#ubuntu-testing 2008-08-05
<ara> morning!
<ara> cr3: ping :-)
<cr3> ara: pong
<ara> cr3: hello, how was the trip back to montreal?
<cr3> ara: painful, I tried to get standby tickets on a couple occasions to make the trip quicker but that didn't work. so, the trip took like 11 hours
<ara> cr3: ouch!
<ara> cr3: about the hwtest+ldtp integration, have you had the chance to have a look?
<cr3> ara: brb
<cr3> ara: sorry about that, I don't recall where we were last with ldtp-hwtest
<ara> cr3: we have now the packages, therefore you can know were the files are going to be
<ara> cr3: and you have also my previous email
<ara> cr3: where I explained you how it went
<cr3> ara: right, thanks for the update :)
<cr3> ara: I will work on the integration this afternoon, my time, so expect an email in your inbox by tomorrow morning (your time)
<ara> cr3: thanks1
<cr3> ara: now that we have the package, we can implement dependencies and rely on specific paths
<cr3> ara: welcome1 ;)
<ara> cr3: :D
#ubuntu-testing 2008-08-06
<parallax> Anyone having an odd red and white screen during the boot up process?
<Cusoon959> What's the new Ubuntu release called? (next one, not Hardy...)
<persia> Intrepid Ibex
<Cusoon959> Thanks persia :)
<davmor2> Morning Everyone
<ara> morning davmor2
<davmor2> ara: don't try using yesterday's iso for tests they will all fail :(
<ara> davmor2: thanks for the advice. bad bad news :(
<davmor2> alternative has missing kernel modules and live has broken x that may or may not have something to do with the missing kernel modules
<persia> No, it was outdated hal.
<persia> (or at least it was for me, who upgraded a system to intrepid yesterday)
<davmor2> persia: I can only tell you the warning message I received for the alternative cd that said there are missing kernel modules......
<persia> davmor2: Right.  There was that.  I think the non-working X was about hal, but it could also have been a side effect of kernel modules.
<davmor2> :)
<davmor2> I think that the error message for kernel bugs best sums up yesterdays iso.....  Ooooopps
<davmor2> apachelogger: Morning dude :)
<apachelogger> morning
 * apachelogger needs to get coffee
<davmor2> ara: don't use today's alternatives either :)
<ara> davmor2: :)
<cr3> schwuk: welcome back! dude, I'd like to bounce a problem with you. got a minute?
<cr3> ara: I started the hwtest-ldtp integration yesterday and I ran into a problem: there needs to be a way to run some tests as root and some not as root
<cr3> ara: unless you might've found a way to run the desktop tests as root
<ara> cr3: why is necessary to run the test as root?
<cr3> ara: some tests require access to devices, such as /dev/sda, and some tests require information which is only available to root such as provided by lshw
<cr3> hm, I just noticed that lshw describes by machine as a "Computer" when run as non-root and "Laptop" when run as root.
<ara> cr3: yes, for hw that's true, but for desktop testing?
<cr3> ara: well, I'm hoping that the whole suite could be run at once
<ara> cr3: well, the problem is that we try to mimic as much as possible the end user behaviour
<cr3> ara: for example, I would like desktop tests to be their own suite which people could choose to run in the same way they might choose to run wireless testing
<ara> cr3: yes, i understand, but  I think that we could maybe split between end-user suites & root suites
<ara> cr3: update manager tests, in example, we could test the gksu dialog
<ara> cr3: just an example
<ara> cr3: but we have to try as much as possible to avoid relying on root privileges when running desktop tests
<heno> IMO hwtest should always run as the user and use policy kit to elevate access only for select commands to gather hw info
<cr3> heno: my concern is that it then becomes necessary for each test to potentially define whether they should run as root or not
<cr3> heno: (sorry for the lag, I was on the phone with schwuk discussing the next great features in the website)
<cr3> heno: however, I don't think that's an unreasonable requirement, so I'll start playing with the idea of using the policy kit. in principle, I agree that it would be the right thing to do
<heno> QA meeting about to start in #ubuntu-meeting
#ubuntu-testing 2008-08-07
<ara> cr3, morning :-)
<cr3> ara: hi there
<ara> cr3: we didn't finish yesterday's discussion about the root/non-root issue with hwtest + ldtp
<cr3> ara: it seems that hwtest should be running as non-root and using (gk)sudo to bump privileges on a per test basis
<cr3> ara: that should enable your desktop tests to run out of the box
<ara> cr3: that's ok for me (for ldtp tests). i.e. for update-manager tests I use gksu to install things
<cr3> ara: that should work as well
<cr3> ara: leveraging the usability of gksu, the user should only be prompted the first time such privileges are required
<ara> cr3: yes
<cr3> ara: one problem that I've yet to solve is when this is required for automated tests. maybe I can do a first pass, check if any automated tests might need it, then prompt before starting to run the automated tests
<ara> cr3: that might work, yes
<cr3> ara: but, if an automated test takes more than 5 minutes which is the default delay for gksu I think, then the usability starts sucking bad :(
<ara> cr3: can you give me upload permissions to lp:ubuntu-desktop-testing/packaging?
<ara> cr3: I will need to merge changes from time to time
<cr3> ara: I changed the owner to hardware-testing, to which I have made you a member. so, you should now have commit privileges
<ara> ta!
<ara> cr3: in case that you want to document the ldtp+hwtest progress: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Testing/Automation/LDTP/IntegrationHwtest
<ara> cr3: i know you love it... :-P
<cr3> wikis are my friend, I keep trying to convince myself
<stgraber> hey there
<cr3> stgraber: salut quebec!
<cr3> schwuk: how insane do you think it would be to map all hal subsystem namespaces to individual tables: http://people.freedesktop.org/~dkukawka/hal-spec-git/hal-spec.html#properties-subsystem
<persia> cr3: That can't be part of standard normalisation procedures.  Are you sure you'll be able to find everything later?
<cr3> persia: "find everything"? what do you mean?
<persia> cr3: When later collecting the data, if everything gets put in different subsystem tables, I'd suspect you'd find issues with the less common devices.
<persia> Then again, for optimisation purposes, depending on your client code, it may be the most efficient means to write the data, which is probably your performance bottleneck (rather than read)
<cr3> persia: each device has "info" properties, so they will all at least appear in that table
<persia> cr3: Hmm.  I suppose.
<cr3> persia: additional information might be stored in other tables which can be searched if there is specific interest for it
<persia> Ah, that works for the odd device situations.
<cr3> persia: exactly, like pci and usb will most certainly be of specific interest so that specific interest will be searched as well
<schwuk> cr3: in principal, I like the idea. It would be easy to implement in code (polymorphism FTW!), but I'm not seeing how it would be implemented in SQL, other than each row having bunch of 'possible' FK columns, which would be populated for the appropriate device type.
<cr3> so: 1. we avoid a generic properties table of arbitrary key/value pairs; 2. we don't loose any information by using subsystem specific tables.
 * schwuk needs to look into polymorphism in Storm
<persia> cr3: Do note that there are physical devices that connect to *both* pci and usb :)
<cr3> schwuk: I think I have that problem solved, you'll be given some device object which magically has the appropriate properties available based on the subsystem
<persia> (actually, I've only see this for dual-slot front-loading CardBus-compliant PCMCIA ports for workstations, but there might be others)
<cr3> persia: this is going to be fun!
<soren> persia: Yes, they're called usb host adapters..
<persia> soren: Do those expose HAL events in both subsystems?
<cr3> soren: hey dude! you never received my letter, did you?
<soren> cr3: I didn't :(
<schwuk> cr3: I don't believe in magic.
<cr3> soren: the dogs must've smelled the house specicial chicken on the letter :(
<soren> persia: I imagine so.
<cr3> schwuk: how do you think plugins work in hwtest? :)
<schwuk> cr3: heh
<soren> cr3: Yeah. I was really looking forward to dissecting it and try to reproduce it.
 * davmor2 produces a bunch of flowers from thin air ta ra
<persia> Ah, indeed, as usb_device contains the information on the root hubs.
<schwuk> cr3: So the act of retrieving a device from the database will automagically retrieve the various properties from the relevant namespace?
 * schwuk believes in automagic
<davmor2> schwuk: do you not see the flowers I thought that was pretty impressive magic ;)
<schwuk> cr3: I can see that working. Not as elegant as Storm supporting multiple tables for an object, but it would work. It's just a bit more code.
<schwuk> davmor2: not as impressive as the Joker's disappearing pencil trick :)
<davmor2> I've not seen dark knight maybe I should :)
<schwuk> davmor2: It's a must see, but only for the Joker. The rest is so-so.
<davmor2> :)
<davmor2> so was the first one :)
<cr3> schwuk: right
<schwuk> Talking of magic the Pixar short before Wall-e is brilliant.
<davmor2> Jack Nicholson made it :)
<schwuk> cr3: And the same approach for creating objects works. We just have to make sure Device.type is a valid value before proceeding.
<schwuk> or rather Device.subsystem
<cr3> schwuk: exactly, so the concern is no longer the usability of the interface but the maintainability of so many tables
<schwuk> cr3: But that means we're not letting our RDBMS manage our relations anymore. That is A Bad Thing(TM).
<cr3> schwuk: this is what all the tables are looking like so far, and I'm not nearly done with functional properties which I'm still debating whether we should use 'em: http://people.ubuntu.com/~cr3/device.txt
<cr3> schwuk: the device.subsystem is only used in the application layer to determine the class to instantiate, the relation between subsystem information is still stored relationally in the database
<schwuk> cr3: Not that I can see in the file you shared. There's nothing linking e.g. pci with info.
<cr3> schwuk: right, I need to find a name for "id" because that name is already used by hal
<schwuk> but how will the "id" differentiate between, say, pci and usb devices?
<cr3> at this point, I'm simply mapping stuff from the 0.5.12 specification to straight sql. I first want to assess how insane the database will look
<cr3> schwuk: by using the info.subsystem?
<cr3> crap, perhaps I should have a foreign key for each possible subsystem... I need a smoke
<schwuk> cr3: That's what I was getting at earlier.
<cr3> schwuk: yeah, I was thinking the other way around: the subsystem would have a key to the info table. doesn't work though
<schwuk> info.subsystem will be string (pci, usb etc.) - it won't relate to a specific row in the relevant subsystem table.
<schwuk> cr3: want me to ring while you have a smoke?
<cr3> schwuk: well, I was thinking that the subsystem table would have the id of the info table, so it could relate to that. this could actually work if I set the info_id in each subsystem table to be unique!
<cr3> schwuk: capital idea! give me a minute
<schwuk> but can you express that as a relation in SQL?
<steve555> Hi everyone
#ubuntu-testing 2008-08-08
<yoanis> hi there
<yoanis> i just read about SRU
<yoanis> and i want to help
<persia> yoanis: if you happen to read the logs, we'd love to have your help, but might be slow responding at this time of day
<ara> morning :-)
<ApOgEE-> .google define:wtf
<ApOgEE-> !google define:wtf
<ubot5> ApOgEE-: Error: I am only a bot, please don't think I'm intelligent :)
<persia> Also, it's not ideal in this environment to use that abbreviation, and if you want to play with the bot, a /query might be the best place.
<jpds>  /whois ubot5 - reveals all.
<ApOgEE-> :D
<jpds> persia: You have to admit, he has a sytlish hostname... :/
<persia> jpds: For some value of "stylish".
<ara> hello, one quick question, does anyone remember the command to get the candidate version of a package for all ubuntu versions???
<ara> (also asking at ubuntu-motu)
<persia> One place is usually sufficient, although it also depends on where people's eyes are :)
<persia> (which may affect latency by a few minutes)
<heno> davmor2: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Testing/DailySmoke suggests alternates are working again, is that right?
<davmor2> yes
<davmor2> brb
<heno> cool, thanks
<davmor2> heno: yes the alternatives started working again with 20080806.1 I think but I didn't find out till yesterday
<heno> davmor2: ok great, thanks
<davmor2> They all still have issues like usplash is temperamental and ndiswrapper doesn't work and other minor quirks but they install at least :)
<davmor2> oh and mostly they are oversized which I believe slangasek is on
<slangasek> they're mostly not oversized anymore... :)
<davmor2> as I said I believed you were on it :)
<cgregan> heno: ping
<heno> hi cgregan
<cgregan> heno: hello....I got an email from Intel about Launchpad
<cgregan> heno: Can you see all of a bugs history from the web interface?
<heno> cgregan: no, there are parts missing
<cgregan> heno: Is there a script?
<heno> that's a top wishlist item for the next updates of LP
<heno> bdmurray may be able to extract what they need from the mailing lists
<cgregan> heno: ok...thanks
<heno> cgregan: are these public bugs?
<cgregan> heno: they are public
<heno> if so it should be on the mailings lists
<heno> and so that should mostly work
<bdmurray> cgregan: I should be able to help
<cgregan> ï»¿bdmurray: Thanks! Let me get a list of bugs
<persia> cgregan: https://bugs.launchpad.net/malone/+bugs?field.searchtext=Activity+log has a good list of the outstanding issues with activity, if you want to track them.
<bdmurray> cgregan: what types of information are you looking for?
<cgregan> ï»¿bdmurray: Seeing the status changes and notes over time for a single bug #.
