#ubuntu-motu 2005-08-08
<robitaille> dholbach: thanks.   which part? :)
<dholbach> the .ics part this time :)
<Mo42> dholbach, could you review my gnomeradio package on revu? just if/when you have some time left...
<dholbach> Mo42: i'm completely out of time, but i'll give it a look later, alright?
<dholbach> now mo42's away
<dholbach> hrbml
<ogra> dholbach, how up to date are you currently ?
<ogra> dholbach, my firefox crashes constantly if i go back...
<dholbach> i don't have the newest one
<dholbach> just a sec
<ogra> hmm, keep the old one around :)
<dholbach> i still have the source around because i compiled it with debugging symbols :)
<ogra> ah, great
<dholbach> upgrade.... :)
* ajmitch is ready to kill his work computer :)
<dholbach> ouch, why that?
<dholbach> ogra: seems ok
<dholbach> although i'm inclined to say, i like epiphany much better by now
<ajmitch> dholbach: win XP
<ogra> dholbach, hmm, strange... i cant read a heise article and go back...
* ajmitch has been using galeon a lot
<dholbach> ajmitch: good point
<ajmitch> dholbach: been using firefox, it's using a fair bit of memory on windows
<ajmitch> and windows *really* can't handle it :)
<dholbach> ogra: heise works fine for me
<ogra> dholbach, with back button/alt-left ?
<dholbach> yep
<dholbach> works nicely
<dholbach> ok pals, i'm off to bed - see you around
<ajmitch> bye dholbach
<crimsun> bye dholbach
<sistpoty> gn8 dholbach
<dholbach> :)
<ogra> ciao dholbach
* sistpoty needs some sleep as well... gn8
* ajmitch wonders at the usefulness of rss feeds :)
<ajmitch> doesn't gmane already provide them?
<ogra> ajmitch, Seveas says he only parses the changelog and discards the rest
<ajmitch> ogra: could be useful
<ajmitch> the changelog is the most entertaining part
<ogra> gmane shows tha whole changes mail
<ogra> the even
<ajmitch> especially with daniels :)
<Seveas> ajmitch, I'm currently working on prettifying it a bit
<ogra> grimpf... i cursed daniels a lot today
<Seveas> hehe
<ogra> Seveas, http://www.wiggy.net/presentations/2001/DebianWalkThrough/handouts/handouts.html#AEN305
<ajmitch> ogra: 1024x768 doesn't resize well on your screen? :)
<Seveas> ogra, found the spec already
<Seveas> but thanks :)
<ogra> i guess its also in the debian NM guide anywhere
<ogra> ajmitch, nope...
<ogra> ajmitch, its stretched and horribly blurry... after 10min i get a headache
<ajmitch> dpkg-parsechangelog might spit out something remotely useful for you
* ajmitch hasn't restarted his X server for a couple of months now
<ogra> http://changelogs.ubuntu.com/ might be useful too :)
<ajmitch> true
<Seveas> all true
<Seveas> but i'm using the mail to update automatically :)
<Seveas> and the mails have a soewhat different format then the official changelog format
<Seveas> anywho, I've prettified them
<Seveas> even with correct spacing in the xml and html :)
<bddebian> Dang where is everyone?
<majic> right here
<majic> hello bddebian
<bddebian> Heya majic
<majic> how are ya?
<bddebian> Fair to midland. You?
<majic> doing good... Just drank a pot of coffee... Now I'm bouncing off the walls
<bddebian> heh
<ajmitch> hello bddebian, majic
<majic> what's up ajmitch?
<ajmitch> just had lunch :)
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<ajmitch> feeling somewhat closer to alive
<bddebian> OK, where the hell is pxscan?
<ajmitch> firstly, what is pxscan?
<bddebian> I don't have a clue but yaprimaxgui depends on it :-)
<ajmitch> scanner utils
* ajmitch looks in non-free/contrib
<bddebian> lamezor
<bddebian> Debian doesn't have it either
<ajmitch> so fix it :)
<bddebian> But non-free/contrib would have to go in Multiverse right?
<ajmitch> sure
<ajmitch> but it's not in debian
<bddebian> Isn't it odd that a package in Universe would depend on something from Multiverse?
<ajmitch> it's not in multiverse...
<ajmitch> it's not in the archive at all
<bddebian> I know but if it was it would go into Multiverse wouldn't it?
* ajmitch sighs
<ajmitch> only *if* it were in non-free or contrib
<bddebian> I thought that is where you said you found it??
<ajmitch> no, I didn't say I found them at all
<ajmitch> I said I was looking for them
<bddebian> Oh, well you said scanner utils then "looks in..." so I thought that's where you found it. SORRY.. Sheesh :-)
<ajmitch> ok, so it's crack that was imported from apt-get.org only just before hoary released
<ajmitch> http://www.stuff.demon.co.uk/apt/source/
<schweeb> anyone else using network-manager on breezy?
<schweeb> mine's borked I think
<gradzac> hi everyone
<ajmitch> ie someone ran dh_make, tweaked some compile flags & put up a package
<ajmitch> schweeb: I've not used it
<bddebian> Hello gradzac, schweeb
<bddebian> ajmitch: Ahh, OK, thanks
<gradzac> schweeb: is the network manager in breezy still gnome-system-tools?
<bddebian> OK, I'm not doing as well on UniverseUnmetDeps as I did on Merge stuff :'-(
<schweeb> gradzac: I'm talking about real network-manager
<ajmitch> bddebian: you've done more than me
<bddebian> ajmitch: Yeah, but I'll never be as sexy as you.. ;-)
<majic> anyone know if the backported Ruby package is the same as the breezy package? I mean same version. That is probably a dumb question.
* ajmitch sighs
<ajmitch> majic: it ought to be
<majic> ok, because that version is a 1.9pre
<majic> which doesn't make alot of sense either
<majic> we go from a broken 1.8pre to a broken 1.9pre
<majic> hehe
<ajmitch> majic: I don't know the ruby situation, I just heard that people were going to backport it
<bddebian> ajmitch: What's the sigh for this time? :-)
<ajmitch> I don't see a ruby 1.9 in breezy
<majic> the latest stable is 1.8.2, I'm gonna have to roll my own if it's going to be the 1.9pre build
<majic> ajmitch, it's there, I downloaded that package and built it yesterday. It says 1.8.2 but it's really a 1.9 pre
<ajmitch> so file a bug
<ajmitch> ruby is in main, so we can't do anything with it
<ajmitch> bddebian: you :P
<bddebian> ajmitch: Can I ask you a question without you sighing at me? :-)
<majic> if it's a 1.9 pre like the package I built yesterday I am gonna cry
<majic> I don't understand who made that decision
<ajmitch> bddebian: depends on the question
<ajmitch> majic: the debian maintainer, I'd say
<majic> that baffles me
<ajmitch> hmm, perhaps not
<majic> why are we including pre release stuff in major releases of a distro?
<bddebian> ajmitch: I don't get how Depends: ${shlibs:Depends}, ${misc:Depends} work
<majic> and then code freezing it so it cannot be fixed
<majic> I just started with debian packaging yesterday so I don't have the experience to fix the problem. It seems like I'm bitching but I'm not really. I'm fighting for the Ruby developers that want to use Ubuntu like me.
<majic> but want to maintain package integrity
<ajmitch> majic: as I said, the MOTUs are not the ones to complain to
<ajmitch> bddebian: debhelper voodoo
<majic> alright =)
<ajmitch> ruby --version says 1.8.3 for me
<ajmitch> the changes are listed in /usr/share/doc/ruby1.8/changelog.Debian.gz
<ajmitch> which says that the updates from 1.8.2 are just for critical bugs
<ajmitch> bddebian: what do you not understand about those items?
<bddebian> ajmitch: How they get resolved
<majic> right 1.8.3 (my bad)
<majic> but there is no 1.8.3
<majic> unless they are grabbing from CVS
<ajmitch> majic: read the changelog
<bddebian> If there is already an ubuntuX version and I am just rebuilding should I increment the ubuntu version or no?
<ajmitch> it says, critical fixes from cvs
<ajmitch> bddebian: yes, increment
<bddebian> Thank you
<majic> I don't see the change log, is that in the diff?
<majic> ok
<ajmitch> majic: I gave the changelog path above for an installed package
<ajmitch> hi ogra
<majic> ah, I don't have it installed anymore. I'm looking at the source package stuff
<majic> but I have one question
<ajmitch> then look in the diff, it's debian/changelog
<majic> since there is no sanctioned endorsed 1.8.3 package on the official website for Ruby, who's responsibility is it to update the software? Distro developers or the developers of the actual software.
<majic> ajmitch, did. I see =)
<majic> I'd say the latter
<majic> but would seem to not be the case
<majic> it would seem to me that the distro developers are taking it upon themselves to patch software as they see fit rather than working with the authors to have them officially fixed. Is this the case? It appears like that from the Ruby package that's currently in Breezy
<ajmitch> majic: they are officially fixed, of course
<ajmitch> the fixes weren't pulled from nowhere, but from ruby cvs
<ajmitch> by the debian maintainer
<majic> right but why are they doing that?
<majic> if the CVS code was finished it'd be an official 1.8.3 package
<ajmitch> ask the debian maintainer, I don't know why he chose to do it that way
<majic> is that standard policy?
<ajmitch> my crystal ball seems to be acting up today
<majic> I mean is that normally the case with packaging software for debian / ubuntu?
<ajmitch> it is up to the maintainer's discretion
<majic> ok
<ajmitch> since every upstream is different
<majic> alrighty. I'll just forget about it and be happy
<bddebian> So if I post a rebuilt package for an MOTU to look at should I just host the debdiff or everything?
<gradzac> majic: its up to the maintainer, but the debian maintainers I have talked with usually only package released software
<majic> is Breezy frozen now?
<ajmitch> majic: upstream version freeze, yes
<gradzac> they might build a new package with patches needed to close bugs on debian
<ajmitch> feature freeze is on the 11th
<ajmitch> exceptions can be made for UVF
<ajmitch> gradzac: when it comes to critical fixes, some developers might just update to the latest cvs, rather than try & backport the fixes
<majic> so if Breezy currently has a pre-release version of Ruby, will that mean that it cannot be updated to a final release? supposing there was alot more work to be done on it?
<ajmitch> majic: depends on bugs
<gradzac> ajmitch: true, some do that
<ajmitch> if you want the latest just because you're uncomfortable with having a prerelease, then that's probably not adequate justification for breaking the freeze
<ajmitch> but if the prerelease has real issues, then sure
<majic> ok, I'm just trying to understand the process =)
<majic> no problem
<gradzac> majic: you could always maintain your own ruby package seperate from the distribution that has the features you want
<gradzac> I do that for a debian package that I use
<majic> gradzac, yeah. Hehe once I get up to speed on packaging =)
<ajmitch> gradzac: which one is that?
<gradzac> ajmitch: madman, the version in debian is old and the arch version has a lot of new features.  The debian maintainer only wants to release a new package when the upstream releases.
<ajmitch> right
<gradzac> majic: debian new maintainers guide is a great place to start
<bddebian> How the hell did xbsql end up in my unmet dep output when there is nothing in the archive??
<ajmitch> because the debian maintainer would have to deal with the bugreports for unreleased otherwise
<majic> yeah, I've been reading through it
<ajmitch> bddebian: apt-cache showsrc xbsql kthxbye
<gradzac> ajmitch: maybe, the code in arch would actually close a lot of the bugs open against the package in BTS
<ajmitch> bddebian: in other words, the binary package is not named xbsql
<ajmitch> gradzac: but it might have a lot of other bugs
<bddebian> ajmitch: Aye, I got that, it's libxbsql0 :-)
<gradzac> ajmitch: I doubt it, the latest code is a lot better than the packaged version
<gradzac> either way, I have my own package that I use
* ajmitch should roll some pre-release packages this week for testing
* bddebian should roll a joint for better packaging sk1llz :-)
<gradzac> working your own package is also a good way to learn about how to build a package
<ajmitch> I learnt the hard way, by trial & error :)
<gradzac> start from someone else's example and make it into what you want
<bddebian> Hoary doesn't have modconf?  Sounds fishy
<ajmitch> bddebian: why would it have modconf?
<bddebian> Why wouldn't it?  Isn't that pretty common?
<ajmitch> I've never used it
<ajmitch> and I think the module loading in ubuntu is different
<bddebian> :-)
<bddebian> Ohh
<ajmitch> it might be useful, I don't know
<bddebian> Fuck, I think my HD is dying in my Stinkpad.. :-(
<ajmitch> back it up
<ajmitch> if you can
<schweeb> <3 my thinkpad
<bddebian> Frickin' lame.  This is my second R31 off sleaze-bay.  This one I'm typing on has a dying AC connection.. :-(
<bddebian> Damnit, just when I was getting going on UniverseUnmetDeps.. :'-(
<ajmitch> bddebian: surely you've got other boxes you can use?
<bddebian> Bah, they all run Hurd.  For about 5-10 minutes.. ;-P
<ajmitch> eg a spare dell with a dodgy keyboard? :)
<bddebian> Heh
<ajmitch> might as well use that, saves you having to find a box for it
<ajmitch> of course it might be a *little* slow for compilign
<bddebian> I'll just "borrow" a shiny new laptop drive from work.. ;-P
<bddebian> Yep, drive is definetely headed south... crap
<ajmitch> save what you can
<ajmitch> I managed to get 99.9% of the stuff of my laptop drive before it died
<bddebian> Not sure there is anything worthwhile on it, I've mostly been packaging stuff on it :-)
<ajmitch> only a few files lost, which were copied from my desktop anyway :)
* ajmitch might go home from work early today
<ajmitch> since it's been a fairly unproductive day :)
<bddebian> :-)
<ajmitch> gah, we need a newer arch-buildpackage..
<bddebian> gah, my hard drive has died.. :'-(
<ajmitch> that's a shame
<schweeb> time for the freezer trick
<bddebian> The freezer trick?
<robitaille> bddebian:  http://www.meetmyattorney.com/slink/mt-archives/000275.html
<bddebian> heh
<bddebian> And here I have been tapping drives with a screwdriver all this time
<bddebian> Oh well, I guess I'm relegated back to pr0n then.. :-)
<schweeb> I've never heard of it working like that specific incident
<schweeb> but I've has it work first hand to get data off unbootable disks on at least 3 different occasions
<bddebian> Nice
<ajmitch> impressive
<ajmitch> I'll have to try that with my next dying drive
<bddebian> Man this really irks me.. :-(
<whiprush> I've had it work twice, it really works
<chillywilly> do you guys think gnome 2.12 will make it into the breezy release?
<ajmitch> chillywilly: of course it will
<bddebian> chillywilly: If you build it it will.. ;-P
<ajmitch> 2.12 is released & uploaded to breezy about a day before preview release
<chillywilly> ok
<ajmitch> it's a definite part of the release plan
<ajmitch> happened with warty & hoary
<chillywilly> cool, I was just reading the pre-release tour notes
<chillywilly> ajmitch: do you use totem with the gstreamer backend?
<chillywilly> I have found the gstreamer backend to be subpar
<ajmitch> nope
* bddebian hugs chillywilly 
<ajmitch> I don't use totem at all
* chillywilly melts into a puddle
<chillywilly>  Finally, due to popular demand, audio CD copying has been added to Nautilus' CD burning functionality.
<chillywilly> yay!
<chillywilly> :)
<bddebian> heh
<bddebian> chillywilly: You are going to have to take over my tasks since my laptop has died.. ;-P
<chillywilly> okey dokey
<ajmitch> chillywilly: so hurry up & fix packages
<chillywilly> bddebian task #1 - Slacking
<ajmitch> you've got a quota to fill, you know
<chillywilly> bddebian task #1 - IRC Harassment
<bddebian> chillywilly: lol
<chillywilly> erm, #2
<chillywilly> bddebian task #3 - Sarcastic Inappropriate Jokes on #ubuntu-motu
<ajmitch> you've already got #3 down
<chillywilly> those truly are hard shoes to fill ;)
<bddebian> chillywilly: moi??? :-)
<chillywilly> ajmitch: you betcha
<chillywilly> why do you think we get along so well :)
<bddebian> Man, now I'm even getting lambasted by chillywilly
<chillywilly> haha
<ajmitch> chillywilly: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UniverseUnmetDeps is a good place to start working thanks
<chillywilly> gnome 2.12 looks cool
<bddebian> Man, am I really that annoying?
<chillywilly> ajmitch: there's plenty of stuff I can do for work too ;)
<ajmitch> bddebian: nope, that's just chillywilly
<chillywilly> :-o
<chillywilly> take that back ajmitch
<chillywilly> geez, my internet really blows tonight
<chillywilly> that wiki page still hasn't loaded yet
<ajmitch> chillywilly: you may have taken it the wrong way :)
<chillywilly> ah, silly SSL certs
<ajmitch> I meant that you just like harassing bddebian
<chillywilly> oh
<chillywilly> yea, it's fun
<ajmitch> but it doesn't get universe fixed, so get to work
<chillywilly> so do you buil the pbuilder environment for breezy?
<ajmitch> chillywilly: yes
<chillywilly> alrighty then
<ajmitch> though I often don't use pbuilder because I'm lazy
<chillywilly> *gasp*
<chillywilly> what's zorp bddebian ?
<chillywilly> never heard of it ;)
<bddebian> Me either :-)
<ajmitch> bddebian: btw, why do you put up debdiffs for packages that only need rebuilds?
<bddebian> Because I changed the changelog
<ajmitch> yes, but it's just a rebuild
<bddebian> Should I not bother?  That is why I asked earlier
<chillywilly> last edited 2005-08-03 02:09:23 by Bddebian
<bddebian> chillywilly: ??
<chillywilly> uh oh...;)
<bddebian> Oh, UniverseUnmetDeps?
<ajmitch> well, the debdiff has far more than just changelog stuff
<ajmitch> yes, unmet deps
<bddebian> ajmitch: For which?
<ajmitch> xbsql
<ajmitch> lots of config.* junk
<bddebian> Aye, I don't get why
<bddebian> W00t, saved my home dir without the freezer :-)
<ajmitch> because they get modified by the build process
<chillywilly> bddebian: you don't have a desktop machine?
<ajmitch> bddebian: zeiberbude should be -2ubuntu1, not -2build2
<bddebian> chillywilly: Not for Ubuntu yet.  They are all Hurd or XP boxes :-)
<ajmitch> since you made changes
<bddebian> sheesh
<chillywilly> why is the PBuilderHowTo page missing?
<ajmitch> bddebian: also, you don't need to add build-essential to build-depends
<ajmitch> chillywilly: case-sensitive?
<ajmitch> PbuilderHowTo works for me
<bddebian> ajmitch: Did I do that or was it already there?
<chillywilly> well that's lame
<chillywilly> hmmm, you have to register on launchpad.net?
<ajmitch> bddebian: your debdiff has that change
<bddebian> I don't think I would ever add a build-dep for build-essential so that sounds fishy
<chillywilly> is launchpad.net like a authentication web service thing?
<chillywilly> s/a/an/
<ajmitch> bddebian: then it's probably the evil cdbs & control.in
<ajmitch> chillywilly: launchpad is pure crack
* bddebian punches himself
<chillywilly> wth does that mean?
<bddebian> This is why I don't like debdiff
<ajmitch> chillywilly: insanity run amok
<ajmitch> chillywilly: it's where things like the bugtracker & various other services live
<ajmitch> a number of which aren't live yet
<chillywilly> ok
<ajmitch> so yeah, I think you do need to register on launchpad, as it's the central site for everything
<chillywilly> well I have a login already...
* chillywilly clicks forgot password thingy
<ajmitch> bddebian: I hope you don't mind me picking out these issues :)
<robitaille> note: they had problem earlier with launchpad...so some things don't work in it for the next few hours
<ajmitch> robitaille: wonderful news..
<robitaille> including malone bug reports :)
<ajmitch> I'm logged into the wiki at the moment, so I think they may have cleared up
<ajmitch> heh
<bddebian> ajmitch: No, I need to know
* ajmitch wonders why bluez-utils is on unmet deps
<ajmitch> since I installed it a couple of days ago
<bddebian> ajmitch: Can I just use diff then?
<ajmitch> bddebian: hmm? how would diff be different from debdiff?
<bddebian> ajmitch: I can control diff ;-P
<chillywilly> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowTo <-- that doesn't work for me either
<ajmitch> chillywilly: strange, what does it complain about?
<ajmitch> since I have that page open
<chillywilly> just says it doesn't exist basically
<ajmitch> bddebian: can you confirm that bluez-utils is installable?
<chillywilly> it's PbuilderHowto
<ajmitch> oh wel
<ajmitch> gah, you ahd to edit it while I had it open...
* chillywilly shrugs
<chillywilly> I've never really used a wiki much before
<bddebian> ajmitch: Give me a sec
<ajmitch> it means that I had to resolve conflicts
<chillywilly> big deal
<ajmitch> and that you ignored the warning that someone was editing it :)
<chillywilly> wtf does it say that?
<chillywilly> my bad
<chillywilly> like I said I am not used to using a wiki ;)
<bddebian> ajmitch: Yep, installs fine here
<ajmitch> bddebian: ok, I took it off the list
<ajmitch> might as well get the list down as small as possible
<bddebian> Aye
<ajmitch> ah, I see it was a suggests on bluez-firmware
<ajmitch> we need to clear that list of junk entries
<bddebian> SUggests shouldn't be on there?? Hmm
<ajmitch> no, I don't think so
<ajmitch> since it shouldn't cause issues for a user
<bddebian> No, I mean, THEY shouldn't be.  I generated the list :-)
<ajmitch> using what command?
<bddebian> The one dholback posted on the wiki, plus some perl voodoo to put it in the "correct" format
<ajmitch> which doesn't take into account depends or suggests
<ajmitch> it just takes the whole list
<bddebian> Hmm, it doesn -v Suggests ?
<ajmitch> I may be wrong
<chillywilly> do I need to build a hoary chrtto env then just change the lines to breezya dn sit-upgrade?
<chillywilly> dist*
<chillywilly> chroot*
<ajmitch> I didn't see any mention of suggests on the page
<bddebian> ajmitch: Hmm, I don't see that now that you mention it
<ajmitch> chillywilly: that is probably a good way to do it
<chillywilly> ok
<chillywilly> bah
<chillywilly> E: Failed getting release file http://archive.ubuntu.com/archive/dists/hoary/Release
<chillywilly> pbuilder: debootstrap failed
<ajmitch> works for me
<chillywilly> http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/hoary/Release
<ajmitch> perhaps you have broken intarweb
<chillywilly> that looks to be the proper URL
<ajmitch> ah right..
<ajmitch> so how'd you manage to break debootstrap like that?
* chillywilly fixes ti
<chillywilly> no clue...
<chillywilly> didn't follow the directions properly
<chillywilly> :)
<chillywilly> fixed it in my pbuilderrc file
<chillywilly> it's building now
<chillywilly> bah, I probably need to add a universe line via the OTHERMIRROR config var
<chillywilly> or can I just screw with the chroot env?
<chillywilly> ah, I have all the same repo lines
<chillywilly> duh
* chillywilly dist-upgrades to breezy after doing sudo pbuilder login
<crimsun> I presume you really don't want to save the breezy dist-upgrade?
<chillywilly> yea that would be nice ;)
<chillywilly> so do it outside the pbuilder login crap?
<crimsun> I don't know your intent, but I presume you know all changes made after pbuilder login are discarded.
<chillywilly> now I know :)
<crimsun> you need to use --override-config with an updated sources.list if you want to dist-upgrade to breezy.
<bddebian> hehe
<chillywilly> well, ok right now I have a haory chroot...how can I I upgrade to breezy?
<bddebian> Replace all instances of hoary with breezy and pbuilder update --distribution breezy --override-config
<chillywilly> ok
<chillywilly> upgrading...
<chillywilly> this is fun
<chillywilly> danielb@frodo:/var/cache/pbuilder/result$ ls -l
<chillywilly> total 248
<chillywilly> -rw-r--r--  1 root root 107274 2005-08-02 23:22 alexandria_0.5.1-3_all.deb
<chillywilly> that was fun I guess ;)
<bddebian> w0000t
<bddebian> Of course it was, you know it was :-)
<chillywilly> well I am assuming there's a lot more involved then jsut rebuilding it straight away?
<chillywilly> :)
<chillywilly> like changing the package info or changelog or something
<bddebian> Depends on what the problem is.  Many of them are just rebuilds :-)
<chillywilly> doesn't matter that is talks about debian and unstable in the .changes file?
<chillywilly> bittorrent outta be fun
<chillywilly> bittornado too ;)
<bddebian> .changes? or changelog?
<chillywilly> .changes
<bddebian> Hmm
<chillywilly> when you say rebuild you mean just pulling the source straight form the breezy repo then issuing the rebuild with sudo pbuilder build whatever.dsc?
<chillywilly> btw, I don't even see aboot or ace
<bddebian> Well I'm a little whacky.  I usually use dpkg-buildpackage :-)
<bddebian> even in apt-cache showsrc ?
<chillywilly> dunno
<chillywilly> yea it's there
* bddebian learns from ajmitch  :-)
<chillywilly> heheh
<chillywilly> I don't know all the nifty developers commands yet ;)
<chillywilly> so you were runing breezy natively then?
<chillywilly> ace source package is only in hoary it seems
<bddebian> Of course :-)
<chillywilly> well alexandria had an updated version in breezy
<chillywilly> http://packages.ubuntu.com/breezy/source/ace
<chillywilly> it's the same package in hoary and breezy
<bddebian> Doesn't surprise me
<chillywilly> so wht changes have you had to make to packages?
<chillywilly> anything?
<bddebian> Have you looked at my spot on the wiki?? :-)
<chillywilly> your personal page or the on the unmet deps page?
<chillywilly> one on the
<bddebian> UnmetDeps
<chillywilly> ic
<chillywilly> nevermind then :)
<bddebian> Of course ajmitch is telling me that I'm doing it all wrong :-)
<chillywilly> oh, that's nice
<chillywilly> what are you doing wrong?
<bddebian> debdiffs aren't quite right.  Wrong changelog entries, etc :-)
<chillywilly> so you never built zorp?
<chillywilly> a bug needs to be fixed upstream?
<chillywilly> arg
<chillywilly> this thing failed to build :)
<chillywilly> oh yaya
<chillywilly> yay
<chillywilly> c++ templates
<bddebian> heh
<chillywilly> basically everyone is hacking these packages so that they build with a new gcc, right?
<bddebian> Most of that has already been done.  But some of it affected the depends
<chillywilly> well I got a compile error when attempting to build ace
<chillywilly> :)
<bddebian> Anway, sorry to bail on you but I have to get to bed.  Good luck, enjoy, and welcome to the fold.. ;-)
<chillywilly> ok
<dabaR> hi, do you guys know if aptitude is installed on default ubuntu install?
<ajmitch> yes, it is
<Lathiat> dabaR: yes, its installed by ubuntu-minimal
<dabaR> ok, cool./
<dabaR> thanks.
<ajmitch> heh
<ajmitch> hi koke
<koke> hi all! :)
<jsgotangco> hi
<ajmitch> hey jsgotangco
<ajmitch> what's up?
<jsgotangco> oh my dsl just normalized again
<jsgotangco> after a few days of outage
<ajmitch> I'm finally getting a dsl upgrade to 2Mbps next week
<jsgotangco> how much would that cost?
<ajmitch> an extra $15 NZ a month
<ajmitch> from 256Kbps
<ajmitch> so 8x the speed, for about 25% more
<koke> ajmitch: which is the base price?? :)
<ajmitch> $50 NZ a month for a dead slow connection :)
<ajmitch> or about $30 USD, iirc
<koke> ouch, and I thought here was bad
<ajmitch> you think sydney was bad...? ;)
<koke> no, Spain
<ajmitch> yeah I know
<ajmitch> but NZ is most similar to australia
<ajmitch> except a few years behind :)
<koke> now they are doubling bandwith from time to time
<koke> I think they want to sell TV over IP
<ajmitch> they're only increasing here because the government is putting pressure on them
<ajmitch> so next week I might be able to download packages a bit quicker :)
<koke> now there are offers for 4096/512 at ~ $40
<ajmitch> we might get that in 10 years
<koke> last year we had 256/128 for the same prce
<ajmitch> that's what I'm currently using
<koke> and last moths popular connections were 512/128 or 1024/300
<koke> the upload rates are quite odd
<koke> given that half of the people waste their bandwith with emule and other P2Ps
* ajmitch will be on 2048/128
<ajmitch> they've capped the upload rates very low here
<koke> so patience for uploading packages :)
<ajmitch> lots..
<ajmitch> I just have to upload diffs :)
* ajmitch wonders what's with gnue-designer & gnue-forms on the unmet deps list
<ajmitch> ah fun, wx2.4 transition...
<mbreit> ajmitch: most items on that list are wx issues...
<ajmitch> time for me to do some fixing then
<mbreit> i am working on the unmet deps list too, but skipping the wx issues ;)
<ajmitch> I'll attack the wx issues :)
<mbreit> great
<mbreit> btw: it seems that gtkmm needs a rebuild (again...)
* Lathiat is doing libgmp3 stuff
* ajmitch owns the gnue-* packages, so has an obligation to look after them :)
* mbreit tried to fix noteedit... patched configure.in.in, needs autoconf run, but depends on autoconf2.52 which is not in breezy. :(
<\sh> mbreit: but 2.59
<ajmitch> I should really split this gnue packaging, it's a bit ugly
<mbreit> \sh: does not work with 2.59... gives "undefined macro: AC_Dest"
<mbreit> google told me to use 2.52..
<\sh> mbreit: fix it
<\sh> 2.52 is obsolete
<mbreit> i really hate those auto* magic...
<\sh> mbreit: yes :) everybody
<mbreit> btw: just if someone asks... i am mo42... just changed my nick
<pete> good morning :)
<mbreit> \sh: the problem seems to be in the admin/ directory copied from kde-common/admin... and has not been fixed in the kde svn..
<mbreit> and i really do not understand the magic that they are doing there...
* Amaranth heads for bed
<mbreit> \sh: forget what i said, seems to work now
<ajmitch> hmm, new bochs version uploaded to sid, should I break UVF for it?
<ajmitch> since it needs rebuilt anyway :)
<siretart> ajmitch: does it fix any bugs? how many reverse depends does it have
<siretart> ?
<ajmitch> siretart: yes it fixes bugs, and it's an app, not a lib
<ajmitch> oh, and it fixes compilation for g++ 4.0 properly :)
<siretart> well, that I would consider important :)
<siretart> so, go on and update it! :)
<ajmitch> yay
<siretart> looking at bochs changelog, we really should have it for breezy
<ajmitch> certainly
<ajmitch> I'm just fighting with the debian mirrors to actually give me the source
<Mez> logjam needs a rebuild
<Mez> (c2 transitipon
<Mez> would do it myself, but i dont see the point if I dont have upload
<alisher> Hello, I have a question. The new version of Lyx 1.3.6 has just been released. The version in Universe is 1.3.4 and 1.5 years old. The packages build from tarball work good, how can the new version be added to Universe?
<ogra> alisher, if its in debian, we can easily sync it
<alisher> I think the version in debian is also old. I used http://wiki.lyx.org/LyX/Linux .diff file and have all the packages working good in Ubuntu
<ogra> if it wont enter debian in time, you have the opportunity to find a MOTU who packages and uploads it...
<alisher> I think in Debian is same old version
<ogra> alisher, in any case it would be nice if you could clerify for when a debian update is planned...
<ogra> clearify even
<ogra> ...they are probably working on a update already
<alisher> I see. Do I have to ask at #debian-monu, or can you give me the address I have to ask at?
<ogra> if t wont be in time, there is no problem adding it, if you either find a MOTU to help you packaging and uploading or convince hom even to do all this for you
<ogra> alisher, the maintainer can be found in the debian package description... you can also find it in the details page if you search for lyx at packages.debian.org
<alisher> thank you, i will go and try to ask the debian maintener
<alisher> anyway, the packeges I compiled at Ubuntu using http://wiki.lyx.org/LyX/Linux .diff file work just fine
<alisher> Thank you once more
<ogra> alisher, does it work in a pbuilder and is it lintian clean ?
<ogra> alisher, make sure these two things work for you...
<ogra> then it would be ready for inclusion (after some reviews for 3 MOTUs)
<mbreit> alisher: try to replace the xlibs-dev build-dependency
<mbreit> it is depricated and should not be used iirc
<ogra> Edubuntu Meeting starting in #ubuntu-meeting
<ogra> in case someone is intereased
<alisher> ok I will try it with lintian first
<bddebian> Hello
<mbreit> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Hello mbreit
<CarlFK> E: Build-Depends dependency for transcode cannot be satisfied because the package libdivxencore0 cannot be found - I can't find it either.  - whos problem is this?
<bddebian> CarlFK: Is there something else that meets that?  I.E. libdivxencore0c2 or anything?  Sorry I don't have my session handy
<siretart> a friend asks for some ubuntu banners for his website, are there any out there?
<infinito> siretart: it's supposed that there are banners here https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ServerBanners
<infinito> siretart: but i think they don't work....
<siretart> infinito: yes, they seem to be gone with the wiki move :(
<bddebian> So fix it (tm)
<bddebian> :-)
<siretart> sure, can you find me the banners, then :P
<bddebian> fng.. hehehe, good nick :-)
<fng> thnx
<infinito> siretart: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/WebsiteButtons
<siretart> infinito: thank you!
<infinito> siretart: welcome!
<infinito> just one stupid question... when do pkgs in MOTUToSync get synced?
<CarlFK> bddebian - I can't find  libdivxencore anything
<bddebian> CarlFK: Hmm OK.
<bddebian> CarlFK: Man, you are right, there is nothing even related..
<bddebian> CarlFK: There isn't even anything in Debian.  Hmm
<incomplete> Hi, I don't know if mine is considered as an On Topic question here, tell me if it isn't:  is it possible to compile the libcairo breezy package in hoary?  i.e. adjusting the dependicies.
<bddebian> incomplete: It is certainly "possible" but not advised
<incomplete> bddebian, I in fact need it, as the last version.  I thought it would have been better to debianize it instead of install from the sources: .debs are easily removable.
<incomplete> The breezy package is The Right One: 0.6.0, in this (latest as now) release they finished making changes in the API (apart from additions) until the 1.0.  I'm working on the Haskell cairo bindings and I _need_ it :-)
<incomplete> I can't use the breezy one directly because of the libc, et all.
<incomplete> Upgrading to breezy is also not advised, IIUC.
<siretart> infinito: as soon as they are reviewed by daniel or oliver and forwarded to elmo
<infinito> siretart: maybe before feature freeze?
<siretart> preferably
<incomplete> Any hints?
<bddebian> incomplete: Not really unfortunately.  I'm a little new to the game myself. :-)  You could try to contact someone in the backports team but if libc is an issue, that is a biggie.
<incomplete> I don't think it is.  It is for the breezy package because breezy itself has a new libc, but if I'm compiling it on my hoary it would not be a problem.
<mbreit> a simple rebuild should work... but it will break all applications which are linked to cairo
<incomplete> mbreit, there aren't many at the moment, I think.
<incomplete> mbreit, could you please explain to me how to do the rebuild?
<mbreit> evince as an example
<mbreit> sure..
<mbreit> goto some empty directory...
<siretart> incomplete: backporting an essential lib like libcairo is not trivial. in fact doing it properly is not feasible in many cases and should generaly avoided.
<siretart> incomplete: it would probably best if you could wait the remaining 3 months for breezy becoming stable
<mbreit> siretart: sure, it will break existing applications which are linked to that.. but other then that?
<incomplete> I can't, I'm doing this for the Google Summer of Code... and the deadline is 1st of September <http://haskell.org/gtk2hs/>
<mbreit> incomplete: you could install breezy in a chroot or in vmware...
<incomplete> hmm.
<mbreit> i use breezy for my everyday work, it is not THAT unstable (but... unstable *g*)
<siretart> incomplete: in your case, I would recommend installing your needed libs manually to /usr/local
<incomplete> mbreit, how about X?
<siretart> mbreit: is Xorg in breezy usable again? does xkb work?
<ogra> siretart, xkb works here...
<mbreit> yes, it is usable (apart of the missing v4l module *g*)
<siretart> because of my thesis, I'm still on hoary, because I need a stable system
<ogra> but it took me half a day to get a working config yesterday after the upgrade
<mbreit> but in some cases, you have to fix something to get it running
<ogra> i resorted to the livecd config in the end
<incomplete> Is there a breezy livecd?
<ogra> so dont use breezys X with nvidia card and stupid wxga lcd if you dont have a lvecd around :)
<ogra> incomplete, i used the hoary one
<incomplete> I'm on a laptop with nvidia card, argh :)
<ogra> it worked out of the box at 1024x786
<ogra> but my panel is totally blurry at this :(
<incomplete> By the way, evince seem to run, even without the libcairo1 package.
<mbreit> would a chroot be an option? then you can use your hoary x server but you can use all breezy libs and apps...
<siretart> oh. hm. I would need the nvidia module, I assume that means there is no linux-restricted-modules available yet, is there?
<incomplete> In fact it seem to not depend on cairo.
<ogra> nope
<ogra> siretart, nv doesnt work for you ?
<siretart> ogra: I have a nvidia 6600 gt, I don't think so
<incomplete> GeForce4 440 Go 64M here
<ogra> hmm, i thought all nvidia cards should work in 2d with nv...
<siretart> I never tried, actually. the hoary installer installed with nvidia config. that why I make that assumption
<ogra> huh ?
<CarlFK> bddebian - $ apt-cache policy libdivxencore0 ...  ftp://ftp.nerim.net sid/main Packages
<ogra> never...
<CarlFK> what is the apt/sources like to use that?
<ogra> we dont install the nvidia module by dafault... you wont get it without explicitly installing nvidia-glx
<bddebian> CarlFK: You got that from your Ubuntu box?
<siretart> yes? hm. then I have to recheck
<CarlFK> bddebian - no, I got that from an email from Christian Marillat ;)
<siretart> maybe my memory fools me
<bddebian> CarlFK: Ahh :-)
<ogra> probably... else something is wrong with the installer on your CD ;)
<siretart> hehe :=
<siretart> ;)
<bddebian> CarlFK: I think someone would have to bring libdivxencore0 into the archive for you to even fix that properly.  But don't quote me. :-)
<CarlFK> bddebian - so I am guessing if I add "that" to my sources I could at least get tc to build
<incomplete> siretart, do you think the lib will be simply removable installing in /usr/local ?  Would it be cleaner to install it (and its dependicies, maybe) in /opt ?
<CarlFK> bddebian - trying to get it to work at all, then I will figure out how to get it to do it right
<bddebian> CarlFK: Fair enough
<siretart> CarlFK: you are interested in a working transcode for breezy? thats on our topic for the MOTUMedia team. you are welcome to help :)
<CarlFK> siretart - yup.  i kinda fell into it
<siretart> incomplete: if you install it with --prefix=/opt/libcairo/ or --prefix=/usr/local/libcairo, why not?
<siretart> CarlFK: great!
<incomplete> siretart, I'm wondering how would you proceed for an uninstallation, just in case.
<siretart> incomplete: rm -rf /opt/libcairo ;)
<CarlFK> tc is a sticky one.  the devs attitude is: you figur out what you need, then build what you need from source
<bddebian> CarlFK: ?
<siretart> CarlFK: I don't think that I will find time before next week to look into this. It would be a great help to know, which dependencies of trancode need to be fixed in breezy
<incomplete> siretart, sorry, I missed the "libcairo/" part before.
<siretart> incomplete: you may also use /opt/libcairo-<version>
<incomplete> I'm trying, thank you very much.
<incomplete> (You all) .-)
<incomplete> /opt/libcairo-0.6.0/lib:
<incomplete>         libcairo.so.1 -> libcairo.so.1.0.0
<incomplete> Cool :)
<siretart> incomplete: :)
<bddebian> shiite, the MOTU meeting is at 6:00pm EDT?
<ogra> bddebian, nope, 24:00 CEST :)
<incomplete> siretart, do you know how to handle pkg-config well?
<bddebian> ogra: Bah, don't confuse me, I'm confused enough :-)
<bddebian> If it's at 6, I'm screwed :'-(
<incomplete> siretart, nevermind, got it.
<siretart> ok
<CarlFK> http://paste.foxshare.net:8888/38 - Package libavifile-0.7-dev has broken dep on libavifile-0.7
<CarlFK> um... shouldn't there be a reason why it failed?
<siretart>     (111) Connection refused
<siretart> CarlFK: have you checked the buildlogs?
<CarlFK> um, what build logs?
<siretart> see http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont
<CarlFK> ah, those.  yes.
<bddebian> CarlFK: Didn't I already touch that one?
<CarlFK> bddebian - yesterdays sugestion (not sure who) was apt-get build-dep libavifile-0.7
<CarlFK> did that, no help.
<CarlFK> store time - be back in 20
<bddebian> CarlFK: I meant, I thought I had that problem before recently.. I'm loosing my mind :-)
<bddebian> Anyone here an Oracle expert? :-)
<zAo^> how can I get Totem in my Empiphany in stead of Mplayer (Breezy)? Thanks
<CarlFK> bddebian - any idea how you might have solved it?
<bddebian> No, I am currently beating my head against my desk so I am useless atm.. :'-(
<CarlFK> maybe we should do that togeter
<bddebian> CarlFK: :-)
<sivang> bddebian: why do you need an oracle expert?
<bddebian> sivang: I need to find spaces in a field and remove them :)  Like s/' '// ;-P
<sivang> bddebian: ah
<CarlFK> bddebian - not that I am a fan of stupid field names, but it may be easier to fix the client
<bddebian> CarlFK: It isn't my software :-)  And I'd LOVE to "fix" the user ;-)
* bddebian pulls out a very large cluebat
<CarlFK> lol
<CarlFK> i hear ya
<bddebian> Bah, you all suck:  "update foo set bar = REPLACE(bar, ' ', '');"
<bddebian> :-)
<siretart> n'evening, folks
<bddebian> Heya siretart
<siretart> now with korean keyboard in my laptop *g*
<siretart> huhu dholbach!
<dholbach> hellas
<siretart> ooouzoo! :)
<bddebian> Heya dholbach
<dholbach> hey barry
<CarlFK> bddebian - oh damm - I thought you meant spaces in the field name
<bddebian> CarlFK: Oohh :-)
<bddebian> So can anyone verify the meeting time in EDT for me?  Is it really 6:00pm? :-)
<dholbach> date --utc should help you to verify
<dholbach> :)
<bddebian> dholbach: Yeah I tried that but I don't believe it :-)
<dholbach> it's 0:00 for me
<bddebian> Doh
<dholbach> and our agenda is quite long
<bddebian> Yeah, I noticed ;-)
<dholbach> but that means that MOTU is active
<dholbach> and that's what i like about it
<bddebian> Was my item dumb?
<bddebian> In other words, is it only me that has that problem? :-)
<dholbach> no, not dumb at all
<dholbach> because we have that question a lot of times
<dholbach> i wasn't aware of build<n> until very recently
<bddebian> OK
<dholbach> but we have a policy there already - we just need a very prominent place to get it out to the people :)
<bddebian> Ohh
<dholbach> so let's assume there's a debian version 1.2.3-4 and you add a fix to it
<dholbach> then you call it 1.2.3-4ubuntu1 - so you will be reminded to merge it, when there's 1.2.3-5 or 1.2.4-1 in Debian
<bddebian> Describe "fix" :-)
<dholbach> if you just rebuild it for one reason or the other, you call id 1.2.3-4build1
<bddebian> OK
<dholbach> if you rebuild it again 1.2.3-4build2
<dholbach> which will sync the new version and won't remind you to sync :)
<dholbach> if you have 1.2.3-4build2 in ubuntu and add a fix, you get 1.2.3-4ubuntu1 :)
<dholbach> did that make it clearer?
<bddebian> Well after several trials and errors, I think I got that much.  Thanks. :-)
<dholbach> i don't know if there are any other special cases
<ogra> btw you could also call it 1.2.3-4shnubbel1 there was no real naming convention, the only important fact is that it shouldnt be -XubuntuX because the merge scripts react on that
<dholbach> bddebian: trust me, i did quite a lot wrong on the way :)
<ogra> we all did :)
<ogra> we are HUMAN !
<dholbach> bddebian: one day i got a version completely wrong, so i'd have to add an epoch - which is bad and breaks sync-ability from debian :)
<bddebian> OK, I will start calling all my reuilds XfubarX ;-P
<dholbach> i moaned and cried on #ubuntu-devel and elmo managed to remove it, before it got processed
<dholbach> :-)
<ogra> wouldnt have been *this* worse, you only had to care for the package until debian adds a epoch themselves :-p
<dholbach> super :)
<bddebian> Well take it off the agenda then.  Thanks.
<ogra> dholbach, your baobab sync ftbfs with strange errors
<dholbach> oh
<dholbach> nice
<ogra> everywhere but on i386
<ogra> (works fine in my pbuilder, just checked
<ogra> )
<bddebian> Heya majic
<majic> hello there
<dholbach> ouch
<dholbach> debian/rules is wrong
<dholbach> completely
<dholbach> people should use cdbs - it figures that kind of stuff out for them :)
<bddebian> How about a different phrased question.  Meeting is in 2 hours? ;-P
<dholbach> yes, bddebian  :)
<bddebian> Heh. gotcha. :)
<bddebian> Thx dholbach
<dholbach> de rien
<jbailey> dholbach: Your french is getting better. =)
<bddebian> What did you call me?
<bddebian> ;-)
<jbailey> bddebian: Yours is apparently not ;)
<dholbach> jbailey: you should have heard seb128 about my french
<dholbach> something about "barely understandable"
<jbailey> Ah.  Maybe you were speakig Canadian French. =)
<dholbach> i was talking garbled-up french :)
<dholbach> that's one of my specialties
<jbailey> Hmm.  I want my keyboard accents back.
<bddebian> jbailey: I can't speak French, I'm American.. ;-P
<bddebian> OK, I'm heading home.  Hopefully I'll make it home in time for the meeting.  Later gang.
<Burgundavia> ogra, ping
<ogra> Burgundavia,
<ogra> po
<ogra> ng
<ogra> or pong even
<Burgundavia> edubuntu main inclusion reports
<ogra> yeah, do you still want to go on with them ?
<Burgundavia> shall we discuss in #edubuntu?
<ogra> yup
<\sh> *yawn*
<siretart> hi \sh
<\sh> evening gentlemen
<dholbach> hellas stephan
<\sh> hey daniel :)
<\sh> robitaille: ping
<\sh> dholbach: time on saturday for a beer? duesseldorf-benrath -> bierboerse ,-)
<dholbach> \sh: absolutely not, sorry :-(
<\sh> so I have to drink a beer for every member of the MOTU team...for dholbach and ogra I have to drink 2
<dholbach> seems to :)
<\sh> will be fun
<\sh> hehe ;)
<\sh> wow...the points on the agenda
<robitaille> \sh: pong
<\sh> robitaille: should we stick your topic to the taskforce groups as well? fixing malone bugs is also a big task
<ajmitch> morning
<dholbach> hey ajmitch :)
<\sh> ajmitch: hey how r u doing?
<ajmitch> just crawled out of bed, of course ;0
<\sh> ajmitch: me too ;)
<robitaille> \sh: doesn't matter with me where it is on the agenda.  I just want to know what the motu team wants to do with all these bugs in Malone
<\sh> robitaille: fixing in any way ,)
* ajmitch wonders where his audacity upload disappeared to
<\sh> dholbach: can u put me into the MOTU team on launchpad
<dholbach> erm
<ajmitch> any of us can
<dholbach> i'm not sure, that i'm its "leader"
<\sh> oh it's oliver
<ajmitch> dholbach: we're all administrators in the team
<\sh> ok...I just clicked join...
<\sh> ajmitch: add me then ;)
<ajmitch> \sh: I don't see your name anywhere :)
<\sh> launchpad name: sh-sourcecode
<ogra> checking for Win32 platform in general... no
<ogra> checking for gnuchess... no
<ogra> configure: error: Couldn't find gnuchess
<ogra> ./configure: line 24841: exit: please: numeric argument required
* ogra *cries*
<ajmitch> Stephan Hermann (sh-sourcecode) was added as a member of MOTU.
<\sh> ajmitch: thx :)
<\sh> robitaille: now u can assign all the bugs to motu team *eg*
<ajmitch> hehe
<\sh> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CxxLibraryResync
<\sh> please have a look on this list :)
<ajmitch> ogra: hmm, do you have to set \sh as admin? it says that I can but gives me no way to do so :)
<siretart> oh, could anyone add me to the motu team, too? ;)
<ajmitch> \sh: looked at it last night
<ajmitch> siretart: if you ask really nicely
<siretart> please, please pretty please :)
<ogra> ajmitch, no idea, i'll look at it
<ajmitch> & forward some $$ to my bank account :)
<siretart> hehe
<ajmitch>  Reinhard Tartler (siretart) was added as a member of MOTU.
<siretart> thanks! :)
<\sh> ajmitch: can u put my name in the middle of the members list? I don't like to be on top ,-)
<ajmitch> \sh: complain to the launchpad hackers
<\sh> well...the team lead must always be on top
* ajmitch wonders if the audacity upload was REJECTed
<ajmitch> since I did an upload with unstable in the changelog, then with breezy 2 min later ;)
<ajmitch> yay, jbailey uploaded bzr
<jbailey> ajmitch: Stalker.
<\sh> ajmitch: source uploads?
<ajmitch> \sh: of course
<\sh> hmmm
<ajmitch> jbailey: I read breezy-changes
<ajmitch> jbailey: stalking is me using your daily builds as well :)
<\sh> and very good...xfce4 is in
* ajmitch will bbiab
<herzi> dholbach: ping
<dholbach> herzi: opng
<dholbach> pong
<herzi> dholbach: may i wish an ubuntu package?
<herzi> http://live.gnome.org/Istanbul
<dholbach> herzi: i'm working on it and it's still in the review queue
<herzi> you've got preview packages?
<dholbach> the new utspream version has some trouble also and the cvs version's buildsystem is fucked up
<dholbach> it's on http://siretart.tauware.de/revu/index.py
<ajmitch> we need to get that queue smaller :)
<ajmitch> dholbach: when's the next review day planned for?
<dholbach> you will have to make the date without me
<ajmitch> :'(
<ajmitch> 2 weeks from now?
<dholbach> i'll be available from 05. sept. on again
<dholbach> add it to the agenda
<ajmitch> how about a review day every 2-3 weeks?
* ajmitch is just doing that :)
<dholbach> we need review days every day
<ajmitch> yeah
<dholbach> the review days nowadays are just to catch up
<dholbach> training new MOTUs is WAY important
<herzi> dholbach: try once a week (every eight days), so others can joind more easily
<dholbach> herzi: we could do that
<dholbach> herzi: but for me in a month :)
<ajmitch> it's on the agenda
<\sh> and I'm burned out.
<herzi> search for "gnome bug day" and you'll get an example of a working thing
* \sh needs holidays
<\sh> herzi: we have bug days
<ajmitch> \sh: we can pick up from here :)
* ajmitch has work deadlines in the next week or two
<ajmitch> but there are enough of us around now to do something useful
<\sh> right now, we have a lot to do in the office..and it's no fun to get up in the night and doing some stuff on DTV hardware :( it's a mess
<\sh> it looks like that the shareware versions of the SA kryptons is running out :(
<\sh> s/is/are/
<\sh> when I'm older I'll write a book about the digital tv cable provider business...yes
<ajmitch> eevil
<ajmitch> time to beat around the debian maintainer of gnue-forms, what an idiot..
<dholbach> ajmitch: don't be too hard with him :-p
<ajmitch> dholbach: I'll bring him back in good enough shape to handle UnmetDeps ;)
<dholbach> hehe
* ajmitch will be back in ~15min :)
* Natja is away: Occup
<ogra> ajmitch, erm, what had to be done for audacity ? i run it fine since it built on the new wx lib
<ogra> i.e. since the weekend
<majic> what is the preferred method of building packages? I've been playing around with pbuilder.
<ogra> pbuilder is right...
<ogra> and if you want, a chroot for testing the binary
<majic> so does pbuilder create a chroot for itself (for building purposes?)
<\sh> yes
<\sh> and it cleans itself after build
<siretart> majic: yes. it keeps a base tarball with the chroot and build the package inside that chroot
<\sh> and have all fetched packages in the right cache
<siretart> majic: that way you always have a 'clean' chroot
<majic> the tutorial on the ubuntu website for pbuilder mentions doing a "pbuilder update" after each build. Is this needed?
<siretart> \sh: :)
<siretart> majic: pbuilder update updates that base tarball.
<siretart> majic: you need it for keeping the packages inside your chroot up to date. once a day should really be sufficent
<dholbach> majic: not really, but if you do regular updates, you'll see when you need it (new gcc or new xlibs, whatever you might want to have for your package)
<majic> ok
<janimonoses> any of you using the regular apt cache for pbuilder as well?
<dholbach> janimonoses: no, sorry
<janimonoses> hmm, that's why I keep postponing pbuilder :) It wants to dl too much
<\sh> hmmm...anyone tried to build some wx2.4 build-dep apps with wx2.6?
<ogra> janimonoses, use --aptcacache ;) (man pbuilder)
<janimonoses> ogra, I think I tried but it still wanted to go on the net
<janimonoses> I'll retry
<ogra> \sh, that cant work... its a different api afaik
<dholbach> Riddell: umbrello is making fun of me!
* ajmitch returns
<ogra> janimonoses, it must got on the net for stuff thats not in the cache
<ajmitch> ogra: as you can see I just uploaded a rebuild for audacity
<dholbach> Riddell: whatever i do, it refuses to draw straight, orthogonal lines in the .eps :)
<janimonoses> anybody seen an error like pkg-config failing in a build on the servers even though the package is installed as required in the BD?
<\sh> ogra: the last xchm merge was for 2.6 and actually I changed it to use 2.4 and it worked...so it should be downward compatible
<ogra> ajmitch, but the former version was fine, thats why i'm asking
<ajmitch> ogra: not for me - it ran fine until I tried to install it :)
<ogra> ajmitch, i'm running it here since monday
<\sh> and now I can upload xchm with 2.6 build-deps ,-)
<dholbach> Riddell: forget what i said - i tricked it :)
<ajmitch> ogra: libwxgtk2.4c2 became libwxgtk2.4-1
<ajmitch> so it needed a rebuild
<ajmitch> the SONAME change happened on the 19th, last audacity build was before then
<ogra> ajmitch, yes, but it already was rebuilt i think... it wasnt installable on friday here, but on monday it was
<\sh> ajmitch: why that?
<ajmitch> on my up-to-date chroot it showed a depends on libwxgtk2.4c2
<ajmitch> \sh: hmm?
<\sh> also no C++ exported stuff?
<\sh> ajmitch: 23:33 < ajmitch> ogra: libwxgtk2.4c2 became libwxgtk2.4-1
<ajmitch> \sh: ask the debian maintainer or doko for that one :)
<ajmitch> doko's been handling the wx packages
<ogra> ajmitch, audacity (1.2.3-1build1) breezy; urgency=low
<ogra>   * Rebuild for new C++ ABI
<ogra>  -- Matthias Klose <doko@ubuntu.com>  Tue,  7 Jun 2005 14:18:46 +0000
<ajmitch> ogra: yes, and the SONAME changed since then
<ajmitch> so it needed another rebuild
<\sh> ajmitch: yes I read the changelog...was synced back from debian
<ogra> that rebuild was eternally waiting on the buildd until the new wx was available
<\sh> ogra: forget those...I think we have to rebuild some of dokos rebuild again
<ajmitch> \sh: we do, that's what I'm doing
<\sh> hmmm..I wonder if elmo merged my key for main...lets try again ,-)
<ajmitch> ogra: the audacity rebuild binary was available for me
<ogra>  \sh  i'm just a bit worried, i have to demote audacity to main... as well as the other edubuntu stuff
<ajmitch> ogra: why?
<ajmitch> ogra: -1build1 is on the mirrors, so it must have built fine
<ogra> because its in the default install of edubuntu-desktop
<ogra> ajmitch, it has
<ajmitch> so that's why you're grilling me over that :)
<\sh> ogra: so...it's depending on 2.4? did u ever try it with 2.6?
<ajmitch> ogra: I tested this in a chroot yesterday, audacity was not installable due to a depends on libwxgtk2.4c2
<Riddell> dholbach: hmm?
<ajmitch> which means that it built after the C++ transition, and before the next SONAME change
<ogra> ajmitch, hmm, i installed it fine here n monday, as i said... but didnt try on x86....
* ajmitch has the proof on his screen ;)
<ogra> ajmitch, its ok...
<dholbach> Riddell: forget it :) since i just learnt about umbrello and you maintaining it, i wanted to share my disgruntlement - it's alright again :)))
<ajmitch> ogra: so you can trust that I did the right thing? ;)
<dholbach> Riddell: it worked better for me than all it's uml-contestants :)
<Riddell> woo :)
* ogra sighs deeply about gcompris...
<dholbach> Riddell: i should have noted the bugs down... :)
<dholbach> Riddell: but i think i still have some diagrams to do :)
<Riddell> bugs in umbrello??  surly not
<dholbach> haha
<janimonoses> what is the deal with pbuilder and unauthenticated packages?Why aren't all those tweaks already part of a default pbuilder install?
<dholbach> of course
<dholbach> where is tritium when you need him
<ajmitch> janimonoses: because pbuilder just uses debootstrap - I think a new version from debian might fix it
<\sh> ogra: I'm trying audacity with 2.6
<dholbach> latex experts - stick your hand up! :)
<\sh> looks good until now
<ogra> \sh, wont work... but there is a port going on
<janimonoses> ajmitch, a sync from debian now or a future version?
<ogra> in case they didnt merge the two
<\sh> ogra: BlockFile.cpp:466: error: ambiguous overload for 'operator+' in 'wxFileName::GetFullPath(wxPathFormat) const(wxPATH_NATIVE) + ".auf"'
<mbreit> dholbach: i am writing a latex editor for gnome, but that makes no latex expert out of me
<ajmitch> janimonoses: looks like breezy has the latest version :(
<janimonoses> dholbach, UML and latex?diplomarbeit ? ;)
<ajmitch> \sh: I've had issues trying to get stuff working on 2.6 that was designed for 2.4
<dholbach> janimonoses: yeah :)
<janimonoses> rock on!
<\sh> ajmitch: yeah somethings changed...
<ogra> \sh, yep... look at the audacity homepage... there is a port going on... i dont know the current status
<dholbach> mbreit: i was looking for rotating and searched horizontal and vertical and whatever before :)
<\sh> let me have a look on those little bastards ,)
<ajmitch> \sh: eg my python packages really don't like wx 2.6 :)
<dholbach> mbreit: texdoctk was my friend after all, thanks :)
<\sh> ajmitch: hmmm...new bindings?
<ajmitch> and I'm not brave enough to dig in, so I've harassed upstream instead ;)
<dholbach> mbreit: cool to hear that - do you have some screenshots already?
<ajmitch> \sh: wx has always been a problem :)
<\sh> ajmitch: that will be fun with sip4 and qt4 ,-)
<ajmitch> of course
<\sh> ajmitch: but this boa constructor was mentioned as a cool python IDE *hides*
* ajmitch hopes the python-wx* stuff gets into debian ASAP
<ajmitch> \sh: use 0.4.0 from experimental, I noted it in the bugreport on the merge page
<ajmitch> it's one that needs synced :)
<mbreit> dholbach: there is not (yet) much to see, and we (slomo and i) have no time atm because of exams at university... but in a few weeks we will continue to work on that...
<\sh> ajmitch: forget it ;) I've got problems with yehia and gtk-gnutella...i don't like this gtk stuff at all..it's a secret to me ;)
<dholbach> mbreit: that sounds excellent
<ajmitch> \sh: ok I'll handle the wx evil ;)
<\sh> mbreit: ah...slomo...greetings to him :) so when we will see u as motu?
<\sh> ajmitch: can u have a look on yehia?
<ajmitch> \sh: how bad is it?
<\sh> ajmitch: it's a lib from cxx trans
<\sh> ajmitch: truth or a lie?
<dholbach> we're 9 minutes before the meeting
<ajmitch> tell me the whole truth
<\sh> ajmitch: bad as hell...at least more bad then hell
<mbreit> \sh: he is on holiday atm, so i will tell him when he's back ;)
<\sh> mbreit: so when we will see u as motu?
<ajmitch> \sh: c++ mess?
<dholbach> hey sistpoty - nice to see you
<mbreit> well, that does not depend on me ;)
<sistpoty> hi dholbach
<siretart> huhu sistpoty
<sistpoty> hi siretart
<\sh> ajmitch: wrong void usage ;)
<\sh> ajmitch: but I don't see the light in there...it's a bloody overloaded function
<ajmitch> \sh: I'm not a C++ expert, sadly
<ajmitch> I can take a look & beat my head against it :)
<\sh> ajmitch: i can send u a first patch to fix the easy issues ,-)
<mbreit> \sh: i think i should do some more motu work before talking about me becoming a motu...
<ajmitch> it doesn't help that there's been no debian upload for ~2 years
<dholbach> mbreit: you'll be fine soon :)
<\sh> mbreit: sure...help us with everything...and learn from slomo ,-)
<mbreit> btw: i just uploaded a new gnomemeeting package to revu... please review ;))
<\sh> ajmitch: *nod*
<\sh> oh...
<ajmitch> hi bddebian
<\sh> gnomemeeting is in main?
<mbreit> oh no..
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<mbreit> i meant gnomeradio of cause
<\sh> ah ;)
<siretart> mbreit: reviews are on the topic of our meeting starting in 5 minutes. don't you want to join, too?
<\sh> mbreit: u r welcome to attend :)
<mbreit> yes, i have planned to do that ;)
<mbreit> thanks!
<siretart> :)
<mbreit> is the meeting in #ubuntu-meeting?
<\sh> yep
<dholbach> yep
<ajmitch> so it'll hopefully get quiet in here for a bit :)
<mbreit> ;)
<\sh> meeting is starting in -3
<\sh> -1
<bddebian> \sh, the timekeeper :-)
<siretart> now! :)
<sistpoty2> gna... 24h disconnect :(
#ubuntu-motu 2005-08-09
<ajmitch> hard choices, should I do simple-patchsys or dpatch for this package? :)
<mbreit> ajmitch: i would say, if you use cdbs use the first.. if not, use dpatch...
<ajmitch> well I'd rather not use a patch system at all & convert all these packages to baz archives
<crimsun> I'd use simple-patchsys only because I'm used to it, but cdbs is fair game.
<ajmitch> but that will take a bit longer to setup
<janimonoses> hey crimsun
<janimonoses> so far I only closed the MOM bugs
<janimonoses> some more xfce packages built after the clean sync but many didn't still
<janimonoses> I am looking at weird build failures
<ajmitch> please
<crimsun> janimonoses: ok.
<crimsun> I'm looking at xfce-mcs-manager now.
<janimonoses> crimsun, I think I saw similar pkg-config errors in hoary but I don't know in which package and more importantly how did the problem go away :)
<crimsun> janimonoses: hard-wired configure.ac, mostly
<dholbach> mdz: we're meeting in #ubuntu-meeting - if you wanted to join us
<ogra> yay mdz
<dholbach> mdz: point 5 of https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTUMeeting
<ogra> we're discussing config{sub,guess} handling in the pacjage
<ogra> by default dh_make places the copying in the clean target, that means i clutter my diff.gz totally... whats the rationale for that
<ogra> ?
<ogra> grmpf... talking to myself here
<bddebian> ogra: :-)
<Burgundavia> ogra, well, tuxtype has legal issues as well
<ogra> hrmpf
<Burgundavia> but a new upstream, not yet in debian might solve it
<Burgundavia> see http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=218908
<Burgundavia> without that new upstream version, I don't see pitti approving it
<Burgundavia> ogra, can you help me with FHS and Debian Policy stuff?
<ajmitch> what FHSisms are at issue?
<Burgundavia> ajmitch, no, just checking that packages meet those
<ogra> Burgundavia, sure... but currently i'm in motu meeting... and if the packages come from deban we dont need to care about FHS i think
<Burgundavia> I honestly have no idea where to start looking
<Burgundavia> ogra, can I assume all debian packages meet both, or there would be bugs about it?
<ogra> yep the latter
<Burgundavia> ok
<Burgundavia> ogra, we have to move an entire source package, no?
<ogra> Burgundavia, either that, or modify and split the binary targets that get built from it
<Burgundavia> this is one of those huge kde packages
<Burgundavia> kdeedu
<ogra> do we need that ? i thought we only need pieces...
<Burgundavia> we need all but about 3 parts
<Burgundavia> the japanese lang stuff
<Burgundavia> ogra, shall we just pull in the remain few things?
<ogra> hmm, can we postpone that decision ? i' currently in the mou meeting and working since 16h or more...
<Burgundavia> ogra, ok
<Burgundavia> shall I email edubuntu-devel about it?
<dholbach> good night everybody
<ogra> Burgundavia, probaly good as a reminder
<comadreja> ogra: I have some minor problems, do you have a bit of time for me ?
<comadreja> ogra: or maybe refer me to somebody else I could ask for help...
* ogra doesnt know who's awake now... 
<ogra> what is it comadreja ?
<comadreja> launchpad doesn't let me join the team moto and motuim
<comadreja> and I haven't received yet acknowledge for my key, CoC signature
<ogra> comadreja, someone has to add you
<comadreja> it doesn't let me even be a proposed member
<ogra> mako was travelling, he just arrived home... give him some time to catch up with mails and poke him online
<comadreja> oh, I see, could you add me to the motu team ?
* ajmitch still isn't in the ubuntu members group :)
<ogra> comadreja, you launchpad name ?
<ogra> your
* ajmitch will bbl
<comadreja> ogra, jorge-drqueue ?
<ogra> jorge@drqueue.org ?
<comadreja> yes
<ogra> added
<comadreja> thanks !!
<comadreja> you rock :D
<ogra> its two clicks ;)
<comadreja> hey why is everybody administrator and me only approved ? :D
<ogra> changed, sorry :)
<comadreja> just kidding, I thought it was right :)
<ogra> every approved member should be able to change stuff for motu ;)
<comadreja> oh, I see
<mbreit> i will go to bed now, too...
<mbreit> good night everybody!
<comadreja> nite mbreit
* robitaille wonders if he should apply for the MOTU launchpad team and see how much bug report spam he generates....
<robitaille> ~/quit
<Burgundavia> ogra, I will email edubuntu-devel. I should also be able to have most of the reports finished tonight
<ogra> wow
<ogra> Burgundavia, you rock  !!
<Burgundavia> it just means I have to knuckle down
<Burgundavia> making the reports is quite tedious
<ogra> yes, but there are some heavy things in the list.. i'll have to add a lot later and ahve to change several dependencys of the packages
<Burgundavia> the servers apps I would like you to do
<Burgundavia> I don't trust that I have the right knowledge
<ogra> sure, no prob... especially since we dont know yet if we go with php4 or 5
<ogra> i have to rebuild and test the packages first
<Burgundavia> the desktop stuff is pretty easy and I haven'
<ogra> but currently my nightmare has the name gcompris... it wont compile with gcc-4.0
<Burgundavia> the kdeedu stuff is going to be easy
<Burgundavia> I don't anticipate any problems there
* ajmitch returns
<tseng> hi
<ajmitch> ogra: do you know if gcompris FTBFS in sid as well? I don't see the bugreport there
<ajmitch> how's it going, tseng ?
<tseng> meh
<ajmitch> one of those weeks?
<ogra> ajmitch, nope, but on all gcc-4.0 based distros
<ogra> cvs works fine here, i'll fix our package tomorrow
<ajmitch> ogra: ok, I guess someone is yet to file a sid bug (hint, hint) *g*
<ogra> ajmitch, i'll do this as well, but i cant wait anymore for debian...
* bddebian hides before he gets "Volunteered" again.. ;-)
<ogra> *g*
<ajmitch> ogra: I know, I don't want to put any more pressure on you
<ajmitch> bddebian: whyever not?
<ajmitch> summaries of meetings is nice & easy :)
<ogra> ajmitch, i work better under pressure ;)
<ajmitch> so do I, funnily enough
<ogra> but the only thing that is able to give me pressure is a calendar :)
* ajmitch has the client coming in tomorrow at some point to get a demo
<ajmitch> of course I only found out about it yesterday ;)
<ogra> fun :)
<ajmitch> sure is
<ajmitch> not as fun as fixing unmet deps though
<bddebian> Heh
<bddebian> OK, ice cream time, later gang
<ajmitch> bye bddebian
* ajmitch looks at rapidsvn.. needs sync from experimental rather than fixed
<ajmitch> if I touch it & don't file a debian bug, doko would hunt me down ;)
<ogra> ciao bddebian
<Burgundavia> ogra, you are aware that audacity is still borked on breezy
<ajmitch> Burgundavia: how so?
<ajmitch> please give some details of how I broke it, please :)
<bddebian> eh
<bddebian> Err heh even
<Burgundavia> ajmitch, cannot find default sound device
<crimsun> even if /dev/dsp is free?
<Burgundavia> yes
<Burgundavia> bloody hell, malone is borked right now
<ajmitch> ok..
<Burgundavia> it might just be my system
<robitaille> Burgundavia:  Malone seems to work for me
<Burgundavia> I type is the search bar and go here
<robitaille> I was looking at https://launchpad.net/malone/bugs/337
<Burgundavia> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/
* ajmitch is at work right now, can't check audacity
<robitaille> Burgundavia:  https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/ works for me...
<Burgundavia> yes, but I don't go to that page
<Burgundavia> my url stays the search one
<Burgundavia> ajmitch, you are doing alsa stuff no?
<ajmitch> Burgundavia: nope, crimsun is
<Burgundavia> ok
<ajmitch> I try & ignore the details of sound stuff as much as possible :)
<Burgundavia> crimsun, are we waiting on a sync from debian with alsa?
* ajmitch can't believe that someone would set sb16 detection as major severity, high priority :)
<crimsun> Burgundavia: which source package?
<ajmitch> considering that they don't even use ubuntu1
<ajmitch> crimsun: look at malone #407 & lart them :)
<Burgundavia> crimsun, -base and -utils
<Burgundavia> sorry, -driver
<crimsun> Burgundavia: perhaps 4
<crimsun> (-4)
<Burgundavia> ok
<robitaille> ajmitch:  well...if you can't listen to your mp3s on your sb16 card, that's a real emergency :)
<ajmitch> robitaille: I've still got an sb16pnp in a breezy box here :)
<ajmitch> I can't remember the last time it actually worked
<crimsun> snd-sb16 should work fine with it if it's a genuine SB16 PNP
<bddebian> Gnight gang
<ajmitch> crimsun: sure, but my card is probably dead
<ajmitch> isa deserves to be relegated to the history books :)
<chillywilly> barry is a wimp
<chillywilly> :)
<chillywilly> who the hell needs sleep anyway?
<ajmitch> I don't see you volunteering to help out with everything ;)
<chillywilly> I attempted to build some packages that had unmet deps but this guy ajmitch took away all my fun :)
<ajmitch> that's what I'm here for
* chillywilly is actually screwing around with M$ Project...boy is this fun...
<Burgundavia> chillywilly, you tried planner?
<chillywilly> wassat? ;)
<chillywilly> oh, project replacement
<Burgundavia> pretty much dead
<Burgundavia> needs someone who likes to hack something like that
<chillywilly> I'd rather have something web based
<Burgundavia> which is pretty much nobody
<chillywilly> dotproject looked promising
<chillywilly> but I figure I will just learn stinking M$ Project for now and then find something web based later on
<dabaR> Hi. Is there a bum package for ubuntu anywhere?
<Burgundavia> dabaR, just got synced
<dabaR> was that mean?
<dabaR> haha
<dabaR> that did not mean what I meant.
<ajmitch> he means 'yes'
<dabaR> What do you mean synced?
<dabaR> ok, coolness.
<dabaR> so, in one of the repos for hoary?
<ajmitch> probably breezy
<ajmitch> it would only be in hoary if it were backported
<dabaR> hm...so should one isntall it onto hoary, what is your estimate?
<Lathiat> dabaR: it wont happen unless someone begs for it to go into backports, and assuming it can easily go into backports
<dabaR> so not just install the breezy version onto hoary?
<ajmitch> it's often not a good idea
<dabaR> so, yall been warned type of deal...ok, thank you guys.
* Amaranth passes out
* Natja is away: Pas l, pas loin
<Burgundavia> Natja, please turn that off
<chillywilly> hmmm, MS Project must die
<siretart> morning, folks
* Natja is back (gone 00:23:12)
<Amaranth> Natja: Please turn that off.
<Burgundavia> hmm --> http://users.on.net/~spohlenz/ubuntu/
<siretart> Burgundavia: what is with that?
<Burgundavia> basic little tool to install ndiswrapper stuff, graphically
<siretart> cool
<Burgundavia> there are even sources there
<Burgundavia> I have asked the author to come here
<Burgundavia> http://www.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?p=286024&posted=1#post286024
<siretart> I don't use ndiswrapper, but he is welcome to upload that package to revu
<Burgundavia> yes
<Burgundavia> that ndiswrapper thing is even written in python
<siretart> cool
<Burgundavia> the UI cannot be simpler
<Burgundavia> siretart, http://img323.imageshack.us/my.php?image=ndisgtk0zc.png
<siretart> looking nice, indeed
<Burgundavia> this one we might want to push into main
<niran> it's another summer of code project: http://spohlenz.blogspot.com/
<Burgundavia> oh
<Burgundavia> didn't know that
<Burgundavia> that is why it is written in python
<niran> it's for this spec: http://udu.wiki.ubuntu.com/GraphicalConfigTools
<Burgundavia> given that all the ones on that page got done by gnome in .12, I wondered what they would do
<tamir>  /msg NickServ IDENTIFY 275364547
<Burgundavia> tamir, oops
<Burgundavia> tamir, you know that xchat can autoidentify for you?
<tamir> damit
<tamir> oh doesn't matter, I don't care of this
<Burgundavia> I find it interesting who is fetching that atheros project stuff
<siretart> do you mean madwifi?
<siretart> who is caring for this?
<Burgundavia> no
<Burgundavia> fedora got a soc to reverse engineer the atheros driver
<Burgundavia> http://computer-lab.blogspot.com/
<Burgundavia> fedora and ubuntu both got bounties to write simple backup things. Both to be written in python
<niran> i could search... but where are the fedora bounties?
<Burgundavia> http://www.fedoraproject.org/wiki/FedoraBounties
<niran> thanks
<Burgundavia> I really hope in the next month we get a flood of releasing stuff
<Burgundavia> because it is all quiet on the western front with some people
<niran> yeah, there's a few of the ubuntu bounties that i havent heard anything about
<Burgundavia> one has already been dropped
<Burgundavia> the xen stuff
<niran> yeah, i saw that
<niran> i don't know how many of them realize that the projects are supposed to be finished by feature freeze
<niran> i.e. one week
<Burgundavia> ouch
<Burgundavia> features after feature freeze make the doc team hunt you down and kill you
<niran> exactly
<niran> i'd like to live
<niran> there are still a couple of big things i need to do in the next week
<niran> it should be interesting
<niran> and next week is my physics final
<niran> fun.
<siretart> what?!
<siretart> xen has been dropped?! why that?
<niran> the bounty reciever never replied
<Treenaks> that, and the hype has died down
<siretart> :(
<siretart> is there some mail about that decision? or blog entry?
<niran> hm... i thought the breezygoals page said it, but now it says it's assigned
<niran> did someone else get it afterwards?
<Burgundavia> deferred
<niran> ah, it's here: http://udu.wiki.ubuntu.com/BreezyBounties
<siretart> err, I thought ed despard was working on this
<siretart> he wrote this in a mail to ubuntu-devel on Jul 5
<niran> ah, i see the mail
<niran> maybe it will actually happen
<Burgundavia> all the google stuff I want to see happen, but your stuff niran was probably the best
<niran> :) that's why i picked it
<Burgundavia> I am glad you have not gone awol
<niran> i think it'll really nelp new users that are used to the windows way to install programs
<Burgundavia> yes
<Burgundavia> synaptic + my step-mother = evil
<niran> haha
<Burgundavia> let alone CLI stuff
<niran> i think what really helps in terms of the bounties is that i was already around the community beforehand, so i kind of knew how things worked
<Burgundavia> yes
<Burgundavia> dropping in and starting something like g-a-i is hard
<niran> i still had to spend lots of time learning random things
<niran> it's my first real pygtk program
<niran> plus, it's using libraries with no documentation
<niran> fun.
<Burgundavia> when does google want the project to be done by?
<niran> sept 1
<Burgundavia> ah
<Burgundavia> and who upchecks you?
<niran> our mentor
<niran> for me, mvo
<Burgundavia> ok
<Burgundavia> is the plan to make g-a-i agnostic of dpkg and push it upstream?
<niran> ultimately, sure
<niran> if fedora or someone shows interest, i'll try to abstract away the apt-isms
<niran> but for now it's not worth it
<Burgundavia> ya
<niran> what i'm more concerned about is making it easy for someone to do a kde port
<niran> but... it's tied pretty closely to the gui, so it'd take a lot of new code
<niran> one gtk program won't hurt kubuntu people
<Lathiat> ITS MURDER
<koke> niran: BTW, if you want to look at my old notes about FindingPackages http://wiki.amedias.org/wk/FindingPackages
<niran> koke, cool, thanks
<niran> Lathiat, you'll live :)
<koke> I've just seen rrdtool binary is in universe but source is in main
<koke> is it normal? have I missed a layout change? :)
<Burgundavia> night
<herve> hello
<ajmitch> hey herve
<\sh> hey herve
<\sh> tseng: what must I read now on p.u.c? u had a surgery?
<ajmitch> \sh!
<tseng> \sh: i did.
<tseng> yesterday
<ajmitch> must have been fun
<tseng> much better now
<\sh> tseng: I hope nothing serious....a new arm or something for faster typing?
<ajmitch> recovering ok then?
<tseng> yep
<tseng> \sh: i am the 6 million dollar man
<tseng> \sh: no.. read the post before
<\sh> tseng: ay...this is not good..
<ajmitch> no, it's obvious he needs motu work to keep his mind off things
<\sh> i believe it came with the mono work...MS stuff is not healthy at all...try to work on python stuff, tseng, or perl, and everything will be fine
<tseng> i am not that interested in mono in and of itself, believe it or not
<ajmitch> mainly in the apps?
<Treenaks> tseng: so you're not Miguel's clone?
<tseng> its the apps that run on mono that i am in love with
<tseng> Treenaks: no.
<\sh> tseng: as your doc I will give you the advise..leave mono for a while and concentrate on soft stuff like python or perl ,-)
<tseng> haha
<tseng> i do tcl and php at work
<ajmitch> miguel can be quite entertaining
<tseng> ajmitch++
<tseng> bradb: yo yo
<ajmitch> how's the launchpad sprint going/gone in .br?
<bradb> hey tseng, how's it going?
<tseng> bradb: not too bad, yourself?
<bradb> good thanks. busy spec'ing in brazil.
<tseng> yeah, brazil :)
<ajmitch> great, malone is looking better these days :)
<CarlFK> how do I tell what libavifile-0.7-dev depends on?
<ajmitch> apt-cache depends libavifile-0.7-dev
<CarlFK> thanks
<ajmitch> and grep-dctrl tells me that only drip & dvr build-depend on it
<CarlFK>  transcode apparently does
<CarlFK> but  libavifile-0.7-dev wont install
<CarlFK> libavifile-0.7-dev: Conflicts: libavifile-0.7 but 1:0.7.43.20050224-1ubuntu4 is to be installed
<ajmitch> right, I just checked universe, not multiverse :)
<ajmitch> perhaps it's a package that hasn't progressed through NEW due to a c++ transition or similar?
<ajmitch> or I think the depends/conflicts is a mess
<CarlFK> should I post this to the -devel list?
<ajmitch> possibly, I'm not sure if anyone plans to fix it there
<ajmitch> since it's a universe issue
<CarlFK> ah
<CarlFK> so where?
<ajmitch> file bugs in malone
<CarlFK> I have heard of that... where is it?
<ajmitch> launchpad.net/malone
<CarlFK> thanks
<CarlFK> so do I register libavifile as a product?
<tseng> no
<tseng> oh wow @ new malone page
<tseng> CarlFK: File bug on a package
<CarlFK> which package?
<tseng> libavifile?
<CarlFK> ah - i see package now
<tseng> bradb: i am loving malone.
<CarlFK> how do I search for libavifile?
<tseng> view ubuntu bugs
<tseng> on the front page
<bradb> tseng: really, that's good to hear
<bradb> tseng: have you noticed significant improvements of late?
<tseng> it looks like you fixed alot of my problems
<tseng> bradb: im just now seeing the new updates, i must have not been on the page for awhile
<ajmitch> yeah, malone is certainly more usable now
<tseng> but oh
<tseng> i got some malone spam
<tseng> should i fwd to you
<ogra> bradb, hey... have a look at
<ogra> https://launchpad.ubuntu.com/malone/bugs/768
<ogra>  ... any chance to avoid autoresponder spam from users ?
<tseng> ah, right
<ajmitch> because we get that spam now that the bugs are assigned to us
<ajmitch> that's what we had to ask about - getting a mailing list subscribed instead of all the MOTU team
<ogra> the bugsummary is worth making a poster of it  :)
<tseng> what about an alias
<tseng> rather than a list
<ogra> 2.0.1-7ubuntu2 fubar, rebuilt 2.0.4-1 from Debian Testing fine
<bradb> sorry guys, getting kind of distracted over here in .br. in the middle of writing Malone specs.
<bradb> next landing is a CVE report for the distribution
<tseng> thats what gentoo does, as \sh is so fond of pointing out :P
<bradb> by tomorrowish, we should have landed the source package bugs listing
<ajmitch> sweet
<CarlFK> shouldn't "source package name" be libavifile-0.7-dev or something similar?
<mbreit> source package name of libavifile is "avifile"
<mbreit> see apt-cache show libavifile-0.7-dev
<CarlFK> thanks
<mbreit> btw: could someone please review my gnomeradio package?
<mbreit> http://siretart.tauware.de/revu/details.py?upid=292
<ajmitch> should I bother to fix the speedtouch package? since apparantly it isn't needed for kernels >= 2.6.10
* ajmitch uses it on a sarge box downstairs..
<tseng> sounds like a -devel list question
<havoc> what is speedtouch?
<tseng> see if anyone stil has a need
<ajmitch> havoc: dsl modem driver
<havoc> ah
* havoc dislikes DSL :(
<ajmitch> there's a kernel driver, and 2.6.10 has it's own firmware loader that this package supplied
<havoc> DSL sucks
<havoc> at least SBC's DSL sucks
<ajmitch> so does everything else, but DSL just sucks less
<havoc> SBC's is pretty bad as far as reliability goes
<havoc> I have many clients who have no other option other than SBC DSL and it is nothing but problems
<havoc> most of the issues related to PPPoE
* ajmitch has no option but dsl
<ajmitch> and there's only 1 dsl provider here
<havoc> or rather their implementation of PPPoE
<havoc> ajmitch: SBC?
<tseng> you guys dont do cable?
<ajmitch> no...
<ajmitch> this is new zealand, why would we have SBC? :)
<havoc> ajmitch: duh, I forgot :)
<ajmitch> there is cable in only a couple of areas in NZ
<ajmitch> but telecom NZ has the DSL monopoly
<highvoltage> hi guys
<zul> powered by sheep?
<tseng> is this "the" jono?
<ajmitch> no, hot air piped in from parliament :P
<zul> hehe
<ajmitch> looks like backports mono is failing on the buildd due to build-deps
<tseng> which?
<ajmitch> 36	 cli-common: Depends: mono-utils but it is not installable or
<ajmitch> 37	cil-disassembler but it is not installable
<ajmitch> just the usual
<tseng> oh right..
<tseng> buh
<ajmitch> that's why I specified backports before getting you worried
<tseng> yes i forgot to tell them to bootstrap it
<highvoltage> tseng: what do you mean by "the" jono?
<tseng> ill get Mez up to speed when im not hopped up on drugs
<tseng> highvoltage: jono bacon
<highvoltage> oh, no.
<highvoltage> my name is jonathan :)
<tseng> heh.
<\sh> going home...later dudes
<Mez> ajmitch, mono failing on buildd? tseng told me it built fine
<tseng> Mez: you need to cut build-deps to start
<tseng> its funny
<tseng> we can talk about it later
<Mez> ??
<tseng> ??
<tseng> its a bootstrap dude
<tseng> mono build-dep cli common, cli-common dep mono
<tseng> you have to work around first upload
<Mez> ah fair enough
<tseng> we'll talk later
<Mez> tseng: fair enough - you'll have to poke me and stuff
<Mez> I cant see it failing though
<tseng> yep
<tseng> aj says it is
<tseng> i believe everything he says.
<Mez> ah yes it is
<Mez> but cli-common is building ok
<Mez> well, i386 is anyways
<tseng> yes but its uninstallable
<tseng> is the point
<Mez> ah, yes :D I see what you mean now
<Mez> file:///usr/share/ubuntu-artwork/home/index.html
<Mez> grr
<Mez> The following packages have unmet dependencies:
<Mez>   cli-common: Depends: mono-utils but it is not installable or
<Mez>                        cil-disassembler but it is not installable
<Mez>               Depends: mono-mcs but it is not installable or
<Mez>                        strong-name-tool but it is not installable
<Mez> E: Broken packages
<tseng> yes
<tseng> so the deal is
<tseng> oh wow
<tseng> how are we going to do this
<tseng> if everything has to be pulled from breezy
<Mez> tseng: how did you get it to build for hoary?
<tseng> hoary was totally different
<tseng> and much worse
<tseng> oh.. how did i do the backport?
<tseng> i commented out cli-common build dep
<tseng> and dh_*cli* in rules
<tseng> built once
<tseng> then cli-common is installable
<tseng> put it all back, built again
<tseng> done.
<Mez> so you basically made a fake pacakge for cli-common
<tseng> but you cant make changes to the packages
<tseng> yes
<tseng> a bootstrap
<Mez> hmmles
* Mez pings elmo/mdz
<Mez> tseng: I think we can probably get this to work, it's just a PITA to get it to that point
<tseng> ok
<tseng> someone can insert it by hand
<tseng> the dummy source, that is
<tseng> and then do a normal backport
<tseng> I think
* chillywilly kick MS Projet in the nads
<chillywilly> Project too
<chillywilly> what a useless tool...people just simply do not work this way
<chillywilly> I am not a computer I don't do everything sequentially ;)
<chillywilly> I also cannot predict the future
<tamir> Does some one have freezing rhythembox problems?
<tamir> I think it is something wrong with the package
<bddebian> Howdy
<Mez> tseng: brandon right?
<tseng> yes
<tseng> whats up?
<Mez> just checking so I knew I was CC:ing the right person
<bddebian> ogra: Ah, I thought I scared you away when I joined.. ;-)
<ogra> bddebian, you did... but i recreated very fast today :P
<bddebian> Heh
<ogra> :)
<siretart> release candidate 1 finished..
<tseng> of revu2?
<siretart> tseng: hehe, of my thesis ;)
<tseng> oh.
<siretart> but this means, I will soon have time to work on reu2
<siretart> revu2
<bddebian> Heh
<tseng> i figured out why cover art fetching in muine is broken (and fixed it)
<tseng> rock on.
<bddebian> tseng++
<bddebian> Heya majic
<majic> hello bddebian
<majic> how is the universe today?
<bddebian> How would I know? :-)
<terrex> i'm fine, thx
<terrex> lol
<majic> I suppose I need to get one of those fancy gpg key things...
<bddebian> majic: If you want to become an MOTU, yes :-)
<majic> I'm researching it. I never messed with gnupg before.
<majic> so once I create a key, somebody will have to sign it so that it can become part of the strongly connected set?
<bddebian> majic: Yes, basically
<dholbach> hellas :)
<dholbach> could somebody remove "danielholbach" from malone motu group and add "dh" instead? thanks :)
<mbreit> hi dholbach... and thanks for the vote...
<dholbach> mbreit: de rien :)
<ogra> dholbach, any objection to do that yourself ?
<ogra> i made all memebers admins
<dholbach> ogra: danielholbach is a random crappy account
<dholbach> ogra: dh is MY account
<dholbach> :)
<dholbach> that's my major objection which brought me here in the first place :-p
<ogra> heh... ok, so if we want to see you here, we'll change your launchpad login in the future... great info ;)
<dholbach> hahahahah
<bddebian> Heya dholbach
<dholbach> hey barry
<tseng> dholbach!
<dholbach> brandon! woohoo! - you're all here :)
<tseng> sortof
* bddebian sent meeting minutes to \sh
<dholbach> bddebian: super!
<ogra> wow
<ogra> thats fats
<ogra> fast too
<dholbach> i'm glad to see that everything's still the same... still REVIEW DAY! and ogra still struggles with his keyboard :-p
<bddebian> Well, I didn't say they were right :-)
<dholbach> ok, i'll be off cooking, before ogra slaps me too hard
<ogra> dholbach, yes, but only because i broke it with my forehead hitting it caused by a gcompris desiase
<dholbach> ogra: that's completely understandable
<dholbach> ogra: ask herve on the side effects of extensive gcompris debugging
<ogra> i fixed it... but python-gnome2-dev was broken.... costs me half a day...
<herve> dholbach, 2 aspirins and a rope attached on the ceil
* bddebian jumps for the rope first
<ogra> bddebian, thats a waste of aspirine
* dholbach hugs herve consolingly
<herve> hello, by the way
<dholbach> :)
<bddebian> Hello herve
<herve> hello from Paris even :-)
<bddebian> herve: Nice
<dholbach> you're in paris?
<dholbach> cool
<dholbach> i'd love to get there once again
<herve> Montmartre, Pigalle :-)
<herve> a tv series was shot the whole day in front of our office
<herve> there were sweet actresses :-)
<bddebian> Heh
<jeffm> hey guys
<jeffm> can i install KDE on Ubuntu with no reprocussions?
<dholbach> what's a reprocussion?
<jeffm> will everything still work after i install KDE
<dholbach> yes
<jeffm> ok cool
<dholbach> you can remove it afterwards as well (if you shouldn't like it)
<jeffm> so its no big deal switching between KDE and GNOME
<dholbach> not at all
<jeffm> wicked
<dholbach> you can choose the session type on the login screen
<jeffm> are you on Ubuntu right now?
<dholbach> yes
<jeffm> whats its best feature??
<dholbach> that's a good question, but i think after more than a year i haven't decided yet - maybe somebody else knows a good answer to that :)
<jeffm> lol
<jeffm> did you switch from micro$oft?
<dholbach> i think it's closest to the "just works" ideal and i love it's community
<jeffm> k
<jeffm> lol
<dholbach> that was no joke, i really do :)
<jeffm> good
<dholbach> so you're going to try ubuntu now?
<jeffm> well, on Friday
<dholbach> excellent
<jeffm> im getting a laptop
<jeffm> and im gonna put Ubuntu on it
<highvoltage> cool
<koke> jeffm: I installed kubuntu-desktop last week and works nice .)
<dholbach> super, be sure to tell the mailing list how it all went
<jeffm> isnt it in Beta?
<dholbach> hoary is released
<jeffm> ok
<koke> jeffm: so it's breezy and I'm using it everyday :)
<jeffm> whats the diff, besides KDE?
<dholbach> breezy is still a bit bumpy and if you don't know where to look for errors it's a bit hard
<dholbach> better stick to hoary still
<koke> sure, hoary is nice enough :)
<dholbach> if you install ubuntu, you can load the kubuntu-desktop package from the net (via synaptic) and be off just fine
<jeffm> nice
<koke> and there'snot much time left untils breezy becomes stable too
<jeffm> i cant wait
<jeffm> :D
<dholbach> or install kubuntu hoary and load the ubuntu-desktop package (that's vice versa)
<jeffm> yeah
<koke> the result should be the same
<dholbach> koke: 9 weeks or something
<jeffm> ok, is the Ubuntu setup complicated?
<dholbach> not at all
<dholbach> should be pretty straight forward
<dholbach> if you know partitioning from the windows world a bit, you shouldnt be afraid
<dholbach> but there are setup guides out there
<jeffm> ok nice
<bddebian> ZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
<bddebian> Everybody is busy working right? :)
<chillywilly> yea right
<chillywilly> need foof
<chillywilly> food too
<chillywilly> bye
<bddebian> chillywilly!!!!
<chillywilly> bddebian!
<bddebian> chillywilly: You an MOTU yet? ;-)
<chillywilly> no
<chillywilly> u?
<chillywilly> bddebian: you'll always be master of my universe ;)
<tseng> uh
<chillywilly> huh?
<bddebian> chillywilly: ;-)
<bddebian> chillywilly: tseng doesn't like me
<chillywilly> tseng sucks then ;)
<bddebian> Bah
* Amaranth smacks bddebian 
<Amaranth> err, reflex
<Amaranth> ;)
<Burgundavia> bddebian, if you don't dwell on it, tseng won
<Burgundavia> t either
<bddebian> Amaranth: What did I do?
<Amaranth> i dunno
* chillywilly brandishes the trout
* bddebian hides
* chillywilly wings it wildly
<Amaranth> just felt like the right thing to do for some reason :D
<chillywilly> *thwap*
<tseng> bddebian: ive told you already
<tseng> bddebian: i dont like you when you are running at the mouth and not contributing anything
<tseng> im much more cooperative when the scale tips the other way
<Riddell> ogra: I'm alowed to upload new stuff to universe yes?
<tseng> stop telling everyone how I hate you, its more "annoyed"
<ogra> Riddell, you ask *me* ?
<ogra> Riddell, you were MOTU before me :)
<tseng> mdz told me yes
<Burgundavia> Riddell, for the record, I heard mdz say that new universe stuff is fine with him
<Riddell> ogra: just checking status of version freeze
<Riddell> Burgundavia: groovy
<ogra> Riddell, we talked about it... i trust you wrt UVF
<chillywilly> tseng: everyone has to start somewhere and bddebian is trying from what I see
<Riddell> groovy groovy
<ogra> Riddell, so just go ahead
<chillywilly> more than I can say for myself :)
<bddebian> chillywilly: It's not good enough :-)
<chillywilly> so what, you'll get better
<chillywilly> what is this? #debian-devel? ;)
<bddebian> Doh... Ouch :-)
<tseng> dude, this doesnt involve you
<chillywilly> and?
<tseng> he's been on about a half dozen times about how i "hate him"
<tseng> its tiring
<chillywilly> I thought he was just being his normal goofy joking self
<Burgundavia> ogra, that is a nasty version number
<ogra> hehee
<ogra> its a ridiculous patch, that deserves a ridiculous version number :)
* Burgundavia imagines pitti saying "You want to my to upcheck that?"
<ogra> i'll sort it with pitti... dont worry... i dont expect i'll get it through without changes ;) but i need the package installable to move on for now
<ogra> i can always unapply the patch (its just dpatched) and even decide we move childsplay to main instead of gcompris
<Burgundavia> I have always found gcompris to be very crashy
<ogra> its rocksolid here
<Burgundavia> ok
<ogra> at least the little alien i made of it :)
<ogra> <-- never used gcompris before edubuntu
<tseng> alien :/
<tseng> im using that on scotty from mandrake
<tseng> debian dropped it years ago
<ogra> i didnt mean the tool :)
<tseng> oh
<ogra> i wouldnt upload alienized packages... even if alien would create source packages
<tseng> sure
<bddebian> tseng: So if you think I'm not doing enough, tell me what I should be doing :)
<tseng> bddebian: start by not randomly going on with "tseng hates me"
<tseng> i thought we were both past that
<bddebian> :-)  Sorry, I have esteem problems :-)
<ajmitch> morning
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<bddebian> ajmitch: Since tseng won't tell me, will you tell me what I should focus on? :)
<tseng> unmet deps.
<bddebian> Stick to UnmetDeps?
<bddebian> Ohh heh
<tseng> theres lots!
<bddebian> No kidding
<ajmitch> bddebian: stop being so paranoid
<bddebian> ajmitch: Paranoid about what?
<bddebian> Heya \sh
<ajmitch> people hating you, not talking to you, etc
<\sh> evening
<bddebian> \sh: You get my meeting minutes?  Not specific enough?
<ajmitch> hello \sh
<mbreit> hi \sh
<\sh> bddebian: I will wrap the rest ,) your "STEPHAN" was noted *lol*
<\sh> hey mbreit
<bddebian> OK, thx
* Mez goes and shufties around UnmetDeps
<mbreit> tseng: and there are yet many debdiffs on the wiki page, but it seems that no motu is reviewing them
<bddebian> mbreit: Glad you said that :)
<ajmitch> sigh, elmo is around but boa-constructor isn't ready to be synced
<tseng> mbreit: sorry. there are more projects than motus
<dholbach> mbreit: is uploading that stuff to REVU to much overhead?
<mbreit> dholbach: you told me not to upload it to revu? (or was it siretart?)
<tseng> mbreit: hopefully bddebian will go for his upload rights soon and can go straight to the top.
<bddebian> To be honest, I'm not sure I'm ready.  I feel like there is a lot I don't know yet.
<Mez> tseng: straight to the top?
<mbreit> tseng: sorry, i think you misunderstood me... i did not want to critizise me
<Mez> tseng: I think I'm still waiting for my upload rights
<\sh> Mez: me as well for main....but don't hesitate :)
<\sh> ask ivoks..when he's back
<mbreit> ahm, i did not want to critizise _you_ of cause
<Mez> \sh - hesitate ?
<\sh> Mez: ivoks went crazy ,-)
<Mez> ??
<\sh> Mez: to wait for elmo :)
<mbreit> well, i am a bit confused now... should simple changes like the ones on the unmet deps page be uploaded to revu or not?
<Mez> how did he go crazy?
<Mez> mbreit: depends on how big the change is and whether you can get someone to review a debdiff
<bddebian> mbreit: If they aren't very big no
<\sh> Mez: he just started to try to upload every day ;)
<bddebian> mbreit: In fact, I was told, they shouldn't really go on REVU at all because they aren't "new".
<Mez> \sh lmao
<Mez> \sh I've been trying now and then
<mbreit> okay, my noteedit debdiff could be a candidate for revu, but the rest?
<mbreit> the most patches are simple rebuild-for-unmet-deps-patches...
<\sh> sorry when I'm delayed with my answers ...I'm hanging clothes
<mbreit> \sh: you wanted to review my qcad patch... you promised to do that after the cc meeting ;) i do not want to annoy you, just to remind you.. if you have some time left....
<\sh> mbreit: just a moment :)
<bddebian> mbreit: If I understood ajmitch correctly the other night, if all it needs is a rebuild with no changes, just make a note on the wiki.  Doesn't even need a changelog entry
<\sh> let me finish my underwear :)
<bddebian> uhm
<mbreit> ah, btw: i looked at the breezy release schedule today...
<mbreit> and i have a question about that:
<tseng> shoot
<tseng> you know, no one probably needs to post diff's for rebuilds
<tseng> its just as easy for me to do the changelog myself
<mbreit> tseng: some motu told me to do so ;)
<tseng> hm
<tseng> arent we organized
<mbreit> can new packages come into universe after the feature freeze?
<bddebian> no
<tseng> yes
<dholbach> yes
<mbreit> okay, thanks
<bddebian> I meant NO to
<bddebian> <tseng> arent we organized
<Mez> mbreit: if they're just rebuilds - then poke a MOTU
<Mez> if you have to change something - and the debdiff is small, poke a MOTU
<tseng> can someone tell me what things are simple rebuilds?
<Mez> if it's BIG(or not small)
<Mez> then REVU is yours
<tseng> i can do a few
<Mez> tseng: wish I knew :D
<Mez> for example, http://dev.kubuntu.org.uk/~mez/debdiff/webmin-optional.diff would be a "Poke a MOTU" candidate
<mbreit> okay, then could someone please rebuild gltron, qsynth and qjackctl? they all worked well after i rebuilded them in pbuilder
<tseng> i will
<bddebian> I had a few on the wiki that are simple changes/rebuilds
<mbreit> tagtool and skribe also go to that list..
<ajmitch> we try & get to them when we have time
<mbreit> tagtool and skribe are seth's to i can't garantee that
<tseng> i am doing the 3
<mbreit> tseng: thanks!
<bddebian> xdiskusage and xbsql were just rebuilds I think
<tseng> mbreit: please verify them as they build
<\sh> mbreit: which archs u have to test?
<mbreit> i tested all on amd64
<mbreit> but i could also test on x86, but not today, because i need a new chroot for that
<mbreit> tseng: gltron, qsynth and qjackctl are verified by me a few days ago, should i do that again?
<tseng> no i mean
<tseng> after the build by ubuntu
<tseng> verify that they are working and mark them off the list or something
<mbreit> tseng: okay, i will do tha
<mbreit> t
<tseng> ive uploaded those three, are there more you can say are good for sure?
<\sh> mbreit: where is your qcad diff?
<tseng> http://ubuntu.mobr.de/sources/debdiffs/qcad_2.0.4.0-1-2ubuntu1.debdiff
<mbreit> \sh, http://ubuntu.mobr.de/sources/debdiffs/qcad_2.0.4.0-1-2ubuntu1.debdiff
<bddebian> tseng: xdiskusage, xbsql
<bddebian> On x86 anyhow
<mbreit> so http://ubuntu.mobr.de/sources/debdiffs/noteedit_2.7.1-2ubuntu1.debdiff is a candidate for revu?
<tseng> um
<tseng> ok.
<mbreit> it is not as much as it seems to be...
<mbreit> most of that patch is a file from kde svn repository
<tseng> bddebian: done, please verify when they hit the archive
<bddebian> tseng: OK, thx
<mbreit> tseng: oh, thanks for actually mentioning me in the changelog ;)
<tseng> mbreit: thanks for testing.
<mbreit> then i could add them to my done list? ;)))
<tseng> mbreit: its nice to have a documented record of what people do, when you might want to join motu
<tseng> we can point at it
<tseng> mbreit: after they build and you verify it
<mbreit> cool
<tseng> rock on :)
<tseng> you will have a few good things on your list.
<bddebian> Gah, where's the buildlogs again? :-(
<dholbach> http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/byDate/today.html
<tseng> people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/
<Burgundavia> http://hwdb.ubuntu.com/buildlogs/
<tseng> buh
<bddebian> Sheesh, thx
<bddebian> Yeah we're organized  Three MOTUs, three different answers.. ;-P
<Mez> hmmles: logjams deps have been fixed
<tseng> at least they are all right.
<mbreit> tseng: so it's okay if i add these packages to my done list? or should i put your credit there?
<Burgundavia> bddebian, for the record, I am not a MOTU
<tseng> mbreit: no, put *your* credit
<mbreit> cool, thanks
<tseng> mbreit: i dont have to prove anything to anyone :P
<\sh> mbreit: patched qcad source now...I'm test building now
<bddebian> Burgundavia: Oh,sorry
<Burgundavia> bddebian, np
<mbreit> tseng: well, i do ;) perhaps i should do something for my self-esteem...
<tseng> heh.
<tseng> hopefully you will prove yourself to TB someday
<mbreit> \sh: cool...
<mbreit> tb?
<tseng> tech board approves new MOTUs
<\sh> technical board
<\sh> but first he has to be a member, i think
<mbreit> when should i try to become a member? i mean, i just startet with this...
<\sh> mbreit: write a wiki page with everything u did for ubuntu
<\sh> document your work
<mbreit> \sh: well, i only did this motu work...
<mbreit> before that, i tried to help out the backport project on amd64...
<\sh> mbreit: yes..document it
<Mez> mbreit, when was that
<bddebian> mbreit: Any work is help :-)
<mbreit> Mez: i wrote john at least 3 emails, not just one answer...
<Mez> mbreit: not just one answer  .... ?
<Mez> just wondering,cause only peron I know who's worke don backports for amd64 = Mike
<mbreit> everything i heard from him was a short answer in the forums..
<mbreit> and there he just said that most of the work will be done automatically now...
<bddebian> Well I'm gonna head home.  Hopefully I can get some work done there.  Later gang
<mbreit> i did a lot of backports... a complete set of mono 1.1.8 with gtk# and so on for amd64 hoary... and a lot of other things...
<Mez> mbreit: yes it will
<mbreit> Mez: i know... but he could at least answer my questions... that was very frustrating for me
<Mez> are you on the new mailing list?
<mbreit> no, that was before there was a mailing list... i know there was some google group, but i never postet there
<ajmitch> gah, demo at work has been moved up 3 hours... bad things
<Mez> mbreit, well, the google group would have been a good place
<Mez> ajmitch, did your stuff get put into backport
<mbreit> Mez: after trying to contact john directly, i tried it in the forum.. but no luck as well, then i gave up...
<Mez> mbreit: how long ago was this
<\sh> any launchpad gurus online?
<\sh> Mez needs to be as well admin for motu team on LP
<mbreit> Mez: june?
<dholbach> ogra: ^ ^ how is the "new" team called?
<ogra> dholbach, no idea, i guess sabdfl will mail us after he created it
<dholbach> ok
<dholbach> thank you
<ajmitch> Mez: what packages?
<dholbach> i'm doing some reviews - could somebody look at the 1-review-to-upload packages on REVU? :)
<Mez> ajmitch, wha?
<ajmitch> Mez: you asked if I got my stuff into backports
<Mez> oh, I must hit wrong key
<ajmitch> ok :)
<ajmitch> since I didn't recall requesting any backports
<mbreit> Mez: could you (backport team) use another amd64 backporter?
<Mez> ajmitch - was talking to mbreit
<Mez> mbreit, not really now everythings moved to the buildds
<Mez> plus, Mike does a great job anyways
<ajmitch> although it'd be *great* to have the latest upstream inkscape in hoary ;)
<mbreit> Mez: glad to hear that ;)
<Burgundavia> ajmitch, we need it in breezy first
<ajmitch> Burgundavia: I know
<Burgundavia> ajmitch, I need help convincing mdz
<Mez> mbreit,  0.41 ?
<ajmitch> and I hope to see it there soon
<mbreit> Mez: you mean ajmitch...
<Mez> yes
<Mez> ajmitch, 0.41 ?
<Mez> see..
<Mez> yuou talk next to each other
<\sh> ok...
<ajmitch> 0.42
<Burgundavia> ajmitch, I have a half finished email explaining why it is a good thing
<\sh> mbreit: qcad is just building :(
<ajmitch> Burgundavia: it's a great thing, not just a good thing
<mbreit> btw: someone should update gaim-guifications to the new upstream release... there are a lot of fixed bugs
<Burgundavia> ajmitch, mdz freaked at the idea of a big release
<\sh> mbreit: tomorrow morning it should be finished...so it looks good now...and if it builds niceley I will upload the patch ..hope your email address is whitelisted
<ajmitch> Burgundavia: I can understand that
<mbreit> \sh: i know... i takes a bit in pbuilder.. because of this network connections from uic...
<ajmitch> Burgundavia: we're a few weeks past UVF, and they have to support it for 18 months
<\sh> mbreit: i don't really care about uic :) kdebase takes longer ;)
<mbreit> *g*
<Burgundavia> ajmitch, yes
<Burgundavia> ajmitch, the inkscape people already use Ubuntu
<ajmitch> and the notice of 0.42.1 'real soon now' due to serious bugs isn't reassuring
<mbreit> \sh: about my email address is whitelisted: i don't know...
<Burgundavia> ajmitch, seriously?
<ajmitch> Burgundavia: from a distro point of view :)
<Burgundavia> yes
<Burgundavia> just saw that
<\sh> mbreit: please have a look in wiki.ubuntu.com/Uploads and use this address to send your email with a nice statement to elmo
<mbreit> \sh: i will do that
<Burgundavia> the sheer number of features, it doesn't surprise me
<ajmitch> Burgundavia: I think mdz would worry about time it would take the release to stablilise
<ajmitch> and I know the inkscape developers wouldn't want to wait another 8 months to get 0.42 or newer into a stable release
<mbreit> \sh: elmo is at upload@ubuntulinux.org?
<dholbach> mbreit: elmo or whoever does the job at the moment :)
<dholbach> it's connected to the purpose
<Burgundavia> ajmitch, I will prod them about our Feature Freeze
<mbreit> okay, then i should just send an email "please add my address.... etc"?
<\sh> yes
<Burgundavia> ajmitch, you use screem?
<ajmitch> Burgundavia: nope, emacs :)
<Burgundavia> ajmitch, do you know anyone that uses screem on Hoary?
<\sh> ok...off to bed
<ajmitch> Burgundavia: my flatmate is quite into design, and likes inkscape, which is why I would like to see 0.42.1 in
<mbreit> " You must use a GPG key that is known to our archive scripts - if in doubt, mail keyring@ubuntu.com"
<ajmitch> nope
<mbreit> do i have to do that fist?
<mbreit> ... first?
<\sh> mbreit: no
<dholbach> \sh: night stephan
<mbreit> \sh: good night and thanks!
<dholbach> mbreit: you have a gpg key already?
<\sh> dholbach: u will end up like me...broken relationship, sleepless nights, terrible eyes...man..get some rest and sleep :)
<dholbach> \sh: you should have seen me during hoary :)
<mbreit> dholbach: yes... i always had one...
<dholbach> \sh: i have a couple of relationships - that keeps young :-p
<\sh> oh qcad just finished to build
<ajmitch> dholbach: well we saw you after hoary ;)
<dholbach> mbreit: super, just sign it and you're set
<\sh> dholbach: a couple? wow...wanna share? ,-)
<mbreit> okay
<dholbach> \sh: hahahaha :)
<\sh> anyway my girl is back....so I need to get my hands on her...but she has also a lot to do for the weltjugendtag
#ubuntu-motu 2005-08-10
<dholbach> so you can relax a bit together
<\sh> mbreit: uploaded
<ogra> dholbach, nah... he should make her MOTU, then she can help here ;)
<dholbach> ogra: man... :)
<ogra> :)
<\sh> dholbach: yeah..later that month..but hell no..I'm on a training *eeks* and then I want to go to berlin to meet treenaks and eventually dholbach ah thats you ;)
<\sh> ogra: where is your better half to help us here? some rolls and some snacks would be fine ,-)
<dholbach> \sh: ok :)
<dholbach> kmess... what a name for a project
<dholbach> tststs
<mbreit> \sh: thanks, but my email adress is not yet whitelisted ;)
<ogra> \sh, i asked her.... she still thinks about the meaning of the words :)
<\sh> ogra: and actually her son is better in computer then she is...so I will ask her son ;)
<\sh> ogra: didn't you show here last night, what it means: MOTU? *run'n'hide'
<ogra> lol
<ogra> \sh, i sowed her last night what it means if your boyfriend has to build a distro like every night :-P
<ogra> showed even
<\sh> ahaha
<mbreit> oh, xdiskusage failed to compile... we need to tell bddebian about pbuilder ;)
<\sh> mbreit: please send the patches as well to the debian maintainer :) thx
<\sh> mbreit: but only the gcc4 amd64 patches
<\sh> ok...and now...I go and sleep...g'night
<ajmitch> night \sh
<mbreit> good night \sh
<ogra> ciao \sh_away
<dholbach> ok i did 5 reviews today - that's just like review day :)
<mbreit> dholbach: i think you are the only one doing reviews atm...
<dholbach> shall i take a leaf out of \sh's book and go to bed early or do something else?
<Mez> o_O
<Mez> my name shows up :D
<dholbach> mbreit: Riddell, siretart, ivoks, Mez and slomo did some as well
<Mez> hehe :D
<Mez> I dont know if thats just cause I'm whitelisted or cause I've been added, but yay my name shows up
<mbreit> dholbach: i said atm... i know that slomo did many reviews... and siretart as well
<dholbach> maybe there were not as much as anal as i was :)
<Riddell> but dholbach is the best at it :)
<mbreit> but atm slomo is on holiday and siretart works on his theses..
<dholbach> Riddell: sorry for keeping the kde apps from being uploaded :)
<dholbach> Riddell: but it's not just them - i just thought you suffer most from that part of the story
<Mez> dholbach, = uber scary reviewer
<mbreit> Riddell: if you want to get better, there is my gnomeradio package waiting for a few votes ;)
<dholbach> sorry for that
* dholbach lends Mez a "" :)
<Mez> dholbach, i cant be bothered to remember the code for it
<dholbach> Mez: don't worry
<Mez> dholbach or load up kcharmap
<Riddell> mbreit: hmm, that sounds like gnome to me
* ajmitch wishes this terminal did utf-8 :)
<mbreit> Riddell: if you want a kde package, there is my noteedit debdiff ;))
<dholbach> Riddell: slacker - i reviewed quite a bunch of kde apps :-p
<dholbach> majic: ah ok
<majic> dholbach, it's seeming a bit overwhelming with all the information out there on net about package creation. There is quite a bit of information overload.
<dholbach> majic: absolutely
<dholbach> majic: we use REVU as a tool to review packages and give hints on what to do with them
<dholbach> dh_make is a good start to get templates for the stuff in the debian/ directory
<majic> okay, hypothetically if I built a package how do I know that I've built it correctly (in terms of fitting into the Ubuntu way of doing things)
<dholbach> and on REVU (http://wiki.ubuntu.com/REVU has some info on it) you can see quite a lot of source packages, which are in different states of quality
<dholbach> majic: we review it, pbuilder is a nice tool to make sure it builds on a build daemon (http://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto)
<dholbach> majic: and lintian/linda are tools which help you to get a clue of what goes wrong too
<dholbach> majic: we added some tips on http://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingTips as well
<dholbach> majic: but first i'd   apt-get source    a similar package and have a look at that
* Mez has never used apt-get source in his life
<dholbach> Mez: MAN! :) how do you check debdiffs against a current version? :)
<Mez> dholbach, I wget :D
<majic> dholbach, thanks
* dholbach shakes head disbelievingly
<dholbach> :-)
<dholbach> majic: anytime
<Mez> I've never done anything other than that :D
<Mez> lol
<dholbach> majic: #ubuntu-motu is the place to be to get you there
<Mez> mainly cause I used to (until recently) be on hoary :d
<majic> yeah I'm looking into using Pbuilder and have successfully built 2 packages with it. The breezy Ruby package and another one.
<dholbach> majic: super
<majic> I can't learn this stuff fast enough =)
<majic> I wanna help out so damn bad, haha.
<dholbach> majic: you'll make it, definitely and sooner than you think, i'm quite sure
<dholbach> majic: helping out in fixing build-dependencies and rebuilding stuff (in the motu crew) helped me to get a feel for it
<majic> I would help out with the UnmetDeps (I think that's what you guys are calling it) but I don't have time to play with Breezy right now.
<dholbach> majic: building in a breezy pbuilder (and making sure they're installable in a breezy chroot) should be cool too, but you might get other views on where you could help out in here, too
<ajmitch> majic: don't worry, you can get in quicker as a MOTU than in debian ;)
<majic> I think I'll look around for some software that isn't packaged and try to package it up
<CarlFK> when making a deb, where are the configure parameters stored?
* ajmitch probably holds a record for debian
<ajmitch> CarlFK: debian/rules
<tseng> ajmitch: understatement for the win.
<ajmitch> tseng: it took me 3+ years for debian
<tseng> rock on.
<CarlFK> tx
<tseng> meebey is going on 6 months
<Burgundavia> ajmitch, why did it take you so long?
<majic> and then I'll ask for some people to review it, see if it looks good and is in the Ubuntu way of doing things. But before all that I have alot of reading to do =)
<ajmitch> Received application 2001-12-11
<ajmitch> Account Created 2005-02-03
<ajmitch> Burgundavia: Real Life intervened ;)
<dholbach> i wonder how long it will take me
* Burgundavia keeps meaning to learn how to package, it might take him that long too
<ajmitch> my AM was jordi, he was quite good about it
<ajmitch> so it took me over 3 years before I met him in person :)
<dholbach> hehe :)
<tseng> you have to meet your am?
<ajmitch> not at all
<tseng> yeah.
<ajmitch> but jordi was at UDU
<tseng> yes.
<tseng> sortof
<ajmitch> heh
<tseng> zombie jordi
<ajmitch> poor guy
<tseng> xfce 4.2 is pretty rad
<tseng> i dont think ill replace gnome, but eh
<tseng> its fun
<dholbach> i'm off to bed pals - see you around
<crimsun> cya dholbach
<mbreit> night dholbach
<ajmitch> tseng: I found it pretty good, still prefer a nice gnome desktop though
<ajmitch> wishing I had one here at work
<whiprush> evening folks
<whiprush> tseng: you live!
<ajmitch> whiprush!
<tseng> whiprush: i am tough as nails
<whiprush> heh
<tseng> hm where did that last upload go to
<mbreit> why does gltron not show up in the build logs? it was accepted before the packages like qsynth...
<ajmitch> tseng: check breezy/unstable in changelog
<tseng> ajmitch: ah-right
<ajmitch> it's the most common mistake I make
<Riddell> universe/games/gltron_0.70final-5build3: Dep-Wait by buildd+terranova [optional:out-of-date] 
<Riddell>   Dependencies: libgl-dev
<tseng> REJECT THIS, JACKASS
<Riddell> mbreit: is it dep-waiting libgl-dev?
<whiprush> ok, this gnome-screensaver lock dialog is dead sexy.
<mbreit> hmm.. does that mean that it will be build after libgl-dev?
<mbreit> and where can i get that message from?
<Riddell> mbreit: http://people.ubuntulinux.org/~lamont/buildLogs/Lists/breezy.all.i386
<Riddell> mbreit: it might mean that, or it might mean there's a problem with the build daemons
<Riddell> mbreit: so, is a sufficient version of libgl-dev built?
<Burgundavia> whiprush, what is the point of the count down thing?
<mbreit> Riddell: i don't know...
<ajmitch> whiprush: heard any news about TheFridge from jdub?
<whiprush> No idea, other than most lockdown stuff has always had one.
<whiprush> ajmitch: I sent him a note yesterday.
<Burgundavia> whiprush, never mind
<whiprush> elmo got a linode all set up
<ajmitch> great
<Riddell> mbreit: well what version of libgl-dev does it need?
<whiprush> so I'm assuming it's still a go after Mr. IGotAndAwardWorhipMe gets home. :)
<Burgundavia> we have somebody on the forums about to start there own site, plus spreadubuntu
<Burgundavia> whiprush, rofl
<tseng> whiprush: its ready to go live?
<whiprush> tseng: hahahahaha.
<whiprush> right.
<ajmitch> ready to start development, you mean
<whiprush> yes.
<mbreit> Riddell: xlibmesa-gl-dev without any spezified version
<tseng> dude
<tseng> you guys are slow
<mbreit> but it seems that xlibmesa-gl is broken atm...
<tseng> ive built a complex web app from scratch since udu
<tseng> you guys cant even write a few articles
<mbreit> that's why bddebian's xdiskusage failed, too
* tseng hides under rock
<ajmitch> whiprush: right, so when can we start the jdub fanboy club on the fridge?
<whiprush> Well, the writing isn't a problem for me.
<ajmitch> tseng: yeah, that's what I get paid to work on too :P
<whiprush> though, if it takes us more than a few days to slap some ubuntu art on drupal then yes, it will be sad.
<ajmitch> who's doing the artwork though?
<whiprush> I saw some mockups from andy right after udu.
<whiprush> dunno though, I assumed him and jdub were working that out.
<Riddell> mbreit: there's no such package as libgl-dev
<ajmitch> ah good
<Burgundavia> whiprush, andy was working on look and feel, afaik
<mbreit> Riddell, there is also no build-dep to that... just to xlibmesa-gl-dev
<ajmitch> I'd hate for a prominent site to look like the rear end of a bus
<whiprush> heh
<tseng> andy++
<Burgundavia> ajmitch, can I quote you on that?
<ajmitch> Burgundavia: if you wish
<Riddell> mbreit: looks like a problem with the build daemons then, poke lamont
<ajmitch> does lamont still get paid to do all this ubuntu work?
<ajmitch> or is it just of love, I wonder?
<lamont> ajmitch: love
<ajmitch> lamont: your dedication is impressive
<tseng> meh, what does MOTU work for
<tseng> but definately a big lamont++
<lamont> hehe
<ajmitch> we work for fame & glory, of course
<ajmitch> or bugreports
<Riddell> wow, dholbach approved gnomeradio.  that's the first package I've seen him approve
<lamont> actually, much of what I'm doing now is driven by getting the hppa and ia64 ports happy, as well as just doing fun cool stuff.
<lamont> the crap work I give to infinity. :-P
<whiprush> heh
<mbreit> Riddell: it a very clean small package... but i needed to change some things to make dholbach happy ;)
<Riddell> how does gnome stuff get from Makefile.am to Makefile.in?
<ajmitch> oh evil, breezy goal meeting at 3AM local time
<mbreit> Riddell: i think they have a autogen-script in cvs that is deleted before making release-tarballs
<Riddell> hmm, so if the packages has to fix Makefile.am then you're screwed
<Mez> tseng: ping
<tseng> yes
<tseng> i see you
<Mez> ah ok
<tseng> the packages are fine in breezy
<tseng> if he wants to just install those
<mbreit> Riddell: have you seen my noteedit patch?
<mbreit> thats exactly the problem there...
<mbreit> i needed to patch configure.in.in... and then let debian/rules rebuild the configure-script
<mbreit> Riddell: http://ubuntu.mobr.de/sources/debdiffs/noteedit_2.7.1-2ubuntu1.debdiff you would make me very happy if you could review (and eventually upload) that ;)
<Riddell> still on gnomeradio, all these gnome deps take ages to install
<mbreit> Riddell: oh, did not know that... then thanks for doing that!
<ogra> Riddell, nah, they are preinstalled :)
<CarlFK> woo!
<CarlFK> ../transcode_1.0.0-0.1_i386.deb
<CarlFK> it built!
<Riddell> mbreit: what is /usr/share/omf/gnomeradio/gnomeradio-C.omf ?
<mbreit> it looks like the users manual
<schweeb> hey all
<mbreit> Riddell: it's actually a part of that
<Riddell> I know, but what is omf?
<mbreit> open source metadata framework
<Riddell> gosh.  what's one of them?
<Riddell> approved by the way :)
<mbreit> oh, thanks!
<mbreit> btw: omf has something to do with scrollkeeper
<Riddell> don't know what that is either
<mbreit> scrollkeeper is a system for managing document metadata..
<mbreit> it keeps track of all available gnome documentation (manuals) for the gnome help browser...
<Riddell> mbreit: quite an ugly debdiff that
<mbreit> i know...
<Riddell> mbreit: no need to build-dep on autoconf2.13 and autoconf
<Riddell> mbreit: and build-dep on automake1.9 not automake
<mbreit> well, yes, there is need to do that
<mbreit> cause i had to change configure.in.in...
<mbreit> so configure needs to be regenerated
<Riddell> mbreit: I mean it has both autoconf2.13 and autoconf, only 1 needed
<mbreit> okay, i see...
<Riddell> mbreit: also you add  make -f admin/Makefile.common cvs  to the build target
<Riddell> mbreit: but your 03 patch already contains all the changes made by that
<mbreit> no, the 03 patch just changes the admin/acinclude.m4.in by that from kde svn
<mbreit> nothing more
<Riddell> ah ok
<majic> it's funny, there is a package in debian for some software I wrote and have been maintaining, there were quite a few patches made and nobody ever bothered to let me know. That's hilarious
<mbreit> Riddell: fixed the build-dep issues... removed autoconf build dep and changed automake to automake1.9
<Mez> majic, lol - thats probably because a lot of upstram authors tell DDs to "go away" (thats the polite version) when they try and send patches back
<ajmitch> Mez: not necessarily
<Mez> ajmitch, a lot do...
<Mez> or ignore
<Mez> or just dont want the packages
<ajmitch> I've had pretty good luck getting changes upstream
<majic> I mean it's not a huge deal, but I would have appreciated an email. I could have incorporated these changes
<Mez> or at le least have in the past
<Mez> majic: yeah, I can understand that, just a lot of DDs dont bother trying anymore cause of previous bad experiences
<Mez> email the DD who works on it and ask him to mail you packages
<Mez> patches *
<ajmitch> for all my packages I solely maintain, I have commit access upstream
<Mez> what package is it btw majic, out of curiosity
<Mez> ajmitch, thats you
<Mez> :P
<majic> it's a small window manager called aewm++ that was born from yet another small window manager called aewm
<crimsun> ah, aewm++
<crimsun> lots of wms spawned from aewm.
<Riddell> mbreit: compiles and runs, all looks good.  well done
<mbreit> thanks! so you want to upload that? ;)
<mbreit> yay, my qcad changes have been build ;)
<Riddell> mbreit: uploading..
<mbreit> cool!
<mbreit> Riddell: still uploading?
<Riddell> mbreit: sorry, got distracted by pbuilding the wrong .dsc file
<mbreit> no problem
<mbreit> i was just wondering why it does not show up on breezy-changes
<Riddell> noteedit_2.7.1-2ubuntu1_source.changes ACCEPTED
<Riddell> woo
<mbreit> thanks!
<mbreit> hi bddebian
<mbreit> bddebian: xdiskusage did not build... see buildlogs for the reason... seems to be a broken mesa package
<mbreit> i am going to bed now... see you all tomorrow... good night
<bddebian> Ack, that makes no sense..
<bddebian> Why does xdiskusage install clean for me in a clean pbuilder but not normally?
<ajmitch> because it doesn't like you, of course
<bddebian> :'-(
<ajmitch> isn't that your usual response? ;)
<majic> what exactly does the watch file do in the debian folder of a package?
<majic> package source that is
<bddebian> Serously, it installs fine for me in pbuilder after I rebuilt it but the buildlog fails one a depends for xlibmesa-glu
<ajmitch> lets you watch for upstream updates
<ajmitch> man uscan for more info, I can't tell you much :)
* ajmitch doesn't use them in his packages enough
<majic> ajmitch, how would I know. Would I know only when I build a new package?
<majic> what exactly let's me know
<ajmitch> see the manpage.. it's also useful for automated checks in debian
<bddebian> See ajmitch, you hate me too :-)
<majic> ajmitch, which manpage?
* ajmitch points majic up about 5 lines in his scrollback..
<ajmitch> man uscan
<majic> oh, I thought you were talking to somebody else
<majic> uscan - looked like some scanner tools (as in like an HP scanjet)
<bddebian> heh
<ajmitch> bddebian: nah, not at all, you're just paranoid ;)
<majic> haha
<majic> hmm, looks like I don't have uscan installed
<ajmitch> apt-get install devscripts
<ajmitch> devscripts is a very useful & important package for package development
<majic> hmm, I didn't run across that yet mentioned in the wiki. My reading comprehension sucks probably.
<ajmitch> perhaps not everyone uses it, but I can't live without it :)
* bddebian thinks he'll make an MOTUWannabeTips wiki :-)
<ajmitch> bddebian: great, please put all these comments there
<bddebian> OK.  Any idea about my problem?
<ajmitch> bddebian: it's broken
<ajmitch> check that your pbuilder is up to date
<bddebian> I just updated before trying it again
<ajmitch> since building with an out-of-date pbuilder can mislead you
<bddebian> I just updated before trying it again
<ajmitch> why are you using xlibmes-glu-dev ?
<bddebian> All I did was rebuild the package
<ajmitch> and the build-depends are wrong
<ajmitch> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTUGLUTransition
<ajmitch> not sure how up-to-date that page is in terms of packages
<ajmitch> but it has the right build deps
<bddebian> Sheesh, how am I supposed to keep up with all this shiite? :)
<gradzac> anyone know where there is a ubuntu rootfs for uml?
<ajmitch> bddebian: simple, look on the wiki, it has a search feature if you don't get the news about transitions :)
<bddebian> ajmitch: How would I know what to search for without even knowing it was an issue?? :-)
<ajmitch> well the build logs just told you that it was an issue
<bddebian> You are a big help :-)
* Mez blogs a lottle respect for elmo
<ajmitch> bddebian: yes, I am
<ajmitch> bddebian: I am helping you by telling you to look for things when problems occur :)
<bddebian> :-)
<bddebian> I still don't get why it installs in my pbuilder though..
<ajmitch> installs, or builds?
<bddebian> installs
<ajmitch> why would you care about installation, when it's the build that fails?
<ajmitch> you did test the build in a clean, up-to-date pbuilder, right?
<bddebian> Yes
<ajmitch> it can't have been terribly up-to-date if it succeeded with the build-deps still set at xlibmesa-glu-dev
<Mez> bddebian, are you building ina  BREEZY pbuild
<bddebian> Anyway, xlibmesa-glu-dev build-dep should be xlibmesa-xorg-deb right
<bddebian> Mez: I have breezy install and breezy pbuilder :-)
<Mez> bddebian, then how the hell does it build?
<bddebian> s/-deb/-dev
<Lathiat> libglu1-xorg-dev or something isnt it?
<ajmitch> Mez: it shouldn't
<Mez> bddebian, sudo pbuilder login --save-after-login
<Lathiat> ajmitch: i thought it should
<ajmitch> and it won't in any sane chroot or breezy setup
<Mez> then
<Mez> apt-cache clean
<Lathiat> ajmitch: i thought it just upset the buildds
<ajmitch> Lathiat: not with just xlibmesa-glu-dev
<ajmitch> afaik
<ajmitch> Lathiat: there is that possibility
<Mez> ajmitch, It may if he has the old package installed on the pbuild ;)
<bddebian> Lathiat: Oh yeah, sorry: libglu1-xorg-dev
<Mez> bddebian, do the following and paste the output
<Mez> sudo pbuilder login
<Mez> dpkg -l xlibmesa-glu-dev
<Mez> apt-cache madison xlibmesa-glu-dev
<Mez> just the output from the last 2 commands
* ajmitch decides to give up on being a motu for today & retire somewhere
<Mez> to see where they hell you're getting that package from
<bddebian> ajmitch: :-)
<Lathiat> wtf is madison?
<Mez> Lathiat, It's madison the archive managers little sister
<Mez> as pitti put it
<bddebian> Mez: dpkg -l yeilds No packages found matching xlibmesa-glu-dev
<Mez> then how the hell does it build if it's B-D on that
<Mez> I think someones telling porkys
<bddebian> I dunno maybe I'm on crack
<Mez> Lathiat, check man apt-cache
<Mez> madison's REALLY useful
<bddebian> madison does yeild a bunch but I don't have it on this machine to dump the output and I aint typing it all :-)
<Mez> madison shouldnt yield anything
<ajmitch> somehow there's a xlibmesa-glu-dev binary still in universe, supposedly built from xorg source at 6.8.2-10
<ajmitch> at least according to the packages list I have
<Mez> wait
<Mez> sorry
<ajmitch> that's some serious breakage, the binary should be removed
<Mez> xlibmesa-glu-dev |   6.8.2-10 | http://gb.archive.ubuntu.com breezy/universe Packages
<ajmitch> Mez: obsolete, it should be removed
<Mez> ajmitch, good idea
* Mez heads off to MorgueCandidates
<ajmitch> unless that was the version in hoary
<bddebian> So I'm not totally stoned? :-)
<ajmitch> in which case, it's just the Packages.gz that is wrong
<ajmitch> bddebian: you are, fix the broken build-depends
<bddebian> ajmitch: I'm doing that already :-)
<Mez> ajmitch, it's the same version, but, it's in universe
<ajmitch> http://packages.ubuntu.com/cgi-bin/search_packages.pl?keywords=xlibmesa-glu-dev&searchon=names&subword=1&version=all&release=all
<ajmitch> Mez: yep, breakage
<Mez> ajmitch, yeah, but pool points back to main
<Mez> ajmitch, you should email elmo about that
<Mez> it shouldnt have been NEWd in breezt
<ajmitch> daniels might want to hear about it too
<Mez> CC
<Mez> :D
<ajmitch> go ahead, be my guest
<ajmitch> I'm just a lowly MOTU
<Mez> ajmitch, so am I
<Mez> you email them :D and tell them
<Mez> james.troup@ubuntu.com and  daniel.stone@ubuntu.com
<Mez> and CC me
* ajmitch isn't a big, important backports developer ;)
<Mez> martin@sourceguru.net
<Mez> ajmitch, you might not be, but I dont have upload rights and I'm about to go to bed
<ajmitch> hehe ok
<Mez> ;)
* ajmitch will do it after work
<Mez> I await your CC
<Mez> g'night
* ajmitch could always delegate to bddebian 
<ajmitch> ;)
<ajmitch> night
<bddebian> Sorry, family came home
<bddebian> ajmitch: Did you go too?
* ajmitch is doing work
<bddebian> Are you / did you notify the above?
<ajmitch> no, I didn't, I said I'm at work
<bddebian> If anyone is bored, could you check out https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTUWannabeTips
<bddebian> ajmitch: Well, you are talking here aren't you?? ;-P
<ajmitch> " If there was not an ubuntuX version, be sure to downgrade back the epoch version from upstream and add ubuntu1"
<ajmitch> there is no epoch being changed
<bddebian> Wrong?
<ajmitch> epoch has a specific meaning in debian
<bddebian> If you use dch -i it does, doesn't it?
<ajmitch> new package from source has -0ubuntu1 version
<ajmitch> no!
<bddebian> Are you sure?
<ajmitch> look up what epoch means in debian & why they should very very rarely be used
<bddebian> Then what do you call the -X portion of the version, in say 1.0.1-X ?
<chillywilly> hi
<bddebian> Heya chillywilly
* chillywilly is now playing with basecamp as an "alternative" to M$ project ;)
<ajmitch> the revision
<chillywilly> http://basecamphq.com
<ajmitch> epoch is like A:x.y.z-1
<ajmitch> with the epoch is A
<ajmitch> http://workshop.linspire.com/package-version-policy.html
<bddebian> ajmitch: Ahh
<ajmitch> see there for example
<Amaranth> http://blogs.qtdeveloper.net/archives/2005/08/03/some-basic-thoughts-about-kde-4/
<Amaranth> KDE guys start thinking like GNOME guys, oh dear
<ajmitch> cxx transition should not change the -dev package name
<ajmitch> you're missing useful things like apt-cache rdepends
<ajmitch> and grep-dctrl/grep-available
<bddebian> Ohh, that's right, epochs are used to override versioning screw-ups right?
<ajmitch> yes
<bddebian> ajmitch: Where did I say they should change the -dev name?
<bddebian> Damn man, I just started the thing.. :-)
<ajmitch> in the example for apt-cache dump
<ajmitch> and I"m giving you feedback
<ajmitch> I'll stop now if you'd prefer
<Burgundavia> ajmitch, who is doing usplash?
<ajmitch> Burgundavia: no idea, but it's not me
<bddebian> ajmitch: Oh, so that is a bad example you are saying?  There would never be a libfooc2-dev?
<ajmitch> bddebian: there usually wouldn't be
<bddebian> OK, fair enough
<ajmitch> grep-dctrl says there are none, and I'm sure that policy specifies it too
<bddebian> OK, thanks
<Amaranth> Burgundavia: Matthew Garrett, iirc
<ajmitch> I'd find apt-cache rdepends far more useful, to find out what depends on a package
<ajmitch> and grep-dctrl to find build-deps
<Amaranth> Burgundavia: mjg59
<bddebian> I have never used grep-dctrl
<bddebian>  rdepends shows you what packages depend on *that* package doesn't it?
<Burgundavia> Amaranth, ok
<ajmitch> yes
<ajmitch> eg, apt-cache rdepends libwxgtk2.4c2
<ajmitch> shows me a list of packages I need to get rebuilt
<bddebian> Aye
<bddebian> ajmitch: I don't seem to have grep-dctrl, what is that from?
<ajmitch> bddebian: grep-dctrl..
<bddebian> Oh, hehe
* bddebian feels st00pid again
* ajmitch introduces bddebian to apt-cache search
<ajmitch> btw, dlocate is much much faster than dpkg -S
<bddebian> Yeah, yeah, I did it that way after I asked the dumb ass question
<bddebian> Good god, why am I writing this??
<ajmitch> because you volunteered, sucker :P
<bddebian> OK, better now?
<ajmitch> nope
<ajmitch> you mentioned my name in there
<chillywilly> ok, I really do not like KDE
<chillywilly> makes me want to gouge my eyes out
<ajmitch> you don't have to use it
<chillywilly> I'm not
<chillywilly> just thought I would play with it but I just can't stand looking at it
<chillywilly> now I have tons of KDE packages dirtying up my menus
<chillywilly> :P
<Burgundavia> chillywilly, if you don't like it, that is fine. There is no need to bash it
<Burgundavia> chillywilly, for the record, I prefer gnome as well
<chillywilly> not really bashing it but I think gnome has a more professional look while KDE looks like a cartoon to me ;)
<chillywilly> ok, maybe I am poking at it some
<chillywilly> I'll stop now
<herve> morning
<dholbach> hellas
<dholbach> look what i found while reviewing qt4-x11: http://www.trolltech.com/video/qt4dance.html
<dholbach> Riddell: i nearly wet myself, those qt guys are crazy :)
<ajmitch> hi dholbach
<dholbach> hey andrew
<dholbach> :)
<\sh> mornin
<\sh> g
<dholbach> hey \sh
<mbreit> good morning!
<dholbach> hey moritz
<\sh> hey dholbach
<mbreit> hey dholbach...
<mbreit> btw: what does universe/sound/noteedit_2.7.1-2ubuntu1: Not-For-Us [optional:out-of-date]  mean?
<dholbach> what distribution did you have in dbeian/changelog?
<mbreit> breezy
<dholbach> hm
<dholbach> better ask on #ubuntu-devel
<mbreit> okay..
<ajmitch> infinity or lamont can answer best, I'd say
<\sh> normally it's waiting for something
<mbreit> the same entry was for noteedit_2.7.1-2build1 before...
<\sh> is it new?
<\sh> no
<mbreit> no, i just fixed compilation on gcc4
<Riddell> dholbach: you mean you weren't taken aback by the professionalism of their marketing?
<dholbach> Riddell: erm well... taken aback... yes :)
<Burgundavia> marketing?
<dholbach> http://planet.ubuntu.com :)
<koke> maybe we should have a promotional video with the badger dance :)
<Amaranth> yeah, how about no?
<Amaranth> the qt 4 music video scares the shit out of me
<Amaranth> one nice thing: my connection is fast enough to stream that 47MB mpg
<Treenaks> QT4 music video?
<Treenaks> *shudder*
<dholbach> haha :)
<Treenaks> The gnome devs should do something like this at the next GUADEC :)
<Amaranth> you want to see jdub dance?
<Amaranth> i'm sure we could get sabdfl to do it after some drinks ;)
<Treenaks> Amaranth: we've seen sabdfl, mdz, etc. sing that song at debconf...
<Amaranth> that reminds me, does anyone have that video?
<ajmitch> nope, never seen it
<ajmitch> it disappeared very quickly
<Amaranth> aye
<Amaranth> it was up for a couple hours
<dholbach> i didnt see it either
<ajmitch> I think mako has a copy if you ask him nicely
<ajmitch> he doesn't have the bandwidth to stick it up for everyone to grab
<dholbach> people.ubuntu.com should be fine :)
* jsgotangco dreams of the day dholbach sings at wembley
<dholbach> *cough slightly*
<dholbach> i'm perfectly alright with doing the funky motu dance... but singing
<dholbach> only under the shower
<jsgotangco> dude i said singing at wembley
<jsgotangco> that's like 50,000+ capacity
<jsgotangco> heh
<dholbach> well... let us all wait where this MOTU thing goes
<dholbach> (and i'll take singing lessons until then ;-))
<Treenaks> signing lessons ;)
<dholbach> Treenaks: it's not me who failed to sign all the keys on http://www.cs.uu.nl/people/henkp/henkp/pgp/pathfinder/stats/A94050AF.html - it's all been the others :)
<Treenaks> dholbach: other signatures : 6
<ajmitch> dholbach: you need more sigs, you're out of the top 1000
<dholbach> Treenaks: that's because they didnt manage to import the keys i sent them
<Treenaks> ajmitch: debconf and wth took care of that...
<jsgotangco> who is part of the top 1000?
<dholbach> jsgotangco: i was
<jsgotangco> ooohhhh
<Treenaks> I'm still in :)
<jsgotangco> this is like pokemon
<Treenaks> http://www.cs.uu.nl/people/henkp/henkp/pgp/pathfinder/stats/3FA5E031.html
<Treenaks> by a small margin
<jsgotangco> oh well i see you all later
<dholbach> bye jerome
<jsgotangco> a few hours ago, i just joined the ranks of the unemployed :)
<dholbach> oh... anything in sight yet?
<jsgotangco> none at the moment, i just finished a contract with an employer
<jsgotangco> although i can live off with my savings in a few months fortunately :)
<dholbach> i hope the best for you
<jsgotangco> :D
<jsgotangco> they're taking me to karaoke later
<jsgotangco> i will probably drop by the 15utc meeting
<dholbach> hehe... karaoke night! :)
<ivoks> hi all
<ajmitch> hi ivoks
* ajmitch seriously doubts he'll get to the 15utc meeting
<ivoks> happy thanks giving day and day of victory for all from croatia :)
<ivoks> ajmitch: hi
<Treenaks> aug 05  Dan domovinske zahvalnosti
<Treenaks> that's what calendar tells me
<ivoks> yeah :)
<Treenaks> no idea what it means..
<ivoks> day when country is thanksfull for their soliders :)
<ivoks> s/for/to
<Mez> dholbach, it's you who puts the stuff in UniverseUnmetDeps right?
<dholbach> Mez: bddebian did the last list afaik
<dholbach> hey ivoks
* ivoks is still on vacation
<dholbach> ivoks: push somebody to review wifi-radar - NOW!
<ivoks> becky (backup tool) is going nicely
<Mez> dholbach, I'm just wondering how it's built, as it needs updating
<ivoks> dholbach: would you? :)
<dholbach> ivoks: i did and signed already
<ivoks> dholbach: ok, thanks
<ivoks> ajmitch: would you review it too? :)
<dholbach> Mez: the command is on the page itself
<Mez> bash: apt-cache: command not found
<Mez> o_O
<Mez> uh-oh
<dholbach> i removed the 
<dholbach> it was wrong
<Mez> so what should it be
<dholbach> LC_ALL=C apt-cache -i unmet | grep ^Package | cut -d' ' -f2 | xargs apt-cache showsrc | grep ^Package | sed 's/Package\://' | sort -u > unmet.txt
<mbreit> dholbach: well, the perl-magic part is still missing ;)
<dholbach> mbreit: that's no coincidence :)
<Mez> dholbach, I'm only getting a TINY output from that command
<dholbach> Mez: on amd64 the list is significantly longer
<dholbach> Mez: how many lines have you got?
<Mez> dholbach, 13
<Mez> ah
<mbreit> on amd64 i get 282
<Mez> It works on source packages
<dholbach> oops i have 379
<dholbach> NICE :)
<mbreit> btw: to get that comma sperated add " perl -e'while (<>) { chomp; print($_ . ","); }'" at the end of the pipe
<ogra> eeek perl
<Mez> 361 on i386
<ogra> 360 here
<ivoks> ogra: hi
<ogra> hey ivoks
<ivoks> ogra: backup tool is going ok...
<ogra> nice :)
<ivoks> ogra: it will be ready for 1.9. 100%
<ogra> see that you get a package in soon... even if its not yet working right...
<tseng> hi
<ivoks> will try, but too many nice girls over here :))
<ivoks> time to go...
<ivoks> see you guys in few days...
<ivoks> could someone please upload etherape in breezy?
<ivoks> i fixed it month ago, and in breezy is still broken version
<dholbach> i'm off - see you later
<tseng> whiprush: your website is sex.
<Lathiat> url?
<tseng> http://www.ubuntudetroit.org/
* Amaranth passes out
<WaterSevenUb> Hi! In gnome-app-install I have noticed that the menu entry is not translateable as a string. I would like to make a patch but I have no idea how to do that. http://bazaar.ubuntu.com/gnome-app-install@bazaar.ubuntu.com/gnome-app-install--MAIN--0
<WaterSevenUb> anyone can help? Thanks.
<ogra> WaterSevenUb, g-a-i is in main... this is the channel for universe maintainers.... ask in #ubuntu-devel
<Mez> do MOTU have upload access to Multiverse?
<Mez> I've always assumed they have but never asked
<herve> Mez, yes
<tseng> morn bradb
<bradb> hey tseng
<Mez> things shouldnt depend on Virtual packages should they?
<herve> virtual package | proposed package
<herve> e.g., www-server | apache2
<herve> I don't remember the exact name
<ogra> httpd :)
<Mez> hmmles :D
<Mez> if I dont get any output from katie, is that bad ?
<herve> thanks ogra
<ogra> Mez, are you whitelisted ?
<Mez> ogra, I dont know
<ogra> herve, i'm just rebuilding moodle, it has exactly this dependency ;)
<Mez> I've had output previously
<ogra> ah, ok
<Mez> well, I had output yesterday when \sh uploaded for me
<Mez> but that was the first time :P
<ogra> did yo ever upload yourself ?
<Mez> I tried uploading myself once and got a rejection
<Mez> Rejected: The key (0x2404ED3A6AAAA569) used to sign webmin-optional_1.210a-2ubuntu1.dsc wasn't found in the keyring(s).
<Mez> just tried uploading again today to see if I've been added yet
<ogra> 	Accepted webmin-optional 1.210a-2ubuntu1 (source)
<ogra> from yesterday
<Mez> yeah, that was \sh uploading for me
<ogra> you know that you never upload the same version twice i assume, else elmo will hunt you down
<Mez> not even if it gets rejected cuase of keyring?
<Mez> and I'm not uploading same version tewice
<ogra> not even then without talking to a buildd master
<Mez> i was trying a different package today
<ogra> its generating extra work
<ogra> just a hint ;)
<Mez> to wait and see if I got accepted or rejected by katie
<Mez> :D
<Mez> and then if it was rejected, poking a proper MOTU
<ogra> nope
<ogra> talk to elmo about your key please, dont generate xtra work
<Mez> ogra, I've tried talking to him :D
<ogra> so it should get rejected...
<ogra> but just pushing it forward to another motu instead of fixing the problem isnt nice
<ogra> s/should/shouldnt
<herzi> is there a wiki page to request packages for universe?
<yuacht> how can i get involved with dev when i don't know any programming? =)
<Mez> yuacht, you dont neccesarily need to know how to program
<Mez> but it helps
<majic> I see some php5 packages in the universe repo, I don't see one for an apache2 module, nor do I see it in the main repo along with the other libapache2 modules. Is there a php5 module package?
<Mez> anyone here wanna sponsor an upload or two for me
<Lathiat> majic: ... Filename: pool/main/p/php5/libapache2-mod-php5_5.0.4-3ubuntu1_i386.deb
<Mez> Lathiat, do you have upload access?
<Lathiat> Mez: no
<Mez> grr
<Mez> anyone? http://dev.kubuntu.org.uk/~mez/debdiff/libkexif.diff and http://dev.kubuntu.org.uk/~mez/debdiff/tex-guy.diff
<bddebian> Howdy
<crimsun_> Mez: have those been checked?
<majic> Lathiat: when I apt-get install libapache2-mod-php5 I get an error message saying that it doesn't exist.
<Lathiat> majic: well your packages are out of date or something
<majic> I just did an apt-get update
<Mez> crimsun_, yes, I made them, they just need uploading
<crimsun_> I'll look.
<Lathiat> majic: well dude i dunno what your doing, wfm
<jamessan|work> majic: are you running breezy?
<\sh> Mez: send it via mail please to me...i will take care about it when I'm at home...
<majic> I'm running Hoary 5.04
<\sh> majic: php5 is for breezy
<jamessan|work> well, that's why
<Mez> \sh well if crimsin can do it, then you wont need to
<Mez> crimsun_, they're only small changes
<bddebian> If any of you get bored, can you please look at:  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTUWannabeTips ?
<\sh> Mez: ok
<DanielN> what
<DanielN> PHP5 is in breezy?
<\sh> so I can work on bddebian's text ,-)
<\sh> DanielN: thx to ogra, yes
<DanielN> RRRROCKING :))))
<majic> I keep getting burned in the ass with these old packages
<majic> damn, I got spoiled running Gentoo
<bddebian> \sh: ??
<ogra> \sh, really not my fault :)
<DanielN> great work ogra
<crimsun_> Mez: I'll take care of it. Updating my pbuilder atm.
<ogra> \sh, thats infinitys work
<DanielN> ouch
<DanielN> :)
<ogra> :)
<Mez> crimsun_, kk, just needs the diffs applying to old sources, resigning and uploading
<DanielN> i hopefully have more time now to doing ubuntu stuff
<DanielN> since my "thesis" is over
<DanielN> ;>
<Mez> hmm
<Mez> should we enable gtk support for mplayer-plugin
<majic> I can't believe it. PHP 5.0 came out 13 July 2004 and PHP 5 is only available in Breezy. That is hilarious. Is there any reason for this? I keep getting burned like this, I go to install something I've been used to running on another distro and I can't get a package for it.
<DanielN> no
<DanielN> fedora core 4 has it too
<\sh> majic: php5 is a bit crappy...cause not all php4 apps are running on php5
<\sh> majic: so there is a decision to be made..php4 or php5 ... the better case was php4...
<ogra> it'll most likely be php5 .... 4 will stay in universe
<\sh> majic: and gentoos php5 was even more scary...but since Sebastian Bergmann took over PHP5 ebuilds...it's just running quite stable
<\sh> ogra: yes...but for hoary it was 4
<ogra> yup
<ogra> Mez, yes
<DanielN> harhar
<ogra> Mez, there is a malone bug open for that
<DanielN> ubuntu becomes server interesting distro :)
<ogra> becomes ??
<DanielN> ;>
<\sh> majic: and believe me...if Sebastian is doing some harm to my php5 install on my gentoo servers...I will kick his ass..he's living just around the corner ,-)
<\sh> DanielN: it is...
<DanielN> yeah
<DanielN> but there weren't any averages debian -- ubuntu
<DanielN> now there are :)
<Mez> ogra, yes I know there is a malone bug, I asked for it to be made, was just wondering whether it should be done
<Mez> I'm working it now
<ogra> oki
<Mez> just fixing a couple of deps on it too
<\sh> DanielN: which ones? debian is working on php5 as well...and I think php5 in ubuntu will be an interims solution until debian has it in the archives
<bddebian> do be do be doo
<ogra> \sh, the packages are the same
<\sh> ogra: yes
<crimsun_> Mez: tex-guy will not pbuild.
<Mez> crimsun - really?
<Mez> it did for me
<Mez> hmmles
<Mez> ah wait
<DanielN> yeah /sh but since it will takes another 3 years until debians next release ubuntu will be first debian derivate with a stable release including php5
<bddebian> heh
<bddebian> Mez: Did you tell anyone about xlibmesa-glu-dev?
<Mez> ...?
<Mez> I was meant to tell someone
<bddebian> Shouldn't someone tell someone? :-)
<Mez> ogra: ?
<ogra> ?
<Mez> bddebian, was I meant to tell someone
<Mez> sorry ogra ..
<Mez> hmm
<Mez> where can I find gthread
<bddebian> I guess not
<ogra> glib i'd guess
<bddebian> libglib, libc6-dev
<ogra> sigthread != gthread
<DanielN> arghs
<Mez> crimsun, yeah sotry I forgot vflib = b0rked
<DanielN> damn error... i meant advantages and not averages :)
<Mez> dpkg-shlibdeps: warning: format of libplc4.so not recognized
<Mez> hmm
<Mez> I'm getting lots and lots and lots of those
<Mez> ogra: http://dev.kubuntu.org.uk/~mez/debdiff/mplayerplug-in.diff done :d
<ogra> great
<Mez> wanna upload ?
<ogra> no time
<ogra> if you fix moodle :)
* Mez has no idea what that is or how to do it
<Mez> crimsun, ping :D
<crimsun> Mez: pong.
<Mez> crimsun, fancy uploading that one for me
<crimsun> Mez: I'll look in 30 s.
<dholbach> re
<Mez> re?
<bddebian> wb dholbach
<dholbach> bddebian: excellent work on that motuwannabetips page
<dholbach> bddebian: i linked it from a couple of places
<bddebian> dholbach: How did YOU see that? :-)
<dholbach> bddebian: i'm subscribed to the wiki
<bddebian> Ah, well thanks.  It's a work in progress :)
<dholbach> yeah definitely - now we have a place to send people to
<crimsun> re dholbach
<dholbach> good thinking - thanks for that
<dholbach> crimsun: hey daniel - how's it going?
<Mez> hmm
<crimsun> dholbach: not bad, yourself?
<crimsun> Mez: your diff doesn't apply cleanly (debian/rules); I'll patch by hand.
<dholbach> crimsun: a bit sleepy - was taking a nap when my landlord brought somebody in to look at the flat (i'm moving out in two weeks) - GRR - he could have told me before - the place was a mess :)
<Mez> crimsun, thats weird - it;s a tiny change to debian/rules
<crimsun> dholbach: d'oh, hehe. To where are you moving?
<dholbach> crimsun:  b e r l i n !  woohoo!
<crimsun> dholbach: awesome!
<dholbach> yeah  i'm so happy :)
<Treenaks> dholbach: yes, we need to drink some beer there together ;)
<\sh> ok...going home
<dholbach> definitely
<dholbach> bye stephan
<crimsun> Mez: it looks like you diffed against _your_ previous revision of ubuntu2
<Mez> crimsun, huh?
<Mez> crimsun, I diffed agasint the version I downloaded from the repo
<crimsun> look at your debdiff
<Mez> what about it
<crimsun> notice "+  * Fixed Depends on mozilla-browser | mozilla-firefox to firefox | mozilla-browser | mozilla-firefox"
<crimsun> and "+ -- Martin Meredith <martin@sourceguru.net>  Fri,  5 Aug 2005 14:46:22 +0100"
<Mez> ah
<Mez> ok
<Mez> I see
<Mez> sorry
<Mez> you manage to sort that? or want another debdiff?
<crimsun> I applied by hand. libkexif and mplayerplug-in are both uploaded.
<Mez> ah, thankies
<crimsun> np
<bddebian> Man it's quiet in here today :-(
<dholbach> we're in the meeting and listen in awe
<bddebian> Ohhh, sorry
<dholbach> don't worry :)
<tseng> oh wow
<tseng> is there a pete here?
<tseng> pete AT openfestis.org
<jsgotangco> heh
<bddebian> tseng: Hi.  Would you mind looking at xdiskusage again?  I think I fixed the build-dep.
<tseng> i think ajmitch fixed the build-dep, no?
<tseng> is it still broken?
<tseng> i am not on my laptop
<bddebian> He is the one that pointed it out to me.  Maybe he fixed it.  Fsck, what do I know.
<tseng> he uploaded a fix, so..
<tseng> please tell me if it is really broken or what
<tseng> im using a livecd
<bddebian> Heh. OK
<pete> tseng: yeah I'm here
<dholbach> pete, tseng: if you're going to takl about monopod: it's still broken on amd64 breezy
<pete> on my breezy i386 mono is broken allover
<pete> is that just me or..?
<bddebian> tseng: Yep, looks like ajmitch fixed xdiskutils
* bddebian curses ajmitch :-)
<bddebian> Hmm, what to work on today..
<chillywilly> what meeting?
<dholbach> breezy goals update
<dholbach> #ubuntu-meeting
<chillywilly> hi bddebian
<chillywilly> oh
<chillywilly> nifty
<bddebian> Heya chillywilly
<bddebian> chillywilly: Hey check out https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTUWannabeTips if you get a sec and let me know what you think :-)
<chillywilly> your link to PBuilderHowTo is not right
<chillywilly> :)
<bddebian> Gah
<bddebian> Fixed, thanks
<chillywilly> looks to be some good and helpful content but I don't really have much time to read through it atm
<bddebian> NP
<mbreit> bddebian: great page... i think most newbies can learn a lot from that...
<koke> bddebian: it looks nice :)
<koke> btw, the new launchpad look is far nicer than the old one :)
<mbreit> btw: is someone working on packages for sonance or spe?
<koke> I think I'll fix more bugs now ;)
<bddebian> mbreit / koke: Thanks
<bddebian> mbreit: Thanks for the note on xdiskusage btw :-)
<mbreit> bddebian: no problem
<mbreit> if nobody is working on sonance or spe, i will add them to my todo list
<bddebian> mbreit: You think it would makes sense to add a "Ready to upload" or "Just needs rebuild" section to UniverseUnmetDeps to make it easier for MOTUs to identify what can "quickly" be fixed?
<mbreit> bddebian: i had this idea, too.. at least a "just needs rebuild" section would be nice
<bddebian> Aye.  I'll add it, thanks
<mbreit> do you want to add another table just like the "need love" table?
<bddebian> Yep
<mbreit> good idea
<mbreit> that saves even time for us... so i do not have to make a changelog-entry and so on... just rebuild in pbuilder and see if it works
<koke> doh, my most hated maolne bug is here again ;)
<mbreit> and we need to get this unmet deps list smaller... its so frustrating to see it growing
<bddebian> Aye
<bddebian> OK< added
<mbreit> great... but i can't really work on that list today because i have a exam for university tomorrow...
<mbreit> but after that exam i will fix a few more of that packages..
<mbreit> btw: if you put xxdiff to the rebuild list, you can remove it from the "NOBODY" list
<bddebian> mbreit: Well, that was a placeholder. I'm testing right now ;-)
<mbreit> okay
<bddebian>  pbuilder build does a test install also?
<mbreit> bddebian: you can user pbuilder login to try to install a package
<tseng> dholbach: we dont care you about amd64
<tseng> dholbach: :P
<dholbach> ok
<dholbach> well i dont care about mono
<dholbach> :-p
<tseng> or more realistically
<bddebian> mbreit: Yeah but then I have to update my local apt repo :-)
<tseng> everyone tells me about bugs on amd64 and doesnt do anything about it
<tseng> i dont have hardware
<tseng> dunno what im supposed to do.
<bddebian> Buy one :-)
<dholbach> arrange with Mithrandir
<jsgotangco> jeez my hiccups is already half an hour...
<tseng> im hoping to work one out a different way
<tseng> but in the mean time
<tseng> i still cant fix amd64 bugs
<bddebian> I thought I saw something somewhere about doing an install with the .deb with pbuilder
<mbreit> tseng: i am on amd64.. if i can help you somehow...
<tseng> mbreit: dholbach thinks monopod is broken.
<tseng> from revu
<tseng> it gives an X error
<dholbach> it still is
<dholbach> tested this morning
<tseng> well it really looks like X
<tseng> i dont know
<mbreit> bh... i want bash-completion for pbuilder...
<bddebian> heh
<tseng> definately
<bddebian> Won't dpkg -i update packages for depends?
<tseng> it should be smart enough to only complete *.dsc
<tseng> bddebian: because dpkg doesnt account for dependency info?
<tseng> apt does that
<mbreit> tseng: i am building monopod now, but i have very few time today, so i will have to investigate that tomorrow
<bddebian> So I have no choice but to use my local repo to test package installation?
<tseng> mbreit: ok thanks. if you can give me a hint, great
<tseng> bddebian: or, install them all?
<tseng> dpkg -i 1 2 3
<bddebian> tseng: No, it wants a newer version of libgcc1 installed then what I have installed.
<tseng> uh
<tseng> it sounds like you did something bad
<bddebian> Why?
<bddebian> There is a candidate for it
<tseng> you built something with a newer libgcc1 than you system has?
<tseng> or something.
<dholbach> bye everybody - i'm off
<bddebian> Later dholbach
<mbreit> grr... the bug i most hate is the crashing panel on package installation
<mbreit> bye dholbach
<bddebian> tseng: Its a depends not build-depends
<tseng> dude comeon
<bddebian> What?
<tseng> when you build something, it fills in sh:Depends
<tseng> build-depends
<tseng> on what version you built it with
<bddebian> That makes no sense to me, sorry
<tseng> ok
<tseng> say libfoo is binary incompatible between versions
<tseng> if i build my package against libfoo-1.3.so
<tseng> it wont work when i have libfoo-1.2.so installed
<bddebian> I understand that part
<tseng> so whats the problem
<bddebian> Firstly, I don't even know where it is getting xxdiff depends on libgcc1 (>= 1:4.0.1)??
<mbreit> tseng: all other gtk# applications seem to work well here... its only monopod which is crashing
<mbreit> so i will debug that tomorrow to see where (which code line) it crashes
<bddebian> Hello CarlFK
<bddebian> CarlFK: You're in IL ?
<CarlFK> hey bddebian - yup
<bddebian> CarlFK: Where, if you don't mind me asking?
<CarlFK> Niles - just north of Chicago
<bddebian> Ahh.  I grew up near Peoria / Bloomington
<CarlFK> neat - friend from there is coming up tomorrow
<CarlFK> Jason Nance
<bddebian> Coolio
<bddebian> tseng: Does this mean you gave up on me? :-)
<Seveas> OKay guys, I have a program that installs with a setup.py. Which package is a good example to look at for creating a deb package of such a program?
* Seveas wants to be a MOTU too if I can make this work :)
<Seveas> ogra, help me out here :)
<ogra> can you give the setup.py a custom path ?
<ogra> s/path/install path
<Seveas> --prefix=
<Seveas> it's a normal setup.py
<Seveas> I just want a package to look at as an example :)
<ogra> i dont know one from the top of my head
<Seveas> isn't hwdb-client a python program?
<ogra> yup
<ogra> but i dont use a setup.py
<Seveas> ah
<ogra> since i already wrote it for being installed from a .deb
<Seveas> will apt-file show these files? They don't show up in the .deb
<jamessan|work> Seveas: there's not really much to do. you can take a look at Supybot, though. I know that uses it.
<ogra> unlikely they get installed
<Seveas> jamessan|work, thank you, I'll have a look
<ogra> Seveas, i would look what setup.py really does and try to do the same in the rules file
<Seveas> can't I simply call setup.py from the rules?
<ogra> its most likely only copying files around
<JanC> & pre-compiling
<Seveas> that's what dh_python can do too
<Seveas> wow, cdbs is the best thing since debhelper
<Seveas> the supybot rules in 7 lines long...
<Seveas> is*
<bddebian> supybot! Cool package :-)
<ogra> Seveas, learn debhelper first...
<ogra> Seveas, even if cdbs is tempting
<Seveas> cdbs uses debhelper
<Seveas> well, it can
<ogra> never mix these two
<ogra> its not a good habit ...
<Seveas> hmm
* bddebian mixes Irn Bru and Vodka
<Seveas> i mean include /usr/share/cdbs/1/rules/debhelper.mk
<ogra> yes, but these are cdbs implementations of debhelper
<Seveas> the call dh_*
<Seveas> they*
<ogra> yes, all of them... you generate either a huge overhead or have a lot to exclude for simple packages
<Seveas> ah
<Seveas> well, let's get back to maint-guide then :)
<jbailey> ogra: Eh?  Don't tell me you're using cdbs *without* debhelper...
<ogra> so if you can make a package with 2 or 3 debhelper calls, cdbs makes no sense
<ogra> jbailey, i dont mix them up in rules
<jbailey> Ah, good.
<jbailey> I half feared you meant you were using cdbs *without* debhelper.mk
<ogra> thats what i had problems to bring acreoss to Seveas ;)
<jbailey> Which I've done to prove that it was possible, but...
<Seveas> ah ok
<ogra> nah, i wouldnt
<jbailey> ogra: I've been considering (but haven't done) for cdbs2 to test to see if the debhelper call would be a no-op.  Would that make you happier?
<ogra> sure...
<jbailey> It's certainly not a release blocker, but I had assumed that nobody but poor m68k hackers would care.
<ogra> i dont like to waste cpu cycles ;)
<jbailey> What else are they *for*?
<Seveas> buildds have to do something :)
<ogra> heh
<tseng> yay!
<tseng> i got my laptop working with my apple monitor
<tseng> and docking station
* Seveas recently got his own cluster for experimenting with d_i
<jbailey> ogra: Besides, the overhead of running all the debhelper calls versus a decent testsuite is pretty small.
<Seveas> talk about wasting cpu cycles :)
<ogra> buildds have to annoy their meintainer... they are very busy with that already ;)
<jbailey> And I'd love to see every app out there grow a really comprehensive testsuite.
<tseng> unit testing +++
<ogra> yup, sounds reasonable
<jbailey> ogra: Another thing that I quite like about cdbs versus similar sized debhelper-based rules files is just consistancy.
<jbailey> You have the promise that various DEB_BUILD_OPTIONS are honoured, and takes no time to figure them out at a glance once you've seen a couple of them.
<ogra> i'm probably just to oldschool :) i should make more with cdbs
<ogra> but still, for a MOTU its important to be familiar with both Seveas :)
<ogra> and cdbs is easy... so learning debhelper first makes sense ;)
<bddebian> Like learning asm before C?  I'm sure everyone still does that?? ;-P
<Seveas> rofl
<Seveas> I did :)
<bddebian> Seveas: Nice.  I don't know either :-)
<Seveas> but then again, I learned java before that ;)
<bddebian> ack
<ogra> bddebian, nah, C before C++ :)
<bddebian> heh
<Seveas> hmm
<Seveas> postpone C++ as much as possible
<jbailey> ogra: Which is often also a mistake.
<jbailey> ogra: It's best to consdier C and C++ to be generally unrelated but somewhat compatible languages.
<ogra> jbailey, was the best example that came to mind :)
<janimonoses> any idea why xfce4-terminal is not entering the build?
<janimonoses> http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Lists/breezy.all.i386
<janimonoses> says it depends on dbus-glib-1-dev
<janimonoses> but http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/universe/x/xfce4-terminal/xfce4-terminal_0.2.4-3ubuntu1.dsc
<janimonoses> shows that libdbus-glib-1-dev is in the bd: line actually
<janimonoses> I am confused
<janimonoses> lamont ^^
<ogra> janimonoses, so depend on that one
<ogra> err..
<ogra> oh
<ogra> nm
<janimonoses> that's deprecated in favor of what I wrote
<ogra> yes
<lamont> if it shows that it's depwait, and that doesn't match, then it means someone needs to poke me to clear it.
<lamont> uploading a new version to change build-deps _WILL_NOT_ clear a dep-wait
<janimonoses> lamont, thanks
<lamont> (and I've cleared it)
<janimonoses> the previous version tried building at least
<lamont> or, more precisely, I've told wanna-build to pretend that dbus-glib-1-dev is available
<janimonoses> so I thought : failed build -> needs upload
<tseng> janimonoses: now you know :)
<bddebian> "And knowing is half the battle"
<lamont> dep-wait --> never try again until that dependency is available, no matter how many times they upload
<janimonoses> tseng, but this is only one of the many corner cases which I don't :)
<zyga> hello
<bddebian> Hello zyga
<janimonoses> hi zyga
<crimsun> lamont: would you poke vlc, too, please?
<zyga> any gnomebaker devs lurk here?
* lamont makes a note to write  up the state engine for people.  It's a _TRIVIAL_ state engine... hence the difficulty
<lamont> crimsun: poke it how?
<janimonoses> lamont, writing it up would be GREAT
<lamont> pretend vlc is available, or what is it dep-wait on?
<crimsun> lamont: it's dep-wait on aalib1-dev, but aalib1-dev's not listed as a build-dep
<crimsun> that's why I'm quite confused
* zyga would really love to contribute gnomebaker 4.0 for hoary 
<zyga> and the polish translation
<zyga> (hoary-whatever-backports)
<crimsun> janimonoses: do we know what's going on with xffm4?
<lamont> crimsun: it was
<janimonoses> criumsun, let me take a look
<janimonoses> crimsun, I think  we need to ask elmo to sync?
<crimsun> lamont: hmm. I built it in an i386 and an amd64 pbuilder successfully.
<lamont> crimsun: 0.8.1-1ubuntu8: Build-Depends: ... liba52-0.7.4-dev, aalib1-dev, libdvbpsi3-dev,
<crimsun> janimonoses: according to http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/universe/x/xffm4/ it's already there.
<lamont> <lamont> dep-wait --> never try again until that dependency is available, no matter how many times they upload
<lamont> <janimonoses> tseng, but this is only one of the many corner cases which I\
<lamont> oops. only meant to paste one line
<crimsun> lamont: oh, I see. That would mean my 0.8.2-1ubuntu1 upload is stuck.
<lamont> crimsun: so now that I've told wanna-build to pretend taht aalib1-dev is available, the buildd will actually finally _TRY_ to build 0.8.2-1ubuntu1
<crimsun> lamont: right. Thanks!
<zyga> eh, anyone?
<lamont> not so much stuck as just totally ignored
<crimsun> janimonoses: doesn't look like xffm4 is actually being built at all
<crimsun> zyga: I don't think there are any here.
<zyga> crimsun: how about gb-4.0?
<crimsun> zyga: what about it?
<zyga> crimsun: there is none for ubuntu, can't it go to backports or someplace like it?
<crimsun> (I presume you mean 0.4)
<zyga> (yes)
<crimsun> it won't be autobuilt for backports from breezy since it's not in breezy, but it may be done by some other method. You might want to check with Mez.
<zyga> I've just built gb on hoary i386 (I can also build for amd64)
<zyga> It's not debianized yet but that can probably be taken from 3.0
<zyga> er 0.3
<zyga> crimsun: any reason why it's not in breezy?
<crimsun> we're already semi-UVF
<zyga> UVF?
<crimsun> looking at the changes for 0.4, there are some rather important fixes, so if other MOTUs agree, I don't mind seeing 0.4 in Breezy
<crimsun> (upstream version freeze)
<zyga> crimsun: ah
<zyga> crimsun: breezy would be bad without 0.4 IMHO :)
<jeffm> hey guys
<zyga> hi jeffm
<jeffm> ubuntu supports dual screens right?
<zyga> jeffm: I'm woring on a dual monitor setup ATM
<crimsun> jeffm: X.org does, yes.
<jeffm> AT The Moment?
<jeffm> thanks guys
<zyga> jeffm: yes
<jeffm> k
<zyga> what is 'k' exactly :>
<zyga> ?
<jeffm> ?
<zyga> jeffm: what does 'k' mean?
<jeffm> in KDE>
<jeffm> ?
<zyga> no.. in your message
<zyga> 20:41 < jeffm> k
<jeffm> its short for O.K
<jeffm> which is short for Okay
<ogra> which is short for "agreed" :)
<jeffm> yeah
<jeffm> or serves as acknowledgement
<ogra> wow, so many words in only one letter
<zyga> okay :>
<jeffm> lol
<jeffm> what is this X.org stuff?
* zyga never really knew that 'k' stood for 'ok' \
<jeffm> im on the site now
<zyga> jeffm: x.org is your x server, it does support mulit-head setups via xinerama
<jeffm> so that is build into Ubuntu?
<zyga> jeffm: this really is more suited on #ubuntu though
<jeffm> ok
<zyga> jeffm: yes it is, it works but there is no gui for it
<jeffm> so what de we tlak about here?
<jeffm> *talk
<jeffm> *do
<jeffm> lol
<zyga> universe
<jeffm> ohhh O.o
<ogra> especially its expansion ... and how to fix it
<jeffm> oh nice
<jeffm> you guys rock
<ogra> :)
<jeffm> im so glad that there is a viable alternative to M$
<zyga> how do I update various sha/md5 sums in .dsc files?
<ogra> zyga, you rebuild the source package
<zyga> ogra: so apt-getting source gnomebaker, extracting debian directory, removing patches and moving it to gnomebaker-0.4 is enough to debianize?
<zyga> okay some patches should stay...
<ogra> you weill need to make version specific adjustments ... but you can do it along this lines
<ogra> alternatively run dh_make and copy over the bits and pieces you want from the other version
<zyga> ogra: I'm not sure how to adjust build-deps, it did build on hoary with previous gnomebaker deps though
<zyga> ogra: thanks, I'll try
<zyga> dh_make is really nice :>
<zyga> ogra: keeping old changelog + adding new entry is okay for a version change?
<zyga> ogra: and what should I do with maintainer field from debian.control?
<ogra> hmm, i would make a new changelog for a completely new package, else i'd use the old one and just announce the new upsteam version
<crimsun> I'm already updating gnomebaker, zyga.
<mbreit> lamont: are you still around?
<lamont> never.
<lamont> :-)
<crimsun> (just running through the pbuild now)
<ogra> if you reuse nearly everything, leave it like it is... if you build from scratch, add yourself
<zyga> crimsun: :-)
<zyga> crimsun: there is no need to do any work :) ?
<zyga> crimsun: I'd love to help you know :)
<lamont> mbreit: what did you need?
<mbreit> lamont: could you remove dep-wait on gltron? i just checked again, and it builds in pbuilder, without dependency problems
<crimsun> wb jani
<janimonoses> :)
<janimonoses> hw failure
<janimonoses> luckily temporary only
<crimsun> janimonoses: :/
<crimsun> re dholbach
<dholbach> re :)
<janimonoses> crimsun, I thought I asked elmo to sync xffm4 but looks like I forgot
<mbreit> hi dholbach
<dholbach> hey moritz
<mbreit> dholbach: what happens to packages on revu with 3 votes?
<dholbach> it should be uploaded straightawway
<dholbach> :)
<mbreit> well, i have 3 votes...
<dholbach> excellent
<dholbach> shall i do it?
<mbreit> and i think i am whitelisted already
<dholbach> super
<dholbach> i'll upload it then
<mbreit> perfect! ;)
<janimonoses> crimsun, shall I ask him now?
<mbreit> then i will start with new packages tomorrow ;)
<dholbach> mbreit: that's the spirit
<zyga> crimsun: updated package will be available in breezy?
<zyga> crimsun: (or rather, where will it be available)
<mbreit> dholbach: yea... it's the "i wanna be a motu" spirit *g*
<dholbach> ROCK'N'ROLL!
<mbreit> ahhhhhh grrrrr.... wft?
<mbreit> how can a package build in pbuilder when i can't install the build-depends on my normal breezy system?
<dholbach> Riddell: could you please kick the packages from REVU, you uploaded?
<crimsun> janimonoses: not sure if you saw my last post
<crimsun> janimonoses: doesn't look like xffm4 is actually being built at all
<dholbach> mbreit: depends vs build-depends?
<janimonoses> no, I am just looking at the irclogs
<crimsun> janimonoses: but the 4.2.2-1 files are already there.
<mbreit> dholbach: just build-depends... i have a dep-wait on gltron..
<janimonoses> crimsun, why arent' they built?
<ogra> Riddell, ping
<mbreit> but i did a pbuilder update and a pbuilder build and that worked without problems... then i did a apt-get install libgl-dev  (which is the build-dep in question) but it does not want to install it
<crimsun> janimonoses: I have no idea :/  There's nothing in the build logs.
<crimsun> janimonoses: xffm4 does not appear to be dep-wait on something either, and it built in both i386 and amd64 breezy pbuilders.
<janimonoses> so how do we know it was synced?
<janimonoses> it's not on the ongoing-merge page either
<dholbach> i absolutely despise "sponsored upload for x.y.z" - there is  debuild -kyour@mail.adress , guys
<sivang> dholbach: Hi there Daniel
<sivang> dholbach: 'sup?
<dholbach> hey sivang :)
<sivang> dholbach: how is your autotools foo lately? :)
<dholbach> sivang: not better - did a lot of other stuff in between
<janimonoses> rigth so xffm4 source package is in the archive
<dholbach> sivang: how are you?
<crimsun> janimonoses: yep, I think that got cut off when your client pinged out
<sivang> dholbach: trying to find some advice on creating the right autotools foo for a shared lib
<dholbach> sivang: murray cumming has an excellent article on that - just a sec
<sivang> dholbach: cool, thanks , should I have used google better ? 0_o
<Mez> dholbach, the "sponsored upload for x.y.z thing is done cause then you acutally get output from katie
<dholbach> sivang: it's hard to find
<dholbach> Mez: everybody should asap let their mail adresses whitelist
<sivang> dholbach: ah ok, just send it up and I'll be greatful :)
<Mez> dholbach - I only got whitelisted like- 2 days aho
<Mez> ago *
<Mez> so, if whoever was whitelisting addresses didnt take their time so, then it wouldnt be a problem
<dholbach> i saw like 20 uploads or so in the last time
<dholbach> whitelists should be done by then
<dholbach> you can always re-ask
<dholbach> sivang: http://www.openismus.com/documents/linux/using_libraries/using_libraries.shtml
<ogra> Mez, i'm telling you since some time to contact elmo to getyour key and whitelisting sorted, please do so
<sivang> dholbach: thanks you very much
<dholbach> sivang: and the links from there - murrayc rocks
<sivang> dholbach: how did you come across this article ?
<sivang> dholbach: is he a MOTU ?
<dholbach> sivang: i know murrayc - no he is gnome-c++ :)
<Mez> ogra: and I've been trying for some time to contact him... I've got my whitelisting... but not my key
<dholbach> maybe you forgot the magic words :-p
<ogra> :)
* Mez sighs
<janimonoses> lamont, any idea why xffm4 does not enter the build?
<Mez> I would keep emailing him and stuff, but, I dont want to annoy him
<ogra> Mez, email him
<dholbach> Mez: don't worry - he's just incredibly busy - busier than anybody else you know, mail him, be nice, he'll understand
<Mez> ogra, I already have :D
<dholbach> and we have to other packages that are ready for upload
<Mez> I dont think anyones key from the last TB meeting has been sorted yet
<ogra> do it again then or catch him on irc... i've seen him around several times today
<dholbach> 1) mbreit and gnomeradio
<dholbach> and to others, which i will take care of
<dholbach> ExpandingUniverse, baby! :)
<Mez> ogra: I he never seems to reply to me on IRC - even if he's ther e:d
<Mez> but, I'll email again
<janimonoses> Mez, indeed elmo is very busy
<janimonoses> I've been after him almost two weeks for the xfce4 sync ;)
<Mez> I know he's very busy :D
<ogra> Mez, you are the backports team currently... getting your key sorted is a essential thing
<janimonoses> he's nice but busy
* Mez thinks elmo needs some minions
<dholbach> does ivoks has his key sorted out yet?
<dholbach> s/has/have
<Mez> what's his real name?
<ogra> james troup
<ogra> ?
<Mez> ivoks :P
<ogra> or do you mean ivoks
<janimonoses> ante karamatic I think
<ogra> AnteKaramatic
<ogra> yup
<Mez> he doesnt seem to have any uploads yet (not even sponsored ones
<dholbach> he does
<Mez> not sinceth
<Mez> 14th *
<ogra> he's on holiday
<Mez> ah
<dholbach> i'll upload his wifi-radar
<dholbach> rejoice - finally - users will love to see it
<crimsun> great :)
<dholbach> it's UP!
<mbreit> oh, i just looked at the wifi-radar homepage... looks very promising...
<dholbach> woohoo
<mbreit> that would be a reason to upgrade my laptop to breezy this weekend ;)
<dholbach> i won't upload python-pyrtf-0.45 yet - i'm not sure about how bdddebian and tritium are going to settle the maintainership of it
<dholbach> but that's rocking
<dholbach> 2 new packages up!
<dholbach> you can't believe how good that feels - the review process works
<dholbach> at least a bit it does :)
<mbreit> and i hope to create 2 new packages at the weekend ;) so there's always something to review ;)
<dholbach> what are you going to work on?
<dholbach> mbreit: i'm not complaining about not having enough work :)
<mbreit> spe and sonance... but i promise nothing...
<dholbach> ah... oculd it be they're on UniverseCandidates or something?
<mbreit> dholbach: i will also help with the unmet dependencies...
<mbreit> dholbach: yes, they are...
<janimonoses> dholbach, did the ubuntu-motu ml idea get dropped?
<dholbach> janimonoses: yes
<dholbach> janimonoses: unfortunately so
<janimonoses> so motu mails go to devel?
<dholbach> janimonoses: but we'll have a bug mailing list for universe
<dholbach> janimonoses: yes
<dholbach> janimonoses: and if you report about something crazy, include ubuntu-users - we want  press  everywhere :)
<janimonoses> ;)
<dholbach> mbreit: make sure you tick them off
<dholbach> mbreit: on UniverseCandidates
<mbreit> dholbach: i moved them down to the "already handeld" list
<dholbach> super
<blueyed> I had compiled/packages Apache2 from source for myself, because of another configure option to suexec. What's the easiest way know to upgrade to the latest security release?
<blueyed> s/packages/packaged/
<ogra> get the new source and compile it ?
<dholbach> blueyed: sudo apt-get install devscripts; sudo apt-get build-dep <package>; apt-get source <package>; cd <package-dir>; debuild; sudo debi
<kungkang> hey all, why is gedit-dev in universe when gedit is in main? there also seems to be a version inconsistency between them so gedit-dev is not installable.
<dholbach> kungkang: to the first part of the question: that's quite common - main should be as small as possible (to fit on a CD or something)
<dholbach> kungkang: to the second part: could be build problems - what architecture are you on?
<kungkang> i386
<crimsun> kungkang: for hoary/amd64, Candidate: 2.10.2-0ubuntu2
<crimsun> I don't see any version mismatch.
<mbreit> lamont: did you remove the dep-wait for gltron? or is it on dep-wait _again_?
<kungkang> gedit is ubuntu2, but gedit-dev is ubuntu1 according to my synaptic
<dholbach> do apt-get udpate again
<lamont> mbreit: what was it dep-wait on?
<crimsun> kungkang: you need to refresh. hoary-security has ubuntu2
<kungkang> crimsun: ah! i did not have hoary-security! thanks
<tseng> mbreit: you are working on sonace?
<mbreit> it sais libgl-dev... but it build depends on xlibmesa-gl-dev
<mbreit> , works perfectly in pbuilder
<tseng> sonance
<lamont> mbreit: I did not - no one asked...
<lamont> iz done now
<mbreit> lamont: i asked you just a few minutes ago?
<blueyed> dholbach: Thanks. Before "debuild" I'd patch the debian/rules file again, right?
<mbreit> lamont: directly after you said "mbreit: what did you need?"
<dholbach> blueyed: yes, exactly
<lamont> bradb: sorry - it scrolled off and I missed it.
<mbreit> tseng: yes, i want to package that, why to you ask?
<tseng> mbreit: because its a mono app
<mbreit> tseng: does that matter?
<mbreit> tseng: i love mono....
<tseng> yes
<mbreit> why?
<tseng> that is my main area, I can help you
<mbreit> oh, that would be nice ;)
<janimonoses> lamont, any idea why xffm4 does not enter the build?
<dholbach> janimonoses: new binary packages?
<janimonoses> even though 4.2.2-1 source is in the archive
<janimonoses> nope there was an xffm4 -- .deb already
<janimonoses> it used epoch if that matters
<lamont> janimonoses: nothing springs to mind... but it doesn't appear in the w-b output, which would tend to point towards the archive mangement stuff..
<lamont> since "not in w-b" --> never tried.
<janimonoses> there was a source called xffm which built xffm4 binary
<mbreit> lamont: btw: can you help with a "Not-For-Us" status? do you know where that comes from and what i can to that the package builds?
<tseng> so xffm4 is NEW?
<janimonoses> now there's a source called xfmm4 which builds same binary
<tseng> that is your problem.
<janimonoses> tseng, not really
<tseng> yes really
<janimonoses> apt-cache show xffm4
<tseng> Source: xffm
<janimonoses> but the source was xffm and now it would be xffm4
<lamont> NFU means that the buildd admin manually said "leave me alone, package"
<tseng> so its a new source
<crimsun> (Warty had a binary xffm4 that comes from xffm4 source)
<tseng> its in NEW
<tseng> it needs manual approval
<tseng> to enter buildd
<lamont> in this particular case, it means that the package was put on hold its dependencies were all done with the g++-4.0 transition] 
<tseng> crimsun: eh?
<janimonoses> actually there was an xffm4 source too for xfce4.0
<tseng> wow.
<crimsun> janimonoses: yep, that was Warty.
<mbreit> lamont: who can change that? i have fixed that package for gcc4, but it's still on NFU
<janimonoses> so a packages NEW-ness is reset on starting a new release cycle?
<lamont> are all of it's dependencies current in the archive?
<mbreit> yes
<crimsun> janimonoses: I wouldn't think so...
<lamont> janimonoses: NEW is a function of a.u.c/ubuntu/indices/override.${dist}....
<mbreit> lamont: it builds in pbuilder and is reviewed by a motu...
<janimonoses> so why is xffm4 considered new if there was already a source named like that?
<lamont> and generally that begins with what the previous release had and gets added to
<crimsun> janimonoses: I don't think it's considered NEW, because Warty had it. There seems to be something else holding it back.
<lamont> mbreit: infinity was dealing with NFU stuff - I'll poke him to review all of them and see what else can be given back...
<lamont> (that is, the class needs review, not just the one instance)
<mbreit> lamont: thanks!
<janimonoses> crimsun, lamont just said something re previous release, maybe NEWness gets reset?
* janimonoses awaits lauchpad - the solution to every annoyance
<mbreit> ahhh... gltron is build... thanks again, lamont
<lamont> mbreit: which package, btw
<lamont> ?
<mbreit> lamont: noteedit
<Mez> hmmles
<Mez> getting some weird errors whiel trying to update
<dholbach> do we have a netinst image or something?
<ogra> yes
<ogra> dont ask for a url though
<ogra> there was a post to u-d with the url the last days
<ogra> tseng, just for the record, YOU ROCK !
<tseng> ogra: do I?
<ogra> i just realized that my f-spot on amd64 runs rock solid !!
<tseng> hah sweet dude
<ogra> yeah :)
<ogra> hmm, slideshow doesnt work, i guess thats an X issue
<ogra> hmm,and fullscreen shows a question mark...
<mbreit> well, fullscreen works here without any problem (f-spot on amd64)
<tseng> ogra: right now im trying to hack muine-inotify for new inotify in breezy
<ogra> mbreit, fully up to date ?
<ogra> i obvously only have the thimbnail view available, everything else shows just a question mark...
<mbreit> ogra: update half an hour ago
<ogra> hmm... propbably i flddled to much with the mono stuff in the past
<mbreit> slideshow as well as fullscreen mode work like a charm...
<ogra> oki,so i suspect my setup
<mbreit> but it does not work rock solid.... it just crashed...
<ogra> it works rock solid here, i never could ues it longer then 5mins without crash
<ogra> we shoudl merge :)
<mbreit> crashed again... that seems to be a problem with one picture i have... in thumbnail view, it is shown landscape, if i open it, its portrait... if i open another photo after that, it crashes
<mbreit> it seems that it also crashes when rotating some picture... so it's definitly not "rock solid"....
<mbreit> but tseng does a great job anyway ;)
<ogra> it just doesnt rotate here... but doesnt crash
<mbreit> hmmm
<ogra> funny
<mbreit> ahh... i want the -44 xorg version....
<Nafallo> uhm
<Nafallo> is it just me or is gnomebaker's deps way off?
<Nafallo> jackd for example?
<ogra> mbreit, not for us... and daniels ejoys his weekend already ::::/
<Nafallo> gstreamer0.8-polypaudio? :-P
<ogra> wow, i'm an eight eyed alien today.. my broken keyboard is funny sometimes
<mbreit> ogra: i know.... but i want my television back... and -44 finally includes the v4l-module....
<Nafallo> hmm
<dholbach> mbreit: throw away your television :)
<Nafallo> update-notifier doesn't work for me :-/
<mbreit> dholbach: my television is my pc...  i just want to be able to watch tv... and therefor i need the v4l module
<dholbach> i see
<Riddell> ogra: hi
<mbreit> i need a motu to review and upload a drpython-fix... won't take long, just a small debdiff...
<dholbach> mbreit: link? :)
<mbreit> http://ubuntu.mobr.de/sources/debdiffs/drpython_3.10.13-1ubuntu1.debdiff
<dholbach> how nice does it work?
<mbreit> very nice ;)
<dholbach> did you very absolutely well test it?
<dholbach> :)
<dholbach> you will receive all following bug reports :)
<mbreit> well, i build it, i started it, i loaded a file, and it was still running ;)
<dholbach> http://packages.debian.org/changelogs/pool/main/d/drpython/drpython_3.10.13-2/changelog :)
<mbreit> wtf?
<dholbach> sounds like a sync from debian experimental was in order :)
<dholbach> sorry for that :)
<mbreit> yeah... damn...
<mbreit> dholbach: it's not your fault... i should have looked in debian experimental
<dholbach> be sure to mail james.troup@canonical.com to sync it
<dholbach> don't worry
<dholbach> it's just the thing what i learnt from all the MergeOMatic business
<mbreit> james.troup? why him?
<dholbach> he's elmo
<dholbach> because he does syncs... in general
<mbreit> oh, okay
<mbreit> so i have to write him an email that he should sync drpython with debian experimental?
<dholbach> yes... and add a "please" somewhere - and tell that their fix works nicely for you :)
<mbreit> hehe... okay, i'll do that
<ogra> and that dholbach approved the UVF override ;)
<mbreit> uvf?
<ogra> upastream version freeze
<ogra> upstream
<mbreit> well, it's no new upstream version?
<ogra> all new upstream versions need approval since some weeks
<dholbach> it's just a debian fix
<dholbach> not a new version
<ogra> oh...
<ogra> i thought its a newversion... then forget about it
<mbreit> okay, email is on the way..
<JanC> new drpython package depending on wxpython 2.6 ?  nice :)
<mbreit> yes... and that works quite well
<mbreit> going to bed now... good night everybody!
<dholbach> sleep tight moritz
<mbreit> thanks
<herzi> dholbach: ping
<dholbach> pong
<dholbach> herzi: pong :)
#ubuntu-motu 2005-08-11
<herzi> dholbach: tust du mir einen gefallen? machst du ein criawips.deb?
<dholbach> gern
<dholbach> jetzt auf der stelle? :)
<dholbach> hast du nen release?
<dholbach> for those unfamiliar with the german language: herzi wants me to package his world dominating criawips - watch out for it :)
<herzi> http://www.criawips.org/
<dholbach> herzi: i'll take care of it, but not now - i'll mail you about it in the following days - alright?
<Nafallo> hehe. I saw the demo of that one :-)
<herzi> okay
<dholbach> super
<dholbach> couldn't you dispose of the debian/ dir?
<dholbach> that 'd be very kind of you
<dholbach> say from the next release on?
<herzi> dholbach: i'll do
<dholbach> thank you very much
<dholbach> what a depends line :)
<dholbach> build-depends
<dholbach> it looked good already
<herzi> of course, i have been building it to have it for presentation purposes installed into /usr (without trashing my distro)
<dholbach> i'll try to get it in soon
<dholbach> the debian gnome guys will be excited too
<dholbach> herzi: how ready is it?
<herzi> well... it's developing
<dholbach> that's nice to hear
<herzi> i need to work on a good text model and some "template list" (a list for slide templates to be applied) now, then context menus, more text editing, images in presentations, and everything's fine
<herzi> (sounds easy, doesn't it)
<dholbach> sounds like a pain in the ass, if you ask me
<dholbach> sorry for the explicit language
<dholbach> those fixme-warnings are funny :)
<herzi> well, they help to not forget things
<herzi> at least if one uses the color-gcc
<Nafallo> dholbach: what is all the numbers for in the "Ort" column @ wiki.ubuntu.com/GermanTeam?
<Nafallo> dholbach: we're about to start SwedishTeam ;-)
<dholbach> beginning of the postal code
<dholbach> it's 5 numbers in germany
<dholbach> these are the first 2 ones
<dholbach> s/ones//
<Nafallo> ahh, as in Sweden then.
<Nafallo> why do you need those numbers there? :-)
<dholbach> just for brief orientation and managing how well covered your team is
<dholbach> it wasnt my idea :)
<Nafallo> hehe, oki :-) thanx.
<Nafallo> confused me a lot ;-)
<dholbach> ok everybody - i'm off to bed
<dholbach> was a pleasure to be here - see you around
* terrex nanit! // nites!
<ajmitch> hi all
<ajmitch> been busy in here in the last 12 hours
<gradzac> hi ajmitch, I don't think too many people are in here right now
<ajmitch> gradzac: that's ok, I can talk to an empty room ;)
<squinn> haha ajmitch
<gradzac> hehe, there is some advantage to that....nobody disagrees with you
<Nafallo> ajmitch: morning :-)
<ajmitch> hi Nafallo
<Nafallo> is it just me or is gstreamer0.8-plugins dep of gnomebaker pure insanity?
<ajmitch> why would it be?
<ajmitch> it probably decodes oggs for burning music cds
<Nafallo> there is more than oggs in there
<Nafallo> the damn thing wants to install jackd for instance ;-)
<ajmitch> hehe
<Nafallo> I don't need gstreamer0.8-swfdec when I burn stuff ;-)
<ajmitch> dunno why not ;)
<Nafallo> hmm. I wonder if I got upload rights yet :-P
<gradzac> ajmitch: when I verify a package listed in unmetdeps builds for breezy, I'm adding to the done table in the wiki....done means a MOTU uploader rebuilds the package and uploads it, right?
<ajmitch> no, done means done..
<gradzac> what should I do when I know a package builds in breezy....tell you guys here?
<hub> hi
<hub> hi
<hub> in the UniverseCandidate, there is a package I have done
<crimsun> which?
<hub> hugin
<crimsun> is it on REVU?
<hub> mmm
<hub> it is here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UniverseCandidates
<hub> and packages are on my harddrive
<hub> I mailed dh
<crimsun> have you posted diff.gz anywhere?
<hub> no
<hub> I was reading the documentation
<hub> if I understand, I have to be approved
<hub> or some sort
<hub> and have a signed GPG key
<hub> I have a key, but not signed AFAIK
<crimsun> you have to be in the keyring to actually upload to Ubuntu, yes, but you don't need to be approved to actually do packaging work
<hub> okay
<hub> crap
<hub> t-bird does not do gpg apparently
<hub> or it is not obvious
<hub> ah
<hub> I miss the package
<crimsun> mozilla-thunderbird-enigmail
<hub> yep
<hub> found it
<hub> thx
<pef> hello
<\sh> morning
<crimsun> re \sh
<\sh> ok..coffee and wrapping up the meeting minutes...
<highvoltage> hi guys
<Burgundavia> are there minutes to the meeting on the 5th?
<crimsun> http://people.ubuntu.com/~fabbione/irclogs/ubuntu-meeting-2005-08-05.html
<Burgundavia> yes, reading them now
<\sh> siretart: ping
<\sh> ok..mail send to ubuntu-devel
<\sh> I'll setup a new wiki page for the MeetingMinutes of MOTU: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTUMeetingMinutes
<\sh> s/I'll/I'd/
<siretart> morning
<siretart> \sh: pong
<pef> is there any ruby fan motu here ?
<\sh> siretart: can we put something for MOTUNewPackages (not reviewing stuff) on REVU?
<\sh> siretart: something like a tracker for packages which could be synced from debian when they're requested from users?
<pef> siretart: and how to deal with rtp and itp :)
<siretart> \sh: hm. I think I understand what you want, I'm thinking how to do this best
<siretart> you basically want to keep track if a newer version is already in debian, right?
<koke_> pef: I like ruby but I haven't layed enough with it
<\sh> siretart: something like this...a replacement of MOTUNewPackages...where the people can add fav. packages which are not in ubuntu and/or not in debian
<siretart> \sh: you mean, where people can point to packages done by third parties?
<pef> koke_: are you able to make a package for rubygems ?
<\sh> siretart: yep...
<siretart> hm
<siretart> I will think about this.
<siretart> my concern is, that that third party may not be interested in maintaining the package in ubuntu
<siretart> I think of packages packaged for personal use with questionable licence
<\sh> siretart: many third party packages do have an ITP running in debian...but they're quite slow..u know the processes :(
<siretart> and I'd rather try to avoid the sitation that random people try to import random stuff without doing basic checking for fittness in ubuntu
<\sh> siretart: that'll be our job ,)
<koke_> pef: I'm not sure if I can, but I have no much time
<koke_> :D
<\sh> and if the package doesn't fit our QA we will trash it from this list...
<siretart> so you want some tracker for itp's in debian?
<siretart> have you seen how many itp's there are in debian?
<siretart> hm
<\sh> siretart: no...the users should be able to put package requests on this list...and if there is an ITP, good for us, we will w8 to sync it someday...but if there is no itp/rfp in debian, we have to check the quality of the package
<\sh> and decide if we can include it...asking the maintainer to maintain it for ubuntu and if not...decide again
<siretart> \sh: ok. I see your point for this. I'm not sure if this is in scope of revu, but another server, perhaps with relationship/bindings to revu
<siretart> s/server/service
<\sh> siretart: yes...to get rid of this MOTUNewPackages page...cause it's a different scope as MOTUToReview
<\sh> so next thing on my todo: learn the basics of mod_python ,-)
<\sh> but it doesn't look like so different from mod_perl
<siretart> oh, that isn't that hard. the documentation is quite short ;)
* siretart never seen mod_perl
<\sh> siretart: the heart is always the request object from apache ;)
<siretart> that's 'req' in mod python :)
<\sh> jepp
<\sh> ok..upgrading to new xorg
<Amaranth> *sigh*
<Amaranth> another x migration needed
<Lathiat> apparently it works now
<Amaranth> no, i mean libgl1 things
<Lathiat> oh
<Lathiat> right
<Lathiat> ive been waiting to see what ended up happening
<Lathiat> so now its glu and gl
<Amaranth> libgl1-xorg conflicts with xlibmesa-gl and xlibmesa-gl is used by a lot of things
<Lathiat> im still waiting for elmo to add me to the breezy-changes whitelist
<Amaranth> if they're the same thing it's just a matter of updating the Depends
<Amaranth> err
<Amaranth> you don't send mail to -changes, you reply to the -changes email on -devel
<Amaranth> or is that not what you mean?
<Lathiat> no i mean
<Lathiat> so when i upload packages
<Lathiat> i get mail about them
<Lathiat> and their mails togo breezy-changes
<Amaranth> ah
<Amaranth> Hosting-Geek: You're not banned?
<Hosting-Geek> Amaranth: no
<Hosting-Geek> Amaranth: lilo is messing with my mind
<Mez> what package is dh_make in again?
<Mez> meh
<Mez> dh-make
<HostingGeek> heh custom css file for ebay in this auction... http://cgi.ebay.com.au/NEW-MEGXON-S306-12MP-DIGITAL-CAMERA-8X-ZOOM-AV-RECORD_W0QQitemZ7536220350QQcategoryZ98400QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
<HostingGeek> makes ebay look weird
<Treenaks> that's what custom CSS files are for..
<Treenaks> it's not even real 12mpix, but interpolated 7mpix
<Mez> hmm
<Mez> trying to build simias should be fun
<Amaranth> smeg 0.8 gains another feature on the road to greatness
<Amaranth> :)
<Mez> wow, ok, it's pretty simple to build
<Mez> a generic dh_make should work
<Mez> w-0-0-t
<tseng> generic dh_make is nasty stuff.
<Mez> hmm
<Mez> needs g++
<Mez> where do i find lstdc++
<tseng> libstdc++
<Mez> nvm
* Mez is an idiot
<Mez> thanks tseng :d
<tseng> np.
<Mez> btw, I may need your help with this
<Mez> it is mono after all
<tseng> with c++?
<Mez> not too sure :D
* Mez is confused
<tseng> hah ok
<Mez> /usr/bin/ld CSPObjectIterator.o CSPropertyIterator.o CSPStore.o CSPStoreObject.o FlaimWrapper.o -oFlaimWrapper.so -L "../../../external/flaim/lxx86/gcc3/release" -lflm -lstdc++ -lpthread -shared
<Mez> /usr/bin/ld: cannot find -lstdc++
<Amaranth> so depend on libstdc++?
<Mez> yet I have libstdc++6.4.0 and -dev installed
<Amaranth> oh
<Mez> (I'm trying a manual make to get deps first
<tseng> so your linker cant find it
* Treenaks discovers why throughput from eth0 -> eth1 is bad:
<Treenaks> The debian stock kernel compiles 8139TOO with PIO instead of MMIO
<Mez>  /usr/lib/libstdc++.so.6
<Mez> isnt that what it's looking for?
<Mez> no, it's looking for libstdc++.so
<Mez> hmmles..
<Mez> what should i do about that?
<Amaranth> punt?
<Mez> Amaranth, huh?
<Amaranth> give up, let someone else do it, etc
<Mez> Amaranth, doing a sudo ln -s /usr/lib/libstdc++.so.6 /usr/lib/libstdc++.so
<Mez> fixes it
<Mez> and makes it build for me
<Amaranth> Mez: you can't do that
<Mez> Amaranth, not in a package no
<Mez> but, manually I can
<Mez> now if I only knew how to fix that without having to do it like that, then I'd be sorted
<siretart_> \sh: is anything left to do with wine?
<siretart_> \sh: what about the winetools package?
<\sh> siretart_: I'm working on it
<siretart_> ah, ok.
<\sh> it will be there before the 11th :)
<\sh> need some more testing
<siretart_> what is on 11th?
<\sh> hard feature freeze
<siretart_> oh
<siretart_> if you need help, tell me
<\sh> we need to get done with unmetdeps...and I have a lot to fix for amd64 as well...na ok...tomorrow is the day...just now I will leave for the bierboerse
<siretart_> hehe have fun
<siretart_> I'm already on unmet deps
<\sh> and I have to setup a process for breezy+1 :(
* HostingGeek kicks Mez... Mez lands on the ground upset... Mez happened to fall on a lot of money... Mez is happy HostingGeek kicked him
* Amaranth bans HostingGeek 
* HostingGeek unbans HostingGeek 
<Amaranth> :P
<\sh> I have to have a meeting with ogra at his place.....lemme check my timetable for next week
<Amaranth> HostingGeek: hey, do something useful and test smeg for me :)
* Mez cries
<HostingGeek> Amaranth: newah
<HostingGeek> Mez: be happy you are a mutli-multi-multi millionar
<Amaranth> 'newah'?
<HostingGeek> Mez: with so much money you can buy out fedora... gentoo... ...
<HostingGeek> Amaranth: never...
<Mez> HostingGeek, if only it was real money
<HostingGeek> Mez: it is
<tseng> oh rock
<tseng> libevolution-cil built
<tseng> and tomboy
<tseng> Amaranth: icon fixed
<Amaranth> has been for awhile?
<Amaranth> oh, cool, it can be a panel applet or a notification tray icon
<tseng> i mean, the scaling
<tseng> we use the 24px one now
<Amaranth> yeah, i see that, cool
<Amaranth> but i could have swore that was working 2-3 days ago too :)
<tseng> i see
<tseng> i just noticed this built
<tseng> but ive been pretty out of it so
<Amaranth> the important thing is i can't nag anymore :)
<tseng> today might be a nice day for amd64 beagle fans
* tseng uploads fixage
<Mez> lol
<\sh> ok...I'm gone :)
* Mez growls
<Mez> tseng, do you know how to get the makefiles to use g++ instead of ld to link stuff, cuase I need to do it and i have no clue how 9kamion mentioned automake?
<Mez> as apparently libstdc++6 was shipped in a way so that people would use g++ instead of ld
<tseng> hm no we missed \sh :/
<tseng> one of our c++ heros
<Mez> grr
<highvoltage> why do people use _away if irc has an away feature?
<Mez> so people who are new to IRC know
<tseng> in alot of clients there is no visible indication that someone is away
<tseng> i dotn really care if people think im here or not.
* Amaranth passes out and hits his head on the desk on the way down
<Mez> lol
* siretart_ kicks tim riker for his bzflag package :/
<Lathiat> siretart: ?
<Lathiat> siretart: the crappy packaging?
<siretart> its NATIVE!
<siretart> and sizes about 10mb
<siretart> he was already approached, but his rationale is that he is also upstream and releases the debian package in advacne :/
<Amaranth> that's what i said for smeg
<Amaranth> unless the .tar.gz you get from the bzflag website contains a debian/ directory it shouldn't be a native package
<Amaranth> and if it does have a debian/ directory he is pissing off red hat, mandrake, etc packagers
<Amaranth> i should be in bed...
<siretart> perhaps I should repackage that..
<tseng> is anyone still using nm-applet
* Mez dances
* Seveas runs away
<Treenaks> Mez: I hope you're not dancing the QT4 Dance?
<Mez> Treenaks, no the "I got somehting to work finally" dance
<siretart> bzflag should be finally working in breezy
<siretart> hey bddebian
<bddebian> Heya siretart
<siretart> bddebian: good work on the motu report and the MOTUWannaBeTips :)
<siretart> bddebian: thank you! :)
<bddebian> Oh, thanks
<bddebian> Now if I could just make some worthwhile packaging contributions :-)
<HostingGeek> hey bddebian
<bddebian> Hello HostingGeek
<Mez> hmmles, dpatch = being annoying
<bddebian> Hello Mez
<Mez> hello
<HostingGeek> bddebian: you mean Hello Count Mez
<bddebian> Count Mez?
<Mez> HostingGeek, give up on that
<HostingGeek> bddebian: (i kick Mez over and he found a few million dollars)
* Lathiat sedates HostingGeek 
<tseng> please, no more silly business.
<HostingGeek> bddebian: few million == almost a billion
<bddebian> Uhm, OK
<Mez> tseng: any chance you can tell me why my dpatch isnt working
<tseng> Mez: thats pretty specific
<HostingGeek> bddebian: I hear Mez is planning on buying everyone in this channel a new home :P
<HostingGeek> ok ok I'll stop
<Mez> tseng, dpeatch isnt applying it
<tseng> HostingGeek: strike 2
<tseng> Mez: ENOCONTEXT
<Mez> tseng? what?
<tseng> err: no context
<Mez> tseng, I've modified my debian/rules to call "patch" but it doesnt seem to run the "patch" part of the makefile
<tseng> did you include dpatch.mk
<Mez> include /usr/share/dpatch/dpatch.make
<tseng> or.. you told it to call literall "/usr/binpatch"
<Mez> build: patch build-stamp
<tseng> ok
<tseng> right
<tseng> did you add the patch to 00list
<Mez> wtf is 00list?
<tseng> debian/patches/00list
<tseng> lists patches to apply
<Mez> ah
<tseng> just put in the patch name
<Mez> the full name or wthout the extention
<tseng> no path, no suffix
<tseng> you can really go either way about extension, i think
<tseng> i remove it
<Mez> aha, I missed that lil bit in your instructions
<Mez> w00t
<Mez> and i now have a buildable package
<Mez> now to clean it up
<tseng> rock out
<Mez> tseng: mind if i poke it over to you (or get you to look at in REVU) when I'm done?
<tseng> yeah i will look at it on revu
<tseng> im heading out again for a bit i hope
<bddebian> tseng: Oh btw, I think I fixed (xdiskusage), it had a bad build-depends so it didn't build.
<tseng> bddebian: you need another upload?
<bddebian> tseng: Yeah but it needs a change in control and a changelog entry
<bddebian> I have a diff posted
<tseng> yes fine
<tseng> can you mail me a link/diff/watever?
<tseng> brandon AT smarterits.com
* tseng out
<bddebian> tseng: It's linked on UniverseUnmetDeps
<bddebian> Oh, sorry, bye
<siretart> slomo already has a package prepared for xdiskusage
<bddebian> aaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhh
<siretart> http://yggdrasil.sytes.net/files/ubuntu-krams/upload/
<bddebian> siretart: See why we need a wannabe "process" ;-)
<siretart> I'm currently uploading his stuff ;)
<Mez> tseng: uploading to revu
<Mez> aw crap, pinging out due to damn upload to REVU
<mbreit> hi all...
<Lathiat> Mez: look at wodershaper
<Lathiat> *wondershaper
<Lathiat> can set a max down/up stream value, if you set it somewhere under your actual value you can prevent that
<Lathiat> keps latency down too if you set it low enough
<Lathiat> whcih is usually not mkuch under your actual speed
<bddebian> Hello mbreit
<mbreit> hi bddebian
<gradzac> hey bddebian
<gradzac> someone here that can help me with a pbuilder issue?
<mbreit> gradzac: what's your problem?
<gradzac> when I try to to a debuild, pbuilder bombs saying it can't find the control file.  I start the process from the top level source directory where the debian directory is
<mbreit> i always do a dpkg-buildpackage -S and then i call pbuilder this the generated source package (pbuilder build *.dsc)
<gradzac> k, I'll try that
<bddebian> Hello gradzac
<gradzac> hey, I was gonna ask you for some help with pbuilder, but mbreit answered my question
* Mez wishes dput had a status thing
<Mez> 13 Mb upload = PITA
<gradzac> Mez: you on dialup?
<Mez> gradzac - no - but sometimes I feel like I am
<Mez> It's b een going for at least 20 mins now
<gradzac> damn....I'd complain to your ISP if you have DSL or cable
<gradzac> or is it REVU?
<Mez> I've got like - 128 kbps upstream
<Mez> which is what - 13 kBbps?
<Lathiat> * changing build dep to libgl1-xorg-dev, glu is provided by this
<Lathiat> wtf ?
<Lathiat> (in bzflag upload)
<Mez> which is about 17 mins
<Lathiat> Replaces: libgl-dev, libutahglx-dev, xlibmesa-dev (<< 4.2.1-5), xlibmesa-gl-dev
<Lathiat> Conflicts: libgl-dev, libutahglx-dev, xlibmesa-dev (<< 4.2.1-5), xlibmesa-gl-dev
<gradzac> Mez: or less, there is overhead for the protocol
<Lathiat> Provides: libgl-dev, xlibmesa-gl-dev
<Lathiat> Depends: xlibmesa-gl (= 6.8.2-44), x11proto-core-dev, libxext-dev, libx11-dev, x11proto-gl-dev
* Lathiat doesn't see any GLU
<Mez> gradzac, dont you mean more?
<gradzac> I mean less available bandwidth for your data, since some of the bandwidth gets used up by protocol stuff
<Mez> gradzac, yeah - I know that
<gradzac> is the CxxLibraryList the best place to look for the versions of C++ libs in breezy?
<mbreit> btw: some motu with upload right around here?
<gradzac> Mez: one of the reasons I don't like DSL is the slow upstream rate
<gradzac> if I use apt-cache it says that the version of libgtkmm-dev is 1.2.10-7ubuntu1, but the wiki says 2.6.2-0ubuntu2
<Lathiat> gradzac: well, adsl goes up to 1mbit upstream
<Lathiat> adsl2 adn 2+ stay at 1mbit but increase the downstream from 8 to 12 and then 24 for 2+
<mbreit> gradzac:  libgtkmm-2.4-dev is there...
<gradzac> Lathiat: my cable is 3 Mbps up and 5 down
<Lathiat> heh
<Mez> gradzac, I'm on cable: just stupid people limit it
<Lathiat> well, we cant get cable here
<Lathiat> theres almost no cable infrastructure in my city
<Lathiat> only in a few places
<Mez> lol
<Lathiat> best adsl i acn get is 1.5mbit down, 256kbit up
<Mez> I cant wait till I move back out of here
<gradzac> mbreit: any idea what I'm doing wrong?  My pbuilder is set up for breezy but doesn't have those versions
<Lathiat> and we have data limits unlike the rest of the world :\
<Mez> before I moved here I had 4Mbps down and 1Mbps up
<Mez> now I have 1 mbps down 128 up
<Lathiat> i get 10GB on-peak (7am-midnight) and 10GB off-peak (midnight-7am)
<Lathiat> and i pay AU$70/mo for that
<Mez> Lathiat, where you based?
<Lathiat> Mez: perth, western australia
<Lathiat> which is $53usd
<Mez> ah cool.
<gradzac> not a bad price
<Lathiat> gradzac: from what ive seen compared to us and canada its crap
* Lathiat shrugs
* Mez used to pay 50GBP ($100USD ish) for 4Mbps down 1Mbps up
<Mez> with no limits
<Mez>  :D
<Lathiat> heh
<gradzac> I'm paying about $60usd for 5Mbps down and 3Mbps up, no limits and I can run my own servers
* highvoltage pays about 150USD for a 128kbps connections, and here that's real cheap
<Lathiat> gradzac: i'd kill for that
<Mez> Lathiat, as would I
<Lathiat> highvoltage: now see, i feel sorry for you :\
<highvoltage> Lathiat: me too!
<gradzac> highvoltage: where is that?
<highvoltage> South Africa.
<Lathiat> highvoltage: p.s.: where the f**k do you live
<highvoltage> we have the most expensive telekom monopoly in the world.
<Mez> highvoltage, get in contact with mark :P
<Lathiat> ah lovely
<Lathiat> highvoltage: well, ouch :\
<Lathiat> i'll take back my complaints
<Mez> highvoltage, at least you have Freedom Toasters :D
<highvoltage> Mez: Mark is already involved
<Lathiat> 1.5mbit with 20GB is just fine at au$70/mo
<Lathiat> Mez: heh
<highvoltage> telkom.co.za is our telecom provider
<highvoltage> and some guy started hellkom.co.za
<Lathiat> heheh
<highvoltage> and telkom sued him, so mark paid for his legal fees, and he won the case!
<Lathiat> hahaha
<Lathiat> nice
<highvoltage> my 128k is illegal, it's a wireless connection. that's why it's so cheap.
<highvoltage> i get it from www.wo.co.za
<Mez> highvoltage, I actually remember mark talking about that
<highvoltage> here are prices:
<highvoltage> http://www.wo.co.za/products.html
<highvoltage> devide by 6.5 for USD
<highvoltage> i've spoken to mark about it too.
<Mez> mark should start his own ISP :P
<highvoltage> we have a 512KB up and down link at work, for that we pay
<highvoltage> (doing some calcs)
<mbreit> gradzac: for your pbuilder problem: did you do a pbuilder update lately?
<gradzac> highvoltage: if the company has a website advertising service, how is it illegal?
<highvoltage> about US$9500 a month
<Lathiat> highvoltage: f**k me, wtf
<gradzac> mbreit: I thought so, I'm going to create a new pbuilder base
<Lathiat> thats nasty
<highvoltage> gradzac: it isn't legal, these companies pop up and get shut down all the time.
<Lathiat> highvoltage: because they dont have a carrier license right
<Lathiat> in .au you cant broadcast non-personal traffic without a carrier license
<highvoltage> when we read on slashdot on how "expensive" bandwidth is in the US, we laugh, because we'd kill for the US "expensive" price.
<highvoltage> Lathiat: no, because it's illegal for any other company than Telkom to provide communication infrastructure in SA.
<Lathiat> highvoltage: oh really? wtf is with that
<Lathiat> sounds a bit dodge to me
<highvoltage> there are only one company that's allowed to provide wireless services legally, and that's sentech.co.za
<highvoltage> but they're mostly telkom anyway.
<mbreit> gradzac: gtkmm seems a bit broken atm... build after pbuilder update or making a new base.tgz it _should_ work ;)
<gradzac> mbreit: ok, thanks
<highvoltage> and then you can get 3g with vodacom.co.za, but vodacom is half vodafone and half telkom anyway.
<Lathiat> you have a 3G infrastructure? interesting
<highvoltage> Lathiat: south africa gets stuff like 3g before the UK and US.
<Lathiat> sounds like the prices are so insane i have no idea how they have customers to support that. :)
<highvoltage> we're a big playing field for experimental technology.
<gradzac> mbreit: I'm working on the unmetdeps packages...I just want to make sure I put the correct version in the build depends
<highvoltage> Lathiat: your thinking sounds rational, but you can't do bussiness without a connection, and that's where telkom smiles big
<Lathiat> well, your 3G data is slightly cheaper than ours
<highvoltage> just google for "i hate telkom" and see what comes up :)
<mbreit> gradzac: it depends on what your package needs.. if its gtkmm 2.4+ i would build-depend on libgtkmm2.4-dev
<highvoltage> Lathiat: oh yes, our cellular rates are of the lowest in the world.
<gradzac> where can I get the breezy.buildd for pbuilder?
<highvoltage> in fact, it's cheaper to own a cellphone than a landline in S.A.
<Lathiat> interesting
<highvoltage> I have a friend that only uses GPRS, he doesn't have a landline.
<gradzac> mbreit: thats what I put, but I can't test the build with pbuilder becuase it can't find that package
* Lathiat looks at them
<crimsun> gradzac: you can use the Breezy pbuilder deb
<Lathiat> seems a little cheaper than ours
<crimsun> gradzac: alternately, just dist-upgrade to Breezy within your pbuilder from Hoary using --override-config
<gradzac> do I have to use the --override-config option *everytime* i update the pbuilder?
<crimsun> yes
<gradzac> ah....thats my problem then
<gradzac> thanks
<crimsun> np
<mbreit> grr... i think i will put pgadmin3 back to the nobody-list... i just can't even pass the configure...
<mbreit> and i have no idea how that worked before... since i do not use a new upstream version... and i have changed nothing in the rules file...
<Treenaks> highvoltage: isn't gprs extremely slow & flakey?
<Treenaks> highvoltage: (it is here in the Netherlands)
<mbreit> gradzac: which package are you working on?
<highvoltage> Treenaks: here it's quite stable. (more so than our dial-up accounts, at least)
<gradzac> mbreit: I was working on amsynth, but I can't get the depends for libgtkmm to work correctly
<mbreit> i am asking because i am working on the unmet deps page as well...
<gradzac> i'm basically starting at the top of the list and seeing what builds
<gradzac> if it builds I adding it next to my name in the "needs love" section
<mbreit> that's always a good idea..
<mbreit> i am working on ardour now..
<mbreit> so you can skip that ;)
<gradzac> ok
<mbreit> and after that i will start at the bottom ;)
<gradzac> i'm building aqsis right now
<mbreit> lol... pbuilder could not install libgtkmm-dev ;)
* bddebian was starting from the bottom.. :-)
<mbreit> well... then... i do some packages in between ;)
<gradzac> mbreit: yeah, I figure that is a hopeless cause right now
<gradzac> I'm confident that my pbuilder is set up correctly for breezy, but it can't resolve any deps for libgtkmm
<bddebian> mbreit: Well I'm just the MOTU secretary now so you go right ahead.. ;-P
<mbreit> bddebian: well, no...
<gradzac> does anyone know....is breezy still going to use gnome-system-tools for network configuration?
<mbreit> lol... okay, i think we can declare gtkmm for broken now..
<mbreit> and i don't think they will resolve main-bugs on a weekend...
<gradzac> is there a bug filed against that? does one need to be filed?
<mbreit> we could find someone on ubuntu-devel to fix that...
<mbreit> we should really make a list of all packages that can't be build because of gtkmm...
<gradzac> that would take some time
<mbreit> gradzac: just the one we tried..
<mbreit> so nobody else has to try until gtkmm is fixed
<gradzac> maybe add a new section to the wiki?
<mbreit> yes... i'll be doing that
<mbreit> just tell me which ones you tried
<gradzac> ok, so far amsynth
<gradzac> aqsis is unhappy because of the compiler version
<mbreit> and amsynth
<mbreit> a, well, do we really need a new section for that? perhaps we should add these to our own "needs-love" list...
<mbreit> gradzac: do you want to fix amsynth when gtkmm is fixed?
<gradzac> sure, I think it only needs an update to the control file
<mbreit> okay, whats your real name?
<bddebian> So fix it :-)
<gradzac> BenjaminMontgomery in the wiki
<mbreit> okay
<mbreit> i put it in your list
<gradzac> thanks
<mbreit> done
<mbreit> 2nd try ;) i left the gtkmm-line in there ;)
<gradzac> ok, so I just noticed the "Just needs a rebuild" section....is the intent to put packages there that build without changes?
<mbreit> yes
<mbreit> publishing a debdiff for that is senseless...
<gradzac> k, then I need to move madman to there
<mbreit> yeah
<gradzac> when did that section get added
<gradzac> ?
<mbreit> yesterday or so... ask bddebian
<mbreit> gradzac: did you make sure that it works well after recompiling?
<gradzac> yup
<mbreit> super... then put it in that list...
<gradzac> it works as well as that old version can work :)
<mbreit> btw: bddebian: are you a member yet?
<tseng> bddebian: xdiskusage (ajmitch already fixed) ???
<mbreit> hi tseng!
<tseng> hi
<tseng> i see some more rebuilds with your name
<bddebian> tseng: Yes
<mbreit> tseng: are there any plans to package gst-sharp yet?
<tseng> bddebian: i thought we were over this a few days ago
<tseng> mbreit: no
<tseng> mbreit: is there a release yet?
<bddebian> tseng: What?
<tseng> bddebian: the fact that ajmitch already fixed it?
<bddebian> mbreit: I'm an Ubuntu member, yes
<tseng> bddebian: i could swear we keep going over and over it
<bddebian> tseng: Yes, so what are you saying?
* Mez cries
<tseng> so why are you asking me to look at it yet again?
<mbreit> tseng: looks like there are other distros which ship it already.. with releasenames like 0.2.5 or so... but i can't find any source package in the net
<tseng> is all im wondering
<tseng> mbreit: right. its all cvs snapshots
<mbreit> hmm... then its not yet a candidate for ubuntu?
<tseng> right
<Mez> GODAMNIT
<Mez> siretart: ping
<mbreit> then i do not need to package sonance yet... it depends on gst-sharp
<tseng> bddebian: ok, simple question. is there something still broken?
<tseng> mbreit: it has an internal copy
<bddebian> tseng: Sorry, I am confusing myself :-)  I meant xxdiff this time
<mbreit> tseng: i just downloaded the latest release and there is NO gst-sharp in the source package
<tseng> bddebian: uh.
<tseng> bddebian: ok.
<mbreit> ah, while we are talking about rebuilds...
<tseng> mbreit: oh.. most of my knowledge of sonance is based on svn
<mbreit> tseng: could you rebuild mysql-query-browser and mysql-admin for me? ;)
<tseng> after i figure out what in the world bddebian is talking about
<tseng> he told me there is a diff for xdiskusage, now that he meant xxdiff
<mbreit> tseng: i did not look at the svn because i do not want do package a svn-snapshot ;)
<tseng> which is under "simple rebuild" category
<bddebian> tseng: No, xxdiff just needs a rebuild, should be fine.  I'm on crack apparently
<tseng> bddebian: tell me what you want me to do please :)
<tseng> ok great :)
<tseng> so i will rebuild.. xxdiff, mysql-query-browser, and mysql-admin
<tseng> off we go
<gradzac> add madman to the list if you want more :)
<tseng> rock on.
<bddebian> Thanks and sorry.  I keep bouncing back and forth between stuff.  I got an e-mail about smart too and I am all fsck'd up.. :-(
<gradzac> bddebian: coffee fixes that for me :)
<tseng> uh wow
<mbreit> tseng: seems as if there is no gst-sharp in sonance _cvs_ anymore... but burn-sharp and hal-sharp ;))
<Mez> tseng: can I link you to something else other than revu for the package, it's taken an hour so far to try and upload it and apparently uploading to my FTP server will only take another 16
<mbreit> so i wait with packaging that until after breezy...
<tseng> mbreit: tbh i think sonance* is smoking too much crack right now
<tseng> Mez: fine
<mbreit> and concentrate on unmet deps and so on..
<tseng> mbreit: bddebian gradzac same deal as always: please watch build logs for your packages. if they build and install, update UnmetDeps page
<mbreit> tseng: sure...
<mbreit> i hope to get some more packages for you to rebuild today... we really need to get this list smaller...
<tseng> yes
* Mez growls at dput
<Mez> why does it take soooo long
<tseng> wth madman
<gradzac> are the RSS build logs for breezy I saw on the ubuntu mailing list working?
<tseng> it wants qt to build a source package
<tseng> it runs freaking scons
<gradzac> that is from the debian maintainer
<tseng> i realize that
<tseng> its just stupid :)
<gradzac> I agree...
<gradzac> I'm not sure why he didn't make scons a build-dep instead of unpacking the scons in the source package
<tseng> well, the clean target calls scons --clean
<tseng> and forces me to install all build-deps to rebuild a source package
<tseng> brokenness
<mbreit> tseng: add tipptrainer to the rebuild-list ;)
<tseng> mbreit: ok.
<mbreit> it works.. although there is a bug in resolving the dependencies when installing the binary... but that seems to be wxgtk24's fault
<tseng> ok.
<Mez> wehat packae is gdk in?
<gradzac> tseng: if it is ok to diverge from the debian package, I can change all that
<mbreit> (or don't we do any wxgtk2.4 packages  any more?)
<bddebian> I didn't think we had wxgtk2.4 any more?
<tseng> gradzac: no im not criticizing you, just kind of raging about that packaging
<mbreit> bddebian: we have it... again...
<bddebian> hmm
<tseng> everything we change we need to justify putting back in debian
<tseng> or maintainer forever
<mbreit> that's why i go through the wx-packages on umet deps again
<gradzac> tseng: I know...madman is a package I have been playing with for awhile...before I got involved with ubuntu
<tseng> gradzac: ah rock on. have you spoken to the debian maintainer?
<gradzac> I have a custom package of madman that changes a lot of that, plus uses the latest arch version which is much better
<gradzac> tseng: yeah...I will probably do the package if the upstream ever does a new release
<tseng> hm awesome!
<tseng> oops
<tseng> i goofed on tipptrainer, too much multitasking
<tseng> did ubuntu1 not build1
<bddebian> ah-ha
<bddebian> :-)
<tseng> the rest are done properly.
<tseng> everyone is done, good job folks
<mbreit> btw: is scummvm still broken on x86?
<mbreit> it works fine here...
<gradzac> thanks tseng
<mbreit> good job tseng!
<bddebian> mbreit: I can try it after xmule finishes here
<mbreit> seems that the list finally gets smaller ;)
<bddebian> mbreit: Aye but not nearly small enough :-)
<mbreit> bddebian: the weekend just started ;)
<bddebian> Heh
<Mez> tseng: http://www.sourceguru.net/ubuntu/dev/
<tseng> dbus-mono
<tseng> i can fix that one
<tseng> by making it die horribly
<Mez> tseng: stupid thing needs to wait slightly
<bddebian> Interesting, xmule looks like a cxx problem
<mbreit> bddebian: there are some gcc4 issues on that list...
<bddebian> mbreit: Aye, I just noticed :-)
<bddebian> mbreit: btw, is scumvm a build or install problem on x86?
<mbreit> someone who knows qt a bit could fix lincvs as well..
<Mez> tseng: done
<mbreit> bddebian: it's on the unmet deps list.. but i have no problem installing it
<tseng> Mez: the diff is still full of crap
<Mez> tseng it is?
<tseng> http://www.sourceguru.net/ubuntu/dev/simias_1.1.5217.1-0ubuntu1.diff.gz
<tseng> ^ full of crap
<tseng> can you copy your debian dir to a clean source tree and build a new source package
<Mez> tseng: you mean all the Makefile stuff?
<tseng> yes
<bddebian> mbreit: I have it installed :-)  Give me a sec and I'll try it in a pbuilder
<tseng> and you dpatch has no name
<Mez> the makefile stuff is meant to be there, cause i had to change them all
<tseng> --- simias-1.1.5217.1.orig/debian/patches/.dpatch
<tseng> +++ simias-1.1.5217.1/debian/patches/.dpatch
<tseng> no its not
<tseng> look
<mbreit> tseng: recompileList += poedit
<tseng> you have a debian/patch/foo.dpatch that is supposed to do all the makefile changing
<tseng> there is a ton of changes to source that isnt in debian/
<Mez> ah
<bddebian> mbreit: No, it says depends libflac6
<Mez> kk
<mbreit> bddebian: okay, then it should stay on that list...
<tseng> please clean that, and give your dpatch a filename
<mbreit> bddebian: but i would not make much sense if i fix that... cause its not broken here...
<Mez> tseng: I think theres a problewm with that diff.gz ;)
<tseng> i know there is.
<tseng> fix it :)
<tseng> Mez: done.
<bddebian> mbreit: What are you on amd64?
<tseng> er, mbreit done
<mbreit> tseng: thanks
<mbreit> bddebian: yes i am
<tseng> id like to take a break from these for awhile
<bddebian> mbreit: Ah, cool
<mbreit> comadreja: are you listening?
<hub> "dpkg-buildpackage -S -sa -rfakeroot" does not sign my source changes
<hub> it tries to sign the i386 changes, but this does not exist
<mbreit> ahh... i found a way to make the "nobody" list much shorter..
<bddebian> mbreit: ?
<mbreit> bddebian: put myth* to non-free stuff *g*
<hub> any clue ?
<bddebian> Heh
<tseng> hub: hm really weird
<tseng> you didnt start a build w/o -S or something?
<tseng> to confuse it
<gradzac> ok, I'm working on haskell-utils from the middle of the list since I need it to work the alex package
<hub> tseng: I did dh_clean
<Mez> tseng: I've uploaded the changed .diff
<hub> tseng: I had build the binary package earlier
<tseng> Mez: cheers
<tseng> hub: hm right, it sounds like something is stuck, not sure what
<hub> ok, I'll move the file and redo from a clean tree
<tseng> my first guess would be to copy debian over a clean source package
<tseng> er, yes :)
<tseng> Mez: is it up? it looks the same
<hub> I redid the dpkg-source -x
<tseng> oh, dpatch is fixed
<hub> no change
<tseng> Mez: still full of autoconf
<Mez> tseng: yeah, in a patch
<tseng> no its not
<tseng> please *look* at the diff
<tseng> --- simias-1.1.5217.1.orig/config.guess
<Mez> I am
<tseng> +++ simias-1.1.5217.1/config.guess
<tseng> that is not in debian/
<tseng> --- simias-1.1.5217.1.orig/debian/patches/01_fix_g++_ld_problems.dpatch
<tseng> +++ simias-1.1.5217.1/debian/patches/01_fix_g++_ld_problems.dpatch
<tseng> the diff is there, and has nothing to do with it
<Mez> tseng: the .config.guess and .sub are generic dh_make things
<Mez> dh_make puts it in clean
<tseng> yes, I hate it
<highvoltage> may i ask debian-installer related questions here?
<tseng> but fine.
<tseng> leave them
<Mez> tseng: I know you hate it, and I agree they shouldnt be there, but it's a raging debate and I forgot to make that change in the rules file
<tseng> ok, well the dpatch is fixed
<tseng> so ill look at control now
* Mez changes that rules bit
<tseng> where did the mono-mcs stuff go
<Mez> tseng: cli-common depends on mono-mcs does it not?
<Mez> therefore a specific B-D on mono-mcs isnt needed if cli-common is listed
<Mez> or am I missing something
<tseng> eh
<mbreit> Mez: "Depends: debhelper (>= 4.0.0), mono-utils | cil-disassembler, mono-mcs | strong-name-tool
<mbreit> "
<tseng> yes the virtual
<tseng> someone can fill that with pnet
<mbreit> that means that it depends on mono-mcs OR strong-name-tool
<tseng> who is to say that pnet can compile simias
<Mez> huh ?
<tseng> virtual, dude.
<tseng> cli-common doesnt depend specifically on mono-mcs
<tseng> you are leaving it to chance
<Mez> ah
<Mez> ok
<tseng> to get a working compiler by your argument
<Mez> I didnt see the or
<mbreit> i think the point is the OR there... i think Mez needs mono-mcs and not strong-name-tool...
<tseng> ya, we get it :)
<tseng> http://pkg-mono.alioth.debian.org/cli-policy/ch3.html
<Mez> mbreit, I thought you were saying to depend on mono-mcs | strong-name-tool
<tseng> At a minimum, CLI applications must build-depend on the following packages: cli-common (>= 0.1.3), mono-mcs (>= 1.0) | c-sharp-compiler
<tseng> c-sharp-compiler != strong-name-tool
<Mez> tseng, other than that, any other problems?
<tseng> +Description: <insert up to 60 chars description>
<tseng> thats one.
<Mez> lol
<tseng> "\ No newline at end of file"
<tseng> thats probably 2
<Mez> :D
<tseng> (control)
<tseng> ok
<tseng> thats all the obvious stuff
<tseng> oh
<tseng> does this include libs that some other app will use?
<tseng> or the jury is still out on that one
<Mez> yes, It does (I think)
<tseng> then you need to call dh_makeclilibs
<Mez> ah cool
<tseng> binary-indep also
<tseng> before clideps
<Mez> yeah :D
<tseng> if there is really libs + tools in here we might need to split it
<tseng> we'll see
<Mez> tseng, no cause it depends on it's own libs
<Mez> so there's no point
<tseng> why is there no point
<tseng> gtk installs demos
<Mez> it depends on it's own libs, and it's libs depend on it.
<tseng> they depend on gtk
<tseng> should we ship them with the library?
<tseng> hm the libs depend on a bin?
<Mez> well, it could be split into 3 I guess
<Mez> simias-libs simias-bin and simias-data
<Mez> like k3b
<tseng> so wait
<tseng> i am thinking that something else is going to use the simias libs, right
<tseng> or does the next tool up the ladder use the bin
<tseng> i guess i should really read wth this thing does
<mbreit> ahh... our packages have been build...
<Mez> tseng: it uses the libs
<tseng> and no one else does?
<tseng> like, i dont split libmuine
<tseng> because no one else uses it
<Mez> tseng: iFolder + simias use the simias libs
<mbreit> Mez: do you want to package the whole ifolder stack?
<Mez> but, iFolder and simias also need the simias stuff
<Mez> mbreit, huh/
<mbreit> Mez: i cant wait having it in ubuntu...
<mbreit> then i can finally replace this ugly unison ;)
<Mez> mbreit: the plan is to package it so it can be used
<Mez> but,
<Mez> apparent
<Mez> ly
<Mez> SimpleServer and iFolder cant be used on the same machine
<mbreit> i know...
<Mez> oh
<Mez> no
<mbreit> i would even prefer a server-less solution... afaik should that be possible with ifolder, too
<Mez> it has to be installed as it's own user
<Mez> mbreit: not atm
<Mez>  For the time being, Simple Server cannot
<Mez> run side by side with the iFolder client under the same local user
<Mez> account.  You must dedicate a separate machine or run Simple
<Mez> Server in a separate user session.
<Mez> tseng: as far as I can see at the moment, without trying to build iFolder, there shouldnt be a problem splitting them
<tseng> i will ask meebey
<Mez> who's meebey?
<tseng> Debian CLI Policy (DRAFT)
<tseng> Copyright  2005 Mirco Bauer and Brandon Hale.
<Mez> ah
<tseng> meebey is the half that isnt me.
<tseng> :)
<Mez> fair enough
<Mez> anyways
<bddebian> Damn, xxdiff fails on powerpc and ia64
<Mez> time to try and work with iFolder
<tseng> ok
<tseng> Mez: how about this
<tseng> Mez: just keep simias like it is and get everything working
<mbreit> bddebian: seems as if that is not your fault..
<tseng> we can split it later if we have to
<tseng> i want to do things properly for debian
<tseng> not just "working"
<gradzac> bddebian: where are you seeing the build info?
<mbreit> bddebian: i think that mesa has not been fixed on ppc now...
<mbreit> gradzac: http://hwdb.ubuntu.com/buildlogs/
<gradzac> thanks
<Mez> tseng: now I have to try and work stuff out for iFolder
<tseng> Mez: where is the ifolder build instructions?
<bddebian> mbreit: I know but then where do I put it?  Back to "needs love"?
<mbreit> yes... i think you have to rebuild them after the mesa issue is solved...
<bddebian> Man my hit rate on UnmetDeps is like 5:1 :-)
<Mez> tseng in the ifolder INSTALL file
<tseng> ive seen a web page
<tseng> ok :)
<tseng> oh duh
<tseng> ifolder.com
<Mez> lol
<Mez> yeah
* Mez sighs
<Mez> stupid thing
<tseng> hm ifolder 3
<bddebian> Is anyone still working on ghc6 or has everyone given up? :-)
<tseng> i just had an idea
<bddebian> Scary
<bddebian> :-)
<tseng> about these big transitions
<tseng> we need them to be in sql, not wiki
<tseng> you can do a programmatic comparrison
<tseng> first you run your command to get the list of packages to work on
<tseng> that goes in
<bddebian> That would be cool
<tseng> every so often.. you give it a new list
<tseng> and it compares to the database
<tseng> drops of stuff that is no longer there
<tseng> and whatnot
<mbreit> tseng: i also had that idea...
<tseng> yeah wiki royally sucks
<tseng> (for this purpose)
<mbreit> would that be a candidate for revu2?
<tseng> no, its its own thing
<bddebian> I should make my own buildd and local repo and have it burn through this whole freakin' list.  Now that would be an idea!! :-)
<tseng> I can work on it
<mbreit> but could it work together with revu? revu has the user management that such a thing should have..
<tseng> revu management isnt a great idea
<mbreit> so it could keep track of who is working on which package...
<tseng> there should be a launchpad authentication api
<tseng> and we should all use it
<mbreit> tseng: yeah... that would be the best...
<bddebian> Why not just use some modified bug-tracker?  It seemed to work fairly well for the MOM stuff?
<tseng> bddebian: eh
<bddebian> At least you could assign yourself the "bug" and so forth
<tseng> think about it
<tseng> its not really bug tracking
<tseng> there are too many
<tseng> unless you can tell me a sane way that it would work in malone
<tseng> and convince bradb
<tseng> (and mark)
<gradzac> it would be nice if there was an automated way to identify the packages that only need a rebuild and take care of that
<tseng> that could be sanely automated
<tseng> from the full list
<tseng> with pbuilder and piuparts
<gradzac> that would make the list a lot smaller
<bddebian> Aye
<tseng> hah daniel's script is ugly
<Mez> would also be nice to be able to link it into REVU and similar
<gradzac> the most confusing thing for me is understanding all of the different apps that are being used :)
<tseng> i just dislike the perl bit
<tseng> it makes a CSV
<tseng> instead of just one package per line
<tseng> i cut it out
<mbreit> tseng: do you mean the script from unmet deps page?
<tseng> yes
<mbreit> daniel did not the perl part
<mbreit> that was me ;)
<tseng> heh
<tseng> apt-cache -i unmet | grep ^Package | awk {'print $2'} | xargs apt-cache showsrc | grep ^Package | awk {'print $2'}
<tseng> this would be my version
* Mez has an iFolder headache
<mbreit> add LC_ALL=C before that ;)
<tseng> i export it
<tseng> at the top of the script
<mbreit> tseng: and add sort -u
<tseng> the sort doesnt matter to pbuilder
<tseng> but ok.
<tseng>  for package in $unmet do {
<tseng>      foo
<tseng>  }
<tseng>  done
<mbreit> oh, okay, i thought you were rewriting it for the wiki page
<tseng> is this ok?
<tseng> its been awhile
<mbreit> tseng: i think the { } are not needed
<gradzac> need to add a way to know if the build fails
* Mithrandir waves
<tseng> they arent
<tseng> but i want them.
<tseng> hi Mithrandir
<tseng> gradzac: obviously.
<mbreit> okay... i think there is a ; missing somewhere...
<hub> still not working
<hub>  dpkg-genchanges -S -sa
<hub> dpkg-genchanges: including full source code in upload
<hub> dpkg-buildpackage: source only upload (original source is included)
<hub> dpkg-buildpackage: Cannot open ../hugin_0.5-0ubuntu1_i386.changes: No such file or directory
<mbreit> but i am not goot at bash scripting... i like python better... or boo... or even perl ;)
<tseng> hm, boo
<mbreit> boo is cool ;)
<tseng> ya
<tseng> i do alot of tcl these days
* mbreit hates tcl
<tseng> everyone does
<tseng> it seems.
* Mez hates iFolder
<mbreit> well, there is one thing i hate more: complicated auto* scripts like the kde build system
<hub> ok, it tries to generate the hugin_0.5-0ubuntu1_i386.changes file
<tseng> dholbach_: !!!
<hub> I don't get it
<hub> hi dholbach_
<mbreit> hi dholbach_
<bddebian> Heya dholbach_
<dholbach_> i'm so stupid
<tseng> oh this sucks
<dholbach_> i uploaded a package to ubuntu instead of REVU
<dholbach_> OUCH
<tseng> dholbach_: :/
<dholbach_> fortunately it's a NEW package, so they acn reject it
* Mez pets dholbach_ and runs away as elmo comes chasing after him
<tseng> you can mail elmo
<Mithrandir> dholbach_: you should have a different set of upload keys for revu and ubuntu
<tseng> apt-get source $package
<tseng> in the script, how do i know for sure what dir to cd into
<tseng> from there.
<dholbach_> Mithrandir: maybe
<mbreit> tseng: if you do it in an empty dir, there should be only one subdir
<tseng> eh pbuilder build $package*.dsc
<Mithrandir> dholbach_: I'm considering the same for Debian and ubuntu, since it's only a question of time before I misupload to one or the other.
<hub> anyone know why dpkg-buildpackage -S wants a i386.changes ?
<tseng> is good enough
<mbreit> tseng: cd `ls */ -d` or something like that ;)
<Mithrandir> hub: because it does, it's nothing to worry about.
<mbreit> oh, okay, the pbuilder approach is better, i think
<hub> Mithrandir: well, it fails
<hub> Mithrandir: I have to trick it with a symlink
<Mithrandir> hub: eh?  dpkg-buildpackage creates that file.
<hub> no
<hub> it create the -source.changes
<Mithrandir> hm, actually, it should make a source.changes, yes.
<hub> and then try to sign the i386.changes
<hub> and that fail
<tseng> mbreit: alright, so we build the package. how to verify its workable?
<tseng> im thinking piuparts
<hub> how does it take to appear on REVU
<hub> ?
<dholbach_> how long?
<dholbach_> like 5 minutes
<Mithrandir> hub: you can just ignore that and use debsign on the changes file afterwards, but it shouldn't do as you're describing.  Can you put the full build log somewhere?  (there's one automatically made for you if you use debuild and not dpkg-buildpackage directly)
<dholbach_> hi hub, by the way :)
<tseng> dholbach_: i am writing a script to automatically rebuild and test for UniverseUnmetDeps
<dholbach_> oh cool
<gradzac> tseng: how are you going to define "workable"?
<tseng> gradzac: installs.
<gradzac> ok
<tseng> look at piupart
<hub> Mithrandir: ok
<hub> seen the package
<hub> starting enblend
<gradzac> tseng: its not in ubuntu right?
<dholbach_> i'm off again - i better get out before the next upload goes wrong too :)
<dholbach_> see you around
<tseng> gradzac: it is.
<gradzac> in hoary?
<Mez> hmm
<tseng> er, no
<Mez> what was the quick way to send all output of a command to a file ?
<tseng> echo foo > bar
<Mez> 1>&2 > file
<tseng> or echo foo &> bar
<Mez> tseng, STDOUT amd STDERR
<Mez> I want to capture output from my failing make command
<Mithrandir> Mez: make >$file 2>&1
<Mithrandir> order is important
<dholbach_> *wave*
<Mez> acutally - &> worked
<Mez> thanks tseng
<Mez> http://paste.ubuntulinux.nl/1002
<Mez> can anyone tell me whats going wrong there?
<Mez> ah
<Mez> i'm trying a damn unstable build
<gradzac> did all the output get pasted?
<Mez> no wonder
<Mez> gradzac - no
<janimonoses> hey all
<Mithrandir> Mez: why are you trying to link something in statically?
<Mez> Mithrandir, no idea :D
<Mez> I'm running the makefile from the package
<Mez> :D
<tseng> Mithrandir: dude, thse guys used to be ximian
<tseng> Mithrandir: release engineering isnt their strong suit.
<hub> uploaded enblend
<hub> btw, how do I get a login on REVU ?
<hub> I could upload
<gradzac> hub: check out the REVU page in the wiki, you have to send a signed email to siretart
<hub> gradzac: I did
<hub> he put my key in the keyring
<hub> and the packages appear there
<gradzac> then you upload your package
<hub> I did too
<gradzac> hub: After your first upload, you will be automatically registered to the database and assigned a random password. Use your email address you used in the changelog file of your upload as login and press the 'recover password' link.
<gradzac> from the REVU wiki page
<hub> ah
<Mez> tseng: what was the link for your dpatch guide?
<hub> gradzac: not really obvious, but it works
<hub> gradzac: thx
<gradzac> np
<hub> perhaps should I update the wiki
<gradzac> its on the wiki
<hub> ah well, it is unclear
<hub> or I'm just dumb :-)
<gradzac> I cut and pasted that text from the wiki page
<hub> column B
<hub> I'm just dumb
<hub> or I should take nap
<mbreit> Mez: for the dpatch guide: http://tseng.ath.cx/log/?p=7
<Mez> yeah o found in history
<Nafallo> howto upload orig.tar.gz with dput? :-)
<mbreit> Nafallo: create the sourcepackage with dpkg-buildpackage -S -sa
<mbreit> Nafallo: the "-sa" is the important switch
<Nafallo> mbreit: I use pbuilder / pdebuild for everything. and a clean system :-).
<mbreit> Nafallo: to create a source package? dpkg-buildpackage -S just builds the source package..
<mbreit> but there is a pbuilder option iirc
<mbreit> -> man pbuilder
<Nafallo> just have to see in man dpkg-buildpackage what -sa does ;-)
<mbreit> Nafallo: includes ...orig.tar.gz in the source package.. ;)
<Nafallo> --debbuildopts seems to be what I want.
<Mez> anyone know whats going on here?
<Mez> http://paste.ubuntulinux.nl/1004
<Nafallo> any REVU admin in here? :-)
<Mez> Nafallo, siretart = REVU admin
<Mez> what you need him for, it might be something a reviewer cna do
<Nafallo> Mez: prune my upload of gnomebaker :-)
<Mez> lol
<Mez> kk
<Nafallo> is siretart the one and only REVU-admin? :-)
<mbreit> Nafallo: afaik yes
<Nafallo> oki :-)
<Mez> siretart and sistpoty
<Nafallo> hmm, try to upload again anyway ;-)
* Mez yawns
<Mez> so noone knows whats going on there
<Nafallo> hehe worked :-)
<Nafallo> http://siretart.tauware.de/revu/details.py?upid=302
<Nafallo> ^ review anyone :-)
<mbreit> i would do it... but i am not a motu yet
<Nafallo> I am, but I have no upload rights yet :-P
<Mithrandir> siretart: could you also make some links on that page which got you the .diff.gz as a text file?
<siretart> hi folks
<mbreit> hi siretart!
<siretart> ah, so many hilights :)
<Mithrandir> siretart: oh, just ignore me, it's already there.
<siretart> Mithrandir: err, I don't quite understand
<siretart> ah
<Nafallo> siretart: sorry ;-)
<Nafallo> Mithrandir: you're trully my mentor? :-D
<Mithrandir> Nafallo: why so many blank lines at the end of debian/rules?
<siretart> mom phone
<Mithrandir> siretart: http://siretart.tauware.de/revu/incoming/gnomebaker-0508062100/gnomebaker_0.4-1ubuntu2.diff appears to be served with the wrong content-type?  That is, the charset is wrong?
<Nafallo> Mithrandir: I didn't touch debian/rules
<Nafallo> Mithrandir: only debian/control
<Mithrandir> Nafallo: I'm just reviewing the full patch, I don't know who've done what. :-)
<Nafallo> Mithrandir: that patch shouldn't be that long.
<Nafallo> siretart: can you prune my upload of gnomebaker so that I can have proper diffs? :-)
<Nafallo> Mithrandir: I accidently uploaded without .orig.tar.gz the first time :-)
<Nafallo> @ 3 tonight ;-)
<siretart> ok, re
<siretart> Nafallo: make an appropriate comment on that upload, an admin will nuke it, then
<Mithrandir> siretart: the page showing an upload should say what time zone the time is from.
<siretart> Mithrandir: hm. I'm using the default config from sarge's apache config
<Mithrandir> Nafallo: I see a .orig.tar.gz just fine?
<siretart> Mithrandir: yes, all times are currently on UTC+2, this is a 'known' bug
<Mithrandir> siretart: hmm, I guess you could argue both ways, it's just icky to see raw utf8
<Mithrandir> siretart: just add a "All times are UTC+2" at the bottom of the page, then?
<Nafallo> Mithrandir: just uploaded in the second upload. the patch should only include debian/control and debian/changelog
<siretart> Mithrandir: good idea, will do that on the main page, ok?
<Mithrandir> siretart: I'd do it on all pages, but just the main page is a good start. :-)
<Nafallo> siretart: comment added :-)
<Mithrandir> Nafallo: the diff should be the full diff towards the orig.tar.gz?
<Nafallo> Mithrandir: oh? not against the previous version?
<Mithrandir> Nafallo: the .diff.gz is against orig.tar.gz
<Mithrandir> Nafallo: so you can grab the orig.tar.gz and any diff.gz + .dsc and build a package.  It would be cumbersome to hunt down all the previous diffs to build a proper package
<Nafallo> hmm, things start to fall into place now.
<Nafallo> I always name my debdiffs what .diff.gz are without .gz ;-)
<Nafallo> but revu's "without .gz" is a gunzip'ed diff.gz :-P
<Mithrandir> yup
<mbreit> i always name them .debdiff, thats more clear
<Nafallo> mbreit: I will start follow that after this ;-)
<Nafallo> a hate to have brain-bugs :-P
<Mithrandir> debdiff gives you the diff between two debian packages, which is what changes you've made for that particular upload.  The diff.gz is against the upstream version.
