#ubuntu-motu 2005-04-04
<herve> doko, I let you think about it :-)
<herve> ++
<lamont> dholbach: gcc-2.95 _WANTS_ to die
<lamont> and in fact, you can't fix it... (it needs bootstrap love, which I will only give it under duress)
<dholbach> gcc-3.2 too?
<lamont> yep
<dholbach> doko approved it, but i wasnt sure
<dholbach> rocking
<dholbach> i'll tell elmo
<lamont> well, 3.2 won't build - if you look at it, you'll find that there's a circular dep-wait
<dredg> dholbach: make sure you use the actual words "wants to die" :)
<lamont> how'd it get installed on i386...
* dredg grrs
<dredg> 23.00 and haven't eaten yet. ok, stopping work for today.
* dredg orders food and peruses the list of things
<lamont> hrm.. actually, I might should maybe bootstrap gnat where I can... doko?  thoughts?
<Slant> What is the proper method of reporting Universe bugs? Or perhaps, a better question, where was I supposed to look to find out how? I wasn't able to find anything.
<dredg> malone :)
<dredg> it's your friend.
<dredg> mmmm
<dredg> happy...
<dredg> *ahem*
<dholbach> sladen: it will be  http://launchpad.ubuntu.com/malone , but for now, it's either this channel or ubuntu-users@lists.ubuntu.com
<dholbach> argl
<dholbach> Slant: it will be  http://launchpad.ubuntu.com/malone , but for now, it's either this channel or ubuntu-users@lists.ubuntu.com
<Slant> Ahh, ok.
<Slant> Should I try using malone irght now, or just e-mail the list?
<sabdfl> Slant: malone!
<Slant> I tried. No access.
* Slant shrugs.
<koke> dholbach: UniversePriorityList is great :)
<dholbach> good
* koke subscribing :)
<dholbach> :-)
<koke> dholbach: how did you made it?
<koke> some script?
<dholbach> i chucked the list together and then used a python script by mvo :-)
<koke> can you pass me that stuff, it'd be great to have info about what has to be done for each package
<koke> or at least, what transition/section does it belongs to
<dholbach> just a sec
<tseng> anyone want to upload f-spot?
<dholbach> i completely lost track of what to upload
<dholbach> so just give it over here
<dholbach> :-)
<dholbach> url?
<tseng> well you cant get to my site
<ajmitch> hi
<ajmitch> UniversePriorityList looks big
<dholbach> it is due to UniverseDoesNotBuild
<dholbach> (which is not finished itself)
<dholbach> tseng: how do i get them?
<tseng> http://getsweaaa.com/~tseng/f-spot/ if you can
<tseng> if you cant i guess i will have to put it somewhere else
<dholbach> cant
<tseng> smarterits.com/~brandon/f-spot
<tseng> uh
<tseng> wtf
<koke> tseng: were you the mono guy?
<ogra> koke, he still is
<koke> ok, so I guess you also maintain tomboy
<koke> http://www.reigndropsfall.net/index.php?itemid=149
<koke> "
<koke> Hmm, that Tomboy icon is really out of place (for any icon theme). If only theyd use a sane icon like the one that Jakub made a couple of months back"
<koke> what do you think about that??
<koke> we could include a new HIG compliant icon in the ubuntu package while upstream realises the icon needs to be changed :)
<tseng> koke: i think ive asked him to give me a working patch for it
<tseng> and i give him credit, he took a nice stab at it
<tseng> but it doesnt work
<tseng> if anyone else has hacked in a new icon, ill happily take it.. dont really have time to waste on it
<koke> http://jimmac.musichall.cz/weblog.php/Artwork/LowresTomboy <-- the icons are missing :(
<crimsun> test-building wxwidgets2.5-2.5.3.2ubuntu3 (fixes FTBFS on ppc, which is holding up at least wxvlc)
<dholbach> libnet-ph-perl fixed
<ogra> yay+#
<dholbach> looking at xlockmore
<ogra> bah, morgue, we have a screensaver *g*
<dholbach> it seems to be quite popular on the debian end
<ogra> hehe, was kidding...i know
<dholbach> oh... forgot the smiley :-)
<dholbach> xlockmore looks goooood
<dholbach> what about icewm?
<dholbach> is it fixed?
<koke> tseng: http://koke.amedias.org/2005/03/24/tintin-is-not-hig-compliant/
<mdz> dholbach: did you have luck prioritizing according to the popcon data?
<koke> do you like that?
<dholbach> mdz: YEAH! wiki/UniversePriorityList
<mdz> dholbach: that list looks just right; great work
<dholbach> mdz: but the list is as incomplete as wiki/UniverseDoesNotBuild - since the rebuilds will still be taking 2-3 days
<mdz> kdebase is in main now
<tseng> koke: dude jimmac made icons
<dholbach> mdz: yeah, it's not perfect and i'll try to poke the right people :-)
<mdz> it builds and is installable, too
<tseng> koke: they just need a patch to a few files
<koke> tseng: where the hell they are??
<dholbach> mdz: must be still on one of the lists (python could be)
<tseng> koke: one minute dude
<koke> <koke> http://jimmac.musichall.cz/weblog.php/Artwork/LowresTomboy <-- the icons are missing :(
<tseng> its on his blog way back
<tseng> oh, damn
<mdz> if you guys can get only the top 25% or so of that list, I think you'll be in good shape
<dholbach> i can't stop the constant-headache i have, when i think about all the broken packages (and those to come)
<mdz> try not to worry about the ones to come; we'll make it easy to exclude them from reports
<dholbach> from user reports to? :-)
* koke goes for icewm, great wm :)
<koke> it seems just lacks a build-dep on libxinerama-dev
<lamont> koke: quite likely, actually
* ogra is impressed by the cleanness of the afterstep package...
* koke pbuilding icewm
<ogra> dholbach, didnt you talk about libdumb yesterday ? i thought you touched it
<dholbach> erm
<dholbach> i think i uploaded it already
<ogra> its still on the X lost
<ogra> list
<dholbach> chuck it out
<dholbach> please
<crimsun> [libdumb_0.9.2-5ubuntu1.dsc] 
<ogra> dholbach, sure :)
<schweeb> think I'll take a look at x2vnc, I know a bunch of peeps that use it
<koke> schweeb: I use it sometimes
<koke> actually I'm not sure if I use x2vnc or x11vnc
<schweeb> it's in the fails to build list ;)
<schweeb> x2vnc allows you to control a remote display using VNC protocol with your local X keyboard and mouse
<schweeb> similar to synergy, etc...
<tseng> koke: if you recall jimmacs hd crashed
<dholbach> looking at ntop
<schweeb> x11vnc exports your X session for control
<schweeb> since I've never tried fixing any of these packages before - the source that failed to build is the same you get with apt-get source X? or are those sources stored elsewhere
<dholbach> apt-get source <bla> is fine
<schweeb> k, good
<tritium> good night all
<schweeb> cool, think I figured out x2vnc already :D
<dholbach> did ajmitch fix licq?
<dholbach> ah no.. he's working on it
<ogra> is still tagged in the xosd list...
<schweeb> standard naming convention is to add -ubuntuX onto the end of the debian version, right?
<ogra> no dash
<schweeb> k
<dholbach> schweeb: what typ of package is it?
<ogra> blah-1.2.3-1 becomes blah-1.2.3-1ubuntu1
<dholbach> native package?
<dholbach> no   .orig.tar.gz and  .diff.gz?
<schweeb> no, it's not native
<dholbach> alright
<schweeb> debiain version is x2vnc 1.6-3, so new version would be x2vnc 1.6-3ubuntu1
<schweeb> *debian
<ogra> yup
<dholbach> looking at 3ddesktop
<schweeb> lintian complains about capital letter/article as first word in description, fix or leave alone?
<dholbach> the latter
<ogra> hehe, the first :)
<dholbach> if it's your package or you plan to maintain it, ... :-)
<ogra> schweeb, up to you
<schweeb> dissension among the ranks!
<schweeb> yes, I guess if it gets synced with debian again, it'd be a kinda pointless fix
<dholbach> it's the workload, that makes us less anal
* ogra has to often discussed with elmo about lintian warnings of NEW packages....
<dholbach> s/us/me
<ogra> so i try to avoid them always
<ogra> lamont, ping
<schweeb> that gsf-sharp package passes lintian, except for the netlibs thing that it doesn't know about ;)
<dholbach> hope we get a new lintian soon ;-)
* koke getting asleep
<ogra> night koke
* dholbach gives koke a cookie
* ogra gives koke a pillow
<koke> I'll put icewm into th list tomorrow if it builds while I'm dreaming
<dholbach> koke: you rock
<crimsun> may I remove modconf from UniversePriorityList?  It doesn't exist in Ubuntu.
<dholbach> it does
<ogra> yeah, koke, that was really a nice workday from your side, respect
<dholbach> apt-cache showsrc modconf
<crimsun> what the
<ogra> unfortunately
<dholbach> it's for the 2.4-kernels
<ogra> crimsun, we also have kernel 2.4
<koke> ogra: I just want a script to generate all the .desktop files :)
<ogra> yeah
<crimsun> argh, does it even build?
<dholbach> koke: i want a fix-all-broken-builds-script
<lamont> ogra: ak
<koke> maybe my target for tomorrow
* crimsun checks buildLogs
<koke> dholbach: but you have to begin at something
<koke> :D
<dholbach> at broken-builds ;-)
<lamont> schweeb: I should really fix that same lintian error in postfix, eh?
<ogra> lamont, how hard would it be to add a http-refresh meta tag to the http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/byDate/today.html page, my ctrl and R keys start getting glossy
<dholbach> 3ddeskop fixed
<schweeb> lamont: hah
<koke> ok, sounds reasonable
<lamont> ogra: uh, tell me what it should say... :-)
<ogra> yes
<ogra> easy
<ogra> ?
<ogra> wait...
<lamont> hrm.. will actually be work..
<lamont> today, the file consists of nothing but one-line-per-logfile, appended blindly as I go...
<lamont> no <head>, etc.
<lamont> now I'm gonna have to notice that I'm starting a new file...
<lamont> and if you tell me I have to tack something on the end of it, that'll be annoying enough to not do it.. :-(
<ogra> in the header put something like <meta http-equiv="refresh" content="600">
<ogra> ah, no head, darn
<lamont> well, can I have a head, but no <body></body> tags?
<ogra> hmm, might work....
<lamont> <a href="../x/xlockmore/1:5.13-2ubuntu1/xlockmore_1:5.13-2ubuntu1_20050324-0219-amd64-successful">xlockmore_1:5.13-2ubuntu1_20050324-0219-amd64-successful</a><br>
<Amaranth> i'm confused, how do i add something to MOTUNewPackages?
<lamont> that's what the current lines all look like...
<lamont> Amaranth: login (upper right), then click on edit above the page.
<dholbach> poking xdiskusage
* ogra looks at the code
<Amaranth> no, i know that
<Amaranth> where do i add it?
<lamont> oh.  a harder question.  sihg.
<Amaranth> that first table with my name as NEW Maintainer?
<dholbach> in the table
<dholbach> yeah
<schweeb> alright, I got x2vnc fixed... I'm gonna upload to my site... should I sign the pkgs or what? (and how to do so manually)
* lamont searched for a while to find the login button, you see...
<dholbach> schweeb: just upload it
<schweeb> k
<ogra> lamont, i'll think about it, probably a frameset or something ..... tell you tomorrow ....
<lamont> schweeb: if you dpkg-buildpackage, it defaults to signing,
<lamont> otherwise, debsign is your firiend
<koke> my firefox is crashing very strangely today
<lamont> ogra: sure
<koke> dholbach: could you please update http://amedias.org/~koke/misc/UniversePackagesWithoutDesktopFile for me??
<ogra> koke, thom just built 1.0.2
<koke> I've extracted the window managers from the list
<koke> ogra: I guess it's a mozex problem
<koke> when I click the textarea it freezes eating my cpu
<ogra> oh, youre using extensions...
<dholbach> schweeb: be sure to tell elmo he should whitelist your emailadress
* Amaranth looks at https://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/MOTUNewPackages :)
<ogra> ah great afterstep is done...
<dholbach> koke: what shall i change?
<koke> just replace the wiki page with the URL's content
<dholbach> why dont you do it yourself?
<dholbach> dont you have a wiki account by now? :-)
<koke> <koke> when I click the textarea it freezes eating my cpu
<dholbach> oh nice
<dholbach> alright
<koke> I can try tomorrow anyway
<koke> but I've killed firefox about ten times in the last minutes
<crimsun> koke: 1.0.2 is in main.
<koke> crimsun: yeah, and update-notifier is telling me I have 241 updates
<koke> but I usually update at the university :)
<dholbach> koke: done
<koke> and I'm on holidays now :)
<koke> dholbach: thanks
<dholbach> de rien
<schweeb> where should I document that I've fixed this package now?
<dholbach> debian/changelog
<crimsun> \m/
<crimsun> http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/w/wxwidgets2.5/2.5.3.2ubuntu3/wxwidgets2.5_2.5.3.2ubuntu3_20050324-0138-powerpc-successful
<koke> ypopup.cc:118:2: warning: #warning "FIXME: this logic needs rethink"
<koke> icewm comments are quite curious
<ogra> dholbach, that != what
<schweeb> dholbach: I mean to tell others that I've fixed the package, so they don't duplicate work
<dholbach> ahhhhhhhh ok
<schweeb> ;)
<ogra> schweeb, on which wiki page did you find it ?
<schweeb> UniversePriorityList
<dholbach> xdiskusage fixed
<schweeb> should I do it on there, or on UniverseTODO
<ogra> hmm, must be on another list too
<schweeb> err MotuTODO
<ogra> crimsun, with gtk2 ?
<schweeb> ogra: DoesNotBuild
<crimsun> ogra: yep.
<ogra> wooot
<ogra> schweeb, then there...and rip it off the Priority list
<schweeb> wtf is the diff between "Done" or "Taken Care Of"
<ogra> dholbach, ?
<dholbach> if it has passed all 4 buildds on http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/byDate/today.html
<koke> w0w, I was already tired anough but this http://www.burtonini.com/blog//life/india-2005-03-24-02-18 ...
<dholbach> then it's done
<schweeb> is "Taken Care Of" where you speak for the fact that you intend to fix something?
<dholbach> yeah or you fixed it and hope the buildds say the same :-)
<schweeb> forgive my green-ness, I'm just trying to do shit right the first time, and learn quickly
<dholbach> schweeb: you're doing admirably well
<koke> pbuilder is cleaning!!! icewm fixed
<ogra> schweeb, six months ago we werent better ;)
<dholbach> i was worse
<koke> I'll sleep really tight
<schweeb> kinda helps that I've used debian day-in/day-out for the last 2 years
<schweeb> as an admin and an desktop user
<ogra> yeah
* ogra has his last cigarette...
<ogra> nearly 4am
<koke> icewm uploaded, see you
<koke> I'm running out of batteries :)
<koke> bye
<ogra> hmm, we probably should announce malone in ubuntu-users
<dholbach> koke
<dholbach> bye
<ogra> dholbach, i've given up to try this, he's always gone to fast if he says that :)
<schweeb> argh,I really wish there was a way to stay always logged into the wiki
<dholbach> schweeb: i'll upload your packgae, right?
<schweeb> yea
<dholbach> i'll check it :-)
<schweeb> http://schweeb.org/~chris/ubuntu
<dholbach> unstable -> hoary
<dholbach> in the changelog
<dholbach> apart from that... good
<schweeb> err whoops
* schweeb blushes
* Amaranth is going to feel really stupid
<dholbach> not to worry :-)
<Amaranth> there are tools that generate all this stuff, aren't there?
<Amaranth> the control and changelog and etc
<schweeb> dh_make and friends
<dholbach> schweeb: i change and upload it, right?
<schweeb> dholbach: you mean you're fixing it, or you want me to?
<dholbach> schweeb:   dch -i Dhoary   <--- helps
<Amaranth> hah, i took the files from pymusique and have been modifying them by hand
<dholbach> schweeb: i do it and spare you the pain
<schweeb> heh
<schweeb> alright, cool
<dholbach> schweeb: you tested it? it installs?
<schweeb> yes
<dholbach> rock
<dholbach> uploaded
<schweeb> cool :)
<schweeb> man, editing the wiki sucks... I can't get ffox to search the textboxes
<dholbach> schweeb: take a seat in the back row and enjoy:  lists.ubuntu.com/archives/hoary-changes/2005-March/thread.html  and  http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/byDate/today.html
<ogra> Amaranth, be carful with that, one tends to make errors or leave old junk in....better use the debhelper scripts
<Amaranth> ogra: *shrug*, all i really had to do was change every pymusique to menueditor and edit the control file
<Amaranth> both are python apps that install the same way
<schweeb> dholbach: :D
<ogra> Amaranth, try building it in pbuilder and let lintian check it...
<Amaranth> lintian?
<ogra> yup
<schweeb> lintian rocks
<dholbach> did my 200th upload *headbang*
<crimsun> nice!
* ogra applauds dholbach
<Amaranth> why do i need pbuilder to use lintian?
<dholbach> Amaranth: as a packager you need both
<dholbach> pbuilder to build packages in a clean environment, lintian to perform nitpicking-checks
<ogra> Amaranth, pbuilder cares for the building like the buildd does, lintianb chacks for all the other chacks
<ogra> outch, time for bed i think...
<dholbach> s/chacks/cracks ;-)
<ogra> dholbach, come on, 4am, i'm allowed to make typos...
<schweeb> dholbach: so I need to tell elmo to whitelist my email?  is that for when I start being able to upload stuff on my own (hopefully eventually), or do I need to it now?
<dholbach> you don't need it
<dholbach> but it's nicer
<dholbach> because 1) you get a receipt mail by the buildd  2) you appear with your full name on hoary-changes
<dholbach> and 3) elmo asked for it
<schweeb> k
<lamont> and 4) you get reject notices
<lamont> if any
<ogra> schweeb, you'll see your packages even before you are allowed to upload, e.g. when dholbach uploads for you, you get katies nice ACCEPTED/REJECTED mails
<dholbach> so just ping him tomorrow, tell him your name and mail adress and that you're going to be rocking MOTU soon
<schweeb> alright
<schweeb> elmo's in the UK?  what's the time offset between US->UK I always forget
<ogra> 8h ?
<crimsun> where are you based, schweeb?
<ogra> donno exactly and i guess it depends if youre west or east
<schweeb> k, sounds about right
<schweeb> EST
<crimsun> schweeb: he's approximately 5-6 hours ahead of you
<crimsun> we're (EST) -0500 GMT
<Amaranth> whee, running pbuilder
<crimsun> ok, time to test on amd64.  Sigh.
<ogra> crimsun, sigh ?
<schweeb> ah, it's based off Greenwich... /me never even connected the 2
<crimsun> ogra: I've been burned by 64-bit so many times that I just make it a point to compile on both arches now
<crimsun> err, i386 and amd64
<ogra> ah... i dont compile on 32bit anymore :)
<crimsun> :)
<schweeb> I need to get a 64bit machine
<dholbach> ok pals, i'm off to bed
<dholbach> good night
<schweeb> night
<crimsun> bye daniel
<ogra> night dholbach, i'll follow up right away
<schweeb> crimsun: so you're EST? where you at? MI here
<dholbach> *wave*
<crimsun> schweeb: NC
<schweeb> nice
<ogra> night all
<crimsun> night oliver
<schweeb> nice. guess I have "unstable" in my gsf-sharp package too
<schweeb> whoops
<schweeb> is there a config setting in devscripts.conf or something where I can tell it to always use hoary?
<Amaranth> heh, pbuilder just found me an error in my control file :P
<Amaranth> i forgot to build depend on python-dev
<schweeb> which is the point of pbuilder ;)
<crimsun> Amaranth: python2.4-dev, currently, please
<Amaranth> oh, i just did python-dev (>= 2.4)
<crimsun> ok, that'll work
<Amaranth> ok, so how do i use lintian?
<schweeb> lintian blah.deb
<schweeb> and I think you can do lintian -c blah.changes to check from a changes file...
<Amaranth> http://rafb.net/paste/results/kXgVVQ88.html <--d'oh
<Amaranth> are any of those serious?
<dredg> all very easy to fix
<dredg> `lintian -i' will give you full descriptions
<Amaranth> well, i don't have a man page :P
<dredg> write one
<Amaranth> heh, can it just say the command and a short description?
<Amaranth> there isn't anything else to it
<crimsun> if it's missing a man page, that's not RC
<crimsun> (release-critical)
<crimsun> you should definitely look into implementing one, however
<Amaranth> i can make one, once i learn how :P
<crimsun> it's very straightforward
<Amaranth> i've got it down to just the man page
<Amaranth> i'll make one of those and upload -2 for consideration for universe
<Amaranth> meh, i suck at creating man pages
<schweeb> ugh, this ethereal source is organized hideously
<Amaranth> ok, -2 uploaded without a man page
<schweeb> is it appropriate to put a strict python2.4 dep in the build-deps?
<crimsun> yes
<schweeb> where it's currently just "python"
<schweeb> (no version whatsoever)
<schweeb> okay
* schweeb is looking into ethereal/ethereal-dev
<crimsun> gkrellm here
<Amaranth> don't suppose i could get anyone to take a look at http://dev.realistanew.com/menu-editor/
<Amaranth> it's pretty small
<schweeb> crimsun: yea, I was gonna do that, but no amd64 box
<crimsun> Amaranth: sec.
<crimsun> Amaranth: Debian-native?
<Amaranth> ?
<Amaranth> no, i don't think so
<Amaranth> the unstable bit in the changelog is just me being stupid
<crimsun> but you wrote it, correct?
<Amaranth> yep
<crimsun> ok, lintian will complain about the versioning scheme then
<crimsun> since you're both upstream and the ubuntu maintainer, it's probably best if you reversion it to just 0.4.2
<crimsun> then tack on the ubuntu1
<crimsun> -> 0.4.2ubuntu1
<crimsun> unless, of course, you absolutely want 0.4.2-2ubuntu1
<Amaranth> done
<crimsun> whoa
<crimsun> ok, debian/rules needs to be cleaned
<crimsun> all right, let's start from the top.
<crimsun> make sure the tar.gz extracts into menu-editor-0.4.2ubuntu1
<crimsun> eek!
<crimsun> you have conflicting source/package names.
<Amaranth> eh?
<Amaranth> I really didn't want to be the maintainer of this. :P
<crimsun> both source and [binary]  package are listed as "menueditor", but your tar.gz extracts into menu-editor
<Amaranth> I don't even know where to being.
<Amaranth> err, begin
<crimsun> ok, well first of all, you need to rename the directory to 0.4.2ubuntu1
<Amaranth> the one i'm building out of?
<crimsun> second of all, decide what names you'll use for source and binary packages
<crimsun> yes
<Amaranth> can i use the same thing for binary and source?
<crimsun> yes, but source must match the base of the directory if it's non-Debian/-Ubuntu-native
<crimsun> in other words, if you choose menueditor to be your source package name, then the tarball must extract to menueditor-0.4.2ubuntu1
<Amaranth> ok, so if i call both of them menu-editor and rename the dir to menu-editor-0.4.2ubuntu1 it should be good?
<crimsun> yes
<Amaranth> actually, i don't want to confuse people already using it, i'll make it menueditor
<crimsun> ok, I recommend you use the python policy
<crimsun> which means you'll need to bump debian/control:Build-Depends to debhelper (>= 4.2.28)
<crimsun> and uncomment dh_python in debian/rules
<crimsun> furthermore, you can replace debian/control:Depends's python (>= 2.4) with ${python:Depends}
<crimsun> definitely make the long description more verbose
<crimsun> the synopsis should probably hint toward being a python-based menu editor for the freedesktop.org xdg standard
<schweeb> ugh, this python switch is a pain in my ass
<Amaranth> how about "A simple menu editor for GNOME 2.10 that can edit and add new entries."
<crimsun> schweeb: cheer up, it's not so bad!
<crimsun> Amaranth: is it limited to just gnome 2.10, or might another DE that uses fd.o's xdg utilise it?
<schweeb> crimsun: I'm trying to figure out how the ethereal package got the python stuff into site-packages, they're not using a setup.py, and I don't see any explicit python2.3 declarations, it's annoying
<Amaranth> Well, if _might_ work but I've got it pretty well setup for GNOME only.
<Amaranth> It will more then likely not run at all or be unable to do anything with other DEs.
<crimsun> Amaranth: ok, that's a good start then.  You might want to note that while it supports the fd.o xdg spec, it may or may not work with other DEs  [which of course, you'll want to ensure it does if you'd like it to pick up usage] 
<crimsun> Amaranth: there are some fairly useless sections in debian/rules that can be deleted, like the whole lib section
<crimsun> be sure you call python2.4 explicitly, or use a shell variable
<crimsun> PYTHON = python2.4
<crimsun> ...
<crimsun> $(PYTHON) setup.py build
<crimsun> ...
<Amaranth> lib section?
<Amaranth> I don't even know what that is.
<schweeb> which it'd be great if ethereal did it that way
<schweeb> @_@
<crimsun> Amaranth: "# shared library versions, option 1"
<crimsun> that block
<crimsun> I highly recommend you consider cdbs
<schweeb> mmm cdbs rules
<crimsun> cdbs will simplify many, many things
<Amaranth> well, that can come later :)
<Amaranth> new try uploaded
<Amaranth> still ubuntu1, dunno if i should have changed that since it isn't in any repo yet
<crimsun> nah, not really worth changing
<crimsun> although I tend to use ubuntu0~1, ubuntu0~2, ubuntu0~3, ...
<crimsun> then when it's all fixed, I bump it to ubuntu1
<Amaranth> good idea
<crimsun> you're missing a COPYING (license) file
<crimsun> that's critical
<crimsun> although debian/copyright might be able to pass
<schweeb> question, why would a -dev package (ethereal-dev) have an explicit depend on debhelper and cdbs... ?
<Amaranth> lintian told me not to have that
<crimsun> Amaranth: since it's native, all right, that's true
<crimsun> sorry, need to jet for a bit, be back
<Amaranth> ok
<Amaranth> thanks for your help
<schweeb> oh nice... it's a manual copy of this python script to site packages in the rules file, jesus
<Amaranth> o_O
<schweeb> W: ethereal source: changelog-should-mention-nmu
<schweeb> ^^^ what's that mean
<Amaranth> use -i
<Phython> Hi, given that I am a DD and I uploaded a package to debian, to get it into ubuntu, I should add the package to the MOTUToSync page and then it should someone else will rebuild it?  Or should I build the package on Ubuntu, sign it, put it in my own repo and put it on the MOTUTodo list?
<schweeb> which package?
<schweeb> and does it already exist in ubuntu?
<Phython> schweeb: yes, retchmail does, libwvstreams4.0 doesn't, libxplc doesn't
<Phython> oh yeah, libwvstreams3 is also in base, so I dono't want to mess with that
<schweeb> I'm not authoritative or anything, but I imagine if you fix all those packages to build on ubuntu, someone will at least consider syncing/adding them
<schweeb> as long as they're not in main
<Phython> schweeb: I'm put libwvstreams4.0 in universe until after hoary is released then let it move to main with a new wvdial
<Phython> schweeb: I'll put up a repo soon enough with this stuff
<schweeb> yea, that's what they'll be lookin for
<schweeb> alright
<schweeb> got ethereal fixed, test building now
<HostingGeek> <Amaranth> Then why use debmaker?
<HostingGeek> *g*
<Amaranth> HostingGeek: Ignored.
<HostingGeek> You know i only cp that here so others can tell you why
<HostingGeek> as hardly anyone repects me
<herve> hi!
<Amaranth> g'night all
<dholbach> hey!
<crimsun> morning daniel :-)
<dholbach> hey daniel!
<dholbach> is there ANY package that DOES build in universe: wiki/UniverseDoesNotBuild ?
<ogra> what for ? we have apt-get.org :-P
<ogra> morning all
<dholbach> hey ogra
<dholbach> updated UniversePriorityList will take me a while
<dholbach> will have to do it by hand
<ogra> hrm
<ogra> dholbach, seen my mail to the other daniel ?
<dholbach> erm
<crimsun> which, me?
<ogra> nope robitaille
<crimsun> ah
<dholbach> oh ROCK
<ogra> i invited him to become MOTU, i think its about time
<dholbach> yeah good thinking
<dholbach> our list system is becoming a bit of a PITA
<dholbach> may i ask you to remove a package you fixed everywhere from all lists?
<crimsun> I'm pretty sure I already do that
<dholbach> alright
<dholbach> just wanted to impress it on you all again
<dholbach> it's not perfect and i hope i have a better system for breezy
<Amaranth> crimsun: I'm using cdbs now. :)
<dholbach> ARG
<dholbach> ARG
<dholbach> ARG
<crimsun> Amaranth: great!
<dholbach> UniverseDoesNotBuild is fucked up now
<dholbach> because of buildd fuckup
<Amaranth> crimsun: The help you were giving me last night with the rules file seemed to have broken it (was making an empty data.tar.gz) so I figured I might as well switch.
<Amaranth> :)
<crimsun> guh, I don't understand how diacanvas2 built on ppc 6 days before
<crimsun> and suddenly it just ... doesn't?
<dholbach> i give up on lists
<dholbach> i COMPLETELY give up
<dholbach> see you in half an hour
<dholbach> fuck
<crimsun> go get some coffee
<crimsun> :-)
<Amaranth> crimsun: Think you could take another look at it?
<ogra> dholbach, relax
<crimsun> Amaranth: sure, but I'm really tired; do you mind if I look in the afternoon during a break at work? (~8 hours)
<Amaranth> I'll be asleep but sure. :)
<crimsun> Amaranth: just leave your away log on, and I'll prefix comments with your nick
<Amaranth> away log?
<Amaranth> how do you make one of those? :P
<crimsun> do you use irssi?
<Amaranth> no, xchat
<Amaranth> just pm comments?
<crimsun> hmm, when you set /away in irssi, it logs statements addressed to you and pms
<crimsun> here, test with xchat right quick
<Amaranth> ok
<crimsun> (let me know when you've set away)
<Amaranth> oh, i did before i said ok :P
<crimsun> k
<crimsun> Amaranth: this should show up in your log when you come back from /away
<Amaranth> what log? :)
<crimsun> is it in your server window?
<Amaranth> err, i don't have one
<crimsun> k, nevermind, I'll just pm you
<Amaranth> hehe
<Amaranth> ok
<crimsun> k, quick nap, then back to work.
<dholbach> Burgundavia: hey
<dholbach> crimsun: sleep tight :-)
<Burgundavia> salut
<dholbach> Burgundavia, comme va-tu?
<Burgundavia> xchat actually crashed on my
<Burgundavia> s/my/me
<koke> hi all!
<Burgundavia> salut
* koke looking for uploader for icewm
<koke> some has put it in the Done list?!
<dholbach> might have been me
<dholbach> i was messing around with the lists yesterday
<dholbach> sorry for that
<koke> do you know if the ubuntulinux.org zope has webdav enabled??
<dholbach> erm
<dholbach> dunno at all
<dholbach> koke: where is it? i'll upload it
<HostingGeek> Hi daniel!
<dholbach> hi... whats your name?
<HostingGeek> Is it possible to take mallarts LEGAL GPL package of that itunes app that Amaranth is working on (who ingore me for ome weird reason) and stuff it into universe some day so we can install it any not get dependce problems because ubuntu has a diffrent version of gstreamer?
<koke> http://www.amedias.org/~koke/debian/hoary/icewm_1.2.18-1ubuntu1.diff.gz
<dholbach> koke: i'm on the phone, but will take care of it
<Amaranth> HostingGeek: You're off ignore now. PyMusique needs libfaad2 from CVS.
<koke> ok, I'm going to make something for lunch now
<Amaranth> HostingGeek: Everything that uses libfaad2 would have to be patched and recompiled.
<dredg> Amaranth: fool. chuck him back on ignore :)
<HostingGeek> Amaranth: which is in universe
<Amaranth> HostingGeek: The release version. We need the one from CVS.
<HostingGeek> Amaranth: well i said SOME day
<HostingGeek> Amaranth: and not for hoary
<Amaranth> Sure, when libfaad has a new release.
<HostingGeek> koke_cooking: if your cooking why not put into ##cooking for some tips ;)
<HostingGeek> Amaranth: there is a lot of cvs stuff inside the reps
<dredg> wonderful justification.
<HostingGeek> Amaranth: and i belive grumpy will be used for cvs snapshot builds of gnome
<Amaranth> grumpy doesn't exist
<Amaranth> name changed to breezy
<HostingGeek> Amaranth: no
<HostingGeek> Amaranth: there is going to be grumpy AND breezy
<HostingGeek> grumpy will be like sid/experiMENTAL
<HostingGeek> Amaranth: you can read my thread on the forums where daniels replys
<HostingGeek> and explains
<dredg> HostingGeek: are you a troll?
<HostingGeek> dredg: did i just troll?
<HostingGeek> dredg: the answer is no if just in case you are wondering
<dredg> actually, are you a script that contains 'print "I want $randpackage in ubuntu"' running from cron?
<HostingGeek> dredg: if i was a motu i would be able to do it my self
<dredg> last i checked, that wasn't a requirement
<HostingGeek> dredg: umm thats only not a requeirment for 1 or 2 packages
<HostingGeek> dredg: but really i want to rebuild 40 packages or so
<HostingGeek> and my talents going to waste...
<HostingGeek> :P
<dredg> so you reckon that instead of trying to get MOTU it's better to get someone here to do it for you?
<dredg> how does this sound: go away.
<dholbach> HostingGeek: being a MOTU is about involvement
<dholbach> and dedication
<dholbach> and being active yourself
<HostingGeek> dredg: i will do it IF i could
<HostingGeek> but as ubuntu hates me
<dholbach> not about complaining, asking others to do stuff
<HostingGeek> i'll never see them being THAT friendly to me
<dholbach> you just complain again
<HostingGeek> yes
<dredg> HostingGeek: it's very simple, if you have nothing better to do than demand things, you have no real business being here
<dholbach> everyone in here had assembled some piece of code and asked others kindly to review it
<HostingGeek> and i contuine untill i could help
<koke_cooking> HostingGeek: I think the point here is that there are huge lists about packages to fix before release
<koke_cooking> so we can't afford new packages atm
<HostingGeek> koke_cooking: and i can fix some of the,
<HostingGeek> koke_cooking: and i can fix some of them
<dholbach> HostingGeek: you're in here nearly ALL day, you really should have figured out, how things work
<dholbach> i don't even doubt that your intentions are good
<dredg> that, and all of us here are doing this on our own time. telling us what you want doesn't get results.
<dholbach> but your approach is completely wrong
<HostingGeek> and i will fix them if i could with having to edit the wiki for every damb fix
<dredg> the only motivation for any involvement is because you want to, for whatever reason.
<HostingGeek> dredg: you get me wrong
<dredg> then please, give me a better impression of you
<dholbach> dredg: exactly, stop this discussion here
<dholbach> it only wastes time
<Burgundavia> HostingGeek: The correct questions to ask, for those of us who aren't that experienced are ones that pertain to specific problems. Such as "blah does build right with this error. Any ideas?"
<HostingGeek> dredg: I am a type of person that wants stuff and WILL do it myself IF I could but as I am not a motu i can't
<dholbach> HostingGeek: show involvement, and we'll appreciate it
<HostingGeek> dholbach: Yes but for every damb fix i need to edit the wiki
<dholbach> HostingGeek: please drop it: Burgundavia is not MOTU too, even koke isnt yet
<dholbach> and they work hard nevertheless
<dholbach> HostingGeek: that's how things work, if you don't like it, don't consider it and stop wasting people's time
<Amaranth> HostingGeek: I'm not a MOTU either. I made the package for my stuff and offered to maintain it. You could too.
<HostingGeek> well how do fix stuff with out being a MOTU
<dredg> enough. if you're not prepared to put the work in yourself then don't ask anyone else here to do it for you.
<dholbach> HostingGeek: i upload packages for other guys, that's how things work
<HostingGeek> dredg: I am!
<dholbach> people don't get uploader status for nothing
<HostingGeek> dholbach: i don't need the power to upload
<koke_cooking> HostingGeek: have you really been in this channel all this time?? :)
<dholbach> then fix a package, upload it somewhere and ask us to review it
<schweeb> like this:
<schweeb> dholbach: ethereal
<schweeb> hehe
<HostingGeek> dholbach: i need the power to be able to help with out aving so do 2 extra steps
<HostingGeek> *having
<dholbach> which steps?
<HostingGeek> currently if i want to help i need to do extra useless steps
<dholbach> WHICH steps?
<dholbach> editing the wiki?
<koke_cooking> HostingGeek: you can't expect nobody to trust in your packaging abilities the first time
<HostingGeek> 1) Upload the packages to somewhere else
<HostingGeek> 2) Get it reviewed
<koke_cooking> HostingGeek: why not??
<HostingGeek> all i want to have to do is send in a patch
<HostingGeek> for the fixes
<schweeb> seriously though, I fixed ethereal for python 2.4, and it's on my site for someone's review... this should also fix kismet since it failed on installing ethereal-dev... http://schweeb.org/~chris/ubuntu
<koke_cooking> I can do it, I don't think you're more special than me :)
<dholbach> HostingGeek: hear my FINAL word: everyone in here sticks to the rules, they all dedicate their time and it's great to have them in a team - if you don't intend to stick to the rules, GO AWAY
<schweeb> and, off I head to work, later
<koke_cooking> HostingGeek: uploading a .diff.gz is quite similar to send a patch
<HostingGeek> koke_cooking: The problem is if its a simple fix i don't want to have to upload 10MB
<dholbach> a diff.gz won't be 10mb
<koke_cooking> HostingGeek: http://www.amedias.org/~koke/debian/hoary/
<koke_cooking> look at there
<HostingGeek> koke_cooking: a diff.gz to the diff.gz?
<dholbach> debuild -S  will make up a source packge
<koke_cooking> HostingGeek: the diff.gz are the changes between the .orig.tar.gz and your version
<dholbach> store .dsc and .diff.gz somewhere and they will in the most cases be less than 100k
<HostingGeek> koke_cooking: i know
<koke_cooking> but the orig.tar.gz is already in the arvhive, you don't have to upload it
<HostingGeek> koke_cooking: but what if i want to make a SIMPLE patch to a diff.gz
<HostingGeek> i can't submit a patch
<dholbach> HostingGeek: do the diff.gz or leave it
<HostingGeek> i need to upload the whole diff.gz
<dholbach> HostingGeek: please stop complaining
<Amaranth> hey, instead of fighting with HostingGeek could someone poke at http://dev.realistanew.com/menu-editor/ ? :)
<koke_cooking> HostingGeek: oOh, some kbs are killing me :)
<koke_cooking> HostingGeek: what's the problem???
<HostingGeek> dholbach: you know the problem with gdeb it needed a simple edit in the CONTROL file why the hell do i need to upload 100KB
<koke_cooking> mv *.diff.gz *.patch, upload it and be happy :P
<dholbach> HostingGeek: i kindly ask you to read the conversation again, if you don't like the rules we ALL stick to (even those on #ubuntu-devel), don't consider being motu
<HostingGeek> koke_cooking: i have 5KB/s upload
<koke_cooking> HostingGeek: me 10KB/s
<dholbach> HostingGeek: you waste more than 100kb on COMPLAINING
<koke_cooking> and have no prob
<HostingGeek> dholbach: is a motu someone who upload if yes i don't want that
<dholbach> that's how it is
<koke_cooking> dholbach: xD
<dredg> HostingGeek: if you don't want any of this, then why are you here?
<HostingGeek> dholbach: if a motu is some which helps in universe then yes
<koke_cooking> HostingGeek: then, become a friend of malone :)
<HostingGeek> malone?
<HostingGeek> dholbach: rename motu to uploader of something its make its a lot easier to understand
<Burgundavia> launchpad.ubuntu.com/malone/
<Burgundavia> Amaranth: I like the look of the menu editor. Did you do it?
<Amaranth> yeah
<Burgundavia> Burgundavia: nice work
<koke_cooking> HostingGeek: ok, but only after you go to debian and ask to turn Debian Developers into Debian Uploaders
<Burgundavia> Amaranth: nic work
<Amaranth> thanks
<Burgundavia> I am a little tired right now
<Amaranth> trying to get it into universe for hoary :)
<dholbach> HostingGeek: and please listen this time: if you ever complain (about the course of action we take) again, i will ask the community council to have you banned from this channel as well, BECAUSE we are goddamn busy and were as patient with you as we could be, but we set up rules and everybody sticks to them
<HostingGeek> Amaranth: i'll unoffically review your package :P
<dholbach> it simply doesnt lead anywhere and it steals time
* koke_cooking leaving to lunch
<HostingGeek> Amaranth: where is the orig?
<dholbach> i don't tell you to "clear off", but if you don't like this then don't consider it
<Amaranth> HostingGeek: It's the .tar.gz
<HostingGeek> Amaranth: rename it to the corrent terming in the future
<Amaranth> HostingGeek: Tell cdbs
<HostingGeek> Amaranth: no diff?
<Amaranth> HostingGeek: It's an original package....
<HostingGeek> Amaranth: the orig should not contain /debian in it
<HostingGeek> that should all be in .diff
<dholbach> HostingGeek: ack?
<Amaranth> HostingGeek: Tell cdbs
<HostingGeek> cdbs?
<HostingGeek> ack?
<dholbach> i said something to you just 5 minutes ago
<dholbach> i wanted to know, if you could acknowledge
<HostingGeek> dholbach: no one said i don't follow the rules as at this point of time i am not part of the helpers....
<dholbach> but you complain about them
<HostingGeek> OHH! https://launchpad.ubuntu.com/malone/ is just what i wanted!!
<dholbach> and it drives everyone mad, because those are pointless discussions
<HostingGeek> I can file patches using that right?
<dredg> Amaranth: ah. upstream has a debian/ dir in there?
<HostingGeek> dredg: he is upstream
<dredg> right.
<HostingGeek> and upstream shouldn't have it
<Amaranth> So yes. ;)
<dredg> IMO you should still split it out.
<Amaranth> How?
<HostingGeek> because other distros will kill you
<HostingGeek> Amaranth: you want me to fix up your package :)
<Amaranth> HostingGeek: no.
<dholbach> Amaranth: do a <name>_<version>.orig.tar.gz of it
<Amaranth> How? I'm new to all this.
<dholbach> then add the debian/ crack to the extracted tarball
<HostingGeek> Amaranth: get the orig tarball with out the debian stuff
<dholbach> then run   debuild -S -sa
<dholbach> (and you'll have a nice .diff.gz to it
<dredg> Amaranth: create an orig.tar.gz without the debian.... what dholbach said.
<HostingGeek> and do what dholbach said to it
<HostingGeek> WooHoo! 3 people confusing Amaranth lol
<Burgundavia> Amaranth: wondering about the add new entry stuff. Might it be better to bring up another window, to make it a bit more clear when you need to enter the info?
<HostingGeek> Amaranth: you understand what todo still?
<Amaranth> whoa, the FreeBSD GNOME Team is sending me bug reports
<HostingGeek> Amaranth: is it that you have a /debian dir in the orig?
<HostingGeek> (the bug report)
<Amaranth> no
<HostingGeek> https://launchpad.ubuntu.com/malone/ should be make more clear
<HostingGeek> it was JUST what i was looking for
<Burgundavia> HostingGeek: discuss in #launchpad, that is being worked on
<dholbach> koke: icewm uploaded
<koke> dholbach: thanks :)
* dredg goes back to work
<dredg> laters
<Burgundavia> cya
<dholbach> bye dredg
<HostingGeek> Burgundavia: as bob2 set the topic it wont be long till i get banned he bans me from every channel i enter even if i don't say a word :(
<Burgundavia> HostingGeek: that is an issue you are going to have to deal with. I wish you luck doing so
<dholbach> schweeb: ethereal was fine?
<Treenaks> Burgundavia: it's mostly a thing of listening & reading vs shouting & demanding
<Treenaks> s/thing/issue/
<Burgundavia> Treenaks: indeed
<HostingGeek> ok so i send https://launchpad.ubuntu.com/malone/ .desktop files and stuff like that?
<Burgundavia> HostingGeek: bugs for universe go there. malone is in testing right now
<HostingGeek> Burgundavia: only bugs? :( not patches or stuff like that?
<Treenaks> so yes, you can open "wishlist" style bugs, and attach .desktop files, I guess
<Burgundavia> HostingGeek: it is bug tracker
<schweeb> dholbach: yes, it was fine... the only problem with the packages, was there were 2 files going into python2.3/site-packages, so I just changed that to python2.4 (they don't have a setup.py or anything)
* koke has enough food to start eating now
<koke> see you
<koke> :D
<HostingGeek> Treenaks: YAY! I am so happy now!
<schweeb> which is what ethereal-dev failed on on install, python2.3/site-packages didn't exist
<Treenaks> HostingGeek: "bugs" can be wishlist features etc. as well
<dholbach> schweeb:  fgrep 2.4 debian/  helps you there
<HostingGeek> Treenaks: default settings?
<Treenaks> HostingGeek: what do you mean?
<HostingGeek> Treenaks: there are some apps that the default setting is not friendly
<schweeb> dholbach: yea, it took me a while to figure out that they were manually moving the python files in the rules file...
<dholbach> schweeb: i'll have a look
<Burgundavia> HostingGeek: if it would go in bugzilla, it goes into malone
<schweeb> dholbach: but, be back in an hour
<schweeb> later
<dholbach> schweeb: if it'S ok, i'll upload it
<dholbach> wb ogra
<HostingGeek> Burgundavia: hmm why use malone when there is a bugzilla?
<Burgundavia> salut ogra
<HostingGeek> malone == python?
<Burgundavia> HostingGeek: bugzilla is for main, malone is for universe
<Burgundavia> HostingGeek: eventually, malone will be for everything
<HostingGeek> ah ha
<hsprang> hy alltogether :)
<HostingGeek> Burgundavia: this is because bugzilla list thingy... which make it take for ever to load?
<ogra> hey, everybody
<HostingGeek> well i'll start helping on sunday hopefully
<Burgundavia> salut ogra
<hsprang> hy ogra :)
<hsprang> Does someone know id there will be any MOTU's at the CCC Easterhegg event this weekend in Hamburg, Germany?
<hsprang> s/id/if
<Amaranth> hey, how do i create a key to sign this package? :)
<HostingGeek> WTF malone is not open source
<Burgundavia> HostingGeek: none of launchpad is
<Treenaks> *headdesk*
<ogra> hsprang, oh, its this weekend, darn
<ogra> hsprang, i was on the one in duesseldorf (my company sponsored the line for them)....sadly i cant this weekend :(
<hsprang> ogra: I wouldn't go either if it wouldn't be just around the corner for me :)
<ogra> heh, ok, i'm in the eifel, its a serious distance :)
<Amaranth> ok, i think i got this
<Amaranth> what files should i upload?
<Amaranth> bah wtf
<Amaranth> it used the ubuntu1.tar.gz
<hsprang> but i still feel guilty because the weekend would otherwise be the first time since a week that i could do some ubuntu work :(
<Treenaks> Amaranth: the difference between native and non-native packages is essential
<Amaranth> whatever that means
<Amaranth> hehe
<dholbach> hsprang: don't feel guilty
* dredg nods
<dredg> packages should only be native if they are designed to run on $distro and _nothing_ _else_
<Amaranth> ok, i'm just going to upload all of these and let you guys figure out the differences
<ogra> hsprang, nah, no need to feel guilty, ubuntu is (and will be ;) ) always here, easterhegg is to special to miss
<Amaranth> :P
<hsprang> dholbach: i hoped somebody would say this - thank you! :)
<dholbach> :-)
<ogra> hsprang, and if only for the nice cups and t-shirts ;)
<Amaranth> http://dev.realistanew.com/menu-editor/ <--can someone tell me if i don't need some of those?
<hsprang> ogra: it's the first time for me, but i already read something about special cups...
<hsprang> Amaranth: I am not completely sure, i "think" if you go for maintainer-approval,  only the *.dsc, *.orig.tar.gz and *.diff.gz should be needed
<Amaranth> i don't think i have a diff.gz
<Amaranth> how do i make that?
<hsprang> Amaranth: that is documented very good and detailed in the debian new mainainers guide
<hsprang> is your package considered to be a native package?
<Amaranth> native?
<ogra> hsprang, go there, its worth it :) and spread some ubuntu at the conference ;)
<Amaranth> i wrote it for hoary, appearently i wrote it well enough for it to work on freebsd too :)
<hsprang> ogra: hmm, good idea, i should burn some live and install cd's and bring a FAI install server :)
<ogra> yeah
<dholbach> schweeb: ethereal uploaded
<hsprang> Amaranth: hmm, if it can and will be used on other distributions, too, and you will provide a source package in generic *.tar.gz form, it will not be a native package
<Amaranth> ok
<hsprang> ogra: I'm not up to date with the state, would you suggest preview or array7 cd's?
<hsprang> Amaranth: and if it's not native, the source files necessary fo maintainers to review are the one's mentioned above
<hsprang> Amaranth: otherwise, you'd only need a *.tar.gz and a *.dsc file - because there are no patches to be applied for the program to have everything needed to build the *.deb
<hsprang> Amaranth: if I think about my last words, if you are the upstream author yourself, and you will create a *.tar.gz source distribution file where no patches need to be applied to build the deb, but others cann easily buidl their freebsd binary, too, it might be native, too
<hsprang> sorry for the typos
<ogra> hsprang, sorry, i another meeting, array7 is newer
<herve> hi
<ogra> hi herve
<hsprang> ogra: i knew about that, just thought newer isn't always better :)
<ogra> might have new bugs but even new fixes ;)
<herve> kinda like hoary ;-)
<dholbach> hey herve
<Amaranth> so if this doesn't generate a *.diff.gz then there are no changes? :)
<Amaranth> there shouldn't be
<dholbach> herve: one of your packages didnt work out
<dholbach> herve: dont remember which one
<dholbach> herve: poker3d
<herve> dholbach, either poker3d or m2crypto
<herve> ha
<Amaranth> ok, http://dev.realistanew.com/menu-editor/ should be ready to go
<dholbach> Amaranth: put it on MOTUNewPackages
<Amaranth> using dh_make and cdbs goodness this time
<schweeb> dholbach: awesome
<dholbach> (if you didnt already)
<Amaranth> dholbach: it is
<herve> dholbach, refused or failed to compile?
<dholbach> alright
<dholbach> herve: the latter
<herve> I can't find it in the buildlogs
<dholbach> herve: it didnt build here
<dholbach> herve: didnt even debuild -S
<schweeb> dholbach: what happens with kismet, is it just gonna get sent through the buildd again after that gets successfully built?
<schweeb> kismet died on the build-dep
<dholbach> schweeb: ask lamont please
<schweeb> ok
<herve> dholbach, it's in my /var/cache/pbuilder/result, I wonder what could have happened
<dholbach> herve: i'll paste you the log in some minutes
<lamont> schweeb: define 'died'
<schweeb> lamont: well, ethereal-dev was broke, it's a build-dep for kismet
<lamont> define 'broke'
<schweeb> just a sec, I'll show you the build log
<lamont> failed during install?  apt refused to install it?
<schweeb> yea, it failed during install
<schweeb> so the build-deps weren't satisfied
<lamont> and buildLogs/Lists/... has it as 'Building' still, or 'Dep-Wait'?
<schweeb> lemme check
<lamont> schweeb: hoary lists should be in buildLogs/Lists/hoary.all.$arch
<lamont> hoary-test lists are at buildLogs/Test/Lists/hoary.all.$arch
<trulux> hallo
<schweeb> lamont: whoops, I accidentally pasted in #ubuntu-devel
<schweeb> lamont: and here's the build log
<schweeb> http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/k/kismet/2004.04.R1-5/kismet_2004.04.R1-5_20050323-1031-i386-failed
<schweeb> http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/Lists/hoary-test.all.i386
<schweeb> failed - no reason given... but it clearly was the build-dep if you look at the build log
<ogra> schweeb, Setting up ethereal-dev (0.10.4-3ubuntu1) ...
<ogra> /var/lib/dpkg/info/ethereal-dev.postinst: line 7: /usr/bin/python2.3: No such file or directory
<schweeb> yea, that
<schweeb> I fixed ethereal-dev, what's the right thing to do about kismet?
<ogra> schweeb, is it already in the archive ? (eth...-dev)
<schweeb> uploaded about an hour ago
<schweeb> maybe less
<schweeb> http://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/hoary-changes/2005-March/004059.html
<schweeb> so, probably not in the archive yet, but will be (it gets submitted to buildd first, right?)
<ogra> schweeb, yop, then it gets build and _then_ it gets moved to the archive, so it might just not be there yet
<schweeb> right right
<schweeb> what I was asking was just what's the right way to make sure kismet is attempted to build again after it's in the archive ;)
<lamont> schweeb: I've been kicking all the build failures (that show up as email to me) into Failed...
<lamont> with no reason.
<schweeb> ah
<lamont> so.  What we have is a package that has a build log, and is marked Failed (but would be Building if it were hoary)
<lamont> for that, you'll need to pester lamont to give it back
<lamont> oh wait.  that's me.
<lamont> :-)
<schweeb> lol
<lamont> schweeb: which architecture?
<schweeb> I think it failed on all 3, lemme check
<schweeb> it failed on i386, ia64 for that reason
<schweeb> amd64 for a diff reason :-/
* schweeb investigates
<herve> haa... amd64 build failures... :-)
<schweeb> on amd64 because snacc is not installable
<schweeb> I don't have and amd64 to do anything with... and the ppc version was "given-back" cause there were umpteen dep problems
<schweeb> s/and/an/
<schweeb> lamont: so it should be good on i386 and ia64... other than that, I'm useless ;)
<lamont> schweeb: yeah -that particular ppc buildd is my current annoyance... then I'll kick kismet around some
<schweeb> lamont: so, should i consider it marked off, or just make a note next to kismet saying the ethereal-dev dep should be fixed?
<lamont> schweeb: uh, dunno - I'll kick it back to the buildd and let you look at it again, I guess.
<schweeb> alright
<schweeb> build log will be in the same place?
<lamont> oh - this is hoary-test?
<schweeb> yea
<lamont> build-dep issues there should be failures
<lamont> so: start with a current hoary system
<lamont> apt-get source kismet
<lamont> dpkg-buildpackage -B -rfakeroot
<lamont> see if it fails or passes
<schweeb> ok
<lamont> I'll accept some transience, but anything other than success in hoary-test is probably bad.
<schweeb> lamont: builds fine on i386
<lamont> ok - will kick it
<schweeb> installs cleanly too :p
<schweeb> man, I need pain killers... this lady in our ATM department is loud as hell and giving me a killer headache
<koke> hi again!
<herve> hi!
<lamont> schweeb: sorry - finally given back
<schweeb> hmm?
<schweeb> kismet didn't build?
<dholbach> see you later
* schweeb pokes lamont 
<lamont> schweeb: at :37, I tossed it back into the hoary-test ring.
<lamont> it'll get to the front of the queue _sometime_
<lamont> and then it'll try to build again
<schweeb> alright
<koke> wow, I see blender in the priority list, do you know what is the problem??
<koke> dholbach: do you have the raw lists anywhere??
<koke> I *really* need to connect them :)
<herve> koke, dholbach is away for a moment
<koke> herve: ok, I leave the question in the air :)
<schweeb> what do you need? the build log to see what's wrong?
<schweeb> hrm, the build log in test says "successful" for blender
<schweeb> for all of the 4 arches
<schweeb> http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/b/blender/2.36-1ubuntu1/
<koke> schweeb: the problem is
<koke> it's on the priority list, but I don't now if it's a python transition, a doesn't build,...
<schweeb> looks like someone may have fixed it... it may mistakenly be on the list
<schweeb> or maybe it doesn't install
<schweeb> http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/b/blender/2.36-1ubuntu1/
<schweeb> it failed a few times there
<koke> I have a dirty solution :)
<koke> https://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/UniversePriorityList
<koke> I've added a search link next to each package
<koke> it looks for package+Universe
<koke> blender - uses scons to build, causes problems when using ccache (used by buildd). Suggested workaround does not appear to work.
<schweeb> nice :)
<schweeb> now it'd be even cooler if lamont's stuff was indexed for faster navigation
<lamont> schweeb: patches welcome. :)  it's about 20 minutes of python programming so far, because "it's temporary"
<schweeb> lol
<schweeb> python ain't my thang
<koke> schweeb: what do you mean by "faster navigation"??
<koke> well, I know the concept :P
<koke> but what do you want to have exactly?
<herve> schweeb, need python help?
<schweeb> no
<schweeb> koke: rather than having to click Test/k/kismet/kismet-blahblah, it'd be cool to just search for kismet and come up with all of the kismet build logs ;)
<koke> extracted XFCE packages from the list :)
* lamont will, um, deal (yeah, that's the right word) with the hoary-test false-failures in a minute or 10
<schweeb> herve: don't plan on learnin python anytime soon, don't need another language to get jumbled in my head :p
<ogra> koke, hi
<herve> schweeb, that's why I volunteered to help :-)
<schweeb> guess I should do some work for my real job for a while, hehe
* schweeb goes back to the samba3 PDC migration for a few
<herve> see ya!
<koke> ogra: hi!
<ogra> koke, see the other win ?
<koke> hey, I've added numbers to priority list, so you can group the pacakges :)
<schweeb> nice
<koke> hehe, just upgraded a computer from warty to hoary, and the new artwork is cool
<ogra> yeah
<koke> the funny thing is update-notifier tolds me about three updates: my icewm packages :D
<ogra> YEAH
<koke> the bad thing is 800x600 is a *big pain*
<koke> the video card has 11 years
<ogra> hmm, talk to daniels
<koke> ogra: it's not a software problem :)
<ogra> oh
<ogra> ok
<koke> the software problem are some windows bigger than screen
<koke> it's going to be a computer "for dummies"
<ogra> ouch....
<koke> its only mission is to serve as ERP
<koke> for a small enterprise
<koke> anyway, it's a pentium II 350, with 64MB and gnome 2.10 runs quite smooth
<ogra> woah, with 64MB ?
<ogra> how did you manage to install ? didnt think that was possible
<koke> ogra: `free` actually says 60
<ogra> woah
<ogra> unbelivable...
<koke> I installed XFCE, but realised gnome was running quite well
<koke> (for not intensive use) :P
<ogra> yeah, but that it is usable at all is very impressing
<schweeb> I'm guessing it sits there swapping all day
<schweeb> similar to a windows on the same configuration ;)
<schweeb> s/a//
<koke> Mem:            60         59          1
<koke> I guess so :)
<koke> I put 250M of swap
<schweeb> running w2k on 64mb of ram is evil.
<koke> running w2k is evil by itself :P
<schweeb> think the kernel itself consumes 64 (maybe 128)
<Treenaks> schweeb: s/on 64mb of ram//
<schweeb> necessary evil at work :0/
<schweeb> er :-/
<koke> schweeb: work is evil too :P
<schweeb> true...
<schweeb> my boss is definitely evil
<Treenaks> most bosses are
<schweeb> swear I can see devil horns on him
<schweeb> rich bastard
<dholbach> re
<dholbach> koke: what do you need?
<koke> IIRC, there are plans to run synaptic as user, and separate the root part?
<koke> dholbach: I can't remember
<koke> I guess the search hack will be enough by now
<koke> https://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/UniversePriorityList
<Treenaks> dholbach: we need to sign keys some time... you're one of the few people who aren't "close enough" according to my trustdb
<dholbach> Treenaks: mvo and i signed
<Treenaks> dholbach: yeah, but I forgot to sign mvo in Matar
<dholbach> ah i see
<ogra> dholbach, Treenaks left before the keysigning party :/
<Treenaks> ogra: no, my plane did :P
<ogra> heh
<Treenaks> dholbach: so, where in Germany are you? N, E, S or W? :)
<ogra> Treenaks, around the corner
<dholbach> W
<Treenaks> dholbach: ah, the "close to the Netherlands" part :P
<dholbach> dortmund
<dholbach> to be exact
<Treenaks> *looks at map*
<ogra> the "nearest to the netherlands part
<ogra> "
<Treenaks> ogra: :P
<Treenaks> oh yeah it's really close
<dholbach> how many kilometers?
<dholbach> ah herve is gone again
* schweeb would like to visit Germany some time
<ogra> dholbach, amsterdam....
<Treenaks> dholbach: 235km
<Treenaks> 2 hours by car
<dholbach> oh cool, amsterdam
<schweeb> heh
<dholbach> coooooooooool
<Treenaks> dholbach: not quite Amsterdam :) but almost
<dholbach> then we should meet there :-)
<Treenaks> dholbach: ok, cool :)
<dholbach> i'll grab mvo as well :-)
<Treenaks> :)
<schweeb> wish I remembered more German too
<schweeb> been 6 yrs since I learned it in hs
<Treenaks> dholbach: ok, but when? :)
<dholbach> Treenaks: after UDU
<Treenaks> dholbach: of course
<dholbach> rock
<Treenaks> yay for beer + keysigning :)
<dholbach> woohoo
* ogra is sad, we already signed...
<schweeb> man, wiki's been slow as hell lately
<schweeb> so, if anybody's got some time, and wants to review my gsf-sharp package, feel free to... it's beneficial to beagle being in universe (beagle can index ms docs and stuff w/ it)... pretty sure jdub intends to upload beagle eventually
<schweeb> I know of 1 prob in it, which I can fix before upload (it's set to 'unstable' branch, rather than 'hoary' in changelog)
<tritium> Good afternoon.
<schweeb> afternoon
<schweeb> I take it you're in the US? it has to be evening in europe by now ;)
<tritium> Yep
<tritium> :)
<schweeb> MI here
<tritium> IN here, neighbor
<schweeb> nice
<tritium> Yeah!
<schweeb> guess the eastern half of the US is the place to be... can't think of any ubuntu related people in the west that I know of
<tritium> schweeb, not yet, but I'll be moving back to NM in August
<schweeb> ahh, nice and warm there
* schweeb is envious
<tritium> yes, mostly :)
<Treenaks> (anyone interested in a DVB-T receiver + antenna, supported in Linux)
<Treenaks> </offtopic>
<schweeb> just curious, what's the normal amount of time it usually takes some thing to make it from upload -> archive.u.c
<dholbach> schweeb: wiki/Uploads answers that
<schweeb> thx
* schweeb checks
<tritium> How's it going dholbach ?
<dholbach> tritium: hey... nice - how are you?
<dholbach> ogra: could i have a drumroll?
* dholbach turns on all the flashy lights
* ogra rolls the drum
<tritium> I'm fine, thanks :)
<dholbach> may I introduce you all to....
<ogra> yayaya
<dholbach> our NEW MOTU
<dholbach> welcome aboard: koke!"
* ogra jumps up and down extatically
<dholbach> :-)
* dholbach hands koke the microphone
<ogra> hey koke
<koke> I'm here :)
<koke> thanks all :D
<dholbach> koke: how does it feel there? :-)
<schweeb> congrats
<koke> well, as all you know I'm fighting with an old computer now
<koke> so it's a mixture of feelings
<schweeb> lol
<koke> :P
<ogra> hehe
* dholbach can imagine :-)
<herve> re
<schweeb> I'm fighting with Windows right now, if it makes you feel better
<dholbach> wb herve
<ogra> hey herve
<tritium> Congratulations koke :)
<ogra> herve, you missed the fun
<dholbach> herve: poker3d uploaded
<herve> dholbach, rock!
<dholbach> yeah :-)
<herve> ogra, I shopped for baking cookies meanwhile :-)
<ogra> ah, yeah, thats indeed a good excuse
<dholbach> :-)
<koke> uff, I really love clearlooks, but "Simple" is quite simpler, so lighter :)
<herve> what happened, anyway?
<ogra> yeah, as the name says :-P
<dholbach> our new MOTU was announced
<dholbach> we all had fun "on stage" :-)
* dholbach turns of the microphone
<dholbach> off
<dholbach> koke made it in :-)
<herve> haggai, sh*t
<herve> argh...
<herve> (how the hell I typed his nick so many times...)
<dholbach> i started writing this months motu report, so if you could all *try* to remember, what you did and drop me a line in either IRC or dh@mailempfang.de i'd be really grateful
<herve> I remember I complained a lot :-)
<schweeb> hah
<dholbach> or rather tell, what the last month in the MOTU crowd was like
<dholbach> just a brief statement, thanks :-)
<herve> laughs and tears :-)
<herve> anyway, I'll seriously think about it
<dholbach> this was the last one: http://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2005-March/005006.html
<dholbach> but i'd like to have it livelier
<dholbach> s/have/make
* tritium checks his apache logs to see if his packages have had any reviewers drop by
<dholbach> i'll start some review action, after i was in the showers
<dholbach> brb
<schweeb> odd
<schweeb> ethereal failed on ppc looks like...  but it built successfully before
<dholbach> herve: could you please tell elmo to whitelist your mail adress?
<koke> I'll have to go soon
<ogra> enjoy your new motuness :)
<herve> dholbach, how so?
<dholbach> herve: just tell him: state your name and mailadress, so you could work with the motu gang
<herve> koke, how does it feel to be a motu, by the way?
<koke> herve: well, my right foot is sleepy
<koke> :P
<herve> dholbach, it's not related to membership at all?
<dholbach> no
<dholbach> just tell him, no mail, nothing
<herve> will do, but the oven is calling me :-)
<ogra> koke, you sent the signed CoC to mako already, right ?
<koke> ogra: yes, I think he confirmed it, but not sure
<ogra> ok, elmo just asked in -devel
<ogra> please confirm to him that you did
<dholbach> siretart: ping
<dholbach> siretart: fdclock uploaded
<dholbach> siretart: i did 3ddesktop yesterday as well :-)
<siretart> short re (I'm in an internet cafe).
<dholbach> alright
<siretart> dholbach: w000t! great news! :)
<dholbach> just wanted to tell you
<Burgundavia> dholbach: <mako> well my brother is in the city for the next 3 hours only.. so it will be later this evneing :)
<siretart> thanks! :)
<Burgundavia> from ubuntu-doc
<dholbach> siretart: thank YOU!
<siretart> I'll hope I can fix some more packages this weekend.. I have to see how well my studiing for exam next thursday's going..
<dholbach> don't put too much pressure on you
<siretart> I'll see. I see it as good recreation from thinking in Operating Systems :)
<dholbach> yeah, absolutely :-)
<dholbach> siretart: it's nice of you putting work into ubuntu :-)
<siretart> ok, gotta back to table, others are waiting :)
<dholbach> *wave*
<dholbach> have fun
<siretart> dholbach: I have to thank YOU (the Motu team) doing such a great job in maintaining universe!
<dholbach> i speak for myself: it's a pleasure... it really is
<ogra> siretart, actually you already took part :)
* schweeb may have to yell at tseng for some more mono or muine deps again
<dholbach> schweeb: now that you say it: i can only review the packaging itself, because i'm on amd64
<schweeb> heh
<dholbach> but i will do
<schweeb> coolness
<dholbach> Burgundavia's packages are first
<dholbach> because they're hosted like 10m from me :)
<dholbach> Burgundavia: you there?
<Burgundavia> yep
<schweeb> hrmph
<schweeb> muine's dying on something with gettext/libintl
<herve> dholbach, done
<dholbach> herve: gooood
<dholbach> siretart: did you ask elmo to whitelist your mail adress?
<herve> dholbach, though I don't get the point of being whitelisted without a valid GPG key
<dholbach> it's just a list of mail adresses
<dholbach> nothing more
<herve> dholbach, could you please upload sip-qt3, now sip4-qt3 is updated?
<dholbach> herve: sure... schweeb's mono package is first :-)
<schweeb> dholbach: I did mention that I forgot to change the branch -> hoary?
<dholbach> you want to change it and i upload herve's stuff first?
<schweeb> I can just update the source, right? you don't care about a binary
<dholbach> yeah
<schweeb> does it matter if it's first upload would be revision 3? should I kick it back to 1?
<dholbach> yeah 1 is nicer
<dholbach> herve: building
<dholbach> herve: you generated NEW packages with your transition?
<dholbach> sip4-qt3 that is
<schweeb> dholbach: alright, uploaded src
<herve> dholbach, NEW source package?
<dholbach> no
<dholbach> binary onew
<dholbach> one
<herve> dholbach, I added another conflicts to sip4-qt3
<herve> ha yes, a new binary one then
<dholbach> hmm
<dholbach> has to go over elmo's desk first
<herve> we agreed to still generate it for python2.3
<dholbach> yes
<dholbach> i update my box, maybe it's ok then
<herve> who want fresh... erm, hot cookies?
<herve> encolpe, thanks again ;-)
<dholbach> hmmmmmmmm, herve's baking again
<schweeb> wtf
<Burgundavia> I am glad I live on the other side of the world then
<schweeb> muine worked on my system like last week just fine
<Burgundavia> schweeb: restart x
<Burgundavia> schweeb: muine was broken for me until I did that
<schweeb> urgh
<schweeb> I figured it out
<schweeb> restarting X might help it
<schweeb> but I had to dllmap libintl -> libc.so.6
<Burgundavia> anyboyd else having a locales issue?
<schweeb> odd, I've never had to map libintl before...
<schweeb> even did it after a restart of X
<schweeb> I'll have to prod tseng and see what he thinks of it later
<herve> Burgundavia, how so?
<Burgundavia> when it tries to generate locales, it fails
<Burgundavia> about half way through
<herve> last libc6 upload seemed problematic
<herve> Burgundavia, I could generate a new locale
<ogra> herve, nope, the last should actually have fixed it
* ogra <- dinner
<encolpe> If you continue to bake, you will be married soon
<herve> encolpe, you bet :-)
<encolpe> ;)
<Burgundavia> herve: no when the locales was updated, the setting up of new locales fails
<Burgundavia> herve: just a sec and I will get the exact error
<Burgundavia>  sr_YU.UTF-8@cyrillic...LC_ADDRESS: `country_ab2' value does not match `country_num' value
<Burgundavia> LC_ADDRESS: `country_ab3' value does not match `country_num' value
<herve> re
<herve> Burgundavia, can't help further, sorry
<herve> I don't get how the buildd works
<herve> some packages get built before although they were uploaded after
<herve> and they're all urgency=low
<dholbach> hrm?
<rimbert> ugh
<herve> hey tritium!
<rimbert> hey herve :)
* rimbert is using irssi for the first time since gdm is broken and won't let him input his username
<dholbach> *arg*
<dholbach> :-(
<rimbert> :(
<tritium> if anybody has updated anything gdm-related, don't logout ;)
<dholbach> that's really strange
<ajmitch> good morning
<tritium> Yeah
<dholbach> hey ajmitch
<dholbach> tritium: anyhing in the logs?
<herve> tritium, what version of gdm?
<schweeb> http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/e/ethereal/0.10.4-3ubuntu2/ethereal_0.10.4-3ubuntu2_20050324-1622-powerpc-failed
<tritium> let me check...
<schweeb> this kinda worries me
<schweeb> it didn't fail before... and I didn't change anything other than the python stuff...
<tritium> yeah, in syslog, gdmgreeter: No default session link found.  Using failsafe gnome.
<dholbach> if you try with a new user?
<tritium> it doesn't take any keyboard input at all
<herve> schweeb, this build ends in a strange manner
<schweeb> indeed
<herve> tritium, maybe you can type but can't see it
<tritium> unfortunately not
<herve> which version of gdm theN
<herve> n?
<tritium> heh, I also had to reboot into 2.6.10-4 since nvidia stopped working today also with latest kernel update
<tritium> not my best day ;)
<tritium> let me check gdm version
<tritium> 2.6.0.7-0ubuntu3
<herve> here too
<tritium> it's somehow related to themes, though.  I don't think gdm was updated today
<herve> and I could log two hours and a half ago
<herve> ha maybe
<tritium> I'll be back...
<herve> hi master :-)
<dholbach> schweeb: maybe you add  python2.4-dev  to the build-depends
<herve> schweeb, the way the build fails makes me think of a hardware problem
<schweeb> dholbach: it doesn't actually compile any python afaict, and builds fine on the other arches
<tritium> thank goodness for startx
<schweeb> herve: yea, no real error... it's like it was ctrl+c'ed
<koke> hi all!
<dholbach> hey koke
<tritium>  not exactly jdubtv, but tritium can be seen here: http://www.mgmt.purdue.edu/info/cameracenter/public.asp?camera=drawingroom
<lamont> schweeb: was that ross?
<lamont> schweeb: in the top few lines - the buildd is named
<dholbach> royal
<lamont> scratch that thought
* lamont will look at it in a few
<herve> tritium, can you wave the hand? ;-)
<dholbach> haha coooooolk
<tritium> :)
<herve> tritium, seen you ;-)
<tritium> hi :-)
<dholbach> is that where you work?
<dholbach> :-)
<tritium> No
<herve> tritium, there's a cute girl on your right!!
<tritium> I had to go to the library, so I'm in the business school main floor
<tritium> herve, sure enough, but I'm married ;)
<herve> whoops!
<dholbach> ha... we'll be watching you now :-)
<tritium> heh
<dholbach> but where's the drawing?
<tritium> for some reason they call this the drawing room.  No idea why
<dholbach> that guy picked his nose... i saw it
<herve> UserLinux joining Ubuntu? it seems good
* ajmitch takes a look at tritiumTV
<schweeb> lamont: yea, in the logs it just randomly dies in the middle of a gcc... really odd
<tritium> ajmitch, it's nothing special ;)
<ajmitch> tritium: where are you in there? :)
<dholbach> ajmitch: on the computer
<tritium> ajmitch - I just waed
<tritium> waved
<ajmitch> hehe :)
<ajmitch> I saw you
<koke> wohooo, a happy day :)
<koke> <CIA-1> jbernal * update-manager/po/ (ChangeLog es.po): * es.po: Updated spanish translation.
<dholbach> YEAH
<koke> my first gnome commit
<tritium> awesome
<koke> more first things to come this night
<koke> now, I need a shower
<ajmitch> schweeb: it does look rather odd
* tritium hears "value added" here in the business school
<tritium> a lot
<tritium> me wife is here!!!
<ajmitch> almost like dpkg-buildpackage was the one killed
<dholbach> hi anne! *wave*
<lamont> schweeb: SIGILL?
* ajmitch drags firefox to the other screen so he can watch both
<dholbach> tritium: kiss her... for the camera :-)
<herve> dholbach, he may be shy :-)
<dholbach> herve: he isnt :-)
<tritium> did you catch it?
<herve> bye anne
<dholbach> :-)
<schweeb> lamont: you want me to paste you just the relevant portions?
<tritium> it might have been too fast
<schweeb> lamont: in PM?
<tritium> dholbach, herve:  I'll tell Anne you guys said hi :)
<dholbach> tritium: good :-)
<tritium> herve, good thing I wasn't talking to that girl you spotted, eh?
<ajmitch> otherwise we'd have lost a valuable member of the team ;)
<tritium> heh
<herve> tritium, you can, I'll warn you when she gets back -;)
<tritium> okay, thanks ;)
<herve> na, kidding... now get back to work, Big Motus are watching you ;-)
<tritium> will do!
<schweeb> bah
<schweeb> forgot to update my samba pdc scripts when I upgraded my ldap :-/
<dholbach> what's the problem about   http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/liba/libapache-request-perl/1.1-0.1/   ?
* schweeb quickly tries to figure out how to join to the domain
<lamont> schweeb: ethereal/ppc would be someone terminating the buildd with extreme prejudice
<schweeb> lamont: what's the simplest way to resolve this... I don't have PPC, and I didn't change more than 2-3 simple things relating to python when I fixed the package
<herve> good night all!
<tritium> Good night herve :)
<dholbach> good night herve
<schweeb> I changed the "python" build dep to "python2.4" and added teh PYTHON_VERSION variable in the rules file... that's it
<ogra> night herve
<schweeb> (and changed the created directory/moved python files to have PYTHON_VERSION in them)
<tritium> Sweet, my office-mate got a faculty position!
<dholbach> congrats to him! :-)
<tritium> :)
<lamont> schweeb: I gave it back - someone killed it
<lamont> either me, or elmo rebooting the box... was a messy morning
<schweeb> that makes me feel better
<lamont> whcih is to say, probably me
* schweeb chastises lamont
<lamont> dholbach: any hoary-test ppc build failure from before 20050324-1857 is uninteresting
<lamont> well, unless > 24 hours or so old
<dholbach> it was amd64 and ppc
<dholbach> both the same error
<lamont> yeah -not entirely sure what's up with apache perl there
<lamont> but they'll both be retried
<lamont> (1857 or so is when I gaveback everything marked as 'failed'
<dholbach> ok
<crimsun> hmm.
<dholbach> hi crimsun
<crimsun> hi dholbach
<crimsun> lamont: any clues http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/d/diacanvas2/0.13.0-4ubuntu1/diacanvas2_0.13.0-4ubuntu1_20050321-1234-powerpc-failed ?  diacanvas2 built on 15 March on ppc...
<lamont> crimsun: that one is an indicator of the cluster that caused the giveback at 1857 today
<crimsun> lamont: ah, ok.
<crimsun> whew.
<schweeb> lamont: another odd thing is that i386 said build completed successfully hours ago, and it hasn't been sent to archives, but ia64 and amd64 were... related to the other stuff?
<lamont> schweeb: different cluster, same result
<schweeb> alright
* lamont goes to find the rest of the files that got hit by #2.
<tritium> I'm shutting down guys.  See you later on!
<dholbach> argl
* ajmitch watches tritium pack up
<dholbach> we have some really cracked up cases on the list
<crimsun> dholbach: indeed
<dholbach> where you have hop along a list of 5 packages to find some dumb package build-depending on libtool1.4 which doesn exist on $random_arch
<crimsun> yep!
<crimsun> I was trying to figure out why vlc never built on ppc
<crimsun> so I started checking its b-d
<crimsun> sure enough, there was wxwidgets2.5 FTBFS
<crimsun> but totally nonexistent... that's a complete headache
<dholbach> yes
<dholbach> i like those especially:    maintainer-script-lacks-debhelper-token debian/libgtop-dev.preinst
<crimsun> oh, make the b-d libgtop2-dev
<crimsun> I just did that for gkrellm earlier
<dholbach> oh you fixed gkrellm already?
<crimsun> yes
<dholbach> must have missed it
<dholbach> ok
<dholbach> then... :-)
<crimsun> oh, sorry, I only updated UniversePriorityList
<dholbach> np
<dholbach> didnt invest much time yet :-)
<schweeb> lamont: you'll probably also wanna kick kismet again after you resend ethereal
* ajmitch should scratch licq off the list
<tseng> schweeb: huh?
<tseng> schweeb: i dont package either of those
<dholbach> python-gnome is nice:
<dholbach> checking if Python version >= 1.5.2... configure: error: too old
<dholbach> configure: error: /bin/sh './configure' failed for pygtk
<dholbach> i'll investigate
<schweeb> tseng: which, muine?
<tseng> schweeb: muine and mono
<schweeb> I was just gonna ask your advice
<tseng> go for it
<schweeb> I thought you did mono?
<tseng> er, not exactly?
<schweeb> ah
<schweeb> ok
<tseng> we use the debian packages where possible
<schweeb> well
<schweeb> on install of muine
<schweeb> I get:
<schweeb> Unhandled Exception: System.TypeInitializationException: An exception was thrown by the type initializer for Muine.Global ---> System.DllNotFoundException: libintl
<tseng> uh
<tseng> intltool?
<schweeb> and I have to dllmap manually
<tseng> uh
<schweeb> to libc.so.6
<tseng> wha?
<schweeb> I googled
<tseng> thats crack
<schweeb> yes
<schweeb> and I already have intltool installed
<tseng> there is alot of stuff mapped ootb
<schweeb> where is it mapped at, there's no /etc/mono/config
<tseng> well there should be
<tseng> unless its from my 1.1.4 build
<schweeb> hrm
<schweeb> chris@omglaptop:~$ dpkg -S /etc/mono/config
<schweeb> mono-common: /etc/mono/config
<tseng> yep was just doing that
<schweeb> but it didn't get installed
<schweeb> lemme purge and retry...
<tseng> you have mono-common, right?
<schweeb> yes
<tseng> wee
<tseng> crack.
<schweeb> ii  mono-common    1.0.5-1        common files for the Mono CLI runtimes
<schweeb> ohh
<schweeb> nm
<tseng> eh?
<schweeb> I was gonna say I thought the latest rev was 1.0.5-2, but guess not
<tseng> there is mono*-2 in sid
<tseng> but it just disabled building on s390
<tseng> we dont even have s390 buildd's afaik
<dholbach> we luckily dont
<tseng> that arch smokes serious crack
<tseng> and costs 3 arms and 5 legs
<schweeb> w... t... f....
* ogra would like one in his closet
<ogra> s/in/as ?
<schweeb> it worked just fine now
<schweeb> that's crazy.
<schweeb> I've purged like 4 times
<tseng> it was my magic touch.
<schweeb> oh, but it for some reason redownloaded mono-common 1.0.5-1
<schweeb> ??
* schweeb shrugs
<schweeb> guess as long as it works now
<schweeb> heh
<tseng> schweeb: no... -2 is in unstable
<tseng> we dont have it
<schweeb> yea, I dunno where I saw -2 at
<schweeb> I don't have any debian sources in
<schweeb> maybe mono-common wasn't fully downloaded on my box, and somehow dpkg didn't notice
<tseng> uh
<tseng> im pretty sure it checks md5, and gpg in our case
<schweeb> weird.
<schweeb> as long as it works now, I guess
<ogra> tseng, why the heck do you still answer b.f.i ?
<ogra> he obviously doesnt get it...
<tseng> ogra: we go way back...
<ogra> ah, k
<tseng> he is a hardened gentoo user
<tseng> been trolling me out of my mind for years
<ogra> i know
<tseng> so, I do what i can to keep him under control in #u-d, I guess
<tseng> in hardened we abuse him senseless
<tseng> (no CoC)
<ogra> yep
<tseng> so, whats new ogra
<ogra> nothing special...
<ogra> koke is MOTU
<tseng> hm
<tseng> cool.
<koke> somebody said koke?? :P
<dholbach> :-)
<ogra> i'm fixing hwdb bugs, dholbach cant stop uploading like a berzerk...
<ogra> so i would say snafu
#ubuntu-motu 2005-04-05
<dholbach> i simply hate when autoconf-stuff doesnt work in the buildd anymore
<schweeb> hrmm
<schweeb> think I found a bug in muine :)
* schweeb pokes tseng 
<schweeb> tseng: you wanna test something for me?
<tseng> what
<schweeb> tseng: make a path to some music with a '#' sign in it.... i.e. "Chevelle - Point #1"... and see if the files under it play in muine
<tseng> um
<tseng> /home/brandon/rips/mp3/Fugazi/Repeater + 3 Songs/03. Fugazi - Brendan #1.mp3
<tseng> hows that
<schweeb> the path
<tseng> uh
<schweeb> the directory I think does it
<schweeb> from what I can tell
<schweeb> cause I can play 'Chevelle - Open.ogg" when it's under /home/files/music but not under /home/files/music/Chevelle - Point #1
<tseng> so what happens for you
<schweeb> and it spews some glib assertions on the console
<tseng> and stops at 0:00
<tseng> yeah
<schweeb> yea, it just doesn't play... the play button goes to 'play' but does nothing
<tseng> right
<schweeb> so you see the same behavior?
<tseng> yes
<schweeb> I'll report upstream
<schweeb> ah, good, already reported and fixed
<schweeb> tseng: and if you're not horribly busy, wanna review those gsf-sharp packages I have... dholbach suggested I ask you... he's already reviewed them, as has jdub
<tseng> where to
<schweeb> http://schweeb.org/~chris/ubuntu
<schweeb> and write any comments in http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/MOTUNewPackages
<tseng> yeah dyde
<tseng> dude.
<tseng> it looks good
<tseng> im not going to build it atm, since they did
<tseng> i read the diff.gz
<dholbach> (i didnt build it)
<schweeb> jdub did I'm pretty sure, dholbach didn't
* tseng trusts jdub
<schweeb> :)
<tseng> but the debian/ looks fine
<schweeb> dholbach: should I get anyone else to review, or that good enough then?
<ogra> schweeb, did you fix the unstable/hoary thing ?
<schweeb> yep
<ogra> so i would say its ready to go in
<schweeb> excellent :)
<ogra> 3 reviews are enough
<koke> hey, discover pbuilds here
<ogra> uuuh discover...ugly
<trulux> tseng: better to discuss it here, read http://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-hardened/2005-March/000003.html
<tseng> hm
<dholbach> i thought you started off #ubuntu-hardened?
<trulux> dholbach: yeah
<ogra> so why do you need to discuss that here ?
<trulux> ogra: maybe it's of the interest of other people
<ogra> then i would join -hardened
* trulux takes his marbles and continues on #ubuntu-hardened
<dholbach> it's not exactly motu related, is it? not wanting to chuck you guys out
<trulux> dholbach: nah, it's ok, will continue on -hardened
<dholbach> right
<trulux> free beers there, anyone interested, join ;D
<ogra> heh
* dholbach has tea and cookies here
<ogra> trulux, sorry, nothing personal...
* dholbach isnt that hard. ;-)
* ogra neither
* dholbach throws 5 in the "stupid wordplay cash box"
<ogra> so no more uploads today it seems...
<schweeb> buildds get turned off or what?
<ogra> <elmo> right upload.u.c's going away!
<ogra> dunno for how long
<schweeb> ahh
<schweeb> hrm
<schweeb> what's you guys' opinion on this... Xen is in the Priority list... albeit about halfway down... but, it's a really really old version... I've been working on making packages of 2.0.5 myself... should I fix the old ones, or should I try getting mine good enough to upload?
<ajmitch> xen 2.0 packages are stuck in debian NEW queue
<schweeb> yea
<schweeb> doogie's packages are hackish
<schweeb> from what I saw
<schweeb> although, xen's python stuff may have to be used w/ python2.3... I don't know firsthand, but fabbione only got them working w/ 2.3
<ogra> looks like it takes a bit for uploads.ubuntu.com to come up again (see -devel)
<schweeb> haha
<schweeb> nice
<schweeb> .5TB fsck
<ajmitch> well, I guess it'll come back up in a few hours then ;)
<ogra> lets see waht elmo decides...
<schweeb> ogra: glad we share taste in filesystems... I won't touch reiser either
<ogra> :)
<schweeb> although I've had a couple of XFS incdents as of late... related to the 2.6.8 kernels
<schweeb> but playing out the journals fixed it
<ogra> yeah, thats the great thing with xfs, you'll be always able to fix it
<dholbach> good night... i'm off
<schweeb> night
<ogra> night dholbach
<schweeb> this may just be the "gentoo effect" but it seems to me that XFS is faster too
<koke> dholbach: night
<schweeb> (than ext2/3)
* schweeb heads home
<ogra> bye schweeb
* lamont fixes exim.
<lamont> well, shut it up anyway
<schweeb> hehe
* schweeb browses the priority list for something else to fix
<goedson> ogra: ping.
<crimsun> ok, gkrellm builds on "all 4" arches now, so removing from UniverseDoesNotBuild
<schweeb> cool
<schweeb> <3 gkrellm
* koke sleep()
<dholbach> gooood morning
<crimsun> morning dholbach
<dholbach> hey daniel
<dholbach> how are you?
<crimsun> not too bad, wrapping up here at work, about to head home
<dholbach> yes... that sounds good :-)
<dholbach> i worked the popcon data into our lists and saw that xfce is _quite_ popular
<dholbach> i must underestimated that :-)
<dholbach> so good to have you and jani working on it
<crimsun> I should ping elmo again regarding that, thanks for reminding me :)
<dholbach> yeah and write a mail to him about it too
<dholbach> that's what he told me wrt morgu-ification
<crimsun> ok. james@nocrew.org ?
<dholbach> i wrote to james.troup@canonical.com - i guess they all end up at the same place :-)
<crimsun> sure thing
<dholbach> hrm... i'm trying to find out, how to find all of those lines from file1 that are simply NOT in file2 (  grep -v -f file1 file2   didn't work) and i can't stop  diff  from worrying about line changes
<dholbach> ok... python's  a.__sub__(b) worked
<siretart> good morning
<dholbach> hey siretart!
<siretart> dholbach: I didn't ask elmo for whitelisting my email address. Shouldn't I first get a ubuntu "member" sending a signed the code of conduct to Mako?
<dholbach> do both
<siretart> I'm note quite sure about the procedures...
<siretart> ok I'll do
<dholbach> whitelisting is no problem and just requires adding your mailadress
<siretart> for what exactly I'm whitelisted then?
<dholbach> you'll receive the buildds receipt mails then
<dholbach> and your name will appear on hoary-changes@
<siretart> ah, ok. I'll do
<dholbach> good
* dholbach is dogwalking
<siretart> have fun, cu! :)
<dholbach> re
<dholbach> i'll have a look at bzflag
<tseng> dholbach: woooo
<tseng> i got the mail from Manoj
<tseng> about keysigning
<dholbach> YES
<dholbach> ROCK
<dholbach> FINALLY
<tseng> yeah
<dholbach> PAAAAAARTYYYYYYYYYYy
<tseng> its been weeks :(
<dholbach> but you'll make it
<dholbach> that's the only thing that counts :-)
<tseng> yeah.
<lamont> dholbach: btw, if you run across any  test failures where things bitch that /dev/null: permission denied, please let me know - I'm certain there are some.
<lamont> preferred format is in the form: sourcepackage_version (with epoc)
<dholbach> ok
<lamont> e.g.: kdeaddons_4:3.4.0-0ubuntu1
<dholbach> i'm all cracked up concerning the lists
<dholbach> but will do
<lamont> dholbach: actually, I expect I'll just run across all the log files looking for them once I'm awake again
<dholbach> take a rest
<dholbach> :-)
<dholbach> you deserve it
<dholbach> how can anyone make a native package of a 5mb tarball?!
<tseng> s/5mb tarball//g
<Treenaks> dholbach: why make a native package anyway?
<Treenaks> dholbach: (99% of the time, that is)
<dholbach> yeah
<dholbach> i'm glad you're on my side
<dholbach> i sometimes even cry the whole night in bed because of that
<Treenaks> dholbach: just hit the guy who did it in the head with some heavy, blunt object
<dholbach> i talked to my control-your-agressions group about that too, they said it was the wrong way to deal with it
<tseng> you could take it out on HG instead
<Treenaks> dholbach: it does feel good :)
* tseng jokes.
<Treenaks> tseng: :P
<Treenaks> tseng: maybe he made the package
<tseng> he doesnt do packaging, he just pushes other peoples work as his own
<Treenaks> oh yeah
<tseng> and then tries to hit me with blackmail and FUD
* tseng sigh.
<dholbach> bzflag fixed
<Amaranth> tseng: what other people's work?
<tseng> Amaranth: yours, some other guy csj iirc
<tseng> he kept reffering to cjs's package as "mine"
<Amaranth> heh
<tseng> because csj, who was here for 10 minutes total and never spoke, was apperantly told by me I would ban him
<Amaranth> he kept trying to make the package for my stuff
<tseng> which i definately said to no one but HG
<tseng> the next time I have to say something it will be a final warning
<tseng> ive been extremely patient
<Amaranth> * HostingGeek has quit (Ping timeout: 600 seconds)
<Amaranth> Remenic \o/
<Amaranth> hehe
<Amaranth> no one likes him
<tseng> it seems that way, heh.
<tseng> moving on
<ogra> Amaranth, he's our channel pet ;) (i never give up hope sadly)
<Treenaks> ogra: /j #ubuntu-ogra
<Treenaks> :P
<ogra> hehe
<tseng> i need to be getting ready for work
<tseng> cya tonight, hopefully with a workable gpg key
<ogra> yaeh
<tseng> manoj++
<ogra> yippie
<ogra> hey goedson
<dholbach> bin grad mit meinen 2 cousinen am english-konversieren
<dholbach> ich bin beeindruckt
<dholbach> oops
<goedson> Hi ogra.
<goedson> I've uploaded a new gnomebaker package implementing your requests
<ogra> goedson, changes done ?
<goedson> Yep.
<ogra> yeah, i'll look at it soon and do the upload ;)
<dholbach> ROCK
<Amaranth> dholbach: ever figure out what was wrong with gsf-sharp?
<dholbach> hrm?
<ogra> Amaranth, there is anything wrong ?
<Amaranth> err, i think that's you
<dholbach> i use amd64, so i can't really tell
<Amaranth> yeah, that's what i meant
<dholbach> what do you mean?
<Amaranth> why doesn't it build? :)
<dholbach> because on amd64 mono doesnt build
<dholbach> at least 1.0.x doesnt
<Amaranth> ah
<Treenaks> people STILL write CPU-dependent C code?
<Treenaks> *headdesks*
<ogra> goedson, ok, i'm ready to upload it, one thing, could you make a soure.changes file for it .... (debuild -S)
<ogra> there is only a i386.chages....
<ogra> +n
<goedson> ogra: Doing it right now.
<tritium> Good morning, ajmitch, ogra, trulux.
<ogra> goedson, great...then we'll have it in today ;)
<ogra> hi tritium
<tritium> How are things going?
<ogra> tritium, just uploaded gsf-sharp.....
<ogra> tritium, lets poke haggai or amu to give some judgement about kreciepes
<tritium> I see...
<tritium> ogra, okay.  amu has already reviewed it for me.
<HiddenWolf> Did you guys see that OSnews posting about X11 catching up to tiger/longhorn?
<ogra> tritium, he didnt comment on the MOTUNewPackages page
<tritium> ogra, true...
<ogra> schweeb, please move gsf-sharp from MOTUNewPackages to UniverseNewPackages, its uploaded
<ogra> HiddenWolf, to catch up ? we're far ahead http://www.gnome.org/~seth/
<tritium> HiddenWolf, are you referring to that luminosity demo?
<tritium> with the wobbly windows?
<goedson> ogra: uploaded.
<ogra> yeah
<HiddenWolf> tritium: yup
<ogra> goedson, uploaded, so now they have to pass elmos eagle eyes :) please do the same i told schweeb above...
<goedson> ogra: I believe above is before I connected :)
<goedson> ogra: Can you repeate?
<ogra> goedson, please move gnomebaker from MOTUNewPackages to UniverseNewPackages, its uploaded
<trulux> hey tritium !!!
<tritium> Hey there trulux :)
<trulux> tritium: how's it going?
<tritium> I'm great, thanks.  How are you?
<trulux> tritium: fine, finished many work, just fixing some things in the new libssp packages
<tritium> very good
<goedson> ogra: OK. Will do it now.
<ogra> goedson, good :)
<goedson> ogra: So now gnomebaker is waiting for elmo in two NEW queues. Universe and Debian :)
<ogra> heh
<ogra> goedson, ubuntu is usually faster
<goedson> ogra: I hope so.
<goedson> ogra: Should I link to the source package in my repository, until it is approved into universe?
<ogra> yop
<ogra> goedson, if we can sync it from debian, you can remove it completely from the wiki
<goedson> ogra, Will it be the case if it is in NEW? Or only when approved for Debian?
<ogra> if its in the debian repo
<ogra> our NEW policy only applies to packages that are in neither of them....
<ogra> so if its in debian and we can sync it, its a regular package for us
<goedson> OK.
<goedson> Should I remove the reviews from the MOTUNewPackages?
* goedson is going to lunch, now.
<ogra> goedson, nope, leave them there if elmo has questions....if the package is in the archive you can remove them too
<goedson> OK.
<goedson> Done.
<ogra> great thanks :)
<dholbach> re
<dholbach> hi lamont
<dholbach> lamont: you know what went wrong here (http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/p/pingus/0.6.0-8/) and here (http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/l/lbreakout2/2.5.1-1/)?
* lamont looks
<dholbach> lamont: they both have funny "pkgstriptranslations: inconsistent /CurrentlyBuilding file, Package: value is YYY (should be XXX)"-lines
<lamont> which arch?
<dholbach> i386
<lamont> dholbach: there were two buildd's running on that machine...
<dholbach> ah and then  pkgstriptranslations  didnt happen in the chroot?
<lamont> dholbach: and then pkgstriptranslations killed the build in anger
<tritium> hi dholbach
* lamont gives both back just to be sure
<dholbach> then someone should tell pkgstriptranslations to be nice and easy and maybe even sign the CoC
<dholbach> hey tritium
<ogra> dholbach, it hasnt yet ?
<dholbach> well... if it is killing like that
<dholbach> and not controlling anger... that makes me really sad
<ogra> dholbach, talk to the maintainer ;)
<schweeb> ogra: cool :)
<ogra> schweeb, please leave the review stuff up until it passed elmo, if he has questions
<schweeb> alright
<dholbach> thanks lamont
<lamont> dholbach: if you see any more, and they aren't 'needs-build' in wanna-build, holler.  ditto for any '/dev/null: permission denied' messages
<dholbach> i will
<dholbach> our lists are way to full anyway ;:-)
<lamont> think of it as a challenge...
<dholbach> i already do so
<dholbach> lamont: but thanks for working with us, i'm glad you're around
<schweeb> ogra: done
<ogra> great
<ogra> thanks :)
* schweeb considers attempting to package mono 1.0.6 so we can get beagle 0.0.8
<ogra> schweeb, please coordinate with tseng, he's the MOTUMono teamlead
<schweeb> ogra: yea, sure will
<ogra> good
<ogra> dholbach, oh, short dogwalk today
<schweeb> I think he's been attempting to package 1.1.4 (as have I) but I run into problems as soon as I compile it as a package rather than just manually
* tritium goes to lunch...
<ogra> crimsun, i gave up on jack__, he simply doesnt listen...
<tritium> hi crimsun
<crimsun> hi tritium!
<crimsun> &ogra :)
<ogra> :)
<tritium> :0
<tritium> :)
<jani> hello all
<crimsun> alo
<dholbach> hey jani
<jani> looks like elmo did not sync xfce4.2 yet right?
<jani> those build errors are for 4.0
<crimsun> jani: not yet
<jani> did he ack the request though?
<crimsun> hasn't gotten back
<crimsun> just emailed, actually
<crimsun> I batched the request with one for alsa-source/universe
<jani> ok I thought it was just the IRC ping :)
<crimsun> yeah, I pinged him earlier, but email was suggested
<mdz> alsa-source is built by a package in main (alsa-driver), and a modified one at that
<crimsun> mdz: ah that's right!
<crimsun> mdz: unfortunately I guess I that means there's no chance of pulling in Thomas's 1.0.8+1.0.9rc2-1 packages
<mdz> crimsun: I don't think that would be wise at this juncture, no
<crimsun> mdz: right-o.
<mdz> he has merged/obsoleted several of our patches, though, so we should be able to clean things up after Hoary
<crimsun> great
<jani> mdz, for GPG id whitelisting for uni upload is elmo the person?
<dholbach> jani: yes
<jani> thanks,I'll mail him then I never seem to catch him here
<dholbach> jani: whitelisting (receipt mails) and keyring (uploading) are two different things
<dholbach> that's soooo great!
<jani> oh, well keyring then
<dholbach> wiki/Uploads
<tritium> I'm getting occasional Input/output errors when I ls, rm, mv, cat various files.
<tritium> wonder if my journal is screwy, or if my drive is going bad
<dholbach> tritium: anything in dmesg?
<tritium> dholbach, nothing that would indicate a problem, no
<crimsun> tritium: journal errors are reported as journal errors and almost always result in an immediate remounting of the partition as read-only
<tritium> crimsun, okay, thanks.  Hmm...
<crimsun> tritium: hardware errors are more likely :/
<tritium> I think you're right.  I just replaced the hard drive in this laptop in November.
<tritium> I wonder if the controller is bad.
<crimsun> I envy you folks with laptops :p
<tritium> crimsun, can't you use any of your university discretionary funds to get you one?  ;)
<dholbach> crimsun: i don't own one myself, hope that comforts you a bit :-)
<jani> elmos email address?
<jani> nocrew or canonical
<dholbach> jani: wiki/Uploads
<tritium> maybe I'll replace this soon anyway.  ogra - you have an amd64 laptop, am I right?
<jani> not his address but keyring at ubuntu.is he reading that?
<dholbach> jani: he read it in my case
<crimsun> jani: he reads that
<crimsun> dholbach: :)
<jani> ok thanks
<tritium> Thanks for the trouble-shooting advice dholbach and crimsun.  I think I'm going to go backup some important files :)
<dholbach> alright... have a nice day/evening/morning pals... i'm off - must run to get the train
<crimsun> cya dholbach
<herve> re
<herve> erm
<herve> hi
<crimsun> hi
<ogra> whoops, just fell asleep for an hour
<crimsun> hehe
<crimsun> power nap!
<herve> it can't be bad :-)
<ogra> yeah, preparing for the hacking night :)
<crimsun> :)
<ogra> crimsun, ubuntulog is fabbionnes logbot ;)
<ogra> *grin*
<crimsun> hehe, too fast with the tab-completion :)
<ogra> heh
<ogra> but nice that you apologized
<mdz> jani: whitelisting is based on email address, but yes, elmo
<herve> jani, I still wonder how you made the notary authenticate your GPG key
<jani> herve, she just authenticated a declaration I gave
<jani> anything in that decl is my responsability
<herve> that's why I thought
<herve> I could write about anything
<ogra> herve, you fingerprint would be a good idea i guess ;)
<herve> I should somehow type my password in front of her for a proof
<herve> ogra, the real one? ;-)
<ogra> :-P
* herve will add a photograph to his key, that's a start
* ogra -> dinner
<crimsun> l8r ogra
<ogra> wohooo
<trulux|working> voodooo
* ogra just found out that he leads his netblock
<ogra> http://uptime.netcraft.com/up/hosted?netname=HEUROPE-NET,217.115.138.0,217.115.143.255
<trulux|working> what a fuck, cracklib is an asspain while building new PAM (upgraded to 0.78)
<ajmitch> heh
<herve> yeah! I lead mine too!
<herve> er... I'm alon on it :-p
<herve> (alone)
<ogra> heh
<trulux|working> who maintains cracklib? I have the knife ready for fun
* trulux|working grins like a psycho
<ogra> herve, i actually never thought i would pass the server of astalavista.com, its right beside mine
<trulux|working> ajmitch: there?
<ajmitch> well I was here 5 minutes ago..
<herve> maybe it was an answering machine :-)
<ajmitch> perhaps ;)
<trulux|working> ajmitch: I'm starting to get annoyed with the cracklib shit, the dicts are installed in the right place, cracklib is properly configured, but I won't be able to finnish Linux-PAM 0.78 for Breezy until someone tells me what's the hell that makes it saying "checking path to cracklib dictionary... configure: error: none found"
<ajmitch> fun :)
<ajmitch> got something for me to look at then?
<trulux|working> ajmitch: I have a task for you if you want it
<trulux|working> make the coreutils package
<ogra> hmm, probably your system knows that breezy is vaporware until next month...
<ajmitch> is there something wrong with the current coreutils? :)
<trulux|working> ogra: my system is frustrated, annoyed, overloaded, fscked up and not capable of understanding sarcasm.Sory.
<tseng> ogra: he is trying to get some selinux stuff going early
<tseng> ogra: (very impatient)
<trulux|working> ajmitch: maybe should we add SELinux?
<ogra> tseng, i see that
<ajmitch> trulux|working: are there not already patched packages?
<trulux|working> ajmitch: yes, without a fixed PAM they won't build ;)
<trulux|working> ajmitch: read current https://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/SELinux
<trulux|working> tseng: holidays put me on steroids, no holidays, no extra solar power, no Ubuntu work
<ajmitch> probably because I've got 0.77-0.se5 installed still :)
<trulux|working> 2 days left to the end of holidays
<trulux|working> ajmitch: right, look at http://pearls.tuxedo-es.org/selinux/ubuntu/cron/
<trulux|working> erm
<trulux|working> http://pearls.tuxedo-es.org/selinux/ubuntu/pam/
<trulux|working> that's just the upstream diff
<ajmitch> hah
<ajmitch> 1MB diff
<trulux|working> I have modified some debian-related stuff to make it at least building
<ajmitch> good luck reviewing that ;)
<trulux|working> ajmitch: I did, it's done
<trulux|working> that's because 15 minutes of wasted time fsck me up and make me feeling disappointed
<ajmitch> heh
<trulux|working> ajmitch: could you get coreutils sources?
<trulux|working> then...
<ajmitch> I've got the source
<trulux|working> get http://people.debian.org/~adric/selinux/coreutils/coreutils-5.2.1-selinux.tar.gz
<ajmitch> I'm just trying to access fedora cvs
<trulux|working> don't do that
<ajmitch> I'm grabbing the ubuntu source
<trulux|working> use that tarball
<trulux|working> use the tarball I sent to you, please
<ajmitch> that depends on what changes there are
<trulux|working> decompress it on debian/patches/
<trulux|working> red hat's ones but more fixed for compliance with other debian patches
<trulux|working> I will work on the targeted policy
<trulux|working> don't disturb ;D
<ogra> trulux|working, could you do that i -hardened ?
<ogra> in eevn
<trulux|working> ogra: sure
<ogra> who execpt dholbach worked on the priority list the last three days ? i know he is very dissapointed doing all the work alone recently ? and we are getting short of time...
* ajmitch hasn't really had any spare time in the last week
<herve> ogra, no one I'm afraid
<ogra> we have excatly 11 days to get this done https://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/UniversePriorityList
<ogra> looks like a lot....
<herve> hmm...
<herve> I should clean packages I have done...
<ogra> that would be good
<herve> this
<herve> just to be sure...
<ajmitch> there are packages on that list such as kudzu that we just won't use
<herve> it's ok for removing done packages from the sorted list?
<ogra> but they are in universe
<ajmitch> and what is wrong with packages like kismet?
<ogra> ajmitch, look at the build logs
<herve> kudzu is suggested for the morgue, as I rememer
* ajmitch needs to take a look - he uses that one on hoary
<ogra> herve, great...
<ajmitch> ogra: sure, it doesn't build on amd64 only
<schweeb> ajmitch: kismet should be fine
<schweeb> just needs another kick
* schweeb pokes lamont-away 
<ajmitch> schweeb: again? :)
<schweeb> yea :-/
<schweeb> well
<ajmitch> I see..
<ajmitch> The following packages have unmet dependencies:
<ajmitch>   ethereal-dev: Depends: omniidl (> 1:3.0.4.1-10) but it is not installable or
<ajmitch>                          omniidl4 (>= 4.0.1-2) but it is not going to be installed
<ajmitch>                 Depends: snacc but it is not installable
<ajmitch> E: Broken packages
<schweeb> the buildd's were goofy yesterday
<ajmitch> in the last build attempt
<schweeb> which arch?
<ajmitch> as I said, amd64
<schweeb> I usually only look at i386, as that's what I can build for :)
<schweeb> ah
<ajmitch> as amd64 is the only reason it's in the list :)
* ogra looks at snacc
<schweeb> it wasn't building on x86 as of yesterday...
<crimsun> i386 is usually not problematic; it's the other arches that we really have to fix up before March 30th
* schweeb checks the build logs
<crimsun> (I recently got two friends to give me access to pbuilders on their amd64s so I could test)
<schweeb> ajmitch: http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/k/kismet/2004.04.R1-5/
<schweeb> there's the latest build logs for it
<ogra> hmm, snacc segfaults on build...
<schweeb> so, it wasn't building on i386
<ajmitch> uh..
<ajmitch> fun, so I was looking at the wrong build logs
<schweeb> yea
<schweeb> there's 2 sets
<schweeb> I don't know how lamont's sorting them exactly :-/
<ajmitch> and it's the same culprit again, ethereal-dev
<schweeb> which I fixed
<ajmitch> Setting up ethereal-dev (0.10.4-3ubuntu1) ...
<ajmitch> /var/lib/dpkg/info/ethereal-dev.postinst: line 7: /usr/bin/python2.3: No such file or directory
<ajmitch> dpkg: error processing ethereal-dev (--configure):
<ajmitch> crazy stuff
<schweeb> I fixed that
<schweeb> it would have worked, except the buildd's hadn't uploaded my fixes yet
<schweeb> still missing snacc on amd64 though
<ogra> hmm, seems it fails since quite some time, even in debian http://lists.debian.org/debian-qa-packages/2004/10/msg00120.html
<schweeb> so, maybe no kismet for amd64?
<ogra> looks like
<herve> I don't want to blame anyone
<herve> but I saw a package twice in the lsit :-)
<herve> (poor daniel...)
<trulux|working> pam 0.78 finished
<trulux|working> (applause) :P
<herve> clap clap!
<herve> I pushed a few packages in the morgue proposal
<ajmitch> depends if it works & has no regressions ;)
<trulux|working> ajmitch: feel free to test, dear
<trulux|working> ;P
<ogra> herve, great, every package that is off the list will make dholbach happier
<herve> I wonder how many need just a trivial fix
<herve> ogra, you find it!
<herve> that's the "let's make dholbach happy" transition!
<ogra> yaeh
<ogra> crimsun, whats the status of xfce4 ?
<herve> doko, ping
<crimsun> ogra: awaiting word from James
<crimsun> ogra: I emailed him earlier regarding syncing from os-works
<ogra> ah, great :)
<ogra> ok, i added a can't build section on the page....
<ogra> crimsun, sorry, i'm to blind, just saw your comment on the list page, ignore me
<crimsun> ogra: np
<herve> hmm...
<herve> strange slune is there
<herve> another buildd bug it seems
<ogra> what is slune ? seems i386 only...
<herve> a 3D game in python
<ogra> hmm, so why is it i386 only...
<herve> I thought it could be broken by soya, that FTBFS
<herve> but soya is even missing from the priority lsit
<herve> though it's in the python transition
<ogra> hmm, seems slune has only i386 in the arch list, weird...older versions are arch all
<herve> apt-cache says Arch: all
#ubuntu-motu 2005-04-06
<herve> but python-soya is arch: i386
<herve> so why the hell buildd is building it for all...
<ogra> ah, d3vic3 has changed it to i386...during the pythin transition....
<herve> easy fix ;-)
<ogra> so its ok...
<ogra> lets just rip it off...
<herve> such a change is ok for you?
<ogra> what should i do about it ? rewrite soya ?
<herve> if it's a "all" package
<herve> why restricting it to i386?
<ogra> but it cant build on all
<ogra> in fact it never has according to the build logs
<ogra> at least from 0.6.1 to 1.0.5 it hasnt...so its pointless to have it as all
<crimsun> dang!
<herve> Debian has it in all
* crimsun slaps his forehead
<crimsun> I just dput a package that's in main :<
<ogra> i'll put it on cant build with a comment...
<ogra> crimsun, dont worry, it will silently disappear
<crimsun> ogra: will you need to bump the revision to upload it?
<ogra> crimsun, yup... if one version has been uploaded thats the way to go....(another would be to beg elmo to wipe it from the queue)
<crimsun> ogra: ok, http://sh.nu/~crimsun/ubuntu-motu/  has the version that I accidentally dput
<crimsun> ogra: that fixes FTBFS on ia64
<herve> ogra, http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/s/soya/0.9.1-2ubuntu1/soya_0.9.1-2ubuntu1_20050301-0548-amd64-failed
<herve> I don't know what to think of all those weird build failures
<schweeb> guys, does grub work on amd64?
* schweeb doesn't have any boxes so is unsure
<crimsun> I certainly hope it does, or ogra wouldn't be online ;)
<ogra> schweeb, sure
<schweeb> ok, heh
<ogra> crimsun, i'd take lilo ;)
<crimsun> hehe
<schweeb> h8 lilo
<herve> grub... I read hurd :-)
<schweeb> hah
<schweeb> hurd, how useful
<ogra> crimsun, do you bump the version number ? then i'll upload
<crimsun> ogra: ok, I'll do that.
<herve> I guess that weekend will be kind of a marathon for fixing the universe
<herve> hopefully monday is a day off here
<crimsun> herve: pretty much
<herve> welcome tritium!
<herve> erm...
<herve> nevermind :-)
<herve> it's sign I need to sleep :-)
<herve> good night all
<crimsun> night herve
<crimsun> ogra: uploaded.
<ogra> great
<crimsun> thanks! :)
<ogra> crimsun, i assume you tested it extensively....
<crimsun> it runs, yes. Installs and uninstalls and upgrades cleanly.
<crimsun> the real fix is for IA64, and it's pulled from Debian Sid's 0.8.9-3
<ogra> ok
<ogra> uploaded
<crimsun> thanks :)
<crimsun> back in a bit
<tritium> hello
<goedson> ogra: gnomebaker entered Debian. This means I may remove it from UniverseNewPackages, right?
<ogra> goedson, hmm, ok
<tritium> yikes
<tritium> hda: status error: status=0x58 { DriveReady SeekComplete DataRequest }
<tritium> ide: failed opcode was: unknown
<tritium> hda: drive not ready for command
<tritium> my hard drive is giving me fits
<ogra> that looks quite bad
<tritium> yeah, I agree.  I'm backing up everything right now before I have a disaster on my hands
<ogra> good plan
<tritium> this will be the second drive in 5 months with this laptop.  Maybe it's time to look at a new one.
<tritium> ogra, you have an amd64 laptop?
<ogra> yup
<tritium> May I ask the make and model?
<ogra> acer aspire 1520
<tritium> Thanks.  You happy with it?
<ogra> but i wouldnt recommend it if you are after a good keyboard or a good case
<tritium> I see.
<ogra> oh, and the builtin wireless only works with win drivers, but ndiswrapper doesnt support them yet (using a pcmcia card currently)
<tritium> one of the remaining quirks, I guess?
<ogra> but it was the cheapest amd64 machine i could get (80GB HDD, 512MB widescreen 15,4", nvidia 64MB)
<tritium> nice
<ogra> DVD/CD writer...
<ogra> 1250
<tritium> Cool.
<tritium> there don't appear to me many more AMD64isms anymore.  Is that fairly safe to say?
<ogra> yop, if you can live without java and flash plugin :)
<tritium> yeah, no problem :)
<tritium> cool, thanks for the info.  I might compare against powerbooks.  I think I'm done with Dell, for sure.
<ogra> they told me today that you can get a powerbook g5 for a similar price now
<trulux|working> hey tritium
<tritium> hi trulux|working :)
<tritium> g5?  really?  wow
<ogra> tritium, ask zyga in -devel he told me...
<tritium> ogra, cool.  Thanks.
<trulux|working> tritium: https://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/SELinux <- 75% completed :)
<tritium> trulux|working, nice :)
<tseng> ogra: !!!
<ogra> tseng
<tseng> ogra: key is signed!
<ogra> whatsup ?
<ogra> YAY YAY YAY
<tseng> YAY
<crimsun> hooray!
<ogra> \O/
<ajmitch_> tseng: good work
<tritium> tseng, :)
<tseng> heh I tried
<tseng> i guess he's too busy with his beard
<crimsun> darned beards.
<ogra> hehe
<crimsun> you need to post on planet about it.
<crimsun> :p
<tseng> "manoj is my hero, even if he is nuts"
<crimsun> ugh, #u is madness
<tritium> what's going on?
<tseng> you know what ill just mail mako again anyway
<tseng> with the CoC
<ogra> crimsun, because bluefoxicy is there ?
<tseng> hah "big indian"
<crimsun> ogra: just generally :)
<ogra> heh
<tritium> ogra, now that I'm investigating G5s, I'm wondering why there's no 64-bit powerpc stuff
<crimsun> tritium: it's in debian, dunno about the design decision to not include it
<tritium> crimsun, oh, okay.  Thanks.
<ogra> tritium, we have a g5 kernel....but no explicit system...
<tritium> I see
<tseng> ogra: i just do gpg --sign CoC.txt, right?
<ogra> yop
<tseng> yay
<ogra> tseng, the other 3 signs were not sufficient ?
<tseng> they arent very strong if you follow them
<ogra> ah, i see
<tseng> so i waited for manoj, who is a gpg diety
<mdz> tritium: ppc64 requires some toolchain work which we didn't have time for for Hoary
<mdz> and there hasn't been a clear demand
<tritium> mdz, oh, thanks for the info :)
<crimsun> whew, good thing I didn't start on clanlib
<crimsun> I suggest we also remove the packages we fix from "The list"
<crimsun> ok, lincity definitely builds on [i386] 
<crimsun> must have been buildd screwage, judging from http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/l/lincity/1.12.1-1/lincity_1.12.1-1_20050324-0454-i386-failed
<lamont> crimsun: time's about right
<lamont> everything before 20050324-1857 or so
<lamont> is at least somewhat suspect
<crimsun> ah ok.
<crimsun> thanks for the clarification.
<lamont> and even after that, if you see bitchiness about /dev/null permissions, check if it's marked 'needs-build' or 'failed' in buildLogs/Test/Lists/hoary-test.all.$arch
<lamont> if failed, poke lamont
<crimsun> ok.
<crimsun> wb tritium
<tritium> thanks :)
<tritium> I noticed that dholbach signed my krecipes package :)
<crimsun> congrats! :)
<tritium> Thanks!
<crimsun> pike7.* make me want to bash my forehead against a brick wall
<tritium> ?
<crimsun> the only one that has successfully built on all 4 arches is 7.6, but 7.6 is too new for the two apps I'm trying to fix
<crimsun> both 7.2 and 7.4 are broken on at least one arch
<crimsun> (FTBFS, that is)
<tritium> ah
<crimsun> so now I get to try and unbreak 7.2 and 7.4 so I can unbreak the two packages I _originally_ intended to fix.
<crimsun> heh, gonna be a long morning
<tritium> nice work, crimsun
<crimsun> not yet ;)
<tritium> Well, I admire the effort already
<crimsun> so do I, though my stomach doesn't.  Hmm, food time.
<crimsun> hi daniel
<robitaille> Hi there.   Oliver sort of convinced me the other day that I should visit you guys on this channel
<crimsun> yes, welcome
<crimsun> now we have three daniels
<robitaille> to see what the motu team is up to
<tritium> Hi Daniel :)
<crimsun> /wiki/MOTU is a good place to start
<crimsun> basically we're nearly finished with the Python 2.4 transition and are delving madly through the DoesntBuild list, prioritised by PriorityList
<crimsun> trying to get as much of universe building on all 4 arches as possible
<crimsun> oh, and we have 1 1/2 weeks to do that ;)
<robitaille> you can't never have too many Daniels on a project
<robitaille> And one of these days I'm going to learn python.  THere is too many people around trying to convince me to do so, and it was one of the reason to get into Ubuntu in the first place for me last fall
<crimsun> yeah, ubuntu is big on gnome and python
* crimsun stabs pike7.4
<tritium> have a good morning, crimsun.
<dholbach> goooood morning! how are you all?
<Burgundavia> salut
<dholbach> hey Burgundavia :-)
<schweeb> dholbach: morning sucks :)
<dholbach> schweeb: oh don't complain :-)
<dholbach> schweeb: i only slept 5h30m because somebody thought it was early enough to phone me :-)
<schweeb> heh
<schweeb> I should be sleeping myself
<schweeb> but I'm all hopped up on mountain dew
<dholbach> :-)
<schweeb> it is rather interesting being awake for all the drunk people who come home and randomly IM you :)
<dholbach> hahaha :-)
<prettylove> hi, kaloz
<prettylove> hi riddell
<schweeb> why is irssi-text in the Pri-List... isn't that in main?
<dholbach> schweeb: hmm, tick it off or mark it as "main's job"
<schweeb> looks like crimsun may have done something to it... dunno what or why
<schweeb> which, if he actually went through and fixed that and the other packages under "done", he should probably remove the build-failed links to them
<schweeb> argh, I better go to bed
<schweeb> it's nearly 6am here
<schweeb> night
<dholbach> good night
<dholbach> probably it's my fault
<dholbach> maintaining those lists is a horror
<dholbach> so i maybe overlooked it
<herve> morning!
<dholbach> hey herve
<dholbach> herve: how are you today?
<herve> slept well, much better!
<herve> ready to start the motu marathon!
<dholbach> gooooooood :-)
<dholbach> oh... even better ;-)
<herve> not really actually
<herve> breakfast first!
<herve> lamont, ping
<herve> hi Amaranth
<Amaranth> hi
<herve> doko, ping
<ogra> morning....
<ogra> darn, i missed robitaille
<dholbach> hey ogra
<herve> morning ogra
<herve> how was that hacking night?
<ogra> tired...
<herve> I didn't mean the consequences :-)
<ogra> herve, no, but the night too, i didnt really find my starting point...
<herve> I must admit I lost motivation yesterday night
<HiddenWolf> Ugh. I'm so damn pissed off. :P
<ogra> by what ?
<HiddenWolf> Ordered two sticks of ram a month ago to upgrade my current pc
<HiddenWolf> Did the math, figured I could afford a new rig, and ordered the new pc.
<HiddenWolf> Now my mother calls, they just delivered all the last components. But I still haven't recieved the ram.
<HiddenWolf> Ordered it at a diffent shop.
<ogra> gah
<HiddenWolf> Now I check at the shop who got the rest of the components, and they also sell that ram, and have it in stock.
<HiddenWolf> Now I want to cancel the order and order it at the shop that actually has the stuff, but they won't awnser the phone. Guess they are in church or something.
<ogra> yeah, its easter...
<HiddenWolf> No, tomorrow is easter. :P
<ogra> yeah, but....
<HiddenWolf> So, now I have to cancel the order on tuesday, order it in the other shop, payment due wednesday, and if i"m lucky, I'll have it friday.
<ogra> (in germany we already have a public holiday on friday....)
<herve> in Alsace too
<HiddenWolf> ogra, yeah. I didn't think about it yesterday either. I was in the train, and my public transport pass wasn't valid. Only on working days. Had to pay a fine.
<ogra> so many ppl dont work on saturday...
<ogra> gah
<HiddenWolf> Now for me it is a working day. :P
<HiddenWolf> The employee didn't agree
<ogra> hmm..
<ogra> so you have to convince the conductor :)
<ogra> (guessing for him it was a working day too, the chances arent to bad ;) )
<doko> herve: pong
<herve> hi doko
<herve> I suggest we just drop zopectl and zope-zshell
<doko> why zope-zshell?
<herve> unmaintaned
<herve> and written by the time of zope 2.6
<herve> it patches the roots of Zope
<herve> I doubt it would still work with all the changes in zope 2.7
<dholbach> herve: sip4-qt3 uploaded
<herve> muhahaha!
<doko> herve: did you test it?
<herve> not yet
<herve> I'm finishing with the python transition in itself
<herve> sometimes I don't understand how DDs choose their dependencies
<HiddenWolf> Yes. managed to cancel that damned order. :P
<ogra> congrats
<HiddenWolf> And I'm not paying the other shop until I see the order is ready to be shipped. :P
* ogra groars at all these missing python gnome functions 
<ogra> damned, do they only implement what they like ??
<herve> it's free software ;-)
<ogra> half of the stuff i can do in gtk-perl is missing in pygtk, thats annoying
<HiddenWolf> ogra: did you only get that notion just now?
<HiddenWolf> gnome imho doesn't listen very well / at all
<ogra> nope, but at the moment i have to fix a bug in hwdb-client that would require only one line if not half of the functions were not missing
<HiddenWolf> write the function, and propose a patch to pygtk to add the function there?
<ogra> gah, then i'll rather find a workaround, i dont have the time to fix pygtk currently.... i simply rely on the fact they call it a stable implementation and wouldnt expect that functions available in ALL other bindings are missing there...
<ogra> thats just ill
<herve> ogra, have you check if it was implemented in CVS?
<ogra> herve, i already asked them in #pygtk.... they told me gnomecanvas will be obsolete once so they wont iplement the missing bits, GRRR
<herve> and gnome has been stabilized for just a few days...
<herve> ho good...
<herve> a configure script asking a question
<herve> nice to script in debian/rules :-)
<ogra> herve, gnomecanvas is a _very_ old implementation, it is not related to that new release
<herve> so they make it right?
<ogra> but simply everything described here is missing: http://developer.gnome.org/doc/API/2.0/libgnomecanvas/GnomeCanvasRichText.html#gnome-canvas-rich-text-get-buffer
<ogra> (and not planned to get implemented)
<herve> and what superseded it?
<ogra> the waiting on a stable cairo implementation (which still might take more then 6 months)
<ogra> i'm just upset by the ignorance....
<herve> than, even :-)
<herve> sounds like 6 months is worth binding gnomecanvas in python
<ogra> might be, but i have to match a release date with my SW so i wont look into it now :)
<HiddenWolf> Hm. So in six months time, gnome might start on a 3.0, using cairo?
<ogra> HiddenWolf, that was just a gues, it might tae 3 months it migth take 2 years
<ogra> its simply that a very ancient functionallity is missing _now_ and i need it _now_
<dholbach> bbl
<HiddenWolf> Sorry ogra, but that's how it works. Little incentive not to do what you don't want to, and an easy excuse to avoid doing it. (you can get to the source, add it yourself -kind of idea)
* HiddenWolf is off to buy thermal paste and some other stuff. 
<herve_> I *hate* those random crashes
<herve_> dholbach left?
<Amaranth> so we have until the 30th to get things done?
<Amaranth> was reading the hoary release schedule, a bit confused
<herve> hoary universe will be kinda frozen afterwards
<herve> it will make things difficult to fix packages
<Amaranth> you mean it'd be froze from the 30th until breezy starts, right?
<herve> nope, frozen like warty is
<herve> only security updates, rougly
<herve> (roughly)
<ogra> herve, yes, he had a short night....
<ogra> (dholbach)
<herve> ok, the nap he programmed :-)
<ogra> :)
<herve> have you guys checked luminocity?
<ogra> nope
<herve> ogra, I think it's related to what you talked about
<herve> cairo, no?
<ogra> ah, yeah, that one from seths blog...
<herve> looks like it
<ogra> sure, i've seen it and look forward to program with it...but that doesnt help me now :-/
<herve> sure
<Treenaks> does anyone know how I change the font in Wine from something-serif to something-sans-serif?
<herve> I'm tempted to answer windows' control panel :-)
<Treenaks> herve: *whack*
<Treenaks> herve: I don't have windows, only some windows app running in wine
<Treenaks> (I almost wrote "whine")(
<herve> hey, a euro!
<herve> wash your clothes and earn $$$
<Treenaks>  Get rich fast!!
<lamont> herve: mornign
<herve> lamont, hi
<herve> we uploaded a new version of poker3d
<herve> but it never appeared in the archives
<herve> though it successfully compiled on all archs
<lamont> when was the upload?
<lamont> buildLogs/Lists/hoary.all.amd64:universe/games/poker3d_0.2.12-1ubuntu1: Dep-Wait by buildd+king [optional:uncompiled] 
<lamont> on all 4 architectures.
<herve> two days ago
<lamont>   Dependencies: libxml2-python2.3
<lamont> so you fixed that build-dep, and you need it kicked>?
<lamont> where did it successfully compile?  hoary-test?
<herve> I don't really know those procedures
<herve> but if you say it needs a kick, let's go!
<lamont> ok. lets back up.
<lamont> <herve> though it successfully compiled on all archs - where did you get this information?>
<lamont> and, was the upload 2 days ago doing the python2.4 transition?
<herve> erm, I was think of another (problematic package)
<herve> so poker3d was upload but never built
<herve> (uploaded)
<herve> yes, I am still working on that python2.4 transition
<herve> my second concern is about sip-qt3
<herve> this one was successfully built
<herve> but no news in the archives
<lamont> sip-qt3 is marked 'uploaded', which means it almost certainly contains files not found in the overrides file.  --> elmo love
<herve> because of new binary packages?
<lamont> for future...  if the package is marked as 'Dep-Wait' in buildLogs/Lists, and you upload a version that removes the build-depends: for the package it's blocked by, you must poke me.
<lamont> new binary packages require NEW processing by elmo
<herve> got it
<herve> and what do you need to do for poker3d
<herve> update some file?
<lamont> I tell wanna-build to pretend that libxml2-python2.3 is available.
<lamont> which I have now done.
<herve> thank you
<herve> hey jani!
<jani>  hey herve
<siretart> hi folks!
<siretart> is there some known problem with the ia64 buildd?
<jani> what do you mean?
<jani> I know fewer packages build on ia64 since there are fewer users
<jani> and testers/developers
<herve> I think he wonders if the ia64 buildd itself has bugs
<siretart> I'm trying to fix some packages from UniverseDoesNotBuild, and the packages in question have build failiures on ia64
<siretart> e.g. here: http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/p/pidentd/3.0.16-7/pidentd_3.0.16-7_20050324-1300-ia64-failed
<herve> good one :-)
<jani> that one look like apt-get failed not the build itself
<siretart> From the logs I would suspect that authentication should be taken out for sbuild
<jani> WARNING: The following packages cannot be authenticated!
<jani> I wonder why is that? Isn't that pulling from the ubuntu archives?
<siretart> thats basically what I'm asking :)
<herve> siretart, my diagnosis is... ask lamont :-)
<siretart> herve: :)
<schweeb> ugh
<schweeb> I think I should go back to bed
<herve> what time is it at yours?
<schweeb> 12:30p
<lamont> note that said build log is from before 20050324-1857
<schweeb> went to bed about 6:30a
<herve> schweeb, yes you're missing something :-)
<lamont> jani: that was cluster #1
<herve> it was found problematic,
<herve> ?
<jani> lamont, I don't know what cluster #1  means :)
<lamont> jani: that's ok.
<jani> nothing to do with pink floyd I assume
<lamont> s/cluster/disaster/
<lamont> no
<lamont> is fire service term
<lamont> means royal mess
<jani> aha
<jani> british or american English?
<herve> royal mess... so it's british? ;-)
<lamont> jani:" american
<lamont> fire serivce, military, etc.
<jani> ok thanks :)_
<lamont> http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=cluster
<lamont> is actually a contraction of a longer, less polite term
<siretart> re
<siretart> I'm looking at http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/p/pike7.2/7.2.580-3/pike7.2_7.2.580-3_20050324-0910-powerpc-given-back and try to imagine what the problem could be
<lamont> janc: and thursday, I was numbering them.  I didn't like thursday very much.
<lamont> 20050324-0910
<herve> still before 18:57 :-)
<lamont> cluster #2: ross, et al.
<siretart> err, I'm sorry, I must have missed whats up with that date?
<lamont> from sometime late 0323 until 1857 on the 24th, there were a collection of issues iwth the buildd's
<lamont> 1857 was the point at which the last of them was declared dead, and I gave everything back
<lamont> well, most everything
<siretart> ah.. I see.
<lamont> the lingering annoyance is anything that is currently marked 'failed' in hoary-test.all.*, and complains about /dev/null: permission denied.
<lamont> the proposed fix for the root cause of that one is a bit too invasive to do right before the release... so I get to babysit regularly and cleanup after it when it happens..
<herve> yes, that reminds me of a chroot error
<lamont> but if y'all would be nice and avoid uploading too many packages that build-depend udev, hal, dbus, or such while I'm sleeping, I'd appreciate it.
<herve> but I forgot what's wrong
<lamont> ross was victimized by a kernel bug, the fix was to roll forward to a new kernel
<siretart> oh, sounds ugly..
<siretart> ok, then I'll grab other packages..
<lamont> siretart: just start with buildLogs/Test/byDate/today.html is a good start - pick from that and you're fine
<lamont> likewise ..../byDate/20050325.html is a good one too.
<siretart> ah, that makes it easier.. thanks lamont1
<lamont> alternatively, search for 'Failed' in buildLogs/Test/Lists/hoary-test.report.$arch
<lamont> those are regressions, that need to either be fixed, or (hopefully) dropped from the archive
<lamont> that is, best case is fixed
<lamont> worst case is left in the archive unbuildable
<siretart> the buildLogs are created by dak, I assume?
<lamont> uh... small piece of python that salts them away
<lamont> and generates that report for hoary test.
<lamont> basically, 'report' only contains packages which are marked 'Installed' in hoary, but marked !Installed in hoary-test
<siretart> ah. thanks for explanation
<lamont> and undoubtedly contains some false positives, e.g. /dev/null: permission denied
<herve> welcome back Daniel!
<dholbach> hey herv
<lamont> morning dholbach
<dholbach> hey lamont :-)
<siretart> hi Daniel
<lamont> well, it's (a) still morning here, and (b) always morning on the internet.  except at bedtime.
<dholbach> hehe
<siretart> :)
<dholbach> hey reinhard, how are you all? how's the overall atmosphere? :-)
<herve> quite calm
<herve> I'm trying to poke elmo about poker3d
<herve> and lamont checked sip-qt3
<dholbach> oh cool
<lamont> s/checked/glanced at/
<herve> or the other way round?
<lamont> I didn't verify my assertion
<lamont> herve: the other way around.
<herve> you took a look :-)
<lamont> sip-qt3 almost certainly needs elmo
<lamont> poker3d should build now
<dholbach> well... as soon as i finshed the crack list, i try to make the atmosphere a bit more cheery :-)
<herve> ok, that's the evidence I haven't taken coffee for the day :)-
<siretart> dholbach: quite fine, I have a good feeling for thursday, so I'm spending some time for universe :)
<dholbach> siretart: exam on thursday?
<siretart> dholbach: yeah
<lamont> old-logs/daemon-20050326-1720.log.gz:Mar 24 20:45:01 buildd-mail: sip-qt3 must be manually dinstall-ed -- delayed
<lamont> assertion  verified
<schweeb> education is overrated :)
<siretart> schweeb: :)
<herve> lamont, thanks
<siretart> but its quite intersting stuff: operating and distributed systems..
<dholbach> oh nice
<dholbach> when on thursday?
<schweeb> sounds like a senior level class
<lamont> hrm... bug in the report generator... /me studies
<siretart> 10:10, weird time, but its colloquial..
<dholbach> siretart: i'll have my fingers crossed
<siretart> thanks! :)
<dholbach> :-)
<lamont> ok.  5 minutes until clean report
<siretart> hm. the scm build problem is known to the debian bts: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=245810
<lamont> (new hoary-test.report.$arch will only list packages which are marked 'Installed' in hoary
<lamont> hrm.. and Uploaded.
<herve> argh. poker3d fails on ia64!
<siretart> well, since I don't have a ia64 or alpha to test steve langasaks patch, I'd suggest removing scm :(
<herve> ho, not so easily?
<lamont> herve: note that ia64 is not a release critical architecture
<siretart> oh. then never mind
* lamont spews
<lamont> universe/libs/libgdiplus_1.0.4-1: Failed
<lamont> universe/games/kq_0.98+cvs.20031006-5: Failed
<lamont> universe/games/pinball_0.3.1-3: Failed
<lamont> universe/devel/gprolog_1.2.18-12: Failed
<lamont> universe/devel/rscheme_0.7.3.3.b20-1: Failed
<lamont> unknown/swt-motif_3.0-4: Failed
<lamont> #       Failed:        16
<lamont> hrm... missing several
<lamont> fenris, gal2, gmime2, kdebindings, libmrproject, libxcb, mico, nvidia-settings, stax, yehia
* siretart looking at kq
<siretart> is there a convinient meta package for xorg devel headers?
<siretart> a common problem seems to be that some header file have moved to other packages..
<herve> siretart, that's the point
<schweeb> if you're looking for scrnsaver.h, it's in libxss-dev
<herve> xfree dev packages have been split out
<herve> use dpkg -S or apt-file search to find out :-)
<herve> lamont, I need to poke elmo too for a upload that should have not been made?
<ogra> herve, ?
<herve> I made uploaded sip4-qt3 4.2
<herve> but our current qt/kde packages depends << 4.2
<lamont> herve: well, it's like this... after cron.hourly runs, it's pretty much too late
<ogra> what was wrong with that one ?
<ogra> ah
<lamont> now, if we're talking sip-qt3, and no binaries have entered the archive, then you have a bit more luck.
<lamont> but in any case, once you upload it, the options are basically: upload a yet-newer version to undo what you did
<herve> no it's sip4-qt3, another upstream branch
<ogra> herve, fix it, bump the ubuntu version number....and reupload i guess
<lamont> oh, and cron.hourly runs every 5 minutes...
<herve> argh!
<herve> ogra, it's 4.2 against 4.1
<ogra> herve, then you will need to make it 4.2-ubuntu1 ?
<herve> any 4.2 will conflicts with qt/kde python bindings
<siretart> kq fixed.. taking next one..
<ogra> oh, so this never should have been uploaded since it cant build ?
<herve> it can
<herve> but could prevent other from building
<herve> stupid me!
<ogra> hmm
<herve> who care about kde anyway? :-)
<tseng> right.
<herve> just kidding...
<tritium> Hi dholbach
<herve> hi tritium
<tritium> hi herve :)
<ogra> herve, dont say that to loud, you'll never know if Riddell is watching
<tritium> hi ogra
<ogra> hi tritium
<herve> it was too good DD made the transition job for me...
<herve> but on a newer and incompatible upstream release :-/
<siretart> next package fixed: pinball..
<ogra> woah, thats speed....
<siretart> well, those 2 package just needed more build depends,
<tritium> How are we going about fixing package that won't build on architectures we don't have?
<ogra> try to find out the problem and ask someont who owns the arch to testbuild
<tritium> ok
<tritium> and we're starting from the top of the prioritized list?
<ogra> yup
<tritium> cool
<siretart> thats weird: http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/Lists/hoary-test.all.i386 says that rscheme is failing, but it is building fine in my hoary chroot
<siretart> http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/r/rscheme/0.7.3.3.b20-1/rscheme_0.7.3.3.b20-1_20050322-0658-i386-failed failing with an unmotivated segfault. hardware problem? I dont know..
<herve> before 24th at 18:07 :-)
<siretart> ;)
<lamont> bad times didn't really get going until the 23rd though...
<lamont> discount (1) anything ross did before 24 mar 18:57, and (2) anything that bitches about /dev/null permissions
<siretart> ok
<herve> (I finally remember how I fixed that error!)
<ogra> oh, i missed its DST night tonight.....
<siretart> swt-motif also seems to have builddep problem, I'm on it..
<siretart> ogra: oh, thanks for the reminder :)
<ogra> siretart, in any case your ubuntu would have reminded you ;)
<siretart> ogra: hehe :)
<schweeb> motif? /me vomits
<ogra> schweeb, its like antique furniture :)
<schweeb> I'd much rather claw out my eyes than look at THAT furniture :)
<ogra> (in fact with a sexy concrete look, but well...)
<siretart> motif.. that always reminds me to that acroread4 stuff...
<siretart> well, package building again..
<schweeb> http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/d/dietlibc/0.27-7/
<schweeb> is there any reason why dietlibc isn't build on amd64?
<schweeb> isn't even attempted...
<schweeb> (one of my buddies noticed it wasn't in the archive for amd64)
<dholbach> schweeb: doesnt build there, i tried it to solve a couple of issue
<schweeb> 14:21 < schweeb> it's quite possible it doesn't build
<schweeb> 14:21 < schweeb> lemme check
<schweeb> 14:21 < Beirdo> built fine for me
<schweeb> 14:21 < Beirdo> in about 20s
<dholbach> erm
<schweeb> *shrug*
<dholbach> hm
* dholbach gets it
<tritium> Hi dholbach!  Thanks for signing krecipes :)
<dholbach> hey tritium
<dholbach> de rien :-)
* tritium really appreciates it
<schweeb> dholbach: I don't see /any/ buildlogs for it on amd64, any version
<siretart> schweeb: is dietlibc an arch: any package at all?
<dholbach> schweeb: Architecture: arm i386
<dholbach> schweeb: for Package: dietlibc
<schweeb> ahh
<schweeb> should it be built for amd64?  I don't know much about multiarch support... my buddy says vservers needs it
<dholbach> schweeb: twoftpd-run, runit-run, socklog-run, bincimap-run need it via runit
<dholbach> i'm not sure either... maybe lamont knows :-)
* dholbach thinks . o O { *pling* }
<schweeb> hahha
<siretart> schweeb: vserver needs dietlibc?
<schweeb> probably somewhere through the deps
<schweeb> this comes second hand, so I'm not 100% sure the situation
<schweeb> it's built for ia64 and ppc though, so I'm imagining it should be built for amd64 ;)
<lamont> %dietlibc: alpha amd64 arm hppa i386 ia64 mips mipsel powerpc sparc s390    # ANAIS
<lamont> it should be building on amd64
<dholbach> ok... so changing it in debian/control and uploading should suffice
<siretart> whats this: http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/o/openmosix/1:0.3.4-7/openmosix_1:0.3.4-7_20050324-0633-i386-failed - including files from /usr/include/linux directly?! waah?!
<schweeb> hehe
<siretart> hmm.. thinking later bout it, going to get something to eat.. bbl
<lamont> dholbach: if there are no logs, we may need to have elmo resync-PaS
<lamont> and, of course, there's no guarantee it actually builds...
<dholbach> no build logs for amd64 ever
<lamont> yep.
<lamont> needs elmo love
<dholbach> i don't understand... won't it (after a change of debian/control) just be in elmo's "NEW queue"?
<lamont> it's in PaS
* dholbach doesn't understand that either
<lamont> that is, quinn-diff has been specifically told to ignore dietlibc on amd64
<dholbach> i see
<dholbach> hrm
<schweeb> PaS ?
<lamont> you'll note that it's not in buildLogs/Lists/hoary.all.amd64
<lamont> Packages-arch-specific
<schweeb> ahh
<lamont> for various reasons, the architectures that attempt a build are controlled outside of the packages source.
<schweeb> well, considering amd64 isn't a supported arch in debian yet, that's understandable (it's still unsupported, right?)
<dholbach> thanks lamont
<lamont> righ
<lamont> t
<koke> hi all!!
<herve> hi koke !
<dholbach> hey koke
<koke> how are you?
<herve> fine, thanks
<dholbach> fine... all kinds of crack around me, but still fine
<schweeb> I've seen the term 'crack' thrown around here more than anywhere else, ever ;)
<koke> :D
<dholbach> schweeb: it will all get better with SneezySnail or something
<koke> I've received a mail from a DD asking me if I wanted to maintain the evolution-sharp package in debian too
<koke> tseng: do you want it??
<koke> you are the mono guy :P
<dholbach> koke: oh nice... i just saw some apt-get.org-repo having it too
<schweeb> dholbach: haha
<tseng> i am the mono lead, i dont need every package directly :)
<dholbach> schweeb: ;-)
<schweeb> is that actually a proposed name?
<tseng> go for it if you want to work with him, koke
<koke> tseng: I only packaged it to compile beagle
<koke> but I'm not maintainig it and know not very much of mono
<herve> SneezyNose?
<herve> ha no, I misread :-)
<tseng> koke: so, you dont want it? or what.
<tseng> we can make it owned by Mono Team for ubuntu, or something
<tseng> and you can mail relevant stuff to your DD
<koke> tseng: it would be better
<dholbach> yeah... please someone give us   qa.ubuntu.com   and  packages.ubuntu.com
<koke> I don't mind to maintain it
<dholbach> PLEASE
<tseng> thats still means you and me.
<koke> but it's very possible I'll forget it :)
<tseng> dholbach: dude, didint i give you packages?
<dholbach> tseng: what are you talking about?
<tseng> dholbach: http://higgs.djpig.de/ubuntu/www/
<dholbach> yeah... that's a start :-)
<tseng> has worked well for me so far
<herve> well, going forth and back between this and lamont's logs is not handy
<lamont> tseng: you could add links to the logs for him....
<tseng> email the owner?
<tseng> yes.
<lamont> at least to the directory - that's highly predictable
<tseng> its not mine, but im sure the guy running the site would accomodate that
<tseng> yeah the directory should be fine
<tseng> I will mail him, dudes
<dholbach> woohoo
<tseng> anyone have a burning need for CC'age?
<lamont> tseng: and remember with and without /Test
<tseng> lamont: /Test?
<lamont> tseng: you could lend some authentecity by cc'ing me... no burning need, but you're welcome
<lamont> to
<lamont> buildLogs/Test/f/foo/1.1/
<lamont> is the rebuild
<dholbach> and we want to be able to make notes according to teams and tag packages as In<Bla>Transition - thanks for being so kind ;-p
<tseng> dholbach: that sounds like a deeper architectural change that deserves its own thread
<dholbach> yes... i am aware of that :-)
<koke> tseng: that looks just great :D
<tseng> i have no idea how deeply in tune this guy is to this webapp
<tseng> yeah I posted that link in #u-d before, I didnt know so many people missed it
<tseng> ill blog it when we're done ehre
<tseng> *here.
<herve> and make links with malone, obviously :-)
<tseng> is malone powered up yet?
<ogra> we are supposed to use it
<ogra> (but not the users)
<tseng> lamont: sorry, /Test is when you "kick" an existing source to rebuild?
<lamont> no
<lamont> there is the hoary distribution, and the hoary-test distribution.  hoary-test is currently doing a complete rebuild of hoary, to verify that things actually build against the current archive.
<lamont> those failures (regressions) are top of my list.
<lamont> http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/Lists/hoary-test.report.$arch
<tseng> ah-ha
<tseng> thanks for clarifying
<dholbach> tseng: that's what http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UniverseDoesNotBuild and http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UniversePriorityList is all about :-)
<tseng> oh.
<dholbach> :-)
<siretart> re
<dholbach> wb siretart
<koke> have to go
<koke> see you soon :)
<siretart> cu koke
<tseng> lamont, dholbach sent
<dholbach> tseng: ROCK! :-)
<tseng> heh.
<herve> I'm trying to sort why gcompris ftbfs
<herve> the only differences I found with a working compilation on Sid are:
<dholbach> herve: removed it from meta-gnome2 ;-)
<herve> 1. Hoary Makefile don't have "-Wl,--export-dynamic"
<herve> still motu business ;-)
<herve> 2. Sid had mawk, Hoary gawk
<herve> 3. Python 2.4 instead of 2.3
<herve> I can't find the relationship :-(
<hsprang> hy all :)
<herve> hi!
<dholbach> hey hsprang
* ogra wonders who might be travis watkins....
<ogra> there is a menu editor on motunewpackages...and the link of the name points to a totally empty wiki page....weird...
<herve> syntax error?
<herve> in the url
<hsprang> ogra: this is amaranth
<ogra> nope
<ogra> hmm, then he probably should put his nick on the wiki page...a empty page is somewhat pointless...
<herve> he is, check the /whois :-)
<hsprang> i remember telling him which packages he need to pu online for reviewing for the menueditor
<herve> I remember HostingGeek asking for a screenshot to enter ubuntu :-)
<ogra> hmm, the package is funny
<ogra> there is a orig.tar.gz.....
<ogra> but no diff.gz....
<ogra> but a ubuntu1.tar.gz
<ogra> and a .dsc ....
<dholbach> ho... this repo has zakmccracken
<hsprang> hmm, doesn't sound like he did it how i told him...
<ogra> half native.....
<dholbach> not sure if that's something for even multiverse
<ogra> half non native...
<hsprang> or better: misunderstood me
<dholbach> sounds like repository "warez" or something :-)
<hsprang> yes, i remember we wasn't wuite sure which it was
<herve> dholbach, not sure
<dholbach> zakmccracken rocked
<siretart> definitly!
<herve> it could have been one of these games free'd for scumm
<herve> but I can't find a proof
<hsprang> when i looked at it there was nothing like that, we just talked about the editor...
<dholbach> HO, it even has vmware
<dholbach> maybe this repo even works with   porn-get  ;-)
<schweeb> hah
<dholbach> yeah: http://www.fbriere.net/debian/dists/unstable/scummvm/src/ :-)
<herve> okay
<herve> lucasart games are obviously not been freed :-)
<siretart> woooh, nice repo :)
<herve> haaa... maniac mansion...
<herve> quite all lucasart adventures games actually
<dholbach> LOLLL
<dholbach> look at this *scroll*
<dholbach> --- indiana-jones-last-crusade-ega-1.orig/debian/copyright
<dholbach> +++ indiana-jones-last-crusade-ega-1/debian/copyright
<dholbach> @@ -0,0 +1,10 @@
<dholbach> +This package was debianized by Frederic Briere <fbriere@fbriere.net> on
<dholbach> +Sun, 13 Jun 2004 01:37:02 -0400.
<dholbach> +
<dholbach> +It was downloaded from somewhere on the Net.
<dholbach> +
<dholbach> +Upstream Author: LucasArts Entertainment Company
<dholbach> +
<dholbach> +Copyright:
<dholbach> +
<dholbach> +Yes.
<dholbach> hahaha
<siretart> LOL
<schweeb> hahahahahaha
<ogra> heh
<dholbach> we should definitely NOT have that synced
<tritium> amazing
<herve> for he had to fill in the dh_make blanks :-)
<hsprang> ogra: what do you think - as i got it, menueditor is a native package, as everyting it needs to build is in the original tar.gz
<tseng> dholbach: oh jeez
<hsprang> ogra: only, this tar.gz could be used to build from source for freebsd, too
<tseng> dholbach: elmo said that he did check out copyright on stuff
<herve> and a psx emulator with a bios ;-)
<tseng> before adding
<tseng> *why* we are adding so much junk in the first place..
<tseng> boggle.
<ogra> hsprang, but thats pretty weird...there is a lot of cruft in the repo...
<ogra> hsprang, if only the tgz is needed....
<ogra> hmm, and a source.changes would have been nice...
<hsprang> ogra: argh, no, sorry, i'm a bit confused, you need only the tar.gz and the dsc AFAIK
<ogra> hsprang, sure
<herve> Amaranth said his application is far from being ready anyway
<ogra> hsprang, i dont like native packages (as nobody here does), ignore my ranting ;)
<tritium> ogra, why do we dislike native packages?  What if there's no debian package yet?
<dholbach> native packages are a pain... ogra uploaded a 5mb one for me
<tritium> and for me too
<ogra> tritium, then make one, just not a native one :) its nice for other maintainers to separate the code and the packaging
<tritium> well, a 5 MB package, not a native one
<siretart> I updated MotoTodo with my prepared package. I'm quite tired and getting some rest. gn8 folks!
<tritium> ogra, oh, gotcha
<dholbach> tritium: a native 5 mb one
<ogra> tritium, if you make small changes to a 5M native package you cant upload only the changes, its 5M every time
<dholbach> siretart: good night
<ogra> and thats just silly
<ogra> night siretart
<dholbach> and no .diff.gz to read
<ogra> yup
<tritium> dholbach, okay.  I meant the one that ogra had to upload for me was not a native one.
<tritium> It was that tipa one
<dholbach> ah alright
<herve> I also prefer versionning upstream and debian work in separate archives
<ogra> tritium, nope, it wasnt
<tritium> tipa was a pita
<ogra> heh
<dholbach> lol
<tritium> I'm with the program now ;)
* ogra is wondering if we shouldnt put that in the NEW policy
<herve> with a "should" or "must"? ;-)
<ogra> must !!
<ogra> :)
<herve> "or you'll burn in hell!"
<herve> :-)
<ogra> yeah
<tritium> My grecipes upstream already has a debian/ directory, and it's a mess.  It's not an official debian package.
<ogra> tritium, split it :)
<dholbach> tritium: that's apain too
<tritium> ogra, what do you mean by split?
* herve wonders if it's a case of "separation of concerns"
<ogra> make a orig.tar.gz with the source and a separate diff.gz with the debian dir...
<tritium> from upstream's package?
<ogra> so all your changes will always go into the diff.gz
<tritium> okay,
<ogra> theny convice upstream to take your package instead of his :)
<ogra> -y
<tritium> cool
<tritium> I'll try that
<ogra> and soon your uploads only take some bytes in the future and the maintenance is fun :)
<tritium> yay
<herve> and tell me about cvs/svn/tla-buildpackage
<herve> s/me/them
<ogra> yeah, thats a pita too
<ogra> CVS leftovers in a package are just ugly
<herve> hu?
<herve> I didn't mean that :-)
<dholbach> if people just used  cvs export ...; make dist
<ogra> herve, never had a package that did this ?
<herve> ogra, mine, I left .arch-ids before I knew tla a bit more :-)
<ogra> herve, sorry, i know you didnt mean that...
<herve> you get nervous when reading the word "cvs"? ;-)
<ogra> but mostly thats the result if ppl dont know about xxx-buildpackage ;)
<herve> hmm...
<herve> I think I remember a package which cleaned CVS dirs in debian/rules
<schweeb> setting DH_EXCLUDE_FILES = CVS or something like that
<ogra> herve, what do you gain with that ? the CVS mess is still in the orig.tar.gz....
<ogra> its just cleaner at buildtime
<herve> ogra, don't blame me, I just saw that as a motu :-)
<ogra> :)
<ogra> i dont blame you
* schweeb cracks his knuckles
<schweeb> okay, gonna eat some food, then make myself useful and fix somethin
<jani> shouldn't we have a no lintian warnings policy on NEW packages made specifically for ubuntu?
<dholbach> sounds good
<dholbach> apart from the 0ubuntu1-crap :-)
<jani> it's different from when syncing sid or getting from another 3rd party repo
<jani> sure apart from NMU and things like that
<schweeb> remind me again what nmu stands for
<tseng> non maintainer upload
<dholbach> non maintainer upload
<tseng> wee
<dholbach> debian politics :-)
<schweeb> ahh, gotcha
<schweeb> yea, debian... politics... imagine that
<schweeb> love debian, but I have mixed emotions about half of the community
<Burgundavia> no, there is no polics in debian
<tseng> half?
<Burgundavia> it is all love and joy
<schweeb> there is a good half of the community...  some of them are working on ubuntu now, even
<hsprang> ogra: i'm back und read the above (incompletely) - but, if you think it's better not to have the debian things in the same distribution file, then you should tell amaranth
<hsprang> ogra: development is early and he can easily change i guess...
<jani> both gnomebaker and krecipes seem to be specifically packed for ubuntu
<jani> and both have warnings
<jani> that's why I asked
<ogra> hsprang, i'll do
<ogra> jani, the last gnomebaker package has no warnings
<schweeb> I made sure gsf-sharp didn't have any (except for netlibs) :)
<jani> oh great then I reviewed that last week
<herve> jani, it depends of the type of warning
<ogra> (i checked and uploaded it yesterday)
<hsprang> does it make sense for me to change that in FAI, too? it's a native package in debian already, the same it is in ubuntu
<jani> cool, it is still in the wiki :)
<herve> hd
<herve> hsprang, is it a real native debian package
<ogra> jani, ntil it passed elmo
<herve> in the sense of "made in Debian"
<herve> ?
<hsprang> made in debian for debian from start - it's intended to install debian
<jani> I see so hoary-changes gets it after elmo, ok.
<ogra> hsprang, its way easier to maintain
<hsprang> only it "learnt" to install solaris and ubuntu, too in the meantime
<ogra> jani,  all NEW packages get amual review by elmo, so if he has questions its nice to still have he review comments on the wikipage
<ogra> manual avan
<ogra> even
<jani> ogra, ok thanks
<hsprang> i'll see if and how i can do that
<jani> I have am just reviewing krecipes
<jani> has two warnings as well (shlib related)
<ogra> hsprang, if you have totouch it anyway to get your changes in, its probably the best
<ogra> jani, uhh, shlibs isnt nice...
<jani> weird warnings I am not sure how serious they are
<dholbach> jani: which ones?
<hsprang> yes, i worked out the current solution with dholbach and we might not be completely sure how to do it
<jani> a moment so I copy paste them
<ogra> jani, NEW packages shouldnt have any warnings
<dholbach> ogra: some of those shlibs warnings are pointless... at least that's what seb128 and i agreed on
<dholbach> ogra: when they're no lintian ones
<jani>  krecipes: non-dev-pkg-with-shlib-symlink usr/lib/libkrecipesexporters.so.0.0.0 usr/lib/libkrecipesexporters.so
* ogra guesses $(misc:Shilibs)
<jani> and a similar one for another .so
<dholbach> do you have a debian/package.shlibs ?
<ogra> dholbach, i wont approve NEW packages with warnings, its up to you if you do
<jani> we shopuld see if they cause problems at runtime as well
<dholbach> this is krecipes???
<jani> yes
<dholbach> erm... why didnt i get those warnings?
<jani> since while testing it it entered a loop
<jani> dholbach, I don't know
<jani> weird indeed
<dholbach> ogra: i meant a different one... not lintian-related
<jani> I am now installing kde 3.4 see if it crashes with that too
* dholbach checks again
<ogra> dholbach, _any_ warning
<jani> ogra, some warnings are false positives though even lintian doc admit it
<ogra> dholbach, except NMU
<jani> we just have to make sure which
<hsprang> ogra: but it'll take some time, i'll be busy working the next week, and atm i am fighting with system freezes and wireless issues with crappy notebook and wlan hardware...
<ogra> jani, as i said i wont approve them
<jani> even if false positives ;) ?
<ogra> jani, but the requirement is three MOTUs for NEW packages not one ogra ;)
<jani> really lintian docs say they cannot be sure they nail them all correctly
<jani> still we should get 3 happily agreeing motus :)
<jani> not voting
<ogra> jani, i have discussed hours with elmo about capital letters in descriptions or furmulations he didnt like, thus i wont accept _any_ warnings anymore...
<dholbach> ogra:
<dholbach> i was talking about warnings as STUPID as these:
<dholbach> dpkg-parsechangelog: warning: no utmp entry available and LOGNAME not defined; using uid of process (0)
<dholbach> debian: warning: no utmp entry available and LOGNAME not defined; using uid of process (0)
<jani> yes those capital letters and articles are boring
<jani> but could be correceted with a script across the universe
<ogra> jani, its one letter to change...
<ogra> dholbach, why does it touch utmp at all ?
<dholbach> ogra: please build any package
<jani> ogra I agree with you on the warings I mentioned even if they are boring
<schweeb> I only ever get errors like that when I use pbuilder...
<dholbach> schweeb: yes, exactly
<jani> but still you cannot say kDE or dVD ;)
<jani> that's why I propes an override file for gnomebaker
<jani> proposed
<ogra> jani, then you should use another formulation
<ogra> and not tart the sentence with KDE
<schweeb> dholbach: those are more problems with pbuilder's functionality than packaging problems afaict
<ogra> +s
<dholbach> schweeb: that's what i'm talking about
<dholbach> schweeb: i got a shlibs warning that was as silly as those
<dholbach> schweeb: and that was all i talked about
<schweeb> ah
<jani> ogra, do you think using override files are too much for such cases
<jani> ?
<ogra> dholbach, thats why i use debuild-pbuilder after using pbulider
<ogra> jani, if i simply can change it by rearranging a sentence, yes
<jani> hmm, I gotta start using pbuilder myself
<jani> how did he did it for gnomebaker after all?
<jani> it was CD writer ap for GNOME or something
<jani> for the shlib warnings in krecipes the verbose msg says:
<jani> N:   Shared libraries are supposed to place such symbolic links in their
<jani> N:   respective `-dev' packages, so it is a bug to include it with the main
<jani> N:   library package.
<jani> but in the next paragraph:
<jani>  However, if this is a small package which includes the runtime and the
<jani> N:   development libraries, this is not a bug
<jani> so even these warnings are not set in stone
<dholbach> jani: i'll proofread the package again
<ogra> jani, did you see my comments on gnomebaker ?
<jani> ogra,yup
<jani> in the wiki I mean
<ogra> jani, yesterday it built absolutely clean...so i uploaded it
<ogra> yup
<jani> ok I just asked how did he rephrase the description to avoid capital
<jani> I'll look on his site
<jani> except there's no link
<jani> ogra, but I'm also btw for no warnings in NEW, this is what I proposed when I started this 'thread' :)
<ogra> jani, Description:
<ogra>  gnomebaker - application for CD/DVD creation in the GNOME desktop
<jani> aha, thanks, sounds a bit forced though :)
<ogra> jani, its pointless to discuss it now, but a goodtask for the next MOTU meeting i guess, i'll put it on the agenda
<herve> I checked the developers reference for hints
<herve> the first synopsis you gave would be ok
<herve> but the DR is not normative
<jani> good idea, let the debian oldtimers set a policy so we don't spend too much time on it in the future
<dholbach> :-)
<jani> also wrt sealing universe when hoary releases it was not just  technical reasons IIRC
<herve> it's not like we're starting from zero
<jani> but mdz said something about it possibly being risky?
<jani> I though how about uni being open only for NEW packages not fixes or updates to existing ones
<jani> so nothing can regress
<herve> I can't find that "no capital letter at first" rule in the debian policy
<jani> but people ca still get new apps without adding 3rd party repos
<schweeb> that's actually a relatively decent idea
<jani> there are mant pack which won't make it in hoary
<jani> s/mant/many/
<jani> dholbach,ogra what do you think?
<dholbach> jani: to be honest, NEW packages are not my primary concern atm
<dholbach> but i'll help to review each and every new one
<jani> fair enough :)
<herve> I wonder when lintian got that silly rule
<herve> s/when/where
<jani> herve it is in thepolicy manual but I am not sure which chapter
<jani> the one that describes the control file
<jani> if you run lintian -i it migh ttell you :)
<ogra> jani, i'm very worried about the quality of our packages...(since apt-get.org goes in)
<ogra> herve, we are not debian
<ogra> herve, and we could always patch this warning out of the lintian package
<ogra> (which we probably should do for breezy)
<herve> yes
<herve> I just wondered how lintian could impose such a thing
<ogra> ask the lintian devs
<herve> hehe
<ogra> :)
<herve> a "zero warning" rule should calm down that apt-get.org thing ;-)
#ubuntu-motu 2005-04-07
<schweeb> yea, shit on apt-get.org is far from passing anything
<ogra> but we cant apply it to the apt-get.org pkgs....
<ogra> thats what makes me worried...
<herve> that's what is unfair
<dholbach> everyone: ping  re: motu report -- please /query me a line or two about what you did and liked in the last month of motu work, kthxbye, love daniel
<herve> those packages bypass quality requirements
<ogra> you can put a package with a huge backdoor on apt-get.org.....and then access all the ubuntu systems using it
<ogra> dholbach, tonight ?
<dholbach> i will now ping each and every hour
<dholbach> :-)
<ogra> how many hours ?
<dholbach> to make sure you don't feel left out afterwards
<dholbach> until april, 1st
<tritium> I'll be back later, and I'll start working on it, dholbach.
<dholbach> that's when the report is due
<ogra> ok
<dholbach> tritium: bye michael... working on what? linitian?
<ogra> so tomorrow is enough...
<tritium> dholbach, motu report info for you
<dholbach> tritium: thanks a lot
<dholbach> tritium: just one or two lines
<tritium> sure, no problem :)
<tritium> see you all soon.
<schweeb> dammit, burned my food :-/
<ogra> dholbach, http://kitenet.net/~joey/debian/unstable/
<ogra> dholbach, fun
<dholbach> yeah
<dholbach> ;-)
<ogra> Kamion will love it...
<ogra> </irony>
<herve> let me guess...
<herve> importing apt-get.org also was Colin's idea?
<ogra> there is also a experimental ....
<ogra> luckily its empty currently
<jani> herve, no I think sabdlf wants as many packages in ubuntu as possible
<jani> but we're too few to review them all
<ogra> yep
<herve> jani, I know ;-)
<schweeb> I think importing a few key packages of interest is a really good idea... after review... everything? no
<schweeb> just feels wrong
<herve> I asked for either users or those maintainers ask for the inclusion of such packages
<jani> yes there should have been a voting or something going on on users list and get in what is demanded
<jani> not every deb
<herve> as ogra said, the motu all agree :-)
<jani> evening all
<herve> bye
<ogra> schweeb, sabdfls idea was that no user has to touch the sources.list, which is a really ingenious idea....but still...
<schweeb> ogra: don't they have to go into the apt sources configurator to even get universe?
<dholbach> schweeb: yes
<ogra> schweeb, yop
<herve> hmm
<herve> I think synaptic has a checkbox
<herve> but it's
<herve> still
<herve> it's consired to be the advanced user tool
<schweeb> add another section in the repos then... "not-looked-at-by-motus-imported-from-apt-get.org"
<schweeb> :P
<herve> s/consired/considered
<herve> I suggest "dont-even-whin-on-ubuntu-users" :-)
<schweeb> hehe
<dholbach> haha
<herve> 3 level user support ;-)
<schweeb> you've got supported, supported by MOTU, and "piss off"
<herve> "cry to your mother" to stay polite!
<herve> tomorrow I'll work on other thing
<herve> those python transition are really pissing me off
<ogra> herve, any idea about burn ? there is a weird message on ubuntu-users
<herve> checking...
<ogra> its not on the transition list and installs fine on my amd64
<herve> "error installing burn on hoary" ?
<ogra> yop
<ogra> but py2.3 is available...so it should get sucked in by the deps
<herve> I'm working on it :-)
<herve> "tar: burn/docs: implausibly old time stamp 1970-01-01 01:00:00"
<herve> good...
<ogra> heh
<herve> i'm always impressed by those DD who used dh_make but but that's pretty all...
<ogra> heh
<ogra> be happy they didnt use debmake ...
<herve> *fear*
<ogra> *g*
<herve> I'm seriously wondering which priority to give to a bug against python-iconvcodec
<ogra> low ?
<herve> it seems maintain by dh_make itself, not a human being
<ogra> very_extra_low ?
<ogra> below_ground ?
<herve> I thought QA bugs would be serious
<herve> burn is nice too
<herve> "I use `pwd` because I don't know about $(CURDIR)
<herve> "
<ogra> lol
<herve> okay
<herve> I have burn ready to upload
<ogra> yay
<herve> I would have been usefull today finally
<ogra> herve, youre always useful :)
<ogra> not only today
<herve> you kidding
<herve> I broke sip4 and packages depending on it
<herve> which means qt and kde python bindinds
<ogra> and ?
<herve> bindinggggs
<herve> yes I know
<herve> who cares about kde :-)
<ogra> *g*
* ogra has drunken nearly a bottle merlot 
<herve> I'm desperately waiting on the DD to continue his work on new upstreams of those packages
* herve gives the high five to tritium 
* tritium smiles at herve :)
<schweeb> ogra: heh, I should start in on this fifth of rum I have next to me ;)
<herve> what? I said it wrong? :-)
<herve> merlot? phew...
<ogra> schweeb, prost :)
<herve> I've got whisky and champagne here ;-)
* dholbach 'd rather like cookies
<ogra> hehe
<herve> can do
<schweeb> lol
<herve> I'm still thinking how to send them in Germany...