<bdmurray> that should all be in the activity log then
<cgregan> ï»¿bdmurray: Excellent
<cgregan> ï»¿bdmurray: I have sent email to my Intel contact to get some numbers.
<bdmurray> cgregan: cool, let me know if you need any assistance
#ubuntu-testing 2008-08-09
<vadi2> I'm having issues with rsync, it's not working: http://pastebin.com/m4bc773d4
<vadi2> actually, even the direct link gives a 404.
<persia> vadi2: Try looking for a newer image: the dailies get deleted after a couple days.
<vadi2> But this is what the website is giving me.
<persia> Which website?
<vadi2> http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/
<persia> Ah.  Well, that's out of date.  If you want to test Alpha 3, http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/releases/intrepid/alpha-3/ is where the images live.
<vadi2> Thanks
#ubuntu-testing 2008-08-10
<Danny> hi
<Danny> Hi I would just like to know if the latest Ubuntu linux distribution will work on my TOSHIBA laptop......
<persia> And sticking about is more likely to get an answer.
#ubuntu-testing 2009-08-03
<ara> eeejay, hey! are you around? are you travelling?
#ubuntu-testing 2009-08-04
<davmor3> hello davmor2
<davmor2> hello davmor3
<Socah> Hello. Anyone got problems with network-manager after today's update of amd64 ubuntu?
<davmor2> Socah: I can say that it is playing up on unr
<davmor2> Socah: bug 408862
<ubot4> Launchpad bug 408862 in apparmor "dhcp and networking failure in karmic (dup-of: 408773)" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/408862
<ubot4> Launchpad bug 408773 in apparmor "apparmor capabilities not working properly" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/408773
<Socah> davmor2, thank you very much
#ubuntu-testing 2009-08-05
<Form0> Hello
<davmor2> Form0: hello
<Form0> hi hi
<Form0> Been wanting to participate with ubuntu for some time and finally got some free time and figured I'll start with testing
<Form0> Now just need to get started somehow :P
<davmor2> Form0: grab the latest daily image install onto hardware or vm and test the apps.  When you find bugs file them (using ubuntu-bug appname) and once you find out there is a fix try it.  Sign up to the tracker at http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/ this will then be used just before releases in order to keep track of what iso's have been tested, does that help?
<Form0> sure thing
<Form0> But I suppose I'll have to download new image every day I wanna do something?
<Form0> Or can I just update?
<virtuald> if you install you can just update
<virtuald> or if you already have ubuntu installed you can update through update-manager
<Form0> Well, I'm running alpha3 now I believe
<virtuald> ok
<davmor2> Form0: go into synaptic and install the ubuntu-qa-tools package this includes an app called dl-ubuntu-test-iso so if you only want to test ubuntu you can use the following command dl-ubuntu-test-iso --only ubuntu
<Form0> aha, lets see
<davmor2> this will download all the ubuntu iso's in 64bit and 32bit
<Form0> I'm actually running kubuntu atm, does that have separate channel?
<davmor2> Form0: no just specify --only kubuntu
<Form0> ok
<davmor2> Form0: if you don't add a --only command you get most of the iso's available
<davmor2> Form0: also it uses rsync so it will only download the differences between the daily iso's
<Form0> good, I was wondering how bandwidth heavy this is :)
<davmor2> Form0: first run is second is light
<virtuald> grub2 can boot iso files so no need to burn it
<Form0> handy!
<davmor2> because the first run needs to download entire iso's it's quite heavy, however once you have them it only downloads the daily diffs then
<Form0> so, is there a bug database of somekind?
<virtuald> yes, https://bugs.launchpad.net and booting isos in grub2 is described here http://mgerards.net/blog/?p=16
<Form0> thanks a bunch
<virtuald> i've never done it, looks like you have to find out the name of the kernel and initramfs image, mount -o loop kubuntu-something.iso /mnt and then look for vmlinuz and initrd in /mnt and /mnt/boot
<Form0> yup, looks like have to experiment some
<davmor2> Form0: fyi vm is the easiest way to test :)
<Form0> hehe, ok of course
<Form0> Omg, there's so many ISOs
<davmor2> Form0: that's why I said if you only want to test kubuntu ues the --only kubuntu command :)
<Form0> Good thing I don't have limit on data transfers
#ubuntu-testing 2009-08-06
<ara_> eeejay, happy ATK hacking :-) https://bugs.launchpad.net/notify-osd/+bug/409810
<ubot4> Launchpad bug 409810 in notify-osd "ATK Text interface for notify-osd is not working" [High,Confirmed]
<eeejay> thanks ara_ ;)
<ara> eeejay, heh
<ara> hey, even
<ara> eeejay, any idea why? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/notify-osd/+bug/409798
<ubot4> Launchpad bug 409798 in notify-osd "Notify-OSD does not appear in the list of accessible applications when the session starts" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<eeejay> ara, maybe because notify-osd is starting before the at-spi registry?
<ara> eeejay, where would you check that?
<eeejay> ara, look at both proccesses with a ps, what has a higher PID?
<ara> eeejay, I have to reboot, then, because I already killed notify-osd
<ara> :)
<ara> brb
<ara> eeejay, no :(, the pid of notify-osd is higher
<ara> ara@sushirider:~$ ps -A | grep at-spi
<ara>  4028 ?        00:00:04 at-spi-registry
<ara> ara@sushirider:~$ ps -A | grep notify-osd
<ara>  4046 ?        00:00:00 notify-osd
<eeejay> ara, dang
<eeejay> and it doesn't show?
<ara> eeejay, no, it does not
<eeejay> ara: don't have time now, but maybe it doesn't have the right env variables or something
<eeejay> ara: or perhaps..
<eeejay> ara: ps ax | grep dbus-daemon
<ara> eeejay, what should I be looking?
<eeejay> ara: nvermind, brain fart
<ara> eeejay, hehehehe
<ara> eeejay, ok, don't worry
<eeejay> ara: there used to be a bug that the session dbus daemon didn't have accessibility enabled
<Socah> Hello. I have fallowing problem: rhythmbox is changing system volume. I wanted to report a bug, but found that there is already same reported, and signed as fixed. Any tips what to do?
#ubuntu-testing 2009-08-07
<Socah> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/rhythmbox/+bug/392671
<ubot4> Launchpad bug 392671 in rhythmbox "volume control in program affects main " [Low,Fix released]
<virtuald> it's a feature :(
<Socah> feature? lol
<virtuald> seems like it's fixed upstream so fix should be in karmic soon
<Socah> ok, thank you for information
<Socah> I'm pretty new in this whole bug-reporting-things
<virtuald> me too but i think i'm getting the hang of it (if that's the expression)
<Socah> Hello. Is there any reason that after removing pulseaudio and reloading alsa GNOME can't detect any audio device, but mocp (music on console player) is playing well?
<Socah> Or should I report it as bug
<Socah> Hello. Is there any way to control sound level without pulseaudio via gnome? gnome-volume-control and applets are not visible (they try to connect to sound server, but can't?). The only way that I can control sound atm is alsamixer
<shrift> I just installed a fresh kubuntu karmic daily.... Anything I can help test?
#ubuntu-testing 2009-08-09
<laeeqashahid> hello all
<laeeqashahid> i m new to ubuntu
<laeeqashahid> installed a couple of days b4
<laeeqashahid> on my hp mini net book
<laeeqashahid> 9.04 remix version for net books
<laeeqashahid> im facing some issues..
<laeeqashahid> can any one help me resolve thhese issues
<Socah> ALSA lib ../../../src/pcm/pcm_dmix.c:1008:(snd_pcm_dmix_open) unable to open slave
<Socah> Could somebody give me a hint? this happens when trying to play flash movie
<Socah> no sound, and this is log from terminal
#ubuntu-testing 2010-08-09
<ara> good morning all
<KE1HA> Hi Ara, I finally got Maverick working again. I had to use the ALT install distro, but have started testing again.
<ara> KE1HA, great!
<ara> KE1HA, have you signed up for the new desktop testing team? http://ubuntutesting.wordpress.com/2010/08/06/desktop-testing-team/
<KE1HA> Im not sure, let me have a look.
<KE1HA> Nope, not on that one, will have a quick read.
<KE1HA> Im on there now Ara :-) gona read a bit more.
<ara> KE1HA, nice :)
<KE1HA> I'm already on the ISO testing Team, but this looks a bit diffrent, just checkign out the Wiki now.
<KE1HA> Oh I se, this is for Desktop version only, but uses the QA tracker, ok, got it.
<KE1HA> Ara, these are for Milestone only releases, and it's not tied to ISO testing on the QA tracker yes ?
<ara> KE1HA, exactly, this is not tied to ISO testing. Once the milestone has been released, it is time to test the desktop
<KE1HA> Ok, got it, APPS testing per Milestone Release. We need allot of folks to test Network, especially WLAN, as there is a stupid number of bugs / issues with WLAN at the momentl.
<KE1HA> You need a Member Icon fer Launchpad :-)
<KE1HA> Ara, this is all good stuff, really like the QA Tracker for APPS and ISO's.
<ara> KE1HA, great :)
<KE1HA> Ara, if you still here, whe / is find issues with the APP's testing docs, would you prefer we submit bug reports, or e-mail you directly with the problems identified? Also, same for problems with the APPS themself, I'd assume you want bugs for the APPS yes?
<KE1HA> .. When / If ...we find ..
<ara> KE1HA, if you find issues with the testing docs, just edit the wiki and fix it yourself
<ara> I am subscribed to all changes, so I will be reviewing them
<ara> if you find issues with the apps, yes, file a bug
<KE1HA> Ara, ok thanks. Found one already in Empathy :-) TTUL
<ara> KE1HA :)
<KE1HA> Ara, one last question and I'll quit bugging you (  no pun intended :-)  )  What Tags should we use for the bugs reports during this type of testing?
<ara> mmm, we haven't decided yet, maybe desktop-testing
<ara> Â¿
<ara> if that's fine for you, could you send an email to the desktop testing mailing list announcing it?
<KE1HA> Sure, no problem, So you want me to send the bug and send it to the new mailing list ? Now see I just had to ask another question ;-)
<ara> KE1HA, not exactly, the new bug put it in the tracker, and then send to the mailing list that we are going to use desktop-testing as tag
<KE1HA> If we put the bug only in the tracker, we wont get a bug number will we ?  I sent the e-mail to the Mailing List, ooops, it put my real name in there, guess thats ok fer now. But in the tracker, we're supposed to put the Bug number, that's only from Launchpad right?
<ara> KE1HA, in the testcase that failed, mark it as failed and put the bug number that you filed in Launchpad
<KE1HA> Oh, Ok, that's what I've been doing for ISO-Testing as well. TNX, have a good day.
<ara> jibel, good morning!
<jibel> Hi ara, good morning
<davmor2> morning all
<davmor2> hey fader_ cr3
<ara> happy birthday davmor2!
<davmor2> ara thanks hello too
<davmor2> fader_: speak to me
<Moustafa> Happy birthday davmor2 !
<fader_> davmor2: Sprinting, sorry dude
<fader_> Happy birthday though :)
<davmor2> Moustafa: Hey dude thanks
<Moustafa> fader_ !  cr3!  fromage!
<davmor2> fader_: forgiven,  I thought the sprint was next week ;)
<elopio> hello there
<elopio> my thunderbird is crashing but I don't know how to debug it.
<elopio> "thunderbird" is not a binary, so gdb doesn't start it
<elopio> and if I use /usr/lib/thunderbird-3.0.6/thunderbird-bin, when gdb starts it can't find libmozjs.so
<elopio> is there any guide?
<elopio> um, I guess this should go to #ubuntu-bugs. sorry :)
<notlistening> Hi anyone else havng X problems after the latest round of updates?
<fader_> notlistening: You'd probably be better off asking in #ubuntu (or #ubuntu+1 if you're running the development version)
<fader_> notlistening: This channel is for coordinating testing and test development, and most people aren't listening in here right now
<notlistening> oh sorry
<fader_> notlistening: No need to apologize :)  Just letting you know why you might not get a response here ;)
<notlistening> thanks fader ;)
<fader_> notlistening: No problem... good luck!
<notlistening> thanks
#ubuntu-testing 2010-08-10
<ara> good morning all!
<KE1HA> GM Ara. Question for you :-) Do you plan to have the testing we do on ISO's and Desktop Apps add to out Launchpad Karma Scores ?
<ara> KE1HA, morning
<ara> KE1HA, this is something we definitely want to do, but, for the moment, as the ISO tracker is not connected to LP, it is not straight forward to implement
<KE1HA> Ara, understand, it just takes allot of time and some us us ( me especially :-) ) need all the Karma help we can get. Anyway, have a good day.
<ara> KE1HA, but, if you apply for membership, this effort will be taken into account, of course
<KE1HA> Ara, membership to what ?
<ara> KE1HA, Ubuntu Membership
<KE1HA> Ara, ok, but I think thats a ways off yet fer me, as I'm just getting started in all the UB project stuff. Although it would be most welcome.
<alourie> hello
<ara> hey alourie
<alourie> hi ara
<alourie> ara: actually, I was looking for you
<ara> alourie, tell me
<alourie> ara: is it ok to issue bugs on tracker usability? Or, rather wishes, "bugs" are subjective
<ara> alourie, on the tracker itself?
