#ubuntu-arb 2012-07-02
<wendar> ajmitch: I did a rough cut through all the ARB submissions, dividing them up into channels in Trello
<wendar> most haven't been looked at by anyone (first channel)
<wendar> a few are waiting for a reply from the developer
<wendar> and a few have a reply from the developer and are ready for further action
<ajmitch> wendar: awesome, thanks for doing that
<wendar> I also tagged every submission that has a PPA
<wendar> and, tagged the ones that were submitted to App Showdown
<wendar> so we can quickly search and pull those up
<ajmitch> now we just have to make sure we can keep this in sync with myapps
<wendar> yup, it's pretty quick to tweak an app
<ajmitch> I see you've marked some as license issue?
<wendar> I wonder if we might be able to repurpose dholbach's tools for scraping MyApps to check for synchronization between MyApps and Trello
<wendar> ajmitch: yes, those had some comment about a license problem in the feedback
<ajmitch> I was planning to do so, since I know we can poke some stuff into trello via the API
<wendar> or, for Scratch and Skype, I just know they're a situation that is likely to have licensing problems
<wendar> that would be cool. Even if we can't automate all changes to Trello, we can at least "lint" between the two to make sure they make sense
<ajmitch> so now I just have to use this info to take a look at apps :)
<ajmitch> I'll mail the list asking for people's details so I can add them to the board
<wendar> personally, I'm prioritizing the ones that already have a reply from the developer
<wendar> since, they're likely to be closer to done
<wendar> then ones with a ppa
<wendar> (actually, it seems most have ppas now, which is goo)
<wendar> *good
<ajmitch> the PPA requirement was emphasised as part of the app showdown
<wendar> and last priority on ones that have no PPA
<wendar> yes, all the app showdown submissions have a ppa
<wendar> but, even lots of others now have ppas
<wendar> a good sign that we've improved the documentation :)
 * ajmitch is still seeing a few .deb submissions
<ajmitch> the upload field is still confusing there
<wendar> yes, I bounced back a couple of .debs as I was going through the list :(
<wendar> ajmitch: btw, is the trello board publically viewable?
 * wendar thinks it should be, just not sure where that setting is
<ajmitch> no, it's not yet
<ajmitch> I've just set it to public
<wendar> cool
<dholbach> good morning
<dholbach> Happy Apps Sprint Day 1! :)
<dholbach> can somebody please move https://myapps.developer.ubuntu.com/dev/apps/1125/ to the other queue? (.pdf submission)
<ajmitch> dholbach: do you have a 'submit to myapps' button? if so, you can move those
<dholbach> ajmitch, do I need to "start review"?
<ajmitch> yeah
<ajmitch> this is one of the confusing parts of the workflow :)
 * ajmitch is just overjoyed at the moment that he can use ssh for a few minutes, ISP seems to have had some bad packet loss tonight
<dholbach> Apparently I do. :)
<dholbach> ajmitch, thanks
<ajmitch> thanks for lookign at it
<ajmitch> dholbach: what's your email you use on trello?
<ajmitch> https://trello.com/board/ubuntu-arb-submissions/4fee2215cee295013c0862ba <-- wendar's done some awesome work adding & tagging submissions on there
<dholbach_> sorry, fell out of the internet
<dholbach_> ajmitch, so yeah, I could put it into the other queue :)
<dholbach_> ajmitch, do you think you could help a bit with bug 1019212 and 1019216? :)
<ajmitch> 18:53 < ajmitch> thanks for lookign at it
<dholbach_> I guess that'd make reviewing for a lot of people a lot easier
<ajmitch> 18:53 < ajmitch> dholbach: what's your email you use on trello?
<ajmitch> 18:53 < ajmitch> https://trello.com/board/ubuntu-arb-submissions/4fee2215cee295013c0862ba <-- wendar's done some awesome work adding & tagging submissions on there
<dholbach> oh wow
<dholbach> you trello
<dholbach> ajmitch, my id there is danielholbach
<ajmitch> invited you
<dholbach> sweet
<ajmitch> I'll take a look at those bugs
<dholbach> and if for the /opt thing you can just mention a couple of examples/rules, I guess I could write the code myself
 * ajmitch thought you had the opt check sorted
<dholbach> no, it's just translations-outside-opt
<dholbach> I get the feeling that quickly does not make use of the most recent DEP5 - I know that's a minor issue, but I guess I'll tell mterry/didrocks later on
<PaoloRotolo> Hi all!
<dholbach> ajmitch, coolbhavi's ID is bhavanishankarr
<ajmitch> thanks, invited him too
<dholbach> invited asomething too
 * coolbhavi checks his mail
<coolbhavi> ajmitch, dholbach joined thanks
<dholbach> ajmitch, wikipedia lens should be ready to go, right?
<ajmitch> dholbach: afaik, yes
<dholbach> alright, I will have to rush off to the dentist, but I'll be back for the Apps Sprint as soon as I can
 * ajmitch may or may not be around much this evening, sorry
<dholbach> ajmitch, as long as you can add a few comments to the bugs, I'm happy ;-)
<didrocks> hey ;)
<dholbach> salut didrocks :)
<ajmitch> hi didrocks
<didrocks> good morning dholbach, ajmitch :)
<dholbach> didrocks, do you know where would I find the code for creating debian/copyright in quickly? :)
<didrocks> dholbach: it's in python-distutils-extra
<dholbach> oh, that's not exactly where I would have expected it :)
<didrocks> /usr/bin/python-mkdebian
<dholbach> didrocks, do you think it'd be worth SRUing the current version of it to precise?
<dholbach> because I just found that many apps submitted weren't using a recent DEP5 (I know, it's a minor issue, but still)
<didrocks> dholbach: juts checked the newer versions, yeah, can worth a SRU
<coolbhavi> ajmitch, was having a look at simple-gmail-checker but I get an error as http://pastebin.com/jSfdLvXQ while trying to execute.. did I miss something there?
<coolbhavi> m running default perl installation on precise
<didrocks> libmail-imapclient-perl ?
<didrocks> that's what apt-file is telling about a Mail/IMAPClient.pm file
<coolbhavi> thanks didrocks
<didrocks> yw coolbhavi ;)
<dholbach> can somebody please add https://wiki.ubuntu.com/AppReviewBoard/AppsSprint to the topic?
* ajmitch changed the topic of #ubuntu-arb to: Ubuntu Application Review Board | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/AppReviewBoard | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/AppReviewBoard/AppsSprint | Feel free to ask, we're not always staring out our screens so please hang around for an answer
<dholbach> thanks
<coolbhavi> does anyone know how to package a single perl script? I think simple-gmail-checker gives you how many unread mails you have in a single click
<vibhav> coolbhavi: You can use the debian/install file (probably)
<vibhav> coolbhavi: http://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/maint-guide/dother.en.html#install
<coolbhavi> vibhav, :) I was thinking of using dh-make-perl
<vibhav> coolbhavi: Yeah, that should too work (but I usually use d/install for such stuff)
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, Hi! Sorry, the app sprint is for all or for the ARB member only?
<vibhav> ^
<vibhav> PaoloRotolo: https://trello.com/board/ubuntu-arb-submissions/4fee2215cee295013c0862ba have a look at the apps having a PPA
<PaoloRotolo> vibhav, great, what should I do?
<dholbach> PaoloRotolo, no no - it's not
<dholbach> it's for everybody interested in apps
<dholbach> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/AppReviewBoard/AppsSprint might help a bir
<dholbach> bit
<dholbach> didrocks, I filed https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/python-distutils-extra/+bug/1020017
<didrocks> dholbach: isn't it better to follow the SRU process directly?
<didrocks> dholbach: like for each bug writing a test case and such
<dholbach> you mean just upload it?
<didrocks> yeah
<dholbach> test-case
<dholbach> hmhm
<didrocks> there is no backport needed :)
<dholbach> what do you mean?
<didrocks> dholbach: if we don't follow the SRU process, the new release team won't ack it
<dholbach> ok
<didrocks> well, we take the version in quantal
<didrocks> just change the versionning to be < quantal one
<didrocks> for each bugs, write the test case, regressions, so on
<didrocks> and upload that
<dholbach> ok ok
<dholbach> didrocks, test-cases added
<dholbach> I think I'll just change the version in 2.33-1 to 2.33-0ubuntu0.1 or something
<didrocks> dholbach: yeah, looking good (but no potential regression stenza). I'm afraid that they will ask you to put some test case for each bugs fixed though
<didrocks> dholbach: may be better to ping bdmurray beforehand?