<mbreit> *g*
<Nafallo> siretart: you don't have to prune it then ;-). my mistake :-)
<Mithrandir> you can do debdiff across upstream versions too, but then you'll get all the changes in there.
<Nafallo> Mithrandir: yepp. I follow everything now :-)
<Mez> w00t
<Mez> ifolder = building
<mbreit> cool
<Mez> was  building
<Mithrandir> it stopped? :-P
<Mez> It broke
<siretart> Nafallo: ok :)
<Mez> siretart, any reason why after 2 hours a 13 Mb upload to REVU wouldnt be finished?
<siretart> puh. 13 Mb upload?
<Mez> yeah
<siretart> Mez: perhaps you can put that somewhere else, and I import that manually
<Mez> well, er, the new ones 17Mb
<siretart> puh
<Mez> siretart give me a moment I'll upload it
<Mez> once I've rebuilt the latest version
<Mez> siretart do the files need to be signed?
<siretart> Mez: I assume only the orig.tar.gz is that big, yes?
<siretart> Mez: yes
<siretart> Mez: just tell me where to grab the files
<Mez> siretart, just uploading now
<Mez> and yes, only the .orig is that bug
<Mez> big *
<Mez> gonna take me about half an hour to upload on this connection
<mbreit> tseng: ping
<siretart> Mez: perhaps I can download that orig from somewhere else?
<Mez> http://ftp.novell.com/pub/forge/ifolder/client/stable/20050608_2016/source/simias-1.0.20050608.tar.gz
<Mez> = the original tarball
<Mez> should jsut need renaming to .orig.tar.gz :D
<Mez> then the rest is at http://www.sourceguru.net/ubuntu/dev/
<Mez> that ok for you siretart?
<siretart> very fine, just a moment
<siretart> Mez: what is this at all?
<Mez> what is all what
<siretart> what is this ifolder client?
<Mez> siretart : http://www.ifolder.com
<siretart> Mez: http://ftp.novell.com/pub/forge/ifolder/client/stable/20050608_2016/source/simias-1.0.20050608.tar.gz has a different md5sum than your dsc file says
<Mez> gah
<Mez> I'll have to upload the orig.gz then
<siretart> what did you change in the orig.gz?
<gradzac> well gotta go....see you all later
<siretart> cu gradzac
<Mez> siretart I dont know ...
<siretart> Mez: better try to package it so that it uses the real orig.tar.gz
<mbreit> bye gradzac
<siretart> 6b81e0e8e0359eeef9dc4038d76834bf  simias-1.0.20050608.tar.gz
<siretart> in incoming
<Mez> siretart
<Mez> the only thing thats changed is the folder name
<siretart> Mez: that's not a valid reason to touch the tarball, imo. dpkg-source handles this
<siretart> Nafallo: It could be possible that I just broke your gnomebaker upload to revu, if that is the case, please reupload. sorry
<Mez> siretart - it did it itself!
<Mez> I just did dh_make
<Nafallo> siretart: already did :-)
<Mez> when I made the thing it changed the name
<Nafallo> siretart: when it didn't came up :35 ;-)
<Mez> siretart, http://paste.ubuntulinux.nl/1006
<siretart> Mez: is there any particular reason why you cannot use the 'real' orig tarball from upstream?
<Mez> siretart, no - I've just renamed it :D
<Mez> siretart - if i do a partial upload without the .orig.tar.gz now will it pull in the .org.tar.gz
<siretart> Mez: just create your changes file as normal with `debuild -S -sa`, and tell me where to grab the files. that would be the most convinient way for me
<Mez> kk
<Mez> am trying :D
<Mez>  6b81e0e8e0359eeef9dc4038d76834bf 18126221 simias_1.0.20050608.orig.tar.gz
<Mez> is that right?
<siretart> yepp!
* Mez is uploading
<siretart> :)
<Mez> http://www.sourceguru.net/ubuntu/dev/
<Mez> I think it did it cause like - the original wasnt in the right filename format
<siretart> okay
* Mez yawns
<siretart> Mez: imported
<Mez> ty
<Mez> siretart - I'm gonna need another upload
<siretart> :)
<Mez> same thing
<Mez> but I gotta fix a couple of things
<siretart> yeah
<Mez> grr
* Mez growls at dpatch-edit-patch
<Mez> I need to make a patch to remove all CVS dirs
<Mez> but...
<siretart> well
<Mez> cant find one
<Mez> camnt with dpatch
<siretart> I think that we agreed yesterday that repackaging for removing cvs dirs is a valid reason
<siretart> removing CVS dirs is a valid reason for repackaging
<Mez> *sighs*
<Mez> so I'm going to have to upload the .orig.tar.gz anyways?
<siretart> looks like
<mbreit> somebody here using seahorse?
<siretart> or you tell me the exact commands how to create the orig.tar.gz
<Mez> siretart, or I could make a patch :D
<Mez> lol
<mbreit> can somebody verify that seahorse is broken in latest breezy?
<siretart> Mez: :)
<mbreit> okay, hands up: who is on x86 and has one minute time (won't take longer than 60 seconds!!)
<mbreit> really nobody?
<Nafallo> mbreit: we have all converted to amd64 ;-)
<mbreit> Nafallo: hehe... that's good for us... so we will get more support and less broken packages ;)
<Nafallo> :-)
<Nafallo> is xorg -44 a safe xorg to dist-upgrade from hoary?
<Nafallo> I'm on amd64, so I can't really tell ;-)
<Mithrandir> current breezy appears to work for me atm, as long as you make sure xkbutils is installed.
<Mithrandir> @ even works
<Amaranth> xorg is uninstallable
<Mez> SETH!
* Mez huggles seth_k 
<Mez> how was the gig?
<seth_k> it was tons of fun
<seth_k> except I was up till like 3 every night
<Mez> I bet it was
<Mez> and thats a problem why?
<seth_k> haha
<seth_k> cos i'm not used to it
<Mez> lol, I'm a MOTU now :D
<seth_k> I've spent today just getting back in the groove
<Burgundavia> can I get some comments on this bug? http://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=12534
<Nafallo> Mez: got upload rights yet?
<Mez> Nafallo, hahahaha
<Nafallo> ehh? :-P
<Nafallo> what? :-)
<Mez> Nafallo, aka no.
<Nafallo> hehehehe
<Nafallo> bugzilla won't get security updates in warty before I get those rights ;-)
<Amaranth> Burgundavia: I like it.
<Amaranth> Burgundavia: Are you the one that killed the usefulness of the Java wiki page?
<Mez> hmmles
<Mez> what package is debsign part of
<Amaranth> devscripts
<tseng> mbreit: pong
<tseng> mbreit: i have 2 inutes
<Burgundavia> Amaranth, either a wiki bug or I was tired, either way, not intentionally
<Mez> hmm
<mbreit> lol... that was fast ;)
<Mez> #i found a bug in debsign
<mbreit> tseng: i have debugged monopod
<tseng> mbreit: on amd64?
<tseng> with the X thing
<mbreit> ah btw: could you rebuild seahorse for me?
<tseng> yes but not now
<mbreit> yes, the X thing on amd64
<tseng> what was it?
<tseng> there is a similar sounding thing for blam
<mbreit> the short answer: it's in Egg.Icon
<mbreit> bae
<mbreit> it's in Egg.TrayIcon.ShowAll()
<mbreit> so it seems that it's no monopod bug but a egg-sharp bug
<Mez> siretart: ping
<siretart> Mez: pong
<Mez> siretart : http://www.sourceguru.net/ubuntu/dev/
<Mez> :D
<Mez> *gives siretart puppy-dog-eyes*
<mbreit> tseng: does blam use egg-sharp?
<tseng> hm maybe
<mbreit> tseng: all mono apps i know that are working on amd64 don't use it..
<tseng> it has tray icon bits
<siretart> Mez: I take the orig tarball from there, yes?
<Mez> yes :D
<Mez> as it's all funked up and stuff
<siretart> downloading with 130k ;)
<whiprush> Mez: are you martin meredith?
<siretart> 300k
<Mez> whiprush, yes
<tseng> whiprush: no, he is The Goomba
<whiprush> k
<siretart> lol
<tseng> hi whiprush
* whiprush pushes tseng into a river.
<Mez> whiprush, why ?
<whiprush> Mez: I was just catching up on the list. wrt ifolder.
<tseng> mbreit: oh, is there an egg fix?
<Mez> ah
<Mez> kl
<mbreit> tseng: i did not find anything about that with google
<mbreit> i did not yet even find out where i have egg-sharp... i mean, in which ubuntu package it is
<mbreit> i can find no documentation, nothing...
<tseng> its probably just thrown into the packages
<tseng> we dont ship it seperately
<siretart> Mez: done
<Amaranth> it's probably a part of gtk-sharp
<Mez> ty siretart
<mbreit> tseng: i looked at the source package of monopod... nothing...
<tseng> oh!
<tseng> maybe its hidden in gtk-sharp
<mbreit> i must be somewhere... there is no using egg in the source ... just using gtk; und using gnome;...
<tseng> yeah its in gtk im guessing
<tseng> hm
<tseng> grep -R egg * in gtk-sharp isnt very revealing
<mbreit> i did try that as well ;)
<mbreit> i think i am just to stupid... it must be somewhere ;))
<gradzac> can someone give me the debootstrap script for breezy?
<tseng> gradzac: debootstrap hoary and dist-upgrade
<Nafallo> or better, use pbuilder :-)
<Nafallo> pbuilder the chroot-handler :-)
<gradzac> I'm using pbuilder on a hoary system, but I want the pbuilder to be breezy
<gradzac> I keep getting complaints about a mission breezy.buildd ile
<tseng> yeah dude, you have to pbuilder login --save-after-login or something
<gradzac> er....can't type
<tseng> hm or even
<Nafallo> gradzac: the PbuilderHowto thinks you should build hoary and upgrade the chroot :-)
<tseng> edit /etc/pbuilder/apt.conf.d/sources.list
<tseng> and upgrade it to breezy
<tseng> thats really the way to go
<gradzac> I did the upgrade as suggested in the wiki
<Nafallo> then you should have a breezy chroot already?
<gradzac> I'm playing with the piuparts util
<Mez> siretart: ping
<siretart> Mez: yes?
<Mez> one last upload (hopefully)
<Mez> just to iron out last couple of things
<mbreit> tseng: i seems that i am really too stupid...
<tseng> mbreit: me too.
<mbreit> tseng: it's in the monopod sources...
<siretart> I uploaded a fixed version of piuparts earlier today, should work in breezy now
<tseng> mbreit: yeah thats where i said it was :)
<Mez> siretart: http://www.sourceguru.net/ubuntu/dev/ .orig.tar.gz hasnt changes
<mbreit> so my debugging effords can go on ;)
<highvoltage> cheesenibbles :)
<Mez> what about cheesenibbles?
<highvoltage> just found it. where's the comics?
<tseng> dinner time
<tseng> cheers.
<highvoltage> tseng: cheers!
<gradzac> bye
<Mez> highvoltage, I'd like to know too
<siretart> Mez: looking good
<Mez> siretart :D ty
<Mez> care to review it ?
<Mez> ping for tseng when you've eaten
* siretart too tired for today
<Mez> aw
* Mez force feeds siretart coffee grounds
<siretart> sorry
<seth_k> siretart, were you ever able to upload that zsnes package i did?
<siretart> argl. thanks for the reminder
<siretart> seth_k: where are your packages?
<Mez> http://www.sethkinast.com/ubuntu/
<seth_k> siretart, http://sethkinast.com/ubuntu/breezy/zsnes/
<seth_k> siretart, ooh, a debian package entered unstable last week though...
<Mez> lol
<Mez> they prob stole it off of you
<seth_k> heh, probably, it's a non-maintainer upload
<siretart> seth_k: would you mind looking at it and upload a package for reviewing to revu if necessary?
<seth_k> should I just request a sync from Debian instead?
#ubuntu-motu 2005-08-12
<siretart> if you think that debian has all changes we need, sure
<siretart> hi daniel
<dholbach> hi
<dholbach> hi reinhard
<mbreit> hi dholbach
<dholbach> hi moritz :)
* seth_k grumbles at not getting a package into Breezy :P
<seth_k> I claim a moral victory
<mbreit> dholbach: sorry, i meant "hi daniel" ;))
<dholbach> don't worry :)
<gradzac> can someone help me with dpatch-edit-patch?
<dholbach> gradzac: what's going wrong?
<dholbach> gradzac: maybe http://tseng.ath.cx/log/?p=7 does help? :)
<gradzac> I try to create a new patch and it dies with "make: *** No rule to make target `unpatch'.  Stop. "
<gradzac> dholbach: I'm using that page :)
<mbreit> gradzac: read that page again ;) you missed something ;)
<mbreit> gradzac: i asked exactly that question some days ago... and found out, that i did not read that page properly ;)
<dholbach> gradzac: compare to files in /usr/share/doc/dpatch/examples or something
<dholbach> you have to add the unpatch-stamp target somewhere - i just applied the changes to a debian/rules some minutes ago :)
<gradzac> I missed the part about including the dpatch make rules
<gradzac> I guess I assumed since the package already had a bunch of patches that was already done
<dholbach> does it use cdbs?
<dholbach> something about simple-patchsys in debian/rules?
<gradzac> it is bluez-utils
<gradzac> dholbach: yes
<dholbach> gradzac: then you don't need dpatch
<dholbach> use cdbs-edit-patch instead
<gradzac> ok
<dholbach> it's the same and you can use it, if you have cdbs around
<dholbach> "the same"
<gradzac> dholbach: thanks, that works as well
<dholbach> super
<dholbach> now at least you learned both methods :)
<gradzac> and I now how to tell them apart :)
<gradzac> r/now/how
<gradzac> grr...know
* gradzac cries.
<mbreit> gradzac: and sorry for my useless answer... i just start thinking ;)
<gradzac> mbreit: np :)
<siretart> gn8, folks
<gradzac> nite siretart
<mbreit> n8 siretart
<dholbach> bye reinhard
<dholbach> can somebody look at http://siretart.tauware.de/revu/details.py?upid=298 and tell me why i get that cracked up lintian warning?
<dholbach> the first one - the second one is just stupid lintian on crack again :)
<mbreit> dholbach: try to remove the space in line 60
<mbreit> that should fix every lintian error...
<dholbach> alright, *has a look*
<dholbach> mbreit: you're a genius!
<mbreit> thanks ;))
<dholbach> hub: did anybody talk to you about your packages already?
<Mez> tseng: ping
<hub> dholbach: no
<hub> I uploaded them today
<dholbach> hub: i had a brief look at hugin and the conversation about dpatch above might be interesting for you as well
<hub> yeah
<dholbach> i only added some brief comments to hugin, not much, but i'll try to catch up
<hub> I switched to CDBS
<dholbach> oh rocking
<dholbach> cdbs is lovely
<hub> and actually one of the patches I applied is no longer needed
<hub> looks like gcc4 got fixed
<Mez> dholbach, wanna do one of your scathing reviews for me?
<dholbach> even better, even smaller diff to review :)
<hub> yeah
<dholbach> Mez: scathing?
<hub> I sent the patch utstream when I did it, never heard from them
<dholbach> Mez: am i that bad?
<Mez> dholbach, yes - but you know what I mean ;)
<dholbach> hub: you're not the only one :)
<Mez> dholbach, http://siretart.tauware.de/revu/details.py?upid=308
<hub> dholbach: yeah
<dholbach> Mez: i'll dive into it
<hub> I should check in ubuntu all the patches for software I "maintain" upstream
<Mez> dholbach, ?
<dholbach> Mez: have a look into it :)
<hub> to make sure they are
<Mez> ah ty dholbach
<dholbach> hub: or push the maintainer to package a new release
<dholbach> hub: as a package maintainer you're always grateful to get nudged about serious issues from upstream
<hub> dholbach: yeah, that too.
<hub> dholbach: like abiword that stayed in 2.2.2 whil we were release 2.2.6
<hub> and stuff like that :-/
<dholbach> hub: the problem is always introducing new features late in the distro release schedule
<dholbach> hub: if the changes are "merely" fixes, they should go in
<Mez> dholbach, poke me when done please
<dholbach> take your time :)
<hub> dholbach: yeah. but in the case of AbiWord for exemple, it is really bug fixes... Our release policy is somewhat strict
<dholbach> i see
<dholbach> well then you should have poked :)
<hub> when shall I request the packaging to Debian ? when the package is uploaded or now ?
<hub> dholbach: seb128 made me CC in bugzilla for abiword. that's a good start :-)
<dholbach> erm... you mean for hugin now?
<hub> for hugin yes
<dholbach> if there's a RFP or ITP you could reply to those bugs and tell them that you are working on them too
<dholbach> if we have the package approved and in the archive you could announce them to utnubu-discuss@lists.alioth.debian.org
<hub> in bugzilla ?
<dholbach> at least, that's how i do it
<dholbach> yes bugs.debian.org
<dholbach> there are mail adresses attached to the bug
<hub> mm yeah
<hub> ok
<dholbach> so you come up with something definite on the mailing list and announce it and in the other case you just tell the packaging guy that he could get in contact with you
<dholbach> http://bugs.debian.org/wnpp is the list
<dholbach> of work needing packages
<hub> yeah querying that package right now
<dholbach> super
<dholbach> Mez: do you have an idea, why the tar.gz on the homepage is 13M and the .srpm just 1.1M?
<Mez> dholbach, I wish I knew :D
<dholbach> did you grab from 20050805_1205/ ?
<dholbach> oh yes, you did, alright
<gradzac> anyone have any experience with DBus?
<dholbach> it runs on my system for 2 years now, what do you mean explicitly? :)
<Mez> dholbach, I grabbed from stable :D
<dholbach> Mez: ok
<Mez> it's listed in copyright - I believe
<dholbach> Mez: then you give me the wrong link there :)
<Mez> ah
<Mez> I've given wrong link in copyright
<Mez> http://ftp.novell.com/pub/forge/ifolder/client/stable/20050608_2016/
<gradzac> ever written any code that uses dbus?
<gradzac> the bluez-utils package used to depend on an older version of dbus and dbus has had an API change :(
<dholbach> ouch - maybe upstream has something?
<gradzac> dholbach: I've been searching but nothing yet
<dholbach> hrm
<gradzac> I can disable dbus for the build
<dholbach> gradzac: that's a main package
<gradzac> or make a patch....I'm having trouble with dbus' typing
<dholbach> i suggest you talk to the kernel guys or chmj about it - afaik they're hacking on it
<gradzac> dholbach: I can disable dbus in the bluez-utils build
<gradzac> so it doesn't depend on dbus
<mbreit> dholbach: could you rebuild medussa for me?
<dholbach> mbreit: yes, give me a debdiff with your name on it :)
<Mez> dholbach, other than the wrong link, it look ok?
<mbreit> dholbach: okay ;)
<dholbach> Mez: no, i'm not finished yet
<Mez> lol
<dholbach> gradzac: i think dbus is needed alone for the pin-thingie
* Mez waits for the foot long essay of things wrong with it
<dholbach> gradzac: dbus-pin-helper or something
<gradzac> dholbach: yes and no, it can use dbus to get a pin, but it has another utility to do that
<gradzac> the dbus pin helper is probably nicer in gnome
<dholbach> foot long essay --- haha, that's like the foot long essays on parchment in harry potter :)
<gradzac> BTW, the hoary package doesn't use dbus by default
<dholbach> gradzac: as i said, you better talk to chmj - he's working on bluetooth stuff or write him a mail
<gradzac> k, where do I find his email address?
<Mez> dholbach, how long is your list so far?
<mbreit> grr... i hate those config* in debdiffs...
<dholbach> mbreit: don't worry about it
<dholbach> gradzac: just a sec
<dholbach> gradzac: charles at ubuntu.com
<mbreit> dholbach: http://mo42.ath.cx/medussa.debdiff
<gradzac> dholbach: thanks
<dholbach> mbreit: i just finish the review
<mbreit> dholbach: it does not matte when you upload it...
<mbreit> +r
<mbreit> dholbach: then we will see if my adress is whitelisted ;)
<dholbach> yes
<dholbach> Mez: done
* Mez is scared to hit refresh
<Mez> dholbach, 1) wasnt neccessary, but I felt it was worthwhile
<dholbach> why?
<Mez> dholbach, from orig.tar.gzx the changes were CVS removes and remove of config.guess and .sub
<dholbach> you remove upstream config.guess config.sub?
<dholbach> better write a harsh mail to upstream about using   cvs export   instead of   cvs checkout   instead of hacking an orig.tar.gz together
<dholbach> i thought we agreed on that in the motu meeting
<dholbach> this is not a corner case :)
<Mez> dholbach, I was told that the meeting said changing it for CVS was ok
<dholbach> i don't think so
<Mez> and yes I removed upstream config.guess and config.sub mainly cause they were for building on an apple
<Mez> dholbach, apparently it was deemed appropriate in the meeting
<dholbach> our config.guess even includes stuff for building on a xbox
<dholbach> daniel@bert:~/1/medussa-0.8$ grep -i xbox /usr/share/misc/config.*
<dholbach> /usr/share/misc/config.sub:     xbox)
<dholbach> daniel@bert:~/1/medussa-0.8$
<dholbach> :)
<Mez> dholbach, I'm working on tyhe principle that pulling from the buildd is better..
<dholbach> but just removing it is wrong
<mbreit> dholbach: if i am yet whitelisted, i have a second debdiff for you ;))
<dholbach> and therefore changing the orig.tar.gz is double inappropriate
<Mez> fair enough
<Mez> I'll add them back in
<Mez> but the CVS stuff was allowed
<Mez> yes?
<dholbach> leave it in and write to upstream please
<dholbach> lintian will complain but that's ok
<Mez> dholbach: theres no email for upstream
<Mez> and bug tracker doesnt work
<Mez> dholbach, would you be happy with it being in a patch ?
<dholbach> erm what exactly? the removal?
<Mez> the CVS removal
<dholbach> hm, that wouldnt change anything, it wouldnt be considered afaik
<dholbach> you could try it though
<Mez> how do you mean
<Mez> not be considered?
<Mez> by lintian?
<dholbach> just leave it in for this release
<mbreit> Mez: http://forge.novell.com/modules/xfmod/project/?ifolder <- there you will find upstream email adresses, mailing lists, whatever you want ;)
<dholbach> but you're right about their email
<dholbach> oh... mbreit spotted it :)
<mbreit> all announces are written by tbadger at novell.com
<Mez> ty mbreit
<Mez> so you still dont like the automake patch dholbach ?
<dholbach> i dont know why
<Mez> and dholbach how did you get that error?
<dholbach> just tried to build it in a pbuilder
<Mez> weird
<Mez> mine builds fine
<dholbach> yeah, it's weird
* dholbach does a pbuilder update
<Mez> before it does that it should copy in the .sub and .guess
<Mez> ah
<Mez> they're in build not config
<dholbach> mbreit: next debdiff? :)
<mbreit> http://mo42.ath.cx/morph.debdiff
<mbreit> but my email adress seems not to be whitelisted...
<dholbach> super
<dholbach> same crack on breezy-changes again?
<mbreit> it's from Ubuntu Installer <katie@jackass.warthogs.hbd.com> again
<dholbach> oh that's alright
<dholbach> if you get the mail that should be fine
<dholbach> ah no
<dholbach> sorry
* dholbach got it wrong
<Mez> mbreit, have you emailed the hwitelisting address
<mbreit> yes...
<mbreit> upload@ubuntulinux.com
<Mez> fair enough,
<Mez> ping elmo when you get a chance
<Mez> he's a busy man though
<dholbach> your host doesnt seem to be online
<dholbach> ah no... it#s a 404
<mbreit> oh, there a m missing...
<mbreit> http://mo42.ath.cx/mmorph.debdiff
<dholbach> ok
<dholbach> mbreit: it's up
<mbreit> dholbach: thanks!
<dholbach> de rien
<mbreit> but there's one thing i don't understand: if my adress is not whitelisted, why does it accept the packages?
<dholbach> because i signed with my key :)
<mbreit> okay, that makes sense
<gradzac> dholbach: want to upload babytrans and haskell-utils?
<gradzac> they just need a rebuild
<dholbach> gradzac: did you talk to elmo already about whitelisting your maliadress?
<gradzac> no, didn't know I was supposed to
<dholbach> gradzac: then please do so :)
<gradzac> ok
<dholbach> gradzac: they rebuilt nicely for you on breezy and worked well?
<gradzac> yes, as best as I can test them
<gradzac> the working part is more of a "it builds and installs"
<dholbach> because i remember the haskell stuff to be a pain and sistposty was working on it
<dholbach> gradzac: i'll do it - want to add your own changelog to it? then i'd need a debdiff
<gradzac> ok, I'll make the debdiffs and let you know where they are
<dholbach> super
<dholbach> it's 2 o clock already?
<dholbach> wow
<dholbach> i'll do those uploads and be off to bed
<gradzac> don't wait for me, it will take me awhile to make the diffs
<gradzac> I'm slow at doing that :)
<dholbach> no, it's fine
<dholbach> reading mails
<mbreit> dholbach: seems like i have another package for you ;)
<dholbach> ok
<dholbach> go ahead
<dholbach> you guys tested that stuff?
<dholbach> :-)
<mbreit> i at least test if it runs...
<dholbach> cool
<mbreit> i can't test all the functionality of a client for the ms sql-server ;))
<Mez> night all
<Mez> mbreit, MSSQL?
<dholbach> apt-cache show package is always good to see how the dependency versions changed (if you installed it)
<Mez> mbreit, of freedts
<mbreit> dholbach: http://mo42.ath.cx/sqsh.debdiff (this time the right way)
<mbreit> Mez: apt-cache show sqsh ;)
<Mez> mbreit: yeah, freetdsd
<dholbach> mbreit: W: sqsh source: outdated-autotools-helper-file autoconf/config.guess 2001-08-21 :)
<mbreit> hmm? i did not change anything ;)
<dholbach> lintian -i *.changes
<dholbach> uploaded it
<mbreit> great
<dholbach> ok... have fun with the buildLogs
<dholbach> i'll see you around
<mbreit> i will just wait for the buildd to finish the packages, then i will go to bed, too
<dholbach> and thanks for the excellent work
<mbreit> thanks for uploading all my debdiffs ;)
<dholbach> 02:33 should be the time, shouldnt it?
<dholbach> de rien :)
<mbreit> the buildlogs come before that, don't they?
<mbreit> 2:33 is the time the packages are moved to the archive, at least as far as i understood that...
<dholbach> ah no... that's for pushing into the archive
<dholbach> yes
<dholbach> ok... have fun - i'm off
<mbreit> good night... see you tomorrow
<dholbach> we'll see :)
<mbreit> ;) or next week
<dholbach> bye moritz, benjamin, hubert :)
<mbreit> bye
<gradzac> cya
<gradzac> i'm taking a break for dinner....
<mbreit> gradzac: where do you life?
<gradzac> Nebraska
<mbreit> it's 02:10 here ;) time to sleep....
<mbreit> oh, ok
<mbreit> then see you tomorrow...
<mbreit> (or next week *g*)
<hub> what is the difference between ITP and RFP in Debian bugs ?
<hub> ah well, google helped again
<hub> sorry for the noise
* crimsun dist-upgrades to Breezy finally.
<highvoltage> what do you mean finally!? it's way before release
<highvoltage> I think it's only been half-sane to upgrade since last week.,
<crimsun> I've been waiting for xorg to stabilise before dist-upgrading
<highvoltage> yes, me too. i did it friday :)
<crimsun> well, it's nice to check that my uploads to Ubuntu actually work in Breezy
<crimsun> it'd be a shame for all those dputs to be useless
<ajmitch_> hello all
<crimsun> re ajmitch_
<Burgundavia> salut ajmitch_
* ajmitch_ sees that people have been talking about CVS dirs being an exception for .orig.tar.gz
<ajmitch_> that is not good :)
<siretart> hi
<siretart> ajmitch: did I get something wrong? I thought there was some consensus about that?
<ajmitch> siretart: the consensus that I saw was not to change
<siretart> damn.
<siretart> ajmitch: http://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2005-August/009441.html
<ajmitch> it wasn't in the minutes
<siretart> err, what about that?
<ajmitch> CVS exports are different from having a tarball that already exists
<ajmitch> imho :)
<siretart> hm. I get that sentence diffrently
<ajmitch> perhaps
<siretart> we should ask daniel for clarification
<ajmitch> I think it's talking about where upstream has just thrown together a tarball of a CVS snapshot
<ajmitch> and we have to run auto* on it to get it usable anyway
<siretart> well, this does happen from time to time
<ajmitch> sadly
<ajmitch> upstream needs to be severely beaten in such cases
<siretart> Mez's upstream was novell, in that case ;)
<ajmitch> in my case, I'm building a tarball myself using make dist
<siretart> :)
<ajmitch> you haven't seen how bad novell are at times :)
<ajmitch> my case (pnet) is that they want a cvs snapshot tested before release
<ajmitch> so I'll build & upload a snaphot
<ajmitch> for releases, I convinced them not to ship CVS dirs or an old debian/ dir :)
<siretart> hey, rsnapshot from breezy works for me [tm]  :)
<siretart> from hoary, it doesn't..
<pete> hi all
<mbreit> hi pete
<\sh> g'morning
<mbreit> good morning \sh!
<\sh> hey mbreit :)
<mbreit> \sh: what should i do if i want to fix a bug and there is already a patch in debian bts?
<\sh> take the patch from debian bts
<mbreit> i have already put the patch in the package and made it use dpatch... is that the right way? i have also mentioned the author of that patch
<mbreit> do i have to do something else?
<\sh> mbreit: put a "Closes: BTS: #<btsnumber>" in it...that's all...i mean that's what I'm doing normally
<highvoltage> topic
<highvoltage> sorry
<mbreit> \sh: it is a but in debian bts.... not in the ubuntu bugzilla
<mbreit> s/but/bug/
<\sh> mbreit: yes...but it's good to know that the fix came from debian bts
<mbreit> so i should add "Closes: BTS: #<debianbtsnumber>"?
<\sh> yepp
<mbreit> like so: http://mo42.ath.cx/gambit.debdiff ?
<\sh> mbreit: write it behind the patch statement...
<mbreit> okay
<mbreit> is it right now? (same url)
<\sh> yepp..but why dpatch?
<mbreit> why not? how else should i do that?
<\sh> with a normal patch :)
<\sh> patch: patch-stamp
<\sh> patch-stamp:\ndh_testdir\n patch -p1 < debian/patches/<patchname>\ntouch patch-stamp
<\sh> clean: unpatch
<\sh> unpatch: patch unpatch-stamp
<mbreit> hmm... dpatch is easier...
<\sh> but one build-dep more
<mbreit> hmm.. dpatch is so small
<\sh> but then put your realname + email address and a small description in the dpatch template
<mbreit> oh, okay
<\sh> ok..coffee, shower, buying something to smoke...and then lets do some work
<mbreit> \sh: tell me if my debdiff is okay now first ;))
<\sh> mbreit: yepp
<mbreit> cool, thanks...
<mbreit> you want to submit that?
<\sh> mbreit: I will do this...damnit Ihave to buy some cigarettes and now it's starting again with the rain
<mbreit> lol... the sun is shining here... nice wether ;)
<\sh> mbreit: where`
<\sh> ?
<mbreit> detmold
<mbreit> you know where that is?
<mbreit> it's at the teutoburger wald...
<\sh> yes..near bielefeld
<mbreit> exactly
<\sh> my grandgrandgrandrandgrandgrandpa  is staying there
<ajmitch> hi
<\sh> this big guy in stone
<\sh> hermann, the cherusker
<mbreit> lol... the world is so small... my grandmother is in bielefeld, too
<mbreit> \sh: yeah... hermann is about 2 km from here... in front of my window..
<mbreit> that's detmold ;)
<\sh> mbreit: hehe...and I was working in guetersloh
<mbreit> *g* then you know paderborn as well? i am studying there
<\sh> mbreit: paderborn? yes...you should read http://shermann.blogweb.de/archives/341-Das-Web-und-nichts-ist-so-schnell-vergessen-wie-die-Vergangenheit.html
<\sh> mbreit: I'm born in dortmund so not far from OWL ,-)
<mbreit> \sh: as i said.. the world is so small ;)
<\sh> mbreit: yes :)
<\sh> ok..updating pbuilder
<mbreit> good idea ;)
<\sh> mbreit: but u don't know this girl? Birgit <nachname weiss ich nicht mehr>
<mbreit> \sh: no, i don't know _any_ birgit ;)
<\sh> mbreit: thats said :)
<\sh> ok..patched and now testbuilding
<\sh> mbreit: can u do me a favour and test kwave if it's building for you?
<\sh> mbreit: use the version from MoM, pls:)
<mbreit> \sh: okay...
<\sh> mbreit: thx
<\sh> hmmm...noone from india here?
<\sh> gambit uploaded
<mbreit> thanks!
<mbreit> \sh: inline assembler problem
<mbreit> the same problem i had with vlc ;) but i can't solve that
<\sh> mbreit: upstream said, there is no problem
<mbreit> well, there IS
<\sh> mbreit: please confirm that in the bts ;) http://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=1244320&group_id=6478&atid=106478
<tseng> mbreit: so what was up with mbreit ?
<tseng> er
<tseng> egg-sharp :P
<mbreit> tseng: i did not find the problem yet..
<mbreit> but it's somewhere in TrayLib.cs
<mbreit> or in the libraries behind that ;)
<tseng> ok.
<mbreit> \sh: i have added a comment
<mbreit> tseng: could you rebuild seahorse? it needs to be recompiled for the new libsoup in breezy
<tseng> ok
<tseng> done.
<tseng> hm or not
<tseng> done.
<mbreit> thanks!
<bddebian> Ohh, is tseng uploading again? :-)
<bddebian> BTW, hello tseng, mbreit  :-)
<tseng> hi.
<mbreit> oh, hi bddebian
<ajmitch> hello bddebian
<tseng> mna i have using pacakges.d.o
<tseng> why does it default to "stable"
<tseng> i feel almost like making my own form for searching it
<ajmitch> I hardly ever use it
<tseng> i use it to get source pacakges from sid
<ajmitch> packages.qa.debian.org is more useful for looking at a package
<tseng> because i hate mom
<ajmitch> ah, I have a script for getting packages from sid, and a sid chroot
<tseng> ah rock on
<Lathiat> bah
<Lathiat> is elmo on holidays or something?
<tseng> dude
<tseng> he doesnt work on weekends
<tseng> he works hard enough the other 5 days
<Lathiat> i know that
<tseng> and yes, i think he is on holiday
<Mez> siretart: ping
<Mez> tseng: http://siretart.tauware.de/revu/details.py?upid=308
<bddebian> So what's the word for the day folks?
<Mez> I'd appreciate any input you can add to that tseng (I've already worked out most of dholbach's problems
<Lathiat> hrm
* Lathiat wonders why he has no calendar in evolution
<tseng> oh daniel looked at it
<tseng> good
<tseng> you changed orig?
<Mez> yeah, under advice from siretart
<tseng> buh
<tseng> what for
<tseng> we can talk to upstream
<mbreit> Lathiat: i have that problem, too
<Mez> tseng: for removing CVS dirs,
<tseng> OH NICE
<tseng> they put CVS/ in the tarball?
<Mez> yeah
* tseng goes to town
<Mez> ..?
<tseng> kicking upstream in the head
<Mez> lol
<tseng> oh
<tseng> did you get a cvs snapshot tarball
<Mez> no.
<tseng> link me
<tseng> http://ftp.novell.com/pub/forge/ifolder/client/current-head/
<Mez> http://ftp.novell.com/pub/forge/ifolder/client/stable/20050608_2016/source/
<tseng> thats a cvs snapshot..
<Mez> It's in stable ..
<Mez> *shrugs*
<tseng> so did you just rm CVS?
<tseng> or you did autogen and make dist
<Mez> find -name CVS | xargs rm -rf
<tseng> =/
<tseng> o
<tseng> no*
<Mez> tseng - there was no autogen
<tseng> !
<tseng> this package sucks
<Lathiat> mbreit: http://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=13254
<Mez> mez@apathy:/backports/arena/simias-stable/simias-1.0.20050608-clean$ ls autogen*
<Mez> ls: autogen*: No such file or directory
<tseng> i see
<tseng> is there make distcheck/make dist targets?
<mbreit> Lathiat: ah, i know that problem... that's why i let tseng recompile seahorse..
<Mez> mez@apathy:/backports/arena/simias-stable/simias-1.0.20050608-clean$ make distcheck
<Mez> make: *** No rule to make target `distcheck'.  Stop.
<Mez> mez@apathy:/backports/arena/simias-stable/simias-1.0.20050608-clean$ make dist
<Mez> make: *** No rule to make target `dist'.  Stop.
<tseng> that royally sucks dude
<tseng> we can talk to miguel next week
<Mez> *shrugs*
<Mez> for now
<Mez> I'm gonna lreave it with CVS dirs to keep dholbach happy
<tseng> for now the package isnt bad on your end I guess
<tseng> no we arent uploading this either way
<Mez> ... ?
<Mez> tseng, why not?
<tseng> because thats totally broken
<Mez> what is?
<tseng> I guess I might upload the orig unchanged
<tseng> if upstream wnt fix it
<Mez> where does it state CVS folders are bad... cause i cant find it and would like to quote the wording
<tseng> maybe Mithrandir can answer that
<tseng> im not a debian policy guru
<tseng> neither is daniel really
<bddebian> Mez: Dunno but lintian complains about it :-)
* Mez cant find it in the policy manual (after a quick scan)
<Mithrandir> they're useless, it's more that they're unneeded and need to be replaced if you want to use CVS rather than being actively harmful
<Mez> Mithrandir, yes we know that, but it'd be nice to find the line in the policy manual
<tseng> btw there are a bunch of new guys here working on monoish stuff, we should all get together at least once and talk a few things
<Mez> ;)
<tseng> like debian mono team structure
<Mez> tseng MOTUMono?
<tseng> ya.
<tseng> but its better to do the work in debian team
<Mez> ..?
<tseng> we got slomo's cowbell package uploaded in debian
<tseng> and will sync to ubuntu
<tseng> its the "right way"
<Mez> ah, fair enough
<tseng> we will hopefulyl do the same thing with ifolder, when the time comes
<Mez> yeah
<Mez> when I can at minimum get iFolder to build
<mbreit> there is also monopod... and hopefully sonance some day
<tseng> yes monopod i almost uploaded already
<Mez> I still cant find anything in the dan debian policy regarding CVS files
<mbreit> (if we can get monopod to run on amd64 *g*)
<tseng> i did a package long before peter
<tseng> but his is fine.
<mbreit> tseng: i can't find anything about this trayicon bug on amd64 with google...
<tseng> yeah
<mbreit> perhaps someone should send a bug report to edd...
<tseng> try blam
<tseng> see if it does the same thing
<tseng> it could be an underlying lib
<Mez> <Lo-lan-2> Oh, Ubuntu.  Do they even have a policy?
<Mez> grr
<tseng> hah, #debian-devel?
<Mez> yea
<tseng> good one.
<mbreit> huh? blam seems to have another bug in breezy
<tseng> what do you mean
<Mez> tseng: I thought I'd go poke debian and they said while it's ok to do it, poke upstream aswell
<mbreit> tseng: i can not load gnom-sharp assembly
<tseng> mbreit: meh
<tseng> mbreit: msg me the exception
<\sh> yes
<\sh> new photos from yesterday
<Mez> evening \sg
<Mez> \sh *
<\sh> check planet...we met ozzy alive :)
<Mez> the real ozzy?
<tseng> haha
<tseng> thats not ozzy
<\sh> this guy was coming around...and he just looked like ozzy...and I gave him my glasses...:)
<Mez> lol
<Mez> I know
<Mez> I was joking
<bddebian> Heya \sh
<\sh> hey bddebian
<highvoltage> is there a list on the ubuntu site of which nick is which person?
<highvoltage> (sorry for asking here, but it is related to motu)
<tseng> Mithrandir: do you have a amd64/sid setup?
<Mez> highvoltage: they ight list their nick on their wiki page, or their launchpad page, otherwise no
<\sh> working on unmet deps...
<mbreit> \sh: if you have fun with inline assembler problems, try vlc first ;)
<\sh> mbreit: hehe..I don't like inline assembler ,-)
<Mithrandir> tseng: atm just a chroot
<tseng> Mithrandir: ok, cheers.
<Mithrandir> how so?
<tseng> eh, blam is dying on ubuntu/amd64
<tseng> no reports on debian
<bddebian> What, no assembler?  You wimps :-)
<mbreit> ahh... bddebian, thanks for volunteering to fix vlc and kwave!!
<mbreit> \sh: could you do the libicq2000 cxx transition?
<\sh> mbreit: will check
<mbreit> or just tell me how i could do that...
<bddebian> mbreit: doko took vlc on bugzilla :-)
<mbreit> oh... didn't look at bugzilla
* mbreit does not like bugzilla
<bddebian> It
<bddebian> 's from MOM
<mbreit> bbdwell, but i don't see doko there...
<doko>  bddebian: I did?
<bddebian> doko: Did you make a note on bugzilla for vlc?
<mbreit> bddebian: it was crimson
<bddebian> Oh, whoops
<\sh> mbreit: done...
<\sh> mbreit: I just test the build...and attach a debdiff to bugzilla
<mbreit> \sh: icq2000?
<\sh> mbreit: jepp
* highvoltage remembers icq2000
<mbreit> why is there lincvs_1.3.2-4build1 in breezy and 1.4.2-2 in unstable?
<bddebian> Did you check Mom?
<mbreit> in breezy is -4build1... not -4ubuntux
<bddebian> I'm saying, did you check MOM to see if we are merging in the newer version? :-)
<mbreit> no... but there should be no merging... because it is no special ubuntu version
<mbreit> btw: i think i know why... it's moved to debian-nonfree
<mbreit> so what should we do with lincvs?
<Amaranth> build1 means it's the second time it's tried to build 1.3.2-4, iirc
<mbreit> the breezy version has unmet dependencies and does not compile... and it has the same license then the version moved to non-free
<mbreit> should it be moved to restricted or multiverse then? or can it stay in universe?
<mbreit> should it be updated to 1.4.2? or should we try to fix 1.3.2?
<mbreit> tseng: the new blam package seems not to have that dependency problem any more
<tseng> mbreit: awesome..
<gradzac> where can I search for what packages are in breezy (besides using apt-cache in my pbuilder chroot)?
<tseng> packages.ubuntu.com
<gradzac> duh....I should have guessed that ubuntu mirrored that debian feature, I think I tried ubuntulinux.org and it failed...oh well
<\sh> how did I know that knet is ftbfsing on amd64
<\sh> *grmpf*
<gradzac> what if a lib doesn't show up in the archive (libcapi20)?
<gradzac> the libary is in debian
<\sh> gradzac: check the source package
<\sh> libcapi20-3
<\sh> is the right package
<\sh> and libcapi20-dev is the dev package
<\sh> isdnutils is source package
<gradzac> got it, thanks
<tseng> who is doing the breezy-changes rss
<tseng> i kind of like to see the name of the uploader
<gradzac> Dennis Karrsemaker made the RSS feeds
<gradzac> can someone running breezy tell me what the output of "dpkg -L xutils" is?
<Mez> /usr/share
<Mez> /usr/share/doc
<Mez> /usr/share/doc/xutils
<Mez> /usr/share/doc/xutils/copyright
<Mez> /usr/share/doc/xutils/NEWS.Debian.gz
<Mez> /usr/share/doc/xutils/changelog.Debian.gz
<gradzac> thats what I get....isn't there supposed to be a lot of binaries in there also?
<gradzac> this package is supposed to have all of the build tools for X, but all I get is the docs in /usr/share/doc
<gradzac> pacakges.ubuntu.com shows 200+ files get installed
<\sh> gradzac: please read the announcement message of daniels...xutils is only a transitional package from now on
<Amaranth> packages.ubuntu.com is outdated
<Mez> packages.ubuntu.com isnt outdated
<Mez> It's showing -44
<Mez> I'm using -42
<Mez> oh, nvm me
<Mez> hthere an upload for -44
<gradzac> \sh: where I can I find the message?
* Mez misses xkill
<gradzac> nvm, I found it
<\sh> Message-ID: <20050805090632.GB3598@brainfreeze.fooishbar.org>
<\sh> check on gmame
<gradzac> can we start a column on the unmet deps page for pacakges that build depend on the old xutils?
<gradzac> er...row
<mbreit> i think sorting that list a bit is a good idea
<gradzac> only downside I can think of is that it will make sorting the list a real pain
<gradzac> I mean updating the list
<gradzac> damn I can't type this morning
<mbreit> yeah... but updating it is a real pain anyway
<mbreit> gradzac: we could sort out some more categories... gtkmm, wx26-transition, gcc4-transition
<gradzac> that would make things a little easier
<gradzac> maybe a table for "packages waiting for other packages to get fixed" :)
<\sh> gradzac: this will be all done
<\sh> and is done already
<mbreit> \sh: ?
<mbreit> gradzac: just make new rows in the "need love" table
<gradzac> k
<gradzac> I'd like to see what \sh is refering to though
<\sh> mbreit: we will have a lot of work to do...and I'll prepare all things for that
<\sh> http://wiki.ubuntu.com/CxxLibraryList
<\sh> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CxxLibraryResync
<\sh> http://wiki.debian.net/?EtchSlang2upgrade
<\sh> and wx26 transition is being prepared :)
<mbreit> okay... didn't know that..
<gradzac> ok, maybe we just link to those pages from unmet deps (i know there is a link for the cxx page)
<mbreit> gradzac: i think that is a good idea... just like the cxx transition row
<gradzac> plus, it would be nice to sort some of the packages out of the "NOBODY" list into categories that we know are waiting for other packages to be updated
<gradzac> mbreit: make the first column a link to the appropriate wiki page
<mbreit> if it's okay with stephan...
<\sh> with wx26 we have to be carefull..some API changes are really painfull
<mbreit> \sh: we still have wx24... just for packages depending on wx25
<mbreit> the wx24 packages just need a rebuild
<gradzac> ok, for the package aqsis, the build fails with "../render/.libs/libaqsis.so: undefined reference to `Aqsis::CqPoolable<Aqsis::CqLath, 512l>::m_thePool'", is this an upstream bug or a package problem?
<gradzac> I think it is an upstream issue
<mbreit> i would count that as gcc4 issue ;)
<mbreit> but upstream
<gradzac> it does give warnings about unknown compiler version
<\sh> aqsis was this packages where upstream didn't do somethign for 2 years? ,-)
<\sh> thats libboost
<\sh> forget it
<gradzac> thats another point....I've come across a couple packages that the last time the upstream did anything was two years ago
<gradzac> is there a place where we could recommend that the package be removed from universe?
<mbreit> gradzac: do you sort unmet deps? or shall i do that? (if that's finally ok with \sh)
<\sh> gradzac: morque
<gradzac> mbreit: not yet, I was waiting to see what \sh said
<\sh> there are more packages
<Mez> gradzac : https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MorgueCandidates
<\sh> but check first some dependencies...
<gradzac> \sh: you mean the reverse dependencies?
<mbreit> btw: what shall we do with packages on the unmet deps "unknown" list, where we know that somebody is working on that?
<\sh> gradzac: yepp
<\sh> make a new row put your name on it and work :)
<mbreit> e.g.: crimsun seems to work on vlc (according to bugzilla), i know that slomo is working on smlnj
* Amaranth passes out
<tseng> mbreit: oh hey
<mbreit> hey tseng
<tseng> mbreit: does muine-plugin-trayicon have the same bug as the others?
<mbreit> lol... seems that there is no muine on amd64?
<tseng> oh thats right
<tseng> its in NFU or something there
<tseng> no one can find it
<mbreit> lol... but muine-plugin-trayicon is installed ;)
<mbreit> tseng: lamont said he will talk with the buildd admins next week about the nfu's
<mbreit> tseng: there are some nfu's that have to be cleared
<mbreit> hey slomo!
<slomo> hi mbreit
<bddebian> slomo!!
* Mez growls
<slomo> hey bddebian :) were there any news the last week? :)
<bddebian> slomo: News?
<slomo> bddebian: yeah... were there some really awfull or wonderfull things happening in the world last week? ;)
<bddebian> slomo: Well the UnmetDeps list is still HUGE :-)
<slomo> bddebian: and i don't have upload rights yet ;) hmm... what a boring week... i'm in holidays and the world stops spinning
<mbreit> slomo: well, the xorg -44 package i would call a major event ;))
<bddebian> slomo: Well what were we supposed to do without you here to crack the whip?? ;-)
<slomo> bddebian: hmm, the same as with me around? :P
<slomo> siretart: ping?
<slomo> Mez: you mean the spelling (at http://siretart.tauware.de/revu/details.py?upid=243)?
<gradzac> slomo: you still working on the UnmetDeps page in the wiki?
<Mez> slomo: you listed an upstream uthor but said "upstream authors"
<mbreit> bmonty: i just changed the wiki page...
<bmonty> I got interrupted in the middle of editing it, I wanted to make sure I wasn't stepping on anyone's toes :)
<mbreit> bmonty: just go ahead... i my change is lost, i could do it again, was just a sooo small change
<slomo> bmonty: nope... i just "assigned" smlnj to me
<bmonty> k, I was making the changes for the x packages we talked about earlier, and I was going also mark pacakges in the NOBODY list that are on the MorgueCandidates page
<bmonty> ok, I'm done
<mbreit> bmonty: looks good
<bmonty> thanks
<bmonty> There are probably about 10 packages that depend on libcapi that have nothing to do with X, do you think they belong in the "waiting for X" category?
<mbreit> if they can't be rebuild without the new x, then yes
<bmonty> k
<bmonty> anyone care if I keep the page in edit mode for a little while?
<mbreit> i don't
<mbreit> oh, i have a debdiff which i want to put there... but that can wait a while ;)
<bmonty> ok, I'll let you know when I'm done
<mbreit> great
<mbreit> wtf?
<mbreit> i am working on pingus...
<mbreit> and there is a /usr/share/locale/locale.alias in the package... that's not very nice
<bmonty> ok, I'm done with the wiki
<mbreit> fine... and my package does evil things, so i will not put that patch on the wiki
<bmonty> :)
<Mithrandir> tseng: I had no idea you had been ill.. hope you're getting better.
<Treenaks> hey Mithrandir... haven't seen you around for a while
<Mithrandir> I've been at debconf, then at a larp then moving
<Treenaks> what a way to spend a summer :)
<Mithrandir> yeah, moved twice.
<Mithrandir> I'm tired of boxes. _really_ tired.
<Treenaks> I can imagine..
<mbreit> ahh.... i need help... could someone please build my pingus package and see if it's doing the same .... as on my machine?
<crimsun> dsc+diff.gz+orig.tar.gz?
<crimsun> (url to, rather)
<mbreit> oh, wait... i'll first try something... perhaps that will solve it
<mbreit> (but thanks anyway)
<tseng> Mithrandir: getting better every day now. thanks
<crimsun> I'll have to take a closer look at this atheros stuff in linux-restricted-modules in Breezy, cos something's fishy
<mbreit> hmm... didn't work...
<mbreit> so crimsun: do you want all files or do you prefer a debdiff to breezy release?
<crimsun> url to dsc+diff.gz+orig.tar.gz is easier for me
<crimsun> where is it failing?
<mbreit> it includes a /usr/share/locale/locale.alias... which is not very clever
<mbreit> crimsun: debdiff would be much easier for me...
<mbreit> i have that already on my server
<crimsun> mbreit: ok, I'll look at that then.
<crimsun> (sorry, I don't know your url)
<mbreit> http://ubuntu.mobr.de/sources/debdiffs/pingus_0.6.0-8ubuntu1.debdiff
<crimsun> ok, give me a few minutes. Gotta tidy up something before I wget it.
<mbreit> crimsun: sure... thanks for looking at it!
<crimsun> dpkg-deb: building package `pingus' in `../pingus_0.6.0-8ubuntu1_amd64.deb'.
<crimsun> dpkg-deb: building package `pingus-data' in `../pingus-data_0.6.0-8ubuntu1_all.deb'.
<crimsun> built fine here.
<mbreit> yes, i know..
<crimsun> does it not run correctly?
<mbreit> now try to install the first package
<mbreit> as i said, it includes /usr/share/locale/locale.alias...
<crimsun> ah, ./intl/Makefile.in
<mbreit> crimsun: i made a patch which removed the locale.alias from that file...
<mbreit> but that did not help (or i did something wrong with that patch...)
<crimsun> that looks like an upstream issue, but I have not checked Debian BTS
<mbreit> crimsun: that is the old upstream release...  i just patched it for gcc4.. (and the german translation)
<crimsun> afaik, this packages should not be mucking with /usr/share/locale/locale.alias
<mbreit> but why is it not included in the breezy version?
<mbreit> i have not changed anything in the build system
<mbreit> crimsun: any idea what i could do?
<crimsun> sorry, was looking at -8 vs. -8ubuntu1
<mbreit> no problem...
<mbreit> i think located the part where it installs that file
<crimsun> it's related to the translation, but I don't know enough about po innards to say precisely why
<crimsun> mbreit: you can rip out the references to locale.alias in intl/Makefile.in, and it will not install it.
<crimsun> mbreit: definitely a suboptimal workaround, but it "works"
<mbreit> crimsun: i am already trying to do so...
<mbreit> and so far i have not succeded.. ;)
<crimsun> I tested it here, it works
<crimsun> to fix it correctly, though, you'll want to check whether the original de translation patch has other interactions
<crimsun> unfortunately I don't know enough about that to say
<mbreit> i just patched the de.po
<mbreit> okay, i _should_ work now
<mbreit> i am a bit slow because i update my laptop to breezy
<mbreit> (can't wait for wifi-radar *g*)
<crimsun> I just updated last night. So far I can't use wifi (l-r-m stuff?).
<mbreit> i use my own kernel..
<mbreit> i use swsusp2, acpi2 and so on
<mbreit> and i need a patch to make my laptop sleep well ;)
<mbreit> yay... pingus works now
<crimsun> great.
<mbreit> oh no... i hate this package...
<mbreit> i already uses dpatch for a couple of things...
<mbreit> but in diff.gz are still many direct source changes....
<crimsun> yeah, that's pretty hairy
<dholbach> hi
<dholbach> :)
<mbreit> hey dholbach
<ogra> ho dholbach
<mbreit> sorry... hi daniel ;)
<dholbach> hey, how are you all?
<mbreit> fine...
<dholbach> super
<mbreit> but i have a question for you
<dholbach> you've been quite busy :)
<dholbach> fire away
<mbreit> about lincvs
<mbreit> it's very outdated in breezy, i think 1.3.2 iirc... in sid is 1.4.2
<mbreit> it has not been synced because debian moved it to non-free due to the license
<dholbach> i see
<dholbach> you should discuss with elmo
<mbreit> the license says: it's gpl, but only if you link it against qt/free
<crimsun> if it has significant bug fixes over 1.3.2, I certainly don't mind.
<mbreit> i heard elmo is on holiday?
<crimsun> (particular security?)
<dholbach> write him a mail, tell him why we need it (and better not say 1.4.2 looks fancier)
<mbreit> well, the question is: can it stay in universe? has it to be moved in restricted?
<dholbach> it'd be moved to multiverse, if it's going to be moved
<crimsun> right, restricted would be part of main
<mbreit> oh, okay
<dholbach> write him a mail he should know, afaik there was a comparable issue with libmysqlclient*
<dholbach> but i'm not that sure
<dholbach> he will know
<mbreit> and about upgrading to 1.4.2.. 1.3.2 does not work with gcc4 and is not installable atm
<dholbach> well then... :)
<crimsun> ftfbs is fairly major, I'd say :)
<crimsun> ftbfs, rather
<mbreit> well, what does ftbfs mean?
<crimsun> fails to build from source
<dholbach> wtf ftbfs :)
<ogra> failed to build from source
<mbreit> oh, i see
<dholbach> sudo apt-get install bsd-games; wtf ftbfs
<dholbach> if you don't manage to come up with a fix, either upstream or yourself, we won't upgrade to it :)
<mbreit> ??
<dholbach> if we can't make it build, we won't upgrade
<crimsun> I think mbreit is implying that 1.4.2 does build
<dholbach> ah ok
<dholbach> sorry
<dholbach> <-- confused
<dholbach> i'd love to get a newer freeciv in - the new one fixes loads of bugs, but ftbfs as well, because of our broken xaw3d
<crimsun> hmm
<mbreit> what happens if lincvs does not get updated?
<dholbach> if we don't manage to fix it or come up with that new version, we won't have it for the release
<mbreit> does it get deleted before release?
<dholbach> no, we'll have that uninstallable version
<mbreit> uh? we would include a package that can't be installed? that sucks
<dholbach> yes, but that's reality
<dholbach> we have to cope with 15000 packages
<crimsun> Warty and Hoary both had such cases.
<mbreit> then it has to be fixed ;)
<dholbach> but we'll do the best we can
<crimsun> Breezy undoubtedly will, too, but like Daniel said, part of our job is to fix that.
<dholbach> i wonder if sarge had those cases too
<dholbach> i'm inclined to say it did
<glick> is there a list anywhere of packages that need maintainers?
<dholbach> mbreit: i like your attitude :)
<dholbach> glick: we do team maintenance, so yes :)
<glick> i would like to help out
* tseng peaks in
<dholbach> glick: super :)
<dholbach> hey tseng
<crimsun> glick: right, none of us really "own" a package, though certainly some of us choose packages with which we're more familiar
<bmonty> dholbach: I posted debdiffs for the packages I've check on the Unmet deps page
<glick> yeah id like to work on something i use
<dholbach> bmonty: super
<dholbach> bmonty: want me to look at them?
<bmonty> sure, if you have time
<dholbach> yep, a bit
<bmonty> there are some that just need a rebuild, and some that need to have their install dependencies slightly changed
<dholbach> bmonty: ok... point me to them :)
<bmonty> http://www.montynet.org/ubuntu/debdiff
<mbreit> glick: look at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CategoryMOTU there are a lot of usefull pages
<dholbach> bmonty: and they do build and are installable and seem to work on first glance?
<bmonty> dholbach: yes
<mbreit> glick: bmonty wrote a cool page that is good for a first look of what the MOTU do:
<mbreit> glick: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTUWannabeTips
<bmonty> I didn't write that :)
<dholbach> glick: bdddebian wrote it in the beginning :)
<bmonty> ...but it is a cool page
<dholbach> yep
<dholbach> bmonty: why do you remove babytrans-common as a dependency?
<mbreit> glick: and if you have any questions, just ask
<dholbach> bmonty: that doesnt look right to me
<bmonty> glick: I'd look at a lot of the pages in the MOTU category
<bmonty> dholbach: that package doesn't exist and the program works as far as I can tell
<glick> yeah im checkin them out
<dholbach> bmonty: ha... that's funny - you're absolutely right
<bmonty> i just had a though....maybe it is in non-free??
<ogra> but babytrans isnt a buildX version anymore after such a change
<dholbach> bmonty: no, it doesnt seem to exist
<ogra> buildX is only for plain rebuilds
<bmonty> ogra: true, I'll have to fix that
<dholbach> bmonty: i'll take it to a query
<glick> hehe looks like there is nothing much to do for xfce
<ogra> glick, you can help the xfce team :)
<crimsun> glick: yeah, Jani and I have mostly finished it. The plugins remain.
<glick> the plugins?
<crimsun> xfce4-*-plugin
<tseng> i tried it
<tseng> its great (xfce4.2 debs)
<glick> i really have no idea where to begin, ive never contributed to a distro before
<crimsun> glick: the WannabeTips is a good place to start
<dholbach> glick: it's mostly trying to build, changing bits, trying to build again, it's easy :)
<tseng> glick: neither have alot of good MOTUs
<tseng> like, dholbach :)
<mbreit> dholbach, tseng: who want's to review my pingus fixes?
<tseng> not me
<mbreit> daniel?
<tseng> i just woke up.
<dholbach> yes
<tseng> again :/
<mbreit> tseng: oh, good morning then ;)
<mbreit> http://ubuntu.mobr.de/sources/debdiffs/pingus_0.6.0-8ubuntu1.debdiff
<tseng> i cant speak for any gcc patching whatnot
<tseng> but the diff is clean.
<crimsun> the diff looked fine to me when I was helping him debug
<dholbach> bmonty: babytrans can't be changed like that - it has to be pulled from marillats repository it seems - ogra was kind enough to investigate: ftp://ftp.nerim.net/debian-marillat/pool/main/b/babytrans-common/ ...
<mbreit> okay, who wants to upload that pingus patch?
<dholbach> i'll do it, just a second
<bmonty> dholbach: figures it comes from marillat :)
<bmonty> I'll fix that later tonight then
<dholbach> bmonty: uploaded the other two
<bmonty> ok, thanks
<dholbach> have fun with http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/byDate/today.html :)
<dholbach> mbreit: there's another pingus fix on REVU - did you have a look at it?
<dholbach> mbreit: http://siretart.tauware.de/revu/details.py?upid=262
<glick> do i need to install breezy to help develop?
<tseng> you should at least have a breezy pbuilder
<tseng> to make sure your package will build with breezy's libs
<ogra> and a breezy chroot to test
<mbreit> dholbach: grrr... why has Mez not put it on the unmet deps page?
<ogra> (not mandatory though)
<dholbach> mbreit: i thought it was Lathiat
<Mez> ...?
<tseng> ogra: he can use piuparts with his pbuilder base.gz :)
<Mez> mbreit: what ?
<ogra> true :)
<mbreit> Mez: the pingus-package on revu is yours?
<Mez> nope
<mbreit> okay, sorry then
<Mez> <mbreit> dholbach: grrr... why has Mez not put it on the unmet deps page?
<Mez> ... /
<dholbach> Mez: ?
<mbreit> Mez: it was my fault... i thought it would be your package
<Mez> dholbach, I was asking why mbreit asked you why I didnt put something on unmet deps
<Mez> mbreit: why?
<Mez> pingus = lathiat
<dholbach> Mez: it's ok now :)
<Mez> siretart: ping
<mbreit> yes... are you martin@sourceguru dot net?
<Mez> oh, dholbach I checked with debian... It's fine to repackage :D
<Mez> if it needs it
<Mez> mbreit: yes
<mbreit> that was my mistake.. i just saw your adress at your comment
<mbreit> is lathiat at bur dot st here?
<dholbach> mbreit: if my dear pingus won't work after this... :)
<mbreit> dholbach: i even included a patch for a better german translation ;)
<dholbach> Mez: how long do you want me to discuss that topic with you?
<dholbach> mbreit: yeah, super :)
<Mez> dholbach: their words were: repackage to make lintian happy and poke upstream and hope they fix it for next release
<mbreit> dholbach: i just looked at the debian qa page for that package and included all patches in the bug reports that are usefull in ubuntu ;)
<dholbach> making lintian happy is not worthwhile, it's rather worthwhile to not make your package reviewer find out what you may have changed on orig.tar.gz
<mbreit> it seems that the debian maintainer of pingus is not very active..
<dholbach> Mez: manually finding out, what was changed is tedious
<Mez> dholbach, it may be annoying for you, but would you rather see a package with them or without
<Mez> and debian policy says it's fine
<Mez> but, only change source to clean up (for example if it hadn't been make clean'd
<dholbach> Mez: without them, but only if it's an upstream change
<Mez> or CVS/.svn firs are tehre
<Mez> s/firs/dirs
<tseng> hey
<tseng> who is doing these rebuilds for universeunmet as Ubuntu Installer
<dholbach> i try to take reviewing seriously and i check md5sums of orig.tar.gz, just to make sure we don't get any crack into universe
<Mez> tseng: those are ones that are done by none-MOTUs and resigned
<tseng> I see.
<Mez> if they havent been whitlisted, it comes up as katie
<tseng> hm i wasnt bothering with anyones patches to just bump the changelog
<tseng> i did it myself and gave them all credit
<Mez> tseng: yeah thats fair enough if it's just a bump in the changelog :D
<Mez> lol
<tseng> easier than cut, wget paste, apt-get source, patch
<mbreit> tseng: most of these uploads where mine ;)
<tseng> mbreit: :)
<tseng> mbreit: where is your wiki page
<mbreit> as elmo did not whitelist me yet ;)
<tseng> are you a member/motu yet?
<mbreit> tseng: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MoritzBreit
<Mez> mbreit: are you a member yet ?
<mbreit> tseng: no, i am not...
<mbreit> Mez: no ;)
<tseng> well we need to fix that
<Mez> lol
<tseng> are you on the CC agenda
<mbreit> not yet
<Mez> tseng: the MOTU cheerleaders strike again ?
<dholbach> mbreit: do you have utf8 enabled?
<dholbach> mbreit: you should
<mbreit> dholbach: yes
<mbreit> oh, stupid patch ;)
<dholbach> mbreit: nevermind, it's better than before
<tseng> your wiki is nice
<tseng> you need to get on agendas
<tseng> so we can cheerlead
<mbreit> tseng: thanks
<dholbach> YES
<dholbach> :)
<mbreit> thanks for the flowers ;)
<dholbach> i won't be there, but you'll get a lot of good comments from everyone :)
<mbreit> should i get on that agenda now? the next meeting is not very soon now...
<dholbach> yes, do it
<tseng> it is never > 2 weeks
<dholbach> you'll feel better afterwards
<mbreit> so i should really add my name on CommunityCouncilAgenda?
<dholbach> yes
<dholbach> absolutely
<dholbach> ++
#ubuntu-motu 2005-08-13
<mbreit> okay, done
<dholbach> super!
<dholbach> rejoice!
<mbreit> should i even join the member group on launchpad now?
<dholbach> if you're a member, you'll soon get an @ubuntu.com mail adress - that's worth it :-p
<tseng> no, you need to be added
<tseng> dholbach: will he?
<tseng> where's mine
<mbreit> "To apply for membership in Ubuntu, please follow this link, log in (or create a Launchpad /Ubuntu web site account if you don't yet have one, it's the same account you use for wiki and web site editing and everything else in ubuntu) and then join the "ubuntumembers" team."
<mbreit> i mean the last few words... should i do that now?
<Mez> dholbach, yeah right - we've been waiting for @ubuntu.com emails for ages
* Mez pokes seth_k 
<dholbach> Mez: how long are you a member now?
<tseng> mbreit: hm oh
<Mez> dholbach, I'm about 5'11"
<dholbach> ...
<crimsun> Mez: not height dude, duration.
<Mez> crimsun, I know, was a joke
<dholbach> which period of time did we have the pleasure to have you among the motu members?
<Mez>   	2005-06-21 was the date I was approved
<tseng> i thought it was a good one
<crimsun> Mez: I know ;)
<Mez> and I've been a MOTU for 12 days
<dholbach> i see
<mbreit> should i join the member group or not??
<tseng> if the wiki says so, I guess
<dholbach> mbreit: do it, you'll have to be approved
<tseng> ive never heard of that
<mbreit> okay, done
<Mez> tseng: it's a new thing
<dholbach> mbreit: uploaded
<mbreit> cool
<mbreit> now the next question: why does my xorg on my laptop (just upgraded to breezy) not start :(((
<tseng> hm where is google news rss feed
<dholbach> mbreit: there was a mail from daniels on that topic
<dholbach> mbreit: http://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2005-August/009421.html
<mbreit> dholbach: according to his mail it should work
<tseng> he might still have bad font paths
<mbreit> yeah... that's my problem
<tseng> in xorg.conf
<tseng> make your paths like this
<tseng>          FontPath        "/usr/share/X11/fonts/100dpi/:unscaled"
<mbreit> ouh? i let dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xorg create a new config... and that says /usr/share/X11/fonts/...
<mbreit> oh, well, it's the same ;)
<tseng> huh
<tseng> and you have mkfontdir?
<Mez> mbreit, my dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xorg breaks my xorg.conf
<Mez> I had to make my own
<mbreit> tseng: yes, i have it
<mbreit> but still "could not open default font "fixed""
<mbreit> it's xorg -44
* Mez only has -42
<Mez> has 44 gone through now
<mbreit> Mez: since friday...
<mbreit> but not for amd64, and that sucks..
<dholbach> xkbutils installed?
<dholbach> xkeyboard-config?
<dholbach> oh sorry ... different problem
<mbreit> dholbach: yes... its not the xkb problem..
<dholbach> xfonts-100dpi-transcoded?
<mbreit> yes
<dholbach> good night everybody
<dholbach> i'm off to bed
<mbreit> loooool... i have solved my x problem...
<mbreit> aber studying every line in the log i saw that it used ~/xorg.conf as config file... no idea where that file came from ;)
<ajmitch> morning all
<mbreit> hi ajmitch
<crimsun> I should look at Thunar packages.
<Amaranth> ick
<Amaranth> we don't need thunar, we have the new kickass nautilus :)
<Amaranth> which happens to look a lot like thunar...
<tseng> Amaranth++
<tseng> but anything to get rid of xffm is cool with me
<tseng> that thing is even worse than konq
<whiprush> word
<tseng> whiprush: to your mother.
<Amaranth> how can it be worse than konq?
<tseng> dude, have you seen it?
<Amaranth> does it just not do _anything_?
<crimsun> thunar is in massive churn
<whiprush> correct
<Amaranth> because, i mean, konq is pretty bad
<tseng> not only does it not do anything
<Amaranth> it looks ugly doing it?
<crimsun> a default perspective hasn't even been set
<tseng> ill screenshot for you
<crimsun> and god, those march '05 mockups are so ugly
<tseng> tseng.ath.cx/images/xffm.png
<tseng> this is the most crackful application of all time
<whiprush> heh
<whiprush> that's awesome.
<tseng> can you guess what a pause button in a file manager does?
<tseng> I cant.
<whiprush> nor me
<tseng> the red and blue
<tseng> "scramble"
<tseng> "unscramble"
<crimsun> dude, xffm is nasty. I'm almost happy xffm4 doesn't build.
<whiprush> I like the red and green circles on the left
<tseng> there is a button for Touch
<whiprush> no idea what they could possibly mean
<tseng> whiprush: it seems to encrypt them with some obscure thing
<crimsun> Maybe we'll just jack it and make it a metapackage that depends on nautilus. =)
<whiprush> rol
<tseng> dude ship thunar with xfce-meta
<tseng> throw this pos out
<whiprush> only thing neo-nautilus is missing is drag and drop onto the sidebar items
<crimsun> I'm definitely considering making thunar preferred over xffm4 - if the latter will ever build
<tseng> please.
<tseng> another complaint, why doesnt xfce use the apps pixmap when i add a launcher
<tseng> it still wants to use these like half dozen stock ones
<tseng> or make me navigate to the real one
<crimsun> it's less than intelligent
<tseng> man
<tseng> i cant figure out how to properly add lil star to the session either
<tseng> or totally remove the taskbar
<tseng> i seem to remember this being *more* usable
<ajmitch> tseng: they probably saw KDE & thought 'we need this!'
<tseng> meh
<ajmitch> playing catchup with number of icons & buttons they can cram onto a screen
<tseng> oh, xffm :P
<tseng> yep
* tseng doesnt think revu should show archived uploads on the main page
<crimsun> oh man, I'm a moron. That epoch is probably why the new xffm4 hasn't built.
* crimsun stabs os-works
<ajmitch> who put an epoch on it?
<crimsun> Benny (os-works) did
<ajmitch> how evil
<ajmitch> why would he do such a thing?
<crimsun> "* Raise version to keep APT happy."  -- Benedikt Meurer <bm@os-cillation.de>  Wed, 05 Jan 2005 01:11:29 +0100
<crimsun> Benny's a great guy, but that just makes syncing with Debian a nightmare
<ajmitch> not just a nightmare, but basically impossible
<ajmitch> since your version will always be higher unless debian takes on the epoch as well
<crimsun> tseng: the "best" you can do is to enable auto-hide for the taskbar (if I understand what you're talking about)
<tseng> crimsun: yeah figured
<tseng> i was sure i removed it totally in 4.0
<tseng> xfce is cute, but i dont think its for me :)
<tseng> oh man
<tseng> xclip installs in /usr/X11R6/bin
<tseng> thats pretty bong
<bddebian> bong? Heh
<tseng> yes.
<bddebian> Damn UniverseUnmetDeps just seems like it isn't getting any smaller :-(
<bmonty> i'm trying :)
<bmonty> there are a lot less a's and b's
<ajmitch> hello bddebian
<bddebian> bmonty: Me too but sheesh.. :-)
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<bmonty> there are a lot of packages there
<bmonty> tseng: did you ever have any luck with that script you were working on?
<tseng> no
<bddebian> ajmitch: Boxed up the laptop today, plus mouse, wireless card, keyboard, and extra AC adapter.  I just wanna grab an extra battery tomorrow and I hope to ship it out.
<tseng> piuparts wasnt as helpful as i hoped
<ajmitch> bddebian: great
<bmonty> tseng: why not?
<tseng> ^
<ajmitch> what script was this, tseng ?
<tseng> ajmitch: build list of unmetdeps, apt-get source each one
<tseng> pbuild, install in piuparts
<tseng> do you want it
<ajmitch> ah
<bmonty> yeah
<ajmitch> sure
<bmonty> please email it bmontgom@montynet.org
<ajmitch> I'll see what I can do to make it play with any scripts I have
<tseng> its nothing special at all
<tseng> but i guess its a start in the right direction
<ajmitch> easier than me writing my own 10-liner
<bmonty> i'm wondering if my efforts would be better spent to make a script to figure out which packages only need a rebuild
<bmonty> and which have other issues
<tseng> thats what we are talking about
<bmonty> I keep thinking that having a uml image of a breezy install would help
<tseng> sent
<ajmitch> bmonty: it could be, but I just have a chroot or 3
<bddebian> Just throw them all to a buildd :-)
<tseng> ajmitch: it needs a way to verify the install in piuparts and list it to a file or so
<bmonty> thanks tseng
<ajmitch> bddebian: we'll probably get that later in the cycle
<bddebian> ajmitch: ?
<ajmitch> bddebian: lamont or infinity will do a test rebuild of the whole archive
<bddebian> Ahh, then we can stop? ;-)
<ajmitch> so we get build logs for packages that now FTBFS, but built fine earlier
<bddebian> bmonty: How are you checking your installs after your rebuild?
<ajmitch> don't be stupid, that gives us 10x more work to do :)
<bmonty> bddebian: I login to the pbuilder chroot and install them
<bddebian> bmonty: From where?  Are you using a local apt repo?
<ajmitch> local apt repositories are dead simple to setup, use mini-dinstall for simplicity
<tseng> i thought about that too
<bddebian> ajmitch: I have one but it's a PITA to upload and synch for every package :-(
<tseng> i didnt look too hard at what piuparts is doing
<bmonty> bddebian: I don't have a local repo (though I probably should)
<tseng> but it seems to be able to resolve depends given a dpkg
<ajmitch> bddebian: automate it
<bddebian> ajmitch: I'm too st00pid as you just pointed out :-)
<tseng> also, this script would have to run on a system with some serious horsepower
<tseng> or nothing better to do
<tseng> its not really game for my laptop
<bmonty> I use the build-dep to get most of the packages and then do everything else by hand
<ajmitch> tseng: there re a number of useful tools like dpkg-depcheck, dpkg-checkbuilddeps
<ajmitch> tseng: I don't have horsepower, just patience
<bddebian> Hmm, maybe I should break out the old Dual PII 450 Proliant :-)
<Lathiat> heh
<Lathiat> whats this for, rebuilding everything?
<tseng> unmetdeps
<tseng> figure out what needs a simple rebuild
<tseng> and what needs fixed build-deps or something else
<Lathiat> ah
<Lathiat> how would you do that?
<tseng>      apt-get source $package
<tseng>      sudo pbuilder build $package*.dsc
<tseng>      sudo piuparts -p ${RESULT_DIR}/$package*_i386.deb
<tseng> something like this.
<tseng> but what do I know
<Amaranth> only one thing left on my system is using libexif10 :/
<Amaranth> beagle
<tseng> beagle is infallible
<tseng> you see nothing.
<Amaranth> i don't even have it running
<Amaranth> i don't know why i keep it installed
<tseng> should I rebuild it, I guess
<ajmitch> ok, infinity says that auto-rebuilds are ongoing, so we can probably get logs of that sometime & throw together some more work for bddebian
<Lathiat> tseng: hrm, if you set beagle to start on start in the preferences thing, it doesnt
<tseng> Lathiat: thats in cvs
<Lathiat> tseng: ah ok
<Lathiat> ahh i love uni wireless
<Lathiat> syncing up a breezy mirror at 1.6M/s
<ajmitch> Lathiat: I really hope they get wireless access turned on before LCA here :)
<Lathiat> ajmitch: :)
<bddebian> ajmitch: More work for me? :-)
<ajmitch> http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/byDate <-- looks like the rebuilds that we may want
<ajmitch> bddebian: sure, you seem to have too much free time
<bddebian> Oh yeah
<bddebian> This freakin sucks
<ajmitch> what does?
* crimsun slaps xaw3d
<bddebian> If you don't make a changelog entry and rebuild half of them puke dputing to a local repo because of "unstable"
<bddebian> Heya crimsun
<crimsun> hi bddebian
* tseng rebuilds beagle
* bddebian quits
<tseng> ajmitch: any ideas for the script?
<tseng> im not sure piuparts is really suited for this
<Lathiat> wtf
* Lathiat kicks evolution
<tseng> dude me too
<Lathiat> how can they possibly have this as some kind of commercial product
<tseng> just crashed for the 30th time today
<Lathiat> i click "Automatically synchronize remote mail locally", and it disables the OK button in the preferences dialog
<Lathiat> tseng: that might be a libsoup thing?
<tseng> meh
<tseng> whats wrong with libsoup?
<bmonty> i think the only way they make any money is selling the exchange connector
<Lathiat> tseng: it had a soname change, and evo hasnt been rebuilt to suit
<tseng> its been crashing for awhile
<Lathiat> thats why the calendar doesnt load among other things
<tseng> oh, it hasnt?
<tseng> I see
<Lathiat> i only want to use it so beagle will index my mail
<ajmitch> tseng: you shouldn't need to even use piuparts
<Lathiat> i need to write a thunderbird plugin for it
<ajmitch> if you're only checking for dependencies
<tseng> ajmitch: yeah im sure there is something more clever to check installability
<tseng> ill leave that to you, i did at least 2/3rd of it
<bddebian> a "pbuilder install" using something like apt or dpkg-checkdep would be nice :-)
<bddebian> err depcheck
<ajmitch> alright, email the script you have to me
<tseng> i did
<ajmitch> ok, might take awhile to show up then
<Lathiat> then we can split up the package list and do some kind of distributed building of packages by various MOTUs? :)
<tseng> hah
<tseng> ill head 50, youll tail 50
<tseng> and then we'll regroup in the middle
<Lathiat> :)
<tseng> haha
<ajmitch> and then we can start on the next big group of packages to fix
<tseng> incoming is back to accepting superfulous .orig.tar.gz
<ajmitch> whatever they may be
<tseng> i was sure it would reject this
<Lathiat> i think all the glu stuff needs changing again
<Lathiat> to libglu1-mesa
<Lathiat> not sure what libgl is supposed to be tho
<Lathiat> anyone know? or should i harass daniel
<tseng> i dont know anything.
<bddebian> heh
<Lathiat> tseng: heh who told you that? :)
<ajmitch> Lathiat: yeah, not sure what's happening this week with X & mesa
<Lathiat> man this LT chair im sitting on feels like it wants to snap off
<Lathiat> ajmitch: i figure its libglu1-mesa-dev, but im not sure what we want for libgl1 dev
<tseng> the only thing i know about GL is
<tseng> enemy territory started last week
<tseng> this week it insists i dont have DRI
<tseng> and dies
<Lathiat> heh
<ajmitch> yeah, I wouldn't be surprised if my nvidia drivers were broken at the moment
* Lathiat 's gl is working fine
<tseng> its radeon
<Lathiat> im using the new sexy l-r-m
<Lathiat> manually installing the drivers was getting tiresome
<Lathiat> due to having to reinstall them on every X or kernel upgrade
<bur[n] er> has anyone used Parano?  or another sfv file checker for gnome?
* bur[n] er has a universe request for breezy if it's not too late :\
<hub> and people say that I'm wrong when I say that proprietary drivers are bad
<ajmitch> bur[n] er: can't say I've heard of it
<bur[n] er> http://parano.berlios.de/
<ajmitch> it might be possible to slip into breezy
<ajmitch> I think mdz might be calling for a freeze on new packages soon
<bur[n] er> i just don't think there are any sfv file checkers in ubuntu right now
<ajmitch> (for universe)
<tseng> buh
<bur[n] er> it's just a .py and a .glade file
<Lathiat> bur[n] er: cksfv
<bur[n] er> well.. no gtk/gnome sfv checker
<tseng> why in the world would this need so much gui
<Lathiat> tseng: people leeching w4r3z off ftp sites
<tseng> Lathiat: oh.
<bur[n] er> because i want to double click a .sfv file
<whiprush> juarez
<Lathiat> which come with SFV files to check its complete
<bur[n] er> if an xterm came up when double clicking .sfv, i'd be all forit
<tseng> whiprush: classic
<Lathiat> whiprush: heh
<Lathiat> hrm i wish my battery lasted longer with the brightness up
<bur[n] er> not necessarily warez
<crimsun> must be emo juarez
<bur[n] er> linux isos, big packages, etc
<whiprush> tseng is sandbagging. His old gentoo side knows exactly what this is for. :p
<bur[n] er> it also does md5
<Lathiat> that tool does md5 too so i guess its kinda valid. :)
<crimsun> those are usually md5summed or sha1summed
<tseng> whiprush: dude dont stereotype me
* bur[n] er makes sfv's since his windows user friends know that :\
<whiprush> heh
<ajmitch> whiprush: you wouldn't be one to mock gentoo users, would you? ;)
<bddebian> Bah, this blows, I think I'll just go back to pr0n ..
<bur[n] er> in any event, it'd make a nice .md5 checker as well
<whiprush> Not me. :p
<bur[n] er> what do I gotta do to get this in universe?
<ajmitch> wiki.ubuntu.com/UniverseCandidates
<ajmitch> or you can package it & we'd take a look at it
<bur[n] er> don't suppose you like checkinstall .debs? ;)
* Lathiat laughs
<crimsun> that's a no.
<crimsun> we don't upload binaries, we upload source + diffs
<bur[n] er> oh... well source is easy enough to come by :)
<ajmitch> a source package, not just a source tarball :)
<ajmitch> as you can see, there's a small backlog of requested packages from users
<bur[n] er> i see :\
<bur[n] er> heh
<bur[n] er> sorry, wish I knew more
<tseng> lighttpd would be good
<tseng> but there were some concerns about upstream on the itp last i looked
<whiprush> wifiradar could probably be removed from that list once networkmanager is fixed.
<bmonty> is breezy still going to use gnome-system-tools for network config?
<ajmitch> bmonty: network manager, afaik
<tseng> good night
<ajmitch> night tseng
<whiprush> nite
<bddebian> gnight tseng
<bur[n] er> thanks for the help y'all
<ajmitch> ah, first thing in tseng's script, it needs to do apt-get build-dep $unmet
<chillywilly> boo
<bddebian> chillywilly!!
<bddebian> chillywilly: I'm handing over my UniverseUnmetDeps duties to you ;-P
<chillywilly> uh, yea right
<ajmitch> great, get to work, chillywilly  :)
<chillywilly> no
<chillywilly> I think bddebian needs more practice ;)
<ajmitch> so do you
* chillywilly is a pro and needs no practice ;)
<bddebian> heh
<crimsun> don't worry, I'm chipping away at UniverseUnmetDeps, too.
<crimsun> although I should budget my time tonight so I can get up early to prep for work tomorrow. :/
<bddebian> Aye :-)
<bddebian> crimsun: How do you test your packages after you build them?
<bmonty> BTW, I'm working from the top of the list
<bmonty> bddebian: you can test the install in the pbuilder chroot
<crimsun> bddebian: install previous version, upgrade, execute, remove. Install new version, downgrade, execute, remove.
<crimsun> sometimes the second one's hairy, but the first one's essential.
<bddebian> Uhhh
<crimsun> I have a breezy chroot and a breezy pbuilder
<Lathiat> crimsun: shoudl you not also check an install without upgrade
<hub> updated my 2 packages for REVU
<crimsun> Lathiat: that's the second.
<crimsun> "Install new version..."
<crimsun> I suppose I could test for purge as well as remove
<crimsun> shouldn't make any difference, though
<Lathiat> well my point is
<Lathiat> a fresh package
<Lathiat> may be missing something in the previous version
<Lathiat> so you really should purge
<Lathiat> and i assume then theres an execute before the downgrade part
<crimsun> err, I switched the order in the second part.
<crimsun> yes, I do execute before downgrading.
<Lathiat> ah right
<Lathiat> makes sense now
<Lathiat> :)
<bmonty> crimsun: do you do your install tests in your chroot?
<crimsun> bmonty: yeah.
<bmonty> crimsun: do you know where I can find instructions on how to make my own chroot?
<crimsun> bmonty: search the wiki for debootstrap, or look in the Debian Developers Guide for the chroot section by Colin Walters
<bmonty> ok, thanks
<crimsun> np
<Lathiat> tseng: buh duh, tried blam recently? :)
<bddebian> Bed time for me.  Gnight folks
<bmonty> yeah, its about time for me also.....cya all later!
<crimsun> night.
<pete> morning all
<highvoltage> morning pete
* netjoined: irc.freenode.net -> zelazny.freenode.net
<tseng> Lathiat: yes?
<Firetech> How can you make a debian package that isn't architecture specific?
<HostingGeek> easy
<HostingGeek> source package
<HostingGeek> or non-binary package
<Firetech> well it's more of a script package
<Firetech> Trying to package GNU Source Installer
<siretart> Firetech: make it Architecture: All (instead of Any)
<Firetech> dpkg-gencontrol: error: current build architecture i386 does not appear in package's list (All)
<Firetech> hmm
<Mithrandir> use all, not All
<Firetech> now it worked.
<Firetech> hmm, It's too late for new packages for breezy, right?
<Lathiat> tseng: nhandled Exception: System.DllNotFoundException: libblam.so
(tseng/#ubuntu-motu) Lathiat: um
(tseng/#ubuntu-motu) how did you manage that
(Lathiat/#ubuntu-motu) dunno
(Lathiat/#ubuntu-motu) i jus tupgraded it
(Lathiat/#ubuntu-motu) and it stopped workign
(Lathiat/#ubuntu-motu) libblam.so is in /usr/lib/blam
(Lathiat/#ubuntu-motu) and its a valid link
(tseng/#ubuntu-motu) ldd it
(Lathiat/#ubuntu-motu)     libgtkembedmoz.so => not found
(Lathiat/#ubuntu-motu)         libxpcom.so => not found
(tseng/#ubuntu-motu) there you go
<tseng> mine is correct, wahts wrong with yours?
<Lathiat> well libgtkembedmoz.so is in /usr/lib/mozilla-firefox only
<Lathiat> that be why it cant find it?
<tseng> mine can find it
<tseng> /usr/lib/mozilla/libgtkembedmoz.so
<Lathiat> hrm
<tseng> /usr/lib/mozilla-firefox/libgtkembedmoz.so
<tseng> hm
<Lathiat> mm, i dont have the mozilla one
<tseng> yeah
<tseng> oh I know
<tseng> i didnt fix the build dep i bet
* tseng fixes
<Mez> siretart: ping
<tseng> uploaded
<Lathiat> thanks
<mbreit> someone with amd64 here?
<HostingGeek> mbreit: sf.net has....
<mbreit> HostingGeek: ??
<HostingGeek> wtf --- irc.freenode.net sets ban on %*!*HostingGe@*.exetel.com.a
<HostingGeek> mbreit: sf.net have a compile FARM
<mbreit> HostingGeek: i just need someone to verify that nvu segfaults on breezy/amd64 ;)
<ogra> mbreit, the startscript vcalls a wrong binary somehow
<mbreit> ogra: ah, okay... is someone working on that?
<ogra> mbreit, i'd really appreciate if someone workd on nvu since i have to move it to main foe edubuntu but lacking time
<ogra> for even
<ogra> so grab it if you like ;)
<mbreit> oh, i don't know if it is a good task for a newbie like me
<ogra> its probably only hanging the call to the right binary in the startup script, i havent looked in detail yet
<ogra> changing even
<mbreit> but i get that error only on amd64? on x86 it runs just fine..
<ogra> i havent tried on i386 as well yet... i'll do if i run my next ltsp test...
<mbreit> oh, there was a build1 in the source archives... but compilation has failed on all archs
<ogra> aha
<ogra> !
<\sh> what?
<ogra> nvu
<\sh> oergs
<mbreit> error: X11/extensions/Print.h: No such file or directory
<ogra> \sh, edubuntu ...
<\sh> xprint-dev?
<mbreit> looks like there are build deps missing...
<ogra> *sighs deeply*
<\sh> something like this
<mbreit> i'll have a quick look at it... but i don't have that much time today...
<\sh> Package: xprint
<\sh> Binary: xprt-xprintorg, xprint-common, xprt, xprint
<mbreit> oh, and there is the depricated xlibs-dev dependency
<ogra> why the hell do KDE people tend to put everything in one HUGE source package... thats so silly
<Lathiat> ogra: yeh i noticed like their multimedia stuff was like one big subset
<ogra> recompiling kig here.... since 3h !!!
<Lathiat> kig?
<mbreit> kde interactive geometry
<Nafallo> ogra: followed xorgs example? ;-)
<ogra> its a very small and simple geometry tool
<\sh> ogra: calm down...breath...calm down :) it's such a nice day :)
<ogra> compiling it alone would work within 5min
<ogra> \sh, i'm under total pressure
<Nafallo> ogra: you should split kde for breezy+1 ;-)
<\sh> ogra: we as well..until yesterday night
<\sh> s/we/me/
<ogra> Nafallo, ha ha ha
<ogra> (note the tired tone in the ha)
<\sh> or no...we is correct...nevermind
<mbreit> where are the xprint devel files?
<\sh> apt-file is not installable...right now
<mbreit> looks like there is no xprint-dev package...
<chmj> bmonty: ping
<ogra> wow it actually stopped generating .cpp and .moc files....
<ogra> hmm... and started to create .cc files
<slomo> good morning :)
<mbreit> hi slomo
<tseng> i
<tseng> hi
<mbreit> yay... gnomeradio and wifi-radar has been accepted
<mbreit> (and my adress is still not whitelisted...)
<tseng> slomo: cowbell ACCEPTED
<tseng> rock on
<slomo> tseng: yeah i saw it :) today or tomorrow will come a new version... brad has almost finished 0.2.2
<tseng> i saw in svn
<tseng> alot of fixes
<slomo> tseng: and you already uploaded it to ubuntu :) thanks
<bmonty> chmj: whats up?
<chmj> hey ben
<chmj> charles here
<bmonty> you wondering about the email for bluez-utils?
<chmj> yes
<bmonty> I was playing around trying to get that to compile, and it seems that the D-Bus API it is using is obsolete.
<bmonty> some folks in here suggested I email you
<chmj> ok
<bmonty> I wrote a patch for part of the problem, but I didn't have time to figure out the code for building a D-Bus message
<bmonty> the code with the problem is specifically with hcid and the ability to request a PIN with a D-Bus message (which can be disabled)
<chmj> that works with the dbus in breezy, iirc
<bmonty> the source package I had FTBFS with undefined references to D-Bus functions that no longer exist (I'm not a D-Bus expert, so I can only go from what is on their website now)
<slomo> bmonty: which dbus functions did it use which no longer exist?
<chmj> bmonty: what version of dbus ware you building against ?
<bmonty> I think they were dbus_message_iter_get_reply, dbus_message_init_iter, dbus_message_iter_append_boolean
<bmonty> chmj: the version from breezy
<bmonty> not exactly sure on the function names
<slomo> dbus_message_iter_append_boolean was replaced by dbus_message_iter_append_base or something similar... converting from the old to the new function is simple IMHO... but don't know about the other 2 but shouldn't be that hard too
<bmonty> slomo: the other ones where easy, to build the D-Bus message I would have to figure out the typing stuff that D-Bus uses, and I haven't had time to do that
<chmj> bmonty: what version of bluez-utils ware you building?
<chmj> bmonty: 2.18(latest release) accommodate for the function changes
<bmonty> afaik it was the latest source package
<chmj> bmonty: check the version please
<bmonty> looks like 2.10
<bmonty> wonder how that happened :(
<chmj> bmonty: thats an old version
<chmj> bmonty: the one in breezy is 2.18, its has better dbus support
<bmonty> ok, I'll make sure I have the new version and see if I can get it off the unmet deps list
<chmj> bmonty: the shouldn't be any unmet deps, otherwise I would have known about it :)
<bmonty> chmj: its on the unmet deps list
<bmonty> hopefully it only needs a rebuild
<bmonty> I gotta go...time to leave for work, cya
<chmj> erm
<chmj> bluez-utils is in main
<\sh> who is approved motu now and doesn't have upload rights until now?
<mbreit> \sh: slomo is, but i think he is afk atm
<wickedpuppy> hi anyone knows where is .emacs ?
<hub> in ~
<wickedpuppy> i can't only see .emacs.d
* Mez is approved upload and doesnt have upload
<Mez> \sh: why
<janimo> crimsun, hi
<crimsun> janimo: hi
<janimo> I jus got your mail
<janimo> have 5 minutes?
<janimo> I send you mail otherwise
<crimsun> sure, got time now.
<janimo> ok I agree with keeping the 4.3 desktop
<janimo> just talked to elmo in devel and looks like xffm4 has an epoch that's why we cannot sync
<janimo> I am subscibing to xfce-debian right now to talk to them
<janimo> about this
<janimo> also xfce4-terminal seems to have built but not made it to the archives, need to talk to lamont
<janimo> what do you think?
<crimsun> hmm, haven't looked at xfce4-terminal yet, looking now.
<janimo> and what do you mean with pushing xubuntu-desktop to elmo, it's gonna be a new universe package
<crimsun> hmm, xfce4-terminal seems to have built
<crimsun> at least according to http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/universe/x/xfce4-terminal/ it's present.
<crimsun> (0.2.4-3ubuntu1)
<janimo> yep, built but still Lists says it's uncomplied
<janimo> and it did not go to the archives
<crimsun> I'm not sure what you mean by "did not go to the archives"
<crimsun> I see the debs for 3 arches in pool, and all arches save hppa list it as installed
<janimo> hmm?it's in the pool, I wonder why apt-cache does not show it?Maybe it did not build fo i486?
<janimo> I'll take a look
<janimo> I updated 4 hours ago, I'll do it again
<janimo> crimsun, yep it arrived in the past 4 hours :)
<crimsun> ok :)
<janimo> now it conflicts with xterminal but I'll fix it tonight
<janimo> I justsent a mail to xfce-debain and cc:-d you
<crimsun> great, thanks.
<crimsun> oh, sorry, forgot to address your other question.
<crimsun> I just meant we should ask elmo about xubuntu-desktop after we finalize its dependencies
<crimsun> (out of NEW, etc.)
<janimo> I thought that if it's a new packge in uni elmo has nothing to do with it or does he?I mean if it's not from sid
<tseng> there is an xubuntu-desktop?
<janimo> tseng, not-yet ;)
<janimo> but I want one
<tseng> heh rock on
<Mez> janimo: r u making it ?
<crimsun> janimo: oh, that's right. I think mdz/kamion take care of it
<janimo> Mez, I'll try
<Mez> janimo :D go for it
<janimo> Mez, thanks :)
<janimo> but please anybody can beat me to it ;)
<crimsun> weekdays are bad for me due to presentations at work, but I'll steal nights as I've been doing to work on it
<janimo> in about 2-3 weeks I'll be hopefully full time on this stuff :)
<janimo> until then nights too
<janimo> s/too/only/
<crimsun> sounds great. I tried 4.2.2 last night, and there are a few graphical glitches, but I think they're related to the new GTK
<crimsun> janimo: going offline (->work) for a bit, if you see anything else, please e-mail me. Thanks!
<janimo> by crimsun
<bddebian> Howdy
<mbreit> hey bddebian
<bddebian> Heya mbreit
<slomo> hi bddebian :)
<bddebian> Hi slomo
<zyga> hello
<pkern> Hm. I seems that the recent binutils security update broke binutils-multiarch's dependency. Who should I bother to fix this?
<zyga> I was wondering why pylint depends on python2.3-lint instead of python2.4-lint
<bddebian> chillywilly: Ahh, I thought I scared you away.. :-)
<bddebian> Heya zyga
<bddebian> zyga: It probably needs an update :-)
<mbreit> btw: could someone please verify that gtkmm is still broken (dependencies in the -dev package)?
<zyga> bddebian: well there is python2.4-lint
<zyga> bddebian: I guess depends are broken
<chillywilly> bddebian: just messing with my irssi config
<bddebian> zyga: Aye, that's what I mean :-)
<zyga> bddebian: ah :)
<chillywilly> bddebian: set it up to auto-join here
<pkern> Hm that's weird. binutils-multiarch is in Packages as 2.15-5ubuntu2 but listed on packages.ubuntu.com as ubuntu2.2 (the right one)
<chillywilly> brb, gotta test something
<bddebian> zyga: Does pylint fail on depends?
<katzor> hi, on ruvu, a reviewer told me to use dpatch for my patches, however 'dpatch-edit-patch 01mx-support' gives me make: *** no ruleto create unpatch! What am i doing wrong? did i miss anything
<katzor> *revu
<mbreit> katzor: perhaps you are missing the "unpatch" dependency of the clean target in debian/rules
<mbreit> katzor: forget it ;) you perhaps forgot to include dpatch makefile in debian/rules
<katzor> any rtfm on that?
<mbreit> yes
<mbreit> http://tseng.ath.cx/log/?p=7
<katzor> thanks :-)
<mbreit> np
<janimo> hey MOTUs :)
<bddebian> Hello janimo (even though I'm not MOTU :-) )
<janimo> bddebian, you wil be :)
<janimo> assimilated
<janimo> ;)
<bddebian> Heh, don't bet on it :-)
<Mez> bddebian, you seme to have a cheerleading crowd
<Mez> are you a member yet bddebian ?
<bddebian> Mez: An Ubuntu member?
<Mez> yes
<bddebian> Aye
<Mez> thats goiod :)
<bddebian> I have a cheerleading crowd?  Who is that? :-)
<Mez> *shrugs*
<Mez> whoever was cheerleading for you in the emails
<bddebian> In what e-mails?
<Mez> bddebian, on -devel
<Mez> and your cheerleader would be dholbach
<bddebian> Oh.. I really need to join some MLs :-)
<Mez> lol
<mbreit> okay, could someone please fix gtkmm? there are a lot of unmetdeps-package that depend on gtkmm and can't be compiled....
<mbreit> or can even someone help me to fix it ;)
<slomo> mbreit: what's the problem?
<mbreit> slomo: try to apt-get install libgtkmm-dev
<slomo> hmm
<slomo> that's just unmet build-deps, right?
<slomo> i.e. renamed libsigc++
<mbreit> shouldn't be to hard to fix
<mbreit> slomo: i think it has already been rebuild..
<slomo> should be boring ;)
<mbreit> but the -dev package has the old dependency
<slomo> hmm
<mbreit> okay, now i know what to fix ;))
<slomo> let me guess: just the control file? ;)
<mbreit> yea
<slomo> ok, so it is boring :) the hardest part will probably be to find someone who uploads it for you ;)
<doko> mbreit, slomo: the names of the -dev packages didn't change
<mbreit> doko: i know
<doko> ok
<slomo> doko: sure, but they have hardcoded dependencies on the binary packages which got renamed
<mbreit> but i thought it was that it depends on the old libgtkmm
<mbreit> but that is right... but libgtkmm1.2-0c2 is broken, too
<doko> slomo: in the debian/control file? strange ...
<mbreit> okay, so gtkmm needs to be recompiled with libsigc++0c2
<mbreit> i need the binary needs a new name then...
<mbreit> i think the... ;)
<slomo> mbreit: probably not... gtkmm was already renamed for cxxtransition so i think you should keep the name as is
<mbreit> slomo: it has been recompiled against libsigc++0
<mbreit> oh, that was \sh..
<mbreit> but he's not around atm :(
<slomo> mbreit: but what do you want to call it now? it's already c2... but for such things better ask someone else... imho a plain rebuild of gtkmm should solve this
<mbreit> slomo: that's why i do not want to take the job atm....
<mbreit> but i will fix some other packages when that's done...
<mbreit> oh, and libgnomecanvasmm2.0-1 needs some love, too ;)
<mbreit> that's pretending me from fixing passepartout (well, i fixed it already... but can't compile it)
<slomo> preventing? btw, is all the MoM stuff already merged?
<doko> slomo, mbreit: the packages are not yet rebuilt. please check the build logs
<mbreit> doko: someone uploaded it already?
<mbreit> doko: oh, i just saw that you have uploaded it last tuesday
<mbreit> doko: but that is the version that is already in breezy... and is broken
<doko> which package?
<mbreit> gnomecanvasmm
<doko> mbreit: do you mean libgnomecanvasmm2.0 ?
<mbreit> exactly
<doko> not yet built
<mbreit> huh? oh, okay, i see i have got those version numbers wrong..
<mbreit> 2.0-1 is the one i need, not the one i have ;))
<mbreit> so you are right.. sorry
<eruin> is the blam maintainer here?
<mbreit> okay, i really need to get a shower now...
<slomo> mbreit: have fun ;)
<mbreit> thanks ;)
<eruin> where should I submit bug reports for blam?
<eruin> it's a universe package but I cant find it on malone
<slomo> eruin: what version and what are the problems you have with it? ;)
<eruin> breezy version, small cosmetic bug; the planet ubuntu url is wrong
<eruin> it is .org , while it should be .com ;)
<slomo> ok, fixed... someone wants to upload it for me? tseng?
<eruin> :)
<bddebian> slomo: You still don't have upload rights?
<slomo> bddebian: nope... nobody approved at that meeting has ;) and \sh is missing main upload rights too
<bddebian> slomo: Well \sh is a little dangerous so that is understandable.. ;-P
<bddebian> What would be the harm in re-submitting all of the UnmetDep packages back to the buildds, just the overload on the buildd?
<slomo> bddebian: the version numbers wouldn't be raised
<bddebian> slomo: Well obviously I mean with a small/quick changelog change
<mbreit> bddebian: besides the load on the buildd it will cost some traffic, because everyone will update to the new version ;)
<bddebian> mbreit: Well they should anyway since the current version had broken dependencies :-)
<mbreit> bddebian: then there has to be a new revision anyway
<bddebian> Uhm....
<mbreit> bddebian: or i understood you wrong
<mbreit> but i have no time now, i have to get to the local lug meeting ;)
<bddebian> I'm just saying an motu grabs the package, update changelog to build1 and re-submit :-)
<bddebian> Oh, have fun :-)
<mbreit> thanks!
<slomo> mbreit: can you notice me when you leave your house ;)
<mbreit> slomo: well, i will dry my hair then i will go
<slomo> ok fine... i'll get ready in a few seconds
<bddebian> You two are going together? :)
<mbreit> bddebian: yes ;)
<bddebian> Nice
<mbreit> see you all later
<bddebian> Later mbreit
<slomo> someone wants to upload this small change? http://yggdrasil.sytes.net/files/debdiff/blam_1.8.2-2ubuntu2.debdiff
<slomo> ok... see you all later :)
<bddebian> Later slomo, enjoy
<slomo> thanks bddebian :)
<janimo> anyone knows what was decided re config.{sub,guess} in the debdiffs?
<janimo> should I just remove them from the source?
<bddebian> Where the hell is everyone today?
<infinito> anyone knows who's in charge for MOTUToSync ?
<tseng> hi
<Burgundavia> salut tseng
* Burgundavia enjoys the irony of having his X borked by daniels all-fixed X release, when he has not had a problem until now
<bddebian> Heya tseng
<chris^> Bin Pennen Jungs - bis morgen ;)
<tseng> where's mez =/
<slomo> tseng?
#ubuntu-motu 2005-08-14
<tseng> slomo?
<slomo> do you want to upload something trivial for me? ;)
<tseng> ok
<slomo> http://yggdrasil.sytes.net/files/debdiff/blam_1.8.2-2ubuntu2.debdiff
<tseng> oh
<tseng> right
<ajmitch> why the change?
<tseng> +  * Corrected the Planet Ubuntu URL (.com not .org)
<tseng> brainfart
<ajmitch> right
<tseng> no, I dont use mom
<tseng> i am a bad person and I apply changes from memory
<slomo> at least you have a somewhat working memory ;)
<tseng> done
<slomo> thanks
<mbreit> tseng: do you want to rebuild something for me? ;)
<tseng> like what
<mbreit> tseng: gutenbrowser is the source package... it has unmet dependencies, but after a rebuild, it works fine
<mbreit> (well, not fine... it's a damn ugly qt program...)
<tseng> done
<mbreit> thanks!
<mbreit> doko: may i move aspell-de-alt to your done-row in UniverseUnmetDeps?
<mbreit> ah, tseng: you could rebuild sqsh as well...
<tseng> or I could go to dinner
<mbreit> again unmet deps
<tseng> sorry
<mbreit> that's definitly a better idea ;)
<slomo> gn8 everybody
<mbreit> gn8 slomo
<mbreit> err, well, i think i got to bed as well, so gn8 everybody
<crimsun> geez, rosegarden is a PITA.
<chillywilly> music software for linux?
<crimsun> yeah. It takes forever to run through the compile-test cycle
<chillywilly> you're packaging it?
* chillywilly should try using it ;)
<chillywilly> I got some tunes to record
<crimsun> it's already packaged. I'm fixing it.
<chillywilly> ok
<cat> hey everyone
<Burgundavia> tseng, you want muine bug reports, or shall I just tell you?
<tseng> Burgundavia: meh
<tseng> Burgundavia: whatever floats your boat.
<Burgundavia> tseng, 1st one is easy: Error loading plug-in TrayIcon.dll: gdk-x11-2.0
<tseng> i have that
<Burgundavia> 2nd one is a seg fault with double-clicking on a song
<tseng> uh
<Burgundavia> clicking play works fine
<tseng> works for me
<Burgundavia> let me get you a backtrace
<tseng> im not sure that will help
<tseng> upstream is mia
<Burgundavia> ok
<tseng> he comes and goes
<Burgundavia> nev mind then
<Burgundavia> hope it goes away on its own (it may be some other part of the system)
<Burgundavia> tseng, cool, delete pressing delete and enter also cause a segfault
<tseng> ctrl f does for sure
<Burgundavia> ironically, that doesn't do anything here
<Burgundavia> I take that back
<tseng> http://tseng.ath.cx/images/08-08-05_2051.jpg
<tseng> sweet :)
<Burgundavia> you lucky man
<tseng> check the mono branded ruppert doll
<tseng> for the win
<Burgundavia> finally, ext2/3 for windows --> http://www.osnews.com/story.php?news_id=11506
<tseng> huh rock on
<Burgundavia> no need for clunky addon programs
<Burgundavia> tseng, notice with the segfault it takes the last command and then dies
<tseng> yeah
<Burgundavia> tseng, it is cowbell
<tseng> what is?
<Burgundavia> the muine crashes
<Burgundavia> just removed it and they went away
<tseng> you.. removed cowbell
<tseng> and muine doesnt crash?
<Burgundavia> yes
<tseng> do you have some of that crackrock left?
<Burgundavia> I have no idea how that worked
<Burgundavia> let me test again
<tseng> k.
<Burgundavia> might have just been planetary alignment
<chillywilly> mmm, crack rock
<tseng> yeah it sounds insanely odd
<Burgundavia> sorry, was smoking
<Burgundavia> with planetary alignment
<Burgundavia> cowbell doesn't cause it
<tseng> one theory down :)
<tseng> ill ask Mono Ruppert
<ajmitch> afternoon
<tseng> hi aj
<Burgundavia> salut ajmitch
<Burgundavia> this is maddening, now it won't crash
<ajmitch> Burgundavia: that's the fun of development
<Burgundavia> ajmitch, I was wondering why X wouldn't start and I couldn't find gdm.
<tseng> Burgundavia: ive had similar experiences, but all stemming from muine ruffle plugin
* Burgundavia hangs his head in shame
<tseng> which i traced down to something with sqlite
* Burgundavia removed his gdm and didn't notice
<tseng> ajmitch: http://tseng.ath.cx/images/08-08-05_2051.jpg < rupperts new home
<chillywilly> Ubuntu rocks my socks
<Burgundavia> tseng, I wonder if cairo is the issue. I have had synaptic randomly segfaulting as well
<tseng> hm
<Amaranth> start it in gdb and run it until it dies
<tseng> thats completely useless
<tseng> (attaching muine)
<tseng> a coredump maybe
<Amaranth> i meant synaptic
<Burgundavia> how do I do one of those?
<tseng> stepping through it is an exercise in futility
<tseng> any gstreamer app really
<tseng> the timer is going constantly
<ajmitch> tseng: nice
<bmonty> hi everyone
<chillywilly> who the heck is ruppert?
<chillywilly> bddebian!
<bddebian> Heya chillywilly
<bmonty> what?
<ajmitch> hello bddebian
<bmonty> hey bddebian
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch, bmonty
<bmonty> whats going on?
<bddebian> Just put the kids to bed.  You?
* ajmitch is working..
<bmonty> no kids....yet, but I figured I work on some more unmet deps
<bddebian> I thought ajmitch automated all that for us already? :-)
<bmonty> lol
<ajmitch> bddebian: yeah right
<ajmitch> I'm still waiting for that DSL upgrade
<bddebian> No?
<bddebian> :-)
<ajmitch> it's a bit hard to download all the source on that list with a 256Kbps line :)
<tseng> oh did you fix up that script?
<ajmitch> tseng: nope, that's next on the list
<ajmitch> once I get some spare time, and I care enough to use my box at home
<bddebian> Right after taking a nap :-)
<ajmitch> more or less :)
* ajmitch will start the downloads now
<bmonty> if I could get my chroot to build, I might be able to make some progress on a script
<bddebian> ajmitch: I've got a pretty fast connection if you want me to try something
<bmonty> same here
<ajmitch> bddebian: mine is meant to be upgraded to 2Mbps today
<ajmitch> I'll need to do a bit of hacking anyway :)
<bddebian> 2Mb..pfft.. ;-P
<bmonty> I keep getting the error "Couldn't download libiw27" when I try to use debootstrap to make a chroot
<ajmitch> bddebian: that's fast for NZ
<ajmitch> Need to get 515MB of source archives.
<ajmitch> yay
<ajmitch> I see someone else at the flat is abusing the bandwidth as usual
<ajmitch> iptables time..
<bmonty> lol....its good to be the person that knows how to control the firewall
<bddebian> Hmm, what to work on tonight
<ajmitch> bddebian: start working on FTBFS issues :)
<bddebian> ajmitch: On what?
<ajmitch> FTBFS..
<ajmitch> get the build list
<bddebian> From what list?
<ajmitch> I gave the url yesterday
<bddebian> You did?
* bddebian is on crack
<ajmitch> http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test
<ajmitch> yep
<ajmitch> plenty of failed packages in there
<ajmitch> not sure if he's handing back all of universe every few days or not
<bddebian> Ack, is there a consolidated list anywhere there?
<ajmitch> see Lists
<ajmitch> or byDate
<ajmitch> the breezy failed list looks too short to be true in the Lists dir
<bddebian> :-)
<ajmitch> but I suspect it's not build failures there
<bddebian> Those lists pretty much make no sense :-)
<ajmitch> http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/byDate/20050804.html
<ajmitch> for example, what is so hard to understand here?
<ajmitch> there are successful builds, and there are failures
<bddebian> They're all ia64 and ppc failures.. ;-P
<ajmitch> not all
<ajmitch> take a closer look
<bddebian> I was kidding. :-)
<ajmitch> so find something broken & fix it
<ajmitch> or if you want something different, look on revu & look over some packages, adding comments where you can
<chillywilly> ajmitch: I have 6MBit down roughly
<chillywilly> :)
<ajmitch> chillywilly: congratulations
<chillywilly> there are like 7 i386 failures
<chillywilly> all the rest are weird archs
<chillywilly> ;P
<bddebian> And several are xfce
<bddebian> And debian-installer which I don't even get why that's there :-)
<chillywilly> danielb@corporate2:/etc/bind$ uname -a
<chillywilly> Linux corporate2 2.6.11-1-amd64-k8-smp #1 SMP Fri Feb 11 15:42:34 UTC 2005 x86_64 GNU/Linux
<chillywilly> :)
<chillywilly> I have a couple dual amd64 machines at work :)
<bddebian> chillywilly: So get busy ;-)
<chillywilly> I am busy setting them up
<chillywilly> :)
* chillywilly is going to install 3DM2 next
<chillywilly> and the 3ware cli tools
<chillywilly> then smartmontools
<chillywilly> and tons of other crap
<bddebian> I'm bored. :'-(
<ajmitch> chillywilly: so when are you going to provide breezy chroots for us to work in?
<majic> does anyone know if the Ruby package from Breezy was backported yet?
<chillywilly> ajmitch: well, I don't own those machines
<chillywilly> ajmitch: depends on what the load is like after they're in production ;)
<bmonty> somebody want to upload the source package for bluez-utils?  it doesn't need any changes, just a rebuild
<Lathiat> majic: should bu in the real backports archive
<ajmitch> chillywilly: so you're just showing them off then, not providing them for use? :)
<ajmitch> bmonty: we can't, and a rebuild doesn't fix it
<chillywilly> ajmitch: penguin computing stopped making the Altus 3150
<ajmitch> you can still install the main package,bluez-utils
<bmonty> hmm, I just rebuilt the package and was able to install it, remove it, upgrade in my chroot
<ajmitch> but another package is on the unmet deps list because of firmware
<chillywilly> we still have support but they pulled that product off their site :(
<ajmitch> bmonty: unmet deps has source packages, remember
<bmonty> yup, I built the package from source
<ajmitch> and there can be cases where most of the binaries install properly, except on
<ajmitch> which is the case for bluex-utils
<bmonty> k, I'll leave it alone then
<ajmitch> bmonty: eg, try install  bluez-bcm203x
<ajmitch> you'll find that it fails, which is why it is on the list
<ajmitch> bmonty: besides, it's in main
<ajmitch> this is why a simple rebuild of everything doesn't work unless you test installation of *all* the binary packages
<bmonty> hmm, I missed that :(....so it should be in the main category on the unmet deps page then
<ajmitch> yes
<bddebian> What's the latest with libgtkmm?
<ajmitch> bmonty: and I think the fix that may get implemented is just disabling the bluez-bcm203x package
<ajmitch> bddebian: ask dholbach if you see him
<bmonty> ajmitch: ok, thanks
<bddebian> Sheesh, maybe I'll just work on Hurd stuff
<ajmitch> bddebian: if you want to
<ajmitch> throwing out a random package name & expecting us to know 'the latest' doesn't often work
<bddebian> ??
<bddebian> Ohh
<bddebian> Well I was trying to find something else to fix other than UnmetDeps
<ajmitch> right
<ajmitch> don't you like unmet deps any more?
<ajmitch> I think we're going to have more X fun in the next couple of weeks, judging by the -44 changelog
<bddebian> It's repetative and takes too long just to test 1 single stinking package :-)
<ajmitch> bddebian: who said MOTU work was fun?
<bddebian> ajmitch: I asked daniels if he needed any help but he ignored me :-)
<ajmitch> it's a thankless task that just keeps on piling up
<ajmitch> bddebian: trying to initiate someone new in the ways of X packaging when he has to have it done by feature freeze is futile
<bddebian> Well "fun" is a relative term.  It almost seems pointless
<chillywilly> thanks for being a MOTU ajmitch ;)
<chillywilly> there? see? It's not thankless!?!
<ajmitch> bddebian: almost as much as Hurd development ;)
* bddebian whips out the trout
<bmonty> I've learned a lot working on the unmet deps
<bddebian> ajmitch: Well thats a labor of "love" ;-P
<ajmitch> bddebian: so is MOTU work
<bmonty> at least I know where most of the ubuntu devel tools are on the web
<ajmitch> people only mention it when things break
<ajmitch> other times they just use it
<chillywilly> thanks be to all MOTUs for without such dedicated people I would not have some of my favorite wares, I salute thee
<bddebian> Why does \sh still have libicq2000 on UnmetDeps under Cxx transition?
<chillywilly> whoops him
<chillywilly> whoop too
<ajmitch> because it was only uploaded in the last day or so?
<bddebian> ajmitch: No, the binary is still unmet but it builds fine
<ajmitch> go ahead & fix it then
<bddebian> Fix what?  I think it just needs a rebuild and I can't upload??
<ajmitch> I did say that it had been uploaded in the last 24 hours or so
<ajmitch> you say it's still broken, so there must be something wrong
<bddebian> The ubuntu1 version doesn't appear to be the one in the archive!?
<bddebian> wtf
<chillywilly> ftw
<ajmitch> because there's a new binary name?!??
<ajmitch> it has to be manually approved
<bddebian> Oh, hehe
<bddebian> <-- dumbass
<chillywilly> be nice to bddebian
<ajmitch> chillywilly: I am being nice :P
<chillywilly> he should be nice to himself ;)
<bddebian> chillywilly: Yeah, I at least TRY to help and he's mean.. ;-P
<ajmitch> oh dear
<ajmitch> bring on the violins :P
<chillywilly> ajmitch is a nice guy
<chillywilly> I love you ajmitch
* ajmitch is not a nice guy :)
<ajmitch> php has warped me
<bddebian> heh
<chillywilly> they should use Python, twisted, and nevow
<chillywilly> :)
<chillywilly> ajmitch: show them the way ;)
<ajmitch> of those, I'e used python
<ajmitch> and rewriting a rather large app just for the sake of it, is incredibly unproductive
<chillywilly> and REST of course
<bmonty> if a package needs fam and depends on libfam0 (the client lib) does it need to also depend on fam?
<chillywilly> RESTification is worth it ;)
<bmonty> libfam0 depends on fam
<chillywilly> ajmitch: those are currently my tools of choice
<ajmitch> bmonty: then I'd say that just depending on libfam0 will do
<ajmitch> since that will drag in fam anyway
* ajmitch could be wrong
<bmonty> yeah, thats what I thought
<bmonty> you haven't been wrong so far tonight :)
<ajmitch> bmonty: I spent enough years in training ;)
<chillywilly> ajmitch: all web apps should follow REST principles as closely as possible and practical, imho :)
<ajmitch> chillywilly: sure, in your opinion ;)
<ajmitch> I think it is useful as well, but rewriting existing apps is fairly pointless
<chillywilly> well, that depends
<chillywilly> I know a certain website/app that should just plain die ;)
<ajmitch> sure
<chillywilly> a rewrite would be a major improvement
<ajmitch> but it's slightly OT here
<chillywilly> sorry...
* ajmitch feels like going home early today
<chillywilly> doh
<chillywilly> Peter Jennings died
<ajmitch> ok
<bddebian> Ahh WTF
* chillywilly does a remote reboot and crosses his fingers ;)
* ajmitch isn't silly enough to do a remote restart of his dsl modem today
<ajmitch> since that'll probably involve unloading & reloading the usb kernel modules
<chillywilly> this is just the big noisy 3U box in my office
<chillywilly> if it doesn't come back up the only thing that will suck is I won't be able to do anymore setup
<chillywilly> from here
<chillywilly> which might be a good thing considering I don't paid by the hour anyway ;)
<ajmitch> hehe
<ajmitch> it'll probably live just to spite you
<bddebian> heh
<chillywilly> it came back up
<ajmitch> if only bddebian's hurd boxes would be remote-rebootable so easily
<bddebian> heh
<ajmitch> bddebian: wire up a relay for the reset switches :)
<bddebian> They typically reboot OK, it's just that our ext2fs sucks so bad, the fscks fail on bootup :-)
<ajmitch> makes sense
<chillywilly> bddebian: write a new ext2fs
<chillywilly> :)
<ajmitch> bddebian: write a decent networked filesystem instead
<bddebian> ajmitch: smbfs?
<chillywilly> hahah
<chillywilly> cifs ;)
<bddebian> Sure
<bddebian> God I hate UniverseUnmetDeps
<bmonty> ajmitch: isn't there a network file system that mirrors stuff to your drive and syncs up automatically?
<ajmitch> bmonty: probably, but we're talking about the Hurd, which is a little lacking in a decent network filesystem
<bmonty> ahh
<ajmitch> bddebian's other spare time project is hacking the hurd
<bmonty> he must have lots of spare time
<bddebian> Not hardly
<bddebian> And even less skills and patience :-)
<Lathiat> haha
<bddebian> That's not funny, it's depressing :-)
<chillywilly> pfft
<bmonty> goodnight guys...I think I got one thing productive done, I posted a debdiff for doodle on the wiki
<bddebian> Gnight bmonty,thanks :-)
<bmonty> cya all later
<bddebian> I swear that 4 out of 5 things that I try to build FTBFS.. :'-(
<crimsun> ftbfs isn't bad
<crimsun> it's the ftbfs && g++4 && kde-based prog that really hurts
<bddebian> Well yes, that's true
* chillywilly watches his RAID array initialize...
<chillywilly> I think it's time for beddy bye
<chillywilly> g'night dudes
<bddebian> Later chillywilly
<Mez> Siretart: ping
<siretart> huhu Mez (pong) :)
<Mez> can you purge simias from REVU
<ajmitch> hi Mez, siretart
* ajmitch is going to do a crazy thing & shut down this X server, reboot, and hope that everything comes back up ;)
<siretart> huhu ajmitch
<Treenaks> ajmitch: good luck
<siretart> Mez: will do
<ajmitch> since I'm still running the hoary kernel
<Mez> dont run the hoary kernel for breezy
<Mez> install the breezy kernel first
<mbreit> hi all
<ajmitch> Mez: and why not?
<ajmitch> since I've been using it for the last several months with no problem
<Mez> cause it doesnt work :P
<mbreit> Mez: i have been using hoary kernel for breezy, too... no problems...
<ajmitch> udev may have had issues if I was to reboot without the 2.6.12 kernel
<Mez> weird...
<Mez> I've been using breezy kernel ever since Ive been usin breexy
<ajmitch> so why would you then say that the hoary kernel doesn't work?
<Mez> cause it didnt work for me
<Mez> If i try uysing the hoary kernel it wont boot
<ajmitch_> well
<ajmitch_> system still hasn't come up yet, still fscking ;
<JanC> <Burgundavia> finally, ext2/3 for windows --> http://www.osnews.com/story.php?news_id=11506
<JanC> "finally" ?
<JanC> there is also an open source ext2 IFS driver...
<Treenaks> JanC: which doesn't work
<Treenaks> JanC: (tried it last Saturday)
<Lathiat> it works
<JanC> I have used it... ?
<Lathiat> but it caused a number of windows kernel panics
<Lathiat> randomly
<Lathiat> but fo rthe most part it worked
<Treenaks> Lathiat: it didn't for me.. it didn't recognise my USB disk
<Lathiat> pretty cool ti has write support tho
<Lathiat> Treenaks: you have to set it up
<Lathiat> with the program
<Lathiat> so youd plug yoru usb disk in and load the program etc
<Lathiat> it wasnt overlyh great
<Treenaks> Lathiat: yes, I did. but that program didn't find the drive
<JanC> which driver have you folks used ?
<JanC> tehre are 2 or 3 open source drivers  :)
<Treenaks> JanC: some 0.3 one
<JanC> try this one: http://ext2fsd.sourceforge.net/#ext2fsd
<Treenaks> JanC: I don't need it anymore :)
<JanC> bookmark it then  :)
<Lathiat> i ahvent seen one that writes yet
<Lathiat> so this one must be either good or the author is crazy
<Treenaks> Lathiat: or BOTH
<Lathiat> haha
<Lathiat> can i resize ext3 online with ubuntus kernels?
<JanC> write support is marked experimental :)
<Treenaks> Lathiat: online? that's scary
<Lathiat> heh
<Lathiat> well
<Lathiat> ah, ext2online only goes growing
<Treenaks> this is why people love live CD's
<Treenaks> so you can do it offline in a sane way
<Treenaks> hey Seveas
<Lathiat> heh
<Lathiat> well
<Lathiat> bbs, i hope ;p
<Seveas> hi
<Lathiat> well
<Lathiat> parted refuses to resize it
<Lathiat> says its busy
<Lathiat> yet neither swap nor the fs is mounted
<infinito> \sh: ping
<Nafallo> \sh: ping jabber
<Mez> jabber ?
<Nafallo> Mez: I can only see ajmitch as online
<Nafallo> i.e. something odd is up with jabber.org :-P
<Nafallo> also, it takes >10s for messages from me to my girlfriend.
<Mez> Nafallo: address/
<Nafallo> nafallo@jabber.org / gothcat@jabber.org
<Mez> gothcat as in gothcat that recently became a member
<Nafallo> gothcat is -EBUSY though :-)
<Nafallo> yepp
<Nafallo> my girlfriend :-)
<Mez> fair enough
<hno73> NOTICE: the ubuntu and udu wikis are now READ-ONLY, so hold off on edits for a while. Should be about 30 minutes. Thanks.
<infinito> anyone here is in charge for syncing pkgs from MOTUToSync??
<ajmitch> infinito: elmo does syncs
<Nafallo> ajmitch: morning :-)
<infinito> ajmitch: elmo seems not to be here....
<ajmitch> and we shoul mark them off done
<ajmitch> infinito: that's right, elmo doesn't visit -motu
<ajmitch> hey Nafallo
<Nafallo> ajmitch: how come you're the one MOTU I see on my jabber? :-)
<Nafallo> and Mez now, actually
<ajmitch> Nafallo: no idea, I saw ogra come online earlier
<Nafallo> ajmitch: yea, but \sh is not there. and he should _always_ be there IIRC ;-)
<ajmitch> it's a worry ;)
<retrix> hey, how do i specify i want to build an architecture-independent package?
<ajmitch> retrix: Architecture: all in debian/control
<retrix> ajmitch, hmm ok, i had any in there for some reason
<ajmitch> any means build on any arch
<ajmitch> all means the package works on all :)
<retrix> ah i see, thx
<\sh> heaven and hell...back from bloody meetings
<Nafallo> \sh: wee! :-)
<Nafallo> \sh: why can't I see you online on jabber? :-)
<mbreit> hi \sh
<hno73> NOTICE: The ubuntu wiki is now writable again after pages have been transferred in from the UDU wiki. udu.wiki.ubuntu.com now forwards to wiki.ubuntu.com
<\sh> Nafallo: cause I'm not online with jabber right now :)
<Nafallo> \sh: WHAT? now you're scaring me.
<\sh> Nafallo: now I'm online ,-)
<Nafallo> \sh: see jabber ;-)
<\sh> mbreit: hey..U msged me
<DanielN> hiho guys
<mbreit> \sh: do you know a famir, or fatmir or so from essen?
<\sh> mbreit: no...but farid ,-)
<mbreit> \sh: yes, that was it ;)
<\sh> farid mesbahi
<mbreit> \sh: he was at our lug meeting yesterday ;))
<\sh> mbreit: really? well...I know him since my early c64 days :)
<mbreit> \sh: yes, he told us that he knows you from essen...
<\sh> yeah...I lived in essen when I was 13 till my age of 17
<\sh> essen-steele to be exact
<mbreit> \sh: i think he lives now in paderborn or some city near that
<\sh> mbreit: yes...I heard from him when I was working in guetersloh...and he told me that he's working in paderborn...
<\sh> mbreit: he just mailed me yesterday :)
<\sh> funny
<mbreit> \sh: we gave him your email adress
<\sh> mbreit: you must have taught him how to use google ,-)
<mbreit> *g*
<mbreit> \sh: he saw your ubuntu-wiki page when he tried to get some informations about ubuntu
<\sh> hehe...sh*t I'm not invisible...;)
<\sh> but the world is small...yes..
<\sh> and I know too many people out there
<mbreit> *g*
<Nafallo> \sh: you are invisible :-P
<Nafallo> still offline ;-)
<\sh> Nafallo: I'll ask mvo if I'm offline for him as well
<\sh> Nafallo: register an account with linux-server.org
<infinito> \sh: hi... i wanted to ask u about MOTUToSync...
<\sh> infinito: elmo is responsible for this page :)
<Nafallo> \sh: I thought I'd ask you to experiment with magicalforest.se if you would want to. I'm eager to try the SRV-lookups :-)
<infinito> deadline for syncing before breezy is next 11th doesnt it??
<\sh> Nafallo: well...actually I need to know if ejabberd/psi or gaim and jabberd.org are having problems...so I can poke peter st. andre to fix it
<Nafallo> \sh: *s* oki :-).
<Nafallo> \sh: you _are_ still online, right?
<Nafallo> and get my messages and stuff
<\sh> yes
<siretart> SloMo_: ping
<SloMo_> siretart: pong ;)
<siretart> ah, there you are
<siretart> SloMo_: I'm just on doing revu work, and processed some packages of you
<siretart> SloMo_: shall I upload faac-1.24clean? there is some statment in the changelog, that it requires a newer faad2 package
<siretart> SloMo_: shall I upload it as is and you ping elmo so that it gets in multiverse?
<SloMo_> yes... but the "newer" faad2 package is already for weeks in the archive... you uploaded it ;)
<siretart> oh, my memory.. :)
<SloMo_> hmm, isn't it already in the multiverse list?
<siretart> possibly
<siretart> but is it ok to upload?
<SloMo_> yep... both are already in the multiverse list, at least the older version got into multiverse
<SloMo_> sure
<siretart> uploading now
<siretart> SloMo_: I made some comments to your liferea upload, could you please have a look at it?
<siretart> http://siretart.tauware.de/revu/details.py?upid=248
<SloMo_> ok, i'll talk to elmo... at the time a uploaded the package to revu there was no 0.9.4 in debian
<siretart> ah, I see
<SloMo_> hmm but can't i take just the debian package, make the small change and upload the ubuntu1 version directly?
<siretart> that would be the other option
<siretart> yes
<SloMo_> ok, sounds easier and takes some work from elmo ;)
<siretart> jepp :)
<SloMo_> ok, i'm uploading it in a few minutes :) just need to get really awake *gets some coffee* :)
<siretart> hehe
<siretart> good morning, btw ;)
<SloMo_> ree
<SloMo_> thanks :)
<SloMo_> liferea currently builds in pbuilder
<SloMo_> hmm... but what i wonder since over a year... why don't the mozilla people split their stuff into something like a libgecko which then gets used by firefox, mozilla and every other browser which uses this for rendering... that way not everybody needs the whole mozilla/firefox just to use galeon or epiphany...
<Nafallo> SloMo_: same question for kde
<Nafallo> SloMo_: and uptil now, xorg :-)
<SloMo_> yeah... cowbell 0.2.2 arrived in debian :)
<siretart> :)
<SloMo_> siretart: http://siretart.tauware.de/revu/details.py?upid=324
<siretart> SloMo_: in already in my pbuilder ;)
<mbreit> yeahoo... just got mail from elmo, i am finally whitelisted ;))
<Nafallo> I got REJECT :-P
<SloMo_> siretart: hmm hopefully the version which came at 15:10 ;) the older one was missing a dependency
<siretart> jepp, it is the right version
<SloMo_> Nafallo: so we were not added yet... :(
<siretart> Nafallo: oh, did I bork some upload?
<siretart> Nafallo: arn't you a motu yet and can upload for yourself?
<Nafallo> yay! I'm added both as MOTU and whitelisted :-)
<siretart> Nafallo: well, then you can upload yourself, right?
<Nafallo> siretart: since some minutes yes :-).
<siretart> hehe
<siretart> excellent. then you can handle your reject on your own :)
<siretart> SloMo_: what about you?
<Nafallo> I got an reject before I got the acks :-)
<siretart> ah, i see
<SloMo_> no idea ;) i got no mail from elmo but i'll test in a few seconds ;)
<siretart> SloMo_: he seems to be on irc right now, perhaps you can ping him
<Amaranth> SloMo_: What you described (mozilla stuff) is what the Gecko Runtime Environment (GRE) and I guess XULRunner are supposed to do.
<Nafallo> yay!
<Nafallo> first upload
<Amaranth> what was it?
<Nafallo> I've must have done that some days ago :-P
<siretart> Nafallo: contratulations! :)
<Nafallo> siretart: thanx :-)
<mbreit> and i have some problem (again) that i am unable to solve...
<mbreit> i recompiled ickle
<mbreit> against libicq2000c2... but the generated .deb depends on libicq2000
<siretart> Nafallo: do you have time to look at some packages in revu? I'd like to get some NEW packages uploaded..
<mbreit> iit uses  ${shlibs:Depends}, and pbuilder installed libicq2000c2 and not libicq2000... so where is the problem?
<mbreit> s/iit/it/
<Nafallo> siretart: sure. I just have to mail you before I can give comments :-).
<siretart> Nafallo: ah, you cannot login?
<Nafallo> siretart: only as contributor.
<siretart> Nafallo: no need to do so, I upgraded you as reviwer
<siretart> ;)
<Nafallo> siretart: *s*
<Nafallo> siretart: thanx, I've been having troubles with evo and gpg :-)
<siretart> oh
<Treenaks> Nafallo: evo is your problem :)
<Nafallo> Treenaks: ;-)
<Mez> w00t
<Mez> I have upload!"
<Nafallo> :-)
<Nafallo> dang. have to do sysadministration of my server. I'll have to look at REVU later.
<siretart> congratulations, Mez :)
<Nafallo> girlfriends _are_ demanding :-P
<siretart> Nafallo: ooh, no problem. take care!
<siretart> ;)
<siretart> yes, there are.
<siretart> :)
<Mez> siretart :D 2 weeks late - but meh
<mbreit> could someone help me with my problem?
<SloMo_> mbreit: sure... what problem is it?
<mbreit> see above about my problem with ickle and libicq2000
<SloMo_> look at libicq2000... i bet it calls dh_makeshilibs with libicq2000 and not with libicq2000c2
<mbreit> SloMo_: it calls "dh_makeshlibs -a"
<mbreit> should that be dh_makeshlibs -p libicq2000c2 ?
<SloMo_> wait i'll look at it...
<siretart> Mez: hey, I finally find some time to do ubuntu work :)
<Mez> ..?
<Mez> like what ?
<SloMo_> mbreit: ok, in the control is a mistake... Repalces: ;)
<mbreit> oh... okay... do you fix that or shall i do it?
<SloMo_> well that can't be the problem you found... i'll look further after eating
<mbreit> well, i think you gave me the right pointer with dh_makeshlibs... i will look at that myself...
<tseng> buh
<tseng> is there no package for php4-oracle?
<Mez> tseng: i believe its in php4-universe
<tseng> i dont see it
<tseng> oh thats a binary?
<tseng> no
<siretart> Mez: are you still working on gaim-assistant?
<Mez> siretart, I've no idea how to fix that compile error
<siretart> Mez: shall I archive that upload then or wait a few days more?
<siretart> \sh_away: congratulations to your first upload to main, dude!
<Mez> siretart, archive it till I can work out how to fix
<siretart> ok. it will get unarchived on new upload anyway
<Mez> bddebian: ping
<Mez> who isnt here so why am i pinging him
<Mez> WANTED: very brave user with Ubuntu hoary who doesnt mind reinstalling
<Nafallo> libglu1-mesa-dev is not a good build-dep, is it?
<SloMo_> Mez: what are you trying to do? ;) one week earlier and i could help... now my laptop is updated to breezy
<mbreit> Mez: i updated my laptop to breezy the day before yesterday, so bad luck :(
<Mez> lol
<SloMo_> but i've a hoary chroot lying around... if this is enough for what you want to test...
<Mez> nop
<Mez> e
<Mez> watch i -devel
<SloMo_> brb
<Nafallo> Mez: was that for me? :-)
<Mez> anyone who wants to know what we're dfoing
<Nafallo> Mez: sure :-)
<JanC> SloMo_, you might want to read this : http://wiki.mozilla.org/XUL:Xul_Runner
<sistpoty> hi folks
<siretart> huhu sistpoty
<Nafallo> hmm
<siretart> sistpoty: how are you?
<Nafallo> hi sistpoty :-)
<SloMo_> JanC: thanks :)
<SloMo_> hi sistpoty
<sistpoty> siretart: so far so good ;)
<sistpoty> siretart: did everything work out with your study thesis?
<siretart> sistpoty: yepp, it now for review :)
<sistpoty> *g*
<bddebian> Morning
<Mez> ah hey bddebian
<bddebian> ah? :-)
<bddebian> Hello Mez
<Mez> one sec
<SloMo_> hi bddebian :)
<bddebian> Heya SloMo_
<Mez> bddebian, https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=11578
<mbreit> hey bddebian
<Mez> what was the reason fordropping the patch
<bddebian> Heya mbreit
<bddebian> Mez: It was FTBFSing for me and wasn't necessary
<Mez> FTFBS?
<mbreit> fails to build from source
<bddebian> Fail To Build From Source
<Amaranth> Failure To Build From Source
<SloMo_> lol
<Mez> bddebian, you need to state the reason why you do things :D or people will ask why :P (like me)
<bddebian> "No dropped patches but had to remove unnecessary gcc4 patch from kubuntu"
<bddebian> "unnecessary" doesn't explain it? :-)
<Mez> doesnt explain why it was unncessary
<bddebian> Ah, fair enough
* bddebian gets no love
<sistpoty2> hm... I'm just trying to do some work on UniverseUnmetDeps... if I see packages assigned to nobody, that are installable right now, should i remove these from the list?
* Mez pets bddebian on the head
<Mez> sistpoty run the command at the top and regen the list :D
<mbreit> sistpoty2: there are some package that have unmetdeps only on one arch...
<sistpoty2> ah... ok mbreit, good point
<bddebian> sistpotyYes but what is installable for you?
<Mez> can someone just regenerate the list?
<mbreit> sistpoty2: tell us which packages you mean, then i will test on amd64... and perhaps slomo can do on ppc
<mbreit> Mez: i think regenerating is much more work...
<Mez> mbreit - the command is at the top of the page
<mbreit> Mez: i know
<bddebian> But then you have to rip out what people have already looked at :-)
<sistpoty2> mbreit: just a moment
<mbreit> bddebian: full ack
<SloMo_> sistpoty2: to see whether it is not installable on one arch look at packages.ubuntu.com... in that case there are some deps missing (for one or more architectures)
<GazerWork> siretart, hi, in https://perso.duckcorp.org/duck/cdbs-doc/cdbs-doc.xhtml, there is nothing about DB_INSTALL_DOCS_, (or I don't understand why DB_INSTALL_DOCS_ is a better solution for my problem)
<siretart> GazerWork: to be honest, I also never heared about DB_INSTALL_DOCS, perhaps you can ask jbailey about this?
<GazerWork> siretart, yes , thx
<mbreit> SloMo_: but packages.ubuntu.com shows it just for one arch?
<GazerWork> jbailey, ping :) ?
<mbreit> SloMo_: and it's often not up to date
<sistpoty2> mbreit: aspell-de-alt...
<mbreit> sistpoty2: that belongs to the doko list...
<Mez> mbreit, yes, but usually you'll be able to see that on there and then check the version thats in the repo :D
<mbreit> i have asked him yesterday if i could move that to his list...
<SloMo_> mbreit: when there are differences between the archs it shows them
<mbreit> SloMo_: okay, i did not know that
<mbreit> doko: ping
<Mez> bddebian, are you whitelisted?
<bddebian> Mez: As of last night yes
<sistpoty2> mbreit: bacula
<Mez> good
<Mez> bddebian, watch for katie output
<doko> mbreit: pong
* Nafallo builds a script to auto-rebuild things :-)
<mbreit> doko: can we move aspell-de-alt to your list at UniverseUnmetDeps?
<Mez> Nafallo: you may want to look @ autobuild.py for backports
<bddebian> Nafallo: I think tseng started one
<bddebian> Mez: OK, thanks
<Mez> I'm sure it can be changed easily
<mbreit> doko: or can we do that generally without asking?
<doko> Nafallo: but don't add -ubuntuN suffixes for packages, that don't have a -ubuntuN suffix ...
<doko> what is wrong about aspell-de-alt?
<mbreit> sistpoty2: just verified: bacula is installable on amd64
<sistpoty2> so is it on i386
<Nafallo> doko: I'll increment automatically with dch and then run nano -w on debian/changelog right after :-)
<mbreit> doko: nothing... that's why it does not belong to the "need-love" lsit
<mbreit> s/lsit/list/
<Nafallo> ugly and working ;-)
<mbreit> doko: and because you fixed it, i would like to move it to the "doko"-row on that page
<Nafallo> simple bash :-)
<doko> mbreit: if you think, that it's worth the work ...
<mbreit> doko: at least it should be removed from the needs-love list...
<mbreit> sistpoty: i think you can remove bacula...
<sistpoty> mbreit: ok
<seth_k> Mez, what would be different about the mails on the Backports mailing list? Thunderbird crashes every time I try to open one
<seth_k> I thought it might be the ones that are signed, but I can open non-Backports signed mail with no crash
<Mez> seth_k, nothing - that's weird
<seth_k> Mez, what's the attachment on them? Those are the ones I can't open
<seth_k> is it a detach clearsign?
<Mez> atachement
<Mez> ?
<bddebian> Heya seth_k, where you been? :-)
<Mez> seth - have you the latest version of thunderbird?
<janimo> guys was there a resolution of the config.{sub.guess} issue in diffs?
<sistpoty> janimo: these shouldn't be modified every build time... iirc the resolution was to contact upstream of autotools
<janimo> but until then? my debdiffs have them
<janimo> is it ok to upload like this
<janimo> ?
<sistpoty> sorry, dunno
<infinito> siretart: ping
<janimo> ok thanks :)
<sistpoty> janimo: but if you're building new packages, you could consider cdbs, which afaik eliminates the config.sub/guess problem
<janimo> texisting package, but I've been meaning to try CDBS :)
<sistpoty> hehe, haven't tried it either
<seth_k> Mez, yeah, it only started after last update -1
<Mez> weird, woeks fine for me
<seth_k> hi bddebian, i've been on vacation
<bddebian> seth_k: Ah, nice
<seth_k> nice except that the universe vomited in my inbox :D
<bddebian> Hehe, yeah, I imagine :-)
<sistpoty> caudium also seems to be installable...
<SloMo_> Mez: can we backport gkrellm? ;)
<bddebian> Is the x86 buildd down today or behind?
<mbreit> siretart: nope
<mbreit> siretart: the list is about _source packages_, and caudium-pixsl (which belongs to caudium source package) is not installable
<Nafallo> bddebian: they seem down. I think one is online and catching up
<sistpoty> mbreit: ok, thanks for the hint
<mbreit> sistpoty: btw: add bacula to the list again ;)
<mbreit> bacula-wxconsole has unmet deps
<mbreit> oh wait... i'll put it to my list...
<sistpoty> mbreit: done
<sistpoty> mbreit: but putting packages that can be rebuilt without changes to the "Just Need A Rebuild"-list is ok?
<mbreit> bddebian: the i386 buildds are back ;)
<mbreit> sistpoty: if you tested them after rebuilding and you verified that they are working, yes
<sistpoty> ok
<Nafallo> I'm preparing uploads for that list :-)
<bddebian> Damn, is everyone working today to impress the TB at the meeting?? ;-P
<mbreit> bddebian: i haven't done much for ubuntu today....
<bddebian> Me either :-(
<mbreit> i will write my last exam tomorrow, so the real work will start after it ;)
<mbreit> bddebian: but i don't have to impress the TB... i am not yet a member, so that's my next step *g*
<sistpoty> good luck mbreit
<mbreit> sistpoty: thanks
<bddebian> mbreit: You have my vote ;-)
<mbreit> bddebian: thanks ;)
<mbreit> hmm... bacual ftbfs... so i will have a closer look tomorrow
<sistpoty> cooking time... will be back later
<seth_k> bddebian, gimmie a quick hand with dput for revu? what part of the source tree should I be in before typing "dput revu"
<sistpoty> seth_k: one directory above the source tree, where your .dsc/.changes file reside
<seth_k> okay, thanks sistpoty
<sistpoty> np
<bddebian> seth_k: afaik, wherever your ... Oh, nm :-)
<sistpoty> <-- off now ;)
<seth_k> hehe
<bddebian> Later sistpoty
<sistpoty> cya
* bddebian is too slow.. :-(
<bddebian> Man, it got quiet in here all of the sudden
<janimo> is there a standard way of upgrading a meta-package and it's depends w/o a full dist-upgarde?
<Treenaks> janimo: apt-get install metapackage
<Treenaks> when a new version is available of course :)
<janimo> Treenack, that does not update it's depends if already there
<janimo> i.e I have latest x-window-system-core and the syetm is happy even though
<janimo> it's depends are older than -44
<janimo> a restricted dist-upgrade
<Treenaks> janimo: if you're running breezy, just dist-upgrade
<Treenaks> janimo: if you're running hoary, poke daniels
<Treenaks> uh no
<janimo> see my initial question :) w/o dist-upgrade
<Treenaks> janimo: what are you trying to upgrade then?
<janimo> I jsust want latest X and depends not all cruf^W nice software :)
<Treenaks> janimo: impossible
<Treenaks> (or VERY VERY hard)
<Treenaks> and likely very broken
<janimo> Teenaks, hmm I wonder why is this not in apt?
<janimo> just iterate over depends and install them recursively
<seth_k> hmmm
<seth_k> why would pdebuild not be signing my .changes files...
<bddebian> Someone else had that problem recently
<seth_k> oh, it's not signing the source.changes
<seth_k> just the i386.changes
* seth_k ponders
* Nafallo uploads a couple of "Just Need A Rebuild"
<Nafallo> from UniverseUnmetDeps
<mbreit> Nafallo: i you would mention our names in the changelogs... ;)
<Nafallo> mbreit: did :-)
<mbreit> Nafallo: great, thanks!
<Nafallo> mbreit: sqsh uploaded :-)
<mbreit> great... the list gets smaller...
<Nafallo> seth_k: tagtool skribe uploaded
<seth_k> cheers Nafallo
<Nafallo> bddebian: w3mmee uploaded :-)
<bddebian> Nafallo: Ah cool, thanks
<tseng> SloMoSnail++
<SloMoSnail> hm?
<tseng> you seem to be uploading now
<tseng> good stuff
<bddebian> w00t SloMoSnail
<SloMoSnail> tseng: i'm not uploading ;) i delegate my uploads to others as elmo hasn't added my key to the keyring yet... my signed CoC hasn't arrived at mako :(
<tseng> i see
<mbreit> Nafallo: thanks for rebuilding that packages!
<janimo> yay, my first upload to REVU!
<siretart> grats janimo :)
<seth_k> janimo, how did you get your _source.changes file signed, mine refuse to sign :P
<seth_k> it only signs the i386.changes
<janimo> seth_k, I could using gpg :)
<seth_k> mm, true, manually
<janimo> dpkg-buildpackage asks for password doing build
<janimo> if you have gpg set up correctly it should work
<seth_k> yeah, I know, I put it in
<seth_k> but it only signed i386.changes
<seth_k> not source.changes
<seth_k> hmm
* seth_k tries again
<janimo> well if you pass -S so that it's a source build and don't pass -uc it shoudl sign it
<bddebian>  -us
<janimo> right I confuse -us and -uc :)
<bddebian> :-)
<seth_k> ah, I'm doing -b, and only -S on dpkg-genchanges
<seth_k> probably the issue
<bddebian>  -S -sa
<janimo> bddebian, actually -uc is for changes and -us for dsc I think
<bddebian> janimo: Ahh, I wasn't familiar with -uc :-)
<janimo> I use -us -uc when I don;t want to be bothered with password promt while testing
<bddebian> I usually use -us -tc :-)
<janimo> orthogonal :)
<janimo> -tc I mean
<janimo> what are the meaning of icons in REVU?
<janimo> bulb,hammer,heart?
<siretart> janimo: your upload of xubuntu-meta has strange permissions in the tarball
<janimo> rules +x
<janimo> what else?
<janimo> I wonder what I b0rked :)
<siretart> janimo: bulb means, the package is NEW and requires 3 MOTU's to sign off
<siretart> janimo: hammer meens, need work
<siretart> janimo: and heart means: ready to be uploaded or already uploaded
<janimo> thanks
<janimo> heart and bulb means ready, and heart alone alreday uploaded then?
<janimo>  what are the strange permissions, I just copied form kubuntu-meta most of the files and di not mess withh perms
<siretart> drwxr-x---  3 siretart users 4096  9. Aug 21:28 xubuntu-meta-0.1/
<siretart> that I'd consider strange :)
<janimo> oh the direcotry itself :)
<janimo> indeed
<janimo> that's the same as on the kubuntu-meta source dir though
<siretart> then thats broken, too ;)
<janimo> and all XXbuntu-meta-s
<siretart> well, I does not violate debian policy, so its not legally broken
<janimo> you mean it should be rx for all?
<janimo> I just looked at some other source pkgs
<siretart> the problem is rather, that revu doesn't fix permissions, so you cannot browse the package online
<siretart> for that upload, I fixed that manually
<janimo> aha so rx for all for future packages right?
<siretart> 755 is imo sane
<siretart> jupp
<siretart> perhaps its rather a workaround for revu, but it works :)
<janimo> ok thanks for the heads-up :)
<janimo> so if I want to review stuff I send you my gpg key?
<janimo> oh I see I should get a mail after my first upload, is that automatic?
<siretart> janimo: enter your email and try to login. then use the 'revocer' button
<siretart> s/button/link/
<Mez> siretart: who's ben collins/
<siretart> Mez: dunno, sorry
<Mez> lol
<Mez> he's going for main tonight (in 4 mins I beleive?
<janimo> Mez, ben collins is a DD
<janimo> among others maintainer of firewire in linux kernel
<Mez> ah - never heard of him afore looking at the agenda
<tseng> its unprecedented to go from 0 -> main in the open community afaik
<tseng> there are several cases of backdoor canonical magic
* tseng shrugs
<janimo> well trusted debian old timers may bypass the usual ritual I guess
<janimo> they have a proven technical  and social track record
<Burgundavia> ogra, we should probably add a backports resolution to the bugzilla
<Mez> lol
<chillywilly> bah...having problems getting subversion to work in hoary
<ogra> yes, its quite annoying
<Mez> ogra ... ?
<Mez> backports in bugzilla?
<bddebian> chillywilly!!
<Mez> poke them over to malone :D
<chillywilly> wassat?
<Burgundavia> Mez, we do, but we a resolution status for universe
<ogra> Mez, unoffical backports bugs assigned to officail packages from main
<Mez> lol
<Mez> ogra: you can add one and point it to backports -unofficial in malone
<Mez> https://launchpad.net/products/ubp-hoary-unofficial/
<Burgundavia> Mez, look at this https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=488
<janimo> siretart you may want to update linda and lintian on REVU so they don't warn on standard version 3.6.2 :)
<janimo> latest lintian in breezy is ok
<siretart> janimo: I installed lates breezy lintian, but not linda
<Mez> Burgundavia, whats that gor to do with backports
<siretart> Version: 1.23.10ubuntu1
<janimo> I dunno about linda either, I used only lintian myself
<Burgundavia> Mez, it just shows what bugzilla would do. The resolution would be Backports
<Burgundavia> Mez, that allows to search for backports bugs occasionallyt
<janimo> siretart, why is commenting allowed only for one's own uploads?
<janimo> in REVU
<siretart> janimo: I wanted that to be discussed with other MOTU's, but no one has objected so far
<janimo> ok I am trying to familiarize myself with revu
<janimo> and assumed that part of review is sticking comments online :)
<janimo> but I'll see what the real way to do it is
<siretart> janimo: are you already a motu?
<janimo> yes
<siretart> argl. sorry, then your permission level is worong
<janimo> a lazy one :)
<Mez> does UVF apply to Universe?
<janimo> MEz, yes but it's laxer
<siretart> Mez: yes
<janimo> still you have to ask permission
<siretart> janimo: ok, you are reviewer now :)
<janimo> it is usually asking elmo to sync
<janimo> siretart thank you :)
<Mez> I know sybncs are ok :D
<janimo> Mez, well syncs are one way around UVF :)
<Mez> lol :D
<siretart> no
<janimo> what else do you mean
<janimo> Mez ^
<siretart> syncs are only acceptable when you are sure they dont destabilize universe
<Mez> I mean - like for example, guifications, seth's put it in revu
<janimo> universe is destabiled as it is ;)
<sistpoty> nice quote, siretart ;)
<janimo> sure we don't sync everything
<Mez> but I already made the package but didnt upload cause of UVF
<janimo> one takes responsibility for the syncs one asks
<janimo> Mez, is it a new package?
<ogra> janimo, UVF applies to universe too... so every sync needs approval
<Mez> janimo, no
<janimo> ogra (23:17:47) janimo: still you have to ask permission
<janimo> :)
<ogra> :)
<ogra> sorry, missed :)
<Mez> I'm just on about when packages show up in REVU that arent new packages
<janimo> so the rule in REVU is 3 MOTU's approval for upload right?
<Mez> whether they should be uploaded or not
<Mez> janimo, 3 for new, 1 for old
<janimo> does it include original uploader or do we need honest and objective reviews ;) ?
<Mez> doesnt include original uploader
<ogra> janimo, 3 foreign ones for NEW or non MOTU packages, 1 foreing one for a fix
<janimo> for a fix? and Mez said old.
<sistpoty> old = in debian
<janimo> Isn;t REVU only for NEW? I guess I misunderstood
<ogra> we abuesd it for fixes from non MOTUs
<Mez> ogra: I think that's fair though :D
<janimo> ogra, that's reasonable then
<Mez> (fixes from non MOTUs)
<ogra> jup, not everyone has webspace
<janimo> and it's better if it's in a central place
<tseng> its better in one place anyway
<janimo> doesn't get lost easily
<ogra> yep
<tseng> i have my stuff in at least 3 places
<janimo> tseng, if you want xubuntu-desktop you'd better review it ;)
<tseng> i find xfce more of a toy
<janimo> aren't all computers toys ? :)
<tseng> its nice to play with sometimes
* bddebian likes xfce
<janimo> dict: sometimes,   when one has less than 512M of RAM
<tseng> poor deprived souls
<janimo> 80% of computer users :)
* janimo pulled that number out of his a$$ of course
<janimo> How to get rid of bloat in software? Step 1) take RAM manufacturers out of business 2) wait 3)profit
<Mez> siretart/sistpoty: ping
<sistpoty> Mez: pong
<siretart> Mez: pong pong
<Mez> sistpoty, native debian patches in revu cause weird *.diffs
<Mez> http://dev.kubuntu.org.uk/~mez/archive/pool/breezy/guifications/
<Mez> *.diff	0 Bytes
<janimo> siretart, is there a deb-src archive at REVU so one can apt-get source?
<siretart> Mez: I know. that why I dont recommend uploading native packages :/
<siretart> Mez: I will think about this with revu2 ;)
<sistpoty> janimo: not yet...
<siretart> janimo: will come with revu2
<janimo> ok :)
<Mez> siretart: if you want a hand with revu, then I'm more than willing
<Nafallo> hmm
<Nafallo> that was upload number 10 :-P
<Nafallo> I think
<bddebian> Nafallo: Nice
<siretart> Mez: thanks for your offer. sistpoty and I will meet tomorrow and work out a plan for development of revu2. then we will be able to share workload
<Nafallo> sistpoty: camstream uploaded
<sistpoty> Nafallo: cool :)
<bddebian> How long does it generally take from upload, buildd, to reach the archives?
<mbreit> bddebian: half an hour.. or even longer
<Nafallo> bddebian: depends on when you upload. atleast 30minutes.
<siretart> bddebian: that depends. if the package is already in archive, does not change build depends and dependencies, and got built before, I think about 2h
<siretart> including mirroring to secondary mirrors, primary may be faster
<bddebian> OK, thanks folks
<siretart> bddebian: in any other case, most likley manual work is required
<siretart> gn8 folks
<siretart> cu tomorrow, sistpoty :)
<bddebian> Later siretart
<sistpoty> gn8 siretart
<bddebian> Guess I should head home myself.  Later folks.
<janimo> good night all
<ajmitch> morning
<Nafallo> morning ajmitch :-)
<SloMoSnail> morning? hum ;)
<ajmitch> SloMoSnail: yep, ~9:30AM here :)
<Nafallo> SloMoSnail: it's _always_ morning. you talk to little with jdub ;-)
<ajmitch> well jdub is usually just 2 hours behind me :)
<SloMoSnail> hmm... 23:44 here ;)
<Nafallo> damn I hate this server sometimes. the admin haven't installed ntp-server as I asked him todo.
<Nafallo> hmm
<Nafallo> is it just me or is debians kismet _a lot_ worse than ours? :-)
<ajmitch> dunno, I don't have wireless with a debian laptop :)
<ogra> hmm, doesnt work for either of my wlan cards....
<ogra> i guess debians wont either
<ajmitch> it worked for me, when I was using sid
<ogra> i doubt it would work for you with my HW in sid ;)
<ajmitch> why is that?
<ogra> because of the cards and amd64.... i guess...
<ogra> one is a orinoco silver..... the kernel even doesnt recognize it as wireless....
<ogra> (bu it works fine)
#ubuntu-motu 2006-08-07
<railz2> when I put in the cd it asked to upgrade or start package manager, i choose package manager and it added the cd as a source
<railz2> but next to no packages are being listed, i see the dapper kernel and a couple of things but thats about it
<railz2> for ex, no upgrades are shown for firefox, gnome, xchat and pretty much everything else
<railz2> i made sure all other sources are removed so it's only the cd
<Mez> railz2 - have a look at your /etc/apt/sources.list
<railz2> this is the only line uncommented
<Mez> you need to change everything from "hoary" to "dapper"
<railz2> deb cdrom:[Ubuntu 6.06 _Dapper Drake_ - Release i386 (20060531)] / dapper main restricted
<Mez> railz2... then do a
<Mez> sudo apt-get update
<railz2> already did
<Mez> sudo apt-get upgrade
<Mez> sudo apt-get dselect-upgrade
<railz2> when i do update or reload in synaptic it's showing only about 8 packages in total that can be upgraded
<railz2> i've never done dselect-upgrade whats that?
<Mez> same as dist-0upgrade but will remove packages you dont need
<railz2> i just wanted to see all the packages available in synaptic first then i was going to kill X and do apt-get dist-upgrade
<Mez> railz2 - this isnt the place - try #ubuntu or the mailing lists
<railz2> i realize this isn't the place, but no one knows in #ubuntu and the forums are failing me
<railz2> this should be relatively easy but can't find the solution
<railz2> but i'll try elsewhere
<ajmitch> bmonty: pong
<ajmitch> railz2: sorry, you can't use the live/desktop cd to do upgrades - it's the one failing of it not having the packages on the cd as packages
<Lathiat> i always thought the 'alternate' cd should be called the upgrade cd or something
<ajmitch> except that it's not primarily used for that
<bmonty> ajmitch: any updates on your SoC project?
<hub> are we in UVF for Universe?
<tseng> no.
<bmonty> hub: are you looking at the email about sympa on ubuntu-motu?
<hub> yeah
<bmonty> it looks like that package is just a sync
<hub> bmonty: I just wanted to make sure I didn't miss something
<Fujitsu> Note that there doesn't seem to be a newer sympa in Sid.
<Toadstool> bmonty, hub: edgy has the exact same version as sid, looks like the package is not well maintained in Debian
<Fujitsu> There should be a CC meeting tomorrow, shouldn't there?
<zul_> i thought it takes place on tuesday
<Fujitsu> zul_, it is Tuesday tomorrow here :P
<Fujitsu> But I note that there was no meeting on the 25th, when there should have been.
<LaserJock> grr, my laptop just doesn't like mouse buttons after coming out of hibernation
<zul_> macbook?
<LaserJock> no
<LaserJock> toshiba
<zul_> ah that explains it :)
<LaserJock> it's kinda crappy
<LaserJock> wrt hibernation
<zul_> i heard nothing but bad things about toshibas
<LaserJock> sound doesn't work
<LaserJock> and now the mouse buttons don't work
<LaserJock> I just have to Ctrl-Alt-Backspace
<jsgotangco> really
<jsgotangco> satellites are a pain based on my experience
<jsgotangco> not so much on the Tecras
<LaserJock> it has been a pretty nice machine for me
<LaserJock> not *too* many complaints considering how much I paid for it at the time
<LaserJock> but hibernation is weird to start with I guess
<LaserJock> it goes through the BIOS stuff, etc.
<LaserJock> that isn't normal is it?
<LaserJock> I don't have any other hibernation experience so I'm not sure what other laptops do
<jsgotangco> hibernate saves the session in your disk and powers down
<LaserJock> right
<LaserJock> but what is it supposed to do when you come out?
<jsgotangco> so when you boot up, you'll still get your bios stuff
<jsgotangco> i think what you're expecting is when you suspend to ram
<LaserJock> ah, could be
<jsgotangco> dont even try it on a binary video driver its more likely to fail than succeed
<caravena> Hello, I'm finding in http://cvs.gnome.org/viewcvs/gnome-system-tools/ the glade.in of gnome-system-log. I do not find it.  Somebody knows as it is the file?
<welshbyte> i think gnome-system-log is part of gnome-utils
<caravena> welshbyte: "logview" == "gnome-system-tool"?
<caravena> welshbyte: "logview" == "gnome-system-log"? (Sorry)
<crimsun> geez.
<crimsun> so in an attempt to not drag in xulrunner's libs, I have to build-depend on firefox-dev and add firefox as an explicit dependency.
<crimsun> I don't know which hurts more.
<Fujitsu> Ouch.
<crimsun> on top of that, I seem to be triggering a strange feature in GTK+ 2.10.1 in which a dbox doesn't respond to a delete-event.
<welshbyte> caravena: yes, it looks like it
<welshbyte> is
<Munchkinguy> I would like to reccomend for inclusion in the universe: Sakreble, a scrabble-type word game
<Munchkinguy> The source can be found at
<Munchkinguy> http://sakreble.sourceforge.net/
<imbrandon> |||||||||||||||||||||\
<zul_> hey imbrandon
<Munchkinguy> ...because it's the free only gui-based scrabble c
<Munchkinguy> lone out there
<Hobbsee> hi all
<zul> hey Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> hi zul :)
<zul> right im going to bed....night night
<Hobbsee> night zul
<Fujitsu> Anybody want to approve two syncs for me?
<Fujitsu> Hmm.
<Fujitsu> One has been duplicated.
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: which ones?
<Fujitsu> bug #55264 is trackballs...
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 55264 in trackballs "Please sync trackballs 1.1.1-4 from Debian Sid" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/55264
<Fujitsu> And bug #54402 is playmidi, but it's been duplicated by bddebian in #55085.
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 54402 in playmidi "Please sync playmidi 2.4debian-5 from Debian Sid" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/54402
<Hobbsee> oh yeah, i remember trackballs.
<micahcowan> how are versions compared for packages? I'm trying to help someone in #ubuntu with a custom package that he doesn't want conflicting with ubuntu-only versions... I advised him to use netatalk_2.0.3~3ubuntu1 (note the tilde), but that appears not to do the trick...
<LaserJock> micahcowan: you can use dpkg --compare-versions
<LaserJock> micahcowan: something along the lines of dpkg --compare-versions <packagversion1> lt <packagversion2>
<micahcowan> LaserJock, thanks; is it completely just an ASCII charval comparison?
<LaserJock> not sure
<LaserJock> I wouldn't use a tilde
<LaserJock> I'd probably go with putting something on the end
<micahcowan> so that minor ubuntu revisions would override? I'm not sure that's what he wants...
<crimsun> micahcowan: for which release, dapper?
<micahcowan> well, apparently, it may be what he wants, so he should put it on the end afterwards. crimsun, yeah, I believe he's on dapper.
<crimsun> micahcowan: 2.0.3-3ubuntu1 is dapper's, so anything newer that isn't newer than a possible update would work.
<crimsun> 2.0.3-3ubuntu1.1~tackystuffgoeshere1
<micahcowan> cool.
<micahcowan> I'm surprised, though that substituting + for - (before the XubuntuX bit) results in a "greater" version, despite the fact that + is less than -, ascii-character wise.
<crimsun> right, because the '+' can be part of the original source version.
<crimsun> '-' is strictly used to separate source version from package revision
<crimsun> (well, ideally it's only used in such a fashion)
<micahcowan> what might I use, then, if I didn't care about any revisions coming down the pipe from debian and ubuntu, only actual version changes to the upstream? +3ubuntu1 or somesuch?
<crimsun> micahcowan: 2.0.4~blahblahblah1
!lilo:*! services is restarting, please let us know if you still have a cloak problem after it restarts....thanks
<Hobbsee> hi again all
<Fujitsu> muse has some conflicts in muse_fr.qm and muse_sv_SE.qm, which appear to be compiled translations. What should be done to them?
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: check the dates and the sizes
<Hobbsee> likely debian has updated them
<Fujitsu> True.
<Fujitsu> Ubuntu's are two years older.
<Fujitsu> Thankyou!
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: :)
<Fujitsu> The only remaining Ubuntu change in muse is the removal of rules to backup config.{guess,sub}. Why would that be there in the first place?
<Fujitsu> Oops.
<Fujitsu> Not to back them up, but to move them away then link default ones.
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: does the changelog say?
<Hobbsee> hi dholbach!
<dholbach> good morning
<dholbach> hey Hobbsee
<TheMuso> Hey dholbach.
* Fujitsu checks.
<dholbach> hey TheMuso - i did an orca upload, hope you didn't mind :)
<TheMuso> dholbach: I now have a Braille display, so will be able to do a lot more a11y/braille testing for brltty, and GNOME.
<TheMuso> Not at all.
<dholbach> TheMuso: wow - super
<TheMuso> dholbach: Am I to assume that orca is not in line with the new python policy yet?
* TheMuso can't see any python-support/central deps.
<dholbach> uh, no it isn't
<TheMuso> I can do that if you'd like.
<dholbach> it's gnome release today and tomorrow again, so if you want to do that - i'm happy to upload it for you
<TheMuso> Cheers.
<Fujitsu> Hobbsee, the entry in the Debian changelog says thus:
<Fujitsu>   * Updated config.guess and config.sub to the latest versions in
<Fujitsu>     autotools-dev (Closes: #165663).
<Hobbsee> bug 165663
<Hobbsee> debian 165663
<Ubugtu> Debian bug 165663 in muse "Subject: muse_0.5.3-1(mipsel/unstable): out of date config.guess / config.sub" [Serious,Open]  http://bugs.debian.org/165663
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: what are the ubuntu changes on that package?
<Fujitsu> Just that at the moment.
<Fujitsu> And bug 165663 only affects mips.
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: mips?
<Fujitsu> Yes, mips the archictecture, which Ubuntu doesn't currently do.
* Nafallo starts poking at jabberd2
<Hobbsee> ah
<Fujitsu> From that bug: `muse has an old version of config.sub and config.guess, which don't correctly support mips and mipsel.'
<Nafallo> ehm. debian only has it in experimental, but the changelog says it somes from unstable?
<Nafallo> s/somes/comes/
<Fujitsu> I don't see why Ubuntu needs that stuff removed... If we leave it, we score an extra sync.
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: yeah, i'd try building and installign the debian version, then requesting a sync
<Fujitsu> OK, that I shall do.
<Hobbsee_> sigh.
<Nafallo> we still got time for merges and new upstream versions in universe, no?
<Hobbsee> Nafallo: yep
<Nafallo> nice. I'll start working on jabberd2 then :-)
<Hobbsee> Nafallo: you've got till sept 7
<Nafallo> hehe, I hope I will finish it today, but thanks :-)
<Hobbsee> Nafallo: :P  then you can do all the other merges
<TheMuso> Anybody have any ideas as to what one does with packages that are python, but also produce a shared library for bindings to other libraries?
* TheMuso checks the policy
<TheMuso> Nothing mentioned here.
<crimsun> TheMuso: python-gtk2 comes to mind.
<TheMuso> crimsun: Thanks, I'll have a look.
<Toadstool> 'morning everybody
<Fujitsu> Evening!
<Hobbsee> hi Toadstool
<Nafallo> bon jour Toadstool :-)
<Hobbsee> Toadstool: Fujitsu has some merges, etc :P
<Toadstool> :)
* Nafallo goes for not merging jabberd2, but just updating it.
<Toadstool> let me grab some coffee first, I've just got out of my bed :p
<Hobbsee> Nafallo: dont you have to do the merge in the process of updating it?
<Nafallo> Hobbsee: the package in debian experimental is an /entirely/ diffrent story then what was in unstable earlier :-). I'll rather maintain the unstable version.
<Nafallo> ...in ubuntu that is.
<Hobbsee> Nafallo: heh.   you might have fun next version of ubuntu then?
<Nafallo> :-)
<Nafallo> we already does this with gajim ;-)
<Fujitsu> Anybody have any idea what `${man/[17] /sgml}' is meant to do? I presume it's a bashism...
<Fujitsu> Hobbsee, I got a response from the fbi maintainer. He'll fix it up in the next upload, which he's planning to do next Sunday.
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: right, cool.  you might want to suggest the ubuntu changes to him as well, and ask if he wants to use them in debian.
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: seeing as then we can sync it :P
<Fujitsu> Can anybody help with removing that bashism?
* Hobbsee cant.  have to go to work :(
<Fujitsu> Urgh, work.
<Hobbsee> yeah
<crimsun> it's a pattern substitution
<Hobbsee> but it get paid, and that bit is useful.
<crimsun> think s/foo/bar/
<Hobbsee> s/it/i'
<Hobbsee> s/it/i/
<Fujitsu> Er, a three argument substitution?
<Toadstool> Fujitsu: ${man/[17] /sgml} is a bashism, it replaces the first occurrence of 1 or 7 in $man by sgml
<Toadstool> e.g: foo.1 -> foo.sgml
<Toadstool> see man bash ;)
<Fujitsu> Ah. OK... How do I unbashise it? Is there a POSIX-compliant equivalent, or do I have to specify all the files manually?
<Toadstool> Fujitsu: hmm... you could try something like "${man%[17] }sgml"
<Toadstool> Fujitsu: with this, 1 or 7 must be at the end of $man though
<Fujitsu> That seems to have worked, Toadstool... But now I'm getting some unknown instruction errors from the assembler. How pleasant.
<Toadstool> heh :)
<Fujitsu> Ah. I see why.
<Fujitsu> It's a PowerPC-only package.
<Fujitsu> >_<
<Toadstool> :D
<Fujitsu> I didn't think I knew of an `mr' opcode in the x86 instruction set.
<phanatic> morning
<Gloubiboulga> morning phanatic
<phanatic> hi Gloubiboulga
<Gloubiboulga> (damn, mor<tab> never works)
<Toadstool> hi phanatic
<phanatic> hi Toadstool
<phanatic> if somebody has time to review: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2847
<Fujitsu> How odd. Bug #54845 was marked as fixed 5 days ago, but the new version apparently didn't actually come through.
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 54845 in muse "[Sync Request]  muse 0.8.1a-2" [Untriaged,Fix released]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/54845
<dholbach> Fujitsu: maybe it FTBFS?
<Fujitsu> No, it works fine. I checked it myself, and was about to file a sync request when I noticed there was already one, but closed.
<crimsun> Fujitsu: that's odd, please ping an admin to have that checked.
<Fujitsu> An archive admin?
<Fujitsu> I shall do.
<crimsun> It's not in the NEW queue (wouldn't need to be), and the source packages haven't appeared on the public mirror at all.
<Fujitsu> I noticed that.
<Fujitsu> Also, are things meant to appear on edgy-changes after they are built? Or before?
<tseng> before.
<crimsun> that only means they were accepted as source uploads.
<Fujitsu> I thought so.
<crimsun> dupload/dput _source.changes -> -> qprocd [-> source NEW]  -> publisher -> buildd [-> binary NEW]  -> publisher -> mirror (publicly available on archive.uc)
<crimsun> the accept seen on edgy-changes is right at the end of second stage (after source NEW if necessary)
<Fujitsu> OK.
<geser> If I read https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/muse/0.7.1+0.7.2pre5-2ubuntu1 correctly it was first uploaded to edgy and then two hours later the same version to dapper again
<geser> on the same page are also only build logs for dapper listed
<Fujitsu> That's the old version.
<crimsun> no
<crimsun> ISO date format is used, so it's May 8th vs. June 8th
<geser> yes, I should read more carefully
<crimsun> FWIW, infinity doesn't handle syncs; you probably want to wait for keybuk since kamion is on vacation
<crimsun> I probably should have clarified that before, d'oh
<Fujitsu> Ah, I noted that Kamion was on vacation.
<Fujitsu> Thanks :)
<crimsun> -> work
<Fujitsu> Bye!
<dholbach> Fujitsu: is going to be on vacation
<dholbach> Fujitsu: <Kamion> mvo: please file bugs and subscribe ubuntu-archive - I'm on holiday for the next two weeks
<Fujitsu> I'll reopen the existing one, then.
<phanatic> hi raphink
<raphink> hi phanatic
<Toadstool> siretart: around?
<Toadstool> yay! first MOTU mentor mail :)
<siretart> Toadstool: yes? (but at work)
<Toadstool> siretart: hi, I've made a patch for revu1: http://revu.tauware.de/index.py or index.py?archived=false -> shows only current uploads and index.py?archived=true shows archived uploads (with a link to the other page on each one)
<Toadstool> Gloubiboulga and I think the page is far too long ;)
<Toadstool> if you're interested in applying the patch, I've published my branch at http://resel.fr/~jcorbier/revu1/
<siretart> Toadstool: wow. I definitly am interested in any patches
<Toadstool> cool :)
<siretart> Toadstool: yes, you're right. splitting the page is a good idea
<Fujitsu> Yeah, it's horrifically long at the moment.
<siretart> Toadstool: one thing: Perhaps we should provide a link to show archived uploads at the main page, no?
<siretart> I don't see that link in your diff
<Toadstool> er just under the <h2>...</h2> no?
<siretart> arg, my bad. you're right
<Toadstool> :)
<siretart> I can't apply it right now, because the production revu is still running as a svn checkout. I have moving it to a bzr checkout on my list, and when thats done, I will include your patch
<Toadstool> ok, cool
<Toadstool> thanks :)
<TheMuso> Hey Hobbsee.
<Hobbsee> hi TheMuso
<TheMuso> Night folks
<Hobbsee> night TheMuso
<bddebian> Heya gang
<dholbach> how are we going to deal with pitti's "get your packages sponsored" proposal?
<bddebian> Deal with it?
* Nafallo thinks it is easier to ping folks at IRC ;-)
<bddebian> Hi dholbach :-)
<Nafallo> hi bddebian :-)
<bddebian> Heya Nafallo
* bddebian would be happy if his sync requests would get done ATM.. :)
<dholbach> we have the 'motureviewers' team everywhere
<dholbach> and a mailing list for it
<bddebian> dholbach: ?
<dholbach> ubuntu-universe-sponsors  and  motureviewers  are slightly redundant, no?
<bddebian> Well motureviewers are for MOTU-wannabe sponsored uploads for Universe, no?
<dholbach> and ubuntu-universe-sponsors?
<bddebian> dholbach: I'm not sure, is that the one they want to set up for MOTUs to get main uploads sponsored?
<dholbach> no
<dholbach> but i'm happier if there's one process we have to document
<bddebian> Oh, hmm, I don't know then :-)
<dholbach> :)
* bddebian is always clueless
<Nafallo> dholbach: for people that have lost their gpg-keys?
<dholbach> Nafallo: and for everybody not being an uploader to ubuntu yet
<Nafallo> I think it is redundant then...
<dholbach> we could close down the motureviewers team and stop the mailing list also - it kept on getting a lot of spam
<bddebian> dholbach: Yeah, I would drop ubuntu-universe-sponsors
<Nafallo> indeed
<Nafallo> that's the new kid, so have less mindshare.
<dholbach> i would do it otherwise, for having correlation between the team names and the list got more spam than bug mails :/
<Nafallo> well... spamfilter anyone? :-)
<bddebian> dholbach: Aren't you the boss?  Do what you want. ;-P
<dholbach> hahahaha
<dholbach> far from it ;)
<bddebian> dholbach: Well who IS the boss for MOTUs? :-)
<dholbach> the MOTUs :)
<bddebian> Scary
<Nafallo> lol
* schultmc waves @ fryfrog
<fryfrog> hi sirs, i have been told by a debian package guy that this would be the chan to dicuss...
<fryfrog> zomg
<fryfrog> he is here ;p
<fryfrog> So anyway, Gallery 2 in debian is nice and current, ubuntu it is... not
<fryfrog> it'd be super-awsome if that could be resolved :)
<fryfrog> it'd be pretty groovy if i wasn't talking to myself too :)
<bddebian> fryfrog: What is the acutal package name?
* Nafallo looks at bddebian
<schultmc> bddebian: gallery2
<fryfrog> gallery2 :)
<schultmc> if I was a MOTU I could handle this myself :)
<fryfrog> wait wait, if you were He-Man?
<schultmc> heh
<schultmc> by the power of Greyskull, I have the power!
<Nafallo> hehe
* Nafallo has that power, but rarely uses it ;-)
<Nafallo> when I DO upload something it's mostly main anyway :-P
* schultmc <3 Ubuntu and would like to help out
<Nafallo> and I can't do that without a proxy-person :-P
<bddebian> fryfrog: Are you taling about Dapper?
<Nafallo> s/Dapper/6.06 LTS/g
<Nafallo> :-)
<fryfrog> yes, 6.06
<fryfrog> specifically, i am gooving around in the server install right now
<Nafallo> 6.06 is frozen. like sarge in debian :-).
<nexu> what does LTS stands for anyway ?
<bddebian> fryfrog: The only way to get that done would be to request a backport on Launchpad.  Debian and Ubuntu are in sync for Edgy
<schultmc> Long Term Support
<nexu> whats is the big deal about it ?
<Nafallo> nexu: 3 year security on the desktop
<Nafallo> nexu: 5 year on the server...
<Nafallo> so LTS :-)
<fryfrog> Nafallo: I'm sorry, i don't understand?  Frozen?  Every day or three, I do an "apt-get update" and there are updated packages?
<fryfrog> Nafallo: is it not reasonable to go from Gallery2 2.0.2 -> Gallery 2 2.1.1?
<fryfrog> Nafallo: if that is the case, its okay cause I can work around it just fine
<fryfrog> my thought was that I could get Gallery2 package in ubuntu updated *and* make things easier in this silly vmware appliance
<fryfrog> but i can do the same with svn, it just won't help ubuntu at all
<nexu> Nafallo: heh
<Nafallo> fryfrog: security updates and other hi-urgency packages
<nexu> Nafallo: i wonder or they'll keep their word on it and how they'll realize it
<nexu> User X: "i need to run app Y and it doesnt work on 6.06 LTS"
<fryfrog> nexu: what do you mean?  assuming they don't just... disappear, seems pretty easy to provide support
<nexu> well, or they 'll just tell the users to upgrade
<nexu> or something
<fryfrog> they support *ubuntus* stuff on it
<Nafallo> main+restricted
<Nafallo> nexu: does app Y exist in ubuntu? :-)
<Nafallo> nexu: where ubuntu is main + restricted ;-)
<nexu> ow noes it doesnt! there goes my support ;-(
<fryfrog> ?
<fryfrog> nexu: isn't that a bit retarded?
<nexu> kinda, i was joking anyway
<fryfrog> nexu: does MS offer support for adobe photoshop?
<fryfrog> oh :)
<fryfrog> ;p
<Nafallo> but then again. we motus can probably upload some of that fixes to dapper-updates if needed to :-)
<nexu> hence the ;-(
<Nafallo> like I already uploaded the gajim bugfix release :-)
<bddebian> Nafallo: But those have to get approved don't they?
<Nafallo> bddebian: yes, Kamion etc... :-)
<Chons> hi. as the task list on the wiki is pretty empty and I would like to contribute, I wonder where to start.
<LaserJock> Chons: do you know how to create source packages?
<Chons> not yet, I am working on that
<LaserJock> Chons: cool
* schultmc knows how to create source packages and would also like to help
<LaserJock> schultmc: cool
<LaserJock> right now I think mostly we are working on getting all the packages in Edgy updated/merged from Debian unstable
<LaserJock> as well as doing bug fixes
<kozz> what is the number before the : good for in package version? like kdebase-bin has 4:3.5.4-0ubuntu1, the 4 there
<schultmc> kozz: that's an epoch
<schultmc> if you increase an epoch, it makes it so you can install a lower version instead
<fryfrog> haha, what is an epcoh?
<fryfrog> oh
<schultmc> like 3:1.0 can install over 2:2.0
<kozz> as I though actually, but thanks
<kozz> good to be certain
<tristanbob_> are there any Ubuntu projects that involve security compliance checking - something similar to Microsoft Baseline Analyzer?  I am interested in enforcing network admission control.
<tristanbob_> making sure the system packages are up to date, etc.
<Yagisan> tristanbob_, use an app such as nessus
<tristanbob_> right, that is great for external scanning
<tristanbob_> but a client could provide more visibility to internal status
<tristanbob_> I was trying to find a #ubuntu-security to ask them, but I didn't see one
<lucas> tristanbob_: I personnally run a cron job to check that my system is up to date
<tristanbob_> lucas: that is also a great idea - however I would like to find a client that can report the status of security updates, and inform the network device of the status
<tristanbob_> that way a non-conforming end-station can be isolated and directed to remediation
<dholbach> good night everybody
<LaserJock> good night dholbach
<dholbach> night laser
<dholbach> LaserJock :)
<Sp4rKy> hi
<Sp4rKy> what's the syntaxe for add an url to a manpage ?
<Sp4rKy> with direct link to the real adress
#ubuntu-motu 2006-08-08
<bmonty> did any edgy automake packages get changed recently?
<crimsun> just the usual sync from Sid
<bmonty> crimsun: does 10 Jul sound right to you for the last upload?  I built a package in a pbuilder the other day with no problems, and now it FTBFS because of a syntax error in a Makefile.
<crimsun> bmonty: of which source package?
<bmonty> crimsun: I figure it has to be autoconf or make
<crimsun> I know autoconf 2.60 has a few transition features; I'm not aware of any for automake.
<crimsun> automake1.x ^
<bmonty> hmmm, looks like debian had a similar problem, but it magically went away
<crimsun> if by "magically" you mean packages had to be fixed ;)
<bmonty> crimsun: no, I mean the package FTBFS, but then started building for some unknown reason (package is seq24)
<crimsun> if it built successfully today but failed earlier, it's probably due to the mass give-back
<crimsun> (I haven't looked at its LP page)
<bmonty> It doesn't appear to have built successfully on the buildds, but I know it build in my pbuilder on Saturday
<crimsun> please do not feed the troll in -devel.
<LaserJock> sorry
<LaserJock> I just thought that was really funny
<LaserJock> I think that was the funniest thing I've read today
<nixternal> LOL
<LaserJock> wahooo, chuck the kernel cause there are too many distros ;-)
<Fujitsu> Yeah, it was quite funny.
<jdmpike_> are there mirrors for http://archive.ubuntu.com and http://security.ubuntu.com
<jdmpike_> I am not able to pull from them - my downloads timeout
<Hawkwind> Yes
<Hawkwind> Look on the wiki and search for 'Mirrors'
<Fujitsu> Not of security.
<zul> oh microsoft how i spit in your face
<bddebian> Heya gang
<bmonty> hi bddebian
* Kyral_Laptop kisses bddebian
<bddebian> Hi bmonty, Kyral_Laptop
<bddebian> Uhm Kyral_Laptop? :)
<bddebian> Heya Gloubiboulga
<Kyral_Laptop> I'm a litttle tipsy
<bddebian> Ah :-)
<bmonty> good night everyone
<Kyral_Laptop> hic
<bmonty> :)
<zul> yeah irc and drinking is a good mix
<Kyral_Laptop> yeeeapapapapa
<Gloubiboulga> hello MOTU world
<Gloubiboulga> hi bddebian :)
<bddebian> Gnight bmonty_away
<LaserJock> hiya bddebian
<bddebian> Hi LaserJock
<[cro] smiley> hi all
<bddebian> Hello [cro] smiley
<[cro] smiley> i have an application that i would like to be included in ubuntu repository if its possible. Here is project page: http://timesaver.sourceforge.net and deb package is here: http://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php?group_id=170378&package_id=194451
<LaserJock> [cro] smiley: do you know if there is a source package for that .deb? a .deb alone isn't helpful for us
<[cro] smiley> yes
<[cro] smiley> there is at the same adress
<[cro] smiley> both deb and tar.gz with sources
<LaserJock> well, the the tar.gz isn't the source package
<LaserJock> that's the source tarball which is a bit different
<[cro] smiley> LaserJock, ok what do i need then?
<[cro] smiley> i made deb using just that tarball
<[cro] smiley> at least that is what i read in a thread about making debs for ubuntu at ubuntuforums.org
<[cro] smiley> this thread: http://www.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=51003
<LaserJock> use dpkg-buildpackage -S -rfakeroot
<[cro] smiley> i did...
<LaserJock> instead of dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot
<[cro] smiley> atually i think i used sudo
<LaserJock> you don't want to do that
<[cro] smiley> ok
<LaserJock> [cro] smiley: the source package is the .diff.gz .dsc and .orig.tar.gz files
<[cro] smiley> LaserJock, so i just need to rename it or what?
<LaserJock> do you hve those files?
<[cro] smiley> LaserJock,  i mead its mine project at least i know its sources or? :)
<[cro] smiley> *mean
<LaserJock> source package != source tarball
<[cro] smiley> what is the difference except name, that would help me a bit you know....
<LaserJock> well the source package
<LaserJock> is 3 files
<LaserJock> the .diff.gz (which holds the diff to the tarball)
<LaserJock> the .dsc which is the description file
<LaserJock> and the .orig.tar.gz which is the source tarball
<[cro] smiley> and way to make source package would be ?
<LaserJock> dpkg-buildpackage
<micahcowan> [cro] smiley, does your original tarball have a debian/ directory in it, or did you add it after, just to make a .deb (which is better)?
<LaserJock> you should have one
<[cro] smiley> oh now i know, sorry....
<[cro] smiley> i have those
<[cro] smiley> do you need dsc.asc?
<LaserJock> no
<LaserJock> that file usually exists if you didn't sign the .dsc file
<[cro] smiley> so i put those 3 files in a package right?
<Hobbsee> hi all
<micahcowan> Hi Hobbsee. :-)
<LaserJock> [cro] smiley: no
<Kyral_Laptop> Hobbsee *drunken swagger*
<[cro] smiley> LaserJock, ok
<micahcowan> [cro] smiley, nope, those 3 files /are/ the "source package"
<Hobbsee> hi micahcowan, Kyral_Laptop
<Hobbsee> Kyral_Laptop: heh.  scary
<[cro] smiley> micahcowan, so i upload that separattely
<[cro] smiley> *them
<micahcowan> I think you get someone (LaserJock?) to upload/sponsor for you?
<LaserJock> [cro] smiley: well, if want to get the package reviewed you upload to our REVU server with dput
<bddebian> Heya Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> hi bddebian
<LaserJock> [cro] smiley: take a look at wiki.ubuntu.com/REVU
<Hobbsee> hi LaserJock
<LaserJock> hi Hobbsee
<LaserJock> how's it going?
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: good, i dont think i took in a word of that electronics lecture :P
* Hobbsee had better make sure she doesnt get arrested today.
<Hobbsee> s/arrested/pulled over, etc/
<micahcowan> Shouldn't Kyral_Laptop be the one worrying? :)
<Kyral_Laptop> huh?
<micahcowan> what with all the swaggering...
<Kyral_Laptop> wha?
<Kyral_Laptop> Oh I'm faking
<bddebian> Bah, I'm going to bed.  Gnight folks
<[cro] smiley> LaserJock, i looked at REVU and now i have created a gpg key and uploaded it to keyserver.ubuntu.com
<[cro] smiley> , what do i do next?
<[cro] smiley> sorry for asking but i seem to lost the guidelines...
<LaserJock> [cro] smiley: do you have a Launchpad account?
<[cro] smiley> LaserJock, yes
<LaserJock> [cro] smiley: add you gpg key to your launchpad page
<[cro] smiley> ok, i got it now...
<LaserJock> [cro] smiley: ok, now join the ubuntu-universe-contributors Launchpad team
<LaserJock> https://launchpad.net/people/ubuntu-universe-contributors/+join
<[cro] smiley> LaserJock, no i said i understand, ill be done in a minute ;)
<LaserJock> oh, sorry
<[cro] smiley> np
<[cro] smiley> just done adding gpg key to launchpad, this one of most exciting things ever done :)
<[cro] smiley> joined the team :)
<ajmitch> LaserJock: you don't have revu admin access, do you?
* ajmitch will sync the keyring then
<[cro] smiley> LaserJock, i don't think i have
<[cro] smiley> oh sorry not for me
<ajmitch> once the keyring syncs you'll be able to upload to REVU
<ajmitch> please make sure you upload source-only packages, always with the orig.tar.gz
<[cro] smiley> ajmitch, ok thank you very much
<[cro] smiley> ajmitch, no problem
<ajmitch> after your first successful upload, you'll be able to retrieve the password on REVU, which is just used for logging in to comment on your uploads
<LaserJock> ajmitch: no I don't :-0
<ajmitch> LaserJock: keyring sync is almost done anyway
<ajmitch> it just breaks badly if 2 people do it at once
<[cro] smiley> ajmitch, so i upload does 3 files mentioned above, right?
<[cro] smiley> just to check
<ajmitch> [cro] smiley: dput revu package_version_source.changes
<ajmitch> dput will take care of uploading what it needs
<[cro] smiley> oh, ok then
<caleb-> Hello. Is there any official channel for backporting? I want to ask backporting issue about edgy to dapper.
<crimsun> generally, this one.
<caleb-> crimsun: GTK2 of edgy has migrated to 2.10.0, and /usr/lib/gtk2.0/2.4.0 changed to /usr/lib/gtk2.0/2.10.0. All GTK immodules will be in 2.10.0/immodules, which will not be found in dapper.
<caleb-> crimsun: I am maintainer of gcin, and gcin was approved to be backported. I wonder if I must do something for this...maybe add a 2.4.0 link point to 2.10.0?
<[cro] smiley> ajmitch, i have a problem i cant find *_source.changes, i only have: diff.gz, dsc, orig.tar.gz and deb
<ajmitch> how did you build the package?
<ajmitch> you should use debuild -S -sa, or dpkg-buildpackage -S -sa
<[cro] smiley> i try but says: gpg: [stdin] : clearsign failed: secret key not available
<crimsun> caleb-: the backport from edgy will be built against dapper+dapper-security+dapper-updates. Is there any reason you'd need to adjust anything for GTK+ 2.8.x?
<[cro] smiley> WARNING: unsafe ownership on configuration file `/home/smiley/.gnupg/gpg.conf'
<[cro] smiley> should i changa ownership or what?
<[cro] smiley> *change
<ajmitch> does the name & email address you put in debian/changelog match that on your key?
<[cro] smiley> yep
<ajmitch> try with debuild -S -sa -kD7984D11
<[cro] smiley> cp: cannot remove `config.sub': Permission denied
<ajmitch> something for you to fix - it was probably built as root at some point
<LaserJock> do you create the source package with sudo
<LaserJock> s/do/did/
<[cro] smiley> all fixed
<ajmitch> great
<[cro] smiley> _source.changes and _source.build appeared
<caleb-> crimsun: GTK immodules needs /usr/sbin/update-gtk-immodules to update immodule data. If immodules was put in 2.10.0 directory, dapper's update-gtk-immodules will not find them.
<ajmitch> iirc, revu is in the default dput configuration, so you should be able to just use dput revu package_version_source.changes
<ajmitch> whatever the name & version may be :)
<caleb-> crimsun: I have disscussed with seb128(maintainer of gtk2), but he said that is backport-team's problem.
<[cro] smiley> ajmitch, uploading .... :)
<caleb-> crimsun: https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/gtk+2.0/+bug/54956
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 54956 in gtk+2.0 "Wrong path name 2.10.0, should be 2.4.0 for back-compatibility" [Untriaged,Rejected] 
<[cro] smiley> Successfully uploaded packages.
<[cro] smiley>  :)
<[cro] smiley> says not running dinstall is this ok?
* ajmitch doesn't see them in the revu queue
<[cro] smiley> name is tsaver_0.4-0ubuntu1
<ajmitch> ah yes, it's there
<[cro] smiley> yipeeee
<ajmitch> it's a rather large .diff
<caleb-> crimsun: I can add a link in gcin, then gtk2 needs not change. I just wonder if I have to upload a new gcin, or just let backport team to work?
<[cro] smiley> ls
<ajmitch> [cro] smiley: I suggest you target edgy rather than breezy
<ajmitch> also remove the .ex files in debian/
<crimsun> caleb-: if it's backported, why are you concerned about GTK+ 2.10?
<ajmitch> since they are examples only
<[cro] smiley> ok
<ajmitch> that's the majority of the .diff.gz
<[cro] smiley> ok
<ajmitch> also, clean up any unused #dh_* commands in debian/rules
<caleb-> crimsun: It is approved for backport, but not backported yet. A CJK member told me that backport was done by machine automatically.
<ajmitch> [cro] smiley: debian/cron.d.ex will need renamed to debian/cron.d to be used
<caleb-> crimsun: If that is true, then machine-made-backport will not work in dapper. It needs a 2.4.0 link to 2.10.0.
<crimsun> caleb-: the source packages are uploaded manually and built by buildds, yes.
<[cro] smiley> ok, im writing all down
<caleb-> crimsun: OK. So I have to upload a new release for this issue. Thank you. :-)
<ajmitch> [cro] smiley: sorry, I should put this in comments on REVU :)
<crimsun> caleb-: is this link a problem in dapper-updates's GTK+ 2.8.20?
<[cro] smiley> ajmitch, well its ok
<caleb-> crimsun: No. Debian / Ubuntu GTK 2.4 to 2.8 all uses 2.4.0 for compatibility.
<ajmitch> [cro] smiley: I've put the comments from irc on revu
<crimsun> caleb-: so why are you concerned about 2.10?
<caleb-> crimsun: 2.10 in edgy broke this back-compatibility. It uses 2.10.0 instead 2.4.0.
<crimsun> caleb-: Dapper doesn't have 2.10, therefore gcin will not be compiled against 2.10
<[cro] smiley> ajmitch, can you check dependencies, it depends on wxwidgets but i'm not shure if i did list them right...
<ajmitch> [cro] smiley: dpkg-gencontrol: warning: can't parse dependency binu tils (>= 2.16.1-2ubuntu6 )
<crimsun> caleb-: your newer version of gcin will be compiled against GTK+ 2.8.20
<ajmitch> looks to be an added space there
<caleb-> crimsun: gcin can work ok with gtk 2.4 to 2.10. That build-limitation is added by GTK2's maintainer.
<ajmitch> [cro] smiley: unless you really need things to be specific versions, you don't need to build-depend on anything in build-essential
<caleb-> crimsun: It is ok. gcin works smoothly in hoary / breezy / dapper / edgy.
<ajmitch> [cro] smiley: also the binary package should not need automake & autoconf as dependencies - at most they should be build-depends
<ajmitch> most of the Depends: line is not needed
<[cro] smiley> ajmitch, ok, if you can tell me what should i leave
<[cro] smiley> ok
<ajmitch> ${shlibs:Depends}
<[cro] smiley> when do i execute that?
<ajmitch> in Depends:
<[cro] smiley> ah ok
<ajmitch> you won't need all those wx packages in Build-Depends
<[cro] smiley> where then
<ajmitch> probably just libwxgtk2.6-dev
<[cro] smiley> ok
<[cro] smiley> ajmitch, can you comment all this please just to be shure
<ajmitch> done
<[cro] smiley> thx
<ajmitch> though it's 3 separate comments on revu now :)
<[cro] smiley> i see, will be ok
<[cro] smiley> ajmitch, so is that all, did you try to install?
<ajmitch> no, that was just from 2 minutes of looking at the diff
<ajmitch> and the build log - it failed to build due to the space in binutils, which doesn't need to be there
<[cro] smiley> so i have to fix that to continue checking or?
<ajmitch> yep
<ajmitch> someone else will hopefully pick up & do reviewing
<[cro] smiley> ok, and who finally ads it to repos if all goes well?
<ajmitch> one of the MOTUs
<ajmitch> once it gets advocated by 2 MOTUs
<[cro] smiley> i just wait
<[cro] smiley> ?
<ajmitch> yes, fix what you can, upload, and get comments
<[cro] smiley> nice, well thanx for all the help it really means a lot
<caleb-> [cro] smiley: Contents in README.Debian looks a bit poor. If you have no important messages specific for Debian / Ubuntu users, you may remove that file.
<caleb-> [cro] smiley: Upload a modified and clean diff will make it enter into Ubuntu more easily.
<[cro] smiley> caleb-, i'm working on it
<Lathiat_> has anyone else noticed trouble with select copying and pasting in dapper
<Lathiat_> i often find my newlines disappearing
<Lathiat_> pasting from both firefox & terminals to both irssi & gaim
<[cro] smiley> caleb-, packages uploaded
<[cro] smiley> i have put tsaver new packages at revu that need to be reviewed
<caleb-> [cro] smiley: It seems not updated yet. It may needs 5 minutes.
<[cro] smiley> caleb-, ok it said: Successfully uploaded packages.
<caleb-> [cro] smiley: changelog should for edgy, and * Initial release.
<caleb-> [cro] smiley: compat should be 5, not 4.
<caleb-> [cro] smiley: dirs is not needed in most situation.
<caleb-> [cro] smiley: Build-Depends should have debhelper, because your rules uses them.
<caleb-> [cro] smiley: Standards-Version should newer.
<caleb-> [cro] smiley: Long description includes short description. It is better have some
<caleb-> [cro] smiley: linefeed in long description.
<caleb-> [cro] smiley: manpage should be tsaver.1 or something.
<caleb-> [cro] smiley: manpage.sgml.ex is not needed.
<caleb-> [cro] smiley: You may use lintian or linda to check your new diff and debs. Use those commands in edgy.
<[cro] smiley> caleb-, what do you mean by: It is better have some linefeed in long description?
<caleb-> [cro] smiley: Your long description in control is too lone for a 80x24 terminal.
<[cro] smiley> oh i see
<[cro] smiley> no problem
<caleb-> [cro] smiley: It still have some tiny problems. But I think you may fix these first.
<[cro] smiley> ok
<[cro] smiley> caleb-, is this ok: * ubuntu linux package for Edgy Eft
<[cro] smiley> in changelog
<crimsun> "Initial release." is fine
<[cro] smiley> just that?
<caleb-> [cro] smiley: tsaver (0.4-0ubuntu1) edgy; urgency=low
<crimsun> it'll be pretty obvious that it's for ubuntu edgy
<[cro] smiley> and why does it have to be edgy if i may ask?
<crimsun> because edgy is the current dev branch.
<[cro] smiley> remove dirs?
<crimsun> if you don't use it, remove it
<[cro] smiley> and what should i do about Standards-Version
<crimsun> (I haven't looked at it on REVU)
<crimsun> it should be the latest according to Policy
<crimsun> of course you need to verify first that it meets Policy
<[cro] smiley> hm, that doesn't tells me much
<crimsun> apt-cache policy debian-policy
<crimsun> [and of course, http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ ] 
<caleb-> [cro] smiley: Standards-Version is not that important. You may fix it later.
<caleb-> [cro] smiley: check your debs and diff with lintian. It helps very much.
<[cro] smiley> caleb-, ok
<[cro] smiley> lintian say only: W: tsaver source: out-of-date-standards-version 3.6.1
<[cro] smiley> well i think i fixed all mentioned above, I'm putting it up for third time...
<crimsun> upid?
<[cro] smiley> crimsun, sorry what?
<crimsun> the URL.
<[cro] smiley> what url
<ajmitch> crimsun: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2852
<ajmitch> ah, there's been another one
<ajmitch> 2853 then
<crimsun> thanks, ajmitch
<[cro] smiley> oh, sorry i know now
<[cro] smiley> still uploading...
<[cro] smiley> it is there now
<caleb-> [cro] smiley: Your tarball has no its own manpage? Those files in diff.gz should put in debian/, unless you want to patch source.
<caleb-> [cro] smiley: for example, tsaver.1 should be put in debian/tsaver.1
<[cro] smiley> no problem
<Toadstool> 'morning
<crimsun> Section: Utilities
<crimsun> Description: TimeSaver is simple time management application.
<crimsun> debian/copyright:Copyright needs date{,s}
<crimsun> you generally should include the GPL preamble
<[cro] smiley> ok, but what about section and descriptio?
<crimsun> tsaver.1: +.TH TSAVER SECTION "August  1, 2006"
<crimsun> note template SECTION
<crimsun> Section: utils
<crimsun> Description: a simple time management application
<[cro] smiley> ok
<crimsun> or just drop the article completely
<crimsun> Description: simple time management application
<ajmitch> it should generally be read as 'package is a'...
<ajmitch> so yes, drop the article
<[cro] smiley> where does .TH TSAVER SECTION "August  1, 2006" go?
<[cro] smiley> what line in tsaver.1
<caleb-> [cro] smiley: depend_script is useless I think.
<[cro] smiley> caleb-, yes you are right i used it for filling the dependencies in control
<ajmitch> [cro] smiley: that's what ${shlibs:Depends} is for
<crimsun> [cro] smiley: the line placement is fine in the man page. You just left in the template SECTION without changing it.
<[cro] smiley> yes, i didn't know, i was following ubuntuforums.org example as i said before
<caleb-> [cro] smiley: make install creates essential directories, so debian/dirs is not needed.
<[cro] smiley> ok
<caleb-> [cro] smiley: or you will have a useless /usr/sbin directory in your deb
<caleb-> [cro] smiley: Most problems are resolved. Others needs MOTU to review.
<[cro] smiley> caleb-, so is it possible to install it?
<[cro] smiley> crimsun, so can i replace SECTION with 1
<caleb-> [cro] smiley: You have not tried it? I am under win32 in work. I can not build it now...
<[cro] smiley> caleb-, well not this modifed version
<[cro] smiley> i tried one i made myself only
* caleb- My country is slave of Micro$oft. :(
<carthik> caleb-, but you are free
<carthik> my University has sold out too
<crimsun> [cro] smiley: sure
<carthik> and all the sysadmins would lose jobs if they moved off of Microsoft
<[cro] smiley> crimsun, do i also replace the NAME?
<[cro] smiley> crimsun, in .SH NAME
<caleb-> [cro] smiley: Your are the upstream author? If your put the manpage in next release, then you do not have it in *.diff.hz :)
<[cro] smiley> caleb-, yes i'm the author, and what should i do about manpage, i don't understand?
<[cro] smiley> what should i do about copyright?
<caleb-> [cro] smiley: debian / ubuntu do not change upstream tarball unless they have non-free data.
<[cro] smiley> where do i need a date?
<caleb-> [cro] smiley: http://revu.tauware.de/revu1-incoming/gcin-0606170225/gcin-1.2.0/debian/copyright # a example of copyright file
<caleb-> [cro] smiley: It is debian's traditional style. It is not the best version, though.
<[cro] smiley> is my licence text ok, or do i have to copy /usr/share/common-licenses/GPL
<caleb-> [cro] smiley: list 3 or 4 paragraph in copyright, and leave a message point to /usr/share/common-licenses/GPL
<caleb-> [cro] smiley: You may leave this issue unfixed. Wait MOTU to comment.
<[cro] smiley> ok
<caleb-> [cro] smiley: make sure all files in diff.gz is under debian/, and make sure lintian and linda are happy. Then wait for MOTUs. :-)
<[cro] smiley> fourth upload on the way...
<[cro] smiley> linda and lintian are now complaining, please help: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2854
<[cro] smiley> sorry: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2855
<caleb-> [cro] smiley: It is just about debhelper's version.
<[cro] smiley> caleb-, i don't think so
<caleb-> [cro] smiley: Grossly it looks fine now.
<[cro] smiley> http://revu.tauware.de/revu1-incoming/tsaver-0608080245/lintian
<[cro] smiley> or am i looking at the wrong one
<caleb-> [cro] smiley: edgy is not a traditional debian release name. It is normal for you.
<caleb-> [cro] smiley: Build a new deb using current diff file, and check deb by lintian / linda.
<caleb-> [cro] smiley: And a bad news...I think edgy is freeze for upstream now. Your package may wait for edgy+1 to enter ubuntu.
<caleb-> [cro] smiley: Unless some core team member want to upload the package for you.
<[cro] smiley> and when is edgy+1
<crimsun> eh, new for universe is fine
<caleb-> [cro] smiley: April 2007 I think.
<[cro] smiley> not soon
<crimsun> this doesn't at all need to go into main
<ajmitch> universe is not frozen
<caleb-> Oh. sorry. :P
<ajmitch> new apps are accepted until late september, iirc
<ajmitch> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/EdgyReleaseSchedule
<ajmitch> Universe freezes sept 28th
* caleb- is stupid. :P
<[cro] smiley> can i change debian/compat back to 4, i think this is a problem?
<ajmitch> no, you probably just heard about main's UVF
<ajmitch> hey dholbach
<ajmitch> [cro] smiley: having it at 5 is no problem if you build-depend on debhelper (>= 5.0.0)
<dholbach> good morning
<dholbach> ajmitch: hey andrew
<[cro] smiley> ajmitch, sounds like someone forgot to mention that :)
<[cro] smiley> and is debhelper >= 5.0.0 available at all?
<dholbach> 5.0.37.3ubuntu1
<dholbach> that's what we have in ubuntu atm
<dholbach> (edgy)
<[cro] smiley> thx
<[cro] smiley> i hope this is the last upload, must get some sleep
<[cro] smiley> seems ok now, now is all to MOTUs, and Im going to sleep
<[cro] smiley> night guys and thanks for all the fish ;)
<ajmitch> night [cro] smiley
<Hobbsee> hi all
<ajmitch> hello Hobbsee
<TheMuso> Hey Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> hi TheMuso :)
<ajmitch> hi TheMuso
<TheMuso> Hey ajmitch.
<kagou> hi
<cbx33> hi guys
<cbx33> when installing phpmyadmin, should I just be able to browse to localhost/phpmyadmin
<cbx33> or do I need to set stuff up manually
<TheMuso> cbx33: #ubuntu
<cbx33> TheMuso: fixed it now
<phanatic> hello
<TheMuso> Does one have to subscribe a specific MOTU related team to get a sync request confirmation examined?
<ajmitch> motureviewers *may* work
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: i'm assuming it's the universe team that you used before.
<Hobbsee> or just poke someone here, i guess
<ajmitch> if MOTUs are willing to check that list for syncs pending
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: might be offering :P
<ajmitch> Hobbsee is a MOTU
<TheMuso> I know that.
<ajmitch> Hobbsee can do all
<ajmitch> no need to subscribe anything :)
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: i just uploaded one of his bits.  it's your turn nwo :P
<ajmitch> I'm busy updating stuff in main
<TheMuso> heh
<TheMuso> Tis fine guys. I shan't depend on you for too much longer.
<ajmitch> swearing at upstream, etc
<TheMuso> I intend to go for MOTU as soon as I can get my key signed by someone who is part of a strong set.
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: haha
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: stevenk can sign it, i expect
<StevenK> I so can't.
<TheMuso> heh
<Hobbsee> StevenK: why not?  ajmitch signed yours?
<zul> ajmitch is not strong enough physically oh wait...you are talking keys,
* StevenK denies everything.
<ajmitch> watch it zul
<zul> hehe..
<zul> hi ajmitch
<ajmitch> hello
<StevenK> TheMuso: If you're free during the day, you can bug me at work and we can lunch together.
<TheMuso> StevenK: I'll think about it. There is one problem however, one which I had an interesting time resolving when I had to get my key signed to look a bit better when signing the coc.
* TheMuso waits to see if anybody can guess what that was.
<StevenK> TheMuso: Verifying the other party
<TheMuso> Yup.
<StevenK> Bart uses someone sighted who he trusts.
<Hobbsee> ah yes, that's a point.
<TheMuso> Thats what I had to do.
<StevenK> TheMuso: Dealing with blind people teaches you just how much people depend on sight.
<TheMuso> If I ever get around to setting up a blog, it is something that I will certainly blog about.
<TheMuso> I'll bet.
<neutrinomass> Generally speaking, is it a rule that no two patches can change the same function ? Because if they do, and you edit the first patch, then you might have to edit the second patch as well which might break something else etc. etc.
<siretart> neutrinomass: now you see why some ppl prefer a VCS over a patch system
<Hobbsee> hi siretart
<neutrinomass> siretart: True ...
<neutrinomass> And since we're at it, should bugs be filed against packages with unmet deps or will this be sorted automatically before release ?
<siretart> huhu Hobbsee!
<Hobbsee> neutrinomass: they usually have a script for that.  its' quicker to just fix it though, and get someone to upload it :)
<siretart> neutrinomass: I think bugs should be filed and tagged appropriately, so we can batch process them
<neutrinomass> OK OK, I'll file one ...(Hobbsee I already told you that I can't really fix stuff yet :P )
<Hobbsee> neutrinomass: you can learn to :P
<Hobbsee> neutrinomass: what package, and what's the fixed build dep?
<neutrinomass> bug 55666
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 55666 in moodss "[UNMETDEPS]  moodss has unmet dependencies" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/55666
<phanatic> cool bugno :)
<neutrinomass> Hobbsee: I just finished the patching tute, searching the wiki for more reading material
<siretart> do we already have a tag for unmet deps?
<neutrinomass> siretart: I looked a little bit at the ones in the /topic but they had no tags ...
<ajmitch> siretart: tags seem to get added at random by users
<siretart> neutrinomass: perhaps we should start compiling a list of proposed tags
<siretart> huhu ajmitch
<ajmitch> hi :)
<neutrinomass> siretart: There's some discussion on the -devel mailing list, isn't there ?
<siretart> neutrinomass: yes, dholbach started it. I'm following that thread
<TheMuso> Night folks
<ajmitch> night TheMuso
<neutrinomass> Um.. what does dh_desktop do exactly? Is it required whenever installing a .desktop (I looked at the man page but it didn't really elaborate )
<bddebian> Heya gang
<StevenK> neutrinomass: It takes care of modifying the postinst/prerm
<ajmitch> neutrinomass: it adds bits to the postinst/postrm to run update-desktop-database
<ajmitch> which is of course undocumented
<neutrinomass> ajmitch: Which means that it should be used whenever a .desktop is installed, right ? (Sorry, I'm very new to this )
<ajmitch> I think so
<neutrinomass> Actually, by grepping through gftp's and gerbv's debian/ directory, none of them use it :-/
<neutrinomass> And should the changelog be edited with a text editor or with dch ? (or does it make no difference? )
<Hobbsee> neutrinomass: it'd be in debian/rules
<neutrinomass> Hobbsee: I figured, but it isn't :-/
<Hobbsee> neutrinomass: and dch (with -i, if you want to increment the changelog) effectively adds bits to the changelog, and opens it in your favorite text editor.
<Hobbsee> neutrinomass: it's quicker to do dch
<neutrinomass> Hobbsee: ok, thanks
<Hobbsee> neutrinomass: ah.  does the package happen to use cdbs?
<neutrinomass> Hobbsee: Um... not sure - it's got no gnome.mk in it though
<Hobbsee> neutrinomass: what do the first few lines of debian/rules say?
<Hobbsee> does it have something about includes?
<neutrinomass> Hobbsee: No, and there's no reference to cdbs in debian/control ...
<Hobbsee> neutrinomass: ah right.  how odd.
<Hobbsee> neutrinomass: doesnt use cdbs then :P
* neutrinomass isn't exactly sure what cdbs is but figured it should be mentioned in control if it's used :P
* neutrinomass is still busy reading tutorials
<Hobbsee> neutrinomass: you'd be right.  it's an alternate to debhelper
<Hobbsee> neutrinomass: anotehr build system
* StevenK whispers something evil in Hobbsee's ear.
<neutrinomass> Ok, thanks.
<tseng> get a room!
<Hobbsee> heh
<StevenK> tseng: I have one, thank you.
<StevenK> Hobbsee will know what I'm talking about.
<Hobbsee> !!!!!
<ubotu> I know nothing about !!!! - try searching http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi?db=ubuntu
<Hobbsee> oh now i do
<ajmitch> a certain 4 letter word, I presume
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: yeah, that's the one
<StevenK> Correct.
<Hobbsee> i had to think about that for a while.
<ajmitch> really?
<tseng> not really a word
<ajmitch> must be late for you :)
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: heh
<StevenK> ajmitch: Not as late as it is for you.
* Hobbsee shudders at the evil mention of the thing in her ear.
<ajmitch> yes, but I'm trying to fix xen stuff
<Hobbsee> evil...must...purge...all...evil......
<neutrinomass> According to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/NoDesktopFile though, if cdbs's gnome.mk is not used, dh_desktop must be called. :-/
<StevenK> Hobbsee: Heh, I'm sorry.
* Hobbsee goes off muttering about EVIL thigns.
<Hobbsee> s/thigns/things/
<zul> heh ajmitch does my bidding now
<ajmitch> yes master?
<Hobbsee> zul: nice work.  the mind control hats are working then :)
<Hobbsee> oh, wait, that was a school joke. darn.
<zul> Hobbsee: yes and when he does something wrong the hats have electrodes
<Hobbsee> zul: hehe, very nice.
<ajmitch> yay, pain1
<zul> ajmitch: it builds character
<ajmitch> and it's so much fun
<neutrinomass> bug 55356 - my first debiff - can somebody please take a look to see if it's OK ?
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 55356 in specimen "specimen has no .desktop file" [Untriaged,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/55356
<neutrinomass> Actually, it doens't look correct ( I didn't change all that), but I don't know what went wrong :(
<phanatic> pinging some reviewers: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2847 :)
<Gloubiboulga> phanatic, I'll have a look in 1 or 2 minutes :)
<phanatic> Gloubiboulga: thanks :)
<Gloubiboulga> phanatic, I'm not sure about the files in /usr/lib
<phanatic> Gloubiboulga: do you think they would be more appropriate in /usr/share/uck maybe?
<Gloubiboulga> phanatic, I think so
<phanatic> Gloubiboulga: okay. if there's nothing else, i'll update the package
<Gloubiboulga> and the watch seems a little buggy ;)
<phanatic> Gloubiboulga: maybe the guys changed the extension :) it has worked for 1.1, but 1.2 was just recently released (after the package was done btw) :)
<Gloubiboulga> gauvain@tiber:/var/revu/revu1-incoming/uck-0608070510/uck-1.2$ uscan
<Gloubiboulga> uck: remote site does not even have current version
<Gloubiboulga> I guess you're right ;)
<phanatic> Gloubiboulga: indeed. .tgz was changed to .tar.gz - consistency rulez :)
<Gloubiboulga> hehe
<phanatic> Gloubiboulga: just add that to your comment too, so i don't forget it ;)
<Gloubiboulga> phanatic, ok :)
<phanatic> Gloubiboulga: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2858
<Gloubiboulga> /me looks
<Gloubiboulga> phanatic, Cannot read file /usr/share/gfxboot/themes/Ubuntu/langlist, please check that you have package gfxboot-theme-ubuntu installed
<Gloubiboulga> I have this error when I try to run the guy
<phanatic> Gloubiboulga: gfxboot-theme-ubuntu should be a dependency...
<Gloubiboulga> and I have gfxboot-theme-ubuntu installed
<phanatic> oh, well
<phanatic> upstream bug :)
<phanatic> you running edgy i suppose...
<Gloubiboulga> did you test on edgy?
<Gloubiboulga> yes
<phanatic> okay
<phanatic> i'll tell the coders to dist-upgrade then :)
<Gloubiboulga> :)
<phanatic> Gloubiboulga: i'll come back to you when this is fixed :)
<Gloubiboulga> phanatic, ok :)
<Gloubiboulga> I'm off for tonight, I have a great book to read :)
<phanatic> Gloubiboulga: thank for your time, enjoy then :)
<Gloubiboulga> thanks phanatic, see you
<Whoopie_> Hi, just saw that there are two sync requests for xosd, bug 55660 and 55678. Am I allowed to mark one of these as a duplicate?
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 55660 in xosd "Sync request for xosd." [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/55660
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 55678 in Ubuntu "sync xosd 2.2.14-1.3 from sid (overriding changes OK)" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/55678
<zul> sounds good to me
<Whoopie_> zul: as a dev could you do it perhaps?
<zul> probably not right now since im at work
<Whoopie_> which one should I mark as a duplicate, the older or newer bug report?
<zul> which has more information?
<imbrandon> is one ack'd by a motu ?
<Whoopie_> no
<imbrandon> looking i would mark the first as a dupe and leave the one lucas filed
<imbrandon> as lucas is a MOTU
<lucas> oops
<Whoopie_> lucas: Hi! could you do it?
<imbrandon> hehe or have lucas just ACK the first one and then mark his as a dupe ;)
<imbrandon> either way the mans here now ;)
<imbrandon> heh
<lucas> imbrandon: done
<imbrandon> ;)
<bddebian> hahaha, my karma is 588,000+ now.. Oh brother :-)
<Toadstool> bddebian: wow, you rock! :)
<Toadstool> hi everybody
<azeem> bddebian: get davyd to integrate that into his GNOME thingy
<azeem> bddebian: http://davyd.livejournal.com/189538.html
<LaserJock> hmm, has anybody dist-upgraded from dapper to edgy recently?
<zul> nope i took the plunge earlier
<bddebian> Heya Toadstool
<bddebian> azeem: ?
<bddebian> azeem: Oh, hehe
<imbrandon> LaserJock: i did about 1.5  days ago on my ppc lappy
<imbrandon> this box though has been on edgy for a long time
<LaserJock> k
<imbrandon> problem ?
<LaserJock> well, at first I was just going to do a dist-upgrade
<LaserJock> but it wanted to do some funny things
<imbrandon> i'll tell you now though that you will have to dpkg --configure -a and rerun dist-upgrade a few times
<imbrandon> infact i had to remove oo.o and reinstall it once it was done
<LaserJock> I'm using ugrade-manager now
<imbrandon> atm its not a pretty process but you can get it done with no data loss
<imbrandon> cool
* imbrandon needs to win the lottery 
<LaserJock> me too
<LaserJock> I suppose
<imbrandon> heh
<LaserJock> I don't know that it would change much
<LaserJock> I'd probably get an AMD64 and a macbook pro
<LaserJock> and a new car
<imbrandon> me either cept i could afford all my toys i want
<imbrandon> yea heh
<LaserJock> but other then that, I'm not sure
<imbrandon> probbaly fund a few ( quite a few ) bounties lol
<LaserJock> yeah, that would be cool
<imbrandon> and a new computer lab and new car, but other than that yea pretty much the same
<LaserJock> i'd have to fund the "One Science app to rule them all" bounty ;-)
<imbrandon> heheh
<imbrandon> scibuntu lol
<LaserJock> heck yeah
<LaserJock> imbrandon: what archive mirror do you use?
<imbrandon> i have a local mirror i sync with archive. once an hour
<LaserJock> hmm archive seems almost dead
<imbrandon> old 333 mhz sitting in the closet ;)
<imbrandon> yea it runs about 30kb a sec for me most of the time , us. is a little faster but lags behind on updates sometimes
<LaserJock> and us.archive is giving me ~60K which will not due for an upgrade to edgy
<imbrandon> yea
<imbrandon> you could use mine but outside my network you'll be lucky to get 40kb sec
<imbrandon> LaserJock: more than welcome to try it though ( i386 , ppc and source only though no amd64 mirror ) http://72.135.8.5/ubuntu
<imbrandon> but like i said probbably wont get better than 35 - 40k outside my lan
<LaserJock> imbrandon: I'm getting ~ 1.4mps  now from Portland :-0
<LaserJock> :-) rather
<imbrandon> nice
<imbrandon> LaserJock: you got a fileserver on your lan ?
<LaserJock> I have no idea
<LaserJock> I'm at the uni
<imbrandon> if you have about 30gb on a file server i can help ya setup a local mirror ;)
<imbrandon> ahhh
<LaserJock> I should have a talk with the CS department
<imbrandon> yea really
<imbrandon> they would probably go for it as many use ubuntu now
<LaserJock> yeah
<imbrandon> hell i would use it when i'm in town ;)
<imbrandon> heh
<imbrandon> i need to make another trip out that way soonish
<LaserJock> yeah, and now that we have a lot more wireless on campus I could be sitting outside dist-upgrading away ;-)
<imbrandon> hrm i wonder if one of the uni's arround here mirror
<imbrandon> hehehe
<LaserJock> but what am I talking about, they put us Physical Chemists in the basement where we get no windows :-)
<LaserJock> sun light might hurt :-)
<imbrandon> or anywhere arround here for that matter, /me go's to look at the LP mirror page
<imbrandon> hahaha true
<imbrandon> hrm where is anl.gov ?
<LaserJock> I think that's close to Chicago
<imbrandon> hrm thats not too far, closer than protland for me
<imbrandon> but its +6 hours behind
<imbrandon> guess its better than the minisota mirror a week behind
<imbrandon> jes
<LaserJock> I just need to dist-upgrade and then I'll probably switch back to archive.ubuntu.com
* imbrandon is listening to "Gimme Back My Bullets" by Lynyrd Skynyrd [amaroK] 
<imbrandon> gah wrong key grrrr
* tseng dies a little
* imbrandon takes that out of the keymap
<imbrandon> tseng: ??
<tseng> when I was 16 I thought stuff like that was pretty rad
<imbrandon> heh yea, i forgot i had even maped that key
<imbrandon> to my windows key
<[cro] smiley> hi all
<imbrandon> hello
<[cro] smiley> i would like some of the motu to check this: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2856 ,thank you.
<[cro] smiley> *like to invite :)
<crimsun> that's you, imbrandon.
<imbrandon> hehe yea i'm looking
<imbrandon> moins crimsun
<bddebian> Heya crimsun, imbrandon
<imbrandon> heya bddebian
<crimsun> hi.
<imbrandon> only thing i see right off without knowing much about the pkg ( and not real exp revuing them ) is the standards version is a tad old
<imbrandon> ( for edgy )
<imbrandon> [cro] smiley: ^^
<crimsun> it should be 3.7.2 if you created it from scratch and followed Policy.
<[cro] smiley> i was told to leave that
<[cro] smiley> anyone wants to help me make that 3.7.2?
<crimsun> um, change the numbers
<[cro] smiley> hmm, only that? :)
<[cro] smiley> sounds too simple
<crimsun> no, certainly not. Did you check Policy to see if your package meets all its guidelines?
<[cro] smiley> no
<imbrandon> well you could loo at vi /usr/share/doc/debian-policy/upgrading-checklist.txt.gz and make sure
<imbrandon> it meets the new guidelines
<imbrandon> s/vi/<fav editor>
<imbrandon> other htan that though its looking ok to me , i dont see anything else that sticks out
<imbrandon> possibly ad the preamble to the debian/copyright ( and tell what version of the GPL its under )
<crimsun> (yep, all mentioned yesterday)
<[cro] smiley> is this ok:
<[cro] smiley> You are free to distribute this software under the terms of
<[cro] smiley>         the GNU General Public License (Version 2, June 1991).
<[cro] smiley>         On Debian systems, the complete text of the GNU General Public
<[cro] smiley>         License can be found in the file `/usr/share/common-licenses/GPL'.
<[cro] smiley> sorry for paste
<[cro] smiley> first line goes tab also, and without "sorry for paste" ;)
<imbrandon> [cro] smiley: have a look at http://revu.tauware.de/revu1-incoming/apt-mirror-0607130210/apt-mirror-0.4.4/debian/copyright
<crimsun> note that for all new source packages for universe, you need to make sure the GPL Preamble is actually up-to-date.
<[cro] smiley> ill just copy that one
<imbrandon> It was downloaded from <http://prdownloads.sourceforge.net/timesaver>  <-- shouldent that be the project website also ?
<imbrandon> crimsun: ^^
<crimsun> no, that URL is fine
<[cro] smiley> well i thougt it should be direct link
<imbrandon> okie
<crimsun> as long as it is easily navigable to a tarball, it's sufficient
<crimsun> note that "59 Temple Place - Suite 330, Boston, MA 02111-1307" is outdated
<crimsun> See http://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl.html for the current address
<imbrandon> gah yea i need to fix that ( and tell upstream heh )
<micahcowan> Someone want to draft an RFC for physical URNs?
<micahcowan> physical address URNs
<Sp4rKy> hi
<Sp4rKy> does anyone use chrpath ?
<Sp4rKy> i've put
<Sp4rKy>      chrpath -d debian/tmp/usr/bin/audacious
<Sp4rKy>         chrpath -d debian/tmp/usr/bin/audtool
<Sp4rKy> 
<Sp4rKy> in my debian/rules
<Sp4rKy> and chrpath in B-D
<Sp4rKy> but i've always this messages :
<Sp4rKy> W: audacious: binary-or-shlib-defines-rpath ./usr/bin/audacious /usr/local/lib
<Sp4rKy> W: audacious: binary-or-shlib-defines-rpath ./usr/bin/audtool /usr/local/lib
<[cro] smiley> is this ok from lintian: W: tsaver source: newer-standards-version 3.7.2
<imbrandon> thats fine , as is the unknown distro "edgy"
<[cro] smiley> ok then im uploading...
<imbrandon> revu hasent been updated yet to reflect the new changes
<Sp4rKy> does anyone could help me ?
<imbrandon> Sp4rKy: i honestly have no idea
<imbrandon> me personaly
<crimsun> Sp4rKy: eh, that's not as clean as simply building without rpath
<Sp4rKy> imbrandon, :(
<crimsun> Sp4rKy: you probably need to patch libtool to get rid of -Wl,--rpath
<Sp4rKy> crimsun, how can i do this ?
<Sp4rKy> crimsun, yes, it's what i thought do , but Toadstool talked me about chrpath
<Sp4rKy> so i've tried with it
<crimsun> Sp4rKy: http://pastebin.ca/122618
<Sp4rKy> what's it ?
<[cro] smiley> ok, you check agin now: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2862
<crimsun> ?
<[cro] smiley> *again
<Sp4rKy> crimsun, i don't understand what your script done
<imbrandon> [cro] smiley: yea give me a few to grab another mt dew etc then i will
<[cro] smiley> imbrandon, ok no hurry
<crimsun> Sp4rKy: it's not my script, but it prevents libtool from using rpath
<Sp4rKy> and how can i use it ?
<crimsun> Sp4rKy: that way you don't need chrpath at all
<Sp4rKy> k
<crimsun> Sp4rKy: I do hope you read the title of the page...
<Sp4rKy> oups
<Sp4rKy> sorry
<Sp4rKy> i add it in configure ?
<crimsun> in that target, yes
<Sp4rKy> k
<Sp4rKy> trying
<Sp4rKy> pbuilding ....
<imbrandon> [cro] smiley: you are upstream on this correct ?
<[cro] smiley> imbrandon, ?
<imbrandon> IE you made the program
<[cro] smiley> yep
<imbrandon> ok just makein sure, becosue it said copyright you
<[cro] smiley> ok
<imbrandon> ok looks good to me , i'll add a comment in a sec
<[cro] smiley> thanks
<[cro] smiley> how do i get those two things i need to have? :)
<[cro] smiley> i mean to get tu repos
<[cro] smiley> *to
<imbrandon> well i'm going to leave on ( advocate ) then you need a second ( on the same upload IE crimsun ) then the second will upload it
<imbrandon> *being a MOTU
<[cro] smiley> ok
<imbrandon> gah actualy i cant atm , crimsun do i need to be added to the MOTU reviewers or somesuch
<imbrandon> [cro] smiley: give me a few, i havent got all the right access privs yet as i'm a new MOTU ( less than a week old heh ) but once i do i'll make sure i get it advocated
<imbrandon> you have to poke for a second MOTU to revu now
<imbrandon> once the second MOTU reviews it , it can be uploaded
<[cro] smiley> ok
<[cro] smiley> crimsun, are you here :)
<Sp4rKy> crimsun, doesn't works
<[cro] smiley> crimsun, can you pls check: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2862
<imbrandon> ajmitch: ping , does the keyring need to be synced or something , i have the motureviewers emblem on LP
<crimsun> very busy atm, please be patient.
<imbrandon> [cro] smiley: yea give it time, might be a while ;P
<[cro] smiley> ok, no hurry
<imbrandon> [cro] smiley:  crimsun good about reading back in IRC for his mentions
<[cro] smiley> imbrandon, acctually i don't see no change at detail view upid=2862, do i have to wait or?
<imbrandon> [cro] smiley: i havent made a change yet as my keyright isnt updated
<imbrandon> keyring*
<imbrandon> [cro] smiley: i will once i get thta cleared up
<[cro] smiley> ok
<imbrandon> wb LaserJock
<imbrandon> howd the upgrade do
<LaserJock> ok, I think
<LaserJock> it didn't like me not having grub :-)
<LaserJock> I'm gonna reboot and see how it did, brb
<imbrandon> ;)
<Kr4t05> Has anyone else complained about bad sun-java5-bin and *-jre packages?
<[cro] smiley> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2862 still needs motu reviesion
<[cro] smiley> *revision
<tseng> imbrandon: hello
<crimsun> Kr4t05: "bad"? care to qualify?
<LaserJock> bah, my edgy dist-upgrade went bad :/
<crimsun> hah, you're known as "raging Ubuntu-aholic MOTU"
<LaserJock> who?
<LaserJock> you?
<crimsun> no, you.
<crimsun> UWN #9 prelim
<mc44> the first step is admitting you have a problem.
<LaserJock> crimsun: hehe
<LaserJock> ah stink, I did say Friday didn't I :/
<LaserJock> I was thinking Thursday
<LaserJock> oh wait, that is Thursday local time
<LaserJock> I HATE time zones
<ajmitch> imbrandon: nothing to do with the keyring
<crimsun> [cro] smiley: don't hardcode the path to the icon in src/TimeSaver.desktop
<crimsun> [cro] smiley: additionally, is there a particular technical gotcha that forces you to not want the menu entry displayed in KDE menus?
<[cro] smiley> crimsun, no there isn't
<[cro] smiley> what should i do then?
<crimsun> [cro] smiley: ok, then I suggest removing NotShowIn and dropping the absolute path to the icon (all in src/TimeSaver.desktop )
<[cro] smiley> crimsun, sorry but i don't get it :/
<[cro] smiley> where do i drop absolute path, where is NotShowIn
<crimsun> [cro] smiley: in src/TimeSaver.desktop , remove the NotShowIn line, and use only "Icon=tsaver.xpm"
<ajmitch> imbrandon: what email do you use on revu?
<[cro] smiley> ah, ok no problem
<bmonty> hi MOTUs
<[cro] smiley> crimsun, should i wait more suggestions or do i upload now?
<imbrandon> ajmitch: imbrandon@kubuntu.org
<imbrandon> heya bmonty
#ubuntu-motu 2006-08-09
<LaserJock> well, I think I'm in worse shape than I though
<Kr4t05> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/20036
<Kr4t05> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/20036 <- Could someone help me out with this?
<bmonty> Kr4t05: that is a question for #ubuntu
<imbrandon> LaserJock: howso ?
<LaserJock> my X is totally gone
<imbrandon> ouch
<LaserJock> I have no idea what happened
<imbrandon> make sure kubuntu-desktop is installed
<LaserJock> it kind find vesa for pete's sake :-/
<imbrandon> that uninstalled on mine ( along with x )
<imbrandon> when i updated
<LaserJock> *-desktop are all ok
<imbrandon> hrm
<LaserJock> X packages are there
<imbrandon> whats your say , anything ?
<crimsun> which driver were you using?
<imbrandon> s/your X log
<LaserJock> fglrx, ati, and vesa
<crimsun> and you have xserver-xorg-video-ati installed?
<crimsun> (if you are able to use the ati driver)
<LaserJock> X log says "module ABI major version (0) doesn't match the server's version (1)"
<crimsun> cough, that's from xserver-xorg-driver-*
<imbrandon> yea
<LaserJock> I've got: xserver-xorg-driver-ati                6.5.7.3-0ubuntu7
<crimsun> right, which is obsolete now.
<crimsun> (thanks for following development! ;)
<ajmitch> that's so 2 weeks ago
<imbrandon> heh
<LaserJock> well, I don't really care when it was
<LaserJock> :-)
<crimsun> mister raging ubuntu-aholic MOTU indeed
<LaserJock> hehe
<LaserJock> X is Main dude ;-)
<ajmitch> so?
<LaserJock> ok, so does that explain why vesa wouldn't work?
<LaserJock> I'm thinking something bigger is wrong
<ajmitch> depends what the error message is
<ajmitch> if you get the same with vesa, then that's probably your issue
<ajmitch> since the New World Order is using xserver-xorg-video-* now
<LaserJock> hmm
<LaserJock> well that makes upgrading fun :-)
<ajmitch> the x server should depend on the right drivers now
<ajmitch> blame rodarvus if it doesn't
<LaserJock> I'll have to have a talk with Mr. Rodrigo >:)
<LaserJock> ok, brb I'm going to see if that did it
<ajmitch> this is why my irc client isn't on my edgy box :)
<ajmitch> LaserJock: any luck?
<LaserJock> ajmitch: kinda, got vesa to work
<LaserJock> I'll need to see if ati will work because I'd like to get 1400x900
* ajmitch would like a screen that did that resolution
<ajmitch> I might have to get a couple of 23" cinema displays
<ajmitch> 3840x1200 would be nice
<TheMuso> Wouldn't the text be way too small?
<imbrandon> heh ajmitch did you see that dual xgl vid thing ?
<ajmitch> imbrandon: no?
<ajmitch> TheMuso: probably not
<ajmitch> TheMuso: I already have 1 crt at 1600x1200 & another with 1280x1024
<imbrandon> ajmitch: heh lemme find a link, looks like a NICE setup
<imbrandon> ajmitch: btw thanks for fixin me up on REVU
<ajmitch> no problem
<bmonty> ajmitch: how goes the SoC project?
<imbrandon> ajmitch: ahh found it, GNOME twinview XLG stuff, really nice setup imo http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DUSn-jBA3CE
<imbrandon> even has the cube stuff working on a dual display
<ajmitch> bmonty: ok
<ajmitch> imbrandon: not too hard to do - I have that
<ajmitch> bmonty: I have to go out in a couple of min sorry :)
<bmonty> ajmitch: If you need a tester I'm interested in helping out...cya later
<imbrandon> l8tr ajmitch
<imbrandon> err later , heh
<LaserJock> I'm having an unexpected struggle getting out of OS X, it seems I've invested too much time into it ;)
<tseng> oops
<crimsun> I can't believe how anti-wifi I used to be
<tseng> crimsun: I can't live without wifi
<tseng> seriously
<crimsun> neither can I now
<tseng> its like birdman away from the sun
<imbrandon> LaserJock: hahahah quote " ... presented by raging Ubuntu-aholic MOTU [WWW]  JordanMantha (LaserJock) .... "
<imbrandon> whom did that ?
<imbrandon> crimsun: yea wifi rocks
<imbrandon> i used to hate it too when it was hard to setup and short ranged but as it gets better and easier i find it hard not to use
<tseng> imbrandon: you have another mono dude in your area
<tseng> imbrandon: he just found you on kansas lug
<imbrandon> tseng: who ?
<imbrandon> haha cool
<tseng> snorp
<tseng> james wilcox
<imbrandon> hrm i've seen that name somewhere
<tseng> planet gnome?
<imbrandon> probably
<imbrandon> heh
<imbrandon> kc lug or kansas lug ?
<tseng> dunno
<imbrandon> where you getting this ? heh
<tseng> 17:42 <@snorp> he's posting messages to the kansas city lug, at least
<imbrandon> what chan ?
<tseng> our top secret chat on gimpnet
<imbrandon> ahh lol cool
<imbrandon> yea tell him to look me up sometime, yea i post to our lug list semi often
<imbrandon> we have another gnome upstream dev in town too
<tseng> whos that
<imbrandon> i'm the token kde guy LOL
<tseng> yeah
<tseng> he noticed
<imbrandon> jhutchins
<tseng> never heard of him
<imbrandon> infact i just ordered a few hundred {k}ubuntu cd's for our lug to use at ITEC in oct
<imbrandon> wilcox , ahhh i have seen him on the lug list its self is why, that where from, ask him why he dosent come into the lug chan ( #kclug here of freenode )\
<imbrandon> i knew i did somewhere
<imbrandon> *from
<imbrandon> infact i was thinking of forming ( or help form ) a KC LoCo team as 80% or so of our lug runs some form of ubuntu and we always promote it at ourr meeting/shows/confrences etc
<imbrandon> maybe someday hehe
<tseng> maybe today!
<imbrandon> ;P
<bmonty> imbrandon: KC = Kansas City?
<imbrandon> bmonty: yea
<bmonty> cool, I'm in Omaha
<imbrandon> ahh nice yea thats only like 45 min away
<bmonty> more than that
<imbrandon> my best friend from HS went to omaha for college
<imbrandon> yea maybe a tad more ;)
<bmonty> its more like 3 hours
<imbrandon> not tooo far though
<imbrandon> probably , i havent made that trip in 8 or 9 years heh
<imbrandon> since he graduated
<tseng> my job has a big data center in omaha
<tseng> and some other offices i think
<tseng> First Data
<imbrandon> cool where are you tseng ?
<bmonty> yeah, first data has a large office here
<tseng> Wilmington, DE for work
<imbrandon> cool
<tseng> across the border i live in PA
<bmonty> so doesn't paypal, ameritrade, and a few others
<imbrandon> ameritrade has a big office in KC too afaik
<bmonty> ameritrade uses a large portion of an old mall for their offices
<imbrandon> or did at one point
<imbrandon> i think they have a few floors on the sprint building here iirc
<bmonty> anyone using ekiga on amd64?
<imbrandon> not i
<LaserJock> anybody know who the moderator of -motu and -devel is?
<imbrandon> the ML ?
<LaserJock> imbrandon: yeah, I stupidly posted using the wrong email address
<imbrandon> ubuntu-devel list run by mdz at ubuntu.com
<imbrandon> Ubuntu-motu list run by dholbach at ubuntu.com
<imbrandon> future ref its listed at the bottom of https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/<list-name>
<jsgotangco> ahh so jono got the job
<LaserJock> oh, Mr. Smarty Pants over there :p
<imbrandon> hehehe ;)
<LaserJock> well, I wonder if I  should brave the wrath of -devel and send it from the right email address
<imbrandon> heh
<Fujitsu> Can somebody please perform some merges for me?
<LaserJock> lol
<imbrandon> Fujitsu: ?
* LaserJock does his Ubuntu merging dance
<imbrandon> hehehe
* Fujitsu points towards http://people.ubuntu.com.au/~fujitsu/merges.
<imbrandon> brb mt dew refil time, i should just get one of those fast food resraunt soda fountains in my computer lab room
<Fujitsu> Hahaha
<imbrandon> ohhh mol, whats new with that /me looks
<imbrandon> Fujitsu: does that include the patch for 10.4 thats floating arroudn the net
<imbrandon> you just wanting these uploaded ? are they on the MoM ?
<Fujitsu> imbrandon, I don't think it includes it, no.
<Fujitsu> And yeah, I'd like them uploaded. They're mostly done my MoM.
<Fujitsu> Brb.
<imbrandon> ok i can do the mol one as i know that package well enough to build/check/upload it etc
<imbrandon> brb
<jsgotangco> LaserJock: just a suggestion, i think you should send a follow up email on about the motu school or have it on a wiki page about what packages need to be installed in advance instead of saying durng the session to install foo and wait for people to finish
<LaserJock> jsgotangco: did that ;-)
<jsgotangco> coolies
<LaserJock> it's on the "for those who want to read ahead" page
<LaserJock> http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/School/PackagingBasics
<Hobbsee> hi all
<Hobbsee> hi zul
<zul> hey Hobbsee how goes it?
<Hobbsee> zul: it goes, late again :P
<zul> fun fun
<imbrandon> heya Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> hi imbrandon
<Hobbsee> zul: it goes, late again :P
<TheMuso> Hey Hobbsee.
<zul> Hobbsee: deja vu
<Hobbsee> zul: wasnt sure if you got it, i seemed to timeout there
<Hobbsee> hi TheMuso
<zul> ah..
<Fujitsu> Back.
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: :)
* Fujitsu kicks Year 12 assembly.
<zul> ick...assembly language blows chunks
* Fujitsu hits zul.
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: yr 12 assembly?
<Fujitsu> Yeah.
<Fujitsu> Assembly of all the year 12s at school.
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: ahh...you're not a part of this group?
<zul> im old all of the sudden
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: when we hit year 12, we were as bored as everyone else, and just wanting to escape the assembly too.  the guard of honour was really cool though
<Hobbsee> zul: :p
<imbrandon> heh zul me too
<Fujitsu> I am a part of it.
<Fujitsu> Hence the going away for 12 minutes.
* TheMuso remembers my year 12. We had our own common room :p
<Hobbsee> ah right
<zul> heh do you guys still pass notes in class? :)
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: they wouldnt let us have that :(
<Hobbsee> zul: yes, and during assemblies.
<Fujitsu> TheMuso, as do we... But I never use it, I've got the back room of the library :)
<imbrandon> zul: IM's man IM's heheh
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: Aww. My sympathies.
<TheMuso> :)
<zul> imbrandon: nah...smoke signals are cooler
<imbrandon> zul: or txt messages ;)
<imbrandon> heh
<Fujitsu> Heheh.
<zul> imbrandon: when i was in school we just had pen and paper..i am so old school
<imbrandon> zul: lol me too, pagers were high tech then , no cell phones
* TheMuso doesn't know how he woud have got through school without technology.
<imbrandon> let alone cell's with txt or IM
<TheMuso> I guess I would have just had to use a brailler, like many others before me.
<Fujitsu> TheMuso, ouch.
<TheMuso> And they can piss off classmates, very quickly, due to their noise levels.
<Fujitsu> I can imagine.
<imbrandon> TheMuso: i found a cool link today that reads off RSS feeds to ya, i thought of you right away hehe
<TheMuso> heh
<imbrandon> i'm sure you have something that works much better though
<TheMuso> Indeed.
<zul> imbrandon: heh...when i was in high school i was in a third world country that didnt have pager, cell phones, or any other fancy gadgets
<imbrandon> heh
<zul> if i go back now they have all of the fancy gadgets
<imbrandon> lol probably
<imbrandon> i would hate to be in HS right now
<imbrandon> i think i went through at the right time, the end of the dot com boom ;)
<imbrandon> if i had went though a few years before though i might be sabdfl hehehe
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: Another lock-up?
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: no, i'm switching to wired, as bigpond did my request to host the kubuntu edgy knot 1 cd, so i can download it unmetered :)
<imbrandon> nice ( they should run a full ubuntu mirror )
<imbrandon> heh
<TheMuso> Cool!
<Fujitsu> Nice Hobbsee!
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: very :)
<Fujitsu> Although being on Bigpond must be bad...
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: yeah...they have got most of the dapper ones hosted
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: well, yeah
<Fujitsu> But at least they don't meter traffic to their own servers, whereas Optus does.
* Hobbsee runs the download accelerator on the unmetered site :D
<TheMuso> hehe
<imbrandon> Hobbsee: yea but i mean a apt-mirror that syncs often
<Hobbsee> hope i can use the alternate cd - it lets you select partitions, doesnt it?
<TheMuso> What kind of speed do you get from their file server?
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: Yes.
<Hobbsee>  Current speed = 382.00Kb/s, Average D/L speed = 674.58Kb/s
<imbrandon> Hobbsee: yea actualy either one does but yea
<TheMuso> Nice!
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: oh good.
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: good.  it just doenst let you create, or something?
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: Which one are you downloading?
<imbrandon> either way
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: kubuntu desktop
<TheMuso> Well that is the live CD.
<TheMuso> I think ubiquity allows for partitioning advanced setups, but not sure how good it is.
* TheMuso will never ever use ubiquity. Give me a text-mode installer that is known to be stable any day.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: it's both live and install.  for edgy (like they did for dapper)
<imbrandon> TheMuso: yea it does, i tested it the other day on my ppc lappy
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: I know.
<LaserJock> somebody in -devel needs ops
<TheMuso> I jsut don't think GUI installers on top of live CDs is a good idea.
<TheMuso> Personally.
<zul> LaserJock: uh yeah..
<Fujitsu> Same guy as yesterday.
<TheMuso> But I am also aware that that is not what most people want.
<TheMuso> lol in -dev
<LaserJock> TheMuso: I go back and forth. I like having a livecd around for fixing things and showing people stuff
<Fujitsu> Yep.
<LaserJock> TheMuso: but if I want to do a straight install, I'd rather go with the alternate cd
<TheMuso> LaserJock: I'm the same. Live CDs are invaluable for that sort of thing.
<Fujitsu> Somebody called the ops, did they?
<LaserJock> does anybody have ops in -devel?
<Fujitsu> I presume nalioth does, as he's Freenode staff...
<LaserJock> oh yeah
<LaserJock> I didn't see him come in
<TheMuso> lol!
<Fujitsu> HAHAH.
<Hobbsee> what'd i miss?
<Fujitsu> He got banned from -offtopic!? Impressive..
<Hobbsee> stupid telstra
<Fujitsu> That sam guy from NZ in -devel again.
<Fujitsu> As MarkShuttleworth.
<Hobbsee> oh, so that's what that ban was for
<TheMuso> How can one get banned from -offtopic? Breaking the coc is one reason I guess, but how else?
<Fujitsu> Yup.
<Fujitsu> He was there yesterday as well...
<Fujitsu> TheMuso, that'
<Fujitsu> *that's it.
<ajmitch> ah, the usual guy
<ajmitch> silly
<imbrandon> TheMuso: or constant trolling too
<imbrandon> can get ya banned
<imbrandon> ok bbiab
<TheMuso> Right.
<zul> crunchy trolls even better
<imbrandon> Hobbsee: [20:07]  <imbrandon> and #kubuntu also , but i must run, can someone else with ops in there keep an eye out please
<imbrandon> ^^ for that mark imposter
<Fujitsu> Yummu.
* Fujitsu eats trolls.
<TheMuso> Not again...
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: sigh.  and for a paster.
<TheMuso> Has he been in here at all?
<ajmitch> probably, I can't recall
<Fujitsu> Hobbsee, considered fixing your dodgy connection?
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: dunno what's screwing up.  but i am downloading an iso
<Fujitsu> Ah.
<zul> Hobbsee: can i just suggest dialup? :)
<Hobbsee> zul: haha!
<Fujitsu> Hey, I'm on 28.8kbps for half of most months!
<zul> Hobbsee: i had dialup for a year i didnt do much afer that
<Hobbsee> iso is done yay :)
<TheMuso> You lucky thing to get them that fast.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: heh, yeah.  yay for download accelerators and unmetered sites.
* TheMuso can't wait for ADSL2. :)
<Burgundavia> crimsun: for the record, august 11th will be before the published date of the next UWN
<Fujitsu> Anybody feel like looking at my other three merges?
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: i can download stuff here, no problem, if you want it burned and given to you at some point.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: assuming it's an iso that's on the unmetered site :P
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: Nah thats fine. I have access to quota free mirrors as well, which carry just about all ubuntu stuff.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: ah nice :)
<TheMuso> And I keep up to date with the latest CDs using rsync.
<Hobbsee> ye
<Hobbsee> p
<TheMuso> So it doesn't take too much quota.
<TheMuso> /c
<Burgundavia> any interesting apps uploaded in the past 2 days?
<zul> *cough* xen *cough*
<ajmitch> interesting, he said
<Fujitsu> ajmitch, hahah.
* zul smacks ajmitch 
<zul> shut up you
<ajmitch> friendly chap
<zul> hehe..
<Burgundavia> zul: what interesting has happened/will happen this week in xen development
<Burgundavia> ?
<zul> we will have amd64 versions
<ajmitch> eventually :)
<zul> once i upload it
<ajmitch> package seems sorted now
<Burgundavia> ok, very cool
<Burgundavia> ping me when those go up
<zul> leaving me to my own devices is dangerous :)
* ajmitch shuts up
<zul> yeah...perv
<ajmitch> hah
<TheMuso> o oh
<TheMuso> ubuntu+1
<ajmitch> we know
<TheMuso> ok
<poningru> hi can I bother someone with some pbuilder help?
<poningru> first time fixing some bugs
<imbrandon_> Fujitsu: ping , you MOL ftbs , here is my build.log if you wanna look at it http://pastebin.ca/122986
<imbrandon_> s/you/your
<poningru> nm
<imbrandon_> moins bddebian
<bddebian> Heya gang
<imbrandon_> poningru: whats the problem ?