<schweeb> when I'm not typing, I'm drinking :)
<herve> (add "about" where appropriate)
<schweeb> herve: in a big, ticking box that says "not a bomb" on it
<herve> and "fragile" too :-)
<dholbach> hmmmmmmmmmmmmm
<dholbach> cookies
<dholbach> wow, siretart had just fixed 3 packages
<herve> dholbach, you'd prefer coconut or chocolate ones?
<herve> or both!
<dholbach> yeah both! :-)
<herve> I think I'll start a business and sell them on open markets ;-)
<herve> I buy home-made jam that way
<herve> soooooo good
<dholbach> herve: my mum provides me with it :-)
<herve> you lucky
<schweeb> how old are you, dholbach
<dholbach> herve: i tell her to send you a package :-)
<dholbach> schweeb: 26
<tritium> never too old for cookies :)
<herve> I have to provide mine with this jam from grenoble :-)
<dholbach> hihi
<herve> yeah, sending a jar should be easier
<schweeb> just send some vacuum packed cookes to him, heh
<dholbach> herve: i wouldnt start a package with ONE jar - give me your adress and i'll see what i can do ;-)
<herve> it's too late if you were not serious ;-)
<dholbach> ok somebody give me an easy package to fix
<dholbach> please
<dholbach> :-)
<dholbach> i need more of a success feeling before i go to bed
<herve> "python-iconvcoded: unmaintained crap, fire that maintainer"
<dholbach> :-)
<herve> hmm... too aggressive I guess :-)
<herve> dholbach, whoops
<herve> I should have left you "burn"
<herve> or you can pretend I haven't done anything and fix it yourself
<dholbach> hrmmmm
<dholbach> EDOESNTFEELRIGHT
* schweeb hasn't had the energy to fix anything yet
<herve> in how many hou^Wdays you want to go to bed?
<herve> because you could fix gcompris :-p
<dholbach> ETOOMUCHPAIN
<dholbach> ;-)
<dholbach> wow... autogen needs assembler
<dholbach> *shudder*
<schweeb> eeek
<schweeb> why
<dholbach> http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/a/autogen/1:5.6.5-1/autogen_1:5.6.5-1_20050319-0049-ia64-failed
<herve> dholbach, I suggest you look at pidentd
<herve> but this means asking lamont to kick it, roughly :-)
<dholbach> hmm
<herve> are ia64 fixes really important if this arch is not official?
<ogra> no
<dholbach> lamont: scummvm build was cracked up by pkgstriptranslations on i386
<dholbach> lamont: nevermind... you already gave it back
<herve> why are kdebase and kdeaddons on the list?
<herve> they're in main now
<schweeb> put a note by em, irssi-text is in there too...
<dholbach> herve: it's all my fault
<ogra> irssi is fixed
<herve> dholbach, ho no, don't say that
<ogra> uploaded yesterday
<dholbach> herve: messed up the lists
<schweeb> ogra: what was the prob with irssi?
<ogra> ia64 bug
<schweeb> ah
<dholbach> lamont: why have all of the builds powerpc-givenback?
<herve> and anything related to mrproject should be dropped NOW
<dholbach> gives me the feeling something wasnt right
<herve> linux-restricted-modules-2.6.10_2.6.10.3-8_20050324-2326-ia64-failed
<herve> I guess it's not our concern either?
<dholbach> alright... looking after kmerlin
<dholbach> broken kde stuff should be referred to as Krack, right? ;-)
<schweeb> rofl
<herve> :-)
<schweeb> *cough* krap *cough*
<herve> nautilus-media should be dropped too
<dholbach> herve: mailed elmo about it
<herve> lol
<herve> pcmcia-modules-2.4.26-i386_3.2.5+1_20050324-0623-i386-failed
<herve> who cares...
<dholbach> chuck out
<dholbach> :-)
<schweeb> what should we do with these packages that need things like kernel-source-2.4.26 and such (user-mode-linux)
<dholbach> tell #u-kernel
<dholbach> zul wanted to have a look at those
<schweeb> just inform them about any package that requires a kernel-source package?
<dholbach> any kernel crack
<schweeb> okay
<herve> I wonder how many times you said "crack" today -:)
<dholbach> hehe
<tritium> be back later
<dholbach> too often
<schweeb> I could grep logs :P
* schweeb has like 200MB of IRC logs from various networks/channels
<herve> m2crypto in the archive \o/
<dholbach> yeah
<herve> I can go to sleep with the mind in peace :-)
<herve> good night all
<dholbach> i'm about to go to bed too
<dholbach> kmerlin seems to build just fine :-)
* ogra watches battlestar galactica before bed...and probably im juli afterwards
<dholbach> jaaaaaaaaa
<dholbach> "IM JULI"
* dholbach takes murphy for the last walk tonight
<schweeb> ogra: best scifi show ever
<ogra> schweeb, its the film :)
<ogra> s/film/movie
<schweeb> miniseries then ;)
<ogra> yeah
<schweeb> all the same to me, it's all good
<schweeb> when season 2's out I'll be much happier :)
<ogra> heh
<dholbach> kmerlin fixed and uploaded
<dholbach> have a good night everyone
<schweeb> night
<crimsun> night dholbach
<dholbach> if tritium turns up again: tell him to look if those libs are really needed (i doubt it) and he should look how mlview handles it in debian/rules
<crimsun> check.
<dholbach> bye daniel
<ogra> night dholbach
<dholbach> bye oliver
<schweeb> w00t, elmo put gsf-sharp through
<crimsun> evening ogra, schweeb
<schweeb> evenin
<ogra> hi crimsun
<crimsun> Riddell: ping
<crimsun> dts in #ubuntu is having problems upgrading python-kde3 (due to it not having been rebuilt for python2.4)
<crimsun> if it's ok, I'll go ahead and do the transition, but I need to check with the kubuntu folks first, I presume
<crimsun> morning, tritium
<tritium> morning, crimsun.  How are you
<tritium> ?
<crimsun> not too bad, listening to Kenny Garrett (Standard of Language) and getting ready to do more pike work.  Yourself?
<tritium> I'm fine, thanks.  Going to read some papers and perhaps try to pick something off the priority list and see if I can do anything with it ;)
<crimsun> =)
<tritium> I recorded my wife singing, and she's having a blast with audacity now :)
<crimsun> great :)
<tritium> It's fun seeing her pick up linux so well.  She uses it full time now.
<schweeb> nice
* schweeb plans on converting the parents
<tritium> hey schweeb :)
<schweeb> what up tritium
<tritium> not much.  you?
<schweeb> thinkin about fixin libgdiplus and user-mode-linux
<schweeb> heh
<tritium> nice
<schweeb> although I either gotta get the kernel guys to pkg 2.4.26's source, or I gotta upgrade u-m-l's version
<crimsun> it'll be easier to simply upgrade it in Breezy
<crimsun> for Hoary, perhaps bandaid it so it builds
<Burgundavia> just looking at torcs
<schweeb> bandaiding it so it builds needs kernel-source :)
<Burgundavia> it builds on ia64
<Burgundavia> but nothing else
<schweeb> so I gotta bump it to .27
<schweeb> in Breezy, I'll upload a 2.6 kernel
<schweeb> as I use u-m-l a decent bit
<crimsun> schweeb: rather, have it check for _a_ kernel source, not kernel-source-foo
<schweeb> er, it's rather version sensitive
<crimsun> oh, which version of u-m-l?
<schweeb> it patches the kernel, then builds from the uml arch
<crimsun> right, make arch=um
<schweeb> in universe right now it's 2.4.26
<schweeb> no 2.4.26 source... got .25 and .27
<crimsun> hmm, uml is in 2.6, though.
<schweeb> still needs patches
<schweeb> just smaller ones :)
<crimsun> gah
<crimsun> that way insanity lies
<schweeb> I'm IRCing from a UML right now
<schweeb> heh
<crimsun> yeah, I used uml a bit a while ago
<schweeb> although, I could harass mdz about it, it is his package :)
<crimsun> true :)
<schweeb> bugger
<schweeb> I'd have to fix kernel-patch-uml too
<tritium> crimsun, feel like helping ells with his sound problem :D ?
<schweeb> although I could hack it to work w/o it :)
<crimsun> tritium: lemme read scrollback
<tritium> crimsun, thanks
<tritium> ogra, you up?
<tritium> lamont, can you get ops in #ubuntu (if you're up)?
<Burgundavia> we got any aussie admins?
<Burgundavia> those are the people that would be up
<Burgundavia> like jdub
<tritium> I tried ogra and lamont
<tritium> I see you tried jdub in -devel
<Burgundavia> it is 6am in europe
<Burgundavia> on Sunda
<Burgundavia> y
<lamont> sorry - sup?
<Lathiat> 3pm/5pm in aussie so someone might be kicking around
<Lathiat> daniels perhaps
<tritium> lamont, we have a racist situation in #ubuntu
<Lathiat> talk to an oper perhaps
<lamont> who needs kick-banned?
<tritium> it has gotten rather offensive at times
<tritium> dcm
<Lathiat> oh lamont is around
<tritium> lamont, it's all in the logs if you need to see.  Also, Burgundavia has some logs of his own
<lamont> saw enough scrollback
<crimsun> thanks.
<Burgundavia> good
<lamont> so does that deal with it?
<crimsun> he'll probably be back :/
<Burgundavia> I have emailed mako
<Burgundavia> with gpg signed logs
<tritium> great
<tritium> I'm glad the issue of ops has already come up in the CC meetings
<tritium> Thanks for handling that lamont
<Burgundavia> added thanks lamont
<tritium> Burgundavia, crimsun, lamont:  have a good night.  See you tomorrow.
<dholbach> gooood morning
<siretart> morning dholbach
<crimsun> morning, dholbach
<siretart> yeah! my first package has been ACCEPTED in debian! :)
<crimsun> congrats!
<dholbach> WOW
<dholbach> grats! :-)
<dholbach> hey you two
<siretart> it's still in incoming, but has already been build for 5 architectures (not counting amd64 and i386) - buildds rock!
<crimsun> indeed they do
<dholbach> which one is it?
<siretart> its pong2
<dholbach> oh cool
<dholbach> we'll have it, when breezy opens
<dholbach> *ROCK*
<siretart> its a nice small game, classical pong in 3d (opengl). A friend of mine has done it as homework for a course, and started a project on berlios for it
<dholbach> i packaged a friends tool too
<siretart> pong2.berlios.de
<dholbach> felt obliged to ;-)
<dholbach> *screenshots*
<dholbach> woah... these kind of games make me dizzy ;-)
<siretart> definitly :)
<Lathiat> ls
<dholbach> anyway... as soon as we have it, i'll give it a spin
<dholbach> Lathiat: :   #   .   ..   HOW-TO-GET-INVOLVED.txt
<Lathiat> dholbach: :)
<dholbach> ;-)
<crimsun> are we supposed to be able to create accounts on malone?
<dholbach> erm... i have one for ages... should be the one you use with the wiki
<crimsun> d'oh!
<crimsun> no wonder, I use a different email for that one  O:-)
<dholbach> you can merge accounts on malone as well
<crimsun> ah.  Thanks!  :)
<dholbach> i went through that procedure already ;-)
<dholbach> is malone slow for you as well?
<dholbach> i wonder if it's my connection
<crimsun> it's not noticeably sluggish, no
<dholbach> ah ok
<herve> mor... afternoon!
<crimsun> morning!
<crimsun> (guh, need sleep)
<dholbach> hey herve!
<dholbach> crimsun: good night then :-)
<crimsun> 'ni :)
<ogra> night crimsun
<crimsun> night ogra :)
<ogra> good work in #ubuntu ;)
<HostingGeek> crimsun: you do not need sleep
<HostingGeek> crimsun: i NEED sleep
<HostingGeek> crimsun: paste 3 days partying only 4hrs sleep
<HostingGeek> crimsun: feet totaly swallowen
<HostingGeek> ...
<herve> dholbach, did you poke elmo about sip-qt3 new binary packages?
<dholbach> no
<herve> they just magically appear in the archive
<dholbach> wow wiki/AptGetOrg nearly finished
<dholbach> i guess i'll be able to write to the list tonight
<herve> crimsun, ping
<herve> er... he meant it when he said good night? :-)
<dholbach> pals... i'm off
<dholbach> see you later tonight
<tseng> dholbach: gift-fasttrack reverses kazaa/sharman's network
<tseng> dholbach: which they arent big fans of.
<dholbach> tseng: erm?
<dholbach> tseng: what do you refer to?
<tseng> im looking at your list
<tseng> AptGetOrg
<dholbach> comment on it, please
<tseng> ill move it to "legal"
<dholbach> yes
<dholbach> thanks for that
<dholbach> i didnt have the time to review and heavily rely on everyone's input
<herve> we'll be there :-)
<dholbach> tseng: thanks for the "heads up"
<dholbach> have a nice day everyone
<dholbach> need to catch the train
<dholbach> *wave*
<herve> ++
<HostingGeek> Amaranth: what happened with your menu editor?
<Amaranth> HostingGeek: Bugs in pyxdg have halted development.
<Amaranth> I have an 0.5 practically ready to go but pyxdg doesn't show user created menus.
<HostingGeek> Amaranth: you said it was fixed :|
<Amaranth> different bug
<HostingGeek> Amaranth: why can't you patch pyxdg...?
<Amaranth> even if i figured it out it wouldn't get into hoary
<HostingGeek> Amaranth: you got more than 1 WEEK!
<Amaranth> and other things to do
<Amaranth> pymusique is taking up a lot of my time
<HostingGeek> Amaranth: but this is a MENU EDITOR!
<Amaranth> not even in the same category as pymusique, sorry
<tseng> HostingGeek: I've told you nearly a half dozen times, no caps
<tseng> you need to stop being obnoxious or you are out.
<ogra> Amaranth, i looked at your package yesterday, we prefe not to have native packages (debian dir in the tar.gz)
<HostingGeek> tseng: but.... its a menu editor!
<ogra> prefer even
* mode/#ubuntu-motu [+o tseng]  by ChanServ
<Amaranth> ogra: I could have sworn my latest package fixed that.
<HostingGeek> ok
* mode/#ubuntu-motu [+q HostingGeek!*@*]  by tseng
<tseng> timeout chair.
* mode/#ubuntu-motu [-o tseng]  by tseng
<ogra> Amaranth, i didnt see a diff.gz in the dir...
<Amaranth> diff.gz would have the debian dir?
<ogra> Amaranth, the clean way is to have the source stuff in the .orig.gz and the debian specific stuff in the diff.gz, yes
<Amaranth> i tried taht
<Amaranth> err, that
<Amaranth> i followed the guides and everything
<Amaranth> i got an orig.tar.gz and a package
<tseng> ftp://ftp.duckcorp.org/myserver/ - can anyone get here?
<tseng> im going to mark it as dead
<ogra> tseng, nope, its dead
<Amaranth> i can
<tseng> hm
<tseng> Amaranth: yeah?
<ogra> i tried several times already....it always timed out for me
* mode/#ubuntu-motu [+o tseng]  by ChanServ
* mode/#ubuntu-motu [-q HostingGeek!*@*]  by tseng
* mode/#ubuntu-motu [-o tseng]  by tseng
<StoneTable> I'm trying to fix some stuff on the priority list (new guy).  Should I add what I change to the changelog of the package I fix?
<Amaranth> try ftp://62.4.21.229/myserver/ ?
<Amaranth> i've just gotten it twice
<HostingGeek> tseng: i can reach it
<HostingGeek> tseng: thanks
<HostingGeek> tseng: there is a hurd folder there....
<ogra> StoneTable, yup, and use pbuilder for building the new source package
<tseng> StoneTable: definately. use dch -i, and change the dist to hoary, and the revision to Debian rev -Xubuntu1
<tseng> X = debian rev
<StoneTable> yeah, I got educated on pbuilder last night :)
<ogra> great
<tseng> great
<tseng> heh :(
<ogra> :)
<tseng> anyone for http://twerner.debian.net/deb-src/ ?
<ogra> timeout
<tseng> yep.
<ogra> tseng, do you start from the bottom ?
<tseng> yes
<tseng> i will save in one second just for you
<StoneTable> do I add it to the last changelog entry, or bump the version and add a new one?
<tseng> ogra: saved
<ogra> tseng, go ahead, i wont do it now, but start from the top later then
<ogra> (didnt know dholbach wanted to leave, he was the top down guy ;) )
<tseng> i was going to go through everything in unreviewed
<ogra> me too
<tseng> just to make sure it exists
<tseng> ok well im taking a bath
<tseng> so hit it for 20 minutes or so :P
<tseng> i did a bunch
<ogra> tseng, for later....pull the Packages.gz and do
<ogra> for i in `zgrep -E 'Package\:' Packages.gz | sed 's/Package\:\ //g'`; do LC_ALL=C apt-cache show $i; done | grep -E "(Package|Version)" | grep -v Standards
<tseng> ok.
<ogra> thats what dholbach uses....
<tseng> bbiab then
<ogra> StoneTable, dch -i does nearly everything for you, if you made ubuntu changes, change the distribution in the first line from unstable to hoary and append the -Xubuntu1 to the debian version as tseng said
<ogra> make sure the mailaddress is ok...dch will tell you whats wrong on save if you made formatting mistakes
<StoneTable> okay, cool, thanks
<HostingGeek> tseng: http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/AptGetOrg LOL
<HostingGeek> tseng: i said it has a FOLDER called hurd and another one i386
<HostingGeek> tseng: plus some tarballs
<StoneTable> oh, dch is nice
<ogra> yp
<ogra> yup
<herve> dch -Dhoary is better :-)
<ogra> heh
<ogra> herve, dont disclose all our secrets ;)
<herve> don't worry, I keep the secret options for us ;-)
<ogra> heh
<Amaranth> how do i make an diff.gz?
<ogra> debuild -S
<Amaranth> dh_make made an orig.tar.gz
<Amaranth> d'oh
<ogra> you make the orig.tar.gz with dh_make, then move into the source tree and make your modifications in the debian dir....then run debuild -S to create the diff
<Amaranth> it didn't make one :/
<ogra> err, debuild -S -sa
<ogra> sorry
<Amaranth> grr, still nothing
<herve> grrr
<StoneTable> okay.  I think I've done it right: http://thorin.battleaxe.net/~stone/hoary/
<StoneTable> gotta run, but I'll be back in an hour or so
<StoneTable> Once I've built a package (going through the priority list), what's the process to have someone review it?
<herve> ask it :-)
<StoneTable> okay, could someone review my xmms-alarm-bmp1 packages? http://thorin.battleaxe.net/~stone/hoary/ :)
<herve> hmm wait
<herve> argh
<herve> I think you should have move this packages to "Working on"
<StoneTable> oh?
<herve> so that no one else would work on it at the same time
<StoneTable> ahhh, I see that on the page now
<StoneTable> I'll do that now
<herve> and I added a step
<herve> "Waiting review"
<herve> I'll review it
<herve> but can't upload it
<StoneTable> okay, cool
<schweeb> wassup stone
<herve> argh
<herve> I won't go further
<herve> it shouldn't be named like this
<herve> but xmms-alarm-bmp1_0.3.6-0.1ubuntu1.dsc
<herve> (er... no .dsc)
<StoneTable> hey schweeb
<StoneTable> okay, I'll get that fixed
<herve> no need to add another entry to the changelog
<herve> just fix yours
<herve> hey trulux !
<schweeb> StoneTable: oh yea, something I forgot to mention... when you modify a package for ubuntu, you don't generally up the main revision, you up (or add) the ubuntu revision
<trulux> hey herve
<trulux> howdy?
<herve> yeah  \o/
<herve> hi jbailey
<jbailey> heya herve.
<tseng> ogra: i finished weeding out dead/obvious stuff
<tseng> ogra: everything is in "Source Repos" now for stage 2 review
<ogra> yeah, great work tseng
<tseng> thanks.
<ogra> you rock ;)
<tseng> was nothing.
<tseng> dholbach is the real hero
* ogra is fighting with https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=8262
<tseng> (and will probably be doing alot of stage 2 :( )
<ogra> tseng, true
<tseng> poor guy doesnt know when to say no
<tseng> or something.
<ogra> thats what i am here for ;)
<ogra> i often pull him back to the ground....
<ogra> but sadly i'm not always available....
<StoneTable> is there a trick to creating a patch to use with dpatch?  I can't get dpatch to apply this patch
<ogra> he really likes to do it, but time is short....we'll have to drop a lot of tasks
<tseng> StoneTable: indeed there is.
<StoneTable> diff -u src/file.c src/file.c.patched
<ogra> diff -ruN olddir newdir
<tseng> StoneTable: http://tseng.ath.cx/log/?p=7 read this.
<StoneTable> ah
<tseng> hopefully your source isnt in a half patched state atm
<tseng> I hate when I manage that
<StoneTable> heh
<StoneTable> luckily, its a tiny patch
<StoneTable> good to learn with
<tseng> dpatch is great once you know the "trick"
<tseng> however, if your package is already using cdbs
<tseng> simple-patchsys.mk lets you use regular diffs in the same manner
<tseng> very nice.
<trulux> I don't get the (r) registered trademark character working with LaTeX
<trulux> :)
<ogra> very nice description...
<ogra> deserves a wiki page...
<tseng> there is a bit of one
<tseng> that i found after writing that
<tseng> but its not as comprehensive imo
<tseng> http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/PackagingTips/view?searchterm=dpatch
<tseng> ogra: when i wrote that, someone from docs was here and asked me about doing an ubuntu development handbook in the breezy time frame
<tseng> i dont recall the nick
<ogra> yeah, sounds like a marvelous idea
<StoneTable> well, hopefully I can get this figured out today, test this out, and get it reviewed
<herve> I'd like to participate to that
<tseng> great herve
<herve> and I know dholbach would too :-)
<tseng> basing on the debian new maint guide seems obvious to me
<ogra> the ubuntu MOTU book
<tseng> but its lacking on a few subjects
<tseng> cdbs, dpatch usage, transitions
<tseng> stuff that comes up daily here.
<herve> tseng, reading you blog page... I would never have thought dpatch is so impressive
<tseng> yeah it seemed that alot of people didnt know about it when dholbach and I started playing with it
<herve> the last howto I saw about dpatch
<herve> suggested to put the diff in 01foobar.dpatch
<tseng> and edit the top?
<tseng> lame.
<herve> and copy/paste the sh snippet at the top of it
<tseng> i was doing that as well
<herve> now I discover there's some shell inside it :-)
<tseng> but hey, on the same note
<tseng> you can actually add a custom dpatch template to debian/patches and have it use that
<herve> I guess the result is the same
<StoneTable> wow, tseng. dpatch-edit-patch is /really/ nice
<tseng> yes, but "my" way is way cooler
<herve> no hesitation :-)
<tseng> for an example of a template, see linux-image source
<tseng> not that that is terribly interesting to me
<tseng> just be aware that its possible.
<herve> I like finding examples of nice packaging tips in other packages
<tseng> im going to blog http://higgs.djpig.de/ubuntu/www/ after I hear back from the author
<tseng> it seems like alot of people miss out on that as well
<tseng> I just made a feature request for links to buildlogs
<herve> next step, qa.packages.ubuntu.com -:)
<herve> :-)
<tseng> yes.
<StoneTable> alright, patch works if called directly via dpatch
<StoneTable> but isn't applying when I run dpkg-buildpackage. I must have foobared debian/rules
<tseng> are you including dpatch.mk?
<tseng> include /usr/share/dpatch/dpatch.make
<StoneTable> yep, I added that
<tseng> did you add the patch to 00list?
<herve> it's a cdbs package?
<tseng> minus the suffid.
<tseng> suffix
<tseng> herve: doesnt matter
<StoneTable> oh, minus the suffix
<tseng> you can include dpatch anywhere
<tseng> yeah cat 00list
<herve> yes but that syntax is to be used inside cdbs?
<tseng> no?
<tseng> its makefile syntax
<tseng> cdbs just gives a set of prebuilt rules
<herve> ok, after phony targets, I need to learn that "include" keyword :-)
<StoneTable> once the file is included, I need to tell it to patch and unpatch in rules, right?
<tseng> if you actually took all the code from various .mk's in cdbs, youd have a traditional debian/rules
<tseng> albeit overly large
<schweeb> StoneTable: I would assume dpatch.make takes care of that
<tseng> its just a bit of abstraction.
<Lathiat> Can someone tell me if detachable toolbars are on in a default ubuntu install?
<tseng> yes.
<StoneTable> schweeb:  so I assumed, but it doesn't look like the patch is getting applied
<Lathiat> to me?
<tseng> yes.
<Lathiat> tseng: can you open gedit or evolution, detach the toolbar by dragging it off, then see if you can drag it back into the docked state?
<herve> StoneTable, I remember changelog entries from DDs saying they forgot to add their new patch to 00list :-)
<tseng> no, i cant put it back atm
<StoneTable> $ cat 00list 01fix-alarm-c-bmp
<Lathiat> yeh same here, so not just me and will file a bug
<herve> Lathiat, it's stuck
<Lathiat> tseng: you can get the draggers focus
<Lathiat> and hti enter
<Lathiat> and it will re-dock
<Lathiat> or just restart the app
<Lathiat> thanks
<StoneTable> patch minus the extension, right?
<tseng> yes
<tseng> that looks right
<StoneTable> okay, looks like something in my rules then.  I'll keep hacking on it
<StoneTable> something with the way it's applied via rules that's different
<herve> StoneTable, you fixed the ubuntu revision number?
<StoneTable> herve:  yep
<StoneTable> but then I found something else I should be doing different, so I'm fixing that :)
<herve> np
<herve> ogra, I think I've got the same temperature problem as you
<herve> what did you do in the end?
<ogra> herve, take my laptop off the pillow to make sure the air can circulate better
<ogra> herve, you got an amd64 ?
<herve> arf
<herve> no, a simple p4m
<herve> but I already know laptops are not to be chocked :-)
<ogra> herve, does the file /proc/acpi/thermal_zone/THRC/temperature exist on your system ?
<herve> s/THRC/THRM yes
<herve> temperature:             52 C
<herve> I'll wait to compile python-kde :-/
<ogra> i have a little tool for my system tray, i'll upload a tgz for you, might be necessary to adjust the path a bit
<herve> I had a tool for toshiba to force the fan on
<herve> I don't know for dell
<ogra> www.grawert.net/cputmp.tgz
<herve> you're using gnomecanvas? ;-)
<ogra> as i said, adjust the THERM_ZONE variable in cputmp.py and just run it...
<herve> it seems I need to install some egg.trayicon
<ogra> oops, indeed
<herve> found
<herve> apt-file rocks :-)
<ogra> yeah
<herve> gulp! 55 C
<herve> better go to dinner while it's cooling :-)
<ogra> mine is going over 70 from time to time...
<herve> I don't find the point of an amd64 in a laptop, anyway ;-)
<herve> see you later
<ogra> ciao
<herve> strange... it won't cool below 49C
<ogra> herve, mine is lowest at 42
<ogra> but the averages is 47
<ogra> -s
<herve> I don't expect a "little" p4 mobile cpu to heat that much
<herve> especially when doing nothing for a quarter of jour
<herve> hour
<ogra> probably you need to blow a bit cool wind into the case :-P
<herve> I have a usb fan to plug in case ;-)
<herve> I removed the media base to see
<herve> </ot>
<StoneTable> okay. xmms-alarm-bmp1 should probably be put into the morgue.  It depends on beep-media-player <0.9.6.1.  0.9.7 is in hoary, and it does not work with either xmms or bmp in hoary (makes xmms segfault, bmp doesn't even recognize it)
<StoneTable> should I put that in MorgueProposal?
<ogra> StoneTable, ok, then put it on the MorgueCandidates list :) thanks for investigating :)
<StoneTable> okay, np. On to the next one
<ogra> yeah :)
<herve> yeah!
<herve> let's get rid of those unmaintained crack ;-)
<ogra> yeah
<ogra> and pull in other unmaintained crack from apt-get
<ogra> .org
<herve> yeah! and python-kde too! it's incompatible with latest libraries!
<ogra> go on :)
<herve> yeah! enthusiasm!
<herve> it can't seem to go below 42C. I guess I can't expect more
<herve> good
<herve> I can't compile C++ code
<herve> it heats the laptop like hell :-)
<dholbach> hey
<herve> yo Daniel!
<dholbach> tseng: thanks for your mail
<dholbach> hey herve
<dholbach> tseng: and for AptGettingOrg :-)
<dholbach> tseng: funny thing is: mxpxpod (bryan forbes, mr. coaster) said to me coaster wasnt ready, so i stopped my packaging attempts; i'm was flabbergasted as you are, when i read his blog entry about it
<dholbach> if it's ready now *shrug* get it in
<dholbach> hey herve :-)
<herve> do you remember than command-line utility
<herve> to launch another command with regular intervals?
<tseng> dholbach: wb
<trulux> where's tritium?
<dholbach> maybe out... on a sunshiny day
<trulux> :)
<herve> er...
<herve> dholbach, ?
<dholbach> herve: !
<herve> what if I sollicitate you to upload "burn"
<herve> which is ready for 24h now :-)
<dholbach> hahaha
<dholbach> dpkg-source: extracting burn in burn-0.4.2
<dholbach> tar: Read 5120 bytes from -
<dholbach> tar: burn/docs: implausibly old time stamp 1970-01-01 01:00:00
<dholbach> tar: burn: implausibly old time stamp 1970-01-01 01:00:00
<dholbach> ESOFTWARETOOOLD
<herve> ;-)
<dholbach> shall i   touch -m   it?
<ogra> good idea :)
<herve> can't tell
<dholbach> oh.. tar/whatever did it itself
<dholbach> ah no... orig.tar.gz won't be changed
<herve> which is kinda what you except from a "orig" file ;-)
<dholbach> herve: done
<herve> thank you!
<herve> tell me you gave it a quick review :-)
<herve> I'm not totally reliable these times
<dholbach> a brief one
<herve> just a debdiff would reassure me
<dholbach> not that many uploads today :-)
<herve> yes
<herve> I'm still stuck with those sip4/qt/kde hell's angels :-)
<dholbach> :-)
<dholbach> i have a good excuse as well, was busy with lists and playing-drums-and-eating-pizza-with-a-charming-girl today ;-)
<herve> excuse accepted!
<dholbach> thanks :-)
<tritium> good afternoon :)
<dholbach> hey tritium
<tritium> What's up dholbach ?
<herve> houba!
<tritium> Hi herve
<dholbach> tritium: did they convey my message to you? concerning the shlibs-message of krecipes?
<tritium> dholbach, no.  Who's they?
<dholbach> erm
<tritium> But I know which 2 lintian warning you're referring to
<dholbach> whoever was in the channel after i went to bed ;-)
<tritium> I dicussed that with amu
<dholbach> ah ok
<dholbach> did you find out if those libraries are needed?
<dholbach> i mean... to be installed?
<dholbach> if not, you might have a look at mlview
<dholbach> they handle it nicely in debian/rules
<tritium> mlview?
<tritium> oh, okay.
<dholbach> yeah... had to have a look at their code and then remembered
<tritium> amu and I read up on that, and found out that in the case of small binary packages that require a few libs, it's okay
<dholbach> if the binary is compiled against their own libraries and those aren't to be installed you can remove them in the post-install target
<dholbach> else lintian will assume you want to install them and argues about missing shlibs files
<dholbach> erm post-compile
<dholbach> sorry
<tritium> dholbach, okay.  I'll double-check
<tritium> dholbach, this is what I was referring to: http://lintian.debian.org/reports/Tnon-dev-pkg-with-shlib-symlink.html
<tritium> 3rd paragraph
<dholbach> ah yes
<tritium> But I'll try to find out if they can be completely removed instead.
<dholbach> yeah
<tritium> dholbach, so, did anybody else review the package?
<herve> lintian would be much funnier if reports by maintainer where sorted in violation order
<herve> not alphabetical one :-)
<herve> s/where/were
<dholbach> haha herve
<dholbach> tritium: did amu review it?
<tritium> dholbach, yes, some time ago
<dholbach> did he make a note?
<tritium> he told me to fix up some lintian warnings, which I did, and it looked good
<tritium> No, but ogra reminded him to about 2 days ago
<tritium> I don't know if he ever responded to ogra or even got his /msg
<dholbach> i'll push someone towards it
<tritium> Thanks.
<dholbach> :-)
<dholbach> de rien
<ogra> tritium, i only pinged him with a messeage in -devel, he didnt answer
<tritium> ogra, okay, thanks :)
<ogra> just waiting for his comment on the page, i'm willing wave it through blindly then (even if its not my normal practice)
<tritium> Thanks, ogra.
<tritium> we had quite a night/early morning in #ubuntu last night
<ogra> np
<tritium> There was a racist incident
<tritium> luckily lamont as able to kick/ban him.
<tritium> I'm glad they discussed getting ops for #ubuntu at the last CC meeting
<dholbach> yeah... even without those guys it's hard to read anything in #ubuntu scroll-wise
<herve> I came to the conclusion that...
<herve> either python-kde or me is fscked up :-/
<herve> I quit
* dholbach comforts herve 
<dholbach> herve: take an easy Xorg-buildproblem
<dholbach> :-)
<herve> that's what I'm thinking of
<dholbach> although they're hard to spot on the list
<herve> but I wanted that python transition to finish
<herve> here I am!
<herve> free to handle that xorg transition!
<dholbach> you have to cherrypick them from the lists
<dholbach> but i'm preparing new ones ... hahahahaha
<dholbach> but i'll preserve those already fixed
<herve> er... which am I supposed to consult?
<ogra> oh, god, someone give him his pills !!!
<dholbach> UniverseDoesNotBuild
<herve> dholbach, I prefer you as WikiMaster than ListMaster ;-)
<herve> ogra, even that girl would not have calm him down ;-)
<ogra> hehe
<herve> xorg and xosd lists seem over
<dholbach> but not all xorg-buildproblems ever appeared there
<dholbach> most of those reverse-depending on liballegro* should be b0rked
<dholbach> (like atanks)
<herve> the DesktopFile transition seems endless!
<dholbach> E_NOTPRIMARYTARGET :-)
* ogra cries about electricsheep
<dholbach> 1) buildable 2) installable 3) clickable
<herve> dholbach, I just was giving a tour to all our lists
<ogra> herve i still would prefer a script generating them...
<dholbach> herve: i know :-)
<ogra> (.desktop files)
<herve> is the unmetdep list reliable?
<dholbach> yes, but you can make up your own :-)
<dholbach> apt-get -i unmet | less
<tritium> dholbach:
<tritium> rimbert@ubuntu:~ $ objdump -p /usr/bin/krecipes | grep NEEDED
<tritium>   NEEDED      libkrecipesexporters.so.0
<tritium>   NEEDED      libkrecqsqlite.so.0
<tritium> (among others)
<tritium> Does that only specify build dependencies?
<dholbach> you could just try :-)
<dholbach> and see, if they're REALLY needed ;-)
<tritium> try removing the libs and seeing if it works?  okay, I'll dothat
<tritium> do that
#ubuntu-motu 2005-04-08
<tritium> ldd returns similar info
<tritium> I'm expecting it to fail, but I'll try
<herve> looking the priority list
<herve> no one tempted to solve modconf? ;-)
<dholbach> hahahaha
<ogra> herve, go ahead
<dholbach> with kernel2.6 yeah
<tritium> I saw nvidia-settings on the list, and was going to take a look at it, and then I see daniels fixed it when I upgraded yesterday
<herve> it will be entertainment compared to gcompris and qt/kde :-)
<herve> looking at that clearsilver package... I have doubt on the mental health of either the maintainer or the mentor...
<dholbach> herve: just don't try to see sense in it
<herve> I do for choosing between fixing this version
<herve> or using the new one with a "oops! removed non-existent package from my control file!" changelog
<herve> dholbach, to be sure
<herve> are we supposed to remove packages from the list, once working on?
<dholbach> yeah
<herve> good!
<herve> I made no mistake :-)
<herve> guys, I need you to be sure I have turned mad
<herve> http://packages.debian.org/cgi-bin/search_contents.pl?searchmode=filelist&word=clearsilver-dev&version=unstable&arch=i386
<herve> http://packages.debian.org/cgi-bin/search_contents.pl?searchmode=filelist&word=python2.3-clearsilver&version=unstable&arch=i386
<herve> http://packages.debian.org/cgi-bin/search_contents.pl?searchmode=filelist&word=python-clearsilver&version=unstable&arch=all
<herve> what's the point of those empty packages,
<herve> ??
<herve> "added -fPIC for building. Should help to build"
<herve> yeah... it's not like the debian policy said it as "must"...
<herve> is physical violence against a DD in violation of the CoC?
<tseng> id say yes
<tseng> unless its preauthorized by the TB or CC
<herve> it's like that clearsilver package could have been packaged by my grandmother
<dholbach> i think most canonical employees never even read the CoC
<tseng> -fPIC should be applied to every library w/o any thought applied
<herve> debian QA standards, heh...
<tseng> its absolutely required on amd64, mips, and probably others
<herve> tseng, the debian policy clearly says it
<tseng> good.
<herve> dholbach, you mean I could ask a canonical employee to torturate that guy? ;-)
<dholbach> herve: of course
<herve> yoohoo!
<dholbach> i recall at least 4-5 people kicking, killing and xyz-ing stuff
<herve> if that guy is a DD, I could have been for years
<herve> </therapy>
* tritium gives herve electric shock therapy ;)
<herve> wasn't enough, I still to get my nerves on something :-)
<tritium> heh
* dholbach shudders slightly
<tritium> Well, removing the symlinks removes the lintian warnings, but the program doesn't run now.
<dholbach> argl
<dholbach> grm
<dholbach> bad idea then
* tritium utters expletives under his breath
<herve> dholbach, would you please upload that rott^Wwonderful clearsilver package? :-)
<herve> heya koke !
<koke> hi all!
<koke> I'm at home again :D
<dholbach> herve: of course
<dholbach> koke: hellas
<herve> koke, this means you're back for fixing the universe? ;-)
<koke> herve: sure :P
<herve> great!
<herve> so we have all finish in a few hours now :-)
<herve> now I want to play with modconf :-)
<dholbach> herve: erm
<dholbach> herve: could it be they just never built? those 2.3-modules?
<herve> they can
<herve> but the maint invented some clearsilver1 package he never created
<herve> what the... kernel-source 2.2.25 is in the archive :-)
<dholbach> hm, you seem to remove the python2.3-modules
<herve> and install python2.4-module :-)
<dholbach> i really have the biggest sympathy if you do that, but...hmmmmm
<herve> let's pretend I haven't touched modconf at all...
<dholbach> don't feel so obliged
<herve> can I push it to the morgue? :-p
<dholbach> don't think so
<herve> dholbach, what is the number in parentheses next to the package?
<herve> (in priority list)
<dholbach> popcon rank
<dholbach> popcon.debian.org
<herve> er...
<herve> are the most important packages at the top or bottom?
<dholbach> top :-)
<herve> hmm
<herve> ho
<herve> rank != score
<herve> unless less is better :-)
<herve> lamont, ping
<herve> does anyone have an ia64?
<ogra> herve, are we millionaires ? :-P
<herve> not all of us ;-)
<ogra> heh
<herve> hmm
<herve> kdebase should not be ther
<herve> e
<herve> it's in main
<herve> move it the the mo... er I mean, remove it :-)
<herve> the same goes for kdeaddons
<herve> was something decided for kernel 2.4 packages?
<ogra> they need to be in
<dholbach> zul wanted to take care of those
<dholbach> make them installable again
<dholbach> or look which could be chucked out
<ogra> probably hecould take modconf too
<herve> who will otherwise? ;-)
<ogra> fabio
<dholbach> ok pals, i think i'm off for tonight
<dholbach> see you tomorrow
<lamont> herve: not really  here - need to run off for a while
<lamont> amu:   kdepim-dev: Depends: kmail (= 4:3.4.0-0ubuntu5) but it is not going to be installed
<lamont> is the new kdeaddons state
<ogra> lamont, he's not here
<ogra> lamont, -> -evel
<ogra> devel
<ogra> night dholbach
<tritium> good night dholbach
<dholbach> bye ogra
<lamont> ogra: ah,
<herve> I can't see what's wrong with svgalib1g(-dev)
<herve> sure it's outdated
<herve> but I still can install it
<tritium> ogra, I poked amu about krecipes review
<ogra> yup, i saw :)
<tritium> cool :)
<lamont> herve: which platform?
<lamont> and package...
<herve> ia64
<herve> pidentd, a2ps and mpage
<herve> seems they were blocked by these problems on the buildd
<herve> pidentd could even be in the ia64 archive by now
<lamont> grep svgalib_ buildLogs/Lists/hoary.all.*
<lamont> buildLogs/Lists/hoary.all.i386:universe/libs/svgalib_1:1.4.3-20ubuntu2: Installed by buildd+terranova [optional:out-of-date] 
<lamont> that's what's wrong with svgalib...
<lamont> it only exists on i386...
* lamont must go.
<herve> I don't really know svgalib
<herve> but what's wrong about it :-)
<herve> thanks lamont
<herve> night all
<crimsun> ok, I'm going to go ahead and transition python-kde3 if that's ok with others.
<crimsun> Will wait one day for objections.
<schweeb> what's up tritium
<tritium> Not much, how about you schweeb?
<schweeb> trying to work up the energy to work on something before bed :)
<tritium> It's pretty late already ;)
<schweeb> yea, 11:40 already
<tritium> yep
<crimsun> evening you two ;)
<tritium> hi crimsun.  What did you just fix for GhostFaceKilla?
<crimsun> tritium: .desktop entry for vlc was installed to wrong location in debian/rules (d'oh!)
<tritium> nice fix :)
<crimsun> I wish all fixes were that straightforward ;)
<tritium> yeah
<trulux> heya
<crimsun> I'm fine with the idea, trulux, but we need to go over them
<trulux> crimsun: http://pearls.tuxedo-es.org/libssp/debian/
<trulux> ogra: pitti commented to me that I can ask you too
<trulux> hey doko
<trulux> jezz, this ill is an asspain
<crimsun> hmm
<crimsun> 404
<trulux> crimsun: really?
<trulux> it's mirrored
<trulux> immediate solution: http://tuxedo-es.org/downloads/libssp/
<trulux> it's rsync'ed every hour with pearls.tuxe...
<crimsun> any possibility that 2001:470:1f01:165::1 has a different config from 140.211.166.18?
<crimsun> apparently I'm hitting the ipv6 addr
<trulux> then that's the problem
<trulux> I will report it to OFTC
<crimsun> thanks.
<trulux> thanks for noticing it :)
<crimsun> np :)
<trulux> reported
<crimsun> hmm, I'll just trick moz-firefox into using only ipv4
<trulux> ok
<trulux> hehe
<trulux> have you got the packages, diff, dsc and original tarball? I can mail them so you don't need to waste your time
<crimsun> I'll try and wget them from the mailing list post
<crimsun> trulux: have these packages been added to MOTUToDo?
<trulux> crimsun: ok, many thanks in advance
<trulux> crimsun: not yet
* trulux goes for it
<crimsun> trulux: ok, please add these, thanks :)
<ogra> morning
<crimsun> morning, ogra :)
<ogra> trulux, guessing libssp is a NEW package, it should also go on MOTUNewPackages
<trulux> ogra: Ok, so, not in Todo
<trulux> jezz, reversed TPE got in grsec a few time ago, and that was an idea of mine that was remove from vSecurity in it's first release :D
<ogra> if you put it on todo, add a hint to it...that ist on NEW
* trulux slaps himself
<trulux> ok
<crimsun> will look later, have to jet back to work.
* crimsun waves
<ogra> bye crimsun
<crimsun> bye ogra, trulux
<trulux> ogra: done
<ogra> great :)
<dholbach> hey!
<ogra> hi
<trulux> dholbach: qoo woo!
<dholbach> :-)
<trulux> dholbach: submitted libssp1 stuff to MOTUTodo
<trulux> mot mot!
<dholbach> it's a NEW package, right?
<trulux> right
<dholbach> could you then put it on MOTUNEWPackages, please?
<trulux> it's in NewPackages page
<dholbach> ah right ok
<trulux> just my repo is in Todo page
<trulux> <trulux> Ubuntu is really Debian on steroids
<trulux> shouldn't that be the motto of the project?
* dholbach linkes this better: "Ubuntu" is an ancient African word, meaning "humanity to others". Ubuntu also means "I am what I am because of who we all are". The Ubuntu Linux distribution brings the spirit of Ubuntu to the software world.
<trulux> me too
<trulux> it would rock to append my one ;D
* trulux kidding
<dholbach> hey koke
<koke> hi all
<koke> do you know if I already can upload?
<dholbach> ask elmo if he added your key to the keyring
<koke> hmmm, I think I should add a bit more of complexity to the list :)
<encolpe> hi
<koke> IMHO, WithoutDesktopFile packages have less priority than DoesNotBuild
<koke> dholbach: elmo is 82 hours idle :)
<dholbach> hrm
<trulux> anyone reviewing libssp1?
<ogra> trulux, there are a lot other packages on NEW...
<ogra> i doubt we will have three free MOTUs before release
<ogra> (regarding the more then 3000 unbuildable packages on the lists)
<trulux> christ :O
<trulux> ok, kein Problem
<trulux> :)
<ogra> gut :)
<ogra> trulux, you targeted breezy anyway, right  ?
<trulux> right, but getting libssp1 in Hoary might be a great thing
<trulux> as my gcc patches are already in gcc-3.4 sources
<trulux> :)
<ogra> lets see waht we can do, but i cant promise anything....
<trulux> many thanks in advance
<trulux> ogra: NP, don't do it if it harms other Ubuntu work being done
<trulux> If i must wait I will do, first we need to to get Hoary properly released, and I wouldn't like to an asshole that makes it harder to accomplish ;)
<trulux> s/to an/to be an/
<herve> hi!
<dholbach> hey herve
<haggai> guys what's the freeze policy for universe nowadays?  apt-proxy should be updated to newest version because I have fixed a lot of bugs since the current universe version
<dholbach> haggai: update it
<haggai> dholbach: k thanks
<ogra> haggai, we are unfrozen until the last minute ;)
<haggai> heh I thought that would be the case :)
<herve> hi haggai !
<herve> glad to hear you
<haggai> hi herve
<Treenaks> http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/p/putty/0.57-1/putty_0.57-1_20050324-1302-ia64-failed
<Treenaks> that looks like a problem on the buildd to me
<herve> I have several like this
<herve> I suggest we make up a list for lamont to check
<herve> and give them a kick if necessary
<ogra> Treenaks, thats before 19:00
<Treenaks> yeah
<herve> ogra, 18:57 precisely ;-)
<Treenaks> ogra: oh, there should be a note on the page about that then :)
<ogra> heh
<herve> even more
<herve> I'll change the wiki page for that list
<ogra> yeah
* Treenaks waits
<ogra> guys please, please, please comment dholbachs apt-get.org mail, its important that we see as many opinions as possible
<amu> moin
<dholbach> hey amu
<herve> Treenaks, done
<ogra> hi amu, frohe eier ;)
<herve> hmm... I wonder if the "can't build" table applied
<ajmitch> ogra: replied
<herve> hey ajmitch !
<ajmitch> hi
<dholbach> hey ajmitch
<ogra> yeah !!
<ajmitch> hopefully I used the right email address ;)
<ogra> heh
<ogra> nice reply :)
<ajmitch> thanks
<amu> we've probably a new guy for packaging kde, i'll send him to here, he's very new on building .debs
<ogra> great..
<dholbach> cool
<ogra> we'll push him into shape ;)
<dholbach> MOTUKDETeam is just around the corner
<herve> as long as he's not new to building itself :-)
* ajmitch subscribes to u-users
* dholbach hands ajmitch a handkerchief... in advance
<ajmitch> dholbach: I wasn't using my gmail account for anything useful ;)
<ogra> hehe
<dholbach> ah alright, i see
<amu> ogra: danke, wuensch dir auch dicke eier
<ogra> amu, hehe
<amu> motaboy: welcome, this is the motu channel
<motaboy> amu: Hi :D
<ogra> hi motaboy
<motaboy> hi ogra
<herve> Treenaks, I merged my list with the "can't build" table in the end
<herve> erm
<herve> latest putty ia64 build succeeded
<herve> so end of the story?
* herve wikiing again...
<motaboy> I've got a little question. kdebluetooth has it source dir called kdebluetooth-1.0_beta1 and already a debian dir that I'd like to change.
<motaboy> the version is wrong. How can I call it?
<dholbach> motaboy: what version would be appropriate?
<dholbach> oh so it's a NEW package... does not exist yet for debian/ubuntu?
<motaboy> dholbach: not again
<motaboy> dholbach: the problem is that dh_make says that kdebluetooth-1.0_beta1 is wrong (for the _ betwee 1.0  and beta1)
<motaboy> doko: but also calling it 1.0beta1 is wrong as 1.0beta1 > 1.0 for apt
<ajmitch> perhaps 1.0~beta1 would be acceptable
<dholbach> yeah exactly
<dholbach> dpkg --compare-versions   can always tell
<motaboy> dholbach: the problems is that I want to keep the original debian dir, create a .orig file, and then change it.
<motaboy> to do this I tried using dh_make to create the orig file, but it complains on the directory name.
<herve> let me suggest 1.0+beta1
<dholbach> motaboy: no problem: mv upstream-tarball.tar.gz <package>_<version>.orig.tar.gz
<herve> haggai, that's just this step?
<dholbach> then extract it to   <package>-<version>  and if you run   debuild -S   (after applying your changes) you have a nice source package and a nice diff.gz which tells what you changed
<motaboy> dholbach: Thanks a lot. I'll try!
<dholbach> motaboy: cool :-)
<haggai> herve: 1.0+beta1 > 1.0   - not good for apt
<motaboy> dholbach: and the <package>_<version>.orig.tar.gz would have the new version i choosed, but I'll keppe it's dir to the original name?
<haggai> 0.99+1.0beta1
<doko> starting with breezy I hope we are able to use 1.0~beta1
<haggai> ajmitch: using '~' causes problems with various tools
<ajmitch> haggai: I thought those tools were fixed by now
<haggai> ajmitch: I don't think so for hoary
<ajmitch> and that it was only woody that had old enough versions to break
<dholbach> doko: it should work already
<haggai> ajmitch: no, there are other factors.  eg libtool breaks
<ajmitch> nasty
<haggai> libtool uses '~' as internal seperator and you get all sorts of problems
<dholbach> oh
<dholbach> hrm
<haggai> that one might be fixed but afaik there were other probs
<herve> how can I see the current list of packages with version on ia64
<herve> some build issues seem resolved by now
<doko> dholbach: yes, it works, but does it already get accepted by katie?
<dholbach> doko: i recall a package using it... hang on... i'll ask mvo, he'll know
<ogra> dholbach, ALL packages on backports use ~
<dholbach> ogra: that doesnt answer the katie question :-)
<ajmitch> ogra: you said the word!
<ogra> dholbach, which you secetly asked while i was disconnected ;-P
<dholbach> ogra: no... doko did
<ogra> ah, ok *g*
<dholbach> ogra: and you were there
<dholbach> 14:47
<ogra> ah, ok.... the first sign of life i saw again after the GRMBLFJX
<dholbach> doko: he thinks i should work and also recalls some package using it already :-)
* doko thinks dholbach's dog needs fresh air ...
<dholbach> doko: he thinks it should work .... :-)
<dholbach> doko: murphy will get fresh air an hour or something, when i finished this does-not-build list crack
<dholbach> ok, i'm going to ease some wiki pain: I'll remove UniverseDoesNotBuild and integrate it into UniversePriorityList (i'll try to take care of your changes ;-)) and it'll be all in the format:  * libdata-dumper-perl [http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/libd/libdata-dumper-perl/ Logs]  (16848)
<tritium> Good morning :)
<ogra> hi tritium
<tritium> hi ogra
<herve> heya tritium !
<tritium> hi herve!
<tritium> What's up herve?
<motaboy> Thanks to you all I finally understand how everything works and made a first version kdebluetooth deb.
<herve> compiling packages all day and night :-)
<motaboy> now I've got other questions :P
<tritium> way to go :)
<motaboy> in kdebluetooth there's also an IrmcSync konnector for kitchensync... I'd like to make a separate package for it as it depens on kdepim and it's not very stable...
<motaboy> what is the policy compliant name it should have?
<herve> check how other kitchensync connectors are named
<motaboy> herve: they are all in the kitchensync package.
<dholbach> ok lists done
<herve> I suggest kdebluetooth-irmcsync then
<dholbach> hey tritium
<dholbach> UniverseDoesNotBuild is obsolete
<dholbach> sorry for the trouble i gave you... list-wise
<dholbach> but it took me a while to figure out
<dholbach> and i hope the test rebuild is finished soon
<tritium> dholbach, you have me no trouble at all.  What do you mean?
<tritium> gave, that is
<herve> ha
<herve> I tought you were doing mistakes using French grammar :-)
<dholbach> tritium: i mean the lists (UniverseDoesNotBuild and UniversePriorityList) on the wiki - i manage to have main entries there as well, forget to remove things, ...
<herve> (thought)
<tritium> dholbach, it's okay :)
<dholbach> herve: is this the only trouble i gave you? :-)
<tritium> herve, did I use French grammar unknowingly?
<herve> not really :-)
<motaboy> herve: ok thanks!
<dholbach> so: have fun with UniversePriorityList - i'll take a leaf out of doko's book and head out for a walk
<herve> ++
<herve> er... dholbach?
<dholbach> herve: h?
<dholbach> hm?
<herve> it seems you have added packages from main
<dholbach> yeah
<dholbach> i know
<herve> and there are xcfe packages, although they have their own list
<dholbach> sorry for that
<dholbach> if you have an idea how to fix it... i put the URLs of the scripts i used on the page
<dholbach> and i didnt "add" them, i just didnt manage to remove them :-)
<herve> I compared to the previous list :-)
<motaboy> herve: so now I should create a debian/kdebluetooth.files and a debian/kdebluetooth-irmcsync.files reporting inside the files needed by the packages?
<herve> yes
<herve> now you have several binaries
<motaboy> herve: or can I only define the debian/kdebluetooth-irmcsync.files and all the other will automaatically belong to kdebluetooth?
<herve> you need to distinguish those kind of files
<herve> hmm... I don't really now for that
<herve> I'll try to clean the list
<dholbach> bbl
<tritium> see you dholbach
<ogra> bye dholbach
<jinty> hey, is there someone in here that can upload a patch for schoolbell for me?
<crimsun> jinty: sure, got a url?
<herve> grmf!
<crimsun> darned Internet! ;)
<herve> no, the laptop
<herve> it gets easily at 60 C and hangs
<crimsun> d'oh
<encolpe> mmh
<encolpe> natural born bad laptop, change laptop
<herve> thanks the Dell Site Care :-/
<encolpe> huh
<encolpe> :(
<encolpe> my dell laptop doesn't hang, it melts
<tritium> my Dell power supply sure gets hot, and then decides to shut itself off, particularly when I'm powering the laptop and charing batteries at the same time
<herve> nice :-)
<herve> hmm... debian kernels use dpatch but don't use any 00list file
<herve> I hope the patch I added will be applied
<trulux> hey tritium
<tritium> hey trulux
<trulux> tritium: howdy?
<tritium> trulux, hi
<trulux> tritium: just a bit of confusion, heh
<tritium> :)
<jinty> hoi crimsun, sorry it took so long, the patch is for http://issues.schooltool.org/issue185 and is at http://issues.schooltool.org/file28/patch
<\sh> happy easter to all :)
<tritium> Happy Easter, \sh :)
<herve> it was yesterday no? :-p
<\sh> well...today is eastermonday ;)
<\sh> so...if you forgot some eggs ;) please find it today ;)
<herve> all eaten :-)
<\sh> hehe...
<\sh> installing 101MB deb packages now ;)
<trulux> \sh: 170 here
<trulux> :)
<\sh> trulux,  :)
<herve> hopla!
<jani> hello all
<herve> hello jani
<dholbach> hey janc
<dholbach> argl
* dholbach rips out the TAB key
* jani hands another tab key to dholbach
<dholbach> hello mr. jani monoses, how are you on this lovely day?
<dholbach> ah... this is better
<dholbach> :-)
<jani> why thank you monsieur holbach I am fine
<herve> dholbach, I'm removing the packages from main in the list
<jani> I have to catch elmo, as usual :)
<dholbach> i'm delighted to hear
<jani> hmm he's idle for > 3days looks like it's not gonna happen today
* dholbach prepares for some uploading party ;-)
<herve> to be sure my algorithm is good
<herve> can you confirm bind9 is in main?
<dholbach> yop
<herve> good
<herve> and apache 1.3 is not considered to be dropped?
<dholbach> don't think so
<herve> muhahaha! on ubuntu-users
<herve> "glxgears, an intensive opengl application"
<dholbach> oh my... i wish they had more tangible worries
<herve> nope, when you discover cpu and mem monitoring, anything worries you :-)
<herve> hi thierry
<thierry> hi herve
<thierry> herve, I've just seen that gdesklets is still at version 0.33.1
<thierry> I sent the changes to seb128 to make it to 0.34.1
<thierry> any idea what happened?
<herve> why do you ask me?
<thierry> well because you were the first to talk to me and that seb128 is not here :P
<herve> I don't know if I should feel honoured :-)
<herve> hmm... another security hole fixed in webmin :-)
<dholbach> was it removed? :-)
<herve> users like it :-)
<herve> wasn't pinball fixed?
<herve> lamont, ping
<herve> or anyone having power on the buildd
<herve> we need to sort out those buildd issues!
<herve> what's the status of importing those new xfce packages?
* herve wants the universe to ROCK!
<herve> dholbach, I suggest when we make a first run on the list
<herve> to see what was caused by a buggy buildd
<lamont> herve: sup?
<herve> what was fixed by now
<herve> what is serious
<herve> lamont, can you search "buildd" on https://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/UniversePriorityList
<herve> lamont, and tell us what's your diagnosis and remedy
* lamont looks
<lamont> snacc: snaccC, not buildd is segfaulting.  Does it in the non-test build as well.  Probable cause: sizeof(void*) != sizeof (int): binary not in archive
<lamont> pidentd: built on all 4 architectures, hoary and hoary-test.  ppc log missing from main logs, but built/in archive.
<herve> so issue closed?
<lamont> a2ps: given back on ia64
<jani> herve, we requested elmo to sync xfce, so it is pending I guess
<herve> what given back means?
<herve> ok jani, thanks
<herve> lamont, a2ps also failed on ia64, but for an odd reason
<lamont> a2ps given back on ppc too
<lamont> given-back ==> requeued
<lamont> pidentd is closed
<lamont> snacc is preexisting issue in the package
<lamont> a2ps is requeued on the architectures where it was dying
<herve> are the build attempted as much as necessary or the number of tries is limited?
<lamont> builds are tried once, then either succeed, auto-depwaited, or come to me for handling.
<herve> okay
<lamont> mpage given back on ppc, ia64
<herve> ia64 need a kick?
<lamont> proftpd is OK. (closed)
* herve discovering the buildd slang ;-)
<lamont> putty OK as well (closed)
<lamont> udev needs a kick to the head..
<lamont> anyway, entire list either fixed, explained (snacc - your issue...), or requeued
<lamont> s/fixed/fixed already/
<herve> yes, that's our current concern
<herve> but when the build fails for obvious reason
<herve> we need you
<herve> thank you very much!
<lamont> right.
<lamont> np on having me check any of those
<herve> I hope so :-)
<dholbach> hrm, what's the problem with http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/g/gnucash/1.8.9-4/
<herve> hmm... gtkhtml3.0 seem to need a libhowl transition
<dholbach> gtkhtml3.0 needs to be chucked out
<herve> also :-)
<dholbach> should transition the rdepending to gtkhtml3.6
<dholbach> about gnucash: i get the same cracked up unmet-dependency messages, when i try to build it
<lamont> dholbach: personal bet would be that the build-depends include one that depends: libreadline5-dev, and one that depends libreadline4-dev
<dholbach> lamont:    apt-get -d build-dep gnucash    works at my place
<lamont> whcih is to say, a series of apt-get -ud commands should reveal which package needs to have things fixed...
<lamont> current hoary?
<dholbach> yep
<dholbach> lamont: had the same problem with multisync
* lamont investigates
<lamont> libguppi-dev
<lamont>   liborbit-dev libpaper1 libpopt-dev libreadline4-dev libwrap0-dev libxau-dev
<lamont> guile-1.6-dev
<lamont>   libreadline5 libreadline5-dev
<lamont> in hoary test
<herve> dholbach, so I transition gtkhtml3.0 or move it to the morgue?
<dholbach> herve: there are still some packages depending on libgtkhtml3.0-bla
<herve> what's what I meant by transitioning :-)
<herve> hmm... there's maybe too much
<lamont> dholbach: and also current hoary
<lamont> so either guppi or guile-1.6 is out-of-date for you...
<dholbach> lamont: very strange indeed
<dholbach> herve: would begnomesword, encompass, mysql-query-browser
<herve> yes, peacock too
<herve> so libhowl transition?
<dholbach> herve: you the first two, i the last two?
<herve> so gtkhtml transition?
<herve> :-)
<dholbach> we need not list for those :-)
<herve> just tell me what to do!
<dholbach> herve: change build-dependencies to gtkhtml3.6 and see if it works for 1) gnomesword 2)  encompass
<dholbach> :-)
<herve> good!
<herve> no thinking!
<herve> like it!
<herve> dholbach, checking for libgnomeui-2.0 gtk+-2.0 libgtkhtml-3.0 gal-2.0 libxml-2.0 sword... Package libgtkhtml-3.0 was not found in the pkg-config search path.
<herve> report from gnomesword
<dholbach> change in configure.{ac,in} and add changes of autconf in a patch :-)
<herve> nothing more?
<dholbach> hoping that it works :-)
<herve> I mean, some command to run :-)
<dholbach> autoconf
* herve will make its second dpatch attempt
<herve> in the rules file?
<dholbach> no, separatedly on your box
<dholbach> and add its changes in a (d)patch
<herve> got it!
<dholbach> *ROCK*
<dholbach> herve: same here :-)
<herve> encompass too
<herve> woogoo!
<schweeb> dholbach: I added a morgue recommendation yesterday - user-mode-linux (talked with mdz about it)
<herve> :-)
<dholbach> haha
<dholbach> schweeb: added it on wiki/MorgueCandidates too?
<schweeb> yes
<dholbach> schweeb: rock
<dholbach> will write to elmo about it
<schweeb> man, this sucks... 4 hours late for work :-/
<siretart> hi folks :)
<herve> hi siretart !
<siretart> I'm trying to fix some Packagess from the priority list, namly gpm and mtr
* herve is living dangerously!
<herve> siretart, you're welcome :-)
<siretart> but I fail to see any problems with those packages. how comes?
<herve> siretart, gpm seem to miss from i386
<herve> probably just needs a kick/sync
<siretart> herve: but it is building fine in my pbuilder chroot!
<siretart> hmm. just a new reupload?
<herve> something like that
<herve> about mtr
<herve> latest is all successfull
<herve> just remove it from the list
<siretart> ok. both?
<herve> no
<herve> wait for gpm to hit all the archives
<siretart> ok
<herve> tseng, I added you blog entry about dpatch on wiki/PackagingTips
<siretart> I'm looking now at vcdimager, it fails with error message CHARSET CONVERSION FAILED... I guess this is due to utf8
<siretart> would It be acceptable to disable the testsuite? the package seems to build fine though.
<siretart> it is disable when crosscompiling anyway.. hmm
<herve> siretart, that's what unit tests are for :-)
<siretart> herve: yeah, usually I would agree, but..
<siretart> hmm.. ok, I try to fix the tests..
<herve> okay I spoke too fast!
<herve> my dpatch patch is not applied at all:!
<herve> dumb me!
<dholbach> herve: same here
<herve> dholbach, vim debian/patches/00list
<dholbach> i messed up the rules file instead :-)
<herve> gulp!
<siretart> gulp. vcdimager is using some kind of magic testsuite of automake..
<herve> anything involving automake is magic to me :-)
<herve> dholbach, hmm... I guess I need to add dpatch to the build depends...
<dholbach> herve: ha... did that too, just my debian/rules doesnt work yet
<siretart> ah, I think I found it..
<herve> gaaaa!
<herve> how do you make a dpatch patch applied at all?!
<siretart> herve: I use the dpatch-edit-patch command
<siretart> great tool :)
<herve> sure!
<herve> and listed my patch in debian/patches/00list
<herve> and added the include into debian/rules
<herve> but nothing happeds
<herve> (happens)
<herve> rock! my laptop got below 39 C!
<herve> wow! you can add conditions in 00list
<siretart> rock! vcdimager fixed! this was a rather tricky one :)
<siretart> herve: you need to depend on target patch-stamp in target build in debian/rules. have you?
<herve> argh
<herve> tseng, you never said it ;-)
<herve> thanks siretart, I'll find some example
<herve> siretart, I followed the dpatch example and added patch-stamp to build-stamp
<herve> and patch in the phony targets
<herve> it's ok for you?
<siretart> herve: shoud be ok, I think. be sure to read /usr/share/doc/dpatch/README.gz
<dholbach> ha nice... mysql-query-browser requires 1) gtkhtml 2) gtkmm 3) python transition *ROCK*
<herve> that's a big fish you caught ;-)
<herve> there's progress
<dholbach> herve: gladly the mandatory  package[outstanding_transitions] ==gcompris[outstanding_transitions]  -check didnt work
<herve> my patch is unapplied but not applied :-)
<herve> dholbach, which means?
<dholbach> herve: i'm still looking at the package :-)
<herve> got it!
<herve> I patched after the configure
<herve> whereas I was patching that #$*! configure :-()
<herve> :-)
<dholbach> woohoo
<herve> you can tell it
* herve having dinner
<herve> argh!
<herve> gnomesword is incompatible with latest gtkhtml
<dholbach> *argl*
<dholbach> latest unstable 3.1.1
<herve> you sure you want to get rid of gtkhtml3.0 ? ;-)
<dholbach> herve: don't worry... just leave it :-)
<dholbach> herve: the new version uses gtkhtml-3.0 still
<herve> yep
<herve> we're really not helped :-)
<dholbach> ok... mysql-query-browser done
<herve> so what have you done in the end?
<dholbach> dpatched it
<dholbach> want to have the debian/rules i used?
<herve> I mean
<herve> it compiled smoothly with gtkhtml3.6?
<dholbach> fortunately, yes
<herve> you lucky!
<dholbach> forget it... take another one
<herve> I don't quit so easily :()
<herve> but I have a gtkhtml3.0 recompiled just in case!
<jani> goodbye all
<herve> now I quit!
<herve> dholbach, are you interested in that gtkhtml3.0 recompiled without libhowl? ;-)
<dholbach> poor herve :-/
<dholbach> i ask seb :-)
<herve> er... what do I say...
<ogra> what do you say herve ?
<herve> I'm not even sure why the build failed!
<herve> ogra, http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/g/gtkhtml3.0/3.0.10-1/gtkhtml3.0_3.0.10-1_20050326-2023-ia64-failed
<herve> what's your diagnosis
<lamont> herve: one of the packages that it build-deps on still has libhowl.la mentioned somewhere in /usr/lib/lib*.la
* lamont investigates
<herve> I knew rebuilding it wasn't enough...
<ogra> yep, its libhowl
<ogra> creating libgtkhtml-3.0.la
<ogra> /bin/sed: can't read /usr/lib/libhowl.la: No such file or directory
<ogra> libtool: link: `/usr/lib/libhowl.la' is not a valid libtool archive
<herve> sure :-)
<dholbach> grep howl /usr/lib/*.la
<ogra> herve, grep
<herve> /usr/lib/libgal-2.2.la:dependency_libs
<herve> /usr/lib/libgal-a11y-2.2.la:dependency_libs
<herve> I rebuild libgal2.2
<lamont> herve: actually, it requires uploading a new gal2.2 to hoary
* lamont goes to kick seb128\
<herve> lamont, how do know?
* herve foolish want to upload a package in main...
<lamont> because libhowl was dropped through a carefully ordered uploading of packages, instead of adding versions to the build-depends
<lamont> and ia64 appears to have lagged behind a bit
<herve> Isee
<herve> dholbach, woohoo! encompass doesn't bother me with gtkhtml's version!
<dholbach> YES
* ogra thought ia64 wer the faster ones... *g*
<ogra> were even
* ogra kisses his amd64
<herve> ;-)
<herve> config.log po/POTFILES
<herve> those files are changed in my diff of encompass
<herve> is it wrong?
<lamont> ogra: the ia64 boxes in the data center are really dog-slow boxes... lowest pricepoint machines, etc
<lamont> although bdale tells me there must be something wrong, since they should be much faster than they are
<ogra> ah, ok....probably it scales heavily with the amount of CPUs....
<\sh> hey ogra...
<ogra> hi
<herve> siretart, ping
<\sh> ogra, why u told klaus that I'm doing now something for ubuntu ?? ,-)
<siretart> herve: pong
<herve> siretart, so you fixed vcdimager?
<siretart> herve: yeah, it is building for me in my pbuilder
<siretart> i uploaded it on my server..
<ogra> \sh, why not, is it a secret ?
<herve> siretart, because you have not moved it from "The list" to "Working on"
<herve> and now "To review"
<herve> :-p
<\sh> ogra, he told me that last thursday in jamesons ;)
<siretart> herve: oh. did I miss to press 'save'? hang on..
<herve> don't press save then!
<herve> dholbach, about that "Finally worked on all Buildds (all archs)" table
<dholbach> lamont: i just saw that mdz assigned you #8316 - here is what i gave doko ages ago: http://moz.gotdns.org/ubuntu/wxwindows2.4-debdiff
<ogra> \sh, was it wrong ? should i keep it secret ? tell me if thats the case
<herve> dholbach, let's just remove things that were already fixed to light the page
<siretart> herve: well, UniversePriorityList looking fine now, or did I miss something?
<dholbach> herve: yeah go ahead
<\sh> ogra, no :) i was just suprised if he's making jokes with me that evening...i was a bit dizzy ;)
<ogra> oh, ok
<herve> siretart, okay, but just remove it from "The List" so that no one will pick it
<herve> I'll do it
<siretart> herve: thank you, next time I'll get it right ;)
<jbailey> Are universe bugs supposed to go into malone now?
* doko wonders about dholbach's interpretation of "ages" ...
<dholbach> jbailey: bradb wanted to spread the word, when the backend is ready (from what i know)
<dholbach> doko: sorry, didnt want to blame you for anything - i typed it in a hurry
<ogra> doko, an age >= 30min
<jbailey> dholbach: 'k thanks.
* dholbach wipes out "ages ago"
<herve> ogra, and how much in american seconds? ;-)
<ogra> hehe, ask mako ;)
<herve> someone having a powerpc?
<jbailey> herve: I do.
<herve> jbailey, could you try to (p)build usbview?
<lamont> dholbach: confused by why I wound up with 8316... I can fix it sure, but it is universe, and all that...
<ogra> hmm, why is it in bugzilla ?
<lamont> must be used-to-was main, dunno
* ogra kicks firefox
<\sh> hmm?
<lamont> dholbach: so, since you have a patch, and the power, you wanna just upload?
<herve> jbailey, same thing for libapache-mod-ssl, a serait gnial :-)
<dholbach> lamont: he must think you're the saviour :-)
<jbailey> herve: Am I looking for the same problem with both?
<herve> jbailey, the buildd failed, I'd like to test it elsewhere
<herve> and with the current seed (?)
<herve> ogra, I just love your temp applet!
<dholbach> lamont: can't: it's a 4267426MB native package and my connection is too slow
<herve> dholbach, you forgot a digit :-)
<ogra> herve, if i have enough data about all the thermal implementations, i'll package it
<lamont> we have no terabyte source packages
<lamont> :-)
<jbailey> herve: Feh.  usbview seems to want to update the buildenv at build time, and does so poorly.
<ogra> lamont, ot yet...wait until apt-get.org gets in ;)
<lamont> although OO.o is trying to get there, it seems...
<dholbach> hahaha :_)
<lamont> dholbach: grumble... ditto here.
* lamont deals with it
<jbailey> herve: In fact, the whole packaging is fubar, it's a GNU mode automake package without a ChangeLog, etc.
<lamont> your debdiff is good, dholbach ?
<jbailey> herve: I don't imagine how it would work on any arch.
<dholbach> lamont: not really sure... i hoped someone would double check it... it's not really nice, since files that are in both (wx2.4 and wx2.5) are simply removed
<herve> jbailey, argh!
<tseng> herve: it was on planet
<tseng> herve: but thanks.
<herve> just leave it, libapache-mod-ssl it more important IMO
<herve> tseng, planet? the TV channel? I don't watch it :-p
<tseng> herve: er.. planet.ubuntu.com
<herve> tseng, didn't know
<ogra> herve, planet.hollywoord, dont you know the restaurant ;)
<ogra> -r
<jbailey> herve: After I reran autoreconf -f -i and fixed and added AUTOMAKE_OPTIONS=foreign to Makefile.am, it builds fine.
<lamont> WTH needs 14MB of source.  sheesh
<dholbach> lamont: and it takes AGES to compile
<herve> ogra, :-p
<herve> jbailey, usbview? you ROCK!
<ogra> herve, :)
<ogra> doesnt that need /proc/bus/usb ?
<herve> dholbach, beware people will interpret it as half an hour :()
<herve> ogra, the libusb I guess
<jbailey> $ ls -ald /proc/bus/usb
<jbailey> drwxr-xr-x  4 root root 0 2005-03-28 08:57 /proc/bus/usb
<jbailey> Oh, hmm.  I'm running on a fallback 2.6.8 kernel right now because a grub2 experiment went poorly yesterday.
<dholbach> herve: then it took at least 4 ages
<lamont> ETA 1:05:00
<jbailey> If this build is dependant on kernel features, this might not be the best test.
<herve> dholbach, it didn't even exist at the dinosaurs time!
<dholbach> herve: hopefully not :-)
<herve> jbailey, don't worry for the functional test, I just wanted to test the build
<herve> hmm... what did we say about kernel-source-2.6.8 in our list...
<dholbach> zul wanted to check those
<herve> I mean, wo we leave it in our list?
<jbailey> herve: libapache-mod-ssl builds fine here.
<herve> jbailey, you just rock!
<herve> good, lacheck was already fixed!
<jbailey> herve: Eh?  I didn't do anything to that one. =)
<herve> jbailey, you gave me time :-)
<herve> jbailey, I guess you know better than me what to do with those changes in usbview?
<herve> strange, usbview is in the archive for all archs
<jbailey> herve: Up to date even...
<herve> argh!
<jbailey> Although,
<jbailey> Oh I see why I trigger the AM bug.
<herve> I think I'm confused between the archive and rebuilding universe
<jbailey> It wouldn't trigger if the person doesn't have automake installed.
<ogra> hey guys pe7er would like to help with some easy tasks, could someone lead him a bit ?
<pe7er> :)
<herve> lamont, I'm still not confident with the log
<herve> lamont, http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/g/gtkam/0.1.12-2.1/
<herve> lamont, how to say lincity is fixed or not on powerpc?
<dholbach> hello pe7er :-)
<herve> s/lincity/gtkam
<herve> but the same applies :-)
<herve> hi pe7er
<pe7er> please play easy on me, i'm not a coder by any means.
<pe7er> hi
<pe7er> (so i'm afraid of wasting your time, but if you have something i can do i'll gladly help)
<herve> pe7er, you're welcome and we're here to help too, so don't worry
<dholbach> pe7er: i'm glad you show up here, nice of you, you want to help out
<schweeb> pe7er: lookin to fix some packages I take it?
<herve> hi Burgundavia
<dholbach> pe7er: at the moment our biggest target are packages that fail to build, some cases are easy since they just require different build-dependencies, if you're brave look at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UniversePriorityList :-)
<schweeb> pe7er: http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/UniversePriorityList check out that list for a package you're interested in helping with
<dholbach> pe7er: if you run into any trouble, just holler :-)
<schweeb> damn, beaten by dholbach by a millisecond
<schweeb> build logs for the packages are at http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/
<dholbach> pe7er: you might find installing pbuilder helpful (it takes care of a completely separated build process and shows up most common errors) -> http://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto
<tseng> hi dholbach
<tseng> how goes
<dholbach> hey tseng
<ogra> tseng, busy like bees all around ..... 24h to RC
<lamont> herve: universe/graphics/gtkam_0.1.12-2.1: Needs-Build [extra:uncompiled] 
<dholbach> tseng: reviewing kdebluetooth, looking at peacock, kicked off the apt-get.org thread
<tseng> hm
<herve> lamont, where do you read that :-)
<lamont> buildLogs/Test/Lists/hoary-test.all.powerpc
<ogra> *****yeah, again, please everybody reply to this thread on ubuntu-devel@ we need as many opinions as possible ****
<ogra> (apt-get.org that is)
<pe7er> great. i'll take a look and see what i can do. besides someone brought to my attention that there is a problem with the current wx2.5-headers package (not only in hoary but in debian also), see http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=294998, recent amule will fail to build because of that (and i guess it will be a popular package).
<Burgundavia> herve: salut
<herve> lamont, and this means it's on the queue for another try?
<lamont> yes
<lamont> Needs-Build -> Building -> {Failed, Dep-Wait, Uploaded -> Installed}
<lamont> with the understanding that Building-> Failed is a lamont-step
<herve> I just can't wait :-)
<dholbach> pe7er: not sure if that is one of the easy cases
<dholbach> pe7er: just talked to lamont about it
<dholbach> pe7er: you set up the pbuilder already?
<herve> could someone please review and upload siretart's vcdimager?
<dholbach> herve: yeah
<crimsun> pe7er: wait, wha?
<pe7er> dholbach, i am on it and yes, i've been already told its not a trivial case. i don't think i could do that
<crimsun> what's wrong with wxwidgets2.5.3?
<crimsun> err, s/.3//
<lamont> crimsun: #8163
<herve> crimsun, it's wxwidgets, that is :-)
<dholbach> pe7er: sure: go ahead :-)
<crimsun> what the
<siretart> stats for today: installed girlfriends notebook with hoary, probably fixed 1 package :)
<siretart> gotta go, cu folks!
<herve> bye siretart
<herve> thank for you work!
<dholbach> crimsun: some files (those on mentioned here: http://moz.gotdns.org/ubuntu/wxwindows2.4-debdiff) conflict in 2.4 and 2.5
<herve> good... I broke the wiki page :-)
<crimsun> dholbach: yes, but I didn't muck with those because the Debian maintainer says there's a coming solution
<crimsun> I'm really hoping Ron packages 2.5.5 with a fixed archive.h
<ogra> crimsun the next 6 days ?
<crimsun> ogra: highly doubtful, which is why I did all that cruft :)
<ogra> heh
<ogra> k
<crimsun> looks like I need to push archive.h in, though
* herve dreams of an intelligent merging of concurrent wiki changes, and "au revoir" conflicts!
<dholbach> herve: i think it's next goal after "don't save everything in ONE blob" :-)
<herve> dholbach, do we really need that xfce list on that page?
<dholbach> herve: chuck it off, crimsun and jani know what they're doing
<herve> hmm... a three-way merge :-)
<herve> dholbach, I just wanted to move it :-)
<crimsun> speaking fo XFce, waiting on elmo; he's understandably busy
<crimsun> of^
<dholbach> crimsun: what about manually uploading those? how many source packages have you got?
<dholbach> crimsun: would still require elmo's NEW approval
<dholbach> phone
<Vollstrecker> crimsun or dholbach: Have you modified the rules file of wx?
<herve> good night all!
<ogra> night herve
<tseng> uh
<schweeb> gotta love netsplits
<herve> (fixing a last package...)
<crimsun> what the
<Vollstrecker> crimsun: netsplit
<crimsun> I think I pinged out completely, though
<ogra> herve, youre addicted ?
<herve> ogra, can't stop... gaaaa...
<ogra> heh
<lamont> crimsun: rather, 8316
<herve> ++
<ogra> herve, go to the anonymous packagers :=)
<Vollstrecker> crimsun: Have you modified the rules file of wx?
<crimsun> lamont: right, that's what I read in BTS
<crimsun> Vollstrecker: yes, I added an explicit invocation to autoconf
<crimsun> Vollstrecker: Debian #285186
<Vollstrecker> crimsun: I'm working on the archive.h bug of the debian pkg.
<crimsun> Vollstrecker: ok, great.
<Vollstrecker> I was the one that told pe7er to tell you
<crimsun> Vollstrecker: thanks, appreciate the heads-up
<Vollstrecker> I'm just compiling
<ogra> Vollstrecker, if its solved before the 5th it could go in the release
<Vollstrecker> But I think you won't get a working diff if you modified that file.
<crimsun> is archive.h the only missing header?
<Vollstrecker> ogra: I want to fix it this night
<Vollstrecker> Afaik yes.
<ogra> yeah
<crimsun> can we made explicitly certain it is?
<crimsun> that way it would be sufficient just to pull archive from upstream cvs's tag
<crimsun> archive.h, rather
<Vollstrecker> It is in the source package. The dir were it is in is copied, I don't know why it ins't copied, too.
<crimsun> ok, it'd be line 707 of ubuntu's wxwidgets2.5's debian/rules
<crimsun> now to figure out why archive.h doesn't land in $(objdir_msw_install)/include/wx-$(release)/wx
<Vollstrecker> Because msw isn't built. You mean objdir_gtk_shared
<tseng> ogra: sent.
<ogra> yeah, great
<crimsun> Vollstrecker: aha
<Vollstrecker> install-gtk-shared-stamp: build-gtk-shared-stamp build-gtk-shared-contrib-stamp
<Vollstrecker>          dh_testdir
<Vollstrecker>          mkdir -p $(objdir_gtk_install)
<Vollstrecker>          cd $(objdir_gtk_shared) \
<Vollstrecker>                  && $(MAKE) install prefix=`pwd`/../$(objdir_gtk_install)
<Vollstrecker>          cd $(objdir_gtk_shared)/contrib/src \
<Vollstrecker>                  && $(MAKE) install prefix=`pwd`/../../../$(objdir_gtk_install)
<Vollstrecker>          touch $@
<Vollstrecker> That's the place to look for
<crimsun> oh d'oh, I didn't read the previous line in the build log
<crimsun> says objs_gtk_sh right there, sigh
<Vollstrecker> I think that's the place. I'm just testing this place, but it takes long, till build process is there
<ogra> yeah, wx is a pita to build
<ogra> at least you have lots of spare time....
<Vollstrecker> jep, and I'm afraid of starting it another time after it works, like I want.
<ogra> tseng, are you sure the first letter of the pre last word wasnt a typo ? ;)
<tseng> ogra: s:g:r:g ?
<tseng> quite possibly.
<ogra> lol
<tseng> the emial might be a little strong
<tseng> i tend to do that.
<Seveas> ogra, on my system hwdb-client gives pythin errors after the sound test, is this known?
<ogra> Seveas, oh, no.....that shouldnt happen, can you send me the error ?
<Seveas> ogra sure
<Seveas> pm or e-mail?
<Seveas> it's quite short
<ogra> as you like....
<Seveas> i'll pm you
<ogra> so pm
<dholbach> ok, back again
<tseng> wb
<dholbach> now i'll look at the vcdimager
<Burgundavia> ogra: I am getting an error with hwdb-gui with xrandr (probably due to the flgrx drivers)
<ogra> GAH...
<Seveas> Burgundavia lol :)
* Seveas too :)
<Burgundavia> ogra: should I file a malone bug so as you have something to track?
<ogra> Burgundavia, you tried it before, right ?
<ogra> iirc
<Burgundavia> it worked before I changed to ati drivers
<ogra> aha
<Burgundavia> and it worked until it tried to collect the data
<ogra> ok....
<Burgundavia> I can test without the ati drivers to see if that is the issue?
<ogra> strange, seems like the fglrx driver is borked then
<dholbach> siretart: uploading vcdimager
<Burgundavia> flgrx and xrandr don't like each other
<ogra> Burgundavia, that would be helpful
<Burgundavia> never had
<Burgundavia> s/had/have
<ogra> ah, i didnt know that, daniels gave me the advice to use xrandr
<Seveas> ogra I will try it too
<ogra> Seveas, no need, according to Burgundavia i'll have to change my code then
<Seveas> brb
<Seveas> ow ok
<Burgundavia> xrandr error happend with xfree86 too
<ogra> Burgundavia, thats not an issue for me....
<Burgundavia> ok
<ogra> but fglrx is
<Burgundavia> yes
<Burgundavia> flgrx is crap
<ogra> a serious one...
<Burgundavia> I wish I bought nvidia
<Burgundavia> but I was being patriotic (being canadian)
<tseng> do the ati driver not work for you?
<tseng> oss
<tseng> they suit my needs well enough.
<Burgundavia> it does, but no 3d
<Burgundavia> they work very well, but I play tuxracer and quake3 about once a week
<tseng> ive played quake3 with the oss drivers
<Burgundavia> I like my 90fps
<crimsun> Vollstrecker: hum, arrimpl.cpp probably shouldn't exist in the -headers package(s), either
<Burgundavia> poor ogra
<Vollstrecker> Never noticed this file.
<ogra> Burgundavia, i'll sort it, no worries...will just make my night a little longer ;)
<crimsun> Vollstrecker: yeah, there are three .cpp files in include/wx/
<Burgundavia> ogra: is that something that is a release goal for hoary?
<Vollstrecker> Jep, I see. Maybe I should ask Ron, if this is expectet
<tseng> i just played tuxracer np
<ogra> Burgundavia, it has to be ready tomorrow 22:30 UTC
<Seveas> oof
<Seveas> well, i'll test as soon as you have the new version then
<Vollstrecker> crimsun: There are several .bmp's too.
<Burgundavia> ogra: eep
<ogra> Burgundavia, its ok, i really love to program until the sun rises.... (not kidding)
<Burgundavia> ogra: sorry about not reporting it earlier
<ogra> Burgundavia, not your fault, i blame daniels for that advice if its a known problem...
<ogra> (never owned an ati card in my whole life)
<Burgundavia> http://noxa.de/~sbeyer/debian/packages/ <--- this is listed as dead on aptget.org wiki page, but is live
<Burgundavia> however, I don't know where it should be filed
<dholbach> lamont: is it considered to be ok to chuck build problems (just) on ia64 (like http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/c/catdoc/0.93.4-1/) off the list?
#ubuntu-motu 2005-04-09
<lamont> dholbach: they're not issues until hoary releases
<lamont> then they're issues again
<lamont> so it's good to still at least semi-track them...
<schweeb> might as well make a DoesNotBuildIA64 page
<tseng> Burgundavia: like i said, some of that stuff times out for ogra and I, and others can get to it
<dholbach> lamont: seems like it was a buildd issue
<tseng> Burgundavia: to be painfully obvious, we dont want that stuff in the first place, so marking a false dead is cool in my book
* lamont looks
* tseng hopes he doesnt get hit with fire and brimstone for saying suck
<tseng> such
<ogra> tseng, sabdfl isnt lurking ;)
<schweeb> hehe
<Burgundavia> tseng: I have no opinion, so I leave it as is
* lamont swats dholbach with the pre-1857 log file for catdoc
<ogra> heh
<dholbach> lamont: merci beaucoup :-)
<lamont> dholbach: having said that, it looks like it didn't get given back either
<lamont> so I did that
* dholbach looks at qiv
<crimsun> Vollstrecker: I will be away for two hours, but please let me know which fixes to merge.
<Vollstrecker> If it finished till then.
<dholbach> Vollstrecker: you're not working on the conflicting files of wx2.4 and wx2.5?
<dholbach> it's something else, right?
<Vollstrecker> archive.h
<dholbach> ah ok
<ogra> Burgundavia, does the resolution selection work for you (it relys on xrandr afaik)
<ogra> (from System->Settings)
<Burgundavia> ogra: no
<ogra> ah, ok
<Burgundavia> ogra: The X Server does not support the XRandR extension.  Runtime resolution changes to the display size are not available.
<ogra> thats what you get ?
<Burgundavia> yep
<ogra> nice
<Burgundavia> always have with flgrx drivers
<ogra> wow, today i recieve nearly every 10mins a new submission....i'll know every system on the planet if i'm done with all this data...
<dholbach> hahahaa
<ogra> at least all laptop setups ;)
<ajmitch> hi all
* ajmitch went in to work today, no internet connection there, and nearly everyone taking the day off :)
<dholbach> :-))
<ajmitch> so today is a fine day for MOTU work! :)
<dholbach> ajmitch: have fun: wiki/UniversePriorityList is all yours :-)
<ajmitch> haha
* ajmitch does some nfs trickery first
* schweeb looks at gnome-alsamixer
<dholbach> what was the state of linux-user-mode stuff, was about to chucked out or what?
<schweeb> it has a build dep on 2.4.26 for one
<dholbach> re-appeared on the list, like a zombie :-)
<schweeb> and I talked to mdz, who is the upstream maintainer
<dholbach> alright
<schweeb> er debian maintainer
<schweeb> and he said that it's not currently worth the time to fix
<schweeb> 2.4.26 is security hole ridden
<schweeb> and it would require a big overhaul to make it work for 2.6 kernels
<dholbach> ok
<dholbach> *arg* gnucash build-depends on libtool
<schweeb> hehe
<ajmitch> nasty
<dholbach> and on m4
<dholbach> nice
* ajmitch is waiting for his box to stop thrashing so he can look at the todo list for the day
<ogra> Burgundavia, could you run: lsmod|grep fglrx for me ?
<ajmitch> hmm, I'm glad I got home when I did, raining outside now..
<ajmitch> just the sort of weather for hacking
<tseng> yesh
<ogra> or Seveas ^^^
<ajmitch> just remove from the list packages that appear to have magically been fixed?
<ajmitch> eg: http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/p/portsentry/1.2-5/
<dholbach> ajmitch: yip
<ajmitch> make[1] : Entering directory `/build/buildd/echoping-5.2.0'
<ajmitch> cd . && automake --gnu Makefile
<ajmitch> configure.ac:7: your implementation of AM_INIT_AUTOMAKE comes from an
<ajmitch> configure.ac:7: old Automake version.  You should recreate aclocal.m4
<ajmitch> configure.ac:7: with aclocal and run automake again.
<ajmitch> Makefile.am: required file `./depcomp' not found
<ajmitch> nasty stuff that
<dholbach> ajmitch: dpatch-edit-patch 01_reran_aclocal_and_automake  ->  aclocal; automake --gnu -f -> ctrl-d   :-)
<ajmitch> eeevil
<ajmitch> it only failed on ppc, btw
<ajmitch> and it'd require adding the dpatch build dependency :)
<dholbach> well yes and editing debian/rules :-)
<tseng> mmm dpatch
<Burgundavia> ogra: and?
<Burgundavia> ogra: fglrx                 237312  7
<ogra> ah, thanks, just needed approval, rolling the fixed package now
<schweeb> bugger
<schweeb> gnome-alsamixer looks to be some gtk+ goofiness I don't understand
* ajmitch spots a WONTFIX issue on the list there :)
<ogra> Burgundavia, could you try out http://www.grawert.net/hwdb-client_0.5-0ubuntu3_all.deb ?
* dholbach has to rebuild guppi, before he can finish off gnucash
<ogra> yeesh, i just recieved the hwdb data for a mac mini
<schweeb> heh
<Burgundavia> ogra: can do
<ogra> Burgundavia, thanks
<Burgundavia> ogra: got it
<Burgundavia> ogra: it worked
<ogra> yeah
<dholbach> someone around who wants to have a look at #8324?
<Burgundavia> ogra: wierd bug though, the forward button seems to be timed
<koke> hi motus!
<ogra> Burgundavia, timed ?
<dholbach> seems like a test, if we can sync fwbuilder
<dholbach> hey koke
<Burgundavia> ogra: imm. after it ungreys, it is not clickable
<ogra> Burgundavia, iz GTK bug ;) a ancient one
<ogra> you need to move the mouse away once its weird :=)
<Burgundavia> ogra: yes, I see that
<Burgundavia> ogra: very annoying
<ogra> Burgundavia, you can hit the enter key if youre testing....thats the advantage....(of train a chicken to do i for you)
<ajmitch> dholbach: btw, have you done over 250 yet?
<Burgundavia> ogra: lol
<dholbach> ajmitch: no unfortunately not... was busy with those wretched lists the last days :-)
<ajmitch> :)
* ajmitch just uploaded a couple of his own that needed fixing
<koke> who did the change in PriorityList from "search" to "logs" ??
<dholbach> koke: it's new
<dholbach> koke: UniverseDoesNotBuild now is obsolete
<koke> there are a lot packages without build problems
<dholbach> so i figured it'd be the easiest thing, to check the build-dir
<Burgundavia> ogra: hmm, wierd gtk display glitch
<koke> like the WithoutDesktopFile
<ogra> Burgundavia, yop
<dholbach> koke: we're weeding out
<Burgundavia> ogra: no different one
<ajmitch> koke: well if you want to add extra columns to indicate which category they belong to?
<ogra> ??
<Burgundavia> ogra: text wierdness
<ogra> NOOO
<dholbach> koke, ajmitch:those are just from http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/*.html
<ogra> Burgundavia, where
<dholbach> koke, ajmitch: if you come across one that built on all archs, remove them from the list
<ajmitch> dholbach: ok, so it's not the whole collated list of packages to fix, no matter what the problem :)
<schweeb> I can't for the life of me get libgdiplus to build either... not even the newer version
<Burgundavia> ogra: on video, really minor
* ogra hasnt written one line of the code he is suppoed to tonight
<dholbach> ajmitch, koke: sorry for all the confusion the lists brought
<ogra> Burgundavia, elaborate please
<ajmitch> dholbach: no! they're great :)
<Burgundavia> ogra: easiest to make you a capture and you can see
<ogra> Burgundavia, or mail me a sshot
<koke> dholbach: ok, I hope tomorrow I'll be back to real world :D
* dholbach looks at xfprint4
<dholbach> koke: cool :-)
<koke> I just came back home yesterday, but some friends are visiting the city
<koke> I'm soo tired :)
<Burgundavia> ogra: I will
<Burgundavia> ogra: what is your email?
<dholbach> Burgundavia: hostmaster@grawert.net
<Burgundavia> ok
<ogra> heh, you just sent me a mail ;)
<schweeb> tsocks appears to be building fine now
<dholbach> koke: so now you're going to have a beer or something?
<koke> dholbach: no, I'm on bed now
<ajmitch> has there been any news at all on the status of apt-get.org packages?
<koke> relaxing in my universe :)
<dholbach> ajmitch: just those 5 mails on the mailing list
<ajmitch> ok..
<schweeb> lamont: wu-ftpd might need a kick on ia64, builds fine on all others, and the problem looks like a buildd problem
<schweeb> lamont: http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/w/wu-ftpd/2.6.2-17.2/wu-ftpd_2.6.2-17.2_20050328-0636-ia64-failed
<dholbach> crimsun: you'll update xfprint4 then as well?
<ogra> Burgundavia, i must admit i dont really see the difference in the screenshots....
<ajmitch> what do we need to do about those that just have 1 arch remaining in 'given-back' state?
* schweeb heads home
<Burgundavia> ogra: there is a small display glitch with the text
<ogra> hmm
<thierry> im packaging gdesklets 0.34.3 ... anyone interested to commit the change after?
<dholbach> thierry: seb128 is the maintainer afaik
<thierry> k...
<seb128> hi
<seb128> what's the issue with gdesklets ?
<dholbach> seb128: <thierry> im packaging gdesklets 0.34.3 ... anyone interested to commit the change after?
<thierry> and when there's new dependencies, what do I need to do?
<seb128> hum, to be clear
<dholbach> thierry: change debian/control
<dholbach> thierry: and maybe try building in a pbuilder (http://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto)
<seb128> if somebody want to work on gdesklets, update it, whatever feel free
* koke 's going to sleep now
<seb128> but don't break it
<koke> bye all
<Vollstrecker> If they aren't added automatically while building, you have to set them manually, or check why they aren't set.
<thierry> Vollstrecker : k so if they are in the configure.in is it ok?
<seb128> thierry: obviously you don't know a lot about packaging, you should read how that works, updating just by guessing what to do will not give anything good
<seb128> no
<thierry> k
<ogra> seb128, how is it possible to break something thats always boken :)
<dholbach> thierry: no, you have to change debian/control
<seb128> the Build-Depends need to be manually listed
<seb128> and the shlibs magic works only with ldd
<seb128> ie: not for python
<seb128> and to be clear: gdesklets is crap
<ogra> :)
<seb128> they break compatibility every 2 versions
<tseng> seb128++
<seb128> and I don't speak about how the desklets are b0rked
<tseng> there is a dh_python btw
<seb128> dh_python will not guess than you need python-xdg to run
<seb128> that works fine for usual stuff, but not for desklets
<Vollstrecker> seb128: shlibs works for perl, too. I don't know about python
<seb128> no it doesn't
<seb128> dh_perl works for perl
<seb128> like dh_python for python
* ogra wonders about the dh_seb128 that fixes all gnome packages in a row :)
<thierry> ok, once the configure is updated, is there anything else to fix for the dependencies?
<seb128> you don't have to change the configure
<thierry> I mean the debian/control
<seb128> debian/control.in should reflect the requirements
<Vollstrecker> ${perl:Depends}, not shlibs, but it works
<Vollstrecker> Now I see what you meant, sry
<seb128> what an useless discussion, sure than perl:Depends works
<ogra> Vollstrecker, thats the equivalent to dh_perl
<Vollstrecker> A little late tonight
<ogra> Vollstrecker, here too :) gruss aus der eifel
<thierry> so after the debian/control fixed is there anything else to do for dependencies?
<Vollstrecker> Gru aus Fulda
<ogra> oh, ein hesse
<seb128> I don't want to be rude, but learn about packaging instead of changing some random stuff on people advice
<thierry> ok
<thierry> so where can I learn?
<dholbach> thierry: try the build
<dholbach> thierry: try building in a pbuilder (http://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto)
<seb128> no no no
<seb128> no point to build packages when you don't know what you do
<seb128> gdesklets use a debian/control.in, you need to update this one
<seb128> not debian/control
* tseng remembers that :)
<seb128> the Build-Depends need to reflect what you need to build
<seb128> the Depends what you need to run
<thierry> k
<seb128> what depends is new ?
<thierry> but where can I learn?
<thierry> Well, gnome-python and pyorbit
<seb128> these depends are not new
<Vollstrecker> For debian there are howtos, for ubuntu I don't know.
<thierry> well they are not in the configure.in of 0.33.1
<seb128> the 0.33.1 configure is broken
<seb128> look on debian/control
<ogra> Vollstrecker, the package format is the same....we just use a special versioning scheme for ubuntu changes
<seb128> python-gnome2 is in the depends
<thierry> ok
<seb128> http://www.debian.org/doc/developers-reference/
<seb128> http://www.debian.org/doc/maint-guide/
<seb128> about the packaging
<ogra> Vollstrecker, so all the debian docs apply
<seb128> and python-gnome2 depends on python-pyorbit
<thierry> k
<thierry> gotta go, thanks guys, I'll learn and come back one day
<dholbach> bye thierry
<seb128> what is your requirement usually guys ?
<seb128> people are supposed to know how the packaging work, or you just upload random stuff as far as the update works ?
<dholbach> requirement?
<seb128> like thierry who wants to update gdesklets
<dholbach> seb128: i hope you can imagine the answer
<ogra> seb128, we cross check the packages, until we think the work is sufficient
<seb128> I've explained to him how to update the changelog a week ago
<seb128> and to update the debian/control
<dholbach> seb128: if we don't feel confident in people they don't become MOTUs
<ajmitch> yay, got an old imac, might be able to build powerpc stuff now
<seb128> but he doesn't even know what the package install, how the control field work, etc
<tseng> seb128: we keep giving their stuff back until we are happy with it
<seb128> k
<tseng> if they arent getting a clue after awhile
<tseng> im not sure what to tell them
<seb128> because updating gdesklets once is easy, that's basically a changelog update
<tseng> people here so far either get it, or are total tools (HG)
<seb128> but if there is one change he's screwed because he basically doesn't know anything out of the changelog update and will not notice any issue
<seb128> k :)
* dholbach looks at xfstt
<ogra> dholbach, morgue morgue morgue
<dholbach> ogra: go ahead :-)
* dholbach uploads the fix anyway ;-)
<ogra> heh
<dholbach> elmo didnt morgu-ify the others i told him to
<dholbach> i think morguifying will be breezy business
<ogra> hmm
* ogra thinks this could become a malone stress test for unmorguified software
<dholbach> ogra: that's what i like about you: you always think positive :-)
<ogra> hehe
* ajmitch gets to fixing up qemu
<dholbach> crimsun: will you get xfprint4 synced too?
<dholbach> crimsun: because there's a build issue and i fixed it, before realizing it was xfce - shall i upload it nevertheless?
<crimsun> dholbach: yes, and yes
<dholbach> ok
<dholbach> rock
<crimsun> thanks :)
<dholbach> de rien :-)
<Vollstrecker> crimsun: I got archive.h included. I've done that by hand while interupting the build process with the read instruction. Tommorrow morning I'll modifie the rules, to include it automatically.
<crimsun> Vollstrecker: In the 'install-gtk-dev' target?
<crimsun> if so, I'll just use a manual install invocation
<Vollstrecker> In that lines I gave you. install-gtk-shared-stamp:
<crimsun> uh I pasted the wrong target
<crimsun> yeah
* dholbach takes kterm
<dholbach> hmmmmm, fresh krack :-)
<crimsun> Vollstrecker: ok, I'll make that adjustment and test locally.  Thanks for your troubleshooting.
<Vollstrecker> Now I have to look, in which dir it is, when this line is reached, then I can copy it automatically.
<Vollstrecker> Maybe you wait, tommorrow morning it will be in debian bts, so you can use your time for some other pkg'd
<Vollstrecker> pkg's
<crimsun> right, but we might not be able to sync from Sid
<Vollstrecker> I can send you the modified lines per mail.
<crimsun> if we can, then great; if not, at least wxwidgets2.5_2.5.3.2ubuntu4 will have archive.h
<lamont> schweeb: kicked
<crimsun> Vollstrecker: ok, great
<Vollstrecker> Just give me your adress
<crimsun> Vollstrecker: crimsun at fungus dot sh dot nu
<Vollstrecker> k, you'll get it when it's finished.
<dholbach> gnucash fixed
<dholbach> kterm fixed
<ajmitch_> dholbach: good work :)
<ajmitch_> nfs is giving me issues, otherwise I would have qemu fixed by now.. :)
<schweeb> lamont: cool, that kick did it :)
<crimsun> ok, building locally.
<dholbach> i look at  wing  now
<dholbach> wing uploaded
<schweeb> dholbach: man, you're on a tear
<dholbach> the list now looks quite ok
<dholbach> i went through the top 25% and most of packages are in state waiting-for-powerpc/ia64-to-start-building-instead-of-smoking-crack
<ogra> hey, youre lagging dholbach ...
<ogra> <dholbach> i look at  wing  now
<ogra> <dholbach> wing uploaded
<ogra> that were 7mins
<dholbach> haha :_)
<ogra> ;)
<dholbach> ok... if the release gets delayed we may even tackle 25%-50%
* dholbach has a look
<dholbach> ;-)
<ogra> heh
<schweeb> is there talk of delay?
<dholbach> yes -> #u-d, jdub and mdz had a conversation, due to gnome-2.10.1 release date
* schweeb reads his scrollback
<schweeb> ahh
* ajmitch_ wonders if the pam 0.78 packages got tested at all
<ajmitch_> (u-hardened stuff)
* dholbach looks at powermanga
<dholbach> hey tiil
<dholbach> hey tritium
<tritium> Hi dholbach
<tritium> I have an email from Jorge Bernal
<tritium> It takes me to the MOTU page
<dholbach> hm? what abouit?
<tritium> I'm trying to figure out what it is.  I just figured it out.  It's because I subscribed to that wiki page ;)
<tritium> heh
<dholbach> ah alright :-)
<tritium> Hackers is on TV, so it has dumbed me down.
<schweeb> indeed it will do that
<dholbach> powermanga done
<schweeb> I watched it on DVD the other day, and drooled on myself for the rest of the day ;)
<tritium> schweeb, do you find that summation equations float around the air when you write code?  ;)
<schweeb> I don't generally write code :)
* dholbach looks at dict-bouvier
<tritium> Silly movie
<tritium> We could take our motto from the movie, with a slight modification:  "Hackers of the universe, unite!" ;)
* dholbach looks at liquidwar too
<dholbach> that movie was REALLY silly ;-)
<dholbach> although it's been a whilew
<tritium> no kidding
<dholbach> dict-bouvier done
<tritium> dholbach, you're rocking tonight
<ajmitch_> qemu builds
* ajmitch_ will upload in a bit
<dholbach> tritium: it's how i feel, when i don't have to take care of LISTS :-)
<tritium> :)
<dholbach> liquidwar fixed, looking at ion2
* ajmitch_ uploads qemu, the package even works :)
<dholbach> woohoo
<dholbach> ion2 done
<dholbach> someone aware of #8324 and #8327?
<zezere> hello there!
<dholbach> hey zezere
<zezere> where shall i report a broken package?
<zezere> dholbach:
<dholbach> just tell us
<zezere> :D
<zezere> cool
<dholbach> xmule? fwbuilder?
<zezere> ok
<zezere> xmule
<dholbach> ;-)
<zezere> ah!
<zezere> :D
* dholbach read ubuntu-bugs@lists.ubuntu.com
<dholbach> zezere: i'll put it on wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTUTodo
<zezere> ok
<zezere> thank u
<dholbach> zezere: but unless debian has a more recent version or someone packages a new upstream version i see very little change this late in the release cycle
<dholbach> s/change/chance
<zezere> :D
<zezere> isn't there any bugzilla for the universe packages?
<dholbach> zezere: it's in the work
<dholbach> http://launchpad.ubuntu.com/malone
<zezere> ah!
<dholbach> but we're experiencing problems with the backend
<dholbach> but we all hope it's ready soon
<Burgundavia> zezere: if it breaks, tell us
<dholbach> or file a bug for the malone component
<zezere> :D
<zezere> thank u
<dholbach> de rien
<zezere> well... bai bai!
<dholbach> bye
<tseng> where are metallikops mono
<zezere> i'll be back when i discover some more bugs...
<dholbach> good one
<zezere> hm.....
<zezere> how do i register in malone
<zezere> ?
<zezere> there's no such thing as a "register" link
<dholbach> you have an account on the main website? like for the wiki?
<schweeb> tseng: he started a new job today
<schweeb> so he's probably not around
<tseng> eh?
<schweeb> metallikop
<tseng> oh
<tseng> yes
<schweeb> <--- lives by kop
<tseng> oh
<tritium> in meecheegan?
<schweeb> did he make 1.0.6 packages or 1.1.5?  last I heard, he made 1.1.5
<schweeb> tritium: ja
<tseng> 1.1.5 i guess
<tritium> ;)
<tseng> its not on his main page
<schweeb> I'm not sure he's put them up anywhere
<schweeb> when/where did he mention them?
<tseng> beats me
<tseng> someone else mentioned it
<schweeb> ah
* dholbach looks at xautolock and glunarclock
<tritium> dholbach, did you and herve get the packages from main removed from the list?
<dholbach> xautolock done
<dholbach> tritium: herve luckily took care of it
<tritium> cool.
<dholbach> looking at mgapdesk
<dholbach> i'm out with murphy
<tseng> that could be taken out of context
<dholbach> torcs uploaded
<dholbach> nvtv uploaded
<tseng> easy there tiger
<dholbach> tseng: you're right
<dholbach> i think i'll call it the day
<dholbach> good night pals, i'm off
<StoneTable> I've got a little problem trying to build libgdiplus
<StoneTable> It looks like the latest stable version is incompatible with the cairo in hoary
<StoneTable> but the unstable version of libgdiplus (1.15+) will build
<dholbach> StoneTable: does debian have it?
<StoneTable> looks like debian has 1.0.4 of libgdiplus, but (checking)
<dholbach> yes
<StoneTable> hm. a newer version of cairo, maybe
<StoneTable> 0.4.0-1
<StoneTable> vs. 0.3.0-1 in hoary
<dholbach> so no syncing luck
<dholbach> ok... i'm off; StoneTable, i hope, you'll have luck with your experiments :-)
<StoneTable> thanks ;0
<StoneTable> I'm trying to figure out the next step
<dholbach> you could try packageing a new version if their changelog gives some sort of evidence it'd work
<dholbach> *wave*
<StoneTable> yeah, I'll try that next, thanks
<StoneTable> well, built the updated libcairo and libpixman from debian but libgdiplus still isn't building.
<encolpe> hi
<dholbach> gooood morning
<\sh> moening
<\sh> -e+r
<dholbach> hey \sh
<dholbach> how are you?
<\sh> tired and working on the emails from last week ;)
<dholbach> i'm tired as well ;-)
<dholbach> ogra: klingeling? how are YOU?
<Treenaks> dholbach: you're not tired.. I am.. *4 hours of sleep*
<dholbach> Treenaks: as much as i had
<dholbach> Treenaks: look at hoary-changes and you'll see ;-)
<Treenaks> dholbach: hmm..
<dholbach> *GRR* why didnt half of the crap i uploaded get built?
* Treenaks saw an X upload...
<Treenaks> and an installer upload
<Treenaks> and lots of other stuff
<dholbach> lists.ubuntu.com/archives/hoary-changes/2005-March/thread.html
<dholbach> all the Universe stuff
<Treenaks> yes.. look before that.. xorg, lots of installer components
<dholbach> yes
<dholbach> TB meeting today
<ogra> dholbach, hearly done
<ogra> nearly even
<dholbach> ogra: Oh good! Jolly good!
<ogra> http://www.lanschmiede.net/hwdb-data/
<ogra> :-D
<ogra> autosubmitted ;)
<Treenaks> hwdb-server? :)
<ogra> Treenaks, hmm, something like that...the interim...
<dholbach> yeah
<Treenaks> why 500 <xlogdata> elements, instead of one, which we parse later?
<Treenaks> and bootdata
<ogra> Treenaks, currently still very ugly and insecure...
<ogra> Treenaks, the real server will be a postgers db and cut the file into little pieces...
<Treenaks> ogra: yes, but why are you splitting boot and X logs into pieces, instead of keeping them as one big chunk of CDATA?
<dholbach> ok, two days for you all to tell me what you did in the MOTU world and liked about it... and liked me to write about it in the MOTU report
<Treenaks> dholbach: mail or irc?
<ogra> Treenaks, i have worked nearly 25h now, please lets discuss my bad xml later...
<Treenaks> ogra: k :)
<dholbach> Treenaks: how you like it
<Treenaks> I really need my new laptop.. that'll make me so much more productive in MOTU-land
<Treenaks> (1.8GHz vs 600MHz, 512M vs 192M)
<Treenaks> (80G vs 20G)
<dopey> is there a qemu howto somewhere?
<dholbach> Treenaks: i'm just glad if we remember everything, it's all nice and pretty and you guys were involved in writing as well ;-)
<Treenaks> apt-get install qemu :)
<dholbach> hey dopey
<dopey> lo dholbach
<dopey> Treenaks: i got that far, but the image files that the included debian script generated didnt seem to work
<dopey> Treenaks: i'm assuming, of course, that i'm doing something wrong
<Treenaks> hmm
<dopey> thus was hopefull there'd be such a document available
* dholbach looks at dict-gazetteer2k
* dopey starts off simple - what does one type in order to fire up qemu with an image?
<Burgundavia> qemu -cdrom image.iso
<Burgundavia> dopey: expect to use a lot of cpu time and it will look like it has hung a lot of the time
<dopey> Burgundavia: i used 'qemu-make-debian-root' to generate a hard disk image - do i also need to create a disk image to do what you suggest?
<Burgundavia> dopey: that would be for a live cd
<Burgundavia> dopey: that is just to run a livecd
<dopey> Burgundavia: at the moment, i'm using 'qemu -hda imagefile' - it just doesnt seem to work
* dholbach looks at xpat2
* ogra yawns heavily
<dopey> (by 'doesnt work' i mean takes a long time to not doing anything visible)
<dholbach> hey sivang!
<dholbach> sivang: how are you?
<sivang> dholbach: fine, 'sup?
<dholbach> sivang: i'm a bit tired...
<sivang> dholbach: anyway, I need to run, laterz buddy :)
<dholbach> sivang: but happily gambolling through wiki/UniversePriorityList
<dholbach> sivang: have a nice day
<sivang> dholbach: thanks!
<Burgundavia> dopey: qemu will take a long time to use
<Burgundavia> dopey: I am not really conversant on how to use it
<dopey> no probs, i'll just leave it for an hour or so then
<dholbach> doko: cool you fixed hfsutils *taking it off the list*
<GheRivero> good morning!
<Treenaks> hey ghe
* dholbach looks at xonix
<dholbach> ahhhh knoda, new Krack
<dholbach> xonix fixed
<dholbach> mark has responded to our apt-get.org mails
<jani> hello all
<dholbach> hey jani
<jani> can you guess why I logged in ;) ?
<jani> hint sesame-street :)
<jani> nope he's idle for 4 days 10 hours...
<ajmitch> dholbach: he has?
* ajmitch hasn't got that mail yet
<dholbach> "Prioritisation of apt-get.org and other .deb imports"
<dholbach> u-d@
<ajmitch> obviously my mailbox is yet to receive it :)
<ajmitch> as is gmane
<dholbach> http://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2005-March/006235.html
<dholbach> and: http://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2005-March/006236.html
<ajmitch> waiting for thrashing to stop... ;)
<dholbach> what could "I'm happy to compromise on getting it "all done" for Hoary, to allow everyone time to polish the Hoary release, as long as we can aim to have Universe be totally comprehensive for Breezy. " possibly mean?
<dholbach> i don't grok "compromise" in that context
<ajmitch> because we don't have the time before the release
<dholbach> to compromise means... leave it for hoary, if you don't make it?
* ajmitch would rather not have apt-get.org packages in hoary..
<ajmitch> no idea what he means
<ajmitch> actually I think he means he's willing to let us drop apt-get.org for now
<ajmitch> so long as we get it in for breezy
<dholbach> hmm
<ajmitch> and let us work frantically on the existing universe packages
<dholbach> yeah and morguify half of them
<ajmitch> and that we request imports, rather than a wholesale import of everything
<dholbach> someone please nudge lamont to rebuild nearly all of those on the lists (powerpc and ia64 in most cases)
<dholbach> because murphy needs to get out ;-)
<ajmitch> hehe :)
<dholbach> see you later
<ajmitch> ok, bye
* ajmitch has to sleep, work in the morning
<jinty> hoi, I asked around yesterday but think it got lost, anyone want to help me squish a schoolbell bug? there is a patch(http://issues.schooltool.org/file28) ready for uploading for http://issues.schooltool.org/issue185.
<dholbach> jinty: i have no permission to read http://issues.schooltool.org/file28
<dholbach> hey derdg
<dholbach> derdg: did your nick change recently?
<derdg> no, i'm in a data centre. left my desktop elsewhere
<dholbach> ah alright
<dholbach> hey koke
<koke> hi!
<koke> I don't understand very well the new UniversePriorityList
<koke> Almost all the logs are because missing build-deps
<dholbach> it shows all the test-builds that failed (at some stage)
<dholbach> we remove those that finally built
<dholbach> and fix those that have to be fixed
<dholbach> for the rest we nudge lamont
<jinty> dholbach: drat... pretty silly of me. this then http://issues.schooltool.org/file28/patch
<dholbach> and for powerpc/ia64 we should nudge him again
<dholbach> jinty: what do you want to with the patch?
<dholbach> i mean where could we help?
<jinty> a re-upload of schoolbell with that patch
<dholbach> ok, will do
<jinty> The bug it fixes is pretty serious and I would prefer hoary not to go out with it
<jinty> Thanks!!
<dholbach> alright
<dholbach> i'll do it now
<hsprang> hy there :)
<dholbach> jinty: done
<tseng> just a heads up, im attempting to do everything in my power to make mono 1.1.5 work at this point
<tseng> lest we ship beagled with serious memory leaking
<dholbach> WOW
<dholbach> ROCK
<jinty> dholbach: great! thanks a lot!
<dholbach> GO AHEAD
<tseng> heh.
<dholbach> jinty: my pleasure :-)
* dholbach looks at luma and kvdr
<dholbach> kvdr fixed
<dholbach> bbl
<Gervystar> tseng: that's great! Thanks for your job!
<StoneTable> tseng:  excellent!  I've only been able to get libgdiplus 1.1.5 to build
<thierry> I'm trying to follow this page : http://www.debian.org/doc/maint-guide/ch-build.en.html#s-completebuild but I don't know what is my secret PGP phrase
<thierry> How can I find it?
<tritium> thierry, you need to setup your gpg key: http://webber.dewinter.com/gnupg_howto/english/GPGMiniHowto.html
<thierry> thanks tritium
<tritium> no problem :)
<crimsun> morn' :)
<tritium> Good morning, crimsun :)
<Vollstrecker> crimsun: You got my mail?
<crimsun> Vollstrecker: just logging in, actually
<Vollstrecker> Burt first, Hi crimsun
<crimsun> Vollstrecker: ah, I used a very similar workaround (uploaded 2.5.3.2ubuntu4 last night, already built and in archives)
<Vollstrecker> Not so cruelty like mine?
<crimsun> almost exactly like yours :)
<crimsun> I used install, but otherwise it's identical
<Vollstrecker> I never used install.
<HostingGeek> Should I try and get $100K tomz or is that pushing it too myxh?
<HostingGeek> *much
<HostingGeek> I will of cause not accept less than $20k
<HostingGeek> ooops
<HostingGeek> wrong channel
<crimsun> ok, gotta scram.  Will be a few minutes late for TB.
<dholbach> hai
<Vollstrecker> hi
<HostingGeek> hi daniel
<tritium> Hi dholbach :)
<dholbach> hey you three, how are you?
<tritium> Not bad.  How are you?
<dholbach> bit tired but ok
<dholbach> i'll get myself some tea and start working then ;-)
<doko> herve: ping?
<dholbach> doko: he's not here... i'll fetch him :-)
<herve> heya!
<tritium> hey herve
<dholbach> doko: may i present you: herv, the incredible! :-)
* herve *blushse*
<thierry> is 0.34.3-0ubuntu1 a correct number version for the 0.34.3 package of gdesklets? I'm getting a warning with  lintian -i gdesklets_0.34.3-0ubuntu1_i386.changes
<doko> herve: you did want to send me an zope-debhlper patch?
<herve> thierry, lintian emits this warning for every package we add ubuntu in the revision
<herve> doko, er... no...
<herve> but Fabio from Debian is looking forward to :-)
<dholbach> doko: maybe it was ajmitch
<doko> dholbach: no, ajmitch does php4 ...
<herve> ajmitch, is a python&zope master too ;-)
<herve> anyway, I sens you no patch
<koke> http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/g/gpm/1.19.6-19ubuntu1/ <-- do you know why there's no logs on i386 and ia64??
<dholbach> doko: i got it only a bit wrong:   AndrewMitchell: Hacked up /usr/share/cdbs/1/class/zope.mk to make cdbs packaging of zope products easier. Packaged zope-quills as a test.
<dholbach> ;-)
<herve> so what do I do here? :-)
<tritium> dholbach, where is your report located?
<dholbach> tritium: in /home/daniel/notes unfortunately
<tritium> heh, okay ;)
<herve> then, see you tonight
<lamont> koke: good question.  It's installed on all 4 though
<koke> dholbach: if the package is built in all arches should be removed from the list??
<koke> example : http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/m/mirrormagic/2.0.2.0deb1-2/
<dholbach> yes
<dholbach> and thanks for that
<tritium> dholbach, is there no longer a TB today?
<crimsun> it was moved, I forgot
<tritium> It was on the calendar until just a few minutes ago ;)
<crimsun> I rushed to a place with a more reliable Internet connection, too ;)
<dholbach> tritium: mdz just changed it on TechnicalBoardAgenda :-(
<tritium> well, maybe you got some exercise ;)
<tritium> dholbach, okay
<schweeb> hrmph
<schweeb> how long does it take a NEW package to go through? I got an email saying it was approved like 6 days ago :-/
<dholbach> schweeb: ping elmo
<dholbach> but he's really busy
<schweeb> yea
<dholbach> given the release state
<schweeb> I don't really want to bug him
<ogra> schweeb, be patient, elmo came back today
<dholbach> and compare to packages in debian :-)
<schweeb> RC is supposed to come out tomorrow
<dholbach> drop him a mail
<ogra> schweeb, RC is no issue for universe stuff....it wont be on the CD
<schweeb> right
<schweeb> but I know that means he's gotta be busy
<ogra> yop
<dholbach> hey d3vic3
<\sh> grmpf
<d3vic3> lo dholbach
<\sh> i can't decide...mono-c# or python
<ogra> python indeed
<ogra> hi \sh
<\sh> ogra, just started @troisdorf my first c# experiments :)
* schweeb prefers c#
<ogra> heh
<koke> http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/p/pdfjam/1.10-1/pdfjam_1.10-1_20050324-0848-powerpc-given-back
<koke> this has a build-deps problem
<lamont> koke: it's also before 2005-03-24 18:57
<koke> but if I do pbuilder login and apt-get build-dep pdfjam, I have no problem
<koke> oOp
* lamont considers obliterating all the logs from before 1857
<koke> there are a lot of log like this
<koke> is quite confusing for me
<lamont> koke: yeah.  ignore them
<koke> lamont: ok, but I'm following the priority list, looking for smth to fix
<koke> and I can't find a package that actually FTBFS
<lamont> ah.
<lamont> see people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/Test/byDate/
<schweeb> gg lamont
<schweeb> http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/byDate/
<schweeb> :p
<lamont> schweeb: yeah. that.
<koke> lamont: there isn't a needs-build list, to mix with priority list??
<lamont> buildLogs/Test/Lists/hoary-test.needs-build.i386, for example.
<koke> lamont: oh! thanks :D
<herve> hi all!
<dholbach> hey herve
<herve> doko, glad to see things got better with Fabio
<herve> so... let's get that taxes payed!
<schweeb> lamont: hrm, in looking over the bydate log for Test... is Test still supposed to be trying the older version of workrave?  dholbach uploaded 1.6.2-1ubuntu1, and it's still trying to build 1.6.2-1 under Test
<schweeb> http://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/hoary-changes/2005-March/003891.html
<schweeb> http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/w/workrave/1.6.2-1/
<koke> http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/x/xbill/2.1-4/xbill_2.1-4_20050326-1904-ia64-failed <-- what does this mean??
<schweeb> koke: looks like buildd goofiness... tell lamont to kick it
<jani> hello all
<schweeb> hello
<dholbach> hey jani
<jani> wasn't there supposed to be a TB meeting today?
<lamont> koke: that's rather common for :03-:04 or :33-:34 time builds.. :-(
* lamont makes a note to auto-retry those
<schweeb> lamont: problems during mirror uploads?
<dholbach> jani: i heard it like 2 hours ago
<dholbach> jani: and then changed wiki/Calendar and the channels topic
<jani> was cancelled?
<lamont> schweeb: the buildd's look at the master archive, for other reasons, and therefore has a slightly larger window where Release.gpg doesn't match Packages.gz
<schweeb> gotcha
<jani> did you write anything before 'heard it 2 hours ago' ?
<dholbach> jani: seems to have been postponed a week ago or something, just didnt know
<schweeb> lamont: scroll up for my question about workrave and Test :)
<jani> I seem to remember that too but I thought the chan topic is more autjoritative ;)
<jani> ok thanks
<lamont> schweeb: yeah - Test is a snapshot from last week
<lamont> elmo was talking of flatlining it to do a fresh build of everything.
<dholbach> *arg* i never use my scanner, now i have to use it and it's unconfigured yet *argl*
<lamont> I told him was good by me...
<schweeb> yea, sounds like a good idea
<lamont> of course, the down side is that it'll rebuild all of main first.  on the upside, that should only take about 6-8 hours, give or take
<schweeb> dholbach: I've found USB scanners are pretty simple to set up these days :)
<dholbach> schweeb: i hope so... just found the crappy firmware in an .exe file :-)
<schweeb> lamont: it'll save some time for false build errors like that, though
<lamont> yeah
<schweeb> firmware? eww
<schweeb> last one I tried just worked OOB
<dholbach> schweeb: it was just a crappy some euro scanner
<schweeb> ah
<dholbach> but it worked with my debian installation... *looking*
<schweeb> this was a compaq
<koke> I think I've fixed d4x :D
<dholbach> WOW cool
<dholbach> what was it?
<koke> there was gtk code embedded into one file
<koke> that obvioulsy crashed with actual gtk code
<dholbach> and you fixed it?
<koke> it seemed like a disty hack for features available in cvs but not in stable gtk+
<dholbach> oh i see, but cool
<dholbach> will it be your first upload?
<koke> dholbach: yep, in fact, the conflicting code was between /**************/ marks :D
<dholbach> :-))
<koke> dholbach: some hours ago elmo told me "I'll go see where we're upto with the new MOTUs in a bit"
<koke> 05:59 in the logs == ??:?? UTC
<dholbach> koke: i guess we're in the same timezone :-)
<koke> dholbach: that was around 17:00 ~ 18:00
<koke> maybe later
<ogra> dholbach, i guess he means lamonts logs...(which are located in the DC, which is in UTC TZ)
<koke> ogra: nop, irclogs
<ogra> ha, thats fabio, he is in denmark
<dholbach> anyway, i saw it too
<dholbach> and it was ages ago
<ogra> so UTC+1
<koke> ogra: it seems there is a 12hrs offset
<koke> mybe 11, maybe 13 :P
<ogra> nope, there is a 12h clock i guess, not 24h
<dholbach> .xchat2/xchatlogs/FreeNode-#ubuntu-devel.log:Mr 29 17:59:32 elmo       koke: I've been offline with easter weekend too, I'll go see where we're upto with the new MOTUs in a bit
<dholbach> so everythings alright: 5:59
<siretart> nevening folks :)
<dholbach> hey siretart
<siretart> I'm again looking through the PriorityList, there seem quite a lot of packages not building because of weird dependency errors. what to do with them?
<dholbach> siretart: wait until the magic buildds had a go with them again
<siretart> dholbach: ok.
<siretart> woah, gcompris is a big beast :)
<dholbach> siretart: it's a pain
<dholbach> siretart: ask herve :-)
<siretart> :)
<herve> ?
<herve> siretart, I offer you gcompris to fix :-)
<dholbach> in the same time you code a new one
<siretart> herve: I just downloaded it, but there seems to be some more gtk foo :/
<siretart> herve: did you get past this errors: interface.c:51: error: initializer element is not constant
<siretart> interface.c:51: error: (near initialization for `menubar1_uiinfo[0] .label')
<herve> gtk, .desktop, python...
<herve> dholbach, am I forgetting something? :-)
<schweeb> hah, have fun with that, siretart
<schweeb> I was getting that earlier
<schweeb> with gnome-alsamixer I believe it was
<schweeb> I couldn't figure out which friggin library it wanted
<schweeb> so I set StoneTable off on it :)
<herve> guys
<herve> note martin pitt just uploaded fixed mozilla-locales-*
<herve> I think we have some on our list
<siretart> schweeb: herve: did you get past that interface.c:51 error?
<mdz> morning guys
<mdz> did sabdfl's email satisfy your concerns about the imports from third-party repositories?
<herve> siretart, nope
<siretart> ok
<herve> mdz, we *would* like another repo in ubuntu
<herve> not to mix those imports with universe where we can afford another level of QA
<mdz> we already have multiverse
<herve> isn't it for legal issues?
<mdz> herve: currently it is used for software which does not meet Ubuntu licensing guidelines
<mdz> but we could redefine it
<herve> ha ok
<herve> yes why not, multiverse == "you have been warned!"
<mdz> right, it already has the right caveats
<mdz> as-is, it's up to you to determine whether you have the right to use it, etc.
<herve> and maybe move packages to universe when we have a thorough review and can afford the same level of support
<StoneTable> yeah, I'm working on that same error, soon as I finish mulching in the front lawn
<schweeb> siretart: ^^^
<siretart> oh. :)
<herve> mdz, right now we have two concern
<herve> a big chunck of packages although we're already short on time to fix the existing universe
<herve> and a mass of packages to import while we have folks here with NEW packages and a policy to review and add them
<mdz> right, did you read the email from Mark?
<herve> yes
<mdz> basically, we are happy for the MOTU team to set the pace for importing these packages, and for there to be a policy for acceptance
<herve> sure
<herve> but hoary is not a realistic target for me
<herve> breezy is good
<crimsun> herve: fixing python-qt3 and python-kde3 now.
<herve> crimsun, good luck ;-)
<crimsun> yeah, I'll need it ;)
<herve> crimsun, python-kde3 is barely to compile from source
<herve> seems like I fscked up sip4-qt3 :-/
<herve> plop encolpe
<crimsun> right now python-kde3 can't be compiled.  I needed to rebuild python-qt3 because the upper version restriction on python2.4-sip4-qt3 is too strong (needed to be << 4.4 instead of << 4.2)
<herve> why 4.4?
<crimsun> because 4.2ubuntu... is what's available
<crimsun> which is does not meet << 4.2 requirement
<herve> I mean
<crimsun> s/is//
<herve> why not << 4.3?
<crimsun> I looked at the previous range, which is between 4.0 and 4.2
<crimsun> if you think 4.3 is sufficient, I'll bump it down
<herve> I don't know at all :-)
<herve> but since we don't know 4.3
<herve> (doesn't exist even)
<herve> let's limit to this one
<crimsun> and minor is usually development where A[BP] I breaks, ok
<herve> if you need to
<encolpe> Hi
<herve> debian uploaded a new python-qt3 today
<herve> with both python 2.3 and 2.4 modules generated
<encolpe> all ?
<herve> crimsun, not all software have the same versionning scheme
<crimsun> herve: ok, so what do you wish the range restriction to be?
<herve> << 4.3
<herve> because the future is unknown :-)
<crimsun> that's what I did
<crimsun> (the rebuild just restarted about 30 seconds ago)
<herve> rock, now you can light a candle ;-)
<siretart> I found the cause for the lxdoom failing to build: http://sources.redhat.com/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=414
<siretart> its a bug in the linker :(
<herve> siretart, woah!
<siretart> patch applied, I wonder if there are also packages in main suffering from this problem..
<siretart> s/applied/attached to the bugreport/
<herve> yeah, that's not what I call "applied" ;-)
<herve> crimsun, the configure script succeeded?
<siretart> srry, should think more before hitting <return> *G*
<herve> man... I haven't eaten yet :-/
<dholbach> zul and i were talking about the kernel situation in universe:
<dholbach> zul since the debian kernel guys changed the name of the package we suggested that you guys sync with debian 2.6.8 and get the ones for the arch we support
<dholbach> dholbach what about the 2.4 stuff?
<dholbach> dholbach the patches and everything
<dholbach> zul gimme a sec..:)
<dholbach> dholbach alright
<dholbach> oh sorry
<dholbach> now zul invites me to #u-kernel ;-)
<zul> ok..
<zul> nah..here is fine
<herve> dholbach, you flooder :-)
<dholbach> confusion perfect
<siretart> ah, and this seems to be debian #274929
<zul> dholbach: yeah if you guys sync debian 2.6.8 for the arches we support
<zul> ie  386,686,686-smp,k7,k8,powerpc,ia64, and sparc that would be cool
<dholbach> what about 2.4?
<dholbach> all the patches, images?
<zul> 2.4 should be ok as well, i would say the images just for now
<dholbach> loads of the meta-packages aren't installable
<zul> grr...
<zul> i think that would be up to you guys..
<dholbach> ok... we leave the images that we support (last version, right?) and we're set?
<zul> dholbach: yes 2.6.8 for the arches i listed about im waiting for confirmation about hppa
<dholbach> and for 2.4 the same
<zul> i would say 2.4.29
<dholbach> wow... they have it already?
<zul> its in the svn
<dholbach> argl
<dholbach> we really have loads of things to do
<zul> actually 2.4.27 would probably be better
<dholbach> i can't promise that we make it
<dholbach> not at all
<zul> sure no problem
<crimsun> herve: yes.
<crimsun> herve: we're supposed to maintain the python2.3 packages, correct?
<siretart> HA! I got lxdoom building on amd64 :)
<herve> crimsun, yes
<herve> siretart, you ROCK!
<crimsun> herve: argh.  That means I have to create another build target in debian/rules and populate debian/ .
<siretart> herve: there where 2 "extern int errno;" statments in lxdoom source. replacing them with an #include <errno.h> helped
<siretart> herve: I'll prepare a package..
<herve> siretart, I hope you made a nice dpatch patch ;-)
<siretart> herve: not yet, I'm on it..
<siretart> ;)
<siretart> herve: I don't own an amd64, this was remote on a friends machine ;)
<herve> you know tseng page about dpatch?
<herve> (tseng's page)
<siretart> herve: I'm used to dpatch, thanks. but tseng's page?
<siretart> I don't think I know that site..
<herve> tseng.ath.cx/log/?p=7
* tritium believes he fixed xawtv
<siretart> ah, nice page, thanks for the link..
<ajmitch_> morning
<tritium> good morning, ajmitch
<herve> hey koke !
<herve> hi ajmitch
<koke> hi!
<tritium> Hello koke :)
<tritium> ogra, I believe I've fixed xawtv.  I edited the wiki to request a review for it.
<siretart> lxdoom awaiting review/sponsoring, wiki updated
<herve> siretart, you managed to make it pbuild on your friend's computer?
<tritium> herve, what's the procedure here?  Who is supposed to review for us?
<herve> I could
<siretart> herve: yeah, he granted me root access in a chroot. nice guy ;)
<herve> if I have time
<herve> but can't upload
<herve> siretart, I'd prefer a pbuild
<herve> (if I had time)
<herve> I even haven't eaten yet :-/
<tritium> herve, no worries.
<herve> good!
<herve> I don't have taxes to pay this year
<herve> I mean, for 2004
<encolpe> me too
<encolpe> :)
<herve> which I hardly believe...
<herve> :-)
<encolpe> weddings
<herve> good catch ;-)
<encolpe> -s
<encolpe> just do it ;)
<schweeb> odd
<schweeb> my package is now in the archive now, but never got announced to hoary-changes
* schweeb shrugs
<herve> schweeb, I've experienced the same
<schweeb> hrm
<schweeb> does mono even work on ia64 or amd64?  should I change gsf-sharp so it doesn't build at all on ia64 and amd64?
<herve> no s
<koke> herve: no s?? ;)
<herve> feel free to correct my Spanish ;-)
<koke> herve: it's correct, but surprised me :)
<siretart> does anybody here use xfce? xfcalendar seems an easy target to fix *hint* :)
<schweeb> jani and crimsun are working on xfce, I believe
<herve> koke, this being correct does surprise me!
<crimsun> well, we're doing more waiting currently
<schweeb> still waiting for elmo to sync?
<crimsun> waiting on elmo to merge 4.2
<crimsun> err, sync.
<herve> I haven't practiced Spanish for more than 5 years
<tritium> crimsun, you care to review xawtv for me if you're waiting?
<crimsun> tritium: in 15 mins, ok.
<tritium> sure, thanks
<herve> heya dredg !
<crimsun> (trying to iron out some python2.[34] -qt3 issues ;-)
* dredg waves feebly
<dredg> hi
<schweeb> think I've run out of packages I'm capable of fixing :-/
<tritium> no problem, crimsun.  Only if you have time
<siretart> well, xfcalendar seems to be missing a build dependency on libxinerama, but I've seen in the wiki that there is some more foo to xfce, so I better leave this package off to crimsun ;)
<herve> crimsun, you'r recompiling python-qt3?
<crimsun> herve: yeah, I need an updated version for python-kde3
<herve> crimsun, because DD made what you want to do today ;-)
<herve> (the debian dev)
<crimsun> oh yeah, I could have just waited duh
<crimsun> totally didn't register with me ;)
<herve> and I told you when you said you began :-p
<crimsun> yeah, but by that point I was already hacking up debian/rules :)
<crimsun> (and my mirrors don't get the dinstall updates til ~4 PM EST)
<crimsun> I'll compare his debian/rules with mine
<herve> note he rewrote almost it
<herve> (almost rewrote it)
<herve> (it's the zero spelling mistake night!)
<crimsun> hehe
<dholbach> re
* herve gives the high five to dholbach 
<siretart> hping3 seems to just need an resync from debian for fixing ftbfs on amd64
<dholbach> i sense activity on UniversePriorityList
<crimsun> re
<herve> dholbach, to tell that like you sensed a change in the balance of the force ;-)
<dholbach> yes, exactly :-)
<herve> dholbach, good news, I don't pay taxes this year ;-)
<herve> crimsun, I reaffected python-kde3 to you
<dholbach> herve: coool :-))))
<crimsun> herve: I don't know whether to cry or to cry :D
<siretart> MOTUToSync updated
<herve> good
<herve> scummvm fixed itself
<koke> I wanted to make my first upload but elmo does not answer :(
<koke> someone wants to upload d4x for me?
<herve> wasn't someone working on gnome-alsamixer?
<schweeb> StoneTable is still, I think
<schweeb> it was having the same kind of issues as gcompris
<schweeb> koke: do you know if mako sent him your key?  mako's not around today, as he's at the groklaw case
<koke> schweeb: I have no idea
<StoneTable> ya
<schweeb> koke: try again, elmo was just around...
<schweeb> or, you could just try uploading
<schweeb> if your key works, it'll go in the archive, if not, it'll silently disappear (although I dunno if this causes other problems)
<koke> schweeb: already silently disappeared ;-)
<schweeb> ah
<schweeb> well then, either mako hasn't sent it, or elmo hasn't added it
* schweeb eagerly awaits the day when he becomes MOTU
<dholbach> schweeb: that won't take long... trust me
<dholbach> with the good work you do
<schweeb> :D
<koke> <elmo> koke: hmm, no, you're not in mako's list yet <-- bad news :(
<herve> I must admit the motu did incredible work today
<herve> I mean all people, not just granted motu maintainers ;-)
<dholbach> koke: *arg*
<dholbach> koke: ask someone to give him his phone number :-)
<dholbach> herve: HEAR! HEAR!
<herve> dholbach, hu... have you taken your pills? :()
<tritium> I'm off for now.  I'll be back this evening.
<herve> :-)
<herve> bye tritium
<koke> dholbach: who has the number??
<tritium> bye herve, and everyone :)
<dholbach> tritium: packages on the normal place?
<tritium> dholbach, yes, my repo
<koke> dholbach: and... it's urgent enough?? :P
<schweeb> I'd like to fix more packages, but it appears as though most of the bugs are not for my platform, or code related (api changes, etc...)
<tritium> Thanks for reviewing, dholbach!
<dholbach> koke: it was more a joke, but you could ask the guys on #ubuntu-devel
<herve> StoneTable, remember to remove a package from the list when you book it in "Working on"
<herve> we desperately need to see that list shrink :-)
<StoneTable> oh, pull it from the list?  okay, I didn't realize that :)
<schweeb> should we be pulling things like kismet out of the list that only won't build on ia64?
<herve> the idea is to make package go up to "Done"
<herve> which is the heaven of motu package :-)
<dholbach> hehe
<herve> schweeb, currently won't or never ever?
<StoneTable> yeah, what about if I'm only working on one platform, but it won't build on several?
<schweeb> herve: not before hoary release... it needs snacc, which is uncompilable on amd64
<schweeb> er ia64
<herve> schweeb, ok, just postponed then
<herve> schweeb, the way it is in "Can't build" is fine
<schweeb> it's already noted that it won't build
<schweeb> so should it be removed from lower down
<herve> ha yes
<herve> but leave the link to the build logs
<herve> er
<herve> forget about it
<herve> snacc' logs are the ones important
<schweeb> right
<schweeb> well, since most of the remaining bugs are obscure, I'll go through and weed out some stuff like that tonight
* herve is so proud of the motu!:
<siretart> :)
<herve> schweeb, a cleaning is welcome, so we see the real work we have left
* dholbach is so proud of the MOTU and of herve especially :-)
<herve> er... not today :-)
<dholbach> always
<dholbach> you'll always be "Herv 'pass da cookie' Cauwelier" to me :-)
<herve> gaaa
<herve> I'm sure someone fixed/touched xawtv tonight!
<dholbach> tritium
<dholbach> i'm reviewing it
<herve> dholbach, don't push it too far ;-)
<herve> was just for moving it in our workflow
<dholbach> hehe :-)
* herve workflow master at the office and the motu!
<siretart> good night, folks, gotta get some sleep for tomorrow ;)
<herve> good night siretart
<dholbach> bye siretart
<herve> thanks again!
<dholbach> you're exam tomorrow?
<dholbach> thought it was thursday?
<siretart> dholbach: yeah, but tomorrow is the last day to learn/exercise something
<dholbach> oh good so i remembered right
<dholbach> sleep tight siretart
<siretart> ;)
<siretart> thanks. same to you all :)
#ubuntu-motu 2005-04-10
<haggai> herve: looking at why python-qt3 is uninstallable.  Seems it conflicts with the sip4-qt3 new version you uploaded
<crimsun> haggai: it's due to the requirement on python2.4-sip4-qt3 (<< 4.2)
<crimsun> haggai: I'm on it already :)
<herve> yes :-(
<crimsun> haggai: but --
<crimsun> haggai: if you want to fix it, go ahead! :D
* herve slaps himself
<crimsun> (since I need it a fixed version to fix python-kde3 :-)
<haggai> crimsun: ok, elmo pinged me about it.
<crimsun> haggai: ok
<haggai> crimsun: I don't have time to fix it, sorry too busy with kubuntu bugs
<crimsun> haggai: ok
<dholbach> tritium's xawtv was fine
<dholbach> *rock*
<dholbach> uploading
<herve> rock even more!
<herve> :-)
<herve> good night all!
<dholbach> good night herve
<dholbach> thanks for being here
<herve> haggai, that I can admit :-)
* schweeb checks wiki/AptGetOrg
<schweeb> MERGE ON PAIN OF DEATH lol
<dholbach> we should try to be more serious about the list; i'll walk through the list again and check which packages we can really include and be confident about them
<dholbach> it'll be a hard task for all of us
<dholbach> but i spotted some nice things in there and if we manage to get the maintainers/upstream guys involved, breezy will rock even harder
<dholbach> didnt we have someone with powerpc around? to get usbview going?
<crimsun> dholbach: ajmitch_ has access to ppc
<dholbach> the idea i had about http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/u/usbview/1.0-6/usbview_1.0-6_20050328-0655-powerpc-failed isnt nice, but i'd include a patch with the changes of rerunning aclocal and automake
<dholbach> that could make it work again
<ajmitch_> dholbach: I haven't had time to install ubuntu on the mac
<ajmitch_> partly because it's not mine :)
<dholbach> ajmitch_: don't worry
<dholbach> ajmitch_: i think koke and jbailey had one
<dholbach> someone who would take his time in the next days to walk with me through the kernel-packages in universe in the next days?
<ajmitch_> jbailey has a pegasos ppc iirc
<schweeb> dholbach: what do you need exactly?
<jbailey> Yup
<dholbach> jbailey: we were discussing http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/u/usbview/1.0-6/usbview_1.0-6_20050328-0655-powerpc-failed
* koke has an ibook G4
<jbailey> Someone had me look at usbview yesterday...
<dholbach> jbailey: and i said that a patch with the changes of rerunning aclocal and automake wouldnt be nice, but could work
<dholbach> ah...
<tritium> hi dholbach.  Looks like you uploaded xawtv for me :)
<dholbach> tritium: yeah... good work
<tritium> Thanks, dholbach :)
<jbailey> dholbach: You need to add AUTOMAKE_OPTIONS=foreign, and then autoreconf -f -i, and the package is otherwise fine.
<jbailey> dholbach: A simpler solution for now is to not have automake loaded in the chroot.
<jbailey> Why is it there>
<dholbach> jbailey: dunno
<jbailey> dholbach: I think the rebuild methodology is a bit bogus.  Having random versions of automake presence is a good way of cuasing grief.  It's one of the suckages of automake.
<dholbach> yes
<jbailey> You can solve it by setting maintainer-mode in the packages, but that's way more work.
<dholbach> jbailey: thanks for elaborating
<jbailey> When I argued against maintainer mode ages ago, I hadn't understood what kind of nightmare we were going to see.  I'd love to see it always in and disabled, with an option to enable it.
<jbailey> But either way, I don't know who maintains automake these days.
<dholbach> jbailey: must be quite a lot of people :-)
<jbailey> dholbach: np.  Anything else you need while I'm here?
<dholbach> so now... who fixes usbview? ;-)
<tseng> HI DHOLBACH
<dholbach> HEY TSENG!
<schweeb> dholbach: what are you lookin to do with kernel-packages?  I'm willing to help
<dholbach> jbailey: not from my side... thanks for replying so fast :-)
<jbailey> dholbach: The current version is in the archive, this is only a failure from the rebuild.
<StoneTable> hey tseng, just the person I was looking for.  You're working on mono 1.1.5, right?
<jbailey> dholbach: I'd be inclined to ignore the problem, given that there are probably real bugs to chase.
<koke> dholbach: I'm trying...
<dholbach> jbailey: alright
<dholbach> jbailey: will there be a cdbs-bof in .au? :-)
<jbailey> dholbach: I don't think so.  I thought about it after I heard the the bof schedule was frozen.
<dholbach> schweeb: there are LOADS of packages that won't work anymore, aren't installable
<jbailey> dholbach: Hopefully there'll be a bit of free time around drinks or something to preview cdbs2 and answer questions about cdbs1.
<dholbach> yeah cool
<dholbach> i'd very much look forward to that one
<schweeb> dholbach: well, count me in, as long as I don't have to demolish my system doing so :)
<schweeb> cdbs rules.
<schweeb> very very much
<dholbach> schweeb: we should focus on the last debian packages and weed out, what we don't need
<jbailey> dholbach: If you want something more than that, I don't know who to ask, really.  I haven't thought much about UDU.
<dholbach> schweeb: thank you very much
<dholbach> jbailey: i can imagine
<schweeb> dholbach: we have a list of those kernel packages that have problems?
<dholbach> schweeb: wiki/UniverseUnmetDeps
<schweeb> ah
<dholbach> schweeb: http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/universe/k/ should give you an idea as well
<schweeb> so we wanna get rid of stuff like m68k and shit?
<jbailey> dholbach: http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/UbuntuDownUnderBOFs seems to be the list.  I thought I heard that the list was frozen, but I don't see anything here indicating that.
<dholbach> schweeb: yes
<jbailey> dholbach: If you want a formal cdbs bof, could you add it, with some notes as to what you want to get out of it?  (training, improvements, a chance to treat one of the authors as a piata...)
<dholbach> jbailey: i guess there'll be a lot of last-minute-bofs or discussions-that-anybody-is-interested
<jbailey> dholbach: As full as the schedule is sounding, I'm not sure there will be.
<dholbach> piata?
<dholbach> hrm
<dholbach> jbailey: you're right... for one week
<jbailey> dholbach: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pinata
<dholbach> ahhhhh coool :-)
<jbailey> You're sounding a little too eager on that one...
* jbailey runs.
<dholbach> jbailey: i guess there'll be a lot of interested guys and we'll have our fun, even if it's not on the schedule
<dholbach> it shouldnt be toooo official either ;-)
<koke> http://www.mikesjournal.com/images/Pinata%201.jpg <-- quite graphic :P
<dholbach> :-)))
<schweeb> dholbach: I say we just drop all the kernel stuff that doesn't work :)
<tritium> tons of packages given back
<koke> http://www.amedias.org/~koke/debian/hoary/usbview_1.0-6ubuntu1.diff.gz
<koke> I'm building now...
<nictuku> i'm not really familiar with "version changes" in debian packages. I mean, I don't know what to update besides debian/changelog
<dholbach> you said debian/rules would have to be changed
<nictuku> sure
<nictuku> but I'd have to update debian/changelog to explain what was changed.
<dholbach> yes
<dholbach> dch -i -Dhoary is most easy
<nictuku> hmm what package provides dch?
<dholbach> devscripts
<nictuku> thank you.
<nictuku> hmm.. how do I create the source package after I've made the changes?
<dholbach> with debuild
<nictuku> I didn't know even that MOTU existed. great idea
<schweeb> bbiaf
* schweeb starts migrating his Samba domain to Samba 3
<dholbach> lamont: you know why http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/g/gpm/1.19.6-19ubuntu1/ was only built on amd64 and powerpc?
<nictuku> guys
<lamont> dholbach: likely the result of one or more of the issues I was fighting in the DC.  FWIW, a fresh hoary-test run is starting, and I'll be grumbling if anyone mentions logs predating somewhere < now (really about 10-40 minutes)
<nictuku> now I have the source package, what's next? sign it?
<lamont> otoh, if it failed > 18:57, it's probably gonna fail again
<dholbach> lamont: ack
<nictuku> I mean, somebody signing my key...
<lamont> nictuku: and you tweaked the version to end with ubuntu1, yes?
<dholbach> nictuku: if you want to thoroughly help us out, you'll (at some stage) have to have a nicely signed key
<dholbach> nictuku: having a good signed key is always GOOD, but before you upload your own packages to ubuntu, some guys will have to review them
<nictuku> lamont: hmm actually, no.
<lamont> 1.2-3 is followed by 1.2-3ubuntu1 :-(
<lamont> because otherwise, you conflict with the other guy building 1.2-4, and that'd be bd.
<lamont> bad
<nictuku> yeah I got it.
<nictuku> how can I have my key signed? I live in Brazil, btw.
<lamont> where in brazil
<lamont> ?
<nictuku> Goiania, state of Goias
<lamont> hrm.. no clue where that is.. second
<dholbach> you could talk to guys on http://nm.debian.org/gpg_offer.php
<dholbach> but i'm not sure how far you'd have to travel
<nictuku> been there, no one near me. not even close.
<nictuku> In debian, they would sign a key in extreme cases, if one sends a scanned version of its real ID or drivers license...
<lamont> and Fortaleza, Curitiba, Recife, Sao Paulo all far away?
<dholbach> nictuku: http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/UnsignedGpgKey
<nictuku> very far.
<lamont> nictuku: is really a mako question -he's got connections _everywhere_.
<nictuku> :)
<dholbach> anyway... while you're working towards a gpg key and really want to help out, you will have to have us review packages and upload them for you :-)
<nictuku> yep. where should I send the diff file to?
<nictuku> about wiki/UnsignedGpgKey - biglumber didn't help either.
<nictuku> I'm not in a hurry to do that, though. I can wait till I meet with a dd (that happens sometimes in events)
<dholbach> nictuku: you have access to some webspace where you could add .diff.gz .orig.tar.gz and .dsc ?
<nictuku> yes. wait a second, please.
<dholbach> nictuku: next step: add the link to it on wiki/MOTUTodo ("to review" section)
<dholbach> someone will get in touch with you, when he finds the time
<dholbach> and hey... thanks for helping out :-)
<nictuku> nah, I'm the one grateful here! :)
<dholbach> so we're all glad in here :-)
<dholbach> ok... i'll go for the last walk tonight and get murphy out
<dholbach> good night
<nictuku> night
<tritium> good night dholbach
<dholbach> bye tritium, nictuku
<nictuku> is this currently accessible? http://www.grupomabel.com.br/ubuntu/
<fredix> hu
<fredix> hi
<fredix> where i can report a bug for universe ?
<nictuku> maybe http://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/ ?
<Burgundavia> no
<fredix> not for universe
<Burgundavia> launchpad.ubuntu.com/malone
* dredg pokes diamond in the spleen
<diamond> dredg: morning.
* diamond rubs his spleen
<fredix> someone know who upload libgtk-trayicon-ruby into universe ?
<nictuku> can anybody see an explanation for the wontfix in debian #242066?
<nictuku> oh i found it
<tritium> crimsun, how are things?
<crimsun> not too bad
<crimsun> just uploaded python-qt3, have to wait for it to build so I can fix python-kde3 :)
<crimsun> yourself?
<tritium> congratulations!
<crimsun> small fries compared with universe :/
<tritium> dholbach reviewed xawtv, and it's already uploaded and built just fine
<tritium> thanks for offering earlier
<crimsun> yep, read above.  Great!
<tritium> thanks
<crimsun> yeah, sorry about the lag, I had been called away and wasn't able to even finish python-qt3 til now
<tritium> no, don't even worry about it.  It's fine.
<StoneTable> What should I do when I come across a package that won't build, due to api changes?  Looks like gnome-alsamixer is busted.  Upstream is broke, and doesn't look like it's been touched since the middle of last year
<crimsun> StoneTable: personally, it's a morgue candidate
<StoneTable> sunds like a plan to me.
<crimsun> StoneTable: gnome's Volume Control (in 'gnome-media')) already provides the functionality through gst's mixer
<StoneTable> yeah, maybe that's why it's been abandoned
<diamond> newbie question here, looking at packages in UniversePriorityList, some of them don't build purely because apt isn't accepting unauthenticated dependancy packages,
<diamond> how does that get fixed? the maintainer tweaks the build env?
<crimsun> none of them should build if you're using pbuilder
<crimsun> you have to add an explicit configuration
<diamond> crimsun: for example, putty is listed on that page as failing, but builds fine here in pbuilder with the steps provided in the pbuilder howto wiki entry
<crimsun> diamond: if it builds fine for all 4 arches, then note it as done
<crimsun> (add a note)
<diamond> wait. i'm a moron, sorry. i've mixed up amd64 and ia64.
<diamond> looking at the build logs now, it appears to have build successfully on i386, ppc, amd64 and ia64 (which i presume are the four arches).
<crimsun> yes, I was just about to say that.
<diamond> so, the maintainer will presumably take care of updating the UniversePriorityList, and i should go pick a different broken package, right?
<diamond> (apologise for the flood of painfully unsure questions ,-)
<diamond> *apologies
<schweeb> hooray
<tritium> diamond, the maintainer may not be aware of the UniversePriorityList
<schweeb> my Samba migration went about as good as possible
<tritium> what's up schweeb ?
<tritium> ah, cool
<schweeb> howdy
<schweeb> I'll just say that WINS sucks.
<diamond> tritium: ah. what can i do then? apt-cache show putty says the maintainer is Colin Watson (@debian.org).
<schweeb> colin watson = Kamion :)
<tritium> yeah, you could tell him I guess
<schweeb> although why you would run putty on linux...
<tritium> no idea...
<diamond> schweeb: i use it elsewhere, mainly for pterm, the terminal emulator.
<diamond> schweeb: it's fast, and pretty bug-free
<diamond> schweeb: gnome-terminal for example is paaaainfully slow on my p3-800 in work
<crimsun> I'd use rxvt-unicode then ;)
<StoneTable> <3 aterm
<schweeb> aterm or Eterm
<diamond> crimsun: aye, utf8 support is a must, but i've had issues with rxvt too. basically, every terminal emulator sucks (just like osen -), pterm just sucks a little less
<schweeb> although I'm using gnome-terminal currently out of laziness...
<diamond> i have a friend tho who had to resort to using putty on his box because openssh couldn't get past his router.
<diamond> t'was a really weird issue
<crimsun> diamond: well in my case I was using zsh, which has issue with utf-8
<crimsun> err, issues
* diamond slaps forehead
<diamond> as i was saying before i so rudely interrupted myself,
<diamond> it eventually turned out that openssh was setting some QOS bits for some of it's inital packets,
<tritium> It's hard to pick a package to fix.  It does seem like some failed to build only because build-dependencies weren't available in some cases.
<diamond> and his router, being a cheap piece of crap, was dropping on them
<diamond> tritium: indeed
<diamond> s/on//
<tritium> (e.g. octave2.1 on ia64)
<schweeb> * on ia64
<tritium> indeed
<diamond> if anyone has any favourite packages that aren't building on amd64, i'm willing to have a poke
<tritium> cool, diamond.  Thanks.
<tritium> You could look at vpnc.  It seems to be failing to build only on amd64, if I recall correctly
<diamond> tritium: just checking the logs now, it looks like everything except ppc is currently building
<tritium> no, looks like it built, actually
<tritium> yeah, that's new status info on that
* diamond nods
<diamond> for that matter, i can poke i386 and ppc stuff too, but i'm guessing there are more people around with those platforms
<schweeb> yea, most of us have i386 :)
<diamond> amd64 is the way of the future i tell you -)
<crimsun> ppc64 :)
<diamond> either that or i've just bought myself a rather expensive flop
<schweeb> I'll reserve my judgement for when I actually own one
<diamond> er. pun unintented, obviously.
<schweeb> I'm pretty happy with i386
<diamond> schweeb: tbh, i switched mainly because i was looking for a new machine, and amd are selling the 64-bit athlons as their main line now
<schweeb> yea
<tritium> crimsun, you have a G5?
<diamond> right. mr. watson mailed re: putty.
<schweeb> okay, I'm gonna go through and start moving stuff where the only platform it doesn't build on is ia64...  should I add a new page with DoesNotBuildIA64, or should I just put them in the comments section on the UniversePriorityList?
<tritium> he's in #ubuntu-devel, you probably could have talked to him in real-time
<diamond> tritium: ah hah. right. i scanned the channel list here, didn't think of poking in there.
<tritium> so what did he tell you?
<schweeb> anyone have an opinion?  ia64 does not build, new page, or add to comments
<tritium> schweeb, my bet is that dholbach (and everyone else) trusts you enough to do what you feel is best
<schweeb> alright :)
* schweeb starts a new page
<tritium> not that I have any say in the matter, but I know you do good work
<crimsun> (yes, DoesNotBuildIA64 was mentioned before.  Go for it.)
<crimsun> tritium: access to, yes, not personally (unfortunately)
<tritium> crimsun, I see.  It turns out, my hard-drive problems were fixed with an fsck, but I'm still considering a new machine.
<crimsun> tritium: ah!  Well, at least that's good news.
<tritium> Yeah, it was!
<tritium> I wouldn't mind seeing a G5 powerbook come out next month with OS X 10.4, but there's no indication of that happening.
<StoneTable> my wife is dreaming of a g5 powerbook
<StoneTable> my pocketbook, however, is not ;)
<tritium> heh
<diamond> tritium: told me to go ahead and update the page, putty is now moved to the 'done' section.
<tritium> diamond, congrats
<diamond> tritium: well, t'was he that fixed it, i did nothing only notice and tell him -)
<tritium> well, it's still a good thing :)
* diamond grins
<diamond> true
* diamond goes to poke at snacc
<crimsun> back later, need go to for a run.
<crimsun> err, word order switch.
<tritium> see you crimsun
<tritium> cool, a fellow runner :)
<schweeb> nice
<schweeb> lots of these ia64 only bugs seem to just be buildd problems
<schweeb> might be able to clear up a bunch of bugs tonight
<tritium> that would be way cool
<wasabi_> So are we still accepting new packages to universe for hoary?
<tritium> wasabi_, I tend to doubt it at this point
<schweeb> jeeze this ia64 buildd is messed up a good portion of the time it seems
<tritium> schweeb, are you putting that list together by hand?
<schweeb> yep
<schweeb> I'm looking at the buildlogs and determining the general problem too
<schweeb> so it can't be scripted
<tritium> fun
<schweeb> gotta be done
<schweeb> this stuff would be way better if it was in a database and you could query for certain attributes
<lamont> schweeb: the dev/null antics were all over, but ia64 had more stuff to do when it started hitting the fan
<lamont> ditto ppc
<lamont> and then there was the fact that one of the ia64 buildd's wasn't really happy, iirc, which meant it went flying through the packages vomiting
<schweeb> lamont: well, I'm compiling a list of stuff that needs to be kicked for you on ia64
<lamont> schweeb: uh, everything got kicked.
<schweeb> oh
<schweeb> :-/
<schweeb> are the logs going into Test still?
<lamont> Total 27 package(s) in state Building.
<lamont> Total 1468 package(s) in state Needs-Build.
<lamont> Total 3 package(s) in state Uploaded.
<lamont> Total 1498 package(s)
<lamont> yes
<lamont> but atm, it's just main.
<schweeb> you mean just main that's building?
<lamont> that'll take 6-8 hours or more to finish, and then we just have to convince elmo to reimport universe
<lamont> main always beats universe in the build ordering
<schweeb> right
<lamont> just as universe beats multiverse
<diamond> hum. i'm beginning to suspect a gcc/libc6 but is causing this problem with snacc on amd64
<diamond> *bug
<lamont> so the fact that only main is in the test repository doesn't really affect things until it finishes...
<lamont> diamond: that or it's doing something stupid like casting between pointers and int's...
* lamont becomes curious
<schweeb> lamont: well, I'm at least compiling a list of stuff that's only wrong on ia64 right now :)
<diamond> lamont: the point at which it crashes is definetely safe,
<diamond> lamont: but Weird Stuff appears to be happening.
<schweeb> unclutter the PriList a bit
<tritium> hmm, I just got qemu to build without modification
<lamont> hrmpf no nice neat warnings-that-are-really-errors
<tritium> I'll double-check...
<lamont> schweeb: coolness
<diamond> lamont: heh, aye -)
<lamont> diamond: interesting
<tritium> not at first glance
<diamond> lamont: the code does, basically:   long int t; printf("%s",ctime(&t));
<diamond> lamont: and strlen inside printf (well it's actually fprintf, but no matter) barfs
<lamont> diamond: and there's a #include <time.h>, I expect
<diamond> er. i left out the 't=time(NULL)' bit -)
<lamont> wonder if making that say 'time_t t' helps
<diamond> lamont: i checked the headers, time_t == long int
<lamont> yeah
<diamond> hum. you know, you're right. time.h ain't included.
<lamont> that could matter
<diamond> whaddya know, i think it's actually building now ,-)
<diamond> i blame the 5am time for me not having checked that
* lamont tips his hat
<lamont> only 9PM here. :-)
<diamond> bing. that fixed it!
<diamond> lamont: cheers for the hint
<diamond> wooo
<diamond> right. i'm a newb. where do i go from here? i have a patch...
<diamond> (and yeah, it's a oneliner ,-)
<lamont> diamond: and I presume that you're not in the universe-uploaders keyring
<diamond> lamont: no, i'm not
<schweeb> lamont: so are all arches being rebuilt from source again, then?
<diamond> dredg can vouch for who i am, apart from that...
<lamont> hrm....  /me isn't sure of the actual process either...
<diamond> lamont: heh heh, k.
<lamont> schweeb: yes
<schweeb> diamond: you'll have to wait till one of the MOTUs are around
<schweeb> lamont: an MOTU reviews it and uploads it if satisfactory :)
<lamont> schweeb: yeah.  that much I knew
<schweeb> that's about it, heh
<lamont> then there's the issue of email addr whitelisting, etc, etc,etc.
<schweeb> ah, yes
<diamond> schweeb: right
<lamont> I mean, I could upload it, but that would feel like , dunno, cheating somehow...  we should give diamond the proper visibility with the MOTU's
<schweeb> elmo should just make a web form to whitelist :)
<schweeb> right
<diamond> lamont: aye, i'd like to work towards motu-ship
<lamont> schweeb: is just email to elmo to do it, yes?
<schweeb> oh
<schweeb> I just poked him in IRC :)
<lamont> well, that too
<schweeb> all the whitelist gains for you is emailing you if you're in the Changed-By header, right?
<lamont> diamond: in that case, you probably want to send email to james.troup@ubuntu.com, or poke elmo in irc, and ask him to add your email addr to the whitelist.  Then, as you build source packages, you will get the nice email from the installer, etc.  and your name will be in the changes mail that goes to everyone and their mother.
<lamont> schweeb: and the visibility that goes with it
<lamont> then we know we've been seeing your work... otherwise it just comes from 'Ubuntu installer'
<lamont> and we don't readily know who did the changes...
<schweeb> oh
<lamont> admittedly, that's just reading the From: header in the mail, rather than the Changed-By field inside the body
<diamond> lamont: cool.
<schweeb> my stuff has all been Ubuntu Installer so far I think....  but I think that was before I was whitelisted
<lamont> once whitelisted, you should appear as the From address
<lamont> (yes, katie forges email.  so?)
<schweeb> lol
* lamont needs some faster cd-rw media
<lamont> diamond: see also http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/DeveloperResources
<tritium> lamont, qemu sure appears to have built correctly on i386.  The log appears to indicate there were unsatisfied build-deps when the buildd made its attempt
<lamont> tritium: le huh?  URL?
<tritium> http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/q/qemu/0.6.1-1/qemu_0.6.1-1_20050327-1915-i386-failed
<lamont> is missing zlib1g-dev build-dep
<tritium> looks that way, yet it built
<lamont> now, whether that should be a direct build-dep:, or some other package is missing a Depend:, remains as a question
<tritium> it's in the control file
<lamont> what's in the control file?
<tritium> zlib1g-dev
<lamont> when it built for the archive in november, something Depended: on zlib1g-dev
<tritium> (as a build depend)
<tritium> Yes, qemu
* lamont fetches source
<lamont> Build-Depends: cdbs, debhelper (>= 4.1.0), libx11-dev | xlibs-dev, libsdl1.2-dev (>> 1.2.1), texi2html, sharutils, libgpmg1-dev | not+linux-gnu
* lamont sees no zlib1g-dev
<lamont> and it clearly needs a Build-Depends: zlib1g-dev
<lamont> since it references -lz directly (Makefile, Makefile.target)
<tritium> Build-Depends: cdbs, debhelper (>= 4.1.0), libx11-dev | xlibs-dev, libsdl1.2-dev (>> 1.2.1), texi2html, sharutils, libgpmg1-dev | not+linux-gnu, zlib1g-dev
<tritium> (that's what I have here)
<tritium> no modification
<lamont> and what does head debian/changelog say?
<tritium> heh, ajmitch fixed it today ;) sorry
<lamont> thank you
<tritium> sorry for the bother
<lamont> no
<lamont> np
<lamont> damn keyboard
<lamont> typing break
<tritium> I just assumed it hadn't been fixed since it wasn't in the "Done" section of UniversePriorityList.  My bad.