<alourie> ara: yes, I mean to open bug on ubuntu-qa-website product in launchpad
<ara> alourie, yes, it is OK, fee free
<ara> and feel free to submit patches :-)
<ara> patches welcome
<alourie> great :-)
<alourie> thanks
<alourie> I'll do it while on lunch
<davmor2> hello testers
<ara> davmor2, morning
#ubuntu-testing 2010-08-11
<cmeiklejohn> hey there.
<cmeiklejohn> Has anyone been playing around with unity on maverick?
<cmeiklejohn> I was just testing it out on my Eee and it's extremely slow -- just wondering if that warrants a bug or not and if anyone else has seen this?
<ara> morning all!
<alourie> morning ara
<ara> morning alourie
<alourie> ara: I have question
<alourie> when you create a new test in tracker, how do you provide it with wiki link to the test description?
<ara> alourie, you have to be administrator to add new testcases
<alourie> ara: yes, I understant, but I mean, you do it manually?
<ara> alourie, yes, through an admin view of the site
<alourie> aha.
<alourie> ok
<alourie> ara: I've submitted the "usability" bug. As the issue is subjective, what would be the best way to find the solution?
<alourie> bug #616195
<ubot4> Launchpad bug 616195 in ubuntu-qa-website "Redundant instruction links to test description (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/616195
<ara> alourie, I think that the solution you propose is good enough
<ara> alourie, I'll try to have it fix it for Beta testing
<ara> alourie, thanks for your report!
<alourie> cool
<KE1HA> GM all, back to testing today, and playing Elmer Fudd --> I'm Hunting Bugs :-)
<ara> KE1HA, morning :)
<KE1HA> Hi Ara .. Hey saw your video on screencasts .. very nice. what app do you use to make those ?
<davmor2> morning all
<KE1HA> GM
<KE1HA> Ara, I found the how to, having a read of it now.
<ara> KE1HA, which how to?
<davmor2> KE1HA: What screencast more to the point :)
<KE1HA> davmor2, http://screencasts.ubuntu.com/node
<KE1HA> davmor2, Ara's screencast is the second one down I think.
<KE1HA> ara, the how-to make screencasts. I found it though.
<ara> mvo, hello
<mvo> hey ara
<ara> mvo, I am getting an error upgrading a 386 installation
<ara> maybe you can help.. 0:-)
<mvo> what is the error?
<mvo> ara: and what distro?
<ara> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/476371
<mvo> I mean, what release
<ara> mvo, Ubuntu
<mvo> heh :)
<ara> Maverick
<mvo> I figured that ;)
<ara> mvo, it could have been any of the derivatives, i.e. ;-)
<mvo> ara: true :) that bug is known I think, I will talk to seb128 to be sure
<jibel> ara, I got the same this morning but we don't receive reports in launchpad because it breaks apport I think.
<ara> jibel, dpkg --force-overwrite -i /var/cache/apt/archives/libgirepository1.0-1_0.9.3-0ubuntu2_i386.deb
<jibel> ara, I downgraded to libgirepository1.0-0 then you can upgrade cleanly to 1.0-1
<davmor2> morning fader_ cr3
<cr3> davmor2: hey dude
<fader_> davmor2: Hey dude... I'm at linuxcon today so not very accessible :)
<cameo> ceva in limba romana
<ara> hey, QA IRC meeting now at #ubuntu-quality
<ikt> ok
<ikt> heya ara, are mago test scripts usable to complete desktop testing requirements?
<KE1HA> she's in the ubuntu-quality channel meeting.
<ikt> all good
#ubuntu-testing 2010-08-12
<ara> good morning all!
<alourie> good morning ara
<ara> morning alourie
<alourie> ara: regarding that bug I opened yesterday
<alourie> I even thought to create another solution
<alourie> instead of suggesting to click a link to instructions, just fetch them from wiki and show :-)
<alourie> but that is more complicated
<ara> alourie, indeed it is more complicated, it will require more code changes, and it is not in the roadmap for this cycle, sorry
<alourie> yea, I know
<ara> alourie, but, if you want to implement it, feel free ;-)
<alourie> ara: sure, I might
<alourie> ara: wasn't there a thought to move to something django-based anyway?
<ara> alourie, yes, but not for the moment. It is just a thought. If things go as expected, we might change it next year
<alourie> ara: that would be a load of a rewrite :-)
 * ara -> lunch
#ubuntu-testing 2010-08-13
<ara> good morning!
<KE1HA> GM ara .. hope all is well on ur side of the big pond :-)
<ara> hey KE1HA, norning
<ara> morning, even
<KE1HA> ara, I think I've ran out of ISO's to test. Are we going to ISO test the release on the 17th I think it is?
<ara> KE1HA, indeed, once they are ready to test they will appear in the tracker as usua
<ara> l
<ara> I will ask at #ubuntu-release how's that going
<KE1HA> Ok. And the other thing, I sent an e-mail to the fealla asking about Server Apt testing. Is there a way to get that on a Tracker as well ?
<KE1HA> Server Apts meaning (admin - service apts) not Ubuntu-Server applications.
<ara> KE1HA, yes, I saw the email
<ara> KE1HA, I don't think it fits under desktop.qa.ubuntu.com
<ara> KE1HA, and it hasn't been release to Ubuntu yet
<ara> Once it gets into Ubuntu and it is widely used, we can add it to the tracker
<ara> I'll reply to your email in the mailing list
<ara> mmm, his nick, now I remember that he's called Greg
<ara> I am looking for your email
<ara> but I don't seem to find it
<ara> hey! just found it
<ara> replying now
<KE1HA> ara, sri was in the ubuntu channel .. I think that tracker system is awsome, and to keep things consistent and the flows straight, it makes allot of sense to ahve them all in one spot.
<ara> KE1HA, yes, but the application is not in Ubuntu yet, there are other applications that need more testing
<ara> I am replying to the email
<KE1HA> ?? I dont understand, what you mean its not in UB yet?
<KE1HA> you mean the packages themselves are not in UB yet?
<ara> yes
<ara> they are in a PPA
<KE1HA> Ahh, ok, so he was asking us to test things that are standard distro packages?
<KE1HA> oops are not standard
<ara> yes, but it is going to be standard
<KE1HA> Ok, Now Im with you, yes, I'd agree with that totally.
<ara> in fact, yesterday was Feature Freeze, so it might be now part of ubuntu
<KE1HA> Ok, uderstand.
<ara> yes, it is now in Ubuntu
<ara> but, still, first things first, someone has to write the testcases
<KE1HA> I thought they were normal apps that needed to be tested, allbeit, service apps.
<ara> and we have a lot of applications that need testcases first
<KE1HA> Is there a list of those ?
<KE1HA> second, I have a recommendation. There's lots and lots of folks working on lots and lots of things, but I've also see lots of folks workign on the same things and not know it.
<KE1HA> Opps it cut off my line.. sri,,,,
<KE1HA> Is there a way to Implement like a W3 system, who-what-when type thing so we dont duplicate efforts?.
<KE1HA> For instance, the test-case writing, could folks volenter to write x,y,z and have that posted somwhere, so people can see what's left to be worked on?
<ara> KE1HA, it is a wiki, so if someone is editing something, you would know
<ara> anyway, the best way is to send an email to the mailing list saying "I will work on ..."
<ara> so people know
<KE1HA> Ahh, ok, so use the Wiki and e-mail for notificaiton & tracking, ok, just wanted to understand how it is to be done.
#ubuntu-testing 2010-08-14
<njin> Hello , 20100813.3 is already in rebuild ?
<chocanto> hello :)
#ubuntu-testing 2010-08-15
<chrigu_86> Hi, i can't find the Image to test, "This build wasn't found on http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily-live/20100815/lucid-desktop-i386.iso (may no longer exists)" and the ISO is not marked as "rebuilding", but one person has tested it. Where can i find the ISO?
<KE1HA> chrigu_86, it looks like, for whatever reason the build was pulled off the server as only 08-11 and 08-12 are present.
<KE1HA> chrigu_86, also, it looks like ara is the one testing it, so she may have had them pull the ISO's due to a problem or something.
<chrigu_86> but "ara" has 3 times "Pass". With the last build (20100814.3) had the same Problem.
<KE1HA> chrigu_86, I dont know, maybe you could send her an e-mail. She did say laate last week that the 10.04.1 ISO's would be out soon, in time for us to test them before the 17th, maybe things have changed.
<njin> yofel: here too ?
<njin> hggdh: around?
<czajkowski> evening
<czajkowski> anyone around?
<czajkowski> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xorg-server/+bug/605041  wondering could someone have a look at this
<ubot4`> Launchpad bug 605041 in xorg-server (Ubuntu) "High usage of the cpu - up to 100% (affects: 1) (heat: 8)" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<czajkowski> guy on identi.ca has been mentioning it
#ubuntu-testing 2011-08-09
<roignac> guys, whats the current status of mago? Is it still being used to test oneiric?
<roignac> As I've seen reports for natty only
<jibel> mvo, good morning
<jibel> mvo, do you know what this means
<jibel> apt-get[27161] trap divide error ip:7f08b489c4ee sp:7fff284854e0 error:0 in libapt-pkg.so.4.11.0[7f08b482a000+114000]
<jibel> mvo, I get it with automated ISO testing today.
<mvo> jibel: what architecture?
<mvo> jibel: any more info? like do you have a log with the commands that ran when it happend?
<jibel> mvo, looks like a 64bit specific problem. If you have access to phad, syslog is there:
<jibel> http://localhost:8080/job/oneiric-server/ARCH=amd64,HOST=virtual-host,PRESEED=default/46/
<jibel> s/localhost/phad/ :)
<jibel> here: http://people.canonical.com/~j-lallement/d-i-syslog.log.gz
<jibel> I'll try to reproduce locally because there's not much in the logs.
<mvo> thanks jibel, I suspect I know what is going on, I look into this next
<jibel> mvo, ok thanks, I trying to get a more useful trace.
<jibel> mvo, it is reproducible in a 64bit VM. On i386 there is a dependency failure instead. I'll file a bug.
<mvo> jibel: how do you reproduce it? I have one fix that may help, but I'm interessted to see the additional details
<jibel> mvo, install oneiric-server-amd64.iso in a VM. The installer crashes when it installs the kernel.
<jibel> mvo, bug 823277
<ubot4> Launchpad bug 823277 in apt (Ubuntu Oneiric) (and 1 other project) "Ubuntu 64bit failed to install with d-i : apt-get[26978] trap divide error ip:7fc64730d4ee sp:7fffa066b2a0 error:0 in libapt-pkg.so.4.11.0[7fc64729b000+114000] (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Critical,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/823277
<jibel> it is independent of the VM it fails on kvm and vbox. I haven't tried on bare metal.
<mvo> jibel: is there a crash file that you could upload? getting a gdb backtrace of this would rock
<jibel> mvo, no crashfile and that's rather difficult to get a trace. When I install the kernel manually in the target environment it doesn't crash.
<jibel> hggdh, any idea how we could get a trace for bug 823277 ?
<ubot4> Launchpad bug 823277 in apt (Ubuntu Oneiric) (and 1 other project) "Ubuntu 64bit failed to install with d-i : apt-get[26978] trap divide error ip:7fc64730d4ee sp:7fffa066b2a0 error:0 in libapt-pkg.so.4.11.0[7fc64729b000+114000] (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Critical,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/823277
<mvo> jibel: if you run the same comamnd in the shell, does that crash too?
<jibel> mvo, nope
<hggdh> jibel: bad mojo :-(
<jibel> mvo, correction, yes it does, I was looking at the wrong place. Ok I think I can get a trace from here.
<jibel> good morning hggdh :)
<hggdh> jibel: good afternoon :-)
<hggdh> jibel: it only happens on alternate 64?
<jibel> hggdh, server too of course
<hggdh> of course... how could I expect different?
<jibel> i386 fails but for a missing dependency on kernel headers, this should autofix with next build.
<mvo> jibel: great, let me know once you have somethng that gives more info
<jibel> mvo, it seems to crash only when called from debconf-apt-progress . That makes my life a bit more complicated
<mvo> jibel: ha! I think I have it
<mvo> jibel: i.e. that was the missing clue, its still good to get the trace, but if its a lot of work, we can defer to after I uploaded a fix
<jibel> mvo, I feel the pain of debugging in the installer environment, indeed ;)
<hggdh> heh
<jibel> mvo, if there's a build that you think fix this, I can test it before it is uploaded, if it helps.
<mvo> jibel: thanks! I uploaded it already, its definitely a required fix, I'm just not sure if its sufficient (but it looks like it should)
<jibel> mvo, thanks, I'll keep you informed if it is not sufficient :)
<mvo> hehe :) ok
<jibel> mvo, 0.8.16~exp5ubuntu3 fixed the crash but now apt-get hangs when called from debconf-apt-progress.
<jibel> mvo, maybe I did something wrong and the testing environment is rather unstable.
<jibel> mvo, I'll let you know the results with next images tomorrow.
<jibel> mvo, thanks again for the fix
<mvo> jibel: great, thanks for verifying, I hope its really the environment, I don't see how the fix could cause it to hang now
<vadik> guys, whats the status for mago and tests?
<vadik> Is is still active , it worth contributing?
<vadik> as mailing list and testsuite branch seems to be inactive since april
#ubuntu-testing 2011-08-10
<PaoloRotolo> Hi all!
<jp_Hranice> Hallo. I'm from Czech Republic here. And I want introduce yourself.