<dholbach> didrocks, there are test-cases for each bug fixed
<didrocks> dholbach: I meant, adding a precise test and the test case directly in https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/python-distutils-extra/+bug/1002076 for instance
<dholbach> ah
<didrocks> oh, there is already one in fact, not part of the bug description though
<didrocks> but none for instance in https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/python-distutils-extra/+bug/995653
<didrocks> dholbach: also, Regression Potential is mandatory now on the SRU/ https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates#Procedure
<dholbach> ok
<didrocks> dholbach: they started to be really picky for precise :)
<dholbach> welcome back PaoloRotolo
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, thanks :)
 * PaoloRotolo is reading https://wiki.ubuntu.com/AppReviewBoard/AppsSprint  ;)
<dholbach> cool :)
<dholbach> didrocks, ok, I think I updated all the bugs in question :)
 * dholbach feels very tired now :)
<didrocks> dholbach: heh, only 4 bugs, imagine for unity :p
<didrocks> \o/
<dholbach> maybe another espresso or a pot of tea will help
 * didrocks is taking tea as well brb :)
<dholbach> I'll just upload the updated version now
<dholbach> let's see what happens
<dholbach> mhall119_, I'll have a fix for a number of https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.tag=arb bugs up in -proposed hopefully soon
<dholbach> coolbhavi, if you have a bit of time later on, do you think you could have a look at the apps which are currently up for votes? :-)
<dholbach> wendar, stgraber, ajmitch, highvoltage: I might need some help with https://bugs.launchpad.net/arb-lint/+bug/1019212 - do you think you could help me with putting together a list of rules for how the /opt installation should look like? I'm not 100% sure about it, but would be happy to write the code
<dholbach> also, do we have rules for files like /etc/apport/crashdb.conf.d/ppasc-crashdb.conf?
 * dholbach is reviewing the ppa software center
 * dholbach just did the anagram finder too
 * coolbhavi reviewed simple-gmail-checker
<dholbach> nice :)
<coolbhavi> dholbach, there was no way where I could find the access to the code he maintains on the web and when I googled found number of apps with similar functionality
<dholbach> it looks like there's only https://myapps.developer.ubuntu.com/site_media/arb/packages/2012/06/mailchecker_1.pl
<coolbhavi> yes but I was looking for a publicly accessible code repository
<coolbhavi> was testing out opensinhalese now got an error on execution http://pastebin.com/ZFMEAbCa and app crash so was digging into it
<dholbach> do you have python-desktopcouch installed?
<coolbhavi> yes
<coolbhavi> after installing too I get a crash
<dholbach> python-desktopcouch-application maybe?
<coolbhavi> its already newest version
<coolbhavi> i have the latest version of python-couchdb installed on precise
<dholbach> ok, then I don't know
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, sorry "https://wiki.ubuntu.com/AppReviewBoard/Review/Guidelines" says: "Use a Standards-Version of 3.9.2". Should I update the page with the Precise version (3.9.2)?
<dholbach> it should be 3.9.3
<dholbach> let me update the guidelines
<dholbach> 3.9.2 was in oneiric
<PaoloRotolo> yes, sorry, 3.9.3
<dholbach> updated :)
<dholbach> ... in the guidelines
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, ok, thanks"
<dholbach> thanks PaoloRotolo
<coolbhavi> dholbach, still a crash http://pastebin.com/tD32T9Eq
<dholbach> coolbhavi, I'm not exactly sure, maybe didrocks knows
<coolbhavi> dholbach, hmm
 * didrocks backlogs
<didrocks> coolbhavi: do you really need couchdb?
<didrocks> I'm think python-couchdb doesn't work anymore on precise
 * coolbhavi too thinks of the same 
<coolbhavi> I just had a review of the source and found it to be crashing couple of times
<mhall119_> dholbach: would you be able to help with a packaging support workshop tomorrow at 1700 UTC?
<mhall119> or someone on the ARB who can answer questions about packaging python apps for /opt
<dholbach> mhall119, I'm not sure I'm the best person - I just started a few weeks ago and mostly just copied/pasted O:-)
<didrocks> I'm think python-couchdb doesn't work anymore on precise
<didrocks> oopss wrong monitor :)
<mhall119> dholbach: you're a good person to answer general packaging questions though :)
<mhall119> I'm going to need both
<dholbach> would somebody mind running lp:~dholbach/arb-lint/1019212 on a few apps and see if the output seems to be according to https://bugs.launchpad.net/arb-lint/+bug/1019212?
<dholbach> stgraber, how do we deal with usr/share/python/runtime.d/*.rtupdate files?
<dholbach> are they OK to go in?
<dholbach> didrocks, I found a few submissions now which had .bzr in their source package, also some funny debian/copyright files (the last one where I found it was https://launchpad.net/~simonvermeersch/+archive/journey/+files/journey_12.06.8.dsc)
<didrocks> dholbach: quickly remove them, I think they used debuild -S ?
<dholbach> no idea
<dholbach> I just thought that it might be a general problem since I saw it 2-3 times now
<dholbach> maybe that's the --extras bits?
 * dholbach has no clue
<didrocks> le me recheck
<didrocks> let*
<didrocks> buildcommand = ["dpkg-buildpackage", "-S", "-I.bzr"]
<dholbach> hm
<didrocks> this is called by both --extras and release
<didrocks> so I really think they used something else
<didrocks> can you ask them?
<dholbach> I'll have a look if I can find more
<didrocks> dholbach: thanks, keep me posted :)
<dholbach> https://launchpad.net/~matthias-ruester/+archive/anagram-finder/+files/anagram-finder_0.1-public3ubuntu1.dsc too
<dholbach> didrocks, "quickly submitubuntu" maybe?
<dholbach> it's what http://developer.ubuntu.com/showdown/ suggests in (4)
<didrocks> dholbach: same, calling exactly the same code path
<didrocks> anagram-finder_0.1-public3ubuntu1
<didrocks> this versionning is not from quickly
<didrocks> it would have stripped the public3
<didrocks> (created by quickly share)
<dholbach> weird
<didrocks> yeah
<didrocks> just tried on a project
<didrocks> and don't reproduce
<didrocks> with --extras, release, share or submitubuntu
<didrocks> I would be interested in knowing how they are using it :)
<dholbach> I think they all used http://developer.ubuntu.com/showdown/
<didrocks> dholbach: hum, we do have their email address right? can we ask them how they created the .dsc file?
<dholbach> I guess it should be in the changelog somewhere
<PaoloRotolo> Hi all!
<dholbach> wb PaoloRotolo :)
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, thanks :)
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, ehm, can I review an App from here: https://code.launchpad.net/ubuntu-app-reviews  :)?
<dholbach> sure
<PaoloRotolo> "koza" for example?
<dholbach> branch any of them, you could try to run arb-lint on them, test-build them, test them and see how they work for you
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, ok, thanks. I'm follow the "Check list" on the AppsSprint page.
<dholbach> sweet
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, bzr faild the build because I don't have the Ravi Vagadia's secret key. It's normal?
<PaoloRotolo> failed*
<dholbach> yes
<dholbach> just do this:         bzr bd -- -us -uc
<dholbach> then it will not try to build it
<highvoltage> good morning(ish) everyone
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, oh, thanks :)
<dholbach> hey highvoltage!
<dholbach> PaoloRotolo, I'll update the docs
<PaoloRotolo> highvoltage, Good morning :)
<PaoloRotolo> :D
<highvoltage> dholbach: will comment on that arb lint bug a bit later if I can think of anything. I have it open in a tab, at least :)
<dholbach> highvoltage, if you have a bit of time today, do you think you could try out lp:~dholbach/arb-lint/1019212 on an app or two and see if the file list and the output about /opt stuff is what you expect? :)
<highvoltage> hey PaoloRotolo
<dholbach> highvoltage, excellent :)
<dholbach> highvoltage, to me it looked alright - the only thing I wasn't sure about was usr/share/python/runtime.d/*.rtupdate
 * highvoltage isn't either, tbph
<dholbach> I wonder if these files are absolutely necessary
<dholbach> let me try something
<dholbach> ah no, this doesn't fix it - nevermind - that's one thing I'd be interested to find out
<dholbach> also about the /etc/apport/crashdb.conf.d/*-crashdb.conf files
<dholbach> highvoltage, I'll add it to the bug
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, I have this error: W: This package does not use DEP-5, which provides a machine-readable  debian/copyright file.
<PaoloRotolo> I can't fix it...
<dholbach> it's just a warning - that's not too bad :)
<PaoloRotolo> This is the copyright before: http://paste.ubuntu.com/1071508/
<PaoloRotolo> and this after my fix: http://paste.ubuntu.com/1071507/
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, â
<dholbach> PaoloRotolo, you might want to keep "Ravi Vagadia <ravirdv@gmail.com>" as an "Upstream-Contact"
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, oh, yes
<PaoloRotolo> but this don't solve the issue
<PaoloRotolo> doesn't* :/
<dholbach> did you save the file and then reran arb-lint?
<dholbach> ah
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, yes...