* schweeb installs workrave on lamont's system
<lamont> workrave and I haven't agreed in the past
<schweeb> hehe
<schweeb> I've never tried it
<schweeb> does it actually prevent you from typing after a certain point, or can you circumvent it?
<lamont> you can tell it to let you postpone or not
<lamont> hence knowing that i need to take a break... had postponed it a few times already
<schweeb> wooo
<schweeb> almost done with the first 50%
<schweeb> and I just remembered I should go to sleep soon
<diamond> schweeb: sleep is good.
* schweeb has to babysit the Samba PDC when everyone shows up at work tomorrow
<schweeb> diamond: I know better than most
* schweeb is a narcoleptic
<diamond> ah. ouch. i'm the exact opposite
<diamond> well, no. i guess the exact opposite is someone who is asleep all the time and wakes up at random intervals ,-)
<schweeb> I only have problems in class and watching TV really
<schweeb> so, it's not so bad
* diamond nods
<diamond> i'm currently on a month off from work due to a sleep disorder
<diamond> so i decided i'd help out with ubuntu with my spare time, heh.
<schweeb> good call.
<tritium> wow, diamond
<diamond> interdiff! what a wonderful program. (that i've only just found out about -)
<diamond> tritium: i'm supposed to be doing a research postgrad in computer science, but the last 6 months have been completely unproductive due to lack of sleep, so between that and the stress of not getting anything done, it was agreed i'd take off for a month. they even offered to still pay me for the time off, which i gladly accepted
<tritium> diamond, post-doc?
<diamond> 'course i'm supposed to be trying to set up a regular sleeping pattern, but i'll start that tomorrow, right? -)
<diamond> tritium: nah, just a lowly masters
<tritium> diamond, don't say "lowly".  That's an awesome accomplishment.
<tritium> That's nice that they'll pay you :)
<diamond> tritium: it will be if i ever finish it (or tbh, start it properly)
<diamond> tritium: yeah, they're very supportive.
* tritium thinks he'll try the "enormous omelette sandwich" at Burger King tomorrow
<tritium> diamond, that's good.  I hope you'll take good care of yourself in the month you have off.
<schweeb> lamont: what bout packages that say ia64 isn't in their arch list... should they be fixed and reuploaded, or what
<tritium> We'll support you fully in your recovery!
<lamont> schweeb: depeends.
<schweeb> http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/d/dfsbuild/0.6.17/dfsbuild_0.6.17_20050325-0106-ia64-failed
<diamond> tritium: cheers -)
<lamont> generally speaking, the answer to that question is either (1) fix the package and upload, (2) live with it, or (3) edit PaS to exclude the package from the build on that architecture
<tritium> :)
<schweeb> lamont: k
<lamont> schweeb: and that particular package is probably (3)
<lamont> or (2)
<lamont> since (1) is beyond the scope of the current exercise
<tritium> crimsun, how was the run?
<lamont> schweeb: as in, (1) involves actually finishing the _port_ of the package to ia64.
<crimsun> tritium: not too bad, thanks
<schweeb> heh
<schweeb> and me no havey ia64
<lamont> schweeb: neither does hoary. :-)
<schweeb> are installer CDs even generated for ia64?
<lamont> schweeb: yes, but not as of 3/28
<lamont> and not in the release directory
<tritium> doko, ping
<lamont> server install works, desktop is really close, last I heard
<lamont> right
<schweeb> is ia64 eventually gonna be a target arch, or is it just kinda bonus?
<schweeb> I hear fabbione has a soft spot for sparc and has an unofficial buildd for that too ;)
<diamond> right. i'm a little lost. i've fixed a couple of bugs in a package (snacc). i've made a patch. how do i go about incorporating this patch into the ubuntu.diff.gz so that i can test the entire build using pbuilder?
<schweeb> which files did you patch?
<schweeb> if they're in debian/ then the methodology is different than if they're in the actual source
<diamond> schweeb: they're in the actual source
<tritium> diamond, do you use cdbs for your rules file?
<schweeb> you'll wanna look at incorporating dpatch into your rules file
<tritium> I use simple-patchsys with cdbs
<crimsun> (cdbs makes patching a cinch!)
<diamond> schweeb: ah. right
<schweeb> yea, cdbs rules
<schweeb> tritium: dpatch has dependencies and stuff I believe
<diamond> right, i'll look at that so. however, from what i understand,
<schweeb> like, inter-patch deps
<tritium> schweeb, probably.  I know very little about dpatch
<diamond> nm. i'll go read first. ask confused questions later. -)
<schweeb> and a few other benefits I can't list ATM
<schweeb> it's only a little bit harder to use dpatch than simple-patchsys
<crimsun> just tell cdbs to grok your debian/patches/
<tritium> anybody know if doko is working on python-gnome?
<schweeb> okay, I'm done for the night
<schweeb> https://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/DoesNotBuildIA64
<tritium> Good night schweeb
<diamond> schweeb: nite
<crimsun> night, schweeb
<schweeb> there are some packages at the bottom that are all the way fixed on all arches
<tritium> nice work, schweeb!
<crimsun> tritium: do you mean the source package 'gnome-python'?
<schweeb> if someone wants to go through and remove them, please do
<tritium> crimsun, yes, from the UniversePriority list
<schweeb> (from the UniversePriorityList)
<tritium> looks like he fixed it up for the python transition at least
<crimsun> hmm.  It built on 7 Marrch
<schweeb> I'm guessing after the Test archive gets resynced, we'll probably want to entirely regenerate these lists... it'll probably be easier
<tritium> probably
<tritium> crimsun, I'm looking at the Logs linked to from UniversePriorityList for python-gnome
<tritium> failed as recently as 27th
<crimsun> hmm!
<tritium> This is odd, considering python-dev (>=2.4) Build-Depends:  checking if Python version >= 1.5.2... configure: error: too old
<crimsun> k, I'll pull the source
<tritium> ok, thanks
<crimsun> I'm pretty sure that's a hiccup - it just built fine here (unchanged).
<tritium> really?  not here...
<tritium> thanks for checking it
<crimsun> hmm, when did you last update your pbuilder?
<crimsun> I updated mine just before I threw the .dsc at it
<tritium> earlier tonight, but I'll do it again now
<tritium> gee, still failed after I updated pbuilder.
<crimsun> hmm, i386, correct?
<tritium> yeah
<crimsun> could you post your config.log somewhere?
<tritium> sure, one sec
<tritium> crimsun, I can't find a config.log
<crimsun> configure.log?
<crimsun> sorry, my brain's fuzzy, so I probably misstated it
<tritium> sorry, the build log?
<crimsun> just the log of configure running up until it fails
<lamont> tritium: it doesn't check for python2.4, just 2.3 down to 1.5.2, I bet
<lamont> that or it fails to Build-Depend: python
<crimsun> it does b-d on python (>= 2.4)
<lamont> since python2.4 nor python2.4-dev Depends python.
<lamont> hrm
<crimsun> and python2.4 is passed explicitly to ./configure
<crimsun> and I built it successfully on a P4 here just a few minutes ago, so this is an odd one
<lamont> then you'll want that config.log from the build tree
<tritium> crimsun, when I run pbuilder, I don't know how to find the configure logs.  I only know how to save a build log.
<crimsun> tritium: use login
<tritium> ok
<crimsun> invoke debian/rules manually, check config.log
<tritium> thanks
<crimsun> np
<tritium> is there an easy way to copy the file out of the chroot?
<crimsun> just copy it as a user out of the /tmp/foo
<crimsun> (or use --save-after-login)
<tritium> ok
<tritium> I'm too inexperienced with chroots.  I don't see anything in /tmp, so I'll try the --save-after-login
<diamond> tritium: i think pbuilder uses /var/cache/pbuilder
<tritium> diamond, yeah, thanks.
* diamond pokes dpatch in the eye
<tritium> crimsun, sorry for the delay: http://mip-lab4.ecn.purdue.edu/~rimbert/config.log
* tritium feels stupid
<readingboy> hello everyone
<diamond> morning
<tritium> hello
<readingboy> this is the packaging group, correct?
<crimsun> for universe, yes.
<tritium> crimsun, I don't think I did that right.
<readingboy> I'm interested in knowing how packaging works and learning how to do that myself. Is there a good place to go learn about this?
<readingboy> I've googled to not much avail...
<tritium> readingboy, The first step I took was to read the Debian New Maintainer's Guide
<readingboy> tritium, excellent! I've found the page and am off to read now. thanks!
<tritium> sure :)
<crimsun> apparently configure is dying because Python.h isn't found
<tritium> I don't think I could have done that right.  logging in to the chroot doesn't get any of the build-deps it needs
<tritium> can you log in to a running build process?
<crimsun> not that I know of, besides possibly ptracing
<crimsun> but that wouldn't be "logging in," really
<diamond> woo. think i've finally got dpatch doing what i want.
<tritium> let me apt-get build-dep python-gnome in the chroot, and try again
<schweeb> tritium: you could apt-get build-dep inside the chroot... or use dpkg-checkbuilddeps to tell you which ones are missing...
<tritium> schweeb, :)
<schweeb> apt-get build-dep will only grab the deps from the source in the archive, not your modified sources
<crimsun> tritium: you're on ia32, not amd64, correct?
<tritium> it's unmodified right now anyway
<tritium> crimsun, yes
<crimsun> tritium: try invoking autoconf explicitly in the build-2.4/config.status target immediately proceeding dh_testdir
<crimsun> tritium: which means you'll have to add autoconf to debian/control/Build-Depends
<crimsun> err, debian/control:Build-Depends
<crimsun> (yes, hackety-hack)
<tritium> okay, shall I proceed with this first, and get you a new config.log?
<crimsun> yes, please
<tritium> ok
<crimsun> brb, drink
<tritium> ok
<crimsun> (back)
<tritium> ok
<tritium> new file up at same URL
<crimsun> k
<tritium> lamont, thanks for the suggestions earlier :)
<crimsun> ok, it gets further
<diamond> sweet. finally. i have got snacc building in pbuilder
<crimsun> what did it die on this time?
<tritium> nice job diamond
<diamond> (for amd64)
<diamond> tritium: cheers
<tritium> checking if Python version >= 1.5.2... configure: error: too old
<tritium> configure: error: /bin/sh './configure' failed for pygtk
<tritium> those are the last 2 lines
<ajmitch> ah, I see I wasted your time today, tritium  :(
<ajmitch> sorry about that, forgot to edit the wiki after fixing up qemu
<crimsun> tritium: hum, still?  That's even more odd.  Where did you edit debian/rules?
<tritium> ajmitch, no, you didn't :)
<tritium> crimsun, so far, no changes yet.  I'll try your suggestions next.
<tritium> this is wacky, especially since it builds on your machine
<tritium> ajmitch, I'm glad you got it fixed!
<crimsun> tritium: extract gnome-python source (via apt-get source) in a temp directory, edit gnome-python-2.10.0/debian/rules to invoke autoconf, and use pbuilder debuild
<ajmitch> tritium: it was an easy fix
<tritium> ajmitch, yeah, that's why I was going to attempt it ;)
<ajmitch> previously the Build-Depends pulled in zlib1g-dev by themselves
<tritium> it was pretty obvious from the buildd log what was needed :)
<ajmitch> yep
<tritium> crimsun, ok
<ajmitch> just took awhile to compile ;)
<tritium> yeah
<diamond> right, should i upload my changes to my website, and add a line to 'waiting review' on UniversePriorityList?
<crimsun> and MOTUToDo
<diamond> right. cheers.
<tritium> I think I'll create a new pbuilder base.tgz.  it's huge now
<tritium> crimsun, how late do you plan on being up?  Should we continue this tomorrow?
<tritium> They're going to be rebooting the freenode us hub in 30 minutes anyway
<crimsun> I'll be up for a good while, since I have to grade quizzes and make a programming assignment
<tritium> Ah, okay.
<crimsun> tomorrow(today)'s fine if you feel like turning in
<tritium> I'm good for a while.  Hopefully the freenode hub reboot won't be too disruptive
<crimsun> k
<tritium> crimsun, I just noticed you grabbed gnome-python, and I'm working on python-gnome
<tritium> the version # difference is what I first noticed
<tritium> ajmitch, how are things?
<ajmitch> ok
* ajmitch on phone :)
<crimsun> tritium: python-gnome2, right?
<crimsun> tritium: (I don't see a python-gnome)
<crimsun> tritium: I use apt-get source $source_name
<tritium> crimsun, I used apt-get source python-gnome
<crimsun> whoa.
<crimsun> I don't even have a python-gnome.
<tritium> apt-cache search only shows python-gnome2, but apt-get source python-gnome does find version 1.4.5
<crimsun> what does ,,apt-cache policy python-gnome'' print out?
<tritium> no candidate
<crimsun> how in the world...
<crimsun> http://higgs.djpig.de/cgi-ubuntu/search_contents.pl?word=python-gnome2&searchmode=searchword&case=insensitive&version=hoary&arch=i386   also finds no python-gnome
<tritium> you can't apt-get source python-gnome ?
<crimsun> ah!
<crimsun> I see.
<crimsun> my apologies
<ajmitch> tritium: grep python-gnome /var/lib/apt/lists/*
<tritium> crimsun, okay, cool.  This is strange, huh?
<diamond> right. it's 7:45am, i'm going to bed. 'nite' folks ,-)
<ajmitch> 'night' diamond  ;)
<tritium> ajmitch, lots returned
<crimsun> tritium: actually that makes a lot of sense now.  Anyhow, the cause is a missing b-d on python (>= 2.4), python (<< 2.5)  just as lamont said
<ajmitch> heh ok
<crimsun> :)
<tritium> crimsun, yet, python-dev (>=2.4) should depend on it
<lamont> tritium: no, it shouldn't.
<ajmitch> perhaps I should have specified grep-dctrl on the sources lists
<lamont> in fact, that dependency was specifically removed about 6-8 months ago
<crimsun> tritium: I trigged that same missing b-d on python2.4 for one of the packages I transitioned.
<tritium> lamont, why does apt-cache depends python2.4-dev return python2.4 ?
<lamont> because it does.
<lamont> but python2.4 doesn't deliver /usr/bin/python
<lamont> it delivers /usr/bin/python2.4
<tritium> That's confusing to me, but I'll add the build-depends.  Thanks crimsun and lamont.
<crimsun> (python-minimal actually delivers /usr/bin/python, and python-minimal depends on python2.4-minimal)
<lamont> amusingly, now that python2.4-minimal (and python-minimal) are essential, you don't actually have to declare python build-depends...
<lamont> if minimal works, that is.
<lamont> s/works/works for you/
<lamont> although it doesn't hurt, since it would cause ftbfs in debian
<ajmitch> bbl
<tritium> the way I checked was apt-cache depends python-dev
<tritium> that depends on python2.4-dev
<tritium> wich in turn depends on python2.4
<crimsun> right, but configure only checks for python, which would be /usr/bin/python, which python-minimal delivers, which is really python2.4-minimal...)
<tritium> But I must be misunderstanding things.
<crimsun> had I realized that I should have been getting the source for python-gnome instead of gnome-python (?!), you could have saved an hour :\
<tritium> crimsun, not your fault at all.  Thanks for helping me.  Sorry if I wasted your time.
<crimsun> oh no, I was up anyway hacking at python-kde3 :)
<crimsun> which of course is $fun
<tritium> okay.  Well, I appreciate the mentoring.  You too, lamont.
<crimsun> yep, thanks lamont.
<encolpe> good morning
<crimsun> morning, encolpe
<tritium> I'll need to re-add python (>= 2.4) build depends to some of my new packages, then.
<crimsun> only if it needs it
<tritium> it doesn't need it to build
<crimsun> then they're fine without python as a b-d
<tritium> ok...I think I'll re-visit this tomorrow morning with a fresh mind.
<crimsun> we try and use the minimal b-d list
<crimsun> k, night
<tritium> ok, goodnight.  thanks again
<crimsun> np :)
<tritium> :)
<koke> morning all!
<dholbach> hai
<dholbach> added #8367 and #8369 to the motutodo
<dholbach> i'm off - have to use a friends scanner *grmbl*
<mdke> anyway to post bugs on universe packages?
<mdke> no one home?
<jani> hello all
<pvanhoof> A few weeks ago I posted a proposal for the quickcammes module, which adds support for Logitec Quickcam messenger, tot he mailinglist. Did somebody picked this up? I've wrapped the module in an easy-to-build build environment and did some bugfixes to it. You can find more information here: http://freax.be/wiki/index.php/Quickcam_Messenger_Linux_kernel_2.6_driver (please forward it to a kernel-packager, it would be nice if it was support
<pvanhoof> and a few people already asked for packages)
<pvanhoof> there's a package for normal Quickcams in ubuntu, however, a) it requires that you still build it (some wieerd way of installing itusing source packages) and b) it doesn't support the messenger (which is slightly different)
<dholbach> pvanhoof: are there any packges yet?
<Treenaks> dholbach: no
<dholbach> pvanhoof: then please add it to wiki/UniverseCandidates
<Treenaks> dholbach: we're going to start working on our private fork of the driver, and get it into mainline
<Treenaks> dholbach: so the MOTU won't have anything to do with it, eventually
<dholbach> Treenaks: sounds charming
<pvanhoof> :p
<Treenaks> dholbach: less work for you, though :P
<dholbach> Treenaks: i'm glad to hear that
<pvanhoof> I can still add it to that wikipage, of course, if you want to add support for it while we are trying to get it acceptable for mainline
<pvanhoof> since it does work and is easily packagable atm
<dholbach> pvanhoof: we're incredibly busy at this stage, so i hope you understand, when i can't promise anything
<pvanhoof> (it's code is just a bit ugly and it tries to support to many different kernel versions, stuff like that)
<pvanhoof> ok, I understand. I'll add it to the wiki?
<Treenaks> pvanhoof: great idea
<dholbach> yes
* ajmitch briefly checks in
<ajmitch> night all..
<tritium> good morning, dholbach
<StoneTable> is there a policy on what to do with abandoned packages?  I was working on aime, trying to get the package to build, and I see the project hasn't had a release in almost 3 years
<dholbach> hey tritium
<dholbach> StoneTable: if you're fully confident in the package's removal head straight to wiki/MorgueCandidates
* StoneTable nods
<StoneTable> hopefully I can find a package that won't be a morgue candidate ;)
<dholbach> StoneTable: please check   apt-cache rdepends <package>  before
<dholbach> so we make a clean job
<StoneTable> oh, cool I didn't know about rdepends :)
<tritium> arg, more Input/Output errors...going to fsck again...
<schweeb> mornin
<tritium> good morning, schweeb
<schweeb> dholbach: I got through about the first 50% and wrote down all the pkgs that were ia64 problems only
<schweeb> haven't yet had time to remove them from the list yet
<dholbach> wow!
<schweeb> but they're on wiki/DoesNotBuildIA64
<schweeb> I also noted some packages that are building on all now on the same page
<schweeb> some story, havent' had time to remove from the list yet
<dholbach> alright
<schweeb> but, apparently they're retrying Test, starting yesterday
<schweeb> so everything should be rebuilding
<dholbach> brb
<schweeb> k
<HostingGeek> dholbach said he wont ban me for saying this useless funny link so here goes nothing: http://www.tomsphotos.com/router/
<HostingGeek> walmart takes back every and anything
<schweeb> whoa
<schweeb> diamond fixed snacc last night? cool
<tritium> yeah, he did
<diamond> morning.
<tritium> good morning
<diamond> right. i've fixed snacc, would someone mind reviewing it for me? it's at diamond.nonado.net/packages/snacc
<schweeb> this top 25% list is getting pretty short
<tritium> I tried fixing python-gnome.  Adding a python (>=2.4) Build-Depends did not help.
<pitti> Hi guys
<pitti> I'm currently doing a full security review of Ubuntu
<pitti> many universe packages can be fixed with Debian syncs
<pitti> ogra/dholbach agreed that I shall just do the syncs instead of asking for every package
<dredg> hey pitti
<pitti> however, I don't overwrite Ubuntu changes
<pitti> can somebody please merge grip?
<pitti> (CAN-2005-0706)
<pitti> Hi dredg
<pitti> ogra: is there anybody in particular I shall contact about universe security issues?
<dredg> pitti: there will ultimately (i hope) be a MOTU security team of some description.
<ogra> pitti, we dont have a MOTUSecurity team yet, someone needs to go for that....
<ogra> pitti, but its on the plan: http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/MOTUTeams
<pitti> ogra: wine has a CAN too, but it is a "heavily new" upstream version
<pitti> ogra: any reasons against syncing?
<ogra> pitti, no, absolutely not, i had it on my list as well
<pitti> okay, I ask elmo about it
<dredg> pitti: grip is a small patch. i'll apply and upload in a bit
<dredg> (assuming nobody else has jumped on it)
<pitti> thanks
<pitti> you all know Keybuk's MOM output?
<schweeb> pitti: MOM output?
<pitti> http://people.ubuntu.com/~scott/ongoing-merge/
<pitti> merge-o-matic
<tritium> being his mother's child, should he be it?
<tritium> ;)
<pitti> http://people.ubuntu.com/~scott/ongoing-merge/SOURCE/SOURCE-ubuntu.patch has the Ubuntu changes
<pitti> and there is also an automatically merged source package
<pitti> i. e. grip was successfully merged automatically
<pitti> http://people.ubuntu.com/~scott/ongoing-merge/grip/
<pitti> dredg: ^
<pitti> so you only need to verify that this worked and is current, and upload it
<diamond> really have to stop doing that -/
<schweeb> okay, just knocked about 50 things off the PriorityList
<diamond> schweeb: wow. sweet.
<dredg> pitti: oh, excellent. yeah, debian already includes the patch for CAN-2005-0706. i'll go over the diff
<pitti> dredg: that was the purpose for syncing/merging :-)
<pitti> dredg: I mean, the Ubuntu changes should not get lsot
<pitti> lost, even
<tritium> lamont, do you have any other ideas regarding python-gnome, since adding the python (>=2.4) Build-Depends did not help?
<lamont> tritium: uh, not without looking at it... give me a minute
<tritium> sure
<koke> hi all!
<tritium> hi koke
<lamont> tritium: that _should_ fix it.
<tritium> lamont, yeah, I had hoped
<lamont> one could either regenerate the autocrap files, or edit configure and add python2.4 to the list near line 19000
<diamond> i suspect the test is broken
<tritium> thanks, both of you
<dredg> pitti: i just added a quick patch to grip to fix CAN-2005-0706. I haven't really got time to go over the merge patch atm, i might be able to check it out later
<pitti> dredg: that's fine
<dredg> pitti: it's uploaded
<HiddenWolf> dredg: grip rips cd's, how can it have a security problem? :S
<dredg> HiddenWolf: buffer overflow in the cddb lookup bit
<HiddenWolf> dredg: ugh, that's nasty.
<tritium> diamond, you probably know autoconf a lot better than I.  If you care to look at python-gnome, be my guest.
<diamond> tritium: i wouldn't bet on it, but sure, i'll have a poke -)
<tritium> diamond, you're CS, I'm EE, so I'm betting on it ;)  Thanks for taking a look.
<dredg> tritium: he's far far far worse than that
<diamond> lol
<diamond> tritium: i'm originally CE -)
<tritium> diamond, no kidding... ;)
* schweeb is CE
<tritium> dredg, that's what you mean?
<dredg> tritium: no. and now i shall be enigmatic and vague about the whole thing.
<tritium> heh, okay
<HiddenWolf> Do any of you guys of any app/way that can restrict a program to a certain portion of the screen?
<tritium> cool, schweeb :)
<tritium> with each fsck, my /lost+found grows :(
<schweeb> o_O
<schweeb> are you aggressively shutting down your system or what
<tritium> No, not at all.
<tritium> only 24 days left on the support contract...
<tritium> schweeb, I'm contemplating a new laptop
<schweeb> you really shouldn't be seeing fs damage then
<schweeb> only reason for stuff in lost+found is if you haven't properly unmounted
<tritium> I think it's the controller.  This is the second drive I've had in less than 6 months.
<schweeb> ah
<sabdfl> hello-motu!
<diamond> morning
<dredg> hey sabdfl
<tritium> hello!
<crimsun> morning!
<schweeb> mornin
<ogra> hey sabdfl
<trulux> btw, I'm trying to apply for membership and maintainer"-ship", and I've been told to ask for those who know on my contribution to write something in my wiki page
<ogra> trulux, who asked for that ? normally its required that yo fill your wiki page yourself....
<trulux> ogra: mako
* diamond smites autoconf in the face
<trulux> ogra: my page is just done, but mako asked for references, for those who know on my contrib. to write one statement
<koke_> bye koke :P
<dredg> argh i'm a retard
<diamond> dredg: in which way?
<dredg> the ways that matter sometimes
<diamond> heh
<dredg> added patch for grip, never put it in 00list
<dredg> woo, great. a patch that won't be applied
<dredg> gah :(
<diamond> ah. yes. handy -)
<dredg> right, re-uploaded
* dredg smashes face off keyboard
<jani> hello all
<herve> hol!
* schweeb wipes the sweat off his brow
<schweeb> that was fun
<schweeb> my LDAP server crashed, hence crashing my domain
<diamond> woo. python-gnome building!
<jani> can anyone tell me what version of darcs does apt-cache show?
<schweeb> Version: 1.0.2-1
<jani> I cannot find in hoary-changes  whenit got to 1.0.2
<jani> thanks, here as well
<schweeb> maybe elmo synced it?
<schweeb> do syncs go to -changes?
<jani> Yes, I asked him to do it yesterday
<jani> that's why I am confused
<diamond> silly question. when i change something in a package, i should be adding an entry into the changelog and uping the version number, yes?
<jani> and today at work it was there before I updates
<jani> updated
<jani> and I cannot see it on hoary-changes even though I thought syncs go there
<herve> diamond, yes
<tritium> diamond, you got it building?  awesome :)  What did it need?
<herve> diamond, updating means adding ubuntu1 to it
<jani> schweeb, I thought syncs go to changes ,yes
<herve> diamond, or ubuntun+1 if n exists
<tritium> diamond, just some smiting autoconf in the face?
<diamond> tritium: a whole bunch of headwrecking searching, followed by lots of autoconf smiting
<jani> I'll ask in devel
<tritium> heh
<diamond> herve: right, that last bit was the bit i wasn't sure about. cheers.
<diamond> tritium: took me hours to figure out that the issue wasn't in the main configure script,
<tritium> diamond, thanks for doing that.  I'm terrible at smiting, particularly in the face.
<herve> yell if you need something, going washing the dish ;-)
<diamond> tritium: it was in pygtk/configure
<diamond> tritium: hehe. np
<diamond> anyway, currently confirming it builds in pbuilder before throwing it onto the web
<tritium> awesome job!
<dredg> diamond: dch is useful for editing changelogs
<diamond> i'm pretty happy to have made 2 small contributions in my first day. that said sleep would also be good ,-)
<diamond> dredg: ok, will look at that
<herve> diamond, dch is *mandatory* to edit the changelog!
<herve> including the -Dhoary flag
<diamond> herve: right, noted.
<dredg> just make sure to fix your alternatives so that editor points at something useful. like vi.
<schweeb> i.e. not nano :)
<dopey> export EDITOR=
<diamond> schweeb: agreed -)
<dredg> herve: could you tell the difference between a changelog edited using dch and one edited by hand? :)
<schweeb> I occasionally edit by hand, if it's a quick fix
<tritium> or even worse, the mc editor
<herve> dredg, I just want to reduce those tiny errors and ease the job of reviewers
<herve> dredg, but to answer you, no :-)
<dredg> update-alternatives --set editor /usr/bin/vim :)
<diamond> dredg: just done
<schweeb> dredg: damn, I was about to paste the same thing
<schweeb> :p
<dredg> diamond: when a package comes from debian it has a version like `1.0-1'. when we modify it, we change that to '1.0-2ubuntu1'. This allows us to increment the version without getting ahead of the upstream debian version
<diamond> dredg: did you intend to change -1 to -2 there?
<dredg> though while useful, it does tend to hurt when a sync from debian wipes out some ubuntu-specific changes
<dredg> er
<dredg> `1.0-1ubuntu1'
<dredg> ahem
<diamond> dredg: right so -)
* dredg retroactively rewrites the logs
<dredg> you saw nothing
<herve> don't worry ;-)
<tritium> diamond, if I recall, doko already made 1.4.5-2ubuntu1, so you'll want to increment to ubuntu2
<diamond> tritium: right
<diamond> hum. dpkg-buildpackage seems to have changed config.sub and config.guess. should i be removing those diffs from my updated package?
<tritium> diamond, you didn't build it in pbuilder?
<diamond> tritium: ah. good point. i've confused myself with the different locations
<diamond> tritium: wait, in order to get pbuilder to build it, i need to use dpkg-buildpackage to create the appropiate diff.gz, no?
<tritium> diamond, I usually use debuild
<schweeb> you can use dpkg-buildpackage -S
<diamond> ah, k
<tritium> diamond, debuild would also require -S
<diamond> ok
<herve> debuild is just a front-end
<herve> all options are passed to dpkg-buildpackage
<herve> (roughly
<schweeb> dpkg-buildpackage is a frontend as well :)
<schweeb> it calls dpkg-source or some shit
<herve> all the mess you don't want to see :-)
<diamond> right. think i'm gonna just make all the changes from scratch again. unsure as to what perversions i've introduced -)
<dredg> debdiff is also a useful tool :)
<tritium> hi sivang
<diamond> right. i'm well confused. why would 'diffstat snacc_1.3bbn-5.1ubuntu1.diff.gz snacc_1.3bbn-5.1ubuntu2.diff.gz' think i've changed every file?
<diamond> is it just because the version number has changed?
<herve> diamond, do you know debdiff?
<diamond> herve: no, but dredg has just poked me with it
<diamond> i had thought it was for comparing .debs
<dredg> it is
<dredg> it can also do source packages
<diamond> ah, right.
<herve> man, I'm really a-way!
<diamond> ok. deb-diff is showing that config.guess and config.sub have changed in addition to my changes, is that expected behaviour?
<diamond> (they look like they're updated versions)
<diamond> apologies for the string of questions
<diamond> tritium: http://diamond.nonado.net/packages/python-gnome/
<tritium> diamond, cool :)
<tritium> diamond, you should probably edit https://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/UniversePriorityList, requesting a review of it
<diamond> tritium: just done
<diamond> ditto MOTUTodo
<tritium> thanks again, diamond
<diamond> tritium: np. i'm looking to get package fixes under my belt anyway, so if there's any more you'd like fixed, just shout. otherwise, i'll keep poking at the priority list
<dredg> fear
<dredg> debdiff python-gnome_1.4.5-2ubuntu1.dsc python-gnome_1.4.5-2ubuntu2.dsc|wc -l
<dredg> 34239
<diamond> dredg: yeah, that's what i was talking about...
<diamond> dredg: any idea what it's like that?
<dredg> autoconf crack i'm guessing
<diamond> dredg: ah, wait, that is actually correct. all the makefiles etc were re-created in the pygtk subdir
<dredg> mc is so useful for looking through diffs :)
<diamond> oh dear. looks like i didn't delete the autom4te dir. oops.
<dredg> that would do it :)
<diamond> dredg: that brings it down to 11012 lines changed.
<dredg> sweet jesus
<dredg> curse you automake
<diamond> dredg: it's only ~4 fiiles tho
<diamond> aye
* dredg shakes fist
<diamond> *files
<dredg> er, autowhatever
<diamond> right. updated python-gnome_1.4.5-2ubuntu2.dsc now
<dredg> still crack addled :)
<diamond> yeah, but it's _all_ auto*'s fault now -)
<dredg> looks fine to me
<dredg> i'll let someone else review it as well though
<diamond> dredg: cheers
<diamond> dredg: if you're feeling really reviewy, have a look at snacc there too ,-)
<dredg> ok, but only because i can't hunt for an insurance quote from quinn direct...
<diamond> woo -)
<dredg> only 440 changed lines in this one ;)
<dredg> you updated config.sub and config.guess, yes?
<diamond> dredg: aye, config.guess and config.sub got updated by dpkg-buildpackage. no idea why
<dredg> not necessarily a bad thing
<dredg> all that was missing was include <time.h>?
<dredg> heh
<dredg> looks fine as well, though i'd still prefer if someone else took a look over as well
<dredg> and for dpatch stuff, have a read of http://tseng.ath.cx/log/?p=7
<diamond> dredg: yup. it was only biting in once place, but i found another similar usage so i added it there too
<dredg> nothing wrong with what you did, that's just easier...
<diamond> dredg: ah. nicey.
<diamond> very nicey
* diamond bookmarks that
<dredg> yeah. it wins
* diamond loses the game
<dredg> let's not inflict the game on the folk here :) no work will get done.
* dredg sets up apt-proxy
<dredg> care to share your config? :)
<diamond> dredg: sure. one sec, i'll drop it onto nonado
<diamond> dredg: http://diamond.nonado.net/misc/apt-proxy-v2.conf
<diamond> dredg: my apt-proxy cache is currently ~2.2G
<diamond> dredg: the only stuff changed from defaults (afair) are the backends i've added
<dredg> urk
<dredg> right
<diamond> the cache is rather large due to the large number of archs+distros that have been using it
<diamond> i386, ppc, amd64. debian, ubuntu, fedora
<dredg> your dsl upgrade will come in useful for that then :)
<schweeb> heh
<schweeb> proto just got linkedin finally?
<diamond> dredg: indeedy
<schweeb> whoops, wrong window
* schweeb hides
<koke> hi all!
<koke> is the universe also frozen??
<schweeb> no
<schweeb> main isn't fully frozen either, but mostly frozen
<mdz> main is pretty densely frozen at the moment
<koke> ok, so we keep fixing the universe... ;)
<schweeb> koke: yes
* lamont wonders who asked for the sync of squirrelmail that made it unistallable?
<mdz> lamont: I believe it was pitti, check -changes
<schweeb> hah
<lamont> mdz: so can we sync squirrelmail-locales too?
<lamont> so it's installable again?
<mdz> lamont: yes
* lamont request
<lamont> s
<diamond> if anyone here has a couple of spare minutes, i have a few package fixes that need to be reviewed (snacc, python-gnome, and xfcalendar)
<lamont> mdz: sent
<diamond> hurm. X just hung on me -/
<bradb> hey dudes
<bradb> how's the Malone usage going? i haven't heard a lot of feedback from you guys up to now.
<herve> re
<bradb> ogra: ping
<ogra> bradb, pong
<bradb> ogra: hi
<ogra> bradb, soryy, i didnt do very much universe work recently (was very busy with hwdb)...so no bugs from me
<ogra> when did you adjust the font ?
<bradb> me? :)
<bradb> that was an sabdfl inspiration
<ogra> yeah, or i have new font settings since my last xorg update...it looks bigger
<bradb> well sabdfl and mpt
<ogra> ah
<bradb> so, MOTU is officially using Malone though, right? from what kiko's relayed to me, dholbach/mdz seem to be unsure of this, or perhaps even of the impression that i "haven't given the go-ahead" yet for that, despite the fact that the IRC log in the /topic contains that very announcement giving the official go-ahead from me :)
<bradb> the only thing i'd prefer to not happen right now is an "official" announcement, i.e. on ubuntu-users
<ogra> bradb, but without user input a bugtracker is not quite useful...
<bradb> ogra: indeed :) i encourage you all to use Malone though.
<bradb> ogra: if you make an official announcement though, next thing you know we're on Slashdot. :)
<ogra> bradb, the probelm here is that if a MOTU finds a bug, he fixes it right away, the only thing we could put in there would be one of our transition lists i think...
<bradb> he does? heck, i find bugs all the time in Malone that I can fix right away :)
<ogra> the other possibility would be that someone stis down and transfers all bugs from ubuntu-users....
<bradb> to restate this clearly though: i encourage
<bradb> er, my return key got in the way there
<bradb> to restate this clearly though: i encourage all MOTU's (and MOTU end-users) to use Malone. i wouldn't yet endorse an official announcement of MOTU to any public forum or mailing list though. spreading the word on IRC is cool though, but keep in mind that if we get slashdotted, we don't yet have the admin-availability to immediately recover.
<ogra> w
<ogra> oops
<ogra> ok i meant...i'll try to spread this spirit herea bit
<bradb> share the love, spread the joy
<bradb> :P
<ogra> but since the ML is our current bugtracker its hard not to answer "please put that in malone" ;)
<bradb> you could even add the bug filing URL to the /topic.
<bradb> ogra: heh, fair point ;)
<ogra> so the real bug will still get handled in the ML...i'll see that every MOTU that does support in #ubuntu points to malone, this will probably be a good start
<bradb> sure, that'd be good
* ..[topic/#ubuntu-motu:ogra] : Ubuntu Masters of the Universe | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/Calendar | get Python rocking again: http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UniversePythonTransitionTODO | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTUTodo | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UniverseUnmetDeps | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/JavaPackagingProgress | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTUNewPackages | please file universe bugs in https://launchpad.ubuntu.com/malone/distros
<ogra> URL ok ?
<bradb> https://launchpad.ubuntu.com/distros/ubuntu/+bugs
<ogra> or do you like it better without /istros
* ..[topic/#ubuntu-motu:ogra] : Ubuntu Masters of the Universe | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/Calendar | get Python rocking again: http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UniversePythonTransitionTODO | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTUTodo | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UniverseUnmetDeps | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/JavaPackagingProgress | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTUNewPackages | please file universe bugs in https://launchpad.ubuntu.com/distros/ubuntu/+bugs
<ogra> :)
<bradb> cool, thanks
<ogra> yeah
* ogra grins about what you can do with a bit grep, ls and python (http://hwdb.ubuntu.com)
<\sh> howdy ogra
<ogra> hey \sh
<\sh> ogra: i'm missing u @irrenhaus ;)
<ogra> hehe, i dont miss it.... :) but you guys i miss indeed...klaus ICQed too today :)
<\sh> hehe yeah he helped a lot today
<\sh> but he has a nice night in front of him ;)
<ogra> nightshift ? him ?
<\sh> ogra, FLPs + channel shuffling ;)
<\sh> nagra screwing, kryptons bashing
<ogra> hehe, darn DigiTV.... i'm happy i will never get nearer then my remotecontrol allows anymore ;)
<\sh> todays reading en_300468v010501p.pdf
<\sh> ETSI EN 300 468  DVB: SPEC ON SI in DVB Systems
<ogra> heh
<\sh> i want to know, if some humax dev suckers screwed up the spec
<\sh> in their new software release
<ogra> no, they would _never_ do that  ;)
<\sh> ogra: they fucked up the whole EIT p/f stuff in the humax pr fox-c
<\sh> any service without EIT p/f or any service with broken EIT p/f you can't watch it on their boxes anymore
<ogra> heh
<\sh> we spreaded today dummy events to those services...
<\sh> ogra: i'm really pissed off with humax...u don't know whats going on between me and ksc..fossy is not there, and i'm right now the interface between isp/dtv team and P.F. ;)
<ogra> oh, so you took a piece of my job :)
<\sh> no
<\sh> no no and no :)
<ogra> hehe
<\sh> but i send all tickets to EDP ;) so to p.f. and klaus...and klaus was not amused ;) because he's not in charge of that...understandable
<ogra> you know you can puh the loan a lot if you offer to take my job ! if this position isnt filled soon they are fucked
<ogra> s/puh/push
<\sh> ogra: no money increasement right now
<\sh> ogra: and I don't want to play political stuff between jim, guenther, helmut and all the others...I'm operational staff
<ogra> yeah, i learned a lot of poiltical mess there, more then i liked as you can see ;)
<ogra> yeah, 527 submissions today...on http://hwdb.ubuntu.com/
<\sh> ogra, well..u r doing your job very well @ubuntu...ogra for president ;)
<ogra> i'm really wondering how my old server will cope with the masses tomorrow....if they all have downloaded the RC
<\sh> ogra: if u need bandwidth and space :) i'll welcome u
<schweeb> ogra: does RC automatically start hwdb after install?
<\sh> ogra, but will be a gentoo server *eg
<ogra> \sh, if it gets to tight for me i'll have a place in the ubuntu DC ;) no probs
<ogra> its easy to bend the DNS
<ogra> schweeb, nope
#ubuntu-motu 2006-04-03
<j^> what to do to remove files from http://revu.tauware.de/?
<crimsun> ask a revu admin
<crimsun> (mez,ajmitch,slomo,siretart)
<j^> upid=823 and 912 should go
<j^> i just uploaded a new version of 823(network-manager-vpnc) for NM 0.6 though so possibly that will be overwritten
<j^> 912 is an outdated version of nm which is in main for some time now
<ajmitch__> they're already archived
<j^> confusing, i just searched, so i did not see the archived section
<hub> j^: n-m 0.6 for Dapper?
<j^> hub which other n-m 0.6 would be in question?
<hub> don't know
<hub> in fact I don't have n-m 0.6 for dapper
<j^> it just hit the archives
<hub> oh
<j^> the vpn plugins build find in my dapper pbuilder
<Kyral> anyone here know about passing vectors and the like in functions?
<Kyral> they aren't by reference right?
<Kyral> no one...
<hub> w00t
<hub> installing nm 0.6
<hub> so I can use WPA
<crimsun> I'm still quite uncomfortable with wpasupplicant+n-m in main, but I don't have much say about that, heh.
<ajmitch__> especially with the 3 year support
<ogra> ajmitch_, 5 years if you use a wireleass server :P
<j^> i put my server in a tree in the garden and after only 2 years it stoped responding, now im to old to climb on the tree, i need help
<ZuZubuntu-fr|AWA> lol
<ogra> j^, if you were clever you put it in a cat costume so you can call the fire brigade to save it ;)
<jdong> so, x264 is now in multiverse; will mplayer be built using it?
<jdong> I'd love to be able to encode and play h.264's from mplayer/mencoder
<gclair> howdy all
<yves> hi
<LaserJock> hi gclair and yves
<gclair> Hi Laser
<Erlang> my "manpages that lead to nowhere" thingee doesn't make much people react
<LaserJock> Erlang: ?
<Erlang> on u-devel
<LaserJock> interesting
<crimsun> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2006-March/016888.html is so less-than-helpful
<Erlang> I see why now -_-
<Erlang> the message shows up just fine in mutt.  When i'll come back home I'll link with the wiki instead of attaching the list.
<crimsun> heads up for us in dapper+1: http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2006/03/msg01084.html
<crimsun> we'll probably be running into those issues sooner than later
<ajmitch__> oh we will
<ajmitch__> 4.1 is already planned for dapper+1 :)
* crimsun stashes page in cache
<ajmitch__> and in this case I'm glad that many patches are filed in debian BTS before we move
* ajmitch__ really has to question why he's subscribed to the users list
<TheMuso> ajmitch__: If you mean ubuntu-users, I got off that list LONG ago.
<bddebian> Heya gang
<crimsun> 'lo bddebian
<bddebian> Hi crimsun
<LaserJock> hi bddebian and crimsun
<bddebian> Heya LaserJock
<crimsun> 'lo lj
<LaserJock> man, I'm finally feeling like a MOTU today
<crimsun> dolson: please join #ubuntu; 19:59 < jadaz87> IamEthos i am looking to have a music production pc based off of linux
<crimsun> LaserJock: oh?
<LaserJock> crimsun: wait a bit for dapper-changes ;-)
<crimsun> LaserJock: ah
<LaserJock> hopefully it won't be "Rejected" :-)
<LaserJock> a simple developer asking about a bug report turned into a 2 day mission
<ajmitch__> LaserJock: decided to upload 10 or 20 packages? :)
<OgMaciel> somebody know how I can get a hold of jdub by any chance?
<LaserJock> ajmitch_: only 3 but one is NEW
<LaserJock> OgMaciel: I think he is in -devel
<OgMaciel> LaserJock, thanks much  ;)
<OgMaciel> LaserJock, found him...  not sure he's awake though...  ;)
<ajmitch__> he ought to be
<ajmitch__> since it's lunchtime if he's in .au
<OgMaciel> ajmitch_, forgot about the time difference... true...  ;)
<LaserJock> OgMaciel: he last said something in -devel about 30 min ago
<OgMaciel> LaserJock, been trying to get a hold of him for a while now...
* LaserJock waits for the email with fingers crossed
<OgMaciel> guess \sh hasn't been around either
<OgMaciel> LaserJock, I know what you mean...  ;)
<LaserJock> yeah! They made it
<LaserJock> hmm, "bombs away" keeps coming to mind ;-)
<ogra> LaserJock, yay
<LaserJock> ogra: oh, I didn't think you'd still be up
<LaserJock> ogra: yeah, I got it all done I think. squeak runs fine from the menu now
<ogra> i'm on my way to bed, but looked into the mail before ;)
<ogra> cool
<ogra> i'll test as soon as Kamion waved -image through
<LaserJock> cool
<ajmitch__> LaserJock: ogra is always up this late :)
<LaserJock> gosh, I feel like going to bed and I'm US Pacific TZ
<ogra> ajmitch__, its getting spring ... i'm starting to get up earlier :)
<LaserJock> hi tritium
<ajmitch__> ogra: what, 7am? :)
<tritium> hi LaserJock, ajmitch__
<ajmitch__> hey tritium
<ogra> so i wont be around this long in the next months
* ajmitch__ needs to do more uploads & bugfixing :)
<ajmitch__> I can't let my key go stale
<tritium> hi ogra
<ogra> ajmitch__, 9am is fine instead of 11am :) but that means going to bed *before* 4am ;)
<ajmitch__> heh
<ogra> hey tritium
* ajmitch__ got up very late today, after 9am
<tritium> rub it in, ajmitch__ ;)
<ajmitch__> tritium: I'd usually be up a bit after 7am :)
<tritium> ajmitch__: I'm already at work by then :)
* ajmitch__ is not quite that crazy
<LaserJock> man, mutt seems to have a bit of a steep learning curve
<ajmitch__> LaserJock: mutt? hardly :)
<LaserJock> hmm, maybe I'm just to GUIfied but pine seems a whole lot easier
<LaserJock> I can't figure out how to get back to my inbox once I've gone to another folder
<TheMuso> LaserJock: YOu know there is in-built help?
<Kyral> I hate C lol
<Kyral> well, C++
<LaserJock> TheMuso: and the FAQ is full of RTFMs
<TheMuso> hahaha
<Kyral> I coded for like 3 hours
<LaserJock> I can get to all my mailboxes (they are in ~/Mail) but I can't get back to my inbox (somewhere in /var/spool/ I think)
<Kyral> only to be shot down by conversion between my Structs
<Kyral> (which only differ in that they interpret the < and > differently)
<Kyral> so hows it going :D
<jamessan> LaserJock: you could have your mail delivered via procmail so it goes to ~/Mail
<LaserJock> jamessan: hmm, ok. I was thinking about learning how to use procmail
<ajmitch__> LaserJock: when you hit c to change folder, hit ? to get a list, your inbox should be in there
<LaserJock> ajmitch_: but it isn't
<Kyral> I have mine delivered to my server :D
<jamessan> ajmitch__: not the system mail (which goes to /var/spool/...)
<ajmitch__> jamessan: it is here (at least when I hit tab in that list)
<jamessan> not for me  :/
<ajmitch__> however that's because it's listed in my muttrc :)
<Kyral> jeez...I just got ANOTHER email address
<Kyral> my GPG key is insanely long now....
<LaserJock> ajmitch_: ah, maybe that is what I'm missing
<ajmitch__> my muttrc has just grown a bit over the years
<jamessan> ajmitch__: nice. thanks :)
<psusi> is there a way to tell gpg to not be a moron and go fetch keys it doesn't recognize?  like when I try to verify a downloaded tarball, it just says it doesn't recognize any of the keys that signed it... well, fetch them from the key server!
<ajmitch__> psusi: yes, but it's usually turned off because key fetching is so slow
<psusi> ok... so how do I turn it back on? ;)
<psusi> because otherwise, what's the point of the web of trust?
<psusi> if you have to already have all the keys in the web on your ring that is
* ajmitch__ thought he had it in but disabled, but I guess not..
<psusi> I was also wondering what happens when two people get the same key id?
<ajmitch__> ah, auto-key-retrieve, in the manepage
<ajmitch__> manpage
<Kyral> I think I have one at "petermcv@acm.org" now....
<ajmitch__> psusi: the short ID doesn't have to be unique
<ajmitch__> for example, hub's 32-bit key id clashes with someone else's
<psusi> right... so what happens when they clash?
<hub> yep
<hub> psusi: lot of bugs
<hub> lot of pain
<psusi> lol.... fantastic
<hub> but nothing serious
<Kyral> jeez...
* Kyral goes to add it
<hub> keyserver are still confused
<ajmitch__> signing scripts often get confused, too :)
<hub> ajmitch__: much less
<ajmitch__> they still tend to do the right thing
<psusi> why did they only use the first 32 bits of the fingerprint?
<ajmitch__> would you prefer to remember 64 or 128 bits everytime you want to use a key?
<psusi> is there a conf file or something I can edit so I don't have to specify --keyserver-options auto-key-retrieve every time?
<ajmitch__> yes
<ajmitch__> as I said, look at the man page
<psusi> gpg's man page is too darn long... shoudl have been done as an info tree, heh
* ajmitch__ is going out for a bit
<Kyral> ...I think I just set the record for registered email addresses on LP
<LaserJock> arggh, I still can't figure out how to add my inbox
<Kyral> mutt?
<LaserJock> yeah
<Kyral> uhh...
<Kyral> I just pointed it at the mailspooler
<Kyral> I think
<Kyral> I may have a copy of my .muttrc around...
<LaserJock> it seems like the FVWM of email
<Kyral> lol
<Kyral> Yah personally I just use POP3
<psusi> imap >>>> pop3
<Kyral> psusi: yah but I don't have the space to pull it off on my server
<Kyral> well, I do...
<Kyral> and the ports are open
<Kyral> all I gotta do is tell Domain 0 to forward the IMAP ports
<LaserJock> anyway, I'm not using pop or imap at the moment
<LaserJock> my inbox is at /var/mail/mantha
<psusi> my imap server is holding lkml traffic since jan 1... 31,000 messages taking up like 150 megs... one of these days I think I'll stuff it into a cramfs and see if I can't use unionfs to maintan access to the full maildir while keeping the older messages compressed
<LaserJock> but when I list the mailboxes I can't see it
<Kyral> ouch lkml
<Kyral> Thats what my GMail account is for :D
<psusi> I went through my work machine today and compressed around 400 megs of 'normal' email too ;)
<Kyral> I download it all to my desktop
<psusi> fortunately, 7zip shrank it down to 50 megs
<Kyral> wait...this client is on my server
<Kyral> lol I forgot I was SSH'd into a screen session
<psusi> lol
<LaserJock> lol, there is a website to build a muttrc
<psusi> the actual signatures generated by gpg only identify the signer by their first 32 bits of fingerprint right?  aka the keyid?
<Kyral> yah I saw that lol
<psusi> so if two people get the same keyid, there's no way to tell which one is the one that signed something because they would both look the same no?
<psusi> I think I prefer s/mime... your whole public certificate goes into the message so the recipient doesn't have to download it from a key server... just validates the CA's signature on it
<Kyral> PGP/Inline
<psusi> actually, I guess you really couldn't do that with gpg
<psusi> since if you were to try and recursively include all signer's keys, you could end up with millions of them
<Kyral> lol
<psusi> man... what's up with this guy's key?  de885dd3... he has a million signatures... and like two people that each signed like 30 times...  I guess the big 'X' means that sig expired right?
<Lathiat> i tried that once
<Lathiat> i crashed gpg
<Lathiat> (recursing down my signatures and their signatures etc
<psusi> lol
<Lathiat> after about 24 hours
<Lathiat> on a p100
<Lathiat> :)
<psusi> how many GB did the output file grow to? ;)
<Lathiat> i cant find that key id?
<Lathiat> it was a few hundred meg
<ajmitch__> Lathiat: and on your new box now it'd probably succeed in a few minutes
<Lathiat> yeh probably :)
<Lathiat> if i had a gig net connection to stick into it
<truz24> how often do you guys regenerate key pairs for gpg?
<ajmitch__> Lathiat: I think the keyservers would be too slow though
<Lathiat> ajmitch__: multiple keyservers at once? ;p
<ajmitch__> you'd need a *lot*
<Lathiat> :)
<ajmitch__> me will bbl
<ajmitch__> bad keyboard, missing / :)
<Kyral> lol
* psusi wishes he coudld figure out how to increase the font size that gitk uses... this is killing my eyes
<minghua> doesn't gitk use tcl/tk?
<crimsun> yes
<minghua> I suppose tcl/tk has some global configuration files, no?
<crimsun> I don't think so [for tcl] 
<crimsun> [or tk] 
<minghua> oh okay.  no wonder fewer and fewer apps are using tk these days, then :-P
<psusi> the question is what does tcl/tk use?  that's just a scripting language... what X toolkit does the script interpreter use?
<psusi> based on the simple look if I had to guess, it's motif
<psusi> I'm thinking there's some sort of black magic I can do with X resources... but I have a few scarry memories of trying to figure that stuff out
<psusi> the number of changes that go into the linux kernel in only a day or two span is mind boggling
<psusi> I've been reading all the changes since I last pulled a few days ago for a half hour now... and I'm only half way done
<psusi> and i'm just skimming it!
<Amaranth> psusi: stop drinking out of the fire hose
<minghua> hehe
<psusi> lol... that's what it feels like....
<psusi> my head is swelling I swear
<Amaranth> that's how i felt when i was subscribed to ubuntu-users :P
<psusi> I haven't even found my commit yet
<psusi> heh... ubuntu-users isn't bad at all
<psusi> about half the traffic of lkml
<psusi> of course... I'm on both ;)
<psusi> looking at this git history is like examining a fine tapestry...
<psusi> finally, THERE is my patch
<psusi> I can't believe the sheer number of patches that linus alone applies
<cassou> Hi
<psusi> omg... 1836 commits in a week
<cassou> I would like to help with the squeak package
<cassou> to make it ready for dapper
<psusi> ok, I'm now officially insane... and up too late... night...
<cassou> I've already reported bugs
<cassou> what can I do now ?
<cassou> ogra, are you responsible for the package ?
<minghua> cassou: I believe getting a patch for the bug you reported would help a log
<ajmitch__> argh, users
* ajmitch__ feels tempted to go off on a rant
<minghua> cassou: either track it down yourself, or contact upstream/debian, then ask people to review your patch
<minghua> ajmitch_: users list?
<ajmitch__> minghua: no, someone on malone
<cassou> minghua, I already wrote patches
<ajmitch__> someone who *should* know better & be able to provide actual information instead of just saying 'it breaks, fix it'
<minghua> oh.  I suppose any user that endured the horrible interface of malone and reported a bug should deserve better treatment :-P
<cassou> why do I need to talk to debian peaple ? I just would like to have good ubuntu packages
<minghua> cassou: great then, try find someone who knows the package to review it
<ajmitch__> minghua: this is not just a random user, and he replied to a needinfo setting with basically 'just try it'
<minghua> cassou: that's your choice.  but usually the debian maintainer is a good choice to ask for review
<cassou> minghua, ogra (on this channel) seems to be responsible for this package but he is not here
<cassou> minghua, what is the best way to talk with debian maintener ?
<minghua> poor ajmitch_
<G0SUB> ajmitch__: lol
<G0SUB> ajmitch__: bug ID?
<minghua> cassou: for bugs, if you can reproduce it in debian, Debian BTS would be best place.  if you don't want to try reproduce in debian, I think email would be better.  But as I said, your choice
<ajmitch__> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/stratagus/+bug/32991
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 32991 in stratagus "MOTU:  Stratagus AMD64 Segfault" [Normal,Needs info] 
<ajmitch__> I know he's perfectly capable of providing even a backtrace :P
<G0SUB> haha
<G0SUB> smart but lazy guy
<ajmitch__> and he's perfectly willing to mouth off on the devel list :)
<cassou> minghua, I don't mind  helping debian too. I just would like dapper to have squeak ready and easy to use.
<minghua> see, never show that you are more than a dumb user.  otherwise the devs expects more.  ;-)
<cassou> minghua, However, I can't install debian now
<ajmitch__> minghua: I expect at least common sense
<G0SUB> ajmitch__: the guy's wiki says this -- ``I'm just rallying for greater security in general. If I seem strange to you, don't give it a second thought; I'm neither primarily a Debian or Ubuntu user.''
<minghua> cassou: let me put it this way: if upstream/debian maintainer says your patch is good, I am willing to upload your patch even I know nothing about squeak (as long as it builds)
<minghua> ajmitch_: I know.  I was just kidding.
<ajmitch__> GOSUB: I know, I've run into him a few times on irc as well
<G0SUB> heh
<cassou> minghua, if I can
<G0SUB> strange people ...
* ajmitch__ is strange
<crimsun> oh great, my pop host is down.
<cassou> minghua, if I can't install debian, to whom do I need to write a mail ? with what information since there is no debian package for squeak currently
<minghua> cassou: oh, squeak is not in debian?  try contact upstream, maybe.
<cassou> by upstream, you mean squeak community ? I'm one of them already
<cassou> I do not have squeak patches, but packages patches :-)
<minghua> cassou: what is the malone bug number?
<cassou> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/squeak-vm/+bug/36804
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 36804 in squeak-vm "Desktop file needs update" [Normal,Unconfirmed] 
<cassou> (for example)
<ajmitch__> hi Hobbsee, tritium
<tritium> hi ajmitch__
<minghua> cassou: I suggest writing a mail to ogra or MOTU mailing list
<minghua> cassou: I can upload a fix for 36804 but I suppose you need more than that
<cassou> I thought it was automatic when filling a bug
<cassou> minghua, it will be a good start if you upload the fix.
<cassou> minghua, but you are right: we need more :-)
<Hobbsee> hey ajmitch__
* ajmitch__ needs to put together a hackergotchi for launchpad :)
<minghua> cassou: about bug 36806, squeak-vm fails to build on amd64 (and powerpc): https://launchpad.net/+builds/+build/180761
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 36806 in squeak-vm "amd64 version" [Normal,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/36806
<minghua> cassou: can you figure out why?
<minghua> cassou: As you say you are from upstream community, I am willing to review your patches and upload them if ogra is busy
<minghua> cassou: but I still suggest you contact him first
<cassou> I removed dapper-amd64 to test squeak32 as requested by someone from squeak community. Can I try to compile it without reinstalling everything ?
<cassou> minghua, I will try to contact him
<minghua> cassou: probably not.  but reading the build logs is usually inspiring
<minghua> cassou: but it wouldn't be hard to have a 64bit chroot from what I heard
<G0SUB> ajmitch__: send me a pic, I will make one for you
<cassou> minghua, never tried to chroot :-(
* ajmitch__ has no decent pics :)
<G0SUB> heh
<cassou> minghua, I just contact him
<minghua> cassou: feel free to ping me when you have patch ready (I would prefer some other people to confirm your patch, but for the .desktop file I can see it's good)
<cassou> minghua, did you upload it ?
<minghua> cassou: you want me to?
<cassou> minghua, why not ? It would be a good start. But you may have reasons not to do it or you may think there are better solutions ?
<minghua> cassou: no, I don't have any objections, I'll upload
<cassou> minghua, thank you very much. It's one point solved
<cassou> minghua, can you close the bug too ?
<minghua> hmm, why is squeak-vm in multiverse...
<cassou> minghua, squeak has some problems with copyrighted fonts if I remember well
<minghua> cassou: yes.  but you probably want to test the autobuilt package before closing the bug?
<cassou> minghua, can you explain me what autobuild is ?
<minghua> cassou: I'll upload only the source.  then there is a build machine that builds the binary package
<minghua> (and packages for different arches are built by different machines, obviously)
<cassou> minghua, what do I need to do ?
<cassou> minghua, I'm sorry my ubuntu machine is not started and I'm not at home to switch it on. So I'll have to wait to test it
<minghua> cassou: wait until the package I upload (should be 3.7.7-5ubuntu4) appears in achive, install it, test that the .desktop works, and close the bug
<cassou> minghua, but I still would like the explanation to test everything this afternoon
<cassou> minghua, ok, thanks
<minghua> cassou: "the explanation to test everything"?  please rephrase
<cassou> minghua, I was just waiting for your comments on how to test the patch. I got it now. Thanks
<cassou> minghua, thank you for your help.
<cassou> minghua, If I already have squeak-vm installed, I will just have to apt-get update/upgrade to upgrade the package to your version ?
<minghua> cassou: does squeak-vm handles images?
<cassou> there is now images now. It is another bug however
<minghua> cassou: and your patch doesn't apply (the icon is already fixed, de_DE translation is already added)
<cassou> minghua, I'm sorry, I need to leave you now. Thank for your fix, I will continue working later
<minghua> cassou: okay.  see you then
<cassou> minghua, I was waiting for that problem. It seems I did not manage to get a real diff. I did not find documentation
<cassou> minghua, what I changed is :
<cassou> - adding the french translation
<minghua> cassou: paste the correct .desktop then, don't paste a wrong diff
<cassou> - modifyng the categorie
<cassou> minghua, sorry, I will do that
<crimsun> siretart: ping. The current wpasupplicant package doesn't handle removing /etc/network/if-p{re-up,ost-down}.d/wpasupplicant, which seems to have been superceded by /etc/network/if-{down,pre-up,post-down}.d/0_wpasupplicant
<cassou> minghua, thank you for your time
<minghua> cassou: please paste now so I can upload later
<minghua> cassou: you are welcome
<cassou> minghua, I do not have my computer here, I'm sorry
<minghua> cassou: don't worry then, I think I can handle it
<cassou> minghua, thank you very much for all
<cassou> minghua, I must leave now
<minghua> cassou: see you
<cassou> I will help squeak and ubuntu later
<minghua> Hmm, what is the command to test .desktop files?
<minghua> got it, desktop-file-validate
<siretart> crimsun: oh. interesting. well, in that case, we should do some postinst magic for that.
<siretart> crimsun: which upgrade path did you use for having /etc/network/if-p{re-up,ost-down}.d/wpasupplicant lying around?
<crimsun> siretart: I've not touched any of those [conf] files
<crimsun> these have been straight upgrades via apt
<crimsun> 0.4.7->0.4.8, that is, and all Ubuntu Dapper versions
<siretart> crimsun: I see. if time permits, I will look into this today, and write a workaround for that in our trunk/ branch. then we can decide if we do another upload of trunk/ to ubuntu or not
<ajmitch> hey siretart
<crimsun> siretart: sounds good, thanks.
<crimsun> should be good enough to simply check for the existence of the obsolete conffile and nuke it
<siretart> huhu ajmitch
<siretart> crimsun: kel has already written some preinst magic for conffiles. I suspect that we could just lengthen that list of conffiles in preinst
<crimsun> ok
* minghua knows why squeak-vm FTBFS on amd64 now
<minghua> it's arch: i386
<minghua> doh
<ajmitch> oops
<ogra> minghua, LaserJock worked on squeak (as the changelog would tell :) )
<minghua> ogra: yeah, but since both him and you are not around, I figure I shouldn't discourage cassou too much
<minghua> but later I realized he/she doesn't know much about debian/ubuntu
<ogra> and probably about squeak ...
<ogra> there are three binarys and one script :)
<ogra> all you can do with this package is change the script or the location of the binarys ...
<mdke> is there some kind of policy that bugs about menu entries not complying with HIG guidelines are to be set as "Wishlist"? I've had two bugs marked down like that
<ogra> but thats pretty much it :)
<ogra> (no sources)
<ajmitch> how useful
<ajmitch> btw good morning ogra ;)
<ogra> moin moin
<minghua> ogra: ah, and cassou told me it's some "font related issues" :-(
<minghua> mdke: I am not aware of any policies but I agree with such categorization (unless there is a patch)
<mdke> minghua, why? bad menu entries are bugs like all others
<ogra> minghua, right, the squeak license forbids to change the fonts iirc
* verwilst is happily using pure-ftpd 1.0.21 ;)
<minghua> mdke: IMO they are the same as feature requests, but that's just my opinion
<mdke> minghua, I don't see how changing a menu entry with a usability problem is "adding a new feature to a program in Ubuntu". I'd say they are minor or normal bugs
<minghua> mdke: Hmm, I don't want to argue, and I don't really care
<mdke> fair enough
<mdke> I'll do a patch anyway
<minghua> mdke: get the patch ready and it will get applied regardless of the severity
<minghua> indeed, that's the way I prefer
<mdke> argh. there is no desktop file in the source
<siretart> ogra: hrhr, I can only smile at arnieboys answer to my 'genuine concerns'..
<ogra> siretart, heh
<ajmitch> siretart: you're still even reading that thread?
<ogra> i *love* peter garrets short commments in that thread :)
<ajmitch> morning dholbach
<dholbach> heya ajmitch
<dholbach> hey guys
<verwilst> hello dholbach
<verwilst> dholbach: the new pure-ftpd is purring away nicely ;)
<dholbach> rockn'roll
<verwilst> just backported it to breezy too ( we have 1 breezy server which was using .19 :) )
<siretart> ajmitch: he finally provided his email address :)
<ajmitch> siretart: yeah, impressive :)
* ajmitch is running out to get food
<siretart> good idea :)
<minghua> ajmitch, ogra, siretart: are you talking about a thread on automatrix (and if yes, where is it)?
<siretart> minghua: a stupid thread on ubuntu-user@lists.ubuntu.com
<minghua> siretart: thanks
* minghua is not subscribed to -user (and is usually happy about that)
<siretart> minghua: I read it via gmane only
<mdke> siretart, I'm just reading via the mailman archive, where is his response to your post?
<mdke> i don't see it
<mdke> oh, the thread was broken
<siretart> mdke: gmane and the mailman archive may lag a bit behind
<siretart> I love the scoring capabilities of slrn. I use them intensively
<ogra> minghua, err
<ogra>  * Apply patch for .desktop file from Damien Cassou, thanks!  (Ubuntu #36804)
<ogra>      - Add French translation.
<ogra>      - Put squeak to the correct categories.
<ogra> minghua, the package already ships a .desktop file and LaseJock added the needed script to start properly with his last upload ...
<ogra> hmm
<ogra> i hope yu didnt revert his stuff  ...
<minghua> ogra, no, not at all.  I looked at LaserJock's change and changelog
<ogra> oki, then  its fine ...
<minghua> ogra: the detail is in the bug report if you are interested
<ogra> he just discussed several hours with upstream since the scrippt needs some special functionallity it seems
<ogra> argh
<ogra> you've put it into education ?
<ogra> squeak is a multimedia programming framework ...
<minghua> I don't use/know smalltalk at all, like I said, I dared to upload because I know .desktop files
<minghua> ogra: it's not?
<minghua> it was in AudioVideo
<ogra> yes, thats where i put it
<minghua> which now sounds right...
<ogra> :)
<ogra> and i dont like the education categorya at all :)
<ogra> but anyway , thats harmless ...
<minghua> ogra: does Development category makes sense then?
<ogra> either that or audio/video
<minghua> not both?
<ogra> hmm, i'm not a big fan of doubling entries ...
<minghua> ogra: now it's in both education and development...
<ogra> hrm
<ogra> yes, i just see it
<minghua> ogra: I'll take care of the category thing before upload
<ogra> thanks
<minghua> development makes more sense to me
<minghua> I'm not a fan of double entry either
<ogra> yep :)
<minghua> ogra: and do you have any idea if it is useful on non-i386 arches?
<ogra> i want to get rid of the menu structure in later edubuntu releases, especially of the education section
<ogra> i doubt that
<ogra> the image and source packages both only contain big binary images
<minghua> and BTW the description of squeak-vm can have some improvement... (I didn't figure out it's multimedia platform at all)
<ogra> i'm not sure that even if the vm compiles on amd64 it could run any of the images
<minghua> ogra: would you please comment on bug 36806 then?
<ogra> (i very much doubt that)
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 36806 in squeak-vm "amd64 version" [Normal,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/36806
<ogra> i have the squeak list open ...
<minghua> oh okay
<ogra> cassou mailed me the buglist
<ogra> (i doubt squeak has even more than 10 users on ubuntu btw)
<minghua> apparently you know much more than I do about squeak, my future upload will be only fixing the category in .desktop then :-)
<minghua> well, smalltalk is not a popular language after all ;-)
<minghua> quite stupid thread indeed...
* minghua just realized he has been spelling automatix wrong
<Toadstool> hi here
<Toadstool> anyone to check and maybe upload the debdiffs I attached to bug 34409 and bug 34663?
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 34409 in lprng "lprng fails to start" [Major,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/34409
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 34663 in ipmasq "Default configuration logs IGMP packets" [Normal,In progress]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/34663
<HeatBlazer> hello
<HeatBlazer> are there any ubuntu developers?
<azeem> HeatBlazer: what do you think?
<HeatBlazer> I think-yes
<HeatBlazer> may I suggest something
<HeatBlazer> it`s about the x.mame
<HeatBlazer> please...add xmame 0-104 to Synaptic pakage installer
<HeatBlazer> compiling it is very confusing and hard to most of the people,especially newbies like me.
<HeatBlazer> will you,please?
<HeatBlazer> I really hope you will,you have my forward greetings.:)
<HeatBlazer> have a nice day:)
<siretart> hey kelmo_lap
<kelmo_lap> hi siretart
<siretart> kelmo_lap: looks like wpasupplicant will make on the flight6 cd, which is due to today :)
<kelmo_lap> cool, should find out how its going then
<kelmo_lap> siretart, you use wpa_supplicant with EAP, iirc?
<siretart> kelmo_lap: depends. I have a place where I use either EAP-TLS using x509 certificates or PEAP (with username/pw). at home I currently use PSK2
<kelmo_lap> siretart, would you be going to those places anytime soon?
<kelmo_lap> if so, can you please grab me some wpa_cli output
<siretart> kelmo_lap: we had a user in launchpad complaining that the ifupdown script checks for /proc/net/packet. what breaks if af_packet isn't loaded?
<kelmo_lap> just the output of "status"
<siretart> kelmo_lap: I'm normally on mondays there, but if its urgent, I can go there on my way home
<kelmo_lap> siretart, not urgent
<kelmo_lap> siretart, i think that maybe that check should be removed, its a bit restrictive
<kelmo_lap> i shall do it now
<siretart> this is bug #37121, btw
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 37121 in wpasupplicant "ifupdown script 0_wpasupplicant assumes CONFIG_PACKET=y" [Normal,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/37121
<siretart> ok, then lets remove it until we know what breaks because of it
<siretart> btw, do you happen to have an account in launchpad?
<kelmo_lap> ok, its removed in my local copy
<kelmo_lap> and the reason being:
<kelmo_lap> if its not existing, wpa_supplicant would have to make a call to load it
<kelmo_lap> that may not succeed in some situations
<siretart> hm. perhaps we can issue a warning if it doesn't exist
<kelmo_lap> no, i don't have a launchpad account
<kelmo_lap> have not used ubuntu, so never required one yet
<siretart> no problem
<kelmo_lap> nah, i think we can safely ignore that issue for now
<kelmo_lap> it will be in the changelog if it comes back to bite
<kelmo_lap> ok, so some further clarification, we will be closing both ubuntu and debian bugs in these changelogs? or how will this work?
<kelmo_lap> ie, how do we manage the release aspect of this combined source package
<siretart> malone bugs  can be linked to debian bugs
<siretart> so if someone files a bug in malone about wpasupplicant, a 'bugtask' for ubuntu is created
<siretart> if the same bug already exists in debbugs, we create another 'bugtask' for the debian bug. so the 2 issues are linked
<siretart> the debian bugtask is supposed to be checked and updated automatically, but I don't know if malone is there yet
<siretart> I don't know if we need to import all malone bugs to debugs. At least, I don't think so
<minghua> well, I am waiting for launchpad to support closing bugs in changelog first (or is that already possible?)
<siretart> minghua: Kinnison asked for opinions on a syntax for that. I think there was some consensus on that point, which is a prequisite for the implementation for that
<siretart> minghua:  #launchpad should be able to give you a definite answer on that
<minghua> siretart: yes I read that thread in -devel
<siretart> btw, this is bug 2037. I filed that some time ago
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 2037 in malone "feature request: closing via changelog" [Normal,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/2037
<minghua> I suppose there should be an announcement when it's available
<siretart> yes
* minghua subscribes to that
<siretart> I love the subscribing feature in malone.
<minghua> to be honest, I really thought about replying "whatever format is okay for me, as long as you guys implement it fast" :-)
<siretart> :)
* minghua sees MOTU is already subscribed and decides not to double-subscribe
<kelmo_lap> siretart, ok, but how about just the simple thing like managing changelogs for debian/ubuntu releases
<siretart> kelmo_lap: I expect that someday, we just need to close the debian bugno in the changelog, and malone will close the relevant bugtask as soon as the package enters the given distribution. the debian bugtask when accepted in debian, and the ubuntu bugtask when synced to ubuntu
<minghua> yes, subscribing is the only thing I prefers malone over Debian BTS
<siretart> kelmo_lap: I don't have any problem in having 'ubuntu' revision in the debian changelog. there are other (core) package which do this
<kelmo_lap> siretart, no i have absolutely no problem with it either
<kelmo_lap> just curious as to how we release
<siretart> kelmo_lap: 0.4.8-0ubuntu2 is smaller than 0.4.8-1, so we could even introduce a 0.4.8-0ubuntu3, without violating the order of version numbers
<kelmo_lap> ie, do we prepare for debian first, then make a new entry for ubuntu, and release again
<siretart> ah, now I understand.
<kelmo_lap> i think its great to share the same source package! changelog and all
<siretart> I'd say, lets focus on a 0.4.8-1 upload for unstable. Then we 'sync' that version to ubuntu (I will handle that, don't worry)
<kelmo_lap> just a minor point of curiousity is all ; )
<minghua> kelmo_lap: BTW "sync" means sharing the same source package (and changelog) in case your didn't know
<kelmo_lap> sure
<kelmo_lap> i do the same for kanotix releases
<kelmo_lap> well, i am primarily interested in wpa_cli status ouput, that is indicitave of the state of an interface
<kelmo_lap> output*
<siretart> I see
<kelmo_lap> i'll read the source a bit
<siretart> how do you handle divergence to debian in kanotix?
<kelmo_lap> we don't diverge, unless we are somehow releasing a package that one of us currently work on in debian (wpasupplicant, madwifi, spca5xx etc); or
<kelmo_lap> the package is broken, and/or very old
<siretart> ok, but given that you need some short time divergence, what do you upload to kanotix?
<kelmo_lap> http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2006/01/msg01293.html
<kelmo_lap> i follow those rules
<kelmo_lap> i think the packages that have been dealt with like that are just minor
<kelmo_lap> and bugfix patches are then sent to the debian maintainers
<siretart> there is surely more divergence in ubuntu than in kanotix. I know
<kelmo_lap> sure, we diverge maybe 5 - 10 source packages only
<kelmo_lap> including such important things as kismet, nvclock ; )
<siretart> so you use +a0.kanotix.X or +c0.kanotix.X suffixes, yes?
<kelmo_lap> +c0.kanotix.X if i am updating a debian package
<siretart> I see
<kelmo_lap> i am the worst offender for this
<kelmo_lap> the gatekeeper won't allow some things to pass through
<kelmo_lap> ie, we don't diverge
<siretart> well, I think this makes only sense for distribution who support installation of binary packages built in debian chroots, which ubuntu doesn't
<kelmo_lap> just small updates to satify our own interests
<kelmo_lap> satisfy*
<siretart> I see. interesting to know
<kelmo_lap> well, we almost experience it ourselves
<kelmo_lap> say my sponsor for spca5xx is away
<kelmo_lap> Kanotix will not wait for that, so i apply those rules
<kelmo_lap> then the next debian upload upgrades shortly after
<siretart> what if there is a security upload for spca5xx? acording to that policy, it would be versioned 1.2-3+s1.sarge.1, which would be higher than your 1.2-3+c0.kanotix. This would override your changes
<kelmo_lap> exactly
<siretart> :/
<kelmo_lap> and our users would get the benefits of the security upgrade
<siretart> but your divergence/fix would be overwritten.
<kelmo_lap> it means that we must not diverge, unless we know exactly what we do, and are prepared to fix mess up
<siretart> I think we have to agree that this policy wouldn't work in ubuntu
<kelmo_lap> never did i suggest that
<kelmo_lap> maybe we got a bit sidetracked in conversation ; )
<siretart> I was thinking about that.
<siretart> but now I see why this won't work :)
<minghua> I am not sure security updates and derivative distros using the same namespace (branch) is a good idea, but I didn't think it through and don't have any better proposal
<siretart> that post suggests ubuntu to follow that policy by explicitly mentioning ubuntu as example derivative. they should perhaps rather mention kanotix, where this scheme actually works :)
<kelmo_lap> they do not like to mention kanotix much ; )
<siretart> you think they like to mention ubuntu better? ;)
<kelmo_lap> its the hot topic i think
<kelmo_lap> just sit in #debian for 20 minutes
<siretart> minghua: I think for debian, this policy is great. As well as for distribution which do support installation of package built in debian chroots.
<kelmo_lap> and watch the first person to whisper ubuntu get shot down
<kelmo_lap> happens too reguarly
<siretart> kelmo_lap: which is sad, but I don't think we can help then from the ubuntu side
<siretart> I don't have neither time nor interest to hang around in #debian. the operators decide how to moderate that channel
<kelmo_lap> me neither
<kelmo_lap> but sometimes it can provide light amusement
<siretart> :)
<minghua> siretart: what if the derivative want to be based on testing?
<minghua> and you have testing-security
<kelmo_lap> easy: do not diverge
<minghua> I am also thinking about volatile
<siretart> minghua: I don't see problems with this policy regarding derivatives based on debian/testing, if the testing-security team obey this policy
<kelmo_lap> unless you plan to maintain all of it
<kelmo_lap> like ubuntu
<minghua> siretart: I'll think more
<minghua> I am interested in this as well
<minghua> mainly because I am involved in some Chinese-related unofficial repos
<siretart> I see. well, currently, neither of the 2 debian security teams obey this policy
<minghua> heh
<minghua> but kelmo_lap's rule of thumb is always right:  the less you diverge, the less trouble :-)
<siretart> minghua: the same is true for ubuntu
<siretart> thats why we want to unify package development for wpasupplicant
<kelmo_lap> yes, hence why i try hard to get any ideas i have into debian
<minghua> siretart: I'm all for it
<cassou> hi
<cassou> ogra, minghua, are you here ?
<ogra> cassou, yep
<cassou> hi
<cassou> I'm the one for squeak
<ogra> nearly all the bugs you filed were fixed by LaserJocks upload yesterday
<ogra> (before you filed them :) )
<cassou> I don't see any update. I'll take a look
<cassou> Squeak has multiple uses.
<ogra> see the bugs i added info to the ones i closed
<cassou> It can be an educational software used by teachers to teach how to develop, how to use a computer, how to make things move without writing code (there is a very simple scripting language)
<ogra> cassou, i know
<cassou> Squeak can be used as a real Smalltalk implementation. You can then write pure smalltalk code and execute your code
<ogra> but in the end its a multimedia creation framework ...
<cassou> It is an IDE too. You have browsers, refactoring tools...
<cassou> you can write web apps, there is a very powerfull framework
<cassou> so, I think the categories I used where good abstract categories. But now, you are more familiar than me with debian packages so you have to choose the right policie to adopt
<minghua> cassou: it doesn't really matter whether it's an IDE or not, if IDE isn't in freedesktop spec, and not supported by GNOME or KDE, I believe it's useless
<ogra> i'll drop it from the education meniu though
<cassou> ogra, I never used Squeak for multimedia. I don't know how to display pictures or listen to sounds
<cassou> minghua, I found the categories in the specs
<ogra> cassou, the only usecase i know for it and i'm told by edubuntu users, is to create audiovisual stuff
<cassou> but I don't know what specs :-)
<cassou> ogra, not at all. I use it every for metamodeling and as a very high level language.
<cassou> I work on the web framework too and I help with developping a CMS
<ogra> cassou, i'm not intrested how *you* use it, i'm intrested about the *common* use ... we probably should make a poll on the edubuntu mailing list or something ...
<ogra> i will strongly oppose to have more than one menu entry for it ... so lets find the best category ;)
<cassou> ogra, you can make a poll or what you want :-) You can just send a mail to squeak-dev mailing list
<minghua> cassou: yeah I see IDE in the spec, I don't have problem with it then
<Hobbsee> if there's a bug in a ubuntu package, and it's linked to a bug upstream, which is marked as fix released, and the problem is not still occuring, i can mark the bug as fix released, right?
<cassou> ogra, squeak has very different uses
<ogra> cassou, if IDE is a proposed feature, i'm fine with the development category
<ogra> i can only judge what my users tell me
<cassou> ogra, do you want me to write a mail to the mailing list so that you will see answers without subscribing ?
<ogra> and what we were told by the teachers we had at the edubuntu summit was that they'd like squeak included for multimedia programming tasks
<ogra> cassou, i run the mailing list :) just mail :)
<cassou> ogra, they may only tell you what they know. But I'm sure squeak has multiple uses and I'm not the only one
<minghua> just FYI: Developement is in the "releated category" of IDE
<cassou> I know a laboratory which only use squeak for developing
<ogra> cassou, thats why i say lets find the most *common* usecase :)
<ogra> if its IDE, then development is just fine ...
<ogra> the old location was based on the info i had back then
<cassou> ogra, there are no more common use cases. There are just very different use cases. It is like if you want to categorise linux or a computer
<cassou> But education is very interesting too
<ogra> nope
<cassou> ogra, do you want to write a mail ? You will see very different uses
<ogra> the education menu is supposed to go away
<cassou> why ?
<ogra> edubuntu will add dynamic menu profiles for one of the next releases
<ogra> task driven ...
<cassou> so what can I do then ?
<ogra> cassou, as i said, most of the bugs were fixed yesterday, test the new packages ... and trigger a discussion on the edubuntu ML about the category if you like :)
<ogra> and indeed, report bugs where you find them in the packages :)
<cassou> ogra, I did not understand your last sentence. Have I done something wrong ?
<ogra> er, nope
<ogra> you asked what to do ...
<ogra> and i said the new packages will need testing
<cassou> sure I will test them
<ogra> which LaserJock and i would really appreciate to get from someone who actually knows squeak :)
<ogra> (neither of us uses it )
<cassou> fell free to mail me when you need help, I really really want ubuntu to get a working squeak
<ogra> we'll have one
<ogra> :)
<ogra> thankls for all the work you put in it :)
<cassou> thanks for helping squeak
<cassou> without knowing about it
<cassou> minghua, I do not understand your comment on https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/squeak-vm/+bug/36806
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 36806 in squeak-vm "amd64 version" [Normal,Unconfirmed] 
<cassou> minghua, is it possible or not to build amd64 version ?
<minghua> cassou: it is possible, but the package need to explicitly specify it
<minghua> cassou: currently the package says "only build me on i386"
<minghua> cassou: therefore no amd64 pacakge
<cassou> minghua, I don't know why
<ogra> cassou, you can build the vm on amd64 ...
<cassou> minghua, I will send a mail to mailing list to know
<ogra> cassou, but that doesnt mean it will be able to work with -source and -image ...
<minghua> cassou: which part you don't know?
<ogra> (its very unlikely they will work on amd64)
<cassou> I'm not sure what can be done with the vm on amd64. I know it is in development but I don't know if a package can be released, if the images are compatible...
<minghua> cassou: it's a feature in the package, it's easy to build on amd64, but we need to make sure it works on amd64 before that
<cassou> I have an amd64, but I installed a 32bit dapper to test squeak on 32bits
<minghua> cassou: and I suppose squeak won't work on powerpc?
<ogra> cassou, dapper will be supported for 3 years, lets keep the experimental stuff for dapper+1 :)
<cassou> there are vms for powerpc :-) lots of squeakers use a mac
<cassou> I don't know if it is experimental or not, that's why I need to mail
<cassou> If there is a squeak-vm for mac os x, is it sure that a vm will be able for dapper on power pc ?
<Toadstool> i'm trying to build squeak-vm on my amd64 box
<cassou> Toadstool, thank you very much
<Toadstool> well it doesn't build...
<Toadstool> i'll try to figure out why
<cassou> is it because of the 'only build on i386' field ?
<Toadstool> no I've added amd64 to debian/control ;)
<cassou> another vm might be used then
<cassou> I need to leave you know
<TheMuso> Hey all.
<cassou> minghua, ogra, Toadstool, thank you very much for your help. Feel free to mail me as soon as you have a question about squeak or a package
<cassou> bye
<Toadstool> see ya cassou
<ogra> will do :)
<minghua> cassou: bye
<redguy> Does anyone know where does bootlogd write its log in ubuntu? Could not find /var/log/boot which is the default...
<redguy> OK, found out that bootlogd is disabled by default in /etc/default/bootlogd. Can anybody tell me why??
<LinuxJones> Has anybody seen seb128 around ?
<bddebian> Heya gang
<tseng> hi
<bddebian> How come no one told me about the Bug Squad? :-)
<bddebian> Heya tseng
<dholbach> bddebian: man... it was on all the mailing lists
<dholbach> :-)
<bddebian> dholbach: I know, I'm lame these days :'-(
<dholbach> comeon... :)
<cassou> hi
<cassou> ogra, are you still here ?
* lamont grumbles at gtk+2.0-directfb
<Yagisan> If the entire copyright notice in some code is " Use, distribute, and modify this code freely" that would be public domain right ?
<azeem> Yagisan: it dubious whether distribution of modified works is allowed under such terms, AIUI
<azeem> it's definetely not public domain
<crimsun> no, not public domain
<Yagisan> ok. I'm documenting all copyright in a package that I'd like to see in dapper +1, and found a file with that notice, that's gone author -> FLOSS project 1 -> FLOSS project 2
<Yagisan> how would I call a file licensed as such ?
<crimsun> doesn't mean anything. You should contact the contributors in addition to the original author for clarification.
<phanatic> hi people
<Yagisan> crimsun: thanks. it seems it was pinched from allegro (there are a few ifdef ALLEGRO_UNIX in there), so I'll grab the source to that and look for clarification
<cassou> hi
<cassou> ogra ?
<ogra> cassou, sorry i'm very busy preparing flight-6 edubuntu CDs
<cassou> ogra, no problem. I'm writing bug reports.
<Yagisan> well, it doesn't seem different in intent to allegro.
<ogra> cassou, please talk to LaserJock as well if he appears ...
<cassou> ogra, ok
<cassou> thanks
<ogra> :)
<david_> Hello, is there any list of games that are not in Ubuntu yet?
<david_> I've only found this: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Teams/Games/NEW
<Yagisan> david_: some are also listed in http://doc.gwos.org/index.php/Main_Page like my repo
<david_> thanks :)
<Lure> we are looking for somebody to REVU knetworkmanager package
<Lure> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2220
<Lure> we would like to have this pushed to universe, since network-manager 0.6.1 is in official repo
<akulah> !ping
<LaserJock> anybody know anything about zenity?
<ajmitch> it has a cool name?
<LaserJock> ajmitch: lol, I got that already
<LaserJock> I'd like to make a wrapper script for an app that can do some file choosing and or select from a list
#ubuntu-motu 2006-04-04
<sistpoty> hi folks
<crimsun> 'lo sistpoty
<ajmitch> hi
<LaserJock> hi sistpoty
<sistpoty> hi LaserJock, hi ajmitch
<sistpoty> hi crimsun
<bddebian> Heya sistpoty, crimsun, ajmitch, LaserJock.... :-)
<ajmitch> the man is here!
<sistpoty> hi bddebian
<ajmitch> bddebian: got some stuff to upload today?
<bddebian> Yeah, sure.. gnumach ;-P
<ajmitch> I mean real stuff
<ajmitch> for ubuntu
<bddebian> No, I suck :-(
<ajmitch> no, you're just as lazy as I am ;)
<ajmitch> though by now your karma has decayed quite a bit, since you need a kick in the rear to get working again ;)
<sistpoty> btw.: I noticed some strange karma jumps last week...
<ajmitch> rebalancing
<ajmitch> now translators don't get super-karma compared to everyone else
<sistpoty> ah... I personally liked the rebalancing that gave me > 50k karma *g*
<ajmitch> yeah
<ajmitch> I'm back up to 23k though
* ajmitch needs to get it >50k by release ;)
<sistpoty> ~ 16k
<Amaranth> Karma:  710
<Amaranth> :(
<Amaranth> people need to file more bugs on alacarte that i can reject or dupe :P
<bddebian> ajmitch: Aye, am I negative yet? :-(
<Erlang> Amaranth: okay
<ajmitch> bddebian: not yet..
<Se7h> hi, is there any build-dep to be able to check libraries on the system?
<Riddell> who owns ubotu?
<TheMuso> Riddell: Someone on the ubuntu-au team I think.
<Amaranth> cafuego
<Amaranth> why? want him in #kubuntu?
<Toadstool> re
<monzie> hi all
<Toadstool> good night
<^Odd^> hi i was wondering what i do with this patch for streamtuner? streamtuner-0.99.99-live365.diff
<^Odd^> i don't know if i am supposed to exicute it or place it some where can some one please help me?
<Erlang> where did  you get it?
<^Odd^> from the streamtuner site
<^Odd^> i clicked about in the title bar of stream tuner and a link poped up and i followed it
<^Odd^> there is no instructions but i know that i need that patch
<^Odd^> live 365 changed there login and i cannot get in with streamtuner
<^Odd^> http://www.nongnu.org/streamtuner/
<^Odd^> is where it came from
<Erlang> did you fill a bug explaining this?
<^Odd^> um no why would i have to?
<^Odd^> it's just a patch that goes somewhere i would imagine
<^Odd^> i just don't have the knowledge as to what to do with it
<Erlang> Because that patch would probably benifit all the users of streamtuner.
<^Odd^> i got it from there site
<^Odd^> other can as well can't they?
<Erlang> well, others would be like you and have no clue what to do with it :D
<^Odd^> i thought bug reports where for important things like the nvidia drivers being broken lol
<^Odd^> ahh
<^Odd^> ok how about you help me figure out what to do with it and i will include it in a howto and in a bug report?
<Erlang> ^Odd^: What you say is that streamtuner is broken for Live365.  That may not be a critical bug, but that's a bug nonetheless.
<^Odd^> that way people can go to the ubuntu forums and see it and get help from both places
<^Odd^> ok i see
<^Odd^> i did not know lol
<^Odd^> as used to linux as i am getting there are still something that are new to me
<^Odd^> i am always afraid that i will get yelled at or something
<^Odd^> where do i file a bug report?
<Erlang> https://launchpad.net/malone
<Erlang> could you give me the exact url to that patch?
<^Odd^> this should be fun i have never done this before
<^Odd^> yea sure ^_^
<Erlang> I'm gonna do the required steps on my PC first.
<^Odd^> http://savannah.nongnu.org/download/streamtuner/streamtuner-0.99.99-live365.diff
<Erlang> It shouldn't be that hard, but you'll see after that why people won't want to do it themselves.
<^Odd^> i will start work on my first bug report >.<
<^Odd^> oh ok
<Erlang> wait a minute, that patch seems already in the source.
<Erlang> ^Odd^: What version of Ubuntu are you using?
<^Odd^> breezy
<Erlang> that explains it.  the patch you are talking about is already integrated in package distributed in the next version of Ubuntu
<^Odd^> so do not submit the report?
<^Odd^> and is nvidias agp support problem going to be fixed as well in the next release?
<^Odd^> as nvidia drivers have broken the agp support for my system
<Erlang> well, I'm not sure of what I say yet... please file the bug, we'll just close it turns out to be not revelant.
<Erlang> ^Odd^: I'm not aware of all the issues yet.
<^Odd^> ok
<Erlang> ^Odd^: Has Live365 support (whatever that is) been broken for a long time or just recently?
<^Odd^> i just thought i would try to get my system fixed lol i am always bragging how ubuntu is awesome for games native and non native
<^Odd^> about a month i have noticed
<Erlang> then that patch probably won't cut it.  the patch you have has been integrated in the Breezy package too.
<^Odd^> really\
<^Odd^> then how come it does not work
<Erlang> yeah, it's old.
<^Odd^> oh ok
<^Odd^> see i don't know these things lol
<Erlang> They might have changed the site again.
<^Odd^> not trying to be offencive or rude
<LaserJock> in a bash script how do I check if a directory does not exist?
<^Odd^> that might have
<Erlang> ^Odd^: You bug report only becomes more revelant.
<^Odd^> oh ok
<^Odd^> so what should i put in there i can pastebin what i have so far
<^Odd^> i want this to be something productive that can help others
<Se7h> im gonna in the middle just to ask a small thing. Why doesn't the pbuilder detect some libs he's supposed to ?
<Erlang> just provide as much detail you can about that what is working, what is not working, when it stopped working and such.
<Se7h> (might be some build dep)
<sistpoty> LaserJock: if [! -d yourdirectory] ; then... at least iirc ;)
<Se7h> hi LaserJock
<LaserJock> sistpoty: ! -e is for files?
<Erlang> ^Odd^: If there is any information missing, the person triaging your bug will ask for more information.  You'll receive notification by email.
<TheMuso> LaserJock: man test
<sistpoty> LaserJock: man test ([ is a symlink to test, though it usually is a shell-builtin which behaves identically)
<LaserJock> TheMuso: thanks dude
<TheMuso> The [ program is basically the same as test.
<^Odd^> ok
<Erlang> ^Odd^: but if you link this: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=341531, in your report, there shouldn't be much information to add since this is a bug report on Debian which may explain things.
<Ubugtu> Debian bug 341531 in streamtuner "Subject: streamtuner: categories incorrectly parsed in Live365 plugin" [Normal,Open] 
<LaserJock> yeah, I was just wondering -d vs. -e I had the [ part ;-)
<Erlang> thank you Ubugtu.
<Hobbsee> hi all
<TheMuso> Hey Hobbsee.
<TheMuso> Did you get anywhere with warped?
<Hobbsee> nope
* Hobbsee went through and got rid of some of the old kdenetwork bugs instead :P
<^Odd^> shoot there going to send it to the wrong email address
<^Odd^> thank you all for helping me i really appriciate it
<Erlang> np
<ajmitch> hello Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> hi ajmitch :)
* Hobbsee ran away from uni early :P
<^Odd^> is lurking allowd here so i can learn? it seems pritty geeky here "in the good sence of the word"
<sistpoty> ^Odd^: sure ;)
<TheMuso> ^Odd^: Many of us idle here most of the time. Feel free to stick around.
<^Odd^> thanx your also welcome in any of the channels that i am in
<^Odd^> if you want
* ajmitch is still at uni, doing lab demonstrating today
<bddebian> Later gang
<^Odd^> if any of you hate windoze then #winflame is a good place to trash it
<ajmitch> bye bddebian
<sistpoty> cya bddebian
<Erlang> ^Odd^: I'm past the "Windows suck! Linux rulez!" age.  I've become more moderate ;D
<^Odd^> well i have used windows most of my life
<^Odd^> and for some reason it just wasent doing it for me to many bsod
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: anything new & exciting at uni today? :)
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: not really - i was pretty much so sick due to tiredness that i was about to collapse...so that kinda sucked...
* Mithrandir yawns and thinks 0400 meetings are a bit harsh.
<^Odd^> then i herd about linux and ubuntu so i decided to give it a try and quickly realized that pirating windowz and it's software was not a good thing
<Hobbsee> hehe!  i agree with you Mithrandir!  what meeting is that early?
<Se7h> ^Odd^ wise choice :)
<^Odd^> it's nice haveing ubuntu on my box the peace of mind knowing that all of my software is legit and mine is nice
<^Odd^> and all my freinds think i am uber smart because i use ubuntu and i tell them that it's not hard
<Se7h> ahahah
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: let me guess, got to bed about 3am?
<^Odd^> so has anyone herd of the nvidia agp problem?
<Mithrandir> Hobbsee: distro team meeting.  Rotates six hours each week, and this week it's the "let's make it suck for the europeans" week
<ajmitch> Mithrandir: excellent!
<Hobbsee> ah yep, fun
<^Odd^> roflmao
<^Odd^> thats awsome
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: no, i actually went to bed at around 12.30am last night...
* ajmitch should be able to make this meeting at a sane time this week
<Se7h> o.0 Mithrandir
<^Odd^> from what i can tell all sis chipsets are busted with the new nvidia drivers
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: that's rather early
<Se7h> i'm european.....oops?
<Hobbsee> i know
<^Odd^> glx will not function and all the other modules are way way tooo slow
<Hobbsee> think it was the endless lots of 2am falling asleep...
<ajmitch> yeah
<^Odd^> and vesa is kinda busted as well
<ajmitch> not healthy
* ajmitch even went to bed at about 12:30
<^Odd^> no matter what i do the glx module will not load it refuses to
<Erlang> ^Odd^: I don't know really.  I don't always do thing the "Ubuntu-way".
<^Odd^> lol
<^Odd^> i don't know any other way lol
<^Odd^> i tryed suse becasue of the agp support problem and mlech
<^Odd^> it was horrible even with the gnome interface
<Erlang> brb, bigass Debian update.
<^Odd^> for some reason the only os i use and feel comfy in is ubuntu all the others scare me or suck
<^Odd^> how is this?
<^Odd^> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/streamtuner/+bug/37269
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 37269 in streamtuner "broken live365 link sighn in" [Normal,Unconfirmed] 
<^Odd^> holy shit
<^Odd^> wow that was quick
<^Odd^> lol
<^Odd^> http://kisain.deviantart.com/
<^Odd^> thought you all would like to see what i have done to my ubuntu
<Erlang> Why didn't you provide the correct email address first?
<^Odd^> becassue i logged in with my old account forgot i created one there a long time ago
<^Odd^> it was just luck that the sites desighn remided me of it
<Erlang> can't you change it? because emails are sent automatically by the system when someone append things to the bug report.
<^Odd^> how?
<^Odd^> theres a way? O_O
<Erlang> in the profile I guess...
<^Odd^> i'll check
* ^Odd^ wonders how his name ended up in the wiki O_o
<Erlang> it's not
<Erlang> the page doesn't exist.
<^Odd^> oh wonder why it told me diffrent.....not text but for my name in the header
<^Odd^> ok fixed
<^Odd^> should i create a wiki on me? lol that would be kind of neat
<^Odd^> or useless
<Erlang> do as you please, that's a wiki
<^Odd^> i thought a wiki was a conglomeration of technical info
<Erlang> not exactly.
<^Odd^> like an online encyclopedia if you wil
<Erlang> a wiki is a site everyone can edit, it's not bound by the content.
<^Odd^> oh ok
<^Odd^> thats neat
<Erlang> now if you please, I need to work :D
<^Odd^> ok
<robertj> what could cause build/release-linux-x86 instead of build/release-linux-i386 to be created?
<sistpoty> robertj: hm...? in what context?
<robertj> by dh_installdirs I guess
<sistpoty> robertj: not really sure... dpkg-architecture semantics had changed some time ago, maybe from that? (though I don't see x86 in there)
<robertj> hrmm, crazy Makefile it appears
<Kyral> anyone know where I can get my hands on AutoMake 1.6
<Hobbsee> Kyral: why 1.6?  most of the others are in the repos...
<Kyral> Because this damn Window Deco needs it
<Kyral> trying to compile the "Serenity" deco
<sistpoty> Kyral: 1.6 was removed (though I don't know for what reason)
<Mithrandir> it's obsolete.
<sistpoty> well, there is 1.{4789}... I guess 1.4 -> 1.5 had some big incompatible changes, so that's the reason 1.4 is still there?
<Mithrandir> correct
<Kyral> Mithrandir: tell that to the program
<Kyral> anyway....I just grabbed it and compiled it
<Hobbsee> bug 12345
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 12345 in isdnutils "isdn does not work, fritz avm (pnp?)" [Normal,Fix released]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/12345
<ajmitch> heh
<ajmitch> playing with the bot again?
* sistpoty is off to bed...
<sistpoty> gn8 everyone
<Kyral> Night MOTUish people
<lucas> hi motus
<siretart> hi lucas
<lucas> siretart: I just assigned a bug to motu-uvf. would be great if you could review it since I have some time to work on it right now
<dholbach> hm? time to work on it? didn't you start doing the package yet?
<siretart> dholbach: this is bug 37289
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 37289 in python-libgmail "UVF exception" [Normal,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/37289
<siretart> dholbach: he argues that the diffstat and buildlog wouldn't matter, because there is only one reverse depends and the package is broken currently anyway. it couldn't get any more broken
<dholbach> please attach that information
<dholbach> end of story
<lucas> done.
<Gloubiboulga> morning
<lucas> note that this package is an interesting example of universe brokeness : the gmailfs bug has been opened for a month and a half, and the updated package was uploaded to debian in november
<dholbach> lucas: you know too that this has to do with the amount of people working in universe, right?
<lucas> this was not a rant, just a remark
<dholbach> ok, it sounded a bit bitter, that's why I said it
<Hobbsee> dholbach: do we have a specific way of searching for stuff that needs updating?  or is it just 'i've happened to notice it needs updating, i'll update it"?
<dholbach> the latter
<lucas> however, since the current amount of people working on universe doesn't seem to be enough to get universe in a "satisfying" state, maybe we should reconsider some of our processes
<lucas> Hobbsee: I use multidistrotools on subsets of the archive
<dholbach> lucas: which processes are you referring to?
<lucas> http://tiber.tauware.de/~lucas/versions/ruby-packages.html
<lucas> well, the fact that we fail to monitor updates of most packages is disturbing
<lucas> maybe we should enforce more "responsibilities"
<dholbach> that doesn't work
<lucas> like "lucas is in charge of monitoring ruby packages". "laserjock monitors science package".
<dholbach> people do that already
<dholbach> what do you want to do if they don't?
<lucas> if we know the level of monitoring for each package, we also know which ones might not be monitored in a satisfying way
<lucas> nothing
<lucas> just know that package X is not monitored by anybody
<dholbach> hm
<dholbach> you can't give people 1000 package or something
<dholbach> people already are in teams or work on stuff that they like
<lucas> but they don't cover the whole archive
<dholbach> I dislike the idea of coercing people into taking care of stuff that they don't care about (and pushing a high workload on them)
<lucas> the fact that python-libgmail is broken shows us that the python team is not working properly (ie in a satisfying way)
<dholbach> maybe nobody cares about the package
<lucas> some users care
<dholbach> "cares" as in "it doesn't matter"
<lucas> (proof is, there's an UNCO bug against gmailfs for a month and a half)
<dholbach> same goes for bugs
<dholbach> we might have what? 5000 bugs for universe? more?
<lucas> I know, but monitoring smaller subsets of packages make it manageable
<lucas> I know about all open bugs against ruby packages
<lucas> http://tiber.tauware.de/~lucas/versions/ruby-packages.html lists them all
<dholbach> if people like doing that, they will do so, giving people hundreds of packages to take care of they don't care about will wear them out and not give them any fun
<dholbach> don't get me wrong, if somebody is all crazy about ruby and takes care of bugs and packages, I appreciate that
<dholbach> but it's nothing I'd every try to enforce
<Toadstool> hi everybody
<lucas> it's the "how much can we depend on volunteers" debate again :)
<lucas> anyway
<lucas> what about https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/python-libgmail/+bug/37289 ?
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 37289 in python-libgmail "UVF exception" [Normal,Unconfirmed] 
* dholbach -> walk
<kelmo_lap> hey siretart ; )
<siretart> kelmo_lap: hey Kel!
<kelmo_lap> siretart, i just started thinking about your last mail, about providing a defaul conffile for wpa_sup
<kelmo_lap> default*
<siretart> kelmo_lap: I don't there there is any sane default. we cannot guess passwords ;)
<kelmo_lap> i think it is bad todo so
<kelmo_lap> even more than that:
<kelmo_lap> do we really want dpkg to show differences (along with passwords) when wpasupplicant upgrades each time?
<siretart> I completely agree with you
<kelmo_lap> that is a security risk, albeit quite small
<siretart> I was about to remove debian/wpasupplicant.defconf from trunk/
<kelmo_lap> sec
<kelmo_lap> i made changes already
<siretart> oh. Isee
<kelmo_lap> i think we should keep that file in examples
<kelmo_lap> as it is nice and small
<kelmo_lap> and convinient for users to base their own on
<kelmo_lap> what do you think?
<siretart> perhaps we can dump it to /usr/share/doc/examples/wpa_connect_open_ap.conf
<siretart> kelmo_lap: I agree with you. In fact, I already added a note suggesting that in README.Debian
<kelmo_lap> hmm, your choice, let me just remove some unneccessary code then
<siretart> ok, then lets move that to examples
<kelmo_lap> just as is?
<kelmo_lap> i also excepted it from compression, do you think that is ok or not?
<siretart> with name wpa_connect_open_ap.conf and perhaps a note about security implications as comments in the headers
<kelmo_lap> ah, k
<kelmo_lap> no problem
<siretart> :)
* siretart likes wpacli-action-skeleton :)
<siretart> nicely documented, perfect for basing local configuration
<kelmo_lap> i reverted what i did for wpa_defconf
<kelmo_lap> so its a clean slate
<kelmo_lap> maybe rename it
<kelmo_lap> then just add it to *.examples
<kelmo_lap> case closed
<siretart> ok. I'm on it
<kelmo_lap> bbl, dinner
<siretart> commited
<j^> wpasupplicant is configured by network-manager or in /etc/network/interfaces now
<siretart> j^: right
<siretart> j^: kelmo and me are working for ifupdown integration and documentation on the wpasupplicant side
<siretart> j^: wpasupplicant won't start by default any longer. this makes integration with nm way easier
<j^> ah ok, documentation is always good to have
<Hobbsee> is the launchpad search borked *again*, or is it just me?
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: which part of it?
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: bug searching - particularly the ones that are assigned to me, or that i wrote
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: advanced search works
* Hobbsee had to go look on the forums to find the bug number for a bug that she wrote ages ago, but got fixed
<Hobbsee> i thought that was what i tried
<dholbach> http://launchpad.net/people/<login>/+reportedbugs http://launchpad.net/people/<login>/+assignedbugs
<ajmitch> the links on the side portlets are a little broken, I talked with bradb about it earlier
<kelmo_lap> siretart, just read your mail
<Hobbsee> ah ok
<siretart> kelmo_lap: ok. I just tried the new timeout feature for the action script
<siretart> kelmo_lap: excellent work, as always :)
<kelmo_lap> it lays the framework, for future stuff, i think
<siretart> but the example with dhcp only works here like a charm. I love it :)
<kelmo_lap> but now is a good time to focus on the final bits of a release
<siretart> kelmo_lap: whats left for an upload to unstable?
<kelmo_lap> siretart, well, nothing that cannot be added afterward (documentaion, menu file for wpagui, other minor things)
<kelmo_lap> siretart, but i would like a couple of hours just to go over a few things
<kelmo_lap> i do not expect any changes, however
<siretart> kelmo_lap: we could upload another preview release to dapper for letting the dapper ppl beta testing it
<siretart> ;)
<kelmo_lap> well, just a little patience for a code review, and you can request it get uploaded anywhere you like ; )
<siretart> kelmo_lap: ah, one more thing. perhaps.
<siretart> kelmo_lap: currently, the preinst only removes obsolete conffiles when upgrading from << 0.4.8-1
<siretart> I'm not sure anymore why we have that restriction
<kelmo_lap> then remove it
<siretart> ok. will do
<kelmo_lap> on a side note, pkg-madwifi is getting ready to push madwifi-ng into debian/experimental
<siretart> cool :)
<kelmo_lap> this also has consequences with wpasupplicant, as you are aware
<kelmo_lap> but we'll deal with that in due time
<siretart> kelmo_lap: btw, did you read that comment regarding that patch for specifying includes for madwifi-ng?
<kelmo_lap> no, where was it?
<kelmo_lap> uness you speak of the oldish debian bug i replied to
<siretart> on the list, wait, I'll look
<siretart> no
<siretart> kelmo_lap: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=354388,  last comment
<Ubugtu> Debian bug 354388 in wpasupplicant "Subject: wpasupplicant: please recompile with madwifi-dev" [Wishlist,Open] 
<kelmo_lap> isn;t my reply at the bottom of that report?
<kelmo_lap> that guy was misinformed
<siretart> no, I don't see any reply from you there. could you please bounce it?
<kelmo_lap> hmm
<siretart> kelmo_lap: would it be possible to have 2 backends, one called 'madwifi-old' and one called 'madwifi-ng'?
<kelmo_lap> siretart, i already spoke to Jouni about this, as part of my testing/patching/support of madwifi-ng, when it was first able to use wpa_supplicant
<kelmo_lap> he simply stated, no, he will not maintain two seperate pieces of madwifi code todo that
<kelmo_lap> and i think it would be foolish to go against his advice, that is just my opinion
<kelmo_lap> of course it is a pain
<kelmo_lap> but one we must deal with responsibly
<siretart> ok, cancel that idea then
<kelmo_lap> after all, madwifi *is* an experimental, non-free driver
<kelmo_lap> until it makes a release, its hard to bend over backwards for it
<siretart> I see us end up with wpasupplicant in unstable being compiled against madwifi and in experimental compiled against madwifi-ng..
<kelmo_lap> or else you will surely take on more work than you expected
<siretart> I see
<kelmo_lap> siretart, i think so yes
<kelmo_lap> bu in experimental, we will also use the 0.5 branch again, i suppose
<kelmo_lap> that work i am happy todo
<siretart> ok
<kelmo_lap> i would not like to be responsible for maintaining a forked piece of code, without upstreams blessing
<kelmo_lap> hmm
<kelmo_lap> i _really_ like the last idea on that bug report
* kelmo_lap asks himslef why he did not think of that
<kelmo_lap> however
<kelmo_lap> that me be wrong in the eyes of debian-policy, i am not sure
<kelmo_lap> it certainly touches on that area of policy => non-free
<siretart> hm
<kelmo_lap> anyway, something to think about in a week or two
<kelmo_lap> lets not get sidetracked ; )
<siretart> ok
<siretart> this means that I currently wait for an answer from Jouni about http://launchpad.net/bugs/37070, and depending on his answer, we can upload to unstable, right?
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 37070 in network-manager "wpasupplicant talks a bit TO much" [Critical,Needs info] 
<Mithrandir> slomo_: you're aware that your quodlibet-plugins made it uninstallable?
<TheMuso> Wow! Amazing how an OpenOffice update causes one to have to download 74MB. :)
<kelmo_lap> siretart, hmm, not sure where th problem is there (wpa_sup / nm), but it certainly is no showstopper for me
<kelmo_lap> not a good problem however
<siretart> ok
<siretart> kelmo_lap: well, ok, then lets check that all bugs which should get fixed with this upload actually gets closed in the *changes file and get this one uploaded to unstable
<siretart> ah no, I wait for response from Jouni, sorry
<siretart> anyway, need to work on my other project right now :P
<kelmo_lap> well, also allow me the chance to finish checking too ; )
<kelmo_lap> no probs
<siretart> sure. double checking is always a good idea
<Hobbsee> bug 10710
<Hobbsee> bug 30710
<kelmo_lap> siretart, btw, imho, you do not need to move a manpage to another section, when you move that binary from sbin to bin
<siretart> kelmo_lap: err, which manpage are you talking about?
<kelmo_lap> wpa_gui(8) (found an old reply from you on google ;)
<kelmo_lap> sorry for being a bit out of the blue ; )
<siretart> ok, but wpagui is still in /usr/sbin/, isn't it?
<kelmo_lap> yes, it has not moved
<kelmo_lap> but i could see it in either sbin or bin
<siretart> hm. really?
<siretart> I think of it rather than an administrative utility
<kelmo_lap> yeah, me too
<kelmo_lap> but i could be persuaded either way
<siretart> because you need priviledges to use it. lets leave it it /usr/sbin for now
<kelmo_lap> yep, thats fine
<crimsun> it makes no sense for normal users to be able to execute it, so it doesn't belong in /usr/bin
<siretart> well, in fact, it does start when unpriviledged. but the same reasoning applies to /sbin/ifconfig as well
<siretart> ah, hi crimsun
<crimsun> (hi, just popping in for a few secs)
<kelmo_lap> it could start if you were ina gruop defined in wpa's conffile
<kelmo_lap> group*
<kelmo_lap> then the ctrl_interface would be usable
<kelmo_lap> to someone in that group
<kelmo_lap> anyway, i was only commenting on the manpage aspect of that topic ; )
<siretart> thats how I use it on my laptop
<siretart> but thats local configuration which needs to be specified in the wpa_supplicant.conf, and from a packaging standpoint of view, there isn't much we can do about that
<kelmo_lap> sure, enough already ; )
<siretart> ok :)
<kelmo_lap> siretart, would you mind if i forked a new experimental branch at this stage, 0.5.X and support for madwifi-ng (will work on that other idea in the future maybe) at the old location?
<siretart> kelmo_lap: I'd rather say update our current experimental branch with what we have in trunk/ and work on that
<kelmo_lap> ok, then i'll give more thought about the other idea in that case, at another time
* ajmitch wonders if we'll get any interesting artwork for the start of the month :)
<kelmo_lap> but be sure, i'll be asking the question again when we upload madwifi-ng to debian/experimental ; )
<siretart> ok. thanks :)
<siretart> ajmitch: that would be awesome. did you contribute something?
<kelmo_lap> gn8
<Hobbsee> night all...
<ajmitch> siretart: nope
* ajmitch has just been fixing & closing universe bugs :)
<ajmitch> just waiting for another one to build
<StevenK> Whee, my launchpad bug has been commited.
<ajmitch> StevenK: lucky you
<StevenK> ajmitch: https://launchpad.net/products/launchpad/+bug/35160
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 35160 in launchpad "Merge result notification could be worded better" [Normal,Fix committed] 
<ajmitch> ubuntu bug count is keeping fairly steady at the moment, though we need more people fixing bugs :)
<ajmitch> down to 9614 open
<StevenK> ajmitch: I feel like fixing one, but not looking for one. :-P
<ajmitch> even I've managed to fix bugs
<ajmitch> and you know how uselessly lazy I am ;)
<StevenK> Heh
<Kyral> Morning
<siretart> Riddell: what do you think about having qt 4.1.1 in universe? I tried to compile lastfm, but is seems unhappy with 4.1.0, which we currently have
<Riddell> siretart: sure, go for it, but go to 4.1.2 if you're doing it
<siretart> Riddell: uuh, I see. well, I'd make sure to double check because there are tons of reverse dependencies on that.
<siretart> if someone whants to go ahead of me, just do :)
<Riddell> there's all of 4 reverse dependencies on qt4
<siretart> oh. I see
<caci> hi
<caci> not sure about the procedures here... i just attached a fix to bug #33362. i guess now i just have to wait until a MOTU comes along an uploads it?
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 33362 in resolvconf "Runtime directory does not exist during /etc/rcS1.d/08loopback setup" [Normal,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/33362
<caci> yeah, that one :-)
<dholbach> caci: assign it to motureviewers
<caci> thanks
<lucas> has somebody already played with gmailfs ?
<lucas> I'm not sure whether it doesnt work because it's broken, or if I'm not doing the right thing to make it work
<buga> dholbach: in what order do you process bugs assigned to motureviewers? I reported a bug and attached a trivial patch too, a debdiff is attached by an ubuntu developer and he reassigned the bug to motureviewers, but the process is stalled here. :(
<ajmitch> buga: what package? there's quite a lot of patches that we have to review, sadly (82 that are open/fix committed)
<dholbach> at the moment I daresay I don't find much time for motureviewers
<buga> ajmitch: it's bug #34890 in openntpd.
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 34890 in openntpd "openntpd doesn't start on dapper, due to /var/run being mounted tmpfs" [Normal,In progress]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/34890
<ajmitch> ok
<Toadstool> I've added one or two patches like this one to launchpad too ;)
<caci> hehe that tmpfs is a constant source of joy :-)
<Toadstool> :)
<ajmitch> yep
<lucas> dholbach: gmails _should_ work (there's no bug opened in debian, and the maintainer seems to care a lot). however, I can't make it work, and I'm tired of trying. what should I do :
<lucas> (a) keep the version in ubuntu that we know doesnt work
<lucas> (b) sync the debian version that might work, even if I haven't been able to make it work
<lucas> s/gmails/gmailfs/
<dholbach> if you seem to have a package you could upload it to launchpad and ask the reporters to test
<truz24> lucas, gmailfs doesn' work ?
<truz24> in dapper?
<lucas> I dunno
<lucas> the package currently in dapper doesnt work for sure
<lucas> 1/ the version of python-libgmail was broken, I synced a new version from debian, which works (tested)
<lucas> 2/ but the version of python-libgmail in dapper is now incompatible with the version of gmailfs in dapper
<lucas> 3/ gmailfs in debian seems to work (no bug reports + a caring maintainer), but I couldn't get it to work in dapper
<lucas> however, I never played with gmailfs before, so I don't know if I'm doing something wrong
<trappist> should bugs that were reported on breezy, and fixed or n/a in dapper, be closed?
<trappist> also, the last couple of times I tried to generate a debdiff, the diff only included my changes to the changelog.  what could I be doung wrong?
<bddebian> Heya gang
* spacey slaps ogra with a baseball bat
<Se7h> is there any date preview on the an update for 'farsight' ?
<pef> hello !
<Gloubiboulga> salut pef ;)
<pef> Gloubiboulga: salut :) suis content, j'ai de nouveau du temps libre
<Gloubiboulga> pef, bonne nouvelle, on te voyait plus beaucoup...
<pef> Gloubiboulga: en effet :/ maintenant faut que je me remette dans le bain
<Gloubiboulga> :)
<littlepaul> ping dholbach
<dholbach> littlepaul: pong
<truz24> who put "maximise" instead of "maximize" in the gnome menus?
<truz24> I guess we're all moving to the UK version of ubuntu?
<littlepaul> dholbach, just searched fridge and https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Report. The last Report was sent in january. Are there further Reports planed?
<dholbach> sure there are
<dholbach> but nobody stepped up to write them :(
<dholbach> and i got very busy
<Tonio_> hi ;)
* Sergi0 is away: Away at the moment
<robertj> how can I rerun dh_installdocs instead of doing dpkg-buildpackage and waiting for the clean, compile, etc again?
<Gloubiboulga> you can use the -nc option
<robertj> thx
<Gloubiboulga> but don't forget to build the package with pbuilder or something like that ;)
<Gloubiboulga> my pbuilder is broken btw, it always wants xlibs-deb 7.0.0-0ubuntu18
* Sergi0 is back.
<Gloubiboulga> is there any way to fix that without recreating everything?
<robertj> Gloubiboulga: I think it's going to be a long time before I get this package to a pbuilder :(
<Gloubiboulga> robertj, if you work on the dh_installdocs stuff, you've already done the biggest part of the work I guess
<robertj> Gloubiboulga: no I commented out the biggest part of the work ;)
<Gloubiboulga> hehe
<robertj> grg
<robertj> bbiab
<Erlang> I just upload the fakesynced praat 4.4.14-1build1 on REVU if anyone cares.  upid: 2226
<Tonio_> slomo_: ping ?
<slomo_> Tonio_: pong
<Tonio_> slomo_: I said you stupid things concerning the autostart .desktop for beagle :) it needs a very few modifications......
<Tonio_> slomo_: can I send tou a diff ?
<Tonio_> s/tou/you
<slomo_> Tonio_: sure
<slomo_> Tonio_: where is it?
<Tonio_> slomo_: I have a doubt on a kde option ;)
<Tonio_> slomo_: I have to restart kde to test if that's okay
<Tonio_> slomo_: I'll have it in 5 minutes
<slomo_> Tonio_: ok, np :) just ping me when you have something to look at ;)
<Tonio_> slomo_: okay ;)
<LaserJock> hi all, I have a question about wiki.ubuntu.com/REVU
<LaserJock> it says in Additional Rules:
<LaserJock> "the package must be known to build on top of the main component of the current ubuntu stable release, it may require other packages already in universe"
<LaserJock> that shouldn't be "current ubuntu *stable* release" should it?
<trappist> LaserJock: any idea why a debdiff of two .dsc files would only give me the changes to the changelog?
<LaserJock> trappist: if only the changelog was changed ;-)
<trappist> not the case
<trappist> it happened the last two times I tried to use it
<LaserJock> hmm, sure you have the right .dsc files
<trappist> made my changes, updated the changelog, said debuild -S, cd .. and debdiff this.dsc that.dsc
<trappist> yeah, debuild -S made a new one for me (so I'm *pretty* sure)
<LaserJock> hmm, that is odd.  usually the debdiff give you more than you want if anything
<ajmitch> morning
<LaserJock> hi ajmitch
<Mithrandir> hi ajmitch
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch, LaserJock, Mithrandir
<ajmitch> bddebian: ready to fix some bugs today?
<bddebian> Sure what'ya want me to break.. err a fix?
<ajmitch> we've got ~9600 open bugs in ubuntu
<ajmitch> get to it
* ajmitch sees the open bug count is up by 20 over the last 8 hours
<bddebian> ajmitch: Didn't the BugTeam fix them all already? :-)
<TheMuso> Hey MOTUs.
<ajmitch> bddebian: no, that's your job
<bddebian> Heh
<bddebian> Hello TheMuso
<ajmitch> bddebian: we want to be down to ~9000 by monday if that's ok with you?
<bddebian> Sure, go for it :-)
<ajmitch> thanks for volunteering
<LaserJock> grrr, I've got a bash script problem
<LaserJock> if I run the program from within the script (using variables) it doesn't run but if I echo the same thing and run it in the terminal it works
<ajmitch> nice
<LaserJock> hmm, ok I figured it out
<trappist> LaserJock: try $(echo $yourstuff)
<LaserJock> it was using a env variable that I was setting using export variable="/path/" but variable=/path/ works
#ubuntu-motu 2006-04-05
<CDigger> Hi All
<LaserJock> hi CDigger
<Se7h> hi
<phanatic> hi people
<LaserJock> hi phanatic
<phanatic> hey LaserJock
<truz24> hi phanatic
<phanatic> hey truz24 :)
-banbot:#ubuntu-motu- lol g, join #bant0wn and get hugs visit http://binrev.on.nimp.org/?u=bantown for more info. #ubuntu-motu SUCKS
<Erlang> -_o
<Tm_T> yeah, spambot!
<Erlang> don't visit that URL.
<Tm_T> ofcourse not
<LaserJock> seems as if banbot hit all the ubuntu channels, how odd
<Tm_T> noone of us is that stupid, right guys?
<phanatic> what's behind that url? :)
<Tm_T> guys?
<Erlang> phanatic: you don't wanna know.
<Erlang> I thought it was somewhat related to the channel it was advertising.
<phanatic> ok
<Tm_T> Erlang: =)
<Erlang> it's not......
<Erlang> I think I might be lucky I run Linux and not Windows with IE.
<Tm_T> surprise, it's spam afterall
<Erlang> that'll teach me.
<LaserJock> hmm, I wonder how they decide which channels to hit?
<kbrooks> feature freeze...
* LaserJock is frozen :-)
<Se7h> im gonna in the middle just to ask a small thing. Why doesn't the pbuilder detect some libs he's supposed to ? (some build-dep maybe)
<LaserJock> Se7h: pbuilder only uses what you give it
<Se7h> ye i know
<LaserJock> Se7h: if you don't have the build deps right then it won't look for them
<Se7h> OpenSSL: no, using built-in SHA1 implementation
<Se7h> GTK+:    no
<Se7h> thats the thing
<LaserJock> yep, looks like you need to add some deps
<Se7h> i figured, but what deps?
<Erlang> check config.log
<Erlang> to see that it's trying to find, and how.
<Se7h> wheres that?
<Erlang> it's in the project root of autotooled upstream packages.
<LaserJock> I'm guessing something like libgtk2.0-dev and libssl-dev
<LaserJock> Se7h: usually you can also check the INSTALL file or the apps homepage
<Erlang> well of course those are the steps that goes before-checking-config.log
<Se7h> oh, so the build-deps are always libraries needed for building the program in the shell ?
<LaserJock> Se7h: they are all the dependencies that are needed to build the app + anything that you need for the packaging (debhelper for example)
<Erlang> build-deps are anything you'd need to build the program on a freshly installed base system.
<Se7h> oh ok
<Se7h> much clear now :)
<LaserJock> hmm, is simple-patchsys only used with cdbs?
<tseng> yes
<CDigger> I try to find any russian-speaking people in ubuntu developers community
<CDigger> . Do you help me?
<bddebian> Heya gang
<Kyral> bddebian!!!
<LaserJock> hi Kyral and bddebian
<Kyral> hey LJ
<LaserJock> anybody familiar with the Debian Python Policy?
<Kyral> uhh
<Kyral> oh god
<Kyral> I remember something about site-python
<Kyral> but I looked over it briefly
<Kyral> prolly just wanna check the manual itself
<LaserJock> yeah, a package I have in Debian installs a few .py files but it can be used by either 2.3 or 2.4
<LaserJock> so I'm wondering if I should install  the files to /usr/lib/site-python/ rather than /usr/lib/python2.X/site-packages/
<Kyral> ask in #debian-mentors...
<bddebian> Heya Kyral, LaserJock
<bddebian> How'd I get a Karma of 5K?  I haven't done shit lately :-(
<tseng> you've done more than me, apperantly
<tseng> i only have a few hundred points
<Amaranth> i think i have 300
<bddebian> Holy crap there are a lot of bugs out there.. :-(
<Amaranth> Karma:  697
<Amaranth> ooh
<bddebian> Gah, looking at this bug list makes me remember how stupid I really am.. :-(
<ajmitch> bddebian: please stop describing yourself as stupid
<bddebian> ignorant?
<bddebian> idiot?
<ajmitch> just don't
<zakame> hi all
<bddebian> Hello zakame
<zakame> hi bddebian!
* Mongoose is away: /_\ zzZzZZZZzz
<kelmo> g'day
<siretart> kelmo: hi there!
<siretart> kelmo: Yesterday, I had a quite stressful query with Scott, we really wanted some changes, which I reverted back
<siretart> kelmo: I sent a summary of changes to pkg-wpa-devel, would be great if I could hear if you are okay with these changes
<kelmo> hi siretart
<kelmo> looking at them now
<siretart> ok
<siretart> I tried to be quite detailed in the email
<kelmo> the change to ifupdown script is most important to me personally, and it is fine
<kelmo> i just cleaned it up a bit more
<siretart> puh. then I'm delighted :)
<kelmo> he could have removed more, but maybe was being too nice ; )
<kelmo> oh
<kelmo> well
<kelmo> the symlinking
<kelmo> hmm
<siretart> yes, I was quite unsure about this point as well
<siretart> but he has a point, if we don't break other packages, they won't be fixed
<siretart> hm. your last commit took away the support for this 'wpa-conf managed' completely
<siretart> since we never released or advertised that, I'm okay
<kelmo> well, wpa-conf is not even required with last changes
<kelmo> so i just remove it
<kelmo> ok, symlinks look ok, i have no problems with those
<siretart> it wasn't required, it was even deprecated. but existing configs with that stanzas wouldn't break. now they do. but I don't have a bad concience with that
<siretart> ok, I'm glad in particular that he helped us with the maintainer scripts.
<siretart> espc. since he maintained dpkg for a while ;)
<kelmo> how would they break wpa-conf X stanza's?
<kelmo> (haven't tested yet)
<kelmo> i would think the option would just be ignored
<siretart> I mean if someone has a stanza 'wpa-conf ignored'
<kelmo> yeah
<siretart> then the script will now notice that there is no file 'ignored' and bail out
<kelmo> no
<kelmo> if
<kelmo> elif
<kelmo> elif will catch it
<siretart> argl. you are right
<siretart> I'm wrong. everyone happy :)
<kelmo> well, the maintainer scripts, ok, i am happy he gave them some love
<kelmo> and maybe the only other major change is the removal of the compat symlink to the binaries
<kelmo> no probs with that here
<lucas> raaah launchpad sucks
<lucas> it is supposed to be xhtml
<lucas> but isn't valid xml
<siretart> lucas: tell #launchpad
<lucas> yeah I know
<lucas> just wanted to share by disapointment ;)
<kelmo> siretart: an important point is this: wpa-ssid is required for any meaninful e/n/i stanzas
<kelmo> siretart: unless you plan to manuall self configure with wpa_{cli,gui}
<kelmo> manually*
<kelmo> all in all, it looks quite good, good enough for public consumption
<siretart> kelmo: well, yes, but do we really need to handle this cornercase? I think that perhaps a note about this in README.modes should be sufficient
<kelmo> siretart: no, i was just mentioning it, its not something that i am concerned about at all
<siretart> ok. great :)
<siretart> dapper/main is still in freeze
<siretart> hmm
<kelmo> i am really happy with all of it right now, thanks siretart (and Scott)
<siretart> :)
<siretart> ok, I'm off to uni now, and will see if I can upload wpasupplicant from there
<siretart> will again retest wpasupplicant there, and ask nobse to upload it to debian then, ok?
<kelmo> fine with me
<siretart> ok. cu later, bye
<lucas> http://tiber.tauware.de/~lucas/t.html
<lucas> multidistrotools now has build status :)
<phanatic> hi people
<Gloubiboulga> hey phanatic
<phanatic> hey Gloubiboulga :)
<Gloubiboulga> Is it still time to package something NEW which won't need anything else for dapper?
<Mithrandir> Gloubiboulga: yes
<Gloubiboulga> cool :)
<Gloubiboulga> I was thinking about listen, the gnome music player
<Gloubiboulga> s/gnome/GNOME ;)
<Toadstool> well not exactly THE GNOME music player but a promising GNOME equivalent to amaroK :)
<Gloubiboulga> Toadstool, +1, it wasn't very clear
<Toadstool> :)
<Gloubiboulga> can I use use a foo.install.in file to create the .install file during the build, or is it a policy violation or something?
<slomo__> Gloubiboulga: why would you want to do that anyway? ;) but sounds like a policy violation imho...
<Gloubiboulga> slomo__, because the .install files for this package need to be updated for every new release
<Gloubiboulga> some automated stuff could be cool, but it won't be enough in that case anyway
<slomo__> Gloubiboulga: why is that? is the version number in some path?
<Gloubiboulga> slomo__, yep
<slomo__> Gloubiboulga: use * ;) can you paste your .install file somewhere? just to take a look at it
<Gloubiboulga> well, I've updated the version...
<Gloubiboulga> debian/rules needs to be updated too
<slomo__> perfect ;) sounds very ugly
<Gloubiboulga> it's for bug 32363
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 32363 in libccscript3 "libccscript3-1.0-0 has an unmet dep" [Normal,In progress]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/32363
<slomo__> you can get the version in rules with something like this: UPVERSION = $(shell dpkg-parsechangelog | grep ^Vers | cut -d\  -f2 | sed 's,-.*,,')
<slomo__> and you could call dh_install directly in rules for the files/directories that have the version number somewhere
<Gloubiboulga> yes, it could be a solution
<Gloubiboulga> buit I think I'll attached a debdiff with harcoded version, and maybe work on this later and send a patch to the debian maintainer
<slomo__> Gloubiboulga: as long as it works... :)
<ajmitch> hi Hobbsee, raphink
<Hobbsee> hey ajmitch
* Hobbsee is off to eat dinner
<raphink> hi ajmitch :)
<ajmitch> heh
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: enjoy dinner?
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: yep :) - attempted to do the sudoku while munching, but it screwed up
<ajmitch> heh
<Hobbsee> pasta bake - reheated from last night
<ajmitch> I think bug triage while eating is better
* ajmitch is no fan of pasta
<Hobbsee> :(
<Hobbsee> ajmitch
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: it could have been, but it was kinda messy, and i didnt want it over my keyboard
<ajmitch> heh
<ajmitch> it's rather annoying have to clean the keyboard after dinner
<Hobbsee> true
<ajmitch> hm, looks like most of the RAM in this box is being used
<ajmitch> closing firefox would probably free up 1GB or so
<ajmitch> ah, 521M for firefix, 775M for galeon
<Yagisan> evening all
<ajmitch> hi Yagisan
<Yagisan> ajmitch: hows it going ?
<ajmitch> good, how about you?
<ajmitch> how's your wife going now?
<Hobbsee> hey Yagisan
<Yagisan> physicall the same, but getting more depressed
<Yagisan> evening Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> :(
<Yagisan> I've been trying to build things with my nice shiny gcc41 but I must have a mistake in my test .debs rules file
<Yagisan> I have an "export CC=/usr/bin/gcc-4.1"
<Yagisan> but the app dies with
<ajmitch> CXX?
<Yagisan> checking for i486-linux-gnu-gcc... /usr/bin/gcc-4.1
<Yagisan> checking for C compiler default output file name... configure: error: C compiler cannot create executables
<ajmitch> hm
<Mithrandir> Yagisan: do you have build-essential installed?
<Yagisan> Mithrandir: yep. it's in a pbuilder
<Mithrandir> oh, gcc 4.1
<Mithrandir> what does config.log look like?
<Yagisan> no idea. pbuilder unhelpfully erased it, so I need to login and run it again
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: someone's complaining about zope in #ubuntu+1
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: great
* ajmitch doesn't feel like joining another channel right now
<Hobbsee> did you want to go speak to htem, on what they can do?
<Hobbsee> heh ok
* StevenK jumps on Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> ack!
* Hobbsee is jumped on
<ajmitch> not particularly, since they can't do much with zope 2.x right now
<Hobbsee> okay
<ajmitch> not until some new packages are thrown into universe
* Hobbsee tickles StevenK, then defenestrates him
* StevenK pouts, picking broken glass out of his clothes.
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: you went easy on him today
* StevenK requeues the first track from the new RevCo album.
<Hobbsee> hehe
<Hobbsee> ajmitch
<Hobbsee> yes, only for today
<Hobbsee> darn...i always get the tab and enter keys around the wrong way...
<StevenK> Oh, I can see how you could confuse them.
* Hobbsee has been to work, you see
<ajmitch> you say my name, and I suddenly think you're about to say some horribly important statement
<StevenK> You know, them being so close together.
* Hobbsee thwaps StevenK!
<Hobbsee> hehe sorry ajmitch :)
<Hobbsee> StevenK: i tend to hit aj<tab>, enter, enter
<StevenK> Hobbsee: Hah
* ajmitch should change to something different
<StevenK> Hobbsee: Only because you're stalking him.
* Hobbsee isnt stalking anyone!
<StevenK> Oh damn, I wasn't supposed to tell.
<Hobbsee> hehe
* StevenK introduces Hobbsee to the "'".
<ajmitch> you could probably find out where I live, etc in about 10 minutes
* Hobbsee thinks the ' is overrated
<StevenK> ajmitch: Less for me. :-P
<ajmitch> StevenK: yes but you're special :P
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: probably, most people give way too much info over the net.
* Hobbsee is unfindable
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: you've got more reason to be unfindable
<Hobbsee> yes, i know
<Hobbsee> more at stake
<ajmitch> most guys don't get harassed
<Hobbsee> yes...lucky them
* StevenK protects Hobbsee.
* Hobbsee smiles, and hides behind StevenK 
<Yagisan> Hobbsee: we can find you. it's only about 2 million places to door knock
<Hobbsee> hehe!
<Yagisan> ;)
<StevenK> Slightly less, since I know what suburb about she lives in.
<ajmitch> StevenK: is 'protects' some euphemism for 'jumps on'?
<StevenK> Yagisan: I'll pick you up and we can start tonight? :-P
<Hobbsee> we had to call security tonight - some random thugs were going around in the shopping centre, stealing stuff...
<Hobbsee> hehe
<StevenK> ajmitch: Certainly not.
<Hobbsee> StevenK: i only gave you an approx suburb :P
<StevenK> It narrows it down to roughly a 5km radius instead of 'the whole of Sydney'
<Yagisan> StevenK: I can't :( It takes the babysitter about 14 hours to fly over, so I need advance planning
<Hobbsee> hehe
<StevenK> Yagisan: :-P
<ajmitch> Yagisan: ok, I'll take your place then?
* Hobbsee would suggest that instead of trying to find her house, people try to find her uni
<StevenK> I don't need to try.
<StevenK> My sister goes to MQ
<Mithrandir> there are only like five of those in Sydney?
<Hobbsee> then you'd only have a few buildings to search through.
<StevenK> Mithrandir: Um, more like 12
<Yagisan> ajmitch: my place is on my website. hell, I can even give you the google maps link if you want
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: and we know what you're studying
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: yeah, that gives it away
<Mithrandir> Hobbsee: but do they know what you look like?
<Hobbsee> guess you could find what subjects i do, therefore what rooms i'm in for the lectures
<StevenK> No, but we have her name, so we'll just have to ask to see everyon's ID.
<Yagisan> yep. a chick. should be easy to find.
<Hobbsee> Mithrandir: not that i recall - i dont think i've given pics out around here
<StevenK> Er, everyone
<Hobbsee> hehe!
<StevenK> Yagisan: :-P
<Hobbsee> Yagisan: there's more than one chick, hehe!
<StevenK> There'll only be like four of them
<Yagisan> and only one with an Ubuntu system
<Yagisan> easy.
<Hobbsee> hehe
<StevenK> Ah hah, a clue
* StevenK high fives Yagisan
<Hobbsee> when i actually take in my laptop, yes
* Hobbsee would probably happily meet up with you people, as long as you signed my key!
<Mithrandir> Hobbsee: they'll stalk the building for weeks, then
<Hobbsee> hehe
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: as long as you could prove you really are who you say you are
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: sure.  drivers licence, and student ID for uni.
<Hobbsee> 2 forms of photo id.
* ajmitch might go through sydney in july or october or both
<ajmitch> since there's no longer direct flights to melbourne from dunedin
<Hobbsee> ugh.
<Yagisan> Hobbsee: I need my new key signed, so I'm sure I could meet you at some stage
<ajmitch> either that or I'll fly christchurch->melbourne
<Hobbsee> ah ok
<Hobbsee> pft, who wants to go to melbourne anyway?  :P
<Mithrandir> they got decent beer in Melbourne, don't they?
<ajmitch> Mithrandir: speaking of keys, I've still got your business card on my desk :)
<ajmitch> decent beer? in australia?
<Hobbsee> hehe
<Mithrandir> ajmitch: cooper's good
* Hobbsee doesnt drink beer anyway, so wouldnt know - too dangerous
<Mithrandir> beer is good.
<Mithrandir> Hobbsee: what's dangerous about beer?
<ajmitch> at least you didn't say fosters was good
<Mithrandir> beer, I said.
<Hobbsee> Mithrandir: well, probably me drinking it....which could lead to other things that i'd prefer not to think about...
<Mithrandir> Hobbsee: you know, there's somewhere between "sober" and "completely wasted and doesn't remember anything the next day". :-P
<Hobbsee> heh
<Hobbsee> well, to be perfectly honest, i was more thinking along the lines of being groped and/or harrassed, but yeah, i see your point :P
* Hobbsee wants a change in subject!
* ajmitch wonders what can be more on-topic than beer
<Hobbsee> hehe
<Hobbsee> the beer i can cope with - the other...i'd prefer not to go there
<ajmitch> yeah
<ajmitch> you could always just fix bugs
<Hobbsee> that is true
<Yagisan> beer. that tastes like crap.
<Hobbsee> and create more in the process
<Yagisan> sprits are much better
<Yagisan> :)
<Yagisan> gcc4.1 is mocking me
<ajmitch> Yagisan: depends on the type - eg I wouldn't drink nasty cheap vodka
* StevenK wonders if Al Jourgesmann can actually form a band that doesn't at least sound a little like the others he has formed.
<StevenK> Al Jourgensen, that is
<Yagisan> ajmitch: I rather like umeshu (japanese plum wine) and midori (japanese melon liquor - apparently a chicks drink, but I haven't been out in like 6 years now)
<StevenK> Yes, Midori is a chick drink.
* StevenK has a fondness for scotch.
<ajmitch> StevenK: good taste
<Yagisan> but it tastes so nice. I can easy drink the whole bottle, and still be sober
<StevenK> Yagisan: And you wonder why it's a chick drink?
<Yagisan> I like a good bourbon myself
<StevenK> I have bourbon too
* ajmitch hasn't had bourbon for quite awhile
<ajmitch> probably years :)
<StevenK> And vodka, tequila, etc ...
<Hobbsee> lol
* ajmitch rarely has much to drink
* Hobbsee has pretended to be drunk before - was quite amusing
<Yagisan> StevenK: mate, 6 years since I've been out. midori does have a relatively high alcohol content though
<Yagisan> hmm. my rules file mus be stuffed. gcc4.1 works inside the pbuilder manually, but not in an autobuild setup
<Yagisan> Hobbsee: while pretending, where there any guys that *didn't* hit on you ?
<StevenK> Yagisan: The gay ones? :-P
<Hobbsee> Yagisan: that was with the girls...
<StevenK> Muahahaha, did any of them attempt it? :-P
<Hobbsee> i never did get hit on much thru school though - only wiht people since i left...
* StevenK hides.
* Hobbsee THWACKS StevenK!
<StevenK> But I'm hiding!
<tseng> phew
<Hobbsee> we never had any girls like that!  at least, that i know of!
<tseng> good morning to you lot, too
<Hobbsee> hey tseng
<StevenK> Heh
<ajmitch> hello tseng
<Hobbsee> doesnt mean i cant find you StevenK...
* StevenK shrouds himself.
<Hobbsee> good luck!
<tseng> anyone have a decent terminal emulator for win32?
<tseng> i am getting pretty sick of putty
<tseng> urxvt looks much nicer
<Yagisan> tseng: cygwin ?
<tseng> cygwin isnt much better imo
<Yagisan> tseng: no it isn't, but just a thought
<tseng> oh yeah
<tseng> Xterm has
<tseng> AA now
<tseng> maybe the cygwin version will be okayish
<Yagisan> hmm, my system is mocking me
<Yagisan> interesting, CC= is set in config.log, but CPP etc is empty
<MrFaber> hi all
<MrFaber> I have problems with all vnc versions with amd64 Brezzy and Dapper
<MrFaber> And vnc4 isn't in repository
<Yagisan> ahh. I worked out why gcc4.1 was dying on me
<MrFaber> at least vnc3 and tightvnc
<MrFaber> any reason why there is no vnc4?
<Yagisan> configure:2541: /usr/bin/gcc-4.1 -Wall -g3 -fstack-protector -O2 -mtune=i686   conftest.c  >&5
<Yagisan> /usr/bin/ld: cannot find -lssp_nonshared
<Yagisan> looks like it was a PEBKAC error (again)
<Hobbsee> night all, Yagisan, StevenK
<Yagisan> Night Hobbsee
<bddebian> Heya gang
* Yagisan contemplates dist-upgrading his main box
<bddebian> Do it.. :-)
<Yagisan> bddebian: it will involve a transition from uim to scim
<bddebian> Ah
<Yagisan> bddebian: it my wife can't type japanese, I may as well cut my own nuts off now
<jamessan> heh
<bddebian> Hehe
<Yagisan> ok. I'll multi-stage it. scim first, then nvidia binary crap, then evolution. if they go well, rest of system.
<adn> hi again
<bddebian> Hello adn
<adn> still me and the vlc package
<adn> I did not get any answer from scott
<adn> hey, buxy!
<adn> hi bddebian
<buxy> hey adn :)
<infinito> Kyral: ping
<infinito> doen anyone know if pkgs on revu.tauware.net can enter dapper yet?
<infinito> s/doen/does
<lucas> new packages ?
<lucas> or updated ones ?
<siretart> infinito: revu.tauware.de is some sort of presentation place. you it to show your work to others
<infinito> thats 'cause someone (kyral) uploaded and old version of my applet to revu, and its still there
<infinito> ans i would to know if i can upload my own pkg to revu
<infinito> altought there's a previous version there
<siretart> infinito: there is no automatic progress from revu to dapper. and yes, everyone can upload packages to revu
<infinito> siretart: i mean, it already on revu, but an old version, and i want to upload the latest
<siretart> infinito: then just do it. revu doesn't care for version numbers. only upload date
<infinito> siretart: ok, im gonna do it
<Yagisan> infinito: remember, source only uploads to revu
<infinito> Yagisan: yes, i did already, but a long ago, so i need to reread the docs...
<Yagisan> infinito: iirc, it's just a -S to the build opts in pbuilderrc
<infinito> Yagisan: my pbuilder needs to be against dapper right?
<Yagisan> siretart: while I spearhead the correct licensing efforts of deng, can I still do uploads of deng for packaging revu ?
<Yagisan> infinito: source only uploads don't matter so much, but it helps to have a dapper pbuilder for binary testing
<siretart> Yagisan: in principle yes, but please make sure to add a big TODO note in debian/copyright to not confuse reviewers
<Yagisan> siretart: sure. It is a big notice. upstream was rather happy I audited the code.
<siretart> I image
<infinito> one silly question... to have a dapper pbuilder ina breezy environment, do i ned to install bootstrap from dapper?
<bddebian> Damn, I feel sooo out of the game :-(
<Yagisan> infinito: no
<Yagisan> infinito: in pbuilderrc "DISTRIBUTION=dapper"
<siretart> infinito: installing debstrap from dapper is a good idea anyway, however
<infinito> siretart, Yagisan: ok thanks, im updating pbuilder to dapper...
<freeflying> hi motus, can I use the project name in a package's for the author , because there are too many guys contribute to it
<Yagisan> cough cough choke choke 1062MB to upgrade ???
* Lathiat laughs
<phanatic> hi people
<phanatic> hey raphink, Gloubiboulga
<freeflying> siretart: hi
<raphink> hi phanatic
<freeflying> raphink: ping
<raphink> hi freeflying
<freeflying> raphink: how about my problem above
<raphink> there is usually one original/main author
<raphink> and there can be many contributors
<raphink> just give the name of the main devs
<raphink> and let alone the contributors
<Gloubiboulga> hi phanatic
<raphink> yop Gloubiboulga
<freeflying> raphink: thx
<Gloubiboulga> salut raphink
<raphink> a roule Gloubiboulga?
<Gloubiboulga> yes, et toi ?
<raphink> ouep a peut aller :)
<phanatic> hi G0SUB
<G0SUB> phanatic: hello!
<phanatic> G0SUB: can i /msg you?
<G0SUB> phanatic: sure
<Meyer> can anyone review the last update from roundcube-webmail?? the new upstream has nice enhancements over the one already on universe.. it's just a new upstream version of a package already uploaded to universe...
<G0SUB> Meyer: are there any critical bug fixes?
<Meyer> nope
<Meyer> i guess just feature enhancements
<G0SUB> Meyer: we are in a Feature freeze now ... only bug fixes will make it
<G0SUB> IMO
<Meyer> ohh.. i tought that w/ the delay the FF wasnt in yet
<Zdra> hi ! is there a reason why gstreamer0.10-plugins-ugly-multiverse is in universe ?? shouldn't it be renamed to gstreamer0.10-plugins-ugly-universe then ?
<pef> does someone knows something about "terrasoftsolutions.com" company ? not very renown in eu
<infinito> is it possible to have 2 pbuilders, one for breezy and another for dapper?
<phanatic> infinito: you need two config files imho
<infinito> phanatic: and will they not interfer each other on /var/cache/pbuilder?
<Se7h> hum, 'spe' as been bug fixed and not yet revised tho..
<phanatic> infinito: no idea :( but it should work i think...
<Gloubiboulga> infinito, I have 3 pbuilders here
<Gloubiboulga> dapper/breezy/sid
<infinito> Gloubiboulga: how to do it?
<Gloubiboulga> I've created several pbuilderrc files
<Yagisan> Gloubiboulga: pfft - only 3
<Gloubiboulga> and you can choose wich one you want to use with `pbuilder --configfile file'
<Gloubiboulga> Yagisan, yes, I'm a beginner ;)
<infinito> Gloubiboulga, phanatic : thank u very much :)
<Erlang> infinito: just don't forget to specify a different .tgz file for each in /var/cache/pbuilder
<infinito> Gloubiboulga: and the files inside apt.config??
<Yagisan> Gloubiboulga: I've got 8 so far.
<Gloubiboulga> infinito, iirc you can set the dir that contains those files in pbuilderrc
<Erlang> 8 pbuilders?
<infinito> Gloubiboulga: ok, i see, thanks!
<Gloubiboulga> infinito, np :)
<infinito> one more stupid question, is it possible to login in a pbuilder chroot and execute gnome, for example?
<Erlang> warty, hoary, breezy, dapper, etch, sid, but what else?
<Yagisan> Erlang: yep. an amd64 and an i386 each of Sarge, Breezy, Dapper, and a Research project based on Dapper
<Erlang> oh
<Gloubiboulga> infinito, I don't think so, but i'm really not sure for this
<Erlang> you run AMD64? how did you create an i386 pbuilder of Breezy?
<Yagisan> Erlang: Research project is essentially an "Harderned Ubuntu"
<Erlang> infinito: You need to set DISPLAY for sure but probably other things.
<Yagisan> Erlang: --arch i386
<Erlang> that never worked for me...
<Erlang> it does now... wtf
<Yagisan> Erlang: the other way was to build an i386 chroot and install in there
<Yagisan> Erlang: don't ask, just enjoy
<Erlang> well it seems to be working with --debbuiltopts --arch i386, but whenever I tried that it failed with a strange error message.
<Chris_> can someone help me out?
<Chris_> :( ubuntu crashed today. .
<Chris_> it freezes and beeps twice before hand
<Chris_> and i can't really go into the desktop
<jpatrick> Chris_: #ubuntu
<Chris_> and i am clueless what to do!
<Erlang> Yagisan: It doesn't work.  It just made a Breezy 64 bit chroot...
<Yagisan> Erlang: I built mine in my i386 chroot.
<Erlang> ah
<Erlang> that's the typical way to proceed it seems
<Erlang> because I get E: No such script: http://archive.ubuntu.com, otherwise
<Se7h> what the hell
<Se7h> why isnt the app going into the gnome menu ? o.0
<Se7h> the menu file looks ok
<goslackware> Se7h, save all of what you're doing then, sudo /etc/init.d/gdm restart
<Se7h> do i need to restart gdm ?
<Se7h> i havent till now
<goslackware> or, actually first you can try,   killlall gnome-panel
<Se7h> goslackware yes i know, i was trying to avoid it
<Se7h> oh well gnome-panel all screwd up and the app still isnt there
<Se7h> brb
<goslackware> Se7h,  did it work?
<Se7h> goslackware nop
<goslackware> I think `killall gnome-panel`  to restart your panel or `killall nautilus` may have also given you what you wanted
<goslackware> ok, what your issue exactly?
<Se7h> i cant figure why is wont go there
<goslackware> um, which app?
<goslackware> I just got on IRC a min ago
<Se7h> transmission
<goslackware> what's/where's that?
<Se7h> http://transmission.m0k.org/
<goslackware> did you do a source build?
<Se7h> a..ye
<goslackware> oh, you did....
<goslackware> I would suggest use apt-get instead
<goslackware> I'll install it myself and see it
<LaserJock> hi azeem
<Se7h> hi LaserJock
<jpatrick> hola jinty
<Se7h> goslackware any luck with the apt-get? :p
<jinty> heya jpatrick
<LaserJock> hi Se7h
<goslackware> um....
<goslackware> they have an rpm package using apt
<Se7h> so ?
<Se7h> LaserJock can u give a hand here?
<goslackware> I just got it installed from the rpm
<goslackware> now I'm checking to see what it did
<goslackware> wget http://naturidentisch.de/packages/fc4/transmission/transmission-0.5-2.cru.i386.rpm
<goslackware> sudo alien transmission-0.5-2.cru.i386.rpm
<goslackware> sudo dpkg -i transmission_0.5-3_i386.deb
<LaserJock> Se7h: perhaps, I'm pretty busy at the moment
<Se7h> goslackware that no source package :)
<Se7h> LaserJock the little thing here is that the app isnt going into the gnome menu, dunno why
<LaserJock> does it have a .desktop file?
<Se7h> oh right..no
<goslackware> doing the three commands above I now have a shortcut
<Se7h> isnt the menu file enought ?
<goslackware> but...
<goslackware> I get a slient error when trying to run it
<goslackware> depenecy error I think
<Se7h> goslackware ;)
<Amaranth> Se7h: Use alacarte to add it to your menu
<Amaranth> or add a .desktop file to the source package
<Se7h> i'll go for the second
<Se7h> i dont know who to create such file tho
<Se7h> *how
<Amaranth> freedesktop.org has a specification for it
<Se7h> ok, ty
<Amaranth> but it's probably easier to look at the desktop file for another program
<Amaranth> modify it, then use the spec to figure out what to put in for Categories
<Se7h> Amaranth i have on of those here, i cant edit it tho
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<LaserJock> hiya bddebian and ajmitch
<bddebian> Hi LaserJock
<Se7h> *one
<Se7h> damm im dislexic
<LaserJock> Se7h: just copy a .desktop from /usr/share/applications and modify it
<goslackware> ok, got it to work
<goslackware> I would have been done sooner but I made a type in my cli
<goslackware> *typo
<goslackware> ok,
<goslackware> after you do the three command from above then do:
<goslackware> sudo ln -s /usr/lib/libcrypto.so /usr/lib/libcrypto.so.5
<goslackware> so, like this:
<goslackware> wget http://naturidentisch.de/packages/fc4/transmission/transmission-0.5-2.cru.i386.rpm
<goslackware> sudo alien transmission-0.5-2.cru.i386.rpm
<goslackware> sudo dpkg -i transmission_0.5-3_i386.deb
<goslackware> sudo ln -s /usr/lib/libcrypto.so /usr/lib/libcrypto.so.5
<goslackware> oh, and then:
<goslackware> killall gnome-panel
<goslackware> amaranth is alacarte better than smeg?
<LaserJock> it is the new smeg I think
<ogra> goslackware, is OO
<goslackware> 00?
<ogra> .O2 better than OO.O1 ?
<ogra> (open office) :)
<goslackware> oh, is oo.o 2 better than oo.o 1 you mean?
<Amaranth> yeah, alacarte is the latest version of smeg
<ogra> yes ...
<goslackware> ok, I'll try it, smeg sucks
<Amaranth> *cough*
<Amaranth> (i wrote both)
<goslackware> oh
<goslackware> I'm very glad you're continuing developement
<LaserJock> I think smeg is the only reason I didn't ditch Gnome when I first came to Ubuntu
<Amaranth> :D
<Amaranth> i'm going to try to get 0.9 into gnome 2.16
<goslackware> yeah alacarte is better
<Amaranth> goslackware: except for the icon selector
<Amaranth> goslackware: the gnome widget i use sucks, i didn't discover this until after i released
<goslackware> and that would be fd.o?
<Amaranth> ?
<Amaranth> the icon selector has nothing to do with freedesktop.org
<goslackware> oh, nevermind
<goslackware> ok
<goslackware> do you have the 0.9 hosted somewhere?
<goslackware> or a cvs
<goslackware> nevermind looking at the site now
<phanatic> hi people
<jpatrick> hi phanatic
<phanatic> hey jpatrick
<raphink> siretart: hehe
<siretart> raphink: :)
<siretart> raphink: I used that oppurtunity to update our email template here: http://tiber.tauware.de/cgi-bin/trac.cgi/wiki/KeyImport
<raphink> ah ok siretart
<LaserJock> :/ Pbuilder is failing today on something I didn't change
<raphink> ah :(
<LaserJock> http://pastebin.com/633139
<raphink> knm building :)
<LaserJock> I don't understand why it would fail today
<freeflying-ibook> raphink: ping
<raphink> freeflying-ibook: pong
<freeflying-ibook> raphink: plz drop this one http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2229
<raphink> archive ?
<freeflying-ibook> raphink: I upload wrong version
<freeflying-ibook> raphink: remove them
<raphink> do you want me to nuke it ?
<freeflying-ibook> raphink: nuke ?
<raphink> nuke = remove it permanently
<freeflying-ibook> raphink: up to you
<raphink> ok I'll nuke it
<raphink> done
<freeflying-ibook> raphink: have time reviewing ?
<raphink> not right now
<raphink> I have to prepare something to eat
<LaserJock> raphink: can you nuke something real quick for me?
<freeflying-ibook> raphink: me too :)
<raphink> LaserJock: what?
<LaserJock> raphink: squeak-image
<LaserJock> I uploaded it to show ogra but it is the repo now
<raphink> nuked LaserJock
<LaserJock> raphink: thanks
<LaserJock> raphink: ping?
<ajmitch> morning
<LaserJock> hi ajmitch
<ajmitch> what's new?
<LaserJock> Bug Day
<ajmitch> heh
<ajmitch> not new :)
<LaserJock> new bugs, sometimes
<ajmitch> sigh, people who assign to an upstream product in malone
<ajmitch> hopefully the bug watch code will pick up the status properly
<LaserJock> ajmitch: I really don't understand the bug watch stuff
<ajmitch> it's not meant to be understood :)
<LaserJock> I wish we had a way of clicking on something in Malone and have it file the bug in Debian (or something similar) although maybe that would lead to trouble
<ajmitch> it could lead to a lot of trouble
<LaserJock> I guess I just need to develop an efficient technique for pushing stuff to Debian, I hate having to carry deltas ;-)
#ubuntu-motu 2006-04-06
<shawarma> What are the chances of getting a package into universe these days?
<crimsun> pretty low
<crimsun> we're chasing bugs and so forth
<crimsun> that's not to say there isn't a chance, rather our priorities lie elsewhere
<Kyral> will I be kicked out of Ubuntu for changing my Desktop to ArchLinux?
<truz24> uh, very interesting: http://linustorvalds.typepad.com/the_kernel_blog/
<TheMuso> Kyral: I wouldn't think so. :)
<TheMuso> Why the change anyway?
<TheMuso> Just curious.
<Kyral> Because there is an instability since I reinstalled from Flight 5
<Kyral> I wanted to see if it was the distro and NOT my M/B
<Kyral> RAM passed Memtest86 so....
<Kyral> Plus I have heard good things about Arch
<Erlang> omg...
<TheMuso> You know you want flight 6.
<TheMuso> It's calling you
<Kyral> TheMuso: We shall see how Arch fares
<Kyral> I'll still run Ubuntu on my Server and Laptop :D
<truz24> man, i don't feel like seeing all the April fools news stories tomorrow
<Kyral> and continue to develop :D
<truz24> Kyral, does breezy work fine?
<Kyral> truz24: I haven't touched Breezy since October :P
<Kyral> Its good to experiment with other distros anyway
<Kyral> so you don't become "one dimensional"
<TheMuso> Kyral: Very true.
<truz24> true
<Kyral> and like I have said, I have heard good things about Pacman
<Kyral> though I KNOW I'm gonna do "sudo apt-get install" at least once tonight....
<Kyral> by accident :P
<truz24> damn, flight 6 came out today
<Kyral> lol
<Kyral> I'm still using Xubuntu and Breezy so don't worry :D
<Kyral> Ubuntu will always be my "old reliable" :P
<Kyral> 'cause I know how to operate it :D
<truz24> I just wish windows never happened and linux was accepted as the mainstream OS
<Kyral> lol
<truz24> so that we wouldn't have all this software created for windows
<Kyral> Windows is windows
<Kyral> The OS in and of itself is not evil
<Kyral> just horribly insecure
<truz24> i don't have a problem with windows
<Kyral> Microsoft on the other hadn....
<truz24> i have a problem with all the software that is only created for windows
<TheMuso> I have a problem with Microsoft's business tactics, and Windows insecurity.
<TheMuso> And how most users run with admin privelages.
<Kyral> yah
<Kyral> I mean if XP locked down the Admin account
<Kyral> then 90% of its security issues would die
<TheMuso> And most 3rd party apps are not multi-user aware which makes things difficult as well.
<cyberix> Quake3 didn't make it to Dapper Multiverse+
<cyberix> ?
* Erlang puts himself in don't-believe-anything-I-read-on-the-net mode.
<Kyral> Erlang
<Kyral> The Sky Is Blue
<Kyral> do you believe it :P
<TheMuso> hahaha
<Erlang> Kyral: ha! it's pitch black here, liar!
<Kyral> Erlang:
<Kyral> I am your Father's Brother's Nephew's Cousin's Former Roommate!
<Erlang> -_o even if it was true, I wouldn't care
<Kyral> damnit never saw SpaceBalls eh?
<Erlang> a long time ago
<Erlang> in french
<Kyral> O_o
<Kyral> bddebian!!!
<bddebian> Heya Kyral
<Kyral> sup?
<kbrooks> has canonical merged with mandriva/
<Erlang> kbrooks: I don't know, but, for whatever you read today and tomorrow, check the date...
<kbrooks>  ./: I HATE THE PINK
<kbrooks> PINK, PINK, PINK. FOR EVERYONE? NO
<kbrooks> FOR GIRLS? YES
<kbrooks> FOR BOYS? NO
<crimsun> um, that's immediately ETOPIC?
<bddebian> heh
<crimsun> (sorry, but I'm attempting to chase down bugs, so every flash is incredibly annoying if it's not directly related to some dev work)
<kbrooks> sts = topic_checker("I HATE THE PINK"); sts # ETOPIC; if (sts == ETOPIC) { exit(1); }
<kbrooks> :)
<bddebian> Go crimsun go..
<hub> so what is the name of dapper+1?
<yves> dappes
<spacey> Wifebeater Wombat
<bddebian> hehe
<bddebian> gonaditropis
<LaserJock> hi tritium
<LaserJock> anybody here use VNC?
<LaserJock> hmm, how is Gnome's keyboard layout set?
<Amaranth> System->Preferences->Keyboard
<crimsun> LaserJock: meaning backend?
<LaserJock> crimsun: yeah kinda
<LaserJock> I'm having problems with the keys being scrambled when I use vnc
<LaserJock> it works with openbox
<LaserJock> but Gnome is all messed up
<crimsun> sounds like an xkb issue
<LaserJock> so how would I diagnos such an issue?
<crimsun> I'm not familiar w/ gnome; ask seb later?
<LaserJock> crimsun: you don't use gnome or you don't know the inner workings?
<LaserJock> just curious
<crimsun> the latter
<crimsun> my guess is that gnome is failing to set xkb magic
<crimsun> (which is precisely the opposite of my experience w/ Xfce)
<tritium> Hi LaserJock.  Sorry, stepped away for a bit.
<ajmitch__> hi
<tritium> hello crimsun, ajmitch__
<LaserJock> hi ajmitch__
<whiprush> hi ajmitch__, crimsun, others ....
<LaserJock> hi whiprush, thanks for the muttrc, btw ;-)
<whiprush> hey crimsun, I read your wiki entry, so you're really a U professor?
<whiprush> LaserJock: dude that was like 4 weeks worth of work, heh.
<LaserJock> whiprush: yeah, I'm still trying to figure it out
<LaserJock> I'm still not sure if mutt is for me, but it sure seems cool
<whiprush> it never hurts to have a mutt config handy.
<whiprush> on a shell someplace or something
<tritium> hi whiprush
<LaserJock> well, I got procmail going which was good in any case
<ajmitch__> whiprush: you didn't know that crimsun was a professor? :)
<crimsun> whiprush: yes.
<LaserJock> I don't know what to do for an address book though
<whiprush> crimsun: I work at an .edu
<LaserJock> Prof. crimsun, MOTU ;-)
<whiprush> I think that's awesome.
<crimsun> whiprush: rock
<whiprush> I wish our faculty were as involved in oss.
<whiprush> do you give talks and stuff?
<crimsun> on floss? I wish.
<whiprush> my dean is very pro-OSS.
<tritium> whiprush: where are you?
<whiprush> I wonder what it would take to get you up here to michigan ...
<whiprush> tritium: Detroit area, Michigan, USA.
<tritium> Oh, you're at UofM?
<whiprush> ajmitch__: yeah, I didn't know.
<whiprush> no, oakland.edu
<Yagisan> bddebian: you here ?
<whiprush> about 1 hour north.
<tritium> Ah, okay.
<bddebian> Yo
<bddebian> Heya tritium
<whiprush> Most of our faculty have a linux box, but none of them really /get/ OSS.
<LaserJock> hmm, better than our faculty
<tritium> Hi bddebian :)
<whiprush> it's unfortunate, I
<Yagisan> bddebian: remember yesterday I joked about copping it if I broke my system in the dapper upgrade ?
<whiprush> MO
<bddebian> Uh oh
<truz24> How can i determine which version of dapper ( flight ) i have currently installed?
<Yagisan> bddebian: I broke the system all right
<bddebian> :-(
<Yagisan> bddebian: *no* kernels boot. old or new
<Yagisan> bddebian: and none of my boot cd's can find my lvm on raid partitions
<whiprush> crimsun: out of curiosity, is OSS part of your coursework?
<Yagisan> w00t :(
<crimsun> whiprush: yes
<bddebian> Yagisan: :-(
<nictuku> truz24, packages are pushed every day to the repositories, so
<whiprush> crimsun: man, that's totally awesome.
<truz24> So flightX isn't really a vesion, but more of a snapshot?
<Yagisan> bddebian: error is "PANIC Circular dependency. Exiting." on new kernel
<nictuku> flights are snapshots
<truz24> k
<nictuku> truz24, from what I know, yes
<Yagisan> bddebian: or endless segmentation faults on older
<truz24> was just curious if there was a file that said "this is flight5" anywhere
* Yagisan hopes the amd64 flight6 live cd will be able to fix the system
<LaserJock> whiprush: I collaborated with a Physics prof at Oakland in my undergrad research
<crimsun> whiprush: we use Hugs98, Eclipse, NachOS, Kdevelop, Minix, Linux, and Ubuntu.
<whiprush> LaserJock: wow, awesome!
<whiprush> crimsun: dude, you should come do a talk at our school.
<crimsun> they walk around with 5.10 live cds, I'm proud to say
<Yagisan> bddebian: I'm logged in via my firewall now, no X, nothing. At least it still works.
<bddebian> That sucks man, sorry
<ajmitch__> can I ask any MOTUs with spare time to review patches on https://launchpad.net/people/motureviewers/+assignedbugs & upload them?