<xdatap1> jp_Hranice, hello. Welcome on the channel :)
<jp_Hranice> I' 30 years old. And I use Ubuntu fro Hardy Heron.
<jp_Hranice> I'm not experienced for development but I sispect I can test ISO.
<jp_Hranice> sorry, suspest :-(
<xdatap1> jp_Hranice, cool. Take a read here for partecipate: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Testing
<jp_Hranice> suspect
<jp_Hranice> This is why I am here.
<xdatap1> jp_Hranice, welcome aboard then. Any question ask here :)
<jp_Hranice> I read it.
<jp_Hranice> I can styl read some to know how and come back with a question.
<xdatap1> jp_Hranice, my suggestion is to take a read also on how to report bugs and then try to perform an iso test. Next image will be available at the end of the month. (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/OneiricReleaseSchedule)
<jp_Hranice> How does work QA mailing list. It collaborate project like ISO Testing ?
<xdatap1> jp_Hranice, not only. Everything about Quality :)
<xdatap1> jp_Hranice, a great read here -> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs
<jp_Hranice> xdatap1:  I install oreinic yet.
<xdatap1> jp_Hranice, you can try live cd testcase as first test, it doesn't require an installation
<xdatap1> jp_Hranice, all test case are in the tracker: http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/
<xdatap1> jp_Hranice, here full infos about it: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Testing/ISO/Procedures
<xdatap1> jp_Hranice, have fun :)
<jp_Hranice> xdatap1: OK, thank you
<jp_Hranice> xdatap1:  one qestion - Can I test ISO from USB Disk ?
<xdatap1> jp_Hranice, yes of course. It's cheaper than burning a CD every test ;)
<jp_Hranice> I can not get ISO.
<jp_Hranice> Whot is wrong Ubuntu ISO testing tracker ? Some ISOs are not longer avaible.
<davmor2> jp_Hranice: it only lists the isos that are awaiting testing at key staging like alpha3 beta 1 etc once that has gone it isn't in use
<davmor2> Sometime I fell I've got to run away, I've got to get away.....
<davmor2> feel even
<jp_Hranice> I do not understand. Can I use ISO I download few days ago and continue testing ?
<davmor2> jp_Hranice: Yeap you can test what ever you want the tracker is only use for specific iso that will become the stage image
<jp_Hranice> so I can submit start of testing today with ISO i have ...
<jp_Hranice> davmor2: It's styl Alpha 3
<jibel> jp_Hranice, we are using the tracker to report results during milestone testing alpha1,2,3, Beta 1, 2, and so on.
<jibel> jp_Hranice, between milestone you can test daily builds
<jibel> jp_Hranice, there is chance that bugs reported during milestone testing are already fixed in the latest daily build
<jibel> jp_Hranice, you can report any bug found in a milestone candidate or a daily build to LP
<jp_Hranice> jibel:  This is it. dayli build is not today avaible.
<jibel> jp_Hranice, builds for today and yesterday failed and only powerpc is available.
<jp_Hranice> OK. I have to go away. Thank you for your answers. Bye.
<jibel> jp_Hranice, you'll need to check again later this week.
<jibel> jp_Hranice, thanks for helping
<charlie-tca> Ubuntu QA meeting in #ubuntu-meeting in 30 minutes. Agenda is at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/QATeam/Meetings
<charlie-tca> QA Meeting in #ubuntu-meeting now
<jp_Hranice> Hallo
<jp_Hranice> Ido no understand dls-003 at http://testcases.qa.ubuntu.com/Install/DesktopLiveSession
<jp_Hranice> Plese can any body help me ?
<charlie-tca> looking
<charlie-tca> What part is giving you problems?
<charlie-tca> That is a test using a USB pendrive/thumbdrive with a separate partition to store settings and user docs
<jp_Hranice> I do not understand whot is persistent sesion.
<charlie-tca> persistent session is a way to place the live image on the drive and store your settings for it, so when you use it, it is like using after installing
<jp_Hranice> I can configure live sesion to store some informations on difrent partition ?
<charlie-tca> You can configure the usb to do that, yes
<jp_Hranice> how
<charlie-tca> most live sessions, you lose everything when you restart
<jp_Hranice> yes
<charlie-tca> The persistent install means you keep what you changed in preferences
<jp_Hranice> I never do this.
<charlie-tca> That is what part 3 tells you. create two partitions on the usb stick
<jp_Hranice> I start ubuntu frum USB Stick
<charlie-tca> one is the normal live image, and the other one is called "casper-rw"
<jp_Hranice> I'm lookink for disk utilyty
<charlie-tca> Then when you do "try ubuntu", it is supposed to save any changes you make to preferences.
<charlie-tca> um, I don't know where it is now, in unity. It should be called gparted
<jp_Hranice> I have 1MB partition casper-rw
<vikingur> 'Disk Utility' is palimpsest
<jp_Hranice> it automaticaly save preferences on casper-rw ?
<jp_Hranice> ok. I did it by gparted.
<charlie-tca> I think so, I don't have usb boot ability
<jp_Hranice> I found something. Little text on botton of page.
<jp_Hranice> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/LiveCD/Persistence#Booting%20the%20Live%20CD%20in%20Persistent%20Mode
<jp_Hranice> ok. Thak you. I'm going to reboot.
#ubuntu-testing 2011-08-11
<joru> Hi
<joru> I'm just new to the qa-list and this channel. want to give something back to the community why i'm initially going to test some isos
<brendand> hi joru
<joru> hi brendand
<joru> so i'm visiting the testing iso procedure and the qa site atm
<joru> and reading up on them
<joru> i've got a few computers and some spare hardware
<joru> so if i understand correctly, something that has not been tested by anyone yet is for example listed in the "untested" section on the iso testing tracker?
<joru> e.g http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/build/all/untested
<joru> or is there a section which i can read on what to prioritise testing on?
<joru> well alot of my questions are answered as i read. i'll read up on some more. cheers.
<fader> joru: That's correct -- the 'untested' section is a good way of quickly finding things that need tested
<fader> joru: Though at the moment we are not testing any images :)
<fader> Alpha 3 was released last week
<fader> We'll be testing more at the end of the month, before the release of Beta 1 on 1 September, so we will *definitely* want help then :)
<joru> fader: ok good to know you are not testing anything
<joru> fader: is that dicided during the weekly irc sessions?
<fader> joru: It's discussed at the meetings as needed, but there is a schedule here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/OneiricReleaseSchedule
<fader> joru: You can generally assume that in the week leading up to a release there will be ISO testing going on
<fader> And this is the right channel to check in with questions or to see if testing has started
<joru> ah good schedule
<joru> didnt see it before
<joru> at least i now know i dont need to test in vain
<fader> :)
<fader> joru: There's also other testing always going on, not just ISO testing
<fader> If you're bored that is :)
<joru> well the knowledge acquired from reading and setup of my local environment is done
<joru> well i report a few bugs here and there when they happen
<joru> do some translations etc
<fader> Awesome!
<joru> but i would like to become more involved in the future
<joru> since i'm aming to take a different turn with my career
<fader> Fantastic... great to have you on board!
<joru> thanx
<fader> joru: Aiming to do more OSS work?
<fader> In your career I mean
<joru> buts most fantastic to have such a great pack of software at hand
<joru> fader: yes, more software development, and especially in the open community
<joru> amung other things
<fader> joru: Excellent!  More hackers are always needed!
<joru> though the learning curve seems a bit steep at times
<joru> but the challenge is part of the goal
<joru> brb
<joru> fader: well i've always liked programming, but didnt go for that as formal education
<fader> joru: Digging in and just trying it is a great way to learn.  And the Ubuntu community in particular is very friendly and helpful in my experience
<joru> yes i've got taht experience too
<fader> (Full disclosure is that I get paid to work on it, but I found that to be the case even before that was the case :) )
<fader> Er, wait, terrible sentence
<fader> Argh, hopefully you know what I meant
<joru> yea :)
<joru> well part of my plan is to be paid in one way or another to contribute to oss in the future
<joru> prob sometimes could be lack of formal cs education
<joru> but what counts in the long run is what you actually do
<fader> Eh, it doesn't seem to be a big problem if you can point to some things that you've done
<fader> Exactly!
<joru> thus i'm going to activate myself more
<joru> then things get sorted out
<joru> so do you have any suggeestions of where one could start?
<fader> Cool... glad to have you on board!
<joru> preparing packaging?
<joru> besides bug reporting that is
<joru> guess i'll ask that q in beginners-dev instead
<joru> not to flood this channel with nonsence =)
<joru> glad to be on board.
<fader> Yeah, that might be a better channel... I can't help much with that
<fader> But if you come back during ISO testing this channel will be more active :)
<davmor2> extremely active infact
<fader> Heh
<fader> davmor2: Only because everyone is hanging out and having a good time... there are never any bugs.  Ever.  ;)
<davmor2> fader: Never ever ever,  there might be the odd destruction of an iso maybe causing a respin from time to time but never any bugs :D
<fader> davmor2: Yeah, respins are for aesthetic reasons.  Yeah, that's the ticket.  To make their MD5sums look nicer.
<davmor2> fader: and when that nasty build system breaks it,   but that's only so you feel like you under pressure to hit the target right :)
<joru> fader: yes, i will monitor during ISO testing
<fader> joru: Great!  We'll look forward to having you around! :)
#ubuntu-testing 2011-08-12
<nabeel> hi
<nabeel> i m having trouble with sound...
<nabeel> any body here..?
<njin> Hello, there's someone experiencing a strong delay in dragging windows in oneiric after today's updates?
<njin> that seems to disappear when a nautilus or FF windows are maximized in background?
<njin> hello launching results2launchpad i've got Error: Failed network connection to service root, what i've to do ?
#ubuntu-testing 2012-08-06
<smartboyhw> Hi
<smartboyhw> phillw, you here?
<smartboyhw> Someone write testimoinials for me and +1s in the Ubuntu Forums membership part, I want to apply for Membership...http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=2038322
<balloons> phillw, ping
<smartboyhw> Yeah, balloons, you're here!
<smartboyhw> balloons: I'm working on a draft for UEFI, Want to see?
<balloons> smartboyhw, sure
<smartboyhw> Wait, putting it in Skydrive.
<smartboyhw> balloons: http://sdrv.ms/ROS6Cz
<smartboyhw> balloons: Got that?
<balloons> smartboyhw, yep
<balloons> did you go through this yourself?
<smartboyhw> No, I asked phillw to do so.
<phillw> hi smartboyhw balloons,
 * smartboyhw waves at phillw and balloons.
<phillw> balloons: I did email you - was awaiting you to come reply.
<balloons> phillw, hey
<balloons> yes.. I think I sent one back
<smartboyhw> Anyone read my e-mail to add two things to the agenda?
<phillw> okies. I'm just back from shopping :)
<balloons> I was pinging you on the dvd overwriting issue
<balloons> remember that bug from last week?
<smartboyhw> How's your vacation?
<balloons> with wubi?
<smartboyhw> Wubi?
<smartboyhw> WHich one?
<phillw> There has been some falling out with one of them. I await the dust to settle...
<balloons> phillw, ahh ok. Well I did confirm wubi cannot write to a cd or dvd
<phillw> we always fight like cat & dog, but this time it got a more serious :/
<balloons> it doesn't contain code to do so
<phillw> balloons: thanks, in that case I'm not sure what it happening - as Jason did replicate it.
<balloons> phillw, did he?
<balloons> smartboyhw, bug not reported
<phillw> yes, he did while you were in IRC with him.
<smartboyhw> I need to go. Bye!
<balloons> phillw, right right
<balloons> i can only assume user error
<balloons> the problem he is describing is impossible according to the dev
<balloons> which confirms my thoughts..
<phillw> hmm, well. When the dust settles (hopefully in next couple of days) I will bring the matter back up with him.
<phillw> balloons: okies, I'll go through that test case with Ho Wan.
<balloons> phillw, yes
<balloons> I continnue to be currious
<balloons> heh
<phillw> I don't have a copy of vista, so I cannot install it onto my other hard drive and try myself.
<balloons> phillw, yes if you wouldn't mind helping him that would be good.. something in the proper format could be usefull to add
<balloons> right, same
<phillw> TBH I'm very suprised at Derrick still running Vista! It is releases what ME was ... best quietly forgotten :P
<phillw> I spent months putting XP back on computers that came shipped with Vista ;)
<phillw> I couldn't on my own laptop as there were no XP drivers for it :( It is now my sister's laptop with lubuntu on it & flies like the devil!
<balloons> hehe
<balloons> yes, seems more people are hearing about lubuntu
<phillw> for any basic XP or Vista computer it is a good one to at least try. If they like their candy (and some do), then they can try one of the members of our family. Having a choice is brilliant :)
<phillw> balloons: as you get chance, can you onto an email your thoughts of iso's being archived as you mentioned. I estimate that at 6 milestones / flavour / arch it is actually not an inconsiderable amount of work!
<balloons> phillw, http://www.reddit.com/r/Ubuntu/comments/xp3q5/stepmothers_emachines_t3120_revived_with_lubuntu/
<balloons> phillw, well, do you archive the dailys or milestones right now for lubuntu images?
<balloons> do you have the alpha 1 from this cycle?
<balloons> from last cycle?