<dholbach> use http://dep.debian.net/deps/dep5/ as the URL
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, no... It doesn't work...
<PaoloRotolo> [and sorry again for my bad english :( ]
<dholbach> no, it's fine :)
<PaoloRotolo> paolo@voyager:~/Sviluppo/koza/koza$ arb-lint
<PaoloRotolo> W: This package does not use DEP-5, which provides a machine-readable
<PaoloRotolo>    debian/copyright file. You might want to review
<PaoloRotolo>    http://www.debian.org/doc/packaging-manuals/copyright-format/1.0/ to
<PaoloRotolo>    find out how to accomplish it.
<dholbach> PaoloRotolo, sorry, my fault - I just fixed it in arb-lint
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, ahahah, ok, no problem :D
<dholbach> but http://dep.debian.net/deps/dep5/ should be fine
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, yep
<dholbach> hey mterry
<mterry> dholbach, hello!
<dholbach> didrocks, mterry, do you know if these .rtupdate files are strictly necessary?
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, shall I update the fix on a my branch?
<dholbach> PaoloRotolo, sure
<didrocks> dholbach: I don't think they are, but I'm not sure as well what they are for. I asked barry about it last week and he even doesn't know
<mterry> dholbach, no...  I'm not even confident I know what they do.
<didrocks> so if barry doesn't know, who can? :)
<dholbach> I'll ping barry again :)
<mterry> dholbach, what creates them?
<dholbach> ah, he's not around
<dholbach> mterry, dget https://launchpad.net/~sbreese/+archive/gr8s/+files/gr8s_12.06.11.dsc and try to build it
<dholbach> mterry, but what exactly creates it I'm unsure about
<dholbach> didrocks, mterry, dh_python2 does, in quantal
<dholbach> in precise it doesn't
<dholbach> I just overrode dh_python in debian/rules and it didn't get created
<mterry> dholbach, I built it fine.  Was I supposed to see an error about .rtupdate?
<dholbach> mterry, did you try in quantal?
<mterry> dholbach, yeah
<dholbach> it builds fine, but the .deb contains a .rtupdate file
<dholbach> (outside /opt)
<mterry> dholbach, ah
<dholbach> which is why I asked
<dholbach> I wrote a small tool to help review arb apps
<dholbach> and it pointed out the file
<mterry> ah right
<mterry> yeah, it looks like it's a python dpkg trigger
<mterry> To update/clean .pyc files
<dholbach>   * dh_python2:
<dholbach>     - generates rtupdate scripts for private directories that compile files
<dholbach>       from given package only, add --compile-all to dh_python2's call if you
<dholbach>       want the old behaviour (i.e. compile also files (plugins?) provided by
<dholbach>       other packages, which do not use a helper/bytecompile them)
<dholbach> python-defaults (2.7.2-5)
<mterry> dholbach, I'd say it's OK, but not necessary.  ARB can say whether it's awful or not
<dholbach> but it still does not explain to me if we really need it
<mterry> dholbach, I don't believe it's necessary.  If python files aren't compiled, they will just be slightly slower
<dholbach> the ARB are likely going to ask the TB about it
<dholbach> thanks didrocks, mterry
<mterry> dholbach, it could be handled like gsettings schemas and just compiled by the packaging itself without a trigger
<mterry> dholbach, (normally schemas are compiled by a trigger, but since we don't install them in the normal place, quickly for example will generate packaging that compiles it manually)
<dholbach> aha!
<dholbach> I can't say I have much of an opinion, I just noticed it earlier
<didrocks> the rt-update file triggering the triger?
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, sorry, one more question: I've tried to install the .deb file, but koza doesn't work...
<PaoloRotolo> paolo@voyager:/opt/extras.ubuntu.com/koza/bin$ ./koza
<PaoloRotolo> Traceback (most recent call last):
<PaoloRotolo>   File "./koza", line 45, in <module>
<PaoloRotolo>     import koza
<PaoloRotolo>   File "/opt/extras.ubuntu.com/koza/koza/__init__.py", line 25, in <module>
<PaoloRotolo>     from PySide.QtGui import *
<PaoloRotolo> ImportError: No module named QtGui
<dholbach> try: sudo apt-get install python-pyside.qtgui
<dholbach> and install again
<dholbach> err
<dholbach> try to run it again
<mterry> didrocks, yeah I believe, without reading the dpkg trigger file
<dholbach> PaoloRotolo, ^ - it could be that the package is missing this in its Depends: line
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, ok, I'll add python-pyside.qtgui to Depends
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, nope, I've the same error
<dholbach> the exact two same lines?
<dholbach>      from PySide.QtGui import *
<dholbach>  ImportError: No module named QtGui
<PaoloRotolo> oh, no... Isn't the same error, sorry
<PaoloRotolo> Traceback (most recent call last):
<PaoloRotolo>   File "./koza", line 45, in <module>
<PaoloRotolo>     import koza
<PaoloRotolo>   File "/opt/extras.ubuntu.com/koza/koza/__init__.py", line 27, in <module>
<PaoloRotolo>     from koza import KozaWindow
<PaoloRotolo>   File "/opt/extras.ubuntu.com/koza/koza/KozaWindow.py", line 24, in <module>
<PaoloRotolo>     from PySide.QtDeclarative import *
<PaoloRotolo> ImportError: No module named QtDeclarative
<dholbach> install python-pyside.qtdeclarative probably :)
<PaoloRotolo> ok, I'm installing qtuitools too
<PaoloRotolo> Now it works :D!
<PaoloRotolo> ok, python-pyside.qtgui, python-pyside.qtdeclarative and python-pyside.qtuitools added to Depends
<dholbach> thanks a bunch
<dholbach> that's great
<dholbach> PaoloRotolo, there should be a new arb-lint version available now - I hope it fixes the issue you found :)
<mhall119> can someone explain why I get emails for an app being submitted (to app-review-board ML), but on clicking the link for the app I get a 404?
<mhall119> this has happened many times since I've been watching the ML
<dholbach> mhall119, which app is it?
<mhall119> dholbach: most recently it was clchat https://myapps.developer.ubuntu.com/dev/apps/1128/
<dholbach> interesting
<mhall119> also sometimes I get a permission error
<dholbach> maybe the mail is sent out before everything is "processed"?
<mhall119> maybe...
<dholbach> the permission error might be because an app (most likely media content, so .pdf files) were moved over to the "commercial queue", because the ARB does not deal with them
<dholbach> the latter sounds like a process issue, which myapps could fix for us
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, here it is: https://code.launchpad.net/~paolorotolo/ubuntu-app-reviews/koza/+merge/113077   ;)
<dholbach> PaoloRotolo, if you go to the page of the app, you can go to the "feedback" tab of the page and mention to the app author the changes you made and a link to the proposal
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, good, thanks!
<dholbach> thanks for your work on this
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, thanks you for the patience :P
<dholbach> no no
<dholbach> thanks for your help!
<PaoloRotolo> :)
<dholbach> alright, now it's time for me to call it a day and find some dinner
<dholbach> have a great rest of your day everyone!
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, thanks, you too
<PaoloRotolo> uhm
<PaoloRotolo> Access forbidden
<PaoloRotolo> You just tried to access a feature which you don't have permission to use.
<PaoloRotolo> Only the owner of an application can do that.
#ubuntu-arb 2012-07-03
<dholbach> good morning
<dholbach_> ajmitch, thanks for the review
<dholbach> I just commented on it again, as I wasn't quite sure how to proceed
<PaoloRotolo> Good morning!
<dholbach> hey PaoloRotolo
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, hi!
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, I tried to post a feedback on the app page: https://myapps.developer.ubuntu.com/dev/apps/1032/  but it says that I haven't permission
<dholbach> oh, I had no idea :/
<dholbach> can you put up your comment on a pastebin again, then I'll try to put it in there
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, ok
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, here it is: http://paste.ubuntu.com/1072675/
<dholbach> PaoloRotolo, ok, this time it worked: https://myapps.developer.ubuntu.com/dev/apps/1032/feedback/
<dholbach> you might have to be member of ~ubuntu-app-review-contributors
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, good, thanks :)
<ajmitch> dholbach: hi, sorry I didn't comment earlier
 * ajmitch picked a bad time to get sick
<dholbach> ajmitch, oh damn :-/
 * dholbach hugs ajmitch
<dholbach> I hope you're going to be better soon again!