<whiprush> crimsun: do you have a faculty page? I want to totally get you to come speak at our U (if you want to that is).
<LaserJock> ajmitch__: I can try
<crimsun> whiprush: not really.
<ajmitch__> thanks LaserJock :)
<ajmitch__> it helps keep patches coming in if we show interest in contributions
<Yagisan> bddebian: it's mocking me today. will need to put a burner on the firewall soon
<Yagisan> ajmitch__: it sure does
<whiprush> crimsun: If I got you sponsored to come speak on OSS, would you be interested?
<crimsun> whiprush: (that was in response to the page) I'd love to, but I'm extremely tight on time currently
* Yagisan must remember not to give away *all* his ubuntu cd's next time
<bddebian> ajmitch__: I might be able to try now
<LaserJock> go bddebian go!
<whiprush> crimsun: We can work something out in the future? I'm 95% sure our department would sponsor an OSS speaker, especially one in academia already.
<ajmitch__> bddebian: great!
<crimsun> whiprush: I'm certainly open to that; e-mail contact is viable.
<whiprush> crimsun: Will do so...
<whiprush> crimsun: this made my day, I've been doom and gloom about OSS in schools for months.
<LaserJock> whiprush: well, I'm certainly trying to change that in the scientific community ;-)
<crimsun> really? most of the public NC universities are pretty stalwart OSS users
<crimsun> particularly NCSU, since Red Hat is located right on their campus
<whiprush> crimsun: we're about 50 feet from Daimler-Chrysler. We teach Java and CAD. That's about it.
<whiprush> LaserJock: where are you at?
<bddebian> Oh man, look at all those EASY .desktop files I can knock out.. :-)
<LaserJock> whiprush: University of Nevada, Reno
<bddebian> Of course my Gnome is fuXX0red
<LaserJock> whiprush: Department of Chemistry :-)
<Yagisan> bddebian: yours too ? gconf2 nver configured itself
<whiprush> cool.
<Yagisan> bddebian: before the kernel decided it didn't want to restart
<LaserJock> it would be fun to have an Ubuntu Academia BOF some time
* Yagisan impatiently waits for flight6 to download
<whiprush> yeah really LaserJock
<LaserJock> all the profs in my department use macs or windows
<LaserJock> and most of the data collection is Windows
<truz24> So if each flight is a "snapshot", then why do I have to type apt-get dist-upgrade to get some of the newer packages?
<truz24> what is the difference between apt-get dist-upgrade and apt-get upgrade?
<nictuku> is OSS spread in government agencies in the US? any of you work for the government?
<nictuku> truz24, dist-upgrade is a bit more radical resolving dependencies
<truz24> ok, i noticed it was upgraded my kernel and stuff
<nictuku> see apt-get(8)
<truz24> So going from the final flight up to 6.10 will be fine with apt-get dist-upgrade and apt-get upgrade?
<truz24> or is a fresh install the best solution?
<LaserJock> dist-upgrade
<nictuku> dist-upgrade
<truz24> sweet
<LaserJock> I have never used apt-get upgrade
<truz24> I see
<truz24> so no need for the two separate commands
<nictuku> well you still need update
<nictuku> besides, consider using aptitude instead of apt-get
<nictuku> but if you want to use aptitude, ALWAYS use aptitude
<nictuku> and review pending actions, since it removes unused packages
<nictuku> some aptitude beginners have a lot of trouble with that
<Yagisan> dist-upgrade will delete .debs to make the upgrade work IIRC
<truz24> so you don't keep using more and more disk space for packages?
<whiprush> the occasional apt-get clean does the trick
<LaserJock> I think he means it will remove packages to satisfy dependencies
<LaserJock> or maybe not
<Yagisan> yes
<Yagisan> sorry - half here. try to fix my dead box
<LaserJock> I've never gotten the hang of aptitude. I always get it in an unfixable (at least for me) state fairly quickly
<truz24> So if you install flight5 and apt-get dist-upgrade to flight6, and then apt-get clean, you should use the same space on your hard disk as if you installed flight6 fresh?
<LaserJock> more or less
<nictuku> truz24, probably not because packages could grow - or it can install new packages
<truz24> So a package grows... wouldn't apt-get dist-upgrade delete the old one?
<nictuku> it can grow, it does not pile up one over the other
<whiprush> at worst, you'll maybe have an old config someplace.
<truz24> thats not *too* bad :-)
<whiprush> generally speaking though, it just works.
<nictuku> truz24, new icons could be added to gnome themes, for example
<truz24> yeah, but again, that would require the same space as if you installed flight6 fresh right?
<whiprush> If you install flight5 right now, and apt-get update and upgrade, you'll get flight6
<whiprush> or whatever is current.
<truz24> Agreed.
<whiprush> I've had the same install on my laptop since hoary.
<whiprush> there's probably a bit of cruft, but generally speaking
<whiprush> it works.
<truz24> The topic we are discussing is if you install flight5, apt-get update & upgrade, does that == fresh install of flight6
<truz24> and it seems that there might be some odd files left behind
<truz24> but nothing big
<whiprush> right
<truz24> I assume those files left behind are dynamically generated by some packages, and are not cataloged by the repositories
<Kyral> okay...dist-upgrade path definately broken
<LaserJock> Kyral: do you get EasyChem bug reports?
<Kyral> LaserJock: no..have there been?
<truz24> whiprush, so when you upgraded from hoary to breezy, did you just go into sources.lst and change all instances of hoary to breezy?
<whiprush> yep.
<LaserJock> Kyral: yeah, there was a .desktop bug
<whiprush> truz24: knowing apt and dpkg well help, sometimes there's a bug.
<Kyral> LaserJock: tell me about it
<Kyral> i prolly got the email but skipped over it
<LaserJock> Kyral: you .desktop file sucks <g>
<truz24> well, its a server install, hopefully it will be simple :-) if not i'll learn
<whiprush> if you're tracking a devel release, then knowing how dpkg works well helps a ton.
<truz24> yeah, i'm not gonna take it to the devel versions
<truz24> just from hoary to breezy
<LaserJock> Kyral: it is bug #36371
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 36371 in easychem ".desktop file is incomplete" [Minor,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/36371
<LaserJock> truz24: I'm doing a dist-upgrade right now (last time was probably ~ Flight4) 381 packages upgrade
<truz24> have you guys ever downgraded with dist-upgrade?
<LaserJock> I did once or twice. It seemed much harder but it sorta works
<LaserJock> seemed like a fresh install worked better
<Yagisan> no, but I've manually downgraded with aptitude
<Yagisan> downgrades don't seem to be really supported
<Yagisan> but they usually work
<truz24> Are there any implementations of Wakeup on Lan in ubuntu?
<truz24> I'm wanting to hibernate a couple of servers when they aren't being used, and have them startup when a lan request is made...
<Yagisan> truz24: WoL is a bios/netcard rom feature IIRC
<truz24> right, but doesn't the OS have to support it as well?
<Yagisan> truz24: better to just turn powersaving on so the spin down the drives and throttle the cpu
<truz24> powersaving can be turned on in the server distro?
<truz24> or do you mean at the bios level
<Yagisan> truz24: I turn it on. actually IIRC it was there by default when I put breezy on
<Yagisan> wish me luck people. my flight6 iso has downloaded, now to try and fix my box
<bddebian> Good luck Yagisan
<LaserJock> go Yagisan go!
<truz24> interesting.  I just upgraded the server from hoary to breezy, and did apt-get clean, and its using 20 megs less disk space :-)
* netjoined: irc.freenode.net -> brown.freenode.net
* #ubuntu-motu  [freenode-info]  if you need to send private messages, please register: http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#privmsg
<kelmo_lap> hi siretart
<siretart> hey, kelmo_lap, how are you?
<kelmo_lap> pretty good, its saturday after all :)
<siretart> :)
<siretart> kelmo_lap: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/pkgreport.cgi?src=wpasupplicant looks quite cleaned up for now :)
<kelmo_lap> now that i have had enough time to go over the just released code, i have found some minor shortcomings
<kelmo_lap> yes, it does indeed
<siretart> yes? what are they?
<kelmo_lap> well, the most critical:
<kelmo_lap>   * Remove check for wpa_cli pidfile when executing an action script. This
<kelmo_lap>     check was racy, and not always successful. Sometimes, the device was
<kelmo_lap>     marked as up without allowing the action script a chance to finish.
<kelmo_lap> this will directly impact the report that was just closed
<siretart> oh
<kelmo_lap> bug #287223
<kelmo_lap> the guy who wanted a drop in replacement for waproamd
<kelmo_lap> i am guessing he'll start exploring the action script setup soon
<kelmo_lap> he might find a small hole in it ; )
<kelmo_lap> fixed in svn
<kelmo_lap> second point i'd like to discuss quickly:
<kelmo_lap> maybe we should arrange a new debian/experimental upload, after importing all the stuff from current trunk?
<siretart> yes, I agree
<kelmo_lap> alot has changed in the last two or so days
<kelmo_lap> the i will leave you be for a little while ; )
<kelmo_lap> then*
<kelmo_lap> ok, i will prepare the experimental branch
<kelmo_lap> based on trunk
<siretart> ok. great
<kelmo> siretart: i also have some concerns about how the maintainer scripts handle removing/backing up the conffiles when they are symbolic links, this is crucial in the if-pre-up/if-post-down directories, or else ifupdowns run-parts may execute two instances of it
<Toadstool> hi here
<enyc> apparently I have to come ehre if I need to nag people about versions of packages that need updating ;-)
<enyc> ?whatis #ubuntu-motu ?
<enyc> aaaaaaaah
<mhz> enyc: it's the developers maintaining universe packages
<enyc> Masters of the Universe
<enyc> ;-)
<mhz> .)
<mhz> yeah
<mhz> M.O.T.U
<enyc> ;-)
<enyc> 1 moment....
<enyc> just testing debian freedoom deb ;-)
<enyc> that works
<enyc> (not tested extensively)
<enyc> however
<enyc> This seems silly
<enyc> Breezy and Dapper have freedoom 0.3 versions...
<enyc> Sarge and deb/unstable have freedoom 0.4.1 version...
<enyc> and the sarge freedoom deb (appears) to work fine on breezy
<enyc> (its arch-independant data)
<enyc> its unlikely to have any compatibiltiy rpbolems besides potential moved-locations-of-files
<ogra> enyc, file a bug and assign it to MOTUGames
<enyc> where/how ? ;-)
<enyc> malone something?
<DarkMageZ> enyc: https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+bugs
<enyc> right.. and launchpad _uses_ malone [?] 
<ogra> malone is a part of launchpad
<enyc> so nalone is the bugtracker?
<azeem> enyc: ys
<azeem> yes, even
<enyc> ok
<enyc> got login working....
<enyc> searched for bugs (none found)
<enyc> now writing new bug ;-)
<enyc> what I cant see is how to do the 'assign' / MOTUgames
<enyc> maybe that comes after 'add'ing the bug
<ajmitch__> yes, it does
<enyc> Umm errr...
<enyc> I can see "Assigned To" readout but not a link to actually add an assignment to the bug
<ajmitch__> isn't malone great?
<ajmitch__> click on the arrow on that details line
<enyc> aaaah ;-)
<enyc> Affects  	Status  	Severity  	Assigned To
<enyc> 	freedoom (Ubuntu) 	Unconfirmed 	Normal 	Motu Games Team
<enyc> ;-)
<enyc> done ;-)
<enyc> thanks all ;-)
<Toadstool> hub: is_computer_on() is a great idea :p
<Hobbsee> hi everyone
<ajmitch__> hi Hobbsee
<ajmitch__> how's it going?
<Hobbsee> hey ajmitch__ - well, i made it out of work tonight - they tried to lock me in!
<ajmitch__> heh
<ajmitch__> they must value your contributions ;)
<Hobbsee> well, my car in - but they forgot to add a padlock to the lock - so it was just unclippable :P
<Hobbsee> they must do...
* Hobbsee glares - 11 hours...
<ajmitch__> 11 hours?
<Hobbsee> till i have to be back in there again
<ajmitch__> ah
<ajmitch__> you sound like you're not looking forward to it :)
<Hobbsee> heh
* Hobbsee will cool off soon enough :P
* Mithrandir tickles Hobbsee 
* Hobbsee stomps on Mithrandir's foot
<Mithrandir> ouch
* Hobbsee pokes Mithrandir 
<Mithrandir> my fiancee did that last night.  Accidentially, I may add, but still.  It hurts when people do that.
* Hobbsee then goes and tickles Mithrandir 
<Hobbsee> hehe
<Mithrandir> I'm not very tickly, I'm sorry.
<Hobbsee> ah yes, one of *those* people
<Mithrandir> yeah.  Shame, isn't it?
<Hobbsee> very
* Hobbsee is very ticklish...
<ajmitch__> heh
* Yagisan finally gets his system booting
<Yagisan> hmm firefox ate my home page. This has been the upgrade from hell
<Yagisan> no menus, no taskbar, heaps of errors on a console login :(
* Yagisan picked a bad time to upgrade
<Yagisan> but on the plus side, everything from universe that was upgraded seems to work
<Hobbsee> ouch
<Yagisan> Hobbsee: oh the system would not boot for 6 hours
<Hobbsee> yuck
<Yagisan> Hobbsee: initramfs didn't genrate properly
<Hobbsee> :(
<Yagisan> Hobbsee: and I gave away all my ubuntu cd's, so had to download and amd64 livecd from my firewall, install a burner, burn it (severral times - damm coasters), and try to resuscitate it.
<Hobbsee> eek!
<Yagisan> Hobbsee: I have a big box in the middle of my screen. its blank, but the title is question. If I force kill it, the panel restarts and it comes back
<Hobbsee> lol great
<Yagisan> Hobbsee: and whatever gconf2 is, it still hasn't configured itself after 15 minutes
* Yagisan is having a bad day :(
<Yagisan> so Hobbsee, hows your day been
<Hobbsee> Yagisan: pretty good, apart from stupid centre management deciding to lock my car in :)
<Hobbsee> and mum being sick all last night
<Yagisan> Hobbsee: my misses seems to have caught something too.
<Hobbsee> :(
<Yagisan> Hobbsee: I'm just waiting to see what breaks next now
<Hobbsee> apt?
<Yagisan> Hobbsee: gconf2 and metacity won't configure, they just hang apt.
<Hobbsee> ugh
<Yagisan> Hobbsee: it seems a lot of stuff depends on gconf2 as well
<Yagisan> :(
<Hobbsee> :(
<Yagisan> Hobbsee: w00t another problem now :(
<Hobbsee> what's this one?
<Yagisan> packages hangs on removal
* Yagisan is going to get a strong drink, and prepare to sacrifice a chicken to fix the computer
<Hobbsee> hehe
<Yagisan> wb Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> ty
* Hobbsee just saw something interesting, and thought she'd congratulate those involved
<bradb> Why is it that I have a five hour old email on dapper-changes about yaboot, but I still can't see the new version when I update/dist-upgrade? I got the impression from https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BuildDaemons that the delay should be about an hour, at most.
<Toadstool> bradb: https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/dapper/+source/yaboot/+builds <-- build is pending
<bradb> Ah. I thought dapper-changes were emails about things that have changed in dapper.
<bradb> But it seems like it's more of a dapper-uploads.
<Toadstool> well, dapper-changes mail come when the package is uploaded, not when it's built
<Toadstool> *mails
<bradb> yeah. so if the build fails, nothing changes in dapper, right?
<Toadstool> yep
<Toadstool> except for the source package
<bradb> interesting
<bmonty> doko: ping
<bddebian> Heya Gang
<Yagisan>  G'day bddebian
<bddebian> Heya Yagisan, any luck?
<Yagisan> bddebian: got the system booting again, now trying to clean up the mess from a failed dapper upgrade
<bddebian> Yagisan: Great
<bmonty> hey bddebian
<Yagisan> bddebian: not really. several packages hang in config stage
<bddebian> Oh Ugh
<bddebian> Heya bmonty
<Yagisan> bddebian: and as luck would have it, those are needed by most of gnome
<bmonty> wow, is malone actually aggregating changes to bugs into a single email?
<Toadstool> bmonty: there's a 5 minutes cache to avoid flooding ubuntu-bugs
<bmonty> Toadstool: cool, it is a very welcome change
<Toadstool> yep :)
<truz24> mmm, how come this is redirecting to the ISO? : http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/releases/dapper/flight-6/dapper-live-i386.iso.torrent
<Yagisan> bddebian: :( http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/11242 the packages that are causing all the trouble
<bddebian> WTF?
<Yagisan> bddebian: yes, that's exactly what I'm thinking too
<bddebian> I assume you have tried apt-get -f install?
<Yagisan> bddebian: nope. they hang and need a Ctrl+C
<bddebian> Ugh
<Yagisan> Do I win a prize ?
<bddebian> heh, sure :-)
<Yagisan> bugger it. I'll see if I can downgrade the system
<truz24> has anyone noticed a big performance gain going from i386 to amd64 versions on their amd?
<Yagisan> truz24: for what workload ?
<truz24> any
<truz24> Aren't there still a lot of packages that don't have a 64 bit equivalent?
<Yagisan> truz24: well depending on what you use it for you won't see any improvement
<Yagisan> truz24: not really. You can run those in an i386 chroot very easily
<siretart> Yagisan: amd64 has twice as much registers available compared to x86
<truz24> but thats one additional step that the i386 install doesn't need...
<siretart> truz24: If you are asking question like this, I suspect you are better off with an i386 install
<truz24> ok
<Yagisan> siretart: I know. It also has a 1 byte overhead on instructions so cache is slightly less effective in 64bit mode,
<Yagisan> siretart: if he's after something cpu bound it will help, otherwise no, he should go with i386
<siretart> Yagisan: 64bit instructions and pointers are twice as big as their 32bit equivalents, so his caches will fill up faster
<siretart> Yagisan: so even on cpu bound application, there might be a performance loss.
<Yagisan> siretart: yes, but usually the throughput in 64bit mode overcomes that small loss
<Yagisan> bbs - hope my box comes back up after this reboot
<truz24> Dapper flight 5 or 6 does not boot on my machine, but 5.10 does... anything new that might cause this?
<truz24> flight5 & 6 just hang on the initial ubuntu splash screen
<truz24> and doesn't display the "what type of install do you want" text
<cyberix> slomo_: Are you there?
<slomo_> cyberix: yes
<cyberix> slomo_: GNUnet 0.7.0c has some really important fixes for bugs in 0.7.0b
<cyberix> slomo_: We were wondering, if they are bad enought so 0.7.0c could still make it to Dapper.
<slomo_> cyberix: no idea :) but in any case you have to file a UVF exception... read https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-motu/2006-February/000545.html
<cyberix> slomo_: UVF?
<cyberix> Ubuntu Version Freeze?
<crimsun> upstream
<paniq> what the hell
<paniq> www.ubuntustudio.com
<jdong> paniq, april fools!
<paniq> yes
<paniq> obviously
<paniq> i got fooled
<paniq> i wrote the fruityloops guys an angry email!
<slomo_> paniq: ubuntustudio is older and real ;)
<paniq> i called them assholes
<slomo_> oh...
<paniq> oh no :(
<paniq> i thought its some kind of domain snagging
<slomo_> the forward to FL is new
<slomo_> dolson: do you know anything about this? :)
<paniq> ok
<paniq> another thing
<paniq> i want to provide LASH to ubuntu
<paniq> i just installed ubuntu yesterday, so i have no idea how to do it
<paniq> i already learned how to use checkinstall
<slomo_> paniq: what's LASH?
<truz24> How can I diagnose a boot up freeze ?
<paniq> slomo: linux audio session handler
<paniq> slomo: its basically the new ladcca
<slomo_> paniq: cool :)
<truz24> When I insert 5.10 it boots up fine... but 6.6 flight 5 and 6 freeze on the "select type of install" screen
<paniq> dave robillard is working on it, and i am helping to get it around
<slomo_> paniq: for packaging look here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/Packaging
<paniq> hum
<paniq> kubuntu? ;)
<slomo_> paniq: look at the pages below :)
<paniq> ok
<paniq> i will deal with this later ;)
<paniq> hmm
<paniq> alsa sequencer is not supported by default in ubuntu?
<cyberix> slomo_: Is this ok? https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/gnunet/+bug/37611/+index
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 37611 in gnunet "UVF Exception 0.7.0b -> 0.7.0c" [Normal,Unconfirmed] 
<slomo_> cyberix: hm no... get the new and the old tarball, get a diffstat from the old to new and a diff of the changelog in there
<slomo_> diff -Naur old new | diffstat
<slomo_> and diff -Nau old/ChangeLog new/ChangeLog or similar
<bddebian> What are we supposed to do with bugs that have been upload to REVU?
<bddebian> I.E. just missing .desktop files?
<bddebian> Should we "review" them per REVU or just take the fix in Malone and upload?
<bddebian> dolson: ping?
<bddebian> Hey, wake up people. :)
<cyberix> slomo_: Now?
<LaserJock> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Heya LaserJock
<LaserJock> I'd think if there is a problem with the package on REVU you could review it,etc. If it isn't on REVU but a debdiff is attached in Malone, I'd use that I guess
<bddebian> LaserJock: There is a diff on REVU but it's wrong.  But it's an easy fix so.. ?
<LaserJock> I'd say it is up to you then ;-)
<LaserJock> I'd probably just fix it and upload but also provide a comment on REVU
<bddebian> Aye, that's what I'm doing now :)
<LaserJock> bddebian: you probably just want to make it clear that you already uploaded it so then don't need to update
<bddebian> Aye
<G0SUB> is there _any_ way to get a NEW package for Dapper?
<LaserJock> yeah
<G0SUB> it's a trivial package
<G0SUB> LaserJock: what's the procedure?
<LaserJock> Not sure at the moment, dholbach was thinking of doing something similar to UVF exceptions
<G0SUB> hmm
<G0SUB> LaserJock: should I put it up on REVU?
<crimsun> yes
<LaserJock> why not? It should probably go there regardless
<G0SUB> yes, but it's important that the package is in Dapper
<LaserJock> but after it is reviewed it can be decided whether to put it in Dapper or not
<G0SUB> LaserJock: ok
<G0SUB> it's kmfl.sf.net ... a very important Input Method for us
* Yagisan sighs. time to give up and wipe the box now
<bddebian> :'-(
<Yagisan> I don't even have working X any more
<Yagisan> must remember to get gpg key and evoulution mail + accounts
<Yagisan> flight 6 install ok ?
<G0SUB> Yagisan: agh! what's the issue?
<Yagisan> G0SUB: I've been moaning on here for about 24hrs about the dapper upgrade from hell
<G0SUB> Yagisan: oh! this happened to me too when I upgraded ... I thankfully have my /home in a different partition
<Yagisan> G0SUB: I have / /boot /usr /opt /home /var and /tmp all different, but on lvm
<Yagisan> G0SUB: I learned today that most rescue disk and cd's can't read lvm :(
<Yagisan> or at least lvm on md
<G0SUB> yeah
<G0SUB> agh! md
<Yagisan> yes it was a server I screwed
<Yagisan> and not just any, but my ltsp server
<Yagisan> w00t
<Yagisan> the only working system here was the firewall
<G0SUB> hehe
<Yagisan> with no kb, monitor, or burner
<Yagisan> G0SUB: 1st initramfs failed to generate. needed the amd64 dapper live cd to fix that
<Yagisan> G0SUB: then about 15-16 odd packages failed to configure
<G0SUB> that's sad
<Yagisan> G0SUB: they were things like dbus, gconf2 etc ie the bits everything else depends on
<G0SUB> eeks
<Yagisan> G0SUB: and a downgrade failed
<Yagisan> G0SUB: because gconf2 was changed and had a hissy fit over which gconf2 owned a file
<Yagisan> G0SUB: so nothing could downgrade because of tight version dependencys on the f*ck gconf2
* Yagisan smacks head on desk
<Yagisan> which brings me to my question
<G0SUB> Yagisan: did you try pinning gconf2 to an older version?
<Yagisan> any reported issues with a flight 6 installed system
<Yagisan> G0SUB: it would not downgrade
<Yagisan> G0SUB: and the dapper packages would not install with the breezy version
<G0SUB> hmm
<G0SUB> Yagisan: I am in Dapper atm ... I don't see any issues as such
<Yagisan> G0SUB: multi-lingual ?
<G0SUB> Yagisan: multi-lingual ?
<Yagisan> that's partly why I wanted to upgrade.
<Yagisan> G0SUB: I need english + CJK
<G0SUB> Yagisan: I have English + Indic
<Yagisan> J for me, C, and K for the don't park in my car space notes I find I have to write
<G0SUB> hehe
<Yagisan> G0SUB: the shop downstars really doesn't get the fact that my car space is for *my* customers, not theirs
<G0SUB> Yagisan: haha
<Yagisan> G0SUB: thats what I say when I'm playing with my keys >:)
<Yagisan> right, time for me to go. lets see what else goes wrong. I bet my cd's will become coasters next
<Yagisan> or the burner will die
<bddebian> What are you folks using for switches to dpkg-buildpackage/debuild these days?
<LaserJock> bddebian: I just use debuild -S or debuild -S -sa for including .orig.tar.gz
<LaserJock> bddebian: -k if I need to sponsor somebody's upload
<LaserJock> bddebian: and -v if I'm doing a fakesync ;-)
<bddebian> LaserJock: I was talking about for a binary build but no worries :-)
<LaserJock> pbuilder all the way :-)
<bddebian> pfft :-)
<LaserJock> bddebian: I'm just providing some noise so you don't think you're alone.
<bddebian> Thanks :-)
<LaserJock> I don't think I've ever actually used dpkg-buildpackage directly to build a binary
<inflate> hello, somebody know how I can 'remaster' (k)ubuntu install CD? I want to add/remove some packages from CD to fill my needs, any help?
<bddebian> inflate: Not me sorry :-(
<inflate> well, the question is for all, not for you only :)
<inflate> I know about this: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/InstallCDCustomizationHowTo
<inflate> but it's not working
<LaserJock> inflate: that question has come up a few times here and I honestly don't know that anybody here will be much help.
<LaserJock> inflate: You might have better luck on a mailing list perhaps
<inflate> ok, but another question
<inflate> how can I build the installer?
<inflate> I've downloaded it and compiled
<inflate> but I don't know how to merge it with packages
<LaserJock> are you talking about debian-installer?
<inflate> yes
<LaserJock> so you downloaded the source package?
<inflate> yes, also compiled them, and I've a small repository which contain packages I need,
<inflate> but I don't know how to merge installer with repository
<LaserJock> hmm, well I have no idea. I've never messed around with d-i before
<LaserJock> I'm not sure what you are trying to do
<inflate> what I wnat exactly is to create a modified version of kubuntu, the default package selection on ubuntu doesn't fill my needs
<inflate> I need more packages
<inflate> and I want to remove the 100MB of lang-packs
<inflate> I tried to use the article mentioned here https://wiki.ubuntu.com/InstallCDCustomizationHowTo
<inflate> but it's not working
<LaserJock> ok, how often do you want to do that?
<inflate> well, this is what I'm asking about, the article's way isn't working, so I need another way
<LaserJock> I'd just modify the kubuntu-desktop meta package
<LaserJock> or provide a kubuntu-inflate-desktop meta package ;-)
<inflate> :)
<inflate> really i tried
<inflate> installer worked normally, and install the base system
<inflate> and the kernel + usplash too
<inflate> but it skip kubuntu-desktop package
<LaserJock> perhaps because it's dependecies were not met
<bddebian> Hmm, should .ui files changes have a proper "debian patch" or just hack the source?
<akulah> I have a question
<LaserJock> inflate: what I would do (and am thinking of doing this in the future) is create my own -desktop meta package
<akulah> anybody want to help me?
<G0SUB> akulah: sure. just ask
<LaserJock> inflate: and then remove the installed -desktop package and install mine after install
<bddebian> akulah: Just ask.  Don't ask to ask.  If we can help you we will :-)
<inflate> as I told you, i've done this, also I tested it in a chroot environment
<inflate> all dependencies are there
<akulah> ok
<akulah> I'm a MOTU wanabe
<LaserJock> inflate: so what happened?
<LaserJock> akulah: great!
<akulah> if i've created some packages what I have to upload to revu?
<G0SUB> akulah: excellent
<akulah> th binaey package
<akulah> ?
<akulah> binary package?
<inflate> as I told you, installer skip -desktop meta package
<LaserJock> akulah: no the source package is what you need to upload
<akulah> aha
<akulah> ok tnx
<G0SUB> akulah: the orig.tar.gz, the .dsc, the diff.gz
<inflate> I checked all logs, nothing about non met deps
<LaserJock> inflate: no, I'm saying don't mess with the installer or the cd, do it after you install with a regular cd
<LaserJock> akulah: you need your gpg key added to the REVU keyring before you can upload though. Have you seen wiki.ubuntu.com/REVU?
<akulah> yes
<akulah> I've added my key
<inflate> I don't understand, you mean the official cd, or the modified cd?
<LaserJock> inflate: official cd
<LaserJock> inflate: I wouldn't make a modified cd is what I'm saying. I wouldn't bother
<akulah> I have received the confirmation email today
<LaserJock> akulah: great
<inflate> well, thanks for help
<LaserJock> akulah: then you are set to upload. just use "dput revu <package>_source.changes"
<LaserJock> inflate: you would have to modify each install cd in the future, which would be a pain
<LaserJock> inflate: you should be able to do everything you want with a metapackage
<inflate> yes I know, but, I like to learn how things happen, and I want to learn from this more than only modifying kubuntu
<inflate> also, my internet connection is limit
<inflate> so i dont want to download packages every day
<inflate> using a modified cd, i do it once
<LaserJock> you wouldn't have to
<LaserJock> anyway, if you want the educational experience go for it.
<inflate> well, it wil continue trying, may be I can discover what is the problem, and also fix the howto in wiki ;)
<LaserJock> yeah, that would be great. Seems like a few people have had problems with the wiki page.
<inflate> gtg, thank you very much LaserJock
<LaserJock> hmm, I'm not feeling very helpful this morning. Maybe I just need to shut up :/
<bddebian> Damn I feel rusty.. :'-(
<crimsun> don't worry, there are 9300 other bugs you can unrust with
<bddebian> Heh, so I've noticed :-)
<kimo_> I am a motu-wannabe :)
<kimo_> Any master want to take my hand
<LaserJock> kimo_: well, we don't do hand holding here ;-)
<LaserJock> kimo_: but we can certainly help you and get you going in the right direction
<kimo_> LaserJock: please do :)
<kimo_> I just subscribed on the mailing list
<kimo_> I would just like to know if I have to be a developer ?
<kimo_> I can read code, but I am not a programmer per se
<LaserJock> no, I'm not much of a programmer either
<kimo_> ok that's relefing
<kimo_> great .. I am on the list .. what's the first thing I can do
<kimo_> I have read the wiki for about an hour now .. it does seem too complex :)
<LaserJock> I would take a look at both the Ubuntu Packaging Guide (at doc.ubuntu.com) and the Debian New Maintainer's Guide (at the bottom of www.debian.org/devel/)
<Kyral> Hey guys :D
<kimo_> ok ... afterwards .. like what's the simplest thing I can start to help with
<Kyral> I may be running ArchLinux on my Desktop
<Kyral> but I'm still spreading UBuntu lol (Gave out like 10 Shipit CDs at the Clarkson Open House :D)
<Kyral> oh LJ I saw that bug
<Kyral> I'll apply the patch as soon as I make a Dapper VM to work in
<LaserJock> kimo_: I'd say that doing some bug work at this point would be helpful.
<LaserJock> Kyral: Arch? only Arch? You sound like me now :(
<Kyral> huh?
<LaserJock> Kyral: I fired up my Ubuntu box for the first time in weeks today
<Kyral> LaserJock: I still run Xubuntu on my laptop..and my server is powered by Xen Breezy
<LaserJock> Kyral: I've been using OSX and Windows almost exclusively
<Kyral> Just wanted to try something out :D
<Kyral> can't get complacent now can I?
<LaserJock> nope
<Kyral> meh the latest NVidia drivers are causing my system to freeze
<Kyral> wonder if 7676 will work
<kimo_> LaserJock: how do I start on this bug work ?
<kimo_> ok .. just noticed last section of maintiners guide is on bug fixing
<Kyral> I must say....Arch makes me realize how much Ubuntu autoconfigures (or remember rather lol)
<Tm_T> ugh
<Tm_T> there's one thing we need, some kde4 extras, just sowe can say "we have it, you don't" ;)
<Tm_T> not very useful but so what
<kimo_> Kyral: then why do u enjoy Arch ?
<Kyral> kimo_: its a new experiance :P
<Kyral> Different way of doing things
<kimo_> ahh ..
<Kyral> I mean I know Ubuntu and Debian in and out
* kimo_ remembers the rush of Gentoo
<Kyral> practically
* kimo_ envies Kyral ;)
<Kyral> why?
<Kyral> I will still "work" for Ubuntu :P
<kimo_> I am an RHCE, pretty confy with redhat, but I am a noob with debian
<kimo_> wish I could say I know debian in & out :)
<kimo_> but I'm trying
<LaserJock> kimo_: I moved from Gentoo to Ubuntu
<LaserJock> kimo_: wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuBugDay has some good bug fixing info/links
<kimo_> LaserJock: ok thnx
<kimo_> why are the motus only 38!
<kimo_> is it too difficult, or simply no people are wanting to become motus
<bddebian> There's only 38 MOTUs?
<bddebian> That doesn't sound right
<kimo_> just read it on the wiki
<kimo_> maybe it's outdated
<bddebian> I suppose it's possible
* bddebian has only counted as like .00001 MOTU for Dapper :'-(
<Mithrandir> bddebian: you still have time to count as more!
<bddebian> Mithrandir: I'm uploading away man.. :-)
<Mithrandir> bddebian: good. :-)
<bddebian> Probably all wrong, but I'm a uploadin' ;-P
<LaserJock> kimo_: there are 40 MOTUs listed on launchpad (https://launchpad.net/people/ubuntu-dev) but I'd say that only half are really "active" at any given time
<bddebian> Yeah, we can't all be stars all the time like LaserJock ;-)
<crimsun> or bddebian ;-)
<bddebian> Heh, I was going to say crimsun but I wasn't sure if you were here.. Bastage :-)
<LaserJock> lol
<LaserJock> unfortunately I haven't really figured out a good way to be here 24 hours a day, yet
<crimsun> it's my masterful idling
<truz24> Have you guys heard of 6.6 hanging on the "select type of install" screen?
<LaserJock> yes, I need to master that. I get so distracted here that I don't get any work done :(
<truz24> it works on my laptop, but not on my desktop machine, wondering what i could disable in the bios to let it through
<truz24> 5.10 works on the desktop
<truz24> its sitting at this screen: http://www.howtoforge.com/images/perfect_setup_ubuntu_5.10_/img_1.gif
<truz24> but without any of the text, only the ubuntu logo
<LaserJock> hmm, did you restart?
<truz24> several times
<truz24> the thing that is odd, is that 5.10 install disc works fine
<truz24> i guess i could install 5.10 and then upgrade to dapper
<truz24> also, the dapper install cd works fine on my laptop
<truz24> so its some hardware conflict i assume
#ubuntu-motu 2006-04-07
<Pupeno-> Hello.
<crimsun> hi.
<Pupeno-> Does anybody know what might be causing this error: http://paste.lisp.org/display/18522 ?
<Pupeno-> I am currently uploading the package for all to see, but it'll take a while on my dialup.
<crimsun> is emacs21 installed?
<bddebian> The emacs lisp crap isn't installed?
<crimsun> i.e., why dpkg -i ?
<crimsun> is erlang-base installed?
<Pupeno-> crimsun: emacs21 is installed.
<Pupeno-> bddebian: the package didn't have a problem untill I upgraded so I supouse the emacs lisp *crap* is installed.
<Pupeno-> crimsun: how else should I install a .deb ?
<Pupeno-> crimsun: erlang-base is installed.
<Pupeno-> Note: this is a package I am building (actually, upgrading).
<crimsun> Pupeno-: I presume erlang is already installed, then.
<crimsun> i.e., what are the differences in the postinsts?
<Pupeno-> crimsun: I am installing erlang. Erlang is the package I am making.
<Pupeno-> crimsun: none, I kept the debian directory as is. I only got rid of most of the patches to the rest of the tree (most were patched upstream).
<crimsun> Pupeno-: dpkg -l erlang|grep ^ii
<Pupeno-> $ dpkg -l erlang|grep ^ii
<Pupeno-> ii  erlang         10.b.10        A real-time, concurrent and distributed functional language
<crimsun> it installed just fine. You just need to check the emacs policy to make sure the site-locals are correct.
<crimsun> (I'm not familiar w/ emacs policy)
<Pupeno-> crimsun: I know it finishes installing, but emacs complaints, the original version didn't have that problem.
<Pupeno-> ok.
<crimsun> Pupeno-: then you should ask in an emacs-related channel; this one's not really appropriate.
<crimsun> I don't know offhand who our emacs gurus are, so I can't point you to them readily
* Pupeno- bets that in #emacs they say that it is not an appropriate channel, that I should I ask in my distribution channel.
<Pupeno-> but I'll try anyway.
<bddebian> It certainly isn't me, I'm a nano fan.. :-)
<crimsun> mm buildd screwage.
<crimsun> http://librarian.launchpad.net/1834920/buildlog_ubuntu-dapper-i386.linuxdcpp_0.0.1.cvs20060116-1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<bddebian> Nice
<bddebian> better tell infinity :-)
<crimsun> even worse, I spent 1 hour futzing with migrating pbuilder only to discover pmount's flags prevented that (nothing sudo mount -o remount,.. doesn't fix), and then I discover that linuxdcpp builds just fine. Blarg.
<bddebian> Doh
<enyc> urrm
<enyc> ?where is the UVF-exception precess described/detailed ?
<crimsun> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-motu/2006-February/000545.html
<bddebian> crimsun: You there?
<bddebian> Someone help, I need a dpatch refresher :-)
<LaserJock> bddebian: you're on a roll dude
<LaserJock> bddebian: what do you need?
<bddebian> LaserJock: I got it, never mind.  I couldn't remember dpatch-edit-patch for some reason?? :-(  Thanks though~
<bddebian> !
<LaserJock> ah, yes, fun-n-games with dpatch ;-)
<Toadstool> 'night here
<bddebian> Ack what do I do with this piece of crap that doesn't have a dirs file?
<LaserJock> something like install -d perhaps
<bddebian> I was thinking that
<bddebian> It creates the debian/usr/share/applications but doesn't install it.. :-(
<LaserJock> you did install -d on the directory or file?
<bddebian> Neither it was a patch on Malone.  He just added dh_install... and dh_desktop
<bmonty> hi LaserJock, bddebian
<LaserJock> hi bmonty!
<bmonty> bddebian: are you working on packages again?
<bmonty> LaserJock: how are things going?
<LaserJock> bmonty: oh, very busy. Got tons of stuff to do. And you?
<bmonty> very busy as well....seems like every day this week, by the time I get home I only feel like going to sleep :(
<LaserJock> yep
<bddebian> bmonty: Moi?  No never :-)
<bmonty> hmm..I hope bluefoxicity comes back...I've got openldap+kerberos running on my network and I am thinking about writing a spec for dapper+1
<dolson> bddebian: I am here now...
<dolson> slomo__: ah yes, that was my doing. :D
<crimsun> bddebian: pong
<crimsun> bddebian: unpong
<bddebian> Ugh?
<bddebian> Oh
<bddebian> Jesus, maelstroms rules file is a freakin' mess
<rami> \q
<dolson> bddebian: hey.. I was using diff. I never heard of debbdiff before
<bddebian> dolson: Well it appears that you are diffing against an empty directory or something.  Everything looks like it's coming in as a new file.
<bddebian> dolson: Check out debdiff.  After you build a package you can just debdiff the resulting .dsc or .deb against the original
<dolson> that's weird... I made patches before that next had that problem
<LaserJock> hi seth
<bddebian> dolson: What do you use with diff?  -Nurp?
<dolson> yeah
<bddebian> Hmm
<LaserJock> hmm, I usually use -Naur or -ruN (that one is easy to remember)
<dolson> -purN is like porn, but with a u
<LaserJock> hmm, ok I didn't really want that picture ("check out the diff pr0n")  ;-)
<dolson> put that in your doc
<bddebian> heh
<truz24> LaserJock, So I got dapper installed by installing breezy and then upgrading to dapper... but now it says xorg won't start because xorg isn't setup correctly, is it because my video card is too new ( ati x700 )
<LaserJock> hmm, not sure
<LaserJock> did it work with breezy?
<truz24> no
<truz24> I was hoping it would be fixed in dapper :-)
<hub> truz24: what if you force to ati driver?
<LaserJock> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/?action=fullsearch&context=180&value=x700&fullsearch=Text might be promising
<hub> truz24: the problem with video cards is that it is not simple
<truz24> lspci |grep ati shows "ati tech ... Unknown device "
<hub> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/HardwareSupportComponentsVideoCards?highlight=%28x700%29
<hub> but you are out of luck
<hub> kick ATI for that
<truz24> how do i force it to use "ati"
<hub> you need to edit the xorg.conf file
<truz24> isn't there a dpkg-reconfigure way to do it ?
<hub> see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BinaryDriverHowto
<truz24> its been a looong time since i've had to configure x manually
<hub> end https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BinaryDriverHowto/ATI
<truz24> yeah, i saw the redirect too
<truz24> sudo dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xorg -- thats what i was thinking of :-)
<truz24> hub, thanks, i am up and going in xorg now :-)
<truz24> I just used the fglrx driver
<persia> About .desktop bugs: some time ago I filed a bunch, and was uploading patches, but was asked to stop.  I've seen quite a few uploads with the new .desktop files in the past few days.  May I resume creating/fixing .desktop files & drafting patches to packages?
<bddebian> persia: Hmm, uh oh, maybe that was my mistake.  Am I not supposed to be uploading them? :)
<persia> I don't know.  I think they should be fixed, but the stated reason to avoid fixing them in Ubuntu was that it increased the load on those coordinating with Debian, and broke automatic sync from sid.
<bddebian> Great, I'm probably in trouble again :-)
<persia> bddebian: Maybe it's a timing question.  I started my mass effort before the freeze, and was only asked to stop after opening >40 bugs in a single day :)
<bddebian> Well, shit.. :-(
<truz24> lol
* bddebian crawls back into his hole
* Kyral grabs bddebian
<ajmitch__> hey Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> hey ajmitch__
* Kyral yawns
<Kyral> Shower felt good :D
* Hobbsee is about to lose her connection again, she suspects...
<Kyral> lol
<Hobbsee> off to fix the phone...
* Kyral glues Hobbsee to the internet
<bddebian> persia: ajmitch__ might know, he knows everything :-)
<Hobbsee> or not...woot!
* Hobbsee is now glued!
<Hobbsee> phone has to work - dad just called from teh US
<persia> ajmitch_: Do you know if fixes for .desktop files for Dapper are welcome?
<Kyral> lol
<Kyral> talk about long distance :D
<Kyral> oh that reminds me
<Kyral> LaserJock: go ahead and upload that patch to EasyChem
<Kyral> I cannot apply it right now for obvious reasons
<LaserJock> persia: they are
<persia> LaserJock: Thanks.  I'll make some more, and upload patches.  If bddebian is allowed out of his hole, he'll probably upload them :)
<Kyral> LJ?
<LaserJock> yeah
* Kyral points to above
<LaserJock> yeah, yeah, yeah ;-)
<Kyral> 'cause yanno, its hard to build debpacks on ArchLinux :P
<Kyral> I'll start using Kubuntu again when Dapper+1 opens :D
<LaserJock> Kyral: it's called dual booting
<Kyral> you should talk....
<LaserJock> Kyral: heh, I'm versatile.
<Kyral> and I'm curious....
<Kyral> and that sounded sketchy
<bddebian> persia: No, thank YOU :-)
<bddebian> OK, it's 2am now with daylight savings.  Gnight folks
<LaserJock> cya bddebian
<Amaranth> crap, that's tonight
<Amaranth> at 1am it jumps to 2am, right?
<Kyral> huhwha?
<Kyral> in the US?
<ajmitch__> probably
<Kyral> what time is it? UTC?
<robitaille> yes, US is change time tonight
<robitaille> s/change/changing
<Kyral> someone just tell me what time it is Eastern so I can set my clock lol
<Kyral> already screwed up my system clocl
<robitaille> I think it should 2:18am in the east...with the time change already done
* Kyral wonders why his other devices didn't change yet...
<Kyral> meh I'll just let my computer take care of it...
<Hobbsee> hehe
<Hobbsee> just make sure you turn up to work/whatever at teh right time
<Kyral> stupid DST
<Kyral> only thing tomorrow is Church
<Kyral> I mean my Cell hasn't "turned over" yet
<Hobbsee> yeah, well it's worth being on time to that...
<robitaille> I'm sure my kids will wake me up at the "wrong" time anyway tomorrow morning...
<Kyral> maybe it takes affect at 2 AM?
<ajmitch__> Kyral: it usually does
<Kyral> MEH! Why did they even invent DST?!
<ajmitch__> to confuse people like you
* Kyral wants to shoot whoever came up with the idea
<Kyral> ....
* Hobbsee watches with amusement as a few people try to find her, from the net...
<Kyral> are you calling me a simpleton
<ajmitch__> Hobbsee: stalkers?
<Hobbsee> ajmitch__: just idiots - doubt they'd stalk
<Hobbsee> besides, i'm unfindable
<ajmitch__> heh
<Hobbsee> hehe
<Hobbsee> well, mostly
* ajmitch__ doesn't really feel like trying :)
<Hobbsee> :P
<Kyral> Screw it I'm going to bed
<Hobbsee> well, when you visit up here, you can have a location, then i'll meet you.
<Hobbsee> night Kyral...
<ajmitch__> Hobbsee: most likely the airport, knowing me :)
<ajmitch__> night Kyral
<Hobbsee> ack...
<ajmitch__> Hobbsee: it turns out that it'll probably be cheapest for me to fly to melbourne via sydney
* Hobbsee doesnt want to go to the airport which is very far away!
<Hobbsee> ah ok, yep
<ajmitch__> yeah
* ajmitch__ could catch the train in
<Hobbsee> true
<ajmitch__> since the train does stop right at the international & domestic terminals, iirc
<Hobbsee> that is true
<ajmitch__> though you'll probably get your key signed before then :)
<Hobbsee> possibly...
<StevenK> Hobbsee: I'll sign your key if you like.
<Hobbsee> StevenK: oh goody, when?
* StevenK comes back from swimming and bathing the puppy.
<StevenK> Hobbsee: Whenever we meet up for lunch or something
* StevenK still needs to add his Ubuntu address to his key.
<StevenK> Whee, Debian has built 91% of the amd64 archive.
<ajmitch__> not bad
<ajmitch__> it should be mostly usable now
* StevenK nods.
<StevenK> I'm waiting for the magical 95% mark before I build a sid-amd64 chroot.
<ajmitch__> we just need bddebian to do hurd-amd64
<StevenK> Ugh, hurd
<Lathiat> anyone knwo any kernel patches to hdie user processes from each other?
<Lathiat> no grsec for 2.6.15/16 :(
<kelmo> i hear sony have done that before
<Lathiat> haha
<Lathiat> nahlike, so you can only see your own processes
<Lathiat> and root can see all
<crimsun> the /proc patch originally from openwall?
<crimsun> SD/openwall
<freeflying> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2232 --< looking for review
<Toadstool> hi here
<TomaszD> I'm probably the hundreth person to ask, but why isn't, for example, Wine 0.9.11 being UVF-exceptioned? It might do more good than harm to upload a newer version. I know you guys focus on bugfixing now, but still. Are there no UVF exceptions given in this period?
<bmonty> TomaszD: it may be that nobody has had time to write up the exception
<enyc> Hrrrm.... ? where are UVF-exception requests made/listed ?
<bmonty> enyc: you create a new bug in malone with info on the new package, see https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-motu/2006-February/000545.html
<Toadstool> enyc: https://launchpad.net/people/motu-uvf/+assignedbugs for the list
<enyc> bmonty: thatnks ;-)
<enyc> Toadstool: thanks ;-)
<enyc> evidently the bug I filed whichi generated a reply sayintg they will request a UVF exception.... has not had the UVF requested yet ;-)
<TomaszD> bmonty, I see that a mortal like me isn't really able to ask for an UVF exception, given that one needs to attach a "diffstat" and such. What can I do then, I'd really like to see a more up-to-date version of wine in Ubuntu's universe...
<bmonty> TomaszD: do you know how to create debdiffs?
<TomaszD> bmonty, if I knew what all this https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-motu/2006-February/000545.html means, then I wouldn't even ask about anything and went ahead to produce a correct uvf exception request :)
<bmonty> TomaszD: does debian have the new version of wine packaged?
<TomaszD> bmonty, will check.
<Toadstool> nope, current debian version is 0.9.10-1
<TomaszD> yeah
<TomaszD> damn it
<TomaszD> I have to go
<TomaszD> bbl
<bmonty> looks like our version of wine is from july
<bmonty> hey bddebian
<bddebian> Heya bmonty
<bddebian> Are lamont's pages stil the place to look at the build logs?
<bmonty> bddebian: its in launchpad now
<bmonty> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu
<bddebian> I'm already there.  Now what? :-)
<bmonty> type the name of the source package
<bddebian> Oh View Builds maybe? :-)
<bmonty> that too
<bmonty> there are several ways to get to the build logs for a package
<bmonty> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/dapper/+source/<source package name>
<bddebian> Hmm, I think lamont's pages may actually have been more concise :-)
<bmonty> bddebian: I agree
<bddebian> You what would be awesome would be to have it e-mail the uploader back with the results for each arc :-)
<bddebian> Err arch even
<bmonty> bddebian: you could open a wishlist bug against malone for that...I'd add a +1 for it :)
<bmonty> s/malone/launchpad
<bddebian> :-)
<bmonty> hmm...I think that it would be better to not ask for a UVF for wine and then use backports for new versions
<bmonty> they release a new version almost every week it seems
<bddebian> Gotta keep up with the Windows bugs ya know :-)
<bmonty> :)
<bddebian> Hmm look at more bugs or play Morrowind....
<spacey> please don't use 0.9.10
<spacey> it has some regressions
<spacey> i'm more happy with 0.9.9
<spacey> :)
* spacey filing bugs for that is still on my todo
<spacey> 0.9.11 is already out btw
<bddebian> bmonty: How are you using dolson's patches? (REVU)?
<bddebian> Or do you grab the .dsc and such and build that way?
<bmonty> bddebian: I usually grab the dapper packages and apply his patches to them
<bmonty> a LOT of the patches in malone require you to figure out what they did and apply them manually
<bddebian> bmonty: Ah, OK
<bddebian> WTF, I upload a bunch of stuff and close bugs and my karma goes down? :'-(
* Yagisan waves a tired hello
<bddebian> Heya Yagisan
<bddebian> If these bugs are tagged as In Progress, does that mean someone is actually working on them?
<Yagisan> bddebian: yes
<Yagisan> bddebian: I'm having a shit weekend :(
<bddebian> :-(
<freeflying> anyone tell me how to write manpage
<bddebian> freeflying: Try help2man first, it makes it much easier :-)
<Yagisan> bddebian: my dvd burner has now stopped too
<bddebian> Who is Jonathan Patrick?
<bddebian> Yagisan: d00d :-(
<Yagisan> freeflying: I did mine in xml
<freeflying> Yagisan: I'm cofused which will be the easiest :)
<Yagisan> freeflying: you'll need to look up deng on revu though. My system was fubared upgrading to dapper, so I don't have a handy link
<Yagisan> bddebian: yeah, "only" 150GB more to go
<freeflying> Yagisan: thx
<freeflying> bddebian: thx
<bddebian> NP
<Yagisan> bddebian: have a dvd-burner ?
<bmonty> Yagisan: what are you using to burn dvds?
<Yagisan> k3b
<bmonty> which is a frontend for growisofs, yes?
<bmonty> anyone know what package generates the update applet in the notification area?
<Yagisan> bmonty: probably. the physical burner itself is buggered though
<Yagisan> bmonty: syslog is full of errors from it. and not reading anything is a dead give away
<Yagisan> hmm. lite-on dvd burners - any good ?
<pef> Yagisan: depends on what you mean by "good" :)
<freeflying> I wonder if I must provide manpage for a library package
<Yagisan> pef: no overheating issues, can read the disks they burn, can read disks burned in other machines, don't fill syslog with errors trying to read pressed cd's and dvds that work in other units fine
<pef> Yagisan: do you care about cdrws burn quality ?
<Yagisan> pef: I tend to use rewritables a lot, but to a certain extent yes.
<pef> Yagisan: dvd burners tends to write bad quality cdrws :/
<pef> Yagisan: you should check http://www.cdfreaks.com/, very good tests about burners
<Yagisan> pef: I have a cdrw drive still. but yes, I noticed that too
<bmonty> Yagisan: I have a lite-on
<Yagisan> pef: thanks for link. checking now
<bmonty> you can get them real cheap on newegg.com
<Yagisan> bmonty: happy with it ?
<bmonty> Yagisan: so far...I've used lite-on burners for years and never had a problem
<Yagisan> bmonty: I'm in Aus, so I walk to my wholesalers
<Yagisan> they are like 4km away. easy walk
<bmonty> Yagisan: should be even cheaper for you then...less distance to ship it
<Yagisan> bmonty: I wish that were true, but its not. after conversion it's about the same price
<bmonty> you can get a lite-on DVD burner for <$40 US
<bmonty> with shipping
<Yagisan> bmonty: less quantity here. 20M in AUs, and that's what NYC ?
<bmonty> heh, yeah maybe
<Yagisan> bmonty: I can get a lite-on for about $58 AU.
<bmonty> the only issue I have had is that dvdrecord refuses to work with the drive....growisofs works just fine though
<bmonty> Yagisan: any idea what the conversion is?
<Yagisan> bmonty: about $43-44 US
<bmonty> Yagisan: like you said...the same price
<Yagisan> bmonty: only place I found cheaper was Tokyo, but I need a burner now, so I'm not going to wait for shipping
* Yagisan is off to d/l flight6 and try and fix his sysytem. bye all
<paddy> hi
<alon> hello world\
<bddebian> Hmm, I haven't gotten an accept or reject message for xfonts-marumoji
<ogra> bddebian, NEW ?
<bddebian> ogra: No
<bddebian> Malone #34217
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 34217 in firestarter "Initscript does not use lsb-base functions" [Normal,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/34217
<bddebian> Whoops wrong one
<ogra> :)
<bddebian> Shit, now I can't find the bug #
<ogra> no need for that :) wont solve LP issues if there are any ;)
<wasabi> If anybody is curious: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/GAptI   Just trying to generate interest/comments/etc.
<nictuku> interesting
<nictuku> will it install dependencies too?
<ogra> how does that differ from gdebi ?
<wasabi> ogra: jump to ThirdPartyApt
<ogra> just read it, sorry for the unqualified question :)
<wasabi> np.
<wasabi> Just put a big === Security === section to head off the obvious.
<nictuku> will dapper version still be 6.04?
<truz24> no, 6.6
<truz24> or maybe 6.06
<wasabi> ogra: any furthur thoughts? :)
<lifeless> moin moin
<phanatic> hi people
#ubuntu-motu 2006-04-08
<nictuku> hi!  could you guys please review http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2228 ? Thank you
<truz24> As far as development effort is concerned, where is there the most need for help?
<robertj> why did quake3 not make it from revu into dapper?
<Kyral> hey guys, isn't the REVU server donated by Canonical or something?
<ajmitch> Kyral: yes
<Kyral> SEJeff: wants to know :P
<Kyral> why he asked in #ubuntu+1 instead of here is beyond me :P
<truz24> any known problems with compiling the vmware kernel module with 2.6.15-19-386 ?
<ajmitch> robertj: I don't know, the last message said 'uploading'
<SEJeff> Kyral: I'd rather not bother ppl in here
<robertj> ajmitch: I bastardized those packages to Tremulous up :)
<bmonty_> can anyone suggest a package that has a good example of a gnome applet written in python?
<ajmitch> robertj: explain?
<ajmitch> bmonty_: deskbar-applet, iirc
<robertj> ajmitch: Tremulous is a stand-alone FPS with 99% CC Share-alike content
<ajmitch> robertj: ok
<robertj> I've emailed the author of the other 1% begging him to relicence
<bddebian> Heya gents
* ajmitch just couldn't parse your sentence
<ajmitch> hello bddebian
<robertj> ajmitch: quake3 src is gpl + some other DFSG bits
<bmonty_> hey bddebian
<robertj> quake3 content is totally non-free
<robertj> Tremulous began like as a quake3 mod but is now standalone with all new content and a different executable
<robertj> and it's quite a game
<ajmitch> soon to be fully distributable then?
<robertj> dunno about that. The problem is the textures can't be replaced without causing players not to be able to play on "pure" servers who check media assets before connection
<robertj> but if he will relicence then we _still_ have to wait for CC 3.0 share-alike to come out of draft stage in ~ 3 months
<ajmitch> right
<robertj> raelly we could just stick it in multiverse and promote it to universe in dapper+1
* ajmitch has to head out now, sorry
<robertj> np
<robertj> thanks
<bddebian> So what to do about patching a package with no patch system in place?
<Kyral> yo LJ
<LaserJock> hi Kyral
<bddebian> Heya LaserJock, Kyral
<bmonty_> bddebian: just patch it?
<bddebian> bmonty_: That was kind of my thought
<LaserJock> Hola bddebian and bmonty_
<bmonty_> hey LaserJock
<crimsun> bddebian: apply the patches directly.
<lifeless> ajmitch: upload pyflakes to debian !
<lifeless> (bug 330896)
<bddebian> crimsun: OK, thnks
<crimsun> bddebian: np
<TheMuso> bddebian: Thanks for sponsoring that upload. :)
<bddebian> NP
* TheMuso waits for the binaries to appear in the archive so he can fix silky which needs silc-toolkit. :)
<robertj> anyone else want to take a gander at why quake3 never made it to dapper?
<robertj> last update in revu was positive in january...
<LaserJock> hmm, is it bad for a package to dep on a transitional package?
<ajmitch> lifeless: I got the mail about it :)
<lifeless> ajmitch: so did I :{
<ajmitch> why?
<lifeless> dunno
<lifeless> bts decided I was cool or something
<ajmitch> maybe
<lifeless> so coming to the meeting tomorrow night ?
* lifeless wants a fan club
* bddebian starts lifeless fan club
<lifeless> ajmitch: actually, its tonight
<lifeless> in 6 hours
<LaserJock> bddebian already has a fan club. There's even a wiki page ;-)
<bddebian> Bah, bullocks
<lifeless> bddebian: thank you :)
* nictuku needs a fan club also hehe
<nictuku> s/also/too/
<ajmitch> lifeless: I'll try & be there then if I can
* ajmitch is currently at work :)
<bddebian> Work??
<LaserJock> dholbach: hi!
<dholbach> hello LaserJock
<dholbach> good morning
<bddebian> Heya dholbach.  You're alive? :-)
<LaserJock> Guten Morgen
<lifeless> ajmitch: thanks!
<dholbach> good morning guys
<lifeless> morning!
<Se7h> hi all
<dholbach> just said in another channel "when I swore to myself to start working earlier, I didn't know life was going to make fun of me and I couldn't sleep at 3:30 any more" :-)
<bddebian> Heh
<bddebian> Hello Se7h
<Se7h> aloha bddebian
* dholbach gets some coffee
<nictuku> anyone available to do some reviewing?
<nictuku> it's a dependency for nwu
<LaserJock> anybody want to write the Packaging Guide for me?
* bddebian doesn't
<bddebian> s/doesn't/couldn't/
<LaserJock> like I can?
<nictuku> I'd like to improve my packaging skills and become a MOTU
<lifeless> LaserJock: ?
<LaserJock> lifeless: ?
<lifeless> what Packaging Guide do you need written ?
<LaserJock> lifeless: do you have Dapper gnome in front of you?
<lifeless> yes
<LaserJock> System->Help->System Documentation
<lifeless> nictuku: excellent
<lifeless> LaserJock: nice.
<freeflying> any motus would give me a review on http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2237
<LaserJock> lifeless: I'm hoping to finish it in the next couple days and send an email to -motu and -devel asking for review before the doc freeze
<lifeless> have you incorporated matt palmers packaging hints ?
<LaserJock> some, I think. Do you have a URL? I can't remember
<lifeless> http://people.debian.org/~mpalmer/debian-mentors_FAQ.html
<LaserJock> I did try to grab some info from http://ftp-master.debian.org/REJECT-FAQ.html ;-)
<lifeless> its not square on 'how to package', but there are useful tidbits there
<bddebian> nictuku: Checking
<lifeless> revu would be more useful with an interdebdiff
<nictuku> bddebian, its "pycacic"
<bddebian> nictuku: pycacic?
<LaserJock> lifeless: yeah, I'll have to glance through it and see if there is anything I don't have. At first glance it looks like I probably have most of it
<nictuku> bddebian, provides "python*-sysinfo", to which nwu-agent depends
<LaserJock> lifeless: but he does have a good description of native and non-native packages
<LaserJock> lifeless: which seems to be an issue for people
<bddebian> nictuku: Advocated
<nictuku> :-)
<LaserJock> nictuku: is this a totally new package (not in Ubuntu before)?
<nictuku> LaserJock, yes. It's not supposed to go into dapper
<ajmitch> bddebian: that was a very very quick review :)
<LaserJock> nictuku: should it go in Dapper?
<ajmitch> lifeless: what debdiff do you want on revu?
<nictuku> I mean, it would be useless since only nwu-agent depends on it, and nwu-agent is not there yet
<lifeless> ajmitch: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2237
<LaserJock> nictuku: ok, cool
<lifeless> ajmitch: against the last one that hit the archive
<nictuku> LaserJock, I don't know how strict FF is in universe
<LaserJock> apparently not as strict as I thought
<ajmitch> lifeless: doesn't the debdiff option on the page work?
<lifeless> ajmitch: what debdiff option ?
<nictuku> did I do something wrong? Should I have uploaded it during FF?
<nictuku> s/shouldn't/
<lifeless> ajmitch: there are debdiffs against some random versions whose version I cannot tell
<ajmitch> lifeless: in the comments section, there's a debdiff link by each previous upload
<lifeless> The following uploads have been uploaded concerning the same Package:
<lifeless> Comments for upload of April 02 06:50 (debdiff)
<lifeless> what version is that ?
<ajmitch> lifeless: debdiff is between what you're currently viewing & the upload you select
<lifeless> ajmitch: so what I <want> is between the version currently in dapper, and the version the guy asked for a review on
<ajmitch> that is a debdiff from the current upload to the first upload
<ajmitch> revu isn't meant to be used for packages currently in dapper
<ajmitch> though it often gets used that way
<bddebian> So I've noticed :-)
<LaserJock> I like debdiffs attached to bug reports better
* nictuku feels relieved
<lifeless> ajmitch: so its good to know that its not meant for that ... but if its the first time I review something I'll want a diff against HEAD
<lifeless> ajmitch: which means dapper, and if its new, it will be a full-diff ;)
<ajmitch> if it's a new package on REVU, the first upload shouldn't show a debdiff option iirc
<lifeless> even if its in dapper ?
<ajmitch> we'd have to hack revu to check that a package is in dapper, grab it, and do the checks
<lifeless> sure.
<lifeless> when we get revu-in-lp we'll have that sort of functionality
<ajmitch> sure, and until then there's a revu2 rework that's underway
<ajmitch> it'd be a bit easier if it were integrated with lp
<ajmitch> and we'd probably be reviewing branches & using bzr by then anyway :)
<ajmitch> how's 0.8 going anyway?
<lifeless> quite well
<lifeless> do you encourage people to use the autodebtest stuff yet ?
<ajmitch> not yet
* ajmitch hasn't looked at it himself
<lifeless> the code made my eyes bleed, other than that it looks like a good start
<bddebian> heh
<LaserJock> lifeless: what does it do?
<LaserJock> bzr rocks, btw ;-)
<lifeless> LaserJock: it lets you put tests in the debian dir for a package
<LaserJock> did Diziet write it?
<lifeless> yes
<LaserJock> man, he has his hands all over Debian ;-)
<LaserJock> I was hoping he would have time to finish the Ubuntu Developer's Reference for Dapper
<nictuku> bddebian, did you really advocate that package?
<bddebian> Yep
<nictuku> pycacic or nwu?
<nictuku> it's not showing in the revu
<bddebian> Oh, maybe I hit the wrong one.  This was scim-bridge
<nictuku> ah ok
<nictuku> :-D
<bddebian> That's what you posted
<bddebian> 2237
<nictuku> no, that was lifeless
<nictuku> or freeflying, rather
<bddebian> Oh, whoops, sorry
<nictuku> np
<bddebian> tsk, tsk, out of date standards .. ;-P
<nictuku> yeah, I don't agree with the newer ones :-P
* nictuku changing that
<LaserJock> jeeze, don't these young whipper-snappers run lintian ;-)
<nictuku> I did, on debian sarge :-(
<LaserJock> odd, sarge isn't outdated at all ;-)
<bddebian> nictuku: Does it really need python2.3-dev?
<bddebian> LaserJock:
<bddebian> Err :-)
<nictuku> bddebian, hmm probably not, but many python libraries have the same build-depends, I guess that's for a reason?
<LaserJock> hmm, a soon as rewrite the data collection program at work I can move sarge to Dapper on the computer at work:-)
<bddebian> Oh God, don't mention Data Collection :-(
<LaserJock> bddebian: Right now I have to have a 2.4 kernel :(
<bddebian> I'll trade you, ours in Windows :-)
<lifeless> 2.3-dev is only needed if you are building the package on debian
<LaserJock> but then my boss sort of offered to by LabView
<lifeless> cause debian still hasn't migrated
<nictuku> lifeless, well that package is for debian too.
<nictuku> Isn't it the RightThing to ensure that it compiles on Debian too?
<nictuku> I mean, build.
<LaserJock> no
<LaserJock> not necessarily
<LaserJock> Ubuntu's defualt Python version is 2.4
<nictuku> hmm shouldn't we send improvements back to Debian?
<LaserJock> it's not so much that. They don't want 2.4 as default yet
<LaserJock> so their default is 2.3 and ours is 2.4
<lifeless> nictuku: sure, and we do
<lifeless> nictuku: but its easier on some packages than others
<nictuku> I thought it was wrong to contribute a new package for ubuntu and don't worry about debian portability.
<nictuku> compatibility, I mean.
<LaserJock> nictuku: you can worry about it all you want ;-)
<crimsun> it's not wrong, just not necessarily the most efficient
<nictuku> crimsun, you mean it's not efficient to keep debian compatibility or the opposite?
<LaserJock> nictuku: you can use python-dev as a dep
<crimsun> nictuku: I mean it's more efficient to maintain Debian as the primary development point, since versions can simply be synced into Ubuntu.
<nictuku> LaserJock, oh that's true
<nictuku> well as long as I'm able to build both 2.3 and 2.4 versions using the default python-dev, right?
<nictuku> in this package, the same source package creates python-, python2.3 and python2.4, as suggested in the python policy
<crimsun> it's really simple. Build-depend on both python2.3-dev and python2.4-dev, and your Ubuntu delta will be the one-line change in debian/control for python-yourpackage that Depends on python2.4-yourpackage
<bddebian> Whatever happened with all the apt-get.org crap?
<nictuku> crimsun, then I guess it's fine already: http://revu.tauware.de/revu1-incoming/pycacic-0604022255/pycacic-0.3/debian/control
<LaserJock> bddebian: what crap, that is high quality packaging there
<bddebian> The packaging wasn't the issue.  It was licensing problems wasn't it?
<LaserJock> nictuku: why would python-sysinfo depend on python?
<LaserJock> bddebian: really? I never heard about that
<crimsun> afaik, it was licensing.
<nictuku> LaserJock, seems useless, but then again a common practice in python packages I've seen (eg. python-sqlobject)
<nictuku> I'm not saying they are right.
<LaserJock> hmm, seems like it will cause more delta (since it should be python2.3 in Debian)
<nictuku> it actually depends on python (>= 2.4), python (<< 2.5)
<nictuku> or better, python (>= 2.4), python (<< 2.5), python2.4-sysinfo
<nictuku> the delta would be changing that to the current default (2.3 in debian)
<LaserJock> yeah, and I dont' see why you would need that. the only real dep is python2.4-sysinfo
<nictuku> I agree.
<nictuku> I'll fix that, but i'm just wondering why those other packages do that... maybe for a reason?
<LaserJock> I've got to clean up the python app I maintain in Debian too. I'm still not quite sure to do with it
* nictuku sees no reason
<LaserJock> if there is somebody will file a bug report for sure ;-)
<nictuku> hehe
<LaserJock> My problem is that my app can use either 2.3 or 2.4 but it places some modules in site-packages so I have to give it a version :/
<Se7h> btw LaserJock, a package here wont go into the menu, any ideas?
<LaserJock> Se7h: did you run desktop-file-validate on the .desktop file?
<Se7h> LaserJock use the latest availble on the system
<bddebian> Ack..
* bddebian didn't even know about desktop-file-validation
<bddebian> Err validate
<nictuku> LaserJock, for nwu I send the files to site-python..
<LaserJock> nictuku: are they compiled by a postinst script?
<Se7h> bddebian same here
<Se7h> its the first time this happen
<Se7h> LaserJock isn't menu / .desktop file enough?
<LaserJock> no
<nictuku> LaserJock, I use a minimal cdbs debian/rules, then move them using .install
<nictuku> seems to work: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2236
<LaserJock> nictuku: hmm, you might check the installed deb
<nictuku> (please don't mind reviewing 2236)
<nictuku> LaserJock, check if they have compiled files, you mean?
<LaserJock> nictuku: yeah, I found with my packages that posints scripts were added in /var/lib/dpkg/info
<LaserJock> nictuku: that compiled the .py files
<LaserJock> dh_python does it
<nictuku> I don't get what the problem is
<LaserJock> if it does that then it will compile with the default Python version, which means they shouldn't go in site-python
<LaserJock> because the files are version specific, or at least that is my worry/understanding
<nictuku> I don't see any problem there, as long as you don't get a deb package you build in ubuntu and take it to sarge.
<nictuku> and vice-versa.
<LaserJock> well, what if you run the app with different versions of python
<LaserJock> if you run the app with 2.4 but it was byte compiled with 2.3 that might be a problem, no?
<nictuku> my files are in site-python but only .py, not .pyc
<LaserJock> but you don't know that
<LaserJock> they are compiled after isntall
<nictuku> well dpkg -c tells me that
<LaserJock> it won't show in dpkg -c
<nictuku> really?
<nictuku> oh
<nictuku> postinst
<LaserJock> yeah
<nictuku> ding
<LaserJock> I just installed the .deb in looked int /var/lib/dpkg/info/
<LaserJock> and found it there
<nictuku> that's why the python policy say that a "all versions" package is not supported.
<LaserJock> perhaps, although you could not use dh_python and get rid of the postinst I suppose
<LaserJock> but I'm not sure if I want to do that
<nictuku> you could just prevent dh_python fromdoing that
<nictuku> but I'm not sure either
<LaserJock> actually dh_python -n looks good
<LaserJock> although I assume that the idea is that you sacrifice speed when you do that
<ajmitch> hi Hobbsee
<LaserJock> hi Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> hey ajmitch and LaserJock!
<Hobbsee> the maths test didnt  kill me!
<ajmitch> great!
<LaserJock> yeah!
* ajmitch is on hold trying to contact ISP... zzz
<Hobbsee> you've gotta start wondering when you cant understand question 1, part a....
<LaserJock> I never really enjoyed math, especially 2nd semester Calc :(
* ajmitch wasn't much of a calc fan at uni
<Hobbsee> eek
<crimsun> it's all blarg until you hit number theory, then at least it's fascinatingly dizzy and worth falling asleep over
<ajmitch> hehe
<Hobbsee> so i'll have lots of fun in the future, hey?
<LaserJock> I enjoyed 1 semester adn 3rd sememster but 2nd just kicked my butt
<ajmitch> loads
<ajmitch> hey robitaille
<LaserJock> and now I come to find that 2nd semester had everything I need for my career :/
<ajmitch> yeah..
<Hobbsee> number theory...wonder which bit that is....
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: oh good, so i can try to skip all possible  maths units, and otherwise ingore them?
<LaserJock> umm, no :-)
<Hobbsee> :( whyever not?
<Hobbsee> i wonder which bit number theory is...
<LaserJock> because you don't know what you will be doing years from now
<Hobbsee> true
<LaserJock> and calculus is very universal
* ajmitch might have slightly faster DSL in a week, yay
<Hobbsee> ajmitch
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: yay!
<Hobbsee> as long as you dont go with bigpond, or equivalent
<Hobbsee> after seeing their performance yesterday...
<ajmitch> heh
* Hobbsee doesnt want to count how many times she had to reset the router
<ajmitch> actually I was just told that it's already been changed
<ajmitch> & that I just need to reconnect the DSL
<Hobbsee> ah ok
* ajmitch will be back in a min :)
<bddebian> Well time for this old fart to go to bed.  Gnight gents
<LaserJock> cya bddebian
<bddebian> And ladies
<Hobbsee> night bddebian
<LaserJock> yeah, don't be sexist
<LaserJock> ;-)
* Hobbsee twirls around in her skirt :P
<bddebian> Heh
<Hobbsee> actually, i lie - i dont usually wear skirts
<ajmitch__> ok
<LaserJock> I don't either :p
<ajmitch__>  modem_run[9740] : ADSL line is up (4288 kbit/s down | 608 kbit/s up)
<ajmitch__> much better
<ajmitch__> LaserJock: that's good to hear ;)
<Hobbsee> ajmitch__: so why do you have a tail?
<ajmitch__> Hobbsee: because I just reconnected?
<robitaille> hi ajmitch__
<Hobbsee> :)
* robitaille is a bit late responsding...
<ajmitch> that's ok :)
* ajmitch missed some conversation for a minute or so
<ajmitch> very disappointing :)
<Hobbsee> hehe
<Hobbsee> poor ajmitch_
<ajmitch> I know
<LaserJock> I don't feel bad for him, he got faster internet out of the deal
<ajmitch> :P
<ajmitch> now I can upload packages 4x faster
<LaserJock> nice
<Hobbsee> yay!
<ajmitch> it's got a 20GB cap though
* Hobbsee gets stung by slow uploads too :(
<Hobbsee> debdiff's are way better :D
<LaserJock> my DSL is fairly slow but considering I was on dialup before I'm pretty happy
<ajmitch> start of last year I was on 128/128kbps
<Se7h> LaserJock lol
<ajmitch> so 3.5/512 is a good improvement from that
* TheMuso wishes Telstra offered faster DSL than 1.5mbps, but since we are moving in the next 12 months, he won't worry about ADSL 2 just yet.
<LaserJock> but my uni line is sweat
<ajmitch> TheMuso: it's strange that I can actually get faster DSL in NZ than that - though we don't have adsl2+ here yet
<ajmitch> another Hobbsee_
<TheMuso> ajmitch: Yeah. And if I'm right, if Telstra do release ADSL 2, it won't be fastr than what is available on cable.
<LaserJock> hmm, did Hobbsee get a faster line too?
<Hobbsee_> hehe yeah
<TheMuso> SO will have to go with an ISP with own DSLAM.
<ajmitch> TheMuso: impossible here :)
<ajmitch> we have no unbundling
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: no, i moved my laptop, and the wired pulled itself out.  but the wireless actually felt like connecting, which is good.
<TheMuso> ajmitch: That must suck.
<ajmitch> just a bit
<TheMuso> How long after binaries are built shoul they hit the archive?
<ajmitch> within 30-60min
<Se7h> where u from btw?
<ajmitch> who?
<Se7h> all of ya
<TheMuso> Se7h: Sydney, Australia.
<ajmitch> NZ
<ajmitch> too many people from sydney here :)
<Se7h> TheMuso a just made a call to there a few minutes ago
<TheMuso> heh
<Se7h> really ?
<Se7h> all from aus ?
* robitaille waves from Canada... 
<Se7h> jeje
<trappist> I can't make a bug a duplicate because the bug itself has duplicates - how do I find *those* bugs to make them duplicates of what seems to be the best bug report?
* LaserJock is from Reno, Nevada
<Se7h> two of the countries i might go live to
<ajmitch> Se7h: I said I'm from NZ, not australia
<ajmitch> never ever confuse the two ;)
<Se7h> ajmitch  i read it ;)
<Hobbsee> sydney here, too
<trappist> anyone?
<robitaille> trappist:  you have to change all these other duplicates to be duplicate of the bug you want to keep open
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: your bigpond connection go haywire last night as well?
<LaserJock> what I though NZ was a state of AU
* LaserJock hides
<trappist> robitaille: I know, my question is how to identify those bugs
<TheMuso> ajmitch: re binaries and being built, bdebian uploaded a debdiff for a package I fixed a few days ago, and while all arches have reported a successful build, I haven't seen the packages in the archive yet.
<Se7h> LaserJock lmao
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: it is, we send all of our criminals there.
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: I am with Westnet on ADSL.
<ajmitch> TheMuso: what package?
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: oh ok, i thought you mentioned telstra earlier
<Se7h> u'r were talking bout dsl connections
<Se7h> i have 4Mb and think it sucks
<TheMuso> ajmitch: silc-toolkit
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: Yeah, because I still rely on them for ADSL itself.
<Hobbsee> *nods*
<trappist> robitaille: any idea?
<TheMuso> IMO WestNet are 100% rock solid.
<robitaille> trappist:  the duplicates should be in the ledft-hand side column of that report.
<LaserJock> Se7h: I have no idea what I get but I think it is ~1 Mb
<robitaille> which bug number you are looking at?
<trappist> robitaille: gotcha, thanks. this is bug 32915
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 32915 in kde-guidance "Display applet does not start" [Normal,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/32915
<ajmitch> TheMuso: strange
<Se7h> LaserJock didn't i read 512Kb ?
<TheMuso> ajmitch: Agreed.
<TheMuso> ajmitch: But, the sources are in the archive.
<LaserJock> Se7h: eh?
<Se7h> LaserJock forget it...i'm just pissed cus i dont have higher than 10Mb
<Se7h> :p
<TheMuso> Se7h: Many of us in Australia don't either, at least most on ADSL don't.
<TheMuso> I could get cable here, but DSL is better value for money.
<robitaille> trappist:  so if you go to 37275, you can see all the duplicate on the left.
<LaserJock> Se7h: well, at my uni I have a nice connection. Sometimes I can download an .iso in 1.5 min.
* TheMuso drools at the connection access LaserJock has.
<Se7h> LaserJock thats 1Gb
<Se7h> very nice :9
<robitaille> trappist:  so 32915 has already been dealt with by beeing marked as duplicate of 37275
<Se7h> :>
* Hobbsee glares at LaserJock 
<Se7h> well mates, its 6am here, i'm off to bed, cya all
<Hobbsee> is that with a download accelerator, or not?
<Hobbsee> or a torrent?
<LaserJock> cya Se7h
<TheMuso> lol
<LaserJock> Hobbsee: no just an .iso
* Hobbsee can pull an ISO in around 25 mins, with a download accelerator
<trappist> robitaille: yeah, I just did that
<LaserJock> if I find a good uni close by University of Southern California has a fast mirror I think
<LaserJock> Kyral has got the best hookup, his uni mirrors Ubuntu so he doesn't have to go outside the local network
<Hobbsee> hehe nice
<Hobbsee> if the flight cds get on bigpond, i can just grab them from the ISP, rather than having to search for another mirror somewhere
<Hobbsee> that ends up being pretty fast - with an accelerator
<LaserJock> Hobbsee: do you use adept at all?
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: very occasionally
<tritium> Hello, all
<LaserJock> Hobbsee: could you check something for me real quick?
<LaserJock> hi tritium
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: what is it?
<ajmitch> hey tritium
<tritium> Hi LaserJock, ajmitch
<LaserJock> Hobbsee: if you search for acl2 I would like to know if the description line is complete
<LaserJock> Hobbsee: or if it is truncated and ends with a P
<Hobbsee> it shows up to main ...
<LaserJock> in synaptic it has "... main binaP"
<ajmitch> acl2 - A Computational Logic for Applicative Common Lisp: main binary
<ajmitch> from the commandline
<robitaille> LaserJock:  I have seen the same in another package recently... there is a bug report; for the life of me I can't remember which one right now.
* ajmitch installs adept to check
<LaserJock> robitaille: yeah, they guy said he filed like 3 dozen bug reports about it
<robitaille> https://launchpad.net/people/tjaustinbardo/+reportedbugs
<robitaille> yep...quite a few reported bugs about that problem
<tritium> holy Thilo Six, batman
<LaserJock> robitaille: I told him to report just 1 bug against synaptic but I think we could Reject the other ones
<robitaille> and it seems he has looked only at the "a"s
<robitaille> the bug report I saw was 2-3 weeks ago, so it must from someone else
<ajmitch> oh goody, he filed yet another f-spot bug
<LaserJock> robitaille: so I think I stopped him before he got to the 'b's ;-)
<trappist> I wonder if that's how I should file my complaints about the menu locations of certain apps, or their lack of menu entries in kde
<trappist> it would be a few dozen bugs at least, if I filed per-package
<LaserJock> trappist: if they lack .desktop files you can file bugs about that, I've got about 40 of those to upload still :/
<trappist> LaserJock: then I guess you've got that process down - could you add Eterm to your list if you haven't already?
<trappist> that's my personal #1 concern
<trappist> that and two other eterm gripes that aren't getting a lot of attention
<trappist> I've fixed one of em, but they don't let me upload :)  and nobody's looking at the patch.
<ajmitch> probably because the bug isn't assigned to be reviewed & it's floating around with the ~10K other bugs?
<trappist> I didn't figure I was supposed to assign bugs.  what should I do with a bug like that?
<robitaille> ajmitch:  only 9371 bugs tonight....there was some serious bug triage over the weekend by some senior Ubuntu developers :)
<ajmitch> bugs with patches should be assigned to motureviewers
<ajmitch> (universe bugs, that is)
<ajmitch> robitaille: great, I noticed that there were no more bugs assigned to debzilla :)
<trappist> cool, eterm is universe
<ajmitch> it makes them a little easier to search for
<LaserJock_away> 'night folks
<ajmitch> night
<trappist> done
<ajmitch> wb Hobbsee
<trappist> ajmitch: what if it wasn't a universe package?
<Hobbsee> oops...
<Hobbsee> ctrl + esc isnt the same as ctrl + alt + backspace!
<trappist> ajmitch: or if it didn't have a patch
<ajmitch> trappist: then you don't assign it
* trappist decides not to see what ctrl-esc does
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: you did a silly thing?
<trappist> ajmitch: is there an appropriate way to get a bug some visibility if it doesn't happen to be a universe package with an attached patch?
<Hobbsee> i wanted xkill!  not restart x, hehe!
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: lol
<ajmitch> trappist: there's not really an appropriate way without nagging & annoying developers, usually :)
* Hobbsee notices that some goose has assigned a bug report to motu UVF, without a working patch - because my patch on it doesnt work!  
<trappist> bleh.  I assume this is why so many bugs languish for so long on malone
<Hobbsee> yeah, they slip thru as unassigned
* Hobbsee is surprised at just how many fit into that category
<ajmitch> trappist: and if everyone clamours for their favourite bug,the situation will be the same except much much noisier
<trappist> ajmitch: good point.
<Hobbsee> what, like checkinstall?  :P
<trappist> well, thanks ajmitch.  off to bed with me.
* trappist &
<ajmitch> wb Hobbsee :)
<Hobbsee> ty
<ajmitch> keep on hitting the wrong keys?
<ajmitch> dholbach: I've got a UVF exception to make, but it's going to be a rather large diff.. how likely are you to approve it? :)
<ajmitch> (upstream requested the exception)
<Hobbsee> ajmitch
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: nah, that was just my net connection going awol.
<ajmitch> ah, the usual
* ajmitch is getting ~1K/sec at the moment
<ajmitch> fairly impressive upgrade, isn't it?
<TheMuso> Oh yeah.
<dous> if someone files a bug that is related to a package that isn't in ubuntu, is it perfectly okay for me to mark it wontfix?
<lifeless> dous: where did they file it ?
<dous> lifeless: malone
<lifeless> what source package did they file it on ?
<dous> lifeless: see 4195 it was filed on eclipse, but the details say that it conflicts with azureus
<lifeless> hmm, how did they figure that out/
<lifeless> ?
<robitaille> and it was using a deb file from Debian...as per the wiki instructions
<dous> yes. so it's okay if I mark it wontfix?
<dous> since the software involved is unsupported
<robitaille> personally I would reject it on the basis the package didn't come from the ubuntu repos.  We don't support everything written in the wiki :)
<dous> okay then.. thanks :)
<zakame> hi all
<Toadstool> hi all
<zakame> heya Toadstool
<viviersf> sigh
<viviersf> i hate broken packages
<viviersf> :(
<zakame> awww
<lifeless> come one come all
<ajmitch> everyone join the lifeless cheer squad
<ajmitch> hopefully the CC members show
<ajmitch> hi Seveas
<TheMuso> ajmitch: Whats the big occasion?
<nictuku> TheMuso, CC meeting
<Seveas> hi
<TheMuso> Oh ok.
<ajmitch> TheMuso: just another CC meeting
<ajmitch> lifeless: maybe in another 2 weeks? :)
<lifeless> ajmitch: meh. This one was at a good time ;)
<lifeless> do they often just awol ?
<ajmitch> not usually
<zakame> question: what would be the new version of resolvconf if I touch it to fix malone 33362
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 33362 in resolvconf "Runtime directory does not exist during /etc/rcS1.d/08loopback setup" [Normal,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/33362
<lifeless> win 25
<allee> exists a policy for dapper to not ship python2.3 modules for dapper, only phython2.4? (python-numarray, doko dropped 2.3 in -2)
<lifeless> yes, we dont have python2.3 in dapper IIRC
<ajmitch> we do, but in universe
<ajmitch> since some packages (zope 2.8 being the prime culprit) still need it
<lifeless> oh right
<lifeless> I forgot about the black beast from hell
<ajmitch> zope & plone are still popular :)
<allee> ajmitch: if 2.3 will only be in universe what happens with py modules in main?
<ajmitch> there are no python 2.3 modules in main any more
* allee checks where python-numarray is ...
<ajmitch> in main
<ajmitch> allee: what do you need python 2.3 for?
<allee> a science software astrowise (analyzing data from a teleskop soon mounted in chile)
<StevenK> ... but does that mean python2.3-numarray still exists in universe?
<ajmitch> StevenK: nope
<ajmitch> StevenK: the only way to get it into universe is to upload a new source package (evil, I know)
* StevenK nods. 
<ajmitch> but that's what I have to upload to get zope working again :)
<allee> ajmitch.  So that a problem.  When a 2.3 module in universe depends on a module in main. BANG  (see https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/matplotlib/+bug/37625/)
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 37625 in matplotlib python2.3-matplotlib "python2.3-matplotlib has unavailable dependencies" [Major,Confirmed] 
* ajmitch ought to get back to that
<ajmitch> that's fallout from the recent changes
<StevenK> ajmitch: Same thing as main/non-free in Debian.
<ajmitch> I'll have to talk to doko & see what we can do to fix those
<ajmitch> allee: can your software work with python2.4 instead?
<allee> ajmitch: From INSTALL: 1) Install python 2.3.5 (currently < 2.4)
<ajmitch> wonderful
<allee> yeah.
<allee> But to be fair it's a huge package (lot's of c binding too).  I don't know what has changed in 2.3 -> 2.4.  Maybe upgrade would be not trival.
<ajmitch> lifeless: congrats
<ajmitch> easiest one I've seen for awhile :)
<lifeless> possibly I should not have been nervous.. heh.
<ajmitch> and I think your packaging skills should hold up well for the TB meeting, being a DD
<lifeless> oh right, theres more :0
<ajmitch> yeah
<ajmitch> where they grill you on whether you'll break the archive
<lifeless> heh.
<ajmitch> looks like bug 2397 can be closed :)
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 2397 in pornview "Pornview segfaults at startup" [Normal,Fix committed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/2397
<lifeless> done
<lifeless> bug 2397
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 2397 in pornview "Pornview segfaults at startup" [Normal,Fix released]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/2397
<ajmitch> great
<lifeless> ajmitch: so wheres the doco on the next step ?
<lifeless> found it
<lifeless> MaintainerCandidates
<lifeless> so, just add to the team, ... done
<ajmitch> yeah
<ajmitch> turn up at TB meeting
<ajmitch> plead your case
<lifeless> ajmitch: haha: YYYY-mm-dd at HHMMUTC
<lifeless> ajmitch: next meeting date
<ajmitch> nice
<lifeless> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/TechnicalBoardAgenda
<jacob-wardell> hi
<jacob-wardell> hello...
<jacob-wardell> ?
<nomed> hi all
<jacob-wardell> morning
<jacob-wardell> how are you?
<doko> how are obsolete files handled on the REVU web site?
<ajmitch> we remove them if needed - the revu page shows current & archived packages
<ajmitch> if an old version is there, it generally gets archived
<doko> ajmitch: please could you remove the pydev / eclipse-pydev packages?
<ajmitch> remove altogether, or just archive?
* ajmitch has set as archived for now
<zakame> hi all
<kelmo> hi siretart , you about?
<zakame> heya spacey kelmo Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> hey zakame
<spacey> hi zakame
<kelmo> hi zakame
<siretart> kelmo: I'm currently at work, and can't give much attention to irc
<siretart> kelmo: I just read your email about the init script, I intended to answer the bugreports from earlier today this evening
<kelmo> ok, that is there just as a reminder
<siretart> kelmo: my opinion about this is to install the init script in the examples/ dir with an explanation why
<kelmo> i await your response ; )
<siretart> I'll give you a short version
<siretart> I don't think that we should install an init script
<siretart> even disabled, because we cannot really provide a good roaming solution which integrates into the rest of the system
<siretart> the current package is suitable for OTHER daemons to provide a decent roaming solution
<kelmo> enough said, that is fine with me
<kelmo> exactly my earlier point
<kelmo> i always hated that daemon
<siretart> I think the solution joachim proposed (wifiroamd) is the way to go
<siretart> kelmo: for the guy who rised that one bug to severity grave
<siretart> kelmo: how do you think shipping the init script in the examples dir, provide some documentation, and close the bug
<kelmo> 100% comfortable with that
<siretart> :)
<kelmo> ok, well, we may as well use that script you rewrote
<kelmo> that i fixed up a little bit
<siretart> sure
<kelmo> and make a not in *modes
<zakame> Toadstool: ping
<Toadstool> zakame: pong
<Toadstool> :)
<kelmo> that it lives in /examples for those that need it
<kelmo> s/not/note
<siretart> if you have time and want to include it in our trunk/, just go for it, I won't get to it at least in the next 6 hours. perhaps only tomorrow
<kelmo> i have a little bit of time, at the cost of sleep
<zakame> Toadstool: rock on for ebtables :)
<kelmo> that is cheap i think ; )
<kelmo> siretart: have a good day then
<siretart> I consider sleep precious *g*
<Toadstool> zakame: well that was an easy fix :)
<siretart> kelmo: thanks :)
<zakame> yeah, too bad it was only until now that it got committed
<Toadstool> it would have been in the archive a few days ago if I hadn't forgotten to change unstable to dapper in debian/changelog :/
<zakame> hehe, yeah I got that snag too
<zakame> anyhow, is yann around?
<Toadstool> hum I have to generate a file containing a base64 encoded key in a postinst script and I don't want my package to depend on openssl and use "openssl rand -base64 32", what do you think about something like "dd if=/dev/random bs=32 count=1 | uuencode -m file"?
<janimo> crimsun: ping
<janimo> Gloubiboulga: ping
<Gloubiboulga> janimo, pong
<janimo> Hi Gauvain
<Gloubiboulga> hi :)
<janimo> did you read the gnumeric mail
<janimo> on their list?
<Gloubiboulga> yep, but it's not really clear to me
<janimo> a bit conrradictory answers but in the end I think
<janimo> yeah my thoughts as well
<janimo> and he followed up in a personal mail which was again unclear
<janimo> :(
<Gloubiboulga> maybe we could try to meet the devs on irc
<janimo> Gloubiboulga: yes, good idea
<Gloubiboulga> janimo, I have time now...
<janimo> ok, np I try
<janimo> ah you _do_
<janimo> :)
<Gloubiboulga> yep, i *do*
<janimo> I am logging in now to gnome.ner
<janimo> net
<janimo> hmm can I specify the server in a /join command?
<Gloubiboulga> it's /server
<janimo> ok let's see if it does not log me out from here
<Gloubiboulga> janimo, the server is not gimpnet?
<janimo> hmm yes, I think so
<janimo> althoug I saw ref to gnome.net too
<janimo> or org
<Gloubiboulga> irc.gimp.org
<Gloubiboulga> it works here :)
<janimo> gnome.org here :)
<kelmo> siretart: i have tested and committed an alternative init script, that will be installed to the examples dir
<kelmo> siretart: i just ask that you add documentation/comments where neccessary please
<kelmo> siretart: or point out defficiencies to me if too busy
<siretart> kelmo: thank you very much. will do that this evening
<kelmo> gn8 then
<janimo> Gloubiboulga: uh, progress :)
<Gloubiboulga> janimo, yep :)
<janimo> they know how to scare people :)
<Gloubiboulga> :D
<janimo> it seems I am very bad at asking clear questions :)
<Gloubiboulga> it was clear to me :)
<Gloubiboulga> janimo, the guy you pinged is Ray?
<janimo> yes
<Gloubiboulga> ok
<janimo> since those are his initials I think
<janimo> JHM Dassen
<janimo> am writing a mail now
<Gloubiboulga> janimo, could you tell me why several files in /usr/bin in the xffm package are removed?
<janimo> Gloubiboulga: haven;t looked at xffm at all
<janimo> it is as it comes from debian (4.2.x)
<bddebian> Heya gang
<Gloubiboulga> hm
<janimo> you mean current (broken) dapper package right?
<Gloubiboulga> hi bddebian
<Gloubiboulga> janimo, yes
<bddebian> Hello Gloubiboulga
<Gloubiboulga> janimo, I have a working deb here, but not clean yet
<janimo> Gloubiboulga: that was always just synced, and epoch bumped but other than that I haver not looked at it
<janimo> Gloubiboulga: how is xffm 4.3? have not tried to from svn either
<ercin> hii
<Gloubiboulga> there's a stable release available and it works fine with our current Xfce
<bddebian> Hello ercin
<ercin> is there a service like alioth for ubuntu?
<janimo> ercin: not really as most ubuntu packages are minor mods of debian ones
<janimo> but some groups (X, kernel) use their own repos for the ubuntu specific work
<Gloubiboulga> bddebian, thanks for the upload of my hibernate patch :)
<bddebian> Gloubiboulga: NP, thanks for the patch :)
<Gloubiboulga> it wasn't a hard one
<ercin> janimo, we need a mirror for xgl/compiz/mesa packages
<janimo> ercin: mirror?
<janimo> for developing on those packages you mean?
<ercin> janimo, actually quinnstorm need a mirror for her apt repository
<ercin> and she is makin some contributions to the code
<ercin> some kind of development
<janimo> ercin: afaik, most people keep their contribs on their external webspaces
<bddebian> Put it on a wiki page?
<janimo> but the revu people used to give web space for those not having any
<ercin> revu?
<ercin> ayaa she have some space but its reallly slowwwww
<janimo> ercin: REVU if you wish :)
<janimo> http://revu.tauware.de/
<ercin> janimo, ok thx
<janimo> or ask around if nay motu has good bandwidth and sets up space for other motus
<janimo> s/nay/any/
<zakame> was there an UVF exception filed for sysstat?
<Gloubiboulga> Could anyone have a look at the texmaker package on REVU?
<Gloubiboulga> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2059
<Gloubiboulga> it's a new upstream release, and UVF has been accepted for it
<Gloubiboulga> a long time ago...
<bddebian> Gloubiboulga: Riddell says he uploaded in December.  Is this a new version?
<Riddell> Gloubiboulga: does it still compile?  there was an issue with texmaker that it didn't compile with qt 4.1
<Gloubiboulga> bddebian, Riddell, it's a new version
<Gloubiboulga> it builds with qt 4.1
<bddebian> Ah
<bddebian> Riddell: You wanna do it?
<Riddell> nope, busy
<Gloubiboulga> It's the main change since the previous version
<bddebian>  1.3-0?  Isn't that the same?
<Gloubiboulga> we have 1.2.1 in dapper
<bddebian> Yeah, I just noticed that, sorry :-)
<Gloubiboulga> np :)
<jdthood> Newbie alert.  Hi.  I'm quite familiar with Debian.  I'd like to become better acquainted with Ubuntu.  I thought that I might be able to do that by doing MOTU work for a package in maintain in Debian.  Can someone direct me to instructions on what I should do next?
<Gloubiboulga> jdthood, we use REVU (http://revu.tauware.de) to manage new packages in universe
<Gloubiboulga> you can have a look at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU
<Gloubiboulga> jdthood, your package is not in ubuntu yet?
<jdthood> It's already in ubuntu.
<jdthood> However, it needs some adaptation.
<jdthood> Thanks for the URLs
<Gloubiboulga> np
<Gloubiboulga> what is your package?
<jdthood> resolvconf
<zakame> jdthood: whoa, I just touched that today
<sladen> -:)
<zakame> that's why the nick sounded familiar
<jdthood> Maybe you fixed the error message at boot, then.  :)
<zakame> yes, that was fixed today, malone 33362
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 33362 in resolvconf "Runtime directory does not exist during /etc/rcS1.d/08loopback setup" [Normal,Fix released]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/33362
<jdthood> Cool.  Except that means I have to find some other learning exercise.
<bddebian> Ah, 33362 is fixed?
<zakame> yup, thanks to sebastian kapfer
<bddebian> Sweet
<bddebian> Gloubiboulga: Building texmaker now
<zakame> still waiting for the actuall install into the archive though
<Gloubiboulga> bddebian, ok
<jdthood> Bizarre.  There is a discussion going on right now on ubuntu-devel about handling of /etc/resolv.conf.  No mention of resolvconf.  Is there some common knowledge about "resolvconf in ubuntu" that I'm lacking?
<sladen> never heard of it
<zakame> hmm, even so, I'm not aware of that... I'vebeen using resolvconf now even since sarge, and I haven't found any problems with it (even 33362 doesn'r bite much)
<jdthood> E.g., was any decision ever made about whether to integrate network-manager with it?
<jdthood> SFAIK it works properly with all network configurers and DNS caches in Debian, but network-manager development has been happening in ubuntu and I don't know where the relevant conversations are going on.
<jdthood> I believe that NM doesn't cooperate with resolvconf, but don't really know.
<jdthood> Ah, found it.  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NetworkMagic
<jdthood> "As the resolver will controlled entirely by dhcp3 or static configuration, no need for the resolvconf tool is forseen."
<jdthood> That's good news.  A standard DHCP client will be used, and the standard DHCP clients already work properly with resolvconf if it's installed.
<bddebian> Gloubiboulga: Uploaded, thanks
<Gloubiboulga> bddebian, thanks :)
<bddebian> Is this too much detail in a changelog for such a small change to a package?
<bddebian> graveman (0.3.12-4-2.1ubuntu2) dapper; urgency=low
<bddebian>   * Change Icon=graveman in desktop/graveman.desktop.in
<bddebian>   * Copy graveman48.png graveman.png
<bddebian>   * Update desktop/Makefile.* to reflect filename change
<bddebian>   * Closes Malone: #1849
<bddebian>  -- Barry deFreese <bddebian@comcast.net>  Mon,  3 Apr 2006 11:32:31 -0400
<zakame> most probably
<zakame> but of course, 'tis your call :)
<zakame> gn8 all
<Gloubiboulga> night zakame
<zakame> thanks Gloubiboulga
<trappist> is there some utility to write a line like "-- Barry deFreese <bddebian@comcast.net>  Mon,  3 Apr 2006 11:32:31 -0400" in the changelog?  I've been doing it by hand every time, and it kinda sucks
<bddebian> trappist: dch -i
<trappist> oh cool
<bddebian> The -i will automatically increment the version number though, so make sure you check it :-)
<trappist> I usually do that too.  I generally only submit debdiffs of pretty small changes, though, and I dunno what SOP is for that
<trappist> bddebian: btw I replied to your reply on the list re: changelogs
<trappist> if a bug is reported against breezy and it's fixed in dapper, should it be closed?
<bddebian> trappist: I think so yes
<pef> trappist: and add -D dapper to be sure to have the correct distro set ;)
<trappist> pef: thanks, I'll have a look at the man page - never heard of this tool until now
<LaserJock> trappist: WRT changelogs, I usually do is this
<LaserJock> if I don't have to change anything, I just sign and upload
<LaserJock> if I have to change something I do my own changelog entry and add what the person contributed
<ogra> it really depends on the change though ...
<trappist> is this stuff documented anywhere?  when to do what to the changelog?
<LaserJock> no
<trappist> LaserJock: aren't you the packaging guide guy? ;)
<ogra> i often have one liner pending locally until a upload is justified by more changes for example ...
<trappist> ogra: out of curiosity, do you mention that in bug reports?  I often see bugs with fixes attached and no further comments
<ogra> trappist, i usually mention the bugnumber in the changelog then ...
<trappist> ogra: and the patch contributor's name, right? ;)
* trappist is on a changelog attribution crusade
<ogra> not if it was changed before already and the bug was in progress or fix pending ...
<bddebian> trappist: Did the submitter not have a changelog entry?
<trappist> bddebian: I'm not referring to a specific case
<ogra> its just a cornercase, but happens sometimes with xscreensaver for example, where i collect changes because 90% of them are very small ones
<bddebian> Ah, OK
<trappist> imho even very small changes should be properly attributed
<bddebian> Hmm, maybe I shouldn't have copied graveman48.png to graveman.png?  Now I get unrepresentable changes to source errors on build.. :-(
<siretart> has the update-manager tool for upgrading from breezy to dapper already been uploaded to breezy-updates, or shall testers still use http://people.ubuntu.com/~mvo/backports/update-manager/?
<siretart> hey bddebian1
<bddebian> Heya siretart
<trappist> I am so frickin happy with the new cupsys I'm going to cry
<bddebian> Damn I hate not having an Ubuntu box here at work.. :-(
<LaserJock> trappist: this is how I usually do attribution https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/dapper-changes/2006-February/006344.html
<trappist> I love working in an ubuntu shop :)
* bddebian kicks trappist ;-)
<trappist> LaserJock: I think that's awesome.  I wish they were all like that.
<LaserJock> trappist: honestly, I think most are. We slip sometimes but I think for the most part we try to give credit where credit is due
<trappist> LaserJock: yeah in my experience most are.  I got my diaper in a bit of a wad when a patch I was really proud of that took a lot of work had no attribution, and I'm suddenly sensitive to it.
<bddebian> trappist: You are Rocco?
<trappist> yeah
<bddebian> Ahh
<trappist> and you're Barry
<bddebian> Well python wasn't me ;-P
<trappist> I assume
<trappist> yeah I know :)
<bddebian> Yeah, I'm Barry
<LaserJock> the Ubuntu go
<LaserJock> d
<bddebian> pfft
<LaserJock> heah man, you got me started in this whole MOTU thing, I have to say stuff like that ;-)
<bddebian> Heh, yeah, sorry for that ;-P
<trappist> I'm just starting to get interested in the MOTU thing, now that I realize that so many of my favorite packages are in universe
<ogra> bddebian, do it at build time (the copying, not in the source package)
<bddebian> ogra: By build time do you mean in the Makefile instead of in debian/rules?
<ogra> bddebian, nope i mean a cp in rules
<ogra> or mv even
<ogra> you can do it as well with a .install file or if you have with .files ...
<ogra> there are many ways to achieve it ...
<LaserJock> like everything else in packaging ;-)
<bddebian> But then the Makefile doesn't match the filename
<ogra> but moving the png *in* the orig.tar.gz is surely the worst :)
<ogra> copy it in the install target ;)
<akulah> how do I upload a package to REVU?
<LaserJock> akulah: dput revu <package>_source.changes
<akulah> when I do: dupload packagename.changes it uploads it to ubuntu
<akulah> server
<akulah> hello!
<bddebian> akulah: Why are you using dupload instead of dput?
<akulah> sory
<bddebian> Don't be sorry, both work, I was just asking
<redguy> can anyone tell me what sets my eth0 to 169.254.0.0 network even though I have a eth0 inet static section in my /etc/network/interfaces?
<ogra> NM ?
<orbital_fox> anyone alive in here?
<DrMegahertz> sort of
<bddebian> orbital_fox: Define alive :-)
* ogra smells the 110 dead corpses
<bddebian> ogra: :)
<LaserJock> Dapper has killed them all :(
<LaserJock> six extra  weeks has done the MOTU in ;-)
<ogra> evil duck
<Schugy> anyone here who can teach me how to use ./configure e.g. properly, sometimes i have some libs in /usr, /usr/local but when I simply change the prefix pkgconfig-pc-files are searched under the new prefix and not in /usr and /usr/local and so on...
<orbital_fox> is this channel ment to be just for developers?
<trappist> Schugy: try ./configure --help for that
<Schugy> no idea
<Schugy> trappist: i haven't found it out in 5 years of --help
<TomaszD> ok, got a debug log now
<TomaszD> ops
<TomaszD> sorry
<TomaszD> wrong window
<Schugy> damn, i would like to specify a include, lib, bin dir for every single package
<Schugy> installing ekiga on wartyis a pain ^
<ogra> warty is nearly dead, why would someone want to do that ?
<Schugy> well, i would like to use a linux installation for 5-7 years just like others did with win2000, xp blabla....
<ogra> then use one thats supported for 5 years :)
<ogra> warty will be shut down in
<ogra> ~4 weeks
<Schugy> the only problem is that new software doesn't work with 5 year old glibc, gtk, gcc, alsa....
<ogra> and that you dont get any security uptdates etc ...
<Schugy> many projects use bleeding edge libraries
<ogra> wartys 18 months are done ...
<Schugy> still wonder if it's really bad to have a five year old linux just like win xp
<ogra> yes
<bddebian> yes
<ogra> as long as you care about security it is
<Schugy> but maybe there have been 5 years of fixing bugs instead of producing new ones while devoloping new features
<ogra> thats why we make upgrading from release to release so easy
<ogra> warty wont see any bugfixes, security updates etc anymore
<ogra> its dead
<LaserJock> orbital_fox: sort of, people wanting to help out, etc. It isn't a support channel though
<poningru> orbital_fox: also its meant for people who want to package stuff and seeking help in that regard
<Schugy> it always takes several weeks to make a new distro work like the old one
<ogra> really ? did you try it with ubuntu ?
<Schugy> dvb. bluetooth, avm driver, philips webcam driver, xcdroast, webcam_server, mplayer, kde...
<trappist> I used to be an xcdroast guy
<trappist> for mplayer, if I just keep my ~/.mplayer/config and remember to install w32codecs I'm good
<ogra> as long as you make sure ubuntu-desktop is installed, upgrades should be a no brainer ... note that no .deb will ever touch a user config change, sou your config will be preserverd
<Schugy> is mythtv in the universe now? well, there were quite many programs missing in warty :-)
<ogra> its in universe since hoary, yes
<Schugy> cool
<Schugy> and vice c=64 emu?
<ogra> was that missing in warty ?
<ogra> just look at packages.ubuntu.com :)
<Schugy> in breezy...
<Schugy> not warty...
<Schugy> well, i see there was some progress
<bddebian> Hello thierry
<Schugy> oops, i've forgotten to select "any"
<Schugy> but i have 1.19 instead of 1.14
<Schugy> but one essential seems to be still missing!
<Schugy> i've compiled the SuSE jstools from source for warty
<Schugy> i need jstest and jscal. really
<Schugy> and i've posted it in the forums ^^
<Schugy> jscalibrator is just for a special joystick-lib
<Schugy> or is there anything else i don't know?
<thierry> hi bddebian
<phanatic> hi people
<bddebian> Hello phanatic
<phanatic> hey bddebian
<dholbach> have a nice evening
<LaserJock> going already?
<LaserJock> have a good evening dholbach :-)
<dholbach> bye LaserJock
<dholbach> "already"?
<LaserJock> only 12:22pm here
<dholbach> i've been here since ~4:00 time :)
<dholbach> now it's 21:22 my time
<LaserJock> arggh
<LaserJock> poor dholbach :/
<dholbach> yeah couldn't sleep
<dholbach> but i'll have no problems tonight
<LaserJock> I should mention that on the "Ubuntu devs are never around" thread on the forums
<dholbach> maybe :)
<bddebian> Hehe
<bddebian> Later dholbach
<ajmitch> morning
<crimsun> 'morning ajmitch
<ajmitch> LaserJock: which forum thread was that again? :)
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<bddebian> And crimsun
<ajmitch> hello bddebian
<crimsun> 'lo bddebian
<LaserJock> ajmitch: http://www.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=153380
<bddebian> ajmitch: You don't love me anymore :-)
<ajmitch> bddebian: not when you complain like that
<bddebian> What am I complaining about now?  You asked me to lookat Bugs assigned to MOTUs and I am doing so :-)
<ajmitch> 08:16 < bddebian> ajmitch: You don't love me anymore :-)
<ajmitch> LaserJock: oh I could go & explain why the forums just aren't attractive for developers to sit round & help out ;)
<LaserJock> ajmitch: well, I tried to make it sound friendly. I was a forums only guy once.
<ajmitch> yeah
<ajmitch> I try & do stuff on the forums every once in a while
<ajmitch> but it's like spitting in the wind most days
<ajmitch> & I can do more just as a developer
<LaserJock> I can certainly understand that
<ajmitch> usually it's just nagging them to file bugs
<ajmitch> since they often seem unwilling to do that, preferring to just complain in yet another forum thread
<ajmitch> it's a certain class of user that's attracted to the forums :)
<bddebian> What are you trying to say? :)
<ajmitch> bddebian: that I'm bound by the CoC to not go much further
<bddebian> Heh
<LaserJock> lol
<LaserJock> well, I am interested in the people who are really interested
<ajmitch> hm, should I join this NZ loco team, or would it be a waste of my time? ;)
<bddebian> ajmitch: You should just fix bugs.. :-)
<ajmitch> yeah
* ajmitch had better go to uni & 'learn' stuff
<LaserJock> maybe we should have a #ubuntu-motu LoCo team ;-)
<LaserJock> since I swear it is a location
<ajmitch> haha
<ajmitch> it fits the crazy part of loco
<LaserJock> yeah, since they dont' have crack teams ;-)
<ajmitch> such a shame, that
* ajmitch had better go
<LaserJock> cya ajmitch
<bddebian> Later ajmitch
<Kyral> oy oy oy
#ubuntu-motu 2006-04-09
* netjoined: irc.freenode.net -> brown.freenode.net
<nictuku> hi.
<nictuku> LaserJock, remember that python version issue we were discussing yesterday?
<nictuku> LaserJock, that is solved by using python-support
<nictuku> Seveas, are you around?
<bddebian> Hey folks
<bddebian> Heya gang
<OgMaciel> anyone from Boston going to Linux world tomorrow?
<LaserJock> nictuku: yeah
<nictuku> with python-support we can drop all that python2.* confusion
<ajmitch> afternoon
<ajmitch> and a nice, wet afternoon it is here
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<bmonty> evening everyone
<bddebian> Heya bmonty
<bmonty> bddebian: are you uploading packages without attributing the patches again? :)
<bddebian> Not if I can help it
<ajmitch> as long as he's checking the patches thoroughly as well.. ;)
<bmonty> do we prefer attribution by putting the patch author's name as the person who made the change or just mention them in the text of the log?
<bddebian> ajmitch: Oh, I'm supposed to check them? ;-P
<bmonty> I've done both, and had people do both for me
<ajmitch> bddebian: it does help..
<GTswagger> Would anybody be willing to upload the LiSt (linux-stats.org) client for review and (hopefully) inclusion into the main repository?
<GTswagger> There is a .deb file available here:  http://linux-stats.org/index.php?c=download
<crimsun> ...into main?
<crimsun> why main?
<crimsun> (we deal with universe and multiverse here)
<GTswagger> sorry, I use Gentoo and I'm very unfamiliar with Ubuntu... somebody suggested I come here if I wanted to see that this new project makes into Ubuntu's software stack
<GTswagger> umm... added to the equivalent of the "extra repositories" in SuSe and Fedora?  :)
<crimsun> right, well, you really should put it on REVU
<crimsun> see http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU
<GTswagger> REVU -- this?  http://revu.tauware.de/index.py
<crimsun> yes.
<GTswagger> Does it use Launchpad for logging in ... or developers only... or?
<crimsun> just sign up for an acct. You need a GPG key.
<GTswagger> ok -- subscribing now
<GTswagger> alright -- I subscribed to the mailing list -- but I'm still somewhat at a loss for how to upload something to that page -- send it to the mailing list?  I'm assuming the login at the top of REVU is for devs?
<crimsun> you need to wait for your GPG key to be added.
<bddebian> Ack, 1:00am I gotta get my old ass to bed.  Gnight folks
<crimsun> 'night, bddebian
<bddebian> Later crimsun
<zakame> hi MOTUs!
<dholbach> heya motu world!
<zakame> hello dholbach!
<dholbach> heya zakame
<akulah> when i build a .deb package that is not even in debian sid how do I do to name it package0.1ubuntu1?
<freeflying> akulah: if you build for ubuntu , than use 0ubuntu1
<akulah> ok! but how do I do it
<lifeless> freeflying: that does not match everything in the archive
<freeflying> lifeless: he mean that the package not in debain
* netjoined: irc.freenode.net -> brown.freenode.net
<lifeless> freeflying: right. look at other packages not in debian. I don't recall them having ubuntu suffixes
<freeflying> lifeless: if the package not in debain , or you'd have patch for ubuntu only m then we'd add the suufixes
<lifeless> freeflying: mmm. I'm very not sure of that.
<lifeless> ajmitch: any comment ? or dholbach ?
<dholbach> hm?
<freeflying> lifeless: we have policy for ubuntu , so you may get it on wiki  ,hehe
<dholbach> if you make changes for ubuntu you add ubuntu1 if it's not there yet, if it's there you use ubuntu<n+1>
<lifeless> dholbach: yes yes, this is not 'make changes for ubuntu'
<lifeless> dholbach: this is 'upload only to ubuntu'
<dholbach> if it's a no-change upload, you use build<n+1>
<lifeless> dholbach: and I'm going off of an example by mdz when I query this, not because I suddenly wanted to be difficult
<dholbach> I never said you are being difficult
<lifeless> dholbach: I'm just explaining ;)
<dholbach> sure, you can differ from that scheme, if you're sure it won't end up in Debian
<dholbach> most packages of that sort are native packages
<lifeless> freeflying: the wiki is big, if you point someone at it please give a hint for the page, or the url. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/New/Policy is what I think you meant and it answers my question
<lifeless> dholbach: yes, that makes sense to me.
<dholbach> xorg otoh was not :)
<dholbach> and they still chose to use 6.x.x-<n>
<akulah> EX: I want to build a new package but it can't be found in Ubuntu or Debian and I want to add th ubuntu suffix to the package name
<akulah> how do I do that?
<freeflying> akulah: you'd find if it is in debian
<akulah> I mean do I have to change the rules file or what?
<akulah> and if it isn't in debian
<akulah> ?
<freeflying> akulah: you mean it is in debian now ?
<akulah> no it is not in debian unstable
<freeflying> you build it from scratch ?
<akulah> yes
<akulah> I wanted to upload it to REVU
<freeflying> change it in debian/changelog
<akulah> aha
<akulah> I get it
<akulah> tnx
<siretart> hi
<siretart> does daniel robitaille irc?
<dholbach> siretart: hi... his nick is robitaille, and i suppose he's in bed now (canadian)
<siretart> ah, okay
<siretart> hey daniel :)
<kelmo_lap> gday
<siretart> hey kelmo_lap :)
<kelmo_lap> hi siretart
<siretart> kelmo_lap: is there anything left to do for the next wpasupplicant upload?
<kelmo_lap> siretart, nothing i can think of currently
<kelmo_lap> siretart, the -0.5 branch is also in sync with -stable
<kelmo_lap> siretart, i'd like to see that go up at the same time, if possible
<siretart> kelmo_lap: ok. could you arrange to uploads to debian then?
* siretart really hopes that he gets an AM assigned soon..
<kelmo_lap> ok, i can try my best, probaly contact Kyle first
<kelmo_lap> probably*
<siretart> ok
<allee> ajmitch_: any news about python2.3 variants of python pkgs in main?
<allee> ajmitch_: oh, more presice: any news about python2.3 variants in universe of python{,-2.4} pkgs in main?
<siretart> kelmo_lap: thanks
<siretart> allee: if the source is in main, then all build depends must be satisfiable in main as well. python2.3 has been demoted to universe AFAIK
<ajmitch> evening
<Se7h> morning
<allee> evening ajmitch
<allee> ajmitch: any news about python2.3 variants in universe of python{,-2.4} pkgs in main?
<ajmitch> no
<allee> 'k
<allee> I've asked astrowise upstream about 2.4 support. No answer yet
<Toadstool> hi here
<phanatic> hi people
<phanatic> hey raphink, Gloubiboulga and G0SUB :)
<G0SUB> phanatic: hey!
<Gloubiboulga> hi phanatic
<jsmidt> I'm trying to build a package that doesn't have a makefile.  To install the package to type ./seamonkey.  How do I alter debian/rules to fix this?  I've been using debhelper and it is complaining it can't find a makefile.
<Gloubiboulga> jsmidt, are you Joseph Smidt?
<Gloubiboulga> (just to be sure)
<jsmidt> yes
<Gloubiboulga> jsmidt, I'm Gauvain Pocentek :)
<jsmidt> That's funny
<Gloubiboulga> yes :)
<jsmidt> Gloubiboulga, thanks a lot for your help with texmaker.  I'm new at this.
<Gloubiboulga> jsmidt, no problem, I'm glad I can help
<phanatic> jsmidt: Gloubiboulga helps newbies a lot, a can confirm that :)
<jsmidt> That's why I ask questions like the one above.
<cyberix> How do I add a picture to a page in Ubuntu wiki?
<Gloubiboulga> jsmidt, I'm surprised that seamonkey doesn't use autotools
<jsmidt> Gloubiboulga, I think you are right.  It looks like they have more than one source tarbill and I downloaded the wrong one.
<Gloubiboulga> jsmidt, you've probably downloaded the binary installer
<jsmidt> yes, I did
<TheMuso> Is there a way to get into a pbuilder chroot right after a package fails to complete buiding?
<TheMuso> I know there is the login argument, but am not sure how to use it in this context.
<azeem> I am not aware of one
<azeem> but I don't use pbuilder myself
<siretart> TheMuso: look in /usr/share/doc/pbuilder/examples for a 'C' hook
<TheMuso> siretart: Thanks.
<TheMuso> siretart: C hook? I am not quite sure what I am looking for.
<TheMuso> Ah got it.
<bddebian> Oh, forgot my obligitoray "Heya gang" :-)
<Toadstool> :D
<Toadstool> hey bddebian
<bddebian> Hello Toadstool
<Toadstool> bddebian: I don't want one of my package to depend on openssl to generate a random base64 encoded key with openssl rand -base64 32... what do you think of "dd if=/dev/random bs=32 count=1 | uuencode -m key" and a sharutils dependency?
<TheMuso> If any MOTUs could review Malone bug #38028, that would be great. Thanks.
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 38028 in xcursor-themes "Latest source release of xcursor-themes FTBFS" [Normal,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/38028
<TheMuso> bddebian: BTW, that other upload you did for me for silc-toolkit. The binaries haven't shown up in the archive yet, even though they have been successfully built.
<bddebian> Toadstool: Uhm, you're over my head on that one, sorry
<bddebian> TheMuso: Weird, I'll check on it
<truz24> Is it possibly to get VMware Player added to the repositories?
<truz24> possible*
<Tm_T> truz24: is it freely distributable?
<Tm_T> I know it's free as a beer but is it free as FOSS
<truz24> No
<truz24> They aren't providing source code
<truz24> but I wondered if it could be packaged and put it multiverse or something...
<ogra> that doesnt matter
<ogra> if they have a license that allows free redistribution, its suitable for multiverse
<Tm_T> that's what I was asking
<Yagisan> Yay, my system is booting again.
<crimsun> that's always a good thing.
<Tm_T> Yagisan: hmm, that means it's time to break things, right?
<truz24> You must obtain VMware's prior written consent for each application that you intend to bundle or distribute with the Software.
<truz24> I guess that isn't something we like to do for packages...
<Yagisan> crimsun: it's been dead to the world since since a failed dapper upgrade on Saturday
<Yagisan> Tm_T: not again thanks.
<truz24> lol
<crimsun> truz24: does that apply to the Player itself or just anything distributed with the Player?
<truz24> the player
<Yagisan> hmm, dapper does look pretty spiffy compared to breezy
<truz24> If you wish to distribute VMware Player, please read our Distribution Agreement.
<truz24> http://www.vmware.com/download/eula/player_distribution.html
<truz24> I just think it would be awesome to "apt-get install vmware-player" ( which would also install the kernel module for you too :-) )
<truz24> I don't mind compiling the module, but other people I know who use ubuntu/vmware don't know how to do that stuff and I always have to do it.
<truz24> and if they upgrade their kernel.... do i again i do
<truz24> first i = it
<crimsun> that license is decidedly non-free
<crimsun> it's not suitable for even multiverse
<truz24> Ok
<crimsun> look at 2.1.4, for instance
<Yagisan> nope not at all
<truz24> I don't see a violation in 2.14
<truz24> 2.1.4*
<crimsun> it's a gaping violation of DFSG
<Yagisan> I see one in 2.1.3
<Yagisan> hmm vmware-player or gcc, I'd rather gcc
<truz24> I thought it was more a social engineering clause
<Yagisan> "hacking" tools
<crimsun> how precisely do you prevent someone from launching a DDoS?
<Yagisan> ;)
<truz24> lol
<truz24> I assume that means distributing an image that has a root kit on it
<Yagisan> 2.1.5 causes issues with our release cycle
<truz24> and they are just being very general
<crimsun> yes, but assuming gets us into trouble.
<truz24> Yeah, it does.
<truz24> They need to not be difficult :-)
<crimsun> the problem is that it's vague enough to render ping a culprit
<truz24> yeah
<bddebian> Heya Yagisan, how goes it?
<Yagisan> bddebian: finally back up :)
<Amaranth_> ack the launchpad UI changed again
<bddebian> It did?
<bddebian> Has it gotten worse again?
* bddebian ducks
<Yagisan> bddebian: 1 new lite-on burner + 50 dvd's later I've got a fresh install up. Now to restore it all
<bddebian> Egads
<Amaranth_> bddebian: the left column is overloaded with information now, the right column is almost empty
<Yagisan> bddebian: this lite-on burner is great. I can abuse the hell out of it, and only 4 coasters. It's been going almost non-stop since I bought it.
<Yagisan> now to get 4 days email :(
* Yagisan sighs. forgot to set up spamassassin 
* Yagisan sighs again. evolution doesn't want to print.
<trappist> I remember when lite-on drives were crap
<Yagisan> trappist: oh, then you haven't tried gigabyte yet. they reached new levels of crapness
<trappist> no, memorex has earned my trust, and they're not too expensive, so that's what I buy these days
<Yagisan> back in a bit. need to beat cups and my p-o-s printer into submission
<cassou> hi
<cassou> ogra ?
<ogra> cassou, ?
<cassou> ogra: I'm the one for squeak-vm, remember ?
<ogra> sure
<cassou> gra, it seems Laserjock corrected lot's of things in squeak-vm-3.7.7-5ubuntu5
<cassou> ogra: but it seems this version is not on the repositories
<cassou> can you check it please ?
<ogra> hmm, thats a bit trickya, i only have powerpcs around
<Gloubiboulga> 3.7.7-5ubuntu4 is on the repos
<Gloubiboulga> on x86 :)
<ogra> the source is there, it either ftbfs or its stuck in NEW because he added a squeak metapackage
<cassou> can't you just have a look at the repositories ?
<ogra> http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/multiverse/s/squeak-vm/
<cassou> I see
<cassou> what can be done then ?
<ogra> look at the logs
<ogra> on lauinchpad
<cassou> where exactely ?
<ogra> sorry i'm very busy with other stuff, launchpad has all info you need
<cassou> ok, thanks
<cassou> I'll take a look
<Gloubiboulga> cassou, https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/dapper/+source/squeak-vm/+builds
<cassou> thank you
<cassou> it seems squeak-vm is build correctly on x86
<cassou> I'll have a closer look
<cassou> thank you
<dholbach> did you all notice that Malone can search for Universe bugs now?
<bddebian> No
<dholbach> http://tinyurl.com/nl87h
* ..[topic/#ubuntu-motu:dholbach] : Ubuntu Masters of the Universe: Ubuntu Universe Repository Maintainers | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Documentation | We are in feature freeze now. Focus on http://tinyurl.com/nl87h
<dholbach> :-)
<Yagisan> w00t. I know why I can't print now. esp ghostscript dies while rendering. :(
<dholbach> oh nice
<dholbach> tell diziet
<dholbach> he'll be delighted to investigate
<ogra> heh
<Yagisan> great
<crimsun> bddebian: ECONTEXT
<bddebian> ?
<crimsun> /usr/include/IV-2_6/InterViews ?
<crimsun> (no context for that question)
<bddebian> Oh
<cassou> ogra: it seems squeak is published now. Thank you
<ogra> yup, as i said it was stuck in NEW ...
<cassou> LaserJock: are you here ?
<ogra> needed a little kick
<ogra> :)
<bddebian> crimsun: mxv is getting the wrong path for InterViews/perspective.h
<cassou> ogra: thank you for your kick then :-)
<crimsun> bddebian: does it use pkg-config?
<ogra> i just kicked the guy who kicked the package ;)
<cassou> ogra: cool :-)
<bddebian> crimsun:
<bddebian> ivmkmf -a
<bddebian> + imake -T template -I/usr/lib/ivtools/config '-DCURDIR=`pwd`' -DUseInstalled
<bddebian> + make Makefile ARCH=LINUX UseInstalled=1
<crimsun> well, it shouldn't be an imake problem anymore (fabbione fixed that)
<crimsun> if the source file is including the wrong path to perspective.h, then that needs to be fixed
<crimsun> if it's not getting the path at all, then yeah, you need -I
<bddebian> Oohh, it's finding /usr/X11R6/include instead of /usr/include/..
<LaserJock> cassou: yes
<cassou> LaserJock: hi
<cassou> LaserJock: thank you very much for all your work on squeak
<crimsun> huh. I bet ivmkmf wasn't fixed.
<LaserJock> oh, heah. Are you the guy with all the bugs?
<bddebian> crimsun: That's my guess
<cassou> LaserJock: yes, sorry
<bddebian> crimsun: Any idea who I'd bug about that?
<crimsun> imake (1:1.0.1-0ubuntu2) dapper; urgency=low * Fix xmkmf config path. -- Fabio M. Di Nitto <fabbione@ubuntu.com>  Sat, 28 Jan 2006 10:38:56 +0100
<bddebian>  xmkmf?
<crimsun> no, ivtools-dev needs to be fixed
<bddebian> Aye, I was looking at your imake thing :_)
<crimsun> or ivtools, rather
<crimsun> yes, look at fabbione's fix. (It's basically a change to use /usr/include/X11 instead)
* bddebian wonders if he should attempt to fix that
<bddebian> But the ivtools stuff is in /usr/include not /usr/include/X11
<crimsun> ivtools-dev provides ivmkmf, correct?
<bddebian> afaik
<crimsun> so ivmkmf is producing invalid imake templates that use the old XFree86 include path instead of the new modular X.Org one
<crimsun> thus ivmkmf needs to be fixed
<bddebian> Am I being unclear?
* crimsun updates pbuilder and downloads the source
<bddebian> I have it :-)
* bddebian races crimsun
<crimsun> oh by all means, fix it
<crimsun> I have three honors theses to review by tomorrow
<bddebian> Ugh
<bddebian> Hmm, weird, configure.in looks right
<bddebian> Oh, debian/dirs is wrong I think
<crimsun> it's not just debian/*
<crimsun> take a look at that nasty Makefile in the toplevel source
<bddebian>     + Moved all includes/libs/install dirs from /usr/X11R6/* to /usr/*
<bddebian>   * Renamed debian/ivtools-unidraw to debian/ivtools-unidrawc2a
<bddebian>   * debian/*.files: Adjusted the paths
<bddebian> Maybe just regenerate it with imake?
<crimsun> yes, the Makefiles definitely need to be regenerated
<bddebian> Ack, what do I pass to imake?
<crimsun> don't change the imake invocation. You need to use xmkmf
<crimsun> -> office hours
<bddebian> Huh?
<crimsun> (debian/rules's imake invocation, shown above [?] , is fine)
<bddebian> I'm talking about ivtools
<crimsun> yes, and that's precisely what I mentioned 30 minutes ago
<crimsun> wherever ivtools/config ends up being installed needs to be the path passed to imake in src/scripts/ivmkmf
<bddebian> Oh
<bddebian> Sorry I'm a little slow :-O)
<bddebian> crimsun: Sorry, one last dumb question.  Can I just rebuild or do I have to DO something with ivmkmf first after removing X11R6?
<Jobman> Filed Bug #38093 and attached debdiff. Is it correct so far?
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 38093 in enigmail-locales "unmet dep" [Normal,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/38093
<bddebian> Later gents
<bddebian> Damn I did it again.. AND LADIES :-)
<crimsun> bddebian: sorry, just returned
<bddebian> Gah :-)
<bddebian> OK, I hacked the shit out of debian/*, I've run xmkmf and everything else and it keeps puking :-(
<crimsun> bddebian: but did you modify the ivmkmf script?
<crimsun> it has hardcoded references to /usr/X11R6/* in it
<bddebian> Yes
<crimsun> ok
<crimsun> I'll look later
<bddebian> NP, I gotta head home anyway.  Thanks
<crimsun> np, see ya
<sivang> can anyone toss me the link to the "the" debina shared library packaging howto? (I know there is one repeatedly referenced doc)
<sivang> raphink: any idea? ^^
<raphink> sivang: on ?
#ubuntu-motu 2007-04-02
<crimsun> shawarma: well, the first point is rather moot, so we're really discussing the second...?
<shawarma> crimsun: Why is the first point moot?
* shawarma may not entirely understand what "moot" means..
<lupine_85> "moot" ~= "a given"
<crimsun> shawarma: it's not the present interface that matters but the fact that there's no midi available by default
<shawarma> lupine_85: Thanks.
<crimsun> I believe a few bug reports are open that lament missing midi functionality OOTB
<jdong> lupine_85: more like "No longer relevant/needing arguing."
<jdong> or maybe I suck at assuming what moot means too :D
<crimsun> (jdong has the gist of it)
<lupine_85> if you want to get technical, it's a gathering where people agree on things
<lupine_85> ;)
<jdong> lupine_85: or the USA law term meaning circumstances changed to the point where it is no longer actionable to contest a point :)
<shawarma> crimsun: Ok. Well, yes, I suppose we're discussing the second point, then.
<jdong> but anyway, this is all... err.. moot.
<lupine_85> :)
<jdong> :)
<crimsun> shawarma: so something for which it's worth creating a Feisty+1 spec would be providing midi functionality OOTB
<shawarma> crimsun: Right.
<crimsun> we load snd-seq by default as of Feisty anyhow, so simply having timidity seeded in desktop would resolve much of it
<shawarma> crimsun: Yes, whether it's using timidity is secondary.
<LaserJock> darn, I need to keep remembering it's April 1st
<LaserJock> I almost had a heart attack reading about Martin Krafft getting kicked out of Debian ;-)
<shawarma> crimsun: Precisely... That's why I'm wondering why it's not done already.
<crimsun> shawarma: likely lack of resources
<shawarma> crimsun: Possibly. I just expected a technical reason, but couldn't imagine what it'd be.
<shawarma> crimsun: And since your the sound guru..
<crimsun> nope, the closest thing to a technical "reason" would be bug 34831
<ubotu> Malone bug 34831 in linux-source-2.6.15 "Hardlock of entire system (Dapper Flight 5)" [High,Rejected]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/34831
<crimsun> that's precisely the reason I used the sledgehammer approach in alsa-driver (as of 1.0.13-1ubuntu1)
<crimsun> one of the things on my plate for Feisty+1 is scrapping the entire asound.state saving/restoring, as the mixer interface is far too volatile (thanks, HDA!) to be useful
<shawarma> I see.
<crimsun> (yes, I have much _love_ for HDA.)
<crimsun> in any case, if you want to file an MIR for timidity, feel free :)
<DktrKranz> LaserJock, we discovered something about yesterday's php issue
<LaserJock> DktrKranz: yes?
<Fujitsu> crimsun, shawarma: Isn't timidity pretty useless without a soundfont? The size of those isn't insignificant.
<shawarma> crimsun: Nah, I try to stay away from anything that has to do with sound.
<DktrKranz> well, php-interbase and friends depends on a package in universe
<shawarma> Fujitsu: freepaths is about 10 MB, I think.
<shawarma> Fujitsu: freepats.
<crimsun> shawarma: aww.
<Fujitsu> 30MiB.
<shawarma> Really? Shit.
<Fujitsu> Yeah.
<DktrKranz> so they were dropped accordingly
<DktrKranz> it's the correct behaviour
<LaserJock> bah, we have plenty of room on the CD;-)
<LaserJock> DktrKranz: what do you mean?
<crimsun> bah, just because edubuntu now has _2_ cds... ;-)
<LaserJock> hehe
<Fujitsu> LaserJock: Damn you and your second CD.
<LaserJock> hehe
<LaserJock> we only put 200MB on it
<LaserJock> I've got another 500MB to play with ;-)
<crimsun> hey, another openoffice.org instance might fit...
<Fujitsu> Hopefully we'll have maxima and co. on there next time.
<DktrKranz> php-interbase could not be included into php5 (in main) because of a universe dependency
* Fujitsu hits crimsun hard.
<LaserJock> DktrKranz: right, but it shouldn't have just been dropped
<Fujitsu> LaserJock: What other choice was there?
<LaserJock> make a package for it
<Fujitsu> We have a few other similar situations.
<DktrKranz> they had to be packaged as stand-alone packages
<Fujitsu> LaserJock: That requires a universe-based php5 as well...
<Fujitsu> Or does it not need all of php5 to build?
<LaserJock> no it doesn't
<DktrKranz> anyway, there was some doubt about this procedure
<LaserJock> well, it is tricky
<LaserJock> but we shouldn't just abandon packages because they dep on Universe :(
<DktrKranz> of course
<DktrKranz> the main discussion was how to handle them
<DktrKranz> since debian ships them in php5
<Fujitsu> LaserJock: As I said, there are other cases of this... it'd be nice to fix that, though.
<DktrKranz> we have some options
<LaserJock> where was this discussed?
<Fujitsu> The same with AAC support and stuff.
<DktrKranz> here, this afternoon
<LaserJock> ok, but it was dropped a while ago, right?
<LaserJock> there should have been some discussion on ubuntu-devel or something
<DktrKranz> it was dropped during autosync of php5 in october
<LaserJock> it's annoying to loose packages that are depended on without any discussion
<DktrKranz> (or when it happened, i didn't remind the exact date)
<LaserJock> although I guess at the time the deps were php4
<DktrKranz> you guess right
<DktrKranz> StevenK proposed to include them in a "php5-universe" package
<DktrKranz> but this way we should monitor php5 updates
<Fujitsu> We really should be notified when archive people do that.
<DktrKranz> and workload is quite high
<Fujitsu> We already have a couple with universe/multiverse clones, like gtkpod.
<DktrKranz> so there isn't an immediate solution 
<DktrKranz> nor a bitesize one
<DktrKranz> we could see if it is possible to promote firebird2
<DktrKranz> but it requires time
<geser> DktrKranz: promoting firebird2 would solve it for php-interbase but not for the other php modules (php-imap, php-mcrypt)
<DktrKranz> that's right, checked
<TheMuso> crimsun: Ok thanks for the update.
<DktrKranz> good night :)
* bddebian learns that playing Jedi Academy with a 7 year old is pointless :-)
<ajmitch> bddebian: they beat you constantly?
<bddebian> Heh
<bddebian> ajmitch: Hey, you should be happy.  You are about to get rid of me. :-)
<ajmitch> oh are we?
<ajmitch> silly me, I thought you wanted your team membership renewed
<LaserJock> darn Windows, I boot into XP to do taxes and it messes up the clock
<joejaxx> :\
<zul> teaches you a lesson to not to use xp
<LaserJock> yeah
<LaserJock> I wonder if the tax software would work in Wine
<jmg> 1.25, 1.41, 1.43
<LaserJock> it's stupid though, XP couldn't figure out daylight savings time
<bddebian> LaserJock: It needs a patch
<bddebian> ajmitch: I'm not quite sure how I'm supposed to renew it
<LaserJock> bddebian: reply and say "please, pretty please, with a cherry on top!"
<RAOF> Hi LaserJock :)
<LaserJock> hi
<LaserJock> brb, gotta reboot Windows for a sec for my wifes recipie program ;-)
<Burgundavia> LaserJock: you need to get her using gourmet
<bddebian> LaserJock: I would have assumed some type of knowing whether I was wanted back or not I guess.  Though sistpoty kind of did that I guess.
<LaserJock> bddebian: it's more if you want to be renewed
<LaserJock> at least that was my understanding
<ajmitch> bddebian: you renew it by the TB giving you a big tick
<ajmitch> hello Burgundavia 
<Burgundavia> hey ajmitch
<bddebian> ajmitch: But what is the "process"?
<LaserJock> Burgundavia: well, it's a specific program on CD called "Million Recipies", not ones that she's put in
<ajmitch> bddebian: sit back & relax, you've seen the MC thread
<LaserJock> I *think* I installed it in Wine but it doesn't find the CD (it needs the CD)
<ajmitch> alrighty then
* bddebian hopes his "building" machine hasn't finally died for good
<joejaxx> :(
<poningru> uhoh
<poningru> then we're all in trouble
* poningru hooksup his amd64 to the intarwebs as an offering
* ajmitch was thinking of what he should put in a new box
* joejaxx gets bddebian a backup abacus
<bddebian> w00t
<bddebian> :)
<joejaxx> :)
<joejaxx> abacus ftw :)
<joejaxx> hmm
<joejaxx> i have finally found out another difference between vmware workstation and server
<joejaxx> server does not have video capture capabilites
<jdong> joejaxx: also multiple snapshot abilities
<ajmitch> mmm, quad core chip...
<poningru> joejaxx: also kernel utils
<joejaxx> hmm i might have to switch back to workstation for this one
<joejaxx> hmm
* joejaxx thinks
<bddebian> woo hoo she lives
<joejaxx> :)
<ajmitch> that's useful
* ajmitch wonders if the w2k3 server upstairs is alive yet
<joejaxx> ajmitch: what version?
<joejaxx> web, standard, enterprise, datacenter, storage?
* ajmitch shrugs
<ajmitch> it's not exactly relevant
<zul> happy joy joy..
<Kamping_Kaiser> i seem to remember the way to ask for package inclusion changed recently. can someone point me where i need to look for details?
<Hobbsee> Kamping_Kaiser: ubuntu-motu ML
<Kamping_Kaiser> Hobbsee, thanks :| i'll hope its in the archives :|
<TheMuso> Heya Hobbsee.
<TheMuso> How goes uni?
<Hobbsee> hi TheMuso.  it goes, with lots of assignments
<TheMuso> Don't remind me. :)
<TheMuso> My uni days are still very fresh in my mind.
* RAOF is marking first year test :)
<Hobbsee> heh
<ajmitch> hi australians
<TheMuso> Fun.
<TheMuso> Hey ajmitch.
<RAOF> Hey ajmitch.
* Jucato waves to Hobbsee and RAOF and ajmitch and etc etc etc :)
<Hobbsee> hiya Jucato 
<Jucato> RAOF: if you recalled my RAM problem in #ubuntu+1 yesterday, yeah it was a loose chip :/
* Jucato now operating on full 1GB RAM again
<RAOF> :)
<crimsun> 03 - Upside Down.mp3: Audio file with ID3 version 24.0 tag, MP3 encoding
<crimsun> that's an interesting ID3 version
<TheMuso> heh
* crimsun looks at Debian 412513
<ubotu> Debian bug 412513 in file "file: Typo in description of MP3 with ID3 v2.3 tag" [Minor,Open]  http://bugs.debian.org/412513
* TheMuso marvels at how good cdparanoia is.
<TheMuso> Even with tracks it says some bits have uncorrected errors/skips.
<TheMuso> Yet the track sounds perfect.
<RAOF> Sandpapering your CD collection?
<TheMuso> Must be a good drive as well.
<RAOF> Probably.  I like cdparanoia too :)
<TheMuso> RAOF: No, a CD I lent to someone and it wasn't treated very well.
<RAOF> >:(
<TheMuso> Actually, I didn't lend, someone else did without asking :S
* RAOF wrote the patch to Banshee that allows you to use paranoia mode on import.
<TheMuso> Cool.
* TheMuso uses, and loves, abcde!!
<RAOF> Sadly I don't know a smily more angry than ">:("
<crimsun> just use a pointy stick of doom
<TheMuso> hahaha
<don_j> hey hey
* Hobbsee DOOMS crimsun 
<don_j> I'm trying to make a deb package but it aint workin' as expected
<crimsun> sorry, I've got a magic pony
* ajmitch watches launchpad disappear
* RAOF wishes he had a magic mind-reading pony.
* don_j nods
<don_j> any package maintainers on the line?
<TheMuso> Yeah there are many of us here. :)
<don_j> cool
<TheMuso> don_j: What exactly is the problem?
<don_j> I can compile it the 'normal' way (./configure && make && make install) but when I invoke dpkg-buildpackage strange things seems to happen
<TheMuso> don_j: Things? What things? Please give some more information.
<don_j> its a fresh version of gstreamer
<don_j> I'm tryin' to get the new totem erected
<TheMuso> don_j: Please patebin any errors you are getting and I can then try to help you further.
<TheMuso> pastebin even
<don_j> some fresh version of GTK and glib is missing too
<don_j> and I'm all new to this dpkg system so I thought you might wanted to do all the hard work
<don_j> make[5] : *** [libgstspider.la]  Error 1
<ajmitch> that misses the actual error
<don_j> should I grep the errors or how do I do it?
<don_j> libtool: link: warning: `/usr/lib/gcc/i486-linux-gnu/4.0.3/../../..//libxml2.la'  seems to be moved
* Hobbsee wonders why we'd want to do all the hard work for someone else, instead of point them in the right directino.
<don_j> Hobbsee: because it's to get a nicer ubuntu image instead of that buggy ol' totem version
<crimsun> Hobbsee: well since LP is down for maint, we likely have nothing to do
<don_j> undefined reference to `g_type_ class_ref'
<Hobbsee> crimsun: thought you were subscribed to bug lists
<TheMuso> don_j: Did you use the original packaging data from the version of totem in Ubuntu?
<crimsun> Hobbsee: pfft, subscribing to bug lists is for deities!?
<Hobbsee> yes.  :P
<don_j> not really; I'm runnin' the buildpackage too in a the source directory though
<don_j> err. not really; I'm runnin' the buildpackage toot in the original source directory though
<don_j> tool damnit
<RAOF> don_j: Rather than playing 20 questions with you, why don't you try to summarize: (1) What you're trying to do, (2) how you are going about it, (3) pastebin the entire build-log, and optionally (4) why you're doing it in the first place :)
<don_j> RAOF: cant you explain how to do it instead?
<don_j> #1 I'm trying to update gstreamer
<Hobbsee> don_j: that's documented in the packaging guide, for the most part.
<Hobbsee> don_j: to explain everything about packaging, when a lot of it's documented anyway, is not terribly sensible w.r.t resource use
<don_j> #2 I fetched the gstreamer-0.8.11.tar.gz from ftp.gnome.org
<RAOF> Old school :)
<don_j> RAOF: yeah
* RAOF doesn't understand why don_j is trying to build totem against an old gstreamer.
<don_j> what log-file?
<RAOF> don_j: Not a log file, the entire terminal output that occurs when you dpkg-buildpackage your package.
<RAOF> However, Hobbsee has a better idea:
<RAOF> You've read the packaging guide, right?
<don_j> ./configure GST_LIBS=/usr/local/include/gstreamer-0.8/ GST_CFLAGS=/usr/local/include/gstreamer-0.8/gst/
<RAOF> Nooo!  I didn't mean "paste here" I meant "pastebin"!
<don_j> Requested 'glib-2.0 >= 2.12.0' but version of GLib is 2.10.3
<don_j> but that was the ./configure totem step to show some perspective
<RAOF> don_j: Isolated snippets don't really give any useful information.
<RAOF> !packagingguide | don_j 
<ubotu> don_j: The packaging guide is at http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/index.html - See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/New for information on getting a package integrated into Ubuntu - Other developer resources are at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DeveloperResources - See also !backports
<RAOF> You *have* read that, right?
<Hobbsee> don_j: so you're building on an old release of gnome, giving us no real useful information, and expect us to hold your hand for every single step?  I think you're dreaming...
<don_j> I've alread looked into all that but I still cant get into a deb package
<Hobbsee> there's lots of stuff MOTU's already doing.
* Hobbsee thought a prerequisite of building packages and such was to be willing to look for information, and work things through yourself, rather than expect hand-holding for each step.
<don_j> RAOF: what's the new version of gstreamer then?
<Jucato> Hobbsee: may I quote you on that? :)
<Hobbsee> Jucato: sure.
<Jucato> :D
<don_j> Hobbsee: It;s for your own best man
<don_j> Hobbsee: I could just skip all the debianization steps
<Hobbsee> don_j: how?  
<Jucato> Hobbsee: j/k... but I'll be mentioning it in my blog :)
* Jucato bows down to the lady with the long pointy stick of doom :)
<Hobbsee> Jucato: not a bad idea, actually.  for an explanation on how to start doing MOTU-type stuff, and what you need
<don_j> Hobbsee: by not using that dpkg-buildpackage too
<don_j> tool
<Jucato> Hobbsee: that's what I'm planning to do with my MOTU series of blog posts :)
<RAOF> don_j: It might be worthwhile testing out that supposition.  You'll get the same errors trying to configure that manually, too.  Unless you can build the source normally, you can't expect dpkg-buildpackage to magically fix things.
<don_j> RAOF: It works when I build it manually
<don_j> at least totem doesnt complain after I build gst manually
<Hobbsee> but it doesnt when you use debian packaging, for some unknown reason, which you dont think is important enough to tell us, only the stuff around it.  yay.
<don_j> Hobbsee: What log file?
<Hobbsee> don_j: the build log
<RAOF> Also, I don't see how this will help Ubuntu.  Gstreamer0.8 hasn't been used in Ubuntu since Dapper (or was it Breezy?)
<don_j> should I just pipe the output to a file?
<don_j> RAOF: Whats the new version then?
<RAOF> 0.10
<Kamping_Kaiser> the email https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-motu/2007-March/001480.html asks to set to wishlist on 'needs packaging' bugs, but afaik most people cant - i know i cant. if theres another public location for that (say the wiki) could it be updated?
<don_j> gstreamer-0.10.8.tar.gz then
<Hobbsee> Kamping_Kaiser: i'd presume that one would just omit that instruction, and do the rest.  
<Hobbsee> (non-motu and people not in -qa cant)
* Hobbsee wonders where (if) that's on the wiki
<Kamping_Kaiser> Hobbsee, i did, but non motus will be wanting to request packages, and the instructions will 'fail' for all of them. a simple 'note this can only be done by motus' would be fine
<Hobbsee> Kamping_Kaiser: indeed.
<RAOF> Oooh, launchpad's out of beta.  Cool!
<Hobbsee> Kamping_Kaiser: seeing as it's a ML, it'd have to be copied to a wiki, seeing as most people wouldtn likely find the second message
<LaserJock> RAOF: ?
<Kamping_Kaiser> Hobbsee, i'm inclined to agree ;), but i didnt see it under MOTU/
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: the new interface
<RAOF> LaserJock: Head over to launchpad.net.  For me, everything now uses the beta interface, and I no longer have to strip "beta." from in front of all the links :)
<Kamping_Kaiser> those little menu things take their time loading though, thtas going to drive me insane
<TheMuso> I hope they did the right thing by turning it on for everybody.
<Jucato> ooooh shiny new launchpad
<Jucato> roflmao!!! help.launchpad.net is... :D
<crimsun> holy hackergotchi stretch, batman
<ajmitch> Jucato: hm?
<Jucato> roflmao :)
<ajmitch> Jucato: I don't see the humour
<Jucato> ajmitch: nothing I didn't realize it was an unthemed moinmoin :)
<Jucato> (the roflmao was for the hackergotchi)
<Jucato> (the 2nd one)
<imbrandon> moins all
<ajmitch> hi imbrandon 
<Jucato> moin imbrandon
<ajmitch> crimsun: nicely stretched 
<LaserJock> I put my old hackergotchi back up
<Kamping_Kaiser> lol. your right, there is some stretch happening
* Jucato just only saw help.LP.net today... and didn't know why it was that way..
<imbrandon> i've had the same one forever
<Jucato> hm... fancy help side panel...
* Jucato wonders how they made that...
<TheMuso> hackergotchis.... pfft
<LaserJock> TheMuso: some people appreciate them, I dunno
<Kamping_Kaiser> Jucato, the one taht says "Sorry, help isnt available for this page."? :P
<Jucato> Kamping_Kaiser: for which page?
<Kamping_Kaiser> Jucato, faq :P
* Jucato is actually more interested in the implementation of the side tab/panel thingy :)
<Jucato> ah heh :)
<imbrandon> whoops fujitsu's python majic dosent like the beta interface :)
* imbrandon pokes it a bit
<LaserJock> heh, this is funny to see people seeing Beta for the first time
<imbrandon> LaserJock, hehe yea 
<Kamping_Kaiser> hm. no help on homepages either :/
<imbrandon> when did they roll out? i dident notice since i've had it for a while now
<crimsun> about 30 mins ago, if you meant beta.LP going public
<imbrandon> crimsun, yup
<LaserJock> man, I bet my LP bug mailboxes are going to get pretty busy :-)
* Jucato waves to LaserJock too
<Jucato> pretty LP :)
<LaserJock> well, this should mean some things I've been wanting to land have finally made it
<Jucato> or in this case, to "launch" :)
<LaserJock> tag preloading and search by bug contact should be in now
<crimsun> yanno, if I could see, in ~/+bugs , those subscribed/assigned bugs for which teams I'm also in, I could just killfile all these LP emails
<ajmitch> LaserJock: yay!
<LaserJock> well, I did get ~/+bugs to show both assigned and subscribed bugs
<LaserJock> hmm, it would have been good if they could have automatically scaled the hackergotchis
<don_j> Finally it workd :)
<imbrandon> ugh screenscaping sucks
<LaserJock> imbrandon: no kidding, what do you need?
* ajmitch hasn't bothered with hackergotchis
<ajmitch> since there are no decent photos of me
<LaserJock> I took one with the iSight thingy on my iMac at work
<LaserJock> that's all I could come up with
<imbrandon> LaserJock, i'm trying to adapt the users script that Fujitsu made for the c-b-n
<imbrandon> and for some reason its only returning 2 users ;)
<LaserJock> c-b-n?
<imbrandon> community build network
<LaserJock> ah
<don_j> now I got a conflict  trying to overwrite `/usr/bin/gst-xmllaunch-0.10', which is also in package gstreamer0.10-tools
<imbrandon> after i fix this , since beta is rolled out i'll poke the LP guys to get a real xml-rpc interface
* ajmitch hopes that bugs with lvm snapshots are solved soon in feisty
<ajmitch> so that we can use sbuild :)
<imbrandon> don_j, seems to be pretty self explinitory
<imbrandon> wasup?
<imbrandon> ajmitch, right on, yeqa
<imbrandon> yea*
<don_j> imbrandon: can you hint me to solve it?
<imbrandon> remove the dupe file from the package where it dosent belong 
<don_j> imbrandon: by changing some configuration switch?
<imbrandon> e.g. /usr/bin/gst-xmllaunch-0.10 cant be in your package and -tools unless yours replaces/provides -tools
<jml> imbrandon: just make sure we know what a real xml-rpc is supposed to look like :)
<imbrandon> jml, :)
<imbrandon>  /whois jml 
<imbrandon> err whoops
<jml> imbrandon: that's a pretty deep question, I wouldn't expect Freenode to be able to answer it very well :)
<imbrandon> hahah :) right on
<don_j> imbrandon: thats exactly why I, in the first place, told you to update it heh cuz it seems you are cutting the app. in your own prefered way
<imbrandon> don_j, excuse me ? sorry i dont follow?
<don_j> imbrandon: not you but the the gst maintainer
<imbrandon> hrm ok, i'm sorry i dont know what your trying to do exactly so i'm still not following completely, but ok
<RAOF> Hey jml :)
<don_j> imbrandon: Im trying to erect the new totem...
<jml> RAOF: hey.
<RAOF> don_j: Ok, finally.  What do you mean by the "new totem"?  2.18.0?
<jml> RAOF: I'm not here to do any packaging, just making sure I'm hanging around LP users :)
<don_j> RAOF: yes
<RAOF> don_j: That's in Feisty.  There's no need.;
<imbrandon> jml, you've come to the right place then :)
<imbrandon> don_j, its already in feisty
<don_j> RAOF: why isn't it in the 'std' repository then?
<imbrandon> jml, can i bug you later about some xml-rpc stuff ? ( not sure your normal operating hours )
<imbrandon> don_j, std?
<jml> imbrandon: I'm on the Australia east coast. Please feel free to bug me.
<RAOF> By "std" you mean Edgy's (or Ubuntu 6.10's) repositories?  The reason is the Edgy has been *released*
<don_j> imbrandon: the one configure with ubuntu
<don_j> imbrandon: configured
<jml> imbrandon: probably the best place to bug me about that is in #launchpad though. 
<imbrandon> don_j, it is once feisty is released, if you mean why isnt it backported to edgy ( not on by default ) its because thats been released already
<don_j> can I just add the Feitsy then?
<imbrandon> sure you can upgrade to feisty, its not released yet but its there to use 
<don_j> imbrandon: by adding that repository?
<RAOF> !upgrade | don_j 
<ubotu> don_j: For upgrading, see the instructions at https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UpgradeNotes
<don_j> cool
<superm1> imbrandon, u there?
<don_j> maybe I should just copy the Live Fietsy image to a smart-card and so it that way instead then
<imbrandon> superm1, yup, and i'll have you fixed up before the nights over, i'm working on it now
<superm1> imbrandon, thx :)
<don_j> s%/Fietsy/Feisty/g
<RAOF> don_j: #ubuntu+1 is probably where you want to go for advice/comments on Feisty installation/use.
<don_j> ok
<don_j> btw may I suggest to put ncftp in the repositories?
<RAOF> You may, but it's already in there.
<don_j> in Feisty too?
<crimsun> !info ncftp feisty
<ubotu> ncftp: A user-friendly and well-featured FTP client. In component universe, is optional. Version 2:3.2.0-1 (feisty), package size 483 kB, installed size 1092 kB
<crimsun> !info ncftp
<ubotu> ncftp: A user-friendly and well-featured FTP client. In component universe, is optional. Version 2:3.1.9-1 (edgy), package size 441 kB, installed size 1020 kB
<crimsun> answer your question?
<imbrandon> ugh who the hell thought it was a good idea to put n-m in a server install
<crimsun> n-m is tolerable; avahi-autoipd is becoming intolerable
<imbrandon> AND have it restart networking before its configured from a remote ssh session ?
<jussi01> can someone tell me how to change the color of the screen behind the gnome splash at boot?
<Lathiat> crimsun: whats wrong with avahi-autoipd?
<don_j> my installation must be a dapper then
<crimsun> imbrandon: oh, I strip n-m from server installs
<imbrandon> crimsun, i do too, untill i just dist-upgraded it and it must be in one of the seeds now
<crimsun> Lathiat: I don't think it's avahi-autoipd; I think it's our networking hooks
<don_j> !info ircp
<ubotu> ircp: Utility for "beaming" files via IRDA. In component universe, is optional. Version 0.3-2 (edgy), package size 8 kB, installed size 64 kB
<imbrandon> Setting up network-manager (0.6.4-6ubuntu4) ...
<imbrandon>  * Reloading system message bus config...
<imbrandon>    ...done.
<imbrandon>  * Restarting network connection manager NetworkManager
<imbrandon> ... and aurora is now unreachable
<crimsun> Lathiat: for instance, across three different networks, there are dhcp servers that are notoriously crappy with providing leases in a timely manner, which means I get an 169.foo nondeterministically
* imbrandon grumbles
<Lathiat> crimsun: well it sounds like your DHCP is timing out
<Lathiat> crimsun: it'd break in any case...
<Lathiat> crimsun: you just wouldnt have an IP at all.
<LaserJock> imbrandon: yeah, gotta watch out for n-m on remote machines :(
<LaserJock> I did that the other day
<crimsun> Lathiat: yes, that's part of the issue. I'm having this problem across _all_ networks, however, on both dist-upgraded installs and fresh 7.04 Beta installs
<crimsun> Lathiat: meaning I nondeterministically get a 169.foo even if I actually do see a dhcp lease
<crimsun> s/lease/offer/
<Lathiat> crimsun: ah, interesting.
<imbrandon> i wonder if i have someone reset that box if it will come back, it has a static in the /etc/network/interfaces
<Lathiat> it shouldnt break anything tho
<imbrandon> so i dont have to drive out there
<don_j> !info mplayer
<ubotu> mplayer: The Ultimate Movie Player For Linux. In component multiverse, is extra. Version 2:0.99+1.0pre8-0ubuntu8 (edgy), package size 3461 kB, installed size 8624 kB
<don_j> you guys rocks!
* don_j leaves
<don_j> how do I get the source packages for the default idle-screens?
<imbrandon> apt-get source <package>
<Hobbsee> figure out the package name, apt-get source packagename.
<imbrandon> heya gurl, how goes it
<crimsun> funny, I actually executed /wi gurl
<imbrandon> heh
<LaserJock> lol
<Kamping_Kaiser> wi?
<crimsun> /whois
<Kamping_Kaiser> oh
<TheMuso> heh
<ajmitch> imbrandon: yeah that's crap
<ajmitch> (about aurora going byebye)
<ajmitch> I had the same thing with my box at home yesterday, and it's a static eth0 config
<imbrandon> yea its all good now, i had the tech at the other place reset it to bring it back up
<ajmitch> insanity
<imbrandon> yea its shitty
<ajmitch> ifup eth0 would do it
<ajmitch> but NM had to go & kill it
<imbrandon> well they would requite i make an account for them or give them mine
<imbrandon> require*
<ajmitch> ugh
<LaserJock> you'd think they'd get rid of n-m for at least the server seed
<imbrandon> so i just had him power cycle it , it came back ok though
<ajmitch> only hand out root to people you know & trust
<ajmitch> like random people in NZ ;)
* don_j found it at http://spacepants.org/src/glsnake/ ;)
<imbrandon> no one has root but you and me
<LaserJock> heh
<imbrandon> ;)
<LaserJock> I don't think ajmitch is random
<LaserJock> although he is in NZ
<LaserJock> which is close
<LaserJock> ;-)
<ajmitch> foolish people, trusting me
<imbrandon> yea thats why i had them power cycle it , and not give them a passwd
<imbrandon> anyhow its back now, brb smoke break
<crimsun> (oh crap, a mini-ajmitch sitting in /usr/lib/f-spot/libfspot.so.0.0.0 !)
<crimsun> ;-)
<ajmitch> hehe
<imbrandon> btw ajmitch got a sec for some python ? i made a few minor mods to the lpusers script from Fujitsu to work with beta , but for some reason its only returning 2 users now
<ajmitch> k
<imbrandon> if you have time to look its in /home/imbrandon/lpusers.py ( on aurora )
* ajmitch finds a spare terminal
<LaserJock> you need spares?
<ajmitch> sure
<ajmitch> a terminal for each box I login to, and then run screen on each :)
<don_j> glsnake.c ;)
<siretart> morning folks
<crimsun> mm, I like how the new LP bug emails list the reason for receiving the emails at the bottom
<ajmitch> hey siretart 
<crimsun> 'lo
<ajmitch> crimsun: that's finally useful
<siretart> hi ajmitch, crimsun, imbrandon!
<imbrandon> heya siretart 
<imbrandon> i really should invest in a sshable powerstrip ;)
<ajmitch> yep :)
* RAOF 'd buy one of those
<imbrandon> with 24 hours staff on jabber though its nice , almost as good as a sshable powerstrip ;)
<imbrandon> kinda like powercycle over jabber ;)
<ajmitch> imbrandon: so has the new beta UI screwed up the script?
<imbrandon> yea a tad
<ajmitch> s/beta/1.0/
<imbrandon> ---> other chan
<pef> hello
<imbrandon> hello pef 
<ajmitch> dholbach!
<dholbach> good morning
<dholbach> hey ajmitch
<ajmitch> how are you?
<imbrandon> heya dholbach 
<dholbach> hey imbrandon
<dholbach> good good - how are y'all?
<dholbach> how was your WE?
<ajmitch> good, was visiting family
<ajmitch> how about your weekend?
<imbrandon> good, i'm finaly off weekends and on a normal schedule at work after 6 months ;)
<imbrandon> so its time to start crankin hard for me and ubuntu ;)
<ajmitch> yay!
<ajmitch> haha
<imbrandon> lol
* ajmitch has heard of 2 job possibilities within the last few days
<imbrandon> ( or atleaste getting some sleep )
<imbrandon> ajmitch, rockin
<ajmitch> yeah, one of which would involve a bit of ubuntu work
<ajmitch> the other being sysadmin of (mainly) debian boxes
<imbrandon> nice
<ajmitch> yeah, I'm considering it
<dholbach> very good - beautiful weather in berlin, lots outside, so I'm happy :)
<imbrandon> dholbach, cool, yea it is here too, been 70 F to 75 F here all week
<dholbach> nice
<TheMuso> Very nice time of year here in Australia/Sydney. Warm days, but cool nights.
<imbrandon> dholbach, you see the new LP 1.0 got rolls out for the general public tonight ?
<TheMuso> Isn't it a public beta?
<dholbach> oh yeah
<imbrandon> TheMuso, nah its for everyone now
<ajmitch> hence "public"
<imbrandon> heh well yea 
<imbrandon> but a website you cant exactly install an "old version" as a user
<imbrandon> so its rolled
<imbrandon> :)
<Lure> imbrandon: did you have time to look into bug 75435 debdiff?
<ubotu> Malone bug 75435 in digikam "Gnome and KDE trash are incompatible.  Was: usdigikam expects trash to be in ~/Desktop/Trash - causes error in Ubuntu" [Undecided,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/75435
<imbrandon> Lure, i thought keescook did them both, i'll get it right now
<Lure> imbrandon: nope, he did just gtk-qt-engine
<imbrandon> kk
<Lure> imbrandon: thanks
<imbrandon> np
<imbrandon> Lure, uploaded
<crimsun> sorry, I don't have ops in -devel
<crimsun> I believe fabbione and keybuk do, however
<crimsun> you really want an ircop, though
<crimsun> imbrandon, jenda, nalioth, etc.
<imbrandon> working on it, i dont seem to either
<gnomefreak> none of the normal ops have ops in devel
<gnomefreak> maybe Sevea^s
<imbrandon> well freenode staff wasent on the list either so i couldent even op that way ( nor could others )
<imbrandon> without operserv access that is :)
<Fujitsu> Sevea^s could have, as he should know the password, and can tell Freenode staff to do stuff.
<imbrandon> Fujitsu, imbrandon , jenda , RichH all are freenode staff heheh but without @freenode/staff/* on the list its kinda hard to op up without opersev access ( not all staff have that )
<BugMaN> hi
<imbrandon> hello
<BugMaN> someone can control this patch (its my second patch ever) malone #96326
<ubotu> Malone bug 96326 in php-html-template-it "[UNMETDEPS]  php-html-template-it has unmet dependencies" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/96326
<Fujitsu> imbrandon: You're staff!?
<imbrandon> Fujitsu, yes , have been for a few months now :)
<Fujitsu> Ah.
<Fujitsu> I knew of the last two.
<TheMuso> imbrandon: Wow!
<crimsun> I think I knew of imbrandon being staff before I knew of jenda being staff
<imbrandon> yea i was about 2 months before jenda iirc ( not that it really matters )
<crimsun> err, nautilus just exploded copying a 4.5 GB mkv onto FAT32.
* crimsun executes mkfs -t jfs and resolves that
<imbrandon> fat32 dosent like files bigger than 4GB does it ?
<Fujitsu> Heheheh.
<TheMuso> FAT32 is 2GB afaik.
<imbrandon> i knew it was something like that
<TheMuso> Lovely. Apt-file can't be installed.
<gnomefreak> on feisty?
<TheMuso> gnomefreak: Yeah.
<gnomefreak> it works here if you use apt-file :)
<gnomefreak> ill tell you for sure in like a minute
<TheMuso> Hang on, I'll run apt-get update again
<gnomefreak> Setting up apt-file (2.0.8.2ubuntu1) ...
<TheMuso> Yeah ok.
<TheMuso> Probably newer deps or something.
<gnomefreak> if you used capped A than it will fail
<TheMuso> No I didn't.
<TheMuso> Anyways
* TheMuso waits for update to finish
<TheMuso> Ok probably to do with the fact that I hada broken package partially installed. :)
<gnomefreak> could be
<Lure> imbrandon: ta
<imbrandon> np
<pochu> heya!
<mr_pouit> hi pochu 
<TheMuso> Hey pochu.