<bddebian> Hi imbrandon
<Hobbsee> oops.
* Hobbsee notes that batteries really do eventually run out of juice.
<imbrandon_> lol
<bddebian> Hi Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> hi bddebian
<TheMuso> heh
<poningru> so the question I had was how to edit the .diff.gz and put it back?
<poningru> still looking
<bddebian> Why do you want to edit the diff.gz instead of rebuilding the source package with the change?
<poningru> oh...
<poningru> nm
<poningru> bddebian: its just a two line fix and would be much easier to do that way
* poningru is currently bugfixing
<bddebian> Ah, nice
<LaserJock> it's better (easier too, IMO) to rebuild the source package
<LaserJock> because you also need a changelog entry
<poningru> well its a bug in the postinstall script
<poningru> not in the prog itself
<poningru> bug 55706
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 55706 in python-uncertainities "python-uncertainities python2.3/2.4 breakage." [Untriaged,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/55706
<bddebian> Is it using the new python policy? :-)
<LaserJock> right, but you still need a changelog entry
<LaserJock> micahcowan: did you get my email regarding the time of the MOTU School session?
<bddebian> Heya LaserJock
<LaserJock> bddebian: hi
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: nice time :)
<Hobbsee> 11am :)
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: not like you need to attend
* bddebian does
<bddebian> Hi ajmitch
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: oh i dont know, it could be interesting.
<Fujitsu> What's it covering?
<micahcowan> LaserJock, oh, haven't checked. I'll do now.
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: how to be a package master
<TheMuso> haha thats a session that I will actually be able to make this tim.
<TheMuso> time
<ajmitch> where LaserJock details his skills
<LaserJock> ajmitch: yikes, or lack thereof
<LaserJock> I'm a little worried
<ajmitch> why?
<LaserJock> I've got like 3 presentations to do this week
<LaserJock> 2 for ubucon and then the MOTU School one
<micahcowan> LaserJock, oh, right. -7 because of daylight savings, right?
<LaserJock> micahcowan: yeah
<bddebian> ubucon?
<micahcowan> thanks
<imbrandon> ubucon ?
<imbrandon> Fujitsu: did you see my note about the FTBS ?
<micahcowan> and that'd be Thursday night for me.
<Fujitsu> imbrandon, I did.
<LaserJock> micahcowan: me too ;-)
<imbrandon> ok, makin sure , i was switching clients so i dident have time to look at my logs
<LaserJock> imbrandon and bddebian Ubucon is a Ubuntu conference held at Google after Linux World Expo
<LaserJock> http://www.linuxpip.org/ubuconwiki/
<Fujitsu> Ah, thanks.
<bddebian> Oh, Nice
<imbrandon> nice
* bddebian never gets to go to shit :'-(
<imbrandon> that would be cool to goto
<imbrandon> bddebian: me either hehe
<LaserJock> well, I just happen to live not to far away
<Fujitsu> Yeah, it'd be nice to go... But I'm on the other side of the world and 15, so it's unlikely to happen :P
<imbrandon> LaserJock: yea that was the one cool thing about being out there
<LaserJock> and my wife's aunt live ~ 1 mile from Google Headquarters so ....
<bddebian> 15 WTF??
* bddebian feels even older now.. :'-(
* Hobbsee hands bddebian a walking stick.
<imbrandon> hahaha
<LaserJock> Fujitsu: you guys have quite a few cool conferences in AU
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: we do?
* imbrandon even feels old with 15 yr olds deving
* bddebian goes all ninja with his new walking stick
<Fujitsu> Yeah, I agree with Hobbsee/
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: jpatrick's 14 :P
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: like LCA every year
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: where are you?
<imbrandon> Hobbsee: WHAT !!??!!!!
<Fujitsu> LCA's about it.
<Fujitsu> Hobbsee, Mel8ourne :P
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: ah.  dodgy place that.
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: do you think you'll get to LCA next year?
* Fujitsu hits Hobbsee.
* Hobbsee doenst see why anyone would want to live in smellbourne :P
* ajmitch was thinking of moving to melbourne soon
* Hobbsee thumps Fujitsu.  sure you want to do that?
<Fujitsu> ajmitch, not going to happen, I don't think. Too darn expensive.
<Fujitsu> Yay!
* Fujitsu welcomes ajmitch.
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: maybe you could apply for the regional delegates program
<Fujitsu> But '08, I might. KatteKrab asked if I wanted to help out.
<ajmitch> that would be good
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: if I'm in melbourne I should call in & visit
<ajmitch> I have friends in ringwood
<Fujitsu> Aha.
<LaserJock> well, western US gets pretty much nothing of interest so I'm glad to see Ubucon come up (organized by the guy that was organizing LWE)
<Fujitsu> I'm in Ringwood East/Heathmont.
<ajmitch> yep
* Fujitsu hits Malone.
<Hobbsee> violent Fujitsu :P
<Fujitsu> I'm trying to submit an upstream bug tracker thing for #54124, but it wants a product name... What am I meant to put>
<Fujitsu> *?
<LaserJock> yeah, one of my talks at Ubucon is about Launchpad and how to use Ubuntu tools
<bddebian> Hobbsee: Now that's funny coming from you! :-)
* Hobbsee grabs bddebian's walking stick, and pokes him with it repeatedly.
<LaserJock> I hope I can come up with more than, "It's pretty cool, if it works and you know how to use it"
<bddebian> Wow, LaserJock is becoming a real Ubuntu fanboi ;-P
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: ah.  use the search button, then go for the closest
<bddebian> LaserJock: hehe
* imbrandon would like a formal motu class on revu and revu tools *hint LaserJock*
<Fujitsu> I searched for gl-117, nothing.
<ajmitch> launchpad used to allow remote bugs without the product being registered
* micahcowan seconds imbrandon's suggestion
* Fujitsu thirds it.
<ajmitch> no doubt that feature was changed
<ajmitch> imbrandon: hm? there's not that much to detail
<LaserJock> imbrandon: I want a MOTU class on how to hack REVU2 so it gets done ;-)
<ajmitch> LaserJock: hah, good luck
<Fujitsu> Hahah.
<ajmitch> LaserJock: I still have some code for that somewhere :)
* Fujitsu hits REVU a bit.
<imbrandon> LaserJock: hehe yea +1
<Fujitsu> I'm being violent today :(
<micahcowan> Do you have to be someone special to @ at Ubugtu?
<imbrandon> micahcowan: what do you mean ?
<Fujitsu> @lart micahcowan
<Hobbsee> micahcowan: to add, or to get Ubugtu to say something?
<ubuntu-es> Fujitsu: Error: "lart" is not a valid command.
<Fujitsu> Not the effect I desired...
<Fujitsu> So apparently yes.
<ajmitch> Laser_away: feel free to work on revu2
<micahcowan> I was trying to play with the @lart command in #ubuntu-bots, but never got responses.
<imbrandon> Fujitsu: only in offtopic
<imbrandon> micahcowan: -offtopic
<Fujitsu> Aha.
<micahcowan> gotcha.
<imbrandon> only works in certain channels
<imbrandon> so your not inclinded to play with it in *cough* dev channels
<Laser_away> bddebian: btw, I'm a raging Ubuntu-holic MOTU, what do you expect?
<imbrandon> poke Seveas about maybe turning it on in -bots too though, he may if you ask nice
<ajmitch> bddebian: you mean Laser_away has his own fan club
<ajmitch> not quite as large as yours
* imbrandon isnt even a member of his own fanboi club
* ajmitch is happy to be another anonymous developer
<ajmitch> who gets told how wrong he is on the forums ;)
<imbrandon> lol i avoid the forums the last few months
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: hah.  more likely that they're wrong.  want to do an upload for me?
<imbrandon> heh i shouldent i guess
<Hobbsee> well, it's on MoM, but it looks to be a new upstream versoin.  which probably requires a buggered exception report.
<ajmitch> then get that before you ask me
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: no, wait, no it isnt.  dont mind me.
<imbrandon> heh i FINALY found a reason for me to switch to vi{m} and learn to use it over nano
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: which was?
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: oh, you suddenly finding it was the default editor on your machine?
* Hobbsee looks around and whistles innocently
<bddebian> ajmitch: I have no fan club
<ajmitch> hah
<imbrandon> that i can vi a *.diff.gz and it will automagicly uncompress it etc , and nano reads it as a bin file ( rightly so )
<ajmitch> hahaha
<Fujitsu> I think REVU rejected my last upload of convertall because it didn't have my new key...
<micahcowan> Hobbsee, you did that? ;-)
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: probably
<bddebian> Laser_away: Hey, I live here and I don't give classes and speak at "Ubucon" ;-P
<Hobbsee> micahcowan: sure
<micahcowan> I was surprised... but from a "normal user" perspective it makes a lot of good sense.
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: ahhh...nice.  i quite like how it deals with changelogs too.
<bddebian> ajmitch: Well I think Laser_away used to be a fan because I worked on his Science packages, but now that he has azeem, I have no one :'-(
<ajmitch> bddebian: that's simply because you continually say you're stupid & convince yourself that you can't :)
<Hobbsee> micahcowan: i've got ssh access to imbrandon's machine.  and sudo access.
<imbrandon> Hobbsee: yea that confuesed me at first but i'm getting used to it
<Fujitsu> Quite a nice position, Hobbsee :)
<Fujitsu> Oh, and jpatrick is 15, not 14.
<imbrandon> Hobbsee: ?? /me missed something
<bddebian> OK, I have to get out of this bar and get to my hotel room, bbiab
<micahcowan> Hobbsee, oh, I meant in general...
<imbrandon> Hobbsee: oh YOU changed my default editor , grr i was wondering LOL
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: did you ask a revu admin about it after you added a new key?
<jsgotangco> hmm does anyone remember that small screencast app that saves as a gif byzance something?
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: haha.  yeah
<ajmitch> imbrandon: that's why I only give sudo access to chroot & pbuilder
<micahcowan> nice
<Fujitsu> I got the key synced 3 days ago, just after I uploaded the package..
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: who else would have?
* imbrandon /kicks Hobbsee , dont do that please no more hehehe
<Fujitsu> (after I realised it had probably broken it)
<imbrandon> i thought it was an edgy regression
<imbrandon> heh
<imbrandon> then i just started using it
<imbrandon> lol
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: can you upload convertall again then?
<ajmitch> imbrandon: silly, you know what hobbsee is like
<micahcowan> imbrandon, decided against switching back, you mean? :-)
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: actually, i didnt think that that hapened over the entire system.
<Fujitsu> That's better now, thanks ajmitch.
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: depends how you changed it
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: http://rafb.net/paste/results/uSzjKV19.html  thanks
<imbrandon> Hobbsee: it did, no biggie though, micahcowan yea
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: create it with debuild -S -sa
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: with sudo update-alternatives --config editor
<ajmitch> you're missing an .orig.tar.gz for this upload
<Fujitsu> I did, ajmitch.
<Fujitsu> Hm.
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: of course that's system-wide
<ajmitch> convertall_0.3.1-0ubuntu1.tar.gz
<imbrandon> Hobbsee: yea thats system wide, you could have just put export EDITOR in ~/.bashrc
<ajmitch> no orig
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: yeah, i did that on other machine
<ajmitch> naughty hobbsee
* Fujitsu checks the package.
<imbrandon> Hobbsee: but yea no biggie, but if you change sys wide setting anymore please atleaste lemme know LOL
<ajmitch> at least switch him to gnome
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: sure :P
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: hah.
<imbrandon> ajmitch: hahah i have both installed
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: actually, iirc, you werent around for a few days after i did it...
<imbrandon> just KDE default
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: otherwise i would ahve
<Fujitsu> Oops.
<imbrandon> heh yea i took a 2 or 3 day holiday from dev stuff
<ajmitch> imbrandon: yes, but switching your session to gnome is another matter
<imbrandon> ajmitch: true ;)
<imbrandon> and refraing from using kde apps in gnome too LOL
* ajmitch is glad that he hasn't given Hobbsee access on this system
<Fujitsu> I uploaded an old one. It's all a little confusing because I am on one computer, the package is on another (my laptop), and there's no FTP access outbound, so I have to copy the bits & pieces to an external server... I'll try again...
<imbrandon> heh she only has access to one of mine ;)
<Fujitsu> Silly Department of Education.
<imbrandon> well two if you count the webhost
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: lag to NZ would be horrifying anyway.  now are you going to upload my merge, or will i need to get another core-dev to do it?  :)
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: you haven't given any details yet, so there's nothing for me to upload
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: http://rafb.net/paste/results/uSzjKV19.html  thanks.  libglade2
<Hobbsee> http://merges.ubuntu.com/libg/libglade2/REPORT
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: what other details did you want?
<ajmitch> you're touching desktop team stuff now?
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: no, i'm stealing yet another one of dholbach's merges.
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: but effectively
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: mainly that dholbach has a whole lot of stuff to do, and was running out of time, so i decided to take some of them over.
<bmonty> Hobbsee: there are many more merges on the universe list :)
<imbrandon> 200+ last i looked bmonty
<imbrandon> hehe
<bmonty> only 162 new
<Hobbsee> bmonty: indeed.  i was checking for bits on the main list that were marked as me.  decided to keep ignoring that one, and saw dholbach's name on another, so decided to steal it.
<imbrandon> yea i havent looked in 48hrs or so
<Hobbsee> bmonty: hwo many more do you still have to go on there?
* ajmitch wonders about this one
<Hobbsee> 162 new merges
<Hobbsee> 67 updated merges
<bmonty> Hobbsee: only a couple that won't build on my machine
<Hobbsee> it's gone down.  keybuk did a few billion syncs.
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: how so?
<Hobbsee> bmonty: ah okay.  those are always fun
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: DEB_DH_MAKESHLIBS_ARGS_libglade2-0 := -V 'libglade2-0 (>= 1:2.5.1)'
<ajmitch> whether that should have been updated in debian
<Hobbsee> hmmm...quite possibly
<ajmitch> also have to check libglade2-dev depends
<bmonty> Hobbsee: actually I have been working from the top of the list for about a week now
<ajmitch> whether >= 2.3 is adequate now
<ajmitch> for python
<Hobbsee> right..
<Hobbsee> bmonty: yeah, that's what i figured people were doing.  that's why i started at the bottom, after doing all of mine
<Hobbsee> well, almost all.
<Hobbsee> one's still screwy.
* ajmitch needs a new keyboard
<ajmitch> or try & clean this one properly
<bmonty> ajmitch: get a logitech wireless
<ajmitch> bmonty: why?
<bmonty> very nice
* Hobbsee goes off to work.
* ajmitch wonders why he should spend that much on a keyboard
<ajmitch> since I'm not likely to take it far from my desk
<bmonty> I don't think they are overly expensive
<bmonty> I guess if you compare it to the $5 ones in Walmart
<ajmitch> I'd rather spend the money on a decent flat panel or two
<bmonty> but I wouldn't want to use of those for very long
* ajmitch is wanting 2x23" apple cinema displays :)
<bmonty> gotta set your priorities :)
<imbrandon> ajmitch: +1 on that , i would love 1x23in cinema apple display
<imbrandon> heh
* ajmitch is not so sure about this libglade2 merge
<ajmitch> I'll check some things over with the desktop team before uploading
<ajmitch> I'm sure hobbsee will understand
<bmonty> libglade2 isn't very important....
<ajmitch> not at all
<ajmitch> bmonty: it's just the incidental things, like shlibs, python dependencies, .la file, etc
<ajmitch> nothing that would cause it to break stuff when installed
<bmonty> ajmitch: so you want to tell me anything about what you have going on SSO?
<ajmitch> hm, looks like it may be ok, compared to -0ubuntu1
<ajmitch> not nearly enough on the server side, done more client-side configuration
<bmonty> I think the client side is the hardest....especially if you want to make things "just work"
<bmonty> I'm having problems on a wirless client that sometimes looses its connection and then all kinds of bad things happen
<ajmitch> true, but I'd prefer an overall set of tools that let you have client/server easily
<ajmitch> oh, what happens?
<ajmitch> it breaks doing nss lookups?
<bmonty> yes
<ajmitch> sigh
<bmonty> which does lots of bad things to gnome
<ajmitch> one of the flaws
<ajmitch> only way around that at the moment is nscd
<bmonty> there are supposed to be two things that help with the problem
<ajmitch> which has its own set of problems
<bmonty> the nscd daemon and a caching module for PAM
<ajmitch> ah right
<ajmitch> but pam caching wouldn't be useful for nss
<bmonty> neither of which I have working yet :(
<ajmitch> since they're separate
<ajmitch> nss being a libc feature
<bmonty> ajmitch: yeah, the other thing is when it looses its connection and then I can't log on at all
<ajmitch> suck
<bmonty> which hopefully PAM caching will fix
<ajmitch> using pam_krb5?
<ajmitch> or similar
<bmonty> yes
<ajmitch> how would pam caching work with kerberos though?
<ajmitch> it sounds fragile
<bmonty> I do pam_mount -> pam_unix (sufficient) -> pam_krb5 (sufficient)
<ajmitch> right
<bmonty> ajmitch: it may let you log in, but if your TGT is expired you aren't going to be able to authenticate anywhere else
<ajmitch> yes
<bmonty> of course if the network is hosed, that might be the least of your problems :)
<LaserJock> :-)
<ajmitch> but if you're logged out, the ticket should have been destroyed
<ajmitch> unless the cache decides to keep things around
<bmonty> ajmitch: true
<ajmitch> which sounds a bit sticky
<bmonty> I don't know much about how it works yet...I just know it exists
<ajmitch> it's not like windows handles things much better :)
<bmonty> true
<ajmitch> nscd is the usual solution for the network going away when you're logged in
<ajmitch> for the few things it may have cached
<bmonty> I haven't been able to get nscd working well
<ajmitch> what isses have you have with it?
<bmonty> caches time out too quickly
<bmonty> it requires some thought to tune its timeouts
<bmonty> the defaults are definately inadequate
<ajmitch> yeah - too long & things break
<ajmitch> I haven't got a config module for nscd yet, I'll probably have to quickly add one
<bmonty> are you just trying to get authentication/authorization working, or are you going to add some other features (like pam_mount)?
<ajmitch> not adding pam_mount for now
<ajmitch> though I've considered having a generic pam config tool
<ajmitch> one that is just a frontend for the files, allowing you to reorder/add/delete modules
<bmonty> ajmitch: that sounds like a complicated task
<ajmitch> something any one can do with an editor
<bmonty> ahh...that might not be so bad
<ajmitch> what were you thinking?
<ajmitch> getting the order right automatically is hard
<bmonty> a tool that required no knowledge of how PAM worked
<ajmitch> that requires knowledge of most of the PAM modules out there, and the context they can be used in
<bmonty> but if you expect the user to know PAM, then you are just making life a little easier
<ajmitch> for now, my tool just adds things like pam_krb5 in what could be an appropriate place
<bmonty> A tool that could list all of the modules, their capabilties, and options in a nice GUI would be very useful
<ajmitch> probably require reading the source of each module to find that out
<bmonty> you could assume that the system is starting with a stock ubuntu setup and modify from there
<ajmitch> I may do it though
<ajmitch> I do assume that
<bmonty> and offer to completely overwrite the configs if it isn't the default?
<ajmitch> I'm glad that smb.conf can be managed by python's ConfigParser
<ajmitch> no, I don't do that, though I should
<ajmitch> "blow away your config? (yes|no|I feel lucky)"
<bmonty> :)
<bmonty> with a big flashing "WARNING YOU MIGHT NOT BE ABLE TO LOG ON"
<ajmitch> if they have a custom pam config that I can't handle, then they're not so likely to be using this tool :)
<bmonty> I've done a lot of recovery mode boots in the past few weeks :)
<ajmitch> hehe
<ajmitch> vmware is great, really
<ajmitch> if you have the RAM
<bmonty> yeah I know, I need to start using it more
<ajmitch> I'm so glad I planned for heavy RAM usage when I bought this box
<ajmitch> it runs nicely without any swap
<caleb-> Hey, an Ubuntu member said that backport can start before edgy release. But Dapper's backports has zero package. Anyone has idea? The member I mentioned is freeflying, an Ubuntu CJK leader.
<bmonty> I meant to have 4GB in this box, but I messed up the order....when I priced out what I really needed for that much RAM it was more than my budget
<ajmitch> yeah
<ajmitch> you were going to get ECC registered RAM though, right?
<bmonty> yes
* ajmitch just has boring RAM, but 4GB
<bmonty> so I've got 2GB....getting to 4 might be a future upgrade
<ajmitch> seeing that new Mac Pro - could be nice to have dual-cpu, dual-core, 16GB RAM
<nexu> buwhaha
<bmonty> ajmitch: I gotta go to bed, but if you need help testing let me know
<ajmitch> night
<bmonty> I also have the python code for libkrb5 kinda working too
<bmonty> good night all
<LaserJock> man I *just* got 1GB in my AMD 1800+ box not too long ago
<ajmitch> great
<LaserJock> cya bmonty
<ajmitch> bmonty: can you push your branch of that to launchpad?
<bmonty_away> ajmitch: it is in launchpad
<ajmitch> LaserJock: heh, I've got a dead 1800+ sitting here
<ajmitch> bmonty_away: ah, I didn't see, product name?
<bddebian> Gnight bmonty_away
<bmonty_away> ajmitch: python-krb5
<LaserJock> ajmitch: that's my fast box :/
<bmonty_away> hey bddebian
<ajmitch> last time I fetched from you, I used wget to mirror the .bzr dir from https ;)
<ajmitch> Page not found
<ajmitch> There?s no page with this address in Launchpad.
<ajmitch> hm
<bmonty_away> https://launchpad.net/people/bmontgom/+branch/+junk/python-krb5
<ajmitch> ah ok
<ajmitch> thanks :)
<bmonty_away> don't ask me what the +junk is there for
<Fujitsu> bmonty_away, fbi isn't suitable for syncing.
<Fujitsu> bmonty_away, there is a packaging error.
<ajmitch> unattached to a product
<Fujitsu> I've talked to the Debian maintainer, and he's uploading a new one to unstable on Sunday.
* ajmitch lets bmonty_away go to sleep now :)
<bmonty_away> Fujitsu: ok, can you please put that on the bug
<Fujitsu> I shall.
<bmonty_away> yeah...night guys
<Fujitsu> Bye!
<bddebian> Damn, where's lfittl?
<bddebian> Hmm, no one has touched wine yet? :-)
<Amaranth> bddebian: does the one in the repos still segfault?
<Amaranth> bddebian: I just add the winehq source repo and build on my own with patches and -fno-stack-protector
<imbrandon> ajmitch: ping
<ajmitch> yessir?
<imbrandon> your a DD right ?
<ajmitch> am I meant to admit to that?
<bddebian> Amaranth: Dunno but we are a little behind in Edgy
<imbrandon> heheh well i was gonna ask you about the RTP preocess , i have never delt with debian directly
<ajmitch> imbrandon: ITP? RFP?
<imbrandon> got a min or two to explain it to me so i dont fumble it up on my first attempt
<imbrandon> err yea , see i already did lol
<ajmitch> reportbug in a debian chroot
<ajmitch> easiest way to get a template for it
<ajmitch> hm
<imbrandon> ok i have NO clue about how it even works etc
<ajmitch> who put in the libnss-ldap sync request?
<imbrandon> its there a mini doc on it somewhere
<imbrandon> ajmitch: whos name does it say ?
<ajmitch> bddebian:
<ajmitch> bddebian: visit bugs.debian.org/libnss-ldap & tell me how many RC bugs you see there, please
<bddebian> Oh, hehe 5, whoops
<ajmitch> you have tested the debian package on edgy, right?
<bddebian> But of course...
<ajmitch> that is, more that just biuld & check if it installs
<imbrandon> ok ajmitch soo let me be a newb here for a minute, i make me a debian ( probbably sid ) chroot and file a big for a package that isnt even in debain ? ( i'm wanting to get a sponsor for apt-mirror but i'll have to change the config for it as the ubuntu one is ubuntu specific )
<ajmitch> imbrandon: you can send a mail if you want
<imbrandon> s/big/bug
<ajmitch> but I assumed that if you were creating a debian package, you'd be building and testing on debian
<imbrandon> yea i will , err planned to but i just dont know the "debian way"
<imbrandon> to get something in unstable
<LaserJock> hmm, does Xubuntu have a community council?
<imbrandon> only read a very little
<Amaranth> file an ITP?
<imbrandon> Amaranth: yea , thats what i was asking about
<Amaranth> LaserJock: we have one community council for everything
<ajmitch> pretty much as you said - people generally help on #debian-mentors & the mentors mailing list
<ajmitch> Amaranth: not quite correct
<ajmitch> there are also edubuntu & kubuntu councils
<LaserJock> but not Xubuntu, right?
<nexu> blah!
<ajmitch> LaserJock: not that I know of
<Amaranth> ajmitch: oh yeah, i go to the edubuntu meetings :)
<ajmitch> imbrandon: #debian-mentors may be on oftc now
<ajmitch> there's also mentors.debian.net, sponsors.debian.net, or bug your local DD
<imbrandon> ajmitch: ok cool thanks alot , i'll pop in there and see too
<imbrandon> hehe yea your my local DD ;)
<imbrandon> bwhahaha
<ajmitch> there's more than just me here
<imbrandon> true but i dont know whom else is , /me looks arround to see if someone perks up
<ajmitch> noone else wants to admit to it
<LaserJock> imbrandon: basically, and ITP is a bug filed against wnpp
<ajmitch> NM guide has details on it, or the developer's reference
<imbrandon> LaserJock: yea thats all and good but i know zero about wnpp or ITP , i came from suse to ubuntu and learned that way so i have very very very little working knolage about the debian way
<LaserJock> imbrandon: me neither
<LaserJock> take a look at http://www.debian.org/devel/wnpp/
<imbrandon> kk
<LaserJock> ITPs are under "Packages being worked on"
<LaserJock> look at a few of them to see what they look like
<LaserJock> but reportbug, I believe, has a template and everything for it
<imbrandon> yea i'll probably use that as i'll have to install a debain chroot for sid and test it etc anyhow
<ajmitch> debootstrap is your friend
<LaserJock> yeah
<imbrandon> ok so i should build my chroot and get all my package ducks in a row before i bug someone to mentor me ajmitch / LaserJock ?
<ajmitch> you already know packaging, so it shouldn't take too long
<imbrandon> ajmitch: yea i have had a sid chroot on here a few times i just keep cleaning it when i dont use it, shouldent do that i guess
* ajmitch tends not to cleanup
<imbrandon> heh i removed it when i removed my breezy chroot and suse chroot
<imbrandon> heh
<imbrandon> should have kept that one, atm i only have 2 edgy and 2 dapper ( 32/64 bit of each )
* ajmitch still has hoary & breezy
<ajmitch> also sarge
<imbrandon> heh
<imbrandon> sarge is stable right ?
<imbrandon> or old stable
<ajmitch> stable
<ajmitch> woody is oldstable
<imbrandon> ahh yea thats the one, i tried installing that way way way back
<imbrandon> leaste i think that was the one
<imbrandon> it was arround 99ish
<imbrandon> i got it on a magazine cd
<imbrandon> heh
<imbrandon> back when i changed distros once a week
<imbrandon> might have even been the version before woody, dunno it was long ago
<bddebian> Potato
<imbrandon> ;)
<imbrandon> w00t , one more step to world domination complete ....
<imbrandon> I: Base system installed successfully.
<imbrandon> brandon@voyager:/media/extra/sid$
<imbrandon> ;)
<LaserJock> hehe
<crimsun> wow, that totally sucked. Apparently choosing to keep one's system (Win XP) updated just blew away my MBR, so I had to boot from Shipit's Kubuntu live cds to restore GRUB. /me shakes his fist at Win XP.
<imbrandon> crimsun: ouch
<caleb-> crimsun: grub works fine in a bootable active partition. :-)
<crimsun> caleb-: oh it was far more insane. I had to use PXE to get to the frigging cdrom.
<bddebian> nice
<bddebian> Well I see that the popplerkit framework is well maintained..
<bddebian> Oh well, gnight folks
<crimsun> 'night
<dholbach> good morning
<imbrandon> moins dholbach
<dholbach> hey imbrandon
<Burgundavia> Laser_away: can you write me a short piece on your MOTU school?
<Laser_away> dholbach: look at the top sticky at http://www.ubuntuforums.org/forumdisplay.php?f=144
<Burgundavia> Laser_away: after it happens, for the UWN
<Laser_away> Burgundavia: like what?
<Laser_away> Burgundavia: sure
<carthik> What about before it happens for the fridge, and/or the events calendar? I am sure it could use some more visibility.
<carthik> I don't know if the events calendar has to be only about meetings though.
<dholbach> Laser_away: nice
<Laser_away> yeah, I'm not really sure about the fridge calendar
<Laser_away> dholbach: I'm thinking we should have a permanent MOTU School sticky on the edgy forum
<carthik> I tried asking at #ubuntu-fridge regarding an article reproducing your email, Laser_away, but did not get a definitive response
<imbrandon> Laser_away: yea
<dholbach> I personally don't look into the forums much, so I'm probably not the best about handling of the forums. :(
<imbrandon> carthik: i'll take care of the cal thing
<carthik> imbrandon, great :)
<Laser_away> dholbach: me neither, but I feel bad if we don't invite them at least ;-)
<Laser_away> imbrandon: thanks
<imbrandon> carthik: as far as a story just stick one in the cue and get one of us to ACK it ( us == other fidge devel's , we do it on a peer review thing )
<imbrandon> Laser_away: might poke hobbsee about the forums too she frequents them alot
<imbrandon> ( as far as keeping an eye on the post )_
<Amaranth> I'm on the forums all the time.
<Amaranth> In the edgy section, anyway.
<Laser_away> Amaranth: I know, I keep running across your posts
<Amaranth> hehe
<imbrandon> hehe or Amaranth ;)
<Laser_away> ok, I'm going away again
<imbrandon> heh
<imbrandon> ajmitch: ping ( again ) hehe
<TheMuso> Hey imbrandon.
<imbrandon> heya TheMuso
<carthik> imbrandon, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Fridge/Motu-school-packaging if you wish to ACK it
<imbrandon> Laser_away: its in #ubuntu-motu-school right ?
<crimsun> (editing)
<imbrandon> kk
<imbrandon> Laser_away: added to the 11th http://fridge.ubuntu.com/event ( might check for accuracy )
<crimsun> (done)
<imbrandon> cool crimsun thanks
<imbrandon> crimsun: mind proofing that one last time ( i have it live now ) http://fridge.ubuntu.com/
<crimsun> looks fine
<Gloubiboulga> Morning
<carthik> Good morning, Gloubiboulga
<Gloubiboulga> hello carthik
<TheMuso> Evening Hobbsee.
<Hobbsee> hi TheMuso
<TheMuso> How be life?
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: we had the auditors thru work, so that was kinda interesting
<Hobbsee> then again, my painful boss is away at the moment, which is good :)
<TheMuso> heh
<lucas> rah, I like it when we package new software in ubuntu, and then debian packages it too, but differently
<Amaranth> lucas: Dude that's half the fun. :/
<Yagisan> evening all
<TheMuso> Hey Yagisan.
<Hobbsee> hi Yagisan
<Yagisan> so how are we all today ?
* Yagisan is happy. He was banning jerks today.
<micahcowan> sounds... therapeutic.
<Yagisan> it is
<Yagisan> crimsun, did you get my email re nforce2 audio not working ?
<micahcowan> Huh.... I have nforce2...
<micahcowan> ac97
<Yagisan> micahcowan, I found a user that gets no sound at all with their nforce2
<Yagisan> micahcowan, modules loaded etc, just no sound
<Amaranth> Yagisan: Banning jerks?
<Amaranth> Yagisan: The dialip.xtra.co.nz guy was just a huge newb if that's who you're talking about. sabdfl and lilo have both talked to him.
<Yagisan> yes indeed Amaranth. the kind that come in swear, fight with new users, and otherwise cause trouble
<Yagisan> Amaranth, nope - different channel
<Amaranth> ah
<[cro] smiley> morning people
<Hobbsee> hi [cro] smiley
* Yagisan waves hello
<[cro] smiley> can some of the motu review: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2865 please
<lucas> [cro] smiley: trailing '.' in the short description
<lucas> and how does it compare to gtimer, gnotime, and karm ?
<[cro] smiley> lucas, i remove '.' in short description?
<lucas> yes
<[cro] smiley> ok
<lucas> and what about my second question ? also, you could include this info (how it compares to others) in the description
<[cro] smiley> lucas, to be honest i don't know how it compares, never used those :)
<lucas> others might think differently, but I'm not comfortable with the idea of adding a package to ubnutu which does exactly the same thing (or less) than another package already in the archive
<azeem> there are some obvious exceptions to his, like editors, web browsers and irc clients, to which people are emotionally attached to
<azeem> but in general, I think duplicating packages for the sake of packaging isn't so great
<lucas> I'm not saying we need only one editor
<azeem> lucas: sure :)
<lucas> but we wouldn't need two gtk-based editors with vi syntax, for example
<micahcowan> 'course, even there, you could have a "vim" versus "elvis" type thing going on...
<lucas> yeah, but it's easy to justify the presence of both, since one of them has a lot of features, and the other one is aimed at being very light
<Toadstool> 'morning
<Fujitsu> Morning Toadstool.
<[cro] smiley> lucas, i just tryed gtimer, gnotime and kam.  Only gnotime is a bit similar but just with the basic idea. The point at TimeSaver is not to count elapsed time, but to countdown defined task duration.
<imbrandon_> ajmitch: ping , still awake / alive ?
<[cro] smiley> tsaver also has report view but in xml that can be viewed in web browser
<[cro] smiley> lucas, i my opinion my app is much simpler and easyer to use then apps you mentioned above
<[cro] smiley> still it's up to you to decide if you need it or not...
<ajmitch> imbrandon_: what now?
<StevenK> ajmitch: That's a little melodramatic, isn't it?
<imbrandon_> heh i have my package uploaded to mentors.debian.net as gonna see if you wanted to sponsor me or if i should just email the mentor list
<imbrandon_> heh
* StevenK hides from imbrandon_.
<imbrandon_> lol StevenK
<ajmitch> imbrandon_: did you hear that StevenK is a DD? :)
* StevenK curses ajmitch
<imbrandon_> yup yup i see that
<imbrandon_> heh
<ajmitch> StevenK: you know you want to
* StevenK wonders if he became a DD before ajmitch.
<ajmitch> StevenK: of course you did
<StevenK> Nah, he did.
<ajmitch> imbrandon_: I'd email the list
<StevenK> imbrandon_: Depends how large this upload is.
* StevenK isn't at home.
<imbrandon_> StevenK / ajmitch  could either or you look at it , very small stevenk , few hundred k
<imbrandon_> http://mentors.debian.net/cgi-bin/sponsor-pkglist?action=details;package=apt-mirror
* ajmitch is home but probably going to sleep soon enough
<StevenK> Wah.
<imbrandon_> StevenK: its only a few hundred k, its basicly the same package i got into universe
<StevenK> db.d.o doesn't list record creation time.
<ajmitch> nm.d.o lists me
<StevenK> nm.d.o lists me too.
<ajmitch> Account Created 2005-02-03
<ajmitch> see, I'm new
<imbrandon_> hehe
<StevenK> Then you upload it, you need the experience.
* StevenK ducks.
<imbrandon_> lol
<StevenK> Account Created 2001-07-17
<imbrandon_> soooo StevenK you gonna hook a bro up or should i fire up my email client hehe
<phanatic> afternoon
<imbrandon_> 'ello phanatic
<phanatic> hi imbrandon_
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: congrats
<TheMuso> and ajmitch
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: :)
<ajmitch> nothing to congratulate me about
<TheMuso> Yeah there is.
<TheMuso> Recognition from core devs that you are capable and responsible enough to look after that team.
<ajmitch> nah, Hobbsee is set as team owner
<ajmitch> not me
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: you're still the admin
<StevenK> What's the team name?
<ajmitch> ubuntu-universe-sponsors
<Hobbsee> https://launchpad.net/people/ubuntu-universe-sponsors
* StevenK accidently joins.
<Hobbsee> hehe
<TheMuso> I might actually join you lot once I have had MOTU rights for six mnths.
<ajmitch> heh
<TheMuso> months
* Fujitsu considers joining, just to pollute the team, as I have no rights at all :P
* ajmitch tries this f-spot build
<ajmitch> it'll be interesting to see if this works
<TheMuso> heh
* TheMuso hasn't seen -devel go this off-topic before.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: oh it does :P
<tseng> come back at night
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: did you never see it right after release?
<TheMuso> Yeah I have.
<TheMuso> But it wasn't as crazy as this
<Gloubiboulga> TheMuso, hello
<TheMuso> Gloubiboulga: Hey
<Gloubiboulga> TheMuso, could you upload espeak on REVU, it's easier to review a new upstream release there
<TheMuso> Gloubiboulga: Sure.
<Gloubiboulga> (I'm testing the gnome-orca build)
<TheMuso> Gloubiboulga: espeak should be up there.
<Gloubiboulga> TheMuso, ok, thanks
<TheMuso> np
<Gloubiboulga> Hobbsee, why a star (just curious)?
<Hobbsee> Gloubiboulga: because stars are pretty, i'ts yellow, and i like yellow, and...yeah...pretty much :)
<Hobbsee> Gloubiboulga: oh, and the good uploads get a star on them, whereas the bad ones get rejected :P
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: you should have used the heart from REVU
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: could have done that.  one problem:  i dont have a heart.
<ajmitch> because it's on REVU still?
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: How should we take that? :p
<ajmitch> TheMuso: in the worst way possible, of course
<TheMuso> Oh thats right, you like using your whip
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: hehe
<TheMuso> Gloubiboulga: Thanks.
<Gloubiboulga> TheMuso, my pleasure :)
<Fujitsu> Goodnight everybody.
<Hobbsee> night Fujitsu
<Fujitsu> I'll be back tomorrow to pester you all with more merges :P
* TheMuso actually feels like he is starting to get things right.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: yay :)
* TheMuso has been hiding behind merges, while he plucks up the courage to start the ball rolling in implementation, as well as discussion, to do with the radicle accessibility specs he got approved from Paris.
<TheMuso> :p
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: yay :)
* TheMuso decides to write the big bad emails tomorrow, when he has his complete set of wits.
<ajmitch> TheMuso: how radical?
<TheMuso> ajmitch: Well the speakup inclusion and spoken boot specs for a start.
<TheMuso> And theres a few legistical issues that need sorting out from those specs.
<ajmitch> brave
<ajmitch> how would this be enabled?
<TheMuso> Which one?
<ajmitch> spoken boot
<TheMuso> The speakup inclusion spec is the easy one. Speakup is in the kernel, I have just got to finish writing the userspace glue.
<kagou> hi
<ajmitch> I can't imagine that spoken boot would be on by default
<ajmitch> hello kagou
<TheMuso> Basically putting a small speech synth into initramfs with soundcard drivers to start speaking asap. It won't be on by default, but the legistics of getting everything in there.
<TheMuso> Keybuk suggested it in Paris, and Jeff thought it would aso be possible.
<TheMuso> I wasn't thinking of stuff nearly as radicle.
<ajmitch> how would someone that needed it turn it on?
<TheMuso> A command that is run at sudo to set things up.
<TheMuso> Eventually, we hope to put together one big control panel for everything accessibility related.
<ajmitch> so there wouldn't be a boot option on the live cd, for example?
<ajmitch> this would only be for an installed system, at least to start with?
<TheMuso> Not for spoken boot, no.
<TheMuso> Yes.
<TheMuso> It will hopefully piggyback of keybuk's boot message logging stuff that is also in another spec.
<ajmitch> sounds good
<TheMuso> We'll see.
<TheMuso> At least the idea of edgy is to push the boundaries somewhat.
<TheMuso> And play with stuff that might not be entirely stable.
<ajmitch> which is a good thing
<TheMuso> Perfect accessibility testing platform.
<TheMuso> As some of this stuff is still a little raw.
<ajmitch> and very needed
<TheMuso> Very true.
* Yagisan feels sad. All my dapper cd's are gone. I'll need to download and/or order new ones
<TheMuso> Night folks.
<Yagisan> night TheMuso
<nexu> what is "launchpad-integration" for ?
<trappist> I have a bug here that can be fixed easily if 'route -n' will show the right default gateway on a machine whose routing tables were put together by iproute2.  anybody know if this is the case?
<bddebian> Heya gang
<LaserJock> hiya bddebian
<bddebian> Heya LaserJock
<bit_doidao> hello there!
<bit_doidao> i want to recompile php5. how can i do that?
<LaserJock> bit_doidao: apt-get source <sourcepackage>
<LaserJock> that will grab the source package
<bit_doidao> LaserJock, i runned sudo apt-get build-dep php5
<bit_doidao> first i runned the apt-source
<LaserJock> k
<bit_doidao> but it gave me children proccess error
<crimsun> Yagisan: yes, but I've been horridly busy. I'll get to it this evening (~4 hrs)
<LaserJock> bit_doidao: you ran apt-get source php5 ??
<bit_doidao> LaserJock, just did without error
<Yagisan> crimsun, np. take your time (and why am I up at 4:30am ?)
<LaserJock> Yagisan: no wonder you see spots
<LaserJock> bit_doidao: ok so if you go into the source directory and find debian/rules
<Yagisan> LaserJock, sadly ther predate my first use of a computer by about 4 years
<LaserJock> hmm
<bit_doidao> LaserJock, where is the source?
<LaserJock> in the directory you ran apt-get source in
<bit_doidao> LaserJock, untar the php source but dont have debian/rules there
<bddebian> bit_doidao: dpkg-source -x foo.dsc
<LaserJock> bit_doidao: you don't need to untar it
<LaserJock> bit_doidao: the dir should be there
<bddebian> Oh, he did apt-get source.. Duh..
* bddebian shuts his mouth
<bit_doidao> ok, i have three files here.
<bit_doidao> -rw-r--r--  1 root root  102328 2006-07-19 10:10 php5_5.1.2-1ubuntu3.1.diff.gz-rw-r--r--  1 root root    1768 2006-07-19 10:10 php5_5.1.2-1ubuntu3.1.dsc
<bit_doidao> -rw-r--r--  1 root root 8064193 2006-01-18 05:15 php5_5.1.2.orig.tar.gz
<LaserJock> and a directory?
<LaserJock> ack, don't do it as root
<LaserJock> rm those files
<LaserJock> and run "apt-get source php5", no sudo
<bit_doidao> owk, im going from beginning
<bit_doidao> owk, i have everything in /home/duda/php5
<bit_doidao> what now? its my first compilation
<LaserJock> ok, so what do you want to do?
<bit_doidao> LaserJock, use the same php5, but with additional features
<LaserJock> ok
<bit_doidao> in fact, i need imap supoprt and the function imap_rfc822_parse_adrlist
<LaserJock> look at debian/rules in the source directory
<bit_doidao> cool
<bit_doidao> ok, now i have to insert the compile parameter that i want, and than just compile?
<bddebian> dpkg-buildpackage or debuild
<bddebian> With some switches
<bit_doidao> bddebian, i runned ./configure
<bit_doidao> and now make
<bit_doidao> its working..
<LaserJock> bit_doidao: that's probably not the way you want to do it
<LaserJock> bit_doidao: generally you would run dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot (after you install fakeroot)
<bit_doidao> LaserJock, whats the diference from the two methods?
<bit_doidao> it worked here
<LaserJock> well, if you just do a ./configure, make, make install you are not using the Debian/Ubuntu source
<phanatic> bit_doidao: with dpkg-buildpackage you create (build) a package
<LaserJock> dpkg-buildpackage actually uses the info in debian/ to build the package
<bit_doidao> LaserJock, i can redo this now?
<LaserJock> did you do make install?
<bit_doidao> ops, undo
<bit_doidao> LaserJock, yeah
<LaserJock> bit_doidao: hmm, it probably went to /usr/local/
<LaserJock> just rm the source directory
<trappist> I have a bug here that can be fixed easily if 'route -n' will show the right default gateway on a machine whose routing tables were put together by iproute2.  anybody know if this is the case?
<LaserJock> and then run "dpkg-source -x *.dsc " to unpack the source package agian
<Sp4rKy> hey motus
<Sp4rKy> i've always rpath issues with audacious
<LaserJock> darn it!
<LaserJock> a piece of glassware just disintigrated in my hands :(
<LaserJock> I guess it just proves I should give up on chemistry  ;-)
<crimsun> no, it implies you should get increased funding so that lackeys can do the work involving glasswork.
<crimsun> glassware, even
<bddebian> heh
<LaserJock> well, this was more highlevel stuff
<LaserJock> not just cleaning ;-)
<crimsun> like I said, increased funding to get lackeys.
<LaserJock> and us Physical Chemists can't afford to hire undergrad lackeys
<LaserJock> we spend it on lasers
<LaserJock> :-)
<crimsun> you need to work for Uncle, then.
<LaserJock> I just made up a solution and was holding the flask in the sonicator
<LaserJock> and the top just broke into pieces
<LaserJock> very odd
<mc44> LaserJock: I hope you might know this - is there anything like ChemDraw or Chem3D that is packaged for Ubuntu?
<LaserJock> mc44: 2D or 3D or both?
<mc44> both if possible
<LaserJock> for 2D there are quite a few
<mc44> any recommendations for the best?
<LaserJock> xdrawchem and chemtool are ok
<LaserJock> bkchem is supposed to be really good but we don't have it in Ubuntu yet :(
<LaserJock> for 3D, I like ghemical
<LaserJock> it's a molecular modeling app that is really nice
<mc44> Oh sweet, I'll try them out, thanks alot!
<crimsun> (where is bkchem?)
<LaserJock> mc44: also check out https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuScientists
<LaserJock> crimsun: hm?
<LaserJock> http://bkchem.zirael.org/
<crimsun> LaserJock: revu? NEW queue? not in debian? what's the holdup?
<LaserJock> not in anything
<crimsun> I hear bddebian is bored...
<LaserJock> oh wait, there is an ITP (400+ days) in Debian
<bddebian> Nice
* bddebian still wonders why crimsun hates him
<crimsun> dude, you "lost" my pony.
<mc44> LaserJock: Thanks for the link! lots of interesting stuff. Mmmmm mpqc!
<LaserJock> it's python, very nice looking. I hadn't heard of it until a couple days ago and undergrad in my lab mentioned it was better for him than anything we have
<LaserJock> mc44: yeah, ghemical can use mpqc
<LaserJock> as well as mopac7
<mc44> awesome, shall go play some...
<LaserJock> anyway, bkchem is on my todo list, I'd like to do it for Debian
<LaserJock> probably in the debichem project
<LaserJock> we are starting to get a nice gathering of chemistry software
<LaserJock> I also started a team of devs to make a periodic table app for gnome
<mc44> to steal the stuff from kalzium?
<LaserJock> yep
<mc44> excellent
<LaserJock> a big problem for Edubuntu is that kalzium is an excellent educational app
<bddebian> bkchem doesn't look too hard
<LaserJock> and so kdelibs have to be included in the .iso
<LaserJock> which takes up a lot of space
<sbalneav> Be on later tonight.  Bye all
<LaserJock> but gperiodic is not really a serious alternative
<mc44> yeah I played with gperiodic, it wasnt great
<LaserJock> yeah, so we are taking kalziums data (very comprehensive)
<mc44> kalzium isnt listed on that Ubuntu Science page - is that because it is kubuntu only?
<LaserJock> and using pygtk and cairo to do a gnome app
<LaserJock> mc44: it's probably because it's considered more of an educational app or somebody forgot to add it :-)
<LaserJock> mc44: so if you feel like adding it go for it
<LaserJock> mc44: do you know how to use bzr?
<mc44> LaserJock: Its not educational, its required for all those times I forget which thing named after ytterby is which
<mc44> LaserJock: no havent used bzr
<LaserJock> mc44: install bzr real quick :-)
<mc44> its not like I can code either :)
<LaserJock> mc44: well, it is a part of KDE Edutainment so..
<LaserJock> mc44: neither can I ;-)
<LaserJock> I'm a chemist remember :-)
<mc44> I meant its not just educational...
<LaserJock> of course
<mc44> Heh Im more of a not a chemist anymore really
<LaserJock> mc44: tell me when you have it installed
<mc44> just apt-get bzr?
<LaserJock> apt-get install bzr
<mc44> but I like it when apt tells me it cant bzr :)
<LaserJock> hehe
<LaserJock> for some reason I do that all the time
<mc44> there we go
<LaserJock> I think it's because of the -get part
<LaserJock> in my mind i'm saying "Apt, go get bzr"
<LaserJock> ok, now run bzr branch http://dev.realistanew.com/gallium--tw/
<mc44> LaserJock: its finsihed. with 19 revisions apparently
<LaserJock> mc44: then go in to gallium--tw and run python table.py
<mc44> ooooh shiny :)
<LaserJock> mc44: that's what a smart person can do in ~2 days
<LaserJock> they guy who wrote the alacarte menu editor did most of that
<mc44> LaserJock: very cool. Also i'm a big fan of pink for transition metals
<LaserJock> lol, maybe we should have ponies for the elements that don't have pics
<LaserJock> crimsun would like that ;-)
<mc44> And here is Mendelevium, represented by a pony thats *not yours*
<LaserJock> mc44: anyway, that's the kind of thing Ubuntu is about. We were in an Edubuntu meeting talking about how we would like to not have to ship both Gnome and KDE libs
<LaserJock> and a major sticking point to dropping the KDE libs is kalzium
<LaserJock> so we decided to do something about it :-)
* mc44 hugs LaserJock
<mc44> :)
<LaserJock> anyway, I'd better get back to some real chemistry
<mc44> by that you mean, breaking glassware? :)
<LaserJock> mc44: well, hopefully not
<mc44> LaserJock: thanks for the help! I will play with gallium until it breaks then report some bugs :)
<nemish> hello just curious where can I find bugs currently found in Edgy?
<LaserJock> nemish: launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+bugs
<nemish> is that for Edgy or all releases?
<LaserJock> well, it's bugs
<LaserJock> but we need to know of they are for edgy or not
<LaserJock> because they need to be closed if they were fixed :-)
<nemish> hmm okay.. just trying to figure out if bugs I'm finding are found or not.. have never done this before with a "Testing" branch
<LaserJock> just look for the bug
<nemish> ok
<LaserJock> if you don't find it, file it
<nemish> hehehe.. okay
<LaserJock> nemish: and #ubuntu-bugs is the place to ask :-)
<nemish> okay.. what is #ubuntu+1 and #ubuntu-devel used for? and this channel as well?
<nemish> just so I know
<crimsun> edgy and development discussion, respectively.
<nemish> crimsun, which this channel or those others?
<mc44> ubuntu+1 is for the support you get in ubuntu, but for the developmental release (in this case edgy)
<mc44> in #ubuntu i mean
<crimsun> nemish: the topic outlines what this channel is used for :)
<nemish> crimsun, I understand that part but just trying to find out which of these groups would be best to discuss findings in Edgy before/after I file a bug
<nemish> :)
<crimsun> #ubuntu-bugs
<bddebian> Dinner time, later gang
<LaserJock> #ubuntu-bugs is for bug related activity
<nemish> ok figured ubuntu+1 was for edgy discussion.. but okay thanks
<LaserJock> ubuntu+1 is for edgy support
<LaserJock> ubuntu-devel is for development discussion
<LaserJock> and ubuntu-motu is for Universe development in particular
<dholbach> night guys
<LaserJock> cya daniel
<LaserJock> nemish: does that make sense?
<nemish> Sorry to be a pain but for example.. sound not working in Edgy where would I discuss this before opening a ticket that might already be filed? bugs, edgy support(#ubuntu+1) ... just don't want to cause unecessary aggrevation
<nemish> for the most part i can understand that but just don't want to ask about Edgy stuff in wrong channel
<crimsun> ask me in -+1.
<nemish> people tend to get pissed that way
<LaserJock> #ubuntu is about the only place you can't talk about edgy
<tseng> people dont really get pissed
<tseng> but you have to understand
<tseng> if you let people ask anything you will be overwhelmed
<tseng> its esp annoying when the topic clearly states so
<tseng> and no one bothers to read
<LaserJock> yeah, it's really hard to just have random questions, and then people get mad when they aren't answered within 2 minutes :-)
<mc44> LaserJock: are those pics in gallium all the ones from kalzium?
<LaserJock> mc44: sure
<LaserJock> mc44: all the data is from kalzium
<mc44> LaserJock: I might pull together a better collection from wikipedia, at least for the missing ones
<LaserJock> mc44: that would be a nice contribution :-)
<LaserJock> nemish: don't worry too much about it. Just remember to read the topic when you join a channel, usually there is a statement of what is on-topic for that channel
<redguy> howdy LaserJock
<redguy> LaserJock: is the packaging basics MOTU school lecture sheduled for tonight?
<crimsun> tomorrow night.
<micahcowan> or friday morning, depending on where you're located. :-)
<crimsun> unless you're in au/nz
<crimsun> in which case, yes, "tonight"
<redguy> heh, it's tomorrow night then
<redguy> any chance of rescheduling it to 04:00 UTC?
<imbrandon> redguy: doubtfull as it has been announced already for a few days
<imbrandon> redguy: but there will be logs
<redguy> as one of the requests on the wiki says, it would allow more people to participate
#ubuntu-motu 2006-08-10
<imbrandon> depending on LaserJock's schedule though you MIGHT convince him to "re"hold the class again at 4 UTC though, but thats totaly upto him and what else he has planned, i know he is very busy most of the time
<LaserJock> I was thinking of perhaps doing it again at a better time
<LaserJock> what would 04:00 UTC be for the Europeans?
<redguy> 6 am for CET
<LaserJock> let's see, that would be 9:00 pm for me, I don't think I could do it
<LaserJock> what about 17:00 UTC?
<redguy> coffe it is then ;-)
<redguy> oh
<redguy> 17:00 would be just perfect for me
<TheMuso> Meh. I'd have to refer to transcripts again. :)
<redguy> 18:00 in the UK, 19:00 in the resto fo eourope (i suppose)
<TheMuso> LaserJock: I don't mind really, as long as there are logs/transcripts afterwards.
<imbrandon> TheMuso: he is talking about doing it 2wice
<TheMuso> Oh.
<LaserJock> yeah, I will keep the present one
<LaserJock> but if people want another go I could try it (I might be a little tired of the subject by then, but ...)
<redguy> btw, where are the earlier logs availible?
<redguy> oh, sorry. Didn't look hard enough
<nemish> any talk of flock making it into Edgy?
<nemish> or Dapper
<nemish> ?
<crimsun> (sorry, but questions lacking context are really difficult to absorb on initial reading)
<phanatic> i know it's not a support channel, but it's s.o.s.: my / partition was remounted as ro due to an error
<phanatic> i cannot even save my work :(
<phanatic> /dev/sda7 on / type ext3 (rw,errors=remount-ro)
<TheMuso> Ouch.
<phanatic> i just launched a search in nautilus
<phanatic> after that i got this
<phanatic> the /home is on a different partition, but i cannot save to that either (tho it's mounted rw)
<TheMuso> What?
<TheMuso> Thats really weird.
<phanatic> yep
<phanatic> never seen like this before
<phanatic> oh my, #ubuntu is pretty useless :(
<micahcowan> phanatic, you've hardly given it any time.
<phanatic> micahcowan: okay, i can wait :)
<phanatic> it's just running off the screen very soon...
<imbrandon> heya Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> hi imbrandon, hi all
<ajmitch> hello
<Hobbsee> hi ajmitch
<LaserJock> hmm, does anybody have ops in #ubuntu-motu-school?
<ajmitch> yay, another merge(well, a sync) for me to do
<ajmitch> LaserJock: yes
<ajmitch> you want topic unlocked for now?
<crimsun> that would suffice
<LaserJock> I guess, I just want it updated
<ajmitch> go ahead
<crimsun> we shouldn't have to worry about vandalism in there anyway.
<ajmitch> is it cheating if I create syncs for me to file, if I do the debian upload? :)
<StevenK> Heh
<StevenK> ajmitch: I don't think so, but I've done the same thing. :-)
<LaserJock> ack, I can't figure out how to do it
* StevenK points at spe.
* ..[topic/#ubuntu-motu:crimsun] : foo
* LaserJock is an IRC noob ;/
<crimsun> err, sorry
<StevenK> crimsun: Nicely done.
<StevenK> :-P
<crimsun> yeah, go me with my missing leading /
<crimsun> LaserJock: /topic newstuff
<LaserJock> yeah, I figured
<LaserJock> it just wasn't letting me do anything
<LaserJock> but I guess chanserv is being difficult
<ajmitch> LaserJock: that's fixed
<crimsun> if anyone has topic history, that would be great ;)
<ajmitch> crimsun: grepping logs :)
* ..[topic/#ubuntu-motu:ajmitch] : to: Ubuntu Masters of the Universe: Ubuntu Universe Repository Maintainers | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Documentation | Focus on http://tinyurl.com/nl87h (MOTU bugs) and http://tinyurl.com/rjcqu (UNMETDEPS) and http://tinyurl.com/kbxpe (mysqlclient) | http://tinyurl.com/pghsw (motureviewers) | [Edgy MoM]  https://merges.ubuntu.com/universe.html | Add yourself to http://tinyurl.com/fgpgy to upload to REVU
<ajmitch> hopefully that was the last one set
<ajmitch> probably not, looking at how old it is
<StevenK> That looks Dapper-ish
* ajmitch scrolls up 
<Hobbsee> before foo?
<crimsun> yeah
* ..[topic/#ubuntu-motu:Hobbsee] : Ubuntu Masters of the Universe: Ubuntu Universe Repository Maintainers | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Documentation | Focus on http://tinyurl.com/nl87h (MOTU bugs) and http://tinyurl.com/rjcqu (UNMETDEPS) and http://tinyurl.com/kbxpe (mysqlclient) | http://tinyurl.com/pghsw (motureviewers) | [Edgy MoM]  https://merges.ubuntu.com/universe.html | Add yourself to http://tinyurl.com/fgpgy to upload to REVU
<Hobbsee> there you go :)
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: yes, exactly the same
<crimsun> thanks :)
<ajmitch> we should change a few of those items
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: true enough
<Hobbsee> hi Burgundavia
<TheMuso> Hey Hobbsee
<ajmitch> hello Burgundavia
<Hobbsee> hi TheMuso
<Burgundavia> hey Hobbsee
<Burgundavia> can anybody get to ubuntu.ca or ubuntu-ca.org?
<StevenK> Burgundavia: I can.,
<StevenK> s/\,$//
<crimsun> same here
* ajmitch just has to figure out the python policy for his other packages now
<ajmitch> oh that's an interesting point about the use of ~ in versions
<LaserJock> heh, the only bugs I get from Debian for my packages are the policy kind
<Burgundavia> ajmitch: isn't mvo doing some sort of python policy too?
<ajmitch> other packages that depend on foo (>= x.y), foo (<< x.y+1), but foo x.y+1~z is uploaded
<ajmitch> Burgundavia: the whole world is moving to a new policy
<ajmitch> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/pkgreport.cgi?submitter=madcoder-python-transition@debian.org
<ajmitch> to give an indication of how much needs fixed
<Burgundavia> ajmitch: yes, and what is the difference between central and support?
<ajmitch> not much
<ajmitch> it's basically just pick which one you want
<LaserJock> doko recommends central, but he wrote it so that makes sense ;-)
<crimsun> from a maintainer's perspective, you install to a different location for pysupport
* StevenK finally updated Linda a few days ago.
<Burgundavia> right, that is utter insanity
<Burgundavia> why have two?
* ajmitch used pycentral with his package that was just uploaded
<StevenK> pycentral looked less polished than pysupport.
* StevenK tried both of them.
<ajmitch> I only had to add a few lines in either case
<crimsun> right, it's absolutely trivial for a maintainer's usage
<LaserJock> Burgundavia: I think there is an internal... discussion that means 2 apps to do the job
<StevenK> I changed Linda's build system so I could specify the module path more easily.
<Burgundavia> right, I sensed it was a bit more than discussion
<crimsun> See point #1 here: http://www.debian.org/doc/packaging-manuals/python-policy/ap-upgrade.html
<ajmitch> LaserJock: you should get your announcement of the school session on devel-announce if posible
<LaserJock> ajmitch: well, I sent it to -devel
<ajmitch> I saw
<LaserJock> I wasn't sure if u-d-a was appropriate or not
<ajmitch> the sessions by pitti & crimsun were listed there by dholbach
<ajmitch> does anyone here use f-spot & want to test importing?
<ajmitch> especially those bitten by imports of rotated photos being broken in some cases
<jsgotangco> ajmitch: edgy?
<ajmitch> jsgotangco: for sure
<ajmitch> I don't have issues with it at the moment, but others run into the bug
<jsgotangco> now if i could only have a sane network on edgy
<Burgundavia> hmm, I wish I could get edgy to install
<bmonty> hi all
<Hobbsee> Burgundavia: you cant?
<imbrandon> i've been on edgy for a while now
<imbrandon> heya bmonty
<TheMuso> Hey imbrandon.
<imbrandon> heya TheMuso
<Burgundavia> Hobbsee: installer fails on the partitioner
<Hobbsee> Burgundavia: ah. useufl
<Hobbsee> *useful
<TheMuso> Burgundavia: You using desktop or alternate
<jsgotangco> mine doesn't recognize the interfaces at first boot
<imbrandon> Burgundavia: even with the alternate ?
<Burgundavia> TheMuso: desktop
* ajmitch has only done upgrades from dapper
<TheMuso> Right.
<Burgundavia> don't have any edgy alternate pulled down
* TheMuso tried to install with the latest daily, but it seems to fail in the step after bootstrapping. The server preceed file doesn't exist on the site either.
<TheMuso> SO I had to use knot 1.
<Burgundavia> I have heard all manner of hell from my LUG about the dapper installer, so I try and test is rigourously
<TheMuso> site/cd/
<ajmitch> Burgundavia: dapper's install was ok, but had quite a few bugs
<Burgundavia> yep
<ajmitch> most of which are probably fixed with 6.06.1
<ajmitch> if that's out now
<ajmitch> looks like it is
<imbrandon> ajmitch: yea its out afaik just maybe not on ALL mirrors
* imbrandon wonders whom idea it was to put higher version of packages in dapper-updates than in edgy
<imbrandon> brb
<bmonty> crimsun: ping
<crimsun> pong
<bmonty> do you know anything about fcitx?
<bmonty> (free chinese input toy)
<crimsun> no, freeflying might
<bmonty> package is on the merge list...looks like a sync request to me
<freeflying> bmonty: please sync it from sid
<bmonty> freeflying: ok
<freeflying> bmonty: thanks
<bmonty> np :)
<bmonty> gaim 2.0.0 is going to be the standard for edgy, correct?
<ajmitch> bmonty: should be
<ajmitch> current in edgy is 1:2.0.0+beta3-4ubuntu2
<bmonty> ok, I think we should remove the gaim-meanwhile package.  See http://meanwhile.sourceforge.net/wiki/Gaim%20Meanwhile
<ajmitch> currently gaim is built without meanwhile support
<ajmitch> due to the lib being in universe
<bmonty> ajmitch: yeah, but if it was built with meanwhile support, the plugin is included in gaim 2.0.0
<ajmitch> either way we don't have the meanwhile plugin built
<ajmitch> the hard option is to rip the plugin out of gaim's source & update gaim-meanwhile with it in universe
<ajmitch> the easier option is to convince people that libmeanwhile should be in main
<toddobryan> Hi, all. If a Debian package exists for something, how hard is it to get an Ubuntu package?
<imbrandon> toddobryan: depends, it should be in edgy if its in unstable
<imbrandon> if not its just a matter of a sync
<imbrandon> if it builds ok  etc
<imbrandon> toddobryan: what package ?
<toddobryan> drscheme, v352
<ajmitch> probably just needs another sync
<imbrandon> yea
<imbrandon> its in edgy
<imbrandon> brandon@voyager:~$ apt-cache madison drscheme
<imbrandon>   drscheme | 1:209-9ubuntu2 | http://192.168.1.5 edgy/universe Packages
<imbrandon>   drscheme | 1:209-9ubuntu2 | http://archive.ubuntu.com edgy/universe Packages
<ajmitch> source is 1:301-15
<ajmitch> which obviously didn't build
<imbrandon> right
* ajmitch grabs & tries building
<imbrandon> kk
<toddobryan> If it's in edgy, can I install it in dapper?
<toddobryan> Oh, wait. This is the backport thing, right?
<toddobryan> (Can you tell I've only been doing the Ubuntu thing since June?)
<imbrandon> possibly but its not recomended unless its in dapper-backports becouse then it has been tested in a dapper enviroment
<toddobryan> While you're trying to build that, how hard is it to learn to package stuff?
<toddobryan> Specifically, I use some Java programs in my teaching, and would love to have Ubuntu packages for them.
<imbrandon> toddobryan: depends on the person, a good place to start is the packaging guide and the MOTU classes
<imbrandon> !packaging guide
<ubotu> The packaging guide is at http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/index.html Other developer resources are at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DeveloperResources
<toddobryan> I just saw the class channel tonight. Once I can figure out how I'm related to UTC, I'll be sure to give those a try.
<toddobryan> :-)
<imbrandon> heh
<imbrandon> where are you ?
<toddobryan> US, Eastern Time.
<toddobryan> I think I'm UTC-6 ??
<bmonty> toddobryan: you are -4 from UTC
<imbrandon> gmt -4 then i would think
<toddobryan> Thanks.
<imbrandon> yea
<toddobryan> I was close.
<bmonty> toddobryan: the difference between New York and Denver :)
<imbrandon> heh
<toddobryan> But are Java programs reasonable given that they don't have different binaries, don't need make, etc?
<bmonty> toddobryan: yes, the packaging system can handle java programs
<toddobryan> bmonty: I meant, are they reasonably easy to package? Is it something I could figure out in a weekend, or should I wait until I have a free week or two?
* ajmitch should really get beaglefs synced
<nixternal> east coast is UTC -4 until we fall back an hour, then it will be UTC -5, and me and imbrandon will be UTC -6 again
<bmonty> toddobryan: hard to say, but take a look at the packaging guide.  It should give you an idea of the level of effort required
<imbrandon> toddobryan: you could probably get a good start on it in a weekend but dont expect to be an expert by then, it will likely take a cupple of months of weekends to get it 1000%
<ajmitch> imbrandon: that soon?
* ajmitch must be a really slow learner
<bmonty> ajmitch: I thought you learned how in two hours
<imbrandon> ajmitch: hehe well possibly longer, but the basics to make a simple package
<nixternal> no doubt imbrandon, i have been doing it for a few months, and i still bother you to show me stuff
<nixternal> oh, the basics tonight ;)
<ajmitch> bmonty: more like 5 years
<nixternal> i did my first package in a few hours, then had to learn how to sync it last night ;)
<toddobryan> Looking at the packaging guide is actually very frustrating. They go through the basics of packaging some files, but there's no big overview to help you get your bearings.
<nixternal> thanks to Hobbsee of course on that first package
<imbrandon> ajmitch: heheh yea thats what i mean i've been doing it some months new and am still very much a newb for the most part
<bmonty> I love creating a sync request for a package I just finished merging a couple days ago :(
<imbrandon> toddobryan: thats becouse its very much experince orented every package can be very diffrent even though they all follow the same basic guidelines
<toddobryan> Ah.
<imbrandon> or /should/ follow
<imbrandon> heh
<ajmitch> bmonty: I love filing a sync request for stuff that I've been changing in debian
<bmonty> ajmitch: at least you can plan for that
<ajmitch> quite easily
<ajmitch> if I've got time to test one, I test the other
<imbrandon> but yea you can get the basic concepts down in a weekend or two but like ajmitch said ( and dont let him fool you he is VERY good ) has been doing it 5 years and still trips up on things ;)
<bmonty> if I had waited 24 hours I could have done the sync request in the first place (kboincspy)
<ajmitch> imbrandon: yes, like learning how to work with the new python policy, for example :)
<imbrandon> hehehe
<ajmitch> oh good
<ajmitch> drscheme builds cleanly on edgy
<toddobryan> OK. So there's this program, DrJava. It's a double-clickable jar file. That's the whole thing. Should *theoretically* be really easy to package, right?
<imbrandon> ;P
<toddobryan> ajmitch: Thank you!!! That's great news.
<imbrandon> toddobryan: single binary ?
<toddobryan> imbrandon: yep. That's it.
<imbrandon> toddobryan: yea shouldent be terribly difficult but dont quote me 100% on that as i've never even looked at the progam
* imbrandon avoids java like the plague
<toddobryan> imbrandon: no problem. But it's probably a good one to start with.
<toddobryan> imbrandon: I've become very enamored of Python recently. But as long as I teach AP Comp Sci, they're using Java.
<imbrandon> heh get em to use c# ;)
* imbrandon hugs mono
<bmonty> toddobryan: you are able to require the use of ubuntu in your class?
<welshbyte> i've been using java for over 5 years and it's the language i'm most proficient in... i hate it
<ajmitch> sync request filed for drscheme for edgy
<toddobryan> imbrandon: Um, C#??? How would I afford the Visual Studio licenses?
<imbrandon> toddobryan: *cough* mono *cough*
<imbrandon> monodevelop
<toddobryan> bmonty: I'm going to require it in my senior class, which is a software engineering/random CS topics class.
<imbrandon> on windows sharpdevelop
<bmonty> toddobryan: since you said "AP" I'm assuming this is a high school class?
<toddobryan> bmonty: There are only 20 kids, so I can help them with the installation.
<toddobryan> imbrandon: Ah, now I remember what mono is...the OSS version of .Net?
<imbrandon> toddobryan: basicly yes
<toddobryan> bmonty: Yes. I teach at a high school with a Math/Science/Tech magnet.
<Burgundavia> http://www.mono-project.com/Main_Page
<bmonty> toddobryan: nice
<toddobryan> bmonty: Most days. Today we heard from the district office that they wouldn't tell us the license code for Windows so that we could create images for our labs.
<ajmitch> now if you can go ubuntu all the way, it'd be good
<bmonty> even more reason to use ubuntu
<imbrandon> ubuntu ;)
<toddobryan> bmonty: We'll see whether they expect us to go around and install software on every machine individually or if they hope to do it before school starts next Tuesday.
<ajmitch> though we're just slightly biased towards ubuntu in here
<LaserJock> ajmitch: really? I hadn't noticed that ;-)
<imbrandon> or {k,ed}ubuntu
<Burgundavia> toddobryan: we recommend Edubuntu or Ubuntu for your licensing needs. I have found to remove 100% of them.
<imbrandon> ;)
<bmonty> I'm not biased
<toddobryan> Actually, the plan in my lab is to have Windows on the hard drives to keep the county people happy, and then run Ubuntu using DRBL.
<ajmitch> LaserJock: yes, we hate it with a passion & can't help noticing the flaws
<welshbyte> *jedi hand wave* It's ubuntu that you're looking for, not these droids...
<imbrandon> lol
<Burgundavia> the MCP in me would like to point out that AD is still easier than LDAP
* ajmitch finds that people that are involved with development are often more realistic about the shortcomings :)
<toddobryan> Oh, I'm convinced.
<toddobryan> But, get this.
<ajmitch> Burgundavia: I know, oh I know
<Burgundavia> ajmitch: right. Do something about it already ;)
<toddobryan> They just got an email server that is only fully functional with IE.
<bmonty> Burgundavia: lol
<LaserJock> toddobryan: ouch, that's not nice
<imbrandon> toddobryan: ouch , email that requires IE ?
<bmonty> toddobryan: let me guess...outlook web access?
<toddobryan> Uh-huh.
<toddobryan> And that's all we've got.
<ajmitch> Burgundavia: that sort of thing will take a year or two at least - it needs to be integrated across the system & desktop
<imbrandon> toddobryan: you know evolution can access owa 100% right ?
<bmonty> you know it is possible to use it with firefox if the admin enables the "standard" mode
<Burgundavia> toddobryan: OWA will work in FF
* bmonty has fought several admins to turn that on
<bmonty> ...and lost
<toddobryan> The teacher next door to me had her account frozen because there were too many messages in her inbox, and they kept telling her it was because she was using Firefox.
<toddobryan> Oh, it's usable. Just not "fully functional." Whatever that means.
<imbrandon> toddobryan: evolutions excahnge connectior will connect to OWA also no problems infact thats what it was designed to do
<toddobryan> I use a Mac at home. :-)
<LaserJock> I use a Mac at work. :-)
* imbrandon has a mac downstairs ( with ubuntu on it )
<imbrandon> hehe
<welshbyte> I use a Mac when i have to walk to the shops in the rain
<LaserJock> bah, well mine has a really messed up Edgy on it, darn ATI
<toddobryan> My PowerBook dual boots...
<toddobryan> :-)
* Burgundavia watches toddobryan's bug roll by in #ubuntu-bugs
<imbrandon> yea my iBook dual boots osx 10.4 and edgy
<toddobryan> So, once drscheme is in edgy, can I request a backport?
<LaserJock> some days, what I wouldn't give for a ppc mac :/
<imbrandon> heh
<imbrandon> LaserJock: trade ya ;) hehe
<LaserJock> sorry, my boss might get mad
<ajmitch> there's a fairly good chance drscheme will build cleanly on dapper as well
* ajmitch should check that now
<imbrandon> toddobryan: yea but i would pop in here and ask the proper protocal first to make sure it go's through
<toddobryan> I did not know that Evolution would work with a web connection. I'm setting that up now.
<Burgundavia> toddobryan: evo can speak directly to exchange
<imbrandon> LaserJock: just paint my iBook black and print a sn sticker on the laser printer and pop it on the battery , good to go .... heheh
<toddobryan> It would be great if the Ubuntu teachers had better email access than the poor saps on Windows.
<imbrandon> Burgundavia: thats what i asaid, and actualy it talks to OWA not exchange directly if you actualy read what it does even though its named "exchange connector"
* ajmitch needs to fixup his dapper pbuilder
<Burgundavia> imbrando: yep
<bmonty> goodnight all
<ajmitch> night bmonty
<toddobryan> Does anyone know if apostrophe is legal in an email address?
<ajmitch> toddobryan: unlikely
<imbrandon> doubtfull
<toddobryan> Yeah. They just made us all new email addresses, and didn't check.
<toddobryan> So mine is Todd.O'Bryan@lameschool.us
<toddobryan> Argh.
<imbrandon> lol
* ajmitch looks at the RFC
<ajmitch> toddobryan: looks valid actually
<toddobryan> Yeah. It worked. Amazing.
<imbrandon> sounds like you guys need a IT dept ;)
<welshbyte> imbrandon: cor, that's a bit drastic, isn't it? :)
<imbrandon> welshbyte: heh maybe ;)
<toddobryan> It's not really the IT people's fault. The district pays crap, so can't get qualified people.
<LaserJock> hmm, anybody know if quod libet has done the python policy transition in edgy?
<toddobryan> I had a student find her way into a payroll department computer and a big list of social security numbers.
<imbrandon> heh nice
<ajmitch> LaserJock: yes
<toddobryan> All because no one bothered to turn off hidden shares.
<ajmitch> LaserJock: at least it depends on python-central
<LaserJock> k, I was thinking of using it tomorrow
<imbrandon> toddobryan: yup another valaid reason for all linux ( esp the servers )
<ajmitch> LaserJock: brave of you
* poningru cries on Burgundavia 
<poningru> whyyyyyyyyy
<crimsun> mutagen might be simpler
<LaserJock> ajmitch: or stupid
<Burgundavia> poningru: ?
<crimsun> (it depends on mutagen)
<poningru> dude I should have asked you to make a presentation to the UF people
<crimsun> (and yes, mutagen has transitioned)
<LaserJock> crimsun: well, I liked quod libet because it was python and it has multiple binaries
<Burgundavia> poningru: UF?
<poningru> uni of florida
<poningru> just got a new library
<LaserJock> crimsun: I don't think I'll say much about it
<crimsun> LaserJock: then you probably want to use 0.22-2, which has some stuff fixed.
<poningru> millions of $$$ on computers+software
* poningru wept
<ajmitch> Burgundavia the ubuntu superstar?
<Burgundavia> poningru: that is sad
* poningru wept like little girl
<Burgundavia> ajmitch: more like Corey Burger the Userful salesman
<crimsun> stuff are on tiber:/var/cache/pbuilder/result/
<LaserJock> crimsun: hmm, maybe I should do mutagen and then quod libet to show what a multiple binary package looks like
<LaserJock> I'm afraid people have too high of expectations, you can't cover much in that amount of time
<crimsun> LaserJock: however you want to, prof.
<Burgundavia> poningru: in better news, colorado is shaping very nicely
<toddobryan> Thanks so much, guys. Just got Evolution set up. It's awesome.
<LaserJock> crimsun: hah, you're the real prof
<ajmitch> LaserJock: teach us to package OOo!
<imbrandon> toddobryan: np ;)
<LaserJock> ajmitch: don't make me cry
<ajmitch> LaserJock: I think you'd scare everyone off
<imbrandon> hehe pick a k* package ;)
<ajmitch> and you'd probably be hitting the liqour cabinet quite soon ;)
<imbrandon> lol
<imbrandon> LaserJock: my wife just told me its been 112+ out there the last few days
<LaserJock> imbrandon: I'd rather not package any g* or k*
<LaserJock> imbrandon: recently? it hasn't been that bad I don't think
<imbrandon> well i just got off the phone with her, about an hour ago
<imbrandon> she might have been talking about recient past
<poningru> Burgundavia: nice
<LaserJock> imbrandon: yeah, the high today was 90 in Reno
<LaserJock> it was really hot not long ago
<toddobryan> OK. Completely off-topic question...How do I find the Global Catalog server name?
<imbrandon> is there an ldap server setup ?
<crimsun> hah, I just called a troll in #ubuntu. Nice.
<crimsun> just got called, rather
<imbrandon> hahaha
<LaserJock> oh nice
<ajmitch> yes, after saying 1 line
<ajmitch> I was impressed
* imbrandon looks
<LaserJock> what did you say?
<crimsun> 23:34 < mike-e> so, ubuntu doesn't support ISA?
<crimsun> 23:35 < crimsun> mike-e: it does, why?
<toddobryan> Well, on the web interface, I just click a button.
<imbrandon> hahaha thats classic
<imbrandon> you anwsered him
<imbrandon> should i feed the real troll and ask him why ? heh
<crimsun> nah
<crimsun> serves me right for trying to help
<imbrandon> heh
<toddobryan> ajmitch: Any news on drscheme in Dapper?
<ajmitch> toddobryan: no, have to fix my build system first :)
<toddobryan> ajmitch: Oh, OK. No prob.
<LaserJock> ah, stink. I don't know how far to take this
<LaserJock> I'd like to use an edgy pbuilder to build the packages
<LaserJock> but that means people need to have an edgy pbuilder
<imbrandon> thats a good hour there setting that up ;)
<imbrandon> for newbs
<welshbyte> luckily i set one up just yesterday :)
<imbrandon> ajmitch: i got drscheme building in a dapper pbuilder right now
<imbrandon> we'll see if it works
<ajmitch> imbrandon: thanks - it should build fine
<ajmitch> since it does on edgy, build-depends look sane
<imbrandon> yea it grabed all the deps fine, and its actualy building now
<imbrandon> brb gonna get a soda while this compiles
<ajmitch> edgy sync request is already in
<LaserJock> hmm, mutagen is CDBS goodness
<toddobryan> You guys are awesome.
<toddobryan> It'll be so much nicer if this installs in the right place with an icon and everything.
<imbrandon> ok builds find in a dapper chroot too
<imbrandon> i'll file a backport request for dapper , meantime toddobryan i have uploaded the package that it built to my webserver but rember 2 things before you grab it and try it
<imbrandon> 1 is i have zero idea if this actualy works and there is zero support for this as i just personaly built it from the unstable source
<imbrandon> 2 i'm not responsible if it makes your system go BOOM lol
<ajmitch> imbrandon: wait for the sync to go through before going for the dapper backport
<imbrandon> but with that said your more than welcome to try this package while you wait for the backport request to take effect as that could be a while
<imbrandon> ajmitch: ok
<imbrandon> toddobryan: http://www.buntudot.org/people/~imbrandon/misc/drscheme/  <-- i uploaded the dapper builds ther if you want to try them
<imbrandon> they should install fine
<imbrandon> s/ther/there
<imbrandon> i assume your on i386 too , if not i have amd64 / pcc that i can do later tonight if you want but i'm not gonna waste my time unless you ask
<imbrandon> toddobryan: ^^
<imbrandon> woot ajmitch i got an email back from a DD sponsor but i dont quite understand what he's asking me to do
<imbrandon> got a half sec ?
<imbrandon> he replied with :
<imbrandon> I'll review it.
<imbrandon> Please reopen #293048 [0]  and close it in the changelog.
<imbrandon> [0]  http://bugs.debian.org/293048
<imbrandon> reopen the bug ? and close it with the changelog ?
* imbrandon isnt sure what that means
<crimsun> you need to reopen it, because it timed out due to inactivity and was thus closed
<crimsun> then in debian/changelog, you can use: (Closes: #293048)
<imbrandon> ahh ok so rebuild again and add that ( once the bug is reopened )
<ajmitch> yes, though you shouldn't have to wait long
* ajmitch tries out the new i810 driver
<imbrandon> wait long ?
<ajmitch> depending on how slow the bug server is
<Fujitsu> ajmitch, it's pretty slow...
<imbrandon> ahh ok
<ajmitch> imbrandon: http://www.debian.org/Bugs/ has info on how to reopen bugs
<imbrandon> kk thanks ajmitch
<toddobryan> imbrandon: Thanks!!!!
<toddobryan> imbrandon: (was in the bathroom, then got distracted by a bad install.)
<imbrandon> yw , but as i said , it builds dosent mean it works heheh try at your risk
<toddobryan> I have actually run the source version, so it *should* be okay.
<toddobryan> Maybe.
<toddobryan> Grabbed them both and will give them a try! Thanks again.
<imbrandon> np
<imbrandon> so i send these command to control@ in the body of the email ?
<crimsun> it's described at the above URL
<imbrandon> yea i'm reading it, its kinda cryptic
<ajmitch> oh dear
<ajmitch> we're getting spam on bugreports now
<ajmitch> bug 4670
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 4670 in linux-source-2.6.15 "when webcam is connected the system hangs" [Medium,Fix released]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/4670
<ajmitch> see last comment
<imbrandon> hahahah classic
<toddobryan> Well, it's closing in one 1:00 am here, so I think I will go home and leave my classroom till tomorrow.
<toddobryan> :-(
<toddobryan> Thanks for all the help!!!
<Burgundavia> ajmitch: that looks like an automated "look at my cool thing", list created by uploaded a list from his email client of all the email addies that have sent anything to him
<imbrandon> darn windows users
<ajmitch> Burgundavia: still rather inconvenient
<imbrandon> whats this " quit stop thank... " at the end, is that an example or grrr
<ajmitch> imbrandon: btw, a useful tool is bts :)
<crimsun> imbrandon: it's a delimiter
<imbrandon> heh probably but this is so freakin cryptic i HATE the debian website, it links back to links to the same links back to .....
<imbrandon> i cant ever find anything i'm looking for
<crimsun> actually I think the Debian Web site is straightforward
<imbrandon> crimsun: i realize that but is it ment littlerly or ...
<imbrandon> like here is the email i'm composing
<imbrandon> reopen 293048 imbrandon@kubuntu.org
<imbrandon> #... Reopening this request , and uploaded to mentors.debian.net
<imbrandon> quit
<imbrandon> stop
<imbrandon> thank...
<imbrandon> --...
<imbrandon> thats what i got out of this damn thing so far
<imbrandon> heheh crimsun the website is the main reason i use ubuntu , i could never find the right link to the iso i wanted to download
<imbrandon> ( long ago )
<Burgundavia> ajmitch: can you pm me a one line summary of where your soc project is?
<imbrandon> isnt there a web interface to do all this ?
<LaserJock> grrr, this is turning into a novel :(
<Fujitsu> Does anybody want to process merges for me?
<Fujitsu> They all build properly on x86 Edgy.
<Hobbsee> hi all
* Hobbsee hides
<imbrandon> heya Hobbsee
<Fujitsu> {Eve,Mor}ning.
<Hobbsee> hi imbrandon
* Fujitsu heads off home.
<TheMuso> Hey Hobbsee.
<TheMuso> How goes the wonderful world of studies?
* IRCD=dancer CAPAB CHANTYPES=# EXCEPTS INVEX CHANMODES=bdeIq,k,lfJD,cgijLmnPQrRstz CHANLIMIT=#:20 PREFIX=(ov)@+ MAXLIST=bdeI:50 MODES=4 STATUSMSG=@ KNOCK NICKLEN=16 :are supported by this server 
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* Signon time  :    Fri Jul 21 19:12:37 2006
* Signoff time :    Thu Aug 10 09:19:34 2006
* Total uptime :   19d 14h  6m 57s
* Starting logfile irclogs/ubuntu-motu.log
<Hobbsee> hi all
<lucas> hi Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> hey lucas :)
<Burgundavia> Hobbsee:  http://www.warbard.ca/temp/official-desktop-happy-corey-2.svg <-- just to cheese you off ;)
<Hobbsee> Burgundavia: hah
* Hobbsee has actually been thinking of trying gnome again, actually
<Burgundavia> Hobbsee: in fact, I am going to be making a 3' x 5' banner for LWE with that on it
<Burgundavia> just to expressly cheese you off
<micahcowan> Why would it cheese her off... is she KDE?
<Burgundavia> micahcowan: oh yes, and I remind her of it quite frequently
<micahcowan> :-)
<Burgundavia> honestly, Hobbsee is hard working and a nice person
<Burgundavia> she takes my kidding quite well
* Hobbsee is an axe murderer.  all be warned
<Hobbsee> micahcowan: i'm part of the kubuntu council, among other things.  so kde stuff, yes.
<micahcowan> Well, I've seen her onlist just enough to conclude she's pretty nice.... as to her being hard working, well, I see her lounging on IRC all the time...
<micahcowan> ;-)
<Hobbsee> micahcowan: heh
<Hobbsee> micahcowan: check out edgy changes for the last couple of months :P
* Hobbsee files A BUG!
<micahcowan> Ah, yes. But I'm on ubuntu, so I might not see your changes :p
<Hobbsee> micahcowan: edgy changes shows them all.  actually, i have done a couple of gnomeish packages
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: You are interested in looking at GNOME again? :)
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: only very slightly.
<TheMuso> hehe right.
<Hobbsee> GNOME is horrible :P
<TheMuso> Oh really?
<Hobbsee> yes :P
<TheMuso> Convince me. :)
<thom> anything that claims to be a desktop environment is horrible
* thom proposes starting ibuntu
<Lathiat> heh
<thom> it'd be very minimal. ion3, rxvt-unicode, firefox, evince-gtk, muttng
<nexu> thats too bloated, you would have something that manage your windows
<thom> i didn't say unusable :-)
<nexu> :P
<nexu> but ion is somehow cute yes
<nexu> i'm using it for my gaming in linux, windowed mode
<Burgundavia> thom: interesting point on your blog. You truly could cause traffice chaos
<thom> Burgundavia: they /have/ caused chaos
<Burgundavia> thom: I was thinking a wider "attack", across maybe the eastern seaboard and the UK simultaneously
<thom> Burgundavia: you don't really need to - already you can't fly uk-> us, and the US airports will start to see backlogs because they'll go to higher security alerts
<Burgundavia> true
<carthik> I got the parts I needed for my frankenstein PC for $197 :)
<carthik> wrong channel - oops!
<geser> is there a wiki page describing how to produce a debdiff?
<micahcowan> geser, the manpage is sufficient, I believe.
<geser> ok will try it
<neutrinomass> Hobbsee: In response to bug 55261 : I'm always trying to get .desktops into debian because then it's less work for us :-)
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 55261 in pixelize "Pixelize doesn't appear in the menus (no .desktop file)" [Unknown,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/55261
<Hobbsee> neutrinomass: true :)
* neutrinomass didn't want to put that in the bug report though 
<slomo> Hobbsee: don't touch banshee please
<Hobbsee> slomo: ok, sure
<ajmitch> and don't touch the zope stuff
<ajmitch> since a number of the debian changes are broken NMUs which need fixed
<slomo> Hobbsee: it needs some code changes from upstream that i'm still waiting for ;)
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: wasnt going to go anywhere near the zope stuff - i know that's best left to you :P
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: slomo is debian maintainer for banshee - listen to him
<Hobbsee> slomo: ah nice.  geser's asking for a package to be removed from the archive, to do with banshee.  i'll leave you to deal with it, or you want me to reject it now?
<slomo> Hobbsee: which package?
<slomo> and who's geser?
<Hobbsee> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/nautilus-cd-burner/+bug/55865
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 55865 in nautilus-cd-burner "[Edgy]  Please remove obsolete libnautilus-burn3 from archive" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed] 
<Hobbsee> slomo: guy in the channel
<Hobbsee> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/banshee/+bug/55863 also
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 55863 in banshee "[Edgy]  banshee is linked against libnautilus-burn3 which is superseded by libnautilus-burn4" [Untriaged,In progress] 
<slomo> Hobbsee: ah, yes old n-c-b should be removed... but this will be done semi-automatically by the archive admins... no need for a bug
<Hobbsee> slomo: true.  i didnt file the thing.  in fact, i only started looking when i saw it was asking to remove a package that still had rdepends.
<zakame> hi all
<zakame> MOTUs and folks at large :D
<Hobbsee> hi zakame
<zakame> heya Hobbsee !
<zakame> I'm playing with ntfs-3g, just finished building packages for it :))
<Hobbsee> nice :)
<zakame> I'll be uploading to revu tonight, hopefully :)
<Hobbsee> :)
<zakame> how are you? taking my merges now?
<zakame> er,  previous merges I mean
<ajmitch> zakame: she's stealing everyone's
<zakame> hi ajmitch! :D
<zakame> lol
<ajmitch> hi zakame
<zakame> well I do hope to see Hobbsee to take the podium at the next MOTU school hehe
<ajmitch> hope? I expect it
<zakame> ooh!
<zakame> well I've been pretty much away from MOTU land till now :)
<ajmitch> you scared her off
<zakame> buwahaha
<kiko> hey there
<kiko> does anyone here know gauvain pocentek?
<Gloubiboulga> kiko, yep
<Gloubiboulga> it's me :)
<kiko> heh
<kiko> can you /join ##soyuz1.0 for a moment?
<Gloubiboulga> sure
<kiko> thanks
<TheMuso> Hey MOTus.
<Hobbsee> hi TheMuso
* TheMuso just returned from seeing a musical put on by students from Maquary uni. My sister was in it. :p
<Hobbsee> we had a musical on tonight?   cool
<TheMuso> Yeah. You don't hear about them?
<TheMuso> They have at least two every year, and then there's the law review show.
<TheMuso> WHich is very funny.
* TheMuso only goes because my sister is usually involved.
<Hobbsee> i'm not really on that side of things
<TheMuso> Thgouth you may have heard about them anyway.
<TheMuso> thought
<TheMuso> Night folks.
<sladen> nn TheMuso
<kgoetz> is there a recommended example rules file? or should i try and fine on on the net?
<kgoetz> er, makefile
<neutrinomass> I'm following the Ubuntu packaging guide and " dpkg-buildpackage -S -rfakeroot" gives me a /usr/bin/fakeroot: 152: debian/rules: Permission denied error message ... any ideas ?
<thom> neutrinomass: chmod 755 debian/rules
<thom> as a first guess
<neutrinomass> thom: Heh, indeed. Thanks :-)
<neutrinomass> Why is it that tab's cannot be copy pasted btw ?
<Kyral_Laptop> Someone clear something up...there is an Ubuntu 6.06.1?
<Gloubiboulga> yes
<Kyral_Laptop> ...why....
<Gloubiboulga> to include updates in the iso?
<Kyral_Laptop> ....*pound head into wall*
<neutrinomass> Kyral_Laptop: I think it was mainly done to fix several installer issues ....
* Kyral_Laptop sigh
<slomo> Kyral_Laptop: what's your problem with this?
<Kyral_Laptop> nothing....
<Kyral_Laptop> its becoming more and more like XP
<Nafallo> Kyral_Laptop: you mean... fix severe bugs? :-)
* Nafallo is happy it does in that case
<Kyral_Laptop> doesn't the normal process do that
<Nafallo> yea, it's real fun to download 300+ packages on a newly installed computer with a frozen release.
<thom> Kyral_Laptop: sure, but it doesn't hurt to give people the opportunity to be safe by default
<Kyral_Laptop> ...this is what highspeed is for :P
<thom> rather than get the winxp situation of installing and being immediately compromised
<Nafallo> hispeeds on the compromise might be faster...
<Kyral_Laptop> if you do NetInst then you are already safe
<thom> Kyral_Laptop: great, that's very helpful indeed for the .1% of our users who do that
<Kyral_Laptop> Why wouldn't you NetInst....
<slomo> because you don't have a fast and unlimited connection?
<Kyral_Laptop> you mean 56kers?
<Nafallo> because my dad isn't a hacker? :-)
<slomo> for example... or people who can only download 1 gb/month... or people who don't have an internet connection at all
<Kyral_Laptop> ...using Linux in general with no Net is painful to begin with
<Gloubiboulga> Nafallo, +1
<Kyral_Laptop> even for Hackers
<Nafallo> you still talked about _netinstall_
<slomo> Kyral_Laptop: s/even/only/ probably...
<Kyral_Laptop> Yes, I prefer a Netinst
<Nafallo> normal users doesn't do that.
<Kyral_Laptop> one the ISO is a helluva lot smaller
<slomo> it is not... but you could download it somewhere else
<Kyral_Laptop> The ISO for NetInsts are almost always smaller
<Kyral_Laptop> compare the Debian NetInst image to the normal Debian installer image....there is at least a 300 MB difference
<slomo> so what?
<Nafallo> they fixed a lot of bugs in the partioner it seems...
<Kyral_Laptop> Espresso should have been tested more throughly
<thom> Kyral_Laptop: it's irrelevant to 99.9% of our users what your preference is
<thom> you're massively off-topic for this channel
<Nafallo> Espresso doesn't exist :-)
<Kyral_Laptop> whatever...
<Kyral_Laptop> and I don't feel like ranting in -devel :P
* Kyral_Laptop shrugs
<Kyral_Laptop> Maybe this is why I stopped deving for this project
<phanatic> evening
<neutrinomass> Why is it neccessary for packages built with debhelper to build-depend on debhelper?
<neutrinomass> Oh... of course, because of all the dh_* scripts ....
<azeem> :)
<LaserJock> azeem: have you ever looked at bkchem?
<azeem> uh...
<azeem> was I supposed to upload it?
<azeem> ah, wait
<azeem> LaserJock: this screenshot made me cautious about it: http://bkchem.zirael.org/img/newsnap4-test.png
<azeem> LaserJock: Daniel Leidert made packages for it, but I haven't tried it myself
<LaserJock> azeem: hmm, the undergrad in my lab said it was the best molecular drawing app he had tried
<LaserJock> azeem: and he had tried all the ones Ubuntu shipped
<LaserJock> is Leidert going to get any of those packages in Debian? Is there movement there?
<azeem> LaserJock: I need to ping him WRT chemicalmime, he said he'd want prepare that for upload
<azeem> if bkchem is said to be good, I'll bug him about uploading that as well
<LaserJock> azeem: it seems like every time I want to get something, he's got a package but hasn't gotten it into Debian :-)
<azeem> yes
<azeem> this really needs fixing
<azeem> as soon as it is in, we can maintain it as a tea
<azeem> m
<LaserJock> yeah
<azeem> LaserJock: the relevant date for getting those into Ubuntu would be UniverseFreeze, which is on September 28th, right?
<LaserJock> yes
<azeem> ok
<LaserJock> and both of us can now poke peole about them too ;-)
<azeem> if this takes much longer, I'll just import his debian/ trees to the debichem svn, and then do an edgy branch
<azeem> and/or just upload to unstable
<LaserJock> do you have a list of packages he has that aren't in Debian?
<LaserJock> he said that gnome-chem-utils or something was supposed to be updated
<LaserJock> hehe, I was just about to pull a "This is not a support channell, please try #ubuntu+1" on elmo ;-)
<zul> LaserJock: ill repeat to elmo what you just said ok? :)
* zul is evil
<LaserJock> zul: go for it ;-)
<zul> yeah i dont want to get into trouble just yet :)
<azeem> LaserJock: gotta go now
<LaserJock> zul: you won't get in trouble :-)
<zul> uh huh..
<LaserJock> azeem: sure, np. Lets work more on debichem though
<plhardy> hi i am new and wanna to help fixing packaging or whatever i can do.
<Gloubiboulga> hello phlaegel :)
<Gloubiboulga> oops, sorry phlaegel
<Gloubiboulga> hello plhardy :)
<Gloubiboulga> plhardy, have you already had a look at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Bugs ?
<plhardy> there are mainy different pages about many things to do...
<Gloubiboulga> that's true
<Gloubiboulga> but there's a lot to do too :)
<Gloubiboulga> do you have an experience in packaging?
<plhardy> what lacks is just a page telling : to start try fixing BUg ZZZ or try packaging WWW where ZZZ and WWW are real things
<plhardy> no i have no experience in packaging
<plhardy> even if i know a lttile about package content
<Gloubiboulga> ok
<Gloubiboulga> maybe you can start with some merges
<plhardy> ok, but with what package in particular (would prefer work on kubuntu packages)
<Gloubiboulga> here is the link about this: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Merging
<Gloubiboulga> let me see if I can find a qt/kde package
<Gloubiboulga> tellico and poedit are two good candidates to start IMO
<Gloubiboulga> and texmaker
<Gloubiboulga> they are all qt/kde packages
<Gloubiboulga> oops again, poedit is gtk
<plhardy> ok i will pick tellico and see how to start with that
<Gloubiboulga> ok, feel free to ask questions here if you need some help :)
<plhardy> i think i risk to bother you with many questions... but i have many things to read on wiki meanwhile
<Gloubiboulga> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/School/Merging-and-Syncing is certainly more helpful than the previous link I gave you
<ryanakca> Gloubiboulga: Hey... that clipboard daemon... we're waiting for upstream to change the name from gnome-clipboard-daemon  to clipboard-daemon... after that, crim.sun said he'd upload it.. oh, and I did write that man page for you :)
<Gloubiboulga> ryanakca, ok, that sounds good :)
<ryanakca> Gloubiboulga: 7 days and counting... he's probably on vacation... I know hasn't dissapeared, because he's a dev for autopackage... but no rush :)
<ryanakca> what dependency in debian/control provides http://pastebin.ca/125494 ?
<Gloubiboulga> a package with 'kde' and '-dev' in it I guess :)
<gnomefreak> has there been any word when nvidia will release the xorg7.1 drivers?
<pirast> i have got a problem with pbuilder.. i have a package which depends on a package which i just build. how can i tell pbuilder to install it since it isn't available in the online repos?
<welshbyte> right, i've found a package in edgy with a "fails to install" bug which has been fixed in debian unstable... what now?
<crimsun> which package?
<welshbyte> lastfmsubmitd
<crimsun> file a bug against that source package and request a sync from Debian Sid
<crimsun> note that it's currently uninstallable in Edgy, which is fixed by the sync, etc.
<welshbyte> will do
<welshbyte> done
<crimsun> u-a subbed.
<welshbyte> thanks
<ryanakca> is it kdelibs4-dev or kdebase-dev that provides http://pastebin.ca/125494 ?
<crimsun> the former iirc, and installing the latter will automatically pull in the former
<ryanakca> eh hunh... so... might as well put kdebase-dev in debian/control... solve any other kde dependencies that might come up??
<ryanakca> (I think... from what I understand...)
<crimsun> kdebase-dev may be overkill, and we prefer minimal build-dependencies
<ryanakca> kk
<nexu> opersneeded
<crimsun> ?
<tseng> bot
<tseng> looks to be
<tseng> or just in a bunch of channels
<mc44> er have I missed LaserJock's packaging pedagogy? or was that later
<plhardy> Gloubigoulga: well it seems i am not a master of merging :-) process tells to run ../merge-builpackage but  meerge_buildpackage is at root directory...
<plhardy> i have to it from inside the extracted sources ?
<crimsun> mc44: later.
<mc44> crimsun: will it be in this channel?
<hub> is it okay to upload a newer version that is still in NEW in the upload queue?
<plhardy> crimsum: you have answer on my above question since i followed what you told on irc and that is on wiki https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/School/Merging-and-Syncing
<crimsun> mc44: #ubuntu-motu-school.
<mc44> crimsun: ah, thanks!
<crimsun> plhardy: did you use grab-merge.sh?
<plhardy> yes
<crimsun> plhardy: then merge-buildpackage is in the directory in which you executed grab-merge.sh
<plhardy> exactly
<plhardy> then i should cd in a sub directory to call ../merge-buildpackage
<crimsun> you need to invoke merge-buildpackage from the root of the extracted, merged source
<hub> did mono packaging change in edgy>
<hub> ?
<hub> like windows.forms.dll
<tseng> yes.
<hub> so I have a FTBS
<hub> and didn't even get a bug filed for it
<tseng> "even"?
<tseng> i never got a bug for ftbfs
<hub> neither
<hub> but how can I know it does not build?
<tseng> watch the build logs when you upload
<hub> it didn't upload it in edgy
<hub> that is all the problem
<tseng> so its already built
<tseng> yes?
<tseng> you can complain about the process all you want, can't help you with that
<tseng> I imagine you know how to fix it
<hub> not yet
<hub> I don't know which package I nend
<hub> but I have an edgy machine right here
<tseng> libmono-winforms1.0-cil - Mono System.Windows.Forms library
<tseng> libmono-winforms2.0-cil - Mono System.Windows.Forms library
<hub> won't be long
<hub> ah ok
<tseng> depending on if you are using 2.0 or not
<hub> how do I know?
<tseng> if you use gmcs
<tseng> instead of mcs
<hub> ok
<hub> rebuilding in chroot
<hub> pbuilder I mean
#ubuntu-motu 2006-08-11
<hub> sigh
<hub> and dh_clideps is no longer?
<hub> I'll go and check that later
<hub> nothing urgent
<neutrinomass> (I asked this earlier but no one responded so I apologise for spamming) Are inline changes acceptable to fix typos/other minor issues ?
<bddebian> Heya gang
<Fujitsu> Hi bddebian
<bddebian> Hello Fujitsu
<bddebian> Dang it, how do I read MemoServ messages?
<Hawkwind> /msg memoserv read 1 or read all
<bddebian> Ah, thx
<Hawkwind> s/all/last
<zul> hey Hobbsee
<ajmitch> hello Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> heya
<Fujitsu> Hi Hobbsee.
<Hobbsee> dont seem to have broken my system too badly
<Fujitsu> ?
<Hobbsee> i was messing with it earlier
<Fujitsu> Ah. Doing what?
<Fujitsu> Hm.
<Fujitsu> Maybe she did mess it up :P
<bddebian> heh
* Fujitsu rubs his eyes...
<Fujitsu> I can't be seeing this...
<Fujitsu> They announced the Community Council meeting more than 24 hours in advance?
<ajmitch> surely not
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<zul> its only community council :)
<ajmitch> hello
<Fujitsu> ANd it's at 2am :(
<ajmitch> sounds fair
* ajmitch will skip it
<zul> noooo..
<bddebian> anyone know of a well done (meaning packaging) python app for me to look at?
<crimsun> mutagen.
<bddebian> Thanks crimsun
<bddebian> Hi btw
<crimsun> di
<crimsun> err, hi
<bddebian> You want me to die? :'-(
<bddebian> :-)
<ash211> does anybody know much about QuinnStorm's Compiz packages?
<ajmitch> yes
* imbrandon points to ajmitch
<ash211> on the most recent update, apt only wants to update compiz and compiz-gnome, but not compiz-kde
<ash211> (I'm running kde)
<ash211> before all three updated
<ajmitch> in any case, it's an external repository
<ash211> updating the compiz package will remove compiz-kde
<ajmitch> it's best for you to ask in #ubuntu-xgl
<ajmitch> you'll probably get told to use compiz & cgwd
<ash211> i'll do that
<imbrandon> cgwd ?
<ajmitch> imbrandon: yes
<imbrandon> gnome win deco ?
<ajmitch> supposedly 'generic'
<imbrandon> ahh
<ajmitch> meant to replace {gnome,kde}-window-decorator
<ash211> does it currently work better
<ajmitch> no idea
<ash211> here's some info in cgwd: http://compiz.blogspot.com/2006/07/new-window-decorator.html
<bddebian> Do Python packages have to be python-foo?
<bddebian> Heya LaserJock
<LaserJock> hi bddebian
<ryanakca> whats the current standards version?
<LaserJock> 3.7.2 I think
<bddebian> 3.7.2 afaik
<Fujitsu> 3.7.2, I'm pretty sure.
<ryanakca> kk, ty
<ryanakca> it's unanimous :)
<LaserJock> hmm, well I decided to reinstall OS X on my iMac this afternoon :/
<LaserJock> maybe it wasn't the best timing
<ryanakca> ???
<LaserJock> well, you know how the first time you try an OS you trash it with all kinds of junk?
<LaserJock> or is it  only me that does it?
<DarkMageZ> everyone does it =D
<ryanakca> yep, everyone does
<LaserJock> ok, so this is my first reinstall of OS X
<ryanakca> I remember, my first install of FC... 3 I think... I had selected full install... 6GB of junk installed...
<ryanakca> my science teacher is a big mac fan.. despises windows with a pation :)
<LaserJock> with Gentoo I never could get over it :-)
<LaserJock> that's why I had to jump ship for Ubuntu
<ryanakca> get over ???
<LaserJock> I always had > 9 GB of stuff on my Gentoo box
<LaserJock> and recompiling it all the time was a pain
<ryanakca> heh
<ryanakca> "The computer is your slave, not the other way around" is how I look at Gentoo
<LaserJock> not for me
<LaserJock> I couldn't take it anymore, every time I got KDE done compiling they'd come out with another one to try ;-)
<DarkMageZ> i've been building packages recently, it's great fun, cept when things don't work :(
<ryanakca> DarkMageZ: yeah... and then afterwards, when you aren't a programmer, and someone reports a bug..
<neutrinomass> LaserJock: I had that thing too.... with an 800 Mhz Duron :P (I even went into the trouble of compiling -r1 versions )
<ryanakca> you have to figure out whats wrong...
<DarkMageZ> oh, i'm never going to distribute my packages for the sake of sanity =D
<ryanakca> DarkMageZ: I'm going to send up a couple... but no way I'm sending up 20+ like some people
<DarkMageZ> except with a *this package may kill millions of people* sticker :)
<ryanakca> lol, yeah
<poningru> !packaging guide
<ubotu> The packaging guide is at http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/index.html Other developer resources are at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DeveloperResources
<DarkMageZ> now, that could be useful!
<ryanakca> I have my own repos... built with .seveas's software... highly unstable... with big flashy text with warnings and all... legal junk
<DarkMageZ> i have 3 packages sofar. dosbox 0.65 & xchat 2.6.6 & rhythmbox 0.9.5 ( + cvs + ubuntu changes )
<DarkMageZ> cept the xchat package & the rhythmbox package won't install side by side, but hopefully something in the packaging guide will help me fix that
<ryanakca> I have 2... typespeed 0.51 (which will never make it into repos), and gnome-clipboard-manager, which I'm waiting for upstream to change the name to clipboard-manager... and I'm working on a finance app
<ryanakca> would http://eqonomize.sourceforge.net/   go into "mathematics", or "kde"?
<ryanakca> it's a personal finance app
<crimsun> kde
<DarkMageZ> anyone know how i'd go about building my packages differently to avoid error's like http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/20234
<welshbyte> what's the correct naming scheme for a package that didn't start off in debian? foo_0.4.2ubuntu1 ?
<imbrandon> !versioning
<ubotu> Ubuntu and Debian have slightly different package versioning schemes, for an explanation see http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/basic-scratch.html#id2528873
* welshbyte reads
<LaserJock> MOTU School Session in #ubuntu-motu-school is about to start
<welshbyte> how convenient :)
<poningru> ooh
<poningru> wtf
<bddebian> So what do I do about --prefix=foo screwing up the path in in the binary?
<Lathiat> bddebian: patch :)
<Lathiat> whats this for?
<ajmitch> bddebian: you use --prefix=/usr
<bddebian> ajmitch: That's not what mutagen does.
<bddebian> Lathiat: bkchem
<Lathiat> iirc you use --prefix=/usr and make install DESTDIR
<Lathiat> or somethign like that?
<bddebian> It's a python package using setup.py, there really isn't a install
<ajmitch> mutagen's debian/rules doesn't even specify --prefix
<bddebian> python ./setup.py install --prefix debian/python-mutagen/usr
<bddebian> From mutagen
<ajmitch> you appear to have a different mutagen than I do then
<bddebian> This is dappers
<ajmitch> right
<ajmitch> and since we're doing edgy stuff, I looked at the package in edgy
<bddebian> Well I don't have an edgy machine handy
<bddebian> What is the most appropriate way to install extra files (ie desktop and icon) in a cdbs package?
<Gloubiboulga> hi bddebian
<Gloubiboulga> you can use a .install file, you won't have to change debian/rules this way
<bddebian> Hi Gloubiboulga
<bddebian> Will .install work in addition to whatever exists?
<Gloubiboulga> I think so
<bddebian> OK, I wasn't sure.  Thanks
<Gloubiboulga> np :)
<bddebian> Gloubiboulga: Oh, crap but I need to cp images/icon.png to usr/share/pixmaps/bkchem.png and I have never had success with that in .install files.  Just do a cp in rules?
<Gloubiboulga> bddebian, a cp should work fine :)
<Gloubiboulga> I'm not sure that dh_install can rename files
<bddebian> Aye
<bddebian> Grr fsck
<bddebian> Heya Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> hi bddebian
<bddebian> rules doesn't like install -D or cp because there are no targets :'-(
* Hobbsee wonders just how badly she killed her system
* LaserJock runs for the bathroom, too much pop and a 2 hr MOTU Session
<LaserJock> ;-)
<bddebian> hehe
<Hobbsee> haha
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: how'd it go?  the motu session
<welshbyte> IMO it was ++good
* TheMuso was in there for a little while.
<TheMuso> And actually learnt something new. :)
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: nice!
<TheMuso> I never kneww zless / z-other cool stuff existed.
<TheMuso> like zipgrep
* Hobbsee learnt not to rm -rf ~ without having a full backup of it first, not just a half one.
<TheMuso> heh
<TheMuso> What happened?
<welshbyte> yikes
<Fujitsu> Heheheh. I remember what I did a few years back...
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: well, i'm going to put a clean copy of edgy on there.  had a bit of trouble copying the semi-backup
<Fujitsu> I wanted to remove all the hidden things from some directory.
<Hobbsee> seems that i can access everything now, before the reformat, except my email
<Fujitsu> So I ran, as root, `rm -rf .*'
<Hobbsee> *ouch*
<Fujitsu> I didn't expect it would go up the tree >_<
<Hobbsee> it *doesnt*
<Hobbsee> does it?
<Fujitsu> It did, I'm pretty sure. But that was 6 years ago.
<Fujitsu> I can't remember very well...
* Hobbsee runs rm -rf * often.  
<Hobbsee> in the devel directory, or whatever
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: You didn't loose email did you
* Hobbsee headdesks.
<Hobbsee> oh noooo.......
<LaserJock> one time I wanted to remove all those pesky emacs backup files, normally I would run, rm  *~ but I accidently did rm * ~
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: you bet
<TheMuso> ouch!
<Hobbsee> what??????????
* Hobbsee goes off swearing and cursing
* Hobbsee seems to have lost at least .gnupg and .thunderbird
<LaserJock> well I wiped my machine this afternoon
<LaserJock> but I meant to do it
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: so did i, but not a few crucial folders!
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: I hope you have .gnupg stored somewhere safe.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: finding it
<TheMuso> Right.
<TheMuso> Howd this all happen?
<poningru> Hobbsee: if its absolutely necessary you know you can recover it right?
* welshbyte gets stuck into the debian python policy
<poningru> err not sure if you have ext2
<Hobbsee> poningru: nope,  but i should be able to recover it from here
<Hobbsee> fairly sure it's ext3
<LaserJock> welshbyte: I think we all have recently ;-)
<welshbyte> they dropped a bomb huh? :)
<LaserJock> well, it's just that it isn't exactly straightforward to me what I actually have to do
<LaserJock> I can read through the thing
<LaserJock> but I'm not always sure what applies, etc.
<jsgotangco> can anyone say to linspire just use d-i :D
<LaserJock> anyway, I've transitioned a package I maintain in Debian
<LaserJock> and it went ok
<jsgotangco> or heck even use ubiquity :D
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: got it back :)
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: as for my email though....
* Hobbsee cries.
<welshbyte> LaserJock: maybe i'm out of my depth with python, as a packaging newbie then... :/
<LaserJock> no
<LaserJock> it's probably better as a newbie :-)
<bddebian> welshbyte: Nah, I'm doing one right now and I'm a clueless moron
<welshbyte> bddebian: so i've heard ;)
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: because i was an idiot, and tried to do things the short way.
<bddebian> welshbyte: Ah, word has finally gotten around eh? :-)
<zul_> very fast :)
* Hobbsee really cries.
<zul_> hey Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> hi zul_
<LaserJock> bddebian: well it's hard not to when you spread it yourself ;-)
* Hobbsee really didnt back up her email.
* bddebian pokes LaserJock
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: I know how it feels.
<TheMuso> I had a drive die on me in January, and i hadn't backed up important stuff since October.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: i got .gnupg back though.
<Hobbsee> heh
<Hobbsee> ouch
<TheMuso> So I lost stuff as well
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: half of my trouble is that i dont remember what i lost
<TheMuso> Good you got your keys back.
<TheMuso> heh
<zul> Hobbsee: at least you know you should have a good backup plan now
* TheMuso looks forward to the day he can switch all his email to imap.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: yeah, exactly.
<TheMuso> Just need to get around to doing it.
<Hobbsee> zul: hah.  or just actually check the backup first before using rm -rf a bit
<zul> or that too
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: yeah, i wish.  half of my email is like that.
<imbrandon> i did the other day now i'm lovin it
<imbrandon> ( moved it all to imap )
* welshbyte gets paranoid and runs a website and email backup
<Hobbsee> hehe
<zul> heh...if google goes down im screwed
<TheMuso> I wish gmail had imap.
* Hobbsee continues to cry.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: yeah, me too.   did someone ever find a way around that?
<TheMuso> Not that I know of.
<TheMuso> I know it is certainly one of the most requested gmail features.
<Hobbsee> definetly
* TheMuso intends to move his email to imap when he moves his domain over.
<Hobbsee> work time.
<Hobbsee> hmmm...
<welshbyte> if they're stubborn about not offering imap someone could set up a service to fetchmail from google accounts and serve the email up from imap.. should be  pretty simple
<ajmitch> bddebian: what did you want me to check?
* Hobbsee wonders about moving her @kubuntu.org somehow to an imap server.
<Hobbsee> oh well
<TheMuso> Have fun at work.
<imbrandon> Hobbsee: i can help you do that later when you get home
<imbrandon> later
<bddebian> ajmitch: Just see if my upload went up?
<TheMuso> imbrandon: Rock on Dreamhost!! :)
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: that'd be cool
<ajmitch> bddebian: that means telling me what it is
<imbrandon> ouch i made a booboo
<bddebian> Oh, hehe, sorry bkchem
<imbrandon> TheMuso: exactly ;)
<ajmitch> bddebian: 0.11.4-0ubuntu1 ?
<bddebian> ajmitch: Aye
<ajmitch> it's listed on the revu page
<TheMuso> imbrandon: The only thing I don't like about their email, is that they *Make* you move old email from your inbox to another folder.
<bddebian> Oh, I see it now, sorry
<bddebian> ajmitch: ^
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: will, or wont do
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: i'll be thinking about whatever else i've lost
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: hehe
<TheMuso> hahaha
<imbrandon> shiznit, ajmitch you have main privs right ? i need to make a trivial fix to something that i got uploaded earlier
<TheMuso> It happens to the best of us
<LaserJock> bddebian: doh, did you do bkchem?
<bddebian> LaserJock: Aye, should I not have?
<bddebian> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2871
<LaserJock> kinda
<LaserJock> azeem and I would like to get it into Debian
<LaserJock> and there is a guy that has a Debian package
<ajmitch> imbrandon: put the debdiff on malone
<bddebian> LaserJock: So take it, fix it and upload it to Debian :-)
<bddebian> Oh
<imbrandon> ajmitch: kk
<LaserJock> but he hasn't gotten it into Debian
* bddebian gives up
<ajmitch> again?
<LaserJock> bddebian: well, I wouldn't mind seeing it in Edgy to start with, I have no idea when it'll hit Debian
<LaserJock> but it might get synced in the end
<welshbyte> man this python policy is written in legalese, someone should translate it to english.. can we put it in rosetta?
<LaserJock> lol
<zul> python is still evil
<imbrandon> grr wth, why do i keep getting this when i add a line to debian/rules " debian/rules:64: *** missing separator (did you mean TAB instead of 8 spaces?).  Stop. " and no i dident use tab
<LaserJock> the first thing to do is to figure out what kind of package you are doing
<LaserJock> welshbyte: is this a Python library, or an application written in Python?
<welshbyte> LaserJock: application.. in python/glade
<zul> imbrandon: im guessing it doesnt like something at lie 64
<imbrandon> zul: yea heh thats the line i'm adding , but it /looks/ ok , drivin me nuts
<LaserJock> welshbyte: ok, then that's a bit easier
<welshbyte> phew
<LaserJock> welshbyte: check out http://wiki.debian.org/DebianPython/NewPolicy
<zul> right im off to bed
<LaserJock> welshbyte: and I'd go for the python-central option (although it really doesn't matter a whole lot in the end)
<bddebian> ajmitch: Yes again
<welshbyte> LaserJock: great, thanks for the tips :)
<LaserJock> np, I aim to please ;-)
<LaserJock> I'm on a packaging buzz right now
<ajmitch> LaserJock, packaging master
<LaserJock> no no
<ajmitch> master of masters?
* bddebian goes back to picking his nose
<ajmitch> thanks for that bddebian
<LaserJock> I'm getting a little better, I think, but I certainly don't know a whole lot about packaging
<ajmitch> yet you hold sessions teaching others - you obviously know enough
<welshbyte> bddebian: why? whats wrong with your old one?
<LaserJock> nobody asked the "What is ${shlibs:Depends} and what does it do"?
<LaserJock> ;-)
<ajmitch> unfortunate
<ajmitch> but you explained it anyway?
<LaserJock> I didn't
<ajmitch> why not?
<LaserJock> I was running out of time fast
<ajmitch> I see
<LaserJock> it took 2 hrs as it was
<LaserJock> but I at least have an idea of what it is
<LaserJock> and could do a lot of hand waving
<ajmitch> you should have more than an idea
<ajmitch> you should be intimately familiar
<LaserJock> of course I *should*
<LaserJock> but in practicality I've never had to deal with it
<LaserJock> it just works
<welshbyte> that bit looks pretty guessable anyway... adds the shared libraries that your package uses as dependencies?
<ajmitch> until it doesn't
<ajmitch> welshbyte: understanding the magic behind it is another matter
<LaserJock> ajmitch: sure
<ajmitch> which is sort of what I covered in my talk, all those years ago
<LaserJock> yeah
<ajmitch> which everyone has gladly forgotten about :)
<LaserJock> the problem is you can't get through everything in a reasonable amount of time
<LaserJock> ajmitch: I haven't forgotten
<LaserJock> ajmitch: I plan on using it in the packaging guide
<LaserJock> at least making sure it covers what you did
<ajmitch> you'll want to check on anything mentioned then
<ajmitch> to check for accuracy
<LaserJock> I'll want you (and all the MOTUs) to check the Packaging Guide for accuracy
<LaserJock> ;-)
<ajmitch> of course there are other fun fields to use now
<ajmitch> like ${cli: Depends}
<LaserJock> it's a full time job just keeping up with all this stuff
<ajmitch> but if someone is packaging mono stuff they really have to read the cli policy for debian, which is still officially unofficial :)
<LaserJock> yeah, it seems like there are a lot of unofficial policies
<ajmitch> and it's your job as MOTU teacher to keep up with them all
<LaserJock> yep
<LaserJock> :/
<ajmitch> the test is tomorrow, I hope you studied
<hub> ajmitch: did dh_clideps change?
<ajmitch> hub: from what to what?
<LaserJock> it would be interesting to do a whole MOTU School session on dh_*
<hub> ajmitch: it fails to build here
<ajmitch> hub: it's in cli-common-dev now
<hub> ajmitch: or has the moved out of cli-common?
<hub> ah ok
* bddebian creates a LaserJockistheRealGod wiki and hands over the reigns
<ajmitch> bddebian: you can't
<LaserJock> bah, whatever
<bddebian> ajmitch: Why the hell not?
<ajmitch> bddebian: noone can match your wisdom
<LaserJock> you could teach that in your sleep
<hub> ajmitch: I just need to replace cli-common by cli-common-dev?
<ajmitch> hub: yep
<hub> thanks
<bddebian> ajmitch: Oh, that's funny
<hub> adding a watch file makes a lot of work
* LaserJock starts chanting "I am not worthy, I am not worthy" in bddebian
<LaserJock> 's direction
<bddebian> Yeah right man :-)
<LaserJock> ;-)
<ajmitch> LaserJock: don't forget the grovelling
<LaserJock>  /o\
<LaserJock> \o/
<LaserJock>  /o\
<LaserJock> that's my cool ASCII art version of grovelling
<Lathiat> o<
<Lathiat> that doesnt really work so wel
<Lathiat> l
<LaserJock> wow, and I get to do it all over again in 13 hrs :-)
<ajmitch> lucky you
<ajmitch> I wasn't quite that crazy
<LaserJock> well those Europeans whined so much ;-)
<ajmitch> plus I doubt I'll get to do a session again
<LaserJock> why not?
<ajmitch> I scared people off for most of a year after the last one
* LaserJock signs ajmitch up for the "Packaging done right" session
* bddebian doubts that
<ajmitch> plus there's nothing I can teach
<LaserJock> What is ${shlibs:Depends} and what does it do?
<LaserJock> ;-)
<ajmitch> already covered it
<LaserJock> "mono for the rest of us"?
<ajmitch> I don't think I'm brave enough to talk about library packaging
<LaserJock> "How to review, and mean it"?
<ajmitch> slomo would be better for that
* ajmitch doesn't do reviews
<LaserJock> yeah, I need to get slomo to do one
<LaserJock> "How to be a slacker, and win"?
<ajmitch> hah
<ajmitch> that's more my style
<ajmitch> except I don't win ;)
<ajmitch> imbrandon: got your debdiff on malone yet?
<imbrandon> ajmitch: https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/ktorrent/+bug/55969  <-- can you sponsor that please, very trivial upload
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 55969 in ktorrent "ktorrent 2.0 wont install / upgrade in edgy" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed] 
<ajmitch> heh
<imbrandon> hehe
<ajmitch> timing..
<ajmitch> spell things right in the changelog, please :)
<imbrandon> gah one sec
<ajmitch> 'after upstream installer bit'
<ajmitch> very technical language, that
<LaserJock> ajmitch: "spelling for packagers"?
<bddebian> hehe
<ajmitch> "how to be pedantic & annoy people"
<imbrandon> heh one sec
<LaserJock> pedantic? how elite of you ;-)
<ajmitch> imbrandon: also mention the bug you're closing if there is one
<imbrandon> k
<hub> ajmitch: what does that mean: dh_clideps: Warning! No Build-Depends(-Indep) on cli-common-dev (>= 0.4.0)! ?
<ajmitch> LaserJock: I'm a DD, what do you expect?
<ajmitch> we have pedantry down to a fine art
<ajmitch> hub: is it really missing the build-depends?
<hub> no
<ajmitch> version & all?
<hub> yep
<ajmitch> pastebin control
<hub>  cli-common-dev (>= 0.4.0) is in the control file
<hub> ajmitch: http://pastebin.ca/126036
<hub> in the rules I have
<hub> binary-fixup/autopano-sift::
<hub> 	dh_clideps
<hub> :-/
<hub> I wonder if that should still be there
* ajmitch has it in binary-predeb, but that shouldn't matter
<LaserJock> ok, I gotta get home
<LaserJock> good night guys
<hub> I have to go to bed
<poningru> night
<bddebian> Gnight LaserJock
* bddebian bows to the master
<ajmitch> hub: ok
<ajmitch> hub: looking at dh_clideps, it really shouldn't complain about that
* LaserJock bows back
<ajmitch> since it does a simple regex match on debian/control
* LaserJock gives bddebian a hug
<hub> ajmitch: I'll see tomorrow
<hub> ajmitch: thanks for the tips
<imbrandon> ajmitch: http://librarian.launchpad.net/3874755/ktorrent.debdiff
<ajmitch> imbrandon: hm, I guess it looks ok
<imbrandon> ;) thanks
<ajmitch> will take awhile to test build
<ajmitch> I don't have most of the kde stuff cached for pbuilder
<imbrandon> kk , i'm goin afk for a few , back in about ~20 min
<ajmitch> alright
<bddebian> Gnight folks
* imbrandon is back
<nixternal> whoopy ;)
<nixternal> this gpg secret key think is really making me mad
<welshbyte> is there a difference between Architecture: any and Architecture: all
<ajmitch> yes, quite a lot of difference
<imbrandon> ajmitch: everything go smooth ?
<imbrandon> welshbyte: yea
<ajmitch> arch: all means that there are no architecture-dependant files
<ajmitch> arch: any means it will be rebuilt for each architecture
<welshbyte> ahh
<welshbyte> thanks
<ajmitch> imbrandon: it was uploaded
<imbrandon> cool thanks, i'll close the bug
<imbrandon> ahh new fspot ;)
<ajmitch> yes
<ajmitch> and new tomboy
<imbrandon> does (Malone: #NNN) close a bug like debian bts ?
<imbrandon> automagicly i mean
<ajmitch> nope
<imbrandon> heh that would be nice
<ajmitch> but it's good to document it in the changelog
<imbrandon> yea true, and maybe someday the LP guys will put it in
<imbrandon> what was that LP link to check the build status of it again /+builds ?
<ajmitch> yes
<ajmitch> it'll take awhile to get through the system
<ajmitch> buildds are probably still catching up on the mass give-back
<imbrandon> give-back ?
<ajmitch> retry of failed builds
<imbrandon> ahh
<imbrandon> hrm off to look at Sime's patches
<imbrandon> gah , ok whats the useage for dpkg --compare-versions
<imbrandon> or is that even the right sommnd
<imbrandon> i should write this stuff down lol
<nixternal> wo0t i fixed it
<nixternal> ;)
<imbrandon> fixed what ?
<nixternal> deluid everything, then add it back  ;)
<nixternal> that supid gpg error
<imbrandon> lol
<nixternal> stupid too
<nixternal> and i love how pinentry remembers my pw
<nixternal> for a minute at least ;)
* Nafallo <3 seahorse
<imbrandon> gmail + homebrew imap + kmail ;)
<imbrandon> s/kmail/mutt
<nixternal> you know what..i miss using pine, and then mutt...talk about smooth..only reason i use kmail now is because of Kontact..it does all my PIM stuff in one spot
* imbrandon sets kdelibs and kdebase to compile and go's for a nap
<imbrandon> gnight all
<Hobbsee> hi all
<Gloubiboulga> hi Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> hey Gloubiboulga :)
<onkarshinde> Can anyone tell me who handles package for classpath?
<thom> onkarshinde: if you have classpath installed, less /usr/share/doc/classpath/changelog.Debian.gz
<onkarshinde> thom: Ok. I just wanted to know if there is any chance of latest version getting into edgy. It has full 2D graphics support using cairo.
<micahcowan> I'm preparing patches for a package that already has patches through 99 (to 99a, actually). What's appropriate for this? I'm tempted to rename the patch-files to redistribute them better...
<thom> micahcowan: you have a package with _99_ patches?
<micahcowan> no... :-( someone went from 63 to 98 (nice, huh?). the package is coreutils, btw.
<micahcowan> it uses dbs... so I imagine make_patch would tack on a 99b or somesuch... but it seems wrong to just leave it like that...
<thom> micahcowan: renumbering is just going to make remerging from debian painful
<micahcowan> ah.... yes.
<thom> micahcowan: i'd talk to mike stone (i think it's still him) and see why he did it
<Fujitsu> Hobbsee, you are on a Live CD?
<micahcowan> (she is: said so on #ubuntu-bugs)
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: yes
<Fujitsu> Ow.
<Hobbsee> not really.  it's quite nice :)
<tseng> morn thom, Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> hi tseng
<thom> hey dude
<Hobbsee> tseng: i've mostly recovered :)
<tseng> Hobbsee: from?
<gnomefreak> can i get someone to ack https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/gnomebaker/+bug/56001 ?
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 56001 in gnomebaker "[Edgy MoM]  Please sync gnomebaker" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed] 
<Hobbsee> tseng: this morning, with the loss of cruical folders :P
<tseng> Hobbsee: ah, suck
<Hobbsee> tseng: only look to have lost about 2 months of email, not sur ewhat else
<micahcowan> is it my imagination, or did the coreutils manpages at one time actually direct to "info coreutils <tool>" (as they ought) instead of the currently broken "info <tool>"?
<Fujitsu> Hmm... It's not normal to subscribe revu-people to sync requests, is it?
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: revu people?   which group were you subscribing?
<Fujitsu> Hobbsee, gnomefreak's bug has ubuntu-universe-contributors assigned to it.
<Fujitsu> *subscribed
<slomo> ubuntu-universe-contributors are all the people that can upload to revu
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: ah yes, that's a new group
<Hobbsee> oops...did i not mean that...
<gnomefreak> lol
* Hobbsee meant the group that she's the owner of
<Hobbsee> gnomefreak: find the link off my LP page.  it's the one about universe that i show as admin of, not of kubuntu council
<gnomefreak> Hobbsee: she told me to ill change it if i get the group
<Hobbsee> yeah, my bad
<Fujitsu> ubuntu-universe-sponsors?
<slomo> Fujitsu: yes
<Fujitsu> ubuntu-universe-uploaders is really a little mis-named...
<Hobbsee> ah, thta's it
<Fujitsu> Yeah, I was a little surprised when I found that bug in my subscribed list :)
<slomo> bbl
<Hobbsee> rebooting
<gnomefreak> ubuntu-universe-sponsors this one
<Fujitsu> gnomefreak, yep.
<gnomefreak> k
<gnomefreak> how do i unsubscribe the other team?
<Fujitsu> gnomefreak, I just did.
<gnomefreak> k ty
<Fujitsu> I don't know why I was allowed to, though.
<Fujitsu> I shouldn't have been.
<Fujitsu> I don't think...
<TheMuso> hmmm ok.
<TheMuso> I guess that bug report was from what has just been discussed.
<TheMuso> That I received in my inbox.
<Fujitsu> TheMuso, yep.
<gnomefreak> that would be it sorry if its wrong its my first try at merge
<TheMuso> gnomefreak: Thats fine.
<TheMuso> Has somebody explained a non-MOTU sync request to you?
<gnomefreak> nope hobbsee got me as far as i am
<Fujitsu> That's about it, gnomefreak. Just ask a MOTU to confirm it.
<gnomefreak> yeah that she told me
<TheMuso> Right, well from what I was told, you file a bug against the package, requesting a sync. You ping a MOTU to look at it, they confirm it, and they also subscribe ubuntu archive admins.
<gnomefreak> yes that is what she told me to do
<TheMuso> But you don't subscribe archive admins, as far as I understand it.
<gnomefreak> oh motu subscribes them
<TheMuso> The MOTU has to do that afaik
<gnomefreak> oh ok
<TheMuso> I've done a couple of syncs this way, so I am guessing thats how its done.
<gnomefreak> i mis read what she said sorry
<Fujitsu> Evening again, Hobbsee.
<Hobbsee> hi Fujitsu
<Hobbsee> nice installer, that
<Hobbsee> hey cool, it's even picked the right kernel!
<Fujitsu> Why'd you reinstall?
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: because i could.  i'd gotten lots of random rubbish installed on here
<Fujitsu> Heh, quite a good reason.
<gnomefreak> im gonna run into conflicts on most of the merges correct?
<Fujitsu> gnomefreak, pretty much.
<Fujitsu> I've found a few where I haven't.
<Fujitsu> Speaking of which, I have some merges.
<gnomefreak> and the sync fixes that? so i can just retry it after the sync and it works?
<Hobbsee> gnomefreak: sometimes.
<Fujitsu> The sync eliminates Ubuntu changes.
<gnomefreak> k
* TheMuso has found that the syncs he has requested have only had dependancies as Ubuntu specific changes.
<StevenK> Some of the merges I've done have had to do that.
<TheMuso> Nobody has started work on soundconverter have they?
* TheMuso takes that as a no.
<StevenK> TheMuso: We just didn't want to disappoint you.
<TheMuso> heh
<TheMuso> I'm sure I would have found something else.
* Hobbsee thinks she looked.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: check for a sync for that.  if not, then no
<TheMuso> Something must be driving me to understand how to package python stuff inside out, because I manage to pick packages that have python.
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: Well there are no bugs filed re sync requests, so I'm guessing not.
<TheMuso> Syncs are the first thing I check for.
<TheMuso> But as it is, I don't think this package will need a sync.
* Hobbsee wonders if she merged it last night then
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: checked edgy changes?
<TheMuso> Whats the easiest way to check that?
<StevenK> soundconverter isn't on edgy-changes.
* StevenK has it open.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/edgy-changes/2006-August/date.html
<Hobbsee> StevenK: ah
<TheMuso> There's an RSS feed for that isn't there?
<Hobbsee> 30 uploads in 11 days.  not bad.
<TheMuso> Isn't it a busy list?
<Hobbsee> iirc yes
<StevenK> TheMuso: Depends if Hobbsee is merging a lot.
* StevenK chuckles.
<Hobbsee> StevenK: hah
<TheMuso> lol
<Hobbsee> +syncs.
<TheMuso> Anybody got an idea of what one does with a package who's only python file resides in /usr/bin?
<TheMuso> In regards to the policy/
<StevenK> TheMuso: As in, it's a #!/usr/bin/python script?
<gnomefreak> oh universe syncs i should just subscribe Hobbsee's team?
<Hobbsee> gnomefreak: yeah, or get a MOTU in here to ack it
<TheMuso> StevenK: The package only has one python script, which gets placed in /usr/bin
<gnomefreak> can anyone ack this? https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/eric/+bug/56015
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 56015 in eric "[Edgy MoM]  Please sync Eric" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed] 
<StevenK> TheMuso: Just depend on python-all
<StevenK> I doubt you need python-{support,central} at all.
<TheMuso> Thats what I'm thinking.
<TheMuso> Thanks.
<gnomefreak> is it normal to get out of office replys from bug reports lol
<Fujitsu> Not normal, but not unheard-of.
<Fujitsu> Some people have some silly systems set up.
<gnomefreak> im assuming that is either creeator or mantianer of gnomebaker i got that reply from
<Fujitsu> Or a member of one of the subscribed teams?
<gnomefreak> yeah
<derjohn> Q: is there some package of a 2.6.17 kernel for _dapper_ out? (backport or so ...) My HP nx6325 machine needs that kernel to run properly if you follow (http://gentoo-wiki.com/HARDWARE_HP_Compaq_nx6125_with_Turion64).
<gnomefreak> derjohn: no
<gnomefreak> derjohn: you would have to build it for dapper from kernel.org i think
<TheMuso> And get a newer udev.
<TheMuso> afaik
<TheMuso> I think 2.6.16 onwards has a newer udev than what is in dapper.
<gnomefreak> yeah not sure if libc6 will be needed or not
<derjohn> gnomefreak, I had silent hope that there is already inofficial effort do package it ... also the ATI binary driver would have to be rebuild etc.
<zul> or you could run edgy
<derjohn> i assume I cannot patch-up the ubuntu 2.6.15 with "delta" diffs from kernel.org?
<gnomefreak> derjohn: its rare if ever that a kernel for one version will be in an earlier version too much crap/breakage to do it
<derjohn> zul, I run it on oneof my servers. please not on desktop, where #packages is times 4 ...
<derjohn> zul, currently I cannot reconfigure the locales on edgy ...
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: You know there is still a couple of merges there with your name on them?
<derjohn> i'll try the noapic stuff etc. before I consider efting the machine.
<StevenK> Hell, there's a still a few there with my name on them.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: yeah.  one's being left to lure, and the other one i uploaded yesterday
<lucas> I was wondering: are you MOTUs running edgy or dapper ?
<Hobbsee> lucas: edgy, almost all the time
<TheMuso> Edgy
* gnomefreak edgy
* Hobbsee had to run dapper for a bit, while the wifi was screwed in edgy.  then i got rid of ndiswrapper
<TheMuso> How often does that page get updated?
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: it's usually every hour, i think it's less now
<TheMuso> Right.
<ajmitch> lucas: edgy on all machines
<StevenK> lucas: Dapper, with Edgy in 2 chroots.
<lucas> ok, thanks
<TheMuso> 2 chroots?
<Hobbsee> lucas: yeah.  chroots.  dont forget them.  most MOTU's and devs probably ran chroots/pbuilder as soon as edgy was out
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: sure, one for edgy, the other for dapper
<ajmitch> TheMuso: sure, I have them for i386 & amd64
* TheMuso did until edgy bootstrapped on install easier.
<lucas> yes, of course, but I was talking about main system
<TheMuso> Right.
<Hobbsee> lucas: dual, or tripple boot.  works fine.
<StevenK> TheMuso: amd64 and i386
<TheMuso> Right.
<StevenK> TheMuso: I have six, as a matter of fact - Dapper, Edgy and Sid, each for i386 and amd64
<gnomefreak> i have a main testing pc but main work pc is on dapper atm
<ajmitch> StevenK: for some reason I haven't cleaned up my old hoary & breezy & sarge chroots yet
* StevenK has 2 breezy chroots tarred up.
<gnomefreak> i guess if i want to package i will have to learn chrrot
<Hobbsee> gnomefreak: or use pbuilder.
* StevenK still has to fix his pbuilder.
<gnomefreak> pbuilder sounds easier
<Hobbsee> StevenK: get to it :P
<Hobbsee> it is.  much
<StevenK> Its complaining about invalid devices for hardlinks.
<Hobbsee> you dotn run into the problem of unclean chroots either
<Hobbsee> ah
<TheMuso> Pbuilder alone may not always help. I still build packages normally, if I want to see where files are being placed, and trace a debian/rules calls to various commands.
* StevenK hands TheMuso pbuilder login
<TheMuso> StevenK: I knew about that, but sometimes that is a little quicker.
<TheMuso> Pbuilder does take a while to get everything into place, especially if the package has a lot of depenancies.
<StevenK> pbuilder doesn't help if you want to run a full machine.
<StevenK> Or test KDE stuff, for that matter.
* StevenK shakes his fist at kded and nightmarish friends.
<Hobbsee> StevenK: did you want to check TheMuso's merge, seeing as you were discussing the python stuff earlier?
<Hobbsee> may as well give someone else a go at the edgy changes list.
<gnomefreak> i figure id like to get a few merges under my belt before i try packaging
<StevenK> Damn, I thought TheMuso was a MOTU.
* TheMuso clears his throat.
<ajmitch> gnomefreak: you've probably only got a few hours before Hobbsee finishes them all
<TheMuso> Someone has a great memory.
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: hah.
<StevenK> Muahaha
<gnomefreak> lol
<ryanakca> do we need the kde pot patch for new apps (like this was written in 2006), or is it just for older ones?
<StevenK> TheMuso: Throw it at me, Rails is irritating me.
<Hobbsee> ryanakca: yes, we need them for all packages.
<TheMuso> StevenK: Are you on the universe sponsors team?
<Hobbsee> StevenK: https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/soundconverter/+bug/56018
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 56018 in soundconverter "Request for upload of this merged package." [Untriaged,Unconfirmed] 
<gnomefreak> i dont want to throw too many sync request out at one time
<StevenK> TheMuso: Yup.
<StevenK> Hobbsee made me do it.
<TheMuso> Did you receive an email about it?
<StevenK> Or something.
<Hobbsee> gnomefreak: you wont.  if you could use pitti's script to request the syncs, that'd be cool
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: i did, yeah
<TheMuso> So StevenK should have as well.
<StevenK> TheMuso: Like I check my e-mail.
<gnomefreak> theres  ascript to request syncs?
<TheMuso> hahahaha
<Hobbsee> ah yeah, cos i havent changed that so it seems to go to all places
<Hobbsee> gnomefreak: yeah, pitti wrote one recently
<Fujitsu> Hobbsee, wasn't that for merges?
<TheMuso> gnomefreak: Yes, but its not very useful atm
<gnomefreak> ah
<TheMuso> SOrry, the sponsored upload script is not useful
<StevenK> Sure it is, requestsync works great.
<ryanakca> Hobbsee: kk, and where does the patch go? (hasn't really patched before)... debian/patches ?
<TheMuso> But the sync script can't be used by non-MOTUs afaik
<Hobbsee> gnomefreak: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2006-August/019922.html
<gnomefreak> ty  looking
<StevenK> TheMuso: No mail from you.
<Hobbsee> ryanakca: it's listed in the packaging guide, along with the stuff to add to debian/rules
<TheMuso> StevenK: hmmm
<TheMuso> Hobbsee got one
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: yeah, but i'm the owner of the team
* Hobbsee should, theoretically, get notifications of everything.
<StevenK> What domain would it have come from?
<TheMuso> Ah
<TheMuso> themuso@themuso.com
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: your merge requests are good, cos they have the debdiffs between each version
<StevenK> enervated:~# grep themuso /var/log/exim4/mainlog | grep -v slug
<StevenK> enervated:~#
* Hobbsee likes doing them.
<Hobbsee> StevenK: https://launchpad.net/bugs/56018
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 56018 in soundconverter "Request for upload of this merged package." [Untriaged,Unconfirmed] 
* StevenK points Hobbsee at the backscroll.
<Hobbsee> StevenK: true
<StevenK> Hobbsee: You told me that 4 minutes ago. :-P
<TheMuso> heh
<StevenK> I was checking my mail server.
<Hobbsee> StevenK: bleh.
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: probably because TheMuso has been asked for other debdiffs every time :)
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: I started including debdiffs between debian as well, after MOTUs were also asking me for debdiffs for that. So I thought well its not much extra work to include Debian debdiffs as well.
<Hobbsee> StevenK: yes, but if you'd looked at my message, you wouldnt have needed to look thru your mail
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: that's true.  i think i'll start asking people to do that.
<StevenK> Hobbsee: Which message, sorry?
<Hobbsee> StevenK: the bug report one
<StevenK> TheMuso: The debdiff looks sane.
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: did you lose much data?
<phanatic> afternoon everyone
<ajmitch> hi phanatic
<TheMuso> StevenK: Cool. You should see debian/rules. IMO just a little shocking.
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: about 2 months of email, irssi configs, some of .bashrc, it looks like
<phanatic> hi ajmitch
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: not too much then, though the email loss is annoying
<Hobbsee> yeah
<Hobbsee> fortunately, looks like most is still on malone
<phanatic> Hobbsee: hard drive problems?
<Hobbsee> phanatic: no, a little careless with the rm -rf
<phanatic> Hobbsee: i remember you saying a while ago that you are usually too careless with rm -rf :) but i can feel with you: just ran a fsck and found a bunch of badblocks on my hdd :(
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: SO how many wifi cards do you have now?
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: 2.
<TheMuso> Right.
* StevenK has two as well.
<Hobbsee> phanatic: yeah....well...theoretically the approach would have worked.  only problem was that i missed a few folders to tar.
* Hobbsee had 3 for a while :P
<ajmitch> a bit of a problem
<StevenK> TheMuso: Looks fine, builds fine.
<TheMuso> StevenK: cool
<StevenK> TheMuso: Successfully uploaded packages.
<TheMuso> StevenK: Thanks.
<StevenK> My key is your key.
<StevenK> Well, you wish, anyway.
<TheMuso> hehe
* StevenK sniggers at his evilness.
<Fujitsu> Any MOTUs wanting to check+upload some merges for me?
<TheMuso> Anybody seen Jeremie Corbier around? Just wanted to know if he doesn't mind people taking a merge or two from him. :p
<TheMuso> Fujitsu: Do you log upload sponsor requests in malone against the package?
<Fujitsu> You can, I think, but it's not necessary.
<ajmitch> TheMuso: Toadstool
<TheMuso> ajmitch: Ah ok thanks.
* TheMuso wishes there was a nick -> real name or vise versa table somewhere.
<Fujitsu> Yeah, that'd be nice.
<StevenK> TheMuso: I have an autorealname script for irssi
<TheMuso> StevenK: Doesn't always help if people's real names are in their whois info.
* StevenK glares at Hobbsee.
<TheMuso> Whered you get it?
<StevenK> Um.
<TheMuso> s/are/aren't
<gnomefreak> most of them have thier nicks in thier emails
<TheMuso> gnomefreak: Not always.
<gnomefreak> true
<TheMuso> Jeremie's ubuntu email is not his IRC nick.
<StevenK> TheMuso: Oh geez, somewhere off the irssi.org site
<TheMuso> Ah right.
<TheMuso> So how does it work exactly/
<StevenK> When it sees a join event, it queries for a realname and displays it.
<StevenK> [22:06]  -!- Hobbsee_ [n=Hobbsee@ubuntu/member/hobbsee]  has joined #ubuntu-motu
<StevenK> [22:06]  -!- Hobbsee_ is Hobbsee
<StevenK> Like so.
* Hobbsee_ doesnt show a real name.
* Fujitsu chastises Hobbsee_.
<gnomefreak> thats what i was thinking
<TheMuso> StevenK: Right. Only useful if you see them joining however.
<Hobbsee_> Fujitsu: for good reason.
<StevenK> TheMuso: Yup.
<gnomefreak> looks like it shows the main nick for the linked one
<Fujitsu> Why, Hobbsee_?
* Hobbsee_ only just switched over the LP to show her real name
<Hobbsee_> Fujitsu: think about it.  i'm a woman among a group of men.
<Fujitsu> True...
<Fujitsu> I guess.
<Fujitsu> Please overcome the stereotype :)
<TheMuso> Hobbsee_: Don't let that bother you.
* gnomefreak thinks the people Hobbsee talks to on a daily basis can help her if needed ;)
<Hobbsee> gnomefreak: hmmm?
<Hobbsee> gnomefreak: hmmm?
<gnomefreak> wh would you be worried about being the only or one of the only women in a group of men?
<gnomefreak> s/wh/why
<TheMuso> Fujitsu: Have you started working on drivel at all yet?
<Hobbsee> not worried.  just knowing that i have to put up with a lot mroe
<tseng> yeah, gnomefreak doesnt have his ircname set either
<tseng> maybe he is secretly a girl too
<tseng> and you are reinforcing that
<gnomefreak> :)
<Fujitsu> TheMuso, I've done it as of about 30 minutes ago, I just need somebody to upload it :)
<Fujitsu> Same with apt-watch.
<TheMuso> Ok.
<Fujitsu> And xboard, and xchm, and something else I've forgotten.
<Fujitsu> Ah yes, lcd4linux.
<ajmitch> we haven't seen much of "OMG a girl?!?" in here, actually
<Fujitsu> Which is good, ajmitch.
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: yeah, not for a few months.
<gnomefreak> tseng: i do it cause i had a few script kiddies give me issues after banning them
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: havent you forgotten the stuff a few months ago?
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: yes
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: I forget things from a few hours ago
<tseng> <tseng> omg, a girl in here!?!!?!1111?
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: hah.  think of kyral
<gnomefreak> hes a loud mouth :(
<ajmitch> yes, he's a special case though
<Fujitsu> I don't see how people can say such things...
<TheMuso> Last I heard, Kyro was getting into Ark Linux.
<tseng> if I had seen it I would have banned him.
* gnomefreak had to sit in #ubuntu-offtopic watching a women who use linux bashing session for 3 hours :(
<ajmitch> TheMuso: of course, and he still visits us here
<Hobbsee> tseng: i'm not tempted to ban him.  i'm *very* tempted to ban another guy thouhg.
<tseng> he was in here recently to cry about how we don't care about the forums
<Fujitsu> gnomefreak, ouch.
<tseng> Hobbsee: does it start with a b?
<Hobbsee> tseng: indeed.
<tseng> Hobbsee: i have you covered
<tseng> Hobbsee: *hugs*
<Hobbsee> tseng: think of "pyscopathic bitch" if it helps :P
* Fujitsu looks for b*... Hmm... Not many.
* Hobbsee hugs tseng in return
<Hobbsee> heh
<tseng> Fujitsu: he's not here
<gnomefreak> ive banned him a few times *warning* if you ban him expect an argument or whining
* TheMuso picks up the meaning of who was referred to.
<ajmitch> it wasn't hard to guess
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: :)
<tseng> gnomefreak: I have been banning this person for 4 years
<Hobbsee> gnomefreak: like that doesnt happen for anyone else
<tseng> gnomefreak: back to hardened gentoo days
<Fujitsu> Hmm...
<ajmitch> tseng: seems like a slow learner
<gnomefreak> hes been around that long?
<tseng> ajmitch: he's mellowed, believe it or not
* Hobbsee could ban him from all ubuntu channels, effectively now....
<gnomefreak> i would have asked for perm ban by now
<Hobbsee> not -bugs though.
<ajmitch> tseng: that's worrying
<Fujitsu> Is he around at all at the moment>
<Fujitsu> *?
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: no
* Hobbsee checked that first :P
<Fujitsu> I mean, not just in this channel.
<Hobbsee> user on channels: #ubuntu #ubuntu-devel #ubuntu-offtopic
<gnomefreak> ok i dont ever see him in those channels :(
<tseng> you cant ban him retroactively
<tseng> unfortunately.
<zul> who is this?
<tseng> you know.
<zul> oh..
<Fujitsu> Hrm.
* Fujitsu exports user lists and calculates the intersection between the three channels.
<Hobbsee> heh
<Hobbsee> [22:21]  [Whois]  bluefoxicy is a user on channels: #ubuntu #ubuntu-devel #ubuntu-offtopic
<Hobbsee> is the full line
<Fujitsu> I checked that!
<azeem> hrm, it's not BenC.
<thom> azeem: heh
<TheMuso> WHat is Steven J Harms's irc Nick?
<Fujitsu> Oh.
<gnomefreak> sharms
<Fujitsu> Of course.
<Fujitsu> He's +i, so I see:
<Fujitsu>  [bluefoxicy]  #ubuntu-devel #ubuntu-offtopic #launchpad
<gnomefreak> :(
<TheMuso> He been around lately?
<tseng> sigh.
<azeem> is #ubuntu +s now?
<gnomefreak> i havent seen him really since the crap in -ops with him
<Fujitsu> He was one of my first guesses... But I discounted him... Silly +i.
<azeem> or +i then
<Fujitsu> No.
<gnomefreak> neither
<Fujitsu> People have +i, not channels.
<gnomefreak> +i a channel is invite only
<azeem> so why doesn't #ubuntu show up in his /whois?
<Fujitsu> Because I'm not in #ubuntu.
<Hobbsee> azeem: it does?
<Hobbsee> ah
<azeem> Hobbsee: if you're not in #ubuntu, I mean
<tseng> on a real ircd, you can see peopls channels
<azeem> I thought that only happens for +s chans
<tseng> unless they are +s
<Hobbsee> azeem: ah.
<tseng> freenode likes to be increasingly distanced from everyone else
<Fujitsu> +i means you can only see the person's channels if you're in those channels.
<thom> freenode has a "special" ircd
<Fujitsu> Yep, dancer-ircd.
<azeem> Fujitsu: ok
<Fujitsu> I was playing with it last night.
<tseng> they always used dancer
<Fujitsu> It's a silly thing.
<gnomefreak> hes got that hiding turned on
<tseng> but it was more recntly that they started breaking with everyone else
<gnomefreak> if you are not in the channel with him you cant see them
<Fujitsu> Yep, mode +i.
<azeem> well, not a big issue anyway, I just checked his /whois, and saw #launchpad intead of #ubuntu and #ubuntu-offtopic and thought you people be talking about somebody else
<thom> yeah, by all accounts there're some *really* horrific patches in feenode's dancer
<gnomefreak> yeah
<Fujitsu> azeem, exactly.
<Hobbsee> azeem: ahhh...
<Fujitsu> Same as me.
<ryanakca> Hobbsee: mind pointing me in the direction of that packaging guide you were talking about? the "Packaging for Kubuntu" on just says how to use po, and where to get the patch, and the debian new maintainers guide talks about .dpatch, not .diff
<Hobbsee> ryanakca: i was referring to the kubuntu section of the ubuntu packaging guide
<ryanakca> Hobbsee: http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/ubuntu-kubuntu.html   ?
<Hobbsee> ryanakca: yep
<ryanakca> Hobbsee: it says to add 2 lines to debian/rules, but not what I should do with the .diff (I've never patched before)...
<Hobbsee> ryanakca: the .diff goes into debian/patches
<ryanakca> kk, that's it?
<Hobbsee> and the 2 lines go into debian/rules, so that the pot files are actually created
<Hobbsee> ah, if it's cdbs, it should be.  are there already files in debian/patches?
<Hobbsee> can you pastebin debian/rules?
<ryanakca> nothing in debian/patches, no such directory, I'll create it, and theres allready a po/eqonomize.pot
<ryanakca> It's a package of a new app... rules: http://pastebin.ca/126391
<ryanakca> the po/eqonomize.pot is from upstream, btw...
<Toadstool> heya everybody
<ryanakca> hey Toadstool
<Toadstool> hi ryanakca
<Hobbsee> icky debhelper
<Hobbsee> someone tell ryanakca about how to add patches with debhelper
<Hobbsee> or send him to the -motu school logs on patching
* Fujitsu protects debhelper.
* Fujitsu tells the debhelper not to let evil mean CDBS-loving Hobbsee upset it
<Fujitsu> :P
<Hobbsee> haha
* Hobbsee conscripts Fujitsu to use YADA for the rest of his life.  NYAH!!!!!
<Toadstool> ryanakca: have you read https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/School/PatchingSources?
<Fujitsu> :O
<StevenK> Aiiiieeeeeee
* Fujitsu explodes.
<StevenK> You said the *evil* word.
* Hobbsee thinks that's an appropriate evil.
<Toadstool> er, YADA...
* Toadstool runs away
<Hobbsee> StevenK: i did.  speaking of which, have you considered the fact that a package that usually builds with yada could instead be built with checkinstall?  and then maybe downloaded with a wifi card that needs ndiswrapper to run?
<Hobbsee> oh the evil...the EVIL!!!
<ryanakca> ewww cdbs
* Hobbsee runs away at that.
* Fujitsu begins to hyperventilate.
<Fujitsu> Hobbsee, you have scarred me for life.
* StevenK drops to the floor and convulses.
<azeem> <moshez> mhp: I do great evil!
<azeem> <mhp> moshez: you code perl?!
<azeem> <moshez> no, GREAT evil
<Toadstool> :D
<Hobbsee> hahaha
<Hobbsee> StevenK: and then posts the link on my myspace :P
<thom> azeem: ah, moshez. those were the days
<zul> according to my evil test im pure evil
<StevenK> Hobbsee: NOT HELPING
* Hobbsee suspects that will be the final straw of evil.
<Hobbsee> ROFL!
<azeem> thom: yeah
<tseng> haha myspace
* Hobbsee hugs StevenK 
<StevenK> zul: If you have to declare it, you aren't.
<zul> StevenK: but its generally known
<azeem> http://sinfest.net/comikaze/comics/2006-08-06.gif
<StevenK> Bwahahaha
<Kamping_Kaiser> is there a basic debian/rules file i could look at for reference?
<Hobbsee> tseng: this is the great thing about myspace.  everyone flocks to look, then immediately wishes they didnt.
<StevenK> Kamping_Kaiser: The 'hello' package
<Hobbsee> tseng: http://myspace.com/creamier_oak
<Kamping_Kaiser> StevenK, ok, i'll grab it, thanks
<StevenK> Must ... resist ... temptation.
<tseng> haha!
<Hobbsee> tseng: *that* is why StevenK is being horrified.
<tseng> Hobbsee++
<StevenK> My fragging retinas are *still* hurting.
<Hobbsee> :D
<Hobbsee> so are your wife's, probably
<StevenK> Probably.
<Hobbsee> tseng: actually, you get used to it after a while.
<tseng> im not sure i do
* Hobbsee got bugged over and over by some friends to get one.  so i did, just to get back at them :P
* TheMuso has no retinas to cause pain to. :p
<tseng> but i liked the pony bit
* Fujitsu convulses.
<tseng> jdub added that the the fridge for me
<tseng> before it went live
<Fujitsu> TheMuso, you're lucky in this case :P
<tseng> its still there afaik
<Kamping_Kaiser> Hobbsee, nice
<Kamping_Kaiser> (site)
<Hobbsee> Kamping_Kaiser: yeah, very :P
<tseng> haha it says you are a Swinger
<Toadstool> er, """nice""" :)
<Kamping_Kaiser> Hobbsee, :P:)
<Hobbsee> tseng: it says all sorts of rubbish.
<TheMuso> Fujitsu: I do actually have some sight.
<tseng> Hobbsee: mine says nearly nothing
<TheMuso> Whats the URL?
<thom> you won't after you look at that site
<Fujitsu> TheMuso, are you sure you will after you look at this?
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: http://myspace.com/creamier_oak
<Fujitsu> thom, exactly.
<Hobbsee> haha
<Fujitsu> Hobbsee, that is truely an abomination.
<Kamping_Kaiser> Hobbsee, i just managed to read some text - hillarious
<StevenK> TheMuso: Looking at it in elinks is cheating
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: *exactly*
* TheMuso thinks of what music could be syncronised with that colour pattern.
* Hobbsee enjoyed their responses.
<TheMuso> StevenK: I'm not.
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: YOu should treasure that. Its a work of art. :)
* Fujitsu hits TheMuso.
<TheMuso> A disco in your web browser.
<ajmitch> TheMuso: yes, modern art certainly encompasses a lot these days
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: a guy in a kubuntu meeting sent me that background.  it would have been about 7.30am at the time.
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: impressive
* TheMuso imagines those cheesy sets of lights that mobile DJs have after seeing that pattern.
<Hobbsee> haha
* ajmitch tries to clear the headache
<zul> im going to have a seizure if keep looking at that page
<Kamping_Kaiser> heheeh
<StevenK> Stop talking about the page!
* Kamping_Kaiser sets it as desktop :P
<StevenK> My retinas are starting to bleed again.
<ajmitch> StevenK: just proof that Hobbsee is evil
* StevenK nods.
<Hobbsee> hahahha
* StevenK squishes the evil.
* TheMuso has just got a musical idea from that.,
<Hobbsee> Kamping_Kaiser: new gnome desktop, maybe.
<Hobbsee> you'd get a lot of people starting to use kde...
<Kamping_Kaiser> hahahaa
<Kamping_Kaiser> exept the 15y/o girls who make sites like that ;P
* Fujitsu considers deploying that background to every computer in the school.
* Hobbsee should suggest that to sabdfl, see if he takes it.
<Hobbsee> hah
* ajmitch looks at his passport & decides to go & visit Hobbsee to make her stop it. now.
<TheMuso> The sort of music that would practically hypnotise anybody looking at the page and listening. :p
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: haha.  make sure you sneak in quietly, you know what my parents are like with kerfew.
<Fujitsu> *curfew
<Kamping_Kaiser> oh, the letters move
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: ooh...that'd be fun
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: oh yeah, thanks
<Hobbsee> Kamping_Kaiser: that they do :P
<StevenK> TheMuso: NOW LOOK WHAT YOU'VE DONE.
* tseng posts on the page
* gnomefreak thought kerfew was a kde thing
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: I don't think I could get there until tomorrow evening at the earliest
<StevenK> TheMuso: Hobbsee will ask for the music and put it on the page.
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: ahh right...
* ajmitch checks flights
<TheMuso> StevenK: Thats the idea.
<Hobbsee> StevenK: i'd have to use that awful interface to do it.
<StevenK> Would the evil be worth it?
* TheMuso can be evil too, when he puts his mind to it.
<Hobbsee> StevenK: debatable.
<tseng> "Error: You must be someone's friend to make comments about them."
<tseng> oh
<tseng> too bad
<TheMuso> Just a little more suttle however.
<Hobbsee> tseng: gah.  didnt that get taken out?
<Kamping_Kaiser> Hobbsee, i cant put an S in place, i keep loosing it in the grey :(
<tseng> Hobbsee: apperantly not
<tseng> I only get on here to look at friends show times
<Hobbsee> hmmm.
<tseng> for local bands
<tseng> and hear their songs
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: actually if I get to christchurch by 4AM, I could be in sydney by 7:30AM AEST
<ajmitch> that suitable? :)
<Hobbsee> hehe nice
<StevenK> ajmitch: I can do it by proxy.
<ajmitch> StevenK: that sounds good
<TheMuso> heh
* StevenK could be at Hobbsee's house in about 20 minutes.
<tseng> ajmitch: your planes arent delayed?
<tseng> ajmitch: (http://craphound.com/images/liquids-on-a-plane.jpg)
<ajmitch> tseng: not that I've heard
<ajmitch> it's not like anyone cares about transtasman flights
<StevenK> Hahaha
<tseng> no, but australia does whatever the us does
* tseng hides
* StevenK says "Who wants to go there, anyway?" in a Kiwi accent.
<ajmitch> hm
<tseng> StevenK: your a kiwi?
<StevenK> I am not.
<ajmitch> seems that we're allowed carry-on bags, but no liquids
<ajmitch> what a shame
<tseng> oh damn
<tseng> you're an aussie
* Fujitsu hits tseng a bit.
<Hobbsee> tseng: seems to be set to anyone can comment
<Fujitsu> I am an Aussie!
* StevenK kicks tseng.
<tseng> Hobbsee: not me, ma'am
<zul> tseng: well we all know that nz is australia junior
* Fujitsu hits zul.
<Hobbsee> tseng: odd
<ajmitch> zul: just like canadia is just another american state?
<zul> ajmitch: exactly
<Fujitsu> Ey, I'm Canadian as well!
<thom> ajmitch: australia too
<tseng> Hobbsee: ive given up
<ajmitch> thom: true
<Hobbsee> tseng: seems that you have to be logged in, i'm not sure
<tseng> I was logged in
<Kamping_Kaiser> hm. i like moving letters
* Kamping_Kaiser better leave before he gets involved in it
<TheMuso> So what have people got planned for their weekends? :p
<Hobbsee> Kamping_Kaiser: haha
<TheMuso> Jumping on planes it seems. :p
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: to take over the world, and burn people's eyes out.
<tseng> TheMuso: picking up the piles of mail i sorted on the floor 2 weeks ago
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: I'd better keep away then. Even though I can't see as well as yourself, I still have eyes and a face that I would rather not have scarred. :)
<ajmitch> I think I'll stay in NZ
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: haha
* Kamping_Kaiser pouts. i want movy text
<TheMuso> ...was it something I said? Or has conversation just decided to die?
<StevenK> Hobbsee killed it.
<StevenK> Evil Hobbsee.
<Kamping_Kaiser> TheMuso, freenode died, at that moment
<TheMuso> Well it died in an interesting way. :p
<Hobbsee> hehe
* Hobbsee killed it.  again
<Hobbsee> it wanted to die
<TheMuso> Did it?
* TheMuso glares at Hobbsee.
<StevenK> It's Freenode, it *begs* to die.
<Hobbsee> heh
<TheMuso> Oh thats right. I can't glare at anyone.
* TheMuso glares at blackness
<ajmitch> heh
<ajmitch> blame Hobbsee anyway
<StevenK> No, blame New Zealand!
<Hobbsee> haha
<Hobbsee> it's all new zealand's fault.
<ajmitch> of course it is
<ajmitch> since we obviously control freenode
<StevenK> Obviously.
* StevenK nail it back to wool production, if you like.
<StevenK> s/nail/could nail/
<Hobbsee> hehe
<TheMuso> Any kind MOTU feel like looking this one over? Malone bug 56025
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 56025 in moc "Request package sync from Debian unstable." [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/56025
* Hobbsee doesnt remember that being syncable.  or something was up with that.
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: Really?
<TheMuso> When was that?
<StevenK> Current release:  2.4.0-1build1
<StevenK> That's only a rebuild
<Hobbsee> hmmm.
<tseng> builds are auto-synced
* Hobbsee wonders why she got confused wiht that.
<ajmitch> TheMuso: for sync requests, keybuk really appreciates it if you put the version number in
<TheMuso> ajmitch: ah ok.
<ajmitch> tseng: except that the autosync stopped, so we have to request every time
<TheMuso> I'll edit.
<tseng> ajmitch: yes but its not "unsyncable"
* Hobbsee wonders if gentoo's patch was still needed.
<tseng> someone put a patch in build1?
<Toadstool> nope
<Hobbsee> ahh...excuse my idiocy
<TheMuso> Edited.
<TheMuso> ajmitch: Thanks for the heads up.
<Toadstool> hmm, moc builds fine in my amd64 pbuilder
* TheMuso notes he has some other syncs open, so goes to update those.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: are they all approved?
<Toadstool> TheMuso: moc confirmed
<TheMuso> Theres also Bug #55319
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 55319 in spiralsynthmodular "Request sync of latest spiralsynthmodular version from Debian, oveversion" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/55319
<Fujitsu> Goodnight, everybody.
<TheMuso> Night Fujitsu.
<Fujitsu> See ya TheMuso.
<Hobbsee> night Fujitsu
<Fujitsu> Bye.
<neutrinomass> There's also a sync request by a debian developer that has probably gone unnoticed so I'm bringing it up ... bug 53687
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 53687 in Ubuntu "please ship leptonlib 1.37, not 1.36" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/53687
* neutrinomass can't really find the leptonlib package though ...
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: why get rid of the .deskto for spiralsynthmodular?
<TheMuso> Aah. Didn't even see that.
<TheMuso> Will reject bug.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: that's definetly a merge.
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: I know that now.
<ajmitch> neutrinomass: libleptonica
<TheMuso> Working on it.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: :)
<ajmitch> which didn't appear to make it in at all
<neutrinomass> ajmitch: Yep... I found it in Debian, not in Ubuntu though
* TheMuso decides to get ready for bed while pbuilder works.
<Hobbsee> grr.  kdbg doesnt seem to build.
* Hobbsee waits for upstream to fix it.
<TheMuso> Gar.
<TheMuso> So I return, just as the package starts to get configured.
<TheMuso> heh
<ajmitch> don't you hate waiting for apt-get to finish resolving dependencies?
<TheMuso> And downloading them
<Hobbsee> heh
* Hobbsee uses imbrandon's machine which has a local mirror for that reason.
<Hobbsee> it's sync time!
<TheMuso> Ah right.
<TheMuso> Lucky you.
<TheMuso> I may decide to keep a local mirror when I have my file server built, and ADSL2. :p
* Hobbsee suddenly got a flood of email.
<Bazzi> does it take long for you for apt to resolve depoendencies etc? I never had a problem with the time it takes
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: connection here is a bit sucky now.
<Hobbsee> Bazzi: in a pbuilder, it takes quite a while
<ajmitch> Bazzi: for pbuilder, yes
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: particularly if i'm at uni
<TheMuso> Right.
<Bazzi> oh, for pbuilder
<ajmitch> since it repeatedly simulates installing a set of packages
<TheMuso> Packages which draw in 30 odd MB of deps can be a little on the long side.
<ajmitch> TheMuso: is that all?
<TheMuso> ajmitch: ?
<Bazzi> ok a local mirror might make sense then ;)
<ajmitch> TheMuso: I've seen some that require much more than that
<TheMuso> ajmitch: Well I haven't. :p
<TheMuso> As far as I can remember.
<bddebian> Heya gang
<TheMuso> Hey bddebian.
<bddebian> Hello TheMuso
<ajmitch> hello bddebian
<bddebian> Hi ajmitch
<TheMuso> Meh. I'll check up on that build in the morning .Wanna get to bed, so will take care of later. :)
<TheMuso> Night folks
<ajmitch> night TheMuso
* ajmitch should sleep too, 2AM
<bddebian> Gnight TheMuso, ajmitch
<ajmitch> I said I should
<ajmitch> I haven't quite got there yet
<Hobbsee> heh
<bddebian> Oh, well get to work then.. ;-P
<nexu> what package include pyversions ?
<Toadstool> nexu: "python-minimal: /usr/share/python/pyversions.py" according to dpkg -S
<nexu> hmmm
<nexu> i still get sh: pyversions: command not found
<Toadstool> nexu: the python package creates the /usr/bin/pyversions -> /usr/share/python/pyversions.py symlink iirc
<nexu> yeah i just did that
<nexu> trying again now
<chillywilly> hi
<chillywilly> I am writing an init script for this grey listing daemon (sqlgrey) and there a switch (-d) to put the thing into the background, but if the process fails to stasrt a pid file is written out anyway so the start-stop-daemon command returns success even if the daemon fails to start...is it me or is that really poor behavior?
<chillywilly> if start-stop-daemon --start --quiet --pidfile $SQLGREYPID \
<chillywilly> --exec $SQLGREY -- $sqlgrey_opts; then
<chillywilly> ....
<chillywilly> was doing something like that
<chillywilly>  I suppose it's because the process is put into the background
<matid> Hi everyone. Where can I find any info on prerequisites to be given upload access to REVU?
<Gloubiboulga> !revu
<ubotu> REVU is a web-based tool to give people who have worked on Ubuntu packages a chance to "put their packages out there" for other people to look at and comment on in a structured manner. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU
<Gloubiboulga> there :)
<matid> Gloubiboulga: Thanks ;)
<Gloubiboulga> np :)
<matid> If I update a package and I'd like it to be uploaded to Ubuntu can I safely ignore lintian warnings regarding NMU?
<tseng> yes
<AnAnt> does anyone know the name of the widget that looks like a bubble , Ubuntu uses this widget in it's update manager to tell if there are new updates or need to reboot
<tseng> its libnotify
<tseng> not really a gtk widget you create directly
<AnAnt> tseng: oh, a library
<AnAnt> so I need my program to be in C to use it
<geser> which language do you use?
<AnAnt> Perl
<Kyral_Laptop> I walk in and I see Perl
<Kyral_Laptop> I am happy :P
<zul> im not
<zul> perl is evil most of the time
<AnAnt> Kyral_Laptop: you remind me of the poem called "She walks in beauty "
<Kyral_Laptop> huh?
<Kyral_Laptop> Never heard it
<AnAnt> nevermind, so is it possible to use libnotify in perl ?
<geser> there seems to be no perl bindings for libnotify
<AnAnt> ok, thanks
<geser> perhaps you could use notify-send from the libnotify-bin package
<AnAnt> oh, that sounds nice
<AnAnt> geser: thanks a lot, that worked :)
<AnAnt> btw, I sent some packages on REVU long time ago, and didn't get any comments on them
<AnAnt> especially there is a new package not in Debian nor Ubuntu
<AnAnt> called acon
<AnAnt> for arabic users
<matid> I fixed bug 55799. What's the proper way for me to make this fix actually be uploaded to repositories? Should I attach the debdiff file or upload the package to REVU?
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 55799 in edenmath.app "Typo in package description" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/55799
<matid> I'm not a member of any packaging team
<geser> matid: is it a large debdiff?
<matid> geser: I don't think so. I just fixed a typo. It's 56 lines long
<matid> geser: But this will be an initial ubuntu upload. It was only synced from debian, I think
<matid> geser: Or at least the version doesn't end with ubuntu*
<geser> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Bugs says upload the debdiff and assign it to the motureviewers team
<matid> geser: Thanks
<geser> there is also a ubuntu-universe-sponsors team but I don't know when you should choose it and when motureviewers
<Amaranth> How do I make my package install a file but then have upgrades not overwrite that file?
<Amaranth> It's not really a conffiles thing, I don't think. It's an SQLite DB, getting a diff of that would be useless. :P
<matid> Hi LaserJock
<LaserJock> hi matid
<kagou> hi
<axisys> !date -u
<ubotu> I know nothing about date -u - try searching http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi?db=ubuntu
<Amaranth> @now Chicago
<ubuntu-es> Amaranth: Error: "now" is not a valid command.
<Ubugtu> Current time in America/Chicago: August 11 2006, 11:55:52
<Amaranth> wtf is that?
<Amaranth> @owner
<ubuntu-es> Amaranth: Error: You don't have the owner capability. If you think that you should have this capability, be sure that you are identified before trying again. The 'whoami' command can tell you if you're identified.
<LaserJock> Amaranth: who are you?
<LaserJock> ;-)
<Amaranth> who owns ubuntu-es?
<Amaranth> it needs to go away or change it's prefix
<LaserJock> ### MOTU School Session: "Packaging Basics" is about to start in #ubuntu-motu-school ###
<gnube> hmm.
<LaserJock> hmmm
<gnube> I think I missed the session. Bummer
<LaserJock> it's going on right now
<LaserJock> in #ubuntu-motu-school
<gnube> Oh really? Where?
<gnube> oh, gggg.
<gnube> Thanks!
<segfault> how is the review process going?
<sbalneav> LaserJock: pinggggg
<LaserJock> sbalneav: what?
<sbalneav> when's the next motu-school.  I should attend
<LaserJock> it's going on now
<LaserJock> #ubuntu-motu-school
<neutrinomass> I don't want the interrupt the -school session, so I'll ask here: Is renaming an original tarball to .tar.gz neccessary if it originally was .tgz ?
<LaserJock> I think so
<Gloubiboulga> neutrinomass, yes
<neutrinomass> Gloubiboulga: Besides renaming it (and maybe mentioning it in the changelog), should anything else be done ?
<crimsun> that's if you're packaging from scratch
<crimsun> if you use uupdate, that step is unnecessary
<crimsun> (uupdate of course requires an existing package infrastructure)
* neutrinomass is packaging from source (attempting to, at least )
<Gloubiboulga> neutrinomass, you just have to rename the file I think
<neutrinomass> Gloubiboulga: ok, thanks
<neutrinomass> (I'm quite unlucky today it seems). I got the upstream tarball but unpacking it creates a foobar-2.1 directory and a symbolic link 'foobar' in the cwd that points to foobar-2.1 - what should be done ?
<Gloubiboulga> no idea actually...
<Gloubiboulga> you can run your mailing app and write a nice mail to upstream asking them to provide a clean tarball :)
<crimsun> that's the best thing to do.
<neutrinomass> Ok, will do.
<siretart> Toadstool: I finally managed to get your patch into production
<siretart> Toadstool: I just switched the apache config to use the bzr checkout, instead of the svn one. so merging patches is way easier now
<siretart> if someone wants something uploaded to revu, please ping me.
<siretart> I disabled the cronjob because I want to do the next run manually for testing purposes
<sharms> can anyone recommend a good package for time /task logging?
<siretart> sharms: I've been using gnotime for a while, I read that canonical employees are using gtimelog
<sharms> just what i was looking for, thanks
<Gloubiboulga> LaserJock, you're a star now ;)
<LaserJock> heh, not exactly
<Gloubiboulga> I think that a lot of people were really interested in this session
<Gloubiboulga> people who didn't know who to get started
<gnube> I know I was really interested in this, and I have submitted packages to debian already.
<LaserJock> ok, time for a break
<LaserJock> hehe, about 15 minutes into the session my boss came in and reminded me I was supposed to be doing a fire extinguisher training :-)
<Gloubiboulga> :)
<LaserJock> oops
<bddebian> heh
<matid> ;)
<LaserJock> somehow I always end up missing these trainings
<LaserJock> I'm going into my 5th year
<LaserJock> and I just this year got my laser safety training
<siretart> LaserJock: nice motu school session, indeed
<LaserJock> and I've been the lab laser safety officer for a couple years
<LaserJock> siretart: well, it's ok
<LaserJock> I'd like to see it more compact (+m might help :-) )
<bddebian> Time to head home. Later folks
<LaserJock> I had wanted to look at 3 packages
<LaserJock> but it took 2 hrs just to get through 1 :-)
<LaserJock> cya bddebian
<crimsun> three is a bit much
<crimsun> it took me three hours to cover three packages, and that was with an effective audience of two
<LaserJock> yes, well the last 2 where just quick ones
<LaserJock> like mutagen to show what CDBS looks like
<crimsun> personally it's much nicer to field questions as they come in, making it feel more like an actual session
<LaserJock> but you really can't do much in 1-2hrs
<LaserJock> well, I would have liked to be able to put stuff out and then unmod it
<LaserJock> and have designated question breaks ;-)
<LaserJock> but it works out ok
<LaserJock> I like having stuff as it comes up
<crimsun> I'd really like to be able to use a videocast or something
<LaserJock> because I often forget a point
<LaserJock> and it's nice to have somebody ask a question that reminds me
<LaserJock> crimsun: video cast would be interesting as I'm sitting here in lab and my boss was coming in and out
<LaserJock> asking me questions, etc.
<crimsun> of your screen
<crimsun> like a read-only vnc for multiple users
<LaserJock> well you don't want that either, I used OS X 90% of the time
<LaserJock> ;-)
<crimsun> I don't see how that's relevant
* LaserJock doesn't want to lose his MOTU rockstar status because people see him using OS X ;-)
<LaserJock> hehe
<crimsun> as a raging Ubuntu-aholic MOTU, I doubt you'll lose that
<LaserJock> lol
<LaserJock> oh, I'm tired
<LaserJock> I'm doing 2 weeks of intense contributor development
<LaserJock> and then I'll need a break
<LaserJock> I've got 2 presentation at Ubucon next week
<LaserJock> trying to work on a "contributing to Ubuntu" doc with lloydinho
<LaserJock> and I've seemed to have picked up a "pester the forums with 'Ubuntu is a community project, come contribute'" habit this week ;-)
<LaserJock> but after Ubucon, man I'm going to crash
<crimsun> well, take a well deserved break, then
<crimsun> I had to myself
<LaserJock> yeah
<LaserJock> it's so easy to get sucked in
<LaserJock> Ubuntu is more than contagious
<LaserJock> it's like a vortex that sucks you in
<crimsun> easy solution for that
<crimsun> work for Canonical
<LaserJock> noooooooo
<LaserJock> ;-)
<crimsun> oh you'll find you don't have that problem :-)
<LaserJock> I've made up my mind that I don't want to work for Canonical
<LaserJock> no matter how appealing it sounds some days
<matid> LaserJock: Why is that?
<LaserJock> for one, my wife would divorce me ;-)
<LaserJock> and I'm a chemist and I like being one
<LaserJock> so while Ubuntu is awesome and a great thing to volunteer for
<LaserJock> I don't want it to become a "job"
<LaserJock> and besides, there are tons of people waaaay more qualified than me to work fof Canonical
<LaserJock> I'd rather have them working on my distro
<LaserJock> :-)
<crimsun> the former reason is valid, the latter is rubbish
<welshbyte> heh, my housemate said i can take over as maintainer of his project which i was attempting to package yesterday
<LaserJock> hmm, that reminds me, I was going to go edit the BddebianIsAGod page :-)
<zul> LaserJock: why not you can work at home...naked even
<LaserJock> well, if I was a theoretical chemist I could do that
<LaserJock> but I'm not
<LaserJock> somehow I decided to do a PhD on something that involves almost no computer work
<LaserJock> :-)
<LaserJock> I have thought about working for a scientific software company
<zul> you could make bombs :)
<LaserJock> I already do
<LaserJock> just very small ones ;-)
<zul> cherry bombs? :)
<LaserJock> you should have seen what happend to our lab when a stupid postdoc exploded a gas cylinder
<zul> heh..
<Chons> i just joined the team on LP. so hello everybody!
<LaserJock> the Environmental Health & Saftey department made a poster of it and put it on their homepage ;-)
<gnube> LaserJock, Do you have a link?
<gnube> Would love to check that out.
<LaserJock> hmm, they might have taken it down already
<LaserJock> it was up for a few years
<gnube> Google perhaps . . .
<LaserJock> let me see if I can dig it up
<Toadstool> siretart: thanks :)
<crimsun> hey now, don't disparage the stupid postdocs
<siretart> Toadstool: you're welcome. I'm happy for every patch I get
<LaserJock> well, the guy had to move to CS so....
<LaserJock> ;-)
<zul> blowing up things too easy for him?
<LaserJock> yeah, he also drilled holes through $500 optics with the laser
<LaserJock> :/
<crimsun> meaning he has a doctorate in chem and then went back for compsci? That's not stupidity, just insanity.
<zul> LaserJock: heh...thats something i would do
<LaserJock> well, when you have to teach people how to use a wrench, it's not a good sign for an experimental physical chemistry group
<zul> heh...i electrocuted my lap partner once
<LaserJock> and he apparently like cruching number
<LaserJock> s
<tseng> you mean lab partner?
<tseng> i hope
<LaserJock> lol
<zul> er...yeah...i did
<LaserJock> hehe
<tseng> the other way would be sortof kinky, in the aberant sort of way
<LaserJock> that took me a minute to see
<tseng> ..not that theres anything wrong with that
<zul> dyslexia
<LaserJock> yeah, my math teacher in undergrad was dyslexic, sometimes you had to check your note carefully
<tseng> http://techgage.com/article/sabayon_linux_rc2
<zul> i can usually catch myself but sometimes it slips
<tseng> that first background is not the default i would have chosen
<tseng> if i were building a distro
<zul> tseng: it looks like you puked on the desktop
<tseng> zul: yeah.
<tseng> zul: maybe because its based on gentoo
<zul> tseng: heh...now now :)
<tseng> or kde!
* tseng hides
<zul> hobbsee is not up yet..
<tseng> :/
<tseng> I will get her some other time
<LaserJock> bah, those sabayon guys
<LaserJock> I went looking for the developers of the gnome profile editor, sabayon
<LaserJock> so I found a #sabayon channel and start chatting
<LaserJock> hehe, wrong sabayon ;-)
<Toadstool> hehe
<LaserJock> man, quicksilver has just increased my OS X experience a lot. I can see why that deskbar applet thingy is so cool
<zul> later
<tseng> er
<tseng> firefox 1.99
<tseng> meh
* tseng expects this to break *
<Chons> i would like to start contributing with packaging truecrypt. there is already a package by the company itself but it is always out of date. i still got 2 questions. Where can I find out if someone is working on a package for truecrypt yet? And may there possibly a problem with the licence? I am not so keen in legal stuff, but I think that 2. b. might be critical. http://www.truecrypt.org/license.php
<Toadstool> Chons: looks like the licence prevents truecrypt from being packaged for Debian: http://lists.debian.org/debian-legal/2006/06/msg00294.html
<tseng> 1. You may copy and/or distribute This Product, provided that You do not modify
<tseng> any part of This Product
<tseng> this is non-free
<Toadstool> yep
<tseng> I think its even a gray area if you can apply a diff.gz
<tseng> for packaging foo
* tseng reads the definition of The Product
<tseng> adding new files might be ok
* Chons reads the debian thread
<Chons> ok, then according to the debian-thread packaging would be a bad idea as the licence is unclear
<tseng> I agree
<Chons> perhaps they change the licence if I write them about that issue. a bsd licence might work for them
<matid> Night guys
<Chons> night
#ubuntu-motu 2006-08-12
<poningru> ogra: ping
<ryanakca> what do I add to debian/rules to apply patches?
<Laser_away> ryanakca: are you using dpatch?
<poningru> Laser_away: is the school already over/
<poningru> ?
<Laser_away> yeah
<poningru> :(
<poningru> ajmitch: ping
<Laser_away> you were at the first one weren't you?
<poningru> yeah
<ryanakca> Laser_away: ummm... dunno... I downloaded the kde pot patch thingy... and I put it in debian/patches/ ... which is what I'm supposed to do (from what I can tell of wiki/MOTU/School/PatchingSources)
<Laser_away> yeah, are you using CDBS?
<Laser_away> I'm guessing for KDE you are
<ryanakca> debhelper
<Laser_away> only debhelper?
<gnube> Laser_away, Is that you LaserJock? Are you still here? You are dedicated!
<ryanakca> Laser_away: yes...
* ryanakca gulps
<Laser_away> gnube: I spend a lot of time here ;-)
<gnube> Cool.
<gnube> Maybe that is one of the reasons Ubuntu is such a great distro
<gnube> Dedication.
<gnube> Debian people can be a little cranky, despite their genius.
<LaserJock> yes, and especially dedication by the community at large
<gnube> LaserJock, Absolutely, but you are a member of that community.
<LaserJock> sure, and so are you ;-)
<LaserJock> so I expect you to be here 12hrs a day :-)
<LaserJock> just kidding
<ryanakca> lol
<gnube> Some members do more than others, hopefully one day I can contribute significantly as well.
<gnube> I do my part, but not quite like you.
<ryanakca> LaserJock: learn cdbs?
<gnube> It is really important because packaging is kind of a black art.
<LaserJock> well, I think the Ubuntu philosophy is "everybody contribute what you can, and together we can move mountains" ;-)
<tseng> LaserJock++
<gnube> Sorry to be so off-topic everyone, I'll shutup now.
<LaserJock> gnube: no problemo
<gnube> :)
<LaserJock> we like discussing how great we are ;-)
<tseng> unless slomo comes along and contributes for you
<tseng> thats cool too
<LaserJock> true
* tseng hugs slomo
<ryanakca> Kubuntu is the bestest
<LaserJock> ryanakca: you could
<gnube> who is slomo?
<Amaranth> I can't package either, don't feel bad. :)
<tseng> he is #1
<ryanakca> gnube: no clue
<Amaranth> I just make things. ;)
<LaserJock> slomo is a real MOTU
<LaserJock> :-)
<ryanakca> I can... kindof... package
<LaserJock> everybody has to start somewhere
<ryanakca> nixternal__: hey... can I delegate you some more tasks?
<ryanakca> lol
<Amaranth> i can package python apps using distutils and simple things using gnome-autogen
<LaserJock> I'm sure there was a time (unimaginable as it seems) when elmo first read the GPL
<ryanakca> packaging python = hard
<Amaranth> ryanakca: no it's not :)
<tseng> python is one of the easier things to do
<Amaranth> well, the new stuff is hard
<ryanakca> mind pointing me to a wiki/HOWTO
<ryanakca> I've got some python apps I want to package :)
<Amaranth> but it's just been made as easy as replacing dh_python with dh_pycentral and going
<ryanakca> LaserJock: elmo = slomo?
<LaserJock> ryanakca: you don't have to use CDBS but many KDE apps use it
<LaserJock> ryanakca: no
<nixternal__> having issues right now, one sec ;)
<tseng> ryanakca: ... elmo = elmo
<tseng> ftp-master
<Amaranth> ryanakca: cdbs + distutils used to mean a 1 line rules file, 2 lines if you needed to do patching
<LaserJock> elmo = James Troup, master of Debian and Ubuntu
<tseng> LaserJock: not so much of ubuntu
<tseng> he is a slowly sysadmin these days
<Amaranth> now you need a bunch of crap
<LaserJock> yeah
<gnube> Once one has a package, as I do, for a tool called Xnee, how does one upload it to Ubuntu?
<gnomefreak> is packaging harder in general than merges?
<tseng> wrote himself out of the job :)
<ryanakca> just got confused when you were talking about slomo and then talking about elmo
<gnube> My debian sponsor kind of stinks
<tseng> via launchpad
<LaserJock> hehe
<LaserJock> I suppose
<ryanakca> gnube: REVU
<gnube> And becoming a DD takes a long time
<gnube> REVU eh?
<gnube> hmm . . .
<gnube> must read
<ryanakca> gnube: and then bug laserjock or some other motu untill they go nuts and decide to revue your revu package
<ryanakca> :)
<gnube> ryanakca, Heh, you just told me the secret. ;)
<LaserJock> wiki.ubuntu.com/REVU
<gnube> w00t.
<gnube> Thanks LaserJock
<Amaranth> ryanakca: review :)
<gnube> why are debian people so mad at Ubuntu? They say that Ubuntu does not give back, but that does not seem like a legitimate criticism since so much can just be taken from Ubuntu.
<ryanakca> Amaranth: review :)
<tseng> debian has 1000 developers
<LaserJock> most Debian people aren't mad
<tseng> you cant generalize about their opinions
<LaserJock> there are a few very vocal people who dislike Ubuntu
<LaserJock> but I've had lots of good experiences with Debian
<ryanakca> Some debian people help out in *buntu, and vice versa
* tseng too
<ryanakca> so have I
<gnube> LaserJock, Have you? That is good to hear.
<LaserJock> you kinda have to know who to go to though
<tseng> slomo, ajmitch and I are on the Debian Mono team
<LaserJock> debian-mentors is a good group
<tseng> i wrote the first draft of the debian policy
<gnube> I have heard lots of negative stuff, but I suppose I should not blame every DD for that.
<gnube> tseng, Wha?
<tseng> wha?
<ryanakca> I used Debian for the first 3 months of my linux life... setting up wacom is(or was) a hassle... because you had to compile your own kernel... but other than that... awesome distro
<gnube> tseng, For real? You wrote debian policy? Wow, cool.
<tseng> gnube: haha for real
<tseng> its a draft
<gnube> ryanakca, I agree, but I have a Dell and debian and Dell are not freinds.
<tseng> and other people have added stuff to it
<gnube> draft or not, cool.
<gnube> co-author or not, cool.
<tseng> http://pkg-mono.alioth.debian.org/cli-policy/
* ryanakca gets on his knees, and starts chanting "tseng, ajmitch, slomo, tseng, ajmitch, slomo, ..."
<ryanakca> that's sweet
<tseng> ryanakca: haha
<tseng> seb128 is on the debian gnome team
<gnube> But, you know what I am going to say next . . . Mono is not Free Software!
<gnube> It is based on Microsoft's C#
<tseng> I'll try not to hurt you
<gnube> I know.
<ryanakca> seb128... he's the head of ubuntu-l10n-fr... right?
<tseng> or are you really lacking clue?
<gnube> I expect it.
<gnube> I am wearing flame retardent underwear.
<tseng> it isnt "microsoft's C#"
<tseng> its an open standard
<Toadstool> ryanakca: he used to be
<tseng> including Intel, HP
<ryanakca> used to?
<ryanakca> hmmm
<gnube> tseng, Still, they can change that "standard".
<tseng> they can do whatever they want
<tseng> and we can implement the standard
<tseng> its standardized by internation standards bodies, not by MS
<ryanakca> Toadstool: who is it now? Claude Paroz?
<Toadstool> ryanakca: yeah, too much work with gnome, etc.
<tseng> if you really don't know this you should keep your opinion to yourself next time
<tseng> no offence
<gnube> tseng, But they have some serious influence in those bodies.
<tseng> sure, they originated the idea
<Toadstool> ryanakca: hmm, it must be Claude indeed
<ryanakca> Toadstool: <nocomment>gnome</nocomment>
<Toadstool> heh
<gnube> No offence taken, I speak a lot with Georg Greve, rms, et. al, so I have a bit of knowledge about this.
<tseng> I am not sure what they are going to do maliciously to an open standard of ISO and EMCA
<gnomefreak> Toadstool: ty for helping with the gnomebaker sync request
<tseng> "we standardize on doing destructive things on linux"
<gnomefreak> Toadstool: if it wasnt you forget i said anything
<gnube> tseng, They mangled JAVA
<tseng> Java isnt a standard
<Toadstool> gnomefreak: no problem ;)
<tseng> and microsoft didnt claim to implement something compatible
<gnube> tseng, Lets not stray to far into semantics here.
<tseng> I'm tiring of this
<gnube> ok, fine.
<tseng> if you wanted to go after WinForms you might have a leg to stand on
<tseng> RMS FUD against the CLR is unwarranted by all accounts
<gnube> Well, maybe you are not _so_ tired.
<tseng> this is the same guy with nothing better to do but show up at a talk by ati employees and protest
<gnube> You mean rms?
<tseng> yes.
<gnube> He has worked tirelessly for freedom. He is not the only voice, but he is an important voice, and often he is right.
<LaserJock> anyway...
<gnube> Free Software is really, really important. More important than Fspot or Beagle.
<gnube> I'll stop now, perhaps this is not the correct forum.
<LaserJock> it's a bit OT
<gnube> right. :)
<LaserJock> and I doubt any minds are going to be changed today ;-)
* tseng applies mind control to LaserJock 
<gnube> Fair enough, thanks again LaserJock, see you soon!
<LaserJock> if I had a mind it might work
<gnube> Must go . . .
<LaserJock> cya gnube
* tseng counts to 10
<LaserJock> only 10?
<LaserJock> ;-)
<LaserJock> well, I'm I don't know the whole history of FLOSS etc.
<tseng> its my opinion that rms was a leader 20 years ago and expects top billing to this day
<tseng> as an example
<LaserJock> but I think 90% of users would take Fspot and Beagle any day
<LaserJock> I don't know the details
<tseng> one of his lackies just suggested on the gnome-docs list that every instance of Linux be changed "to GNU/Linux or just GNU"
<LaserJock> but it seems like Mono is open source, that's good enough for me
<LaserJock> of course
<tseng> i need to find the strings in question
<tseng> it pinpoints the idiocy
<LaserJock> I've gotten that a few times
<tseng> these are really obscure
<LaserJock> "Ubuntu" has to be "Ubuntu GNU/Linux"
<tseng> yes, well
<tseng> that was the kind of thing people see
<LaserJock> which I still don't get but oh well
<tseng> imo we might as well call it GNOME/Linux
<tseng> if you went by lines of code
<imbrandon> KDE/Linux <evil grin>
<imbrandon> tseng: just teasin a bit, yea i see your point and totaly agree
<LaserJock> Kubuntu KDE/Linux
<tseng> GNOME/KDE/MOZILLA/Linux
<imbrandon> and actualy it should be Linux/GNU since GNU are the base tools ( in some caes ) and linux is the kernel ;)
<tseng> whatever.
<LaserJock> anyway, I've seen both Linus and RMS say some pretty dumb things
<LaserJock> but I respect what they've done
<LaserJock> ... and life goes on
* imbrandon loves the linus thread where he said "just use KDE" hehehe
<imbrandon> LaserJock: exactly
<tseng> http://mail.gnome.org/archives/gnome-doc-list/2006-July/msg00204.html
<tseng> these are the strings proposed for change
<tseng> enjoy.
<LaserJock> "There is an ongoing confusion for years, which is harmful for the Free
<LaserJock> Software Movement.."
<tseng> holy crap!
<LaserJock> ???
<tseng> there are 16 tracebacks to my last blog
<tseng> LaserJock: i am definately confused
<tseng> spam tracebacks
<tseng> ..to sex sites, brilliant
<LaserJock> tseng: can you explain this at all?
<LaserJock> I want to write about the reasons
<LaserJock> why the GNOME Project was started, and about the danger of "Open
<LaserJock> Source", which constantly threatens to bury the Free Software ideals
<LaserJock> and turn them into something completely different and insignificiant.
<LaserJock> open source is a threat to free software?
<tseng> so
<tseng> open source refers to being able to download the source code, generically
<tseng> Free Software is more specific
<tseng> guaranteing certain freedoms
<LaserJock> ah, hmm
<tseng> generally standardized by OSL or DFSG
<tseng> both written by the same guy, actually
<tseng> very roughly the right to modify and distribute without certain other restrictions
<tseng> gpl has restrictions on this, but its still free.. where it gets complicated
* tseng looks for doc
<LaserJock> right, becuase I could say "you can download the source code, but you can't modify it"?
<tseng> yes, obviously non-free
<LaserJock> but is that open source?
<crimsun> yes
<LaserJock> k
<tseng> because you got the source code
<tseng> its "open"
<tseng> open source doesnt guarantee anything
<crimsun> now consider this: "you can download the source code and modify it, but you can't distribute your modified source code"
<tseng> http://www.debian.org/social_contract#guidelines
<crimsun> e.g., djbdns
<tseng> this is what you should cite
<tseng> http://www.opensource.org/
<tseng> and this
<crimsun> you obviously don't want either example we just talked about :)
<tseng> yeah djb is a nut
<LaserJock> yeah, I mean I've read the DFSG, I just didn't get why you would would have non-free open source
<tseng> because you are a weirdo
<tseng> and don't like the terms of the GPL/BSD/etc
<LaserJock> hmm, well http://www.opensource.org/docs/definition.php seem like more than, "you can get the code"
<tseng> well, hello confusion
<LaserJock> mhm
<tseng> opensource.org defines something close to DFSG
<LaserJock> yeah, it says at the bottom
<tseng> most of the stuff should probably be called Free
<LaserJock> that it is DFSG-(debian specific stuff)
<tseng> as people identify that with something specific
<tseng> open source is not always specific
<tseng> DJB-ware could be "open" source
<LaserJock> I just avoid saying "free software" because people think it's just $0 cost
<tseng> crimsun can correct me if im at all confusing
<tseng> Free with a capital f
<tseng> Libre also
<LaserJock> yeah, I suppose that's true
<LaserJock> I like FLOSS
<LaserJock> it keeps my teeth clean and everything ;-)
<LaserJock> sorry, bad joke
<tseng> no, you don't
<tseng> Jump to: navigation, search
<tseng> Free/Libre/Open-Source Software, or FLOSS, is an alternative term for free software. It is used by those who wish to be inclusive or who do not want to take a side on whether "free software" or "open-source software" is a better term, although neither side has shown much enthusiasm for the term "FLOSS".
<LaserJock> well, I like FLOSS except I have to explain it all
<tseng> sorry if im not being helpful, its a pretty fine line most of the time
<LaserJock> because I really couldn't care less what specifc term they use
<tseng> right
<LaserJock> I want to be able to tell my family what it "means"
<tseng> but you want DFSG free
<tseng> whatever they call it
<LaserJock> yes, I think so
<tseng> you just don't froth at the mouth over it
<LaserJock> exactly
<tseng> we're on the same page
<tseng> frothing at the mouth includes demanding that DFSG is called "Free" and not "Open"
<tseng> Critics have said that the term "open source" fosters an ambiguity of a different kind, in that it confuses the mere availability of the source with the freedom to use, modify, and redistribute it.
<tseng> from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Open_source
<tseng> is the crux of it
<tseng> as we said before somethings called Open don't meet the standard for Free
<tseng> sometimes, the author just isn't interested in the word debate
<LaserJock> I suppose, to me "open source" should be that DFSG goodness that is on http://www.opensource.org/docs/definition.php
<tseng> that would be nice
<LaserJock> but again, I'm not particular what you call it
* tseng neither
<LaserJock> anyway, I get what's going on now, thanks
<tseng> as for GNOME, its always been Free
<tseng> but I talk to miguel every day and he doesn't often get frothy-mouthed
<LaserJock> so if I get some cool stuff from http://www.cafepress.com/opensourcestuff am I likely to get impaled?
<tseng> only if you walk by a serious RMS fanboy
<tseng> do you read everyone loves eric raymond
<tseng> including bruce perens, author of dfsg
<tseng> vs linux, rms
<tseng> even sabdfl
<tseng> http://geekz.co.uk/lovesraymond/archive/terrorismistic
<tseng> hello, Hobbsee
<LaserJock> haha
<Hobbsee> hi tseng
<Hobbsee> hi LaserJock
<tseng> LaserJock: (eric raymond threatened bruce's life)
<TheMuso> Hey Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> hi TheMuso
<crimsun> TheMuso: (looking at your merges)
<LaserJock> tseng: hehe, http://geekz.co.uk/lovesraymond/archive/slashdotted
<TheMuso> crimsun: I think there is only one is there not?
<tseng> LaserJock: this is a classic strip
<tseng> you need the sabdfl
<crimsun> TheMuso: it's quite possible; I have been hacking up alsa this afternoon and haven't gotten a chance to check all the e-mails yet
<tseng> LaserJock: http://geekz.co.uk/lovesraymond/archive/cancomical-lynchpad
<LaserJock> tseng: http://geekz.co.uk/lovesraymond/archive/cancomical-lynchpad
<tseng> yes!
<LaserJock> heh
<tseng> love it
<TheMuso> crimsun: I'd say so, as my others have been done as far as I am aware.
<tseng> LaserJock: this site is funny because its all true
<TheMuso> THe only one outstanding is spiralsynthmodular afaik
<crimsun> ok
<LaserJock> tseng: ok, I gotta go to a BBQ, thanks for the relaxation there ;-)
<tseng> LaserJock: have a nice time
<crimsun> wow um.
<crimsun> did I just break ff in edgy, or is anyone else enable to use https://  ?
<crimsun> (the 2.0 beta)
<tseng> *tries*
<crimsun> unable, not enable
<tseng> i can use https to gmail
<tseng> and my own web server
<tseng> crimsun: i do wish evolution would not crash on start
<crimsun> hmm, I must have broken it for that session; LP works fine now.
<crimsun> thanks, tseng
<tseng> np
<Hobbsee> can someone feeling brave do the merge of libnjb?
<Hobbsee> looks like it'd be useful to have as a dep of amarok.
<Hobbsee> s/dep/build dep, etc/
<crimsun> in about 25 mins, sure
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: when you do merges/sync requests, can you chuck the package in the subject of the bug too?  it's really annoying to see all these merge requests, but not what belongs to what :P
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: No problem.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: i think i'm guilty of the same thing, actually
* Hobbsee has been getting lazy with sync requests.
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: We all live and learn.
<Hobbsee> true
<TheMuso> Things like this I tend to take on board, and just do them next time.
<TheMuso> I'm kinda like that.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: that's cool :)
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: it's not a problem, it's just something i noticed
<TheMuso> I know that.
<TheMuso> I was assuming one could look at the bug, and see the package name. :)
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: that is true
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: but i've been recovering from my errors, not uploading things
<TheMuso> hehe
<crimsun> Hobbsee: what's the issue with libnjb?
<crimsun> it seems a fairly straightforward merge if you wanted to do that
<crimsun> it's even syncable
<Hobbsee> crimsun: no particular issue, looks like we'll need it for amarok.  didnt really know what to change, eyeballing it :P
<Hobbsee> ah nice
<crimsun> it can go either way, really
<crimsun> I presume you want to keep the HAL FDI file, which means it'll be a merge
<crimsun> I'll go ahead and merge it if you haven't already filed the sync req
<Hobbsee> crimsun: i've done nothing with it
<ajmitch> hi
<TheMuso> crimsun: Thanks heaps
* TheMuso goes out for a bit.
<ryanakca> is it acceptable to put "Suggests: kubuntu-desktop" for kde apps?
<crimsun> ...I wouldn't.
<ryanakca> kk
<ryanakca> then I wont :)
<ryanakca> and  "kdelibs4-dev, libqt3-mt-dev" go into build-depends?
<ryanakca> or is it "Depends"... (those two keep on confusing me)...
<azeem> Depends is for stuff you would need at run-time, Build-Depends is for stuff you need during package build
<Hobbsee> ryanakca: they go in the build-deps
<ryanakca> kk
<ryanakca> Hobbsee: your love for the evil cdbs is contagious... I'm learning/kind of relearning packaging :)
<Hobbsee> hehe!
<Hobbsee> cdbs isnt evil :)
<Hobbsee> cdbs is very nice :)
<ryanakca> saves room in debian/rules
<Hobbsee> exactly
<Hobbsee> and incredibly useful for global fixes.
<ryanakca> how do you build a source package? I'm trying to figure out that part... i've got everything done (let's say)... untill that part
<Hobbsee> debuild -S -sa -rfakeroot
<ryanakca> still debuild?
* ryanakca always though debuild was a deb helper thingy
<ajmitch> yes, use debuild
<ryanakca> Hobbsee: except with -rfakeroot now? I always ran "debuild -S -sa && sudo pubuilder update && sudo pbuilder build ../<packagename>-<version>.dsc"
<bddebian> Heya gang
<ryanakca> hey bddebian
<bddebian> Hi ryanakca
<Hobbsee> ryanakca: that works too
<ryanakca> Hobbsee: whats the difference?
<bddebian> Hi Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> hi bddebian
<ryanakca> Hobbsee: is -rfakeroot better?
<Hobbsee> ryanakca: as to building it with debuild -sa -S or with pbuilder?
<Hobbsee> ah.  it builds it as root, even though you arent actually root.
* Hobbsee shrugs
<Hobbsee> pbuilder is the better way to do it
<ryanakca> :)
* ryanakca would have thought running something as root even though you arent actually root as a security risk...
<Hobbsee> no, it's not that kind of idea
<Hobbsee> more that it's just pretending to be root, and building.
<Hobbsee> iirc.
<ryanakca> ah, kk
* Hobbsee catn explain things this early in the morning!
<ryanakca> morning??? it's 8:35PM!
<neutrinomass> ryanakca: It just tells debuilder to ignore the fact that you are not root , from what I know. This is so that it can pass the "are you root?" test that fails when you try to apt-get source -b <package> without being root ...
<ryanakca> where are you? India/Asia/Australia?
<crimsun> .au.
<ryanakca> ah
<ryanakca> oh yeah... Sydney?
<Hobbsee> yeah
<Hobbsee> sydney
* ryanakca tries to stay on topic
<Hobbsee> it's okay
<ajmitch> so far behind
<crimsun> ryanakca: (she has this thing called an LP page ;)
<Hobbsee> ryanakca: you mean there is a topic?  *g*
<Hobbsee> heh
<Hobbsee> it's got pretty icons on it :)
<Hobbsee> gnomefreak: ack'd eric
<ryanakca> crimsun: <stupid>LP page</stupid>
<ryanakca> lol
* ryanakca goes to look at pretty icons
<Hobbsee> hehe
<ryanakca> pretty icons???
<ryanakca> where???
<Hobbsee> launchpad.net/people/hobbsee
<ryanakca> oooh.. the fishy? :D
<ryanakca> yes... I'm there... just trying to find them :)
<Hobbsee> yeah :)
* Hobbsee put the fishy there :)
* ryanakca would sneak into the council just to get the pretty fishy... it's so... fishlike :P
<tseng> some day, Hobbsee will come into the light
<ryanakca> actually no... all that technical talk
<Hobbsee> haha
<tseng> and get a little blue foot
<Hobbsee> ryanakca: you wouldnt get into the council :P
* bddebian is lost
* Hobbsee should swap that and the universe contributors icons over.
<Hobbsee> tseng: eek no!
* Hobbsee hugs kde
* tseng hugs gnome
<ryanakca> tseng: little blue foot... what's she turning into? a smurf or whatever you anglophones call them?
<tseng> haha anglophone
<ryanakca> <nocomment>gnome</nocomment>
<tseng> I am American
<Hobbsee> tseng: little blue foot is gnome dev, or what?  it's not the CC, which is the kubuntu council equivalent.
<tseng> anglo is inferior, clearly
<ryanakca> and you speak english... that makes you an anglophone :)
<ryanakca> french speakers, like me, are francophones :)
<tseng> ryanakca: I do, alot of this country is questionable on that
<tseng> Hobbsee: its nothing, in launchpad.. its the gnome logo
<crimsun> in my own defense I speak IRC.
<tseng> nothing that I know of
<Hobbsee> tseng: ahhhh...gotcha.  thought it might be that
<bddebian> crimsun: :-)
<ryanakca> crimsun: ircophone :)
<neutrinomass> I'm trying a package with upstream tarball named schur-6.01_20060810.tar.gz and I'm getting some dh_make problems - is it ok if it is changed to schur-6.01.tar.gz ?
<crimsun> no
<crimsun> that would be misleading
<crimsun> what vcs does it use?
<gnomefreak> ty Hobbsee :)
<crimsun> many people use name_version.vcs.isodate.orig.tar.gz
<crimsun> for instance, xserver-xgl_7.0.0.git.20060725.orig.tar.gz
<neutrinomass> Not sure... none I think
<neutrinomass> the 20060810 is the release date
<neutrinomass> So it's only a problem if they decide to release another 6.01
<ajmitch> it's also common to use x.y.z~date
<ajmitch> where x.y.z is the next version
<bddebian> If a source package has two tarballs (one for the data) but the data tarball doesn't have a license file, is it safe to assume it's the same license as the application?
<crimsun> no.
<bddebian> So what do I do?  Do I have to contact upstream?
<crimsun> yes, at least for verification if not also to get upstream to slap the licenses in the data tarball
<bddebian> Damnit, I don't know why I try to do anything..
<bddebian> Thx crimsun
<crimsun> np
* bddebian crawls back into his hole
<neutrinomass> When patching a patch in debian/patches, you just edit the patch straight away, right ?
<bddebian> neutrinomass: Depends on the change
<bddebian> It can be risky
<neutrinomass> Trivial... a category change in the .desktop
<neutrinomass> bug #42452
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 42452 in firestarter "[Dapper]  Firestarter is in System > Administration menu, even for non admin users" [Medium,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/42452
<bddebian> Didn't I fix that in Dapper?
<neutrinomass> bddebian: Nope
<neutrinomass> bddebian: I'm trying to fix that and bug 569
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 569 in firestarter "Firestarter Help runs Firefox as root" [High,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/569
<neutrinomass> bddebian: What you probably did is make it appear under System->Administration as well
<bddebian> Hmm
<bddebian> Yeah, if the +Categories line is already there you can get away with just hacking that inside the patch file
<neutrinomass> ok, thanks
<neutrinomass> bddebian: Ha! I think I fixed it. I upload the debdiff and assign to motureviewers now, right ?
<bddebian> neutrinomass: Yep
<bddebian> Holy crap there are a ton of packages on REVU.. :-(
<ajmitch> bddebian: yes, it's your job to get reviewing
<bddebian> My job?  Why, I'm just a nobody
<ajmitch> you're a MOTU, that's what counts
* ajmitch is busy with f-spot bugs
<bddebian> I really don't feel confident enough to review :-(
<ajmitch> you've done it before
<ajmitch> there are plenty of comments you could add
<ajmitch> or just checking packages to see if they're in edgy or debian already
<Hobbsee> bddebian: i dotn feel confident enough to review either.
<bddebian> ajmitch: I notice a LOT of what is up there right now is already in so I don't know if they are patches or what
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: you can do it as well
<ajmitch> bddebian: get a list together of packages that you think could be archived, pleae
<ajmitch> s/pleae/please/
* bddebian is still working through merges
<bddebian> ajmitch: archived?
<TheMuso> lsr can be, as the update on revu has already been uploaded.
<ajmitch> bddebian: yes, make sure you're not looking in the archive section of the page
<ajmitch> it should be changed to show only stuff to review
* ajmitch will talk with siretart about that one
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: i can.  but i'm not confident.
<bddebian> ajmitch needs to do a reviewing packages class :-)
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: I'm sure I will feel the same way, but something tells me that my assistance will also be needed when I get MOTU.
<TheMuso> I think I would be up to it, considering some of the things I have had to do packaging wise lately.
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: why not? you've done enough stuff lately
<ajmitch> you don't have to advocate, just go through & point out mistakes that you see
<Hobbsee> hmm.
<ajmitch> treat it like bug triage - you don't have to fix every bug, just follow up on stuff
<Hobbsee> true
* ajmitch wouldn't have thought he'd hear you say you weren't confident about it :P
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: i thought you knew me better than that.
* Hobbsee is definetly not confident about everything
<bddebian> OK ajmitch, you have successfully guilted me into it even though I'm apparently useless around here
<ajmitch> you were confident enough to try for main, but not to review packages?
<ajmitch> bddebian: excellent
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: so i was just crazy.
<ajmitch> hehe
<sharms> I am confident in my ability to not package things correctly :)
<ajmitch> sharms: as long as you're willing to learn, it's good
* Hobbsee notes that she's never put a new package in.
* TheMuso notes that he has put 3 packages in.
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: that's surprising, I thought you had at least 1 or 2
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: IMO the hardest part can sometimes be the copyright. Other than that, the rest is easy enough.
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: there were a couple that i was going to get in
<Hobbsee> one had nasty symlinks all over the place that i never fixed, the other i had trouble with, and eventually got uploaded by someone else
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: mainly it's been a case of doing so many other fixes, that i havent really had the time to look at putting something new in.
<ajmitch> I figured that was probably the case
<ajmitch> whereas the rest of us have been slacking
<Hobbsee> and the fact that the more new stuff that goes in, the more has to be bugfixed/synced with debian/etc
* ajmitch tends to push stuff to debian at the same time
<ajmitch> or beforehand
<Hobbsee> that's the smart idea
<ajmitch> and I'd encourage others to do the same via a sponsor
<Hobbsee> there's some interesting kde based packages that are goign to be like that, it seems
<StevenK> ajmitch: Damn it, now you and I are going to get hit up upon.
<Hobbsee> haha
* Hobbsee hugs ajmitch and StevenK, grinning evilly
<ajmitch> StevenK: yeah, I think I'll hide in other channels for awhile
<StevenK> ajmitch: I think I'll join you.
* StevenK hides his GPG key.
<Hobbsee> heh
<TheMuso> Hey StevenK
* StevenK waves.
* TheMuso slaps StevenK friendly with his cane.
<StevenK> Ow
<StevenK> Careful where you poke that thing.
<StevenK> What, can't you see where you're poking it?
<ajmitch> I think I should really get som breakfast
* StevenK sniggers.
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: yes, you should
<TheMuso> StevenK: hahahahaha
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: just smash StevenK over the head to avoid such problems.
<TheMuso> ajmitch: Depends on how hungry you feel.
<StevenK> Hey!
<TheMuso> I'd probably hit myself.
* StevenK buggers off for 30 minutes.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: smack the blob that appears to be StevenK.  you should be able to find that one.  just dont smack the shorter blob next to him.
<TheMuso> Well blobs aren't anything to go by. I'd either end up hitting someone I don't mean to, or myself.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: ah.  hmm.
<bddebian> Hobbsee: But you aren't as "cool" just fixing things, you have upload some crap ;-P
* Hobbsee wonders if she'll be a hobbsee-blob at slug this month.
* Hobbsee might be a non-existant-blob instead.
<TheMuso> Non-existant?
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: i'm not sure if i have to work
<TheMuso> Ah ok.
<bddebian> OK I'm trying to review and I still say I don't know enough :-(
<ajmitch> why?
<ajmitch> you should have seen enough broken stuff already to spot some common mistakes
<bddebian> Common yes but seeing the comments from raphink and daemon make me feel even more like an idiot
<imbrandon> moins ajmitch bddebian StevenK Hobbsee and anyone else alive i missed
<imbrandon> TheMuso  ;)
<Hobbsee> hi imbrandon
<ajmitch> hello imbrandon
<ajmitch> bddebian: s/daemon/sistpoty/
<TheMuso> Hey imbrandon.
<bddebian> Heya imbrandon
<bddebian> ajmitch: Aye, sorry
<bddebian> w00t, 1 down :-)
<ajmitch> good
* ajmitch looks at the comments added
<bddebian> ajmitch: So something like lsr that is in, I can just hit the archive link?
<ajmitch> bddebian: if its the same or older than what's in the archive
<bddebian> Same
<ajmitch> archive it
<TheMuso> As I said above.
<bddebian> TheMuso: Whoops, sorry missed that
<TheMuso> Its fine.
<TheMuso> You got it anyway.
<ajmitch> bddebian: planfacile is currently lurking in NEW
<ajmitch> any updates since then just need 1 MOTU to check, like any sponsored upload
<bddebian> OK
<bddebian> Hobbsee: What's up with kradio?
<Hobbsee> bddebian: it's severely broken, and needs fixing.  i'd axe it, as it hasnt been asked for in a while
<bddebian> Hobbsee: I mean it's already in the archive isn't it?
<bddebian> Oh, yours is newer
<Hobbsee> bddebian: it *is*?  it wasnt when it was last packaged
<nixternal> sorry for the floods earlier, as it seems my router was nailed...
<Hawkwind> I had someone asking about kradio 3 days ago :(
<Hobbsee> Hawkwind: ah.  feel free to fix it, etc
* Hobbsee expects there to be a new upstream version now or something
<Hawkwind> Hah
<bddebian> Hobbsee: Should I archive the one on REVU or do you plan another upload? ;-)
<Hobbsee> bddebian: i dotn plan to do another one myself, but someone like Hawkwind may
<bddebian> Won't that come in differently because of the different keys?
<Hobbsee> ah, yeah
<Hobbsee> bddebian: i was more meaning if they wanted to grab my source
<Hobbsee> actually, no it doesnt
<bddebian> Oh, aye, good point
* StevenK ponders what to actually do.
<bddebian> StevenK: With what?
<crimsun> well, a sync from Sid for quodlibet 0.22-2 would be swell.
<bddebian> crimsun: ?
<crimsun> bddebian: just realised that I never filed one; I'm using pbuilt ones
<bddebian> crimsun: Oh :-)
<StevenK> bddebian: I'm at my mothers house, and I'm pondering what to do.
<bddebian> StevenK: Fix kradio for Hobbsee ;-)
<StevenK> Hobbsee?
<StevenK> Hobbsee: 'Splain yourself.
<Hobbsee> hmmm?
* Hobbsee is fighting with a  maths quiz
<Hobbsee> it's being evil, so i'm being evil against it.
<bddebian> Egads soundkonverter is a pig
<StevenK> Hobbsee: Would you like my help with kradio?
<StevenK> Quod 0.22 is out? Damn!
<crimsun> StevenK: as is mutagen 1.6 (just noticed)
<Hobbsee> StevenK: if you want, i was going to leave it alone.
* Hobbsee is going to pass this maths quiz before doing anythign else.
* StevenK can't find kradio on merges.u.c
* crimsun thinks he'll wait for mutagen 1.6 to hit Sid before requesting syncs for quodlibet 0.22-2, mutagen 1.6-1, and quodlibet-plugins 20060713-1
* StevenK nods.
<Hobbsee> StevenK: it's not there, it's something i was going to put into new a while ago
<StevenK> Hobbsee: Pulling from sid, or what?
<bddebian> StevenK: It's on REVU
<Hobbsee> it's on revu
<bddebian> Should a xen upload even be on REVU?
* bddebian loves talking to himself
<StevenK> bddebian: Glad to hear that.
<ajmitch> bddebian: not anymore
<ajmitch> archive it
* StevenK notes kradio is in edgy and sid.
* ajmitch thinks he should upload f-spot to sid again
* StevenK ponders looking at PoCo-IRC
<Hobbsee> StevenK: then axe mine.  mine must be carzy
<StevenK> Hobbsee: Yours is a later version. But not much later.
<StevenK> 6 days or so.
<Hobbsee> right.  axe it.
<bddebian> StevenK: So get the latest upstream ;-P
<StevenK> That would mean that I care.
<StevenK> I don't care that much. :-P
<StevenK> Hell, I'm MOTU, and Hobbsee's MOTU, let's get TheMuso to do our bidding.
* TheMuso looks up.
<crimsun> wow, _that_'s teamwork.
<TheMuso> DId someone mention my name?
<StevenK> crimsun: Indeed.
<Hobbsee> haha
<StevenK> TheMuso: Nose, grindstone, go.
<Hobbsee> hehehehe!
<TheMuso> What package?
<ajmitch> crimsun: delegation - how any good organisation works
<StevenK> All of them, duh.
<crimsun> ajmitch: :)
* StevenK high fives ajmitch.
<TheMuso> StevenK: I am gradually getting packages done thank you very much.
<TheMuso> I just try not to step on other people's toes re merges.
<StevenK> That's hard when you can't see them.
<TheMuso> har har har har har!!
<StevenK> I should stop doing that.
<TheMuso> Nah tis fine.
<ajmitch> yeah, they're quite painful
<bddebian> StevenK: Well if you are a mighty MOTU, get reviewing with me :-)
<StevenK> bddebian: Make me. :-P
* StevenK glares at MoM.
<StevenK> Apparently Debian has offlineimap 4.0.13-0.1, but packages.d.o denies that.
<ajmitch> bddebian: it's all in how you ask
<bddebian> *sigh*
<ajmitch> StevenK: it has 4.0.14
<ajmitch> packages.qa.d.o is updated
<TheMuso> bddebian: I recently did a merge for soundconverter. Is the revu version a merge?
<TheMuso> Sorry, wrong one
<bddebian> TheMuso: :-)
<TheMuso> Damn speech
<TheMuso> I had to check the spelling of that.
<TheMuso> Different package.
<bddebian> Aye, KDE
<ajmitch> might as well blame KDE for everything
* ajmitch sees a few new REVU comments
<ajmitch> bddebian: you said for kvpnc that we already have 0.8.5.1-1 in the archive, but this appears to be a merge anyway
<ajmitch> just one that has a couple of problems :)
<bddebian> ajmitch: Sorry, you lost me there?
<ajmitch> bddebian@comcast.net wrote:
<ajmitch> 
<ajmitch> Why did you downgrade the standards version?  Ubuntu already has 0.8.5.1-1 in Edgy.
<StevenK> ajmitch: Debian does not have 4.0.14
<StevenK> However, it has 4.0.13-0.1
<crimsun> (I supposed 'have' in the context of being mirrored, etc., right. 4.0.14's on incoming.)
<bddebian> ajmitch: Yes.  I am asking him why he downgraded the standards version from the package we have in Edgy on his merge?
<bddebian> Damnit, looks like scourge is out for now :-(
<ajmitch> bddebian: because he did this for dapper
<ajmitch> the last upload of it was done before dapper was released
<bddebian> Ah, hmm
<ajmitch> and he probably took the version from debian-policy in dapper
<bddebian> I told ya I shouldn't be doing this stuff :-)
* ajmitch accepts no excuses
<StevenK> steven@jaded:~% dpkg --compare-versions 4.0.13-0.1 gt 4.0.13ubuntu1
<StevenK> zsh: exit 1     dpkg --compare-versions 4.0.13-0.1 gt 4.0.13ubuntu1
* StevenK sighs.
<crimsun> yeah, I have that issue with apt-proxy, too
<ajmitch> StevenK: http://incoming.debian.org/offlineimap_4.0.14_i386.changes
<StevenK> Ahhhh
<StevenK> My problem evaporates.
<nixternal> hey bddebian, with lyx i appologize for the stupid mistakes with the email addy
<bddebian> nixternal: ??
<nixternal> on revu
<nixternal> Newer version synced from Debian. Archiving this upload. Thank you!
<ajmitch> TheMuso: checking jfbterm now
* StevenK thinks he did jfbterm at one stage.
<ajmitch> StevenK: just another sync being requested
<bddebian> nixternal: No worries :-)
<ajmitch> StevenK: you mustn't have uploaded
<StevenK> Ah, no, it was fbiterm
<ajmitch> TheMuso: confirmed
<TheMuso> ajmitch: thanks
* StevenK waits for offlineimap to make it way through incoming.
* StevenK wonders when dinstall runs.
* Hobbsee HAS BEATEN THE MATHS QUIZ!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: good work
* Hobbsee CHEERS LIKE A MANIAC!
<Hobbsee> that thing was seriously driving me *nuts*
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: Well done.
* ajmitch did work out what the TZ offset of incoming & when the dinstall run was at one point
<ajmitch> makes me wish for ubuntu again, even with soyuz being slow
<Hobbsee> heh
<ajmitch> StevenK: I'd say in ~12 hours or so, maybe about 14 judging by the last upload to incoming
<TheMuso> StevenK: You guys talking about debian?
<StevenK> ajmitch: Oh yes, Soyuz is good.
* bddebian curses ajmitch for getting him started on these damn REVU packages :-)
<ajmitch> oh yes
<ajmitch> 01:31 < Keybuk> it could be worse, it could be designed by a launchpad developer
<ajmitch> 01:31 < Keybuk> --force --force-harder --FORCE --FORCE-FORCE-FORCE
<ajmitch> good alright
<Hobbsee> haha yeah, i saw that :P
<ajmitch> bddebian: it's appreciated
* StevenK wonders about the context for that.
<micahcowan> Would a MOTU be interested in looking at bug 45930, on the joystick package?
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 45930 in glibc "jstest SEGFAULTs with usb joystick" [Medium,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/45930
<bddebian> ajmitch: Oh yeah, by whom? :-)
<ajmitch> bddebian: by me of course
<micahcowan> It's a minor issue, but one that has annoyed some of us who would like to use jstest on USB gamepads. A debdiff is there.
<ajmitch> StevenK: discussing sudo, and then the fun of launchpad
<StevenK> Ah
* ajmitch wonders why that bug is against glibc as well
<micahcowan> It absolutely should nto be ajmitch: it's just that some people's errors refer to glibc... :-)
<ajmitch> then I'll reject the glibc task
<ajmitch> micahcowan: so is it sane to just not print any names if the number is out of range?
<micahcowan> ajmitch, well, the number's not just out of range: they're all zeroes (and meaningless). But the way jstest works, it assumes the button name values are all over N, and uses (value)-N to get the index into an array of text names...
<ajmitch> how annoying
<micahcowan> it may well be that there /was/ a kernel issue as well, but that's no excuse for sloppy coding in jstest, I would think.
<ajmitch> but is this just a workaround for that?
<ajmitch> hm
<micahcowan> Well, I'm not familiar with the kernel code, so I can't profess to know what jstest /should/ expect to get from the device... only what it does get, in the case of USB gamepads and the like. :/
<ajmitch> other crackful stuff in this package, like build-depends-on-build-essential build-depends
<micahcowan> huh.
* StevenK twitches.
<StevenK> I remember a DD who did that.
<micahcowan> Yeah, and no patch system, so the debdiff I submitted was a direct change to the souce.
<ajmitch> StevenK: looks like it could be
<micahcowan> It could be that more information from upstream would be in order, to ascertain whether my fix is more of a workaround than a true fix.
<ajmitch> that's pretty special, having build-essential in there
<micahcowan> (btw, thanks for having a look)
<ajmitch> built fine, I'll upload - patch seems somewhat reasonable
<micahcowan> thanks, ajmitch. :-)
<ajmitch> close the bug with 'fix released' once it's in the archive
<micahcowan> are you talking to me? I can't close bugs... :/
<ajmitch> you should be able to
<TheMuso> micahcowan: You can.
<micahcowan> Oh. Maybe I can, then. :)
<ajmitch> click on the joystick (Ubuntu) task
<ajmitch> you should be able to change status there
* TheMuso is glad that launchpad renders ok i elinks.
* TheMuso is not glad however that elinks doesn't always handle file uploads properly.
<micahcowan> Yeah, I sorta just assumed I didn't have the ability.
<TheMuso> IMO thats its only problem.
<micahcowan> elinks', or launchpads?
<ajmitch> micahcowan: you can change status but not importance
<micahcowan> right... I agree with that thinking. :-)
<micahcowan> though, as someone pointed out in motu-school the other day, it might be nice to be able to mark your own bug as "wishlist"... :-)
<ajmitch> yes
* ajmitch can do that on gnome bugzilla
<bddebian> Bah, I'm going to bed.  Gnight folks
<bddebian> ajmitch: I'll try to hit more REVU stuff tomorrow
<ajmitch> delegation is a good thing :)
<micahcowan> ajmitch: I installed literally the 1ubuntu2 version of joystick that I submitted a debdiff for... when it hits the archive, will I still get an update notification?
<ajmitch> not really, since there's a delay between the upload, the source getting published, and binaries built+published
<micahcowan> Oh. How will I know when it hits the archive (and, to rephrase my earleir question, will I get an update when it's available, given that it's the same "version")?
<ajmitch> you probably won't know, and you may get an update
<ajmitch> source is accepted, at least
<ajmitch> might as well just close the bug now
<micahcowan> okay, done. thanks!
<Hobbsee> bye all
<siretart> ajmitch: yes?
<ajmitch> siretart: ah, sorry
<ajmitch> I mentioned your name earlier when talking about REVU
<ajmitch> whether we need to show all the archived packages on the main page
<siretart> ajmitch: this changed yesterday. I merged Toadstool's branch
<ajmitch> right :)
<siretart> :)
* ajmitch didn't see, sorry
<siretart> no problem
<ajmitch> what did he change?
* ajmitch updates his local copy
<ajmitch> ok, that looks useful
<ajmitch> bddebian went through & archived a number of old uploads today
<ajmitch> the queue is looking slightly more manageable now
<siretart> It would be cool if nuking would work recursivly
<ajmitch> what do you mean?
<siretart> currently, if you use the nuke link, it nukes exactly this upload
<siretart> nuking all uploads regarding a packages would be helpful, I think
<ajmitch> ah, I thought that it nuked all
<siretart> nope.
<siretart> ajmitch: I don't know if you've seen it already, revu now moved from /srv/revu1 to /srv/revu1-production, which is an bzr branch
<siretart> ajmitch: this makes merging patches easier
<ajmitch> yes I saw that there was a new directory there
<ajmitch> do we still use scripts in /srv/revu1/scripts ?
<siretart> better point them to /srv/revu1-production/scripts. I made /srv/revu1 a symlink, for transitional purposes
<ajmitch> ok
* ajmitch just has things in the bash history :)
<ajmitch> hopefully we get bzr & bzrtools 0.9 in edgy soon
<ajmitch> it has a few nice improvements that would be nice to have
<Nafallo> like speed :-)
<ajmitch> yep
<Nafallo> hmm
<Nafallo> so 1h30m until the train leaves...
* Nafallo starts pondering about what he should pack
<Nafallo> I wonder what they used to put their hair in a tail in the medieval ages...
<Nafallo> ?
* ajmitch shrugs
<Nafallo> and beard for that matter ;-)
<Nafallo> hmm, so everything except the chainmail on, and it's already hot :-P
<ajmitch> silly
<ajmitch> how heavy will the chainmail be?
<Nafallo> I'll go and look :-)
<Nafallo> 4kg. so not much :-).
<ajmitch> not so bad
<Nafallo> but the steel will still be heated in the sun :-P
<ajmitch> you'll be nice & toasty warm
<ajmitch> how annoying, GL stuff is all broken on my laptop now
<Sp4rKy> hey
<Hobbsee> hi all
<ajmitch> hello Hobbsee
* Hobbsee tentatively tries to add a printer.
<Hobbsee> and if i dont scan the right subnet, then i certainly wont find the printer!
* ajmitch is busy digging through mesa & X to try & solve a problem..
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: are you running the latest & greatest X, mesa & i810 driver?
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: i believe so, i think i got those updates earlier
<Hobbsee> when did the last update come thru?
<ajmitch> can you run glxgears please?
<ajmitch> mesa should be git version from about 2 days ago, i810 driver is 1.6.5-0ubuntu2
<ajmitch> xorg-server is 1:1.1.1-0ubuntu6
<ajmitch> iirc
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: nice....chuggy
<Hobbsee> yep, i've got them running
<ajmitch> any bad flicker & tearing?
<Hobbsee> apart from the fact that it's like a frame every second and a half, nto that i can see.
<ajmitch> ouch
<ajmitch> can you put your /var/log/Xorg.0.log somewhere I can see it?
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: http://rafb.net/paste/results/zjHNR511.html
<ajmitch> thanks
<ajmitch> (EE) AIGLX error: dlopen of /usr/lib/dri/i915_dri.so failed (/usr/lib/dri/i915_dri.so: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory)
<ajmitch> ok
<ajmitch> you just need to install libgl1-mesa-dri
* ajmitch has that package installed, but the driver is having trouble initialising
<ajmitch> if you'd be so kind as to install that package & restart X, putting the log up again? :)
* ajmitch chuckles
<ajmitch> someone filing an RC bug because a package has ~ in the version number
<ajmitch> true, it's not in policy yet, but it's announced on d-d-a
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: http://www.rafb.net/paste/results/MyBPdK29.html
<ajmitch> thanks
<ajmitch> sorry to inconvenience you :)
<ajmitch> (EE) AIGLX error: Calling driver entry point failed(EE) AIGLX: reverting to software rendering
<ajmitch> great
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: it's okay.  glxgears is still incredibly slow, too
<ajmitch> same error as I get, so that's confirmation
<ajmitch> now I have to track it down in the dri code
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: true.  do make sure you enjoy that :P
<ajmitch> just finished rebuilding mesa
<ajmitch> if I can get some debugging output I'll be happy
<Hobbsee> :)
<TheMuso> Hey Hobbsee.
<ajmitch> hm, didn't manage to get any further output
<Hobbsee> hi TheMuso :)
<TheMuso> How was your afternoon? I assume you worked?
* ajmitch will just rebuild X again :)
<Hobbsee> hehe
<siretart> ok. recursive removals now work. at least foradmins with shell accesson tiver
<siretart> tiber, even
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: no, actually, i met up with StevenK, after finishing that maths quiz.
<TheMuso> Ah right.
<Hobbsee> that was fun :)
<ajmitch> siretart: great
<TheMuso> heh right
<Sp4rKy> please
<Sp4rKy> if i want changes any file in debian/tmp/... , ihave to put command line just before dh_installdeb ?
<ajmitch> Sp4rKy: I wouldn't put it just before - it's common to put it in the install: target
* StevenK appears.
<Sp4rKy> ajmitch, k
<TheMuso> Hey StevenK.
* StevenK waves.
<Kamping_Kaiser> can we have an op in #ubuntu?
<siretart> Kamping_Kaiser: Seveas is not around? Hobbsee might do as well..
<Kamping_Kaiser> siretart, anyone, not picky ;)
<Kamping_Kaiser> ah, got nalioth
<siretart> well, not me at last ;)
<Kamping_Kaiser> hehe
<Hobbsee> siretart: sorry, was afk
<Toadstool> heya everybody
<Hobbsee> hi Toadstool
<Toadstool> hi Hobbsee
<zakame> hello all
<Toadstool> hey zakame
<zakame> yo Toadstool :)
<Hobbsee> hi zakame
<zakame> heya Hobbsee :)
<zakame> ssup?
<Hobbsee> zakame: not a lot :)  yourself?
<Hobbsee> looking at your stuff about ntfs-3g though, and thinking it looks good.
<zakame> aside from SoC and ntfs-3g, just twiddling around with my desktop :)
<zakame> decided to explore deploying web apps again :)
* StevenK is swearing at dosemu.
<Hobbsee> StevenK: what about it?
<zakame> whoa? why, did you got Brain?
<StevenK> It throws an exception and dies.
<zakame> oh, I thought twas a classice dos virus :P
<Hobbsee> ah
<Toadstool> heh
<geser> hello
<zakame> hi geser
<geser> is it possible to get a package from debian experimental into ubuntu?
<geser> gaim-encryption is needed in version 3.0beta5 to work with gaim 2.0beta3 (in edgy)
<zakame> of course, provided the build-deps are sane
<zakame> but I don't think we can vouch support forthat, since the reason why such software's in experimental is exactly for testing :/
<geser> nothing special: gaim, gtk and libnss/libnspr
<geser> the version of gaim-encryption currently in edgy doesn't work with gaim from edgy
<geser> it is for gaim 1.5
<zakame> indeed; just looked at exp's changelog
<zakame> its in expereimental exactly because gaim2 hasn't entered unstable yet
<ajmitch> hi zakame
<zakame> heya ajmitch ! how's things?
<ajmitch> good, just trying to track down a bug
<cbx33> anoyone know exactly how long it'll be before gisomount gets into the universe?
<cbx33> I'm just curious
<ajmitch> cbx33: has it been uploaded?
<ajmitch> ah, it has
<ajmitch> and sitting in NEW
<ajmitch> so, whenever the archive admins feel like accepting new packages
<Hobbsee> which, seeing they did a whole lot of syncs yesterday/this morning, probably not for another while.
<geser> zakame: I rebuild the gaim-encryption package from debian-experimental and it builds and works on edgy
<geser> should I file a bug requesting an update to the version from debian experimental?
<zakame> perhaps its wise to try
<cbx33> ajmitch, wonderful
<cbx33> :(
<cbx33> it's been there for about a month now
<Hobbsee> oh for goodness sake....
<Hobbsee> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/apt/+bug/56125
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 56125 in apt "doesnt look like a cow" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed] 
* Hobbsee headdesks
<Hobbsee> i wonder just how many bugs we have that are like that...
<bmonty_away> heh
<bmonty> that is somewhat humerous
<Hobbsee> true
<bmonty> you that someday there will be a list of launchpad "joke" bugs
<bmonty> in someone's blog
<tseng> at UDU they all involved "the mask guy"
<tseng> medicine mask
<chantra> Hi, is there a motu around
<chantra> could you tell me if gaim-libnotify made its way up?
<Hobbsee> chantra: maybe if you tell us where it came from, and where it's going to.
<bmonty> its not in launchpad
<chantra> I uploaded it to revu
<ajmitch> tseng: don't remind me of that one...
<tseng> ajmitch: haha
<ajmitch> chantra: if you go to revu.tauware.de you'll see it listed there
<tseng> mdz added some kind of tag "medicine mask guy" so he could find it again
<chantra> yep, but not updated
<ajmitch> how long ago did you upload?
<chantra> ajmitch: it is still august 3rd
<Hobbsee> tseng: heh
<ajmitch> iirc siretart turned off the cronjob
<chantra> hhhmmm 30 min ago
<ajmitch> so revu uploads need processed manually
<chantra> okie dokie
<ajmitch> siretart: scripts/register_upload.py isn't executable
<ajmitch> one among a few that probably should be
<siretart> yes
<siretart> I turned that cronjob of
<siretart> because I wanted to process the next upload manuall
<siretart> y
<ajmitch> ok
* ajmitch should put another upload in the queue for you
<siretart> hm. nothing in ~/ftp/incoming?
<ajmitch> I'll put one there :)
<ajmitch> chantra: can you re-upload?
<ajmitch> siretart: uploading libcm as a test
<ajmitch> you can put that through manually
<chantra> ajmitch: yep
<chantra> should I dputs -P or simply dputs ?
<ajmitch> dput -f
<chantra> okie
<chantra> ajmitch:  done
<ajmitch> siretart: there you go, 2 uploads to play with
<chantra> :)
<siretart> hm. just as I expected
<siretart> bad permissions of the ftp server :/
<chantra> :s
<ajmitch> hm?
<ajmitch> siretart: what user are you running the process_uploads.sh as now?
<siretart> ajmitch: I want to change it so it runs as user 'revu1'
<siretart> ajmitch: but vsftp doesn't honor my umask settings :/
<ajmitch> everything still getting set to 0600?
<siretart> yeah, I want it to be 0660
<TheMuso> Hey imbrandon_.
<imbrandon_> heya TheMuso
<siretart> ok, now some more permission fixes..
<chantra> siretart: do wa need to reupload it?
<siretart> chantra: no, it has been acceppted
<chantra> okie :)
<siretart> FYI, I reactivated the cronjob
<ajmitch> siretart: all sorted?
<ajmitch> siretart: did you remove libcm?
<siretart> ajmitch: feel free to hit me if there are still problems
<siretart> ajmitch: not yet, do you want to? ;)
<ajmitch> I don't think the register_upload.py is being run properly
<zul_> wohoo...free shot at siretart
* siretart hides
<ajmitch> so uploads will get accepted but not show up for review
<ajmitch> chmod +x should fix it
<ajmitch> siretart: also, I'll write up a cron job in the next couple of days to clean up old binary uploads
* ajmitch gets pinged too often on irc to remove them
<ajmitch> or some other queue cleaner
<bddebian> Heya gang
<siretart> that would be cool
<ajmitch> hi bddebian
<siretart> huhu bddebian
<bddebian> Hi ajmitch, siretart
<siretart> ajmitch: oh? hmmm..
<ajmitch> it's often incomplete uploads rather than binary uploads that are the problem
<bddebian> Hello Gloubiboulga
<Gloubiboulga> hi bddebian
<bmonty> hey bddebian
<bddebian> Hi bmonty
<ajmitch> siretart: done chmod on register_upload.py, I don't think anything else needs done - both libcm & gaim-libnotify need register_upload.py run on them though
* ajmitch needs sleep
<siretart> ajmitch: ah. I'll add chmods to process-incoming.py
<ajmitch> new script?
<siretart> err, /srv/revu1-production/scripts/process_uploads.sh that is
<ajmitch> ok
<ajmitch> I'll think about how to do a queue cleaner that can work reliably
<ajmitch> for now, I need to sleep :)
<ajmitch> night all
<chantra> nighty
<TheMuso> Night ajmitch
<imbrandon_> gnight ajmitch
<bddebian> Gnight ajmitch
<matid> ajmitch: Nigh
<matid> t
<TheMuso> Has anybody been bitten by bug #53892?
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 53892 in linux-kernel-headers "Please put linux/compiler.h back" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/53892
<bddebian> Nah, I don't do anything so bugs don't affect me.. ;-)
<Gloubiboulga> hehe
<Gloubiboulga> Someon here have had an issue with with file, and he patched the sources to remove the '#include <linux/compiler.h>' lines IIRC
<imbrandon_> quote : " (linux/compiler.h is just an empty file anyway), but I expect other packages might do the same. " ..... would it not be better then to fix the offending packages , rather than put back an empty file ?
<Toadstool> hi Gloubiboulga, bddebian
<TheMuso> imbrandon_: But was it removed for a reason?
<TheMuso> compiler.h that is.
<imbrandon_> TheMuso: probably becouse it was empty
<imbrandon_> heh
<Toadstool> :)
<TheMuso> imbrandon_: hmmm
<bddebian> Hi Toadstool
<Gloubiboulga> bien le bonjour Toadstool ;)
<Toadstool> hehe
<Toadstool> bddebian: cleaning up revu, eh? :)
<imbrandon_> poke BenC he does the kernel stuff , but i'm guessing it was just a cleanup of un-nessesary files ( read: empty ) and the packages that include it should be / should have been  fixed anyhow instead of keeping old unused empty files ;)
<imbrandon_> TheMuso: ^^
<bddebian> Toadstool: Aye, trying :-)
<TheMuso> imbrandon_: Yeah I know.
<TheMuso> I saw what you wrote
<TheMuso> Anyway, to bed with me.
<TheMuso> Night folks.
<imbrandon_> gnight TheMuso ;)
<bddebian> Gnight TheMuso
<Toadstool> bddebian: I wish I worked as hard as you :)
<Toadstool> g'night TheMuso
<bddebian> Toadstool: Bah I don't do much significant unfortunately :-(
<Toadstool> of course you do, every sync, merge you did helped a lot
<bddebian> Thx
<Gloubiboulga> hum, thunderbird just crashed...
<bddebian> Ugh, I have to go clean out my garage :-(
<Kamping_Kaiser> :(
<Kamping_Kaiser> any good gear send my way
<bddebian> Sure, you want a girls bike, a wagon, what? ;-)
* Kamping_Kaiser scored an alpha and a few g'od knows what they are' boxes last time a mate cleand their garage
<Kamping_Kaiser> hehe. a wheelbarrow would be good, help transport the pcs around ;)
<bmonty> bddebian: what kind of wagon?
<tseng> Radio Flyer
<bmonty> tseng: do you have an inventroy of bddebian's garage?
<tseng> yes
<tseng> radio flyer on page 6
<bddebian> Heh, nah just a plastic Little Tykes one or whatever :-)
<bmonty> darn, my kid likes the radio flyer wagons
<chantra> hi
<chantra> siretart: gaim-libnotify update still do not show on revu
<matid> Hi, what are the guidelines for bringing a new package from debian into the universe?
<matid> Should I follow the syncing guides?
<Gloubiboulga> matid, yes, you need to test if it builds fine in ubuntu, and then request a sync
<Gloubiboulga> or merge it if some changes are needed
<matid> Ok. If there is no need for changes I should left the release as it is (not ubuntu* suffix)?
<Gloubiboulga> if there's no change needed just open a bug on LP, asking for a sync
<bmonty> matid: what package are you working on?
<matid> There is already a bug on LP, it's about how can I help to bring this package to ubuntu
<bmonty> bug #?
<matid> bug 56133
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 56133 in Ubuntu "Can you please include slime" [Wishlist,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/56133
<matid> There are some licensing issues but it should be ok for multiverse
<bmonty> this package already exists in debian
<bmonty> ?
<matid> Yes, it does. non-free section though
<matid> http://packages.debian.org/unstable/source/slime
<matid> I thought of uploading it to revu after testing if it build ok, but I'm not sure if that's the good way to go
<bmonty> matid: don't upload to revu
<bmonty> have you built it in edgy yet?
<matid> I'm in the middle of building it.
<bmonty> looks like slime needs cl-swank which is not in ubuntu, so you will need to test that one as well
<bmonty> oops, nevermind
<matid> By the way, I should use REVU only for new packages that aren't in Debian yet?
<bmonty> should click on the source package :)
<bmonty> matid: yes
<matid> bmonty: And the only way to help with syncing is actually testing if the package builds and works well and leaving the rest to MOTUs?
<bmonty> matid: if you test it and it builds and there are no mods required, I'll do a quick test and then we can request the sync
<matid> bmonty: Built, no problems so far. I'll try if it installs correctly and runs as it should.
<chantra> raphink: are you here?
<raphink> chantra: yep
<chantra> top, earleir on i uploaded gaim-libnotify
<chantra> siretart: told me it was accepted, but it still doen't show on revu
<raphink> chantra: let me see
<chantra> cool, cheers
<raphink> i don't see anything in the incoming queue chantra
<raphink> so if it's not there, you have to upload it again
<chantra> raphink: oki, doing it right away
<chantra> raphink: done
<raphink> ok
<raphink> let's wait 3 minutes chantra
<chantra> ok
<matid> bmonty: Installs fine. Don't know about running though, I don't use emacs.
<bmonty> matid: ok, it built fine for me also, please update the bug with your results
<matid> bmonty: My results? What do you mean? Should I just state that it builds fine or sth else?
<bmonty> matid: yes, that it built/installed, what architecture and distro you built under
<matid> bmonty: Done
<siretart> chantra: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2872
<siretart> chantra: so I assume everythings cool again?
<siretart> raphink: ping
<raphink> pong siretart
<chantra> siretart: yes, now it is
<chantra> but it wasn't 10 min ago
<chantra> cheers guys
<bmonty> matid: all set for a sync request
<matid> bmonty: How can I track it?
<bmonty> matid: what the bug...since you are subscribed you should get an email when the archive admins sync the package
<bmonty> s/what/watch/
<matid> bmonty: I meant when it will be uploaded, but I guess tracking the bug itself is the better way to goo
<matid> s/goo/go
<matid> bmonty: And that's the way to help out with syncing? I'm supposed to check if the package builds and installs fine, leave a comment on the bug and wait?
<bmonty> matid: sync requests usually take a couple of days...depends on when they get processed
<matid> bmonty: Who processes them? MOTUs?
<bmonty> matid: no, the archive admins...look at the team members for the actual people
<bmonty> matid: I think you are refering to merging....requesting a sync is one outcome of that
<matid> bmonty: Ok, and what's the procedure of merging? Let's say I took an updated package from Debian, applied the changes from previous ubuntu* release and want it to be merged.
<matid> bmonty: The only thing I can to is to attach a debdiff and wait for a MOTU or whoever to upload it?
<bmonty> matid: essentially yes
<matid> bmonty: Ok, thanks for you help.
<bmonty> np :)
<matid> Guess I'll stick with merging for a while.
* matid has to practice packaging stuff
<bmonty> matid: make sure that you subscribe the ubuntu-universe-sponsors team to any merge bugs you open
<matid> Ok. Merges are handled by ubuntu-universe-sponsors and motu team, not ubuntu-archive-admins, am I right?
<bmonty> matid: if we are uploading a merged package (with a -ubuntuX version) then the motus will handle it, syncs are handled by the archive admins
<matid> bmonty: Ok, I got it
<bmonty> Toadstool: ping
<Toadstool> bmonty: pong
<bmonty> Toadstool: on bug 56001, I think Scott wants you to specifically state that it is ok to drop the ubuntu changes
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 56001 in gnomebaker "[Edgy MoM]  Please sync gnomebaker" [Untriaged,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/56001
<Toadstool> bmonty: hmm, ok
<Toadstool> done
<bmonty> Toadstool: thanks
<gnomefreak> i should have done that :( sorry
<gnomefreak> is there any reason why xchat is in universe while xchat-gnome is in main?
<siretart> gnomefreak: I think for xubuntu, but I'm not sure
<gnomefreak> siretart: i commented and changed it to wish list to support xchat and xchat-gnome in same repo due to unwanted libs being installed if universe is not enabled
<matid> Do you know any tool that will download a requested source package from debian? Sth like apt-get source, but I want it it run on my edgy install
<bmonty> matid: http://merges.ubuntu.com/ get the grab-merge.sh script
<bmonty> it will do that for packages on the merge list
<matid> bmonty: Thanks
<bddebian> Or use wget ;-)
<matid> bddebian: Know this one ;)
<gnomefreak> that script rocks ;)
<matid> No, that's too much. This script did all the job for me. That's cruel ;)
<Goshawk> hi
<Goshawk> this question can be offtopic, but i think that most of you use pbuilder (pdebuild) to build packages. My question is: how can i preserve my build environment even if an error occurs and then clean it when i want? the --preserve-buildplace options cleans the environment on failure but i need that it remains (i'm doing this to see where is the fault), any help will be helpful, thanks...