<dholbach> ajmitch, I updated the merge proposal again - I hope that's what you intended it to be
<ajmitch> yeah, I seemed to be a bit better tonight
 * ajmitch shall have to take a look
<ajmitch> mutable default arguments are something of a python gotcha :)
<dholbach> ajmitch, it'd be great if we could get it in - then I'd trigger another build and we'd have most of the regular checks covered by a small tool :-D
<ajmitch> the list is bound to the function definition & not reset to [] when called with no argument
<ajmitch> ok, will look now then
<dholbach> ajmitch, I'm not quite sure I understand the problem with the default argument
<ajmitch> let me throw together a quick test case
<dholbach> ajmitch, I guess I'm just a bit dense :)
<ajmitch> or I'm just wrong
<ajmitch> you're not changing the argument within the function, so you get away with it afaik, so ignore my MP comments :)
<dholbach> yeah, I just pass it through :)
<dholbach> ajmitch, does "ignore my MP comments" mean "it's approved, merge it" or are you still having a look at it?
<ajmitch> dholbach: merge it
<dholbach> great
<dholbach> thanks
<ajmitch> sorry, I should have marked it as such on the MP
<dholbach> no worries
 * dholbach triggers another build
<dholbach> that'd hopefully make reviewing apps a bit more fun :)
<dholbach> especially once we add examples for successfully fixed apps
<dholbach> PaoloRotolo, there should be a new arb-lint version in the ppa now, which also checks if the /opt installation is correct
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, great!
<PaoloRotolo> I'll install it at home today
<dholbach> super
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, the app review is fun :P
<dholbach> cool, I'm glad you like it :)
<PaoloRotolo> :)
<dholbach> ajmitch, are we going to ignore things like usr/share/python/runtime.d/harvestwidget.rtupdate and etc/apport/crashdb.conf.d/harvestwidget-crashdb.conf?
<ajmitch> dholbach: they're added by dh_python2 & dh_apport respectively, from what I know
<ajmitch> I think we'd need to override those to stop them being created
<dholbach> ajmitch, and that's what we'd want?
<dholbach> I guess what I'm asking is: is it unacceptable to have these files in there?
<ajmitch> to avoid potential file conflicts, it is, since we're trying to stick close to the /opt requirement
<dholbach> ok
<ajmitch> technically I don't know if it's a problem either way, as they have the package name
<dholbach> hum, I can't find dh_apport
<ajmitch> it's shipped in dh-apport
<dholbach> I don't have it installed, but still the crashdb.conf file gets shipped in the package :)
<ajmitch> then I'm probably wrong again & should stop misleading you
<dholbach> no no :)
<dholbach> aha, python-distutils-extra again
<ajmitch> oh is it?
<ajmitch> fun
 * didrocks should set an autojoin :)
<dholbach> hey didrocks
<dholbach> we just found files like etc/apport/crashdb.conf.d/harvestwidget-crashdb.conf
<dholbach> which look like they're shipped through python-distutils-extra
<didrocks> indeed :)
<dholbach> as many folks who just submitted apps didn't modify these files at all, it might make sense to just override whatever ships them somehow
<didrocks> this is to enable running ubuntu-bug <project> against the upstream project
<didrocks> hum, they shouldn't need to modify it
<dholbach> but for the future it'd be nice if apport and python-distutils-extra would do something like etc/apport/crashdb.conf.d/extras-harvestwidget-crashdb.conf or opt/extras.ubuntu.com/harvestwidget/etc/apport/crashdb.conf.d/harvestwidget-crashdb.conf
<didrocks> it should just do the right thing
<dholbach> ah ok
<dholbach> well then, I don't know :)
<didrocks> well, apport doesn't read extras.ubuntu.com
<didrocks> so the bug is apport to read from there?
<dholbach> apport and python-distutils-extra
<dholbach> first for apport to check an alternate location
<dholbach> and then for p-d-e to install to it
<didrocks> yeah, then to push in the alternate location
<dholbach> yep
<dholbach> I'll have a chat with pitti
<didrocks> I still think that if we wanted to be serious about /opt, we would change all desktop service to run from there
<dholbach> ajmitch, which location would you prefer?
<didrocks> run/listen
<didrocks> like dbus and such
<dholbach> etc/apport/crashdb.conf.d/extras-harvestwidget-crashdb.conf or opt/extras.ubuntu.com/harvestwidget/etc/apport/crashdb.conf.d/harvestwidget-crashdb.conf?
<dholbach> yeah
<dholbach> opt sucks balls
<dholbach> :)
<ajmitch> agreed
<didrocks> well, it's only 2 years that I'm advocating for this, since the ARB was created :)
 * dholbach urgently looks for his valerian tea, to calm down again
<didrocks> no issue with /opt as long as we support it :)
<ajmitch> didrocks: advocating for more stuff in /opt, or not at all? :)
<didrocks> ajmitch: everything can go in /opt, but before making this a requirement, we should ensure that apport, dbus, unity lens files, and such are listening to /opt/<whatever>
<dholbach> ajmitch, which of the two location would make more sense to you? etc/apport/crashdb.conf.d/extras-harvestwidget-crashdb.conf or opt/extras.ubuntu.com/harvestwidget/etc/apport/crashdb.conf.d/harvestwidget-crashdb.conf?
<ajmitch> dholbach: I *suspect* we'd need to ask for an explicit exception to have it in /etc still, going by the letter of the law "_
<dholbach> the good thing is: pitti is on the TB ;-)
<ajmitch> yes, and so is stgraber :)
<didrocks> everything where it makes sense to have application hooked up and where you put exceptions :)
<dholbach> alright
<ajmitch> didrocks: and then you still run into problems where people want to write a plugin for a certain app
<ajmitch> whether it be nautilus, or something else
<didrocks> ajmitch: well, do we want plugins in all our apps?
<didrocks> ajmitch: this is a control gate in fact :)
<didrocks> to see what we want to enables for ARB apps or not
<didrocks> enable*
<ajmitch> right, but we don't support them right now except for lenses as a special case
<didrocks> yeah, and I think it should stay that way
<didrocks> like just supporting that for some special cases
<didrocks> base system, like dbus, apport, desktop files detection
<ajmitch> the restrictions on this could probably be made clearer for the next app developer competition, too :)
<didrocks> (so bamf, unityâ¦)
<didrocks> some special ones like unity lens
 * ajmitch needs to bug unity people some more to not have to restart for new lenses :)
<dholbach> ok, I talked to pitti
<dholbach> he said we should just move the file to opt/extras.ubuntu.com/harvestwidget/etc/apport/crashdb.conf.d/harvestwidget-crashdb.conf
<dholbach> and apport and p-d-e will need to be fixed
<ajmitch> problem is, my friends who work on it tell me to submit a patch
<ajmitch> dholbach: ok
<dholbach> I'll add a test and docs to arb-lint about it
<ajmitch> apport would need an SRU for it to look in the right place then
<dholbach> yep
<dholbach> and p-d-e too
<ajmitch> yippee?
<dholbach> let's go shopping
<ajmitch> sorry for sarcasm, I'm a little jaded on /opt still :)
 * dholbach makes a valerian tea for ajmitch too
<ajmitch> heh :)
 * ajmitch really needs to go & sleep soon
<ajmitch> I'm really sorry I haven't been around much for this apps sprint, this just turned out to be one of my busier weeks
<dholbach> we can do it again
<dholbach> I think we all learnt a lot
<dholbach> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.tag=arb
<ajmitch> not too many, but some will take some work
<dholbach> ok, I just went ahead and added tests with docs and examples
<dholbach> ok, lunch time :)
<dholbach> coolbhavi, if you install arb-lint from the PPA now, it should do a lot of the testing for you
<dholbach> hopefully also the /opt stuff
<coolbhavi> dholbach, sure will check it out :) Thanks!
<dholbach> mhall119, so I should run arb-lint on arb-lint itself? ;-)
<dholbach> E: The package seems to contain no files in '/opt/extras.ubuntu.com/arb-
<dholbach>    lint' which indicates a problem with the installation of files.
<dholbach> ;-)
<coolbhavi> :)
<mhall119> dholbach: lol
<mhall119> dholbach: so now we can take a tarball, put it in a bzr branch, create packaging for it, and check that the package follows the extras guidelines
<mhall119> that's great!
<dholbach> yeah, we're slowly getting somewhere :)
<dholbach> hey highvoltage :)
<highvoltage> howdy dholbach
<dholbach> how are things?
<highvoltage> I have a scumbag brain.
<dholbach> what what?
<coolbhavi> hey highvoltage
<highvoltage> I'm a victim of this again today: https://plus.google.com/118060934321492774758/posts/P6Ryggx81MU
<highvoltage> got millions of ideas last night and couldn't sleep and now my head is just a black hole.
<highvoltage> dholbach: "scumbag brain" is a popular meme: http://www.quickmeme.com/Scumbag-Brain/
<highvoltage> dholbach: and you, how are you?
<highvoltage> hey there coolbhavi
<coolbhavi> highvoltage, how are you doing buddy?
<dholbach> ah ok, I had no idea about that meme :)
<dholbach> highvoltage, I had a similar phase and two things helped me back then: I kept pencil and paper (not a laptop!!!) next to the bed and pinned the ideas down - also doing just a little bit of sports (not too much) during the day
<highvoltage> dholbach: I'll try the pencil. I do more and more excercise but that seems to make it worse (especially if I do it later in the day).