<pochu> hey mr_pouit
<pochu> hi TheMuso :)
<DarkSun88> Hi all
<sacater> does anyone here know who maintains the 'vegastrike' package
<imbrandon> sacater, is it in main or universe ?
<Fujitsu> Universe, I believe.
<Fujitsu> !info vegastrike feisty
<Fujitsu> sacater: Why?
<ubotu> vegastrike: A 3d space combat game. In component universe, is optional. Version 0.4.3-5ubuntu2 (feisty), package size 4801 kB, installed size 12272 kB (Only available for i386 powerpc sparc mips mipsel s390 alpha arm ia64 hppa amd64 ppc64 kfreebsd-i386 kfreebsd-amd64)
<imbrandon> then MOTU does :)
<imbrandon> only avil for 500 arches, classic
<StevenK> It doesn't list hurd-i386 :-P
<imbrandon> lol
<ajmitch> poor bddebian
<sacater> Fujitsu: just interested
<jekil> hello
<Fujitsu> Hi jekil.
<TheMuso> Lutin: Sorry, I just fixed a bug, that I realised was assigned to you only after I uploaded a fix.
<RAOF> Wow, the X server really hates the braid screensaver.
<TheMuso> Night folks.
<pochu> good night TheMuso!
<Hobbsee> night TheMuso 
<BugMaN> someone can check this diff, its my first "merge"... maybe i make some mistakes... thanks -> Malone #101893
<crimsun> bug 101893
<Jucato> bot down :)
<crimsun> bah
<BugMaN> :)
<BugMaN> Malone bug 101893 in asp "please merge asp 1.8-6 from Debian unstable" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/101893
<crimsun> aside from trivial whitespace formatting, looks fine
<BugMaN> crimsun: wow :)
<StevenK> Oh damn, bug numbers have hit 6 digits.
<crimsun> hmm
<crimsun> ah, that's buggered.
<crimsun> BugMaN: the merge needs to maintain the original debian/changelog entry from -6, and you'd add to that the ubuntu changes -> -6ubuntu1
<BugMaN> crimsun: ah ok
<BugMaN> crimsun: then only maintener change
<crimsun> BugMaN: yes.
<BugMaN> crimsun: i remake the debdiff :-)
<PhinnFort> !ping
<PhinnFort> !java
<ubotu> pong
<ubotu> To install a Java compiler/interpreter on Ubuntu, look at https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Java - For the Sun Java runtime install sun-java5-jre from the !Multiverse repository. Enable the backports repository on Edgy to install sun-java6-jre
<BugMaN> crimsun: i remake the debdiff it's correct?
<BugMaN> crimsun:maybe i make another error, tomorrow i remake debdiff... bye
<bddebian> Heya gang
<imbrandon> hey bddebian 
<bddebian> Hi imbrandon
<Jucato> hi bddebian, hi imbrandon
<bddebian> Hi Jucato
<chillywilly> where can I download the latest bazaar?
<chillywilly> I know I saw somewhere where jbailey had made some packages
<chillywilly> can't find it now
<Nafallo> chillywilly: bazaar-vcs.org has a repo. feisty has the latest aswell.
<tepsipakki> for motu-uvf: bug 101922
<tepsipakki> so, ubotu is having a day off ;)
<crimsun> (commented)
<tepsipakki> crimsun: thanks!
<Jucato> good day/evening! currently trying to learn how to package (and probably become a MOTU?) and keeping a sort of journal of what I'm learning on my blog. I have a list questions, found the answers, but I'm a bit stumped on 2 of them. 
<Jucato> 1. What is the bare/lowest minimum requirement, in terms of Linux knowledge, does need in learning how to package?
<Jucato> 2. How do you test a package you built w/ pbuilder? Test in terms of "it installs properly" and "it runs properly/doesn't crash"
<crimsun> 1 -> You need to know what Linux is.
<crimsun> 2 -> See pbuilder hooks. Test install/remove/upgrade at the _very_ least. Testing execution is preferred.
<Hobbsee> Jucato: 1.  + knowledge of how to use man 
<Hobbsee> (seeing as google isnt a linux-only thing)
<Jucato> hehe of course other than knowing what linux is. I mean, compiling from source, directories, bash stuff, etc? what do most MOTU's presume you know already?
<zul>   /win 10
<Jucato> crimsun: using pbuilder hooks, I can install and run the package? full GUI? (/me doesn't know the proper terms)
<Hobbsee> Jucato: any of that is good.  any of that you build on.  if you dont have bits of them, you pick it up
<Jucato> hm... ok... :)
<Jucato> Hobbsee: serious about the use of man? :D
<Hobbsee> Jucato: :D
* Jucato only knows man <foo>... none of the switches... needs to learn those now
<Hobbsee> man foo works just fine
<Jucato> man:/foo works even better :D
<Hobbsee> true that
<Toadstool> g'morning everybody
<bddebian> Heya Toadstool
<Toadstool> hi bddebian 
<_MMA_> Im sorry. OT but just too funny not to share: http://ninjapants.org/files/can%20you%20defeat%20my%20wu%20tang%20style.gif
<dholbach> slomo, ajmitch, siretart, crimsun: i cleaned up the motu-uvf bug lists - can you have another look too?
<bddebian> dholbach: Yeah, kick someone to do the darn syncs will ya? ;-)
<bddebian> Heya LaserJock
<LaserJock> hi bddebian 
<LaserJock> _MMA_: that is pretty darn funny
<bddebian> That is funny!
<_MMA_> :)
<bddebian> dholbach: Am I supposed to subscribe archive to that now? (i.e. splashy-themes) ??
<dholbach> if it's a sync sure
<bddebian> OK, thx
<Burgwork> ajmitch: poor fedora people, still struggling with zope and python 2.4
<dexem_> Hi, I'm trying to build OpenOffice.org, and I'm having problems... it says that zlib is not functional. I have correctly installed build dependencies packages so, what could be happening?
<enyc> dexem_: erm... have you "sudo apt-get build-dep {package}" for the relevant source pagckages?
<dexem_> enyc: yes
<enyc> dexem_: oh yes... misread what you said ;-)
<dexem_> ;)
<enyc> dexem_: what is the error exactly ?
<enyc> dexem_: Ive never actually built openoffice.org myself... but done various other things... be helpful to others if you have the exact error
<dexem_> checking for deflate in -lz... no
<dexem_> configure: error: zlib not found or functional
<dexem_> but
<dexem_> checking zlib.h usability... no
<dexem_> checking zlib.h presence... yes
<dexem_> checking for zlib.h... yes
<dexem_> :P
<enyc> dexem_: thats weird... -lz  should load zlib headers... hrrm...
<enyc> dexem_: are you trying to beild stock-version rather than ubuntu-source  or a different version/architecture ??
<dexem_> no, I'm using everything from ubuntu repositories (for my arch)
<mr_pouit> whe the latest revision of a package is 1.0-1build1, the next is 1.0-1build2 or 1.0-1ubuntu1?
<mr_pouit> when*
<gnomefreak> does apt-get source -b package build it?
<gnomefreak> mr_pouit: i would say build
<mr_pouit> gnomefreak: ok, thanks
<dexem_> gnomefreak: I was using apt-build
<gnomefreak> dexem_: feisty?
<dexem_> yes
* gnomefreak wonders if apt-build isnt broken
<dexem_> dunno
<enyc> dexem_: notice that openoffice.org has problems with 64bit...  is this sorted now??
<dexem_> I'm using 32 bits platform
<ogra> mr_pouit, that depends on the change 
<enyc> kk..
<ogra> mr_pouit, -XbuildX should only be used for plain rebuilds without change ... -XubuntuX always if there is a change (the XubuntuX part is what triggers mom)
<mr_pouit> ogra: ok, so -1ubuntu1 (it is a debdiff for a .desktop)
<gnomefreak> mr_pouit: most of time apt-cache policy packagename will giv eyou the installed version and newest version
<ogra> mr_pouit, right ... 
<illovae> hello
<keescook> ajmitch: are there any good Ubuntu-specific "here's how to use SELinux" docs?  wiki.u.c only shows development notes
<slytherin> crimsun: ping
<geser> siretart: do you know why tauware.de sometimes takes 1-2 days to deliver u-u-s mails?
<slytherin> ajmitch: ping
<siretart> geser: is it tiber.tauware.de or freiburg.tauware.de which takes so long?
<slytherin> siretart: ping
<siretart> slytherin: no need to ping, I'm here
<slytherin> siretart: may I bug you for vote on a UVF bug? :-)
<siretart> slytherin: bug?
<slytherin> siretart: bug 95153
<ubotu> Malone bug 95153 in devede "Please sync to latest version 2.12 for feisty" [Medium,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/95153
<superm1> keescook, is there going to be any chance at my patch for pvr150 blaster making it in - or is stuck from feature freeze?
<keescook> superm1: I'm going to look at it today, I suspect it'll get in.  :)
<superm1> keescook, cool, great :)
<superm1> keescook, i'm still waiting on BenC to look over the kernel patch i made as well.  i'm not sure that will make it
<superm1> keescook, considering kernel freeze is thursday
<geser> siretart: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/13555/ shows the received headers
<siretart> geser: is it only today or when did you notice this first?
<geser> it happens now and then and only for some mails
<geser> the first time was some weeks ago
<siretart> hm. I don't see anything strange here
<geser> according to my mailbox I see it since the beginning of march
<geser> the longest delay was 6 days: Mon, 05 Mar 2007 19:50:53 +0100 -> Sun, 11 Mar 2007 06:40:41 +0100
<geser> it only happens once or twice a day
<siretart> wow
<ajmitch> morning
<ajmitch> keescook: not terribly much info on that 
<keescook> ajmitch: do you have any interest in writing something like that up?  I want to get selinux installed in a VM now, since I've got AppArmor in another.  :)
<ajmitch> keescook: yeah, why not? :)
<ajmitch> I'll try & add on another hour or two to the day
<keescook> ajmitch: Heh, cool.  I'm going to be collecting something similar for AppArmor, since I've gotten some training on how to use it now.  :)
<keescook> agreed: too few hours.
<ajmitch> lucky you :)
<ajmitch> I've just had chats with rjc & listened to him at lca
<ajmitch> oh I see crispin cowan had to write about apparmour on the list
<ajmitch> that's one thing that puts me off using it ;)
<ajmitch> well, release is close
<ajmitch> that means we *really* have to get working
<geser> is there a fixed date for the universe freeze?
<geser> all I know is it's the last week before release
<ajmitch> I can't recall if it was agreed on or not
<ajmitch> we'll find out soon :)
<crimsun> Sp4rKy: I can't respond to queries. What's the bug #/issue?
<Sp4rKy> crimsun: you're not registered ?
<Sp4rKy> crimsun: no bug #, can you read my query ?
<crimsun> yes, but I'm not identified, and I have no pressing desire to recover the password.
<boitono> I recently upgraded a server from dapper to edgy and one of the packages we rely on, otrs, was downgraded from 2.0.4 to 1.33~.  I found that otrs 1.33~ was added to the edgy repository and took the name otrs and otrs 2.0.4 was renamed otrs2. Why did this happen? Can anyone give me some more info?
<boitono> should this be filed as a bug?
<crimsun> Sp4rKy: the reason I pinged you in here is precisely due to my reading your query.
<Sp4rKy> crimsun: ok, so you remember me and my issue with sound ?
<crimsun> no, I don't.
<Sp4rKy> grrr
<crimsun> I triage about 200 audio bugs per day.
<Sp4rKy> yep
<Sp4rKy> ok, so, 1 month ago
<Sp4rKy> on a ACER Aspire 5100
<Sp4rKy> alsa doesn't works
<Sp4rKy> only oss
<Sp4rKy> you patch the kernel, but after update , always the same issue
<bddebian> boitono: I don't know the package but I would guess that they probably had some packages still depending on the older version 1.33 but wanted the newer version as well so they kept two seperate packages.
<welshbyte> boitono: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=367959 explains it
<ubotu> Debian bug 367959 in wnpp "ITP: otrs2 -- Open Ticket Request System version 2" [Wishlist,Closed]  
<bddebian> Or, there's that
<crimsun> Sp4rKy: you need to give me more info than that.
* welshbyte pats changelogs.ubuntu.com on the head
<Sp4rKy> crimsun: what do you want ?
<Sp4rKy> crimsun: you asked me for a lot of output but i don't remember what at all
* bddebian pats welshbyte on the head
<crimsun> Sp4rKy: http://bulletproof.servebeer.com/alsa/scripts/alsa-info.sh . Use --with-all
<Sp4rKy> ok :)
<boitono> that's all fine but ti breaks existing OTRS installations....
<Sp4rKy> crimsun: http://pastebin.ca/421347
<boitono> Also, I found the package seems to violate configuration file location policy by placing some of the config files in /usr/share/otrs/Kernel/Config/Files and not symlinking them
<crimsun> Sp4rKy: err, you're not using the latest publicly available kernel. Why not?
<Sp4rKy> hu N
<Sp4rKy> ?
<crimsun> Kernel release:    2.6.20-12-genericKernel release:    2.6.20-12-generic  <--
<crimsun> (sorry for the dupe)
<Sp4rKy> ohh indeed
<Sp4rKy> i upgrade :)
<crimsun> mmm, new udev has some shiny features
<crimsun> 'SYMLINKs may now have per-device priorities specified with OPTIONS="link_priority=100", removal of a device means that the symlink will be changed to point at the device with the next highest priority.'
<welshbyte> boitono: sounds worthy of a bug report to me
<crimsun> this could well wipe out the audio device persistence issue
<ajmitch> crimsun: is this new udev in feisty?
<crimsun> ajmitch: yep.
<ajmitch> useful
* ajmitch wonders how the md/lvm debugging session went
<crimsun> well, at least siretart reported success
<ajmitch> yeah, I haven't had time to reboot my system
<ajmitch> which uses / on LVM on RAID
<siretart> its not only udev, but it seems that my system is booting again
<crimsun> nor me, keep getting accosted by audio bugs ;)
<Sp4rKy> crimsun: i just upgraded,and alsa works now :) really sorry to disturb you
<crimsun> np.
<Sp4rKy> :)
<bddebian> Don't let it happen again! :-)
<bddebian> Only I'm allowed to disturb him.
<Sp4rKy> ^^
<bddebian> :)
<superm1> imbrandon, any word on the acct?
<TheMuso> Hey MOTUs.
<bddebian> Heya TheMuso
<bddebian> Later folks
#ubuntu-motu 2007-04-03
<gnomefreak> is there a way to check SHA1SUM's like md5sum command for md5's?
<TheMuso> gnomefreak: Yeah there is the sha1sum command.
<gnomefreak> sweet :)
<gnomefreak> ty
<TheMuso> np
<TheMuso> If one needs to update a native source package from Debian with a fix for Ubuntu, and the Debian package does not have a debian revision number, i.e -1 or whatever, should one use the same version number with -0ubuntu1 on the end? dpkg --compare-versions says that the version-0ubuntu1 is greater, but is that the best way to go version number wise?
<TheMuso> In this case, I'm reviewing a debdiff for the sbuild package. Bug 84183
<ubotu> Malone bug 84183 in sbuild "sbuild depends on grep-dctrl, which is a transition package" [Medium,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/84183
<crimsun> it'd be 0.52 -> 0.52ubuntu1
<TheMuso> crimsun: I was wondering that. Thanks. I'll ask for it to be re-created, as it patch doesn't apply without manual entring of files to patch anyway.
<TheMuso> i.e, attempt to patch, cannot find file at line blah.
<phaidros> hi, is there an overview how the whole ubuntu provess works?
<TheMuso> phaidros: There may be something on the wiki.
<phaidros> I mean I just got told in another chat, that ubuntu syncs with debian at the begin of a lifecycle. 
<phaidros> but is there something which covers ubuntu-debian, universe, multiverse, motu, who is volounteer, who is canonical (just in general) and such?
<phaidros> what the process of packages from one group to the others is ..
<phaidros> ahm its TheMuso , hehe :)
<phaidros> heya
<crimsun> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment
<crimsun> start there, and spider outward
<TheMuso> phaidros: You also may find this worth reading. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/TimeBasedReleases
<phaidros> thanks TheMuso 
<TheMuso> np
<pochu> Amaranth: around?
<pochu> night all
<bddebian> Heya gang
<fernando> hey bddebian 
<bddebian> Hello fernando
<RAOF> hey bddebian 
<bddebian> Hi RAOF
<Amaranth> d'oh
<Amaranth> missed pochu
<TheMuso> Theres always the goold ol' email. :p
<ajmitch> keescook: seen http://blog.drinsama.de/erich/en/linux/selinux/2007040302-ubuntu-gets-apparmor.html ? :)
<ajmitch> ah I see erich commented on your blog anyway
<jdong> ajmitch: kees blogged it on Planet?
<jdong> oh nvm
<jdong> screw me for saying before reading.
<ajmitch> no thanks
<jdong> but I still think Apparmor is better than nothing....
<bddebian> ajmitch: Did you ever write a translator for Hurd? :-)
<ajmitch> bddebian: why would I want to?
<bddebian> Dunno, I'm trying to write my second one and I'm lost :'-(
* ajmitch shrugs
<bluefoxicy> jdong:  I think there's too many apparmor/lids/selinux/grsecurity stuff laying around alerady :(
<jdong> apparmor's path weakness has been a serious issue.....
<jdong> it's been complained about a lot before
<bluefoxicy> apparmor uses paths instead of xattr
<bluefoxicy> ?
<jdong> yeah
<jdong> symlinking to a binary will neuter apparmor.
<jdong> serious issue :)
<bluefoxicy> I'm not sure how spender takes care of that
<superm1> imbrandon, ping
<imbrandon> moins
<RAOF> Hey imbrandon 
<RAOF> Hm.  If I've got a couple of patches to fix a couple of bugs, one of which is a trivial patch while the second patch is much less trivial, is it a good idea to lump them together into a single debdiff?
<siretart> RAOF: depends on the person which is going to sponsor your upload ;)
<RAOF> 15LOC vs. 2KLOC :)
<RAOF> Eh, they're both patches.  I suppose it'd be easy enough for the sponsor to remove the larger one if they want?
* RAOF is a bit curious as to the process debdiff -> archive :)
<crimsun> is there a compelling reason to be applying a 2KLOC patch at this point to a source package for feisty?
<RAOF> Probably not.
<crimsun> sounds like your question is resolved ;)
<RAOF> It allows banshee to import wavpack files that it has itself created, which would be nice.
<crimsun> oh, that bug.
<RAOF> But not critical, certainly.
<RAOF> Yup.  Upstream decided to refactor to solve it :S
<RAOF> Ok, I'll give the 15 line patch a test tonight, and debdiff that one.
<joejaxx> crimsun: has anyone thought of setting up pts for ubuntu?
<crimsun> joejaxx: I don't know offhand  (but...LP?)
<joejaxx> yeah that is true too
<Fujitsu> crimsun: Can I somehow convince you to bless bug #83539?
<ubotu> Malone bug 83539 in kqemu "Update to GPL'ed version 1.3.0pre11" [Wishlist,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/83539
<crimsun> looks sane, approved.
<Fujitsu> Thanks.
<crimsun> np
<TheMuso> Fujitsu: qemu is in universe is it not?
<Fujitsu> TheMuso: It is.
<TheMuso> Whats the approval needed for then?
<TheMuso> Is that an SRU?
<Fujitsu> TheMuso: It's a new upstream version.
<TheMuso> ah right
<Fujitsu> (and it's kqemu, not qemu)
<Fujitsu> And kqemu is currently in multiverse, though soon to be universe.
<ajmitch> evening
<Fujitsu> Hi ajmitch.
<ajmitch> yay, another debian box setup
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: For what?
<Fujitsu> Hi Hobbsee.
<ajmitch> for work
<ajmitch> because debian is good
<Fujitsu> The latter was assumed.
<ajmitch> & supports sw raid in the installer, along with various other useful things
<joejaxx> ajmitch: yeah that too
<StevenK> So does Ubuntu's alternative CD.
<Fujitsu> StevenK: I thought so.
<ajmitch> StevenK: however it's a little easier to get an etch netinst iso
<Hobbsee> hey jussi01 
<Hobbsee> hey Fujitsu 
<ajmitch> either that or get a dapper alternate cd
<jussi01> hi Hobbsee 
* Fujitsu finds something that doesn't resemble RT at all, and starts fixing bugs in it.
* jussi01 waves
<ajmitch> hi Hobbsee, dholbach 
<Hobbsee> heya ajmitch 
<pochu> morning!
<Fujitsu> Hi pochu.
<pochu> hey Fujitsu
<imbrandon> hello Hobbsee dholbach ajmitch Fujitsu and *
<Hobbsee> hi imbrandon 
<Fujitsu> Hi imbrandon.
<Fujitsu> So many greetings!
* Fujitsu 's head explodes.
* StevenK adds to it and waves to imbrandon
<dholbach> good morning
<dholbach> hey ajmitch, hey imbrandon
<pochu> hi imbrandon
<joejaxx> hello imbrandon 
<jussi01> dholbach, hi
<dholbach> hey jussi01
<jussi01> dholbach, I think I have to nuke that gsopcast... :(
<dholbach> jussi01: let me know if you have something i should look at again
<jussi01> because while the frontend is open source, the backend (sp-sc file you were missing) doesnt seem to be...
<dholbach> jussi01: oh ok - would it be an alternative to get it into multiverse or something?
<jussi01> dholbach, is that allowed? whats the proccedure?
<jmg> you can depend on nonfree elements
<jussi01> ok, so how do I package a single file then?
<dholbach> maybe both have to be in multiverse then
<dholbach> I dunno
<jussi01> dholbach, the package you looked at just needs the sp-sc file to be in usr/bin, thats all that was missing...
<dholbach> right
<jussi01> sp-sc is a binary
<dholbach> best to ask if sp-sc is redistributable at all - maybe in multiverse
<jussi01> ok - who would I be asking about that?
* Fujitsu kicks LP for being stupid and confusing two tasks.
<jussi01> :D
<jussi01> dholbach, the people who made sopcast gave me authority to have it put into repos if I want... 
<dholbach> jussi01: best to prod them and the ubuntu-archive people about it
<jussi01> dholbach, thanks
<joejaxx> Fujitsu: if there is a sync request what is the proper method of handling it?
<Fujitsu> joejaxx: ubuntu-archive performs the syncs.
<joejaxx> Fujitsu: oh ok
<jussi01> btw, can someone help me with a nasty printer driver in feisty? here is the read me... I go up to the modprobe bit, that worked, but the next instruction doesnt... http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/13634/
<Hobbsee> !uvf
<ubotu> uvf is Upstream Version Freeze.  For an exception, see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess#head-9523bc4076ff011324d67cddc97969ec609618d6
<AstralJava> jussi01: Are you sure you're root?
<pochu> slomo: liferea uvfe approved, can you take a look at it please? :) bug 102114
<ubotu> Malone bug 102114 in liferea "[UVFe]  Liferea 1.2.10c" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/102114
<jussi01> yeah, jussi@jussi-laptop:~$ sudo chmod a+rw /dev/usb/lp0
<jussi01> Password:
<jussi01> chmod: cannot access `/dev/usb/lp0': No such file or directory
<joejaxx> Fujitsu: what is the proper way to handle upgrade requests?
<Fujitsu> joejaxx: Wait until Feisty+1, probably.
* StevenK gets sick of uni work.
<joejaxx> Fujitsu: oh
* StevenK looks for a bug to fix.
* Hobbsee is about to fix 10 or so
<StevenK> By Rejecting them? :-P
<jussi01> StevenK, fix my printer... !!!
* Fujitsu looks for something to cleanse his mind of RT.
<micahcowan> Wow, launchpad is changed.
<Fujitsu> Debugging it is not the most pleasant of tasks.
<Fujitsu> micahcowan: Indeedily.
<Fujitsu> And bugged up, of course.
* Fujitsu complains about some of the Ubuntu bugtasks becoming immutable.
<micahcowan> nice....
<jmg> rt?
<StevenK> Request Tracker
<Hobbsee> StevenK: nope.
<Fujitsu> jmg: A really nasty Perl thing we use at work.
<Fujitsu> It's enormous.
<jmg> yuk
<jmg> surely a consideration in reworking lp was to make it load faster.
<Fujitsu> Can somebody head over to https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/kexi/+bug/61850/+editstatus and try and reject it?
<ubotu> Malone bug 61850 in koffice "Kexi cannot access PostgreSQL databases anymore" [Undecided,Confirmed]  
<jmg> it loads slower for me :(
<Fujitsu> jmg: You'd think so, but apparently not.
<jmg> it just look =s like its been whitewashed in web2.0 
<jmg> and not even
<jmg> if it was ajaxified maybeit wouldnt be so slow
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: done.
<zakame> hello motus
<Fujitsu> Hobbsee: Did it work?
<Hobbsee> yes
<Fujitsu> Gr.
<micahcowan> Hobbsee, really? I get the equivalent of a 404 when I try.
<jmg> what were the deficiencies in launchd that required the creation of upstart?
<micahcowan> "Page Not Found"
* Hobbsee had to force it, though
<Fujitsu> Hobbsee: ?
<Hobbsee> dont seem to here
<StevenK> I got a 404 as well
<Hobbsee> oh yeah, now i am
* Hobbsee didnt the first time she clicked it, though
<Fujitsu> OK.
<Fujitsu> It's doing strange things.
<Fujitsu> So my bug is sorta valid.
<Fujitsu> When I attempted to reject it, it decided that the package field wanted to automagically change to koffice, so it complained that it was already filed there.
<Hobbsee> neat.  apparently motu-uvf only requires one person now
<Fujitsu> For you it seems to have just obliterated the package.
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: oh?
<Hobbsee> crimsun: you here?
<Fujitsu> Hobbsee: Did you manually blank the package field?
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: when did that happen?
<Hobbsee> Once one of the [WWW]  team members marks the bug as Confirmed you can proceed with uploading.
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: yes
<Fujitsu> Hobbsee: No, that's still two.
<Fujitsu> Hobbsee: Did it work if you left it alone.
<Hobbsee> ah
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: no
<Fujitsu> Hobbsee: The last of them will mark it as Confirmed.
<Fujitsu> Hobbsee: OK, thanks.
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: could you ack https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/basket/+bug/102252 please?
<ubotu> Malone bug 102252 in basket "UVFe - Sync Basket 1.0.1 from experimental" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  
<joejaxx> Fujitsu: what do you think xchm should be under menu wise?
<ajmitch>  debian/patches/98_buildprep.diff           |94914 -----------------------------
<Fujitsu> joejaxx: Whatever gnochm is under, I guess.
<ajmitch> well that's a large patch dropped
<joejaxx> Fujitsu: ahh that is the name of it
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: indeed.
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: ... rather.
<ajmitch> just autocrap?
<Hobbsee> i think so, yeah
<ajmitch> k
<joejaxx> Fujitsu: i could not remember the name of that similar app
<ajmitch> any other info about it?
<ajmitch> no NEWS or ChangeLog?
<imbrandon> kchm also exists
<Hobbsee> yep, it's autohell
<ajmitch> svn log?
<crimsun> Hobbsee: hi
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: points to the incorrect website link.  the correct website link is attached, and that's the chagnelog
<joejaxx> imbrandon: yeah kchmviewer 
<joejaxx> i need to look at that as well
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: it's only those fixes that were there - upstream is gearing up to do a bigger release in a while, but i requested the bugfixing be done pre-feisty-release
<ajmitch> k
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: basket doesnt do svn, bugtrackers, etc.
<ajmitch> ugh
<Hobbsee> well, it might do svn
<Hobbsee> doesnt really have a bugtracker
<ajmitch> sounds like a moderately crap upstream
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: I have to agree.
<StevenK> Of course, it's a KDE app
<ajmitch> looks like they do have svn
<Hobbsee> well, if it's only one or two people, then why go to all that effort?
* StevenK hides.
<Fujitsu> No bugtracker? That's insane.
* Hobbsee beats StevenK 
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: the ML, apparently
* StevenK grins.
<Fujitsu> Hobbsee: Urgh.
<joejaxx> Fujitsu: gnochm just has a debian menu entry
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: from what i see, its' still relatively new, too.  so i'd expect them to, eventually
<Fujitsu> joejaxx: What about kchmviewer?
<joejaxx> let me check kchmviewer
<joejaxx> Fujitsu: yeah i am doing that now
<Hobbsee> kchmviewer's a direct sync from debian, isnt it?
<ajmitch> doesn't look like they bother with things like svn tags, either
<Fujitsu> Hobbsee: That's irrelevant.
<Hobbsee> quite likely
<ajmitch>  svn ls http://basket.linux62.org/svn/basket/tags gives nothing
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: oh, sorry.  misread - thought you were wanting to make changes to it
<joejaxx> that also only has a debian menu entry
<joejaxx> that one is under Apps/Editors
<joejaxx> gnochm is under Apps/Viewers
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: confirmed
<joejaxx> xchm is Applications;Viewers;Graphics
<joejaxx> hmm
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: thanks.  i need crimsun or someone to do the same nwo?
<ajmitch> no
<ajmitch> dholbach gave +1
* joejaxx tries to think of other similar apps
<Hobbsee> oh, excellent, thanks dholbach!
<dholbach> Hobbsee: np
<Fujitsu> joejaxx: I'm thinking Accessories.
<ajmitch> dholbach: what do you think about ldap-account-manager?
<ajmitch> last comment in bug 95328
<ubotu> Malone bug 95328 in ldap-account-manager "[UVFe Sync Request]  ldap-account-manager 1.2.0-1" [Medium,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/95328
<joejaxx> Fujitsu: yeah
<ajmitch> it'd be ok to have, but the security bug can be fixed from testing-proposed-updates
<joejaxx> Fujitsu: too bad there is not a "Viewers" entry like on the debian menu
* joejaxx goes to create a patch for it
<dholbach> ajmitch: the changes are not really huge and I thought it the update had its benefits anyway - if you disagree, put in a -1 - I don't feel that strongly about it
<dholbach> ajmitch: but good you checked
<ajmitch> I'm ok with it, just had to clarify on the bug
* jmg read the spec page for upstart - interesting
<ajmitch> dholbach: what's special & blingy about accerciser?
* ajmitch hugs codebrowse
<dholbach> ajmitch: it's dogtail-ng
<dholbach> actively worked on - etc :)
<ajmitch> ah :)
<ajmitch> hm, IBM
<ajmitch> looks sane
<ajmitch> do we need another +1 or not?
<dholbach> dunno
<TheMuso> gah IBM.
<TheMuso> They always have to bring out different stuff.
* TheMuso shuts up.
<TheMuso> Duplicate work annoys me greatly.
<StevenK> TheMuso: Lintian and Linda?
<imbrandon> heh
<ajmitch> hm
<ajmitch> bug 101988
<ubotu> Malone bug 101988 in irqbalance "irqbalance universe UVFe" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/101988
<imbrandon> StevenK, use your DD powa's and get me the scripts from lintian.debian.org
<ajmitch> quite a big version jump, but I trust kylem fairly well
<StevenK> imbrandon: Why?
<dholbach> ajmitch: can you assign the bugs you confirm to the people who filed the bugs?
<ajmitch> small package, etc
<ajmitch> dholbach: yeah, will do
* ajmitch thinks irqbalance would be ok to have, given it's been tested by someone we know
<imbrandon> StevenK, so i can setup a ubuntu {lintian,linda}.ubuntuwire.com for the whole archive
<TheMuso> StevenK: Sorry, but that is quite different IMO. Accessibility is such a small field, that we can't have people going off and re-inventing the damn wheel.
<StevenK> TheMuso: Ah.
<ajmitch> hi viviersf 
<StevenK> imbrandon: I'd rather you didn't use the lintian.d.o scripts. They suck. :-)
<imbrandon> StevenK, hehe ok, wanna write some ? lol
<StevenK> imbrandon: I tried, and have about 3 versions somewhere.
<StevenK> I got caught up not having Linda choke on certain packages.
<imbrandon> ahh
<ajmitch> ok, UVF backlog is slowly coming down
<StevenK> And then I got distracted by this whole Ubuntu thing.
<imbrandon> ;)
<ajmitch> wb dholbach :)
<dholbach> :)
<ajmitch> hm, a few uvf bugs that can't be approved just yet
* ajmitch doesn't know about 94962
<ajmitch> (bug 94962, mr ubotu)
<ubotu> Malone bug 94962 in sysv-rc-bootsplash "[UVFe Sync Request]  sysv_rc_bootsplash" [Medium,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/94962
<joejaxx> does this look good? http://fluxbuntu.org/bug83400.patch
<ajmitch> dholbach: yay, 6 open uvf bugs for universe now
<Hobbsee> yay :)
<joejaxx> :)
<dholbach> NICE
<joejaxx> anyone want to look at bug 83400? i uploaded a patch
<ubotu> Malone bug 83400 in xchm "chm applications in different submenus" [Low,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/83400
<tepsipakki> is two ack's enough for a UVFe?
<ajmitch> tepsipakki: yes
<tepsipakki> ajmitch: ya
<tepsipakki> +y
<tepsipakki> :)
<joejaxx> :)
<ajmitch> :)
<siretart> hi ajmitch 
<tepsipakki> all the intel-lovers will get a new driver, then
<siretart> ajmitch: did you already upgrade your raid/lvm system?
<ajmitch> hey siretart 
<Fujitsu> tepsipakki: i810-modesetting?
<ajmitch> no, I haven't rebooted yet
<ajmitch> is it horribly broken?
<Fujitsu> Hahah, I saw that bug, siretart.
<Fujitsu> Looks quite broken.
<ajmitch> uh oh
<tepsipakki> Fujitsu: yes, although that one should be removed when -intel is uploaded
<siretart> ajmitch: booting now works, but the new devmapper upload makes problems for me. wanted to ask you if you can confirm this
<Fujitsu> tepsipakki: We're getting -intel now?
<ajmitch> siretart: I'm not brave enough to reboot right now ;)
<tepsipakki> Fujitsu: yes, but it won't replace -i810 yet
<ajmitch> tepsipakki: into universe still?
<tepsipakki> yes
<tepsipakki> ajmitch: ^^
<siretart> ajmitch: keybuk asked for additional informations. since I have the machine only at home, there are some rather large roundtrips for that :/
* ajmitch would like the modesetting driver on the cd :)
<ajmitch> siretart: ah :(
* Fujitsu is surprised that beryl and its various window decorators and settings things only make up 2% of the universe bugs.
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: That would be great... hopefully for Feisty+1.
<tepsipakki> 1.9.94 was released two hours ago, but I'll upload .93 now
<tepsipakki> and wait for debian to release .94
<tepsipakki> Fujitsu: definately for feisty+1
<ajmitch> for feisty+1 it ought to be default
<Fujitsu> tepsipakki: I'm sure they've been saying that since Dapper.
<siretart> tepsipakki: is that the one which does the lovely xrandr 1.2 crack?
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: it hasnt been there that long yet.
<Fujitsu> `no, we won't promote 915resolution, because i810-modesetting will be fine for Edgy' or similar.
<tepsipakki> siretart: yes, although that requires xorg-server-1.3
<Fujitsu> Hobbsee: True...
<siretart> do we even have an uptodate xrandr 1.2 binary?
<siretart> I only see the 1.0.2 binary in feisty
* Fujitsu can't wait for xrandr 1.2... It looks like it's going to make monitor/resolution switching actually bearable.
<Fujitsu> siretart: No, we don't.
<ajmitch> siretart: are you able to work around your devmapper issues & finally get it booting?
<siretart> ajmitch: yes, by downgrading to ubuntu5, as stated in the bugreport
<ajmitch> ugh
<ajmitch> so you need to boot with a live cd & all
<siretart> ajmitch: nah
<siretart> ajmitch: pressing Sysreq-i helps
<tepsipakki> siretart: no we don't, but that wouldn't work right anyway since we have xorg-server-1.2
<siretart> ajmitch: this way I have to mount my home volume by hand, but at least I have a root shell
<ajmitch> oh that's not so bad
<siretart> tepsipakki: does debian have an xorg-server-1.3 in experimental?
<tepsipakki> siretart: yes
* Fujitsu backports it and tries it out.
<siretart> sounds lovely :)
<tepsipakki> it works fine, but too late for feisty
<tepsipakki> we discussed about it a week ago
<siretart> well, I've heared there will be another release after feisty after all ;)
<ajmitch> siretart: oh really? :)
<tepsipakki> siretart: you'll dist-upgrade when feisty+1 opens, so.. :)
<siretart> :)
* pochu too :)
<tepsipakki> also, the new server would have required a rebuild of all the drivers
* ajmitch will probably wait a few days
<siretart> tepsipakki: how is this rebuild enforced? by binary package rename?
<tepsipakki> ABI changes
<Fujitsu> siretart: Probably an ABI change...
<ajmitch> siretart: by having lots of users complaining
<Fujitsu> ajmitch has it right.
<siretart> so the packages will be renamed, so that the outdated servers needing a rebuild will become uninstallable?
<tepsipakki> no, just change the Provides in control
<tepsipakki> now all the drivers provide xserver-xorg-video-1.0
<siretart> glx seemed to have missed the rebuild
<TheMuso> Can UVF requests and syncs be combined into one bug report, or must they be separate?
<pochu> slomo: thanks :)
<viviersf> lol hey ajmitch 
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: i've done together, never been yelled at
<TheMuso> Ok.
<gpocentek> hello MOTU world
<ajmitch> hi gpocentek 
<gpocentek> hi ajmitch 
<imbrandon> heya gpocentek 
<gpocentek> hi imbrandon 
<Fujitsu> Hi gpocentek.
<Hobbsee> hey gpocentek 
<gpocentek> hey Hobbsee, hey Fujitsu 
<dholbach> hey gpocentek
<gpocentek> hello dholbach :)
* sacater grins evilly
<sacater> muahahaha
<sacater> sorry
<sacater> not me
<Fujitsu> sacater: What have you done now?
<sacater> my mate
<sacater> ignore my grinning
<sacater> sorry
<sacater> welp
<sacater> ignore him
<sacater> any unusual comments from me
<sacater> ignore them
<sacater> im round a mates house
<sacater> :P
<welp> yeah, that really was me... muahahahaha
<Fujitsu> Gentoo dev!
* Fujitsu runs.
<welp> sacater: you should learn to fit more stuff on one line
<welp> yeah, run an hide!
<welp> muahahaha!
* Fujitsu invokes ubotu.
<Fujitsu> !enter
<welp> uuhuh?
<Fujitsu> It appears to not work in here.
<welp> !hide
<sacater> welp
<ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about hide - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
<lupine_85> !enter the dragon
<sacater> please piss of
<sacater> off*
<welp> :o
<Fujitsu> ubotu: enter
<lupine_85> meh :D
<ubotu> Please try to keep your questions/responses on one line - don't use the "Enter" key as punctuation!
<sacater> you are 5 feet away from me :P
<sacater> Fujitsu: im at his desk, and hes on his bed
<welp> sacater: sure about that? there's a tape measure in the kitchen draw downstairs if you wanna check
<Fujitsu> sacater: Ah.
<sacater> welp: screw you hippie!
<Fujitsu> ubotu: offtopic
<ubotu> #ubuntu is the Ubuntu support channel, #ubuntu+1 supports the development version of Ubuntu and #ubuntu-offtopic is for random chatter. Welcome!
* welp giggles
* welp runs away again
* sacater thwocks welp! FO REAL!!
* Fujitsu sentences you all to a lifetime in #ubuntu-offtopic.
<sacater> sorry
<sacater> he ius
<sacater> he is in a home
<sacater> :(
<dholbach> TheMuso: was motu-tools renamed already?
<TheMuso> dholbach: Haven't heard anything about it. I was told that I had to file a question against the launchpad product, which I did, but nothing as yet. Why do you ask?
<dholbach> ok
<dholbach> no, just wanted to know, because seb128 could commit his LP greasemonkey script
<TheMuso> Right.
<TheMuso> Do you think we should wait till its renamed before moving trunk to ubuntu-dev, or should it be done immediately?
<dholbach> it's just a matter of pushing it to the place
<dholbach> and later to mark it as merged or something
<TheMuso> Yeah.
<TheMuso> We'll see what happens.
<Fujitsu> dholbach: What does this greasemonkey script do?
<dholbach> Fujitsu: you have small links which put in stock replies
* Fujitsu likes that idea.
* Hobbsee likes, too
* Fujitsu doesn't like it how people are complaining about the removal of PHP4 on the fora.
<TheMuso> dholbach: I still don't quite get what that script does.
<Hobbsee> fora?
<lupine_85> plural of forum
<Hobbsee> ah
<lupine_85>  /topic == HAPPY UNIVERSE HUG DAY ?
<dholbach> TheMuso: it adds several links to the "change status/importance/... form", if you click them, they add stock replies to the text entry
<dholbach> TheMuso: as in bugs.gnome.org
<TheMuso> dholbach: Oh ok.
<Fujitsu> dholbach: Is this script anywhere publicly accessible at the moment?
<dholbach> people.ubuntu.com/~seb128
<Fujitsu> Thanks.
<dholbach> de rien
<jekil> hello
<Hobbsee> hiya
<DarkSun88> Hi all
<Hobbsee> hiya
<TheMuso> mr_pouit: I just uploaded ndisgtk.
<TheMuso> mr_pouit: SO no need to worry about that one.
<jwendell> Hi, TheMuso 
<TheMuso> Hi jwendell.
<jwendell> TheMuso, i think it's better to forward that bug to debian, instead of fix it. What do you think?
<TheMuso> jwendell: Yeah not a bad idea. If you could do that, that would be great, as I am kinda busy with other things at this moment.
<jwendell> TheMuso, ok, i'll do that
<TheMuso> jwendell: Thanks.
<imbrandon> or forward it to debian AND fix it ( in debian ) ;)
<Fujitsu> It's getting a little late to forward and not fix it here.
<imbrandon> true
<TheMuso> Well its to fix a package depending on a transitional package.
<Fujitsu> Everything needs approval from the 12th.
<imbrandon> Fujitsu, can you stay up with the rdf talk over the next days since you already deal with LP devs a bit
<Fujitsu> imbrandon: Sure.
<imbrandon> Fujitsu, you rock
<Fujitsu> imbrandon: I doubt it.
<AstralJava> Hey guys (dholbach, if you're there), I've got a problem; trying to build iconset package ends up with a situation where make dist breaks if I haven't specified symlinks in source directories, but the thing is I don't want them in Makefile.am files, but in debian/links. What should I do to get rid of the problem? I have tried to look at human-icon-theme but there aren't any symlinks there.
<dholbach> the symlinks in h-i-t get generated by icon-naming-utils
<dholbach> why does the build break if you don't put them in Makefile,am?
<AstralJava> Oh? My eyes have betrayed me then.
<dholbach> that doesn't make sense
<AstralJava> dholbach: This is the tail of the output of make dist. http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/13645/
<AstralJava> dholbach: gtk-save.png is a symlink inside ./16x16/actions/
<AstralJava> But I have no idea how it even sees that.
<dholbach> why don't you leave the symlinks out
<dholbach> and add them to debian/install instead?
<AstralJava> By "leaving the symlinks out" you mean deleting them from the directories?
<AstralJava> ...or not having them in config files? Cause they aren't in any other than debian/links.
<dholbach> delete them and let them get created by the build system
<dholbach> by the debian build
<AstralJava> Okay, I guess I can do that. Any advice on how to mention this in a bzr branch so if another maintainer uses that branch, [s] he gets the idea about this?
<gnomefreak> in command: dpkg-buildpackage -uc -us what do the -uc -us do?
<dholbach> gnomefreak: not sign the binaries, not sign the source
<geser> -us = unsigned source, -uc unsigned changes
<gnomefreak> ah
<gnomefreak> i will rebuild see how it goes.
<geser> this only prevents that you're asked for your gpg passphrase at the end of the build (and thus no signing)
<superm1> imbrandon, you here?
* RAOF seems to always come in just after superrm1 asks for imbrandon :)
<superm1> lol
<TheMuso> superm1: I'd say he's sleeping.
<TheMuso> or is just away
<superm1> TheMuso,  i never understand his schedule.  i thought he was USA, but he appears to sometimes be up at very early hours of the evening many nights
<Hobbsee> he works a lot
<superm1> Hobbsee, I assumed as much :) .  Just hard to figure out when to be on to catch him for a few moments
* RAOF uploads a debdiff for bug #99938, *subscribes* (not assigning  now :() u-u-s, and bails for bed.  Night all!
<ubotu> Malone bug 99938 in banshee "All files in Banshee end with a comma" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/99938
<StevenK> Dear me. Did someone yell at RAOF? :-P
<wick2o> morning
<Hobbsee> StevenK: heh
<bddebian> Heya gang
<joejaxx> hello bddebian 
<bddebian> Hello joejaxx
<joejaxx> bddebian: do you know if a second xserver would be allowed into the repos?
<bddebian> What do you mean by a second xserver?
<joejaxx> like kdrive
<StevenK> I thought kdrive had been killed?
<bddebian> Yeah, me to
<bddebian> Hey \sh
<\sh> moins bddebian
<joejaxx> bddebian: what do you mean by killed?
<bddebian> joejaxx: I thought development had kind of died/stalled?
<joejaxx> oh that is what you mean
<joejaxx> bddebian: well the last commit was one year and a month ago :P
<bddebian> joejaxx: Sure, let's bring it in then ;-P
<joejaxx> :)
<TomaszD> hello, I'm a bit lost when it comes to this uvf of mine https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnomad2/+bug/93226
<ubotu> Malone bug 93226 in gnomad2 "UVF exception for Gnomad2 2.8.11" [Wishlist,Confirmed]  
<TomaszD> I was just assigned to this bug, does it mean that I have to build the .deb now? I don't know how to do this...
<ScottK> Is start-stop-daemon the preferred Ubuntu way to stop daemons?  The init for clamsmtp uses it and it doesn't actually manage to stop the daemon.  The problem is that it doesn't find the running process (and I checked, it's running).
<wick2o> ScottK: i always just use /etc/init.d/
<wick2o> but its just old habit
<ScottK> The problem is the init script for clamsmtp that is IN init.d uses start-stop-daemon and it isn't working.  I'm trying to fix the bug.
<ScottK> The upstream provided init just uses kill and that'll work, but I want to try and do it the 'correct' debian/ubuntu way.
<joejaxx> hmm imbrandon had told me the versioning for cvs before but i cannot recall it
<joejaxx> is it 0+cvsYYYYMMDD ?
<geser> TomaszD: yes, it's up to you now to provide a package (and get it uploaded through sponsors)
<TomaszD> geser, oh, no...
<geser> TomaszD: have you tested if the current packaging can be used?
<TomaszD> <3 packaging
<geser> it most cases you can simply exchange the original source tar ball and be nearly ready
<TomaszD> oh
<TomaszD> I'll try that...
<geser> TomaszD: have you tried to build the gnomad2 packages from Debian experimental?
<geser> there is already 2.8.11-2
<TomaszD> geser, I really, really don't feel comfortable with this topic as I'm only a user who wanted 2.8.11 in Ubuntu, reported it properly and now realised that it's beyond his abilities
<TomaszD> well, not only a user, I'm also GNOME upstream translator and an Ubuntu Translator, but that doesn't help with packaging
<TomaszD> I do my fair amount of work anyway
<geser> TomaszD: I'll test-build the package from Debian experimental later and try to get them (if I got forget)
<TomaszD> geser, thank you!
<azeem> if a bug can be fixed by syncing from Debian, can I just add ubuntu-archive to the subscribers (and do possibly other stuff), or should I file a new bug?
<dholbach> i'd change the bug title to be obvious, but use the same bug
<geser> no need to file a new bug, just add the needed info for a sync to the bug
<azeem> thanks
<geser> TomaszD: I'll try to update your bug if got the Debian packages working so poke me if you don't see an update in the next few days (especially as the upload freeze comes nearer)
<TomaszD> geser, I'll remember to do this, ok
<sacater> gnomefreak: what was that guys name again? the one who gave me +u, my mate wants to know :P
* sacater administers pokings
<imbrandon> joejaxx, yes ( w.r.t. cvs versioning )
<joejaxx> oh ok
* sacater pokes gnomefreak
<Adri2000> what happens to universe/multiverse on thursday? is it like herd freezes?
<geser> Adri2000: I hope so. The Universe Freeze is on 12th April.
<Adri2000> geser: Universe Freeze? FeistyReleaseSchedule says it's RC Freeze
<shawarma> siretart: UDS-Sevilla ftw! \o/
<geser> in the last week uploads to universe needs to be reviewed (it was discussed during one MOTU meeting)
<siretart> shawarma: :)
<shawarma> siretart: Where are you staying?
<siretart> shawarma: I'm getting sponsored by canoncial
<shawarma> siretart: Oh, shiny!
<Adri2000> geser: yes, uploads to main too I guess, RC freeze :)
<LaserJock> good morning MOTU Land
<geser> Hi LaserJock
<bddebian> Heya LaserJock, geser
<geser> Hi bddebian
<LaserJock> I've got an OT question about NM and WPA
<LaserJock> I finally decided to not leave my wifi at home open for everybody
<LaserJock> so I added a WPA password
<LaserJock> I put it in NM but now it asks me for keychain access everytime boot up or resume
<shawarma> LaserJock: That's by design.
<azeem> LaserJock: "open" means really open, not WEP?
<LaserJock> azeem: yes, open
<azeem> NM doesn't ask me on resume, but reboot
<shawarma> LaserJock: There's work in progress to allow a system-wide kind of configuration thing in 0.7.0, but for now, that's the way it is.
<LaserJock> well that sucks
<shawarma> azeem: That's a bug. :-)
<LaserJock> I might just reopen my wifi then :(
<LaserJock> it really needs to be that tough? like somebody's going to hope on your laptop and somehow steal your WPA password
<LaserJock> you should be able to set it and forget
<shawarma> LaserJock: I believe it's in the keyring design to act that way.
<LaserJock> does it do the same thing for WEP?
<azeem> yes
<shawarma> LaserJock: It's not so much nm, I believe.
<LaserJock> bah
<LaserJock> retarded
<geser> LaserJock: have you tried to do it via /etc/network/interfaces and not NM?
<LaserJock> geser: no, because NM is supposed to make it easy
<LaserJock> so much for that ;-)
<LaserJock> for now I have my password on a sticky note on my laptop so my wife can use it
<LaserJock> real secure :-)
<shawarma> Give her her own login, and add pam-keyring to the pam chain.
<shawarma> and make sure her login password is the same as the keyring..
<shawarma> that way, her password is propagated to gnome-keyring, automagically unlocking it on login.
<LaserJock> well, that has it's own issues
<shawarma> Sure.
<LaserJock> if I can do it via interfaces maybe I'll just ditch NM
<LaserJock> I think we were better off before NM
<salty-horse> hi. i'd like to request an update of the xmltv package (maintainer listed as MOTU) to a new version, but that new version includes a dependency on a perl module that doesn't have a debian/ubuntu package at all. where should I file my request?
<LaserJock> salty-horse: on Launchpad
<salty-horse> LaserJock, as a regular bug?
<LaserJock> salty-horse: you can file a bug and tag it needs-packaging for the perl module
<LaserJock> salty-horse: and file a bug for xmltv and tag it upgrade and note the situation with the perl module and give the bug number for that
<salty-horse> where do i file the needs-packaging bug? attached to what package?
<LaserJock> just file it against Ubuntu, no pakcage
<salty-horse> is there anything like debian's wnpp?
<salty-horse> ah
<LaserJock> no, we don't have wnpp, we just file it against Ubuntu for now
<salty-horse> thanks
<stgraber> pochu: http://www.stgraber.org/ubuntu added some test data (today daily + beta)
<stgraber> pochu: hmm, please answer on #-iso :) (I didn't check what channel I was writting to :))
<pochu> stgraber: :)
<salty-horse> LaserJock, I filed the first bug: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/102463 - how do I change the importance to "wishlist"?
<ubotu> Malone bug 102463 in Ubuntu "[needs-packaging]  Locale::Hebrew" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  
<shawarma> LaserJock: If you really hate having to reeenter you password after suspend/resume, it's a 6 line patch to gnome-power-manager. Don't tell anyone.
<pochu> !importance | salty-horse
<ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about importance - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
<LaserJock> salty-horse: did you click on "Ubuntu" under "Affects"?
<pochu> hmm, I thought bdmurray tought ubotu about importance :)
<pochu> salty-horse: are you a member of Ubuntu-qa?
<geser> salty-horse: you need additional privileges to do it, I've done it for you
<LaserJock> bah
<salty-horse> LaserJock, where? I might have missed it? On the form, I marked the package as "I don't know" - that might have been a mistake :/
<salty-horse> pochu, no
<salty-horse> geser, thanks
<LaserJock> salty-horse: no, that's fine
<pochu> salty-horse: if you aren't, you can't change the importance in the Ubuntu bugs
<salty-horse> i don't like how launchpad hides stuff I am not privileged to instead of stating it up front :(
<salty-horse> LaserJock, i "attached" the request to the new version of xmltv in here: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xmltv/+bug/48253
<ubotu> Malone bug 48253 in xmltv "tv_grab_fi broken, needs update to 0.5.45" [Medium,Confirmed]  
<LaserJock> salty-horse: hehe, it's just trying to keep people from being disappointed with "Nananana, you don't get in :p"
<salty-horse> LaserJock, it just means more work for you, answering silly questions like mine :)
<LaserJock> ah well, the things we do so users feel all warm and fuzzy inside :-)
<ScottK> If there is anyone available from U-U-S, I just uploaded fixes for Bug #102470 and Bug #102391.  I uploaded the patch to 102470 since that was the more significant bug.
<ubotu> Malone bug 102470 in clamsmtp "Clamsmtp init script fails to stop clamsmtp" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/102470
<ubotu> Malone bug 102391 in clamsmtp "clamsmtp: config files uses obsolete scanheader option" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/102391
<DarkSun88> Hi
<wick2o> hello
<ScottK> bddebian: Any chance you could look at my latest (and tested) bug fixes?  ^^^
<bddebian> ScottK: Not for a little bit sorry.  Ping me again in a couple hours if no one gets to them
<ScottK> bddebian: Thanks.  Will do.
<fdoving> any chances to get new upstream versions into feisty at this time?
<geser> it should still be possible, you need an UVF exception for it
<geser> but you need to hurry as universe freeze is on 12th april
<LaserJock> oh man, I can't wait
<fdoving> has the UVF process changed since edgy?
<geser> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess#head-9c768217b322f8567d24d91647eaf0a256a73046
<fdoving> thanks.
<_MMA_> siretart: Are you around? I need your opinion on our Ardour2 package.
<siretart> _MMA_: dinner right now
<_MMA_> Ok. Whns a good time?
<_MMA_> *Whens
<sacater> guys, is there an ubuntu installation method, that when installed, will give me nothuing but a a kernel and command prompt (non gui), and i manually compile stuff on top off it (or use apt)
<jdong> sacater: a minimal/expert install from the alternate CD
<_MMA_> A server install
<sacater> jdong: okies
<sacater> thanks
<sacater> _MMA_: thanks
<jdong> a server install will do similar
<jdong> if you uncheck all the servers it offers :D
<sacater> jdong: cool
<LaserJock> well, a netinstall .iso would probably also work
<sacater> LaserJock: ?
<LaserJock> it installs Ubuntu via network rather than disk
<LaserJock> it might depend on how basic you want to go
<jdong> debootstrap!!
<EtienneG> Seavas, hi pal !
<EtienneG> sorry, typo in nick, again :
<EtienneG> Seveas, hi pal !
<Seveas> hi EtienneG 
<Seveas> EtienneG, <tab> is your friend for weird nicks like mine ;)
<EtienneG> Seveas, I have been told you are the clock-giver for IRC ...
<EtienneG> actually, that's on the wiki
<LaserJock> heh
<Seveas> I don't give clocks
<Seveas> mayb cloaks :)
<bddebian> hehe
<EtienneG> er ... right !
<Seveas> EtienneG, launchpad id?
<EtienneG> I'll take a cloak then
<EtienneG> I am etienne-goyer-outlands
<sacater> oooh
<sacater> cloaks
<sacater> i wouldnt mind a cloak :|
<Adri2000> you need to become ubuntu member first
<sacater> Adri2000: :(
<sacater> ive made a few contributions :)
<sacater> is 'few' good enough :S
<EtienneG> Seveas, thanks !
<PhinnFort> i have a cloak, and i haven't contributed anything
<LaserJock> sacater: just keep contributing (and keeping track in your wiki page) for a couple months
<PhinnFort> unofficial cloak;)
<Lure> any motu-uvf member around: one documentation UVF (should be easy): bug 102471
<ubotu> Malone bug 102471 in digikam-doc "UVF exception for 0.9.1" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/102471
<sacater> welp: erm slight problem, i made a new xserver, and i got the OUT OF RANGE message
<sacater> whoops
<ajmitch> morning
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<zul> hey ajmitch 
<_MMA_> ajmitch: Let me know when you have a min. I was gonna talk with siretart but since your hear Ill let him eat. :)
<sacater> erm
<sacater> does anyone here know anything about the xserver and/or xorg
<ajmitch> _MMA_: a brief minute
<ajmitch> maybe 45 seconds
<_MMA_> ajmitch: Well this wont be short. Il wait. :)
<_MMA_> *ill
<ajmitch> heh
<ajmitch> UVF stuff?
<ajmitch> what?
<_MMA_> Yes.
<ajmitch> give me some clue at least
<_MMA_> ajmitch: crimsun was handling the packaging of Ardour2 for Ubuntu Studio. I think he ran out of time/resources so now TheMuso is working on it.
<ajmitch> filed relevant bugs?
<_MMA_> On a new package?
<ajmitch> if it's a new package, file a uvf bug mentioning that if you really really want it in
<ajmitch> & I guess we'd consider it
<crimsun> to clarify, it's not going to be a new package, but an UVFe req is necessary to sync ardour from Debian experimental.
<ajmitch> crimsun: ok, thanks for clarifying
<_MMA_> Well here's what I know:
<_MMA_> TheMuso was told that we need a changelog from the Ardour guys (not the Debian one) but the current Ardour package (.99.3) doesnt have one either.
<_MMA_> So we're really not doing anything outside of what has been done already.
<_MMA_> Now this is a whole new source package. Ardour2 is almost a complete code rewrite and will install alongside Ardour .99.3
<_MMA_> They have no changelog in either of their source packages. So do we really need it?
<ajmitch> more useless upstreams
<crimsun> _MMA_: Ardour2 won't install alongside if we use Debian experimental's source package. It replaces the existing 0.99.3.
<_MMA_> No. I dont want to do that at all.
<crimsun> err, are you willing to carry the delta, then?
<_MMA_> They should be kept seperate.
<ajmitch> then you'll need a new package, and lots more work
<gnomefreak> is there docs on how to set up a repo?
<ajmitch> since you'll have to make them install in parallel in the packaging
<ajmitch> gnomefreak: apt-ftparchive, or use something like falcon by Seveas 
<_MMA_> ajmitch: Im missing why we need to have anything to do with .99? Its should be treated as its own app.
<Seveas> falcon has docs :)
<gnomefreak> Seveas: where? i looked in ubotu he didnt have any
<Seveas> in the package
<ajmitch> _MMA_: and I'm saying that you'll have to modify whatever ardour2 package you have to make it play nice
<crimsun> _MMA_: so you feel that creating an extra delta over and beyond the existing Debian experimental source package is 1) necessary; 2) maintainable?
* gnomefreak assuming falcon is easier than apt-ftparchive
<gnomefreak> Seveas: ok ty 
<_MMA_> crimsun: Yes. Thats Ardour's line from what I can tell.
<_MMA_> I think Debian should change to work along side each other.
<crimsun> _MMA_: ok. Realize that this creates a maintenance burden for us, however.
<_MMA_> las said (maybe) 10% of the code is the same.
<ajmitch> getting debian to change things this close to release may be a bit hopeful
<_MMA_> ajmitch: Oh sure. I know.
<ajmitch> you have a few days at most to get these changes done
<ajmitch> and then you have to make a convincing case for having a new package
<ajmitch> crimsun: what are your thoughts on having it as a new package? unneeded?
<crimsun> ajmitch: if upstream wants them parallel-installable, we should strongly consider that
<crimsun> Luke and I will work on getting that done within the next day
<ajmitch> you'll have to convince ubuntu-archive that it's a new source package split/renamed from an old one
<crimsun> right.
<_MMA_> In the end, I didnt get my actual question answered. :)
<crimsun> In this case, I'd rather Debian have made an ardour2, but I can certainly understand why Free would have wanted beta12 in experimental as 'ardour' instead of 'ardour2'
<crimsun> (skips the NEW, etc., given the proximity to release)
<crimsun> (not saying I agree with that approach, but that's the state)
<_MMA_> The issues come in with older Ardour sessions.
<_MMA_> And people need ardour 1 for existing sessions.
<crimsun> right, I'm not keen on splitting with upstream upstream over backward compat
<crimsun> in any case, I'll look at the bzr side so we can get this resolved
<_MMA_> Ok. What about the changelog issue?
<_MMA_> las said he could work one up from the betas.
<_MMA_> I asked for one from 10 on.
<_MMA_> Beta 10 that is.
<crimsun> we'll be going the feature freeze exception route [https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess#head-c9d177822a71b90ec5fb703ed0d0f30eeb8fc1db ] 
<crimsun> i.e., skip the changelog issue
<_MMA_> ok.
<gnomefreak> Seveas: you dont have feisty packages yet?
<Seveas> no
<gnomefreak> k
<ScottK> bddebian: It's been 'a couple of hours' and AFAICT no one jumped on my patch.  Are you available? - [13:54]  <ScottK> If there is anyone available from U-U-S, I just uploaded fixes for Bug #102470 and Bug #102391.  I uploaded the patch to 102470 since that was the more significant bug.
<ubotu> Malone bug 102470 in clamsmtp "Clamsmtp init script fails to stop clamsmtp" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/102470
<ubotu> Malone bug 102391 in clamsmtp "clamsmtp: config files uses obsolete scanheader option" [Undecided,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/102391
<geser> ScottK: I will try to look at it when I back home
<ScottK> OK.  Thanks.
<ScottK> I'll be here for roughly the next hour and a half and then offline for several hours.  If anything comes up, just mention it and I'll read the scrollback.
<crimsun> ScottK: / geser: I'll look at 'em in 5 mins
<ScottK> Thanks.
<crimsun> goodness, my debian-x inbox has ~400 spam emails
<sacater> anyone here know how to disable framebuffer?
<fdoving> can't you do that with a bootparameter to the kernel?
<fdoving> nofb or something? 
<PF-Away> nofb
<fdoving> :)
<PF-Away> ;P
<TheMuso> Hey MOTUs.
<crimsun> ScottK: is there any additional info on why the pid file is not created successfully [for #102470] ?
<ScottK> crimsun: No.  It seems to work just fine without it, so I didn't investigate further.
<ScottK> crimsun: I have both Edgy and Feisty boxes using clamsmtp and none of them have a PID file for it.
<ScottK> crimsun: I just installed clamsmtp on my one remaining Dapper box and the PID file does get created there.
<crimsun> does the dapper version pass -m to start-stop-daemon?
* ScottK looks
<ScottK> crimsun: No.  The call to start-stop-daemon is the same as in Feisty.
<crimsun> hmm.
<crimsun> I do not like that unchecked path for dirname(1)
<crimsun> unchecked search path, even
<crimsun> this is reminiscent of the issue in oprofile (fixed in Dapper, CVE-2006-0576)
<crimsun> Debian 352910
<ubotu> Debian bug 352910 in oprofile "CVE-2006-0576: Untrusted search path vulnerability in opcontrol in OProfile" [Normal,Closed]  http://bugs.debian.org/352910
<ScottK> Well I just made the init make a PID file.  Let me see if I can figure out what I did...
<crimsun> I'm not convinced -m is the right approach given the big warnings in start-stop-daemon(8)
<crimsun> but I do know that that unchecked search path to dirname(1) should be tweaked, at least
<ScottK> OK.  I am open to suggestions on what I should do on that?
<crimsun> actually, it's a red herring
<crimsun> the darned thing isn't even used
<crimsun> why do people write initscripts with this crack in them?!
<ajmitch> mm, herrings
* ajmitch goes to cut down a tree
<bddebian> hehe
<Fujitsu> When is Adri^2000 normally around?
<TheMuso> Fujitsu: He posted in devel not long ago.
<ajmitch> where 'not long' = 5 min
* TheMuso doesn't use timestamps due to being an annoying clutter when reading lines of the screen with speech.
<Fujitsu> That's probably why I haven't seen it yet.
<ScottK> crimsun: Is the right answer on this bug to figure out why pidfile creation fails and fix that?
<Fujitsu> Adri2000: Are you working on bug #81884?
<ubotu> Malone bug 81884 in slune "[apport]  slune crashed with  SyntaxError in sound() [slune and/or python 2.5] " [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/81884
<geser> TomaszD: uploaded gnomad2
<Adri2000> Fujitsu: yep, I will do it soon
<Fujitsu> Adri2000: Great. Just checking, as it's gained a few dupes recently.
* TomaszD bows to geser
<geser> TomaszD: np
<TomaszD> :] 
<Fujitsu> Is there a way I can make gdb vaguely useful when debugging something which crashes in an inline function?
<crimsun> ScottK: yes; the debdiff just masks it
<crimsun> ScottK: (particularly since it "works" in 6.06)
<ScottK> crimsun: OK.  I'll work on trying to figure that out.  Any hints on what documentation to read to understand how PID files are supposed to be created would REALLY be appreciated.
#ubuntu-motu 2007-04-04
<joejaxx> has anyone constant resizing on some application dialogs? like Save As in gimp or leafpad?
<joejaxx> has anyone noticed*
<joejaxx> on feisty of course
<TheMuso> joejaxx: No.
<TheMuso> I barely use GUI as it is.
<joejaxx> oh ok
<ajmitch> joejaxx: using some crackful window manager?
<TheMuso> heh
<joejaxx> lol
<_MMA_> ajmitch: http://pastebin.ca/423086 (las=Paul Davis Ardour dev) Ive sent off a email to Free to see if we can get something done.
<joejaxx> i wonder why branding was deleted off the launchpad distro pages
<joejaxx> with the switch to launchpad 1.0
<sharms> ScottK: pid files are created however you want to create them
<sharms> ScottK: for instance, in python, I use the os module to figure out my pid, and then I will write that pid to /var/run/myprogram.pid
<sharms> ScottK: rinse wash and repeat for any language really
<gnomefreak> using dpkg-scanpackages . /dev/null | gzip -9c > Packages.gz command in the file for repo. now do i upload teh .gz file or the packages themselves?
<Fujitsu> Both.
<gnomefreak> ah ok ty
<zen> Hey, I'm having some trouble recompiling the mail-notification package.  Where could I paste a log and maybe someone could point me to a fix if it's trivial?
<TheMuso> !pastebin | zen 
<ubotu> zen: pastebin is a service to post large texts so you don't flood the channel. The Ubuntu pastebin is at http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org (make sure you give us the URL for your paste - see also the #ubuntu channel topic)
<zen> Should I toss up the entire thing, or just the end parts near the error?
<zen> Here's the end bit.
<zen> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/13796/
<TheMuso> zen: Whatever you think may be relevant to work out what the problem is.
<zen> I put up the last section.
<zen> Seems like there are multiple errors, but I don't know if it's a cascade.
<zen> I make it just by "apt-get source mail-notification", removing the "--disable-ssl" line from debian/rules, and then just "debuild".
<TheMuso> zen: Have you tried changing --dsiable-sll to --enable-ssl?
<TheMuso> Other than that, I am no C expert.
<zen> Nope.  I'll try it.  (Though according to docs, that's the default.)  As a side note, the raw source package from the author compiles fine.  But the debian/ubuntu packages have some extra integration stuff.
<zen> well, --enable-ssl didn't help, but I just --disable-evolution'd it, and it works now, I think....
<zen> okay...totally different error...
<zen> dh_install -pmail-notification-evolution debian/tmp//usr/lib/evolution/2.10/plugins/org-gnome-mail-notification.eplug
<zen> cp: cannot stat `./debian/tmp//usr/lib/evolution/2.10/plugins/org-gnome-mail-notification.eplug': No such file or directory
<zen> Any ideas to fix that?
<TheMuso> zen: You need to go into the debian directory and remove any references to that file that can't be found. Since you disabled evolution stuff, that file is no longer being built.
<zen> There's a lot of files in there...I should just hunt for it in all the files or is there a likely place to find it?
<zen> (and there's a separate mail-notification-evolution package, so its kinda weird that its stumbling on evolution stuff...)
<zen> is it possible mail-notification-evolution is build with the same deb files as mail-notification ?
<TheMuso> zen: The dpkg command, particularly dpkg -S for searching for what files belong to what packages, as well as the grep  command to find text in files are your friends.
<zen> Okay, suppose the same deb-source file is being used for two packages...how does debuild know which one to build?  Because it looks like it's trying to build mail-notification-evolution instead of just mail-notification (since those dh-install commands are in the rules for mail-notification-evolution).
<TheMuso> !packagingguide | zen 
<ubotu> zen: The packaging guide is at http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/index.html - See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/New for information on getting a package integrated into Ubuntu - Other developer resources are at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DeveloperResources - See also !backports
<TheMuso> zen: The packaging guide will help you work out just how a lot of stuff works in Debian package building.
<zen> Oh....thanks!
* gnomefreak got good at packaging icedove :(
<Fujitsu> gnomefreak: That's a bad thing?
<gnomefreak> Fujitsu: ive packaged it over 15 times since friday 
<gnomefreak> but getting to be fun :)
<Fujitsu> Isn't it already in Debian?
<jmg> hmm
<gnomefreak> yes but thiers wouldnt build for us due to messed up patches
<jmg> icedove being packaged as a totally FOSS alternative to thunderbird?
<gnomefreak> we fixed 3 patches and used seamonkey source with debian dir. 
<jmg> i thought mofo got on better with ubuntu
<jmg> whats the rationale to include icedove and thunderbird other than for foss bigots?
<gnomefreak> oops
<gnomefreak> not icedove iceape
<jmg> iceape = seamonkey on ice?
<gnomefreak> debian refused to agree to mozillas requirements
<gnomefreak> icedove == thunderbird with name and icon changes
<Flannel> jmg: yes
<jmg> ok
<jmg> now
<jmg> i think that iceweasel should alter the about:mozilla page to complain about their trademark policy
* gnomefreak loves the icons and start page for the ice*
<Flannel> gnomefreak: I still think iceweasel shouldve gone with antartica centered the globe.
<gnomefreak> i will have testing repo open for ff3 and iceape in the next couple days
<gnomefreak> Flannel: agreed :)
<gnomefreak> that sounds nicer
* jmg proposes adding about:love
<jmg>              complain about their trademark policy
<jmg> er
<jmg> about:love - Love is a snowmobile racing across the tundra when suddenly it flips over, pinning you underneath. At night, the ice weasels come.
<gnomefreak> ok be back tomorrow its bed time
<bddebian> Heya gang
* Jucato waves to bddebian and Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> heya Jucato!
<bddebian> Hi Jucato, Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> hey bddebian 
<Jucato> Hobbsee: saw my post? :D
<Hobbsee> looks good, from glancing at it just then
* Fujitsu explodes the fora.
<Fujitsu> PHP4 is dead, get over, stupid people.
<Fujitsu> *get over it
<Hobbsee> lol
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: dont read the forums.  it will do you lots of good.
<Fujitsu> I made the mistake of responding to the thread about PHP4's removal a number of weeks ago.
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: silly
<Fujitsu> Hobbsee: Duh.
<bddebian> heh
<ajmitch> hello Hobbsee 
<Hobbsee> hi ajmitch 
<joejaxx> bddebian: doing some initial packaging on it :)
<bddebian> joejaxx: ?? You mean kdrive?
<joejaxx> yeah
* ajmitch thought that was already packaged
<joejaxx> ajmitch: it is?
<joejaxx> i must have overlooked it then
<joejaxx> because i thought it was not in the repository
<ajmitch> ah, xephyr is (based on kdrive)
<joejaxx> ahh xephyr
<ajmitch> I think kdrive used to be
<ajmitch> given that there are source package records in launchpad
<joejaxx> yeah
<ajmitch> xserver-kdrive | 6.6.1+cvs20060804-0ubuntu1 | http://apt-proxy edgy/universe Sources
<joejaxx> it was removed from feisty
<ajmitch> correct
<ajmitch> it was also removed from debian
<Fujitsu> Er, why is dmsetup trying to being installed in buildd builds?
<ajmitch> dependency chain
<joejaxx> ajmitch: so that is probably why then
<Fujitsu> And it tries to execute initramfs-tools on installation, and that's not installed, so the world explodes.
<joejaxx> are there any package removal logs?
<ajmitch> e2fsprogs->libblkid1->libdevmapper1.02
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: wrong
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: it was spotted & already fixed
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: Good to hear.
<ajmitch> since it would cause the world to explode, just before a major freeze
<Fujitsu> This is true.
<ajmitch> now it only calls initramfs-tools if it exists
<jmg> why did kdrive get removed?
<Fujitsu> Well, that obviously hasn't propagated to the buildds yet.
<joejaxx> jmg: that is why i asked if there were any package removal logs :P
* Fujitsu thinks we should remove school{tool,bell} soon.
<jmg> Fujitsu: why?
<Fujitsu> They're uninstallable and broken.
<jmg> isnt that in main for edubuntu?
<Fujitsu> Correct.
<jmg> sooo.. fix?
<Fujitsu> Not going to happen.
<jmg> because?
<Fujitsu> That would require a SVN snapshot, which is not meant for release.
<Fujitsu> The changes are inconceivably large.
<ajmitch> jmg: because of various things upstream, stuff can't magically stay in main 
<jmg> is it python2.5/zope related?
<ajmitch> zope3.3 related
<Fujitsu> jmg: It wants an older Zope.
<ajmitch> API changes
<bddebian> w00t
<jmg> ajmitch: older zope blocked why?
<bddebian> Hmm, I think I expire tomorrow..
<ajmitch> jmg: because it was written with older APIs in mind, which were changed
<jmg> bddebian: i'll send your family a card
<ajmitch> since zope 3.x is a moving target still
<jmg> ajmitch: i mean, why cant the older zope required by schooltool live on?
<bddebian> jmg: Sweet thanks
<Fujitsu> Haha, I like the new time display system:
<jmg> surely edubuntu should have the latest stable schooltool
<Fujitsu> Ankur Kotwal   	 2005-08-30   	 in 21 hours   	Approved
<Fujitsu> jmg: Which stable schooltool?
<Fujitsu> There's no such thing.
<ajmitch> because zope 3.2 can't be installed alongside 3.3
<ajmitch> so the only option would be to downgrade zope
<jmg> "cant"
<Fujitsu> bddebian: You have 46 hours remaining, so not toooo bad. You'd better mail The Council.
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: he doesn't need to
<Fujitsu> Is there some new automatic renewal law I didn't see?
<ajmitch> no
<ajmitch> it's already been discussed on the MC list
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: jinty did prepare beta schooltool packages that didn't depend on schoolbell
<Fujitsu> OK, but do we really want to release them?
<ajmitch> it'd require a bunch of new packagesa
<Fujitsu> That's unlikely to happen.
<ajmitch> sad but true
<Fujitsu> They should have a release for Feisty+1, so we're only without it for Feisty.
<ajmitch> considering that a big thing on the schooltool frontpage is being part of edubuntu..
<ajmitch> "new release soon", back in october
<Fujitsu> Yes, the lack of progress is rather unfortunate.
<Fujitsu> But it should speed up a lot once they've got it deployed in the test schools.
<ajmitch> hello Burgundavia 
<Burgundavia> hey ajmitch
<ajmitch> how's it going?
<Burgundavia> work is driving me around the bend
<micahcowan> Does the SixQuoteEscape sometimes fail to work on Moin, and is there an alternative (for some reason, in one or two contexts it is causing a bold-face toggle, like ''')
<micahcowan> ?
<Burgundavia> ``
<Burgundavia> do that
<ajmitch> Burgundavia: oh that's ok, work is supposed to do that for you
<micahcowan> Thanks very much; where do I place that (within the CamelCaps "link"?), and is this documented somewhere in wiki.ubuntu.com's help pages (not in HelpOnLinking, AFAICT).
<Burgundavia> ajmitch: no, not like this
<micahcowan> (I now have the answer to the first part)
<bddebian> Jesus, this frickin' Dell XPS is HUGE
<bddebian> But at least it has sexy neon blue lights :-)
<_MMA_> bddebian: LOL A friend just got one. It is a monster. I think his was red.
<bddebian> Yeah mines chrome with a black front
<bddebian> I about shit myself when I saw the box.  It's bigger than an old Proliant 3000 box
<_MMA_> :)
<crimsun> dang, wealthy folk here
<_MMA_> crimsun: pfftt.. You could have one. Pull some of that cash out of the mattress. :)
<jmg> bddebian: your definition of sexy is disturbing
<bddebian> heh
<ScottK> crimsun: Are you available to help me with my clamsmtp pid file problem?
<crimsun> ScottK: not really, but what's the gist?
<ScottK> The gist is that I could find no pid related differences between the dapper and feisty packages, so I took the feisty source package and built it on my dapper box and it made a pid file just fine.
<ScottK> So, crimsun, who (which package) do I blame or hints on how to figure it out?
<crimsun> hmm, does the initscript check for the existence of /var/run [and /var/lock if necessary]  first?
<ajmitch> and any needed subdirectories under them
<ScottK> The init script doesn't make the pid file.  Clamsmtp does.
<crimsun> the only other major change I can think of would be upstart
<ScottK> That's what I was thinking, but I don't know nearly enough to have any idea.
<ScottK> Since that came in with edgy and it's broken on edgy and feisty, it would fit.
* ScottK is officially in WAY over his head at this point.
<ScottK> The only error that gets logged is 'clamsmtpd: couldn't open pid file: /var/run/clamsmtp/clamsmtpd.pid: No such file or directory'
<crimsun> does invoking clamsmtpd manually create the pid file properly?
<ajmitch> ScottK: right, so what creates the directory /var/run/clamsmtp?
<ajmitch> remember that /var/run gets emptied on boot (tmpfs)
* ScottK is in the midst of trying to run it in foreground with debug set to max.  I'll report back in a moment.
<ScottK> well the directory doesn't get made.
<ScottK> The debug isn't a lot of help:
<ScottK> clamsmtpd: couldn't open pid file: /var/run/clamsmtp/clamsmtpd.pid: No such file or directory
<ScottK> clamsmtpd: wrote pid file: /var/run/clamsmtp/clamsmtpd.pid
<ScottK> But when I look, neither the PID file nor the directory are there.  
<ScottK> I guess I need to hunt through the clamsmtp source and find where it thinks it's making the directory...
<ajmitch> ScottK: the initscript (if any) must make it
<ajmitch> it must be recreated on each bootup
<ScottK> ajmitch: OK.  I believe you, but I don't see where it does it.  Is start-stop-daemon --start --pidfile ${PIDFILE} etc...  supposed to create the pid file or just look for one?
<ajmitch> no, it won't create it
<welshbyte> --make-pidfile does that
<ajmitch> you create the directory
<ScottK> That's the only place in the init the pid file gets mentioned on start.
<ajmitch> ScottK: yes, and it's as simple as 1 line to make the directory
* ScottK is trying that now.
<ajmitch> [ -e /var/run/clamsmtp ]  || mkdir -p /var/run/clamsmtp
<ScottK> ajmitch: This is progress.  "clamsmtpd: couldn't open pid file: /var/run/clamsmtp/clamsmtpd.pid: Permission denied"  Thanks.
<ScottK> That I knew how to fix....
<ajmitch> yeah
<ajmitch> you could replace mkdir with install -d -o someuser 
<ScottK> Any clues why this wasn't necessary on Dapper, but is on Edgy/Feisty?  I'd like to understand a bit of what's going on here...
<ajmitch> because /var/run wasn't a tmpfs on dapper
<ajmitch> since then initscripts have needed to be changed if they used directories under /var/run
<ScottK> Thanks.  Makes sense.  install -d -o works nicely too.  Appreciate the assistance.  I'll do up a new patch now.
<ajmitch> np
* Starting logfile irclogs/ubuntu-motu.log
<ScottK> OK.  The revised patch to fix Bug #102470 and Bug #102391 is uploaded to Bug #102470.  If anyone from U-U-S can take a look at it, I'd appreciate it.  I'm off to bed.  Thanks again ajmitch and crimsun for all the help.
<ubotu> Malone bug 102470 in clamsmtp "Clamsmtp init script does not create PID file" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/102470
<ubotu> Malone bug 102391 in clamsmtp "clamsmtp: config files uses obsolete scanheader option" [Undecided,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/102391
<bddebian> Gnight folks
<dholbach> good morning
<Fujitsu> Hi dholbach.
<dholbach> heya Fujitsu
<ajmitch> hey dholbach 
<dholbach> hey ajmitch
<ajmitch> dholbach: want to email the TB about bddebian?
<ajmitch> unless it's already been done
<dholbach> why me? :)
<ajmitch> because I'm going out soon :)
<dholbach> ok
* ajmitch isn't sure if he's meant to be there in 20 minutes or 50 minutes
<ajmitch> I should really find out..
<ajmitch> ah good, 50 minutes :)
<don_j> I'm gonna edit my startup-files. Any information/manual about the ubuntu startup files?
<imbrandon> upstart.ubuntu.com
<don_j> nice site
<RAOF> I've got a mail from launchpad's buildd's, with an chroot problem when building banshee.  Is there anything I need to do?  Should I contact the buildd admins?
<Fujitsu> RAOF: It's a known issue. All the chroots are broken at the moment.
<RAOF> Ok.  Thanks.
<RAOF> (Is there anywhere where this information is shown?)
<Fujitsu> No.
<viviersf> is any1 else having problems with debootstrap ?
<siretart> hi folks
<siretart> ajmitch: around?
<RAOF> Hey siretart.
<siretart> hi RAOF
<Fujitsu> Hi siretart.
<siretart> hi Fujitsu 
<imbrandon> moins all
<RAOF> Afternoon imbrandon!
<imbrandon> 2m not afternoon :)
<imbrandon> am*
<RAOF> Maybe not for you :)
* RAOF basks in the glow of people finding out that the new nVidia drivers misuse the "refresh rate" field
<jml> heh heh
<jml> the nightmarish, flickering glow
<RAOF> Well, no, not really :)
<joejaxx> hello everyone :)
<\sh> moins
<sacater> mroning all
<sacater> morning*
<Fujitsu> Hi sacater.
* sacater waves at Fujitsu 
<gnomefreak> is it hard to generate a Release.gpg for a repo?
* ajmitch returns
<ajmitch> siretart: here now :)
<jekil> hello
<siretart> ajmitch: I've noticed some requests for new packages assigned to motu-uvf. I remember that we agreed on that, but I don't remember the acceptance policy for new packages
<siretart> ajmitch: could you refresh my memory please? ;)
<ajmitch> it was *meant* to be until beta freeze
<ajmitch> but I don't know if we're sticking to that or not :)
<ajmitch> eg daniel putting in requests for packages :)
<siretart> e.g. I'd love to have sauerbraten in feisty (can be synced from debian/contrib)
<siretart> but I don't know if that would fit our policy of new packages
<ajmitch> dholbach: opinions? :)
<dholbach> tollef said he was fine with that
<dholbach> ajmitch: ^
<ajmitch> ok
<Fujitsu> It's not going to kill anything.
<AstralJava> dholbach: I know you must be super-busy, but can you take a look at ubuntustudio-sounds in REVU? TheMuso has ACKed it once. It needs a 2nd one as it's a new package, no?
<dholbach> AstralJava: please ask somebody else
<AstralJava> dholbach: Okay thanks!
<dholbach> AstralJava: either ping in here or ask on ubuntu-motu@
<dholbach> sorry
<AstralJava> No prob. :)
<AstralJava> Is there a kind and not-so-busy MOTU in here who could take a look at ubuntustudio-sounds in REVU? We need a second ACK for it, to file an exception bug. It'd mean a lot to UbuntuStudio project if we got our artwork packages into universe for Feisty. Thanks! :)
<LongPointyStick> AstralJava: you might want to put the URL for it?
<AstralJava> Okay sorry. :) I'll add those.
<LongPointyStick> (into here)
<AstralJava> LongPointyStick: For ubuntustudio-look http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=4778
<AstralJava> For usplash-theme-ubuntustudio http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=4782
<AstralJava> For ubuntustudio-sounds http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=4780
<AnAnt> how can I request a sync for feisty+1 ?
<StevenK> You can't.
<AnAnt> ok
<AnAnt> nor feisty ?
<StevenK> At least, not until after Feisty has been released.
<AnAnt> ok
<AnAnt> StevenK: I have another problem, a package used to work in Edgy, now doesn't work in Feisty
<AnAnt> and I dunno what's the reason
<StevenK> AnAnt: Which package, and is there a bug?
<AnAnt> StevenK: no, there's isn't a bug, the package is acon
<AnAnt> StevenK: I'm the maintainer btw
<StevenK> Can you explain how it doesn't work?
<AnAnt> StevenK: this package works in virtual console, some key combinations don't work anymore (like CTRL+ALT+O)
<StevenK> Ah nice, 1.5.0-0ubuntu3 == 1.5.0-2
<AnAnt> no, they are not the same
<AstralJava> For ubuntustudio-icon-theme http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=4783
<AnAnt> oh
<AnAnt> yes
<StevenK> In terms of changes made, they are.
<AnAnt> I thought you meant ubuntu3=ubuntu2
<AnAnt> yes, -0ubuntu3 == Debians -2
<AnAnt> StevenK: can there be a reason why it doesn't work in Feisty ? Can it be kernel related or what ?!
<StevenK> Ctrl-Alt-O works for me.
<AnAnt> StevenK: what do you get ?
<AnAnt> StevenK: a blue screen ?
<StevenK> No, I get "Acon is loaded"
<AnAnt> StevenK: yes, it does load, but some key combinations don't work
<StevenK> Ctrl-Alt-O works, can I have more examples? :-)
<AnAnt> StevenK: a menu screen is supposed to appear when you press CTRL+ALT+_
<AnAnt> StevenK: a menu screen is supposed to appear when you press CTRL+ALT+O
<AnAnt> StevenK: but what happens is I get some wierd character typed instead
<AnAnt> btw, it is the leftCtrl+leftAlt+O that I am talking about
<StevenK> Yes.
<StevenK> However, I have no idea how to debug it.
<AnAnt> StevenK: yes what ? 
<StevenK> AnAnt: Okay, does that key combo work with 1.5.0-2 in Debian unstable?
<AnAnt> StevenK: I didn't try it in Debian
<AnAnt> but it did work in Edgy
<AnAnt> it did work with -0ubuntu3 in Edgy
<StevenK> I'm curious if it works if I rebuild -0ubuntu3
<AnAnt> what difference should that make ?
<StevenK> I'm trying to narrow down where the problem is.
<AnAnt> StevenK: ic
<AstralJava> Minor update: ubuntustudio-icon-theme can now be found at http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=4784
<illovae> hello
<ScottK> The revised patch to fix Bug #102470 and Bug #102391 is uploaded to Bug #102470.  If anyone from U-U-S can take a look at it, I'd appreciate it.
<ubotu> Malone bug 102470 in clamsmtp "Clamsmtp init script does not create PID file" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/102470
<ubotu> Malone bug 102391 in clamsmtp "clamsmtp: config files uses obsolete scanheader option" [Undecided,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/102391
<crimsun> nice. If someone else doesn't process them first, I'll get to them in 90 minutes after lecture.
<illovae> !seen LaserJock
<ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about seen laserjock - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
<ScottK> crimsun: Thanks.  I'll let you know if they're still waiting for someone.
<TheMuso> crimsun: I'll still be around. Ging to do a late nighter.
<DarkSun88> Hi all
<BugMaN> Hi DarkSun88 :)
<DarkSun88> Hi BugMaN 
<TheMuso> Heya Hobbsee!
<TheMuso> Hey RAOF.
<RAOF> Hey TheMuso.
<RAOF> I'm just marvelling at the changelog for compiz -1ubuntu13
<RAOF> gandalfn appears to be trying to import 0.4.0 git patch by patch :(
<Hobbsee> hey TheMuso!
<RAOF> Hey Hobbsee
* RAOF checks whether they bumped the ABI version on compiz.  Else it's time for another compiz-extra rebuild :(
<Hobbsee> hi RAOF 
<RAOF> Woah, cool.  That didn't break ABI!
<jdong> RAOF: hehe I was making that comment in another channel yesterday :D
<jdong> looked like a comical case of circumventing UVF :)
<RAOF> :S
* StevenK kicks postfix
* Yagisan waves
* ajmitch sleeps
<StevenK> I've figured out how to do everything I want except domain rewriting
<zul> night ajmitch 
<Fujitsu> Night ajmitch.
<Yagisan> goodnight ajmitch 
<Yagisan> wow
<Yagisan> I bought a logitech mx610 mouse today
<Yagisan> it has a lot of useless buttons
<Yagisan> one has an picture of an envelope on it - I push the button, and evolution loads
<Yagisan> I am impressed
<AstralJava> I could never use those, I accidentally push just the sole extra scroll button. :)
<Yagisan> I've never had any extra button work before
<Yagisan> I was just impressed that on does work
<Yagisan> now to remap them to the things I use most
<EtienneG> good <time of day>, everybody
<EtienneG> I would need a sponsor for an upload, got a UVF exception
<ded_> hi
<ded_> does someone could explain me the difference bethween the same package in two dist using deb?
<crimsun> EtienneG: details, please?
<EtienneG> crimsun, it's bzr-gtk 0.15.2, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/bzr-gtk/+bug/102548
<ubotu> Malone bug 102548 in bzr-gtk "UVF exception for 0.15.2" [Medium,Confirmed]  
<EtienneG> I have uploaded my package at people.ubuntu.com/~etienne/bzr-gtk
<crimsun> bug 102548
<ubotu> Malone bug 102548 in bzr-gtk "UVF exception for 0.15.2" [Medium,Fix committed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/102548
<crimsun> ^ EtienneG 
<EtienneG> crimsun, thanks a lot !
<crimsun> thank _you_!
<ScottK> crimsun: No one jumped on Bug #102470, so if you'd have time to upload, I'd appreciate it...
<ubotu> Malone bug 102470 in clamsmtp "Clamsmtp init script does not create PID file" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/102470
<crimsun> ScottK: looking
<ScottK> Thanks.
<AstralJava> I hope this won't be taken as flooding, but I'm still looking for a second MOTU to ACK these packages in REVU: ubuntustudio-icon-theme http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=4786, ubuntustudio-sounds http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=4780, usplash-theme-ubuntustudio http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=4782, and ubuntustudio-look http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=4778. 
<crimsun> bug 102470
<ubotu> Malone bug 102470 in clamsmtp "Clamsmtp init script does not create PID file" [Undecided,Fix committed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/102470
<crimsun> ^ ScottK 
<ScottK> crimsun: Thanks.  I'll keep an eye one it and update the bugs accordingly.
<Hobbsee> AstralJava: poke
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: Is it to do with the packages he wants reviewed?
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: yes
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: I may be able to help. Whats up?
<Hobbsee> was just looking for where they were
* Hobbsee found them
<TheMuso> oh ok.
<_MMA_> Hobbsee: Thanx for any help you give us. :)
<Hobbsee> looks clean
* Hobbsee isnt good with python and such though
* Hobbsee mumbles...
* Hobbsee will review later
<Hobbsee> ooh, wow.  command not found in action
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: ?
* Hobbsee hadnt seen command-not-found before
<TheMuso> oh
<bahadunn> howdy
<AstralJava> Hobbsee: Hi there. :)
<bahadunn> how long does it take for bugs to be closed after it is resolved?
* Hobbsee notes that going thru REVU would probably be more effective in feisty+1, after the majority of autosyncs are done.
<Hobbsee> bahadunn: the length of time in which it takes for someone who knows how to close bugs, to see it.
* Hobbsee --> bed
<bddebian> Heya gang
<bahadunn> howdy
<ScottK> If a package FTBFS because of a problem not related to that package, do I need to do anything or does it eventually get rebuilt?
<ScottK> My new clamsmtp package fails because of dpkg: error processing libdevmapper1.02 (--configure): on all the archs it's built on so far.  
<jdong> what was that fancy apport-ish command for opening a bug report against a package?
<ScottK> Was that a separate question or a hint I ought to go open a bug against libdevmapper?
<bahadunn> I think I have a patch for bug #67429
<ubotu> Malone bug 67429 in mrename "mrename breaks due to wrong shebang" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/67429
<bahadunn> that was interesting
<ScottK> bahadunn: You need to attach the patch to the bug.
<ucap> what do I need to do once I have added a patch to a bug? Do I have to notify someone and if so, who do I get in touch with?
<Adri2000> ScottK: it's a known problem of devmapper, and a fix has been uploaded
<ScottK> Ah.  OK.  Then I guess someone should update the bug.  Thanks.
<Adri2000> ucap: subscribe ubuntu-universe-sponsors
<\sh> bahadunn: s/\#\!\/bin\/sh/\#\!\/bin\/bash/
<ucap> Adri2000: okay, that's it? how long will it take for them to have a look at it?
<Adri2000> ucap: it will be faster if you give us the bug number here
<bahadunn> ScottK: yeah I need to sign up first though
<ucap> Adri2000: that's a good idea - so someone else can take a look at it, because those were the first two bugs I (hopefully) fixed. just a second - will look up the numbers
<ucap> #83673 and #92432
<Adri2000> bug #83673 #92432
<ubotu> Malone bug 83673 in sendmail "Misleading emphasis" [Low,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/83673
<Adri2000> ... bug #92432
<ubotu> Malone bug 92432 in bzr "index.html contains mainly broken links" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/92432
<sacater> does anyone know who i might talk about the kernel?
<sacater> and a possible bug/glitch?
<Adri2000> ucap: bzr is in main, so we (MOTUs) can't upload it, and I think you should work with EtienneG, he's the maintainer of bzr
<Toadstool> g'morning everybody!
<bddebian> Heya Toadstool
<Adri2000> heya Toadstool
<Toadstool> hi bddebian & Adri2000 
<Adri2000> sacater: the kernel maintainer in ubuntu is Ben Collins
<sacater> Adri2000: thank you
<Toadstool> Adri2000 is a bot!!1 :)
<Toadstool> !maintainer apport
<Adri2000> pitti
<Adri2000> o/
<Toadstool> w00t!
<sacater> !maintainer kernel
<Adri2000> hm
<ucap> Adri2000: will do, thanks!
<EtienneG> ucap, thanks a lot for the bzr doc bug, it slipped by in my inbox
<ucap> EtienneG: I didn't even realize you where in here. Don't mention it - I know it's not a major bug, but it was an easy one to get started
<EtienneG> ucap, sure, your contribution is very appreciated, this one slipped of my radar
<ucap> EtienneG: no problem - btw, as mentioned in the last comment - the last link is a dead link.
<cypher1> can anyone please tell me, what is meant by held packages.. i am having problems updating to Feisty Beta
<cypher1> or how i can find the held(culprit) packages.. the update-manager seems to give less details
<Adri2000> cypher1: this is not a support channel, please join #ubuntu+1
<cypher1> Adri2000, sure sorry
<sacater> anyone here good with perl, and perl gui?
<jdong> ScottK: oh no, no, I didn't mean that as a jab at you.. it was a totally unrelated question
<jdong> I really wanted to know what the command was
<jdong> someone showed me here a few weeks back
<jdong> and I forgot
<ScottK> OK.  NP.  I was just checking.
<xopher> Is deluge 0.5.x going to make it into Feisty?
<ScottK> Looks like my earlier question got answered on #ubuntu-devel:
<ScottK> <cjwatson> geser: not entirely automatically, but it's likely that there'll just be a mass give-back, which amounts to the same thing
<ScottK> <cjwatson> geser: not entirely automatically, but it's likely that there'll just be a mass give-back, which amounts to the same thing
<ScottK> Oops...
<ScottK> <cjwatson> will everyone please stop panicking about buildds. this has been a public service announcement. :-)
<ajmitch> morning
<DktrKranz> hi ajmitch 
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<ajmitch> bddebian: ah, you're still with us
<bddebian> I think I have a few hours left..
<ajmitch> apart from the little fact that the TB will renew your membership
<ScottK> That sounded ominous  ...
<ScottK> Oh.
<bddebian> ajmitch: Well that would be news to me :-)
<ajmitch> bddebian: not really
<bddebian> It wouldn't?  MC != TB
<ajmitch> and?
<bddebian> And how would I know that TB was going to renew me?
<ajmitch> psychic powers
<bddebian> heh
<bddebian> I'm lucky to do simple addition :)
<EtienneG> crimsun, I am kind of worried about the upload of bzr-gtk this morning ... it have yet to show up on Launchapd
<DarkSun88> Any universe sponsor here?
<geser> DarkSun88: what do you need?
<Fujitsu> Morning everybody.
<geser> Hi Fujitsu
<ajmitch> morning Fujitsu, geser 
* ajmitch gets hating php again
* Fujitsu convinces somebody to reject #102843 nicely.
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: Why?
<Fujitsu> bug #102843
<ubotu> Malone bug 102843 in Ubuntu "php4 feisty" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/102843
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: because that's what I do for a job
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: attack ^^
<freeflying> May I ask for UVE now, I know we are in deep freeze now, but this package will affect any others, and is very important foy chinese users
<ajmitch> & I use php4
<Fujitsu> ... darn.
<ajmitch> so I can hardly argue the other way now, while our code still breaks with php5 :)
<Fujitsu> Yeah.
* ajmitch uses debian on the servers anyway
<DarkSun88> geser: Can you so kind to check this Sync? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/tendra/+bug/103080
<ubotu> Malone bug 103080 in tendra "Please sync tendra 4.1.2-16 from Debian (unstable)" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  
<geser> DarkSun88: see bug #79360
<ubotu> Malone bug 79360 in tendra "[Sync Request]  Please, sync tendra (4.1.2-16) from debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,Rejected]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/79360
<danohuiginn> Hi all. Question for you...
<danohuiginn> qcalculate-kde installs duplicate menu items, because it puts entries in /usr/share/applications and /usr/share/applnk (bug 91357)
<ubotu> Malone bug 91357 in qalculate-kde "[feisty herd 5]  qalculate has duplicate entries in kde menu" [Undecided,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/91357
<danohuiginn> which should I get rid of?
<geser> DarkSun88: tendra doesn't build in feisty (at least it didn't build than)
<DarkSun88> geser: Mm, ok. Excuse me.
<geser> danohuiginn: if I'm not mistaken is /usr/share/applnk the old location but you might want to double-check in #kubuntu-devel
<danohuiginn> thanks, geser. I'll ask over there, to be sure
<geser> DarkSun88: np
#ubuntu-motu 2007-04-05
<TheMuso> Hey MOTUs.
<stgraber> hey
<shawarma> Greetings.
<Fujitsu> Hi TheMuso.
<geser> Hi TheMuso
<marcin_ant> hi guys I would like to ask if is this possible (and if it is then please tell me how) to prepare a package that is a set of patches (and few extensions) to some existing package
<marcin_ant> AFAIK there is no way to use the same files with two packages so I ask how to create package that needs to modify files provided by some other pkg
<poningru> someone wanna package http://www.cdc.informatik.tu-darmstadt.de/aircrack-ptw/download/aircrack-ptw-1.0.0.tar.gz
<ajmitch> poningru: you do!
<poningru> :p
<ajmitch> marcin_ant: I'd generally say no - packages aren't meant to touch files from other packages
<poningru> ok so at 0900 EDT hookup to the matrix at your end, and I will hook upto the matrix on my end
<poningru> at that point goahead and scp your knowledge on packaging to me
<Fujitsu> Anybody have an Edgy system around that they are able to test out the edgy-proposed fix for bug #64016 on? I need two acks.
<ubotu> Malone bug 64016 in bluefish "Bluefish crashes when saving document" [Medium,Fix committed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/64016
<poningru> here's my brains public key:
<marcin_ant> ajmitch: so.. there is no way to avoid this situation?
<marcin_ant> ajmitch: I got package with web application written with php
<marcin_ant> ajmitch: and then have extension package that has sources available as set of patches plus some new files
<marcin_ant> ajmitch: and because it's php it has mixed code I see no way to avoid patching
<poningru> ajmitch: no? :(
<ajmitch> poningru: no
<poningru> but the matrix man the matrix :(
<poningru> :P
* poningru stops heckling productive people
<ajmitch> hah
<ajmitch> "productive"
* poningru lulz
<sharms> Does anyone know if the gcc -> 4.2 transition is 100% going to happen in feisty + 1
<wick2o> evening
<wick2o> anyone know how to run a custom bash script whenever a cd automounts?
<selinuxium> hi all, anyone about?
<wick2o> yep
<selinuxium> Just tried to install nexuiz and got a strange error.   nexuiz: Depends: nexuiz-data (>=2.2.3-1) but 2.2.3-1~edgy1 is to be installed
<wick2o> whats so weird about that?
<selinuxium> Nexuiz is 2.2.3-1~edgy 
<wick2o> dont know, im still missing something i guess
<selinuxium> Or am I missing something?
<selinuxium> lol
<Fujitsu> Looks like a backports bug.
* Fujitsu checks.
<selinuxium> All the Nexuiz packages have the same version code, but they are looking for different packages.
<Fujitsu> Bug #90052
<ubotu> Malone bug 90052 in glom "UVF glom: 1.3.8 -> 1.3.11" [Medium,Fix released]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/90052
<Fujitsu> ... not that one.
<Fujitsu> bug #99052
<ubotu> Malone bug 99052 in update-manager "'Could not calculate the upgrade' -- edgy to feisty" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/99052
<Fujitsu> Gah, not that one either.
<Fujitsu> Bug #95002
<ubotu> Malone bug 95002 in edgy-backports "Can't upgrade nexuiz from edgy-backports" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/95002
<Fujitsu> That's the one.
<Fujitsu> selinuxium: ^^
<selinuxium> Fujitsu: Youv'e got a good memory!
<plugwash__> 2.2.3-1~edgy is lower than 2.2.3-1 , this is nowadays the normal way of lowering a version for a backport
<selinuxium> I understand, cheers guys!
<Joe_CoT> hey, i had some questions on packaging. not how it's done :) but how i'd go about it to deal with non-free copyright issues
<Fujitsu> Joe_CoT: Ask upstream to make it free, basically.
<Fujitsu> Or remove the bits if they're not critical.
<Joe_CoT> it is free, it's just not gpl. the engine is gpl, the data files are more restricted. they're free to redistribute, but not to sell, not to put in another game, etc.
<Joe_CoT> so i assume the game data couldn't go into universe, but could it go into multiverse?
<wick2o> ummm udev seems kinda cryptic
<Fujitsu> Joe_CoT: That's right.
<bddebian> Heya gang
<Fujitsu> Hi bddebian.
<RAOF> Heya bddebian 
<Fujitsu> Have you expired yet?
<bddebian> Hi Fujitsu, RAOF
<bddebian> Fujitsu: Dunno
<Joe_CoT> Fujitsu: ok. how would the packages be organized. for example, Warsow or Sauerbraten. Would I make a package for the engine, and then another for the game data? Would I make a third package that had both as dependencies?
<Fujitsu> sauerbraten is about to be synced from Debian.
<bddebian> I thought it was not re-distributable?
<Fujitsu> There is sauerbraten in universe, and sauerbraten-data in multiverse.
<Fujitsu> bddebian: It's in Debian contrib and non-free, so it must be.
<bddebian> hmm
<Joe_CoT> ok. but in general, how would it be done? and where could I get a list of what's to be synced so i don't waste my time? :D
<Fujitsu> (see bug #102841)
<ubotu> Malone bug 102841 in Ubuntu "please add sauerbraten from debian/contrib to feisty" [Medium,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/102841
<Fujitsu> Joe_CoT: Before creating a package, you should always check if it's in Debian.
<tarheelcoxn> eeeew. as a vegetarian, I object to the addition of sauerbraten
* tarheelcoxn runs
<Fujitsu> Wow, sauerbraten-data is huge.
* bddebian uploads MeatMeatAndMoreMeat
* tarheelcoxn eyes bddebian warily
<bddebian> heh
<Joe_CoT> http://wiki.debian.org/Games/Suggested it's listed there as suggested and not in yet. I see it now on packages.debian
* Fujitsu doesn't trust LP's team management.
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: why not?
<Fujitsu> janimo is listed as expiring from ubuntu-dev `1 hours ago', but is still shown as approved.
<ajmitch> probably happens on a cron job or something
<Fujitsu> Maybe.
<Fujitsu> Looks more than a little strange, however.
<ajmitch> bddebian expires in 22 hours
<Fujitsu> Noted.
* ajmitch expires in october
* Fujitsu expires in 1.5 years or so.
<ajmitch> though I expire from core-dev in sept
<Fujitsu> How does that work?
<Fujitsu> Isn't the term 2 years for both?
<ajmitch> I was in motu long before LP was used
<ajmitch> membership was transferred & some expiry dates set, etc
* ajmitch shrugs
<ajmitch> I'll worry about it at the time, when they go to drop me from core-dev
<simonp> !packages
<ubotu> You can browse and search for Ubuntu packages using !Synaptic, !Adept, "apt-cache search <keywords>", the "apt:/" URL in KDE, or online at http://packages.ubuntu.com - Ubuntu has about 20000 packages available, so please *search* for an official package before installing things in awkward ways!
<bddebian> tick tock tick tock
<RAOF> ?
<bddebian> My times running out :-)
* RAOF wonders whether the chroots on launchpad's buildd's are fixed yet.
<RAOF> :)
<Fujitsu> RAOF: They are not :(
<bddebian> Might have, I just got a couple of ia64 build failures :-)
<bddebian> Oh, they aren't?
<RAOF> Me too.
<Fujitsu> Hm..
<Fujitsu> They were broken an hour ago.
<superm1> Fujitsu, what happened today that they broke?
<Fujitsu> It was a couple of days ago.
<Fujitsu> dmraid and something else tried to execute update-initramfs.
<Fujitsu> That's not installed in the chroots, so everything failed.
<superm1> oh wow
<ajmitch> just some postinst changes in some required packages
<ajmitch> which had some sideeffects
<Fujitsu> Um, not dmraid, that other one... dm-setup or so.
<RAOF> It seems that the ia64 chroot is broken in a different way, now
<superm1> Fujitsu, if this was a few days ago, why hasn't it been fixed as of yet?  can't just revert to the old postinst in dm-setup?
<Fujitsu> No idea.
<Fujitsu> Soyuz does strange things, and the buildds might not have updated.
<ajmitch> superm1: no, it's not as simple as that
<superm1> ajmitch, assumed as much :)
<ajmitch> manual bootstrapping would need to be done
<ajmitch> since to compile a new version of the package, the old (broken) version would get automatically installed
<Fujitsu> Oh.
<Fujitsu> Of course, yes.
<ajmitch> because it's in the required set of packages
<Fujitsu> I hand't thought of that.
* superm1 reminisces of his days of bootstrapping into level 1 gentoo installs
<Fujitsu> *hadn't
* Fujitsu tells superm1 to get out.
<superm1> .... didn't finish that comment, glad that those days are long over :)
<jdong> superm1: dude weren't those fun days?
<jdong> superm1: where you have to run ./bootstrap.sh
<superm1> jdong, i dont know if it would say the "fun" days
<jdong> and there's a SPECIAL one for 2.6 as opposed to 2.4....
<superm1> jdong, i hated how often my system would break
<jdong> aye, agreed
<jdong> but it was more "interactive"
<jdong> and if you had nothing better to do... "fun"
<jdong> but I find as soon as one finds something more meaningful to do, one gets less and less tolerant of babysitting OS'es
<superm1> exactly
<crimsun> erg, so many regressions to fix
<Fujitsu> crimsun: In what? ALSA?
<crimsun> Fujitsu: aye
<crimsun> this HDA business is an absolute mess
<Fujitsu> HDA does that, unfortunately.
* RAOF is thankful that his HDA card is fixed (modulo suspend, for some reason), at least.
<crimsun> the "inaudible sound upon resume" bit?
<RAOF> Yeah, that one.
<jmg> hidef audio?
<RAOF> hda_intel
<crimsun> I haven't had time to dig deeper, but it wouldn't surprise me if it were a combination of braindead manufacturer and Linux acpi
<crimsun> does unloading and reloading help?
<RAOF> It doesn't bother me too much, because of various *other* suspend problems.
<RAOF> I don't think I've tried that.  I can, if you'd like.
<crimsun> modprobe -r $(lsmod |grep ^snd |awk '{print $1}') && sudo modprobe snd-hda-intel
* Fujitsu is thankful that suspend works flawlessly on his laptop.
* RAOF makes sure to kill compiz, so he doesn't hit the stupid nvidia bug.
<RAOF> crimsun: "FATAL: Modules snd_hda_intel is in use"
<crimsun> killed all the apps listed in $(lsof -t /dev/dsp* /dev/audio* /dev/mixer* /dev/snd/*) ?
<RAOF> crimsun: Yup, unload/reload works.
<crimsun> hmm.
<crimsun> RAOF: try adding "snd-hda-codec snd-hda-intel" to MODULES in /etc/default/acpi-support
<RAOF> Ok, done.  Is there anything I need to do to get that config reloaded, or just suspend?
<crimsun> you may need to reboot to test
<RAOF> I guess the answer is "yes", because a suspend-resume cycle has failed that test :)
<crimsun> reboot->suspend-to-RAM->resume
<jmg> push to test, reboot to detonate
<RAOF> Hm, it doesn't seem to want to reboot :(
<jmg> 240v reset
* RAOF holds down the power button.
* jmg waves RAOF goodbye
<RAOF> Ok, there's that bug again.
<RAOF> Every now and then, the keyboard stops working after resume-from-suspend.  Just suspending and resuming again fixes it though.
* imbrandon yawns
<imbrandon> moins all
<crimsun> RAOF: does the above modification to /etc/default/acpi-support's MODULES work around the issue?
<RAOF> No, it doesn't.
<RAOF> Sorry it took so long to test, I forgot to disable compiz :(
<crimsun> so it needs the entire sound stack unloaded, blarg.
<crimsun> oh, and this is on 2.6.20-14.22, correct?
<RAOF> Not quite, it's on -13 (the laptop was only updated this morning, and doesn't have a net connection ATM)
<RAOF> crimsun: Anything else I can do for you?
<crimsun> RAOF: in the immortal words of the topic of #ubuntu-kernel...
<crimsun> "2.6.20-14.22 Uploaded - If you aren't using it, then you risk your bugs not getting fixed."
<RAOF> :)
<RAOF> I'll tell you if it fixes sound-on-suspend tonight :P
* RAOF loves the anticipation of a fresh, new kernel :)
<crimsun> it likely won't, but we need to start at -14.22
<RAOF> Fair 'nuff.
<RAOF> Yay, the buildd's are fixed.
<crimsun> indeed. Your patches to banshee are in archive.uc
<RAOF> One fewer local package needed :)
<dholbach> good morning
<sacater> dholbach: MORNING!
<sacater> :D
<dholbach> hey sacater
* sacater dashes about like the energetic young thing that he is
* sacater waves
* sacater zips off for ice cream
<imbrandon> heya dholbach 
<dholbach> hey imbrandon
<imbrandon> Fujitsu, any word on the /+rdf front ?
<AstralJava> If someone could please take a look at Bug #103225, ubuntustudio-look finally got 2 ACKs and oughta be ready for uploading. Thanks! :)
<ubotu> Malone bug 103225 in ubuntustudio-look "[UVFe request]  ubuntustudio-look in REVU" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/103225
<Fujitsu> imbrandon: Nothing at all.
<Fujitsu> (currently at dinner)
<imbrandon> kk
<Ademan_away> gegl isn't in the repositories is it?
<Fujitsu> Ademan_away: I think it is...
<Ademan_away> Fujitsu: package name? i don't see it
<Fujitsu> Indeed... I thought it was.
<Ademan_away> i kinda hoped it was, it's cool stuff
<CrippledCanary> I have a dependency / libusb-dev question. 
<CrippledCanary> A application I try to package uses libusb-dev for build and that generates a dependency on libusb but libusb isn't installable. What to do?
<CrippledCanary> libusb should be a virtual package or something but it isn't.
<CrippledCanary> I'm using feisty by the way.
<DarkMageZ> CrippledCanary, does the control file specify a specific version of libusb-dev?
<DarkMageZ> CrippledCanary, if you're running pbuilder. see if updating the pbuilder environment helps.
<CrippledCanary> No..
<CrippledCanary> No version, I just updated pbuilder
<CrippledCanary> I tried in edgy now and I get the same error.
<CrippledCanary> Let's focus on edgy at the moment cause my feisty environment is beeing rebuildt at the moment.
<CrippledCanary> In edgy the libusb package is actually called "libusb-0.1-4" 
<DarkMageZ> CrippledCanary, hmm, something interesting. in your control file is there a dependency marked on libusb0 ? there is a conflict marked on libusb-dev against libusb0.
<\sh> moins
<CrippledCanary> DarkMageZ: No, the only BD I have is libusb-dev and the D does only have ${shlibs:Depends}, ${misc:Depends} and some other libs that is not related to this.
<CrippledCanary> the libusb dependency is autogenerated.
<DarkMageZ> CrippledCanary, hmm. that's really odd. i'll see if i can replicate that here...
<CrippledCanary> Shure.
<CrippledCanary> I can build the package and if I install libusb-0.1-4 manually and install my new deb with --force-dependency it works so libusb-0.1-4 does what it should. 
<CrippledCanary> A virtual libusb package that pointed to libusb-0.1-4 would be a workaround but not nice.
<CrippledCanary> Or perhaps there is something wrong with my control file
<CrippledCanary> The source package for libusb-0.1-4 and libusb-dev is called libusb.
<DarkMageZ> does it fail @ the " -> Considering build-dep libusb-dev
<DarkMageZ>    -> Trying libusb-dev" part?
<DarkMageZ> if you want, you can pass me a copy of the control file and i'll see if it runs here
<DarkMageZ> but it just worked fine here, afew simple deps + libusb-dev
<giskard> geser, ping :) 
<CrippledCanary> Build runs fine. No trouble with "Trying ...". 
<CrippledCanary> It's when I try to install the generated deb that I get a dependency on libusb.
<CrippledCanary> debuild / pbuilder perhaps picks this up from configure or something like that.
<CrippledCanary> I haven't realy got a good grip of how dependencies is handled when you create packages.
<DarkMageZ> CrippledCanary, any chance of getting a copy of the resulting package? or is this a commerical app?
<CrippledCanary> Shure you can have it...
<CrippledCanary> It's a GPL:ed FUSE based software to access dallas/maxim 1-wire devices.
<CrippledCanary> Where to...
<ajmitch> CrippledCanary: that's expected behaviour though
<CrippledCanary> ajmitch: Ok.
<ajmitch> this is why we have shlibs:Depends, so that you get dependencies on the version of the library you build against
<ajmitch> install with gdebi if you want to resolve dependencies
<CrippledCanary> Yes.. but what if the dependencies generated doesent exist.
<ajmitch> or with dpkg, and run apt-get -f install
<ajmitch> it ought to be there :)
<CrippledCanary> there isn't any package for libusb
<CrippledCanary> not in main, restricted, universe or multiverse
<CrippledCanary> That's the problem.
<ajmitch> libusb-0.1-4 | 2:0.1.12-2 | http://apt-proxy feisty/main Packages
<ajmitch> but the binary dependency is against libusb-0.1-4, no?
<CrippledCanary> yes.. but the autogenerated dep is for libusb.
<CrippledCanary> not libusb-0.1.-4
* ajmitch checks libusb-dev shlibs
<ajmitch> hm, it certainly shouldn't be doing that, the libusb* shlibs are all ok on feisty
<CrippledCanary> Can you check edgy too.
<CrippledCanary> or tell me how to look for it.
* ajmitch has no edgy install
<ajmitch> got the source package somewhere?
<CrippledCanary> my feisty install went "up in flames" after I tried some things I shouldn't
<ajmitch> hehe
<CrippledCanary> the source.. for my package
<ajmitch> yep
<CrippledCanary> I'll give you a url in a moment.
<ajmitch> thanks
<CrippledCanary> I tared everything to http://www.bjorkvagen2.se/owfs.tar.gz
<CrippledCanary> It's not finished in any way. Still lots of things to do but I wanted to get this sorted out first.
<DarkSun88> Hi all
<BugMaN> Hi DarkSun88!
<DarkSun88> BugMaN: ;)
<CrippledCanary> DarkSun88: Hi.
<DarkSun88> CrippledCanary: Hello
<ajmitch> CrippledCanary: Depends: ${shlibs:Depends}, ${misc:Depends}, fuse-utils, libfuse2, libusb
<ajmitch> there's your problem
<CrippledCanary> Ok.. I thought I had removed that, I might have sent you som old sources.
<CrippledCanary> I put in libusb in D: because I wanted to see if it helped but without result.
* ajmitch waits for it to build
<CrippledCanary> My bad...
<CrippledCanary> ajmitch: You are right, it works...... 
<gnomefreak> was the nvidia-glx +upgrade+geforce4 cards been fixed?
<CrippledCanary> ajmitch:  Sometimes it just takes another pair of eyes.... Thanks alot for you valuable time.
<ajmitch> np
<imbrandon> ...
<ajmitch> imbrandon: ?
<imbrandon> heya ajmitch 
<imbrandon> nothing, just me being me
<ajmitch> hehe ok
* ajmitch should expect some oddities then
<imbrandon> i have awstats going over my weblogs for the last 4 months
<imbrandon> been running since noon yesterday
<imbrandon> still not done
<imbrandon> lol
<ajmitch> because you're famous
<ajmitch> it'd take about .05 sec to run for me
<imbrandon> hehe 400k hits a month so far ( on the 2 months its parsed , jan and feb )
<Fujitsu> Not bad, imbrandon.
* ajmitch would be lucky to get 400 hits, total
<imbrandon> i dont have them passwd protected yet ( untill the script gets done ) 
<imbrandon> chek it out
<imbrandon> http://www.imbrandon.com/awstats/awstats.pl?config=www.imbrandon.com
<imbrandon> and actualy part of december 06 is on there too
<imbrandon> thats when i moved everything to the new DC
<imbrandon> 437536 for jan 07
<ajmitch> not bad
<imbrandon> 23k unique visitors
<imbrandon> hehe
<imbrandon> seems i have more readers than i knew about
<imbrandon> i wonder what humboldt.ubuntu.com does
<imbrandon> i have 3k hits from them 
<imbrandon> that might be the box that does the planet or something
<illovae> hello
<ajmitch> yep, same ip address
<imbrandon> ahh
<ajmitch> hello illovae 
<imbrandon> hello illovae 
<illovae> :)
<imbrandon> MOTU renewal is only for 1 year ?
<ajmitch> imbrandon: no idea
<ajmitch> I believe it is though
<ajmitch> we agreed on some length of time for it
<imbrandon> yea
<imbrandon> for Life !?!!!oneone!111!!eleventyone!!11111
<ajmitch> only people like crimsun & dholbach deserve life membership
<imbrandon> :)
<sacater> morning MOTU
<ajmitch> hi
* sacater waves at ajmitch 
<EtienneG> morning everybody
<EtienneG> ?seen ucap
<ajmitch> morning EtienneG 
<EtienneG> damn bot
<EtienneG> !seen ucap
<ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about seen ucap - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
<ajmitch> heh
<EtienneG> crimsun, ping
<dholbach> ajmitch: come on :)
<dholbach> hey EtienneG
<ajmitch> dholbach: well you do deserve it :)
<_MMA_> EtienneG: Tell crimsun what you want in your ping. Its better that way.
<zul> hola
<ajmitch> hi zul 
<zul> hey ajmitch how goes it
<ajmitch> alright, you?
<zul> good
<EtienneG> dholbach, good morning gentlemen  ... not too weary from lack of sleep yet ?
<EtienneG> _MMA_, good point ..
<dholbach> EtienneG: i'm ok - thanks - how are you?
<EtienneG> dholbach, sick (go a cold) but otherwise fine
<dholbach> EtienneG: hope you're going to be ok soon again
* dholbach hugs EtienneG
<EtienneG> dholbach, don't, you gotta catch my germs !!! :)
<EtienneG> dholbach, crimsun have done an upload for me in universe yesterday ... I am kind of worried as it have not shown up yet
<EtienneG> I'm looking for the *^&$%& bug number ...
<zul> its probably stuck being waited for being built
<EtienneG> zul, yeah, might well be ... 
<EtienneG> how long can it take ? 
<EtienneG> are universe upload queued after main for the release, or something like that ?
<dholbach> EtienneG: a NEW package?
<EtienneG> dholbach, no, it's an update to bzr-gtk
<EtienneG> Fix #02548
<EtienneG> Fix #102548 , I mean
<dholbach> which version no?
<dholbach> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/feisty/+queue?queue_state=3&queue_text=bzr-gtk
<dholbach> there seems to be 0.15.1-0ubuntu1
<EtienneG> 0.15.2-0ubuntu1
<dholbach> EtienneG: maybe mithrandir or another archive admin can rescue it from somewhere?
<EtienneG> ok, I will see
<EtienneG> dholbach, could it be that it got ... lost ... somewhere ?
<dholbach> EtienneG: yes
<EtienneG> dholbach, 
<EtienneG> ok
<EtienneG> does the archive admin have their own channel, or I just gran one on IRC ?
<EtienneG> s/gran/grab/
<EtienneG> I'm going to ask on #ubuntu-devel ...
<xerxas> dholbach,  ? 
<xerxas> howcome you can change the importance of bug (in thelepathy) and I can"t ? 
<ajmitch> night all
<EtienneG> night ajmitch 
<dholbach> xerxas: need to be in ubuntu-qa
<giskard_> geser, ping
<sacater> 
<geser> giskard_: pong
<saispo> hi
<saispo> i have a package contrib, how can i submit it ?
<StevenK> At this point, you don't, sorry. We are about two weeks from release.
<saispo> ok
<saispo> no problem :)
<saispo> after
<saispo> StevenK: you have the force to upload in Ubuntu ?
<jussi01> hi motu's! 
<Hobbsee> saispo: he does
<Hobbsee> hi jussi01 
<StevenK> I so don't.
<jussi01> hello Hobbsee 
<StevenK> I uh, lost my key. Yes, that'll do.
<Hobbsee> heh
<jussi01> !revu
<ubotu> REVU is a web-based tool to give people who have worked on Ubuntu packages a chance to "put their packages out there" for other people to look at and comment on in a structured manner. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU
<saispo> StevenK: hh ;-) it's so bad
<stgraber> Anyone has a way to get all the packages that were manually installed since the system install (so : not the base system and not any dep or update) ?
<\sh> guys, happy easter to you :)
<bddebian> Heya gang
<crimsun> EtienneG: unlikely pong
<EtienneG> crimsun, hey !
<EtienneG> thanks for the upload yesterday
<EtienneG> it was not showing up in LP
<EtienneG> so I had a little investigation to do
<EtienneG> it was re-uploaded by our dear dholbach
<crimsun> interesting, I didn't get an accept, either
<crimsun> yet another instance of soyuz-the-grue eating my upload
<bddebian> heh
<Q-FUNK> thrown the .dsc into orbit, I guess
<crimsun> that was supposed to be fixed with the keyserver fix
<crimsun> yep, definitely in ~/.bash_history
<Q-FUNK> crimsun: was it you who is an ALSA hacker?
<soc> are there plans to include the latest swfdec to enabe popular flash video sites like youtube in feisty?
<crimsun> Q-FUNK: of sorts, yes
<zul> of sorts? heh...thats a bit of an understatement
<crimsun> soc: you'd need to file an UVF exception request for 0.4.3 [implying you need to package it, too; see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess#head-9523bc4076ff011324d67cddc97969ec609618d6 ] 
<bddebian> Didn't I already ask for a sync of swfdec?
<crimsun> bddebian: for 0.3.6-2.2?
<bddebian> Oh, nm, sorry
<crimsun> I think soc's asking for an entirely new version, 0.4.3
<geser> crimsun: can you please look at bug #103396
<ubotu> Malone bug 103396 in wordpress "[UVF exception]  Merge wordpress 2.1.3" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/103396
<tonyyarusso> Bugfix, mostly, some new minor features.
<tonyyarusso> Fixing loose ends after the 2.1.2 security fix
<crimsun> geser: commented
<geser> thanks
<crimsun> np
<Q-FUNK> crimsun: ah yes.  now I remember:  the sabdfl bounty to fix all remaining issues in ALSA support on Mac. :)
<LaserJock> some days you just gotta laugh
<LaserJock> I remember in Dapper when people got so mad because network-manager wasn't installed by default
<LaserJock> now there's all kinds of "N-M sucks, what were the devs thinking" threads
<Burgwork> indeed
<DktrKranz> was it decided to disable N-M, then?
<LaserJock> DktrKranz: heavens no
<DktrKranz> oh, great :)
<LaserJock> that would cause even more screaming threads
<LaserJock> moving it to Recommends: was a good move though
<LaserJock> so you can uninstall it without taking out ubuntu-desktop
<LaserJock> I just think it's interesting
<DktrKranz> ah, didn't notice
<LaserJock> I guess with that many users, no matter what you do, you'll get enough people that don't like it that they can cause quite a stir
<zul> its like everyone is has turrets syndrome
<DktrKranz> well, it's quite easy to fit everyone's needs
<DktrKranz> *hard
<nixternal> keescook: are you coming to Flourish? :) Ubuntu Chicago will have a couple of tables (which they just told us about after telling us no), and then we are doing the battle of the distros
<keescook> nixternal: I'm not; I live out in Oregon, but I'm hoping my mom will go (she's the one who emailed me about it)
<nixternal> keescook: sweet!
<superm1> nixternal, whats happening in chicago when?  i'll be back home in chicago in the next month or so...
<LaserJock> keescook: you're from Oregon?
<LaserJock> keescook: Portland?
<keescook> LaserJock: yawp.  I love it here.  :)
<LaserJock> keescook: Biggest Little City
<keescook> LaserJock: totally.  :)
<superm1> nixternal, oh April 6-th 7th... i see now.  man :(
<LaserJock> although I'm from Reno and *we* are the true Biggest Little City :p
<LaserJock> we even have 2 big signs to prove it ;-)
<keescook> hehe
<LaserJock> glad to see some other West Coasters
<LaserJock> can't trust that California lot
<micahcowan> LaserJock, how do Reno'ers feel about Reno 911? :)
<LaserJock> hmm, I don't know
<nixternal> hahahah
<nixternal> Reno 911 rocks
<LaserJock> some of it's, "Yeah, that's about right"
* micahcowan is looking forward to seeing the movie
<LaserJock> mostly it's just a funny thing that doesn't have much of anything to do with the city
* bddebian looks forward to Transformers
<LaserJock> but I really haven't seen it
<LaserJock> so I don't know personally
<micahcowan> Heh, bet the Reno /cops/ hate it...
<micahcowan> Hey, is there a separate repo for -dbg versions of things?
<LaserJock> I think so
<LaserJock> micahcowan: I've only see one or two spots on the local news were they asked the local police about it
<LaserJock> mostly they just seemed to think it was funny
<LaserJock> I'm sure there are some that don't like it
<LaserJock> I don't think we take ourselves too seriously here
<micahcowan> Well, that's good :)
<LaserJock> personally I think most of the officials are just glad to see "Reno" anywhere :-)
<micahcowan> doko, is your name related to "DokoDoko Panic"?
<micahcowan> nm, that's Doki Doki.
<micahcowan> Ah, found it: pitti has the debug repo.
<pizux> hi all
<pizux> is there a way to have next the nvidia special legacy in the repo?
<LaserJock> pizux: I think the kernel team has decided that it would be too much work to do 3 different sets of nvidia drivers
<ajmitch> morning
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<ajmitch> bddebian: see, you even got sabdfl bringing you back into the team
<pizux> LaserJock, it's shame
<pizux> because a lot of people use nvidia super legacy 
<pizux> and it's a problem for newbies
<bddebian> ajmitch: Where is this?
<ajmitch> MC list
<bddebian> Hah, like he even knows who the fsck I am :-)
<LaserJock> everybody know's BddebianIsAGod ;-)
* bddebian vomits :-)
<nixternal> boo
* nixternal slips in it
<LaserJock> ewww
<bddebian> Heya nixternal
<LaserJock> he only gave you 1 year though
<ScottK> bddebian: You've been a big help to me and I say that at a time when I don't even have a package for you to upload.
<LaserJock> :-)
<ScottK> Does anyone here have a Feisty box (actual box, not a chroot) that has never had any version of clamav installed on it that they'd be willing to install it in for a test?  I'm trying to find out if Bug #39853 still happens or not.
<ubotu> Malone bug 39853 in clamav "While installing ClamAV dpkg returns an error" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/39853
<ScottK> It's tricky because it only happens the very first time you install it.
<LaserJock> ScottK: I do
<bddebian> ScottK: I probably can when I get home but I don't have my Feisty box here at the office
<ScottK> LaserJock: If you would please apt-get install clamav and then let me know if the install succeeds, I'd appreciate it.
<LaserJock> "works for me"
<ScottK> Cool.  There were some postinst changes in 0.90.1, so I'm going to declare victory and move on.
<ScottK> LaserJock: Thanks a bunch.
<geser> ajmitch: can you please look at bug #103396. thx
<ubotu> Malone bug 103396 in wordpress "[UVF exception]  Merge wordpress 2.1.3" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/103396
<ScottK> That gets clamav down to two bugs that both go away as soon as Breezy is no longer supported.
<pizux> is there a way to request nautilus open terminal by default in ubuntu?
<ScottK> pizux: This is not a support channel.
<ScottK> Try #ubuntu or #ubuntu+1.
<pizux> ok
<pizux> thx
* ajmitch gets bored & installs feisty in vmware
<LaserJock> ajmitch: that's pretty boring
<bddebian> Later gang
* Fujitsu looks for somebody with an Edgy machine that hasn't had Bluefish used on it before.
<sacater> Fujitsu: i use bluefish, but on edgy beta, and good?
<Fujitsu> You're running Edgy beta!?
<sacater> sorry
<sacater> no
<sacater> feisty
<sacater> i got confused :S
<sacater> any*
<gnomefreak> tonyyarusso: you around?
<sacater> Fujitsu: 
<gnomefreak> tonyyarusso: anyway i packaged iceape(seamonkey) name most likely will stay iceape. but either way it has composer in it and we will be adding this to feisty+1 as it stands. 
<sacater> ice
<zorglu_> i dunno where to say it, so i will say it here :) with the new launchpad i read about it and discovered launchpad itself and especially bazaar which seems really nice
<zorglu_> thanks :)
<zorglu_> there, that all i wanted to say :)
#ubuntu-motu 2007-04-06
<LaserJock> hmm
<LaserJock> I just realized I was talking in -devel
<LaserJock> oops
<nixternal> heh
<LaserJock> I thought I was here
<nixternal> there you go thinking again
<nixternal> man that is so dangerous
<nixternal> ;p
<LaserJock> bad habit
<nixternal> haha, I know the feeling
<nixternal> everytime I think, something gets destroyed
<LaserJock> btw, edubuntu-docs got uploaded
<LaserJock> I think it'll be the last for Feisty
<nixternal> good job bro! you rocked that one out hardcore, and quickly I might add
<LaserJock> unless I put translations back in
<LaserJock> nixternal: we even got some screenshots, TCM, and 2nd CD stuff
<nixternal> groovy
<tonyyarusso> gnomefreak: So, is that like pre-nvu composer, or what?  (not familiar with seamonkey)
<gnomefreak> its composer after nvu since its 1.1.1 )hasnt been out long 
<tonyyarusso> gnomefreak: Developed by who?
<gnomefreak> mozilla
<gnomefreak> person dont know
<tonyyarusso> Hmm
<tonyyarusso> Trying to figure out where in the bugfix progression it lies
* gnomefreak goes out for a bit.
<LaserJock> ok, what exactly is last.fm supposed to do?
<PhinnFort> LaserJock: find music that suits your taste
<PhinnFort> and find friends with similar taste in music
<PhinnFort> afaik
<LaserJock> hmm, ok
<tonyyarusso> gnomefreak: I'll have to look into that and make sure nobody's duplicating work
<gnomefreak> k
<gnomefreak> hmm why is it the patches i need cant be applied :(
<gnomefreak> oh well lets see if it builds
<gnomefreak> later
<_MMA_> LaserJock: http://www.last.fm/group/Ubuntu+Studio I just use it to see what the guys are listening to.
* LaserJock is confused but maybe this social networking stuff just is beyond him
* _MMA_ just likes to see what people listen to.
<bddebian> Heya gang
<chillywilly> bddebian: you liar
<bddebian> About what?
<chillywilly> ;P
<chillywilly> nevermind
<chillywilly> my channel numbers shifted and I thought this was #fsf ;P
<bddebian> haha
<chillywilly> my bad yo
<bddebian> I can honestly say I have never been in FSF.  I have been in #gnu once or twice in my life
<LaserJock> hmm, I haven't been in either
<LaserJock> I can't imagine what I'd need there
<LaserJock> and I'd probably get tarred and feathered anyway
<bddebian> A good lecturing? :)
<LaserJock> hmm, I wonder what would happen if I jumped in #fsf and said "Is this the place for Open Source"
<bddebian> hehe
<_MMA_> lol
<crimsun> "chemists hate GPLv3 draft 2!"
<LaserJock> heh
<LaserJock> maybe, "I've heard Emacs OS is better than Windows, is that true?"
<bddebian> Just tell them you use OSX, that should be enough :)
<LaserJock> bddebian: oh, excellent
<LaserJock> "I'm glad OS X uses Free software"
<LaserJock> crimsun: do you do any upstream development?
<bddebian> LaserJock: heh, you were serious, they only gave me another year :-)
<LaserJock> bddebian: yeah
<LaserJock> Marks was like "boy, I don't know about this guy. I think I better only give him 1 year" ;-)
<bddebian> fair enough
<LaserJock> bddebian: I guess he's just doing 1 year renewals
<LaserJock> that's going to be kind of a pain
<LaserJock> hi Hobbsee 
<Hobbsee> hi LaserJock 
<Hobbsee> has anyone uploaded https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/feisty/+source/bzr/+bug/92432 ?
<ubotu> Malone bug 92432 in bzr "index.html contains mainly broken links" [Undecided,Needs info]  
<Hobbsee> someone's marked it as fix released, and i suspect it hasnt been uploaded
<Hobbsee> oh, it has been, nvm
<joejaxx> nice
<joejaxx> i just found out one reason selinux-policy-default is failing :)
<jdong> because it saw apparmor in the same repositories?
* jdong ducks
<bddebian> hah
<joejaxx> jdong: i really do not want to start  selinux vs apprmor debate lol
<joejaxx> a*
<jdong> joejaxx: nor do I :D
<jdong> VIM RULES!!!!!!
<joejaxx> :)
<bddebian> NANO!
<joejaxx> LOL that is worst
<joejaxx> worse*
<bddebian> nano r0x j00
<joejaxx> apparently selinux-policy-default is looking for setfiles in /usr/sbin
<joejaxx> and setfiles is actuall
<joejaxx> /sbin/setfiles
<joejaxx> actually*
<joejaxx> ajmitch: are you around?
<joejaxx> the funny thing is in edgy setfiles is in /usr/sbin/ but in feisty it is in /sbin/
* jdong puts on forum hat
<jdong> let's just make a symlink!
* jdong takes off forum hat
<jdong> :D
<joejaxx> lol
<joejaxx> i do not think any selinux files have a ubuntu# version
<joejaxx> i wonder if there is a debian-selinux channel
* joejaxx goes to look at changles
<joejaxx> changelogs*
<crimsun> LaserJock: yes
<joejaxx> i wonder what the best way to go about this is
<sacater> oooh
<sacater> nano r0x mi wurld
<sacater> :D
<sacater> nano r0x mi w0rld
<joejaxx> lol
<tonyyarusso> nano has syntax highlighting - that was my cool discovery
<joejaxx> crimsun: are you knowledgable with selinux specific packages?
<sacater> dont laugh, its 4am, and im only on here cause i hacked my dads router restrictions, to keep me OFF at these times
<joejaxx> or anyone else too :)
<crimsun> joejaxx: no, andrew may be
<joejaxx> yeah that is what i was thinking
<joejaxx> i think he is sleep :)
<crimsun> he's likely at work
<jdong> sacater: you bad boy.
<joejaxx> crimsun: oh ok
<crimsun> being in .nz and all
<sacater> jdong: :P
* joejaxx does not know what timezone nz is in
<sacater> jdong: its easy, he is doing it on MAC, so i just change my MAC and the router sees my as any old user
<jdong> sacater: you're awful :D
<sacater> and he uses my new MAC
<sacater> i just change again!
<sacater> BORN FREE
<sacater> more time to fix bugs!
<coniferous> Haha.. Mac filtering. So useless.
<sacater> which is the main reason im up :D
<crimsun> joejaxx: either +11 or +12 UTC, don't remember precisely
<jdong> coniferous: heh that is an understatement
<jdong> coniferous: I wrote an automatic wayport AP hacker based on MAC identity theft
<sacater> if anyone cares i am GMT, not sure what that is it UTC
<crimsun> that is UTC.
<sacater> in*
<sacater> oh
<sacater>  :D
<sacater> then i am UTC+0
<tonyyarusso> No, GMT does daylight savings, UTC does not, iirc.
<tonyyarusso> might be wrong
<sacater> think you are
<coniferous> Jdong: Very cool. Wish i had the skill to do that. 
<jdong> coniferous: http://codebrowse.launchpad.net/~jdong/barnacle/barnacle.dev/files
<sacater> as i have done my daylight shift
<jdong> coniferous: it defeats the pay-to-surf public hotspots by locating another user on the subnet and assuming his MAC and IP
<coniferous> Jdong: Yeah, i just read the readme.. Brilliant! I'm holding on to this little gem. 
<joejaxx> Lol
<joejaxx> that is so wrong
<coniferous> Ah, man. I need to get myself a real wireless card. Ndis wrapper just dosent do the job..
<jdong> joejaxx: haha I've kinda shoved the moral side of it on the backburner :D
<sacater> oh, great, in the time it takes me to say a few lines, ive given people ideas....
<joejaxx> jdong: Lol
<coniferous> So, i have a question about MOTUs, I don't mean to sound noobsih or anything, but i was kinda wondering how to contribute to ubuntu. I've been using debian for a while so i know the format of a debian package fairly well, am i wrong in assuming this channel is for the package maintainers?
<tonyyarusso> coniferous: You're correct about that.
<tonyyarusso> I don't know exactly how one becomes a MOTU, but becoming a maintainer for a particular package is pretty simple.
<tonyyarusso> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU has lots of info
<coniferous> Oh, thats even in the topic.. thanks alot. I'll look that over. 
<crimsun> you may wish to snoop https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment , too.
<coniferous> i'll look at that too. thank you.
* ScottK is drinking Scotch and coding in Python. Hard to beat that.
<LaserJock> darn it
* bddebian is playing Oblivion again.. w00h00
<joejaxx> what is the Maintainer line once again?
<joejaxx> for ubuntu modified packages?
<bddebian> XSBC-Original-Maintainer, you mean?
<bddebian> Or what we put in it?
<joejaxx> Maintainer: Ubuntu MOTU Development Team <ubuntu-motu@lists.ubuntu.com> ?
<joejaxx> bddebian: yeah what we put
<ScottK> joejaxx: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebianMaintainerField
<coniferous> Funny you should mention that, Drinking cider and working in a cisco router simulator here. 
<coniferous> Mind you, i'm sure your having more fun then me..
<joejaxx> thanks
<bddebian> Well, looks like I expired from ubuntu-dev anyway
<ScottK> bddebian: Kinda takes the pressure off a week before freeze though?
<bddebian> Honestly without trying to sound like a whiny bitch, I'm a little bit offended
<ScottK> Are you the first one to come up for renewal under the new policy?
<joejaxx> bddebian: oh that is the motu team on launchpad
<bddebian> I don't think so but I don't know < ScottK
<Burgundavia> bddebian: likely a mere oversight
<joejaxx> well that setfiles error was only one problem
<Burgundavia> we really have no procedures in place for any sort of renewal yet
<StevenK> I thought ubuntu-dev was going to be killed?
* joejaxx looks to solve the next
<StevenK> And I thought the renewal procedure was to ask the techboard really nicely?
<bddebian> StevenK: I'm not sure about u-d, I had thought that also
<ScottK> Of course bddebian's no less screwed just because if it was a mistake.
<crimsun> bddebian: it's intentional that you are no longer part of ubuntu-dev
<crimsun> bddebian: see https://launchpad.net/~MOTU/+members
<crimsun> MOTU is a member of ubuntu-dev, so your upload privileges are preserved.
<bddebian> ScottK: I'm not saying that I'm screwed and I don't mean it to sound that way
<ScottK> Ooops
<ScottK> All I meant was intentional or not, the impact is not affected.
<bddebian> np
<crimsun> again, ~ubuntu-dev is deprecated in favour of ~MOTU
<crimsun> you were reactivated in the correct group.
<bddebian> crimsun: Understood thanks, that wasn't really what I meant
<crimsun> oh, are you referring to the term length?
<bddebian> I guess just a little of the overall process.  I realize that I'm no you or LaserJock, etc but I put a lot of my free time in to trying to help out where I can with just some blind e-mail telling me I'm expiring and to begging to the TB.
<crimsun> the silliness of the "you or LaserJock" comment aside ;-), you and Jani are the first to go through the procedure IIRC
<bddebian> Why is that a silly comment?  I realize that I'm not as intimately involved as you folks are.
<ScottK> No, he's saying you are overboard with being self-deprecating.
<bddebian> Well that's a personality quirk but it makes the comment no less valid
<joejaxx> every motu gets upload rights?
<bddebian> For Universe, yes
<crimsun> hmm, there sure are a lot of Deactivated people
<crimsun> (under ~MOTU)
<joejaxx> oh ok
<StevenK> crimsun: Including two Daniel Holbach's
<Hobbsee> bddebian: LP never was into personalized email, much.
<Hobbsee> bddebian: didnt you see the MOTU ML, which was where msot of the stuff went on?
<bddebian> 13?  Yeah and why is dholbach de-actived, because he's a core-dev?
<joejaxx> crimsun: looks like more selinux fun
<joejaxx> crimsun: changing the path to setfiles fixed one problem
<joejaxx> crimsun: now i am looking into the next :)
<crimsun> bddebian: yes, he's in core-dev
<bddebian> Hobbsee: Yes, most of them, though it's been hard to keep up lately with RL job :-(
<Hobbsee> bddebian: same here
<LaserJock> arggg
<joejaxx> LaserJock: what is wrong? :\
<LaserJock> I hate networking
<LaserJock> I can't wpa_supplicant to work
<crimsun> which wifi chipset?
<LaserJock> I tried wpagui but it can't connect to wpa_supplicant
<LaserJock> madwifi
<LaserJock> a AR5212
<crimsun> are you using madwifi or wext?
<LaserJock> madwifi I think
<crimsun> open, WEP, or WPA{,2} AP?
<LaserJock> WPA
<LaserJock> I went from open to WPA
<ScottK> LaserJock: I have ARS5212 and it works in Feisty with linux-restricted-modules and network manager.
<Burgundavia> LaserJock: I have madwifi and I use wap no problems
<LaserJock> well, sure, network manager works
<crimsun> err, wait, what?
<LaserJock> I'm just trying to get rid of network-manager
<crimsun> oh, so you're trying to use interfaces(5)?
<ScottK> Oh.  OK.  It just worked for me, so I didn't mess with it further.
<LaserJock> yeah
<crimsun> ok, is your /etc/wpa_supplicant/wpa_supplicant.conf configured correctly?
<ajmitch> joejaxx: you wanted something?
<LaserJock> well, I *think* so, there was a HOWTO on the forums and a wiki page
<crimsun> LaserJock: also, pastebin your interfaces(5) stanza
<LaserJock> but it doesn't look like it's working very well
<joejaxx> ajmitch: ah yes
<joejaxx> ajmitch: i figured out one part why selinux-policy-default does not install
<joejaxx> ajmitch: in the makefile it references setfiles as being in /usr/sbin/setfiles
<joejaxx> ajmitch: when in the newest policycoreutils it is in /sbin/setfiles
<ajmitch> probably because you're using the wrong policy
<ajmitch> and selinux-policy-default should be removed
<LaserJock> crimsun: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/14143/
<crimsun> LaserJock: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/14144/
<joejaxx> ajmitch: but is the makefile referencing /usr/sbin/setfiles still a problem?
<LaserJock> geeze, that's completly different
<ajmitch> joejaxx: just use selinux-policy-refpolicy-targeted
<crimsun> LaserJock: kel & reinhard spent a while making it interfaces(5)-compliant
<crimsun> this was back in breezy or dapper, don't remember
<joejaxx> ajmitch: ok
<ScottK> My query object cache is implemented and appears to be working, so I'm going to bed.  Good night all.
<joejaxx> Goodnight ScottK 
<joejaxx> looks like i need to manually relabel the files
* Hobbsee pokes imbrandon 
<Jucato> hm.. poking...
<bddebian> Ah well, gnight gang
<Jucato> bye bddebian
<joejaxx> ajmitch: may i pm you?
<joejaxx> Goodnight bddebian
<LaserJock> crimsun: slightly better, but it won't connect, it just keeps trying
<crimsun> LaserJock: can you sanitize and pastebin the foregrounded wpa_supplicant output?
<sacater> anyone seen any bugs in xmms lately :(I
<LaserJock> crimsun: yes, on sec
<LaserJock> crimsun: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/14145/
<LaserJock> crimsun: it was doing a lot of reconnects,  now it just sits there, so I'm assuming it's sort of working
<LaserJock> but I get no network
<ajmitch> joejaxx: if you need to
<crimsun> LaserJock: does iwconfig show you're associated?
<crimsun> (there's not enough output there to see)
<sacater> hey, because it comes with source, i dont suppose anyone would like to help me make a debian install for sauerbraten http://sauerbraten.org , i would need a lot of hand-holding though
<LaserJock> one sec, I have to turn off and on N-M between tests
<sacater> LaserJock: was that to me?
<LaserJock> sacater: no, it was for crimsun 
<LaserJock> crimsun: so maybe my /etc/network/interfaces is messed up?
<crimsun> LaserJock: you should definitely be using interfaces(5) syntax with wpa_supplicant
<crimsun> but does iwconfig show association?
<LaserJock> yes
<LaserJock> iwconfig shows the same with wpa_supplicant as with n-m
<LaserJock> it has my ssid, etc.
<LaserJock> when I try to ping a computer on the same network I just get: connect: Network is unreachable
<crimsun> LaserJock: well, do you have an IP [IPv4] ?
<LaserJock> I assume so yes
<LaserJock> or wait
<crimsun> `ip a'
<LaserJock> crimsun: nope, no IP
<crimsun> right, that explains the error above
<crimsun> now, which iface is that, ath0?
<LaserJock> ath0
<crimsun> does ``sudo dhclient ath0'' give you a lease?
<LaserJock> crimsun: wahoo, success
<LaserJock> I've never used dhclient, now I kinda feel like an idiot :/
<jussi01> morning motu's
<LaserJock> do you have to do dhclient everytime you want to get on the network?
<crimsun> no
<crimsun> I use the interfaces(5) format that I pastebinned
<crimsun> wpa_supplicant does the magic for me
<LaserJock> hmmm
<crimsun> (see /usr/share/doc/wpasupplicant/README.modes.gz for more info)
<LaserJock> well, I used yours
<crimsun> hmm.
<LaserJock> let me try something real quick
<crimsun> I see that "Madwifi supports both the 'wext' and 'madwifi' driver backends. 'wext' is referred, however 'madwifi' may work better in some circumstances."
<crimsun> (that's a typo for "preferred")
<LaserJock> crimsun: sorry, I'm an idiot, I accidently didn't do s/eth0/ath0/ in one spot in interfaces
<LaserJock> now ifdown ath0 and ifup ath0 work like magic
<crimsun> excellent.
<LaserJock> but I did have my wpa_supplicant and interfaces wrong
<LaserJock> so thanks
<crimsun> np
<LaserJock> now I can be N-M free
<LaserJoc1> phew, made it
<joejaxx> :)
<joejaxx> apt-get -o "Dir::State::Lists=$TARGET" -o "Dir::etc::sourcelist=$TARGET.list" -o "Dir::State::status=$TARGET.status" -o "Dir::Cache=cache" update
<joejaxx> does anyone see anything i am missing in that command? :P
<LaserJoc1> unfortunately, Feisty seems to not be going downhill for me in terms of hardware stuff
<joejaxx> LaserJoc1: that is good :)
<LaserJoc1> s/not//
<LaserJoc1> sorry
<joejaxx> oh
<joejaxx>  :\
<ivoks> LaserJoc1: what doesn't work?
<LaserJoc1> resume/suspend seem to have gone south
<LaserJoc1> and I just rebooted and it stalled on some hardware loading
<LaserJoc1> took at least twice as long to reboot
<ivoks> it stalled for me on setting up network
<LaserJoc1> at this point I think Edgy was better, hardware wise, for me
<poningru> packaging request: lives
<poningru> http://lives.sourceforge.net/index.php?do=downloads&PHPSESSID=03f197f4c756f4f9d819707da616dc2f
<poningru> err
<poningru> doh on the phpsession id
<poningru> whats the package request official method?
<StevenK> poningru: Later. Like, after we've released Feisty.
<poningru> buh?
<poningru> I thought here was a decision made re: packaging requests
<poningru> something along the lines of going through launchpad and tagging it as such
<Hobbsee> there are.  it's documented on the ubuntu-motu ML 
<poningru> pretty please link?
<Hobbsee> lists.ubuntu.com
* Hobbsee only has the email version, not the link to it
<Q-FUNK> What would be the best way to catch a command's stderr and stdout to ensure that if that comand alone fails, the whole preinst won't fail?
<poningru> ...
<poningru> Hobbsee: can you just tell me what the official method is?
* poningru thinks this should be made readily available to people who might want to request the packaging and not hte people who are doing the packaging
* Hobbsee wonders why the mailing list archvies are so impossible to find, but goes to look them up
<sacater> interesting statistic, but who has the most Karma in launchpad?
<Hobbsee> guess if you didnt knwo the month...
* Fujitsu doesn't. Does that help?
<Hobbsee> mmm okay.  *looks harder*
<Fujitsu> sacater: Probably popey, as he does the support requests.
<sacater> Fujitsu: ok, thank you :D
<Fujitsu> Sorry, they're "Answers" these days, and get incredibly high amounts of karma.
<sacater> im on 140 something
<sacater> oooh
<sacater> i need to do answers :D
<Hobbsee> poningru: argh.  i cant seem to find it.
<Hobbsee> (yet)
<poningru> Hobbsee: I've been searching too
<poningru> cant find it
* poningru thinks about downloading the whole thing and grepping
<poningru> its fracking 7MB
<poningru> :(
<sacater> Fujitsu: i cant find a popey launchpad page
<poningru> and its opening in firefox :(
* poningru is sure he is about to get pwnt
<Fujitsu> alanpope, sacater.
<Hobbsee> poningru: i wonder if it was in a meeting log instead
<Fujitsu> Be warned, he has 116k karma.
<poningru> :(
<sacater> Fujitsu: :D
* poningru <3 egrep
<poningru> Hobbsee: found it
<sacater> Fujitsu: ill see how he earned it
<poningru> Hobbsee: http://pastebin.mozilla.org/5990
<Hobbsee> poningru: ah, yep, that's it.
<Hobbsee> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-motu/2007-March/001480.html yep
<poningru> thanks I will be adding it to teh wiki's
* Hobbsee was looking for new, or packages
<sacater> Fujitsu: https://launchpad.net/~alanpope/+packages
<sacater> Fujitsu: not a single package :D
<Hobbsee> poningru: great :)
<Hobbsee> poningru: clean it all up while your'e at it :P
<poningru> :p
<Hobbsee> poningru: it's already there, but a couple of links down
<poningru> it is?
<poningru> which wiki page?
<poningru> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/New
<poningru> doh
<poningru> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/Candidates
<Hobbsee> yeah
<Hobbsee> it *all* needs a redo
* Hobbsee contemplates a few blog posts askign what people would like to see, etc, on the MOTU page, and doing a mockup, to work on in spain
<Burgundavia> Hobbsee: the UWN is also covering such things, so if want something in it, feel free to ping me
<Hobbsee> Burgundavia: good point
<superm1> every time that a package is updated, what is the order that its debian scripts get called?  say you have package A with both a postinst and a config script
<superm1> are they both called on the package update?
<crimsun> http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-maintainerscripts.html#s-mscriptsinstact
<sacater> is there anything i can do to increase boot speed?
<superm1> crimsun, thx
* Hobbsee looks for people.  perhaps someone like crimsun 
<Hobbsee> if i've got package a, and package b, which both have an identically named file, but are completely different, what should i do?
<Hobbsee> should i use a conflicts for that, or something else?
<geser> superm1: http://women.debian.org/wiki/English/MaintainerScripts shows the order of script execution as diagrams
<geser> Hobbsee: should both package be installable?
<geser> at the same time
<Hobbsee> geser: it's https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/basket/+bug/103476
<ubotu> Malone bug 103476 in basket "[can-not-install]  file overwrite error" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  
<Hobbsee> no reason why they shouldnt be
<geser> then one of the both packages need to install this file with an other name
* Hobbsee notes that one probably doesnt want to have 2 executable basket files anyway
<Hobbsee>         ( cd debian/gcpegg/usr/share/man/man1 ; \
<Hobbsee>                 ln gcpegg.1.gz basket.1.gz ;\
<Hobbsee>                 ln gcpegg.1.gz eggsh.1.gz ;\
<Hobbsee>                 ln gcpegg.1.gz regtest.1.gz )
* Hobbsee wonders what would happen if she changed that to basket.2.gz
<geser> please don't do it
<Hobbsee> what happens?
* Hobbsee hasnt tried it
<geser> section 2 is for "System calls (functions provided by the kernel)" (see man man for the other sections)
* Hobbsee wonders why she didnt realise that there'd be a man page for mans....
* Hobbsee wonders why not...
<Hobbsee> interesting
* Fujitsu hopes merges.ubuntu.com will be back up soon... The downtime is flooding my INBOX.
<Hobbsee> oh?
* Hobbsee didnt think any merging was beign done nwo anyway
<sacater> Ive been told how to make boot time, and many other things extreamly fast, gentoo's done it
<Fujitsu> My MDT cron jobs look there.
<sacater> We need to change all bash to C/C++
* geser merged wordpress yesterday
<sacater> faster than bash by far
<Fujitsu> sacater: We don't use bash during bootup.
<sacater> okl
<sacater> let me relay that to my mate
<sacater> actually hang on
<welp> hmm?
<sacater> welp
<sacater> explain the bash thing
<geser> Hobbsee: so rename basket.1.gz to something like gcpegg-basket.1.gz and make basket conflict gcpegg < fixed_version
<welp> bash is slower than C
<welp> generally RC is coded in bash, therefore init is relatively slow
<sacater> welp: but Fujitsu says we dont use bash at bootup
<sacater> @|
<sacater> :|
<welp> sacater: "generally"
<welp> not always...
<Fujitsu> We use dash.
<welp> Fujitsu: what does ubuntu use for RC
<Fujitsu> Which is substantially faster.
<welp> dash? what's that?
<geser> sacater: /bin/sh -> dash
<sacater> oooh
<welp> i've never heard of dash...
<sacater> welp: C faster than sh
<sacater> ?
<welp> yes
<sacater> ok
<sacater> anybody got any idea how long it would take to replace all sh and bash with C
<sacater> :P
<Hobbsee> geser: right.  do i need to change anything else than the name of the manpage for gcpegg-basket.1.gz?
<sacater> welp: thanks, 
<Fujitsu> sacater: A few eternities.
<welp> i can get through init (ie after kernel load -> login) in 2 seconds with a "warm boot"
<sacater> Fujitsu: what welp said
<sacater> ive seen his laptop
<sacater> zzzzzooooooooooooommmmmmm
<sacater> and its an old laptop too :
<sacater> :D
<welp> and that's my laptop... 700mhz, 386mb ram
<sacater> Fujitsu: is it possible to do it bit by bit, and maintain a working system, eg. remove a piece of bash and replace with C, but remain working
<geser> Hobbsee: what about the bin name? /usr/sbin/basket and /usr/bin/basket don't strictly conflict but having two executable with the same name but in different dirs doesn't sound good
<sacater> gnomefreak: can you please tell welp the name of the guy who gave me +u
<sacater> :D
<Hobbsee> geser: exactly
<sacater> welp: Fujitsu says eternity, is that true, if it is true how did gentoo manage it?
<sacater> eser: exactly
<welp> the guy who did it has "Uber" in his nick... really, he does
<welp> :P
<sacater> welp: oh him :D
<sacater> welp: what one person did it...
<welp> sacater: nod, one person.
<welp> he also wrote the latest version of dhcpcd
<sacater> wow...
<sacater> uber he is..
<sacater> Fujitsu: after hearing that are you sure it would take an eternity, fast boot would look great for ubuntu :D
<sacater> and BE great
<welp> but you don't want ubuntuians to have a ricer image, like us gentooians :P
<crimsun> boot loader -> tty in 2 seconds can be done, but that's not our approach. boot loader -> gdm is.
<sacater> hmm
<crimsun> note that's significantly more complex.
<sacater> i still think its a great idea
<welp> crimsun: you can get the kernel loaded in <2 seconds?
<crimsun> welp: I'm using your example.
<sacater> welp: i keep telling people, neither is better, they are just different, gentoo is more difficult, and some people go for that, whilst other like user friendly
<crimsun> anyhow, we're straying off-topic.
<sacater> crf
<sacater> crimsun: no way hose'
* welp checks the topic
<sacater> we are right on topic :D
<sacater> oh
<sacater> actually
<sacater> maybe not :(
<welp> hugday?
<sacater> welp: dont laugh...
<sacater> shall we continue this on another channel
<sacater> ?
<welp> that's the ubuntu equivilant to gentoo's bugdays, isn't it?
<welp> (i'm talking about hugday atm(
<welp> s/(/)
<sacater> welp: no, its just a laugh really 'hug for a bud day
<sacater> bug*
<welp> so it's like gentoo's bugday.
<sacater> we still love it :D
<sacater> welp: yes, but they are more often than gentoo
<sacater> about once every 2 weeks at least
<welp> every fortnight
<sacater> yes
<sacater> i think we have an 'official' bugday in the year, but its mainly hug days
<sacater> i havnt been doing linux that long though :(*
<sacater> pochu!
* sacater waves at pochu
<pochu> hey sacater
* welp waves in pochu's general direction
<welp> ever manage to get that laptop sold?
<pochu> welp: not yet :(
<sacater> welp: i still need 180
<sacater> erm
<welp> i'm still broke. :(
<sacater> okay,...... pound sign makes a ?
<sacater> 30
<sacater> welp: what did you do to my xserver yesterday
<sacater> ?
<sacater> the other keys work
<welp> sacater: i probably haven't got UTF-8 sorted on descartes
<sacater> ah
<sacater> thats it
<sacater> yeh
<sacater> works fine locally
<welp> yeah
<welp> Terminal on gentoo/freebsd hates utf-8 for some mucked up reason :(
<sacater> meh, porting like that, theres bound to be a few conflicts :D
<sacater> welp: how much ram does descartes have again?
<welp> 2G
<sacater> welp: hmm, well i know little C++ and smaller Bash, 
<sacater> i wonder if i could get someone else to look into it
<sacater> youre jabber is on the fritz again too
<welp> i know
<welp> not it's not
<welp> *no it's not
<mneptok> danger will robinson!
* mneptok waves his claws
* Hobbsee throws mneptok into a pool of hot lava.  yes, danger!
<sacater> is there a way to clear out or 'flush' the ram cache
<mneptok> gtk-gnutella she eez broken
* mneptok will do an LP bughunt in a bit
<sacater> mneptok: espanol?
<zorglu_> sacater: "sync" will do, if what you want is to be sure the ram cache is written on disk
<sacater> zorglu_: thanks
<sacater> works :D
<zorglu_> :)
<BugMaN> hi
* Hobbsee plays with what should be on the MOTU page...
<danohuiginn> Question: is xxx@ubuntustudio.com acceptable for a maintainer field in control?
<danohuiginn> (debuild doesn't like it, but it seems reasonable to me)
<azeem> what's the error message?
<Hobbsee> danohuiginn: doubt it.
<Hobbsee> needs to be a @ubuntu.com email address
<geser> doesn't it only check for ubuntu in it? so it should be happy with @ubuntustudio.com
<Fujitsu> That's acceptable, but the implementation of the policy is bad.
<danohuiginn> azeem: actually now I look again, the only warning I get is about not having an original-maintainer field (dpkg-source: warning: Version number suggests Ubuntu changes, but there is no XSBC-Original-Maintainer field)
<pochu> danohuiginn: create it with the Debian Maitainer
<danohuiginn> pochu: yep, that makes sense. thanks
<geser> danohuiginn: only it it has a Debian maintainer
<geser> if it's a new package you're packaging for UbuntuStudio I'd ignore the warning
<danohuiginn> nah, it's been in debian in the past. I'll add in the field
* Hobbsee wonders why people are working on new packages at the moment
<StevenK> That's a good question.
<StevenK> Hobbsee: You whip them, I'll wave the grindstone
<Hobbsee> StevenK: heh
* Hobbsee doesnt think most of them would *like* to be whipped...
<danohuiginn> not a new package, Hobbsee, put away the whip ;)
<Hobbsee> danohuiginn: even an update.
<danohuiginn> Hobbsee: bug 103507
<ubotu> Malone bug 103507 in om "Script 'launchomsynth' brings up two instances of om_gtk" [Undecided,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/103507
<Hobbsee> ahhh
<enyc> Bah! feisty universe "qemu" 0.8.2+dfsg-0ubuntu1 does not work with the feisty "kqemu-source" built on 2.6.20-14-generic on i386 .. ;-( -- "Version mismatch between kqemu module and qemu (00010300 00010200) - disabling kqemu use"
<enyc> The odd thing is -- kqemu is now GPLv2 license... but the kqemu-source package is in "multiverse" rather than "universe"
<enyc> I'm confused
<Fujitsu> enyc: Is this the new kqemu from about 24 hours ago?
<\sh> moins
<Fujitsu> Hi \sh.
<enyc> Fujitsu: not sure...
<enyc> Fujitsu: its 1.3.0-pre11
<enyc> Note that debian "kqemu-source" is no longer "non-free" in 1.3.0-pre11  but ubuntu's "kqemu-source" is still in multiverse
<Fujitsu> enyc: That's the new one, and it should be moved to universe when pitti gets around to it.
<Fujitsu> (I filed the bug, he was just waiting on it to build and stuff)
<enyc> Fujitsu: okay... excellent ;-)
<enyc> Fujitsu: bug # ?
<zorglu_> enyc: how come ? kqemu has changed its license ?
<enyc> zorglu_: it has...
<enyc> zorglu_: author has... not sure why
<Fujitsu> zorglu_: Yep, GPL now.
<enyc> zorglu_: gone to GPLv2
<enyc> zorglu_: http://fabrice.bellard.free.fr/qemu/kqemu-changelog.html
<zorglu_> cool :)
<enyc> however... there is a realy usability problem in feisty given that  feisty qemu and feisty kqemu-source  do not appear to work together
<zorglu_> my guess is "all the new virutalization stuff made him do the work needed to pass it gpl" :) he talked several time about this
<zorglu_> in anycase this is cool :)
<\sh> moins Fujitsu
<\sh> oh a new experience...umts while travelling in a car
<Fujitsu> enyc: Bug 83539 and bug 102244.
<ubotu> Malone bug 83539 in kqemu "Update to GPL'ed version 1.3.0pre11" [Wishlist,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/83539
<enyc> ?umts??
<ubotu> Malone bug 102244 in kqemu "Please sync kqemu (multiverse) 1.3.0~pre11-4 from Debian Sid (main), and promote it to universe" [Low,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/102244
<\sh> enyc: mobile internet connection up to 2mbit (not wlan)
<StevenK> Oh yes, UMTS is GPRS on steriods.
<\sh> right ;)
<geser> enyc: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Umts
<enyc> bah! I was doing someting silly... I had an older /usr/local/bin/qemu I had compiled in the past!!!
<enyc> error in enyc!
<enyc> qemu-0.9.0-1 from debian experimental works fine...
<enyc> must test fiesty 0.8.2-whatnot
<StevenK> Heh
<enyc> This is my 'testing' machine so I don't mind breaking it... I have done something potentially dangerous... made /dev/sda accessible to my qemu... and booted qemu in 'snapshot mode' off the running hard disk.. I recognize the virtualized machine may not acutally write to the real hdd.. and it may easily crash when accessing the same mounted filesystems due to real-changes in the host machine ;-)
<enyc> but it is, actally, working ;-)
<jdong> mounting a live filesystem again actually does work
<jdong> but either (1) it'll kernel-panic from unexpected changes, once in a while
<jdong> or (2) The next mount, or next time you run fsck, you won't be happy.
<enyc> heh
<enyc> note that this is running a vm in snapshot modes... i.e. it keeps changes to itself... not affecting the real FS
<jdong> enyc: how can you be so sure it's not writing to a filesystem?
<enyc> but it will still get confused due to 'upstream' changes ;-)
<jdong> You know, ext3 replays journals even on read-only mount....
<enyc> jdong: well nothign is for certain... using qemu -snapshot mode
<enyc> jdong: i.e. qemu is keeping changes in ram/tempfile of  block data changes.. not changing real device
<jdong> lol I'm glad it works for you, but it's definitely not something that I would say will work _reliably_ :)
<enyc> ;-)
<enyc> jdong: thats interesting.... given that i now have /dev/sda  mode '664' (readonly blockdevice to my user running qemu)... I can boot DOS from the running hdd ... and it 'ignores' writes to the disk.. you can DEL a file.. and its still there.. qemu must not be passing up the errors at INT 13 level....