<freeflying> how can I  only mirror the dapper and edgy's archive?
<bmonty> hi LaserJock
<LaserJock> hi bmonty
<micahcowan> In synaptic, as I click on "Mark all upgrades", it tells me "to be removed" are language-support-{ja,el,he}. Why? Is there a replacement for these packages?
<bmonty> micahcowan: you should ask that in #ubuntu
<micahcowan> yeah, but it's edgy, so I figured someone who's been working on recent developments might have a clue (it's just today). Thanks, anyway.
<ash211> and check my response to that q in #ubuntu+1
<bmonty> micahcowan: see the /topic
<micahcowan> Yes, I see it: it's for MOTUs. I'm not looking for support: I'm looking for reasons.
<LaserJock> micahcowan: last I checked language-support-* was Main ;-)
<LaserJock> and I would check the changelogs to look for reasons
<imbrandon_> and #ubuntu+1 is edgy
<imbrandon_> heya LaserJock
<LaserJock> hi imbrandon_
<imbrandon_> ssh -p 20022 192.168.1.5
<imbrandon_> gah /me needs to wakeup
<bddebian> Heya LaserJock
<LaserJock> bddebian!!!
<bmonty> hey bddebian
<LaserJock> anybody know who kmilo is?
<bddebian> Hi bmonty
<bddebian> LaserJock: Hmm, name sounds familiar
<LaserJock> well, he added MOTU Enthusiast to our wiki pages
<LaserJock> so now we have MOTU, MOTU Hopeful, and MOTU Enthusiast
<imbrandon_> heh whats the diffrence ?
<LaserJock> well, MOTU Hopeful is supposed to be somebody who *wants* to become a MOTU
<LaserJock> and MOTU Enthusiast is one who just wants to help out
<LaserJock> or something to that effect
* welshbyte puts a bet on either MOTU Fanatic or MOTU Fetishist being next
<imbrandon_> lol
<LaserJock> MOTU-holic ;-)
<welshbyte> :)
<LaserJock> raging MOTU-holic ;-)
<imbrandon_> that would be you ;)
<LaserJock> anyway, I was wondering if that change was discussed here or not
<LaserJock> I'm looking at the log and haven't found anything yet
<imbrandon_> not hat i recall but i just got in today
<imbrandon_> brb , time to get somew food
<LaserJock> imbrandon_: the wife and I just ate at the Bonanza buffet
<LaserJock> it's our 5th year anniversary so we went all out ;-)
<imbrandon_> ;)
<imbrandon_> hehe
<LaserJock> normally we go to Wendy's
<imbrandon_> and your on here ? shame on you heheh
<LaserJock> hehe
<LaserJock> "I don't care if it *is* our anniversy honey, I've got to get some MOTU work done" :-)
<bddebian> hehe
<bddebian> LaserJock: I haven't seen/heard anything about it but hey, I'm nobody :-)
<imbrandon_> LaserJock: LOL
<LaserJock> well, you are at least around
<welshbyte> LaserJock: happy anniversary :)
<LaserJock> I don't see any mention of it in the logs
<LaserJock> my concern about the whole Enthusiast thing is that we have no mechanism for seperating that
<LaserJock> perhaps Hopeful is not the right term
<LaserJock> but we only have MOTUs and non-MOTUs
<LaserJock> ubuntu-dev and ubuntu-universe-contributors
<bddebian> And us lackeys
<imbrandon_> do we realy NEED to seperate it, afaik its the hopefulls jobs to present his case ( with cheering ) if wanted to move to the next step(s) .....
<LaserJock> well, the idea is that there might be some people who want to help, but don't want to become MOTUs
<LaserJock> which I can see
<LaserJock> and so MOTU Hopeful gives the conotation that you are just doing your time until you can make MOTU
<imbrandon_> exactly so they would follow the same proceedures as a hopefull ( the hopefull then takes it one bit further by documenting )
<LaserJock> right
<imbrandon_> no changes in proceedure to seperate their efferts , its upto THEM to seperate
<imbrandon_> IMHO
<LaserJock> so I see where the idea of the MOTU Enthusiast would come from
<LaserJock> but I don't think we have a basis for seperating that
<imbrandon_> right
<LaserJock> the only difference between a MOTU Hopeful and a MOTU Enthusiast is one would apply for ubuntu-dev and the other wouldn't
<imbrandon_> yup
<LaserJock> well, I hate reverting people's stuff on the wiki, but we need a massive MOTU wiki cleanup
<LaserJock> we have over 100 wiki pages marked CategoryMOTU
<imbrandon_> heh i know , i go and mop some up now and then
<imbrandon_> when i'm bored
<LaserJock> ~ 30 pages are for MOTU Teams
<imbrandon_> MOTU Teams ?
<LaserJock> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Teams
<LaserJock> some of the teams are more active/developed than others
<imbrandon_> beejesus theres alot
<imbrandon_> ok soda time
* bddebian starts MOTUlackeys team
<imbrandon_> brb LaserJock , i guess today might be a wiki day
<imbrandon_> bddebian: hahahaha
<bmonty> bddebian: is your icon for the team going to be a picture of a whip?
<LaserJock> bddebian: I thought that's what MOTU Science team was for ;-)
<LaserJock> lol, I love this MOTU School request, "Dealing with hideously packaged packages"
<LaserJock> "Tips from your worst experiences: beating '''really''' badly packaged sources into a deb"
<bddebian> bmonty: Aye
<bddebian> LaserJock: You have azeem now, you don't need me anymore :'-(
<crimsun> bddebian has graduated to head lackey
<bddebian> Not hardly
<LaserJock> yep
<LaserJock> it's true
<imbrandon_> bmonty: a pillow icon ;)
<bmonty> imbrandon_: if bddebianwas the only member :)
* imbrandon_ hands bddebian some fule, a bottle of mt dew ;P
<imbrandon_> fuel*
<imbrandon_> grr
<bddebian> :-)
<ajmitch> morning all
* ajmitch is up *far* too early
<imbrandon_> heya ajmitch
<carthik> morning ajmitch
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<bddebian> Why is the year not on the date of uploads to REVU?
<crimsun> well you know back in 1990 when REVU was first used...
<ajmitch> because we didn't expect to have uploads older than a year when it was written?
<bddebian> Heh, probably :-)
<ajmitch> then get to work
<ajmitch> hm
<bddebian> ajmitch: I'm still working on your damn REVU stuff even though I'm probably doing them all wrong
<ajmitch> well...
<bddebian> well what?
<bddebian> ajmitch: Well what?
* bddebian stops reviewing until ajmitch answers
<phanatic> evening
<bddebian> Heya phanatic
<phanatic> hey bddebian
<bddebian> do be do be dooo
<Toadstool> too much revu, he's cracking up :)
<Toadstool> re
<bddebian> Heh, heya Toadstool
<bddebian> Toadstool: Nope, I'm waiting for my scolding from ajmitch
<Toadstool> uh?
<Toadstool> what did you do?
<bddebian> Toadstool: Don't know yet, he hasn't told me :-)
<Toadstool> heh
#ubuntu-motu 2006-08-13
<LaserJock> wow, I've got a ton of mail in my motu-reviewers box
<LaserJock> way to go
<imbrandon_> hehe
<crimsun> hmm, impressively I have none
* imbrandon_ is trying to run windows on xen without a vt processor
<imbrandon_> this is gonna be fun i can already tell
<LaserJock> crimsun: you don't get motu-reviewers?
<crimsun> I'm not subbed
<crimsun> (iirc)
<LaserJock> hehe, smart man
<LaserJock> mmm, nothing like Debian spam bugs :-)
<Hobbsee> morning all
<TheMuso> Hey MOTUs./
<gnomefreak> morning
<LaserJock> hi Hobbsee!
<Hobbsee> ;)
<imbrandon_> moins everyone
<TheMuso> Hey imbrandon_
* TheMuso has never seen so much traffic on motu-reviewers.
* Hobbsee isnt subscribed to there.
<Hobbsee> so i dont know anything :P
<Burgundavia> anybody uploading anything last week they think should be mentioned in UWN?
<Burgundavia> new versions, new features, etc.
<imbrandon_> i'm not either, i get enough mail as is ;)
<Hobbsee> Burgundavia: no sorry, i cant upload amarok till they release it
<Hobbsee> Burgundavia: merges list is coming down though
<Burgundavia> oh LaserJock, you owe the UWN a writeup on your MOTU school session
<LaserJock> Burgundavia: oh yeah
<welshbyte> how do i find out which package provides time-admin ?
<micahcowan> welshbyte, time-admin is gnome-system-tools.
<Hobbsee> packages.ubuntu.com usually
<micahcowan> You find this out by typing "dpkg -S /usr/bin/time-admin" (or whatever the path was)
<welshbyte> ok thanks :)
<micahcowan> but don't submit bugs to it...
<welshbyte> ?
<micahcowan> I was recently informed that it's not supposed to be in working order atm (that is, if you're running edgy?)
<welshbyte> yep, it seems very broken
<micahcowan> I submitted a couple bugs related to setting the time with it, and the NTP-install stuff... but the developers are very aware that it's broken, so it'd be more fruitful I guess to wait until it's "supposed" to be working, and then test it. :-)
<welshbyte> hehe ok
<micahcowan> There was some talk that they might just put the dapper version of time-admin back in, if necessary. They seem to be giving it a major API overhaul atm...
<welshbyte> well i'm glad you were around to tell me that, saved me a bit of bother :)
<Bazzi> hm, ntp and stuff actually works better for me than with dapper, in a vm that is
* bddebian pokes ajmitch
<welshbyte> bddebian: still on revu strike?
<bddebian> welshbyte: Nah but I would like him to tell me if I am doing something wrong
<welshbyte> i'm curious too, it's been a while since he said "well..."
<bddebian> What is this no .mo file crap from linda?
<StevenK> bddebian: Crap. Thanks.
<StevenK> bddebian: Can I have the complete message?
<bddebian> StevenK: Thanks for what?
<bddebian> Linda: Unable to find a suitable .mo file!
<StevenK> Which version?
<bddebian> StevenK: Of what?
<StevenK> Of Linda
<bddebian> Oh
<bddebian> Dunno, these are all over some packages on REVU :-)
<StevenK> Ah.
<StevenK> Right. Who do I talk to about fixing Linda on REVU?
<bddebian> Probably siretart
<Burgundavia> bddebian: did you upload any packages last  week that you think are worth mentioning in UWN?
<StevenK> siretart: Ping
* StevenK buggers off to shop
<bddebian> Burgundavia: I don't do anything of worth :-)
<Burgundavia> bddebian: right
<bddebian> Heya tuxmaniac, TheMuso
<tuxmaniac> bddebian> booo
<tuxmaniac> bddebian> and am at home town with family :D
<tuxmaniac> Yay!
<bddebian> tuxmaniac: Cool
<welshbyte> where does python search for libraries/modules when you import them these days (i.e. in edgy)?
<LaserJock>  /usr/lib/python2.X/site-packages/
<welshbyte> d'oh, python-osd installs an empty /usr/lib/python2.4/site-packages/pyosd/  :(
<TheMuso> Don't forget the python policy and python-central/python-support
<welshbyte> all the files go in /usr/share/python-support/python-osd/pyosd
<TheMuso> with /usr/share/python-{support,central}
<welshbyte> should it be looking in there then? it can't seem to find the pyosd module
<LaserJock> I don't think they are installed there in the end
<LaserJock> they should be installed to /usr/lib/python2.4/site-packages in the end
<LaserJock> as /usr/share/python-* is not in Python's  path I don't think
<bddebian> Heya LaserJock
<LaserJock> hi bddebian
<welshbyte> right, so the python-osd package needs work? should i file a bug?
<ajmitch> LaserJock: no, they really do get installed there
<ajmitch> postinst does symlink stuff
<ajmitch> that's part of the new python policy - stored in one place rather than in /usr/lib/python2.x
<welshbyte> in that case it looks like the symlinks aren't getting set up in python-osd
<LaserJock> does python-central do symlinks as well?
<LaserJock> I thought that was only python-support
<ajmitch> check the policy & docs for them
<LaserJock> but anyway, my point is that Python path hasn't changed
<ajmitch> LaserJock:
<ajmitch> lrwxrwxrwx  1 root root    64 2006-08-10 13:50 messages.py -> /usr/share/pycentral/pyflakes/site-packages/pyflakes/messages.py
<LaserJock> hmm, that's not for all python stuff?
* ajmitch shrugs
<LaserJock> because you need to seperate python 2.3 from 2.4 and also 3.5
<LaserJock> 2.5 rather
<ajmitch> that's why we dropped python2.x-foo binary packages & have the policy now
<LaserJock> yeah
<LaserJock> but they are still byte-compiled for each version
<LaserJock> as far as I know
<ajmitch> of course
<ajmitch> otherwise you get a performance penalty each time you run stuff
<LaserJock> so my understanding was that python-* byte compiled for all the installed python versioins
<LaserJock> versions
<LaserJock> but I could be getting really messed up
<ajmitch> yes
<ajmitch> that's why installing stuff can be a bit slow
<ajmitch> but it's best to do it then rather than compiling on every use
<LaserJock> yes, I know
<LaserJock> but my question was why /usr/share/pycentral/pyflakes/site-packages/pyflakes/messages.py doesn't have any versioning
<ajmitch> because it's a .py
<LaserJock> ah right
<ajmitch> I did  ls -la /usr/lib/python2.4/site-packages/pyflakes/
<ajmitch> and that was 1 file
* ajmitch knew that pyflakes at least uses pycentral
<LaserJock> ok, well I gotta get going
<LaserJock> thanks for the info
<ajmitch> ok, bye
<welshbyte> so, should i file a bug on python-osd? :)
<ajmitch> might as well
<ajmitch> it has a missing postinst, so something is broken
<bddebian> So ajmitch are you goint to tell me?
<bddebian> Err going
<ajmitch> bddebian: hm?
<imbrandon_> [15:52]  <bddebian> ajmitch: I'm still working on your damn REVU stuff even though I'm probably doing them all wrong
<imbrandon_> [15:57]  <ajmitch> well...
<imbrandon_> [15:58]  <bddebian> well what?
<ajmitch> and you've been waiting all this time? :)
<ajmitch> hehe
<bddebian> imbrandon_ :-)
<imbrandon_> he's been wondering all afternoon ;)
<ajmitch> I don't think there was too much that I spotted that was badly wrong
<ajmitch> just things like FTBFS - you could suggest Build-Depends: dpatch
<ajmitch> in the case where that happened
<imbrandon_> ajmitch: you rember that ccache command to show the stats off the top of your head ?
<bddebian> ajmitch: Ah
<ajmitch> CCACHE_DIR=/path/-to/cache ccache -s
<imbrandon_> thanks
<imbrandon_> hell yea, got it working , w00t
<ajmitch> imbrandon_: hm?
* imbrandon_ does a little pbuilder dance
<imbrandon_> heh finaly tookt he time to get ccache working with pbuilder the "right way"
<imbrandon_> took*
<ajmitch> which is?
<ajmitch> I'd love to hear what the "right way" is meant to be :)
<imbrandon_> the way i was doing it but you HAVE to set a BUILDUSERID and a BUILDUSERNAME or the $path dosent get transfered
<ajmitch> right
<imbrandon_> bug is pbuilder apparently ( got that from debian bts )
<imbrandon_> thats why it wasent hitting my ccache dir before , it dident have both of those set
<imbrandon_> in the pbuilderrc
<imbrandon_> i set those and its working heheh
<imbrandon_> just tested with kdelibs lol
<ajmitch> ok
<ajmitch> welshbyte: filed a bug?
<imbrandon_> ahh you mean about the "right way" , i mean that i got it working with the pbuilderrc instead of a hookdir script
<ajmitch> right
* ajmitch doesn't use a hook script for it
<imbrandon_> yea i WAS before but it s kinda a pita
<imbrandon_> and this is better , even if i clean the base or make a new one etc it still works
* ajmitch tries python-osd build again
<welshbyte> ajmitch: https://launchpad.net/bugs/56187
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 56187 in python-osd "python-osd doesn't set up symlinks to modules on install" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed] 
<ajmitch> ok
<ajmitch> I think I've fixed it now anyway
<ajmitch> just rebuilding to check
<welshbyte> cool
<ajmitch> good, fixed, will upload & close bug
<welshbyte> ajmitch: great, thanks :)
<bddebian> Hmm, anyone know much/anything about the LaTex license?
* imbrandon_ barly knows about his own drivers license
<imbrandon_> barely
<imbrandon_> haha bddebian check out the second comment down on this
<imbrandon_> http://linux.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=191480&threshold=1&commentsort=0&mode=thread&cid=15736530
<imbrandon_> thats classic
<bddebian> imbrandon_: Heh :-)
<imbrandon_> hrm anyone know how to assign a mouse key to a keyboard key , ie make ummm ctl+f12 "right click" ?
<bddebian> imbrandon_: In what, X?
<imbrandon_> yea X and/or kde
<bddebian> I think you can do it in xorg.conf can you?
<imbrandon_> preferably x so i can use the same key in gnome/kde
<imbrandon_> dunno , actualy the reason i ask is f12 used to ( still does ) in dapper "right click" my mouse on my ibook ( since there is no right mouse button )
<imbrandon_> but in edgy that functionality seems to be gone
<imbrandon_> i'm sure a config is just not set right but i dunno what makes it happen, i guess xorg.conf might ;)
<imbrandon_> i'm assumeing in dapper X did it not kde becouse gnome/kde both used the same binding too
<imbrandon_> not that big of a deal but annoying to not beable to "right click" heh
<bddebian> :-)
<bddebian> OK, reviewing is starting to get boring :-(
<imbrandon_> hehe
<welshbyte> wow how'd it get to 5am
* welshbyte goes to bed
<imbrandon_> ahh ajmitch you probably know most if not all whats on this page , but if not check it out, i found it very usefull when messing with the "advanced" pbuilder stuff like ccache and distcc
<imbrandon_> http://edseek.com/~jasonb/articles/pbuilder_backports/advpbuilder.html
<imbrandon_> i might try to wikify some of that for the CategoryMOTU later as it took me FOREVER to figure some of those things out
<LaserJock> cool
<imbrandon_> heya LaserJock ;)
<bddebian> Gnight folks
<imbrandon> wb Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> hi imbrandon
<imbrandon> guess what ? hehe
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: do tell :P
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: you fixed the machine?
<StevenK> He broke it harder?
<imbrandon> my domain transfer FINALY went through, now i just got to setup my email account again so i dont miss any email
<imbrandon> whiule the dns server arround the world update
<Hobbsee> yay!
<imbrandon> Hobbsee: ohh yea the machine is fixed up too
<imbrandon> heh
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: hey, there's a merge listed for wine on MoM - you might want to do that one
<imbrandon> it only took 10 minutes of so to build a new base.gz
* imbrandon grumbles hehe
<imbrandon> who's is it ?
<Hobbsee> hah
<Hobbsee> dont remember.  someone elses
<Hobbsee> but you're free to take it over
<TheMuso> Hey Hobbsee, imbrandon.
<imbrandon> heya TheMuso
<Hobbsee> hi TheMuso
<imbrandon> Hobbsee: i probably will later tonight i would just like to atleaste ping whomever so we dont dupe work
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: of course.  although i'm just stealing anyone's by now
<imbrandon> hrm go i put my homegrown cms back on imbrandon.com or wordpress or soemthing else *thinks*
<imbrandon> Hobbsee: dig imbrandon.com , see if your dns has updated yet, or if its still some that hasent
* Hobbsee pastes that in a query
<imbrandon> dig should say ns#.dreamhost.com
<imbrandon> if its updated
<Hobbsee> dont think so
<Hobbsee> *pokes*
<Hobbsee> ah :)
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: is kxdocker supposed to work ootb now?
<imbrandon> yea it will probably take another 24-48 hrs now
<imbrandon> for everyones to update
<imbrandon> hrm i havent tried kxdocker on edgy yet
<imbrandon> on dapper you have to "mess" with the config to make it useable
<imbrandon> but it "works"
<imbrandon> why?
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: got a user asking about it, for dapper
<Hobbsee> he's had fun fighting it :P
<imbrandon> ohhh btw i tried k3b on 2 diffrent computers with fresh edgy installs and all its missing is it needs kdesu in the .desktop
<imbrandon> if you kdesu it it works fine, i dunno what all this talk about kernel stuff is
<imbrandon> infact i just burned 2 ppc iso's one of 6.06.1 and both worked fine ( one kubuntu one plain ubuntu )
<Hobbsee> why are you having to run cd burning software as root anywya?
<imbrandon> becouse it "writes" to the /dev/cdrom afaik
<imbrandon> i thought you always had to
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: did you change the --update-alternatives back?
<imbrandon> YES , add $editor to your ~/.bashrc please
<imbrandon> hehe
<Hobbsee> heh
* imbrandon cant get used to vim{m}
<crimsun> Hobbsee: direct/raw block device access requires root privileges.
<imbrandon> yea what crimsun said ;)
<crimsun> because we don't suid-root cdrecord, you have to su{,do}
<Hobbsee> right...
* TheMuso has never had to run cdrecord with sudo.
<Hobbsee> funny, the lag to a box in sydney is much less than a lag to the US.
<TheMuso> And I don't suid either.
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: What were you expecting?
<imbrandon> Hobbsee: and thats not what you were expecting ?
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: actually, lag to the US has gotten worse recently.
* TheMuso remembers what lag from Paris to Sydney was like.
<crimsun> TheMuso: you can -scanbus without errors?
<TheMuso> Oh scanbus, no.
<imbrandon> scanbus ?
<Hobbsee> yay, i found a newer copy of my .bashrc :)
<TheMuso> imbrandon: no
<imbrandon> lol Hobbsee set a crontab to tar.gz your /home once a week and rsync it somewhere offsite
<imbrandon> ;)
<crimsun> if you're in the cdrom group, you can actually write cds/dvds without being root (by virtue of your /dev/sgX device being owned by root:cdrom)
<crimsun> you just won't have permission to change your scheduling priority
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: yes.  offsite is the problem.
* Hobbsee doesnt exactly *have* an offsite.
<crimsun> if you write to an atapi device, this is moot
<imbrandon> Hobbsee: i gave ya 2 gigs on buntudot.org and if you dont put it in ~/public you cant get to it from the web
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: point.
<imbrandon> hopefully your /home tar.gz isnt over 2 gigs , just stick it in your ~/ on buntudot ;)
<Hobbsee> yeah, i'ts not
<imbrandon> see , a crontab once a week for that would work ;0
<imbrandon> and be secure becosue its not in the ~/public folder , if your paranoid encrypt it ( with something OTHER than your gnupg key lol )
<Hobbsee> hah.  i wouldnt be stupid enough to stick it in /public.
<imbrandon> IE no one can get it but you if its not in ~/public
<imbrandon> heh
<imbrandon> even so like i said if your realy paranoid encrypt it though, but IMHO its not that big of a deal as ling as its not publicly accessable
<imbrandon> but thats just my 0.2c
<Hobbsee> what happened to imake?
<Hobbsee> true
<imbrandon> imake ?
<Hobbsee> it was a package in breezy/dapper
<Hobbsee> it got removed.
<Hobbsee> hmmm
<imbrandon> probably a reason, anyhow , afk a few , i'm going to load ubuntu on my laptop , tis OSX only atm
<imbrandon> guess i could get on voyager while i do this hehe
<TheMuso> voyager?
<crimsun> yes, it was removed because we resynced with Debian's X.Org packaging for Edgy
<TheMuso> You mean startrek voyager?
<crimsun> the xutils-dev binary package contains an imake executable, so the imake source+binary packages "went away"
<imbrandon> TheMuso: all my computers are named after ST ships ( my main build machine is voyager , main file server enterprise , amd64 intrepid , etc etc etc )
<crimsun> you were probably idling in -x when we discussed this, Hobbsee
<TheMuso> imbrandon: aah
<crimsun> (then again, maybe not; this was several weeks ago at least)
<Hobbsee> crimsun: right...okay
<Hobbsee> crimsun: so depend on xutils-dev instead of imake?
<Hobbsee> bugger.  i'll have to reupload that then.
<crimsun> correct
<Hobbsee> ah great.  tarball out of date too.
* Hobbsee just uploaded a package that ftbfs :P
<Hobbsee> guess i should fix that :P
<Hobbsee> fixed.
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: Get your act together. :p
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: heh.  i'll try to.
<AnAnt> is there a way to use pbuilder environment for compiling arbitrarily ?
<AnAnt> ie. unpack a pbuilder environment to try compiling ?
<crimsun> meaning "compiling random undebianised source?"
<crimsun> yes, you can accomplish such with pbuilder hooks
<AnAnt> crimsun: what's that ?
<crimsun> I wouldn't necessarily recommend such a use case, but...
<AnAnt> crimsun: what's pbuilder hooks ?
<crimsun> pbuilder(8) has some works about shell/perl/etc. scripts you can use to manipulate [stuff into]  pbuilder.
<crimsun> s/work/word/
<AnAnt> crimsun: so I can get an interactive shell in pbuilder using these hooks ?
<crimsun> you can get an interactive shell just by using the login target
<crimsun> the hooks are for other uses (think copying stuff)
<AnAnt> cool ! that's what I want
<AnAnt> ok, so how does one get a dependancy in pbuilder environment ?
<AnAnt> apt-get also ?
<crimsun> apt-get install, yes.
<Toadstool> 'morning everybody
<AnAnt> k, thanks
<Gloubiboulga> morning Toadstool
<crimsun> hi
<crimsun> Toadstool has some pbuilder hooks iirc
<AnAnt> crimsun: that would get it from the cache if it is available, right ?
<crimsun> AnAnt: yes
<AnAnt> crimsun: thanks a lot for the help
<Toadstool> hey Gloubiboulga, crimsun
<crimsun> I haven't really done anything except for spit pbuilder(8) at you ;)
<imbrandon> hrm is *.ubuntu.com down for anyone else? specificly the wiki
<Burgundavia> imbrandon: yes, and the downtime is probably unplanned
<imbrandon> ok np, just wanted to make sure it wasnt my flacky isp
<imbrandon> not a big deal
<imbrandon> ;)
<crimsun> you know, "back in the old days" (I think in the hoary dev cycle), *.ubuntu.com went down every Sunday morning
<crimsun> it got to the point when we just said, oh it must be Sunday cos Apache's down
<Kamping_Kaiser> LP goes off tuesday nights
<Kamping_Kaiser> heh
<ajmitch> ah, back in the day...
<imbrandon> hahaha
* ajmitch is reading some of the links from sounder
<ajmitch> one guy writing about "What Canonical doesn't want you to know"
<ajmitch> entertaining stuff
<imbrandon> yea i read that earlier
<imbrandon> kinda funny
<imbrandon> he just seems mad becouse we have a "community"
* ajmitch is yet another brainwashed cult member
<imbrandon> lol me too i guess ;)
<imbrandon> BUT he does back my point up that the debian site is cr*p /me looks at crimsun
<Burgundavia> being in a cult is supposed to be hard, with lots of pointless work
<imbrandon> hehe
<ajmitch> Burgundavia: sounds about right
<ajmitch> you seen how many bugs we have to fix on malone?
<imbrandon> Burgundavia: and thats chnges his comment how?
<Burgundavia> right
<ajmitch> all for this elusive 'karma;
<imbrandon> hehe
<imbrandon> ajmitch: hahaha just file 3 or 4 specs if you wanna karma whore
<imbrandon> lol
* ajmitch wonders what our Glorious Leader has to say for us today
<Burgundavia> all to make us more integrated into the community, whereupon we get more pointless work
<Kamping_Kaiser> lol ajmitch
<Burgundavia> imbrandon: the glorious leader spoke directly with me today
<Kamping_Kaiser> :o
<imbrandon> heh
* Kamping_Kaiser tortures Burgundavia for words
<Burgundavia> he told me about his plans
<ajmitch> Burgundavia: great, where'd you see him?
* imbrandon is wondering if your refering to sab
<Burgundavia> hm pm
<ajmitch> ah
<Burgundavia> he pm'ed me
<ajmitch> I thought you meant in person
<ajmitch> hard to keep track of where he is at any time
<imbrandon> sabdfl ?
<ajmitch> yeah
<imbrandon> hehe
<imbrandon> i talked to him about umm 2 days ago PM , well infact that was the only time i ever talked to him directly
<imbrandon> lol
<ajmitch> I wonder what this guy must think of the debian cult - it's nearly all volunteer work
<imbrandon> lol
<imbrandon> that and i was trying to figure out what "canonical dosent want you to know ..." every thing he said is very public , even posted on ubuntu.com mostly
<ajmitch> it's meant to lend an air of mystery
<Burgundavia> imbrandon: the easiest way to hide something is in plain sight
<ajmitch> like revealing some dark, sordid secret
<imbrandon> heh
<imbrandon> just looks like FUD to cash in on some "hits" form a sensational headline to me
* ajmitch reads UWN #9
<imbrandon> he said he would take a "technical" look at it but i see nothing technical about the artical tbh
<Burgundavia> it was a giant rant
<ajmitch> yep
<Burgundavia> ajmitch: tell me if you think I imply that there is any connection between jdub leaving and jono coming, in 9
<ajmitch> almost a foaming-at-the-mouth type of rant
<ajmitch> Burgundavia: yes
<imbrandon> *ubuntu* does get alot of press though, but honestly i think rightly so
<imbrandon> Burgundavia: yea
<ajmitch> Burgundavia: only because you mention it - knowing some of what goes on lends a different perspective for me reading it
<Burgundavia> imbrandon: you agreeing to my question to ajmitch?
<Burgundavia> right
<imbrandon> [03:06]  <Burgundavia> ajmitch: tell me if you think I imply that there is any connection between jdub leaving and jono coming, in 9 <-- yea
<Burgundavia> jdub emailed me and told me off for it
<ajmitch> curious
<imbrandon> why? i dont see the problem with it
<ajmitch> community manager was never jdub's real job
<ajmitch> jono is not really replacing jdub
<Burgundavia> yes
<imbrandon> even if it was / or  he is , dident jdub leave on his own choice ?
<ajmitch> certainly
<imbrandon> i dont see the issue then tbh
<Burgundavia> I don't see a big issue, but I will add a not to next weeks issue
<imbrandon> its not like anyone is downing jdubs work, i think he did and does great
<ajmitch> pass the text by jdub first
<Burgundavia> he can edit it just like anyone else
<Burgundavia> I refuse to cater to one person
* Hobbsee noted the connection earlier, but thought it was unfounded.
<Burgundavia> jdub pisses me off sometimes
* ajmitch should remember to file a bug on mesa 
<Burgundavia> what really pisses me off is that I had several people review it, including crimsun, and nobody said anything
<imbrandon> wonderfull , 6.06.1 just failed to install yaboot , now i got to figure out how to get a traceback off a uninstalled system to file a usefull bug
<imbrandon> Burgundavia: like i said tbh i dont see a probelm with it even if it did infer that but maybe i just dont see a problem becouse i'm not directly involved , dunno , thats just me
<Burgundavia> right
<imbrandon> just becouse he is not a canonical employee dosent mean he'll stop contributing to ubuntu either from what i've seen he still is and plans to , but again i havent ask him personaly , just what ive noticed myself
<imbrandon> anyhow thats their cup of tea, best if i stay clear as i realy dont know the half of it, but to a peon like me its no big deal
<imbrandon> brb more mt dew
<imbrandon> ugh this sucks, ok i have the lappy with no internet atm becouse its on a live cd and no wireless drivers installed yet, ubiguity crashes 2 time in the same place with the same traceback so its definate bug , but i have no way to get the file off other then my ipod
<imbrandon> now the funny part, my ipod is formatted hfs and the darn comp wont read it
<imbrandon> lol
* imbrandon hates bugs sometimes
<imbrandon> i guess i could reformat my ipod to fat32 but then i would have to reput all that music on it , 4gigs of songs over usb2 is slow
<TheMuso> heh
<TheMuso> WHy not use the alternate cd?
<imbrandon> anyone else have a better idea before i format the ipod just to file this bug
<imbrandon> TheMuso: i will now BUT that dont make the bug do away ;)
<TheMuso> I know.
<TheMuso> But its an idea. :p
<imbrandon> for that matter i have an old dapper cd that work and i can just dist upgrade ;)
<imbrandon> i'd like to get the installer/syslog and syslog and partman and traceback off
<imbrandon> to make a good bug report heh
<TheMuso> Fair enough.
<TheMuso> What wireless drivers does it need?
<TheMuso> And did you try the hfsplus filesystem?
<imbrandon> orinoco drivers ( airport in an ibook )
<TheMuso> Right.
<TheMuso> Try hfsplus first
<imbrandon> hfsplus wont write to a journaled file system
<TheMuso> modinfo hfsplus
<TheMuso> Oh ok.
<TheMuso> Does the Ipod use hfsplus?
<imbrandon> i'd have to turn the journaling off and tbh i dunno how to do that on an ipod
<TheMuso> Right.
<imbrandon> yea it can eather use hfs+ or fat32 , i choose hfs when i formated it
* imbrandon headdesks
<TheMuso> Damn.
<TheMuso> DO you still have any unpartitioned space on the machine?
<TheMuso> the hard disk rather
<imbrandon> hrm i still have the osx partition and the journalings turned off on it
<imbrandon> good call
* ajmitch doesn't have any toys like that, quite sad
<imbrandon> toy's ? hehe all i have is an ipod
<ajmitch> it's enough of a toy
<imbrandon> ipod was a fathers day gift ;)
<ajmitch> ah :)
<ajmitch> I see Hobbsee is still merging
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: i was, yeah
<phanatic> morning
<Gloubiboulga> morning phanatic
<phanatic> hi Gloubiboulga
<Fujitsu> Good evening, phanatic, Gloubiboulga.
<phanatic> evening Fujitsu
<Gloubiboulga> hello Fujitsu
<ajmitch> nexu: ping
<nexu> ajmitch: pong
<ajmitch> nexu: are you associated with the files in http://files.beep-media-player.org/packages/ubuntu/dists/dapper/main/binary-i386/ ?
<nexu> yes
<siretart> StevenK: pong
<ajmitch> nexu: I just spent half an hour trying to figure out a bug with a user that was due to broken backports from there
<nexu> ajmitch: what is exactly the problem ?
* ajmitch is not happy
<nexu> ajmitch: is it related to python2.4-dbus ?
<ajmitch> no, libdbus-1-cil
<ajmitch> backporting dbus is crackful in itself
<nexu> hmm i used the exact script from edgy
<nexu> from a while back
<siretart> nexu: did you check what effects a different environment has?
<nexu> so what was wrong about it ?
<nexu> i'm interested in it
<siretart> no idea. I don't touch dbus for exactly these reasons..
<ajmitch> the assembly simply couldn't be loaded at all
<ajmitch> it wasn't in the GAC
<nexu> i lost you there; what is GAC?
* ajmitch nods
<ajmitch> that's why you need to understand a package to touch it
<StevenK> siretart: Hey. I wanted to fix Linda on REVU.
<siretart> nexu: the GAC is the global assembly cache, I assume
<StevenK> siretart: How do I go about this?
<nexu> uurh ok
<siretart> StevenK: oh, right. do you have a fixed linda for breezy?
<StevenK> Breezy!?
<siretart> tiber still runs breezy, we didn't upgrade yet
<nexu> so what was the symptoms and issues it raied with the borqed backport i made ?
<nexu> raised*
<StevenK> siretart: I can make one.
<ajmitch> nexu: as I said - the assembly cannot be found in the GAC
<ajmitch> so it can't be loaded
<siretart> my laptop broke yesterday while upgrading to edgy
<ajmitch> which breaks pretty much any mono desktop apps (banshee, muine, tomboy, f-spot, etc)
<siretart> I'm currently reinstalling. don't have time to investigate the breakage :/
<StevenK> That reminds me, I need to upgrade a server to Dapper.
<StevenK> My work got their first Ubuntu server installed last week.
<siretart> StevenK: I intended to upgrade it this weekend :(
<StevenK> siretart: Heh. This weekend is nearly gone.
<nexu> ajmitch: those dbus lib has been on there for perhaps almost a month now, i havent heard about this before or i would have either taken them down or something
<siretart> StevenK: and my laptop is still broken ;)
<siretart> StevenK: I still have 12h weekend
<Hobbsee> siretart: but broken is fun.
<StevenK> siretart: I will make/hack a package together for Breezy, and also for Dapper.
* StevenK buggers off to dinner.
<nexu> siretart: was that on your machine ?
* ajmitch should really consider having some food as well
<zanaga> is it too late to get a package from debian pushed to edgy universe? (currently there is no such package in unverse)
<Hobbsee> zanaga: no, you've got until sept 7 to do that
<siretart> Hobbsee: not if you have a thesis to write ;)
<zanaga> ok.. that's good to know. What is the right way to get a package pulled?
<Hobbsee> siretart: heh.
<Hobbsee> zanaga: file a bug about it, get a MOTU to ack it, if you arent one yourself, and subscribe ubuntu-archive
<zanaga> Hobbsee, ok. I'll do that once i get the next version upload out of the way.
<zanaga> Hobbsee, thanks
<Hobbsee> zanaga: not a problem
<ubuntu_demon> hi
<Hobbsee> hi ubuntu_demon
* StevenK looks to resurrect a breezy chroot.
<StevenK> siretart: tiber is i386?
<StevenK> Oh, what does it matter, Linda is arch: all
<siretart> StevenK: yes
<StevenK> siretart: Piong
<StevenK> Ping, even
<Hobbsee> the new form of greeting.  piong.
* StevenK pouts at Hobbsee.
* Hobbsee tickles StevenK 
* StevenK jumps on Hobbsee.
* Hobbsee drops icecubes down StevenK's back.
<siretart> StevenK: yes?
<StevenK> Grah
<StevenK> siretart: How do you want this package?
<siretart> can I trust a debian developer? ;)
<Hobbsee> siretart: such as StevenK?  no.
<StevenK> The correct answer is 'No'.
* StevenK high fives Hobbsee.
<Hobbsee> :)
<siretart> ok. then as source. :)
<StevenK> siretart: http://wedontsleep.org/~steven/linda/breezy/
* StevenK goes back to playing with Rails.
* welshbyte wakes up
* Fujitsu sends welshbyte back to sleep.
<welshbyte> i probably need it
<Toadstool> siretart: "/usr/bin/revu-build: line 106: libaudacious3.0.0_1.1.1-0ubuntu1_i386.lintian: Permission denied" on tiber, with revu-report :)
<siretart> Toadstool: interesting..
<siretart> Toadstool: which source package is that?
<Toadstool> siretart: audacious
<siretart> Toadstool: relogin, should work then
<Toadstool> ok, thanks
<Toadstool> siretart: it worked, thanks a lot :)
<welshbyte> '-*-bitstream vera sans-bold-r-*-*-*-240-*-*-*-*-iso10646-1' <-- what exactly are those things?
<Hobbsee> fonts?
<tseng> forge, font name, weight, size, charset....
<tseng> xfontsel breaks it down if you really cared
<welshbyte> i really care, thanks :)
<tseng> these days we rarely bother with such detail
<tseng> fontconfig
<gnomefreak> is there a deadline on merges?
<Hobbsee> gnomefreak: sept 7, universe freeze?
<Hobbsee> well, after that you need exceptions
<Gloubiboulga> Hobbsee, the deadline has changed?
<Gloubiboulga> I thought it was sept 28
<gnomefreak> ok cool so the 2 i want to do can wait til 08/27
<Hobbsee> Gloubiboulga: right, so i've rmemebered wrong?
<gnomefreak> Gloubiboulga: seethats bad
<Gloubiboulga> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/EdgyReleaseSchedule
<Hobbsee> oh, wiki's back
<Hobbsee> Gloubiboulga: ahhh...you're right.
* Hobbsee still doesnt understand that.
<Hobbsee> how do we have a feature freeze for all of ubuntu, then have a main freeze after that?
<gnomefreak> oh nvm i thought you said aug. 28th
<Hobbsee> s/main/universe/
<bddebian> Heya gang
<phanatic> hey bdde
<phanatic> bddebian: :)
<bddebian> Hi phanatic
<phanatic> hit return before tab :)
<bddebian> :-)
<TheMuso> Night folks
<Hobbsee> night TheMuso
<gnomefreak> night TheMuso
<Seveas> Hobbsee, please bump the gtk-dev build-depends for monkey-bubble to 2.10 -- configure fails with older gtk
<Seveas> which screws over backporting 
<Hobbsee> Seveas: gotcha
<Hobbsee> Seveas: i'm not terribly familiar with them :(
<Hobbsee> Seveas: build depends should read:  Build-Depends: debhelper (>= 5), libgtk2.0-dev (>= 2.10), cdbs, librsvg2-dev, libgstreamer-gconf0.8-dev, libxml2-dev, libgnomeui-dev, libglade2-dev, gconf2, libgstreamer0.10-dev, libxml-parser-perl, docbook-to-man, scrollkeeper, gnome-doc-utils
<Hobbsee> ?
<Seveas> !info libgtk2.0-dev edgy
<ubotu> Package libgtk20-dev does not exist in edgy
<Seveas> heh, bug in ubotu 
<Hobbsee> now *that's* interesting :P
<Hobbsee> hah
<Seveas> yeah
<Hobbsee> you should fix that
<Seveas> already on it
<Hobbsee> Seveas: what else do i need to bump?
<Hobbsee> this package hasnt been touched since breezy.
<Seveas> the rest should be ok
<neutrinomass> When a package installs an icon in /usr/share/foo/, but it should also go in /usr/share/pixmaps, is duplicating the icon in both locations the right way to do it ?
<redguy> a softlink seems a better approach
<Hobbsee> er, i'm thinking taht libgstreamer-gconf0.8-dev may be wrong too.
<Hobbsee> i wonder if that builds without it.
<neutrinomass> Yes, that's what I think too but I vaguely remember hearing a long time ago that symlinks should for some reason be avoided...
<Seveas> Hobbsee, the libgtk2.0-dev (>= 2.10) should be ok, that exists in edgy -- did you bump gstreamer to 0.10?
<Hobbsee> Seveas: yes
<Seveas> Hobbsee, 0.8 and 0.10 aren't compatible, you shouldn't just bump
<Hobbsee> iirc upstream changed it?
* Seveas checks
<dsas> Is there any need for an MTA do have reccomends on every MUA in the archive?
<dsas> s/do/to
<dsas> see bug 56238
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 56238 in aptitude "Install Recommended packages automaticaly should be disabled by default" [Untriaged,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/56238
<Seveas> Hobbsee, right, monkey-bubble does gst-0.10 now
<Hobbsee> Seveas: that's what i thought i read, yes.
<Seveas> I think you should just drop the gstreamer0.8-gconf dep
<Goshawk> i've problem with pbuilder, can someone help me?
<Seveas> I'll try a testbuild without it
<Hobbsee> yeah, i'm just trying that now
<Hobbsee> Seveas: i'm not that much of an idiot to bump gstreamer 0.8 to 0.12 at random.
<Seveas> Hobbsee, heh 
<Seveas> You had me worried though ;)
<Hobbsee> s/0.12/0.10/
<Hobbsee> i'm bumping to versions that dont exist yet!  woo!
<Seveas> sigh -- my pbuilder is broken
<Hobbsee> Seveas: considering i've done the last couple of uploads of amarok, i should hope i'd get the build-deps right.  although, we dont ship amarok-gstreamer anymore, i guess
<Hobbsee> Seveas: how'd you break it?
<Toadstool> dsas: postfix doesn't recommend *every* MUA
<Seveas> Hobbsee, -ENOCLUE, I'm just wiping it now
<dsas> Toadstool: Not every, but a fair few - including emacs.
<Hobbsee> Seveas: ah okay
<Toadstool> dsas: uh? it just recommends mail-reader
<dsas> Toadstool: Ah, I wondered what that was.
<dsas> Toadstool: But all apt based tools will automatically install all reccomended packages in edgy afaik, will that mean it tries to install all of those?
<Seveas> no
<Seveas> just one
<Toadstool> dsas: which means that if you have a package providing mail-reader installed, apt/aptitude/whatever will not try to install another mail-reader
<dsas> ok, sorry for the confusion. Out of interest if you don't have a package providing mail-reader how does it choose which one to install?
* Hobbsee still hasnt figured how all of that works.
<Hobbsee> i should do that though
<Toadstool> dsas: no idea :)
<dsas> Toadstool: Ok, I'll reject the bug anyway
<Sp4rKy> hey
<Sp4rKy> please MOTUs
<Sp4rKy> i need some help
<Sp4rKy> i'm packaging audacious
<Sp4rKy> and the library libaudacious is buggued
<Sp4rKy> it soname is 3.0.0 whereas it should be 3
<Sp4rKy> and upstream doesn't want modify the libaudacious
<Sp4rKy> so what could i do ?
<bmonty> Sp4rKy: do you know what rdepends on libaudacious?
<Sp4rKy> rdepends doesn't  seems to be the issue
<bmonty> bmonty: Sp4rKy, I'm not sure of the answer to your question, but I would want to know if changing the soname of the lib would effect any other packages
<Sp4rKy> no
<Sp4rKy> libaudacious is only used by audacious
<Sp4rKy> but if i call my package libaudacious3 , lintian says soname must be libaudacious3.0.0
<tseng> proper so naming has little to do with who uses it
<tseng> if your library had zero users, you should get your soname right
<Sp4rKy> how ?
<Lutin> hi
<Lutin> is there a way to massively sign packages without having to give the password each time ?
<bmonty> Lutin: take the password off your key (not recommended)
<Lutin> bmonty, no other way, such as a gpg-agent, smthg like that ?
<bmonty> Lutin: not that I know of
<Lutin> **argh**
<Lutin> bmonty, how could I take the password off my gpg key ?
<visik7> how can I get dpkg-buildpackage to run make with -j3 ?
<bddebian> visik7: You need to modify the make line in debian/rules
<visik7> bddebian: isn't there a global var ?
<bddebian> visik7: Yes, but it would still need put in debian/rules
<visik7> I dunno why usually if I run fakeroot debian/rules -j3 binary it works why I can't get the same with dpkg-buildpackage?
<bddebian> visik7: Are you just trying to do this for yourself or are you trying to fix some package?
<visik7> bddebian: no I'm backporting a program but I'm on a dual processor and I would like to get advantge from this
<bddebian> visik7: You should be able to use something like DEB_BUILD_OPTS or some other to do it
<visik7> thanks
<visik7> is it documented somewhere?
<AstralJava> Hey all, a starting MOTU-wannabe here asking; what is the best way to run Edgy in a virtual machine on a Dapper laptop?
<bmonty> AstralJava: you can use vmware
<bmonty> it is in the multiverse repo
<AstralJava> bmonty: the player one?
<bmonty> AstralJava: yup
<visik7> parallels on vt hardware is faster than vmware
<AstralJava> bmonty: Okay then, thanks!
<AstralJava> visik7: Hmmm... vt hardware, whazzat?
<bmonty> AstralJava: I use www.easyvmx.com to create the machine configs for the player
<visik7> processors that support VT like Intel CoreDuo pentium D 9xx and Merom/Conroe
<AstralJava> visik7: Ahh... okay this is a Pentium M proc.
<visik7> so no VT
<AstralJava> visik7: Figured. :) Thanks anyway.
<AstralJava> That easyvmx site seems to have issues...
<visik7> btw I prefere to debootstrap edgy on a directory and chroot in it
<visik7> faster and harmless
<tomveens> hi
<AstralJava> visik7: Right, got a pointer for instructions on that one?
<visik7> AstralJava: man debootstrap have an example on how to do it
<tomveens> wher can I go if I have a question on the egroupware package?
<AstralJava> visik7: Silly me, of course. :) Thanks!
<visik7> at the bottom of the manpage
<visik7> there is an example
<visik7> don't follow it step by step 'couse is old and for debian just use it to figure out the steps
<AstralJava> visik7: Sure thing, I'm on my way. Thanks for the help you guys! :)
<visik7> things like modifying your fstab and your inittab aren't so smart
<tomveens> when I install the egroupware package than it uninstalls the apache php5 modules
<AstralJava> visik7: I see that modifying fstab everywhere that mentions deboostrapping edgy, why is it not smart?
<visik7> as you want I don't like to do it
<AstralJava> visik7: Okay. :) But lemme understand why modifying fstab isn't smart, granted I don't yet understand how a POSIX system works, but I suspect that adding /proc -section is important, no?
<AstralJava> visik7: I kinda get that inittab part though.
<visik7> AstralJava: is important yes but you are editing fstab of the host machine for settings that impact on a guest machine
<visik7> if we can call this chroot a machine
<visik7> btw
<visik7> I prefere  script that mount proc for the chrooted directory and then chroot in it
<AstralJava> visik7: Ahh... now I see. Thanks for clearing that for me.
<visik7> AstralJava: have you debootsrapped edgy ?
<AstralJava> visik7: Yuppers. :) Now doing the same for dapper, so I can triage some bugs since my main conf is dist-upgraded from hoary.
<visik7> :)
<visik7> but you had /usr/lib/debootstrap/scripts/edgy ?
<AstralJava> I decided to make scripts for mounting as well, just haven't figured out how to automagically umount when exiting the chroot.
<AstralJava> visik7: No, I downloaded the new debootstrap from edgy repository.
<visik7> oh :) a link to dapper was enough
<AstralJava> visik7: Err.... sorry can't follow?
<visik7> nevermind
<AstralJava> :)
<visik7> timetogo
<visik7> bye
<AstralJava> Bye, and thanks again!
<welshbyte> where can i find a good tutorial for writing man pages?
<bmonty> welshbyte: use google, there are tutorials out there
<crimsun> e.g., http://www.unixreview.com/documents/s=8925/ur0312i/
<welshbyte> bmonty: yeah i did and it found lots, just wondered if i could get a recommend from more experienced people :)
<welshbyte> crimsun: thanks
<bmonty> welshbyte: I think the last time I had to make a man page, I just copied one from some other package and modified it
<welshbyte> bmonty: cheat ;)
<bmonty> welshbyte: I prefer to think of it as efficient :)
<welshbyte> hehe
#ubuntu-motu 2007-08-06
<norsetto> ScottK: adding a note about the repackaged upstream source 
<norsetto> ScottK: was also checking the upstream authoir email .....
<norsetto> ScottK: daM, I should have left a note on that upload
<ScottK> OK.  Not a big deal.  Do up a -2 with the corrections and bump compat and the debhelper version dependency to 5 while you're there.
<norsetto> ScottK okki dokki, sorry about that
<TheMuso> ScottK: If a MOTU uploads to REVU, I believe they only need one ACK, so I already uploaded it.
<TheMuso> for a new package
<ScottK> Ah.  Would have been nice to have archived it on REVU then...
<ScottK> I wondered why it was still there.
<ScottK> I guess two uploads don't hurt.
<TheMuso> ah sorry, my fault.
* ajmitch shouldn't backport packages to etch on his amd64
<ajmitch> given that I built a few & then realised that I needed x86
<lifeless> use the -arch option
<ajmitch> oh I know that now
<ajmitch> I just didn't realise that I was building amd64 packages at the time
<ajmitch> typical monday morning
<lifeless> http://rafb.net/p/QGFBdY36.html
<lifeless> thats what I use
<lifeless> with a match pbuilder-etch-i386 script
<opop>  hey, do the kernel sources in the repositories come pre-configured the same as they are distributed in binary?
<lifeless> all the scripts are the same
<ajmitch> that'll partly work
<ajmitch> except that I need a set of build-dependencies from sid 
<lifeless> surely thats just a pinned apt source?
* ajmitch has something similar setup for pbuilder, but with a local repository to use built packages 
<norsetto> ScottK: I believe the cleanest would be to open a new bug report with the patch?
<ajmitch> but for now I'm just using a chroot with debootstrap since it's simpler
<ScottK> No need for a bug report.  Just upload it.
<ScottK> norsetto: Actually, yet
<ScottK> yes
<ScottK> That's correct.
<norsetto> ScottK: ok, thanks man, you ROCK :-)
<RainCT> good night
<ScottK> Good Night.
<norsetto> ScottK: If you need me to do something else just bug me; I'll be glad to (try to) help
<ScottK> Did you do the patch?
<ScottK> If you uploaded it to revu, that's fine too.
<ScottK> norsetto: ^^^
<ScottK> Just saw the bug.
<opop> is vesafb framebuffer under block devices in menuconfig?
<opop> * character devices, rather?
<opop> found it under character->graphics
<desertc> Heya Fellahs - Got a questions for your about some directory structures, more specifically about games.  Why does it have to be that some of them Ubuntu packages go into /usr/games and some go into /usr/share/games and some go into /usr/local/games ?  Is sure does make a head weary looking in all those directories for a guy's game.
<RAOF> desertc: If any of the ubuntu packages install something in /usr/local, that's a bug and should be filed.
<desertc> What do you say we lasso all these packages up and wrangle 'em into one place?
<TheMuso> desertc: Games that store stuff in /usr/share/games are doing the right thing.
<RAOF>  /usr/games should be used differently to /usr/share/games
<TheMuso> Generally games will have a data package, that contains all non-architecture specific data, which goes in /usr/share/games/gamename
<desertc> That's the type of tough-talk I was hoping to hear... seems to me /usr/share was for putting files on other computers around your so-called LAN... don't reckon there's a reason to put a game for your rig in /usr/share
<TheMuso> desertc: Not exactly. A lot of, including desktop environments use /usr/share.
<RAOF> desertc: No, that's not what /share is about - /share is for arch-indep data and stuff.  Icons, documentation, etc.
<desertc> Now, TheMuso, I gotta take issue with a fellah who thinks he can put a little piece of his program here, and another little piece in that directory.... I figure a fellah should stake out a little plot of land to call his own and defend it with everything he got... but not get too ambitious to take another fellah's place, too!
<ScottK> norsetto: Uploaded.  Thanks.
<RAOF> desertc: See the FHS - that's not how linux works :)
<TheMuso> desertc: I think you need to have a look at the FHS standard.
<norsetto> ScottK: thx 2 u Scott
<RAOF> desertc: This page is the home of the Filesystem Hierarchy Standard (FHS).
<RAOF> The current version is 2.3. It was announced on January 29, 2004.
<RAOF> desertc: http://www.pathname.com/fhs/pub/fhs-2.3.html
<RAOF> Gah, I really need to get that pasting habit under control.
<desertc> Well now -- I now a little bit about the so-called scalability of enterprise computing, but we're talkin about some games here, fellahs... just some eye-candy for fun.  Do we really need to be calling in the law into this matter?  Not like we're going to take this across state-lines, or nuthin'
<ajmitch> keeping the whole system consistent is quite useful
<ajmitch> rather than doing things 10 different ways just because you feel like being relaxed
<desertc> Seems to me, most of these files you are talking about are hardly a meg in size.  Not like you're going to rustle-up a whole new drive for even a hundred of those varmints!  Meanwhile, you got users - moms and pops - racing all around the farm trying to find where you hid the file, like some sort of hunt on easter day.  Now, that doesn't seem right, does it?
<TheMuso> desertc: But the fact is, its very easy to find what package owns what file.
<ajmitch> and that they're in standard locations
<ajmitch> you shouldn't need to care where a package puts its sound files or levels
* norsetto wonders if ajmitch has ever been a gamer....
* RAOF is, and I don't care where the games put their sound files or levels
<desertc> Well, shucks, A.J., you don't have to getting all steamed-up over there... I was just saying 'cause I'm throwing fits over here trying to keep my darned self organized.  With a share here, a local there, I hear there's some var and opt making a fuss on occasion, too.
<RAOF> desertc: You don't need to keep yourself organised.  Trust apt! :)
<desertc> Golly, RA OF, I 'spect I might be takin' your advice on this one.  I'll put my six-shot back for now and be trying my best to build the fence around what I got wit' the apt tool down at the warehouse.  I reckon it won't be too long 'till I got a handle on it all.
<desertc> Happy Trails, partners.
<norsetto> yawn, oh well, lets call it a day...
<norsetto> g'night all, sleep tight and well
<ajmitch> that was an 'interesting' visitor
<RAOF> Indeed.
<opop> vesafb is no longer modularized at all?  I can't even M it in the kernel config, rats.
<DarkSun88> Hi all
<geser> Hi DarkSun88
<DarkSun88> Hi geser 
<DarkSun88> Thanks for previous upload
<geser> np
<geser> are you going to merge wordpress 2.2.2-1 from Debian unstable?
<DarkSun88> Yes.
<DarkSun88> I'm building it.
* RAOF decides that 1 1/2 hours is long enough, and starts spruiking xgl again: https://code.launchpad.net/~raof/xserver-xgl/ubuntu-raof
<DarkSun88> Well, works.
<RAOF> Anyone merging deluge-torrent?
<jrib> ScottK: hey, thanks for the comments.  I'll work on the LGPL issue.  But the lintian warning seems to have been generated from python-reverend_0.3.svn20070609 which is the older version.  The current version on revu is python-reverend_0.3.svn20070730
<opop> i'm gonna recompile the generic kernel without vesafb support, and with nvidiafb support instead.  Is there a good reason not to do this?
<RAOF> opop: Because you will no longer be able to file useful kernel bug reports?
<opop> RAOF, also, because nvidiafb breaks the prop nvidia driver
<opop> RAOF, i've abandoned it.
<ScottK> jrib: I may have run the wrong one through lintian.
<ScottK> I still have the old one on the hard drive.
* Fujitsu finally gets around to preparing rdiff-backup-stable
<Fujitsu> s/stable/1.1.9/
* StevenK re-does one of the libquicktime NBS rebuilds again, since someone uploaded a new mlt about 4 hours ago.
<Fujitsu> Hum... To go with 1.1.5 or 1.1.9...
* StevenK ponders being a bastard and NMU'ing xmovie in Debian.
<Fujitsu> StevenK: Why does it need NMUing?
<StevenK> Because it fails to build, and has 3 RC bugs open on it. :-)
<Fujitsu> Ah.
<StevenK> The being a bastard bit was NMU'ing a new upstream version, which is frowned on.
<Fujitsu> Ah, yes.
<StevenK> Oh, THE BASTARD.
<Fujitsu> ..?
<StevenK> Upstream for xmovie includes libmpeg3, libsndfile1, libquicktime, libogg, libfaad, libflac, and a few others in his tarball.
<Fujitsu> Oh, neat!
<Fujitsu> I love it when they do that.
<Fujitsu> So you have to coerce it into working with external versions?
<StevenK> I knew I should have guessed that when he said on his site, "and the distributions change their libraries too fast to justify binaries anymore"
<Fujitsu> Haha.
<StevenK> Now I have to repack the bloody tarball after waving rm over it, and see if it will actually build.
<Fujitsu> Or just let it rot.
<StevenK> I'm tempted to get it removed from Ubuntu, yes.
<Fujitsu> Or you could ask him to update it.
<Fujitsu> He uploaded stuff a couple of weeks ago, so he's around.
<StevenK> The Debian maintainer hasn't touched the package in over 16 months.
<StevenK> Or any bug reports related to it.
<Fujitsu> Hm.
<StevenK> I note xmovie doesn't appear in popcon results ... :-)
<Fujitsu> Heheh.
* StevenK 's opinion of upstream plummets even further.
<StevenK> wc:
<StevenK>         cat *.C *.h | wc
<RAOF> UUoC!
<jmg> Euw.
<Fujitsu> Ick.
<StevenK> And the Makefile has a very large opinion of the included libraries. Removing it is looking better all the time.
<bobrikcz> Hi, I am testing Ubuntu Gutsy in VMware; but to install/reinstall it every time is time consuming - did anyone consider creating "official" VMware images each time new testing release gets released?
<Fujitsu> Won't the previous diff handle most of that, though?
<Fujitsu> bobrikcz: Why not upgrade it?
<StevenK> Fujitsu: Point. I like the Debian maintainer's Makefile much better.
<bobrikcz> Fujitsu: I might mess the machine up so I can prefer reinstall, and upgrade between e.g. Feisty and Gutsy can go wrong
<bobrikcz> Fujitsu: not to speak about people that did not set up such a machine yet ;)
<RAOF> But we care if an upgrade from Feisty -> Gutsy goes wrong :)
<Fujitsu> bobrikcz: Well, this isn't the right channel, at any rate.
<bobrikcz> Fujitsu: oh, I see; I misread the channel description at #ubuntu-dev :)
<StevenK> Right. xmovie $LATEST_UPSTREAM fails too. I am so getting this removed.
<Fujitsu> Yay :)
* Fujitsu wonders when a heap of removals for libapache-* will appear in Debian.
<Fujitsu> It must have been almost 2 months since the mass bug-filing.
<StevenK> They look to be slowly filtering in.
<Fujitsu> I see two open at the moment.
<StevenK> There's about five to ten I've gotten NBS'd out.
<StevenK> Fujitsu: I'd be curious to see a comparsion of how many libapache-* packages are in Debian, versus Ubuntu.
<Fujitsu> StevenK: As far as I can tell there are no differences. 
<RAOF> Gah!  There's something I've forgotten to fix in my xgl package:  How do you test for the existance of Makefile, and run $(MAKE) distclean only if it exists?
* Fujitsu kicks Telstra hard.
<RAOF> I think the way I currently do it is wrong.
<StevenK> RAOF: test -f Makefile && $(MAKE) distclean ?
<RAOF> StevenK: Won't that fail (and abort the build) if Makefile doesn't exist?
<StevenK> RAOF: test -f Makefile && $(MAKE) distclean || :
<RAOF> Won't that always succeed? :)
<StevenK> If you want to be that way. :-)
<StevenK> RAOF: if [ -f Makefile ] ; then $(MAKE) distclean ; fi
<RAOF> Aha!  looks good :)
<StevenK> RAOF: Learn shell. :-)
<RAOF> I kinda know shell, just not how it interacts with makefiles.
<RAOF> (My initial attempt, which was basically the same as your "if ..." thingy didn't work.  Each line is executed in a different shell, perhaps?)
<ScottK> Good evening everyone.
<Fujitsu> Hi Sco	.
<Fujitsu> Oops.
<Fujitsu> Laaag.
<StevenK> RAOF: Right.
<StevenK> RAOF: If you want multiple lines, end it with \, which tells make to join them together.
<StevenK> RAOF: if [ -f Makefile] ; then \\n $(MAKE) distclean ; \\n fi
<RAOF> StevenK: Thanks.  You've just earned yourself a free "won't get pestered to review xgl" pass :)
<RAOF> Everyone else: review xserver-xgl! :P
<jmg> hey all. turbogears bugged on feisty? have to roll $ python2.4 $(which tg-admin)
* Fujitsu eats some unmetdeps for lunch.
<ScottK> jmg: It's build for Python 2.4 and 2.5 both, so you shouldn't have to do that.
<ScottK> File a bug if there isn't one already.
<jmg> rgr\
<jmg> ScottK: no bug reports at all for python-turbogears
<jmg> one bug in something called loggerhead
<ScottK> Then I'd file one.  Please explain exactly what you did to make it nor work with Python 2.5
<jmg> am i searching right?
<jmg> all i did was apt-get install it
<ScottK> Did you search on just turbogears?
<jmg> yeah
<ScottK> OK
<jmg> but i dont know what i might have done on this box to frell it up
<jmg> the shebang is set wrong
<ScottK> OK, but " turbogears bugged on feisty" isn't much of a bug report.
<ScottK> What's it set to?
<jmg> #!/usr/bin/python should be #!/usr/bin/env python2.4
<jmg> correct?
<ScottK> No,
<RAOF> No
<jmg> oh
<RAOF> Env is wrong.
<jmg> :(
<ScottK> usr/bin/python gets you the default Python.
<jmg> why?
<ScottK> Which in Feisty is 2.5
<jmg> why is env wrong?
<ScottK> Because the results aren't always consistent with what the packaging system tries to do.
<RAOF> 1) /usr/bin/env python will show up as "python" in top, etc, not your script name.
<jmg> ok
<RAOF> 2) what ScottK said
<ScottK> It's in the Debian Python policy, but I don't recall exactly where.
<jmg> i suspect this only affects tg-admin
<ScottK> jmg: Just give us exact test steps including, if needed, a reduced test case to run to make if fail.
<ScottK> I know nothing about Turbogears, but I'm likely to be the one trying to fix it.
<ajmitch> heh
* ScottK does OK with Python so with a decent test case I usually muddle through.
* ajmitch has used turbogears
<ajmitch> on gutsy, running 'tg-admin' alone gives me the expected result
<jmg> im just checking the rest of the turbogears files
<ajmitch> hello Burgundavia 
<Burgundavia> hey ajmitch
<jmg> hmm
<jmg> is there a better way to make find operate on a given set of files then find $(cat list)?
<ScottK> jmg: You didn't find a bug because it's already been fixed: Turbogears (1.0.2.2-0ubuntu1) Python 2.5 compatible (LP: #84145)
<ScottK> That's in Gutsy.
<ScottK> It looks like the fact that turbogears is built for Feisty for Python 2.5 is wrong.
<jmg> ScottK: can you mark it as relevant for feisty or must i file a new bug?
<ScottK> I can, but can't you work around this?
<jmg> I can, but shouldnt the bug get fixed?
<jmg> s/ can,/already have,/
<jmg> s/Ia/I a/
<ScottK> If you can work around it, it's not a crash, and it's doesn't cause data loss, it's not going to be SRU worthy.
<jmg> doesnt faliure to start at all count as 'grave' in BTS?
<ScottK> The good news is that you can, since it's a new version with new features, ask for a backport.
<jmg> Ooo.
<ScottK> But you can start it with python2.4, right?
<jmg> Yeah.
<ScottK> So, not grave.
<jmg> I have to use magick to make it start though.
<jmg> I cant just invoke the script directly.
<jmg> Well, I can, now that i've patched it.
<ScottK> File a bug in feisty-backports, build and test the gutsy package, and then ping me: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BackportRequestProcess
<jmg> If I wind up having to deploy this to more than a trivial number of  feisty boxes, I'll raise and patch the bug myself.
<jmg> OK.
<ScottK> Then you won't have to.  You'll just have the new version.
<jmg> my coworker is LOLing at me because I didnt just do "easy_install turbogears" like he said.
<ScottK> You're doing the right thing.
<jmg> What's the backport-o-matic tool?
<ScottK> It's called prevu.
<ScottK> If you have a pbuilder set for Feisty you can just use that.
<jmg> Cool, i'll give it a go.
* ScottK svn up's the Debian Python Modules Team repo to see what's new with that package anyway...
<jmg> does sudo prevu-init set up the pbuilder for me?
<jmg> it's doing stuff.
<ScottK> Dunno.
<ScottK> I use real packaging tools, not jdong's crack versions ;-)
<jmg> i see prevu is pretty ghetto.
<ScottK> Turbogears is a DPMT package, so maybe I can invest a little time getting Debian and Ubuntu back in sync.
<jmg> 5:00 < ScottK> I use real packaging tools, not jdong's crack versions ;-)
<jmg> good thing he's not here to see that
<ScottK> Nah, he'd laugh.
<jmg> he might kamehameha you
<ScottK> If not, he can fire me from ubuntu-backporters and approve all the crack himself.
<jmg> heh
<jmg> i suppose specifying /usr/bin/python on the shebang is a policy violation rather than a grave bug.
<ScottK> He's probably on here on one nick or another anyway.
<RAOF> jmg: No, that *is* policy, isn't it?
<ScottK> Specifying  /usr/bin/python is correct.
<jmg> so its up to the maintainer to make sure the script works with whatever the system interpreter is?
<ScottK> It's up to the maintainer to package it correctly.  Python versions are controlled through the packaging system, not by shebang naming in Debian.
<Fujitsu> The point of it is to ensure it runs with the packaged Python, rather than something in /usr/local or so.
<jmg> Python scripts that only work with a specific Python version must explicitly use the versioned interpreter name (pythonX.Y).
<jmg> ok, prevu needs additional smarts to grok gutsy sources
<Hobbsee> jm
<Hobbsee> jmg: why are you using prevu?
<Fujitsu> jmg: It's probably not backportable, then.
<jmg> Hobbsee: laziness?
<ajmitch> hello Hobbsee 
<RAOF> Hobbsee!!!  Review xserver-xgl! :)
* StevenK waves his free "won't get pestered to review xgl" pass at RAOF, and convinces him to include Hobbsee on his pass.
<jmg> DIST=gutsy prevu turbogears, and it fetches from feisty
<Fujitsu> jmg: Why're you trying to build in gutsy? You want to build in feisty.h
<RAOF> StevenK: Aww, OK.  If I must :(
<Hobbsee> hehe
<ScottK> Heya Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> RAOF: i'm at uni.   the connection would fall over
<Hobbsee> hiya ScottK 
<jmg> Fujitsu: in that case, how do i make it download the gutsy version?
<Hobbsee> hi ajmitch 
<ajmitch> StevenK: we could just avoid reviewing it & just upload it anyway
<Fujitsu> jmg: Don't use prevu, I guess.
<Fujitsu> Or modify it to accept a local file.
<ajmitch> it's crack anyway, I'm sure it can't be made any worse
<StevenK> ajmitch: It could be packaged by Kmos ...
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: now, if it were to auto-install automatix as well....
<StevenK> I'm fairly sure that would make it worse.
* Fujitsu stabs Hobbsee.
<Fujitsu> Die die die die die.\
* Hobbsee dies bloodily all over Fujitsu 
<Fujitsu> Yay, finally!
<jmg> it should wget -o - http://blah/automatix.py | python
* Hobbsee vanishes in a puff of smoke, repairs self, and comes back to haunt Fujitsu 
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: sure, I think it'd be sane to kill -9 -1 in the preinst
<Fujitsu> Damn.
<jmg> excellent, prevu is smartened.
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: heh
<Fujitsu> Has there been a response from the Automatix team yet?
<jmg> ScottK: Could not satisf build-dependency
<elkbuntu> someone mentioned it on their forums, but no reply to it yet
<ScottK> jmg: Which?
<Fujitsu> jmg: Which? python-support?
<jmg> python-support >= 0.6.4
<Fujitsu> Hahha.
<ScottK> Your screwed then.
<ScottK> Can't backport it officially.
<ScottK> Sorry.
<jmg> you're
<ScottK> Yeah.  That
<jmg> *sniff*
<elkbuntu> Fujitsu, im still waiting for you know who to say mjg59 has 'no technical merit'. 
<ScottK> Backporting major tools like python-support is too crackish even for jdong.
<ajmitch> elkbuntu: he's just elitist
<jmg> alright
<Fujitsu> elkbuntu: Heh, yes.
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: Ye, Automatix is great.
* jmg gets out the crackpipe
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: it Works For Me
<jmg> you made me do this
* Fujitsu invokes !wfm
* ajmitch doesn't see what's so bad about backporting python-support :)
* ScottK is not suprised.
<ScottK> All the backports breakage we've had recently is stuff done by core-devs.
<ajmitch> evil core devs
<jmg> Bastards!
<ScottK> Well the scary ones are the archive admins because they can and do backport stuff without any documentation the rest of us can see.
<elkbuntu> "Turns out that the deb file on my personal hosting had been incorporated into Automatix without anyone asking me and burnt up several gigabytes of bandwidth in a couple of weeks(!)"
<Fujitsu> <3 secret documentation
<Fujitsu> elkbuntu: Where's this?
<elkbuntu> ubuntuforums
<jmg> elkbuntu: baaaa
<elkbuntu> http://ubuntuforums.org/showpost.php?p=3133201&postcount=28
<ajmitch> not as good as the skull wallpaper
* Fujitsu remembers the conversation that resulted in the skull wallpaper.
<jmg> ok
<ajmitch> "let's find as many crack repositories as we can & give them to people!"
<jmg> so
<Fujitsu> Mhm.
<elkbuntu> Fujitsu, with jbj?
<jmg> what's going to happen
<jmg> if i install this python-support_0.6.4ubuntu1~7.04prevu1_all.deb
<Fujitsu> elkbuntu: jbj wasn't involved, AFAICR.
<ajmitch> probably nothing interesting
<Fujitsu> It was in #ubuntu-devel.
<elkbuntu> Fujitsu, i misread, sorry
* jmg checkpoints the vm
<ajmitch> python-support should be compatible with previous versions of itself, given its purpose
<Fujitsu> I don't think it should cause any issues, but you never can tell.
<elkbuntu> Fujitsu, i thought you were referring to where jbj had this 'great' idea of a repo of every piece of crap any ubuntu dev wannabe can put into a package
<Fujitsu> Ah, no.
<ajmitch> elkbuntu: oh you mean PPAs?
<jmg> well i have a snapshot just in case it does break stuff
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: Yeah, pretty much.
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: at least it requires source uploads
<ajmitch> so no checkinstall 
<jmg> haha
* Fujitsu kicks Telstra again.
<jmg> Fujitsu: you cant possibly kick them hard enough
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: True...
<Fujitsu> We might even be able to convince Canonical to remove evil things.
<elkbuntu> ajmitch, it starts here: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/sounder/2007-February/010020.html
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: unlikely, unless it's not legally redistributable
<ajmitch> elkbuntu: oh that thread
* Fujitsu checks the TOS, after kicking Telstra again a few times.
<Fujitsu> My SSH connection keeps dieing.
<ajmitch> he's had some interesting ideas
<Fujitsu> And it's not a problem in the network at either end.
<elkbuntu> ajmitch, yeah. i misread what fujitsu originally said, and thought he meant that
<Fujitsu> elkbuntu: I think I stopped reading sounder around then.
<ajmitch> let's use ajax in the desktop!
<elkbuntu> i dont blame you
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: Yesplease.
<jmg> hmm
<elkbuntu> Fujitsu, karl had already stopped at that point, usually refusing to even view the archives, until that thread
<ajmitch> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2006-November/022294.html for the reference
<Fujitsu> I think I have my old account subscribed, but I haven't checked anything bar the INBOX of that in months.
* elkbuntu blinks
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: I made a point of forgetting about that.
* elkbuntu rubs the sore, desk-induced lump on her forehead 
<Fujitsu> jbj is a great asset.
<ajmitch> elkbuntu: sorry
<elkbuntu> ajmitch, ;)
<elkbuntu> i sometimes get to the point where i think the kid cant flabbergast me any longer, and he goes and achieves it
<ajmitch> heh
<Fujitsu> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/sounder/2007-February/010030.html
<Fujitsu> What the &@*#?
<ajmitch> you know what they say about something being foolproof
<elkbuntu> ajmitch, the problem is when living fools somehow manage to evolve in a negative way
* Hobbsee mumbles about the darwin awards
<Fujitsu> Heh.
<elkbuntu> Fujitsu, tbh, i quite liked my response to him :)
<jmg> who is that kid?
<jmg> is he a plant?
<elkbuntu> jmg, there are plants in the world with more intelligence
<jmg> not that kind of plant.
<elkbuntu> i know. it just sounded right
<elkbuntu> jmg, i dont think he's a plant though, one of the first emails from him i remember was to sounder, along the lines of 'nobody likes me :( :( why?! :( :('
<jmg> maybe he's just 12
<jmg> or younger
<elkbuntu> no, he's older than that
<elkbuntu> i think he mentioned uni once
<jmg> gmailing from some internet cafe in the shanty towns outside sao paulo
<elkbuntu> but anyway as I subscribe to the theory of intellectual osmosis, i will now distance myself from all discussion of this individual
<Fujitsu> elkbuntu: Bwahah.
<ajmitch> no, he does show some intelligence & far too much misdirected enthusiasm
* Hobbsee avoids making a comparison of exactly who it sounds like
<Fujitsu> Oh, shiny:
<Fujitsu> http://www.getautomatix.com/wiki/index.php?title=Automatix2_Server
<StevenK> *TWITCH*
<Fujitsu> A bit.
<Hobbsee> wow...
<Hobbsee> even webmin
<elkbuntu> ...
* elkbuntu further distances herself from the new conversation
<jmg> oh man
<jmg> now with TUI!
<jmg> mmm tui
<StevenK> *bloody* webmin
<white> don't make webmin coming back :/
<Fujitsu> white: Mhm.
<Hobbsee> white: it's inside automatix.  anyone using automatix cant file bugs via apport
<Fujitsu> Hobbsee: Oh, they can't? Nice.
<white> !info webmin gutsy
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: yep
<ubotu> Package webmin does not exist in gutsy
<Hobbsee> white: long removed. duh
<Fujitsu> But this is for Debian.
<white> good
<Fujitsu> We haven't had in for ages.
<StevenK> Neither has Debian.
<jmg> openfire?!
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: pitti did it a month or so ago, i think
<elkbuntu> white, webmin hasnt existed in repos since dapper afaik
<nixternal> anyone remember the name of the app that crimsun was working on that had a qt3, qt4, gtk, and what not front-end for asoundconf?
<white> elkbuntu: since sarge, yes
<elkbuntu> white, i speak ubuntu, not debian :
<StevenK> webmin was removed in Dapper.
<Hobbsee>   * Add general-hooks/automatix.py: Refuse to send problem reports if
<Hobbsee>     automatix is installed.
<Hobbsee> apport (0.92) gutsy; urgency=low
<Fujitsu> :D
<StevenK> It was last published in Breezy.
<elkbuntu> yep
<white> !info cacti gutsy
<ubotu> cacti: Frontend to rrdtool for monitoring systems and services. In component universe, is extra. Version 0.8.6j-1 (gutsy), package size 936 kB, installed size 3612 kB
<Fujitsu> So we no longer support it at all. Good, good.
<white> elkbuntu: you want to sync cacti from sid :)
<white> !info egroupware gutsy
<ubotu> egroupware: web-based groupware suite. In component universe, is optional. Version 1.2.106-2.dfsg-3 (gutsy), package size 6 kB, installed size 40 kB
<jmg> i like this
<white> elkbuntu: same about egroupware
<jmg> Winbind - resolves hostnames
<Fujitsu> !info cacti sid
<ubotu> cacti: Frontend to rrdtool for monitoring systems and services. In component main, is extra. Version 0.8.6j-1.1 (sid), package size 941 kB, installed size 3612 kB
<Fujitsu> !info egroupware sid
<ubotu> egroupware: web-based groupware suite. In component main, is optional. Version 1.2.107-2.dfsg-1 (sid), package size 6 kB, installed size 40 kB
<white> Fujitsu: don't you trust your communication device?
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: Don't you maintain egroupware?
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: no
<white> Fujitsu: petere does
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: Hm... I thought you did for some reasons.
<Fujitsu> -s
<ajmitch> jmg: tui is crap
<ajmitch> hey jsgotangco 
<jsgotangco> hi
<jmg> ajmitch: you're crap.
<Hobbsee> hi spam
<Fujitsu> white: Bug #130434, #130350
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 130434 in egroupware "[Sync request]  Sync egroupware (1.2.107-2.dfsg-1) from Debian unstable (main)" [Low,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/130434
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 130350 in cacti "Please sync cacti (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/130350
<white> Fujitsu: nice, I am just forwarding all sec-related stuff here :)
* jsgotangco is drained after his trip
<ajmitch> jmg: that's really helpful
<jmg> ajmitch: so's insulting beer
<ajmitch> it's crap beer that students drink
* Hobbsee --> class
<white> Hobbsee: enjoy
<jmg> you're crap beer that students drink
<Hobbsee> i'd prefer to go home :P
<ajmitch> it's like calling fosters or budweiser 'beer'
<jmg> all right
<white> !info kdegraphics gutsy
<ubotu> kdegraphics: graphics apps from the official KDE release. In component universe, is optional. Version 4:3.5.7-1ubuntu3 (gutsy), package size 22 kB, installed size 64 kB
<white> that is another candidate
<white> !info koffiice gutsy
<ubotu> Package koffiice does not exist in gutsy
<white> !info koffice gutsy
<ubotu> koffice: KDE Office Suite. In component main, is optional. Version 1:1.6.3-0ubuntu3 (gutsy), package size 25 kB, installed size 76 kB
<LaserJock> ajmitch: you around?
<white> and koffice
<ajmitch> LaserJock: somewhat
<LaserJock> ajmitch: it's generally considered bad form to hijack somebody's package in Debian isn't it?
<white> LaserJock: yes
<ajmitch> LaserJock: generally, yes
<ajmitch> why?
<white> LaserJock: what are you looking at?
<LaserJock> well, a guy I know just sent debian-mentors a RFS for a new upstream release for my package
<ScottK> It just occured to me to wonder if Michael Dell has read the Automatix report ...
<white> LaserJock: which package?
<LaserJock> it seemed, slightly ... bad form?
<ajmitch> LaserJock: probably just someone not knowing the procedures - a sponsor should check that & tell him that it's bad
<LaserJock> white: gausssum
<ajmitch> I prefer to assume ignorance rather than malice :)
<white> hmm did not arrive here yet
<LaserJock> I'd like to move the package to team maintained
<LaserJock> but he keeps doing stuff like that
<white> LaserJock: can you write that in an answer to the list?
<LaserJock> he NMU'd the package a while back
<white> and yes he should have asked you beforehand
<RAOF> nixternal: The answer to your question as "asoundconf-gtk", etc.  I didn't see anyone else reply.
<pschulz01> Greetings.. how do I create a 'debug or developers' package the same time I build a 'user' package?
<pschulz01> The rules file has a 'make' and a 'make install' target, but I would like to do these separeatly (with a make clean in between) for each of the <package> and <package>-dev.
<pschulz01> or <package>-debug
<StevenK> Damn it doko, stop uploading gc{c,j}-4.2!
<LaserJock> white: my guess is maybe the email is in moderation, I'm not subscribed to debian-mentors anymore either
<ajmitch> pschulz01: any reason to build multiple times?
<LaserJock> maybe I'll reply to him privately first
<pschulz01> ajmitch: Libraries - with and without debug symbols, 
<ajmitch> pschulz01: man dh_strip
<pschulz01> ajmitch: .. or should the policy be.. build everything and then split things out in packages as required?
<RAOF> pschulz01: Generally, packages will create all their binaries with a single run, then use dh_install & dh_strip to move the files to the right place and strip the debug symbols (into a dbgsym package)
<LaserJock> grrr, that sneaky ...
<pschulz01> ajmitch: RAOF I am (partly) asking the question on behalf of someone else.. 
<LaserJock> his NMU added himself as Uploader:
<LaserJock> so now he's listed as co-maintainer
<pschulz01> <pschulz01> Greetings.. how do I create a 'debug or developers' package the same time I build a 'user' package?
<pschulz01> <pschulz01> The rules file has a 'make' and a 'make install' target, but I would like to do these separeatly (with a make clean in between) for each of the <package> and <package>-dev.
<pschulz01> <pschulz01> or <package>-debug
<Fujitsu> LaserJock: Oh, lovely.
<pschulz01> mithro: Was that what you were after?
<ajmitch> pschulz01: sorry, got called away
<pschulz01> <RAOF> pschulz01: Generally, packages will create all their binaries with a single run, then use dh_install & dh_strip to move the files to the right place and strip the debug symbols (into a dbgsym package)
<LaserJock> Fujitsu: it's a little irritating, is what it is
<ajmitch> as RAOF said
<Fujitsu> Sneaky, irritating, and most impolite.
<RAOF> pschulz01: Um, what are you doing?  I saw your question, *and* my response to it :)
<pschulz01> RAOF: (sorry) just repeating for mithro.
<mithro> pschulz01: yes, kind of
<LaserJock> Fujitsu: I suppose I could have a new version uploaded with him removed ;-)
<Fujitsu> LaserJock: Has his already been uploaded?
<pschulz01> mithro: Is it possible to build everything in one 'make'?
<ajmitch> pschulz01: it can even be done simply with cdbs
<LaserJock> Fujitsu: yes
<Fujitsu> ... why!?
<Fujitsu> Shouldn't a sponsor see that it's wrong?
<ajmitch> LaserJock: give me a source package, I'll upload a new one for you after work
<LaserJock> Fujitsu: well, we are in a team together
<LaserJock> and so I think our sponsor kinda overlooked it or something
<mithro> pschulz01: it's a "python" application, you don't need to build binaries, you just run "python setup.py install --prefix=<blah>"
<LaserJock> but I'm still Maintainer:
<LaserJock> so it would have been nice to at least let me know
<ajmitch> LaserJock: so it's unofficially team-maintained?
<pschulz01> mithro: What's the difference between the 'developer' and the 'install'
<LaserJock> ajmitch: yes
<pschulz01> mithro: versions
<LaserJock> ajmitch: long story is, I took over the ITP from him because he couldn't get it done, once I got it in he's been all over it
<white> LaserJock: well, he did a few things in the past (according to changelog) so it might be hard to see for a sponsor
<mithro> pschulz01: I think you are confused, there is a "stable" and a "development" version - which come from totally different source tarballs
<LaserJock> I was going to move Maintainer: to the team once we figured out what we wanted to do
<ajmitch> LaserJock: I love debian politics
<LaserJock> but now I'm a little ... irritated
<white> if the other versions got uploaded
<ajmitch> mithro: right, so the question as asked earlier can be ignored, and you want 2 source packages
<white> !info gausssum sid
<ubotu> gausssum: parse and display Gaussian, GAMESS, and etc's output. In component main, is optional. Version 2.1.0-1 (sid), package size 186 kB, installed size 652 kB
<pschulz01> ajmitch: RAOF Sorry.. my misunderstanding.. we return you to your regular broadcast.
<ajmitch> mithro: though having it that way is a bit strange on the part of upstream
<LaserJock> white: the sponsor is in our team, it *should* have been sort of ok
<white> LaserJock: then he already uploaded version on his own (or merged changelog entries, which is evil)
<pschulz01> ajmitch: Although I did learn something.
<LaserJock> white: yes, he had a NMU that set himself as Uploader: and now wants a sponsor to upload a new upstream version
<white> WTF?
<white> 2.0.5-1~dev was not marked as a NMU
<LaserJock> he emailed our team list a few days ago saying the new upstream release was ready
<LaserJock> but hasn't really given our sponsor time to get too it
<LaserJock> so I'm not sure why debian-mentors was involved
<white> LaserJock: are you saying that he uploaded a NMU, which he did not indicate as one?
<white> LaserJock: when i look into the debian/changelog, i see this version upload 2.0.5-1~dev
<white> and it just says new upstream release
<white> so i assume that he already did a MU by himself (via sponsor)
<mithro> how does one handle the fact that they are both the same "program", just different branches?
<LaserJock> white: if you look at http://packages.qa.debian.org/g/gausssum/news/20070701T231702Z.html only the last one was uploaded
<LaserJock> so he made the Uploader change in a changelog entry before
<white> WTF
<LaserJock> but it wasn't uploaded until gausssum (2.1.0-1)
<white> well i would expect a sponsor to pick it up though
<LaserJock> yes, well, the sponsor is the lead for our team and LI is in the team
<LaserJock> and has been working on the package
<white> so the lead of your team made him an uploader? or who sponsored it?
<white> <- confused
<LaserJock> the team lead sponsored it
<white> well then i feel it is somehow ok
<white> (although the changelog entries should have been merged into one)
<LaserJock> well, it was until LI decides to do a RFS on debian-mentors for a package he never asked me to be Uploader on ;-)
<white> LaserJock: well, but the lead of your team agreed on him as being uploader and overruled you or?
<xtknight> i'm trying to fix Bug 130031.  gutsy has all the dependencies listed on striim's site.  what's the next step?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 130031 in Ubuntu "[needs-packaging]  Striim" [Wishlist,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/130031
<LaserJock> I think he overlooked it, or it wasn't a big deal
<LaserJock> I wouldn't have minded either, except for this latest thing
<xtknight> (the striim source tarball has no debian directory)
<LaserJock> it's irritating to me to have him RFS on debian-mentors when we already have a sponsor and he didn't even ask before hand
<white> i still don't get the whole thing
<RAOF> xtknight: dh_make and friends?
<white> LaserJock: you are listed as maintainer, so it is *only* your call
<RAOF> xtknight: Looks like that's ready to be hit with the packaging guide.
<xtknight> RAOF, ahh i see that
<xtknight> RAOF, wish me luck ;)
<RAOF> xtknight: Good luck :P
* xtknight bows down like a brave warrior
* RAOF wonders why people on UF want a "driver manager".  Is there some huge class of devices for which we don't ship drivers?
<xtknight> well what would a driver manager even do?
<xtknight> i suppose you could change drivers, but that sounds like it's interfering with the kernel a bit
<white> LaserJock: i wrote an answer and asked him on-list
<RAOF> xtknight: I don't know.  I really don't know what the people of that thread are thinking.
<RAOF> xtknight: I am intrigued, though :)
<LaserJock> white: do you see my PM?
<xtknight> RAOF,  in windows that's just the way they do things.  they d/l a driver in a zip, right click their device and select the driver thru an install cmd.  but on ubuntu everything is in command line wrt drivers.  besides all instructions on the web are command line.
<xtknight> so it doesnt make much sense to me
<xtknight> now an NDISwrapper manager, maybe
<xtknight> a restricted drivers-like interface for that..
<xtknight> besides the fact everyone hates ndiswrapper, it allows a user to actually use his network card, soo... ;)
<RAOF> Or even just extending restricted manager to handle that, like it does fwcutter.
<xtknight> ah i didn't even know fwcutter had a frontend
<RAOF> Restricted manager is a frontend for it now, I think.
<xtknight> i was working on something that would detect device compatibility between windows and linux, but i sort of lost interest in it.  there's not much point
<RAOF> Not a bad idea.
<joejaxx> ajmitch: may i pm you?
<xtknight> besides this, stuff like ndiswrapper support couldnt be detected reliably.  including device IDs for proprietary drivers could be a pain
<ajmitch> joejaxx: if you're bored, sure
<xtknight> if they want to know of driver support, all they have to do is boot up the livecd honesly
<LaserJock> ajmitch: is it ok to umm, clean up a changelog after it's already been uploaded?
<LaserJock> this package has a few intermediate changelog entries that never actually got uploaded, it's a bit confusing
<Fujitsu> Playing with previous entries is generally regarded as a Bad Thing.
<LaserJock> alright, that's sort of what I thought :/
<LaserJock> weird
<LaserJock> he's even got an changelog entry for an identical version to one of mine
<Fujitsu> Is the changelog of his new version radically different from the previous one?
<LaserJock> no
<LaserJock> the problem is that the problem changelog is from the previous upload
<LaserJock> Fujitsu: check out http://packages.debian.org/changelogs/pool/main/g/gausssum/current/changelog
<xtknight> do contributers count as authors?
<xtknight> in a debian/copyright file
<LaserJock> Fujitsu: 2.0.4-1 (LI's version) and 2.0.5-1~dev were never upload
<LaserJock> Fujitsu: but I *did* upload a 2.0.4-1
<LaserJock> what a mess
<Fujitsu> Oh, ew.
<Fujitsu> That ~dev should be UNRELEASED, and they should really be in order... and sponsors should check that.
<RAOF> xtknight: It doesn't hurt to add them, and I think you should.
<xtknight> RAOF, probably not translators though, or those also?
<LaserJock> and see, his 2.0.4-1 changelog has him added as Uploader, but another person in our team who isn't the maintainer ;-)
<LaserJock> s/but/by/
<Fujitsu> Yeah, that's wrong.
<RAOF> xtknight: AFAIK the general principle is "better safe than sorry".  It's less effort to just list everyone than it is to get rejected by a reviewer, or an archive admin.
<Fujitsu> It may be sort of team maintained, but a team isn't set as the maintainer.
<LaserJock> Fujitsu: no, we were waiting until we figured out exactly what we wanted to do
<LaserJock> but now ... I'm not sure how it's going to work out
<ScottK> xtknight: It is absoutely essential that all licenses in the package be listed in debian/copyright.  Minor contributors need not be.  Minor is a squishy concept, so better safe than sorry.
<LaserJock> I kinda need to be able to trust my teammates, you know
<Fujitsu> LaserJock: Yeah, just a bit.
<Fujitsu> They should at least talk to you and not hijack things.
<LaserJock> what the heck
<LaserJock> I guess I should've paid more attention to what they were doing
<LaserJock> they moved install manpages and menu to <package>.*
<LaserJock> but there's only one binary package so that just makes debian/ look cluttered
<Fujitsu> That's really not NMU material.
<LaserJock> it wasn't *meant* as a NMU
<Fujitsu> But it was.
<Fujitsu> But it w/win 11
<Fujitsu> *was
<LaserJock> it was meant as a hijack, IMO, although that's maybe a bit harsh
<Fujitsu> True.
<Q-FUNK> goooooooooooooooooooooooooood mooooooooooooooorning MOTU land!
<LaserJock> hello to you too Q-FUNK 
<ScottK> On that note, good night all.
<Q-FUNK> 'night ScottK
<LaserJock> ajmitch: are you available
<ajmitch> soon, just finishing stuff at work
<LaserJock> I need to head to bed, if I send you a package can you upload it for me?
<ajmitch> LaserJock: ok
<ajmitch> time to walk home, back later
<LaserJock> grr
<LaserJock> they change my python-central to python-support
<LaserJock> for goodness sakes
<Fujitsu> Fun fun fun.
<Fujitsu> Yay, I'm up to 6th in the AM-assignment queue.
<afflux> g'morning
<afflux> could some motu please archive http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=6283 ? thanks
<coNP> May I ask some core-dev to sponsor Hungarian spell checker magyarispell (http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=6332)?
<Q-FUNK> how do I unsubscribe an Also Affects that was invalidated?  I keep on getting copies of whatever is added to the bug.
<Fujitsu> Q-FUNK: You complain to LP people to implement a feature to delete it, or reassign the task to some junk project.
<Q-FUNK> ah
<Amaranth> so that's why wow-pro gets so many bugs :)
<Fujitsu> Amaranth: ?
<Amaranth> " reassign the task to some junk project"
<geser> ScottK: the turbogears patch in the Ubuntu package is filed as Debian bug #433192
<ubotu> Debian bug 433192 in python-turbogears "python-turbogears: Wrong imports for ElementTree if running with python2.5" [Normal,Open]  http://bugs.debian.org/433192
<geser> it should be obsolete with the new upstream version
<geser> I've filed a wishlist bug for it already (Debian bug #434443)
<ubotu> Debian bug 434443 in python-turbogears "python-turbogears: New upstream version: turbogears 1.0.3.2" [Wishlist,Open]  http://bugs.debian.org/434443
<geser> as would like to see the new version in gutsy so I'll proabably update the Ubuntu package on the next weekend to get it in before UVF
<DarkSun88> Hi
<geser> Hi DarkSun88
<DarkSun88> Hi geser 
<DarkSun88> Thanks for upload.
<ScottK> geser: Thanks.
<ScottK> I'll see if I can get an upload through Debian Python Modules Team.
<ScottK> geser: On packages managed in DPMT, please ping me and I'll try and get stuff done.
<xxxxx1> good morning
<geser> Hey Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> hiya geser 
<xxxxx1> morning Hobbsee :)
<Hobbsee> evening
<Kmos> bug 130618
<xxxxx1> ;D
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 130618 in cups-pdf "Please sync cups-pdf (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/130618
<Kmos> this is a good reason to ask for a sync ?
<Kmos> it's confirmed and subcribed to U-A
<xxxxx1> Kmos, the sync guy :D
<xxxxx1> heh
<Kmos> xxxxx1: that's no by me!
<Hobbsee> xxxxx1: that is *not* the reputation you want to give out.
<Kmos> check it
<Hobbsee> xxxxx1: we dont want him to attempt to sync the world, repeatedly
<xxxxx1> :)
<Hobbsee> Q-FUNK: ping
<xxxxx1> Kmos, you're brazilian?
<Hobbsee> Kmos: that bug is wrong.  he hasnt had that sponsored, he's not a MOUT
<Hobbsee> * MOTU
<Q-FUNK> Hobbsee: ?
<Hobbsee> Q-FUNK: did you become a MOTU without anyone noticing?
<Kmos> xxxxx1: portuguese :)
<Kmos> born at germany :p
<Q-FUNK> Hobbsee: no, why do you ask?
<Hobbsee> Q-FUNK: explain to me https://launchpad.net/bugs/130618 then please
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 130618 in cups-pdf "Please sync cups-pdf (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,Confirmed]  
<Kmos> Hobbsee: that's why I talk here about that
<Q-FUNK> Hobbsee: what is there to explain?
<Hobbsee> Q-FUNK: you need to specify with -s to get sponsorship.
<Q-FUNK> Hobbsee: having that stated in the man page would help.  oh wait, having a man page for the tool would even be better.
<Hobbsee> Q-FUNK: you are not a MOTU, you need sponsorship for everything you upload, and for all sync requests, removal requests, etc.
<Hobbsee> Q-FUNK: this is true.  there is documentation on it, on the wiki.
<StevenK> Hrm. Do I care enough to run help2man over requestsync? Not so much.
<Hobbsee> Q-FUNK: it would be most helpful for you to provide a patch ofr it, then
<StevenK> I might care tomorrow.
<Hobbsee> StevenK: the -n and -s on requestsync with no arguments are not explained at all, btw
<Q-FUNK> Hobbsee: --help doesn't tell much and there is no man page.  fix it instead of demanding explanations.
<StevenK> Hobbsee: Hrm? Parse error.
<Kmos> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SyncRequestProcess
<Hobbsee> Usage: requestsync [-n|-s]  <source package> <target release> [basever] 
<Hobbsee> In some cases, the base version (fork point from Debian) cannot be determined
<Hobbsee> automatically, and you'll get a complete Debian changelog. Specify the correct
<Hobbsee> base version in that case.
<Kmos> it's all here
<Hobbsee> StevenK: you never specify what -n and -s actually do
<ScottK> Q-FUNK: The sync process is clear on the wiki.
<StevenK> Hobbsee: It's help output, it doesn't have to.
<Hobbsee> StevenK: then it probably should have a manpage
<Q-FUNK> StevenK: either this has a good and usefull --help output, or it has a man page.
<StevenK> Q-FUNK, Kmos, Hobbsee: I'm writing a manual page for requestsync.
<Q-FUNK> good :)
<Q-FUNK> that's at least an improvement
* StevenK bashes his head against his desk.
* Hobbsee wonders how people *find* requestsync if they dont read that sync request process document
<StevenK> What do you want for nothing?
<Kmos> StevenK: that's nice
<Q-FUNK> rubber biscuits?
<elkbuntu> StevenK, a double strength iced coffee would be nice. thanks for offering :D
<Hobbsee> most of those will require main sponsors anyway
* coNP requires at least one now :)
<Kmos> Hobbsee: bug 128634 -> i've the debdiff for stunnel4 attached there
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 128634 in crywrap "[Remove]  Please remove crywrap from Gutsy" [Undecided,Invalid]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/128634
<geser> Kmos: please check the next time if the package is in main or universe and subscribe the right sponsors time instead of always u-u-s
<Hobbsee> Q-FUNK: to be honest, i would have expected that you'd checked one of the bugs real output, just to check that it was working for you, as a non-MOTU.
<Hobbsee> rather than filing a whole bunch of them
<Q-FUNK> Hobbsee: it does work.  the bug gets filed.
<Kmos> geser: sorry.. 
<Hobbsee> Q-FUNK: but the sponsors dont get assigned.  those scripts are mostly done for MOTU's and core devs, and sometimes need changing for sponsorships.
<Hobbsee> er, but the sponsors dont get added correctly
<Hobbsee> which is why it's often a good idea to actually check the script, and the output
<Hobbsee> incidently, this is also useful for debian-specific scripts.
<Q-FUNK> Hobbsee: you're complaining to the wrong person.  just add usefull --help output and help StevenK complete his man page, then get it released in time for Gutsy.  that's gonna a LOT more towards fixing the issue than routinely doing your offended diva number.
* Hobbsee sighs
<Hobbsee> i love it when people utterly and totally miss the point.
<Kmos> Hobbsee :) 
<ScottK> Q-FUNK: OTOH, working out of process in bulk and never checking how the script was working for you isn't so great either.
<Hobbsee> on that basis though, you can find another core dev and MOTU to sponsor those changes.
* coNP whispers: maybe it would be easier to not assume you are a core-dev or MOTU. 
<Hobbsee> coNP: this is true.  but then it's a pain for all the MOTU's.  hence, providing an option for the non-catered for group is useful.
<coNP> (Because the people, who should use a switch are those, know what they want to do. And you can assume core-devs and MOTUs know what they want to do, which you should not assume from everyone)
<Fujitsu> coNP: take it as an incentive to become a MOTU :P
* coNP has filed a request. Now waits for 12 days :)
<Hobbsee> coNP: wow, which bug?
<Hobbsee> sync run was only done a copule of days ago, i thought
<ScottK> His MOTU application.
<Hobbsee> oh right
<Hobbsee> thought you meant a sync request
<coNP> Hobbsee: you mean where I need core-devs? Or my MOTU application?
* ScottK notes that a track record of care and attention to detail is a good thing for a MOTU candidate to have.  
<Hobbsee> coNP: no - i thought you were talking about that you'd made a sync request, and that it hadnt been dealt with in 12 days
<coNP> No, I have made it during the WE. I guess I'll bug someone next Monday if it does not gets done till then.
<coNP> ScottK: sorry, I don't see, what you mean. I have certain difficulties in English...
<geser> Kmos: are you going to also file a remove request for gnotepad+-help? It's uninstallable now
<Hobbsee> geser: there's already one, i ack'd it.
<Hobbsee> geser: or else i'm going insane :)
<Hobbsee> coNP: i think he means, as a general comment, it's good for MOTU candidates to not be making mistakes, especially trivial ones, and that paying attention to the little details will be useful in that
<ScottK> coNP: Not directed at you.
<ScottK> What Hobbsee said.
<Hobbsee> ScottK: yeah, i didnt think it could be, seeing as coNP seems sane ;)
<coNP> Cool, thank you both. I was asking indeed, if it has been directed at me...
<Hobbsee> coNP: i think it was more a "and while we're on the subjects of MOTU candidates..."
<geser> Hobbsee: ah, I see now what happened: the bug for gnotepad+-help was duped to the one for gnotepad+ but only gnotepad+ got removed
<Hobbsee> geser: i wonder why, they're different sources
<geser> I've opened a bug task on the acked one for gnotepad+-help, hope this is enough to get it removed
<ScottK> geser: Did you un-dupe it?
<Hobbsee> geser: would have thought the unduping would be enough, tbh
<geser> no, see bug #128637 now
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 128637 in gnotepad+ "[Remove]  Please remove gnotepad+ from Gutsy" [Wishlist,Fix released]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/128637
<geser> this way all the history is there
<ScottK> I think un-duping with a comment about why would be easier and sufficient.
<Hobbsee> meh
* Hobbsee marked that as triaged
<Hobbsee> either should work
<Hobbsee> ScottK: just that i'ts going to cause more bugmail, etc
<ScottK> OK.
<Hobbsee> ScottK: i guess if they get confused or something, they'd poke on irc
<ScottK> That or find something less confusing to work on.
<Hobbsee> indeed
* Hobbsee ponders working on fixing all the MOTU documentation up.
<Hobbsee> (some more)
<Hobbsee> then again, i guess there's only any point when people read it
<Kmos> geser & Hobbsee: thanks
<Kmos> bug 128634 -> i've the debdiff for stunnel4 attached there, so after new update of stunnel4 this bug can be triaged
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 128634 in crywrap "[Remove]  Please remove crywrap from Gutsy" [Undecided,Invalid]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/128634
<norsetto> Good time of the day, everybody
<Hobbsee> hiya norsetto 
<ScottK> DarkSun88: Why did you invalid your python-sqlite sync?
<DarkSun88> Because the changes are not in Debian
<ScottK> I don't understand what you mean by that?
<elmargol> do i have to rename a source directory to lowercase?
<DarkSun88> In Ubuntu changes there is bump version of python-central, debhelper and python-all-dev
<StevenK> Q-FUNK, Kmos: New devscripts uploaded to Gutsy, now with a shiny manual page for requestsync.
<DarkSun88> ScottK: In Ubuntu changes there is bump version of python-central, debhelper and python-all-dev
<Q-FUNK> hurray for StevenK!
<DarkSun88> ScottK: Add python-all-dbg in field Build-Depends.
<ScottK> Ah.  I see.
<DarkSun88> ScottK: Debian has python-all-dbg in field Build-Depends but not bump version of debhelper,python-all-dev and python-central
<DarkSun88> So, it's not a sync.
<ScottK> Then ask yourself are they really necessary?
<ScottK> I don't know.
<ScottK> Just because there is an Ubuntu diff, doesn't mean it's a useful one.
<DarkSun88> I know.
<ScottK> If you can answer the question: "It is safe sync over the Ubuntu changes because ..." then it may well be a good sync.
<DarkSun88> I want to be sure.
<ScottK> Agreed.
<DarkSun88> Thanks :)
<Kmos> StevenK: nice.. thanks!
<geser> snort (universe) FTBFS because html.sty is missing. It's in latex2html (multiverse). Does somebody see an other option except disabling the documentation?
<StevenK> Demotion of snort
<Kmos> geser: there isn't a new version of it on debian qa ?
<geser> Kmos: that's the last version from experimental
<Kmos> :-(
<geser> StevenK: I would like to avoid that
* ScottK notes that StevenK has now been bit by Bug 130220 see the last two comments in Bug #78165 for details.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 130220 in launchpad "LP marks bugs fix released multiple times and sends multiple mails when a bug number appears in more than one .changes file" [High,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/130220
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 78165 in devscripts "debuild fails to use seahorse-agent or gpg-agent" [Medium,Fix released]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/78165
<Kmos> report it to maintainer.. stfl maintainer has done a new revision, removing CFLAGS
<elkbuntu> hey guys, if only 7.28% of people who had a problem with ubuntu *failed* to file a bug report, that would be a fair increase on the current, right?
<Hobbsee> any idea of latex2html actually needs to be in multiverse?
<Hobbsee> elkbuntu: uh, yeah
<StevenK> ScottK: Damn it, I uploaded devscripts about 20 minutes ago.
<geser> Hobbsee: it's in Debian non-free
<ScottK> StevenK: I was subscribed to the old bug and got the bonus bugmail.  
<StevenK> ScottK: Ah, I see why. I think I meant to take out that (LP: #) and forgot.
<StevenK> ScottK: Sorry for the spam.
<ScottK> Yeah, but you shouldn't have to.
<ScottK> Not your fault.
<ScottK> StevenK: I blame a buggy proprietary application of some name.
<ScottK> The good news is it's fixed in the next release.
<StevenK> Of course you do, you always do. :-P
<elkbuntu> Hobbsee, right, then automatix should count themselves exceptionally lucky then
<ScottK> I don't ALWAYS blame LP for stuff, just when it's at fault.
<ScottK> Not that that's a rare occurence.
<Kmos> Hobbsee: latex2html doesn't say anything on offical homepage about license
<Kmos> Some portions of this package are published under the
<Kmos> GNU public license. These are clearly marked in the header.
<Kmos> http://saftsack.fs.uni-bayreuth.de/~latex2ht/user/LICENSE
<StevenK> "Some portions" that doesn't mean all
<Kmos> yep
<Kmos> :)
<StevenK> And latex2html has been in multiverse since warty.
* StevenK closes a few bugs against kino.
<geser> I'll open a bug for the snort FTBFS in Debian as this is AFAIK also a bug there (missing build-depends)
<hendrixski> umm, what's the name of that program that brings up the password box when I need to sign things (like while running debuild -S)?
<ScottK> pinentry
<ScottK> There are different flavors (-gtk2, qt, curses_
<ScottK> err. curses)
<ScottK> hendrixski: You also need to have gpg-agent installed and enabled (use-agent in gpg.conf for the user).
<hendrixski> ScottK, right...  yeah, I accidentally deleted my /home/ directory (forgot to unmount it when deleting a chroot) so I have to reconfigure all those things and I totally forgot the names...
<_MMA_> Can anyone tell me if someone is working on getting this into the repos? Mumble: http://mumble.sourceforge.net
<elmargol> can someone test a package for me on pbuilder? i don't have enough disk space to setup :(
<_MMA_> All I find is bug 129081 So I'm guessing my answer is no.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 129081 in Ubuntu "Mumble needs packaging" [Wishlist,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/129081
<Hobbsee> _MMA_: if it's not set as in progress
<_MMA_> Hobbsee: Naa... Just "Confirmed". Maybe I can get one of my guys to do it.
<_MMA_> Hobbsee: If it can be synced do I have to talk to a motu or can a "motu in training" do it?
<ScottK> _MMA_: Synced from where?
<_MMA_> Debian.
<_MMA_> ScottK: I couldnt find it there. I'm just assuming. Might not be there.
<_MMA_> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=429988
<ubotu> Debian bug 429988 in wnpp "ITP: mumble -- Voice chat client" [Wishlist,Open]  
<ScottK> That would mean someone is likely working on it.
<ScottK> You might e-mail the person who filed the ITP and see how close they are.
<_MMA_> Ok.
<ScottK> It's maybe too late to get something uploaded to Debian, through Debian NEW, and then sync'ed into Ubuntu before the Universe new package freeze.
<ScottK> You might invite them to work with you to get an upload to Ubuntu first if they are close.
<_MMA_> Thats my only worry. Ill email them now.
<norsetto> _MMA_: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-motu/2007-July/001996.html is this the same guy?
<_MMA_> norsetto: No. Doesnt look like it.
<_MMA_> "Grkan Sengn" Is on the Debian one.
<_MMA_> But he just submitted it. I'm not sure that means he's working on it.
<norsetto> _MMA_: don't think he is
<_MMA_> Too bad we cant get the GetDeb guys more in-line with helping here. They have a package there. :(
<elmargol> can someone please sync the revu keyring?
<elmargol> can someone help me please? I tried to upload a new package to revu. Where can I see if it was successfully uploaded?
<elmargol> dput says that it worked
<peebrain> elmargol: http://revu.tauware.de/
<ScottK> But it takes seveal minutes for it to show up usually.
<elmargol> if the keyring is not synced it will be rejected right?
<ScottK> Yes.
<Hobbsee> !info gcj-4.2 gutsy
<ubotu> gcj-4.2: The GNU compiler for Java(TM). In component main, is optional. Version 4.2.1-1ubuntu1j1 (gutsy), package size 2703 kB, installed size 5968 kB
<elmargol> should i use pbuilder or sbuild
<ScottK> elmargol: Whatever works for you.  I use pbuilder.  With the scripts at http://revu.tauware.de/~laserjock/ it's very easy to set up.
<StevenK> Hah, that's cute.
<StevenK> "Never underestimate the power of somebody with source code, a text editor, and the willingness to totally hose their system."
<ScottK> I like that.
<mohammad> ScottK: hello, thank you for advocating my package :)
<ScottK> You're welcome.
<ScottK> I've been waiting for Persia to show up and see if he would review it, but I haven't seen him.
<ScottK> mohammad: I know it's been a lot of work.  I hope you can see that the package is improved by it.
<StevenK> That's a bad loop.
<StevenK> bmm starts swimming, and doesn't stop until the weather turns back. He could be swimming for weeks!
<StevenK> s/back/bad/
<ScottK> That or painful if he's not in an ocean.
<StevenK> ScottK: Tumble turns? :-)
<mohammad> I have one advocate for http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=6329, and I am looking for another one. that's a Quran study tool. If you are interested, would you please take a look
<elmargol> how big is pbuilder?
<StevenK> Installed-Size: 460
<elmargol> is this the minimal size?
<StevenK> It's 460KB once unpacked.
<elmargol> no i mean the build env
<StevenK> That's a different story, and it usually is roughly 70 to 80 MB per base tarball.
<elmargol> ok thx
<keescook> Fujitsu: tcpdump> yeah, I made a mistake in the version #
<keescook> joejaxx: apparmor> sure, what's up?
<ScottK> keescook: Speaking of apparmor...  If cupsys can't find the init for apparmor, is that a cupsys problem or an apparmor problem?
<ScottK> It seems I don't have one on my Gutsy box.
<keescook> ScottK: I haven't dug around to see how pitti implemented the apparmor profile for cupsys yet.  if you need the apparmor init script, the "apparmor" package should include it.
<ScottK> OK.  I'll file a bug then.
<ScottK> I'll put both packages on it and let you two sort it out.
<keescook> ScottK: sounds right to me.  :)
<ScottK> keescook: Looks like there is an existing cupsys bug on it.
<keescook> ScottK: cool, which is it so I can check on it later today?
<ScottK> Sorry, already closed the browser window.  I'll dig it up again, but it'll take a minute.
<ScottK> keescook: Bug #130014
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 130014 in cupsys "[Gutsy]  Unable to upgrade or reinstall cupsys after trying to upgrade" [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/130014
<keescook> ScottK: sweet, thanks
<elmargol> Can someone review my .postinst please?
<elmargol> https://gnunet.org/svn/GNUnet/debian/gnunet-daemon.postinst
<elmargol> Adding the user seems to be problematic
<ScottK> elmargol: On Ubuntu, /var/run is a tempfs, so you can't assume that a directory exists either for postinst or for init.
<elmargol> oh interesting
<ScottK> elmargol: For the user addition, I'd suggest grabbing the clamav source package and look it it.  It works.
<geser> ScottK: it should be safe to assume it in the postinst as it's created by the package and you seldom reboot between unpack and configure
<ScottK> geser: Should be, but isn't.
<ScottK> I've gotten clamav bugs on it.
<geser> how can a /var/run dir vanish between unpack and configure?
<geser> aborted installation and running dpkg --configure -a?
<ScottK> geser: I have no idea, but it did and it's a cheap test.
<broonie> geser: Attempt to install. Fail to configure due to missing dep or whatever.
<broonie> Then reboot while fixing it up.
<geser> ok
<broonie> Or loose power during an upgrade.
<geser> dpkg-reconfigure would be an other possibility
<broonie> Kill dpkg at the wrong moment.
<ScottK> Hmmm
<geser> ok, checking for the dir should be added then
<ScottK> Clamav is one of the packages that Automatix installs, so kill dpkg at the wrong moment is a VERY good possibility.
<elmargol> Doesn't clamav detect automatic as virus? :D
<ScottK> It is a virus scanner, yes.
<elkbuntu> ha. if only
<broonie> elkbuntu: It'd be easy to make it do so...
<elkbuntu> broonie, please. I'll bring the popcorn.
<StevenK> Oooh, why don't we get clamav to Conflict against the automatix package?
<zorglu_> q. i run autogen.sh in a project, and it create a lot of files, COPYING etc... is there a command to remove all the file which has been created ? or should i all remove them by hand ?
<elkbuntu> StevenK, sounds good, but i'd prefer it built into clamav. it'd make more sense to people then ;)
<elmargol> zorglu_: dpkg-source -tc should work
<ScottK> Well we could patch it.
<elmargol> has gutsy a new compresion for debs?
<zorglu_> elmargol: anyother possibility ? :) i dont have the package working yet 
<elmargol> zorglu_: use a cvs system like git or bazaar
<zorglu_> elmargol: ok so i have to remove them by hand, ok :)
<ScottK> zorglu_: dh_clean?
<elmargol> somehow I'm downloading debs faster than my connection is...
<ScottK> zorglu_: I know little about autogen, so don't assume I'm right.
<zorglu_> ScottK: im learning it :)
<zorglu_> utomake: src/Makefile.am: not supported: source file `mylib1/dir1/mylib1_1.c' is in subdirectory <- inside a MAkefile.am, is it possible to point to a source which is a subdirectory. apparetnly it throw me an error
<broonie> zorglu_: Have a Makefile.am per directory.
<zorglu_> broonie: nothing execpt that ? i mean i got a LOT of directory and putting a Makefile.am in each of them is not really an option
<zorglu_> else i could work it around by doing a first pass with symlink on a single directory
<zorglu_> and replacing / by _ or something 
<elmargol> is it ok to have # comments on a template file?
<broonie> zorglu_: Are you sure you want to use automake?
<zorglu_> broonie: honnestly, if you have any alternative, i am a taker :)
<broonie> This source has no upstream build environment at all?
<zorglu_> broonie: without using the gnu stuff, i have to make all the cross compilation script myself and this start to be hard
<zorglu_> broonie: i am the one coding the 'upstream' :) currently this is a old makefile made by hand which is more than 3000line long... not that i am proud of that. so i look for alternative :)
<zorglu_> broonie: i am more a coder trying to make a package, that a packager trying to package a code :)
<keescook> hunh.  snort 2.7.0 failed on i386 but not amd64 due to latex issue?  weird.
<broonie> zorglu_: Hrm. In that case using auto* is probably reasonable but your life will probably be easier if you do what it wants rather than trying to work around it - it's got some definite ideas about how things should look.
<geser> keescook: fixed already, snort waits to be build
<zorglu_> broonie: well currently im trying on a 'small corner'. i have to avoid any 'polution' of my code just to get autotool running :) so i will do the symlnk workaround. thanks for your help, i may have other silly question along the way  :)
<keescook> geser: okay, cool.
<broonie> zorglu_: You could probably autogenerate the recursive Makefile.ams.
<elmargol> W: gnunet-daemon: maintainer-script-hides-init-failure prerm:9 <- what does this mean?
<geser> run linda/lintian with -i and you should get an informative text
<zorglu_> broonie: i just counted, i got 1595 directories :) i think you may understand better why i dont want 1595 makefiles :)
<elmargol> I search a tool to debug manpages.
<elmargol> W: gnunet-client: manpage-has-errors-from-man usr/share/man/man1/gnunet-stats.1.gz 42: warning [p 1, 9.2i] : cannot adjust line
<Amaranth> zorglu_: why the heck do you have that many? :/
<zorglu_> Amaranth: well it is a large c++ project and i like to have different objects in differents directories. there are like 10apps + 42 library inside the project. depending on like 10 external libraries :)
<Amaranth> zorglu_: wow how long does that take to compile?
<zorglu_> Amaranth: not that much... the whole stuff is like 310kline. maybe 25min for a native linux target
<zorglu_> with no optimisation and dynmic linking
<hendrixski> umm... after setting up pinentry, gnupg, all that.. I still can't run debuild -S
<hendrixski> it tells me gpg-agent command get_passphrase failed:operation canceled... then it can't sign anything :-(
<hendrixski> I have "use-agent" in ~/.gnupg/gpg.conf   what am i missing?
<superm1> hendrixski, are you perhaps hitting bug 78165 ?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 78165 in devscripts "debuild fails to use seahorse-agent or gpg-agent" [Medium,Fix released]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/78165
<superm1> if so, there is a work around listed in the bug for feisty
<hendrixski> superm1, I'll take a look at it and see if that's what I'm hitting
<elmargol> where can I specifiy the gpgkey to use? I'm bored of using -k
<hendrixski> superm1, yup... disabling caching on seahorse made it prompt me for the passphrase.
<superm1> hendrixski, that wasn't the work around i was referring to, but that works too i guess :)
<superm1> for me i think it was unsetting the clearing of  DISPLAY in /etc/devscripts.conf or something to that effect
<hendrixski> right, I should do that as well I guess
<hendrixski> debuild -S is supposed to produce a .deb right?
<superm1> Nope
<superm1> er ya
<superm1> it should a signed deb
<superm1> debuild -sa produces a  source package
* superm1 queries the man page 
<superm1> the -S is indeed for source package.  I always do -S -sa, so i seem to have forgotten :)
<superm1> so if you want to produce a deb, just do it with -b 
<hendrixski> ah, Ok
<Amaranth> -sa is to include the original source
<Amaranth> in the .changes file
* hendrixski was having hell with build-dependencies not loading in pbuilder... needs to get debuild working
<hendrixski> superm1, you maintain the mythtv debs, right?
<superm1> hendrixski, yes
<hendrixski> superm1, so have you run into that problem, where pbuilder just doesn't handle mythtv-frontend?
<superm1> "doesn't handle"?  I wouldn't say so
<hendrixski> hhmmm... because I gave myself the challenge of packaging torrentocracy to better learn this stuff... and I mimicked the dependencies from mythtvplugins.. but pbuilder would always crash before getting any work done.. myth-database would not connect to sockets or something and I wan't able to get a package out of pbuilder :-(
<superm1> hendrixski, come join #ubuntu-mythtv and we can chat a bit about it
<hendrixski> oh. there's a channel for this... awesome
<ScottK> hendrixski: You can also download the gutsy devscripts source package and just copy the debuild script over.
<ScottK> Then your agent should work.
<zorglu_> q. in my configure.ac, i got quite a long AC_CONFIG_FILES aka all my submakefile. is there a way to tell him "follows all the SUBDIRS you find in the first Makefile" instead ?
<coNP> You generate your Makefile with configure.ac, aren't you?
<zorglu_> coNP: yep. but i got like 50 makefiles. so i would like to avoid to get the whole list in the configure.ac
<zorglu_> coNP: if i understand the "SUBDIRS" variable in Makefile.am, it is possible for it to do the recursion automatically, no ?
<jrib> If I export from svn to create the orig.tar.gz, should the get-orig-source rule in debian/rules specify the same revision that I am using to create my deb or should it just fetch HEAD?
<jrib> the exmaple at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/CommonPackagingMistakes/ChangingTheOrigTarball specifies a date but http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-source.html#s-debianrules says "most recent version" so I'm not sure
<ScottK> jrib: I'd follow the Debian policy manual.
<jrib> thanks
<norsetto> /norsetto felt for a moment very alone
<blueyed> I've uploaded a package to revu two days ago, before the keyring was synced probably. But the package does not appear anywhere and I cannot get a password by "recover" to login.
<zorglu_> Makefile.in seems to ignore the --datarootdir setting <- i got a lot of those when doing ./configure . any idea where it might come from ?
<blueyed> However, the file exists already, I cannot dput it again.
<zorglu_> datarootdir = @datarootdir@ <- nevermind, i just found a workaround, adding this in all Makefile.am
<jrib> blueyed: tried passing -f to dput?
<blueyed> jrib: just now, but the same error "Cannot create file". It talks about using dcut, should I try this?
<jrib> blueyed: idk, maybe wait for someone that's more familiar with revu to be around
<blueyed> ok. Do I need to have a successful upload before password "recovery" is supposed to work?
<jmg> good news - lenovo to sell laptops preloaded with lunix
<jmg> bad news - it's SuSE
<desertc> There's plenty of support contracts to go around.
<calc> jmg: overall news, lenovo systems will be tested against linux... good news
<calc> even if its SuSE its better than not testing against linux at all :)
<jmg> lolol
<jmg> M.Dell rolls automatix
<pygi> jmg, ergh?
<jmg> http://www.dell.com/content/topics/global.aspx/corp/biographies/en/msd_computers?c=us&l=en
<jmg> Automatix2
<pygi> ah, I know that
<jmg> so
<jmg> here's a question
<jmg> we all hate automatix
<jmg> so why cant we make something like automatix that doesnt suck?
<pygi> easyubuntu?
<jmg> yeah
<pygi> that exists =)
<jmg> okay, why doesnt it have mind share?
<pygi> dont ask me
<pygi> http://easyubuntu.freecontrib.org/
<yamal> t
<Hattory> can i "talk" about personal repositories there? 
<calc> evand: normally people set up a w.u.c page as well with info on what they have done and their future plans, but with your amount of merges you may be ok without it
#ubuntu-motu 2007-08-07
<tgm4883> would it be possible for someone to sync the revu keyring
<coNP> it would
<coNP> you have to ask a REVU admin for that I guess
<tgm4883> ah
<zul> afternoon
<mtaylor> so how do I assign the bug to myself and set it to "in progress"? if I'm prepping a new package? 
<coNP> mtaylor: why do you need that?
<coNP> You can of course file a bug "include <sg> in ubuntu", set it "in progress" and assign to yourself, this does not mean that your package will be automatically accepted, though.
<mtaylor> coNP: sure. I'm just trying to walk through the steps on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing
<coNP> mtaylor: that is in section "Preparing Patches" that is for bugfixes
<coNP> Applies not for new packages IMO
<mtaylor> it's in the "Preparing New Packages" section too... but I'm happy to skip it if I don't need it. 
<coNP> That is for packages requested.
<coNP> But you can file it so that it can be seen that someone is working on that.
<coNP> On the other hand it might be useful to ask someone to confirm it.
<mtaylor> coNP: and so I put Ubuntu MOTU as Maintainer if I'm going to upload to REVU? 
<mtaylor> or, Ubuntu MOTU Developers <ubuntu-motu@lists.ubuntu.com>, rather, right? then how does GPG know who to sign the package as? 
<ajmitch> it gets that from the changelog entry
<mtaylor> huh. well I'll be. no NMU complaining message :)
<coNP> You will _always_ get NMU complaining messages :)
<coNP> And unknown distribution errors as well.
<coNP> From REVU at least
<mtaylor> coNP: ok. fair enough. 
<mtaylor> coNP: If I've got the package in a PPA, can I just use that URL and ask for comments? 
<mtaylor> or should I still use REVU
<coNP> I guess the wiki pages say REVU, but mostly depends on your sponsors / mentors.
<mtaylor> ok. thanks
<mtaylor> when I'm running debuild -S, what determines whether it's going to include the orig tarball in the upload? 
<geser> the -sa option
<mtaylor> geser: thanks!
<mtaylor> so, revu.tauware.de doesn't seem to be so responsive... 
<dothebart> *roflamo* http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wwLrgxtALWs
<coNP> mtaylor: I can confirm :(
<mtaylor> so, not to be a broken record, but not I'm just curious - what screen in launchpad do I need to go to so I can assign a bug to myself and mark it "in progress" ? 
<mtaylor> nevermind
<mtaylor> I found it.
<mtaylor> it was not obvious to me that I should click the triangle to get to that info, when there are links on the left... 
<mtaylor> anybody feel like reviewing a package for me? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/130740
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 130740 in Ubuntu "[needs-packaging]  mysql-proxy" [Wishlist,In progress]  
<mtaylor> ha. look at that. :)
<ScottK> mtaylor: It'd be a lot easier for me to give it a quick review if it was on REVU.  Sorry, no time for a detailed look now.
<mtaylor> ScottK: thanks... trying to upload to REVU as well, but it doesn't seem to be so healthy - no rush in any case
<ScottK> OK.
<geser> mtaylor: wrong version number: the first upload to Ubuntu should have 0.6.0-0ubuntu1
<mtaylor> aha! 
<mtaylor> that's why it didn't want to make an orig.tar.gz upload.
<geser> and as the license is GPL-2 only, link to the version one (/usr/share/common-licenses/GPL-2)
<geser> that should be unrelated
<mtaylor> geser: should I re-version number stuff, or should I just know that for next time? 
<geser> I'm not sure if ppa will accept an upload with an lower version number
<mtaylor> yeah - I don't think it will - but I think it's getting a delete button RSN 
<mtaylor> I'll fix it for the REVU upload
<bmm> If the COPYRIGHT file doesn't mention some of the authors in the source, I should still mention them in the debian/copyright file, right?
<geser> for the next time: use something like 0.6.0-0ubuntu1~ppa1 which is always smaller 0.6.0-0ubuntu1 but you can increase the number after the ppa
<mtaylor> will do
<geser> bmm: right, a wrong COPYRIGHT file is no excuse to omit them also in debian/copyright
<bmm> geser: though so, but wanted to make sure before compiling the whole list ;-) Thanks!
<mtaylor> geser: is there anyone we should ping about REVU being down? 
<geser> mtaylor: I guess siretart, but he is sleeping now. Try to reach him during the european day.
<mtaylor> k will do
<bmm> Is the debian/copyright file UTF-8? (or, what to do with special characters?)
<Fujitsu> bmm: It should be UTF-8, yes.
<bmm> Fujitsu: thanks! couldn't find it in the policy, so I'm glad you could awnser it :-) Thanks again.
<bddebian> Heya gang
<Fujitsu> Hi bddebian.
<bddebian> Hi Fujitsu
* StevenK waves
<bddebian> Heya StevenK
<bddebian> I see you've taken over? :-)
<RAOF> Hey bddebian!  Review xserver-xgl! :)
<StevenK> bddebian: Taken over ... ?
<bddebian> StevenK: I'm kidding.  I see that you are pretty active! :-)
<bddebian> RAOF: Oh yeah, sure :-)
<StevenK> bddebian: Fairly. :-)
<StevenK> Unless bddebian is kidding, that is so the first time that RAOF's suggestion of reviewing has worked.
<bddebian> heh
<bddebian> I think I'm going to have to re-learn everything :'-(
* ..[topic/#ubuntu-motu:Fujitsu] : Ubuntu Masters of the Universe: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU | Want to get involved with the MOTUs? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing | http://ubuntu.joejaxx.org/ - TOP 10 Uploaders/Packages | REVU down until some time Wednesday (UTC-5)
<jetsaredi1> how do I find out what packages depend on a given package?
<ScottK> apt-cache rdepends packagname
<ScottK> IIRC that just gives you the direct dependencies.
<RAOF> bddebian: Are you serious?
<RAOF> That would be cool if you were :)
<bddebian> About what, re-learning everything?
<RAOF> No, about xgl.
<bddebian> I'm not sure I even feel qualified atm :-(
<RAOF> :(
<StevenK> Heh. RAOF looses again.
<StevenK> loses, even
<RAOF> I'm going to have to apply for MOTU in order to actually adopt xgl, aren't I?
<ScottK> bddebian: You NEVER feel qualified.
<bddebian> Sure, why not RAOF? :_)
<ScottK> That's no excuse not to review his package.
<StevenK> RAOF: You mean, Fujitsu, Hobbsee and I haven't convinced you to apply yet?
<bddebian> ScottK: Probably because I'm not :-)
<ScottK> Never stopped you before.
<RAOF> StevenK: Oh, no.  I do intend to apply.  This will just force me to move up my schedule :)
<StevenK> Heh
<StevenK> You have "apply for -dev" and "apply for -core-dev" on a calendar somewhere? :-)
<RAOF> Heh.
<bddebian> Hmm, REVU is down?
<superm1> appears so.
<StevenK> bddebian: /topic ; Fujitsu even set it while you were here.
<bddebian> Yeah yeah, I know
<bddebian> RAOF: I guess your hosted then :-)
<bddebian> Err hosed even
<RAOF> bddebian: Nah, xserver-xgl is a bzr branch on LP.
<bddebian> bzr, pfft
<RAOF> And, if push comes to shove, on cooperteam.net
<RAOF> There is no escape!
<bddebian> Sure there is
<bddebian> Uhm, cooperteam.net just has .debs
<RAOF> bddebian: Yeah, but if LP went down I'd push my xgl tree there.
<ScottK> bzr push, bzr shove?
<ScottK> Well I'm all the way up to the code is a poorly thought out mess, but it works.
<StevenK> I don't think bzr likes getting shoved.
<ScottK> Now to make it look like I thought about it before I threw it together.
<ScottK> StevenK: Don't ask me, ask RAOF.  He was talking about bzr and pushing and shoving.
* bddebian shoves bzr off a cliff
* ajmitch sighs
<bddebian> :-)
<bddebian> Missed me didn't ya? :)
* Fujitsu kicks whoever installed the new network infrastructure in the new rooms.
* Fujitsu doesn't like thye switches doing crazy things and flooding the network with 40000 UDP packets per second.
<Fujitsu> s/y//
<ScottK> Sounds like an opportunity to exercise your iptables foo.
<Fujitsu> I started Wireshark to see what was causing all the traffic, and it took about 3 seconds to eat all my RAM :(
<ajmitch> bddebian: I did?
<ScottK> Sounds like time for tcpdump then.
<bddebian> ajmitch: Of course you did :-)
<ajmitch> nasty, tracker is back on my system
* ajmitch removes with a vengeance
<Fujitsu> Heh, ubuntu-desktop depends now, doesn't it?
<ajmitch> I hope it only recommends
<Fujitsu> So do I, but you never know.
<ajmitch> I like my laptop to be usable, thanks
<Fujitsu> Is it really that bad?
<ajmitch> not quite that bad, but it does thrash the disk a bit
* ajmitch will see if it indexes the disk before I leave work today
<Fujitsu> How does it compare to Beagle?
<Fujitsu> Presumably it eats a bit less RAM.
<ajmitch> sure, which is why I don't run beagle on there either :)
<ajmitch> hm, I guess I won't get f-spot 0.4.0 in before tribe 4 freeze
<ajmitch> oh well
<Fujitsu> What's new in it?
<ajmitch> addins
<Fujitsu> Is it a bit more sane?
<ajmitch> new query stuff
<ajmitch> I haven't really tested it
<Fujitsu> I was hoping it wouldn't be so "nyahahah all your photos are MINE!"
<ajmitch> I doubt it's going to change its design quite like that
<Fujitsu> Darn.
<ajmitch> though it should be able to keep its catalogue without copying all the photos 
<ajmitch> one of the main things though is plugging in a camera & photos are copied
<Fujitsu> Why would they remove the need for copying it? That would be efficient and make sense.
<TheMuso> Whats LVM currently like in gutsy?
<Fujitsu> I've been using it fine since the start.
<RAOF> TheMuso: It works?
<RAOF> TheMuso: All my systems use it.
<TheMuso> Ok.
<TheMuso> I won't be using it for any data critical stuff yet.
<Fujitsu> Even snapshots, unlike for some of Feisty.
<TheMuso> heh cool.
<RAOF> Yay!  Compiz-git is now broken on Ubuntu!  Finally, people will need to use an actual release!
<bddebian> heh
<RAOF> Please, can we make sure that a libxcb-enabled libx11 doesn't make it into gutsy?  It'd be awesome to break the community's git addiction :)
<Fujitsu> Haha.
<RAOF> Also: "nesl247)) Releases are as useful as git code. It's the same thing as git code, except it's a checkout of a certain date and time"
<Fujitsu> -headdesk-
* RAOF is *pretty* sure they're a Gentoo user :)
<ajmitch> RAOF: is it?
<ajmitch> RAOF: I *just* upgraded my laptop (it was about 6 weeks out of date) and compiz still works
<Fujitsu> 6 weeks? Ouch.
<ajmitch> yeah, about 1400 packages
<RAOF> ajmitch: Yes.  Compiz HEAD now requires libx11-xcb to build.
<Fujitsu> Heh.
<RAOF> ajmitch: Oh, no.  Our *packages* work, 'cause they're now based off an actual *release* :)
<ajmitch> took most of the morning to just install them & restart apt-get/aptitude several times
* ScottK shakes his fist at calc.
<ScottK> Still no OOO in Gutsy in Kubuntu....
<ajmitch> ScottK: good to get opinions on motu applications
* ajmitch is trying to catch up, as you may have seen :)
* StevenK chuckles.
<ScottK> Screaming to sabdfl for help after his important packages had been left unreviewed for a whole 3 hours is going to take me a while to get over.
<ajmitch> haha
<bddebian> hehe
<ScottK> I made sure I had the dates and times in my logs to back me up before I sent that one too.
* ajmitch needs to get an ubuntu sticker for the laptop
* ScottK notes the new kernel downloading and hopes for his CPU fan to start working again with this one.
* ScottK is getting tired of running the laptop sitting on a bag of ice water.
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: Have you not ordered a batch of CDs in the past 14 months?
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: I mean a small one
<Fujitsu> Oh, those.
<justinwray> ScottK: What kind of laptop/CPU?
<Fujitsu> There is a NZ distributor now, AFAIK.
<ajmitch> I already have a larger ubuntu sticker on the lid to cover the shame of the acer logo
<ajmitch> there has been an NZ distributor for awhile
<Fujitsu> Heh.
<ScottK> justinwray: Ancient Dell Latitude L400
<justinwray> ajmitch: Whats wrong with Acer?
<ScottK> Fan works on Feisty, not on Gutsy.
<Fujitsu> I cut out the logo from one of the larger ones to stick over the Dell cirlce.
<Fujitsu> *circle
<ajmitch> justinwray: just ask mjg59 about acer & acpi
<justinwray> ScottK: I'll check my stock pile, I have some old dell laptops around.  I'll see if I can find a working headsink.  If you want?
<ScottK> It's OK.  It's a kernel bug.
<ScottK> The fan is fine, just doens't get turned on.
<justinwray> Ah, I missed that part...
<ScottK> When I swap back to my Feisty hard drive, no troubles.
<justinwray> Was only half paying attention, I saw you say you were running on a bag of ice.
<ScottK> No problem.
<justinwray> ajmitch: Well, it might not be the best with acpi, but things are getting better.  But for the price, they are damn good.  I got a UK version of the 5000 series.  With the Atheros chipset.
<ScottK> Actually I have enough parts to assemble at least one or two more L400's here.
<justinwray> LOL
<ScottK> I've been buying them up on ebay because I really like the form factor.
<ajmitch> hey jsgotangco 
<ScottK> My wife and I both use one.
<jsgotangco> hi!
* Fujitsu bows.
<bddebian> Heya jsgotangco
<ajmitch> bddebian: good thing you're back to tackle the bug mountain & the broken packages
<bddebian> Yeah, good thing :-)
<RAOF> Deluge.  Because changelogs are for wusses.
<RAOF> Why must the software I care about have unhelpful upstreams?
<StevenK> RAOF: Because they hate you. Only you. It's all about you, after all ... :-P
<RAOF> I'm sure *some* upstreams are good.  Why not mine?
<RAOF> :P-
<ScottK> Because they know you?
<bddebian> heh, nice group :-)
<desertc__> Anyone from Tennessee?
<desertc__> oops, mt
<nixternal> I hear Kenny Chesney and Peyton Manning are
<Nergar> hello
<Nergar> anyone know why jedit isn't in the repositories?
<TheMuso> Either it hasn't been packaged yet, or it has not yet been s ynced from Debian.
<TheMuso> Nergar: DO you know if it is in Debian?
<Nergar> idk
<TheMuso> Ok, I'll have a look.
<TheMuso> Ok its not in Debian either.
<TheMuso> I would advise filing a package request bug.
<Nergar> in debian?
<Nergar> or launchpad?
<TheMuso> Launchpad is fine, but if you would like to see it in Debian, filing it with Debian would be preferable.
<Burgundavia> I would do both
<Burgundavia> you can link the debian bug report from the LP one
<Nergar> i can't believe such a powerful programing tool isn't included in either one
<RAOF> No one likes java ;)
<Burgundavia> java had serious freedom issues until recently
<white> !info xpdf gutsy
<ubotu> xpdf: Portable Document Format (PDF) suite. In component universe, is optional. Version 3.02-1ubuntu1 (gutsy), package size 1 kB, installed size 36 kB
<white> !info xpdf sid
<ubotu> xpdf: Portable Document Format (PDF) suite. In component main, is optional. Version 3.02-1 (sid), package size 1 kB, installed size 36 kB
<white> there is an NMU coming into sid. You might want to check, if the patch is included in the gutsy version and if not sync :)
<siretart> morning
<siretart> oh, revu down :(
<white> siretart: good afternoon :)
<siretart> hey white!
<coNP> morgen siretart 
<siretart> hallo coNP  :)
<ajmitch> hi siretart 
<siretart> hey ajmitch 
<\sh> moins siretart, ajmitch
<ajmitch> hi \sh 
<DarkSun88> Hi all
<pygi> hello folks
<RAOF> Hey
<tedp> There is a new version of ccontrol in Debian (arrived a couple of days ago) that could be pulled into Ubuntu. Doing so would probably fix Ubuntu bug #109157.
<StevenK> bug 109157
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 109157 in ccontrol "ccontrol SEGVs on startup" [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/109157
<RainCT> Hi
<norsetto> Hi world!/n
<Hobbsee> hiya
<RainCT> could a U-U-S look at #108742 please?
<Hobbsee> bug 108742
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 108742 in acidrip "no icon in kde menu" [Wishlist,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/108742
<norsetto> Hobbsee: anything to keep me busy today?
<Hobbsee> oh, that one
<Hobbsee> norsetto: hmmm.  not off the top of my head.  i'm not really in the loop at the moment
<norsetto> Hobbsee: sure
<Hobbsee> and of course, people like Q-FUNK make me feel less motivated to do anything in MOTU.
<Hobbsee> norsetto: apt-cache unmet -i | grep Package tends to be a good start
<RainCT> (it's waiting since like 15 days.. for me it's no problem, but the debdiff is from a new guy and I think it's more motivating if it gets accepted soon :P)
<Hobbsee> if you're wanting to fix unmet deps
<Hobbsee> RainCT: someone has to know what the correct stuff is, though
* ajmitch hopes that his box will actually reboot correctly
<Q-FUNK> Hobbsee: was this meant to be a smart comment?  you're one regularly throwing a tantrum here.  
<RainCT> Hobbsee: what do you mean?
<StevenK> ...
<ajmitch> oh dear
<Hobbsee> RainCT: as in, someone has to know the patch is correct, before uploading it
<Hobbsee> Q-FUNK: tantrum?  sorry, i cant define telling people to get their act in gear, and not file mass bugs that are wrong a tantrum.  unless there's a new definition of tantrum which means "a person telling someone else what they do not want to hear"
<RainCT> Hobbsee: of course. you could test it ;P
<Q-FUNK> Hobbsee: you keep on acting like an offended diva.  grow up.
<Hobbsee> RainCT: this is true.  i may do that
<RainCT> :)
<ajmitch> Q-FUNK: I suggest you stop with the offensive comments now
<Q-FUNK> ajmitch: I will when she does, sorry.
<StevenK> That's about as childish as, "She started it!"
<StevenK> Q-FUNK: Please take your own advice.
* Hobbsee sighs
<Q-FUNK> *sigh*
<Q-FUNK> whatever, folks.
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: can you be the person who next has a go at the people who submit incorrect bugs, particularly multiple ones of them?
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: then you can see what they'll come up to call you :)
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: sure, though the CC may have a few complaints about me
<Hobbsee> er, come up with
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: heh :)
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: i'm really starting to wonder if people are going to get offended at being told that what they're filing is incorrect, no matter who does it.  perhaps we set up a rotating roster, of people who enlighten people who's bugs are wrong.  or just mark them as invalid, silently.
* norsetto ponders if the 3 bugs he subscribed u-u-s to could be considered "file mass bugs that are wrong"
<StevenK> 3 bugs makes not a mass bug filing
<Q-FUNK> Hobbsee: it's not in telling people if they missed a procedure. it's int he way you do it that is not acceptable.
* norsetto relaxes and takes the hockey mask down ......
<Hobbsee> norsetto: of course, it helps if they're right, too :)
<Hobbsee> Q-FUNK: possibly.  i think i've been to work too much.
* Hobbsee makes a note to talk around the bush to them instead, not telling them that they've screwed up, not telling them to think about what they're doing...
<StevenK> Hobbsee: "sugar-coat"
* Hobbsee appears to come from a different planet, where people are expected to look and read and think a little.  help is given to those who have done so.
<Hobbsee> StevenK: that's the one.
* ajmitch waits for X to go insane on the laptop again
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: feel like examining https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xserver-xgl/+bug/126255 please?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 126255 in xserver-xgl "FTBFS" [Undecided,Confirmed]  
<ajmitch> I managed to login, have a desktop, and then X died & wouldn't restart without a reboot...
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: impressive!
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: no I don't, I'm trying to upgrade stuff on my box & will reboot soon (hopefully) :)
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: darn :)
* Hobbsee works her way thru the u-u-s queue a bit
<ajmitch> you can't get me to look at xgl that easily
<Hobbsee> hah
* ajmitch guesses that the RAID will need a resync once the box is started
<ajmitch> assuming it boots that far
<Q-FUNK> there's a world of difference between *demanding* explanations versus pointing an issue out.
<ajmitch> my goodness
<ajmitch> it mounted the root filesystem without having to wait 10 minutes & run lvm by hand!
<StevenK> ajmitch: *gasp*
<ajmitch> probably the first time for ~6 months :)
<Hobbsee> Q-FUNK: this is true.  call it the toned down reaction of "what the hell do you think you're doing?"
<Hobbsee> and "why do you think you suddenly get to skip the processes?"
<Q-FUNK> self-righteous.  again.
* Hobbsee ponders this scheme48 bug
<Q-FUNK> Hobbsee: your attitude is unproductive.
<ajmitch> Q-FUNK: calling someone self-righteous rarely helps the matter
<coNP> Hey, Hobbsee, speaking of the u-u-s queue, to bug 130364. I did a gutsy pbuilder build as well that worked fine. Only FYI, no pushing intended :)
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 130364 in tilda "Please sync tilda (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/130364
<Q-FUNK> ajmitch: please drop it.
<Hobbsee> Q-FUNK: granted.  will attempt to improve it.  
<Hobbsee> Q-FUNK: but please, read the docs and such before you do large amounts of stuff, again.
<Hobbsee> aw darn, kmos isnt around
<Hobbsee> while we were on the subject, i was going to tell him that he was doing a great job
<TheMuso> heh
<desertc__> YOU GUYS ROCK.  Thank you for your help.
<Hobbsee> Q-FUNK: the self righteous offended diva will ignore your stuff from now on.  happy?
* TheMuso pitches in with uus.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: great :)
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: i dont suppose you'd be interested in that xgl, or some of the other bugs lingering there?
<Q-FUNK> Hobbsee: sad to see it go that far, but fair enough.
<\sh> how nice...ubuntu linux on dell comes to europe
<Q-FUNK> bug 130648
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: I'll just work from bottom upwards for the moment.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 130648 in devscripts "requestsync: guess whether sponsor is requested automatically" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/130648
<coNP> Okay, then I bug TheMuso as well with MyFavouritePetBug :)
* norsetto is glad he is not the only one to make silly typing mistakes
<Q-FUNK> it's not the silver bullet, but it would help a lot if this were implemented.
<Hobbsee> Q-FUNK: unfortunately, membership gives the ubuntu.com address, not MOTU.
<Hobbsee> so detecting by ubuntu.com address wouldnt help - you'd really need a DB of all the public keys of the MOTU's, and to compare it that way.  which is rather unfeasible.
* ajmitch should expire as both motu & member soonish
<Hobbsee> Likewise, if someone needs sponsorship, it implies that the bug should NOT be marked as Confirmed automatically in the syn request message's body.
<Hobbsee> ^ already happens
<Q-FUNK> Hobbsee: yes, pitti already pointed that out.  still, members would already know a lot more about the correct procedures than outsiders.
<coNP> Don't we have some remote LP interfaces?
<Hobbsee> coNP: gpg signed mail? yes
<coNP> E.g. bughelper uses somethign like thes.
<coNP> Not thiniking of gpg signed mails :)
<Hobbsee> Q-FUNK: btw, there is a manpage there now.  or will be, after the freeze.  unsure
<Hobbsee> coNP: oh, there's text modes, iirc
<Q-FUNK> Hobbsee: yes, I recall seeing that here last night.
<coNP> Just that you could be able to fetch the members of a group
* ajmitch watches his battery life die due to tracker evils
<ajmitch> coNP: yes, that's possible - slightly slow though
<coNP> Okay you don't file sync requests all the time.
<ajmitch> eg https://launchpad.net/~motu/+rdf
<coNP> At least you shouldn't :)
<StevenK> Hobbsee: It was built and published last night.
<StevenK> Hobbsee: (devscripts with requestsync manual page)
<Hobbsee> coNP: particularly as MOTU gets bigger, that gets longer.  syncing the keyring for revu takes 10-15 minutes. i  dont remember which
<Hobbsee> StevenK: neat!
<Hobbsee> Q-FUNK: there you go then.
<ajmitch> coNP: most of that is due to gpg taking a long time
<ajmitch> s/conP/hobbsee/
<Q-FUNK> Hobbsee: here, i just "fixed" the issue by making an alias where requestsync is really 'requestsync -s' but this might not be so obvious to any random debian or ubuntu user who just means well by reporting a newer package.
<coNP> That is okay. But for having a look at some format of https://launchpad.net/~motu/+rdf should be done in some seconds.
<coNP> That could be feasible with requestsync, IMHO.
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: true that
<coNP> The version of Q-FUNK seems very reasonable for me. For those, who know they are MOTUs, can unalias.
* ajmitch hopes that the new motu-uvf team gets put in place soon
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: the votes were done, so...
<ajmitch> but dholbach is on holiday
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: i'm assuming it'll wait till dholbach gets back, unless someone pushes it
<ajmitch> and he's the only group admin
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: LP guys probably wouldnt say no to giving someone else admin rights
<ajmitch> so the rest of us can get kicked off the team
<ajmitch> (about time, too)
<Hobbsee> (they didtn for irc, where Seveas took a sabatical)
<Hobbsee> heh :)
* ajmitch kills trackerd & sees the expected battery life gain some time
<TheMuso> ajmitch: Sounds lovely. CPU hog I assume.
<ajmitch> TheMuso: at least it runs niced so it doesn't put the cpu at full speed
<ajmitch> but it hits the disk a lot
<TheMuso> Right.
<Hobbsee> coNP: btw, when you make uploads which add patches, could you add the name of the patch into the changelog each time?  (i'm looking at tilda)
* coNP does
* ajmitch would love to upload this new f-spot
<coNP> It is a shame, I did not :)
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: you can.  it'll sit in the queue, though
<Hobbsee> coNP: :)
<ajmitch> I can
<Hobbsee> coNP: yeah, i thought you usually did
<ajmitch> but it still segfaults mono on exit
<coNP> Hobbsee: yeah, this is an old of mine. Actually I wonder why that got uploaded. I did a bugfix without using the patch system.
<Hobbsee> lp #63098
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 63098 in tilda "Tilda segfaults if hotkeys are not prefixed (eventually with "None+")" [Medium,Fix released]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/63098
<coNP> Yes, this is the debdiff that should not have been even accepted :)
<Hobbsee> heh
<Hobbsee> oh well.
<coNP> Hobbsee: now this is fixed in Debian.
* Hobbsee ack's the sync, still being unable to tell if all the changes are actually there :)
<Hobbsee> coNP: yeah, that's waht i'd guessed from the debian bug
<coNP> Hobbsee: the tilda in Ubuntu now is seriously broken.
<coNP> The Debian is good. :)
<Hobbsee> oh dear
<coNP> Has the patches, and only the patches that are needed.
<Hobbsee> yep
<ajmitch> shame, f-spot doesn't have facebook or myspace export support yet :)
* TheMuso is working on telepathy-gabble
<coNP> ajmitch: and picasaweb is br0ken as well :(
<TheMuso> Just waiting for it to build.
<ajmitch> coNP: I have 0.4.0
<coNP> ajmitch: yes, it has also broken. At least upstream tgz without patches.
<Hobbsee> darn.  i'll actually have to touch some of Q-FUNK's bugs, to get the bugs here down.
<ajmitch> not that I have a picasaweb account to test with
* ajmitch only has flickr
<coNP> It is easy to get once you have a gmail account
<ajmitch> probably is
<coNP> It is some gnome-keyring crash BTW.
* ajmitch should test it out
* Hobbsee wonders if there's any point requesting a sync for something that's only relibtoolised.
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: I'd say not, as its only for building the package.
<ajmitch> coNP: running on a standard ubuntu desktop, not kubuntu or xubuntu?
<TheMuso> afaik it doesn't affect the deb.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: that's what i thought - we'd normally relibtoolise while building.
<TheMuso> Yup.
<coNP> ajmitch: more-or-less standard. Ubuntu-desktop, a few KDE packages and Xubuntu is almost completly installed as well.
<Hobbsee> even with the new autoconf and automake
<ajmitch> coNP: I'm able to upload (just setup the picasaweb account)
<coNP> ajmitch: 0.4.0?
<ajmitch> yes
<coNP> I might have ruined my gnome-keyring.
<coNP> It does not work.
<ajmitch> most importantly, the gnome keyring daemon is running in my session
<ajmitch> I have no patches against 0.4.0 except some minor makefile changes
* ajmitch is testing by uploading old uds photos
<Q-FUNK> Hobbsee: :D
<Hobbsee> Q-FUNK: oh, only a couple.  which got rejected.
<Q-FUNK> Hobbsee: that happens.
<Hobbsee> Q-FUNK: sync requests getting rejected?  true.
<Hobbsee> it's annoying, though
<Q-FUNK> sometimes.
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: gah you beat me to it.
<Q-FUNK> some syncs are mostly nice-to-have, while others will actually result in user cringing over not getting the latest of their pet package.
<TheMuso> I said I was doing telepathy-gabble
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: oh, sorry!
<ajmitch> bad Hobbsee 
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: it clearly didtn penetrate my brain enough
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: Obviously.
<Hobbsee> Q-FUNK: indeed.  one hopes that the people requesting sponsorship learn which category an arbitary sync fits into, too.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: again, apologies :(
<TheMuso> Anybody doingn griffith?
<TheMuso> If not, its mine.
<Q-FUNK> Hobbsee: *sigh*  there you go again...
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: it looks fine.  i'm currently writing a sync-acker.
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: Ok.
<Hobbsee> which i wsa thinking of testing on that, but any arbitary bug will do
<Hobbsee> or, attempting to
<TheMuso> upgrade-system is mine if nobody else has it.
<geser> where is the right place to ask about ubuntuforums? I wanted to register the same nick as I use on LP and IRC and failed
<Hobbsee> geser: #ubuntuforums
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: Did you end up doing griffith?
<TheMuso> as its still in the queue.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: just sending it now
* Hobbsee is trying otu the mail interface
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: Ok.
<Hobbsee> my python is terrible, so...
* TheMuso grabs turkey if nobody else has it.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: go for it.  i'ts a SRU
<TheMuso> oh
<Hobbsee> oh, wai
<Hobbsee> t
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: my bad.  i cant read tongiht
* Hobbsee grabs graveman
<Hobbsee> morning Kmos 
<Kmos> Hobbsee: hi! morning :)
<Hobbsee> :)
<Kmos> Hobbsee: you got some time to check the stunnel4 debdiff ?
<Hobbsee> oh neat, malone by email works
<TheMuso> norsetto: re turkey, is there a reason why you bumped the standards version?
<norsetto> TheMuso: beside making it up to date, no
* Hobbsee --> dinner
<TheMuso> norsetto: Ok.
<TheMuso> c
<TheMuso> ugh
* TheMuso waits for turkey's build-deps to download.
<norsetto> TheMuso: if you think that is bad, try mail-notify .....
<white> Hobbsee: /join debian.au
<TheMuso> white: She's at dinner.
<white> TheMuso: it was more a way to say that there is a new debian.au channel on #oftc :)
<TheMuso> oh ok.
<RainCT> what is $@ in bash?
<TheMuso> RainCT: All command-line arguments.
<RainCT> same as $* ?
<TheMuso> Not sure.
<norsetto> IIRC $@ and $* differs in between double-quotes
<Yagisan> yay. my new box is almost fully operational
* Yagisan waves
<Nafallo> Yagisan: LTNS
<StevenK> $* is "$@"
<RainCT> ok thx
<Yagisan> Nafallo, !
<Yagisan> Nafallo, it is mate.
<StevenK> Yagisan: Almost?
<Nafallo> Yagisan: :-)
<Yagisan> StevenK, well I had to sneakernet a new kernel over for the tribe3 cd, as I had no networking
<StevenK> Heh
<Yagisan> I'm in a vesa mode now
<Yagisan> as my 8500GT isn't recodniged
<StevenK> That's what you get for running Gutsy. :-P
<Yagisan> as judging by the size of the fontds
<Yagisan> I'm 1024x768 or less
<Yagisan> but but
<Yagisan> fesity won't get net drivers for me
<RainCT> norsetto: what do you mean?
<Yagisan> U already saw the bug report
<Yagisan> gah
<Yagisan> son heling me type
<StevenK> I see that.
<StevenK> He seems to have a handle on Shift and Backspace already
<Yagisan> my pc is silent now. :D
<StevenK> I've had a silent PC for months and months. :-)
<Yagisan> I went down to MSY
<norsetto> RainCT: I only remember that they behaved differently in that case, don't remember why and how though, StevenK said $* is "$@"
<Yagisan> the ultimo store. Been there yet StevenK ?
<Yagisan> dumb question time. this is my first smp system, so is one cpu supposed to hog all the interrupts ?
<norsetto> RaintCT: this link might help http://tldp.org/LDP/abs/html/internalvariables.html#ARGLIST ($* -> All of the positional parameters, seen as a single word)
<norsetto> RainCT:  $@Same as $*, but each parameter is a quoted string, that is, the parameters are passed on intact, without interpretation or expansion.
<\sh> Yagisan: depends..without a running irqbalance cpu 0 (means the 1st cpu) will catch all irqs (so all IO is going through cpu0)
<Yagisan> g'day \sh - haven't seen you in a very long time
<\sh> Yagisan: just sitting here and rant sometimes ,->
<Yagisan> hmm. that must not be a part of the standard install
<Yagisan> my first dual core box to play with :D
<\sh> Yagisan: 
<\sh> shermann@DT0225:~$ apt-cache search irqbalance
<\sh> irqbalance - Daemon to balance interrupts for SMP systems
* Yagisan is excited
<\sh> Yagisan: but there are problems with SMP Opterons and irqbalance before vanilla 2.6.20.x
* Yagisan should be fine
<\sh> Yagisan: in some rare situations the kernel just locks up..you can see it when you try to access /proc fs...this is a known kernel bug in amd64 kernel <2.6.20 and is fixed in >=2.6.20.x
<Yagisan> can't be worse thern my power supply blowing up on saturday
<Yagisan> beware - dust bunnies *are* a hazard to pc's
<TheMuso> norsetto: Have you thought of filing a separate bug asking for turkey to be moved into multiverse? This should be done, as the package now depends on sun-java6-bin which is multiverse.
<TheMuso> So until it gets moved, the package shouldn't be uploaded with the changes.
<norsetto> TheMuso: when I discussed with Hobbsee we just agreed to leave a note for the archive admins; would it be better to file a separate bug?
<\sh> Yagisan: well, it's been a problem when you have >600 servers running into this problem ,-)
<\sh> Yagisan: and only one other guy is reporting this very shitty problem on lkml ,-)
<Yagisan> \sh, if I had > 600 servers, I'd be in nerd heaven :D
<TheMuso> norsetto: hmmm. I would think so, only because sun-java6-bin is multiverse, and a package from universe can't be installed if it has a multiverse dep.
<TheMuso> norsetto: And how would you let the admins know that the note is there?
<\sh> Yagisan: ok.,..then I'm already there ,-)
<norsetto> TheMuso: ok, so the aa do not read the bug, just archive?
<norsetto> TheMuso: let me ask in devel
<TheMuso> norsetto: They would read it if the ubuntu-archive team was subscribed, and then they'd need to see a good description in the bug, otherwise they'd ignore/reject it.
<norsetto> TheMuso: ok, so I just ask the aa to move it to multiverse, and then it is patch?
<norsetto> s/patch/patched
<TheMuso> norsetto: Yeah I think we upload the change once in multiverse...
<TheMuso> But yeah I'd ask in -devel.
<norsetto> TheMuso: ok
<Fujitsu> You can have it moved afterwards.
<TheMuso> Fujitsu: Oh ok.
<Fujitsu> And ask for it to be given-back once moved.
<Fujitsu> Or it might do that automatically.
<TheMuso> Well the dependency is not a build-dep.
<Fujitsu> OK, it doesn't matter when you do it then.
<norsetto> I'm amenable on any option; let me know what is best for you
<TheMuso> norsetto: Ok, I'll upload, but I think a separate bug to ask for amove may be a better idea. Fujitsu WHat do you think?
<Fujitsu> You could poke an archive person in -devel, but they may want a trail.
<norsetto> or poke asking if they want a bug for asking ;-)
<Fujitsu> Or just poke and wait for them to object.
<RainCT> norsetto: thanks :)
<norsetto> RaintCT: np, quite a good guide that
<TheMuso> norsetto: If you don't mind, can you follow it up? I'll upload, but I am trying to track down some accessibility stuff I want to get in for tribe, so if you could, that would be appreciated.
<norsetto> TheMuso: np at all, thx for your work, much appreciated
<tedp> how often are new versions of packages pulled from debian? in this case i'm considering ccontrol which is exactly the debian package, rebuilt
<tedp> or is it manual?
<pygi> tedp, right now it's manual
<tedp> ok
<StevenK> It is automatic earlier in the release, up until DebianImportFreeze
<pygi> tedp, you can however request sync from debian
<tedp> well ccontrol in ubuntu is apparently unusable at the moment
<tedp> bug 109157 as i mentioned a few hours ago
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 109157 in ccontrol "ccontrol SEGVs on startup" [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/109157
<tedp> maybe someone has already acted on it
<pygi> is that (ccontrol) that automated testing thingy?
<tedp> um... it's for customising make/gcc/ld args
<pygi> oh well :)
<pygi> tedp, well, does it work in gutsy?
<tedp> probably not. there's a bug report saying it doesn't work in feisty
<tedp> i have no ubuntu machines, but apparently (as debian maintainer) i am ubuntu maintainer as well
<tedp> which is fine, but i don't know how to ask for it to rebuild, which is why i came here
<tedp> new version has only minor changes; http://packages.debian.org/changelogs/pool/main/c/ccontrol/current/changelog#versionversion0.9.1_20060806-3
<pygi> tedp, if all that was needed from feisty was rebuild, then in gutsy you've got one
<pygi> lemme see
<pygi> tedp, well, we can request a sync of -3 package if you wish?
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: the component thing also picks it up, btw.  
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: ??
<tedp> pygi: -3 would be a good idea
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: so filing bugs about dropping packages to multiverse isnt really needed - it's tracked in other ways.  of course, whether anyone looks at it is an interesting question
<pygi> tedp, ok, lemme open a request, and you chime in on the bug :)
<TheMuso> Oh ok.
<tedp> ok
<tedp> i just set myself as the bug contact for ccontrol, so i might react to problems a bit sooner in future
* TheMuso returns to fixing long broken live CD functionality.
<TheMuso> s/live CD/live CD accessibility/
<pygi> tedp, that's nice =)
<pygi> tedp, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ccontrol/+bug/130845
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 130845 in ccontrol "[sync request]  ccontrol 0.9.1+20060806-3 [Debian Main - Unstable] " [Undecided,New]  
<tedp> ta
<pygi> tedp, just chime in and say it's all fine :)
<tedp> ok, done
<pygi> tedp, thanks
<Fujitsu> Hobbsee: Doesn't anastacia only handle universe->main?
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: hrm.  it seems to now.  when i last looked at it, i'm sure it did universe too.
<elmargol> If I start an application using "start-stop-daemon --start --background --chuid gnunet --pidfile /var/run/gnunetd/gnunetd.pid --exec /usr/bin/gnunetd -- -c /etc/gnunetd.conf"
<elmargol> the application starts twice ... any ideas?
<coNP> Is it a server? With the possibility of a prefork mechanism?
<\sh> one root and one with another user? prefork I would guess
<elmargol> maybe I should remove the --background
<xxxxx1> good morning all!
<xxxxx1> :)
<coNP> hey xxxxx1 
<xxxxx1> hello coNP 
<xxxxx1> ScottK, PM?
<gnomefreak> its not enough to remove a package from control file for it not to be build (binary)
<gnomefreak> ?
<coNP> Are you sure there is no control.in? 
<gnomefreak> there isnt
<Hobbsee> gnomefreak: yeah
<Hobbsee> gnomefreak: usually a good idea to remove the packagename.* files too, etc.
<gnomefreak> checking for clutter in rules as well
<Hobbsee> from debian
<Hobbsee> from debian/
<gnomefreak> Hobbsee: yeah i thought of that :)(
* Hobbsee nods
<Hobbsee> also, if it's replaced by something else, or something...
<Hobbsee> no point leaving a stale binary on someone's system
<gnomefreak> nope just dropping it as its empty
<Hobbsee> ah
<norsetto> TheMuso: if you have not yet uploaded the patch in bug 129742, please don't. I need to make a change following discussion with the archive-admins
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 129742 in turkey "[ftbfs]  turkey ftbfs on gutsy" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/129742
<TheMuso> norsetto: I already have.
<RainCT> what is Debian's http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu url?
<TheMuso> Yet it is waiting for approval.
<TheMuso> norsetto: You could ask for it to be rejected in the queue.
<norsetto> TheMuso: how?
<TheMuso> norsetto: Pitti lets universe stuff through, as the archive is frozen for tribe. Simply state that it was uploaded, and not yet approved, and subject to the above conversation, ask him to reject it.
<norsetto> TheMuso: ok, thx
<TheMuso> c
<TheMuso> ugh
<Hobbsee> RainCT: ftp.debian.org
<Fujitsu> Hobbsee: Noooo, that's often woefully out of date.
<RainCT> Hobbsee: thanks
<gnomefreak> ty Hobbsee :)
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: which is the correct one, then?
<Fujitsu> The master is ftp-master.d.o, AFAIK, but that's not publicly accessible.
<geser> correct
<Fujitsu> You're meant to use your local mirror.
<Fujitsu> ftp.debian.org is a mirror like any other, except it (is|was) out of disk space.
<geser> one of the push-mirrors would be a good choice, but I don't know if there is a list
<StevenK> There is a better mirror than ftp.d.o, but it's DD only
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: ah right
* Hobbsee doesnt trust optus' mirror on principle
* Fujitsu uses optus/pacific
* Hobbsee uses pacific, kept getting out of date packages, and botched MD5SUM's on optus
<xxxxx1> hmm
* TheMuso uses internode. They have a good mirror now.
<xxxxx1> sun-java6 packages on gutsy looks broken
<xxxxx1> O_o
<StevenK> TheMuso: Better yet, you can actually connect to it if you're not on internode.
<TheMuso> StevenK: Yeah I know.
<RainCT> pidgin crashed :/
<StevenK> TheMuso: That changed only recently.
<TheMuso> StevenK: Yeah I know.
<ScottK> xxxxx1: Sure, in 5-10 minutes I'll be available.
<xxxxx1> cool
<RainCT> ScottK: Hi. I've something to test for you when you've time :)
<ScottK> xxxxx1: Any time.
<ScottK> RainCT: What is it?
* RainCT thinks that his internet connection sucks :P
<ScottK> RainCT: What is it you wanted me to test?
<RainCT> ScottK: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/32922/
* ScottK looks.
<RainCT> 15 minutes to upload 2 kb... and they call this a connection :/
<ScottK> Wow.
<ScottK> You can remove warty|hoary|breezy| for a start.
<ScottK> Aslo you should give Laserjock (Jordan Mantha) a credit too, unless you went back to the pbuilder examples and started over.
<ScottK> aslo/also
<ScottK> Why do you enable multiverse for Ubuntu and not non-free for Debian?
<RainCT> (why can't nobody put their name on the top of the scripts they touch? xD tought he was just hosting it)
<RainCT> what's laserjock's mail addr?
<ScottK> Because he just slammed it together for his own use and the popped it onto the page never imagining it would get a huge amount of use.
<ScottK> I'll look.
<ScottK> RainCT: He lists several.  I'd go with mantha@ubuntu.com.
<RainCT> thx
<RainCT> (http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/32923/)
<ScottK> I'm making a new pbuilder with the other one right now.  Seems to work fine.
<RainCT> :)
<ScottK> RainCT: For debian, I'd suggest you also accept release names.  I tried sid and got Warning: Unknown distribution sid
<RainCT> ok, what releases has debian?
<ScottK> currently sarge=oldstable, etch=stable, lenny=testing, sid=unstable.
<ScottK> Sid is always unstable.
<RainCT> (the Debian repository converts the names itself, or?)
<ScottK> IIRC yes.
<broonie> Yes. Uploads to debian should always use the symbolic name.
<ScottK> broonie: This is for a pbuilder creation script, not for anything that would affect uploads.
<geser> AndyP: are planing to merge xpdf?
<ScottK> coNP: I think your script upate is in pretty good shape.
<ScottK> There's a (I think) dev-tools or some such project on Launchpad.  I'd encourage you to add that to it and then talk to StevenK about maybe adding it to devscripts.
<ScottK> Gotta run.  I'll be back later.
<geser> ubuntu-dev-tools in bzr
<ScottK> coNP: ^^^ That one.
<coNP> What script?
<coNP> Hey, ScottK, OTOH :)
<ScottK> Sorry.
* ScottK meant RainCT
<ScottK> RainCT: ^^^^
<coNP> np
* coNP will ping ScottK  later about light tpd
<ScottK> Cool.
<RainCT> I'm pushing it there :)
<stgraber> RainCT: Maybe you can add arch support to your script so we can have a gutsy-i386 and a gutsy-amd64 pbuilder ? (--binary-arch IIRC)
<superm1> ScottK, mythbuntu-lirc-generator just cleared binary NEW.  was it you or TheMuso who was going to upload mythbuntu-live-autostart after it did (it depends on mythbuntu-lirc-generator)?
<bddebian> Heya gang
<geser> Hi bddebian
<bddebian> Heya geser
<RainCT> stgraber: ok will look at it later
<norsetto> if any u-u-s could look at bug 13860 would be cool (so we can finally get rid of the bugger....)
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 13860 in debian-installer "user, timezone, gmt questions would be better asked earlier" [Medium,Fix released]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/13860
<norsetto> heck, make it 130860 :-)
<norsetto> ubotu: bug 130860 pls.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 130860 in turkey "turkey should be executed with the sun jvm java interpreter" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/130860
<RainCT> stgraber: only i386 and amd64?
<stgraber> RainCT: yes, as you can find CPU running both amd64 and i386 (amd64 ones), but none running amd64 and powerpc or things like that
<stgraber> RainCT: so amd64 and i386 for a basic use is fine
<stgraber> RainCT: best would be : if current arch is amd64 allow i386 and amd64
<stgraber> RainCT: otherwise only allow the current arch
<pef> hello
<RainCT> do you know how I can get the arch?
<azeem> dpkg-architecture
<RainCT> oh, thanks
<norsetto> geser: thx :-)
<NeilW> Which dh_ script installs the README.Debian file in the documentation directory?
<norsetto> dh_installdocs
<NeilW> Ta
<Megaqwerty> Could anyone tell me if it's possible to make dch automatically insert my gpg key into the changelog?
<coNP> Megaqwerty: why do you want your gpg key inserted?
<Megaqwerty> coNP:  So I don't have to do it manually every time.
<coNP> You don't have to insert your gpg key into the changelog.
<Megaqwerty> coNP: for signing the sources you do
<Megaqwerty> at least with debuild....
<coNP> But you don't insert it to the changelog.
<Megaqwerty> Okay, where would you insert it then?
<coNP> You "debuild -S" to get the source package signed
* norsetto bite his tongue
<Megaqwerty> right
<minghua> GPG keys and GPG signatures are different things.
<Megaqwerty> minghua: yeah, sorry that's what I meant
<coNP> Are you supposed to insert either your signature or key in the changelog?
<coNP> Sorry, I really think I don't understand the situation.
<Megaqwerty> For example, at the bottom I put:
<Megaqwerty> -- My Name (Repository Key) <myemail@something.com> Date Time -0700
<Hobbsee> coNP: you may want to check "man debuild", so as not to give out incorrect information
<minghua> Megaqwerty: Just make sure you GPG key id (you can check with "gpg --list-secret-keys") and your debian/changelog entry is exactly the same, then debuild should automatically sign it.
<Megaqwerty> minghua: that's not the problem
<minghua> Megaqwerty: You still need to give the passphrase, of course.
<Megaqwerty> That much I know
<coNP> Hobbsee: what do you mean by incorrect information?
<Hobbsee> coNP: particularly with the -S option
<Megaqwerty> I just wanted to know if there was a way to have dch automatically put (Repository Key) in there
<Megaqwerty> without me having to enter it manually every time
<broonie> Megaqwerty: Set the DEBFULLNAME environment variable.
<coNP> I guess you can set DEBFULLNAME "Name (Repository Key)". 
<Hobbsee> coNP: debuild -S builds the source.  -S is not "please sign me"
<Megaqwerty> coNP: broonie thanks, that's what I wanted to know
<Hobbsee> coNP: as in, you have debuild (-b), or debuild -S
* coNP is really sorry. 
<Hobbsee> coNP: no problem, just a heads up :)
<coNP> I seems I've never built an unsigned source package :)
<Hobbsee> coNP: debuild always tries to sign it regardless
<Hobbsee> Megaqwerty: you can set GPGKEY=12345678 in .bashrc which is also useful
<Hobbsee> and amounts to the same purpose
<Megaqwerty> Hobbsee: yeah, already had that one
<Megaqwerty> Hobbsee: thanks though.
<RainCT> stgraber: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/32935/ test please :)+
<Megaqwerty> Hobbsee: damn. It works, but it then inserts the Key into the portion where it puts [Name]  * Change goes here
<Megaqwerty> as well
<Megaqwerty> Oh well, holding down the delete key is easier than typing I guess :-P
<stgraber> RainCT: Thanks, will do a bit later
<Riddell> siretart: revu broke?
<mruiz> Riddell: tiber is offline
<Riddell> ok
<mruiz> Riddell: more information about this issue -> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/loco-contacts/2007-August/001506.html
<Riddell> ooh, maybe it'll get faster if it's in the data centre
<superm1> mruiz, Do these happen to be in the same DC as the servers brandon was hosting for ubuntu studio, mythbuntu : or are those a diff situation?
<mruiz> superm1, sorry but I don't know about those servers...
<superm1> imbrandon, are you here?
<elkbuntu> i think the loco boxes live at serverpronto
<RainCT> TheMuso: when you get a moment: https://code.launchpad.net/~rainct/ubuntu-dev-tools/dev :)
<RainCT> (well, wait, I'm going to do some more changes)
<nixternal> superm1: nice cpux logo :)
<nixternal> RainCT: what are you doing with the dev-tools? makin' um cooler? :)
<RainCT> nixternal: yep, modifying pbuilder-dist today :)
<nixternal> ooh, lovely!
<nixternal> let us know when it is safe to checkout, or are you planning on updating the package as well?
<nixternal> hrmm, I thought there was a package... /me bzr up's
<RainCT> (some days ago I rewrote suspicious-source, unified all headers to look the same and finished the README file, and some other changes in one or two scripts)
<RainCT> nixternal: there's a debian/ dir
<RainCT> but I've no idea if it works
<nixternal> ya, maybe I just checked them out and threw then in /usr/local/bin
<RainCT> and about the the other question, I'd say it's safe right now but if you wait a bit it will be better :)
<nixternal> rock on with your badself then :)
<nixternal> maybe I should just subscribe to the branch then :)
<NeilW> Another dh_installdocs question. Is dh_installdocs -i supposed to put the README.Debian inside all the relevant packages? If not how the devil do you do it?
<RainCT> btw,  is it intended for ln that if you use it like "ln -s ./example ~/example" it creates a symlink to "./example" (literally, which of course fails)?
<imbrandon> superm1: yea I'm here ( only for moments ) trying to get everything up asap in the new DC, its a long long story and isnt related to the canonical dc issues
<imbrandon> i'll post on imbrandon.com with updates even if i'm not on irc, keep an eye out
<Nafallo> Canonical DC issues?
* Nafallo haven't seen any.
<RainCT> is there a command to install the dependencies of a local package source?
<RainCT> s/of/for
<Toadstool> RainCT: dependencies or build-dependencies ?
<RainCT> build dependencies
<Toadstool> apt-get build-dep
<RainCT> if it isn't in the repositories?
<Toadstool> oh
<geser> pbuilder has a script for it
<Toadstool> /usr/lib/pbuilder/pbuilder-satisfydepends
<coNP> the -gdebi one seems faster for me
<geser> the -gdebi one is really faster
* gnomefreak wonders why i cant make a debdiff less than 4.*mb in size :(
<RainCT> Toadstool: nice, thx :)
<RainCT> COPYING can be deleted from ubuntu-dev-tools, or?
<RainCT> there're already GPL-2 and -3
<geser> I'd say yes
<LaserJock> ScottK: around?
<RainCT> uh.. on debian/copyright it says what license each script has, but the GPL text there says "either version X or later" and not all have later as license afaik
<superm1> nixternal, i didn't want to put too much effort into the logo, just something basic atm.  so feel free to wipe it with something better if you want
<nixternal> it works for the time being :)
<geser> RainCT: improve it then, I tried my best to mention all licenses in debian/copyright
<RainCT> geser: removed the "or later" and added "The following of the scripts can be used, at your option, regarding any later version
<RainCT> of the previously specified license:" on the bottom. is it ok like that?
<geser> yes
<ScottK> LaserJock: Around now.
<superm1> could someone sponsor an upload of a new upstream version of mythbuntu-live-autostart?  Its in a bzr branch
<LaserJock> ScottK: I got an email back from the guy that wrote the pbuilder-dist script in 2004 :-)
<Lutin> cypherbios: around ?
<cypherbios> Lutin: yep
<Lutin> cypherbios: heya! was just wondering .. is it ok to sync/fakesync aptoncd from debian, or are there ubuntu changes you want to keep ?
<LaserJock> ScottK: so I'll be able to put a proper GPL header in there and fix up the scrip in ubuntu-dev-tools
<cypherbios> heya Lutin, thanks for working on it. I'm going to upload a new package, most likely tomorrow, so I think the fakesync won't be necessary anymore
<RainCT> nixternal: uploaded. :) http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~rainct/ubuntu-dev-tools/dev
<Lutin> cypherbios: you mean, in debian ?
<cypherbios> Lutin: the version in Debian is > than the Ubuntu one
<Lutin> yep
<cypherbios> Lutin: I'll make packages for both debian and ubuntu separately
<cypherbios> Lutin: I think Debian still not supporting dh_iconcache, then I think this will be the only thing I'll need to change between both in the debian/rules
<Lutin> cypherbios: ok
<cypherbios> Does anyone know if the latest Debian's debhelper has dh_iconcache already?
<RainCT> nixternal: ah, and I tried building it. I'd say it works fine but it creates an empty /usr/lib dir and all manpages are missing
<Lutin> cypherbios: doesn't seem to have it
<cypherbios> Lutin: does it has any alternative?
<geser> cypherbios: iirc dh_icons does a similar thing
<geser> it should be in a recent debhelper
<ScottK> LaserJock: That's great.  RainCT has been doing some more work with it to build on what you did.
<cypherbios> geser: I'll give it a try. Thanks
<LaserJock> RainCT: oh?
<cypherbios> geser: Feisty's debhelper doesn't has dh_icons, does it?
<geser> it's very recent
<RainCT> LaserJock: yes, I've been working on it today. moment I give you the url
<RainCT> LaserJock: http://codebrowse.launchpad.net/~rainct/ubuntu-dev-tools/dev/annotate/siggi.gevatter%40gmail.com-20070807182003-eikei2zvw1xix0p2?file_id=pbuilderdist-20070509231419-byejr3u90tf401in-1
<geser> cypherbios: dh_icons: New program to update Freedesktop icon caches. (included since debhelper 5.0.51)
<cypherbios> geser: So dh_icons is better rather than the old dh_iconcache, right?
<geser> dh_iconcache was Ubuntu-specific
<cypherbios> as dh_icons is available on both ubuntu gutsy and debian unstable/testing
<cypherbios> geser: hmm, I didn't know that
<geser> look inside the scripts to know if they do the same or different think
<LaserJock> RainCT: one addition I think that would be useful would being able to switch on/off Universe/Multiverse
<RainCT> LaserJock: ..where could I place the argument? before the operation or what?
<RainCT> (like with the i386/amd64)
<RainCT> (btw, are main and restricted added automatically to the components?)
<LaserJock> yes, main at least is automatic
<LaserJock> I think anyway
<RainCT> LaserJock: ok. do you have an idea on how to call the parameter to disable them?
<LaserJock> well, it would just be either adding or taking away --other-mirror or your components
<LaserJock> or do you mean Main?
<RainCT> no, I mean how the users activate it
<LaserJock> activates which?
<LaserJock> :-0
<LaserJock> :-) rather
<RainCT> like "pbuilder-dist onlymain ..." or how should they choose they don't want uuniverse
<RainCT> or you mean just editing the file and having there a var for it?
<LaserJock> well, it'd be cool if it could be a flag
<RainCT> LaserJock: which of the both is a flag? :P
<LaserJock> well, like pbuilder-dist  -mainonly or something
<RainCT> ok
<RainCT> LaserJock: should I let it disable non-free in Debian?
<RainCT> or also contrib?
<LaserJock> hmm, I don't know
<LaserJock> I guess if you want to be thorough
* ScottK watches and enjoys free software being developed ;-)
<RainCT> hah :)
<ScottK> Not kidding.
<pygi> ScottK, why don't you develop something? :)
* pygi now hides =)
<ScottK> pygi: I conned RainCT into do it.  It's practically the same thing.
<pygi> ScottK, you should help him then
<ScottK> That and I'm currently up to my eyeballs in trying to get paid work done.
<ScottK> He's doing fine.
<RainCT> if I set a variable inside a function, does it still exist outside (in sh)?
<LaserJock> yes
<LaserJock> I believe
<LaserJock> though you shouldn't take my word for it
<coNP> RainCT: yes, seems so
<RainCT> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/32964/
<RainCT> please test :)
<RainCT> LaserJock: added both, a variable on the top of the script to set the default value and mainonly|allcomp flags
<RainCT> (are u there? :P)
<LaserJock> I'm kinda busy
<ScottK> RainCT: Sorry, I'm tied up right now too.
<Lutin> StevenK: do you mind if I merge cmus ?
<RainCT> ScottK: woo you are working :) xD
<ScottK> Yes, but it's fun work today.
<ajmitch> morning
<ScottK> Good morning ajmitch.
<RainCT> nixternal: btw, what happens with bug 118361 finally?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 118361 in plucker "plucker-desktop: Missing menu entry" [Low,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/118361
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<Lutin> siretart: just want to make sure: is it ok to sync desmume from debian, as it's based on the ubuntu one ?
<superm1> hey bddebian 
<RainCT> will it be dificult to get new universe packages into Gutsy after the 30th?
<ajmitch> yes
<RainCT> so Gutsy doesn't accept new packages anymore and they will have to go to G+1 instead?
<bddebian> Heya superm1
<ajmitch> RainCT: that's pretty much why we freeze
<ScottK> Except Gutsy + 1 repos don't exist until after Gutsy is released, so we work on bug fixing Gutsy from then on.
<RainCT> that's bad :(
<ScottK> No, it's very good.
<superm1> bddebian, would you have a little to sponsor an upload?
<RainCT> for me not
<bddebian> superm1: Possibly, whatcha got?
<RainCT> since I want to get my program into it but I don't know if I'll have enough time (currently broken arm, and I'll also be 1 week away)
<superm1> bddebian, its in a bzr branch.  "bzr branch http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~mythbuntu/mythbuntu/mythbuntu-live-autostart" to grab it
<superm1> its a new version
<bddebian> Ack WTF has everyone gone bzr around here?
<pygi> :D
<ajmitch> bddebian: of course, that's expected
<superm1> bddebian, :)
<moquist> is it acceptable to ask packaging questions in #ubuntu-devel?
<ajmitch> it's only been happening for the last 2 years or so
<RainCT> well, I think I'm going to do a ~pre release and package it tomorrow
<ajmitch> moquist: generally yes, though you may get told to ask them here
<moquist> right
<moquist> ogra told me to ask pitti something, and he's not in here. :)
<superm1> bddebian, an older version is in gutsy, but was waiting for mythbuntu-lirc-generator to clear binary NEW (which happened this morning) to upload this one since this depends on it now
<superm1> once you've grabbed the branch, within the main directory of the source type "debian/rules get-orig-source" to build the .orig.tar.gz from bzr
<moquist> well, not that pitti's in #ubuntu-devel right now, either.
<bddebian> Hmm, maybe it'd be good if I just stay gone
<ScottK> bddebian: No.  Not everyone has gone bzr happy.
<superm1> bddebian, persia got me started on it, and i've started to take a liking to it for managing what would be native packages in it
<bddebian> OK now how do I build the package?  dpkg-buildpackage pukes
<superm1> debuild -S -i -uc -us
<superm1> is how i do it
<bddebian> Damn, you gonna take dpkg-buildpackage away from me too? Sheesh
<superm1> well dpkg-buildpackage might also accept -i
<superm1> i've just become accustomed to using debuild instead
<superm1> -i ignores the .bzr .svn or .cvs directories in a package directory
* bddebian withers away and dies...
* pygi kicks bddebian 
<superm1> according to man dpkg-buildpackage, it also supports -i
<bddebian> Well it seems fine, have you tested all this crap? :)
<superm1> bddebian, yes.
<superm1> its in use actually already on mythbuntu alpha3 
<bddebian> uploaded
<superm1> great thx
<bddebian> NP
<bddebian> I'll get 1 upload in for gutsy at least ;-P
<mtaylor> ScottK: revu is down? 
<ScottK> Is it?
<ScottK> I haven't looked today.
<ScottK> Asking the channel in general is more likely to get you an informative answer.
<mtaylor> my bad. :)
<coNP> It is down for almost one day.
<coNP> mtaylor: I mean REVU ^^
<mtaylor> and if I read the topic... 
<mtaylor> I'd see that it's down til tomorrow. I'm observant
<ScottK> No problem.  I didn't read /topic either....
<ajmitch> until at least tomorrow
<LaserJock> ajmitch: so what's going to happen for REVU admins?
<ajmitch> no idea
<ajmitch> I've only heard what's been said in here
<ajmitch> revu as it currently is done may need to change
<LaserJock> maybe it's a good time for people to do some REVU hacking?
<LaserJock> :-)
<ajmitch> maybe
<geser> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/loco-contacts/2007-August/001506.html mentions also tiber
<ajmitch> yes, that's what I'd seen
<ajmitch> no more root access
<LaserJock> RainCT: so did you commit your changes to your bzr branch on LP?
<RainCT> LaserJock: yes
<ajmitch> LaserJock: so you'll spend your weekend hacking REVU? :)
* ajmitch watches 1001 audit errors on his screen
<bddebian> What the heck is this now?
<bddebian> This upload awaits approval by a distro manager
* RainCT is away for a while
<LaserJock> bddebian: we're frozen for Tribe 4
<bddebian> Ahh
<LaserJock> bddebian: it just takes a manual push for Universe package
<LaserJock> +s
<LaserJock> ajmitch: no, I don't think I'll be hacking REVU, I had a look at it once and it mostly seemed beyond my python foo
<ajmitch> plus you're on vacation from ubuntu
<LaserJock> ajmitch: oh ... yeah
<ajmitch> :)
<mtaylor> so, given REVU being down, should I just chill out on trying to get some packages sponsored and checked and uploaded and all that? 
<NeilW> I've just uploaded a debdiff for bug 88000 that applies a submitted patch. sponsors have been subscribed. Does the review process now happen automatically or is there somebody I should nag? :)
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 88000 in libgems-ruby "bash completion for RubyGems" [Undecided,Fix committed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/88000
<LaserJock> mtaylor: it just means REVU is down. I'd probably wait no brand new packages, but bug fixes, etc. are fine
<mtaylor> LaserJock: ok. 
<LaserJock> NeilW: subscribing sponsors is the proper "nag" I think ;-)
* mtaylor will practice his patience
<LaserJock> mtaylor: well you can keep working on the packages
<ajmitch> 'fix committed' probably isn't the best bug status
<mtaylor> LaserJock: but of course!
<LaserJock> mtaylor: and if you are itching for a review then you could probably put the package up somewhere and ping somebody :-)
<Fujitsu> Oh, lovely, no root access on the loco/MOTU boxes any more.
<LaserJock> yeah, and the doc team box too :(
<LaserJock> although I never needed root there
* RainCT is back
<Fujitsu> On the plus side, they might be on not entirely crap hardware, and even boot with a > Breezy kernel!
<NeilW> ajmitch: ?? - those bug statuses are tricky. There appears to be one missing - between In Progress and Committed. Suggestions?
<Fujitsu> Hum, weren't they a few months back saying they couldn't possibly give ubuntu-dev webspace like people.ubuntu.com because that would imply letting non-Canonical people into the DC?
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: it's ok, it's an excuse for us to move to packages in PPAs & just having a commenting frontend :)
<ScottK> Shudder.
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: because people.ubuntu.com was on a box which had other stuff on it as well
<LaserJock> NeilW: In Progress mean's it it is being worked on, which includes waiting for sponsorship
<LaserJock> Fujitsu: I think there's a DMZ that they let non-Canonical people on to
<ajmitch> a MOTU doing sponsoring would probably see 'fix committed' and assume that the fix had been uploaded
<NeilW> Altered. bug 88000
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 88000 in libgems-ruby "bash completion for RubyGems" [Undecided,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/88000
<Philip5> hi guys! i have a question about how to make a symlink in a debian/rule... i'm packing a build made with scons and need to symlink a lib that i have moved in to package place with install -m 644 /path/to/lib /package/usr/lib
<Philip5> what is the correct way to make a working symlink in debian/tmp/usr/lib ?
<TheMuso> RainCT: Has anybody merged your tree yet?
<ajmitch> probably dh_link, though it's not clear why symlinking in /usr/lib is needed
<TheMuso> superm1: Has live-autostart been uploaded?
<superm1> TheMuso, yes
<TheMuso> Ok then.
<superm1> bddebian uploaded it for me a little bit ago
<superm1> thanks for checking in with it
<TheMuso> np
<TheMuso> I just saw your message in my away log.
<Philip5> ajmitch: i'll have a look at dh_link then
<superm1> i've still got to find a motu who knows a bit about seeds who can give a good look over the -meta however
<justinwray> norsetto: You around?
<norsetto> justinwray: sure,whats up?
<justinwray> Was wondering if you had heard back from mvo?
<RainCT> TheMuso: no, go on please :)
<norsetto> justinwray: talked with him this morning; he has a pretty bad backlog of mail to go through
<TheMuso> RainCT: Ok will do.
<justinwray> norsetto: Okay, no problem.
<ScottK> superm1: I suspect you'll want an archive person for that. Among the MOTUs, AFAIK, Hobbsee would be your best bet.
<norsetto> justinwray: in any case, if you need help just shout here
<superm1> ScottK, yea she looked it over briefly.  She wasn't positive about it though
<superm1> its hard for me to catch her to discuss further though, as she comes on around 2am my time
<justinwray> norsetto: Sounds good, thanks again.
<ScottK> I'd ask pitti, Mithrandir, or Riddell.
<norsetto> justinwray: np
<ScottK> They'll have to live with whatever crack we upload.
<superm1> are they MOTU too or just core-dev?
<ScottK> Infinity is here sometimes too.
<ScottK> They are core-dev and archive admins.
<TheMuso> RainCT: Merged without issue, and now pushing up.
<superm1> ScottK, that's what i had thought
<superm1> well i'll watch out in -devel then for one of them 
<superm1> see if i can steal a few moments
<RainCT> TheMuso: cool, thanks :)
<TheMuso> RainCT: Pushed up to revision 38.
<Riddell> superm1: you want to ask something?
<superm1> Riddell, yes, i was hoping to find someone to do a proper look over mythbuntu-mtea
<superm1> to make sure that my seed use was correct
<superm1> and such
<Riddell> superm1: where are the seed files?
<superm1> Riddell, packaging is here:  "bzr branch http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~mythbuntu/mythbuntu/mythbuntu-meta"   Seeds bzr branch are linked within the update script in the packaging
<superm1> seeds: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~mythbuntu/ubuntu-seeds/mythbuntu.gutsy
<Riddell> superm1: you've added your packages to the live seed, they should be added to the desktop seed
<superm1> Riddell, the thing is we dont have a desktop seed
<superm1> our standalone seed is like a desktop seed
<superm1> the live is only used for the build process
<Riddell> you do have a desktop seed, but you don't seem to use it
#ubuntu-motu 2007-08-08
<superm1> exactly
<superm1> that was copied from the gutsy ubuntu seed
<superm1> but its not used at all
<superm1> i guess it could be removed since its not used
<Riddell> superm1: but why don't you use it?
<Riddell> superm1: what are you trying to create here?  is this only for a live CD?
<superm1> Riddell, because we dont have a desktop target at all.  The boxes are supposed to be set up like appliances
<superm1> the live package is just for the live disk, the standalone is used after install is completed
<Riddell> install of what?
<superm1> there is an ubiquity derived installer in live mode
<superm1> that copies everything over and preconfigures the appliance
<Riddell> superm1: so run me through how you'd set up mythbuntu on a box
<superm1> Riddell, okay, so you'd pop in this disk.  If you've got an existing box setup, and this is adding to the network, you have the option to either add this as a "live" frontend or install as a standalone.  If it is ran as a live frontend, all the settings you choose are copied to a flash drive.  If you choose to install, you open up the installer.  Youre provided with a list of htings to change and modify.  You choose to your liking and its i
<superm1> nstalled like a standard ubuntu install
<superm1> once you reboot, you're ideally all set up and ready to go
<superm1> and can go right into media library, watch tv, etc
<superm1> so after the install finishes, it removes mythbuntu-live
<superm1> and any other unnecessary packages
<superm1> but mythbuntu-standalone sticks around for similar purposes as ubuntu-desktop between releases
<Riddell> so mythbuntu-live is unnecessary for the installed mythbuntu box?
<superm1> correct
<superm1> but it simplifies the current build process
<superm1> and the uninstallation of unnecessary items
<Riddell> but it has all the myth stuff in it
<Riddell> there's hardly anything in standard
<superm1> because so many things can be customized during the install
<superm1> and shouldn't be present on every box
<superm1> during install the user gets to choose if the box will be a frontend / slave backend /master backend /customizes plugins/ customizes services
<Riddell> what do you mean by a "live" frontend?
<superm1> live in the sense, that you dont need a hard drive.  You cna boot off the disk, and load your settings for connecting to another box from a flash drive
<superm1> or choose them on the fly
<Riddell> man, this is going to complicate my SeedManagement diagram :)
<Riddell> is standard the same as ubuntu-standard?
<superm1> yes
<Riddell> oh, wait, it's standalone
<superm1> the standalone isn't however
<RainCT> does the debian/menu file accept PNGs? (can't remember it now)
<Riddell> superm1: so why not make standalone the desktop seed?
<superm1> well we could do that, but then would have to deal with inheriting all the stuff from the standard ubuntu desktop seed right?
<Riddell> presumably you're expecting to make CDs out of this in the same way as ubuntu desktop CDs are with the live filesystem being made from desktop+live (except in your case it's now standalone+live)
<superm1> well the current way that we are making disks isn't the same as the ubuntu desktop CDs are made
<superm1> its a custom script that i wrote
<superm1> i wasn't finding much about the way desktop CDs were made
<Riddell> no, that isn't released yet, it should be sometime before gutsy comes out
<superm1> hence why I couldnt find it then :)
<superm1> in any which case, i can point you at our build script should you be curious how we are doing that too
<Riddell> I think renaming desktop to standalone is a bad idea, it just confuses that it does the same thing, and I wouldn't worry too much about merging being a hassle, I merge ubuntu desktop changes in kubuntu desktop seed all the time and it's not a problem
<Riddell> otherwise, seems fine to me, although cjwatson is the authority when it comes to seeds
<Riddell> superm1: your script takes an existing CD and remasters the live filesystem?
<superm1> Riddell, no.
<superm1> it debootstraps in
<superm1> and then creates a cd from scratch
<Riddell> ah, clever :)
<superm1> only unfortunate side effect is that squashfs-tools ends up in the CD image right now
<superm1> i'm assuming something similar is done for the ubuntu desktop CDs however?
<geser> RainCT: iirc no, as not all window managers support it. I hope the menu policy mentions it.
<Riddell> yes
<superm1> Riddell, so how do I avoid getting all of the ubuntu-desktop items in my desktop seed then when it uses the normal gutsy seed to base from in [gutsy]  from update.cfg?
<superm1> Riddell, and if your curious to see what I do: http://codebrowse.launchpad.net/~mythbuntu/mythbuntu/mythbuntu-livedisk/annotate/supermario%40portablemario-20070731074308-8vd91mtlqhc63a2u?file_id=mythbuntu_install.sh-20070730021708-mgcieyteypjaasi6-4
<Riddell> well, remove them from your desktop seed
<superm1> Ok.
<Riddell> superm1: what's the point of the mythbuntu-live package?
<superm1> Riddell, easy way to modify what's installed in builds without having to modify the build script
<Riddell> ok, the other seeds don't have it so it's a bit a-typical, but then you're not using the same CD build script, so it's fair enough
<superm1> Riddell, given what i'm currently doing here for the builds, will it be a less painful transition over to doing the builds the way the standard desktop cds are built when that procedure is released?
<Riddell> will what?
<superm1> moving away from this build script to the method used to build ubuntu desktop disks
<Riddell> renaming standalone back to desktop would be I imagine yes
<Riddell> if that's what you're talking about?
<superm1> well you had said that the process used to build ubuntu desktop cds will be made clearer by gutsy release
<superm1> so i'd ideally switch things over to be built that way
<Riddell> sure, this seems the way to go
<superm1> ok then i'll switch it over
<superm1> Riddell, should I still push this through the standard revu procedure given that not all of -motu is confident on seed functionality?
<Riddell> superm1: probably not, run it by cjwatson instead
<superm1> Ok.  i'll do that then
<superm1> thanks for your help Riddell :)
<Riddell> no problem, it's been interesting
<Riddell> let me know if you need me to upload it, once cjwatson has seen it
<superm1> okay will do
<RainCT> Good night all
<bddebian> Heya gang
<crimsun> hey, it's the other guy who isn't online much!
<bddebian> crimsun: !!
<crimsun> how's life?
<bddebian> Well I'm hoping to come back
<crimsun> excellent.
<bddebian> Has been busy as hell but slowing down.  You?
<crimsun> getting busier here, will be offline for an extended period shortly.
<bddebian> Doh :-(
<crimsun> don't worry, there are still plenty of packages awaiting your touch :-)
<bddebian> Heh
<RAOF> Like xserver-xgl!
<crimsun> and alsa-*!
<zul__> isnt TheMuso doing alsa ;)
<ajmitch> hello crimsun, zul_______
* ajmitch hates on tracker some more
<zul__> hey ajmitch how goes it?
<ajmitch> alright
<ScottK> Good evening everyone.
<ajmitch> hello ScottK 
<ScottK> Seems like you aren't the only one grumpy about tracker.
<Hobbsee> hiya
<ScottK> Hi there.
<RAOF> Yay!  I managed to log a trackerd segfault.
<RAOF> Oh.  That's a boring log.  Darn.  Hope the backtrace is interesting at least.
<ajmitch> ScottK: me, grumpy?
<ScottK> Wait, no...
<ScottK> Maybe it was bitter.
<ajmitch> yeah, I can do bitter
<zul> sarcastic even?
* ajmitch waves to Hobbsee 
<ajmitch> nah
<Hobbsee> hiya ajmitch 
<zul> hey Hobbsee 
<Hobbsee> hiya zul 
<bddebian> Heya ScottK
<TheMuso> Greetings all.
<ScottK> High there bddebian.
<bddebian> Heya TheMuso
<bryce> I've got a package (displayconfig-gtk) in Section: admin, and am getting this error when doing pbuilder:  Copying source file
<bryce>     -> copying [displayconfig-gtk_0.2+20070731ubuntu2_source.changes] 
<bryce>     -> copying [./admin] 
<bryce> cp: cannot stat `./admin': No such file or directory
<bryce>  -> Aborting with an error
<bryce> anyone know offhand what this means?
<Hobbsee> bryce: at the end presumably?
<bryce> yup
* Hobbsee wonders why it wants a ./admin script
<Hobbsee> bryce: got the source that you can dump somewhere?
<RAOF> Maybe the changes file points to it?
<bryce> no idea.  If I change it to Section: gnome, then it complains about cannot stat `./gnome': ...
<StevenK> Neat!
<RAOF> That's pretty cool, yeah.
<StevenK> bryce: Can you pastebin the debian/rules file?
<bryce> sure
<bryce> this is in the *source.changes:
<bryce> Files:
<bryce>  f20f849c1f2e9c038e644c94293340fd 671 admin optional displayconfig-gtk_0.2+20
<bryce> 070731ubuntu2.dsc
<bryce>  58b085ef5924d3f8b738ed273eb7f675 77649 admin optional displayconfig-gtk_0.2+
<bryce> 20070731ubuntu2.tar.gz
<bddebian> RAOF: Where's your xserver-xgl bzr branch?
<bryce> http://pastebin.ca/649354
<RAOF> bddebian: https://code.launchpad.net/~raof/xserver-xgl/ubuntu-raof
<Hobbsee> bryce: for a start, were you intending to build that natively?
<RAOF> It's also linked to a bug in the u-u-s queue.
<bryce> Hobbsee: "natively"?  I was attempting to build it in a pbuilder gutsy environment on a feisty system
<Hobbsee> bryce: no .diff.gz, and no orig.tar.gz
* bddebian thinks bzr is a pig
<bryce> Hobbsee: I'm attempting to build from displayconfig-gtk's latest bzr checkout
<bryce> (plus some changes of my own)
<bryce> ok, anyway, nevermind, I was just hoping this would be an obvious error message to someone.  I'll experiment a bit more and sort it out.  thanks
* bddebian does a full dist-upgrade waiting on bzr
<RAOF> bddebian: bzr smart-server is coming Real Soon Now(tm) to launchpad, that makes it quite a lot faster.
<bddebian> *cough*
<ScottK> Good thing the LP devs have a good reputation for being able to deliver speedy/responsive <<<<<<<< nevermind.
<ScottK> </bitter>
<bddebian> heh
<Fujitsu> RAOF: It's already there...
<RAOF> But not advertised, because it thrashes I/O on launchpad.
<Fujitsu> Aha.
<bddebian> Hmm, I wonder if I start a build of glibc on GNU/Hurd if it would actually finish before bzr
<Hobbsee> RAOF: i wonder how one uses it, then
* RAOF knows, but has been asked to not advertise it.  See "thrashes LP" :(
<RAOF> Apparently it'll be fixed + advertised in bzr 0.20 :(.
* Fujitsu worked it out through common sense.
<Fujitsu> Wasn't 0.18 just released?
<Hobbsee> RAOF: right, i'll pull other strings then :)
<StevenK>        bzr |     0.18-1 |         gutsy | source, all
* ScottK watches Hobbsee lean on Fujitsu.
<RAOF> Not very long ago, yeah.  Apparently it missed 0.19 because I gave all the Sydney bzr hackers the flu.
<ajmitch> bad bad RAOF 
<bddebian> heh
<ajmitch> bryce: you are running pbuilder build against the .dsc, right?
<bddebian> This is ridiculous
* RAOF is appropriately contrite.
<RAOF> bddebian: Some of the slowness you're seeing is my fault; I shouldv'e excluded the .git directory from the initial import.
* bryce smacks forehead
<bryce> ajmitch: thx
<ajmitch> bryce: easy mistake to make :)
* ajmitch has done it a few times
<bddebian> d00d, I've dist-upgraded my hurd box and pulled the glibc source so far and this thing isn't even 1/2 way done yet :-)
<ajmitch> bddebian: checking out his xgl branch?
<bddebian> Was trying to but about to stop it :-)
<ajmitch> took me about 2 hours to check it out
<bddebian> chirst
<RAOF> Gah!  Smart server is so much faster!  Uuurgh!
<bddebian> Oh my it finished
<bddebian> Do I have to do that stupid get-orig-source or whatever also??
<RAOF> bddebian: No.  "bzr bd --split"
<bddebian> huh?
<RAOF> That's how to build it (easily).
<bddebian> what the heck is bzr bd --split?
<RAOF> bd is the bzr-builddeb plugin, --split tells it to make an orig.tar.gz from the non-debian part of the working dir.
<bddebian> bzr: ERROR: unknown command "bd"
<RAOF> Install bzr-builddeb?
<ajmitch> not really nice to make an orig.tar.gz with that, but oh well
<RAOF> ajmitch: It's just a git snapshot.  Is it really worth making a separate tarball?
<RAOF> ajmitch: I can if it's important.
<RAOF> If there *was* a release, I certainly wouldn't be doing it.
* bddebian still wonders what the advantage of this crap is
<ScottK> bddebian: We're just old and don't understand.
<RAOF> It offers a more fine-grained history than changelog?  Makes it easier to collaborate on maintenance?
<bddebian> ScottK: Apparently :_)
* Hobbsee likes it for seeds and such
<ScottK> Yes, but we aren't doing team maintenance on your package.
* RAOF likes it for git snapshots.
<ScottK> You're wanting bddebian to review it.
* TheMuso just plain likes bzr.
<ScottK> dget -x .... is so much easier.
<ajmitch> poor bddebian 
<bddebian> OK so that fails because I don't have nor want the build deps.  I need to build it in a pbuilder
<RAOF> ScottK: True.  I could push it to revu if that's easier.
<ajmitch> no you can't
<ScottK> Ah. no.  see /topic
<RAOF> Well, not until it's up again, of course :)
<ajmitch> revu has left us
<bddebian> :'-(
<Fujitsu> REVU is some way away.
<ScottK> How big is it?
<Fujitsu> It's being moved into the DC, so... who know.
<Fujitsu> *knows
<ScottK> Oh my.
<ajmitch> most likely not before freeze
<ajmitch> so effectively not used before release
<bddebian> I can see it for upstream development but I don't get it for distro changes but what do I know, I'm a moron
<ScottK> Would have been nice to have waited until after the freeze for that then....
<ScottK> bddebian: Do you read ubuntu-devel?
<Fujitsu> ScottK: There was apparently a security issue on 4 loco servers, including tiber.
<ScottK> Ah.
<bddebian> ScottK: I get it, I don't always read it.  I have a life ya know :-)
<ScottK> OK.
<Fujitsu> So they're all being moved into the DC, which also means no root access except for canonical-sysadmins.
<StevenK> Fujitsu: Where was that message? I can't see it in the archives.
<Fujitsu> StevenK: lococontacts.
<ScottK> bddebian: There was sort of related thread over the weekend through today on apt-get source wanting to redirect you to a vcs.  That's all.
<bddebian> egads
* ..[topic/#ubuntu-motu:Fujitsu] : Ubuntu Masters of the Universe: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU | Want to get involved with the MOTUs? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing | http://ubuntu.joejaxx.org/ - TOP 10 Uploaders/Packages | REVU likely down for the next few days
<Fujitsu> The ETA has unfortunately been revoked :(
<ajmitch> big surprise
<ScottK> If I can bring up a basic Ubuntu LAMP box to use in the meantime, would someone be willing to set up another instance of REVU on it?
<ajmitch> time to use other services
* ajmitch was thinking of 'borrowing' one of imbrandon's boxes if he agreed
<ajmitch> and if they're alive
<Fujitsu> At least tiber will be new hardware when it returns.
<ScottK> I've got spare IPs and a spare box that's a bit in pieces, but I've got all the pieces.
<ScottK> I've also got bandwidth.
<ScottK> I had plans for it, but don't need it until next month.
<ajmitch> so the problem is setting up an instance of REVU
* ScottK looks for a volunteer....
<Fujitsu> I'd first try to get a very ETA from newz2000, but he's likely not around for some hours :(
* ajmitch doesn't know how out of date the bzr branch of it is
<ajmitch> nor is setting it up at all documented
<Fujitsu> Would there have been many changes?
<Fujitsu> I set it up a year or so ago, it's not too hard.
<ajmitch> some small changes
<ScottK> REVU minus a few patches is better than no REVU at all.
<ajmitch> only marginally so at times
<ajmitch> at least it'd give us a chance to clear the backlog...
<Hobbsee> we could just get rid of REVU entirely... </hopeful?
<Fujitsu> It was last merged 3 months ago.
<Hobbsee> we could just get rid of REVU entirely... </hopeful>
<bddebian> heh
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: replace it with...?
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: no new packages to ubuntu
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: No it wouldn't. We haven't got the data from tiber accessible until the new server appears.
<Fujitsu> Hobbsee: That would be nice.
<bddebian> Grr I can't get shit accomplished this evening.. Sheesh
<ScottK> bddebian: Fix bugs?
<ScottK> Steal packages off of mentors?
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: that's what I mean by clearing the backlog
<RAOF> It's probably against Debian ettequete to file a "new upstream version" bug with a debdiff to upgrade the package, right?
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: Ah, I see.
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: not likely to happen
<ScottK> RAOF: I've seen it often done with a link to the .dsc for the upgraded package.
<RAOF> ScottK: Awesome.  I'll look into that then.
<bddebian> The uus queue actually looks pretty clean
<ScottK> Merges then...
<ajmitch> only because people have been all over it, frequently
<bddebian> Where are merges these days?  mom, dad, baby, what? :-)
<RAOF> bddebian: You could take the new upstream version of azureus off my hands, if you like!
<bddebian> no thanks :-)
<ScottK> bddebian: MoM or DaD as you prefer.
<ScottK> Each has advantages.
<ScottK> Fujitsu: Would you be willing to follow up with newz2000 about an ETA for REVU and help me get a new one up and running if it isn't soonish?
<Fujitsu> ScottK: I poked him 20 minutes ago, but he's likely asleep or busy with something else.
<ScottK> OK.
<Fujitsu> He's in UTC-5, AFAIK.
<ScottK> Hmmm
<ScottK> Pleny early then.
<Fujitsu> Fairly.
<ScottK> Plenty even
<Fujitsu> Just got a response.
<ScottK> And ...
<Fujitsu> elmo is working on it, with actual transfers likely starting tomorrow morning London time.
<ScottK> ETA this weekish then?
<Fujitsu> Probably within the next day or two.
<Fujitsu> The hardware is all ready and stuff, just got to get the data from ServerPronto.
<ScottK> Cool.
<ajmitch> not nearly as bad as feared
<Fujitsu> Fortunately.
<ScottK> Then I guess my box can rest in peace (or pieces) for a while yet.
<bddebian> Install GNU/Hurd on it ;-P
<Fujitsu> Hah.
<ScottK> No thanks.  I do eventually want it to do something.
<bddebian> pfft
<ajmitch> ScottK: that's easy
<ajmitch> it'll eventually crash
<bddebian> It's gotten much more stable actually
<wfarr> bugger about REVU being down
<Fujitsu> wfarr: Yeah, probably a couple of days until it's back.
* ScottK is somewhat busy writing evil proprietary software right now anyway.
<wfarr> I'll have to find somewhere else to upload a package I need reviewed for now
<Fujitsu> Hm, as tiber was likely compromised, all the packages on there have to be considered more tainted than usual.
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: might be an idea to ask everyone to reupload the packagse they're interested in.  *shrugs*
* Hobbsee wonders if it's worth learning tex for this assignment
* Fujitsu wonders if this can be used as an excuse to kill lots of stuff off.
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: yes
<Fujitsu> Hobbsee: Yes, it is worth it.
<ScottK> Fujitsu: Is it know when the period of vulnerability was?
* TheMuso wonders if its worth trying to experiment with other ways of reviewing packages.
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: exactly
<ajmitch> however each package on there still has its corresponding .changes file that is signed
<Fujitsu> ScottK: It was discovered on Monday, but I'm not sure if it's know.
<ScottK> OK.
<TheMuso> ajmitch: THey could have been resigned.
<Fujitsu> *known
<ajmitch> so the package source should still be able to be verified
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: I thought of that... Unfortunate :(
<ajmitch> TheMuso: then you'd easily be able to check that, wouldn't you?
<Fujitsu> We can just recheck everything against the REVU keyring.
<TheMuso> ajmitch: Yeah true that.
<ajmitch> it's not like we really trust anything on there anyway
<ajmitch> given that the keyring is basically wide open
<Fujitsu> `more tainted than usual'
<bddebian> OK so uploading is off period atm?
<ajmitch> bddebian: no uploads to revu
<Fujitsu> bddebian: Not to the archive.
<bddebian> Grr
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: hush.  we want to cut down the number of packages on there
<TheMuso> Requires manual approval afaik.
<Fujitsu> Hobbsee: That's what I was thinking. I hope the attacker obliterated the .changeses.
<bddebian> Well the last one I got a message about awaiting moderator.  This one just got plain rejected
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: even if they didnt, we can consider them compromised
<Fujitsu> bddebian: What was the rejection message?
<bddebian> Not permitted to upload to the RELEASE pocket in a series in the 'CURRENT' state.
<Fujitsu> bddebian: You can't upload to feisty.
<bddebian> wtf
<Fujitsu> Or any other pocket than PROPOSED or UPDATES of a CURRENT distrorelease.
<bddebian> Gahh, moron
<bddebian> This is why I hate scripts doing things for me :-)
<ajmitch> don't mention that you use scripts to automate stuff
<bddebian> I meant just dch -i :)
<TheMuso> bddebian: YOu have to check that, especially if you are using feisty.
<TheMuso> I have made that mistake once before.
<bddebian> I know but I'm old and senile
<ajmitch> quick, everyone lynch him!
<bddebian> :'-(
* bddebian should stay away and make ajmitch happy
<ajmitch> don't be silly
<ScottK> bddebian: Don't do that.  Then I'd have to be old and bitter here by myself again.
<Hobbsee> ScottK: and who would you find to have 4 hour rants with?
<bddebian> ScottK: hehe
<ajmitch> not me
* ajmitch never rants
<ScottK> IIRC it was Laserjock last time.
<ajmitch> and look what you did to him
<ScottK> Yeah, well at least I got through 4 hours with him without violating the CoC.
<ScottK> I have done less well on that in far less time recently.
<bddebian> I can't get through 5 minutes without violating the CoC :-)
<ScottK> Yeah, but I did it on a logged IRC channel.
<ScottK> That hurts the deniability.
* ajmitch tends not to do that on a public channel
<ajmitch> nor in private, of course
* ScottK got a little carried away for some large value of little.
<calc> ScottK: heh
<bddebian> Do we really need to change the Section to Multiverse for contrib packages from Debian?
<ScottK> Which?
<ScottK> bddebian: Why would we do that?
<calc> crimsun: still here?
<bddebian> Dunno apparently it was done for ivtv
<ScottK> AFAIK that's not a valid section.
<bddebian> Hmm, I think ivtv should be synced..
<pedahzur> Anybody here deal with X packages? It seems this wishlist item has languished for a while.  Anyone want to tackle it? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xorg/+bug/102018
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 102018 in xorg "[Needs-packaging]  lbxproxy" [Wishlist,Confirmed]  
<Hobbsee> pedahzur: feel free to
<pedahzur> I know...I need to learn to package things anyway, but trying to package something that is part of a larger ecosystem like X isn't really my idea of a "first time packager" task.  Guess I need to a) find a smaller package, b) find a mentor, or c) both. :)
<pedahzur> What's the general opnion of "fixing" packages that were created with checkinstall?  If I created it that way, could I wrangle it into shape, or is the general consensus that one should start from scratch?
<RAOF> pedahzur: It would take more effort to fix a checkinstall package than it would to package from scratch.
<Hobbsee> pedahzur: you dont end up with a source at all, for a checkinstall package, do yoU?
<RAOF> Anyway, checkinstall doesn't make a source package?
<pedahzur> Hobbsee: Not sure...I think it has all the rules there, but you might not.  Never checked that because I never needed it. :)
<Hobbsee> pedahzur: unless you like editing binary files, i'd suggest you start from scratch
<Hobbsee> pedahzur: it doesnt really help you
<pedahzur> OK.
<RAOF> While I'm touching compizconfig-python, do we want to make it build for all supported python versions?
<RAOF> Amaranth: Ping, re compizconfig-python
<Wedhus_Liar> i need help about crossover installation
<DarkSun88> Hi all
<\sh> moins
<DarkSun88> Hi \sh 
* Yagisan cheers at the nvidia binary drivers - (EE) NVIDIA(GPU-0): Failed to initialize dac HAL - yeah - thats just what I want to see ....
* Yagisan would be first in line if theres an intel pcie card
* RAOF would be a close second
<TheMuso> I'd be there for the next system build I would do.
<TheMuso> I don't need a chunky card at all.
<Yagisan> nice shiney new 8500GT - bouaght because new systems don't have agp slots anymore ...
* TheMuso thinks the industry is moving too fast.
<Yagisan> I try 3d games development
<RAOF> Owch, you can't even use the packaged drivers.
<Yagisan> that was the cheapest card I could find that does SM4, and as a added bonus - fanless
<Yagisan> RAOF, yeah - nvidia-glx-new didn't work
<RAOF> And stable-driverless, sadly.
<Yagisan> what really sucks
<Yagisan> my old hardware isn't supported anymore
* Yagisan looks forlonly at that pci s3 virge/dx
<Yagisan> (I really need to get a spellcheck for xchat)
<Yagisan> it still does 2d
<Yagisan> but no 3d since xfree86 3.3
<TheMuso> Yagisan: Wow, talk about a regression.
<RAOF> That card never really did 3d anyway, though, right?
<Yagisan> TheMuso, nobody cares about it anymore
<Yagisan> it did a decent amount of 3d
<Yagisan> not full T&L
<TheMuso> c
<RAOF> Oh, really
<TheMuso> ugh
<Yagisan> but certaily helped with texturing etc
* TheMuso remembers the days when a 3dFX card was put in a chain with your normal video card.
<RAOF> One of my friends had one of those cards, and we tried to run a game.
<RAOF> Not so much with the 3d, then.
<TheMuso> And then it was so cool and new for it all to be on one card. :)
<Yagisan> I bought that card for my then 486
<Yagisan> it had a whopping 4MB of EDO ram
<RAOF> Yeah, that's right.  I think the one I knew was in a pentium 133
<Yagisan> 25% of what my 486 had
<RAOF> That 486 had a lot of ram!
<Yagisan> the 486 is long dead, but that card worked in my 486, 6x86, k6/2, 2 durons, and and athlon64 system
* TheMuso remembers when the S3 Virge card he had in his pentium 166, with 2MB of video RAM, was state of the art.
<Yagisan> RAOF, it was for DOOM :D
<TheMuso> A little over 10 years ago when we got it.
* RAOF had a... what was it again?  I think it was a S3 Virge in a p90 system.
<RAOF> Mmm, the memories.  Hazy as they are :)
* TheMuso still has his S3 virge card.
<TheMuso> And it still works.
<Yagisan> that they do
<Yagisan> one I can't geta 5V pci slot though - then, its not going to grace any new boxes
<Yagisan> I like my new distcc farm - I can build my game in under 22 seconds now
<TheMuso> heh
* TheMuso still has a box from 1999 which will accept the S3 card.
* Yagisan googles for his error , and decided it must be caused by some idiot at nvidia
<RAOF> Man, plain shell sucks.
<RAOF> Amaranth: In here is probably better, because I want to ask whether or not I should care that compizconfig-python is only built against 2.5
<\sh> well, it doesn't suck like ruby ;)
<Amaranth> RAOF: I dunno, mvo did it
<RAOF> The package is crufty.
<Amaranth> mvo did it :)
* Amaranth points all blame to him
<Amaranth> Although I could fix it
<Amaranth> I guess
<RAOF> I'm doing it
<RAOF> There's absolutely no reason to ship static libs for a python module, right :)
<Amaranth> right
<Amaranth> we need a generic "strip static bullshit" helper
<RAOF> Totally.
<geser> AndyP: are planing to merge xpdf?
<geser> lucas: Hi, http://people.debian.org/~lucas/ubuntu-versions seems to use old Ubuntu data as unimultiverse-outdated-ubuntu.html list packages that are synced for over a week
<AndyP> geser: no, wasn't planning on it
<AndyP> i also wasn't planning not to :)
<geser> are you going to merge xpdf or should I? the last Debian upload closes a CVE
<AndyP> geser: i'm pretty busy with other things at the moment so you can go ahead (sorry for the delay)
<geser> ok
<coNP> ScottK: lighttpd .debdiff for feisty ready
* coNP does some pbuilder magic now :)
<siretart> Riddell: thanks for notice, canonical-sysadmin is contacted
<coNP> Does someone have an edgy pbuilder with some computing power and wants me to test a package? :)
<coNP> s/test/help testing/
<RAOF> For *edgy*?
<coNP> edgy-security
<coNP> I guess you need an edgy pbuilder for that.
<coNP> If I am wrong, feel free to correct me :)
<geser> coNP: what do you need tested?
<Kmos> I need a debdiff to be checked and uploaded for stunnel4
<Kmos> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/crywrap/+bug/128634
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 128634 in crywrap "[Remove]  Please remove crywrap from Gutsy" [Undecided,Invalid]  
<Kmos> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/8668258/stunnel4_4.20-2ubuntu1.debdiff
<coNP> geser: bug 127718
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 127718 in lighttpd "lighttpd security fixes" [High,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/127718
<coNP> I guess I can install somehow an edgy pbuilder
<geser> coNP: yes, create a pbuilder and point it to edgy
<geser> coNP: do you need more than a test-build in edgy?
<Kmos> geser: can you help me on that crywrap/stunnel4 one ?
<geser> Kmos: I'm busy now
<coNP> geser: actually I don't need anything from edgy, but maybe should check :)
<Kmos> geser: ok, thx anyway
<coNP> Maybe does sbuild support better building for different targets?
<geser> Kmos: I give it a quick look, what about conflicts? isn't it also needed?
<Kmos> hobbsee doesn't asked for that
<Kmos> just the two ones i've added
<Kmos> but I can change it
<geser> Kmos: I'm not sure about the conflicts, I've to reread the Debian policy about it
<Kmos> geser: :)
<Kmos> http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-relationships.html#s7.5.2
<Kmos> geser: i think it don't need it, because the crywrap package will be removed, so it won't do any conflict
<lucas> geser: fixing this, thank you
* Kmos preparing new ddclient 3.7.3 package
<Kmos> http://kmos.homeip.net/~kmos/ddclient/ -> prepared to be uploaded
<\sh> guys, someone blogged about an tool for monitoring, was written in java and had an eclipse alike ide...can someone remember the name of this tool?
<white> !info teamspeak-server gutsy
<highvoltage> doesn't rung a bell :/
<ubotu> teamspeak-server: VoIP chat for online gaming (server). In component multiverse, is optional. Version 2.0.23.19-1 (gutsy), package size 1067 kB, installed size 2928 kB (Only available for i386 amd64)
<highvoltage> *ring
<white> !info teamspeak-server sid
<ubotu> teamspeak-server: VoIP chat for online gaming (server). In component non-free, is optional. Version 2.0.23.19-1 (sid), package size 1068 kB, installed size 2820 kB (Only available for i386 amd64)
<viviersf> ajmitch, ping :)
<coNP> If preparing security patches, should they be against <distro> or <distro-updates>?
<white> coNP: which package?
<coNP> lighttpd: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/lighttpd/  
<white> coNP: do you have a CVE number?
<coNP> No CVE I guess. I speak about bug 127718
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 127718 in lighttpd "lighttpd security fixes" [High,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/127718
<white> coNP: well lighttpd has a few security issues
<coNP> I based feisty on prev. feisty-security 
<coNP> no, sorry
<coNP> feisty on prev. feisty, edgy on prev edgy-security
<coNP> but dapper has dapper-security and dapper-updates as well
<coNP> I guess I should use dapper-security
<geser> coNP: should it published through <distro>-security or <distro>-updates?
<coNP> geser: Yes. That is the question.
<Amaranth> -security
<Amaranth> and it should be only security fixes
<Amaranth> anything else can come later in -updates
<coNP> Thanks, Amaranth. So get latest -security and do an update. 
<pschulz01> Greetings.. are there any tools for updating debian/changelog with a python script?
<Amaranth> pschulz01: eh?
<coNP> dch is a perl script ... :)
<pschulz01> Ok.. the package is for a python program though.
<geser> coNP: and include the CVE numbers
<coNP> geser: in the changelog?
<Amaranth> pschulz01: don't automatically update changelog
<pschulz01> Amaranth: nightly packaging.
<geser> coNP: yes, under references
<Fujitsu> pschulz01: python-debian might have what you want.
<coNP> Okay, geser, thanks. I guess I have to re-upload my debdiffs then
<coNP> No that it would be very hard to include a line in the changelog :)
<geser> coNP: when I follow http://secunia.com/advisories/26130/ from your changelog entry I see there several CVEs listed
<pschulz01> Fujitsu: Ta :-)
<coNP> geser: yes. So I  should also include the CVE numbers as well
<coNP> Not only the link to them.
<geser> yes
<coNP> Cool, thanks. :)
<geser> and you can tell LP which CVEs belong to your bug
<coNP> I am figuring out right now.
<geser> "Link to CVE" in the left pane
<coNP> Yes. They are only candidates though.
<coNP> Should they be listed anyway?
<coNP> I mean CVE candidates
<geser> yes
<coNP> Okay
<RainCT> is a package of a python program supposed to include .pyc files?
<Fujitsu> RainCT: Urgh, no.
<Fujitsu> RainCT: Please see the Debian Python Policyl
<Fujitsu> -l
<coNP> ScottK2: do you have time a / o are you in a mentoring mood?
<ScottK2> Actually, I'm just about to head out the door.  Sorry.
<coNP> Okay. I am going as well. So later then.,
<norsetto> HiYa all
<Hobbsee> hey norsetto 
<norsetto> Hobbsee: Hey Hobbsee
<RainC1> someone knows what can be the reason why lintian say "postinst-does-not-call-updatemenus" if there is update-menus on qttube.postinst.debhelper?
<Nafallo> hmm
<Nafallo> why do we have both roundcube and roundcube-webmail?
<geser> because it was first packaged for Ubuntu and entered a year later Debian with a slightly different name
<geser> we should add Conflicts/Provides/Replaces: roundcube-webmail to roundcube (or a whole transitional package) and remove roundcube-webmail
<xxxxx1> heya ubunteros
<norsetto> and ubunteras.....
<xxxxx1> norsetto, :)
<bddebian> Heya gang
<geser> Hi bddebian
<bddebian> Hi geser
<xxxxx1> hello bddebian 
<bddebian> Heya xxxxx1
* norsetto bows to bddebian (with a name like his, he can only be a nobleman...)
<geser> norsetto: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BddebianIsAGod :)
<norsetto> LOL!
<bddebian> pfft
<RainC1> gutsy has a help submenu on system, or?
<lamont`> E: Build-Depends dependency for ieee80211 cannot be satisfied because the package linux-headers-2.6.17-2-all cannot be found
<lamont`> hehe
<lamont`> E: Failed to satisfy Build-Depends dependency for onscripter: libstdc++6-4.0-dev
<lamont`> thou shalt not build-depend on build-essential packages, esp since sometimes they change names.
* lamont` considers filing bgs
<lamont`> bugs, even
<Hobbsee> lamont`: you've larted the people responsible?
<lamont`> Hobbsee: just bitched here is all.
<Hobbsee> awww
* lamont` lazy today
<lamont`> OTOH, this effort is brought to you thanks to k3d taking a long time to build, so that the universe packages are still in sources.list and my script therefore works... once that build is done, then the buildd will just have main there, and, well, ...
<lamont`> libpar2 is also guilty of build-depending on a build-essential (and renamed) pacakge
<lamont`> I think it build-deps: libstdc++6-dev
<AndyP> is it bad practice to put informational messages such as "Creating database, this could take a while" in a postinst script?
<lamont`> depends on how long "a while" is, and how impatient the user is likely to become....
<lamont`> AndyP: OTOH, if it's going to take that long, launch it in the background, maybe?
<AndyP> lamont`: my spidey senses don't like that idea for some reason
<xxxxx1> AndyP, it's optional
<lamont`> E: Build-Depends dependency for gaim-xmms-remote cannot be satisfied because no available versions of package gaim-dev can satisfy version requirements
<lamont`> E: Failed to satisfy Build-Depends dependency for festival-gaim: gaim-dev
<lamont`> E: Failed to satisfy Build-Depends dependency for gaim-galago: gaim-dev
* lamont` sees a little gaim-transition work still pending
<AndyP> xxxxx1: which is optional?
<xxxxx1> AndyP, verbosity
<lamont`> AndyP: the messages about taking a long time
<lamont`> and other verbosity. :-)
<AndyP> ok, cool
<lamont`> and whichever way you choose, expect that someone will file a wishlist-bug against the package wanting the other.
<AndyP> no wonder i couldn't find any policy about it :)
<bddebian> AndyP: Heya.  Did you fix svk? :-)
<AndyP> bddebian: ah sorry, no, couldn't find that patch
<bddebian> Bah :-)
<AndyP> bddebian: it was a build failure wasn't it?
<bddebian> Aye
<bddebian> But it built fine for me but not you apparently :-)
<AndyP> yeah, i was thinking... do PPAs offer test building on all arches? :)
<bddebian> I don't even know what PPA is :-(
<geser> bddebian: PPP = Personal Package Archive
<geser> AndyP: afaik supports PPA currently only i386 and amd64
<AndyP> geser: ah ok
* norsetto and bddebian now know what PPA means (norsetto still wonders what it actually is though)
<AndyP> bddebian: well if you're confident that it built ok for you i think it's safe to assume that i screwed up and go ahead and upload the new version ;)
<AndyP> i have to go for dinner, catch up later
<bddebian> Laterz
<lamont`> ecasound2.2 also build-deps libwrap-dev, which is not provided by libwrap0-dev
<geser> norsetto (and bddebian): https://help.launchpad.net/PPAQuickStart
* norsetto thinks geser is really cool
<bddebian> norsetto: geser is DA MAN :)
<lamont`> gpe-todo has a versioned build-dep on a virtual package.  for the loss
<zul> hey lamont` 
<lamont`> morning zul
<lamont`> make[1] : Entering directory `/build/buildd/acl2-3.2/books'
<lamont`> Sun Jul 22 20:50:52 UTC 2007
<lamont`> /bin/sh: time: not found
<lamont`> make[1] : *** [all]  Error 127
* lamont` cackles
<lamont`> acl2 gets to decide if it want so fail because of bashism, or because it has no build-depends: time
<lamont`> how frozen is universe atm?
<geser> it's on manual
* AndyP returns, slightly more rotund
<coNP> ScottK: around? :)
<ScottK> Yes
<coNP> So I did two debdiffs
<ScottK> Did you see keescook's comment on your lighttpd diffs?
<coNP> Not yet. Then first I have a look.
<coNP> But I guess I'll still have some questions.
<ScottK> OK.
<coNP> So. I have checked.
<ScottK> I'll be mostly here for ~ 4 hours
<coNP> http://secunia.com/advisories/26130/ lists other issues. Should these also be fixed? 
* ScottK looks
<ScottK> coNP: I'd say fix all the CVEs you can find patches for.
<coNP> Okay. They seems to include links to trac changesets that can be used as patches
<coNP> OTOH keescook says list CVEs per patch. That is the natural approach. I choose the "references" section, because https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SecurityUpdateProcedures seems to direct me to do so. I am happy to list them for each patch and maybe we can fix the documentation as well. 
<ScottK> Sounds good, I'd talk to keescook about what you are doing and why.
<keescook> coNP: feel free to use either references or on a per-patch basis.  the diff I looked at didn't have the CVE in either place.  (maybe I missed it)
<keescook> and I wasn't sure what the html~ thing was.  :)
<coNP> Oh, sorry. I was only told by geser to add CVEs that I added (home version). But I did not want to upload new debdiffs because I wanted to ask if the other issues should be fixed as well. So first patch-patch-patch, then change logs.
<coNP> I am afraid html~ comes from upstream.
<coNP> I'll check that as well of course.
<coNP> Or was it in the debdiff?
<ScottK> It was in the debdiff if I understood correctly.
<coNP> Okay, np, I will upload new ones soon anyway.
* coNP inserts a HD now.
<coNP> (unfortunately no hotplugging :()
* ScottK moves his laptop off his lap so as not to burn his legs while upgrading to OOO 2.3.
<bddebian> heh
<stgraber> RainCT: just found a small problem with script, it currently creates .tgz based on <distro>-base.tgz which will be a problem if someone create gutsy/i386 and gutsy/amd64
* Starting logfile irclogs/ubuntu-motu.log
<ScottK> coNP: I'll be AFK for several hours now.  Keep up the good work.
<RainCT> coNP, stgraber: please test :) http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~rainct/ubuntu-dev-tools/dev
<RainCT> good night
* AndyP has another go at searching for the svk patch
<bddebian> w00t, go AndyP :-)
#ubuntu-motu 2007-08-09
<superm1> bddebian, you got a few to sponsor another new version of a package?
<bddebian> superm1: Possibly when I get home but I'm trying to get the hell out of the office atm.  Sorry.
<superm1> no biggie :)
<asantoni> probably been said a 100 times today: uh oh, REVU down - Am I screwed for getting my (updated) package into Gutsy?
<ajmitch> no, it hasn't been said 100 times, but it is in the topic :)
<sistpoty> I guess revu is done due to bandwith limitation again :(
<sistpoty> s/done/down/
<superm1> sistpoty, that wasn't the cause i thought.  one of the servers in the datacentre it sat in was compromised i thought
<sistpoty> ah, ok.
<asantoni> anyone have any suggestions for me then? I've got a package that needs reviewing... ;)
<coNP> asantoni: upload it to somewhere and ask someone to review it :)
<coNP> asantoni: to solve the latter is far more difficult :)
<asantoni> ok
<asantoni> hehe
<asantoni> It's an updated Mixxx package (DJ application)
<ScottK> sistpoty: tiber is being logically moved into the Canonical datacenter as I understand it.
<sistpoty> ScottK: I guess that's good news then?
<ScottK> Eventually.
<ScottK> Today, not so much.
<asantoni> ok guys, Mixxx 1.5.2 SVN drop package is up here: http://mixxx.sourceforge.net/packages/
<asantoni> story: Mixxx 1.5.0 contains 4 terribly bad crashes in it, 3 of which have been fixed in this SVN drop (comes from our bugfixes branch)
<asantoni> These are the types of crashes that'll happen on a DJ who's live in the mix (which is embarrassing for both us and them)
<asantoni> (so we'd like to get this crash-fix release out in the repo) :)
<coNP> How to turn "Version number suggests Ubuntu changes, but Maintainer: does not have Ubuntu address" error to a warning?
<geser> unset DEBEMAIL
<sistpoty> coNP: see wiki.ubuntu.com/DebianMaintainerField for details (and also iirc I sent a mail to this somewhere sometime, but can't remember the details right now)
<coNP> thanks geser 
<coNP> sistpoty: I know this issue in general, but I don't want to change a maintainer of a security release.
<coNP> s/a main/the main/
<sistpoty> coNP: right, but IIRC the conditions *when* this warning is made an error is listed there as well ;)
<sistpoty> s/is/are/
<geser> coNP: it's ok for feisty to change the Maintainer field
* coNP does it for dapper-security
<sistpoty> then you'd rather not change the maintainer (I got a reject for this once *g*)
<coNP> sistpoty: there is an error but what follows from that? :)
<sistpoty> coNP: see section "Source packages" (and above). These will tell you when you get the error ;)
<geser> coNP: don't change the maintainer for release before feisty as the tools aren't tested if they still work with this change
<coNP> I know what is the problem :)
<coNP> I have an "@ubuntu.hu" address. And spec says contains "ubuntu" that should be contains "ubuntu.com"  
<sistpoty> coNP: so like geser already stated, make one of the and-clause false (e.g. by unsetting your DEBEMAIL) ;)
<coNP> Yeah, I did. Thanks you both.
<coNP> -s
<coNP> pbuilder-dapper build lighttpd_1.4.11-3ubuntu3.4.dsc says Command line parameter [build]  is not a valid .dsc file name
<coNP> Any hints?
<Kmos> lintian *.dsc
<Kmos> says what?
<Kmos> try this: pbuilder-dapper lighttpd_1.4.11-3ubuntu3.4.dsc
<coNP> Okay, a small pbuilder-dist  error
<Kmos> :)
<brylie> how do I migrate my GPG and SSH keys to a newly installed os?
<brylie> just copy the .ssh foler?
<coNP> stgraber: you need to shift after $OPERATION is selected. Sorry for bothering you with this, but RainCT seems not to be around. 
<coNP> brylie: .ssh and .gnupg I guess
<brylie> ok.. then I run a command to import them again?
<brylie> gpg --import oldkey.asc
<brylie> or something?
<ajmitch> if you copy the directory, you won't need to import
<geser> brylie: copying it enough
<brylie> excellent
<brylie> thanks :)
<coNP> Kmos: what do you want with bug 119796
<coNP> Oh sorry, I guess I understand you
<Kmos> i've updated openbox ?
<coNP> Yes. We have 3.4.2 in Debian, upstream has 3.4.4
<Kmos> and 3.2.2 in ubuntu
<Kmos> with an debdiff attached to it
<coNP> But there is a Debian package 3.4.4 that got accepted to debian, so we can sync
<Kmos> it has ubuntu changes?
<Kmos> :)
<coNP> Yes. 
<Kmos> nice
<Kmos> so change bug and subscribe U-U-S
<coNP> I contacted the Debian Maintainer to put the one patch that is left.
<Kmos> nice
<coNP> I wait till Debian unstable contains Openbox
* sistpoty needs to go to bed now... gn8 everyone
<coNP> good night Simon80 
<coNP> sorry, s/Simon80/sistpoty/
<Simon80> lol
<Simon80> nice and random
* coNP says 2-prefixes should be enough
<TheMuso> c
<TheMuso> ugh
<sistpoty> coNP: haha... in earlier days I was at least only mixed with siretart ;)
<sistpoty> gn8
<coNP> It has the probability of 0.001 if we assume that every character occurs with the same probability that is of course nonsense.
<coNP> Some language expert could provide us the real possibility :)
<pgquiles_> I have produced a new version (upstream = 0.3.13) of a package which is orphaned in Debian ( upstream of latest Debian/Ubuntu = 0.3.10) but I am not really interested in adopting the package. Any chances I get the new version in Debian/Ubuntu?
<nixternal> pgquiles_: what is it?
<pgquiles_> nixternal: heck, you here too :-)
<pgquiles_> nixternal: libntlm
<pgquiles_> nixternal: it's available in my PPA
<pgquiles_> nixternal: https://dogfood.launchpad.net/~pgquiles/+archive
<nixternal> everywhere possible
<nixternal> !info libntlm
<nixternal> silly bot
<RAOF> Is dead.
<nixternal> pgquiles_: have you contacted the Debian maintainer for libntlm to get him/her to update it?
<pgquiles_> nixternal: the is a /former/ Debian maintainer, as the package is officially orphaned. Do you mean that maintainer?
<nixternal> yes
<pgquiles_> nixternal: I'll try
<nixternal> if that maintainer isn't doing it anymore, file an ITP on your latest release and get into debian-mentors to see what they have to say
<nixternal> I am sure theyw ill have no problem doing an NMU sponsor, unless of course you want to maintain it
<pgquiles_> nixternal: e-mail to former maintainer sent
<pgquiles_> nixternal: thank you
<nixternal> no problemo
<ubotu> Package libntlm does not exist in feisty, feisty-seveas
<bmm> I'd like to add an icon to a package, so I first thought I'd just add it in the debian directory, but then the diff can't handle the binary file (PNG). Hows should this be done?
<SEJeff> any C developers here who know how to tell if you are using a gnu libc or not?
<SEJeff> I would like to #define _GNU_SOURCE before including sched.h
<bmm> SEJeff: ldd the binary?
<SEJeff> No, this is a code question
<SEJeff> I don't want to define _GNU_SOURCE on systems like OpenBSD, Mac OS X, etc... but would like it defined on Linux
<SEJeff> So that Linux *specific* things like SCHED_BATCH can be pulled in
<bmm> Already got my awnser on debian-devel. Thanks all.
<AndyP> bmm: out of curiosity, what was the answer?
<bmm> AndyP: uuencode the binary file :-S So I'm probably going to make an SVG... still talking about it all though.
<AndyP> ah i see
<RAOF> bmm: svg's are cooler anyway :P
<bmm> AndyP: xpm also seems to be an option (can do ascii), otherwise potrace to convert it to SVG.
<AndyP> yeah i've come across xpm before too, mostly in the context of the debian menu system
<asantoni> http://mixxx.sourceforge.net/packages/   ---> needs review (package spam) :)
<rob> anyone around who knows pbuilder?
<ScottK> A bit.  Yes.
<ScottK> What's up?
<rob> just a question
<rob> I'm on amd64 and want to be able to create packages for both it and i386, when I run "pbuilder create --debootstrapopts --arch --debootstrapopts i386" can I still build amd64 packages? How can I tell it which arch I want to build for?
<ScottK> You can.
<ScottK> I haven't done it though.
<ScottK> I expect you need to create two different pbuilders for that since they'd have different packages in them.
<rob> that's what I suspected too, just not sure how to have them side by side for the same ubuntu release
<ScottK> Give me a minute to find a helper script for you.
<rob> okay, thanks
<rob> I have one that lets me do DIST=feisty, but nothing that lets me tell it what arch
<ScottK> I believe this one will.
<ScottK> http://codebrowse.launchpad.net/~rainct/ubuntu-dev-tools/dev/annotate/siggi.gevatter%40gmail.com-20070808215510-7qw4tot6njao08tg?file_id=pbuilderdist-20070509231419-byejr3u90tf401in-1
<rob> cheers, I'll check it out
<rob> well that script seem to set them up, but then I get the following:
<rob> $ sudo ../pbuilder-feisty-i386 build hyperion_1.0-1ubuntu0.dsc
<rob> Command line parameter [i386]  is not a valid .dsc file name
<ScottK> rob: RainCT (who's not on now) has been developing that script from some earlier work.  He just added the ARCH stuff today.
<rob> ScottK, oh, well I have some testing for him then :)
<ScottK> Try naming is just pbuilder-feisty and see what happens.
<rob> then I get:
<rob> sudo ../pbuilder-feisty build hyperion_1.0-1ubuntu0.dsc
<rob> ../pbuilder-feisty: line 161: [: argument expected
<rob> Command line parameter [build]  is not a valid .dsc file name
<rob> omitting build doesn't work either
<ScottK> rob: Not sure.  I'd look around for RainCT and ask him when he shows up.
<rob> ScottK, will do, thanks for your help
* ajmitch just uses his own scripts
* RAOF uses a slightly modified one from the wiki
* ScottK is clueless as usual.
<RAOF> I should probably see if I should add my script to devscripts.  It handles pbuilder-dist-arch correctly.
<rob> that would be nice :)
<ajmitch> ScottK: you're sounding like someone else...
<ScottK> RAOF: Maybe have a look at RainCT's update to Laserjock's script.  He's pretty close to having a general "Just works" pbuilder script.
<ScottK> ajmitch: Someone has to fill in until he can come back.
<RAOF> ScottK: Yeah.
<white> !info lwat gutsy
<ubotu> lwat: LDAP Web-based Administration Tool. In component universe, is optional. Version 0.15-1 (gutsy), package size 68 kB, installed size 540 kB
<white> !info lwat feisty
<ubotu> Package lwat does not exist in feisty
<ScottK> white: If you need it in Feisty, we can probably get it backported.
<white> ScottK: whenever I check package versions here, you can become suspicious about it ...
<ScottK> white: OK.
<ScottK> Just thought maybe you knew someone that wanted it.
<white> ScottK: nope, i am not using ubuntu anywhere, sorry
<ScottK> No problem.
<RAOF> Nah, he's our security advisory :)
<ScottK> white: I'm in favor of a strong Debian.  Actually I do all my new package work in Debian now and get it here downstream.  More people benifit that way.
<nixternal> ScottK: and it is less work in the long run, especially when you can build them so they are easily 'sync'able'
<ScottK> Yes.
<ScottK> Although I did have one fun one that built in my Gutsy pbuilder, built in the Sid pbuilder, built on the Debian buildd, and the FTBFS on the Ubuntu buildd.
<ScottK> That was annoying.
* RAOF ponders fixing his sbuilder to build nouveau, over uploading *another* failed build to PPA.
<ScottK> RAOF: Upload to the PPA and file bugs.  Remember my Launchpad motto:
<ScottK> It's proprietary, so I can't help fix it.  The least I can do is complain a lot.
<RAOF> Oh, it's *my* fault they're FTBFS, not LP.  At least, not now.
<RAOF> Incidentally, should x11proto-gl-dev depend on mesa?  Some of it's includes include mesa files.
<RAOF> I should probably not use the PPA as my first line of build testing :/
<nixternal> ScottK: did I sense a little bit of hostility or sarcasm in that last line?
<ScottK> Just facts.
<nixternal> hehe
<nixternal> so is sbuilder superior to that of pbuilder?
<ScottK> Never used sbuild.
<nixternal> I have yet to use it, and will be setting up my new machine to do my building from now on
<RAOF> nixternal: My favourite feature is auto-buildlog mailing.
<ScottK> Dunno
<RAOF> Also, it's faster.
<nixternal> I have heard that it is faster
<RAOF> Less unpacking and repacking of tarballs.
<RAOF> Also, it leaves less cruft around. 
<nixternal> besides it being faster, any other added benefits? pros/cons? wiki page or another page with more info and/or help?
<RAOF> Or rather, *different* cruft :)
<nixternal> hehe
<RAOF> nixternal: Buildlog mailing is a killer app for me.
<RAOF> It's really, really handy.
<ScottK> Really.  I like pbuilder with build --logfile so the build log is stored right with the source I'm building from.
<ScottK> But I need to get to bed, so good night.
<Fujitsu> Proper for support for multiple chroots, guaranteed clean build environment...
<Fujitsu> Hm, I guess pbuilder does the latter too, but it's horrendously slow.
<RAOF> It's much faster now that pbuilder-satisfy-depends-gdebi is used.
<RAOF> But sbuild is still faster by a long shot.
<Fujitsu> The tarball unpacking/removal is what I was complaining about, although the dependency resolution was also really bad.
<RAOF> Absolutely shockingly slow.  Many of the builds I did took longer to work out the dependencies than actually build.
<Fujitsu> Yep.
<RAOF> So, does anyone think it's a bug that x11proto-gl-dev has files that #include files in mesa-common-dev, but x11proto-gl-dev doesn't Depend on mesa-common-dev?
<StevenK> RAOF: PBUILDERSATISFYDEPENDSCMD="/usr/lib/pbuilder/pbuilder-satisfydepends-gdebi", it's *much* quicker.
<RAOF> StevenK: Oh, I know.  I was using that as soon as it was available.
<RAOF> Now I'm using sbuilder, and it's even faster :)
<Fujitsu> RAOF: Is sbuilder != sbuild?
<RAOF> Fujitsu: No.  My fingers just ran on.
<RAOF> Who can teach ubotu that nouveau testing packages can be found in my PPA?
<Fujitsu> RAOF: Look in #ubuntu-ops
<RAOF> Ta
<Hobbsee> greetings all
<RAOF> Yo, Hobbsee 
<white> anyone from .au (or whoever wants) can join debian.au on #oftc by the way :)
<white> thought it would be nice to start a .au channel for debian) and ubuntu, if interested)
<rob> with any luck switching networks may become a thing of the past soon :)
<rob> there is a #ubuntu-au here already
<white> rob: debian.au might attract more people (debian and ubuntu people ) ;)
<rob> I dunno, Ubuntu is pretty popular in its own right :)
<Hobbsee_> hiya white 
<rob> we got 41 in -au now
<Fujitsu> rob: Most of those don't use Ubuntu.
<rob> Fujitsu, maybe, but they are still there
<RainCT> hi
<coNP> hey RainCT 
<coNP> I guess I have found a bug.
<coNP> RainCT: You should shift after selecting the OPERATION build or use something else at the end instead of $@. Since now you want to build "build <file>.dsc"
<rob> was this with the pbuilder script by any chance?
<coNP> This is with pbuilder-dist.
<coNP> At least for me.
<rob> I'm having problems with the same script then
<RainCT> coNP: ah, right. will push the fix when I finish the manpage ;)
<RainCT> rob: from what branch do you have it?
<coNP> RainCT: I fixed it with a shift after the case. 
<rob> RainCT, 47 I think, I only grabbed it a few hours ago
<rob> the output I get is:
<rob> sudo ./pbuilder-feisty-i386 build *.dsc
<rob> Command line parameter [i386]  is not a valid .dsc file name
<rob> I'm on amd64
<coNP> rob: this is the same error. 
<rob> coNP, oh, well I can confirm it then ;)
<coNP> RainCT: you should fix this in trunk as well
<coNP> Or as it is called in bzr
<RainCT> yes, will ask TheMuso if he can merge it later. changes from yesterday are still pending too
<coNP> RainCT: Okay, thanks. Just FYI :)
<RainCT> rob: if you add a line with "shift" after    create|update|build|clean|login|execute)    (line 139) does it work?
<rob> RainCT, just a new line with "shift" written on it?
<RainCT> yes
<rob> no, it does not work
<rob> same error
<coNP> rob: insert "echo $@" at the end and echo  what it writes out to the console, please
<RainCT> actually, better add 'echo' before 'sudo pbuilder' please
<rob> ./pbuilder-feisty-i386: line 140: shift: echo: numeric argument required
<coNP> Oh, then use "shift 1"
<rob>  sudo ./pbuilder-feisty-i386 build *.dsc
<rob> sudo pbuilder build --basetgz /home/rob/pbuilder/feisty-i386-base.tgz --distribution feisty --binary-arch i386 --buildresult /home/rob/pbuilder/ --othermirror deb http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu feisty main restricted universe multiverse hyperion_1.0-1ubuntu0.dsc
<coNP> rob: did you replaced "shift" with "shift 1"?