<phillw> when I was actively testing, I did keep them on my local machine. But it was only at the close of 12.04 did I switch over to the new server. The previous hosting company unilaterally deleted all my archives of lubuntu - I was not pleased, but there was little I could do, it was in the fine print somewhere.
<phillw> nice posting. I'm sure I saw something aboyt nVidia going to liase with lunix for drivers?
<phillw> I'm guestimating about 250 - 300 GB of disk space per cycle if I archive 6 milestones across each flavour / arch.
<phillw> maybe one of the admins from cd.image could tell me what is on each milestone as per the iso.tracker so I have a better idea?
<balloons> phillw, yes I'm guessing we could get the numbers
<phillw> balloons: I've just sent off a support ticket to find the cost of a 2TB usb drive to be added, as it is archiving and hopefully infrequently accessed a usbV2 drive should be fast enough for us.
<phillw> YAY!!! GB have just got another Gold medal in Equestrian event :D
<phillw> oops, sorry... I'm also wathich the Olympics :)
<phillw> 1st Gold in 60 years at show-jumping :)
<phillw> I can have 2 of them, to back up my exisiting 2TB internal drive. I don't think I need the 2nd one yet, I still have over 700 GB in the 'pool' that can be allocated as and where needed.
<balloons> phillw, :-)
<balloons> one more week to go
<phillw> ??
<balloons> phillw, the olympics
<balloons> i was sidebarring with you
<balloons> haha
<balloons> on the iso thing, yea, it would be potentially a lot of bandwidth
<balloons> for images, well, let's take a look
<balloons> if we wanted to store say every flavor image(s) for every milestone  for the entire development cycle?
<phillw> provided you suddenly did have 100 people grab the alpha 1 of kubuntu after the beta 1 of kubuntu, bandwidth is not a real issue, we have 10 Tb / month as an allowance. I've peaked at 1.5 Tb for the month after 12.04 Lubuntu was released. We're only a secondary server.
<phillw> *you did not suddenly have*
<balloons> ok, so something 8 Gig per milestone for ubuntu
<balloons> that was a really fast guess
<balloons> 50 G out to cover all the milestones then
<balloons> that simply for ubuntu of course.. Then you have the other flavors, none of which have that many images
<balloons> I think your 200 G estimate is about right
<phillw> balloons: my maths is not that bad - honest :P
<balloons> phillw, hah
<phillw> I did have a look at the releases & iso sizes before doing my guestimate :)
<balloons> I knew you had it figured out
<phillw> balloons: It is important, that is why I asked for a 2nd opinion. Having a decimal point in the wrong place would have been somewhat embarressing!
<balloons> ask nasa about that one
<phillw> or the French, when a +1 was a -1 and crashed an Arien Rocket :P
<phillw> but, on NASA, they got the rover safely down.... Fantastic news!
#ubuntu-testing 2012-08-07
<smartboyhw> Hi!
<smartboyhw> Hi!
<savio> any help
<smartboyhw> God, they aren't awake.
<savio> :D
<smartboyhw> Anyone here???!!?!?!?
<savio> me
<smartboyhw> Only you, savio, that's not good.
<SergioMeneses> smartboyhw, \o
<SergioMeneses> everybody is working, i guess
<smartboyhw> YEah!
<smartboyhw> Someone's here.
<SergioMeneses> smartboyhw, jeje
<smartboyhw> ...
<smartboyhw> I'm busy translating...
<balloons> lol, I believe the word is 'idle'
<smartboyhw> Hi, balloons!
<smartboyhw> I filled in the survey.
<smartboyhw> balloons: On AOB on tmr
<smartboyhw> let's talk about ISO testing cadences and the survey!@
<smartboyhw> What's the result?
<balloons> AOB?
<balloons> the survey lasts until this Friday
<balloons> so no results until then :-)
<smartboyhw> OK, then next Wednesday.
<smartboyhw> balloons: Hopefully more people will come to tmr's meeting.
<balloons> smartboyhw, yes, you'll have to wait a week
<balloons> but I'll share the results next monday
<smartboyhw> So on next Wed we can talk about how to improve the QA experience from the results of the survey!
<balloons> smartboyhw, yes indeed!
<smartboyhw> YEAH!
 * me4oslav wonders if cr3 is hanging around on IRC -_-
<smartboyhw> ?!!!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!!?!?!?
<cr3> me4oslav: yeah, just real busy :)
<me4oslav> cr3, ok, ping me when you're free :)
<smartboyhw> Bye, I need to go to sleep!
#ubuntu-testing 2012-08-08
<trijntje> Hi all, I do testing on a real system, not a virtual one. How should I submit a hardware profile?
<astraljava> trijntje: Here is a guide on Xubuntu, but it makes no difference what the flavor is, if any (meaning vanilla). https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu/Testing/HardwareProfile
<trijntje> astraljava: thanks! Is it possible to use that tool to just create a hardware profile,without running any of the tests?
<astraljava> trijntje: I believe so, I haven't used it myself, yet.
<trijntje> ah well, one way to find out ;)
<smartboyhw> HI!
<sagaci> ~4.5 til the meeting
<smartboyhw> Yep, I'll be there.
<smartboyhw> It's 1400 GMT.
<sagaci> sorry, 2.5 hours
<smartboyhw> sagaci: phillw will be chair, you know that?
<sagaci> yup
<sagaci> it's scheduled for midnight my time
<smartboyhw> Oh, that's bad.
<letozaf_> Hello my name is Carla I would like to know if it's possible to use testdrive to test quantal ISOs as I see only precise ones configured, I tried to add quantal's one in the "other" tab, but it just seem not work
<letozaf_> sorry got disconnect, now I'm back
<smartboyhw> Yes, letozaf_
<letozaf_> Hello my name is Carla I would like to know if it's possible to use testdrive to test Quantal ISOs as I see only Precise ones configured, I tried to add Quantal's one in the "other" tab, but it just seem not work
<jpds> letozaf_: Someone replied: < smartboyhw> Yes, letozaf_
<smartboyhw> Wait, I'm busying uploading Win 8 LPs.
<sagaci> letozaf_, the testdrive-gtk pulls quantal isos by default
<smartboyhw> Yeah, it should be using Quantal ISOs...
<letozaf__> but on testdrive I get (precise) written in the description instead on quantal
<letozaf__> do you mean that the ISOs are quantal's all the same ?
<astraljava> letozaf__: Please hold for a moment, I'll check in a minute.
<letozaf__> thank you
<balloons> letozaf__, I believe testdrive let's you select which distro in preferences
<astraljava> letozaf__: In the Preferences, make sure you have selected the quantal in the combobox under Ubuntu Releases, this can be found on the General tab.
<balloons> make sure you've selected quantal
<letozaf__> ok thank you
<letozaf__> I'll check
<smartboyhw> balloons, Hi!
<letozaf__> yes you're right thanks again :)
<smartboyhw> I did the ISO Testing Cadence.
 * balloons waves
<balloons> smartboyhw, awesome
<smartboyhw> Let's see what will happen in today's meeting.
<smartboyhw> Starting in 6 minutes.
<balloons> I guess it's a little confusing.. I know the tracker isn't setup nicely to show what we're trying to do sadly
<smartboyhw> Just finished uploading 38 Windows 8 RTM LPs to MDL forums guys. Really tired.
<balloons> smartboyhw, interesting
<smartboyhw> Those guys all thank me for that.
<cr3> me4oslav: you might be interested to know that your changes to checkbox are now in quantal!
<smartboyhw> congrats, me4oslav
<me4oslav> cr3 smartboyhw which changes? :) The home screen MR or the entire UI design change? ::)
<smartboyhw> Ask cr4
<smartboyhw> cr3, sorry
<smartboyhw> Is phillw here!? He is the chair!
<me4oslav> well, I did mentioned cr3 too :D
<phillw> smartboyhw: he is and has just logged on to -meeting :D
<balloons> phillw reporting in
<balloons> lol
<smartboyhw> YEAH!
<smartboyhw> Meeting started!
<cr3> me4oslav: can you point me to your entire UI design change MR?
<me4oslav> cr3, there isn't a MR -_- There is just a pretty sketched design :D https://picasaweb.google.com/100530892038948253747/CheckboxQT
<cr3> me4oslav: without a MR, you can be sure those changes aren't in quantal :)
<me4oslav> cr3, the things is the design I created is something I can't code :D I have to talk with the folks that are working on the main UI to get it implemented :)
<cr3> me4oslav: you might be happy to know that someone is already working on unifying the scrollboxes with the list of tests and statuses
<cr3> me4oslav: actually, it's done already. please pull the latest changes from trunk and run ./bin/checkbox-qt
<smartboyhw> !support | cr3
<ubot5`> cr3: The official ubuntu support channel is #ubuntu. Also see http://ubuntu.com/support and http://ubuntuforums.org and http://askubuntu.com
<smartboyhw> !support | me4oslav
<ubot5`> me4oslav: The official ubuntu support channel is #ubuntu. Also see http://ubuntu.com/support and http://ubuntuforums.org and http://askubuntu.com
<smartboyhw> This channel is for testing issues, dude!
<stgraber> smartboyhw: and development discussions on checkbox (a testing tool) are perfectly appropriate
<cr3> smartboyhw: checkbox is also for testing :)
<cr3> smartboyhw: in theory, checkbox could have its own channel but, in practice, there's not a lot of traffic about checkbox nor testing issues so it seems reasonable to share the same channel
<smartboyhw> Hmm, guys, stay focused at the meeting in #ubuntu-meeting.
<brendand> me4oslav, do you have checkbox 0.14.3 installed? if not what version do you have?
<me4oslav> brendand - the latest trunk
<brendand> me4oslav, try apt-get install checkbox-qt and see if it offers a version
<brendand> new version
<me4oslav> brendand, I'm on P ... will that do the trick?
<cr3> brendand: sudo add-apt-repository ppa:checkbox-dev; sudo apt-get update; sudo apt-get install checkbox checkbox-qt
<cr3> me4oslav: ^^^ that'll do the trick :)
<cr3> the checkbox-dev ppa contains the latest crack of the day
<me4oslav> cr3, MY HERO :D
<sagaci> Ive been testing the regular desktop 32/64bit images and I can commit to doing that every few days especially around this part of the cycle just to make sure there nothing majorly wrong
<cr3> balloons: ^^^ any particular tests you think sagaci should be running?
<balloons> hey cr3 !
<balloons> sagaci, yes you can test things that have been setup as a 'call for testing' on the package tracker
<balloons> I assume you have used the isotracker in the past to report results on your iso testing ?http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/
<sagaci> righteo I'll check it out tomorrow. Painful typing on Android teamviewer.
<njin> ballons: hallo, how can I see my testecase preview for bind9 http://packages.qa.dev.stgraber.org/admin/config/services/qatracker/testcases
<brendand> me4oslav, are you able to run checkbox?
<smartboyhw> balloons: Can I co-ordinate the daily ISO testing?
<balloons> sagaci, ok, well the package tracker is http://packages.qa.ubuntu.com/.
<me4oslav> brendand, behold: http://i.imgur.com/wHDYN.png
<balloons> sagaci, Email me https://launchpad.net/~nskaggs and I can share much more info and get you started, since your on your phone :-)
<smartboyhw> balloons: Read my question?
<sagaci> thanks, I'll have a read through it
<brendand> me4oslav, you mean it's hanging like that?
<me4oslav> brendand ... yup ;s And I can start it from trunk
<phillw> smartboyhw: http://qa.ubuntu.com/ does not have the correct time, and it needs a Canonical person to edit it.
<smartboyhw> Oh!
<brendand> cr3, can we reproduce what me4oslav is seeing?
<phillw> I'm a wiki editor, but I don't have access to that area of the wikis :)
<me4oslav> brendand cr3 - probably not ... checkbox loathes me :D
<balloons> njin, hey :-) yes, looking at it now
<smartboyhw> Oh, that one. Thanks, phillw
<brendand> me4oslav, can you make sure trunk is fully up to date (bzr pull)
<me4oslav> brendand, well I did "bzr branch lp:checkbox" like 10 mins ago, so :)
<brendand> me4oslav, let's try running from trunk
<me4oslav> brendand, it fired up without any issues :) Now what? :P
<cr3> brendand: better to look at the logs than try to reproduce
<cr3> me4oslav: you upgraded both checkbox and checkbox-qt, right?
<me4oslav> cr3 - yes, but who cares if it doesn't run _for me_ if it is installed? It works from trunk :D
<cr3> me4oslav: if it doesn't work for you, maybe it doesn't work for others. it would be nice to know for sure
<cr3> me4oslav: I would really appreciate if you could take a moment to report a bug and attach the logs from ~/.cache/checkbox
<me4oslav> cr3 Hardly the case, a few weeks ago I did some terrible things w/ it (ran commands I shouldn't have ran) and since then it works only from tunk -_-
<cr3> me4oslav: in that case, you might like to rm -fr ~/.cache/checkbox and try again
<cr3> me4oslav: if that doesn't work, try to apt-get purge all checkbox related packages and try installing again
<me4oslav> cr3, removing that did didn't do a thing. I will remove and try again ... but like I said I have screwed it in major way
<cr3> me4oslav: make sure to purge, that should remove all traces of things you might've done :)
<balloons> njin, I think I want to see it on the website
<balloons> you can remove the template stuff at the bottom
<cr3> balloons: the qa dashboard link on this page returns status code 404: http://qa.ubuntu.com/report-list/
<balloons> njin, on the testcase side, looks good, just needs the 'expected results' added to the steps
<smartboyhw> 404!!?!!?!