<highvoltage> I finally joined the trello board. It's pretty cool.
<highvoltage> I wanted to spend more time with arb stuff this weekend but only ended up reviewing one app :-/
<dholbach> I'll blog about what we did in the last few days later on
<dholbach> hopefully that'll get us some more interested folks :)
<coolbhavi> :)
<highvoltage> great. I've been meaning to ask about that, so does that go on the app developers blog?
<dholbach> highvoltage, I don't have access to it
<dholbach> but I guess we could put something up on an etherpad and get it up on the app dev blog if we all think that's the best place for it
<PaoloRotolo> Hi all!
<highvoltage> hi PaoloRotolo
<PaoloRotolo> highvoltage, hi
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, The new release of arb-lint is cool
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, it reported 2 errors against koza
<PaoloRotolo> I'm solving them...
<dholbach> sweet
<dholbach> I'm in a  call - I'll be back in a few
<PaoloRotolo> ok
<PaoloRotolo> Fixed :D
<PaoloRotolo> Successfully updated my branch
<dholbach> PaoloRotolo, shall I add a comment for you to some app?
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, yes, thanks!
<dholbach> ah, that's koza again?
<dholbach> PaoloRotolo, ^?
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, yes :) I've other two errors
<dholbach> perfect
<PaoloRotolo> after the arb-lint update
<dholbach> good work
<dholbach> PaoloRotolo, dh_python2 and which other one?
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, only python
<dholbach> ah ok
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, and I have fixed a typo in debian/control
<dholbach> ah cool
<dholbach> good work
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, thanks :)!
<PaoloRotolo> So, Koza is ready for the software center (IMHO) :D
<dholbach> highvoltage, wendar, stgraber, ajmitch: ^ say Hi to a great new contributor to the apps world! :)
<highvoltage> hi PaoloRotolo!
<highvoltage> PaoloRotolo: and thanks for all the work, it's much appreciated!
<dholbach> I will have to rush out in a bit because a friend of mine will have a surprise birthday party in a bit and I'll have to get a present still 0:-)
<PaoloRotolo> highvoltage, dholbach Thanks a lot :)
<dholbach> so if somebody could have a quick look over lp:~paolorotolo/ubuntu-app-reviews/koza that'd be cool
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, Have a nice evening
<PaoloRotolo> thanks for all
<wendar> hi PaoloRotolo, and thanks!
<PaoloRotolo> :)
<dholbach> I just blogged about the last two days: http://daniel.holba.ch/blog/2012/07/making-better-apps-possible/
<dholbach> thanks everybody for your great work :)
<dholbach> if I missed something, I'll write another blog post tomorrow :-)
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, nice, thanks again!
<highvoltage> wendar: around?
<wendar> highvoltage: yup
<highvoltage> wendar: I think it was you who commented that even MOTU apps only need two +1 from MOTUs
<highvoltage> wendar: do you think it should be like that for ARB apps too?
<highvoltage> wendar: I'm thinking that if the arb pretty much agrees with that then we should get the policy changed to keep the vote queue as small as possible
<wendar> highvoltage: I think 3 is pretty reasonable for arb apps
<highvoltage> indeed.
<wendar> highvoltage: we just need to get better about actually voting
<highvoltage> 3 is still easy to get to at least.
<wendar> highvoltage: I mean, I'm assuming one of the +1s is actually the person who submitted it for vote
<wendar> so, three all together is really only the same as the MOTU "get at least two others to agree this is a good idea"
<highvoltage> wendar: ah yes, but that could also be someone from arb-helpers who submitted it
<highvoltage> (but it would still be fine I guess)
<wendar> yes, that's why I was making the assumption explicit
<highvoltage> ok, sorry for stating the obvious :)
<wendar> I'd say at least two of the +1s should be ARB members who have done a code review/security review on the package
<wendar> the last one could be more of a sanity check
<wendar> and really 3 will be easier to get once we recruit a few more ARB members
<wendar> mainly, I just don't want to get bogged down in policy changes :)
<wendar> three +1s is the current rule
<wendar> so, we can just run with it
<wendar> another way of thinking about it (just thinking out loud here)... the MOTU rule of two +1s assumes a third experienced packager in the process: the person who made the package
<wendar> we don't assume the *developer* is at all experienced
<wendar> so we add one more
<wendar> but... hmmm
<wendar> I could see changing the policy so the third is an arb-helper
<wendar> so, each package has to get two +1 votes from ARB board members, and one +1 vote from the guide who raised it for vote
<wendar> and, the guide can be either a board member or a helper
<wendar> the ARB board members are required to be ubuntu-devs
<wendar> but the helpers aren't
<wendar> so, that makes the whole process more parallel to MOTU
<highvoltage> wendar: yeah that would be good
<wendar> highvoltage: I'd be in favor of that
<wendar> highvoltage: we could do it "inofficially" for now, and just have one board member +1 for experienced arb-helpers, without doing a full code review
<wendar> highvoltage: like, really, I'd confidently +1 anything dholbach submits as an arb-helper :)
<wendar> highvoltage: especially after a couple other board members have done a code review and +1'd it
<highvoltage> wendar: *nod*
#ubuntu-arb 2012-07-04
<dholbach> good morning
<PaoloRotolo> Good morning
<dholbach> ciao PaoloRotolo
<dholbach> come stai?
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, fine, thanks :D
<dholbach> :-)
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, your italian is good :P
<dholbach> no, it's not ;-)
<dholbach> but I picked up a few words and hope to pick up a few more - because I'll be on holiday in Italy in ~2 weeks :)
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, nice, where?
<dholbach> we're invited to a wedding in Massafra, but we're going to see other parts of the country as well :)
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, it's near my town :) I live in Puglia
<dholbach> ah nice :)
<didrocks> hey dholbach ;)
<dholbach> salut didrocks
<didrocks> hi PaoloRotolo
<dholbach> PaoloRotolo, I'm looking forward to it
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, hi!
<didrocks> wrong d<tab> ;)
<PaoloRotolo> didrocks, yes, sorry
<PaoloRotolo> didrocks, hi
<didrocks> PaoloRotolo: no worry, happens to me every single day! :)
<PaoloRotolo> didrocks, me too :)
<dholbach> if any of you could help test the bugs mentioned in https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/python-distutils-extra/+bug/1020017 (test-cases are in there), it'd be much appreciated
<dholbach> ajmitch, are you feeling any better now?
<dholbach> ajmitch, what do we do with the wikipedia lens?
<ajmitch> dholbach: usually the person who puts it up for vote has been the uploader, but that obviously won't work
 * ajmitch has just got back in from pycon meeting, needs to sort dinner
<dholbach> ajmitch, wow, you're in meeting throughout the week :)
<ajmitch> well, last night was codecraft, a monthly meeting
<ajmitch> so we moved the pycon one to tonight
<BerndSch> ajmitch: are there any news for my submitted app (https://myapps.developer.ubuntu.com/dev/apps/548/) for the precise software center?
<PaoloRotolo> ok, can I review the last app: variety?
<dholbach> PaoloRotolo, sure
<PaoloRotolo> good
<dholbach> BerndSch, I'll take a look
<PaoloRotolo> Let's start :)
<dholbach> ajmitch, does etc/apparmor.d/opt.extras.ubuntu.com.unity-lens-sshsearch.unity-lens-sshsearch.py look like a correct path to you?
<dholbach> I never dealt with any of this, so I'm not 100% sure
<dholbach> BerndSch, I pushed a few changes to lp:~dholbach/ubuntu-app-reviews/unity-lens-sshsearch which you might be interested in
<dholbach> BerndSch, I'm a bit unsure about the location of the apparmor profile, but as I'm not an expert, I'll leave it as it is :)
<ajmitch> dholbach: I left that & the debian/{control,rules} stuff in - what I wanted was for other people to vote on it
<ajmitch> there were some problems with qreator & the metadata getting through to software-center from what I recall
<dholbach> oh
<dholbach> you mean the dh_gencontrol stuff?
<dholbach> ok, I reapplied it to lp:~dholbach/ubuntu-app-reviews/unity-lens-sshsearch
 * dholbach just had a look at pyMi
 * dholbach has a look at indicator pingdom
<dholbach> I'll have a look at utrails next
<dholbach> this is actually fun :)
<dholbach> utrails might actually be ready soon
 * dholbach has a look at protoborsa
<achuni> good morning!