<rob> coNP, yes
<coNP> it should work now 
<coNP> The line you put here seems to be valid.
<rob> I have:
<rob> case $OPERATION in
<rob>     create|update|build|clean|login|execute)
<rob>     shift 1
<rob>     ;;
<coNP> rob: does it work?
<rob> coNP, no, I get the same error as before
<RainCT> "Command line parameter [i386]  is not a valid .dsc file name" this one?
<rob> yep
<RainCT> what's if you move the $@ to line 167:   sudo pbuilder $OPERATION $@ \
<rob> ok, getting a different error now:
<rob> E: failed to find /var/cache/pbuilder/base.tgz, have you done <pbuilder create> to create your base tarball yet?
<rob> I'm guessing that fixed it?
<RainCT> if you haven't run 'create' yet, I guess so
<rob> well I'm running it now, I'll see how I go
<elmargol> I have a problem using this script https://gnunet.org/svn/GNUnet/debian/gnunet-daemon.postinst. If i install the package the daemon launches twice.
<coNP> elmargol: are you sure it is supposed to launch only one instance? 
<rob> so I ran the create, but it's still telling me it cannot find the base.tgz
<rob> its looking for /var/cache/pbuilder/base.tgz
<rob> is it suppose to be looking from /home/myuser/pbuilder/feisty-i386-base.tgz ?
<rob> err for, rather
<ajmitch> evening
<rob> hello ajmitch 
<norsetto> hi there
<elmargol> coNP: yes
<RainCT> rob: yes, should use feisty-i386-base.tgz
<mothsart> firstly, excuse me for my bad english (I'm french)
<mothsart> I search to use a path with spaces in a debian/dirs
<mothsart> my first intuition is to use \ like shell
<mothsart> no idea?
<jussi01> dont uses spaces?
<mothsart> for explain : i have create some personal package who automated install wine programms
<norsetto> using double commas also should work (at least if I look at the dh_installdirs script)
* Fujitsu grumps at the large number of unmaintained Ubuntu-specific packages that cause things like bug #131191
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 131191 in sm "please sync package sm from debian testing" [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/131191
<mothsart> norsetto: I use double comma like this "/usr/lib/try to use space", no result
<Fujitsu> Oh, I see Debian has done strange stuff.
<norsetto> mothsart: use relative path, absolute won't work (guess unrelated to your problem though)
<mothsart> norsetto: yeah, is a bad example
<mothsart>  "usr/lib/try to use space" don't work better
<elmargol> this bug drives me nuts :/
<elmargol> 2 days that i can't find the solution :(
* mothsart think is easier to use a mkdir in a postinst
<elmargol> invoke-rc.d gnunet-daemon start. just does /etc/init.d/gnunet-daemon start right?
<Kmos> I need someone to check & upload this package: http://kmos.homeip.net/~kmos/ddclient/
<RainCT> Kmos: hi. why have you asked me to update dosbox?
<Kmos> RainCT: last uploader :)
<RainCT> Kmos: btw, what's with the @ubuntuwire addr? for me it seems to work
<Kmos> not here
<RainCT> does it return the mail or what?
<Kmos> failure
<xxxxx1> heya ubunteros
<ScottK> Good morning all.
<RainCT> hi ScottK xxxxx1
<ScottK> RainCT: Did you find anyone to test the lighttpd fixes?
<ScottK> Hi RainCT
<xxxxx1> morning RainCT , ScottK :)
<RainCT> ScottK: uh?
<ScottK> Sorry.  Did it again.
<ScottK> For some reason I mix nicks up for you and coNP all the time.
<RainCT> :P
<ScottK> coNP: Did you find anyone to test your lighttpd fixes yet?
<RainCT> what was the way to check in what debian section a package is?
<siretart> RainCT: apt-cache show?
<RainCT> siretart: "in debian" :-)
<siretart> schroot -c unstable apt-cache show foo ;)
<siretart> or look in http://packages.debian.org
<RainCT> where does it say it there (on the website)?
<RainCT> ah on the links :P
<elmargol> is revu down?
<Hobbsee> elmargol: /topic
<zul> oh no the world is coming to and end whoe is me (revu being down)
<elmargol> faw days?
<elmargol> few...
<zul> elmargol: go fix some bugs ;)
<Fujitsu> No ETA at this time, but at least another couple of days.
<RainCT> Kmos: requesting sync..
<elmargol> I have packaged a working version of gnuent :/
<elmargol> and can't upload it :(
<zul> elmargol: is gnuent already in universe?
<coNP> ScottK: no I had only time to finish and pbuild each debdiff
<RainCT> elmargol: perhaps you could upload it on mentors.debian.net and post the url here
<elmargol> yes, the feisty version is not working (too old), and the gutsy version is terrible broken
<coNP> heya xxxxx1 
<ScottK> coNP: I saw you were in #ubuntu-server earlier.  That would be a very good place to ask for testers.
<coNP> I regularly reside there, I'll ask for testers.
<ScottK> elmargol: How big is the package.
<Kmos> RainCT: nice
<coNP> I should turn highlighting on "RainCT" I guess ;)
<elmargol> The version on debian testing / unstable is broken too
<Kmos> I need someone to check & upload this package: http://kmos.homeip.net/~kmos/ddclient/
<xxxxx1> hello coNP :)
<ScottK> elmargol: Don't upload it to mentors.
<elmargol> ScottK: the source the patch or the .deb?
<ScottK> The .diff
<ScottK> The source patch.
<zul> upload the debdiff to launchpad
<elmargol> 36K
<ScottK> How big is the tarball?
<elmargol> 2.2M
<ScottK> E-mail me the tarball, diff, and .dsc and I'll put them somewhere where people can get them.
<ScottK> ubuntu@kitterman.com
<elmargol> ScottK: the email in on the way
<ScottK> OK.  I use greylisting so it may be a bit before I actually get it.  I'll give you a link you can use once it's up.
<RainCT> rob: nothing new?
<elmargol> ScottK: did you get my mail?
<ScottK> Yes.  
<elmargol> does it look ok?
<ScottK> I haven't looked yet.  I just saw it.
<ScottK> Kmos: If you are going to edit a bug, please edit it correctly.  In Bug 127922 there are several changelog entries missing between what was there before and what you added.  Please add the rest or revert your change.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 127922 in feisty-backports "Please backport lighttpd v1.4.16 from Gutsy to Feisty" [Wishlist,Won't fix]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/127922
<Kmos> ScottK: ok
<ScottK> elmargol: People can dget your package using http://www.kitterman.com/test/gnunet_0.7.2b-1ubuntu1.dsc
<coNP> Anyone using lighttpd on dapper/edgy/feisty and want to test some security updates?
<ScottK> I'd suggest you download it and make sure nothing got mangled in the mailing.
<ScottK> coNP: IIRC, sommer said he'd do it.
<coNP> Cool. I asked on -server as well. No reply so far. But we have time :)
<ScottK> coNP: leonel (not on now) is another one.
<coNP> Today is tribe4-release day so I don't expect many people having time today
<sommer> hey coNP, ScottK...count me in.
<sommer> I'm in and out  on irc so if you need something you might try email as well :)
<ScottK> sommer: Did you get the bug# for the patches to test?
<sommer> 127922?
<sommer> backport from gutsy to feisty.
<ScottK> elmargol: I took a quick look at your update and two things lept out at me...  You have a bunch of .svn files in your debian dir.  Remove those.  Also, update maintainer according to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebianMaintainerField.  When you have an updated package, mail me again (no need to resend the tarball) and I'll put it up for you again.  I did not give it a detailed review.
<coNP> sommer: bug 127718 is that needs testing
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 127718 in lighttpd "lighttpd security fixes" [High,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/127718
<sommer> ah...I'll take a look.
<elmargol> what is a XSBC-Original-Maintainer field?
<coNP> elmargol: havea a look at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebianMaintainerField
<elmargol> ah ok
<sommer> is doc.ubuntu.com down?
<sommer> this link doesn't seem to work for me:  http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/index.html
<Nafallo> isn't that help.ubuntu.com?
<Nafallo> it's help. not doc.
<sommer> ah thanks Nafallo
<sommer> I've got the wrong link in by bookmarks.
<RainCT> rob: ping
<ScottK> elmargol: Are there any Ubuntu unique changes in your package (now that the svn cruft is out I can actually read it)?
<elmargol> I think this package should also work on debian unstable
<ScottK> OK.
<elmargol> I basicaly used the existing debian directory from debian unstable. and made it working
<ScottK> I misread version numbers.
<elmargol> and did use the new upstream version
<ScottK> I missed the upstream version number difference.
<ScottK> Nevermind.
<ScottK> It looks better, but the version should be -0ubuntu1, not -1ubuntu1.
<ScottK> Fix that and I'll put it on my web site again.
<ScottK> I don't have time for detailed reviewing today.
<ScottK> elmargol: http://www.kitterman.com/test/gnunet_0.7.2b-0ubuntu1.dsc
<elmargol> thx
<sommer> coNP: is this the link for the feisty debdiff?  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/lighttpd/+bug/127718/comments/4
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 127718 in lighttpd "lighttpd security fixes" [High,In progress]  
<sommer> Just want to be sure I know what I'm doing.
<sommer> or relatively sure
<desertc> Hello is there a website I can look at for tips on how I can assist the packaging projects?
<bddebian> Heya gang
<xxxxx1> bddebian!
<bddebian> Hi xxxxx1
<elmargol> desertc: topic
<ScottK> Kmos: On Bug #127922, that's progress.  Now add lighttpd (1.4.16-2) and (1.4.16-2ubuntu1) changelog entries at the top and it will be correct and complete.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 127922 in feisty-backports "Please backport lighttpd v1.4.16 from Gutsy to Feisty" [Wishlist,Won't fix]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/127922
<trainpic> hi i have a data file thats a single file and needs to be packaged.
<ScottK> sommer: That's the correct debdiff.
<trainpic> i looked at the packaging tutorials and they were just for compiling programs to make packages
<sommer> ScottK: thanks it's building now.
<Kmos> ScottK: ok, thx
<ScottK> OK.
<geser> Hi bddebian
<Kmos> ScottK: can you do something about this - http://kmos.homeip.net/~kmos/ddclient/ (REVU is down)
<bddebian> Heya geser
<ScottK> Kmos: No time for reviewing today.  Sorry.
<ScottK> Maybe bddebian would review it.  He needs to get back in practice.  ;-)
<Kmos> :)
<Kmos> bddebian: have time for it ?
<bddebian> I'll take a look
<geser> Kmos: can you merge ddclient with Debian?
<bddebian> Are we in UVF or what atm?
<geser> UVF is on Aug 16th
<bddebian> Eeks
<bddebian> Kmos: Is this a Debian merge?
<Kmos> geser: i think they used our package
<Kmos> bddebian: no
<Kmos> geser: for the last release they've done
<geser> Kmos: ddclient 3.7.3-1 got uploaded to Debian yesterday
<bddebian> So could it be synced?
<Kmos> i need to see
<Kmos> i've made a lot of changes
<bddebian> Speaking of syncs, ivtv looks like it could be a sync to me??
<bddebian> Kmos: Either way, I would merge the new debian package
<Kmos> i'm the package done since 7 aug. :(
<Kmos> let's check it
<Kmos> i'm a member of ddclient team :)
<bddebian> Sorry man :-(
<bddebian> Uh oh
<Kmos> I can merge it, and made my changes again..
<Kmos> he doesn't mention for a lot of fix's in changelog
<sommer> ScottK, coNP: lighttpd works fine as far as I can tell.  The package built fine with the debdiff applied.
<Kmos> http://kmos.homeip.net/~kmos/ddclient/ddclient-3.7.3/debian/changelog
<ScottK> sommer: Does it work?
<sommer> yes
<ScottK> Cool.
<sommer> on feisty
<sommer> I can test dapper later this evening.
<ScottK> keescook: Bug 127718 fix for Feisty is tested now.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 127718 in lighttpd "lighttpd security fixes" [High,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/127718
<ScottK> Great.
<ScottK> Please let us know.
<keescook> ScottK: cool, I'll get it uploaded.  :)
<sommer> Is there anything to test specific to the update?
<ScottK> sommer: I know little about the details of how lighttpd works.  I'd suggest looking at the changelog entries and see what's changed.
<Kmos> bddebian: bug 128634
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 128634 in crywrap "[Remove]  Please remove crywrap from Gutsy" [Unknown,Fix released]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/128634
<Kmos> bddebian: can you check this one? is as also an debdiff for stunnel4
<sommer> okay will do.  Thanks ScottK.
<sommer> should I add a comment to the bug?
<ScottK> Yes
* sommer commenting
<bddebian> Kmos: what does removal of crywrap have to do with stunnel4?
<ScottK> Kmos: Bug #127922 looks good now.  Thanks.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 127922 in feisty-backports "Please backport lighttpd v1.4.16 from Gutsy to Feisty" [Wishlist,Won't fix]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/127922
<Hobbsee> bddebian: one replaces the other
<bddebian> Ahh
<bddebian> So we are replacing an abandoned package with an orphaned one? :-)
<ScottK> Progress of a sort.
<bddebian> hah
<Kmos> bddebian :)
<Kmos> i've mailed ddclient debian maintainer about to change some things in the package :) maybe another release will come
<Kmos> bug 129566 - this one just need to be "acked"
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 129566 in stfl "Please sync stfl (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,Incomplete]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/129566
<Kmos> now I think it will builds fine
<Kmos> in all archs
<Kmos> updated at debian, I talked to maintainer
<ScottK> Kmos: I'll ack that
<bddebian> I'm trying stunnel4 now
<Kmos> ScottK: thank you 
<Kmos> bddebian: ty too
<bddebian> uploaded
<Kmos> bddebian: thanks
<Kmos> bug 128634
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 128634 in crywrap "[Remove]  Please remove crywrap from Gutsy" [Unknown,Fix released]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/128634
<Kmos> fix released ?
<Kmos> it's not removed on gutsy
<Kmos> ah.. the debian watch bug
<Kmos> :)
<Kmos> bddebian: you can mark it triaged plz ?
<bddebian> Kmos: done
<Kmos> bddebian: thanks
<Kmos> bug 129556 - this one need to be "acked"
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 129556 in socat "Please sync socat (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,Incomplete]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/129556
<Kmos> it's incomplete since 2007-08-1
<bddebian> Checking...
<Kmos> bddebian: thx
<Kmos> i be back later :)
<ScottK> I've done my good deed for the day and fixed poker-web.
<bddebian> w000t
<bddebian> :-)
<ScottK> In that package, it's got an upstream debian dir that includes a file called control.feisty.
<bddebian> heh
<ScottK> So it was diff -ruN control control.feisty > patch, patch -p0 <patch, build and test.
<ScottK> And I just realized I left the patch in the debian dir when I uploaded it.
<ScottK> Urgh.
<ScottK> Well it won't hurt anything, but it's poor form on my part.
<bddebian> You're fired :-)
<ScottK> I'll wait and see if any new bugs get reported against the new one and upload a revision that removes it in a couple of days.
* Yagisan is tempted to find it and file a bug :P
* ScottK considered filing a bug, but decided he'd just fix it.
* Yagisan is busy cursing himself for not checking gutsy's support list before buying that geforce 8500
<AndyP> bddebian: the new svk failed to build because it couldn't find libfile-temp-perl (>> 0.17), but it should be there, shouldn't it? i'm confused
<bddebian> yeah, wtf
<sommer> ScottK: I tried applying the dapper lighttpd debdiff for bug 127718 and got this message:  http://pastie.caboo.se/86319
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 127718 in lighttpd "lighttpd security fixes" [High,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/127718
<bddebian> AndyP: I would say ask an archive admin in -devel?
<ScottK> sommer: Care to figure out why it didn't apply and upload a revised debdiff?
<AndyP> i'll ask (if this 5 second lag will let me)
<sommer> ScottK: sure I'm thinking that maybe it's because I'm using 1.4.11-3ubuntu3.2 and the diff takes it to 3ubuntu3.4.
<sommer> is there a 3ubuntu3.3?
<geser> AndyP: the problem is that there is a package named libfile-temp-perl and perl-modules providing libfile-temp-perl
<ScottK> sommer: Yes.
<ScottK> It
<ScottK> It's in dapper-updates
<sommer> mmm...I just did updates and it didn't pull it.
<ScottK> I gues you have the one from dapper-proposed still.
<sommer> ah...probably
* sommer checking config
<ScottK> deb-src dapper-updates?
<sommer> yep looks like it.
<geser> AndyP: sbuild is happy with the one from perl-modules but dpkg-buildpackage isn't as provides can't be versioned
<bddebian> Gahh
<AndyP> ah i see, well that's a pain
<geser> AndyP: ask a build admin if there is a work-around
<ScottK> AndyP: IIRC you have to build-dep something like libfile-temp-perl (version stuff) | perl-modules  (version stuff)
<sommer> ScottK: now I have lighttpd_1.4.11-3ubuntu3.0.1, but still get a Hunk failed error.
<sommer> I'll try to create a debdiff, but it may be later today.
<ScottK> But 3.0.1 != 3.3
<sommer> uhhh...you're right.
* sommer confused
<sommer> where did I get 3.0.1...I recheck configs.
<geser> AndyP: is libfile-temp-perl provided by perl-modules good enough?
<AndyP> geser: what do you mean?
<norsetto> Lutin: where did you upload this (bug 131341)?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 131341 in mlt "Please update to latest version" [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/131341
<Lutin> norsetto: ubuntu/gutsy
<geser> AndyP: will it build with the libfile-temp-perl from perl-modules or do you need the separate one?
<norsetto> Lutin: sorry, I mean, with REVU down?
<Lutin> norsetto: not to revu. to the archive
<norsetto> Lutin: yep, thanks
<Lutin> I don't need to go through revu for this
<norsetto> Lutin: merc bien
<AndyP> geser: i'll have to look into the difference between them...
<Lutin> norsetto: de rien :)
<sommer> ScottK: figured it out, I did't have universe enabled in updates...sigh
<sommer> patch worked fine.
<ScottK> Great.
<sommer> ScottK: quick question about the clamav backport project.  I think everything is tested is it time to move on to the backport part?
<ScottK> sommer: I need some time to sit down and digest it all.
<ScottK> Make sure we haven't forgotten something important.
<sommer> cool...probably be good to have some others test as well.
* AndyP finishes chastising the person who caused his lag and gets back on the case
<bddebian> heh
<mok0> /bye
<bddebian> Gah, forget the unmet deps, sheesh
<highvoltage> hello bddebian!
<sommer> ScottK: The lighttpd dapper patch works fine.  
<ScottK> Great.  Please comment in the bug.
<sommer> just did.
<sommer> I currently don't have edgy installed on anything, so can't test that one.
<ScottK> keescook: Bug 127718 tested for Dapper.  I don't know that we are going to find anyone to test Edgy, so I'd recommend you review the diff and publish it if you are comfortable.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 127718 in lighttpd "lighttpd security fixes" [High,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/127718
<ScottK> sommer: Thanks.
<sommer> sure no problem.
<keescook> ScottK: cool, pulling now.  :)
<ScottK> Great.
<ScottK> leonel: I've forgotten, do you have Edgy?
<RainCT> has someone tried to build a package with pbuilder-dist?
<RainCT> nvm.
<bddebian> Heya highvoltage
<leonel> ScottK:  had edgy 
<leonel> ScottK: do you need to  test  something ?
<ScottK> leonel: Bug 127718 needs the edgy fix tested.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 127718 in lighttpd "lighttpd security fixes" [High,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/127718
<ScottK> Could you do that?
<leonel> checking ..
<keescook> ScottK: btw, is this fixed in gutsy already?
<ScottK> Yes
<keescook> okay, I'll close the gutsy task
<ScottK> These fixes are all backported from the Gutsy release.
<leonel> ScottK: so dapper and feisty  are done and  edgy is missing ?
<ScottK> Right
<ScottK> BTW, I just said nice things about you on the ubuntu-server mailing list.
<leonel> :)  thanks
<leonel> ScottK: do I need to apply the  debdiff  ?
<leonel> for edgy ?
<ScottK> Yes
<leonel> ScottK: so  apt-get source      and then ???
<leonel> patch -p0 < file.debdiff ?
<ScottK> download the patch from the bug
<ScottK> yes
<leonel> ok
<ScottK> then build, install, and test.
<ScottK> keescook: We do have a tester for Edgy for lighttpd
* keescook hugs leonel :)
<leonel> :)
<leonel> going  to edgy ...
#ubuntu-motu 2007-08-10
* Starting logfile irclogs/ubuntu-motu.log
(ajmitch/#ubuntu-motu) hello
<DarkSun88> Hello ajmitch :)
<halcyonCorsair> ajmitch: an ubuntu motu, huh? i still stick by what i said in tele301, gentoo is way better ;P
<ajmitch> halcyonCorsair: ok, if so, why are you here? :)
<halcyonCorsair> ajmitch: because i have a big stick, and i like to stir things? .... no, its because i was having trouble writing an init-script for ubuntu
<ajmitch> heh :)
<TheMuso> OOOO/quit
<ajmitch> tried using #!/bin/bash ?
<halcyonCorsair> hey! good idea, i just had #!/bin/gcc at the top ;P
<ajmitch> some things never change, do they
<StevenK> halcyonCorsair: Surely #!/usr/bin/gcc -O7 -funroll-all-loops .... :-)
<halcyonCorsair> StevenK: well, i considered it, but i decided to optimise out all that extra typing :)
<LaserJock> StevenK: that's not nearly long enough
<ajmitch> not optimised enough
<LaserJock> my CFLAGS were like 4 or 5 lines long when I ran Gentoo
<StevenK> LaserJock: Agreed. I ran out of GCC optimiser flags that I could remember.
<ajmitch> then you saw the light
<LaserJock> I spent like 1-2 days letting this cool app optimize my flags, just for the heck of it
<StevenK> Now the 4 or 5 line CFLAGS are in all of the motu science packages ....
* StevenK ducks.
<LaserJock> then spent 2+ days compiling KDE
<LaserJock> StevenK: mwhahahaha, you know it ;-)
<ScottK> Good night all.  I'm out of steam.
<StevenK> Night ScottK 
<nixternal> interesting...I had an app FTBS earlier today, but in the PPA, it builds fine now...it was due to broken deps on kdelibs4-dev at the time...so in order to fix the breakage earlier, how do I go about doing that?
<ajmitch> nixternal: beg an archive admin for a giveback?
<nixternal> hehe
* nixternal does just that then
<RAOF> So, I've got a couple of "waiting on Debian" packages queued up: miro & deluge-torrent.
<RAOF> With UVF fast approaching, what's the right approach?  Wait for debian, and ask for a UVFe?
<RAOF> Or just package the new upstreams, and sync in Gutsy+1?
<nixternal> and that archive admin has now been bugged :)
<ajmitch> wait & ask & sync
<ajmitch> depends on how long you expect to wait for debian
<RAOF> So, deluge-torrent has an active maintainer, and the upgrade is simple.  That shouldn't be too long.
<guardian_> is it possible to pass CFLAGS as command line when launching dpkg-buildpackage ?
<RAOF> Miro, sadly, is a different matter.  The maintainer's active, but libboost-python is broken in Sid.  And will be until (1) they do the python2.5 transition or (2) Someone makes libboost build against all supported pyversions
<RAOF> guardian: Kinda, but generally no.
<guardian> i have an arch independant package
<guardian> i have an arch independant source package
<guardian> however, i would like to use very special CFLAGS to build for the nokia n800 internet tablet
<RAOF> The democracy/miro maintainer assures me he's working on a package, but I haven't heard from him in a bit.
<RAOF> guardian: debian/rules is your friend, or should be.
<RAOF> guardian: If you're building *on* an n800, that should be easy, just detect the arch and set CFLAGS appropriately.
<RAOF> guardian: If you're cross-compiling, then debian/rules is still what you're after, but I've no experience.
<guardian> ok
<elmargol> RAOF: I'm quite familiar whit the miro packages
<RAOF> elmargol: Oh, cool?
<elmargol> had someone time to review my gnunet packages?
<elmargol> RAOF: I was involved in the democracy -> miro migration (with upstream)
<RAOF> elmargol: Ah, awesome.  Know anything about the gstreamer backend?
<elmargol> http://www.kitterman.com/test/gnunet_0.7.2b-0ubuntu1.dsc <-
<elmargol> RAOF: gstreamer works but xine is more tested atm
<RAOF> elmargol: Is that the gnu CIL runtime?
<elmargol> CIL?
<RAOF> Common Intermediate Language.  mono & .NET implement it.
<elmargol> No, it is an anonymous p2p framework
<RAOF> Heh.
<elmargol> Like freenet or MUTE
<ajmitch> no, the gnu CIL runtime is dotgnu portable.net
* RAOF stands corrected.
<ajmitch> which really needs updated in debian & fixed up
<elmargol> gnunet is atm broken on every debian bases distro
<RAOF> elmargol: Anyway, I'd like to migrate the Ubuntu packages to the gstreamer backend if at all possible.  Are you still in contact with upstream?
<elmargol> RAOF: gstreamer is already in place. You only have to set a gconf entry
<RAOF> elmargol: Yes, I know.  Well, and revert a patch that removes the option, 'cause it segfaults when more than one output is available :)
<elmargol> RAOF: /join #miro
<RAOF> elmargol: Aw, make me do work? :P
<white> !info poppler sid
<ubotu> Package poppler does not exist in sid
<white> ubotu: stupid thing, learn source packages
<StevenK> Hah
<white> !info puppler-utils sid
<ubotu> Package puppler-utils does not exist in sid
<white> !info poppler-utils sid
<ubotu> poppler-utils: PDF utilitites (based on libpoppler). In component main, is optional. Version 0.5.4-6 (sid), package size 100 kB, installed size 276 kB
<StevenK> white: poppler |    0.5.4-6 |      unstable | source
<white> StevenK: nope, 0.5.4-6.1 (once that NMU shows up)
<white> !info poppler-utils gutsy
<ubotu> poppler-utils: PDF utilitites (based on libpoppler). In component main, is optional. Version 0.5.9-0ubuntu1 (gutsy), package size 110 kB, installed size 296 kB
<white> hmm 0.5.9 probably includes the security patch
<StevenK> white: That's based on rmadison -s unstable poppler
<white> StevenK: well i normally use dak ls (which is new madison) on merkel.debian.org :)
<StevenK> dak ls *is* madison
<white> StevenK: i wish the girls would come back
<StevenK> When dak was still on auric (geez, that was a while ago), I had a jennifer wrapper in my ~/bin
<white> StevenK: if we have to upgrade the dak for debian-edu, i will have aliases
<TheMuso> Hobbsee!
<Hobbsee> heya TheMuso 
<Hobbsee> oh, MOTU meeting must have been hours ago
<StevenK> About 2:30 or so
* Hobbsee reads backscroll
<white> Hobbsee: you look like you want to fix a segfault bug on amd64 :)
<RAOF> Na, amd64 is my thing.
<white> debian bug #423606
<ubotu> Debian bug 423606 in k3dsurf "segmentation fault of k3dsurf on start up" [Normal,Open]  http://bugs.debian.org/423606
<white> RAOF: there you go
<RAOF> That looks like KDE.  I retract my amd64 prowess :)
* RAOF adds "fix apt-proxy" to his TODO, and goes off to not think.
<StevenK> Hah, apt-proxy can't be fixed.
<white> ok, whoever works on that debian bug, i will be grateful ;)
<RAOF> StevenK: Well, it can have a 1 line patch applied, which allows it to *start* at least :P
<Fujitsu> Is LP being incredibly slow for anyone else tonight?
<ajmitch> heh
<ajmitch> no, it's fine here
<ajmitch> you just filed a sync request at the same time I did
<ajmitch> bug 131473, 131474
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 131473 in libbusiness-onlinepayment-transactioncentral-perl "Please sync libbusiness-onlinepayment-transactioncentral-perl (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/131473
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 131474 in libbusiness-onlinepayment-transactioncentral-perl "Please sync libbusiness-onlinepayment-transactioncentral-perl (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/131474
<StevenK> Ouch. That package name sucks.
* StevenK runs off home.
<ajmitch> no kidding
<ajmitch> that's probably why we both synced it
<ajmitch> makes the rc bug list too wide
<Fujitsu> Hah, so I did.
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: That's why I attacked it, yep.
<Fujitsu> I was annoyed that I couldn't see the comments :(
* ajmitch is test building gmod & gem to sync them
* Fujitsu is looking at camstream and flim
<rgl> hello.
<Fujitsu> Hm, I think LP is infinitely redirecting https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/flim/1:1.14.8+0.20061220-1
<Fujitsu> Can somebody else try that, please?
<rgl> wnyone running latest clamav 0.91.1 on dapper?
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: broken for me
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: It works without distros/... fix it kthxbye.
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: probably the 'distros' part in the URL
* Fujitsu files a bug.
<ajmitch> gmod == suck
<Fujitsu> Hah.
<ajmitch> dpkg-gencontrol: error: current build architecture amd64 does not appear in package's list (i386)
<ajmitch> dh_gencontrol: command returned error code 65280
<Fujitsu> Bwahaha.
<ajmitch> ok, changed the bug list
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: Danke.
<ajmitch> I need to change the url bits
<ajmitch> .dsc files don't have the epoch
<Fujitsu> Speaking of epochs... they cause the eternal redirection.
<ajmitch> no surprise
<ajmitch> probably for the same reason
<Fujitsu> Why aren't epochs in filenames? Isn't it only Windows that has a fit with them?
<ajmitch> no idea
* Hobbsee attempts to read the meeting log, and notes it would be easier if her connection didnt keep dropping out!
* ajmitch shouldn't touch gem, though it should be remerged by StevenK 
<Hobbsee> bah. speak of the devil.
<ajmitch> hello Hobbsee 
<Hobbsee> at least it only drops the ssh connection now...
* TheMuso forgot about the meeting. What happened?
<TheMuso> And I was in transit somewhere else anyway...
<ajmitch> mostly just discussion about qa & policies for new packages in gutsy+1
* Hobbsee was in uni prac
* ajmitch took off from work early
<TheMuso> Sounds lke I didn't really miss much.
<ajmitch> nah
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: Would it be feasible to have a title attribute on the bug link with the summary?
<ajmitch> maybe
* Fujitsu adds a couple more faces to his cube.
<ajmitch> I'll see what data I have access to at that point without having to rewrite it
<Fujitsu> It's not particularly important, but it'd be nice to have.
<Hobbsee> white: i so dont.
<Lutin> avr-libc fails to build with the following error: tetex-bin(inst 2007-10 ! <= wanted 3.0-30)|texlive-extra-utils(missing)  . it requires texlive (>= 2007-4), but we have 2007-12ubuntu1 . can it be caused by the order of the alternatives ?
<white> Hobbsee: :/
<ajmitch> poor white 
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: The Debian `Grab' link points to the fixed version, not the latest. Thus it often 404s.
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: fixed
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: Thanks.
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: removed the epoch from urls as well, check if they're all still valid
<ajmitch> hm, no
* ajmitch fixes
<ajmitch> forgot to return
<Fujitsu> Hah.
<ajmitch> getting None as a version in a url isn't helpful
<Fujitsu> Quite possibly nor.
<Fujitsu> *not
* ajmitch testbuilds boinc-app-seti
<ajmitch> widest version field :)
<Fujitsu> I was about to look at that one.
<ajmitch> previous change was just a rebuild
* Fujitsu attacks haskell-src-exts
<Fujitsu> (longest Debian version)
<Fujitsu> Hm, VCS checkout. Maybe not.
<ajmitch> then flim
<Fujitsu> I've already requested that, AFAICR.
<ajmitch> ok
<Fujitsu> Hum, maybe not.
* Fujitsu checks.
<Fujitsu> Looks like I didn't end up doing it for some reason.
<Fujitsu> Oh, right, got distracted by the redirections being stupid.
<ajmitch> comment field is useful then?
<Fujitsu> Not in this case, is it?
<ajmitch> in general
<Fujitsu> Ah, yes.
* ajmitch needs a faster build box
* Fujitsu grabs libmasonx-interp-withcallbacks-perl
* Hobbsee grabs Fujitsu, and throws him out the window.
<Fujitsu> Yay, defenstration.
<Fujitsu> *defenestration
<ajmitch> lucky seb128
<coNP> Hi everyone! 
<ajmitch> hello
<white> hi
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: yes, in a classic act of antidisestablishmentarianism.
<coNP> Do you know where packages are that have been accepted in Debian but there are manual override issue because of new binary packages?
<white> coNP: NEW ?
<coNP> No, package updates with new binary packages (because of library soname changes)
<white> coNP: http://ftp-master.debian.org/new.html
<coNP> I wanted to sync openbox 3.4.4 but cannot find it neither on incoming.d.o nor at packages.d.o
<ajmitch> still in NEW
<white> coNP: new binary packages always go through NEW
<coNP> Cool, thanks. Can someone file a sync request against these packages?
<ajmitch> can't sync from NEW
<white> coNP: NEW is not accessable
<white> coNP: only for the ftp team (and some other groups)
<coNP> I see. It was the very moment I wanted to ask where I can get the source :)
<ajmitch> http://arstechnica.com/journals/linux.ars/2007/07/27/firefox-to-support-scripting-with-ironpython-and-ironruby
<ajmitch> interesting
<ajmitch> I guess the ironpython package should be updated :)
<white> coNP: ask the maintainer :)
<coNP> Yes I guess this will be the case.
<coNP> I want this package to get into Ubuntu before it gets frozen
<white> coNP: which one?
<coNP> Actually I wanted to have the this-0.0.2 release, but I was told to send my patches to Debian so that we can sync.
<coNP> white: 3.4.4.
<white> coNP: that is which $package?
<coNP> Sorry, openbox. 
<white> coNP: see if they have it on alioth and maybe build it yourself there?
<coNP> (Actually I have written that earlier :))
<white> coNP: although I would probably suggest waiting until it is in debian
<ajmitch> these debian people just go out of their way to make things hard :)
<coNP> I would want to wait.
<coNP> But we have a freeze next week :)
<coNP> IIRC
<white> ah did not know that
<white> coNP: well is it smart to bring a new big package in, so close before a freeze?
<ajmitch> it's hardly  a new package
<ajmitch> coNP: ubuntu changes are being dropped?
<ajmitch> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=433788 <-- such a helpful changelog entry
<ubotu> Debian bug 433788 in mediawiki1.10 "mediawiki1.10: The installation fails in the post-installation script" [Serious,Fixed]  
<coNP> Wow. DSL again :(
<coNP> No, not dropped. Sent to the Debian maintainer.
<coNP> ajmitch: ^^
<ajmitch> so they're not included in 3.4.4-1?
<coNP> So they *are*
<ajmitch> ok, so the delta is being dropped :)
<coNP> At least they are supposed to be.
<coNP> I want to check.
<coNP> Therefore I asked if I can get the package.
<coNP> I wanted to merge an earlier version, but Hobbsee said let's put the delta to Debian so that it disappears
<rgl> are the packages maintained in CVS/Subversion/Whatever?
<pygi> tedp, synced :)
<coNP> Can a core-dev please review a/o sponsor my magyarispell update package (Hungarian spell checker 0.99 -> 1.2)? It has been put to http://www.inf.bme.hu/~aron/ubuntu/magyarispell_1.2-0ubuntu1.dsc (for the time REVU is down). It has also been reviewed and advocated by persia but the we found out that it is a main package so I need a core dev sponsor.
<norsetto> Anyone would disagree me working on bug 131325?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 131325 in conky "Gutsy uses old version of conky." [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/131325
<ajmitch> I don't think we'll complain a lot
* Fujitsu kicks and screams.
<ajmitch> though it's not a particularly old version that we have
<norsetto> ajmitch: thats correct
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: loaded seb128 with enough sync requests yet?
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: Only a few. I'll do more after dinner.
<norsetto> ajmitch: perhaps you have something else to keep me busy?
<ajmitch> nah, go ahead with conky
* ajmitch is just working through http://django.ajmitch.net.nz/rcbugs/
<Fujitsu> Only 14 so far :(
<norsetto> ok, will do, thanks
<ajmitch> though I'd better have some dinner
<ajmitch> uw-imap, I'd rather file a removal request for that
<Fujitsu> Hehehe.
<ajmitch> fix is only in experimental, too
<Fujitsu> Oh, fun.
<ajmitch> the bug is only that it has some RFCs
<ajmitch> mm, fam
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: How often does that list get updated?
<Fujitsu> (wondering when all the synced stuff will vanish)
<ajmitch> every 12 hours, iirc
<Fujitsu> OK.
<ajmitch> or whenever I feel like running the script
<Fujitsu> Might be nice to poke it at 20:40 or so.
<ajmitch> a bunch of sync requests were processed?
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: Yep, seb128 is doing them all now.
<Fujitsu> Most of mine are done.
<ajmitch> ok
<ajmitch> :0:> at 11pm
<ajmitch> warning: commands will be executed using /bin/sh
<ajmitch> at> /home/ajmitch/debian/ubuntu/scripts/bugs.sh
<ajmitch> at> <EOT>
<ajmitch> job 3 at Fri Aug 10 23:00:00 2007
<ajmitch> I lied about every 12 hours, it's every 24h at 2am
<AndyP> morning folks
<ajmitch> hi
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: Ah, thanks.
<Fujitsu> Hi AndyP.
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: problem is that these comments don't expire
<ajmitch> so next time the same package has a problem, the old comments will resurface
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: I was wondering if that was handled.
<Fujitsu> That sounds suboptimal.
<ajmitch> comments are tied to packages, not to bugs
<Fujitsu> Why not store them per-bug, rather than per-packagE?
<ajmitch> because I didn't feel like doing it that way at the time :)
<Fujitsu> Heh, OK.
<ajmitch> though it wouldn't be hard to change
<ajmitch> maybe 10 minutes
<Fujitsu> That would probably be good.
<Fujitsu> When you have the time, that is.
<pygi> siretart, !
<ajmitch> hm, maybe a little longer
<ajmitch> I may look at it tomorrow if I have time
<Fujitsu> Thanks.
* AndyP realises a meeting happened while he was asleep and reads the backscroll
<StevenK> Heh
<martoss> hi there
<martoss> is there sth like a fakeroot or so i can use in debian/control ?
<TheMuso> grrr. Mutt on my notebook is not picking up new email in my mail boxes.
<martoss> i am trying to package an ugly proprietary package.
<Fujitsu> martoss: You need to modify the installation scripts.
<stgraber> erk, has anyone already see that : E: Type 'deb http://ch.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu gutsy main restricted universe multiverse' is not known on line 1 in source list /etc/apt/sources.list
<stgraber> this is a pbuilder error I have with RainCT script ...
<stgraber> (when pbuilder creating)
<siretart> pygi: ?
<pygi> siretart, multisession support, reading support, iso tree modification support, etc, etc
<siretart> pygi: :)
<pygi> by far the best implementation of that features FOSS world has ever seen, siretart ;)
<siretart> woohooo!
<TheMuso> pygi: Sounds awesome.
<pygi> TheMuso, it *IS* awesome :)
<TheMuso> Is gnome et al using libburn yet?
<pygi> siretart, seems also we've got our first real contributor there, wohoooo :)
<pygi> TheMuso, not really
<siretart> pygi: who is it?
<pygi> but they will, have patience
<pygi> siretart, some folk who initially wrote java bindings
<pygi> he wrote some libisofs code (for multisesion part), he now knows the codebase
<siretart> what's his name?
<pygi> Vreixo
<pygi> TheMuso, they don't have much choice ... :)
<ajmitch> hey siretart 
<TheMuso> pygi: Right.
<TheMuso> hmmm. I think mutt is not finding my mail because of the stupid indexer...
* Fujitsu wonders what fujistu is going to think when he sees 9 accepted emails.
<pygi> TheMuso, you should use puddle :)
* pygi now hides before TheMuso asks what that is :P
<TheMuso> what is puddle?
<ajmitch> TheMuso: set check_mbox_size
* pygi knew TheMuso will ask that xD
<TheMuso> ajmitch: Ok will do, thanks.
<ajmitch> TheMuso: mutt usually relies on file atime, which tracker screws up
<pygi> TheMuso, it's a CLI mail app based on tinymail :)
<siretart> hey ajmitch !
<TheMuso> ajmitch: Yeah I know.
<TheMuso> ajmitch: You're a life saver. I owe you one.
<ajmitch> np
<TheMuso> pygi: I will stick with mutt as long as I live.
<TheMuso> It took a while to configure to my liking, and I am not going to throw that away.
<pygi> TheMuso, that's bad :)
<TheMuso> pygi: In your opinion. :)
<pygi> TheMuso, right ^_^
<pygi> siretart, well, back to new victories
<martoss> why is a "cd src" not changing the directory in the rules file?
<martoss> is each line executed in a new shell?
<Fujitsu> It's a Makefile, so I believe so.
<Fujitsu> martoss: ^^
<martoss> hmm, ok its now in the right directory but not working as expected :-(
<martoss> its properly installing the menu entry and the docs but nothing else
<martoss> and modifying the "install scripts" is not an option, so I guess i have to live with checkinstall.
<geser> martoss: why is modifying the install scripts not an option?
<martoss> ok, the program is called vmd, a molecular viewer.
<martoss> they ship it with a ./configure script which generates a Makefile in the src directory.
<martoss> both of them. ./configure and make do not behave like "standard ones" at all, so no prefix= and so on.
<martoss> if i modify the install script (./configure) i have to mess with it at every update.
<halcyonCorsair> i'm having a problem with start-stop-daemon seemingly not passing arguments correctly, can anyone help?
<geser> or you could try to convince upstream to use a "standard" configure script or at least add some options to configure the prefix, etc.
<martoss> geser, yep, tried that already with a similar package.
<martoss> basically the suggestion is always to "just use" the provided installation scripts.
<Kmos> seb128 re-subscribed bug 129551 because it doesn't have comment: Ack'ed
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 129551 in watchdog "Please sync watchdog (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,Triaged]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/129551
<Kmos> re-subscribed to U-U-S
<white> !info viewvc gutsy
<ubotu> Package viewvc does not exist in gutsy
<white> !info viewcvs gutsy
<ubotu> viewcvs: view CVS Repositories via HTTP. In component universe, is optional. Version 0.9.2+cvs.1.0.dev.2004.07.28-4.1 (gutsy), package size 326 kB, installed size 1436 kB
<white> someone wants to upgrade that (and maybe fix the damn version in sid and check the patch there :) )
<white> !info backup-manager gutsy
<ubotu> backup-manager: command-line backup tool. In component universe, is optional. Version 0.7.6-1 (gutsy), package size 111 kB, installed size 604 kB
<white> !info poppler-utils sid
<ubotu> poppler-utils: PDF utilitites (based on libpoppler). In component main, is optional. Version 0.5.4-6 (sid), package size 100 kB, installed size 276 kB
<white> pff takes ages ...
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: right, the list is cleared of most sync requests now
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: Great, thanks.
* Fujitsu kills some more.
<ajmitch> pykerberos sounds interesting
<ajmitch> seems like it's considered api stable
* ajmitch fetches
<TheMuso> argh.
* TheMuso attempts to adjust to a new workflow.,
<ajmitch> TheMuso: which one is that?
<TheMuso> ajmitch: I am running gutsy, which means no speakup, so I have to use GUi entirely.
<ajmitch> ouch
<Kmos> can someone add a comment "acked" to bug 129551 because it doesn't have it and seb128 re-subscribed it to U-U-S
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 129551 in watchdog "Please sync watchdog (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,Triaged]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/129551
<Kmos> it's already triaged by hoora_ 
<Kmos> Hobbsee: 
<Kmos> :)
<TheMuso> ajmitch: Its probably for the best longterm anyway.
<ajmitch> TheMuso: why?
<TheMuso> ajmitch: Speakup as far as code goes is... well.. words cannot describe the horror that it is.
<ajmitch> heh
<TheMuso> And, text mode browsers are not cutting it as well on the web any more, particularly elinks with launchpad.
<ajmitch> how useful is having only the gui for you?
<halcyonCorsair> hmm
<Hobbsee> ScottK: posting on the forums hey?
<TheMuso> ajmitch: Well its not too bad. It certainly means the gnome a11y will get a more thorough test and bug reporting.
<TheMuso> And if things die, I can still recover gracefully, due to having some sight.
<ajmitch> halcyonCorsair: still having issues?
<halcyonCorsair> ajmitch: yeah, damn wabbits
<Amaranth> Hobbsee: Is there some KDE4 metapackage I can install? Want to try it out
<Hobbsee> Amaranth: kde4base, iirc
<TheMuso> uuajAnd I have wanted to move this way for ages, because like you others, I actually do appreciate looking at a deacent screen, and not having text only staring back at me.
<halcyonCorsair> ajmitch: i think it turns out to be because the author of the program i'm writing the init-script for uses "s for an argument.....like so:
<halcyonCorsair> ajmitch: /usr/local/sbin/vgate-capture eth2 10.32.0.0 255.255.0.0 vlan "ip and net 10.32.0.0/16 and not net 192.168.10.0/24"
<ajmitch> ah, that'll make things fun
<Amaranth> Hobbsee: That will install everything I need to pick 'KDE4' from gdm and login? :)
<ajmitch> so you need to try & quote things in exactly the right manner
<Hobbsee> Amaranth: unsure, check kubuntu.org
<Amaranth> the beta is already packaged, right?
<halcyonCorsair> yeah....and bash ISN'T exactly cooperating....and probably fair enough
<Hobbsee> Amaranth: yes
* Amaranth wants to play with kwin
<Amaranth> From what I've read kwin does things compiz could never hope to
<Amaranth> mostly gracefully scale from texture_from_pixmap to copy rendering to software rendering
<white> !info apache2 gutsy
<ubotu> apache2: Next generation, scalable, extendable web server. In component main, is optional. Version 2.2.4-3 (gutsy), package size 40 kB, installed size 92 kB
<ajmitch> white: more security fun?
<white> ajmitch: always :) 
<white> apache2 is on my list, because testing is not yet fixed, unstable is though
<TheMuso> Ah that reminds me. I should test accessibility with compiz, not that it will result in much I fear.
<TheMuso> Accessibility plus compiz seem slike an oximoron.
<TheMuso> to me anyway.
<white> ajmitch: you might want to sync backup-manager and viewvc from unstable though 
<white> ajmitch: and maybe incorporate the NMU for poppler or just sync it once it shows up
<ajmitch> backup-manager just looks to be a path change for docs
<ajmitch> unless it hasn't hit the PTS yet
<white> ajmitch: it now uses a CONF file to do the ugly sql magic, instead of using the sql pw with the comand line
<ajmitch>     viewvc |    1.0.3-2 | http://archive.ubuntu.com gutsy/universe Sources viewvc |    1.0.3-2 | http://http.us.debian.org sid/main Sources
<ajmitch> viewvc is already the same version according to what I can see locally
<white> ah ok, my fault
<ajmitch> what was the reason for either of those?
<martoss> if i wanna suggest some changes (enabling features) on a package in universe, what's the best way to do this? file a bug report with patch?
* ajmitch saw nothing about sql passwords
<ajmitch> martoss: generally yes
<white> ajmitch: bah that was in -1 which is already in gutsy
<ajmitch> though there are a lot of packages, so someone may not see the patch
<white> seems i am not totally awake
<white> !info poppler-utils gutsy
<ubotu> poppler-utils: PDF utilitites (based on libpoppler). In component main, is optional. Version 0.5.9-0ubuntu1 (gutsy), package size 110 kB, installed size 296 kB
<white> !info poppler-utils sid
<ubotu> poppler-utils: PDF utilitites (based on libpoppler). In component main, is optional. Version 0.5.4-6 (sid), package size 100 kB, installed size 276 kB
<white> hmm the fix is probably present, so it would be worthwile checking
<white> 0.5.4-6.1 will have it in
<ajmitch> it's in main, too
<white> !info xpdf gutsy
<ubotu> xpdf: Portable Document Format (PDF) suite. In component universe, is optional. Version 3.02-1.1ubuntu1 (gutsy), package size 1 kB, installed size 36 kB
<martoss> So, is it then better to get involved somehow myself?
<ajmitch> maybe seb128 or pitti would know about it
<white> someone should check, that the patch from 3.02-1.1 is in 3.02-1.1ubuntu1
<ajmitch> it ought to be, given the version :)
<white> but it probably is according to the version number
<white> hmm seems someone is reading the stuff i was posting here and does the syncs, nice :)
<ajmitch> that's what we do
<white> awesome :)
<ajmitch> martoss: either that, or the change *may* be best done in debian
<martoss> ok, thx
<white> ajmitch: do you already know about your flight and stuff, btw?
<ajmitch> white: nope, and they're expensive for sept
<ajmitch> seems that I have to plan at least 2 months out
<white> ajmitch: we might have a BSP on the 22nd of sept
<ajmitch> right, I won't be there for that
<ajmitch> seems now that I could be there near end of oct
<white> :/
<ajmitch> sorry
<ajmitch> if I was to visit in sept, it'd have to be in the 1st 2 weeks, and there are no cheap flights then, and there's something I want to do there in late october
<RainCT> hi
<ajmitch> hello
<elmargol> any infos why revu is down?
<Hobbsee> elmargol: see the locoteams mailing list
<elmargol> Hobbsee: ubunru-motu?
<Hobbsee> huh?
<coNP> Kmos: sorry, why did you edit status of bug 119796?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 119796 in openbox "Please merge openbox 3.4.2-2 from Debian unstable (main)" [Unknown,Fix released]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/119796
<Fujitsu> The loco-contacts mailing list.
<coNP> It is a bug assigned to me.
<white> !info linux-2.6 gutsy
<ubotu> Package linux-2.6 does not exist in gutsy
<coNP> I try to handle it to my best.
<white> *brr*
<Fujitsu> white: Our kernels are entirely separate.
<coNP> It is very annoying that someone changes its state "just because"... please at least write some explanation.
<white> Fujitsu: aren't they being maintained within alioth somewhere together with the debian team?
<Fujitsu> white: I don't believe so... it's all in Ubuntu git.
<zul__> white: you want linux-source-2.6.22 linux-2.6 is debian
<white> doesn't matter, it was just popping up here, because it is stacked in unstable :/
<elmargol> I can't find any informations about tauware on the locu mailinglist
<Fujitsu> elmargol: The mail about the servers being moved. The last couple of emails, I think.
<elmargol> ahh ok i did read this email
<Fujitsu> tiber is the server in quetion.
<Fujitsu> *question
<martoss> where can i find infos about macros in debian/rules files? e.g. to determine python version?
<StevenK> martoss: man pyversions
<geser> martoss: if you want to package a python software, please also read the Debian python policy (if not already done)
<xxxxx1> morning people!
<martoss> ah ok... 
<elmargol> Fujitsu: some time ago i asked you about the gnunet packages. i invested some time an did the packaging. Who can I ask for a review?
<elmargol> Since revu is down I can't ask there
<elmargol> bug #130666
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 130666 in gnunet "New GNUnet-0.7.2b version available" [Wishlist,Fix committed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/130666
<ScottK> Hobbsee: Only a little.
<ScottK> Good morning all.
<geser> Hi ScottK
<white> hi
<ScottK> Hello geser, white.
<coNP> hey ScottK 
<ScottK> Hello coNP.  Congrats again on your first security upload.  
<coNP> Thanks.
<ScottK> That's pretty much how they go.
<coNP> And thanks for mentoring.
<coNP> It is more easier than it seemed at first sight.
<ScottK> No problem.  The more of us who can do it, the better.
<xxxxx1> morning ScottK 
<ScottK> Good morning xxxxx1.
<coNP> Cool. I got the source packages now.
<xxxxx1> you're on u-u-s today? :)
<elmargol> ScottK: Had you time to review my package?
<ScottK> No I haven't.  I'm unlikely to have much reviewing time before tomorrow at the earliest.
<Hobbsee> yes, make ScottK do it all :P
<elmargol> Well i can't review my own package :D
<ScottK> Sure.
<coNP> Hobbsee: now that openbox Dev Maintainer has incorporated my patch what should I do with Openbox? Is it okay to modify the original sync / merge request?
<coNP> s/Dev/Deb
<ScottK> elmargol: You've just kind of hit us at a bad time for reviewing.
<Hobbsee> coNP: yeah, that works
<coNP> Cool, thanks :)
<Hobbsee> coNP: although i think Kmos played with it, and it got marked as fix released.  whichever.
<Hobbsee> coNP: when does your MOTU app go thru?
<coNP> I asked him not to do that.
<elmargol> well if we wait to long it is to late :(
<elmargol> and since the current version doesn't even work...
<ScottK> elmargol: Understand, but also please understand that everyone here is a volunteer.
<coNP> Especially since (1) it was assigned to me (2) I was working on it indeed (at least bugged the Debian Maintainer) 
<TheMuso> i/c
* Hobbsee voluntells jono to do it
<Fujitsu> If it doesn't work, a UVFe should be trivial.
<ScottK> Agreed.
<ScottK> elmargol: Particularly early on freeze exceptions aren't that hard to get.
<coNP> Hobbsee: crimsun 's opinion / ACK is missing. But some people got through it with 4 ACKs as well.
<Hobbsee> coNP: i dont think crimsun's around.
* coNP goes on holiday for a week. I hope arriving back as a MOTU :D
<ScottK> crimsun started his new job, so I don't expect him around a whole lot.
<Hobbsee> does MOTU require a TB interview?
<Fujitsu> Isn't crimsun going to be entirely missing for some time?
<Hobbsee> i dont remember
<Fujitsu> Hobbsee: Not any more
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: oh, neat
<Fujitsu> Used to, but then MOTU Council sprung into existence.
<Hobbsee> although my MOTU app was kinda fun
<Hobbsee> yeah
<coNP> Hobbsee: why?
<Hobbsee> coNP: was just curious
<coNP> I was not sure if he is around BTW, only checked who is the fifth MOTU council member.
<coNP> Hobbsee: I asked why your MOTU app was kinda fun  :)
<Hobbsee> coNP: ahhh.  because i had a lot of supporters
<coNP> Hmm. What to do with Openbox? If I wait till packages appear in unstable I miss feature freeze.
<elmargol> How can I create a repository for my package?
<coNP> But I was told we cannot sync from -NEW. However I got the packages and pbuilder says they are allright :)
<Hobbsee> coNP: feature freeze?  the one you care about is UVF
<coNP> Oh, sure. It is later I guess
* Hobbsee would accept a UVFe for that, too
<coNP> Maybe Kmos will edit the sync request anyway if the package appears in Debian.
<Hobbsee> coNP: it's your original bug.  you may as well do it
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: it must be my turn to go missing, then.
<Fujitsu> Hobbsee: Aw, why?
<xxxxx1> elmargol, i can help you. open a query
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: because bdmurray is back
<Fujitsu> Um..?
<Hobbsee> oh, sorry, bddebian
<Fujitsu> Ah.
<xxxxx1> ScottK, can you take a look at bug #66940 today?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 66940 in psi "Psi version string presents as "Debian testing/unstable" on Dapper" [Low,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/66940
<ScottK> xxxxx1: Is there a particular urgency for this?
<xxxxx1> nope
<ScottK> As long as UUS is subscribed, then I wouldn't worry about hunting up sponsors.
<ScottK> The UUS queue gets cleared relatively regularly.
<xxxxx1> ok :)
<ScottK> Also, as this is a bug fix, we have a LONG time to get it done before release.
<xxxxx1> right
* coNP leaves on holidays now. Bye everyone. 
<ScottK> Bye coNP
<xxxxx1> bye coNP 
<white> !info bugzilla gutsy
<ubotu> bugzilla: web-based bug tracking system. In component universe, is optional. Version 2.22.1-2 (gutsy), package size 804 kB, installed size 4408 kB
<white> there is a 2.22.1-2.1 coming in, which should be synced :)
<geser> RAOF: have you talked to mvo about the debdiff in bug #131035?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 131035 in compizconfig-python "Doesn't depend on python, ships .a and .la files" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/131035
<white> anyone here some time and interested in php?
<white> just having a look through lwat (and maybe looking for some vulnerabilities) would be helpful
<sommer> lwat?
<white> !info lwat gutsy
<ubotu> lwat: LDAP Web-based Administration Tool. In component universe, is optional. Version 0.15-1 (gutsy), package size 68 kB, installed size 540 kB
<sommer> ah...by look for vulnerabilities you mean in the PHP code itself?  Or there's a package update available?
<white> sommer: php code itself
<white> sommer: it came on my radar for one problem, but i would like to have someone else to look over it and check for more stuff
<white> sommer: that can give you some hints as well (but do not rely on it, it is not always accurate) 
<white> sommer: http://asdfasdf.ethz.ch/~tar/lina/rats/lwat.rats
<sommer> is there a home page for lwat?  
<sommer> I'm pretty new to PHP, but I'm interested in a web based LDAP tool.
<white> sommer: http://bzz.no/lwat/
<sommer> white: thanks
* sommer looking
<geser> white: bug #131560
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 131560 in bugzilla "[Sync request]  Sync bugzilla (2.22.1-2.1) from Debian unstable (main)" [Low,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/131560
<white> geser: thanks :)
<white> geser: i do not know about ubuntu severities. The fix is for a security bug, although not a big security issue
<geser> white: I doubt that a sync request will be proceed faster with a higher severity
<geser> Hi bddebian
<bddebian> Heya gang
<bddebian> Hi geser
<xxxxx1> hello bddebian
<bddebian> Heya xxxxx1
<kdub432> does anyone know anything about  flash package problems for for edgy?
<kdub432> in particular, the package doesnt seem to actually do anything...
<davromaniak> Good evening all
<davromaniak> I would know if there's any MOTU awake here, :)
<ScottK> Sure.  At least one.
<davromaniak> ok
<bddebian> Well awake is a relative term :-)
<davromaniak> I'm finishing the packaging of qtpfsgui, and I would if any MOTU can take a look at it in a few minutes when I will dput it in REVU
<bddebian> davromaniak: REVU is down for several days.  See /topic :-(
<davromaniak> oops, soory
<davromaniak> being a sysadmin makes me very tired
<bddebian> I hear ya
<davromaniak> nobody knows when REVU will be up again ?
<ScottK> It's being migrated to new hardware.
<ScottK> Soonish is all I've heard.
<davromaniak> ok
<ScottK> If you put the package up somewhere where people can dget it, put a link to it in an LP needs-packaging bug, and subscribe UUS, then there's no need to wait.
<davromaniak> ok
<davromaniak> http://perth.davromaniak.eu/qtpfsgui/ <== ScottK or bddebian please
<ScottK> Is there a bug for us to put comments on?
<davromaniak> yes
<davromaniak> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/106239
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 106239 in Ubuntu "[needs-packaging]  qtpfsgui" [Wishlist,In progress]  
<ScottK> I didn't see your orig.tar.gz up there.  Please upload that too.
<davromaniak> oops, sorry
<davromaniak> done
<davromaniak> hmm, what is UUS ?
<bddebian> Ubuntu Universe Sponsors
<davromaniak> ok
<davromaniak> done
<davromaniak> I think there's some problems in the debian/rules
<ScottK> davromaniak: I'd suggest add a comment to the bug so reviewers will know to focus on that.
<davromaniak> ok
<davromaniak> thank you adding it
<guardian> please, is there a way to ignore errors from postinst script ?
<guardian> i'm doing kill - SIGHUP `pidof foo`
<guardian> but some process depends on each other
<guardian> so in the end, i'm getting "no such process" error for one of the process returned by pidof
<Skiessi> xmoto 0.3.2 has been out for a while :P
<ScottK> Skiessi: Is it in Debian yet?
<Skiessi> debian repository? dunno
<ScottK> If it's there, we can probabyl easily sync it into Ubuntu.
<ScottK> packages.debian.org
<Skiessi> nah :/
<Skiessi> http://download.tuxfamily.org/xmoto/xmoto/0.3.2/xmoto-0.3.2-src.tar.gz but here's the source if someone is bored enough
* ScottK looks around and sees Skiessi....
* Skiessi is working with XHTML and PHP at the moment
<ScottK> Well maybe you'll get bored before someone else does ...
<SniperBeamer> i don't think that updating the package is a big problem
<SniperBeamer> the real problem is getting the package maintainer to update it
<ScottK> SniperBeamer: Who is the package maintainer?
<jeromeg> hello
<jeromeg> can someone review my upgrade for dvgrab : http://vv.guelf.free.fr/ubuntu/ ?
<jeromeg> i put it here cause revu is down
* norsetto doesn't think it is worth updating xmoto
<jeromeg> anyone please ?
<norsetto> jeromeg: I think it is advisable to insert the link in the bug report too
<jeromeg> norsetto : well I wanted to be sure that the package is clean before doing so
<norsetto> jeromeg: yes, thats why you should use the link there
<jeromeg> norsetto: ok
<jeromeg> norsetto : and I suscribe ubuntu-universe-sponsors ?
<norsetto> jeromeg: if the package is in universe, yes
<jeromeg> ok
<jeromeg> thx
* AndyP hugs dpkg-checkbuilddeps
* bddebian hugs AndyP
<superm1_> hey bddebian i forgot to catch up with you the other day after work, can you do the upload for mythbuntu-lirc-generator's new version today?
<AndyP> bddebian: :-)
<pygi> hey jdong !
<AndyP> there's a stray config.log in a debian package, that means it wasn't removed in debian/rules clean, right?
<minghua> AndyP: Yes.  Usually it should be removed by "make distclean".
<AndyP> minghua: ok, maybe i'll fix that when i merge the other bits then
#ubuntu-motu 2007-08-11
* Starting logfile irclogs/ubuntu-motu.log
(superm1/#ubuntu-motu) night bddebian
<superm1> Hobbsee, okay well i updated it, if you get some time this `date` to look over/upload i'd appreciate it, if not then i'll leave a response to colin's email for Riddell for any of the people CC'ed to look, upload and respond to the email if/when they do
<ajmitch> RAOF: oh dear, you play WoW as well? :)
* Hobbsee emails the uni.  again.
<ajmitch> hm, and StevenK is playing WoW as well, MOTU is going downhill
<ajmitch> StevenK: I have it working fine with 0.9.41 from winehq on amd64
<RAOF> ajmitch: jml got me into it.  Blame him :)
<ajmitch> my flatmate got me into it
<RAOF> "Masters of the Universe" sounds like a cool guild... :)
<ajmitch> hehe :)
<ajmitch> though we'll be on different servers
* ajmitch wonders which server StevenK is on
<RAOF> :/
<superm1> how can you guys possibly find time for WoW, Ubuntu, and RL?
<Hobbsee> superm1: they dont.
<ajmitch> I only work fulltime
<ajmitch> WoW *is* RL
<superm1> haha
<RAOF> superm1: Big pants.  Helps tremendously :P
<ajmitch> superm1: plus having WoW just run windowed helps me use irc at the same time :)
<superm1> well i can't imagine what it's like to be part of two cults at the same time :) One (Ubuntu) is enough for me :)
<ajmitch> he dares call it a cult
* ajmitch isn't even near level 70 yet :)
<superm1> haha
<ajmitch> the guild I'm has quite a few people in melbourne who are meeting up for dinner tonight, actually
<superm1> see that's more justifiable then.
* Hobbsee wonders what would happen if all the MOTU's went and played WOW
<ajmitch> universe would suffer
<Hobbsee> yes, but how much?
<ajmitch> I think if they could limit their play time to a few hours a week at most, it'd be ok
* ajmitch even managed to do some ubuntu stuff last night
* RAOF does limit his WoW time
<elkbuntu> RAOF, to 'waking hours'?
* RAOF hasn't yet got the telepathic interface installed on his laptop, so he can't play WoW in his sleep yet.
<elkbuntu> hehe
* ajmitch doesn't play it on the laptop
<superm1> RAOF, it's not just sudo apt-get install wow-telepathy yet?  Sounds like you've got something that needs packaging
<ajmitch> I haven't tried with the i915 & wine :)
<RAOF> Incidentally, granparadiso has finally got a feature I've been after for ages: native gtk-form widgets
<RAOF> superm1: Sadly, the hardware doesn't have a linux driver yet :P
* ajmitch tests out the f-spot photo viewer mode
* RAOF wishes nvidia didn't suck so badly at writing drivers.  Again
<ajmitch> what's their problem this time?
<RAOF> They can't run anything OpenGL while compiz is on.
<ajmitch> they can
<RAOF> They kill X as soon as I try.
<ajmitch> it is just slow
<ajmitch> I used to play WoW while compiz was enabled
<RAOF> Where as for *me*, it's a blinding fast killing of X.
<ajmitch> it stuttered too much
<ajmitch> windowed or fullscreen?
<RAOF> Fullscreen
<ajmitch> right, I have it windowed
<ajmitch> you should convince Hobbsee to start playing
<Hobbsee> hah
<Hobbsee> i dont really have time to do ubuntu stuff, if i want to pass uni, let alone WOW>
<ajmitch> true :)
<ajmitch> ok, back later :)
<Hobbsee> ScottK: marked that u-r-e bug as fixed
* Hobbsee *is* one of the main developers of that :)
<zakame> hello all
<Hobbsee> hiya zakame
<zakame> hi Hobbsee
* Fujitsu yawns.
<Hobbsee> wake up Fujitsu...
* Fujitsu squashes some more RC bugs.
<Fujitsu> I've filed too many sync requests today :(
<Fujitsu> Oh, lovely, I just accidentally SIGSTOPped compiz, and X decided it couldn't change to a VT until it woke up.
<RAOF> Yay.  Electric sheep fix!
<RAOF> ...and apt-proxy.
<RAOF> Now, let's package Miro!
<davromaniak> damn, another new version of qtpfsgui was released, and I forgot to send my translation to the dev, :s
<vil> hello
<davromaniak> hello
<vil> looks like REVU moved somewhere
<vil> any idea, where can I find it?
<Fujitsu> vil: see /topic
<Fujitsu> siretart: Can you possibly point revu.tauware.de to some page saying REVU is down for some time?
<vil> Fujitsu, silly me
<vil> :)
<RAOF> Or I could extend software-sources to be able to add repositories from a file.  Hm.
<StevenK> Hrm. I think that's enough WoW.
<Fujitsu> StevenK: Hah. WORK!
<Fujitsu> Is WoW really that good?
* StevenK is finding it enjoyable.
<RAOF> It's more so with other people.
<RAOF> It needs integrated VoIP, though :)
* RAOF does his best to bring down launchpad by checking out bzr branches
<DarkSun88> Hi all
<RAOF> Howdie.
* ajmitch returns
<ajmitch> StevenK: amazing, you can stop when you need to ;)
<StevenK> Very funny. ;-)
<ajmitch> who has seen the post about 'getlibs' on the list?
<ajmitch> that's just scary broken crack
<Fujitsu> me
<Fujitsu> Probably.
<ajmitch> at least it doesn't dump straight into /usr/lib
<ajmitch> StevenK: what realm & faction?
* StevenK has already forgotten.
<ajmitch> heh
<StevenK> I'm doing so well today ...
<ajmitch> just started playing today?
<StevenK> Yup
<ajmitch> poor chap
<StevenK> Installed it and patched it up to 2.1.3 last night.
<ajmitch> trial account still?
<StevenK> Guest Pass key, so far.
<RAOF> Re: getlibs.  amd64 users do crazy, crazy things.
<RAOF> I saw that on the forums and meant to bring it up sometime.
* ajmitch plays wine just fine on amd64 without such crack
<ajmitch> s/wine/wow/
* StevenK does too.
<RAOF> So do I.  I'm not really sure of the use-case for it.
* Fujitsu wonders why the people who want all the i386 stuff don't just use i386.
<ajmitch> though 0.9.42 had some interesting artifacts when I tried it
<StevenK> I just find it strange that I can't type in WoW when I run it under Gnome.
<RAOF> Because they've bought a 64bit capable chip, and they're gonna use a 64bit distro on it, damnit!
<ajmitch> because amd64 is ZOMG FASTEST
<ajmitch> StevenK: odd, I can, running it windowed
* StevenK is running it full screen
<RAOF> I can, running it fullscreen.
<RAOF> Also with wine 0.9.42
<ajmitch> I like having easy access to a browser & irc :)
<vil> I am slightly confused by the freeze dead-lines
<ajmitch> vil: that's ok, they're there to confuse people
<StevenK> ajmitch: That appeals. Running it 1024x768 windowed sounds nice.
<vil> can someone pls tell me, when is the last date to upload a completely new package, which does not exist even in debian?
<ajmitch> StevenK: yeah, though 1280x1024 for me
<ajmitch> vil: new packages freeze, aug 30
<StevenK> ajmitch: Heh, my desktop is only 1280x1024.
<vil> silly me again
<vil> how could I overlook that one?
<vil> ajmitch thanks
<ajmitch> the freeze for new packages is later because new packages are less likely to affect the stability of universe
<ajmitch> StevenK: yes, I used to have a 3200x1200 desktop, so having it in a window was rather nice
* ajmitch is flying through stranglethorn vale at the moment
<vil> ajmitch, I thought that it is UpstreamVersionFreeze, anyway ...
<Fujitsu> Aren't Debian maintainers meant to include NMUs in their changelogs?
<ajmitch> dual-core means I can still build ubuntu packages in the background :)
<RAOF> Yes?
<RAOF> ajmitch: That's an excellent point.
<RAOF> Although I've got a buildd for that purpose :)
<StevenK> Fujitsu: They don't have to, it's a nice-to-have
<ajmitch> hello jml
<jml> ajmitch: hi
<jml> I'm about to try to figure out how to get linux talking to my shiny new monitor from my macbook.
<jml> but I'm not going to ask for help here, because that would be naughty ;)
<StevenK> ajmitch: Realm Nagrand, by the way
<jml> psh.
* Fujitsu wonders if 26 RC bugs is enough for the day.
<jml> Frostmourne ftw.
<ajmitch> StevenK: ah right, I'm on khaz'goroth
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: no
<jml> ajmitch: me too.
* Fujitsu keeps going then.
<RAOF> See?  Everyone should be on Frostmourne.
<ajmitch> jml: oh?
<jml> ajmitch: Mandalon on Khaz'goroth.
<jml> *monitor on linux* go go go
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: thanks for tackling those :)
<ajmitch> jml: ah, horde..
<jml> ajmitch: of course.
<jml> ajmitch: the alliance have no honor.
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: 'tis all I can do.
<ajmitch> and the horde no talent, so it balances?
<ajmitch> not that we're at all off-topic here :)
<ajmitch> since we all play it on wine, I presume
<RAOF> Not jml.
<ajmitch> oh dear
<jml> ajmitch: OS X actually.
<ajmitch> the shame
<RAOF> He has an OS X install, the fool.
<jml> RAOF: the fool who wants to get firmware updates.
* RAOF pities the foo :P
<ajmitch> jml: ubuntu is good for you
<jml> although, actually I can't because I deleted a whole bunch of stuff to fit wow into my tiny tiny OS X partition.
<jml> ajmitch: I <3 ubuntu.
<ajmitch> addict
<jml> ajmitch: I just don't use it to play wow.
<jml> also,
<jml> I have this ubuntu install that doesn't let me use my shiny new monitor :P
<ajmitch> fix it!
<jml> huh, the gentoo guys seem to have a patch.
<RAOF> For what?
<jml> i810switch
* StevenK kicks the game manual
* Fujitsu hugs -intel + randr1.2
<jml> it doesn't recognize my PCI id
<RAOF> Isn't the -intel driver meant to be your friend.
* ajmitch should install the new intel driver on the laptop
<jml> RAOF: friend how?
<ajmitch> if it's not already on there
<RAOF> jml: As in doing xrandr 1.2, AKA "multimonitor just works"
<RAOF> Although I'm not sure how much that works on Feisty, of course :P
<jml> Server reports RandR version 1.1
<Fujitsu> Bah, Feisty is prehistoric.
<RAOF> jml: And that's with the -intel rather than -i810 driver?
<ajmitch> feisty is so 3 months ago
<jml> RAOF: no, that's with the i810. I'll try -intel
<RAOF> Yeah.  I think I mentioned the -intel driver before?  Maybe.
<Fujitsu> Only Gutsy's Xorg supports 1.2
<jml> RAOF: and I tried it before
<jml> but no joy.
<jml> I'll try again.
<RAOF> Ah, of course.  Gutsy fixes it :P
<jml> I'm not installing gutsy on my laptop until I get a backup system.
* RAOF mocks the canonnical policy of running latest stable Ubuntu on work machines!
<jml> RAOF: we run beta, actually.
<RAOF> But that's so far away!  We're not even at freeze yet!
<jml> RAOF: this is the jml policy of "I fix Launchapd, other people chase down packaging bugs"
<ajmitch> everyone needs a friendly launchpad hacker to harass, right?
* jml restarts X
<RAOF> So, I'd like the "One click installer" thread to die, and I thought I'd achieve this by teaching software-properties about GPG keys, since it already knows about sources.list files.
<StevenK> Damn it, WoW, stop demanding to be fullscreen!
<ajmitch> StevenK: you may need to use winecfg
<StevenK> Emulate a virual desktop?
<RAOF> My current thinking is to have a simple [repo-key] <inline GPG key> [repositories]  format, and parsing that.  Comments?
<jml> OK. That gives me mirroring.
<ajmitch> RAOF: talk to glatzor first
<RAOF> ajmitch: He's doing something similar?  Cool.
<jml> RAOF: server still reports 1.1
<RAOF> Yeah, sorry.  Apparently that's Gutsy only.
<StevenK> RAOF: Okay, fixed the focus bug. If I don't let the window manager control the windows, it doesn't give keyboard focus.
<highvoltage> some could even do with two!
<jml> OK. So, next steps: figure out mirroring, figure out how to configure res on new monitor, figure out if there's an easy way to switch between mirrored and dual-head.
<StevenK> Neat. WoW silences the music if I shade it.
<StevenK> Hrm. Seeing the lack of cash I have without going to a vendor would be nice.
<jml> StevenK: open your primary bag
<jml> 'b' by default
<jml> ok, so I think I've got an on-topic-ish sort of question.
<ajmitch> uh oh
<jml> I have a patch for i810switch, I've apt-get source'd the package and am about to apply the patch.
<jml> how do I go from there to a .deb that I can install?
<ajmitch> add an entry in debian/changelog
<ajmitch> debuild
<StevenK> jml: Ah, right. Hiding down the bottom of the bag in plain sight.
<jml> install devscripts for debuild, or should I get something else?
<StevenK> jml: Thanks. :-)
<ajmitch> devscripts has it
<jml> StevenK: any time you need help with something obvious, you'll know who to call ;)
<StevenK> jml: :-)
<RAOF> jml: To add a changelog entry, you want "dch -i"
* ajmitch never uses dch :)
<StevenK> jml: Depending on which release you want to build for, you may need pbuilder or sbuild.
<RAOF> Really?  What do you use?
<StevenK> Or hit up RAOF for access to his buildd.
* StevenK uses either dch or debian-changelog-mode.
* StevenK runs off.
<jml> my editor has abilities, I'm sure I'll manage
<RAOF> jml: If you're targetting Gutsy, you're welcome to build on my buildd :)
<jml> RAOF: I'm targetting jml's laptop.
<RAOF> Heh.
<RAOF> Ok.
<jml> RAOF: if this works, I'll investigate forwarding the patch on.
<Amaranth> RAOF: hey
<siretart> Fujitsu: hm, I would need to adjust the DNS. do you expect the downtime longer?
<RAOF> Amaranth: Ho!
<Amaranth> RAOF: do you remember what the advantage to not reparenting in compiz was supposed to be? :)
<RAOF> No, I don't :)
<Amaranth> RAOF: I thought it was so you could do alpha in the decoration even if the app didn't support it
<RAOF> Maybe?  I think I knew at some point, or at least had it mentioned in my presence, but no longer :)
<Amaranth> RAOF: But kwin reparents and can still do alpha, it just uses twice the pixmap memory because X makes a copy of the pixmap for the window manager to use
<jml> wow, that almost worked.
<RAOF> Heh.
* jml tries the i810 driver again.
<jml> brb
<jml> weird.
<Fujitsu> Oh, lovely, all servers but tiber have been recovered.
<white> Fujitsu: 22nd of sept ;)
<siretart> Fujitsu: did they keep the same ip?
<jml> This page refers to an i810 manpage, https://help.ubuntu.com/community/XineramaHowTo
<siretart> Fujitsu: are they still hosted at serverpronto at all?
<jml> what actual manpage might it be referring to?
<StevenK> Fujitsu: Maybe the canonical sysadmins took one look at tiber at said "Uh huh. Like that's getting turned on again." :-P
<elkbuntu> siretart, no
<RAOF> jml: Have you tried "man i810"?
<Fujitsu> siretart: It will have a different IP, and will probably move into the DC. See Jono's latest email to loco-contacts ML, and maybe poke somebody to work out what's happening.
<siretart> elkbuntu: Fujitsu: then it is very likely that tiber is up as well, and just needs the dns adjusted, which I'd love to do
<Fujitsu> siretart: No, tiber hasn't been recovered yet.
<siretart> Fujitsu: sorry? what mail of jono?
<Fujitsu> siretart: On the loco-contacts mailing list.
<siretart> Fujitsu: I'm not subscribed on that list
<siretart> Fujitsu: can you send me a link to the archive?
<siretart> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/loco-contacts/2007-August/001510.html
<siretart> that one?
<Fujitsu> That's the one, I believe.
<ajmitch> hey siretart
<siretart> I wans't even aware that tiber is one of the loco servers. nor that the loco teams do have sponsored servers as well
* Fujitsu finds it a little unlikely that tiber was compromised, given the general technical competency of its users.
<siretart> (well, I think I read the latter somewhere on irc, but not a definitive announcement or something)
<Fujitsu> siretart: It's not a LoCo server, but it's categorised as one of the LoCo set.
<siretart> hi ajmitch!
<siretart> Fujitsu: ah, I see
<Fujitsu> I think ubuntu-doc might also have one, but otherwise it's all LoCos.
<siretart> Fujitsu: well, I assume that elmo will contact me as soon as he knows more about tiber's status
<Fujitsu> siretart: Does he know you run it and all?
<siretart> for the 'sorry I'm down page', I'd happily repoint the dns of tauware.de to somehwere else,
<siretart> I'd need to setup a vhost or something here, I'd need ot do that tonight
<jml> RAOF: I did, but it didn't work. Turns out I actually need to have xserver-xorg-video-i810 installed for it to work.
<siretart> Fujitsu: he apologized for not emailing me about tiber's downtime. so I'd assume yes
<siretart> that was on irc
<Fujitsu> siretart: Ah, good. I did complain to newz2000 that nobody had been notified.
<siretart> ok, need to visit my familiy now, see you tonight!
<Fujitsu> Bye!
<RAOF> jml: How were you using the -i810 driver without that package installed???
<jml> RAOF: I wasn't.
<RAOF> Ah.  You were using -intel?  Or vesa?
<jml> RAOF: was using -intel.
<RAOF> Ah.
<jml> Still am using -intel, but now have -i810 installed.
<RAOF> Heh.
<jml> is there an easy way to figure out the modeline & related fu for my external monitor?
<RAOF> There's an online modeline generator, but unless intel cards are annoyingly crap you won't need it.
<jml> so I should need to specify refresh rates or anything?
<RAOF> No
<jml> back when I was a lad, we used to run xconfig or something like that
<RAOF> You may want to dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xorg, but I don't think that does Xinerama.
<RAOF> Damnit, gutsy is full of tools for you
<RAOF> Displayconfig-gtk, for example.
<jml> like I said, once I get a backup box, I'll think about upgrading.
<RAOF> Yeah.
<ajmitch> good to hear about the SCO vs Novell ruling
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: Old news, but very good.
<ajmitch> sure, but I don't keep up with the news on the minute it happens :)
<Fujitsu> I found out about 13 hours ago, so it's not really recent.
* man-di just came back from vacation (one week without computers) and wonders what the ruling was
* Amaranth found out like 10 minutes after it showed up on groklaw
<Amaranth> so ha! :P
<Fujitsu> man-di: Novell has been found to be the copyright owner of UNIX(Ware), so SCO v. IBM is invalid.
<Amaranth> And SCO owes Novell a crapload of money from the Microsoft and Sun deals
<Fujitsu> Just a bit.
<Fujitsu> Supposedly more than their net worth.
<Amaranth> The legalese for 'stealing' was in there more than once :)
<jml> hmm
<Fujitsu> `conversion'
<Amaranth> right, that was the word
* Fujitsu will watch their stock price on Monday.
<jml> Seems that the best I can do is get the external display twinning with the laptop at the laptop's res :(
<Amaranth> Fujitsu: it'll go up, of course
<jml> i.e. the default with xserver-xorg-video-intel
<Fujitsu> Amaranth: It seems to have a habit of that.
<jml> 1280x800 at 22" is pretty darn big.
* jml -> wow
<jml> thanks for the help guys.
<norsetto> morning
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: you mean to sew how long before it's delisted?
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: Something like that.
<RainCT> hi
<man-di> Wow, not really surprising but good
<geser> norsetto: re bug #129301: amd64 is the only arch where gtk2hs 0.9.12 builds successfully :(
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 129301 in gtk2hs "[FTBFS]  gtk2hs fails to build on Gutsy (amd64) (dup-of: 129277)" [Undecided,Fix committed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/129301
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 129277 in gtk2hs "[Sync request]  gtk2hs (0.9.11-2) from Debian unstable" [Wishlist,Fix released]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/129277
<norsetto> geser: that the one I indeed tested
<norsetto> geser: but I also wrote in the bug report that this should have been on hold
<norsetto> geser: I suggested to wait for 0.9.12
<norsetto> geser: sorry, I just noticed you are indeed talking about 0.9.12
<geser> I uploaded gtk2hs 0.9.12-0ubuntu1 yesterday once I tested if it builds (on amd64) to fix the unmet deps for it
<norsetto> geser: yes, I tested that on amd64 and was ok
<geser> me too
<geser> amd64 is ok, but it FTBFS on the other archs (but now with a different error as 0.9.11)
<norsetto> geser: strange error, I wonder if CUint is long
<white> !info unicon gutsy
<ubotu> Package unicon does not exist in gutsy
<Fujitsu> unison, you mean?
<white> !info unicon-imc2 gutsy
<ubotu> unicon-imc2: Chinese Input Method Library. In component universe, is optional. Version 3.0.4-12 (gutsy), package size 4058 kB, installed size 10068 kB
<Fujitsu> Oh.
<white> Fujitsu: teach him source packages ;)
<Fujitsu> I must convince Seveas to make it learn about sources.
<white> but unicon looks good :)
<white> !info fireflier gutsy
<ubotu> Package fireflier does not exist in gutsy
<white> brr
<white> !info fireflier-server gutsy
<ubotu> fireflier-server: Interactive firewall rule creation tool - server. In component universe, is optional. Version 1.1.7ubuntu1 (gutsy), package size 45 kB, installed size 196 kB
<white> that is a strange version number
<Fujitsu> Why?
<Fujitsu> !info fireflier-server sid
<ubotu> fireflier-server: Interactive firewall rule creation tool - server. In component main, is optional. Version 1.1.7-3 (sid), package size 44 kB, installed size 128 kB
<Fujitsu> white: It was turned into a native package in Debian for a while.
<white> well the 1.1.7 version should have the security patch
<Fujitsu> Yes, it has that fix.
<Fujitsu> Hi Hobbsee.
<geser> Hi Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> heya Fujitsu, geser
<stgraber> Any pygtk pro around ? I'm having a nice python crash (real crash, not syntax one) with Pixbuf in treeview when hovering them (no event set for hovering) ?
<stgraber> Any known issue with python 2.5 and pygtk treeview ?
<pgquiles> I have a package which needs Internet access to download some files when running dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot. Is that OK of should I tweak the build system to have everything locally?
<Fujitsu> pgquiles: There is no Internet access on the buildds. Everything must be local.
<geser> another reason to have the files locally is that the build can be reproduced
<pgquiles> Fujitsu: that's going to require a lot of tweaking :-/
<pgquiles> so, should I create a mypackage-builddepends.deb package with the dependencies?
<broonie> pgquiles: What is it downloading?
<pgquiles> broonie: a few .jar files from sourceforge.net
<pgquiles> broonie: https://dogfood.launchpad.net/~pgquiles/+archive/+build/348896
<pgquiles> https://dogfood.launchpad.net/+builds/rubidium
<pgquiles> those .jar are only useful when building some apache stuff
<pgquiles> it also downloads its own version of libcppunit, apr, etc
<Fujitsu>  Ewwwwwwwwwwwwwww.
<pgquiles> it's part of the log4cxx build system :-/
* Fujitsu washes his hands of it and quickly goes to bed.
<pgquiles> :-D
<broonie> Um. Yeah.
<pgquiles> without an Internet connection in the build farm, I'd essentially need to rewrite the whole buildsystem for the software
<Fujitsu> IMO, you should leave it alone, complain to upstream, and attempt to package it again when they use a vaguely sane build system.
<broonie> Independantly of the needs of the buildds that doesn't sound like a bad idea.
<Fujitsu> Downloading private copies of various libraries is completely wrong.
<pgquiles> upstream is uttely insane
<pgquiles> they have not published a new version in 4 years
<broonie> If they really need their forked versions at build time they should be shipping them in the distribution.
<Fujitsu> Get upstream to fix it.
<Fujitsu> If they really need their forked versions, they should probably fix themselves so they don't need their forked versions.
* broonie nods Fujitsu
<pgquiles> they are not using forked versions
<pgquiles> it's just they build the latest version to check everything is OK without requiring those packages to be installed in the system
<pgquiles> which is very comfortable when you build log4cxx from sources yourself, but it's very inconvenient when trying to package the stuff
<Fujitsu> Well, I am off to bed to cry myself to sleep about this crazy upstream.
<broonie> This sounds like a variation on the problem with upstreams including copies of zlib, then?
<pgquiles> not exactly because these people are not including a copy of the cppunit, apr, etc but downloading them from sourceforge and apache.org
<pgquiles> it they were including their own copy, I'd have no problem
<Fujitsu> I would have a problem.
<broonie> Yes, but ignoring the crack with downloading it's the same problem.
<broonie> No, including and using a local copy is still a problem.
<pgquiles> I'm sending them an e-mail, let's wait for an answer
<broonie> Ask your favourite security team member (they don't like having to do security fixes for $BIGNUM packages all with their own copy of $LIBRARY)
<broonie> Ideally they should be able to use copies of this stuff that are already installed on the system and only fall back to their own copies (whereever they are) if they can't find one already installed.
<pgquiles> well, that'd be OK for apr, libcppunit, etc
<pgquiles> I'd still need to provide packaged versions of ant-contrib and cpptasks, though
<pgquiles> which is OK, anyway
<bddebian> Heya gang
<pygi> hey ho bddebian
<bddebian> Hi pygi
* norsetto bows
<geser> Hi bddebian
<bddebian> Heya geser
<ScottK> Hobbsee: Cool.  I knew about metapackage install recommends, but I didn't know they'd already been changed.  Thanks.
<Hobbsee> ScottK: yeah, mvo fixed that bug, as i kept bugging him :)
<ScottK> Cool.
* ScottK is not feeling well today, so he guesses that narrows his IRC vocabulary.
<norsetto> ScottK: can we have a word about bug 131670?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 131670 in poker-network "Please merge poker-network-1.1.1-1 from Debian unstable" [Undecided,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/131670
<pygi> bddebian, poke
<bddebian> pygi: peek
<pygi> bddebian, mind looking at my second patch? :)
<bddebian> pygi: For what?
<pygi> bddebian, flashplugin-nonfree
<pygi> since you uploaded the first :p
<bddebian> pygi: Building now :-)
<pygi> bddebian, yay, danke =)
<pygi> bddebian, thank you ;)
<bddebian> pygi: No, THank You! :-)
<pygi> bddebian, you are now officially tagged as the person to upload couple of next patches xD
<Nafallo> making flash work on amd64? :-)
<pygi> Nafallo, that works with swfdec afaik?
<pygi> Nafallo, or did I miss something? :)
<pygi> Nafallo, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/swfdec0.4/0.4.5-2 ^_^
<Nafallo> no idea
<pygi> well, my package there :)
<Nafallo> I'll not even attempt to look at webpages before my ISP has fixed themselves
<pygi> xD
<pygi> Nafallo, ok, then lemme just say *it works*(tm)
<Nafallo> hehe, oki :-)
<Nafallo> kewl
<justinwray> What is the policy on packages that come with an SVN update mechanism? (Namely to download new modules/plug-ins -- but also updates the application is self as well)
<asantoni> poke poke poke
<pygi> Nafallo, and starting next week, fullscreen will work on youtube as well if that's important to you :P
<asantoni> http://mixxx.sourceforge.net/packages/ ---> Mixxx 1.5.2 package needs reviewing
<pygi> Nafallo, although a bit slow, ergh ... damn X & cairo :-/
<Nafallo> hehe. running x86 now anyway. wanted tickless.
<Nafallo> and tickless is broken on Turion :-P
<pygi> Nafallo, still, you should rather run free flash :)
<norsetto> Nafallo: just had a look at the Mono is Microsoft technology bug :-)
<Nafallo> norsetto: anything new since my answer? :-)
<norsetto> Nafallo: yeah, he was still arguing .... some people are amazing
<norsetto> Nafallo: like the guy that posted a bug because he could not run Halo on Linux ;-)
<Nafallo> :-P
<Nafallo> he argued on #ubuntu-bugs yesterday :-P
<norsetto> Nafallo: Halo or Mono?
<Nafallo> Mono
<norsetto> too bad I missed that one
<justinwray> norsetto:  What is the policy on packages that come with an SVN update mechanism? (Namely to download new modules/plug-ins -- but also updates the application is self as well)
<jldugger> i donno if this is the right place to bring this up, but the Ubuntu packaging guide is sorta broke =/
<norsetto> justinwray: what do you mean by policy?
<justinwray`away> norsetto: linda/lintian give a large amount of errors due to the SVN files etc.
<norsetto> justinwray`away: ok, you can use the -i and -I flags to discard those
<justinwray`away> norsetto: Ah, okay.  So it is fine if any application has its own update mechanism, outside of the standard apt-get update? (Like firefox?)
<norsetto> justinwray`away: for instance add this to your ~/.devscripts file: DEBUILD_DPKG_BUILDPACKAGE_OPTS="-i -ICVS -I.svn"
<norsetto> justinwray`away: sorry, wife is calling for dinner (never let a lady wait :-))
<pygi> jldugger, you are free to submit bugs and diffs with fixes
<justinwray`away> norsetto: Not a problem, I am head to my girlfriends to pick her up...so, I'll catch up with you later.
<justinwray`away> Thanks again
<norsetto> justinwray`away: np
<jldugger> pygi: the thing is, it's the hello world package ;) i might not be the right person to be fixing it
<pygi> jldugger, :D
<bddebian> Hmm, I wonder why libodbc++ is currently not built with threads??
<asantoni> 1) Mixxx 1.5.2 package still needs review: http://mixxx.sourceforge.net/packages/
<asantoni> 2) Did the UVF date get pushed back because of REVU being down?
<jeromeg> hello
<jeromeg> i'm fixing a typo error in apturl description, the current version is 0.0+bzr20070709, what should the new version be ?
<jeromeg> anyone please?
<geser> 0.0+bzr20070709ubuntu1
<jeromeg> thx
<Lutin> geser: even if it's an ubuntu-only package ?
<geser> then no
<geser> I'd probably use 0.0+bzr20070709.1 in that case
<jeromeg> maybe it should be fixed in the bzr branch, as mr_pouit says
<geser> yes
<jeromeg> ok then I will let it to the maintainers
<K0brik> yo brothers! What's that mDNS thing doing?
<mr_pouit> mmh, any ETA for a fix for hal in the buildds? I have several packages waiting for a give-back (FTBFS because hal fails to install)
<K0brik> *it seems to be talking with the internet for some reason
<K0brik> it's calling 224.0.0.251.5353 every now and then
<jeromeg> anyone here to test my update of dvgrab ? (camera needed)
<jeromeg> package + source : http://vv.guelf.free.fr/ubuntu/
<K0brik> can I safely exclude it from the init.d without ruining any built-in service(s)?
<man-di_> K0brik: thats a local broadcast address for zeroconf
<man-di_> K0brik: but this is not the channel to discuss this
<K0brik> man-di_: do I need it?
<man-di_> K0brik: I dont know your network
<K0brik> man-di_: what would I use it for?
<man-di_> K0brik: google for zeroconf for more infos
<K0brik> man-di_: I'm not breaking "your" fine system when I'm excluding it?
<man-di_> K0brik: ????
<K0brik> man-di_: I've just installed ubuntu and noone on #ubuntu can answer what services I'd ever use it for
<man-di_> I would go with the rule, if you dont know, disable it
<K0brik> man-di_: and I'm quite irritated about strange firefox requests at the same time lol
<man-di_> its mainly for zeroconf networks
<K0brik> update-init.d or something
<K0brik> man-di_: aren't rhythmbox using for shared films and such?
<man-di_> K0brik: if you tell it to do so, not by default
<K0brik> oh. now I see. I better stick with my own protocol lol
<K0brik> thanks for the help!
<K0brik> it's the avahi-daemon, right?
<bddebian> Heya
<pygi> hey bddebian, pm pls?
#ubuntu-motu 2007-08-12
* Fujitsu wakes up.
<pygi> morning Fujitsu
* Starting logfile irclogs/ubuntu-motu.log
* Starting logfile irclogs/ubuntu-motu.log
(imbrandon/#ubuntu-motu) ugh, whom broke flashplugin-nonfree
* imbrandon grumbles
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: pygi
<imbrandon> heya Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> hiya imbrandon!
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: then again, whoever sponsored it didnt check it either
<Fujitsu> bddebian sponsored it, and Nafallo uploaded a fix which should be published in about 20 minutes.
<crimsun> nope.
<crimsun> 7 is still broken.
<Fujitsu> Really?
<Fujitsu> Hmm...
<crimsun> 7 will fail to update from both 5 and 6.
<Fujitsu> That'll need a new prerm, right?
<Hobbsee> then again, those using gutsy should be able to figure out how to fix 5, 6, to be able to upgrade to 7
<Hobbsee> but it'd be better to fix it, yes
<Fujitsu> Why? It'll teach them.
<imbrandon> heh
<imbrandon> but still annoying
<pygi> crimsun, ergh, I tested, yes, but before that did a cleanup of dpkg status file :-/
<pygi> (the same problem hasn't been with gnash too)
<pygi> ergh!!
<pygi> s/hasn't/is with
<roshan_s> Does anyone have an idea of when REVU will be back up?
<Hobbsee> roshan_s: /topic
<Fujitsu> No ETA at this time.
<roshan_s> Hobbsee: Fujitsu: Sorry, but the topic hasn't been changed for a few days, so I was hoping there might be some updated info. Thanks anyway.
<Hobbsee> roshan_s: probably because there is none :)  People keep asking
<crimsun> pygi: fix uploaded for 131865 and its duplicates.
<crimsun> guys, please test upgrades next time, too.
<Fujitsu> elmo was meant to be giving an update yesterday afternoon UTC, but that didn't eventuate.
<roshan_s> Hobbsee: Well, I know me my behaviour is a bit irrational, but I was just hoping... :-| I just made my first package a few days ago and I'm a bit excited about it
<norsetto> slomo: big mistake .... now I have to ask you if you received my email about mentoring status :-)
<Fujitsu> geser: Hah! Beat you by 21 seconds.
* Fujitsu stalks.
<norsetto> slomo: a y or n is enough ......
<simu> i have a question about REVU and the following doc page
<simu> http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/ubuntu-upload.html
<simu> the REVU link is dead
<Fujitsu> simu: See /topic
<simu> oh
<simu> thanks
<simu> and why is it down?
<simu> the next few days, wow
<Fujitsu> It's down because the Canonical server it was on has apparently been compromised.
<Fujitsu> It's being moved to new hardware.
<Fujitsu> And hopefully being checked for any security issues.
<simu> revu.tauware.de is a canionical server?
<Fujitsu> On a Canonical server, yes.
<simu> actually I wanted to do my very first packaging for ubuntu and now the uload server hhas been compromised.
<simu> :-(
<guardian> morning
<Fujitsu> Hi guardian.
<simu> packages.ubuntu.com down too?
<Fujitsu> simu: I don't think that's the same issue.
<Fujitsu> Um, that's odd. I don't think that host is meant to be in Germany.
<minghua> Fujitsu: I think it's okay.  I remember hearing that p.u.c is on non-canonical machine.
<Fujitsu> minghua: Ah, OK.
<minghua> simu: Just use launchpad.  Not as convenient as p.u.c, but all packages are there.
<simu> I'm looking for an easy package that I can maintain
<simu> I have a list in launchbad with all packages tagged needs-packaging and that are unasigned
* AndyP finds a changelog made up of 33 haikus :)
<AndyP> (debconf 0.9.10)
<slomo> norsetto: yes, sorry... i wasn't there and busy in the last days, you'll get an answer tomorrow
<norsetto> slomo: thx
<simu> where do I find a list of possible sections (devil, etc. control file)
<guardian> debian policy ?
<norsetto> yes: http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-archive.html#s-subsections
<norsetto> I think we use the same, don't we?
<simu> thanks
<stgraber> yep, maybe we have some ubuntu specific ones, but we at least have the debian ones (otherwise syncing would be a problem :))
<khermans_> is there a common way of fixing lintian's 'executable-not-elf-or-script' ?
<khermans_> this warning is generic, but i wonder if there is something existing to fix this, other than me hacking up some find foo
<khermans_> debian policy manual section 10.4 does not suggest an automated solution
<khermans_> http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-files.html#s-scripts
<minghua> khermans_: Why do you assume there is an automated solution?  After all, there are dozens of interpreted languages.
<khermans_> minghua, well i figured someone maybe utilized the tools find, file, grep, and chmod
<khermans_> :-)
<khermans_> my automated hack would be, find all +x, run file | grep -i script/elf, then chmod the ones that are
<minghua> I suppose it's pretty hard to differentiate POSIX sh scripts and bash-only scripts with file and grep.
<khermans_> lose the x for non-scripts/elf
<khermans_> minghua, i dont think it matters, they are both executable
<khermans_> what is your point?
<minghua> khermans_: Hmm, I am probably thinking about the wrong problem.
<khermans_> yes i think so
<minghua> khermans_: So where are these files installed?  Do you want to execute them or not?
<khermans_> minghua, are you familiar with lintina?
<khermans_> lintian
<khermans_> minghua, i am packaging metasploit
<minghua> khermans_: Not really, but it sounds your problem should be fixed by dh_fixperms.
<khermans_> minghua, oh let me check
<broonie> If it's a script it should have a #! line at the top specifying the interpreter.
<khermans_> of course
<khermans_> broonie, problem was some file had +x bit set, but were .h or .c files
<khermans_> actually, many varying files
<khermans_> and some files were scripts, but didn't have +x set
<minghua> khermans_: See, it's not only I that is misunderstanding.
<khermans_> minghua, i dont think dh_fixperms does it though
<khermans_> it looked good at first
<norsetto> what about this: find debian/ -type f -name "*.h" -or -name "*.c" | xargs chmod -x
<khermans_> norsetto, yes of course
<khermans_> i can hack out something, but there are an infinite number of possible file types
<khermans_> not mertely c/h
<khermans_> :-(
<khermans_> i just though some MOTU guys would have a tool for this
<khermans_> i came up with this
<khermans_> find metasploit3/ -type f -perm /u=x,g=x,o=x | while read line; do file ${line} | grep -i script; done
<khermans_> ahh and see, found my first bug in 3 seconds
<khermans_> if path contains 'script' you lose
<khermans_> so now must add cut/awk
<khermans_> ...etc..etc..etc...more bug....bugs.bugs...
<norsetto> have you asked upstream? Tell them to put their act together......
<khermans_> norsetto, lol alrighty then :-)
<khermans_> i did ask in #debian
<khermans_> maybe i head to debian devel
<simu> hi i try to pachage a tool, pbuilder build fails at checking for GTK... configure: error: gtk+-2.0 is a dependency
<simu> my devian/control: Build-Depends: debhelper (>= 5), autotools-dev, libgtk2.0-0, libglade2-0, libgdk-pixbuf2
<simu> Depends: ${shlibs:Depends}, ${misc:Depends}
<simu> INSTALL file of the tool I want to package:
<pygi> you need to build depend on libgtk2.0-dev
<pygi> build depends means you need -dev packages
<pygi> and not regular ones
<simu> Dependencies: gtk+-2.0, libglade-2.0, gdk-2.0, gdk-pixbuf-2.0
<pygi> same goes for libglade and pixbuf
<simu> thanks, another question: the dependencies listed in INSTALL are always build-depends
<bluefoxicy> Somebody needs to step up to the plate and take Ubuntu or some debianite into hard marketed enterprise Linux :(
<simu> how do I find out the run-depends
<bluefoxicy> Has anyone actually tried to run CentOS or SuSE
<bluefoxicy> "Oh I want to install <insert Web application> .... oh, packages for <insert library> don't exist.  I'll just rpmbuild --rebuild them from fedora.. Oh I need 30 dependencies for this one.. oh and 12 for this dependency, and 15 for that dependency..."
<bluefoxicy> I freaking chucked it and threw in Ubuntu.  You can NOT get MySQL Administrator working on CentOS5 or RHEL5, I know that much.
<simu> it is called the rpm-hell
<bluefoxicy> (nor CATS with any reasonable functionality; you can't even upload resums without rebuilding at least 12 packages from Fedora, and that only gets you Word docs ... you CAN'T get xpdf compiled, so no PDF resums)
<bddebian> Heya gang
<crimsun> morn', barry.
<bddebian> Hi crimsun
<bddebian> Uh oh, you touched flashplugin too?
* bddebian hides
<crimsun> I had to.
<bddebian> :-(  Sorry
<crimsun> not your fault :)
<bddebian> Well it partially is.  I didn't really do any install testing :-(
<crimsun> installs were fixed quickly; upgrades were broken
<bddebian> Oh crimsun.  What do you think of adding dependencies for things like gnome-icon-theme to packages like muine?  Damn thing uses gnome icons but KDE users are using it and don't have gnome-icons installed obviously.
<crimsun> sec.
<crimsun> looks fairly innocuous to me.  I might think about a Recommends instead of a Depends since muine would appear to still function without g-i-t.
<bddebian> Aye
<bddebian> crimsun: thx
<crimsun> np
<bddebian> What's up with packages.u.c? Are they working on the DC today?
<crimsun> don't know offhand
<crimsun> I normally use `rmadison -u ubuntu sourcepackage' (needs feisty IIRC)
<bddebian> Dumb question but should Recommends: be versioned?
<crimsun> if you need them to be
<bddebian> Yeah, thought so, but I don't think it should matter in this case
<asantoni> ok, question
<geser> Hi bddebian
<asantoni> How do I get a .diff.gz when I use pbuilder to build the source package, etc?
<asantoni> oh nm
<asantoni> maybe
<asantoni> no no
<asantoni> question still valid :)
<bddebian> Heya geser
<bddebian> asantoni: The diff.gz is generated from dpkg-buildpackage or debuild
<asantoni> hmmm
<asantoni> yeah, I was using "pdebuild"
<asantoni> What's the difference between pdebuild and dpkg-buildpackage?
<bddebian> Sorry never used pdebuild so I couldn't tell ya.  Though I assume it uses debuild with a pbuilder?
<asantoni> beats me, package building confuses the hell out of me :)
<asantoni> here you go
<asantoni> compare:
<asantoni> mixxx_1.5.2svn~20070807dfsg-0ubuntu1.tar.gz
<asantoni> mixxx-1.5.2svn~20070807dfsg.orig.tar.gz
<asantoni> that damn underscore screws me over every time
<crimsun> asantoni: pdebuild does what bddebian mentioned.
<asantoni> dpkg-source: building mixxx using existing mixxx_1.5.2svn~20070807dfsg.orig.tar.gz
<asantoni> dpkg-source: building mixxx in mixxx_1.5.2svn~20070807dfsg-0ubuntu1.diff.gz
<asantoni> dpkg-source: building mixxx in mixxx_1.5.2svn~20070807dfsg-0ubuntu1.dsc
<asantoni>  dpkg-genchanges -S
<asantoni> crimsun: thanks
<asantoni> just needed to have the .orig.tar.gz named properly for pdebuild to find it :)
<bddebian> Gotta run thanks again crimsun
<aos101> I've noticed the gpredict package is a bit out of date (it's 0.6, and 0.8 was released in June).  How would I go about getting it updated?  Does it depend on debian updating it upstream?
<RainCT> is packages.ubuntu.com working for you?
<asantoni> aos101: I'm probably the least authoritative person in this room, but I feel the need to pay forward some help I just got
<asantoni> aos101: No, if you build an updated package, you can get it into Universe
<aos101> packages.ubuntu.com is dead for me too.
<asantoni> aos101: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto   "Rebuilding a package" might be a good starting point
<aos101> OK Thanks.
<crimsun> double you tee eff @ #131967.
<nixternal> crimsun: lol
<nixternal> or better yet... ell ohh ell
<AndyP> looks like that person has filed some more wtf bugs
<AndyP> "Space key not working"  (...!)
<J-Unit> k, retarded question of the day, what eactly is "lpia"?
<AndyP> low power intel architecture
<J-Unit> ah, ok
<J-Unit> http://www.intel.com/technology/systems/lpia/
<J-Unit> thanks
<tsmithe> man-di, aha
<tsmithe> did you get my e-mail?
<eggwarmer> Has anybody seen this error before: files list file for package `os-prober' is missing final newline
<eggwarmer> I Just did a Xubuntu install and now I can't install or upgrade anything else.
<ajmitch> morning
<norsetto> hi
<geser> Hi ajmitch
<sparr> Can one package be made to cause the uninstallation of another via dpkg?  Or only via apt?
<ajmitch> dpkg won't automatically remove another package based on Conflicts, but it will stop it being installed
<jmg> 7rmm
<bddebian> re
<ajmitch> hello bddebian
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<bddebian> ScottK: You aboot?
<ajmitch> odd, a package was apparantly synced but the new version doesn't show up on LP
<sparr> ajmitch: what about apt?
<ajmitch> that's what apt is for
<ajmitch> you use a combination of Conflicts & Replaces to say that one package fully replaces another
<sparr> ahh
<sparr> i shall try that
<bddebian> Hmm, if ghex build-deps on libgail-dev and the dependencies are shlibs:Depends, it will pick up libgail, not necessarily libgail-dev right?
<ajmitch> bddebian: yes, whatever is specified in the shlibs file
<bddebian> Hrm
<ajmitch> root@augustine:/home/ajmitch# less /var/lib/dpkg/info/libgail18.shlibs
<ajmitch> root@augustine:/home/ajmitch# less /var/lib/dpkg/info/libgail18.shliblibgailutil 18 libgail18 (>= 1.10.1), libgail-common (>= 1.10.1)
<bddebian> Damn, so it looks like ghex should have a specific dep on libgail-dev
<bddebian> ajmitch: Aye, I was just looking at that :-)
<ajmitch> why?
<ajmitch> is ghex broken & trying to load the .so directly?
<bddebian> Possibly
<bddebian> Bug #131447
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 131447 in ghex "libgtkhex0-dev should have dependency on libgail-dev" [Undecided,New]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/131447
<ajmitch> oh that's fine
<ajmitch> -dev packages should depend on other -dev packages, certainly
* ajmitch thought ghex was just another end user app
<bddebian> SOrry, source package is ghex
<ajmitch> ok
<bmm> With REVU down, is there a good alternative in any debian mentoring system? Anywhere I should post my packages in the meantime?
<jmg> bmm: i beleive the alternative would be your own webhost
<bmm> hmm... I'm just learning that someone in debian is already posting the same software for review in mentors, which would make the ubuntu version obsolete :-S I hate it when other people already did my job...
<jmg> bmm: unless his package doesnt work in ubuntu
<bmm> jmg: how can a debian package not work in ubuntu? The only thing they are going to do different is leave out the desktop file and the "ubuntu1" version ;-)
<bddebian> heh
<jmg> bmm: there are many possibilities, the main one being depending on a version of something that is in sid that hasnt been synced to ubuntu yet
<jmg> python packages tend to require some massaging to work with py2.5
<bddebian> Hrm, to package a new xmlrpc-c or not to, that is the question..
<johanbr__> I just noticed some of the mono libs in gutsy are fairly old. Are there any plans on updating them for gutsy, or is that too late?
<jmg> johanbr__: are the updated libraries in sid?
<Nafallo> wiki.ubuntu.com/GutsyReleaseSchedule
<bddebian> Nafallo: Oh hush up and get back to fixing my uploads ;-P
<johanbr__> jmg: No, I don't think so.
<Nafallo> bddebian: *asg*
<jmg> johanbr__: then you will need to build the libraries to even have a chance
<bddebian> asg?
<Nafallo> bddebian: lol in swedish :-)
<bddebian> Ahh :-)
<johanbr__> For instance, libtelepathy-cil is based on an svn snapshot from February and hasn't been updated since Feisty.
<Nafallo> bddebian: feel free to steal it ;-)
<johanbr__> jmg: Oh. I don't think I have either the skills or the time for that. :)
* Nafallo think it sounds like johanbr__ is stepping up to do it ;-)
<johanbr__> Nafallo: be quiet :)
<bddebian> hehe
<Nafallo> everyone tells me that today... :-P
<mruiz> hi all
<jmg> johanbr__: that package is not in sid at all
<bmm> Would somebody be willing to review my package if I post in on my own server? The package is called "boswars" and it's a real-time strategy game.
<jmg> johanbr__: you can try and update from svn and rebuild
* jmg cries. the UMC IRC meetings are at 6am nzdt
<johanbr__> jmg: Sure, that I could handle. But I don't think I have the test (or the skills to fix) any packages that might break because of the update.
<johanbr__> "...the time to test..."
<jmg> johanbr__: what are the rdepends?
<johanbr__> jmg: It appears, none. :)
<johanbr__> At least for libtelepathy-cil.
<jmg> johanbr__: :)
<jmg> johanbr__: but it looks as if the upgdate to libtelepathy-cil will require updating the telepathy-sharp source package
<jmg> johanbr__: which appears to provide nothing but libtelepathy-cil
<jmg> so question - if it as no rdepends, why is it in ubuntu? :)
* johanbr__ fears that the longer he stays in this conversation, the higher the risk he'd have to do some actual work
<Nafallo> haha
<Nafallo> jmg: telepathyteam probably :-)
<jmg> johanbr__: go and talk to the telepathy guys about it. #ubuntu-desktop
<johanbr__> jmg: Alright, will do. Thanks.
<bmm> How can I link to an debian ITP? I've already added a link to a debian bug but now I can't add another one. I'd like to add http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=437382 to https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/128416 but can't find a way.
<ubotu> Debian bug 437382 in wnpp "ITP: boswars -- futuristic real-time strategy game" [Wishlist,Open] 
<jmg> bmm: looks like a nice game :)
<bmm> jmg: it is! But it's already being packaged in debian, so my efforts where all in vein. Pretty upsetting, since I've been working together with the developers to get the ubuntu package done as soon as they released.
<bmm> Now the work has been done over by somebody at debian, and I must say that they did a better job at it ;-)
<bmm> (I'm just a beginner at packaging)
<jmg> bmm: well just make sure it builds on ubuntu - then take the credit :-)
<jmg> bmm: i dont see it in sid yet
<bmm> jmg: I'll see what I can do ;-)
<ajmitch> bmm: another reason to do work in debian first :)
<bmm> ajmitch: I've tried to work in debian in the past, but never got anybody to review anything I did so I just gave up. After looking at ubuntu for a while, I tried my luck there :-)
<jmg> ajmitch: maybe bmm doesnt want to die doing the jump-6-helicopters-thru-a-ring-of-fire-on-a-motorbike DD induction :)
<ajmitch> there's no requirement to be a DD to get packages into debian
<jmg> you need sponsorship at least
<ajmitch> same with ubuntu
<jmg> ubuntu is friendlier
<ajmitch> until I show up
<jmg> then we ignore you and go back to being friendly :-)
#ubuntu-motu 2008-08-04
<CarlFK> what is the debconf thing that re-builds xorg.conf?
<jmarsden> CarlFK: Are you looking for    dpkg-reconfigure xorg
<awmcclain> If the only thing I'm changing from the debian package is the distro and the maintainer, should I still append ubuntu1 to the version number?
<persia> awmcclain: Why would you only change those two things?  Would it not be better to sync?
<awmcclain> persia: Sync? What is this "sync"? Maybe my build process is wrong? Oh, keep in mind, the debian package is not part of the debian universe.
<persia> awmcclain: debian universe?  Could you perhaps provide some more context: I'd be happy to answer if I understood the details.
<persia> !sync
<ubottu> Sorry, I don't know anything about sync
<persia> Grr..
<awmcclain> eep. internet went down. sorry
<persia> https://wiki.debian.org/SyncRequestProcess
 * persia is an idiot today
<persia> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SyncRequestProcess
<persia> awmcclain: What are you trying to achieve (in some detail)?
<awmcclain> persia: I'm the (de facto) debian maintainer and the ubuntu maintainer of a few perl-based web server packages. I host the packages in my PPA. Previously, I've branching the upstream source (where they have a /debian directory -- i know, i've been arguing with them about it ), changing the distro from etch to gutsy/hardy, changing the package-maintainer to myself, building with pdebuild, and uploading to launchpad with dput.
<awmcclain> I've been using the version format "perlbal-1.70+svnXXX-1ubuntu1~hardy~ppa1", but I'm wondering if I should drop the ubuntu1.
<persia> awmcclain: I'd recommend e.g. ..-0ppa1~hardy for that use case, updating to ppa2 for a new rev, and using both releases, unless you find a case where you need to diverge between the releases.
<persia> Mind you, in a larger sense, it would make sense to get the packages into Debian proper, and have the source copied into Ubuntu so you only have to maintain -1 and it gets compiled for the right targets automatically (well, you might need to request backports).
<awmcclain> That was my next question. Ok.
<emgent> siretart: heya
<emgent> hey people please add your name in new UTU version
<emgent> http://thc.emanuele-gentili.com/utu/index.php
 * nhandler adds his name
<emgent> nxvl: go to add your name surname and launchpad id in UTU :)
<nxvl> ?
<nxvl> link please
<nxvl> http://thc.emanuele-gentili.com/utu.php ?
<tacone> nxvl: http://thc.emanuele-gentili.com/utu/registration.php
<nxvl> tacone: yep, done
<nxvl> :D
<tacone> nxvl: what's your name ? I forgot
 * nxvl HUGS tacone and emgent 
<nxvl> emgent: btw, did you use pbuilder?
<tacone> nvalcarcel ?
<tacone> nxvl: seems like your full name is so cool that utu is not ready yet to handle it
<emgent> Ã¡
<emgent> charset..
<tacone> mail encoding.
<tacone> python should have some library to handle it, though.
<emgent> uhm..
<nxvl> tacone: yeah, utf-8 issue
<nxvl> tacone: i'm used to it
<tacone> nxvl: I have no doubt you are.
<tacone> nxvl: I posted on the blog a mail I've written on ubuntu-devel. http://www.stefanoforenza.com/ubuntu-gui-coverage/
<nxvl> yeah i saw it
<tacone> I was not really lucid while writing it, but maybe you are interested in the general topic
<tacone> oh
<tacone> ok
<nxvl> it's on my ToDo list to search the tread
<nxvl> :D
<nxvl> now i'm kind of busy testing and writing the build-twice-in-a-row function on pbuilder
<tacone> well, I had only 1 reply. the rest is a slightly different argument.
<tacone> nxvl: any plan to support make -j 2  or make -j 3 in pbuilder ?
<nxvl> tacone: it doesn't?
<tacone> you have to hack it.
<tacone> or maybe set some default env var for make, I don't know.
<StevenK> Some debian/rules support CONCURRENCY_LEVEL
<tacone> StevenK: that would be a nice step forward.
<nxvl> tacone: that should be defined on debian/rules actually
<StevenK> make -j n is hard, though. For complex pieces of software you need *really* *really* well defined upstream Makefiles
<tacone> StevenK: what you mean ? risk of breaking ?
<StevenK> tacone: Yup. So, the whole point of -j n is you break up the build into multiple streams, and start them simultaneously. If stream A needs something stream C is building and doesn't depend on it in the Makefile, so that make knows to 1) order it into stream A, or 2) have stream A block until the piece is built, otherwise it could go bad.
<tacone> StevenK: too bad :-(
<StevenK> tacone: If upstream knows how to write Makefiles, it isn't usually an issue -- you just shouldn't turn it on for every single package in the archive.
<StevenK> tacone: The kernel, for example, easily deals with -j n
<tacone> StevenK: ok, thanks :)
<emma> :)
<Hobbsee> hello emma.
<emma> hehe
<emgent> moin Hobbsee :)
<emma> moin emgent :)
<Hobbsee> hey emgent, how's it going?
<emgent> all good thanks :)
<emgent> I finished now to fix the latest problems in UTU
<emgent> now rocks :)
<emma> emgent: that sounds like a good accomplishment.
<StevenK> Is it faster now? :-P
<emgent> sure crontab :)
<emgent> StevenK Hobbsee go to add your name :P
<tacone> bleeding edge caching techniques, uh emgent ? :-)
<Hobbsee> emgent: can't you just pull them all off LP or something?
<emgent> tacone: hehehe
<emgent> Hobbsee: lists.ubuntu.com version-changes
<Hobbsee> emgent: or that, yes.
<StevenK> emgent: Hardy is blank
<emgent> StevenK: i know.. calculating.. :)
<tacone> not anymore.
<emgent> refresh in 10 min.
<emgent> now all up :)
<emma> emgent - What is it that you work on?
<emgent> emma: it`s a python script for grab uploads, and php scripts for manage it.
<emgent> emma: http://thc.emanuele-gentili.com/utu/index.php
<emma> emgent: oh that's wonderful.
<emma> emgent: That's why I like to hang out in these channels. You are such a talented guy.
 * Hobbsee hears deja vu.
<emgent> emma: ...
<emma> Yes?
<emgent> (06:53) ( emma) emgent: oh that's wonderful.
<emgent> this is a stupid script, stupid but useful
<emma> I see. :)
<emma> emgent: to me it looks wonderful and I still maintain that you are a talented guy :)
<emma> hehe
<emma> :)
<emma> Goodnight now.
<emgent> bye.
<emma> bye.
<persia> emgent: How did you get your initial name list?
<tacone> persia: http://thc.emanuele-gentili.com/utu/registration.php
<tacone> persia: it's linked from the main page.
<persia> tacone: Except I didn't use that, and my name is listed, which is why I wondered
<tacone> I misunderstood. reads from mailing list.
<emgent> persia: someone added your nick..
<tacone> no, emgent he refers to the full name
<emgent> ah nice.
<emgent> yeah, via mailing list.
<tacone> persia: uploaderlist = findall('Changed-By: (.*) <.*>', data)
<persia> emgent: Hmm.  I'm going to agree with those who suggested you pull data from LP: it's too easy to abuse if there is no checking involved.
<persia> tacone: Sure, but that doesn't explain why "persia" exists on http://thc.emanuele-gentili.com/utu/showlist.php
<tbielawa> woohoo! that was exciting. I just figured out what build-deps were required to satisfy pkg-config on something I'm working on :-)
<tacone> guess he added by hand the first entries
<tacone> persia: I don't know if launchpad bugs allows for fullname search right now.
<emgent> i think nhandler
<tacone> maybe the new apis ?
<emgent> same ip in this post.
<persia> Doesn't need it: we always have the email address.
<tacone> persia: same thing. does it allow right now ?
<persia> tacone: Sure.  pass some search text in a JSON object as a GET to https://api.edge.launchpad.net/beta/people
<tacone> !! are the apis already pubblished ? wow.
<ubottu> tacone: Error: I am only a bot, please don't think I'm intelligent :)
<tacone> ubottu: you undervalue yourself
<ubottu> tacone: Error: I am only a bot, please don't think I'm intelligent :)
<tacone> ok ok ..
<emgent> heheh
<tacone> persia: I seem not allowed yet to access that page. I would have to subscribe launchpad beta users etc etc :-)
<persia> tacone: Ah.  Yes.  On the other hand, some people might be subscribed :)
<tacone> (which sounds pretty cool now that I think about that)
<tacone> some people could steal secret information >:-]
<tacone> (jocking)
 * tacone made the wannabe-a-beta-something request
<emgent> tacone: and wait...
<emgent> (07:00) ( kiko) <kiko> okay, flying out to toronto, see you all in some 16h!
<emgent> (07:00) :: kiko (n=kiko@canonical/launchpad/pdpc.supporter.active.kiko) has quit ("Connection reset by santa")
<emgent> heheh :)
<tacone> is him the only one ?
<tacone> oh
<tacone> 16h, not 16th august
<tacone> ok I can wait.
<persia> There ought be others who can approve a request to be a beta tester
<emgent> https://launchpad.net/~launchpad-beta-testers/+members
<tacone> ok, I misunderstood though, 2/3 days is not so much :-)
<tacone> oh
<tacone> efficent people. I am delighted.
<tacone> uhm, the api page still doesn't work.
<tacone> going to sleep a little
<tacone> see you
<emgent> tacone: see you later :)
<TomJaeger> Could someone have a look at the easystroke package on REVU?  Thanks.
<emgent> tacone: moin
<dholbach> good morning
<Laney> howdy
<dholbach> heya Laney
<takdir> could someone review indonesian-fonts and scim-tables-indonesian at revu ?
<Iulian> G'morning
<dholbach> nobody packaged launchpadlib yet?
<james_w> hey dholbach
<dholbach> hi james_w
<james_w> has it been released?
<dholbach> I could check out lp:launchpadlib :)
<james_w> that's good enough
<james_w> I'll take a look
<dholbach> thekorn is working on a pylpbugs connector using launchpadlib
<james_w> awesome
<dholbach> so we can have a smooth transition for the scripts that we have already
<dholbach> yes, thekorn is full of awesome-ness
<dholbach> there are no other words for it
<james_w> and you're not hugging him for that?
<dholbach> I was humping him earlier on
 * dholbach hugs thekorn
<dholbach> thanks james_w for looking into the packaging :)
 * dholbach hugs james_w too
 * james_w starts a group hug with dholbach and thekorn 
<dholbach> :-))))
 * thekorn hugs dholbach and james_w 
<dholbach> yoohooo
 * DktrKranz hugs everyone, simpler ;)
<james_w> dholbach: do you know a way to search for a term in bugs with a tag?
<james_w> I'm trying to see if there is a needs-packaging bug already open
<james_w> ah I can do it from advanced it seems
<ion_> Anyone feel like reviewing http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=compcache-setup? Thanks.
<metilfenidato> packages.ubuntu is out?
<Iulian> Seems that it's down.
<yannick> Why is ffmpeg lacking some video encoders since intrepid? cf. https://bugs.launchpad.net/ekiga/+bug/254201
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 254201 in ffmpeg-debian "feature regression: ffmpeg lacks some video encoders (like h263+, MPEG4, maybe more...)" [Undecided,New]
<persia> ion_: Is that just a wrapper around a udev rule?
<ion_> persia: Well, it has a localizable debconf UI and handles the mkinitramfs compcache code properly.
<persia> ion_: It just seems a bit light for it's own package: there's something about having no actual code that bothers me.
<persia> On the other hand, at least it's native, rather than having an empty "upstream" tarball...
<ion_> Well, there is *some* code, although admittedly not much. :-)
<ion_> The validation of the user-supplied value, the computation of the module parameter based on it etc. :-)
<persia> ion_: There's no code outside of debian/
<ion_> persia: Well, i *could* have put the files outside debian/, but then dh_* wouldnât have found them automatically. ;-)
<ion_> perais: But yeah, i get what you mean.
<persia> ion_: I'm not advocating putting them outside debian, I'm just amused at a "no code" package.
<persia> Anyway, it's not lintian clean.
<ion_> Huh. I could have sworn i checked the source and the binary. I guess i made a mistake.
<joaopinto> Could someone review http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=amoebax ? Thanks
<ion_> persia: What doesn your lintian complain about? It doesnât complain for me.
<persia> joaopinto: The source isn't even lintian clean for that one.
<persia> ion_: I suspect you aren't giving lintian the -iIv options
<ion_> persia: Sorry, no. Will check with them and fix.
<joaopinto> ops, forgot the lintian warnings
<persia> ion_: Anyway notes on REVU (along with non-lintian note)
<ion_> persia: Thanks!
<devfil> asac: I've tested the rdepends of xulrunner 1.8.1.16
<Syntux> Good day
<asac> devfil: good
<asac> please open a bug and attach the bits
<devfil> asac: there is a problem, I don't know hot to find the USN, CVE... fixed in this release
<devfil> *how
<asac> devfil: just look at the firefox USNs
<asac> if we skipped .15 .14 ... and so on, add those to the "fixed" list as well.
<devfil> asac: where exactly? we skipped only .15, .14 is in the repo
<asac> devfil: look for the firefox advisory for .15 and .16 then
<asac> devfil: http://www.ubuntu.com/usn
<asac> devfil: also check the advisories for tbird .15 and .16
<asac> maybe there is one on top
<asac> if there is another referred in tbird add that as well as xulrunner also contains most of mailnews
<asac> devfil: you dont need to name all CVEs/MFSAs in changelog, just USNs would be enough
<asac> (maybe with a link to the USNs)
<Syntux> nhandler, yo
<stefanlsd> Anyone bored and wanna look at and comment / maybe sponsor my gpa build?
<BUGabundo> is Jonathan Riddell (jriddell) around?
<BUGabundo> today's update mess my kmail
<Riddell> hmm?
<BUGabundo> hi there
<BUGabundo> Riddell: see private im
<Riddell> BUGabundo: kde4libs_4.1.0-0ubuntu7 should appear in a bit, ought to help things
<BUGabundo> it was working fine until a few minutes ago, when I did some updates
<BUGabundo> ahhh ok
<BUGabundo> I'll wait...
<BUGabundo> souldnt there be dependecies ?
<BUGabundo> what's up with /libwbclient0_2%3a3.2.0-4ubuntu3_amd64.deb  and likewise?
<Riddell> I don't know what that is
<huats> hello everyone
<joaopinto> could someone review http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=amoebax ? Thanks
<Riddell> BUGabundo: looks like a problem with samba
<BUGabundo> I know
<BUGabundo> more precislly likewise
<ScottK> joaopinto: One quick comment for you on package descriptions ...  It looks like you've written one package description, but the first line should be the short description and the second line should start the long description.  It looks like one, but it's really two separate things.  The long description should read sensibly without the short description present.
<BUGabundo> Hobbsee and Riddell here is the full log http://paste.ubuntu.com/34001/
<james_w> BUGabundo: it's bug 254434
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 254434 in samba "package libwbclient0 2:3.2.0-4ubuntu3 failed to install/upgrade: trying to overwrite `/usr/lib/libwbclient.so.0', which is also in package likewise-open" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/254434
<BUGabundo> thanks
<BUGabundo> thanks james_w
<james_w> I imagine it is actually a bug in likewise-open, but once our samba expert wakes up I'm sure he'll reassign it or fix it as needed
<BUGabundo> its been like this for a week
<BUGabundo> I'll subscribe to it
<Hobbsee> BUGabundo: if it's been like this for a week, then why didn't you report a bug about it a week ago?
<BUGabundo> I was busy with other more pressing bugs
<BUGabundo> I've been reporting bugs against kmail
<BUGabundo> on kde 4.1
<BUGabundo> and last week wasn't all that free time... too much to do at the office
<Hobbsee> i hope you reported them at bugs.kde.org.
<BUGabundo> I avoid to jump on the wagon and post just about any bug, until I know what's behind it
<BUGabundo> just last week I was having some problem, that prevented me from login and with the help of ppl on the # I found out it was a permission related prob. I would be a waste just to open a ticket for that, before I could even confirm it was a bug or a local issue
<BUGabundo> so I do, others I leave for the mantainer to decide if they should go uptream to kde
<Hobbsee> true
<Hobbsee> but package upgrades tend to be bugs, unless you've been using stuff outside the packaging system.
<BUGabundo> I remember all the trouble I had with my nvidia and all due to me instaling the nvidia driver instead of the one in the reps. with the help of envy dev I manage to get it fix... no bug there!
<BUGabundo> nothing out of reps for kde/kmail
<BUGabundo> but there are a lot of regressions
<BUGabundo> but even KDEPIM Ingo doenst want to be bother with some of them
<Hobbsee> well, it is kmail...
<BUGabundo> lol
<RainCT> emgent: Hey. FYI, you can get the user account associated with an email using the new LP API.
<RainCT> (or at least the wiki has an example of that - I haven't tested it yet)
<huats> nxvl: congrats !
<huats> ;)
<nxvl> huats: you too!
<persia> Bah.  You were both members beforehand.  nxvl was the example raised in the discussion that granted the existance of UUC.
<persia> (Coincidence as being on the same agenda for the same day)
<ScottK> nxvl: Congrats on pbuilder.  Thanks.
<nxvl> heh
<nxvl> yes
 * nxvl remembers that
<nxvl> ScottK: thank you
<nxvl> i was surprised to see it already uploaded
<nxvl> :D
<nxvl> but nice
<nxvl> :D
<nxvl> i tested it all night long yesterday so now i'm completely sure it works as spected
<persia> nxvl: Have you discussed the changes with dancer?  Might be worth getting some of them into Debian.
<nxvl> persia: i've already file a bug on debian
<nxvl> persia: so the patch is already there
<huats> hello persia and ScottK
<ScottK> Hello huats.  Congratulations on UUC.
<ScottK> nxvl too (UUC).
<huats> ScottK: thanks
<huats> :)
<huats> you have your part in it :)
<stefanlsd> uuc?
<RainCT> stefanlsd: ubuntu-universe-contributors
 * ScottK stops typing.
 * nxvl dances
<nxvl> ScottK: thanks again!
<nxvl> brb, going for a smoke
<stefanlsd> ok. i guess congrats.  :)
<stefanlsd> for whatever  :)
<RainCT> nxvl, huats: I think I haven't said it yet, so: congrats! :)
<ScottK> nxvl: Courier is needing a merge.  Would you mind looking into it?
<nxvl> RainCT: thanks
<nxvl> ScottK: yep
<nxvl> ScottK: imap-courrier?
<huats> RainCT: thanks
<nxvl> i think i cna do it in the road trip to tampa
<nxvl> and upload it there
<ScottK> nxvl: courier-imap is one of the binary packages, but courier is the source package.
<ScottK> OK.
<RainCT> ScottK: btw, nice catch (the requestsync bug)
<nxvl> ScottK: yeah is just that i, yes
<nxvl> nevermind
<nxvl> ScottK: 0.60.0-1?
<ScottK> nxvl: Sounds right, yes.
<ScottK> RainCT: Thanks.
<nxvl> ScottK: courier-authlib also?
<stefanlsd> I created a watch file for a package - how do i send the patch to debian?
<ScottK> nxvl: If you care to, but it needn't be done together.
<nxvl> :D
<nxvl> it's a 2.5 hours road trip
<ScottK> nxvl: I try to watch over courier a bit because I know a lot of people use it.  courier-authlib I haven't particularly watched, so I've no great opinion on it.
<RainCT> stefanlsd: submit@bugs.debian.org, the subject is the bug title and start the body with:   Package: <packagename>  (and on the next line:)  Severity: wishlist
<RainCT> stefanlsd: you may also want to add the Ubuntu tag.. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/Debian/Usertagging
<ScottK> Isn't there some submittodebian script that deals with most of that?
<ScottK> Personally I tend to use reportbug.
<RainCT> ScottK: probably, but I find that just sending a mail is faster
<nxvl> ScottK: reportbug
<nxvl> i use repurtbug-ng
<nxvl> reportbug-ng*
<RainCT> nxvl: didn't they want to change it to send the bugs to Ubuntu instead?
<nxvl> since it opens a evolution mail and i can edit it as i will
<ScottK> nxvl: I just use reportbug for Debian, so I changed it back to sending to Debian (it's a conf option).
<nxvl> ScottK: i use it to send it to debian
<nxvl> is there any way to use it for sending to ubuntu?
<ScottK> Not usefully.
<nxvl> yeah, launchpad is easy enought
<ScottK> reportbug sends mail to ubuntu-users.
<ScottK> Personally I like Debian BTS better in most respects.
<nxvl> i don't find it useful to have reportbug modified to launchpad
<stefanlsd> LP is nice.  the debian interfaces are really old looking
<ScottK> BTS renders pages fast enough I'm not left waiting.  I care a lot more about that than how pretty it is.
 * persia isn't convinced old is bad: Ubuntu is (mostly) SUS compliant, and there have been plenty of newer operating systems in the meantime
<ScottK> nxvl: Better that than ubuntu-users ML.
<RainCT> ScottK: Fixed. I'll upload the new ubuntu-dev-tools revision in a few days (Laney wants to get a new script in and I've told him to write a manpage for it first).
<ScottK> OK.  No rush.  Thanks for the quick turn around.
<devfil> asac: can you take a look at https://launchpad.net/bugs/254618 ?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 254618 in xulrunner "Please update xulrunner to 1.8.1.16 version." [Undecided,Confirmed]
<bluefoxicy> now this is odd!
<stefanlsd> ScottK: thanks. submitted to debian. Did the usertagging also.  Quiet easy over email...
<bluefoxicy> synaptic says some stuff is obsolete
<bluefoxicy> on Hardy
<bluefoxicy> if I remove it it removes all of Gnome
<bluefoxicy> libasound2
<bluefoxicy> and python2.5
<nxvl> ScottK: heh, indeed
<nxvl> wel
<nxvl> going to tampa now
<nxvl> back in 3 hours i hope
<nxvl> read you!
 * bluefoxicy is on 64-bit so.. has to head to class now though
<nxvl> (if someone is in tampa drop me an e-mail to meet us there)
<bddebian> Heya folks
<sistpoty|work> hi folks
<bddebian> Heya sistpoty|work
<RainCT> hi sistpoty|work
<sistpoty|work> hi bddebian
<sistpoty|work> and hi RainCT
<stefanlsd> crumbs. the more users that use ubuntu the more bugs there are.   need to increase the contributers to dev ratio
<joaopinto> ScottK, about the amoebax description, does http://pastebin.com/m25a5223e looks better ?
 * ScottK looks
<stefanlsd> anyone got a gpg pub key with special chars in. umlauts or the like. want to test it in gpa to confirm a bug and see if my new version of gpa fixes it... (or knows the best way to find such a key)
<RainCT> joaopinto: /me suggests http://pastebin.com/d65184dce
<joaopinto> RainCT, tks, change applied
<ScottK> joaopinto: Or even http://pastebin.com/d6963029f
<dholbach> stefanlsd: try 5BE41F21
<ScottK> I updated from RainCT's.
<stefanlsd> dholbach: thanks
<RainCT> btw, is it allowed for the copyright file to be generated at build time? (I guess yes, as I've just seen a package which does that, but just to be sure)
<joaopinto> ScottK, tks, changed applied
<ScottK> RainCT: The source package has to be distributable.  How does that work if you don't have debian/copyright until you build it?
<sistpoty|work> RainCT: also, if it's gpl, you'll need to have a copy of it in the source package
<RainCT> Uhm.. That package is scaring me :P. The generated copyright file lists the authors' names and then basically says "the files include are under different licenses, check them yourself"
<RainCT> awesome, there are some GPL files, but there isn't a copy of it
<joaopinto> the description was improved, http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=amoebax, now it would be nice to get an advocate
<RainCT> joaopinto: please indent the free art license in debian/copyright for clarity
<RainCT> ah, nvm, it would be over 80 chars then
<ScottK> RainCT: Very bad (copyright stuff).  This package isn't in Debian is it?
<RainCT> ScottK: It is, and in Ubuntu it's in main.. manpages-de
 * RainCT hopes that he is missing something :P
<ScottK> Urgh.
<joaopinto> maybe main needs to use REVU :P
<ScottK> RainCT: I'd suggest asking pitti about it.
<ScottK> joaopinto: We got that one straight from Debian in ancient times, so maybe it wasn't looked at as closely as we would now.
<lamothe> Hi guys, can someone please explain the anomaly that is the new dvb-apps?  I know that dvb-utils has been removed but I can't quite work out if the new package is called linuxtv-dvb-apps or just dvb-apps?
<lamothe> http://packages.debian.org/search?keywords=dvb-apps returns something.
<lamothe> And I get this also, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linuxtv-dvb-apps
<laga> i still have dvb-apps in hardy
<laga> err, dvb-utils
<lamothe> laga: Yes, dvb-utils (Hardy, Etch) -> dvb-apps (Intrepid, Lenny)
<lamothe> I think.
<laga> well, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linuxtv-dvb-apps claims that it's also in hardy?
<lamothe> laga: Yeah, strange, but it's not, if you know what I mean.
<laga> lamothe: linuxtv-dvb-apps is the source
<laga> and it produces dvb-utils on hardy
<lamothe> laga: Ahhhhhh .... got it.  Thanks for that.
<slytherin> geser: ping
<nxvl> ScottK: done with the merges
<nxvl> ScottK: courier-authlib is needed for courier to build
<nxvl> ScottK: debdiff uploaded
<geser> slytherin: pong
<slytherin> geser: i am about to finish working on next upload for jboss. Want an advice. Which runtime dependency do you think is correct, default-jre or default-jre-headless?
<geser> slytherin: good question
<geser> unless you have checked that it doesn't use any UI classes, I'd stay on the safe side and depend on default-jre
<slytherin> geser: there are some references to swing classes. But I guess those are mainly in the admin console part. For now I will make it depend on default-jre.
<Koon> slytherin: afaict for jboss it should be safe to run with -headless.
<Koon> slytherin: in the server team we are trying to have a viable jre-headless environment -- but it's still work in progress, as lots of libraries depend on java2-runtime where they should depend on java2-runtime-headless
<slytherin> Koon: right
<Koon> the idea being not to pull half of X to run Java server things
<Koon> slytherin: you'll probably find that the full java2-runtime gets puleed in by one of JBoss deps anyway ;)
<slytherin> Koon: I am planning to file some catch all bugs to remove duplication in java libraries ex. libservlet2.3 vs 2.4, different versions of xalan, but I will get to that part later.
<Koon> slytherin: be careful with libservlet2.3/2.4/2.5 : they probably must coexist because they reflect different Servlet APIs
<SolarWar> heyo,  can someone advocate/comment on my superawesome package of Qlix- a program that allows one to easily transfer music to MTP devices (like the zune) http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=qlix
<slytherin> Koon: I think most of the packages can be build safely with servlet 2.4. Of course I have to evaluate that.
<Koon> slytherin: note that libservlet2.5 is a binary of the tomcat6 source package
<slytherin> Koon: I know.
<Koon> slytherin: heh :)
<jcastro> ScottK: in the "good communication with upstream" thread on debian devel someone mentiones that you're adding emdebian-tools to a blacklist of packages that don't sync to ubuntu. Do you have a url to that list? Thanks.
<geser> jcastro: http://people.ubuntu.com/~ubuntu-archive/sync-blacklist.txt
<jcastro> geser: thank you!
 * sistpoty|work heads home now... cya
<kirkland> when does merges.ubuntu.com get updated?
<kirkland> anyway to force that update for a single package?
<kirkland> or can I manually do the work for a single package by hand to prep a merge?
<Laney> but of course
<Laney> Get Debian version, get Ubuntu version, do merge
<Laney> I do most of mine that way
<jpds> kirkland: As for updates, I'd ask Keybuk in -devel.
<kirkland> jpds: thx
<jpds> kirkland: De nada.
<kirkland> Laney: is there a wiki page describe the manual merge instructions in more detail?
<BUGabundo> Riddell: kdelibs are available now, and installed
<BUGabundo> but kmail still won't start...
<BUGabundo> ASSERT: "s->parsed == false" in file /build/buildd/kde4libs-4.1.0/kdecore/kernel/kcmdlineargs.cpp, line 524 \n Aborted
<Laney> kirkland: Sure, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/Merging
<Laney> Oh, that's about grab-merge
<kirkland> Laney: right, i've only ever used grab-merge
<Laney> Er, well basically you just check each of the Ubuntu changes and whether they're still needed
<Laney> and copy them if they are
<kirkland> k
<Laney> If it's the same upstream version then I tend to use meld to view the changes
<Riddell> BUGabundo: hmm, works for me
<BUGabundo> bah
<BUGabundo> don't know what to do then, Riddell
<BUGabundo> I depend a lot on email
<BUGabundo> lol
<jpds> BUGabundo: Pastebin: strace -e open -f kmail ?
<BUGabundo> jpds: Riddell http://paste.ubuntu.com/34113/
<jpds> Oh, same thing..
<BUGabundo> you too ?
<BUGabundo> so its not just me..
<BUGabundo> great
<jpds> No, same error.
 * jpds uses mutt for mail ;-)
<BUGabundo> LOL
<BUGabundo> I use it too
<BUGabundo> best email client EVER
<BUGabundo> jpds  Riddell
<BUGabundo> jpds  Riddell see this please http://paste.ubuntu.com/34115/
<BUGabundo> it now doesn't even show kdelibs missing from install
<BUGabundo> but kmail won't start ...
<Riddell> BUGabundo: mm, I think that should be sorted out first
<BUGabundo> I know
<BUGabundo> I don't even us samba that much....
<BUGabundo> but why is it interfiring with kde ?!?
<BUGabundo> actually it seems to be related to DBUS
<BUGabundo> than anything else
<kirkland> so I moved on from MoM to DaD ... but the grab-merge doesn't look right...  the *patch files are empty
<kirkland> http://dad.dunnewind.net/ecryptfs-utils/
<Lutin> kirkland: it's explicitely marked as broken on DaD
<Adri2000> kirkland: DaD relies on snapshot.d.n, and in some cases like this one, the base version is not available there
<Adri2000> that's why the merge is broken
<kirkland> Adri2000: do i just need to wait around until it becomes available?
<Adri2000> if at some point it becomes available on snapshot.d.n, we can reprocess the package in DaD if someone asks us to do it
<kirkland> Adri2000: specifically what files are missing?
<kirkland> Adri2000: http://packages.qa.debian.org/e/ecryptfs-utils.html
<Adri2000> see http://dad.dunnewind.net/ecryptfs-utils/REPORT, DaD needs the base version, the debian version and the ubuntu version. debian and ubuntu versions are easy to fetch (they are the latest version in the archive)
<Adri2000> for the base version we use snapshot.debian.net
<Adri2000> for this package, DaD reads http://snapshot.debian.net/archive/pool/e/ecryptfs-utils/source/Sources.gz
<Adri2000> see that version 50-4
<Adri2000> (base version) is not listed there
<Laney> RainCT: New revisions for u-d-t pushed up to LP
<Adri2000> kirkland: for such merges I'd suggest that you use MoM directly (which doesn't have this kind of problem as it doesn't rely on snapshot.d.n), and use DaD if you want to leave a comment about that merge
<kirkland> Adri2000: :-P  I usually use MoM, but the disk is full over there, and so the hourly script is broken, and it doesn't even know that ecryptfs-utils is out of date
<kirkland> i'm attempting a merge by hand
<Adri2000> ahahaha :P ok :)
<kirkland> rock + hard place :-)
<Adri2000> so either use snapshot.d.n and have some merges broken or keep the entire archives + debian history and have your disk full :)
<geser> DktrKranz: have you some time to put your motu-sru hat on and comment on bug 224077?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 224077 in gnumed-client "Outdated (buggy) GNUmed version (0.2.8.2) in Hardy " [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/224077
<DktrKranz> geser, sounds reasonably sane, but I'll have a more in-depth look after dinner :)
<emgent> heya
<RainCT> Laney: what does --bindmounts do?
<RainCT> Laney: ah I see
<RainCT> Laney: good work. I'm away now but will merge it soon
<saivann> If a member of the backports team wants to take care of this bug, gnucash 2.2.6 is ready to backport to Hardy in bug https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/hardy-backports/+bug/243436
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 243436 in hardy-backports "Please backport Gnucash 2.2.6-1ubuntu1 from Intrepid to Hardy" [Undecided,New]
<stefanlsd> warp10: you around?
<stefanlsd> norsetto: ...
<norsetto> hi stefanlsd
<stefanlsd> norsetto: hey :)   I was told to ask you about a mentor application i sent in. It went to motu-mentoring-reception@responses.net...
<norsetto> stefanlsd: yes, we are trying to match you, but most mentors are right now on holidays
<stefanlsd> norsetto: aah ok.  just wondering if it went in. ok. thanks cool. wasnt sure you guys received it.
<norsetto> stefanlsd: np, thanks for checking
<stefanlsd> oki. thanks :)
<SolarWar> pbuilder is giving me this issue when building my package: http://rafb.net/p/QQw29X59.html  it then proceeds to error out, complaining how it couldn't meet the dependencies
<james_w> SolarWar: I believe you need to enable universe in your pbuilder chroot
<SolarWar> james_w, i'm not sure how to enable repositories inside the pbuilder chroot
<geser> james_w: it's a workaround, because libmtp8 is in universe while the -dev package is in main
<james_w> ah, ok
<slytherin> why is -dev package in main when the library is inuniverse?
<geser> slytherin: I guess it's an oversight as the source is in main
<geser> and the previous version of the lib (libmtp7) was also in main
<geser> SolarWar: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto#head-5e61fa0f52f7f2442fb20f074813bd691744460b
<geser> SolarWar: the issue should be fixed soon
 * NCommander yawns
<SolarWar> is libmtp going to be moved to main? or is -dev going to be moved to universe?
<geser> libmtp8 is going into main
<slytherin> [OT] What is recommended size of hackergotchi for planet Ubuntu?
<daskReech> Hiya
<daskReech>  Does anyone know if gfs is supported under hardy?
<slytherin> daskReech: what is gfs?
<daskReech> Global File system
<daskReech> it's a file system for multipe nodes to access over a network or channel with locking capabiltes and as I understand it data verification and protection
<slytherin> daskReech: What do you mean by 'if gfs is supported'. What kind of support are you expecting?
<daskReech> Well I did a search for Ubuntu and gfs and the only hits I find are people asking if GFS is supported or the gfs[2]-tools
<daskReech> which are packaged
<daskReech> but if I install these on a server with LTS hardy can I get support from Canonical ?
<slytherin> daskReech: AFAIK, canonical doesn't provide free support. At the same time I am not sure of the packages covered by Canonical
<daskReech> not free support
<Laney> Canonical support packages in main
<daskReech> hrrr
<daskReech> Doesn't seem to be community or offically supported
<daskReech> ok I'll find another distro then
<Nafallo> the security updates are free, and are Canonical for main.
<jpds> daskReech: You can buy support at shop.canonical.com
<daskReech> jpds, Yes but it doesn't seem they are supported in any case
<Nafallo> daskReech: how would you define support?
<daskReech> Nafallo, Well the tools are marked as experimental in p.u.c
<Nafallo> not sure I follow.
<daskReech> and depend on a redhat package
<Nafallo> what tools?
<daskReech> GFS
<RainCT> Laney: Btw, I merged your changes a while ago (with some changes).
<Laney> RainCT: Awesome, thanks a lot! What did you change?
<daskReech> Well redhat Virtual package
<Nafallo> daskReech: gfs2 yes, gfs no.
<daskReech> The gfs-tools depend on gfs2
<Nafallo> oh. just saw...
<RainCT> Laney: uhmm little stuff, "bzr merge lp:ubutnu-dev-tools; bzr diff" if you want to know
<daskReech> Doesn't seem likely to be supported
<daskReech>  the only things I can find dealing with Ubuntu and gfs2 are bug reports
<daskReech> doesn't seem like a wise move
<geser> daskReech: do you know if gfs upstream considers it safe for production use?
<daskReech> gfs2 no
<daskReech> Should be ready for 9.04
<Nafallo> daskReech: might want to ask on #ubuntu-server. they are more likely to be able to respond to your particular enquiry.
<daskReech> Nafallo, Wonderful! Thanks a lot
<fabrice_sp> Hi. Some time ago, I uploaded a package in REVU (DVDStyler), to close a needs-packaging request (https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/105653), but I didn't get any comment. What should I do?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 105653 in ubuntu "[needs-packaging] dvdstyler .deb" [Wishlist,In progress]
<fabrice_sp> this one, yes
<lucas> could someone point me to an "how to request a sync?" howto? a request a sync of ruby1.9 for me?
<geser> lucas: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SyncRequestProcess
<lucas> geser: thanks a lot :)
<Laney> Can someone help me with this: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/34165/ - packaging a library with CDBS and it seems to insist on symblinking doc in the -dev to doc in the library, but lintian doesn't like it
<Laney> symlinking*
<geser> Laney: I guess you can ignore it. It a Ubuntu-specific extension to cdbs to save space.
<Laney> geser: Ah, excellent. I tried a lot of stuff to stop it happening but without any success
<Laney> Well in that case I'd like to solicit reviews for my goocanvasmm package on REVU - C++ wrappers for goocanvas (cairo canvas widget). .diff.gz is only small ;) - http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=goocanvasmm
<emgent> hello
<joaopinto> Hello
<joaopinto> Can someone review and advocate http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=amoebax ? Thanks
<ScottK> geser: Thanks for helping jcastro out while I was gone.
<james_w> Is there an ubuntu python channel?
<james_w> the obvious one doesn't seem to exist?
<ScottK> james_w: No.  We pretty well do Python stuff here.
<jpds> #ubuntu-python: Last used  : Apr 22 23:46:54 2006 (2 years, 14 weeks, 6 days, 21:44:49 ago)
<james_w> ScottK: cool, I'll ask here then, thanks.
<directhex> pfft, python. i hear all the cool distros use haskell
<ScottK> The working ones us Python.   I'll take that.
<james_w> I have a python library that uses setuptools, is there a way to make that behave, or is it unwilling to conform?
<ScottK> patch it into submission is the short answer.
<ScottK> I haven't had to do it.
<ScottK> Maybe POX_ is around and can give hints.
<james_w> you mean rip out setuptools and put in distutils?
<POX_> what's wrong with setuptools?
<ScottK> POX_: Isn't that the one that grabs randomon python bits off the net or am I confused?
<POX_> just remove ez_stup related stuff from setup.py and all should work fine
<ScottK> james_w: ^^ Yeah.  That was it.
<james_w> except that this setup.py uses some of the extra features
<POX_> setuptools without ez_* is fine
<james_w> that's fine, and I've patches it out
<james_w> ah, I see, I'll give that a go
<james_w> thanks POX_ ScottK
<ScottK> james_w: If you are interested in python stuff there is also #debian-python on OFTC.
<james_w> this one was complicated by the upstream containing a rather prominent member of the python community
<james_w> ScottK: yeah, that would be my next port of call, thanks
<ScottK> There you can speak to POX_ directly rather than have me summon his spirit first.
<ScottK> ;-)
<POX_> yeah ;)
<slangasek> vorian: ping
<vorian> slangasek: yessir
<slangasek> vorian: hi, looks like you sponsored the upload of monkeystudio to NEW?
<vorian> yes
<slangasek> vorian: and it looks like monkeystudio is embedding copies of Qt Designer and qscintilla, which are already in the archive... is there a good reason for them to be embedded?
<vorian> hmmm
<vorian> let me take a look see
<slangasek> ok
<lifeless> slangasek: software reuse is to be applauded
<slangasek> lifeless: money can be exchanged for goods and services?
<lifeless> slangasek: Quo Vadis?
<slangasek> Rock me, Amadeus
<vorian> slangasek: if you want to reject monkeystudio now, we can go back to upstream and have them remove them and reintroduce it to new before freeze (hopefully)
<syntux> I'm having a problem with pbuilder http://paste.ubuntu.com/34204/ not sure what's causing it or how to solve it
<coppro> you need to add Build-Depends to your package
<coppro> wait... nvm... what?
<ScottK> syntux: You're trying to build a package that needs debhelper 7.
<ScottK> You appear to only have 6.
<slangasek> vorian: well, given that the orig.tgz is built out of svn with a get-orig-tar target I'm not sure a round-trip to upstream is needed, but ok, I'll reject it for now pending cleanup of the code duplication, thanks :)
<ScottK> syntux: Is this an intrepid pbuilder?
<vorian> slangasek: thank you :)
<syntux> yes, it's an intrepid
<ScottK> Try pbuilder login, copy the package into the open pbuilder chroot and build it that way.
<syntux> How can I copy the package into the open pbuilder?
<directhex> or perhaps a pbuilder --update ? when did dh7 land in intrepid?
<tbielawa> instead of copying you can use --bindmounts /path/to/package
<ScottK> tbielawa: You can, but mess that up and you can have effects outside the chroot.
<ScottK> syntux: When you login, it'll tell you the patch to the chroot.  Then use sudo cp ...  to copy it.
<syntux> Ok, I have Version: 7.0.13ubuntu1 of debhelper in pbuilder intrepid env
<syntux> but still getting same error
<directhex> who has the ability to delete some stray files from my ppa archive, and wants to earn some points towards a free cake?
<ScottK> Odd.  Not sure.
<ScottK> directhex: PPA stuff in #launchpad.
<directhex> #launchpad is having a well-deserved nap
#ubuntu-motu 2008-08-05
<pjbroad> Hi, may I ask an upload question?
<pjbroad> ok, I'll ask anyway.  I uploaded a couple of packages a few weeks ago, I have tried to upload new versions but they never appear, any hints?
<Adri2000> upload where?
<pjbroad> to http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/uploads.py
<pjbroad> nevermind, as if my magic they appeared just now, *slighly sheepishly I'll leave*.....
<Adri2000> :)
<TomJaeger> Could someone review http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=easystroke ? Thank you.
<tbielawa> hello everybody
<emma> Hi gnomefreak
<gnomefreak> hi emma
<dholbach> good morning
<ion_> Howdy-ho
<Treenaks> morning
<nxvl> good morning!
<nxvl> dholbach: did you saw jono's mail?
<dholbach> nxvl: yes
<nxvl> :D
<dholbach> I'll get to it later on
<dholbach> (lots and lots and lots and lots of stuff to do)
<nxvl> take your time
 * dholbach hugs nxvl
<dholbach> :-)
 * nxvl HUGS dholbach back
<DBO> oh great a glorious master of the universe... where does one suggest a patch for libgtk2.0-cil?
<persia> DBO: In a bug against the gtk-sharp2 package.
<dholbach> DBO: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SponsorshipProcess
<DBO> thank you =)
<DBO> its a one line patch to fix a memory leak that was already committed into GTK-sharp trunk... do i need to go through that whole process dholbach?
<RAOF> DBO: The bug filing is not optional
<persia> DBO: Well, someone has to commit the fix and upload it.  If you want to do most of the work, it makes it easier for others.  If you don't have time, someone else may read the bug.
<RAOF> DBO: But you could just dump the patch on the bug if you want.
<RAOF> Well, I suppose the bug filing _is_ optional, really.  I've got a stake in the outcome and might eventually find time to hunt this down without a bug.
<DBO> its just in the Gtk.Metadata file...
<DBO> RAOF, that change
<DBO> http://anonsvn.mono-project.com/viewcvs/trunk/gtk-sharp/gtk/Gtk.metadata?rev=109594&view=auto
<DBO> here is the diff
<DBO> http://anonsvn.mono-project.com/viewcvs/trunk/gtk-sharp/gtk/Gtk.metadata?rev=109594&r1=107494&r2=109594
<RAOF> DBO: Put that on a LP bug please.  You can assign it to me if you want.
<DBO> can do boss
<DBO> whats your LP name?
<RAOF> raof
<RAOF> Nice and simple.
 * RAOF is fond of this nick.  He hasn't come across a nick collision yet.
<DBO> okay
<DBO> done
<persia> DBO: What's the bug number?
<DBO> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gtk-sharp2/+bug/254855
<DBO> basically Gtk# leaks every pixbuf you load from your icon theme.  It just so happens you wont notice this unless you do this an aweful lot.   GNOME Do does this, and thus can leak an aweful lot of memory
<Gustov> hey guys, will updating via disk destroy my linux?
<Gustov> I'm on fiesty fawn
<persia> Gustov: Depends on how you upgrade.  You may want to ask for advice on the upgrade path in #ubuntu
<Gustov> I was hoping usb
<Gustov> the prob. is I can't get internet
<persia> Gustov: One can upgrade with no internet access.  On the other hand, you may need support to do so, which is why I suggest #ubuntu: our support channel.
<Gustov> okay, thanks
<nxvl> time to sleep now
<nxvl> read you later!
<coppro> does anyone have experience with KHotKeys breaking in 4.1?
<slytherin> Can someone please give back libjboss-cache1-java?
<persia> slytherin: On i386?
<persia> slytherin: given-back
<slytherin> persia: yes
 * TheMuso likes being able to retry builds rather than having to ask an admin to do it.
<persia> TheMuso: Well, we still have an ask-an-admin model, but there are now >100 admins, rather than just 4 :)
<TheMuso> persia: True.
 * persia waits for wider sync privileges
<TheMuso> Is that coming?
<persia> I hope so.
<Hobbsee> supposedly.
<persia> Currently, I can fake it fairly well, so it looks like I did a sync, but many people make mistakes doing that.  A LP UI would be an improvement.
 * persia had to sync a few packages manually in hardy, as the automated tool couldn't
<RAOF> I seem to recall the LP people bemoaning the fact that a bunch of archive tasks are achieved by running scripts on the datacentre.
<Hobbsee> yeah, they are.
<persia> RAOF: RIght.  It's a matter of getting the tools from somewhat kludgy scripts into Soyuz, and then exposing a UI.
<siretart> saivann_: feel free to upload both gnucash 2.2.6 and libaqbanking 3.5 to gnucash PPA, both hardy and intrepid
<siretart> details in my email
<Hobbsee> persia: and them reliably working, yes.
<Hobbsee> persia: there's not really a lot of demand for it, though
<persia> Hobbsee: How is the demand measured?  I could be demanding.
<siretart> https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/soyuz/2.1 shows the next features for soyuz
<siretart> persia: I have been sent another list of soyuz specs where we are asked to prioritize
<siretart> persia: very similar to the specs for malone, but way shorter
<persia> siretart: I'm happy to share feedback if you like.
<StevenK> siretart: I doubt it, most of them are Implemented
<persia> Anyway, https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/soyuz/+spec/sync-workflows is on the 2.1 list, and the one I was talking about just now.
<siretart> persia: did you already respond to my call for help in prioritizing the specs?
<persia> siretart: Not formally: I'm not in either of the groups you asked for feedback.  Do you want commentary and prioritisation for the entire list?
<Hobbsee> persia: oh yes, you work for canonical now.  but there aren't a lot of archive admins, or canonical people pushing them.
<siretart> persia: I see you did already comment on 2 specs, but a general prioritisation would be exactly what the launchpad crew has asked us to do
<persia> Hobbsee: That canonical is one of my clients doesn't necessarily mean I have any more or less influence than I have anyway.
<siretart> persia: oh, you got hired by canonical?
<Hobbsee> persia: OTOH, MOTU pushes many bugs that they want fixed, so it probably gets lost in the noise.
<persia> siretart: The easiest thing would be to say "Yes", although it's more complicated than that.
<siretart> persia: well, then I will say an easy 'congrats'! :-)
<siretart> persia: may I ask what you are going to work on?
<RAOF> persia: Cool!  Congrats.
<persia> siretart: Yes, but I can't answer.  Mobile stuff is part of it.
<persia> Anyway, back to the point.
<siretart> ah, that's enough for me :-)
<persia> siretart: So, should everyone provide feedback and prioritisation to the list of specs?
<siretart> persia: I asked every member of the release and SRU team for that, yes
<persia> siretart: Right.  I'm not on those teams, and you've just asked me, which is why I'm confused :)
<persia> I have opinions, but don't want to add noise to your workflow.
<siretart> oh right, you're motu-council. Does motu-council work a lot with bugs?
<siretart> persia: no, the feedback is quite low, I'm happy with any response
<persia> Not in their role as MOTU Council.  Mind you, each of the members does.
<persia> siretart: I'll dig up the email again and number them 1 through 15 then.  If you're looking for more feedback, I'd also encourage you to add to the thread that you'd like more feedback from other interested MOTU.
<persia> Personally, I think Hobbsee and wgrant are fairly active in LP-watching, and likely have opinions, although I think neither is currently a member of either of the targeted groups.  There are likely also other interested people.
<siretart> persia: the thing is that I'm going to leave on VAC for 2 weeks starting on tomorrow. I need to make an interim report and hand the task over to sistpoty, I think (he doesn't know about that yet, though ;)
<persia> Well, he does now :)
 * StevenK was just about to say that
<Hobbsee> i'm still thinking on what stuff i'd like to prioritise.
<Hobbsee> i'll have to respond to it tomorrow
<siretart> he's not around, I need to call him on the phone this afternoon
<persia> siretart: I'll get it to soonish then.
<siretart> persia: Hobbsee: thanks!
<persia> s/it to/to it/
<Hobbsee> siretart: poke me if i haven't done it in 24h ?
<StevenK> Hobbsee: You may not have 24h :-)
<Hobbsee> i don't expect to need it.  i'm just not about to do it at uni
<BUGabundo_work> good morning!
<siretart> Hobbsee: ok
<Hobbsee> heck, i can't even sign into LP here.
<TomJaeger> I have a question about the process of getting a package into intrepid:  Should I, in addition to posting the package on REVU, also file a launchpad bug report (or maybe have someone file it for me)?
<huats> morning everyone
<TomJaeger> so should I file a bug report or not?
<BUGabundo_work> TomJaeger: from what I've read on ML, yes you should
<BUGabundo_work> and assign it to the person or team in charge of that package
<TomJaeger> okay, thanks.
<stefanlsd> warp10: u around?
<persia> TomJaeger: You'll want to assign yourself if you are packaging it for REVU.
<warp10> stefanlsd: here!
<persia> BUGabundo_work: Generally, you shouldn't assign anyone else a bug unless you know for certain they want it assigned to them.
<TomJaeger> okay, I'll assign it to myself
<stefanlsd> warp10: aah cool. i just wanted to ask about the watch file i did for mp3wrap and the submission to debian. you posted that - 'Just noticed you didn't add the tag to autoclose the bug in debian/changelog.'  Just wanna understand how i should of done it so i can make sure i do it properly next time...
<warp10> stefanlsd: It's easy: in debian/changelog if you add something like (LP: #XXXXXX), where XXXXXX is the bug number, the bug is autoclosed when the package is uploaded into archives
<stefanlsd> warp10: oh ok. didnt realise that. So i should of put the bug itself in the changelog with the LP: # i was closing by the submission.   makes sense. thanks.
<warp10> stefanlsd: exactely. You can put the tag wherever you want. Usually it is at the end of the line explaining the change you made that fixes that bug, and you can even add more than one, in case the changelog closes several bugs.
<TomJaeger> done ( https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/254893 )
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 254893 in ubuntu "[needs-packaging] easystroke 0.2.1" [Undecided,New]
<james_w> who would like to make dholbach a very happy man? http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=python-wadllib http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=python-launchpadlib
<persia> james_w: Perhaps not using "edge" in the homepage?  Anyway, my python packaging isn't good enough for a proper review.
<james_w> persia: ah, thanks
<persia> Also seems a bit odd to demand debhelper 7, and use a debhelper 5 style rules file.
<RAOF> dh $@ ftw :)
<persia> Well, unless one wants to support backports, in which case debian/compat of 7 is a bit agressive.
<RAOF> Right.
<RAOF> What, you mean we support releases older than Intrepid? :)
<persia> Given the specific libraries, and my personal opinions as to the reasons for the packaging, supporting backporting seems a reasonable goal.
<RAOF> Yes, certainly.
 * wgrant expects it will need to be SRUed heavily.
<persia> wgrant: SRUed?  Why?
<persia> I'd think SRUing ports of all the rdepends would be a bit of a stretch from the no-new-features-in-SRU guidelines.
<wgrant> persia: Better than breaking every time LP feels like it needs to change something.
<persia> wgrant: I guess.  Are we certain that this isn't going to change as often?
<RAOF> james_w: You appear to have set Vcs-Bzr to a branch only you will have commit access to.  This seems anti-social :)
<wgrant> persia: It is labeled beta.
<persia> s/seems/is/
<james_w> RAOF: it's bzr, you can have commit access to your own branch :-)
<persia> wgrant: Depends on the definition of "beta" then.
<persia> james_w: Yes, but packaging can't be coordinated safely with the variance.
<RAOF> james_w: Given you've listed me as a maintainer, I'd hope to have write access to the cannonical trunk :)
<wgrant> persia: It has 'beta' in the REST URLs it uses, IIRC.
<james_w> RAOF: if I do that then I don't get commit access
<james_w> persia: I'm not sure I understand
<persia> james_w: Well, you could put it somewhere to which both of you have access.
<persia> james_w: OK.  I branch your packaging branch.  I change it.  I upload.  RAOF wants to make changes.  From where does he pull?
<wgrant> Or put it somewhere where the people with upload rights have access and can merge from unprivileged branches, which makes a whole lot more sense.
<persia> Does each person changing need to mangle the Vcs-* headers?
<RAOF> I'm not sure that's a problem, though.  MOTU will be maintaining it, motu should definitely have commit access, and I don't think !motu should have commit access.
<wgrant> RAOF: Right.
<persia> Well, I can see the case for allowing certain !motu commit access to certain packages, but generally that makes sense.
<RAOF> Right.  Until we have a debian-maintainer style permission system, I think keeping commit rights equivalent to upload rights is not unreasonable.
<wgrant> persia: Why shouldn't package branches have the same permissions as the package itself?
<wgrant> RAOF: We do.
<wgrant> RAOF: It is only used for one package, AFAIK.
<RAOF> Oh, wow?  Which one?
<persia> wgrant: Well, it's not always done that way in Debian.  I suppose part of that might be differences in workflow between SVN and BZR.
<wgrant> dkms
<RAOF> And why aren't we using this more?
<wgrant> RAOF: Soyuz only got it recently.
<persia> RAOF: Because it requires TB approval for each case, and manual adjustment by LP admins.
<wgrant> RAOF: And I don't think its use has been authorised by the RB.
<wgrant> *TB
<persia> Once the UI gets cleaner, we ought be using it more.
<wgrant> And there's no UI for it, right.
<RAOF> Ah.  So it's not finished enough to really use.  Check.
<persia> Nice thing about the implementation is that it's inclusive: rather than being that some person can upload, it's that some person can *also* upload.
<huats> hello persia
<huats> how are you ?
<huats> TheMuso: are you around ?
<persia> huats: OK.  It's less hot here because of the storm.
<Koon> persia/wgrant: what would be the process james_w should follow ? Change Vcs-Bzr before submitting it to REVU ? At that point he still needs to commit changes...
<huats> hum...
<huats> you are lucky :)
<huats> it is way too hot in here...
<persia> Koon: There's no good model that has been established to permit accurate Vcs-* in REVU packages by non-MOTU.
<RAOF> I'd suggest setting Vcs-Bzr to the value it should be once the package is in the archives.  The uploader should also push the corresponding bzr branch.
<persia> RAOF: But will the uploader?  It may be that that doesn't happen.
<RAOF> Man, wouldn't NoMoreSourcePackages be useful here...
<Koon> RAOF: I would suggest setting it to the developer branch, and if the uploader thinks about it, change it when he pushes the branch somewhere else
<persia> Koon: But that makes "Maintainer" inaccurate by default.
<persia> Mind you, in most cases, Vcs-* is inaccurate and potentially harmful in Ubuntu anyway, so perhaps it doesn't matter much.
<dholbach> nxvl: http://daniel.holba.ch/blog/?p=146
<dholbach> nxvl: excellent work! :)
<persia> RAOF: NoMoreSourcePackages wouldn't necessarily solve this: while there might be a facility to preserve history (or possibly not, depending on how the uploader uploaded), james_w would still not be able to commit to the branch that contained correct information, and someone would need to manually adjust things.
<Koon> persia: with RAOF suggestion it's Vcs-Bzr which is inaccurate by default :) it's kind of chicken-and-egg anyway. the only way to be accurate is to remove it (accurate by omission)
<persia> Koon: Precisely.  If later the maintainer wishes to use a VCS, it can be added.
<james_w> persia: but the sponsor would be using bzr, whereas that's not guaranteed now
<persia> james_w: That's not guaranteed with NoMoreSourcePackages either, or at least from the last rumours I heard.
<persia> Something about supporting the dput use case?
<wgrant> Doesn't that violate the basic principle of NMSP?
<james_w> persia: if there are NoMoreSourcePackages then you can't dput anything
<wgrant> dput is going away soon for other reasons, anyway.
<persia> james_w: Ah.  I heard talk about having an autocommit of changes on dput
<persia> wgrant: What reasons would those be?
<wgrant> persia: Well, at least for PPAs SFTP will apparently be supported. It will allow things like removing .changes replay vulnerabilities, and allowing upload-time feedback on whether an upload failed or not.
<james_w> persia: yes, but that's not NMSP. NMSP is somewhere that we might go, but it's not the starting point. Initially there will be the autocommit  on dput
<persia> wgrant: No reason dput can't do sftp.
<wgrant> persia: True.
<persia> james_w: See, if that gets enabled, disabling it becomes interesting.
<james_w> persia: yep
<persia> On the other hand, if that doesn't get enabled, bootstrapping problems ensure.
<persia> s/ensure/ensue/
<persia> As a result, I imagine dput support (possibly over sftp) would remain for a while.
<persia> Although, I suspect people are more careful with GPG keys than SSH keys, so think that's not a positive step, entirely.
<wgrant> The .changes replay hole needs to be fixed.
<persia> That is one of many issues.
<persia> Personally, I think the "target distribution" is the way to solve that: use e.g. "intrepid-persia" for my PPA.
<persia> That way it fails if I push it somewhere else.
<wgrant> Indeed, that would make sense.
<wgrant> And stop people from shooting themselves in the foot, too.
<persia> That also conveniently breaks pocket-copies from PPA to archive, which I suspect are inherently unsafe for other reasons.
<persia> (e.g. unexpected dependencies, etc.)
<wgrant> Particularly with the lack of ogre-model
<persia> Well, that, and the ability to depend on other PPAs which may or may not have wholly new packages.
<persia> (which is external to the control of the PPA concerned)
<devfil> Adri2000: ping
<Adri2000> devfil: pong
<joaopinto> Hello
<devfil> Adri2000: I've reply at the bug for the merge of amsn, can you take a look at it?
<joaopinto> could some review http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=amoebax ? Thanks
<Adri2000> devfil: yep
<Adri2000> devfil: I don't think amsn should depend on both tk8.5 and tk8.4
<Adri2000> and upstream confirmed me it should work just fine with tk8.5
<Adri2000> fix for kde4 thing: ok
<Adri2000> makefile patch: if you choose to drop that ubuntu change, you should mention it in the changelog
<Adri2000> I agree that this change isn't really useful, it just sounds more logicial to do that way. but if we want to reduce the delta with debian, let's drop it
<Adri2000> devfil: got my comments?
<devfil> Adri2000, no
<persia> Unless the change still accomplishes something useful (fixes a bug), it's better to reduce delta.  If a bug exists without the change, let's keep the delta.
<Adri2000> persia: the change is just about moving some clean commands from debian/rules to the upstream Makefile (where they really should be)
<Adri2000> devfil: I'll put them in the bug report
<persia> Adri2000: Yeah, I don't think it's worth keeping that.  The commands are still in diff.gz
<devfil> Adri2000, why we should continue to make hard the next merges? the makefile problem seems to be only an esthetical choice
<devfil> we should drop useless changes like this
<Adri2000> devfil: yes, that's what I was saying, see the bug report
<Adri2000> you should just mention that you dropped the change in the changelog
<Adri2000> and anyway the patch is going upstream (I just told them about it)
<devfil> Adri2000: done
<Adri2000> devfil: you don't mention in the changelog the ubuntu changes you are dropping
<devfil> Adri2000: is it a
<devfil> "must"?
<Adri2000> I don't know, at least I think it's better
<Adri2000> also, how is the debian/amsn.desktop removal a useful change to keep?
<devfil> Adri2000: when you use grab-merge.sh to do a merge and you have a conflict and the best solution is from debian you mention that you have choice debian solution?
<StevenK> devfil: I would just mention that the Ubuntu change is dropped in the changelog.
<StevenK> devfil: Rationale isn't needed so much
<devfil> Adri2000: It isn't installed, but also messenger.xpm is useless, maybe the best solution is to report this to debian and for now to don't drop them
<Laney> Afternoon all. Anyone up for a review of http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=goocanvasmm ? :>
<Adri2000> devfil: I think so yes
<Adri2000> devfil: how is bug #249534 fixed by your merge?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 249534 in amsn "Using amsn 0.97 from ubuntu repository it ask me to download a TLS module, but then it doesn't work testing Intrepid 64-bit  (no problem using version 0.97.1 compiled)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/249534
<devfil> Adri2000: the new version fixes the problem
<devfil> it is a problem of the new windows servers
<Adri2000> no
<Adri2000> the bug is about a tls module
<Adri2000> not about not being able to connect
<Adri2000> the not being able to connect is bug #243722
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 243722 in amsn "Amsn 0.97 doesn't work testing intrepid 64-bit. There is no way to connect to it. But server works correctly using pidgin and others.." [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/243722
<Adri2000> which is indeed fixed in amsn >= 0.97.1
<devfil> Adri2000: the tls problem is fixed in the new version, I'm sure about this, but if you don't I can ask the user to try the new version and then to mark the bug as fixed
<Adri2000> devfil: can you reproduce the tls bug with the current 0.97 package?
<devfil> Adri2000: let me try
<devfil> Adri2000: not needed to test, it is already tested in the 0ubuntu6 package (thanks to DktrKranz)
<devfil> s/tested/fixed/
<sistpoty|work> hi folks
<geser> Hi sistpoty|work
<sistpoty|work> hi geser
<Adri2000> devfil: if you're sure that upload fixes this bug, then close it manually explaining why it is fixed, but do not close it in your unrelated merge
<Adri2000> hi sistpoty|work :)
<sistpoty|work> hi Adri2000
<devfil> Adri2000: done
<Adri2000> devfil: also I'd suggest adding a new line in the changelog saying the new upstream release fixes the connection bug (LP: #243722), because with the current "merge .. (LP: #...)" it seems to me these are all merge bugs
<devfil> Adri2000: next time, can you please explain me all the changes before? so I don't need to do a lot of debdiff, thanks
<Adri2000> devfil: wait until I tell you it's ok to upload your debdiff, but I think it's good to do such live reviews :)
<devfil> Adri2000: done, there are other changes that
<devfil> I should do?
<bddebian> Heya gang
<Adri2000> devfil: have you listed the dropped ubuntu changes?
<Adri2000> bddebian: heya bddebian !
<persia> bddebian: Hey.  NBS needs *you* :)
<devfil> Adri2000: yes
<Adri2000> devfil: cool, let me do a final check and I think we are done
<sistpoty|work> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Heya Adri2000, persia, sistpoty|work
<bddebian> persia: NBS?
<persia> bddebian: http://people.ubuntu.com/~ubuntu-archive/NBS/ : I'm just remembering some of your package upload marathons, and thought I could tempt you: if you've forgotten, no worries.
<nxvl> dholbach: \o/
<nxvl> dholbach: awesome
<dholbach> :-)
<Adri2000> devfil: please upload, that should ok
<devfil> Adri2000: ehm... what?
<Adri2000> s/upload/attach your debdiff to the bug/
<devfil> Adri2000: done
<devfil> I've already uploaded it
<Adri2000> thanks
<bddebian> Ah NBS as in Not Build from Source?
<bddebian> built even
<persia> bddebian: Yep.
 * persia hunts the wiki
<persia> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/NBS seems to be a reasonable summary.
<Adri2000> devfil: FYI I'm updating the package to 0.97.2, so there will be your merge and the new upstream release in the same upload
<Kopfgeldjaeger> How can I remove a folder in debian/myapp when using cdbs [so that it's not in the binary package]?
<devfil> Adri2000: so why you don't have done the merge?
<joaopinto> Kopfgeldjaeger, I believe you can use the install/package:: rule
<Kopfgeldjaeger> ok, thank you
<joaopinto> I am not just sure wether it's called before or after the CDBS dh_install, but I believe it's before
<bddebian> persia: I'll see what I can do
<slytherin> Kopfgeldjaeger: do not include it in debian/myapp.install file.
<persia> bddebian: It's up to you: if you're busy with other stuff, that's well understandable.
<Kopfgeldjaeger> slytherin: i don't do that anyway
<Adri2000> devfil: I could. but you had already put a debdiff in LP, and we try to not duplicate efforts. so I review what you've done and use it.
<slytherin> Kopfgeldjaeger: then I think the folder won't end up ni .deb
<persia> Kopfgeldjaeger: https://perso.duckcorp.org/duck/cdbs-doc/cdbs-doc.xhtml#id2480675 is likely what you seek.
<Kopfgeldjaeger> it works, thank you
<bddebian> persia: You know me, I don't do anything :)
<persia> bddebian: Which is precisely why I thought you'd like NBS: it's uploading things without actually changing them: the very definition of not doing anything :)
<bddebian> heh
<Adri2000> devfil: there is a duplicated patch
<devfil> Adri2000: ?
<Adri2000> debian/patches/04_settingoff_autoupdate.dpatch
<Adri2000> debian/patches/05-disable_newVersionCheck.dpatch
<Adri2000> the first one was added by the debian maintainer
<Adri2000> it seems he sometimes forgets to add things to the changelog
<Adri2000> so I agree it's not easy for us...
<devfil> Adri2000: are you sure that they are the same?
<Adri2000> err no you're right
<Adri2000> ok, forget what I said :)
<devfil> Adri2000: I'm not a stupid, maybe I can be wrong but I usually do a testbuild for each debdiff ;)
<persia> devfil: Mistakes are not about intelligence: they are just a result of being human :)  In this case, it's not yours, but next time it might be...
<sistpoty|work> geser: you're uploading crack :P
<slytherin> geser: FYI ... I am already working on libjboss-cache1-java FTBFS. So don't put your time on fixing it.
<geser> slytherin: it still FTBFS? I didn't have time to look at it
<slytherin> geser: yes, due to aop classes. We need to bypass then. But there is another problem. The jar file in resultant .deb has no class files.
<slytherin> geser: forget the second part. It was my mistake.
<persia> slytherin: It failed again after the rebuild?
<slytherin> persia: yes
<persia> :(
<kirkland> I uploaded a package (musica) to REVU, but I don't see it on http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/index.py
<kirkland> the upload looks to have succeeded
<kirkland> and trying to upload again yields "already uploaded"
<james_w> kirkland: the "already uploaded" is a dput safety mechanism, you can override it if you need to
<james_w> kirkland: did you log in to REVU first?
<kirkland> james_w: i have not.... logging in now....
<james_w> that will import your GPG key from launchpad, which should mean that your upload will be recognised next time
<persia> kirkland: Remember to delete your .upload file locally.
<james_w> if you already had an account then I believe you can merge them
<kirkland> james_w: i have uploaded to revu before
<kirkland> james_w: this one seems to be misbehaving
<LucidFox> If the upstream software is GPL, can the packaging be BSD?
<persia> kirkland: There was recently a change in keyring management that reset the keyring.
<persia> LucidFox: Yes, but that's a bit odd.  The resulting package is GPL.  Be cautious of the advertising clause.
<kirkland> okay, i deleted my upload file, and dput to revu again
<kirkland> and I logged in
<persia> And now wait 5 minutes :)
<LucidFox> the packager specifically said revised, so no advertising clause
<tuxmaniac> dholbach: pm?
<dholbach> tuxmaniac: sure
<persia> kirkland: Your package is there?
<kirkland> persia: yep, just showed up ;-)
<persia> Excellent :)
<kirkland> persia: see musica
<james_w> http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/revu1-incoming/musica-0808051650/lintian
<james_w> the last one is probably a mistake?
<james_w> it would be great to fix the second.
<kirkland> james_w: i can fix the first 2
<james_w> rockin'
<persia> kirkland: Not the third?
<kirkland> persia: i'm not sure I understand the 3rd warning
<james_w> kirkland: if this isn't meant to be a native package then you didn't have a correctly named .orig.tar.gz in the parent directory while building the source package
<persia> kirkland: Essentially, it couldn't find the orig.tar.gz when you built the source pacakge.
<james_w> if it is meant to be native there should be no "-" in the version number
<james_w> the .tar.gz has to be precisely named: musica_0.1.orig.tar.gz
<Kopfgeldjaeger> If I don't want a (AUTHORS)-file to be included in my binary package [I do not include it anywhere myself, but cdbs does], should I just remove it in install/myapp:: ?
<slytherin> geser: persia: The build failure for libjboss-cache1-java is a mess. I feel like chasing a car at 100mph on a bicycle. :-(
<geser> slytherin: how got the DD then got it build?
<slytherin> geser: That is a question I keep asking to myself again and again. :-)
<slytherin> geser: probably they didn't and they will realize the mess once there is a rebuild for those packages
<slytherin> geser: I will try updating that package to latest upstream version sometime this weekend. Let's what happens.
<LucidFox> lol :)
<LucidFox> avidemux (1:2.4.3-0.0) unstable; urgency=low
<LucidFox>   * New upstream release.
<LucidFox>   * Move to cmake (I still hate cmake).
<Kopfgeldjaeger> How many characters per line are 'allowed' in a man page?
<sebner> Kopfgeldjaeger: as usual 80 I suppose
<Kopfgeldjaeger> OK. Thanks.
<sistpoty|work> Kopfgeldjaeger: man pages wrap automatically, so there isn't really a strong limit to 80 chars
<sebner> huhu sistpoty|work btw ^^
<sistpoty|work> hi sebner
<Kopfgeldjaeger> so I should just write a long text passage in one line (if it doesn't have, say, 10k chars)?
<Kopfgeldjaeger> 'long' does mean <150 chars for my purposes
<sistpoty|work> Kopfgeldjaeger: sure, whatever suits you
<sistpoty|work> Kopfgeldjaeger: personally, I don't exceed 80 chars anywhere, but that's because I know that I can get 3 vsplits with 80 chars each on my desktop :)
<slytherin> geser: Now that libpdfbox-java is fixed, IIRC jabref is a sync now and not a merge.
<nxvl> Adri2000: i don;t understand your amsn versioning
<nxvl> Adri2000: why did you have ~debian0 instead of just -0?
 * sistpoty|work heads home... cya
<Adri2000> nxvl: it's not ~debian0 it's ~debian-0
<Adri2000> as saif in the changelog, I kept the versioning scheme used in debian
<Adri2000> said*
<Adri2000> that is, adding ~debian to the upstream part
<Adri2000> I guess the debian maintainer does that because the upstream tarball is changed
<nxvl> sounds fair
<nxvl> Adri2000: thank you for clarification :D
<Adri2000> np
<Adri2000> do I need an ack from the sru team to upload to -proposed?
<nxvl> i think you can upload to proposed, and then you need and ACK to move it tu -updates
<Adri2000> I don't see any ack needed in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates, but https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ArchiveAdministration#head-1f27dc12ab1558ec21b31ac44e4c86a87a4cd053 says that archive admins should "#
<Adri2000> #
<Adri2000> Only process an upload if the SRU team approved the update in the bug report trail.
<Adri2000> "
<Adri2000> (bad wiki copy/paste)
<geser> Adri2000: you need an ack to get the package accepted into -proposed
<geser> I guess the archive admins will reject an upload without an ACK
<Adri2000> geser: ok, that's not very clear from the wiki page
<geser> Adri2000: at least that's the way I do SRUs
<huats> norsetto: my old friend !!
<norsetto> huats: old ?
<huats> friend for a long time :)
<norsetto> huats: my young and slim friend :-)!!
<huats> LOL
<huats> slim ?
<huats> ;)
<huats> not yet
<norsetto> huats: hmmm, Geraldine parents hit again?
<huats> nope
<huats> but a WE in amsterdam :)
<norsetto> huats: ahhh, that will definetively help your diet!
<sebner> norsetto: because of the snow? ^^
<norsetto> sebner: snow? Is that an Austrian name for, hmmm, spacecake?
<sebner> norsetto: I thought everybody understands :P
<emgent> norsetto: o/
<k0p> DktrKranz, are you there?
<norsetto> emgent: o/
<sebner> emgent: \o/
<emgent> sebner: hey hey hey
 * NCommander is sad
<NCommander> my laptop died, and now I'm stuck in a win32 world
<norsetto> NCommander: think that you could be stuck in a win64 world
<Treenaks> or a macworld
<NCommander> norsetto: I'm debating creating Ubuntu for win32 ...
 * NCommander is not kidding either
<Treenaks> NCommander: you mean wubi?
<NCommander> No
<NCommander> I mean native dpkg/apt/etc.
<Treenaks> NCommander: eek
<NCommander> ;-)
<NCommander> there was some work extended Debian in this direction
 * norsetto doesn't think he would like a wubuntu
<NCommander> how about a Darubuntu?
<NCommander> (Ubuntu userland on Darwin/OSX)
<norsetto> NCommander: dubuntu (sic) is probably more appropriate
 * NCommander admits a passing interest in working in that
<NCommander> The trick is building Darwin x86/powerpc from source
<emgent> i know emerde.
<emgent> and fink
<azeem_> emerde?
<NCommander> well, Darwin is already based around a packaging building system, and GNOME and KDE already ahve upstream patches
<azeem_> sounds french
<NCommander> Might be an interesting project to work on
<emgent> nah sounds italian :)
<NCommander> Install wmaker, and you have the closest to a opensource OPENSTEP your going to get
<emgent> http://emerde.freaknet.org/
 * NCommander misses NeXTstep
<norsetto> emgent: never ask a finnish how they say "Look at the sea"
<NCommander> emgent: interested in Darwin-based Ubuntu? ;-)
<NCommander> (and if your still interested in a wmaker based Ubuntu emgent there is an easy way to do it)
<emgent> NCommander: lol :)
<emgent> s/NCommander/norsetto/
<emgent> i'm back in 10 min.
<NCommander> emgent: I thought about it, and the easiest way would simply create the wmaker-desktop meta-package with the necessary branding :-P
<DktrKranz> k0p, yes
<k0p> DktrKranz, we release stable. and i'm uploading the umit with corrections. after I do that can you take a look?
<DktrKranz> k0p, sure :)
<k0p> DktrKranz, uploading :)
<DktrKranz> k0p, once REVU shows it, link new url
<k0p> DktrKranz, sure ;)
 * NCommander seriously needs to get his laptop fixed
<NCommander> Maybe I can use wubi in the mean time on my old XP machine
<NCommander> I'm just concerned about performance
<DktrKranz> NCommander, is being stuck in win32 a critical issue?
<DktrKranz> ;)
<k0p> DktrKranz, I don't know why but REVU doesn't show yet recenly upload.
<NCommander> DktrKranz: it's a Critical bug ;-)
 * NCommander realizes he's also locked out of REVU's server
<NCommander> *****
<DktrKranz> NCommander, any delays in REVU upload management? (see above)
<k0p> delays? hmm
<k0p> I have a message at last of upload:  "Not running dinstall" What it means?
<DktrKranz> don't worry about it, it's common
<k0p> hmm ok
<k0p> almost 30 minutes, weird..
<NCommander> DktrKranz: dinstall is only run on scp/sftp uploads, right?
<DktrKranz> AFAIK, no
<k0p> DktrKranz, revu doesn't show nothing yet. can be a delay or upload again?
<DktrKranz> dunno... a REVU admin might know better than me
<k0p> I know one but he is away msg sleeping..
<DktrKranz> sleeping is useless
<sebner> sleeping is overrated :P
<DktrKranz> sebner, easy to tell when you just had holidays :)
<sebner> DktrKranz: well, not "real" holidays. culturedays :P
<Lutin> geser: have you reported the limits.h issue to babel's upstream (asking to avoid reporting it twice)
<fabrice_sp> k0p: I had this issue yesterday, and I had to 'migrate' my previous account revu to Launchpad OpenID, before uploading again
<k0p> fabrice_sp, hmm
<k0p> lauchpad?
<fabrice_sp> On the top of REVU webpage, I have "Log in with Launchpad OpenID ", when previously I had a REVU id. After login in, I had to click on "Merge REVU accounts" to migrate old REVU account to OpenID, and been able to upload
<k0p> oh yeah
<k0p> let me try
<k0p> fabrice_sp, I think you have reason.
<k0p> I don't know about it.
<k0p> some changes on revu. very nice now
<fabrice_sp> yep: just discovered that yesterday ï»¿:-D
<k0p> thanks !
<fabrice_sp> you're welcome ;-)
<k0p> DktrKranz, http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=umit
<geser> Lutin: no, feel free to report it upstream
<k0p> DktrKranz, can you review, please? :)
<Lutin> geser: ok. do you mind if I merge it ?
<DktrKranz> k0p, downloading
<k0p> :)
<medo> how can I package a tcl/tk software?
<medo> sorry for the naive question
<medo> it is the first package i'm doing
<TomJaeger> Could someone review http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=easystroke ? Thank you.
<kdub> i want to maybe patch packages, or package things for intrepid, is there a site where packages like that are listed?
<fabrice_sp> Just look for [needs-packaging] in LP
<kdub> fabrice_sp: what is the 'merges' link in the topic about?
<slytherin> geser: can you please confirm and ack bug 251973
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 251973 in libjaxp1.2-java "Please remove the package from repositories" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/251973
<stefanlsd> if im looking at a merge - how do i determine what to keep from the ubuntu stuff.   or, how do I determine if the ubuntu change is still relevant...
<fabrice_sp> kdub: 'merges' indicate that the package exists in debian, and a merge is requested (that is update ubuntu version with debian version)
<kdub> oh... i have a lot of questions about where i should help out. really, i think ill just send an email over the ubuntu-motu mailing list
<slytherin> stefanlsd: read debian changelog ans see if any of the ubuntu changes have been merged in Debian version. This is first step. For others you may need to have deeper knowledge.
<slytherin> !contribute | kdub
<ubottu> kdub: To contribute and help out with Ubuntu, see http://www.ubuntu.com/community/participate
<fabrice_sp> kdub: you can begin there: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/GettingStarted
<k0p> DktrKranz, are you seeing?
<TomJaeger> I still don't understand the process, how exactly do I get someone to review my package?
<DktrKranz> k0p, yes, almost done
<k0p> ok :)
<k0p> say something when finish :)
<stefanlsd> slytherin: would they say they merge a change from ubuntu... or do we always need to check?
<stefanlsd> slytherin: im guessing i'd take the two diff files.gz files between the two version and compare them?
<slytherin> stefanlsd: you have to check. Changelog may not be always explicit. Also sometimes the some problem is fixed in Debian in adifferent way than Ubuntu. you have to evaluate which is better/suitable.
<medo> I'm trying to package a software written in tcl/tk but there is no make file or install. what should I do?
<medo> I tried looking into the packaging guide but couldn't find any thing usefull for me
<slytherin> TomJaeger: by uploading it on revu
<norsetto> Kopfgeldjaeger: you shouldn't take out newlines of course, just be carefull when you insert one that there is no blank space left
<Kopfgeldjaeger> ah you
<Kopfgeldjaeger> mean
<Kopfgeldjaeger> foo bar \n
<Kopfgeldjaeger> bar
<Kopfgeldjaeger> ?
<Kopfgeldjaeger> the space at the end of the line?
<TomJaeger> slytherin, I've done that.  Also filed a bug report (LP: #254893)
<kdub> fabrice_sp and slytherin, i appreciate the links, but i'm really just looking more to find out what people interested in becoming motu's do: package new things, or help out with repackaging and merging existing packages
<slytherin> TomJaeger: Did you check if anyone has added any comment on revu for your package?
<TomJaeger> slytherin, no comments there
<slytherin> kdub: everyone has their own preference.
<kdub> right, ive tried packaging from scratch, and would like to try repackaging things to fix bugs/get upgrades, but dont know what needs repackaging to see what its like
<medo> I want to try packaging from scratch. I found one on LP bug#238612. but I can't get debuild to build the package?
<medo_> I am trying to package coccinella 0.96 from scratch, it debends on a number of other packages when I run debuild it says unmet dependicies
<medo_> how can I solve this problem
<medo_> ??
<medo_> thanks in advance
<DktrKranz> k0p, commented
<k0p> DktrKranz, ok
<k0p> DktrKranz, let me check
<DktrKranz> k0p, they should be easily fixed, other than them, packaging looks good
<k0p> DktrKranz, first it is.
<k0p> but twice..
<k0p> sourceforge is crazy :S
<DktrKranz> heh
<k0p> second I don't have ideia how to fix it .. hmm
<k0p> DktrKranz, how I should refer PSF licence?
<Adri2000> DktrKranz: you're motu-sru aren't you? :)
<DktrKranz> Adri2000, yep
<DktrKranz> k0p, you should paste it in debian/copyright
<k0p> DktrKranz, File utils/msgfmt.py is under PSF LICENCE v2. Only this on copyright?
<k0p> hmm
<k0p> paste and add this lines right?
<slytherin> ahmed: post the error somewhere.
<Adri2000> DktrKranz: I think I need you for bug #243722
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 243722 in amsn "amsn 0.97: login doesn't work anymore due to a protocol change" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/243722
<DktrKranz> k0p, I'd put full license, or a link where it can be found
<k0p> ok ;)
<DktrKranz> Adri2000, ACKed, thanks.
<ahmed> slytherin: this is the output i get from debuild
<ahmed> dpkg-checkbuilddeps: Unmet build dependencies: libtls (>= 1.4)
<ahmed> debuild: fatal error at line 993:
<ahmed> You do not appear to have all build dependencies properly met, aborting.
<ahmed> (Use -d flag to override.)
<ahmed> If you have the pbuilder package installed you can run
<ahmed> /usr/lib/pbuilder/pbuilder-satisfydepends as root to install the
<ahmed> required packages, or you can do it manually using dpkg or apt using
<ahmed> the error messages just above this message.
<slytherin> ahmed: please don't flood the channel. use pastebin
<ahmed> sorry what is that? I am really new to all of this
<Adri2000> DktrKranz: thank you. now /me goes to find an archive admin :p
<slytherin> !paste | ahmed
<ubottu> ahmed: pastebin is a service to post multiple-lined texts so you don't flood the channel. The Ubuntu pastebin is at http://paste.ubuntu.com (make sure you give us the URL for your paste - see also the channel topic)
<slytherin> ahmed: you said you are packaging from scratch. Exactly what steps have you followed till now?
<DktrKranz> Adri2000, FYI, pitti manages SRUs every day. Probably it will be accepted before tomorrow's noon
<ahmed> i ran dh_make
<ahmed> to get the debian directory
<Adri2000> DktrKranz: ok, asked anyway in -devel, otherwise will wait until tomorrow
<ahmed> then I checked the control file to add the deps.
<ahmed> then I thought I should and check wether i would be able to build or no but ended up with the error
<slytherin> ahmed: you need to install the packages which need to build your app. Check 'Build-Depends' in control file and install all those packages.
<DktrKranz> k0p, http://sf.net/umit/umit-(0|1)\.([0-9])\.([0-9])\.tar\.gz
<DktrKranz> ugly, but it seems functional
<ahmed> ok I thought the debuild actually do that. i guess i was mistaken
<ahmed> thanks a lot for your help
<k0p> DktrKranz, is functional?
<k0p> but you comment this...
 * norsetto hugs RainCT
<slytherin> k0p: why so long url? Use the example form wiki.
<k0p> slytherin, some trouble that I don't understand in sourceforge.
<k0p> really.
<k0p> I try push umit-6.04
<k0p> I delete all on sourceforge .. nothing about it.
<Flannel> DktrKranz: http://sf.net/umit/umit-[01](\.\d){2}\.tar\.gz
<k0p> but it push this version.. I don't understand..
<Kopfgeldjaeger> norsetto: cdbs automatically includes README and AUTHORS - should I manually remove them?
<norsetto> Kopfgeldjaeger: there should be an option to tell cdbs what docs to install
<DktrKranz> Flannel, nice try, but it's not correct, upstream has some tarballs which conflicts with good one
<Flannel> DktrKranz: That's equivalent to yours, at least.
<DktrKranz> it says "Newest version on remote site is .5, local version is 0.9.5"
<k0p> yeah
<slytherin> Kopfgeldjaeger: check id you have file named debian/docs.
<Kopfgeldjaeger> slytherin: i had one, but already removed it
<slytherin> Kopfgeldjaeger: keep the file and modify it to include/exclude the files you want
<k0p> DktrKranz, it's a little weird .. where he found 0..5'
<k0p> is it about regular expression?
<Kopfgeldjaeger> slytherin: exclude? can i exclude a file in the docs-file or should I just not include the files I don't want there?
<DktrKranz> k0p, btw, the slightly modified version I gave you seems OK, it's really ugly, but it does the job
<slytherin> Kopfgeldjaeger: not include fiels you don't want
<k0p> really? let me try
<DktrKranz> if somebody has a better one, please fire it :)
<tbielawa> RainCT, you got a minute to comment on a revu upload?
<Kopfgeldjaeger> slytherin: cdbs still includes the files. -- dh_installdocs -pgtkhash ./README ./NEWS ./TODO ./AUTHORS
<k0p> DktrKranz, I'll try find better. give a second :D
<norsetto> Kopfgeldjaeger: if you look at /usr/share/cdbs/1/rules/debhelper.mk there is DEB_INSTALL_DOCS_<package> which should do what you need
<Kopfgeldjaeger> super, thanks
<DktrKranz> k0p, sure... just upload if you discover some, and I'll have a look
<k0p> ok
<k0p> DktrKranz, forget.. when i put \. inside ()
<k0p> it dies.
<k0p> :/
<NCommander> ugh
<slytherin> Kopfgeldjaeger: Someone will have to take a look at the package. and I am tired. :-(
<NCommander> I've hit a new low
<NCommander> I'm programming in COBOL
<RainCT> tbielawa: Hey, I just arrived home. For a fast comment yes :)
<Kopfgeldjaeger> slytherin: norsetto already solved the problem :o]
<k0p> DktrKranz, uploading.
<k0p> but this it's very strange..
<k0p> * doesn't work :/
 * NCommander plays with his COBOL compiler
<k0p> DktrKranz, check it: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=umit
<tbielawa> RainCT, http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?upid=3182
<tbielawa> that comment offer is open to anyone who can give me comments &/ advocates ;)
<DktrKranz> k0p, advocated.
<Kopfgeldjaeger> norsetto: Well, I have set DEB_INSTALL_DOCS_{myapp,ALL} to foo [for testing purposes], but the files are still included: dh_installdocs -pmyapp ./README ./NEWS ./TODO ./AUTHORS foo
<fabrice_sp> tbielawa: just be sure that the lintian file is clean. You can also run lintian on the generated deb package, to check everything
<k0p> DktrKranz, weeeeee :D thanks
<norsetto> Kopfgeldjaeger: thats cdbs for you ;-) Dunno, try using -X, or check out what kind of distorted logic is being employed in that makefile I gave you
<k0p> DktrKranz, I need 2 or 3 advocates? :)
<DktrKranz> k0p, just 2
<DktrKranz> one more, then :)
<k0p> :)
<Laney> Someone in motu-sru: Are upstream bugfix-only release candidates for SRU?
<tbielawa> oh my. that's a new lintian error to me! Didn't even notice
<k0p> ok
<k0p> DktrKranz, very thanks for your attencion. :)
<DktrKranz> Laney, it depends, if new upstream is just a bugfix and you can isolate test cases to see if bugs are really fixed, they can go in
<norsetto> Kopfgeldjaeger: I avoid cdbs like pest for this very reason, it tends to do things its own way, and to bend it to my way it takes me far longer than to actually just use debhelper alone.
<DktrKranz> k0p, np ;)
<Laney> DktrKranz: Ah right, that's good then.
<k0p> DktrKranz, so right now, what I need to do is find another person to review right?
<DktrKranz> Laney, if upstream is *huge*, there are more issues... but if code change is low, it can be approved easily
<DktrKranz> k0p, exactly
<k0p> :)
 * norsetto also notes that debhelper 7 seems way better than cdbs in this respect
<k0p> RainCT, hi :P
 * Laney needs to look into dh 7 at some point
<fabrice_sp> How can I get Bug 242572 (https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/wxsvg/+bug/242572) approved? I pasted the orig.tar.gz and the diff.gz file.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 242572 in wxsvg "Upgrade wxsvg package to b11" [Wishlist,In progress]
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 242572 in wxsvg "Upgrade wxsvg package to b11" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/242572
<Laney> fabrice_sp: Someone will get round to sponsoring it in time
<fabrice_sp> So, I only have to be patient? :-)
<Laney> Yep. We're all in the same boat here!
<Kopfgeldjaeger> norsetto: looks like my value is just appended to the standard-cdbs-var, even if I use =. -- http://rafb.net/p/pdbtBn47.html <- if i comment out this line in debhelper.mk, it works like expected. Maybe I should just leave README and AUTHORS where they are, as cdbs really wants to have them... although there's not much information in them
<norsetto> Kopfgeldjaeger: I disagree, we should not let cdbs rule our policy
<slayton> I'm trying to debug an error i'm getting when Installing a python module that I've packed into a deb here is a paste bin of the error: http://pastebin.com/m4756c1b0
<Kopfgeldjaeger> OK.
<slayton> I can't figure out what the error means as the error message isn't very descriptive
<slytherin> fabrice_sp: when asking for upgrade you don't have to attach .orig.tar.gz. Only diff.gz. Of course it is expected that if for any reason if one can not use upstream tarball as it then you should provide get-orig-source target in debian/rules file.
<fabrice_sp> slytherin:ok. In this case, it is the upstream tarball, so I shouldn't have attached it. thanks ;-)
<cyberix> Could someone take a look at my package http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=pyliblo
<cyberix> It seems to work
<norsetto> Kopfgeldjaeger: do you use DEB_INSTALL_DOCS before or after the include?
<Kopfgeldjaeger> damn
<cyberix> This is the first time I create a source package that creates two different binary packages
 * Kopfgeldjaeger <- idiot
<cyberix> so there might be some error related to that
<cyberix> also I'm not sure I fully understand the way stuff should be divided between different sections in rules
<cyberix> There might be some error in dependencies also
<Kopfgeldjaeger> norsetto: that solved the problem... of courser
<Kopfgeldjaeger> -r
<cyberix> it works in my installation
<norsetto> Kopfgeldjaeger: :-)
<cyberix> but not sure, if the build dependencies are correct
<cyberix> also I'm not sure I understand the automatic generation of python and shlib dependencies
<k0p> norsetto, can you take a look on my package? :)
<norsetto> k0p: you don't really want me to do that ;-)
<cyberix> There are atleast two projects using the pyliblo (that I'm aware of). I'd like to get it into Intrepid and then some application that uses it into intrepid+1
<cyberix> but that depends on the upstreams
<k0p> norsetto, well. why do you say that? lol
<cyberix> so getting the library in early would allow the upstreams to try using their software with the packaged version
<norsetto> k0p: url?
<k0p> http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=umit
 * k0p afraid .. 
<k0p> :)
<norsetto> k0p: I profoundly dislike having two desktop files, one for root and another not ...
<joaopinto> can someone review and advocate http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=amoebax ? Thanks
<norsetto> k0p: beside, you use su-to-root but I don't see a depends on menu?
<k0p> norsetto, hmm
<k0p> norsetto, we're working next release solve the roots issues.
<k0p> norsetto, about the su-ro-root on menu. How to do that?
<norsetto> k0p: I say, lets wait for it then ;-)
<norsetto> k0p: you have to add it as a Depends
<joaopinto> norsetto, I would appreciate your review again since most changes were based on your initial review :P
<k0p> sure.
<k0p> norsetto, but without change the adminstrator mode we can't enter in ubuntu? :s
<norsetto> joaopinto: thats correct, thats way its good if somebody else looks at it with fresh eyes
<norsetto> s/way/why ....
<norsetto> k0p: extra blank line at the end of debian/control
<joaopinto> well, at the current review rate I guess a lot of those packages will get hold on UVF :P
<k0p> norsetto, fixed.
<joaopinto> norsetto, btw, where did you get those lintian warnings from ? I have ran lintian from intrepid and didn't got those..
<norsetto> joaopinto: from lintian :-) Did you run it on the binary packages?
<joaopinto> ah, no, just on the source
<norsetto> k0p: lots of blank spaces where you inserted \n in control
<norsetto> k0p: why python twice as a depends?
<k0p> it's about sqlite
<norsetto> k0p: can you elaborate?
<k0p> norsetto, yeap. python<=2.4 works with different sqlite
<k0p> and it's another package
<norsetto> k0p: so this package only works with 2.5?
<k0p> after it, python integrate sqlite and have changes on packages
<k0p> no
<k0p> works with both
<k0p> but if it is a condicional
<k0p> python2.4 have differents dependences of python>=2.5
<norsetto> k0p: suppose I have python2.4 (and python), will installing python-pysqlite2 make the package work for me?
<k0p> y
<norsetto> k0p: viceversa, if I have python2.5 and python, I don't need it, correct?
<k0p> it's not viceversa. but yes. you don't need.
<k0p> norsetto, about menu, depends is it a field?
<norsetto> k0p: the Depends: in debian/control
<k0p> oh
<k0p> you talking about it.
<k0p> yes!.. of course
<k0p> norsetto, depends of gksu right?
<norsetto> k0p: menu
<k0p> norsetto, what about menu?
<norsetto> k0p: the menu package
<k0p> ok
<sebner> gn8 folks
<k0p> norsetto, done.
<k0p> anymore norsetto?
<norsetto> k0p: Files inside higwidgets/ are under LGPLv2 should be Files inside higwidgets/ are under LGPLv2.1
<norsetto> k0p: you should use the copyright symbol instead of (C)
<k0p> norsetto, symbol of copyright...
<norsetto> k0p: Martin v. Loewis <loewis@informatik.hu-berlin.de> should be quoted as an author
<k0p> norsetto, where?
<k0p> oh it's wrong.
<norsetto> k0p: in debian/copyright, he is an author in utils/msgfmt.py
<k0p> ok
<norsetto> k0p: you should also add a copyright for the package
<k0p> in upstream authors?
<k0p> norsetto, where?
<norsetto> k0p: do you actually need debian/dirs?
<norsetto> k0p: in debian/copyright
<k0p> i'm in the top
<k0p> norsetto, where I add author of Martin v. Loewis? in upstream authors?
<norsetto> k0p: yes
<k0p> and me too?
<k0p> norsetto, added
<k0p> norsetto, and copyright symbols replaced.
<norsetto> k0p: what about dirs? do you really need it?
<k0p> may be not let me check
<RainCT> hi k0p
<k0p> norsetto, don't need. removed.
<k0p> RainCT, norsetto is review my package now. :) I'm run agains deadline.
<Laney> Hmm, while we're in a reviewing mood - I have http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=goocanvasmm on REVU. Last plug for a few days, I promise :)
<k0p> 28 august is limit date right?
<norsetto> k0p: ok, don't forget the package copyright
<k0p> norsetto, about symbol?
<k0p> ops
<norsetto> k0p: no, your copyright for the packaging
<k0p> ok
<norsetto> k0p: how should I know if I have to use umit as root or not?
<RainCT> tbielawa:
<tbielawa> RainCT, yes?
<k0p> norsetto, hmm well umit show
<k0p> if you try a scan that need permission
<k0p> it's like wireshark..
<norsetto> k0p: right, wouldn't be better to write something down in the description and README.Debian too?
<RainCT> tbielawa: bah I didn't want to type enter :P. Anyway, I'm looking at your package now; I was away before (shower and dinner)
<k0p> norsetto, about permissions?
<k0p> I think it's not needed.
<k0p> because user will know if it need root access.
<norsetto> k0p: I do, I just installed it and I have no clue why I have two entries in my menu and which one I should use
<norsetto> k0p: btw, I just used umit and it didn't start, typing umit in terminal gives me nothing
<k0p> norsetto, what?
<k0p> but runs by menu?
<norsetto> k0p: ditto starting as root or with sudo umit in terminal
<norsetto> k0p: nope
<k0p> norsetto, why not? installed /usr/bin?
<norsetto> k0p: yes, but does nothing
<k0p> $ umit
<k0p> $
<k0p> something like that?
<norsetto> k0p: yes
<k0p> unbeliveble..
<k0p> let me check
<k0p> norsetto, no idea.
<norsetto> k0p: me neither :-)
<k0p> what do you have on
<k0p> /usr/bin/umit
<norsetto> k0p: what do you want to know?
<k0p> norsetto, run python /usr/bin/umit
<norsetto> k0p: this is the md5 088d2bad7411ee0e087c44707f4be873
<k0p> it's the same
<k0p> run the python /usr/bin/umit
<k0p> to see whats happen
<norsetto> k0p: I can run it in all flavours and sauces, still does nothing
<norsetto> k0p: which isn't that bad, at least its not crashing ...
<k0p> you're seeing ironic.
<k0p> it doesn't run.
<k0p> norsetto, so.. does not run..well..
<k0p> norsetto, all dependencies are satisted?
<norsetto> k0p: all the given ones
<RainCT> tbielawa: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?upid=3182 - most comments are just minor stuff, but there is some copyright information missing and the package FTBFS for me (with dpkg-buildpackage and all build dependencies satisfied)
<k0p> norsetto, i'll test in a intrepid of a friend.
<norsetto> k0p: ok, I have tested it both in intrepid and hardy
<k0p> norsetto, and doesn't work in both?
<norsetto> k0p: thats interesting, it does in intrepid now
<k0p> in hardy works fine too.
<norsetto> k0p: not for me
<k0p> not only me test the package..
<Kopfgeldjaeger> norsetto: got my message?
<norsetto> Kopfgeldjaeger: email?
<Kopfgeldjaeger> no, in this channel (router crashed...)
<Kopfgeldjaeger> <Kopfgeldjaeger> norsetto: I uploaded a new gtkhash version to revu.
<norsetto> Kopfgeldjaeger: ok
<emgent> community council meeting.
<k0p> norsetto, I add all
<k0p> features on copyright that you request
<tbielawa> RainCT, thanks for the notes.
<k0p> norsetto, what do you do to it run on intrepid?
<norsetto> k0p: just called the binary
<k0p> but you say that he doesn't run.
<k0p> and after you say that run.
<k0p> norsetto, btw it's not to hardy. it's to intrepid.
<norsetto> k0p: I know, yet I would like to understand why, remember that we could backport it
<k0p> backport? to hardy?
<k0p> norsetto, I would like to reproduce your bug.
<k0p> But really.. I don't have idea
<norsetto> k0p: its a standard up-to-date hardy install, package compiled with an hardy pbuilder
<norsetto> k0p: not that it matters, I also tried the intrepid package since there is nothing specific and behaves the same
<k0p> the same what? doesn't run?
<k0p> norsetto, hmm
<k0p> norsetto, can you see if /usr/bin/umit line 38 it's False?
<norsetto> k0p: I can help with debugging, but I know nothing about python, if you think there are breakpoints I can add just tell me (but not now, I'm just too tired)
<k0p> norsetto, no worries. just say about line 38 :)
<k0p> and python version too :)
<norsetto> k0p: I removed the whole thing, what was it, the one about DEVELOPMENT something?
<k0p> y
<norsetto> k0p: yes, it was false
<k0p> ok
<k0p> and you python version?
<norsetto> k0p: both 2.4 and 2.5 and python points to 2.5
<k0p> ok
<k0p> should be works
<k0p> norsetto, after run umit just echo $?
<k0p> please
<norsetto> k0p: 1
 * norsetto goes to bed
<k0p> cya norsetto and thnks
<k0p> RainCT, can you test my package? i'm trying to see one issue
<k0p> DktrKranz, are you there?
<k0p> DktrKranz, I lost advocate. I upload new package with minor fixes like remove spaces etc.
<k0p> DktrKranz, is it normal?
#ubuntu-motu 2008-08-06
<Syntux> can we use non-english characters in URLs, description or name in debian/control ?
<DktrKranz> k0p, yes. advocates are resetted when pushing a new upload.
<k0p> DktrKranz, xiii
<k0p> DktrKranz, I don't know about that.
<k0p> DktrKranz, so I need to talk with norsetto again. After that can you put the advocate again? sorry
<DktrKranz> sure
<DktrKranz> ping me when ready
<k0p> DktrKranz, ok.
<k0p> another question. do you test in intrepid right?
<DktrKranz> i built in intrepid, yes
<k0p> yeap.
<k0p> And I test in hardy.
<k0p> it works fine. But not with norsetto.
<k0p> I don't discover what's happen
<DktrKranz> k0p, I haven't tested it properly, just sure it installs and removes cleanly, are there issues with program itself?
<k0p> well ... I don't know.
<k0p> norsetto tell me that in hardy
<k0p> nothing appears after run umit
<k0p> DktrKranz, do you run umit?
<DktrKranz> just a sec, I'll install it
<k0p> ok :)
<DktrKranz> done
<DktrKranz> launched
<k0p> yeap
<DktrKranz> now launched with sudo to avoid warning message
<k0p> DktrKranz, lot of people runs it in hardy and intrepid.
<DktrKranz> me too
<k0p> noones reports errors
<DktrKranz> I did a couple of scans, no issues here
<k0p> yeah
<k0p> the only issue with norsetto was lauching
<DktrKranz> launched from menus now
<DktrKranz> it works.
<k0p> yeap works.
<DktrKranz> ha! missing su-to-root
<DktrKranz> this needs fixing
<k0p> DktrKranz, how I do that?
<DktrKranz> I don't remember which is the common behaviour... let's see
<DktrKranz> in GNOME, gksu is common
<k0p> yeap.
<k0p> but people tells to put su-to-root.
<DktrKranz> IIRC, that's not the good one, though
<DktrKranz> if you want to use su-to-root, you have to add menu in Depends field
<k0p> I do it.
<DktrKranz> ah... I got older version ;)
<DktrKranz> k0p, it's quite late here, I think it's good to talk with norsetto to see issues he faced in Hardy
<DktrKranz> and I'm moving to bed too :)
<k0p> DktrKranz, ok.
<k0p> i'll do the same
<k0p> DktrKranz, thanks. I'll talk to advocate when it's ready ;)
<k0p> good night ;)
<k0p> thanks
<k0p> someone could review my package? I already have a ack. http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=umit
<NCommander> hola folks
<Hobbsee> heya!
<NCommander> hey Hobbsee
 * NCommander just got a new part for his laptop to fix it
<Hobbsee> \o/
<RAOF> Woot
 * NCommander double clicks RAOF randomly
<eck> where is the debian standards located? e.g. if i wanted to actually read whatever the Standards-Version: 3.8.0 is, where would I look?
<crimsun> debian-policy
<eck> thanks
<crimsun> sorry, that's the package name
<crimsun> http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/  is the URL
<RAOF>  Oh.  It seems that upstream has put Xgl out of its misery.
<RAOF> So now we get to work out whether _we_ want to remove it from Intrepid.
<ogra> how did they do it ? did they finish it off finally ?
<RAOF> git rm xgl/*
<ogra> yay
<RAOF> Well, kinda.
<RAOF> There's a group of users who'll no longer be able to get Compiz if we drop Xgl.
<ogra> unless nvidia reacts on their mails ;)
<RAOF> And adds features to a driver that's been superceded by _three_ newer drivers?
<RAOF> Colour me skeptical.
<ogra> well, xgl broke tons and tons of ltsp setups ... and caused us major headdaces in the support channel ...
<RAOF> Oh, yeah.  Xgl was _crap_ and full of unfixed bugs.
<ogra> if admins thought they are cool and installed xgl ... and suddenly 200 VIA based thin clients dont work anymore
<RAOF> I implemented a blacklist to prevent that from happening.  It didn't work?
<ogra> (the admins indeed worked on the server directly with the nvidia onboard card :P )
<RAOF> Oh.  Craziness.
<ogra> not if your display is remote
<RAOF> Right.
<ogra> ltsp uses ssh -x user@server /etc/X11/Xsession
<ogra> so if xgl starts as part of the session ... boom ...
<ogra> your X is already up on the client before thats run
<RAOF> Urgh.
<ogra> and finding out that the admin simply didnt tell you he had xgl installed ... after a week of debugging ... well ...
<ogra> :)
<crimsun> TheMuso: norsetto's fixes have been in my branch since early june...
<crimsun> TheMuso: (for pulseaudio)
<ogra> crimsun, while i got you here, do you see any reason to keep libflashsupport in intrepid with flash 10 ?
<TheMuso> crimsun: Ahj right, sorry I forgot about your branch.
<ogra> i'd like to drop it asap
<crimsun> ogra: I see no reason
<ogra> great :)
<RAOF> ogra: Was that re: Xgl?
<ogra> RAOF, nope thats was just a question to the master of sounds :)
<RAOF> Right.
<ember> is something wrong with revu? i kinda uploaded a new package a while ago and it's not showing
<ember> hmm i was sending to the old .de . anyone willing to review http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=hamster-applet
<ffm|sh> what buildsystem should I use (I'm a deb newbie, and I'm making a new package, a _very_ small one)
<TomJaeger> =In order to get a package into the archive, is it really a requirement that each source file contain that useless copyright junk?
<crimsun> TomJaeger: not a hard requirement, no.  Of course, not following it means that you make the reviewers' and archive admins' lives more difficult.  And when you make their lives difficult, you make it less probable they'll accept it.
<crimsun> TomJaeger: and no, that "useless copyright junk" is NOT "useless..junk".
<TomJaeger> well, I don't really see an advantage over a single LICENSE file, but okay.  It'd just be a major pita for me to include it right now, rather than with the next upstream release.
<crimsun> TomJaeger: whatever works for you, as long is it's easy for the archive admins to tick off.
<crimsun> as long as*
<crimsun> ("tick off" == verify appropriate licences)
<TomJaeger> okay, I'll add a comment to the REVU page
<foxbuntu> any one what to do when you need to divert a file when its already being diverted by another package?
<TomJaeger> Btw, for the ISC license, would one reproduce the whole license in each header or would the "Permission to use..." part be enough?
<crimsun> see what the bind9 source does.
<TomJaeger> thanks, already checking
<TomJaeger> They reproduce the whole license, so I'm going to do the same
<crimsun> you'll never go wrong reproducing the entire licence(s)
<TomJaeger> but I don't need to add a license to a glade file, right?
<NCommander> yay, my laptop works again
<TomJaeger> god, this is such a waste of time.  Now all my files contain the text "ISC DISCLAIMS ALL WARRANTIES".
<NCommander> TomJaeger:?
<TomJaeger> copied the license from the bind source because they already had the correct * formatting.  However, I'm not ISC and now I have to replace all occurrences of ISC with THE AUTHOR.
<ion_> A sed oneliner.
<TomJaeger> if you don't care that lines be less than 80 characters long
<ion_> A quick vim macro, then.
<Hobbsee> RAOF: in your gnome-do development, do you think it'd be possible to get the standard 'open' for a text document to open in something other than less?
<TomJaeger> why does that every-source-file-must-have-a-license-header rule not apply to the debian/ directory?
<TomJaeger> Anyway, could someone please have a look at my package: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=easystroke
<RAOF> Hobbsee: You should fix xdg-open; that's what we use.
<Hobbsee> RAOF: yes, but i could voluntell you to fix it..
<RAOF> Right.  xdg-open is just plain stuffed.
<RAOF> Ah.  The GNOME detection has been b0rked by new gnome-session.
<RAOF> Hobbsee: You've got a kubuntu desktop handy, right?
<Hobbsee> RAOF: er, no?
<Hobbsee> actually, i might have a really old edgy version...
<RAOF> Am I crazy?
<Hobbsee> no?
<RAOF> I was sure you did kubuntu stuff.
<Hobbsee> i used to
<Hobbsee> i haven't run kubuntu since hardy.
<RAOF> Ah.  I'm merely out of date.
<Hobbsee> i switched over a copule of days before hardy release
 * Hobbsee has been slowly stepping out of kubuntu stuff
<RAOF> Ok.  So: to anyone with a kubuntu desktop - does your environment contain DESKTOP_SESSION=kde?
<crimsun> TomJaeger: again, it's not a rule but a recommendation.
<dholbach> good morning
<crimsun> 'morning
<TomJaeger> crimsun, well anyway, I've added the license boilerplate now.
<dholbach> hiya crimsun
<TomJaeger> (the diff's 36k now)
<RAOF> TomJaeger: You can't actually add license information for upstream.
<TomJaeger> I am upstream
<crimsun> (unless he's upstream)
<RAOF> Aha :)
<TomJaeger> So does anyone want to review it?  I've already looked through a few other submissions in order to anticipate common problems:  I removed commented lines, added a man page, improved the .desktop file and added license information to the source files, so hopefully this will be rather painless.
<fabrice_sp> TomJaeger: if you are upstream, why not updating the orig file? This way, in the ubuntu diff file, we would only have the 'debian' directory stuff
<TomJaeger> Is that really such a big deal?  I'd rather not modify files I've already released.
<fabrice_sp> By the way, could someone review my mountmanage packaging? It's at http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=mountmanager. Thanks.
<persia>  TomJaeger: For licensing, it's a big deal.  For nearly everything else, less so, especially if you commit the patches to your trunk for inclusion in the next release.
<fabrice_sp> TomJaeger: the rule is not to modify anything outside debian directory inside a diff file. In the worst case, you should include patches in you debian directory to modify sources, but as it's about licensing, I think that nobody will ack that package...
<persia> Remember that the orig.tar.gz must be independently redistributable.
<ion_> I uploaded http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=compcache-setup which should have fixed the problems pointed out in the previous review. Anyone up for reviewing?
<TomJaeger> persia, why would the orig.tar.gz not be independently redistributable?
<TomJaeger> fabrice_sp, so you're telling me that there must not be any synergy effects if the packager and the upstream maintainer are the same person?
<persia> TomJaeger: From backscroll, I thought you were patching licensing in the diff.gz.  That is usually not ideal, because if the licensing needs patching for redistribution, the unpatched orig.tar.gz would then not be redistributable.
<persia> fabrice_sp: There's no rule about that.  There's no good reason *not* to modify things outside debian/ as long as the differences are well tracked.
<ion_> Indeed
<persia> Personally, I find that anyone who does this without a well-kept VCS is exceedingly annoying, but that's just me.
<ion_> Such as in VCS commits
<TomJaeger> persia, my current diff is not under revision control because I've made some changes in the development tree that preclude patches from applying to the released version.
<TomJaeger> I actually created a patch by hand and then applied it to the packaging tree
<ion_> tomjaeger: Thatâs what branches are for.
<fabrice_sp> persia: that's what I've been told by apachelogger: for mountmanager package (sponsored by apachelogger), I spend a lot of time using quilt, to patch correctly the configure file (and some sources)
<persia> TomJaeger: If you're diverging, I'd suggest either branches or debian/patches
 * persia develops a strong distaste for pam_mount
<persia> (or maybe just sbuild remounting /home 10 times during a build)
<TomJaeger> ion_, darcs has trouble moving patches between branches when things are diverging, plus it's not like adding that license junk is in any way non-trivial.
<TomJaeger> and why on earth would I spend half an hour or more to figure out how debian's patch system works?
<persia> TomJaeger: So that if you later get distracted and someone else takes over maintenance, they don't need to spend several hours with you detangling the applied patches.
<persia> Of course, if you're sure that won't happen until you're more in sync, it doesn't matter so much.
<TomJaeger> all the patches are in the next version anyway, so that's a non-issue
<persia> Well, uupdate will still show patch conflicts, but there are ways around that.
<fabrice_sp> TomJaeger: why not just updating the easystroke-0.2.1.tar.gz file in sourceforge with the license changes? Maybe, it's a non sense, but it would be easier, as the changes are already in the next version.
<TomJaeger> fabrice_sp, that is out of the question.  What I could do is release a new version just for this purpose, but I won't do that unless it's absolutely necessary
<persia> TomJaeger: You could ask an archive-admin (on #ubuntu-devel), but historically, packages that patch licensing in diff.gz have been rejected.
<TomJaeger> persia, okay, thanks, so I'll have to do it.
<persia> TomJaeger: I suspect as much, unfortunately.  You can try without it, but I don't know that it will work.
<TomJaeger> I'm not going to take any chances.  I'm sick of all the bureaucracy already.
<persia> Yeah.  licensing is a lot of fuss :(
<TomJaeger> I'm not actually changing licensing, though.  I'm just adding redundancy.
<persia> TomJaeger: Yeah, well, unfortunately despite the efforts of many, copyright law isn't the same everywhere.  I live in one of the few places where the Berne Convention was adopted into law directly rather than laws being changed to match, and even that doesn't seem to work well for most people.
<TomJaeger> What's going on here? easystroke: remote site does not even have current version
<persia> TomJaeger: What is the output of uscan --report-status ?
<TomJaeger> Newest version on remote site is 0.2.1, local version is 0.2.1.1
<TomJaeger> easystroke: remote site does not even have current version
<persia> OK.  What is first line of debian/changelog ?
<TomJaeger> easystroke (0.2.1.1-0ubuntu1) intrepid; urgency=low
<persia> OK.  Why 0.2.1.1 rather than 0.2.1 ?
<TomJaeger> Because I don't change files once they're released.  That's shady.
<persia> Essentially, either you need 0.2.1.1 on the remote site, or you need to just list 0.2.1 for the packaging.
<TomJaeger> I just uploaded 0.2.1.1
<persia> Yeah, that is shady.  Maybe release 0.2.1.1 on the main site, with a note that it's just licensing changes?
<TomJaeger> http://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php?group_id=229797
<persia> Oh, so it is there?  What is the match line in debian/watch?
<TomJaeger> http://sf.net/easystroke/easystroke-(.*)\.tar\.gz
<TomJaeger> maybe it takes some time to be available on the server?
<persia> Might just be an issue with the debian sourceforge mirror management system used by the watch file.
<TomJaeger> okay, that was it, it worked now
<persia> Could take a bit to update.  Oh good :)
<TomJaeger> Okay, the package should appear on REVU in just a few minutes
<TomJaeger> okay, it's up now and my pbuilder^H^H^H^H PPA was able to build it.
<TomJaeger> (Ended up having to change a file outside of debian/ anyway: The man page was still mentioned version 0.2.1)
<persia> TomJaeger: Correcting a manpage is the sort of change to diff.gz that is considered good maintenance, rather than being risky.  Thanks for your flexibility.
<\sh> moins
<Laney> howdy
<geser> Hi \sh
 * persia is a little disturbed to read the REVU statistics, and encourages more people to comment on packages: there shouldn't be such concentration in the top 10.
<emgent> moin
<nxvl> hi all
<nxvl> back in home again!
<ion_> Hola
<emgent> hi nxvl
<nxvl> hi!
<huats> hi nxvl
<huats> !
<nxvl> huats: hi!
<laga> darn, even more people leaving motu-sru :(
<DktrKranz> laga, yep :(
<laga> DktrKranz: if you have a minute: what's still missing from bug #241402? i wrote that email to the MOTU mailing list.. do we need martin's ACK for the translations to be tested in hardy-proposed?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 241402 in mythbuntu/8.10 "Mythbuntu control center VNC setup freezes if & in password" [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/241402
<laga> hum, let me check if my mail went through
<laga> no, it didn't go through. resending..
<laga> it would probably help if i didn't reply to ubuntu-motu-bounces@..
<DktrKranz> laga, pitti replied back. he's happy with update translations in universe SRUs (since he manages langpacks updates for main), so your debdiff should be ok. Do you have some mythbuntu guy to sponsor package in -proposed?
<laga> yes, i saw his reply. i was just referring to his "assuming they're tested" bit.
<laga> yes, i have a sponsor
<laga> i just need the ACK ;)
<DktrKranz> laga, good... I'll review it soon, then. thanks :)
<laga> thank you
<DktrKranz> are there some mechanism to test translations?
<laga> setting $LANG accordingly and making sure the app doesn't crash? ;) seriosly though, i guess we'll have to find people who speak these (new) languages and hae them try it.. although that could be a painful process
<DktrKranz> if Italian is one of these new languages, you've found a tester :)
<laga> we do have an italian translation, not sure if it's new ;)
<laga> i believe people need to be in a special team to be able to translate apps - so there should be some quality control regarding applicants.
<DktrKranz> if they follow italian translation team rules, I trust them a lot
<DktrKranz> laga, I see Intrepid tasks are not marked as Fix Released, is it fixed now?
<laga> umm. i've committed all fixes, but not all of them are in intrepid yet
<Syntux> can we use non-english characters in URLs, description or name in debian/control ?
<DktrKranz> plans to release for intrepid soon?
<laga> DktrKranz: we can do that if it's needed by the SRU policy. on the other hand, i'm currently rewriting mythbuntu-control-centre and that's what I planned to have uploaded next to intrepid
<DktrKranz> laga, it's recommended to have intrepid tasks fixed, but if you plan to release fixes for intrepid before the release and keep track of status progress, I think it's safe enough to have a package in -proposed now.
 * DktrKranz goes to lunch
<directhex> i should really try & get an updated merge of mono into intrepid, but given the usual delays on u-m-s, it might only be out in time for 9.04
<DktrKranz> directhex, try asking latest sponsor
<DRebellion> Could somebody take a look at monkeystudio (http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=monkeystudio)? It's already had two advocations, but it was rejected by the archive admins for embedding libraries that were already available in the repos. That's fixed now, so it should be okay.
<DktrKranz> laga, ACKed.
<laga> thanks
<k0p> hi all
<k0p> DktrKranz, are you there?
<k0p> I test my package in hardy x86, 64bits and works fine.
<k0p> I can't reproduce norsetto error :/
<sistpoty|work> hi folks
<k0p> hi sistpoty|work
<sistpoty|work> hi k0p
<k0p> someone could review my package? http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=umit I already have a ack but I need another.
<jmehdi> I've uploaded a new package for Webstrict (http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=webstrict) but I don't see it... can someone help me?
<DRebellion> jmehdi, it takes five or so minutes to show up.
<jmehdi> i've uploaded it several days ago... :(
<jmehdi> is the version number taken into account?
<DRebellion> jmehdi, did you login to revu using your launchpad account first?
<DRebellion> you need to do that to get your keys synced to the new system
<jmehdi> I don't think I did that
<jmehdi> ok, I'll login, then should I have to upload it again ?
<DRebellion> jmehdi, i don't know if you need to upload again. You should ask NCommander or RainCT. After logging in, you probably want to merge your old revu account with your launchpad one using the link at the top.
<jmehdi> drebellion: ok I've merged my accounts
<DktrKranz> k0p, I'm here now
<sistpoty|work> jmehdi: I only see binary uploads of webstrect in the rejected queue, so please reupload (a source package)
<Lutin> \sh: would you mind looking at the emacs21 merge ? the debdiff seeems to contain more than what's actually listed as retained changes
<\sh> lucas: emacs21 or xemacs21?
<jmehdi> sistpoty: I've uploaded that: "Uploading to revu (via ftp to revu.tauware.de):
<jmehdi>   webstrict_1.0-0ubuntu1.dsc: done.
<jmehdi>   webstrict_1.0.orig.tar.gz: done.
<jmehdi>   webstrict_1.0-0ubuntu1.diff.gz: done.
<jmehdi>   webstrict_1.0-0ubuntu1_all.deb: done.
<jmehdi>   webstrict_1.0-0ubuntu1_i386.changes: done.
<jmehdi> Successfully uploaded packages." is it ok?
<sistpoty|work> jmehdi: nope, that's a binary upload
<soren> jmehdi: No. You should only dput *_source.changes.
<sistpoty|work> jmehdi: the _i386 from the changes file
<k0p> DktrKranz, I test my package on hardy with amd64 and x86. It is systems clean. No bugs there.
<sistpoty|work> jmehdi: please build your package/changes file with parameter -S (for source upload) and -sa (to include the orig.tar.gz) as parameters to dpkg-buildpackage/debuild
<\sh> Lutin: do you have somehow the link to the merge report?
<DktrKranz> k0p, I tested it on Intrepid, it seems good too
<DktrKranz> I'll have another review now
<DktrKranz> mh... no, not really now... later today
<k0p> DktrKranz, ok :)
<\sh> argl..it's my own merge ,->
<jmehdi> sistpoty: thanks, I've uploaded it again
<sistpoty|work> np
<sistpoty|work> jmehdi: now it's a native package (is your .orig.tar.gz named correctly?
<sistpoty|work> +)
<k0p> DktrKranz, but I think the possible error on norsetto in hardy doesn't prohibits umit enter on intrepid. is it true?
<DktrKranz> k0p, it can be fixed later, if it will show up
<jmehdi> sistpoty: arf... is it because I changed the version? (I have a webstrict_1.0.orig.tar.gz and webstrict_1.0.0-0ubuntu1... files)
<sistpoty|work> jmehdi: yep, looks like it. would be webstrict_1.0.0.orig.tar.gz then
<sistpoty|work> jmehdi: but the good new is that the package should be on revu now :)
<jmehdi> sistpoty: yep :)
<\sh> Lutin: you can sync it...
<\sh> Lutin: the only change was the libungif4-dev to libgif-dev change, which can go now, since we have this transitional package
<jmehdi> sistpoty: ok, new package with 1.0 version, so it is clean...
<\sh> Lutin: anyways..fileing sync req
<\sh> Lutin: bug #255302
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 255302 in emacs21 "Please sync emacs21 21.4a+1-5.5 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)." [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/255302
<jmehdi> thanks sistpoty, all is fine ; now if someone could review my new package (http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=webstrict) :)
 * ScottK thought we packaged emacs separately from Debian, but maybe that's just 22.
<james_w> wireshark has a pretty bad rules file
<ember> can someone have a look at http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=hamster-applet
<Jazzva> Anyone willing to review sphinxbase and pocketsphinx in REVU :)? It has already been reviewed by RainCT, so current uploads correct what RainCT suggested. Thanks :). The links are <http://revu.ubuntuwire.org/details.py?package=sphinxbase> and <http://revu.ubuntuwire.org/details.py?package=pocketsphinx>
<BUGabundo_work1> tseliot: hi
<tseliot> BUGabundo_work1: hi
<BUGabundo_work1> did the nvidia change from yesterday
<BUGabundo_work1> got any regression reports?
<BUGabundo_work1> I just rebooted and can't seem to use my nvidia card
<BUGabundo_work1> actually I can't even open jokey to select the driver
<tseliot> BUGabundo_work1: yes, a new driver was uploaded
<BUGabundo_work1> can this be the cause why I'm at 800x600 ?
<tseliot> what does this command say? sudo aptitude show nvidia-glx-173 | grep Version
<tseliot> and of course I will also need your  /var/log/Xorg.0.log and xorg.conf
<BUGabundo> tseliot: Version: 173.14.12-0ubuntu2
<BUGabundo> I'll upload to pastebin
<BUGabundo_work1> everything is "slugish"
<BUGabundo_work1> the mouse is moving really slowly
<BUGabundo_work1> metacity looks awfull
<\sh> emgent: ping moin merge 1.7.1-1 from debian
<sistpoty|work> kdub: just found a binary upload to revu (tv-grab) from you in the rejected queue... I'm removing it. please upload only source packages, thanks
<sistpoty|work> tv-grab-dvd even
<tseliot> BUGabundo_work1: oh, and make sure that the linux-headers for your kernel are installed
<BUGabundo> http://paste.ubuntu.com/34760/
<BUGabundo> tseliot: and http://paste.ubuntu.com/34762/
<BUGabundo> looking for headers now
<BUGabundo_work1> tseliot: headers are installed
<tseliot> BUGabundo: add this line to the Device section of your xorg.conf:Driver "nvidia"
<tseliot> BUGabundo: I mean, Driver "nvidia"
<\sh> emgent: I filed a sync req of moin 1.7.1 because it fixes your security issue and some other problems like attachments
<BUGabundo> humm getting DBUS erros while trying to lunch jockye-gtk
<kdub> sistpoty|work: any idea what i did wrong?
<kdub> i thought i did only upload source
<sistpoty|work> kdub: well, only my standard line for this: when building a package, please use -S (to create a source package) and -sa (to include the .orig.tar.gz) as parameters for dpkg-buildpackage/debuild
<tseliot> BUGabundo: you're using the "nv" driver. As regards Jockey you might want to contact pitti in #ubuntu-devel or (even better) file a bugreport against jockey
<BUGabundo_work1> yeah
<BUGabundo_work1> something with the lastest updates mess the system again
<kdub> sistpoty|work: so using the -S flag will only make source then?
<sistpoty|work> kdub: exactly
<kdub> ok, sorry for doing the wrong thing
<BUGabundo_work1> after that I had to run dpkg-recinfigure xserver -phigh just to get 1024
<sistpoty|work> no problem kdub... was just a rm command on revu's server ;)
<BUGabundo_work1> tseliot: so that's why it lost the nvidia driver
<BUGabundo_work1> restarting X
<BUGabundo_work1> tseliot: it fails... it just ask me to configure, because I'm left on a low-graphics mode
<kdub> if i get an error, something like "no appropriate .orig in the parent dir", is that ignorable?
<kdub> when doing debuild -S
<tseliot> BUGabundo_work1: what does this command say? sudo modprobe nvidia
<sistpoty|work> kdub: it usually means that you've got the name of the .orig.tar.gz wrong
<k0p> someone can review my package? DktrKranz have already advocate it. http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=umit
<BUGabundo_work1> tseliot: nothinh
<BUGabundo_work1> tseliot: *nothing
<tseliot> BUGabundo: ok, try to set the driver to "nvidia" then log out, log in and show me your /var/log/Xorg.0.log and /var/log/Xorg.0.log.old
<BUGabundo_work1> tseliot: do I set by hand like I did last time, on xorg.conf?
<tseliot> BUGabundo: yes, by hand
<BUGabundo> tseliot: can is use:;
<BUGabundo> 	Driver		"nvidia"
<BUGabundo> 	Option		"NoLogo"	"True"
<tseliot> BUGabundo: what do you mean?
<BUGabundo_work1> if I can just add those lines to xorg
<tseliot> BUGabundo_work1: yes, you can add them to the Device section
<BUGabundo_work1> ok
<BUGabundo_work1> pastebining the logs
<BUGabundo> tseliot: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/34769/ xorg.0.log
<BUGabundo> tseliot: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/34770/ xorg.0.log.old
<tseliot> BUGabundo: both logs show that the vesa driver is in use. Type: "sudo updatedb && locate nvidia.ko" and show me the output
<BUGabundo_work1> just a sec tseliot
<BUGabundo_work1> pitti may have found another thing
<bddebian> Heya gang
<geser> Hi bddebian
<bddebian> Heya geser
<BUGabundo> tseliot: see private im, please
<sistpoty|work> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Heya sistpoty|work
<jcastro> emgent: I can approve your mailing list today, just ping me when you resubmit it (check your mail) - thanks!
<BUGabundo_work1> tseliot: all fine now
<tseliot> BUGabundo_work1: great
<BUGabundo_work1> now its bug 51054
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 51054 in linux "MS IntelliMouse Optical 1.1A USB stops responding" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/51054
<emgent> \sh: i'm here :)
<emgent> \sh: moin bug opened?
<\sh> http://hg.moinmo.in/moin/1.7/rev/c4cf4327c96e
<\sh> emgent: but after installing the debian package and checking that this patch is in 1.7.1 ... I wonder if I did something wrong or the patch actually doesn't work
<emgent> uhm ok thanks \sh i go to take a look
<\sh> emgent: anyways..I requested a sync..
<emgent> ok nice
<\sh> well, the error is not anymore with uploading but with displaying the stuff
<emgent> \sh: debian fixed the bug that I found ?
<\sh> emgent: upstream fixed the bug in 1.7.1
<\sh> emgent: and debian has now 1.7.1
<emgent> oh ok
<emgent> uhm..
<emgent> Thomas Waldmann had told me that upgrade to version 1.7 was not easy and automatic and that it was necessary to follow the documentation, but I did not detail
<emgent> anyway this night i will try to install debian package in my devbox for see it
<\sh> emgent: it works out of the box from 1.7.0 to 1.7.1...the migration is easy.
<\sh> emgent: even the migration from 1.5.x (hardy) to 1.7.0 was quite easy...
<emgent> \sh: ok
<\sh> uh wow...new zend-framework 1.5.3.
<siretart> sistpoty|work: thanks for taking over! :)
<siretart> sistpoty|work: I've just wrote the email to ubuntu-motu
<sistpoty|work> siretart: no problem
<sistpoty|work> siretart: great
<sistpoty|work> siretart: have a nice holiday ;)
<lukehasnoname> A lot of people are leaving MOTU posts
<Adri2000> DktrKranz or any other sru member: bug #243722 needs ack for gutsy (already got one for hardy)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 243722 in amsn "amsn 0.97: login doesn't work anymore due to a protocol change" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/243722
<DktrKranz> Adri2000, is your patch almost identical to hardy's one, isn't it?
<Adri2000> DktrKranz: it's the same, but applied inline because there is no patch system in this version
<DktrKranz> lukehasnoname, minimum wage, no holidays and bad badges on LP personal page, it's really a pain :)
<DktrKranz> Adri2000, cumulative ACK :)
<DktrKranz> please go ahead
<ScottK> DktrKranz: I really appreciate you carrying the load on motu-sru.  It's a huge help for Universe.
<DktrKranz> ScottK, it's not a problem, I really like SRUs and SRU process
<Adri2000> DktrKranz: thanks
<laga> what - someone likes SRU's? wow ;)
<DktrKranz> laga, sometimes people are crazy, sometimes people are totally crazy, there are cases people like SRUs :)
<ffm|sh> How do I get the rights to upload to universe?
<ffm|sh> I'm working with the maintainer of a package, and a new version is coming out tomorrow.
<ffm|sh> I'm tryng to figure out how to reupload.
<james_w> ffm|sh: for that you can seek sponsorship of the upload
<ffm|sh> james_w: is the magic word to-fetch-a-sponsor "plugh"?
<ffm|sh> :)
<james_w> rights to upload yourself are earned by showing skill and commitment to packaging
<ffm|sh> james_w: Ok, how do I find a sponser?
<james_w> ffm|sh: you prepare the upload, and attach your completed .diff.gz to the bug requesting an upgrade of the package, and then subscribe the "ubuntu-universe-sponsors" team to the bug
<directhex> my subscribing ubuntu-universe-sponsors to a "new version plz" bug with the appropriate files attached to it
<k0p> is frequently people request review on ubuntu-motu mailing list?
<ffm|sh> k0p: hrm?
<ScottK> k0p: Not usually.
<k0p> ok :)
<k0p> thanks.
<k0p> someone can review my package? http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=umit
<DRebellion> jmehdi, i don't know if you need to upload again. You should ask NCommander or RainCT. After logging in, you probably want to merge your old revu account with your launchpad one using the link at the top.
<DRebellion> oops
<DRebellion> :P
<DRebellion> Could somebody take a look at monkeystudio (http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=monkeystudio)? It's already had two advocations, but it was rejected by the archive admins for embedding libraries that were already available in the repos. That's fixed now, so it should be okay.
<ffm|sh> how hard is it to change the maintainer of a package to a team?
<NCommander> ffm|sh, annouce it ont ubuntu-devel, and upload a new revision with the changed Maintainer.
<ffm|sh> NCommander: does that mean that all members of that team have the irght to upload?
<NCommander> ffm|sh, well, anyone can upload any package as long as they're an MOTU or higher
<NCommander> ffm|sh, what are you trying to form a team for?
<DktrKranz> ffm|sh, please note Ubuntu hasn't Maintainer concept (like Debian) and MOTUs and core-devs can upload changes to almost every packages
 * NCommander was going to point that out
<NCommander> Debian allows non-maintainer uploads, but its usually frowned upon, hence why you have teams in Debian.
<ffm|sh> NCommander: ~sugarteam is to be the maintainer of the "sugar-*" package
<NCommander> ffm|sh, is it an Ubuntu specific package, or is it getting maintained in Debian
<ffm|sh> NCommander: Currently there are debian packages and ubuntu packages, they were made by different people, we don't import from each other IIRC
<ScottK> ffm|sh: Why not?  We should leverage Debian's work and contribute enhancements back to them unless there is a very good reason not to.
 * NCommander agrees with ScottK 
<NCommander> Every package I do gets an offer to import my work into Debian
<NCommander> Most people turn me down, but some of my work has got into the Debian GNOME team
<ffm|sh> ScottK: Lack of orginization.
<ScottK> Then I'd say rebase off of Debian first and then see where you are.
<ffm|sh> ScottK: I'd do it myself, but debian doesn't allow pseudononymous contributors AFAICT.
<ScottK> You can send patches to BTS.
<broonie> You certainly couldn't be a direct maintainer but if there's ateam it only needs one person to be able to do uploads
<ScottK> ffm|sh: Let's put it this way...  If I grep'ed out a list of all the sugar packages and then fired up requestsync, how much harm would it cause to the Ubuntu 'sugar' experience?
<ffm|sh> ScottK: we have a new release tomorrow, should our workflow be "wget debian's source, update, build, submit patch to both?"
<ffm|sh> ScottK: I'm not really sure.
<ffm|sh> ScottK: I hjavn't used that application.
<ScottK> ffm|sh: I'd suggest dget Debian's packages and then package for Ubuntu a -0ubuntu1 version based on that.
<ScottK> requestsync is a script to ask for packages to be sync'ed from Debian to Ubuntu.
<ScottK> Where you find differences in the packaging that are needed, file bugs with patches in Debian.
<ffm|sh> ScottK: Is there any docs on how I'd do that?
<ScottK> Do which?
<ffm|sh> ScottK: Here's the question, can I update the ubuntu package and have debian sync with that?
<ScottK> ffm|sh: In theory, but in practice they are upstream.
<ffm|sh> :(
<ScottK> So take their packaging as a basis for your work and then document your changes from it.
<ScottK> Where those changes relate to Ubuntu unique things, that's fine, but where the changes would also benifit Debian, file a bug with a patch.
<ffm|sh> ScottK: OK, so if I sync with latest debian, then a new release comes out (from upstream-of-debian), who do I submit the patch to?
<Lutin> \sh: the gif/ungif thing was actually not the only change when you look at the diff, hence my question
<broonie> ffm|sh: Talk to the Debian maintainer and work with them.
<broonie> ffm|sh: Ideally between the two of you you will be able to get the new version into Debian and then work from there.
<ScottK> ffm|sh: Listen to broonie.
 * sistpoty|work calls it a day and heads home... cya
<ffm|sh> broonie: Ok.
<ffm|sh> ScottK: How can I see the ubuntu-spesific modifications that have been made to a package, so I can see if I'll lose anything in a sync?
<NCommander> ffm|sh, debdiff between the Debian and Ubuntu versions
<ScottK> ffm|sh: Grab both the debian and ubuntu packages and then use debdiff to compare them.
 * ScottK high fives NCommander.
 * NCommander is high fived
<NCommander> Neat
<ffm|sh> ScottK or NCommander The debian version is newer than the ubuntu one. How can I get the older version? (where they have the same version number)
<NCommander> ffm|sh, unless the older one is in etch or lenny, its gone
<NCommander> I think retention on the FTP servers are two weeks, then old packages are purged via dak, and then removed when each mirror rsyncs
<broonie> Try snapshot.debian.net
 * NCommander learns of a new handy debian service
 * ScottK was about to hand ffm|sh http://snapshot.debian.net/ , but broonie got there first ...
<NCommander> ScottK, its amazing how many SRU motus we're loosing -_-;
<NCommander> It's a domino effect
<ScottK> Personally I found the bug volume overwhelming.  LP's U/I and I don't get along and it was just too much for me.
<ffm|sh> Hrm...
<ffm|sh> I see the binaries, but no source at http://snapshot.debian.net/archive/2008/03/11/debian/pool/main/s/sugar/
<NCommander> Maybe its time someone writes a standalone app based off launchpadlib like the GNAT standalone UI
<milosz_> hello, i've got a question regarding creation of Ubuntu packages
<milosz_> i've created and set up the debian/ dir, and now when building a package (it's a libs package) everything is allright, except that the headers and .pc files are not split into the -dev package
<milosz_> i'm at a loss on how to do that and i couldn't find instructions on it
<ffm|sh> broonie or ScottK , any idea wher the source is?
<ScottK> ffm|sh: For what?
<ScottK> Ah.
<ScottK> ffm|sh: Try dget -x http://snapshot.debian.net/archive/2008/03/11/debian/pool/main/s/sugar/sugar_0.79.0-1.dsc
<alex-weej> milosz_: you packaging AudioSource?
<milosz_> alex-weej, yeah
<milosz_> and the dependencies
<milosz_> pywebkit, taglib-gio
<ffm|sh> ScottK: thx
<milosz_> ok i found the .install files, but they are being ignored it seems
<bobbo> can packages in Universe build-depend on Multiverse packages?
<coolbhavi> dad grab merge.sh not working http://pastebin.com/d13024b4a
<coolbhavi> please help
<ffm|sh> ScottK: when  I run requestsync, I am told that my DEBEMAIL isn't defined.