<njin> ballons, yes, but I cannot figure out haw to see the preview for it
<balloons> cr3, ahh.. good catch
<balloons> that's moved as you can tell
<balloons> njin, I'm not sure what accessyou have in the tool
<cr3> balloons: indeed, just thought you'd be the right person to update the website accordingly
<balloons> njin, I put it here: http://packages.qa.dev.stgraber.org/qatracker/milestones/223/builds/16266/testcases/1311/results
<smartboyhw> balloons: Who's android-lee? I looked at the Top testers (current milestones) lists, and he's the first on it!
<balloons> njin, in order to do that I added it to a product and created the build
<balloons> I wonder if you are able to do this or not.. not sure how much access your permissions give you
<balloons> smartboyhw, android-lee is a tester
<balloons> just like you
<smartboyhw> Wow, he's real active.
<njin> smartboyhw, he's a great fun of bruce -lee
<smartboyhw> ...
<njin> ballons, what do you think to run  server in VM and take some screenshot of the default install + the expected results for the verifies ?
<njin> ballons, bwetter not
<balloons> screenshots?
<balloons> njin, yes we discussed the idea of screenshots in the past
<balloons> we've stuck with text for the most part
<njin> balloons, yes it can be good for the server, but for the desktop I think it needs a continuous upgrade work
<balloons> njin, so if you can make sure the testcase follows the format of do A, expect B it should be all set
<balloons> njin, notice it uses html tags.
<njin> ballons, I've noted just now, writing the testcase that we have to choose two times the language... LOL
<njin> balloons:^^
<njin> I've to open another bug report
<balloons> two times the language?
<njin> yes, the firat at the start of the splash screen and the second at the language selection
<njin> firat/first
<njin> I'm wrong ?
<balloons> ohh
<balloons> I understnad, I thinki
<balloons> hmm.. which iso did this appen on?
 * balloons is still getting today's iso's
<njin> today server 8debian installer
<njin> today's build of server
<njin> but in general all debian installer
<balloons> ahh
<balloons> so the alternate images?
<njin> yes
<njin> debian too
<njin> ( not secure about debian)
<njin> balloons, seems to me that chrisccoulson is working on it, so I open a report. I've run that installer hundreds of times and nevwer noted this fact
<balloons> njin, ok
<balloons> that is quite odd
<balloons> I ran into something with ubiquity yesterday that was also weird on language
<balloons> so I thought maybe that was what you were talking about
<njin> balloons, http://packages.qa.dev.stgraber.org/qatracker/milestones/223/builds/16266/testcases/1311/results the first (default instalation) is done and verified step by step
<balloons> njin, ok one sec
<balloons> njin, ahh, so your starting to convert the server testcases :-)
<balloons> cool
<njin> tomorrow I will do a real hardware installation to see the difference with the wireless
<njin> yes
<balloons> You can remove the case id at the top
<balloons> let me look at the behind the scenes and check the formatting :-)
<njin> ok, tomorrow I will write the walkthrought
<njin> now i've to go, see you soon
<balloons> njin,
<balloons> njin, k.. let's talk tomorrow when your around
<njin> ok
<balloons> phillw, ping
<phillw> balloons: pong
<balloons> phillw, check out my response to Lance and the wiki page
<balloons> I hope it helps a little.. I realize the idea is still a bit confusing and off
<balloons> if there's anything else I can do to help clarify or make it easier let me know
<phillw> thanks for the reply.
<balloons> also, while I have you. I need to schedule that meeting
<phillw> frustrated testers are not productive testers :)
<balloons> heh.. it's a big agenda.. everything to do about iso testing.. the scheduling, how we're doing it, the communication, respins, the testcases we're running
<balloons> all of it needs discussed
<balloons> so, my question to you is what's the best format for the lubuntu guys?
<balloons> irc, video hangout, combination?
<balloons> and what's the best time in general to meet (in UTC)?
<phillw> I'm pretty sure that for a one off, they'd be flexible. Best way would be to put the poll to allow people to state when they could attend a special meeting. for such a thing, I'm available at any time.
<balloons> yes, I thought about polling
<balloons> but honestly it's such a big discussion it's going to end up as several meetings.. perhaps not
<balloons> perhaps a mailing list thread is best
<balloons> i'm going to have a think on it
<phillw> maybe start something along the lines of a whiteboard?
<balloons> phillw, hmm.. ok, elaborate if you would
<phillw> balloons: along the lines of https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/lubuntu-q-work-items ? I'm trying to find the live whiteboard!
<balloons> phillw, :-)
<phillw> we have found it invaluable. We can bring up topics, the devs can tell us where things are upto etc.
<balloons> phillw, send me a link whenever you find it again.. no rush
<phillw> balloons: (22:40:07) phillw: hi Boss, do you have the link to the quantal whiteboard to hand? (The one that we can actually edit, not the https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/lubuntu-q-work-items one).
<phillw> (22:40:46) Julien: it's the one on https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/lubuntu-q-work-items
<phillw> (22:41:01) phillw: hmm, how do you edit it?
<phillw> (22:41:04) Julien: there is a section "Whiteboard" which you can edit
<phillw> (22:41:22) Julien: you are login in launchpad ?
<phillw> (22:41:30) phillw: got it!
<phillw> i've changed the irc nick as he does not get pinged.
<phillw> *so as he does not get pinged*
<phillw> it looks like kate set them up, I'm sure she can provide further information as to how they function. Another option is the etherpad as used by the release team?
#ubuntu-testing 2012-08-09
<balloons> phillw, ahh yes those whiteboard
<balloons> yes they are used for spec and work planning and we use the etherpad to generate them generally
<smartboyhw> HI!
<smartboyhw> Hi!
<smartboyhw> No, balloons and phillw and astraljava, we got a certificate problem at http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com
<smartboyhw> Somehow... That's weird, it redirects to the testcases...
<balloons> smartboyhw, ?
<davmor2> smartboyhw: works here
<smartboyhw> Damn, forgotten to show you the link.
<smartboyhw> Forget it for now.
 * smartboyhw goes dancing because balloons is back
<smartboyhw> YEAH!
<smartboyhw> Balloons: You here?
<balloons> smartboyhw, perhaps :-)
<balloons> I've been accused of being a bot before
<smartboyhw> I think I will do all the Ubuntu Studio testing
<smartboyhw> balloons: You a BOT!>!!>!>
<balloons> smartboyhw, ok what do you mean? Have you spoke with there team?
<smartboyhw> Yes, look at #ubuntustudio-devel
<smartboyhw> i want to join the team there.
<balloons> smartboyhw, well, each flavor is responsible for themselves.. they can setup there own QA process, etc, etc.. Obviously we share and help each other. But I'm not a member of ubuntu studio, so I can't tell you a ton about them. They produce only a DVD
<balloons> and I believe they are doing only LTS releases now
<smartboyhw> No, they are doing daily builds
<balloons> as far as joining, that's up to them of course.. but sounds good.. I'm sure they would appreciate the help!
<smartboyhw> balloons: I'm now an official member of the Ubuntu Studio Support Team: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuStudio/TeamStructure :)
<balloons> smartboyhw, excellent! glad to see it
<smartboyhw> Also the Testing Team! Yeah!
<balloons> phillw, ping
<njin> ballons, the new installer is set to encrypt by default and mandatory ?
<njin> ubiquity
<njin> it require a security key to go on, then I have to set it
<njin> so yes, it encrypt mandatory, without the possibility to disable it
<balloons> njin, I haven't run it yet today
<balloons> but I do know stuff is being changed as we speak on it
<njin> a continuos crash
<balloons> it should look different :-)
<balloons> my isos are syncing right now..
<balloons> i'll see it shortly
<njin> ok, needs testing work then
<balloons> k.. just finished syncing.. I'll fire it up and see what your talking about
<balloons> my guess is that yes, your finding bugs
<balloons> we should report and let the installer guys know about htem
<njin> ok, at now I cannot install in ant way
<njin> any/ant
<balloons> I see a couple bugs already from you :)
<njin> when it works in this way i faer that are hardware problems
<njin> fear
<njin> ballons, are you wornking with Precise or Quantal (I've got some problems with the usb-creator in Quantal but I cannot track down as in strace it won't reproduce)
<njin> balloons, ^^
<balloons> I'm in quantal
<balloons> but testing on precise
<balloons> haha
<balloons> i have two boxes
<balloons> I typically just dd the image
<balloons> I can't ever get anything to work otherwise on my pc.. it won't boot
<Odra> Hello, could someone test an app I made?
<Odra> This one here: http://code.google.com/p/chrono-marker/
<Odra> I dont really know where to ask for this...
<balloons> njin, still there?
<njin> balloons, yes tell me
<njin> balloons: ping
<balloons> njin, hey.. just noting my install seems to be fine for the moment
<balloons> but there is the new screen you spoke of
<njin> is weird, but I can't understand if it is wanted so or is a bug
<njin> the mandatory ecryption I mean
<balloons> yes
<balloons> i'm guessing they didn't put the option in yet
<balloons> lol
<njin> lol, me and carla reproduced two same bugs
<balloons> hehe
<balloons> great minds!
<njin> so i think we have done a good work
<balloons> i'm startying up on the ARM testing
<balloons> and John volunteered to do the mac stuff
 * balloons crosses fingers
<njin> good, when I will have some money or someone will miss it I will have an arm too
<njin> whow have you found a mac ??
<njin> great
<balloons> yep
<njin> ok balloons, is late for me, I go, goonoght
<njin> goodnight
<phillw> balloons: ping
<balloons> phillw, pon
<phillw> balloons: for amd64+mac, please do include Lars! (Lubuntu-QA team). He is the only tester I know who has the kit.
<balloons> phillw, ahh ok
<balloons> soon soon soon.. we will have a db we can store all this info
<balloons> and asking will be much easier
<balloons> see above phillw however.. someone else has also volunteered to try.. he's never done it before, but has a mac
<phillw> as Mac (specifically ppc) seems now to be the remit of lubuntu, never be shy to ask those guys to help out :)
<phillw> balloons: who? I do get time outs and have been busy with family today.
<balloons> ahh
<balloons> john kim
<balloons> he's not on IRC that I know of
<phillw> do you have an email contact for him?
<phillw> sorry, for lag; an email account has been compromised - I'm just checking what i can legally do as an admin to trpair it.
<phillw> *repair*
<phillw> my boss is just finishing university, so I'm still awaiting instructions after locking it down.
<phillw> balloons: you have a reply to the request for amd64-mac testing request :)
<balloons> ahh I see
<balloons> excellent
<balloons> I just finished up the arm
<balloons> and doing the final wubi testing as well
<phillw> I do keep telling you to cc Lubuntu-QA :P
<balloons> I think we're in good shape
<balloons> hurray
<phillw> Hmm, my admin privs were not reset correctly on the email system that I'm emergency holographic sys-op for.
<phillw> So much for an early night!
<balloons> ohh boy
<phillw> fortunately, any deleted emails can be recovered. We have, sadly, had such things happen before. It just maddens me that people cause us to waste time & energy for some saddo 'getting a flag' - Yeah, you got a flag, you disrupted an F/OSS system.
#ubuntu-testing 2012-08-10
<smartboyhw> Hi!
<smartboyhw> Balloons: You here?
<balloons> ping jibel
<balloons> smartboyhw, didn't see your ping
<balloons> :-)
<smartboyhw> balloons: How to join https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-qa
<smartboyhw> My question also applys to jibel
<balloons> smartboyhw, if you'll notice, I'm ot a member :-)
<smartboyhw> balloons: ... but phillw is one...
<balloons> smartboyhw, the history of this is that QA was spread out across different teams, etc
<balloons> I've been trying to consolidate and not have tons of lp teams
<balloons> I didn't even realize this one existed
<balloons> or have misplaced the knowledge
<phillw> balloons: that makes two of us, it does have a mailing list!
<phillw> *does NOT have*
<smartboyhw> ... Get Jibel in here...
<smartboyhw> phillw: You clearly forgot the meeting time yesterday...
<phillw> smartboyhw: I did not. I also sent you an email. Have you read it?
<smartboyhw> Yep. I'll be on Monday only now. Sorry
<phillw> that's okay. I should be about on Monday. What time is good for you?
<smartboyhw> 1300UTC. I have a Ubuntu Studio Meeting to go to.
<phillw> that's good for me. 14:00 Local time.
<smartboyhw> OK, then.
<smartboyhw> How is the ISO Testing Cadence for you, phillw?
<phillw> I'm not currently iso testing, been too busy with re-shuffling virtual machines for various teams that I host on my server.
<phillw> I keep up with the lubuntu qa testing team. Things seem to be going well. Julien is aware of the couple of little bugs carried over from A3 and is committed to squishing them by Beta1 arrivwes.
<smartboyhw> I keep up with the Ubuntu Studio Team.
<phillw> hmm, there seems to be couple of the dreaded red bugs on the list... Good old Ubiquity :)
<smartboyhw> ... Well, I only got a green bug
<phillw> http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/milestones/219/builds
 * balloons is running the cadence results check
<balloons> ohh.. I still need to do the wubi cd install tests!