<enyc> whereas if I boot in -snapshot mode, it does indeed show the files deleted correctly... as qemu is caching changes inside that running qemu session... restart and  back to square-1 etc.
<jdong> enyc: ha, that's interesting. Now, after witnessing that behavior, think it's time to stop trying that reckless approach? :D
<enyc> jdong: dont quire understand what you trying to say?
<jdong> enyc: it's probably not a great idea (ok, fine, it's reckless) to use a block device twice like this
<jdong> enyc: find a safer way :)
<enyc> jdong: i do understand this..
<enyc> jdong: i do appreciate that 'normal' filesystems are not designed for simultaneous mounts where any "r/w" mounts exist....
<jdong> right.
<jdong> but I'm not gonna stop you from having fun :D
<enyc> jdong: i.e. many R/O are okay... but r/w+r/o or multiple-r/w  is bad
<jdong> I've done really reckless things like this in the past before.... but anyway, it's fun and you should try it :)
<enyc> there are fileystems designed for such thigns however but that gets more complex ;-)
<jdong> just be sure you're not putting any valuable data at stake
* enyc boots 3vil win32 and sees if it crashes ;-)
<enyc> hrrm.. KMODE_EXCEPTION_NOT_HANDLED
* enyc deletes everything inside the snapshot!
<enyc> oops.. NTLDR is missint ;-)
<enyc> no matter ;-)
<enyc> all sorted now ;-) (closes qemu)
<sacater> guys, as some of you know, i compiled xfce onto ubuntu, but im getting updates for it :| whats going on, can it handle source now?
<Hobbsee> uh, what?
<pochu> hey motus! I have a little problem while packaging a new version of listen. When I do "dpkg-buildpackage -us -uc -rfakeroot", it fails with "/usr/bin/fakeroot: 152: debian/rules: Permission denied". Any idea? :)
<Hobbsee> pochu: yep.  chmod +x debian/rules
<StevenK> pochu: debian/rules needs to be executable
* StevenK glares at Hobbsee
* Hobbsee can type quicker :P
<pochu> oh, cool :)
<pochu> thanks Hobbsee and StevenK :)
<Hobbsee> :)
<Hobbsee> sacater: likely someone in ubuntu uploaded later versions of xfce than the ones you compiled.
<sacater> Hobbsee: weird i know, i just checked with synaptic, and while xfce4 isnt ticked, some of the librays are
<sacater> Hobbsee: nope, im using xfce4.4
<Hobbsee> not a new upstream version - a new ubuntu revision
<sacater> hmm
<sacater> but if i compiled from source, how come synaptic dedtects it
<Hobbsee> depends which source you compiled it from / how you compiled it
<StevenK> If you bumped the version when you did so.
<sacater> Hobbsee: i compiled the source packages i obtained from xfce.org
<sacater> pretty official
<sacater> :D
<DarkSun88> Hi all
<jekil> hello
<pochu> hi jekil
<sacater> guys
<sacater> ive been helping a newbie
<sacater> but there may be a glitch in the ahavi/2
<sacater> whoops
<sacater> sorry
<sacater> avahi-daemon
<sacater> his wireless refuses to work
<sacater> the output of 2 commands i gave him are here http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/14190/
<geser> which interface are there?
<geser> which interfaces are configure in /etc/network/interfaces?
<joejaxx> Good Morning MOTU :)
<pochu> hey joejaxx :)
<joejaxx> :)
<joejaxx> pochu: wmfishtime and bubblefishymon are some funny dock apps
<sacater> geser: the guy cant get his wifi0 to work, the errors are conclusive, look http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/14190/
<geser> sacater: I see there 4 interfaces mentioned: eth1, eth2, wlan0 and wifi0
<geser> which one is the real one?
<lupine_85> wlan0
<sacater> ERM
<sacater> hold on..
<lupine_85> wifi0 would be the control interface (that you feed to wlandev)
<lupine_85> I think :)
<sacater> this is his full ifconfig http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/14193/
<sacater> hes coming anywa
<lupine_85> eh, ath0 then
<rouzic_> Hi everybody
<sacater> lupine_85: talk to rouzic_ 
<sacater> hes the one with dodgy wifi
<rouzic_> Hi lupine_85
<lupine_85> ath0 is the device that needs configuring :)
<lupine_85> ath0:avah is.. umm. No idea, but the IP address it's got suggests zeroconf or something (so it can be ignored)
<geser> I'd guess it got truncated as should be ath0:ahavi
<rouzic_> This problem I have it since I updated avahi-daemon
<sacater> lupine_85: did you see the output of my getting him to restart his networking in init.d
<sacater> this is the bug in question https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/103440
<ubotu> Malone bug 103440 in Ubuntu "[feisty beta]  boot takes much too long" [Undecided,Confirmed]  
<lupine_85> I did now
<lupine_85> wifi0 is not the device to be playing with :)
<sacater> ath0?
<rouzic_> sacater: wifi :)
<rouzic_> atheros
<sacater> ath0 then.....
<sacater> lupine_85: do you know the command that will kill of ath0, at least until its wanted again
<sacater> ifconfig ath0 down?
<sacater> but it needs to be turned off permenantly
<lupine_85> unload the module
<sacater> lupine_85: erm, ok, any idea what the module name is?
<lupine_85> no, sorry. just lsmod and see which modules are using the 80211 module; though it should be pretty obvious from teh name anyway
<lupine_85> you'll need to ifconfig ath0 down before you can unload the module, of cours
<sacater> lupine_85: can i unload him onto you :P, this is where my knowledge gets limited
<lupine_85> eh, if somweone pastebins the output of lsmod, I might be able to point it out
<lupine_85> but I've never actually used an atheros card under ubuntu ;)
<sacater> rouzic_: please paste the output of 'lsmod'
<rouzic_> sacater: oks, wait a moment
<sacater> talk to lupine_85 a bit more now, because he knows more,
<rouzic_> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/14198/
<DarkSun88> Hi.
<sacater> DarkSun88: ello!
<StevenK> ath_pci
<lupine_85> curses, beat me to it :p
<lupine_85> yeah, ath_pci is the one
* StevenK smirks
* lupine_85 plots world destruction
<sacater> lupine_85: care to join me :D
* Hobbsee notes that this will conflict with her plans of world domination.
<lupine_85> Hobbsee: you can dominate whatever's left :)
<jussi01> hello Hobbsee 
<StevenK> Which isn't the world.
<lupine_85> I'm no very good at destruction, so it probably will be
<lupine_85> not*
<sacater> Hobbsee: you will domintae with THE STICK!
<StevenK> It seems the point fell off.
* Hobbsee will dominate WITH EVERYTHING!
* Hobbsee pokes StevenK with the very Long and Very Pointy Stick of DOOM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 
* StevenK is poked
<sacater> hee
<sacater> tm
<jussi01> lol
* sacater snatchs the point stick of doom from Hobbsee, sacater administers pokings to jussi01 and pochu :D
<sacater> rouzic_: how is it going
<Hobbsee> heh.  you cant.
<Hobbsee> it's my stick.
<sacater> er hem
<rouzic_> sacater: erh?
<jussi01> ouch sacater why?
* sacater snatchs
<sacater> :P
<sacater> rouzic_: did lupine_85 not help?
<rouzic_> sacater: yes
* sacater yells!!! LUPINE!! git ur a** bak ere!
<lupine_85> don't negative me
<lupine_85> :p
<rouzic_> But the problem of the take-off has not been solved
<jussi01> lol
<lupine_85> I answered all the questions asked
<sacater> help the padawan!
<lupine_85> 1. make sure ath0 is all set up with iwconfig 
<lupine_85> 2. sudo dhclient ath0
<lupine_85> 3. ???
<lupine_85> 4. PROFIT :D
<rouzic_> Internet Systems Consortium DHCP Client V3.0.4
<rouzic_> Copyright 2004-2006 Internet Systems Consortium.
<rouzic_> All rights reserved.
<rouzic_> For info, please visit http://www.isc.org/sw/dhcp/
<rouzic_> wifi0: unknown hardware address type 801
<lupine_85> !pastebin
<ubotu> pastebin is a service to post large texts so you don't flood the channel. The Ubuntu pastebin is at http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org (make sure you give us the URL for your paste - see also the #ubuntu channel topic)
<rouzic_> wifi0: unknown hardware address type 801
<rouzic_> Listening on LPF/ath0/00:16:cb:bd:34:3e
<rouzic_> Sending on   LPF/ath0/00:16:cb:bd:34:3e
<rouzic_> Sending on   Socket/fallback
<rouzic_> DHCPDISCOVER on ath0 to 255.255.255.255 port 67 interval 7
<rouzic_> DHCPDISCOVER on ath0 to 255.255.255.255 port 67 interval 13
<rouzic_> ups, sorry :s
<lupine_85> but step 1 needs completing first
<lupine_85> (which is mostly to do with associating to the AP)
<rouzic_> sorry lupine_85
<rouzic_> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/14203/
<lupine_85> yep, no dhcp offers because the DHCP server isn't reachable (because you're not associated to the AP)
<lupine_85> Umm. isn't networkmanager meant to do all the grunt work these days?
<sacater> rouzic_: im gonna leave you in the 'capable' hands of lupine :P
<sacater> rouzic_: byeee
<rmjb> hey guys
<rouzic_> bye sacater
<rmjb_> hi guys, i want to fix a bug in dmraid before feisty, bug #102973
<ubotu> Malone bug 102973 in dmraid "dmraid looking for raid45 when kernel uses raid456" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/102973
<rmjb_> I can just patch the source where it asks for kernel module raid45 and change it to raid456 and everything will be peachy?
<sacater> rmjb_: no more bug fixes are being accepted for fesity , unless they are crucial
<rmjb_> this one is, people updating from edgy, using raid5 on their onboard raid will not be able to access their disk
<sacater> youll need to fix it for the next edition, but i dont know what its gonig to be called
<geser> sacater: that's main
<sacater> oooh
* sacater hushes
<geser> universe is still open till April 12th
<jekil> slomo: hello
<jekil> slomo: i am searching a mentor, are you available?
<rmjb> in the changelog, urgency is usually set to low, what happens if I set one to high?
<geser> afaik it's ignored in Ubuntu
<rmjb> oh... was hoping it would help get my update in sooner
<rmjb> ... because it's an important update
<ScottK> rmjb: Make a debdiff for the version with the fix and attach that as a patch to the bug.  Then subscribe Ubuntu-Unverse-Sponsors to the bug.  If you are in a big hurry, come here and ask someone in UUS to look at it.  That's how you get it done quickly.
<rouzic_> lupine_85:
<rouzic_> Already there is solution to the bug?
<rmjb> ScottK: thanks, I want the bug reporter to test the package first though... I just hope they respond quickly
<ScottK> Sure.  Makes sense.  Just wanted to make sure you knew the "quick" process.  Urgency has nothing to do with it.
<gnomefreak> sacater: hint if vlc needs framebuffer than it will use your xorg.conf
<sacater> gnomefreak: but thats one problem, another is that i cant launch gui apps within a root terminal
<sacater> what is going on
<gnomefreak> sacater: gui apps will use your xorg.conf no matter how you launch them
<sacater> i upgraded to feisty and now its baaaad
<gnomefreak> sacater: not all drivers need fb.
<gnomefreak> sacater: geforce4 card?
<sacater> gnomefreak: let me check
<sacater> gnomefreak: shall i paste my xorg.conf to you?
<sacater> or ubuntu paste
<gnomefreak> sacater: no just need to know what geforce version your card is. is it nvidia?
<sacater> http://rafb.net/p/KWj6v357.html] 
<gnomefreak> lspci -v will give you the output you need just look at it tell me what it says geforce *
<sacater> gnomefreak yes
<gnomefreak> sacater: use the nvidia-glx-legacy drivers
<sacater> 01:00.0 VGA compatible controller: nVidia Corporation NV44A [GeForce 6200]  (rev a1) (prog-if 00 [VGA] )
<gnomefreak> and i dont think fb will work with the legacy drivers
<gnomefreak> no
<sacater> gnomefreak: i tried legacy, and my screen went dark
<gnomefreak> thats not a geforce4 card and that is one of the problem cards iirc
<sacater> what can i do...
<gnomefreak> sacater: you need the nvidia-glx package but the 6xxx and 7xxx cards seem to be a pain to set up
<gnomefreak> sacater: that i dont know, ask in #ubuntu+1 maybe someone else knows
<sacater> gnomefreak: hmm, that is a right PITA
<micahcowan> nrg88: Most debian packages have a "debian/patches" directory, does kubuntu-default-settings?
<nrg88> it has a debian directory inside alright
<nrg88> but no patches there
<micahcowan> Oh, wait: that probably doesn't apply to kubuntu-default-settings... I'ma download it so I can check it out
<micahcowan> Debian packages that /do/ have a patches directory, generally want you to make your changes in there: the idea is to leave the unpacked tarball totally pristine, except for debian/, isolating all changes into there.
<micahcowan> Usually, this means using dpatch-edit-patch, but there are various different methods for using patches :/
<micahcowan> Obviously, in cases that are Debian/Ubuntu-specific, this does not apply (no true original tarball)
<micahcowan> That would probably apply to this package.
<micahcowan> Once you've made the changes you desire, you need to first be sure to update debian/changelog. You can do this using a special tool, whose name has just escaped me (and I actually need to use it myself, right now, as I too am preparing a debdiff).
<nrg88> i'll be right back... 10-15 minutes i guess
<nrg88> sorry to leave you here, but my mother needs some help :|
<micahcowan> :)
<rouzic> GoodBye!!! :)
<show_now_on> i get a message like this  [W: Failed to fetch http://us.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/universe/d/drivel_2.0.2-Subuntu1_i386.deb]  when i tried to fetch this package
<micahcowan> What's the name of the tool to add an entry to the debian/changelogs?
<jekil> dch
<micahcowan> jekil, thanks very much
<show_now_on> if anyone can help...i would be greatly appreaciative
<jekil> show_now_on: simple.. you cant get the package
<show_now_on> yes...can't get this package or any other that i've tried
<jabra> can someone sync a package from debian unstable 
<jabra> I updated the debian package and I want to make sure the updates gets into feisty
<nrg88> micahcowan: back :)
<nrg88> what tools do i need to install?
<nrg88> dch and debdiff?
<micahcowan> nrg88, yup
<geser> jabra: which package?
<nrg88> nrg88@nrg88-desktop:~$ sudo apt-get install dch debdiff
<nrg88> Password:
<nrg88> Reading package lists... Done
<nrg88> Building dependency tree
<nrg88> Reading state information... Done
<nrg88> E: Couldn't find package dch
<nrg88> oops
<nrg88> sorry
<geser> nrg88: sudo apt-get install devscripts
<jabra> geser: pbnj
<micahcowan> Peanut Butter N' Jelly? :)
<nrg88> got it, thanks geser
<nrg88> next?
<nrg88> :)
<nrg88> (excuse me for asking so many question, i want to learn to make patch-es and deb files)
<micahcowan> nrg88, since you've already made your changes, invoke dch -i, which will help you add a new entry in debian/changelog (thanks jekil for reminding me of the name)
<nrg88> i change the path to kubuntu-default-settings-7.04 first?
<micahcowan> nrg, yes
<micahcowan> Make sure to correct your name, email address, since you probably don't have the config/env vars set up to fill those automatically.
<micahcowan> nrg88, btw, you may find https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/School/PackagingBasics quite helpful to go over.
<micahcowan> It walks through the creation of a debdiff.
<geser> jabra: found your bug and ACKed the sync request
<jabra> awesome
<nrg88> nice, thanks :)
<jabra> geser++
<geser> jabra: the next time subscribe ubuntu-universe-sponsors to the bug and someone from the team will ACK it
<jabra> ok
<geser> additionally you can ask here for an ACK to speed up things (and mention the bug number)
<jabra> oops forgot to send you the bug number
<jabra> ment to do that
<jabra> figured you would ask
<jabra> cool thanks
<show_now_on> Hi...now trying in terminal to connect to the archive....and still not connecting to [us.archive.ubuntu.com (91.189.89.8)]  
<gnomefreak> show_now_on: remove the country code
<show_now_on> oh...
<gnomefreak> jjust use archive.ubuntu.com
<show_now_on> k
<gnomefreak> us mirrors have been known to have issues
<show_now_on> ok
<micahcowan> In the patch I'm preparing, dpatch apply-all is failing on my patch; however, it appears to have made the actual changes successfully...
<micahcowan> I notice the other patches in the directory have some shell-script stuff at the top checking for -patch|-unpatch as arguments, whereas mine lacks that. Did I do something wrong in how I used dpatch?
<theCore> micahcowan: how did you create the patch?
<theCore> micahcowan: diff?
<micahcowan> via dpatch-edit-patch (and then appending the name to 00list)
<theCore> micahcowan: ah, good
<theCore> I wonder why it's failing, then
<micahcowan> Ah, one hunk failed (finally found -v in the manpage: should've just tried it out anyway).
<micahcowan> Yay! That gawk segfault bug is finally squashed. :)
<show_now_on> help...[E: Type 'archive.ubuntu.com' is not known on line 44 in source list /etc/apt/sources.list] ...now...update doesn't even load
<show_now_on> i can't save to /etc/apt...what can i do
<LaserJock> why can't you save to /etc/apt/ ? no permissions?
<show_now_on> uhmmm
<show_now_on> i mean....that i can't just pull up the doc...correct and save to replace in /etc/apt
<LaserJock> well, /etc/apt/sources.list has got a problem
<LaserJock> so if you can't change it you'll need to get somebody who can
<show_now_on> ahha...figured that much....corrupt mirror @ us.archive
<show_now_on> how can i pull it up to change..through terminal
<LaserJock> sudo nano /etc/apt/sources.list
<show_now_on> ahha...thanx a bunch
<jdong> LaserJock: there's a typo in your command... I think that's supposed to say "vi"
* jdong ducks
<LaserJock> jdong: umm, sure, that would be the "easy" way to do ;-)
<nrg88> micahcowan: now i'm really confused :D
<nrg88> i was trying to make the diff file with kompare (a kde tool)
<nrg88> if i have 2 directories with files
<nrg88> how do i make a diff file?
<nrg88> (so it only contains the modifications)
<micahcowan> nrg88, you're talking about the debdiff?
<nrg88> i used a tool: kompare
<nrg88> now that used diff
<micahcowan> You actually just build a source package from the changes you made, and then use debdiff between the original and your new one.
<nrg88> i need a diff for the sources
<nrg88> oh
<micahcowan> I don't know anything about kompare; but I suspect it just does normal diffs.
<LaserJock> I think so
<micahcowan> Ope, got to go.
<nrg88> so first i need to make the deb packages? :?
<LaserJock> nrg88: once you have the new package just run debdiff <old package>.dsc <new package>.dsc to get the debdiff
<LaserJock> just a new source package
<LaserJock> you don't *have* to build the .debs to get a debdiff
<nrg88> i just tar.gz it?
<LaserJock> hmm, no
<LaserJock> have you built an Ubuntu/Debian source package before?
<nrg88> i've used the file kubuntu-default-settings_7.04-38.tar.gz
<nrg88> no
<LaserJock> are you making a lot of changes?
<nrg88> no, i did modifications in two files and the changelog file
<LaserJock> ok, well, lets go through how to make a new source package out of it
<nrg88> ok
<LaserJock> did you get a .dsc file when you got the .tar.gz ?
<nrg88> yes i did
<nrg88> kubuntu-default-settings_7.04-38.dsc
<LaserJock> ok, those 2 files together are the source package
<LaserJock> so you unpacked the .tar.gz and made you changes
<nrg88> yes
<LaserJock> then you added a changelog entry
<nrg88> that's right
<LaserJock> ok, what's the version in your changelog entry?
<nrg88> kubuntu-default-settings (1:7.04-39) feisty; urgency=low
<nrg88> so it's 7:04-39
<LaserJock> ok, excellent
<LaserJock> nrg88: try running debuild -S in the source directory
<nrg88> it failed
<nrg88> but do you know any other service like pastebin?
<nrg88> pastebin doesn't work right now
<nrg88> strange...
<LaserJock> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/
<nrg88> LaserJock: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/14271/
<jussi01> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/14270/
<jussi01> oops
<LaserJock> nrg88: do you happen to have a gpg key?
<nrg88> no, i don't
<nrg88> is it necessary?
<LaserJock> no
<LaserJock> it's helpful if you want to do more contributions in the future, like package a new app
<LaserJock> for now just run debuild -S -us -uc
<LaserJock> that tells it to not sign anything
<nrg88> Finished running lintian.
<nrg88> great :)
<LaserJock> nrg88: ok so if you cd .. you'll see a new tar.gz and .dsc there
<LaserJock> with the -39 version
<nrg88> yes, i see it
<LaserJock> congrats, you made your fist source package :-)
<nrg88> :D
<nrg88> cool
<LaserJock> now you need to make the debdiff
<nrg88> now i do the debdiff stuff?
<nrg88> ok
<LaserJock> as uploading the whole thing is a bit overkill
<LaserJock> we just want a patch that  will turn the current version into your version
<sacater> LaserJock: would you be my MOTU mentor?
<nrg88> LaserJock: where does it dump the diff file? :?
<nrg88> simply on the screen?
<LaserJock> nrg88: yes
<LaserJock> just add a > tmp_diff to send it to a file
<nrg88> LaserJock: is this what i'm supposed to get: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/14274/ and i just attach it to the bug report in lauchpad as a "patch" ?
<micahcowan> nrg88, did you get what you needed?
<nrg88> hi micahcowan, yes i got the diff file :)
<nrg88> it looks like this: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/14274/
<micahcowan> Coolness. I got mine, too. :) https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gawk/+bug/58256
<ubotu> Malone bug 58256 in gawk "length() memory error " [Undecided,In progress]  
<nrg88> now i just attach the diff file as a "patch"?
<LaserJock> nrg88: beautiful, yes
<LaserJock> nrg88: just a sec though
* ScottK quits typing since LaserJock was quicker.
<LaserJock> this fixes a bug on Launchpad, right?
<nrg88> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/kubuntu-default-settings/+bug/57102
<nrg88> this one :)
<ubotu> Malone bug 57102 in kubuntu-default-settings "Kubuntu Package Manager problem: package doesn't get installed when it is in a directory with spaces on its name" [Undecided,Confirmed]  
<nrg88> this one is present in both edgy and feisty too
<LaserJock> nrg88: generally you want to mention the bug # that's getting fixed in the changelog
<LaserJock> nrg88: add something like (LP: #57102)
<nrg88> ok
<nrg88> all done :)
<sacater> laserjock, will you?
<nrg88> LaserJock: now i can attach the diff file to the bugreport?
<LaserJock> nrg88: just upload it as a patch
<LaserJock> sacater: well, I think the MOTU might want to set up a mentoring mailing list
<LaserJock> nrg88: excellent
<nrg88> thank you LaserJock, and now we wait for the package maintainer to check it out?
<micahcowan> LaserJock, what a terrific idea!
<LaserJock> nrg88: well, you'll probably want to ping somebody in #kubuntu-devel
<ScottK> nrg88: You might want to check in #kubuntu-devel and see if anyone there is interested in uploading the patch.
<LaserJock> heh
<micahcowan> I still love the MOTUSchool.
<LaserJock> yes, we need to get that going again
<LaserJock> probably try to tie them all together
<micahcowan> Looks like I missed a few good ones, like those "maintaining an Ubuntu package" ones ;-) ...I kinda dropped activity the last 6 mos
<LaserJock> it's just hard to take time to prepare a lesson
<LaserJock> and work on documentation, etc.
<sacater> LaserJock: hmm, is that a yes or no :P
<LaserJock> sacater: it's a sorta ;-)
<LaserJock> sacater: you can always ask here. If you aren't sure or don't want to ask here, email me.
* ScottK wonders when someone will fix Bug #56125?
<ubotu> Malone bug 56125 in apt "doesnt look like a cow" [Wishlist,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/56125
<LaserJock> I kinda like the idea of setting up a ubuntu-motu-mentors list
<LaserJock> so people can get info from more than one person
<ScottK> LaserJock: I'd sign up for it.  IRC here works well when people are around the same time I am, but that's sometimes hit or miss.
<micahcowan> Me too.
<nrg88> that would be a great idea
<LaserJock> yeah, for me I think we'd bee doing really well with a combination of several things:
<LaserJock> 1) -mentors mailing list
<LaserJock> 2) MOTU School
<LaserJock> 3) Ubuntu Packaging Guide
<LaserJock> 4) MOTU wiki documentation
<LaserJock> that way we have IRC, ML, guide docs, and easy to change docs :-)
<nrg88> do you guys know this tool: http://www.kde-apps.org/content/show.php/Debian+Package+Tools+FE?content=49723 ?
<nrg88> it seems like an easy alternative to packaging
<LaserJock> I've seen a few tools like that
<LaserJock> personally I don't know that they're much help
<LaserJock> there is way too much "art" to packaging
<LaserJock> so far we have items 1-4
<LaserJock> we just need to make them better
<LaserJock> and get them fired up
<micahcowan> Item 1 exists?
<micahcowan> I find 3 (plus Debian's own dev docs) to have been very helpful.
<micahcowan> and 4
<superm1> is there any way for a package to be aware of other packages being installed at the same time?  say if package_a is being installed right now too, lets run this script.  if package_b is being installed right now, run that script?
<LaserJock> superm1: not currently no
<superm1> k thx LaserJock 
<superm1> what is the best way to handle something like that then?
<LaserJock> superm1: perhaps a predepends
<superm1> can you do a predepends with an or?
<LaserJock> which means that the other package has to be installed *before*
<superm1> like a PreDepends: Package A || Package B
<superm1> sort of thing?
<superm1> and if you did the or on the predepends, it wouldn't necessarily install both right?
<ajmitch> morning
<LaserJock> superm1: I really don't know. Predepends don't seem to be very smilied upon
<sacater> hmm, feisty and the devs have been insulted for being incomplete in our xserver, wifi, and firefox
<sacater> i say he can go back to n00by windows
* sacater wrings his keyboard dry of the evil word
<sacater> LaserJock: is feisty a bit behind in deadline?
<sacater> s/deadline/deadlines
<LaserJock> sacater: what do you mean?
<LaserJock> we have deadlines and we haven't shifted them
<sacater> LaserJock: well i have a noob in #ubuntu complaining that we arnt 'meeting the deadline with good packages'
<LaserJock> well, that's their opinion
<sacater> lousy opinion...
<LaserJock> mostly
<LaserJock> as with all releases, there's probably more we could get done with more time
<sacater> yeh
<sacater> of course
<LaserJock> but this is a time based release, we get done what we can in the time we have
<sacater> but still, we all work had with stuff, 
<sacater> and then get someone like him saying we arnt working hard enough :@
<LaserJock> sacater: get used to it ;-)
* sacater realises that Hobbsee has left her stick behind, sacater picks up the sitck, and switches it to doom mode, sacater marches with stick to #ubuntu
<nrg88> so? we have a hell lot of packages, and we do our best in a matter of months, wereas M$ needs years to bring out releases (oh... and are they bringing out stable os-es? i don't think so)
<nrg88> sacater: then tell the guy to use LTS releases...
<sacater> amen to that!
<zorglu_> sacater: a possible answer to that could be 'if you think we are not doing enought, come help us and we will do more together'
<sacater> 22:44 jack_deltrino : a) When something goes into Beta, I expect it to work with a lot more things than if it was in Alpha.  It supposedly means that developers have fully tested it. Feisty is seriously crapping out on my box  and other distributions of Linux as well as Windows perform just fine, so there's a reason for me to 
<sacater>  believe that the dvelopers aren't doing as well as I think they could be . b) I submit packages to  REVU after asking wher
<sacater> zorglu_: i dont think he wants to help, 
<zorglu_> sacater: me neither, but it would be a lot harder for him to complain once he denied to help :)
<sacater> touche'
<joejaxx> sacater: well tell him to help or be quiet :P
<sacater> yes!
<sacater> shall do!
<joejaxx> sacater: we are volunteers
<joejaxx> :)
<nrg88> i think he is confusing ubuntu with a commercial product he paid good bucks for...
<zorglu_> for the 'i gonna come back to window' threat, i usually answer "ubuntu want you to be happy, if you feel happier with window, we are glad you found a software that fit your need"
<zorglu_> i was good at discarding people gently :)
* sacater high-fives joejaxx 
<sacater> zorglu_: im 14.... and i think that is illogical...
<sacater> :S
* joejaxx ^5's back
<sacater> :D
<sacater> 22:50 jack_deltrino : Okay, talking behind my back like that is pretty low dude. I never said anything about "i gonna come  back to window" [sic] . I just said that it works on other distributions, and the latest Beta doesn't  work. Considering that it is getting close to the final deadline, I don't see how the project has time  to fix all the bugs in time.
<sacater> 22:51 jack_deltrino : If the core developers can't handle the pressure, they can delegate work to more volunteers that are  willing to do some work.
<sacater> i call that person
<zorglu_> ok lets handle this guy :)
<sacater> yes
<jack_deltrino> Hello.
<sacater> 22:51 jack_deltrino : How can anyone become a core developer if REVU isn't being actively reviewed.
<jack_deltrino> Indeed.
<sacater> zorglu_: hes all yours
<joejaxx> really the the developers are not doing enough complain is like a citizen of a fortress complaining that the defensive walls or too weak while people are building it and not helping out
<sacater> joejaxx: hear hear!
<jack_deltrino> I _am_ helping out, no one is reviewing REVU.
<sacater> jack_deltrino: what sort of shiz are you proposing to the community
<joejaxx> jack_deltrino: did you talking to someone about reviewing our package?
<nrg88> isn't launchpad the place for making a release stable? like bugreporting and stuff? :?
<jack_deltrino> sacater: I don't need to take abuse. I merely told you how I felt and _you_ relayed it to a bunch of other people to start a flamefest.
<joejaxx> jack_deltrino: i do not know if people look at revu constantly
<sacater> we arnt abusing
<joejaxx> jack_deltrino: you can always ping someone here
<sacater> you complained
<jack_deltrino> That was never my intent. I like Ubuntu. If there are some flaws, I believe that it should be improved.
<sacater> we are commity
<sacater> talk to us
<sacater> well
<jack_deltrino> sacater: If we are a community, why are you trying to incite arguments?
<jack_deltrino> sacater: I don't believe your goal was honest at all.
<joejaxx> jack_deltrino: and if they are not busy they can review your package :)
<sacater> jack_deltrino: its not arguing, its contradiction
<zorglu_> jack_deltrino: what are your proposal for improvement ?
<jack_deltrino> sacater: I merely mentioned that Feisty was not coming along so well in some channels.
<joejaxx> jack_deltrino: i had to do the same thing with my packages that are currently in universe
<jack_deltrino> joejaxx: And?
* sacater double high-fives zorglu_ and jack_deltrino 
<sacater> whoops
<sacater> no way
<joejaxx> jack_deltrino: ?
* sacater highfives joejaxx 
<_MMA_> sacater: Please take this to PM. This really isnt needed in the channel.
<jack_deltrino> sacater: What? You seem like a troll. The others seem to actively understand what Ubuntu is about.
<zorglu_> jack_deltrino: what are your proposal for improvement ?
<sacater> _MMA_: fine, all those who wish to continue this discussion, make for #sacater
<jack_deltrino> zorglu_: If I tell you they won't go under review. All I will say is that REVU needs to be reviewed. There are a lot of packages that haven't gotten a single comment.
<jack_deltrino> sacater: As far as I'm concerned, my discussion with you ends here.
<sacater> meh
<sacater> in the words of catherine tate
<zorglu_> cool :)
<sacater> am i boffered?
<zorglu_> thus it is no more bothering ubuntu people :)
<sacater> another high five is in order
* sacater offers high-five to zorglu_ 
<zorglu_> :)
<sacater> finalbeta_: what is with your quit message?
<sacater> :P
<finalbeta_> which one?
<finalbeta_> Smoking grass one are lyrics from songs.
<sacater> oh
<sacater> ok, now i understand
<nrg88> jack_deltrino: but if you want feisty to be stable for release, isn't launchpad the place to discuss stability issues and bugs?
<sacater> meh
<finalbeta_> And my high school philosophy ;).
<sacater> finalbeta_: if you dont mind me asking, age?
<sacater> im 14
<sacater> and shiny...
<finalbeta_> I'm 22. And the philosophy got left behind in high school ;)
<jack_deltrino> nrg88: I usually ask on IRC first. If other people suggest that I post on Launchpad, then I do so. I was asking around in #ubuntu and #ubuntu+1 for issues others may have and the general consensus was that wireless and X was broken in a lot of instances.
<sacater> finalbeta_: aha
<sacater> jack_deltrino: that is true, my wireless and xserver are broken, it annoys me, but i dont break down into a hissy fit
<jack_deltrino> sacater: Who said I broke down into a hissy fit?
<zorglu_> nrg88: jack_deltrino: it was over. lets not relaunch it :) if you wish too, you can pm or go on another channel as previously proposed
<sacater> erm
<jack_deltrino> Yeah, true.
<sacater> #sacater is open for arguement!
<sacater> meh im going now...
<sacater> night all
* _MMA_ shakes head.
<ScottK> LaserJock: Is there a mentors mailing list already?  I'd like to sign up if there is.
#ubuntu-motu 2007-04-07
<LaserJock> ScottK: not yet, somebody (dholbach I think) mentioned it on the ubuntu-motu list
<LaserJock> ScottK: please respond to that email if you're interested
<LaserJock> oh geeze
* LaserJock reads scrollback
<micahcowan> @lart LaserJock for saying steps 1 through 4 (1 being motu-mentor list) were in place
<micahcowan> ...
<micahcowan> o yeah, not on this chan...
<LaserJock> micahcowan: oops
<micahcowan> :)
<LaserJock> man, I make a quick Taco Bell run and the whole channel goes to heck ;-)
<ajmitch> you should know better ;)
<show_now_on> LaserJock thank you for before (giving me the command)...i deleted the one line and now @ least my update list populates
<show_now_on> thanx a bunch
<LaserJock> show_now_on: no problem
<sharms> what is the command to show which package a file belongs to?
<Flannel> sharms: dpkg -S file
<ScottK> LaserJock: I responded to the e-mail.
<sharms> Flannel: thanks
<micahcowan> dpkg -S <file>
<LaserJock> ScottK: thanks
<crimsun> hmph.
<crimsun> people keep screaming for deluge-torrent 0.5
<jdong> crimsun: well it is a big step up from 0.4
<jdong> crimsun: the version in our repos has a bug where multifile torrents will get trashed in some circumstances
<crimsun> is there a backportable fix?
<crimsun> --> In short, Deluge isn't really done yet, and it's still in rapid development, which is why I'd almost rather it not be in the repository at all, sadly. I just don't want users to look at whatever version winds up packaged in the repositories and think that it's "done."
<jdong> crimsun: the developer decided to just fix it in the next release
<jdong> which is a full rewrite basically
<crimsun> tell me why -uvf should even consider deluge-torrent 0.5 if the upstream dev states the above unequivocally.
<jdong> heh... I think he was just frustrated and not wording things rationally
<crimsun> sounds pretty rational to me.
<jdong> I think his main point was that the current version has a major data loss bug
<jdong> and he would like to use it as a reason to push a new version in
<jdong> to be fair he was originally aiming it to be out before UVF happened
<jdong> but he fell short
<crimsun> err, then we do the sane thing, which is request that the binaries be removed from the archive.
<crimsun> if we can't do that, then we ask for a full source+binary removal.
<jdong> true
<jdong> well I'm not one way or the other on this
<crimsun> unpopular, yes, but we need to weigh the fact that even if motu-uvf approves it and MOTU uploads, we're fewer than FOURTEEN days from release. Archive admins are already swamped. Clearly fixing milestones for -7.04 are higher priority.
<jdong> crimsun: agreed, it is way too soon to release to be putting in a new release that's a _rewrite_
<jdong> crimsun: I don't think it's the end of the world if it's handled as a feisty-backports
<crimsun> precisely. Besides, feisty+1 will be open $soon
<jdong> sounds like a good plan
<jdong> and I'll try to make him happier about the decision too :)
<jdong> IIRC he filed the UVF around the same time we were battling xgl, no?
<ajmitch> crimsun: had someone even made a package for it?
<ajmitch> I looked at the bug & it seemed rather stalled
<jdong> ajmitch: yeah, he has packages for it
<crimsun> I'm fine with it going in, but I have stated publicly in that bug report (90749) what my opinion is.
<ajmitch> yes, I see that now
<ajmitch> apparantly there are already a number of problems with 0.5, just not as bad as 0.4
<jdong> ajmitch: yeah, that sounds like Deluge :)
<ajmitch> users will complain, but oh well
<ajmitch> that's what developers are here for, to get beaten up by users
<ajmitch> hi jml 
* Fujitsu wonders why anything attempting to use ALSA on this system now hangs.
<crimsun> fresh boot or resume from suspend-to-* ?
<Fujitsu> It hasn't been rebooted in a couple of days, but it hasn't been suspended.
<crimsun> what's holding /dev/dsp*, /dev/audio*, /dev/mixer*, or /dev/snd/* open?
<crimsun> (or /dev/sequencer* )
<Fujitsu> lsof doesn't show anything.
<crimsun> what about in dmesg?
<crimsun> codec warnings, errors, etc.
<Fujitsu> I can't see anything particularly special in there.
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: last time I had that happen, the chipset fan on the motherboard had stopped :)
<Fujitsu> Nice, ajmitch.
<crimsun> err, my terminal just disappeared
<Fujitsu> OSS works fine, oddly.
<crimsun> hmm, seems like an IPC issue, then
<Fujitsu> semget(5678293, 1, IPC_CREAT|0660)      = 6258690
<Fujitsu> semctl(6258690, 0, IPC_64|IPC_STAT, 0xbfa69dc8) = 0
<Fujitsu> semctl(6258690, 0, IPC_64|IPC_SET, 0xbfa69dc8) = -1 EPERM (Operation not permitted)
<Fujitsu> semop(6258690, 0xbfa69e9e, 2
<crimsun> does `aplay -Dplug:hw0 /usr/share/sounds/*up.wav' work?
<Fujitsu> Same thing for the various things I've tried to play with.
<ajmitch> that's special
* ajmitch wonders why X with feisty works in vmware but not etch
<jml> ajmitch: hi
<Fujitsu> hw0 doesn't work, says `Unknown PCM'. Just hw works fine.
<crimsun> oh, right, it would have been -Dplughw:0
<crimsun> ok, yeah, IPC issue with dmix
<crimsun> there a bug report on this, gotta find it
<Fujitsu> Thanks.
<Fujitsu> It does this sometimes after not being rebooted for a few days. A little irritating.
<crimsun> you can work around with sudo modprobe -r $(lsmod |grep ^snd |awk '{print $1}') && sudo modprobe snd-hda-intel
<StevenK> That may not work, due to lsmod's ordering.
<Fujitsu> modprobe complains about an unmatched bracket in `snd_hda_intel'... I don't see any brackets there.
<crimsun> pastebin the command and output, please
<Fujitsu> It's three lines... Should I still pastebin it?
<crimsun> please
<Fujitsu> OK.
<Fujitsu> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/14324/
<sharms> ***Blatant attempt to draw attention to my spec***  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Spec/EnhancedBash
<Fujitsu> I removed and reloaded all the modules manually, but it still hangs.
<crimsun> what the
<crimsun> something a lot more nefarious is occurring
<Fujitsu> Looks that way.
<crimsun> pastebin /proc/asound/card0/pcm0p/sub0/* contents?
<Fujitsu> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/14325/
<crimsun> Fujitsu: vanilla i386 install (not amd64)?
<Fujitsu> i386 it is.
<shawarma> sharms: I don't think you want colour=always in GREP_OPTIONS.
<shawarma> sharms: Are you familiar with the difference between "auto" and "always" in that context?
* shawarma is also known as "Delayed Reaction Man"
<wick2o> evening
<Fujitsu> Hi wick2o
<wick2o> hows it going Fujitsu?
<Fujitsu> Fine, wick2o. And you?
<wick2o> doin already, tring to solve a problem in my postinit script
<wick2o> other then that im ok i guess
<wick2o> im tring to do a dpkg -i filename.deb and still use db_get
<crimsun> Fujitsu: please add ``cat /proc/sys/kernel/shm*''
<Fujitsu> crimsun: Done.
<shawarma> w/in 32
<shawarma> doh..
<wick2o> can you not use db_get in a postinst script when you use dpkg -i?
<LaserJock> hmm, I've never heard of db_get
<rmjb> Hello room
<rmjb> can someone build a x86_64 version of a package for me? I want to give it to a user for testing and I can only build i386
<wick2o> really?
<RAOF> rmjb: Yup?
<wick2o> thats how you get those nice popups for information when you say apt-get ddclient
<wick2o> or anything else that asks you for input when you "configure" durning an apt-get install
<LaserJock> oh debconf?
<wick2o> ya
<LaserJock> ah yeah, I know what you mean now
<wick2o> im tring to install the deb manually with dpkg -i yet still get those prompts
<LaserJock> I think it works with dpkg -i
<RAOF> rmjb: Point me to the source and where you'd like the finished package.
<wick2o> umm, then my deb must be messed up, because it installs fine, but doesnt give me the prompts
<RAOF> Yay!  My banshee imports wavpack now :)
<shawarma> wick2o: Which priority have you set for your questions?
<LaserJock> wick2o: you might need to play with the priority/interface for debconf
<wick2o> umm I dont thing i have ANY priority set
<wick2o> i dont really know what im doing, i just did an apt-get source ddclient and used source from their postinit script and tweaked it a bit to fit my needs....i may have very well missed something
<crimsun> Fujitsu: ok, what I would do is use ipcrm(8) to remove the offending key/segment (see ipcs(8) -m)
* Fujitsu was horrified to see a post by LaserJock in the NM forum thread, and the replies following it.
<Fujitsu> crimsun: I've got nooo idea what I'm doing here, but I'll have a look=.
<crimsun> Fujitsu: the shorter method is simply to reboot, but I'm sure you've been using that already
<LaserJock> Fujitsu: yes, yes. I'm in 2 threads on it
<shawarma> wick2o: Well, there's also something about debconf not asking questions again if it's already got an answer (ie. you've already answered it).
<Fujitsu> `Not especially funny to most of the responders in this thread. Given the standard Ubuntu approach to development packages (if it compiles, throw it in the main repository and let everyone suffer), you're definitely damned, especially since many developers intentionally exclude themselves from community input such as this forum. No one has apparently heard of the concept of at least limited testing before release.'
<Fujitsu> The standard Ubuntu approach to development? What the?
<shawarma> wick2o: I don't remember it all to well. It's been over a year since I've used it last.
<shawarma> Fujitsu: Where's that from?
<Fujitsu> shawarma: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=393039&page=10
<wick2o> shawarma, i think that only holds true if you dont do a purge when you uninstall
<Fujitsu> crimsun: What am I looking for in that list?
<crimsun> Fujitsu: key matching dmix shared memory segment
<shawarma> wick2o: Well, if the postrm script removes stuff from debconf, then yes. debhelper might put stuff in for that. 
<crimsun> Fujitsu: if you haven't modified it, grep 
<crimsun> err
<Fujitsu> crimsun: How do I identify which that is?
<wick2o> umm my postrm doesnt do anything currently
<crimsun> Fujitsu: if you haven't modified it, grep -nH ipc /usr/share/alsa/alsa.conf
<crimsun> ipc_key in particular
<wick2o> shawarma, is there a way to manually remove or check for these answers?
<crimsun> Fujitsu: stracing an alsa app will also help pinpoint where it's failing on the shm segment
<Fujitsu> Only 4 of the items in the list returned by ipcs have a non-zero key, and none of them are that mentioned in alsa.conf :S
<Fujitsu> OK, so it seems mpd had the semaphore that everything was hanging on. I removed it and all is good.
<shawarma> wick2o: It's all stored in /var/cache/debconfig/config.dat, but unless you're quite sure what you're doing, I wouldn't mass too much with it by hand.
<wick2o> shawarma, apt-get -y --purge item did the trick as far as clearning debconf
<wick2o> however that doesnt help at all with my package
<wick2o> ( i did a test with ddclient)
<sharms> shawarma: whats the downside to my grep option
<sharms> shawarma: ah I want auto there
<wick2o> there has to be some debconf settings somewhere else in a standard deb that i have forgotten
<shawarma> sharms: Thought so. :-)
<sharms> I really want to get some of these in feisty + 1
<sharms> gonna make a launchpad spec
<bddebian> Heya gang
<RAOF> Hey bddebian
<bddebian> Hi RAOF
<rmjb> hey bddebian, long time no see
<bddebian> Hello rmjb
<RAOF> rmjb: You've got mail :)
<rmjb> RAOF: thank you kindly
<RAOF> I presume you don't want the build-logs?
<rmjb> nah, I think this builds fine... will inspect with fileroller
<wick2o> shawarma,  i found my whole problem
<wick2o> if any "admins" are around http://www.fifi.org/doc/debconf-doc/tutorial.html
<wick2o> this link might be useful to add to your "!" 
<bddebian> Is it supposed to be a Hug day?
<sharms> bddebian: you can hug my spec any day: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Spec/EnhancedBash
<bddebian> sharms: I don't do specs, I'm just a schlub :-(
<sharms> bddebian: I could also use more people doing propaganda work for it :)
<sharms> such as when someone says a question, work my spec address into the answer
<ajmitch> ugh
<bddebian> heh, sounds "dirty" ;-P
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
* ajmitch hates it when people spam specs like that
<sharms> ajmitch, nobody can spam a spec like me
<crimsun> I like it. Makes my supar-AI's spec-ignorer work overtime!
<ajmitch> it makes me want to ignore that spec 
<sharms> to be fair, I made it almost 6 months ago and it has been totally ignored
<nixternal> ajmitch: did you hug that spec? did you look at it? huh huh did you? ;p
* nixternal hides from ajmitch and sharms 
<wick2o> in debconf id like to use a db_get netcfg/get_ipaddress and use that value as a default for questions in my custom deb
<wick2o> or can you only set defaults in your templates file?
<crimsun> nixternal: my spec-autoignorer hugged it. Hugged it right into /dev/null.
<nixternal> haha
* Fujitsu dives into /dev/null after it.
* Fujitsu is thus disintegrated.
<nixternal> crimsun: have you heard anything about some random weirdness with intel hda? (ICH7 or whatever), where the PCM vol will turn down low to where you can't hear sound all that well? it is random
<crimsun> rich, the correct question to ask is "Have you heard of any situation where sound works correctly?"
<Fujitsu> HDA sounds like a lot of fun to work with.
<nixternal> heh
<crimsun> basically, if it's sound and I've heard of it, it's because it's broken. :-)
<nixternal> crimsun: it works fine, but there was something either a website with flash like youtube, that would just mute sound by dropping the pcm
<nixternal> I think it was YouTube and flash doing it maybe
<nixternal> because it hasn't happened in a couple of days now that I think about it
<crimsun> that's Flash's fault
<crimsun> entirely beyond the prerogative of alsa-{lib,driver}
<crimsun> Flash 9 attempts to open every single subdevice on every enumerated alsa device.
<crimsun> it makes for FUN TIMES.
<crimsun> (it also makes rejecting flashplugin-nonfree bugs a lot easier, but that's another matter altogether.)
<nixternal> ahhh, so it is definitely flash then, I am glad I remembered that
<nixternal> ya, I couldn't think of anything else that was causing the issue
<crimsun> hopefully we'll have the "one mixer interface to rule them all" completed for feisty+1
<Burgundavia> crimsun: might that explain why certain usb audio devices work with everything put flash?
<nixternal> rock on!
<wick2o> umm
<crimsun> Burgundavia: usb audio devices have their own sets of quirks (no pun intended, as quirks are technically hard-coded into the source code)
<Burgundavia> crimsun: indeed. We are busy ripping our hair out at Userful over several devices that customers bought in quantity
<bddebian> usb has quirks period :)
<crimsun> I love how just about every usb audio device requires a quirk entry
<crimsun> what, a usb audio 1.x spec? It was obviously made to be ignored!
<crimsun> Just like HDA...
<crimsun> anyhow, back to your regularly scheduled Ubuntu universe bug list...
<Burgundavia> crimsun: want to work on Fedora?
<Burgundavia> second thought, scratch that
<Burgundavia> *I* don't want to work on Fedora. I shouldn't drag other people into my misery
* Hobbsee waves
<Burgundavia> hey Hobbsee
<nixternal> Burgundavia: what do you have to do with Fedora?
<Burgundavia> nixternal: Userful's product is built on it
<nixternal> word on the streets is that the KDE implementation for Fedora 7 is going to be rockin'
<nixternal> fedora truthfully isn't all that bad, I am just not a fan of rpm
<Burgundavia> there are some proactive security things in Ubuntu that make me happy
<Burgundavia> plus sudo is already setup and our security support timeframe is well defined
<jdong> "4. Wear ANSI approved safety goggles when using this device"
<jdong> umm......
<jdong> A fluke voltmeter??
* jdong wonders what america has gotten to....
<Burgundavia> might blow up
<jdong> yeah :)
<jdong> or the probes might attack you like head crabs
<Burgundavia> nixternal: the reality is that the Fedora people are trying to recreate Ubuntu's community, however RedHat has more engineers
<nixternal> that is true
<wick2o> debconf, is there a way to do dynamic defaults?
<Burgundavia> nixternal: the security policy of Fedora is what sets Ubuntu apart in a production environment
<ajmitch> hello Burgundavia 
<Burgundavia> hey ajmitch
<joejaxx> hello ajmitch Burgundavia :)
<Burgundavia> hey joejaxx
<LaserJock> hiya Burgundavia and ajmitch 
<ajmitch> what's up?
<RAOF> Anyone feel like some debdiff sponsoring?  bug #103722 fixes a bunch of specto bugs.
<ubotu> Malone bug 103722 in specto "specto crashes when monitoring file changes" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/103722
<LaserJock> I still need to finish reading that backlog
<LaserJock> the "MOTU suXors" discussion ;-)
<ajmitch> heh
<bddebian> There was an MOTU suX0rs discussion?
<ajmitch> yes
<LaserJock> ah well, not that exciting after all
<bddebian> Where was this?
<LaserJock> here
<ajmitch> it fizzled out, thankfully
<bddebian> Of course I do suck but that's besides the point :)
<LaserJock> too much "yeah huh" ... "nuh uh" ... "yeah huh"
<nixternal> anyone have a clue on what updates recently would have broken palm pilot syncing?
<bddebian> people still use those things? :)
<nixternal> I like to mess with them every now and then
<LaserJock> I want one
<LaserJock> I keep missing appointments and things
<LaserJock> although, as crimsun already has pointed out, if I can't figure out how to use my watch/computer/stickynotes then why would a palm pilot help
<bddebian> hehe
<nixternal> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/14332/
<nixternal> tell me that isn't scary
<nixternal> wtf
* Hobbsee wonders what was said in that discussion
<LaserJock> oh, somebody in #ubuntu said that devs didn't seem to be able to meet deadlines for Feisty
<Hobbsee> ah, fair enough
<LaserJock> that it's still got too many bugs, etc.
<Hobbsee> meh.  most of the wifi bugs are pebkac, so...
<LaserJock> and when the person was told, "well then help out"
<Hobbsee> heh
<crimsun> LaserJock: well, that much is true. OTOH, that's the nature of software.
<LaserJock> they pointed out that they had put stuff on REVU and it never got reviewed
<bddebian> I have to admit it has seemed like a strange cycle this time for some reason.  Of course my work/home life hasn't helped in that :-(
<Hobbsee> we've gotten a fair few new people, merges were slow, and all the beryl crap whihc took a couple of weeks out of devleopment time
<Hobbsee> but core dev's had the same problem
<LaserJock> well, there's always issues
<Hobbsee> true
<crimsun> community expectations of Ubuntu will continue to be exaggerated
<Hobbsee> oh of course
* Hobbsee was merely comparing this cycle to say...edgy
<LaserJock> although that doesn't me we can't learn from criticism and try to do better
<crimsun> LaserJock: that's a foregone conclusion
<LaserJock> REVU seem not very optimal for consistent reviewing
<bddebian> Yeah, it seemed like edgy was smoother for some reason
<LaserJock> bddebian: we had crimsun to keep everything together ;-)
<bddebian> LaserJock: Well it helps when/if we had more reviewers too :-)
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: atm i'm playing with better use of the MOTU page...
* Hobbsee will send to the ML soonish, once she hsa more concrete ideas
<LaserJock> Hobbsee: the wiki page?
<Hobbsee> yes
<crimsun> the fact of the matter is that we simply do not scale, and we will not scale, and people will proceed as if we indeed scale.
<Hobbsee> crimsun: very true.
<bddebian> crimsun: true dat
<Hobbsee> crimsun: and we're nto so great on training up new people, without the MOTU school
<ajmitch> so we have to work out how to scale better, without collapsing 
<LaserJock> so we need to find a model that does scale
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: you should run a school session then
<Hobbsee> and people either dont have the resources or the will to get better
<LaserJock> I haven't quite figured it out yet
<LaserJock> I thought more team usage would help
<nixternal> dude, the -14 kernel just ate my grub menu.lst
<nixternal> that isn't good man
<ajmitch> tasty menu.lst
<crimsun> nixternal: it ran across your Vista partition and barfed.
<nixternal> if I reboot, I am done
<Hobbsee> seems to be a problem of people getting to developing stuff at all, really
<theCore> nixternal: update-grub?
<nixternal> yup
<nixternal> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/14332/
<nixternal> theCore: ^^
<nixternal> please tell me there is an easy fix
<LaserJock> theCore: hi
<nixternal> it looks like it turned everything into ascii code
<LaserJock> theCore: I was sad to see the thread about emacs-snapshot being removed
<ajmitch> that's special
<crimsun> ok, so we have specs. One way of drawing more people into the fray is to respond more quickly to these specs and to action them.
<theCore> LaserJock: yeah, I was too
<LaserJock> theCore: although I saw he's still going to maintain it in a 3rd party repo
<crimsun> OTOH, the people who are actively writing specs are already technically inclined, so are they really "our" target?
<theCore> nixternal: there's probably a lone [ somewhere in your menu.lst
<nixternal> well there are a bunch of them now, and why all of a sudden it would happen
<theCore> LaserJock: really? do you got the URL to it?
<bddebian> We don't the the "staff" to handle bugs, merges, and new packages, how are we supposed handle additional "stuff"?
<nixternal> 1;31m# altoptions0m=(recovery mode) single
<crimsun> bddebian: TBH, I haven't "tapped" the forum.
<nixternal> looks like it started right there with the corruption
<crimsun> can we pull the more technically inclined forum posters into our fray?
* RAOF would be one of those.
* bddebian is frightened :-)
* Hobbsee thinsk the forums people tend to jump to irc anyway
<Hobbsee> but there would be some that dont, yes.
<LaserJock> theCore: http://emacs.orebokech.com/ 
<theCore> thanks LaserJock
<nixternal> pull me into the frey, give me a mentor and let me flap my wings
<nixternal> or gums, whatever comes first ;p
<crimsun> I may well be misled, but I think that the vast majority of forum posters aren't involved in Ubuntu universe maintenance.
<mohammad> Hello, I have uploaded package zekr to revu but after 1 hour it does not show up at http://revu.tauware.de/ yet
<Hobbsee> crimsun: that'd be accurate
<Hobbsee> mohammad: have you added yourself to the link in the /topic?
<bddebian> Yes he's uploaded it before iirc
<Hobbsee> ah
* ajmitch checks the cron logs
<ajmitch> mohammad: using a new key?
<mohammad> yes
<mohammad> a new key
<bddebian> ahh
<ajmitch> figures..
* ajmitch resyncs
<LaserJock> well, I'm sure it wouldn't go over very well, but I wouldn't mind seeing some sort of moratorium on NEW packages for a release
* nixternal reboots, wish me luck
<mohammad> ajmitch I used my previous email but with a new key
<ajmitch> LaserJock: you mean sticking to a freeze?
<ajmitch> mohammad: your new key is on launchpad, right?
<LaserJock> ajmitch: saying, "we aren't doing any REVU for Feisty+1", essentially
<ajmitch> LaserJock: ah, then I'd have to upload new packages anyway :)
<mohammad> yes I have added it to lunchpad around 3 hours ago
<LaserJock> ajmitch: yeah, it'd be hard to control as there are new packages needed for specs, etc.
<nixternal> oh I am scared, this is what I get for upgrading the kernel right before my presentation tomorrow
<nixternal> son of a ....Error 15: File not found
<theCore> is hard/long to fix these: http://ajmitch.net.nz/~ajmitch/missing-fixes-rc.html?
<ajmitch> theCore: depends
<theCore> I got a long weekend, I might be able to help out 
<ajmitch> check for outstanding sync requests before you touch a package
<ajmitch> plenty of them were just UVF exceptions+sync requests
<theCore> I just need to figure out what to do exactly
<ajmitch> fix bugs :)
<ajmitch> the list is just a version comparison, using the set of packages in debian that have closed RC bugs
<bddebian> Hell, just triage bugs.  I see we still have close to 5000 unconfirmed bugs alone :'-(
<ajmitch> so generally we either want the fix from debian, or the equivalent
<nixternal> theCore: well that kernel upgrade killed my machine
<ajmitch> bddebian: doesn't it give you that warm & fuzzy feeling?
<theCore> nixternal: ouch...
<mohammad> if I upload it again I get this error: 
<mohammad> rejected by the upload queue management software.
<mohammad> Uploading via ftp zekr_0.5.0-0ubuntu1.dsc: Error '553 Could not create file.' during ftp transfer of zekr_0.5.0-0ubuntu1.dsc
<mohammad> Note: This problem might be caused by files already existent on the server.
<mohammad>       For the official Debian upload queues, the dcut(1) utility can be used
<mohammad>       to remove stale files from unsuccessful uploads.
<ajmitch> mohammad: be patient, please
<bddebian> ajmitch: No :-(
<nixternal> ya, I have to give an Ubuntu presentation in 8 hours
<mohammad> ok sorry 
<theCore> nixternal: can I see your grub/menu.lst 
<ajmitch> the keyring sync is still going
<crimsun> nixternal: either rescue from an alternate cd, or chroot from a desktop cd
<nixternal> I would love to show it off, but it is dead right now, I am going to chroot in and take a look
<theCore> nixternal: have fun...
<nixternal> I have never had luck with the rescue from an alternate cd
<nixternal> but then again I haven't tried that in a while
<theCore> nixternal: tip: mount your Ubuntu partition on /mnt, bind /dev and /sys to /mnt/{dev,sys}, and then chroot /mnt
<nixternal> I am trying the rescue first
<nixternal> see if that fixes it
<LaserJock> nixternal: you could also just edit the grub menu item ;-)
<ajmitch> LaserJock: too easy
<crimsun> remember, rich loves Vista. pointy n' clicky!
<crimsun> :-)
<nixternal> haha
<ajmitch> heh
<nixternal> damnit, I am buying it tomorrow!
<LaserJock> well, it does have tab-complete
<nixternal> Vista is way better than GNOME any day!
* LaserJock kicks nixternal 
<bddebian> Vista blows and I'm not even a MS hater :-)
<crimsun> ok seriously, what we're experiencing is analogous to the math & science downturn in US universities
<nixternal> my menu.lst looks fine
<nixternal> root (hd0,0)
<crimsun> so we need to do some serious outreach
<crimsun> jono has mentioned blogging. How seriously do people read planet.uc?
<ajmitch> crimsun: we've made ubuntu too easy for people to use?
<LaserJock> crimsun: sure, but do we have time?
* ajmitch reads planet.u.c daily
* bddebian never reads it
<nixternal> kernel /boot/vmlinuz-2.6.20-14-generic root=UUID=blahblahblah-blahblahblah-blah-blah ro quiet splash
<LaserJock> when I post on planet I generally get ~ 5000 hits
* ajmitch has to get his fix of things like the golden pony awards
<LaserJock> heh
<LaserJock> if you have something really interesting to say you can probably get much more
<LaserJock> my blog posts aren't that great
<LaserJock> but yeah, blogging more
* ajmitch never has anything interesting
<LaserJock> we *could* try to have a subforum or something on ubuntuforums
<LaserJock> there is already a packaging subforum hidden deep down in there
<theCore> so, Ubuntu is losing momentum?
<crimsun> theCore: absolutely, we're doomed.
<ajmitch> theCore: everyone's jumping ship for debian, you know
<theCore> ahh! what we gonna do! 
<crimsun> we should give up and just eat girl scout cookies now
<ajmitch> panic
<bddebian> w00t
<sharms> crimsun: already doing that
<bddebian> But what if I don't like Girl Scout cookies?
<LaserJock> theCore: not so  much losing momentum as growing without scaling the dev community
* ajmitch recalls the end of UDU - we all went & saw hitchiker's guide to the galaxy
<theCore> eat Ubuntu cookies?
<ajmitch> "Don't Panic"
<sharms> thats the problem with so many distros, and a limited free-help talent pool
<ajmitch> sharms: grow the pool
<theCore> hmm... not a bad idea...
<sharms> ajmitch: I cant even get momentum on my bash spec, how in the world can i grow a talent pool
<LaserJock> we have to take  temporary hit to do it thoough
<LaserJock> lol, he did it
<LaserJock> he got in his mention ;-)
<theCore> sharms: bash-spec?
<crimsun> LaserJock: ok, let's say there's a MOTU forum in UF. What would be its focus(ii)?
<sharms> theCore: glad you asked! https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Spec/EnhancedBash
<theCore> sharms: that Pg-[Up,Down]  thingy?
* ajmitch groans
<sharms> theCore: yup!
<LaserJock> crimsun: well, hopefully growing MOTU and getting people excited. However, I expect it to turn into a free-for-all grudge match
<sharms> what I want to know is, if I provide a debdiff, will anyone pay attention more?
<crimsun> there is something immensely comical about sharms attempting to push his spec, I must admit.
<LaserJock> sharms: it would be all good and well if it wasn't PgUp and PgDown, I use those already ;-)
* theCore restores his old bashrc
* Fujitsu walks in on this discussion.
<sharms> LaserJock: out of curiosity what are the bound to?
<sharms> crimsun: I have tried to throw some humor in rather than be blatantly annoying
<LaserJock> sharms: it honestly seems so trivial I don't really expect to get much attention
<LaserJock> sharms: for me it's always been going up and down in the terminal scrollback
<Fujitsu> And it's got nothing at all to do with us.
<sharms> LaserJock: it still does go up and down in terminal scroll back, as long as the line is blank
<sharms> LaserJock: if line is blank, behave normal.  If line has text, try and match
<theCore> sharms: anyway, I wonder why you're still using bash. If you're looking power-shell usage, there
<theCore> there's zsh you know
<sharms> theCore: its just amazingly intuitive and I want to share it
<LaserJock> sharms: ok, whatever, sounds like a wishlist bug
<sharms> right, I am just wondering how I can actually get it in
<LaserJock> I'm not against it by anymeans
<sharms> I have a feeling my debdiffs will get ignored
<theCore> sharms: Up and Down do the same thing
<LaserJock> well, there's not much we can do about that
<LaserJock> theCore: no they don't
<theCore> LaserJock: sure?
<LaserJock> yeah
<LaserJock> Up and Down just go through the histry
<sharms> right which is why I am trying to figure out how someone goes about this, and asking for help
<LaserJock> his PgUp searches the histry
<theCore> search?
<LaserJock> sharms: file a wishlist bug against bash, attach a debdiff
<theCore> I am missing something, I think...
<LaserJock> I guess
<sharms> theCore: say you type "ss" in the command line.  Hit page up and it will match the last command that started with ss, like "ssh sharms@sharms.org"
<LaserJock> it's like doing Ctrl-r
<theCore> sharms: yeah, Up/Down does this
<theCore> sharms: by default
<sharms> theCore: not if you are running ubuntu
<crimsun> yeah, ^r is somewhat similar
<theCore> sharms: I am running Ubuntu ...
<sharms> ^r should be identical 
<sharms> theCore: then you are just misunderstanding 
<theCore> sharms: test it
<sharms> I did! On 3 boxes since you said that
<theCore> oh, wait ...
<theCore> no, it works
<sharms> ok yeah its ctrl-r but easier to use
<theCore> somehow
<sharms> the up key does not do the action i propose
<sharms> I promise you
<theCore> it just doesn't use the history file
<LaserJock> Up/Down just cycles through the history
<LaserJock> ctrl-r searches
<nixternal> this sucks
<theCore> ahh
<theCore> I see the difference
<nixternal> none of the options are working
<theCore> I remember it, now
<sharms> nixternal: in what?
<nixternal> the latest kernel upgrade killed grub
<nixternal> Grub Error 15: File not found
<nixternal> and grub looks correct
<sharms> livecd bootso k?
<nixternal> yes
<ajmitch> grub has lovely tab completion in its shell\
<sharms> did you have a splash image?
<nixternal> yup
<sharms> is it still in its location?
<theCore> sharms: so, Up/Down just history complete, with history-search-backward, you can scroll back
<sharms> theCore: yup and it is amazingly functional and useful, and increases productivity 10x or more
<sharms> that might be an exaggeration.
<theCore> sharms: eh, yeah
<theCore> sharms: I had it my old .inputrc
<theCore> sharms: but, I bound it to Up/Down instead of Pg-Up/Down
<nixternal> ajmitch: tab completion greets me with "not found"
<sharms> theCore: there is some comment about that on the Spec, I am not dead-set on page-up page-down, but there is a huge base of users already using it that way
<theCore> sharms: and btw, these "magic" commands, in .inputrc, are bash-specific 
<sharms> all I know is they work with our default shell
<theCore> sharms: they should be wrap in a $if Bash 
<theCore> wrapped*
<sharms> so check the SHELL variable
<sharms> ?
<nixternal> theCore: how do I bind the /dev and /sys to /mnt{dev,sys}?
<Fujitsu> nixternal: mount -o bind /dev /mnt/dev
<sharms> is inputrc just a shell script?
<nixternal> gotcha
<theCore> nixternal:  mount --bind /dev/ /mnt/dev
<theCore> sharms: no
<theCore> sharms: that's my .inputrc http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/14336/
<sharms> great
<nixternal> hrmm, theCore I have my /boot on /dev/sda1 so that is the one to mount correct?
<theCore> nixternal: yep
<nixternal> and now bind
<theCore> nixternal: I fixed a broken grub, not so long ago
<nixternal> mkdir /mnt/dev first :)
<theCore> nixternal: I booted the rescue disk, took a shell with Alt-Ctrl-F1, mounted my drive, and then bam! I fixed it
<nixternal> OK, everything is done, what shall I look at first?
<theCore> nixternal: first repair the menu.lst
<sharms> nixternal: that error means your just missing a file somewhere
<theCore> nixternal: make sure your grub/device.map is correct too
<nixternal> menu.lst looks good to me
<nixternal> (hd0) /dev/sda
<nixternal> that looks good
<theCore> nixternal: can you post it? 
<nixternal> sure
<nixternal> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/14337/
<theCore> nixternal: that's it?
<nixternal> that is the bottom half, you want it all?
<nixternal> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/14338/
<nixternal> there it is
<theCore> nixternal: thanks
<ajmitch> nixternal: you said you had a separate /boot?
<nixternal> yes
<nixternal> /dev/sda1
<nixternal> I have /boot, /, /home, and swap
<ajmitch> then all the kernel & initrd lines are wrong, and shouldn't have /boot in them
<theCore> nixternal: it looks ok
<ajmitch> eg mine is:
<ajmitch> kernel          /vmlinuz-2.6.20-13-generic root=/dev/mapper/ubuntu-root ro quiet splash
<ajmitch> initrd          /initrd.img-2.6.20-13-generic
<theCore> ajmitch: nope, I think that's something specific to your system
<ajmitch> theCore: unlikely
<theCore> ajmitch: I got the /boot
<theCore> ajmitch: using LVM?
<ajmitch> yes
<ajmitch> it's the same on etch that I installed last night
<crimsun> ajmitch: do you have to pass "break=mount" to lilo?
<theCore> ajmitch: that's probably why, anyway it is not the problem 
<ajmitch> crimsun: not for my laptop
<ajmitch> crimsun: I haven't rebooted my desktop box for ~2 months
<crimsun> ah.
<ajmitch> and I don't use lilo
* ajmitch uses / on LVM, with a separate /boot
<crimsun> yeah, noting the syntax above
<ajmitch> it *ought* to be sorted out now, with LVM+RAID
<crimsun> apparently initramfs is way too fast for my pokey hardware
<crimsun> like on the order of 10 seconds
<theCore> nixternal: try regenerating the menu.lst
<theCore> nixternal: with update-grub
<theCore> nixternal: then post the new menu.lst again
<Fujitsu> The /boot being there is definitely the problem.
<Fujitsu> So running update-grub is unlikely to fix it.
<nixternal> argh, chroot isn't workin' no /bin/sh
<Fujitsu> nixternal: You need to have /boot mounted inside /.
<theCore> Fujitsu: the file in / are just symlinks to the ones in /boot
<nixternal> I have /boot mounted inside of /mnt
<Fujitsu> You need the /boot mounted inside your normal /.
<nixternal> cannot change root directory to /mnt: Operation not permitted
<Fujitsu> theCore: But with a separate /boot, there is no /boot in that partition.
<Fujitsu> nixternal: sudo
<theCore> nixternal: do you use one main partition?
<theCore> or you have separate /boot partition?
<nixternal> /boot       /      /home    
<nixternal> i have a seperate boot
<theCore> oh, well
<theCore> that's different
<Fujitsu> He did say that earlier, I believe.
<theCore> ah, yeah. I missed it
<nixternal> alrighty then
<theCore> but, if it worked before ... why the /boot would be a problem?
<Fujitsu> I don't know, but I had the same thing on a Dapper machine a couple of months ago.
<Fujitsu> The /boot part just appeared after a kernel upgrade.
<nixternal> yup, remove /boot/
<nixternal> so it seems
<nixternal> yup
<nixternal> that fixed it
<nixternal> ajmitch: I owe you a drink
<Fujitsu> How strange that it got put there.
<nixternal> gimme your email address, I will email it to you ;p
<ajmitch> hah
<ajmitch> nixternal: or just attend UDS :)
<nixternal> I can't this go round, school is in the way
<ajmitch> a shame
<LaserJock> I thought most /boot dirs had a symlink to ../boot
<nixternal> yes it is, but I need to finish my schooling before I am 50
<ajmitch> UDS is where drink credits for the last 6 months are traded ;)
<LaserJock> so it wouldn't matter if you had / or /boot
<Lathiat> does anyone know if you create a new thing in /etc/event.d for upstart how to tell it to start now rather than like reboot to make the normal events trigger
<nixternal> sharms: I think your tricks has booged the tab complete, one tab gives me a list of junk
<theCore> anyway, you can't really edit it directly or you will get the same problem again, after every kernel update...
<theCore> nixternal: can you still get to the grub menu, or it fails before that?
<nixternal> heh, update-grub destroys it again
<nixternal> so, with that being said, don't upgrade the kernel
<sharms> nixternal: pastebin the session
<nixternal> ya, I cannot run update-grub at all, it hoses my system
<theCore> that /boot thing is weird ... I wonder what difference does it make
<nixternal> it starts messing up /boot/grub/menu.lst at the # altoptions
<crimsun> Lathiat: kill 1
<crimsun> same for any changes to an upstart script
<nixternal> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/14339/
<theCore> okay ... what these escape codes do there??? 
<theCore> I guess update-grub wants to colourize you grub :)
<theCore> er, you -> your
<nixternal> omg
<nixternal> that is what it is, it is sharms little scipts
<nixternal> !!#@#@
<Fujitsu> It seems to be getting the path right this time.
<sharms> nixternal: update-grub is a bash script I assume?
<Fujitsu> The grep colourisation line made my terminal go somewhat silly.
<theCore> oups
<sharms> ha
<theCore> evil sharms
<sharms> my change is the page-up page-down, the other changes are just ones people have suggested
<ajmitch> nixternal: ah, what wonderful breakage ;)
<Fujitsu> I think we should add all of these to the default installation!
* ajmitch runs with a coloured prompt without any problems
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: obviously
<Fujitsu> Like beryl.
<sharms> ajmitch: no its the --color=auto     appended to the end of grep 
<sharms> not the prompt
<sharms> nixternal: do you have grub --color=auto   or always
<Fujitsu> I added it when it was --color=always, and then the world exploded.
<nixternal> always
<Fujitsu> Changed it to auto, and all is now good.
<sharms> switch it to auto
<sharms> always is a bug
<Fujitsu> It went /crazy/.
<nixternal> I have commented it out, but it still killed update-grub
<theCore> nixternal: did made the changes in /etc/inputrc ?
<Fujitsu> nixternal: You'll need to open a new terminal or rerun your .bashrc.
<nixternal> no ~/.bashrc
<nixternal> brb
<nixternal> source ~/.bashrc isn't good enough?
<sharms> I know I should feel bad, but it is kind of funny
<Fujitsu> That should do it.
<nixternal> sharms: I owe you one ;p
<sharms> haha
<theCore> it is wonderful how today discussions are related?
<theCore> :)
* sharms notes that the always -> auto issue was fixed online and in bug report
<LaserJock> my gosh, emacs is a mess
<theCore> really?
<LaserJock> reading the debian list
<theCore> link?
<LaserJock> emacs-snapshot is gone
<Fujitsu> Does always not bother to check if it's a path or something?
<theCore> hmm...
<LaserJock> then several other packages have to have their manuals stripped
<Fujitsu> That's emacs' job, LaserJock.
<Fujitsu> Non-freeness?
<LaserJock> yeah, GFDL
* theCore starts making some backups
<LaserJock> I wonder if FSF is trying to kill Debian or the other way around
<theCore> what a joke
<Fujitsu> What is it that makes the GFDL non-DFSG-free?
<theCore> that's certainly an insult to the upstream developers
<LaserJock> there is a section on invariant sections
<LaserJock> GFDL is not GPL compatible
<ajmitch> http://people.debian.org/~srivasta/Position_Statement.html
<theCore> not GPL compatible?
<theCore> you mean DFSG, no?
<LaserJock> no
<theCore> wtf...
<theCore> why FSF would make their documentation license incompatible with their software?
<sharms> because they want the BSD guys to look more rational
<ajmitch> because the people who matter at the FSF have a different view of documentation
<theCore> LaserJock: can I have a link to the thread in question?
<LaserJock> theCore: http://news.gmane.org/gmane.linux.debian.devel.emacsen
<theCore> thanks 
<LaserJock> they're fighting amongts themselves and upstream about Emacs22
<LaserJock> and in the end the emacs-snapshot maintainer just decides to quit
<sharms> oh I know what happened with Emacs documentation.  They made my bash changes and it fubar'd it up
<LaserJock> anyway, I wonder if how this will get resolved
<nixternal> thanks sharms :)
<LaserJock> as it is it seems like emacs may end up going to non-free
<nixternal> I set it to =auto and it works fine
<LaserJock> or the manuals will get stripped, which is pretty stupid
<ajmitch> LaserJock: yay
<crimsun> keybuk won't be happy, as he's an emacs user
<ajmitch> hi Burgundavia 
<ajmitch> crimsun: I use emacs a lot as well
<sharms> nixternal: ha my bash changes are ALPHA :)
<nixternal> not even, more like Microsoft ;p
<Burgundavia> hey ajmitch
<Burgundavia> crimsun: is there a known issue with xine crashing with dvds?
<LaserJock> it's just stupid, I thought GFDL was dfsg-free as long as it didn't contain any invariant sections
<crimsun> Burgundavia: err, do you mean xine-ui crashing on $certain dvds, or libxine?
<Burgundavia> crimsun: everything
<Burgundavia> xine, gxine, totem-xine, all crashing the same way
<theCore> so, where are the hackers at Debian are gone...
<Fujitsu> Everybody will just have to use vim. How terrible.
<ajmitch> LaserJock: well there was a GR about it :)
<ajmitch> http://www.debian.org/vote/2006/vote_001#outcome
<crimsun> Burgundavia: ok, I experienced that symptom continually until the region was set (to something other than 0) on newer hardware
<crimsun> Burgundavia: so I presume that the symptom means that the region on that dvd hardware is indeed set?
<LaserJock> ajmitch: yeah
<nixternal> OK, back up and rocking
<nixternal> theCore, Fujitsu, and ajmitch thanks for that one, and sharms fooey~
<nixternal> ;p
<nixternal> great AOL face there
<LaserJock> I found it, apparently emacs contains FDL docs *with* invariant sections :/
<nixternal> Kate rules them all
<sharms> nixternal: thanks for being a good alpha tester
<nixternal> haha
<nixternal> a Microsoft tester is more like it
<minghua> So basically emacs-snapshot's maintainer doesn't want to drop GFDL licensed manual from his package and therefore orphaned it?  Strange decision.
<sharms> they rejected my bash changes
<nixternal> now I know what Vista users have been feeling for 2 months
<Fujitsu> Hey minghua.
<ajmitch> LaserJock: that thread about moving emacs to non-free was from october
<Lathiat> crimsun: and it restarts itself?
<Lathiat> crimsun: ok thanks
<Lathiat> crimsun: killing init used to be frowned upon :P
<nixternal> moving emacs to non-free?
<bddebian> Gnight folks
<LaserJock> minghua: basically he'd either have to move emacs to non-free or strip it of documentation
<Lathiat> who needs documentation anyway
<LaserJock> he decided to give up completely and orphan it and ask that it be removed from the archives
<LaserJock> well, apparently there are a few commands that don't work without the documentation, go figure
<nixternal> LaserJock: what do you mean by moving emacs to non-free? I was busy breaking my system to follow, then got disconnected
<LaserJock> nixternal: the emacs documentation is GFDL with some invariant sections, so DFSG non-free
<LaserJock> so they were trying to figure out whether to keep it together and move the whole thing to non-free (and hence no in Debian)
<LaserJock> or split out the documenation and put just that into non-free
<LaserJock> looks like they did the latter
<nixternal> that is nuts
<nixternal> what is invariant about the sections?
<nixternal> GNU/Debian will have Stallman laid out in the lawn naked if they do that
<LaserJock> apparently they have something like the GPL or something
<Fujitsu> Why are there invariant sections in the docs? I'd say that would very obviously be non-free.
<LaserJock> and obviously they can't make that variant
<crimsun> nixternal: that's an awful mental pic
<nixternal> crimsun: that it is
<nixternal> I just made myself sick
<nixternal> oh wow, there is a post in the Debian Weekly News from 2003 that states exactly that
<Fujitsu> nixternal: Link?
<nixternal> http://www.debian.org/News/weekly/2003/22/
<nixternal> http://lists.debian.org/debian-emacsen/2003/05/msg00033.html
<nixternal> that is the original email
<ajmitch> all old news
<nixternal> ya, almost 4 years old
<LaserJock> bah, that's the kind of stuff I'm just not great with
<LaserJock> I'm all for freedom and open source, but geeze that gets on my nerves
<ajmitch> you're obviously not a True Believer
<LaserJock> ajmitch: certainly not
<LaserJock> well, I think I'm off to bed
<LaserJock> hopefully I'll have energy to show up again tomorrow
<LaserJock> it seems to be getting harder and harder each day
<zakame> hello
<crimsun> LaserJock: take the weekend off if you need it
<Laser_away> maybe
<crimsun> burning out on F/LOSS isn't healthy, either.
<nixternal> tell me about it
<nixternal> I am doing the crimsun right now, only a few hours until I start driving to the city, preparing for a talk, gettin' ready to win the botd
<nixternal> fun fun fun
<macogw> hey, i'm trying to learn to package, and i looked at the "requests" list and found a program i want to try packaging.  the last tarball for it is a year old, but there was a bug-fix a month ago in CVS.  how do i get the proper files from the cvs to use for it?
<RAOF> macogw: You've got two options.  You can take the last release, and add the patch from CVS as a part of the build process.
<RAOF> Alternatively, you can just checkout the CVS and build a package from that.
<RAOF> I *think* that the former method would be preferred, but you'd want to check with people who actually know first :)
<crimsun> yes, generally in that case, the former is preferred. It really depends on what has changed in cvs.
<macogw> the tar is 0.7 and the cvs is up to 1.12 so i'd assume there would be quite a few patches using the former way
<crimsun> oh, so "a bug-fix" is really a bug fix release?
<crimsun> I interpreted "a bug-fix" as a single fix.
<crimsun> or are you referring to the changeset id?
<crimsun> more context would help...
<macogw> well the most recent bug fix was a month ago, but i just looked at the setup.py which is commented as "version number increase" and it's 1.12
<macogw> the last tarball was 0.7 so i'm guessin there's a lot of in-betweens that happened
<macogw> ok actually i can see a bunch of changes
<macogw> so if there's a lot of stuff that changed, would it be best to grab the newest of each source file and put them all in a directory as if they were being unzipped?
<Burgundavia> crimsun: yes, correct region, plays fine on a windows laptop and with totem-gstreamer, just causes xine to crash
<crimsun> Burgundavia: which version of libdvdcss2?
<crimsun> hopefully 1.2.9
<Burgundavia> yep, from mediubuntu
<crimsun> do you have the retraced reports?
<Burgundavia> nah, haven't submitted a bug yet
<Burgundavia> crimsun: http://pastebin.ca/428075
<crimsun> does ejecting the disc and reloading help?
<Burgundavia> nope
<crimsun> tried a different drive?
<Burgundavia> laptop
<crimsun> it's likely crashing inside libdvd*
<macogw> Burgundavia: wait are you talking about when dvds sometimes randomly partway through a movie crash libdvdcss/libdvdread and then it pops up telling you that the dvd must have encryption so you should go install those libraries even though they're already installed?
<crimsun> no, this is on start.
<macogw> oh
<Burgundavia> macogw: naw, just completely dying
<Burgundavia> segfaulting
<macogw> i wonder if there's a bug report for what i described
<macogw> tried playing Dogma on Rav Tux (on the ubuntuforums) computer and it did that consistently about 2 minutes into the movie.  usually i can eject, start over, and get it working on my laptop
<macogw> Burgundavia: is this your bug? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/totem/+bug/25554
<ubotu> Malone bug 25554 in totem "totem locks immediately when a dvd is inserted in another dvd reader." [Medium,Fix released]  
<macogw> oh nevermind
<macogw> that's really old
<Burgundavia> nope, and this is a xine/dvdread/libcss bug, not a frontend specifici one
<macogw> Burgundavia: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mplayer/+bug/508 ?
<ubotu> Malone bug 508 in mplayer "Crashes when loading DVD" [Medium,Confirmed]  
<macogw> it was from hoary, workarounded for a while, came back in edgy, and now theyre asking if it exists in feisty
<macogw> ack no nvm
<macogw> i need to learn to read better
<Burgundavia> hmm, nope
<macogw> or sleep more than 2 hours a night ;)
<macogw> one guy said it was present in xine, but others said its mplayer-only
<joejaxx> anyone here have experience with reprepro?
<stgraber> About bug 85640, shall I wait for more people confirming the package or can I go, attach the debdiff and ask someone to upload ?
<ubotu> Malone bug 85640 in cryptsetup "[Feisty]  crypted root doesnt mount on start (cryptsetup)" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/85640
<stgraber> (As we are coming pretty close to the release date and it's just a two lines patch to a init.d script)
* Fujitsu runs from the dreaded crypto-root.
<Fujitsu> Seems to be /really/ reliable on Ubuntu.
* sacater stretches
<sacater> morning...
<jekil> hello
* sacater waves at jekil 
<soc> is there a place where i can see which packages are pending uvfe review?
<stgraber> Maybe here https://bugs.launchpad.net/~motu-uvf/
<soc> a thnaks!
<soc> thanks
<soc> are the bugs mentioned in http://ajmitch.net.nz/~ajmitch/missing-fixes-rc.html showstopper bugs or is there no priority to fix them before feisty?
<soc> does someone know it?
<DktrKranz> I think they are important bug which have to be fixed, don't know if they are showstopper, though
<soc> mh
<soc> ok
<soc> because hard freeze is approaching quite quickly
<DktrKranz> we are in main freeze, actually
<DktrKranz> but if there is a valid reason, perhaps an exception will be granted
<DktrKranz> I think this is the case, if critical bugs are solved
<Lutin> hi there
<DktrKranz> hi Lutin 
<Lutin> hi DktrKranz 
<Lutin> TheMuso: ping
<TheMuso> Lutin: You sent me a contentless ping.  This is a contentless pong.  Please provide a bit of information about what you want and I will respond when I am around.
<ajmitch> heh
<StevenK> TheMuso: You Mithrandir copycat.
<Lutin> :] 
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: Why does your RC bug list have those three mailcrypt ones on it?
* ajmitch shrugs
<ajmitch> ah that
<ajmitch> cvs vs CVS
<VirhYl3> Hi.  Are you guys going to get Urban Terror in Universe?
<Hobbsee> no
<VirhYl3> porque?
<Hobbsee> if it's not there now, it wont be for feisty
<Hobbsee> !feisty
<ubotu> The next version of Ubuntu (7.04; codenamed "Feisty Fawn") should be released in April 2007. Beta is out! http://www.ubuntu.com/news/Ubuntu704Beta Schedule: !schedule - Specifications (goals): https://features.launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/feisty - Help and support in #ubuntu+1 (NOT #ubuntu)
<Hobbsee> bah.  the schedule's not in that anymore
* Hobbsee doesnt understand porque
<VirhYl3> why not?
<VirhYl3> It's probably the best FPS out right now, and it works in Ubuntu.
<VirhYl3> I'd think you guys wanted something like that prioritized to work easily in synaptic for the n00bs.
<Hobbsee> why not to which?  upstream version freeze, feature freeze, beta freeze, and the fact that no one has submitted a package to debian and ubuntu yet
<Hobbsee> s#and#and/or#
<Hobbsee> VirhYl3: if you want to get involved, you're welcome to.
<VirhYl3> sure, how do I get involved?
<VirhYl3> I'm good in the gimp.
<Hobbsee> see the links in the topic
<Hobbsee> VirhYl3: ideally, we'd have everything done for everything.  but seeing as we've got <30 active developers working on ubuntu...and thousands of packages....
<Hobbsee> well, you do the maths
<VirhYl3> I see.
<VirhYl3> so what are the most important things being worked on atm?
<Hobbsee> bugfixing
<StevenK> *Release-critical* bugfixing
<VirhYl3> lol, naturally.
<Hobbsee> particualrly from the last link in the toipc, general bugfixing, making sure things are installable, etc.
<Hobbsee> the big freeze is on the 12th, then we'll be testing cds, i think
<StevenK> VirhYl3: We are 12 days from release, what do you expect?
<Hobbsee> no new packages, no new versions of existing packages, etc.
<VirhYl3> So if it's too late for Urban Terror, what's the next release that could have it in the repos?
<VirhYl3> is there a room for that one?
<StevenK> Feisty+1, whatever it's called
<Hobbsee> feisty+1 if anyone submits it, and worsk with the MOTU to get it up to standard
<VirhYl3> and submitting it is probably way over my head?
<Hobbsee> !revu
<ubotu> REVU is a web-based tool to give people who have worked on Ubuntu packages a chance to "put their packages out there" for other people to look at and comment on in a structured manner. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU
<shirish> Hobbsee: is there an announce list or something where one can come to know of packages coming onto universe, multiverse, I understand it might be a high-volume list
<Hobbsee> lists.ubuntu.com/feisty-changes is all the changes in the archive
<Hobbsee> dont think there's a sync list
<Hobbsee> the ubuntu-motu ML usually says the new packages coming into the distro release, but doesnt talk about the stuff coming from debian
<shirish> Hobbsee: I have subscribed to feisty-changes incidentally
<StevenK> It isn't going to help you much at this point.
<StevenK> Feisty is not going to have many changes this close to release.
<shirish> StevenK: that I know now, its so boring when everything is sorta working
<Hobbsee> also, the UWN tends to cover some of the more important new packages
* Hobbsee wonders if it's too early to file sync requests for feisty+2
* Hobbsee wonders if it's too early to file sync requests for feisty+1
<StevenK> I suspect so
<StevenK> ubuntu-archive might start disliking you. :-)
<Hobbsee> pity.  i'd like to see the new ksudoku.
<Hobbsee> hehe
<StevenK> Hobbsee: And sync it where? /dev/null?
<Hobbsee> better not have that, seeing as i'll meet a lot of them in spain
<StevenK> Heh
<Hobbsee> to feisty+1 archives.  of course.
<StevenK> Which don't exist.
* shirish wonders what UWN is about?
<StevenK> Ubuntu Weekly News
<StevenK> Do the math
<Hobbsee> StevenK: yet.
<StevenK> Hobbsee: Yes. Yet.
<shirish> StevenK: its a newsletter or what?
<shirish> !UWN
<ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about uwn - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
<shirish> @uwn
<StevenK> shirish: Yes.
<shirish> link please
<Hobbsee> jfgi.com
* Hobbsee notes that may or may not be coc-compliant
<StevenK> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuWeeklyNewsletter/
<Hobbsee> oh, argh.  that doesnt still exist
<StevenK> Muahaha
<shirish> oops, I have also subscribed to that one & also read that
<Hobbsee> you need the elongated form.
<shirish> guys although this might not be the place to ask for it or not, but is apport going to have new features, or it would just be bug-fixing from now on and any new features in 6 months time?
<bddebian> Heya gang
<ScottK> Heya bddebian
<bddebian> Hi ScottK
<joejaxx> bddebian2: do you know why openhackware does not have any binary packages?
<bddebian2> joejaxx: It's a PPC only package afaiui
<joejaxx> bddebian2: oh
<bddebian2> Sorry gotta run to the shower
<joejaxx> ok
<ScottK> We can still request syncs of a new Debian version (same upstream version) to fix bugs on ajmitch's RC bug list, right?
<Hobbsee> ScottK: think so, yeah
<ScottK> OK.  Thanks.
<ScottK> For anyone in UUS, Bug #104151 takes care of a bug on ajmitch's RC bug list.
<ubotu> Malone bug 104151 in sa-exim "Sync Reqeust - sa-exim 4.2.1-7 from debian sid main" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/104151
<Hobbsee> ScottK: done
<ScottK> Thanks.
<Hobbsee> :)
<DktrKranz> does anyone know if motu-mentors list has been implemented?
<Hobbsee> it hasnt as yet.  use this channel, or the standard MOTU ML
<Hobbsee> no point having a separate list if the mentors hasnt taken off yet
<DktrKranz> well, some times ago I was working on bug #93741
<ubotu> Malone bug 93741 in mtop "[can-not-install]  maintainer script failure" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/93741
<DktrKranz> is there a chance to review it or it's too late?
<DktrKranz> i forgot about it :(
<Hobbsee> no, that should be fine
<DktrKranz> good
<DktrKranz> there are plenty of them
<DktrKranz> so I can work on it
<DktrKranz> many of them require a similar patch
<shirish> Hobbsee:  is apport going to have new features, or it would just be bug-fixing from now on and any new features in 6 months time?
<Hobbsee> no new features for *anything* now.
<Hobbsee> shirish: therefore, no.
<shirish> Hobbsee: so most probably it would remain broken for some-time to come
<Hobbsee> dunno about how broken it is - looking at the bugtracker, it seems to be working very well
<shirish> Hobbsee: I have filed 2 bugs for it, if those are acted upon it would be an excellent tool to use
<sacater> whats the source unpackage command again? dpkg -x ?
<sacater> or something
<DktrKranz> dpkg-source -x filename.dsc
<sacater> DktrKranz: thanks
<shirish> Hobbsee: for e.g. see https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/apport/+bug/102868
<DktrKranz> :)
<ubotu> Malone bug 102868 in apport "apport should be mini-ftp client with resuming capabilities" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  
<shirish> Hobbsee: as well as this one #103611
* Hobbsee --> attention elsewhere
<shirish> bug #103611
<ubotu> Malone bug 103611 in launchpad "a progress bar on the site if uploading a crash file through firefox" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/103611
* Hobbsee notes that $mypetbugs often arent terribly important ones
* shirish understood but I would like to give the developers the maximum crash reports I can give.
<shirish> Hobbsee: something totally un-related, in overview for launchpad I do not have the bug symbol but something called support tracker what does that mean?
* Hobbsee points to the 20K open bugs in the bugtracker, so you could understand why $mypetbug wont get fixed immediately, if at all.
* Hobbsee shrugs
* Hobbsee --> attention elsewhere
* Hobbsee sighs
* Hobbsee doesnt actually deal in apport
<Hobbsee> but has anyone noticed that this place is *not* one to get your unconfirmed bugs without patches more attention?
<Hobbsee> neither is -bugs, etc?  especially during multiple freezes?
<sacater> hee hee, this is me with a crazy look http://omploader.org/file/IMG_0589.JPG
<sacater> and this is me with a little more sanity
<sacater> http://omploader.org/file/IMG_0595.JPG
<rmjb> Hey guys
<wick2o> ive created my own deb that uses debconf...is there a way to use default values pulled from debconf settings other then whats listed in your templates file?
<wick2o> for example if i want to read the netcfg/get_ipaddress and use it as a default value
<cheleb> Hi everybody! Is this the right place to propose/request packages of new hardware drivers?
<rmjb> cheleb: is the package available outside of the kernel? meaning can it be installed after the kernel or does it have to be bundled?
<cheleb> rmjb: I think it is available outside the kernel.
<cheleb> rmjb: http://www.avm.de/en/frame/frame.php?destination=http%3A%2F%2Fwebgw.avm.de%2Fdownload%2FDownload_en.jsp%3Flang%3Den%26os%3Dlinux%26product%3DFRITZ%21WLAN+USB+Stick%26category%3Dfritzbox
<rmjb> you can file a "needs-packaging" bug https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/Candidates
<cheleb> rmjb: It's a very popular USB Stick in Germany
<cheleb> rmjb: ah, ok! I will do so! Thanks
<LaserJock> any MOTUs around?
<ScottK> LaserJock: Just you I guess?
<LaserJock> ScottK: apparently
<LaserJock> hmmm, you would do though, mwuahahaha
<jussi01> shh... youll wake the sleeping motu...
<LaserJock> ScottK: I need a victim/volunteer for a Behind MOTU post, you up for it?
<ScottK> LaserJock: What does that involve (probably yes)?
<sacater> LaserJock: if i can i will :D
<ScottK> Well I can definitely tell we are in a hard freeze.  22 packages upgraded, 17 newly installed today </sarcasm>
<LaserJock> ScottK: I'll send you an email with questions. Sometime today. I gotta run some errands
<ScottK> LaserJock: No problem.  Depending on when I may not be able to answer until tomorrow if that's OK?
<LaserJock> ScottK: fine, I don't have a tight deadline ;-)
<ScottK> Great.  I'll look forward to it.
<ScottK> Oh, scott@kitterman.com if you don't have it handy.
<sacater> LaserJock: a while ago you linked me to a wiki page with feisty deadlines, what was it please
<ScottK> !schedule
<ubotu> Ubuntu releases a new version every 6 months. Each version is supported for 18 months to 5 years. More info at http://www.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/releases & http://wiki.ubuntu.com/TimeBasedReleases
<ScottK> sacater: Try https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FeistyReleaseSchedule
<sacater> thanks
<jdong> is there a way to "turn off" a USB port in Linux?
<jdong> like some magical sysfs value that tells the port not to respond to inserted devices?
<ScottK> I've done up a merge to fix some of ajmitch's RC bugs if anyone from UUS is available/interested.  It's Bug #104215.
<ubotu> Malone bug 104215 in python-numpy "python-numpy: Merge new debian version 1.0.1-8 from debian sid" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/104215
<ajmitch> morning
<ScottK> Good morning
<sharms> ajmitch: I did what you said and made a blog post to try and get more developers :)
* ajmitch looks to see the damage
<bddebian> Heya gang
<Burgundavia> hey bddebian
<bddebian> Heya Burgundavia
<ajmitch> hello bddebian, Burgundavia 
<Burgundavia> hey ajmitch
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<Adri2000> hi ajmitch
<Adri2000> ajmitch: would you sponsor an upload to main for me?
<sacater> where is the one they call pochu?
#ubuntu-motu 2007-04-08
<Adri2000> crimsun: hi, could you upload something to main for me please?
<Fujitsu> Isn't main incredibly frozen?
<Adri2000> yeah, but I got the approval from cjwatson
<crimsun> Adri2000: yes, url
<Adri2000> http://adrishost.homeip.net/~adri2000/ubuntu/devscripts_2.9.27ubuntu13.debdiff
<crimsun> Adri2000: could you amend that debdiff to state unequivocally in debian/changelog that you have approval from Colin, please?
<crimsun> that way there's no question
<Adri2000> "* Freeze exception approved by Colin Watson" ?
<crimsun> yes, that's sufficient
<Adri2000> ok
<Adri2000> done
<crimsun>   devscripts_2.9.27ubuntu13_source.changes: done.
<crimsun> Successfully uploaded packages.
<Adri2000> thanks
<LaserJock> hmm, so Etch seems like it's really going to happen :-)
<theCore> that's funny: http://www.ubuntu.com/node/6
<theCore> it seems they're using drupal
<theCore> maybe they should block public access to /blog/* and /node/* URL ...
<Fujitsu> LaserJock: I know! It's incredible. The release notes are even frozen, I believ.e
<LaserJock> Fujitsu: they're even getting release parties ready
<Fujitsu> I noticed, they all seem to be the 13th.
<Fujitsu> I'm unable to find a reason why that day was chosen.
<theCore> hmm... Friday 13th, Etch released? That sounds reasonable
<LaserJock> well, it'll be good to get it out
<LaserJock> I've actually got a fair amount of work that's been waiting since November or so
<Fujitsu> It's only 4 months since the probably release date.
<Fujitsu> *probable
<LaserJock> you can't rush genius ;-)
<LaserJock> that's interesting
<DktrKranz> :D
<LaserJock> so we basically did a whole release (edgy) in about the amount of time they delayed Etch
<Fujitsu> Heheh.
<LaserJock> it's fascinating
<crimsun> well, to be fair, at least Etch's packages will be installable...
<Fujitsu> True.
<LaserJock> exactly
* Fujitsu works on the RC bug list.
<LaserJock> I'm not saying it in a negative sense
<LaserJock> the work they do is amazing
<LaserJock> I just think it's interesting comparing the two distro's development styles
<LaserJock> we basically work on the same packages
<LaserJock> but do so differently
<LaserJock> I think I'm more of the Debian model myself
<Fujitsu> Are you saying you'd prefer to have a stable release? Impossible!
<LaserJock> I'm saying I don't really care about releases much
<LaserJock> I'd rather have a slow-n-steady, focused, release when it's ready, release
<minghua> I believe the targeted release date is tomorrow
<Fujitsu> minghua: Which means it probably will be the 13th.
<minghua> Fujitsu: huh?  how so?
<minghua> delay is of course a possibility
<Fujitsu> Since when does Debian release on a targeted release date?
<LaserJock> well, eventually it does
<LaserJock> it just gets "modified" several times as the time narrows
<minghua> well, in the past releases, when the RMs and the CD guys say "we'll release _tomorrow_", they usually do
<Fujitsu> Eventually... It was meant to be released on the 2nd.
<minghua> it's the "we'll release in two month" promises that are usually broken
<LaserJock> yeah, once *everything* is frozen there's not a lot you can do but release :-)
<LaserJock> exactly
<Fujitsu> There was the 20 day warning saying April 2nd.
<minghua> although sarge did have a brown paper bag release after one day
<Fujitsu> I guess a week after that isn't too bad.
<LaserJock> it's interesting though, we were expecting a flood of new upstream versions midway through Feisty
<LaserJock> but we almost released Feisty before Etch
<minghua> lesson: don't make assumptions based on Debian's release plan? :-)
<Fujitsu> Feisty+1 will be interesting as we get an enormous amount of new stuff from Debian.
<LaserJock> yeah
<LaserJock> how do I find the list of package maintained by a particular maintainer in Debian?
<minghua> aptitude should be able to do that, ~m or something
<LaserJock> I figured it out
<nrg88> when etch is out, testing will be stable, and unstable will be testing?
<nrg88> i mean the repos get relabeled?
<LaserJock> not exactly
<LaserJock> testing will become etch
<minghua> nrg88: no, stable, testing and unstable doesn't change at all
<minghua> hmm, scratch that
<minghua> let me think
<LaserJock> unstable is always unstable
<LaserJock> then testing will become lenny
<minghua> stable will point to etch, lenny will be created as a copy of etch and testing will point to that, unstable doesn't change at all and unstable still points to that
<minghua> I think I am correct this time
<Fujitsu> I believe minghua to be correct.
<LaserJock> yeah, that makes sense
<nrg88> so, ubuntu get's it's packages from testing?
<Fujitsu> And sarge will become oldstable or something.
<Fujitsu> nrg88: unstable
<LaserJock> unstable
<LaserJock> sometimes experimental
<Fujitsu> Or experimental sometimes.
<nrg88> this means feisty will have somewhat newer packages than etch?
<LaserJock> well, it might have some newer and some older
<LaserJock> generally they should be pretty close
<crimsun> crap, I completely missed the newer hugs source package
<crimsun> oh well, at least it'll be a sync in feisty+1
<LaserJock> anybody got much experienec with tex packages?
<bddebian> Yes, they are freakin' scary :-)
<nrg88> i heard about something like Grumpy Groundhog, as it would be the ubuntu version of the debian unstable pool, are there any plans to realise it?
<Fujitsu> That's waiting on Soyuz being competent... not for a long time yet.
<minghua> LaserJock: using, yes; hacking, no.
<minghua> it seems to me grumpy is becoming duke nukem forever of ubuntu...
<zul> heh you get what you paid for
<Fujitsu> I don't think it's going to happen within the next couple of years.
<Fujitsu> When's the DPL election happening?
<LaserJock> I had a completely crazy idea today of taking over tex maintainership in Ubuntu
<Fujitsu> LaserJock: You're insane.
<LaserJock> Fujitsu: well, it's going on right now
<Fujitsu> I had that idea once.
<Fujitsu> I looked at the packages and decided against it.
* bddebian shudders
<Fujitsu> They could do with a maintainer, though.
<LaserJock> yeah
<zul> LaserJock: you are quite sane
<LaserJock> tex's isn't maintained in Ubuntu
<LaserJock> has several Main packages
<minghua> Fujitsu: I just got the DPL result email
<LaserJock> and there's a pretty good upstream (Debian)
<LaserJock> minghua: oh, who won?
<Fujitsu> minghua: result?
<minghua> Sam Hocevar is the new DPL
<crimsun> The winner of the election is Sam Hocevar.
<zul> who?
<crimsun> he maintains the vlc packages, among many others.
<minghua> http://master.debian.org/~srivasta/leader2007/results.png
<minghua> zul: exactly my first impression as well...
<crimsun> he also wrote a very cool input fuzzer for testing various media players' tolerance of bad input
<crimsun> we'll finally be getting that with the sync from Debian
<crimsun> my software engineering sections in the fall will be using it to validate input
<nrg88> what's a DPL?
<crimsun> Debian Project Leader
<nrg88> oh
<crimsun> there are far too many bugs on the beryl-related source packages
<StevenK> Oh, wah
<Fujitsu> You don't say.
<DktrKranz> any UUS still awake?
* StevenK wonders where he placed Sam in his vote.
<Fujitsu> When I checked a week ago, they made up more then 3% of the {un,mult}iverse bugs.
<StevenK> Hrm. 7. Where 4 was None of the Above
<StevenK> Crap
<Fujitsu> What does the DPL actually do?
<minghua> poor StevenK the minority
<StevenK> Fujitsu: That's a loaded question. :-P
<minghua> Fujitsu: I suggest you read Debian constitution is you are truly interested
<StevenK> Yes, but that doesn't help much at all.
<LaserJock> the DPL does Debian stuff :-)
* Fujitsu grumbles at Debian politics.
<crimsun> well, regardless of what Debian politics may do, we still draw the vast majority of our source packages from Debian. I'd better get cracking on this alsa-lib issue.
<nrg88> it's 3:41 am here, so i better get some sleep ;)
<nrg88> goodbye
<jdong> LOL ash-fox
<jdong> joining the XP key club :)
<jdong> XP Pro 32-bit preactivation key, IIRC :)
<ScottK> LaserJock: Still waiting for that e-mail from you...
<rmjb> hello, is anyone here on a Saturday night?
<rmjb> or are all the MOTUs out partying?
<tonyyarusso> I'm here, but mostly useless.
<tonyyarusso> (and not a MOTU)
<rmjb> guess ubuntu has some happening MOTUs
<jdong> rmjb: and I'm here too, playing how many ways can one panic his computer while virtualizing game
<rmjb> I think the answer is 106 jdong :)
<jdong> lol I think I passed that :)
<rmjb> it's changed since I last tried then
* Fujitsu hides.
<jdong> ok, laundry machine is pinging me; time to go put clothes in dryer....
<Burgundavia> jdong: literally?
<jdong> Burgundavia: actually I am fingering the machine at a cmdline and inotifying me when it's done
<jdong> Burgundavia: but same basic concept ;-)
<Burgundavia> right
<rmjb> jdong: you'll have to let us know how you got an icmp stack on a washing machine
* Burgundavia has a bridge to sell somebody
<jdong> rmjb: lol don't ask me, they hooked up a computer to it and put a finger daemon on it
<rmjb> oh right, you're at MIT
<jdong> jdong@severance:~$ finger @laundry
<jdong>  Frylock (Washer 1) has been off for 50 minutes.
<jdong> and so on
<crimsun> good ole alsa-lib madness. Glee!
<bddebian> :-)
<crimsun> does anyone here running current Feisty have a USB Audio device?
<Burgundavia> I can have one in my hands for tomorrow
<crimsun> ok, I'm trying for tonight (i.e., within the next couple hours), though, so I can ping cjwatson for a freeze exception
<bddebian> not I, sorry
<Burgundavia> crimsun: if you want, I can get one easily, just need to go to teh office
<ScottK> bddebian: Up for a look at a merge?
<bddebian> Possibly, I'm doing some work, work atm :-(
<ScottK> It's Bug #104215 if you (or someone else) has time...
<ubotu> Malone bug 104215 in python-numpy "python-numpy: Merge new debian version 1.0.1-8 from debian sid" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/104215
<crimsun> Burgundavia: it's really up to you. Don't put yourself out for it, though. :)
<Burgundavia> I want to go biking anyway
<crimsun> I'll test the changes locally in about an hour, too, when I get back to the office.
<crimsun> Burgundavia: bug 104130
<ubotu> Malone bug 104130 in alsa-lib "USB-Audio.conf uses the card_name function, which is not defined" [High,Needs info]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/104130
<Burgundavia> crimsun: pretty much all I need to do is to dump that conf file in?
<crimsun> Burgundavia: yep, replace the existing file with the one I linked to
<crimsun> Burgundavia: then attempt to use the USB Audio device
<Burgundavia> ok
<crimsun> offline for coffee. This is going to be a strenuous 12 days.
<Burgundavia> ok
<StevenK> ScottK: Has anyone looked at your merge?
<RAOF> Heya Hobbsee
<ScottK> StevenK: Not that I know of.
<ScottK> StevenK: bddebian said he might get to it later, but that's it.
<bddebian> I'm working on it, sheesh
<ScottK> StevenK: I take that back.  He's working on it.
<bddebian> :-)
<Hobbsee> hey RAOF 
<bddebian> ScottK: I'm a little confused.  We currently have -1, the bug asks for -8 from Debian and your merge says -5 ??
<ScottK> Argh.
<ScottK> bddebian: Seems I was a little confused too.  I didn't check closely enough what the merge script gave me.
<ScottK> No wonder some things didn't make sense.  I'll go do it over with the current version.
<jdong> does the gdebi satisfydepends not check build-dep version?
<jdong> hmm yeah, seems like it's that way
<jdong> I just bumped up kdelibs-dev to >= 9999:9999 and it built :D
<bddebian> ScottK: NP, thx
<LaserJock> ScottK: argg, sorry. Busy with Easter. I'll send it soon
<ScottK> LaserJock: Understand.  I'm waiting for the kids to be asleep, then I'll be busy too.
<ScottK> bddebian: I uploaded a revised debdiff.  I'm still test building the binary, but at least it's a diff of the correct version now.
<LaserJock> ScottK: sent
<ScottK> LaserJock: I didn't get it yet, but I use greylisting, so it's no suprise.  I'll keep an eye out for it.
<rmjb> I have a question about upstream source
<ScottK> !ask
<ubotu> Don't ask to ask a question. Just ask your question :)
<rmjb> if they only provide it in a .zip file is that ok?
<LaserJock> sure, either repack it as a tar.gz or unpack it in rules
<rmjb> so i'll just modify the packaging of their source, but not the source, because the zip file also contains one folder called <package>, i.e. without the -<version>
<ScottK> bddebian: Looks like the revised debdiff for Bug#104215 is good to go if you have time for another look.
<Burgundavia> Hobbsee: you around?
<Hobbsee> Burgundavia: yes
<Burgundavia> Hobbsee: want to write a couple of sentences on ubuntu women for the UWN?
<Hobbsee> Burgundavia: not overly.  i'm not terribly involved, tbh.
<Burgundavia> ok, just wondering
<Hobbsee> i'm not sure i could say something as a representative of the group, hardly being involved
<Hobbsee> elkbuntu: might, though
<Burgundavia> she promised stuff but has not delivered. Isuspect an attack of RL
<Hobbsee> ahh
<crimsun> Hobbsee: nice work on #104328 :-)
<Hobbsee> crimsun: that the PEBKAC OMG A COOKIE!!!! bug?
<crimsun> yeah
<Hobbsee> heh.
* Hobbsee thinsk that the "report a bug" link needs to be harder to find.  or removed.  NOW.
<ScottK> Hobbsee: I think you were remarkably restrained in your response on that bug.
<Hobbsee> ScottK: hehe
<LaserJock> it's almost gibberish
* Hobbsee has finally gotten sick of the "is x going to change in feisty?" and so has said that it's almost final in the topic.
<Hobbsee> indeed
<crimsun> I'm not sure how ~/.mozilla/ is incredibly hidden, but maybe I'm just obtuse.
<bddebian> ScottK: Building now (had to play Easter bunny) :-)
<Hobbsee> crimsun: hehe
<Hobbsee> crimsun: but it's a hidden file!  it's very hidden!
<ScottK> bddebian: Great.  I'm going to go take care of that (Easter bunny) soon.
<tonyyarusso> /usr/lib/share/confusing/lightning/tennis/applesauce/mouse/config/X73ffQ/kernel/critical/system/.you_had_a_bug_you_say?
<bddebian> hehe
<LaserJock> well, we could always send it to /dev/null
<LaserJock> that's kinda hidden
<Hobbsee> that'd be nice
<ScottK> http://www.paulgraham.com/microsoft.html - The headline is "Microsoft is Dead".
<rmjb> ScottK: I skimmed that article... he didn't mention open source... afais
<ScottK> No, it was corporate oriented, but interesting none the less.  Google wouldn't be Google without Free Software.
<bddebian> Google killed Microsoft? heh
<bddebian> I wish I was that kind of dead
<bddebian> ScottK: Uploaded
<ScottK> Cool.  Thanks.
<ScottK> LaserJock: Just sent you a reply.  How's that?
<rmjb> in bzr it says 'you can use revert to "undelete" a file by name'
<rmjb> but when I try I'm getting: bzr: ERROR: Path(s) are not versioned: docs
<bddebian> Gnight folks
<rmjb> g'night bddebian
<RAOF> rmjb: Well, bzr revert will only work for things which you've previously "bzr add"ed to your branch.
<RAOF> Although, on reflection, your question's probably a bit more sane than I though.
<rmjb> yeah I had them in... they're in the diff of the last commit... just can't get it back
<rmjb> guess I had to bzr remove before deleting the file??
<RAOF> No, I don't think so, from memory.
<RAOF> You should be able to just "bzr revert" on its own to get rid of all local changes since your last commit.
<rmjb> want to keep those changes, just want back a file I deleted before the last commit...
<rmjb> there's not good scenario documentation for bzr I've found
<RAOF> Ok, so "bzr revert -r 1 bar" works.
<rmjb> not that I've looked extensively, but I've looked
<rmjb> r 1 being the revision number
<RAOF> Aaaah.
<rmjb> ?
<RAOF> So, what happens is: "bzr revert bar" works if that's a part of the changes in the working tree.
<rmjb> that last line was a question
<LaserJock> ScottK: great thanks
<RAOF> Oh, yes.  r 1 is a revision.
<rmjb> bzr revisions 0 count or start from 1?
<RAOF> rmjb: And if you've *committed* the delete of "bar", you need to specify the revision in which bar exists
<RAOF> bzr log tells me they start at 1
<ScottK> LaserJock: I should have asked before...  Where does that get published?
<jdong> rmjb: the first committed revision is 1
<LaserJock> ScottK: planet.ubuntu.com
<jdong> rmjb: IIRC revision 0 is understood as the Blank Revision (tm)
<ScottK> LaserJock: Would you please let me know when it's up.
<rmjb> I call the first committed version "Initial versions" :)
<rmjb> thanks RAOF it worked
<RAOF> NP.
* RAOF likes bzr :)
* rmjb still has to get accustomed to revision control systems
<rmjb> there's something afoot with bzr and packaging?
<rmjb> will that documentation be out soon?
<RAOF> There's bzr-builddeb.  I'll have to look into that
<Hobbsee> !bzr
<ubotu> bzr is Bazaar-NG, a decentralized revision control system designed to be easy for developers and end users alike. Decentralized revision control systems give people the ability to work over the internet using the bazaar development model.
<Hobbsee> bah.  w.u.c/BZR is useful
<micahcowan> !seen doko
<ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about seen doko - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
<Hobbsee> micahcowan: /msg seenserv help
<sharms> ugh
<sharms> I hate it when I get "fanboys" so to speak
<micahcowan> Huh. Didn't ubotu used to have that feature, at some point?
<sharms> it is kind of creepy when you don't know someone and they try to just talk to you forever
<Hobbsee> micahcowan: it used to, ages ago
<Hobbsee> sharms: make sure you never do ops here.
<Hobbsee> it's annoying when they do what you said
<Hobbsee> it's creepy when they do that, and try to hit on you.
<micahcowan> omg, sharms? Is that you! Oh /wow/! Big, BIG fan! ^_^
<sharms> no this guy started pm'ing me, and I made the mistake of responding
<sharms> Hobbsee: yeah but atleast you are friendly.  I am a troll
<crimsun> enough people hate the sound subsystem that I never have fans :-D
<sharms> as to why someone would entertain a conversation with me is beyond me
<sharms> crimsun: I am a fan
<Hobbsee> sharms: i just ignore people eventually.  
<crimsun> crap, better change my nick
<sharms> no its ok, I am outside of your house
<crimsun> lies, I'm at my office.
<sharms> lol
<micahcowan> crimsun, as if you had actually /written/ the sound subsystem, not just maintaining it on Ubuntu (I'm assuming, anyway...)
<crimsun> micahcowan: if I had written it, it'd be much more poorly written /and/ maintained
<Burgundavia> sharms: you might want to lay off on some of your blog posts, they tend towards too trollish at times
<micahcowan> Heh, now I'm curious.
<sharms> Burgundavia: I appreciate your constructive criticism :)
<Burgundavia> sharms: if they cause me to wince, I will let you know
<sharms> I have some weird opinions since I am a bit radical when it comes to offending people, and my views on free software licenses
<crimsun> myriad opinions are good.
<rmjb> is apache1 to be deprecated in feisty? like php4?
<jdong> sharms: I usually love your blog posts, but I felt a bit uneasy by your one-liner link to the BCM thing....
<crimsun> crimsun@Box:~$ apt-cache madison apache{,2} |grep Sources
<crimsun>     apache | 1.3.34-4.1 | http://archive.ubuntu.com feisty/universe Sources
<crimsun>    apache2 | 2.2.3-3.2build1 | http://archive.ubuntu.com feisty/main Sources
<crimsun> rmjb: answer your question?
<jdong> sharms: you did explain yourself to a slight degree in the comments; would've been more appropriate if you started by making the blog post a paragraph reflection on the incident, adding a bit more insight than just a link :-/
<rmjb> crimsun: yes, my real question is, php5 available for apache1? I don't see a libapache-mod-php5
<crimsun> rmjb: no binaries currently
<sharms> jdong: I could not intelligently compose my argument at that time so I figured I would just link it.  It is all relative though; almost everyone in the Ubuntu community was against my view on that, and everyone in the BSD community was for it
<crimsun> rmjb: whether there are sources requires a bit of legwork into the NEW queue (I doubt there are)
<rmjb> crimsun: well I guess that means anyone that wants php5 webapps in feisty will *have* to use apache2... no probs I guess
<RAOF> Hm.  Is there any way to *unsubscribe* u-u-s to a bug?  A second bug has a new debdiff which fixes both bugs?
<Hobbsee> RAOF: you cant.  i can.
<Hobbsee> RAOF: bug #?
<RAOF> bug #98587
<ubotu> Malone bug 98587 in specto "[apport]  specto crashed with NameError in update()" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/98587
<Hobbsee> or otherwise reject it, so it'll go off the listing
<jdong> sharms: That's cool; I'm just saying my first assessment of the post was trying to fuel the flames, and it doesn't seem like I'm alone in that.
<Hobbsee> RAOF: and where's the fixable one?
<RAOF> (And the new bug #103722)
<ubotu> Malone bug 103722 in specto "specto crashes when monitoring file changes" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/103722
<sharms> jdong: gotcha
<Hobbsee> RAOF: you're confident this fixes the bugs?
<jdong> sharms: thanks for listening to my opinion on it :)
<sharms> jdong: The less I bug people the more everyone can focus on bugs
<RAOF> Hobbsee: Yes.  The first one is trivial, the second one I've tested as thoroughly as I can.
<Hobbsee> RAOF: cool.  i'll just upload it, then
<jdong> sharms: haha, that's a good thing then :D
<RAOF> Hobbsee: Ta muchly
* Hobbsee installs dpatch, and tries again.
<Hobbsee> RAOF: error.
<Hobbsee> dpkg-source: error: Version number suggests Ubuntu changes, but Maintainer: does not have Ubuntu address
<Hobbsee> please update the diff
<Hobbsee> (debdiff)
<jdong> ah, everyone's favorite :)
<RAOF> Argh!  Why has it been building locally then :(.
<Hobbsee> RAOF: you've got a script fixing it?
<RAOF> None that I've made myself.  Unless devscripts has one that automatically gets run, or something.
<Hobbsee> motutools does
<Hobbsee> didnt think devscripts did
<RAOF> Hm.  rm'ing a mono tree takes some time.
<RAOF> Ok, I can't even *see* a motutools package :)
<ScottK> RAOF: You didn't happen to build the source package on an Edgy box did you?
<RAOF> Nope
<RAOF> Feisty box, and a feisty pbuilder
<ScottK> Hmmm.  If they're current, it should have caught that one.
<Hobbsee> RAOF: it's not in ubuntu :P
* Hobbsee wonders if one can just remove one of the binaries from the archive...
<Hobbsee> and if amd64 for a package doesnt build, why not use arch all without amd64 (whatever the syntax is)
* RAOF wonders what Hobbsee is talking about
<Hobbsee> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/supercollider/+bug/32460
<ubotu> Malone bug 32460 in supercollider "Please remove stale AMD64 supercollider binaries." [Medium,Confirmed]  
<jdong> Hobbsee: I think it's a soyuz bug that the only removal that can be done is a total source+bin removal
<RAOF> Hobbsee: Attach a fixed debdiff to the bug again?
<Hobbsee> jdong: true, but every time that the source is built, it attempts to build an amd64 version, which is silly
<Hobbsee> RAOF: yep
* RAOF double-checks that it builds in a Feisty pbuilder
<rmjb> g'night everyone
<ScottK> Hobbsee: I looked at the control file for supercollider and it looked to my untrained eye like some of the binary packages were still for all architectures.
* Hobbsee waits
<Hobbsee> ScottK: that's what i would have thought.  i'm wondering why
<RAOF> I suppose the "control contains no Original-Maintainer field" warning can be ignored, as there *is* no original maintainer.
<Hobbsee> true
<Hobbsee> but the later error cant
* Hobbsee notes that you could be the maintainer of that, if you wanted
* RAOF plans to.
<Hobbsee> :)
<Fujitsu> Hobbsee: You need to talk to an archive admin about getting Packages-arch-specific or similar updated, to exclude amd64 for that...
<ScottK> Hobbsee: It seems to me that the premise of that bug "This binary has not been built from the source (by direction from debian/control) since..." is incorrect.  It's only true for some of the binary packages.
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: i thought you could specify which arches to build in the control
<Hobbsee> but that would stop it's autosync from debian
<Fujitsu> I don't believe you're meant to.
<ScottK> Time for me to go play Easter bunny and go to bed.  Good night all.
<Fujitsu> Night ScottK.
<RAOF> Hobbsee: New debdiff uploaded
<Hobbsee> RAOF: done
<RAOF> Yay!
<Hobbsee> yay, less bugs for u-u-s
<RAOF> Thinking of maintaining packages in Debian, a bunch of the motu are DD's as well, right?
<Fujitsu> Yep.
<RAOF> What do you use to actually *test* your packages?  A Sid chroot?  A full Sid install?
* RAOF hopes he's using the right terminology :-/
<elkbuntu> Burgundavia, i said to go to pleia2 in my email
<Burgundavia> elkbuntu: hmm, ah
<Hobbsee> RAOF: either.  both.
* Hobbsee isnt a DD
<RAOF> But you maintain upstream packages?  I suppose my question is really: "is a Sid chroot enough to properly test packages?"
<Fujitsu> I maintain one package.
<elkbuntu> Burgundavia, keep in mind this is easter weekend, so people are not necessarily available. i myself have hardly touched my pc the past 3 days
<Fujitsu> I generally try it in a chroot, but I have a VM of sid too.
<RAOF> I suppose I could check out how to get KVM running on this C2D :)
<LaserJock> ScottK: ok, well it's published, will probably take a few minutes to hit planet
<ajmitch> LaserJock: yay, another round of Behind MOTU!
<joejaxx> lol
<crimsun> hey, when is ajmitch going to appear on B.M.? :-)
<joejaxx> what is bm?
<crimsun> see the line directly above your "lol"
<joejaxx> ohh lol
<joejaxx> :)
<Burgundavia> elkbuntu: pah, RL
<crimsun> yeah, I much prefer the alternate reality of Launchpad and angry users
<LaserJock> crimsun: don't worry, I'll get to him ... and you
<crimsun> crap, better run away then.
<LaserJock> hehe
<LaserJock> they aren't that bad
<joejaxx> what does the versioning for a backport look like?
<LaserJock> I think it usually has a ~<release> in it
<joejaxx> oh ok
<LaserJock> like 1.2-3ubuntu4~edgy5 or something like that
<joejaxx> ah
<LaserJock> i could be totally wrong though
<RAOF> No, that's the versioning scheme on the backports I've seen.
<crimsun> ajmitch: how do you feel about syncing libipoddevice and ipod-sharp from Debian experimental (part of the stack for a Banshee 0.12.1 merge)?
* RAOF excitedly goes to check whether 0.12.1 fixes any bugs he cares about
* Hobbsee jawdrops
* Hobbsee picks up her jaw off the floor again
* Hobbsee dusts it off, and declares it as good as new...
<LaserJock> ?
<RAOF> Not that I'm against dusting off jawbones.
<RAOF> But I'm with LaserJock here.  What? :)
* Hobbsee had no idea that ScottK was that old
<crimsun> IRC is the great age equaliser ;-)
<Hobbsee> ScottK: about the spec @ S/MIME support for kmail out of the box - if you figure otu what it requires, etc, email me
* LaserJock thinks Hobbsee needs to sweep the floors so she doesn't get any dirt in her mouth
* Hobbsee is not the sweeper lady
* Hobbsee keeps teasing her supervisor about that :P
* RAOF thinks a bit of dirt is good for the immune system
<LaserJock> I'm the sweeper dude in my house
* Hobbsee keeps having to avoid the end of the broom, too :D
* RAOF is wondering how finding the roots of a real quadratic can be worth 30% of a first year algebra test
<LaserJock> but yeah, I need to interview some young'ins next time or people will think we are just a bunch of old farts
<crimsun> william seems as good a candidate ;-)
<Hobbsee> RAOF: heh.  that's....odd...
<RAOF> The first set of papers I marked, I followed the marking scheme, which said "2 marks".  However, the test itself says 3 marks :(
<Hobbsee> heh
<RAOF> I had to go back and... I just don't know how to award a mark between 1 and 3 :(
<jussi01> morning motu's!
<Hobbsee> hi jussi01!
* RAOF slinks off to the back of the room
* Hobbsee pulls RAOF back into the limelight
<Hobbsee> RAOF: fixed democracyplayer yet?
<joejaxx> lol
* jussi01 waves to Hobbsee 
* Fujitsu drops something on crimsun.
<RAOF> Hobbsee: :P
<crimsun> is that a shiny new laptop on my feet?
<Hobbsee> no.  it's an echidna.
<Fujitsu> Of course.
<crimsun> oh crap, it has HDA.
<jussi01> echidna...lol
<RAOF> Last time I checked, fixing the dbus problem merely exposed a problem with their python extension modules.
<Hobbsee> is ti worth fixing that much?
<crimsun> RAOF's definitely in the limelight; he's listed on Banshee's contributors.
* Fujitsu shall be 16 in 13 days. Yay!
<RAOF> *I* don't use it.
<Fujitsu> I'm almost not stupidly young!
<Hobbsee> RAOF: heh
<RAOF> Yeah, that was a very simple patch.  I like cdparanoia :)
<RAOF> Hobbsee: I only started touching democracyplayer because I thought that dbus error should be trivial to fix :(
<Hobbsee> awww
<RAOF> Well, that and all the bugs were obviously duplicates. :)
<Hobbsee> hehe
<crimsun> do we need a new checkout from upstream to fix them [if they're fixed upstream] ?
<crimsun> quite a few people seem to try to use it
<RAOF> I think upstream *may* have fixed it.
<jussi01> bug 102675 anyone know if it will be fixed for release?
<ubotu> Malone bug 102675 in netbase "Feisty boot hangs on "Configuring network interfaces"" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/102675
<Fujitsu> I'd certainly hope so.
<jussi01> so would i... :D
<RAOF> Aaah, of course.  Why *should* there be a version between 0.9.2 and 0.9.5 :(
<ajmitch> crimsun: I'm fine with banshee stuff
<Fujitsu> It isn't milestoned, strangely.
* ajmitch has touched those packages enough to know they won't break much 
* RAOF tries building the newest upstream release
<crimsun> ajmitch: ok, shall I file UVF exception requests for those three source packages (incl. banshee), or will your ACK and mine here on IRC suffice?
<crimsun> ignore that, I'm a dufus.
<crimsun> (the former two need UVFes anyhow because of syncs)
<ajmitch> besides, slomo is the maintainer in debian, so I know they should work ok on feisty
<crimsun> precisely
<jussi01> are there any ops in here... I want my factoid changed dammit!!! :P
<joejaxx> jussi01: no that is #ubuntu-ops
<joejaxx> :P
<jussi01> ok...thanks joejaxx 
<joejaxx> you are most welcome :)
<ajmitch> crimsun: do what you wish, I'm fine with ACK by IRC
<LaserJock> crimsun, ajmitch: what do you guys think of turning MOTU Mentors into a mailing list?
<crimsun> I'm fine with that
<micahcowan> what is it now?
<micahcowan> Oh, the "sign up for a mentor" thing?
<crimsun> OTOH, does it really lower the bar for increased community involvement?
<LaserJock> no
<LaserJock> I'm just thinking it might be a better place to encourage learning
<jussi01> could someone remind me how to install pbuilder correctly?? I just reinstalled and need to get everthing working again...
<crimsun> jussi01: ``aptitude install pbuilder''?
<crimsun> LaserJock: it seems like a viable venue, certainly
<jussi01> crimsun, isnt there more extra config than that?
<LaserJock> I was thinking a MOTU School/MOTU Mentors ML combo might be good
<LaserJock> it just seems like people aren't asking packaging questions on ubuntu-motu
<LaserJock> jussi01: http://tiber.tauware.de/~laserjock/pbuilder-ubuntu
<Hobbsee> !pbuilder | jussi01 
<ubotu> jussi01: pbuilder is a system to easily build packages in a clean chroot environment. To get started with PBuilder, see http://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto
<crimsun> LaserJock: not very much, no. Will creating an extra mailing assuage that?
<jussi01> LaserJock, thank you!!!!!
<Hobbsee> crimsun: what's OTOH?  
<crimsun> on the other hand
<LaserJock> crimsun: I think it might if it's understood that that is the place to ask packaging questions
<Hobbsee> crimsun: ahhh
<LaserJock> I'm assuming that a lot of people just think they'll get flamed or something -devel'ish
<LaserJock> jussi01: you need to put that in your path somewhere and rename it pbuilder-feisty or whatever
<jussi01> ok, what exactly does it do?
<Hobbsee> the school seemed good
<ajmitch> LaserJock: a list is fine by me
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: +1 at the lack of packaging questions on -motu ML
* ajmitch looks for new blood to flame
<LaserJock> jussi01: it's just a script that runs pbuilder. You can copy it to pbuilder-<release> to have multiple pbuilders
<jussi01> LaserJock, when I first started coming here I didnt want to ask cause I was scared I would sound *really* stupid...now I know I do...:P
* Hobbsee flames ajmitch 
* ajmitch grabs some marshmallows
<LaserJock> well, it's ok to sound stupid I guess, as long as you're trying
<ajmitch> I manage to sound stupid 95%+ of the time
<ajmitch> so don't feel like you're alone
<LaserJock> I'm certain that I sounded like I wasn't the brightest crayon in the box ;-)
<crimsun> that is, "trying to learn", not "trying to sound stupid" :-)
<Hobbsee> jussi01: you're pretty much OK as long as you're actually willing to do some work, not expecting to get spoonfed all the time (which you dont, dont worry), and not coming in here just to go "when will you put $mypetapp in the repos, and fix $mypetbug OMG I REPORTED IT A MONTH AGO, AND IT'S STILL NOT FIXED!!!  UBUNTU SUX@@@!!!!eleventyone!!!
<LaserJock> yes, sorry 
<joejaxx> Hobbsee: LOl
<LaserJock> but the -motu traffic is certainly not representitive of what goes on here
<Hobbsee> some people dont seem to get that wand waving doesnt work here...
<ajmitch> joejaxx: that's sadly only a minor embellishment on reality
<Hobbsee> joejaxx: i've seen a whole group in here, in the past week, doing that
<LaserJock> or of the number of packages we're responsible for
<PF-Away> omg, why isn't bug #1 fixed???eleventyone UBUNTUSUX
<ubotu> Malone bug 1 in ichthux "Microsoft has a majority market share" [Critical,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/1
<joejaxx> ajmitch: Hobbsee wow :\
<jussi01> Hobbsee, yeah, I know what you mean, its funny cause I feel stupid when someone tells me something and Im like huh? what? I still dont understand... where do I put that command?
<Hobbsee> jussi01: but you're still trying, adn we can see that.  rather htan just trolling
<jussi01> :)
<ajmitch> whereas I just merrily troll :)
<jussi01> btw, I need a "how to" for chroot in feisty - I tried to follow a dapper one but i got all confused. 
<minghua> ajmitch: still better than bitterly trolling, I suppose :-)
<joejaxx> jussi01: you want to create a chroot?
<ajmitch> minghua: oh I can do bitter if you want
<ajmitch> I've had *lots* of practice
<LaserJock> bitter is ajmitch's middle name
<jussi01> joejaxx, yeah... so I dont screw up my system again...
<ajmitch> LaserJock: yep
<minghua> wouldn't that make him abmitch?
* Fujitsu fails to think up a domain name.
<joejaxx> jussi01: here is the basic syntax
<joejaxx> sudo deboostrap <release> /path/to/put/chroot
<joejaxx> so if you wanted a feisty chroot
<joejaxx> sudo debootstrap feisty /home/joejaxx/feisty
<LaserJock> minghua: darn it, when I read that my mind just transposed the "b" and "m". that's no good
<joejaxx> then you want to mount the important stuff
<joejaxx> sudo mount -t proc none ~/feisty/rpco
<ajmitch> LaserJock: bad
<joejaxx> sudo mount -t proc none ~/feisty/prof
<joejaxx> bah
<PF-Away> proc
<joejaxx> sudo mount -t proc none ~/feisty/proc
<PF-Away> :D
<jussi01> :)
<joejaxx> sudo mount -t sysfs none ~/feisty/sys
<LaserJock> ajmitch: I know :(
<joejaxx> sudo mount -t devpts none ~/feisty/dev/pts
<minghua> LaserJock: don't read too fast :-P
<jussi01> joejaxx, thats all?
<joejaxx> jussi01: then the finally command to enter the chroot is
<joejaxx> sudo chroot ~/feisty
<jussi01> joejaxx, thank you very much!!!!!!!
<joejaxx> jussi01: oh btw
* jussi01 saves this conversation...
<jussi01> joejaxx, yea?
<joejaxx> jussi01: once you are in the chroot you probably want to do
<joejaxx> export HOME=/root
<joejaxx> and
<joejaxx> export LC_ALL=C
<joejaxx> it will save you trouble later :P
<joejaxx> jussi01: you are most welcome :)
<jussi01> thanks
<joejaxx> :)
<jussi01> anyway, got to go, thanks again motu's talk later. 
<joejaxx> alright
<geser> jussi01: you might want to look at schroot which helps you with starting your chroot (mounting the necessary parts, etc.)
<jussi01> geser, do I have to do those commands everytime I want to use it?
<joejaxx> i would love to have a System z9 mainframe
<joejaxx> that would be great
<DarkMageZ> where would be the best place to talk about the kde4 packages?
<elkbuntu> new launchpad is mean.. i cant see where to submit specs for the UDS :(
<geser> jussi01: if you keep the parts mounted after you leave the chroot, you only need to do it once
* Fujitsu watches the angry hordes trample DarkMageZ.
<geser> schroot mounts it for you and unmount it after use
<jussi01> geser, is there a reson I should unmount them? also what about after a restart, I asume they dont automatically mount...
<joejaxx> elkbuntu: you are right
<joejaxx> elkbuntu: i cannot see where to add them either
<DarkMageZ> Fujitsu, why exactly would that happen?
<PF-Away> DarkMageZ: in the future
<elkbuntu> joejaxx, was i hallucinating, or was it possible with old launchpad?
* jussi01 got distracted and is still here :D
<geser> jussi01: there is no reason besides keeping the mount output clear, and you need to do the mounts after a reboot or you put them in /etc/fstab
<DarkMageZ> PF-Away, hmm, there are new packages available in universe for kde4 test release.
<joejaxx> elkbuntu: it was definitely possible
<elkbuntu> joejaxx, ok... maybe they added a 'shutoff' option? :(
<Fujitsu> elkbuntu: Is there a `Propose for sprint' link in the actions portlet of the spec? That's where I'd expect to do it.
<jussi01> geser, ok, can you tell me how to set up this schroot thing?
<elkbuntu> Fujitsu, no
<joejaxx> elkbuntu: i do not know but this is weird
<elkbuntu> Fujitsu, that's where i looked, and i've examinated all pages linked there for any way, but no
<geser> jussi01: you created your chroot with debootstrap?
* elkbuntu wonders if there's anyone awake in #launchpad to harass
<LaserJock> elkbuntu: I think there might be a bug report about that but i'm not certain
<jussi01> yeah, as joejaxx said
* jussi01 points up 
<geser> jussi01: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/14547/ is my schroot.conf (without the comments)
<geser> I can change with "schroot -p" into my chroot I use for package building or with "schroot -p -c ubuntu-i386" into the chroot with firefox in 32bit and flash
<jussi01> geser, ok, except for the user, I could use that, is that correct?
<geser> yes, and the path to your chroot (location)
<jussi01> and where does the schroot.conf hide...
<LaserJock> in /etc/shchroot/ I think
<elkbuntu> LaserJock, cant find such a bug
<LaserJock> s/shchroot/schroot/
<imbrandon> ello all
<LaserJock> elkbuntu: hmm, better report it then :-)
<LaserJock> imbrandon!!!
<jussi01> hmm.. I dont seem to have that...
<imbrandon> LaserJock!!
<LaserJock> jussi01: did you install schroot?
<elkbuntu> LaserJock, how do we know they just didnt disable it?
<LaserJock> why in the world would the disable specs?
<imbrandon> mmmm pidgin, what a name
<LaserJock> yeah, odd
<joejaxx> that might be the case
<joejaxx> imbrandon: yeah that is what i thought
<LaserJock> I seriously doubt they disabled specs, especially now
<elkbuntu> it's an appropriate name
* imbrandon looks at who's gonna make the transition , since its a leagle thing we should probably do it for feisty
<LaserJock> really? I wouldn't think so
* jussi01 fells dumb..again...
<LaserJock> can they go back in time and rename already released stuff?
<Fujitsu> I would think that we should change it...
<Fujitsu> Pidgin does fit well, if you look up the meaning.
<elkbuntu> Fujitsu, yep
<elkbuntu> on both counts
<Fujitsu> Ideally we'd get 2.0 final, although I find that very unlikely this close to release.
<imbrandon> LaserJock, not really, but with AOL leagl woes it might be good for us to change it too
<Fujitsu> Very, very unlikely.
<imbrandon> right
<imbrandon> i see that as much more sane than the whole ice*
<elkbuntu> Fujitsu, but, we do have to go through 6 months of 'why is it still called gaim? it's supposed to be pidgin now'
<crimsun> then again, seb would probably touch it. And it's part of desktop. And seb's on the archive team. ;-)
<imbrandon> elkbuntu, 18 months
<elkbuntu> imbrandon, i was thinking in terms of until the next release
<imbrandon> :)
<imbrandon> crimsun!!
<elkbuntu> once the next release comes out with it as pidgin, people would get oover it pretty quick
<crimsun> brandon!
<Fujitsu> crimsun: You are using real names a bit these days!
<crimsun> it's a ploy, someone has stolen the real crimsun.
<imbrandon> crimsun, think seb is the one to touch it mostly? i was just looking at what all it would take to rename the libs etc, i dunno what other IM's would have to be rebuilt that use it, i know btlbee uses the libs right off not sure what else
<LaserJock> sounds like an awefully bad idea this close to release
<crimsun> I'm pretty comfortable with the status quo for gaim
<Fujitsu> Maybe if it were a couple of weeks earlier, but not now.
<crimsun> [for feisty] 
<imbrandon> LaserJock, true, it is very very close to be s/libpurple/libgaim + rcs snapshots
<LaserJock> "Ubuntu maintainers, do you check anything what is submitted??!?!?!"
<LaserJock> :(
<imbrandon> where is that from ?
<crimsun> -EPARSE
<Fujitsu> Lexical parsing failed.
<LaserJock> a bug report
<Fujitsu> LaserJock: Which?
<ajmitch> LaserJock: no, we just vomit up packages into the archive
<PF-Away> LaserJock: sounded like a jolly good fella
<LaserJock> the Debian TeX maintainer triaging our bugs again :(
<ajmitch> ah, exciting
<Fujitsu> Nice.
<LaserJock> it really stinks
<LaserJock> he's right
<ajmitch> yes, we should just remove all his packages from ubuntu
<crimsun> or we could convince the sabdfl to bring him on board to maintain 'em. Hmm...
<LaserJock> it'd almost be worth it ... almost
<ajmitch> hah
<imbrandon> heh
<ajmitch> good luck there
<LaserJock> it's pretty sad for Main packages
<LaserJock> we've had RC bugs sitting there for months before
<ajmitch> that's one reason I tried doing that RC bugs list
<ajmitch> so that we wouldn't have quite as many problems with universe
<ajmitch> however there's still a large pile
<LaserJock> fixed in Debian, and Dapper didn't get the fix because nobody paid attention
<imbrandon> for all the good thinga about large group maintainership like MOTU thats one of the downfalls "i dunt wanna touch it"
<stgraber> morning
<Fujitsu> I'd think that LP should have something to deal with that sort of thing.
<Fujitsu> TeX shouldn't be our problem... but nobody wants to touch it anyway.
<crimsun> I'd love to touch TeX - if so I think I'd better find someone else to pick up the slack on alsa*.
<LaserJock> well, the problem isn't that TeX itself is necessarily the problem
<LaserJock> we are just doing an aweful just of keeping in sync with Debian
<LaserJock> s/just/job/
<LaserJock> all they are asking for is if they do RC fixes that we pick them up
<LaserJock> I'm looking at bugs that are several months old with not so much as 1 response
<Fujitsu> ajmitch's list should help that.
<LaserJock> they are Main packages
<Fujitsu> Especially if a comments field is thrown in.
<Fujitsu> Well, ajmitch's list for main packages.
<Fujitsu> Which doesn't exist, but could easily I'm sure.
<Fujitsu> Having a mailing list of RC bugs being fixed in Debian might be nice, but the list is pretty good.
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: sure, fairly trivial to change for main
<jussi01> hi motu's...again. bug 67429 is fixed, can we clear it from the list?
<ubotu> Malone bug 67429 in mrename "mrename breaks due to wrong shebang" [Medium,Fix committed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/67429
<LaserJock> well, it might help, but the fact remains that nobody wants to touch TeX
<ajmitch> & yes, I really was going to do a comments field, one day
<Fujitsu> jussi01: That's not fixed.
<jussi01> Fujitsu, it says fix uploaded in the comments...
<Amaranth> ooh, yay
<Amaranth> i just remembered GNOME point releases get an automatic UVFe
<Fujitsu> jussi01: But it's not yet closed.
<jussi01> oh..
<Amaranth> so i can fix a couple alacarte bugs today without hassle
<sacater> morning everyone
<imbrandon> ello ScottK 
<imbrandon> err sacater 
<sacater> :(
<jussi01> grrr, Im trying to find a bug to fix thats within what I can do. but all of the ones i think i might be able to do already have debdiffs attached...
<jussi01> maybe its time to learn something new..
<crimsun> yay, wxwindows2.4 looks like a sync.
<crimsun> strike one more from the RC list
<imbrandon> :)
<crimsun> hmm, I seem to have missed supper altogether
<imbrandon> not good, infact its time for me some food too
<RAOF_> I *use* texmacs, I should really look at that what I can do to help the sync request on.
<imbrandon> brb
<LaserJock> oh, btw, I think I'm going to do a "MOTU Launchpad needs" spec for UDS
<Hobbsee> RAOF_: where are you?
<LaserJock> I'll probably need to get lots of good feedback before I go
<jekil> hello
<Hobbsee> australia, obviously
<LaserJock> Hobbsee: geeze, even *I* figured that one out ;-)
<RAOF_> Hobbsee: You mean, geographically?  Sydney.
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: indeed.
<Hobbsee> RAOF_: where abouts?
<RAOF_> I roam between Rose Bay and UNSW.
<crimsun> she'll come and poke you with a stick of doom.
<RAOF_> :)
* Hobbsee attempts to figure out where abouts that is
<Hobbsee> RAOF_: were you at LCA then?
<jussi01> Hobbsee, where are you?
<RAOF_> No, I was busy PhDing
<RAOF_> I should've been.  :(
<Hobbsee> jussi01: sydney as well
<Hobbsee> RAOF_: ahh.  pity you didnt come to the open day and/or i didnt meet you
<jussi01> Hobbsee, Im in finland, but I was born and raised in oz...
<RAOF_> Yeah, I was feeling rather needing to work, work, work on that day.
<Hobbsee> jussi01: ahhh
<RAOF_> Amazingly, English *is* my first language :(
<Hobbsee> heh
<Hobbsee> yes, but irc seems to be an excuse to be lazy
<jussi01> i moved to finland because...well "the woman made me do it"!!!
<Hobbsee> haha
<Hobbsee> blame the woman.  it's always the woman's fault
<LaserJock> it is ;-)
<jussi01> :P well she is finnish...
<LaserJock> they have us wrapped around their little fingers
<Hobbsee> yup.  it's great
<LaserJock> "resistence is futile"
<jussi01> lol
<crimsun> yes, my little lady sure has me wrapped around her finger.
<crimsun> blasted HDA. :(
<jussi01> lol
<jussi01> crimsun, what model is she :P
<jussi01> ?
<LaserJock> crimsun: at least mine goes to sleep at night
<jussi01> heheh
<crimsun> LaserJock: mine does, too, but sometimes she doesn't resume.
<LaserJock> crimsun: that would be a problem for mine :(
<imbrandon> so will etch actualy make it out the door today ?
<crimsun> very, very soon.
<imbrandon> cool
<imbrandon> so is etch released but not published or .... seems a bit confusing
<Fujitsu> Not released yet.
<LaserJock> hmm, so in Debian's BTS if I'm filing a bug can Package: be either binary or source package?
<LaserJock> and the anser is yes
<LaserJock> *answer
<LaserJock> oh crap, it's 3am
<imbrandon> hehe yea
<LaserJock> ok, well I went through the 11 tetex-base bugs
<LaserJock> and closed/rejected 3 and forwarded 1
<imbrandon> grr
<imbrandon> damn 100/1000 NIC isnt working
<imbrandon> well not in 1000 mode
<LaserJock> argg, how do I add a bugwatch?
<imbrandon> not sure, i need to get down and dirty and learn their bts better
<crimsun> more context, please.
<imbrandon> i just hate email
<crimsun> Do you want to add a Debian BTS entry to a Launchpad bug report?
<LaserJock> yeah
<LaserJock> I have a debian bug #, I need to add  bugwatch for it in LP
<crimsun> Also affects: Distribution
<crimsun> in the text drop-down, choose Debian
<crimsun> then paste the URL for the Debian BTS entry in the URL text entry field
<Laser_away> good night
<Laser_away> thanks crimsun 
<crimsun> np
<imbrandon> bbiab , offline to get this darn 1000 mode working 
<crimsun> I should eat breakfast, since apparently I skipped all six meals over the past two days
<crimsun> stupid work
<Fujitsu> crimsun: EAT!
<sacater> crimsun: if thats true im amazed you CAN work :P
<ivoks> crimsun: take a break
<sacater> yeah
<sacater> ther are other motus
<sacater> :D
<siretart> imbrandon: the images still need to propagate to their mirrors. the release team is asking not to download them yet
<Fujitsu> siretart: Where's this being discussed? I've seen very little talk of anything on #debian-devel.
<geser> Fujitsu: #debian.de has something about it in the topic
<RAOF> Hobbsee: Right, democracyplayer is officially a lost cause.
<RAOF> By pulling in the latest upstream version, and applying a patch to that, you can get it to show a window, then segfault.
<RAOF> It seems that to get it to work right, we'll need to pull in a new version of pyrex, too.
<Fujitsu> Shall we get rid of democracyplayer, then?
<RAOF> Yes.
<RAOF> It absolutely fails to work, at all.
<Fujitsu> Sounds ideal.
<RAOF> *I* don't use it, so it's no loss to me.  Except that the work I've put into it will be wasted :)
<geser> we definitely shouldn't ship a software with a bug with over 60 dupes
<Fujitsu> We're not going to lose anything by removing it.
<Fujitsu> (other than 5 bugs)
<ivoks> Democracy. The only video player you need. - this doesn't sound like democracy :D
<sacater> yeah
<sacater> too true
<sacater> should be Democracy. Use it if you wisg
<sacater> wish*}
<Monk-e> jussi01, boo.
<Monk-e> Uh sorry, wrong channel...
<Monk-e> Hm, suppose a program is packaged in universe. And later it's being packaged into debian and merged to Ubuntu. What happens to the universe package?
<Adri2000> it is replaced by the debian one
<Monk-e> And the maintainer of the universe package gets yanked?
<Hobbsee> raough.
<sacater> erm, whats the command to find out which freenode staffers are online
<Hobbsee> sacater: /stats p
<sacater> thank you hobbsee of doom-stick :D
<Hobbsee> Monk-e: sorry?  if it's a merge, it's taking the best of the ubuntu and debian packages
<Hobbsee> :)
<Hobbsee> Adri2000: that's a sync
<sacater> no staffers online :(
<Adri2000> yes, it's either merged or synced
<Hobbsee> argh.  that was supposed to be raof:  ugh.
<Monk-e> Hobbsee, then perhaps I meant a sync.
<sacater> i seek a shiny ubuntu cloak..
<Monk-e> Either way, what happens to the package maintainer?
<Hobbsee> Monk-e: the package maintainer for ubuntu does the merge.  or is inactive
<Monk-e> Ok, that's what I wanted to know thanks. :D
<Fujitsu> Or they're the maintainer in Debian too.
<Monk-e> So in that sense it would be smarter to get a package into Debian first..
<Hobbsee> Monk-e: for a merge.  for a sync, they just get replaced
<Hobbsee> yes
<Monk-e> Hobbsee, can one package for debian with the scripts in ubuntu?
<sacater> grr, i wish more people would mark their bugs as bitesize
<Hobbsee> Monk-e: i think your'e missing some words
<Monk-e> Hobbsee, maybe.
<Hobbsee> sacater: work on the unmet deps bugs, if you like
<Hobbsee> Monk-e: oh wait, no you're not.  um, sort of.  there are a few that are ubuntu specific
<Hobbsee> like, devscripts has some ubuntu specific stuff, and some stuff common to debian/ubuntu
<Monk-e> I see.
* Hobbsee isnt the one to ask
<Hobbsee> white: poke.  recruit for you
<Monk-e> Thanks anyway. :)
<sacater> Hobbsee: got a link for me
<Hobbsee> !utnubu
<ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about utnubu - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
<Monk-e> lol
<Hobbsee> Monk-e: there's a group with that name.   goolge it, and check them out
<Monk-e> utnubu?
<Nafallo> gajim is Ubuntu specific in the case of not wanting Debian packaging :-)
<Nafallo> mplayer aswell
<Hobbsee> sacater: apt-cache unmet -i | grep Package
<sacater> ok
<sacater> thanks
<Hobbsee> Monk-e: yes.  ubuntu backwards
<Hobbsee> sacater: no problem
<Monk-e> Hobbsee, thanks.
<sacater> Hobbsee: it will download them all?
<Hobbsee> sacater: no.  try it
<sacater> meh
<sacater> ok
<Hobbsee> try it without the grep too, if you like
<sacater> make a new folder for it?
<Hobbsee> that'll show you why it's failing, not just what is failing
<Hobbsee> then you can try install, figure out where the problem is, fix it.
<Hobbsee> would help, yeah
<sacater> gr
<sacater> dependencies
<sacater> or dependencys
<Hobbsee> yes
<sacater> ?
<Hobbsee> depedencies..., i think
<sacater> k
* Hobbsee wonders if it's dependancies or dependencies
<sacater> gah
* Hobbsee will have to google that, but thinks it's the latter
<sacater> :D
<sacater> holy
<sacater> are all those packages on my machine?
<Hobbsee> nope
<Hobbsee> they're packages from everything in your sources list
<sacater> ah
<sacater> well thats a lot of packages
* sacater gets started
<sacater> oh
<Hobbsee> sarah@LongPointyStick:~$ apt-cache unmet -i | grep Package | wc -l
<sacater> do i remove the dependancies or what?
<Hobbsee> 87
<Hobbsee> fix them
<Hobbsee> often tehy're old, or foo3 has moved to foo4 or whatever
<Hobbsee> which has happened with mysqlsomethingorother before
<sacater> ive got 103
<geser> sacater: there should be a bug open for every unmet deps
<Monk-e> Hobbsee, the utnubu thing. Seems dead. Last update was november last year. Also www.utnubu.org now points to www.ubuntu.com
<geser> you might want to look there too
<Hobbsee> sacater: wonder if you've got extra repos there or something.  oh well
<sacater> geser: k
<sacater> i have
<Hobbsee> Monk-e: ahh.  white's pretty active, he's a debian dev
<Monk-e> Ah wait yes.
* Monk-e 's bad
<sacater> im gonna try..
<sacater> tikiwiki
<sacater> unmet x 2
<Hobbsee> argh.  that's a php4 thing
<Hobbsee> that'll either work with php5, or die.
<sacater> hmm
* Hobbsee doesnt remember what we do fi it dies
<Hobbsee> The following packages have unmet dependencies:
<Hobbsee>   tikiwiki: Depends: php4 (>= 4.1.0) but it is not installable
<Hobbsee>             Depends: php4-mysql but it is not installable or
<Hobbsee>                      php4-pgsql but it is not installable
<Hobbsee>             Depends: libphp-phplayersmenu but it is not going to be installed
<Hobbsee> E: Broken packages
<geser> half the unmet deps we have are php4 related
<sacater> now what do i do, remove those deps from the packages dependancie list, or add them?
<Hobbsee> sacater: php4 got removed in feisty
<geser> sacater: replace the php4 deps with the php5 equivalents and test if the package still works
<sacater> ok
<sacater> so remove a dep, then add one
<sacater> simple enough
<sacater> apt-get source tikiwiki
<Adri2000> what are the tags for a .desktop file bug?
<Fujitsu> Adri2000: desktop-file
<sacater> Adri2000: i just search .desktop
<sacater> or 'no .desktop'
<Adri2000> Fujitsu: and packaging bitesize too?
<Fujitsu> Adri2000: Not packaging.
<Adri2000> ok
<sacater> Hobbsee: this is one of the dependancies
<sacater> php4 (>= 4.1.0)
<sacater> how do i find the latest version
<sacater> of php5
<Hobbsee> just say it's php5, i dont think you need to version that
<sacater> ok
<sacater> ill try
<geser> only add a version if you know that you need a specific version
<sacater> Depends: dbconfig-common, apache2 | httpd, php5, php-pear | php4-pear, php-date, php-db, php-http, php-http-request, php-net-socket, php-mail, php-xml-parser, php4-mysql | php4-pgsql, smarty (>= 2.6.7), libphp-adodb (>= 4.61), libphp-phplayersmenu
<sacater> sigh
<sacater> got a few more to go
<sacater> guys, how do i change my email address in my gpg key
<geser> you can't, add a new uid and revoke the old
<sacater> geser: how?
<sacater> i have no clue..
<geser> sacater: gpg --edit-key yourkey
<DarkSun88> Hi all
<geser> sacater: with adduid you can add a new one
<sacater> geser: na, i just want to change the email of this one.. know the command?
<Fujitsu> sacater: You must create a new one.
<geser> you can't, the keyservers don't allow to change something, they only merge new key data
<sacater> ah
<sacater> damnit
<white> any etch party in melbourne?
<sacater> new key it is
<Fujitsu> white: Not as far as I know.
<sacater> new key command?
<Fujitsu> Good to see it has propagated to most mirrors :)
<Fujitsu> sacater: Why not just a new UID?
<sacater> erm
<sacater> how
<geser> sacater: not necessarily, you can mark your old uid with revuid as non-use and add a new one
<Fujitsu> adduid, as geser said.
<sacater> ...
<white> Fujitsu: make one happen ;)
<sacater> ...
<sacater> youre losing me..
<Fujitsu> sacater: A key has one or more UIDs.
<geser> sacater: gpg --edit-key yourkey
<sacater> yeh
<Fujitsu> UIDs have the name and email address.
<sacater> i did that
<geser> then adduid to add a new one
<sacater> oh
<sacater> ok
<sacater> right
<sacater> i have a new UID
<sacater> now what
<geser> select the old with 'uid number'
<sacater> ok..
<geser> and 'revuid'
<geser> when everything is like you want 'save'
<sacater> erm
<sacater> it didnt get rid of it
<sacater> i still have 2
<sacater> one old one new
<geser> you never get rid of it
<sacater> oh
<sacater> well
<geser> you can only mark the as old (revoke)
<geser> the keyservers never delete
<sacater> aha
<sacater> got it
<sacater> yeah
<sacater> revoked
<sacater> save
<sacater> yays
<sacater> all done, thanks
<geser> there is a deluid command but does it only for your copy
<geser> don't forget to upload your changed key
<sacater> hey, does this mean i have to resign the code of conduct?
<sacater> upload command?
<geser> if you would deluid your old uid your would get it back when you fetch your key from a keyserver
<chaks> hi
<geser> gpg --send-key keyid
<chaks> anybody here to discuss regarding Academic Involvement ?
<imbrandon> chaks, as in?
<chaks> imbrandon, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/AcademicInvolvement
<chaks> am a Masters Student in University of Otago
<sacater> geser: sacater@neo:~$ gpg --send-key 6127680A
<sacater> gpg: no keyserver known (use option --keyserver)
<sacater> gpg: keyserver send failed: bad URI
<sacater> sacater@neo:~$ 
<chaks> and currently proposed a project and got approved
<geser> sacater: the most keyservers have a web interface where you can look like your key looks on the keyservers
<imbrandon> chaks, ahh one sec
<chaks> sure :)
<geser> sacater: have you uploaded your key to a keyserver already?
<sacater> erm
<sacater> yeh
<sacater> that number
<geser> gpg --keyserver blackhole.pca.dfn.de --send-key 0x6127680A
<geser> or use an other keyserver
<geser> that's the one I use
<sacater> k
<sacater> sent
<imbrandon> chaks, well we can point you to the right direction if you have questions, but as far as specifics dholbach ( not here atm ) would be the one to poke
<Nafallo> keyserver.ubuntu.com is a good guess :-)
<sacater> ooh
<imbrandon> or Laserjock / crimsun possibly
<chaks> oh...i have few doubts imbrandon, can we have second window?
<sacater> im using ubuntu.com for key...
<imbrandon> chaks, sure
<geser> sacater: the keyserver exchange the keys between each other
* Hobbsee gives flash the boot
<Hobbsee> why, when i have v7 and v9 installed, does firefox decide to use the earlier?
<sacater> geser: erm, gajim only sees my key as my old email still
<geser> sacater: if you don't want to specify the keyserver each time you can add it to .gnupg/gpg.conf as "keyserver hkp://keyserver.ubuntu.com"
<Nafallo> subkeys.pgp.net is roundrobin IIRC
<ScottK> Hobbsee: I'll definitely let you know when I get the S/MIME stuff figured out.  I'd hoped to do it for Feisty, but ran out of time.
<Hobbsee> ScottK: cool
<Nafallo> sacater: gajim uses your local file on-disk...
<sacater> but i changed it
<ScottK> Hobbsee: re your comment about my age....  I have a hard time believing it too.
<Hobbsee> hehe
<sacater> geser: do i need to resign the code of conduct with my new details?
<geser> no, as you signed it with your key which is still the same
<sacater> ok
<geser> sacater: once you get an @ubuntu.com address you can add it as an additional uid to your key if you want
<Fujitsu> Mission accomplished, it would appear!
<imbrandon> ajmitch, your in Dunedin correct ?
<chaks> :)
<imbrandon> chaks, Fujitsu and Hobbsee and a few others are down your way too ( in AU )
<chaks> hi Fujitsu, Hobbsee
<chaks> me from dunedin
<Fujitsu> Hi chaks.
<imbrandon> StevenK also iirc, and others i'm sure i've missed
<chaks> University Of Otago
<chaks> :)
<Hobbsee> chaks: met ajmitch yet?
<chaks> no, only now i knew he is from DD
<chaks> :)
<imbrandon> Hobbsee, nope, i was just telling him about ajmitch , because he is wanting to touch some LDAP stuff for school
<imbrandon> a DD from DD lol
<imbrandon> hrm trash must go out, brb 
<Hobbsee> ahhh
<imbrandon> why isnt there a rightclick empty trash IRL ?
<imbrandon> hehe
<Hobbsee> haha
<sacater> geser: yeah, but when..
<sacater> only when*
<\sh> moins...from belgium ;)
<imbrandon> heya \sh 
<sacater> geser: whats the easiest way to get an @ubuntu.com email :P
<\sh> guys, do you think it's too late for a wine UVF report? ;)
<imbrandon> sacater, the only way is to become a member
<sacater> imbrandon: hmm
<imbrandon> ( and thats not hard )
<sacater> imbrandon: ive fixed one package, some answers, and plenty of additions of edits to bug reports, thats not good enough is it ;(
<imbrandon> sacater, sure for a ubuntu membership , it should be
<sacater> imbrandon: oh, then i will apply
<sacater> oh
<sacater> ive already tried
<sacater> 'pending approval'
<Nafallo> hehe. my ex became a member cause she MIGHT join the artwork team :-P
<imbrandon> have you been to the CC meetign ?
<Nafallo> but then again. she translated a bit too :-)
<sacater> imbrandon: was that to me?
<imbrandon> yes
<sacater> imbrandon: what room
<imbrandon> you have to goto the CC meeting when you apply
<sacater> ubuntu-council?
<Nafallo> #ubuntu-meeting
<imbrandon> #ubuntu-meeting, not sure when the next one is
<sacater> oh
<DktrKranz> sacater, look at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NewMemberHowto :)
<sacater> :D
<sacater> im already in there too
<sacater> do you get a freenode cloak when you become an ubuntu member
<imbrandon> right, but actualy attend the Community Council meeting ;)
<imbrandon> sacater, yes
<DktrKranz> next meeting will be on april 17
<DktrKranz> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CommunityCouncilAgenda
<DktrKranz> if you want to apply, add yourself to the list and prepare some info about you
<imbrandon> sacater, and when you do add your self to the agenda for membership, just like the wiki says etc etc etc
<imbrandon> then goto the meeting and they will ask you a few questions etc
<DktrKranz> and, possibly, find some sponsors who can help you
<imbrandon> then your hopefully be welcomed
<sacater> hmm
<sacater> 2 months sustained and substantial#
<imbrandon> ubuntu membership is much less hard than MOTU or Core
<sacater> hmm
<sacater> ooh
<sacater> me nervous
<sacater> even though its a while away
<sacater> just over a week..
<zyga> hello
<zyga> sorry for being ignorant but can someone remind me how to build a package having debian/rules and debian/control
<DktrKranz> sacater, if you worked hard and your contribution is visible, you haven't to worry too much
<DktrKranz> zyga, if debian/ directory is fully populated, you can try with dpgk-buildpackage
<imbrandon> debuild -us -uc
<sacater> DktrKranz: ill work even harder now
<DktrKranz> good :D
<DktrKranz> anyway, it's just a startup
<DktrKranz> once you become a member, you can contiune working with MOTUs and, hopefully, become one of them :)
<sacater> that was my original intention
<\sh> we need some more motus ;)
<sacater> though for this meeting, i dont have much of a 'fanclub'
<imbrandon> one or two current members will be fine
<imbrandon> sacater, ^
<sacater> whats with the ^
<sacater> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CommunityCouncilAgenda
<DktrKranz> dunno which requisites you must have do become a MOTU, though
<sacater> added myself
<imbrandon> DktrKranz, basicly you work on packages and have sponsors, once you have worked with sponsors a bit , one will invite you to mail the MOTU council and ask for membership
<imbrandon> the the process starts
<imbrandon> sacater, ^ is an up arrow in that context
<sacater> oh ok
<imbrandon> e.g. pointing to the line before
<DktrKranz> uhm, is there a minimum amount of work to be done?
<sacater> me need fanclub
<sacater> :|
* \sh needs more jupiler beer ;)
<imbrandon> DktrKranz, 6 months of working on packages and having sponsors is a normal timeframe, though it can vary widely
<zyga> re
<zyga> thanks 
<\sh> re zyga
<zyga> I'm trying to rebuild cnf 
<zyga> and I frankly forgot how to do that without mvo around :/
<DktrKranz> understood, thanks
<\sh> is anybody working of getting rid of all unmet-deps regarding php4 deps?
<DktrKranz> \sh, I was working on them some days ago
<sacater> imbrandon: can i see your wiki page, so i can get an idea on how to structure mine
<\sh> DktrKranz: thx :) if you need a sponsor you can write an email to me :)
<DktrKranz> \sh, if you have a little time, I've got some ready for review
<imbrandon> sacater, sure http://wiki.ubuntu.com/BrandonHoltsclaw ( rember mine is much more info because i'm a Core Dev , and also hasent been updated in 4 or 5 months )
<sacater> ok
<sacater> ill look anyway
<\sh> DktrKranz: I'm reviewing them on tuesday..when I'm back at work..ok?
<DktrKranz> np, thanks :)
<\sh> oh my GF is just coming back from her bike-ride
<\sh> DktrKranz: my internet connection is stolen from a neighbor right here
<DktrKranz> here in italy is illegal, sue him!! :D
<\sh> why? right now I'm in belgium
<DktrKranz> okok, it's only our matter
<DktrKranz> foneros will have hard times ;)
<Nafallo> hehe
<DktrKranz> any U-U-S to ACK bug #104433?
<ubotu> Malone bug 104433 in libembperl-perl "Please sync libembperl-perl 2.2.0-1.2 from Debian unstable" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/104433
<Nafallo> my connection haven't been shared for a long time, neither my ex-girlfriends. none of us have heard a word from FON :-)
<imbrandon> i just got my FON the other day, installed dd-wrt on it :)
<Nafallo> might be related to my mail demanding that they put some efforts into security :-P
<Nafallo> imbrandon: but you probably got a fonera, right? ;-)
<imbrandon> yea
<Nafallo> I got a WRT54GL :-)
<imbrandon> i have 3 matter of fact, all with dd-wrt on them :)
<Nafallo> hehe, oki
<imbrandon> Nafallo, just flash it with open-wrt/dd-wrt or the original linksys firmware
<imbrandon> :)
<geser> \o/ it happend: Debian GNU/Linux 4.0 released
<Nafallo> ehrm... I've already flashed mine some times to many :-P
<imbrandon> :)
<Nafallo> I have to poke with JTAG now :-P
<imbrandon> geser, official now?
<Nafallo> and I haven't got around to do that yet :-)
<geser> yes, I got it from a mail to debian-announce
<DktrKranz> GOOD!
<ScottK> DktrKranz: http://lists.debian.org/debian-announce/debian-announce-2007/msg00002.html
<DktrKranz> let's go party!!!