<bobbo> ffm|sh: export DEBEMAIL="youremail@host.com"
<ScottK> ffm|sh: Don't worry so much about running requestsync.  You need to understand the differences in the packaging and see if there are Ubuntu unique things that need to be preserved.
<ffm|sh> ScottK: I've talked with my group, they say there arn't any.
<ScottK> ffm|sh: Also remember to use -s if you run requestsync, since you'll need to be sponsored.
<ffm|sh> ScottK: Don't worry, I will.
<coolbhavi> Is there anything specific setting up dad compared to MoM?
<ffm|sh> ScottK: How do I do that for, like 8 packages?
<ffm|sh> ScottK: I'd rather not have to set up a separate sync request.
<milosz_> sorry but what do i need to do in order to have a separate -dev package?
<ScottK> ffm|sh: You have to do it per package.
<ffm|sh> argh....
<stefanlsd> When doing a merge - Im still struggling how to figure out what patches have already been applied and what still needs to be merged - is there a procedure for this?
<ffm|sh> ScottK: For some reason requestsync is using my personal, non-pseudononymous key for submissions (good thing launchpad rejected that mail)
<ffm|sh> ScottK: any idea how to fix?
<ScottK> ffm|sh: Use -k and the key id
<ScottK> see man requestsync for details.
<joaopinto> Can someone review and advocate http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=amoebax ? Thanks
<ffm|sh> ScottK: Ok. Is https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-sugarteam/2008-August/000023.html a fairly good reason not to sync with debian?
<slayton> when compiling a binary using the standard procedure (./configure, make) I get a binary named X  is there anyway that when I package the binary into a deb I can get the binary renamed to something like MyPrefix-X?
<broonie> slayton: Your rules file can run whatever shell commands it wants.
 * ScottK looks
<slayton> broonie, so I can rename the binary in my rules file?
<ScottK> Maybe.
<DRebellion> slayton, yes
<ffm|sh> ScottK: obviously, if we dont merge, it'll increase our workload.
<ScottK> ffm|sh: It seems very odd to me that CDBS is doing a major rewrite just after Lenny freezes.
<ScottK> Urgh.
<ScottK> ffm|sh: Are the new Debian sugar packages being pushed to Unstable or Experimental?
<ffm|sh> ScottK: Yes.
<ScottK> Both?
<ScottK> It was an 'or' question.
<slayton> when I write commands in the rules dir I have to write them as if I'm in the same dir as the debian directory right?
<milosz_> i'm trying to add all header and the .pc file of the lib into the -dev package and the shared libs into the main package
<joaopinto> slayton, no, you should assume they are ran from the source dir
<milosz_> however, i get from dpkg-buildpackage:
<joaopinto> run
<milosz_> dh_install: taglib-gio-dev missing files (usr/include/taglib-gio/*), aborting
<milosz_> i don't get the error, there is an .install file taglib-gio-dev.install but i don't understand what i have to to in order for dh_install to find the files (they are getting all installed into debian/tmp, perhaps that's not right?)
<slayton> so would a simple command like " mv ../debian/<package>/usr/bin/X ../debian/<package/MyPrefix-X" placed at the end of my rules file do the trick for renaming the file?
<milosz_> ok i understand that if it doesn't feel like really want to know this no one will tell me so let me state that yes i'd really like to know :>
<Adri2000> coolbhavi: it's because checkinstall's merge is broken on DaD
<ffm|sh> ScottK: unstable.
<lukehasnoname> does ubuntu-dev-tools have all I need to package and patch software?
<ScottK> lukehasnoname: No.
<Adri2000> coolbhavi: see the /!\ on http://dad.dunnewind.net/universe.php
<ffm|sh> ScottK: will it be hard to maintain if we import from debian?
<ScottK> ffm|sh: Then I'd say don't worry about it.  The automated merge/sync tools should deal with those problems.
<ScottK> Mostly anyway.
 * milosz_ thinks it's a typical lvl50-required-to-reach-lvl50-situation
<ffm|sh> 13:42  ScottK$ ffm|sh: Are the new Debian sugar packages being pushed to Unstable or Experimental?
<ffm|sh> 13:42  ScottK$ ffm|sh: Are the new Debian sugar packages being pushed to Unstable or Experimental?
<ffm|sh> ooops.
<coolbhavi> Thanks Adri2000
<bobbo> Can Universe packages Build-Depend on Multiverse packages?
<ScottK> bobbo: No.
<ffm|sh> bobbo: no.
<bobbo> ScottK: ffm|sh thanks1
<bobbo> s/1/!/
 * NCommander never got why the non-free software section gets the cooler name
<lukehasnoname> multiverse?
<lukehasnoname> heh
<lukehasnoname> free should have been called galaxy and non-free should have been called universe
<Kopfgeldjaeger> DktrKranz: hi. I uploaded a new gtkhash version to revu (after norsetto's comments). Looks like I shouldn't specify the author/license for each source file as it's the same for all. Maybe you could... well ;) If you've got time: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=gtkhash
<DktrKranz> Kopfgeldjaeger, I fear I have no time for today, I'm buried in SRU process and I'd like to finish bug list soon, sorry :(
<ffm|sh> How do I request a rename?
<Kopfgeldjaeger> OK, no problem ;)
<ffm|sh> ScottK: see above
<ScottK> ffm|sh: Sorry, busy with $WORK right now.  Someone else will need to answer.
<ffm|sh> kk.
<k0p> someone can review and advocate my pacakge? http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=umit
<Adri2000> is it possible to backport from a stable release?
<Adri2000> eg. backport from feisty to dapper?
<ScottK> Adri2000: Yes, but be very clear in your request so the archive admins don't miss it.
<Adri2000> ok
<slayton> in my rules file I added an ls command to list the contents of usr/bin then I issued the mv command to rename the file... it didn't work: here is the output of the dpkg-buildpackage  http://pastebin.com/m2fa1ee8c  I'm really getting confused to why this isn't working....
<slayton> I did this after the build command
<slayton> http://pastebin.com/m540580d3  <-- this is a better pastebin
<DRebellion> slayton, have you explicitly created /usr/bin?
<DRebellion> wait
<DRebellion> it must already be there
<DRebellion> :P
<slayton> no... but it already exists.... actually I just noticed a spelling error... GRR!!! Sorry
<tuxmaniac> wiki seems to be gone crazy!
<slayton> let me try again
<DRebellion> slayton, yep, there is ; )
<slayton> DRebellion, i've become to reliant on tab completion that I make mistakes when I don't have it :-p
<DRebellion> slayton, same.
<slayton> DRebellion, if I want to  include one or two binaries in a package but  the standard make command builds others that I don't want... is the easiest way to remove the unwanted binaries just delete them in the rules file or is there a specific way to exclude things?
<DRebellion> slayton, just delete them in the rules file.
<slayton> ok great
<slayton> thanks
<DRebellion> slayton, you can do pretty much anything in the rules file to make debian/tspikes/* exactly how you want it.
<slayton> DRebellion, thanks...  i'm pretty new to building programs from source let alone packaging, but its the task that was assigned me...
<slayton> I really appreciate the help i get here
<tuxmaniac> wgrant: Hi. Can you please subscribe Avogadro to MOTU Science team in LP?
<stefanlsd> running a debuild -S -sa and im getting - checking for X... configure: error: Can't find X includes. Please check your installation and add the correct paths!.  Anyone have any suggestions?
<DRebellion> stefanlsd, are you running ./configure in the clean target?
<stefanlsd> DRebellion:  There is something -  if test ! -f $(CURDIR)/Makefile;then \   CFLAGS="$(CFLAGS) -Wl,-z,defs" ./configure $(configkde); \ fi    (this is a merge from debian)
<DRebellion> stefanlsd, that's just odd. You would have to tell us what $(configkde) points to.
<stefanlsd> DRebellion: Only thing i see is - admin/debianrules:  print STDOUT "configkde=$enable_debug $enable_final --disable-rpath --prefix=\$(kde_prefix) --libexecdir=\$(kde_bindir) --sysconfdir=\$(sysconfdir) --libdir=\$(kde_libdir) --includedir=\$(kde_includedir) --with-qt-includes=/usr/include/qt3 --mandir=\$(mandir) --infodir=\$(infodir) --with-xinerama\n";
<DRebellion> stefanlsd, right. Maybe someone else knows why they would be running configure in the clean rule. *shrug*
<stefanlsd> DRebellion: hehe. yeah... seems weird :)
<stefanlsd> DRebellion: yeah. if i hash it out -it builds. let me see if i can find who put the merge in.
<ffm|sh> Is it bad form to ask for a sponser to sync on IRC?>
<ffm|sh> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/sugar/+bug/255432
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 255432 in sugar "Please sync sugar 0.81.4-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)." [Wishlist,New]
<james_w> ffm|sh: it's rare, sync requests are normally processed quite fast anyway
<ffm|sh> james_w: how fast is "quite"?
<ffm|sh> james_w: and how do I ask for a package-renaming?
<ffm|sh> (different package)
<james_w> um, you do it and ask for sponsorship I think, I've never done it though
<james_w> "quite" is within a few days in my experience
<squinky86> I uploaded a package to revu, but it's not showing up in my account on revu
<nxvl> squinky86: it's not automatically
<nxvl> squinky86: it takes some minutes untill you see the package
<squinky86> nxvl: the wiki said '5'. It's been about 20.
<nxvl> squinky86: package name?
<squinky86> nxvl: lrzip
<fabrice_s1> squinky86: did you connect with OpenID, and merge your old REVU account?
<squinky86> I uploaded it again about 7-8 minutes ago just to be sure.
<squinky86> It's a new account all-around.
<nxvl> squinky86: have't you get an error e-mail?
 * persia checks the queue
<squinky86> I have not received an email.
<stefanlsd> Im doing a merge - can i just modify the rules to remove something, or do i need to write a patch to do the remove?
<squinky86> I've never built a debian/ubuntu package before, so I've accepted that I'm doing something wrong, and I'm trying to follow the documentation on the wiki.
<persia> squinky86: Is your GPG key registered with launchpad?
<squinky86> persia: Yes, and I have signed the code of conduct.
<persia> squinky86: REVU isn't smart enough to check that :)
<squinky86> :). As long as it can find my package, REVU can be as dumb as it wants!
<fabrice_s1> squinky86: and did you log in REVU?
<persia> squinky86: I found your package: just trying to figure out why it was rejected.
<squinky86> fabrice_s1: afaik
<squinky86> persia: Thank you!
<persia> squinky86: What's your LP ID.
<squinky86> persia: should be squinky86
<persia> nick consistency is always good :)
<persia> Hmm.. BBAB1A83 seems right :(
<squinky86> persia: Look for a silly mistake. I gaurantee you it was something dumb that I did or overlooked.
<persia> squinky86: By the way, the package as is probably needs work: at least I suspect it oughtn't be native.
<squinky86> persia: What do you mean "native"?
<persia> Also should close a bug with the initial changelog
<squinky86> persia: You're confusing the newbie.
 * persia stops reviewing the .changes file, and looks more for the actual issue
<persia> squinky86: Seems your key hasn't been imported.
<squinky86> persia: Any chance you could tell me how to do that, or point me to the relevant docs?
<persia> That said, I'm not that familiar with the new verison of REVU, and don't know the best way to force import.
<squinky86> persia: Ah, it's an issue with revu?
<persia> squinky86: I think it's supposed to happen automatically when you log in.
<persia> Well, the package has some issues: you'll want to run lintian -iIv lrzip_0.23_source.changes
<persia> You'll probably also want to set the version in debian/changelog to 0.23-0ubuntu1
<slayton> Is there a way for me to get the Intrepid DBUS sources with the debian directory intact?
<persia> slayton: apt-get source
<slayton> persia: I forgot to mention i'm running Hardy
<squinky86> persia: Thank you. I'll definitely do that. Will logging out of launchpad and back in 'import' my key?
<persia> slayton: Well, you can either download from https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/dbus, or add intrepid source stanzas to /etc/apt/source.list and use apt-get source
<lukehasnoname> slayton: apt-get dist-upgrade; apt-get source <_<
<persia> squinky86: Not logging in and out of LP.  Logging into REVU.
<persia> visit revu.ubuntuwire.com
<persia> lukehasnoname: That is inherently dangerous for a wide range of use cases.
<lukehasnoname> I know
<lukehasnoname> notice the sly eyes
<slayton> persia, I downloaded the source from launchpad but it doesn't contain the debian directory....
<persia> slayton: What URL?
 * squinky86 installs lintian
<persia> lukehasnoname: Is that what they were.  I'm not sure everyone understands emoticons well.
<slayton> persia, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/intrepid/+source/dbus/1.2.1-2ubuntu9/+files/dbus_1.2.1.orig.tar.gz
<slayton> persia, and I'd rather not add the intrepid repo to my hardy apt-sources unless I have to
<persia> slayton: OK.  Near there you ought see links for .dsc and .diff.gz: you need all three parts.
<slayton> k
<slayton> persia, how then do I use the .dsc and .diff to add the debian dir?
<slayton> persia, i got it never mind
<persia> slayton: dpkg-source is handy, no?
<slayton> oh... i used patch...
<persia> Ah.  That usually works, but is less reliable.  dpkg-source -x foo.dsc will do the checksum verifications, and deal with tarballs that don't unpack where one might expect.
<NCommander> Is it just mean, or the wiki dead?
<squinky86> NCommander: I can't get to it either. It's been like this off and on all day.
<DRebellion> NCommander, yep, what squinky86 said.
<squinky86> persia: This lintian tool is very frustrating. I keep fixing an issue that it raises, but it won't go away!
<persia> squinky86: Did you log into the REVU site yet?  Also, which issue?
<squinky86> persia: Yes, I've relogged into REVU. The issue with lintian is with the distclean target, starting out, "A rule in the debian/rules file for this package calls the package's..."
<NCommander> squinky86, you do know you need to rebuild the source package before Lintian can detect changes, right?
<squinky86> NCommander: with "dpkg-buildpackage -S -sa -rfakeroot", correct?
<NCommander> squinky86, that would do the trick
<persia> squinky86: BBAB1A83 has now been imported.  Your next upload should work.
<squinky86> persia: Thanks.
<NCommander> persia, was there an issue with the keysyncer?
<persia> Also, `debuild -S -sa` is the short why to type that command :)
 * NCommander has always called dpkg-buildpackage directly
<NCommander> Is there any advantage to using debuild over dpkg-buildpackage?
<persia> NCommander: No idea: the key wasn't in the keyring for the last upload.  A fresh login to REVU fixed it.
<persia> NCommander: it's fewer keystrokes?
<NCommander> persia, its possible LP lagged on updating the RDF data files
<NCommander> persia, or the key wasn't on the LP keyservers yet
<persia> (debuild calls dpkg-buildpackage, and passes most of the options)
<persia> NCommander: Maybe.  I didn't look that hard.
<persia> By the way, is there updated documentation for REVU admins available yet?
<NCommander> persia, I made some basic changes to the pages on the wiki
<NCommander> persia, was there a revu admin doc I missed?
<persia> NCommander: Well, the previous guide to being a REVU admin was an email from sistpoty to ubuntu-motu months and months ago.  Talks about the use of /srv/revu-production/bin/* and common tasks to support uploaders, clean up issues, etc.
<NCommander> persia, that shouldn't have changed at all expect that fetch-launchpad-keys doesn't exist anymore
<persia> I'm guessing some of that has changed (I know alter-user changed).
<persia> Err, it did.
<NCommander> persia, not really, same command syntax
<persia> Not for alter-user.
<squinky86> GRR! The "distclean" message is STILL there. It says it's on line 48 of debian/rules, which I changed to its suggestion: "[ ! -f Makefile ] || $(MAKE) clean"
<persia> Maybe it's just that one.
<NCommander> persia, there were changes to alter-user to remove the password functionality
<persia> Also, I'm presuming we oughtn't willy-nilly import keys anymore, as it won't match unless it as an openid link.
<persia> s/as/has/
<NCommander> persia, nah, its pretty smart, if they key is already in the ring, it will make the assiocation on first login
<NCommander> persia, its just scripting GPG is evil; all its output is also ending up in the apache error_log -_-;
<squinky86> I'm a little upset - if I can't even fix the first issue that lintian spits out at me. Is there somewhere that details all of lintian's possible messages and how to fix them?
<NCommander> squinky86, run lintian -v *dsc file*
<persia> NCommander: Right, but in a case like squinky86, if I imported the key with revu-key, would it have fixed it, or would it still require re-login?
<persia> No.  Run lintian -iIv : -v isn't enough.
<NCommander> persia, no, it would have rejected since the association isn't there
<NCommander> (the register-uploads script got a massive rewrite in sections)
<squinky86> Oh crud, I see what I did now. Changing the package version to "0.23-0ubuntu1" also changed the output files generated from building... I feel dumb now.
<persia> NCommander: Right.  That's a behavioural change, even if the code didn't change.
<ffm|sh> persia: is it OK for me to seek sponsership via IRC?
<persia> Would you mind writing up a new summary?
<persia> ffm|sh: For what sort of thing?
<ffm|sh> persia: debian syncs
<persia> ffm|sh: Generally we discourage specific request for sponsorship for those, unless one is specifically blocking something else you are chasing.
<ffm|sh> persia: yeah, I'm trying to get it synced, so that when the new upstream comes out tonight, I can update our packages and submit a debdiff.
<NCommander> ffm|sh, for syncs, you don't submit debdiff, just put a sync request in
<ffm|sh> NCommander: I know. After the sync, I'm going to give a debdiff for the new upstream (non-debian) version.
<james_w> ffm|sh: what's the point in syncing first if you are just going to upload a new version straight away?
<ffm|sh> james_w: to rebase on debian.
<ffm|sh> james_w: ATM we arn't using debian packaging for this package.
<james_w> making the update to new version easier to understand for reviewers could be a reason I guess, but you can provide the diff to Debian seaprately
<james_w> yeah, but you are going to diverge from Debian again in a few hours anyway.
<james_w> There's no reason why you can't base your packaging of the new upstream on Debian's current version without it being synced to Ubuntu first
<ffm|sh> james_w: OK, question then: If we sync with debian, and don't make any ubuntu-spesifc changes, will the new debian versions be auto-downloaded?
<ffm|sh> james_w: ie. if we synced, and debian made a new change, does that change get passed along?
<james_w> no, not currently, as we are past Debian Import Freeze
<james_w> you would have to request it manually
<james_w> they would be once Intrepid is released though
<persia> ffm|sh: If you're planning to update tomorrow, why bother with a sync?
 * persia stops echoing james_w
<ffm|sh> james_w: ah, makes sense.
<james_w> persia: it was a pre-echo of you
<persia> Note that a manual request for a sync *after* the Debian update would be much more interesting than either the current sync request or the planned update (if such a Debian update doesn't conflict with the Lenny freeze)
<ffm|sh> james_w: tomorrow, there will be updates to a whole bunch of related packages in debian. I have to make a separate req for _each_, even though it's the same project?
<james_w> ffm|sh: yes, if they are different source packages
<james_w> you may want to look at "requestsync" from the ubuntu-dev-tools package
<james_w> "requestsync -s <package> intrepid" will automate a lot for you
<james_w> the "-s" is important
<nxvl> emgent: around?
<ffm|sh> james_w: Yeah, I already sumbitted a request that way. I guess I should close it, right?
<james_w> ffm|sh: if you are going to look to get the new version in tonight then I would suggest so, yes.
<jpds> ffm|sh: Or make changes to the title/body of the existing bug.
<squinky86> persia: I have fixed all the issues that I know how. The remaining ones are: 1) "You've specified an unknown target distribution for your upload in the debian/changelog file...", 2) "This source package is not Debian-native but it does not have a debian/watch file..." Could you please direct me to documentation that can fix these issues?
<persia> squinky86: Which target distribution does it complain about?
<NCommander> squinky86, make sure its "intrepid" instead of "unstable" in your changelog
<persia> Also, man uscan
<stefanlsd> Is anyone able to take a look at a debdiff for a merge im trying - i feel like i may be complicating it...
<squinky86> persia: "Your version string suggests this package is for Ubuntu, so your distribution should be one of intrepid, hardy, gutsy, feisty, edgy or dapper."
<squinky86> How do I specify the version string?
<persia> squinky86: In the changelog, as NCommander specificed.
<persia> stefanlsd: Pastebin?
<squinky86> NCommander, persia: thanks!
<stefanlsd> persia: thanks. will do - just running it through pbuilder quick...
<ffm|sh> lol, there was a pending request for ages before I came along: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/sugar/+bug/246017
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 246017 in sugar "sync with debian 0.81 sugar-release" [Undecided,New]
<stefanlsd> persia: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/34880/
<persia> stefanlsd: Debian has dh_iconcache ?!?
<stefanlsd> persia: dh_icons...   (it was renamed...)
<stefanlsd> oh
 * squinky86 waits 5 minutes to see if it worked this time...
<stefanlsd> it wasnt renamed... is what you are saying?
<jpds> stefanlsd: _iconcache was replaced by _icons some time ago.
<k0p> hi norsetto :)
<persia> stefanlsd: Currently, neither Debian nor Ubuntu have dh_iconcache.  In the past, there was a dh_iconcache only in Ubuntu.  It would have made sense in the context of an Ubuntu package to replace dh_iconcache with dh_icons, but I would be surprised to see that as a "remaining change".
<norsetto> hi k0p
<persia> stefanlsd: I also don't see that as a change later in the diff, I only see something that could be described as "Added dh_icons".
<stefanlsd> jpds / persia: thanks. you guys are right.  an ubuntu1 release made it dh_iconcache, and then an ubuntu2 release fixed it to dh_icons.  so my changelog entry is misleading...
<k0p> norsetto, today I test several package of umit. Compile on hardy with x86, and amd64. Nothing happens. Works fine ever.So can you help me reproduce bug?
<stefanlsd> persia: nodnod. will fix that. thanks
<norsetto> k0p: how?
<persia> stefanlsd: More generally, you should look through all the "remaining changes" and make sure they are really "remaining changes".  Some might need rewording.  Some might have been adopted, and can be dropped.
<k0p> norsetto, strace :X
<k0p> gh
<slayton> so I'm trying to build a dbus daemon with statically linked libs...  so I added "--disable-shared" to the configure script in the rules files but then when I run dpkg-buildpackage I get an error : http://dbus.pastebin.com/m43377587
<k0p> may be help me.. I don't know.
<k0p> it's before debug points.
<slayton> do I need to change the rules file to not try to install the libs?
<k0p> norsetto, run: strace umit
<k0p> and pastebin results, please.
<stefanlsd> persia: i went thru each change in the ubuntu* stuff and it looks like they are current. The only thing im not 100% how it happened is the ./configure landing up in the clean target. I moved it to the configure target and its better.
<squinky86> persia, NCommander: thank you for your help. That one uploaded correctly.
<persia> I suspect ./configure was in clean to make it happen at packaging time rather than build time.  You might check the changelog history for how this came to be.
<persia> Also, as this package is in Debian, I discourage updaing the Standards-Version with the merge, even if it happens to be compliant, it's a useless diff.
<stefanlsd> persia: by changelog history, you mean the changelog file?  (or is there some other history we can see)
<stefanlsd> persia: ok, can fix that...
<persia> Yes, the changelog file, but you might have to read quite a lot of it to understand why ./configure might be in clean.
<persia> Personally, I think moving it is wise, as in clean seems very odd to me, but it needs understanding or testing or both to be worth modifying.
<stefanlsd> persia: will try and find something from the bugs in the changelog.  it doesnt compile with the ./configure in clean.  breaks on looking for X and you get left with a bunch config files. but will look some more...
<k0p> norsetto, there're are one way to test what's happen. increase verboisity.
<k0p> can you help with it? it's easy. only change a var to True, and run : umit -v -v -v -v -v
<persia> stefanlsd: It should compile with it there: it may be that you need more of the build-dependencies installed to build the source.  You might also check with some of the previous uploaders if you get stuck.
<norsetto> k0p: which var?
<stefanlsd> persia: thanks. will do!
<k0p> norsetto, edit /usr/bin/umit line 38
<k0p> where False, put True
<k0p> norsetto, after editr run: umit -v -v -v -v -v
<norsetto> k0p: it says RUNNING WITHOUT PSYCO! and then exit with ImportError: No module named gtk
<k0p> grrr
<k0p> omg
<k0p> pygtk depedencies :X
<k0p> norsetto, give me a minutes to fix it ok?
<norsetto> k0p: sure
<k0p> norsetto, Depends: ${python:Depends}, menu, nmap (>=4.50), python, python (>= 2.5), python-gtk2 | python-pysqlite2, python-gobject
<k0p> looks good to dependences?
<norsetto> k0p: I thought you needed the python (>= 2.5) | python-pysqlite2 ?
<k0p> hmm
<nxvl> a motu still need 2 ACK's for new packages or just 1?
<jpds> nxvl: Last I read: "They are encouraged to get reviews, but don't need them to upload"
<jpds> Not sure if that's changed now.
<k0p> norsetto, I'm thinking ... so I'll put python, python-pysqlite2 ok?
<geser> nxvl: if it didn't change, motus need only 1 ACK
<norsetto> k0p: you better ask somebody that knows about this python stuff, I don't
<k0p> k
<k0p> ok :)
<k0p> RainCT, are you there?
<nxvl> geser: thank you
<nxvl> :D
<geser> k0p: ${python:Depends} will add the dependency on python itself, so you don't need to add it yourself
<geser> k0p: and "python, python (>= 2.5)" is redundant anyway
<k0p> so remove this words, right?
<norsetto> k0p: while you are at it, why don't you add psyco too?
<k0p> norsetto, psyco it on Suggests
<k0p> it's not mandatory.
<norsetto> k0p: I'd rather make it a recommend then
<geser> k0p: yes (it's a good idea to check the dependencies of the build deb if they are like you expected)
<k0p> sure.
<k0p> norsetto, someone around tellme to put psyco on suggests
<norsetto> k0p: upstream says "you're encourajed to install it" thats seems stronger than a simple suggest
<k0p> hmm
<k0p> norsetto, so where you suggest that I add it?
<norsetto> k0p: I said it already, as a Recommends instead of as a Suggests
<k0p> ok
<POX__> psyco works on i386 only, so you have to use: python-psyco [i386 hurd-i386 netbsd-i386 kfreebsd-i386]
<k0p> yeap
<k0p> sure
<persia> nxvl: Generally I consider it to be the case that everyone requires two ACKs, but that MOTU can self-ACK.
<nxvl> persia: so MOTU's need 2 ACK's but one of them can be self made?
<nxvl> persia: so it's like it gets 1, but on the page there are 2?
<persia> nxvl: That's how I interpret it.  Generally, I think the MOTU wants to be their own second ack, so they get Uploaded-By, and direct feedback from archive-admins.
<persia> Essentially.
<persia> Mind you, and MOTU creating a new package is expected to review their own work...
<persia> s/and/any/
<nxvl> exactly
<nxvl> ok, that make perfect sense to me
<nxvl> :D
<norsetto> persia: you are the sound buff here around, you know anything about liblo0?
<k0p> norsetto, uploading :D
<persia> kirkland: Excellent ideas, those.
<persia> norsetto: Debugging, or NBS?
<norsetto> persia: well, was just wondering if it was worth upgrading
<persia> Oh.  Let me look.
<k0p> norsetto, http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=umit
<k0p> norsetto, can you review now?
<persia> norsetto: I don't actually use OSC, but 0.25 seems to have a good set up bugfixes, and upstream moved to liblo.sf.net, which might be interesting to catalog.
<norsetto> persia: right, it also seems a good idea to me, I just asked upstream to clarify why he hasn't bumped the soname and version since it seems that there are API/ABI changes.
<persia> Probably also want to ping the Debian Maintainer, who seems to have let a couple NMUs go by, and might be interested in an easy update to the latest state post-Lenny.
<persia> (it has far too many rdepends to be updated in Debian now)
<norsetto> persia: yes, quite a lot of rd and rbd
<k0p> norsetto, do you will test?
<norsetto> k0p: not today, you can test it yourself on a system which doesn't have gtk stuff installed by default (ie. kubuntu).
<k0p> sure.
<persia> norsetto: Well, only 22 source packages need an update, but still, that gets painful for 11 architectures (or whatever)
<DktrKranz> norsetto, re bug 248150, I'd like to have an exact picture of packages which need love before ACKing it, I'll do some upgrade tests to have things clearer.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 248150 in fcalendar "package r-cran-fcalendar 220.10063-1 failed to install/upgrade: " [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/248150
<norsetto> DktrKranz: be careful because it depends very much on the order of the upgrade
<k0p> DktrKranz, can you comment Depends of umit package? only take a look and comment, please.
<DktrKranz> norsetto, is there a given order to install packages, or just letting update-manager spawn some magic?
<DktrKranz> k0p, I'll have a look
<norsetto> DktrKranz: thats the problem, you can't so they may all or none (or something in between) fail
<DktrKranz> gah!
<norsetto> DktrKranz: to come up with that list, I had to install all the possible packages and to check all their postrm for usage of the R CMD command
<DktrKranz> norsetto, "TEST CASE: upgrade... hope to see a crash... check with -proposed version... hope to see none"
<norsetto> DktrKranz: no, even if you see none with -proposed it doesn't mean its solved for everybody
<DktrKranz> exactly... it's a mess :/
<DktrKranz> k0p, done
<RainCT> k0p: pong
<norsetto> DktrKranz: yes, thats why, since an alternative (not nice,m but working) solution is simply to reconfigure and re-upgrade, I'm more inclined to mark it as won't fix than going to change 32 packages
<RainCT> persia: MOTUs need 1 ack from someone else for new packages now? I thought that was recommended, but not mandatory
<persia> RainCT: Let's say strongly recommended.  If someone doesn't do that, and the archive admins find a problem, they usually point how the simple facility to get peer review, which can be a bit embarassing.
<norsetto> RainCT: its a recommend in the sense that if you don't we kick you out ;-)
<persia> Further, in cases where there are questions or contention about an upload, when it didn't go through REVU, some people complain, and typically the person who uploaded it doesn't want that again either.
<RainCT> norsetto: heh
<DktrKranz> norsetto, I tend to agree with you... it's really ugly, but if there's uncertainty about a fix and how to effectively test it, it's better to provide a workaround (IMHO)
<RainCT> Okay, it's like I thought then :)
<persia> Anyway, what happened to the nice procedure of sending a note to the mailing list when one uploaded something from REVU?  I liked seeing those.
<k0p> RainCT, do you understand about python stuff right?
<norsetto> DktrKranz: yes, the workaround is in the bug report, I tested it successfully (twice)
<RainCT> k0p: a bit :)
<RainCT> (brb)
<k0p> RainCT, can you review my package?
<k0p> RainCT, when you back, tell please. :)
 * NCommander thinks REVU needs a README.quotes file
<k0p> lol.
<NCommander> Here's probably the best from from dak
<NCommander>  <mdz_> SirDibos: that sentence sounds like it wants to be a bug report when it grows up
<k0p> :)
<zooko> :-)
<wgrant> tuxmaniac: Done.
<Adri2000> DktrKranz: me once again :p I uploaded to -proposed as well for feisty and dapper (where the patch is slightly modified), bug #243722
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 243722 in amsn "amsn 0.97: login doesn't work anymore due to a protocol change" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/243722
<james_w> thanks persia
<Laney> congrats james_w!
<james_w> thanks Laney
<james_w> weren't you going to apply this week?
<Laney> I was, and still am
<Laney> rl took over a little bit though
<Laney> maybe tomorrow if I can drum up some sponsors
<k0p> DktrKranz, well. I think that now finally the package it's ready.
<k0p> but I need to test in a system without gtk
<DktrKranz> Adri2000, go go go! :)
<Adri2000> DktrKranz: could you add a comment to the bug? as the patch for dapper is not the same
<DktrKranz> Adri2000, done
<RainCT> k0p: URL?
<Adri2000> DktrKranz: thanks!
<k0p> RainCT, http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=umit
<k0p> :)
<k0p> DktrKranz, so.. I didn't fix the changes on copyright. sponsor will fix right?
<RainCT> (the problem with REVU where you were forwarded to index.p after login has just been fixed)
<k0p> RainCT, I need advocate in package. I make lots of efforts to have umit on intrepid.
<DktrKranz> k0p, it's one character fix, I think it's easier to adjust :)
<k0p> DktrKranz, yeap I know. But right now I can't fix
<k0p> because I lost advocate.
<k0p> if RainCT advocate my package I get two advocates. whats happen after?
<RainCT> k0p: that I'll upload it :)
<k0p> RainCT, upload?
<k0p> to packages of ubuntu?
<k0p> it's my first package. I don't have experience.
<RainCT> btw, I'm looking for someone to review http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=julius. Uhm.. DktrKranz, are you bored? :)
<RainCT> k0p: yep
<DktrKranz> RainCT, on holiday.... ;)
<DktrKranz> I can't be bored :)
<huats> james_w: congrats !
<huats> TheMuso: are you around ?
<k0p> yeap
<k0p> james_w, congrats :)
<k0p> i see mail in the list
<bobbo> congrats james_w!
<james_w> thanks all
 * beuno cheers james_w
<k0p> RainCT, what do you think about my package?
<RainCT> james_w: bah, you should already have become u-u-c long time ago...    congrats :)
<nhandler> Congrats james_w
<RainCT> k0p: I don't recommend using that watch file, as it will break if they change the versioning scheme
<k0p> RainCT, I know.
<k0p> but there was a trouble with sourceforge.
<k0p> DktrKranz suggest this watch file.
<ScottK> k0p: There is a specific format in Debian for Sourceforge watch files.  Are you using it (I haven't looked at your package)?
<RainCT> ScottK: yes, he is
<k0p> ScottK, yeap
<ScottK> OK.  That's the one you should be useing then.
<k0p> but sourceforge does not works very well in our projects
<RainCT> k0p: I see.. Is 6.04.1 older than 0.9.5 or what?
<k0p> yeap
<k0p> it's older.
<k0p> but we already remove this on sf.
<k0p> we don't have a option to watch file :/
<RainCT> k0p: uhm.. umit seems to be the only application (of those which I have installed) creating a directory in usr/share/icons
<RainCT> is that OK?
<k0p> RainCT, yeap.
<RainCT> as in, is that allowed?
<k0p> well I think yes. But I can apply a patch and change it.
<k0p> so I'll lost again advocate of DktrKranz. he will shot me :)
<RainCT> I think usr/share/icons is only for stuff from themes and such.. but I don't really know
<k0p> RainCT, so, what do you advice me?
<k0p> RainCT, change it?
<RainCT> to wait if someone else answers :P
<k0p> RainCT, and you will advocate it?
#ubuntu-motu 2008-08-07
 * persia has a few things in /usr/share/icons, http://paste.ubuntu.com/34919/ is the package list.  Everything seems to be in subdirectories.
<RainCT> k0p: also, please install the html (with it's images and everyting) in usr/share/doc/umit/html
<k0p> RainCT, ok. so I need to fix it again
<k0p> RainCT, if I lost advocate I fix icons too.
<RainCT> k0p: I've done some little changes - I'm uploading them now so that you can see a diff and check if you are happy with them
<RainCT> persia: I have those inside hicolor/??x??/apps/ directories
<k0p> RainCT, I don't have.
<k0p> so RainCT only fix html path?
<RainCT> k0p: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/diff.py?upid1=3212&upid2=3213
<persia> k0p: Just fix, even though it costs you an advocate.  Most of those that do REVU watch this channel, and are less likely to give you a second ack with known issues.  Further, any of them can also cancel your advocation with a comment.
<k0p> persia, so fix the icons and html right?
<persia> RainCT: I have a direct /usr/share/icons/application-default-icon.png, and 17directories full of various stuff.
<persia> k0p: If you fix it, RainCT will likely give you back the advocation.  If you don't, he might just comment and cancel your previous advocation :)
<k0p> of course.
 * persia hasn't reviewed the package, but very much doesn't think not updating because it might cost advocation makes any sense when the person suggesting the changes could override the advocation anyway...
<k0p> but RainCT fix it in the diff
<k0p> RainCT, do you fix it?
<RainCT> k0p: the html one no (wasn't sure how to do that)
<RainCT> and about the icons I still don't know if they are allowed to be there or not
<k0p> RainCT, I'm seeing
<k0p> I don't need ico
<k0p> on ubuntu
<k0p> so i'll remove it
<k0p> it solves two problems. :)
<RainCT> oh. why do you install them if they aren't necessary? o_O
<k0p> well I'm looking the umit code
<k0p> I don't totally sure yet
<k0p> but may be it's
<k0p> wait please
<k0p> RainCT, lacks a setup patch
<k0p> I need to change html dir ;)
<k0p> RainCT, can you wait 10 minutes?
<k0p> I'll made necessary fixes. ok?
<k0p> persia, thanks for you words :)
 * RainCT is asking about the icons in #ubuntu-desktop
<k0p> yeap because it's needed
<RainCT> k0p: Uhm, I think I'm going to bed (I wouldn't feel happy uploading while I'm half asleep anyway ;)), but I'll leave REVU open on a tab and look at it tomorrow morning
<RainCT> good night all
<k0p> RainCT, ok.
<k0p> RainCT, i'll fix it.
<k0p> tomorrow if you can see it
<k0p> please :)
<k0p> good night
<RainCT> cy
<nhandler> Quick question. How many characters long can the short description in debian/control be? I know this is listed on some wiki page, but I am currently unable to locate that page.
<bobbo> nhandler: Debian policay says ~80 chars or less
<ianm_> what needs to happen for this package to get to hardy?  http://packages.ubuntu.com/search?keywords=screenruler
<nhandler> Thank you bobbo.
<crimsun> it would need to enter intrepid first and then be built for hardy-backports
<crimsun> nothing can go into hardy proper now.
<ianm_> crimsun: new apps can't be made available in the repos of hardy?
<crimsun> ianm_: correct.
<ianm_> do you know why that is?  I mean that app was written on Hardy :)
<crimsun> hardy is frozen; anything new has to go into hardy-{proposed,updates}, hardy-security, or hardy-backports
<crimsun> ianm_: it's because nothing new (source package-wise) can enter a frozen pool
<ianm_> is that to maintain some sort of sanity for past releases?  so they don't keep developing new problems?
<emil-caucho> hello
<crimsun> ianm_: yes (to the first).
<ianm_> crimsun: understandable.  frustrating though (as an app developer)
<nxvl> jcastro: around?
<ianm_> oh-- I'd like to connect with a specific launchpad developer, he works for canonical, maybe he's in here (I'm bad with names...)--  I had lunch with you at OSCON, spanish on my shirt, give a shout if you're around
<nxvl> jcastro: why do we haven't had Ubuntu Open Week this release still?
<nxvl> err
<nxvl> DeveloperWeek
<emgent> nxvl: pong ?
<beuno> ianm_, kiko maybe?
<nxvl> emgent: check your mail
<emgent> will do :)
<nxvl> emgent: i CCed you something i will like you to reply
<nxvl> :P
<ianm_> beuno: did he do the OSCON presentation on launchpad?
<beuno> ianm_, yeap. Him (Christian Reis) and Rinchen (Joey Stanford)
<ianm_> beuno: were there any other canonical employees there?
<beuno> ianm_, I don't know, I wasn't there  :)
<james_w> ianm_: there were a few I think, was he Brazilian?
<emgent> nxvl: yeah i saw. will do :)
<ianm_> james_w: no
<nhandler> ianm_: http://en.oreilly.com/oscon2008/public/schedule/proceedings. Scroll down and you will see the Launchpad presentation. It only lists Kiki and Joey
<james_w> ianm_: American?
<nhandler> Here is a direct link ianm_: http://en.oreilly.com/oscon2008/public/schedule/detail/3456
<huats> nxvl: good luck :)
<nxvl> huats: thank you! I'm scared as hell
<huats> I am sure it'll be OK
<huats> :)
<huats> I would have +1 you but it is useless :)
<ianm_> james_w: yeah
<james_w> ianm_: if it's Joey his picture is on the second link nhandler gave you
<ianm_> yeah that's him
<nxvl> huats: heh
<nxvl> huats: i apreciate it anyway :D
<ianm_> this has got to be the most helpful irc channel I've ever been in ;)
<ember> RainCT: thanks, i've updated on revu
<k0p> ever I think that my package doesn't have issue some one discover ones.. :o lol
 * ScottK wonders if "The Software shall be used for Good, not Evil" in the license means it has to go in multiverse
<ianm_> k0p: clear lesson: never think that, and there will never be any problems
<k0p> ianm_, yeap..
<k0p> you're right :)
<jcastro> nxvl: there's one this cycle yes, probably won't announce dates and such until after the global bug jam
<nxvl> jcastro: awesome!
<nxvl> jcastro: you ROCK
<jcastro> nxvl: it's you guys that make it rock, I'm just a glorified calendar, heh
<nxvl> jcastro: :D
<nxvl> jcastro: the initial push is always the hardest
<ApOgEE-> hehe
<nxvl> emgent: can you please take a look at Bug 255367
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 255367 in dovecot "update-rc.d: warning: multiuser is deprecated; specify runlevels manually" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/255367
<foxbuntu> any able to check to see if my package made it to revu?
<foxbuntu> I checked the site but it hasnt showed up and I sent it about an hour ago
<ion_> What was the dput line you used?
<foxbuntu> dput revu my-package_source.changes
<ion_> Ok. And it was PGP signed for sure?
<foxbuntu> yes
<foxbuntu> I have had packages revu'd before
<foxbuntu> ion_, the package is mythbuntu-log-grabber
<foxbuntu> ion_, any thoughts?
 * ScottK gives nxvl a smack.
<ion_> Iâve got nothing.
<tbielawa> I got a comment on a recent revu that it FTBFS. I am unable to replicate that error.
<tbielawa> Can anyone take a minute and try to build this: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?upid=3187
<tbielawa> += please
<james_w> tbielawa: it builds for me too
<james_w> you may want to ask them how they built it
<james_w> it may be something to do with build/clean interactions or something
<tbielawa> james_w, thanks for testing that for me. I'll ask for how they built it when I submit my next upload
<james_w> or even trying to build on a filesystem mounted noexec
<tbielawa> do people do that? perhaps RainCT's home dir is mounted in that way.
<james_w> I doubt it
<james_w> it's a possibility though
<foxbuntu> any one here able to look at the revu system and see if my package is stuck?
<james_w> it's not a supported way to build a package there though
<james_w> s/there//
<TheMuso> james_w: You are up late.
<james_w> TheMuso: yep, day off tomorrow, and a weekend away, so I'm practising staying up :-)
<TheMuso> james_w: hahaha sounds good. :p
<james_w> time to crash though
<james_w> bye TheMuso
<TheMuso> james_w: Enjoy your time off.
<tbielawa> regarding man pages: I'm packaging a game, the game takes no command line options, is a man page going to be required anyway?
<ScottK> Yes.
<tbielawa>  :)
<nxvl> ScottK: what are you applying the patch against?
<nxvl> ScottK: the courier one
<nxvl> ScottK: it's a debian new version vs merged version patch
<foxbuntu> any one here able to look at the revu system and see if my package is stuck?
<tbielawa> foxbuntu: have you attempted to upload it again?
<foxbuntu> tbielawa, I havent, no
<tbielawa> foxbuntu: might as well give it a try I think
<foxbuntu> tbielawa, alright
<foxbuntu> tbielawa, no luck
<foxbuntu> tbielawa, any other help you can offer?
<tbielawa> foxbuntu: I wish I could, I haven't got any administrative right to though. Sorry :(
<RoAkSoAx> o/ tbielawa long time no see
<tbielawa> RoAkSoAx, hi to you!
<foxbuntu> tbielawa, thanks anyways
<RoAkSoAx> tbielawa, how is it being going for ya?
<fabrice_sp> foxbuntu: did you merge your old REVU account and the new Openid one?
<persia> foxbuntu: Which package?
<persia> myhbuntu-log-grabber?
<foxbuntu> persia, yes
<RoAkSoAx> can anyone review http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=plasmoid-qalculate please :)
<tbielawa> RoAkSoAx, things are well. School begins in about two weeks, I just started a free software club! lp.net/~fsag
<foxbuntu> fabrice_sp, I may not have
<persia> foxbuntu: What's your LP page?
<RoAkSoAx> tbielawa, cool, i'm already an engineer, supported my thesis 3 weeks ago :)
<tbielawa> congrats RoAkSoAx
<tbielawa> !
<RoAkSoAx> ty :)
<nxvl> persia: how did you check the queue? with REVU admin superpowers or it's open to public?
<foxbuntu> persia, nickj-fox
<persia> nxvl: REVU admin superpowers
<nxvl> superpowers are kewl
<tbielawa> haha
<RoAkSoAx> nxvl, you back already?
<nxvl> RoAkSoAx: cdbs, you lazy!
<nxvl> RoAkSoAx: yeah, i'm in PdM again
<foxbuntu> persia, https://launchpad.net/~nickj-fox
<RoAkSoAx> nxvl, i was following the example of others plamoids so... i'll work on other packages later :) i need to finish task of  watchfiles/updates  :P
<nxvl> RoAkSoAx: your package doesn't have a watch file
<nxvl> RoAkSoAx: you should add one
<RoAkSoAx> nxvl, i've tried but cant get the download hrefs from kde-look.org
<nxvl> then try harder
<nxvl> :D
<RoAkSoAx> will do :P
<tbielawa> atta'boy!
<persia> foxbuntu: What do you get locally with `gpg --verify mythbuntu-log-grabber_0.1-0ubuntu1_source.changes`?  22D78758 seems to be in the keyring, but manual processing results in a ValidationFAILED!! message.
<RoAkSoAx> well i'm tired, bye all
<foxbuntu> persia, nick@work-lappy:~/Desktop/mythbuntu_branches$ gpg --verify mythbuntu-log-grabber_0.1-0ubuntu1_source.changes
<foxbuntu> gpg: Signature made Wed 06 Aug 2008 08:47:43 PM CDT using DSA key ID 22D78758
<foxbuntu> gpg: Good signature from "Nick Fox <nfox@foxmediasystems.com>"
<persia> foxbuntu: Extra strange.  I'm really not sure why it doesn't work.
<tbielawa> I wonder if this is related to an issue I had with revu today.
<persia> I'll put it back in the queue, and we can see what happens automatically: maybe my manual attempt broke it.
<tbielawa> I went and did a wget -x on my latest .dsc uploaded there and it couldn't verify the upload
<foxbuntu> persia, alright I'll wait a bit longer, let me know if you want me to push it again
<nxvl> persia: can you please try to apply the patch against debian package and reopen the bug if it works on https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/254681
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 254681 in courier "please merge courier 0.60.0-1 from debian sid" [Undecided,Incomplete]
<foxbuntu> persia, awesome...its in now
<foxbuntu> persia, you could look at it an try for an ACK too if you like ;)
<persia> foxbuntu: In that case, the failure was related to your key and account: having fixed your account, it just needed to be put back in queue.  My attempt to manually jam it in place was apparently using a now deprecated procedure.
<foxbuntu> persia, ok thanks
 * persia may, but is currently catching up on ~6 hours of communications backlog
<foxbuntu> persia, no big deal...thanks for your help
 * RAOF is extremely glad he's inside, and not out in the thunderstorm.
<nxvl> RAOF: where are you based?
<RAOF> Sunny Sydney
 * nxvl want's to visit Australia
<RAOF> It's kinda fun watching the windows bulge in as the thunder hits.
<tbielawa> has anyone used manedit for building man pages? does anyone have suggestions for other utilities to use?
<RAOF> Dear lord.  Hibernate works!
<nxvl> i have
<nxvl> once
<tbielawa> lol
<nxvl> long time ago
<RAOF> tbielawa: I've generally used docbook & docbook2x to generate manpages.
<nxvl> it's cool and easy, as far as i remember
<nxvl> i generally ask upstream for manpages
<nxvl> <- lazy
<tbielawa> nxvl: cool and easy? I wish it were _fun_ an easy :)
<nxvl> cool is in some degree fun
<tbielawa> :)
<nxvl> but manpages aren't fun at all
<tbielawa> :(\
<tbielawa> I was writing one for a utility I wrote for my workplace. Writing as in: by hand. It made [ !cool && !easy && !fun ] true
<nxvl> why? by hand is cooler, easier and less PITA than using tools
 * nxvl hates using tools for formatting stuff
<nxvl> what i would do is: take a manpage and edit it's content
<nxvl> nice and easy
<tbielawa> :)
<TheMuso> RAOF: Interesting. We got rain up here, but no storms.
<tbielawa> interesting:
<tbielawa> public domain license
<tbielawa> ack
<tbielawa> $ manedit
<tbielawa> Segmentation fault
<nxvl> heh
<nxvl> Seg faults are always fun
<nxvl> but at some points can drive you crazy
<dholbach> good morning
<tbielawa> d'morning dholbach
<dholbach> hi tbielawa
<tbielawa> dholbach: do you recall me mentioning that my office names servers after motu and main devs?
<dholbach> tbielawa: yes, I do - I still recall you saying "dholbach is about to be replaced" or something along those lines
<tbielawa> dholbach: :p
<tbielawa> well, the dholbach tftpserver has been virtualized, not depricated ;)
<nxvl> dholbach: hi!
<dholbach> tbielawa: man, those were the proudest 5 minutes of my life.... until you told me 'dholbach' was about to be replaced
<dholbach> hey nxvl
<tbielawa> sorry about that dholbach. you're still loved @wvu CS department yet though :)
<StevenK> tbielawa: I'm idly curious if there is a 'stevenk' server
<nxvl> what>
<nxvl> tbielawa: your servers have our names (i still don't think one's got my)
<dholbach> tbielawa: that's good to hear :)
<persia> tbielawa: Is the list of machines public?
<nxvl> someone need to blog about this
<tbielawa> persia: it's not publicised anywhere, but I can aggregate a list pretty quickly :)
<dholbach> nxvl: looks like everybody likes your video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SLpoi5PlFP8) :-)
<nxvl> wow
<nxvl> 1220 people has saw my video in about 3 days?
<TheMuso> nxvl: re segfaults, like failing hardware? :p
<dholbach> yeah, and like 250 in the first 15 minutes - that was amazing
<nxvl> \o/
 * dholbach hugs nxvl
 * nxvl HUGS dholbach back
<tbielawa> http://csee.wvu.edu/~tbielawa/servers_of_fame
<tbielawa> names collected from the planet.ubuntu blog
<tbielawa> minus a few obvious ones here and there...
<nxvl> like torvalds?
<nxvl> and murdock
<tbielawa> ;)
<nxvl> dholbach: are you going to debconf?
<tbielawa> my manager estated the law of server naming. He was a debian maintainer/contributer for DRBD back in the day
<dholbach> nxvl: no, I'm not
<nxvl> it's kind of long way from berlin :P
<tuxmaniac> wgrant: thanks.
<dholbach> nxvl: doko is going (from Berlin :-))
<nxvl> i wanted to go, but i make a misunderstunding on the sponsorship thing i didn't confirm
<nxvl> :(
<nxvl> so, no debconf for me this year
<nxvl> woohoo \o/ launchpad show all the e-mails again
<nxvl> dholbach: would you do me a favor
<dholbach> nxvl: I can try
<nxvl> dholbach: can you please try to apply patch on https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/courier/+bug/254681 against debian package and confir is it patchs
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 254681 in courier "please merge courier 0.60.0-1 from debian sid" [Undecided,Incomplete]
<nxvl> confirm*
<dholbach> nxvl: you mean if the patch applies?
<nxvl> yep
<nxvl> not to review the patch
<nxvl> just to check if the patch applies to the debian package
<dholbach> hang on a sec
<dholbach> nxvl: applies cleanly
<dholbach> hi ara
<nxvl> dholbach: ok, can you please reopen the bug report
<dholbach> hm?
<nxvl> dholbach: ScottK closes it as incomplete since he said it doesn't apply
<StevenK> I thought it was set to Incomplete?
<StevenK> Incomplete isn't closed
<tuxmaniac> dholbach: sorry for interruption. But just a little ping onthe bug report I filed yesterday on 5-a-day
<tuxmaniac> if you havent seen it yet
<nxvl> StevenK: yeah, but for sponsoring queue it is
<nxvl> :D
<nxvl> or kind of
<StevenK> Invalid would be closed. Incomplete is "more information"
<nxvl> dholbach: and Thank you!
<dholbach> tuxmaniac: I've seen it, but I just got up and am triaging my inbox
<dholbach> tuxmaniac: so it will take a while until I get to it
<nxvl> StevenK: and actually incomplete bugs are deleted, so they are kind of closed
<tuxmaniac> dholbach: no no. I just wanted to confirm you have seen it. Just a little ping thats it.
<dholbach> tuxmaniac: yes, got it
<ara> morning all
<nxvl> well
<nxvl> i need to go back to work tomorrow
<nxvl> i hate the end of holidays
<nxvl> :(
<nxvl> i really need a FOSS related work
<nxvl> i hate suits
<nxvl> read you tomorrow
<nxvl> dholbach: thank you again!
<dholbach> np :)
 * nxvl HUGS everyone
<Ash-Fox> Help, I has been hugged.
<ion_> http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=compcache-setup anyone? :-)
<silwol> good morning
<silwol> I am packaging navit for http://launchpad.net/~openstreetmap/+archive
<silwol> there are several different guis available: gtk, cegui...
<silwol> navit needs at least one in order to run
<silwol> I would split the package into several plugin packages (the guis are actually plugins as far as I can see for no)
<persia> silwol: multiple binary packages would make sense: that way users only need to install what they need.
<silwol> persia: how should the dependencies look like?
<silwol> persia: should there be one package called navit which depends on navit-gui-gtk for example?
<persia> I would expect the GUIs to Depends: on the core, and the core to Recommends each of the GUIs with a | relation
<silwol> is there an easy way that the user can just choose to install navit and get the default (currently gtk) gui?
<persia> Rather, nvait-gui-gtk depends on navit (as the GUI isn't going to work without the software), and navit Recommends: navit-gui-gtk | navit-gui-cegui | ...
<persia> You could have a virtual navit-gui, and have navit Recommend navit-gui, and each of the GUIs Provide: navit-gui, but this makes a new virtual package, and somehow I feel that new virtual packages should only go in Debian unless they are critical to Ubuntu in some way.
<silwol> well, I will send an email to the debian-gis mailing list anyway.
<silwol> it is just to have packages for now
<silwol> in the ppa
<silwol> would it be possible to have some meta-package which contains all the dependencies to a minimal set of packages that run?
<persia> You could, but I would expect that installing navit would do that in Recommends.
<persia> Alternately, installing navit-gui-gtk should get me the GUI and navit, so I can run things.
<RAOF> Any Kubuntu users here who would like to post the output of "echo $DESKTOP_SESSION"?
<StevenK> RAOF: default, but I'm no Kubuntu user :-P
 * StevenK hides
<RAOF> StevenK: That's the output?  That's less helpful than I was hoping for.
<StevenK> steven@liquified:~% echo $DESKTOP_SESSION
<StevenK> default
<RAOF> Crap.
<RAOF> There goes the simple xdg-open fix :(
<tbielawa> :(
<RAOF> You're in gnome, aren't you?
<StevenK> I am
<RAOF> Why doesn't that say "gnome" then, damnit!
<tbielawa> mine says default as well (running gnome)
<RAOF> The fact that mine says 'gnome' is obviously a local artefact.
<RAOF> Oh.  Are either of you running Intrepid?
<tbielawa> RAOF: no
<huats> morning everyone
<tbielawa> good morning huats
<huats> morning tbielawa
<RAOF> StevenK: You running intrepid?
<StevenK> RAOF: Nope
<StevenK> RAOF: Mainly, I was trying to tease you
<RAOF> Woot!  My hope is still alive that checking for DESKTOP_SESSION=gnome will be an accurate gnome-detection mechanism!
<StevenK> RAOF: Ask seb?
<RAOF> Good plan.
<tbielawa> RAOF: you looked through all the values from `env', right?
<RAOF> tbielawa: Yup, indeed.
<tbielawa> *nod*
<tbielawa> good luck.
<RAOF> Candidates are GNOME_KEYRING, but that seems unreliable, and GDMSESSION, which is likewise.
<crimsun> heh.  GNOME_DESKTOP_SESSION.
<persia> RAOF: I've "default" on intrepid
<persia> (mind you, I don't seem to have an underscore key on intrepid, but that's a different issue)
<crimsun> err, sorry:  GNOME_DESKTOP_SESSION_ID
<RAOF> crimsun: On Intrepid?
<RAOF> Because that is _not_ set here.
<RAOF> Which is why xdg-open is broken.
<crimsun> no, this is 8.04.1
<RAOF> Right.  All you sane people on Hardy can shut up now, this only affects insane people running Intrepid.
<crimsun> silly insane people.
<directhex> what are the rules regarding adding functionality to an app in the package rather than from upstream?
<persia> directhex: Be very careful not to break anything, and also sent it upstream
<directhex> hm, one itty bitty bug to iron out first
<directhex> currently fails to work unless you use my new functionality :)
<persia> See, that would be part of the "be very careful" part :)
<directhex> well, you know what it's like hacking other peoples' code. at least the new functionality works, and barring typos, THAT part was right first time
<directhex> done.
<directhex>  FilePlugin.cs |   17 +++++++++++++++--
<directhex>  1 file changed, 15 insertions(+), 2 deletions(-)
<directhex> wait, still bugged
<k0p> directhex, what do you need?
<\sh> fresspire/linspire back to debian base and not ubuntu anymore? what went wrong? I wonder
<sistpoty|work> hi folks
<k0p> hi
<directhex> hahaha, found a delightful genius bug
<directhex> it's a really cute bug ^_^
<joaopinto> Hello
<joaopinto> can someone review http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=amoebax ? Thanks
<coolbhavi> Hello
<coolbhavi> is this the correct command? requestsync --lp -s <package> <target_version>
<james_w> <target_release> isn't it? i.e. "intrepid"
<james_w> yeah
<coolbhavi> james_w, no response from requestsync
<coolbhavi> james_w, Internet is fine
<james_w> coolbhavi: you mean it sits there hung, or it just does nothing?
<james_w> no output at all?
<coolbhavi> james_w, exactly.... it was fine yesterday
<james_w> no idea what that will be, sorry
<coolbhavi> james_w, I mean its hung
<coolbhavi> james_w, from pas 45 mins
<coolbhavi> past*
<cody-somerville> My guess is that it isn't working :P
<coolbhavi> cody-somerville, maybe yes
<cody-somerville> I'm pretty sure that script is python, you can probably modify the shebang to see which line it is hanging on
<coolbhavi> cody-somerville, Ok
<coolbhavi> cody-somerville, or shall I reinstall? it was working yesterday
<cody-somerville> reinstalling would fix it how?
<coolbhavi> cody-somerville, when I know that script was working yesterday why would I change it?
<cody-somerville> coolbhavi, to see why?
<ember> can someone have a look at http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=hamster-applet
<coolbhavi> cody-somerville, here is the script http://pastebin.com/d6943ab6 and here is the trackback  http://pastebin.com/d544ce147
<sistpoty|work> coolbhavi: looks like you're missing rmadison
<sistpoty|work> (which should be in depends of ubuntu-dev-tools then)
<coolbhavi> sistpoty|work, yes
<RainCT> (it's in devscripts which is a dependency of u-d-t)
<coolbhavi> sistpoty|work, I have installed ubuntu-dev-tools
<k0p> hi RainCT :)
<k0p> RainCT, tonight I fix what you ask.
<sistpoty|work> coolbhavi: and devscripts (or whatever package rmadison is in) as well?
<k0p> RainCT, can you take a look? :)
<sistpoty|work> coolbhavi: just check, if you can run rmadison from shell
<RainCT> k0p: yep, in a while :)
<k0p> ok, thanks :)
<k0p> RainCT, I discover that icons is only for packing for windows. So, now we don't have icons, and html it's on doc/html.
<coolbhavi> sistpoty|work, E: need at least one package name as an argument.
<jpds> coolbhavi: Then you have it installed.
<jpds> coolbhavi: What command are you doing with requestsync?
<coolbhavi> jpds, is this the correct command? requestsync --lp -s <package> <target_release>
<jpds> Which package?
<coolbhavi> jpds, its firebug
<jpds> coolbhavi: Oh, I think rmadison is still broken on the Debian server.
<coolbhavi> jpds, so I have to wait?
<jpds> Which would explain why it cannot query the server.
<jpds> coolbhavi: Or do the bug report by hand.
<coolbhavi> jpds, ok
<jpds> Hmm, qa.d.o appears to be down.
<jpds> And #debian-devel /topic confirms.
<coolbhavi> jpds, thanks
<RainCT> hi dpm
<dpm> hi RainCT, thanks for the prompt response to the e-mail
<emgent> hello
<lukehasnoname> hello
<raphink> hello there :)
<raphink> anyone ever wanted to view QTVR on linux ? :)
<raphink> http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=freepv
<persia> raphink: source lintian to begin with...
<raphink> persia: yes, I saw
<raphink> gonna fix these details ;)
<huats> TheMuso: are you around ?
<huats> raphink and persia hey there
<raphink> hi huats
<RoAkSoAx> heyall
<persia> raphink: Also, doesn't close a bug, I think there are supposed to be some mozilla-plugin extras in debian/control (I may be wrong), no upstream in debian/copyright, preepv-doc would be a nifty package, and useless installation of all of NEWS, README, and TODO (0-byte files)
 * persia postpones a proper review
<raphink> hmpf
<raphink> standards changed quite a bit since I was a reviewer
 * raphink remembers when ITPs were only for Debian ;)
<persia> Yes, the development of the needs-packaging bug :)
<persia> Anyway, we got complaints from archive-admins about not being sufficiently critical about copyright, from Debian about not being sufficiently critical about policy, and from QA-type MOTU for not being sufficiently picky about package quality.
<persia> So now it's rather stricter.
<ember> persia: mind giving a review on hamster-applet on revu?
<persia> ember: For me, it's a bit late for a real review, but I'd be happy to give a glance.
<raphink> persia: I can tell
<ember> persia: thanks
<k0p> RainCT, what do you think about my last diff? :)
<raphink> persia: what about the mozilla-plugin extras ?
<persia> raphink: I think there's some tag one is encouraged to add to the binary stanza in debian/control when interacting with mozilla, but I don't know the details (and I may be wrong).  You might check with the mozillateam
<persia> (#ubuntu-mozillateam I think)
<raphink> ok
<persia> On the other hand, it's possible I'm sending you on a wild goose chase, in which case I apologise in advance.
<raphink> as for the freepv-doc, there would be a need for something to put in there
<raphink> the doc that would be required is man pages for the two commands
<raphink> whch I plan to do
<persia> raphink: Yes, it was the TODO: Manuals in debian/rules that encouraged me to advocate that :)
<persia> Oh, man pages don't need a separate -doc app :)
<RainCT> k0p: I just started looking at it.. testing installation now :)
<raphink> persia: that's what I meant by the TODO
<raphink> ;)
<persia> Oh.  I presumed there were some manuals available in the source somewhere, and just weren't built by default.
<raphink> persia: no, sadly
<raphink> not even a --help
<raphink> but well, there's no options either ;)
<persia> ember: Remember to reference each license from common licenses with a link when it is used in debian/copyright
<k0p> RainCT, ok :)
<persia> Trivial manpage to write then :)
<ember> persia: right, thanks
<persia> ember: Why debhelper 7 when you're using CDBS?  Especially so when you're not depending on a version of CDBS that requires debhelper 7?
<ember> hmm that must have been dh_make who create that
<persia> In the watch file, don't you want to also capture [02468] as part of the version number?
<persia> (and I don't really see the point of "debian uupdate, but there's no special reason to omit it)
<ember> persia: it's useful, i used it a lot with other gnome- stuff
<persia> I also thought that you needed to define DEB_PYTHON_SYSTEM when using CDBS for python packaging.
<ember> i didn't know about that, RainCT point me
<persia> http://wiki.debian.org/DebianPython/NewPolicy
<persia> That's all I see from a quick glance, but as I said, it's not a proper review.
<ember> You will have to set DEB_PYTHON_SYSTEM to "pycentral" or "pysupport" before the CDBS include directives.
<RainCT> persia: DEB_PYTHON_SYSTEM is only necessary if you use python-distutils.mk, but ember is calling dh_pycentral directly
<ember> yap only with python-distutils.mk
<RainCT> ember: does the application have a setup.py?
<ember> RainCT: no
<RainCT> ok, then you're doing it right (afaik) :)
<persia> RainCT: Thanks for the correction.
<persia> ember: I really don't know much about python packaging: for python, it's usually best to assume I may be mistaken if you've previously heard otherwise.
<RainCT> k0p: I'm happy with everything except the .desktop and menu files :P
<ember> persia: i don't much either, about the python part of hamster i was looking as example the deskbar-applet package
<RainCT> k0p: first, I'm not sure wheter it really makes sense to have the entry in Network/Communications (for Debian) - at least, I'd never look there for a network scanner :P; just Network is probably better
<slytherin> ember: have you looked at their packaging>?
<slytherin> ember: I mean the packaging that hamster upstream provides.
<RainCT> k0p: and then there's that root issue.. do you know if upstream is working on improving that (eg, using policykit or whatever)? if they are it's OK for me to have two entries, but I'd also add an "(as root)" entry to debian/menu
<ember> slytherin: yes
<k0p> RainCT, hmm
<RainCT> ScottK: Thanks for looking at Julius :). Is that one with the description the only problem that you found?
<ScottK> RainCT: I only took a glance at the diff.  That's all I found with that level of review.
<k0p> RainCT, about desktop files
<k0p> ok I'll change section.
<k0p> RainCT, what is about policykit?
<slytherin> persia: can you verify and ack bug 251973?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 251973 in libjaxp1.2-java "Please remove the package from repositories" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/251973
<k0p> RainCT, i'm reading. no way.
<k0p> RainCT, it doesn't working on policykit yet
<k0p> RainCT, how I add another entry in debian/menu?
<RainCT> k0p: if upstream is going to change the application so that it won't be necessary to run it as root anymore somewhen soon, because if they won't I think the best would be (IMHO) to patch the "non root user" dialog to add a "Run as root" button and have just one menu entry
<RainCT> k0p: just duplicate the text in it, I think
<k0p> RainCT, some scans could be done without root previligiues.
<persia> slytherin: Do you need it night now, or can it wait 7-8 hours?
<slytherin> persia: can wait.
<k0p> RainCT, so we can't patch the dialog.
<persia> slytherin: On the RSN list then
<k0p> RainCT, we need to accept both options.
<RainCT> k0p: of course we can: [Run as root] [Continue as $user]
<k0p> oh.
<k0p> but how I do (Run as root) ?
<RainCT> k0p: as buttons on the dialog. but nevermind, I won't complain unless someone other does
<k0p> RainCT, wait.
<RainCT> k0p: python-gnome2-extras
<k0p> I want undertand, if we can do that
<RainCT> k0p: has pygtk2.sudo
<k0p> soren, another depedencies?
<RainCT> so you can do something like:   import pygtk2; pygtk2.sudo('umit'); sys.exit(0)
<k0p> hmm
<k0p> in the dialog?
<k0p> RainCT, I like idea.
<RainCT> k0p: :). Do you know Python?
<k0p> yeap
<k0p> but I don't know about sudo.
<soren> k0p: Huh?
<k0p> RainCT, So can you wait some minutes?
<k0p> pygtk2.sudo*
<k0p> sorry
<k0p> I don't know about pygtk2.sudo.
<k0p> I dind't*
<RainCT> k0p: you can test it in an interactive session
<k0p> my english is so bad. :\
<slytherin> Shouldn't a url of this form https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/intrepid/+source/electric redirect to https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/electric. First url shows no bugs while the second one does.
<k0p> RainCT, I'm hacking :D
<k0p> btw if how verify if I have UID = 0?
<k0p> ok
<k0p> I'll see in the code
<k0p> :D
<ember> persia: thanks for the quick review, i've fixed the issues you mentions, but i'm leaving the watch file with uupdate.
<RainCT> k0p: if you have, the dialog won't be shown
<k0p> hmm I don't need it lol.
<k0p> RainCT, I'll patch dialog.
<k0p> and put two buttons
<k0p> RainCT, sounds nice for you?
<RainCT> k0p: yeah; that's what I was suggesting :)
<k0p> give me some minutes. :D
<ember> RainCT: when you're done with k0p and still have time take another look at hamster-applet.
<k0p> ember, oh my friend :D
<ember> heh.
<k0p> i'll hack in the while.
<RainCT> ember: uscan warning: In watchfile debian/watch, reading webpage http://ftp.gnome.org/pub/GNOME/sources/hamster-applet/1/ failed: 404 Not Found
<RainCT> ember: full message http://paste.ubuntu.com/35113/plain/
<ember> RainCT: that's because of odd numbers, its misses the number 3 for 2.23 development releases as hamster just got into gnome and the only release is 2.23
<RainCT> ember: ah. afaik you can't use wildcards/regex in the URL (only for the filename)
<RainCT> ember: btw, I've just seen that there's an ITP for it, http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=477972   are you in contact with Tim?
<ubottu> Debian bug 477972 in wnpp "ITP: hamster-applet -- Time tracking applet for GNOME" [Wishlist,Open]
<ember> RainCT: sorry. Most of gnome package uses that scheme of regex
<ember> to retrieve only stable updates and etc
<RainCT> ember: what I mean is that the watch file won't work if there's a regex in the URL, except for the filename (ie, downloadsite.com/(?:[0-9]+)/file-(.*)\.tar\.gz won't work; you have to use something like project.site.com/download.php download.site.com/(?:[0-9]+)/file-(.*)\.tar\,.gz instead)
<RainCT> (unless I'm missing something)
<RainCT> anyway, I'm away now. cya
<persia> Actually, both formats work if directory display is enabled.
<RainCT> really? that's nice :)
<ember> RainCT: work, that one isn't working because of the missing 3. You can take as example many of other gnome packages
<k0p> RainCT, later you review my package?
<RainCT> k0p: yep
<ember> libbonoui as example
<ember> vte etc etc.
<k0p> RainCT, can I put a awser dialog?
<k0p> Do you want run as root or conitnue as user?
<k0p> something like that
<slytherin> LucidFox: around?
<LucidFox> yes
<RainCT> o, I didn't know that... I guess I can rewrite some of my watch files now
<LucidFox> congratulations, by the way!
<dpm> RainCT: in case you're still trying to do that, I've answered your question regarding the gmo files
<RainCT> k0p: as long as it works and the buttons are "Runas  root" and something else (ie, not Yes/No), I'm happy
<ember> RainCT: heh, try adding a 3 on the watch file and run uscan, i've fixed on the revu but as soon as it get into Debian it will be gone as Debian only do stable
<k0p> RainCT, why not yes/no button? :S
<RainCT> k0p: check the HIG :P
<k0p> RainCT, hmm
<k0p> RainCT, let me check STOCK buttons
<slytherin> LucidFox: thanks. Can you please find some time for 'electric' upload?
<RainCT> dpm: Where? Seems like I didn't get the answer
<k0p> RainCT, so
<k0p> RainCT, I can't use a dialog :/
<LucidFox> let me check
<k0p> I need make callbacks etc etc blah
<tbielawa> hello everybody!
<tbielawa> *hugs*
<tuxmaniac> tbielawa:
<dpm> RainCT: on PM, but you are currently marked as absent there. Can you join #softcatala? I guess it'll be easier there
<RainCT> dpm: For some reason I can't connect to irc.gimp.org :/
<tuxmaniac> dholbach: that was quick :-)
<dholbach> :)
<k0p> RainCT, need gtk.STOCK icons too the buttons? :S
<SolarWar> i have a package that has two advocates, but would like to make a minor change to the control file (add the homepage)- would i need two advocates again?
<SolarWar> after imake the change/
<slayton> when building a deb can you make it trigger a restart after installation? if so how?
<k0p> RainCT, pygtk2.sudo don't exists :S
<LucidFox> slytherin> I can't find electric on REVU
<LucidFox> is it somewhere else? (sorry for a stupid question)
<slytherin> LucidFox: It is upgrade. Let me find the bug.
<LucidFox> Off topic: http://www.leftmind.net/random/linuxbloat.jpg
<slytherin> LucidFox: bug 242720
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 242720 in electric "[New Upstream Release] Electric has released 8.06" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/242720
<LucidFox> Okay, looking
<tuxmaniac> slytherin: thanks for keeping in mind that bug :-)
<slytherin> ï»¿persia: there are too many java package failures on powerpc. Looks like some problem in default-jdk-builddep. The failures seem to be of sort - can not fine binary javac. Some problem with default-jdk-builddep.
<LucidFox> slytherin> Why don't you add the LP: #xxx yourself?
<LucidFox> just reupload the debdiff
<LucidFox> * diff.gz
<RainCT> k0p: it's in python-gnome2-extras
<RainCT> k0p: and it's gksu2, not pygkt2
<k0p> RainCT, hmm
<k0p> hardy too?
<k0p> oh!
<RainCT> k0p: ^
<k0p> lol
<k0p> this make sense! :D
<slytherin> LucidFox: have no time. :-(
<LucidFox> Okay, I'll correct, although it's as simple as gunzipping the diff, correcting and gzipping it again :)
<k0p> RainCT, it crash other application .. hmm it's weird
 * sistpoty|work heads home... cya
<slytherin> LucidFox: make sure you do thorough review. The app was using C previously now it is using java.
<LucidFox> o_O
<k0p> RainCT, done! :D
<LucidFox> greeeeeeeeat....
<LucidFox> ...and the 14MB jar is downloading...
 * k0p patching!
<NCommander> hey RainCT
<k0p> RainCT, there?
<LucidFox> slytherin> commented on electric
<slytherin> LucidFox: checking, but don't expect any activity for next 2 days.
<k0p> RainCT, can you review now?
<slytherin> LucidFox: that is lot of comments. Will work on weekend.
<RainCT> k0p: yep
<k0p> RainCT, I put a dialog, remove root desktop, and add depends.
<k0p> and fix section on menu
<slytherin> LucidFox: What is java-wrappers?
<LucidFox> http://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/java-wrappers
<RainCT> k0p: awesome :D
<k0p> RainCT, really?
<RainCT> k0p: adovcated and commented with a last complaint :P
<k0p> RainCT, can you complaint before? :P
<k0p> thanks dude :)
<k0p> RainCT, btw do you think that can reject package?
<k0p> DktrKranz, there?
<DktrKranz> k0p, dinner time now, I'll catch it later ;)
<k0p> DktrKranz, you need advocate again later .. sorry dude :\
<k0p> it's 3th time .. but I need it.
<k0p> bon-apetit DktrKranz :)
<directhex> is "(Closes: #494123, LP:255683)" the correct structure for bi-dist Closes: ?
<sebner> directhex: LP: #blabla
<directhex> sebner, "LP #blabla" definitely won't get parsed by debian's infrastructure? i thought "#blabla" would be
<RainCT> k0p: I'm not sure
<RainCT> directhex: is the bug on Launchpad or on bugs.debian.org?
<directhex> RainCT, both!
<RainCT> directhex: if the upload is for Ubuntu only include the LP bug number then
<RainCT> directhex: that's documented somewhere on the wiki
<k0p> RainCT, what?
<RainCT> k0p: you asked if that can cause a rejection
<k0p> oh sure.
<k0p> RainCT, what do you advise me?
<RainCT> k0p: to fix that :P
<k0p> ok
<k0p> RainCT, do you will adovcate me again, right?
<k0p> ever same story...
<RainCT> k0p: sure
<RainCT> lol
<k0p> I gain one. I lost ..
<k0p> I'll nver get 2
<k0p> lol
<k0p> RainCT, do you know some package to see python licence? I see a package that have all python licence in debian.
<k0p> so I copy the licence from there.
<RainCT> k0p: in msgfmt.py
<RainCT> k0p: just copy the licence from there
<k0p> RainCT, sure.
<k0p> give me a second.
<k0p> RainCT, uploading.
<k0p> RainCT, can you advocate again?
<RainCT> k0p: done
<k0p> RainCT, thanks
<k0p> :)
<Kopfgeldjaeger> DktrKranz: got some time today? ;) (sorry for bothering you)
<dx9s_work> I just added some info to launchpad.net about HOW a patch (that is available in Hardy) is breaking (or better said, crippling) suPHP -> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/suphp/+bug/253268
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 253268 in suphp "php5-cgi not working with suphp in Hardy " [Undecided,New]
<DktrKranz> Kopfgeldjaeger, some ;)
<k0p> DktrKranz, do you will review my package? :)
<DktrKranz> k0p, work in progress ;)
<k0p> :D:D
<k0p> tks :)
<Kopfgeldjaeger> I updated gtkhash and now have got one advocate (norsetto). One left ;d
<DktrKranz> Kopfgeldjaeger, so... pretty ready already ;)
<Kopfgeldjaeger> yeah :)
<fabrice_sp> Hi.  apachelogger is getting this warning " manpage-has-bad-whatis-entry usr/share/man/man1/mm.1.gz " when building mountmanager package (http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=mountmanager). But I am not able to get this error. Can someone try to build it and see if he gets this error? Thanks!
<Caesar> Hi, I was wondering if I could get sponsorship for #255819 please?
<Laney> Caesar: Is it fixed in intrepid?
<DktrKranz> bug 255819
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 255819 in slack "prerm will rm -rf / when /etc/slack.conf is empty" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/255819
<DktrKranz> rm -rf / ???  OMG!
<k0p> :o
<DktrKranz> k0p, 2nd advocation \o/
<k0p> finally :D
<k0p> DktrKranz, so what I need to do now?
<DktrKranz> k0p, nothing... I'll do next step myself
<Laney> :O
<k0p> DktrKranz, so umit will stay in intrepid?
<k0p> or now it will to archives and will approve by others?
<DktrKranz> probably
<k0p> hmm
<k0p> ok
<DktrKranz> it will go through NEW queue waiting for archive-admin review
<k0p> ok
<DktrKranz> uploading
<k0p> DktrKranz, so now I can't do nothing more, right?
<DktrKranz> k0p, you could do once in Intrepid
<Laney> Nice one k0p
<Laney> \o/
<Laney> If anyone has time for a review, I've got http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=goocanvasmm up that needs eyes. It should be fairly simple, I hope...
<DktrKranz> Kopfgeldjaeger, your turn :)
<k0p> Laney, tks
<k0p> DktrKranz, do once in Intrepid? what sorry?
<Laney> k0p: More updates
<DktrKranz> Caesar, did you already request a sync from unstable for slack?
<k0p> Laney, like new packages?
<Laney> k0p: No, changes to umit
<k0p> oh sure.
<Laney> As in, there's nothing to do now until it's in the archive
 * Kopfgeldjaeger is too stupid to interpret DktrKranz' hint
<k0p> DktrKranz, thanks for help dude :D
<DktrKranz> k0p, just landed in NEW, now just wait
<DktrKranz> Kopfgeldjaeger, I'll review soon... icecream now ;)
<Kopfgeldjaeger> aah, ok ;d
<Kopfgeldjaeger> Laney: some upstream authors have 2 spaces between their names and their mail adresses, some others only one (i know, very cosmetical ;p )
<Laney> Kopfgeldjaeger: Hah, I grepped that from the news file
<k0p> DktrKranz,:)
<Laney> shall change
<Kopfgeldjaeger> Laney: and I think the NEWS file should already be included automatically by cdbs (see debhelper.mk). Maybe you could use it as upstream changelog (DEB_INSTALL_CHANGELOGS_ALL)
<Laney> Kopfgeldjaeger: Yeah, I had that line because otherwise all the other junk documentation gets installed automatically
<Laney> Like the useless AUTHORS and README file
<Kopfgeldjaeger> DEB_INSTALL_DOCS_ALL =(newline here) would empty the var
<RainCT> fabrice_sp: are you running lintian against the .deb?
 * Kopfgeldjaeger hopes that empty is also a verb
<Kopfgeldjaeger> \o/
<Laney> 'tis
<fabrice_sp> RainCT: yes. I'm running version Lintian v1.24.1~hardy1
<Laney> Kopfgeldjaeger: Would unset DEB_INSTALL_DOCS_ALL work?
<Kopfgeldjaeger> I don't know
 * Laney will try
<Laney> Apparently not
 * Laney shatters the silence
<lukehasnoname> WTF
 * ScottK prepares an indictment against lukehasnoname for the CoC violation of using a forbidden acronym.
<laga> OMGBBQ
<ScottK> lukehasnoname: Kidding about the indictment, but that actual acronym did come up at the Community Council meeting this week.
<laga> ScottK: were there any specific outcomes regarding this acronym?
<DktrKranz> "do not use it on public channel", I guess ;)
<ScottK> I think it was don't aim it at anyone.
 * Laney is aggrieved
<lukehasnoname> WTF is so widespread in online banter, and one great thing about acronyms is their ambiguity. What the flip?
<ScottK> Hey, I don't make this stuff up.
<ScottK> Actually I think that usage is permitted.
<laga> yeah, i'd be like WTF if it wasn't.
<ScottK> I think it's more like "WTF are you doing you blooming idiot.  Go RTFM and don't come back." that they didn't like.
<ScottK> RTFM is, BTW, explicitly not OK.
<crimsun> surely in context.
<lukehasnoname> right, thats for me
<ScottK> I'm not sure what people have against reading fine manuals, but that's just me.
<laga> "read the fine manual" is not OK? well, here's my phone number. call me any time and i'll read it to you.
<ScottK> ;-)
<lukehasnoname> so I'm going to download and install Debian in a few weeks to see how things work on their end, so I can see how much Ubuntu changes it.
<DktrKranz> ah... F stands for Fine? ;)
<lukehasnoname> Then I'm going to download Solaris 10 and see how a REAL OS works :p
<Laney> or fascinating
<laga> i don't like that attitude :(
<ScottK> DktrKranz: As long as you can't prove it doesn't.
 * NCommander loves Solaris, but Linux has better tools ATM for general users
<lukehasnoname> NCommander: I actually haven't used Osol, but I've heard good things. And my *nix experience started with FreeBSD, so I have a fondness for the way they do things.
<NCommander> lukehasnoname, I got started back with FreeBSD 2.2.2 back in the day
<NCommander> Still have my CD and printed manuals
<lukehasnoname> o_O I started with FreeBSD 6.1 and Ubuntu 6.10 and FC4
 * NCommander remembers compiling his kernel to get PPP support so he could use CompuServe's GO PPPCONNECT
<NCommander> I was ... six or seven back then
<NCommander> Then I ran OS/2
<gastoni> If I delete all the files that a .deb installed by hand, would that cause problems in dpkg?
<Laney> yes
<gastoni> so how do I remove a bad .deb, if dpkg is not able of removing it?
<norsetto> gastoni: what bad deb?
<gastoni> one that I made and that I tested :-S
<norsetto> NCommander: any idea why http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=tktreectrl doesn't show as a "need work" !?
<norsetto> gastoni: what is the error?
<NCommander> norsetto, you aren't an MOTU in the eyes of the system
<NCommander> norsetto, did you merge your accounts?
<norsetto> NCommander: thats not me, its pitti, I guess he didn't do that
<NCommander> oh
<NCommander> Tell him to merge accounts
<NCommander> Or bug a REVU admin to mark him a Reviewer
 * norsetto thinks that a system that doesn't recognise pitti as a MOTU should be shot (twice) ;-)
<NCommander> User error
<NCommander> You need to merge with your former life to become an MOTU
<sebner> norsetto: why? pitti can't be motu! he is motu god :P
<NCommander> Without merging, it just a weak halflife
<gastoni> norsetto: the problem is that I added to the "postinst" and "prerm" scripts this command: update-menus
<norsetto> sebner: are you part of the pitti fun club?
<gastoni> norsetto: the system for some reason doesn't have that command, so it can't uninstall it.
<sebner> norsetto: hm ^^ dunno. I'm fan of every motu/archive admin
 * NCommander has no fans ;.;
 * jpds hugs sebner.
 * sebner hugs jpds back :)
<Laney> \o/ NCommander \o/
 * Laney does a one-man mexican wave
<sebner> NCommander: become a motu :P
<NCommander> sebner, I want to be one, but I don't think I've been around enough to survive the process
<norsetto> gastoni: just install menu then
<sebner> NCommander: don't worry ^^ I'm also no motu
<norsetto> gastoni: usually, one would use a test construct (or dh_installmenu) to avoid exactly these kind of problems
<norsetto> gastoni: for instance: if [ -x "`which update-menus 2>/dev/null`" ]; then update-menus ; fi
<gastoni> oooh, thanks for the tip
<norsetto> gastoni: np, if you want to avoid installing menu, you can edit the postinst/prerm which are already installed in your system
<gastoni> norsetto: where do I find them?
<Laney> gastoni: /var/lib/dpkg/info
<gastoni> Great, found them. Thank you norsetto and Laney
<Laney> Welcome
<ffm|sh> How hard would it be for https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/sugar-toolkit/+bug/255850 to occur?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 255850 in sugar-toolkit "Change name to "python-sugar-toolkit"" [Wishlist,Confirmed]
<Laney> ffm|sh: Why did you subscribe the sponsors? There's nothing to sponsor
<ffm|sh> Laney: I'm assuming they need to make the change, right?
<ffm|sh> Laney: alternitively, I could make a sync request, right?
<Laney> I guess it would be a sync+removal request (two separate ones).
<Laney> You'd need to test the new package works and everything though
<Laney> DktrKranz: Can I bug you for a review? I believe you indicated you'd do one earlier...
<DktrKranz> Laney, which package?
<Laney> DktrKranz: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=goocanvasmm
<DktrKranz> Laney, queued, I'll probably have a look later... that "rm -fr /" stuff was bigger priority
<Laney> Right, thanks in advance for your time!
<Laney> 'tis difficult to get reviewers ;)
<DktrKranz> Laney, 150 â¬ per review, sebner is happy to pay the bill for everyone
<sebner> DktrKranz: really? :
<Laney> Now that's a way to contribute to Ubuntu :O
<DktrKranz> sebner, I thought you will ;)
<sebner> DktrKranz: :P
<emgent> lol
<sebner> DktrKranz: I don't even have enough money to pay my reviews :P
 * Laney puts reviewers on the endangered species list
<Laney> Adopt a reviewer for â¬10/month
<DktrKranz> Laney, "will review for food"
<ffm|sh> ffm@merlin:~$ requestsync -s -n -k 5649E681 python-sugar-toolkit intrepid
<ffm|sh> curl: (7) couldn't connect to host
<ffm|sh> python-sugar-toolkit doesn't appear to exist in Debian.
<Laney> Will you send me a postcard once a year?
<ffm|sh> Laney: Any idea why it'd be doing that?
<ffm|sh> Laney: Cause the package exists.
<Laney> The page you asked doesn't exist. However it looks like you were trying to look for `python-sugar-toolkit' binary package. The Package Tracking System is source based, therefore you should have looked for `sugar-toolkit'.
<Laney> ffm|sh: ^
<sebner> gn8 folks
<Laney> ffm|sh: Have you tested it works?
<Laney> nn sebner
<ffm|sh> Laney: ah.
<Caesar> DktrKranz: I'm in the process of doing that now
<ffm|sh> ffm@merlin:~$ requestsync -s -k 5649E681 sugar-toolkit intrepid
<ffm|sh> curl: (7) couldn't connect to host
<ffm|sh> sugar-toolkit doesn't appear to exist in Debian.
<DktrKranz> Caesar, np... I already sponsored your version in hardy-proposed and requested the sync. Many thanks for the tip :)
<ffm|sh> Laney: Still borked...
<Caesar> DktrKranz: oh, okay, I won't request a sync then
<Caesar> I tried using requestsync earlier, but it fails because rmadison fails because qa.debian.org is down
<RoAkSoAx> heya guys, got a question, when requesting an update of a package for a new upstream release, should it be suscribed to u-u-s for example?
<jpds> ffm|sh: Several Debian machines are down thanks to a subnet ourage.
<Laney> RoAkSoAx: Yes, *after* the fix is uploaded to the beug
<Laney> (.diff.gz in this case)
<ffm|sh> jpds: Ah.
<DktrKranz> Caesar, I had similar issues, so I filed a sync request by hand. BTW, do you plan to ask a freeze exception soon for Lenny?
<ffm|sh> In other news, is it easy/hard to do debian package development on an ubuntu system?
<directhex> ffm|sh, learn about schroot
<Caesar> DktrKranz: already done, and its been accepted
<directhex> ffm|sh, and using more than one base.tgz in pbuilder
<DktrKranz> cool
<RoAkSoAx> Laney, so for example, should i suscribe this:  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/event-rpc/+bug/255853 ??
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 255853 in event-rpc "Please update event-rpc to 1.00" [Wishlist,Confirmed]
<directhex> ffm|sh, i've done debian packages on ubuntu before. typically, make it for intrepid, then clean up ubuntisms
<Laney> RoAkSoAx: Yes, if you want it to be sponsored
<RoAkSoAx> Laney, ok cool thanks :)
<Laney> ffm|sh: There usually aren't that many problems porting, hence why we can sync the bulk of our packages. But you should still test on a real Debian installation (VM is fine) to be sure.
<Laney> (or schroot/whatever for console apps)
<apachelogger> fabrice_sp: run lintiang on the debfile
<fabrice_sp> apachelogger: I can find lintiang. How can I install it?
<apachelogger> apt-get install lintian ;-)
<fabrice_sp> o sea que es lintian y no lintiang :-)
<jpds> fabrice_sp: La verdad es que... no.
<fabrice_sp> Sorry for the spanish. to many chats...
<fabrice_sp> apachelogger: I ran lintian on the deb, and I did'nt get this error (only empty directories)
<apachelogger> hm
<apachelogger> maybe it's intrepid lintian only
<fabrice_sp> the version of lintian in intrepid is 1.24.2. I'm using 1.24.1, so I have to update my version. I'll try with newer one. Thanks
<fabrice_sp> apachelogger: Tried with lintian 1.24.2, and I don't get this error in mm.1 manpage....
<DktrKranz> Kopfgeldjaeger, advocated
<Kopfgeldjaeger> thanks a bunch :)
<DktrKranz> on its way to NEW...
<Laney> yahoo
<Laney> !
<DktrKranz> done... Laney, your turn now ;(
<DktrKranz> erm.... ;)
<Laney> DktrKranz: Hooray! You're a sponsoring star you know
<DktrKranz> not really...
<DktrKranz> mh, gnome-panel is definitely buggy tonight...
<Laney> Sure you are, anyone who takes the time to do reviews deserves recognition for it
<DktrKranz> I try to be useful for someone, that's enough
<RainCT> DktrKranz: Can you have a look at http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=julius while you are at it? (After Laney, of course) :)
<DktrKranz> what time is it? gnome-clock is buggy too...
<Laney> 22.50 BST
<DktrKranz> it can't be 21:56 CEST!
<jpds> Thu Aug  7 22:50:29 BST 2008
<DktrKranz> what the ...
<DktrKranz> 23:50 cest, and it says 21:56 ?!?!?
<jpds> DktrKranz: Use NTP.
<DktrKranz> I use it!
<jpds> DktrKranz: local server to update / manual ntpdate?
<huats> hey everyone
<huats> I have one question
<huats> I am trying for the first  time to use pbuilder hooks...
<tbielawa> hello
<huats> does anyone can help me a bit ?
<DktrKranz> jpds, I'll try to switch to a different server, this one in Turin seems broken, or doesn't like latest GNOME
<huats> I am trying to run the B01debuildtest from revu-tools...
<tbielawa> huats, have you don't any searching online about them or are you having trouble working with them?
<jpds> DktrKranz: http://www.pool.ntp.org/zone/it
<huats> tbielawa: I have done some searching but couldn't find  any interesting stuffs (from my point of view of someone who don't know to use it)
<tbielawa> huats, what happens when you run B01debuildtest? what were you expecting to happen?
<k0p> DktrKranz, when a packaged is archived is no way to make anothers fixes?
<huats> tbielawa: the thing is I don't know how to use it :)
<Laney> I think it'll unarchive if you upload another revision k0p
<Laney> But you can't make any more changes to umit now until it's in the archive.....!
<Laney> (at least, not easily)
<k0p> Laney, after it in archive, can I change a little?
<DktrKranz> k0p, better wait and fix directly in Intrepid
<k0p> or its finally ?
<Laney> You can file bugs and attach debdiffs for whatever you want after then
<Laney> just like any other package
<RainCT> Laney: for changes in umit you've to wait until it passes new and then create a bug report, attach a debdiff to it and subscribe ubuntu-universe-sponsors
<RainCT> bah :P
<Laney> haha
<k0p> sure
 * RainCT goes back to break REVU ;)
<Laney> RainCT: Not until I've had my review damn it!
<k0p> So now wait, after that I can public fixes on Interpid right?
<Laney> k0p: After then it's just like any other package
<DktrKranz> RainCT, wait! I'll grab Laney's package first!
<RainCT> DktrKranz, Laney: don't worry, I've to break it locally first :P
<k0p> Laney, sure :D
<k0p> thanks for the help :)
<DktrKranz> RainCT, naaaaaah... broke it on production
<tbielawa> huats, have you tried anything? I haven't used it's hooks too extensively but I imagine that using the --hooksdir option and having the B01debuildtest in the folder you point to should be a start
 * Laney slaps launchpad
<tbielawa> huats, try that and then put the result in the pastebin if anything happens or doesn't happen
<Laney> Why can't I find the queues :(
<DktrKranz> Laney, which one?
<Laney> DktrKranz: I'm looking for hardy-proposed, but I'd like to be able to find them in general
<huats> tbielawa: that is what I tryed
<DktrKranz> Laney, https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/hardy/+queue?queue_state=1&queue_text=
<huats> but the thing is that I don't know if it is called...
<huats> that is what I want to be sure...
<Laney> DktrKranz: That's the one, but where is the link to it?
<jfcgauss1> how can i get a maintainer to package wesnoth 1.4.4 (right now we have 1.4) ? :)
<DktrKranz> Laney, launchpad.net/ubuntu, choose hardy, then choose "show uploads" on the right
<Laney> jfcgauss1: File a bug for it and tag it "upgrade"
<Laney> DktrKranz: Nice one, got it now
<Laney> jfcgauss1: Actually you don't need to, we have bug #
<Laney> bug #252287 which will get it already (sorry for the enter)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 252287 in wesnoth "Please sync wesnoth 1:1.4.4-2 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/252287
<Laney> Hey, why didn't he get that sync request ACKed?
<Laney> tsk tsk...
<tbielawa> huats, you'll need to find the script you want to be executed and give the path to it.
<tbielawa> once you do that put the result in pastebin and send that to us
 * NCommander wonders how he got into debugging dak ...
<jfcgauss1> thx
<DktrKranz> Laney, since it's a library, it will take me more time, I'll probably have a better look tomorrow
<Laney> DktrKranz: OK, in your own time. I used the examples that came with it to verify that it was working properly, btw
<DktrKranz> library has a strange naming, though
<Laney> Lintian told me to name it that
<Laney> i had libgoocanvasmm0 first
<DktrKranz> O.T. shame on you, gnome-panel!
<DktrKranz> strange SONAMEs then?
<Laney> Must be
<Laney> laney@chicken:~/dev/ubuntu/packaging/goocanvasmm/usr/lib$ objdump -x libgoocanvasmm-0.1.so.2 | grep SONAME SONAME      libgoocanvasmm-0.1.so.2
<DktrKranz> bah...
<DktrKranz> but that's how it should be named
<Laney> So it's alright?
<DktrKranz> package name is correct
<Laney> \o/
 * Laney bows down to lintian
<DktrKranz> http://www.netfort.gr.jp/~dancer/column/libpkg-guide/libpkg-guide.html has some useful info to package libraries
<Laney> Yeah, I used that page a bit
<RainCT> http://rainct.homelinux.net/revu/uploads.py?user=rainct - suggestions?
<Laney> RainCT: Can you add an anchor to each comment and link to it from that page?
<Laney> package=pyclamd#commentX
<k0p> RainCT, do you male revu website?
<k0p> make*
<RainCT> k0p: I'm one of the devs, yea. (siretart and sistpoty and NCommander are the other ones)
<k0p> :)
<RainCT> Laney: I'll do :)
<NCommander> huh what?
<k0p> nice
<RainCT> NCommander: that you should finish the PPA Importer :P
<NCommander> It's done
<NCommander> I've just been lazy on merging it
<RainCT> xD
<NCommander> I have to merge the openid and mako branches into it :-/
<RainCT> NCommander: right, that will be funny :)
<NCommander> Might just be easier to rm -r that source and start again
<NCommander> (considering I can do things now that I couldn't do before)
<RainCT> it's your code..
#ubuntu-motu 2008-08-08
<timothywcrane> is there anyone in here who can upload Sauerbraten fixes? No updates without the fix, all have updates. Fix on launchpad board. I admit I am begging.
<NCommander> RainCT, ping?
<RainCT> NCommander: pong
<NCommander> RainCT, if I roll the sauerbraten fixes, will you upload?
<RainCT> NCommander: what changes are it?
<NCommander> I'm looking for the patch now
<NCommander> gtg
<RainCT> NCommander: Doesn't he mean bug 252037, which has to be processed by a core dev?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 252037 in sauerbraten-data "sauerbraten cannot upgrade" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/252037
<RainCT> Laney: (it's on production now, with anchor)
<RainCT> good night
<slangasek> in a cdbs package, how can I ensure that reverse-patches is only ever called after make distclean in the clean target?
<slangasek> google search seems to think that this is the default behavior for cdbs simple-patchsys
<RAOF> I thought the default behaviour was to reverse-patches _before_ running the clean target.
<slangasek> that's not what https://wiki.duckcorp.org/DebianPackagingTutorial/CDBS says, for instance; and it's not a sane default either way :P
<slangasek> ah, behavior was changed in bug #387103
<slangasek> great, so to support tarball-in-tarball, they've instead broken being able to patch build systems via simple-patchsys
 * slangasek exudes nothing but love in the direction of simple-patchsys
<StevenK> In the form of a rusty knife?
<slangasek> StevenK: I was thinking "hepatitis C cultures", but ok
<StevenK> Haha
<StevenK> So, a rusty syringe
<slangasek> heh, and there's a follow-up to that bug from pitti that was never acknowledged, awesome
<slangasek> oh, there are also follow-ups from /me/ to that bug :)
<StevenK> Hah
 * slangasek considers unarchiving and reopening the bug
 * slangasek also considers what the heck he's going to do in the short term to get libgweather working right
<StevenK> slangasek: Ah, I was wondering.
<slangasek> StevenK: yes, I'm not touching either cdbs or simple-patchsys by choice :-P
<tbielawa> hello to all
 * slangasek waves
<tbielawa> :)
<slangasek> makefile-clean:: apply-patches
<slangasek> include /usr/share/cdbs/1/rules/simple-patchsys.mk
<slangasek> clean::
<slangasek>         make -f debian/rules cleanbuilddir
<slangasek> CHEMICAL.  FIRE.
<slangasek> <ahem>
<StevenK> Haha
<slangasek> so to work around simple-patchsys brokenness, we do: unpatch; patch; distclean; unpatch
<slangasek> \o/
<StevenK> Ha
<StevenK> Which poor CDBS maintainer is going to feel your wrath?
<slangasek> do I really have to pick only one? ;)
 * StevenK grins
<slangasek> oh, hah; even better, bug #424080 was fixed with a change that eliminated the reason for the bug #387103 change
<emgent> slangasek: the true fire is bug 255819
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 255819 in slack "prerm will rm -rf / when /etc/slack.conf is empty" [Critical,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/255819
<emgent> :)
<StevenK> Ha!
<slangasek> ... clever
<slangasek> this is why I never install anything with "slack" in its name
<emgent> hahaha
<emgent> old Legend.. Devian Vs Slackware
<emgent> s/Devian/Debian/
<sharms> if I want to build a package for intrepid but the clean script will fail on hardy, is there a way to tell pbuilder to skip calling make clean?
<RAOF> sharms: Build the source package in an Intrepid chroot?
<sharms> I was hoping to just get away with a pdebuild command
<sharms> some flag like --do-make-clean-in-pbuilder-chroot
<RAOF> Hm... dpkg-buildpackage -nc doesn't run the clean target, IIRC.
<slangasek> which can be used only in conjunction with -b or -B, yes
<sharms> ah ha --use-pdebuild-internal
<sharms> ++to pbuilder docs
<slangasek> RAOF: so, you probably work with cdbs more than I do; aside from the tarball case, is there any reason why one would be /expecting/ reverse-patches to be run before clean?
<slangasek> (before I go patching this behavior away)
<greg-g> I have a build question for someone.  I requested a sync for a lib (liblicense) and LP shows that it has been successfully built for Intrepid, but when clicking on the link under "resulting binaries" gives me a 404
<greg-g> https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/liblicense/0.8-1/+build/686396
<greg-g> is there something I am missing?
<vorian> greg-g: which binary arch?
<greg-g> 386
<vorian> drats, irssi fail
<vorian> i see it greg-g
<vorian> clear your cache maybe?
<greg-g> vorian: from here?  https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/intrepid/i386/liblicense3/0.8-1
<vorian> yes
<greg-g> hmmm
<vorian> greg-g: pm me your email, i'll send you the build log
<RAOF> slangasek: It seems to be the most common behaviour when using debhelper? (the clean: target often depends on unpatch).  I can't think of a technical reason why you'd want that behaviour, though.
<slangasek> RAOF: well, you want clean: to depend on unpatch because 'clean' is the policy-mandated target :)
<slangasek> and in the debhelper case, unpatch is often done before make distclean because you're writing the rules by hand, and you generally aren't patching the build system so don't run into problems doing it this way
<slangasek> and it's the simpler way to do it
<slangasek> but cdbs needs to handle the not-simple cases...
<RAOF> Right.  clean: obviously has to do the unpatching, and in simple cases that's most easily handled by making it a dependency of clean:.  I don't think anyone would _depend_ on that behaviour, though.
<slangasek> RAOF: alrighty, well, patch committed to bzr, and bug being filed upstream :)
<sn9> would putting the kqemu in intrepid into hardy be a backport, or an SRU?
<RAOF> Almost certainly a backport, but it depends on why you'd be putting it in Hardy.
<sn9> the version is unchanged, except for the -ubuntu1 suffix
<sn9> it closes 6 launchpad bugs or so
<RAOF> So there are a bunch of patches applied?  That could be SRU worthy (but would probably be sru'd as a bunch of patches against Hardy's kqemu, not by copying Intrepid's source package).
<sn9> intrepid's source pkg _is_ a bunch of patches against hardy's kqemu
<sn9> at least at this point
<sn9> the only changes at all are to fix the packaging peculiarities inherited from debian
<sn9> RAOF: i imported the intrepid source pkg unchanged into my ppa, but with a hardy target, and installed it from there. works perfectly
<slangasek> erm, no, the changes are implementing new features
<slangasek> * Adding DKMS support
<sn9> that's what closes some of the launchpad bugs
<slangasek> which is fine, but I wouldn't expect that to pass muster for an SRU
<RAOF> Yeah.  Adding DKMS support is hardly going to fix any regressions :)
<RAOF> Looks like you'll want to backport it.
<sn9> ok, i'll file against hardy-backports. since i've already tested it, it's got a head start anyway
<sn9> ubottu: bug 255909
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 255909 in hardy-backports "Please backport kqemu from Intrepid. Thank you." [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/255909
<sn9> seems to me, that request can probably go directly to "Triaged" state, right?
<lifeless> are we debian-sync frozen yet ?
<RAOF> lifeless: Autosync is off, yes.
<persia_> lifeless: In an automated fashion, yes.  Of course, if you've a good reason, manual sync is accepted
<lifeless> new package
<sn9> RAOF: "Triaged" is ok in this case, right?
<lifeless> antlr3 if you are curious
<lifeless> I'm just paging in process
<RAOF> sn9: I don't think you've got the two required "it works" confirmations for the "triaged" state; but see the Backports documentation.
<persia> lifeless: Deadline for new packages is FeatureFreeze (August 28th).  On the other hand, you have to acually want the new package now, as opposed to it being automatically pushed.
<sn9> RAOF: oh, it needs two? "Confirmed" then?
<RAOF> !backports > sn9
<ubottu> sn9, please see my private message
<RAOF> I'm not sure what the correct status is; but backports use the statuses to mean specific things.  See the doucmentation.
<sn9> i did -- that's why i said "Triaged"
<RAOF> Hm.  Then ignore me :)
<sn9> slangasek: should i ignore RAOF? :)
<RAOF> That documentation is authoratative; my memory of it is not :)
<lifeless> hmm, its already in intrepid, now that I get around to checking all my facts
<lifeless> so its really easy to sync :>
<lifeless> (as in not-needed)
<persia> lifeless: rmadison is your friend :)
<lifeless> persia: yes, but its so damn slow
<sn9> RAOF: hmm, seems one needs to be an admin to set "Triaged"
<lifeless> $ time rmadison  antlr3
<lifeless> real    0m3.193s
<lifeless> $ time apt-cache madison
<lifeless> real    0m0.027s
<persia> Yes, but that only covers your local apt-cache: not so ideal if you're running hardy.
<lifeless> persia: huh? just add all suites you want to sources.list as deb-src
<lifeless> $ time apt-cache madison antlr3
<lifeless>     antlr3 | 3.0.1+dfsg-2 | http://archive.ubuntu.com intrepid/universe Sources
<lifeless>     antlr3 | 3.0.1+dfsg-2 | http://ftp.au.debian.org sid/main Sources
<lifeless> real    0m0.519s
<persia> lifeless: I suppose, although that can be confusing with trivial use of apt-get source if there is unexpected version skew.
<persia> (and yes, there are ways around that too)
<lifeless> like putting your distro's version at the top of sources.list :P
<persia> Well, no, that's insufficient.  If the versions are the same, it will pull from the top, but if a lower entry has a newer version, it will pull that instead unless you set priorities for the sources.
<persia> This distinction is unlikely to be important for intrepid, but can be useful if e.g. Debian has a new upstream version and we want to backport some of the fixes to fix our bugs without pulling the new upstream version.
<lifeless> oh hmm
<lifeless> anyhow, yes - but I know to look closely :P
<persia> So, yes, you can set priorities for the sources, and put them all in sources.list, and everything does the right thing (plus you can specify *which* version you want when you pull, which is nice for SRUs).
<lifeless> and often do want to grab newer versions, e.g. to see if a backport will play nice
<persia> On the other hand, I tend to have chroots for each distrorelease I may want, and just call apt-get source foo there to get the right data (without looking closely).  With that workflow, rmadison is more informative (although it does take a few seconds).
<persia> lifeless: Sure.  It entirely depends on one's workflow.  If one tends to be focused on a small number of packages, my model is far too much overhead.
<lifeless> persia: I have chroots too
<lifeless> but they are on my home server which is fairly regularly ETOOFAR
<persia> Right.  I've 16 entries from schroot -l on my laptop, and more on my workstation.  Like I said, perhaps too much overhead.
<kostmo> Hey all, I've put some more work into my pyrocket package - was wondering if any MOTU's are around to advocate? http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?upid=3240
<kostmo> Is anyone on this channel so late?
<NCommander> kostmo, I am, but I'm not an MOTU
<NCommander> Just a REVU admin
<kostmo> any suggestions on the right time of day to find a MOTU here?
<persia> kostmo: It's not late for everyone :p
<persia> MOTU are here all day, every day.
<persia> (There are MOTU from UTC+11 through UTC-7 currently, and more timezones would be welcome)
<kostmo> i c
<persia> Which reminds me: MOTU Meeting in 15 minutes in #ubuntu-meeting !!!
<nxvl> i would say that the channel is more active while i'm sleeping (on europe work tine)
<kostmo> can I pitch my package at the motu meeting? :)
<persia> kostmo: Please don't.
<nxvl> persia: i almost forgot it!
<Hobbsee>  oh noes!  a meeting!
<kostmo> sure
<kostmo> I guess I'm having a difficult time finding interested MOTUs - my package serves a pretty niche function
<persia> kostmo: What does your package do?  Why is it cool?  Why should it be included in Ubuntu?
<Hobbsee> kostmo: most people find that, i think...
<kostmo> My package "pyrocket" is a driver for several of the USB rocket launchers that you might find on ThinkGeek or other novelty shops
<nxvl> heh
<nxvl> geek toys
<kostmo> It exposes a few features of the devices that aren't accessible from the Windows drivers
<StevenK> Haha
<StevenK> kostmo: Such as? :-)
<nxvl> kostmo: persia is a toy lover, but only if can get it out of his pockets and people would say "ooohhhhh!!!"
<nxvl> persia: don't you?
<StevenK> Bwahaha
<persia> I'd definitely be interested in such a device, and *very* interested in the driver.  Unfortunately, I've not seen any of the cube-warfare class of stuff in local shops.
<nxvl> i forgot how HORRIBLE gentoo was
 * nxvl rm -rf vm
<NCommander> nxvl, why are you running gentoo O_o?
<kostmo> For example, on one of the Dream Cheeky launchers, my program allows super fine control of the aiming mechanism, where the bundled Windows application only allows rough positioning
<nxvl> NCommander: just for vm fun
<kostmo> and I have a webcam interface that's begging for some augmentation with computer vision
<NCommander> nxvl, ugh, BTW< the comment about persia's toy will forever be etched into my mind. Just like COBOL77, and brainfuck (also goes by the names MIPS assembler, and dak)
<kostmo> to auto-track your missile targets
<persia> NCommander: See, if you'd actually seen my smallest laptop, it wouldn't be so disturbing :)
<persia> (Sharp 922SH)
<nxvl> heh
 * nxvl love's persia's laptop
<NCommander> persia, my mental image of you now involves a trenchcoat, a hat, and ...
<NCommander> ugh
 * NCommander twichs
 * persia a
 * NCommander hides from persia 
 * persia has the trenchcoat and the hat, even the special trenchcoat liner with extra pockets
<NCommander> Speaking of which, persia , you need to merge your REVU accounts
<nxvl> he doesn't use any case or backpack or nothing, just his belt
<persia> NCommander: Why?  I already have too high a number in statistics.
<NCommander> persia, I guess you don't miss your reviewer status ;-)
<persia> nxvl: I don't wear a belt: pockets always win
<kostmo> persia, as an advocate, I suppose you would want to be able to run the program with the device yourself?
<nxvl> heh
<nxvl> ok
<persia> NCommander: I'm an admin: I fixed that with a sledgehammer when I discovered it.
<nxvl> s/belt/where the belt should be/
<nxvl> persia: better?
<NCommander> without context, this conversation would probably persia on some of those predator watch lists
 * NCommander unfixes it, and then modifies REVU's code to reject alter_user.py -n persia ;-)
 * persia wants the sledgehammer back
 * NCommander uses it on persia
<NCommander> Unless of course you vote yes to me becoming a contributator developer so I can get the shiny @ubuntu.com email
<kostmo> I was wondering if maybe I should post a video on youtube of pyrocket in action, since not a lot of MOTU's probably have the hardware themselves
 * persia is amused to note that earthquakes sound like thunder when one is sufficiently close
<persia> Anyway, #ubuntu-meeting is the place to be ...
 * NCommander thinks persia should go AFK, earthwake
<NCommander> persia, when's the next motu meeting?
<persia> NCommander: Now.
<NCommander> wow
<NCommander> Amazing timing I choose to bitch at the right time :-)
<nxvl> ScottK: did you get change to review the merge?
<kostmo> StevenK, are you a MOTU?  I could go into more enticing details about pyrocket if it would generate interest
<nxvl> kostmo: is pyrocket in revu?
<LaserJock> ScottK: you around?
<kostmo> yup: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?upid=3240
<ScottK> nxvl: Patch failed for me again.  Only a little.
<ScottK> LaserJock: Barely.
<nxvl> ScottK: on patching?
<LaserJock> ScottK: nvm then, I've got some questions about matplotlib (maintained by python-modules-team)
<kostmo> btw, I just added support recently for another model - the Striker II USB Laser Guided Missile Launcher
<ScottK> LaserJock: OK.  How about tomorrow.
<LaserJock> ScottK: I can ask another day if you're busy/tired
<LaserJock> ScottK: np
<kostmo> the rockets for Striker II are pretty lame, but at least you get a pan/tilt USB laser pointer
<StevenK> C
<StevenK> Bah
<StevenK> Call me when some Patriot Missle Systems get USB connectivity.
<kostmo> They just had one of these launchers on woot.com
<kostmo> and one guy was asking if they work on linux: http://www.woot.com/Forums/ViewPost.aspx?PostID=2327015&PageIndex=1&ReplyCount=47#post2327044
<kostmo> and yes, they do - but they need my package
<nxvl> kostmo: the pachage has a needs-packaging bug on LP?
<kostmo> nxvl: yes, here: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/242910
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 242910 in ubuntu "[needs-packaging] pyrocket" [Wishlist,In progress]
<kostmo> even though they're kind of random toys, I think having support for them in Linux is a positive thing for linux adoption in general
<kostmo> StevenK, I do have plans in the next release for automatic tracking of targets, if that counts
<kostmo> not quite a Patriot missile, but a step in the right direction
<tgm4883_laptop> Maybe a dumb question, but when doing get-orig-source, should the tar end up the same name as the package name that i'm aiming for in the repo?
<kostmo> This guy has a webcam built into it, if you haven't seen it before: http://dreamcheeky.com/index.php?pagename=product&pid=41
<persia> tgm4883_laptop: It should be $(package-name)_$(version).orig.tar.gz
<tgm4883_laptop> persia, right, so for instance, if I was making mythstream-parser-youtube and the downloaded tar was just named youtube4.tar.gz I would want it to end up as mythstream-parser-youtube_4.orig.tar.gz
 * SolarWar is looking for advocates (http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=qlix) Its a package of an (awesome) GUI application that allows users to sync music to Zunes and other MTP devices 
<persia> tgm4883_laptop: Right.  Note that if you don't need to mangle the tarball manually, uscan will create a symlink for you.
<tgm4883_laptop> persia, awesome, thanks
<kostmo> I'm wondering if I would need to find a MOTU with USB rocket launcher hardware in order to advocate pyrocket?
<SolarWar> kostmo, i don't think advocators care about whether the software works, just that the packaging adheres to standards
<persia> SolarWar: Well, it's supposed to be both, although testing is typically minor.
<SolarWar> i see
<emgent> moin
<slangasek> I'm trying to decide whether SolarWar is trolling me
<SolarWar> hrm?
<slangasek> SolarWar: "advocators don't care if the software works" :)
<kostmo> actually I was wondering what degree of responsibility MOTU's do have for the functionality of the package
<SolarWar> slangasek, did you mention something to contrary earlier? I was afk for a bit
<SolarWar> :)
<SolarWar> slangasek, i think it would be fairly difficult to test packages that require certain hardware, whether its rocket launchers or MTP devices
<slangasek> SolarWar: no, I didn't; I'm just musing to myself whether you're trolling, since I'm predisposed to flying into a rage at people who don't take responsibility for the quality of packages that they upload :)
<persia> SolarWar: Generally we like to have at least one good test report from a MOTU, or several good test reports from non-MOTU.
<persia> In the case of awkward hardware, there is sometimes a call for testers (one example would be a new DVB app in hardy)
<kostmo> is it appropriate to post requests for MOTU advocates or testers on the motu mailing list?
<persia> kostmo: We prefer not for advocates.  If you've one advocate on the packaging, and can't find a tester, that would be appropriate.
<SolarWar> slangasek, I didn't know that about your personality :) good to know- by quality of packages you don't mean the packaging itself, but the upstream software right?
<slangasek> SolarWar: I mean that the package as a cohesive whole should be usable... :)
<slangasek> (and integrate well with the system)
<SolarWar> (also- i didn't mean to troll, no one who has commented on my package has said anything about well the upstream program works, but i welcome bugreports since i'm the author!)
<SolarWar> persia, oh, okay- that sounds fair
<kostmo> so there's the whole "polling" vs. "interrupt" thing that contrasts IRC with the mailing list
<kostmo> it can be quite a time investment to troll for interested MOTUs
<kostmo> and I mean "troll" in a good way
<kostmo> I feel like to catch the attention of someone that might be interested, I would want to repost the same info on IRC at some frequency
<persia> kostmo: Indeed.  The optimum frequency is about every 30 hours, to both hit MOTU in all timezones, and not get below 24 hours (which makes some people refuse to review).
<persia> It's less bad when we have organised REVU Days, but this cycle we've not been very good about organising those.
 * SolarWar has been yelled at for pitching Qlix 
<SolarWar> too often.
<kostmo> \me is glad he is not SolarWar
 * kostmo is a bit new to irc
<SolarWar> i *like* being me
<persia> Each person does best being themselves, and we are each that because of our interactions with each of the rest of us.  Ubuntu.
<kostmo> nice.
<beuno> so, I keep on getting: W: bzr-upload source: native-package-with-dash-version
<beuno> and I can't quite put my finger on what I'm doing wrong
<beuno> any ideas?
<slangasek> is the .orig.tar.gz file missing from your parent directory?
<slangasek> (or misnamed)
<beuno> it's there. It may be misnamed.  It should be the exact name as the parent dir?
<emgent> moin warp10
<warp10> hi emgent
<beuno> slangasek, solved it, thanks  (permissions issues)
<xnevermore> When updating a packaging for a new upstream version, what do I do with the debian patches that are in the previous version package?
<persia> xnevermore: Review them.  Apply those that are still required, or fix useful bugs.  Drop those that are adopted upstream or rendered irrelevant by upstream changes.
<kostmo> I have a question about package maintenance: I know that getting a package initially accepted into Universe requires 2 MOTU advocates.  Once that package is accepted, if the Upstream author releases a new version, how does the repackaged version get accepted back into Universe?
<kostmo> is it 2 motu's each time?
<RAOF> No.
<persia> Someone files a bug asking for a new version, and attaches the updated diff.gz.  That requires one MOTU to sponsor the new version.
<StevenK> kostmo: Nope, just ask for sponsorship
<kostmo> ok, thanks
<persia> Mind you, the testing requirement for new upstreams is usually more strictly enforced, so for a rocket launcher, your choices may be more limited.
<kostmo> persia, which choices do you mean?
<persia> kostmo: choices for sponsors
<TomJaeger> Are there any MOTUs around that would be willing to review my awesome gesture recognition application?
<TomJaeger> It's very well-received, see http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=837032
<persia> TomJaeger: The URL to the app is likely a more powerful incentive than the URL to comments about it :)
<persia> Also, there's a MOTU Meeting on now, so few people are likely to review.
<kostmo> I was especially curious about the sponsorship requirements - because I'm wearing both hats - as the upstream developer and the packager - I have some really cool computer vision stuff in the works for "pyrocket", but I'm trying to decide whether it would be best to get it into the initial version, or a later release
<TomJaeger> Sorry, didn't know about the meeting.
<TomJaeger> Anyway, the website of the app: http://easystroke.wiki.sourceforge.net/#content
<persia> TomJaeger: And the REVU link?
<kostmo> persia, your suggestion to TomJaeger brings a question to mind for me - would polling Ubuntu Forums for user interest in "pyrocket" make a persuasive argument for MOTU advocacy?
<persia> kostmo: Not pursuasive, although it may help with the testing requirement if no MOTU has the hardware.
<TomJaeger> It's on top of this list: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=easystroke
<persia> There you go :)  Now anyone who isn't busy in the meeting can get to a place to do the review with one click.
<kostmo> so MOTU's are unswayed by the din of the masses
<ajmitch> kostmo: I've heard they're more easily swayed by bribes
<kostmo> I have some high quality USB rocket launchers...
 * kostmo is off to code up a sweet rocket launcher demo to win MOTU favor
<dholbach> good morning
<xnevermore> if I have to alter a dpatch, should I rename it? what other changes do I have to make?
<ScottK> xnevermore: No.  Just document that you've changed it in debian/changelog
<xnevermore> ScottK: do I add a credit to myself in the patch itself?
<ScottK> It's a judgement call.  For a minor change I wouldn't.
<xnevermore> alright. fair enough. thanks
<TomJaeger> persia, your comment still puzzles me.  If I can demonstrate that users like my application and that I stand behind it and listen to my user's concerns, surely that's more important than having a shiny homepage? (Which frankly, I don't because I'd rather spend my time improving the software than with marketing)
<dholbach> hiya nxvl :)
<persia> TomJaeger: Not the homepage: the REVU page.  Having a quick click to review tends to make reviewers more likely to actually perform the review.
<persia> It's not about the application homepage.
<nxvl> dholbach: :D
<persia> Many reviewers will look at an application on it's own merits, rather than looking for a strong userbase, so the interested users may not matter to the reviewer, as long as the application is good and the packaging is done right.
<TomJaeger> well I'd already posted the REVU link a million times, that never accomplished anything
<nxvl> dholbach: time for GBJ is reaching
<nxvl> actually we are on GBJ time NOW
<dholbach> yeah and I look forward to it :)
<dholbach> I'm going to mail all organisers in a bit
<nxvl> i'm very excited about that, i have just been noticed that the Gnome dev, the debian deb, the OOo guy and the kde contributor are going to be there!
<nxvl> it's awesome
<slangasek> "the" Gnome dev?
<StevenK> Isn't that Vincent?
 * StevenK hides
<dholbach> slangasek: you know... the guy who wrote GNOME
<nxvl> heh
<StevenK> The guy who started it doesn't work on it any more
<nxvl> the peruvian gnome dev
<slangasek> oh, we're talking about Peru :)
<nxvl> we have one on each project
<nxvl> one in ubuntu, actually 2 now
<nxvl> one in debian (actually 2 now counting myself)
<nxvl> one in gnome
<slangasek> so "the Debian dev" == Rudy Godoy?
<nxvl> one in KDE, and one in OOo
<nxvl> yup
<slangasek> ah, well, say hi to him for me then. :)
<nxvl> i will!
<nxvl> he's a good friend of mine
<nxvl> the FOSS community in peru is really close and small
<nxvl> slangasek: are you busy or have some time to review a package update?
<slangasek> nxvl: I'm busy trying and failing to detach myself from the computer so I can sleep
<nxvl> heh
<nxvl> :D
<nxvl> i'm on the same problem
<nxvl> :D
<nxvl> but my packages are waiting for me
<nxvl> i've just noticed that augeas released a new version
<TomJaeger> persia, I'd be happy if I had gotten MOTUs interested on "the app's own merit", but that hasn't been the case, so what was I supposed to do?  It seems to me that you don't have the manpower to review every package, so I felt it might be helpful to tout the app a little bit, rather than just being annoying.
<ScottK> persia: Explain.
<NCommander> persia, yup
<persia> TomJaeger: Understood.  This cycle has been incredibly poor for REVU.  At the recent MOTU Meeting, we've had a couple people who might help get REVU working smoothly again, which may help you.
<persia> So, to provide context: I was asked " What do you think about individual maintainers for packages not in Debian.", to which I said I was very strongly against it.
<nxvl> agreed
<nxvl> we don't work that way
<persia> The reasoning for this is that I think we operate best as a team, and one of my favorite things about Ubuntu Development is that we work collaboratively.
<NCommander> But we do have packages that have a Maintainer (@ubuntu.com)
<ScottK> Sure.  It's allowed.
<NCommander> But that doesnt't stop NMUs here
<persia> That said, I've nothing against smaller teams declaring support for a set of packages, but that's different.
<persia> NCommander: Yes, but I don't like that anyway (and we don't even acknowledge the concept of NMU usually)
<persia> Note that there is value to having packages specifically maintained.
<NCommander> I personally don't have an issue with individual maintainers as long as anyone form the MOTU team can update a package
<persia> I think that is best expressed in Ubuntu by subscribing to the package in LP, filing regular update bugs, and working with upstream (documenting this in the bugs),
<persia> If someone is doing a good job of this, others are likely to leave them to it.
<NCommander> So why not mark the maintainer then?
<NCommander> Since that's essentially what they are doing
<persia> Further, if someone has demonstrated expertise in a package or set of packages, others are likely to point to them when an opinion is sought.
<nxvl> NCommander: yes, you can use the maintainer field with your name, but NMU are allowed and don't need special versioning
<NCommander> Right
<persia> NCommander: Because I simply don't see *any* value in marking the maintainer: what is the point?
<nxvl> and people are free to change the maintainer field if they feel like
<NCommander> By having your name in the Maintainer field, it makes it offical your the first person you go to support, and who handles it
<ScottK> persia: My use case is if you want your package in Ubuntu, you have to volunteer to maintain it.
<persia> NCommander: Except that we delete that information from all binary packages.
<persia> ScottK: I don't agree with that: I'd rather have things get in because people are interested, and get dropped if they cannot be maintained.
<NCommander> let me rephrase
<slangasek> persia: well, the possible advantage I see is having a way to flag that a package has ended up de-facto orphaned
<nxvl> ScottK: yes, but it doesn't stop the community to work on your package
<persia> slangasek: We have that: http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/uehs/
<persia> It's a rare case that anything appears on UEHS for long if it isn't orphaned (and yes, that includes packages orphaned in Debian)
<nxvl> ScottK: i have some package with my name in the Maintainer field, but i won't get mad if for example you touch it without asking me first
<ScottK> Agreed.
<NCommander> where do the meeting logs go to?
<persia> nxvl: But someone might.  I don't like the possibility because it may be misinterpreted.
<slangasek> persia: what am I supposed to see here?
<slangasek> the "not in sync with upstream" bit?
<ScottK> It's just a question if you aren't willing to sign up to mind the package, why should I be troubled to upload it.
<persia> NCommander: irclogs.ubuntu.com
<StevenK> Into the depths of mootbot
<nxvl> persia: agreed
<nxvl> persia: but the only thing we can make against it, is specifically say that on a policy or something
<persia> slangasek: Any of the classes: those with no watch file, those not in sync, or those with no upstream checkable.  Note that there are some false posivites in the first and third case, but not so many.
<persia> nxvl: Which means more policy, which I don't like.  More policy raises the bar to participation.
<slangasek> persia: well, it's the false-negatives that concern me
<nxvl> mmm
<persia> slangasek: Packages that appear maintained and aren't?
<nxvl> true
<ScottK> persia: Barriers to useless cruft in the archive are no bug.
<slangasek> persia: suppose someone is an upstream, gets their package sponsored into universe, then disappears
<slangasek> it won't stop being in sync with upstream, but that doesn't mean it's being "maintained" in any useful sese
<persia> ScottK: I don't see it that way at all: not much of what comes through REVU is best classed as "useless cruft", and anything removed in Debian is auto-removed from Ubuntu.
<slangasek> sense
<persia> slangasek: I guess, but is it broken?
<slangasek> well, but ScottK was specifically raising the point of packages that are added to Ubuntu by someone that aren't present in Debian
<StevenK> Actually, I have something that wasn't
<nxvl> persia: but the only case in which i think someone can get mad is while having a strong debian concept in mind
<slangasek> so there's no guarantee that there's anyone /anywhere/ maintaining this package
<slangasek> s/package/software/
<persia> nxvl: As we encourage people to read Debian documentation, that's not at all unlikely.
<nxvl> mmm
<StevenK> Compare 'rmadison -u debian twin' and 'rmadison twin'
<nxvl> true
 * nxvl stops talking
<nxvl> :D
<persia> slangasek: Sure, but maybe it's not broken.  I think broken-ness is better tracked by bugs than by some random string somewhere
<persia> Note that plenty of packages come from Debian, have "maintainers", but are pointlessly broken and nobody is watching them.
<slangasek> (fwiw, I'm not convinced that ScottK's is the right solution to this problem, because I'm concerned that once you apply the "maintainer" label you'll trend toward having package unhealthy package feifdoms, which we've consciously tried to avoid)
<nxvl> persia: but either we need a policy saying a) we don't accept maintainers b) maintainers are allowed, but anyone can touch the package
<persia> That might not even be the assigned maintainer's fault: if I use gnue as an example, upstream became messy and incompatible, and the maintainer would have had a hard time keeping the package in shape even if he was so inclined.
<ScottK> slangasek: I'm not either, but I'm fresh out of ideas to avoid drive bys
<nxvl> i don't see more alternatives
<persia> nxvl: That's a contradiction.  I want to stop with "We don't accept maintainers".
<persia> ScottK: I don't mind drive-bys.
<persia> I've had a few packages that were drive-by, but I used them, and I updated them for another cycle.
<nxvl> persia: then i'm lost, what's your point
<ScottK> persia: I think that's the source of a lot of the Ubuntu only stuff.
<persia> I don't want to promise to maintain them, but I like them being around.
<persia> nxvl: That I'm against the idea of having an individual "Maintainer" set in debian/control for uploads to Ubutu.
<ScottK> persia: It's currently allowed.
<nxvl> that's what i meant (or tried to) with a) we don't accept maintainers
<slangasek> persia: there's a non-zero chance that some of these packages are non-broken, yes; but I think there's also a higher than usual chance that they are, and I've personally never accepted the argument that Ubuntu (or Debian) should make all the software available that they can and let users alone decide what's useful or not, because there are central costs associated with doing that
<persia> ScottK: Yes, but discouraged.  I'm not fussy enough to push policy stating it to be prohibited.
<persia> slangasek: I'm not supporting the case that *everything* should be available, although certain dictators have expressed that view in the past.
<nxvl> what i try to do is, when i have special interest on a package i try to get it in debian and maintain it there
<nxvl> then ask for a sync into ubuntu
<ScottK> I will confess that when I have to do an Ubuntu upload of a package I maintain in Debian, I don't change the maintainer.
<persia> I just don't see any value to enforcing that a given application is maintained by an individual within Ubuntu.
<ScottK> I'd get annoyed if I couldn't do that.
<\sh> ScottK: we always had special cases where we never changed the maintainer
<slangasek> ScottK: setting it up for the day when you can troll the Ubuntu mailing lists complaining that the maintainer field wasn't changed? ;)
<persia> ScottK: That's technically a violation of the Debian-Maintainer-Field rule, but you're not alone in that, which is one of the reasons we're a little flexible on that rule when the actual Maintainer is involved.
<nxvl> ScottK: same here
 * slangasek notes that all the packages he maintains in Debian, /do/ have a changed maintainer field when uploaded to Ubuntu
<slangasek> it helps that most of these are team-maintained in the first place :)
 * persia would not complain if LP automagically X-SBC-Original-Maintainered everything on sync source import, as long as teams had a mechanism to declare maintenance.
<\sh> but I agree with slangasek here...we should focus on packages which are used most in our usecases and drop cornercase stuff...which can save bandwidth, time, and resources...or we swamp da debian distro with NM-application in a short period of time
<persia> I agree with that as well.
<NCommander> persia, minutes and points of discussion went to the list
<persia> I'd like to see less cruft.  I'm just very strongly of the opinion that setting "Maintainer" is not the right way to achieve this.
<nxvl> i also don't like the maintainer idea since it can turn in the community saying "it's not our fault, it's $MAINTAINER's fault"
<persia> Right, when it is *our* fault.
<nxvl> persia: the thing there is that sync are untouched imports
<nxvl> persia: so the maintainer is still responsable for it in one or other way
<slangasek> persia: let me pose the question another way.  If a package has no upstream, no Debian or Ubuntu maintainer, and only users who would be better served by another package already in the archive, how do we go about detecting that this is cruft?
<\sh> nxvl: that's already the normal way to go..."it's not ubuntus fault, na it's not even debians fault, it's fault of upstream, and it's not even upstreams fault, it's fault of the fingerpointed guy who pushed the patch in
<persia> nxvl: Not at all.  Several Debian maintainers have expressed that they aren't, and that expression has been supported all members of our technical board.
<slangasek> systematically, that is?
<\sh> nxvl: that's wrong...source in debian != source in ubuntu regarding the different toolchains...
<persia> slangasek: Systematically, I've no idea, but I do think that we've too many barriers to removal now.
<\sh> better to say, the outcome of the source in both distros
<nxvl> persia: if the maintairs have expressed it, i can't go against it
<NCommander> Can someone sum what been discussed since I wrote the notes
<NCommander> (and persia, your two cents on the issue)
<persia> It took me *3* releases to get a broken game with questionable licensing removed when upstream had a name change.
<slangasek> hmm, why so long?
<NCommander> persia, in ubuntu or debian?
<slangasek> why is the procedure more than "file bug, subscribe ubuntu-archive, watch it be removed"?
<persia> slangasek: Not sure.  It kept getting bounced between archive admins, and generally ignored.
<ScottK> I don't think it is.
<slangasek> oh
<persia> Finally I had someone poke one of the archive-admins at UDS and verbally abuse them until they removed it.
<NCommander> persia, that's a break down of proceedure, but the policy itself is fine I think
<persia> Also, that is the procedure, it's just not been well supported by archive-admins historically.
<NCommander> ANd more of an exception then a rule
<slangasek> persia: fwiw, from my perspective it helps if submitters are more assertive with setting bug statuses in cases like that
<persia> NCommander: Well, it's been common historically.  We've had lots of trouble getting cruft removed despite support amoung MOTU.
<NCommander> I dunno, removal requests are pretty rare, but when they do happen, they happen relatively fast
<ScottK> Personally I've had great success with getting stuff removed.
<NCommander> Hrm
<persia> (and that's for identified cruft)
<slangasek> persia: e.g., if another archive-admin has set the bug to 'incomplete', I'll skip over it in my weekly archive day
<NCommander> Maybe we need a "Nominate for Removal" link in LP
<slangasek> expecting it to come back to 'confirmed' before it's ready for me to act on
<persia> slangasek: That makes sense.
<NCommander> ScottK, same, and no problems with Debian (although there is usually a week lag time)
<persia> ScottK: That's good to hear: I'm probably working off older assumptions.
<ScottK> The biggest problem is getting people to look and file the removal bugs.
 * NCommander agrees with ScottK 
<ScottK> If someone want practice, go ask for removal of sylpheed-gtk1.
<xnevermore> If a dpatch that was written for an old package version will not apply on a new one, what is the best way to edit that patch to make it work? or is it best to create a new one that does the same thing?
<persia> Well, we've that problem for lots of classes of issues.
<NCommander> What we need are guidelines for "cruft" and perpahs a set team which during frezes does extactly that
<ScottK> xnevermore: dpatch-edit-patch.
<NCommander> Go through universe/multiverse and weed out the junk
<persia> xnevermore: Yes, although the old patch may well help inform how to achieve that.
<persia> Actually, removals during freezes tend to be discouraged, unless there is a strong reason for removal.
<NCommander> persia, let me rephrase
<ScottK> Not a bad time to file the bugs though.
<NCommander> THey go through during the freeze
<NCommander> File removal requests
<persia> No, and excellent time to file the bugs.
<NCommander> ANd if no one protests and steps forward to update the package
<NCommander> It goes after that release
<ScottK> NCommander: We don't need to wait that long.
<NCommander> (call it a time-delayed removal)
<ScottK> No need.
<ScottK> If something gets removed, you can always add it back in.
 * NCommander nods
<persia> Indeed, although the archive-admins tend to get overwhelmed with duties as release nears, and it may be that the removals aren't the highest priority (which is understandable)
<NCommander> I still think having a strike force of people to do this would work wonders
<persia> NCommander: Start one.
<NCommander> persia, How?
<ScottK> NCommander: Make a team on Launchpad.
<ScottK> NCommander: Write to the MOTU ML asking for volunteers.
<ScottK> NCommander: Get to work.
 * NCommander creates ubuntu-cruft-busters :-)
<NCommander> Unless someone has a better name
<persia> NCommander: Make a team on LP.  Document the activities and responsibilities of team members, and post to ubuntu-motu for team members.
<ScottK> persia is more process oriented than I am.
<persia> Heh :)
 * NCommander is extremely process oriented
<ScottK> Note actually doing the work wasn't on his list.
<persia> I think it's important to tell people for what they are signing on before asking them to join a team.
<NCommander> The idea of having a team came from my ICS training
<ScottK> Bah.  You get fewer volunteers that way.
<NCommander> Any ideas a team name
<NCommander> universe-cruft-busters, ubuntu-garbage-collection?
<\sh> oh another team
<persia> No, there's no reason that the person organising the team does the work, as long as the person organising the team is confirming that the work is being done in a timely manner.  I've no problem with meta-busyness
<persia> ScottK: Yes, but you also have fewer people running away screaming when they find out what they are doing.
<NCommander> I'll help get this project off the ground
<nxvl> ScottK: but you are more complain oriented than persia
 * nxvl hides
<nxvl> :D
<persia> NCommander: Note that if you don't want the overhead of a team, you could also just call for volunteers on the ML, and build the team if you later thought it helpful to have one (e.g. a ML)
<ScottK> NCommander: My suggestion would be find the oldest version of GCC in the archive and see if anything that build-deps on it should stay.
<NCommander> ScottK, GCC is all main
<persia> Yes, GCC would be nice to kill.  Also, there's not a few libraries that have one source per version: porting to only have one version of the library would be a huge win.
<ScottK> NCommander: Not the older ones
<nxvl> NCommander: packages in univers can depend in main packages
<NCommander> SO you two are voluteering to help, right?
<ScottK> NCommander: In Hardy will killed off a gcc2 something package.
<ScottK> NCommander: I'm volunteering to give advice and order you around.
<NCommander> ScottK, you'd make a wonderful politician
<ScottK> Nope.  Too honest.
<nxvl> true
<ScottK> A politician wouldn't tell you that, just do it.
<nxvl> that's why we love ScottK
<persia> NCommander: I'd be happy to help.  Note that my supply of tuits is rapidly reaching historical lows, so you may not find this as beneficial as you might assume.
<NCommander> tuits?
<ScottK> nxvl: Speaking of honesty: I reviewed your courier merge.  The story does not yet have a happy ending.
<ScottK> NCommander: The round ones.
<NCommander> I don't get it
<nxvl> ScottK: the patch still doesn't apply, or it applies, but it's not in good shape?
<NCommander> and ...
<StevenK> NCommander: "round tuit"
<StevenK> NCommander: Say it out loud
<NCommander> Still don't get it
<StevenK> Sound it out?
<ScottK> nxvl: DIdn't apply, I decided to sort it out manually.  Merge is pretty good, but needs a little more work.
<NCommander> too-it?
<StevenK> NCommander: Now you're getting it
<NCommander> ... *sigh*
<NCommander> Anyone know where the make a team button on Launchpad is?
<nxvl> ScottK: mm odd
<nxvl> ScottK: i tested the patch in different sandboxes and have no problems with it
<ScottK> NCommander: --> #launchpad - They have a whole team dedicated to ignoring questions.
<nxvl> ScottK: let me upload the package to my ppa
<ScottK> nxvl: No need.
<NCommander> ScottK, damn it, you just made soda fly through my nose
<ScottK> nxvl: I won't trust PPA code just now anyway.
<nxvl> why?
<ScottK> Unsigned repo + DNS Cache Poisoning.
<nxvl> the sign thing
<ScottK> Yep.
<ScottK> I deleted all the packages out of PPAs I control.
<nxvl> true
<ScottK> nxvl: The problem was you bumped standards version to 3.8, but then didn't update the package to 3.8.
 * persia questions the value of updating the standards version when updating packages except for ubuntu-local packages
<nxvl> ScottK: i did that?
<ScottK> persia: Generally I agree, but the actual maintainer standards version for courier is 3.5.6
<ScottK> nxvl: That's what was in your diff.
<nxvl> and didn't document it on the changelog
<nxvl> i should confuse terminals
<ScottK> Right.  Changelog still said 3.7.3
<nxvl> working in a car in more that one package at the time is not the best to do
<ScottK> nxvl: If you'd been a MOTU already and uploaded that, what would you do now?
<persia> ScottK: Ah, yes, that hits the ancient-standards-version test :)
<nxvl> ScottK: fix it
<nxvl> :D
<persia> nxvl: And how would you have known to fix it?
<nxvl> updating it to 3.8.0
<ScottK> persia: Actually until the last lintian upload 3.7.3 was classified as ancient.
 * StevenK scoffs
<NCommander> ScottK & persia: https://edge.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-cruft-busters
<ScottK> Lintian had the nice feature of basing ancient standards on when a policy was issued, not when it was superceded.
<persia> 3.7.3 shouldn't have been considered "ancient"!
<ScottK> That was, I htink my second Lintian bug to get fix.
<ScottK> persia: Agreed.  The test was logically flawed.
<persia> ScottK: Indeed.  Thanks for sorting that.
<StevenK> NCommander: s/universe and multiverse/the Ubuntu archive/
<ScottK> I pointed out that under the test if policy didn't change for 2 years, the current policy would be ancient.
<NCommander> StevenK, change maded
<persia> Yeah: there's no reason not to cut cruft from main/restricted as well.
<StevenK> NCommander: Approve my membership :-)
<NCommander> Trying to figure out how ;-)
<ScottK> If it has a cool badge, I'll join.
<StevenK> Click links, I think
 * StevenK hides
<persia> NCommander: Click on the edit button from https://edge.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-cruft-busters/+members or wait for the email with the special approve link.
<NCommander> I'm going to use a garbage can
<NCommander> persia, yeah, just found it
 * persia wants a garbage can
<StevenK> Works for me
<SolarWar> NCommander, whats your timezone?
<nxvl> persia: actually i wouldn't
<NCommander> Eastern Standard
<NCommander> -5 UTC
<NCommander> or a nice gun
<StevenK> Garbage can
<SolarWar> NCommander, does that make you EST?
 * NCommander looks for the svg for the GNOME garbage gan
<NCommander> SolarWar, yes
<slangasek> persia: hrm, a disturbing thought that we would have left anything in main/restricted in such bad shape that it should go straight from there to archive removal
<slangasek> (on a "cruft" basis, that is)
<StevenK> slangasek: Cruft could be NBS
<SolarWar> okay just checking, i've seen you active during normal hours, and now, on abnormal hours
<SolarWar> :)
<persia> slangasek: consider the case where something is required for main, but replaced, and ejected to universe: is it necessarily useful in universe at that time?
<slangasek> StevenK: NBS is already dealt with by the archive admins
<StevenK> In which case it does go straight from main to removed
<ScottK> slangasek: KDE3 is going straight out the window as KDE4 replaces it.
<NCommander> Anyone know where I can find the icon for the GNOME trash icon
<NCommander> SolarWar, I have a sleep disorder
<slangasek> ScottK: but we don't need a special group to /track/ that, do we?  The parties responsible for KDE4 are handling it?
<persia>  /usr/share/icons/Human/scalable/places/user-trash.svg
<ScottK> slangasek: True.  That's just an example.
<persia> slangasek: Does it hurt to have a group that also does that?
<ScottK> slangasek: I think we'd have been better off it that'd happened with serpentine.
<persia> Yes, sepentine is an interesting example.
<SolarWar> NCommander, is that a fact?
<NCommander> SolarWar, chronic delayed sleep syndrome
 * NCommander has a nice blue one, but this will work
<slangasek> persia: no, I'm just thinking out loud that I find the prospect of main being in such a state disturbing
<nxvl> ScottK: it seems to be 3.8.0 complaining or i'm to sleepy to notice the diferences now
<persia> slangasek: It's rare, and usually "fixed" by tossing the relevant cruft into universe
<persia> It's just that tossing it into universe isn't always the right solution.
<slangasek> NCommander: is that accompanied by restless leg syndrome?
 * nxvl will check tomorrow
<ScottK> nxvl: I didn't see Homepage: was one thing I noticed.  I'm pretty sure you'll need README.source.
<ScottK> OK.
<NCommander> slangasek, Maybe, define the symptons
<slangasek> NCommander: "your legs move"
<NCommander> (my leg shakes a lot)
<NCommander> then yes
<slangasek> here, have some of these drugs that the nice man on the TV sold me
<slangasek> they'll make your legs stop moving
<StevenK> And probably the rest of you
<persia> Let's call it "sleep".  Perhaps with fishes.
<nxvl> mmm starting with the fact that i need to follow several checklists
<NCommander> ScottK, StevenK persia, check your profile pages :-)
<hagabaka> what's the difference between xorg-driver-fglrx and xorg-driver-fglrx-envy?
<SolarWar> NCommander, that sucks :-/
<persia> hagabaka: The source from which it was installed.
<NCommander> Thanks
 * NCommander will accept new icons
<ScottK> Speaking of sleep ....
<hagabaka> also what version of fglrx is packaged in hardy? i can't really tell from "7.1.0-8-6+2.6.24.502-502.30_i386"
 * ScottK says good night again.
<NCommander> sladen, trying to kill me with that junk ;-)?
<\sh> ScottK: good night :)
 * persia declares that fail2ban would appreciate a bunch of help, if anyone wants to look at a package for general updating.
<NCommander> when did Ubuntu wiki add openid support?
<nxvl> night all!
 * NCommander makes a wiki page
<SolarWar> ScottK, night night
<jpds> NCommander: Some time ago, help.u.c has it too.
<NCommander> jpds, ?
<jpds> NCommander: The OpenID stuff?
<NCommander> seems every ubuntu service has it now
<NCommander> jpds, BTW, come join cruft busters ;-)
<persia> NCommander: Previously the wiki had a hack to use LP has a backend for authentications (since Edgy or so).  OpenID is significantly cleaner.
<NCommander> Ah
<jpds> NCommander: Yeah, it makes things way easier.
<NCommander> It seems to have come after REVU openid
 * NCommander wonders if it was inspired by that
<SolarWar> anyone know if application developers need to do anything special to hook into apport?
<jpds> NCommander: It came before ;-) What are cruft busters?
<persia> SolarWar: Have the upstream build system provide unstripped binaries by default (for compiled languages).
<NCommander> jpds, https://edge.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-cruft-busters
<persia> Otherwise the upstream build system needs to be patches: Ubuntu provides stripped binaries, but the stripping process also saves the dbgsym packages for apport use.
<SolarWar> persia, so the program i packaged up, is in c++, it has the ggdb flag set (for debug symbols when it compiles) my package creates two packages- the normal stripped package, and the dbg symbol package, is that sufficient?
<NCommander> jpds, and https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CruftBusters
<jpds> NCommander: Nice idea. /me joins
<NCommander> persia, care to look at the wiki page and make any suggestions
<NCommander> I wrote up an inital proceedure to keep people going on the same page
<persia> NCommander: We've twice that number of packages, at least.
<NCommander> I don't want to scare people :-)
<persia> Better to appear accurate than to try to keep people from learning the truth because they may be scared.
 * NCommander fixes the number
<persia> That said, scaring people may help in recruitment.
<persia> NCommander: Check LP/ubuntu for the current number
<NCommander> I'm just going with a rough estimation of 14000+
<persia> Is it that hard to look up?  Must I provide you a URL?
<NCommander> yes
 * NCommander is smacked
 * persia uses https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/intrepid to accomplish that
 * NCommander registers #ubuntu-cruftbusters
<persia> Why?  Surely it's better to coordinate here and in #ubuntu-devel to get best quality comments.
 * persia points at the current occupants of #ubuntu-backports as an example of why
<NCommander> Well, I figure its good to have a seperate channel for when Cruft Blasting Day :-)
<jpds> poor Mez.
<persia> Nah.  Here is good.  Gets more interest.  Same as for REVU days.
<NCommander> Works for me
<NCommander> What do you think of the current Procedure on doing a cruft-buster removal?
<persia> Also, do you intend to have the team subscribed to related bugs?  What is the "cruft busters bugs page"?
<NCommander> Each team has a bugs page
<persia> One never assigns an archive-admin to a bug: one merely doesn't assign anyone, and subscribes them.
<NCommander> I would open a Removal Progress on Firefox2
<NCommander> er, meant subscribe
 * NCommander fixs
<persia> Ah, the LP bugs page.  Note somewhere that people should subscribe the team page to such bugs.
<NCommander> persia, maybe you can word it better then I can
<NCommander> (I'm not great with wikis)
<persia> Lastly, "file patches" is not best: better to upload patches, no?  Especially if you are restricting the team to people who can upload.
 * persia isn't great with time.
<NCommander> Oh
<NCommander> D'oh
<NCommander> Well, its restricted to MOTU, or those sponsored by an MOTU to join
 * NCommander clarifies
<NCommander> I think firefox2 should probably start working on being removed from the archive
<NCommander> persia, mail sent to motu
<persia> NCommander: Great.  Now you just need to help people to join the team and get the work done :)
<persia> While certainly not authoritative, you may find that some of the QA resources are good at identifying possible candidates for renewal or removal.
 * NCommander tackles \sh and drags him away
<\sh> hum?
<NCommander> \sh, join the cruft busters, a group dedicated to removing moldy packages from the archive
<NCommander> \sh, https://edge.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-cruft-busters
<NCommander> (see email to motu for more details)
<persia> \sh: Do you really fear a lot of personal attacks to get team members to resign?
<NCommander> You get a cool orange garbage can as a bragging right :-)
<\sh> persia: no...but the paragraph can be easily mis-interpretated
<NCommander> persia, it seems the email to the mailing list works quite well
 * emgent huggs \sh 
<NCommander> or I just wrote good notes
<NCommander> although I think nixternal isn't going to like me after he gets pinged to death
<persia> \sh: I guess.  Personally, I don't think any of us would do that, and if someone did, I'd rather discuss it, rather than needing to explicitly tell them not to do so in advance.
<persia> NCommander: email can be an effective means of communication, and some discussions are worth two months.  I just feel that we ought actually review things when we way we will.
<NCommander> persia, any comments on my minutes?
<NCommander> wow, another cruft buster joins
<persia> \sh: Also, did you get the same impression from https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-motu/2008-July/004275.html ?
<NCommander> I'm soon going to have a complete #u-motu collection :-)
<persia> NCommander: Thank you for writing up the minutes
<NCommander> No problem
<NCommander> gmail also makes it easy to keep track of all the threads
<NCommander> emgent, you be cruft buster
<persia> NCommander: Just don't co-opt the entire SWAT team: we need security support too :)
<NCommander> We need Ubuntu-MOTU cards
<NCommander> persia, Powers: Ability to reason. Weakness: Voting
<persia> Yes, but I have the special "Quash Vote" power, which takes a month to recharge.
<NCommander> you know
<NCommander> I have enough free time I might make a Ubuntu MOTU trading card thingy
<persia> FTBFS is more interesting than MOTU cards, surely :)
<NCommander> slangasek would be an ultra-rare with Release Ubuntu Distro ability
<NCommander> (he's going to see that on the scrollback and go WTF)
<slangasek> yes, yes I am.
<emgent> hehhe
<persia> Still 467 packages to go...
<NCommander> slangasek, Ubuntu developer trading cards :-)
<NCommander> Maybe make FTBFS and bugs be event cards ...
<NCommander> ...
<NCommander> I should stop on this train of thought before I go create a game or something producive
<slangasek> NCommander: explaining this does not cause the "WTF" to diminish
<persia> NCommander: Yes, go kill cruft, fix FTBFS, etc.  You'll feel better in the morning.
<NCommander> I dunno, we could sell it for money or include it with every Ubuntu CD sent via shipit ...
<\sh> persia: nope..
<persia> NCommander: When you have time, could you rewrite the model to be significantly more verbose and closer to the original proposal?
<persia> Based on \sh's comments, I think the summarised version may be confusing to some.
<NCommander> persia, come again
<NCommander> I was just about to put slangsek on qdb.us
 * NCommander runs
<persia> NCommander: Differences between https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-motu/2008-July/004275.html  and https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-motu/2008-August/004389.html
<persia> Also, which some chatter is good to maintain our team spirit, too much random poking or abuse is generally to be avoided.
<NCommander> I'm aware
<NCommander> I'll post it tommorow
<emgent> dholbach: your face is in my launchpad profile now, lol :-)
<dholbach> :)
<NCommander> There won't happen to be an #ubuntu-* fortune file, would there?
<NCommander> SO our insanity can be collected for future generations?
<persia> Generally we try to avoid such insanity, but conceivably such a package could be constructed.
<Iulian> G'morning
<huats> morning everyone
<huats> TheMuso: are you around ?
<stefanlsdx> hi guys :)
<emgent> moin stefanlsd :)
<didrocks> Hi everyone,
<didrocks> I'm currently working on bug #61039
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 61039 in sgt-puzzles "No desktop entries" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/61039
<didrocks> I have already be done some work on it (see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DidierRoche/MOTU/bugsaction)
<abogani> Good morning all!
<didrocks> but I don't really know what is the right way to manage the icons installation (as there is a lot of them: for 27 games)
<didrocks> as it is more explicity explained on the previous link, the question is in the "TODO AND QUESTION" question, if you need more information, do not hesitate to ask :)
<persia> didrocks: Are you sure you want to add all those?  That's a *huge* extra chunk of stuff to get installed.
<persia> Mind you, most of them are good games, and separate executables.
<didrocks> persia: I spoke about it with the debian upstream maintenair and he is ok for putting them (if I provide the debdiff :))
<persia> didrocks: Yes, he would be :)
<persia> sgt-puzzles would also benefit from improvement of the debian menu files to use the icons.
<persia> Although there are surely wiser xdg-compliant locations, I tend to err on the side of putting everything in /usr/share/pixmaps and /usr/share/applications/
<didrocks> but /usr/share/pixmaps are not only for pixmaps image files ?
<persia> If you using the same names for the pixmaps and .desktop files as for binaries in /usr/games/ there is a relatively low chance of conflict.
<didrocks> ok, so, I should rename in debian/rules <package_source>/icons/blackbox-32d24.png to usr/share/pixmaps/blackbox.png
<didrocks> but I really do not see how to do it in a clever way (that is to say, not putting 27 install lines in debian/rules) :)
<persia> didrocks: Yes.  Also, if you can provide a 32x32 .xpm for each of them, that would make the debian menu look good too (which is especially nice if you're sending the patch to Debian)
<persia> dh_install
<didrocks> with a .install file, that's it?
<persia> Then in debian/sgt-puzzles.install (or debian/install) put "./icons/*png usr/share/pixmaps" or something.
<joaopinto> Hello
<persia> Yep.  That makes debian/rules easier to read, and lets you manage the install separately.  Mind you, it's only good to do this if the maintainer is using debhelper.
<didrocks> this is the case here, hopefully :)
<didrocks> so, the idea is to create <game_name>.xpm
<didrocks> and then dh_install to install them using a debian/sgt-puzzles.install file
<persia> didrocks: Yes indeed.  You can also probably move the manpages install into dh_installman and the help into part of dh_installdocs
<persia> Of course, this might not work (depending on permissions, etc.), in which case leaving it in the current way is best.
<didrocks> if some renaming is necessary (like <game_name>-32d24.png to <game_name>.png, is it possible to use in debian/sgt-puzzles.install some bash scripting?
<didrocks> ok, I note that about manpages and help :)
<persia> No.  If you're going to rename things, you need to do that in debian/rules.  dh_install cannot rename, and cannot set special permissions.
<didrocks> persia: is there a good example with renaming or stuff like that (even if I will not use it there), just for next time I will need it :)
<persia> Generally I just call install -m$(permissions) $(source) $(target).
<persia> If this can be automated in some way, you could use a make directive of some sort, although most people seem to give up and use the shell for loop.
 * persia likes $(foreach ...) and pattern-matching targets, but these are hard to explain
<didrocks> so, just put the shell script loop in debian/rules to call install -m..., isn't it?
<didrocks> (for the easy way before going further ;))
<persia> didrocks: If you want to learn make properly, no, but that's the easy way.
<didrocks> ok, I will try to give a look at $(foreach ...) as for pattern-matching, I think I'm used to it :)
<didrocks> persia: thank you so much for your time and patience :)
<persia> Note that in my experience, most Debian Maintainers are more comfortable in shell than in make, so doing it that way may also make it easier to get reviewed and applied in Debian.
<didrocks> oh, ok, noted!
<persia> (but debian/rules *is* a makefile, so people who have the freedom to do it properly in make should)
<didrocks> ok, that's a long time I hadn't touch a complex makefile by hand (IDE's rules...), but I will take a look on it
<didrocks> so, now, I just have to get back to work on it, thanks a lot!
<huats> hello persia
<persia> huats: Hello.
<huats> how are you ?
<persia> OK.  You?
<huats> so do I :)
<SolarWar> once a new package makes its way into ubuntu, do I need to go through the approval process again (eg two advocates) to keep the package up todate or is there a different process for packages that are already in ubuntu ?
<SolarWar> keep the package up to date -> with respect to the upstream tarball
<persia> SolarWar: A different process.  You just open a bug against the package, attach the updated diff.gz, and subscribe the sponsors queue.
<SolarWar> whats a sponsor?
<persia> someone who uploads stuff for people without upload permission.
<persia> SolarWar: You may find it useful to read https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing
<SolarWar> persia, thanks this is usefull now
<SolarWar> previously i was just concerned with packaging correctly :)
<thekorn> hi MOTUs! - I've got two workflow related questions:
<thekorn> what's the way to get python-sphinx into hardy?
<thekorn> and what is the best way to get the latest release into intrepid?
<POX__> ask for sync with Debian ?
<huats> warp10: thanks for the approval in the team ;)
<warp10> huats: my pleasure! It's 150â¬, thanks :)
<huats> ;)
<huats> ok
<huats> didrocks will pay them for me :)
<DktrKranz> warp10, wasn't tax free for the first year?
<warp10> DktrKranz: acceptation and application review fee. First year is free indeed 0:-)
<persia> thekorn: FOr hardy, I think you'd need backports, but for intrepid a sync addresses the problem.
<thekorn> persia, ok, thanks, but debian does not have the latest version yet, so I have to ask for an update there first, right?
<persia> Oh.  I thought 0.4.2 might have been the latest.  What is the latest?
<thekorn> 0.4.3
<persia> POX__: What do you think the chances are of an update in Debian?
<POX__> persia: I uploaded newest package lately, so changes are good ;P
<POX__> oh, 0.4.3 is released
<POX__> I uploaded 0.4.2
<persia> That's what I thought.  Will you get shot for another update?
<POX__> I didn't receive RFS for 0.4.3 yet
<POX__> if I get one, I'll probably upload to experimental for now, 0.4.2 is waiting for transition into testing
<persia> thekorn: Are you able to prepare an update for 0.4.3 to submit an RFS, or do you need someone else to do that?
<POX__> persia, thekorn: I will ask Maintainer to update it
<thekorn> persia, honestly, I've never done real packaging
<persia> POX__: Even better.  Thank you.
<thekorn> persia, POX__ , thanks so much
<persia> thekorn: Just wait a bit and watch debian Experimental.  0.4.3 ought get there in a bit, and we can sync from Experimental.
<thekorn> cool, super
<thekorn> one question, what's an RFS?
<directhex> request for sausage
<persia> Request-for-Sponsorship.
<persia> It's a Debian abbreviation used to describe the sort of email one sends to a list to request upload sponsorship in Debian.
<persia> Sending an RFS is roughly analogous to subscribing the sponsors queue.
<thekorn> persia, thanks
<jelmer> hi!
<jelmer> One of the comments I received for my packages uploaded to REVU is that I should use a patch system
<didrocks> huats: I have so many credits because of you :) (sorry network breakage at my company ^^^)
<jelmer> the package is maintained in a Bazaar branch though, is that sufficient?
<directhex> jelmer, is it a native package, i.e. the package itself has a debian/ directory which is used for making ubuntu packages?
<jelmer> directhex, no, it's not a native package but upstream is in bzr as well
<persia> jelmer: So upstream is in bzr, and packaging is in bzr, and you want to keep it that way to ease merging of patches for new upstreams?
<directhex> jelmer, as part of the packaging process, do you (the package maintainer) make any changes whatsoever to files outside the debian/ folder ?
<jelmer> persia, yep
<jelmer> yes, there are some minor changes I made outside the debian folder
<persia> jelmer: Then you *don't* want a patch system, but you do want to make sure to have good Vcs-* information in debian/control
<persia> Unfortunately, we've not currently a good system to handle the permissions for those :(
<persia> jelmer: Which package?
<jelmer> persia, loggerhead
<persia> loggerhead is becoming an Ubuntu package?  My
<ara> hello, one quick question, does anyone remember the command to get the candidate version of a package for all ubuntu versions???
<directhex> apt-cache policy?
<persia> ara: How do you mean?  rmadison will tell you the most recently available version for each release, but candidates typically need to be larger than this, and are often manually constructed.
<ara> persia: rmadison is what i was looking for, ta!
<persia> Kopfgeldjaeger: Yes, patch systems are nice, but no, they aren't always the solution.  If one manages a source package in a VCS, having a patch system can make it significantly *more* difficult to reconcile upstream updates.
<zorglu_> apt-get doesnt handle http redirect ?
<wgrant> I believe that is correct.
<zorglu_> ?
 * zorglu_ is amazed
<zorglu_> W: Failed to fetch http://urfastr.net/apt/http://fr.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/hardy/restricted/binary-i386/Packages.gz  302 Found
<azeem> maybe it's because of security considerations
<zorglu_> http redirect is a security hole ?
<StevenK> zorglu_: apt doesn't handle 30x redirects.
<zorglu_> StevenK: any specific reason ? or just a poor http implementation
<wgrant> Debian bug 479350
<ubottu> Debian bug 479350 in apt-get "apt-get does not follow redirects over http" [Wishlist,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/479350
<wgrant> That has rationale.
<zorglu_> wgrant: well the rationnal is "no support because some mirror are misconfigured"
<zorglu_> wgrant: i dont know for you, but im not ultra convinced :)
<StevenK> zorglu_: No, that isn't the rationale at all.
<StevenK> zorglu_: mod_speling isn't misconfiguration, it allows the mirrors to provide packages the user didn't ask for, which is *bad*.
<POX__> thekorn: Mikhail told me that he will ask for an upload of sphinx 0.4.3 once 0.4.2 will migrate into Lenny (9 days)
<zorglu_> StevenK: and this is not misconfig ?
<POX__> he's busy with other pacakges at the moment so 0.4.3 will not be uploaded to experimental
<StevenK> zorglu_: How exactly is mod_speling a misconfiguration?
<zorglu_> StevenK: so it is properly configured but provide bad packages ? i dont get it
<StevenK> zorglu_: Okay, so it isn't a misconfiguration, it's that mod_speling provides functionality that can redirect users to download packages that they didn't ask for, if apt follows the redirect. This is a bad thing.
<zorglu_> you call that the way you want :)
<azeem> I think we called it like that all the time
<zorglu_> "bad thing" is a nice word too
<zorglu_> ok so the solution to this mod_speling issue is not to support http redirect ?
<persia> zorglu_: "bad thing" == "unacceptable unrequested misconfiguration of user systems"
<zorglu_> not to fix/enhance mod_speling to give the proper package ?
<azeem> StevenK: however, the rogue Release.gpg would not validate against the GPG key the user has, would it?
<StevenK> azeem: Hold on
<azeem> unless the user ignores or disables that
<zorglu_> well if the user disable the security, it is its problem
<StevenK> azeem, zorglu_: Okay, say apt did follow the redirect. You see an upgrade to base-files in the Packages.gz file. You go to download it, but the mirror admin has deleted that .deb, and put base-files_4.0.haha_all.deb there instead which runs "rm -rf /" during the postinst.
<StevenK> No touching of the Packages.gz or Release.gpg needed
<persia> azeem: Imagine the case where it replaces e.g. apt-file with e.g. aptitude, and both are signed by the same key.
<StevenK> persia: Not even, it's even simpler. ^
<zorglu_> StevenK: ???
<zorglu_> StevenK: how does this relate to http redirect ?
<persia> StevenK: That gets caught by the incorrect checksum on package download (for those sufficiently paranoid to check)
<azeem> StevenK: wouldn't the Packages.gz's md5sum then be out-of-sync against the data in Release?
<thekorn> POX__, thanks for your information
<StevenK> azeem: Packages.gz doesn't need to be changed
<persia> azeem: Only if someone reran the archive scripts.  It's the content of the file that wouldn't match to Packages.gz.
<azeem> StevenK: or what do you mean with "you see an upgrade... in the Package.gz"?
<azeem> persia: which file?
<StevenK> azeem: I mean a new legimate upgrade is there.
<azeem> ok
<zorglu_> StevenK: how all this relate to http redirect
<persia> I think the case of grabbing e.g. 0.4.2-3ubuntu3~hardy1 instead of 0.4.1-2ubuntu6.1 was more insidious
<azeem> why would apt download base-files_4.0.haha_all.deb?
<StevenK> But the mirror admin deleted the .deb, and put base-files_4.0.haha_all.deb in it's place, and enabled mod_speling so it downloads it.
<StevenK> azeem: The asumption here is that apt follows 30x redirects
<azeem> "it's place"?
<azeem> ok
<persia> azeem: It's somewhere in the directory.
<geser> doesn't apt compare the md5sum of the downloaded deb against the one in Packages.gz?
<azeem> but then the md5sum of base-files_4.0.haha_all.deb wouldn't match the deleted .deb's md5sum in the Packages.gz
<zorglu_> geser: i hope so :) or it is a major security hole :)
<zorglu_> geser: and suddently http redirect is really a very small issue :)
<geser> I hope so too, else the gpg signing of the archive would be useless
<zorglu_> geser: because this would mean that any mirror admin could crack *many* computers
<azeem> StevenK: my point is that maybe the reservations against http redirects are from times when we didn't have Release/Packages file signing
<zorglu_> hence my repeated question: how all this related to http redirect
<azeem> ah, I now understand mod_speling implications
<persia> zorglu_: If you're certain it is safe now, you'd do best to attach a patch and make a case to the bug, rather than here.
<zorglu_> persia: im not the maintainer of this
<StevenK> Neither are we
<persia> Firstly, apt isn't in universe, and secondly, it's exceedingly unlikely to be accepted as a variance from Debian.
<zorglu_> else you would have http redirect for a long time: )
<azeem> persia: I think Kamion makes a good point, only allow redirects for the same filename
<persia> zorglu_: How does whether you are the maintainer have anything to do with you submitting a patch and explanation why the patch is now safe?
<zorglu_> persia: the likelyhood to be included
 * persia is fairly certain that nick is deprecated
<zorglu_> persia: aka the fact i do the patch has nothing to do with feature in it or not
<persia> zorglu_: Right.  Still, adding to the bug would be useful.  Arguing here is pointless.
<azeem> and I think the reservations about mod_speling are not all security implications, but just annoyances for users, cause it would hand out the wrong .debs if the one they want is not there, and then APT would complain
<persia> Also, the assumption that someone else would create the patch because you argued with them is presumptive.
<azeem> s/not all/not at all/
<zorglu_> persia: ok lets be productive. i would like to do a mirror. how can i workaround this "feature" of no http redirect in apt-get
<\sh> the easy solution: ipvs and forward your old ip to the new one....
<azeem> zorglu_: why do you need it?
<persia> zorglu_: Don't require redirect in your mirror implementation.
<zorglu_> ok so no way to work around this ?
<azeem> zorglu_: work around /what/?
<zorglu_> the "feature" :)
<azeem> zorglu_: other mirrors seem to get along fine
<\sh> zorglu_: what do you want? mirror.domain.tld is deprecated and now you want to redirect to mirror2.domain.tld?
<persia> zorglu_: What problem are you experiencing?
<\sh> why not forward the ip:port to anotherip:port?
<zorglu_> \sh: the bandwidth would be used on both servers (if i understand what you mean)
<\sh> zorglu_: hmmm? no
<zorglu_> \sh: what 'forward an ip" means then ?
<nixternal> NCommander: pong! :)
<\sh> TCP  media.dev.webzooms.tv:1935 rr
<\sh>   -> fms-edge-2.dev.webzooms.tv:1 Route   1      0          0
<\sh> something like this
<sistpoty|work> hi folks
<nixternal> woo, someone wants to help REVU coordination...yay \o/
<zorglu_> \sh: at the BGP (ip routing) level ?
<\sh> zorglu_: bgp has nothing to do with it
<zorglu_> \sh: ok what is your dump ? what 'forward an ip" mean ?
<StevenK> BGP is a routing protocol.
<zorglu_> \sh: you mean "forwarding the tcp connection at the netfilter level" ?
<persia> Well, even a routing information protocol
<stefanlsd> Im doing a merge - in the debian rules I have    -$(MAKE) distclean         . Does the - there mean anything special?
<sistpoty|work> stefanlsd: it means ignore if make distclean fails
<persia> stefanlsd: It means to ignore errors returned from the command.
<\sh> zorglu_: ok to make it easy
<sistpoty|work> (e.g. if there would be no Makefile because make distclean was already run before)
<\sh> zorglu_: your mirror has ip : 192.168.1.2 and your apache listens on port 80
<persia> stefanlsd: Generally this is discouraged as it's better to trap specific errors, but it's not worth preseving an Ubuntu variation for.
<\sh> zorglu_: your new machine has the ip 192.168.1.9 and has an apache on port 80, too
<stefanlsd> thanks guys
<zorglu_> \sh: ah ok, here you assume both computer are on the same LAN
<stefanlsd> persia: If i am doing an ubuntu revision anyways to fix something else, should I then try trap the error rather?
<nixternal> NCommander: I am getting ready to head to work, but I will be back on in a bit...If you guys are interested in creating a REVU team, I so support that because my time has shrunk to about null right now
<\sh> zorglu_: it doesn't matter on which lan/wan/ip they are on...it's really transparent
 * persia doesn't think we need an LP team for that, just interested people working with the REVU Coordinator to help throughput
<zorglu_> \sh: ok so i keep listening
<DktrKranz> Kopfgeldjaeger, package accepted into universe ;)
<\sh> zorglu_: it's layer 4 switching the whole idea
<\sh> zorglu_: http://www.linuxvirtualserver.org/software/ipvs.html
<zorglu_> \sh: if you get a solution without using both server bandwidth and without http redirect, im all hear :)
<Kopfgeldjaeger> DktrKranz: wwoooo \o/ thank you :)  *hug*
<wgrant> You could of course be boring and just repoint the DNS name...
<persia> And maybe run both servers for 3xTTL to be safe.
<\sh> zorglu_: the bandwidth of the new server is used only..., only for the start point (thinking about mirror.domain.tld will directed to 192.168.1.2) you need your old machine...or a new one with the old ip
<wgrant> persia: I'd hope so.
<\sh> wgrant: damn...that's the easy solution ,)
<zorglu_> not a working solution unfortunatly
<zorglu_> all that for some misconfig mirror several years ago...
<persia> zorglu_: Why is that not a working solution?
<\sh> zorglu_: the whole idea is this : http://www.howtoforge.com/set-up-a-loadbalanced-ha-apache-cluster-ubuntu8.04
<persia> zorglu_: Also, please state the problem you are encountering.
<zorglu_> persia: ok i need apt-get to implement a normal http
<\sh> zorglu_: the old machine with old ip takes the connect and forwards it to another server, another server has different default route but real connects your clients
<zorglu_> persia: how do i do that ?
<zorglu_> persia: and i would llike ubuntu people to get it too :)
<persia> zorglu_: No.  What problem are you experiencing for which you believe that to be a solution?
<zorglu_> persia: tomorrow if possible :)
<zorglu_> a mirror system
<\sh> this is what big boys do...first think, then plan, then think again, replan, then implement ;)
<\sh> zorglu_: archive.ubuntu.com is nothing else then a mirror system
<persia> OK.  There are lots of mirrors.  Explain the problem.
<zorglu_> i guess i got communication problem
<\sh> zorglu_: it's behind a dns rr..and other people are just doing layer 4 switching which means, they are using f5 network big ip, or ipvs, or whatever lb system is there, to just hide the real servers
<zorglu_> lets me think a bit, maybe i can workaround this "feature"
<persia> zorglu_: What doesn't work?
<zorglu_> after all apt-get has this feature for year, it is not anywhere close to be fixed
<zorglu_> \sh: they do a lot but dont support proper http in apt-get :)
<directhex> how can a source package generate binaries in both universe and main?
<persia> directhex: The source must be in main, and nothing in main must depend or build-depend on some of the binaries.
<zorglu_> \sh: do you know if fedora/redhat and go, got the same "feature" ?
<StevenK> zorglu_: It *does* support "proper" HTTP, it chooses not to follow 30x redirects.
<persia> zorglu_: What issue do you encounter which would be fixed by apt supporting redirects?
<\sh> zorglu_: apt4rpm has the same feature, yum is broken by default, zypper I don't know, and smart is following apt afaiks
<zorglu_> \sh: yum support http redirect ?
<\sh> zorglu_: yum is broken...
<directhex> persia, i mean physically. how's it set in the source package?
<persia> directhex: It's not: it is set in the archive.
<zorglu_> \sh: you mean he got "features" :)
<\sh> zorglu_: no I mean it's broken
<zorglu_> \sh: what do you mean by broken ?
<directhex> persia, oh. i see. hm, looks like a sync might be enough rather than a merge then
<persia> z
<\sh> zorglu_: it only support rpm-md repos...and it's totally slow and the last time i used it for sles9 it didn't even have a good and working architecture recognition system
<persia> directhex: I've lost context.  What are you trying to accomplish?
<zorglu_> \sh: ah ok
<zorglu_> \sh: well maybe it got http, that's all i need for now
<zorglu_> now i just have to setup a fedora vm to test :)
<\sh> zorglu_: but as I said, you have an infrastructure problem...your problem is not apt or http...a 30x redirect something temporarily...and not a good use for a package mirror
<zorglu_> thanks guys :)
<zorglu_> \sh: i could trivially implement the system i want if apt-get would respect http
<directhex> persia, i want to update the package "monodoc". the 1.2.6-1ubuntu1 merge made some changes to the build process in order to avoid making monodoc-http Depends: on something in universe. monodoc-http is itself already in universe, so i don't see the problem
<persia> zorglu_: What system?  WIth a use case, it may be able to do so.
<directhex> persia, and the monodoc source package is in main, in case that wasn't clear
<zorglu_> persia: may being the operating word :)
<persia> directhex: No source in main may build-depend on any binary in universe, although it may generate binaries that end up in universe.
<zorglu_> ok all in all thanks for the info
<persia> Bah.  Without any explanation, there's no chance at all.
 * \sh gives up...that's too semi-amateure..well, and normally he will have the same problem with yum or whatever not following 30x and not using whatever he tries to do
<directhex> persia, aha, i hadn't noticed the differing build-depends
<persia> directhex: Yeah.  stuff on the border is tricky.
<directhex> looks like a merge, then. how tiresome
<directhex> then waiting for u-m-s. wheeeee
<persia> directhex: Is u-m-s that much worse than u-u-s?
<directhex> much more fickle, maybe?
 * DktrKranz did a quick stat: u-u-s has *116* unique packages to be reviewed, u-m-s has *72*
<DktrKranz> half the open bugs in u-m-s are debian/upstream tasks which should be removed from the list, actually
<dholbach> DktrKranz: better use https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.subscriber=ubuntu-main-sponsors and https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.subscriber=ubuntu-universe-sponsors
<DktrKranz> dholbach, exactly. I have my own LP queries to exclude uninteresting remote bugs from sight.
<directhex> am i the only one who finds MOTU/Contibuting entirely unclear in places?
<sistpoty|work> hm... seems like there's more revu documentation spread across the wiki, which needs to get updated
<persia> directhex: It's massively out of date.  What is confusing?
<directhex> persia, i just find the bit on mergine new upstream from debian unclear
<stefanlsd> Does anyone have a view on the following bug and patch - https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/netkit-tftp/+bug/217537     . I am doing a merge of the netkit-tftpd from Debian and this bug isn't fixed.  It looks ok to me, but I dont really understand enough C to make a decision on it...
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 217537 in netkit-tftp "Read mode should return ENOTFOUND instead of EUNDEF for files that do not exist." [Undecided,New]
<sistpoty|work> superm1|away: did you come around merging nvidia-settings yet? if not, mind if I'll take a look at it tonight?
<sistpoty|work> oh, tseliot: just saw that you removed conflicts from nvidia-settings. I'll need to undo this. Just a hint: versioned conflicts should almost never be dropped
<persia> directhex: Do you mean "If your revision is a merge from Debian..." ?
<directhex> persia, yeah.
<persia> directhex: Which part is confusing?
<directhex> persia, use of the word "new"
<persia> directhex: Ah.  How do you think it should be phrased?
<directhex> persia, if i want to merge 1.9-1.2 from debian, and 1.2.6-1ubuntu3 is the ubuntu version, then which number goes where in "debdiff packagename_version-debianrevision.dsc packagename_version-newrevision.dsc" ?
<directhex> the debian version is newer, and the debian version is the debian version
<directhex> perhaps i should diff 1.9-1.2 1.9-1.2! \o/
<persia> Maybe.  I was thinking that the "new" revision would be the one the merger prepared.
<stefanlsd> If i have a patch file that someone provided, and I want to include it in a merge ubuntu release.   Is the recommended way to use  dpatch.. ?
<geser> stefanlsd: depends on the package
<stefanlsd> geser: the package currently is not using any patching system (dpatch or cdbs..)
<stefanlsd> or any other i dont know about :)
<geser> stefanlsd: how big are the changes?
<stefanlsd> geser: small. difference of 3 lines...
<geser> stefanlsd: they apply it directly, adding support for dpatch or quilt would be bigger than the patch itself
<geser> stefanlsd: if the package uses cdbs you could use simple-patchsys (or how it is exactly called)
<stefanlsd> geser: ok. thanks, will do.  Just thought it may be easier in the long run for maintainability - but cool. will apply directly :)
<ScottK> If the patch is relevant to Debian, you'll want to send it to them in a bug so they maintain it.  ;-)
<stefanlsd> ScottK: nodnod. I will submit upstream also
<ScottK> YokoZar: Could the vm.mmap_min_addr change for wine perhaps be off by default.  It seems like something only a minority of apps need and I don't generally find myself thinking, "Hey, it's a Windows executable, I think I want less security on this."
<YokoZar> ScottK: I don't think it's a good idea.  A good chunk of modern apps are making 16 bit calls somewhere along the line, including stuff like the .net installer (!)
<directhex> the ms.net installer works?
<ScottK> OK.  I thought from reading mail is was old stuff only.
<YokoZar> ScottK: It is.  But remember that Windows applications often made DOS system calls even as late as 99
<directhex> YokoZar, which is lovely for those of us running 64-bit windows, which has no 16-bit subsystems
<YokoZar> directhex: I imagine it'll be at least 5 years before we see win64 apps that aren't also win32
<directhex> YokoZar, MOAR registers!
<tseliot> sistpoty|work: what's the use case for those conflicts and recommends? Currently each nvidia-glx-VER Recommends: nvidia-settings
<sistpoty|work> tseliot: the use case of the conflicts is to ensure that the upgrade path works
<tseliot> sistpoty|work: the upgrade of what?
<sistpoty|work> tseliot: since iirc the nvidia-settings binary used to live in nvidia-glx (or whatever the conflicts are against) and then has been moved to nvidia-settings (and part time overlapped)
<sistpoty|work> tseliot: so you couldn't install both at the same time
<tseliot> sistpoty|work: ok but this is no longer the case
<sistpoty|work> tseliot: so in case there is a system, which still has the older version (with the conflicting file) installed, that upgrades to intrepid, the upgrade might fail
<sistpoty|work> (because you don't know wether apt will upgrade one or the other package first, if there are no conflicts specified)
<sistpoty|work> I guess it might be safe to drop the conflicts in this case, as I guess we can assume that we don't support upgrades from a pre-LTS version, but they don't really hurt
<tseliot> sistpoty|work: good point. In Update manager I think we check the nvidia-glx package first and upgrade it according to the hardware detection perform through nvidia-common.
<tseliot> sistpoty|work: the gutsy package of nvidia-settings conflicts with nvidia-glx, nvidia-glx-new
<tseliot> sistpoty|work: I was worried about the Recommends which made nvidia-settings install the old nvidia packages
<sistpoty|work> tseliot: dropping recommends is no problem
<tseliot> sistpoty|work: ok, then we've come to an agreement ;)
<sistpoty|work> heh :)
<bhavi_> Hello all
<bhavi_> please help me : http://pastebin.com/d101d4489 is this a correct rules file?
<superm1|away> sistpoty|work, no i got distracted by some other stuff that popped up.
<superm1|away> you can have it if you want, otherwise i should be able to try again this weekend
<sistpoty|work> superm1|away: well I won't come around before somewhen this evening... I'll just drop a note here when I start, ok?
<superm1|away> okay sound good
<bddebian> Heya gang
<huats> hey bddebian
<sistpoty|work> hi bddebian
<ScottK> Heya bddebian.
<bddebian> Hi huats, sistpoty|work, ScottK
<ScottK> bddebian: Got all those RC bugs fixed yet?
<bddebian> Heh, not quite.  I thought you were taking care of them? :)
<geser> Hi bddebian !1!
<bddebian> Heya geser
<persia> sistpoty|work: tseliot: The only supported upgrade path to intrepid is from hardy, so we might be able to drop all the conflicts stuff from nvidia-settings
<sistpoty|work> persia: unless there could be funny situations like for xserver-xorg-driver-ati (which was gone after dapper, but never conflicted against, and hence broke my intrepid upgrade *g*)
<persia> sistpoty|work: Oh my.  Yes.  Still, if the conflicts were in hardy, the necessary bits should have been wiped for intrepid (but we may need new conflicts for intrepid)
<sistpoty|work> persia: well, the question is if all packages that contained file conflicts had new versions in hardy. if so it's safe to drop the conflicts. if one of them vanished it's not safe.
<persia> sistpoty|work: I'll defer to proper investigation then.
<sistpoty|work> either that or I'm conservative and just leave them there. it definitely won't hurt to have them (and we can't sync anyways iirc, but I'm gonna find out more once I start really looking at it *G*)
<tseliot> sistpoty|work, persia: the packages which conflicted with nvidia-settings are nvidia-glx nvidia-glx-new. *Currently* they're both in Intrepid but are deprecated. Keeping the Conflicts wouldn't hurt
<persia> tseliot: OK.  If you think it won't hurt anything, I won't protest.
 * persia just wants to avoid another upload ping-pong match when the nVidia-using machine may be turned on a few weeks before intrepid release
<sistpoty|work> persia: keeping versioned conflicts can *never* hurt ;)
<sistpoty|work> (unless these were wrong in the first place of course
<sistpoty|work> +)
<persia> sistpoty|work: Well, except where it blocks a sync that means we don't have so much work to do later, but in this case, yes, there are other reasons we can't sync.
<persia> heh
<sistpoty|work> heh, well hurt in the sense of introducing a bug *g*
<tseliot> persia: the upgrade to the new nvidia packages (with the new name schemes) should be smooth, nvidia-common will deal with it, since it's used by Update Manager. If however you decide to dist-upgrade from the command line, nvidia-common will bug you to death with Debconf until you install the suggested package ;)
<persia> tseliot: Then that package should be recommended.
<persia> Putting more special-casing into Update Manager should be avoided until we have little choice due to freezes.
<tseliot> persia: currently it is recommended by Update Manager, however it should become  a dependency since recommended packages are not installed by default on Hardy
<tseliot> and without nvidia-common the upgrade will fail
<tseliot> persia: ok, it won't fail but you will keep using a driver which doesn't work
<persia> tseliot: nvidia-common is recommended by update-manager (the package) or by an Update Manager hint?
<sistpoty|work> oh, update manager should really have the hint to not leave my gf's laptop without X after an upgrade *g*
<sistpoty|work> (tried two times, failed two times)
<tseliot> persia: I was convinced that nvidia-common was recommended by the package but it's not...
<persia> tseliot: It oughtn't be, because many users don't need nvidia.
<persia> sistpoty|work: Figure out the issue, and put in a hint if you like.  I suspect it's a matter of making X critical.
<tseliot> persia: nvidia-common is just a simple python script and has the nvidia modalias files as its dependencies
<persia> Anyway, I think update-manager hints should be a last resort: we should make the packages work cleanly anyway.
<sistpoty|work> persia: I guess it's the "if person in front of box == sistpoty then make upgrade harder" part ;)
<persia> tseliot: Yes, but I may not want it on an intel system, if I've only a 2G disk.
<persia> sistpoty|work: Oh, right.  I thought you'd like that bit.
<sistpoty|work> *g*
<tseliot> persia: I understand. BTW jockey-common recommends nvidia-common
<persia> tseliot: Which I don't like either: it offends my sense of purity.
<tseliot> persia: nvidia-common is 53kb
<ScottK> So if I use jockey to deal with my non-free wifi card driver I get nvidia-common installed by default?
<tseliot> ScottK: yes, I guess so
<persia> ScottK: Yes.
<ScottK> That sounds wrong.
<persia> tseliot: In the 2G scenario, that is still a lot.
 * persia notes that it's very much not easy to fit Ubuntu in 2G anyway, so every byte matters.
<tseliot> ScottK, persia: you should discuss this with pitti
<persia> tseliot: See, every time I discuss something with pitti I get reminded of things I should do first :)
<tseliot> persia: it's not a bad thing, is it? :-P
<persia> tseliot: Well, it means I'm unlikely to actually get to the complaint part :)
<tseliot> heh
<tseliot> ScottK: my replacement for guidance-backends is ready (x-kit). I have also added the support for x-kit to Jockey
<ScottK> tseliot: Great.
<tseliot> ScottK: the code is here: https://code.launchpad.net/~albertomilone/xorgparser/main
<ScottK> In KDE4 we can drop it anytime.
<ScottK> tseliot: Is it in Intrepid yet?
<tbielawa> good morning everyone
<tseliot> ScottK: not yet. We're working with bryce and pitti so as to introduce it soon
<ScottK> Sounds good.
<tseliot> ScottK: the gnome-control-center should use it too
<ScottK> tseliot: Would you please talk to the mythbuntu people about it.
<tseliot> ScottK: I guess that only superm1 will use guidance
<tseliot> ScottK: sure
<ScottK> Yes.
<superm1> well we'll switch to xkit when its ready
<superm1> no problem
<tseliot> superm1: great. The API is ready. If you give me a link to your code I can give you a hand
<superm1> tseliot, let me see, it should be the mythbuntu-common bzr branch
<superm1> https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~mythbuntu/mythbuntu/mythbuntu-common
<ScottK> superm1: I also see an rdepend on ubiquity-frontend-mythbuntu
<superm1> ScottK, yeah that was before mythbuntu-common was depending on it directly
<superm1> so that will need to be resolved too
<ScottK> So that's just a matter of dropping the depends then?
<superm1> ScottK, yeah it will be
<tseliot> superm1: ok, I'll have a look at it.
<superm1> ScottK, okay i fixed that in ubiquity bzr
<tseliot> superm1: is it only vnc.py that uses guidance?
<tseliot> superm1: if so, it will take me only few minutes to replace the guidance code with x-kit's
<superm1> tseliot, yeah that's it
<tseliot> great :-)
<JontheEchidna> Ok, so I lost internet connection while uploading to revu
<JontheEchidna> and now it says that the file is already on the server
<Hobbsee> dput -f
<ScottK> or rm the .upload file
<JontheEchidna> rm'ing the upload file worked
<JontheEchidna> thanks
<RainCT> is there some list of %x thingies which can be used in .desktop files? :P
<persia> RainCT: What do you mean?  Experimental keys?  Experimental values?
<persia> On an unrelated note, if anyone is good with schroots: how can I get a usefully populated /sys in a chroot?
<sistpoty|work> persia: you could bind-mount one *g*
<persia> Specificially, timidity currently won't install in my chroots, but installs fine on a normal system.  Apparently this comes from a lack of anything in /dev/snd/
<superm1> persia, you could just mknod stuff in /dev/sdn during debian/rules
<persia> sistpoty|work: OK.  How?  /proc/mounts lists /sys as mounted, it just doesn't have any useful data.
<superm1>  /dev/snd that is
<persia> superm1: Yes, but I don't really want to do that, if I can avoid it: it's a terribly dirty hack.
<persia> Essentially, nothing should build-dep on timidity anyway, so this is only interesting in the case of building images.
<sistpoty|work> persia: s.th. like mount -o bind /sys /var/stuff/chroots/unstable/sys
<superm1> persia, i promise i won't tell anyone :)  I  think bind mounts are the only way to get useful stuff though
<sistpoty|work> (adjust pathes as necessary)
<superm1> you could just bind mount your /dev/snd instead then
<persia> superm1: I think I need useful, as broken entries may well also cause the installation to fail
<superm1> rather than a whole directory and introducing the security vulnerabilities
<persia> (why is it a good idea to start daemons at installation time again?  Can't they be started later?)
<laga> they can
<laga> but i forgot how to do that ;)
<superm1> so that users can start using apps immediately rather than having to read about how to start them or rebooting
<ScottK> persia: Because the package is supposed to work after you install it.  For a daemon to work it has to run.
<superm1> dh_installinit has a parameter to control this behavior
<persia> ScottK: Yes, I know, and in every other case I want that.
<persia> superm1: Yes, but that doesn't solve this one.
<persia> sistpoty|work: bind mounting seems to populate /sys, but it doesn't trigger udev
<ScottK> So edit exit 0 in at the top of the init and remove it later.
<sistpoty|work> persia: then bind-mount /dev as well
<persia> sistpoty|work: Right.  Thanks.  I can now prove the problem.
<sistpoty|work> np
<persia> So, in order to install timidity, one must first have working device files in /dev/snd/ and secondly have run the asoundconf set-default-card macro
<persia> Now I just have to figure out how to do this within the context of a chroot (or maybe hack around it)
<RainCT> persia: serpentine for example has "%U" in the Exec= line
<RainCT> persia: ah, found it, nevermind
<RainCT> they are explained in the spec, I just hadn't noticed them before
<persia> RainCT: http://standards.freedesktop.org/desktop-entry-spec/latest/ar01s06.html
<persia> Oh.  You already found it :)
<RainCT> persia: yes, but thanks anyway :)
<tgm4883_laptop> I tried uploading something to REVU last night (mythstream-parser-youtube) and everything appeared ok, but it doesn't appear on http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/
<tgm4883_laptop> I believe I've followed all the instructions at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU
<sistpoty|work> tgm4883_laptop: did you login with openid to revu yet?
<tgm4883_laptop> yes
<sistpoty|work> tgm4883_laptop: and merged accounts?
<tgm4883_laptop> no
<sistpoty|work> tgm4883_laptop: then please do so ;)
<tgm4883_laptop> ah ok
<tgm4883_laptop> sec
<tgm4883_laptop> will i need to reupload?
<sistpoty|work> tgm4883_laptop: I can put your package right back in the queue
<sistpoty|work> tgm4883_laptop: did you intent to make a native package btw.?
<RainCT> sistpoty|work: merging accounts isn't necessary to be able to upload
<sistpoty|work> RainCT: oh... interesting :)
<tgm4883_laptop> apparenlty I don't have an old revu account
<persia> RainCT: But it does appear to send a refresh event, which can fix some failures.
<sistpoty|work> RainCT: I'll call move_uploads then, and see what happens
<tgm4883_laptop> sistpoty|work, I don't believe so.  By native package, you mean packaged specifically for a debian system?
<sistpoty|work> tgm4883_laptop: yes... at least that's what's left in revu's queue... but it seems s.th. is wrong/missing there
<persia> What does move_uploads do?
<sistpoty|work> RainCT: did you just call move_uploads as well?
 * persia always uses cp to reinsert into the queue
<RainCT> persia: process the queue
<RainCT> sistpoty|work: nope, I'm just looking at the file in rejected/
<sistpoty|work> RainCT: strange, where have the other two files gone to?
<sistpoty|work> (.dsc, .tar.gz
<sistpoty|work> +)
<tgm4883_laptop> sistpoty|work, ah yes, I didn't write the software, just packaging it, so it isn't meant to be a native debian pckage
<RainCT> tgm4883_laptop: btw, the Maintainer must have an @ubuntu.com address; set it to MOTU Team if you don't have one (you can leave your name as XSBC-Original-Maintainer)
<tgm4883_laptop> which means my versioning is incorrect
<sistpoty|work> ugh... seems like cron *might* have interfered... and it seems like either the date of my box or of spooky is wrong *g*
<RainCT> sistpoty|work: what time do you have?
<tgm4883_laptop> RainCT, ok, i'll change that to our team address
<sistpoty|work> RainCT: 18:19
 * RainCT and the server where irssi is running too
<RainCT> I'll change it on spooky (it says :22)
<sistpoty|work> and indeed... cron interfered... I should look better when calling date prior to calling move_uploads: "Fri Aug  8 18:19:58 CEST 2008"
<sistpoty|work> must have been murphy biting me there *g*
<sistpoty|work> anyway, tgm4883_laptop: package is up now
<tgm4883_laptop> i'm a little fuzzy on the version numbering schema, I thought I followed what lintian was telling me, but it keeps giving me the warning
<tgm4883_laptop> sistpoty|work, thanks
<sistpoty|work> np
<tgm4883_laptop> for future uploads, is it going to work automatically or do i need to come in here and ask every time?
<RainCT> persia: I don't see why merging might fix anything
<RainCT> unless it's magic :P
<sistpoty|work> tgm4883_laptop: it should work automatically. *should* *g*
<tgm4883_laptop> ok, i'll fix up these other parser packages I have and test it out
<tgm4883_laptop> need to fix the version thing though first I suppose
 * sistpoty|work heads home... cya
<persia> RainCT: I've been considering it magic, yes.
<warp10> NCommander: thanks ;-)
<NCommander> warp10, Welcome to Cruft Busters :-)
<NCommander> Now we just need some people to file some bugs
<warp10> NCommander: indeed. IIRC you set up a wiki page, right?
<NCommander> yeah
<warp10> NCommander: link?
<NCommander> Grabbing it
<NCommander> warp10, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CruftBusters
<NCommander> comments, criticisms, concerns are welcome
<azeem> cool, the new Launchpad doesn't let me add comments to bugs
<azeem> (we're still using sarge at the uni)
<warp10> NCommander: ah, yeah... /me subscribes to the page
<NCommander> I'd like to work on removing older GCCs from the archive
<NCommander> Probably a good place to start anyway
<NCommander> ANd firefox2
<warp10> NCommander: Indeed. What about opening the LP ML for the team?
<NCommander> warp10, I put a request in
<warp10> NCommander: that would be a good place to discuss these topics
<NCommander> It says "The list will be available in a  few minutes"
<NCommander> So LP must have it almost set up
<warp10> NCommander: ah, great... the last ML I requested needed manual approval by LP admins
 * persia notes that the CC has asked for teams to be created on lists.ubuntu.com instead of lists.launchpad.net when they are for Ubuntu purposes.
<jpds> Requests for new Ubuntu mailing lists should be sent to rt@ubuntu.com.
<warp10> persia: ah, right: good point. I forgot that
<NCommander> CC?
<RainCT> NCommander: community council? :)
<persia> NCommander: They who are the ultimate arbiters of all things Ubuntu
 * NCommander hides in fear of them
<warp10> NCommander: irrelevant: resistance is futile!
 * RoAkSoAx saludos :)
<NCommander> I dunno what I should even email them to ask about the list
<persia> NCommander: Just send an email to rt@ with text like "Please activate the $foo list for $purpose".
<persia> That said, I don't think you need a special list for the cruft-busters.
<jpds> NCommander: With a link to team page and LP. Etc, etc.
<NCommander> well, if this project becomes at all popular, then I'll do that
<persia> NCommander: What do you imagine as a use for the email list?
<NCommander> persia, decision of packages to be removed, and questions Cruft Busters
<persia> If it's coordination, it's probably better to do here, or on ubuntu-motu@ or ubuntu-devel@ if absolutely required (although universe has more cruft than main)
<persia> That's definitely much better on those lists.
<NCommander> ok, we stay on motu unless people bitch
<persia> !ohmy
<ubottu> Please watch your language and topic to help keep this channel family friendly.
<persia> :p
<NCommander> people get steamed and act like Debian Developers.
<NCommander> Happy now persia ?
<warp10> LOL
<jpds> !lol
<ubottu> Please don't use "LOL" and "OMG" and so forth on a regular basis. This is IRC, not IM, and using those lines on their own is not required, and it is rather annoying to the rest of the people in the channel; thanks.
<jpds> :p
<persia> Well, no, but I don't have as easy a time complaining about that.
<laga> omg
<persia> Grrrr..  Why on earth should one run ./configure during clean!
<warp10> jpds: argh :P
<RainCT> warp10: I understand how you feel :P
<warp10> RainCT: :D
<jpds> warp10: /msg ubottu !prayer
<tgm4883_laptop> To upload a change to something I already uploaded to REVU, do I just use the -f flag or is there another way?
<persia> tgm4883_laptop: Remove the .upload file.
 * persia grumbles about libgtk1.2 being part of the recommends stack for devscripts, and wonders if anyone feels like trying to finally kill GTK1.2
<slytherin> tgm4883_laptop: -f should work
<tgm4883_laptop> ok, i pushed it.  I'll check it in 5 minutes to see if it worked automatically
<slytherin> persia: me, me, gtk1.2 has really lived its life.
<warp10> jpds: :D I am wondering how many else command there are that I don't know... /me looks for a list
<directhex> noo, 1.2 is still needed!
<persia> slytherin: You're famously busy right now, but if you think you've time to port the remainders to gtk2+, I shan't complain that much.
<directhex> iirc vmware-agent, which handles resizing the desktop in linux guests when you resize the vmware window, is linked against 1.2
<persia> directhex: For what?  You do know it's incapable of rendering in most locales at this point, don't you?
<slytherin> persia: once I am done with java FTBFS. :-D
<persia> directhex: Get a real VM :p
 * slytherin still has only 512MB RAM. So no VM.
<persia> slytherin: On that note, did you get a chance to update the MoveToUniverse page?
<slytherin> persia: no. was too busy. have much free time today with no office tomorrow. So will do now.
<persia> slytherin: Excellent.  I've some time blocked in about 17 hours to review it :)
<slytherin> persia: of course I have a write a testimonial and a hello planet post before that. :-)
<persia> heh
<slytherin> but should be done in 2 hours.
<slytherin> persia: geser: I wonder why none of you is on Planet Ubuntu.
<persia> slytherin: I don't write anything of interest for there.
<slytherin> persia: But you have a blog, right?
<persia> slytherin: Nope.
<slytherin> oh
<persia> When I'm doing well, I put as much as 10Kb a day here, and similar in email.  Blogging just seems redundant at that point.
<slytherin> :-)
<persia> (plus nobody wants to read a blog about ways to package and pointless device classes: they would rather have their questions answered.
<tacone> is there a command to know if a given .deb file have all dependancies satisfied and can be installed ?
<persia> tacone: dpkg -i
<tacone> persia: don't that actually installs the deb ?
<tacone> s/don't/doesn't/
<persia> Ah.  dpkg --no-act -i
<tacone> oh. thanks :)
<persia> --simulate also works, if you like typiing more characters, or find it easier to remember
<tacone> nice
<slytherin> tacone: in case yiu have gdebi installed and using gnome, just double click the deb
<tacone> slytherin: thanks, I was looking for a programatic method, anyway :)
<sistpoty> ah... those desktop effects somehow snug into my kde and are right now making me nervous *g*
<sebner> sistpoty: I'm near to use ohmy! for your k word :P
<sistpoty> haha
<sistpoty> sebner: well, anything better out there with which I can stay at my favourity mua (which doesn't manage to sign mail currently however)? *g*
<sistpoty> favourite even
<sebner> sistpoty: mua?
<sistpoty> sebner: mail user agent
<sebner> sistpoty: I don't use/like evolution :P
<sebner> TB ftw"
<sebner> !
<sistpoty> sebner: hehe, neither do I (it starts with a k *g*)
<sebner> sistpoty: kevolution? :P
<sistpoty> sebner: yep, just a little bit more lightweight... but I have the feeling that this might change soonish *g*
<sebner> sistpoty: to TB? very good choice :D
<sebner> huhu YokoZar
<sebner> YokoZar: are the staying with stable wine branch?
<YokoZar> sebner: I'm not certain actually.  Wineconf happens to be in September so I plan on asking around there about the best way forward
<sebner> YokoZar: kk :)
<sistpoty> sebner: btw.: still unaddressed bug from me: bug #245591 *eg*
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 245591 in kdebase "konsole: shortcut for new tab changed" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/245591
<YokoZar> sebner: My main concern is no regressions compared with 1.0 for whatever version we use.  Wine's not making another stable release, but maybe someone could make a "semi-stable" release that at least passes that (namely Dan Kegel, Wine 1.0's release manager, who happens to be a big Ubuntu guy :) )
<sebner> YokoZar: well, regressions .. bad but new unstable releases may support new apps/games since a lot improvements happened
<sebner> sistpoty: gnome-terminal does what you want :P
<sistpoty> haha
<sebner> sistpoty: lol! just read your comment xD
<slytherin> sistpoty: I head claws-mail is good, never tried though.
<sistpoty> slytherin: but claws-mail is no window-manager, is it? *g*
<sebner> sistpoty: ehm. question: why ctrl-alt-n? I open a new tab with ctrl+t
<slytherin> sistpoty: I was replying to your MUA comment
<sistpoty> slytherin: the point is that I want to stay with it... after so many years of fighting its bugs *g*
<slytherin> :-)
<sebner> sistpoty: stockholm syndrom :P
<YokoZar> sebner: I know, but not having regressions is like a main feature of Ubuntu :)  -- in the past I didn't care too much, but now that we have an actual stable release we're upgrading from expectations are different
<slytherin> At office I use Ubuntu like Windows. I use whatever apps are installed by default. :-P .... except the fact that I installed terminator. :-)
<sistpoty> sebner: it always used to be ctrl-alt-n for konsole... my fingers have learned that shortcut (and it's easier to type than ctrl-t, as n is right-hand whereas t is left-hand together with left-hand modifier key)
<sebner> YokoZar: True but as we passed LTS ... I want to see intrepid more like edgy :P
<sebner> sistpoty: makes no sense to me xD
<laga> you want intrepid to be more unstable than hardy? ;)
<sebner> laga: intrepid unstable *is* more stable than hardy :P
<sistpoty> sebner: may I blame you user of the "adler-such-system"? :P
<ScottK> YokoZar: Maybe we should have two packages then.  wine and wine-unstable or some such.
<laga> haha
<sebner> sistpoty: hrhr
<sebner> ScottK: seems double work to me and not worth it
<ScottK> We could use Debian as the basis for wine and let YokoZar go nuts on wine-unstable so not double work.
<ScottK> Probably a little extra bugfixing, but no worries about regressions.
 * sebner say: You little stable fanboys and runs away xD
<sebner> *says
<sistpoty> ScottK: not too sure about this... this would shift primary attention to wine (as from unstable), right?
<sebner> sistpoty: version: 4:4.0.83-0ubuntu2 --> may update to current version if it still happenes
<sistpoty> ScottK: maybe the same idea but have wine-stable and wine?
<ScottK> Maybe.
<ScottK> Generally I think you want people who don't now much to install the stable one, so I like my approach better, but either way.
<sistpoty> *shrug*
<YokoZar> ScottK: At this point our Wine package for 1.0 is superior to the Debian one for other reasons
<ScottK> OK.
<sistpoty> sebner: no idea... I've configured my shortcut the way I like it, and it works now *g*
<ScottK> Just trying to maximize benifit and minimize pain.
<sebner> sistpoty: then be happy with it :P
<sebner> huhu norsetto
<norsetto> hi sebner
<sistpoty> sebner: btw.: I still haven't seen a motu-application from you... gogogo ;)
<sebner> hrhr
<sebner> sistpoty: ask norsetto :P
<sistpoty> sebner: I doubt norsetto will fill in the application for you :P
<sebner> sistpoty: but I think in 1-2 months so it doesn't make sense before release so end october I think
<sistpoty> sebner: don't be shy. apply now ;)
<sebner> sistpoty: no no. first some other things to do ;)
<sistpoty> superm1: FYI I'm starting merging nvidia-settings now
<superm1> sistpoty, okay sounds good.  i wasn't going to get to it again until sundayish so that should be fine
<sistpoty> kk
<sistpoty> superm1: just OOI, you specified lp bugs with LP: #bugno,bugno,bugno... does that work? (as vim doesn't seem to highlight it correctly)
<crimsun> yes, it does.
<superm1> sistpoty, it should work
<crimsun> oh wait, no
<crimsun> you need LP: #foo, #bar, #baz
<crimsun> the leading hash is necessary
<sistpoty> crimsun: hm... OTOH bug #195241 seems to prove that it at least did work in the past
<ubottu> sistpoty: Bug 195241 on http://launchpad.net/bugs/195241 is private
<crimsun> ah, it's \s*
<crimsun> (?:,\s*\#\d+)*
<crimsun> but that's just for generating the source package
<crimsun> (and is that private due to the stack trace?)
<sistpoty> (probably more due to coredump, but I guess so)
<slytherin> wow, hamster-applet is an approved module of next GNOMErelease.
<Laney> ember: Hey, did you forward your disable update notification patch for Wordpress to Debian?
<Laney> (just got annoyed by it on my Debian server)
<alex-weej_> http://alex-weej.blogspot.com/2008/08/sucata-run-2008.html
<alex-weej_> http://alex-weej.blogspot.com/2008/08/sucata-run-2008.html
<laga> nice car. you bought it because of the head unit, right?
<laga> alex-weej_: so the goal of the whole race is to raise 1000 pounds?
<alex-weej_> laga: just our team haha
<alex-weej_> there are about 100 teams
<alex-weej_> btw sorry for double post, i thought /amsg was only network-wide
<alex-weej_> i did it once here and then again on gimpnet :S
<alex-weej_> i am now getting loads of abuse
<alex-weej_> way to shoot myself in the foot
<alex-weej_> and yes, the head unit is pretty awesome haha
<alex-weej_> dog saliva less so
<alex-weej_> and it's not a race, we will die if it's a race!
<laga> alex-weej_: best of luck. looks like an awesome event
<alex-weej_> cheers :D
<alex-weej_> we are 3% of the way lol
<laga> although 1000 pounds isn't that much compared to the amount of money spent on cars and gas ;)
<alex-weej_> before anyone else grills me for spam, sorry. "/amsg" works for all networks at once in X-Chat, CAUTION!
<sistpoty> did I grumble about ubuntu breaking reportbug yet?
<sebner> sistpoty: nope
<sistpoty> *grml* about ubuntu breaking reportbug *g*
<sistpoty> aha, the world is small, so henning (whom I met once and smoked some pot^W cigarettes with) reported a bug about ubuntu's reportbug as well *g*
<Laney> Luckily reportbug -B debian still works
<sebner> sistpoty: a bug about the bugreporting tool? doesn't this break *everything*? ^^
<sistpoty> Laney: nope, it doesn't... it relays via fiordland even if told otherwise :(
<sistpoty> sebner: hehe, the universe will explode now *g*
<sebner> sistpoty: tick tick tick
<Laney> sistpoty: Oh, I think I edited the smtp server in reportbug.conf
<sebner> BUMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMm
<NCommander> does anyone know if the .changes files on things uploaded to either Ubuntu or Debian are saved
<sistpoty> NCommander: actually these are published on the changes-lists
<NCommander> Or given a package, and its dsc, a quick way to regenerate the .changes file without rebuilding every source package?
 * NCommander was hoping for something he could wget ...
<sistpoty> NCommander: the changes-lists are public, so you can wget these
<sistpoty> NCommander: e.g. https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/intrepid-changes
<NCommander> I need to generate .changes for every source package and a few thousand binary packages for importation into dak
<NCommander> I was hoping for a format that would be easier to parse ;-)
<sistpoty> NCommander: maybe dpkg-genchanges might also be s.th. what you're looking for?
<jpds> NCommander: https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/intrepid/+source/irssi-plugin-otr/0.2-1
<jpds> NCommander: There's a "View changesfile" link to the .changes
<sistpoty> jpds: an now for a ppa :P
<NCommander> That's a start
<NCommander> Do you know if something like that exists for Debian?
<jpds> sistpoty: https://edge.launchpad.net/~jpds/+archive
<jpds> "(changesfile)"
<NCommander> sistpoty, dpkg-genchanges requires you to rebuild the source package
<sistpoty> jpds: (phew) no changes file public there :)
<slytherin> persia: added some packages for evaluation to MoveToUniverse page.
<NCommander> very painful when your dealing with the entire Debian archive
<sistpoty> NCommander: for debian, there is a list as well, but I've never managed to recall the list url
<jpds> sistpoty: Actually.. it is.
<sistpoty> jpds: but only for your own ppa hopefully?
<sistpoty> jpds: otherwise I'd subscribe you to bug #159304
<ubottu> sistpoty: Bug 159304 on http://launchpad.net/bugs/159304 is private
<jpds> sistpoty: Ah, good point.
<sistpoty> jpds: oh my, I just found your changes file by guessing :(
<sistpoty> (signed even)
<jpds> Really should chmod 0600 like REVU.
<NCommander> why aren't changes files that publically accessible? (it seems they are never pubically shown anywhere)
<jpds> NCommander: Because if it has not been uploaded to Ubuntu/Debian, someone can grab the source package and upload it themselves.
<NCommander> I meant more like files that have bene uploaded
<sistpoty> NCommander: .changes files are basically tickets
<sistpoty> NCommander: they are only meant to grant access for *one* upload
<sistpoty> NCommander: after that the version is in the archive, and no other upload with the same .changes file is valid (aka the ticked has expired)
<NCommander> yeah
<NCommander> Its just anonying because dak has no mechanism it seems to import without each file having a changes
<NCommander> You can easily see how that's going to get anonying real quick
<sistpoty> NCommander: actually I doubt that you'll need to rebuild a package to generate a .changes file
<sistpoty> (at leat an unsigned one)
<NCommander> The .dsc and the changes aren't that different
<NCommander> I can probably cook a utility to do the changes
<sistpoty> NCommander: from an archive POV the .dsc is a description of the (source) package
<NCommander> But there is a depricated "import-archive" dak command that can. in theory, do what I want
<sistpoty> NCommander: while the .changes file is only a "ticket"
<NCommander> I meant the contents are similar
<NCommander> Its only a few changed fields between the two
<sistpoty> NCommander: not really... the .dsc describes parts of the source package... the .changes parts of the *upload*
<sistpoty> NCommander: it's quite different if you add binary packages to it
<sistpoty> (to the upload)
<NCommander> I just need to import source packages ATM
<NCommander> Well, this archive importer might do what I need it to
<NCommander> I still will need to build a source package builder to roll any new source packages
<NCommander> I need some regex help
<NCommander> If I got the name the full name of the dsc file, how can I determine the orig package file
<NCommander> i.e hello_2.2-2.dsc to hello_2.2.orig.tar.gz
<RainCT> NCommander: Python?
<sistpoty> gn8 everyone
#ubuntu-motu 2008-08-09
<emgent> heya
<NCommander> emgent, hola
 * NCommander is seeing how well launchpad works at 14.4k
<ScottK> NCommander: Probably not too bad with no CSS or images.
<NCommander> It works in lynx
<NCommander> I'm looking for packages that are crufty ;-)
<NCommander> someone needs o change the topic in here
<NCommander> It still says the next MOTU meeting is today at 8 UTC
<NCommander> *4 UTC
<ScottK> NCommander: So change it.
<tbielawa> hello everybody!
<NCommander> ScottK, I'm not a member of ubuntu-irc, thus no ops power here
<ScottK> NCommander: Try it.
* NCommander changed the topic of #ubuntu-motu to: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU | Want to get involved with the MOTUs?  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing | Intrepid open, go wild!  https://merges.ubuntu.com/universe.html | QA targets available from  http://qa.ubuntuwire.com | TODAY - Another day!! Keep working. | Next MOTU meeting:  Fr, august 8th, 4:00UTC | All your bases?
<NCommander> O_O;
<ScottK> NCommander: OK.  Now fix it.
* NCommander changed the topic of #ubuntu-motu to: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU | Want to get involved with the MOTUs?  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing | Intrepid open, go wild!  https://merges.ubuntu.com/universe.html | QA targets available from  http://qa.ubuntuwire.com | TODAY - Another day!! Keep working. | Next MOTU meeting:  Fr, august 22th, 5:00UTC |
<NCommander> ScottK, I'm trying, but I'm seriously lagging
<slytherin> I was wondering if anyone has already evaluated possibility of getting java-3d in repository.
<NCommander> slytherin, what's the license?
<slytherin> NCommander: I haven't looked yet. That is why I asked.
<slytherin> NCommander: I think it is redistributable binary only.
<slytherin> NCommander: I am wrong, part BSD part GPL. :-)
<slytherin> when using cdbs, if I am specifying all the locations appropriately in debian/install file then do I actually need install target in rules file?
<azeem> slytherin: no, cdbs would do it for you
<slytherin> azeem: cool
<azeem> one could argue the other way round: *If* you need an install: target, either the build system is broken or the package is too complex for cdbs
<ScottK> azeem: Sendmail uses CDBS.  No package is too complex for CDBS if you want it bad enough.
<slytherin> I use CDBS mainly for java apps and I feel CDBS really makes life easier.
<foxbuntu> anyone have a quick minute to ack a package?
<tgm4883_laptop> If anyone has some spare time to revu a package i'd appreciate some input on mythstream-parser-youtube.  I have 8 other packages that are parsers too but want to make sure I did this one right before I upload them all
<ScottK> foxbuntu and tgm4883_laptop: Your odds go up if you provide a link to the packagae on REVU.
<tgm4883_laptop> ScottK, sorry, thanks   http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=mythstream-parser-youtube
<foxbuntu> http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=mythbuntu-log-grabber
<superm1> tgm4883_laptop, i left you a few comments there to address
<tgm4883_laptop> superm1, thanks
<foxbuntu> sorry but to put two and two together, for any that might be willing to revu my package, thanks: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=mythbuntu-log-grabber
<foxbuntu> sorry but to put two and two together, for any that might be willing to revu my package, thanks: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=mythbuntu-log-grabber
<NCommander> hello world :-)
<foxbuntu> would someone be able to revu my package, it would be greatly appreciated: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=mythbuntu-log-grabber
<ScottK> foxbuntu: If it's not a review day, asking once a day is considered polite.
<ScottK> Any Java packaging meisters around?
 * ScottK suddenly remembers there's a channel for that...
<foxbuntu> ScottK, sorry was just popping in and out and figured with all the people coming and going hoping for someone new willing to help out
<ScottK> foxbuntu: Just so you know ...
 * foxbuntu notes and will stop asking
<ScottK> This has been a very slow cycle for new packages.  I know it's frustrating on that end of the problem.
<RoAkSoAx> hey yall
<foxbuntu> ScottK, its alright as long as it gets there I guess, I have a brandnew app I need to complete anyways
<TomJaeger> Alright, here's the deal.  Chances are, you're gonna hate me after this, but I don't care.
<TomJaeger> Basically, I'm going to ask that my package be taken down from revu unless someone commits to reviewing it
<TomJaeger> I'm really unhappy how this has all played out and I feel like you guys haven't been honest upfront.
<TomJaeger> I feel like I'm a valuable member of the community, and I'll continue to do my part, but I don't think this is how you should be treated.
<white> TomJaeger: ?
<white> TomJaeger: are you trying to get a new package in? If you give me a link to a patch, I can give you some comments :)
<TomJaeger> I've been putting a lot of work into getting my package accepted and except for some wisecracking and some condescending attitude, I haven't gotten any response whatsoever
<TomJaeger> white, yeah, I've been trying to do that for a week or so
<white> TomJaeger: do I get a link now? :)
<TomJaeger> http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=easystroke
<white> so it is a completely new package?
<TomJaeger> yes
<ScottK> TomJaeger: I'm not sure why, but this has been a really slow cycle for reviews.  I remember it being frustrating on that end of the equation.
<ScottK> white: Everything on REVU is supposed to be completely new stuff.
<white> TomJaeger: intentions to bring it into debian?
<white> ScottK: ah
<wgrant> ScottK: But in practice it is not.
<TomJaeger> ScottK, this is not really the problem, the problem is that nobody ever told me what the deal was
<ScottK> TomJaeger: I don't think we knew.
<ScottK> It's not like was all got together and said "Let's not review stuff for Intrepid".
<ScottK> It just seems to be working out slowly.
<TomJaeger> white, I don't have a debian system running and I think it's bad practice to personally support things that you can't test
<ScottK> TomJaeger: It's quite possible for most types of packages to use Ubuntu and a Debian chroot to test effectively.
<TomJaeger> ScottK, this case is pretty sensitive to the version of xserver, among other things (they sometimes gratuitously change stuff from one version to the next)
<white> TomJaeger: are you going to maintain the package or is it a one time contribution?
<TomJaeger> ScottK, it wouldn't have been such an issue if someone had told me that it's going to get reviewed eventually, or what I could do to speed up the process, but as it stands, I feel like I'm completely at the mercy of an elite group of MOTUs and the uncertainty has kind of held back other stuff that I had to do.
<TomJaeger> white, yes, I do stand behind the software I write.
<white> TomJaeger: just wondering, because it states that the MOTUs are the maintainer
<wgrant> white: That is our policy at the moment, unfortunately.
<wgrant> Some of us feel that it shouldn't be the case.
<TomJaeger> I thought you were supposed to do that
<wgrant> TomJaeger: That is correct.
<white> TomJaeger: sounds like interesting software, i do suggest you setup a debian chroot, fill an ITP bug against wnpp on bugs.debian.org and send an email to debian-mentors@ for a sponsoring request
<TomJaeger> It's one of the things I changed after a reading lots reviews for other packages
<white> TomJaeger: if it works with the versions of xserver in debian and ubuntu, it could just be synced
<TomJaeger> see, nobody has told me before that this is the way to go about this
<white> TomJaeger: this way a broader community can benefit from it
<white> TomJaeger: this is the debian way, but both debian and ubuntu (and all other derivates) will benefit from it :)
<wgrant> Getting things into Debian first is almost always a better idea.
<white> TomJaeger: and you could be the maintainer of the package :)
<TomJaeger> The thing is, debian had a broken xserver / wacom-driver combination for like 6 months and nobody felt like doing anything about it, that's why I don't really trust debian at this point
<white> TomJaeger: did you bring that to someones attention? it is always possible to send patches to the debian bts :)
<TomJaeger> it was too obvious.  If anybody really did care, they would have fixed it, it was just a wacom driver update
<white> any php guys here? If i use strip_tags() does it remove any php,java,html,$others tags from a string?
<tgm4883_laptop> If any motu has some extra time to revu something, I'd sure appreciate another look at http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=mythstream-parser-youtube
<white> it sounds a little unreliable :)
<white> TomJaeger: often the debian maintainers are pretty busy and stuff that is obvious to a certain user does not have to be obvious for the maintainers :/
<TomJaeger> there wasn't any bug reports filed either
<wgrant> TomJaeger: THen file a bug?
<white> TomJaeger: see, next time just fill a bug ;)
<white> s/fill/file/
<wgrant> If something in one of my packages is broken on some config that I don't have, you can't expect me to fix it unless I know the problem exists. And I want to fix it.
<TomJaeger> if I'm not running debian, why would I file a debian bug report?
<tuxmaniac> good morning all
<white> TomJaeger: because it makes sense fixing bugs upstream
<ScottK> TomJaeger: We routinely forward bug reports to Debian that relevant to them too (often with patches, but not always).
<TomJaeger> debian is upstream?
<ScottK> For Ubuntu, sure.
<white> TomJaeger: :)
<ScottK> TomJaeger: There are over 1,000 Debian Developers and ~100 in Ubuntu.  We want to get as much work out of them as we can.
<TomJaeger> So if I file a bug report that I have a certain problem on ubuntu and based on the versions of the relevant packages I suspect that the same bug exists in debian, you're saying they're not going to laugh at me?
<white> TomJaeger: it would be nice, if you could verify that the bug exists in debian as well
<white> TomJaeger: it is not too hard to setup a chroot ;)
<TomJaeger> complete with x server and everything?
<TomJaeger> are there instructions out somewhere?
<white> TomJaeger: alternatively, you could also use one of the many emulation softwares around :)
<TomJaeger> it seems easier to actually install debian than doing the whole chroot thing
<white> TomJaeger: on debian sid the package FTBFSes, see http://paste.debian.net/14299/
<TomJaeger> wow, python2.5 is a build dependency and it fails to find python
<white> TomJaeger: are you familiar with cowbuilder/pbuilder?
<white> TomJaeger: you might want to check it out, since it is an essential tool for building a final package and finding all build-depends
<TomJaeger> I've used pbuilder before, though I prefer to just dump the package to my PPA and then see what happens
<white> TomJaeger: i can recommend cowbuilder, it uses pbuilder and symlinks and is pretty fast
<TomJaeger> okay, I'll check it out, but what you posted was a simple dpkg-buildpackage in a chroot, right?
<white> TomJaeger: it was a build with cowbuilder
<TomJaeger> ouch
<white> essentially it is dpkg-buildpackage in a chroot :)
<nxvl> damn libtool!
<TomJaeger> white, so does cowbuilder automatically install dependencies or not?
<NCommander> nxvl, what evil is it doing now?
<white> TomJaeger: it uses pbuilder and yes it installs a minimal chroot and then all the build-depends
<nxvl> NCommander: courier doesn't build in intrepid but it does on debian (same source package) because of libtool
<TomJaeger> but how can it not find python if python-2.5 is a build-depend?
<NCommander> nxvl, well libtool is about as nice as a pile of cow dung
<TomJaeger> anyway, I'm capable of figuring out the details, that's not the issue
<nxvl> NCommander: http://paste.ubuntu.com/35777/
<TomJaeger> so you're telling me is that what I should do is try to get the package accepted into debian first?
 * wgrant always supports that idea.
<nxvl> TomJaeger: i use revu for revision, and once acepted in ubuntu forward it to debian
<nxvl> debian inclusion process is widely slower than ubuntu one
<white> nxvl: but without having a maintainer in debian, you won't get the package in
<TomJaeger> oh, it's even slower than ubuntu?
<NCommander> nxvl, it's fast in Ubuntu if you nag around here
<NCommander> :-)
<white> TomJaeger: it depends on who is reviewing it and when, can be very fast or very slow
<white> TomJaeger: you need to find a sponsor
<nxvl> white: you can always maintain packages
<TomJaeger> well, I've made a decision not to go around begging for someone to review it anymore.
<white> nxvl: of course, as long as you maintain them in debian :)
<TomJaeger> That's too humiliating and time-consuming
<nxvl> NCommander: please! a package can wait 2 months on incoming.d.o before it's inclusion
<nxvl> white: that's what i meant
<NCommander> nxvl, Oh, THAT inclusion
<NCommander> THat's normal
<NCommander> :-)
<white> TomJaeger: it is an email to a mailinglist and then see, if someone picks it up
<NCommander> It's because of the way dak handles new packages thats so braindead
<wgrant> It's the same in Ubuntu...
<TomJaeger> The thing is, I don't even mind it taking it a little bit longer, but I'd prefer not to be kept in the dark about the process.
<white> NCommander: you need manual processing
<TomJaeger> white, are you talking about debian?
<nxvl> almost all of my debian sponsors are ubuntu developers
<NCommander> white, yup, but its a pain to do it in dak IMHO. I don't know how Soyuz is in that respect
<nxvl> :D
<tgm4883_laptop> On an initial package, do we always have to list a bug?  ie, if i'm just packaging something new, do I need to also file a "needs packaging" bug?
<wgrant> NCommander: What's so painful about it?
<white> NCommander: why?
<white> NCommander: it's quite easy actually :)
<NCommander> Well, dak has six queues
<TomJaeger> honestly, I'm not sure if I can take any more of this bureaucracy
<NCommander> white, your a debian archive admin?
<NCommander> (or run dak?)
<wgrant> TomJaeger: What bureaucracy?
<white> NCommander: i maintain dak for debian-edu
<NCommander> Heh
 * NCommander runs dak for the lenny m68k release ;-)
<NCommander> Importing the entire debian archive
<NCommander> That was fun
<wgrant> TomJaeger: We need to stop awful packages from getting into Ubuntu. The barrier for entry is quite low.
<white> NCommander: you have one NEW queue with all the new packages :)
<nxvl> white: in ubuntu archive admins are faster than debian ones
<NCommander> white, I find manually setting overrides for each package to be rather tedious
<NCommander> white, I'm not sure if debian-edu has a contrib or non-free section
<white> nxvl: well i am sure that if you pay some people to do NEW processing, it will be faster ;)
<white> NCommander: we use "local", so no main, contrib or non-free
<NCommander> white, do you require overriding every new package that hits your Incoming?
<TomJaeger> wgrant, then tell people that their packages are probably not going to be expected, then they know what to expect instead of checking revu every day for half an hour and nothing happening
<white> NCommander: yes
<TomJaeger> s/expected/accepted/
<white> NCommander: and deactivate override emails
<NCommander> Out of the box, any package that isn't recongized needs manual intervention to be added to the archive and set the m/c/nf switch
<nxvl> white: that's what i meant
<NCommander> I dunno
<wgrant> TomJaeger: Doesn't it tell you everywhere that you should ask?
<nxvl> :D
<NCommander> I'd find it tedious to do
<NCommander> But thats just me
<TomJaeger> wgrant, what do you mean, ask?
<white> NCommander: you need to do some scripting, when you have something like openoffice hitting the queue ;)
<wgrant> TomJaeger: You're meant to ask in this channel for people to look at your package...
<NCommander> I need to do some scripting to import the m68k unstable binaries, and weed out ones for versions not in testing
<TomJaeger> yeah, right, like that's going to accomplish anything
<wgrant> Why wouldn't it?
 * NCommander thinks TomJaeger been around d-sponsors too long
<wgrant> If people know that your package exists, they are more likely to review it.
<white> TomJaeger: it can be quite useful to interact with a sponsor
<white> especially at the beginning
 * NCommander agrees with white 
<NCommander> white, do you run britney on your dak server?
<white> no way
<NCommander> ah, so you avoiding that piece of braindamage ;-)
<white> indeed
 * NCommander has to set it up >.<;
<white> NCommander: my spare time is not unlimited ;)
<NCommander> I ran britney before
<NCommander> WIthout the connected dak server
<NCommander> So it shouldn't be such a nightmare to get running I hope
<TomJaeger> well, this is the only package I'm ever going to try to get in (unless I write another piece of software), packaging is not my forte, but I'll do it if it needs to be done.  I really don't know anybody who is a MOTU and who I could ask.
<white> TomJaeger: that is not unusual
<white> and quite often it is also fun to get to know other people and their motivations
<white> at least i made it a habbit to have some small talk with sponsorees
<TomJaeger> be that as it may, I don't think I have the time for all that social interaction
<TomJaeger> if I see a bug that annoys me and I figure out how to fix it, I'll tell people
<TomJaeger> If I have something to share with the community, I'll share it
<TomJaeger> but that's about the extent of involment that I want to commit myself to
<TomJaeger> if that makes me an ubuntu anti-social, then that's okay with me, I'd still like to think I'm helpful at least to some people
<white> well, then do that and file the bugs, send an email for the package, ...
<TomJaeger> at this point though, my primary concern is that I just don't want to deal with this issue anymore
<TomJaeger> it's just been taking up too much of my time
<white> TomJaeger: you are not making it easy for people to help you :)
<white> TomJaeger: here is a guide for debian and once it's in debian it can easily be synced I guess: http://mentors.debian.net/cgi-bin/welcome
<TomJaeger> all right, I'll try the debian route (even if that means it definitely won't make it into intrepid)
<TomJaeger> which is frustrating, because this is what I've been working towards
<white> when will intrepid be frozen?
<tacone> white: 28th august I guess
<TomJaeger> maybe three weeks from now
<white> well, you could state your ubuntu involvement in the mail to debian-mentors@ and maybe someone, who is a MOTU and a DD will pick it up
<TomJaeger> well, maybe
<TomJaeger> the important thing is not to get your hopes up, though, because you are going to get disappointed
<white> it might also not be the best idea to add a new package just before a release
<white> bugs quite often tend to be discovered after an upload
<TomJaeger> there's only one release every six months so this is what you're going to have to go for
<white> a package can age though and bugs can easily be fixed in a development version
<white> it gets harder when it comes to fixing bugs in a stable version :)
<TomJaeger> so-called stability is overrated.  If something works for you, it works for you, the package doesn't have to be ten years old for that
<TomJaeger> it's just a slap in the face of users who are seeing bugs that are fixed in later versions that are not deemed stable
<TomJaeger> so does revu send out email notices if there are comments?
<white> TomJaeger: that might be your personal view, i am pretty happy that certain servers use a stable release, instead of bleeding edge software :)
<TomJaeger> the software that I'm developing is desktop software, not server software
<white> and of course you always test it on all the different hardwares available to assure that it runs for everyone? You must spend a lot of time on testing ;)
<TomJaeger> So my users have two choices: They can either use a six-month old version from the archives that is deemed stable but nevertheless does have bugs that -- while they might be annoying -- aren't really dealbreakers or they could use the latest version and if they have an issue with it they can just send me an email and I might within a few days.
<TomJaeger> *I might fix it within a few days
<white> this is the typical upstream vs. maintainer discussion a lot of debian people (and ubuntu i assume) have with upstreams :)
<TomJaeger> of course I can't test every possible situation, but if an issue arises, I usually know how to fix it.  That's better than to just live with it.
<TomJaeger> But this thing is, even if I might not agree with you guys, I'll still be willing to do things your way to get the software accepted into the archives.
<andrew_sayers> TomJaeger: You're assuming that your users want to spend that sort of time and social effort with you.
 * Treenaks is building a package of http://www.pharscape.org/component/option,com_forum/Itemid,68/page,viewtopic/t,425/
<Treenaks> tiniest package _ever_ :)
<TomJaeger> For example, even though it was a pita, I backported all the license clarifications and actually released a new upstream version with the same code, but including a license header.
<TomJaeger> andrew_sayers, it's enough if only a fraction of the user base is willing to do that because people tend to have the same problems.
<TomJaeger> You have to listen to them, though and not dismiss everything out of hand
<andrew_sayers> Yeah, but the others need the out-of-date stable version.
<TomJaeger> If they don't care enough to try out the latest version if they have a problem and they're also too lazy to contact me, then I don't care
<TomJaeger> anyway, that's not the issue
<TomJaeger> if I try to get a package accepted into a distribution, I'll play by the distribution's rules
<TomJaeger> and if that means pain-in-the-ass backporting, then I'll do it
<andrew_sayers> Well, I have no argument with that :)
<TomJaeger> What I do have a problem with is if I ask if I should go through all this trouble and you're all like, yeah, go ahead and then nothing happens.
<TomJaeger> The appropriate response would have been: Don't even bother to try to improve your package before you're sure anybody will be looking at it
<white> TomJaeger: i gave you some advice now, I suggest you go and follow it. Constant blaming here will unlikely result in finding someone, who is willing to work with you
 * porthose agrees with white
<TomJaeger> well if I had any hope in finding anybody to work with me, I'd probably wouldn't be writing this.  This is based on the experience I previously had in this channel not on this encounter.
<TomJaeger> That said, I do appreciate your trying to help me and I'll try to follow the advice
<TomJaeger> So what I'm going to do is I'll unassign myself from the bug report, I'll add a comment to my revu page that I'll still be willing to work on the package, but that I'm just not going to check revu anymore, so they should email me if they have any comments and then I'll see if I can get the software running in a debian chroot or, failing that, a debian installation and then I'll try to get it into debian first
<Druui> hi
<ion_> superm1: Thanks a lot for the information! I was just wondering about that.
<superm1> huh?  what did i say?
<superm1> ion_, ^?
<ion_> superm1: You informed all of us that you went away at 10:01 and came back at 10:19. Weâre thankful for the useful information.
<superm1> ion_, i informed?  oh no.  if my IRC proxy is informing people when i get disconnected....
<superm1> was it just a nick change?
<superm1> or actual away announce
<ion_> It was an away announce in the form of a nick change.
<superm1> ion_, yeah i had an internet hicup locally
<ion_> Yeah, i was just saying, thanks for informing us about that.
<superm1> but my IRC proxy does do that (it's typically more useful when i actually disconnect for extended periods of times :))
<Iulian> Good morning.
 * persia notices backscroll and points out that REVU sends all the comments to a mailing list, which may be easier than polling the site for those waiting for package reviews.
<nxvl> persia: it should send them to the uploaders e-mail aswell
<persia> nxvl: That sounds like a good idea.  Do you want to file the bug?
<nxvl> persia: i'm just about to sleep, but i will do tomorrow morning
<nxvl> :D
<nxvl> i'm sick of libtool
<persia> nxvl: I'll do it now then: it's stupidly frustrating to have to check the site every day when the system has notifications anyway.
<nxvl> yep
<persia> heh bug #254081
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 254081 in revu "Send email to uploaders when new comments are posted." [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/254081
<nxvl> the LP OpenID API should have some way to check e-mail addresses
<nxvl> or at least ask for them in login time
<nxvl> i think
<nxvl> well
<nxvl> i'm gone now
<persia> They are available from the package anyway.  Good night.
<nxvl> read you later (or tomorrow)
<persia> (or, worst case, the associated GPG key)
<nxvl> persia: heh, true
<persia> I've an init script issue: http://paste.ubuntu.com/35805/ exits with a non-zero value when /proc/asound is not present.  Does anyone have any suggestions on how to force it to both end the init script and provide an exit value of 0 ?
 * persia reads more about {}
<stefanlsd> persia: what about putting it in an if statement?
<persia> stefanlsd: Yeah, that was my next try :)
<stefanlsd> yeah. should work.  the  [   ]   is short notation for  the linux command   test
<stefanlsd> and the || used in the example says - only run the next part of the command if the first part fails.    (as opposed to && which says - run the next part only if the first part returns success)
<persia> Right.  I only want to send the log message and exit the init script when there aren't any sound devices
<persia> (it doesn't make sense to poll the sound devices when there aren't any)
<stefanlsd> persia: probably want something like this - http://paste.ubuntu.com/35810/
<persia> stefanlsd: I just tried it with [ ! -d /proc/asound ]; then, and an extra echo Trapped.
<persia> It did trap it, but it didn't exit
<stefanlsd> persia: should work - http://paste.ubuntu.com/35812/   here u can see the last echo doesnt run...
<persia> stefanlsd: Thanks for the hint.  As it turns out, the original logic was correct: it's just that log_end_msg and log_warning_msg are failing.
 * persia doesn't feel particularly insightful today
<slytherin> Is it necessary to use @ubuntu.com address in changelog if you have one?
<persia> No, although most people do.
<slytherin> persia: is there anything for/against it?
<persia> I try to use my @ubuntu.com email for everything Ubuntu because it makes it easier for me to filter my mail.
<porthose> bobbo: ping
<laga> \sh: "your wifes"? ;))
<laga> just reading your blog post
<slytherin> persia: what are your thoughts on this? https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/183139
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 183139 in openjdk-6 "[wishlist] make gtk laf default for icedtea-java" [Wishlist,Triaged]
<persia> slytherin: Personally I like it, but 1) I think it would be better to ask in #ubuntu-java (but nobody is there right now), and I'd like to hear from yuriy, as he had some things to say about how Java was working with Kubuntu: I don't know if such a switch would break something there.
<slytherin> persia: right, that is a point even I considered. A particular look and feel is part of JRE and does not depend on native libraries IIRC. A java app with GTK LNF will be as much odd one out on Kubuntu as much one with Metal KNF.
<persia> slytherin: Right, although someone of the art & branding persuasion may feel that having Java be metal is somehow preferable.
<persia> Basically, if yuriy (or someone else who has interest in both Java and Kubuntu) says GTK isn't more broken, I'd like to see it switched.  If it is more broken, I'm less sure.
<slytherin> persia: I will attach few screenshots of an example application to that bug and let people comment on that.
<persia> slytherin: That makes sense.  You might also try asking if anyone in #kubuntu-devel has an opinion.
<persia> (perhaps post-screenshots)
<slytherin> persia: I will talk to yuriy first.
<Laney> Does a new microrelease SRU version number need ~hardy1 (or similar) at the end? As the package will be the same as the one in Intrepid
<geser> Laney: yes, or something other between the version in hardy and the version in intrepid
<Laney> geser: Even if the versions in Hardy and Intrepid are the same?
<Laney> done it anyway
<geser> Laney: does intrepid have already the new version?
<Laney> geser: Yeah
<geser> how can then hardy and intrepid have the same version? or do you mean after the SRU?
<Laney> That's what I mean, yes
<Laney> They will both be at .17-0ubuntu1 then
<geser> as the hardy version and the intrepid version are build in different environments it's better to upgrade the package when someone upgrades from hardy to intrepid
<emgent> moin
 * slytherin takes a break for some food after a successful merge.
 * Laney merges with slytherin 
<slytherin> persia: geser: I will be glad if anyone of you can sponsor this merge - bug 227125
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 227125 in jabref "Please merge jabref 2.3.1-3 (universe) from Debian unstable (contrib)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/227125
<Laney> k0p: umit is built!
<Laney> rlaney@chicken:~/dev/ubuntu/packaging/glom$ rmadison umit umit | 0.9.5-0ubuntu1 | intrepid/universe | source
<Laney> oh, source only :O
<Laney> well, LP says it's built :(
<k0p> hmmm
<geser> binary NEW: https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/intrepid/+queue?queue_state=0&queue_text=umit
<k0p> Laney, is need a requirement to compile?
<k0p> what means that?
<sebner> k0p: in some days it will hit the archive
<geser> k0p: every new package gets inspected by an archive admin before it gets included into the archive
<k0p> geser, but the sources is already on the archive
<k0p> sebner, :) ok
<geser> k0p: first the source needs to pass NEW, and later also the newly build debs
<k0p> hmm ok
<k0p> thanks everyone
<geser> slytherin: jabref uploaded
<slytherin> geser: thanks. :-)
<slytherin> geser: can you please also ack removal of libjaxp1.2-java from archive? bug 251973
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 251973 in libjaxp1.2-java "Please remove the package from repositories" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/251973
<geser> I knew I've forgotten something
<geser> slytherin: are there perhaps some third party apps that might need it? or will they work with libjaxp1.3?
<slytherin> geser: I don't know. Should we really care about third party apps?
<geser> slytherin: not really, I just wonder as Debian has it still in their archive and Ubuntu seldom moves ahead with removing packages
<slytherin> geser: yes, Debian having old packages in archives is what causes people to keep using it even. But in this particular case there are no rdepends or reverse-build-depends.
<geser> slytherin: is JAXP 1.3 the successor or JAXP 1.2?
<slytherin> geser: yes
<slytherin> geser: LOL, even jaxp1.3 is in end of life. There will be no further releases.
<geser> slytherin: ACKed as upstreams also considers 1.3 as EndOfLife, so it's really time to drop 1.2
<slytherin> geser: Do you have any non-VM installation of intrepid, is it stable enough? I was thinking about upgrading so that I can give more time on actually testing some java apps/libs.
<geser> slytherin: my desktop is running intrepid since some weeks now, without problems (at least for me)
<slytherin> geser: that is cool. I will upgrade today then. :-)
<slytherin> I was thinking of upgrading my ibook first but its power adapter is broken and repair will take time.
<geser> slytherin: please report bugs for any upgrade issues you encounter
<slytherin> sure. :-)
 * RainCT uploads ubuntu-dev-tools 0.35
<slytherin> LucidFox: your timing is perfect. I was waiting for you. :-)
<LucidFox> You fixed electric?
<RainCT> what is debuild's -v option for?
<slytherin> LucidFox: yes, only 2 changes not done. Everything else fixed.
<elmargol> If I build a qt4 application it required opengl now?
<elmargol> requires
<LucidFox> elmargol> Only if it depends on QtOpenGL
<geser> RainCT: without looking into the code, my guess is that it gets passed to dpkg-genchanges: Causes  changelog  information  from all versions strictly later than version to be used.
<RainCT> geser: ah, thanks
<slytherin> LucidFox: any comments? I am going out for some work for 2-3 hours.
<LucidFox> slytherin> let me see
<LucidFox> slytherin> You can generate the XPM icon from any other image in, say, GIMP, and then put it in the debian directory
<penguin42> Does anyone here know nspluginwrapper? I've put in a launchpad entry asking for it to be upgraded to the latest version; is there any chance of that happening for Intrepid - the version in Hardy has a nasty problem with flash crashing regularly that's apparently fixed (#254422)
<slytherin> LucidFox: is that so urgent?
<LucidFox> probably not
<LucidFox> let me test-build it
<slytherin> Can anyone please explain what this condition means? ifeq (,$(filter $(DEB_HOST_ARCH), alpha))
<LucidFox> It checks if the package is being built on the alpha platform, I think
<LucidFox> slytherin> http://paste.ubuntu.com/35845/
<ion_> On any other platform than alpha, i think.
<slytherin> LucidFox: I have java home properly specified.
<LucidFox> ah\
<LucidFox> indeed
<LucidFox> and I even explicitly exported JAVA_HOME when that failed
<LucidFox> actually, with CDBS, you need to use JAVA_HOME_DIRS instead of JAVA_HOME
<LucidFox> and list the allowed JAVA_HOME values
<LucidFox> Ah, wait
<LucidFox> I get it
<LucidFox> everything is fine
<slytherin> LucidFox: no, JAVA_HOME_DIRS is needed when you are using multiple jdk, for different arch
<LucidFox> but I'm building the source package on Hardy, which doesn't have default-java
<slytherin> :-D
<LucidFox> Well, I think at least the _source_ package should build on hardy, if not the binary package
<LucidFox> And I was under the impression that JAVA_HOME_DIRS makes ant.mk try the listed JAVA_HOMEs in order until it finds a valid one
<slytherin> LucidFox: yes, you are right. But since it is arch all package it will be compiled on i386, so other JAVA_HOME will not come into picture anyway.
<LucidFox> I've changed the line to
<LucidFox> JAVA_HOME_DIRS := /usr/lib/jvm/default-java /usr/lib/jvm/java-6-openjdk /usr/lib/jvm/java-6-sun
<LucidFox> now it builds
<LucidFox> now building the binary package in pbuilder
<slytherin> LucidFox: Then change it to ï»¿JAVA_HOME_DIRS := /usr/lib/jvm/default-java /usr/lib/jvm/java-5-sun /usr/lib/jvm/java-6-sun please.
<LucidFox> why not openjdk first?
<LucidFox> I can insert java-1.5.0-sun, but I'd like to keep openjdk
<slytherin> LucidFox: default-java is symlink to openjdk
<LucidFox> On Intrepid. But not Hardy.
<slytherin> LucidFox: but the update is for intrepid right? :-)
<LucidFox> Yes, but I need to build the source package first before uploading it
<slytherin> LucidFox: on hardy it will build with sun jdk since there is no openjdk in build depends.
<slytherin> I mean for you at least.
<LucidFox> I don't have Sun JDK installed! It's proprietary! :p
<LucidFox> just kidding
<LucidFox> but this will allow it to be backported
<LucidFox> (hopefully)
<slytherin> LucidFox: Build it in intrepid pbuilder. It is risky matter to upload something to intrepid but testing it in hardy pbuilder.
<slytherin> LucidFox: if you are thinking about backport, then it will be good to also add openjdk in build depends.
<LucidFox> I'm testing the binary package in intrepid pbuilder
<LucidFox> but to test something in pbuilder (or to upload  it to Ubuntu for that matter), I need to build the source package first :)
<slytherin> LucidFox: Ok. Whatever way you want to do it. I am going now. Will be back after 2-3 hours.
<LucidFox> All right
<LucidFox> I'll be still online then
<persia> RainCT: To answer the question differently, -v is used when uploading something that spans several changelog entries, as when processing a merge from Debian.
<persia> sebner: Please fix bug #256347
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 256347 in almanah "Error in Original Maintainer (usually from Debian)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/256347
<sebner> persia: I'm unsure "how" ;)
<persia> sebner: Well, how did the package get this way: did you package it through REVU?
<sebner> persia: yes, I was first and my package is better but I don't want to be rude :)
<persia> sebner: Ah.  Right.  Grumble.  This is why it's good to file an ITP :)
<persia> Anyway, can it be merged?
<persia> Also, if the package isn't based on the Debian package, it might be good to mention that in the bug, although I still think it's worth doing a merge.
<persia> (depends on things like the orig.tar.gz, etc.)
<sebner> persia: In generel I can merge it though it differes sometimes
<sebner> persia: how are my changes to convince him to make me the debian maintainer?
<persia> sebner: Are the orig.tar.gz files the same?
<persia> Your chances are fairly low, although you may be able to be co-maintainer.
<persia> When you package something, it's best practice to file either an RFP or ITP in Debian: the former if you want someone else to be Maintainer, and the latter if you want to be maintainer.
<sebner> persia: I'm sure he not even contaced upstream -.-
<persia> sebner: He could have copied your package, changed it to put in his name, and he would still be able to be "Original Maintainer".  This seems odd, but is a consequence of the goal of basing everything off Debian.
<sebner> persia: however I think it's better if I try first 1) ask if I can be (co-)maintainer 2) convince him to take some patches (manpage ,..) so we can sync it
<persia> sebner: That does sound better.  You could even have the conversation in the bug: first note that you didn't base the package off his, but created it separately, and would be happy to collaborate.
<sebner> persia: because I have good contact with upstream and package another programm of him :P
<sebner> morning afflux :)
<sebner> persia: *packaged
 * afflux kicks the loose cable in the hub under the table
<afflux> heya sebner :>
<sebner> afflux: wlan?
<persia> My.  Looking at the "patch", I think it's fairly clear there is no common history between the packages.  I wonder why he thinks you based it off his package.
<afflux> sebner: ni ni ni!
<sebner> persia: dunno, debian guys ....
<persia> sebner: Indeed.  That's exactly the sort of upstream coordination that would suit you well as the Debian Maintainer, but now that there is another one, you'll need to coordinate.
<persia> sebner: Careful: there's no small number of Debian developers here :)
<sebner> persia: hrhr, I know :P
<sebner> persia: btw, how you got attention to that (small) bug? O_o
<azeem> he's not a DD
<azeem> AFAICT
<azeem> (or she)
<sebner> azeem: who?
<azeem> hrm, I thought this was about https://launchpad.net/bugs/256347
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 256347 in almanah "Error in Original Maintainer (usually from Debian)" [Undecided,New]
<sebner> azeem: sure he isn't
<sebner> azeem: he has 2 packages in Debian
<sebner> huhu DktrKranz
<persia> sebner: I (try to) watch all the bugs as they arrive in #ubuntu-bugs-announce.  Some of them I think out be escalated.
<DktrKranz> aloha sebner
<azeem> sebner: well, it's not clear whether it's a man or a woman from the name, I think
<sebner> azeem: https://edge.launchpad.net/~angel-abad  ;)
<sebner> persia: kk, btw. what about you being a DD?
<azeem> sebner: oh, so it's a Ubuntu guy, rather :P
<persia> sebner: What?
<sebner> persia: no intention to become one?
<sebner> azeem: not that active though
<persia> sebner: No time, really.  I maintain 1 package in Debian (and might add some more if I have time), and work with a collaborative Debian team.  I don't find not having upload rights blocks me much.
<sebner> persia: kk :)
<DktrKranz> sebner, what about YOU to become one? :P
<persia> sebner: One of the requirements when undergoes the NM process is a demonstration that one can allocate sufficient time to be a good DD.  It's not all about technical knowledge or understanding the social contract.
<sebner> DktrKranz: you can mentor me if you are one :P
<sebner> persia: I see :)
<persia> sebner: It doesn't quite work that way: you'll want to get an AM from the Front Desk if you want to do NM.
<sebner> persia: joke ;)
<persia> sebner: Why?  It's a reasonable goal, and if you're as active as you are, it may be useful to be a DD.
<azeem> becoming a DM takes less time and is quite useful as well
<sebner> persia: hrmpf, People are telling me I should apply for motu. Even more you and DktrKranz are telling me to become a DD. Calm down folks xD
<DaneM1> Hi, everybody.  I'm a novice at packaging (trying to learn), and I'm trying to package the latest version of empathy for hardy.  It compiles just fine using the ./configure && make && make install method, but when I try to compile it in pbuilder, it errors out.  I've copied the build-depends from the one in the intrepid source repos., and made packages (using pbuilder) for the dependencies that are not in the hardy repos.  Can
<persia> sebner: Well, they are different.  Typically one applies for MOTU after completing the demonstration period.  In Debian, it's wise to apply early, as then one's work (e.g. collaboration on almanah) counts towards the demonstration.
<persia> On the other hand, if you want to focus your time on MOTU, we shan't complain :)
<sebner> persia: you say it man :)
<RainCT> persia: thanks for the info (I was away)
<mok0> Hmm, my upload to REVU never showed up.
<persia> RainCT: -v and -k and what not are the sorts of things that are useful as MOTU, but fairly meaningless when requesting sponsorship.  There might be some others.  Might you have time to collect them on a wiki page?  I'm thinking it might be good to have a doc for new MOTU that covers the differences between things that are to be sponsored and things that are to be uploaded.
<mok0> Has anything changed wrt REVU over the summer? (apart from the layout)
<RainCT> mok0: Yes, it has a new suer system. You authenticathe over OpenID with Launchpad, now
<persia> mok0: The means by which one logs in, the means by which keys are synced, and more.  Usage is mostly the same.