<dholbach> hey achuni
<achuni> hi dholbach :)
<didrocks> hey dholbach :)
<didrocks> dholbach: so the new requirements on http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~dholbach/ubuntu-app-reviews/indicator-pingdom/changes/4?start_revid=4 (like apport and the .rtupdate) makes it difficult for people using Quickly for the context
<didrocks> as it won't be update for this
<didrocks> and next quickly package will overwrite this
<didrocks> TommyBrunn: for 2. you can quickly configure dependencies
<didrocks> then manually add in a line the dep
<didrocks> then, quickly package will add this dep when recreating debian/control
<TommyBrunn> didrocks: Ok, that I can certainly do.
<didrocks> TommyBrunn: for the copyright, right, it's a case we don't support, apart from copying over the debian/copyright, I'm unsure :)
<didrocks> but it's interesting, yeah, didn't think about apps wrapping multiple libs
<TommyBrunn> didrocks: Wouldn't it be fairly common to have at least something that's not necessarily your own. Such as using a CC icon or something?
<dholbach> didrocks, urgh :-(
<didrocks> TommyBrunn: well, Quickly was done for applications in the distro first, not ARB one
<dholbach> didrocks, it wasn't clear to me that quickly would overwrite it again
<didrocks> TommyBrunn: so normally, that would ask for a separate source package
<TommyBrunn> didrocks: doing quickly configure dependencies will add libglib2.0-bin as a regular dependency, not a build-dependency. Is that a problem?
<didrocks> TommyBrunn: not really, automagic build-dep doesn't work in dh_python2 anyway
<didrocks> but yeah, something to note when it will work :)
<dholbach> didrocks, do you know what might cause something like lines 8-10 in http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~dholbach/ubuntu-app-reviews/protoborsa/revision/24?
<didrocks> dholbach: what is wrong? :)
<dholbach> didrocks, the removed lines
<dholbach> didrocks, I think it's auto-generated stuff
<didrocks> it's a quickly project?
<dholbach> and I've seen it many times reviewing apps
<dholbach> yes
<didrocks> this comes from the AUTHORS file
<dholbach> almost all of them are
<didrocks> so if the AUTHORS file changed, it's put there
<dholbach> "</property>" does not look like a standard AUTHORS bit
<didrocks> the first stenza changed is the new format
<didrocks> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~dholbach/ubuntu-app-reviews/protoborsa/view/head:/AUTHORS
<dholbach> what about the "</property>" bit?
<dholbach> but I guess it's more of a p-d-e problem anyway, right?
 * didrocks doesn't see </property>
<didrocks> ah
<didrocks> in the lines removed
<didrocks> yeah, it's an old bug of p-d-e
<didrocks> the new update, as you can see, removes it :)
<dholbach> sweet
<dholbach> I can't wait for the update to go into -updates
<dholbach> it's in -proposed already
<dholbach> didrocks, I'm not sure what we do about 'quickly package' overwriting things :-/
<didrocks> dholbach: well, if the requirements are moving, we won't be ever able to stabilize some stuff on quickly
<didrocks> dholbach: we do have to update because the packaging is changing
<coolbhavi> highvoltage, ajmitch dholbach https://myapps.developer.ubuntu.com/dev/apps/1111/ < -- can I reject this request?
<coolbhavi> its available freely and readily for download I see no point in pushing this through as an app
<coolbhavi> available as is as a pdf
<coolbhavi> any comments?
<dholbach> didrocks, the requirements stayed the same - it's the packaging infrastructure which changed :)
<highvoltage> coolbhavi: hmm, PDFs are usually allowed, I think it usually goes through the commercial process because they have some process for that. I agree that it's kind of pointless but I'm not sure if that's enough basis to reject it on
<dholbach> you can punt it to the other queue
<coolbhavi> highvoltage, thanks for that
<coolbhavi> dholbach, whom to contact for the commercial queue?
<coolbhavi> for moving the app?
<coolbhavi> this is the first time I am encountering such situations
<coolbhavi> achuni, hi
<achuni> hey coolbhavi
<coolbhavi> https://myapps.developer.ubuntu.com/dev/apps/1111/ there is a pdf which is readily available for download.. Yet submitted to the ARB for processing
<coolbhavi> achuni, ^^^
<achuni> coolbhavi: right, MyApps bumps everything that is $0 and uses a free license over to the ARB
<achuni> coolbhavi: even though the ARB doesn't do pdf content, it's hard to tell automatically when an app is a pdf-in-a-box
<achuni> coolbhavi: ah, I see your comments above (I might have missed a few, I dropped out a bit I think)
<coolbhavi> achuni, personally I see no point in pushing this as an app because its available as is for download as pdf  as I said above
<achuni> coolbhavi: I'd say bump over to the non-ARB queue
<coolbhavi> achuni, do you guys have a process for packing a pdf document btw? and how to move it over?
<achuni> coolbhavi: until there's a separate "book store" for ubuntu, pdfs and apps are being mingled... there's an intent to separate them out at some point soon
<achuni> coolbhavi: to move over, during review you should have a button at the bottom of the page that says "Move to MyApps"
<coolbhavi> achuni, ah ok never used that thanks!
<achuni> coolbhavi: which is a very non-intuitive label, yep.  at first we referred to the non-ARB queue as the "MyApps" queue
<achuni> coolbhavi: I still don't think we have a good name for the non-ARB queue :)
<coolbhavi> achuni, seemed a bit confusing at first look because we are reviewing in the My apps portal atleast going by the website :) so I just got a bit dumb I guess
<coolbhavi> sorry for that
<achuni> coolbhavi: np :)
<TommyBrunn> So dholbach, didrocks, any ideas on how to solve this problem? I imagine I'm not going to be the only person in the Ubuntu App Showdown to use quickly and have some third-party stuff in there. I'd be fine with a hacky solution for now, as long as there _is_ a solution.
<dholbach> TommyBrunn, which problem are you referring to? the .rtupdate and apport issue?
<dholbach> if that's the case, ignore it for now - I'll send a mail to the ARB list about it
<TommyBrunn> No, I was referring to the issue with the copyright file
<didrocks> well, you are the only one about the copyright file as of today TBH :/
<didrocks> it's something to open a bug for, it's an interesting case quickly wasn't design for
<didrocks> right now, I can only see this as copying it over
<TommyBrunn> What do you mean about that last part?
<dholbach> I think I'm missing part of the discussion right now - is debian/copyright auto-generated too and overwritten or what is the issue?
<TommyBrunn> That is correct
<TommyBrunn> When quickly packages the project, it generates a new copyright file and overwrites the old one
<dholbach> ok
<didrocks> as you can have added AUTHORS to this file
<didrocks> bundling other libs in your app was not what quickly was designed for
<dholbach> didrocks, once the project is in the "finishing touches" stage, would it be possible to use something like "bzr bd -- -S -sa; cd ..; dput ppa package*.changes" instead of 'quickly package'? or would it cause problems?
<dholbach> so we could tell people to concentrate on the code and once they're happy, "upload it regularly"?
<didrocks> dholbach: that won't cause any problem
<didrocks> well
<didrocks> until you add new deps :)
<didrocks> or update AUTHORS
<didrocks> or add new files :p
<dholbach> right
<dholbach> debuild -i.bzr then ;-)
<didrocks> same issue if you add new deps or update AUTHORS, but yeah, at least, new files are handled :)
<dholbach> didrocks, or we would tell app authors to just give us a link to their bzr branch
<didrocks> yeah, but that will break at next release
<didrocks> I think it's something to discuss for next week
<didrocks> it's a tricky question
<dholbach> I just sent https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/app-review-board/2012-July/001056.html
<didrocks> until now, we told "the debian directory is owned by quickly"
<dholbach> and CCed you
<didrocks> thanks :)
<dholbach> TommyBrunn, for now I'd recommend to ignore the issue
<dholbach> and just keep on working on the app :)
<dholbach> as soon as we have a solution we'll advise through myApps comments
<TommyBrunn> Okay, thanks for your time. :)
<dholbach> thanks a lot for bringing it up
 * dholbach goes back to teaching the apps-brancher to pull from PPAs :)
<PaoloRotolo> Hi all!
<highvoltage> hi PaoloRotolo
<PaoloRotolo> hi highvoltage
<dholbach> ciao PaoloRotolo
<dholbach> PaoloRotolo, I'm not sure if you saw https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/app-review-board/2012-July/001056.html yet
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, ciao :)
<dholbach> (not sure if you are on the list)
<dholbach> but for now we should probably hold off making .rtupdate, crashdb and DEP5 changes
<dholbach> as they will be overwritten anway :-/
<dholbach> hey highvoltage
<dholbach> but still it should make sense to branch apps, install them, test them and review them - there might be other issues we can point out or fix :)
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, sorry I don't understand... We can't fix the DEP5 in the copyright, for example?
<dholbach> PaoloRotolo, yes, even if the app author merges the changes, they will be overwritten the next time they run 'quickly package'
<dholbach> so until we have a good solution to the problem, it doesn't make sense yet
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, and... what happens if someone doesn't use Quickly?