 * smartboyhw is waiting for balloons and also get to do more on Ubuntu Studio.
<astraljava> smartboyhw: If you want to help Studio, do test the dailies. We don't have too many of the people who do.
<smartboyhw> I did yesterday.
<smartboyhw> Will do it tmr.
<astraljava> Nice, did you post results on iso.qa.u.c?
<smartboyhw> Uh oh, Quantal meeting now.
<green_> hello
 * smartboyhw waves at green_
<green_> I want to join the QA team. Where should I start?
<smartboyhw> Go to iso.qa.ubuntu.com, follow the testcases and report.
<green_> well?
<green_> what should I do next?
<smartboyhw> Then join the meeting every wednesday 1400UTC in #ubuntu-meeting
<green_> What should I know in order to contribute?
<smartboyhw> Nothing!!!!!!!
<smartboyhw> Just know how to install Ubuntu is surely quite enough.
<smartboyhw> If not ask balloons!
<green_> What would I be doing then?
<balloons> green_, howdy :-)
<balloons> there's some wiki pages here that might help you
<green_> hello balloons!
<balloons> one sec, I'll link you to them
<smartboyhw> balloons: You help him, I still got issues to fix in Studio
<phillw> hi green_ we're busily rewriting and moving stuff around to make life a little less daunthing for newcommers.
<green_> okay
<green_> cool :)
<smartboyhw> phillw: Like!
<phillw> green_: head over to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/QATeam/ and simply have a good explore. (Don't get freaked out by the glossary page, it  is there as a reference - you are not expected to learn it word for word!).
<green_> thank you
<balloons> ok yes, thanks phillw
<balloons> I was still catching the tail end of my call
<balloons> green_, so the most important thing to do is signup to the mailing list. Send an intro email to say hello. Then watch the list for announcements to join up in testing
<balloons> depending on the type of testing being asked for, we can help you learn how to do it..
<green_> So, I'll have to update for daily builds and things like that?
<balloons> it's not hard at all.. once you've learned how to use the qatracker it's straightforward
<green_> Also, can I contribute to both QA and BugSquad?
<balloons> green_, here's an overview of all the testing stuff we do: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Testing/Activities
<balloons> and yes, you most certainly can!
<green_> thank you!
<balloons> right now we're doing some calls for testing on the package tracker -- http://packages.qa.ubuntu.com/. There's webapps testing, testing the 12.10 kernel on ubuntu precise, and some pulseaudio testing.
<balloons> the other big pieces of testing we do invovles iso
<balloons> http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/.. this week we tested the quantal daily isos for the desktop images in particular
<green_> So, on average how much time do I need to dedicate?
<green_> every week?
<balloons> green_, as much as you wish ;-) The most time sensitive testing is the iso testing. During a milestone week, being able to test for several hours over the course of a few days is really handy
<balloons> we have 4 or 5 milestones through the 6 month cycle
<phillw> green_: the important thing is not to burn yourself out. Don't overload yourself.
<balloons> ^^
<balloons> most of the time, the commitment is rather low. Testing the pulseaudio or webapps packages are 15-30 mins
<balloons> one time
<green_> And there would be wiki or manuals on how to start?
<balloons> yes, if you wanted to test something today, you can help out on a call for testing
<balloons> First, look over this page: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Testing/QATracker
<green_> okay :)
<balloons> it will explain the qatracker, which is the tool we use to recieve tests and record our results
<balloons> there are 2 walkthroughs (and video) linked off of that page
<balloons> are you running precise or quantal at the moment?
<green_> precise
<balloons> ok, great
<balloons> so let's have you try the 12.10 kernel on precise testing
<green_> cool!
<balloons> The url for that is here: http://packages.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/milestones/223/builds
<balloons> so read the https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Testing/QATracker page, then click the 'calls for testing' walkthrough link at the bottom
<balloons> that should be everything you need to know :-)
<balloons> but we're here.. please ping if you get stuck or lost.. I want to see how well the docs take you through it
<green_> thank you again
<phillw> green_: there are plenty of links from the main QA page. As I stated earlier, myself and balloons are busy integrating a 'one stop' page for newcommers. Whilst this page is a bit slanted to Lubuntu, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/Testing, it does hold some more information which is getting moved onto the 'main' QA site. some of that background information has not been  carried over yet. It is quite a task to re-model an entire wiki area!
<green_> got it.
<phillw> balloons: I also got a link to  xubuntu testing which I will be having a good look at over the weekend :)
<balloons> phillw, :-_)
<phillw> balloons: for cadence results, can I use the history part of reporting lubuntu results to attempt to draw up something similar to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Testing/ISO/Cadence/Status as a learning passage for myself?
<balloons> phillw, whoa.. I missed something in that sentence
<phillw> balloons:  iso tracker can have history turned on, thus I can see what has been tested during cadence?
<balloons> phillw, yes
<balloons> but I can help you better
<phillw> balloons: :D I'm all for that
<balloons> the tracker has an API
<balloons> so I'm creating that wiki page automatically using a script
<phillw> okies, I'll leave that in your capable hands :)
<balloons> if you wanted to track lubuntu a bit easier, I can share ways of making that happen
<balloons> long term, we want the tracker updated to show this!
<balloons> I consider it a quick fix to the problem.. but I want the site fixed
<phillw> if you would, I'm all for learning stuff
<phillw> balloons: hopefully you, st, and karl can develop something. Karl is very new to testing, so it will take a little while for him to come up to speed. But, he is very keen to help.
<balloons> yes, did he email stgraber himself or no?
<phillw> Not sure if he has as yet, I had a quick chat last night with st last night. I've offered a VM to the project if it is wanted. (I'm back to having 3 spare machines).
<phillw> I'm pretty sure he would have cc'd us had he done
<phillw> I know from my chat to st, he's really busy as the release team try pull back time for Q following the concentration on 12.04.1
<phillw> balloons: when do you next expect to be able to schedule an hour chat?
<balloons> phillw, what do you mean?
<kanliot> hi there, just let me read the chat buffer
<kanliot> nope haven't emailed him.  I suppose I will need instructions from him to build the testing tracker.
<phillw> balloons: as a ten minute chat always over-runs, I want to ensure we have time to discuss a 10 minute thing :P
<kanliot> why dont you use skype?
<kanliot> or etc.
<phillw> kanliot: coz we are busy editing wiki areas :)
<kanliot> :) i don't believe ya.   maybe you have a nefarious reason for not using voice chat
<phillw> he he
<phillw> btw kanliot some of the stuff does cross boundaries. As the none flavour specific stuff from https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/Testing is moved to the central area. This follows the rules of less duplication and easier to update :)
<balloons> phillw, i'll ping you in a bit
<phillw> balloons: no worries :)
<balloons> phillw, ping
<balloons> kanliot, yes ping and/or email him
<balloons> he's on rc
<balloons> *irc
<kanliot> ping stgraber
<phillw> balloons: pong
<balloons> phillw, so you wanted to chat? heh
<balloons> I've been non-stop chatting most of today
<phillw> balloons: it is not urgent, just a bit about the naming of https://wiki.ubuntu.com/QATeam/Overview as it seems that it is more a case of 'further information' for ISO testing, which is what it was orriginally written for?
<balloons> phillw, you want to name it something else?
<balloons> I'd still like a quick start page
<balloons> quick start/overview/readme first
<balloons> that's the idea
<phillw> balloons: yes, as a 'quick start' or something, the overview is really our activities page?
<balloons> the activties page should be just that.. a listing of everything we work on.
<balloons> but it doesn't explain the how and why we work on it
<balloons> that's what I envisioned the overview page to do
<balloons> aka.. if I don't know what the team does really, looking at the iso testing entry on activities doesn't really help or make sense
<phillw> indeed, so how do we move 'introduction' from the home page onto another one? It is a real pain to find the babalnce.
<balloons> why and when would  do ths
<balloons> ok, so we're on the same page, for this page
 * balloons notes puns are fun
<phillw> indeed.
<phillw> let me just go have a look at L home page.
<balloons> is there anyone about running quantal? I feel crazy, but i can't delete files from a mounted usb disk
<balloons> lol -- locked
<balloons> bad sd card.. the switch is loose
<kanliot> going to go out for a bit, i'll send graber an email when i get back. bye
<phillw> balloons: could it be added to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Testing/ISO as an introduction, or is that going to be too hard to find?
<balloons> phillw,  iwanted to introduce everythng, not just iso testing
<balloons> currently I feel like pointing someone at our activities page isn't useful to them if they are new
<balloons> they lack the background on the team, and the flow of when and why we test
<phillw> indeed, and that is more an introductions to iso testing, which is a full subject in its own right.
<balloons> exactly
<balloons> and that intro should be on the ISO page, and in the walkthrough
<balloons> but before you go down the road of I want to iso test, there needs to be a general knowledge transfer
<phillw> those are my thoughts, we can add to the other ones as we get time.
<phillw> I think that as ISO testing is probably the most important one - and one that we do have documentation for. I think it is a good introduction to QA
<phillw> it does cover how the qa tracker is used, and as there is a desire to use qa-tracker for more things; I do think it is a good grounding for newcommers?
<balloons> phillw, so are we on the same page?
<balloons> we need that intro wiki page written up
<balloons> As part of the intro, I think recommending doing an iso test or call for testing is a good start
<phillw> I think so. Let me have a go by using it as an example of the stuff we do?
<balloons> yes, please do.. I think the overview page s the place for it
<balloons> we can rename it if needed.. that was my goal for the page
<balloons> edit it away
<balloons> I'm changng the start page a little bit
<phillw> just having my dinner. I'll be on it shortly.
<phillw> balloons: my 1st stab at it is at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/QATeam/Overview/test
<balloons> phillw, not bad
<balloons> you should bring in mention of the unscheduled testing as well
<balloons> aka, the calls for testing that start whenever the dev teams are ready
<balloons> and thus, not on the master schedule
<phillw> there is a rewrite to do for both https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/Testing/TheStages and https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Testing/ISO/Milestones to get the best out them both and remove duplication.
<phillw> Yes, I can add in ad-hoc, but that will most likely mean adding back in the ppa section that we had previously removed?
<phillw> as the page has shrank (I've been fairly harsh in shrinking it down). Do we have room to add that section in, or should it remain as a seperate page?
<balloons> shouldn't require adding back in the ppa piece.. well, I mean.. yes we should explain t
<balloons> but no not in a lubuntu specfic way if possble
<balloons> it's a fine line.. lol
<phillw> As cadence is also not on there and needs to be added, maybe ad-hoc testing warrants its own page?
<balloons> giving an overview but not giving a ton of detail
<balloons> cadence is part of the schedule
<balloons> along, it was ad-hoc'd in this time around
<balloons> it needs to be scheduled properly, and treated as such
<balloons> shouldn't be any different
<phillw> balloons: go chose someones PPA and an application, I'll happily edit my existing ppa instructions :D
<balloons> phillw :-)
<balloons> I want to reflect that these calls for testing happen
<balloons> and they have specific instructions
<phillw> balloons: as we currently do have any reporting, I don't want to open a can of worms until we do?
<balloons> I think  that's suffcent
<balloons> since by definition it could change dependng on the testing
<phillw> *do not have*
<balloons> any reporting for?
<phillw> reporting for cadence testing
<phillw> except for your manual one for ubuntu.
<balloons> let's just mention there is unscheduled testing, for example a  call for testing, and they wll be unscheduled and have specific instructions with how to test
<balloons> sound good?
<balloons> yes, off-milestone iso testing isn't reported well
<phillw> yup :) any ideas on the slant of the merger between https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/Testing/TheStages and https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Testing/ISO/Milestones ?
<balloons> let's put that detail on the Testing/ISO page
<phillw> ooh, there goes the 1st hour :P
<balloons> the off-milestone iso testing
<balloons> ok, ideas on the merger
<balloons> let's see
<balloons> I touched that page last
<balloons> go ahead and just do a merge as you see it
<balloons> then i'll come in after and see where we end up
<balloons> sounds good?
<balloons> we can debate specific points
<phillw> the L one, was part of an introduction to newcommers, to let them know, with out scaring them - what can be expected.
<balloons> but overall, daily, alpha, beta, final
<balloons> yes you could define a milestone (or link it)
<balloons> perhaps a small intro would be good
<phillw> okies, let me have a 'play'.
<balloons> hehe
<phillw> I'll edit the L* one, so as not to damage anything on the wiki
<phillw> balloons: please have a read through and edit of https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/Testing/TheStages
<balloons> k
<balloons> looks good
<balloons> I wonder about the VM piece however
<balloons> perhaps we need a page on those? It seems silly, but they come up in different places
<balloons> talking about them on the page is on topic, but defining them is a bit offtopic
<phillw> the VM is to be moved, once the new VM page is up and running. you were doing some stuff on that?
<phillw> I would be looking to remove it from the page and moved to a page of its own.
<phillw> that one currently has the link to quemu which is the bigger hope for ppc and ARM processors.
<phillw> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/VMwarePlayerAndQemu last updated 2008, so it does need a re-vamp!
<phillw> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Installation/QemuEmulator does seem a lot more recent :)
<balloons> yea
<balloons> we don't have good info there
<balloons> ok, well, I suppose that works
<phillw> I can look to get https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Installation/QemuEmulator up to date so as to include the ppc systems, if soemone can do the same for ARM?
<phillw> the other VMs that are mentioned can be linked to.