<RainCT> mok0: and instead of getting the keys from all members of revu-uploaders periodically, they are synced for the individual users each time they log in
<mok0> RainCT: how would that affect an upload?
<mok0> RainCT: perhaps I need to log on once using openid?
<RainCT> mok0: You have to log in once before you upload so that your key is synced. Also, you can merge your old account after logging in, so that you get your MOTU status back.
<mok0> :-)
<mok0> RainCT: thanks
<RainCT> yw :)
<mok0> RainCT: hey that's cool!
<DaneM1> would somebody mind helping me with my packing problem?
 * mok0 re-uploads
<persia> DaneM1: Please describe said problem.
<DaneM1> I'm a novice at packaging (trying to learn), and I'm trying to package the latest version of empathy for hardy.  It compiles just fine using the ./configure && make && make install method, but when I try to compile it in pbuilder, it errors out.  I've copied the build-depends from the one in the intrepid source repos., and made packages (using pbuilder) for the dependencies that are not in the hardy repos.
<persia> mok0: No need for that: just ask for queue reinsertion :)
<azeem> DaneM1: you will have to quote the error for us being to help you
<DaneM1> I want to learn some stuff, test empathy with Asterisk, and make my work available to anybody who wants it :-)
<mok0> persia: arghh didn't see your note before I uploaded.
<DaneM1> sure.  One min.
<DaneM1> Here's a sample.  I'll pasebin the rest...
<DaneM1> libtool: link: x86_64-linux-gnu-gcc -shared  .libs/pyempathymodule.o .libs/pyempathy.o   -Wl,-rpath -Wl,/tmp/buildd/empathy-2.23.6/libempathy/.libs -lffi /usr/lib/libgconf-2.so /usr/lib/libglade-2.0.so /usr/lib/libgtk-x11-2.0.so /usr/lib/libgdk-x11-2.0.so /usr/lib/libatk-1.0.so /usr/lib/libgdk_pixbuf-2.0.so -lm /usr/lib/libpangocairo-1.0.so /usr/lib/libpango-1.0.so /usr/lib/libcairo.so /usr/lib/libfreetype.so -lz -lfontconfig 
<DaneM1> .libs/pyempathymodule.o: In function `pygobject_init':
<DaneM1> /usr/include/pygtk-2.0/pygobject.h:315: undefined reference to `PyImport_ImportModule'
<DaneM1> /usr/include/pygtk-2.0/pygobject.h:337: undefined reference to `PyObject_GetAttrString'
<persia> mok0: reuploading works too, but REVU admins (when they are around) can just copy the .changes from rejected into the queue, which saves bandwidth and later rejection cleanup.
<mok0> DaneM1: missing dependency
<DaneM1> (sorry if I spammed...not sure how much I can paste)
<DaneM1> figured that.  I really don't know what to do though; I've searched google and added a bunch of python and other stuff to build-depends, to no avail.
<DaneM1> should I pastebin any files so you can see what I've been trying?
<persia> Better to use a pastebin rather than pasting directly in the channel.  paste.ubuntu.com is one.
<DaneM1> ok
<RainCT> DaneM1: Which version do you want? If 2.23.6 is enough you might be able to rebuild the version from Intrepid for Hardy
<laga> DaneM1: okay, so you backported the dependencies with pbuilder and now you're trying to build empathy in pbuilder?
<DaneM1> empathy-2.23.6
<mok0> DaneM1: Let's see your Depends line too
<DaneM1> laga: that's right.  I've built the depends (telepathy and missioncontrol stuff) using pbuilder.
<persia> Actually, a pastebin of debian/control would be better than just the depends.
<DaneM1> mok0: sure...pastebinning my control file
<DaneM1> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/35860/
<laga> DaneM1: and now you're building empathy in pbuilder?
<DaneM1> much of it is copied from the intrepid source package (hope that's not considered plaigurism or some such).
<DaneM1> laga: yes.
<laga> DaneM1: well, you need to make sure the dependencies are available in pbuilder
<laga> otherwise, pbuilder will just use what's available in the repositories
<DaneM1> laga: nodnod.  I've used --login --saveconfig and added them to the archive using another terminal, then installed them using the logged-in terminal.
<laga> ah. okay.
<mok0> DaneM1: but did you update your pbuilder recently?
<DaneM1> mok0 hmmm...don't think so.  I'll do that now.
<DaneM1> mok0: "0 upgraded, 0 newly installed, 0 to remove and 0 not upgraded."
<ScottK> Hello mok0.
<ScottK> It's been a while since I've seen you.
<mok0> ScottK: yeah, I've been busy doing other stuff
<mok0> Now I am resurfacing...
<ScottK> Great.  Glad to have you back.
<mok0> :-) thanks
<mok0> Good to be back
<DaneM1> here's the error in its entirety: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/35865/
<mok0> DaneM1: yeechhh
<DaneM1> mok0: hehe...no fun here :-p
<mok0> DaneM1: Looks like pygtk-codegen-2.0 is having trouble
<mok0> That could be the cause of your problems
<DaneM1> hmm...I wonder if I should specify that explicitly as a build-depend...
<DaneM1> that's odd...it's not in the hardy repos, as far as I can tell
<mok0> DaneM1: It looks like it's run alright, but it fails
<DaneM1> mok0: any idea why it would build find on my fully updated hardy install, but not in a fully updated pbuilder?
<mok0> DaneM1: It's in python-gtk2-dev
<mok0> DaneM1: not right now :-)
<DaneM1> mot0: maybe the package is messed-up.  Should I try clearing the archive?
<mok0> DaneM1: I don't think that will  help
<DaneM1> k
<DaneM1> mok0: I'm going to try making a new pbuilder...maybe that will help (I've messed with this one a lot)
<mok0> DaneM1: what is the version of  python-gtk2-dev in your pbuilder/workstation respectively?
<DaneM1> checking...
<DaneM1> mok0: lol!  It's not even installed on my workstation!
<DaneM1> mok0: maybe if I remove it entirely from the build-depends...
<mok0> DaneM1: Huh? And you can build the package?
<DaneM1> mok0: yeah!  very strange.  I wonder if the library(ies) are provided by another package
<mok0> DaneM1: ... or perhaps that codegen thing is not called when it isn't installed, and it's not really needed
<DaneM1> mok0: could be.  I'm trying a build without python-gtk2-dev...
<mok0> DaneM1: k
<DaneM1> mok0: OK...now we're getting somewhere: I have a different error, later in the compile process!
<mok0> DaneM1: your first log does say: "Warning: Constructor for EmpathyChatroom needs to be updated to new API"
<DaneM1> mok0: (lines separated by "\"): dh_installchangelogs ChangeLog \ install: cannot stat `ChangeLog': No such file or directory \ dh_installchangelogs: command returned error code 256
<DaneM1> mok0: what does that mean?
<azeem> it means there's no ChangeLog file
<mok0> the dh_install... is called from debian/rules
<DaneM1> hehe should I just rename changelog to ChangeLog?
<mok0> DaneM1: no
<DaneM1> k
<mok0> DaneM1: check in rules
<DaneM1> nodnod.
<mok0> DaneM1: you can change the name there
<DaneM1> it was called ChangeLog in rules.  Changed it to lowercase...trying again
<RainCT> bobbo: why does mozilla-checky have a ubuntu2 revision but not a ubuntu1? :P
<mok0> DaneM1: Perhaps you should check in the empathy writeup... it seems the newest version requires a very new version of python-gtk2
<DaneM1> mok0: where might I find the writeup?
<ScottK> RainCT: I read your mail on mozilla stuff.  I think that needs to be on a wiki page somewhere if it's not already.
<mok0> DaneM1: I suppose it must be in the tarball
<mok0> DaneM1: README?
<DaneM1> mok0: aah...silly me :-)
<mok0> nomen est omen
<DaneM1> mok0: it just says to use ./autogen.sh, make, make install, then run empathy.
<mok0> DaneM1: it doesn't say anything about what else is required?
<DaneM1> mok0: no :-(
<mok0> DaneM1: what about upsstream''s website?
<DaneM1> looking
<porthose> nxvl: ping
<nxvl> porthose: :D
<mok0> DaneM1: be back in 15 min
<DaneM1> k
<porthose> could you update junior.csv for me my bzr is broken right now
<porthose> bobbo paired with suman
<nxvl> ok
<bobbo> porthose: pong
<porthose> nxvl thx
<bobbo> sorry!
<porthose> bobbo: np
<nxvl> porthose: starting date today?
<porthose> nxvl: yes
 * porthose goes back to fixing bzr
<RainCT> ScottK: okay, I'll write it down somewhere
<nxvl> porthose: just rm -rf and branch
<porthose> nxvl: will try that :)
<nxvl> porthose: pushed
<porthose> :)
<LucidFox> Is "debian-changelog-line-too-long" a blocker for updated packages?
<Kopfgeldjaeger> nm 0.7 in intrepid \o/
<Treenaks> Kopfgeldjaeger: but it breaks on my pcmcia/umts card
<mok0> LucidFox: can't you fix it?
<LucidFox> I can, but is it allowed?
<Kopfgeldjaeger> yeah, it probably really needs some (eeh.. damn much) tuning
<LucidFox> when sponsoring someone else's package
<persia> LucidFox: No, but if the too-long changelog entry is in the most recent changelog, it's best to get it fixed before uploading.
<LucidFox> yes, it is in the most recent entry
<persia> LucidFox: Yes, if you just add whilespace to the changelog, and want to give them credit, that's usually fine.
<mok0> LucidFox: it is just the wrapping that needs fixing
<persia> If you do something more substantive, it's good to add it to the changelog so you get a multiple-author changelog.
<persia> norsetto: actually, there's a few things that FTBFS because of the timidity thing: something appears to have changed in the way chroots handle /sys for intrepid, which made that significantly less of a corner case.
<RainCT> how can I mark code blocks on the wiki?
<tgm4883_laptop> If any motu has some extra time to revu something, I'd sure appreciate another look at http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=mythstream-parser-youtube
<persia> RainCT: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/HelpOnFormatting
<RainCT> thanks
<LucidFox> Is it possible to validate man pages without building a package and running lintian against it?
<RainCT> LucidFox: try man --warnings
<LucidFox> tried, and it doesn't print any warnings
<persia> LucidFox: You can fiddle with nroff -man and lexgrog if you like.
<LucidFox> but lintian does
<persia> Which error?
<LucidFox> W: electric: manpage-has-errors-from-man usr/share/man/man1/electric.1.gz 256: warning: `cadrc' not defined
<LucidFox> This is the only warning lintian gives - but when I open it in mc, it prints a different warning entirely
<LucidFox> man --warnings -l electric.1 doesn't produce any warnings at all
<persia> Strange.  That seems to be exactly the command lintian runs against it.
<persia> Maybe the groff_man or groff_mdoc manpages can help?
<LucidFox> I've looked at the source for /usr/share/lintian/checks/manpages
<mok0> LucidFox: did you try lexgrog?
<RainCT> ScottK, fta: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MozillaTeam/Extensions/Merging
<RainCT> (improvements are welcome)
<ScottK> RainCT: Thanks.
<LucidFox> "lexgrog electric.1" doesn't generate any warnings either
<persia> LucidFox: Hmmm..  Frustrating, that.
<ScottK> RainCT: Looks reasonable to me, my only comment is that I'm not sure Debian can write Iceweasel/Firefox in anything visible to the end user without trademark problems.
<LucidFox> Guess I'll have to rebuild the package on every manpage change
<RainCT> ScottK: I don't know, but I've seen packages in Debian that do this
<LucidFox> Oh come on...
<RainCT> ScottK: but being the extensions which says which says that it works with Iceweasel and Firefox I don't see why it might be a problem
<ScottK> RainCT: Make sense.
<LucidFox> Just because "Firefox" is a Mozilla trademark doesn't mean everyone suddenly can't use the "Firefox" in any text whatsoever.
<LucidFox> * the word
<ScottK> Understand.
<persia> LucidFox: But likely not in the context of a computer program except when referencing the specific trademarked product.
<azeem> "Remember, it's spelled `Netscape', but pronounced `Mozilla'"
<persia> (depends on where it's trademarked, where the text exists, and prevailing fashions in interpretation of trademark law in the jurisdiction in which the conflict is considered)
<LucidFox> So I can't say "This program works under Windows" just because I can't distribute software and call it "Windows"?
<Kopfgeldjaeger> http://changelogs.ubuntu.com/changelogs/pool/main/j/john/john_1.7.2-3ubuntu1/changelog <-- hm, interesting changelog entry
<persia> LucidFox: Rather, if you use the word "Windows" in the context of computer software, you should mean "Microsoft Windows" explicitly, rather than some other meaning.
<persia> Mind you, this is a poor example, as "Windows" itself isn't trademarked for use in Computer Software
<persia> (although e.g. "Windows XP" is)
<LucidFox> From my understanding, "Firefox" being a Mozilla trademark simply means that you can't distribute something and call it Firefox without their permission. I don't think it prohibits you to distribute software claiming that it's "a Firefox extension", which is what the question is about.
<persia> You also are prohibited from referring to epiphany-browser as "Firefox".
<LucidFox> Someone does that?
<RainCT> persia: yes, but because then you would be claiming that Epiphany *is* Firefox, not that it can be used with Firefox, like in the case of the extensions
<persia> RainCT: Well, maybe.  None of us is likely to provide actual legal advice to Debian in #ubuntu-motu, nor should they accept it if we tried (SPI has counsel for that). :)
<RainCT> Adri2000: still nothing new about MoM?
<ScottK> dholbach: A couple of us are discussing an idea for harvest.  Would you be able to join us on #ubuntu-quality ?
<RainCT> bobbo: ping
<Adri2000> RainCT: Keybuk replied to some bugs a few days ago
<bobbo> RainCT: hey
<RoAkSoAx> hay guys, i have a question! Is there a policy about triaging [need-packaging] bugs? (I mean, for example, if some package is currently unmaintained... how should we set the Status and Importance)
<bobbo> RainCT: can you email or /msg me it? I'm just about to go out
<RainCT> bobbo: I just wanted to ask if you tested mozilla-checky with Firefox 3
<bobbo> RainCT: I dont think I have been working on mozilla-checky...
<RainCT> bobbo: the last revision is from you
<bobbo> RainCT: ah, no I wasnt aware I should have been testing it
<RainCT> RoAkSoAx: Not that I know.. Just check if it's in Ubuntu or the current Ubuntu development version and if it isn't and the licensing is fine, mark it as confirmed
<RainCT> bobbo: You've added firefox as an alternative dependency to it, but Debian doesn't have iceweasel as one, and the homepage says that it was tested with Firefox 1.0
<bobbo> RainCT: so you want me to test it on an Intrepid firefox 3 to make sure it is actually an alt dependency?
<RainCT> bobbo: I removed it again, and did some some other changes necessary for the package to work with SeaMonkey (see my mail on ubuntu-motu@)
<RainCT> bobbo: but yes, if you want you can test it with Firefox 3 and if it works add the alternative dependency again (but you'll have to figure out what symlink you've to create for Firefox to recognize it)
<bobbo> RainCT: ah ok, I wasnt totally sure of what I was doing for that upload, so you;ve probably fixed it :D
<bobbo> right i gotta go
<RainCT> bobbo: okay, have fun
<RoAkSoAx> RainCT, ok cool thanks :)
<RainCT> RoAkSoAx: also ensure that they have the needs-packaging tag (beside having "[needs-packaging]" in the title) and set the importance to wishlist if you can
<RoAkSoAx> RainCT, will do :) thanks
<RainCT> but that isn't that important; I've a script for that which I run from time to time :P
<RainCT> np :)
<dholbach> ScottK: do you think you could file a bug about it? I'm about to leave in a bit
<persia> RoAkSoAx: The best way to progress those bugs is to package the software: of course, please only package software that you actually want to use, and would be willing to help keep up to date.
<ScottK> dholbach: It's more complicated then that.
<ScottK> dholbach: You should join us in #ubuntu-quality when you have some time.
<dholbach> I'm invited to a birthday party and need to leave in a bit
<RoAkSoAx> persia, what if the software is no longer maintained but is still useful... wouldn't it be a deprecated piece of software after a while? and maybe is useless to package it?
<ScottK> Sure
<persia> RoAkSoAx: If upstream is no longer there, maybe "wontfix" is the right status for the bug.  If upstream is around, and the package is "mature" (there is a community, but no commits, and no outstanding bugs), it depends entirely on how useful the software could be.
<RoAkSoAx> persia, perfect, that's what i wanted to know exactly, thanks :)
<slytherin> LucidFox: I am back
<LucidFox> slytherin> Good, I've found two more issues in electric
<slytherin> tell me
<LucidFox> W: electric: manpage-has-errors-from-man usr/share/man/man1/electric.1.gz 256: warning: `cadrc' not defined
<LucidFox> W: electric: debian-changelog-line-too-long line 27
<slytherin> ahh, I must have overlooked lintian warnings
<LucidFox> you should run lintian on the deb after building
<persia> (lintian -iIv, and on the $(arch).changes file)
<slytherin> LucidFox: hmm, I am not sure what Ican do about manpage since I didn't write it. But I will fix changelog problem.
<RoAkSoAx> is there any wikipage on how to use lintian ?
<LucidFox> man lintian
<LucidFox> :)
<LucidFox> per persia's advice, I use "lintian -iIv packagename.deb"
<RoAkSoAx> what about dsc's
<LucidFox> slytherin> who did write the manpage, though?
<persia> What!  No.  $(arch).changes
<LucidFox> what's the difference? :)
<RainCT> persia: what's the difference?
<RainCT> :P
<slytherin> LucidFox: it was there in debian directory in previous version, 6.x
<LucidFox> ah
<LucidFox> well, you can modify it
<persia> IF you run on $(arch).changes, lintian will process all the .deb files generated by the package.  Also, it won't repeat the verbose explanation for the errors on repeats, but only once, which makes the output less obnoxious to read.
<LucidFox> ah
<LucidFox> I didn't know it was possible to run lintian on deb packages
<persia> (in the case where the package only creates one .deb, it's not that different, really, except that it checks a couple things in the .changes file)
<persia> Yep.  You can run on .deb, .changes, or .dsc
<persia> For maximum information about a pacakge in a single run, you want to have a .changes that represents both a source and binary build.
<LucidFox> persia> slytherin is preparing a major world-breaking update for a package removed from unstable (but still in testing), should we strive for lintian cleanliness or minimum divergence from the old Debian package?
<persia> Of course, generating one of those safely is tricky :)
<persia> LucidFox: If it's no longer maintained in Debian (either orphaned or removed), and we want it, strive for perfection.
<LucidFox> aye, captain
<slytherin> persia: mr. tuxmaniac from motu science team requested the update. :-)
<persia> slytherin: Then you know who to poke to help test :)
<sebner> persia: do you know if debian meebey repo something (semi-)official?
<persia> sebner: I don't understand that question.
<sebner> persia: forgot a "is" ^^
<sebner> persia: http://debian.meebey.net/
<persia> sebner: Never heard of it before.
<sebner> persia: so a private project!? thanks :)
<sebner> nxvl: go go go ... for motu
<LucidFox> meebey has a website?
<LucidFox> I didn't know
<sebner> ^^
<sebner> LucidFox: you know them?
<nxvl> sebner: :D
<LucidFox> meebey? He's Mirco Bauer, a Mono maintainer, and he's available on #debian-mono on irc.oftc.net
<sebner> LucidFox: so his private repo?
<LucidFox> No idea - I didn't know it existed
<sebner> ah ok ^^
<nxvl> sebner: i'm scared as hell
<sebner> nxvl: why? I think you'll make it easily
<nxvl> sebner: yep, but not having a review and being myself in front of the archives makes me scared (i think everyone is at the beginning
<nxvl> )
<sebner> nxvl: don't worry =)
<RainCT> :)
<LucidFox> sebner>
<LucidFox> <meebey> its the playground for the official packages
<LucidFox> <meebey> whatever goes there will end up sooner or later in debian
<sebner> LucidFox: fine fine, thx
<emgent> heya
<sebner> emgent: \o/
<slytherin> LucidFox: what is JAVA_HOME for sun-java6-jdk?
<LucidFox> /usr/lib/jvm/java-6-sun
<slytherin> LucidFox: are you sure? because for 5, it is /usr/lib/jvm/java-1.5.0-sun
<LucidFox> Yes, I'm sure
<LucidFox> I sincerely beg you to include openjdk as well, its JAVA_HOME is /usr/lib/jvm/java-6-openjdk
<slytherin> LucidFox: yes that is what I am doing
<marnold> Hello does anyone have any objections to re-introducing emerald-themes for intrepid
<sebner> marnold: isn't emerald obsolete?
<slytherin> marnold: why were they removed?
<sebner> slytherin: isn't that a beryl thing?
<slytherin> sebner: So emerald does not work at all with compizfusion?
<marnold> the logs say removal of beryl but emerald is still in the repos
<sebner> slytherin: I think that was the window manager of beryl and pretty obsolete
<persia> marnold: Is that better then removing emerald from the repos?
<marnold> it and the themes tarball are sti;; being maintianed upstream
<RainCT> uh? emerald works fine here
<marnold> still *
<slytherin> marnold: well you first need to answer this question. "Does emerald work with compizfusion"?
<marnold> yes
<marnold> as i am using it
 * RainCT can confirm that
<marnold> and upstream still maintains it
<marnold> and it is still in the archive
<RainCT> yep, I think I update the package to a new version some months ago
<marnold> looks like someone just forgot to do the themes package
<slytherin> persia: did you get a chance to look at MoveToUniverse page?
<RainCT> guys.. I'm working on user feeds for REVU and I need feedback on how you would like it to be
<nxvl> RainCT: o/
<nxvl> RainCT: that's the idea?
<nxvl> RainCT: to have an rss feed about the comments?
<RainCT> eg, having one entry for each package and listing all the comments in it, having individual entry for all comment against uploads from you and entries for all uploads, etc
<RainCT> nxvl: atom, but yes
<nxvl> RainCT: so i will need to subscribe myself to every package's feed?
<nxvl> RainCT: wouldn't it better to use the main information from the package and send them by mail?
<RainCT> nxvl: I said "user feed", not "package feed" (which is also planned) :)
<RainCT> and mail notifications are also planned, but for some reason I find email stuff boring and will leave that for NCommander :P
<nxvl> RainCT: so one feed for all my packages? that would be awesome
<RainCT> yep
<RainCT> nxvl: the question is, should it have entries for everyting ("Uploaded package XXX, upload id YYY" entries which would say if it is lintian clean or not and not much more, "Comment for package XXX (YYY) from ZZZ" entries for each comment, etc.) or some other structure?
<nxvl> RainCT: i know what i did
<nxvl> RainCT: i want to know what everyone else do
<RainCT> nxvl: yep, with the comments I mean all comments against a package uploaded by you
<nxvl> RainCT: yeah, what i meant is: i don't really want to get an update about if i uploaded a package
<nxvl> RainCT: i know that i did it
<nxvl> RainCT: what i found awesome is in mentors.debian.net you get an ACCEPTED or Rejected e-mail (as in the archive) about your packages
<RainCT> nxvl: (about the uploaded packages:) ah, yes. but this way I can put the lintian output and such stuff there (which nobody seems to notice). also, you can subscribe to feeds from other people (like your mentee or whatever)
<nxvl> RainCT: agreed
<slytherin> persia: any idea why updates to netbeans packages are on revu? There should be bugs logged instead, right?
<RainCT> perhaps a &uploads=no option could be added, but I'm not sure if that's really necessary
<nxvl> RainCT: no, now that i understand what you meant i'm for it
<slytherin> LucidFox: I am almost done. fixed both warnings. Added openjdk to build deps and made a small change in get-orig-source.
<LucidFox> slytherin> Great
<LucidFox> Have you uploaded it?
<slytherin> LucidFox: doing a last build to be sure. 5 minutes.
<penguin42> hi I'd like to ask for nspluginwrapper to be updated to the latest version - I can't see a Debian version of it either however; the version in Hardy is very very flaky but apparently fixed in the latest version; I've filed a launchpad bug #254422
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 254422 in nspluginwrapper "nspluginwrapper 1.0.0 released; please update" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/254422
<crimsun> penguin42: it has been updated source-wise in a ppa.
<crimsun> penguin42: i.e., the mozillateam has it in its ppa.
<penguin42> ppa?
<crimsun> penguin42: they'd appreciate feedback in their channel, too
<RoAkSoAx> penguin42, Personal Package Archive (PPA)
<penguin42> ah right - which is the mozillateams channel?
<crimsun> penguin42: https://launchpad.net/~mozillateam/+archive
<crimsun> ubuntu-mozillateam
<penguin42> ah right, thanks I'll go and look in there - it would be great for that to get into Intrepid; the one in Hardy is very broken
<slytherin> LucidFox: done
 * ScottK suggests reading http://www.doxpara.com/DMK_BO2K8.ppt and then consider if they really want to install code from an unsigned repository (PPAs are unsigned).
<laga> .ppt as in "power point"?
<crimsun> yes, it's in powerpoint
<ScottK> Yes.
<penguin42> OOo can do that
<slytherin> why not use S5. :-)
<ScottK> I didn't put it up, just pointing to it.
<crimsun> (in any case, I sbuilt/pbuilt the source package)
<penguin42> well source packages are no safer
<crimsun> penguin42: you have to trust the source package at some level.  Do a code audit over the entire base?
<nxvl> did someone has information on how to relibtoolize a package?
<crimsun> penguin42: fwiw, I /did/ inspect the source package.  I tend to do that (having been core-dev).
<penguin42> crimsun: Well yes; but there's no reason to trust one more than you trust a binary package
<crimsun> penguin42: that's the point.  You don't trust; you verify.
<penguin42> nod; although there's been some very convincing stuff on minimal changes for barn-door sized security holes
<ScottK> Also the .dsc's on PPAs do still have the uploader's signature.
<ScottK> So there's a point to leverage trust in the source if you have a path to trust the uploader's key.
<penguin42> (on a vaguely related note I tried to build an apparmour profile for nspluginwrapper - it's hard, especially since you really want one for each plugin, and in a way for each flash program
<crimsun> flash itself has issues.  allowInsecureDomain()?  uhh
<ScottK> Yeah.
<ScottK> Someone looking for something really useful to do might do a survey of DNS related packages in Ubuntu to see if they've all been fixed.
<nxvl> ScottK: they have been fixed, long ago :D
<ScottK> nxvl: Are you sure?  I fixed one just a little over a week ago.
<nxvl> ScottK: well, bind has :D
<ScottK> Right.
<ScottK> I'm not worried about the ones in Main.
<ScottK> python-dns didn't even do TID randomization before I started beating on it in July.
<nxvl> oh
<nxvl> ok
<nxvl> :D
<nxvl> then yes
<tacone> hello, I need a reliable way to test an intrepid packaged application with gui interface. what to use ? Is a properly binded chroot ok ? Are virtualmachines the only way (tm) ?
<ScottK> 89 packages with DNS in the name in the archive.
<nxvl> :(
<nxvl> ScottK: we should add it to the server team roadmap
<tacone> nxvl: what's up with UCSA ?
<ScottK> nxvl: Good idea.
<nxvl> tacone: working con config model
<Brucevdk> Hey, I'm working on a Debian package. Currently a script just builds a directory and packages it using dpkg-deb --build). I'm trying to "adhere" more to Ubuntu packaging standards (I read the PackagingGuide, Debian Policy Manual etc.). The program is a Nautilus Python extension (which are installed into /usr/lib/extensions-2.0). Can anybody give me any pointers on the creation of a proper (small and beautiful) rules file for creating the package using
<Brucevdk> debuild?
<tacone> nxvl: I am working on a parser these days. I still feel the pain. painful pain. :-(
<Brucevdk> Correction: /usr/lib/nautilus/extensions-2.0
<nxvl> ScottK: btw, about the courier merge
<ScottK> Yes?
<nxvl> ScottK: i need to relibtoolize it
<nxvl> ScottK: it's FTBFS for some reason with ubuntu's libtool
<ScottK> OK.
<ScottK> So the diff it going to be painful.
<nxvl> yep
<nxvl> i'm getting a really odd error
<nxvl> ScottK: http://paste.ubuntu.com/35777/
<ScottK> Dunno what to tell you.  Maybe someone else here has had enough fun with libtool in the past to help.
<nxvl> ScottK: i'm on it
<Flannel> Hey guys, I know this is somewhat offtopic, but in the deb file, how can Ifind out what options something (specifically the kernel) was compiled with?
<nxvl> ScottK: i have found some information
<alex-weej_> what does FTBFS stand for?
<alex-weej_> Failed To Build, Fuck Sake?
<ScottK> alex-weej_: From Source
<crimsun> nxvl: I presume you've read http://tservice.net.ru/~s0mbre/blog//devel/networking/dns/2008_08_08, then.
<alex-weej_> ah right
<alex-weej_> somebody got the acronym wrong in a bug i posted, that was confusing hehe
<ScottK> crimsun: Seems to me like just adding source port randomization is not going to be enough for long.
<slytherin> Flannel: don't think it is possible
<NCommander> alex-weej_, it stands from Failure to Build from Source
<Flannel> slytherin: alright, thanks
<tuxmaniac> nellery: are you working on bug 251281 ? If not I would like to give it a shot next week.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 251281 in ubuntu "[needs-packaging] toped" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/251281
<RainCT> REVU -> Your Packages -> Nice feeds icon on Firefox -> Subscribe to Â«Personal feed for $YOURNAMEÂ»
<RainCT> :)
 * RainCT wants testers ^^:P
<RoAkSoAx> RainCT, seems to work :)
<nhandler> What do you want testers for RainCT ?
<RoAkSoAx> nhandler, i think for this: <RainCT> REVU -> Your Packages -> Nice feeds icon on Firefox -> Subscribe to Â«Personal feed for $YOURNAMEÂ»
<nhandler> Thanks RoAkSoAx. RainCT, I was able to successfully subscribe to my personal REVU feed.
<RainCT> great :)
<RainCT> thanks RoAkSoAx, nhandler
<nhandler> You're welcome RainCT.
<RoAkSoAx> np =)
<RainCT> Suggestions are welcome. (The Â«Â»).
<RainCT>                 
<RainCT>               
<RainCT> argh
<nhandler> Are you planning on adding rss feeds/email subscriptions on a per-package basis RainCT ?
<RainCT> * Suggestions are welcome. (The Â«Lintian may be happy or not.Â» will change, of course).
<RainCT> nhandler: yep (s/rss/atom)
<nhandler> RainCT: What about subscribing to a package and getting email alerts when a comment is added or a new version is uploaded?
<RainCT> nhandler: that's planned, but I don't like doing email stuff so it may still take a while (*whistle* unless NCommander does it) :P
<NCommander> huh what?
<nhandler> NCommander: Being able to get email updates when a comment/new upload occurs for a package on REVU
<NCommander> oh
<sistpoty> hi folks
<sistpoty> hm... does anyone have a clue why my insert key doesn't set gvim into insert mode any longer?
<crimsun> intrepid?
<sistpoty> yep
<crimsun> sorry, don't have the vm up
<sistpoty> well, I will get used to "i" in some time I guess *g*
<nhandler> sistpoty: What version of gvim are you using? My insert sets it into insert mode
<sistpoty> nhandler: vim-gtk: 1:7.1.314-3ubuntu3
<sistpoty> (but it might be anywhere I guess... maybe some kde<->gtk thingy... or in xorg?)
<nhandler> I don't think it is an issue with the vim-gtk package. I have the same version installed. Like you said, it is probably an issue with something else like xorg
<sistpoty> nhandler: or maybe my insert key is broken *g*
<nhandler> Well, that isn't too dificult to test sistpoty
<sebner> huhu sistpoty
<sistpoty> hm... my insert key doesn't work in kde it seems, but it does work on vt... and switching back from vt to kde doesn't work *g*
<sistpoty> but I have desktop-effects, which somehow should cheer me up about everything else being broken *g*
<sistpoty> and... *drumroll* dpkg is localized... how interesting and amusing :)
<sebner> sistpoty: strange things are happening *g*
<sistpoty> heh
<jpds> Anyone know where Flash has gone? http://download.macromedia.com/ is down.
<sistpoty> jpds: have you tried adobe yet?
<sebner> jpds: blame all the users who prayed for that :P
<sebner> maybe someonw haXX0red them =)
<jpds> sistpoty: Works from the download page. Someone was complaining about it in #ubuntu.
<sistpoty> ah, k
<sistpoty> jpds: is flashplugin-nonfree affected?
<jpds> Checking.
<jpds> sistpoty: No - it uses fpdownload.m.c.
<sistpoty> ah, cool... thanks for checking jpds
<tgm4883_laptop> If any motu has is bored and wants to revu something, I'd sure appreciate another look at http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=mythstream-parser-youtube  I've fixed what superm1 commented on
 * RainCT wonders if http://brainstorm.ubuntu.com/idea/12018/ should be left open or marked "Won't implement"
<nhandler> RainCT: I would mark it as "Won't implement"
<jpds> nhandler: Does Brainstorm use OpenID?
<jpds> RainCT: Have you seen bug 149524?
<nhandler> jpds: I know I had to make a separate account for it. I don't think they have implemented OpenID yet.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 149524 in ubuntu "mirrors should update so they're usable during the update" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/149524
<jpds> RainCT: Err, ignore that.
<jpds> nhandler: OK.
 * sistpoty recalls that someone referred to backports as the latest stable crack - a contradiction by itself *g*
<YokoZar> RainCT: I'll mark it won't implement right now (by the way, it's relatively easy for MOTU to get brainstorm admin access if you poke the right person)
<sistpoty> superm1: nvidia-settings uploaded... I'll leave it to you to fix what I got wrong *g*
<RainCT> YokoZar: I already have developer & moderador status :)
<RainCT> I'm just not sure if I'm supposed to close half of the ideas :P
 * sistpoty takes a look at tgm4883_laptop's package
<tgm4883_laptop> yay
<tgm4883_laptop> thanks
<sistpoty> tgm4883_laptop: being picky, you'll need to say that the debian packaging is Copyright (or copr.)... (C) is not enough... and there is comma after the year
<sistpoty> tgm4883_laptop: get-orig-source doesn't get the newest upstream version but rather the current one as it seems
<sistpoty> (and is quite useless, since no mangling is performed FWIW)
<sistpoty> tgm4883_laptop: the long description could be a little bit more verbose
<tgm4883_laptop> Do i need get-orig-source?
<tgm4883_laptop> I was under the impression it was a requirement
<sistpoty> tgm4883_laptop: in this case I guess a watch file would be more suitable... get-orig-source is mainly useful if you'll e.g. need to remove some non-free bits of upstreams release or do other mangling (e.g. convert a zip to a tar)
<tgm4883_laptop> ok
<tgm4883_laptop> is there documentation on how to do a watch file?
<tacone> tgm4883_laptop: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Recipes/DebianWatch
<sistpoty> tgm4883_laptop: or man uscan
<tgm4883_laptop> tacone, thanks
<tgm4883_laptop> sistpoty, " and there is comma after the year", thats correct right?  Or did you want me to remove it?
<sistpoty> tgm4883_laptop: no, it shouldn't be there, but that's really just cosmetical ;)
<tgm4883_laptop> ah ok
<sistpoty> tgm4883_laptop: seems like you're missing a dependency on perl (strange, is perl no longer essential: yes in ubuntu?)
<tgm4883_laptop> ah, yes i am, i'll add that
<sistpoty> oh, perl is from perl-base, so forget the last comment tgm4883_laptop
<tgm4883_laptop> ok
<sistpoty> (which is still essential)
<sistpoty> tgm4883_laptop: the question though is if you need some perl modules to be present and should put these in depends (have no clue about perl myself)?
<tgm4883_laptop> I think i'm ok, as this depends on mythstream which looks to pull the modules I need.  I could list them here though too
<sistpoty> tgm4883_laptop: that's not needed then
<tgm4883_laptop> ok
<sistpoty> tgm4883_laptop: however your .diff.gz contains basically all files from the orig.tar.gz as well... maybe clean doesn't remove the installed files or s.th.?
<tgm4883_laptop> perhaps not
<sistpoty> tgm4883_laptop: now let's come to grave issues: there's no GPL in the upstream tarball, and also no clue that any file is actually GPL
<sistpoty> tgm4883_laptop: is it stated somewhere on the website at least?
<tgm4883_laptop> yes
<tgm4883_laptop> sec
<tgm4883_laptop> at http://home.kabelfoon.nl/~moongies/streamtuned.html under the downloads section the first line says  "All code is protected by GNU/GPL" and links to the GPL
<sistpoty> tgm4883_laptop: ok, that's good... but still you must change the source package and include a copy of the GPL in there (that's a requirement of the GPL itself)
<sistpoty> tgm4883_laptop: maybe you could also point out where you found the initial gpl notice in debian/copyright, just to avoid confusion
<tgm4883_laptop> oh ok, sorry about that.  I only knew the rule "don't change the source package"
<tgm4883_laptop> ok, i'll add that too
<sistpoty> tgm4883_laptop: well, that's one of the reasons to change the source package (and btw.: I know that rule by heart, I wrote the part for the packaging guide *g*)
<sistpoty> brb, just out for a smoke
<sistpoty> tgm4883_laptop: are the perl scripts source from somewhere or meant to be directly executed?
<sistpoty> (because they miss the +x bit)
<sistpoty> sourced even (or imported or whatever you do in perl *g*)
<tgm4883_laptop> mythstream calls them
<sistpoty> tgm4883_laptop: call as in shell call?
<tgm4883_laptop> err, let me check real quick
<tgm4883_laptop> I think I had to do something funky when I packages mythstream about that same thing
<tgm4883_laptop> they are not +x on my box and i've installed it and it works
<tgm4883_laptop> i'd have to dig deeper into mythstream though for 100% confirmation
<tgm4883_laptop> sistpoty^
<sistpoty> tgm4883_laptop: well, if it works, I don't think its much of a problem
<tgm4883_laptop> ok
<tgm4883_laptop> i'm adding this watch file now, after that I can just remove the get-orig-source from the rules right?
<sistpoty> tgm4883_laptop: well, now you've got s.th. to mangle (i.e. to add the GPL to the source package)
 * tgm4883_laptop smacks head
<tgm4883_laptop> yep
<sistpoty> tgm4883_laptop: just summed up the important issues on revu. please make sure to rename the .orig.tar.gz (and the upstream version in debian/changelog) so that it's clear that you needed to change the orig tarball
<tgm4883_laptop> sistpoty, ok, so then will I have still have a .orig.tar.gz in there or just the new renamed one
<sistpoty> tgm4883_laptop: a new, renamed one
<tgm4883_laptop> ok.  Do you still want it to end in .orig.tar.gz?
<sistpoty> tgm4883_laptop: of course ;)
<tgm4883_laptop> ok, just making sure
<tgm4883_laptop> thanks for the revu, i'll be back when it's all fixed up
<sistpoty> tgm4883_laptop: now it's mythstream-parser-youtube_4.orig.tar.gz, and mythstream-parser-youtube_4ubuntu1.orig.tar.gz might be suitable probably
<sistpoty> tgm4883_laptop: (don't forget that you'll then need to change the upstream version in debian/changelog as well)
<sistpoty> which would then be 4ubuntu1-0ubuntu1
<tgm4883_laptop> ah
<tgm4883_laptop> ok, will do
<sistpoty> (what you add to the upstream version is quite irrelevant, as long as it a) documents that you needed to fiddle with the orig.tar.gz and b) is consistent with debian/changelog)
<tgm4883_laptop> ok, thanks
<sistpoty> np
<stryd_one> hi all
<stryd_one> I'd like to get into packaging stuff up for ubuntu, I'm rather tech-savvy but new-ish to linux.... I've followed the links in the topic and a few google searches but I'm experiencing some information overload... Is there a "right" place to start for a newbie?
<stryd_one> I was hoping for a step-by-step how to, just to get the first thing packaged up and get to know it a bit better (yaknow, build it, tear it to bits) but I seem to be finding a lot of conflicting information
<Kopfgeldjaeger> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/GettingStarted
<RainCT> sistpoty: why not use dfsg for the tarball rename? (4ubuntu1-0ubuntu1 looks really strange :P)
<RainCT> hi stryd_one
<stryd_one> thx Kopfgeldjaeger ... that's one of the 28 tabs I have open right now :)
<stryd_one> hi RainCT
<Kopfgeldjaeger> then you should probably close most of them and walk through the GettingsStarted guide ;)
<stryd_one> exactly what i needed to hear, danke
<sistpoty> RainCT: well, I guess dfsg is mainly used to state that some files needed to be removed due to not respecting a given license... and as I've seen debianXY in orig.tar.gz ubuntuXY seems like a logical choice
<[cliff]> hi everyone
<sistpoty> RainCT: however as I wrote, the exact version name is moot as long as it fulfills the goal ;)
<[cliff]> is the packager of gshare here? i'm the dev, would like to talk
<sistpoty> [cliff]: that would be slomo
<sistpoty> (who doesn't seem to be around)
<[cliff]> sistpoty, oh good to know it's still him. i'll drop him an email then. cheers
<sistpoty> you're welcome ;)
<sistpoty> slangasek: around and mind a query?
<nhandler> Are the -kde4 suffixes on package names only temporary until kde4 is the default?
<sistpoty> nhandler: no idea... maybe ask on #kubuntu-devel?
<nhandler> Ok, I'll give that a try sistpoty
<RainCT> sistpoty: you remembered me of the "can't stop clicking" Firefox commercial, but in your case it's a "can't stop answering" ;)
<RainCT> well, I'm off.. Good night
<sistpoty> heh
<sistpoty> gn8 RainCT
<foxbuntu> would someone be able to revu my package, it would be greatly appreciated: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=mythbuntu-log-grabber
#ubuntu-motu 2008-08-10
<nxvl> ScottK: http://tservice.net.ru/~s0mbre/blog/devel/networking/dns/2008_08_08.html
<nxvl> ScottK: we are still fucked
<wgrant> nxvl: Grmph.
<nxvl> wgrant: exactly
<nxvl> my paranoia reached an unthinked level
<wgrant> Yes.
<nxvl> i have just changes all my sources.list from URL's to IP's
<nxvl> wgrant: btw, can you accept me on motu-swat please
<wgrant> nxvl: Sure.
<wgrant> Done.
<emgent> uhm?
<crimsun> it's still "broken"
<nxvl> wgrant: thank you!
<crimsun> as Dan mentioned in his talk, updates to packages have to be signed by a trusted party specifically for that package in a monotonically increasing version.
<crimsun> and of course, distributed "securely" - whatever the heck that means.
<sistpoty> well, the insecure nature would be obvious by a failed signature, wouldn't it?
<wgrant> There are more avenues for exploitation than apt.
<wgrant> If there's no way to fix BIND...
<sistpoty> of course
<emgent> nice.
<emgent> very nice news. gh
<sistpoty> just assume that the site of my bank would be diverted to another ip... I'd be doomed (well, i.e. I wouldn't not too much to get from my account *g*)(
<wgrant> sistpoty: SSL saves there, as long as the CA's DNS isn't poisoned.
<sistpoty> heh
<soren> I really don't see what all the fuss is about. You've never been able to trust the response you got from DNS before anyway.
<nxvl> soren: the problem is that now you have a LOT of script kiddies pretending to be crackers and trying to crack some dns just to say they have
<soren> From my POV, DNS responses have gone from "untrustworthy" to "very untrustworthy".
<soren> If you've been doing anything up until now that depended on trustworthiness of DNS replies, you've been doing it wrong :)
<wgrant> Now anybody can do it reliably and easily.
<soren> yes.
<soren> The problem with the whole "oh, noes! We can't trust DNS anymore!" business is that it's nonsense. You couldn't trust it before either.
<nxvl> soren: the actual worrying thing is that ppa don't use signed packages
<nxvl> soren: so if you get poisoned, you'r fck'd
<soren> nxvl: How would that help anything?
<soren> Ah, well..
<soren> Yes, it would help somewhat.
<nxvl> soren: that if it's signed you can check the source of the package
<sistpoty> nxvl: not really, I gues using ppa's in the first place is wrong ;)
<soren> ...but any idiot or script kiddie can set up a ppa anyway.
<nxvl> soren: that's why i don't use ppa's i don't trust
<nxvl> just for testing
<wgrant> soren: But I'm not going to add some scriptkiddie's PPA to my sources.list.
<soren> wgrant: Right.
<wgrant> Now no PPAs are trustworthy, even if they are owned by sane people.
<soren> True, true.
<wgrant> (they never really were before either, but particularly now)
<sistpoty> hm... I wonder if revu should use ssl, and if so how to set it up right *g*
<nxvl> even MY ppa is trustworthy
<wgrant> Well, primary isn't much more trustworthy than a PPA right now, but that's another story.
<soren> wgrant: How so?
<sistpoty> heh
<wgrant> Not sure it should be said.
<soren> Of course it should.
 * soren heads to bed
<wgrant> Night soren.
<soren> 'night, all.
<nxvl> soren: night
<soren> *whoosh
<Brucevdk> Alright, I don't think anybody caught my question 5 hours ago. But I managed to create a super duper Debian package (wrote a Python distutils setup script and just let debhelper.mk python-distutils.mk handle the rest). \o/ Happy days.
<Brucevdk> Now I can sleep. Zzz
<crimsun> sistpoty: don't use a self-signed cert.
<sistpoty> crimsun: heh... that's where my knowledge ends *g*
<crimsun> sor.en's right, there's a lot of hype over something that has existed for decades.
<sistpoty> anyway... got to go to bed now... gn8 everyone
<wgrant> Night sistpoty.
<effie_jayx> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/cfv/+bug/256500
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 256500 in cfv "cfv package recommends bittorrent | bittornado, not transmission" [Undecided,New]
<effie_jayx> does it make sense to change the suggests line then?
<effie_jayx> or is it not enough reason to do it
<_sebastian1> Andrew_Sayers: hi
<_sebastian1> Hi
<vorian> sebner: hello, connection problems?
<vorian> bah, _sebastian1 even
<vorian> sebner: sorry about that
<emgent> vorian: hello
<vorian> hiya emgent :)
<_sebastian1> hi all
<vorian> _sebastian1: hello again :)
<infinitycircuit> how would i get a list of packages that have Build-Essential: yes?
<StevenK> Build-Essential: yes isn't a tag.
<StevenK> infinitycircuit: apt-cache show build-essential ?
<infinitycircuit> in apt-cache dumpavail it does list it
<nxvl> infinitycircuit: build-essential?
 * StevenK blinks
<StevenK> apt-cache dumpavail | grep-dctrl -sPackage -FBuild-Essential 'yes'
<StevenK> That will do what you want
<infinitycircuit> ah thank you
<emgent> moin
<andrew_sayers> _sebastian1: Hi.
<_sebastian1> andrew_sayers: hi
<andrew_sayers> I'm hoping you're the Sebastian I've been talking to for the past little while :)
<_sebastian1> are you the andrew I wanted to meet :-D
<andrew_sayers> :)
<Iulian> G'morning
<Whoopie> persia: Hi, time to discuss bug report 211252? what is the right way to apply patches? with CDBS?
<persia> bug #211252
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 211252 in obex-data-server "Cannot recieve files using bluetooth" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/211252
<slytherin> Whoopie: cdbs has it's own patch system called cdbs-simple-patchsys. There is some documentation on wiki.ubuntu.com
<slytherin> Whoopie: and obex-data-server is in main, so discuss on #ubuntu-devel first.
<Whoopie> slytherin: yes, thanks. should I use the example from udev or cdbs?
<persia> Whoopie: Yes.  Your debdiff was perfectly formatted, except for three things: 1) the fix needs to get into intrepid before it gets into hardy, 2) there's no value in also closing bug #227429, and 3) Full Names are appreciated.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 227429 in bluez-utils "[hardy] Bluetooth Serial Port undiscoverable (dup-of: 211252)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/227429
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 211252 in obex-data-server "Cannot recieve files using bluetooth" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/211252
<sebner> persia: I sent a mail to him :)
<Whoopie> slytherin: it's just to know which of the example is the prefered. plain patch or cdbs.
<persia> slytherin: I'll admit to not looking at MoveToUniverse yet.  It's about third on my list, and ought get hit in the next bit (unless I get more strange results with the top two).
<persia> sebner: Excellent to hear.
<ion_> Hei hei, Jukka.
<sebner> persia: we'll see what he answers ^^
<slytherin> persia: no issues, I just upgraded to intrepid and will start looking at some of them.
<ion_> Eh. Sorry.
<persia> Whoopie: debdiff is generally preferred.  Whether this uses a patch system or not depends on the package being changed.
<ion_> http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=compcache-setup anyone? :-)
<slytherin> Whoopie: if you mean which patch system to use? the simplest is cdbs-simple-patchsys provided packages uses cdbs to build. The next best thing is dpatch.
<sebner> or quilt :)
<Whoopie> slytherin: ok
<Whoopie> too much choices ;)
<slytherin> sebner: we are talking about simple, not powerful. :-)
<persia> ion_: As usual, I'm not going to give it a full review, but isn't -plow specifically designed to not block, and still use the debconf template?
<sebner> Whoopie: I'm off the opinion that quilt is simpler than dpatch :P
<persia> slytherin: Except the best thing is *always* to use the existing patch system.
<sebner> argh
<sebner> Whoopie: sry
<sebner> slytherin: see above ^^
<slytherin> persia: of course
<slytherin> sebner: not for me.
<Whoopie> for obex-data-server, there's none, so I'd need to choose.
<ion_> persia: I want the message to printed for anyone reading messages printed by the scripts, but i donât want it ever to block (no matter the debconf priority the user has).
<persia> Whoopie: What does what-patch say?
<sebner> slytherin: well, everyone has to decide on his own
<Whoopie> persia: thanks!!! didn't know that command. it's cdbs
<persia> Whoopie: Yep.  I've just also checked the the identity of the Debian maintainer, and it's the same as for bluez-utils, so it is likely they prefer the same patch system (when selecting with no hints, this can be a useful method to find the patch system most likely to be accepted).
<slytherin> persia: now that openjdk is in main, we should prefer it over gcj for building packages, right?
<ion_> persia: Itâs basically the equivalent of the config script containing âecho "Restart compcache-setup to apply the change"â, but might as well use a debconf template for localizing that since the package uses po-debconf in any case.
<Whoopie> persia: I attached the upstream patch for the nokia browsing issue to bug #211252. I think, Kenny's used patch is not complete.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 211252 in obex-data-server "Cannot recieve files using bluetooth" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/211252
<persia> ion_: Right, but by using -plow you don't need the lintian override, and most users ought never see it anyway.
<persia> slytherin: Best to follow https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel-announce/2008-July/000460.html
<Whoopie> persia: and another question regarding bluez-utils: why not syncing with debian to get latest version 3.36 instead of patching?
<persia> Whoopie: Well, we've a bunch of patches.  That said, perhaps a merge is overdue :)  I'll take a look.
 * slytherin wonders what is need of jorbis and jogg libraries in an ftp program.
<persia> On the other hand, I still think your patch is correct for hardy-proposed (aside from the small notes above), as we wouldn't want that.
<persia> s/that/a full merge as an SRU/
<Whoopie> persia: are we in freeze? didn't follow the roadmap.
<persia> Whoopie: We're in Debian Import Freeze, which means we need a good reason for an update
<persia> http://packages.qa.debian.org/b/bluez-utils/news/20080720T163203Z.html has the changes for the latest upload to Debian: someone needs to investigate to verify that 1) the changes are an improvement and 2) it doesn't break anything.
<persia> Hmm.  New upstream might be nice, but I'm not sure if any of the Debian-specific patches apply.
<persia> slytherin, mario_limonciello: do either of you have an opinion on this?
<slytherin> persia: it has been long since I stopped doing anything related to bluetooth. But as far as I know, the 4.x version of bluez stack is kind of rewrite.
<persia> slytherin: This is 3.30 vs. 3.36.  Also, I see your name from only April :p
<slytherin> persia: yes, that was the upload I did. I believe tollef is the right person to bug about this. In any case 3.36 is last release of 3.x series so whatever fixes we want to backport we need to do it before 4.x lands in Ubuntu.
<persia> slytherin: I very much doubt 4.x will drop in Ubuntu until after intrepid.
<slytherin> persia: why? I think it should be in intrepid.
<persia> slytherin: Well, it would need someone to specifically try to get everything upgraded.  Why do you think we should use 4.x?
<persia> Upstream says it's still experimental
<tuxmaniac> persia: does that mean "sync requests" also need to undergo a certain procedeure? (wrt Debian import freeze) I thought it doesnt have to until FF. May be I am missing something here?
<slytherin> persia: from what I have read in upstream news it is better implementation of all the services, specifically network and file transfer.
<persia> slytherin: Hmm, but "experimental"...
<slytherin> tuxmaniac: DIF means there is no auto sync. FF means sync needs exception.
<slytherin> let ubuntu-mobile team decide, I guess they are the one who handle bluetooh
<persia> tuxmaniac: sync requests need review now: before DIF, they only needed review if there was ubuntu variation: otherwise they happened automatically.
<slytherin> persia: if there was variation it wouldn't be called sync, it is merge :-P
<persia> slytherin: Not always: sometimes we sync over Ubuntu variation (when there is no longer a point in keeping it)
<slytherin> ahh, right
<persia> slytherin: A common example of this is when people backport bugfixes from Debian into Ubuntu during Ubuntu freezes.
<slytherin> hmm
<RainCT> heya
<coolbhavi> heya RainCT
<RainCT> persia: I may start the wiki page for new MOTUs which you requested yesterday now. Do you have any wishes on what should be there?
<persia> RainCT: -v, -k, testing in Debian and forwarding patches, "give-back", +queue at least.
<persia> (probably better as "Uploading a Merge", "Sponsoring someone else's work", "Pushing upstream", "Handling FTBFS Reports", "Checking package status".
<persia> )
<persia> RainCT: Do you remember anything else that is important *as* MOTU, but not typically needed/learned before becoming MOTU?
<persia> (or anyone else: please chip in)
<RainCT> persia: Right now, no. About the "Pushing upstream" point, what should it say (or rather: shouldn't you already be doing this before you become a MOTU)?
<persia> RainCT: Hmm.  Maybe just something about looking at Debian bugs when sponsoring stuff?
<persia> Essentially, I think that those with more experience are good about Debian collaboration, but I don't like to block new people just because they aren't yet, and I think most MOTU ought do that.
<persia> As a result, we have a certain obligation to help with Debian collaboration for those seeking sponsorship until they are doing it on their own.
<persia> (Mind you, if you strongly disagree with that, there's no point adding it to the page)
<slytherin> does anyone know why seahorse doesn't act as passphrase agent in intrepid?
<RainCT> So, something like "Check if the problem has been reported in Debian's BTS and link it to the LP bug, perhaps leaving a comment explaining the contributor how to do so. If it hasn't been reported there, but the problem is also in Debian, ask the contributor to forward the fix.", or you mean even a "Consider forwarding the fix yourself."?
<persia> I even mean consider forwarding the fix oneself, linking it to the LP bug, and explaining to the contributor that they ought do that next time.
<persia> I'm all for patch authors forwarding stuff, but believe there is a learning process that ought be supported.
<RainCT> alright
<slytherin> persia: should I log a catch all bug for MoveToUniverse or separate bugs for each package?
<highvoltage> howdy motus
 * wgrant wonders if anybody is looking at why libhibernate3-java doesn't build. I've been getting an awful lot of build failures because it is missing.
<slytherin> wgrant: go ahead and bang your head on wall. :-P I did that for 2 weeks almost. There are hell lot of circular build dependencies in hibernate in jboss packages.
<wgrant> I like to stay away from Java.
<wgrant> I just happened to notice lots of packages failing while rebuilding multiverse today.
<slytherin> wgrant: any report about these failures?
<slytherin> I mean other than the usual FTBFS page
<wgrant> http://builder.ubuntuwire.com:9998/dist/intrepid/arch/i386 has all so far, but it's a bit flaky at the moment due to the load produced by the rebuilding.
<persia> slytherin: Seperate bug for each package.
<slytherin> wgrant: Ok, I will check in an hour or two
<slytherin> persia: ok
<white> http://channel.debian.de/map.html
<persia> Hmm.  Some of that looks like England.
<persia> (But the rest looks rather nifty indeed)
<persia> Is there a utility that will parse a .dsc file, and copy all referenced files (and the .dsc file) to a target directory?
<laga> something like dget?
<white> Any new MOTU/ubuntu enthusiast in melbourne?
<ion_> persia: dcmd might work.
<persia> laga: Sortof.  That takes a URL to a remote .dsc and moves it to the current directory, but I want something local.
<tuxmaniac> Can someone please review bug 255224 and sponsor if found OK. Thanks in Advance. earlier posted it in #u-bugs by mistake
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 255224 in gnusim8085 "New Upstream Release 1.3.4" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/255224
<ion_> dcmd mv foo.changes bar/
<RainCT> ion_: dcmd? is that new?
<ion_> rainct: Dunno, just found it with apropos.
<persia> ion_: I don't seem to have a dcmd, do you mean http://sourceforge.net/projects/dcmd/ ?
<persia> ion_: Which package?
<ion_> devscripts >= 2.10.20 apparently.
<slytherin> persia: one down, jftp. :-)
<wgrant> white: I think I'm about the only Ubuntu dev in Melbourne :(
<persia> ion_: Nifty.  Thanks.
<white> wgrant: i was just wondering about that email on debian-melb from Udo
<white> wgrant: although it's still a few weeks, we might want to fix a date :)
<wgrant> Indeed.
 * wgrant -> bed
<RainCT> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/New - suggestions are welcome (if you can thing of a better name for the page, too)
<RainCT> persia: ^
 * persia grumbles at http://ftp.debian.org/debian/pool/main/d/dbus-java/ not containing an orig.tar.gz
<slytherin> persia: that is because version number is wrong.
<slytherin> persia: it got converted to native package
<persia> slytherin: Did it now.  There's also no native package .gz there.
<persia> By the way, the 2.5-3 .dsc references the same checksum for an orig.tar.gz as was used in the 2.5-1 upload.
<persia> So the file is present at http://ftp.debian.org/debian/pool/contrib/d/dbus-java/ : it's just DAK being strange
<slytherin> he he
<persia> Still, it meant that dget didn't work, which is why I grumbled
<Adri2000> any ubuntu studio people here?
<persia> Adri2000: Why?
<Adri2000> persia: I'm confused about the latest comment in bug #243722. ubuntu studio uses the ubuntu repositories just like ubuntu, doesn't it?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 243722 in amsn "amsn 0.97: login doesn't work anymore due to a protocol change" [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/243722
<persia> Adri2000: Absolutely.  There are some differences (different kernel, some special settings, etc.), but it's really just a flavour.
<RainCT> Adri2000: Is the new version already in -updates?
<persia> Erm.  That is confusing.  Maybe a mirror that doesn't include -updates?
 * persia investigates
<Adri2000> it's only in -proposed for now
<RainCT> Adri2000: To me it seems like that guy is just confused and doesn't know about -proposed
<Adri2000> but the same person reported earlier that the fix worked in hardy, so I guess he know that
<Adri2000> knows
<Adri2000> or maybe he has -proposed enabled on his hardy machine without knowing it or something... I'll ask
<persia> That would make sense: perhaps he's using -proposed on a -desktop install, but not on a -studio install.
<Adri2000> probably
<persia> Adri2000: I've just double-checked and confirmed that the ubuntustudio specific mirrors are CD mirrors, but that the sources.list ought be identical to any other flavour.
<persia> s/CD/DVD/
<Adri2000> persia: ok
<RainCT> persia: have you placed links to MOTU/New somewhere or should I do so?
<sebner> RainCT: cool page btw :)
<RainCT> sebner: thanks :)
<persia> RainCT: I was planning to just point new MOTU at the page on induction.
<persia> RainCT: Also, thanks a lot for putting that together:  I think it's stuff we all mostly learn in the first week or two, but sometimes things get missed, so good to have organised for reference.
<directhex> where would i file a request to have a package synced from debian that isn't in ubuntu?
<RainCT> directhex: just against Ubuntu
<directhex> seems it should be fine in universe for now, but i may not have considered all the possibilities
<tuxmaniac> directhex: please rise a bug report in LP
<tuxmaniac> directhex: for. e.g. like bug 253324
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 253324 in ubuntu "[sync request] Avagadro Sync from debian unstable 0.8.1-4 version." [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/253324
<directhex> can someone with an intrepid build environment run a quick build test against http://ftp.de.debian.org/debian/pool/main/w/webkit-sharp/webkit-sharp_0.2-1.dsc ?
<directhex> i only have a hardy environment on this machine
<sebner> directhex: sure
<tuxmaniac> directhex: it doesnt seem to build. Maybe I am doing something wrong. http://paste.ubuntu.com/36216/
<tuxmaniac> thats output of pdebuild
<slytherin> tuxmaniac: what did you do eaxctly?
<sebner> directhex: working
<tuxmaniac> pdebuild --debbuildopts -sa ?
<directhex> tuxmaniac, intrepid?
<tuxmaniac> directhex: yes.
<sebner> tuxmaniac: did you do  a debuild in the source folder or just built the dsc with pbuilder?
<tuxmaniac> sebner: debuild in the src folder
<sebner> directhex: working with pbuilder building the dsc
<sebner> tuxmaniac: no need to
<slytherin> tuxmaniac: you simply need to build with pbuiler using .dsc
<tuxmaniac> sebner: shouldnt both work?
<directhex> tuxmaniac, when did you last update your pbuilder environment? cli.make is in cli-common-dev 0.5.7, from may 11th
<tuxmaniac> directhex: today evening.
<directhex> and possibly older too
<sebner> tuxmaniac: sure but with debuild it's building on your machine and not in the clean chroot
<tuxmaniac> sebner: i use pdebuild. which in turn uses the pbuilder environment right?
<sebner> tuxmaniac: well, if debuild succeds ^^
<geser> tuxmaniac: have you debhelper 7 installed?
<slytherin> is javacio.us accessible to anyone? Can someone please search which jar file contains netscape.javascript.JSObject?
<tuxmaniac> geser: no
<directhex> meebey's a fan of dh7, it'll be a frequent build-depends of things i talk about
<directhex> okay, sync request at 256641
<sebner> directhex: I also once wanted to sync webkit-sharp. dunno why I didn't ^^
<directhex> sebner, well, i need it in order to sync mono-tools
<directhex> s/sync/merge
<directhex> or maybe sync. most of the ubuntu1 changes are gecko-related
<geser> slytherin: if my google foo is reliable than its in plugin.jar (> Java 1.4.2) or jaws.jar (Java 1.4.0/1.4.1) [http://www.rgagnon.com/javadetails/java-0172.html]
<slytherin> geser: that is what I found from some forum. I just wanted to see if it was available anywhere else. Even rhino jar doesn't have it. :-(
<slytherin> I have a question. I am trying to build worldwind with openjdk. But an applet include doesn't build. Is it ok to exclude the applet from build so that package can be built with openjdk and moved to universe.
 * slytherin out for dinner
<effie_jayx> persia,  justr an update on fonts I have them all done. all I have to do is package them
<effie_jayx> if a new package closes several bugs how does one reflect that in the changelog
<geser> effie_jayx: LP: #123, #456
<effie_jayx> thanks
<effie_jayx> all in parenthesis no?
<geser> effie_jayx: like you want, parenthesis are not required for automatic bug closing
<geser> you can also use several LP: #xxx entries, depending on your changelog entries
<effie_jayx> I am building a fonts package.. there are changes in a binary file as well as in the source file
<effie_jayx> I try to build the source package and it fails
<effie_jayx> Irrepresentable Changes in the source
<effie_jayx> I am using debuild -S -sa to build
<geser> effie_jayx: you need to figure out how you can get the changes to the binary file(s) into plain text (and apply them during package build)
<effie_jayx> geser,  mmkey, perhaps e fontdiff of some sort
<jpds> effie_jayx:
<jpds> effie_jayx: Err, uuencode and uudecode, can convert binary files to text and vice verse.
<jpds> -a*
<jpds> They're in the sharutils package.
<slytherin> geser: Can you please comment on what I said above about worldwind?
<geser> slytherin: the idea sounds sane as long as the applet is only an add-on to the package
<effie_jayx> jpds,  ok, do I first dencode them into text files and then generate a diff from the text files ?
<effie_jayx> then specify changes into the building process?
<slytherin> geser: yes, it is not even part of core jar file, AFAIK
<jpds> effie_jayx: Yes, see 'man uuencode'
<jpds> effie_jayx: uuencode .ttf file. And on the prebuild stage for the package building "uudecode" the encoded file.
<effie_jayx> jpds,  I am bit confused... I just ran uuencode with the ttf file.. Now I run uudecode with debuild?
<jpds> effie_jayx: No, you place the encoded file somewhere and run uudecode in debian/rules.
<effie_jayx> jpds,  right... the encoding seems stuck
<effie_jayx> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/36237/
<jpds> effie_jayx: Try: uuencode Ubuntu-Title.ttf Ubuntu-Title.ttf
<effie_jayx> jpds, get output
<jpds> effie_jayx: To save the output - simply redirect it to a desired filename: "> Ubuntu-Title.ttf.uu"
<emgent> heya
<effie_jayx> jpds,  it takes a while aparently
<jpds> Hello emgent
<emgent> jpds: :)
<slytherin> geser: need you advice. Can you please take a look at libjogl-java? Some part of code is under SGI Free Software License B which is supposed to be non-free. But the code is licensed with some exceptions which I guess should make it free.
<jpds> effie_jayx: Depends on the filesize I guess.
<RainCT> effie_jayx: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Howtos/BinaryFilesInDiff
<slytherin> is there any url where a list of Free and non-Free licenses according to DFSG is available?
<geser> slytherin: can you point me to the exceptions? for libjogl-java
<JasonSpradlin82> anybody here to answer newbie questions about packaging?
<slytherin> geser: If you have source then you can find them in the LICENSE.txt file in jogl directory.
<JasonSpradlin82> I was following the Packaging Guide and after getting pbuilder, it showed me an example of how to create a build environment
<JasonSpradlin82> i ran the command, and created the build environment
<geser> slytherin: you mean the paragraphs starting with "The JOGL source tree contains code
<JasonSpradlin82> but what was the point of doing that, aside from creating a build environment that isn't affected by my computer settings, that can work as any hardy computer
<JasonSpradlin82> i have this build environment there on my computer now, but what would a person normally do next?
<slytherin> geser: yes
<geser> slytherin: if I understand this correctly then libjogl-java still contains code licensed under SGI FreeB
<slytherin> geser: re-licensed by Sun (that is what I believe)
<jpds> JasonSpradlin82: Build packages with it.
<geser> slytherin: I don't know, I'm not a licensing expert
<JasonSpradlin82> ok... like how?
<slytherin> geser: whom should we consult?
<JasonSpradlin82> jpds: (forgive my ignorance, i am trying to fix that)
<JasonSpradlin82> ((my ignorance))
<jpds> JasonSpradlin82: Did you setup pbuilder?
<geser> slytherin: ask an archive admin or the debian-legal ML
<JasonSpradlin82> no, i just installed it using apt-get... the package guide simply said I would need it installed, if I wanted to start contributing
<slytherin> geser: I think debian-legal ML would be right place.
<jpds> JasonSpradlin82: Well, pbuilder builds packages in a chroot environment, it installs the necessary programs, libraries, etc - which a package needs in order to build.
<jpds> JasonSpradlin82: This way, you don't have to install everything on your working system.
<JasonSpradlin82> jpds: The problem with the packaging guide, methinks, is that it tells you how to do things, but assumes you already know why you are doing them... i've been using computers my whole life, was writing programs on my commodore 64 when i was 10, but i've never, ever worked on linux, and I really have no clue as to the way things are done... and the package guide seems to assume I have more common knowledge on these issues
<JasonSpradlin82> jpds: yeah i kind of understand that... so can you give an example of when and how i might use it, while contributing to ubuntu?
<jpds> JasonSpradlin82: To test the build process of your own packages?
<JasonSpradlin82> jpds: yeah... i mean like... "you would take a package (or source code), and with programX, you would run it and it would be built into that build environment" or "it would be built according to the settings of that build environment" (i'm guessing here)
<jpds> JasonSpradlin82: "man pbuilder" - explains the program a bit more.
<JasonSpradlin82> jpds: would i be using pbuilder later to package a program, and then it go into that build environment to see what files are already on the system and see what files (dependencies) it would need to obtain, on a bare-bones ubuntu hardy install?
<JasonSpradlin82> ok thanks
<JasonSpradlin82> jpds: this is much more informative... real quick: is chroot as mentioned in this manual, the same as the base.tgz/build environment?
<jpds> JasonSpradlin82: The base.tgz is uncompress to create the chroot.
<JasonSpradlin82> ok cool...
<JasonSpradlin82> and that would be a kind of virtual file system with base settings and any other changes i've affected to it using pbuilder, correct?
<jpds> JasonSpradlin82: Have you seen the videos? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Videos
<JasonSpradlin82> i was going to watch them earlier, but I don't have my sound set up yet
<JasonSpradlin82> ((sheepish grin))
<jpds> JasonSpradlin82: One has to get to grips with the debian/ directory: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/PackagingOverview - beforing starting with building the package ;-)
<JasonSpradlin82> jpds: ah good... also, what is the upstream, actually?  The latest version undergoing debugging?
<jpds> JasonSpradlin82: Upstream are the actual program coders/writers.
<RainCT> JasonSpradlin82: upstream is from where we take the application (it can refer to the authors, or in some cases to Debian)
<RainCT> JasonSpradlin82: The reason why pbuilder (or another system like it) should be used, beside avoiding your system to get full of unnecessary stuff, is that this way you ensure that the package declares al necessary dependencies, and that pbuilder allows you to have chroots for different Ubuntu/Debian versions (ie., you can build packages for Intrepid with it being on Hardy)
<JasonSpradlin82> AHA!  "the original (sometimes called "upstream") tarball"
<JasonSpradlin82> so when we update a debian package for ubuntu, are we only adding patches that will self install when unpackaged for installation, and leaving the original debian source untouched?
<jpds> JasonSpradlin82: Untouched, but with patches if necessary.
<JasonSpradlin82> awesome (that i get that)
<JasonSpradlin82> ok wow... it should have been stated somewhere to me that the "basic overview guide" is much more helpful to the ignorant that the complete guide is....
<JasonSpradlin82> it was extremely informative and cleared a lot of things up for me.
<JasonSpradlin82> thanks
<jpds> Hey, we're all here to help each other \o/
<tuxmaniac> LucidFox: thanks for electric :-)
<bdrung_> does someone know how to escape " in an $( ... ) command (in debian/rules)?
<bdrung_> PLATFORM := $(python -c "from distutils.util import get_platform; print get_platform()") does not work
<geser> use \"
<bdrung_> geser: does not work
<geser> bdrung_: try adding more \, e.g. \\"
<bdrung_> geser: does not work
<geser> hmm, then I've no idea
<slytherin> bdrung_: why do you need to get platform that way?
<bdrung_> slayton:  because it is used in a patch
<geser> bdrung_: what error did you got?
<slytherin> bdrung_: I mean isn't there any other way to retrive platform?
<bdrung_> is maybe $(...) the wrong command
<bdrung_> afk
<slytherin> slomo: gst-plugins-bad FTBFS on intrepid. Are you already working on that?
<bdrung_> geser, slytherin: i have to use $(shell ... ). in my case: PLATFORM := $(shell python -c "from distutils.util import get_platform; print get_platform()")
<slytherin> bdrung_: yes, I completely overlooked shell part
<bdrung_> slytherin: i use this way to get the platform name, because the directory name is generated using the same function. the debian maintainer used dpkg-architecture for getting the platform name, but this causes a ftbfs on i386
<slytherin> hmm
<slytherin> Can anyone please ack bug 254919 It will fix FTBFS for gst-plugins-bad on intrepid.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 254919 in libdvdnav "Please update to 4.1.2-3" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/254919
<tuxmaniac> Can someone please ack bug 255224 after revieing the changes. its new upstream release
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 255224 in gnusim8085 "New Upstream Release 1.3.4" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/255224
 * RainCT hugs jpds because he is working on ubuntu-dev-tools
 * jpds hugs RainCT.
<RainCT> so guys, now you know what you have to do if you want a hug ;)
<foxbuntu> would someone be able to revu my package, it would be greatly appreciated: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=mythbuntu-log-grabber
<nxvl> emgent: ping
<Kopfgeldjaeger> foxbuntu: hi. you probably should have a look at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebianMaintainerField - and you can add yourself as XSBC-Original-Maintainer
<Kopfgeldjaeger> and you could probably merge both changelog entries into one - if you want both names there sth. like [ Thomas Mashos and Nick Fox ] should be ok
<foxbuntu> Kopfgeldjaeger, what do you mean? I was working on the package the with original author and just submitted it to revu becuase I completed it and had it ready to go
<foxbuntu> Kopfgeldjaeger, I can do that
<tgm4883_laptop> Is there someone that can clarify a packaging rule for me?  Should get-orig-source grab the source from the original authors site, or from a bzr branch that I placed the authors source on?
<RainCT> tgm4883_laptop: usually from the author's site, but if you prefer to get it from a branch that's OK too
<RainCT> you can pretty much let get-orig-source do whatever you want :)
<tgm4883_laptop> yea, thats what I was afraid of
<tgm4883_laptop> what would be the consequences for not having a get-orig-source?
<tgm4883_laptop> RainCT, regarding that question you answered from me earlier.  Is it also OK to change that branch that i'm getting the source from if i'm not the orig author?
<tgm4883_laptop> i'm asking for clarification, because the packaging guide seems to indicate otherwise
<RAOF> tgm4883_laptop: Someone will likely complain at you a little, and then move on.
<tgm4883_laptop> and i'm finding trouble getting the source from the projects homepage when I am trying to package this.  It keeps warning me about  dpkg-source: warning: ignoring deletion of file search.pl
<RAOF> That's not a problem, as long as the resulting thing builds of course.
<tgm4883_laptop> even though AFAIK, i'm not deleting anything.  Also, this error only occurs if I have the .orig.tar.gz in the dir above
<RAOF> Presumably search.pl is being deleted on clean.
<tgm4883_laptop> RAOF, ok, but I think that is what Is making all the files end up in the .diff
<RAOF> No, it isn't.
<tgm4883_laptop> which is what sistpoty said I needed to fix
<tgm4883_laptop> h
<tgm4883_laptop> oh
<tgm4883_laptop> hmm
<RAOF> All the files end up in the .diff?
<tgm4883_laptop> yea
<tgm4883_laptop> http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=mythstream-parser-youtube
<tgm4883_laptop> in case you want to look ;)
<RAOF> That probably means that your clean target doesn't work.
<tgm4883_laptop> which is in my rules file?
<RAOF> Yes.
<tgm4883_laptop> yea, my rules file only contains 2 things
<RAOF> Then it's quite possibly wrong :)
<tgm4883_laptop> include /usr/share/cdbs/1/rules/debhelper.mk and get-orig-source
 * tgm4883_laptop curses at the packaging guide
<tgm4883_laptop> so would that be some dh_clean type thing?
<tgm4883_laptop> just point me in the right direction and i'll go a learning
<tgm4883_laptop> ;)
<RAOF> Hm.  So you're using cdbs, which will be calling all the right things.
<RAOF> Which would point to... how does the source actually get _built_?
<tgm4883_laptop> built?  All I want to do is stick this parser into /usr/share/mythtv/mythstream/parsers/"name"
<tgm4883_laptop> when you say built..
<RAOF> Ah.  So, what you want the package to do is to copy foobar.script to /usr/share/mythtv/mythstream/parsers/foobar?
<tgm4883_laptop> yes
#ubuntu-motu 2009-08-03
<quidnunc> Is emacs23 being packaged for Karmic and Jaunty?
<RAOF> It'd only get into Janty via backports; I know that there's work in Debian to package it, so we'll probably just pull that down.
<micahg> It's in debian unstable
<quidnunc> RAOF: So Karmic is waiting on Debian?
<quidnunc> micahg: Is there any work going on to put it into Karmic?
<micahg> idk, you can check for an open request, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/emacs
<quidnunc> micahg: I've looked, didn't see one and was surprised, considering its popularity. I assumed I missed something
<micahg> nope
<micahg> if it's not there, you can file a sync request
<quidnunc> micahg: That link is bad by the way
<micahg> sorry
<quidnunc> #408085:
<quidnunc> This report is public
<quidnunc>  
<quidnunc> Sorry. ^ Someone filed the sync request 5 hours ago.
<micahg> great
<micahg> you can subscribe and be notified when it's complete
 * micahg didn't know emacs source versions are numbered :) 
 * micahg uses vi :)
 * micahg will use the bot next time :)
<quidnunc> Thanks micahg
<micahg> np
<kklimonda> Could someone sponsor bug 317366 - it's a small patch (i'll send it to debian when it's uploaded). Also is this bug worth and sru? fwiw it may be pretty irritating for people who use rxvt-unicode often
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 317366 in rxvt-unicode "urxvt menu hangs urxvt with x input frozen" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/317366
<coolbhavi> hello m trying to update xoscope to 2.0 but its ftbfs
<coolbhavi> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/29805253/buildlog_ubuntu-karmic-i386.xoscope_2.0-0ubuntu4_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<coolbhavi> http://pastebin.com/m7106b864 <= Rules file
<coolbhavi> orig.tar.gz available here : https://edge.launchpad.net/~bhavi/+archive/xoscope/+files/xoscope_2.0.orig.tar.gz
<coolbhavi> please help
<billybigrigger> anyone alive?
<billybigrigger> anyone here familiar with phoronix test suite?
<micahg> yes and no :)
<billybigrigger> well i just installed it from repos
<billybigrigger> and the gui doesn't work without PHP GTK
<billybigrigger> so i have to compile and build it myself
<billybigrigger> billybigrigger@cabo:~/php-gtk-2.0.1$ phoronix-test-suite gui
<billybigrigger> The PHP GTK module must be loaded for the GUI.
<billybigrigger> This module can be found @ http://gtk.php.net/
<micahg> yes, I'm familiar with the module
<micahg> I'm not familiar wiht the test suite though
<billybigrigger> oh
 * micahg is alive though
<\sh> moins
<billybigrigger> well maybe for karmic if it's not too late we can get a php gtk package made up and installed with the test suite?
<billybigrigger> since it's the only decent gui benchmarking tool i know of for linux
<micahg> bug 260235
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 260235 in ubuntu "[needs-packaging] php5-gtk2" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/260235
<billybigrigger> i have a howto written up on how to get the gui working for phoronix 1.8
<micahg> debian bug 473396
<ubottu> Debian bug 473396 in wnpp "ITP: php5-gtk2 -- GTK2 bindings for PHP" [Wishlist,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/473396
<billybigrigger> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1108731
<billybigrigger> ahhhh
<billybigrigger> :P
<micahg> sorry
<micahg> might want to poke upstream, it was last touched apr 2008
<micahg> This came out of one of the posts: http://php-gtk.eu/en/ubuntu-php-gtk-repository
<micahg> but no guarantees
<stochastic> I'm packaging a program and a few of the files included in the source tarball have this copyright notice: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/245629/ is it still eligible for inclusion in Universe?  How do I summarize this for the debian/copyright file (or do I paste the whole notice there)?
<slytherin> stochastic: 'without fee' looks like non-free me. I am not sure if it will be allowed in archives.
 * stochastic needs to do more research on this, because the feature that these files implement are used by many other programs in the archives...
<directhex> slytherin is correct
<directhex> "without fee" is non-free. which sounds ass-backwards really
<stochastic> I'll talk to upstream about it
<slytherin> Does anyone know if we are taking advantage of the improved dpkg-shlibdeps for programs linking against gtk libraries?
<directhex> slytherin, improved how?
<slytherin> directhex: I read something related to symbols file which is used by dpkg-shlibdeps to check which symbols are actually being used by the program and set the dependencies (shlib:Depends) accordingly.
<directhex> slytherin, as long as ld's using --as-needed
<directhex> (it amazes me that --as-needed isn't the default)
<slytherin> And how do I know if ld is using as-needed or not?
<slytherin> directhex: what is the correct way to specify ld flag --as-needed?
<directhex> dunno. probably in LDFLAGS somehow. i do mono packaging, remember? our linker doesn't include useless linkage
<pochu> slytherin: LDFLAGS += -Wl,--as-needed
<slytherin> pochu: What is -Wl in this case?
<pochu> slytherin: it tells the compiler to pass that flag to the linker
<slytherin> pochu: Ok. Let me try.
<renderguy> Hi there.
<pochu>        -Wl,option
<pochu>            Pass option as an option to the linker.  If option contains commas, it is split into multiple options at the commas.
<pochu> from gcc(1)
<slytherin> renderguy: hi
<renderguy> I'll apologies in advance, as I'm not sure where best to request help, but I was hoping to gauge in interest of any official package maintainers to help bring our package up-to-date? - http://packages.ubuntu.com/jaunty/aqsis
<renderguy> No-one on our team is qualified to handle this task so we're hoping to be able to work with packagers to help keep things current.
<directhex> renderguy, try poking ender in debianland - he's the original maintainer
<directhex> and a fixed package in debian helps every dist, not just ubuntu
<renderguy> directhex: I've tried the previous maintainers, they seem to have vanished.  :-(
<renderguy> We do have someone looking into this at the moment, but he is also new and not an official package maintainer... what we lack is the 'Experience'.
<renderguy> Users are also rushing us as our project is also used by other apps, and we're releasing a new version shortly (few weeks).
<renderguy> If anyone would be interested in providing a little time I'm sure we can get things rolling again.
<slytherin> directhex: pochu: --as-needed worked, but it doesn't solve my original problem. The package has dependency libgtk2.0-0 (>= 2.17.5), whereas only 2.12 is needed.
<directhex> oh. oh, interesting
<renderguy> I have experience of our current RPM (Fedora) package, though not the repo process, so I'm sure with an experienced Debian/Ubuntu packager on-board we could get something running pretty quickly.
<renderguy> </salesman>  ;-)
<pochu> slytherin: that's likely because of the shlibs
<pochu> see /var/lib/dpkg/info/libgtk2.0-0.shlibs
<slytherin> pochu: Right, but from what I had heard the dpkg-shlibdeps is now smart enough to check which symbols are actually used and adjust the dependencies accordingly.
<renderguy> Are there logs for this channel (online)?
<slytherin> renderguy: irclogs.ubuntu.com
<StevenK> renderguy: Yes, irclogs.ubuntu.com
<slytherin> pochu: here is the reason, the gtk source package in karmic does not contain debian/libgtk2.0-0.symbols file. Where as the version in Debian does. So the same package built in Debian has only necessary dependencies (gtk2 >= 2.12 in this case).
<renderguy> slytherin & StevenK: Thanks, I can monitor that should anyone respond when I'm offline.
<slytherin> s/package/application.
<slayton> I've seen a few examples where people use svn<revision_number> in a package title... what would be the appropriate way of doing this using a sources that are kept in a git repository, as the revision hash doesn't increment with git?
<slayton> - package title + package version number
<jpds> slayton: ~gitYYYYMMDDHHMM.
<slayton> jpds, great thanks!
<geser> and perhaps mention the git hash in the changelog
<fabrice_sp> Hi. I've been requested to add a build log to a sync request. Is it a new mandatory file to attach to a sync request?
<fabrice_sp> it's for bug #406505
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 406505 in deal.ii "Sync deal.ii 6.2.1-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)." [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/406505
<StevenK> I didn't think so ...
<fabrice_sp> So did I...
<fabrice_sp> Anyway: as I always build the package before requesting a sync, the log should be somewhere
<geser> some sponsors like to see it to have a proof that you test-build it
<slytherin> I am curious. The guy who asked it could have checked himself if the package build fine.
<fabrice_sp> ok. I'll attach it from now on
<fabrice_sp> I can understand because this is a looooonnnnngggg building package
<fabrice_sp> (almost 2 hours in my case)
<fabrice_sp> (and most packages builds in less than 20 minutes)
<\sh> slytherin: I thought so too...sponsor needs to check for him/herself when she/he is not sure, but that's only me
<fabrice_sp> I was just checking if it was a new approach, not blaming anybody :-)
<slytherin> Right. I always check if the package builds fine before confirming a sync. Call me paranoid but I usually do not trust someone else's build log.
<geser> I usually check myself too, but for long-building packages I sometimes take the word from the contributor that it builds (if it's a known contributor)
<bddebian> Heya gang
<slytherin> TheMuso: Is there any known solution to the current powerpc buildd problem?
<renderguy> Gotta shoot now, I'll monitor the IRC logs to see if anyone's interested in helping... thanks for listening.
<loic-m> What's the way to specify that a package has to be built with a version of gcc different than the latest one in karmic (i.e. << 4.4)?
<StevenK> loic-m: Add gcc-X.Y to the Build-Depends, and change CC in debian/rules
<StevenK> loic-m: I think it would be preferable to just fix it to build with 4.4
<loic-m> StevenK: thanks. I added gcc (< 4.4) but didn't think about debian/rules
<StevenK> loic-m: gcc (< 4.4) won't work
<loic-m> StevenK: I don't know C, so I can't fix it unfortunately :(
<loic-m> Steven: why?
<pochu> loic-m: you need gcc-4.3 or gcc-X.Y
<maxb> Because for arcane compatibility reasons, < means <=
<pochu> gcc (<< 4.4) won't work either
<pochu> (in build-depends)
<loic-m> pochu: thanks a lot.
<dkg0> LP345054 is the request for syncing monkeysphere from debian unstable.
<dkg0> in particular, it requests version 0.26-1
<pochu> bug 345054
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 345054 in monkeysphere "please sync monkeysphere 0.26 from debian unstable" [Wishlist,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/345054
<dkg0> but it was closed as fixed by an upload of 0.25-1
<dkg0> 0.25-1 is going to have the same FTBFS under pbuilder rebuilds
<dkg0> due to the test suite running under /tmp
<dkg0> 0.26 contains a fix for that
<dkg0> should i change the status off of "Fix Released" since it is not really resolved?
<dkg0> if so, what should i change it to?  should i assign it to anyone?
<slytherin> dkg0: Why not simply file a new bug.
<dkg0> because this bug was not actually resolved?
<dkg0> would it be better as a new bug?
<loic-m> dkg0: I don't have a clue, but personnaly when an upgrade/sync request takes a while, and there's a new version, I just update the bug description, especially if a prospective uploader has already started looking into the bug
<dkg0> loic-m: my concern is that it was marked "fixed" two hours ago by a sync of an old version
<dkg0> i *did* update the bug description, but that was a few days ago
<slytherin> dkg0: No. For the sake of cleanliness on launchpad. You already modified a sync request for old version. That is why I believe the archive admin got confused.
<loic-m> dkg0: news bugs then maybe. If you use requestsync, it's simple
<dkg0> i'll use requestsync going forward for sure, i'm just trying to figure out the right way to handle this particular case, where the ticket is effectively tracking this FTBFS issue about the test suite.
<loic-m> dkg0: won't 0.26 process be far more straightforward though, with no building problems? Or is there a need to keep some information from the bug report you linked to?
<dkg0> well, i hope there'll be no more build problems, but i've been wrong before ;)
<kamalnandan> Hi All
<loic-m> dkg0: if there's no need to read the previous bug report, won't a new sync request be easier, specifying it has to be pulled from unstable? Unless you want to ping slangasek if really necessary
<dkg0> yah, i see what yer saying.
<dkg0> i think i dug in a bit too much on the old bug report, and should have just let it go ;)
<kamaln> Hi All
<loic-m> Is there an example of a package that needs to be build with a different version of gcc than the default one so i can have a look how it's done in debian/rules?
<Lin_> Hi there all!! I wish to know: 1. if kernel-ppa images (2.6.31 to be more exact) contains backports-modules. 2. and, if dont where can I find the patch to apply them to kernel-ppa 2.6.31 sources? BTW, i have seem that some drivers (v4l to be exact) are not set to be compiled, is this working as intended? cause isnt a big cost add more capture cards (mainly usb ones).
<Eaxexe> Hi there, is there a tool to package to .deb and .rpm at the same time?
<UbuntuNISMO>   anybody can help fixing /etc/network/interfaces ?
<slytherin> UbuntuNISMO: This is not a general support channel. Try #ubuntu
<UbuntuNISMO> thanks
<UbuntuNISMO> im not linux beginner but what is MOTU about?
<slytherin> Eaxexe: The files needed by both are different. What do you mean by build at same time?
<slytherin> UbuntuNISMO: Packaging software.
<Eaxexe> slytherin: Well I've been looking into creating (or just TRYING to) develop a Unified Package System, but as I've been searching the net it seems an impossible task. So my idea is to develop a tool where if you've developed a program you can pack to .deb and .rpm at the same time :)
<slytherin> Eaxexe: About unified packaging system, I believe autopackage tries to solve that problem.
<Eaxexe> slytherin: great thanks :) Looking into it
<Eaxexe> Thanks I'll look into it :)
<slytherin> What is exactly the meaning of error 'failed to upload'?
<UbuntuNISMO> ok nice , I did some .deb packages in the past, I know theres a lot to know with automate freedesktop to read about, good channel!, I keep this in mind
<c_korn> hello, how can I resolve such a dependency problem?
<c_korn> The following packages have unmet dependencies:
<c_korn>   libcdparanoia0-dev: Depends: libcdparanoia0 (= 3.10+debian~pre0-6) but 3.10.2+debian-5~ppa2~hardy is to be installed
<slytherin> c_korn: you are mixing repositories it seems.
<pochu> or -dev is arch:all and the library isn't built yet
<c_korn> hm, yes. I was trying to build gst-plugins-base0.10-0.10.23.4 on hardy.
<c_korn> it build-depends on libcdparanoia0-dev
<c_korn> which is virtual in karmic. and a normal package in hardy
<c_korn> http://packages.ubuntu.com/search?keywords=libcdparanoia0-dev&searchon=names&suite=all&section=all
<c_korn> should I change the dependency in gst-plugins-base to libcdparanoia-dev ?
<slytherin> c_korn: your problem is not the name of dependency
<slytherin> c_korn: it is version mismatch between -dev and the lib package
<c_korn> hm, all packages are already in the ppa repository. I don't know why it is tried to install the old version.
<fabrice_sp> c_korn, what is the url of the ppa?
<c_korn> fabrice_sp:  https://launchpad.net/~c-korn/+archive/vlc
<c_korn> this is the build log http://launchpadlibrarian.net/29832263/buildlog_ubuntu-hardy-amd64.gst-plugins-base0.10_0.10.23.4-1~ppa1~hardy_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<fabrice_sp> libparanoia0-dev is not the same as libparanoia-dev
<fabrice_sp> :-)
<fabrice_sp> your ppa contains libcdparanoia-dev
<fabrice_sp> change the build dependency from libcdparanoia0-dev to libcdparanoia-dev
<fabrice_sp> c_korn, ^
<c_korn> fabrice_sp: yes, thanks. as I suggested.
<slytherin> james_w: slangasek: Is either of you planning to look at new source packages in queue today? I am waiting for processing of jakarta-jmeter. :-)
<fabrice_sp> andv, about Bug #400528
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 400528 in taskjuggler "Please merge taskjuggler 2.4.3-1 from Debian unstable" [Wishlist,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/400528
<fabrice_sp> do you want me to update the changelog to make clear why the --without-arts is mandatory?
<andv> fabrice_sp, yes, I saw some changes you didnt apply back
<andv> fabrice_sp, like debian/rules: compile again with kde support
<andv> +
<andv> for example
<andv> I want to know why you dropped them and why you added that configure rule
<fabrice_sp> really? I'll check again, but I'm sure they have been applied in Debian
<andv> fabrice_sp, could be, but you didnt say why those changes can be dropped
<andv> in bug description
<fabrice_sp> andv, ok. I'll make that clear
<andv> fabrice_sp, something more
<fabrice_sp> yes?
<fabrice_sp> not from my part
<andv> try to document changes you make more clearly
<norsetto> any kubuntero wishing to check if http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?upid=6499 conforms to their standards?
<andv> fabrice_sp, by adding an entry like the one you added will confuse next mergers
<fabrice_sp> andv, which one? The no Remaining changes?
<andv> fabrice_sp, nope
<andv> fabrice_sp, the one related to --without-arts
<andv> fabrice_sp, you said you added it but you don't document why
<andv> fix all of them and set the bug on confirmed again
<andv> ;)
<fabrice_sp> ok. Thanks ;-
<fabrice_sp> )
<andv> np
#ubuntu-motu 2009-08-04
<maxb> krisives: debian/rules is executble so you can just run "debian/rules unpatch"
<maxb> Or slightly more aggressively, "fakeroot debian/rules clean"
<Zhenech> hyperair, building XD
<krisives> Right now everytime I want to make my test deb I have to run make -f debian/rules unpatch
<krisives> I just do ./debian/rules unpatch instead?
<maxb> You don't even need the ./
<\sh>  /window 14
<\sh> grmpf
<hyperair> Zhenech: oh pbuilder's fixed eh?
<Zhenech> hyperair, yupp
<hyperair> ah, good =)
<krisives> Anyone know a good C regular expression library I should use?
<Zhenech> hyperair, done
<hyperair> that was fast O_o
<Zhenech> well, it wasnt really big :)
<hyperair> hmm true =\
<Zhenech> hyperair, btw, if you have time, it'd be nice to replace the hardcoded 0.17 version of geany with something dynamic (parse the output of geany --version and put it in substvars?)
<hyperair> oh yeah that would be a good idea.
<Zhenech> geany --version |awk '{print $2}'
<Zhenech> that prints the version just fine :)
<hyperair> or pkg-config --modversion geany
<Zhenech> or that, right
<rawang> hi, how to cancel a dh_auto_test?
<cjwatson> rawang: ctrl-c?
<cjwatson> or do you mean "how do you make it not run?"
<rawang> cjwatson, yeah
<rawang> how do I make it not run :)
<rawang> cjwatson, I just leave %:   to do  dh $@
<rawang> i mean
<rawang> %:
<rawang>         dh $@
<rawang> use dh7
<StevenK> That will certainly run dh_auto_test
<directhex> yould you just have a blank override_dh_auto_test ?
<Laney> yes
<rawang> oh,
<rawang> override_dh_auto_test with nothing command right?
<Laney> just put override_dh_auto_test:
<directhex> then dh voodoo will run whatever you specify instead of dh_auto_test
<Laney> which is nothing
<rawang> good idea
<cjwatson> right, sorry, that was what I was going to suggest but I got distracted :)
<cjwatson> if you do that, you need to build-depend on debhelper (>= 7.0.50)
<cjwatson> I also have to ask - why?
<cjwatson> it should be unusual to have to arrange *not* to run a test suite
<cjwatson> so it's worth looking into why you feel the need to turn this off, and fixing it
<rawang> cjwatson, so what is usual way to disable the tests?
<rawang> cjwatson, the tests need a dbus daemon within build environment,  but apparently the temp build environment don't have
<rawang> Laney, StevenK directhex thanks for you ideas :)
<james_w> the tests should perhaps create a private dbus session so that they don't intefere with anything on the system
<james_w> cjwatson: I believe that is the version that adds the override_* handling
<cjwatson> james_w: yes
<cjwatson> james_w: what I meant is why does he need to disable the test suite
<james_w> ah, sorry, misread
<rawang> cjwatson, yep, so what is usual way to disable the tests?
<cjwatson> rawang: we already gave you the usual way to disable the tests - but it's also usual, when disabling tests, to consider why
<rawang> but not using override
<cjwatson> it's best not to disable tests at all
<rawang> yes, agreed
<cjwatson> dh 7 didn't have an elegant way to disable tests before 7.0.50 - you could do it but it was painful
<cjwatson> dh build --before dh_auto_test # I think
<cjwatson> and that might confuse something else - so use that only if you're prepared to debug stuff :)
<rawang> cjwatson, the build is ahead of test already
<rawang> but seems like override_dh_auto_test won't work
<directhex> rawang, nah, the point is, the debian/rules "build" rule is handled as "dh build" which runs through a long list of dh_foo commands. you used to specify "dh build --before dh_foo" then "dh build --after dh_foo" to make changes to dh_foo behaviour
<rawang> directhex, yes, i see, but the problem is i only want to skip the dh_auto_test
<directhex> rawang, which is what i just described - the old pre-7.0.50 way to do that
<directhex> rawang, doesn't the build system have a --disable-tests or something?
<rawang> directhex, and override_dh_auto_test doesn't work,  my debhelper is 7.0.17ubuntu4
<directhex> well, that explains why it doesn't work
<directhex> let me find an example of old overrides
<rawang> directhex, yea, unluckily, the build system don't have a --disable-tests options :(
<directhex> gnome-subtitles in pkg-cli-apps svn
<rawang> directhex, sure, thanks ! :)
<rawang> ok
<directhex> http://svn.debian.org/wsvn/pkg-cli-apps/packages/gnome-subtitles/trunk/debian/rules
<slytherin> rawang: why not patch the source to not run the tests.
<rawang> slytherin, you mean patch an option to disable the tests for configure?
<slytherin> something like that
<Laney> why's that better than overriding dh_auto_test?
<rawang> slytherin, ok, nice, but I might need to skip the tests first to see whether it works or not, thanks :)
<Laney> I suppose you could disable some of the test
<slytherin> Laney: it will surely work no matter what version of debhelper. :-)
<Laney> s
<Laney> heh
<Laney> a versioned build-dep is no problem...
<rawang> directhex, there is not a "skip test" from your example
<rawang> if --disable-tests is specified, the dh will not run dh_auto_test wisely?
<directhex> rawang, there's an override though - dh_auto_configure is overridden
<directhex> rawang, try also nant
<rawang> directhex, sorry, what is nant? :)
<rawang> directhex, even though I could override configure, but does it help to avoid running dh_auto_test?
<directhex> rawang, another overridden package
<rawang> ok
<directhex> rawang, um..... the point here is you do as cjwatson says, and use "dh build --before_auto_test \n dh_build --after dh_auto_test" as your build: rule
<Laney> is it?
<directhex> and then the build rule will do everything before, and everything after, dh_auto_test in its list o' commands - but not dh_auto_test
<Laney> I thought the point was to override and version the b-d
<directhex> Laney, or that
 * Laney spins in circles
 * Laney goes back to just a minute
 * directhex flings a monkey at Laney 
<rawang> directhex, oh, the point is run all the dhs before and after dh_auto_test, so that we could skip dh_auto_test, right?
<directhex> right
<rawang> got it
<rawang> ugh, it appears to be complicated then, :(
<directhex> rawang, easier with 7.0.50!
<rawang> if my debhelper > 7.0.50, i could just using "override_dh_auto_test: with nothing " to simply skip the dh_auto_test, right?
<directhex> right
<rawang> ok
<rawang> will try
<c_korn> geser: thanks for adding the debian bug watcher to the bug. I completely forgot about that
<fabrice_sp> andv, about bug #400528
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 400528 in taskjuggler "Please merge taskjuggler 2.4.3-1 from Debian unstable" [Wishlist,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/400528
<andv> fabrice_sp, yeah
<fabrice_sp> the address is the new one that has to be used ("Ubuntu Developers <ubuntu-devel-
<fabrice_sp> discuss@lists.ubuntu.com>" )
<fabrice_sp> it's auto generated by update_maintainer script
<andv> fabrice_sp, ppl keep using the other one
<andv> it seems
<fabrice_sp> I'll check the changelog, because I let MoM generate it, and it seems MoM is forgetting some things
<fabrice_sp> the MOTU one, you mean?
<andv> fabrice_sp, yeah, some ppl keep using MOTU one
<andv> fabrice_sp, does it really matter?
<fabrice_sp> andv, I'm just following https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebianMaintainerField (and I already had this discussion here about the right Maintainer value)
<fabrice_sp> it changed in May 2009
<andv> fabrice_sp, perfect then
<andv> leave that comment out ;)
<fabrice_sp> ok :-) I'll check the changelog entries when at home (in 6 hours, more or less :-/ ) thanks
<andv> fabrice_sp, np, watch out for missing entries in the future
<fabrice_sp> andv, I generally use meld to compare the changelog. I'll check what happened in that case. Bye
<andv> fabrice_sp, perfect, cya
<slytherin> does anyone know how to boot live CD iso using grub2?
<cjwatson> andv: as long as people switch over gradually eventually, it's not *that* important
<andv> cjwatson, ok perfect
<cjwatson> slytherin: no idea, no effort put into it, and doing that would certainly lose the graphical menu for now
<andv> cjwatson, anyway when revieweing I gonna tell them it's better to adopt the new way
<cjwatson> slytherin: I'd like to switch over to it eventually (maybe a couple of cycles out); you're welcome to try it now as long as you're aware that you'll be trailblazing :)
<slytherin> cjwatson: Perhaps I put my question wrong. I read in one of the articles mentioned in latest UWN that it is possible to boot a ISO image from grub so there is no need to burn that ISO to a CD.
<cjwatson> I don't know the answer, but I'd start with grub.enbug.org
<slytherin> I searched on the grub wiki. Didn't find anything there.
<cjwatson> there's an iso9660 module, certainly
<slytherin> I am wondering where did th article writer get that info from
<cjwatson> 'insmod iso9660' in the grub shell and play around from there?
<slytherin> Ok. Let me try.
<amar> hi folk,
<amar> Recently django released a stable/security update
<amar> http://www.djangoproject.com/weblog/2009/jul/28/security/
<amar> Is this the sort of thing that should be applied to Universe SRU?
<kklimonda> wrt django is it possible to update it to 1.0.3 directly? upstream has a pretty big range of various tests
<kklimonda> unfortunately those tests aren't distributed in tarballs..
<amar> I have attempted to create an update to 1.0.3 following the update recipe on the MOTU wiki
<amar> Just wondering what the next step would be
<andol> andv: Might if I take a mergin (unison) question here, instead of going on and on in the comment field?
<StevenK> didrocks: Are you going to update clutter-gtk?
<StevenK> didrocks: Since you didn't put clutter-gtk-0.9 into the archive
<didrocks> StevenK: I wasn't planning putting 0.9 into the archive but waiting for 1.0 (I didn't checked if it's released yet)
<StevenK> didrocks: It's out, 0.10.2
<StevenK> didrocks: Which requires clutter 1.0
<didrocks> StevenK: ok, can this wait for this week-end? (and clutter 1.0 is waiting for an archive admin approval FYI)
<StevenK> didrocks: I'm a member of -archive, I'm just about to accept it
<didrocks> or is there some emergency on that? (not sure to be able to handle it before this timeline)
<StevenK> didrocks: Well, is it in Debian?
<didrocks> StevenK: thanks :) If you can have a look about mutter, this will be awesome
<didrocks> StevenK: it's still in NEW. I'm working with kov merging the changes
<didrocks> (same for mutter)
<StevenK> didrocks: It's not my archive day, I was just asked to look at clutter since I know about it
<StevenK> didrocks: I'd prefer it sooner
<didrocks> StevenK: ok, I will try to take a look at it this evening. If I can't, I will tell you tomorrow, is that ok?
<StevenK> didrocks: Sure. I'm happy to finish up the work, given some direction, too.
<didrocks> StevenK: great :)
<Zhenech> bdrung, fetching your stuff
<Zhenech> 18k/s
<Zhenech> why is mentors sooo slow
<bdrung> Zhenech: no idea
<Zhenech> bdrung, are there any lookworth changes to the packaging besides of the fix for #536480?
<Zhenech> not for arc-colors at it seems :)
<Zhenech> s/at/as/
<coolbhavi> Hello to upload to mentors.debian.net is this the correct config file? http://pastebin.com/mca03d0a
<Zhenech> same for shiki colors *build*
<Zhenech> bdrung, I guess you tested the alternatives stuff? I have no gnome to tamper with here :)
<bdrung> Zhenech: it's running on my two systems, and the PPA is updated, too (tested by many people). I only broke thing for Ubuntu hardy users. ;)
<Zhenech> haha
<Zhenech> I dont care for ubuntu ;)
<Zhenech> (well, I do, but... you know ;))
<bdrung> Zhenech: i know. the packages fits better into debian than ubuntu.
<Zhenech> stupid inkscape btw, when it is launched in batch/headless mode, it still complains it cant open a DISPLAY...
<bdrung> Zhenech: yes. and it can behave strange with relative pathes: https://bugs.launchpad.net/inkscape/+bug/398221
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 398221 in inkscape "export drawing to png failed" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<bdrung> Zhenech: i tried imagemagik for transforming svgs into pngs, but the result is crap.
<Zhenech> never tried
<Zhenech> I guess I made one SVG in my life
<Zhenech> and that was using inkscape :)
<Zhenech> btw
<Zhenech> there is a minor glitch in your gnome common postinst
<bdrung> Zhenech: imagemagik is *the* command line tool for images (but it fails on svgs)
<Zhenech> bdrung, I know, you don't want to know how many "convert" calls I have in several scripts at work
<Zhenech> converting JPG and PDF back and forth
<Zhenech> wi28
<Zhenech> ups
<bdrung> Zhenech: i use it for converting my wallpapers.
<Zhenech> bdrung, any reason you call update alternatives on EVERY invocation of the postinst?
<Zhenech> wouldnt "configure" be sufficient?
<bdrung> Zhenech: i don't know. the script is mostly stolen from gnome-icon-theme.
<bdrung> Zhenech: all noteworty changes are commented in the changelog. So there are no changes for arc and shiki. For gnome-colors there is only the bug fix.
<Zhenech> yeah, arc and shiki are fine, will upload "gleich" :)
<Zhenech> for gnome its better to wrap that call into
<Zhenech> if [ "$1" = configure ]; then
<Zhenech> ...
<Zhenech> fi
<Zhenech> imho
<bdrung> Zhenech: when will configure run?
<Zhenech> see http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-maintainerscripts.html
<Zhenech> esp 6.6 6.7 and 6.8
<Zhenech> interestingly you also use remove or deconfigure in your prerm, and one of my own packages has remove or upgrade for the same task...
<Zhenech> time for a smoke, brb :)
<Riddell> YokoZar: arne is onto you about .otf files in games
<Riddell> spring-engine includes FreeSansBold.otf, it should just depend on ttf-freefonts
<Zhenech> bdrung, shiki uploaded
<Zhenech> bdrung, arc uploaded
<bdrung> Zhenech: i will have a look at all the maintainer scripts target and update the tonight.
<Zhenech> ok
<mac_v> anyone know why the cairo-dock plugins aernt available in Ubuntu repos?
<Laney> what package name?
<mac_v> Laney: cairo-dock has plugins available when installed from their repos , but not In the Ubuntu repos
<Laney> maybe nobody packaged it
<mac_v> Laney: http://developer.berlios.de/project/showfiles.php?group_id=8724&release_id=15624 < plug-ins
<mac_v> Laney: do i send a mail to the list?
<gilir> mac_v: because it's wainting in REVU
<mac_v> gilir: so ? when can we expect it in the Karmic repos?
<Laney> when it's done
<mac_v> ;)
<gilir> mac_v: you can monitor the status here : http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/cairo-dock-plugins
<mac_v> gilir: thanx for the link :)
<Laney> DEB_BUILD_OPTIONS=nocheck dh_auto_test
<Laney> what's this?
<slytherin> anyone else having problem with buildd script on jaunty?
<Laney> I don't understand what you did to makeshlibs either
<gilir> Laney: nocheck to skip the tests when using dh v7
<Laney> why not an empty override?
<gilir> and makeshilbs to avoid unnecessary shlibs generation
<gilir> Laney: I didn't know empty override works :)
<Laney> yes sir
<slytherin> Can any of the python experts take a look at http://paste.ubuntu.com/247356/ and tell me if it is problem with buildd script?
<fabrice_sp> andv, about the changelog of taskjuggler
<fabrice_sp> there is a sync in hardy, and also in Intrepid, so the ubuntu specific changelog has been lost before then. Does it make sense to add the Ubuntu entry before 2.4.1-1 (Intrepid)?
<fabrice_sp> This is not the way I've done merge until now, as I only recover the Ubuntu entries in the last changelog available.
<andol> andv: Hey, that ^^ was pretty much the same question I was about to ask you :)
<fabrice_sp> andol, :-)
<fabrice_sp> the merge request for taskjuggler is bug #400528 (in case you want to have a look :-) )
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 400528 in taskjuggler "Please merge taskjuggler 2.4.3-1 from Debian unstable" [Wishlist,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/400528
<fabrice_sp> I've been able to build successfully sound-juicer. Is it possible for some MOTU to give-back the build. so that it get rebuilt? Thanks
<jpds> fabrice_sp: Done.
<iulian> fabrice_sp: All archs?
<iulian> Ah.
<fabrice_sp> thanks jpds ! (and iulian too :-) )
<jpds> iulian: The buildd script filters out all the successful ones. :)
<kamalnandan> why do i get this error? even though I have correct version of cmake installed?
<kamalnandan> dpkg-checkbuilddeps: Unmet build dependencies: cmake (>= 2.6.4)
<fabrice_sp> yeah: it was only i386 in that case (all others except powerpc has been already built)
<kamalnandan> though cmake is installed in /usr/local/bin
<iulian> jpds: Oh cool, didn't know that.
<fabrice_sp> kamalnandan, /usr/local is not good
<fabrice_sp> kamalnandan, what is the output of apt-cache policy cmake ?
<kamalnandan> fabrice_sp: thanks for your response..here is the output..
<kamalnandan> http://paste.ubuntu.com/247378/
<kamalnandan> BTW..i downloaded the source of cmake 2.6.4 , built that and installed..and it got installed in /usr/local/bin only..
<kamalnandan> fabrice_sp..if its installed in /usr/local/bin, is there any problem?
<fabrice_sp> kamalnandan, why don't you just install the Ubuntu package?
<fabrice_sp> kamalnandan, yes: debuild don't know about local application (in /usr/local). Only about packages
<kamalnandan> there is 2.6.2 only available in ubuntu package..i need 2.6.3..
<fabrice_sp> kamalnandan, 2.6.4 in karmic
<fabrice_sp> kamalnandan, it would be easier to setup a karmic chroot
<fabrice_sp> and build it inside (or a karmic pbuilder)
<fabrice_sp> !pbuilder
<ubottu> pbuilder is a system to easily build packages in a clean chroot environment. To get started with PBuilder, see http://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto
<kamalnandan> i have jaunty..how do i setup karmic?
<fabrice_sp> !chroot
<ubottu> chroot is used to make programs believe that the directory they are running in is really the root directory. It can be used to stop programs accessing files outside of that directory, or for compiling 32bit applications in a 64bit environment (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebootstrapChroot)
<fabrice_sp> I love that ! thing :-)
<iulian> Our lovely robot.
<fabrice_sp> :-D
<kamalnandan> fabrice_sp...i havnt really ever used chroot..
<fabrice_sp> kamalnandan, with a chroot, you will avoid installing unnecessary packages in your normal environment
<fabrice_sp> and you can have several versions (I even have a sid and a hardy chroot)
<TheMuso> slytherin: I believe a work-around is going to be put in place.
<kamalnandan> fabrice_sp: how do we do that?
<iulian> kamalnandan: Everything you want to know can be found in those wiki pages.
<andv> fabrice_sp, who says they are lost?
<andv> fabrice_sp, I see them
<kamalnandan> iulian: thanks..let me check that..
<andv> fabrice_sp, taskjuggler (2.2.0-1ubuntu1) dapper; urgency=low
<andv>   * debian/rules: call dh_iconcache
<andv> for example
<andv> fabrice_sp, you have to include all ubuntu changelogs
<andv> I hope that's clear
<andv> andol, yes?
<andv> andol, you added karmic/intrepid entries and lost all the previous ones
<andv> andol, what's not clear?
<andv> andol, unison (2.13.16-5ubuntu1) feisty; urgency=low
<andv> andol, unison (2.13.16-6ubuntu1) feisty; urgency=low
<andv> should I continue?
<andv> ;)
<kamalnandan> fabrice_sp: you meant this page ..right
<kamalnandan> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto
<fabrice_sp> andv, when I say lost I mean that in the last changelog (for version 2.4.1-1ubuntu3), there is only changes since 2.4.1-1 because of the sync of 2.4.1-1.
<andv> fabrice_sp, https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/taskjuggler
<andv> fabrice_sp, it seems they are not lost in this page
<fabrice_sp> Anyway, I'll recover all the ubuntu changes since the very first version, even if the package has been synced several time since then
<fabrice_sp> andv, I was speaking in term of last changelog
<andv> fabrice_sp, what's the point of dropping changelog entries?
<fabrice_sp> andv, it was already dropped. I didn't dropped them by myself
<andv> fabrice_sp, they got dropped cause a sync
<fabrice_sp> yes
<andv> fabrice_sp, but LP register every changelog entry submitted
<andv> fabrice_sp, as you can see in the link I sent you
<andv> fabrice_sp, so take LP as reference
<fabrice_sp> I knoiw. that's only that until now, I alsways used the last changelog as reference. I will change the way I do the merge to include all entris since dapper
<fabrice_sp> using LP and not the changelog
<andv> follow LP
<andv> and you'll do good
<andv> :)
<andv> those pages are there to be checked
<fabrice_sp> does that mean also that when you 'ubuntify' a package (to fix a FTBFS, fo r example), you should check the previous ubuntu version, and add all of them to the changelog?
<fabrice_sp> or it only apply to merge?
<andv> fabrice_sp, you should answer yourself now :)
<andv> fabrice_sp, if you fix a FTBFS on Ubuntu you won't use the Debian package
<andv> but the one you find in the Ubuntu archives
<andv> when you do a merge, you grab debian package and apply ubuntu changes
<andv> losing changelog entries is not nice anyway
<didrocks> StevenK: I am wondering about how to deal with clutter-gtk-doc (as it is the same package name and files in 0.8 version). Do we plan to remove 0.8 in karmic and I add a Replaces: or do you think we should use make the same trick that in clutter, ie using version number in -doc package name?
<fabrice_sp> tbh, I still don't see the point of recovering a changelog entry from dapper, when the package has been synced 8 times since then. But I will add the dapper entry. Should I also add the build* entries?
<fabrice_sp> ooops: no build entry in that case
<andv> fabrice_sp, nvm
<andv> fabrice_sp, leave it as it is
<fabrice_sp> np: I'm updating it right now
<fabrice_sp> andv, new debdiff uploaded
<andv> fabrice_sp, perfect
<andv> fabrice_sp, thanks for the fast responses
<andv> fabrice_sp, I gonna process it later when I get back home
<krisives> fabrice_sp: You helped me yesterday, right?
<fabrice_sp> thanks to you to sponsor my upload
<andv> fabrice_sp, are you willing to become a developer?
<fabrice_sp> krisives, I think so, yes
<fabrice_sp> about the patches, right?
<krisives> I found the problem I was having
<andv> or you are just a normal contributor
<krisives> fabrice_sp: It was because my patch name was lexigraphically (caps) before the other patches
<krisives> I actually filed a bogus bug report and then RTFM'd and it was in the man page :(
<fabrice_sp> andv, for the moment, I'm just a u-c-d, but willing to become a motu at some point
<fabrice_sp> krisives, this things happens, yes :-)
<andv> fabrice_sp, cool
<krisives> Yeah, but alwys lame to be the guy who fails to RTFM
<fabrice_sp> lol
<andv> fabrice_sp, when andol gets back tell him what to do
<fabrice_sp> andv, ok
<andv> ty
<fabrice_sp> yw :-)
<andv> fabrice_sp, where you the one who said you use mom?
<krisives> The code in question is parsing an SFTP address by hand, and many NPE and other bugs have came from it, would it be a horrible idea to link with libpcre3 and use a regex?
<fabrice_sp> andv, yes, but only to quickly get the dsc files, and the changelog. This is the part I will have to change
<andv> fabrice_sp, start doing merges manually
<andv> fabrice_sp, you'll improve and learn more
<fabrice_sp> andv, apart from the changelog, I do it manually
<fabrice_sp> easier to see what's happening
<andv> k
<andol> andv: You know, looking at the current Ubuntu unison package (2.27.57-1ubuntu1) doesn't contain any of those older changelog entries in its debian/changelog
<andol> andv: If we add stuff, neither present in the current debian or ubuntu package, is it really a merge then?
<andv> andol, add stuff?
<andv> we add something that was there before
<andv> andol, https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unison
<andv> andol, you see any changelog you didnt add?
<andol> andv: Yes, I know LP keeps track of old stuff. What I'm saying is that the package unision 2.27.57-1ubuntu1 doesn't have those entires in its debian/changelog.
<andv> andol, so?
<andv> andol, it's something nice to do adding all changelog's entries
<andol> andv: Hence I'm confusing about it beinga merge of 2.27.57-1ubuntu1 and 2.27-57-2, since we are adding stuff which isn't actually in any of those two packages.
<andv> fabrice_sp, can you please explain him
<andv> im leaving
<geser> please only add the changelog entries since the last sync not all available ubuntu changelog entries
<andv> geser, why?
<andv> geser, I'm used to apply all changelog entries
<andv> geser, some other developers are used to apply them all
<andv> there is no rule against it
<geser> why do you add changelog entries for changes that have nothing to do with the current changes (i.e. when there was a sync in between)
<andv> geser, what's the point of dropping entries?
<andv> geser, does old entries hurt someone?
<geser> no, but they don't help either
<andv> some developers add them all, some other don't
<andv> there is no rule
<andv> and I prefer having all of them
<geser> why it is important to re-add changelog entries from dapper when you do a change in karmic?
<andv> geser, I'm used to do it
<andv> geser, I see nothing bad on doing it
<andv> geser, I could say the same of dropping them
<andv> geser, someone worked on that package on dapper so we have to credit him for his work
<andv> dropping stuff won't help
<geser> and why do we credit it only in dapper and karmic and not e.g. in jaunty (where the package is synced)?
<andv> geser, all changelog entries are added
<andv> geser, so we add jaunty stuff too
<geser> and when there are no ubuntu changes in jaunty?
<geser> then there are no ubuntu changelog entries there at all?
<andv> geser, if there are no changes we have to credit no one
<geser> and why do you want to credit someone for changes in dapper when adding a new change to a synced package?
<geser> or do I don't understand the problem?
<andv> it looks like you are not understanding
<andv> he is doing a merge
<geser> if the changes are carried over since dapper then I'm also for keeping the changelog entries since dapper
<andv> and I told him to apply all changes since the beginning
<andv> (on the changelog)
<geser> but I'm not for re-introducing changelog entries for changes that were merged in to the debian package already
<andv> geser, we think that different then
<andv> geser, there is no rule on it
<fabrice_sp> sorry, I was having an ice cream
<andv> geser, I like to have them all, but might be different for you
<geser> no, but you are the first I know of doing it that way
<andv> DktrKranz does it too
<andv> for example
<andv> geser, anyway as I already said there is no rule on it
<andv> so we can have different opinions
<geser> true
<andv> no one can say that my / your opinion is right or wrong
<andv> so andol if you wanna do it, good
<andv> if not I won't take care of your merge, sorry
<geser> and I'm certainly not telling that my opinion is the only truth, just commenting
<andol> Well, unison 2.27.57-2 doesn't seem to come with any overly important changes anyway...
<andv> geser, yeah np
<geser> andol: I'm not saying that you shouldn't do as your sponsor wants it, just noting that other sponsors might have a different view on things
<andv> I'm off, andol if you still wanna fix it as fabrice_sp
<andv> * ask
<andol> geser: ok
<fabrice_sp> I'm still here with my ice cream (32ÂºC here) :-)
<andol> fabrice_sp: Ice cream is something I agree very much to :-)
<andv> leaving
<fabrice_sp> lol
<andv> cya
<fabrice_sp> bye
<geser> fabrice_sp: and it's not thawing?
<andv> 7away
<fabrice_sp> geser, no, because I'm a fast eater :-)
<sebner> geser: have I read the backlog correctly? andv wants to re-add changes to the changelog when there was a sync and the re-added changes doesn't have anything todo with the current changes?
<geser> sebner: if I understand it correctly then yes
<sebner> geser: wth? You are right, nobody does that, simply because it doesn't make any sense
<geser> I certainly won't hunt down old changelog entries from LP and only keep those which are already there
<iulian> Hmm, could someone please enlighten me a bit about this situation.  When we do a change to a package and that change is merged with the debian package, why should we bother in keeping the changelog of that *specific* change we did?
<iulian> In this case, the changes will appear twice.
<geser> iulian: not the change, but the old changelog entries, telling that we changed the package once in the past
<iulian> geser: I meant the changelog entries.
<sebner> iulian: if you sync a package our old changes vanish because debian changelog doesn't contain them
<iulian> sebner: Yes, but it seems that andv wants to keep the changelog entries, even though, the changes we made are merged.
<iulian> This is what I want to clarify.
<fabrice_sp> iulian, you cna have a look at  bug #400528
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 400528 in taskjuggler "Please merge taskjuggler 2.4.3-1 from Debian unstable" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/400528
<geser> yes, e.g. intrepid: make changes, jaunty: sync, karmic: make other changes and re-add intrepid changelog
<fabrice_sp> in this case, I added the Dapper entry to the changelog
<fabrice_sp> (you have both changelog)
<andol> or in my case, bug #377652
<iulian> geser: Why's that?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 377652 in unison "please merge unison 2.27.57-2 (universe) from debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/377652
<geser> iulian: don't know, andv told to credit the old contributor
<iulian> geser: That's why +packages are for.
<iulian> Or whatever that page was.
<andol> iulian: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/packagename ?
<iulian>  /+uploaded-packages
<geser> andol: I'm currently reading through the bug, but we don't need to mention the maintainer change (can lookup the mail for andv if necessary)
<andol> geser: Thanks, but I was actually just about to unassign myself from the merge. The changes just doesn't seem important enough to take a fight with a sponsor over.
<geser> andol: for me http://launchpadlibrarian.net/29794377/unison_2.27.57-2_2.27.57-2ubuntu1.debdiff would be ready for sponsoring (after a quick look), but I don't want to hijack this now
<andol> geser: Ohh well, no hurry I guess. If nothing else we can always let this issue rest for a day or two.
<geser> I'm for educating new contributors, but certainly don't let them repeat a debdiff for small errors till they are near the point of abandoning the merge
<geser> I inform them about the small errors (so they learn for the future) and fix them myself before uploading
<andol> geser: Actually, I don't mind nitpicking, as long as I get to learn more. In this case the problem was/is having to do changes which I didn't understand why to do. (I.e the old changelog entries)
<geser> me neither
 * iulian nods.
<bdrung_> Zhenech: i had a close look at the debian policy and i have to agree on using configure for installation and remove | upgrade for removing.
<Zhenech> bdrung_, great
<Zhenech> gimme fixed dsc and I upload tomorrow
<bdrung_> Zhenech: wait a moment. i have to modify my upload script.
<Zhenech> bdrung_, no hurry, I wont upload today anyways
<StevenK> didrocks: Using the version number sounds fine
<bdrung_> Zhenech: thanks for uploading the other two packages.
<Zhenech> np
<bdrung_> Zhenech: writing the makefiles for upstream makes new upstream releases simple to package. :)
<Zhenech> bdrung_, heh, thats good
<bdrung_> Zhenech: he is the designer and i am the programmer. that fits good together. :)
<Zhenech> yeah, from my expirence programmes cant design
<Zhenech> and designers cant code :)
<bdrung_> Zhenech: he once wrote a script for installing *-colors, and the code was ugly ;)
<bdrung_> i would be a bad designer.
<dupondje> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/dutch/+bug/407951 <- need to get synced :)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 407951 in dutch "Sync dutch 1:1.10-1 (main) from Debian unstable (main)." [Wishlist,New]
<bdrung_> Zhenech: the script is now running. if there are no problems, the new package will be available in approxatly 15 minutes.
<bdrung_> Zhenech: the ppa seems to be used by many people. when i break something there (mostly with hardy), then there will be a bug report the same day.
<dupondje> somebody want to check my sync request ? :)
<Zhenech> bdrung_, great :)
<Zhenech> bdrung_, restoring backup of my main machine (had to testinstall windows) and going to bed
<Zhenech> will have a look at your changes tomorrow from work
<Zhenech> at about 1100 cest
<bdrung_> Zhenech: you can use utc+2
<bdrung_> ups
<bdrung_> Zhenech: should i send you the dsc link?
<bdrung_> when it's up?
<Zhenech> bdrung_, I guess ill find it
<Zhenech> but you could ping me on irc tomorrow
<Zhenech> in the case ill forget
<bdrung_> Zhenech: ok
<bdrung_> Zhenech: i will ping you, when i am up. :)
<Zhenech> kk
<bdrung_> Zhenech: i would have normal sleep time when i would live in utc-4. :)
<fabrice_sp> dupondje, it's for main, so perhaps, you would have more luck at #ubuntu-devel :-)
<Zhenech> haha
<Zhenech> yeah, my sleep time is also kinda strange
<bdrung_> Zhenech: that's normal for an "informatiker"
<Zhenech> no, itd be normal if theyd be constant
<Zhenech> but sometimes I go to bed at 2200 and wake up at 0900
<Zhenech> and osmetimes I go to bed at 0400 and wake up at 1000
<bdrung_> Zhenech: my are not so fluctuating. i go to bed between 0100 and 0400 and wake up ...
<bdrung_> either my clock rings between 0800 and 1000 or i will sleep 7 hours or longer.
<bdrung_> Zhenech: ok, the updated package is on mentors
<Zhenech> ok, will do tomorrow then
<Zhenech> bedtime now
<Zhenech> n8
<bdrung_> Zhenech: gn8
<andv> andol, you there?
<andv> sebner, who says no one do that?
<andv> geser, maint field change not need to be added on changelog
<andv> geser, is that right?
#ubuntu-motu 2009-08-05
<pace_t_zulu> hey, how do i find out who is responsible for the 'open-vm-tools' package and where the packaging code is?
<fta> pace_t_zulu, apt-cache showsrc open-vm-tools | grep -E '(Vcs|Maintainer)'
<pace_t_zulu> fta thanks
<YokoZar> Riddell: Well, that's an easy change to make ;)  Thanks for pointing out
<pace_t_zulu> fta, if the package has been neglected in ubuntu, is it worth trying to fix
<pace_t_zulu> fta, the package is important to my dev environment
<fta> pace_t_zulu, sure. strange there's nothing on MoM for it, do you mean debian is fresher?
<pace_t_zulu> fta, MoM?
<fta> https://merges.ubuntu.com/
<ajmitch> fta: it's in multiverse, and looks like it needs a sync rather than a merge
<pace_t_zulu> fta, which debian version would be merged into karmic? unstable?
<pace_t_zulu> fta, the current karmic version that has been FTB for months is 2009.05.22-167859-3
<fta> pace_t_zulu, then fix it, and look for a sponsor ;)
<pace_t_zulu> fta both sid and squeeze are ahead
<pace_t_zulu> fta, you want to sponsor?
<pace_t_zulu> :)
<fta> i need to look at your work first
<YokoZar> Riddell: I guess I've learned my lesson about reading the copyright off the project page rather than looking at individual files.
<pace_t_zulu> fta: understood
<pace_t_zulu> fta: since the package is maintained upstream by debian... how would i patch it? create a bazaar branch? ... could you perhaps point me to documentation that would provide instruction?
<pace_t_zulu> anyone ^
<pace_t_zulu> if a package is maintained upstream by debian in a git repo... how would i patch it? create a bazaar branch? ... could you perhaps point me to documentation that would provide instruction?
<elgeneralmidi> bon un clopio et aulit
<elgeneralmidi> sorry
<kklimonda> hyperair: are you going to upload banshee 1.5 to karmic or are you waiting for stable release?
<directhex> kklimonda, the latter
<kklimonda> directhex: thanks.
<jerbear> I would like an example or a tutorial for how to package a python app.
<jerbear> please?
<porthose_> jerbear, for some examples http://svn.debian.org/wsvn/python-apps/
<jerbear> maybe a tutorial on how to manage it?
<jerbear> on the dev tools?
<jerbear> anyone?
<porthose_> jerbear, have a look at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Complete, if you haven't already :)
<porthose_> jerbear, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment
<vorian> jerbear: http://wiki.debian.org/DebianPython/NewPolicy
<porthose_> thx vorian, that one was next :)
<vorian> :)
 * vorian has a couple of python packages floating around
<porthose_> :)
<jerbear> vorian: what's your workflow like?
<vorian> first you get a clean tarball
<vorian> extract it
<vorian> use dh_make, choosing cdbs
<vorian> rm *.EX *.ex
<vorian> from the debian dir/
<vorian> then get to work from there
<jerbear> vorian: any options to dh_make?
<vorian> the wiki page there explains pretty much everything you need to do
<vorian> yes, there are - i suggest man dh_make to explore the arguments
<vorian> usually, you can dh_make -c (type of copyright) -f ../original.tar.gz
<vorian> python is very easy to package, as long as there arent any eggs to deal with
<jerbear> vorian: eggs to deal with in what way?
<vorian> like java jars, complex python apps use eggs
<vorian> check out - chm2pdf for an example of a fabulous python package :D
<jerbear> i know what eggs are, i'm just not sure how you mean "deal with"
<vorian> if you have never created a debian package before, it will be worth your time to go through the docs on the MOTU wiki first
<vorian> jerbear: it's explained on the link i gave you
<vorian> just a few extra steps
<jerbear> vorian: which one, DebianPython/NewPolicy?
<vorian> jerbear: yep
<jerbear> vorian: thanks
<vorian> no problem
<vorian> just keep firing questions at us, as you need
<jerbear> i really appreciate it
<jerbear> vorian: when are you usually available? (in case i have any questions on another day)
<vorian> usually around this time
<jerbear> Okay :)
<vorian> i'm in the US, and available most evenings
<jerbear> US here too
<vorian> gotcha
<vorian> :)
<pace_t_zulu> hey guys...
<pace_t_zulu> so i'm trying to get a package built.... it's been in ftbfs for months
<vorian> sounds awesome
<pace_t_zulu> where can i learn how motu syncs with upstream... debian
<vorian> is it a gnome package?
<pace_t_zulu> varian  ... actually a multiverse package
<vorian> ah
<pace_t_zulu> the debian version is fresher and seems to build just fine
<vorian> depends, it may need merged vs synced
<vorian> pace_t_zulu: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SyncRequestProcess
<vorian> debian import freeze was a while ago, so all syncs have to be done manually
<pace_t_zulu> vorian: thanks
<vorian> no problem
<pace_t_zulu> vorian: well this has been an ftb in karmic for months
<vorian> does it have an ubuntu version?
<ajmitch> pace_t_zulu: have you tried building the newer debian package?
<pace_t_zulu> ajmitch: yeah... built it in pbuilder
<pace_t_zulu> ajmitch: running it now
<ajmitch> then it's most likely a sync request to put in & get ACKed
<vorian> i've got time to test it now, if you want to file the bug pace_t_zulu
<ajmitch> since you've tested it builds & are running it, you can use 'requestsync -s' to file a bug in launchpad about it, if there's not one there already
<pace_t_zulu> vorian: yeah... gimme a sec... running into a snag
<vorian> ahhh, the snags :)
 * vorian pets drop to shell hook
<YokoZar> Riddell: Question ~ springlobby: according to the authors the entire libtorrent folder is unnecessary on Linux (since we ship/link to the system libtorrent-rasterbar by default) and can just be deleted.  Do I need to delete this from the .orig source and make a new "upstream" tarball without it?
<pace_t_zulu> spoke too soon :(
<pace_t_zulu> vorian: should i just file a bug on LP
<vorian> pace_t_zulu: did you get it built?
<vorian> rather, did it build in a clean environment?
<pace_t_zulu> vorian: ya, it's running
<pace_t_zulu> vorian: built just fine in pbuilder
<vorian> pace_t_zulu: great, does it have an ubuntu version?
<pace_t_zulu> vorian: i'd seen those proble before...
<vorian> as in package_1.1-#ubuntu#
<pace_t_zulu> vorian: i don't think so... checking
<vorian> or just package_1.1
<pace_t_zulu> vorian: hopefully i'm handing you some low hanging fruit
<vorian> na, you're doing the work :)
<pace_t_zulu> vorian: no ubuntu version
<vorian> cool
<vorian> file a sync request
<pace_t_zulu> vorian: using 'requestsync'?
<vorian> that's one way, the easiest for sure :)
<pace_t_zulu> meh.... "No credentials found for 'ubuntu-dev-tools', please see the manage-credentials manpage for help on how to create one for this consumer."
<vorian> oh yeah, that fancy stuff
<vorian> it may be best to manually do it
<vorian> the wiki page describs it fully
<vorian> describes too
<pace_t_zulu> vorian: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/open-vm-tools/+bug/409163
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 409163 in open-vm-tools "Please sync open-vm-tools from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,New]
 * vorian gets on it 
 * pace_t_zulu thanks vorian
<pace_t_zulu> vorian, how does it look?
<LaserJock> can we i18n package long descriptions at all?
<vorian> pace_t_zulu: i will know for sure in about 12 hours
<vorian> i dont think i'll be able to finish tonight
<pace_t_zulu> vorian: no worries, thanks for your help
<pace_t_zulu> open-vm-tools has been FTBFS for too long
<LaserJock> vorian: hola
<vorian> LaserJock: yo
<vorian> the i18n stuff hates me
<LaserJock> vorian: how's it goin'? KDE 4.3 out yet? :-)
<vorian> YUS!
<vorian> today
<vorian> LaserJock: i'm moving out your way in a week, just a few hundred miles north (ID)
<LaserJock> vorian: lol, I'm moving to Boston Saturday
<vorian> holy!
<LaserJock> vorian: where in ID?
<vorian> Idaho Falls
<LaserJock> oh, awesome
<LaserJock> that's only 2hrs from where I grew up
<vorian> i'm very excited
<vorian> cool
<LaserJock> Idaho Falls was like the "big city" for us :-)
<vorian> haha, that's what I hear.  It's a big regional center
<LaserJock> yeah, I flew into there for my brother's wedding
<vorian> and now you are moving to a foreign country :'(
<LaserJock> heh
<LaserJock> well, I gotta go where the jobs are
<vorian> at least the baseball is good there
<LaserJock> and I'm lucky to get anything right now
<LaserJock> I got a job contracting to the Air Force
<vorian> excellent
<vorian> that's job security
<LaserJock> well, kinda kinda not
<LaserJock> it's a 2 year job
<LaserJock> but could lead to some more stuff maybe
<LaserJock> I'm liking 2 years 'cause if I hate Boston I can get out :-)
<vorian> true
<LaserJock> grew up in a town of 4k, went to school in a city of 400k, now moving to 4M :-)
<vorian> that's quite a jump
<LaserJock> well, at least I'm used to traffic lights now ;-)
<vorian> and quite a change in weather too B-)
<LaserJock> thank goodness
<vorian> ha
<LaserJock> I'm so tired of sun
<vorian> i bet
<vorian> I purchased a nice big ole snow thrower on my last day at TSC
<LaserJock> gimme some rain!
<vorian> i was not a fan of the summer in phonex
<vorian> or the monsoons
<vorian> or the black widows
<LaserJock> Idaho Falls has some cold cold weather
<LaserJock> one time we drove through there and the interstate was solid black ice
<LaserJock> icecycles were hanging on all the fences
<vorian> that happens here all the time
<LaserJock> I think the thermometer said -26F
<vorian> in fact, I have a photo from one of our ice-storms as a kdeartwork wallpaper!
<LaserJock> ID & MT are dry enough to not have many ice storms
<vorian> yikes, that's cold
<vorian> that's what I hear, and we just got two really really nice de-himidifiers too :(
<LaserJock> lol
<LaserJock> I lived with a humidifier growing up
<LaserJock> used to get bloody noses all the time from the dry air (wood stoves)
<vorian> i bet
<vorian> when we visited IF a month ago, 2 of my kids got bloodies noses
<LaserJock> interestingly, Reno has seemed a bit wetter
 * vorian can't type tonight
 * LaserJock can't type ever
<vorian> haha, lies
<LaserJock> vorian: you hear I'm Dr. LaserJock now?
<vorian> wow
 * vorian bows
<vorian> congrats!
<LaserJock> thanks
<vorian> that's awesome
<LaserJock> it was an insane amount of work at the end
<vorian> but you lived!
<LaserJock> *barely*
<vorian> haha
<LaserJock> it was 11 years of uni
<vorian> that is crazy
<LaserJock> I'm glad I didn't get a university postdoc, I'm tired of it
<vorian> i couldn't handle 4
<LaserJock> oh, the first 4 were *easy*
<LaserJock> the last 4 were a giant pain in the butt
<vorian> i'm sure
<LaserJock> I found out that I like learning a lot more than I like research
<LaserJock> so after I was done with all the classes it kinda dragged on a bit
<ajmitch> hey LaserJock
<LaserJock> ajmitch: hi!
<LaserJock> my favorite kiwi
<ajmitch> only one you know? :)
<ajmitch> how's it going?
<LaserJock> oh, OK
<LaserJock> I'm putting the final corrections on the dissertation
<LaserJock> the defense was pretty easy (2.5 hrs)
<ajmitch> great :)
<ajmitch> & congrats on the new job (just read scrollback)
<LaserJock> thanks
<LaserJock> I'm 27 and *just* getting my first real job
<ajmitch> heh
<LaserJock> I feel like such a bonehead
<ajmitch> the life of an academic :)
<LaserJock> I almost didn't take the job though
<LaserJock> the Air Force requires Windows!
<ajmitch> it's a big change
<ajmitch> oh no!
<LaserJock> bbiab, gotta walk the dog
<andol> andv: Here now. Saw that you upload the debdiff, thanks
<RoAkSoAx> slangasek, ping
<hyperair> `/lastlog -hilight
<hyperair> oh whoops
<hyperair> kklimonda: waiting for 1.6.
<hyperair> kklimonda: the guys in #ubuntu-desktop weren't keen on taking in an unstable release
<hyperair> kklimonda: not without a schedule of when the stablew ould be coming out anyway
<kklimonda> hyperair: how stable is it btw?
<hyperair> ```it's pretty stable, but they've announced 1.5.x as an unstable release
<kklimonda> oh wait, it's in banshee unstable ppa so I can actually test it myself :)
<hyperair> =)
<hyperair> oh yeah the banshee unstable ppa has shifted to https://launchpad.net/~banshee-team/+archive/banshee-unstable
<stochastic> Can anyone revu ANY of these packages http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/xwax     http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/a2jmidid    http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/xjadeo     http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/slv2   ( http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/pyphat would also be nice)
<stochastic> Is there any other way to get people to Revu packages other than posting a request in this channel?
<Zhenech> bdrung_, done
<Riddell> YokoZar: you don't need to delete the libtorrent unless it has licencing problems, but if it has a different licence than the rest of the sources you need to mention that in debian/copyright
<YokoZar> Riddell: ok, that seems fine (same code as another package we ship)
<YokoZar> not sure why it's in the upstream tarball
<geser> andv: yes, mainterfield change shouldn't be mentioned anymore in the changelog
<directhex> YokoZar, for "convenience"
<directhex> YokoZar, be happy it's source & not binary!
<YokoZar> fair enough :)
<kamalnandan> how do we install karmic release on jaunty..
<kamalnandan> someone mentioned that it can be done using chroot...i didnt get it..
<kamalnandan> any clue folks?
<kamalnandan> how do we install karmic release on jaunty using chroot?
<kamalnandan> any clue
<hyperair> for some reason gmail is sticking all the emails i send from @ubuntu.com into my inbox O_o
<hyperair> is anyone noticing the same thing?
<hyperair> kamalnandan: please don't keep repeating your question.
<iulian> kamalnandan: Asking same question over and over again won't help you.  We already answered yesterday.
<hyperair> kamalnandan: and this isn't the right place.
<bdrung_> Zhenech: thanks
<Zhenech> bdrung_, yw, in exchange I need a free webdav client for windows :)
<iulian> kamalnandan: Did you follow what we gave you yesterday?
<bdrung_> Zhenech: what is windows? :)
<kamalnandan> iulian: sorry...infact, i dont have that document with me right now...i am at my workplace and forgot to forward the link(then i was at my home)..it would be kind of you, if you could send the link to me once again..:-)
<kamalnandan> i read that, but couldnt follow much...so didnt go futher..however, i want to read that once again with a fresh mindset..
<Zhenech> bdrung_, that thingy that still does not have a fullz posix compatible env :)
<bdrung_> Zhenech: o, i can remember now. but who wants to use that crap? :)
<kamalnandan> I am searching for that page on the internet, but somehow, havnt been able to locate as yet..
<Zhenech> bdrung_, /me points at that person at the right side of his table
<bdrung_> Zhenech: Sincere condolences to him.
<kamalnandan> iulian: can you send the link to me once again, if you dont mind..sorry for being irresponsible...
<Zhenech> bdrung_, her ...
<bdrung_> ok
<iulian> !chroot | kamalnandan
<ubottu> kamalnandan: chroot is used to make programs believe that the directory they are running in is really the root directory. It can be used to stop programs accessing files outside of that directory, or for compiling 32bit applications in a 64bit environment (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebootstrapChroot)
<eboyjr> Hello, what are the typical questions, topics asked in here?
<iulian> !pbuilder | kamalnandan
<ubottu> kamalnandan: pbuilder is a system to easily build packages in a clean chroot environment. To get started with PBuilder, see http://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto
<eboyjr> In better words, what is the MOTU?
<kamalnandan> iulian: thanks a lot..:-)..
<iulian> eboyjr: /topic.
<eboyjr> iulian: Oh well my firefox is not working cuz of the update i just got so i cant click the links
<eboyjr> Soo... what is the MOTU
<iulian> eboyjr: Then find another way to access those wiki pages.  There are loads of things to tell.
<eboyjr> ..thanks.
<kklimonda> if some source files in tarball are missing license header it's a big no-no and I should contact upstream?
<directhex> kklimonda, depends how bad it is
<directhex> kklimonda, there's no strict rule, more of a gut-feeling "this needs moar licensing"
<kklimonda> directhex: not really - 3 unittests and one header (the "top" one that just includes other)
<directhex> feh. i'd let it in
<jdetaeye> a quick question from a newbie-uploader:   I just uploaded my first package with dput.  Is there a time delay before I can see the upload package on http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/?
<geser> up to 3 min or so
<geser> did you use ..._source.changes for upload?
<jdetaeye> hmm... has been over 30 minutes now
<jdetaeye> see http://dpaste.com/75456/
<jdetaeye> paste is not compete - but has no error messages and ends with "Successfully uploaded packages."
<geser> then you need on one of the REVU admins so he can look into it
<jdetaeye> any harm in re-uploading?
<geser> afaik no
<jdetaeye> hm says "Already uploaded to revu on revu.ubuntuwire.com   Doing nothing for frepple_0.7.1-1_source.changes"
<kklimonda> use -f
<andv> geser, perfect ty for updating me
<geser> andv: this was also once mentioned in a mail on ubuntu-devel but I can't find it right now
<andv> k
<jdetaeye> new upload done - http://dpaste.com/75458/ - this time it worked and it is already visible on the page.  Thanks!
<kwah> Hi all
<kwah> Probably silly beginner question, but...
<kwah> How one could start with sources of the packages available in debian/unstable
<kwah> Is there any documentation/hotos related to that?
<kwah> *howtos
<iulian> kwah: What do you mean?  Do you want to download source packages from unstable?
<kwah> At least to begin with
<iulian> I'm afraid I don't understand the question.  Could you please rephrase?
<azeem> add an appropriate deb-src then
<azeem> and possible specify the version like apt-get source foo=1.2.3-4
<kwah> Hm. I think I do something wrong then...
<iulian> Or use pull-debian-source from ubuntu-dev-tools.
<azeem> heh, or that
<kwah> I hav a set of files package-xxxx in dsc,orig,diff
<kwah> and want to try building it for ubuntu
<kwah> In FM (fine manuals) etc, there is always a start from apt-get source...
<kwah> Which does a lot of staff "under the hood" apparently.
<iulian> kwah: Not really, it just downloads the source package.
<kwah> + unpacks tarballs
<kwah> + applies patches
<kwah> ?
<kwah> So, I figured out download part myself... :D
<iulian> When you build the package it links everything together.
<kwah> So, before I modify something (like adjust package-src/debian/* files) I should build package?
<iulian> kwah: s/before/after/.
<kwah> pull-debian-source does not do it. I believe because package is still in review and not in the repositories yet.
<kwah> ok, how from pack.orig.tar.gz, pack.diff.gz and pack.dsc I can get sources layout I can start modifications then?
<iulian> kwah: pull-debian-source just downloads the source package (*.diff.gz; *.dsc and *.orig.tar.gz).  To build the package you want dpkg-buildpackage.
<kwah> dpkg-buildpackage needs proper control files
<kwah> how one makes layeout for source package out of  (*.diff.gz; *.dsc and *.orig.tar.gz) ?
<kwah> isnt it automated?
<kwah> somehow
<iulian> You mean, .deb packages?
 * kwah believes that it is so basic, noone even think about it :D
<iulian> You need to build the package in order to get the .deb.
<kwah> let me start again
<iulian> And please elaborate.
<kwah> I have  (*.diff.gz; *.dsc and *.orig.tar.gz) for certain package
<iulian> kwah: Yes, that's the source.
<kwah> How can I unpack everything so I can tweak some minor things ?
<iulian> kwah: dpkg-source -x *.dsc
<kwah> iulian, thanks, that's it
<iulian> No problem.
<kwah> I remember there was something like that in one of the dozens tutorials I went briefly through last night :(
<kwah> Sorry for bothering.
<iulian> kwah: If you have any more questions, please ask.
 * kwah should read more carefully 
<kwah> iulian, ok.
<slytherin> ttx: ping
<slytherin> ttx: I was wondering how your jetty6 package is different than the jetty package in Debian experimental
<ttx> slytherin: it's the libraries only. No daemon. It's needed so that it can reach main.
<slytherin> ahh
<ttx> slytherin: current state of the package in debian experimental isn't satisfying
<ttx> (for main qa standards)
<slytherin> hmm
<slytherin> so when it reaches that state are you going to drop your package?
<ttx> We'll work to qa and sync it for karmic+1
<ttx> depending on what name they finally choose
<ttx> merge or replace it.
<slytherin> find
<ttx> slytherin: I should be able to improve the package in debian when I have more free time it after featurefreeze
<ttx> so that karmic+1 sync is painless.
<slytherin> No issues. I believe we discussed this already. Just didn't recall it when I saw your package.
<geser> Laney: I've a question about your haskell overview plot: does it check only a specific arch for installablity?
<Laney> geser: yes, i386
<geser> Laney: I wonder why it marks haskell-curl as green while libghc6-curl-dev being unavailable on i386
<Laney> geser: you can run edos-debcheck manually to find out
<Laney> or I can
<Laney> geser: It doesn't appear in packages.bz2
<Laney> probably because it never built correctly
<geser> it never build correctly (needs a rebuild)
<Laney> yes
<Laney> I did give-backs now
<Laney> but that explains why it was green
<geser> Laney: it build on sparc and armel in the past, so we need a build1 upload anyway
<geser> just wanted to inform you about a possible bug in the script for the graph if it marks missing packages as ok
<Laney> hmm
<Laney> :q
<Laney> So you have to check for every source package if all of the binaries are present in Packages
<slytherin> geser: Laney: Which script are you guys talking about?
<Laney> haskell-pkg-graph
<slytherin> oh, I thought it was some generic script to check status of packages.
<Laney> it would be nice if it were more generic
<Laney> geser: are you taking care of some of the rebuilds?
<geser> Laney: yes, why?
<Laney> just curious
<Laney> looking at the hsql ones now
<geser> I regularly look at the FBTFS list and unmet deps and transitions are easy to get off those lists
<Laney> right
<geser> argh, haskell-http currently in Ubuntu needs a package which isn't there anymore and the new version from Debian needs a newer cdbs than currently in Ubuntu
<Laney> yes :(
<Laney> I tried to bribe sebner to do that merge
<geser> any success?
<Laney> I think not
<didrocks> StevenK:  clutter-gtk 0.10 uploaded
<StevenK> \o/ !
<StevenK> didrocks: Source package name?
<didrocks> StevenK: clutter-gtk. So, you will just have to ack for new binaries (as 0.8 seems to be a dead branch)
<StevenK> didrocks: It wants clutter 1.0 ?
<didrocks> StevenK: yes
<StevenK> didrocks: If so, it won't build, since clutter-gtk is in main, and clutter-1.0 is in universe.
<didrocks> StevenK: Oh clutter-gtk is in main? ok, my upload will fail so. I saw that the maintainer was MOTU developer and didn't check
<StevenK> didrocks: I can sponsor it for you, but won't do so until clutter-1.0 gets promoted
<didrocks> StevenK: ok, so I can use a different package name that we put on universe?
<StevenK> didrocks: It should go to main, anyway ...
<didrocks> StevenK: so, it's maybe the time to achieve a MIR for clutter 1.0?
<StevenK> didrocks: It doesn't need one, 0.8 is in main
<StevenK> didrocks: Just needs some other things promoted, which is in progrsss.
<didrocks> StevenK: ok. I just open a bug and just subscribe you and not the u-m-s. I put a comment about waiting clutter 1.0 in main
<StevenK> *progress
<didrocks> StevenK: so, we clutter 1.0 will be in main, bug #409323
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 409323 in clutter-gtk "Please, update clutter-gtk to 0.10.2" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/409323
<StevenK> didrocks: Thanks!
<didrocks> StevenK: y/w :)
<kwah> Is it possible to get binary only-component in the repositories, when there is a statement like this imposed: The free downloading of X is only allowed for coupling with Y. For any other use, a license agreement is requested.
<kwah> ?
<kwah> Which is (I guess) really vague statement in itself.
<Laney> no
<Laney> http://www.ubuntu.com/community/ubuntustory/licensing
<Laney> kwah: check that
<kwah> ok
<kwah> thanks
<Laney> does sbuild have some known problem with packages that use dpatch?
<Laney> try rebuilding haskell-hsql-sqlite3, it bombs out at applying the patches for me
<Laney> whereas pbuilder works fine
<RoAkSoAx> slangasek, Hey there. Got one question regarding lsb. Should LSB 4.0 in karmic be exactly the same in Jaunty, so that when doing a debdiff between them, there would be no changes?
<slangasek> RoAkSoAx: by definition there will always be at least one diff between two versions of a package, which is a changelog
<slangasek> the other differing bits look suspiciously like a botched merge
<RoAkSoAx> slangasek, I see, but for example, should init-functions be the same in both packages? Because there are differences that are causing non normal functioning on the status action of init scripts
<slangasek> though it wasn't introduced from 0ubuntu1 to 0ubuntu2, so I don't know
<slangasek> RoAkSoAx: ok; as I recall, the 4.0 SRU to jaunty cherry-picked only the bits relevant to be able to claim it's 4.0, no other functional changes from what was already in jaunty
<RoAkSoAx> slangasek, I see. I'll report the bug then and ping you to take a look at it. :)
<RoAkSoAx> DktrKranz, heya!! I've uploaded the new changes for lekhonee: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/lekhonee When you have some free time please review them. Thank you.
<slangasek> RoAkSoAx: pinging me personally is likely the wrong approach...
<RoAkSoAx> slangasek, yes I know, but since you where the one who uploaded the latest version of LSB i though you might be interested in this bug
<slangasek> I am interested in many bugs, that doesn't mean a personal ping is necessarily effective :)
<RoAkSoAx> slangasek, ok :)
<kiko> hey, any motu willing to do a super trivial backport of rss2email?
<kiko> it's working fine on karmic
<geser> c_korn: http://ftp.debian.org/debian/pool/main/s/schroedinger/schroedinger_1.0.7-2.dsc
<c_korn> geser: yes, thanks. I will test it
<DktrKranz> RoAkSoAx: I'll probably have a look this evening. I'll be on holiday with limited network access (if none at all!), so better hurrying up ;)
<RoAkSoAx> DktrKranz, yep, it should be done now :) (at least i hope so). I've tried to use a private directory (/usr/share/lekhonee) but couldn't get it to work, and I think that of upstream.
<pace_t_zulu> vorian: you around?
<kees> sbeattie: why is bitlbee even compiled with Depends: libc6 (>> 2.9), libc6 (<< 2.10)  ??
<sbeattie> kees: bitlbe's control file just has ${shlibs:Depends}
<sbeattie> kees: so I have no idea.
<kees> sbeattie: yeah, it's creepy.  :P  slangasek: help!  :)
<slangasek> kees: uh?
<kees> slangasek: Depends: ${shlibs:Depends} is expanding (in bitlbee) to Depends: libc6 (>> 2.9), libc6 (<< 2.10)   (LP: #409422)
<kees> just weird
<slangasek> kees: currently, or when previously built with eglibc 2.9?
<kees> slangasek: when previously built, I assume
<slangasek> then I guess it was a previous bug in libc6?
<kees> but why are other things not melting down in the same way?
<sbeattie> slangasek: when rebuilt against eglibc 2.10, it becomes libc6 (>> 2.10), libc6 (<< 2.11),
<slangasek> peer
<slangasek> checking
<slangasek> could be a corner case in symbols file
<sbeattie> (am basing on a test rebuild I did in https://launchpad.net/~sbeattie/+archive/ppa)
<slangasek> or it could be to do with the package calling dpkg-shlibdeps manually in debian/rules, instead of using a sensible abstraction
<slangasek> sbeattie, kees: the .symbols file has a fallback to the dep in question when any symbols not listed out in the .symbols file are referenced
<slangasek> GLIBC_PRIVATE __res_iclose
<slangasek> maybe that one?
<kees> hunh
<slangasek> the symbol in question is listed, but with a strange version qualifier that I don't understand
<logari81> if anyone can imagine what the combination of the "--enable-shared" configure option and the pydoc error "cannot open shared object file" could mean, would probably be able to help me with a building/packaging problem that I have.
<geser> when refactoring a python script and moving code into it's own module, who put I into the copyright line of the new files? the authors of the main script or myself and just name the other possible authors?
<slayton> is there any documentation on how to package a single python script into a debian package?
<POX> slayton: /usr/bin/script?
<slayton> POX, yes
<geser> slayton: can't it be added to some other existing package instead of creating a new one?
<slayton> I'd prefer it be a stand alone package as there are several other packages that will rely on it...
<slayton> but its not common to any other package I'm working on
<slayton> err... it wouldn't make sense to add it to any of the other packages
<POX> all you need to do is add python to Depends (or pythonX.Y if it's in shebang) and a manpage
<slayton> ok thanks
<POX> if you import something outside stdlib, you need it in Depends as well, of course
<slayton> right... I guess I was more wondering what is the proper way to write the rules file as I don't have a makefile
<POX> dh_install script /usr/bin
<POX> in install: target
<POX> or put in in install file and use /usr/share/doc/debhelper/examples/rules.tiny
<slayton> POX, thank you that rules file is exactly what I was looking for
<frafu> Hi; could anybody help me with the po and mo files in distutils? In fact, setup.py sdist produces a tarball with the po files; however setup.py bdist produces a tarball without any translation files. Moreover, dpkg-buildpackage based on a cdbs debianization also produces a deb package without any translation files. Could anybody please tell me how I can get the translations into the deb package?
<fabrice_sp> frafu, compile them and install them. The installation can be done in a lot of ways (through an .install file, via make install, ...)
<fabrice_sp> it really depends on the way the package is ... packaged :-)
<frafu> fabrice_sp: it is package by using cdbs
<fabrice_sp> .install file is the way, then
<frafu> fabrice_sp: do you know where I can find information about how to setup an install file?
<fabrice_sp> frafu, man dh_install
<slayton> POX, if I want to sign package do I have to add something extra to the rules.tiny file?
<slayton> *sign a package
<frafu> fabrice_sp: thanks
<slayton> POX, never mind I figured it out. I can just explicitly sign the package with debsign
<fabrice_sp> yw ;-)
<fabrice_sp> Are recommends installed in the buildd? I changed my sbuild to not install the  recommended packages, and some packages are FTBFSing...
<fabrice_sp> so I'm wondering if I need to explicitly build depends on the recommended package of a principal one (libboost-dev, in that case)
<geser> no recommends during build
<fabrice_sp> ok
<fabrice_sp> thanks geser
<porthose_> nellery, ping
<geser> if you need something you need to specify it in Build-Depends(-Indep)
<nellery> porthose_: hi
<porthose_> nellery, hey, do you have some time to do some mentoring?
<fabrice_sp> geser, in that case, I need to explicitly Build-Depends on libboost-filesystem-dev then. Thanks!
<nellery> porthose_: sorry, I'm busy right now
<nellery> what type of mentoring did you need?
<porthose_> nellery, I have a mentee who needs a mentor
<nellery> porthose_: ah. Best to get in touch with the mentoring reception
 * porthose_ has his MOTU Mentoring Reception hat on
<nellery> porthose_: oh!
<fabrice_sp> Where can I see what are the requirements to change the Standards-version of a package from 3.7.2 to 3.8.2 ?
<frafu> fabrice_sp:  There is something that is puzzling me now: there is an older version of that package (its name is onboard) in ubuntu main; when I run dpkg-buildpackage on it, the resulting deb does not have mo files; but there are onboard.mo files installed on my system. Is this normal?
<porthose_> nellery, I just wanted to know if you where interested,  and if you had time. :)
<geser> fabrice_sp: /usr/share/doc/debian-policy/upgrading-checklist.txt.gz
<geser> frafu: for packages in main the packages are stripped during build and installed later through the language packs
<fabrice_sp> thanks again geser (I had to install debian-policy package ;-) )
<frafu> geser: but if I download the package with 'apt-get source ' and run dpkg-buildpackage on it, should the resulting deb not have mo files?
<geser> frafu: in that case it should have it
<frafu> geser: but it does not: there is no /usr/share/locale in the resulting deb!?
<frafu> geser: Does this mean there is an error in the debianization of that package?
<frafu> geser: i wonder where the onboard.mo files come from; but as I am not using a  clean system, who knows!
<fabrice_sp> frafu, it comes from language-pack-gnome packages
<fabrice_sp> http://packages.ubuntu.com/search?suite=karmic&section=all&arch=any&searchon=contents&keywords=onboard.mo
<fabrice_sp> :-D
<frafu> thanks to both of you; i have to leave now; bye
<fabrice_sp> bye
<dtchen> Laney: please push a no-change rebuild of xmonad-contrib, too, when you have a chance
<Laney> dtchen: ok
<dtchen> Laney: sbuilt & pbuilt locally & using the resulting packages now, so it does work
<Laney> dtchen: uploaded
<Laney> feel free to do any such uploads yourself in future
<dtchen> Laney: i don't have upload privileges.
<dtchen> Laney: but, thanks
<Laney> what?!
<geser> Laney: expired
 * Laney expresses shock
<geser> dtchen: do you plan to re-apply for them anytime?
<dtchen> geser: when time permits, yes
<huats> porthose_: ping
<huats> around ?
<porthose_> huats, hey
<huats> hey porthose_
<huats> how are you ?
<porthose_> fine you?
<huats> fine too
<huats> :)
<huats> I just saw your email about monty for the mentoring
<huats> I am not sure I said it to the list but he would take a slot in the senior step...
<huats> you agree with me right ?
<porthose_> yes
<huats> good :
<huats> ):)
<porthose_> I am trying to match him with one of the senior mentors
<huats> so we are ok :)
<huats> great !
<porthose_> huats, I thought his app was somewhat impressive
<huats> :)
<huats> same here :)
<DktrKranz> bdrung_: are you a DD?
<sebner> DktrKranz: trying to make bdrung_ and sponsoring slave? :P
<DktrKranz> sebner: no, just trying to see if I've just discovered a weird thing in NEW page (and I hope to be able to do stuff myself soon ;(
<DktrKranz> ;)
<sebner> DktrKranz: "soon" *heh*, NEW page containing 1 km packages list in weird indeed ;D
<DktrKranz> sebner: ask our intrepid bddebian to process some then ;)
<sebner> DktrKranz: he can't, he told me that he can review then but they have to be reviewed again by a real ftp master
<DktrKranz> I know, but not for long (I hope, for the 2nd time...)
<sebner> hehehehe
<bdrung_> DktrKranz: no, i am no dd and i am no motu.
<bdrung_> the NEW queue is scary long.
<DktrKranz> bdrung_: it seems you have upload rights, look at the bottom of http://ftp-master.debian.org/new.html ;)
<bdrung_> DktrKranz: i was sponsored
<DktrKranz> yeah, but under normal condition you see something as Sponsor: name@debian.org
<bdrung_> yes, no idea why he is not listed there.
<DktrKranz> bug ;)
<DktrKranz> or you're a DD now without notice
<DktrKranz> (mind pushing sth for me? ;)
<sebner> DktrKranz: It's a feature not a bug. Don't tell Debian or the invest time to fix it instead of reviewing stuff ~o~
<bdrung_> maybe. the first upload of my sponsor gets into the nirvana.
<blackmoon> hi, a binary firmaware (for usb card) can be included in a deb package?
<bdrung_> DktrKranz: being a dd would be nice. :)
<DktrKranz> bdrung_: I hope I can tell you soon ;)
<bdrung_> DktrKranz: then i would need to go the sponsors on their nerves.
<DktrKranz> blackmoon: answer is likely no
<DktrKranz> not as in universe, at least
<dtchen> blackmoon: see medibuntu as an alternate repository for such packages.
<dtchen> e.g., alsa-firmware
<blackmoon> DktrKranz: ok, thank you for answer... it's the same for ppa archive rigth?
<sebner> blackmoon: you can upload anything you want to your ppa
<sebner> well, as long it's not against the CoC
<DktrKranz> sebner: PPA terms forbid to use it for non-free software
<DktrKranz> (or they used to)
<sebner> DktrKranz: really? O_o
<DktrKranz> yu
<DktrKranz> p
<blackmoon> DktrKranz: thank you again
<DktrKranz> blackmoon: I'll check, it's been ages since I last checked
<blackmoon> DktrKranz: ok
<DktrKranz> sebner, blackmoon: https://help.launchpad.net/PPATermsofUse
<sebner> DktrKranz: Ubuntu "main" and "restricted" Component license Policy Compliant
<sebner> DktrKranz: besides, the next question is who and how is this controlled? Automatically by LP?
<DktrKranz> sebner: mark in person ;)
<sebner> DktrKranz: haha, anyways I'm sure is not 100% save regarding that
<blackmoon> so if i want include a rt73.bin firmware in a deb package, i must do a script for download it from external?
#ubuntu-motu 2009-08-06
<kwah> Hi all
<kwah> Are there howto's on how to package a number of software pieces at once?
<kwah> For example, I am packaging A and B
<kwah> B should build-depend on A
<kwah> What would be the way to proceed with chroot-ed environments etc?
<dtchen> kwah: there are ways to accomplish that via pbuilder, sbuild, schroot, etc.
<kwah> I guess there should be, of course.
<kwah> Do I need a sort of local repo in chroot-ed env then?
<dtchen> kwah: that's certainly one way to accomplish it. you could also just cp the newly built build-dependencies into the schroot.
<kwah> And what about pbuilder? I build package A, put it into some-repo, update what is in chroot... Biuild package B?
<dtchen> kwah: yes, same basic procedure regardless of chroot method
 * kwah tries to find his way around all this new things
<kwah> thanks, dtchen
<stochastic> Can anyone revu ANY of these packages http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/xwax     http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/a2jmidid    http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/xjadeo     http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/slv2   ( http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/pyphat would also be nice)
<YokoZar> stochastic: I think we're behind on the sponsorship/revu queue because dholbach is on vacation and most of the canonical people are at a Sprint
<YokoZar> I'll try and get a tackle on some of it myself soon if I can
<stochastic> YokoZar, ahh, that explains things, thanks.  I look forward to any comments/advocations you may have, but I'll sit pretty until the Sprint is over (when is that anyway?)
<YokoZar> I think they're a week long
<pace_t_zulu> vorian: you around?
<vorian> pace_t_zulu: yes sir
<pace_t_zulu> vorian: any word on open-vm-tools?
<vorian> just got around to giving it the nod
<vorian> good find on that one
<vorian> :)
<pace_t_zulu> vorian: yea, thanks... i'm a little iffy about the amd4 build
<pace_t_zulu> the i386 version is fine
<vorian> i'm amd64
<vorian> it's fine
<pace_t_zulu> ok, it's my vm then
<pace_t_zulu> no problem, if it builds and there are problems with the package, we can fix them
<pace_t_zulu> it's been FTBFS for months
<vorian> true enough
<pace_t_zulu> this is better... give it time before oct. 29
<vorian> very much so
<pace_t_zulu> vorian: you been motu for a while?
<vorian> yeah
<vorian> twice even :P
<pace_t_zulu> vorian: cool
<didrocks> StevenK: thanks for closing the bug manually. As I opened it after having on the package, I forgot to put the number in the changelog
<StevenK> didrocks: No worries :-)
<Laney> urgh
<Laney> trying to merge cdbs, not fun
<artfwo> hi! does anyone know what's the problem with REVU (dput)? It just gives me an error: "425 Security: Bad IP connecting." for anything I try to upload
<slytherin> asac: Nice to see gnome-bluetooth being considered for main inclusion. :-)
<slytherin> NCommander: directhex: does either if you have access to armel box?
<directhex> i don't. i got arm working in qemu once if that helps
<slytherin> directhex: will it be able to replicate a build failure seen on armel buildd?
<directhex> slytherin, depends on what kind of failure it is. arm can be pretty sensitive to different host CPUs
<slytherin> directhex: the failure is because the javadoc takes too long on armel and hence build process times out.
<bddebian> Heya gang
<TheMuso> slytherin: Looks like we have powerpc again, there is now a big queue of rebuilds for powerpc.
<slytherin> Figured that looking at the powerpc binary of modemmanager in queue. So is it now going to be a mass rebuilds?
<TheMuso> Yes, there is 600 odd according to https://lauchpad.net/builders.
<slytherin> TheMuso: Am I right that libc6 was held back so that the version that was causing problem in installation due to kernel check will be skipped and next version will be installed whenever it is built.
<fabrice_sp> Hi. I'd like to provide a daily build of a package in a ppa. Is there some how-to? Or I have to make a local script that chain the 'uscan / uupdate / debuild -sa -S / dput' jobs?
<slytherin> fabrice_sp: I believe someone from mozilla team is providing daily builds for xulrunner/firefox. Try talking with whoever the person is.
<maxb_> It's fta and his scripts are in a bzr branch in his +junk
<fabrice_sp> I saw fta in their ppa (it's for chromium)
<fabrice_sp> I'll have a look. Thanks maxb_ !
<mrooney> how might I turn a diff into a dpatch?
 * fabrice_sp_ hates his ADSL provider! :-/
<c_korn> mrooney: man dpatch -> Creating dpatch scriptlets
<slytherin> mrooney: dpatch-edit-patch name.patch, patch -px < file.diff, exit (value of x as appropriate in your case).
<RoAkSoAx> fabrice_sp, me too :) Telefonica?
<fabrice_sp> RoAkSoAx, nop: Jazztel. But I think I should blame the lines and not the provider :-)
<fabrice_sp> supposed to be 14Mb (because of the attenuation and the noise of the line), but I only have 7Mb...
<slytherin> RoAkSoAx: Telefonica as in Telefonica Mexico?
<RoAkSoAx> slytherin, as in Telefonica del Peru :)
<slytherin> oh
<RoAkSoAx> fabrice_sp|web, lucky you, I have 1Mb :(
<fabrice_sp|web> RoAkSoAx, well: 4 losts of connectivity in half an hour... I prefer having 1 stable Mb than 7 Mb unstable...
<RoAkSoAx> fabrice_sp|web, true, but my 1mb is not stable either :( that's something that you have to live with if you live in a third world country :S
<fabrice_sp_> RoAkSoAx: not good, no... But if you compare Spain with France on ADSL topics, Spain is 'Third World country' also...
<fabrice_sp_> (or Japan :-) )
<fabrice_sp> anyway: it's a bit OT... :)
<RoAkSoAx> fabrice_sp, I see, but at least you have speeds higher than 5Mb, which is the maximum here (And for residential connections is 2.5Mb). And yes, Japan rocks on Internet Speed.
<pochu> Japan simply rocks :)
<pochu> except on suicides ;)
<RoAkSoAx> pochu, haha that's the same thing that my friend tells me. People suicide a lot because of so much pressure they have in their jobs
<fabrice_sp> RoAkSoAx, the ADSL lines we have where I work have a maximum speed of 1Mb, even if we bought a 'up to 20 Mb' lines. So it's not only in Peru ;-)
<fabrice_sp> Hey: Only Spanish people this afternoon :-)
<fabrice_sp> Spanish speaking, I mean
<pochu> Telefonica EspaÃ±a is pretty good, but pretty expensive too
<pochu> and the funniest thing is that sending an sms to another european country is cheaper than sending it to my city
<RoAkSoAx> here Telefonica del Peru is pretty much the only option for internet access. There's also telmex but is less reliable than telefonica.
<fabrice_sp> pochu, I personally had bad experience with Telefonica, so got rid of them. Anyway: when you see that in France all small towns have at least a 'up to 20Mb' internet access, and in 'big city', you have 'up to 50Mb', with European call included :-/
<fabrice_sp> RoAkSoAx, it' just a matter of time :-) Competency will come
<bitplane> I have a suggestion, not sure where to make it
<fabrice_sp> bitplane, you can't be more OT than we are right now :-)
<bitplane> haha okay
<bitplane> well I'm toying with making a property page thing for nautilus
<bitplane> and the easiest method seems to be to use nautilus-python and do it that way
<bitplane> so I was thinking I'd make my thumbnailer dump a list of key value pairs, INI file style to stdout
<bitplane> and make a generic python property page maker which calls an external program to generate the list of properties
<bitplane> so it calls "my-thumbnailer --properties file.ext" and uses that
<bitplane> so.. does this sound like a good idea, if so, how would I go about getting such a thing included?
<bitplane> in fact, if it was a generic one it wouldn't have to use the python-nautilus package
<fabrice_sp> bitplane, about the good/bad idea, I don't have any opinion on it :-) And to include such a thing, you have to package it
<fabrice_sp> !package
<ubottu> Sorry, I don't know anything about package
<bitplane> i guess my suggestion is different from my proposed implementation, suggestion is to make making extra property pages as easy as adding a thumbnailer (should I be asking about this in a gnome channel instead?)
<fabrice_sp> bitplane, this channel is more about packaging, that is how to include things in Ubuntu
<bitplane> fabrice_sp, I also want to package a few things, so pointing me at some packaging docs would also be cool :)
<fabrice_sp> I'm lloking for it (as ubottu does not know about packaging)
<fabrice_sp> !packaging
<ubottu> The packaging guide is at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide - See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/NewPackages for information on getting a package integrated into Ubuntu - Other developer resources are at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment - See also !backports
<fabrice_sp> ?
<fabrice_sp> yesssss
<bitplane> fantastic, thanks :)
<fabrice_sp> ;-)
<bitplane> would it make more sense to package my app and its dependencies for Debian and have it propagate to Ubuntu?
<fabrice_sp> It's always better to go through Debian, as more distribution will make use of it
<fabrice_sp> but sometime, it's not possible
<bitplane> thanks, I'll read all the docs and come back with questions if I get stuck :)
<bitplane> (or more likely, when I get stuck!)
<fabrice_sp> perfect :-)
<RoAkSoAx> vorian, ping?
<nxvl> norsetto: i'm finishing to check source-highlight-qt-0.1, did you want me to upload it, or just advocate
<nxvl> norsetto: i need to do a final test and i'm finish, until now everything looks good
<norsetto> nxvl, if you want to upload that would be nice ;-)
<nxvl> norsetto: ok
<nxvl> norsetto: btw, how is everything going, long time without seeing you
<norsetto> nxvl, if you want to test, there are some sources in /usr/share/doc/libsource-highlight-qt-doc/examples you can use
<norsetto> nxvl, fine and dandy, and you?
<nxvl> norsetto: good, traveling too much, and with less free time everytime
<nxvl> norsetto: but everything going smooth
<norsetto> nxvl: globetrotting ... in few years you will hate traveling, believe me ;-)
<nxvl> norsetto: mm, i'm not getting a -doc package, just commented on revu
<nxvl> norsetto: i ALREADY hate traveling
<nxvl> norsetto: but it's a funny loop, i started liking it, then hated it, now i just don't care
<norsetto> nxvl, well, you must be doing something wrong then, its called libsource-highlight-qt4-doc
<nxvl> this saturday will be 2 weeks sleeping away from home, in 3 different cities
<nxvl> i just did sbuild -c karmic source-highlight-qt_0.1-0ubuntu1.dsc
<nxvl> and didn't get any -doc binary
<Laney> you need -A
<Laney> i bet
<norsetto> nxvl, what did you get?
<nxvl> -1 and -dev
<Laney> to build arch:all with sbuild
<nxvl> i pasted the ls on revu
<nxvl> trying that
<nxvl> it might be an issue with arch, sounds reasonable
<norsetto> nxvl, actually, don't upload, I want to change the -1 dep on source-highlight to a Suggests
<nxvl> norsetto: ok, will advocate it when i re-test the build
<norsetto> nxvl, muchas gracias
<nxvl> now i'm getting the -doc
<nxvl> it was an arch issue
<nxvl> advocating
<norsetto> for revu packages, IIRC, one is supposed to forward the archive's acceptance email to the ubuntu-motu m.l.?
<geser> yes
 * sebner waves at norsetto nxvl and geser :D
 * geser waves back
 * norsetto waves
<porthose> is banshee going to be the default media player in karmic?
<dtchen> it doesn't look likely presently.
<porthose> dtchen, ty
<dtchen> porthose: directhex would be the person to ask
<porthose> dtchen, I will :)
<TheMuso> slytherin: I think they patched around the issue in the latest glibc upload.
<andv> norsetto, only if the package is NEW of course
<andv> norsetto, if you use REVU for new upstream releases you don't need to
<norsetto> thx andv
<andv> np
<directhex> ahoy there, fancy pants
<porthose> directhex, is banshee going to be the default media player in karmic?
<directhex> porthose, no. banshee upstream will not commit to a stable release within an ubuntu-friendly timeline, so the desktop team feel safer sticking with the status quo for now. the decision can be re-evaluated for lazy lynx
<porthose> directhex, ok ty
<StevenK> Lazy Lynx, you say?
<directhex> StevenK, i'm using up all the names i don't like in public, in the hope that shuttleworth is forced into a corner in picking the remaining name!
#ubuntu-motu 2009-08-07
<bitplane> anyone around to answer my dumb questions?
<bitplane> do packages generally do a "make install" to install something?
<bitplane> and is there an equivalent of "make uninstall" or is that something I made up and is completely unconventional
<maxb> < bitplane> do packages generally do a "make install" to install something?
<maxb> Well that all depends on how you define "package"
<azeem_> depends on the Makefile; automake e.g. ships an uninstall target by default
<maxb> and how you define "install"
<bitplane> well, currently I do "make" followed by a "make install" to compile, then copy my binaries into the system
<maxb> Upstream source packages typically provide a "make install"
<bitplane> it also calls a script which adds new mime types, installs icons and a desktop file
<bitplane> registers my thumbnailer with gconf, etc
<maxb> Debian/Ubuntu source packages wrap the upstream source and typically use the "make install" step to install files *into the binary package they are building*
<maxb> Debian/Ubuntu binary packages go nowhere near "make install" in their installation through dpkg / apt
<bitplane> hmm okay
<bitplane> so packages generally contain binaries for the platform, rather than instructions on how to build them?
<bitplane> which is what pbuilder does?
<maxb> Well, be careful what you mean when you say "packages". There are source packages, which are the recipes for building binary packages.
<maxb> And there are upstream source tarballs which could concievably be termed "packages" by upstreams
<bitplane> ah okay, by package i mean whatever is downloaded (deb files?) when I type "apt-get install x"
<directhex> a source package, typically, contains a "make install" call at one point where the prefix is not /usr or somesuch, but a temporary folder for the build process. these binaries are then copied into a deb archive, and when the deb is installed, they go into /usr
<directhex> (very very potted summary)
<bitplane> fantastic, that makes sense
<bitplane> thanks
<LLStarks> hi. do i request package updates here?
<dtchen> no, on Launchpad.
<dtchen> LLStarks: specifically, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/FAQ#Can%20%3Cpackage%3E%20be%20upgraded?
<artfwo> hello! I wonder, are new packages still accepted to karmic through the revu?
<artfwo> hello! I wonder, are new packages still accepted to karmic through the revu?
<vorian> for a short while longer artfwo
<vorian> you have until August 27th
<artfwo> well, then I'd like to request a review for http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/scantailor - a Qt-based interactive post-processing tool for scanned books
<vorian> hrm
<vorian> the Qt part sound promising
<artfwo> it has already been advocated earlier, but rejected from the archive
<vorian> what was the reason?
<artfwo> there was a CC-licensed icon packed into a GPL binary
<vorian> yikes
<artfwo> I have replaced the icon, and this change have been accepted upstream as well
<dtchen> good work
<vorian> that is really worth a look tonight :)
<vorian> i'll see if i can get another motu to check it out as well
<artfwo> I shall remain online then, in case something needs a quick fix
<vorian> libqt-dev is at 4.5.1 right?
<micahg> !info libqt-deb karmic | vorian
<ubottu> vorian: Package libqt-deb does not exist in karmic
<artfwo> it's 4.5.2 now
<vorian> lex has been busy i see
<vorian> grr
<vorian> liboost-test
<artfwo> yep, the package works with any libboost >= 1.35
<artfwo> that's why I have put a dependency on the default version
<vorian> it would be great if libboost1.38 had the test binary
<artfwo> it does
<artfwo> there is libboost-test1.38-dev
<vorian> ah, so it does
<vorian> artfwo: will it build with 1.38?
<artfwo> yes, I have built a binary yesterday in my PPA
<vorian> mind changing that in the control then?
<artfwo> I don't mind, but what the purpose of having a "default" boost metapackage then?
<artfwo> java package ought to build-depend on default-jdk, why boost cannot be the default?
<vorian> most all KDE packages migrated away from the "default" boost during the last cycle
<vorian> besides, 1.38 is in main
<artfwo> okay, will do just now
<vorian> everything else looks perfecto
<artfwo> grr, I'm having the "425 Security: Bad IP connecting." error with REVU again
<vorian> noooo
<artfwo> I guess it's a problem with my ISP
<artfwo> vorian, there
<artfwo> uploaded with libboost-test1.38-dev
<vorian> thanks artfwo
<vorian> artfwo: ack'd
<artfwo> vorian, thanks!
<vorian> thank you artfwo :)
<stochastic> is anyone in here familiar with the qmake system?
<stochastic> If a copyright notice in a source file reads "Copyright (C) 2005, 2006 Sean Bolton and others" is this okay for inclusion? and if there's another sourcefile that reads simply "Copyright (C) 2005, 2006 Sean Bolton" do they both need to appear in the debian/copyright file?
<artfwo> I'd include both of them separately
<qiyong> i think the distro is buggy on this
<qiyong> clamav-daemon (clamd) doesn't start up autoamatically
<qiyong> no startup links
<qiyong> there's K19clamav-daemon
<qiyong> is that bug?
<qiyong> the default installation should have get it right
<qiyong> # find /etc/rc?.d | grep clamav-d
<qiyong> /etc/rc0.d/K19clamav-daemon
<qiyong> /etc/rc1.d/K19clamav-daemon
<qiyong> /etc/rc2.d/K19clamav-daemon
<qiyong> /etc/rc3.d/K19clamav-daemon
<qiyong> /etc/rc4.d/K19clamav-daemon
<qiyong> /etc/rc5.d/K19clamav-daemon
<qiyong> /etc/rc6.d/K19clamav-daemon
<qiyong> anyone confirm me this?
<StevenK> qiyong: Don't do that!
<StevenK> !pastebin
<ubottu> pastebin is a service to post multiple-lined texts so you don't flood the channel. Ubuntu pastebin is at  http://paste.ubuntu.com | To post !screenshots use http://tinyurl.com/imagebin | !pastebinit to paste directly from  command line | Make sure you give us the URL for your paste - see also the channel topic
<qiyong> StevenK: this chann is silent, paste doesn't hurt?
<Hobbsee> qiyong: it still does.
<Hobbsee> mainly because people read scrollback
<Laney> ooh
<Laney> is ff 3.5 happening?
<daurnimator> evenin
<slytherin> Laney: what do you mean?
<Laney> slytherin: to karmic
<Laney> as default
<slytherin> ah that. yes it is.
<Laney> exciting
<slytherin> I am using 3.5 on jaunty and it looks to be faster than 3.0.x
<blackmoon> whare i can fing a guide for packaging a kernel module? (i need use module-assistant)
<blackmoon> *find
<directhex> you need to use dkms, not m-a
<slytherin> blackmoon: AFAIK, module-assistant is deprecated in favour of dkms.
<blackmoon> ah, ok...
<blackmoon> do you know a guide for packaging with dkms?
<directhex> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Kernel/DkmsDriverPackage
<blackmoon> directhex: thank you
<tseng> Hi folk, I am currently worknig on bug #408825
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 408825 in python-django "security update micro-release" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/408825
<tseng> Marc made some comments about my previous patch
<tseng> I understand the first 2 comments made about version and changelog formats
<tseng> but I am lost with the patch tagging
<tseng> I have tried reading https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/PatchSystems and got more lost
<geser> I guess he meant https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/PatchTaggingGuidelines
<tseng> so do I just add a bunch of text manually to the finnished patch or is there an automated way?
<geser> which patch system does this package use?
<tseng> cdbs i think
<tseng> when i type what-patch i get cdbs
<tseng> though i have no idea how to use cdbs
<azeem> tseng: cdbs patches are usually just diffs; so adding a comment on the top according to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/PatchTaggingGuidelines should be fine I guess
<tseng> so - just want to get the order right here:
<tseng> I applied the upstream patch
<tseng> directly to the code in the tree,
<geser> no, place the upstream patch in debian/patches
<tseng> updated the changelog and debian/controle file
<tseng> aahh
<tseng> will try again
<geser> (check that it applies: patch --dry-run < debian/patches/yourpatch)
<mdeslaur> tseng: I use the cdbs-edit-patch tool
<mdeslaur> tseng: you enter the tree, do something like "cdbs-edit-patch 05_security_xxx.diff, apply the patch, and type "exit"
<mdeslaur> the patch should get automatically added to debian/patches
<mdeslaur> and then, you edit debian/patches in a text editor and add the stuff described in the wiki to the top of the patch
<tseng> thanks
<loic-m> Is today REVU day?
<loic-m> I'd appreciate if a MOTU could review (and hopefully advocate) gmameui, a Gnome front-end for MAME (arcade emulator) at http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/gmameui
<loic-m> I'm packaging it within the Debian Games Team, but since the RFS is still on it won't make it in time for Karmic unless I go through REVU
<loic-m> package should be in good shape, there was one review in DGT already
<lemon> I'm learning to become the MOTU,so what's the first step?
<loic-m> !MOTU
<ubottu> motu is short for Masters of the Universe. The brave souls who maintain the packages in the Universe section of Ubuntu. See  http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU
<Laney> see topic
<lemon> thanks for all
<RoAkSoAx> DktrKranz, any luck with lekhonee :=)?
<s0nix> can we upgrade a package with dpkg ? (without using -r, -i)
<s0nix> ha, -i replace it automatically. nvm.
<xnox> Heya! in which version of debhelper did override_dh_* target appeared?
<mrooney> Whoa, 1.9.0-6-0ubuntu1 is newer than 1.9.0-7?
<mrooney> Does apt prefer Ubuntu packages over Debian regardless of version?
<pochu> no, and it's not
<mrooney> pochu: oh, then what is going here: http://pastebin.com/m2715c2d5
<mrooney> am I missing something?
<pochu> err, it is
<mrooney> hm do you understand why?
<pochu> because the upstream version in 1.9.0-7 is 1.9.0 and 7 is the debian revision
<pochu> and in 1.9.0-6-0ubuntu1, the upstream version is 1.9.0-6 and the debian revision is 0ubuntu1
<mrooney> oh hm
<pochu> and 1.9.0-6 is greater than 1.9.0
<mrooney> I see
<mrooney> so I named that PPA version incorrectly?
<pochu> looks like :-)
<mrooney> buggers.
<mrooney> what should it have been?
<pochu> 1.9.0-6ubuntu1~ppa1
<mrooney> ahhhh
<mrooney> thanks!
<mrooney> I guess I should just delete the package from LP
<cyphermox> mrooney: when you run lintian on your package, i think it would normally say something like native-package-with-dash-version as a warning
<mrooney> ah, all those lines scroll by in like .5 seconds
<cyphermox> that's one flag to spot that there could be something wrong
<cyphermox> yep :)
<jtimberman> mathiaz: ping?
<slytherin> directhex: here by any chance?
<directhex> yes
<directhex> until the wife finishes changing
<slytherin> directhex: remember we discussed about the resolution on my LCD TV?
<slytherin> do you have time to guide me to fix it?
<directhex> sorry, no - but i'd direct you towards http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Working_with_Modelines and http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/Modeline_Database as a place to start
<maxb> Hi, can anyone point me to simplish source package for something using qmake upstream?
<slytherin> directhex: will take a look
<quadrispro> hi guys
<ximion> Hi everybody!
<ximion> Could someone please review the smile package at revu? http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/smile
<ximion> The package should be fine now.
#ubuntu-motu 2009-08-08
<Quintasan> Hiho, if any REVU admin is online please ping me.
<nekohayo> hey there, would someone be kind enough to enlighten me on what's going on with http://code.google.com/p/specto/issues/detail?id=266 ?
<nekohayo> it seems like whenever the user has python 2.4, it insists on trying to compile the package even though python 2.6 is the default
<nekohayo> thus making .debs fail
<geser> when installing a python module it gets made available for all installed python versions
<artfwo> hello! I'm looking for a second advocation of http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/scantailor - an interactive post-processing tool for scanned books (c++/qt/cmake/cdbs)
<artfwo> could anybody help with that one? :)
<nekohayo> geser: well, even if the code compatibility breaks from one python version to the next?
<nekohayo> that doesn't quite make sense to me
<kklimonda> nekohayo: you can define in package which versions of python is it compatible with
<nekohayo> you mean make the package conflict with python2.4, or something else?
<kklimonda> nekohayo: I don't know how is specto packaged but in general (if you use python-central or python-support) you can specify a versions of python that the module is compatible with - either using XS-Python-Version: field or some magic file in debian/ directory
<nekohayo> thanks for the advice folks :)
<dreamcat4> Hi guys, I've been having an autoconf issue, but only for the ppa builds
<dreamcat4> i can build locally ok, from the unpacked source dir
<dreamcat4> its driving me crazy
<dreamcat4> going to try 'debuild -B php5_5.2.10.dfsg.1-1ubuntu18.dsc'
<dreamcat4> but i won't get the error, i just know it
<directhex> dreamcat4, how about with pbuilder?
<dreamcat4> yeah, i run pbuilder locally and can't reproduce the error
<nixternal> dreamcat4: what is the autoconf error you are getting in the PPA builds?
<dreamcat4> i'll put you the link to the build log
<nixternal> groovy :)
<dreamcat4> https://launchpad.net/~dreamcat4/+archive/karmic/+build/1154420/+files/buildlog_ubuntu-karmic-i386.php5_5.2.10.dfsg.1-1ubuntu18_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<dreamcat4> i'm gonna put up a 'success' log too, so you can compare the two together
<dreamcat4> The success case (on local) https://dl.getdropbox.com/u/588496/Terminal%20Saved%20Output.txt
<nixternal> hrmm...confdefs.h is part of libsnack2-dev correct?
<nixternal> dreamcat4: can you link me to the .dsc file for this package so I can see something?
<dreamcat4> okay
<dreamcat4> https://launchpad.net/~dreamcat4/+archive/karmic
<nixternal> thank you
<dreamcat4> confdefs.h is a generated autoconf file
<dreamcat4> just building again (locally) with pdebuild
<nixternal> ahh, right
<dreamcat4> no missing confdefs.h
<dreamcat4> its so off. There was a different autoconf error which was about the build stamps for the make targets
<dreamcat4> I added 'sleep 1' to fix that. Then i get this error
<dreamcat4> If I look at the successful build, the './configure' script is different
<dreamcat4> and there is no references at those lines about the ac_fn_... undefined constant either
<dreamcat4> So it's like the configure script is totally different (on the Launchapad build farm)
<nixternal> do you get a lot of dpkg-source warnings with debuild?
<dreamcat4> yes
<nixternal> k, just making sure
<dreamcat4> those warnings don't appear on the buildfarm log files
<dreamcat4> which seems the only discernable difference between the two log files
<nixternal> wonder if they have a poopy libtool
<dreamcat4> The only thing I can think to do is add a link in the rules file before it falls over
<dreamcat4> like "cat ../configure"
<nixternal> dreamcat4: it crashed out in my pbuilder as well
<nixternal> same exact error
<dreamcat4> okay. Do you have the work source dir ?
<dreamcat4> maybe there's some temporary files left over by the autoconf tools
<dreamcat4> Mainly i'd like to know if the confdefs.h was generated (in a different directory)
<nixternal> had to reenable my hooks as they were removed for some reason
<nixternal> at least I hope I just reenabled them :)
<dreamcat4> hooks ?
<nixternal> ya, so when it FTBFS it drops me to a shell instead of cleaning everything out :)
<dreamcat4> ahh
<nixternal> apache2-build/confdefs.h
<nixternal> dreamcat4: ^^
<dreamcat4> thanks that makes (a bit more sense)
<dreamcat4> if you can,  please bzip the whole thing and upload to: http://www.snapdrive.net/pupload/   (500MB Max filesize)
<dreamcat4> or email just the ./configure file to dreamcat4 {at} gmail.com
<nixternal> hrmm
<nixternal> ya, I can do that one, as I have no clue how to get a tarball out of the buildd
<dreamcat4> yeah - i don't know either
<dreamcat4> scp it over ssh?
<nixternal> ooh, I installed ssh into the buildd, lets see if this works, as that configure file is huge
<nixternal> so, do you want the tarball or just the configure?
<dreamcat4> well thank you - erm the tarball might quite big but i'd really like it pretty please !!
<nixternal> doing it now
<jtimberman> Need another MOTU / Developer for Chef, Merb and Syntax ruby lib: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/404403 (merb/syntax bugs linked in latest comment) please.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 404403 in ubuntu "[needs-packaging] chef, chef-server, chef-server-slice" [Wishlist,New]
<nixternal> dreamcat4: http://people.ubuntu.com/~nixternal/php5.tar.bz2
<dreamcat4> unpacking tarball...
<AndrewGee> Are there any MOTUs around that can help me with a proposed SRU patch I've attached to a bug? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/jaunty/+source/osm-gps-map/+bug/387043
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 387043 in osm-gps-map "osmgpsmap python bindings placed in site-packages rather than dist-packages" [Undecided,Fix released]
<ximion> Hello! Could someone (who has enough time) please review the Smile-package ( http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/smile )? It should be finde now.
<ripps> Is it worth keeping backports for hardy in the gmpc-trunk ppa? It's getting harder to get things to build for it because it's getting so out of date
<ripps> I was hoping to keep hardy until the next LTS came out, but it's getting pretty difficult to do so.
<Aquina> Why? I'm using hardy too.
<ripps> Aquina: I maintain a ppa for bleeding egde ppa package, but the developer is moving on to vala and automake1.11 and it's making it difficult to backport all the necesary packages just to build the packages
<ripps> vala0.7 to be precise
<ripps> He's thinking I should just discontinue hardy/intrepid support, but I'm unsure if anybody else is still using it or not.
<Aquina> oh. I never heard about that one.
<Aquina> A language?
<kklimonda> Vala? yes
<ripps> Technically, automake1.11 isn't even in Karmic, but I easily add some packages fo build-depends.
<kklimonda> ripps: if it's getting too troublesome then just drop it. People who use bleeding edge most likely aren't using Hardy anymore
<ripps> Do Hardy users even using bleeding-edge package ppa's?
<kklimonda> exactly my though
<Aquina> Hey! We use harrdy because of the *big* LTS.
<Aquina> That's way some KMU's don't use SuSe, RHEL, etc.
<ripps> Man, why aren't there ppa download counters, this would be alot easier to decide if I knew what the userbase for my ppa was.
<Aquina> We are 20+ people in our organization and need LTS since we do not have the time and resources to make a dent every 6 months.
<kklimonda> Aquina: but do you use all those bleeding edge PPAs?
<Aquina> What about the Ubuntu/Xubuntu popularity contest?
<dhillon-v10> Ubuntu is better
<kklimonda> :D
<Aquina> It runs as a cron job or s.th. Can't we use that one?
<kklimonda> Aquina: only if ppa packages has different name from the ones from distribution.
<Aquina> No, we intentionally avoid bleeding edge stuff. But a language that avaoids problems of C (and is yet powefull) can't be bleeding edge but must be a standard ASAP. Please correct me in case I'm wrong with my assumptions.
<Aquina> oh I see.
<kklimonda> Aquina: Vala isn't stble yet :/
<kklimonda> stable*
<Aquina> hm.
<Aquina> Ok... the other way round...
<kklimonda> Aquina: I think we were discussing gmpc all the time
<Aquina> who much time whould it take to bacckport it and what intervals are necessary?
<kklimonda> Aquina: vala is just a language and a) it generates C code and b) isn't widely used
<Aquina> gmpc?
<ripps> Aquina: the GNOME Music Player Clinet. A gtk client for MPD
<kklimonda> Aquina: that's what ripps was talking about - he just mentioned that the author is rewriting (parts of) it in vala
<Aquina> hence.. I'm using Audacious :-)
<Aquina> (I loved Winamp)
<kklimonda> ripps: fwiw I wouldn't loose time for hardy if it was that troublesome
<ripps> Well, the guys at #mpd are constantly pointing to my ppa's for bleeding-edge packages, so I'm unsure of the userbase, and I don't want to just cut out a bunch of people just because it's a little difficult to backport a few packages
<Aquina> Ok I see. But how can I help you without to estimate a man hour-count or something?
<Aquina> You need to estimate the userbase, appraise who long it will prevent you from doing differnt work, and take into account wether there are more important projects to do atm.
<Aquina> You could temporarily create a package with a totaly weird name to check userbase?
<Quintasan> nixternal: ping
<Aquina> pong
<doctormo> Stupid question: Does anyone here know how to do packaging for init.d based services and would like to spend 10 mins packaging a wakeonlan-enable scripts which turn on ethtool wol for a client computer.
<dtchen> i'm happy to help you if you want assistance, but i won't do it instead of fixing my current plate.
<doctormo> dtchen: You have so much on your plate you broke it?
<dtchen> in a manner of speaking
<doctormo> dtchen: Then can you advise on the best way of setting of a run once on boot package with single etc config and single sbin script?
<dtchen> doctormo: take a look at procps for hints
<doctormo> dtchen: Awe, I figured you'd tell me rather than getting me to chase docs.
<doctormo> dtchen: Although it doesn't appear to be that useful, not from the first docs. It talks a lot about /rpoc
<doctormo> proc*
<doctormo> dtchen: Maybe I don't understand the context I should be searching these docs for
<dtchen> take a look at debian/init
<doctormo> dtchen: Or maybe you want me to download the source package for it and look at the debian directory?
<dtchen> yes, sorry for not making that explicit
<doctormo> dtchen: Ah then that is most helpful, thanks for the pointer.
#ubuntu-motu 2009-08-09
<doctormo> OK
<doctormo> I have created this crude attempt at a basic debian package directory http://divajutta.com/doctormo/awakenonlan-1.0-deb.tar.gz
<doctormo> But ti's having problems with man pages
<doctormo> While it would be useful to have the man pages built at package time with pod2man, I've built them with the idea that they can just go in as is.
<white> doctormo: wouldn't it be better to check the exit code of ethtool?
<white> doctormo: the debian/rules file looks pretty empty :/
<doctormo> white: The exit code is always 0, damn thing
<doctormo> I wouldn't know about debian/rules, I normally do python packages.
<white> doctormo: hmm, that I'd probably consider a bug worth reporting (not that I have looked at what the whole package does and stuff ;) )
<white> the init script is lacking a few options
<white> the copyright file needs the copyright years or something, ftpmasters are always very picky ...
<white> not sure why there is a provides line in the control file
<white> i guess if you are maintaining the package, then you could add yourself to the maintainer field in control, but i am not sure about ubuntu's policy here
<white> doctormo: the postinst script should use invoke-rc.d rather than calling the init script directly
<white> best to use dh_installinit to configure the code snippets for the maintainer scripts i'd say
<doctormo> white: The init script can't really have many more options, since it's not a daemon.
<white> doctormo: i guess you are somehow depending on the dbus python module
<white> doctormo: then have a look at a few other packages, the other targets could perform the same than others, like stop and then start or so
<doctormo> white: start-stop for restart makes no sense, I conceed I'm not a MOTU package master. But somethign about un-setting and then setting ethernet device attributes doesn't seem right.
<doctormo> Although I wish the ethlist was perl based too, it's just python is so much easier with dbus
<white> doctormo: that's alright, i am not a MOTU package master either, just throwing in some random comments ;)
<doctormo> white: Are you a debian guy or an ubuntu dude?
<doctormo> I decided to post it to launchpad so I could work on it later lp:~doctormo/doctormo-random/awakenonlan
<micahg> ping  sladen
<artfwo> hello! could anybody with a little spare time re-review a package http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/scantailor - an interactive scanned book processor (c++/qt/cmake/cdbs)?
<sladen> micahg: pong
<sladen> micahg: (but rather than pinging, it would be more useful to ask a question ;-)
<micahg> ah, hi sladen
<micahg> can you join me in #ubuntu-mozillateam
<TheMuso> c
<loic-m> asac: ping
<asac> loic-m: ?
<loic-m> asac: sory, I saw you did the last upload for miro, was that just because of the xulrunner transition or are you looking at the merge too?
<loic-m> s/sory/sorry
<Laney> loic-m: you do it
<loic-m> Laney: would like to, but I'll be afk for 2 weeks starting tomorrow
<Laney> so you just tried to nag? ;)
<loic-m> Looking at the merge report just now, I'm not sure if I'll have time to finish
<loic-m> Laney: no, somebody asked on ubuntu-motu ml :P
<loic-m> (I don't use it, never understood what the point was)
<asac> loic-m: #ubuntu-mozillateam usually deals with miro.
<loic-m> According to grab-merge, the job should be trivial, just debian/control conflicts, and that's just python 2.6 and xulrunner 1.9.1
<asac> i guess we could find a merge reviewer there
<Laney> I've done miro merges in the past
<loic-m> oh, so it's better to leave it to them no?
<asac> i dont remember exactly if we have a branch
<Laney> and raof before me
<Laney> didn't know it was mozillateam territory :O
<asac> loic-m: no. if laney wants to do it go ahead
<asac> loic-m: its not.
<asac> its just that we did some porting in the past and also packaged trunk stuff etc.
<Laney> alright
<asac> Laney: ^^
<Laney> i'll put it on the stack but really it's quite large
<asac> Laney: but i am not sure if we had a branch at some point
<asac> but i guess its too late for that already ;)
<Laney> loic-m: It's not so bad, so if you have time to do it today ping me for a review
<loic-m> ok, thanks
<Johnlesbergtion> hello
<hyperair> hi
<Johnlesbergtion> I am having an error with my apt: http://pastebin.ca/1523119
<Johnlesbergtion> It is for ubuntu studio upgraded from Ubuntu interpid
<hyperair> it means that there's another package manager running
<hyperair> you should ask this in #ubuntu
<hyperair> #ubuntu-motu is a developer channel
<Johnlesbergtion> I did
<hyperair> and?
<Johnlesbergtion> they said come here
<Johnlesbergtion> nvm
<Johnlesbergtion> I got a backup
<Johnlesbergtion> :)
<hyperair> =\
<Johnlesbergtion> I just don't have the ubuntu studio apt now
<Johnlesbergtion> :(
<hyperair> no, you just have to quit your other instance of the package manager
<Laney> they shouldn't have sent you here
<Laney> spank them
<Johnlesbergtion> I would get banned
<Johnlesbergtion> Ubuntu staff there like to ban
<Johnlesbergtion> I been banned for doing things like that
<Johnlesbergtion> :(
<Johnlesbergtion> I would have to say support for Ubuntu sucks
<jMyles> Laney:  Totally my bad.  I just didn't want to mess him up.  I looked over here and saw that it wasn't busy and thought maybe you all could help.
<hyperair> channel staff don't ban unless they have a good reason
<hyperair> if you got banned then it's usually completely your fault.
<Laney> try your loco channel for a less insane pace anyway
<Johnlesbergtion> I know
<Johnlesbergtion> I know I got banned and I probally deserved it
<Johnlesbergtion> that was awhile ago anyway
<Johnlesbergtion> I won't hold it as all of Ubuntu staff's fault
<jMyles> I knew that this was a devel channel, but it's a good vibe and I've gotten apt help here before.
<Johnlesbergtion> anyway
<jMyles> So again, my bad.
<Johnlesbergtion> can soemone give me a sources.list for ubuntu studio
<Laney> #ubuntustudio? ;)
<Johnlesbergtion> I tried there
<Johnlesbergtion> they were idle
<Johnlesbergtion> :P
<Laney> that is the way it goes
<Johnlesbergtion> ok
<Johnlesbergtion> :)
<ximion> Ubuntu-Studio sources.list should be the same as Ubuntu
<ximion> try your local support channel
<Johnlesbergtion> oh ok
<Johnlesbergtion> makes sense then
<Johnlesbergtion> :)
<Johnlesbergtion> thank you for all your help
<ximion> http://wiki.ubuntuusers.de/sources.list => Standard sources.list (without comments)
<Johnlesbergtion> thanks
<Johnlesbergtion> :)
<ximion> But I don't think this is useful.
<Johnlesbergtion> ok
<Johnlesbergtion> thanks for the help
<Johnlesbergtion> I got it all working now
<Johnlesbergtion> :)
<ximion> strange guy...
<ximion> :-)
<nellery> Laney: ping
<Laney> hi
<nellery> Laney: are you planning on merging miro?
<Laney> nellery: not me, but loic-m might be
<Laney> you should talk to him
<nellery> Laney: alright
<nellery> Thanks.
<loic-m> I've got an error building miro atm
<norsetto> conky
<nellery> loic-m: what's the error?
<loic-m> python2.6 is in Build-Depends, but the log shows it's trying to use python 2.5 and fails because it's not there
<loic-m> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/30085869/buildlog_ubuntu-karmic-i386.miro_2.5.2-1ubuntu1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<loic-m> "/bin/sh: python2.5: not found"
<loic-m> Compared to Debian, except for the xulrunner 1.9.1 dep, the only diff is  python2.5 (>= 2.5.2-6), >> python2.6,
<loic-m> which is an Ubuntu modification
<nellery> loic-m: did you change pyversions too?
<loic-m> no, because that wasn't changed in previous 1ubuntu2
<loic-m> but maybe I have too
<nellery> loic-m: the last merge included that
<nellery> with the python2.5 (>= 2.5.2-6) > python2.6 change
<loic-m> nellery: that's the debian/control I use. I don't see the diff with the ubuntu one, didn't Debian bump the version already? > http://paste.ubuntu.com/250457/
<lfaraone> Hey, can someone assist me in debugging bug 409001? I don't think this is a problem in the package. as xcb_io.c isn't part of python-gasp.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 409001 in python-gasp "begin_graphics crashes python shell" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/409001
<nellery> loic-m: that looks fine
<nellery> but what is your debian/pyversions?
<loic-m> Sorry, I didn't understand the question before
<loic-m> nellery: you're right, error spotted! Thanks a lot
<nellery> loic-m: no problem
<loic-m> 2.5>2.6 now, should be ok. I shouldn't rely on grab-merge so much. I'll have a second look at it now
<nellery> loic-m: hm, I used grab-merge and it changed it for me
<loic-m> must be something else then. My Karmic is such a Crash'O Land atm...
<loic-m> Laney, miro merge should be ready for a review at bug #411110 - thanks nellery for the help
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 411110 in miro "Please merge miro 2.5.2-1 from Debian unstable" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/411110
<Laney> loic-m: done much testing?
<nellery> I'll play with it
<Laney> loic-m: don't mention the maintainer change
<Laney> (i'll fix that)
<loic-m> I don't know how to use the thing. I started it, and it seems to be fluid with the #### radeon drivers, so it's not as bad as I expected (still can't get a video to display right with any player :( )
<loic-m> Laney: thanks
<nellery> Laney: runs and plays videos fine
<Laney> cool
<loic-m> (my video is still dl... :( )
<loic-m> BTW, could someone please review GMAMEUI at http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/gmameui ?
<loic-m> It's about the best MAME front-end I could find that's also actively developped upstream, and we don't have anything like that in the repos
<loic-m> At the moment, SDLMAME users have to run it from the command line, and that must be painful
<RainCT> loic-m: Why is the MAME stuff in Recommends?
<loic-m> RainCT: because it can run without MAME
<RainCT> ("Contact" in debian/copyright should be "Maintainer")
<loic-m> RainCT: Right. I changed that from Maintainer to Contact when it did the same on the DEP5 page, but now I'm checking it's Maintainer
<RainCT> (also configure, mkinstalldirs, install-sh, actocal.m4, etc. don't need to be listed, but I guess that doesn't do any harm either :))
<loic-m> RainCT: yes I asked on Debian, and even though it's not "mandatory" a developer told me it's still good to have
<RainCT> loic-m: looking at debian/rules it doesn't look like the package will build twice in a row (because of the "mv debian/gmameui.xpm" and the like. I'd suggest using dh_install for that, or at least install or cp)
<loic-m> RainCT: right, I'll use cp, I already use that for the .desktop file
<RainCT> loic-m: the menu entry is missing a subcategory
<loic-m> RainCT: yes, there's no subcategory that fits
<loic-m> (also asked on Debian Games Team)
<loic-m> since it's a front-end that can play many different categories of games
<loic-m> and there's no ArcadeGame subcategory
<RainCT> I see. There's Applications/Emulators but I guess that isn't as fitting as Games..
<RainCT> loic-m: ok, looks good to me other than what I've already mentioned
<loic-m> Yes, that's also my opinion, and other game-related emulators don't use that section either
<loic-m> RainCT: I'll upload in a minute, pbuilding at the moment ;)
<loic-m> I also added a Disclaimer, that way the package is ready for Debian too ;)
<RainCT> Disclaimer?
<loic-m> Because it's in contrib, and I forgot the disclaimer in debian/copyright
<loic-m> What do you think of "This package is not part of the Debian GNU/Linux distribution because it recommends MAME, SDLMAME or XMAME, whose license prohibits commercial use."
<RainCT> Ah right.
<RainCT> s/license/licenses/
<RainCT> s/prohibits/prohibit. looks good other than that
<loic-m> Thanks a lot!
<loic-m> However it's a single license (they all use the same), so should it be license_s_ ?
<RainCT> loic-m: ah, it's fine then
<loic-m> Ok, I wasn't sure
<RainCT> No problem, it was getting about time that I do some Ubuntu stuff :P
<loic-m> Thanks RainCT!
<chrisccoulson> would anyone mind taking a look at this FTBFS from a package i uploaded last night: https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/octave3.2/3.2.0-2ubuntu1/+build/1154977
<chrisccoulson> i'm not too sure what is going on :-/
<chrisccoulson> the point which fails is "cp: cannot stat `doc/interpreter/octave-a4.pdf': No such file or directory", but that is the effect of an earlier problem in the build
<RainCT> chrisccoulson: so it doesn't find the file and it aborts
<chrisccoulson> RainCT - yes. the file is missing due to this earlier error:
<chrisccoulson> "./plot.texi:69:  ==> Fatal error occurred, no output PDF file produced!"
<chrisccoulson> but i can't figure out what happens there
<RainCT> chrisccoulson: ./plot.texi:69: pdfTeX error (ext1): invalid image dimensions.
<chrisccoulson> i'm stuck at that bit though:) i had a look at the file, but i'm not sure what i'm looking for on that line
<chrisccoulson> and it's only failed on i386 :-/
<Laney> is it arch:all documentation?
<chrisccoulson> Laney - it is
<Laney> that'll explain that then
<chrisccoulson> ah, yeah, i see now
#ubuntu-motu 2010-08-09
<bdrung> Laney: not sortable sponsor queue -> adblock plus?
<Laney> yeah i do have that on
<Laney> seems weird though
<bdrung> Laney: whitelist everything on this page
<bdrung> micahg: mozilla package set -> ubufox sponsoring (3 bugs)
<Laney> that works
<Laney> cheers
<micahg> bdrung: only 1 I can do
<micahg> and it's not really complete
<bdrung> micahg: start small
<micahg> I'll look at it again
<bdrung> tumbleweed: i raised the bar by ~ 5 :)
<micahg> bdrung: the script doesn't take into account which series one can upload to
<micahg> bdrung: I haven't done it because chrisccoulson is planning an upload of ubufox, so I left it for him
<micahg> bdrung: PM?
<highvoltage> moo
<micahg> highvoltage: builders empty for grazing packages :)
<highvoltage> I have some packages to fix but I don't have the energy for them now :)
<ajmitch> it's not like it's late there, right?
<highvoltage> ajmitch: 21:35, but I have to be up at 4:00 to take someone to the airport
<highvoltage> (in eastern canada atm, not south africa :) )
<ajmitch> highvoltage: aha :)
<zooko> Greetings, people of #ubuntu-motu!
<zooko> We Tahoe-LAFS hackers moved up the release date of Tahoe-LAFS v1.8.0 to Wed, Aug 11 in the hopes of getting it included in Maverick.
<ajmitch> zooko: still no progress on getting them into debian as well?
<zooko> ajmitch: no, no recent progress on getting Tahoe-LAFS into Debian.
<zooko> ajmitch: but Tahoe-LAFS v1.8.0 offers some pretty dramatic performance, feature, and bugfix improvements over the v1.6.1 that is currently in Ubuntu.
<zooko> ajmitch: http://tahoe-lafs.org/trac/tahoe-lafs/browser/trunk/NEWS
 * Rhonda cries out loud, https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/600100
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 600100 in lucid-backports "Please backport wesnoth-1.8 (1:1.8.2-1/universe)" [Undecided,Invalid]
<ajmitch> invalid?
<Rhonda> I *explicitly* asked about wether it might go in through a stable release update!
<ajmitch> confusion reigns
<Rhonda> And was told that there isn't a way. No I receive an invalid for the backports request?!
<Rhonda> Sorry, but this is winding me up. :/
<ajmitch> bugs aren't serious enough for a SRU, and because they're bugs, no backports
<ajmitch> yay for worshipping the process
<Rhonda> I would be *more* than happy to have it go in through a SRU, but then, being told that it won't happen I do the other way that makes it possible to offer it, and now this.  :'(
<ajmitch> I can understand why you'd be annoyed
<Rhonda> And wouldn't a SRU has to go through a bugreport in launchpad, too?
<ajmitch> yes
<Rhonda> Why not reassign it appropriately instead of marking it invalid, then?
<ajmitch> and requires eyballing of the diff
<Rhonda> This is so shooting the effort down the drain. :(
<ajmitch> because it would still be an invalid task in lucid-backports
<Rhonda> Ah, alright.
<ajmitch> same bug can be used, just needs a task against wesnoth in ubuntu, targetted to lucid
<ajmitch> & why not 1.8.3? :)
<Rhonda> Right, should get updated to that. Thanks for the reminder.
<Rhonda> Actually I potential would need to bump it to 1.8.4 in a week or two week's time anyway.
<Rhonda> And it's definitely not invalid for karmic, there never was a wesnoth-1.8 package in karmic.
<Rhonda> The SRU team would only laugh madly at me filing a SRU request for wesnoth-1.8 to karmic.
<Rhonda> stalcup: ^^ - can you please take a look, with sugar on top?
<dholbach> good morning
<ajmitch> morning dholbach
<dholbach> hey ajmitch
<jdong> stalcup / Rhonda: as a bag of bug fixes new release that was rejected az.
<jdong> Err
<jdong> as a SRU, I think it's a good backports candidate
<jdong> And all those typos means a sleepy jdong
<maco> jdong: and no wonder, given the timezone we're in!
<jdong> Hey, why are you still up? :)
<maco> im up because im a stupid college student who still hasnt gotten it through her head that getting up for work requires going to bed at a decent time
<Rhonda> jdong: I still am not clear what you mean. :P  So would you think it does indeed make a good SRU candidate, or not?
<jdong> Rhonda: No i mean it's a good backports candidate and was rejected in error
<huats> morning
<Rhonda> jdong: Can you set it back to new then, I don't want to be involved in status ping-pongs.  %-/
<Laney> jdong or ScottK: Could I be added to backporters?
<micahg> dholbach: would a bzr merge work better for a new upstream version?
<micahg> actually, I'm not sure how to do that
<tumbleweed> micahg: bzr merge-upstream? (if you are talking about new upstream versions, not via debian). And yes, that does make for easier reviewing than people attaching tarballs to bugs
<micahg> tumbleweed: yeah, idk how to do that yet
<tumbleweed> micahg: bzr merge-upstream --version=$VERSON --distribution=maverick $TARBALL
<hyperair> debfx: ping
<hyperair> debfx: i'm looking at this: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/wormux/+bug/541078
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 541078 in wormux (Ubuntu) "Upgrade to version 0.9.2.1" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<hyperair> and i was wondering, why don't you replace the config.guess and config.sub files?
<debfx> hyperair: dh_autoreconf replaces them
<hyperair> debfx: ah, it does, eh.
<hyperair> i'm not familiar with dh-autoreconf, actually.
<hyperair> part of the new debhelper, i suppose.
<micahg> tumbleweed: k, now do I ask for reviewer from -sponsors?
<debfx> it's a fairly new package (dh-autoreconf) but should work with all debhelper/cdbs versions
<tumbleweed> micahg: propose it for merging, it'll appear in the sponosr queue
 * micahg didn't close the bug right in bzr..trying again
<tumbleweed> debcommit should do the right thing
 * micahg didn't use debcommit since I already used it for the commit before
<micahg> tumbleweed: fixed it, just used debcommit -e :)
<hyperair> debfx: yes, i see. okay, let me continue looking.
<dholbach> micahg: that'd work too
<micahg> dholbach: bzr merge ready :)
<micahg> tumbleweed: thanks for your help
<dholbach> micahg: I'm going to be a bit busy today, if nobody beats me to it, I'll have a look tomorrow morning
<micahg> dholbach: k, thanks
<micahg> dholbach: if a bug has a patch and bzr branch, both show up on the sponsoring page
<dholbach> micahg: if you do a merge, no need to file a bug
<hyperair> debfx: i noticed you dropped README from debian/docs, which looks like it might be useful.
 * micahg thought tracking bugs were always a good thing
<debfx> hyperair: the README is in wormux.docs
<hyperair> debfx: ah, i must have missed it, sorry.
<hyperair> debfx: you're missing entries in debian/copyright for vlgothic.
<hyperair> debfx: add those and i'll upload
<stalcup> 18
<debfx> hyperair: done, thanks for reviewing the package :)
<hyperair> debfx: sure =)
<LucidFox> http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/gmail-notifier <-- do we really need *another* gmail notifier for GNOME?
<LucidFox> we have like 5 already
<directhex> LucidFox, but the other ones are *wrong*!
<nigelb> ok, folks! We (Maia and me) need your help.  We're re-branding "Behind MOTU" since everyone in ~ubuntu-dev would be included.  We'd like your suggestions for name!
<hyperair> argh.
<hyperair> dput finally reached 97343k/97344k of this 90M tarball crawling at 30k/s
<hyperair> and then
<hyperair> it hung.
 * hyperair facepalms
<hyperair> whyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy
<hyperair> why does this happen to me?
<\sh> hyperair: the karma ;)
 * hyperair weeps
<Laney> hyperair: you should use sftp
<Laney> it won't have that problem
<hyperair> Laney: eh?
 * hyperair tries
<Rhonda> stalcup: I should have mentioned that I was guided there after a SRU discussion, right.
<stalcup> Rhonda: that would have been helpful :)  although I jumped to conclusions as well
<Rhonda> I *think* I did a test in karmic back then as well, but will try so tomorrow again when I am at the place with my chroots.
<stalcup> coolio
<Rhonda> Given that 1.8 is already in karmic-backports and the development since then is on a stable branch upstream wise so only translation/bugfixes go in, I though don't expect 1.8.3 to be any different here.
<Rhonda> But for completeness (and to please my own perfectionist approach) I will give it a shot just to be sure
<stalcup> :)
<stalcup> excellent
<hyperair> debfx: uploaded.
<stalcup> Rhonda: ScottK approved your lucid request, care to comment on your package in karmic?
<Rhonda> Like said, can do that tomorrow. :)
<Rhonda> Two hours doesn't make the day change over here, mind you. :P
<stalcup> Rhonda: it's still morning where I am :)
<Rhonda> See, day hasn't even changed for you. ;)
<ari-tczew> Laney: thanks for sponsoring   ; O
<Laney> np
<ari-tczew> Laney: just you don't need to set status manually if debian/changelog includes LP: # tag
<Laney> I know.
<Rhonda> Where are the metting logs again in the wiki?
<Rhonda> Ah, I think I just found me a search pattern.
<geser> for which meeting?
<Rhonda> Found it ^^
<fabrice_sp> jtb is waiting in binary new, and this is blocking 4 syncs to get josm at the latest version. Taking into account that FF is around the corner, should I poke an archive admin to get it approved ASAP?
<fabrice_sp> or should I request a FFe right now ? :-)
<geser> fabrice_sp: if you know that josm will build after the 4 syncs, why not requests sync for all needed packages now? and deal with the build ordering (if necessary) later
<fabrice_sp> geser, right. I forgot about that! tbh, I'm releuctant to upload something that will FTBFS. I'll upload it to my ppa before. Thanks!
<ari-tczew> tumbleweed: ping
<tumbleweed> ari-tczew: pong
<ari-tczew> tumbleweed: hello, what's the command for verbose files in .deb (binary)?
<tumbleweed> dpkg-deb -c ?
<tumbleweed> (or debc for a binary changes file)
<ari-tczew> tumbleweed: I'll prepare a patch for ddd package, which misses .xpm install
<tumbleweed> cool. please forward to debian (obviously)
<ari-tczew> could someone check whether it can be sync'd? the delta for ssl-cert package reffering to jaunty. https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ssl-cert/+changelog
<geser> ari-tczew: what's your opinion?
<ari-tczew> geser: the delta is reffering to upgrade packages in jaunty, but jaunty is very old release
<ari-tczew> I'd drop the changes, but I'm not 100% sure
<geser> because a delta is old, it doesn't automatically mean it can be dropped
<ari-tczew> geser: I don't said delta is old, just affected release is old
<ari-tczew> geser: what's your opinion?
<geser> then I misunderstood you
<geser> and I agree that it can be dropped, openssl-blacklist got moved to suggest in the Debian package and the upgrade notice should be a non-issue now
<ari-tczew> geser: that's right
<Laibsch> Is REVU still the place for sponsorship requests?
<Laibsch> it doesn't seem to process my uploads
<micahg> Laibsch: REVU doesn't process, people process things in REVU
<Laibsch> micahg: not quite correct ;-)
<Laibsch> the server needs to process the upload to show it
<Laibsch> mine doesn't show up in the list
<Laibsch> uploaded it yesterday and today
<micahg> Laibsch: are you referring to an existing package or a new package?
<Laibsch> new package
<Laibsch> natspec
<micahg> oh, yeah, well then...
<Laibsch> where is the place now?
<micahg> Laibsch: same place, just lack of REVUers :)
<Laibsch> OK
<Laibsch> that's kind of unchanged ;-)
<Laibsch> but again, the server doesn't even process my package
<Laibsch> it doesn't show up in the list
<micahg> Laibsch: is it debian 545151
<ubottu> Debian bug 545151 in wnpp "ITP: libnatspec -- a library for national and language-specific issues" [Wishlist,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/545151
<Laibsch> yes, that's the one
<Laibsch> and there is a bug in LP as well
<Laibsch> about unzip and encoding issues
<micahg> Laibsch: so, getting into debian would be ideal, have you tried that route?
<Laibsch> do you remember my nick
<Laibsch> ?
<Laibsch> no need to always start with the basics ;-)
<Laibsch> Yes, I'm maintaining a number of packages in Debian already
<Laibsch> and the upload to Debian is in progress
<micahg> Laibsch: are you just trying to get in Maverick before FF?
<Laibsch> but that won't be in time for maverick (at least most likely it won't)
<Laibsch> kind of
<Laibsch> DIF
<Laibsch> no?
<Laibsch> and I think we're already past DIF
<micahg> k, I should probably stop now since I'm not helping here...
 * micahg will bbiab
 * micahg can't REVU anyways
<Laibsch> but maybe you can help me find out why the darn server won't process my uploads
<Laibsch> :-/
<ari-tczew> tumbleweed: ddd patch updated
<micahg> Laibsch1: idk, I see the upload, but it says there was an issue and idk who admins REVU
<Laibsch1> some special restricted-access area?
<Laibsch1> because I don't see anything
<Laibsch1> and I did not get a mail about it, eithr
<micahg> Laibsch1: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?upid=8500
<Laibsch1> it's now showing in the list, too
<Laibsch> thanks
<ari-tczew> bdrung: could you sync this one? bug 614210 it's necessary for some packages to merge
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 614210 in javatools (Ubuntu) "Sync javatools 0.32 (main) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/614210
<siretart>  
#ubuntu-motu 2010-08-10
<geser> someone got an idea why my firefox doesn't want to load the CSS and JS for http://qa.ubuntu.com/reports/sponsoring/index.html?
<Laney> geser: do you have adblock?
<Laney> I had to whitelist that site
<geser> ah
<Laney> bdrung pointed this out to me. Didn't investigatge *why* though.
<geser> matches on "/sponsoring/*"
<ajmitch> heh, of course..
<micahg> does abp block all content external from the page by default?
<ajmitch> no
 * micahg has no idea then :)
<ajmitch> but this one hits one of its patterns
<ajmitch> as geser said, /sponsoring/*
<geser> I should probably propose dholbach to "fix" the location as adblock is a common extension
<geser> I'm that used to adblock that I didn't think of it blocking wanted content
<zooko> Folks, over in #tahoe-lafs we're discussing when to release Tahoe-LAFS v1.8.0.
<zooko> We were planning to do so Wednesday in the hopes of getting into Maverick, but it doesn't seem like we've got anyone who can do the work up upgrading Tahoe-LAFS in Ubuntu in that timeframe,
<zooko> so we'll probably delay the release of Tahoe-LAFS v1.8.0 by a week or so.
<maco> you need to file for a Feature Freeze Exception if you want to break freeze
<maco> (i'll be doing the same for my project)
<zooko> What project is that?
<maco> wrote an app to teach sign language
<zooko> Dang, it would still be good to have Tahoe-LAFS v1.7.1, which is already
<maco> its called gally
<zooko> YOU WROTE AN APP TO TEACH SIGN LANGUAGE? Sweet! :-)
<zooko> My wife was starting a project to do that.
<maco> http://launchpad.net/gally
<maco> i have one last thing to do for KDE integration before release
<zooko> It would still be good to have Tahoe-LAFS v1.7.1, which is already long since released, in Maverick.
<zooko> Instead of Tahoe-LAFS v1.6.1.
<maco> is it not in debian?
<zooko> No. Is that a problem? People keep asking that.
<maco> if it was in unstable, i would just request a sync, but nevermind
<maco> you DO get more users if you have it in debian
<zooko> I see.
<zooko> I want it to be in Debian.
<zooko> But the Maverick deadline is coming up, so I'm focussing more of my energy on Ubuntu. :-)
<maco> gotcha
<zooko> Well I have to hit the sack. I'm glad I discovered gally.
<maco> zooko: does your wife sign?
<maco> zooko: if so, have her join #gally  -- could use more folks working on lessons
<zooko> We both know a little ASL, which we learned originally to teach our babies.
<zooko> All hearing, just enjoy ASL.
<zooko> Good night!
<maco> good night
<zooko> Help me with Tahoe-LAFS if you can. :-)
<LucidFox> ASL? Aetas Sexus Locus? ;)
<StevenK> American Sign Language
<dholbach> good morning
<huats> morning
<\sh> moins
<AnAnt> jdstrand: ping
<AnAnt> jdstrand: I am trying to sync debhelper 8, the problem is that dh_apparmor manpage does not get built
<AnAnt> jdstrand: I found that the reason is that dh_apparmor must be executable, which is something I cannot represent in the debdiff
<AnAnt> ah, fixed it
<Rhonda> ScottK: Did my karmic test for wesnoth-1.8 (bug #600100)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 600100 in lucid-backports "Please backport wesnoth-1.8 (1:1.8.3-1/universe)" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/600100
<paultag> Hey MOTU. I'm Ubuntu-izing a package of mine in Debian. I put the "XSBC-Original-Maintainer" field in the control file, and lintain is whining about it. Any ideas why?
<AnAnt> paultag: why are you putting the XSBC-Original-Maintainer for ?
<paultag> AnAnt: I have diversions in place, I maintain Fluxbox and I did a theme for Ubuntu. I want to do a debdiff for you guys so we don't have to have Debian branding ( as awesome as my theme there is )
<AnAnt> Hello, I logged in REVU, yet I don't see a button or so to advocate an upload, does it require privileges other than MOTU ?
<AnAnt> oh, you are preparing a Debian package for Ubuntu
<paultag> AnAnt: yeah, I'm an uploader in Debian on Flux, and I want to make it nice for you guys.
<paultag> since I'm @ubuntu and everything, y'know.
<AnAnt> well, just sync it then
<paultag> AnAnt: then it has Debian branding.
<AnAnt> or there are Ubuntu-specific changes ?
<paultag> AnAnt: yes, the Ubuntu theme
<tumbleweed> AnAnt: you need a revu admin to give you advocation righ
<tumbleweed> rights
<paultag> AnAnt: none of this really has to do with my lintian warning, though
<paultag> AnAnt: do you know why lintian would complain about that tag?
<AnAnt> paultag: are you sure you got maverick in the changelog ?
<paultag> AnAnt: yes
<paultag> AnAnt: AnAnt and XSBC-Original-Maintainer has been in since dapper series
<paultag> I'd think it would be in Lucid
<AnAnt> paultag: I am using lintian 2.4.3, and I don't get warnings about XSBC-Original-Maintainer
<paultag> Let me get you my warning:
<paultag> W: fluxbox source: unknown-field-in-dsc original-maintainer
<paultag> let me pastebin the control file
<AnAnt> ok
<paultag> AnAnt: http://paste.ubuntu.com/475913/
<AnAnt> paultag: why remove uploaders field ?
<paultag> AnAnt: I did not want to to get confused -- uploaders in Debian != uploaders in Ubuntu, I thought
<paultag> AnAnt: after all, I'm changing maintainer, so I thought Uploaders might change as well
<AnAnt> Ubuntu doesn't make use of the field
<paultag> AnAnt: so it's safe to leave uploaders intact?
<paultag> AnAnt: my control file now looks like http://paste.ubuntu.com/475915/
<AnAnt> paultag: I just ran lintian, and I don't get the warning
<AnAnt> paultag: probably you are using an old version of lintian
<paultag> Lintian v2.3.4ubuntu2
<paultag> So is it safe to ignore the warnings? ( does everything look OK ) ?
<AnAnt> well, I dunno why you changed the build-deps, is that an Ubuntu specific requirement ?
<paultag> AnAnt: I just changed them upstream as well
<AnAnt> ah, ok
<paultag> AnAnt: old libtool, I need to reconf before build
<paultag> :)
<AnAnt> I was comparing with the one currently in Debian
<paultag> AnAnt: yeah the dfsg release is junk right now
<paultag> AnAnt: I just repackaged and am going to re-upload as soon as this is stable
<AnAnt> tumbleweed: so who's a REVU admin ?
<paultag> thanks for the help AnAnt :)
<AnAnt> no problem
<AnAnt> nhandler: ping ^
<AnAnt> jpds: ping ^
<paultag> AnAnt: he's out right now, getting ready for some stuff later on today :)
<paultag> ( nhandler )
<zooko> Okay, we release Tahoe-LAFS v1.8.0 release candidate 2. http://tahoe-lafs.org/pipermail/tahoe-dev/2010-August/004950.html
<shadeslayer> 0_o
<ScottK> Rhonda: Approved.
<Rhonda> Sweet, thanks!
<paultag> Could I convince someone to review a package for me? I'm looking to get my changes for Ubuntu done in time for 10.10
<paultag> Well if anyone cares to donate some time, the dsc is in my ppa. dget https://launchpad.net/~paultag/+archive/staging/+files/fluxbox_1.1.1+git20100806-1~ppa2.dsc . I'd really appreciate a review.
<jacob> morning all
<quadrispro> hi ScottK! are you around
<quadrispro> ?
<AnAnt> paultag: the revision should be -0ubuntu1
<jacob> if anyone's got some time, I'd appreciate reviews on http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/jobservice & http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/jobs-admin. both are gsoc projects and just need one more review. would like to get this finished up today, if at all possible. :)
<paultag> AnAnt: it's ok. dholbach just helped me, I'm just going to change it upstream
<AnAnt> ok
<paultag> AnAnt: thanks, though
<paultag> jacob: good luck buddy :)
<ScottK> quadrispro: Sort of.
<zooko> Could anyone help me upgrade Tahoe-LAFS in Ubuntu to the latest stable release?
<AnAnt> jacob: there is a quilt patch, is it intended ?
<AnAnt> jacob: in jobservice
<warp10> ScottK: quadrispro will be back soon. He was pinging you about a package in NEW, font-manager. Mind taking a look at it?
<ScottK> warp10: It's already done (on #debian-devel)
<quadrispro> warp10, ACCEPTED by pitti, thank you anyway :)
<ScottK> err debian/ubuntu
 * warp10 nods
<jacob> AnAnt: both patches in jobservice & jobs-admin are a result of the manpage generation when setup.py is run, and are automatically stripped when built. wasn't sure how to remove them from the source before the source packages were built.
<AnAnt> jacob: remove it in a clean target
<jacob> AnAnt: ok, will give it a shot
<AnAnt> jacob: override_dh_clean for example
<jacob> AnAnt: that seems to have fixed it. however, that leaves jobs-admin.debhelper.log in the source diff, is that ok?
<jacob> (contains dh_auto_clean)
<AnAnt> jacob: you override dh_clean ?
<AnAnt> jacob: I think you forgot to run dh_clean in the override itself
<jacob> AnAnt: override_dh_clean:
<jacob> rm -f jobs-admin.1
<jacob> AnAnt: ah. :)
<AnAnt> jacob: also, dh_clean accepts arguments
<AnAnt> ie. dh_clean jobs-admin.1
<AnAnt> so it would be a one-liner
<jacob> AnAnt: ah, that fixes it. preparing another upload now
<jacob> AnAnt: re-uploaded, only change is the rules file and the lack of patches now (in both)
<AnAnt> jacob: for the override you'll need to depend on debhelper >= 7.0.50~
<jacob> AnAnt: fixed in both & uploaded
<AnAnt> I: jobservice: package-contains-empty-directory usr/share/jobservice/sls/
<AnAnt> I'm not sure if this is important
<jacob> AnAnt: that's intentional: it's intended for service maintainers to drop in SLS XML files there, but we don't ship any in it by default
<jacob> defaults are shipped in usr/share/jobservice/default
<AnAnt> in this case, either add a lintian-override , or you can create the empty folder in postinst
<AnAnt> jacob: I: jobs-admin: capitalization-error-in-description dbus D-Bus
<jacob> AnAnt: fixed those two up -- working on the last notice on jobservice (doc-base)
<AnAnt> jacob: ok
<jacob> AnAnt: fixed both up & reuploaded. hopefully that's the last of the lintian issues :D
<dupondje> the merges page is still down :( damn
<AnAnt> dupondje: try using Debian's PTS page
<AnAnt> dupondje: you'll find an Ubuntu patch at the bottom, that would help
<dupondje> I miss the overview :)
<dupondje> the patches itself are still availible on the mom also :)
<AnAnt> jacob: ok, advocated
<jacob> AnAnt: thank you very much :)
<AnAnt> jacob: thank you for the good work
<stalcup> AnAnt: did you upload jacob's packages?  If not I'll do so now
<AnAnt> stalcup: no, I didn't
<stalcup> okay
<jacob> stalcup: thanks :) (for the earlier review as well)
<AnAnt> bye
<stalcup> no, thank you for your contributions :)
<stalcup> jacob: now maybe you can bribe Riddell to take a peek at your packages and maybe accept them
<jacob> stalcup: hah, I'm sure it'll all happen in due time
<jacob> no offense to motu, but this is the difficult step ;)
<stalcup> that's because no one looks at REVU anymore
<stalcup> it's frustrating
<SEJeff> stalcup, Well what is the preferred method?
<jacob> heh :/
<stalcup> I should encourage you to submit your package into debian as well
<stalcup> SEJeff: I look at review - however I was on an 8 moth hiatus
<Laney> the preffered method is Debian
<jacob> stalcup: I plan on it, just was a little rushed at the moment as this is the last GSoC week and I'm out of town for a few days starting tomorrow
<SEJeff> Makes sense
<stalcup> Laney: I see nothing wrong with accepting a package in Ubuntu first as long as it goes to Mentors
<stalcup> but you know that Mentors can be just as long a process
<Laney> That there's nothing wrong with it doesn't make it preferred
<stalcup> Laney: There are people (like me) who only have time to worry about one distro
<stalcup> I have upload right in ubuntu - and have to scramble for someone in debian
<stalcup> it's a no-brainer for me
<jacob> true. I'm a little more lost when it comes to submitting to debian honestly: once you submit a package, it seems you need to know someone for an upload. otherwise it just sits as an open but report forever
<Laney> I think it's sad that you think like that
<stalcup> in jacob's case, he is the upstream
<Laney> you should find a packaging team which is close to your area
<stalcup> what do you mean Laney?
<stalcup> I have a few packages in debian, and have long since given up on finding sponsors
<Laney> I mean that I haven't had a problem with getting sponsored as I maintain stuff in a packaging team
<stalcup> ah, good point
<Laney> you should mail the derivatives frontdesk if you're having trouble
<stalcup> maybe I'll do that, like I said ealier, I've been on an 8 month hiatus
<stalcup> I know that one of my packages was adopted, which is fine
<Laibsch> does "debsnap scim-qtimm" work for anyone here?
<jimmy__> i have beem trying to install limewire for 2 days now but the installer keeps giving me this error message..... Error: Dependency is not satisfiable: sun-java6-jre|icedtea-java7-jre|sun-java6-jdk|icedtea-java7-jdk
<jimmy__> i just recently switched 2 ubuntu from linux ... i like it but am very unsure about how 2 use it...could someon please help
<jimmy__> ubunut from windows***
<micahg> jimmy__: you should probably go to #ubuntu for support, but try enabling the partner archive
<jimmy__> i have been to ubuntu and read thru the support files... i do not understand... i dont kno how to use terminals or nething....and wat is partnert archive???
<micahg> jimmy__: let's switch to PM
<jimmy__> pm?
<jimmy__> private message
<lfaraone> Is there a way to set someting in a package where (at run time) debug logging is enabled if we're currently in a development release?
<micahg> lfaraone: add a wrapper?
<lfaraone> micahg: I mean, is there a variable IS_DEVELOPMENT_RELEASE or something? :)
<micahg> lfaraone: oh :), hmm, check if apport is enabled?
<lfaraone> micahg: I was considering doing "status apport" and grepping for "start", but I don't think that'd work if we have localization, right?
<micahg> lfaraone: you can check /etc/default/apport to see if enabled=1
<lfaraone> micahg: but the user might have "sudo service apport start force_start=1"'d it this time.
<micahg> lfaraone: right, that means apport was forcibly enabled and not the default
<lfaraone> micahg: yeah. ideally, we'd like to have logging on that time too.
 * micahg leaves apport enabled all the time though
<lfaraone> hmmmm.
<nigelb> 31
<nigelb> grr
<jacob> lfaraone: `cat /etc/lsb-release | grep development` ?
<Laney> not cat | grep noooooooooooooo
<jacob> well you could parse it manually for "development" then... :P
<micahg> oh, if it's in there, then source the file and check the proper variable
<jacob> ah, that works as well
<lfaraone> my naive guess is "status apport | grep start/running"
<Laney> you mean lsb_release -d, yeah?
<lfaraone> but I'm not sure if that will work the way I want on other locales.
<Laney> LANG=C lsb_release -d -s
 * RainCT doesn't think lsb_release is localized
 * sebner waves at RainCT :)
<RainCT> lfaraone: it takes the info from /etc/lsb-release
<RainCT> Hey sebner, how are you?
<sebner> RainCT: fine and you? =)
<lfaraone> RainCT: yeah, but, more accurately, I want to enable debugging even if apport is enabled outside a devel release.
<RainCT> Ah. Well just check wherever it is that apport is enabled/disabled
<RainCT> sebner: fine, at work.. :)
<sebner> RainCT: at that time? O_o
<RainCT> sebner: Yeah, I'm to lazy to get up in the morning so I'm coming here at 17h :P
<sebner> ROFL
<shadeslayer> any advice on bug 603831 ?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 603831 in fprint-demo (Ubuntu) "Please Merge fprint-demo from debian" [Wishlist,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/603831
<shadeslayer> i think everything is alright..
<AnAnt> Hello
<jsomers> hi, I'm trying to build a .deb package, but it fails on a --build option. http://pastebin.com/x4JRYbax Can I disable that, or am I missing an option. Googling for the --build line returns no results, so it's a bit problematic
<james_w> jsomers: please pastebin your debian/rules
<jsomers> james_w: http://pastebin.com/NBdq2h0w
<james_w> jsomers: don't call dh_auto_configure, call ./configure with the options that you want
<james_w> jsomers: dh_auto_configure is trying to give you helpful defaults
<jsomers> james_w: thanks!
<Rhonda> hmm. too lazy now that I know requestsync to do it manually.  %-/
<zooko> Oh good someone on #tahoe-lafs volunteered to upgrade Tahoe-LAFS in Ubuntu before the Maverick Feature Freeze.
<zooko> Then they said I should "remind them tomorrow".
<zooko> So we'll see if they actually do it. :-)
<pindonga> Hi, could anyone please review the django-configglue package? It's a django application that allows it to use the latest configglue code to define settings in a more robust way. We are trying to get it into maverick hopefully. Thanks
<zooko> Oh, good, rockstar will look at it. There is hope!
<AnAnt> Hello
<zooko> Hi AnAnt!
<AnAnt> wassup ?
<zooko> Finally found a hero to package Tahoe-LAFS.
<ajmitch> good, glad that someone has some time :)
<AnAnt> zooko: ah, you're an upstream
<ajmitch> rockstar will still need to pass it by a sponsor, I think
<ajmitch> which is easier than convincing someone to do all the work :)
<zooko> ajmitch: okay. Now looking for a sponsor. :-)
<zooko> One of the many awesome things about the new version of Tahoe-LAFS is that it can act as an SFTP server, which means Nautilus can browser your secure distributed filesystem automatically.
<ari-tczew> hello, I'm looking for sponsor this one: bug 615048
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 615048 in nautilus-image-converter (Ubuntu) "Merge nautilus-image-converter 0.3.0-3 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/615048
<nhandler> angelabad: Still need me?
<nhandler> err, ignore that angelabad
<angelabad> nhandler, ok :-D
#ubuntu-motu 2010-08-11
<isleshocky77>  I've been looking through the packaging documentation for a while now and still I'm running in circles. Could someone set me straight. I took the source of pidgin-libnotify and modified one file. Now I want to get a build in my personal launchpad ppa for x32 and amd64
<micahg> isleshocky77: try #ubuntu-packaging
<micahg> if I'm doing a new upstream release, is it worth merging from Debian?
<micahg> sorry I should be clearer, the new debian release only was for 1 of the ubuntu revisions (i.e. we don't add anything, diff slighlty smaller)
<rhpot1991> got a question on licensing, is it possible to get a non gpl compatible open source product into one of the ubuntu repositories?  the license in question is apple public software license.
<micahg> rhpot1991: is it a free license?
<rhpot1991> micahg: http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/apsl.html
<RAOF> rhpot1991: If it's DFSG free, there's no problem (unless, of course, it does something stupid, like link against GPL libraries or somesuch).
<ScottK> Of course GNU considers GFDL invariant a free license, so I wouldn't take their opinion as counting for much.
<RAOF> Heh.
<zooko> Yay! rockstar uploaded a package of Tahoe-LAFS 1.7.1 for Ubuntu!
<zooko> Anybody want to test it out?
<AnAnt> Hello
<bilalakhtar> Why did M-o-M has to go down just before FF ?
<dholbach> good morning
<zooko> Who sponsored Tahoe-LAFS v1.7.1 to go into Maverick just now?
<zooko> (I want to thank them on the tahoe-lafs mailing list.)
<dholbach> zooko: https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/tahoe-lafs/1.7.1-0ubuntu1
<zooko> Thanks!
<zooko> Thanks, maco
<zooko> Good night, folks (UTC-6)
<AnAnt> dholbach: Hello
<dholbach> hey AnAnt, sabah il cheer
<AnAnt> dholbach: I think you meant: kheer
<dholbach> AnAnt: that could well be :)
<dholbach> Rhonda: does your offer for that git session still stand? :)
<Rhonda> I hope so, but I don't have much time to prepare it properly.  %-(
<Rhonda> Didn't sleep much this night neither, your young one wasn't working along.
<dholbach> Rhonda: next week thursday?
<nigelb> wow, git session.  Now that totally rocks :)
 * Rhonda cries
 * X3 throws Rhonda a chocolate tnafish
<tumbleweed> it'd also have to ch
<tumbleweed> grr, excuse that
<pindonga> hi, I would like to seek sponsoring for bug #616025
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 616025 in django-configglue "needs packaging" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/616025
<pindonga> anyone iinterested?
<AnAnt> looking
<AnAnt> pindonga: in copyright file, upstream source can be https://launchpad.net/django-configglue
<pindonga> ok,
<AnAnt> also from upstream LICENSE file, it seems the copyright holder is Canonical Ltd., not Canonical ISD hackers
<AnAnt> pindonga: ^ that is for the Copyright field
<AnAnt> pindonga: the License field machine readable format copyright would be as follows:
<AnAnt> License: LGPL-3
<pindonga> the License was like that but lintian complained I wasn't referring to the common licenses
<pindonga> Copyright: 2010 Canonical Ltd. would be ok?
<AnAnt> followed by the disclaimer
<AnAnt> as for Copyright: 2010, Canonical Ltd.
<AnAnt> and you may even add a URL
<AnAnt> for example. Copyright: 2010, Canonical Ltd. (http://www.canonical.com)
<AnAnt> back to License
<AnAnt> have a look at gst123 copyright file for example
<AnAnt> http://packages.debian.org/changelogs/pool/main/g/gst123/gst123_0.1.2-1/gst123.copyright
<AnAnt> is this tarball a repackage ?
<pindonga> this would be the first package for ubuntu
<pindonga> we had some previous packages in our own ppa for custom deployments
<pindonga> but in those we never bothered to get the package right
<AnAnt> I mean, no upstream tarballs released ?
<pindonga> not yet, but I can do that if its needed
<AnAnt> I'm not sure about that, but it seems to me that you removed the non-free icons, right ?
<pindonga> mhhh
<pindonga> actually I think the disclaimer in the license is wrong
<pindonga> (I copied this from another project we opensourced)
<pindonga> this  one doesn't have any images or icons
<AnAnt> the disclaimer is in the LICENSE & the LP page
<AnAnt> from LP:    Commercial subscription expires 2020-12-09
<pindonga> this was an internal project first, and now I changed the license to LGPL3 as we were allowed to opensource
<pindonga> I don't know why the "internal project" and "commercial subscription" did stick around
<AnAnt> ok, maybe that should be changed upstream
<pindonga> ok, so, let's recap please. I need to
<pindonga> a) change the License field
<pindonga> b) add a Dsiclaimer field
<pindonga> c) change the Copyright field
<pindonga> d) change the Upstream-Source field
<pindonga> e) publish an upstream source tarball
<pindonga> f) fix the LP project status
<AnAnt> not a Disclaimer field, it is just a paragraph under License field, have a look at the example I gave you pleas
<pindonga> g) fix the lincese disclaimer
<pindonga> ah, ok
<AnAnt> I'm not sure if it is required to publish upstream source tarball, but that would be useful for other distros anyways
<AnAnt> as for f) what matters is fixing the LICENSE file in upstream tarball
<AnAnt> but it would be rational to also fix the description in LP page
<AnAnt> oh, you mentioned it in g) already !
<AnAnt> ok, h) there is a generated patch
<AnAnt> you can avoid that by removing the generated files in  clean target
<AnAnt> I dunno how that is done with CDBS
<pindonga> where do you see the patch?
<AnAnt> debian/patches/debian-changes-0.3-0ubuntu1
<pindonga> k
<pindonga> I'll look into it
<AnAnt> ok
<AnAnt> pindonga: in the control file, you can drop XB-Python-Version field
<pindonga> AnAnt, I just reuploaded the package, can you please give it another look?
<pindonga> hi AnAnt , in case you didn't see my previous message
<pindonga> pindonga> AnAnt, I just reuploaded the package, can you please give it another look?
<pindonga> (I noticed you had a connectivity hickup)
<pindonga> :)
<pindonga> AnAnt, regarding the 'commercial support' thing, bac told me it's not so easy to remove... if this is still an issue for packaging, please contact him
<AnAnt> pindonga: what commercial support ?
<AnAnt> pindonga: the only issue was with this:
<pindonga> in the license (in the launchpad page)
<pindonga> we had 'internal project'
<AnAnt> The image and icon files in django-configglue are copyright Canonical,
<AnAnt> and unlike the source code they are not licensed under the
<AnAnt> LGPLv3.  Canonical grants you the right to use them for testing and
<AnAnt> development purposes only, but not to use them in production (commercially or
<AnAnt> non-commercially).
<pindonga> ok, that I removed
<AnAnt> pindonga: you were talking about the LP page ?
<pindonga> yeah, don't worry
<AnAnt> ok
<pindonga> just let me know if there is anything else I need to change on the package
<pindonga> please
<AnAnt> pindonga: third-party copyright should be noted in debian/copyright
<AnAnt> pindonga: so you'll need a section like
<AnAnt> File: path/to/file
<AnAnt> Copyright: year, holder
<AnAnt> License: whatever
<AnAnt> pindonga: also please run lintian on the changes file, it will give you some good pointers
<AnAnt> I don't understand why the resulting deb file has python (<<2.7) dependency
<AnAnt> pindonga: by the changes file, I mean the one resulting from building the binary package (not just _source.changes)
<AnAnt> or just run lintian on the source & binary packages
<pindonga> AnAnt, sure, thanks
<tumbleweed> AnAnt: python dependancies like that are a result of a python helper
<AnAnt> tumbleweed: he's using python-central, I dunno about it
<AnAnt> I'm used to python-support
<tumbleweed> AnAnt: looking at th epackage now
<AnAnt> thanks
<AnAnt> brb
<tumbleweed> pindonga: python-support is more widely used :)
<pindonga> tumbleweed, I started off from another package :) is it important to use python-support instead of python-central?
<tumbleweed> pindonga: it helps if you actually learn what you are doing rather than just modifying something else (but one has to start somewhere)
<pindonga> yes, I agree
<tumbleweed> more people know python-support, but both of them are slated to be replaced by dh_python2
<pindonga> :/
<pindonga> I'll try to make the next package use python-support
<tumbleweed> pindonga: practically speaking for this package, there's nothing really python-central specific
<tumbleweed> pindonga: full review on revu
<AnAnt> tumbleweed: does debhelper compat level matter ?
<tumbleweed> AnAnt: I don't know what caused python-central to misbehave either, I don't know it as well as -support or dh_python2
<tumbleweed> AnAnt: it doesn't matter, it's just a case of why use an old version...
<AnAnt> tumbleweed: ok
<AnAnt> I don't understand what third-party license is there
<AnAnt> running licensecheck says that every file is copyrighted by Canonical
<pindonga> AnAnt, its because we copied over some code from django and adapted it, so we need to say it came from django source base
<AnAnt> and changed the license to LGPL?
<LucidFox> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/53483722/buildlog_ubuntu-maverick-i386.epiphany-browser_2.30.2-1ubuntu5_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<LucidFox> Any idea what could cause this?
<micahg> LucidFox: yeah, there was some discussion about this in -desktop yesterday
<micahg> bdrung: why do sponsorships get the assignee unassigned?