<PaoloRotolo> is not obligatory
<dholbach> in that case the change would make sense :)
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, so, if the app don't use Quickly I can fix the issue, right? How can I know if the app are using it?
<dholbach> didrocks, is the .quickly file always shipped?
<didrocks> dholbach: in the source package? right, but it shouldn't be installed
<dholbach> sure, sorry - that's what I meant
<didrocks> yeah yeah ;)
<didrocks> apart if the dev is doing some tricks ;)
<didrocks> but no garantee then!
<dholbach> PaoloRotolo, if there's a .quickly file in the source package then it uses Quickly
<dholbach> the apport crash db we filed a bug report for, the DEP5 thing should be fixed once python-distutils-extra gets into -updates
<dholbach> but for the .rtupdate thing we still don't have a good answer :/
<dholbach> didrocks, can we get a 'quickly package --dont-do-it' option? :-P
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, good. If there isn't a quickly file I can fix the issue. If there is, we can invite the owner of the app to run 'quicly package', ok?
<didrocks> dholbach: well, we need to find a way, as told in the email, there are a lot of reasons to have those files owned by quickly
<dholbach> PaoloRotolo, 'quickly package' will overwrite all our changes to debian/rules and debian/copyright
<didrocks> the issue is when the platform and requirements changes :)
<didrocks> like this new rtupdate file
<didrocks> the copyright dep5, it's not mandatory to push latest versions
<dholbach> and in more complicated cases like a more complicated debian/copyright
<dholbach> no, it's not - agreed
<didrocks> the older spec is still valid
<didrocks> and we have a bunch of packages in main still following it :)
<didrocks> the "I embeed a separate lib in my app" is more worrying
<didrocks> not really sure how we can do that
<didrocks> I'm sure pkgme has the same issue btw
<dholbach> ask authors to add a EXTRA_COPYING file which gets >> debian/copyright ;-)
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, oh, I finally got it :D
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, So this affects only the apps in development. (for the contest)
<dholbach> PaoloRotolo, let's wait which replies come up in the discussion on the mailing list
<PaoloRotolo> It's not valid for the mature apps submitted to the ARB
<dholbach> right now, I'd say best ignore it for quickly apps
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, ok, thanks! I'm going to subscribe the mailing list
<dholbach> thanks :)
<PaoloRotolo> [I'm afk for 5 minutes]
<PaoloRotolo> ok, fixed 4 issues with "variety"
<PaoloRotolo> I'm uploading it into a branch
<PaoloRotolo> Here it is: https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-app-review-contributors/ubuntu-app-reviews/variety
<BerndSch> dholbach, ajmitch: I updated my branch with dholbach changes and submitted the new tar.gz for my app https://myapps.developer.ubuntu.com/dev/apps/548/changerequest/145/
#ubuntu-arb 2012-07-05
<dholbach> good morning
<dpm> morning
<dholbach> ajmitch, highvoltage: we might have to decide how we move forward with app showdown apps
<dholbach> as 'quickly package' will overwrite changes we ask for
<PaoloRotolo> Good morning
<dholbach> ciao PaoloRotolo
<PaoloRotolo> Hi dholbach :)
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, please, can you post a feedback on this app: https://myapps.developer.ubuntu.com/dev/apps/1151/  ? I've uploaded some fixes here: https://code.launchpad.net/~paolorotolo/ubuntu-app-reviews/variety :)
<dholbach> PaoloRotolo, it seems like the app uses quickly too, so those changes would get overwritten too the next time it gets updated in the ppa :-/
<dholbach> dpm: ^ meet PaoloRotolo, a tireless new helper in the app world :)
<dpm> heya PaoloRotolo, nice to meet you and welcome! :-)
<dpm> I saw some of your merge proposals already, good work!
<didrocks> hey hey
<dholbach> salut didrocks
<PaoloRotolo> dpm, hi, thanks!
<PaoloRotolo> hi didrocks
<didrocks> hey dholbach, PaoloRotolo!
<dholbach> didrocks, which of the changes in https://code.launchpad.net/~paolorotolo/ubuntu-app-reviews/variety/+merge/113424 should we be able to make in p-d-e itself? :)
<dholbach> bug 1002379 is already fixed or going to be fixed soon
<didrocks> dholbach: the DEP-5 one
<dholbach> bug 1020502 is already filed
<didrocks> ah :)
<dholbach> I'm not quite sure how to proceed in the .rtupdate case
<dholbach> and do you think we should file a bug about extending debian/copyright somehow?
<didrocks> why do you override dh_python2?
<dholbach> at least to document the problem somewhere
<dholbach> didrocks, it creates  usr/share/python/runtime.d/*.rtupdate files
<didrocks> dholbach: I would prefer that we discuss that with all the other problems we saw recently on Monday
<didrocks> and see what could  be done
<didrocks> yeah, but only on quantal?
<didrocks> dh_python2 is useful :)
<dholbach> I think I saw it in precise too
<didrocks> for having compiled .pyc I guess
<didrocks> the crashdb.conf is fixing in pde as well
<dholbach> I think that's all the problems I currently know of
<dholbach> so it's not too bad
<dholbach> let me do a test-build on precise and see what I get
<didrocks> yeah
<PaoloRotolo> didrocks, I override dh_python2 to fix this error:
<PaoloRotolo> E: Unallowed file usr/share/python/runtime.d/variety.rtupdate was found in
<PaoloRotolo>    the package, which is created by dh_python2. To find out how to override
<PaoloRotolo>    dh_python2, please have a look at http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~dholbach
<PaoloRotolo>    /ubuntu-app-reviews/harvestwidget/revision/59
<dholbach> it was introduced in python-defaults 2.7.2-5
<didrocks> PaoloRotolo: right, but you mean that dh_python2 is useless then?
<dholbach> PaoloRotolo, yes, I know - that was added to arb-lint before we knew about quickly rewriting things
<dholbach> didrocks, the same problem should be in precise as well (.rtupdate)
<didrocks> dholbach: hum ok
<didrocks> dholbach: I need to look at what this file is for exactly
<didrocks> dholbach: and see if we can make use of it
<didrocks> I think we should really spend time to ensure that everything works well frmo /opt
<didrocks> so that we have a requirement which really works
<dholbach> maybe we need a dh_extrasapp :-D
<didrocks> dholbach: yeah, maybe, I would be happy that we clearly look at that :)
<didrocks> dholbach: can you setup a hangout for Monday?
<dholbach> didrocks, so as far as I can see there are two issues which we don't have bugs for: 1) extending debian/copyright and 2) .rtupdate
<didrocks> with some people aware and deep into that? :)
<dholbach> didrocks, who would you want to have in the hangout
<didrocks> dholbach: it will be in French, of course :p
<didrocks> dholbach: don't really know, I don't know the arb members ;) probably you, david, already
<dholbach> bien sÃ»r :)
<didrocks> people who knows about the requirements and exception, as well as different issues we have with it :)
<PaoloRotolo> didrocks, are you French :)?
<didrocks> PaoloRotolo: you never hear me talking I guess and my english accent, I'm clearly French :p
<dholbach> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/python-distutils-extra/+bug/1021207
<dholbach> PaoloRotolo, I'll update arb-lint to explain that this is something we should ignore for now
<PaoloRotolo> nice :)
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, only in the quickly app, right?
<dholbach> PaoloRotolo, no, I fear it's a more general issue
<dholbach> didrocks, in which cases will p-d-e write the debian/copyright file?
<didrocks> for all apps where python-mkdebian --force-copyright is called
<didrocks> I added force-control, force-rules and force-copyright some years ago
<didrocks> and then, make them called by Quickly
<didrocks> I'm not sure anyone else but Quickly is using it
<dholbach> and in which cases are they called by quickly? always? or just for extras?
<didrocks> always
<dholbach> ok
<didrocks> as soon as you have to update the packaging
<didrocks> meaning release, share, package
<dholbach> gotcha
<didrocks> so
<didrocks> this rtupdate file
<didrocks> in fact, it's really interested
<didrocks> and definitively relocatable
<didrocks> we should have the dh_extraapp that dholbach is talking about :)
<didrocks> and moving the additional things we move that way
<didrocks> would be way more clean :)
<didrocks> this would support changing the prefix, moving files around and such
<didrocks> than, just adding dh --with extraapp to debian/rules
<didrocks> and the magic happens :)
<dholbach> I filed https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/python-distutils-extra/+bug/1021216
<dholbach> dpm, the list of https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.tag=arb is growing
<didrocks> dholbach: so no special check for rtupdate, the only check is that is should be installed in /opt
<dholbach> didrocks, but will it be run if it's located in /opt?
<dpm> dholbach, yeah, I saw that. https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/quickly/+bug/1018038 seems to be a critical one to me. Do you know if many people have hit that bug?