<balloons> hmm
<phillw> balloons: can we start with https://help.ubuntu.com/community/VirtualMachines and then battle on? That looks a good page to point to as an index?
<balloons> phillw,
<balloons> we do have some vbox pages
<balloons> somewhere :-)
<phillw> I'll point to it on L, and leave the ppc specific stuff in, but copy the remainder to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Testing/ISO/Milestones If you are in agreement?
<phillw> balloons: well, they need to be pointed to by https://help.ubuntu.com/community/VirtualMachines which does look a well put together page that covers the options.
<balloons> phillw, k
<balloons> and yes
<balloons> let me find the vbox pages
<phillw> Do you want me to transfer over the 'thanks for reading so far bit', or not transfer it?
<phillw> the L version was designed to welcome people - Not sure the views on 'official' area.
<phillw> balloons: Final draft (couple of internal links to change when copying). https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/Testing/TheStages  Is it good to go onto https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Testing/ISO/Milestones ?
<balloons> looks good
<phillw> you can take your time & fine tune it as you get the time. Main thing was to get it there :)
<phillw> How did your headache of the front page comealong?
<balloons> keeps lookng better and better
<phillw> balloons: transferred to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Testing/ISO/Milestones That's the the best I can do re: cadence testing. Please do go and tidy up any typos etc!
<balloons> indeed!
<balloons> ohh
<balloons> lol
<balloons> I forget the cc again
<balloons> hahah
<balloons> tidying now
<balloons> can you cc for me?
<phillw> yeah, will do.
<phillw> also just tidying up some stuff on the source page that I did not spot until I did the transfer! I'll let you do the clean up & then just cheat and copy it back :D
<balloons> k - I fixed the typos, etc
<balloons> k -- so let's look at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/QATeam/Overview one last time
<balloons> haha
<balloons> Let me add the unscheduled testing piece
<balloons> then we'll let it sit and come back to it again later
<balloons> k
<balloons> whew
<balloons> fun fun phillw
<balloons> good work mate
<phillw> of, small hairy spherical objects... i forgot that one!
<phillw> I've also had a think of ppa testing, I'll post it up shortly.
<phillw> warning, it involves mention of the Klingon language :)
<phillw> balloons: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/Testing/PPA_Testing do you want me to still use lxinput & the lx/staging area, or should I change it to application and ppaxyz?
<balloons> phillw, umm whatever is fine
<phillw> balloons: which do you prefer? a theoretical example or a real one? We can always edit it later! I'm just trying to get stuff useful for newcommers on the area.
<balloons> rght
<balloons> umm.. things could change
<balloons> agnostic is better I suppose
<phillw> i'll go make it agnostic
<phillw> balloons: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/Testing/PPA_Testing
#ubuntu-testing 2012-08-11
<green_> hello
<green7> hello
<sagaci> hello green7
<green7> I have a question regarding application testing
<green7> I have a question regarding application testing
<green7> hello
<green7> hi!
<green7> hi
<green7> hello
<smartboyhw> Hi!
<green7> hello
 * smartboyhw waves at green7.
<green7> I need some information regarding the application testing.
<smartboyhw> OK.
<green7> To test the applications, should I install the packages in a virtual machine or on my machine? I think new packages might break the system.
<smartboyhw> green7: Most recommendable on VMs, including TestDrive.
<green7> okay
<green7> Also, in a nutshell, what am I supposed to do as  a member of BugSquad?
<smartboyhw> green7: If you find a bug please report it.
<green7> okay
<phillw> hi green7 the source of infinite knowledge on bugs can be found at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BugSquad/KnowledgeBase
<green7> thank you phillw!
<phillw> I'm still unpicking the links that head back to Lubuntu-QA from the work myself and balloons are doing... Drat... just found another one :/
<phillw> sure enough, it is for bug reporting!
<green7> :)
<green7> what is launchpad staging?
<green7> what is 5-a-daying?
<phillw> green7: for the bug squad, 5 a day means looking at 5 new bugs each day and checking they have all the information needed / are not duplicates etc.
<green7> okay
<phillw> launchpad staging is, afik, where a test application is added up to launchpad to be tested before being accepted into the main area.
<green7> got it!
<phillw> green7: yes lp staging is indeed that. I've just re-written the ppa testing page https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/Testing/PPA_Testing just waiting to work with balloons as to where to slot it in.
<green7> :)
<phillw> green7: does that page explain sufficiently for you?
<green7> yes! Both, the KnowledgeBase and PPA_Testing pages are comprehensive.
<phillw> good, it is important to get people new to these areas to give us input as to how the pages are. If you find pages that are confusing etc. please, please do let myself and nicholas know so that we can look into them.
<green7> I found https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/HowToTriage/ confusing. It explains Apport but not clearly. I think the first transcript in the https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BugSquad/KnowledgeBase is better to provide introduction to the new comers.
<phillw> which one on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BugSquad/KnowledgeBase do you prefer?
<green7> The first one, by Brian Murray. It also explains how to read/write simple Apport hooks.
<phillw> green7: so which area of https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/HowToTriage/ needs an overhaul to use the lesson?
<green7> I think the section "Apport Reports" should be extended to include more about hooks, and how it actually works, before getting into CoreDump and things.
<green7> Also, not everyone knows about core dumps and stack traces, so a link or some explanation should be provided.
<phillw> green7: do please pass on your experience and observations to brian@ubuntu.com , he is also present on this channel but may be away from his computer. Like everyone else in testing / release etc. he does not bite :)
<green7> All right, I'll mail him. :D
<phillw> green7: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BugSquad/Contacts has the full list.
<green7> thank you!
<phillw> kanliot: has also recently started bug triaging, he's also a nice guy and is around quite often,
<kanliot>  a matter of opinion
<phillw> My apologies that most of my links etc. are Lubuntu based, I'm the admin for the Lubuntu-QA team and so know those people best :)
<phillw> kanliot: did you get the car sorted?
 * green7 waves
<kanliot> uh nope,
<kanliot> it actually starts most of the time
<kanliot> i was wondering you said devs were marking bugs to be retested immediately...
<kanliot> like next day
<kanliot> well i guess it's not my responsibility, but i was curious about that incident
<phillw> kanliot: not to my knowledge. what is however the current problem is that bugs are wiped clean at each respin.
<kanliot> what's a respin?  dailies or cadence cycle?
<phillw> so, a bug reported on 10th August will not be visible on 11th August.
<green7> Hey, if someone files bugs for some third-party packages, what should a triager do?
<phillw> the respins are carried out on a cron job, they are the dailies.
<kanliot> ok simple enough
<kanliot> pardon me i have to run
<phillw> at present when a milestone is planned, the cron is turned off. Thus the bugs do not get setroyed.
<phillw> kanliot: np - catch you later.
<phillw> *destroyed*
<green7> phillw: if someone files bugs for some third-party packages, what should a triager do?
<phillw> as in a package not maintained by ubuntu?
<green7> yes
<green7> and how to confirm whether certain package is maintained by Ubuntu?
<phillw> That's one I cannot fully answer, I'd have to go ask :)
<phillw> green7: pop over to #ubuntu-bugs they are the bug specialists, I know enough to get by :)
<green7> no problem
<phillw> I'd hate to give incorrect information.
<green7> you've already taught me more than enough :D
<phillw> I'm a the dictionary definition of a technician.... knowledge of many systems, master of none :) Or, as I prefer to call myself, a librarian... I may not know the subject, but I can ferret out the information for the questioner :)
<green7> in practical world, that is often very useful!
<phillw> a black belt in google-fu is handy :)
<phillw> green7: http://www.googleguide.com/ is a useful resource :)
<green7> seems good
<phillw> he he, I've just found out that they phased out + .... something new learned!
<green7> hmmm, I feel good after learning something useful :D
<green7> can you tell me something about cadence cycle?
<phillw> green7: not a great deal. It is still new to me. we don't have an automated system of collecting results yet. Basically, when it comes fully on-line, we will dispense with alpha and beta milestones. they will be replaced with 2 weekly testing cycles. It's still a young idea and much work is still to be done to bring it to fruition.
<green7> hmm
<phillw> Karl has been  asked to help out with the reporting of it. There is a lot of work to do, and the final version may well evolve over time.
<green7> okay
<phillw> Karl knows drupal, so is now on a crash course of QA. As he is already a bug triager he is familiar with QA.
<green7> cool
<green7> I'm currently a student
<phillw> a lot of the testers are.
<green7> just wanted to have some experience
<green7> of real world :P
<phillw> there are so many areas of the F/OSS world, take your time and choose the areas you want to learn more about. I'm biased, I do think that QA are the underated stars of ubuntu.
<phillw> the devs make things, we ensure that we break them to keep them busy :P
<green7> Yeah, QA is important. I guess MS/Apple understand it very well.
<phillw> well, for apple maybe.... but for some of the MS releases, I do question it. Think ME, Vista ... releases better forgotten about.
<green7> I think of Vista as the beta release of 7.
<phillw> A few releases ago, a zero day show stopping bug was found for ubuntu. The devs gathered together to celebrate launch day were instead put to work to fix it.
<green7> :D
<green7> so are you a developer too?
<phillw> Further back, a release was a few days late because the decision was made to pull it and correct an issue.
<phillw> green7: nope, As it states on the PPA page... I know dev-speak about as well as I do Klingon :P
<phillw> I can follow them for a couple of minutes, but once they get all code & technical - I'm out of my depth!
<green7> :D
<green7> I wanted to be in the developing team, but then I thought maybe I'd have lots of code to write, and also, I was not familiar with anything
<green7> So, I decided to start with QA and triaging.
<phillw> It is a good way to start, you will be in contact with devs so will learn their language.
<phillw> for the SII team, I'm an admin, people have joined that team and then found the areas that most excite them.
<phillw> My training is in server admin, I've leaned QA stuff gradually :)
<green7> what does SII team do?
<phillw> http://thesii.org/
<phillw> http://thesii.org/purpose.php describes it better
<green7> this is awesome!
<green7> It's not available right now, is it?
<phillw> speech control has just gone beta.
<green7> will it be available for free, and will it support all linux distributions?
<phillw> yes, it is the rule for SII. all stuff is released under GPL
<green7> who all can test the beta version?
<phillw> anyone can
<green7> Do we need to add some repository?
<phillw> http://thesii.org/wiki/SpeechControl
<green7> I don't think many people know of this
<phillw> We have not officially released the test version yet.
<phillw> feel free to pop onto #sii The Institute is currently logged on.
<phillw> *The head of*
<green7> Can I put this conversation on the Internet, just to let people know? They would love to check it out.
<phillw> pop over to #sii and have a chat.
<Guest8962> hi
#ubuntu-testing 2012-08-12
<green7> If during testing I find a new bug, should I file a new bug and then fill the bug number in the report?
<smartboyhw> Hi!
<smartboyhw> Hi!
<stlsaint> is anyone getting duplicate source.list entires in latest precise 12.04.1 iso's or is this a already filed bug?
<stlsaint> I even downloaded precise release iso and run apt-get update and duplicate entires
<smartboyhw> Hi stlsaint
<stlsaint> smartboyhw: o/
<smartboyhw> That should be a new bug
<stlsaint> well i have seen bugs dating back to march but no fix and i would like to ensure im not tripping and that others are seeing this before i go filing bugs
<smartboyhw> No fix = no fix
<stlsaint> it adds in the Debcdrom entries multiple times
<smartboyhw> Actually, ask that in #ubuntu-bugs
<smartboyhw> BYE!
<balloons> ping phillw
<phillw> balloons: pong
<balloons> phillw, got your email string
<balloons> :-)
<phillw> okies.
<balloons> hehe
<balloons> I'm going to go through and reply
<balloons> just thought I'd let you know it might take me a bit to do so
<phillw> there's no mad rush :)
<balloons> phillw, the short story is that yes cadence testing is not well supported tool wish
<balloons> *wise
<balloons> and it looks like you may have found the original conversation that triggered us undertakng it
<phillw> wel, karl did... he's been getting himself upto speed on it so better to understand it.
<phillw> and in so doing, has helped me understand things better :)
<balloons> I'll write more in my reply, but as you likely saw in the email, our original plan for the cycle was to test milestones, starting a few days early to help lower respins and give devs more time to finalize before the milestone
<balloons> the basic idea was, during the milestone we have to exhaustively test all the images and then re-test when there are re-spins
<balloons> that's no fun to have a respin
<balloons> so if we take a little time to find the serious bugs but running a test or two before we generate the iso's during the milestone we can avoid this
<phillw> I know, it does stress the testers!
<balloons> in other words, when we spin a milestone iso, we should have every reason to believe it will pass all the tests
<balloons> we test it and release it.. no respins
<phillw> as long as you keep your fingers crossed for the installer ;)
<balloons> this overall in my mind should have reduced the stress and respin count.. since we were NOT going to exhaustively test the daily before the actual milestone testing, it should have been less work. and if we found a bug, the devs could take a few days and fix it before pushing an image
<balloons> again, if you push a milestone image and you want testing on it.. me finding a bug should be an exception, not a normal event
<balloons> especially one large enough to cause a respin
<balloons> tis but one opinion :-)
<phillw> the freeze to qa seems to have consistently been late. This reduces the time for testing / bug fixing. If we say 5 days before a milestone, then doing it 3 days before is not right.