<DktrKranz> I'm not aware of news from Debian
<DktrKranz> is Dunk-Tank still involved?
<geser> this experiment is already completed
<\sh> wow...etch released
<DktrKranz> uhm, it seems lists.debian.org is archiving emails quicker than we do...
* imbrandon welcomes lenny to the family ( the current Debian "Testing"
<imbrandon> )
<DktrKranz> lenny? who is it?
<imbrandon> lenny is the current version of debian testing now since Etch is released
<sacater> imbrandon: if I made a change to the 'tea' package, and created a team for it on launchpad, does that make me the maintainer?
<lupine_85> etch was a better name than lenny :D
<DktrKranz> i know :)
<imbrandon> sacater, psudoly yes, but ubuntu there isnt "maintainers"
<DktrKranz> i was referring to "toy story 2" :D
<imbrandon> ahh
<geser> DktrKranz: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Toy_Story_characters#Lenny_the_Binoculars
<imbrandon> looks like debian.org is updated too
<DktrKranz> i don't remember who it is
* DktrKranz is going to visit a blockbuster soon
<lupine_85> 300? ;)
<imbrandon> 300 isnt on dvd yet ( unless its from a torrent )
<imbrandon> :)
<lupine_85> as if I'd illegally download movies ;)
<lupine_85> but yeah, a pretty good-quality torrent actually
<imbrandon> heh yea i seen it a few days ago, not that i would either
<lupine_85> So; where are we dining tonight?
<imbrandon> btw if your local mirror is slow , i've put the netinstall here : ftp://voyager.imbrandon.com/mirror/debian/debian-40r0-i386-netinst.iso
<Nafallo> se.archive.ubuntu.com has 4Gbit and a cluster that can handle it... :-)
<imbrandon> they dont have a debian mirror though do they ?
<Nafallo> ehrm. ftp.se.debian.org
<Nafallo> and they are master CD-mirror :-)
<Nafallo> so yes. that's where isos are produced... :-)
* lupine_85 loves dist-upgrade sooo much
<Nafallo> hmm
<Nafallo> etch seems a bit outdated for me though :-P
<lupine_85> heh, I know what you mean
<lupine_85> I'll be tracking unstable
<Nafallo> I track feisty on all my boxes now :-)
<\sh> se.{debian,ubuntu} is maswans responsibilty...right?
<Nafallo> yes
<\sh> hmmm..30mins ETA to shutdown :(
<Nafallo> shutdown?
<\sh> laptop powers
<Nafallo> ah
<\sh> getting powercable now ;)
<\sh> ah....new electrical power is flowing through this thing
<geser> power-over-wlan :)
<\sh> nope...power from the house via a very long cable to my place now ;)
<jdong> geser: I've seriously contemplated several times if I should me an induction-based wireless power brick for my laptop :D
<jdong> it's always ended with some worry about cancer
<jdong> or planetary alignment
<geser> :)
<\sh> jdong: forget cancer...we will cure cancer very soon ,-)
<jdong> :)
* sacater has fresh cookies
* sacater hands out cookies
* jdong begins Debian torrent
<\sh> no cookies, it clashes with my belgium beer ;)
<sharms> Laser_away: you gotta post pictures of their desktop with the blog entries
<sacater> \sh: if you want, you can dip them in your beer, thus the result is beer-cookies :D
<\sh> sacater: gg
<\sh> ok....going back to holiday mode...cu tuesday
<sacater> imbrandon: how does this look so far https://wiki.ubuntu.com/sacater
<imbrandon> sacater, looks like a good start, now just rope a ubuntu member that can vouch for you at the meeting and you both attend
<imbrandon> brb , headed to the store
<sacater> imbrandon: doubtful, but can i rope you?
<jdong> hey imbrandon, how are you?
<sharms> lol
<sharms> haha... since my last entry in my blog, if you google "giving a bad name to linux developers" my blog comes up
<sharms> as first result
<jdong> sharms: congratulations? :D
<sacater> ooh
<sacater> i will google it up
<sharms> I just find it hilarious that when people google bad linux developers they will find me
<jdong> sharms: lol
<sharms> one interesting thing so far is, the main problem with my latest blog entry is there are ALOT of people who dont understand IRC
<welp> imbrandon: ping
<sacater> hi welp
<welp> yo
<sacater> welp: read up
<sacater> about 12 lines for me
<Lathiat> right
<Lathiat> ubuntus screwed, debian 4 releases
<Lathiat> for the next 6 months until its out of date again :)
<welp> sacater: i already have, silly
<sacater> welp: good good...
<sacater> and hows this look for a starter https://wiki.ubuntu.com/sacater
<sharms> sacater: I think it would help if you get your name on more packages and kick that karma on launchpad up
<sacater> i tried
<sacater> i did some answers
<sacater> i thought they got them up fast?
<sharms> here was mine: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StevenHarms
<sharms> and I *barely* got in'
<sharms> they have changed the karma system so I dont think you can achieve that level of karma anymore
<sharms> but triaging some bugs definitely wont hurt
<sacater> aw
<sacater> me will do
<sacater> i have until...
<sacater> er..
<sacater> 17th...
<sacater> not this tuesday, but the next one
<sharms> also if you have any community work with marketing / locos post that in your profile
<sharms> or advocacy 
<sacater> hmm
<sacater> i got some ubuntu cds, and gave a few out
<sacater> got my parents friends using kubunta
<sacater> got my parents friends using kubuntu*
<sacater> im gonna get started on this https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gcolor2/+bug/70386
<ubotu> Malone bug 70386 in gcolor2 "doesn't have a desktop entry" [Undecided,In progress]  
<sharms> sacater: yeah that is a great one
<sacater> sharms: for 2 reasons
<sacater> simple
<sacater> and esay
<sacater> :D
<sacater> easy*
<sharms> :)
<sacater> dont get me wrong
<sacater> its not like me to slack :D
<sacater> much.
<sacater> :P
<sacater> sharms: erm there is a slight problem, i just compiled the source into a .deb and installed it, the .desktop file works fine
<sacater> and works
<sharms> then atleast you resolved the bug :)
<sacater> erm
<sharms> Mark it as rejected
<sacater> i didnt fix it..
<sacater> ok
<sharms> with a friendly explanation
<sacater> i have
<sacater> check it out again
<sharms> looks good
<sharms> one more thing that is a good way to help / get karma
<sharms> do a bug search, advanced, for bugs that are unconfirmed or need information
<sharms> if they need information and nobody has been able to provide information in a long time, reject it 
<sharms> and if they are unconfirmed, but vague on information, ask for more information
<sharms> and switch status to needs info
<sacater> hmm
<sacater> ok
* sacater reads sharms explanation again
<sharms> check out this real quick: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BugSquad/Diaries/fmartinez
<sacater> k
<sacater> sharms: is this ideal? https://bugs.launchpad.net/debian/+source/perl/+bug/6834, how much karma would it get me?
<ubotu> Malone bug 6834 in perl "has issues with tying read only arrays (DB_File,O_RDONLY)" [High,Rejected]  
<sacater> whoop
<sacater> s
<sacater> ignore that
<sacater> i looked at debian rather than ubuntu
<sacater> sharms: how about this, reject it? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/initramfs-tools/+bug/32123
<ubotu> Malone bug 32123 in initramfs-tools "initramfs not generated correctly on upgrade to Dapper" [High,Needs info]  
<sharms> sacater: leave a comment saying "Is this still an issue in Feisty?"
<sacater> ok
<sacater> sharms: just that?
<sharms> yeah and if nobody answers for awhile we can close it
<sacater> ok
<sacater> so how to I remember it :|
<sacater> to close it after a while
<sharms> click the button "subscribe to any changes" or email me changes
<sharms> then it may pop back up
<sacater> ok
<sharms> or when you are doing the same "needs info, unconfirmed drill" you will come across it again
<sacater> ok
<so1> hi
<so1> whats the status of gaim/pidgin in feisty?
<sacater> sharms: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/localechooser/+bug/26536 shall i do 'needs info'
<ubotu> Malone bug 26536 in localechooser "Chinese language selection orders" [Medium,Unconfirmed]  
<so1> will the legal hassle with aol conflict with our schedule?
<bddebian> Heya gang
<sacater> bddebian: hi mate
<bddebian> Hello sacater
<sharms> sacater: yeah just ask if this bug is still present in feisty
<sacater> okies
<sacater> welp: you dont have an old PC case i could have do you, socket A size at least
<Adri2000> so1: I think we will keep gaim beta6, and will have pidgin in feisty+1
<Adri2000> so1: but the better person to ask is seb128, we (the MOTUs) don't maintain gaim
<Adri2000> s/better/best/
<so1> mh
<so1> aol should be shot ...
<sacater> sharms: reject? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/update-manager/+bug/40060
<ubotu> Malone bug 40060 in update-manager "update-manager doesn't understand gtk changelog" [Medium,Unconfirmed]  
<so1> if gaim really came out with "aim" before aol, they should sue the hell out of them
<sharms> sacater: reject saying "This bug appears to be fixed in recent releases.  If you can reproduce this in feisty, please open a new bug"
<sacater> ok
<sacater> will do
<sacater> when does karma get updated
<sacater> ive marked a few things and it hasnt budged
<imbrandon> sacater, yes if i am not sleeping you can rope me
<imbrandon> welp, pong 
<welp> imbrandon: mind if i /query you?
<imbrandon> welp, sure ( might be a bit slow right now, but yea )
<sharms> sacater: it updates at night
<jdong_> imbrandon: since I am in a really awesome mood today, I'll resist a comment based on your last statement ;-)
<imbrandon> jdong_, lol
<imbrandon> hows it goin
<jdong_> pretty good, busy, but still keeping my sanity
<jdong_> and you?
<imbrandon> same
<imbrandon> :)
<jdong_> gonna side-track from my todo list and try out Debian etch today :)
<joejaxx> Good Afternoon Everyone
<sacater> joejaxx: afternoon
<danohuiginn> I'm looking at ajmitch's missing fixes page from the topic. Is there a way to remove a package from the list if the bug doesn't apply to ubuntu?
<BlakeM> I'd like to learn how to package and contribut to the Universe repo, could some one PM me with some information on how to get started?
<geser> !packaging guide
<ubotu> The packaging guide is at http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/index.html - See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/New for information on getting a package integrated into Ubuntu - Other developer resources are at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DeveloperResources - See also !backports
<BlakeM> thx
<sacater> if i get another cloak, can i get an ubuntu one later, or can i tie them together or something
<geser> I'd guess you can have only one
<geser> why would you need two cloaks to hide your ip?
<LaserJock> geser: because it's cool ;-)
<geser> you could also hide your ip by a cloak which itself is hidden by another cloak :)
<sacater> geser: i have a colchester LUG cloak, ill replace with ubuntu if i get it
<corevette> where do you learn how to add a project into the repositories?
<LaserJock> !packagingguide
<ubotu> The packaging guide is at http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/index.html - See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/New for information on getting a package integrated into Ubuntu - Other developer resources are at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DeveloperResources - See also !backports
<LaserJock> !revu
<ubotu> REVU is a web-based tool to give people who have worked on Ubuntu packages a chance to "put their packages out there" for other people to look at and comment on in a structured manner. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU
<LaserJock> corevette: do those links ^^ help?
<corevette> yes thanks LaserJock
<sacater> Seveas: can i ask you about the cloaks, i have a colchester lug one, but im applying for ubuntu members so i can get @ubuntu as well, can i have both?
<Seveas> sacater, no
<bddebian> Heya gang
<geser> Hi bddebian
<bddebian> Hi geser
<LaserJock> hola bddebian 
<Lutin> hi bddebian 
<bddebian> Hi LaserJock, Lutin
<ajmitch> morning
<LaserJock> hi ajmitch 
* ajmitch sees there was some student from otago uni in here earlier
<ajmitch> I wonder if I know that person
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<LaserJock> is otago in NZ?
<ajmitch> well yeah
* ajmitch is about 10 minutes walk from otago uni
<ajmitch> which is where I studied
<LaserJock> oh, cool
<ajmitch> hm, almost 9AM
<ajmitch> I should have a beer tonight to celebrate etch release ;)
<minghua> otago somehow sounds Japanese to me...
<LaserJock> I'd need more than 1 to install it ... ;-)
<ajmitch> s/japanese/maori/
<minghua> oh I see
<ajmitch> LaserJock: bah, it's simple to install, I've done a couple of etch installs in the last week :)
<LaserJock> I suppose Etch doesn't have a 2.4 kernel?
<minghua> no
<jdong_> haha no.
<minghua> 2.6.18
<LaserJock> ajmitch: no, it's not the installing that's the problem
<LaserJock> darn
<LaserJock> I need a 2.4 kernel for the only Debian machine I run
<ajmitch> I'll have to check if you can install with a 2.4 kernel
<ajmitch> I *think* it's still possible
<minghua> install sarge and upgrade to etch then
<minghua> ajmitch: I believe not, all 2.4 kernels are dropped in etch IIRC
<LaserJock> minghua: will that take out my kernel though?
<minghua> LaserJock: of course not, but make sure you read http://www.debian.org/releases/etch/i386/release-notes/ch-upgrading.en.html#s-upgrade-from-2.4 first
<ajmitch> minghua: oh well
<minghua> LaserJock: or better, the whole release note
<ajmitch> LaserJock: why do you need 2.4 in this case?
<LaserJock> ajmitch: umm, proprietary instrument drivers
<LaserJock> it's my data acquisition machine
<jdong_> sounds like fun :)
<LaserJock> I'm probably better of not messing around with it
<jdong_> how long is oldstable supported for?
<ajmitch> 1 year
<jdong_> that's not bad at all....
<LaserJock> right now I can actually build my data acquisition app on top of it
<minghua> I thought 18 months?
<jdong_> gives plenty of time for the vendor to write 2.6 drivers... oh who am I kidding :)
<LaserJock> oh they have one
<LaserJock> it just doesn't work with the app I wrote for it
<jdong_> ah
<ajmitch> minghua: afaik it's always been 1 year 
<LaserJock> but we just dropped about $3000 in Windows hardware/software with them :/
<curado> does anyone knows about the motu-school project?
<minghua> ajmitch: you are correct, one year it is
<LaserJock> curado: sure
<curado> as I red the last post at the wiki was in the middle of last year
<minghua> (or until next stable release, whichever is sooner, but as we all know...)
<ajmitch> minghua: don't make me laugh
<minghua> sorry, forgot you are having beer :-)
<curado> LaserJock: I'm looking for a mentor to start helping with packaging
<ajmitch> nah, it's monday morning, too early to have beer yet :)
<LaserJock> curado: yes, we haven't had a School session for a while. We'd like to get that going again
<curado> great
<LaserJock> curado: well, we are here to help
<LaserJock> curado: if you have specific questions you can ask here
<LaserJock> or if you're not comfortable with that email one of the people on the wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Mentors page
<ajmitch> bah
<ajmitch> bug 104499
<ubotu> Malone bug 104499 in f-spot "PC Crash when I import data into f-spot" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/104499
<ajmitch> lots of helpful info there
<curado> LaserJock: Thanks! I'll study the documentation and I'll look for help here if I need
<LaserJock> curado: awesome, thanks for the interest :-)
* LaserJock kills off more TeX bugs
* jdong_ files "\finishwritingmypaper causes error"
<LaserJock> jdong_: lol
<sacater> LaserJock: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/sacater#preview hows that look for a member application
<AstralJava> LaserJock: Hi. :) Can you take a look at UbuntuStudio packages, they're fixed according to your comments now? First up ubuntustudio-icon-theme http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=4797
<AstralJava> ubuntustudio-sounds http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=4799
<LaserJock> sacater: you need more specifics as far as time. How long have you been contibuting? What specific things have you contributed (with links and dates, etc.)? thinks like that. But it's a good start
<sacater> cool
<sacater> will do
<AstralJava> usplash-theme-ubuntustudio http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=4798
<sacater> time... time...
<ajmitch> sacater: saying that you've helped out in "a few different ways" & then only mentioning one package..
<LaserJock> AstralJava: on it
<stgraber> sacater: Have a look at this one for example : https://wiki.ubuntu.com/RichardJohnson
<LaserJock> stgraber: you're just going to give nixternal a big head ;-)
<nixternal> haha
<stgraber> LaserJock: yep, but I didn't want to give mine :)
<sacater> ajmitch: , ok
<sacater> stgraber: k
<bddebian> don't look at mine, that's for sure
<stgraber> and nixternal's one isn't that bad :)
<nixternal> I have been meaning to redo that. I have noticed the past 5 or so CC meetings, mako always gets the "I stole that from nixternal" :)
<LaserJock> sacater: mine is at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/JordanMantha
<sacater> LaserJock: okies
<ajmitch> nixternal: well it's way better than my seriously outdated page ;)
<LaserJock> which I suppose I should update if I want to go for core-dev :/
<ajmitch> though I haven't done any work on ubuntu since putting my wiki page up
<stgraber> and mine at : https://wiki.ubuntu.com/stgraber (stolen a little bit from LaserJock and nixternal) :)
<nixternal> I have a /Beta on there I started, and never came close to finishing
<sacater> okies
<superm1> can anyone think of a good example of a package that queries the status of another package in its debian/config or debian/postinst scripts?  eg finds out if its been configured yet or is installed yet?
<nixternal> this strnicmp with gnu is killing me
<stgraber> LaserJock: Will have to update it as well if I want to apply for being a MOTU :)
* ajmitch is going off to get some breakfast, back later :)
* stgraber didn't work on it since he's a member
<LaserJock> I haven't done anything with mine for a year
<LaserJock> although I think they use them less and less as they get to know you
<stgraber> sure, the LP activity also help a lot. If you haven't done anything on Launchpad and only worked on LoCo then you really need a good wiki page
* LaserJock trys to see if he can get his karma above 2000
<stgraber> LaserJock: work on some specs, that's the best way to earn Karma :)
* geser tries to not drop below 12k and get back to over 13k
<bddebian> I was at some million now I'm at like 2000 :'-(
<stgraber> it's 3740 of my 4474 :) with only having worked on say 2-3 specs
<LaserJock> stgraber: well, that's how I have 1000 of the 1500 I have :(
<stgraber> bddebian: yep, too bad they fixed that bug :)
<bddebian> Well I was in the top 5 contributors for Edgy.  Now, I suck :'-(
<stgraber> well ~2000 only working on bugs is quite good :)
<geser> over 10k in bug management :)
* bddebian pokes geser in the eye ;-P
<geser> bddebian: have you seen the karma of alan pope?
<bddebian> Nah, I rarely even check my own
<stgraber> geser: You aren't human, that's all
<geser> bddebian: alan pope has over 113k in support tickets
<LaserJock> geeze
<stgraber> Seems support tracking is like specifications, a good way to earn karma (but finally who cares about karma ? :))
* geser wants karma for uploads
<LaserJock> yes, I have it on my Top 5
<LaserJock> although anymore it's almost redundant with bug karam
<bddebian> WTH is a support ticket?
<geser> bddebian: https://answers.launchpad.net/ubuntu/
<bddebian> ahh
<geser> according to http://ubuntu.joejaxx.org/ I've updated over 370 packages, that would give much karma :)
<crimsun> ooh, karma chasing
<crimsun> :-)
<crimsun> I'm glad to not be in the top 50
* bddebian just doesn't do shit
<crimsun> no, that's called "having a life"
<ColonelKorn> Hey all
<bddebian> crimsun: I wish that were my excuse
<geser> bddebian: promote Ubuntu in second life :)
<crimsun> bddebian: well, you could be like me - not have a life, not have much karma, not do much in Ubuntu :-)
<bddebian> :-)
<bddebian> crimsun: Yeah right, like you don't do much
<ColonelKorn> I kinda new to all this, any good places to help get me started in developing for ubuntu?
<crimsun> ColonelKorn: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment
<ColonelKorn> Thank you
<LaserJock> AstralJava: done, all acked
<LaserJock> _MMA_: ^^
<AstralJava> LaserJock: Whee! Thanks a million! :)
<LaserJock> np
<AstralJava> So, now TheMuso's ACKs aren't showing up in the REVU listing, since the package's been updated. Does that matter, or can I now file the exception bugs?
<crimsun> you can file them, but generally you should get him to recheck
<AstralJava> crimsun: Okay thanks.
<crimsun> to be strict, you /must/ get another MOTU to check
<AstralJava> Right.
<LaserJock> yeah, they should be trivial, as my only complaints were debian/copyright related
<superm1> LaserJock, can one package's debconf section query variables and information from another (already installed) package?
<crimsun> it can query anything in the debconf db.
<superm1> oh very good
<crimsun> note that can be nasty
<crimsun> it essentially adds a Dependency if you don't already have it
<superm1> well but in a case of a package that needs to setup a mysql database, but needs the root password to do it
<superm1> it can query that from mysql-server/root_password
<superm1> rather than ask the user
<LaserJock> superm1: hmm, what if the person has changed the root password?
<superm1> well if they changed it via dpkg-reconfigure mysql-server-5.0 its updated in debconf
<superm1> but i guess if they changed it via mysql console that case wouldnt be covered
<minghua> superm1: I think you want to look at package dbconfig-common
<minghua> superm1: (and the packages that are using it
<superm1> k thanks minghua 
<AstralJava> Okay I've got UVF exception bugs filed. bug #104571
<ubotu> Malone bug 104571 in ubuntustudio-icon-theme "[UVFe request]  ubuntustudio-icon-theme in REVU" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/104571
<AstralJava> bug #104573
<ubotu> Malone bug 104573 in ubuntustudio-sounds "[UVFe request]  ubuntustudio-sounds in REVU" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/104573
<AstralJava> bug #104575
<ubotu> Malone bug 104575 in usplash-theme-ubuntustudio "[UVFe request]  usplash-theme-ubuntustudio in REVU" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/104575
<AstralJava> ...and bug #103225
<ubotu> Malone bug 103225 in ubuntustudio-look "[UVFe request]  ubuntustudio-look in REVU" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/103225
<AstralJava> It'd be super-great if someone could take a look and tell me what's needed more in the bug report.
<crimsun> well, first of all, they're not UVF exception requests
<crimsun> they're Feature Freeze (FF) exception requests
<AstralJava> Nice, good start. :)
<ajmitch> they're "ZOMG NEW PACKAGE!" requests
<ajmitch> so they're basically just branding packages?
<ajmitch> artwork & sounds?
<ajmitch> I see you recycled the bug description for each one
<ajmitch> they all seem to be "one of the most important artwork packages for the project."
<LaserJock> of course :-)
<AstralJava> ajmitch: Yes, that's true. Isn't it? ;)
<AstralJava> Yeah I suppose I should have changed that a bit.
#ubuntu-motu 2008-03-31
<mattismyname> So, I'm trying to build a package of a library (my first try...).  This library can make use of other libraries if they exist on the system, but it does not require they be present (libtiff, libpng).  My question is...should I include these on the Build-Depends: line in the package control file?
<RAOF> mattismyname: So this will depend on a number of things.
<RAOF> 1) Are these libraries required to be present at compile time for them to be used?
<RAOF> (The answer to that is almost certainly yes).
<mattismyname> yes
<RAOF> 2) Is the extra functionality provided by building against those libs useful?
<RAOF> (Again, probably yes).
<mattismyname> Yes
<RAOF> 3) Do those libs trigger a licensing problem
<RAOF> (More difficult to say :))
<mattismyname> Estimate maybe 50% of the users will find the additional support useful
<mattismyname> 3) Probably not.  Libs I'm talking about are libpng, libtiff, and jpeglib
<RAOF> They'd be mainly LGPL/MIT, yes?
<mattismyname> yes
<RAOF> So, generally you want to build with as many dependencies as possible.  Librarys are cheap!
<mattismyname> ok...that is the "rule of thumb" I was looking for :)
<RAOF> The reasons why you might not want to build against a library are if it's obscure, poorly maintained, or badly licensed.
<mattismyname> Thanks
<mattismyname> Another question: The lib I'm packaging depends on "An OpenGL library or the Mesa library".  Now, I know how to specify that it depends on libgl1-mesa but how do I accomplish the other half of the "or" statement?  Is there some sort of libgl metapackage?  If so, how would I find it?  I've tried apt-cache search to no effect.
<RAOF> mattismyname: The pipe character ('|') is used to denote an OR relationship.  So, you'd be after libgl1-mesa | libmesa-not-hwaccel, or something.
<jdong> the vertical frobulator ('|')....
<jdong> ^^ fixed it for you
<RAOF> GAH!  Dear internet: I'm not interested in gaining a l0nger shl0ng!  Please GO AWAY!
<mattismyname> Hmm...now I'm thinking I can just specify libgl1-dev as the dependency
<mattismyname> But thanks for the info on the OR
<lifeless> There will be a short interruption to bazaar.launchpad.net and the ubuntu wiki to deploy a fix for the performance problems.
<mattismyname> Is there any reason putting a "cd" command in debian/rules would not take effect?  For example, after configure, the makefile gets placed in the src subdirectory so I need to cd into that directory for when the make command is issued.
<mattismyname> I tried putting "cd src" on the correct line in the rules makefile but it doesn't seem to work...
<RAOF> mattismyname: You need to remember that each (tab-indented) line of a makefile is run in a _separate shell_.
<RAOF> mattismyname: This means that make runs "cd" in a shell, which promptly changes _that new shell's_ current directory, and then exits.
<TheMuso> 5~/c
<warp10> Good morning
<geser> good morning
<dholbach> good morning
<geser> Guten Morgen dholbach
<dholbach> hiya geser :)
<AnAnt> Hello, does launchpad have svn ?
<AnAnt> Hello, does launchpad have svn service I mean ?
<siretart> AnAnt: launchpad has an svn import service
<Hobbsee> AnAnt: #launchpad, surely
<AnAnt> thanks
<slomo_> siretart: gst-ffmpeg still works great with latest ffmpeg from experimental ;)
<siretart> slomo_: yeah, but it requires that 015_build_imgresample.diff patch
<siretart> slomo_: could you check if it is possible to patch gst-ffmpeg in a way so that it is no longer necessary?
<slomo_> siretart: the patch is for adding the deprecated imgresample api to ffmpeg again?
<siretart> excatly
<slomo_> siretart: well, upstream plans to port to the new stuff :) don't know when this is started/done though
<slomo_> i'll ask later
<slomo_> siretart: or is it easy to do? can you give me an example or something? :)
<siretart> slomo_: http://paste.debian.net/52207
<siretart> that is the patch
<slomo_> ok
<slomo_> doesn't help me :)
<slomo_> how is the new stuff called? do you have an example patch that converts from imgresample to the new, etc?
<siretart> no idea right now, sorry
<slomo_> ok
<slomo_> well, i'll take a look later
<slomo_> bbl :)
<siretart> I'm currently thinking about how to get this to unstable..
<\sh> siretart: if I propose to you a debdiff with a funny build-dep of wine to mplayer to compile some tools which are only running with it...would you take it?
<slomo_> siretart: is this imgresample patch a problem for getting it into unstable?
<slomo_> siretart: ok, the new stuff is swscale and it can do magic ;)
<siretart> slomo_: I don't think so
<siretart> slomo_: rather how to sell this to the release team
<slomo_> ok, then i'll simply wait until next upstream release :)
<slomo_> what could be the problem with the release team? except that it might introduce regressions but fixes a million bugs
<warp10> Hi all!
<\sh> siretart: forget the question..you are not responsible for mplayer ;)
<\sh> Fujitsu: /window 15
<\sh> grmpf
<soren> \sh: /win is much faster.
<soren> (to type)
<\sh> soren: well, /win<tab> is cool...but not looking at the bottom line on irssi, forgetting about what I wanted to tell Fujitsu, and not Ctrl+U the input line..gives "\sh is angry about python"
<tbf> is there something i should do for moving gnome-lirc-properties to the next stage?
<tbf> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/hardy/+queue?queue_state=0&queue_text=lirc
<tbf> hmm... stop.... 28th was friday... i am just impatient - as usual
<siretart> \sh: isn't wine in universe? you cannot build depend on packes in multiverse, can you?
<\sh> siretart: yeah...but mplayer is multiverse...and mplayer is this what I want to change ;)
<siretart> \sh: err, sorry, you confuse me.
<siretart> \sh: do don't seriously propose to make mplayer build/test some tools of wine, which won't show up in the mplayer package anyways, are you?
<siretart> s/do/you/
<\sh> siretart: the tools are for converting videos from one to another...the vfw2enc e.g is a windows tool, which can be compiled via winegcc or mingGW...those tools need to be in the mencoder package if this is feasable ;) but after thinking about it, it's bad
<\sh> siretart: the sources are already in the src package.
<siretart> in which source package?
<\sh> siretart: mplayer...i was confused with ffmpeg when I asked you...that's why I said, forget about it :)
<siretart> if there are tools unbuilt in the mplayer source pacakge, then probably they should be built and installed
<\sh> siretart: the idea came from http://www.mplayerhq.hu/DOCS/HTML-single/de/MPlayer.html#menc-feat-video-for-windows <- it's for converting movies into Flash media Files with vp6 encoding ;)
<siretart> given they are of any use, of course
<\sh> siretart: well, it needs to be build with a windows compatible compiler like winegcc or on windows with msvc or minGW..
<siretart> I know that we do have minGW, no idea about winegcc
<\sh> siretart: winegcc comes with wine :) I tested it already and it works...I wonder if it's a good idea to b-d on wine ;)
<siretart> but
<siretart> for http://www.mplayerhq.hu/DOCS/HTML-single/de/MPlayer.html#menc-feat-video-for-windows, don't you need the windows dlls anyways?
<\sh> siretart: nope..they are built-in by wine
<\sh> siretart: ah you mean the w32codecs ;)
<\sh> siretart: they are only needed for running and converting video for windows stuff...but to building those tools, they are not needed.
<siretart> so we could build those tools, but they would still be unusable without ripping some dlls from a windows installation?
<\sh> siretart: yes
<siretart> then it seems to be a waste of time to me
<siretart> if you want to do it, go ahead, but I wouldn't spend any time on that
<\sh> siretart: as I said, forget about it...I'll fork the package for my needs and provide a selfmade package for it
<siretart> too bad that you can't publish it
<\sh> siretart: well, I'll send the changes as debdiff to LP...just in case someone is interested to go with it...but I won't push it into hardy..
<\sh> siretart: the reason behind this is, that I need to convert all types of videos into FLV media with vp6 encoding which will be pushed by adobe into the next flash player at the end of the year (AFAIK)...vp6 right now can't be played with it without any additional software from on2 e.g.
<siretart> aha
<\sh> siretart: and the good thing is, when we do it here...we pay as well license fees for it :(
 * \sh is testing adobe air alpha 1 ,-)
<sebner> \sh: just read the news :)
<sebner> DktrKranz: buon giorno :)
<\sh> jikes...wireshark 1.0
<\sh> should we go with it?
 * pochu waves
<sebner> heya jono pochu
<jono> hey seb
<jono> hey sebner
<\sh> jono: please explain thong-a-gong ? ;)
<jono> \sh: heh, a man, in a thong, with a gong and lots of 5 min talks :)
<sebner> \sh: it's a sync right? If we wait for debian I could do it if no one else is willing to do :)
<\sh> sebner: dunno if debian comes faster then providing a 0ubuntu1 version...I'll have to check first, because it's fixing as well some security stuff
<sebner> \sh: k
<\sh> sebner: I'll take a look this evening...
<sebner> \sh: bp
<sebner> *np
<Iulian> Hey
<ScottK> siretart: I worked on one of Manoj packages last night for the first time and it really wasn't so bad.  They are different, but OTOH it only took about a minute to find the right knob to turn to get it to work with our default Python.
<james_w> they are well structured and sensible, the problem is that they are just so different.
<slytherin> Hi all. This is regarding the catch-all bug for python-xml dependency removal. It doesn't work for pyslide. A friend just reported. And I am reopening the bug.
<slytherin> bobbo: ping
<ScottK> slytherin: Did you add details of the failure?
<slytherin> ScottK: No. I am adding. them
<ScottK> slytherin: OK.  Let me know when you're done.
<slytherin> ScottK: done
 * ScottK looks
<emgent> hello
<emgent> keescook: when you have time please see bug #194687 it's a security regression for cacti. (debdiff attached)
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 194687 in cacti "cacti web frontend fails with 'Invalid PHP_SELF Path' after upgrade" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/194687
<emgent> i go at work, bye people
<\sh> emgent: nope...it's not security...it's sru...the main part works if you don't run it from /<dir> but from /
<mok0> Is there someone here who has fiddled with octave?
<ScottK> mok0: You want sistpoty probably.
<\sh> mok0: what's wrong with octave?
<mok0> ScottK: ok, thanks.
<\sh> packagewise or codeing wise?
<mok0> It's got an unconventional debian/ directory layout
<mok0> with a debian/in, that seems to hold templates for the "real" files
<\sh> mok0: which package?
<mok0> octave3.0
<mok0> It's the only package that shows up in the "Science" menu item on the K-menu, I want to change that, so it appears in "Education/Math"
<\sh> I wonder if octave is education ;)
<mok0> I wonder if any of the programs in Education is education, but that's where they all are...
<\sh> mok0: e.g.?
<mok0> octave is the only one I have in "Science"
<Fujitsu> Anything sciency is in Education, because f.d.o refuses to give us a sane category.
<\sh> damn
<mok0> Education has 4 entries: languages, mathematics, miscellaneous & science
<\sh> mok0: ok...when you read debian/rules, you'll see that it copies files from debian/in/* to debian/
<\sh> mok0: depending on the $(VERSION)
<mok0> \sh: ok, that's what I was guessing... line no?
<mok0> Ah
<mok0> I see it
<\sh> debian/%: debian/in/% slice -o $(sliceterm):$@ $<
<mok0> sneaky
<\sh>  cp debian/in/$(PACKAGE)-00list debian/patches/00list
<\sh>         cp debian/in/$(PACKAGE)-watch debian/watch
<\sh> I think they were building all ocatve{2.1,2.9,3.0} with the same package layout
<mok0> \sh: right, so one needs to modify the files in debian/in
<slytherin> ScottK: Did you look at pyslide problem? What is the reason for not working?
<ScottK> slytherin: I'm looking at it now.
<mok0> \sh: I guess it's nifty, but non-standard.
<\sh> mok0: well, it looks like it just uses debian menu system and no .desktop files
<ScottK> slytherin: It appears that pyslide needs some XML bits not provided by the standard python.
<mok0> \sh: yeah it's a simple one-line fix :-)
<\sh> oh of course ... desktop.in
<ScottK> slytherin: Short version is it should have been tested more before uploading.
<\sh> Categories=Development;Math;Science;
<\sh> hmmm?
<slytherin> ScottK: hmm. So adding the dependency again is the right thing to do, right?
<mok0> \sh: yes. I haven't figured out what it should be
<mok0> \sh: not really into the desktop/menu system yet
<ScottK> slytherin: No.  We're trying to remove python-xml from the archive
<slytherin> ScottK: so what do you suggest? Look for alternate APIs and then add patches?
<ScottK> slytherin: Yes.  or as a last resort copy the needed bits of python-xml into the package and use it from a private directory.
<ScottK> slytherin: Will you look into it?
<\sh> mok0: you need to adjust examples/octave.desktop.in :)
<\sh> mok0: the other stuff is done from rules it looks like
<slytherin> ScottK: I will try tonoght.
 * mok0 looks
<ScottK> slytherin: OK.  I'll assign you the bug.  Let me know if you get stuck.
<slytherin> ScottK: sure. tell me your timezone so that I will know when to ping you. :-)
<mok0> \sh: yeah looks like it. I need to figure out how the Categories are mapped out to menu items.
<ScottK> slytherin: -0400.  You?
<slytherin> ScottK: +5:30
<slytherin> ScottK: So you will be accessible to me when I am at home tonight. :-)
<ScottK> slytherin: I'll be here most of my day, so chances are yes.
<mok0> What is the difference between a .menu entry and a .desktop entry? Both seem to be read by kde4
<slytherin> ScottK: a brief look doesn't give any idea. will do more debugging later
<\sh> mok0: .menu files are debian specific...man menufiles
<ScottK> slytherin: Thanks for looking into it.  We're down to 2 packages that need python-xml (until your report I thought it was one), so we're very close to being able to get rid of this package.
<mok0> \sh: it is the /usr/share/applications entry that gives problems with octave
<\sh> mok0: mok0 this should from the .desktop file then
<mok0> \sh: yes, it is
<\sh> mok0: ok...desktop-file-validate will give some warnings too..if you are on it, please fix them too
<mok0> \sh: I will fix it and submit a patch
<mok0> \sh: ok
<\sh> mok0: when you file a bug ( or you did already, assign the bug to me...I was the stupid one who made octave3.0 possible :()
<mok0> \sh: why was that stupid?
<\sh> mok0: because the guy who touched it last or synced it is responsible ,->
<mok0> \sh: ah :-)
<mok0> \sh: now you'll get the chance to repent :-)
<mok0> \sh: with such a minor change, is it necessary to create a patch in debian/patches, or is it ok to leave it with diff.gz ??
<\sh> mok0: if it has a patch system, use it...if not leave it in diff.gz
<mok0> let's see...
<\sh> it has dpatch
<mok0> patch it is, then :-)
<\sh> mok0: dpatch-edit-patch :)
<mok0> doing it this very minute :-)
<bobbo> slytherin; pong
<slytherin> bobbo: I was going to point you to pyslide problem. See if you can work on it.
<bobbo> slytherin; ok, i'll have a look
<mok0> \sh, what is your lp ident?
<mok0> \sh, got it
<sebner> aloha afflux :)
<afflux> heya sebner :)
<\sh> mok0: shermann :)
<mok0> \sh thanks
<\sh> sorry...we are in prelive rollout mood at work :)
<mok0> \sh: bug 209701 is now owned by you :-)
<ubotwo> Launchpad bug 209701 in octave3.0 "[hardy] octave appears by itself in science menu" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/209701
<sharperguy> Anyone know how to get an app to put an icon in the menu when you make install?
<bddebian> Heya gang
<hyperair_> hi
<sharperguy> Anyone know how to get an app to put an icon in the menu when you make install?
<nijaba> sharperguy: you need a desktop file
<sharperguy> right
<sebner> ahoi bddebian
<mok0> \sh: damn
<bddebian> Hi sebner
<geser> Hi bddebian
<bddebian> Heya geser
<sharperguy> Yeah I remember those, so what do I do with it when I make it?
<nijaba> sharperguy: look in /usr/share/applications/
<sharperguy> right...
<nijaba> sharperguy: this is documented in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/SupplementaryFiles
<sharperguy> ok tu
<sharperguy> *ty
<sharperguy> *cheers (sorry I know this isnt IM)
<\sh> mok0: ?? :)
<mok0> \sh: ah, it's just that my patch wasn't getting applied... fixed now
<mok0> \sh: I had to edit debian/in/octave3.0-00list ...
<mok0> \sh: which I didn't, the first time around...
<mok0> \sh: the package takes forever to build, even though I have a really fast machine
<\sh> mok0: no problem :) I built normaly over night when it's a long waiting for results package ;()
<mok0> \sh: yeah... I thought the fix was trivial, so I went ahead and uploaded before the package finished building :-P
<\sh> siretart: are you sure about gnucash and hardy? gnucash in hardy is already Version: 2.2.4-1ubuntu1
<siretart> \sh: did you really use the new gnucash with hbci on hardy yet?
<\sh> siretart: no...but I thought before people are complaining about the version ;) does it work somehow with 2.2.4-1ubuntu1?
<siretart> \sh: AFAIUI, it uses libgwenhyfar for the 'lowlevel' stuff. this means that if something is broken there, gnucash will be broken as well
<siretart> I'm still on gutsy on my main laptop, because I know that gnucash does work there :)
<proppy> hi
<proppy> how can I create a ipex chroot ?
<\sh> siretart: could you send me the changes you made on the 2.2.1 source for gnucash and I can try to build and test it...
<RainCT> proppy: ipex?
<siretart> \sh: there shouldn't be any changes necessary. just try the source from debian/unstable (+ your patches if applicable)
<RainCT> proppy: if you Ibex (Hardy+1), it has no repositories yet, so you can't
<proppy> RainCT: thanks for the tip
<siretart> the codename is 'intrepid', not ibex
<siretart> like 'hardy', and not 'heron'
<siretart> or 'gutsy', and not 'gibbon'
<\sh> siretart: so 2.2.4 in debian is already prepared? :)
<siretart> prepared for what?
 * \sh doesn't use hbci yet...so I don't know how to enable it ;)
<siretart> ah, I see
<siretart> you'll need this ofx plugin for libgwenhyfar and gnucash
<\sh> siretart: ok...will read me through the guides and start convincing my bank to have webbanking and hbci
<siretart> \sh: if all works well, there should be a new menu point: Actions-> Online Actions
<siretart> try starting up gnucash and see if you have such a menu
<\sh> gwenhyfar47?
<siretart> yes, that's the new one
<siretart> it is linked against gnutls instead of libssl, which was the point of the excercise
<siretart> oh, that late already... :(
<\sh> ok...yeah.../me needs to go too :9
<\sh> ok..cu later
<james_w> siretart: hi, where do the gnucash packages need testing from? Are they in hardy or a PPA?
<siretart> james_w: gnucash itself should be up-to-date in hardy, however I don't expect them to work with hbci at all. updated packages are in the gnucash PPA, which desperatly need testing
<siretart> see my mail to -motu earlier today
<james_w> siretart: ok, thanks.
<nxvl> james_w: hi!
<james_w> hi nxvl
<emgent> nxvl: heya
<nxvl> emgent: :D
<siretart> james_w: do you use gnucash with hbci?
<james_w> ah, nope, I missed the point then? It's not just general testing you need (outside of the normal general testing that's always needed)?
<siretart> well, installation and a small startup is also appreciated :)
<james_w> I'm sure I can manage that.
<siretart> the most interesting point however is if online banking via hbci works. TBH, I haven't met any user of hbci outside germany yet
<siretart> so I was curious if english banks offer hbci as well
<james_w> no, I just checked and my bank doesn't seem to offer it
<james_w> I'll write and complain that I can't test your packages properly because they don't support it
<siretart> it's pretty popular in germany, nearly every bank offer it. However, it seems that most desk clerks don't really understand it :/
<siretart> yay :)
 * siretart hugs james_w 
<james_w> siretart: starts fine and the wizard runs ok. It's not terribly obvious now how to set opening balances for accounts in the wizard, I'm sure it used to be better.
<milli> any committment for bug 180619 for Hardy?
<ubotwo> Launchpad bug 180619 in vnc4 "Xorg module VNC cores on keyboard input" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/180619
<ScottK> warp10: Congratulations.
<milli> I'm guessing no
<huats> warp10: congrats
<sebner> warp10: just saw the mail. congratulations :D
<sebner> ScottK: did you notice my monodevelop FFe merge?
<cody-somerville> warp10, congratsz :) You're the 112th member! :D
<jpatrick> cody-somerville: who was the 111?
<jpatrick> warp10: congrats!
<sebner> jpatrick: cody-somerville himself ;)
<ScottK> sebner: I saw it, but didn't have time to look at it.
<jpatrick> sebner: ;)
<sebner> ScottK: k. np
<ScottK> sebner: I'm not the one you really want looking at Mono stuff anyway.  For me it's more of a feature if it's not working.
<sebner> ScottK: hrhr. but it's working so *I* want it in hardy :P really np. I'll find someone else
<sebner> cody-somerville: btw, why 112th member? LP shows 85 active and 25 inactive. So he is number 111th
<cody-somerville> I was going by ubuntu-dev
<cody-somerville> but it appears it is at 111 anyhow
<cody-somerville> Someone must have deactivated
<sebner> k
<warp10> ScottK, huats, sebner, cody-somerville, jpatrick: thank you very much! :-)
<pochu> warp10: congratulations!
<warp10> hey pochu, thank you :)
<mok0> If there are MOTUs online with time to spare, please take a look at at bug 188086 and bug188093 . I'd really like to get them out of the way. Thanks!
<ubotwo> Launchpad bug 188086 in xtide "[needs-merge] xtide-2.9.5-2 from sid" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/188086
<pochu> bug 188093
<ubotwo> Launchpad bug 188093 in xtide-data "[needs-sync] xtide-data-20070318-1 from sid" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/188093
<txwikinger> where can I see the packages again that have been dropped?
<geser> txwikinger: you mean removed from the archive?
<txwikinger> geser: yes
<geser> http://people.ubuntu.com/~ubuntu-archive/removals.txt
<txwikinger> thanks geser
<ScottK> warp10: Don't forget to go back and upload anything you had in the sponsor's queue.
<pochu> and everything else :)
<ScottK> pochu: That's your job.  Thanks for bringing it up.
<mok0> pocho, did you get a chance to look at the xtide bugs?
<mok0> s/pocho/pochu
<pochu> I didn't look at them
<mok0> ok
<mok0> pochu: I'll poke one of the guys who've been involved earlier...
<pochu> if they are trivial I can look at them, but if they are not I prefer not to, as I have other things to do
<mok0> pochu: they are pretty trivial
<mok0> pochu: the main thing is that both get uploaded
<pochu> mok0: doesn't bug 188086 need a FFe ?
<mok0> pochu: no, because it fixes a bug
<mok0> pochu: no new features
<pochu> ah, ok
<mok0> ScottK: are you here?
<mok0> pochu: I dunno... you think I need to get an ack?
<pochu> mok0: I haven't looked at the upstream changelog yet
<pochu> I'm reading the bug and the debdiff right now
<\sh> mok0: building octave
<mok0> \sh: ... and that will go on for a while...
<\sh> mok0: well, don't care...I had to recreate my whole dapper-hardy schroot lvm devices..
<mok0> \sh: yikes. What happened?
<\sh> mok0: see #ubuntu-devel
<\sh> mok0: i didn't do an fsck of the ext3 fs on those..and now there were some lvm devices missing because of corrupted superblock
<\sh> mok0: i fixed it now with recreating, and forcing mk-sbuild-lv to use xfs instead of crappy ext3
<mok0> \sh: I've had that happen to me, but I never found out what happened
<mok0> \sh: fsck hosed it
<jdong> \sh: wait you're trusting xfs_repair over e2fsck?
<\sh> jdong: no...I'm not trusting any tool which tells me to fix an corrupted fs :)
<jdong> don't get me wrong, I love XFS and I use it, but "easy to repair" and "resistant to corruption" are NOT on the top of its feature lists :)
<\sh> jdong: well, tbh i never had a failed xfs fs in my life...
<\sh> jdong: but many ext2 and ext3 and reiserfs brokeness
<\sh> (well, reiserfs is now in jail ;))
<\sh> mok0: http://paste.ubuntu.com/6286/ and my device list grows
<mok0> only version 4 :-)
<jdong> \sh: well I'm gonna pop your bubble and say that I've had plenty of XFS failures, and not related to the 2.6.17 infamy either
<warp10> ScottK: sure! I'm just waiting to be added into the team on launchpad.
 * ScottK kicks nixternal
<warp10> :)
<\sh> jdong: well, i had my problems during upgrade from 2.6.12 to 2.6.14...where vanilla upstream changed the eit/gpt stuff and broke all >2TB devices we had :(
<\sh> jdong: but I had never a problem with xfs...strange :(
<jdong> \sh: ouch. My problems have usually been serious filesystem corruption, often beyond xfs_repair's abilities to resurrect, after a string of improper shutdowns
<mok0> warp10: congrats with being  MOTUed
<warp10> thank you mok0 :)
<jdong> \sh: of course I'm using run-of-the-mill consumer-grade hard drives and one could easily place the blame on hardware....
 * ScottK kicks mok0
<mok0> *ouch*
<jdong> but overall I've found EXT3 more resilient, though still not anywhere near perfect, to this
<\sh> jdong: well, using XFS as main fs (only /boot is ext2) on my desktops and servers I'm quiet ok with it..no problems so far...server side as well...but the server half-life time is around 8 months and 2 years without rebooting (when they are not on the public front of the network)
<jdong> \sh: awesome. I always find myself coming back to XFS for its consistent performance over long periods of time and superior backup/restore tools
<jdong> my primary system is currently XFS 100%
<jdong> but I do have to say that I've experienced massive XFS corruption on more than one occasion linked to bad powerdowns
<\sh> jdong: and you should try to use ext3 on 6TB volumes...it's a shame that you have to wait at least 6-10 mins or more (depending on the raid controller) to succeed with the creation of the FS
<jdong> just so that you're aware it's not bulletproof
<jdong> \sh: oh no kidding, I wouldn't suggest using ext3 on that kind of setup
<\sh> jdong: well, software is never bulletproof
<jdong> ain't that the truth :)
<\sh> bah...should I package wireshark 1.0 or do we get it for free from debian?
<nixternal> warp10: Andrea Colangelo (warp10) has been added as a member of this team.
<nixternal> sorry, it was the one thing I forgot to do :)
<warp10> nixternal: :D Thank you!
<nixternal> congrats and welcome!
<warp10> nixternal: :) thank you! My pleasure to be member of the family
<sebner> warp10: remember to join u-u-s ;)
<\sh> warp10: btw...congrats :)
<Scientus> any/j vmware
<Matthias_M> Hi, just wanted to say that I uploaded gnocky_0.0.5-1_i386.deb using dput both to upload.ubuntu.com and revu.tauware.de see also https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/209236 this is my first package
<crimsun> err
<\sh> lol?
<\sh> Matthias_M: I think you just got something wrong...
<warp10> sebner: for sure! :)
<warp10> \sh: thank you :)
<\sh> Matthias_M: as you are not core nor universe member you can't upload to upload.ubuntu.com
<Matthias_M> dput without parameters uploads to upload.ubuntu.com by default, but it is already rejected (got a mail a second ago)
<sebner> warp10: great :D
<sebner> Matthias_M: you shouldn't upload the *.deb ;)
<\sh> Matthias_M: yes, that's why the documentation tells us, to use the revu part :)
<Matthias_M> everything around the .deb is also uploaded
<sebner> Matthias_M: dput revu package_version_source.changes
<sebner> Matthias_M: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU
<Matthias_M> done
 * ScottK changed his dput.cf to upload to a place called bob after the first time he uploaded to u.u.c instead of his PPA by accident.
<Matthias_M> but I can't login at http://revu.tauware.de/ and I don't see my uploaded package
<\sh> Matthias_M: the .deb is not necessary .. we don't care about binary packages, just the .dsc,.diff.gz,.orig.tar.gz is important :)
<\sh> ScottK: lol...in the old, dark days of motu, where we didn't have the "ubuntu" upload area as default, I uploaded every now and then to debian :)
<Matthias_M> I just did dput revu '/home/matthias/.debcreator/gnocky/gnocky_0.0.5-1_i386.changes' and I think the program took care of that (dsc, tar.gz, diff.gz, deb, changes are uploaded)
<Matthias_M> but it still says no REVU account exists and does not show my package
<\sh> Matthias_M: you don't use the binary changes file..use the _source.changes file :)
<\sh> Matthias_M: did you attach your public gpg key to your LP account? did you ask for a sync of the revu keyring to include your key
<Matthias_M> I uploaded my GPG to LP yesterday, it says there is a 24h auto-sync.
<james_w> I think it may be down at the moment, I'm not sure
<Matthias_M> I reuploaded the sources version this time: gnocky_0.0.5-1_source.changes
<\sh> mok0: I'm uploading the stuff after the build (eventually tomorrow morning...I'm going to bed now)
<mok0> \sh: great, thanks
<RainCT> Matthias_M: was your package on REVU accepted?
<Matthias_M> I don't know, dput says it's okay, but I did not get an email.
<RainCT> Matthias_M: At the moment REVU sends no emails (beside one to a mailing list). Can you see your package on http://revu.tauware.de?
<Matthias_M> I don't see my package (gnocky 0.0.5) there and there is no message at http://lists.tauware.de/pipermail/motu-reviewers/2008-March/thread.html
<Matthias_M> Besides, I also uploaded my package to http://mentors.debian.net/cgi-bin/welcome as Ubuntu is currently in feature freeze, you might cancel my request at REVU.
<RainCT> Matthias_M: OK, then it was rejected. Although it says so, keys aren't synced automatically.
<Matthias_M> hmm.. menthors.debian.net also does not reply to me via eMail
<bddebian> Matthias_M: It has been down.  They are working on it
<Matthias_M> ok, then I'll try again tomorrow. good night
<blueyed_> warp10: congrats!
<warp10> thank you blueyed :)
<RainCT> good night
<m-c> greetings masters of the universe!  would someone please glance at this bug, which appears to be related to packaging?  I believe the program's author attached at fix, too.
<m-c> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mumble/+bug/202672
<ubotwo> Launchpad bug 202672 in mumble "installing mumble-server requires dbus" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<m-c> slicer: this is yours
<m-c> slicer: this is your application, I mean
<emgent> hi dendrobates :)
<dendrobates> hi emgent
<dendrobates> you finally found me with a minute to spare  :)
<emgent> ehehehe cool :)
#ubuntu-motu 2008-04-01
<xtknight> hmm i dont understand the response to Bug 204496
<blueyed> bug 204496
<xtknight> ( https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/204496 )
<xtknight> i thought the patch was suppoesd to be for the current version
<blueyed> xtknight: is the version in hardy broken? (2.x)
<xtknight> blueyed, i haven't checked
<xtknight> should i run the hardy version on gutsy?
<xtknight> ok ... i think i understand.  they are trying to get me to report the problem if exists in the development version.  but im still providing a patch for gutsy right?
<blueyed> xtknight: I think it's fixed, at least the interface changed (there's no "Help" menu, but only a button an it works)
<blueyed> xtknight: right.
<blueyed> For Gutsy you'll need a SRU, as Daniel pointed out.
<xtknight> k
<blueyed> xtknight: I think the bug should get closed and if you want to fix it for Gutsy (which is cumbersome), "Nominate [it] for release". I don't think it's critical enough though.
<xtknight> blueyed,  what release would i be nominating it for?  it's fixed in hardy right (well, assuming it is)?
<blueyed> xtknight: gutsy
<blueyed> xtknight: but please read the wiki page posted by Daniel first.
<xtknight> some other release of gutsy?
<xtknight> oh nominate for release places it in backports then...
<slangasek> no, backports are separate from release nominations
<slangasek> "nominate for release" -> SRU
<slangasek> ... which means, if the change doesn't fit the SRU policy, it will be declined
<xtknight> i guess i don't understand what "nominate for release" does on gutsy since gutsy has already been released.
<blueyed> xtknight: you'll nominate it for gutsy-updates
<xtknight> ok i guess i was misreading it.  i thought there would be some new release or sometihng.  i'm nominating it for an existing release..
<xtknight> now, it states to set hardy's bug report to Fix Released (if the bug does not exist in hardy).  hardy doesn't have a bug, so i didnt file a bug report for it.  does that mean i need to create a bug, or somehow set my current bug to Gutsy only?
<xtknight> on this page ( https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates  )
<blueyed> xtknight: you would close the existing bug and if the SRU for Gutsy gets approved, a new bug task for Gutsy appears.
<slangasek> xtknight: any bugs you file are implicitly shown as affecting the current development release.  So you should mark the bug as 'fix released' to indicate hardy has the bugfix, then nominate the bug for an SRU via 'nominate for release'
<xtknight> by close you mean set Bug 204496 to Fix Released?
<xtknight> hmm
<xtknight> ok
<xtknight> i see.  so the bug represents the latest dev version more than anything else
<xtknight> in the whole continuum of things
<bobbo> is anyone around to check an upload for me?
<slangasek> Fujitsu: no features added in the new upstream version for bug #208993?
<xtknight> how do i upload a package to release-proposed?
<emgent> heya people
<xtknight> i already put gutsy-proposed in the changelog
<emgent> xtknight: subscribe motu-sru and add Test case
<xtknight> emgent, ah ok.
<xtknight> thx
<xtknight> i mean step number 4 on procedures here.  it sounds like im supposed to uplpoad something to an ftp or something.  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates
<emgent> slangasek: thanks for turba2
<xtknight> because the earlier tests already said subscribe and add test cae?
<xtknight> case*
<xtknight> earlier steps*
<slangasek> emgent: no worries
<Fujitsu> slangasek: There's a FFe linked.
<slangasek> Fujitsu: why, so there is
<slangasek> Fujitsu: I'm used to seeing a single bug for the FFe and the sync request... more efficient on the submitter's side anyway, now you have a stray bug sitting open ;)
<Fujitsu> slangasek: Ah. Not any more.
<emgent> heya Fujitsu :)
<Fujitsu> Hi emgent.
 * Fujitsu disappears for lunh.
<Fujitsu> *lunch
<emgent> :)
<bddebian> Heya gang
<RAOF> Howbidie bddebian
<bddebian> Hi RAOF
<marnanel> I'm trying to build a package to do a debdiff.  What is it I have to do between introducing my new patch to debian/patches and running debuild -uc -us -S ?  I thought I used to know this...
<marnanel> It fails because "distclean" isn't a make target.
<RAOF> marnanel: That sounds like a bug in the package.  Does it build in Hardy?
<marnanel> I thought it did, but I will try again
<RAOF> What package?
<marnanel> gnome-alsamixer
<marnanel> make[2]: *** No rule to make target `gnome-alsamixer.schemas', needed by `all-am'.  Stop.
<marnanel> But it does compile and link the binary, so I can *test* it
<marnanel> Okay, and having got that far, debuild is okay
<marnanel> so I can actually make the debdiff
<marnanel> and test it
<marnanel> even if I can't actually do a full make
<marnanel> yes, rigorously engineered work going on tonight folks
<xtknight> may someone clarify exactly what i need to do in step four under Procedures here: https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/204496
<xtknight> sorry, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates
<jdong> apologies in advance for my contributions to April 1st.
<jdong> :D
<Fujitsu> jdong: I see you got the bug reference right.
<jdong> Fujitsu: that's just about the only thing that was right in that package :)
<jdong> Fujitsu: I called make with nested sudos in rules too :)
<Fujitsu> Hah, left *.ex in, I see.
<Fujitsu> Kwality packaging.
<jdong> all of em :)
<jdong> now.... who can spoof Accepted e-mails?
<Fujitsu> jdong: I'm sure you can work it out.
<ajmitch> jdong: shame you had to announce that you'd done something for april 1
<jdong> ajmitch: did it ruin the surprise factor for you?
<ajmitch> well I looked at irc before I read my mail
<ajmitch> 'essential', a nice touch there :)
<jdong> :)
<jdong> I almost contemplated Conflicts/Replaces: on update-manager and synaptic
 * ajmitch petitions the MC for revokation of upload rights
<jdong> lol
<ajmitch> nice, even the .pyc files
<jdong> ajmitch: lol I just unpacked upstream's deb, that's all unintentional :D
<jdong> (other than calling make with sudo in rules)
<Fujitsu> jdong: Did you do anything more than dh_make?
<Fujitsu> Oh, didn't notice that.
<Fujitsu> Very good.
<Fujitsu> That'll build well.
<StevenK> jdong: You're evil
<ajmitch> quick, where's an archive admin to accept it?
<jdong> :D
<StevenK> Hah
<StevenK> jdong: You should have set the release as gutsy-updates
<StevenK> :-P
<jdong> StevenK: hah
<jdong> well looks like it worked on Kees
<keescook> it was a good few seconds of confusion.  I enjoyed it.  :)
<TheMuso> jdong: automatix... please explain?
<TheMuso> And... the package desc is missing a description.
<jdong> TheMuso: calendar
<TheMuso> jdong: It would have been nice to see that at a glance from a package description, but you left the template there.
<StevenK> But it can't be obvious
<StevenK> That's the whole point
<nixternal> jdong: totally classic!
<jdong> :D
<ScottK> ajmitch: To bad the MC's been dithering and we don't actually have a firing policy yet.
<nixternal> shush
<nixternal> before we fire you!
<ScottK> You need the Tech Board to fire me now ...
<nixternal> remember, LP is closed source, so they haven't found all of the security issues yet..now if it were open, you might be a tad bit safer :p
<jdong> nixternal: it'd take you 6 months to fire him
<nixternal> probably more
 * nixternal wonders what happens when you pull "Ubuntu Membership"
<nixternal> wonder if that causes all of the other memberships to collapse
<Fujitsu> nixternal: It doesn't.
<nixternal> damn
<nixternal> ;p
<LaserJock> Fujitsu: pingaloo
<Fujitsu> LaserJock: Evening.
<LaserJock> Fujitsu: have you looked at bug #194687 at all?
<LaserJock> I think it is a -security issue
<Fujitsu> It is -security.
<Fujitsu> As it was broken in -security.
<Fujitsu> Was it not?
<Fujitsu> emgent was right to subscribe ubuntu-security in the first place.
<ScottK> Note to self: Do not make all your libdb database updates on the Hardy box in 4.6 and then copy the database onto the Gutsy box that's using 4.5.
<LaserJock> Fujitsu: right, so that doesn't need MOTU SRU correct?
<Fujitsu> LaserJock: correct.
<LaserJock> Fujitsu: is it worth having a gutsy task for that? I can accept emgent's nomination if so
<Fujitsu> LaserJock: We should have a task for Gutsy. I've just accepted it.
<LaserJock> he said it's fixed in hardy so might as well to be accurate
<Fujitsu> Oooh, I like edge's release nomination stuff.
<Fujitsu> No extra page loads for approving nominations.
<LaserJock> yeah
<LaserJock> wish there was more of that
<Fujitsu> I often do that for 5 releases, so it's a big thing for me.
<Amaranth> you mean launchpad is going web 2.0?
<Amaranth> that reminds me, i need to get them to change someone's name
<Amaranth> someone named themselves 'Compiz'
<jdong> does web 2.0 mean waiting a long time and putting in CAPTCHAs for everything?
<StevenK> If Web 2.0 == CAPTCHAs, count me out
<Amaranth> I'm trying to decide if I want the launchpad guys to change the name or wait for the bug triage guys to assign all bugs to that guy
<jdong> Amaranth: reverse spam sounds more appropriate
<\sh> moins
<\sh> jdong: you suck...you gave me just a heart stroke this morning with your automatix upload and fixing bug #1
<\sh> jdong: ;)
<slangasek> now would it be a better follow-up joke for me to accept it...
<\sh> slangasek: well, let sabdfl push the button so it looks like that it was "gods" fault ;-)
<RAOF> He filed the bug, it's only fair he accepts the upload that fixes it :)
<dholbach> good morning
<ajmitch> hi
<dholbach> hey ajmitch
<dholbach> how are you doing?
<ajmitch> alright, how are you?
<dholbach> good, thanks
<ajmitch> good to hear :)
<\sh> hey....old man ajmitch :)
 * ajmitch is feeling old after days like today
<ajmitch> first day of client testing for a big upgrade at work
<\sh> well, yeah....I request the deletion of the MOTU team...jdong just fixed the world and everything..so it's nothing left to do for us...
<ajmitch> great
<ajmitch> didn't anyone suggest to the TB that ubuntu switch to using fedora as a base rather than debian?
<milli> Yggadrasil would make a much better base than debian
<\sh> ajmitch: I think we should switch to BSD
<ajmitch> true
<milli> Redhat 5 wouldn't be a bad choice
<RAOF> Surely it's time GNU Herd got a major distro based off it, right?
<RAOF> s/herd/hurd/
<ajmitch> bddebian would be overjoyed
<\sh> milli: na rhel was forked by centos...
<\sh> BSD is the better choice...we could even get aqua for free from apple ;)
<StevenK> Ubunherd
<\sh> UBunSD ,->
<milli> Or perhaps DOS 5.x as a base.
<milli> Oh wait a sec.  That's been done already.
<\sh> oh well...
<\sh> mithrandir changed his job, too :(
<warp10> Good morning
<warp10> Is there an admin of u-u-s that may add me to the team, please?
<dholbach> warp10: done
<warp10> dholbach: great! thank you!
<dholbach> anytime :)
<Riddell> jdong: ahem
<ajmitch> Riddell: ACCEPTED?
<Riddell> hmmmm
<ogra_cmpc> Riddell, leave it in for today :)
<ogra_cmpc> (and notice the date)
<\sh> lol
<\sh> Riddell: read my blog ,-)
<Riddell> \sh: why, is this phpgroupware thing also a joke?
<\sh> Riddell: nope
<Riddell> \sh: oh, so I shouldn't have rejected it?
<\sh> Riddell: but automatix definitely fix bug #1 ,-> you should push it to the archives...or leave Mark the honour ;)
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 1 in ubuntu "Microsoft has a majority market share" [Critical,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1
<Riddell> ah well, https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-archive/2008-April/017142.html
<\sh> actually it made my day :)
<\sh> first I got a heart stroke this morning..and then I realized, it's time to wakeup
<Riddell> New Queue Zero!  I'm a genius.
<\sh> wait...I'll upload new crap ,-)
<ogra_cmpc> \sh, it would have been a lot funnier if you hadnt revealed the joke already on planet
<ogra_cmpc> we should have slashdotted it indeed *g*
<afflux> I've a package with debian/control.in and want to change the maintainer as in the DebianMaintainerField. Do I need to change both control and control.in?
<broonie> afflux: Most likely.
<broonie> afflux: If it's done sanely you should find that you only need to change control.in and control will be updated automatically.#
<afflux> but both will show up on the debdiff, right?
<broonie> yes
<afflux> alright, thanks
<afflux> dholbach: new debdiff attached to bug 186141. btw. juliux suggested you could have your bugs counted under ubuntu-de-locoteam :)
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 186141 in nautilus-actions "missing nautilus-actions menu entries" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/186141
<\sh> ogra_cmpc: tbh...riddles on dot.kde.org is better ,->
<\sh> just because it's from the 31.03 ;)
<Riddell> \sh: I can't be held responsible for the dot's timezone
<\sh> Riddell: but it's good :)
<\sh> 3,737,000      5.15K/s
<\sh> wow...wireshark is dead ;)
<soren> dead?
<\sh> well, everything which is under 10k is dead ;)
<soren> Oh, their *website*?
<Hobbsee> dholbach: i thought comments like https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/transmission/+bug/208836/comments/7 were supposed to go away?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 208836 in transmission "Feature Freeze Exception request for Transmission 1.10" [Wishlist,Incomplete]
<Hobbsee> jdong: would you prefer to be blasted on irc, or on the mailing list?
<ogra_cmpc_> Hobbsee, happy first of april :)
<Hobbsee> oh, sod it.
 * Hobbsee forgot!
<ogra_cmpc_> *grin*
 * ogra_cmpc_ hugs jdong 
<ogra_cmpc_> thats one of the best april fool okes i've seen in years
<ogra_cmpc_> *jokes
 * Hobbsee beats jdong
<Hobbsee> still, having the savage pleasure of rejecting it might have been nice....
<ogra_cmpc_> is it rejected already ?
<Hobbsee> yes
<ogra_cmpc_> gah .... the archive team really should have been notified in advance to keep it for today
<Hobbsee> it's 11pm on 1/4
<ogra_cmpc_> for you
<ogra_cmpc_> its 2pm here
 * Hobbsee is reminded of the monty python "Just kill him anyway"
<Iulian> Heya
 * Hobbsee reads the MC meeting minutes
<Hobbsee> hope they're not april fools too
<Hobbsee> s/irc council/ Hobbsee/ though, i'm the chanowner.
 * cody-somerville nods.
<Hobbsee> (in effect though, for anything motu-related, they'd delegate it to me as i'm the person here, so it really makes no difference though)
<soren> Hobbsee: The irc council has the final word, though, don't they? (I've little or no clue about our irc governance)
<cody-somerville> I would hope control  (ie. final say) of the channel would stay with the -motu team.
<Hobbsee> soren: not if they delegated it to me, no.  Although, from freenode POV, yes, they do.
<soren> I see.
<Hobbsee> oh wait.  does the GC trump the chanown?
 * Hobbsee asks
<Hobbsee> yes, it does, i'm told.
<Hobbsee> soren: so, the council has the final word.
<Hobbsee> but i think it's required that they have to discuss changes with me, being the chanown, assuming i've not gone backpacking to another country, or something.
<soren> Hobbsee: gc?
<Hobbsee> soren: group contact.  ie, irc council. it's a freenode thing.
<soren> Hobbsee: Ah.
<zul> I refuse to read slashdot on the first of apirl
<Hobbsee> zul: so read the forums instead!
 * Hobbsee glances at it
<Hobbsee> it's not pink this year!
<juliank> Hey, I need a motu-release ACK for bug #210215
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 210215 in aria2 "Please sync aria2 0.12.1-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)." [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/210215
<zul> Hobbsee: sure make me gouge out my eyesockets
<Hobbsee> haha
<zul> ow...
<jdong> lol morning everyone :D
<\sh> jdong: hehe...
<Hobbsee> morning crack lover.
<jdong> lol
<jdong> sorry, couldn't resist :D
 * Hobbsee had talked about doing that at UDS, actually - but not for april fools
<ogra_cmpc_> jdong, so what about a backport ?
<ogra_cmpc_> feisty and gutsy users will want it as well :)
<jdong> lol indeed :D
<jdong> bug 210292
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 210292 in gutsy-backports "Please Backport Hardy Heron to Gutsy" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/210292
<jeromeg> jdong: i'm uploading it to my ppa ;) just wiat a few days
<jeromeg> *wait
<jdong> jeromeg: we may need a source change backport so that LSB release version is 8.04~gutsy1
<jeromeg> jdong: i'll investigate this :)
<norsetto> a good fool's day (or night) to all
<\sh> rotflbtc
<\sh> anyone read http://blog.drinsama.de/erich/en/linux/debian/2008040101-renaming-directories.html from erich schubert?
<jpatrick> \sh: afternoon :))
<\sh> hey jpatrick
<jpatrick> \sh: I forgot the name of the distro that did that..
<soren> GoboLinux
<jpatrick> ah yeah: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GoboLinux
<soren> Madness.
<\sh> jpatrick: well, but "Ubuntu X" ,-) and the idea never came from the famous sabdfl ;)
<\sh> jpatrick: and the idea is horrible....;) /system/Administrator -> well...it's my job title ;)
<jpatrick> \sh: I think we'll have time to implement it, seeing as Hardy is being delayed for 3 months (#ubuntu /topic)
<\sh> jpatrick: right ;)
<\sh> ok...time to leave for home :)
<\sh> cu later
<mok0> RainCT: ping
<marnanel> I'm trying to debuild a package which has a patch added in debian/patches, but after I debuild -S -uc -s, debdiff just shows the changelog entry.
<marnanel> Is there something I should do to get the patch included in the source package that I'm not already doing?
<mok0> marnanel: no
<james_w> marnanel: hi, do you run "debuild -S -uc -s"
<james_w> that last -s looks suspicious, I think you want -us
<marnanel> Oh, I'm sorry, I put "debuild -S -us -uc", actually
 * marnanel tries it again
<james_w> marnanel: and check the output for messages about not including the file in the diff
<james_w> for instance it won't include files it thinks are binary.
<mok0> debuild -S -sa -uc -us
<norsetto> afternoon mok0, or should I say, Master mok0?
<mok0> norsetto: afternoon! :-) The Master part is a bit premature
<norsetto> mok0: yes, timing was never my strong point either ;-)
<mok0> Hehe, april 1st, yes...
<norsetto> mok0: I must say I'll be glad to pass the GrandDad title to somebody else :)
<mok0> Ah, but isnt't it good to be a wise, old MOTU?
<mok0> Like Yoda, even though he is 300 years old, he kicks ass! :-)
<norsetto> mok0: the older the kickier usually
<mok0> hehehe
<mok0> norsetto:btw, the gfortran transition seems to be almost done...
<norsetto> mok0: I sure hope so!
<mok0> I am impressed, it went really fast
<norsetto> mok0: actually, only things left is the removal of some packages and that should be it
<mok0> Why removal?
<norsetto> mok0: heck, the biggest work was done by the good folks in Debian
<mok0> true
<norsetto> is it me or launchpad is getting slower and slower
<sebner> norsetto: LP -.-
<RainCT> Heya
<sebner> norsetto: btw, looked at my FFe for monodevelop?
<norsetto> sebner: no time yet
<sebner> norsetto: k, np
<RainCT> mok0: pong
<marnanel> dpkg-genchages reported that it wasn't including source, until I added the -sa switch (thanks, mok0), but that still didn't change debdiff not showing the new file
<marnanel> Oh wait
<marnanel> "No rule to make target 'distclean'", way back in the scrollback
<marnanel> I thought that happened the other day;  I wonder how it can do a regular make if it can't distclean
<james_w> marnanel: is the debian/rules calling distclean?
<marnanel> james_w: the word "distclean" does not exist in debian/rules.  Where should it be?
<james_w> marnanel: I don't know, what's trying to execute it then?
<marnanel> oh, I see
<marnanel> Hang on, running again and watching carefully
<james_w> if you want you can pastebin the output and we can have a look.
<warp10> Hi all
<james_w> I'm sure you can spot it, but sometimes you just want to get it done.
<sebner> hoi warp10 our newest motu :P
<marnanel> Thanks :) I'm sure it's something obvious but I can't see it.  Hang on, pastebin coming up.
<RainCT> hi warp10, gratz
<marnanel> warp10: congrats.
<warp10> hey sebner :)
<norsetto> congrats warpie
<warp10> RainCT, marnanel: thank you! :)
<norsetto> ops, congrats master warpie ...
<marnanel> http://pastebin.ca/966306
<warp10> ciao norsetto, thank you :D
<norsetto> sebner: I think tomorrow or day after we should have a conky package source ready for the FFe
<sebner> norsetto: in sid?
<norsetto> sebner: no, in the svn. It will take longer for it to be in the archive
<marnanel> james_w: any ideas?  I'm stuck, for now.  I'll have another look when I get home :/
<sebner> norsetto: ah. ok. btw. I never had anything to do with these svn repos. any links, docs for me?
<james_w> marnanel: ah, sorry, missed it at first
<slytherin> Wow. That April fool's joke was nice. :-)
<slytherin> jdong: Thanks for the entertainment. :-)
<jdong> ;-)
<norsetto> sebner: just install svn (if you don't have it already) and do an svn co address destination and it will create a local copy
<sebner> norsetto: yeah. I know that ^^ but in generel for ubuntu related things
<james_w> marnanel: Use of uninitialized value in pattern match (m//) at /usr/bin/dpkg-source line 429. looks a little odd
<norsetto> sebner: what related things!?
<james_w> marnanel: CFLAGS="-UG_DISABLE_DEPRECATED -UGDK_DISABLE_DEPRECATED -UGTK_DISABLE_DEPRECATED -UGNOME_DISABLE_DEPRECATED" /usr/bin/make -C . -k distclean is what calls it
<sebner> norsetto: ah sry. misunderstood something. btw conky 1.5.1 is out
<norsetto> sebner: yes, thats what we packaged
<sebner> norsetto: fine :D
<mario_limonciell> jdong, what was the joke?, i missed it :(
<james_w> marnanel: it's a cdbs package, so it's probably one of the included makefile snippets that calls it.
<slytherin> Does anyone know how the new archive backend in gvfs works? How to make use of it?
<slytherin> mario_limonciell: Check motu mailing list archives
<marnanel> james_w: ah, weird.
<jdong> mario_limonciell: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-motu/2008-April/thread.html
<mario_limonciell> ha!
<mario_limonciell> very nice.
 * marnanel will look at this tonight; I should  be working now, and it's beyond what I know how to fix trivially
<bddebian> Heya gang
<norsetto> heya bddebian
<cody-somerville> Heya bddebian
<bddebian> Hi norsetto, cody-somerville
<sebner> heya bddebian
<bddebian> Hi sebner
 * norsetto -> dinner
<mok0> you mean dinner -> norsetto
<Iulian> Is Hardy going to be delayed by three months?
<Iulian> Uhhmm, is this a joke?
<soren> Yeah.
<Iulian> Ah ha, thought so :)
<Iulian> Well, I shouldn't ask that question anyway.
<slytherin> Iulian: franly you shouldn't read any blogs, news sites on 1st April :-P
<Iulian> slytherin: Yeah indeed.
<DktrKranz> neither hardy-changes :P
<slytherin> DktrKranz: Which mail are you referring to?
<slytherin> DktrKranz: I thought only motu list was affected by 1st April
<DktrKranz> slytherin, God save NEW queue :)
<slytherin> :-D
<danielm> http://blogs.zdnet.com/microsoft/?p=1304
<nixternal> how goeth greyskull today?
 * norsetto <- dinner
 * pochu wishes mok0 good luck with his MOTU application, so that he can upload his stuff himself ;)
<pochu> mok0: not that you need it though... :)
 * mok0 thanks pochu :-)
<pochu> mok0: I don't feel very comfortable uploading xtide. It looks fine, but it's a bit late and I don't know it
<pochu> but hopefully you will be able to upload it on your behalf very soon :)
<mok0> pochu: that ok, I can ask norsetto or one of the guys who have looked at it before
<mok0> pochu: I just want to get it off my list :-)
 * norsetto thinks mok0 will soon make his furst upload
<mok0> norsetto: I think I will just wait and see
<mok0> norsetto: If I'm not able to upload before the 23. I'll ping you :-)
<norsetto> mok0: wait and see ....
<sebner> mok0: what's on the 23ten?
<sebner> 23 th
<mok0> sebner: last day before hardy release :-)
<sebner> mok0: I know  but why aren't you able to upload before this day?
<mok0> sebner: because I am not a MOTU
<sebner> mok0: but on 23th you become one?
<mok0> sebner: but hope to be soon
<sebner> mok0: ^^. I will follow you in some months :D
<mok0> sebner: lol
<emgent> heya
<pochu> hi emgent
<sebner> pochu: you are ff crazy guy, right?
<pochu> sebner: lol, yes I am :)
<sebner> pochu: ff 3.0 beta5 is out. /me waves :D
<pochu> I love exceptions ;)
<sebner> pochu: ff = firefox
<sebner> ^^
<pochu> well, I'm not a mozilla guy... tell fta, but he's likely aware :)
<RainCT> sebner: officialy Fx but well :P
<sebner> RainCT: never heard about Fx for firefox ^^
<pochu> try: upload_package()
<RainCT> learned that in spreadfirefox.com (and it's explained on firefox.com's FAQ iirc) :P
<pochu> except FeatureFreezeException: request_exception()
<pochu> :)
<sebner> hrhr
<fta> beta5 out ? i don't think so; it's still in QA
<sebner> RainCT: well in german it's common to say ff
<RainCT> sebner: everywhere I know actually :)
<sebner> ^^
<sebner> fta: not offical I suppose ^^ ftp://ftp.mozilla.org/pub/firefox/releases/3.0b5/linux-i686/
<fta> yes, but that's just b5 rc2 for now
<fta> http://en-us.www.mozilla.com/en-US/firefox/3.0b5/releasenotes/
<fta> and if you run it, you'll get: http://en-us.www.mozilla.com/en-US/firefox/3.0b5/whatsnew/
<fta> "it's a trap! You've downloaded a release candidate of Firefox 3 Beta 5"
<sebner> fta: ohhh :\ ^^
<jcastro> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/puppet/+bug/204066
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 204066 in puppet "Please sync puppet 0.24.4-3 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)." [Undecided,Confirmed]
<jcastro> can a motu look at this when they get a chance?
<jcastro> according to the wiki a sync request should have a ubuntu-universe-sponsors added to it, I hope that's still the case.
<sebner> jcastro: why is ubuntu-archive subscribed? and set to Confirmed?
<jcastro> I don't know how ubuntu-archive got subscribed
<jcastro> should the status be New?
<sebner> jcastro: yes
<DktrKranz> sebner, basically because thom is core-dev :)
<sebner> DktrKranz: ^^
<sebner> jcastro: btw. it's a new upstream release. only bugfixes?
<sebner> jcastro: otherwise you need a FFe
<jcastro> yes.
<jcastro> according to the upstream maintainer it's strictly bugfixes
<andrea_c7a> Hi. I created a debdiff to fix bug #201330. Now I should look for a sponsor but https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SponsorshipProcess is not very clear on how to do this. Shall I set it as "Fix Released" ? Why not "Fix Committed" ? Why "unsubscribe ubuntu-main-sponsors" ?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 201330 in compiz "Need to whitelist multiple ATI cards, or remove blacklisting" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/201330
<sebner> jcastro: ok
<sebner> DktrKranz: It's you turn :P
<DktrKranz> sebner, huh=
<DktrKranz> s/=/\?/
<sebner> DktrKranz: he is looking for a motu :P
<DktrKranz> compiz requires core-dev superpowers :)
<sebner> ah
<sebner> DktrKranz: they should leave a comment -.-
<sebner> jcastro: they are already working on it. just wait
<jcastro> cool, thanks so much!
<sebner> I haven't done anything but ok. you're welcome ^^
<andrea_c7a> DktrKranz: I have no core-dev superpowers but aren't common mortals still allowed to propose a patch to fix a bug ?
<DktrKranz> andrea_c7a, of course :)
<ajmitch> jcastro: hey dude
<DktrKranz> but I could be little help here
<andrea_c7a> shall I click "nominate for release" after sending a comment with the patch attached ?
<andrea_c7a> has anybody here ever done this before ?
<afflux> andrea_c7a: first of all, you should create a debdiff. Afterwards, subscribe ubuntu-main-sponsors and then wait untill the patch get's uploaded by a sponsor.
<andrea_c7a> debdiff is done. I'm about to send it and subscribe ubuntu-main-sponsors as you say. Thanx for help
<RainCT> good night
<norsetto> yes, g'night all
#ubuntu-motu 2008-04-02
<bddebian> Heya gang
<RAOF> Yo! bddebian !
<bddebian> Hi RAOF
<emgent> :)
<bddebian> Hello emgent
<kgoetz> is the maintainer of the ubuntu sugar packages here?
<cody-somerville> Jani? No.
<cody-somerville> He doesn't usually hang out on IRC
<kgoetz> mm ok.
<kgoetz> i was hoping to talk to him about making my install work ;)
<cody-somerville> :)
<cody-somerville> jani@ubuntu.com
<kgoetz> i'll let him get to the bug when hes ready. just thought i might be able to pin him about it
<jdong> ScottK: bug 209012 has an inappropriate status set, correct?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 209012 in monodevelop "[FFe] Merge monodevelop_1.0+dfsg-1 from Debian(Unstable)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/209012
<warp10> Good morning
<dholbach> good morning
<warp10> good morning dholbach
<dholbach> hi warp10
<elmargol> siretart, you there?
<\sh> moins
<emgent> heya
<mok0> k
<mok0> k
<siretart> elmargol: at work, what's up?
<siretart> elmargol: email is the safest way
<elmargol> siretart, did you notice that xine is atm broken on hardy?
<siretart> elmargol: oh, sorry, is there a bug nr yet?
<elmargol> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xine-lib/+bug/210510
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 210510 in xine-lib "[Hardy Heron] Some formats including quicktime (.mov) and m4v stop playing with xine after upgrade" [Undecided,New]
<siretart> ah, that one, I'm aware of it
<siretart> I'll update the bugreport, thanks
<siretart> elmargol: I frightened me. xine is not broken, a demuxer of xine is
<emgent> heya siretart :)
<siretart> hey emgent
<dholbach> congratulations mok0
<mok0> dholbach: It's a bit premature to congratulate, I think
<mok0> dholbach: unless you know something that I don't :-)
<dholbach> mok0: I don't think so :)
<warp10> Congrats mok0! :-D
<mok0> warp10: :-)
 * mok0 is somewhat puzzled
<soren> mok0: Yeah, congrats.
<mok0> soren: ... and thanks for the +1  :-P
<mok0> Ah, now I see my email :-D
<mok0> Yay
<siretart> elmargol: fix uploaded
<james_w> congratulations mok0
<mok0> Thanks james_w! I just saw the email a few moments ago!
<mok0> Definitely cool
<pochu> mok0: congrats :)
<mok0> Thanks pochu! I can take care of xtide myself now :-D
<pochu> :-)
<james_w> who's next then?
<\sh> mok0: congrats :)
<mok0> Thanks \sh!
<elmargol> siretart, thx
<mok0> Is gcalctool a calendar??? https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/gcalctool
<mok0> I would say calculator
<\sh> mok0: hmmm
<\sh> mok0: lol
<mok0> \sh that package is so buggy it should be removed from hardy
<mok0> We can't make a release with a buggy calculator!!
<mok0> ... and there are plenty of others available
<ScottK2> mok0: Congratulations.
<mok0> ScottK2: Thanks! Wouldn't have happened without you!
<mok0> ScottK2: Now I have to learn how to use my new powers ;-)
<mok0> ScottK2: I'll likely be asking a lot
<soren> mok0: Have you used a ppa before?
<james_w> s/learn/abuse/ :-)
<mok0> Yes, I have a ppa
<soren> mok0: Then you'll feel right at home :)
<soren> You just upload to upload.ubuntu.com/ instead of ppa.launchpad.net/~username/ubuntu
<mok0> soren: and then the packages appear in the queue, I assume?
<soren> mok0: Yeah, and get built and all that.
<mok0> soren: ... while completely new packages still need an ack from the archive-admin, right?
<soren> mok0: Right.
<soren> Both binary and source packages.
<soren> Which means:
<soren> a) if an existing source package starts building an extra binary package, that new binary package needs to be accepted by an admin.
<soren> and
<soren> b) if you upload a new source package, first the source package needs to be accepted, then it gets built and then the resulting binaries need to be accepted.
<mok0> soren: very reasonable
<mok0> ... but noone actually checks to see if the application (say) in fact runs on a given platform? I do not have access to all supported platforms
<mok0> soren: ^
<soren> mok0: No, we rely on users for that.
<broonie> Well, people testing the development version will and any testsuites run during the package build will have been run.
<soren> mok0: Most arch-specific problems turn up at build time, though.
<soren> I think.
<soren> :)
<mok0> soren: I've seen that happen :-)
<soren> Oh, sure, I'm just not entirely sure that *most* arch-specific problems will reveal themselves at build time. I think so, though.
<mok0> soren: you are probably right. If it builds, it runs, unless the application does something arch-specific that does not trigger a compile error or something
<soren> Right. I just don't have any statistics to back me up, so I should probably be careful with words like "most" :)
<mok0> heh
<mok0> yes
<broonie> A lot of arch-specific problems that don't stop the build will at least generate warnings during build.
<tjaalton> Seveaz: hey, falcon 2.0.5 is not in hardy :)
<Seveas> tjaalton, there are some issues
<tjaalton> Seveas: really? 2.0.4 is broken for me, but .5 works
<Hobbsee> boo
<Iulian> Hey
<RainCT> Hi
<siretart> has anyone seen tepsipakki latey?
<RainCT> mok0: that was fast, gratz! :)
<mok0> Thanks RainCT! Yeah it was fast! I was taken by surprise :-)
 * RainCT hadn't even time to answer :)
<Hobbsee> siretart: good response, btw
<siretart> to what?
<Hobbsee> wait.  wrong one.
 * Hobbsee meant sistpoty.
<Hobbsee> i always get confused with your two name <--> irc nick conversions.
<siretart> the stpoty == Stefan Potyra. my name is 'REinhard TARTler' :)
<soren> siretart: tepsipakki == tjaalton
<siretart> ah
<soren> siretart: Just like shawarma == soren. Things change :)
 * Hobbsee mumbles about canonical naming
<soren> It was (almost) unrelated to my joining Canonical.
<soren> It certainly wasn't mandated in any way.
<Hobbsee> just the others all seem to do it
<soren> At the first sprint I overheard someone say that if a nick wasn't used, you could hijack it. (on freenode)
<Hobbsee> ....no?
<Hobbsee> you can link to it, etc, though
<Hobbsee> i fyou have it registered, you can ghost people off it
<soren> I guess if I hadn't joined Canonical, I wouldn't have been at that sprint, and I wouldn't have known, and hence wouldn't have changed, so in a *very* Ã®ndirect way, it's because I joined Canonical :)
<soren> Hobbsee: If a nick hasn't been used for more than 6 months, you can ask to take it over.
<Hobbsee> oh, true
<soren> That's what I meant.
<Hobbsee> although i would expect that if the master nick was active, they'd say no
<soren> It's not like it automatically frees up so that you can just take it over somehow.
<soren> Hobbsee: Nope.
<soren> Hobbsee: I'm *almost* sure the previous master nick of "soren" was active (not much, though), but "soren" itself hadn't been used for almost two years. It was waay easy taking it over.
<Hobbsee> oh, strange
<Hobbsee> then again, freenode rules seem to change on who you get, at times
<soren> Lots easier than taking over #ubuntu-virt, for instance.
<Hobbsee> yeah, well.  erk, channels.
 * Hobbsee ponders what to say about till's core dev app
<\sh> Hobbsee: I'm biased
<\sh> Hobbsee: one the one hand, it would be good to have someone who has a lot of clue about printing to work in main...on the other hand, when you want to be a core-dev you need to be more careful even when you need packages in before FF badly
<Hobbsee> well...yeah...
<Hobbsee> so, i'm allowed to write that kind of thing?
<\sh> Hobbsee: if this is your opinion, too why not :)
<Hobbsee> \sh: i can't help wondering if these packages would still have been shoved through, in broken state, if till had *not* been working for canonical though.
<Hobbsee> presumably the community devs would have been looking at the work done, and would have rejected it due to the errors it contained, had it been from a community member.
<\sh> Hobbsee: well, motus can push packages without reviewing into ubuntus archive...I did that once, because I was really sure that I fixed all warnings, errors etc. from lintian and friends...but normally I go via revu...especially then when I need more then one pair of eyes to look at the package
<Hobbsee> \sh: that's different, isn't it?  they've done enough packaging to know how it all works?
<Hobbsee> oh wait, till was a MOTU
<\sh> Hobbsee: TBH, everyone makes mistakes...e.g. sometimes the copyright stuff is really a problem
<Hobbsee> oh, indeed.
<Hobbsee> i'd forgotten he was a MOTU for a second there
<Hobbsee> \sh: oh, rats.  MC makes the recommendation, then TB acts on their recommendation, right?
<soren> Hobbsee: Allowed to write what kind of thing?
<Hobbsee> soren: objections in general?
<soren> Hobbsee: Why shouldn't you be allowed when Stefan clearly is?
<Hobbsee> soren: because i'm hated by various people?
<Hobbsee> soren: i don't feel like being told i'm overreacting, when respectfully stating objections again.
<Hobbsee> hence, i'm fairly careful in what i write, when it comes to people, and them making questionable judgements.
<soren> Well, if you think you're right, go ahead. If people disagree, that's their right, too, surely?
<sladen> you don't have to be correct the first time, if it promotes a discussion
<crimsun> huh.  I thought Till was already core.
<zul> meh..
<Hobbsee> sladen: no, they just grill me if they didn't like what i said.
<\sh> grmpf
<\sh> Hobbsee: sry..I didn't get your last statements..because totem thinks about letting my desktop die when I use strace on it with an .flv file
<Hobbsee> \sh: http://pastebin.ca/967443
<\sh> Hobbsee: I think when we are not allowed to write or say our valid objections anymore, then the community model of ubuntu in general failed
<soren> Noone's barring anyone from saying anything.
<\sh> Hobbsee: actually...tbh...we shouldn't make any diff between someone who is doing voluntary work or someone who is freelancing for the company which sponsors the project...
<Hobbsee> \sh: we shouldn't, yes.  I'm just wondering if we are...
<Hobbsee> as in, we collectively
<\sh> Hobbsee: in 2006 it was my call that till went to UDS Paris and talked to pitti because of printing..(while he was still working for mandriva) so, I know he knows a lot of printing stuff and also packaging...(during our dinner he gave me a personal shock that till knew still the line numbers of special stuff inside cups' source, he scared me ;))
<soren> It's only natural to consider that fact that we know that these people work on Ubuntu all day long.
<Hobbsee> argh.  an envy-ng uvfe.
<\sh> soren: regarding his status, he is working for the linuxprintingfoundation...or what the name is
<soren> \sh: Right.
<soren> Hobbsee: What exactly would you expect people to do if they disagreed with you?
<Hobbsee> soren: dunno.  disagree politely, and not flame me to hell about it?  not discuss it in an office block, and then get multiple emails complaining about it, even from people who weren't even there?  Also, i'd appreciate people actually looking at the idea i'd put forth, rather than my actual manner of saying it, if they found that unpallatable.
<Hobbsee> the latter part, in particular.
<soren> Hobbsee: Er... So you want other people to disregard your tone, because you don't like *their* tone when they don't?
<Hobbsee> soren: is it a problem to drop all tone from all mails, and feel that people are trying to do the best they can, and may well have credible ideas, on both sides?
<Hobbsee> as in, pick the best possible interpretation, from all sides?
<soren> Do you think so?
<Hobbsee> i don't, no.
<soren> So what's the problem?
<Hobbsee> if i'm rude to people, then yes, call me on it.  if i've not done the mail with my rose coloured glasses firmly enough on, then look at what i mean, and don't flame me to hell.
<Hobbsee> that's what i'd *like*
 * soren is on the phone
<crimsun> TBH, just about all of us are rude at some point.  (e.g., I'm a PITA)
<Hobbsee> i find it crazy that if i say something with a glass-half-empty approach, people flame me for tone, and not being positive.  yet someone who says *exactly* the same thing, with their rose-coloured glasses on, glass half full, doesn't receive any censure at all, and people actually read the intent of their male.
<Hobbsee> now, obviously, i should ensure that i do it with the rose-coloured glasses on, but in the case that i don't, is it *really* productive to ignore the entire mail, and not take anything from it?
<soren> Not at all.
<Hobbsee> so, why does it happen?
<Hobbsee> and why do you think that i now don't speak much, because of that?
<soren> Yet, I've certainly seen e-mails that were written in a tone that so thoroughly and consistently invited me to ignore it or act on that instead.
<Hobbsee> all of them?
<soren> Huh?
<soren> No, I've seen e-mail that didn't. I get a *lot* of e-mail.
<soren> At some point, if someone consistently sends e-mail in such a tone, I (bloody human as I am) get annoyed as soon as I see that person's name on an e-mail.
 * \sh is an asshole from time to time, too...but it's just because you need to be one at certain times...even a CoC doesn't change that
<Hobbsee> soren: which is exactly why i don't bother sending mails now, a lot of the time.
<Hobbsee> what's done is done.
<Hobbsee> i can't change it now, when people have gone into ignore mode.
<soren> While being human, I also find myself to be rather reasonable.
<soren> If one of those people started to be not quite as testy, I might very well start to reconsider.
<Hobbsee> sometimes i wonder why i put effort into ubuntu at all, if everything gets ignored.
<soren> It doesn't happen overnight (just like getting to this point didn't)
<Hobbsee> no, but it appears to be a one way street, apparently.
<soren> I don't know what you're basing that on.
<soren> ..but I disagree.
<Hobbsee> if you ignore mail, then of course you don't see any good stuff.
<crimsun> OTOH, you also avoid a lot of flaming.
<Lamego> Hobbsee, some people have a personal orientation in being more noisy blocking/opposing other people participation, that is usually labeled as negative, IMHO you are such kind of person, regardless of the great things you do
<Hobbsee> crimsun: this is true.  i'm actually trying to stop that.  and wondering if it's worth it.
<crimsun> Hobbsee: well, trying is worth it.  I wouldn't worry about drama much; anytime you put people together, you get it.
<Hobbsee> crimsun: just that i don't get taken seriously at all anymore.
<Hobbsee> although i'm greatful to see that stefan agreed with my mail, so people should take what i said into consideration, through him.
<crimsun> Hobbsee: their seeming failures to accomodate your perspective should not drive you off, though
<Hobbsee> crimsun: why?
<Hobbsee> if i'm being unproductive, for various reasons, and can't seem to fix that, then what's the point in wasting everyone's time?
<Hobbsee> it doesn't matter what i think, if people don't agree with it - it gets discounted.
<Hobbsee> and if peopel do agree with it, they say it themselves.
<soren> None. (Please note that I don't believe the conditions to be true)
<Hobbsee> so unless i'm making uploads, i'ts pretty much worthless to be here, as it's proven that i'm not doing anything usfeul for the team.
<crimsun> allow me to play devil's advocate.  If you're a whistle-blower and everyone else turns a blind eye, does it mean you're incorrect?  Does it mean you should stop saing things?
<crimsun> saying *
<Hobbsee> crimsun: doesn't say anything about correctness, but does say that i should shut up, yes, for the general good of the team.
<Hobbsee> ther'es no point consistently fighting, no matter whehtehr you're fighting for something that is right, if the rest of the team has no intention of changing their mind.
<Hobbsee> no matter what
<soren> Hobbsee: If someone is unproductive beyond repair it's a waste of (everyone's) time (by definition). I'm not saying that you are indeed unproductive beyond repair, though. I'm merely confirming your hypothetical logical implication.
<Hobbsee> soren: i'm failing to see, how if someone's contributions get put on an ignore list, how anyone might know if their contributions have turned useful or not, as they don't see it.
<Hobbsee> am i missing something?
<Hobbsee> or is it not a true ignore list?
<soren> Hobbsee: Yes, you are.
<Hobbsee> then please tell me what i'm missing
<soren> That we're all humans?
<soren> For instance: While I tend to try to ignore certain people, I sometimes fail to do so.
<soren> Other times I give them a second chance to see if they've changed.
<soren> Other times again, someone else tells me something to make me see things from a different perspective.
<soren> We work with computers, yes, but we are not computers ourselves. Deal.
<cody-somerville> Hobbsee, There seems to be a lot of parallels between a situation I was in with another ubuntu team about a year ago and yours.
<Hobbsee> cody-somerville: oh?
<soren> Hobbsee: I don't believe, by the way, that I ever mentioned any sort of filter. Every time I ignore someone, it's a conscious decision.
<Hobbsee> soren: out of curiousity, hypothetically, how would you go about putting your thoughts about something that clearly doesn't work, into a mail, which would be accepted due to it's rose-coloured glasses.  if something's not working, then the world is *not* all fine and rosy, so trying to pretend it is isn't a great idea.
<Hobbsee> right
<Hobbsee> this is my great problem, you see.
<james_w> it's not an easy one to solve
<Hobbsee> soren: there's my attempt at a productive mail.  Take it as you will.
<murrayc> protonchris: I just released another glom. 2.6.12. It has another fix for a postgres 8.3 change, so it would be great if it can get in to Hardy.
<\sh> soren: we work with humans...the computer is just a tool like a hammer or screwdriver...if I'm shouting at my computer...he won't be pissed and works like expected...people don't
<soren> Hobbsee: I try do deal with things constructively. Good or bad.
<soren> \sh: Precisely.
<pochu> hi RainCT, what do you think about Debian bug #455482? do you think we should keep it, remove it, or wait until someone (you?) writes it in PyGTK?
<ubotu> Debian bug 455482 in pyzenity "Please motivate inclusion in Debian" [Serious,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/455482
<\sh> the problem here is this: till made a mistake for the first time...the first time he judged by himself the good or bad of this upload..his solution (imho): I need to get the package in, without fixing the bugs, but I still have time to fix them..
<\sh> the decision to be made is upon us motus/cores....if till thinks it's allright, then ok...he needs to deal with the questions at some point...which is good...and should go into the decision if he's becoming a core dev or not...if he made a wrong decision in universe/multiverse it's likely to happen that a similiar decision is going to be made for main. But the latter is not Till...Till learns quickly...and if he's not going to become a core dev now, h
<Hobbsee> \sh: you got cut off
<soren> At "if he's not going to become a core dev now,"
<\sh>  he will become one in the near future
<\sh> soren: the MOTU team is now more then 3 years old...most of the policies we developed in the last year
<soren> \sh: My point exactly.
<\sh> regarding other projects...yes, we are young...regarding ubuntu, we are just as old as ubuntu itself ;)
<soren> Pretty much, yes. My statements hold true for most of Ubuntu.
<mariuz> hello
<mariuz> i have an dilemma about an bug that is fixed in LP but is still present when you install the package
<mok0> In a watch file, how do I deal with a version that is present in both the directory and the tar file? E.g http://...../foo-1.2/foo-1.2.tar.gz
<james_w> mariuz: what's the bug number?
<jdong> hmm, where did my theme go?
<mariuz> 135695
<jdong> is there a known hardy bug where the theme disappears?
<james_w> bug 135695
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 135695 in php-interbase "FTBFS: depends on php4-dev, which has been removed" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/135695
<james_w> thanks ubotu
<mariuz> the problem is fixed in hardy but in gutsy is still there i mean the php5-interbase package is not installable
<mariuz> it depends on the php4 api , yes i know is horrible
<james_w> mariuz: ok, you will need to apply for a stable release update, a.k.a. an SRU.
<jdong> ah removal of murrine.
<james_w> mariuz: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates
<mariuz> ok thanks
<jordi> hi
<sebner> mok0: congratulations ;) a bit ealier than the 23th ^^
<mok0> sebner: yes :-) I am surprised it went so fast!
<jordi> I just uploaded OpenTTD's new major release to Debian, and I wonder if/how hard would it be to sneak it in hardy at this point. It'd be good to have compatible network games with the current version during while ubuntu 8.10 gets developed.
<mok0> jordi: does it fix major bugs?
<nxvl> mok0: congratilations!
<jordi> mok0: *shrug*, the main changes are new features, it's not a bugfix release.
<nxvl> congratulations*
<jordi> but I'm having a look at the changelog
<mok0> nxvl: Thanks! :-)
<mok0> jordi: then it's a no-go
<\sh> jcastro: mail send...I can't because linuxtag :)
<pochu> mok0: see any gnome package, their watch file have versioned directories
<jcastro> \sh: I appreciate the timely response, thanks!
<mok0> pochu: thanks!
<jordi> mok0: my biggest concern is people using the current version won't be able to play online with the servers, as they'll have outdated clients
<\sh> jcastro: postpone the invitation for octobre ;)
<mok0> jordi: the package might go in hardy-backports
<mok0> jordi: although I don't know what the policy is for that to happen
<mok0> jordi: you mean the servers have changed, so the current version doesn't run anymore?
<jordi> mok0: aha, anyway, I just wondered if it'd be not too hard to get in
<jordi> if it's a problem, I'm not going to push for it too hard
<jordi> mok0: if the public servers at openttd.org run 0.6.0, which they will, 0.5.3 clients won't connect
<mok0> .... and when is this upgrade going to happen?
<mok0> jordi: ^
<jordi> mok0: 0.6.0 was released yesterday, I assume it'll happen in the following weeks
<jordi> mok0: this happens all the time with online games: frozen bubble, freeciv, etc.
<mok0> Hmm. I'd say that is a bug
<jordi> the timing for this release isn't too fortunate then
<jordi> mok0: no, it's like trying to install a package compiled for glibc 2.7 on a glibc 2.3 system
<jdong> do people really play f-b online?
<jordi> the client lacks features the server wants to use in the game
<mok0> jordi: you can try to file a bug at Launchpad, with all the facts you've given here, and subscribe the motu-release team. They will decide
<jordi> jdong: is there any point playing solo? :)
<jordi> jdong: I only play online
<jdong> mok0: I think in the case of incompatible network games, a FFe should be attempted
<jdong> jordi: thanks for making me feel antisocial ;-)
<mok0> jdong: yeah
<jordi> jdong: haha
<mok0> jdong: jordi first said it was a new feature release
<jordi> mok0: yeah, this is the biggest reason for my request; I mean, I come from Debian, there's a pretty tough culture to not allow freeze breaks :P
<jordi> mok0: and the new features are a problem to old client users
<mok0> jordi: but you need to present it as a bug that the older version will not work shortly
<soren> Well, the thing is: You can't just file a sync request and expect it to be done. You need to file a feature freeze exception.
<jdong> I think this is a case of "if nothing horribly breaks it's better than freezing the way it is"
<jdong> but yeah without a doubt a FFe needs to be filed for this to happen
<mok0> jdong: exactly
<mok0> jordi: you know what to do?
<jordi> I had a look at th wiki
<jordi> ugh, changelog diffs
<james_w> jordi: how long might it be until they release another incompatible version?
<mok0> jordi: just cut'n paste upstream changelog from 0.5.3 to now
<jordi> james_w: openttd's release schedule is long
<jordi> let me check when 0.5.x was released
<jordi> that's another reason I'm trying this
<jordi> if they were going to release 0.7 in May it'd be pointless
<jordi> openttd (0.5.3-1) unstable; urgency=low
<jordi>  -- Jordi Mallach <jordi@debian.org>  Tue, 18 Sep 2007 12:05:28 +0200
<james_w> jordi: yeah, that's what I was wondering.
<jordi> er
<jordi> that was 0.5.3
<jordi>  -- Jordi Mallach <jordi@debian.org>  Thu,  8 Mar 2007 15:34:54 +0100
<mok0> james_w: but that's not saying they change the protocol at every release
<james_w> true
<james_w> I think it's probably worthwhile, and the chance of breaking something else is low.
<mok0> yes, and the application will apparently be partly broken anyway
<mok0> jordi: will it work now? Or only after the upgrade of the servers
<jordi> jesus
<jordi> http://www.openttd.org/servers.php
<jordi> everyone is running 0.6.0 already
<jordi> and it was released yesterday
<jordi> mok0: I guess it doesn't work anymore *today*
<mok0> jordi: go ahead and make your case in a bug report. The release team will likely ask the same questions that we've done here on IRC, so put all that info there
<jordi> should I report the bug against openttd, or what?
<mok0> jordi: yes
<mok0> jordi: Ubuntu -> openttd
<mok0> jordi: openttd has ubuntu changes, so you need to ask for a merge
<jordi> wtf
<jordi> I had no idea
<jordi> +  * Merge from Debian unstable (LP: #181738). Remaining Ubuntu changes:
<jordi> +    - Add .desktop file.
<mok0> jordi: it may just be dependencies or something
<jordi> can be discarded, 0.6.0 includes one
<mok0> jordi: if you can argue that a straight sync will work on Ubuntu, just do that in the bug comment
<mok0> jordi: we want to get rid of as many ubuntu'isms as possible
<james_w> jordi: why wtf?
<jordi> james_w: I had no idea
<jordi> but the added change made sense
<jordi> I'm not sure if our desktop file came from the same person
<jordi> it's not the same though
<james_w> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=460073
<ubotu> Debian bug 460073 in openttd "Add .desktop file" [Minor,Fixed]
<james_w> the person who made the change in Ubuntu reported that
<jordi> ah, great
<james_w> there's a couple of updates in the bug, so that may explain the difference.
<james_w> jordi: do you know about the "derivatives" keyword in the PTS?
<jordi> no, I don't know how it works
<jordi> I regularly look for ubuntu diffs in the pts for some of my packages though
<james_w> if you subsribe to that keyword on the PTS then you get a mail when an upload is made in Ubuntu for the package, with the diff attached.
<jordi> mm, that's really interesting
<jordi> I'll do that
<jordi> because the ALSA diff is getting way too big
<james_w> yeah, I was just about to say that we could probably use some help reducing that
<jordi> I'd want the Ubuntu ALSA people to join the Debian ALSA team, which is suffering from lack of time
<james_w> that would be good
<james_w> I don't think there is an Ubuntu ALSA team though
<james_w> crimsun: you appear to be the Ubuntu ALSA team, is that right?
<james_w> jordi: I'd be happy to go through the patches with you some time to sort them out if you would like.
<jordi> james_w: that'd be great
<james_w> jordi: it's obviously not the best time right now, but after release when we look to merge with Debian again I'll get in touch, does that suit you?
<jordi> james_w: totally
<jordi> not the best time for me either :)
<james_w> where would be the best place to find you?
<jordi> I'll always be online in feenode and oftc, but pkg-alsa-devel@lists.alioth.debian.org should be the best place, so Elimar is also in the loop
<jordi> he's doing most of the work lately
<james_w> ah, ok. I'll note it down so I don't forget
<jordi> it's the Maintianer for all the ALSA packages
<jordi> hard to miss
<james_w> yep, I meant more the fact that I have said I'll do it :-)
<jordi> oh
<jordi> :)
<jordi> ok, so bug was filed
<jordi> we'll see
<james_w> jordi: thanks for taking an interest
<jordi> james_w: no, you really
<jordi> I see there are interesting ALSA fixes there
<jordi> and minimising diffs is always good
<james_w> yeah, I see there are a couple of things you may not want to take as they are pretty Ubuntu specific, and there are some things plucked from upstream, but yes, minimising them would be great.
<jordi> james_w: yeah, I was aware some things will stay as diff
<jordi> but much of it can be merged
<james_w> I'm sure it can. It would be great if we could also come up with a strategy to keep the ubuntu diff easier to manage as well.
<james_w> but that's our problem, not yours really.
<jordi> yep
<james_w> we can help you by discussing new patches though.
<jordi> yeah
<jordi> I need to go now
<jordi> let's talk after hardy
<james_w> yep, I'll be in touch.
<jordi> good luck, and thanks for the earlier advice!
<james_w> thanks :-)
<jussio1> Could someone remind me how to check out a svn without the .svn folders?
<james_w> jussi01: is it export?
<jussio1> james_w: thats sounds right...
<jussio1> james_w: thanks :)
<james_w> jussi01: no problem
<rockstar_> I've got a package from old debian that hasn't been maintained in a few years.  I've taken over maintenance of the project, and am trying to build an initial package for Ubuntu (as an experiment).  Are there any differences in the debian/ files I need to worry about?
<woodwizzle_> Looks like there is a new beta of firefox out.
<woodwizzle_> Can I update the package on my hardy machine?
<Moniker42> another beta of firefox?
<jdong> wait patiently for an update?
<Moniker42> i simply can't WAIT for the blog posts Â¬.Â¬
<jeromeg> Moniker42: then grab it from mozilla.com
<jeromeg> extract the tarball in your home directory, and double click on the executable to launch firefox
<woodwizzle_> Yeah, but I don't want to have multiple installs of different betas :P
<beuno> rockstar_, no differences in a technical sense, no. You might want to take a look at: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuForDebianDevelopers
<Moniker42> i was being sarcastic... i'm fed up hearing joe blogg the blogger's opinions on the positioning of the bookmarks toolbar
<jeromeg> Moniker42: yep sorry, I got confused between the two nicks
<jeromeg> woodwizzle_: then wait for the update ;)
<Moniker42> jeromeg, ah - okay. what two nicks did you mean? :)
<Moniker42> (other than mine, i mean)
<jeromeg> Moniker42: yours and woodwizzle_
<jeromeg> sorry :)
<Moniker42> np
<woodwizzle_> jeromeg: Will there be a package? I thought hardy was in feature freeze and didn't get updates?
<jeromeg> woodwizzle_: firefox won't stay in beta forever in hardy, so i guess it will be updated
<jeromeg> could a motu upload a package for me in gutsy-proposed ?
<jeromeg> the bug is bug 156432
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 156432 in zim "Zim freeze when create a link" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/156432
<jeromeg> it has been approved by a memeber of motu-sru
<jeromeg> the debdiff is available in the lats comments
<jeromeg> please, anyone for my upload ?
<sebner> jeromeg: you could also subscribe u-u-s. though it would take longer than asking ^^
<jeromeg> sebner: ok, i'll, i was just asking because i was asked to :)
<sebner> jeromeg: I read it. this wasn't specific to ask here. just to get a motu uploading it
<jeromeg> ok
<jeromeg> done :)
<sebner> jeromeg: but maybe you keep asking if you don't want to wait too long ^^
<jeromeg> :)
<DktrKranz> jeromeg, re bug 156432, are there test cases for the other two bugs addressed?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 156432 in zim "Zim freeze when create a link" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/156432
<jeromeg> DktrKranz: for the second one, you just need to move the files in their respective folders
<jeromeg> DktrKranz: the links do not get updated in the app for some people, thus leading to a crash
<jeromeg> DktrKranz: for the third one, the trayicon becomes unusable for some persons, it does not bring zim back
<jeromeg> DktrKranz: the three fixes are in hardy already
<DktrKranz> jeromeg, thanks. I'll boot a gutsy box and test it, /me likes SRUs :)
<jeromeg> :)
<jeromeg> DktrKranz: the two last ones seem to be very architecture dependant, i could not reproduce them
<DktrKranz> which arch are you on?
<jeromeg> i386
<DktrKranz> ah, me too :(
<jeromeg> by arch i meant luck/hardware/something else :)
<jeromeg> but it does crash for some people
<jeromeg> and the aptch fixes it :)
<jeromeg> *patch
<jeromeg> sorry got to go
<jeromeg> see you DktrKranz
<DktrKranz> c u :)
<slytherin> is midi file playing for anyone?
<sebner> heya bddebian
<bddebian> Hello sebner
<\sh> re
<norsetto> hyall
<sebner> norsetto: heya :D
<norsetto> sebner: gruss
<sebner> norsetto: the funny thing is that I took conky from Debian incoming before I noticed your mail :D
<norsetto> sebner: faster than light ....
<sebner> norsetto: yeah. kapil rocks :D
<DktrKranz> or faster than dinstall
<DktrKranz> heya norsetto :)
<norsetto> DktrKranz: Hola!
<sebner> norsetto: in addition. Thanks for the two ACKs :)
<norsetto> sebner: ack
<sebner> ^^
<jdong> ScottK: could we shove those ff3b4 backports through?
<sebner> jdong: ffb5 is out. now official :D /me waves xD
<jdong> sebner: yep, saw that. Hence why I wanted to shove ff3b4 through
<sebner> ^^
<jdong> the new one doesn't make the old one any less functional :)
<sebner> jdong: but useless work!?
<jdong> sebner: there's no work, just the upload of two source packages.
<jdong> sebner: all the work has been done
<sebner> jdong: ah. k
<jdong> sebner: and if we want to validate 3b5 we'd have to go through the 3-4 ACKs and front-porting of patches all over again, which is a lot of work and risk for screwing something up
<jdong> so I'd rather shove 3b4 through for now
<Moniker42> that's what she said
<Moniker42> if "three beta four" is a nickname for some sort of sexual object, anyway.
<Moniker42> (a bit tenuous, i admit.)
<sebner> hrhr
<jdong> Moniker42: I don't know if you want your runtime heap size to not grow anymore ;-)
<jdong> but they make pills for that.
<sebner> gn8 folks
<ScottK> jdong: Maybe tonight
<norsetto> g'night all
<emgent> hello people
<cody-somerville> :/
<Dossy> Hi.  What team is responsible for VNC?  the X Swat team?
<tonyyarusso> Dossy: I'd guess Desktop, but not sure.
#ubuntu-motu 2008-04-03
<pochu> Dossy: any problems with it?
<Legendario> hi, can anyone explain me or give me a hint on were a can read about merging a package from debian to ubuntu?
<RAOF> Legendario: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/Merging ?
<Legendario> thanks RAOF, you're the one that always answers my question... :-D
<bddebian> Heya gang
<RAOF> Yo!  bddebian!
<bddebian> Hello RAOF
<protonchris> hey bddebian
<bddebian> Hi protonchris
<Dossy> pochu, yeah - vncconfig bug - I'd like to help make sure the fix makes it into hardy or whatever
<Dossy> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/vnc4/+bug/119982
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 119982 in vnc4 "amd64 vncconfig crashes" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<superm1> Dossy, that bug is irrelevant if bug 184225 isn't fixed
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 184225 in vnc4 "FTBFS in latest archive rebuild test" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/184225
<Dossy> superm1: that's strange - it builds for me ... what version of gcc was used there?
<superm1> Dossy, are you building on hardy?
<Dossy> No, gutsy ... ah.
<Dossy> Still, it'd be worth backporting a fix to bug #119982 to gutsy, no?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 119982 in vnc4 "amd64 vncconfig crashes" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/119982
<superm1> yeah.  and not to mention the related bug that all the xorg stuff in there is all out of date
<superm1> the new stuff doesnt compile
<superm1> i spent a few evenings at it and made a fair deal of progress
<superm1> but never successful
<superm1> can't be backported unless we have a "working" vnc :)
<superm1> you know, to backport from
<Dossy> Hm.  I guess I should set up a hardy VM too, then
<Dossy> well, patching the existing vnc4server from gutsy w/ the fix, fixes the problem :)
<superm1> https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~superm1/+junk/vnc4
<superm1> https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~superm1/baracuda/trunk
<superm1> if you want to pick up where I left off at
<Dossy> "baracuda"?
<Dossy> what version of x11proto-render-dev is in hardy?
<RAOF> !info x11proto-render-dev hardy
<ubotu> Package x11proto-render-dev does not exist in hardy
<Dossy> oh.  wacky.
<Dossy> !info x11proto-render-dev gutsy
<ubotu> Package x11proto-render-dev does not exist in gutsy
<Dossy> uh, that's wrong.
<RAOF> So, ubotu is wrong.  It's version 0.9.3
<Dossy> and gutsy is 0.9.2.  I wonder what changed between the two versions.
<Dossy> So ... the hurdle here is getting the vnc4 stuff to build on hardy?  OK - guess I'm setting up a hardy image :)
<Dossy> Is there a way to find out what packages were installed at the time of the sbuild?
<LucidFox> What is the opposite of "subtle"?
<LucidFox> Other than "anvilicious"
<Dossy> obvious?
<LucidFox> No, not in that sense :)
<Dossy> Well, in what sense, then?  :)
<LucidFox> It's when you're presented with something that conveys a particular message with such lack of subtlety that you feel like you're being hit with an anvil
<Dossy> Unmistakable?
<LucidFox> Gah... no :)
<LucidFox> never mind
<Dossy> :)
<Exfil> what is the best virtual machine software for running Windows XP Professional and Fruti Loops Audio Software with USB Midi Keyboard
<Dossy> realtime audio in virtualized guest?  wow, you're brave :)
<dholbach> good morning
<LaserJock> morning dholbach
<dholbach> hiya LaserJock
<superm1> Dossy, baracuda was a fork of realvnc
<superm1> intended to work on xorg
<superm1> whereas realvnc was always patched to make it work
<superm1> good morning dholbach
<dholbach> hey superm1
<superm1> whatcha been up to these days?
<kgoetz> j #gnu
<kgoetz> gr
<dholbach> superm1: lots and lots of small stuff
<freeflying> bug #210860
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 210860 in scim-m17n "After adding scim-m17n scim does not work automatically" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/210860
<warp10> Good morning
<siretart> good morning, MOTU!
<AstralJava> Morning.
<emgent> heya
<zul> Fujitsu: ping
<Fujitsu> zul: Hi.
<zul> Fujitsu: is nagios2 in a state to go into main?
<Fujitsu> zul: In what respect?
<emgent> Fujitsu: see invite.
<zul> Fujitsu: ie If I take the time to do a MIR it wont get rejected and would be easy to promote?
<Fujitsu> emgent: I tried to join earlier, but I don't have the key.
<emgent> ok see notice :)
<Fujitsu> zul: Security-wise it's not bad, it seems to work well (I use the package in a number of locations), but it has some dependencies not in main.
<Fujitsu> Hm, only two non-nagios, actually.
<Fujitsu> libnet-smtp-perl and libradius1. So it shouldn't be hard.
<Fujitsu> *snmp-perl
<mok0> ScottK?
<ScottK> Yes
<ScottK> mok0: ?
<mok0> I would like to upload the xtide packages, but I want to make sure that it's ok FFe-wise
<ScottK> OK.  Bug #?
<mok0> bug 188086
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 188086 in xtide "[needs-merge] xtide-2.9.5-2 from sid" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/188086
<ScottK> Looking
<mok0> bug 188093
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 188093 in xtide-data "[needs-sync] xtide-data-20070318-1 from sid" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/188093
<mok0> They belong together
<ScottK> Making sure I understand ...
<ScottK> xtide needs a merge.  It looks like it also needs an FFe unless the upstream version is bugfix only.
<ScottK> xtide-data is just a new revision.
<ScottK> mok0: Is that right?
<mok0> right
<mok0> the problem is with the current xtide in hardy
<ScottK> For xtide are there new features or is it just bugfixes?
<mok0> I introduced (in agreement with the DM) a change which we later revoked
<mok0> ScottK; but the upload got hung in LP as you can see
<ScottK> Can you make a new revision of the current version in Ubuntu that reverts that change without jumping to the new upstream version?
<mok0> I could, but I am pretty sure that there is no real difference
<mok0> (Except we would loose the icons I made)
<ScottK> That gets back then to the question of are there new features in the new xtide version?
<mok0> I can investigate it further
<mok0> I dont want my first upload to be a FF violation :-)
<ScottK> If you can convince yourself it's only bugfixes, then all you need to do to be clear with motu-release is paste the new upstream changelog entries in the bug and upload.
<\sh> can someone unsubscribe motu-release from bug #211057
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 211057 in wireshark "FFe for inclusion of wireshark 1.0.0-1 into Hardy" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/211057
<ScottK> If it's got features you need to fill out an FFe.
<mok0> ScottK; got it
<ScottK> \sh: We don't normally bother.  It'll just go off our radar once it goes Fix Released.
<mok0> ScottK: what about xtide-data?
<\sh> ScottK, good then :)
<ScottK> mok0: That's just a new revision, right?  You should be able to just do that one.
<mok0> ScottK: great
<pochu> mok0: I did review xtide's changelog diff and it looked like bug fix only
<mok0> pochu: that's my impression too, but it's been a while since I looked at it
<pochu> mok0, ScottK: see the 2.9.[45] entries... the diff had a lot of space reformating: http://emilio.pozuelo.org/~deb/xtide_changelog
<pochu> gtg
<mok0> thanks pochu
<\sh> so...wireshark 1.0.0-1 synced
<emgent> hardy?
<\sh> yepp
<emgent> cool :)
<\sh> emgent, your gutsy debdiff looks good..please assign the the bug to yourself, so I'm off the radar
<\sh> now for the other CVes for wireshark in older releases ;
<\sh> )
 * emgent thinking to backport
<\sh> emgent, try to backport it to dapper first..because version in dapper is bad very bad regarding security because of the state of the source
<emgent> ok cool
 * emgent adding it in todolist.
 * \sh has some nice octave crap on his todo 
<emgent> :)
<emgent> omg it's late..
<emgent> i go to office
<emgent> see you later people
<asac> hmmm ... anyone has a time-slot to fix xine-plugin build? i reuploaded it with just a new link in xine-plugin.links and now it fails to build
<asac> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/13092176/buildlog_ubuntu-hardy-lpia.xine-plugin_1.0.1~cvs20070523-1ubuntu2_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<asac> looks like that the version checks are busted
<asac> *** 'xine-config --version' returned -1717986918.1072798105.-1717986918, but XINE (1072798105.858993459.1076245299)
<asac> ouch
<asac> $ xine-config --version
<asac> 1.1.11.1
<asac> thats what i get :/
<ScottK> mok0: I'm curious if you have an opinion on Bug 66862
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 66862 in python-numpy "scipy not built with atlas support ?" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/66862
<mok0> hm
<mok0> it should build depend on libatlas-base-dev
<mok0> not atlas3-base
<mok0> after gfortran transition...
<asac> ok i think i have the fix. cheers
<mok0> Otherwise it can't find the right lapack library, and I bet it switches off lapack support then
<mok0> asac: it always helps talking to one self...
<\sh> phew
<\sh> company release 0.8.8 is out....so for this week i'm done...at least as relmgr
 * persia points at https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-motu/2008-April/003523.html and invites criticism, comments, and applicants.
<mruiz> hi all
 * cody-somerville is excited about the change.
<persia> cody-somerville: Welcome to yet another group :)
<cody-somerville> :)
<warp10> persia: is it the way to implement the decision about MC assigning ubuntu membership for good, not yet ready for MOTUness contributor?
<persia> warp10: Membership is one of the entitlements granted by the new group.
 * cody-somerville is now a member of 48 launchpad groups.
<persia> warp10: While it does implement the recent CC decision, it will also be used to make things easier for contributors.
<persia> The idea being that if you've been working on stuff for a few months, it would make sense for you to be able to commit to a bzr repo, and ask for review, for bzr-managed packages.  There are several other entitlements under consideration, although suggestions are welcome.
<huats> persia if I understand correctly, every current contributor is encourage to apply to that new group
<warp10> persia: indeed. And I say +1 particularly because the road to MOTU is pretty long, and having an intermediate target as a first, official acknowledgment for your good contribution is something that suprs to go ahaed.
<persia> huats: Once they've been around a while, and done some stuff, and have some sponsors, yes.  On the other hand, not everyone would be approved.
<ScottK> persia: We don't have bzr managed packages in Universe
<huats> persia: of course
<persia> ScottK: Are they all in multiverse now?  The one I remember most closely is mplayer.
<ScottK> persia: There is no process agreement.  The agreed process is that the canonical source for our packages is the Debian Source package.
<huats> persia:  it is the way for the MC to manage to grant membership ? we already discussed that a long time ago
<huats> :)
<ScottK> persia: I also see that teams are being renamed.
<persia> ScottK: I don't disagree.  On the other hand, there are a couple packages listed that way.  Maybe only mplayer.
<ScottK> persia: Just because someone stuffed some VCS headers into a package doesn't mean anything.
<persia> ScottK: Only the one team is being renamed.
<ScottK> persia: On what basis?
<ScottK> Who has agreed to this?
<ScottK> It's been done with no discussion.
<persia> ScottK: Hmmm...  It was done as part of the MC taking over the team from the previous administrator, but I agree that the rename may have benefitted from discussion.
<ScottK> persia: MC has no authority to change process.
<ScottK> persia: It seems no comment is needed since MC has already acted and dictated.
<persia> ScottK: Right.  I guess I didn't see a process change beyond the introduction of the new team, which was confirmed in the CC meeting a month or so ago.  It can be changed back if you think the name change is a process change.
<ScottK> There's also automatic expiration.
<ScottK> There is using a VCS.
<persia> Expiration hasn't been done yet, and it's a valid point.  I'll take it to the next MOTU Meeting.
<ScottK> persia: This is not written as a proposal, but as an MC fiat.
<persia> Some packages use a VCS.  I don't think this is a new argument.
<ScottK> persia: We've been through the VCS business many times before and the answer was no.
<ScottK> persia: Where in the sponsorship process is there a VCS?
<huats> persia: is there somewhere where sponsors can found a more detailled description of the requirements to integrate that team ?
<persia> ScottK: VCS is not part of sponsorship.  That's agreed.
<ScottK> persia: This fiat changes that.
<persia> huats: Not really.  it's a new team.  The first members will likely set the tone for requirements, but the requirements for Ubuntu Membership should be considered a minimum basis.
 * persia rereads the mail, to check the phrasing again
<ScottK> persia: Given that changes in Launchpad have already been made, there is no argument that this is a proposal.  It's already being implemented.
<persia> ScottK: Which change?  The new team?  That was in part the implementation of the previous CC decision.
<ScottK> persia: Yes.
<ScottK> The team structure has been changed with not even notification to the community.
<huats> persia: I was asking that since I am sure many potential sponsors would ask themselves asking that question (someone already asked me that since he didn"t know what was exactly required he couldn't answered me...)
<ScottK> I discovered it because I happen to be subscribed to a wiki page.
<mok0> ScottK: apart from the de facto decision, do you disagree with it?
<persia> ScottK: A new team was defined.  It doesn't have any members yet.  This is implementation of the previous CC discussion, plus spin.
<ScottK> persia: Not true.
<huats> mok0: congrats btw :)
<mok0> huats: thanks :-)
<persia> I don't understand this as fiat, and it can be undone, if it is.
<ScottK> mok0: Except for the VCS business, I think it's in the right area.
<persia> ScottK: I said " I would like to encourage anyone maintaining a VCS for Ubuntu packaging of a universe package to consider using this team in place of ~ubuntu-dev as a source of acceptable committers"
<mok0> I read it such that the VCS is an option for contributors
<ScottK> persia: Look where this link goes https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-universe-contributors
<persia> I didn't say "people should use VCS"
<cody-somerville> Debian makes heavy use of VCS. They must see some benefit. Why don't we see the same benefit?
<mok0> I think there could be some benefit in group maintenance
<ScottK> cody-somerville: They use it in small teams where there is agreement to use it.  I participate in several such teams and it works well.
<persia> cody-somerville: Because it makes merging annoying, especially as LP is restricted to bzr, and bzr is almost never used in Debian.
 * broonie notes that he maintains a couple of Debian packages in bzr specifically because Ubuntu send him 90% of the patches and I still don't get stuff in bzr format :/
<ScottK> persia: I will argue strongly against any mention of bzr in particular and vcs in general.
<mok0> But bzr and git are very similar in their functionality
<ScottK> mok0: For me it's n+1 vcs to deal with and I've never run into bzr outside Ubuntu.  I'm not going to learn a new vcs just for Ubuntu.
<mok0> I think you can run whatever you want on your side
<persia> ScottK: I'm happy with that.  I'm not in favor of using bzr for Debian-derived packages myself.  On the other hand, I know some packages to be maintained in bzr, especially some newer ubuntu-local packages, and I want all members of the new team to be able to commit.
<ScottK> persia: Then put it in some documentation related to that. Not in anything Universe related.
<persia> ScottK: new ubuntu-local packages are in universe.  Please suggest text for a correction
<ScottK> persia: It's orthoganal to the question.  Just delete it.
<ScottK> persia: It does seem that there's a hidden change here that one will need to qualify for membership before one can upload to REVU.  Is that wrong?
<ScottK> persia: Those packages (ubuntu-dev-tools for example) are separate Launchpad projects.  It's really nothing to do with Ubuntu or Universe formally it's how they manager their 'upstream' work.
<persia> I can't delete email.  I'll issue some correction statement, but want to avoid a flamewar with the no-more-source folks (with whom I disagree)
<persia> And, no, there's no hidden change.  While the new team does have REVU Upload rights, that's still encapsulated in the current open team (which got renamed).
<siretart> code monkeys? who came up with that name?
<slicer> If I understand this correctly; the overall intention is to make it easier for "smaller" contributors to contribute?
<slicer> (ie: people like me ;))
<ScottK> siretart: Don't worry.  MC have it all figured out.  It'll be wonderful.  We can just go about our business.
<persia> slicer: Right.
<geser> ScottK: REVU upload is still through the open team ~ubuntu-code-monkeys (formerly know as ~ubuntu-universe-contributors)
<siretart> ScottK: lol
<persia> ScottK: I disagree with that entirely.
<slicer> persia: If so, I heartily applaud it :)
<mok0> persia: looking at the wiki, for each type of developer, it would be good to have the _requirements_ needed to enter that group. For example, to enter group 3 (MOTU) you have to be a group 2, etc.
<ScottK> persia: Actions speak louder than words and the actions started before there was even an announcement.
<persia> mok0: Except you don't have to be in each of the earlier groups to join the later groups, although it is expected most people will.
<ScottK> geser, persia: Why was it renamed?
<persia> slicer: Yes.
<mok0> persia: well, then it should be stated in terms of skills, etc
<persia> mok0: Maybe.  I've never seen a list of requirements for any of the teams that was a firm set of rules.
<ScottK> Or to be more correct it appears action and the announcement happened at roughly the same time.
<mok0> persia: I think it is difficult to understand if you don't already know the system
<persia> ScottK: We created a LP group, and sent an email.  If you disagree, help me understand how, and we can change it.
<ScottK> Given that the plan is being excecuted already, it seems quite clear that the decision is taken and it's done.
<huats> mok0: I cannot more agree more... I already asked someone if he agrees to "sponsors"  me for that new team... he told me he cannot for the moment since it is not yet clearly defined
<huats> ...
<persia> While I hope the new group will inform changes in process, none are currently imposed.
<siretart> ScottK: I assume to show that there is action in ubuntu development. TBH, those renames are pretty confusing to me
<ScottK> persia: I disagree that MC has any authority to make any changes.
<persia> ScottK: No changes have been made.  I sent an email.
<ScottK> persia: LP teams have been changed already.  That is a change.
<slicer> Ah, this is probably a bad time, but creation of new users on the wiki seems broken. Once it gets to show the user preferences for the first time and you hit "save", it just hangs.
<persia> ScottK: OK.  If the rename is your issue, I'll rename it back.  Is that it, or is there something else?
<persia> slicer: #launchpad can likely help you with that
<ScottK> persia: My issue is action in advance of decision by the MOTU community.
<slicer> persia: Ah, thanks :)
<persia> ScottK: Umm.  By "action" do you mean a team rename, or something else.
<\sh> -ETOOMUCHREDTAPE
<ScottK> persia: I am aware that renaming has been done.  I am not aware of what other actions have been done or may be planned to be done in advance of any agreement from the community.
<mok0> persia: I think ScottK thinks there should have been some discussion first
 * siretart tends to agree with ScottK 
<ScottK> mok0: I'd put it stronger.  I think that under our agreed method of making policy, MC has exceeded it's authority.
<persia> ScottK: The totality of that planned is my email, and a question I raised on LP: https://answers.launchpad.net/launchpad/+question/28815
<persia> I'm hoping to see more change, but as I said in my email, that should be discussed in the ML thread, or in a MOTU Meeting.
<ScottK> persia: Put back what's been done and let's discuss it all.
<ScottK> persia: I also really don't like the new name.  I think it would benifit from some disucssion about why it needed changing at all.
 * mok0 thinks that renaming certain groups doesn't really matter
<siretart> it seems that we need a defined process for changing processes
<persia> ScottK: Some of it I can't easily put back.  I'm happy to refrain from adding anyone to the new team, and undoing the rename, if that meets your needs.
<ScottK> siretart: We've done that.
<siretart> ScottK: we did?
<ScottK> siretart: It's my understanding that the process is we discuss it at a MOTU meeting and vote.
<persia> We've talked a lot about it, but I don't think we ever had the meta-process meeting (unfortunately).
 * persia agrees with ScottK
<siretart> ScottK: ah, right. I was rather thinking about somthing similar to http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/glep/ or http://dep.debian.net/deps/dep0/
<ScottK> I see.
<ScottK> We at least have a basic mechanism defined.  It may or may not need more structure.
<siretart> right
<siretart> is this worth a bof in prague?
<ScottK> persia: As far as putting stuff back goes, I think you need to make it as it was before.  If that's difficult, I think that only emphasizes the point that it should have been discussed and agreed in advance.
<persia> I feel like it might.  I thought I followed all the processes.  I'd like a BOF
<persia> ScottK: Anyone can make an LP team.  Why are you mad about Universe Hackers?
<siretart> persia: because it is a disruptive change
<\sh> guys, the new names of those teams is something for kids...I don't think we are K1dZ
<persia> siretart: Help me understand how.  Please.
<ScottK> persia: I'm mad about unilateral action.  What that action is is pretty irrelevant.
<siretart> e.g. revu has hardcoded the team name 'ubuntu-universe-contributors' in the source. changing the team name breaks keyring syncing
<\sh> we want to get new blood for development and packaging but we don't want to invent a kindergarden
<persia> ScottK: That happens every time I upload.  Further, this was based on things discussed in MOTU Meetings and CC Meetings.
<persia> Help me understand where I messed up, so I can undo what I can, and do it right.
<ScottK> persia: To start with you just broke REVU keyring syncs.
<ScottK> persia: That should be clue enough that there was insufficient discussion.
<persia> siretart: Ah.  Good point.  I believe undoing that name change is already agreed, although I'd like confirmation that it meets people's needs.
<siretart> persia: please undo the rename. at least for now
<\sh> secondly, https://answers.edge.launchpad.net/launchpad/+question/28815 I don't know if I like to grant those permissions...what I like is the "work with your mentor or motu of your day on bugs and tasks" so the mentor or motu of the day knows what's going on...
<persia> No problem.  I'm happy to undo the rename, and whether for now or forever isn't important to me.
<emgent> heya
<ScottK> persia: From my perspective your mail does not present a proposal for discussion.  It presents a fiat that's already being executed.  That's the source of my unhappiness.
<siretart> besides, this is really a pretty unfortunate time for doing process change. lets defer that to after hardy release
<persia> ScottK: I'll dig up my proposals then, all sent to lists or presented at meetings.  Hold on for some URLs...
<siretart> persia: I don't really oppose to the change. Really.
<\sh> anyhow, whatever we invent, it gives us too many policies, processes and red tape ...
<persia> (after unrenaming the team)
<ScottK> persia: Be sure to find the one that talks about Ubuntu Code Monkeys.
<siretart> in principal. but I agree to scottk that this hasn't been discussed in appropriate length and forum
<siretart> even dholbach told me in a private mail that this discussion did happen on motu-council, but was rather hidden
<ScottK> persia: I think the change is generally a good proposal.  I just think we need to discuss/agree in advance of action.
<\sh> siretart, there it is again: "hidden" and "private"
<siretart> I know that discussion about processes and process change has been pretty frustrating in the past. and will be in the future. however, since we need to have this discusssion again, it appears that the current state of affairs aren't really adequate for us
<persia> ScottK: Hmm.  OK  I thought I did, for the main thrust.  I agree that "Code Monkeys" is a surprise (which I'm currently undoing)
<siretart> \sh: there is nothing hidden about that mail. he asked me privately to transfer ownership of the lp team 'ubuntu-universe-contributors'
<siretart> \sh: and I insist that we need to allow private discussion and chatter, even about development, processes and change
<ScottK> siretart: Sure, but private disucssion followed by action with no public discussion is what's at issue.
<persia> https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-universe-contributors
<mok0> OOPS-824EB60 -- code monkeys are gone...
<\sh> siretart, I don't say nobody can discuss in private, quite the opposite
<ScottK> persia: Thank you.  I'll calm down and consider the main points.
<siretart> ScottK: I wasn't involved in the decision process. I'm not guilty! :)
<ScottK> siretart: Of course.
<mok0> Well this is a a good time to reboot the discussion
<persia> ScottK: Thank you.  I'm more than happy to undo things as required, but I'll argue for some of them.
<persia> ScottK: I agree with you about process, and thought I had done it correctly with the new team.
<ScottK> persia: I'd appreciate a follow-up from you making it clear that this is an MC proposal to MOTU that will be decided by MOTU.
<ScottK> persia: What is there that's been done that is hard to undo?
<persia> ScottK: I'll be replying to your email once I catch up on my wiki edits.
<\sh> and again for the record: 1. too many teams for such a small bunch of people 2. the names are really childish...and I don't think that this is the right way
<mok0> I think finer granularity is good, so people with different skills can find their slot and become actively involved Otherwise they tend to slip away again
<persia> ScottK: I can't unsend email, and I don't want to delete the new Ubuntu Hackers team, for fear it would take a month to restore it to the current state.
<ScottK> persia: I don't mind the team existing as long as it's made clear it's a placeholder for now.
<cody-somerville> I think the change is a good one as well. As for the names, I don't see them as childish myself. However, I wouldn't oppose more formal terminology either.,
<huats> sorry to insist, but it is needed to express some guidelines, or ideas of what is needed to join this group... otherwise contributors (like it already happen to me) won't be able to find anyone that accept to "sponsor" them for the new team....
<persia> \sh: I disagree with 1, and have since feisty, which is why I've written so much about recognising contributors properly for the past while.
 * pochu just ended reading the backscroll
<\sh> mok0, people will go away, when they don't have interest anymore in the stuff they want to do...that is the main reason
<\sh> mok0, or when they are not patient enough....
<persia> huats: It may take a while before we reach that point :)  I doubt it will be formalised, but rather that someone may start sponsoring people, which may inform others.
<mok0> \sh: exactly, which is what often happens.
<pochu> have you guys heard of branches in distributed VCS? people don't need to be in the main team, they branch and the reviewer merges if that's ok
<pochu> I think these changes are pointless...
<ScottK> pochu: VCS is not part of our sponsorship process.
<pochu> ScottK: I know, but the changes were done thinking in that, and even then that sounds wrong to me because of branches
<\sh> persia, I agree with you, that we a) recognising people who contributed a lot, but are not ready for upload rights...
<ScottK> pochu: Until someone shows me a VCS that scales to 20,000 packages, it's not something that we can use.
<siretart> hct!
<persia> \sh: Right.  The new team is that, and ought get granted what rights seem appropriate.
<mok0> ScottK: If there are people who are willing to work using a VCS, I think it is perfectly reasonalble to allow that. It doesn't need to be either-or
<\sh> persia, there are two ways you can recognise people: 1. in a social manner...2. in a technical manner...for 2) we need to adjust LP to have more granulated bug/task rights for people/teams...but LP is not there and this is only technical..
<cody-somerville> persia, this new group should be a member of the ubuntu bug control group
<\sh> I think for 1) we (the motus) need to do some action, so we should telling the people we like that they do awesome work...
<ScottK> mok0: I disagree.  Then you have stuff in VCS that gets missed by people who don't use it.  The team either uses a VCS or not.
<pochu> ScottK: I'm not defending moving the packages to a VCS (I don't have a strong opinion on that), I'm just saying I can't see the point of the changes *even* if we were using or were going to use bzr, because this sounds like the changes are done for contributors to be able to commit, but IMHO they can branch
<jeromeg> cody-somerville: i don't think so, this group has nothing to do with packaging/hacking
<persia> cody-somerville: That's a good idea, but I'm holding off making it more complex until the email thread is done.  Please reply to the email with your suggestion.
<pochu> and I agree with ScottK this should have been proposed first...
<ScottK> mok0: If two people agree to work together using a VCS, that's fine, but not as part of the agreed sponsorship process.
<cody-somerville> jeromeg, I'm pretty sure it has everything to do with packaging/hacking
<cody-somerville> jeromeg, Hence why it is called the "Ubuntu Universe Hackers".
<jeromeg> cody-somerville: ubuntu bug control ?
<cody-somerville> jeromeg, When you said "this", you referred to the group we were discussing which was the universe hackers group.
<\sh> cody-somerville, packaging has nothing to with hacking...hacking has nothing to do with software development...hacking is really something else in the real old geek meaning...
<cody-somerville> \sh, ...
<jeromeg> cody-somerville: by this i meant your proposal of making it part of ubuntu ug control, sorry if I was not clear
<sebner> cody-somerville: do you also got the mail and are thinking. Heee?
<cody-somerville> see my e-mail
<persia> OK.  Unmonkeying complete (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopers?action=fullsearch&context=180&value=code-monkeys&fullsearch=Text)
<huats> cody-somerville: it worth what it worth but I think that you email introduces a good point
<huats> (I mean it is just my opinion)
<ScottK> persia: Thank you.
 * ScottK needs to run.  Back later.
<persia> ScottK: Thanks for raising the flag on this.  As important as I think this is, I do want to follow the processes properly.
 * \sh goes home...cu later
 * cody-somerville eats lunch at his desk.
<tsmithe> slomo__, you around to take a peek at mscore?
<james_w> I am trying to fix a bug for hardy. The package is unmodified from Debian currently. The bug is actually caused by one of the build dependencies.
<james_w> the fix is pulled out from Debian's svn (it's a Debian native package) for the build-dependency and I'm applying that.
<james_w> once that fix is in then all that needs to happen for the first package is a rebuild.
<james_w> I'm now thinking about version numbers. The change is already in Debian's packages which are newer.
<james_w> so I could go build1 for both, so we just get Debian's packages after release with no intervention
<james_w> ubuntu1 for the second package as it is a code change, and build1 for the first, as it isn't
<james_w> however until the merge was done this could lead to a FTBFS, or at least a dep-wait.
<james_w> so I could ubuntu1 them both and then request a sync for both at the same time in the next cycle, has anyone got a recommendation?
<james_w> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/debian-edu/+bug/190682 if anyone wants specifics
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 190682 in debian-edu "package education-astronomy 0.824 failed to install/upgrade: subprocess post-installation script returned error exit status 1" [High,In progress]
<james_w> it's a milestoned bug for Hardy.
<LaserJock> dholbach: universe-code-monkeys?
<sebner> LaserJock: sounds funny :D
<persia> james_w: I usually upload an -Xubuntu1 in that case, and note in the changelog that the change should be able to be dropped for the next merge with Debian.
<james_w> persia: thanks
<james_w> a related question, as I need to rebuild against the fixed package should I bump the Build-Depends to make sure, or would just submitting in order work?
<persia> Best to set versioned build-depends if you need them.  Otherwise, it doesn't flag right for someone trying to backport.
<persia> For the same reason, best not to set versioned build-depends if you don't need them.
<sebner> heya bddebian
<bddebian> Heya gang
<bddebian> Hi sebner
<james_w> persia: well, it will still build with the old version, you'll just end up with the same bug again.
<james_w> I guess I'll set them here, as we're only going to be dealing with it for a few weeks until I sync the new upstream.
<persia> james_w: If you're reporting the bug fixed in the changelog, better to set the versioned depends.  Someone can later examine the debdiff, and decide about backporting.  If you don't set it, you've not really closed the bug, it just disappeared.
<james_w> true, thanks
<tapH20guru> I'm trying to repackage ffmpeg... got the deb source... make the change in the C code.. ran "sudo dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot -uc -b" ... install the debs on another machine... now getting errors like: error while loading shared libraries: libavutil.so.49: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory
<tapH20guru>  libavutil.so.49 exists... it's just called  /usr/lib/libavutil.so.1d.49.3.0
<tapH20guru> is there a reason why it adds a 1d in front and a 3.0 at the end of the filename?
<tapH20guru> if I symbolic link it it runs fine.
<tapH20guru> lol... i hope this is the right place to ask this kind of question
<persia> tapH20guru: For repackaging, this is likely as close as it gets, although we tend to mostly focus on things planned for upload into Ubuntu.  On the other hand, the answer to your question is in your build system, so those not very familiar with the package may have difficulty providing a good answer.
<tapH20guru> got ya
<tapH20guru> just wonderinf if I modify the debian/changelog if it wants to change the name of the shared libraries
<james_w> just doing that shouldn't do it.
<slytherin> persia: I sent a mail to motu ML few days ago about debconf preseed for java 1.4 packages. Looks like it got overlooked. Can you make any comments?
<persia> slytherin: I'm really sorry to say you should have sent that before, without the knowledge that sending it would be so difficult :)
<persia> (and you misspelled my name :p)
<persia> But seriously, I don't know enough about the specifics to have an opinion, and believe it's better decided by either the buildd admins or the motu-release team (and couldn't even say which is the right team).
<persia> I think not having FTBFS situations is good, but I don't know if failing to build with a newer Java should be considered enough of a problem that it ought to be fixed differently than preseeding.
<slytherin> persia: sorry about spelling. Was doing multitasking. :-D Yes the delay was very bug. I will hope for the best. Otherwise batik 1.7 will eventually enter hardy + 1 anyway. :-)
<slytherin> persia: It is not possible to fix any other way. The newer java is simply too new for batik 1.6. :-P
<persia> slytherin: Right.  It's a question of an upstream version exception vs. preseeding another version of non-free Java.  I'm just not sure which is safer, or the impact of one choice or the other on the distribution as a whole.
<slytherin> persia: UVFe won't be possible at this moment because it also needs some additional library. Anyway, I think I should wait for someone to notice the mail and make a comment.
 * slytherin goes to fix the continuous beeping elevator
<persia> slytherin: That's probably best.  I can reply, but I just didn't think my reply would be constructive, given my lack of knowledge about the situation.
<persia> (That's part of why I suggested you mail the list before, instead of just answering your question in February)
<andres_> asac, hi
<asac> hi
<andres_> I have a question (excuse my English)
<asac> yeah ... if its mozilla related please use #ubuntu-mozillateam
<asac> otherwise go ahead :)
<andres_> :P
<andres_> xD
<andres_> ok
<nxvl> persia: how is the Universe Hackers thing going?
<nxvl> geser: can you explain it?
<nxvl> soren: or you?
<LaserJock> nxvl: what do you want to know about it?
<nxvl> LaserJock: if it is going to be deployed and when does applications start
<LaserJock> I'm thinking it needs to be ratified at the next MOTU Meeting first
<LaserJock> I think we might also need to make sure everybody's clear on it and have the right team memberships
<sebner> slomo__: do you plan also to update ubuntu mono version?
<slomo__> no
<jdong> ss
<sebner> slomo__:  what a pitty :)
<sebner> jdong: thanks for you interest in MD :)
<zul> hey LaserJock long time no speak
<LaserJock> hi zul
<POX_> RainCT: PAPT instead of DPMT is in pyclamd's Uploaders
<POX_> also do "s/@echo/echo" in debian/rules (my mistake)
<LaserJock> can MOTUs approve/decline release nominations?
<RainCT> LaserJock: yes
<slangasek> ... they can?
<RainCT> slangasek: or at least I get a enable/disable link on nominations and clicking on it it shows a confirm button (haven't tried it though)
<slangasek> that's interesting. if it says "confirm", it's also completely different from the UI I see.
<RainCT> slangasek: not sure if that's the names it has. if you have a URL I can check
<slangasek> RainCT: bug #199960?
<LaserJock> should say " Nominated  for Hardy  by Hans Deragon   (approve/decline) "
<LaserJock> RainCT: do you get that?
<RainCT> LaserJock: yeh
<LaserJock> good
<LaserJock> I believe ~ubuntu-dev has permissions for release nominations
<RainCT> POX_: uploaders fixed in svn. thx
<LaserJock> it seems LPs documentation needs to be updated :-)
<LaserJock> ok, so we've got that ~ubuntu-bugcontrol can flip Importance and Won't Fix, ~ubuntu-dev can do release nominations, are there any other bug-related permissions in LP?
<slangasek> milestone targetting
<LaserJock> who has permission for that? Ubuntu Drivers?
<slangasek> I'm not sure
<slangasek> I think it's wider than drivers
<LaserJock> slangasek: how do you target a milestone? I don't see anything obvious in the UI?
<slangasek> LaserJock: it's in the status/importance/assignment pull-out menu
<LaserJock> bah
<LaserJock> I just figured it out
<rockstar_> Anyone have a really good tutorial for creating a pbuilder or sbuild environment?  I'm trying to build mine based off of too many different howtos that don't seem to match up
<LaserJock> rockstar_: yeah, there are good ones for both
<LaserJock> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/SbuildLVMHowto
<rockstar_> Either/or is fine.  I'm just looking to build something sane
<LaserJock> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto
<mok0_> rockstar_: the sbuild howto requires you to have an lvm volume with room to spare
<rockstar_> mok0_, Yea, I see that.  Not sure if that's the route I want to go with my build system.
<mok0_> rockstar_: it's a lot easier to set up a pbuilder
<rockstar_> mok0_, noted, thanks
<LaserJock> well
<LaserJock> actually if you are familiar with LVM and have spare LVM space sbuild/LVM is easier to set up IMO
<LaserJock> other than if you want just a single pbuilder
 * mok0_ just recently set up a whole series of sbuilders and is very happy with them
<LaserJock> keescook's script creates everything for you
<LaserJock> so all you need is free LVM space
<Lamego> you can use sbuild with a file based chroot, but it will not be as fast as using LVM
<LaserJock> although I guess it did take me a bit to get them to use a common apt cache
<ssweeny> i did
<Lamego> setting apt-cache is easy :P
<LaserJock> Lamego: it will also get messed up
<Lamego> LaserJock, not really, I use it daily, no problems
<LaserJock> oh wait
<Lamego> i mean file based, not dir based
<LaserJock> oh, right, sorry
<Lamego> it does take 12s, schroot/exit
<LaserJock> well, pbuilder has to do the same thing right?
<Lamego> never used pbuilder, but I guess so
<Lamego> but I believe it is easier to interact with a schroot
<mok0_> Another possibiliby is cowbuilder, which is nearly as fast as sbuilder
<ScottK> mok0_: Did you do your xtide uploads?
<LaserJock> Lamego: how did you configure a common apt cache in sbuild?
<LaserJock> I ended up compiling a new schroot from Debian
<mok0_> ScottK: I asked for the FFe clearance for xtide, and for xtide-data I subscribed ubuntu-archive
<Lamego> LaserJock, I have a script which does the initial scrhoot setup, it clones my sources.list which points to the localhost apt-cache
<ScottK> mok0_: What's the bug again for xtide?
<mok0_> hang on
<LaserJock> Lamego: oh, I meant actually bindmounting an apt cache directory into the chroot
<mok0_> bug 188086
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 188086 in xtide "[needs-merge] xtide-2.9.5-2 from sid" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/188086
<Lamego> LaserJock, ah, I am not doing that any more, I did on the past with a bind mount, now I am using apt-cache, the http cache
<LaserJock> I guess it would work pretty much just as well
<ScottK> mok0_: I just confirmed no FFe needed, so go ahead and upload.
<mok0_> So I just build the source package on my own machine and upload it?
<ScottK> mok0_: Yep.
<mok0_> ... and the sync is done by the archive admins, right?
<Lamego> yes, but the bind mount is a bit more "dirty", you need to change the schroot mount script
<ScottK> mok0_: Make sure to build with -v to get all the debian/changelog entries since the last Ubuntu on in .changes.
<ScottK> mok0_: Yes.
<mok0_> ok
<ScottK> on/one
<LaserJock> Lamego: on the other hand you have to set up apt-cacher
<Lamego> LaserJock, which is simple, install & enable & source.lst change :)
<LaserJock> well, sort of simply
<LaserJock> I've had problems with it
<Lamego> and also because I have both 32bits and 64bits
<Lamego> I had problems with apt-proxy, moved to apt-cacher later
<nixternal> anyone feel like doing a backport at all? if so, look at backporting the bitlbee in hardy to previous releases, otherwise everyone not using Hardy will not be able to get on Yahoo
 * nixternal gets ready for skewl
<dhaval> how does one get a package added to ubuntu?
<pochu> !newpackage | dhaval
<ubotu> dhaval: The packaging guide is at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide - See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/NewPackages for information on getting a package integrated into Ubuntu - Other developer resources are at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment - See also !backports
<pochu> !revu
<ubotu> REVU is a web-based tool to give people who have worked on Ubuntu packages a chance to "put their packages out there" for other people to look at and comment on in a structured manner. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU
<dhaval> pochu, thanks!
<pochu> no probs. what package is it?
<dhaval> pochu, so how tough would it be find two developers to review the code?
<dhaval> pochu, its still under development, i hope to have it in position to package it by may, http://libcg.sf.net
<dhaval> pochu, its a library to allow userspace applications to easily exploit a kernel feature known as control groups
<pochu> dhaval: it won't be accepted until at least when Hardy is released
<pochu> I mean, it needs to go to Intrepid, as Hardy is frozen
<dhaval> pochu, also another quick question, the answer to which i can't find with a quick glance, is tehre some agreement to be signed with canonical or something like that before thy will start accepting it?
<dhaval> pochu, right, I am aware of that
<pochu> you can start packaging it now, of course, and even get acks
<pochu> err, no
<dhaval> pochu, ah, first i would like to stabilise it :)
<dhaval> pochu, it should be in a position ot be packaged sometime mid may i guess
<pochu> Canonical sponsors ubuntu, but it's up to MOTUs to upload packages to Universe
<pochu> that's fine then
<dhaval> pochu, you are more tahn welcome to join the list and influence the development
<pochu> although have in mind there will likely be quite more packages to be reviewed, so the sooner the better
<ScottK> dhaval: The major legal/contractual requirement is that the package be licensed appropriately for inclusion in Ubuntu.
<dhaval> pochu, true, but it has to be ready ot be reviewed, unless of course folks are willing to review it as we keep churning out patches
<dhaval> ScottK, LGPL should be allowed right?
<ScottK> dhaval: Absolutely.
<dhaval> right, so libcg is licensed under LGPL
<blueyed> dhaval: I would be glad to review it! (I'm MOTU)
<mok0_> uhuh, another glibc build on the way...
<dhaval> blueyed, cool! thanks! i would really love it if you joined in as we develop and give your feedback (all reviews are very well appreciated!)
<blueyed> dhaval: sure, just let me know when there's something to test.
<ScottK> mok0_: Congratulations on your first upload.
<mok0_> ScottK: :-D
<ScottK> mok0_: Now get to work ...
<sebner> ScottK: would you mind ACKing #210849 ?
<sebner> bug #210849
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 210849 in conky "[FFe] Please sync conky 1.5.1-1 from Debian(Unstable)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/210849
<sebner> mok0_: ah congrats also from my side
<ScottK> sebner: How many of the conky bugs does it fix? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/conky
<mok0_> sebner: thanks! I am having fun watching the build queue now :-P
<sebner> ScottK: likely bug #158933
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 158933 in conky "Conky is leaking memory at a very fast rate" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/158933
<sebner> ScottK: beside that a "non-reported-yet" segfault
<ScottK> Just that one?
<sebner> ScottK: ehm have you checked how many conky bugs are currently open? and for hardy? 2 I think
<ScottK> sebner: I see 4 other than the sync.
<ScottK> sebner: Are you subscribed for conky bugmail and are you going to mind after the package if there ther problems?
<sebner> ScottK: I have good contacts to debian maintainer so yes
<ScottK> OK.
<sebner> ScottK: but If you are unsure please N'ACK
<ScottK> sebner: Approved.
<sebner> ^^
<sebner> ScottK: thanks
<ScottK> sebner: I'm sure if there are problems I'm get to torture you into fixing them.  If there aren't, the distro is improved.  Either way I win.
<sebner> ScottK: Ok then ^^
<sebner> ScottK: btw, can Firefox break debdiffs during upload?
<ScottK> Dunno.  I don't much use Firefox.
<sebner> ScottK: e.g bug #65036
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 65036 in exim4 "Minor typo in docs" [Low,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/65036
<sebner> k, nvm then
<blueyed> sebner: only displaying is b0rked.. I've changed the content type of the attachment to plain/text, now it looks better.
<blueyed> sebner: you also want to check the "is a patch" box.
<sebner> blueyed: cool.thank :D Never had problems with that before though
<blueyed> sebner: from my experience, .debdiff uploads get the correct content type on upload though.. yeah, maybe a new bug then?
<sebner> blueyed: new one?
<blueyed> sebner: because of "never had problems with that before though"
<sebner> blueyed: ehm this is not my first contribution to ubuntu ^^
<blueyed> sebner: what I'm saying.. e.g. a "new bug" in firefox or launchpad, not handling the uploads correctly automatically.
<POX_> RainCT: huh? I changed the field before uploading
<sebner> blueyed: ah^^ sry. I'm too tired to understand what people say xD
<RainCT> POX_: yeh, got "svn: Out of date" :)
<POX_> RainCT: btw, join #debian-pythonm or they kick me from this channel for being offtopic
<RainCT> POX_: have you added a changelog entry?
<POX_> RainCT: it's "Initial release"
<POX_> see tags
<RainCT> POX_: ah, thought it had already been uploaded before
<sebner> gn8 folks
<mok0_> TheMuso: ping
<TheMuso> mok0_: pong
<mok0_> Hi TheMuso, I am pinging you to ask if you would add me to ~ubuntu-universe-sponsors :-)
<TheMuso> mok0_: Sure. Whats your LP username?
<mok0_> mok0
<TheMuso> mok0_: Give me a sec.
<mok0_> TheMuso: It's no hurry
<TheMuso> mok0_: done
<crimsun> james_w: no, I stepped down last year, but I punch the source every once in a while.
<mok0_> TheMuso: thanks!!
<TheMuso> mok0_: You're welcome.
<TheMuso> mok0_: Thanks for joining, and helping out.
<crimsun> james_w: I already feed hints, etc., to pkg-devel-alsa
<mok0_> yay, I got another icon :-P
#ubuntu-motu 2008-04-04
<cosmodad> is there a place to ask questions concerning the ubuntu building process, possibly here?
<cosmodad> more precisely, questions regarding package building as done in Ubuntu.
<persia> cosmodad: You could try here.  Depending on the question, it may be the right place.
<cosmodad> persia: ok let me shoot.
<cosmodad> I'm trying to add a patch to the thunderbird packages but already trouble with CDBS and quilt.
<persia> I suspect for that, you want #ubuntu-mozillateam
<cosmodad> persia: likely, but I suspect my question to be more of a general nature.
<persia> OK.  Try again then :)
<cosmodad> heh ok
<cosmodad> I apt-get source'd the thunderbird source package which comes with a tarball'ed copy of the upstream source...
<cosmodad> in order to see how quilt works, I unpacked the tarball and tried to push the first patch using `quilt push'.
<cosmodad> when I try so, however, I get a "can't find file to patch at input line X" error.
<persia> Ah.  Packages with built-in upstreaam tarballs can be tricky.
<cosmodad> persia: is there something wrong with my approach?
<persia> I don't think there is a quilt-edit-patch script (but I could be wrong).
<cosmodad> even if not, shouldn't a plain quilt push work anyway?
<persia> You'll need the unpacked, and patched source somehow, to create your patch.  I'm not sure of the standard way of generating that for thunderbird.  You likely do want a hint from #ubuntu-mozillateam, but your basic approach is correct.
<cosmodad> ok.
<cosmodad> persia: thanks for the starter, I'll try the mozilla branch of Ubuntu next.
<persia> cosmodad: In general, you want to have the patched source (just apply all the patches in quilt), a quilt add, a quily push, a quilt refesh, unpatch everything with quilt, and try a build.  The only tricky part is making sure you prepare the patched source the same way it is usually prepared.
<cosmodad> persia: the "just apply all the patches in quilt" is what bugs me. I can't even tell quilt to apply the very first patch.
<cosmodad> seems to me like some more preparation work needs to be done before quilt push can work, but I can't find anything.
<persia> Hmm.  Let's try automation...
<persia> !patch
<ubotu> Patches are files describing the changes in code to achieve some results.  There are a number of ways these can be produced, but https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/HowToFix and https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/PatchSystems may provide some useful guidelines.
<persia> Yep.  See the second link ubotu provided.  Should be some hints on using quilt.
<cosmodad> cool, I'll take a look.
<cosmodad> persia: ok I'm doing some progress. However, I couldn't resolve the following quilt question yet, maybe you can help me out: how'd I tell quilt that file foo.diff includes a patch file already?
<cosmodad> persia: seems to me that quilt's purpose is to filter out diffs by difference between an edited version and the original only.
<persia> cosmodad: You'd be better asking generally.  I have to leave now.  I believe you just reuse the current patch as the patch name, but I don't remember precisely.
<cosmodad> persia: ok, thanks for helping.
<crimsun> cosmodad: you certainly can tell quilt to apply the very first one.
<cosmodad> crimsun: what I want is have quilt take the .diff file I have and create a new patch from it.
<crimsun> cosmodad: put the patch into debian/patches (or wherever $QUILT_PATCHES is set to), and modify $QUILT_PATCHES/series as appropriate
<cosmodad> crimsun: that's it?
<crimsun> cosmodad: well, you'll need to test that it applies and builds afterward, but yes.
<crimsun> it's that straightforward.
<cosmodad> great.
<crimsun> cosmodad: I think you'll find the `push' definition in quilt(1) helpful
<cosmodad> crimsun: seems to have worked.
<cosmodad> crimsun: I'm off, thanks for the assistance.
<crimsun> yw
<bddebian> Heya gang
<RAOF> Aloha bddebian.
<bddebian> Howdy RAOF
<protonchris> Hey bddebian
<bddebian> Heya protonchris
<LaserJock> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Heya LaserJock!
<LaserJock> anybody familiar with bootcharts around?
<bddebian> Not me, sorry
<LaserJock> I'm trying to diagnose why my wife's laptop is having issues
<LaserJock> booting takes roughly 2.5-3 min
<LaserJock> it spends about 80s in readahead
<mb2> LaserJock: have you tried doing a profile boot
<LaserJock> just did one
<mb2> did that help at all?
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: where's the chart?
<LaserJock> mb2: didn't do anything as far as I can tell
<mb2> interesting... had the system ever been profiled before?
<LaserJock> nope
<LaserJock> it's a fairly fresh install
<mb2> you rebooted again after the profile boot right?
<LaserJock> yeah
<LaserJock> http://laserjock.us/files/gutsy-20080403-2.png
<LaserJock> I wonder if perhaps the hard drive is dying but I'm not sure why it would neccesarily make everything slow
<jdong> LaserJock: holy mother of jeebus
<LaserJock> jdong: what?
<jdong> LaserJock: usplash is slurping on your silicon soul!
<jdong> LaserJock: it would appear like splash is CPU spinning throughout bootup
<jdong> have you tried booting nosplash?
<LaserJock> nope
<jdong> yeah try removing splash for a bootup and see if that gets any better
<jdong> I've seen this bug several release cycles back with AMD64 nvidia
<LaserJock> this is i386 ATI, but ...
<LaserJock> ok, that's so totally better
<jdong> I guess the more interesting question now is, why on earth is usplash misbehaving? :)
<LaserJock> haha
<LaserJock> it's 40s now
 * ajmitch wishes his laptop booted in 40s
<LaserJock> that trimed off 145s
<StevenK> Does removing splash from the options, or adding nosplash fix it?
<jdong> removing splash from options
<jdong> nosplash I just made up
<jdong> lol
<LaserJock> I did nosplah
<LaserJock> nosplash
<crimsun> they're semantically identical
<jdong> what does usplash look for?
<LaserJock> http://laserjock.us/files/gutsy-20080403-4.png
<LaserJock> that's the new bootchart
<LaserJock> this is so weird, I mean all I did was a fresh install of gutsy and the thing is like roasted
<LaserJock> now at least it boots fast
<nixternal> may I retire please?
 * LaserJock fires nixternal 
<nixternal> sweet jesus, that's just as good!!!
<nixternal> our class tonight, we bid for projects for points...so me being the dumb ass I am, bidded on all of the high point projects and got all 10 of them
<nixternal> what a dumb ass I am
<jdong> :'<,'>s/(>=[^)]*)//g
 * jdong whistles....
<jdong> brownies for whoever identifies what evil that does :D
<StevenK> It's a ed line for vi, firstly
<StevenK> It removes the version components in lines containing a ','
<jdong> lol guilty as charged :)
<LaserJock> hmm, that's pretty good
<LaserJock> StevenK's the man
<jdong> impressive indeed
<ajmitch> nixternal: which means that you have a large amount of work to do?
<StevenK> :'<,'s/(>[>=]?[^)]*//g
<StevenK> Is probably better, though
<nixternal> yo yo
<nixternal> ajmitch: a large amount is an understatement
<ajmitch> sucker
<nixternal> tell me about it
<nixternal> that's what I get for being greedy for that 4.0 GPA
<ajmitch> extra shots of espresso tonight!
<nixternal> no way, I gotta go to bed..gotta wake up in a few hours and get to the free software conference in the city
<ajmitch> why bother with sleep?