<dholbach> yes, a few
<dholbach> some fixed it after they saw the answer on AskUbuntu
<didrocks> dholbach: yeah
<didrocks> dholbach: it's just compiling .py to .pyc
<dholbach> didrocks, really? what's running it?
<didrocks> nothing
<didrocks> should be in the postinst
<dholbach> oh yeah?
<dholbach> will have a look
<dholbach> (if somebody could verify all the test-cases from the bugs in https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/python-distutils-extra/+bug/1020017 and leave a comment on the individual bugs, that'd be nice)
<dpm> dholbach, I'll ask mterry if he can have a look when he's around later on. It's a pretty bad bug if we ask people to use submitubuntu and then the package fails to build
<dpm> Btw, does anyone know the answer to http://askubuntu.com/questions/159673/how-to-use-gsettings-from-opt - does Quickly take care of it?
<dholbach> didrocks, I see nothing in the postinst calling the .rtupdate file
<didrocks> dpm: it's easy to fix with current infra
<didrocks> dholbach: yeah, it needs to be set manually in postinst
<didrocks> dholbach: http://www.mail-archive.com/debian-python@lists.debian.org/msg04587.html
<didrocks> oh
<didrocks> it's even worse
<didrocks> wow, people are going crazy :)
<didrocks> so we have this file
<didrocks> which should be executed in a postinst
<didrocks> BUT!
<didrocks> dh_python3
<didrocks> is adding: f which py3compile >/dev/null 2>&1; then
<didrocks>         py3compile -p unity-lens-radios /usr/share/unity-lens-radios
<didrocks> fi
<didrocks> so doing the same :)
<dholbach> I don't think I understand what's going on :)
<didrocks> dholbach: "it's a mess" is a good summary? :)
<dholbach> I think we've had the .rtupdate files much much much longer already
<didrocks> dholbach: yeah, but it was removed before, that was what barry told me last week
<didrocks> but this file is useless since dh_python it seems
<didrocks> basically, dh_python adds the same thing in postinst
<didrocks> (compiling the .py in .pyc if you project is not in a standard python directory)
<dholbach> aha!
<dholbach> the python and python3 maintainer scripts run it
<didrocks> but it's useless
<didrocks> as the postinst stenza is already doing the same
<didrocks> dholbach: I do not see any trigger?
<didrocks> ah, you mean in each libs
<dholbach> http://paste.ubuntu.com/1076151/
<dholbach> for python.p{re,ost}inst
<didrocks> dholbach: right, but this is only when you install python
<didrocks> see the thread I pointed to you, it confirms that
<didrocks> but then, there is no trigger
<didrocks> so if you install something afterward installing python
<dholbach> I would suggest we override dh_install with p-d-e for now and remove the file and be done with it :)
<didrocks> this files isn't used
<dholbach> and backport the change to precise as well :)
<didrocks> dholbach: yeah, it's not needed
<didrocks> dholbach: making this down as something to discuss on Monday? :)
<dholbach> or rather delete the whole directory :)
<didrocks> I'll try to grab more info to confirm that it's not needed anymore
<didrocks> (in our case)
 * didrocks is out for some exercice, see you soon :)
<dholbach> didrocks, ah, maybe it's needed in case you upgrade to a new python
<didrocks> dholbach: hum, interestingâ¦ ;)
<dholbach> but then we just might have to update the python and python3 maintainer scripts to look into /opt as well
<didrocks> yeah
<dholbach> bugger bugger bugger
<didrocks> I need to try to compile with both :)
<dholbach> enjoy the exercise
<didrocks> and see how it behaves
<didrocks> thanks!
<dholbach> .rtupdate is a bad hack really :)
<didrocks> enjoy is not the correct them :p
<didrocks> well, /opt is as well
<didrocks> so 1-1 :)
<dholbach> haha
<dholbach> lp:~ubuntu-app-review-contributors/ubuntu-app-reviews/webbar â got PPA info from myApps submission, downloaded last package, imported into branch and uploaded :-D
#ubuntu-arb 2012-07-06
<PaoloRotolo> Good morning
<PaoloRotolo> 7 submissions to the ARB in 7 hours :)
<dpm> good morning all
<PaoloRotolo> Good morning dpm
<dholbach> good morning
<PaoloRotolo> Ciao dholbach ;)
<PaoloRotolo> Good morning didrocks
<dholbach> ciao PaoloRotolo
<didrocks> hey PaoloRotolo, dholbach!
<dholbach> salut didrocks
<dpm> good morning PaoloRotolo, dholbach, didrocks
<dholbach> hola dpm
<dpm> hey!
<didrocks> hey dpm ;)
<PaoloRotolo> hi dpm :)
<dpm> didrocks, dholbach, quick question: mterry fixed https://bugs.launchpad.net/quickly/+bug/1018038 yesterday and uploaded it to precise-proposed, but it's pending approval. Do you know who the best person to talk to would be to get the upload into -proposed? I'd like to get it there as soon as possible, because more and more app devs are stumbling upon this now that they're starting sending submissions for the appshowdown
<didrocks> dpm: bdmurray
<dpm> thanks didrocks, do you know someone else who might be online right now?
<didrocks> dpm: any people on the ubuntu-sru team
<dpm> ok, cool, thanks
<dholbach> didrocks, jibel maybe?
<didrocks> dholbach: is he on the sru team?
<dholbach> I think so
<didrocks> I didn't know that, I didn't follow the latest move :)
<dpm> he does not seem to be: https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-sru/+members#active
<dpm> I've asked cjwatson and RAOF
<PaoloRotolo> dpm, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates#Publishing
<PaoloRotolo> There is a schedule
<dpm> PaoloRotolo, cool thanks, I did not know about that. slangasek is not online right now, but RAOF is helping out ou #ubuntu-devel
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, ok :)
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, sorry, wrong tab...
<dpm> dholbach, the fixed quickly package has now been uploaded to precise-proposed. I'm writing some instructions for app developers to use the -proposed package. Once they've enabled the -proposed repo and ran 'sudo apt-get update', what's the best way to upgrade only the Quickly package, just 'sudo apt-get install quickly'?
<dholbach> yep
<dpm> thanks!
<dholbach> dpm, don't forget the python-distutils-extra -proposed update!
<dpm> dholbach, I know, I just installed it :)
<dholbach> sweet
<didrocks> dpm: dholbach: apt-get install quickly isn't enough
<didrocks> in fact, you need apt-get install quickly-ubuntu-template
<didrocks> as the fix is there :)
<didrocks> and upgrading quickly doesn't force to upgrade quickly-ubuntu-template
<dpm> didrocks, ah, thanks for the heads up. So 'apt-get install quickly-ubuntu-template' should do then, without the need of 'apt-get install quickly'?
<didrocks> dpm: yeah, TBH confirmed, but that should be enough :)
<dpm> ok, cool, thanks
<dpm> didrocks, thanks, updated the instructions on http://askubuntu.com/questions/156339/launchpad-failed-to-build-after-quickly-submitubuntu/156362
<highvoltage> holy crap. that's a lot of submissions.
<dpm> :)
<PaoloRotolo> Hi all!
<PaoloRotolo> I'm reviewing "webbar"
<PaoloRotolo> hi dholbach :)
<dholbach> great
<dholbach> ciao PaoloRotolo :)
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, uhm,  Webbar is installed in usr/bin
<PaoloRotolo> not in /opt
<dholbach> maybe somebody can give you an example how to move stuff to /opt
<dholbach> I'm in a call right now
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, ok, I'll wait :P
<dholbach> or review something else in the meantime
<dholbach> or review functionality
<PaoloRotolo> dholbach, it crash too
<dholbach> then report the info back :)
<PaoloRotolo> ok, thanks :)
<PaoloRotolo> Here's the traceback:
<PaoloRotolo> http://paste.ubuntu.com/1078218/
<dholbach> ^ can somebody from the ARB add this please? (webbar)
<PaoloRotolo> Can somebody post this feedback here: https://myapps.developer.ubuntu.com/dev/apps/1057/  ?
<PaoloRotolo> http://paste.ubuntu.com/1078246/
<PaoloRotolo> thanks in advantage :)
<dholbach> the next arb-lint build will go to https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-app-review-contributors/+archive/ppa instead
<dholbach> which will be a much better place
<PaoloRotolo> toh... a .exe app :|  http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-app-review-contributors/ubuntu-app-reviews/guidecpubuntu/files
<PaoloRotolo> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-app-review-contributors/ubuntu-app-reviews/pivot/files
#ubuntu-arb 2012-07-07
<PaoloRotolo> Good morning
<stgraber> win 38
<stgraber> oops :)
<highvoltage> stgraber: you're up early :)
<stgraber> highvoltage: I wouldn't really consider 11am as early but yeah, a bit earlier than usual on a Saturday ;)
#ubuntu-arb 2012-07-08
<PaoloRotolo> Hi all!