<LucidFox> micahg> From the looks of it, WebKit-1.0.gir depends on JSCore version 1.0, while JSCore-1.0.gir claims 1.1
<micahg> LucidFox: yeah an upload was done last night to change 1.0 to 1.1
<micahg> LucidFox: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/maverick/+source/gir-repository/0.6.5-6ubuntu6
<pindonga> AnAnt, tumbleweed I just uploaded a new version, can you please re-check? (I hope I got it all this time)
<pindonga> tumbleweed, shall I  look for someone else to finish the review (I don't want to bother you too much, but I would really like to make the maverick deadline)
<tumbleweed> pindonga: I added more review
<pindonga> ah, cool thanks
<pindonga> tumbleweed, a few things
<tumbleweed> pindonga: btw, does it work? :)
<pindonga> 1. the thing with third-party: we copied some code over from django and modified it... the idea is to cope with django's license, mentioning that we used and modified original django code
<pindonga> 2. re License: when  I run the lintian locally, it complains if I just use LGPL-3 saying I'm not referencing the common-licenses location
<pindonga> how can I spot all those errors you found? running lintian locally gave no errors at all (I checked against the built package, the sources file and the dsc file)
<tumbleweed> 1. so, it shouldn't only say "Copyright: Canonical"
<pindonga> s/sources/changes/
<tumbleweed> 2. instead of sying "given below" five the common-licenses path, then lintian knows you are doing the rgiht thing
<tumbleweed> I could be using a newer lintian...
<pindonga> I'm on lucid (maybe it's that?)
<pindonga> :q
<highvoltage> also, lintian doesn't always spot all the problems that a human can :)
<tumbleweed> highvoltage: we try to make it, though :)
<pindonga> tumbleweed, what do you mean by 'the watch file doesn't work?' / how do you test that?
<highvoltage> *nod*
<tumbleweed> pindonga: uscan --verbose --report
<pindonga> ok, regarding the License: shouldn't it say the same thing as the LICENSE file? in that case, should I remove the LGPL code from it and point to the common-licenses file? if so, what happens on non-ubuntu distributions?
<tumbleweed> pindonga: common-licences comes from debian
<tumbleweed> it should say the same thing as LICENSE, yes, except that you can factor out the licence body, as found in common-licenses (look at other packages' copyright files)
<maco> zooko: thank rockstar. he did the packaging. i just sponsored it
<zooko> I did.
<zooko> He and I have some plans to get packaging of Tahoe-LAFS for Ubuntu more automated.
<maco> ok
<zooko> So, that was Tahoe-LAFS v1.7.1. It has the major new improvement that it can be configured to act as an SFTP server, which means you can then point Nautilus at it and browse your decentralized filesystem graphically.
<zooko> Now, Tahoe-LAFS v1.8.0 is in release-candidate mode. In all likelihood the current release--1.8.0c2--is going to be identical to the final 1.8.0 release.
<zooko> (Unless someone reports a regression, security hole, or major bug.)
<zooko> I'm toying with the notion of going ahead and announcing 1.8.0-final a few days early in the attempt to get 1.8.0 into Maverick.
<zooko> The scheduled release date for 1.8.0 final is "approximately August 15".
<zooko> Hm, I don't think I should cut the 1.8.0c2 test cycle short.
<zooko> So, suppose I want to get 1.8.0-final included in Maverick, but it won't be released until the 15th (Sunday), then should I:
<zooko> 1. ask to include 1.8.0c2 into Maverick right now
<zooko> 2. file a FFE for 1.8.0-final, on Sunday
<zooko> 3. forget about it and wait til Maverick+1
<zooko> 4. other?
<zooko> whoops gotta get ready for work. will check this IRC window soon...
<pindonga> tumbleweed, what Standards-Version should I use? the one on lucid is 3.8.4
<pindonga> tumbleweed, ok, I just pushed another version (please let me know when you looked at it)
<paultag> lfaraone: ping, I was told to talk with you :)
<paultag> lfaraone: I'm up in Debian, I work on the Fluxbox package ( only active maintainer right now ), and my DD is out ( his dad just died ). I'd love to get my new version uploaded in Debian in time to sync for Ubuntu. Is there any chance you could sponsor the upload / review the package. Currently there are 4 lintaian issues on the .deb because of upstream doc issues. I'm working on helping them resolve them
<lfaraone> paultag: I'll be happy to take a look at it. Upload it to mentors and mail me the resulting email to myircnick at debian dot org
<paultag> lfaraone: thanks! I'll do that right away.
<lfaraone> paultag: these issues were present in the previous version, right?
 * lfaraone will get to it in about 30 minutes, I was just walking out to lunch
<paultag> lfaraone: yes, I have removed quite a few other lintian issues, and did a few bugfixes, and other fixes
<paultag> lfaraone: sure, no problem. I'll be online
<paultag> lfaraone: no new features
<pindonga> anyone around that want to finish reviewing #616025?
<fabrice_sp> pindonga, you have a generated patch in debian/patches: either make a clean patch or change it upstream. Maintainer field has the old value
<pindonga> fabrice_sp, thanks, what do you mean by 'old value'?
<fabrice_sp> it's not MOTU anymore
<fabrice_sp> it's Ubuntu Developers <ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com>
<fabrice_sp> Standards-version should be 3.9.1 also for maverick
<fabrice_sp> also, do you really need a build dependency on python ?
<pindonga> fabrice_sp, don't know, I think it was mentioned in the packaging guide
<pindonga> fabrice_sp, when I remove the python build dep, lintian complains (E: missing-python-build-dependency)
<pindonga> so I think I just leave it in there
<fabrice_sp> because of distutils. it seems. ok
<pindonga> fabrice_sp, ok, just pushed a new revision
<fabrice_sp> ok
<lfaraone> paultag: ah, maco referred you to me. I'll have to talk to her about that :P
<fabrice_sp> pindonga, the watch file get a newer version from launchpad
<fabrice_sp> is it normal?
<pindonga> yes, I don't know why that is
<maco> lfaraone: he needed someone that could make uploads to debian AND ubuntu happen... ergo: you
<pindonga> ah, actually I think I need to replace the released source with the latest one
<lfaraone> maco: thanks :P
<paultag> lfaraone: haha
<lfaraone> maco: by the way, when are you planning on leaving / returning from OLF?
<maco> dunno yet
 * lfaraone has school that week.
<paultag> lfaraone: one time deal. My DD / all my DD friends IRL are busy :(
<paultag> lfaraone: come on by, it will be great, I'm in Ohio
<paultag> lfaraone: this counts for beer debt
<lfaraone> maco: friday after 3:01, monday before 8:19 :P
<maco> paultag: which you cant pay off til he turns 21 in 4 years?
<paultag> Oh lawdy
<lfaraone> paultag: right, I'll collect it in 4 years when I'm legal.
<paultag> Sure thing.
<maco> lfaraone: or in one year in europe?
<paultag> maco: I had my first legal drink @ 16 in Germany
<lfaraone> maco: sure. you going to debconf bosnia? :)
<paultag> :)
<paultag> maco: did you hear about the ubucon we'll be doing on friday @ olf ?
<paultag> maco: akgraner was nice enough to get the ball rolling with that, it should be a blast.
<pindonga> fabrice_sp, I think it finds a newer version beause lp doesn't really delete the old files? (even though I deleted them via the web interface?)
<pindonga> if you notice it matched 0.3.0.1  and now it matches 0.3.0.3 while looking for 0.3
<paultag> lfaraone: any issues you see so far?
<pindonga> fabrice_sp, if having a watchfile is optional, I'd go with removing it if it causes issues for approving the package
<lfaraone> paultag: I'll let you know.
<paultag> lfaraone: thanks :)
<fabrice_sp> pindonga, I'd really prefer to have a working watch file :-)
<pindonga> do you know how I can change it so that it takes the version in the url file? I tried that but it complains
<pindonga> the download url is: http://edge.launchpad.net/django-configglue/trunk/0.3/\+download/django-configglue-0.3.tar.gz
<lfaraone> paultag: is there a reason you're packaging a git snapshot?
<pindonga> uscan complains about 'Use of uninitialized value $filepattern...'
<paultag> lfaraone: yes, the 1.1.1 release is over 2 years old now, and there are a lot of debian patches I got merged into git mainline
<paultag> lfaraone: it resultes in a much cleaner package imho. Is that wrong?
<lfaraone> paultag: have attempts to get upstream to relese failed?
<paultag> lfaraone: yes
<paultag> lfaraone: I've tried over the last 4 months to get a .2 release, no luck
<lfaraone> paultag: it's fine. you still have a tonne of patches though :)
<paultag> haha, aye. I think the ones left are debian-isms
<paultag> or ones upstream refuses
<lfaraone> (well, only two, which is an improvement over the last version)
<paultag> lfaraone: :)
<lfaraone> paultag: if you're packaging git snapshots, you *should* write a get-orig-source rule to automate the process so that other people can reproduce your steps.
<fabrice_sp> pindonga, this is because you have 2 times (.+) in your watch file
<paultag> lfaraone: OK, I'll get that in the git.debian asap. Is it blocking this upload?
<lfaraone> paultag: not per se, but I'll have to guess which repo etc oyu used so I can verify your tarball.
<paultag> lfaraone: Ahha. git.fluxbox.org. I'll write the rule and get it in git.debian
<fabrice_sp> pindonga, if you replace the first one with .*, it works
<pindonga> fabrice_sp, cool, I'll just resubmit the package
<pindonga> thanks
<lfaraone> hmmm. how does one diff two *debian.tar.gzs.... debdiff tells me all the changes that were made, period, when I just want the changes that have been made in debian.
<pindonga> fabrice_sp, ok, I just pushed the update
<lfaraone> paultag: there's no commit on 2010-08-07 according to http://git.fluxbox.org/?p=fluxbox.git;a=shortlog;h=HEAD , did you mean the 2010-08-05 commit?
<paultag> lfaraone: doh! yes, I forgot, I was playing in my PPA and had to get rid of the old revisions. That was just the date when I pulled the git tree down
<lfaraone> paultag: if so, which? (I personally find it helpful to do "BASE_VERSION+gitDATE.REF" so there's no ambiguity.
<paultag> lfaraone: yeah, I used the date of when I pulled
<lfaraone> paultag: so you would want something like fluxbox-1.1.1+git20100805.0cc08f9, methinks
<paultag> lfaraone: will that work if the sha sum on the same day for the next revision is "less" then the current revision?
<paultag> lfaraone: e.g. a f8
<lfaraone> paultag: No. But I'd expect you wouldn't be packaging two releases from the same day.
<paultag> lfaraone: Very true
<paultag> lfaraone: Should I change that, then?
<lfaraone> paultag: if you are planning on that, feel free to do fluxbox-1.1.1+git20100805.0.0cc08f9, and incr the middle .0. :)
<lfaraone> paultag: very yes.
<lfaraone> paultag: it's important to have zero ambiguity about what version you're working with.
<paultag> lfaraone: should I also include get-orig-source? I was just working on it, but I think it's broken. Could I exclude that for this revision?
<paultag> lfaraone: OK. Let me fix that.
<lfaraone> paultag: sure. I have a spare get-orig-source rule lying around, if you want it.
<paultag> lfaraone: I'd love it
<lfaraone> paultag: here's what I use for pianobar: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~lfaraone/pianobar/debian/annotate/head:/debian/rules#L6
<lfaraone> which also supports tags, as a matter of fact.
<paultag> lfaraone: Ahha, I see what you're doing.
<paultag> that's a lot better then what I was writing
<lfaraone> paultag: that code has been adopted, rehashed, converted to different VCSs, so I'm surprised I got it working myself :)
<fabrice_sp> pindonga, the package is not installable in Maverick, because python-configglue (>= 0.9), but maverick has 02dev-0ubuntu2it's expecting
<paultag> lfaraone: I just noticed I don't have a debian revision on the package. Would it do me good to have it as 1.1.1-1+git... ?
<pindonga> python-configglue 0.9 should have been proposed for maverick already
<pindonga> let me check
<lfaraone> paultag: uh, you do, the debian revision is at the end.
<lfaraone> paultag: "fluxbox_1.1.1+git20100807-1"
<paultag> Oh duh, my changelog
<paultag> I was looking at my ls
<paultag> lfaraone: I'm still just a programmer, sorry for the new-ish questions
<fabrice_sp> pindonga, maverick still has 02dev
<lfaraone> paultag: no worries. I'm only a packager. I'm still amazed anybody trusts me to upload anywhere, let alone Debian / Ubuntu :)
<paultag> :P
<paultag> lfaraone: you're keeping me in-line :)
<pindonga> fabrice_sp, ok, I'm told they are updating maverick right now
<pindonga> I'll ping you back as soon as I have word that it reached maverick
<fabrice_sp> ok
<paultag> lfaraone: I'm trying a build now. I'll put it to mentors if it builds OK
<lfaraone> paultag: mk.
<paultag> lfaraone: seriously, thanks so much. You really just saved my day :)
<lfaraone> paultag: I live to serve.
<paultag> lfaraone: warning: the current version (1.1.1+git20100805.0cc08f9-2) is smaller than the previous one (1.1.1+git20100807-1) <-- this was giving me flack
<paultag> lfaraone: is it safe to pull the 5 to 7?
<lfaraone> paultag: we have not uploaded it anywhere important, so yes.
<paultag> OK
<lfaraone> paultag: where did you get that warning?
<paultag> lfaraone: in my dsc build. my pbuild failed, so I'm reviewing what went wrong
<paultag> lfaraone: I really hate to bug you again, but I'm getting an error I'm not sure about
<paultag> lfaraone: chmod: cannot access `/tmp/buildd/fluxbox-1.1.1+git20100807.0cc08f9/./configure': No such file or directory
<paultag> lfaraone: I can paste the pbuilder log if that might help
<lfaraone> paultag: I'm not a pbuilder wiz, but ask and maybe someone here can help.
<paultag> Let me run it one more time catching stderr
<paultag> Oh, wait
<paultag> I think I know why
<paultag> lfaraone: I'm having issues. can I email you when it's all set?
<lfaraone> paultag: sure.
<paultag> lfaraone: thanks, stupid build issues plus a long day of writing stupid code
<paultag> lfaraone: thanks so much
<lfaraone> paultag: no sweat.
<fabrice_sp> what is the status of the sugar packages? Do we keep 0.86 and 0.84 packages or only 0.86?
<fabrice_sp> it's for bug 616444
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 616444 in Ubuntu "Sync sugar-read-activity-0.84 69-4 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/616444
<bdrung> micahg: because the sponsors assign the bug to themself before beginning sponsoring
<micahg> bdrung: k, but why unassign?
<Laney> because it's no longer their task to work on
<bdrung> micahg: ^ and because only one person can be assigned
<ajmitch> morning
<bdrung> micahg: and noone assigned means that it's ready for sponsoring. if someone is assigned it means that he/she is working on it
<bdrung> good evening ajmitch
<micahg> bdrung: yes, but if one is actually doing the sponsoring, why isn't that considered fixing the bug?
<bdrung> micahg: hÃ¤? i don't get it.
<bdrung> bug fixing and assigning are two different things
<ajmitch> the person who fixed the bug is the person listed in debian/changelog, generally
<micahg> ah, ok
<ajmitch> having someone assigned is a way of saying that this bug is being looked at by a particular person, don't touch it
<ajmitch> whether that be the bug fixer or the sponsor
<ajmitch> just a short-term lock, nothing really meant by it afaik
<bdrung> yeah, it's a spin-lock :)
 * micahg will remember when sponsoring
<yofel> someone got time to look at a SRU for lucid? bug 616498   (FTBFS fix)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 616498 in gorm.app (Ubuntu) "gorm.app FTBFS in lucid" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/616498
 * ajmitch would if his laptop wasn't being useless & thrashing after a resume
<yofel> heh
<Laney> ajmitch: no! work on U1 in Debian!
 * Laney covers your eyes
<ajmitch> I'll just join the club & blame the fglrx drivers :)
<ajmitch> Laney: that requires the same laptop
<Laney> sure does
<ajmitch> since that's my only up-to-date sid install
<ajmitch> you seem eager to have U1 in?
<Laney> yeah I'd like it on my work PC
<Laney> and from a development POV, to reduce deltas
<ScottK> Seems a bit odd to see excitement about clients for proprietary web services.
<Laney> I'm quite relaxed about those really
 * Laney visits twitter.com
 * ajmitch uses the notes syncing more than the file sync, and that's pretty much just couchdb replication
<Laney> Tomboy Web could be tasty though
 * Laney will use a decent Free option if one exists
<ajmitch> I saw a suggestion to have a default note in tomboy?
<Laney> yeah, some advertising
<ajmitch> I know that in debian you do need to configure note sync manually (typing in a URL)
<bdrung> yofel: i don't think that's worth a sru. there must a more important reason than "fixes TFBFS"
 * ScottK considers adding adverts to a bunch of packages.
<ScottK> bdrung: I don't agree with that.  Fixing FTBFS is a good reason for an SRU.  Particularly in an LTS it improves the supportability of the archive.
<yofel> bdrung: thanks to gorm.app missing, gnustep-devel is uninstallable in lucid
<ajmitch> bdrung: even though there's no binary package in lucid due to that FTBFS?
<micahg> bdrung: I'd say that depends on the likelihood of needing a security update
<micahg> s/say/suggest/
<ScottK> In fact, when we did the removal of unbuildable binaries in Lucid, we explicitly said they were eligible to be restored as an SRU if the FTBFS was fixed.
 * Laney has fixed at least one like that
<Laney> p.s. I hope it didn't sound like approved of advertising changes or wanted them in Debian/anywhere
<Laney> ;)
<Laney> s/like/like I/
<jdong> sagemath people still seem upset at us
<jdong> I'm assuming it's impossible to remove software from released repos?
<ajmitch> why are they upset?
<micahg> jdong: upload an empty package?
<jdong> ajmitch: we apparently took a snapshot from sid that was not release quality
<jdong> (e.g. badly broken)
<ari-tczew> jdong: hello! did you come back from holidays?
<pindonga> fabrice_sp, a quick question, assuming configglue 0.9 gets into maverick in the next 30min, would the django-configglue package need anything else done to it?
<bdrung> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gorm.app/1.2.8-1 looked like there were a binary package.
<jdong> and nobody figured this out until after it froze
<pindonga> I'll have to leave in a while and I want to make sure everything is done so it gets included
<micahg> jdong: sagemath isn't in lucid
<ajmitch> jdong: so is it worth updating, or removing?
<jdong> micahg: jaunty and karmic, sorry.
<micahg> oh
<ari-tczew> jdong: could you review one my SRU bug?
<ajmitch> old old releases
<fabrice_sp> pindonga, I haven't seen anything, but you need 2 acks before upload
<micahg> jaunty is almost EOL :)
<jdong> ajmitch: I'm asking the maintainer that right now
<pindonga> ok, anybody else that want to volunteer to review django-configglue ?
<pindonga> :D
<fabrice_sp> :-)
<ajmitch> pindonga: url?
<pindonga> http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?upid=8519
<pindonga> ajmitch, do you want the bug url?
 * ajmitch knows python-configglue, so django-configglue should go with it :)
<ajmitch> sure
<pindonga> ajmitch, https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/616025
<yofel> bdrung: there was the binary package from karmic that was copied over, but it was removed after the rebuld test showed that it fails to build
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 616025 in Ubuntu "needs packaging django-configglue" [Undecided,New]
<jdong> ari-tczew: is it uploaded to -proposed yet?
<pindonga> ajmitch, yes, python-configglue is being updated for maverick as we speak
<bdrung> yofel: ok. i might look after processing the sync requests
<ajmitch> pindonga: yeah I was talking to chipaca about it last night, I've uploaded the previous version to debian
<pindonga> django-configglue uses latest python-configglue
<pindonga> ajmitch, cool,
<ari-tczew> jdong: no, it's require review by SRU team first, right?
<yofel> bdrung: thanks :)
<ajmitch> ari-tczew: it's been recently clarified that they find it easier to review an uploaded package
<ajmitch> the policy was never very clear on the order of things
<ari-tczew> ajmitch: interested in uploading to -proposed?
<ari-tczew> :>
<jdong> ari-tczew: right, as ajmitch said, I anounced a bit ago on -devel that after the SRU teams merged, it's now preferable to upload into the queue first, then review
<ajmitch> ari-tczew: possibly, if someone else doesn't jump on it first :)
<ari-tczew> ajmitch: you don't think which it's a simple!
<ari-tczew> bug 464175
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 464175 in skyeye (Ubuntu Karmic) "[SRU] Broken shared library dependency for skyeye in Karmic and Lucid" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/464175
<ajmitch> ari-tczew: sorry?
<ari-tczew> ajmitch: ehkm, it's very simple SRU :) sorry for lack english
<ajmitch> np :)
 * ajmitch was about to ask where the debdiff was, until I saw the branches
<Quintasan> Anyone knows if persia is on holidays or something?
 * ari-tczew is looking also for persia
<ajmitch> anyone else, feel free to grab that sru as well for sponsoring :)
<bdrung> ajmitch: ping me once i have updated vlc and sponsored the sync requests. :)
<pindonga> fabrice_sp, ajmitch , in case I don't get news word from Chipaca in the next 15 minutes, I will tell him to let you know when configglue reached maverick, so you can finish the review on django-configglue, ok?
<ajmitch> pindonga: ok
<pindonga> in case everything is ok, is there anything else on my side I should do?
<ajmitch> at this point now
<ajmitch> s/now/no/
<fabrice_sp> pindonga, it's bed time for me. Sorry I'll check tomorrow morning
 * ajmitch just needs to get time to sit down & look over it properly :)
<ajmitch> it's only 9AM here, so I have a little bit of time
 * fabrice_sp just needs to sleep :-)
<pindonga> fabrice_sp, isn't today the deadline for maverick?
<pindonga> if we still have time, I don't mind waiting a few days
<pindonga> ok, Chipaca just told me configglue should be in maverick now
<pindonga> just in time :)
<fabrice_sp> If I remember correctly other cycles, freeze will happen tomorro morning
<ajmitch> ok, I'll grab it (I need to stick 0.9 in debian anyway)
<ajmitch> pindonga: is there any easy way to test django-configglue? :)
<pindonga> ajmitch, once installed not really, as we are not including the test project in the deb file
<pindonga> but if you grab the branch (or the source tar file)
<ajmitch> is the test project public?
<pindonga> yes
<ajmitch> ok, that's good
<pindonga> in the source tar file you should have the test project and a readme file on how to run the tests
<ajmitch> just fetching now
<fabrice_sp> pindonga, otherwise, you can find another sponsor. I really have to go now. Sorry
<pindonga> fabrice_sp, ok, np. thanks
<fabrice_sp> bye
<ajmitch> pindonga: OK, I'll try & get this checked over in the next couple of hours - I've got a little bit of other stuff i need to do this morning as well :)
<pindonga> ajmitch, I appreciate it
<pindonga> do you think there is still time for it to get into maverick (assuming everything is ok)?
<ajmitch> should be
<pindonga> if you think there is a risk of it not getting included because another reviewer is required, would you mind requesting someone to look at it in addition to you?
<ajmitch> otherwise freeze exceptions will be granted fairly readily if there's a good reason
<pindonga> as I have to leave now, and won't be back for a couple of hours
<pindonga> ajmitch, ok, thanks a lot
<pindonga> I'll talk to you when I get back, or tomorrow
<ajmitch> ok
 * ajmitch really needs to get that dpkg backport tested & installed soon :)
<jdong> there are days where I feel like my official job title is "coaster maker"
<jdong> I hate optical drives
 * micahg had that job for a while :)
 * ajmitch wishes he could upgrade X
 * Laney did earlier
<shane2peru> I'm trying to help package a python app, It is all in the directory, and I created the deb with this: sudo dpkg-deb -b directory name.deb and it worked well, however the dev wants to be able to put files in the /home/$USER/app directory, how is this done?
 * Laney dare not reboot
<ajmitch> Laney: virtualbox-ose is holding me back
<ajmitch> shane2peru: packages should never put files into home directories on installation
<ajmitch> the app can place files there when run, but packages cannot
<shane2peru> ajmitch, ok, this is a Bible application, with the ability to install other Bibles, or user material, like Sword does with .sword in the user directory, what is the proper way to do this?
<ajmitch> the app should have a shared directory & per-user data directories
<ajmitch> iirc sword would store bibles in /usr/share/sword or similar
<shane2peru> ajmitch, so it would be better if the Bibles, and or user data were in /usr/share/bibleanalyzer then
<shane2peru> it is a Bible app that is written in Python on windows, and is ported to Linux (specifically Ubuntu) but the dev is  in need of some help from a Linux guy, that is where I come in
<ajmitch> yes, it would be better
<ajmitch> also, you should never need to be using dpkg-deb to put together a binary package :)
<bdrung> RainCT: ping
<shane2peru> it is really odd to me, because there is no compiling necessary, I'm compiled apps, and that seems less odd to me then building a deb from a folder
<RainCT> hi bdrung
<shane2peru> ajmitch, ok, obviously I'm spilling out all my complete ignorance of this, what is the proper way to build a deb for a python app, and distribute it?
<ajmitch> you need to make a source package which has the standard files (control, changelog, rules, etc) in a debian/ directory
<ajmitch> the packaging guide has some good examples
<ajmitch> if I can recall the URL :)
<ajmitch> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Complete
<shane2peru> the dev didn't have a 64bit deb, so I started tinkering around, edited his control file to get the deb so that it would install on 64bit, because it is python, with no compiling, I don't know if it need to be architecture specific
<Laney> it's best to get the *source* package and modify that
<ajmitch> python packages like that should be created as architecture: all
<RainCT> bdrung: what's up?
 * bdrung shouldn't do too many thinks in parallel...
<paultag> lfaraone: I have my stuff working. Should I email you again ( this is more of a ping then anything else ;) )
<bdrung> RainCT: suspicious-source  license.
<shane2peru> well, I don't know how he built his deb, but I extracted it and it was folders with the control files etc, I edited it to read all, and re-built the deb, which installed with no complaints on my 64bit setup
<shane2peru> I also installed it on a 32bit setup, and it didn't complain
<ajmitch> you extracted the binary package, no doubt
<shane2peru> ajmitch, thanks for the link, I will read that, as I want to learn this to help him get his app out to Ubuntu,
<bdrung> RainCT: do you allow relicensing the man page for it under the isc license?
<shane2peru> right, I just right clicked the deb, and extracted, never done that before, apparently cli is ar or something of that, I'm not familiar with that.
<paultag>  shane2peru ar x file.deb
<RainCT> bdrung: Ah. Sure.
<paultag> shane2peru: it's the old unix archive tool, and it was common at the time :)
<shane2peru> paultag, right, I read that somewhere online.
<paultag> shane2peru: in my younger years, I tried building a deb that way
<paultag> it's hard
<shane2peru> paultag, oh, with ar you mean, yeah, I could imagine.
<shane2peru> one last question, with python type apps, you don't have to make configure and compile, is that correct?
<shane2peru> actually it is wxpython
<bdrung> RainCT: thanks. current change: http://pastebin.com/enCnWpbL the AUTHORS section is a little bit rough.
<ajmitch> shane2peru: correct, they often have setup.py though
<paultag> shane2peru: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Complete
<paultag> Oh shoot!
<shane2peru> ajmitch, that is so odd for me, so then building a deb from the folders is the proper way to do that with python apps then?
<paultag> That was going to be the python one
<bdrung> RainCT: i failed to not mention my name twice
<shane2peru> paultag, ohh, if there is a python specific link, I would love that!  Because seems as though they are not the same.
<paultag> shane2peru: yeah, let me find it, I just lost it
<ajmitch> shane2peru: you use tools like 'debuild' to build it from a source package, not using dpkg-deb
<RainCT> bdrung: Heh.  Â«\fBsuspicious\-source\fP have been written byÂ» -> Â«has beenÂ».  You may just remove my name from the manpage if you want.
<paultag> shane2peru: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Python
<shane2peru> ajmitch, ok, thanks!!!  I will do some research on debuild later, I only ever used checkinstall before, and I don't think I can use that with a folder
<shane2peru> paultag, thanks!!!
<paultag> Sure, that guide is pretty complete
<shane2peru> wonderfull!  Thanks guys, I'm sure I'll be back
<bdrung> RainCT: is that really ok for you?
<neeraj> I have requested sync of some packages which now I have found that will not work in maverick.
<bdrung> neeraj: fix them ;)
<neeraj> what will be the proper procedure for closing the bug
<neeraj> bdrung, we have upgraded versions of those packages which will work :)
<RainCT> bdrung: Yeah. What's left there, 5 lines? I can live with not getting mentioned for that ;)
<bdrung> neeraj: are the not working version already synced?
<neeraj> no, i filed a request today only
<bdrung> RainCT: ~8 lines ;)
<bdrung> neeraj: mark them as invalid and give a short reason for marking them invalid
<bdrung> neeraj: which one are they? i am currently processing sync requests
<neeraj> bdrung, Ok.  thanks :)
<bdrung> neeraj: i just uploaded sugar-write-activity-0.86_70-1
<neeraj> sugar-chat-activity-0.84
<neeraj> bdrung,  LP Bug#616462
<bdrung> neeraj: all other sync request of you are unaffected?
<neeraj> bdrung, no. LP#616444 and Bug #616465 too.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 616465 in Ubuntu "Sync sugar-read-activity-0.84 69-4 (universe) from Debian unstable (main) (dup-of: 616444)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/616465
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 616444 in Ubuntu "Sync sugar-read-activity-0.84 69-4 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/616444
<neeraj> bdrung, rest are working properly to my best knowledge.
<RainCT> bdrung: Oh, I've just seen you 'stole' my merge. Thanks :)              (manpages-de)
<directhex> DktrKranz, is there any planned slowdown in debian NEW alongside the freeze?
<ajmitch> apart from ftpmasters recovering from debconf? :)
<bdrung> RainCT: :)
<directhex> ajmitch, i don't know how many of them were at debconf. i make no assumptions of slacking, i merely ask if there's a plan to do other things in the short term
<bdrung> RainCT: can i exchange it for vim?
<norax> Hi
<norax> If there is someone over there, just a question: Someone told me that when you submit a patch to launchpad you should subscribe to Ubuntu-Universe-Sponsors. Now it seems that this group is depreciated. Any alternative?
<ScottK> norax: ubuntu-sponsors
<norax> thank ScottK
<micahg> hmm...I thought patches go through reviews and debdiffs go through sponsors
<norax> well, I have submit a debdiff, but what is the difference?
<micahg> norax: yeah, sponsors then, patches that are suggestions for fixing usually go through reviews that will attempt to upstream and make sure it works
<micahg> debdiffs as tested fixes go through sponsors AFAIK
<norax> hmmm, don't know. When I submit a patch, I create a debdiff and test it in my computer. I do not create a patch so other people can test and later create a debdiff to submit. I mean maybe I should subscribe just to reviews, and wait that it is tested from other people and later subscribe sponsors.
#ubuntu-motu 2010-08-12
<micahg> norax: so then you just need -sponsors :)
<micahg> SpamapS: what do you think of pulling in mongodb 1.6 in maverick?
<SpamapS> micahg: heh, we have what, 24 hours to get 'er done? Why not!
<micahg> SpamapS: k, I'll see if I get to it later :)
<SpamapS> micahg: as of the last merge, the only delta was the upstart file
<SpamapS> micahg: oh hah, I see.. 1.6 just hit unstable
<micahg> SpamapS: cool, it's already in debian, so we'll see if it'll be easy
<SpamapS> micahg: https://launchpad.net/debian/+source/mongodb .. gets a lot easier once 1.6 shows up there
<micahg> SpamapS: since I"m rushing, I won't be using UDD
<lifeless> SpamapS: btw
<micahg> will try to use it more next cycle
<lifeless> SpamapS: are you on the launchpad-dev list ?
<SpamapS> lifeless: I'm not, but I've been meaning to join. :)
<lifeless> please do
<lifeless> https://edge.launchpad.net/~launchpad-dev
<micahg> yeah, you get cryptic messages in foreign languages :)
<lifeless> SpamapS: I was thinking of you when I wrote https://lists.launchpad.net/launchpad-dev/msg04228.html
<SpamapS> si? idiomas que no son ingles? bueno.
<SpamapS> lifeless: measurement just makes the world seem less scary. :)
<SpamapS> lifeless: great report! definitely gives an idea of which pages are being the most naughty.
<SpamapS> ok I have to run.. will digest it more later.. :)
<highvoltage> SpamapS: your nick sends me in an infinite loop!
<pindonga> hi again, ajmitch , did you manage to get a look at django-configglue?
<ajmitch> pindonga: yes, it's awaiting an archive admin now
<pindonga> cool. so it passed initial review? whom shall I bother now?
<ajmitch> I'd say look at the queue, but it just timed out for me
<ajmitch> it's best not to bug archive admins about stuff in general
<ajmitch> it's been uploaded, they'll most likely get to the backlog soon
<ajmitch> freeze time is very busy for them, as you can imagine :)
<pindonga> yes, so basically now we sit and wait? and it should get archived into maverick? that's awesome!!
<ajmitch> yes
<pindonga> ajmitch, thanks so much... it was a lot of effort, and you made it worth :)
<pindonga> thanks
<ajmitch> np
<pindonga> where can I see the queue? just in case I get too anxious
<ajmitch> https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/maverick/+queue
<pindonga> cool, I'll sit and wait now
<pindonga> happy hacking :)
<nigelb> 25
<ajmitch> 16?
<nigelb> dangers of using irssi :/
<nigelb> ajmitch: 42!
<micahg> I've got a weird problem with source format 3 not applying patches when I run debuild -b, am I doing something wrong?
<ajmitch> probably :)
<ajmitch> debian/patches/series ?
<ajmitch> actually, is the problem that you're doing -b? since the patch applying is done prior to that, I think
<paultag> not using pbuilder is doing something wrong ;)
<paultag> +1 ajmitch
<paultag> dpkg-sourcec does it
<paultag> dpkg-source *
<paultag> at least according to my last build logs
<paultag> dpkg-source: info: applying fix-xterm-keybinding.patch
<micahg> ajmitch: weird, it's worked fine in tehe past
<micahg> paultag: I use pbulder to test once it works :)
<paultag> micahg: looks like it's patching ( i use source 3 ) via dpkg-source. Were you using source3 before?
<paultag> micahg: it could be that your rules file called depatch
<micahg> paultag: it's a merge between source format 1 and 3
<paultag> micahg: were you using quilt before?
<micahg> paultag: yes
<paultag> micahg: were you patching in the rules file or was it handling it on it's own?
<micahg> on its own
<paultag> micahg: did you take ajmitch's advice and check debian/patches/series ?
<micahg> it's fine
<paultag> micahg: could you try a pbuild, perhaps?
<micahg> it'll probably work...
<micahg> but the build is broke
<micahg> so I need interactive
<paultag> micahg: it really looks like it's dpkg-source that does it
<paultag> micahg: and dpkg-source is also a debsrc3 thing iirc
<paultag> micahg: so it might be due to a migration from format 1 to 3
<micahg> k, I'll get back to that in a minute, I'm trying to do about 5 uploads tonight, so we'll see what actually gets done
<paultag> sure :)
<lfaraone> Is the Feature Freeze now in effect?
<paultag> lfaraone: not yet, in a few days
<paultag> lfaraone: deb is frozen ( as you know ;) )
 * micahg hopes not
<micahg> should be sometime today/tomorrow
<lfaraone> micahg: mk. is pyxpcom anywhere near shippable? :)
<micahg> lfaraone: no, chrisccoulson took that over
 * ajmitch saw python-xpcom uploaded to debian as a separate source
<micahg> lfaraone: try him in the morning
<ajmitch> he was around about 40 minutes ago, might still be
<micahg> we can still get it in before beta if it's feasible and ubuntu-release is nice to us :)
<ajmitch> what's left to fix up on it?
<micahg> ajmitch: idk, he started packaging it, but there are questions about viability
<micahg> last commit was 6 months ago
<ajmitch> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=591894 fwiw
<ubottu> Debian bug 591894 in wnpp "ITP: pyxpcom -- XPCOM bindings for Python" [Wishlist,Open]
<micahg> is a patch target no longer needed in source format 3?
<ajmitch> wow, it really hasn't had many commits in the last year
<paultag> OK. I'm off for the night. lfaraone I sent you an email, I got flux to behave. I'd really be indebted to you if you got to it sometime
<paultag> Night!
<lfaraone> paultag: will do.
<micahg> oh, debian's trying for it too
 * micahg subscribed
<MTecknology> The other channels seem kinda dead so I hope nobody minds me asking here too...
<MTecknology> In my init script - I have a little thing in there that makes sure nobody accidentally stops something for every user - but that catches when the system shuts down. Is there any way to see if the system is shutting down from inside of the script?
<LucidFox> heh "Currently building on crabapple (armel)"
<LucidFox> I read that as "crappable"
<MTecknology> LucidFox: your first line - I did too :P
<micahg> hi simar
<simar> micahg: Hi :)
<simar> micahg: i am in ubuntu bug control now :)
<micahg> simar: I saw congrats
<simar> micahg: ya, a lot of..
<simar> micahg: I found that I should focus on papercuts as fas as ubuntu packaging is concerned, rather than FTBFS, what do you say?
<micahg> simar: up to you
<simar> micahg: I think papercuts will make my entry more smooth :__|
 * micahg hates packages that run configure to build a source package
<SpamapS> micahg: dh_autoreconf / dh_autoreconf_clean
<micahg> SpamapS: thanks :)
<SpamapS> micahg: oh wait, I think I misread that..
<SpamapS> configure or autogen.sh ?
<micahg> SpamapS: mongo db is failing because of mozjs now
<SpamapS> micahg: right I was reading that bug report
<SpamapS> micahg: I'm ready to test if you need a tester. :)
 * micahg needs to figure out how scons works
<micahg> I guess this one bites the dust too
<SpamapS> micahg: I think this is my fault.. the merge probably was done wrong. :-/
<SpamapS> isn't libmozjs what xulrunner replaces?
<micahg> heh, don't worry about it, yeah, but it's not in /usr/liib like in debian
<micahg> my happy packaging night is turning sad :(
<SpamapS> actually I remember now where Mathias fixed that.
<SpamapS> $ LD_LIBRARY_PATH=/usr/lib/xulrunner-1.9.2.3 mongos
<SpamapS> error: no args for --configdb
<micahg> SpamapS: I get it during build
<SpamapS> micahg: is it as simple as providing a wrapper script and dumping the actual binaries in /usr/lib/mongodb?
<micahg> SpamapS: first I want it to build :)
<micahg> it might be, idk
<SpamapS> micahg: 1.6 won't build, or 1.4?
<SpamapS> I'm building 1.4 now, ugh.. I forgot how painful this build is
<ajmitch> yay for weird build systems?
<micahg> SpamapS: trying 1.6
<SpamapS> Its not weird, its just giant
<micahg> SpamapS: no, it's weird
<SpamapS> ajmitch: C++ might qualify as weird actually. ;)
<SpamapS> isn't libtool supposed to embed the full path to the depended on lib?
<micahg> SpamapS: the path changes with each xulrunner release
 * micahg thinks maybe to try mediatomb again
<SpamapS> why, exactly, aren't we dumping an ABI compaible libmozjs.so.1.9.2 in /usr/lib ?
<micahg> SpamapS: because it's not guaranteed to stay compatible for 1.9.2
<micahg> and we don't want people using it until mozilla commits to providing it
<SpamapS> Ah lovely
<SpamapS> ugh building this on my lap is proving to be a burn hazard
<SpamapS> but at least its killing my battery so I can justify going to sleep earlier
<SpamapS> linking.. running tests.. ok 1.4 builds fine
<SpamapS> 10395 clint     20   0 49304  29m 2720 R 11.7  2.9   0:00.36 /usr/lib/gcc/x86_64-linux-gnu/4.4.4/cc1plus -quiet -I/usr/include/nspr -I/usr/include/xulrunner-1.9.2.3/stable -I/usr/include/xulrunner-1.9.2
<micahg> SpamapS: maybe I should just merge 1.4.4-3 and be done with it then
<SpamapS> I just love C++
<micahg> SpamapS: wrong path :P
<micahg> or your system isn't up to daye
<micahg> *date
<SpamapS> oh wait, thats reasonable.. 1 second before copying that, it was 385m not 29m
<SpamapS> micahg: 1.9.2.3 is old? s***
<micahg> 1.9.2.8 is current
<SpamapS> I have been updating my pbuilder but not my system.
<SpamapS> well rebuilding w/ 1.9.2.3 did fix mongos when 1.9.2.3 is installed... :-P
<SpamapS> micahg: seems like we need to be manually setting the depends on xulrunner to be (==1.9.2.8) on build
<micahg> well, gjs does that ATM, we're trying to move away from that
<DktrKranz> directhex: there is, for binary-NEW packages, we're waiting for RT input before accepting those, source NEWs pass regularly (holiday in progress, though)
<directhex> DktrKranz, is it maintainer responsibility to check with RT and hand over that feedback, or does that happen in the background directly between you? my understanding is the RT is okay with meebey's plan regarding mono 2.6.7, but i don't know if that's been communicated to the ftp team
<DktrKranz> directhex: I created a page to help them track bin-NEWs, I think I can accept any exp package, but if someone say "please go", I'm even happier :)
 * DktrKranz doesn't want to break freeze with a simple "A" pressure :P
<ajmitch> DktrKranz: do it! :)
<ajmitch> noone will mind...
<SpamapS> micahg: so really we just need to file a "needs noop rebuild" bug for all of xulrunner-1.9.2's rdepends, whenever we upload a new version?
<directhex> DktrKranz, 2.6.7-1 is an exp package, and i kinda badly want to merge it into ubuntu. i believe there's clearance for -2 into unstable->squeeze a week later, but i wasn't involved in the discussion so can't present any evidence
<micahg> SpamapS: well, just a couple at the moment, most of them have wrappers
<DktrKranz> directhex: I saw meebey raised the topic in #d-release, I'll drop a sentence me too
<SpamapS> micahg: so wrap mongod/mongos and all is well?
<SpamapS> micahg: (I think this is happening in lucid too, so will be looking at doing an SRU this week)
<micahg> SpamapS: yeah, no source rebuild should work for lucid, wrapper might work, needs to be tested
<SpamapS> micahg: works for me to set LD_LIBRARY_PATH properly
<micahg> SpamapS: in a wrapper?
<SpamapS> micahg: well, in /etc/init/mongodb.conf and/or on my own via the cmdline
<SpamapS> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mongodb/+bug/557024/comments/10
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 557024 in mongodb (Ubuntu) "mongo / mongod as packaged can't load libmozjs.so" [High,Triaged]
<micahg> you should do xulrunner-1.9.2 --gre-version
<SpamapS> ah
<SpamapS> well, need to sleep, feel free to correct me w/ another comment. ;)
<dholbach> good morning
<huats> morning
<Quintasan> https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=626593
<ubottu> Gnome bug 626593 in User Guide "Gnome ate my boyfriend! Help!" [Critical,Resolved: invalid]
<Quintasan> good morning by the way
<bilalakhtar> I'm facing a dilemma over here. Should I sync or merge? Just a minute, I explain the situation
<bilalakhtar> The only ubuntu change is that the python version everywhere is changed to 2.6 from 2.5
<bilalakhtar> ^^ including debian/rules
<bilalakhtar> debian has accepted the changes, except the one-line change in debian/rules
<bilalakhtar> What should I do?
<directhex> bilalakhtar, talk to the ubuntu python team
<bilalakhtar> directhex: fine
<AnAnt> Hello
<bilalakhtar> AnAnt: Assalam alaikum
<AnAnt> bilalakhtar: wa alaykom as-salamu wa rahmatu Ullahi wa barakatoh
<tumbleweed> bilalakhtar: there isn't only one way to fix a bug in a package. Is the Debian version broken?
<bilalakhtar> AnAnt: lp is down, once its up I need you for some acking.
<bilalakhtar> tumbleweed: I don't think so
<tumbleweed> bilalakhtar: most of the python2.6 compatibility fixes in Ubuntu were non-optimal (or even horrifically ugly)
<tumbleweed> bilalakhtar: then sync
<bilalakhtar> tumbleweed: I think syncing is better
<bilalakhtar> tumbleweed: yup
<AnAnt> bilalakhtar: LP is working here
 * bilalakhtar checks lp
<bilalakhtar> AnAnt: It is read-only
<AnAnt> oh
<bilalakhtar> That's akin to be down
<bilalakhtar> According to the schedule, It should be up in 5 mins
<bilalakhtar> LP IS UP!
<bilalakhtar> AnAnt: bug #616655
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 616655 in grig (Ubuntu) "Please sync grig 0.7.2-4 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/616655
<tumbleweed> bilalakhtar: that doesn't look like it came from requestsync
<bilalakhtar> tumbleweed: requestsync is failing
<bilalakhtar> tumbleweed: I got 2 failure messages from some *.ubuntu.com server
<bilalakhtar> tumbleweed: so I filed one manually
<bilalakhtar> tumbleweed: sorry I had to dash a description
<bilalakhtar> tumbleweed: I will re-qrite it after 10 mins
<bilalakhtar> *re-write
<AnAnt> tumbleweed: what failures ? SMTP ?
<AnAnt> bilalakhtar: ^
<bilalakhtar> AnAnt: no, some 'Cannot connect to launchpad' issue
<AnAnt> ah
<bilalakhtar> AnAnt: it still comes
<bilalakhtar> AnAnt: LP isn't up completely
 * abogani waves
<abogani> Anyone could pinpoint me how configure dput for working behind a proxy?
<bilalakhtar> tumbleweed: Why did you assign that bug to yourself?
<tumbleweed> abogani: can you ssh? then use sftp mode
<tumbleweed> bilalakhtar: that's ack-sync
<bilalakhtar> tumbleweed: But, This is the first time I saw a sponsor assigning instead of acking
<AnAnt> tumbleweed: so, you're going to upload it?
<bilalakhtar> tumbleweed: you're gonna upload?
<bilalakhtar> aha
<bilalakhtar> got it
<tumbleweed> AnAnt: I can answer that in 20 secodns
<bilalakhtar> thanks tumbleweed and AnAnt
<tumbleweed> AnAnt: yes
<AnAnt> ok
<bilalakhtar> tumbleweed: it appears requestsync finally worked. bug #616662. please mark dup
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 616662 in grig (Ubuntu) "Sync grig 0.7.2-4 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/616662
<bilalakhtar> why did I get failure messages then?
<abogani> tumbleweed: Ah! Thanks!
<bilalakhtar> tumbleweed: Thanks!
<AnAnt> tumbleweed: does sftp work with ubuntu , revu & PPA ?
<bilalakhtar> AnAnt: only PPA
<AnAnt> ok
<bilalakhtar> tumbleweed: free? Another sync: bug #616676
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 616676 in mirage (Ubuntu) "Sync mirage 0.9.3-5.1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/616676
<tumbleweed> bilalakhtar, AnAnt: I thought it worked for upload.ubuntu.com too?
<jpds> It works with ubuntu.
<bilalakhtar> tumbleweed: probably, I don't know, I am not MOTU
<bilalakhtar> BRB
<tumbleweed> except I do most of my sponsoring on debian, where dput doesn't support sftp...
<directhex> DktrKranz, can you please let mono 2.6.7-1 into exp, for ubuntu's sake? we can worry about uploading to unstable and release team fiddling at a later date
<AnAnt> Hello, could someone comment on 616685 ?
<AnAnt> LP #616685
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 616685 in nginx (Ubuntu) "Please merge nginx 0.7.67-3 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/616685
<tumbleweed> AnAnt: doing so
<AnAnt> tumbleweed: thanks
<AnAnt> tumbleweed: I don't understand
<AnAnt> tumbleweed: those errors are not in the Debian package
<tumbleweed> AnAnt: oh I missed that, fix it
<tumbleweed> AnAnt: that reminds me of how apache used to install it's default index.html but I don't know the details of the changes there...
<AnAnt> the changelog is misleading too
<AnAnt> tumbleweed: this has been there since karmic
<kaushal> is java6 update 20 ported to hardy ?
<tumbleweed> AnAnt: the lintian warning seems pretty reasonable
<AnAnt> tumbleweed: can you suggest a fix/workaround ?
<tumbleweed> AnAnt: you can look at apache2.2-common's default-site installation method, as this was inspired by apache2.2-common's old method
<DktrKranz> directhex: will do
<SpamapS> micahg: did you give up on mongodb 1.6 for now?
<tumbleweed> AnAnt: basically, don't have the deb install stuff there, but if there's nothing there (fresh install) or old default site, you can copy a default site in
<DktrKranz> directhex: I sent a last-notice, it seems transition was discussed on IRC only, so it will take a while to upload to unstable anyway
<SpamapS> AnAnt: I'd agree with tumbleweed.. it can be very simple. cp -n /usr/share/doc/nginx/examples/nginx-default/* /var/www
<SpamapS> AnAnt: done in a postinst maintainer script that would not clobber any existing files at least.
<directhex> DktrKranz, thanks luca
<kaushal> Any clue to my query ?
<AnAnt> kaushal: $ rmadison sun-java6-jre
<AnAnt> sun-java6-jre | 6.20dlj-0ubuntu1.8.04.1 | hardy-security/multiverse | all
<AnAnt> sun-java6-jre | 6.20dlj-0ubuntu1.8.04.1 | hardy-updates/multiverse | all
<AnAnt> I dunno if that is what you ask for or not?
<pindonga> AnAnt, tumbleweed, I wanted to thank you for your help yesterday reviewing django-configglue
<tumbleweed> pindonga: np
<AnAnt> pindonga: no problem
<DktrKranz> directhex: accepted
<directhex> DktrKranz, awesomes!
<sebner> DktrKranz: awesome! \o/  :P
<DktrKranz> directhex: sebner bribed me :)
 * sebner hides
<shadeslayer> can anyone complete the sponsorship process at summit.ubuntu.com ?
<jpds> shadeslayer: Yes.
<shadeslayer> i cant :(
<jpds> Explain.
<shadeslayer> waiting for like 15 mins and it still is at http://summit.ubuntu.com/openid/login/?next=/uds-n/sponsorship/done/
<shadeslayer> ^ isnt loading
<jpds> shadeslayer: Talk to jcastro.
<shadeslayer> jcastro: poke poke
<shadeslayer> i cant complete the sponsorship process, its on a endless load loop :P
<shadeslayer> Waiting for summit.ubuntu.com -> waiting for login.launchpad.net -> waiting for summit.ubuntu.com
<shadeslayer> also... it seems the process is complete as such because i get : You've already requested sponsorship to uds-n. If you have any queries about your request, please e-mail jorge@ubuntu.com. We'll let you know whether or not your request has been accepted after March 26th
<shadeslayer> that date needs fixoring :P
<directhex> there's an uds-n? :o
<directhex> orlando..... i'm taking my family holiday there next summer. the wife would kill me
<directhex> i'll wait for Outrageous Ocelot
<shadeslayer> directhex: hehe :P
<shadeslayer> this is probably my first and last chance of attending UDS :P
<AnAnt> DktrKranz: I don't understand, why do you need to ask before uploading to experimental ?
<AnAnt> how many hours till freeze ?
<DktrKranz> AnAnt: overrides are shared between experimental and unstable, so it could happen that a subsequent upload lands in unstable without any barrier, triggering an unplanned transition. Worst case is *deliberately* doing that, but we hope it's a corner case.
<DktrKranz> and even if testing is frozen, it doesn't mean new troubles can't arise
 * DktrKranz is too picky at times :)
<directhex> well, aba gave you an ack for mono anyway ;)
<AnAnt> DktrKranz: I don't understand
<AnAnt> DktrKranz: how could a subsequent upload land in unstable ?
<shadeslayer> hi anyone around to help me package a mozilla plugin ?
<AnAnt> shadeslayer: I'm sure -mozillateam would be useful
<shadeslayer> AnAnt: im there ... but its pretty dead
<AnAnt> I see
<DktrKranz> AnAnt: you just have to target an upload to unstable, and it will be accepted.
<micahg> SpamapS: yes, for the moment
* ScottK changed the topic of #ubuntu-motu to: Maverick Feature Freeze in effect - Fix bugs | Want to get involved with the MOTU? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing | Sponsor queue: http://is.gd/2y76G | http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/ftbfs | http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/NBS | http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/bugs/rcbugs/ | latest rebuild failures: http://udd.debian.org/cgi-bin/ubuntu_ftbfs.cgi
<juli_> hi everybody! Give me advice plz. I want to upload an update for  a package before FF but the library it relies on is still in NEW queue.  I built this package in pbuilder using local deb. Is is ok to upload it or I should ask for FFE?
<lfaraone> juli_: if FF is not in effect, sure, uplaod it, and it'll  just be in depwait
<sistpoty|work> *cough*, pointing at topic :P
<sistpoty|work> juli_: source or binary new?
<juli_> sistpoty|work, new upstream release
<sistpoty|work> juli_: sorry, meant the package that's needed as build-dep
<juli_> sistpoty|work, binary
<sistpoty|work> juli_: ok, then please make sure that it won't break things and upload (as it'll sit in dep-wait then as lfaraone explained)
<lfaraone> juli_: you're a few minutes late :)
<juli_> sistpoty|work, thanks! I'll upload soon.
<juli_> and for the future - is there an exact time when FF happens?
<sistpoty|work> juli_: the date should be always described at the release schedule (wiki.ubuntu.com/<dist>ReleaseSchedule).
<juli_> sistpoty|work, I know thw date, but exact time?
<sistpoty|work> juli_: well, once the announcement is sent :P
<juli_> sistpoty|work, :))) it is not easy to be in time if you don't know it:)
<sistpoty|work> juli_: sure it is, just make sure to land new features a day earlier then :P
<juli_> sistpoty|work, I'm trying but too many dependencies:(( I should wait for approvals on REVU and in NQ
<sistpoty|work> heh
<juli_> sistpoty|work, anyway thank you for help!
<sistpoty|work> yw
<didrocks> hyperair: trying to avoid duplicated work, do you plan to update banshee this week?
<directhex> something bansheeish went into RFS earlier today
<directhex> <CIA-6> debian-pkg-cli-apps: hyperair pristine-tar * rf1951ad banshee/ (banshee_1.7.4.orig.tar.gz.delta banshee_1.7.4.orig.tar.gz.id): pristine-tar data for banshee_1.7.4.orig.tar.gz
<directhex> so that'll be in debian as soon as a DD uploads it there
<didrocks> directhex: oh awesome! thanks for the info :)
<didrocks> I know hyperair is quick at that :-)
<SpamapS> micahg: ok, I'm adding wrappers to 1.4
<micahg> SpamapS: k, if I finish my other stuff, I might come back to trying to get 1.6 in maverick, but feel free to do it
<micahg> SpamapS: after getting an FFe of course ;)
<micahg> SpamapS: BTW, I can sponsor that for you :)
<SpamapS> micahg: mongodb is one of those things where each release fixes so much, its probably worthwhile to apply for FFe for 1.6, though I haven't looked through the changelog.
 * micahg was more concerned for security, but apparently there are no CVEs
<hyperair> didrocks: yeah i'll be doing the merge as well, unless you want to handle it?
<didrocks> hyperair: if you want to handle the merge, do not hesitate. I have a lot on my plate right now :)
<hyperair> didrocks: sure.
<didrocks> hyperair: thanks a lot :-)
<hyperair> np =)
<hyperair> thanks for your netbook on banshee =)
<didrocks> hyperair: heh, my pleasure ;)
<didrocks> hyperair: so, no more hal dep, right? \o/
<hyperair> eh? O_o
<hyperair> are we ready for that?
<didrocks> hyperair: hum, the udev branch should have been in this release, I didn't check
<hyperair> i didn't detect anything from *.m4
<hyperair> or configure.ac
<didrocks> ahâ¦ maybe false alarm so. I'll check with them (not now, but tomorrow)
<Laney> I don't think it got merged
<hyperair> yeah i don't think it did.
<hyperair> lool: regarding your upload to banshee.. did you mean to purge the entire /usr/share/mime, or did you mean to leave /usr/share/mime/packages behind?
<hyperair> nevermind, the changelog entry seems to answer the question
<SpamapS> micahg: ugh, I just read through the reasons why libmozjs.so isn't in /usr/lib. What a crock.. "we can't provide a stable release because we have to change things too fast"
<micahg> SpamapS: well, its their choice
<SpamapS> micahg: has anybody considered forking spidermonkey to provide a stable lib?
<SpamapS> Seems like it wouldn't be too hard to simply maintain a branch that imports fixes and makes sure they don't break ABI compatibility.
<micahg> SpamapS: even if they did idk if we'd take it since it's a security nightmare
<SpamapS> I mean, thats.. sort of what we do here, isn't it? ;)
<SpamapS> micahg: the alternatives aren't all that attractive though, right?
<micahg> SpamapS: idk
<SpamapS> micahg: seems incredibly silly for us not to just maintain our own stable release branch. The alternative is breaking everything that depends on it every time we roll out a release.
<SpamapS> s/breaking/potentially breaking/
<SpamapS> wrappers work, but they might not if the ABI is in fact broken
<hyperair> iirc we've got some agreement about keeping the firefox branding only if we do not deviate from upstream firefox
<micahg> SpamapS: security maintenance would be a nightmare, that's the issue
<micahg> I think...
<micahg> SpamapS: we have enough trouble getting supported stuff out the door in time :)
 * micahg points to TB3.1 not in maverick yet :-/
<SpamapS> micahg: true, mongod that won't start is definitely more secure than mongod that starts with an insecure library version. ;-)
<micahg> SpamapS: let's get a wrapper around it then so it doesn't need rebuilds
<SpamapS> micahg: right, working on that, but I guess my point is, if we can't guarantee ABI compatibility, we're just delaying the inevitible bug reports that will happen when it does get broken, instead of at least being able to know when that will happen.
<SpamapS> libmozjs.so is not a special snowflake
<SpamapS> its just an orphan needing somebody to give it a nice stable home and a hot cup of soname.
<micahg> SpamapS: that works with upstream support, we don't have it, Debian's trying anyway, bbiab
<Laibsch1> Hi, is this the right place to ask about a sync request? -> bug 605774
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 605774 in Ubuntu "Please sync mozc 0.12.410.102-1 (universe) from Debian unstable(main)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/605774
<Laibsch> this may not be a regular sync, the package is not yet in Ubuntu
<Laibsch> it only entered unstable a few weeks ago
<fabrice_sp> Laibsch, we are past feature freeze, so you need a FFe first
<fabrice_sp> strange, the ack is one month old, and archive admin is subscribed
<fabrice_sp> but no sync happened
<shadeslayer> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/53569501/buildlog_ubuntu-lucid-i386.kdepim-runtime_4:4.5~beta2-0ubuntu1~lucid1~ppa1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz << any ideas?
<fabrice_sp> shadeslayer, ../../../migration/kmail/imapcachelocalimporter.cpp:212: error: 'class OrgKdeAkonadiMaildirSettingsInterface' has no member named 'writeConfig'
<shadeslayer> fabrice_sp: err... ok, but the same thing builds in maverick
<shadeslayer> could be that i downgraded boost to 1.40 from 1.42
<fabrice_sp> shadeslayer, where is defined OrgKdeAkadoniMaildirSettingsInterface class defined?
<fabrice_sp> doesn't seems to be linked to boost
<shadeslayer> lemme check kdepim runtime sources
<Laibsch> fabrice_sp: yes, the ACK is old.  FF happened today?
<Laibsch> I also wonder why the sync got stuck
<fabrice_sp> Laibsch, yes. I'm asking the same in ubuntu-devel
<shadeslayer> !find OrgKdeAkonadiMaildirSettingsInterface
<ubottu> Package/file OrgKdeAkonadiMaildirSettingsInterface does not exist in lucid
<shadeslayer> oh wait.. it cant search files... dang
<jpds> That would take a while.
<jpds> Keeping in mind the whole archive is about 380G.
<Laibsch> fabrice_sp: thanks.  joining the channel myself now.
<shadeslayer> yeah :P
<fabrice_sp> no answer yet (quite quiet there)
<ScottK> fabrice_sp: If the request was made prior to FF, then no FFe is needed.
<Laibsch> uff
 * Laibsch is glad
<fabrice_sp> ScottK, ok. Thanks. As more recent sync request has been processed, I was wondering if I made something wrong
<Laibsch> ScottK: I'm not sure, can you do the sync?
<Laibsch> ;-)
<ScottK> No.  Needs shell access to the archive.
<Laibsch> the people in charge are already subscribed to that ticket, right?
<Laibsch> so, there isn't really much us "mere mortals" can do, correct?
 * Laibsch is the merest of the mortals ;-)
<ScottK> Laibsch: That's correct.
<ScottK> Didn't malone used to have a link to the full history of the bug?
<ScottK> I don't see when the archive was subscribed and can't see how to find it.
<fabrice_sp> See Full Activity log at the bottom?
<fabrice_sp> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/605774/+activity
<ScottK> Thanks.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 605774 in Ubuntu "Please sync mozc 0.12.410.102-2 (universe) from Debian unstable(main)" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<ScottK> Note sure why it wouldn't have been done.
<ScottK> Mabye james_w is still doing syncs and can look?
<shadeslayer> fabrice_sp: no idea :(
<shadeslayer> cant find it in kdepim
<shadeslayer> fabrice_sp: ill build kdepim first and then kdepim-runtime
<fabrice_sp> did you do a grep -R on /usr/include ?
<shadeslayer> fabrice_sp: more like on the sources
<shadeslayer> nope... nothing there too :P
<shadeslayer> maybe i dont have the headers installed :P
<fabrice_sp> install the build dependencies, to check
<shadeslayer> brr...
<shadeslayer> will have to wait till tommorow then
<fabrice_sp> no idea. Sorry
<shadeslayer> thanks anyways
<SpamapS> Hmm.. so.. is it necessary/a good idea to add a copyright/license header to a 5 line shell script?
<SpamapS> I feel like "more explicit is always better" .. but it feels like using a jackhammer in a sand box.
 * micahg forgot to add one when I added a wrapper, but gxine has one
<micahg> SpamapS: probably a good idea I would think since it gets installed on the system
<ScottK> SpamapS: If you want it to be legally distributable, then yes.
<SpamapS> well said Scott. :)
 * micahg needs to update tuxguitar w/a liicense for the wrapper
<SpamapS> ugh
<SpamapS> accidentally cleaned out my working dir for mongodb..
 * SpamapS waits 10 minutes more for it to finish compiling
<tyarusso> Is 'cd' not available in debian/rules for some reason?  It doesn't appear to be working for me....  (The real issue being that I made a package with the 3.0 source format, and now I'm trying to modify it to build on Hardy, and quilt isn't finding its series file because it's one directory too high.)
<paultag> tyarusso, did you put it on one line?
<paultag> tyarusso, remember make sends each command out on it's own, so a cd on the line before won't work. Try an
<paultag>     cd ../ \
<Laney> there's an environment variable for that, but what? the series file should be in the same place
<paultag>     echo pwd
<tyarusso> paultag: Oooohhhhh, that would explain it.  (Make is Greek to me)
<tyarusso> paultag: Don't I need && or ; between commands then still?
<Laney> including quilt.make should set it all up for you
<paultag> tyarusso, yeah, a ;, but Laney is giving good advice as well
<tyarusso> Laney: could you expand on what you mean by that?
<Laney> tyarusso: usually adding include /usr/share/quilt/quilt.make and having clean: unpatch configure: patch is all you need
<paultag> tyarusso, and just fy(future)i -- http://paste.ubuntu.com/477073/
<tyarusso> paultag: what are the @ for?
<tyarusso> Laney: where would I put the include statement?  Just up at the top?
<paultag> tyarusso, just makes it shut up, sorry, habit :)
<Laney> yep
<tyarusso> Laney: I don't have a configure target currently, just build.  Will that work, or should I make one?
<Laney> nope, you can add it to build
<tyarusso> sweet
<Laney> whichever target you need the patches available for
<tyarusso> hey, that appears to have worked.
<tyarusso> Of course, now I get a different (unrelated) error that I thought I fixed already, but hey...
<Laney> there you go, you just learned how to add quilt to a package :)
<tyarusso> Oh, debhelper compat change.  /me looks back at the man page.
<tyarusso> yay!
<tyarusso> Of course, with the new source format you just make the patches directory and it's all magic.
<Laney> If you like that sort of thing ;)
<tyarusso> whoooo, successful pbuilder exit status
 * paultag hugs tyarusso
<paultag> tyarusso, great job :)
<tyarusso> Now to see if soyuz does it happily too.
<micahg> SpamapS: I'll have a look this evening, thanks
<SpamapS> micahg: np, thanks for the encouragement. :)
<micahg> SpamapS: np, it's good to know someone with experience with the app, I don't have any :)
<Rhonda> james_w: Thanks for the syncs. :)
<james_w> np
<SpamapS> micahg: my experience with mongodb is setting it up about a year ago to compare it to CouchDB and TokyoTyrant. :)
<micahg> SpamapS: still more than me :0
<SpamapS> micahg: I do find it odd that all of these server side apps are using javascript.
<micahg> SpamapS: usually in their admin interfaces
<SpamapS> micahg: in couchdb's case.. almost everything ends up being javascriptable.
<bdrung> has anyone a idea why audacity fails to build on maverick (but builds on lucid): http://launchpadlibrarian.net/53254262/buildlog_ubuntu-maverick-amd64.audacity_1.3.12-5_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<ajmitch> bdrung: the only obvious error I can see is /usr/bin/ld: cannot find -lhpi
<ajmitch> ah, and earlier errors, I was reading from the bottom :)
<bdrung> ajmitch: configure: error: "Your version of portaudio does not include required functions"
<ajmitch> yeah, I see that now
<bdrung> ajmitch: but it uses the portaudio version provided by upstream
<ajmitch> the --with-pa-include=../portaudio-v19/include ?
<ajmitch> that is the directory name?
 * ajmitch is waiting for the laptop to stop thrashing before checking it
<lfaraone> dyfet: idle question re bug 617026, any idea why it would only ftbfs on armel and sparc, yet work fine on all other arches?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 617026 in imageshack-uploader (Ubuntu) "ftbfs - incomplete syslog support" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/617026
<dyfet> lfaraone: yes, that seems strange to me also, is the version in ports archive different?
<lfaraone> dyfet: I don't see why it would be, I just uploaded the package unmodified to all arches in Debian...
<lfaraone> that is, I didn't do anything specific for different arches.
<lfaraone> in debian, the buildds do not  have problems with it: https://buildd.debian.org/pkg.cgi?pkg=imageshack-uploader
<dyfet> well, av_log_level doesnt seem to exist anywhere within the package itself, maybe it is an oddball dependency difference then ..I will try to verify that.
<dyfet> lfaraone: let's do this, lets change the status from new to something else...and remove sponsors from it for the moment...
<dyfet> Oh, never mind, I see you already mostly did that :)
<lfaraone> dyfet: I unsubbed sponsors because I was going to sponsor it, but it didn't make sense :)
<lfaraone> the problem, that is. I don't doubt your patch solves it.
<lfaraone> dyfet: shall I assign it back to you and set it to in-progress?
<dyfet> Yes, it may be fixing the wrong issue...that makes sense to send it back to me and set in progress.
<lfaraone> dyfet: by the way, you didn't happen to be at debconf, were you?
<dyfet> nope
<dyfet> if i had i would have been the one with the eye patch
<bdrung> ajmitch: the directory is lib-src/portaudio-v19/include
<chilicuil> good afternoon, I'm trying to upload a new debdiff to the bug #462193 , however my diff ( http://pastebin.com/dHLELxfE ) looks differente to one uploaded by the last person ( http://launchpadlibrarian.net/52823113/lp462193.debdiff ) , since it's a dump change I'd not like to upload the wrong diff, I've make it with $ bzr diff --old ../previous_copy, do you think is it ok?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 462193 in djvulibre (Ubuntu) "djvulibre-bin produces garbage in the root (/man1/*)" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/462193
<micahg> chilicuil: he added some stuff
<micahg> chilicuil: he gave you credit for what you did and made some packaging fixes
<paultag> lfaraone: howdy :) -- did you get a chance to take a look at the changes I made?
<chilicuil> micahg: I'm sorry, I dont get it, do you think the last patch ( http://pastebin.com/dHLELxfE ) is ok?, I've never worked debdiffs with bzr
<lfaraone> paultag: sorry, I didn't get a chance . I'll take a look now.
<paultag> lfaraone: sorry, if you don't have time, I don't mean to be an ass, I just know how often I forget about stuff / did partial amounts of stuff
<lfaraone> paultag: no, it just slipped lower in my inbox :)
<paultag> lfaraone: happens to me all the time :)
<lfaraone> paultag: so you opted to not go for the lower date? (not a problem, just making sure it was intentional)
<paultag> lfaraone: aye, I won't push more then once a day, I was just trying to make sure I understood what was going on ;)
<paultag> I like knowing where the "gotchas" are
<lfaraone> paultag: fyi, when you change the upstream version part you reset the debian revision to -1 :)
<lfaraone> paultag: I know what you were trying to do, so no harm :)
<paultag> lfaraone: Ah, shucks. Thanks, I should have figured that out
<lfaraone> paultag: in debian/changelog, you mangled some unicode character somehow.
<paultag> lfaraone: is it OK to leave for now?
<paultag> lfaraone: whoh, what? where?
<lfaraone> paultag: "* Fluxbox decoraciÃ³n y xmms (closes: #311669)." became "* Fluxbox decoraciÃÂ³n y xmms (closes: #311669)."
<paultag> whoh what
<lfaraone> paultag: *how* you did that is beyond me :D
<paultag> lfaraone: whoh, that's from way far back. Can I edit that safely?
<paultag> lfaraone: looks like Dmitry did that
<paultag> lfaraone: I was told never to edit old changelog entries
<lfaraone> paultag: you can modify the changelog entry. in fact, you should, because something you did mangled it :)
<paultag> o.O
<paultag> lfaraone: let me fix that
<lfaraone> paultag: I'll just fix the Ã³ when I upload, but it's usually a good idea to review the diff of your changes to catch things like this.
<paultag> lfaraone: thanks :)
<lfaraone> paultag: also, FYI, you misspelled Ubuntu: Ubuntnu. I'll fix that too.
<paultag> lfaraone: yeah, I'll have to modify my workflow to keep old builds to check against
<paultag_> My connection just died, sorry
<lfaraone> that's exciting.
<lfaraone> paultag: long time no see.
<paultag> for the love of...
<paultag> lfaraone: :)
<paultag> lfaraone: my work laptop is acting up, it barfs on my network all the time for no reason
<lfaraone> paultag: why was Denis Briand <denis@narcan.fr> removed as an uploader? I didn't see a mention of that in changelog.
<paultag> lfaraone: oh yes, he quit a few weeks back, it must have been lost when I reset my git.pault.ag repo
<paultag> lfaraone: nasty situation :(
<lfaraone> paultag: I see. Dmitry's the one whose father passed?
<paultag> lfaraone: yessir. and narcan ( Denis ) was a DM on the project, but he was really fed up with it ( he did not like working on a project "alone" ) so I have no way to get stuff uploaded :(
<paultag> lfaraone: just pushed that edit to git.debian
<paultag> erm, pushing
<lfaraone> paultag: if I had known you used git, we wouldn't have needed to use mentors :)
<paultag> lfaraone: git.debian and git.pault.ag :)
 * lfaraone uses git for almost all his packaging.
<paultag> :)
<paultag> lfaraone: flux is in collab-maint, just fyi
 * lfaraone saw.
<paultag> hey lfaraone, I was just checking old revisions, that unicode error has been in there for years
<lfaraone> paultag: interesting, diff told me it wasn't in the most recent version of the package published in debian.
<paultag> lfaraone: I just checked fd19439c9208f8cfc60c51ffd14652af4fc121f3 ( 1.1.1-3 )
<paultag> yeah and 1.1.1-1
<paultag> sorry, 2
<lfaraone> paultag: compare http://git.debian.org/?p=collab-maint/fluxbox.git;a=blob;f=debian/changelog;h=05d4fd96ce04f882e0ec362748572728f588d66a;hb=e270e7737d232a283ee18c28f6277e07ae05eb9b#l278 and http://git.debian.org/?p=collab-maint/fluxbox.git;a=blob_plain;f=fluxbox-1.1.1%2Bgit20100807.0cc08f9/debian/changelog;hb=HEAD
<paultag> lfaraone: Ahha, sorry. They both looked messed up :)
<paultag> lfaraone: You're right, I'm wrong
<lfaraone> paultag: no worries.
<lfaraone> paultag: any reason why you didn't ask madduck?
<paultag> lfaraone: he's been inactive for a long time, Dmitry left him on because they worked closely, I think he wanted to be removed
<paultag> lfaraone: I don't really like pestering people if I can help it
<paultag> ( you worked on this once 4 years back, mind doing some work on it? kthx ) ;)
<lfaraone> paultag: do you want me to collapse the changelog entries since hte last debian upload?
 * lfaraone will brb, dinner.
<paultag> lfaraone: that would be great
<paultag> lfaraone: sure, I'll be here
#ubuntu-motu 2010-08-13
 * jdong_ giggles
<jdong_> http://web.mit.edu/jdong/www/cores.png
<jdong_> g-s-m doesn't seem to be optimized for a 24-core machine
<ajmitch> aw
<ajmitch> what are you using? a sun box?
<jdong_> ajmitch: reproduction new mac pro
<ajmitch> or is this boring old x86?
<jdong_> err PREproduction
<jdong_> yeah it's just a 2x6-core nehalem westmere
<ajmitch> nice
<chrisccoulson> nice!
<jdong_> it's very shiny
<chrisccoulson> this is the sort of thing i need for building mozilla on ;)
<jdong_> and expensive.
<ajmitch> 8GB RAM, I thought you'd have more in it
<jdong_> ajmitch: working on that
<jdong_> took enough hunting around to find this machine
<jdong_> I'll have to go on a RAM hunt later
<ajmitch> given that you can buy laptops relatively cheaply with 8GB RAM
<jdong_> well it's cheap DDR3 1066 RAM in these things too
<jdong_> I just need to find 6 symmetric sticks
<ajmitch> probably a little expensive
<jdong_> ironically
<jdong_> I've got 32GB worth of FB-DIMMs under my desk
<jdong_> which must be expensive as hell
<ajmitch> heh
<jdong_> too bad it doesn't fit in these new towers
<ajmitch> so, archive rebuilds on this box? :)
<jdong_> hahaha
<jdong_> wouldn't that be awesome?
<jdong_> they're GenuineIntel 0000's at 2.66GHz
<ajmitch> as long as you have fast enough storage
<jdong_> sadly not the default config of these things
<jdong_> I need to scavenge up a few more drives too
<jdong_> it only came with 1 hitachi 640GB SATA
<jdong_> okay
<jdong_> I clearly don't have enough RAM to be make -j25'ing
<directhe`> jdong_, g-s-m from sles10 sadly doesn't do anything fancy on many-many-core systems
<ajmitch> yeah
<jdong_> directhe`: I was just doing some confidential make -j4 builds on it, and that made the lines dance around a bit
<directhe`> jdong_, iirc you don't get any lines on g-s-m in sles10. i wonder how many cores would be used by g-s-m's crummy drawing code to draw 256 lines
<jdong_> hahaha
<jdong_> it's using radeonhd too XD
<directhe`> Christian Hergert has some infinitely more lightweight & smoother graph code
<jdong_> cool
<micahg> directhe`: do you maintain a PPA of the last moonlight for Lucid?
<paultag> heyya lfaraone, any chance we could finish up before I kick off for the night?
<lfaraone> paultag: yes, I just got back from dinner.
<lfaraone> paultag: I just checked with madduck, he says he'd like to be removed from uploaders.
<paultag> lfaraone: I'll reflect the change
<paultag> lfaraone: thank you for checking, btw
<lfaraone> paultag: okay. I'd commit it directly, but I'm not sure exactly how you're doing your packaging, it doens't seem to be like any git-buildpackage setup I've seen :)
<paultag> lfaraone: I did not know there was something common? I'm just tracking the debian branch + the tar.gzs to run the builds right off the directory
<paultag> lfaraone: is that bad?
<lfaraone> paultag: well, before in e270e7737d232a283ee18c28f6277e07ae05eb9b, you could run "git-buildpackage -S" from the repository, and gbp would regenerate the tarballs from pristine-tar and handle everything nicely.
<lfaraone> paultag: http://honk.sigxcpu.org/projects/git-buildpackage/manual-html/gbp.html
<paultag> lfaraone: ach. Damn. I'll read up on these guidelines :). I have a tendency to do things the hard way
<paultag> lfaraone: changes noted in git.debian, btw
<lfaraone> paultag: hmmm. you're using multiple tarballs, which isn't supported by git-buildpackage, so I guess what you're doing is *okay*.
<paultag> lfaraone: yeah, my DD asked me to use two tarballs before I left
<paultag> lfaraone: is there a better way to do what I'm trying to do?
<lfaraone> paultag: not as far as I can tell.
<paultag> Righto
 * lfaraone is building
<paultag> lfaraone: really, thanks so much, again. This is far above what I expected
<lfaraone> paultag: happy to help
<lfaraone> paultag: by the way, what happened to your watchfile? it disapparated between versions.
<paultag> lfaraone: crud, it might have got lost when I messed up my git directory on my server
<paultag> lfaraone: Let me import it back in
<lfaraone> paultag: I'll just copy it over from your previous version for now.
<paultag> lfaraone: just did that on the git repo
<paultag> lfaraone: pushed in
<paultag> Gah, forgot to add changelog
<lfaraone> paultag: uploaded, thank you for your contribution to Debian. (and eventually Ubuntu)
<paultag> lfaraone: thank you so much for your help, you've really helped me along
 * paultag hugs lfaraone 
<paultag> lfaraone: try and make OLF, it's always fun
<lfaraone> paultag: it's been a pleasure. I'll see what I can do, re OLF.
<paultag> :)
<micahg> SpamapS: I assume you've tested the mongodb stuff?
<micahg> SpamapS: BTW, the lintian overrides don't apply in Ubuntu
<micahg> ScottK: does adding a wrapper so a package doesn't need a rebuilt for every xul update need an FFe
<micahg> I have a question about merging from debian and updating the upstream, how does that work?
<micahg> 1 changelog mentioning both?
<RAOF> micahg: Yup.
<micahg> RAOF: got it, thanks
 * micahg now has to fix a 600 line patch that failed in 12 different hunks...
<ScottK> micahg: Sounds like a bug fix to me.
<micahg> ScottK: k, thanks
<micahg> SpamapS: can I copy your license?
<SpamapS> micahg: yes of course. :)
<micahg> SpamapS: thanks
<SpamapS> micahg: I did test the mongodb to the level of running mongod, logging in with 'mongo', passing args to 'mongos'
<micahg> SpamapS: k, and everything works normally w/the wrapper I'm adduming?
<micahg> *assuming
<SpamapS> micahg: I installed it on lucid and maverick with both 1.9.2.8 and 1.9.2.3, both worked fine.
<SpamapS> or I should say, all 4 worked fine. ;)
<micahg> SpamapS: do you have libmozjs installed?
<SpamapS> micahg: the only libmozjs I have is in /usr/lib/xulrunner-1.9.2.x
 * micahg wonders how you could build mongodb then
<micahg> I can't even generate the source tarball w/out libmozjs
<SpamapS> micahg: I've had no problems. Where are you bombing out?
<SpamapS> micahg: I did have one time where scons tried to run something that was linked against the wrong libmozjs.so... to fix that I just did 'LD_LIBRARY_PATH=/usr/lib/xulrunner-`xulrunner-1.9.2 --gre-version` debuild clean' and started over
<micahg> SpamapS: that won't help when building in a clean env
 * micahg tries something
<SpamapS> micahg: I believe the only reaosn that was an issue was that I had switched from 1.9.2.8 to 1.9.2.3 while mid-build
<micahg> SpamapS: nope
<lfaraone> jcastro: hi, George. You misspelled "Faraone" again :X
<SpamapS> micahg: I'm uploading to PPA now, whats the error?
<lfaraone> jcastro: ref: http://castrojo.tumblr.com/post/912710482/stack-applet-vanity-for-your-se-rep
<micahg> SpamapS: I think I need to export LD_LIBRARY_PATH in debian/rules, but I could never get it to work right
<ajmitch> lfaraone: shall we just say "that debian guy"? :)
<SpamapS> micahg: Why would we suddenly need to do that now though?
<SpamapS> micahg: there can be no dependency on libmozjs.so until we've linked against it..
<SpamapS> and scons takes care of the rpath..
<lfaraone> ajmitch: that might work, but I've toiled very hard to build a strong brand identity :)
<ajmitch> lfaraone: besides, 'that debian guy' isn't overly specific
<lfaraone> ajmitch: hehe. at least it was corrected when they posted the slides from the Ubuntu-Debian talk online :) http://dl.dropbox.com/u/5720/debian%20and%20ubuntu.pdf
<SpamapS> micahg: we only have to set LD_LIBRARY_PATH for when the path changes but the binaries haven't.
<maco> lfaraone: yeah the 3rd time he uploaded ;-)
<maco> (first upload was old version without that last slide, second was misspelled, then i pointed it out, third is right)
<ajmitch> lfaraone: oh great, I was hoping I'd see those slides somewhere :)
<micahg> SpamapS: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/477283/
 * lfaraone is surprised that it isn't hosted on ubuntu one :)
<SpamapS> micahg: yeah thats the one I got when I had to start over from scratch, but I only had to set LD_LIBRARY_PATH to run 'debuild clean'
<SpamapS> micahg: I may have exported it tho.. that would be t3h suck
<SpamapS> micahg: ugh, I need more cores for building
<micahg> SpamapS: yeah, let me know if your ppa works :)
<ajmitch> lfaraone: we can lart jcastro about that later
 * SpamapS starts dreaming about a cluster of ec2 machines for compiling...
<ajmitch> lfaraone: maybe it's because he uses debian & the u1 client isn't in there yet ;)
<lfaraone> ajmitch: ahaha.
<ajmitch> hopefully soon
<SpamapS> micahg: https://launchpad.net/~clint-fewbar/+archive/fixes/+build/1917296
<SpamapS> micahg: looks like the buildd's are busy. :-/
<micahg> yes :)
 * SpamapS wishes he could stuff quarters in and have it spawn ec2 nodes
<dholbach> good morning
<AnAnt> Hello
<dholbach> hey AnAnt
<AnAnt> I haven't seen persia for some while
<huats> morning
<paultag_> Hey MOTU. I would like to request a sync with Debian, I have the debdiff if that helps. Where should I file the bug on LP?
<AnAnt> You'll need to file a freeze exception
<paultag_> AnAnt: it's not adding new features, and it closes a few lintian errors + lp bugs
<AnAnt> btw, is it a sync or merge ? you mentioned a debdiff
<paultag_> AnAnt: sync. I don't know the process
<paultag_> AnAnt: it will work fine on Ubuntu ( and even theme it's self right )
<AnAnt> requestsync -se <package> maverick
<Laney> paultag_: you want the requestsync script from ubuntu-dev-tools
<Laney> and a Launchpad account
<paultag> thanks Laney, AnAnt :)
<paultag> Laney: Yup, all set. I'll rt f'n m :)
<AnAnt> Laney: but still it needs a freeze exception, right ?
<Laney> AnAnt: not if it's a bug fix upload
<AnAnt> ok
<paultag> Laney: shucks, will this not let me do it from Unstable?
<Laney> paultag: It all depends on what the upload contains
<Laney> where it comes from doesn't matter
<paultag> Laney: it's erroring out saying they are in sync, it was uploaded and built last night
<AnAnt> by default sync'ing is from unstable
<paultag> Hurmm
<Laney> does rmadison know about it?
<paultag> Laney: about my package?
<Laney> the new version
<AnAnt> rmadisom -u debian <package>
<paultag> thank AnAnt :)
<paultag> Laney: no, looks like it does not
<AnAnt> your package is not fully uploaded to debian servers, it takes time
<Laney> ok then you can either wait some time until it does (shouldn't be more than a few hours) or file the request manually
<paultag> OK, cool. I can wait :)
<paultag> thanks Laney, AnAnt
<Laney> nps
<SpamapS> micahg:  https://launchpad.net/~clint-fewbar/+archive/fixes/+build/1917296 ... built fine
<sebner> huhu RainCT :)
<RainCT> Hey sebner
<paultag> E: Could not connect to fiordland.ubuntu.com:25: Connection timed out (110)
<paultag> Anyone have advice? I'm trying to run a sync :)
<Laney> paultag: try with the --lp option
<Laney> you'll need to manage-credentials create -c ubuntu-dev-tools first
<paultag> Laney: thanks :)
<Laney> . o O ( surely not a version of fluxbox with stray .git files ;)
<paultag> Laney: That took me a minute to figure out that was you on OFTC too :)
<paultag> Laney: Seriously, though. Is that a big issue?
<Laney> well if you'll be uploading a new version to sid to fix itâ¦
<paultag> Laney: I don't have my DD or DM, so I'll have to get another review. I was going to wait until my DD on flux gets back
<paultag> Laney: I just wanted to get the critical stuff knocked out before 10.10
<paultag> Laney: his dad died and he's been out for about two weeks now, and no signs of getting back in the short term
<Laney> fair, you should request it but keep on top of what's happening in Debian
<paultag> Laney: Roger
<sistpoty|work> paultag: can you add a build log and state about testing to bug #617445 please? thanks
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 617445 in fluxbox (Ubuntu) "FFe: Sync fluxbox 1.1.1+git20100807.0cc08f9-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/617445
<sebner> huhu sistpoty|work :)
<paultag> yeah sistpoty|work, I'll do that now
<sistpoty|work> hi sebner
<sistpoty|work> paultag: thanks, and also I'll get personally angry if fluxbox breaks :P
<sebner> sistpoty|work: no nexuiz ffe work anymore for us I guess, hope xonotic is ready soon though :P
<paultag> sistpoty|work: me too :P
<sistpoty|work> heh
<paultag> sistpoty|work: thanks for getting to that so soon :)
<sistpoty|work> np
<paultag> sistpoty|work: if this pulls through, we'll be ahead of Gentoo
<sistpoty|work> woohoo
<paultag> sistpoty|work: all set, if you need more, let me know. Be sure to check it out, too, I added new themes for Debian and Ubuntu a bit back
<micahg> SpamapS: I'll take another look over teh weekend at your merge
<ScottK> sistpoty|work: It's worth noting that paultag is also asking for a freeze exception for Squeeze.
<sistpoty|work> seen that
<sistpoty|work> paultag: I assume rdepends aren't affected?
<paultag> sistpoty|work: only fluxconf, I filed a severe bug on it, but that package has been broken for over 2 years now. No new damage
<sistpoty|work> paultag: ok, great, then I'd say let's get it in :)
<paultag> sistpoty|work: :)
<SpamapS> micahg: cool
<Laney> ScottK: Will you be free for a call in â¦ 10 mins ish?
<ScottK> Laney: Possibly.
<Laney> OK. Ping me if/when
<ScottK> Laney: I'm tied in in work stuff for a bit yet.
<Laney> ScottK: Let me know when you're free and if we sync up then we can do it tonight, otherwise another time
<ScottK> OK.
 * Laney is happy that there is pushback on -devel@
 * Laney notes that these were his concerns at UDS
<ScottK> Feel free to join the 'fun'.
<ScottK> Rhonda: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/GerfriedFuchs?action=diff&rev1=7&rev2=8 is interesting.  Particularly who made the change ...
#ubuntu-motu 2010-08-14
<Rhonda> ScottK: Who is Danilo?
<chilicuil> hi, good afternoon, when dealing with bzr branches and quilt, should I remove the patches pile before using debcommit?
<chilicuil> I've added a new patch to a pkg using quilt and then I've used debcommit (leaving the changes), when I run $ bzr bd -- -S -uc -us, I get the following error: "dpkg-source: error: cannot read xsane-0.997.orig.oG0rqG/debian/patches/fix_umask_permitions.patch: No such file or directory", that patch is the one I made, what I'm doing wrong?, is this the correct channel?, or should I ask in another one?
<tumbleweed> did you bzr add that patch?
<chilicuil> tumbleweed: not afaik
<chilicuil> tumbleweed: ok, that made the trick, thx, and sry to bother u
<tumbleweed> chilicuil: np
<ScottK> Rhonda: No idea.
<ScottK> Just odd that anyone not you is editing your page.
<AnAnt> what's the difference between base.cow & base.tgz ? I mean
<AnAnt> I mean, will creation of a base.cow will download packages again, if I already have a base.tgz ?
<AnAnt> bilalakhtar: welcome back
<AnAnt> does 616685 need FFe ?
<AnAnt> ^ LP #616685
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 616685 in nginx (Ubuntu) "Please merge nginx 0.7.67-3 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/616685
<bilalakhtar> AnAnt: I don't think so
<bilalakhtar> AnAnt: no feature is being added
<ari-tczew> AnAnt, bilalakhtar: if this upload will fix any bug, it doesn't need FFe
<Laney> no
<Laney> if the upload does not introduce any new features, that's the test
<bilalakhtar> ari-tczew and Laney: The only changes being incorporated are that an extra configure option is being added
<bilalakhtar> and Standards-Version is being bumped
<bilalakhtar> no need for FFe
<Laney> bilalakhtar: It'd be nice if you pasted the entire new changelog into the bug
<Laney> oh, sorry, AnAnt
<bilalakhtar> Laney: I filed the merge
<Laney> well, whoever :P
<ari-tczew> bilalakhtar: upstream changelog
<Laney> if it's a new upstream release then that too indeed
<bilalakhtar> ari-tczew: Why?
<bilalakhtar> ari-tczew: Its not a new upstream release
<bilalakhtar> Laney: ^^
<Laney> I know.
<Laney> put in what's appropriate and sensible basically
<bilalakhtar> The problem is
<bilalakhtar> The current Ubuntu package installes files in /var/www
<ari-tczew> if merge doesn't include new upstream, you don't need include upstream changelog :)
<bilalakhtar> Laney: ^^
<bilalakhtar> ari-tczew: We never include upstream changelog
<Laney> If you want the sponsors to be able to easily confirm that it doesn't need a FFe then include as much detail as you can
<ari-tczew> bilalakhtar: ehh, listen: if you want to upload a merge and this package includes new usptream release, then in bug you have to paste an upstream changelog
<ari-tczew> during FFe of course
<bilalakhtar> ari-tczew: But not in debian/changelog, right? That's what I meant
<AnAnt> bilalakhtar: ?
<bilalakhtar> AnAnt: ??
<bilalakhtar> fta: You have been disconnecting every now and then
<ari-tczew> bilalakhtar: yea, most upstream changelog is in file called ChangeLog
<ari-tczew> or NEWS
<Laney> in the bug
<AnAnt> bilalakhtar: I think that you would have to put the changelog entry of -3
<fta> bilalakhtar, i know. it sucks. that's my adsl link flapping
<bilalakhtar> fta: I have also faced a problem like yours
<bilalakhtar> AnAnt: Why?
<AnAnt> bilalakhtar: in case the debian packaging introduced a new feature for example, you said something about adding an extra config option
<bilalakhtar> config option? ^^
<AnAnt> AFAIK, Debian is considered upstream for Ubuntu
<bilalakhtar> AnAnt: yes
<Laney> It's just nice for the sponsors
<bilalakhtar> Debian is upstream for us
<Laney> to be able to see what changes you are making
<bilalakhtar> AnAnt: But FF blocks UP-Upstream updates
<Laney> no
<fta> bilalakhtar, started a few weeks ago, but nothing's wrong on my side. it's somewhere in the network but tricky to isolate
<ari-tczew> bilalakhtar: I encourage you to fix RC bugs
<ari-tczew> you can fix rc bug by sync/merge
<bilalakhtar> ari-tczew: rc bugs?
<ari-tczew> just you need to test if it works
<bilalakhtar> What's that?
<ari-tczew> bilalakhtar: http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/bugs/rcbugs/maverick/
<bilalakhtar> fta_: again? :( I understand
<fta_> bilalakhtar, yep, 20~30 times a day :(
<LucidFox> Is there a specific team responsible for maintaining Wine in Ubuntu?
<LucidFox> I'm in favor of including the winepulse patches into the Ubuntu build of Wine, but I feel like uploading them right away would be steamrolling.
<geser> LucidFox: if things didn't change then YokoZar is taking care of wine in Ubuntu
<YokoZar> LucidFox: the "Wine Team" is me
<LucidFox> YokoZar> Ah, good
<YokoZar> LucidFox: And I'm watching the pulse situation pretty closely
<YokoZar> For openal-based games Wine 1.2 actually uses native OpenAL now (next step is to expand mmdevapi.dll to use openAL for other programs)
<LucidFox> Well, I know they're going to implement a New and Improved sound architecture in some distant release, but until then, I have long been running the vivnet PPA builds with the winepulse patches
<LucidFox> YokoZar> Why does Wine try to build on multiple architectures? Wouldn't Architecture: amd64, i386 make more sense?
<LucidFox> it fails to build on any other one anyway
<shadeslayer> YokoZar: poke
<shadeslayer> do you know about software-properties package ?
<shadeslayer> like the internal workings and stuff
<shadeslayer> bah.. not here
<shadeslayer> YokoZar: software-properties-kde is broken, it cant "Select Best Server" , backtrace here : http://pastebin.com/Jns8SW7X, will try and fix
<shadeslayer> if the new package doesnt fix it already
<YokoZar> shadeslayer: no
<YokoZar> shadeslayer: I want to know more about it eventually though
<shadeslayer> ok... well ill wait for mvo then
<shadeslayer> and try to fix with no idea of python internals :p
<bdrung> chilicui1: around?
<chilicui1> bdrung: yep
<bdrung> chilicui1: regarding bug #462193. i recommend to use the full name in the changelog stanza and not the nick name.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 462193 in djvulibre (Ubuntu Lucid) "djvulibre-bin produces garbage in the root (/man1/*)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/462193
<bdrung> "-- chilicuil <chilicuil@i.am>  Thu, 12 Aug 2010 17:02:53 -0500"
<chilicui1> bdrung: ok, I'll do it next time, thx for the comment
<bdrung> chilicui1: can you update the debdiff or give me your real name (then i can fix it)?
<chilicui1> bdrung: sure, it's "Javier Perez Lopez"
<bdrung> chilicui1: uploaded
<chilicui1> bdrung: thx =)
<bdrung> yw
<bdrung> chilicui1: you might want to add your realname to https://launchpad.net/~chilicuil
<chilicui1> bdrung: oki doki
<AnAnt> Hello, is removing an un-necessary package from Depends , something that requires a FFe ?
<geser> no
<AnAnt> so I can immediately upload the package ?
<geser> FF is to stop "adding features" and to concentrate on to fix/stabilise the existing ones
<geser> sure
<AnAnt> ok
<AnAnt> hmm, I am using syncpackage to sync zekr from experimental. Currently maverick has the -0ubuntu1 revision, and I am syncing -1, now why is the source.changes having the orig tarball ?
<Laney> just use requestsync ;)
<AnAnt> Laney: and ?
<bdrung> AnAnt: maybe a bug?
<Laney> it does rather sound like a bug
<AnAnt> bdrung: well, syncpackage gives those messages:
<AnAnt> syncpackage: Warning: Overwriting modified Ubuntu version 1.0.0+repack-0ubuntu1, setting current version to 1.0.0+repack-0
<AnAnt> parsechangelog/debian: warning: 'since' option specifies non-existing version
<AnAnt> parsechangelog/debian: warning: use newest entry that is smaller than the one specified
<bdrung> syncpackage: D: needs source tarball: False
<AnAnt> bdrung: yup, I get that with verbose option
<bdrung> AnAnt: ok, found it. i will fix it
<AnAnt> bdrung: line 276 ?
<bdrung> line 281
<AnAnt> you want to add if ! need_orig ?
<AnAnt> or just else:
<bdrung> AnAnt: pushed
<bdrung> to lp:ubuntu-dev-tools
<AnAnt> bdrung: thanks, I manually fixed it here
<bdrung> AnAnt: you're welcome.
<Rhonda> ScottK: Didn't you edit it, too? :P
<jenkins> I am trying to write a debian rules file for a project I am working on. I do not have any questions yet but which channel would be best to ask questions in?
<geser> #ubuntu-packaging
<jenkins> thanks geser
<shadeslayer> bug 603831 if anyone is interested
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 603831 in fprint-demo (Ubuntu) "Please Merge fprint-demo from debian" [Wishlist,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/603831
<geser> shadeslayer: as this a new upstream version (sort of), have you checked if any new features got added?
<shadeslayer> err...no, ill do that right now
<shadeslayer> i guess ill need a FFe  if that is true
<geser> yes
<shadeslayer> http://pastebin.com/yUqajX7j
<shadeslayer> thats the NEWS file
<shadeslayer> nothing new there
<geser> and in the git commit log also nothing that would qualify as new feature
<geser> so looks like you got lucky not needing a FFe :)
<shadeslayer> ^_^
#ubuntu-motu 2010-08-15
<geser> shadeslayer: don't forget to close your bug in your changelog entry the next time
<shadeslayer> geser: i have to close my own bug in the changelog? 0_o
<shadeslayer> i didnt know that
<geser> yes please, else they stay open
<shadeslayer> yeah, but i would have closed it manually :D
<shadeslayer> but either way, ill remember this
<shadeslayer> geser: thanks :D
<geser> of course you can close them after your debdiff got sponsored through the web ui but it's easier to do through the changelog and one doesn't forget it
<Laney> and better, because then the bug tells you in which version it was fixed
<shadeslayer> right
<geser> and one also has a reference to a previous merge bug (if a need arises in the future to understand some changes and why they kept merged)
<Laney> haha
<Laney> see, many reasons!
<geser> as the merge bug might have some additional info
<shadeslayer> any idea where cowbuilder stores generated debs? :P
<geser> and from a DMB point-of-view: when looking at the sponsored packages from an applicant, the linking to the sponsoring bug makes it easy to check how it got handled
<geser> shadeslayer: try /var/cache/pbuilder/result/ (if you don't use a script that sets a different directory)
<shadeslayer> geser: its not there, thats why im asking
<shadeslayer> which i find very odd
<geser> does your ~/.pbuilderrc specify BUILDRESULT?
<shadeslayer> nope
<geser> I've never used cowbuilder, so I'm mere guessing
<geser> :(
<Laney> are you using pbuilder-dist?
<shadeslayer> nope, just simple cowbuilder
<geser> almost last idea: check the value of BUILDRESULT in /etc/pbuilderrc
<geser> and if that doesn't help: check the source
<shadeslayer> BUILDRESULT=/var/cache/pbuilder/result/
<shadeslayer> well.. thats ok, it built fine
<geser> and the build succeeded?
<Laney> is there a cowbuilderrc?
<shadeslayer> geser: yes
<shadeslayer> Laney: no
<Laney> i suggest you check the manpage
<Laney> and if that fails then the source
<shadeslayer> i did... nothing there :p
<geser> Laney: http://manpages.ubuntu.com/manpages/maverick/en/man8/cowbuilder.8.html
<shadeslayer> i wonder if its because i run sudo -E pdebuild
<geser> mentions only the pbuilder configuration files, nothing cowbuilder specific
<geser> shadeslayer: yep, pdebuild != pbuilder
<geser> slight difference
<geser> check .. for the debs
<shadeslayer> geser: not there as well
<geser> damn
<geser> ok, the pdebuild manpages mentions /var/cache/pbuilder/result
<geser> then you have to dig through the source where your debs got put
<micahg> SpamapS: what Ubuntu version are you on?
<micahg> anyone here that understands scons?
<AnAnt> Hello
<shadeslayer> ho
<shadeslayer> err... hi
<ari-tczew> please open task on maverick and lucid in bug 617614
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 617614 in gwget2 (Ubuntu) "epiphany-extension-gwget cannot be installed: requires 2.29 <= epiphany-browser < 2.30" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/617614
<Laney> ok
<Laney> there yo ugo
<ari-tczew> thanks Laney
<nthykier> Hi, I got a package (libsysactivity) that FTBFS on Ubuntu due the Autobuilders using a 2.6.24 kernel and one of the tests needs a 2.6.25 (or newer) - is there a way to get it built on a machine with a newer kernel or should I patch the package to skip the particular test?
<tumbleweed> nthykier: I think the best solution is to patch out the test
<bilalakhtar> hi tumbleweed
<bilalakhtar> tumbleweed: looking at the nginx issue, Why is the lintian error being discussed now? Why wasn't it discussed when it was added?
<bilalakhtar> tumbleweed: BTW, adding the HTML files is not important
<bilalakhtar> tumbleweed: Its just an added convenience
<bilalakhtar> tumbleweed: and, there's no need to run checks, because nginx has /var/www as its root by default
<bilalakhtar> unlike apache ^^
<tumbleweed> bilalakhtar: people make mistakes
<tumbleweed> (and are lazy)
<tumbleweed> but it's easier to get sponsorees to do the right thing :)
<bilalakhtar> tumbleweed: yup, it appears the previous uploader has taken up the issue
<bilalakhtar> tumbleweed: and he is ready to get it fixed
<tumbleweed> bilalakhtar: I disagree re the checks. /var/www is an area that belongs to the sysadmin, we shouldn't be messing with their things in there
<bilalakhtar> tumbleweed: but see, nginx is a server of its own and not an add-on
<bilalakhtar> tumbleweed: it conflicts with apache and lighttpd
<tumbleweed> bilalakhtar: so, as a sysadmin, you installed nginx when you deployed your machine
<tumbleweed> now you upgrade to a new version of ubuntu
<tumbleweed> and suddenly files appear in your /var/www
<tumbleweed> (new files, that you didn't expect)
<bilalakhtar> tumbleweed: should we do what debian is doing?
<tumbleweed> you mean not installing them?
<bilalakhtar> yes ^^
<bilalakhtar> they are an added convenience
<bilalakhtar> and
<tumbleweed> yes, that's the easy solution
<bilalakhtar> it appears that no bug was filed to have them in there
<bilalakhtar> in lp ^^
<tumbleweed> yeah, fair enough to remove them then
<bilalakhtar> then the only change from debian would be the ufw profile
<bilalakhtar> its always better to clean up packages when merging
<tumbleweed> agreed, we often end up with cruft
<tumbleweed> bonus points if you look at any bugs in lp with patches :)
<bilalakhtar> BTW, the html file addition was done way back in karmic
<bilalakhtar> it skipped lucid
<bilalakhtar> and
<bilalakhtar> was detected in maverick
<bilalakhtar> RoAkSoAx was the one who uploaded
<bilalakhtar> RoAkSoAx: ping
<tumbleweed> the curse/advantage of group maintainance - every time we touch a package, a different person works on it.
<bilalakhtar> Its somewhat better
<bilalakhtar> In debian, NMUs take a long time to get sponsored
<bilalakhtar> here, almost every upload is an NMU
<tumbleweed> helps if you are a DD :)
<bilalakhtar> tumbleweed: are you a DD ?
<tumbleweed> bilalakhtar: no, I need someone to want to advocate me
<bilalakhtar> tumbleweed: I have 6 uploads in debian pending sponsorship, of which 5 are new packages and 1 NMU
<bilalakhtar> I am hunting down debian IRC channels and asking people to sponsor that NMU which is 2 months old now. But, most of them tell me to contact maintainer, who has been unresponsive
<tumbleweed> yup, unresponsive maintainers are a pain
<bilalakhtar> tumbleweed: dammit, a confusing, two-way bug #547267
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 547267 in nginx (Ubuntu) "nginx should not install into /var/www/nginx-default (Debian policy)" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/547267
<tumbleweed> there you go, you weren't th efirst to run into this
<bilalakhtar> yup
<bilalakhtar> and, RoAkSoAx has said that he forgot to add the reference to the bug
<bilalakhtar> earlier, I mentioned that there was no bug
<bilalakhtar> there is this one
<vish> ScottK: tumbleweed: hey, [i think]found out why the lp janitor switches the name and email fields..  it seems to do that when the name has a . [dot], for some reason it doesnt like dots ;)
<vish> tumbleweed: similar happened in Bug #532056
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 532056 in bzflag (Debian) "Inappropriately appears in Ubuntu Software Center's "Graphics" > "3D" section" [Unknown,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/532056
<tumbleweed> vish: aha, file a bug :)
 * tumbleweed has acutally just uploaded a (papercut) sponsorship with a .
<vish> tumbleweed: yeah, should do that , bug in which...?  :)
<bilalakhtar> vish: file a bug in malone
<vish> bilalakhtar: malone!
<vish> hrm..
<bilalakhtar> vish: yes, the janitor is a part of malone
<bilalakhtar> vish: https://edge.launchpad.net/malone
<tumbleweed> vish: indeed: https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/acm/5.0-27ubuntu2
<tumbleweed> bilalakhtar: I don't think this is malone, the problem is in th echanges file processing. soyuz?
<bilalakhtar> tumbleweed: vish: Is the problem here as well? Aha
<bilalakhtar> Go file in soyuz, vish
<vish> tumbleweed: yeah, always wondered why it kept doing that.. finally found someone who suffers the same fate! ;p
<bilalakhtar> vish: Yes, While looking at your uploads I thought why don't you follow the debian changelog policy!
<vish> bilalakhtar: pff, policies ;p
<bilalakhtar> vish: for adding changelog entries, I suppose you use dch
<tumbleweed> bilalakhtar: the changelogs are correct, it's lp which has th ewrong data
<bilalakhtar> tumbleweed: I know that
<bilalakhtar> so soyuz grabs the latest changelog entry and tries to validate its e-mail address. Due to a dot in the name, it thinks the opposite and interprets the changelog in the wrong manner. malone just copies the data provided by soyuz
<nthykier> tumbleweed: okay - TY
<vish> DktrKranz: hi , does zipper work on Ubuntu or is it meant for use only after installing GNUstep?
 * vish noticed DktrKranz made the last upload and might have some info.. :)
<vish> DktrKranz: Bug #613301 was filed as its description seemed confusing for the user...  could you comment on it? thanks.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 613301 in zipper.app (Ubuntu) "Zipper description is confusing" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/613301
<DktrKranz> vish: well, it's an app designed for GNUstep, so it requires at least base packages (e.g. gnustep-base). Perhaps description can be improved, but it should be done Debian side first (and there's currently an ongoing transition there)
<vish> DktrKranz: ah yeah, maybe for that info could be included .  could you comment on the bug?
<vish> DktrKranz: maybe we can ask the reporter to forward the bug to debian :)
<DktrKranz> vish: done
<ScottK> Rhonda: I did, but to provide an endorsement.  it seems odd to me people doing random edits on people's wiki pages, but maybe that's just me.
<xelister> I fixed a 1 year old damn bug in krusader
<xelister> how to build it now? I got sources via apt-get source + apt-get build-dep
<geser> debuild
<xelister> geser: ok.. now what?
<xelister> Successfully signed dsc and changes files
<xelister> but I dont see any .deb file
<xelister> the modified by me sources seem to build, debuild seem to execute,  now how to install the builded package to test if program works correctly?
<shadeslayer> xelister: cd ..
<shadeslayer> and then : sudo dpkg -i foo.deb
<xelister> shadeslayer: how to make a diff to be attached as .patch to LP bug report for the bug I fixed?
<shadeslayer> !debdiff | xelister
<ubottu> xelister: A simple way to patch Debian/Ubuntu packages is to attach a debdiff to a bug report, or send it to the team which handles the package. Learn more about it from https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Howtos/Debdiff
<vish> tumbleweed: hmm , i think there is a white space in the changelog. :s the second entry, probably why it was failing?
<micahg> jdong_: ping?
<Rhonda> ScottK: Yes, it's strange to some degree. Though, I don't see the big deal when turning channel names into links. :)
<micahg> Rhonda: are you familiar with scons?
<Rhonda> Not really. I gave it once a try wether switching from autotools to it for wesnoth would make a sense, but I sticked with autotools. Why do you ask?
<micahg> Rhonda: having trouble getting mongodb to make a source upload
<yofel> does anyone know if there's a reason why there are no -dbgsym packages for -backports?
<micahg> yofel: maybe because they're not officially supported
<yofel> was looking through old bugs and found bug 316227
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 316227 in Ubuntu "devscripts-dbgsym unistallable in intrepid" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/316227
<micahg> yofel: also intrepid is EOL
<yofel> yep, but NO release has dbgsyms for -backports so..
<yofel> you can reproduce that failure with any package from lucid-backports
<ebroder> yofel: My understanding is that extracting the dbgsym packages is a giant hack, and it's probably "just" that nobody has implemented that hack for anything but the main archive
<ebroder> (I have no idea how much resistance there would be on the archive admin/buildd admin/etc admin side to adding functionality for extracting backports dbgsym packages)
<yofel> erm, debug symbol extraction is on for lucid lucid-updates lucid-proposed and lucid-security, only -backports doesn't have them
<ebroder> yofel: Exactly. Someone with the right powers cared enough to set it up for -updates, -proposed, and -security. Nobody with the right powers has cared enough to set it up for -backports
<yofel> any idea where I should send that bug to then? soyuz?
 * micahg thought -backports weren't officially supported
<Rhonda> yofel: There is wesnoth-1.8-dbg in karmic-backports. Or is that something completely different?
<micahg> Rhonda: different -dbgsym
<yofel> Rhonda: that is a packaged -dbg package, we are talking about -dbgsym on ddebs.ubuntu.com
<yofel> those are automatically generated for every package
<yofel> (by the buildds)
<Rhonda> ah
<yofel> micahg: well, I think too that -backports is unsupported so I'll close the bug
<ebroder> yofel: backports is supported, just not through the same mechanisms as the normal archive. It's on a volunteer basis, like universe
<yofel> well, I'll just leave the bug as it is until tomorrow, if anyone knows who I should talk to about or where I should move that bug ping me
<ebroder> yofel: Sorry - I wasn't clear. Backports are supported, but anything related to intrepid is unsupported. So that bug can be closed. It's a separate bug that backports aren't generating dbgsym packages
<yofel> ok, that makes sense, closing
#ubuntu-motu 2011-08-08
<pindonga> ajmitch, ah, ok
<pindonga> I hope you can still manage to get 1.0 and 0.6 of django-configglue in, but if not, I understand
<pindonga> if there is anything I can do to help , please let me know
<ajmitch> I'll do what I can, there's still a couple of days before I have to beg the release team for exceptions :)
<pindonga> ajmitch, I know you'll do your best and I am grateful
<pindonga> I'll check again in a couple of days (wed the latest)
<pindonga> thx
<micahg> \o/ vala-0.14 is almost bootstrapped on powerpc which will fix a number of universe depwait/FTBFS issues
<tonymc> hi all
<tonymc> how do i go about packaging headers? i don't need to compile them or anything, just headers
<mok0> Why does python-stdeb insist on installing python2.6?
<Laney> highvoltage: good post, but I think the technical contributions bit could be a bit misleading
<Laney> the DMB only deals with people doing Ubuntu Development, not these upstreamy folk (wherever they may end up)
<tonymc> how do i go about packaging headers? i don't need to compile them or anything, just headers
<tonymc> is there a way to compile x86 packages on an x64 system?
<dupondje> tonymc: ofc
<dupondje> pbuilder-dist has arch argument for example
<tonymc> what about debuild?
<tonymc> pbuilder is too heavy...
<dupondje> pbuilder heavy ?
<dupondje> not really :)
<tonymc> well it downloads minimal system
<tonymc> i wouldn't want that
<dupondje> guess its not possible then
<dupondje> cause you'll always need a minimal system to build packages
<tonymc> well debuild doesn't need that
<tonymc> i know it's not a clean method to build stuff
<tonymc> but my program isn't that complicated and there are no complex dependencies or anything
<jtaylor> it is possible but it can be a lot of work
<jtaylor> on oneiric it should be easier due to more multi arch packages
<jtaylor> install gcc-multilib and all 32 bit dependencies and pass -m32 to the build should do it
<tonymc> OK then, how do i build with pbuilder? i've found something on google, "linux32 pbuilder -ai386" but it doesn't seem to work - package still builds as x64
<jtaylor> setup a 32 bit chroot
<jtaylor> pbuilder --create --architecture i386
<micahg_> or use pbuilder-dist
<tonymc> can i somehow install a local package onto that chrooted environment?
<jtaylor> pbuilder --architecture i386 --login --saver-after-login
<jtaylor> then do what you want to do in the chroot and logout
<jtaylor> the changes will remain
<jtaylor> there is also --extra-packages you can use
<jtaylor> for packages in the repo
<tonymc> wow
<tonymc> thanks
<tonymc> looks like everything's working now
<tonymc> many thanks, you've been really helpful
<jtaylor> also have a look at pbuilder-dist, it makes a few pbuilder operations a bit simpler
<jtaylor> lots of info here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto#Building_32-bit_packages_on_64-bit_or_for_older_Ubuntu_versions
<tonymc> one more noob question
<tonymc> where does pbuilder store built packages?
<tonymc> i can't seem to find them anywhere
<jtaylor>  /var/cache/pbuilder/result
<jtaylor> or in --buildresult=...
<jtaylor> you can mount directories from your host with --bindmounts=/dir/...
<jtaylor> but note if you create files in there they will be root owned
<tonymc> if i make /var/cache/pbuild/result writeable by me, i won't have to run it as sudo and thus the packages will be owned by me, right?
<tonymc> i mean /var/cache/pduilder
<tonymc> or it's not adviceable?
<jtaylor> no pbuilder will always need root rights so far I know
<tonymc> ah OK
<tonymc> i build everything with scripts anyway, another two lines with chown won't matter
<tonymc> thank you very much
<jtaylor> np
<tonymc> pbuilder doesn't download build time dependencies - is it how it's supposed to be?
<tonymc> it displays an error in which it says that in order to resolve the situation it needs to remove pbuilder-satisfydepends-dummy
<tonymc> however when i login i don't see this package
<tonymc> ah i got it, sorry
<tonymc> needed to enable universe in sources
<tonymc> it is aliiive... once again thanks for your help, quite a crash course in packaging i had
#ubuntu-motu 2011-08-09
<sagaci> trying to pbuilder-dist oneiric create and getting - http://paste.ubuntu.com/661661/
<dupondje> somebody around with upload rights ? :)
<dupondje> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libgphoto2/2.4.11-3/+build/2673025 seems to fail with an odd reason. Package is installable, and tested it right now on a pbuilder, and it works
<RAOF> Woah! The i386 buildds are idle.
 * RAOF gets right on that.
<ajmitch> uploading mesa & X crack? :)
<RAOF> I've already done that today, though.
<nigelb> hm, today the sponsorship report seems to not load at all.
<hakermania> Hello, I have this package over here:http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/wallch  which was not advocated, finally. Now, we've build version 2 of the program. How should I upload it to revu? Via dput *changes or dput -f *changes?
<jtaylor> can someone rebuild twisted-calendarserver? its needed so it picks up python2.7 probably solving bug 823051
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 823051 in calendarserver (Ubuntu) "Missing install dependency on python-twisted-web2" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/823051
<jtaylor> and bug 712214
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 712214 in twisted-calendarserver (Ubuntu) "twistd crashed with ImportError in /usr/lib/twisted-calendarserver/lib/python2.7/site-packages/calendarserver/provision/root.py: No module named web2" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/712214
<jtaylor> aggregated all bugs into 697044
<geser> jtaylor: does a rebuild really fix this? from a look at the build log, calendarserver got build with python 2.7
<jtaylor> twisted-calendarserver
<jtaylor> that was last built in maverick
<jtaylor> geser: so natty and oneiric are broken
<geser> jtaylor: missed that twisted-calendarserver and calendarserver are two different source packages
<geser> ok, with a rebuild I get files for python2.7 but also a Depends on python2.6
<tumbleweed> jtaylor: urgh, what a horrible package :)
<jtaylor> yes ...
<jtaylor> it has an embedded twisted-web2 ...
<jtaylor> and pycentral
<geser> jtaylor: can you check what needs to be done to make the files in /usr/lib/twisted-calendar/bin use python as interpreter (or at least python2.7)?
<jtaylor> hm never used pycentral
<jtaylor> how does one get pycentral to do that?
<geser> IIRC some packages used sed on the scripts to replace the interpreter with an unversioned one
<geser> unfortunately I don't have an example at hand for it
<jtaylor> hm the setup.py does not accept the --executable flag ...
<tumbleweed> then use sed, es
<tumbleweed> yes
<jtaylor> k uploading a branch in a moment
<jtaylor> geser: https://code.launchpad.net/~jtaylor/ubuntu/oneiric/twisted-calendarserver/fix-697044/+merge/70849
<geser> jtaylor: looks good, the next don't forget to also run update-maintainer (no need to document it in the changelog)
<jtaylor> arg I always forget that ._.
<geser> jtaylor: become an Ubuntu member, use your @ubuntu.com email address in the changelog and dpkg-source will remind you when you forgot to run update-maintainer
<Laney> then become a DD, use debian.org and you get to start forgetting all over again :P
<jtaylor> ^^
<nigelb> heh
<jtaylor> geser: are you going to make an SRU for it?
<geser> jtaylor: I lack the time to do it, but I can open the task if you want to do the SRU
<jtaylor> task is enough for now
<geser> task opened
<Laney> kklimonda: hey, just reviewing #688501 â do you want to backport 1.5.4 from M or 2.0-1 from O to L M N?
<Laney> the latter would require a bit more testing, of course
<OwaisL> Hey everyone, when is the feature freeze? I just uploaded a package to revu
<OwaisL> http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/gmailwatcher
<jtaylor> 11. aug
<OwaisL> jtaylor, wow.
<OwaisL> has anyone got time to spare for a review
#ubuntu-motu 2011-08-10
<micahg> Ampelbein: osm-gps-map has a new upstream version in unstable and hasn't been merged this cycle, I think you noted to wait for the .la file diff to be taken by Debian, but FF is tomorrow, would you care to merge it?
<philipballew> anyone know any good guides to get started in packaging?
<Rhonda> Like the one in the wiki?
 * afranke waves hello from Desktop summit
<afranke> I have a few package requests (some are bumping versions on existing packages) and there doesn't seem to be any activity in the reports, so I was wondering what they to draw attention was.
<philipballew> Rhonda, sure. I want to know how to build them and start helping motu
<afranke> didrocks told me I should try talking about it here.
<afranke> The most urgent is https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/planner/+bug/805612
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 805612 in planner (Ubuntu) "Update Planner package to 0.14.5 version" [Undecided,New]
<Rhonda> philipballew: Is there troubles with the guide in the wiki?
<philipballew> is that a compleate guide? by reading that will I know how to help and begin packaging?
<Rhonda> Read it, and if you have any further questions, feel free to bring them up. :)
<geser> !packaging guide
<ubottu> The packaging guide is at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide - See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/NewPackages for information on getting a package integrated into Ubuntu - Other developer resources are at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment - See also !backports
<afranke> !backports
<ubottu> If new updated Ubuntu packages are built for an application, then they may go into Ubuntu Backports. See https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuBackports - See also !packaging
<Laney> afranke: the problem is they need someone to do the work
<afranke> Laney: sure
<afranke> But it's hard to see if they are being ignored or read by anybody.
<Laney> correct
<Laney> see http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=632993 for planner, fyi
<ubottu> Debian bug 632993 in wnpp "O: planner -- project management application" [Normal,Open]
<Laney> someone in Debian is working on updating it, you might email them to offer help or find out how it's going
<afranke> Oh, Xavier forgot to keep me updated about it.
<afranke> He just told me he wanted to orphan it.
<afranke> But isn't it too late for the sync with Debian then?
<Laney> looks bug fix, so no
<afranke> Ok, great.
<afranke> Should I talk about my other requests here too :) ?
<Laney> for upstream versions I recommend you talk to the Debian maintainers
<afranke> What about backports+
<afranke> ?
<Laney> file a bug, test it builds/installs/runs and then give me a link :-)
<Laney> (and if any reverse dependencies [apt-cache rdepends $package], that they still work with the new version installed)
<afranke> Bug is https://bugs.launchpad.net/lucid-backports/+bug/776360
<afranke> :)
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 776360 in lucid-backports "Backport tuxguitar 1.2 to lucid" [Undecided,New]
<Laney> ok, that bug needs information that the version from maverick-updates builds/installs/runs on lucid
<afranke> And building/installing/testing... well, I'm no packager (and I don't intend to become one), so...
<Laney> there's a program prevu that can help you do this easily
<Laney> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Prevu
<afranke> Should I just try downloading the .deb for Maverick and try to install it on Lucid?
<afranke> Oh.
 * afranke started reading the page about Prevu.
<afranke> Well, I'll see what I can do about it when I'm back home.
<Laney> jdong: is prevu still maintained?
<afranke> Thanks for the link.
<Laney> afranke: alternatively you can download the source package for maverick and upload that to a PPA
<afranke> Oh ok.
<afranke> Sounds good.
<Laney> I think there's a new script called backportpackage to help with that, but I don't know how it works I'm afraid
<Laney> (it's in the ubuntu-dev-tools package)
<Laney> ah, maybe this supersedes prevu actually
<afranke> Meh.
<Laney> broder: can backportpackage create the chroot if it doesn't exist?
<afranke> ubuntu-*dev*-tools sounds like something I don't want to have a look at :)
<Laney> you can ignore the rest of the scripts :P
<afranke> I'm just trying to keep focused. There's already much I have to work on, so I don't want to start looking into Ubuntu packaging for instance.
<afranke> But if there are simple things I can test, I'll do them.
<Laney> backportpackage -u ppa:yourlaunchpadusername/yourppa -s maverick -d lucid tuxguitar
<afranke> Ok, I'll try that at home.
<Laney> you know what, I'll try that (so I can tell other people how to do it in the future)
<afranke> Oh
<afranke> Great, thanks a lot!
<Laney> broder: I can't run backportpackage on sid (backportpackage: Error: Unknown release codename maverick
<Laney> )
<Laney> do you want bugs instead?
 * afranke has to detach.
<afranke> See you later and thanks again.
<Laney> bye bye
<willem_> Hi, is there any chance that Eclipse might be update to 3.7 with the upcoming release? If not, because it is still 3.5.2 in Debian. How could I help to bring the newer version to Debian/Ubuntu?
<Rhonda> willem_: Pester the package maintainers in Debian. :)
<Rhonda> Oh, there is 3.7 in experimental in Debian â¦
<Laney> bdrung looks at that AFAIK, and he's away for a little while
<Rhonda> There might actually be a reason behind that it hasn't got uploaded to unstable.  In this case I'd suggest to ask them what the reasoning behind is, and in case it's of no importance and the package there is fine, ask for a sync request from experimental.
<hakermania> Hello, how should I upload the second version of a program whose 1st version Rests In Peace in revu?
<Laney> just upload it again
<hakermania> I have different GPG keys also, but I've used them in lanchpad as well, so REVU will find them :)
<willem_> Rhonda, ok I will do that
<hakermania> Laney, I did with dput -f but the new package didn't show up in revu
<Rhonda> willem_: Just pinged nthykier on irc.debian.org about it, I'll keep you updated. :)
<willem_> ok, I will stick around then :)
<Laney> hakermania: don't know then, sorry
<Laney> ajmitch: you do revu stuff, right?
<Laney> or at least have access to logs
<hakermania> Is this enough to associate it with REVU? http://i.imgur.com/S9KZE.png
<Laney> don't know :(
<Laney> RainCT: ^
<hakermania> I will try again... :/
<RainCT> hakermania: Yeah, but you need to log into REVU so it'll sync the keys from Launchpad
<ajmitch> Laney: yeah
<Laney> nm, RainCT saved the day
<ajmitch> that's ok, I'm used to being too slow :)
<Laney> silly upside down people
<ajmitch> it gets hard to hold on
<hakermania> RainCT, Do you mean that I have to be logged in into REVU via launchpad to have the package uploaded? So, does this mean it's a cookie issue or something :O ?
<RainCT> hakermania: no, you just need to log in once after putting your key on Launchpad
<ajmitch> hakermania: no, the act of logging in syncs the keys for that lp ID
<RainCT> yeah, that
<hakermania> Oh, so I will relogging
<hakermania> got it
<hakermania> Can I see from inside REVU the associated keys?
 * hakermania wants to be sure
<Rhonda> willem_: <nthykier> Rhonda: among things, I have not actually installed it and tried it starts... tests suggests that at least one of its r-depends are broken and if depends on stuff in experimental :P
<Rhonda> willem_: So it might require a bit more investigation than just requesting a sync from experimental.
<willem_> Rhonda: What would be a good way to proceed? Install Debian_experimental in a VM and see if it starts for myself?
<Rhonda> I would give it a try if it's at all buildable in oneiric, and get it running there.
<willem_> Rhonda: OK, will see if I can make some time available for that this evening... :) Thanks for the information!
<hakermania> Rhonda, willem, are you talking about a new package?
<Rhonda> hakermania: eclipse
<Rhonda> For certain definitions of "new" :)
<hakermania> !
<hakermania> willem_ wants to upload it for review? Or not?
<Rhonda> Wonders if it would be possible to get 3.7 into oneiric.
<willem_> yep
<Laney> it's not source NEW if that is what you are asking
 * Rhonda . o O ( wow, feature freeze starting tomorrow and I managed to remember the codename properly, didn't expect that )
<Laney> spelling it was the most difficult part for me for some time
<hakermania> Is feature freeze tomorrow? No! I think it's on Saturday
<Laney> nope, tomorrow
<hakermania> Is this the last day for accepting packages?
<Laney> no, you'll just need a freeze exception
<hakermania> How do I get this?
<Laney> !ffe
<ubottu> Feature Freeze Exception. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess for the freeze exception process.
<hakermania> Laney, Do I have any chance if I upload the package now to have it reviewed?
<hakermania> :S
<Laney> you could ask the patch pilot
<Laney> reviewer time is extremely limited
<hakermania> Its says 15 in the release schedule and I accidentaly thought 15 of August, what a pity :(
<Laney> nah, i expect you can get the exception
<hakermania> Laney, and what am I supposed to say here: "State why the addition of the package should get considered" ?
<Laney> precisely that, why you want to get it in
<hakermania> Laney, because it's great software (kidding :P). What should I say? It's not that important :P, it's a simple wallpaper changer LOL
<hakermania> I want to get it in because it has unity support, something that ubuntu needs so as to support its new features! (that sounds good ;) )
<jtaylor> hmm why are there no dbgsym for libnotify4?
<Laney> hakermania: realistically, new leaf packages (as this is) don't introduce much risk, so freeze exceptions are relatively easy to get
<hakermania> Laney, Hmm, good to know that, but why is this link broken? (File a bug against the Ubuntu distribution (https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+filebug), attach the source package to it (or link to it).)
<hakermania> It redirects me somewhere else, wheere I cannot fill the bug :/
<Laney> works for me
<Laney> are you logged in?
<hakermania> Yes
<hakermania> Laney, doesn't it redirects you to https://help.ubuntu.com/community/ReportingBugs ?
<jtaylor> how strict is the feature freeze actually?
<jtaylor> I'd like to get meld 1.5.2 in
<hakermania> Hehe :)
<jtaylor> but the debian maintainer is on vacation
<jtaylor> so it will only be in debian probably next week
<hakermania> jtaylor, does the link above works for you?
<jtaylor> should I package it myself in ubuntu or can I get an exception?
<jtaylor> it does add new features, but also solves a bunch of bugs
<jtaylor> hakermania: yes
<Laney> jtaylor: if you test it sufficiently it should be fine
<hakermania> Guysm I don't know why but it constantly redirects me to https://help.ubuntu.com/community/ReportingBugs, I tested both from firefox and chrome and I cleared history and cache :/
<chrisccoulson> hakermania, that's deliberate
<Laney> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+filebug?no-redirect&field.tag=needs-packaging
<chrisccoulson> it's to discourage people from filing bugs using the launchpad interface
<Laney> does that work?
<chrisccoulson> i was just about to suggest that :)
<jtaylor> how long does it usually take for SRU uploads to get approved?
<jtaylor> so they are published in -proposed?
<chrisccoulson> and the page you're redirected to explains how to override it anyway
<hakermania> Laney, yes, it did, thanks
<jtaylor> soya is waiting for approval since 1.aug :(
<hakermania> jtaylor, soya? I don't seem to find it at revus main page
<jtaylor> its in the natty proposed upload queue
<hakermania> link?
<jtaylor> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/natty/+queue?queue_state=1&queue_text=
<hakermania> jtaylor, and what's this? Is this a reviewing or something? such as revu?
<jtaylor> no, a sponsor uploads a package to -proposed and the stable release team approves the upload
<jtaylor> then it goes into proposed for people to test, if that succeds it will go into -updates
<jtaylor> its for packages already published in stable releases
<jtaylor> see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates
<hakermania> Oh got it, it's for package updates, for packages that are already in the repositories, new versions etc.
<hakermania> ?
<jtaylor> y
<Laney> ghc takes a depressingly long time to build
<jtaylor> anyone have experience with pynotify?
<directhex> Laney, mcs is uncommonly fast as a compiler - most other things take a long time to build
<Laney> didn't help that i had to disable tmpfs because i don't have enough ram :(
 * Laney eyes bill gates
<jtaylor> be glad youre not compliling pypy
<jtaylor> that monstrosity needs more than 4G ram to compile ._.
<paultag> *cough* eclipse *cough*
<Laney> yes, I have 4G
<nigelb> I keep my room warm with that.
<nigelb> (eclipse)
<jtaylor> well then you do not have enough to compile pypy ^^
<jtaylor> < 4G and it started swapping after 45 minutes :(
<paultag> jtaylor: to the build farm!
<jtaylor> and it prints nice but useless mandelbrot pictures onto the terminal instead of percentage indicators
<hakermania> Can a feature freeze exception bug filled in and requested i.e. tommorow?
<Laney> yes
<Rhonda> wow. bug-watch-updater seems to work again. a bit delayed, but â¦
 * Rhonda . o O ( bug #693584 fixed in debian in may, bug-watch-updater noticed half an hour ago :) )
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 693584 in wesnoth-1.8 (Ubuntu) "wesnothd-1.8 file location asked when starting server" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/693584
<hakermania> Should I request deletion of wallch in revu so as to be removed from there? I want to upload ASAP the 2nd version and I don't know what to do or how. Should i simply use 'dput -f' as usual?
<Laney> just upload it again, yes
<hakermania> Laney, thanks, about the 'subscribe (don't assign to) ubuntu-release' step of filling a feature freeze exception bug, how do I do this? i am on the step of 'Further information' (regarding the bug report) but I can't see anywhere saying 'subscribe X'
<hakermania> Is this later?
<Laney> it's on the right
<Laney> after you've filed the bug
<hakermania> OK thanks again
<Rhonda> Is a sync request meant to be set to confirmed or triaged by the MOTU, or left as New after subscribing ubuntu-archive? I somehow had the impression that it should be set to confirmed for ACKs, now I see triaged with someone else â¦
<Rhonda> I don't find this documented in the wiki at all under SyncRequestProcess, to be honest â¦
<Laney> either should be fine. I'm not sure what the archive admin scripts actually require
<Laney> cjwatson: ^ ?
<Rhonda> requestsync sets confirmed :)
<micahg> Rhonda: yeah, I'm keeping an eye on eclipse 3.7, I already requested one new build-dep to be sync'd and let the release team know we might need an FFe for it
<Rhonda> Great!  Not that I use it myself, but â¦  ;)
<iulian> Rhonda: I usually set them to Confirmed.
<Rhonda> Me too, just though saw two request ACKs done by debfx and was puzzled for a moment :)
<iulian> New means that the syncs haven't been looked at if I recall correctly.
<iulian> Triaged and confirmed are used interchangeably noawadays for ack'd syncs.
<iulian> From what I can see...
<hakermania> hey
<hakermania> What about this bug?
<hakermania> http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/revu1-incoming/wallch-1108101954/lintian
<Laney> it looks like the sync script doesn't care about the status
<hakermania> when I built the application in 11.10 it complained for the opposite
<Laney> 3.9.2 is fine
<Laney> the server probably has an old lintian
<hakermania> nice to hear that
<hakermania> How does it sound? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/824102
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 824102 in Ubuntu "Please FeatureFreeze Exception for Wallch 2.0" [Undecided,New]
<iulian> Laney: How's Notts holding on with regards to the rioters and looters? I've heard that it had some action as well.
<Laney> iulian: not so bad compared, check out the police website for a summary
<hakermania> How would I know if my bug report for featurefreeze exception is accepted?
<Laney> the release team will update it
<dupondje> Could somebody check if https://bugs.launchpad.net/pkg-gearman/+bug/682680 still doesn't build on a sbuilder ? Seems to build fine on a pbuilder here
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 682680 in gearmand (Ubuntu) "New upstream release, gearmand 0.23" [Wishlist,Incomplete]
<geser> dupondje: you could test it by uploading to a PPA (for test-building)
<dupondje> true, lets see :)
<micahg> dupondje: that would be interesting if it builds, but understandable
<dupondje> micahg: https://launchpad.net/~dupondje/+archive/ppa/+packages the amd64 did build fine
<dupondje> the i386 fails somehow
<micahg> dupondje: interesting
<dupondje> FAIL: libtest/unittest
<dupondje> but WHY lovely :)
<dupondje> no errors it seems
<ajmitch> it'd be more understandable if it failed in building the arch-independent parts, but silently failing unit tests on i386 only is just annoying
<dupondje> true :)
<dupondje> it fails in pbuilder on i386 also btw
<dupondje> stupid thing :p
<juli_> Hi! Could someone please tell me if it is possible to remove a source and binary packages  after FF?
<juli_> Or packages removal is considered to be a new feature?
<dupondje> why you would want to remove a package ?
<juli_> well, if I won't be able to find someone who will support and update it, it is  better to remove
<dupondje> what package are you talking about ?
<juli_> anyway it is better to know if there is any deadline for removal
<juli_> netbeans
<Laney> did you speak to juli_?
<Laney> erm
<Laney> you are juli_ :P
<Laney> are you no longer able to maintain it?
<juli_> yes
<Laney> I don't think there's a specific deadline really, to answer your question
<ajmitch> deadline is probably when the archive is finally frozen a few hours before release
<ajmitch> packages have been removed up until then before
<juli_> ok, thanks!
<juli_> I'll try to safe the package anyway:)
<TheMuso> A lot of packages depend on netbeans.,
<TheMuso> I was working on one such last week.
<TheMuso> And not being up on java stuff, wasn't able to get it to build.
<Laney> I don't see any
<juli_> what is the name of the package?
<Laney> I'm sure a lot of users rely on it though
<juli_> I'm currently investigating the impact from removal, so any info is welcome)
<TheMuso> I can't remember off the top of my head.
<dupondje> is it that hard to upgrade it ?
<TheMuso> visualvm
<juli_> visualvm depends on libnb-platform-java
<Laney> ah, build depends
<TheMuso> Still a dependency.
<TheMuso> Whether it be build or runtime.
<juli_> Laney, what package?
<micahg> yeah, visualvm is the only external thing that deps on netbeans and it's a build time dep
<dupondje> micahg: any idea how to debug the issue ? :) running make test in a pbuilder fails also
<dupondje> make -d test doesn't give any usefull info
<micahg> dupondje: clean chroot
<dupondje> have that in a clean chroot now :)
<Laney> TheMuso: I know, I meant that I only checked apt-cache rdepends.
<TheMuso> Laney: right
<micahg> juli_: visualvm is the only thing and it's a build time dependency
<juli_> yes I see, thanks. I'll talk to doko about that
<matttbe> Hello,
<matttbe> I'm looking for one sponsor (or more) in order to upload 3 packages before the feature freeze (sorry to be a bit late :-/) in universe: cairo-dock, cairo-dock-plug-ins and latexila.
<matttbe> All these 3 packages are beta versions (they are almost stable but perfectly usable!) and their stable versions are expected for September or before.
<matttbe> I've opened 3 bug reports linked to 3 bzr branches with 3 merge proposals:
<matttbe> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/cairo-dock/+bug/823513
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 823513 in cairo-dock (Ubuntu) "Please update Cairo-Dock to 2.4.0~0beta2 version (before the FF)" [Undecided,New]
<matttbe> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/cairo-dock-plug-ins/+bug/823514
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 823514 in cairo-dock-plug-ins (Ubuntu) "Please update Cairo-Dock Plug-Ins to 2.4.0~0beta2 version (before the FF)" [Undecided,New]
<matttbe> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/latexila/+bug/823566
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 823566 in latexila (Ubuntu) "Please update LaTeXila to 2.1.1 (= 2.2.0 beta) version (before the FF)" [Undecided,New]
<matttbe> 'bzr merge-upstream' has been used to commit these revisions on these bzr branches and they should be ready to be uploaded on Universe.
<matttbe> Note that I've compiled them with pbuilder and test it on Ubuntu Oneiric with a liveUSB
#ubuntu-motu 2011-08-11
<porthose> Â±
<hakermania> Hell - o :P
<dupondje> can things still get synced today ?
<dupondje> as FF is today right ?
<micahg> dupondje: 2100 now
<dupondje> uh ?
<micahg> dupondje: Feature freeze is 2100 UTC
<dupondje> oh ok :D
<dupondje> can you sync clang for me ? :)
<dupondje> it will fix some ftbfs currently, so guess we'd like it :D
<micahg> dupondje: can you file a request please, I"m about to step out
<dupondje> k
<geser> dupondje: is it a new upstream version? we can still sync new revision from Debian after FF as long as it doesn't violate the FF
<dupondje> Its a new version in debian yea
<balachmar> Hi, I have asked here about a new version of eclipse (3.7) and I was told to see whether the version in debian experimental would install properly
<balachmar> However, I am unsure, how I should proceed.
<balachmar> I have read something about packaging earlier, and I remember something about using the "dsc" file should I use that now as well, or start with the debian.tar.gz?[eclipse_3.7~exp-2.dsc]
<jtaylor> pulling the dsc with dget will fetch all that is needed
<jtaylor> dget -ux url-to-dsc
<jtaylor> but its probably a bit late to get it into oneiric
<jtaylor> feature freeze in  3 hours
<balachmar> yeah I know
<balachmar> But if it works flawlessly (which I do not expect) I could always ask for an exception
<balachmar> And if it doesn't work flawlessly, it is good to know, right :)
<balachmar> Or maybe later for backports or something
<hakermania> Wait, feature freeze wasn't expected to take place today? Or at 23:59:59 today?
<jtaylor> 2100 UTC
<hakermania> jtalor, that means...?
<hakermania> jtaylor,
<balachmar> UTC = GMT
<balachmar> so that is in 2:18
<jtaylor> coordinated universal time
<balachmar> I will try to build Eclipse 3.7 in pbuilder. And will post results here
<OwaisL> Hey guys, could someone help me out with mentioning dependencies in debain/control ? The problem is I've a bunch of dependencies on GIR files.
<OwaisL> to be more precise how to do something like this gir1.2-package-*
<OwaisL> Actually, i had mentioned gir1.2-indicate-0.5 as dependency which was just bumped to 1.6 and now I have to manually update the control file. Is there a "wildcard" way of doing this?
<jtaylor> for build dependencies no
<jtaylor> runtime dependencies usually via substitution variables, but that requires that there is a tool to create them
<jtaylor> I'm unfamiliar if that exists for gir
<OwaisL> It is runtime dependency. So I have to manually edit control each time then. Bummer,  got like bunch of gir deps.
<jtaylor> dh_girrepository?
<jtaylor> just googled that: http://www.makelinux.net/man/1/D/dh_girepository
<OwaisL> jtaylor, thanks mate! will check it out.
<pindonga> hey ajmitch , I just happened to see you uploaded django-configglue! a million thanks!
<ajmitch> pindonga: no problem, sorry I cut it close :)
<pindonga> on the contrary
<Laney> what a great guy!
<ajmitch> Laney: :P
<pindonga> I'm grateful you took  all the work
<Laney> was this an rdep of something cool?
<ajmitch> Laney: django-configglue wasn't, configglue itself is used by U1
<Laney> aha
<ajmitch> so that depends on your opinion of ubuntu one :)
<Laney> my fingers hurt
<Laney> jfyi
<ajmitch> been too busy working?
<Laney> if only
<Laney> just climbing
<Laney> got mocked by a teenage girl for being pants at one climb
<ajmitch> hah
 * Elbrus is not good enough in English to understand the expression "for being pants"
 * Elbrus also climbs (but only outdoor)
<Laney> = bad
<Elbrus> aha
<ajmitch> you need to understand British English :)
<pindonga> Laney, django-configglue is cool by itself ;-) (don't heed to the developer :p)
<ajmitch> right, but nothing in oneiric depends on it yet :)
<Laney> heh, I believe you :-)
<pindonga> ajmitch, yeah
<dupondje> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/clang/+bug/824800 => could somebody ack? Package builds fine
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 824800 in clang (Ubuntu) "Sync clang 2.9-8 (universe) from debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,New]
* ScottK changed the topic of #ubuntu-motu to: Natty Released! - Natty SRUs can be uploaded | Oneiric: Feature Freeze - Open for bug fixing | Want to get involved with the MOTU? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing | Sponsor queue: http://bit.ly/fz6AyQ | http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/ftbfs | http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/NBS | http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/bugs/rcbugs/ | Congrats to new core-dev: SpamapS
<micahg> dupondje: I think that's more bugfix than feature personally
<micahg> dupondje: ignore me :), that's still a feature...
<dupondje> we need it to fix ftbfs of some packages :)
<dupondje> And another question, see https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/apcalc/+bug/817579 . When do we choose libreadline-gplv2-dev, when libreadline-dev?
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 817579 in apcalc (Ubuntu) "Fix FTBFS on oneiric" [Undecided,Incomplete]
<micahg> dupondje: well, that should be easy enough for an FFe
<micahg> dupondje: it depends on the licensing, anything that's not compatible with the new readline6 license, needs to use libreadline-gplv2-dev
<dupondje> readline6 is indeed gplv3
<dupondje> but don't ask me whats the difference ... :)
<micahg> dupondje: I think this is why doko wanted the transition handled in Debian :)
<dupondje> yea he reported a bug 2 years ago in debian ...
<ubottu> Error: Launchpad bug 2 could not be found
<dupondje> no response
<dupondje> guess somebody should nmu it ...
<micahg> I thought apcalc was just uploaded in debian
<micahg> oh, maybe not, that was another thing w/readline
<dupondje> http://packages.qa.debian.org/a/apcalc.html guess not :D
<dupondje> package builds with libreadline-dev & libreadline-gplv2-dev ... but no idea what one is the one to choose for this license
<tumbleweed> dupondje: you'll notice that one depends on libreadline 5 and one on 6. If you don't have a good reason to need gplv2, stick to -dev
#ubuntu-motu 2011-08-12
<ajmitch> ScottK: what's needed to be done for bug 788524 ?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 788524 in python-defaults (Ubuntu) "backport dh_python2 to lucid (and maverick if appropriate)" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/788524
 * ajmitch still runs lucid on the laptop, it gets a bit hard to build source packages on here
<ScottK> ajmitch: Needs a patch.
<ScottK> The trick is to backport just the needed parts of python-defaults, not all of it.
<micahg> shouldn't that bug have tasks for the appropriate releases?
<ScottK> No.  It should be against *-backports
<micahg> ok, then 1 or 2 -backports tasks rather than the UBuntu task
<ajmitch> the duplicate bug says that it'll likely be done via SRU rather than backport
<micahg> that seems risky for an SRU
<micahg> IMHO
<ajmitch> any SRU has some risk, if it's just dh_python2 then it just affects packages at build time
<ajmitch> just looking at the ftbfs list, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/php-compat/1.6.0a3-1/+build/2649444 looks a bit odd
<ajmitch> failed to upload due to a 1 jan 1970 timestamp in the .deb
 * micahg could try in sbuild locally to see if it's reproducible
<ajmitch> all the files in question are under the tests/ directory, so it could be an oddity of the build process that LP isn't liking
<ScottK> I saw this happen once in qt4-x11.
<ScottK> In that case the files were actually getting regenerated with the old time.
<ScottK> I don't recall how.
<ScottK> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/59228404/qt4-x11_4%3A4.7.1-0ubuntu1_4%3A4.7.1-0ubuntu2.diff.gz and the next upload too.
<ajmitch> well it looks like the timestamps are set incorrectly in the source package in this case
<ajmitch> -rwxr-xr-x 1 ajmitch ajmitch  526 1970-01-01 21:14 loadconstant.phpt
<ajmitch> I guess that LP is just a bit stricter about it
<Rhonda> duh
<Rhonda> bug-watch-updater is â¦ strange
<Rhonda> http://mimiandeunice.com/2010/07/27/please/
<iulian> Rhonda: Heh.
<Rhonda> iulian: First thought when I saw that was the CoC :)
<hakermania> Do you think I should speak to a MOTU so as to have the application reviewed? It's very clean and clear and I think it needs a small review... Or do you think I should way for them? :/
<hakermania> wait*
<iulian> Is this about a new package?
<tumbleweed> iulian: yes it is. hakermania: I repeat my suggestion that you attempt to get it into Debian first
<hakermania> tumbleweed, a package specially designed about ubuntu should go through ubuuntu
<tumbleweed> oh, I thought this wasn't
<hakermania> tumbleweed, I suppose that wallch would work on Debian but has lots of features like unity shortcuts that makes wallch an Ubuntu's package first of all
<hakermania> And I also don't know if the featurefreeze exception has been accepted..... -_-
<tumbleweed> hakermania: (with a release team hat on) it'll almost certainly be accepted
<nigelb> tumbleweed: heh, didn't know you had that hat :)
<tumbleweed> nigelb: it's new :)
<nigelb> tumbleweed: :)
<jtaylor> hm when the subscription of sru team gets removed from a bug without a comment, does that mean denied?
<tumbleweed> nigelb: Laney and I are looking after FFes universe (and I'm reporting on universe status in the weekly meetings, which was why I was interested in FTBFS-jamming)
<tumbleweed> jtaylor: that sounds more like a mistake. Was it clear it was an SRU?
<nigelb> tumbleweed: ah!
<jtaylor> tumbleweed: bug 811721
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 811721 in pycryptopp (Ubuntu) "update pycryptopp to version 0.5.29-1 in natty" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/811721
<micahg> dupondje: new apcalc in Debian :)
<tumbleweed> jtaylor: I don't see it being removed: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pycryptopp/+bug/811721/+activity
<jtaylor> oh I had my javascript off
<tumbleweed> jtaylor: surely it should be nominated for natty?
<jtaylor> did not know the subscriptions re loaded dynamically
<jtaylor> yes
<tsmithe> hi - i'm trying to fix bug 770742, an ftbfs that seems to have something to do with gcc 4.6, but unfortunately, i don't know enough about c++ to understand the error or find a solution..
<hakermania> tumbleweed: even if it is, will anyone have the time to take a look?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 770742 in musescore (Ubuntu Oneiric) "musescore version 1.0+dfsg-2 failed to build on amd64 with GCC-4.6/oneiric" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/770742
<tsmithe> the error is "invalid conversion from 'const SLine*' to 'SLine*' [-fpermissive]"
<tsmithe> and the line is "SLine* sl = static_cast<const SLine*>(el);"
<tsmithe> could someone give me a pointer? (i don't know where to find a handy gcc changelog that will help with this)
<tumbleweed> hakermania: yeah, I'll look at it again. You could also help us by working on other packages :)
<jtaylor> tsmithe: add a const befor SLine* sl
<hakermania> tumbleweed, I am preparing for final school exams, but why not? If you don't have time don't look at it, seriously
<tsmithe> jtaylor: thanks, i'll give that a go. what changed that means the cast is invalid now whilst not before?
<micahg> ugh, why would you static_cast a const pointer to a non-const pointer
<tsmithe> (as i said, i don't know enough about c++ semantics...)
<tsmithe> micahg: :s i wish i knew more about this
<jtaylor> tsmithe: the compiler is stricter, here a pointer is cast to const but the const is lost in the assignment
<micahg> oh, I guess that does make sense to have a copy to play with
<tsmithe> jtaylor: right, and owing to the new strictness, it won't solve it implicitly
<tsmithe> micahg: could you explain what it means, and why you objected a second ago?
<tsmithe> and why it's actually ok?
<tsmithe> (i'd like to learn a little)
<tsmithe> jtaylor: (i suppose that should have a '?' at the end)
<jtaylor> what?
<tsmithe> "jtaylor: right, and owing to the new strictness, it won't solve it implicitly"?
<jtaylor> it can solve it implicitly, but the compiler sees this is a bug and complains
<jtaylor> gcc gets increasingly better at spotting errors made by the programmer
<jtaylor> instead of ignoring it, it now complains
<jtaylor> if you want to drop constness, you have to use const_cast
<jtaylor> then the compiler assumes you know what you are doing
<hakermania> jtaylor, I can confirm this, in 11.04 I had no warnings and in 11.10 I had 4 warnings! Of course I fixed them too
<tsmithe> jtaylor: right. i'll do what you suggested. i just wish i knew the language better so i could grasp these semantics. what i'd really like is an introduction to C++ from the perspective of academic logic, rather than from the perspective of the newbie programmer (which, i would hazard, would not cover what i'm interested in)
<jtaylor> a few more details: what is done here is take the el pointer, and cast it to const Sline* (for whatever reason)
<jtaylor> it then assigns it to SLine* which is not const, so the ast to const is made obsolete
<jtaylor> c++ does not allow implicitly dropping constness, so you get an error
<tsmithe> right, so would that mean that the cast to const is just redundant? what's its purpose?
<jtaylor> no the cast is probably correct, but the type it is assigned to is incorrect
<tsmithe> i suppose i don't really know what "const" actually guarantees
<jtaylor> in efect its this: static_cast<SLine*>(static_cast<const SLine*>(el)) which is not allowed
<jtaylor> it means the object the pointer points to ist constant and cannot be modified
<jtaylor> so if you try to change it the compiler will detect it and error out
<jtaylor> it is good practice to make everything const that should not change to help the compiler in spotting bugs
<tsmithe> well, that makes sense to me at least syntactically, and your explanation fits with my intuition - thanks. unfortunately, the cast is more problematic than that, because the next line is "sl->lineSegments().size() > 0", which also generates a bug: "passing âconst SLineâ as âthisâ argument of âQList<LineSegment*> SLine::lineSegments()â discards qualifiers [-fpermissive]"... but that's odd, to me (on the basis of your definition), because that c
<jtaylor> and a very ugly c++ quirk: to get a constant pointer to non constant object you would do: type * const = pointer
<tsmithe> extraordinary
<micahg> tsmithe: here's a pointer on const pointers: http://www.learncpp.com/cpp-tutorial/610-pointers-and-const/ :)
<tsmithe> thanks!
<jtaylor> ok so the code is not really const correct :/
<jtaylor> the lineSegments function should be declared const if it does not change the object
<jtaylor> then you can use it from const pointers
<jtaylor> has the bug been forwarded upstream?
<micahg> tumbleweed: good to have you back to do the MOTU release update :)
<tsmithe> jtaylor: unfortunately, no, not yet. i've been ill for a while and rather neglected the package (which i maintain in debian). tragically, they just made a new release - and so i'm frantically trying to get bugs fixed and a FFe applied for...
<tsmithe> but, i'll speak to upstream/try to produce a patch, and work with what i've got
<jtaylor> a simple solution to get it to compile would be to replace static_cast<const SLine*>(el) with const_cast<SLine*>(el)
<tsmithe> they are developing on natty, so i don't suppose the gcc strictness has got them
<jtaylor> that will behave as with gcc < 4.6
<jtaylor> but the code should be fixed correctly
<tsmithe> jtaylor: yes, i guessed something like that from your comment about const_cast earlier
<tsmithe> i'll go with that bodge and forward it upstream
<hyperair> jtaylor: out of curiosity, what's the type of el?
<hyperair> and what are you trying to cast it to?
<hyperair> it sounds like you're trying to cast away the const?
<hyperair> but i don't see how static_cast<const blah*> would cause trouble.
<tsmithe> "Element* el" is passed to the function that the bug occurs in..
<jtaylor> hm el is not const
<tsmithe> no..
<jtaylor> then you can use static_cast not const_cast
<hyperair> then you shouldn't be using const_cast at all.
<hyperair> yeah
<tsmithe> but the <const SLine*>?
<hyperair> it should work.
<jtaylor> just drop the const
<hyperair> yea
<tsmithe> right, thought so
<tsmithe> bizarre
<hyperair> but casting things from non-const to const is implicit.
<hyperair> you don't even need a cast for that.
<tsmithe> what differentiates <type> from (type)? (ie, what is "<...>"?)
<hyperair> tsmithe: what you should be checking is... is Sline a parent of Element?
<tsmithe> hyperair: i'll have a look
<jtaylor> between the <> is the type it should be cast to
<hyperair> so is ()
<jtaylor> in the () is the variable beeing casted
<hyperair> but () is a c-style cast.
<hyperair> C++ has three different kinds of casts, all of which have different effects.
<jtaylor> well technically no
<hyperair> with () there's no telling which kind of cast you'd get.
<jtaylor> only dynamic_cast has a different effect
<hyperair> hmm no
<jtaylor> the others do the same but have different names for code clearity
<hyperair> reinterpret_cast is different.
<hyperair> static, dynamic, reinterpret.
<jtaylor> ereinterpret_cast also does a normal cast
<hyperair> no it doesn't.
<hyperair> if you reinterpret a float as an int, it'll go haywire
<tsmithe> ah, the confusion isn't just mine, it seems!
<jtaylor> yes but you can do that with static_cast to
<tsmithe> i'll have a look at the link micahg posted
<jtaylor> reinterpret cast does no runtime type checking
<tsmithe> mmhmm
<jtaylor> dynamic_cast does
<jtaylor> the different name just exists to make it clear in the code that the type changes to something different
<tsmithe> right
<micahg> tumbleweed: FYI, we'll most likely need an FFe for eclipse and rdeps if I or someone else can get it working without breaking the world (I mentioned it last week in the release meeting)
<hyperair> 23:34:27 <hyperair> {float a = -1.0; int b = static_cast<int>(a);cout << b;}
<tsmithe> hyperair: by the looks of things, you're right - SLine is indeed a parent of Element
<hyperair> 23:34:29 <geordi> -1
<hyperair> 23:34:33 <hyperair> {float a = -1.0; int b = reinterpret_cast<int>(a);cout << b;}
<hyperair> 23:34:34 <geordi> error: invalid cast from type 'float' to type 'int'
<hyperair> tsmithe: then you can static_cast it from Element to SLine.
<hyperair> at least, you should be able to
<tsmithe> k. thanks for the help
<tsmithe> and thanks for the code example :)
<hyperair> 23:36:03 <hyperair> struct A{}; struct B : A{}; int main() { B *x = new B; const A *y = static_cast<const A*>(x); }
<hyperair> 23:36:05 <geordi> <no output>
<hyperair> that works.
<jtaylor> yes for pointers its the same, builtin types not
<jtaylor> thx did not remember that
<tsmithe> great. and it builds!
<tsmithe> cheers all :)
<hyperair> =)
<tsmithe> hopefully mad things won't happen at runtime either..
<hyperair> actually iirc you don't even need a static_cast to cast to parent
<hyperair> 23:38:29 <hyperair> struct A{}; struct B : A{}; int main() { B *x = new B; const A *y = x; }
<hyperair> 23:38:31 <geordi> <no output>
<hyperair> see
<hyperair> jtaylor: afaik reinterpret_cast means force-cast it to whatever other type, i don't care how. i was pretty surprised to see an error message when reinterpreting a float as an int.
<tumbleweed> micahg: thanks, yeah I saw you mention it in the minutes (although I'll admit I already forgot) :)
<hyperair> there was a cast_damnit_cast as well iirc.
<hyperair> =p
<tsmithe> i'll try that as well, but it looks scary, as taking the line in isolation would make it look like el and sl were of the same type...
<tsmithe> ah, and: "invalid conversion from âElement*â to âSLine*â"
<tsmithe> i'll go back to casting
<tsmithe> hyperair: haha
<hyperair> hmm? weird.
<tsmithe> i'm no expert..
<hyperair> are you sure Element is a child of SLine?
<jtaylor> then you need a reinterpret_cast or dynamic_Cast
<jtaylor> it should be
<jtaylor> the type is checked above
<jtaylor> if (el->type() == HAIRPIN || el->type() == OTTAVA || el->type() == TEXTLINE) {
<tsmithe> hyperair: oh, crap - i misread the code. SLine is a chile of Element, not vice versa
<hyperair> tsmithe: then it's dynamic_cast.
<tsmithe> i think
<hyperair> tsmithe: because you're downcasting.
<jtaylor> reinterpret_cast would be what is intended
<tsmithe> yet static_cast didn't give any error?
<hyperair> i figured as much (because logically a line is an element, but an element is not necessarily a line ;-)
<jtaylor> else probably the check would not have been used
<hyperair> tsmithe: it should have.
<tsmithe> hyperair: yes, sorry, i misread your initial question i think (to follow that logic..)
<tsmithe> strange..
<hyperair> tsmithe: oh wait, i guess you can downcast using static_cast
<hyperair> it just doesn't do any checking.
<hyperair> 23:42:28 <hyperair> struct B{}; struct A : B{}; int main() { B *x = new B; const A *y = static_cast<const A*>(x); }
<hyperair> 23:42:29 <geordi> <no output>
<tsmithe> yeah
<tsmithe> so i'll go for dynamic_, i guess, yes?
<hyperair> 23:43:53 <hyperair> struct B{}; struct A : B{}; struct C : B{}; int main() { B *x = new A; const C *y = static_cast<const C*>(x); }
<hyperair> 23:43:55 <geordi> <no output>
<hyperair> this is super unsafe.
<tsmithe> mmm
<hyperair> because as you can see, you can now treat y as a C.
<hyperair> but it's not a C, but an A.
<jtaylor> given the code context dynamic_cast is probably not wanted
<hyperair> yeah
<tsmithe> yes. fortunately, C and A seem pretty identical in that code
<hyperair> since there's a ->type == blah
<tsmithe> jtaylor: go on?
<hyperair> i'm guessing it already knows what type it wants.
<hyperair> but what horrible code.
<hyperair> tsmithe: dynamic_cast is like static_cast, but slower because it checks to make sure you're casting to the correct type.
<hyperair> tsmithe: during runtime.
<hyperair> tsmithe: however, since you've already checked stuff like el->type() == blah blah
<hyperair> i'm guessing that in those conditions, it can *only* be a SLine
<hyperair> however, it's very dangerous code
<hyperair> the potential for screwup is high.
<tsmithe> quite. i might leave it as dynamic_ for the safety. what sort of performance tradeoff is there?
<jtaylor> if you do that you also need to put in result checks and a bailout
<jtaylor> else the dynamic cast is pointless as it will crash anyway
<hyperair> tsmithe: dynamic_cast may throw if you attempt to cast like what i showed you with A and C just now.
<hyperair> it throws std::bad_cast
<hyperair> if you don't catch it, it'll crash.
<hyperair> but it'll crash early and cleanly.
<hyperair> rather than continuing on and segfaulting in some obscure manner that doesn't give you a sensible stack trace.
<hyperair> s/may throw/will throw/
<hyperair> actually wait, it may throw, or it may give you NULL
<hyperair> i think.
<jtaylor> it returns a null pointer when dealing with poiinters
<jtaylor> it only throws when using references
<tsmithe> surely NULL is almost as bad as continuing on and segfaulting in some obscure manner?
<jtaylor> but I think it can be changed to always throw
<hyperair> http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20071106101012AAggZAk
<hyperair> aha.
<hyperair> it throws bad_cast when you're casting references
<hyperair> but when you're casting pointers, it just gives you a nullptr.
<hyperair> jtaylor: i don't think it can be.
<hyperair> tsmithe: well almost as bad, i guess.
<jtaylor> you could, be dereferencing it ^^
<hyperair> but no, not quite as bad.
<tsmithe> in that case, and because of the need for checks/bailout (which i'm not up to implementing), i'll revert to the hacky static_cast.
<hyperair> fixing a nullptr deref segfault is much much easier than fixing memory corruption
<hyperair> in which case you probably would get memory corruption due to an unchecked bad cast.
<tsmithe> choices choices
<hyperair> tsmithe: or you could static_cast, and put a comment with BIG FAT WARNING
<tsmithe> i'll leave it at static_cast, and forward the bug upstream
<tsmithe> with a slap on the wrist :)
<hyperair> but at the end of the day it's upstream's choice.
<tsmithe> quite
<hyperair> what package is this?
<tsmithe> musescore
 * hyperair adds that to his mental blacklist of applications to ever use. =p
<tsmithe> oh, it's quite a good application, in terms of functionality :p - unrivalled, you could say..
<tsmithe> unforunately, i guess this interesting coding style might be fairly prevalent, as i do occasionally get reports of obscure segfaults that i can't reproduce...
<tsmithe> *unfortunately
<jtaylor> hyperair: what to you critisize about that code?
<jtaylor> it seems to deal with deserialization, there this method is quite common
<hyperair> oh it's deserialization.
<hyperair> whoops =\
<tsmithe> ?
<hyperair> well i guess deserialization is the exception to the rule where you can use this kind of ugly code
<jtaylor> on the other hand its xmlexport = serialization, and there it probably sucks :)
<jtaylor> the filename
<tsmithe> mmmm
<jtaylor> though it was xmlimport
<tsmithe> nope
<jtaylor> the issue is, when serializing polymorphic objects you need to save which type they where (usually by using uuid's) when reading in you then do these kinds of if (obj->type()) static_cast<Obj*>(type)
<jtaylor> for deserialization on the other hand you can use dynamic_cast direclty making the code often cleaner
<tsmithe> and that's ok, because you *know* the cast will work
<tsmithe> ?
<jtaylor> s/de//
<jtaylor> yes
<jtaylor> swap serialization and deserialzation in those two sentences
<tsmithe> i did :)
<hyperair> um? really?
<hyperair> sounds to me more like you'd use static_cast for performance purposes since when you're deserializing you'd know exactly what each type was.
<jtaylor> yes, but I seaid serializing when I meant deserializing
<hyperair> on the other hand, i don't really see a point in casting during serializing.
<hyperair> ah
<hyperair> right
<hyperair> s/de// means s/deserializing/serializing/ ;-)
<wibblymat> I'm looking for some advice on how best to help out. I joined in with a couple of bug jams last month and that was a pretty good intro to packaging. But day to day I'm struggling to find stuff to work on.
<wibblymat> Or at least: stuff to work on that doesn't get fixed by someone else while I'm still investigating :)
<micahg> hi wibblymat!
<wibblymat> hi :)
<Pici> Perhaps the bitesize bugs list? Are those still getting tagged?
<micahg> wibblymat: I'd suggest making sure a bug is filed if you're working on an issue and set it to in progress assigned to you
<wibblymat> The ones that are *really* bitesize go very fast
<micahg> wibblymat: FTBFS needs a lot of help still
<tumbleweed> yeah, there are still hundreds of those
<tumbleweed> although a fair number might be quite tricky
<wibblymat> I did a search: tagged as bitesize, no fix released, no branch attached. There are 257 and they all appear to be old tricky bugs that should have had the "bitesize" taken off
<micahg> ssl1.0.0/libav transitions as well needs
<tumbleweed> wibblymat: there are lots of good links in the topic
<tumbleweed> yeah, this ssl transition tends to need patches, not just rebuilds
<wibblymat> micahg: Is there a wiki page for that or somethin
<wibblymat> oops
<wibblymat> +g?
<tumbleweed> wibblymat: http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/transitions/openssl.html
<micahg> tumbleweed: well, it's the patches ones that need help most I would think :)
<tumbleweed> micahg: exactly
<wibblymat> So the deal with the transition is to update the depends to 1.0.0 and then patch it until it runs again?
<micahg> wibblymat: build-dep should be in most cases a versioned dep on libssl-dev
<tumbleweed> and any of them using SSLv2 funcitons will need to have that code removed
<wibblymat> I'll see what I can work out :)
<wibblymat> If I create a branch to fix an ssl1.0.0 transition, who should I inform? There doesn't seem to be a bug open for any of them.
<wibblymat> micahg: tumbleweed: In case either of you are the right people to tell, https://code.launchpad.net/~wibblymat/ubuntu/oneiric/cryptonit/openssl-transition/+merge/71431 is a merge request for libssl-1.0.0 work.
<tumbleweed> wibblymat: you don't need to tell anyone anything, it'll appear on the sponsor queue
<tumbleweed> see http://reports.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/sponsoring/
<tumbleweed> of course, if you want feedback or to ask questions before a sponsor gets around to reviewing it, you are welcome to ask here
<wibblymat> tumbleweed: Ah, ok, it just goes in the queue by magic :) Thanks!
<micahg> wibblymat: thanks, I noticed that, unfortunately, there are many packages in disrepair, eventually they get dropped, but in general, the ones from Debian we don't fix up unless it's for a transition or we're taking over maintenance, so you did the right amount of work :)
#ubuntu-motu 2011-08-13
<hakermania> Yes!!! FeatureFreeze exception taken(https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/824102)!!! Please guys, now I need 2 reviewers!!!
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 824102 in Ubuntu "Please FeatureFreeze Exception for Wallch 2.0" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<hakermania> Laney, thanks :)
<hakermania> Anyways, i have some lessons now and I have to go! If anyone interested in reviewing it now that the featurefreeze exception was accepted, see http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/wallch Many thanks and bye for now!
<c_korn> are those default postinst scripts generated by dh_make available somewhere in the docs ?
<c_korn> ah, got it: /usr/share/debhelper/dh_make/debian/postinst.ex
<truong_an> anyone here, i have some questions when starting packaging
<hakermania> truong_an, speak directly, if it has to do with packaging only, speak to #ubuntu-packaging
<truong_an> thank you!
<hakermania> tumbleweed, how can I help in other projects?
#ubuntu-motu 2011-08-14
<tumbleweed> jtaylor: poke. when are you going to apply for MOTU?
<jtaylor> you think I'm ready for that?
<jtaylor> I'm just involved a couple of month
<tumbleweed> 6 months is the minimum, but you are doing good work and are well involved in the community around here
<tumbleweed> s/minimum/stated recommended minimum/
<jtaylor> I was planning on applying for dm when I ahve my 6 month, I'll also apply for motu then if you recommend it
<micahg> jtaylor: tumbleweed +1, you've definitely have the community involvement and minimum time and good packaging work
 * tumbleweed reckons you could go straight for MOTU, although the DMB recommends going via contributing developer
<micahg> no need to go for contributing developer unless you feel the need to hone your packaging skills more first
 * jtaylor reading application process
<directhex> jtaylor, i don't advocate for DM, fwiw. someone's good enough for DD, or not good enough for DM, IMHO.
<Laney> no
<Laney> well I don't recommend that anyway
<Laney> (UCD)
<jtaylor> hm ucd seems just like an aknowldgement of my current status
<jtaylor> so I could skip that
<micahg> jtaylor: it's mainly for people that have been contributing to development, have sustained effort, but aren't there yet with the packaging skills
<Laney> not necessarily, it's just a way of getting membership
<directhex> micahg, that seems wholly inappropriate in this case
<micahg> directhex: agreed
<micahg> Laney: ubuntu-dev grants membership as well, if the skills + contribution are there, a person can go for at least PPU
<Laney> I know
<Laney> people can go for whatever they want though
<micahg> I know you know :)
<tumbleweed> anyway, jtaylor has the packaging skills, deserves membership, and can probably get good endorsements from a few people in this conversation :)
<jtaylor> thx for your advice, I'll look into applying next week
<sladen> Laney: as it happens ...I picked up a leadlet about bikes on trains in Germany.  In the UK Brompton sponsor+publish a very good "bikes on trains" leaflet (which helpful points out that through the myriad of restrictions, Bromptons /are/ allowed on all services in the UK
<Laney> sladen: oh, that sounds useful. If only Bromptons were something you'd want to take on a bike tour
<Laney> probably 50ish miles per day + carrying camping kit, perhaps not
<jtaylor> hm bug 823009 now needs an ffe as it wasn't confirmed before the freeze or?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 823009 in argparse (Ubuntu) "Sync argparse 1.2.1-1 (main) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/823009
<tumbleweed> jtaylor: it should probably have an FFe request, yes. Which means an explanation for the necessity of the sync
<jtaylor> it is a bit problematic
<tumbleweed> the version we have, or the one you want to sync to?
<jtaylor> the sync will likely introduce an upgrade failure, I spoke with barry about it and he prefers to jsut break it instead of adding a delta
<tumbleweed> what do we gain from doing the sync now, and not in p?
<tumbleweed> not causing this upgrade failure?
<jtaylor> if we only sync in p we have to add a delta for the general users, if we sync now we can just tell the alpha testers how to fix it manually
<jtaylor> the delta is a pretty ugly preinst
<micahg> jtaylor: why not add the delta and sync again in P?
<micahg> oh :(
<jtaylor> ne the delta would ahve to be added to the version in debian
<tumbleweed> jtaylor: the reason for the sync sounds valid. I'd prepare the FFe request (I won't be able to grant it, it's in main, but there is no FFe queue atm)
<tumbleweed> s/I'd/Go ahead and/
<sladen> Laney: very well suited to the task.  I did 20km in an <1 hour to get the ferry earlier this afternoon.  I had camping kit (eg. stove, sleeping bag) aswell as the usual assortment of Debian kits and the like
<sladen> Laney: low centre of gravity and a luggage system that doesn't throw the weight of the bike sideways when you go around a corner++
<Laney> tumbleweed: we can't do main FFes? I wasn't aware of that.
<Laney> I thought everyone did everything.
<Laney> sladen: I ought to try one really
<tumbleweed> Laney: err I know we're there for universe, I assumed that meant we shouldn't do main
<Laney> I just thought we were extra bodies, but maybe we'd pick universe stuff over main if there's a choice
<tumbleweed> Laney: fair enough. it's not like there's motu-release any more
<Laney> indeed, that's part of the point I think :-)
#ubuntu-motu 2012-08-06
<jbicha> micahg: I saw the bug a minute after I synced :(
<micahg> jbicha: well, there's cleanup still :), you could've found an AA to take care of the removal of tob
<micahg> jbicha: it also needs to be moved to multiverse most likely
<micahg> the RC bug was for the licensing
<jbicha> universe shouldn't depend on multiverse, right?
<micahg> right
<micahg> which is why tob needs to be removed
<micahg> (normally would be moved to multiverse, but it's being removed from Debian)
<bdrung> jtaylor: about which package are you talking?
<yaffs> !ops
<ubottu> Help! Hobbsee, Riddell, sladen, fbond, mneptok, gnomefreak, Seveas, dholbach, elkbuntu, PriceChild, or jpds!
<yaffs> !yay
<ubottu> Glad you made it! :-)
<_ruben> errr, ok :)
<LoT> so i have a very generic question, perhaps a MOTU would be able to answer...
<LoT> if i have SRU'd a main package, and uploaded a debdiff, and I've subscribed the sponsors team... should i poke the sponsors mailing list if the SRU should be included in 12.04.1?
<LoT> since that release date is fast approaching
<geser> we have a sponsors mailing list?
<geser> LoT: is it important that the SRU gets on the discs?
<LoT> geser: not sure if it'd hit the discs, might hit the server discs if any, though, because it fixes a medium and a high importance bug in PHP (one being a segfault, and one being a fix to allow php to report errors to the webserver)
<LoT> it was suggested by SpamapS, though, that it might be included in 12.04.1
<LoT> geser: the other problem is that part of the SRU might not be accepted, as its fix is upstream, and awaiting inclusion in Debian (and therefore waiting inclusion in Quantal)
<LoT> and since this is in Main, i was hesitant to drop in here and poke around.
<LoT> (and the php-error-reporting bug was a regression in Precise, that wasnt present in Oneiric)
<LoT> so if only because its a regression, it should be included/fixed (in my opinion)
<geser> LoT: you could create a patch for quantal too (even if it's gets dropped again with the next php5 merge), so it can get SRUed
<LoT> geser: indeed, although its already incorporated into the PHP upstream
<geser> as Debian is in Freeze it might take some time till a new upstream version gets into Debian which then can get merged/synced
 * LoT will have to dig around for the patch and update/refresh the patch in case parts dont apply)
<LoT> geser: apparently i am unable to create bzr branches of my own, so i would have to put the patch up, but i cant include it in the bzr code.
<LoT> i think somewhere my perms got busted.
<LoT> s/busted/screwed up
<geser> you mean pushing to lp:~$user/ubuntu/quantal/php5?
<geser> (assuming you branched lp:ubuntu/quantal/php5)
<LoT> geser: can't even do that
<LoT> apparently, either (1) my SSH keys are no longer valid
<LoT> or (2)
<LoT> bzr is broken on my computer
<LoT> even then, the comp with my PGP keys has no internet here, so i cant do anything now
<geser> you don't need pgp/gpg for this (gpg is only needed when uploading a package)
<geser> re (1) check the ssh key on your computer with that listed on your LP profile page
<geser> if those match than try to get help in #launchpad for why it isn't working for you
<LoT> geser: i plan to, the issue i'm having right now is no internet
<LoT> then again, i AM at work :P
<LoT> (Windows only :/)
<LoT> i'll try branching again, although if bzr is busted on my system, that'll be a problem
 * LoT might have to generate a key specific to his server(s) in order to use those
<heraclide> hello
<heraclide> sorry to disturb, I'm new to ubuntu-motu, I have make some fix to some ubuntu packages swift_1.4.8-0ubuntu2_all.deb, I have created a new package, can someone point me good url to know to to submit it for review please ?
<LoT> geser: is there an SRU freeze right now on Precise?
<Laney> heraclide: probably thisâ¦
<Laney> !sponsprship | heraclide
<LoT> if so, when did that go into effect?
<Laney> !sponsorship | heraclide
<ubottu> heraclide: You can find out about the package sponsorship process here http://wiki.ubuntu.com/SponsorshipProcess - For !UDS sponsorship see http://uds.ubuntu.com/participate/sponsorship/
<Laney> the first link there
<heraclide> thanks, I'll read it :)
<micahg> LoT: seeded packages or stuff affecting seeded packages will on be accepted into proposed if it'll bring us closer to the 12.04.1 release, everything else should be unaffected
<micahg> s/on/only/
<LoT> .w 5
<micahg> scottK: I was wrong, not gcc-4.7, same failure in precise, it's just missing an include I think
<ScottK> OK.
<micahg> maybe if I examine the problem I'll get a better answer :), those variables are defined in various places in the file, but not in that function, seems like some refactoring it needed for a proper fix, possible a copy/paste for a temporary fix
<micahg> scottK: ^^
<ScottK> micahg: If you could have a look at it, that'd be absolutely lovely.
<micahg> ScottK: sorry, can't right now, already doing too many things at once
<ScottK> Sure.  Thanks for looking.
<micahg> scottK: since it has the same issue in unstable, I'd throw it over the fence as an RC bug and see if that elicits a removal RoM response :)
<ScottK> micahg: Good point.  Thanks.
<ScottK> micahg: Debian Bug 684078, in case you care to watch the fun.
<ubottu> Debian bug 684078 in wv2 "calligra: Buffer overflow" [Grave,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/684078
<micahg> scottK: thanks
<LoT> does the MOTU recommend using pbuilder, or sbuild for building packages locally (for testing)
<ScottK> Yes.
<LoT> ScottK: lemme rephrase
<LoT> which is recommended more, pbuilder, or sbuild?
<maxb> They both have their ups and downs
<LoT> given that pbuilder is breaking on my precise system, i'm curious which would be more recommended.
<ScottK> Odd.  It's working here for me.
<ScottK> In 5 1/2 years of Ubuntu/Debian development it's what I've always used.
<LoT> ScottK: apparently my system isnt autoincluding universe and multiverse
<maxb> Neither is intrinsically superior in all use cases
<Laney> usually it's helpful to share the way in which you're seeing breakage
<LoT> even though i have a devscripts that says to
<LoT> Laney: i'd have to retest, i'm still recovering my PGP keys on my main dev system xD
<ScottK> LoT: Use pbuilder-dist from ubuntu-dev-tools as a wrapper.  It makes it much easier.
 * LoT ran into partial partition corruption
<LoT> ScottK: see previous /me
<LoT> i ran into partial system corruption, recovered my /home, and am now working on restoring the data :/
<LoT> until then, well...
 * LoT has been using a build-testing PPA
<maxb> Using a PPA is inadvisable; unnecessary waiting, no ability to break in and examine the state of a failed builds files
<LoT> well generally all i do is build packages with patches (SRU tests)
<LoT> so if it fails, then the patch was invalid :P
<maxb> If you use pbuilder, I highly recommend the cowbuilder addon - makes build startup considerably faster
<LoT> rarely, if at all, do I end up writing the patch, its usually from upstream.
<Quintasan> LoT: You can try sbuild, the downside is that it will download dependencies EVERYTIME (unless I'm configuring it wrong) you build something
<LoT> Quintasan: pbuilder does the same when you daily-purge the base tgz in the cache
<Quintasan> LoT: Who does that actually?
 * LoT grins
<Quintasan> LoT: There is also cowbuilder which uses copy-on-write chroots instead of base.tgz
<LoT> need I say more? :p
<LoT> anyways, time to go home, end of day!
<maxb> Quintasan: Run a local apt caching proxy
<maxb> I use approx, and all my sbuild chroots are set up to download from http://localhost:9999/
<maxb> (or bindmound /var/cache/apt/archives into the chroot, I suppose)
<TheLordOfTime> geser:  you know, its almost easier to make a damn debdiff instead of branching php5's quantal code
 * TheLordOfTime has been running the branch for twenty minutes and hasnt finished
<Laney> nothing wrong with debdiffs
<TheLordOfTime> Laney:  so if i have a patch, for Quantal, and i upload the debdiff *with* the upstream patch, that'd have just as much chance of being accepted as if I requested a code merge from a project branch of my own with the fix?
<ScottK> Probably more.
<ScottK> I don't know of any sponsors that are unwilling to use debdiffs.
<TheLordOfTime> that's typically how i've handled bugs, upload the debdiff rather than branch the code
<TheLordOfTime> given that bzr is horridly evil on this system
<TheLordOfTime> esp. when you're working remotely
<TheLordOfTime> oh, that's interesting...
<TheLordOfTime> apparently the bugcontrol-managed plugin for launchpad improvements is incompatible with Firefox latest on precise...?
<TheLordOfTime> whoops wrong channel :P
 * TheLordOfTime intended that to go to -bugs :p
<TheLordOfTime> btw, any of you happen to notice if the wiki's lagging like hell?
<Laney> It's never snappy.
<Laney> And yeah, everyone knows how to drive patch. Go go debdiff
 * TheLordOfTime agrees with debdiffs
<TheLordOfTime> i do not agree with bzr xD
<micahg> \o/ ghc 7.4.2-2 in unstable
#ubuntu-motu 2012-08-07
<directhex> micahg, time to recompile the world?
<micahg> directhex: almost, we have to make sure it builds in Debian first, otherwise there will be a -3 :)
<Laney> jesus
<Laney> you scared me, I certainly hoped it wasn't unstable
<iulian> :)
<Laney> syncin'
<Laney> (to proposed)
<iulian> Great.
 * dupondje trying to get pbuilder running for lenny :( damn
<dupondje> changed sources.list (in pbuilder-dist lenny login --save-after-login
<dupondje> but on pbuilder-dist lenny update it still uses other sources :(
<Riddell> anyone know why http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/uehs/ doesn't do universe?
<Laney> what do you mean 'do'?
<Laney> http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/uehs/no_updated.html lists universe packages for me
<Laney> Riddell: ^
<Laney> iulian: jbicha: other interested folks: http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/transitions/ghc.html
<geser> Laney: haskell-* packages from round 1 uploaded
<Laney> oh, nice
<Laney> good job I didn't do any yet :P
<geser> do haskell-dummy and haskell-platform really need a rebuild too?
<Laney> red there merely means they are uninstallable
<Laney> just leave those until last and we'll see
<geser> I noticed too late that haskell-diagrams doesn't need a rebuild either (no ABI in Depends:)
<Laney> yeah it's a metapackage
<paultag> hey kirkland - around?
<paultag> kirkland: OK, I'll just leave this here for you - have you thought about getting overlayfs into Debian? It'd be really handy
<arand> I'm getting this issue when trying to (fast-forward) merge from one bzr repo to the other, both contains patches which are committed as applied (LP import from Debian seems to do that bit :( ###bzr: ERROR: Unable to unapply quilt patches for 'other' tree: rmdir: failed to remove `.pc/security-text-command-fix.patch': No such file or directory
<arand> ^that particular patch exists in the updated branch but not the one I'm merging into.
<arand> Also, does the lp branch matter as far as the bzr repo goes, i.e. if the PP and QQ repos are content/commitwise identical would it matter if I branched PP, did some commits and sent that as a merge proposal for QQ?
<geser> Laney: do you have an idea why haskell-text (-1build2) is still complete red?
<geser> I tried "apt-get -s install" for the binary packages and all can be installed (tested on amd64 but it's red too)
<Laney> geser: no
<Laney> let's wait for the next refresh ...
<geser> Laney: looks good now
<geser> we can process level 2 now
<Laney> i'll not do anything tonight
<Laney> so feel free
<geser> me probably neither
#ubuntu-motu 2012-08-08
 * micahg kicks off a few haskell rebuilds
 * ScottK uploads haskell so micahg  can start over.
 * micahg grumbles over the default suite being precise on precise
<bkerensa> micahg: might you know whats causing this bzr error? http://paste.ubuntu.com/1135538/
<bkerensa> nvm I forget to add my ssh key back
<bdrung> micahg: that's for getting you using quantal! :p
<dupondje> Best way to setup a local apt repo is mini-dinstall ?
<dupondje> but then you need to build the packages localle with pbuilder? And then dput them?
<Lasall> don't use mini-dinstall, reprepro is much better, dupondje
<Zhenech> reprepro
<Lasall> and you are not restricted to use pbuilder. just create your package with -sa and then upload it with dput
<Lasall> (if you missed that -sa you can use changestool provided by reprepro)
<dupondje> the package gets builded on the server then?
<paultag> no :)
<Lasall> no, first build it. either with dpkg-buildpackage/debuild/pbuilder/... then upload it
<paultag> remember, you could host an arch:ppc on an arch:i386 machine
<dupondje> true :)
<dupondje> then I need a build machine & repo machine :d
<paultag> (rather then doing a sourceful upload *source*changes, you can do a binary upload, like Debian, and stich together more then one build -- like *amd64*changes
<paultag> )
<paultag> dupondje: you can build them locally before a dput
<paultag> via sbuild, pbuild or any other exoctic what-have you
<dupondje> need to check that :)
<dupondje> thx
<paultag> yarp.
<elgaton> Hi everyone, stumbled across ITP in bug #328324, decided to fix it. Seems the package was in Debian up to Etch, then it got removed due to lack of maintainers. Should I get the old, original changelogs and debian/ files or start with a fresh packaging?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 328324 in Ubuntu "[needs-packaging] webmin" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/328324
<arand> elgaton: It might need quite a bit of work, since I've normally heard it being discouraged on the basis of it being incompatible with the debian/ubuntu administration model...
<elgaton> arand: What kind of work, more precisely?
<arand> I have no idea...
<elgaton> OK, I'll just have a look at it and see
<elgaton> Thanks anyway
<arand> elgaton: The only thing I've heard is what you get from ubottu: "/msg ubottu !webmin"
<elgaton> arand: OK, I think I got a rough idea. Configuration files in Debian/Ubuntu are usually created from templates in /etc/default or the like (then actual configuration files are generated from them using a script). On the contrary, Webmin directly edits the final configuration files, so, when they are regenerated from the templates (e.g. because a new package version is installed), all edits are lost.
#ubuntu-motu 2012-08-09
<micahg> the top 3 uploaders for quantal so far are not-canonical totalling 25%, nice :)
 * ajmitch obviously needs to get in on the haskell action :)
<micahg> wow, ~5k uploads to quantal already
<micahg> ajmitch: 30 rebuilds will get you on the top 50 list :)
<ajmitch> depends if there are 30 left by next week
<micahg> heh, I'm trying to knock off a few a night
<jtaylor> is new still going to be processed before feature freeze?
<StevenK> jtaylor: If it uploaded before feature freeze and it's in NEW after, it still counts as before.
<jtaylor> StevenK: thx thats good
<ajmitch> StevenK: oh right, you're still an AA that I can bribe?
<StevenK> ajmitch: Whaddya got?
<jtaylor> the package I currently have in the queue (fftw3-mpi) is not really new its the same source as the main fftw3
<jtaylor> so it should be easy to process
<StevenK> Two sources == bad
<ajmitch> StevenK: nothing uploaded yet, but I'll try & upload by this weekend
<Logan_> micahg: so, going off of my question
<Logan_> what is the best path in that case?
<micahg> Logan_: so, in cases of non-Ubuntu specific bugs, it's best to get them fixed as far upstream as possible, any diff we carry requires manual work in the future and we want to minimize that where possible/practical
<micahg> In cases where the Debian maintainer hasn't been paying attention to the package, if it's a package you care about, you might want to ask if the maintainer would like help with it
<Logan_> would that be at WNPP?
<Logan_> or would I e-mail the maintainer directly?
<micahg> sometimes an RFH is filed, otherwise, you can mail directly and ask if it appears neglected
<micahg> lots of packages are now team maintained, so if you want to help, you can ask to join the team
<Logan_> okay, awesome
<micahg> if that doesn't help or isn't appropriate, there are cases when an NMU is appropriate, see http://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/developers-reference/pkgs.html#nmu
<micahg> and for the case where it's not RC in Debian but is in Ubuntu, there's the last resort of uploading a fix directly
<Logan_> cool
<dholbach> good morning
<micahg> dholbach: good morning
<dholbach> hey micahg
 * micahg hugs dholbach for restoring the sponsorship queue
<micahg> dholbach: meeting in ~9 hrs?
<dholbach> micahg, not quite restored - see bug 1031764
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1031764 in Launchpad itself "timeout on code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches" [Critical,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1031764
<dholbach> worked around the problem at least
<dholbach> micahg, I'm not 100% sure yet if I can make the meeting, but I'll do my best - this is my first day back after holidays :)
<dholbach> today is a day of meetings
<micahg> dholbach: well, that's a restoration of sorts (I saw the bug comment, that's how I knew it was you)
<micahg> dholbach: welcome back
<dholbach> thanks :)
<pipedream> what is the difference between unity-greeter and lightdm?
<pipedream> http://www.iloveubuntu.net/unity-greeter-updated-support-disable-ready-sound-ubuntu-1204
<pipedream> I thought that was lightdm
<dholbach> pipedream, lightdm is the machinery which starts different greeters - if you ask on #ubuntu-desktop you might get more detailed answers :)
<pipedream> thanks
<arand> Is it possible to request syncs from experimental due to the Debian Freeze?
<Laney> yes
<arand> ok, now just the question if upstream will release in a week or a month...
<Quintasan> Is it acceptable for package to depend on gdb on build-time? There are some tests which require gdb
<Zhenech> I've seen core packages depend on valgrind, so why not also gdb
<Zhenech> (IANAUD)
<Quintasan> Zhenech: Ok, thanks.
<Quintasan> Aww
<Quintasan> It also wants a X session running
<Zhenech> there is something for that too
<Zhenech> look at the libdbusmenu, libindicate, libindicator packages
<Zhenech> also maybe indicator-session, indicator-messages
<Zhenech> they have a full fledged dbus+x testsuite
<Quintasan> Zhenech: Thanks
<jtaylor> Quintasan: ipython uses xvfb-run for its X tests
 * micahg waves to MOTU people
 * paultag waves at micahg, for no particular reason
 * jtaylor waves from chile
<jtaylor> about to go on a 18 hour flight ._.
<paultag> jtaylor: oh jeez. Where to>
<paultag> />/?/
<jtaylor> santiago back to parise then munich
<paultag> :)
<micahg> MOTU meeting?
<jtaylor> oh I might actually have time to attend it for once :)
<dholbach> meeting time
<dholbach> who wants to chair? I'll be back in 3-4 minutes
 * micahg volunteered last time
 * jtaylor off to the airport
<paultag> kirkland: Did you happen to catch my ping a few days ago?
<kirkland> paultag: I did not...
<kirkland> paultag: what's up?
<paultag> kirkland: I was wondering if you'd considered getting overlayfs into Debian
<paultag> (as a module, not part of the default kernel)
<kirkland> paultag: is debian carrying the overlayfs module?
<paultag> No
<kirkland> paultag: so, no, I really haven't considered it, honestly
<kirkland> paultag: I don't have anything to do with overlayfs, other than being a user of it, with the overlayroot package
<kirkland> paultag: I don't run Debian anywhere, on any hardware or vm's
<paultag> OK
<mitya57> dholbach: good evening
<dholbach> mitya57, in a call right now - how can I help?
<mitya57> dholbach: I can wait, I wanted to ask about developer-guide packaging issues
<mitya57> thanks for merging my branches btw
<dholbach> mitya57, anytime - maybe you could mail Andrew SB about this?
<dholbach> https://launchpad.net/~andrewsomething
<dholbach> he was the last to look into things
<mitya57> dholbach: I'll just file a bug then
<dholbach> have a great rest of your day everyone
 * ajmitch sees he was mentioned by Laney in -meeting earlier
<Laney> ajmitch is always on Laney's mind
<ajmitch> that's a bit worrying
<Laney> â¥
<Laney> also, powerpc makes Laney sad
<ajmitch> it's faling behind, or is broken?
<Laney> the former
<Laney> silly private jobs
<ajmitch> aha
<ajmitch> just convince them to get more ppc buildds
<Laney> fix the brokened one
<xnox> Laney: well new kernel is borked, so don't touch the working one and fix the kernel.
<xnox> or downgrade it?
<Laney> what?
 * ajmitch wishes he could use a standard kernel on his arm device
<Laney> I hope the buildds don't run 'new' kernels (and that SRUs aren't regressing hardware) :P
 * micahg sees Laney's keyboard lashing got xnox to join the channel
<Laney> \o/
 * xnox rumbles something incomprehensible
<ajmitch> Laney: SRU's regressing? never
<Laney> LA LA LA
<lifeless> FINGERS IN EAYRS
<Laney> more private jobs!
 * Laney affixes a stare in the direction of micahg 
 * micahg whistles innocently
<ajmitch> Laney: patience...
<micahg> Laney: you can fix Bug #1035097 while you're waiting :)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1035097 in libnet-ssh2-perl (Ubuntu) "dependency to libterm-readkey-perl missing" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1035097
<Laney> not one of my strongest attributes
<ajmitch> nor mine
<gld1982ltd> Hi all...I need help packaging. I want to package lxmed and upload it to my ppa. I am following the instructions on http://developer.ubuntu.com/packaging/html/packaging-new-software.html. I'm at the bzr builddeb -- -us -uc command. I keep getting an empty binary package. can anyone help? This is my first time trying to package an Ubuntu package.
#ubuntu-motu 2012-08-10
<micahg> ScottK: I need some backports advice, bug 1025027 is a backport to fix bugs, but doesn't look worth for an SRU on its own, there are also other bugs fixed, paperwork is in order, I'm leaning towards accepting with a note that the 2 major bugs should be SRUd still if possible, WDYT
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1025027 in Precise Backports "Please backport pokerth 0.9.5-1 (universe) from quantal" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1025027
<micahg> s/worth/worthy/
<ScottK> micahg: Usually we insist on doing the SRU first, but it's a judgment call.  Basically the  SRU won't happen if the backport's been done already, but if the SRu isn't going to happen anyway, it's not something to block the backport on.  In that context, I'd say use your best judgment.
<micahg> Zhenech: ^^ it's your backport, are you interested in doing the stable release update for the crash bug before we do the backport of everything?  (the catch is that people have to select the backport whereas the stable release update will go to almost everyone (unless they uncheck the updates box)
<micahg> dupondje: I see you on the agenda for Monday, but I haven't seen an e-mail to devel-permissions yet
<Zhenech> micahg, uhm, never did an SRU before, but now that you mention it, yes it would be a valid candidate, yeah
<Zhenech> micahg, what's the process in ubuntu, get a as small as possible diff and get it acked by someone as in debian?
<micahg> zhenech: if you're MOTU, just upload to $RELEASE-proposed and subscribe ubuntu-sru once you fill out the paperwork, see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates#Procedure
<Zhenech> micahg, i'm just a stupid DD :)
<micahg> zhenech: so ubuntu-sponsors then
<micahg> but yeah, minimal diff
<micahg> you can bundle the bugs together in on debdiff as well if you want to fix multiple ones
<micahg> *one
<Zhenech> oki
<Zhenech> will do later today
<Zhenech> thanks!
<micahg> zhenech: thanks, the backport looks good for afterwards
<Zhenech> gotta go now, trains :)
 * micahg needs sleep
<Zhenech> micahg, you said two major bugs - LAN crash and the icon issue? the latter would be a binary diff, but thanmkts to 3.0(quilt) it works fine here :)
<dholbach> good morning
<Zhenech> ScottK, can you nominate the two pokerth bugs for precise?
<Laney> Zhenech: any motu can â which are they?
<Zhenech> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pokerth/+bug/1023582
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1023582 in pokerth (Ubuntu) "pokerth crashes when trying to connect a LAN game" [Undecided,Fix committed]
<Zhenech> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pokerth/+bug/947159
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 947159 in Unity "PokerTH Icon size: Its pixelated on the Alt-Tab-Window" [Undecided,New]
<Laney> there you go
<Zhenech> thanks!
<Laney> is it right for the second one to affect unity?
<Zhenech> i guess not, no
<Zhenech> unity picked the right icon, it was just too small
<Zhenech> mh, do I subscribe -sru or -sponsors now?
<Laney> sponsors
<Laney> you don't really need to subscribe sru team these days
<dupondje> micahg: argh, forgot that :) let me fix that first!
<dupondje> thanks for the notice!
<Zhenech> Laney, thanks! done :)
<Laney> sweet
<Zhenech> I bet I did the versioning of the package wrong, but thats easily changed :)
<Laney> ubuntu0.1 would have been more conventional, but it doesn't really matter
<dupondje> micahg: mail sent!
<Laney> as long as the upgrade path is right
<Laney> Zhenech: ah, s/precise/precise-proposed/
<Zhenech> ew, yeah
<Laney> otherwise, uploading
<Zhenech> should I update the package?
<Zhenech> ah okay!
<Laney> nah
<Laney> things like that are easier to JFDI
<Laney> up
<Zhenech> ty!
<dholbach> micahg, I added something about the sqlite move to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/BugFixingInitiative - if you can make some changes you feel are necessary, that'd be great
<arand> Is there an equivalent to -us -uc you can pass to bzr-bd?
<Zhenech> -us -uc
<Zhenech> I call usually
<Zhenech> bzr bd -- -us -uc -S
<Zhenech> hint: the double hyphen is important
<arand> Yeah, I was looking at the help, and I din't see that documented anywhere :(
<arand> thanks :)
<Zhenech>  You can specify extra options to build with
<Zhenech>   by adding them to the end of the command, after using "--" to indicate the
<dholbach> arand, everything passed to bzr bd after the "--" will be passed to debuild
<Zhenech>   end of the options to builddeb itself.
<dholbach> sorry :)
<Zhenech> *pointi finger*
<Zhenech> pointy even
<arand> Oh, it's hidden there in the middle, at the page break and all :/
<nhandler> I'm trying to figure out the reason Ubuntu needed to add a Build-Depends on libssl-dev in quantal for libnet-ssh2-perl (https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libnet-ssh2-perl/0.44-1ubuntu1) in order to not FTBFS. The package builds fine as-is in sid. I'm willing to bet this is due to some "obvious" change we made to our build-process, but I really do not do much with libraries like this
<Laney> is it pulled in indirectly by something else in sid?
<Laney> check the build log to see if it gets installed
<nhandler> Laney: https://buildd.debian.org/status/fetch.php?pkg=libnet-ssh2-perl&arch=i386&ver=0.45-1&stamp=1344579261 does mention that -lssl and -lcrypto were not found, but these are described as being 'probably harmless'. In Ubuntu, they are not found either (without libssl-dev) but this is not harmless
<bkerensa> mm
<nhandler> Someone thought it might be due to us using --as-needed, but he wasn't sure
<nhandler> /39/39
<Bachstelze> In Ubuntu,  they are not found either (without libssl-dev) but this is not harmless
<Bachstelze> but in ubuntu perl does not find that they on't exist, so it tries to link with them anyway
<Bachstelze> so basically for some reason perl thinks they are on the system when they are not
<c_korn> please help, lintian brings the warning "W: bsnes source: debian-rules-ignores-make-clean-error line 12" in this debian/rules file http://pastebin.com/gjZmQjw5
<Lasall> c_korn: is there already a patch system? and if necessary you can override warnings
<c_korn> Lasall: source/format is 3.0 (quilt) if you mean this
<Lasall> I don't know if it is overskill but you can create a patch and add a "-" before rm command in origin make file
<Lasall> quilt new 01_clean.patch
<Lasall> quilt edit Makefiletopatch
<Lasall> quilt refresh
<c_korn> so the error is in the makefile itself? not debian/rules?
<Lasall> yes
<c_korn> ah, so the - on line 37 is the real problem? http://pastebin.com/w1b9XEX7
<Lasall> - means, it won't exist if command fails
<Lasall> *exit
<c_korn> even after this patch the warning remains :/ http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=hsekEBeZ
<c_korn> ah, there is one more clean target in another makefile. although it is not the one which is called on line 12 in debian/rules
<micahg> zhenech: I don't mind the icon issue so much as it's minor, if you'd like to fix that in an SRU, that's fine though
<Lasall> c_korn: and don't remove the - characters in clean targets. they will prevent errors if files don't exist
<dobey> hi motus; would a couple of you mind taking a look at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/1035392 please? thanks
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1035392 in Ubuntu "[needspackaging] u1db" [Undecided,In progress]
<Lasall> dobey: use format line: http://www.debian.org/doc/packaging-manuals/copyright-format/1.0/ in copyright
<dobey> gah, url changed again
 * dobey wishes that would stop
<Lasall> :-D
<dobey> well, fixed it
<nhandler> dobey: The URL should be relatively stable now
 * shadeslayer does some ftbfs hunting
<Zhenech> micahg, already done, yeah :)
<micahg> Laney: can you merge my tracker update please? https://code.launchpad.net/~micahg/%2Bjunk/transition-tracker/
<Laney> sure
<Laney> done
<micahg> thanks, let's hope that fixes it
<Laney> i can add you to the team so you can update it yourself if you want
<micahg> Laney: sure, that would be great, can you also tell me how to do a test output?
<Laney> you might like to use the 'ben' package
<Laney> it's slightly different but should be mostly compatible
 * micahg looked at the man page and got cross-eyed
<Laney> then lp:~ubuntu-transition-trackers/ubuntu-transition-tracker/configs will be the new configs branch
<Laney> something like ben download -g configs/global.conf -c configs/download/archive.ben and then the same with archive_ports.ben
<Laney> then ben monitor -c configs/global.conf -c configs/monitor/ongoing/sqlite.ben
<Laney> off the top of my head
<micahg> Laney: thanks, do you know if negative lookaheads will work in the tracker?
<Laney> it uses a proper pcre module so there's a good chance
<micahg> well, I guess I'll see in about a half hour...
<micahg> ooh, it did work :)
<Laney> nice
<Laney> 30, not so bad
<micahg> right
#ubuntu-motu 2012-08-11
<Laney> mmm empty builders
 * Laney changes that
<jtaylor> does quantal still need xz dpkg-predepends?
<jtaylor> or why is lintian complaining?
<jtaylor> found debian bug 680391
<ubottu> Debian bug 680391 in src:lintian "lintian: precise now released, remove data.tar.xz-member-without-dpkg-pre-depends" [Minor,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/680391
<ESphynx> hey guys... so libffi, trying to use it building 32 bit stuff here, ffi.h goes into /usr/include/i686-linux-gnu/ ...  should that be /usr/include/i386-linux-gnu/ ? and would that automatically be in the GCC include path? Thanks.
<jtaylor> is the header arch specific?
<jtaylor> i686-linux-gnu looks wrong, I don't see how a header could be dependend on i686
<ESphynx> It is arch specific, yes
<ESphynx> yes looks wrong to me too... I'm wondering if it's just meant to go into /i386-linux-gnu/ and then it would just work...
<ESphynx> also can I ask why symlinks like: sudo ln -s libsqlite3.so.0.8.6 /usr/lib/i386-linux-gnu/libsqlite3.so   are missing ?
<jtaylor> symlinks are in the -dev pacakge
<ESphynx> jtaylor: but the dev packages are installed.
<ESphynx> jtaylor: this is for 32 bit on 64 bit machines. the 32 bit symlinks are missing in action.
<jtaylor> thats a bug
<ESphynx> ok. it's been going on for almost a year, and is a real annoyance :|
<ESphynx> I just put up the instructions on our wiki yesterday to work around that...
<ESphynx> so do you know, if /i386-linux-gnu/ will be in the search path?
<jtaylor> it should be
<ESphynx> I'm worried our PPA won't build anymore with this new libffi dependency
<ESphynx> but I guess I'll just have to give it a try :)
<jtaylor> the 32bit symlink is there on my precise amd64 machine
<ESphynx> The libffi one ? header , or ?
<jtaylor> along with headers in i386
<jtaylor> what dist are you using?
<ESphynx> jtaylor hmm, this one called Windows 7 :P
<ESphynx> jtaylor: those headers were a problem with Precise... and yesterday someone with Mint13 which is based on Precise as well
<ESphynx> those symlinks I eman
<jtaylor> I don't see a problem in precise
<ESphynx> You have a  /usr/lib/i386-linux-gnu/libsqlite3.so ?
<jtaylor> sqlite3-dev is not constallable
<jtaylor> so you can currently only have either the 64 bit or 32 bit symlink
<ESphynx> constallable ?
<jtaylor> ce
<jtaylor> coinstallable
<ESphynx> is it the same for /usr/lib/i386-linux-gnu/libfontconfig.so ?
<jtaylor> possibly
<ESphynx> and all those other libraries I rely on?
<ESphynx> see, that's my problem :P
<jtaylor> you can file bugs
<jtaylor> but for the core ones there is usually a reason why there are these issues
<ESphynx> there's no reason why any libraries could not be coinstallable.
<jtaylor> in most cases yes
<jtaylor> but there are some things that make it hard
<jtaylor> e.g. libxml ships a own config script that hardcodes architectures etc
<jtaylor> libglib recommends on python
<ESphynx> but all I'm missing here is a few symlinks :P
<ESphynx> I bet it 'is' coinstalled after those symlinks are created :P
<ESphynx> Hey guys... Could someone please help me resolving dependencies issues for my PPA with libffi ?
<ESphynx> who could help me figure this out? :|
<UndiFineD> ESphynx, synaptic tells me it only depends upon libc6
<ESphynx> UndiFineD: my problem is my app depends on libffi, and saying lib32ffi-dev does not work
<UndiFineD> i have libffi6 libffi6:i386 libffi-dev installed
<ESphynx> hmmm... should I say libffi6 or libffi? :S
<UndiFineD> i have no libffi package in my repository, so libffi6
<UndiFineD> ESphynx, http://paste.ubuntu.com/1142000/
<ESphynx> I tried putting lib32ffi-dev with [amd64]
<jtaylor> why are you trying to cross build in a ppa?
<ESphynx> jtaylor: yes =)
<jtaylor> I'm not sure if you can build depend on m-a packages yet
<jtaylor> but why?
<ESphynx> It works with a whole bunch of other libraries
<ESphynx> jtaylor: because my software can't built as 64 bit yet.
<jtaylor> then only build it on 32 bit
<jtaylor> and mark it m-a foreign
<ESphynx> jtaylor: that's what I do for the newer distro...
<UndiFineD> /mnt/lvmdisk/mirror/ubuntu/quantal/pool/main/libf/libffi/libffi6_3.0.11-1_i386.deb <- there is no amd64 in repo yet
<jtaylor> so the problem is?
<ESphynx> jtaylor: I'm adding libffi as a dependency...
<jtaylor> you should never add libraries as dependencies explicitly
<jtaylor> that is done automatically by dpkg-shlibdeps
<ESphynx> hmm, really?
<ESphynx> You mean the control file?
<jtaylor> yes
<jtaylor> you only need them in the build dependencies
#ubuntu-motu 2012-08-12
<ESphynx> Yay :) it built!
<UndiFineD> :)
<ESphynx> Ok so my Oneiric build failed :|
<ESphynx> most likely because of the messed up symlink :|
<ESphynx> for ffi.h
<ESphynx> when I build manually, I have to do a: sudo ln -s /usr/include/i686-linux-gnu/ffi.h /usr/include/ ; sudo ln -s /usr/include/i686-linux-gnu/ffitarget.h /usr/include/
<ESphynx> or /usr/include/i386-linux-gnu/ I guess ?
<ESphynx> How should I go about addressing that issue? (That's when cross-building for 32 bit on 64 bit oneiric)
<ESphynx> I have lib32ffi-dev [amd64] in the debian/control file, but I'm guessing that the ffi package messed up and put under i686-linux-gnu instead of i386 ...
<jtaylor> why do you need to cross build on oneiric?
<ESphynx> well, on precise I just do the i386 build
<ESphynx> and I guess 64 bit systems can still pull it
<jtaylor> yes
<ESphynx> but on oneiric, it worked until I added this libffi...
<ESphynx> So since I could do it, I did it.
<ESphynx> it's nice to know it can successfully be built on a 64 bit system.
<ESphynx> as users on oneiric 64 bit might want to build it from source.
<jtaylor> they can in a 32 bit chroot
<ESphynx> they can also in a 64 bit system
<ESphynx> not chroot.
<ESphynx> chroot is overrated.
<ESphynx> is there a way for me to add this missing include symlink?
<ESphynx> setting up a chroot is an unnecessary burden for my users... and something that might carry them away from my software :P
<jtaylor> why does it not compile on 64  bit?
<ESphynx> jtaylor: no 64 bit support yet :)
<ESphynx> Support is planned but will take a lot of dev time :P
<ESphynx> all I need is to create that proper ffi.h symlink :P
<ESphynx> heck, I could just add an -isystem to my makefiles.
<ESphynx> to  /usr/include/i686-linux-gnu/
<jtaylor> the symlink is there in oneiric
<jtaylor> wrong include path is easily worked around with CPPFLAGS
<ESphynx> jtaylor: the symlink from where to where have you got?
<jtaylor> .so to .so.X
<ESphynx> jtaylor: no i'm talking about the ffi.h
<jtaylor> its in lib32
<jtaylor> the headers are in i686
<ESphynx> right... and that's not in the path
<jtaylor> then add it
<ESphynx> they should be in i386-linux-gnu, should they not?
<jtaylor> yes and they are in precise
<jtaylor> pre precise it is not multiarched
<jtaylor> only the old biarch
<ESphynx> they are in precise eh? It's strange cuz yesterday someone had that same problem on Mint 13... and before someone on Precise...
<ESphynx> ok
<jtaylor> (which is probably defined as i686)
<ESphynx> so I'll just go ahead and tweak the makefiles
<ESphynx> (my makefiles don't use CFLAGS from outside :P)
<jtaylor> thats a bug
<ESphynx> is it? ;)
<ESphynx> I hate outside factors messing up a build :P
<ESphynx> besides I can defend it on the fact of not being C ;)
<jtaylor> CFLAGS is compiler flags
<jtaylor> CPPFLAGS is preprocessor flags
<ESphynx> ;)
<ESphynx> i'm not familiar with CPPFLAGS tbh ;) first time I hear it
<ESphynx> is that a standard configure thing? where does it come from?
<jtaylor> its a autotools thing
<ESphynx> k... well I'm not using autotools...
<ESphynx> am I bound to accept CPPFLAGS? ;)
<jtaylor> no
<ESphynx> ah :)
<ESphynx> hehe thanks for all the help jtaylor! appreciate it :)
<ESphynx> i'll get dinner ready and then fix my preprocessor flags :P
<ESphynx> is there still hope to make it into Quantal? :)
<jtaylor> feature freeze is aug 23
<ESphynx> ugg that is soon.
<jtaylor> but you still need to find reviewers which is hard
<jtaylor> so its tight
<ESphynx> are you a reviewer? ;)
<jtaylor> if I find the time
<jtaylor> whats the package about?
<ESphynx> It's the Ecere SDK... a cross platform SDK with GUI toolkit, network library, 2D/3D graphics engine, compiler for the eC language
<ESphynx> we've been hoping to get into Ubuntu for quite a while...
<ESphynx> (note GCC 4.7 fails on the build... trying to fix that tonight :P)
<ESphynx> I would really appreciate help to get this in :)
<ESphynx> whatever I can do!
<micahg> well, there's always backports if you miss feature freeze
<ESphynx> micahg: Do Backports till make it into the official release?
<micahg> ESphynx: backports is enabled by default, so people can see it, it's not officially part of the release though (and can't be on any of the main images)
<ESphynx> oh :( i'd really like to be part of the release though :(
<ESphynx> we've been trying hard @ it since Karmic Koala :(
<micahg> ESphynx: I don't think it makes a difference unless you're trying to get it on an image
<ESphynx> yes I'd like to be on the CD :P
<micahg> ESphynx: which CD?
<ESphynx> hmm... the 1 CD ideally :P
<ESphynx> or DVD :P
<micahg> Ubuntu doesn't have that like Debian
<ESphynx> where do dev apps go?
<ESphynx> hmm, I have an Ubuntu CD here
<ESphynx> 9.04 I think ?
<micahg> no, I mean Ubuntu doesn't have the whole archive on media
<ESphynx> right, but it's got some stuff, right? :)
<micahg> to get something on an image, there has to be a request for it, the primary images (flavors included) are all tight on space except maybe Ubuntu Studio
<ESphynx> I'll settle for Ubuntu Studio I guess ;)
<ESphynx> but anyway, I'd really like to make it to feature freeze :P
<ESphynx> but jtaylor ran away :P
<ESphynx> micahg are you a potential reviewer as well? :)
<micahg> ESphynx: yeah, but just FWIW, I don't see this being included on any media, it's fine for the archive though (in theory, I've done no review)
<ESphynx> micahg: hey, I can dream ;)
<ESphynx> I'll start with being on the archive ;)
<ESphynx> Seriously, eC is an amazing programming language.
<ESphynx> with less popularity than it deserves :P
<ESphynx> And so is the Ecere GUI/toolkit ;)
<micahg> I'm not sure any of the flavors ship an IDE at all
<ESphynx> hmm, I'm sure they do?
<ESphynx> KDevelop etc.
<ESphynx> Python support?
<ESphynx> I'm sure the distros come with Python support?
<micahg> I don't think that's on any media though
<ESphynx> in terms of space, the SDK is tiny...
<ESphynx> we're talking < 10mb
<micahg> we have many in the archive, just none on shipped media
<ESphynx> K.... I sure would have thought some IDEs shipped with it!
<ESphynx> Would you potentially have time to do a review? :)
<smartboyhw> green7: You here?
<green7> yup
<smartboyhw> Did you ask them?
<green7> I'm asking
<green7> need some help in beginning development.
<green7> can anyone help me in starting development?
<micahg> this happens to be one of the few times during the week when very few people are around
<green7> well, can you help me?
<micahg> I'm very close to going to sleep, but what do you mean by development (Ubuntu, Ubuntu App, general)?
<green7> Ubuntu
<iulian> To start with, have a look at the links from the topic.
<iulian> Specifically, the contributing one.
<green7> Well, the Ubuntu wiki has so much links!
<iulian> That's a good thing, isn't it?
<green7> Nope! It's very confusing!
<green7> When I'm close to reading half the page, it directs me to take a look a t some other page.
<iulian> green7: Well, then read that page and come back.
<green7> OK. I want to fix the bugs and probably write some patches. What should I read? The MOTU wiki?
<iulian> There's way too much stuff going on to just have one single page. And thus, we've structured it as much as we could.
<iulian> green7: Yes. That'd be a good place to start.
<green7> All right.
<iulian> If you have any questions, feel free to ask them here and we shall try to point you in the right direction.
<green7> okay, thanks
<green7> hello again
<green7> got a question
<green7> join #ubuntu-devel
<green7> got a question
<smartboyhw> green7: Clearly it is still me here
<green7> so I've read the MOTU wiki
<green7> and I'm ready for packaging
<smartboyhw> OK
<smartboyhw> OK
<green7> The question is that there are many requests for packaging, and some of them already have their ppa, so what's the point of packaging?
<smartboyhw> Don't ask me, ask the others
<green7> I'm asking everyone
<smartboyhw> They are not awake:)
<smartboyhw> green7: Also it's Sunday
<green7> yep
<green7> do you know what's the difference between the packager and the maintainer?
<smartboyhw> green7: I am only good at testing
<green7> okay
<green7> I cannot debuild a code
<green7> I need some help in debuilding a package
<smartboyhw> green7: This is Sunday!!!!
<green7> not a single person works on sunday?
<smartboyhw> NO!
<ESphynx> I do :)
<smartboyhw> Good!
<ESphynx> I have to rewrite my code generator to work with GCC 4.7 though :P
<codemaniac> smartboyhw: a lot of people work on Sundays for the community . :)
<smartboyhw> Oh, do they
<codemaniac> as weekdays are full of work on work .
<green7> right
#ubuntu-motu 2013-08-05
<dholbach> good morning
<iulian> Morning dholbach.
<dholbach> hi iulian
<mfisch> how can I tell who sync'd a package?
<smartboyhw> mfisch, look at the publishing history?
<mfisch> I must be looking in the wrong place, it says sync'd by Ubuntu Archive auto-sync
<mfisch> sponsored by the bot
<mfisch> but I did that one
<mfisch> pycode-browser
<geser> mfisch: look at the entry for saucy-proposed on https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pycode-browser/+publishinghistory (Copied from debian sid in Primary Archive for Debian GNU/Linux by Matthew Fischer)
<mfisch> thanks geser
<mlankhorst> can I get some feedback on https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/1208431 ?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1208431 in Ubuntu "please add xorg-integration-tests to universe" [Medium,In progress]
<mfisch> I'm in meetings all week, but I can look at your package some today
<mfisch> mlankhorst: ^^
<mlankhorst> ty
<mfisch> mlankhorst: is this package in debian already?
<mlankhorst> no they don't have autopkgtest, so it's useless there, also some requirements missing
<mfisch> where did Uploaders and Original Maintainer come from?
<mlankhorst> ugh oops, copy/paste :P
<mlankhorst> those fields can be killed
<smartboyhw> I don't think you should kill Original Maintainer...
<smartboyhw> Uploaders should be killed....
<mfisch> I dont think XSBC-Original-Maintainer makes sense in this case
<mfisch> it's not a debian merge
<mfisch> the copyright file will contain the upstream author
<mfisch> mlankhorst: you need some different copyright stuff for debian/
<mfisch> mlankhorst: apt-get source unyaffs (in saucy) to get an example
<mlankhorst> oh I like MIT, do I need a separate license for debian/* ? :P
<smartboyhw> mlankhorst, probably GPL:)
<mlankhorst> no
<mlankhorst> if I'm lucky I can get the packaging upstream, but then it has to be same license
<mlankhorst> mfisch: I fixed the packaging now with the points you raised
<mfisch> mlankhorst: I cannot get it to build atm
<mlankhorst> needs xorg-gtest from saucy
<mfisch> mlankhorst: so why isn't that a dep?
<mfisch> mlankhorst: I'm curious if there are lintian issues
<mlankhorst> I was waiting for upstream to cut a new xorg-gtest release
<mlankhorst> there are 2 afaik, not much I can do about them :/
<mlankhorst> W: xorg-integration-tests source: illegal-runtime-test-name lib.libX11
<mlankhorst> W: xorg-integration-tests source: illegal-runtime-test-name lib.libXi
<mlankhorst> oh woops, third one from empty newlines in debian/copyright, ah well fixed that one
<mlankhorst> I filed debian bug 711844 about that one, btw
<ubottu> Debian bug 711844 in autopkgtest "autopkgtest: Allow uppercase letters in test names" [Wishlist,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/711844
<mfisch> mlankhorst: the . is also an issue right?
<mlankhorst> I don't believe it is
<mlankhorst> unless you don't have linux-image-3.* ;-)
<mfisch> mlankhorst: "dots" sorry I missed that in the list
<mfisch> mlankhorst: does the warning cause the test to be skipped?
<mlankhorst> no if it did none of the tests would work
<mfisch> mlankhorst: ok. well sounds like whats left is to add that gtest dep and wait for a new version to show up
<mlankhorst> ok, if i require 0.7.1-0ubuntu1 should I depend on >= that version or is 0.7.1 enough?
<mfisch> I'd rely on whatever one has the changes you need
<mfisch> for Ubuntu specifically 0.7.1 and 0.7.1-0ubuntu1 would be the same
<mfisch> if this was in Debian that may not be true
<mlankhorst> shrug debian version wouldn't work, package is not ready for debian yet, guess it doesn't matter
<mfisch> yeah
<mfisch> if you plan on pushing it to debian, I think 0.7.1 makes sense
<mlankhorst> available now
<mlankhorst> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/146840908/xorg-integration-tests_0.0.1%2Bgit20130725%2Bbf7fc95-0ubuntu1%2Btry3_0.0.1%2Bgit20130725%2Bbf7fc95-0ubuntu1%2Btry4.diff.gz
<jtaylor> zzzzZZZzz compiling 70k line c++ files takes forever on qemu ppc :(
<jtaylor> I'd like to get the gnu parallel situation solved in ubuntu
<jtaylor> someone familiar with the package?
<jtaylor> it conflicts with moreutils parallels in debian now
<jtaylor> I don't like that because the stuff in moreutils is useful
<jtaylor> I was thinking about splitting moreutils into two packages, one without parallel that does not conflict with gnu parallel
<jtaylor> thoughts?
<jtaylor> hurray compile done after 16 minutes :D
<ScottK> jtaylor: Fix it in Debian in my thought.
<jtaylor> I'm not sure that will be easy
<jtaylor> the history between parallel and moreutils is not so good
<jtaylor> before I propose anything I'd like some input if its even a good idea
<ScottK> I know just enough about it to think we don't want to deal with the diff.
<jtaylor> the diff probably wouldn't be big
<jtaylor> two extra packages
<jtaylor> hm I guess I can file a bug and see what happens
<jtaylor> X-Debbugs-CC can be put directly into the text header of a mail?
<jtaylor> or is it some special header I can't add with e.g. thunderbird
<jtaylor> found the section in the docs, should work
#ubuntu-motu 2013-08-06
<TheLordOfTime> anyone here who knows specifics about the requestbackport command and how i can get one from Precise to recognize "Saucy" as an acceptable source distribution?
<ScottK> TheLordOfTime: Probably update distro-info data.
<TheLordOfTime> ScottK:  yep that did the trick
<TheLordOfTime> thanks
<ScottK> You're welcome.
 * TheLordOfTime also notices a capitalization problem in his keyboard, and that might also have caused the issue
<dholbach> good morning
<iulian> Hiya dholbach.
<dholbach> hi iulian
<mlankhorst> morning
<mlankhorst> mfisch: does the xorg-integration-tests package look ok now?
<mlankhorst> or anyone else, can they look at xit^
<mlankhorst> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/1208431
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1208431 in Ubuntu "please add xorg-integration-tests to universe" [Medium,In progress]
#ubuntu-motu 2013-08-07
<TheLordOfTime> what's the page I can use to see what bug(s) and uploads have been sponsored for me?
<TheLordOfTime> i lost it, but would like to see all the sponsored uploads I've had sponsored for me.
<micahg> TheLordOfTime: http://ubuntu-dev.alioth.debian.org/cgi-bin/ubuntu-sponsorships.cgi
<TheLordOfTime> micahg:  thanks!
<dholbach> good morning
<fr33r1d3> morning
<smartboyhw> MOTUs: Please review https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/1208021
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1208021 in Ubuntu "[needs-packaging] artikulate" [Wishlist,In progress]
<iulian> smartboyhw: Any particular reason why you don't get it uploaded to Debian first and then sync it over to Ubuntu?
<smartboyhw> iulian, because it will soon be in the KDE SC
<iulian> If I'm not mistaken, Debian KDE is quite active.
<smartboyhw> And Kubuntu is a bit ahead of Debian
<smartboyhw> i.e. We are now at 4.10.97 and they are still at 4.10.5
<iulian> Does it require anything that is available in Ubuntu and not in Debian?
<smartboyhw> Especially since this package is currently based on 4.11.0
<smartboyhw> iulian, ^
<iulian> I don't know much about KDE but I'd still prefer this to go via Debian. Have a chat with the Debian KDE guys and see what they think.
<geser> smartboyhw: you might also try asking in the kubuntu channel for review (and sponsoring) if the package is KDE specific
<smartboyhw> geser, iulian I know
<smartboyhw> Just that it's new and I can only ask a MOTU:P
<smartboyhw> I'm a Kubuntu Developer applicant:)
<smartboyhw> I will get ScottK and Quintasan then:)
<jalcine> Question about source package `lcov`. it's unusable with gcov 4.7 at its current version
<jalcine> would it be possible to ITP the latest version? (1.10)
<micahg> any MOTUs free to review bug 1209414 as a second reviewer?  looks good to me, I wanted a second opinion before uploading
<ubottu> bug 1209414 in Ubuntu Studio "ubuntustudio-installer needs packaging" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1209414
#ubuntu-motu 2013-08-08
<dholbach> good morning
<iulian> Morning dholbach.
<dholbach> hi iulian
<ESphynx> Hey guys, what's the Unity dev channel again?
<ESphynx> Also, is anyone coming to FOSSCON this weekend? :)
<tumbleweed> debconf
<ESphynx> debconf?
<ESphynx> this weekend/
<Unit193> Debian Conference.
<ESphynx> In Switzerland??
<tumbleweed> this week was debcamp. debconf starts sunday
<ESphynx> that is nice
<ESphynx> you guys from the US are going there?
<ESphynx> tumbleweed: drop in a word about eC/Ecere for me , will you :P
<ESphynx> DebCamp is in Switzerland as well?
<ESphynx> Unity dev chan? :P
<Noskcaj> How should i package a program that now needs automake1.14? (gthumb)
<tumbleweed> ESphynx: yes, in switzerland. it doubles as a chance to set up infrastructure
<ESphynx> nice! :)
#ubuntu-motu 2013-08-09
<dholbach> good morning
<sicness_> Hello! I'm PPA maintainer of a game 'curseofwar' https://launchpad.net/~curseofwar . I succesful contributed the game to debian sid http://ftp-master.debian.org/new/curseofwar_1.1.8-3.html . What I should to read about taking my package into Ubuntu?
<tumbleweed> sicness_: it'll get into Ubuntu automatically once it's in Debian
<tumbleweed> (well actually, it won't because we're already past Debian Import Freeze)
<sicness_> From sid too?
<tumbleweed> but right now, the best thing to do is to wait for it to get out of NEW and into sid
<tumbleweed> from sid, yes
<geser> sicness_: once it's in sid, you can request a sync of it (assuming we aren't past FeatureFreeze then)
<sicness_> How can I make this request?
<geser> man requestsync (from the ubuntu-dev-tools package)
<sicness_> thanks. And where I can read about  Debian Import Freeze and about all process Debian -> Ubuntu
<geser> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SaucySalamander/ReleaseSchedule
#ubuntu-motu 2013-08-10
<kotux> hello, I have a package ready to submit
<kotux> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/1210704
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1210704 in Ubuntu "pylang needs packaging" [Undecided,In progress]
<kotux> I would like to know what I must upload.
<asomething> kotux, you have a few options: a link to a PPA with a package to review, a bzr branch of the packaging and a link to the orig.tar.gz
<kotux> hi asomething. I originally ran 'bzr commit -m "foo"' from the source directory.  Now, I just push the orig.tar.gz?
<kotux> What about the five other files?
<asomething> your sponsor will have to rebuild the package to review it. the changes file, dsc file, and the debian.tar.gz till get regenerated
<asomething> s/till/will/
<Noskcaj> kotux, remember to put it into debian if possible too
<kotux> Hi Nokscaj, I will probably do it through both debian and ubuntu
<kotux> should I do debian first, or is it ok to do ubuntu first?
<asomething> if you go through debian first, it will be automatically synced to ubuntu in the start of the next development cycle
<kotux> wow, that's convenient.  Then what's the point of going through ubuntu first?
<asomething> kotux, in most cases you shouldn't
<kotux> thanks for the tip. how does the motu aid in this process then?
<kotux> I should go through the mentors process, correct?
<asomething> there are some packages that rely on ubuntu specific things, that's most usual reason to go directly into ubuntu
<porthose> kotux I would suggest going through debian PAPT https://wiki.debian.org/Teams/PythonAppsPackagingTeam
<kotux> hey porthose, thanks.
<asomething> it is *much* easier to get a package sponsored in Debian if there is a team that is a good fit
<kotux> Rather than going through mentors, I should just join that group  and ask for sponsorship there?
<Noskcaj> kotux, MOTU exists for specific ubuntu changes and packaging things that debian can't/won't
<Noskcaj> kotux, put package in mentors with team as maintainer, you as uploader, then ask the team
<kotux> alright.
<asomething> you'd still upload to debian.mentors.net but ask for a sponsor on the python apps team's list
<Noskcaj> +1
<asomething> http://mentors.debian.net/intro-maintainers
<kotux> Awesome, thanks for all the help.
<kotux> Just for show, here's my finished packgae.
<kotux> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~kotux/+junk/pylang-package/files
<Noskcaj> tip: Get the packages a close to lintian clean as possible and with good copyright stuff before you upload
<kotux> One more thing before I go: is an orig.tar.gz file the only thing they need to see from me?
<kotux> Noskcaj, it's lintian error-free. ;-)
<Noskcaj> even the --pedantic ones?
<kotux> yes
<Noskcaj> good work
<Noskcaj> and no, you will use dput to upload everything
<smartboyhw> Tip: Make sure you fill in the copyrigh properly
<kotux> smartboyhw, it's all good.
<porthose> kotux, make sure you have a working watch file also
<kotux> what's that?
<smartboyhw> Hmm, that's a problem if you don't know:P
<smartboyhw> debian/watch
<Noskcaj> a two line file that makes maintenance so much easier
<smartboyhw> Used to track new releases from upstream
<Unit193> uscan is pretty great.
<kotux> ok, thanks.
<porthose> kotux, http://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/maint-guide/dother.en.html
<Rhonda> Laney: Where are though!
<Laney> Rhonda: just arrived at hotel
<Laney> (not staying at le camp)
<Laney> will be along tomorrow morning
<stgraber> Laney: so do you need me to bring you a power cable along in the end?
<Laney> stgraber: my adaptor works at the hotel
<Laney> also, steve said he was bringing spares so should be fine
<stgraber> ok
<Laney> further also, would have been a figure 8 which I don't think you said you have :P
<stgraber> Laney: ah, if that's a c7/c8 (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/3/32/IEC_60320_C7.svg/100px-IEC_60320_C7.svg.png) then your french adapter will work fine as it's not grounded
<stgraber> ungrounded european/french plugs are compatible, the problem is the grounding pin which tends to differ quite widely between france, germany and switzerland (to take the 3 variants I'm aware of)
<Laney> ah, yeah, there's no grounding pin on it
<Laney> 303 upgraded, 12 newly installed, 0 to remove and 0 not upgraded.
<Laney> Need to get 418 MB of archives.
<Laney> after a week - not enough - try harder :P
<stgraber> ;)
 * Laney sees some interesting stuff
#ubuntu-motu 2014-08-04
<Laney> debfx: thanks for keeping up with backports
<dholbach> good morning
#ubuntu-motu 2014-08-05
<raub> On http://packaging.ubuntu.com/html/fixing-a-bug.html#work-on-a-fix, how do you use edit-patch to edit a file and create appropriate patch?
<raub> openssh-server and -client are packages derived from the ssh source. If I wanted to create a ppa for, say openssh-client, how would I do that starting from the ssh source package?
<RAOF> raub: Take the ssh source package, upload it to your PPA.
<raub> RAOF: the entire thing? What if I want to use the ppa to get just the client?
<RAOF> raub: You could change the ssh source package to not build the -server package (that'd be editing debian/control)
<Unit193> Or d/rules.
<dholbach> good morning
<highvoltage> o/
<Unit193> asomething: Howdy.  Still interested in Xubuntu some, or was that someone else?
<asomething> Must be someone else... I've sponsored a few Xubuntu related packages in the past, but I don't run it myself
<Unit193> Ah, I'll blame bad memory.  Thanks.
<raub> For those who answered my questions yesterday, I need a bit of help putting sudo-ldap in PPA
<raub> I understand (sort of) how to do the deed with the original package, sudo, but still do not understand for the derivative work 9sudo-ldap)
<raub> RAOF said to edit the debian/control file, but if there is a sudo-ldap package already, shouldn't it have that done?
<sn33zy> im looking on the website for ways to contribute but I do not know where to start.  can someone point me somewhere to start?
<Noskcaj> sn33zy, What would you like to do?
<Noskcaj> And do you know any programming languages?
<sn33zy> I know Java and C++... Im kindof bored right now and was curious if anyone wanted help with something (trying to see if I can help out)
<Noskcaj> bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu has a list of all the bugs that need fixing
<Noskcaj> See if a program you use has any bugs
<Noskcaj> Also, what DE do you use? (gnome, xfce, etc.
<sn33zy> Unity
<Noskcaj> #ubuntu-unity is it's channel, although it might not be the best thing to start on
<sn33zy> Noskcaj, i dont know enough to fix the bugs that I am finding.... is there a channel i can find any devs that I could offer my assistance to?
<Noskcaj> #ubuntu-devel
<Noskcaj> maybe #ubuntu-bugs
<Noskcaj> We also have a testing team in #ubuntu-quality
<Noskcaj> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.tag=bitesize should have some easier to fix bugs
<ScottK> sn33zy: If we knew more specifically what bugs, we could probably provide better advice about where to find help.
<sn33zy> ok... heres a bitesize bug... https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nvidia-settings/+bug/723432 .... ScottK  but I really dont know where to start...
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 723432 in nvidia-settings (Ubuntu) "We need a way to translate the nvidia-settings tool" [High,Confirmed]
<ScottK> That's probably not a good choice.  It requires knowing a fair amount about how translations work in Ubuntu (which is not like anything else on the planet).
<ScottK> (unless you really want to learn about how translations work)_
<ScottK> If so, dpm, who does not seem to be online right now, can probably point you in the right direction.
<sn33zy> ScottK, okay so lets say I want to checkout code.... is the best way to do it is through apt-get source <packagename> ?
<sn33zy> because i know another is through git...
<rbasak> pull-lp-source <packagename> is better. It'll give you the latest development version, which might not necessarily be the same as the version you have available to apt on your system.
<ScottK> Right.  I generally point the deb-src line in my sources.list to the development release to solve that problem, but pull-lp-source does it as well.
<sn33zy> ScottK, grr.... downloaded the source code for a package but the code is over my head lol
#ubuntu-motu 2014-08-06
<dholbach> good morning
<dodobrain> hi all.. a slightly offtopic question for ubuntu-motu: how is one supposed to start/stop/restart couchdb on ubuntu 14.04?
<dodobrain> *none* of the official packages couchdb, couchdb-common, couchdb-bin install any sort of init script or otherwise in /etc/init.d or /etc/systemd or ...
<_jame_> Is there something for it in /etc/init?
<dodobrain> ah, bugger there is..
<dodobrain> sudo service <tab> doesn;t list the upstart possibilities
<dodobrain> only the ones in init.d
<dodobrain> grr..
<dodobrain> way to confuse myself :(
<dodobrain> thanks
<_jame_> np
<dodobrain> any idea why everything wasn;t systemd'ed ?
<_jame_> no idea.  Perhaps it simply hasn't been worked on yet...
<debfx> Laney, ScottK: what do you think about the wxwidgets and modemmanager backport requests?
<debfx> I'm inclined to let wxwidgets through
<debfx> I don't know much about modemmanager though
<ScottK> wxwidgets scares me.
#ubuntu-motu 2014-08-07
<Unit193> stgraber: Hello, you seem to have delt with Irssi's merge in the past, what do you think of lp 1350364?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1350364 in irssi (Ubuntu) "[needs-packaging] sync irssi 0.8.16-1 from debian sid" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1350364
<dholbach> good morning
<Rhonda> Anyone know about an IRC channel about stunnel?  Or anyone who feels capable of answering a tricky stunnel related question (not packagingwise)? :)
<Unit193> dholbach: Thanks for the upload, and the fixes to it.
<dholbach> anytime
<elopio> Hello
<elopio> can I use something like:
<elopio> python3 -m pep8 .
<elopio> on my debian/rules ?
<Pici> 70
#ubuntu-motu 2014-08-08
<ESphynx> hey guys
<dholbach> good morning
<_jame_> exit
#ubuntu-motu 2015-08-03
<dholbach> good morning
<Laney> BY THE POWER OF GREYSKULL
<Laney> RISE UP, MASTERS
<highvoltage> wom 13
<teward> MOTUs:  Good morning/day/evening/night/<insert time reference word here>.  I think a package has stopped being maintained in Debian, and as a result we have 'old' and 'broken' software (electrum bitcoin wallet) in the repositories.  Is it possible to request a blacklist until Debian updates it for that package to be included?
<Laney> you almost got away, highvoltage
<teward> and if so what's needed for all that
<highvoltage> Laney: lol
<Laney> teward: broken how?
<Laney> should it be removed from Debian testing too?
<teward> Laney: i think https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=792231 is a good start point
<ubottu> Debian bug 792231 in electrum "Electrum version 1.9.8 vulnerable, needs update" [Normal,Open]
<teward> Laney: it should be UPDATED by the Debian Bitcoin Team
<teward> or torpedoed from their repositories entirely
<teward> the version there, 1.9.8, is a year old
<teward> and current is 2.4.x
<Laney> teward: probably start by making that 'serious', I guess
<Laney> amd we could update it in Ubuntu without waiting for Debian
<Laney> I guess the stable releases want to be updated too
<Laney> which will be fun but maybe the SRU team will let it be updated to the new version assuming that it is compatible
<teward> Laney: i'm not a packaging expert for it, though.  I'd be happy to *try*, but there may be a PPA we could 'borrow' and have the sec team look at
<teward> i'll reach out to electrum upstream to see if they know of prebuild packages for it, i think they have some...
<Laney> Assuming they based it off the same packaging
<teward> good point
<Laney> otherwise... might be a good opportunity to learn
 * teward shrugs
<teward> I am hesitant with anything Bitcoin to use any packaging, and to build from source to make *sure* that the packaging doesn't have hidden surprises
<teward> Laney: well, I got a response back.  http://paste.ubuntu.com/11993520/plain/
<teward> sounds like missing deps are being a big issue
<teward> if anything, I think I'd like the sec team to review and determine if it should be yanked
<Laney> teward: doh
<teward> Laney: i just responded asking "GIven that this is already vulnerable and it has OTHER vulnerabilities, does it even make sense to keep it in the repos"
<teward> from my perspective, on security considerations alone, the answer is "No, this is not worth keeping"
<teward> but I have no say
<teward> not really
<Laney> best to go raise it with security guys
<Laney> sure you do
<teward> so, hop into -hardened and ask for their opinions, link the Debian bug>?
<teward> and let them say "Burn it" :P
#ubuntu-motu 2015-08-04
<dholbach> good morning
#ubuntu-motu 2015-08-05
<dholbach> good morning
#ubuntu-motu 2015-08-06
<dholbach> good morning
#ubuntu-motu 2015-08-07
<dholbach> good morning
#ubuntu-motu 2016-08-13
<lfaraone> if a package is no longer shipped in the archive (last released in 14.04), what should I do with its open bugs? close them, retarget them to trusty somehow? e.g. LP: #1252826
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1252826 in python-django-openid-auth (Ubuntu) "Not compatible with the Django 1.6 default JSON_SESSION_SERIALIZER" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1252826
#ubuntu-motu 2017-08-12
<karstensrage> im not sure where to ask this
<karstensrage> i am trying to package a libnss library i wrote and trying to figure out how best to package it
<karstensrage> all the libnss libraries in /lib/{arch} have a particular version like /lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libnss_compat-2.19.so
<karstensrage> and then a symbolic link named /lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libnss_compat.so.2 to that file
<karstensrage> so for my package should i try to mimic that? and then for different distributions, 14.04, 16.04, etc. whats a good way to pick that stuff up?
#ubuntu-motu 2017-08-13
<tsimonq2> willdeberry: Hey :)
<willdeberry> hey
<tsimonq2> willdeberry: So that packaging guide is horribly outdated
<tsimonq2> BUT
<tsimonq2> I can walk you through
<tsimonq2> What package are you looking to modify?
<willdeberry> that would be awesome as i am just looking to get started working with a bigger community
<tsimonq2> Sure, I totally get it :D
<willdeberry> one of the low hanging fruit tickets was logged against pidgin, so i was starting there
<tsimonq2> Sure, got a link to the bug report?
<willdeberry> https://bugs.launchpad.net/hundredpapercuts/+bug/1602386
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1602386 in pidgin (Ubuntu) "Config directory ~/.purple should be ~/.config/purple" [Low,Confirmed]
<willdeberry> figured that would be a good ticket to get the hang of the release workflow
<willdeberry> i have the lp account, ssh and gpg keys taken care of, just not sure how to get the code itself
<tsimonq2> I see, gotcha.
<tsimonq2> willdeberry: Do you have the ubuntu-dev-tools, build-essential, and devscripts packages installed?
<willdeberry> i do
<tsimonq2> Alright, excellent.
<willdeberry> i just happen to create debian packages for work related code as well, just not sure how to work within the confines of ubuntu :)
<tsimonq2> willdeberry: In your working directory, try this command: pull-lp-source PACKAGE
<tsimonq2> i.e. pull-lp-source pidgin
<tsimonq2> Sure, I get it :)
<willdeberry> i assume this is after running bzr init correct?
<tsimonq2> Nope
<willdeberry> or just create the working dir and run what you refereced?
<tsimonq2> Yep
<tsimonq2> We no longer use Bazaar at all in our packaging workflow
<willdeberry> switched to git i assume?
<tsimonq2> Nope, we're working in that direction though.
<willdeberry> i assume that is where tools like git-ubuntu are going to come in handy down the road?
<tsimonq2> Not all packages have been imported yet.
<tsimonq2> Yep.
<tsimonq2> Just not in this case.
<willdeberry> awesome, sounds like a good future at least ;)
<tsimonq2> :D
<willdeberry> ok, so now i finally got code locally
<tsimonq2> Yay!
<tsimonq2> Ok, do you know the change you want to make?
<willdeberry> i know the idea, just hadn't figured out where to make it yet
<willdeberry> figured it would be a combination of a debian patch file to make sure the new config directory is used and potentially a postinst to handle migration across package updates
<tsimonq2> willdeberry: This is the part where I can't really help because I don't know enough about the package, problem, and codebase, but I'd recommend this guide here: https://raphaelhertzog.com/2012/08/08/how-to-use-quilt-to-manage-patches-in-debian-packages/
<tsimonq2> willdeberry: You said you've already had some packaging experience in Debian?
<willdeberry> i do mainly around the workflow using git-buildpackage
<Unit193> willdeberry: Just as a heads-up, Ubuntu sponsors will liekly not be too fond of diverging from Debian on this, and I'd give a guess same with Debian and upstream.
<willdeberry> so for something like this, probably best to submit upstream then huh
<willdeberry> that's the kind of stuff that i am hoping to gather and get my feet wet with
<tsimonq2> Unit193: Sure, I failed to mention that
<willdeberry> code is obviously only half the battle
<tsimonq2> willdeberry: Yeah, so once you have the patch, even though you could easily get it in Ubuntu, it's preferred to get it in Debian.
<tsimonq2> Like Unit193 said
<Unit193> https://developer.pidgin.im/ticket/4911 - https://developer.pidgin.im/ticket/10029 fyi.
<Unit193> (That's also not really what I said.)
<willdeberry> lol
<tsimonq2> Unit193: But that was the point you were trying to make from what I gather.
<tsimonq2> ("easily" get it in Ubuntu, not meaning sponsors will accept it, I mean in a technical sense)
<willdeberry> so what's the gist of when things go into ubuntu vs upstream (debian or package directly)
<tsimonq2> willdeberry: Try to get as much as possible in Debian
<Unit193> willdeberry: For example, crashing or CVE fixes would be desired as soon as possible, same with failure to build.
<tsimonq2> ^
<willdeberry> so if it needs to get out now, then probably good to submit to ubuntu, otherwise work with upstream
<Unit193> One must remember that it doesn't just have to be pushed, it'll also have to be maintained by whoever merges it in the future.  If a package is in sync with Debian, they'll want you to clarify why you should break sync.
<willdeberry> makes sense
<Unit193> I don't say this to discourage you, just to inform.
<willdeberry> definitely understand
<Unit193> You can see in 10029 there's quite a bit of talk about this, most recent was 9 months ago though.
<willdeberry> now i get to learn a new process :P
<Unit193> \o/
<willdeberry> so other than finding bug tickets to work on, any recommendations on giving back to ubuntu?
<Unit193> Merges.
<willdeberry> updating ubuntu packages based on debian packages?
<tsimonq2> willdeberry: Yep, merges.ubuntu.com lists them :)
<willdeberry> lol, mom...i love it
<tsimonq2> :D
<Unit193> As a side note, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pasystray/+bug/1639867 are my favorite type of bugs, ones with no information. :P
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1639867 in pasystray (Ubuntu) "/usr/bin/pasystray:6:pa_context_errno:pulseaudio_connect:init:main" [Undecided,New]
<Unit193> Rhonda: Ping!
<willdeberry> so any insight on when to do which?
<willdeberry> Run ../merge-genchanges , ../merge-buildpackage or ../merge-debuild when done
<willdeberry> wouldn't the last two options be similar?
<tsimonq2> willdeberry: When done, I'd suggest creating a PPA, run ../merge-buildpackage -S -d -sa, then dput ppa:USERNAME/PPA-NAME
 * tsimonq2 has to go AFK, ttyl
<willdeberry> rgr, ty tsimonq2
<willdeberry> I found https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/Merging so I am going through those steps now
<willdeberry> and now lp is not letting me in, well damn lol
<willdeberry> Unit193: thanks again for all the help as well and direction. as soon as lp stops being a pain, I will definitely be looking into uploading some of these merges to help out
<Unit193> willdeberry: Fantastic, I presume you've looked where it said for proposing changes?  (And can't answer about the scripts, I don't use them.)
<Unit193> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/sponsoring/ you'll want them to show up there.
<willdeberry> right. i was in the process of getting logged back into lp when it started being a pain, but was going to follow the process in the article i linked: create a bug report, then on the merge page place the ticket in the sometimes hidden box on the right and then work out the issue
<willdeberry> i assume by filling out the merge site that gets it to the page you linked just now
<willdeberry> this is what i was about to follow: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/Merging#File_a_merge_bug
<Unit193> Huh, wonder when the last time that page was generated...
<willdeberry> that seems to be a trend ;)
<willdeberry> but basically, update this page for the package: https://merges.ubuntu.com/universe.html with the ticket number is what i got out of it
<Unit193> That is to say, I noticed xfwm4 on there, but at an older version.  There's a couple other xfce packages that are "newer" in Ubuntu too..
<Unit193> (Like xfdesktop4..)
<willdeberry> yea mom shows last modified from 2016 :-/
<willdeberry> at least for xfwm4
<willdeberry> definitely newer in the listings: xfwm4/artful 4.12.4-0ubuntu1 amd64
<willdeberry> i guess if a human never cleans up old conflicts they don't get pruned?
<Unit193> Dunno, looked at the date at the bottom of the page, certainly pulling old data from somewhere.
<willdeberry> all this is news to me so I am just following yalls lead at this point
<willdeberry> lol
<Unit193> I'm a flavor dev (Xubuntu), so I keep a close eye on any Xfce related packages for example.  I also push fixes to MOTU packages when I see them (and honestly?  Think it'll make it through the queue), and try to filter through delta and push anything interesting back to Debian.  Recently did a transition that was aided by watching autopkgtests too.
<willdeberry> so is MOTU just basically a place for people to assist especially where packages don't fall under a specific umbrella of devs?
<Unit193> Most of the Xubuntu packages are in universe actually, main just means that Canonical security team will keep an eye on it (baaasically.)
<willdeberry> and MOTU just focuses on universe packages mainly?
<willdeberry> i would assume by the name
<Unit193> It's more of a subset of core-dev, that way you can give people permission to upload packages, but not yet to core packages that are important to Ubuntu desktop or Ubuntu server.  If you're a core-dev, you likely will still upload to Universe too.
<Unit193> So, I've got packageset upload rights, meaning I can pretty much upload any package relating to Xubuntu, but not all of universe.  Doesn't mean I can't get things sponsored though, just a subset of direct upload privs.
<willdeberry> really bothers me that lp is having this issue with my account right now otherwise i'd walk through some of these steps knowing you are actually responding. guess it will just have to wait till tomorrow though
<willdeberry> i really do appreciate the insight on things though Unit193
<willdeberry> being a OS dev at work but in a much smaller scale, it just makes me appreciate things more seeing all the moving cogs that have to work in sync
<Unit193> Keep in mind that I'm not MOTU, and also that I personally may not do things "the normal way", but sure!  Glad you're interested in getting involved, more so that you have some prior Debian work.
<Unit193> Also, what specifically in regards to LP?  You have your GPG set I presume, and am signing the upload?
<willdeberry> so i found out that i had gotten accounts crossed and using multiple emails accounts. Found this out when trying to add my main email to the already created account.
<willdeberry> now lp has me logged in on their end but what i think happened is that the account IDs and emails don't line up anymore for the session that is open on that end
<willdeberry> so i am stuck till it "logs out" on the server side
<willdeberry> not a huge deal, just puts a damper on doing anything tonight
<willdeberry> if not resolved by morning, then i will be more concerned
<willdeberry> i just like seeing the other tools that are involved in the process too. my main workflow usually revolves around gbp command (git-buildpackage) doing all the heavy lifting for me. ie: auto generating debian/changelog and tags for me
<willdeberry> but we have pytest tied into the deb build process for unit tests and autopkgtest integrated for integration testing of the package which utilizes throw away VMs inside aws
<willdeberry> have had to deal with the struggles of the debhelper process and overwriting the standard postinst files so we can do things a bit different in a couple situations. mainly dealing with kernel modules
<willdeberry> so it would be nice to take some of this new found knowledge and actually give back to the distro we so heavily lean on. and learn some new tricks along the way of course
<Unit193> Yep, I use git-buildpackage, though not for doing the actual package builds, just the packaging.  Veeery nice and useful.  Contributions to Debian also contribute to Ubuntu too, just as a reminder.
<willdeberry> that's fair
<willdeberry> already learning and realizing new things :D
<willdeberry> alright, well i am done for tonight especially since lp is broke for me. will try this again tomorrow. thanks again Unit193
<Unit193> Sure thing, and if it's still broken I'd give #launchpad a lookup, though on a Sunday...Not likely.
<Unit193> Glad to have been of at least some service!
#ubuntu-motu 2018-08-11
<Rhonda> hmm.  jubany ssh was IP restricted, right?
#ubuntu-motu 2019-08-05
<rbasak> Unit193: thank you for the note. I wish there were a way to leave a note explaining the reason for a sync that could be found easily from the upload later :-/
#ubuntu-motu 2019-08-06
<nhasian> Hello, is this the right place to ask for help in creating a PPA?
<rbasak> nhasian: no. Try #ubuntu-packaging. I'm not sure how active that channel is any more though. :-/
<rbasak> This channel is for packaging in Ubuntu itself (in the universe component)
<Unit193> Aka, the fun stuff! :>
<Unit193> Uhh, so after reviewing assaultcube/-data unloads in Debian, I'm not sync'ing.
<Unit193> Ubuntu has the latest upstream release, 1.2.0.2; Debian has 1.2.0.2.1 and updated d/watch to follow a "mirror" of upstream, but it looks more like a forked packaging repo with upstream imported and random commits on top because why the heck not? https://gitlab.com/coringao/assaultcube/commits/coringao
#ubuntu-motu 2019-08-07
<LocutusOfBorg> Unit193, some patches, e.g. the gcc ones looks like included in that fork?
<Unit193> Could be, hard to say.
<LocutusOfBorg> I had a look, and they are there
<Unit193> Again, I'd likely just leave it for now, picking up when there's an actual worthwhile update.
#ubuntu-motu 2020-08-06
<ItzSwirlz> Hey there everyone, I'm trying to request to get a package into Ubuntu repos
<ItzSwirlz> Anyways, checking for requesting packages, by looking at the template here:
<ItzSwirlz> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/NewPackages/ExamplePackageRequest
<ItzSwirlz> It looks as if the package 'needs the packaging'. But my package is already packaged.
<ItzSwirlz> What should I do in that case?
<ItzSwirlz> Anyone here? I'll stay online and wait a bit. Got other things to do in ~2 hours