<nixternal> funny, jcastro and I were just talking about not sleeping for Penguicon in a couple of weeks :)
<ajmitch> but jcastro is mad
<nixternal> true
<Hobbsee> !visternal
<ubotu> Oh no!  The pointy-clicky Vista lover has arrived!  He's rumoured to be giving out free money, too!
<uniscript> if I install a -dbg pkg, where do I need to put the source so that gdb will find it?
<jdong> ScottK2: with regards to the FF3 backport, are you sure you looked at the debdiffs/dscs from post https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/gutsy-backports/+bug/191796/comments/25?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 191796 in gutsy-backports "Please backport firefox-3.0 3.0~b4 final" [Undecided,Incomplete]
<jdong> err how did I bold that?
<ScottK> I think I looked at the last one.
 * jdong looks again
<jdong> ok, time to do a sanity check on myself
<StevenK> "Have I written a unreadable regexp in the last twenty minutes?" 'Check. I'm sane.'
<jdong> ScottK2: both patches apply for me against hardy... make sure you used firefox-3.0 and xulrunner-1.9 source packages?
 * jdong wonders how much his suggestions sound like "is it plugged in?"
<ScottK> I thought I did.
<uniscript> gdb question, how do I persuade it to read the symbol table of a particular .so when info share says the symbol table is there but not read?
<ScottK> I got a grand total of one hour of sleep on Monday night, so I'm a little fuzzy this week.
<jdong> it's been a pretty rough week for me too
<LaserJock> StevenK: are promotions done via bug report these days?
<StevenK> They are.
<dholbach> good morning
<geser> good morning dholbach
<dholbach> hi geser
<\sh> moins
<murrayc_> protonchris: Hi. Do you think we might get one more glom version in?
<warp10> Good morning
<huats> morning
<pochu> LucidFox: hi, bug 184084 has an RFS, are you looking into it?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 184084 in checky "Extension description mentions Iceweasel/Icedove/Iceape" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/184084
<LucidFox> pochu> sure, I'll look into it
<pochu> thank you
<rod> jono. just mailed you
<jono> thanks rod :)
<cosmodad> Heya. I have ge-packaged the thunderbird package and added another patch. To reflect this in TB's version, I changed "2.0.0.12+nobinonly-0ubuntu0.7.10.0" to "2.0.0.12+nobinonly-0ubuntu0.7.10.0~mypatch1". Nevertheless, aptitude upgrade wants to revert back to the non-patched package.
<cosmodad> how'd I need to version the new package in order for it to be more recent than the old one?
<Fujitsu> cosmodad: The entire point of ~ is that it is less than even nothing.
<Fujitsu> Perhaps +mypatch1
<cosmodad> Fujitsu: at the very end?
<Fujitsu> Yes - just change the ~ to a +
<cosmodad> Fujitsu: or next to the first +?
<james_w> cosmodad: no, at the end
<cosmodad> james_w: looks kind of inconsistent to me, having the +nobinonly part followed by the ubuntu-specific version, and then by another +part.
<james_w> cosmodad: it doesn't matter
<Fujitsu> Putting it after the nobinonly is completely wrong.
<cosmodad> ok.
<cosmodad> I used to know a bit of (single-lined) shell code which you could use to compare two debian versions, such that you get to know which of them is the higher one.
<cosmodad> Anyone remember that?
<Lamego> dpkg --compare-versions
<cosmodad> Lamego: ah, thanks a lot.
<cosmodad> is there a way to change the version and produce new binary packages without going through the hassle of recompilation using cdbs?
<james_w> I don't think so
<Fujitsu> Is dpkg-buildpackage really too hard to run?
<Lamego> cosmodad, debuild -nc
<Lamego> assuming you did a previous build
<cosmodad> I did
<Lamego> -nc stands for no clean
<cosmodad> Lamego: I'm using pdebuild and used --debbuildopts -nc to provide the switch, but now I get "dpkg-genchanges: cannot combine -b or -B and -S"
<cosmodad> the build process used dpkg-genchanges -b -S
<zoli2k> Maybe it is not the right channel but, I am looking for a good bug tracking system for bazaar. Is there any other solution as using Launchpad?
<james_w> zoli2k: there is a plugin for trac
<james_w> zoli2k: #bzr would be a more appropriate channel
<zoli2k> james_w: I checked the trac_bzr, but I am not sure it is stable enough for a production production environment.
<zoli2k> I will check the #bzr channel, thx.
<Iulian> Hey
<pochu> nxvl: hi, I've unsubscribed u-u-s from bug 196778. Should you fix it, I'll sponsor you... so feel free to ping me for it once you're done
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 196778 in likewise-open "Provide likewise-open-gui and likewise-open binaries rather than domainjoin-gui and domainjoin-cli" [Low,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/196778
<protonchris> murrayc_: It is definite worth a try.  I'll have time to package it this weekend.
<murrayc_> protonchris: Great. I'll do yet another tarball release today.
<ScottK2> murrayc_ and protonchris: At this point it's probably easier to package a new revision with a patch for a bugfix than upload a new upstream version if that's feasible.
<murrayc_> ScottK2: You can have the diff between versions if you like, but there are about 10 bugs that are fixed. It's easier just to take the tarball.
<ScottK2> murrayc_: Makes sense.
<ScottK2> I missed the earlier part of the conversation.  For single fixes a patch is simpler/faster right now, but for that, I agree a new tarball is better.
<protonchris> ScottK2: thanks for the info.  If you are arround this weekend, I might ask you to sponsor an upload :)
<RainCT> hi
<protonchris> After I get an FFe of course.
<ScottK2> protonchris: I should be around off and on.  No FFe needed if it's just bug fixes.
<ScottK2> jdong: Thoughts on Bug #211605?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 211605 in ktorrent-kde4 "new upstream release ktorrent-kde4" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/211605
<protonchris> ScottK2: Great.  Thanks.
<jdong> ScottK2: I think it's a good Hardy candidate
<ScottK2> jdong: Thanks.
<huats> i just went on that bug : https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/svn-load/+bug/210754
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 210754 in svn-load "apt-get install svn-load fails because of conflicting files" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<huats> what can I do to solve it ? adding a conflict in the control file ?
<huats> is it the right way ?
<james_w> huats: no, it looks like svn-load is now a part of subversion-helper-scripts
<james_w> huats: ah no, I'm wrong
<huats> :)
<huats> (that was my first feeling too)
<james_w> huats: subversion-helper-scripts should be removed from Ubuntu
<huats> james_w: any reason ? any url where can I found that ? (i am cuious)
<james_w> huats: rmadison -u debian subversion-helper-scripts is a good place to start
<huats> james_w: if I understand clearly, the result of your command shows me that it is no longer available in debian ?
<james_w> huats: compare with "rmadison -u ubuntu subversion-helper-scripts"
<huats> I already did :)
<james_w> but yes, sorry for being obtuse, it was removed from Debian a while ago, although I am having trouble finding any evidence it was ever there.
<huats> ok
<huats> so is there any thing I can do to ask for removal ?
<huats> (never did that)
<james_w> huats: I don't know exactly, I've never done it myself.
<huats> ok
<james_w> I think we need a little more information before we do ask for removal.
<huats> i think so
<huats> I'll try to investigate :)
<huats> or may be someone else has an idea ?
<james_w> https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/subversion-helper-scripts
<james_w> that says it's been around in Ubuntu for ever
<james_w> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/subversion-helper-scripts/+bug/149677
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 149677 in svn-load "svn package conflict [hardy, gutsy]" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<james_w> you should mark your bug as a duplicate of that.
<huats> I did already
<james_w> great
<\sh> anyone using lighttpd there?
<james_w> huats: I can't find the record of it being removed from Debian
<huats> hum, weird
<james_w> yep
<james_w> maybe it wasn't synced from Debian, but the changelog says "unstable"
<huats> yep
<james_w> ok, can anyone tell us how to request a package removal?
<slytherin> james_w: whcih package?
<james_w> slytherin: subversion-helper-scripts
<slytherin> james_w: ideally you should file a bug. But why do you want it removed?
<james_w> slytherin: it's gone from Debian, it conflicts with svn-load-dirs, has only had one update
<james_w> and it appears to just be thin wrappers around svn and svnadmin
<slytherin> james_w: gone when and why?
<slytherin> james_w: add that info to bug report. :-)
<james_w> slytherin: that's the problem, I can't find it in removals.txt and google seems to know nothing about it ever being in Debian.
<james_w> you missed all the discussion unfortunately.
<huats> james_w: may be we can just put a conflict between the 2 packages...
<james_w> Is there a record of where a package was synced from?
<huats> james_w: don't seem to find one...
<ScottK> For a package that old, it's unlikely you'll find it.
<\sh> ScottK, we should have references...even when it was coming from this apt-get.org website...
<ScottK> \sh: I agree, but where would it be.  Launchpad didn't even exist yet at that point, did it?
<\sh> nope...
<\sh> ScottK, but some archive-admin could have some old lists ;)
<\sh> asking pitti :)
<ScottK> Maybe.  OTOH, if it hasn't been touched in years the odds of killing it hurting anything are small.
 * ScottK would say ask via the removal bug.
<\sh> well, the fun part:
<\sh>     *   Removed from disk  on 2006-05-04.
<\sh>     * Removal requested on 2006-05-04.
<\sh>     * Superseded on 2006-02-04 by subversion-helper-scripts - 0.5-2
<\sh>     * Published on 2005-12-21
<huats> on the other side like I say since the beginning : since it is conflicting file with another package, why not simply add a conflict between the 2 packages ? since they are both providing the same functionality....
<james_w> huats: no, I don't think they are
<\sh> what about this: http://www1.apt-get.org/search.php?query=subversion-helper-scripts&submit=Submit+Query&arch[]=i386&arch[]=all
<\sh> output is here: http://paste.ubuntu.com/6466/
<ScottK> Then it should definitely die.
<\sh> bah...I'm old...
<james_w> subversion-helper-scripts' svn-load is just a wrapper around "svnadmin load". svn-load-dirs is a replacement for some non-free script that was in subversion package for a while IIRC.
<james_w> \sh: thanks
<huats> james_w: ok... my mistake
<\sh> james_w, np :)
<huats> thanks \sh and ScottK too...
<james_w> so shall I submit a removal request for sponsorship?
<ScottK> My vote is yes.
<\sh> james_w, file it...
<ScottK> But I'm generally a fan of removals.
<james_w> I can convert an existing bug?
<james_w> Do I need to follow a format for the title like ftp.d.o ones?
<ScottK> Yes.
<ScottK> No.  Just provide the needed information.
<james_w> great, thanks.
<\sh> guys...even when I'm not a fan of trance music :) but you should listen to Acid Reflux from Jamendo.com (CC music)
<bddebian> Heya gang
<white> anyone knows a reason other than hardware problem, why my realtek network card would not show up under lspci at all, althgouh it did show up yesterday
<white> but then it had the problem that it timed out after 10 min
<\sh> white, I'm guessing: "Sudden Death" ,->
<\sh> hey bddebian
<\sh> it happens sometimes to realtek nics
<white> \sh: hi :)
<white> \sh: well that was not quite the answer i wanted to hear :)
<ScottK> james_w: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Removal is where the needed information used to live.  Unfortunately it's been moved to I don't know where.
<\sh> white, how old?
<white> 1-2 years
<white> \sh: if another device would steal the memory space, the card would still show up under lspci, right?
<\sh> white, ok...two possibilities: 1. your card died or 2. your mainboard has problems with at least one pci slot
<\sh> white, yes...
<\sh> white, the latter one happened to me in the past...but that was my agp port on a gigabyte board
<crimsun> I'd start by looking through dmesg logs.
<ScottK> dholbach: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Removal was made into a redirect to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment#Removals which no longer exists as part of your wiki reoganization.  Would you please undeprecate the page or repoint the forward to where the information now is.
<white> the story is quite interesting, my laptop was broken and i send it in to acer under warranty. They replaced and most likely changed some hardware in there and when i start up the laptop, i get told that there is a conflict on a pci slot
<white> i mean they should have seen that when they repaired it
<bddebian> Hi \sh
<\sh> oh ...laptop
<james_w> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/PackageArchive#head-6a4a4d2ad0cc004c6199f465539e3bbc2239291e
<\sh> -ENEVERBUYACER ,-)
<james_w> ScottK, dholbach: ^
<white> acer travelmate 5514wlmi
<white> \sh: ACK
<dholbach> james_w: thanks
<\sh> white, I have a desktop from them...cheapware from saturn ... I'll never buy such a thing again..I'll pay more the next time
<white> \sh: well i do not have thre equipment here in my room to open it now and i either suspect that they screwed the slots up or the card is just dead
<dholbach> ScottK: done
<white> either way, i have to wait for my thinkpad to arrive next week, i guess
<white> wasn't sure, if there was anything else i could have tried on the software side, but neither lspci nor iomem shows the code of the device at all
<crimsun> does the bios enumerate it?
<white> nope
<white> the bios does not give anything, as far as i can see :/
<james_w> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/link-monitor-applet/+bug/185318 is on the hardy milestone list and is in universe, does anyone fancy fixing it?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 185318 in link-monitor-applet "link-monitor-applet dependency problems" [Medium,Confirmed]
<\sh> james_w, there should eb a new package in debian
<\sh> regarding the comments
<james_w> \sh: I'm aware of that, I was just suggesting it would be a suitable task for someone.
<\sh> preparing a FFe :)
<\sh> and then following up for sync eventually
<james_w> yeah, hopefully it will be quite straightforward.
<\sh> I'm subscribed now for that bug...if I find the time this evening I'll think I can deal with it
 * \sh has still some other bugs to take care of
<\sh> anywys...weekend time now :) cu later from home
<james_w> I can take it later if no-one else gets to it, I was just hoping that mentioning it would have someone jump at the chance.
<james_w> bye \sh.
<stani> ScottK: How will you handle the SPE fixes?
<pochu> stani: he already uploaded it
<pochu>  spe (0.8.4.e-1ubuntu1) hardy; urgency=low
<pochu>  .
<pochu>    * Add 01pycheck-list.dpatch from spe svn to fix crash (LP: #201069)
<pochu> if that's what you are referring to ;)
<ScottK> stani: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/hardy/+source/spe/0.8.4.e-1ubuntu1
<stani> ok, I've been fixing some more bugs on the upstream bug tracker
<ScottK> stani: Please attach patches to the bugs.  Unified diff is better (diff -ruN)
<stani> but I don't know if it is possible they still get uploaded as well (maybe as SPE 0.8.4.f)
<ScottK> Possible.
<stani> ScottK: but the bugs are on berlios, not on launchpad
<ScottK> I see
<ScottK> stani: How many bugs?
<stani> 5 bugs or so
<ScottK> At this point I think we should limit changes to significant bugs.
<ScottK> I'd say if you've got patches for bugs that aren't in LP, file a bug that essentially says please add the following patches to fix ....
<ScottK> pochu or I will take it from there.
<pochu> or release 0.8.4.f and make our lives easier :)
<stani> and my life too
<pochu> (if it's strictly bug-fix only, of course)
<stani> yes only bug fixing
<ScottK> pochu: If we go that route, I want to upload direct to Ubuntu right now.  I want to leave dpatch in the package so we'll have it for SRUs if we need it.
<ScottK> That'll work too.
<jcastro> hi pochu
<pochu> hey jcastro
<pochu> ScottK: fine for me
<jcastro> pochu: can you pick a time/date for your python packaging on the wiki so I can write an announcement up?
<stani> ok
<stani> pochu: feel free to contact me about it for brainstorming or whatever help you need
<stani> pochu: I mean about open week
<pochu> jcastro: Thu 31st Apr at 18 or 19 UTC... if I knew whether I'm UTC+1 or +2... :)
<pochu> stani: thanks :)
<pochu> stani: what are we right now, +1 or +2?
<pochu> DST confuses me :)
<ScottK> Someone who cares about Tex might want to look into Bug 131239
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 131239 in tex4ht "sync request" [Wishlist,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/131239
<pochu> jcastro: looks like I'm +2... so 18:00 UTC on Thursday WFM
<stani> pochu: I am in amsterdam (so I think +1)
<pochu> stani: is it 17:05 there?
<stani> yep
<pochu> then +2 :)
<stani> pochu: where are you?
<mok0> ScottK: What do you need more to grant FFe?
<ScottK> mok0: The usual stuff.
<pochu> stani: Spain
<mok0> ScottK: I'll give it a look, during the weekend
<LaserJock> is there any possible way we can get a "this absolutely needs to be done before release" list?
<ScottK> LaserJock: In theory it's the list of milestoned stuff.
<pochu> LaserJock: milestone it for ubuntu-8.04 :)
<mok0> aScottK: If you unsubscribe release-team, I'll resubscribe when I'm done with it
<mok0> ScottK: ^
<ScottK> Will do.
<LaserJock> ScottK: are we actually using the milestone?
<ScottK> LaserJock: I know the RM is looking at it.
<LaserJock> as in, maybe we need to announce and properly use the milestone
<ScottK> Dunno how complete it is.
<ScottK> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+milestone/ubuntu-8.04
<LaserJock> I'm feeling overwhelmed by lots of trivial stuff while it seems at times important things are falling through the cracks
<LaserJock> ScottK: yes, I'm aware of where the milestones are ;-)
<LaserJock> but I am unaware of MOTU actually ever using it in a cohesive or coordinated way
<ScottK> I find Launchpad confusing enough that I never assume people know how to find stuff.
<LaserJock> good point
<jcastro> pochu: do you think an hour is enough for your session?
<ScottK> Personally I do use it for stuff that I think really needs to get done.
<jcastro> pochu: I figured if we're going to try to get upstream participation that it would suck if we ran out of time
<ScottK> I agree that we don't use it cohesively.
<pochu> jcastro: hmm, I haven't thought about that... do you think we should do a two hours session?
<pochu> I could probably run one in one hour, making it simple enough
<jcastro> pochu: I was just thinking about that.
<pochu> jcastro: hmm, perhaps we can put it at 21UTC and in case we need more time, we take it :)
<jcastro> that sounds good
<jcastro> or we can move people to an #ubuntu-python after your hour too
<pochu> jcastro: 21 works for me too, so I think that would be better
<jcastro> ok
<pochu> thanks
<jcastro> give me 45 minutes for the wiki to update. :D
<stani> I didn't know there was an ubuntu-python room.
<pochu> I don't think there is one :)
<stani> I think for the logging it would be better to do it at the end 21UTC
<jcastro> stani: yeah I was just recommending that if people wanted to continue to ask questions we could just lump them in a temporary channel while the rest of the classroom sessions went on
<jcastro> but 2100+ is fine too
<stani> jcastro: ok, so let's put it on 2100+
<ScottK> mok0: I can't remember if I asked you this before, but I was wondering if you'd take a look at Bug 66862
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 66862 in python-numpy "scipy not built with atlas support ?" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/66862
<proppy> ScottK: thanks for accepting my membership in ~pythonistas
<ScottK> proppy: You're welcome.  I just recently got that ability.
<proppy> leaving ubuntu-gnomemm
<stani> ScottK: What is pythonistas?
<ScottK> It's a Launchpad team for looking after Python packages in Universe.
<ScottK> Mostly it just gets you bugmail.
<stani> Would it be interesting for me to be a member as well?
<ScottK> If you're interested in trying to triage/fix bugs in packages that are written in Python, then yes.
<ScottK> stani: ^^
<proppy> stani: I just received bugmail from you
<proppy> stani: I thought you were already a member :)
<ScottK> proppy: You'll get a lot more now that you're in the team.
<stani> proppy: yes, I am trying to fix now all bugs on launchpad of spe
<ScottK> stani: If you interest is limited to spe, then it shouldn't be necessary to join.  If you are interested in getting more broadly involved in Ubuntu and fixing/packaging Python stuff, then I'd be glad to add you.
<stani> ScottK: Ok, maybe I don't need to be a member now. Feel free to bother me if you some wxpython applications have bugs. That I know quite well.
<ScottK> stani: As a rule, we'd like to limit asking people to install stuff from outside the packaging system.  Maybe you could upload svn snapshots for testing to a PPA instead of asking people to directly pull from your SVN.
<ScottK> stani: Will do.
<ScottK> stani: We could help you with getting the versioning right so that your svn snapshot would then automatically get replaced by the official package once it's uploaded.
<stani> I am not an expert on packaging (that's why I'd like to see that python-packaging session). I've never setup a PPA before.
<pochu> stani: I have a PPA, I could explain how to use it if you are interested and/or upload a snapshot of spe to mine
<stani> pochu: That would be great, but we have to do it another time as I have to leave soon for dinner.
<stani> Scottk & pochu: I think I fixed all linux related bugs on berlios and launchpad in subversion. So I plan to do a .8.4.f release tomorrow. (There are still some Windows bugs left, which I can't reproduce, but I feel to lazy to start Windows.)
<ScottK> stani: Great.
<pochu> stani: cool, ping me whenever you want and I help you setting a ppa and learning the basis (which are really simple)
<effie_jayx> hey guys... what gpg server should I send my keys?
<effie_jayx> sorry for the offtopic there
<james_w> effie_jayx: there is an ubuntu one.
<james_w> http://keyserver.ubuntu.com:11371/
<tbf> dpkg-source: cannot represent change to .git/objects/09/2b690e4a38923bb7acacad90bcd1c4738e8d58: binary file contents changed
<tbf> is it possible to tell dpkg-buildpackage to ignore certain files?
<persia> tbf: I believe you want -i (although that may be for debuild, which is fewer characters than dpkg-buildpackage, but otherwise similar)
<tbf> persia: hmm... usually i also use debuild - easier to remember
 * tbf reads the man page of debuild again, to find out the difference between both tools
<tbf> (was told to use dpkg-buildpackage for this stuff)
<LaserJock> I just don't include revision control files in my source packages
<LaserJock> but you don't always get to control that kind of stuff
<persia> When I use revision control, I tend to take an export to build.
<LaserJock> exactly
<tbf> persia, LaserJock: i added the git repo by myself to prevent getting nuts with manual patch management and such. don't own the package just want to fix some stuff. don't ask, the scenario is slightly nuts
<tbf> persia, LaserJock: but exporting sounds good
<olopez> hi
<olopez> Here i can make a questions about ubuntu packages?
<ScottK> About packaging and bug fixes, yes.  For support questions, no.
<olopez> ok
<olopez> I have question about package of intel pro wireless firmware , i don`t accept any license agregament of intel when i install ubuntu and my wifi is working , it is ubuntu using a freeversion of this firmware , in freebsd for example i need to accept a lincense agregament
<james_w> olopez: are you using Hardy?
<olopez> yes Hardy Heron
<james_w> olopez: it uses the iwl driver, which is a free replacement for the ipw drivers, or whatever it was called.
<LaserJock> although I don't think ipw didn't ask you about the license
<LaserJock> often times distros will ask people to agree to a license agreement even though it's not necessary
<olopez> ok ,great i don't know it :D
<LaserJock> it's often just to inform users about the license
<olopez> LaserJock: but i think that is good see the license agreement if it has it
<LaserJock> olopez: but you don't do that on every package do you? :-)
<olopez> usually user don`t read it but ...
<LaserJock> Do you agree to the GPL? to the LGPL? to the MIT?
<sistpoty> hi folks
<LaserJock> we don't do that because it's irrelevent to the user
<olopez> LaserJock: usually i read the license
 * sistpoty agrees to the must pet a chinchilla license :)
<LaserJock> olopez: of every package you install?
<olopez> i read it allways at least the type of license , i need know if it is free and how license generate this freedom
<RainCT> olopez: btw, you can see what non-free packages you have installed by running 'vrms', and basically looking from which component you are downloading the package
<olopez> but i undertand that ubuntu a lot of times is for a beginers users and you don`t need see licences agregaments all time , but you can accept more important licenses on installation time
<LaserJock> olopez: you couldn't possibly have read every license for every package on your computer
<LaserJock> or at least, that would be a looooong time
<LaserJock> in Ubuntu we pretty much just make the user agree to license agreements when they have to Sun Java for instance
<olopez> LaserJock: i don't read GPL or MPL license every time that i install GPL or MPL package but i think that could be interesting to read it before you install for frist time you distro and get adverts about non free packages
<LaserJock> right
<olopez> it is only a sugestion ;)
<LaserJock> but you're talking about at least looking at a couple thousand licenses
<LaserJock> just when you install the OS
<sistpoty> well, very often you can read the gpl in an about box of a gpl-d program
<LaserJock> olopez: you choose free or non-free by the repos you enable
<LaserJock> beyond that I don't think there's much of a point for the vast majority of people
<LaserJock> olopez: I'm not criticising you I just can't imagine how long it would take to read all that :-)
<LaserJock> even just to see what the license is
<sistpoty> oh, nice... I just looked out of interest from this discussion. looks like the caspe source package is missing the full gpl... slangasek? ;)
<sistpoty> casper even
<slangasek> huhwha?
<olopez> LaserJock: yes but it could be a posibility on the instalation time , with the base packages
<LaserJock> olopez: how do you mean?
<sistpoty> slangasek: just thought I'd tell an archive admin... but of course I can file a bug if you want ;)
<LaserJock> olopez: what would be possible?
<slangasek> sistpoty: bug please
<sistpoty> kk
<slangasek> sistpoty: particularly as we probably want to fix this by having someone upload casper, rather than removing it from the archive ;)
<LaserJock> sistpoty: casper needs full GPL?
<sistpoty> LaserJock: it says it's gpl
<LaserJock> oh wait, I know what you mean
<sistpoty> slangasek: good point :P
<LaserJock> I thought you were saying full GPL in debian/copyright
<olopez> LaserJock: an option to read L.A,  if you want do it before instalation , at least licences of the base install
<LaserJock> olopez: but that would be probably many hundreds of licenses at least
<LaserJock> well
<LaserJock> I think there is some distinction between a License and a License Agreement, isn't there?
<RainCT> olopez: "less /usr/share/doc/*/copyright"
<RainCT> ah
<LaserJock> I don't think there are any License Agreements for the base install in the sense of "Do you agree to this license, yes or no?"
<LaserJock> maybe I'm mistaken though and a LA is just the License.
<olopez> RainCT: ;) is better cd /usr/share/doc/;  for i in $(ls -1); do less  /usr/share/doc/$i/copyright; done;  ;)
<LaserJock> but by installing th software you aren't agreeing to anything (I don't think) so I'm not sure how it would be called an LA
<RainCT> olopez: true, but there you have your option to see all licenses :P
<olopez> mm i have to leave irc , nice conversation see u all
<sistpoty> LaserJock: not too sure, but I guess someone could interpret installing the software as "using" it (where you'd need to agree with the gpl). At least the final setup will definitely start programs, so it falls under "using"
<sistpoty> LaserJock: oh, at least GPL-2 doesn't seem to say anything about usage, so forget it
<sistpoty> jdong: around? might want to take a look at FFe bug #211910 ?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 211910 in rtorrent "[FFe] request for new upstream version " [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/211910
<jdong> sistpoty: looks good to me, having a lightweight client that supports DHT will be good for Hardy
<sistpoty> jdong: ok, thanks!
<sistpoty> DktrKranz2: some testing for rtorrent would be nice... can you add results to the bug report please?
<sebner> sistpoty: ha. And I always think newbies like me make such mistakes
<sistpoty> heh
<rzr> wtf http://www.google.com/interstitial?url=http://www.jabbin.com/
<sistpoty> ScottK: /me still giggles about universe-code-monkeys... if it had been before April 1st, I'd been doing a REVU - bananas release... collect two bananas and your upload may enter the archive *g*
<ScottK> Absolutely.
<sistpoty> 15 bananas, and you're a MOTU *g*
<ScottK> sistpoty: What do you think about my reply?  On target?
<sistpoty> ScottK: imho yes... but I must admit I haven't thought too much about the whole thing yet
<sistpoty> (I didn't know I may print business cards with an ubuntu logo btw.)
<ScottK> Fair enough.
<ScottK> sistpoty: As a MOTU Council member emeritus, I think people will be interested to hear what you have to say on it.
<sistpoty> ScottK: ok, I'll take a closer look later (I'm still drafting the mail about finalrelease, and need to fix some hw first :/)
<ScottK> No problem.
<sistpoty> ScottK: imho you're right with writing to not mix up membership and other tasks, but imho it might be useful to grant these in the same procedure... otherwise I guess we might create too much levels of steps to go through to becoming a motu
<sistpoty> ScottK: so s.th. like applying for $whateveritiscalled$ which has the side effect that MC will grant membership as well
<ScottK> It's not that I object so much to have additional benifits, but let's walk before we run.
<sistpoty> good point
<sistpoty> ok, need to reboot now to plug in a hard disk... bbl
<LaserJock> ScottK: do we want to limit the "significant and sustained" to Universe/Multiverse?
<ScottK> LaserJock: I think we have to.  Otherwise it's not the MC they should be going to for membership.
<LaserJock> ScottK: in your email you said "Ubuntu"
<ScottK> Oh.
<LaserJock> I'm saying do we want to further that  to "Universe and Multiverse"?
<ScottK> Yes.
<ScottK> My mistake.
<LaserJock> np, just wanted to be clear
<ScottK> I'll follow-up.  I meant to have that in there.
<ScottK> I understand there's a lot of controversy in the CC about who can do membership and we should be careful not to step on toes.
<LaserJock> ScottK: btw, there are a lot of complications with the "extra permissions" bits
<LaserJock> I wouldn't worry too much about it
<LaserJock> but yes, one step at a time
<LaserJock> We can't give them release nomination powers yet
<Syntux> Hi, I'm trying to build a deb for a package that doesn't have a .dsc
<LaserJock> all we can do is to make them a member of ~ubuntu-bugcontrol so the can flip Importance and set Won't Fix
<LaserJock> Syntux: do you have the rest of the source package?
<Syntux> LaserJock, yes
<ScottK> Which is a good start, but let's get the basic thing in place first.
<LaserJock> Syntux: orig.tar.gz and diff.gz?
<LaserJock> ScottK: definately agreed
<LaserJock> ScottK: the limitation is that LP can only handle one team per permission
<Syntux> LaserJock, oh hmm well, I don't know what you are talking about :D the idea is that I wanted to learn about packaging so I could contribute so I picked a package that we don't have it in ubuntu repos for learning purpose http://sourceforge.net/project/downloading.php?group_id=146506&use_mirror=dfn&filename=dictconv-0.2.tar.bz2&59646642
<LaserJock> so we can't grant ~ubuntu-dev and ~universe-hackers both release nomnation permission for instance
<ScottK> If ubuntu-dev is in hackers, then it's fine.
<LaserJock> Syntux: oh, I see. You are starting from scratch
 * ScottK recalls his opnions on LP aren't credible and goes back to work.
<LaserJock> ScottK: right, which I'm against doing ..
<LaserJock> but whatever :-)
<Syntux> LaserJock, yup
<ScottK> Fair enough.
<ScottK> All the more reason to not worry about it in the first instantiation of the policy.
<sistpoty> re
<LaserJock> Syntux: well, then firstly there is a difference between a source tarball and a source package
<LaserJock> Syntux: the source tarball is what you download from the software authors, usually a tar.gz or tar.bz2
<Syntux> LaserJock, ok, that one is tar.bz2
<LaserJock> Syntux: a source package is made up of that tarball, which we name .orig.tar.gz so that it's clear that it is the original source
<LaserJock> then there is a diff.gz which is a compressed diff file that holds all the packaging information
<Syntux> LaserJock, aha and where to get that one from? and is it possible to create one if the author didn't include it ?
<LaserJock> the .dsc file is a description file that tells about the package (name, version, etc.) and the other files of the source package
<LaserJock> Syntux: that's exactly what you have to do, create one
<LaserJock> Syntux: that's the job of the packager
<Syntux> LaserJock, great, How to do so?
<LaserJock> but, first things first
<LaserJock> we need to make sure one doesn't already exist in Ubuntu or Debian
<Syntux> LaserJock, yeah I'm aware of that point and actually dictconv doesn't exists in both.
<Syntux> which is a good start
<LaserJock> we also need to check that it's not presently being worked on
<Syntux> LaserJock, well, that's another story that highly depends on my ability of knowing the unknown and I'm noob at black magic.
<LaserJock> Syntux: no problemo
<LaserJock> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.tag=needs-packaging
<Syntux> LaserJock, I mean, if it was clear on the author and/or package website that someone is doing so then it's meaningless to repeat the work, so of course I will avoid that when possible but is there any other way to know if someone is working on it in feasible manner?
<LaserJock> Syntux: the URL I just gave is a search of all Ubuntu bugs that have the "needs-packaging" tag
<Syntux> ok, assuming I picked one and it didn't have a orig.tar.gz and the diff one what should I do ?
<LaserJock> those are the "please packaging .." bugs
<LaserJock> ok, well
<LaserJock> if you have some patience it's a good idea to read the Packaging Guide
<LaserJock> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide
<Syntux> LaserJock, dude, I'm already there and I have read it but there is nothing about creating the orig and diff
<LaserJock> hmm
<LaserJock> I guess you might have misunderstood then
<Syntux> maybe
<LaserJock> if you've read it then the specific answer is debuild or dpkg-buildpackage creates the diff
<norsetto> hello
<LaserJock> because the original tarball is a .bz2 it's good to convert it to a tar.gz
<Syntux> debuild -S would create the diff is origi.tar is present
<LaserJock> exactly
<sistpoty> oh Syntux: are you a member of bugsquad? If so, I guess there could be some RFP's in debian, which might be worth to be added as bug task
<LaserJock> Syntux: it also make the .dsc
<Syntux> ahaaaaaa
<Syntux> I got you now :D
<Syntux> I was assuming the origi.tar is something should be inside the extracted package :D
 * Syntux hides.
<LaserJock> Syntux: what you want to do to convert the .bz2 to .orig.tar.gz is to bunzip2 and then gzip -9 the result
<LaserJock> name it to <packagename>-<version>.orig.tar.gz
<Syntux> sistpoty, no I'm not.
<Syntux> siretart, but trying to be a packager, it's useful thing
<no0tic> jdong, hi, I saw you commented on FFe about {r,lib}torrent, upstream devs say it's unstable, but I use it on a daily basis since few month without a problem
<sistpoty> no0tic: oh, can you add that to the bug please?
<sistpoty> no0tic: did you spot any regressions to the version that's in hardy?
<no0tic> sistpoty, no
<sistpoty> no0tic: can you also add this to the bug please? thanks a lot!
<no0tic> sistpoty, everything is working smoothly
<sistpoty> great!
<Syntux> LaserJock, Ok, I got that orig.tar.gz nwo
<no0tic> sistpoty, I saw that someone already stressed the fact that is unstable.. I think upstream dev will consider 1.0 as stable so...
<sistpoty> no0tic: oh, just saw it in my mail, thanks... that was norsetto ;)
<norsetto> the bugger ...
<sistpoty> hey norsetto, how's the going?
<LaserJock> Syntux: to start working you can unpack that tarball
<norsetto> sistpoty: smooth as silk ;-)
<sistpoty> heh
<LaserJock> Syntux: and all the packaging "stuff" goes in the debian/ directory in there (which you will create)
<LaserJock> Syntux: one way to do that is to install dh-make
<Syntux> there is no .dsc file
<LaserJock> Syntux: no, not yet
<LaserJock> just untar it
<Syntux> okie done
<LaserJock> if you have dh-make installed you can run it from in the directory
<LaserJock> and it will ask you some questions, and then spit out a templated debian/ directory
<Syntux> shall I use the simplified version of dh-make ?
<LaserJock> not exactly sure what you mean
<LaserJock> are you asking if you should use dh-make?
<Syntux> rules*  the simplified rules created by dh-make as mentioned in PackagingGuide
<LaserJock> well, I was just saying there that it is easier to use dh-make than writing the whole thing from scratch
<Syntux> LaserJock, hmm sorry for ignorant and sorry for the following silly question, I got dh-make-perl/php and pecl but no dh-make alone
<sistpoty> nonetheless, writing from scratch can be very enlightening, too (of course dh-make will probably lead you faster to a working package)
<LaserJock> hmm
<LaserJock> Syntux: you don't see a package called just dh-make?
<Syntux> aptitude why dh-make - The package "dh-make" is manually installed.
<Syntux> whereis dh-make - dh-make:
<Syntux> and of course dh-make is already the newest version
<Syntux> but yet it's not there
<LaserJock> well, of course that's because it's call dh_make
<LaserJock> obviously ;-)
<Syntux> dude, LOL you kept saying dh-make LOL
<LaserJock> yeah yeah
<LaserJock> I had to install it to figure it out
<LaserJock> it's been a while
<Syntux> well, this is the first time for me to see a command with underscore
<LaserJock> heh, you'll see a lot more of those
<Syntux> Ok, what type of package is it ? a single binary?
<LaserJock> I would assume so
<LaserJock> multiple binaries are for packages that are big/complex/modular
<LaserJock> where you get more than one .deb for the source package
<LaserJock> *from
<Syntux> I see
<LaserJock> it's easy to convert later if you need to
<Syntux> Ok, debian created
<LaserJock> awesome
<LaserJock> now you can go in there and have a look around
<LaserJock> the .ex files are example files for various tasks
<LaserJock> you probably won't need them
<LaserJock> Syntux: the thing to keep in mind with using dh_make is that it is a rough template
<LaserJock> Syntux: so you still need to make sure things are filled in right
<Syntux> yeah so in serious packages I should pay attention and edit them
<LaserJock> the biggest issue is in debian/rules
<LaserJock> there dh_make is often just plain not right
<LaserJock> so don't assume it will just work
<LaserJock> but it might
<Syntux> cool
<Syntux> and next?
<Syntux> sorry for being so demanding but I feel hungry for packing :D
<LaserJock> well, once you got things filled out
<LaserJock> and remove the .ex files you don't need
<LaserJock> you can build a source package
<LaserJock> by running debuild -S
<Syntux> gpg error hmm
<LaserJock> Syntux: do you have a gpg key?
<Syntux> do I have to export my key?
<Syntux> sure
<LaserJock> ok
<LaserJock> couple things to look at or bear in mind
<LaserJock> 1) your name and email address in the debian/changelog file must exactly match the one in the gpg key
<LaserJock> 2) you can set the env variables DEBEMAIL ad DEBFULLNAME as well
<LaserJock> sometimes the signing program has a hard time finding keys
<LaserJock> you can tell it to use a specific key by doing debuild -S -k<your key ID>
<Syntux> wow, I forgot my passphrase :D
<Syntux> ok, done
<Syntux> signed.
<LaserJock> so when you go back up to where your .orig.tar.gz is you'll see the other files
<Syntux> now dpkg-source -x *.dsc?
<sistpoty> ScottK, norsetto, TheMuso, Hobbsee: first draft of mail regarding finalfreeze, can you check please? http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/62150/
<LaserJock> Syntux: right now  you have the equivalent of that
<ScottK> sistpoty: Looking
<LaserJock> Syntux: dpkg-source -x *.dsc unpacks the .orig.tar.gz and applies the diff from .diff.gz
<Syntux> so I can proceed with the packaging guide now
<sistpoty> ScottK, norsetto, TheMuso, Hobbsee: also, I think some delegation (e.g. asac -> FF stuff) worked out quite well, should we do this for final freeze as well=
<sistpoty> ?
<LaserJock> Syntux: sure, you just made your first source package
<Syntux> wow :D Thank you dude
<LaserJock> the next task is to build a .deb out of it :-)
<norsetto> sistpoty: ack :-)
<sistpoty> norsetto: ack for the mail or for delegating powers? ;)
<ScottK> sistpoty: My only comment would be to add fixing minor typographical errors to the list of stuff you shouldn't do.
<sistpoty> ScottK: ok, will add that
<norsetto> sistpoty: both
<sistpoty> ok :)
<Syntux> wow! I got a .deb now
<LaserJock> Syntux: how'd you do it?
<Syntux> :D
<norsetto> sistpoty, scottk: just to let you know, I won't be there to help from the 9th to the 15th
<LaserJock> Syntux: did you use debuild or pbuilder?
<Syntux> LaserJock, now tell me, how can I test the package installation ? I mean if it will work on other machines or not
<sistpoty> norsetto: :(
<Syntux> LaserJock, debuild, is there any differences?
<LaserJock> Syntux: oh yes
<norsetto> sistpoty: no, no, :-)
<sistpoty> heh
<LaserJock> Syntux: using debuild is not encouraged if you are building the .deb for anything but personal use really
<LaserJock> Syntux: not that it's evil or anything
<Syntux> yeah I know, nothing personal :p
<LaserJock> but it relies on you having all the build dependencies installed
<LaserJock> and it's easy for you to miss a dependency and building using debuild won't catch that
<ScottK> sistpoty: I'm good with delegation for asac and also for the derivatives up until the last 24 hours.  The final 24 hours I think everything should be ack'ed as sometimes RM wants the buildd's kept clear.
<Syntux> true
<Syntux> Ok, shall I rebuild it again with pbuilder?
<LaserJock> pbuilder provides a "clean" environment
<LaserJock> it however takes more in initial setup to get pbuilder going
<LaserJock> because it create a minimal Ubuntu system
<sistpoty> ScottK: agreed
<LaserJock> Syntux: I would suggest it, especially if you want to contribute your packages to Ubuntu
<Syntux> LaserJock, sure, I will go with it but pbuilder build ../*.dsc aint working
<asac> ScottK: sistpoty: i think the main exception the mozillateam needs is for extensions in universe
<asac> ScottK: sistpoty: i hope to have the last in by mid of next week (in time for hard freeze)
<LaserJock> Syntux: you have to install it first
<LaserJock> Syntux: and then do a pbuilder create
<LaserJock> to create the pbuilder
<sistpoty> asac: does it have one in main? and would you be willing to deal with mozilla stuff?
<Syntux> already have it
<asac> ScottK: sistpoty: everything else that i can think of in universe would only be security updates. but i don't think that there will be anything before hardy
<sistpoty> asac: then you could simply reject all exceptions :P
<asac> sistpoty: sure. feel free to delegate approvals to me
<sistpoty> :)
<asac> sistpoty: but please prod me if you do so
<Syntux> aha, awesome pbuilder create does lots of serious work
<asac> i am currently working hard and cannot really stay on top of all my email
<sistpoty> asac: heh, sure
<LaserJock> Syntux: it creates the minimal Ubuntu system and then compresses it
<LaserJock> Syntux: when you build a .deb it then uncompresses it and build the package
<Syntux> LaserJock, then maybe I should do the packaging on my home server rather than my laptop
<LaserJock> installing the dependencies you specify in debian/control
<LaserJock> Syntux: do you have limited space?
<Syntux> LaserJock, and it will build the minimal ubuntu system with every package I build?
<LaserJock> not build it
<LaserJock> just uncompress it
<LaserJock> into a temporary directory
<Syntux> so it's just once? and the next package will use same system?
<LaserJock> yep
<Syntux> I got around 4gb available
<LaserJock> it doesn't save the changes that you make each build
<LaserJock> so that you get the same environment each time
<LaserJock> but the base is always there
<LaserJock> a pbuilder typically takes ~ 100MB when it's compressed
<LaserJock> of course when it's building it uses up more
<LaserJock> in the temp build directory
<sistpoty> ScottK, norsetto, Hobbsee, TheMuso: what do you think of making jdong responsible for file-sharing related stuff? (in case you agree to this, jdong)
<sistpoty> oh, what derivatives do we have
<sistpoty> ?
<sistpoty> (I've got kubuntu, gnome-desktop stuff, ubuntustudio so far)
<Syntux> LaserJock, cool, it's working now
<ScottK> sistpoty: mythbuntu
<LaserJock> Syntux: before you asked how to test it. the easiest thing is to just dpkg -i the .deb
<ScottK> sistpoty: Ubuntu Muslim Edition has some packaging in the repositories now.  I don't know if they'll be a factor or not.
<LaserJock> Syntux: but first you might want to run dpkg -c to see the contents of the .deb and see if it's what you expected
<ScottK> sistpoty: xubuntu too.
<sistpoty> ah, right
<ScottK> sistpoty: Kubuntu is in Main, so not our concern.
<LaserJock> Syntux: there is also a program called lintian that checks .dsc and .deb files for common mistakes and policy violations
<sistpoty> ScottK: not kde4 stuff
<ScottK> sistpoty: I take that back.  Kubuntu KDE4 is universe
<ScottK> Yes
<sistpoty> ScottK: thought if you think we have enough knowledge (you, Hobbsee) in motu-release, I'll drop that one
<Syntux> LaserJock, Ok and how can I check if my package is Ok to be uploaded to Ubuntu repository ?
<ScottK> sistpoty: I haven't touched kde4.  All my Kubuntu stuff this cycle has been in kde3 or the related python-qt/kde* packages.
<sistpoty> ok
<LaserJock> well, if it works and lintian doesn't complain too much, you should upload it to REVU
<LaserJock> let me send you some links here ;-)
<Syntux> LaserJock, please do
<LaserJock> !revu > Syntux
<LaserJock> !packaging > Syntux
<LaserJock> not sure if that last one is right
<LaserJock> !packaging
<ubotu> The packaging guide is at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide - See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/NewPackages for information on getting a package integrated into Ubuntu - Other developer resources are at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment - See also !backports
<LaserJock> ah yeah, the NewPackages link is what I was after
<Syntux> !backports Syntux
<sistpoty> ScottK, norsetto, Hobbsee, TheMuso: how do we want to deal with FinalRelease debdiffs? Imho one ack should be sufficient, otherwise I fear that we might cause bottlenecks
<ScottK> sistpoty: I think so.
<Syntux> LaserJock, isn't there a script that automate this packaging processes?
<LaserJock> not particularly
<LaserJock> packaging is very much an art
<LaserJock> ;-)
<Syntux> then we should write an artistic script :D
<LaserJock> what I've shown you is just one of several ways you could have done it
<LaserJock> in fact, for almost each step there are at least 3 different tools you could have used
<Syntux> LaserJock, btw the way you explained it was way better than the PackagingGuide, if I were you I'd edit that page with a cleaner steps :-)
<norsetto> sistpoty, ScottK: well, I still like the idea of asking for a further confirmation (like: I'm fine with it but I would like to have another team meber to check this)
<LaserJock> Syntux: heh, well I wrote it
<Syntux> LOL
<Syntux> LaserJock, :D
<LaserJock> Syntux: it's a very complicated thing subject to teach
<LaserJock> much easier on IRC
<Syntux> LaserJock, are you Daniel ?
<LaserJock> no
<LaserJock> Daniel Holbach is one of our leaders
<LaserJock> he "wikified" the Packaging Guide
<LaserJock> my original was a book
<sistpoty> norsetto: well, I guess I would like to do this for some exceptions, but not for all. Maybe we could only do this if not 100% sure?
<norsetto> sistpoty: indeed
<LaserJock> well, long pamphlet maybe, but you could get a hard-copy
<Syntux> ok pbuild is done what next?
<sistpoty> norsetto: then needing only one ack, would solve the issue of no response (e.g. "anyone objects to this" and two days later no response -> you can confirm it)
<norsetto> sistpoty: right
<ScottK> norsetto: I think if someone has doubts, asking is fine, but we don't want to cause bottlenecks.
<Syntux> LaserJock, :-)
<sistpoty> ScottK, norsetto, TheMuso, Hobbsee: next draft: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/62163/
<sistpoty> oh, slangasek: maybe you'd like to take a look at the draft as well ^^
<LaserJock> Syntux: sorry, I gotta help the boss in the lab
<LaserJock> Syntux: I'm gonna be gone for a bit
<LaserJock> good luck
<ScottK> sistpoty: I think IRC acks followed by a bug should be OK too.
<Syntux> LaserJock, yeah sure :-) take your time
<sistpoty> ScottK: right, I'll try to put that in the mail as well
<sistpoty> (just out for a smoke)
<Syntux> guys, last thing I did with LaserJock was sudo pbuilder build ../*.dsc  what next?
<slangasek> sistpoty: requiring bugs filed for each upload during the freeze? Sounds like no fun for you... :)
<ScottK> sistpoty: This is a good point.  I think an IRC ack should be enough.
<ScottK> Channels are logged, so we can reconstruct blame if needed.
<sistpoty> hm... ok, /me tries to redo it
<sistpoty> slangasek, ScottK: hm... I'm unsure, how would ubuntu-archive then sort out the ack'd exceptions from the not ack'd ones=
<sistpoty> ?
<ScottK> sistpoty: RM uses IRC too.
<sistpoty> ok
<sistpoty> ScottK, norsetto, Hobbsee, TheMuso: next try: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/62174/
<ScottK> sistpoty: cody-somerville for Xubuntu and Riddell for Kubuntu
<ScottK> Looks good.
<ScottK> sistpoty: TheMuso for Ubuntu Studio
<ScottK> sistpoty: superm1 for Mythbuntu.
<sistpoty> ScottK: I'd like to get confirmation from them first (about to ask riddel)
<ScottK> OK.  Those are my recommendations.
<ScottK> For Gnome, I don't know.
<sebner> gn8 folks
<sistpoty> gn8 sebner
<sistpoty> superm1: around? would you like to deal with mythbuntu freeze exceptions for universe once final freeze is starting?
<sistpoty> cody-somerville: same question for you, but s/mythbuntu/xubuntu/ ?
<mario_limonciell> sistpoty, i'm at work, so not here as 'superm1', but yeah i'll take care of them
<mario_limonciell> that's no problem
<sistpoty> mario_limonciell: excellent, thanks!
<sistpoty> ScottK: ubuntu-desktop for gnome, ok? (norsetto, Hobbsee, TheMuso)
<norsetto> sistpoty: I always thought seb128 was in charge
<sistpoty> norsetto: I've just talked to him, he suggested to use ubuntu-desktop
<norsetto> sistpoty: ok then
<cody-somerville> Whats the question?
<sistpoty> cody-somerville: would you like to grant exceptions for universe packages during final freeze regarding xubuntu?
<cody-somerville> sistpoty, yes.
<sistpoty> cody-somerville: excellent, thanks!
<ScottK> sistpoty: Find with me.
<sistpoty> ScottK: ok, TheMuso doesn't seem to make too much sense imho, as he's a member of motu-release anyways... should I drop ubuntu-studio or find s.o. else?
<ScottK> Dunno.  I'd say list him as he's who I'd pick and the best qualified
<ScottK> Or see who he'd suggest.
<sistpoty> ok
<sistpoty> ScottK, TheMuso, norsetto, Hobbsee: final try: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/62177/
<ScottK> sistpoty: +1
<Fujitsu> sistpoty: How do translations matter? We're universe, so we don't get LP translations.
<norsetto> sistpoty: go for it or you will spend the whole night here ....
<norsetto> g'night all
<jdong>  /sb end
<jdong> no0tic: *blinks* where did I say it was unstable?
<no0tic> jdong, no, you didn't, norsetto did
<jdong> no0tic: ok whew you had me worried there for a sec!
<no0tic> jdong, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/rtorrent/+bug/211910/comments/11
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 211910 in rtorrent "[FFe] request for new upstream version " [Wishlist,New]
<sistpoty> Fujitsu: they're clobbering the debdiff and make reviewing harder
<Fujitsu> sistpoty: Good point.
 * slangasek peers at the 100% ABI-changing upload of libaqbanking
<slangasek> ah, this is gwenhywfar's fault?
<sistpoty> slangasek: anything wrong with it? (as I take mainly responsability for the approval)
<slangasek> sistpoty: it was just noteworthy to see 10 new packages showing up on the NBS list, and was wondering if someone had gone rogue or if there was a good reason for it. Evidently, there was a good reason for it. :)
<sistpoty> slangasek: yes... even if it comes with the caveat to not being able to build gnucash with HBCI any longer, but I hope -backports might change the from what I read in debian BTS
<sistpoty> (which cannot be done in the archive anyways)
<slangasek> is gnucash going to need a reupload for the change?
<sistpoty> slangasek: no, it doesn't build-depend on libaqbanking, since it lacks the openssl exception
<sistpoty> (or s.th. like that, but it's not affected)
<sistpoty> (only for users rebuilding it ignoring the ssl-exception *g*)
<slangasek> ah
<cody-somerville> sistpoty, You forgot Xubuntu in the e-mail
<sistpoty> cody-somerville: damn, I new I forgot s.th.... sorry, I'll reply to myself then ;)
<cody-somerville> thanks
<slangasek> sistpoty: also, Riddell with two 'd's ;)
<sistpoty> slangasek: that's what you get when you rely on reviewers :P
<slangasek> sistpoty: you only asked me if I'd like to take a look at it, not proofread it :D
<sistpoty> (iow, tab completion didn't work there *g*)
<sistpoty> heh
#ubuntu-motu 2008-04-05
<genixpro> I'm downloading several version of Ubuntu to run in virtual pc's to make packages for my program www.globulation2.org . I'm wondering if theres any tips/considerations I should know about before hand? I know that there are already glob2 packages in the motu, but these packages are outdated, and outdated clients can't play on our hosted online gaming
<sistpoty> genixpro: is the version in hardy (0.8.23) outdated as well=
<sistpoty> ?
<genixpro> sistpoty, We are at 0.9.2 right now, and very soon we are going to release 0.9.3, and we want 0.9.3 to be a major release to re-stimulate our community, so we want every major distribution to have it on release day, to have packages for everyone, etc..
<sistpoty> genixpro: well, we're very, very close to release right now, and we cannot easily change s.th. that has been released again. Hence we try to stabilize every package some time before release (which is coming to the final phase now)
<genixpro> sistpoty, what do you mean by stabalize?
<sistpoty> genixpro: well, find out if it has bugs, and fix these
<genixpro> sistpoty, so you have coders that go into the actual programs themselves?
<sistpoty> genixpro: no, not at that depth. everyone can test the development version and we rely on bugs getting reported
<sistpoty> genixpro: which we usually forward to upstream
<genixpro> sistpoty, ok. If I wanted to make my own, external package that we could distribute on our own website, how would I go about it?
<sistpoty> genixpro: though it looks like, that noone really took much care for glob2 yet (as we inherited it from debian, and obviously noone really took too much care: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/glob2/+bugs)
<sistpoty> genixpro: I guess, I'd start with the latest debian release (same as the one in ubuntu)
<genixpro> Well, we do our own debian package and release it on our website, but our packager, who used to be the lead programmer and maintainer, is doing nothing
<sistpoty> genixpro: that's sad to know
<genixpro> Quite. I'm being paid to maintain the project by some rich guy whos in love with the game, so making packages is one of the tasks.
<sistpoty> genixpro: I'd grab your debian packaging, and copy the debian directory to the new version, then "make -f debian/rules binary" and see if a package falls out
<genixpro> sistpoty, we don't use make, we use scons, I recall the debian package scripts where modified for it to
<sistpoty> genixpro: maybe... but for a debian package, the script to build it is always a makefile (debian/rules). This one may then in turn call scons to build the actual program
<genixpro> sistpoty, I see.
<genixpro> sistpoty, So your reccomending I get the latest version of debian, update and make our debian package, and release it as both Ubuntu and debian package?
<genixpro> sistpoty, Should I make seperate ones for testing, stable, and unstable?
<sistpoty> genixpro: no, it was just a hint to get you started with building a debian package, but I may have a better idea
<sistpoty> genixpro: we have a team for Debian and Ubuntu to manage game packges, which is hosted as a debian team. Maybe you could write a mail to them? I'm quite sure, they'll try to get glob2 updated in debian then, so that we can easily sync it after hardy is released
<sistpoty> genixpro: mail is: debian-devel-games@lists.debian.org
<genixpro> sistpoty, ok, that sounds like a plan. I've been told by Fedora to do the same thing, file a bug report on the package glob2
<sistpoty> genixpro: actually the team can help you with packaging as well, in case you want to do it yourself... at least to some degree, I guess.
<genixpro> sistpoty, just sent them an email
<LaserJock> is ubuntuwire down again?
<Fujitsu> LaserJock: people.ubuntuwire.com is.
<sistpoty> LaserJock: works for me
<Fujitsu> But that has an outage message.
<LaserJock> qa. is down for me
<LaserJock> it says it'll be up by the 2nd ;-)
<Fujitsu> Shh.
<Fujitsu> qa shouldn't be.
<Fujitsu> Ah, qa2 might be.
<LaserJock> it kinda helps doing QA if, you know, we have the info ;-p
<Fujitsu> Indeed. What do you need? I can grab most things from the backups and run them on stratos.
<Fujitsu> rcbugs is already there.
<LaserJock> where can I get at the rcbugs?
<Fujitsu> qa.ubuntuwire.com
<Fujitsu> There should be a link.
<LaserJock> but umm, it's down
<Fujitsu> Uh.
<Fujitsu> You're right.
<Fujitsu> There, better.
<Fujitsu> I left the 2 out of qa2 for one TLD :(
<Fujitsu> Oops.
<LaserJock> ok, so we have Univeres rebuild results and rcbugs
<LaserJock> can we get FTBFS?
<Fujitsu> Sure, I'll set that up now.
<LaserJock> do we even have current FTBFS data?
<Fujitsu> We can get LP FTBFS data quickly, but I haven't run an archive rebuild in a while.
 * slangasek perks up
 * Fujitsu wonders why.
<slangasek> Fujitsu: so if I were to ask infinity to do a universe archive rebuild, would the results be used?  AIUI, this used to be done but nobody was doing anything with the output so it wasn't warranted to continue committing the buildd resources
<Fujitsu> slangasek: We fixed a lot of python-central FTBFSes with the last archive rebuild I did.
<Fujitsu> We can do it in about 5 days assuming things go well.
<Fujitsu> (not with Canonical buildds)
<LaserJock> slangasek: I'm interested in getting that data used, however I don't know how successful I'll be
<LaserJock> it can yell and scream 'till I'm blue in the face but if people don't respond not a whole lot will happen
<Fujitsu> I thought you didn't have resources to do rebuilds of more than main/restricted.
<LaserJock> s/it/I/
<slangasek> Fujitsu: well, ok.  In theory using the DC boxes would also mean being able to get FTBFS info on some/all of the ports too, if that makes a difference
<Fujitsu> Right, that's one thing we can't do.
<slangasek> Fujitsu: well, we don't have the resources to spend on doing rebuilds of universe if the output isn't going to be used, certainly; but if it is, I can talk to infinity and see what's what
<sistpoty> slangasek: that would be most excellent, so I also remember as Fujitsu wrote, that we were denied this in the past due to lack of resources
<sistpoty> s/so/though/
<LaserJock> sounds like the problem is "waste" rather than "lack" of resources
<LaserJock> there are 3 things I'd love for us to really hit as much as we can before release:
<LaserJock> 1) clear the u-u-s queue
<LaserJock> 2) FTBFS
<LaserJock> 3) rcbugs
<LaserJock> that would be a big QA boost for us
<slangasek> LaserJock: manpower is certainly a precious resource, even IS manpower... :)
<LaserJock> oh yeah
<sistpoty> well, /me would like to see bugs tagged with a good priority... however I already considered going through ~9000 bugs and then did s.th. else that weekend
<LaserJock> sistpoty: yeah, my feeling is that we could really be doing better with Importance and milestoning
<Fujitsu> There is of course the importance usage debate that makes importances useless.
<Fujitsu> If importance is distro-wide, then everything in universe should be low. If not, we've been abusing it.
<LaserJock> Fujitsu: which one is that?
<sistpoty> LaserJock: yes, but I think its out of scope for motu-release alone... any clues how to acheive that?
<LaserJock> Fujitsu: I would say that the teams responsible determine the importance
<sistpoty> Fujitsu: for motu-release it should be universe/mulitverse wide
<LaserJock> Importance is for the people doing the work
<LaserJock> however, from the standpoint of slangasek et al. I'm concerned about our milestoning messing up his
<Fujitsu> There's no way to filter milestone lists, is there?
<LaserJock> that's why I've hesitated to use it so far
<LaserJock> Fujitsu: not that I'm aware of
<slangasek> LaserJock: setting importance is not a problem at all; nominating bugs for release is also fair game
<slangasek> (and accepting them)
<LaserJock> but there's no way to distinguish Universe from Main bugs in the milestones
<LaserJock> so I'd rather not make the milestones useless for the core devs
<slangasek> the goal is that milestoning of bugs will only be used for bugs that should be blockers for the milestone; that needn't be restricted to main, I'm happy to see milestoning used for bugs that are blockers for the community flavors as long as there's an actual committment to treating them as blockers in the corresponding project
<slangasek> (the current milestone list is a total mess in this regard, meh)
<Fujitsu> LaserJock: LP FTBFS is working on qa.uw.c now.
<LaserJock> slangasek: ok, I agree with that
<LaserJock> I just think MOTU in general need to get better at identifing targets and making sure they get done
<LaserJock> we've had some really good successes lately IMO with transitions
<jdong> LaserJock: WTF did oyu do that for??
<jdong> LaserJock: now you're gonna jinx it!
<jdong> :)
<LaserJock> heh
<LaserJock> hmm
<LaserJock> so Main has 1 FTBFS and Universe has ~50 for i386
<LaserJock> Multiverse has 22
<LaserJock> that's interesting
 * sistpoty looks innocent for atlas *whistle*
<LaserJock> haha
<Fujitsu> We really need to convince people to work on rcbugs.
<LaserJock> yeah
<LaserJock> I was just gonna say, the scariest one is rcbugs
<sistpoty> Fujitsu, LaserJock: maybe a mail to -motu would help=
<Fujitsu> It is very scary.
<sistpoty> damn, s/=/?/ (again)
<LaserJock> I was thinking of announce a RCbugs day
<Fujitsu> Or three.
<LaserJock> well, yeah
<LaserJock> we only have a few days
<LaserJock> if I could I'd stop all uploading for a week to focus on these topics
<LaserJock> but well, that's not gonna happen
<Fujitsu> One we're in FinalFreeze (FiF?), people have no choice but to fix bugs.
<Fujitsu> Maybe people will look at it then.
<LaserJock> true
<LaserJock> but my hope was to get as many in before the freeze as possible
<sistpoty> LaserJock: want to write a mail about rcbugs?
<LaserJock> just to make the release teams life easier
<LaserJock> sistpoty: will do
<sistpoty> LaserJock: thanks, excellent!
<LaserJock> I gotta run home
<LaserJock> then I'll do it this evening
<sistpoty> :)
<LaserJock> bbiab
<TheMuso> Whats the recent process Debian have introduced for maintaining individual packages called again?
<Fujitsu> Debian Maintainers.
<TheMuso> Right I thought so, but wasn't sure. Thanks.
<sistpoty> oh, TheMuso: are you ok with dealing with ubuntu-studio bugs or do you prefer a delegate?
<TheMuso> sistpoty: I practically upload everything ubuntustudio related, so I don't mind doing it.
<sistpoty> TheMuso: excellent, thanks!
<sistpoty> TheMuso: maybe you'd like to follow up to my mail?
<TheMuso> sistpoty: I will do.
<sistpoty> thanks!
<AnAnt> man-di: ping
<AnAnt> Hello, how much time does it take to approve creation of a mailing list ?
<LaserJock> oh man
<LaserJock> that varies a lot
<LaserJock> I had one take 2 months, but I think that's kind of an extreme case
<Fujitsu> From an eternity, up to three eternities.
<AnAnt> LaserJock: well, I think my case is getting close to 2 months indeed
<Fujitsu> I'm not sure what's so hard about running newlist, really.
<LaserJock> hmm, things haven't changes so much I guess
<LaserJock> I thought they had sped up the process
<LaserJock> since my last one
<Fujitsu> Ha. Hahaha. Hahahaha.
<AnAnt> ok, regarding the packages usplash-theme-ubuntume & ubuntume-themes, both have bugs that are fixed
<AnAnt> for the usplash, the boot text was overlapping the logo for 800x600  resolution
<AnAnt> for the themes package, the cursor theme would make problems if compiz was running
<AnAnt> does fixing those bugs qualify for a freeze exception ?
<LaserJock> I think my mailing lists only showed up after I didn't want them anymore
<LaserJock> and even then they weren't the names I requested, but oh well
<AnAnt> um, what about the freeze exception question ?
<LaserJock> what do you have to have an exception for?
<LaserJock> I wouldn't think those would be considered features
<AnAnt> LaserJock: 1. for the usplash-theme-ubuntume package, the boot text was overlapping the logo for 800x600  resolution
<AnAnt> 2. for ubuntume-themes package, the cursor theme would make problems if compiz was running
<LaserJock> AnAnt: no, I mean what about that would require an exception?
<AnAnt> LaserJock: I mean, can I upload the packages after I fixed those bugs ?
<AnAnt> LaserJock: or they can't be uploaded due to freeze ?
<LaserJock> I would think so but I would ask whoever is in charge of ubuntume first
<AnAnt> LaserJock: erm, I am the maintainer of those packages
<LaserJock> oh, ok
<LaserJock> I would think it would be fine
<AnAnt> ok
<AnAnt> thanks
<LaserJock> I don't think people are going to mind too much for ubuntume packages
<LaserJock> they're just metapackages and common distro stuff
<Syntux> Good morning
<LaserJock> hi Syntux
<Syntux> hey LaserJock  :-)
<LaserJock> still today for me
<LaserJock> I haven't gone to bed yet
<LaserJock> :-)
<Syntux> LaserJock, different timezone or linking days ?
<LaserJock> timezone
<Syntux> I slept less than three hours, when we were talking yesterday it was around 1:00 AM.
<LaserJock> I last talked to you at about 3pm my time I think
<warp10> Good morning
<Syntux> Good morning warp10
<LaserJock> warp10!
<LaserJock> warp10: did I say congrats yet?
<warp10> Hey Syntux!
<LaserJock> bad me if I didn't
<warp10> LaserJock: np, you just did! :D Thank you! :)
<Syntux> warp10, congrats but what for?
<LaserJock> been busy with dissertation work
 * Syntux being nosy 
<warp10> Syntux: for being accepted as a MOTU
<LaserJock> Syntux: warp10 is now a Master of the Universe :-)
<LaserJock> he can leap tall buildings in a single bound
<LaserJock> he's faster than a speeding bullet
<Syntux> warp10, oh! you got your Motorola man! cool cool congrats
<warp10> LaserJock: and can mess up the whole universe... and multiverse too :P
<warp10> Syntux: thank you! :)
<Syntux> :-)
<LaserJock> warp10: I prefer to say that you can fix all science packages in Universe and Multiverse ;-)
<Syntux> I'm learning too to get become a Jedi
<warp10> LaserJock: Indeed.... well, mayavi2 works fine now! :)
<LaserJock> warp10: excellent
<LaserJock> warp10: dude, you have waaay too many LP emblems now
<warp10> LaserJock: Heh... :D
<LaserJock> and some wicked karma
<LaserJock> my karma has always been pretty crappy
<Syntux> Question: Do we need an access to different machines in case we are building a package for different arch?
<LaserJock> good question
<LaserJock> do you mean a package that only works on another arch?
<LaserJock> or just testing if it works
<Syntux> both
<LaserJock> well, we don't really have machines available for people to just log into and build
<LaserJock> what you can do is ask here if anybody can build a package for an arch you don't have
<LaserJock> once it's actually uploaded to the Ubuntu repos it will be built on all archs available or the ones  you specify
<Syntux> LaserJock, ah but you upload it in deb format, right?
<LaserJock> no
<LaserJock> we only upload source packages
<LaserJock> uploading .debs is not allowed
<Syntux> LaserJock, A developer uploads a source package and a MOTU is supposed to build it and upload it, right?
<LaserJock> the MOTU only uploads the source package
<Fujitsu> Developer == MOTU
<LaserJock> well, that too
<jdong> a developer *should* build the source package but not for the purpose of uploading the resultant .debs :)
<LaserJock> exactly
<LaserJock> we do test builds before uploading
<LaserJock> but we don't actually upload the .debs
<Syntux> oh
<Syntux> ok, assuming we are done building and testing the .debs what next?
<LaserJock> well, if you want your new package in Ubuntu you need to get 2 MOTUs to review and accept it
<LaserJock> then it will be uploaded into the NEW queue
<Syntux> that's one and what if it's already in the repos and we are building and testing debs of the newer version
<LaserJock> and the Ubuntu archive admins will have a look and make sure it's ok
<jdong> in general, find someone with upload rights to review your work and upload it into Ubuntu. In the case of a new package it must be approved by two developers.
<LaserJock> yeah, if it's already in the repos then the MOTU will just upload it
<Syntux> LaserJock, upload the source not the debs?
<LaserJock> yep
<Syntux> but then how do we get the debs?
<LaserJock> oh,
<LaserJock> well we have a build farm
<LaserJock> Launchpad handles that
<Syntux> with cows and milk?
<Syntux> ah cool
<LaserJock> so we upload, it takes the source packages and builds them on all archs, then puts them into the repos
<LaserJock> Syntux: you can see them at https://launchpad.net/+builds
<Syntux> so basically what we do on our machines is for testing purposes only and once we feel confident about the package we throw the source online and then same operation perfumed on the build farm
<LaserJock> yep
<LaserJock> this way the environment building the .debs is consistent
<LaserJock> and can be changed if need-be
<Syntux> and the process in the build farm, is it automated ? or humans having access to the farms to build the debs
<LaserJock> no, it's automated
<LaserJock> it would be a disaster to have them all built by hand :-)
<Syntux> hmm interesting, but what if something went wrong up there in the farm?
<LaserJock> ah, then we talk to the buildd admins
<jdong> 1~0.98.2~0~jdong1~7.10prevu1 that is the prettiest and yet most horrifying version number I've concocted yet.
<LaserJock> we call the builder machines buildds (build daemon)
 * LaserJock hurls
 * Fujitsu strangles jdong dead.
<LaserJock> ;-)
<jdong> most of that is not my fault ;-)
<Fujitsu> ~0. Whhhy?
<Syntux> interesting
<jdong> Fujitsu: to make absolutely sure I'm less than any Ubuntu versions that slip in without me knowing
<jdong> banshee upstream calls their newest releases 1-0.98.2
<Fujitsu> Just ~ should do it, shouldn't it?
<jdong> which is insane enough
<Fujitsu> ~ is less than nothing.
<jdong> Fujitsu: yeah
<LaserJock> but if a ~0 is uploaded he wants to be lower than that?
<jdong> I don't think there's a high chance of ~0ubuntu1 or ~0anything being uploaded
<jdong> maybe in a PPA
<LaserJock> PPAs might
<Fujitsu> If a ~0 is ever uploaded, it deserves to be overwritten by anything else.
<LaserJock> I think between PPAs, backports, -updates, and -security it's just plain not fun to think about versioning
<Fujitsu> Backports are easy.
<Fujitsu> PPAs don't matter.
<Fujitsu> -updates and -security are a pain.
<LaserJock> at least people want to be less than other people rather than higher than
<LaserJock> PPAs matter if you're maintaining the PPA
<LaserJock> :-)
<jdong> or we can adopt some hackish pinning system of versioning :D
<Fujitsu> !jdon
<ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about jdon - try searching on http://ubotu.ubuntu-nl.org/factoids.cgi
<Fujitsu> !jdong
<ubotu> <Hobbsee> jdong: yes, but you're FULL OF CRACK!
<LaserJock> hehe
<LaserJock> having good conventions might work too
<jdong> LaserJock: haha the problem is getting $restofworld to follow them :D
<jdong> *coughs and points at that glib2.0 merge*
<LaserJock> we just don't care about $restofworld
<jdong> LaserJock: the way we show we don't care is to give em a pin of 0 ;-)
<Syntux> LaserJock, shall I signup for launchpad team and mailing list requesting a mentor or it's too early?
<jdong> it's never too early to be addicted to Ubuntu!
<LaserJock> isn't that the point of any standard, to force the crack of the few on $restofworld?
<LaserJock> Syntux: it's not too early, although I honestly am not sure how active the mentoring program is
 * jdong fully expects to break his system in his greedy quest for new mono apps
<LaserJock> Syntux: you might want to to talk to norsetto when he's around. He's in charge of the mentoring program
<LaserJock> jdong: but think of the kittens!!
<Syntux> LaserJock, hmm well, actually I'm deadly interested in holding a packaging jam, the idea was posted by Daneil http://syntux.net/blog/2008/03/13/ubuntu-jordan-loco-floss-introduction-the-jordanian-way/
<Syntux> ops, no here http://syntux.net/blog/2008/03/06/jordan-loco-ubuntu-desktop-course/
<LaserJock> heh, that's kinda funny to see
<LaserJock> I didn't know there was a Jordan LoCo
<Syntux> Soon we might get a permanent lab in one of universities so a crash course about packaging would make a difference
<LaserJock> I might have to blog about that ;-)
<Syntux> LaserJock, haha
<jdong> LaserJock: well you need to first twitter that you are blogging about it :)
<LaserJock> jdong: I don't twitter
<LaserJock> haven't figured out yet why I or other people would care about the minutia of my life
<jdong> well I don't do this whole social networking thing either :)
<jdong> I don't know why people would want to listen to me any more than they already do :D
<Syntux> SN is a waste of time
<Syntux> except Linkedin.
<LaserJock> I do Facebook and LinkedIn because well, people send me invites
<LaserJock> but I don't do anything on Facebook but collect invites
<LaserJock> I'm not sure what I'm exactly supposed to do with it
<Fujitsu> I'm boring and just do LinkedIn.
<LaserJock> and I don't know how it's exactly social or networking
<Syntux> coffee time. brb
<jdong> *grumble* why does BSD always feel like I'm using UNIX from the 60's?
<jdong> would it kill their reputation to bind the HOME key?
<LaserJock> how would you even know you little punk
<jdong> LaserJock: that's how I envisioned login worked back then.... username, password, "%"
<jdong> and the console beep is the most lovely piercing tone!
<LaserJock> I was talking about punch cards with my advisor today
<LaserJock> it's amazing, he's only like 45
<LaserJock> his first computer had 4k memory
<LaserJock> stuff like that
<LaserJock> we were cleaning out the lab to make way for a new laser and found an ancient memory board (almost 2x as big as an ATX motherboard)
<jdong> cool
<LaserJock> no wonder he likes Fortran
<LaserJock> it must remind him of the punch cards
<LaserJock> alright
<LaserJock> time for this old geezer to get to bed
<jdong> night!
<Fujitsu> Night LaserJock.
<warp10> goodnight LaserJock ;)
<jdong> OOOOOH shiny mono 1.9 in Debian
 * jdong now REALLY breaks his computer :)
<Fujitsu> What's so wonderfully terrificly good about Mono?
<jdong> Fujitsu: *shrug* I still have some fascination with the .NET/C# runtime and framework
<jdong> I guess that carries over from my final few days on Windows
<StevenK> That's unhealthy.
<jdong> it's everything I'd want Java for but feels more natural and "done right"....
<Fujitsu> WHy would you want Java?
<jdong> as a higher level language than C/C++ with managed runtime type features and not as much a performance hit as python/ruby
<Syntux> guys, can I build a package for hardy if I'm running gutsy or even dapper?
<Syntux> on the same machine I mean.
<jdong> Syntux: you sure can, pbuilder supports doing that
<Syntux> cool
<jdong> ./configure --build i486-linux-gnu --with-sigaltstack=yes
<jdong> hmm
<jdong> the typos do not instill confidence.
<jdong> oh nvm that's supposed to say sigaltstack
<Iulian> G'morning
<macogw> hi there
<macogw> is universe subject to translation strings deadlines like main, and if so, when are they?
<macogw> i just installed rubrica and noticed that there are some strings in the en_US version which are still in Italian
<Fujitsu> We don't have translations, so I doubt we're going to freeze for them.
<macogw> oh ok
<macogw> so um what would be the best thing to do about that then?
<Fujitsu> Translate them to en_US, I presume.
<macogw> but how do i get the translations in? go upstream and then request a sync?
<Fujitsu> Probably a bit late for that now.
<Fujitsu> You'll have to modify them in the source package, and submit a debdiff.
<macogw> ok
<macogw> hmm it looks like these strings are hard coded :-/ probably best to find a way to move them into a .po?
<Hobbsee> oh, drat, i was supposed to read backscroll, and forgot
<AnAnt> Hello, can someone review : http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=usplash-theme-ubuntume  , it's a bugfix
<man-di> AnAnt: you pinged me without content. Please add content to pings. How can I help?
<AnAnt> man-di: oh, few days ago I was saying that the problem of gcc/g++ not being of same version on Debian is over
<AnAnt> man-di: so any news about openjdk going to Debian ?
<man-di> AnAnt: we are working on it in the ubuntu-java team. if you want to help please join.
<AnAnt> man-di: how to join ?
<AnAnt> man-di: ubuntu-java is doing it for Debian ?
<man-di> checkout bzr and test, do fixes, etc
<man-di> AnAnt: we are doing this for both distros
<AnAnt> cool
<mok0> h
<d3vt4r> hello guys
<d3vt4r> i wanted to ask how do i get my python application into a .deb or sumthin and into the ubuntu software repository?
<d3vt4r> im really new to Ubuntu,hope you guys wldnt mind helping your fellow lad here
<mok0> d3vt4r: lookie here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/
<mok0> !packaging| d3vt4r
<ubotu> d3vt4r: The packaging guide is at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide - See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/NewPackages for information on getting a package integrated into Ubuntu - Other developer resources are at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment - See also !backports
<d3vt4r> thanks guys
<d3vt4r> i'll read up on it
<pochu> ScottK, doko: are there any instructions on how to run a Python application under gdb in the wiki or somewhere, to point users to them when asking for a backtrace? If not, I could write something at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Backtrace after checking with bdmurray if that sounds good to you
<d3vt4r> damn its daunting
<d3vt4r> i have a simple python application
<d3vt4r> i didn't realise i wld be bombarded by documentation
<pochu> d3vt4r: check http://people.debian.org/~srivasta/manoj-policy/ too. I think that's more for modules though
<pochu> d3vt4r: does it have a setup.py file?
<d3vt4r> wld anyone care to help me out with this?
<d3vt4r> not now, but im working on it
<d3vt4r> wld it make a diff?
<pochu> wld?
<d3vt4r> would
<pochu> i didn't understand your last question
<d3vt4r> as to would it make a difference if i had a setup.py rather then a main.py?
<d3vt4r> to get my application into the ubuntu software repository
<d3vt4r> pochu?
<pochu> where's the application so I can look at it?
<pochu> the setup.py is used for packaging
<pochu> but you don't strictly need it
<pochu> specially if the application is very simple
<pochu> is it just one file (main.py) ?
<d3vt4r> http://d3vscan.sf.net
<d3vt4r> nah,i have a few files but simple stuff
<d3vt4r> thanks for taking your time looking at my app
<pochu> d3vt4r: BTW, it won't make into Hardy. It will need to go into Intrepid
<d3vt4r> i missed the february deadline ey?
<mok0> !ibex | d3vt4r
<ubotu> d3vt4r: Intrepid Ibex is the code name for Ubuntu 8.10, due October 2008 - For more info, see: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IntrepidIbex
<keescook> so which is it, ibex or intrepid? I never say "drake", "gibbon", or "heron".  :P
<mok0> keescook: ibex is shorter... so perhap's it's time to make a change :-)
<mok0> keescook: some ppl around here are starting to call it "ibex"
<keescook> mok0: yeah, I keep going back and forth.  :)
<mok0> keescook: perhaps the rules has always _been_ to use the shorter name (?)
<mok0> nah
<mok0> len(feisty) > len (fawn)
<d3vt4r> how do i start creating a ubuntu package for Interpid?
<Nafallo> d3vt4r: as for any package, but with the changelog entry changed to i... whatever it's called.
<mok0> In Debian, the release field seems always to be "unstable" no matter where the source package comes from.
<Nafallo> mok0: not really.
<mok0> No?
<Nafallo> mok0: experimental and unstable. those are the only ones where people can upload.
<mok0> Nafallo: ah, I never checked the experimental
<Nafallo> mok0: same with Ubuntu if you think about it a bit. you can only upload to hardy at the moment without it being special circumstances.
<Nafallo> special circumstances being *-security and *-updates
<mok0> Nafallo: except that name changes every now and then
<Nafallo> mok0: yea, but there is always only one main target.
<mok0> Nafallo: In Debian, it's always "unstable"
<Nafallo> mok0: that's because of symlinks :-P
<mok0> Nafallo: Hmmm. Well I am not sure that the distribution logically belongs in the changelog.
<mok0> Nafallo: The same release of a package may well compile on several distributions
<Nafallo> mok0: if it gets uploaded to several distributions indeed.
<mok0> Nafallo: It's something that is relevant at build time
<mok0> Nafallo: so it ought to be defined there, e.g. with a switch
<Nafallo> I might have lost you there :-)
<mok0> Nafello, it belongs in the changes file, so whenever that is created
<Nafallo> mok0: that is what happens now indeed :-)
<mok0> Nafallo: because two identical versions of a package may be built against a different set of dependencies
<mok0> Nafallo: yes, but the distribution string is extracted from debian/changelog
<Nafallo> mok0: with distribution you mean release?
<mok0> Nafallo: no, I mean "hardy" for example
<Nafallo> mok0: yea, so release then :-)
<mok0> Nafallo: so, if you want to back-port a hardy package to gutsy, you need (in principle) to create a new changelog entry with the word "gutsy" in the dist field
<mok0> Nafallo: ah, ok, I was thinking release == -0ubuntu1
<asac> Hobbsee: there? still archive powers? could you push the firefox extensions currently sitting in binary new? (e.g. firebug is one of them)
<Nafallo> mok0: no. you ping jdong and he gets the gutsy-backports thing going :-)
<mok0> Nafallo: hehe
<mok0> asac: I think Hobbsee is in the australian time zone, so she is probably at sleep now :-)
<asac> yeah ;)
<Nafallo> tss.
<asac> everyone else is in weekend
<Nafallo> only 3:34
<Nafallo> Hobbsee should be awake :-P
<asac> thats what i thought ;)
<Nafallo> asac: :-)
<Laney> What do people think about bug 208579? Is there any chance of this getting in for Hardy?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 208579 in vlc "VLC not using PulseAudio by default" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/208579
<sharperguy> How do I get a .desktop file to show up in a specific catagory in the gnome menu?
 * jdong looks in total shock
<jdong> mono 1.9 is actually working
<geser> sharperguy: through the Category field in the file
<sharperguy> geser, I did that, but its just appearing in other
<Laney> sharperguy: Look at http://standards.freedesktop.org/menu-spec/1.0/apa.html for possible values
<sharperguy> geser, The exact thing I put was "Catagoies=Application;Network;"
<Nafallo> sharperguy: ehrm
<sharperguy> umm wait forget it i cant spell
<Laney> ...and you typoed Categories there
 * Laney titters
<Laney> So what about this VLC bug? Sound was completely broken until I installed that pulseaudio plugin.
<sharperguy> Sigh, that fixed it
<geser> sharperguy: check with desktop-file-validate (from desktop-file-utils) if your .desktop file is correct
 * Nafallo smiles
<sharperguy> Hmm, actually gedit told me by not highlighting it
<sharperguy> but yeah thanks
 * jdong gently nudges ScottK towards the firefox backport again
<sharperguy> oh wait that looked worse than it was actually, because in the real .desktop file I didn't also miss out that "r" in categories
<jdong> stupid apparmor
<t0m> Good evening
<t0m> I was wondering if anyone could help me resolve a packaging bug
<t0m> I am trying to recompile some i386 packages for amd64
<t0m> to start with I have just changed the architecture from i386 to amd64 (in a wait and see kind of way)
<t0m> this successfully builds one of the packages with debuild
<t0m> however, the second package builds binaries which link to a library provided by the first package
<geser> t0m: it usually has a reason why a package is i386-only
<t0m> geser: these are canon supplied drivers
<t0m> geser: i think it just lack of support
<t0m> anyway the first package provides the library, (in fact a link to it)
<t0m> dpkg-shlibdeps: failure: no dependency information found for /usr/lib/libcaepcm.so.1 (used by debian/cndrvcups-capt/usr/bin/captdrv).
<t0m> dh_shlibdeps: command returned error code 512
<t0m> make: *** [binary-arch] Error 1
<t0m> debuild: fatal error at line 1247:
<t0m> fakeroot debian/rules binary failed
<geser> t0m: do you have the complete source or are some parts provided as binary only?
<t0m> and i get that
<t0m> geser: complete source
<geser> ah, that kind of error
<geser> I've see other packages failed to build for a similar reason but did look yet how to fix it
<t0m> geser: oh :(
<t0m> i'm not completely familiar with deb from a builders point of view
<t0m> i can see using apt-cache that the first package contains /usr/lib/libcaepcm.so.1
<geser> I guess you need to tell dpkg-shlibdeps in which package the lib will end
<geser> so it can add the correct dependency
<t0m> i'm guessing it does it by searching through a database somewhere?
<t0m> for all of the system packages
<geser> yes, afaik it uses the *.shlib files in /var/lib/dpkg/info (inside the build) and optionally some local shlib files
<t0m> geser: thanks for your help
<t0m> geser: I will try and work something out
<AnAnt> hello, can someone review this upload http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=usplash-theme-ubuntume ? It is a bugfix
<ScottK2> AnAnt: The preferred form is a debdiff attached to the bug for a new revision of a diff.gz attached to the bug for a new upstream  version.
<AnAnt> ScottK2: it's a native package
<ScottK2> Ah.
<ScottK2> Then a debdiff.
<AnAnt> ScottK2: how's that ??
<jdong> aren't themes typically high in binary content though?
<ScottK2> AnAnt: I'll have a look at it though.
<ScottK2> jdong: Good point.
<jdong> ScottK2: can I bug you to look at the firefox beta 4 backport again?
<ScottK2> The current theme is REVU is just for new packages, but native would be different.
<ScottK2> jdong: Yes.
<AnAnt> ScottK2: so how do I do a debdiff for a native package ?
<jdong> ScottK2: thanks! As I mentioned on the bug report, new firefox uploads have gone into Hardy since yesterday and I am not ready for those, so we should stick with the b4 debdiffs/dscs that I posted before
<AnAnt> ?
<AnAnt> jdong: btw, I don't think this diff is high in binary content, I just modified a C file if I recall correctly
<ScottK2> AnAnt: Same as you would for any other.
<jdong> AnAnt: ah, ok, then a debdiff would work
<ScottK2> AnAnt: debdiff usplash-theme-ubuntume_1.1.dsc usplash-theme-ubuntume_1.2.dsc > usplash.debdiff would have worked fine
<foutrelis> hai :)
<ScottK2> AnAnt: I'm looking at it now.
<jdong> I was just concerned ScottK2 might be sending you on a wild goose chase as debdiffs cannot represent any binary changes ;-)
<ScottK2> Yes.
<ScottK2> In general a debdiff is probably best, but not if there's binary content.
<AnAnt> hmmm, there is a another package that will have binary content diff
<AnAnt> what shall I do about that ?
<ScottK2> That one I think you have to upload to REVU.
<ScottK2> AnAnt: Did you get your mailing list yet?
<AnAnt> ScottK2: nope
<ScottK2> OK.  I guess we'll leave the maintainer address then.
<AnAnt> yup
<AnAnt> ScottK2: we started moving to launchpad btw
<ScottK2> OK.
<AnAnt> ScottK2: I requested an SVN import but it is not attempted yet
<AnAnt> 3 days ago !
<ScottK2> I'm not terribly concerned about where you host your code.  The only reason I asked was because the current address you're using is not in accordance with policy (but I'm willing to live with it because I understand why).
<AnAnt> ok
<ScottK2> AnAnt: Uploaded.
<jdong> what happens if a drive providing swap suddenly disappears?
<jdong> I'm guessing very very bad things?
<AnAnt> ScottK2: thanks
<AnAnt> ScottK2: should uploads from today till April 10th only be bugfixes ?
<AnAnt> ScottK2: or can the contain enhancements ?
<jdong> bugfixes unless a freeze exception is granted
<AnAnt> ScottK2: we are almost done with the a usplash theme
<ScottK2> AnAnt: Bugfixes can be uploaded with no extra approvals.
<AnAnt> ok
<ScottK2> AnAnt: Enhances need a feature freeze exception.
<ScottK2> For your usplash theme, I don't think it will be a problem to get one.
<AnAnt> ScottK2: I think the process may take more than the remaining 5 days
<ScottK2> AnAnt: How long?
<AnAnt> ScottK2: I mean to get accepted & so
<ScottK2> AnAnt: No.  Shouldn't be a huge problem.  When will it be ready?
<AnAnt> ScottK2: probably end of day or tommorrow
<ScottK2> Should be doable, but there are, of course, no guarantees.
<jdong> aaahhhh, linking libxul.so makes my system cry
<AnAnt> ScottK2: ok, thanks for the help
<Raseel> Hi, I'm trying yo get involved with Ubuntu Bug packaging. I have just gone through a few tutorials on the Wiki.
<Raseel> Accordingly, I have filed a Bug (212480) for a new package request.
<Raseel> I have also uploaded the files after packaging the source manually.
<Raseel> Here's the link to my Bug for Package request : https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/212480/
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 212480 in ubuntu "[needs packaging]Package request for Prozilla" [Undecided,New]
<jdong> asac: xulrunner typo
<jdong> asac: debian/rules: USE_SYSTEM_NSS := $(shell pkg-config --exists 'nspr >= 3.12'; a=$$?; if test $$a != 1; then echo 1; fi)
<jdong> asac: nspr >= should be nss >=
<ScottK2> Raseel: We are very close to our next release and not taking new packages right now.
<Raseel> @ubotu: ???
<ScottK2> Raseel: If you want to get involved in package, the best way to do it now is to work on packaging bug fixes.
<ScottK2> Raseel: It's a bot.
<Raseel> @ScottK2 : I know. I'm waiting for Hardy too. So, do I just wait until the new package requests for Intrepid  start ?
<asac> jdong: right. thanks
<jdong> asac: certainly :) Makes me feel better that I didn't make a merging mistake preparing these ff3b5 backport candidates :D
<ScottK2> Raseel: Wait or try to help out and see if you can make Hardy better.
<Raseel> ScottK2 : That's the plan. Triaging bugs is on top of my list. Can I help with code contribution directly ?  I'm guessing packaging existing requests will have  to take a back burnere too , huh ?
<asac> jdong: fixed in bzr
<jdong> asac: fantastic
<asac> in .head branch though.
<asac> i'll cherry-pick it to .dev as well
<ScottK2> Raseel: If you know how to make debian packages, you can look for bugs with a patch and package that patch (make a debdiff and attach it to the bug).  Then you subsrcribe ubuntu-universe-sponsors to the bug and they review it and upload it if it's good.
<ScottK2> Raseel: You can use this for a list: http://daniel.holba.ch/really-fix-it/
<asac> jdong: ok its on .dev branch ... prepare your backport from there then
<Raseel> SCottK2 : I am just learning the process of packaging, that is to say, wanted someone to review my packaging.
<Raseel> ScottK2 : What do you mean by "bugs with a patch"
<ScottK2> See this list I gave you the link for.
<ScottK2> Raseel: I understand.  We just don't have time right now.  If you can work on some of the smaller bugs, you efforts will get reviewed and you can learn that way.
<Raseel> ScottK2:Fair enough.
<ScottK2> New packages is probably the hardest way to learn because you have to touch pretty much all aspects of packaging.
<Raseel> ScottK2 : I'm sorry for being such a bother, but would Bug No.32484 be a valid Bug for  "bugs with a patch" scenario. I could test the patch, fix if any errors and debdiff it
<ScottK2> Raseel: Generally yes, but that patch is two years old and so is probably obsolete.  Also starting with disk partitioning in not a low risk area to learn.
<ScottK2> That package is in Main, you'll want to start with Universe packages.
<Raseel> ScottK2 : How about this one : https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/geda-gnetlist/+bug/207760 ? Its Universe and a new one
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 207760 in geda-gnetlist "Broken VHDL and Verilog netlisting backends" [Undecided,New]
<ScottK2> Raseel: Yes.
<Raseel> ScottK2: Great. Thanks for all your suggestions and guidance. Will start working on this.
<emgent> heya
<jdong> *cry* I swear asac has done something to mess with my brain.... firefox-3.0 -> firefox symlinks seem to just pop up like mushrooms
<jdong> :D
#ubuntu-motu 2008-04-06
<Fujitsu> Has anybody else noticed the return of normal window open/close effects to Firefox form autocomplete and AwesomeBar, after installing Fx3b5?
<bddebian> Heya gang
<ScottK2> Heya bddebian
<bddebian> Hi ScottK2
<jdong> asac: do you know if the window class for the address-bar drop-down completion window thingie changed between ff3 b4 -> b5?
<jdong> asac: because now with b5, compiz in Gutsy does this annoying transition-in effect as if it were a full window
<Fujitsu> jdong: Aha, so it's not just me.
<Fujitsu> It's not just the awesomebar, it's also the suggestions for form entries.
<asac> jdong: i don't think it changed
<asac> its always been a full window :)
<Fujitsu> The behaviour has certainly changed within the last 12 hours.
<jdong> Fujitsu: confirmed, form suggestion windows do the same
<jdong> asac: well something regressed, because this didn't happen with the b4 packages
<jdong> asac: whether it's the fault of Firefox or some compiz quirking heuristic is less clear
<Fujitsu> It's a change in Firefox and not in Compiz or anything else, as Firefox is all I've restarted since I upgraded.
<asac> jdong: trey downgrading ffox
<jdong> asac: this is a test backport to gutsy, that's the only thing that has chagned on my system in the past 3 hours, so I'm 100% confident it was not caused by any other package changing
<Fujitsu> As am I.
<jdong> asac: looks like bug 212600 has been reported
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 212600 in firefox-3.0 "Location bar dropdown is animated with Compiz Glide effects in Beta 5" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/212600
<asac> jdong: mozilla bug 412954
<ubotu> Mozilla bug 412954 in Widget: Gtk "menus should have Menu, PopupMenu or DropdownMenu window type" [Trivial,Resolved: fixed] http://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=412954
<asac> thats what landed and looks related
<Fujitsu> Let me guess... it broke the Firefox quirk thing in Compiz?
<asac> jdong: maybe try if reverting that patch helps
<asac> maybe ;)
<asac> Fujitsu: before that patch we had: -            // treat popups with a parent as top level windows
<asac> gtk_window_set_wmclass(GTK_WINDOW(mShell), "Toplevel", cBrand.get());
<asac> now everything is:
<asac> gtk_window_set_wmclass(GTK_WINDOW(mShell), "Popup", cBrand.get());
<asac> with proper hints
<asac> https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/attachment.cgi?id=305729
<jdong> asac: yeah it seems like that patch caused the problem, but I'm not 100% convinced at what's the best fix, reverting this or tweaking our compiz rules
<Fujitsu> Turning off the workarounds doesn't fix it :(
<Fujitsu> Why not make Firefox use GTK properly? Or would that make too much sense?
<asac> Fujitsu: that doesn't make sense
<asac> Fujitsu: they already do it properly
<asac> on a best efford base
<asac> jdong: tweaking the compiz rules
<asac> now everything is vmclass "popup"
<asac> wmclass
<asac> so now firefox is correct
<asac> i added compiz and invalidated firefox task until we know that its firefox
<jdong> I think asac is right
<jdong> based on comment #27 on the mozilla bugzilla
<asac> jdong: please add that reference to the bug so the compiz people see it
<asac> e.g. link to that comment
<Fujitsu> There's a bug on -plugins-main with the patch attached.
<Fujitsu> #212600 should probably be marked as a dupe.
<asac> Fujitsu: please ensure that the same info goes to that bug then
<asac> and take care that its milestoned
<asac> i guess that should be fixed for release
<Fujitsu> Milestoned, duped, appropriate information moved over to #212542.
<jdong> asac: would you mind if I, for the possible gutsy backport of beta5, back out this patch, as trying to fix compiz in both gutsy and gutsy-backports doesn't sound like fun?
<asac> jdong: no ... i won't backout that from hardy because of gutsy. do you have a bzr branch for gutsy based on our .dev branch?
<asac> we should do it there for gutsy i guess
<jdong> asac: no, I don't have a gutsy bzr branch set up based on the .dev's ancestry... I do use bzr locally to track the changes in the packaging and it'd probably be prudent for me to graft that onto a proper bzr branch :)
<asac> jdong: please base it on the .dev branch
<jdong> will do
<asac> should be easy to merge down on every release then
<jdong> right
<asac> .dev will become .hardy once that is stable
<asac> (released)
<asac> but will be just a rename i guess
<asac> ok scrapbook is done
<asac> oops wrong channel :)
<jdong> :)
<jdong> asac: mmmkay, pushed up backports changes rebased against .dev to LP :)
<asac> cool
<asac> rebased?
<asac> using bzr rebase?
<asac> jdong: ?
<emgent> heya people :)
<jdong> asac: nah I didn't go that fancy, I just lumped it all up into one commit
<asac> ;)
<jdong> asac: some embarassing mistakes best not see the light of day ;-)
<asac> yeah
<asac> i know what you mean
<jdong> yeah in general xulrunner was quite cooperative with backporting (fortunately), but firefox-3.0 took me at least 5 rounds to get right per release
<jdong> though that nspr/nss typo did cause a xulrunner build to fail at the very last step :D
 * jdong shakes fist
<asac> what was the problem with ffox?
<asac> we try to be as cooperative as possible. if there are glitches, we want to know about that ;)
<asac> suggestions welcome :)
<jdong> asac: well I have to back out the changes that make firefox 3.0 the default firefox, and the process of doing so always seems to be trial-and-error
<jdong> asac: not your fault in any way :)
<jdong> is there a command to invert a patch or do I have to patch -R then diff?
<asac> jdong: you can drop the patch from series?
<asac> or do you mean something else?
<jdong> asac: well I'm referring to the firefox window toolbar patch from bugzilla
<asac> hmm
<jdong> nvm I'll just hand-do it. The inverse of that patch is more intrusive than necessary to restore old behavior anyway
<asac> maybe flipdiff using an empty patch as second argument :)
<asac> great
<jdong> but I do like the creativity of that approach :D
<asac> should be simple to do when using quilt ;)
<jdong> yay, I love quilt..... ;-)
<asac> welcome ;)
<jdong> grr *whine* this code is in xulrunner?
<ashes_of_youth> can anyone offer me some advice regarding a broken translation?
<ashes_of_youth> hello
<ScottK2> ashes_of_youth: I'd suggest ask in #ubuntu-doc
<AnAnt> ScottK2: Hello, I just made another upload: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=ubuntume-themes
<ScottK2> AnAnt: Looking
<AnAnt> ScottK2: btw, I see usplash theme is on Ubuntu's repos now ! Thanks!
<ScottK2> AnAnt: You're welcome.
<ScottK2> AnAnt: Is the bug this fixes reported in Launchpad?
<AnAnt> nope
<AnAnt> that's why there isn't a Closes: # in changelog
<ScottK2> OK.  Just checking.
<ScottK2> Also there are other changes you made that need to be documented.
<AnAnt> moving x11-apps to Build-Depends-Indep: ?
<ScottK2> Yes and the changes in the package description.
<AnAnt> Ok, didn't know that they were worth mentioning
<ScottK2> After the initial upload they all need to be mentioned.
<ScottK2> People need to be able to recontruct from the changelog not only what was done, but why (if it's not obvious).
<ScottK2> AnAnt: If you would re-upload to REVU with a more verbose changelog, then I think I could upload it.
<AnAnt> so I should mention why I changed long description ?
<ScottK2> For that it's enough to say minor edits in the package description.
<AnAnt> uploaded
<ScottK2> AnAnt: OK.  There's a cron job that needs to run that goes on a ten minute periodic before I see it.
<AnAnt> ok, rebooting
<null_vector> i'm trying to package flam3 and convert it to 3 packages, executables, so and dev.  are there any resources or examples I could look at to figure out hows to go about this?
<jdong> ScottK2: did you have a chance to look at the ff3 backport yet?
<AnAnt> ScottK2: ok, it appears on REVU now
<ScottK2> AnAnt: Looking
 * jdong does some backports triaging
<ScottK2> AnAnt: Uploaded
<AnAnt> ScottK2: thanks
<ScottK2> AnAnt: Thank you for making the extra effort to work through the official archives.
<ScottK2> jdong: I'm looking at it now.
<jdong> ScottK2: thanks :)
<ScottK2> jdong: What xulrunner am I supposed to backport?
<jdong> ScottK2: this one: http://jdong.mit.edu/~jdong/motu/ff-backport/beta4/xulrunner-1.9_1.9~b4+nobinonly-0ubuntu1~gutsy1.dsc
<jdong> and corresponding firefox: http://jdong.mit.edu/~jdong/motu/ff-backport/beta4/firefox-3.0_3.0~b4+nobinonly-0ubuntu1~gutsy1.dsc
<ScottK2> Figured out the problem.
<ScottK2> I have the wrong xulrunner.
<jdong> ah
<ScottK2> I had xulrunner, not xulrunner-1.9
<jdong> yeah, that'll do it :)
<jdong> that's extreme backporting! :)
<ScottK2> jdong: Should we mangle the maintainer?
<ScottK2> Nevermind
<jdong> ScottK2: I don't think it'd be necessary. Plus, spamming asac with bug reports might be fun ;-)
<ScottK2> Yeah.
<ScottK2> jdong: You've tested these are all good and I'm just your mule on this.  Right?
<jdong> ScottK2: yes, it's all tested for several weeks and known good :)
<ScottK2> OK.
<jdong> ScottK2: we can play this game with beta5 again in around two weeks :D
<ScottK2> jdong: Uploaded.  If you'd please do that Launchpad update.
<jdong> ScottK2: awesome
<ScottK2> jdong: Now how about wine?
<ScottK2> Is the current version good to go back?
<jdong> ScottK2: I've been running 0.9.57, not 0.9.58, but that's on my TODO list to look at
<jdong> for tonight
<ScottK2> Great.
<jdong> I'm first going through the obvious/trivial backports that are already confirmed, then I'll take a look at wine and finish this SRU I promised
<jdong> stupid Debian question, does Debian keep old revisions of their packages somewhere?
<Fujitsu> snapshot.debian.net
<jdong> thanks!
<jdong> it would also help if I look for the patch in the right version of the package :D
<Iulian> G'morning.
<james_w> siretart: I don't know if you have seen this: http://patches.ubuntu.com/b/boxbackup/boxbackup_0.10+really0.10-1ubuntu3.patch
<ScottK2> Dear jdong: Please have a look at Bug #211910 and let us know what you think.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 211910 in rtorrent "[FFe] request for new upstream version " [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/211910
<ScottK2> jdong: Shouldn't the wine bug for gutsy-backports be set to In Progress?
<protonchris> ScottK2: If you have time today, could you look at Bug 212301 and sponsor an upload?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 212301 in glom "Please update glom to newest version (1.6.13)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/212301
<Hobbsee> ScottK2: ping
<Hobbsee> ScottK2: what do i need to know about the release stuff, apart from the info gained from having read the emails to the list?
<Laney> james_w: I finally got round to emailing the ML ;)
<james_w> Laney: ah, thanks.
<Laney> No probs. I suddenly realised on the way back from campus that I'd not done it yet
<siretart> james_w: oh, no thanks for the hint!
<siretart> err, insert a '.' at the appropriate place :)
<james_w> :-)
<james_w> siretart: you don't want a bug with the patch in Debian?
<protonchris> ScottK2: nevermind.  Looks like RainCT_ is taking a look.
<siretart> james_w: if want and have the time, please do. I'll try to think about it when I do the next upload of boxbackup. btw, do you use boxbackup yourself?
<jdong> s/sb end
<jdong> ScottK2: (!) Yeah, I did forget to change the status in wine; fixed. (2) I talked to sistpoty about rtorrent the other day, I think it's a good candidate for FFe
<ScottK2> jdong: Please mark it in the bug.
<ScottK2> Hobbsee: Pong: I don't think anything.
<Hobbsee> ScottK2: good, OK
<protonchris> RainCT: thanks for sponsoring glom
<RainCT> protonchris: no problem, thanks for working on it :)
<RainCT> protonchris: (if you are wondering why you haven't got the mail yet, that's because the .orig.tar.gz is still being uploaded :P)
<protonchris> RainCT: ah thanks.  Yeah I was waiting.  I wanted to see the additional changes you added.
<protonchris> RainCT: any advice?
<ScottK2> protonchris: It's better to have someone sponsoring you that does not, on a grumpy day, consider breaking Gnome a feature.
<protonchris> ScottK2: LOL.  Good to know.
<ScottK2> Actually it's mostly just Mono I consider breaking a feature, but the two go together just a little.
<RainCT> protonchris: the changes are just that debian/copyright only mentioned GPL2 but the source files say "2 or later" so I replaced that with the full GPL header as it is there (in the source), and that there was a ". Homepage:" left in glom's description
<protonchris> RainCT: great thanks.
<RainCT> ScottK2: heh, what happened?
<ScottK2> RainCT: Nothing, just don't like Mono.
<RainCT> ah, lol
 * jdong looks at cherrypicking clutchbt....
<megabyte405> Does anyone know of a good resource on the accepted way to build a single source package from what are several upstream tarballs?
<jdong> megabyte405: I'd suggest grouping all of them into a single orig.tar.gz, if it's a good idea to group them together in the first place.
<megabyte405> that's what I was planning on doing. They untar into program-version, program-plugins-version, and so on, where version is all the same and the same as the "orig" version - is there a variable I can use so I don't have to rename the untarred folders?
<james_w> siretart: sure, I'll file one.
<james_w> siretart: I don't use it, I was just looking at the diff.
<james_w> siretart: I used to work with one of the developers though.
<ScottK2> jdong: Please say something nice in Bug #211910 and then I'll approve it.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 211910 in rtorrent "[FFe] request for new upstream version " [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/211910
<jdong> ScottK2: I thought I already was quoted in that?
<ScottK2> jdong: You were, but I'd like to have a "No, really, we want this" that comes after the last comment.
<jdong> ScottK2: ok :)
<ScottK2> Thanks
<jdong> ScottK2: done :)
<ScottK2> Thanks
<ScottK2> jdong: Approved, so some motu might want to look at sponsoring the changes ...
<jdong> ooh I haven't hit the upload button in a while :)
<jdong> ack so that's why Firefox is crashing
 * jdong notes that flashplugin gets very very upset when it's not allowed to write to ~/.macromedia
<ScottK2> pochu: Are you worrying after screenlets?
<ScottK2> pochu: It looks like it needs some grabbing of patches from the upstream bzr.
<jdong> ScottK2: I feel blind.... is the debdiff/interdiff/diff.gz even on the bug report?
<ScottK2> jdong: It's not.  I had a brain dump about the requestor being a MOTU.  I'm sure he'll upload it.
<jdong> ah ok
<jdong> excellent
<pochu> ScottK2: I'm not, and I'm busy...
<ScottK2> OK.
<pochu> (and I'm not here)
<ScottK2> jdong: Care at all about screenlets?  That needs some uploading by someone who cares about Gnome.
<jdong> ScottK2: I don't know what it does, if that says anything :)
<ScottK2> Heh.
<ScottK2> OK.
<slytherin> jdong: something like dashboard widgets in OS X
<ScottK2> There we go.  A volunteer...
<slytherin> ScottK2: Are you one of the build admins who can promote a package to main?
<ScottK2> slytherin: No.
<ScottK2> Promotions are done via Main Inclusion Report.  You can file one.
<slytherin> ScottK2: No the package is in main for i386 and amd64 already. It is not for powerpc
<ScottK2> slytherin: Ah.  You'll want to discuss that with pitti then on Monday probably.
<ScottK2> slytherin: Do you have any interest in screenlets?
<slytherin> ScottK2: Ok. As suggested by Hobbsee I have already filed a bug. I will talk with pitti tomorrow. The problem is that f-spot has depwait due to this.
<cody-somerville> Whats the difference between screenlets and desklets?
<slytherin> ScottK2: I have just used them once.
<ScottK2> Dunno.  I mostly see a lot of bugs being filed and upstream commenting which bzr commit fixes the bug.
<ScottK2> I was hoping someone like slytherin might go through them and pull the patches in.
<slytherin> ScottK2: Any specific bug?
<ScottK2> slytherin: Bug 197712 Bug 212175 Bug 198675 Bug 195036 Bug 205526 and probably more.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 197712 in screenlets "ACPIBatteryScreenlet.py crashed with OSError in __create_tempfile()" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/197712
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 212175 in screenlets "VolumeControlScreenlet.py crashed with IOError in __create_tempfile()" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/212175
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 198675 in screenlets "SensorsScreenlet.py crashed with TypeError in update()" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/198675
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 195036 in screenlets "MainMenuScreenlet.py crashed with TypeError in __render_cell()" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/195036
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 205526 in screenlets "screenlets-manager.py crashed with UnboundLocalError in get_info_from_package_name()" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/205526
<absoluteuri> Hi, new here, trying to help. I see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/TODO#WeeklyTasks the first one (#106244) the last entry was 2007-07-29...I thought that list gets reset weekly? Is this still an active bug?
<ScottK2> Bug 106244
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 106244 in mysql-dfsg-5.0 "CONF Variable in /etc/init.d/mysql unused - support for multiple instance/version of mysql" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/106244
<ScottK2> Looks like, but it's also a package in Main, so I'm not sure what it's doing on the MOTU list.
<absoluteuri> OK, not sure where to begin with helping
<ScottK2> absoluteuri: One area that needs work is to see if there are critical bug fixes in Debian that we don't have.  See http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/bugs/rcbugs/
<absoluteuri> 'approx' is Ubuntu V 3.0.0 but Debian 3.1.0 so this means that the fixes in 3.1.0 need to be ported to the ubuntu 3.0?
<sebner> ScottK: you are wise. very wise
<sebner> ScottK2: same message -> you are wise. very wise
<slytherin> ScottK2: how about we package screenlets 0.1?
<protonchris> For critical debian bug fixes, is it preferred to try and patch the ubuntu version or sync the new package version?
<james_w> protonchris: it depends how much else is changed in the new Debian version.
<james_w> if its only the bug fix then sync, otherwise it is your call.
<protonchris> I noticed that sebner has marked the list with the ones he is working on.  Is it possible for me to do the same?
<sebner> protonchris: sure
<protonchris> Thanks.  I wanted to make sure I wouldn't be overstepping my bounds.
<mok0> sebner?
<sebner> mok0: yes?
<mok0> I was just wondering:
<mok0> you filed a whole bunch of sync requests. Have you cleared it with the release team?
<sebner> mok0: these are normal syncs and we have the 6th april. so I don't need a release team!?
<sebner> *the
<mok0> sebner: not if there are no new features
<sebner> mok0: there are now features ;) I checked it. But you are invited to check and give an ACK ;)
<sebner> *no new feautres
<sebner> *feature -.-
<mok0> sebner: ah :-)
<mok0> sebner: I am not in the release team though
<sebner> mok0: MOTU ACK is enough ;)
<mok0> sebner: he, yes, I can assign them to the archive admin
<sebner> mok0: please check it before ;)
<sebner> mok0: doesn't seem to are familiar with u-u-s?
<mok0> sebner: not really :-)
<sebner> ^^
<sebner> mok0: If you want to 1) check if my syncs requests are really *normal* syncs" 2) give a comment with "ACK" 3) subscibe the archive admins
<mok0> sebner: I will go through some of them, going for dinner soon
<sebner> mok0: thanks so much :)
<mok0> sebner: right
<mok0> sebner: are those bugs from the rcbugs page?
<sebner> mok0: about 90%
<mok0> sebner: great
<sebner> :D
<^linux26> I was thinking about packaging the Bullet Physics engine (v2.67, http://www.bulletphysics.com/) and the Horde3D graphics engine (v0.5.0, http://www.nextgen-engine.net/). Do you have any suggestions or I can start packaging right away?
<ScottK> Check and make sure neither are in Debian already or have Debian ITP bugs indicating someone else is already working on them.
<RainCT> ^linux26: just remember that it's to late to get it into Hardy now
<^linux26> RainCT: sure, the feature freeze
<^linux26> ScottK: okay I'll do that
<sebner> mok0: your comments are unusual and interesting. rock on :D
<mok0> sebner: unusual?
<mok0> :)
<sebner> mok0: normally they just right "ACK" or "Sync request ACK". Normally it doesn't matter how important it is. but your comments are nice ^^
<sebner> *write -.-
<mok0> sebner: Perhaps I will get sloppier with time
<sebner> mok0: would be a pitty :)
<mok0> :-D
<mok0> Dinner!!!
<sebner> hf
<^linux26> It appears that Blender3D uses the Bullet Physics engine - but there is no 'bullet' package in debian/ubuntu; looks like the library is embedded in the package
<^linux26> ScottK: looks like no-one ever packaged the Bullet Physics engine or the Horde3D graphics engine yet
<emgent> hi people
<cody-somerville> StevenK, ping
<emgent> hey cody-somerville :)
<cody-somerville> Heya emgent :)
<JohnPinWa> Hello.  I'm looking for ways to contribute to Ubuntu as a developer.  I'm reading the "How to get involved" web pages but can't find the "Do this step next" instructions.  Who do I tell I'm here and ask how I can help?
<mok0> ! packaging
<ubotu> The packaging guide is at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide - See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/NewPackages for information on getting a package integrated into Ubuntu - Other developer resources are at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment - See also !backports
<mok0> JohnPinWa: or if you want to chase bugs: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/HowToFix
<mok0> and ... ! bugs
<mok0> !bugs
<ubotu> If you find a bug in Ubuntu or any of its derivatives, please file a bug report at: http://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu  -  Bugs in/wishes for the bots can be filed at http://launchpad.net/ubuntu-bots
<JohnPinWa> I've been using Linux and Ubuntu for a while but should probably start on the basics.  What's "ground level" grunt work in this outfit?
<mok0> JohnPinWa: Finding and reporting bugs -- i.e. stress testing of programs -- is very useful and you will learn finding your way around Launchpad
<mok0> JohnPinWa: another task is triaging bugs, i.e. see if you can reproduce them, and supply additional information to the bug report
<JohnPinWa> MokO: Launchpad is really stumping me at this point.  I see what I see but can't figure out how to DO anything with it.  Probably a good place to start huh?
<mok0> JohnPinWa: yeah. It is pretty stumping, but once you get to know it, it's a pretty powerful tool. It's what Ubuntu is using anyway
<Iulian> JohnPinWa: https://edge.launchpad.net/+about will give you an idea of what launchpad is and what it can do.
<JohnPinWa> For the record: It's me that's ignorant of launchpad.  Wasn't saying launchpad was the problem.
<JohnPinWa> I'll take a look Iulian.
<nand> JohnPinWa: I have a few PHP tasks for Brainstorm if you want...
<mok0> ... but est. 90% of users only use the "Bugs" feature, or perhaps ask and/or answer questions in "Answers"
<JohnPinWa> I don't know diddly about PHP.  Python, bash, and a few other scripting/special purpose languages.  I'd love for this to wind up with me working with C.
<nand> too bad :)
<RainCT> nand: i'm curious, what are those tasks?
<mok0> JohnPinWa: You mean you know Python, bash, etc., but not PHP?
<JohnPinWa> Yep.  PHP just looked ugly.  Never got interested.
<nand> RainCT: one of those: http://www.ndeschildre.net/brainstorm-todo-list/
<JohnPinWa> Dang near as bad as perl.
<mok0> JohnPinWa: Python is installed a bit differently in Ubuntu than intended by Guido et al. You may want to read up on that
<nand> that's quite a lot of tasks, from easy to hard ones
<JohnPinWa> Mok0: yeah, that's inherited from Debian I think.  I used to watch that mailing list and the discussion on it was endless.
 * Iulian is going to sleep - g'night.
<mok0> JohnPinWa: It has been settled mostly
<JohnPinWa> mok0: it should be by know but settled "Debian style" which may not have been "Python style".  Still, I've never had a problem with python on Ubuntu.
<mok0> JohnPinWa: Basically, the distribution needs to allow for several versions of Python installed simultaneously, which is not the focus of Guido et al
<JohnPinWa> mok0: Well I can see that makes sense from both points of view.
<mok0> JohnPinWa: but python-central is the preferred tool being used now, it takes care of all the grunt work (e.g. byte-compiling for all the different versions)
<warp10> Hi all!
<linux26> I have a big upstream tarball (Horde3D SDK) which contains a library and demos and data for the demos. How can I split it into several deb packages?
<RainCT> linux26: install the stuff into a temp directory (usually debian/tmp/) and from there move it into the different packages (with *.install files for example)
<linux26> RainCT: I'll look that up, thanks
<jdong> haha, jdong's lazy crack of the day: cached rmadison dependency checker
<jdong> a python script using a sqlite-cached rmadison backend to parse build-deps and check em against various Ubuntu distros
<jdong> for those extra lazy and impatient backporting days :D
<null_vector> I'm trying to package flam3 and I'm getting the shouldn't be linked with errors from dpkg-shlibdeps but I can't find how those libs are being included in the first place.
<null_vector> It's an autotools/libtool package.  Any suggestions?
<mok0> null_vector: you can ignore those errors
<mok0> null_vector: they appear when you build shared libraries
<null_vector> I'm splitting the package into lib / executable packages though and getting those warnings for the executables though
<null_vector> That was almost a coherent sentence.
<mok0> null_vector: you can safely ignore them
<null_vector> thanks
<RainCT> good night
<JohnPinWa> When someone offers mentoring in Launchpad how do you contact him/her to let them know you'd like to learn about it?
<ScottK2> I'd suggest commenting in the bug about what you'd plan to do and what questions you have and see if they react.
<JohnPinWa> ScottK2:  Okay.  Now how do I "comment in a bug"?  Seriously I've spent the day wandering from wiki page to wikipage trying to figure out how to get started.  No joy.
<ScottK2> JohnPinWa: What bug?
<JohnPinWa> On this website: https://launchpad.net/%7Ebugsquad/+mentoring
<JohnPinWa> There are a list of bugs that people are available to mentor on.  I'd love to learn how to start helping but I'm stuck.
<persia> JohnPinWa: For bugsquad-mentored bugs, you likely want #ubuntu-bugs, as the process is a little different.
<JohnPinWa> I've joined mailing lists as well.  Perhaps I should give a shout out there?
<persia> JohnPinWa: For those, I'd recommend asking for help with the bug in IRC.
<JohnPinWa> Yeah, I asked there a while back.  No response.
<ScottK2> Actually I need to go, so hopefully someone else will help you out.
<JohnPinWa> Persia: thanks.
<JohnPinWa> ScottK2: thanks.
<persia> JohnPinWa: Maybe just a bad time of day :(
<JohnPinWa> yeah.  Or I'm spectacularly dense.  Not an option I ever dismiss lightly.
<JohnPinWa> I'll keep plugging.  Something will give.  Not sure if this is for me but I'm sure I want to find out.
<james_w> JohnPinWa: I don't think so. Is there a bug you would particularly like to work on?
<james_w> JohnPinWa: also, those bugs won't be the simplest ones. It looks they are ones that would take a bit of work, but someone would be willing to give you pointers.
<james_w> there are a load of bugs that would be quite easy, and that people would be willing to help you with, but mentoring hasn't been offered for them.
<JohnPinWa> james_w: Thank you.  perisa just walked me through a bit in the bugs channel.  And there's a hug day coming up Tuesday.  I'll just hang around pestering people until I get my feet on the ground.
<mok0> Just a quick procedure question: how do I upload a package that someone else has signed off in debian/changelog
<mok0> should I just sign the changes file?
<mok0> ... or specify my own keyid
<Fujitsu> mok0: debuild -S -k<yourkeyid>
<Fujitsu> or just debsign -k<yourkeyid> existing_source.changes
<Fujitsu> But you should be building the .changes yourself anyway, so the former should be easier.
<mok0> Fujitsu: thx! No "-sa" switch?
<Fujitsu> -sa if you need it.
<Fujitsu> But that shouldn't be needed much, particularly now we're well past FF.
<mok0> Fujitsu: which is..  when the tar.gz is already in the archive?
<Fujitsu> -sa is when the .tar.gz isn't in the archive.
<Fujitsu> It doesn't hurt to upload it again, but it's a waste of time.
<mok0> Fujitsu: got it, thx
<soren> Fujitsu: Why should he be building the .changes himself?
<persia> mok0: In the case where the package has multiple new changelog entries (e.g. merges), don't forget the -v to debuild.
<mok0> persia: ok, but this one doesn't.
<mok0> soren: because I need to upload a diff.gz also
<persia> soren: Verification and review?  The typical sponsoring model is to receive a debdiff, apply it, and build the .changes.
<soren> If someone has provided you with a .changes file, they will also have provided you with a diff.gz.
<soren> persia: I'm perfectly happy to accept a signed .changes and diff.gz and do my review from that, and if it's good, resign just the .changes file and upload.
<mok0> soren: I got a debdiff from LP; I want to build and upload the source package
<soren> I think that's a good workflow.
<soren> mok0: Ok, got it.
<Fujitsu> It's a lot easier to review the debdiff than review the debdiff, .dsc and .changes.
<persia> soren: I guess.  I prefer to see things in LP for documentary purposes, and think more than a debdiff is typically wasteful of librarian storage.
<Fujitsu> As neither of the last two are trustworthy.
<soren> Fujitsu: It's either one or the other.
 * persia doesn't see any value to .changes, if a debdiff or diff.gz is available
<soren> It makes for good practice for coming MOTU's.
<persia> How?
<soren> If they're used to providing .changes+dsc+diff, then the upload process will not be as alien to them, when they get upload rights.
<soren> It's not so much of an issue anymore with ppa's and all that, though.
<persia> The upload process consists of calling dput.  There are lots of places to practice.
<persia> Anyway, one typically generates all of that in the process of creating a debdiff.
<soren> persia: Yes. Possibly incorrectly.
<soren> persia: If I get a .changes file, I review that too. It's especially handy for merges.
<persia> soren: I suspect I'm missing something.  Which part concerns you?
<persia> Ah.  The -v :)  Yes, that's a good bit.
#ubuntu-motu 2009-03-30
<cody-somerville> sparr, It doesn't appear a conflict was actually added
<cody-somerville> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/23145334/boost_1.34.1-15ubuntu2_1.34.1-15ubuntu3.diff.gz
<cody-somerville> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/24456406/python2.6_2.6.1-1ubuntu6_2.6.1-1ubuntu7.diff.gz
<sparr> cody-somerville: even worse?
<cody-somerville> sparr, It looks like maybe he fixed it
<imbrandon> ugh, i need to relocate to cali
<imbrandon> heh
<cody-somerville> Ugh is right.
<imbrandon> i really want to :)
<cody-somerville> I wouldn't want to : (
<imbrandon> need to get out of the midwest
<imbrandon> wonder what the job market right now is like in san fran
 * imbrandon opens google
<sparr> trying to decide if im selfless enough to spend an hour removing python and reinstalling it from intrepid then jaunty to see if all parts of that bug are really fixed
<imbrandon> where is jono where ya need him :)
<imbrandon> sparr: go for it :)
<dtchen> sparr: virtual machines are nice, too.
<imbrandon> as are chroot's
<dtchen> or {,s}chroots
<sparr> either way i would have to either make a fresh installation, or roll back an existing installation
<sparr> no time saved
<dtchen> maco posted a jaunty 6 vm on thepiratebay, so at least there's a bit of time saved if you want to use that
<dtchen> (i.e., alpha 6)
<dtchen> hmm, it would be worth investigating offering vbox images
<sparr> alpha 6 already has python 2.6.1, no?
<imbrandon>  /join #drupal
<imbrandon> err
<ripps> I'm trying to make my ppa packages up to debian standards by including by including an package-version.orig.tar to the packages. I implemented this using cdbs tarball.mk, becuase it always seemed to ingnore the orig.tar otherwise, the problem is that whenever I try to do a test build with pdebuild, I get this error "tar: build-tree: Cannot chdir: No such file or directory"
<Amaranth> ripps: tarball.mk is for tarball-in-tarball packages
<ripps> How do I get dput,pdebuild,etc to recognize package.orig.tar.gz then?
<ripps> Amaranth: ^
<Amaranth> ripps: you create that before you build the package
<ripps> I've tried having one in my source directory and my ../source, but dput never recognizes and uploads it.
<Amaranth> ripps: it should be like alacarte_0.11.10.orig.tar.gz
<Amaranth> and it should not have your debian/ dir in it
<Amaranth> it should be a clean tarball from upstream
<Amaranth> so for that alacarte package the package is alacarte 0.11.10-0ubuntu1 or whatever, the working directory is alacarte-0.11.10
<ripps> Amaranth: I know, does the version matter? I use git to update my source dirs, so I tend to just copy the source and remove all the debian stuff when I make orig tarballs
<Amaranth> the version should correspond to your package version
<ripps> brb
<nenolod> TheMuso: nice patches on alsa-devel
<TheMuso> nenolod: thanks
<TheMuso> nenolod: That script needs a bad cleanup, and I'll probably sit down and do it one day. :)
<ripps> Amaranth: how much of the version has to correspond with the changelog? I use a fairly long version number libmpd_0.18.0+git090318-0ubuntu2~ripps
<Amaranth> libmpd_0.18.0+git090318.orig.tar.gz
<ripps> Amaranth: I use several debian.distro folders that I individually symlink to debian depending on which package I'm building today, but this seems to cause issues with debuild -S.
<ripps> Amaranth: http://paste.ubuntu.com/140501/
<ripps> Amaranth: did you see my pastebin?
<Amaranth> ripps: Nope, but I really don't have any more time to help right now, sorry
<Amaranth> ripps: In 2-3 hours more people should be around
<ripps> Amaranth: I thinked I figured out an alternative, I changed my backporting script to make the debian directory a copy instead of symlink. dput seems to work correctly now.
<ripps> Hmm... Now I need some way for the script to save changes to debian to the old debian.distro directory.
<dholbach> good morning
<ripps> I written a script that automates creating an orig tarball, building a source package, and uploading to a repository (using dput). I called it dshove: http://paste.ubuntu.com/140531/
<ripps> Anything blatanly wrong with it?
<ripps> Actually, it doesn't work right. Does anybody know how to cut the "0ubuntu1~ppa" from a version string?
<imbrandon> morning dholbach
<dholbach> hiya imbrandon
<dholbach> how are you doing?
<imbrandon> when i see you come online i know its (local)time for me to sleep :)
<imbrandon> heh good good
<dholbach> hehe :-)
<imbrandon> u?
<dholbach> sleep tight then :)
<dholbach> I'm waking up slowly, but I'm good - thanks
<tsimpson> ripps: something like "dpkg-parsechangelog | grep '^Version:' | sed -e 's/^Version: //' -e 's/-[^\-]*$//'"
<ripps> tsimpson: actually, I figured it out in #ubuntu+1, my new script version: http://paste.ubuntu.com/140545/
<tsimpson> ripps: that assumes the upstream version won't contain a '-', which is possible (if bad form)
<ripps> tsimpson: well your version works too, so I don't see why not to add it.
 * Amaranth seems to remember i.mbrandon saying he slept on european time
<ripps> Should I create a launchpad bzr branch containing all the devscripts I've come up with?
<tsimpson> ripps: you could branch ubuntu-dev-tools https://code.launchpad.net/ubuntu-dev-tools
<ripps> https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~ripps818/ubuntu-dev-tools/ripps-scripts
<Toadstool> good morning
<gordonsyme> Hello
<gordonsyme> I'm not sure if this is the right place but I have a question about packaging
<gordonsyme> I have a Python package and some scripts
<gordonsyme> I'm using dist-utils to build the Python package and CDBS to build the .deb package
<gordonsyme> At this point I want to build three .deb packages.
<gordonsyme> The Python package is to be common to each .deb package
<gordonsyme> Actually, scratch that
<gordonsyme> I probably really want to build four packages
<gordonsyme> The python package and one for each script/config
<gordonsyme> Is this possible with CDBS?
<directhex> just write appropriate .install files and debian/control entries
<gordonsyme> directhex: CDBS seems to do magic with the tarball from Python's dist-utils, if I add to the control file will CDBS pick this up and do the right thing?
<directhex> dunno. Python is sluggish interpreted black magic to me
<gordonsyme> directhex: Ah :)
<gordonsyme> I suppose there is nothing to do but experiment, thanks for the help
<goshawk> does anyone know why this cdbs debian/rules calls build/ldc twice? http://paste.ubuntu.com/140634/
<hyperair> goshawk: i have no idea why, but why do you ahve a call to bash?
<goshawk> hyperair: yes, debug
<hyperair> lol i see
<goshawk> hyperair: i put it to track that it's really called twice
<goshawk> :)
<hyperair> hahah
<hyperair> i have no idea why
<hyperair> what's DEB_BUILDDIR again?
<goshawk> hyperair: the first one copies a directory in the debian build direcotry
<goshawk> and the other one compiles the previous copied
<hyperair> nono what doies it refer to
<hyperair> debian/?
<hyperair> debian/tmp?
<hyperair> no wait that's DEB_DESTDIR
<hyperair> so what's DEB_BUILDDIR?
<hyperair> is it CURDIR?
<goshawk> no, it's obj-gnu-archblablablasl
<hyperair> .___________.
<goshawk> it's the dir in which all in compiled by default
<goshawk> in cdbs
<hyperair> i see
<hyperair> why don't you just link it
<hyperair> ln -s tango/ $(DEB_BUILDDIR)/tango
<goshawk> yep...
<goshawk> i don't wanna make the tree dirty
<goshawk> so all the changes are in DEB_BUILDDIR
<goshawk> if i link
<goshawk> the tree will be dirty
<goshawk> :)
<goshawk> build/ldc:: build-runtime-stamp
<goshawk> build-runtime-stamp:
<goshawk> 	cp -a tango/ $(DEB_BUILDDIR)/tango/
<goshawk> 	cd $(DEB_BUILDDIR) && $(MAKE) runtime
<goshawk> i'm trying this one
<goshawk> i look in a forum
<goshawk> maybe it works
 * goshawk compiles
<hyperair> that's one hell of a hack =\
<hyperair> goshawk: you'd be better off not using cdbs
<hyperair> goshawk: another thing.. build/ldc:: is called _after_ building ldc
<goshawk> yep it's what i want
<goshawk> make and then make runtime
<goshawk> yep... i should NOT use cdbs...
<goshawk> ok time to go for me
<goshawk> thansk for your help hyperair
<goshawk> see you
<hyperair> goshawk: no prob
<AnAnt_> Hello, is there a way to make pbuilder update from intrepid to jaunty , but get the updates from the alternate CD rather than the internet ?
<directhex> AnAnt_, much easier to create a new pbuilder
<AnAnt_> directhex: well, same question, how do I make it get the packages from CD instead of internet ?
<hyperair> deb-cdrom?
<hyperair> or something?
<directhex> you should be able to use the cd in your --mirror line
<AnAnt_> directhex: what makes new pbuilder easier that --update ?
<directhex> updates may not end up being 100% clean between releases
<directhex> if your pbuilder is unclean, you defeat the purpose of using it
<AnAnt_> directhex: so I use --create , and it will overwrite the existing base.tgz ?
<directhex> if your system is set up to only use one base.tgz, then probably
<AnAnt_> directhex: will that remove packages already existing in  /var/cache/pbuilder/result/ ?
<hyperair> AnAnt_: the only way to remove those is rm them manually =p
<AnAnt_> ok, good
<AnAnt_> thanks
<cbx33> anyone know who is going GSoC this year for Ubuntu?
<jpds> cbx33: I don't think we are.
<cbx33> oh
<jpds> There's stuff at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/GoogleSoC2009 , no idea what the status is.
<cody-somerville> Ubuntu isn't participating
<cbx33> ahh ok
<cbx33> thanks guys
<thekorn> wow, that's surprising, I'm sure I've seen a list with ubuntu beeing one of the accepted organisations for this year
<stefanlsd> Anyone familiar with a QT .ui file. Im trying to use <includehints> and i'm getting Unexpected element includehints.
<bddebian> Heya gang
<goshawk> in a debian/rules that use cdbs, what is the difference between build/foo: and build/foo:: ?
<directhex> :: appends to an existing rule
<goshawk> directhex: thanks :)
<goshawk> so why if i redefine CMakeCache.txt:: if get debian/rules:13: *** target file `obj-x86_64-linux-gnu/CMakeCache.txt' has both : and :: entries.  Stop.
<goshawk> ?
<kees> jpds: why do you have these lines in the pidgin profile?
<kees> +       deny /etc/kernel rm,
<kees> +       deny /etc/passwd rm,
<jpds> kees: Cos pidgin kept asking for them and I wanted to silence it.
<kees> pidgin was asking for "m" on passwd ?
<jpds> Yeah.
<kees> that's very very odd.
 * kees will poke at that -- that's either a bug in pidgin or a regression in the kernel.
<kees> jpds: you did this on i386 or amd64?
<jpds> kees: i386, lemme check my logs again.
<kees> cat you give me the output of two commands:  sudo cat /proc/1/personality; cat /proc/$$/personality
<kees> I would expect both to be "00000000"
<jpds> kees: http://paste.ubuntu.com/140802/
<jpds> kees: Both are: "00000000" - latest Jaunty.
 * kees scratches his head
<kees> okay, I'll poke around some more later today
<jpds> kees: http://paste.ubuntu.com/140818/
<kees> jpds: right, getpwuid shouldn't be mapping "m".
<kees> can you cat the personality of your pidgin process?
<jpds> Same, 0000000
<kees> totally weird!
<kees> do you have any warnings in your logs for cups complaining about the need for "m" on /etc/passwd when it prints?
<jpds> Haven't used cups.
<Legendario> I am having problens when trying to create a package... can ayone help me out with that: http://ubuntu.pastebin.com/d5c95419d
<goshawk> Legendario: i don't see any error line from the source, except the one by pbuilder
<Legendario> goshawk... i am having another problem now... on debuild...
<Legendario> no... not at all
<goshawk> let me see
<Legendario> goshawk
<Legendario> could debuild it again
<Legendario> the problem is on compiling the package with pbuilder really
<Legendario> goshawk, what king of error can it be?
<goshawk> Legendario: maybe some make returns a value which is recognized as an error to pbuilder
<Legendario> goshawk, do u think this bug maybe affecting my build? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/cdbs/+bug/138981
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 138981 in cdbs "makefile.mk overwrites LDFLAGS defined in Makefile" [Medium,Confirmed]
<Legendario> but i don't see that going on in it
<Legendario> cause i am not using cdbs...
<goshawk> Legendario: i don't think so
<goshawk> if you were affected by the same problem
<goshawk> debuild should not work too
<Legendario> yeah... everything ok with debuild
<Legendario> the problem seem to be when compiling this libweed...
<Legendario> goshawk, could give me any suggestion? I am lost?
<Legendario> lost!
<goshawk> can you please past me the output of debuild?
<goshawk> paste
<Legendario> goshawk, http://ubuntu.pastebin.com/d591711ea
<goshawk> Legendario: with debuild -S -sa you are preparing a source package
<goshawk> you are not compiling
<goshawk> to compile
<goshawk> just run debuild
<goshawk> but i think
<goshawk> that you will have to download a lot of dependencies
<Legendario> i think i have done that already... gonna try againg
<Legendario> goshawk, error. gonna paste for u
<goshawk> Legendario: is it a new package the one you are trying to compile?
<Legendario> goshawk, http://ubuntu.pastebin.com/dada0e48
<Legendario> yes
<goshawk> DependÃªncias de construÃ§Ã£o nÃ£o satisfeitas: libgtk2.0-dev libsdl1.2-dev libtool automake1.9
<goshawk> i'm not spanish
<goshawk> but it says to install those packages ;)
<imbrandon> looks like missing build deps
<Legendario> goshawk, it is not spanish. it is portuguese... :-)
<goshawk> ah sorry :D
<imbrandon> sudo apt-get install libgtk2.0-dev libsdl1.2-dev libtool automake1.9
<imbrandon> :)
<Legendario> goshawk, it's been a time since I last tried to build a package... I didn't need to do this in the past... pbuilder used to download those packages to the check enviromment... Did things changed?
<goshawk> no
<goshawk> Legendario: the things are the same
<goshawk> Legendario: but we can figure out what's the error in pbuilder
<goshawk> so you have two solutions
<goshawk> 1) find a log in which there is the error (from pbuilder's logs)
<goshawk> 2) compile it in your environment with debuild
<Legendario> goshawk, i am downloading them... let's just wait a bit...
<Legendario> my connection is kind of slow
<goshawk> in the meantime try to find the error in the pbuilder logs
<Legendario> goshawk, where is the log located?
<goshawk> Legendario: it depends if you are using pbuilder or pbuilder-dist
<Legendario> pbuilder
<goshawk> the first one is in goshawk@earth:/var/cache/pbuilder$ ls
<goshawk> aptcache  build  pbuildd  pbuilder-mnt  pbuilder-umlresult  result
<goshawk> /var/cache/pbuilder
<goshawk> in build
<goshawk> you should find the build logs
<goshawk> no, wrong
<Legendario> yeahh, i am not finding them there...
<Legendario> goshawk, i've made a search for *.log in the /var/cache/pbuilder but found no thing at all
<goshawk> yep, i said that it's wrong that's not the correct dir
<goshawk> sorry i don't know
<Legendario> goshawk... i don't know if there is such a log...
<goshawk> pbuilder-dist does it :P
<Legendario> well, i've never use pbuilder-dist... how diferent is that?
<goshawk> pbuilder-dist is just a wrapper that makes you able to have multiple pbuilders for multiple distributions
<goshawk> you create a smb link in /usr/local/bin of pbuilder-dist named pbuilder-intrepid for example
<goshawk> pbuilder-intrepid create
<goshawk> pbuilder-intrepid build file.dsc
<goshawk> it builds
<goshawk> like normal pbuilder
<goshawk> pbuilder-sid build file.dsc builds for debian sid
<goshawk> and so on
<Legendario> i see here it really has the option to log or not the builds
<Legendario> but does it change debian/changelog?
<Legendario> for the chosen distro?
<goshawk> no
<goshawk> it justs tests build-depends
<goshawk> in different environments
<goshawk> it's not used in production where you need to do packages to distribute, pbuilder is to check that the build depends are satisfied
<Legendario> but u must have a chroot envirommento for each distro, right?
<goshawk> yep
<goshawk> pbuilder-intrepid create
<goshawk> pbuilder-sid create
<goshawk> and so on
<Legendario> goshawk, tried to debuild here
<Legendario> do u want the hole thing or just the end...
<goshawk> start from the end :)
<Legendario> goshawk, big one: http://ubuntu.pastebin.com/d31c1394e
<goshawk> well
<goshawk> finally
<goshawk> :)
<goshawk> from line 420
<goshawk> they are all errors
<goshawk> /home/kemel/Downloads/source/Empacotados/Lives2/lives-0.9.9.7/libweed/weed.c:260: undefined reference to `weed_malloc'
<goshawk> the sources are broken IMHO
<Legendario> i see, but i can't know why...
<goshawk> it's reference problem
<goshawk> it seems that in weed.c some libraries are missed
<goshawk> weÃ²Ã²
<goshawk> well
<Legendario> goshawk, what is IMHO?
<goshawk> only that file has undefined reference for weed_malloc weed_memcpy weed_free, memset and many otehrs
<goshawk> IMHO = In my honest opinion
<quentusrex> Can someone tell me how I can more quickly get a patch into a package?
<broonie> humble, normally.
<quentusrex> or how I can update my own package while I wait?
<Legendario> goshawk, is that an upstream problem?
<goshawk> ye
<goshawk> yep
<quentusrex> I have hit an issue with an upstream(debian package) bug. I have found the proper patch from the software project, but now it needs to be applied to the package.
<quentusrex> What do I do now?
<Legendario> goshawk, but i believe the author has no problem to compile it...
<goshawk> Legendario: are you sure that you have the correct version? i mean the same he compiled
<broonie> quentusrex: Does the package fail to build in Debian?
<Legendario> goshawk, i don't know... at least it is the last stable version that is available
<quentusrex> broonie: the package does not fail to build
<Legendario> i am in touch with him... gonna ask him tough
<quentusrex> it fails to properly detect the capabilites of the server...
<quentusrex> it detects all processors as 686, and not about to detect x86_64....
<broonie> quentusrex: Is there an existing Debian bug for this issue?
<quentusrex> I just filed it
<quentusrex> broonie: it is a brand new bug...
<broonie> quentusrex: Then send the patch to the bug as well.
<quentusrex> debian only applied one of the two patches...
<quentusrex> I did :) http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=521785
<ubottu> Debian bug 521785 in libvirt-bin "libvirt fails to detect host 64 bit capability for kvm" [Important,Open]
<quentusrex> now what?
<quentusrex> I'm a bit worried because my whole network is down because of this bug... :(
<broonie> Wait for the maintainer to react.
<quentusrex> :)
<quentusrex> broonie: could you walk me through modifying the package myself? I have compiled it locally to install it
<quentusrex> now I just need to download the source, then compile and reinstall it myself...
<broonie> This article has a walkthrogh of rebuilding: http://www.debian-administration.org/articles/20
<broonie> When you download the source check if there's a directory debian/patches in the source.
<quentusrex> ok
<Legendario> goshawk, tell me something... i included a file called GETTING.STARTED on the debia/docs. Where is it going to be included in the end? /usr/share/doc/package-name/GETTING.STARTED?
<goshawk> no
<goshawk> Legendario: in debian.docs you put the filenames
<goshawk> Legendario: that you want to have in /usr/share/doc/ldc
<goshawk> oops
<goshawk> remove ldc
<goshawk> :)
<goshawk> eg
<goshawk> goshawk@earth:~/Documents/Projects/MOTU/ldc/d1/ldc-0.9/debian$ cat docs
<goshawk> CMakeLists.txt
<goshawk> readme.txt
<goshawk> readme.txt
<goshawk> goshawk@earth:/var/cache/pbuilder$ cd /usr/share/doc/ldc/
<goshawk> goshawk@earth:/usr/share/doc/ldc$ ls
<goshawk> changelog.Debian.gz  CMakeLists.txt.gz  copyright  readme.txt
<goshawk> goshawk@earth:/usr/share/doc/ldc$
<Legendario> goshawk, no, i just want to write on the README.debian that there is this file called GETTING.STARTED, which is actually a FAQ and tell the location of it
<Legendario> goshawk, so i suppose it is going to be /usr/share/doc/package-name/GETTING.STARTED, right?
<goshawk> if ypu put his name in debian/doc yes
<Legendario> goshawk, that's what i did... ;-) thanks...
<lfaraone> quadrispro: thanks btw for updating those sugar packages in jaunty.
<Legendario> goshawk, well, i asked the author to try to compile it himself and see if he gets the same problem...
<goshawk> Legendario: ;)
<Legendario> goshawk, thanks a lot man. gotta go now...
<goshawk> you are welcome Legendario
<goshawk> Legendario in italian is legend :)
<goshawk> yep, with one more g
<Legendario> goshawk, are u italian?
<goshawk> yep
<Legendario> goshawk, half of my family is too...
<Legendario> from Trento...
<goshawk> ah ;)
<Legendario> my mothers side
<goshawk> the world is little ;)
<Legendario> and the italians travel a lot. ;-)
<Legendario> and end up coming to Brazil :D
<Legendario> goshawk, well see u. Bye
<quadrispro> lfaraone: :) it's a pleasure
<lionel> could someone from motu-sru have a look at bug #220136 ?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 220136 in asterisk-chan-capi "does not provide codecs to translate on hardy" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/220136
<lionel> cody-somerville ? :)
<cody-somerville> lionel, acked
<lionel> cody-somerville: thanks!
<Legendario> goshawk, can i bother u a second?
<goshawk> Legendario: yep
<Legendario> a new file appeared at the debian folder after i tryed to debuild it
<Legendario> it's calle package-name.debhelper.log
<goshawk> seems interesting
<goshawk> it's the debhelper log probably
<goshawk> are you using cdbs?
<Legendario> thereis only this inside: dh_installdirs
<Legendario> not using cdbs
<Legendario> goshawk, any hint?
<goshawk> no
<goshawk> btw it's right
<goshawk> you don't call debhelper
<goshawk> your package dies before reaching all the dh_* scripts
<goshawk> so it's normal that a log of all the dh_* scripts is empty
<goshawk> at least it's logical
<Legendario> goshawk, but my package is dies on build-stamp, doesn't it?
<Legendario> dies, sorry
<goshawk> yep
<goshawk> it dies while building for a problem in the source IMHO
<Legendario> so some dh_scripts are called
<Legendario> and why is this specific script appearing in the debhelper log
<Legendario> ?
<Legendario> goshawk
<goshawk> wait i read now
<goshawk> :)
<goshawk> i think your debian/rules sets it
<Legendario> goshawk, it does, but is that what may be causing the problem?
<goshawk> i dont think
<goshawk> phone
<Legendario> goshawk, ok
<goshawk> back
<Legendario> goshawk, so that doesn't offer any help at all, right?
<goshawk> yep
<goshawk> the error is reported is that the linker does not know which function to reference for the function names it founds
<kees> jpds: weird, I can't reproduce the "m" thing for pidgin on jaunty i386
<goshawk> Legendario: to make a final prood
<goshawk> proof
<goshawk> Legendario: compile it from scratch
<jpds> kees: Nothing new in my logs, very odd.
<goshawk> without debian support
<Legendario> goshawk, ok. i will try
<Legendario> thanks again :-)
<goshawk> Legendario: let me know :)
<goshawk> i'm here everyday :P
<Legendario> goshawk, ok
<Legendario> goshawk, but i think that what i am doing it is packaging from scratch, actually
<Legendario> :P
<goshawk> yep, but since you still dubt that maybe debian/rules is wrong it's the final proof that the source are broken :)
<jpds> kees: Pushed up fixed profile.
<Legendario> goshawk, ok... thanks once again
<goshawk> good nights
<directhex> jcastro, ping?
<jcastro> directhex: yo
<directhex> jcastro, can we take it to /msg?
<jcastro> yep
<RyanK> hmm.. haven't seen ubuntu in years, but picked it up over the weekend and impressed with the changes! Want to help, but a bit overwhelmed with where to start!
<maxb> Find a bug which bothers you and see it through to being fixed? :-)
<directhex> yeah, that's the best way to get stuck in
<directhex> it teaches you all the tools, and gives you both s specific thing to work on and tangible results
<RyanK> well, I looked through the bugs (and there's a lot) and they seemed overly complex to just getting started
<RyanK> was going to work through the example recipies to get familiar, but the issues I was finding seem to require a lot of knowledge of ubuntu
<directhex> there are a lot of core concepts you need to be grounded in to feel comfortable working from scratch
<directhex> if it's any consolation, i'm still constantly finding things i don't know
 * Laney resists smutty comment
<jdong> *cough* :)
<RyanK> well.. the Universe/Multiverse bitesize bugs from https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/TODO/Bugs was what I was looking at
<RyanK> is that a good recommended starting place?
<Laney> the bitesize tag on LP is probably better
<Laney> oh, that's a search link
<Laney> RyanK: There's a couple on there with mentors listed
<Laney> you could speak to those people
<RyanK> ahh.. didn't notice the red plus sign... cool!
<Laney> there's probably a way to search for all such bugs
<RyanK> planning on wiping a laptop tonight and throw the 9.04 beta on there and dig in (assuming everything works on that laptop, reporting any issues, of course!)
<Laney> https://edge.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-dev/+mentoring
#ubuntu-motu 2009-03-31
<TheMuso> .c
<directhex> .cs
<xoox> Can anyone tell me why the ppa repo https://launchpad.net/~rvm4000/+archive/ppa is empty? All the links are broken.
<Milyardo> xoox: https://launchpad.net/~rvm4000/+archive/ppa/+build/917148
<Milyardo> There were build failures at launchpads last attempt to build packages
<xoox> Milyardo: So *no* packages are available?
<xoox> Milyardo: Seems only lpia failed.
<LordKow> so whats going on with nautilus-actions?
<LordKow> bug 341035
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 341035 in nautilus-actions "[jaunty] %d parameter returns nothing" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/341035
<LordKow> upstream cvs has had little activity over the last couple of years, mostly translation updates. all of the bug reports on gnome's bugtracker are being left alone. i don't think ubuntu should try and maintain an otherwise unmaintained package... if that is the case.
<LordKow> it appears that nautilus scripts can pretty much do the same. and as it stands right now nautilus-actions is pretty much useless if %params are broken.
<LordKow> i guess not all the %params are broken, but still my other points stick... i guess if there is a motu person who wants to continue to maintain it then sure.
<dholbach> good morning
<stefanlsd> morning
<dholbach> hiya stefanlsd
<fabrice_sp> 'morning stefanlsd
<pwnguin> ScottK-desktop: out of curiousity, how'd you notice #312957
<dholbach> can I persuade somebody to do a demo of some packaging topic on 23rd April, 0:00 UTC?
<dholbach> I know I might be up at the wrong time to persuade people who are awake around that time ;-)
<dtchen> i could. any suggested topics/boundaries?
<dholbach> hey dtchen
 * dholbach hugs dtchen
<dholbach> anything you like - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Packaging/Training is what we're going to try out
<dholbach> a 15 minute demo + some time for Q&A is compeltely fine
<dholbach> I hope that people will step up and give short demos like "dh_install --list-missing" or "quilt" or "pbuilder hooks" or whatever
<maco> yes plz!
<maco> doh...i'll have to miss that one. there'll be logs, right?
<dtchen> maybe piuparts, though i certainly don't mind covering dh 7/quilt/git
<dholbach> sure
<dtchen> let me get back to you via e-mail
<dholbach> dtchen: thanks a lot - I'll be announcing the sessions in a bit anyway, we'll just keep the slot open until then
<dholbach> dtchen: as I said, whatever you like - I'm sure there's going to be a lot of people who appreciate it
<geser> good morning
<dholbach> hi geser
<geser> Hi dholbach
<stefanlsd> Anyone willing to take a look at https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/tripod/+bug/337862 - its NBS and there is a FTBFS for lastfm. Its qt4.5 related and gentoo has a patch, i just cant work the qmake stuff out
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 337862 in amarok "Small libgpod3 -> libgpod4 transition" [High,Fix released]
<Toadstool> good morning
<abli> Hi! if I want to publish a package in my ppa for hardy, intrepid and jaunty, does that mean that I have to uploaded it three times with only the distrib being different in the changelog?
<geser> abli: yes, changing the distro and the version (e.g. adding ~intrepid1 to the end)
<abli> Even if nothing else is different? Shouldn't I be able to upload a single source package and say "compile this for each distrib"?
<pmjdebruijn> not yet
<abli> ok. thanks.
<geser> abli: as the build debs are strored in one directory you can't have three different debs (each one for a different release) in that one dir (as the filename will be the same)
<abli> ok. Uploading the source three times is no problem. I was just trying to avoid generating extra work for the ppa system, but I guess its not much of an issue.
<pmjdebruijn> just always suffix ~intrepid or ~jaunty
<gordonsyme> Hello
<gordonsyme> Any python packagers about?
<ScottK> pwnguin: One of the Python teams (pythonistas) is subscribed to cwiid bugs.
<directhex> wii!
<directhex> i still wish someone more competent than me had done something with the ps3 bluetooth remote
<goshawk> hi
<gordonsyme> Hi, any python packagers around?
<hyperair> gordonsyme: as in python apps or python itself
<gordonsyme> hyperair: python apps
<cody-somerville> !ask
<ubottu> Please don't ask to ask a question, simply ask the question (all on ONE line, so others can read and follow it easily). If anyone knows the answer they will most likely reply. :-)
<hyperair> well i've been messing around with a python app but nobody's reviewed it/sponsored it in debian
<gordonsyme> hyperair: I've been trying to work out how to package something for a few days and I've just hit a wall. I don't know enough about the packaging process to continue
<hyperair> yea just ask
<POX> hyperair: not possible, did you ask on #debian-python or debian-python@l.d.o ?
<hyperair> POX: what?
<POX> "but nobody's reviewed it/sponsored it in debian"
<hyperair> POX: i'm not satisfied yet
<hyperair> POX: when i'm satisfied with my own packaging i'll ask for sponsoring
<hyperair> POX: there's a java part which may or may not need building
<gordonsyme> I have a bunch of modules and three scripts. I have distutils building a tarball for me. Previously I was using CDBS to package the distutils tarball into a single deb. Now I would like to package the modules in one 'common' deb and put each script into its own deb. Is this even possible without writing a massive rules file?
<POX> oh ok, I thought nodoby in Debian replied to your RFS
<hyperair> POX: hahah
<hyperair> POX: actually i think i posted an RFS on debian-mentors
<hyperair> POX: then i retracted it because upstream changed something
<POX> Cc debian-python@ next time
<hyperair> gordonsyme: look into dh_install
<hyperair> POX: does debian-python have some sort of Vcs?
<gordonsyme> hyperair: thanks
<POX> debian-python@l.d.o is a mailing list, but we have 2 teams as well
<hyperair> gordonsyme: you might be interested in looking at remuco-server which is sitting in mentors.debian.net
<POX> one for modules/extensions and one for applications
<gordonsyme> hyperair: cool, will have a look
<POX> can someone teach the ubottu about DPMT and PAPT?
<hyperair> POX: i see. what are their names?
<hyperair> POX: what's DPMT and PAPT?
<POX> there's a wiki page on ubuntu.com, IIRC
<POX> let me search
<POX> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Debian/PythonModulesTeam
<hyperair> POX: i see. cool
<hyperair> POX: only svn? =(
<POX> but your package will have to be perfect to be sponsored, ask savvas ;)
<hyperair> ?
<POX> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/imgseek/+bug/342450
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 342450 in imgseek "Please sync imgseek 0.8.6-3 from debian unstable" [Medium,Confirmed]
<POX> "It was a long journey" ;)
<hyperair> ._.?
 * hyperair doesn't like svn =\
<POX> it's just a tool that keeps the debian dir
<hyperair> yes iknow
<hyperair> i prefer git
<POX> tell that to >100 other maintainers
<hyperair> =(
<POX> I like git too, but I doubt we'll use it
<hyperair> we could use both =D
<POX> even if I would be the only one to decide
<hyperair> oh =(
<hyperair> well pkg-cli-* has both git and svn
<POX> no we cannot use both
<hyperair> why not
<POX> one of the requirement is to have a command that will update all packages (including the new ones)
<hyperair> oh
<POX> try to check/sponsor few packages a day when you cannnot automate as much a possible
<hyperair> since when is sponsoring an automated task
<POX> updating all packages in one comman and grepping for common mistake is
<POX> or updating it while starting to read RFS mails
<POX> command*
<hyperair> i see
<POX> actually right now I'm without computer at home (it died few days ago), but usually I do it this way
<ahasenack> hey guys, got this error when trying to build a package for smart-1.2 (based on the previous jaunty one):
<ahasenack> pycentral: pycentral debhelper: both directories site-packages and dist-packages exist.
<ahasenack> pycentral debhelper: both directories site-packages and dist-packages exist.
<ahasenack> it's the same rules file (1.1.1 vs 1.2), and same environment (jaunty), but for some reason it fails when using 1.2
<ahasenack> what's this about?
 * hyperair has only used python-support
<hyperair> but if rules fails with 1.2, then obviously upstream has changed something
<hyperair> and rules needs to be updated
<hyperair> or something else
<POX> hyperair: it will be hard to be sponsored with python-central in our teams
<POX> ahasenack: check if you have new pytohn-central
<hyperair> POX: ?
<POX> python2.6 installs to dist-utils by default (or at least if the layout=deb is used)
<ahasenack> POX: 0.6.11ubuntu5
<hyperair> POX: you mean python-support or python-central is preferred?
<POX> so it's ok
<POX> not prefered, pysupport is the only one accepted since few week
<POX> s
<ahasenack> hmm, found a difference in setup.py
<hyperair> POX: then you shouldn't be telling me, i've only ever used python-support ;)
<hyperair> POX: but you should get the debian python policy page updated
<POX> I only wanted to let you know that you're using the right one ;)
<hyperair> POX: ah okay =p
<POX> hyperair: the policy for 95% of packages is 1) install to standard location 2) call dh_pysupport
<hyperair> POX: install to standard location meaning?
<POX> we'll deal with policy once all packages will not use pycentral or "currect"
<hyperair> my package uses python setup.py install --install-lib=/usr/share/python-support/modulename --root=debian/tmp
<POX> hyperair: python ./setup.py --root=debian/package/
<hyperair> POX: is that all that's needed?
<POX> hyperair: that's wrong
<POX> you should not use pysupport internal paths
<hyperair> hm
<POX> remove --install-lib and it will be ok
<hyperair> POX: the policy said to use --isntall-lib. don't you think this is even more reason to correct it?
<hyperair> and perhaps state that "pysupport is preferred"
<POX> hyperair: there are lots of special cases, but again for ~90%  of packages that's all what you need to know about python policy
<POX> at least for python modules
<hyperair> POX: http://www.debian.org/doc/packaging-manuals/python-policy/ap-packaging_tools.html#s-pysupport
<POX> (not applications or extensions)
<hyperair> POX: i'm talking about this. it says use --install-lib
<POX> check README file from python-support package
<POX> (the one from experimental has a mini howto)
<hyperair> hmm
<POX> /usr/share/doc/python-support/README.gz
<POX> (experimental's one is updated)
<hyperair> i see
<POX> (will be uploaded to unstable soon)
<hyperair> but seriously, what's wrong with updating the policy?
<POX> you have to convince doko to update it
<POX> and since he's python-central author, it will be hard
<hyperair> ugh
<goshawk> i'm packaging a compiler which needs a library which is not packaged in ubuntu yet (both library and compiler). The compiler needs the library (which is a .a) to link binaries cuz it's a standard library. Should i package the library into the compiler package or should i create 2 packages, oner for library-dev and one for compiler?
<hyperair> POX: without --install-lib, it installs into /usr/share/python2.6
<hyperair> sorry
<hyperair> debian/tmp/usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages
<POX> that's ok, dh_pysupport will move the files to the right location
<sistpoty|work> goshawk: I'd just put it the static lib into the compiler package
<hyperair> POX: but it didn't
<POX> change "tmp" to package name and it will
<hyperair> meh.
<hyperair> i see
<goshawk> sistpoty|work: uhm... well.
<hyperair> so pysupport is after dh_install eh
<POX> yes
<goshawk> sistpoty|work: do you know if there is a paragraph in the debian policy about it?
<hyperair> i see
<sistpoty|work> goshawk: to my knowledge there isn't
<sistpoty|work> goshawk: does upstream release the library as separate tarball?
<goshawk> sistpoty|work: yes
<goshawk> compiler is a project
<sistpoty|work> goshawk: then I guess the -dev is better... just thought this was in the same tarball
<goshawk> and library another one
<gordonsyme> hyperair: many thanks for your help, your remuco-server rules file showed me exactly what to do
<hyperair> gordonsyme: np.
<hyperair> gordonsyme: one thing. debian/rules should not have --install-lib in the setup.py call
<goshawk> sistpoty|work: but the compiler should depend on the library then
<goshawk> as Depends:
<sistpoty|work> goshawk: if it otherwise can't build binaries then yes
<goshawk> isn't it?
<goshawk> ok
<goshawk> thx
<hyperair> gordonsyme: also, if you don't have a Makefile as well as a setup.py at the top-level, you shouldn't need to override dh_auto_install
<goshawk> one more think
<goshawk> thing
<goshawk> the library name is tango
<goshawk> should i package it as libtango?
<gordonsyme> hyperair: ok, I'll give that a go. Thanks again
<hyperair> goshawk: see the debian library packaging guide
<hyperair> gordonsyme: if you're using git, you can use git clone git://git.debian.org/git/collab-maint/remuco-server.git
<hyperair> gordonsyme: i've updated the stuff there
<gordonsyme> hyperair: great, ta
<hyperair> =)
<vladimir_e> hi all, does anyone know why claws-mail-tools depends on claws-mail? it's a recommended package for Sylpheed and that forces Sylpheed users to install claws-mail
<bddebian> Heya gang
<sistpoty|work> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Heya sistpoty|work
<cody-somerville> vladimir_e, Probably a bug.
<cody-somerville> vladimir_e, please file one :)
<vladimir_e> cody-somerville, yes, wanted some insight before doing so
<\sh> et voila...google-perftools fixed
<ziroday> could anyone help me out with https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/GettingStarted?
<ziroday> I'm getting a 500 error
<vladimir_e> ziroday, working for me
<ziroday> vladimir_e: heh, appending the ? made it work, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/GettingStarted doesn't though
<maxb> ziroday: It works for me, try refresh (or Shift+Refresh)
<ziroday> maxb: must just be my day :)
<LucidFox> If I see a bug with only a patch attached rather than a debdiff, should I ask the patch's author to post a debdiff, or make my own upload and include the patch there?
<maco> make your own
<maco> not everyone that knows how to code knows how to make a debdiff. ive started going through and converting patches i find
 * LucidFox nods
<YokoZar> Quick sponsorship question: if I'm sponsoring someone else's debdiff without further changes, I'm supposed to leave their name in the changelog and manually sign it before uploading yes?
<directhex> afaik yes
<YokoZar> (this isn't listed in the sponsorship workflow page): https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Sponsorship/SponsorsQueue
<directhex> i.e. acknowledgement of who did the work
<directhex> i've been in a few changelog.Debian.gz files anyway
<YokoZar> How does launchpad know whose signature is on it?
<YokoZar> (eg that I uploaded it)
<YokoZar> because it tracks that too I think
<YokoZar> Also I'm not entirely sure of the command to make this manual signature (I'll put it in the wiki on the sponsorship page)
<fabrice_sp> Hi. A small question: can a package in universe depends on packages in multiverse?
<directhex> debuild takes a -k flag
<directhex> fabrice_sp, no, that package is a multiverse package by definition
<YokoZar> fabrice_sp: no, that package should then be moved to multiverse
<YokoZar> Although that has to be done manually I think
<YokoZar> fabrice_sp: It can recommend them though
<directhex> YokoZar, recommends is okay? i thought only suggests
<fabrice_sp> directhex, so what kind of bug report should I open to demote it? (it's for mythtv-status, that depends on libmyth-perl)
<fabrice_sp> or YokoZar
<YokoZar> directhex: I thought recommends was okay...that way when someone has multiverse unchecked in sources it won't freak out like it will with depends
<YokoZar> Only difference between recommends and suggests is install by default -- otherwise we'd need a third category (install by default unless repo is disabled) or something, which is what recommends does currently
<Turl> hi
<Turl> how can I call dh_desktop on cdbs?
<YokoZar> fabrice_sp: file a bug against the package on launchpad and just put that in the description "should be in multiverse" or "depends on a multiverse package but is in universe"
<fabrice_sp> YokoZar, ok. Thanks!
<fabrice_sp> For that request (move from universe to multiverse), should I subscribe u-u-s or archive admin directly?
<AnAnt> Hello, I am trying to create a pbuilder environment from the Jaunty beta ISO image as follows:
<AnAnt> sudo pbuilder --create  --distribution jaunty --mirror  "deb cdrom:[Ubuntu 9.04 _Jaunty Jackalope_ - Beta i386 (20090324)]/"
<AnAnt> and I've mounted the ISO on /cdrom/
<AnAnt> yet pbuilder gives this error:
<AnAnt> E: unknown location deb/dists/jaunty/Release
<lfaraone> AnAnt: run the command without "deb" and see what happens.
<AnAnt> E: unknown location cdrom:[Ubuntu/dists/jaunty/Release
<AnAnt> so ?
<lfaraone> AnAnt: did you use apt-cdrom to add the CD?
<AnAnt> lfaraone: apt-cdrom in what ?
<lfaraone> AnAnt: apt-cdrom is a utility.
<lfaraone> AnAnt: you use it to add CDs to your apt sources.
<AnAnt> lfaraone: I'm talking about pbuilder, apt-cdrom adds CD in /etc/apt/sources.list
<lfaraone> AnAnt: once you do that, apt should know to use it automagically.
<AnAnt> lfaraone: what has apt to do with pbuilder ?
<lfaraone> AnAnt: (pbuilder uses apt)
<lfaraone> AnAnt: *everything*
<AnAnt> lfaraone: anyways, the CD got added when I ran /cdrom/cdromupgrade
<AnAnt> lfaraone: pbuilder uses apt, but it doesn't get the mirrors from /etc/apt/sources.list
<AnAnt> lfaraone: it gets them either from command line or /etc/pbuilderrc
<maco> lfaraone: pbuilders have their own /etc/apt/sources.list though
<maco> you can login to pbuilders
<AnAnt> ah, done it
<AnAnt> --mirror file:/cdrom
<AnAnt> got it from debian  bug 1666651
<ubottu> Error: Could not parse data returned by Debian: HTTP Error 404: No such bug (http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=1666651;mbox=yes)
<AnAnt> got it from debian  bug 166651
<ubottu> Debian bug 166651 in pbuilder "pbuilder: please support CDs" [Wishlist,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/166651
<superm1> AnAnt, add that to the wiki page if you can
<AnAnt> well, this seems to have a problem on subsequent pbuilder update though
<AnAnt> oh, I got other errors
<AnAnt> W: Failed to fetch file:/cdrom/dists/jaunty/main/binary-i386/Packages  File not found
<AnAnt> that causes pbuilder to abort with error
<AnAnt> I see that there is /cdrom/dists/jaunty/main/binary-i386/Packages.gz
<AnAnt> ie. gzip'ed
<ahasenack> are there people from Ubuntu QA here in this channel? I was wondering if we could get https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/console-setup/+bug/309042 fixed for jaunty at least
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 309042 in console-setup "Intrepid: no "brazil - thinkpad" keyboard layout option anymore" [Undecided,New]
<nxvl> nixternal: ping
<AnAnt> why is it trying to fetch cdrom/dists/jaunty/main/binary-i386/Packages instead of cdrom/dists/jaunty/main/binary-i386/Packages.gz ?!
<nixternal> nxvl: pongalong
<nxvl> nixternal: whouldn't you want to run the session of 23rd April, 00:00 UTC??
<nixternal> what session?
<nxvl> nixternal: http://ubuntupackaging.wordpress.com/2009/03/31/packaging-training-kicking-off-this-week/
<nixternal> nxvl: unsure if I can commit to that just yet, but I would be interested in some Kubuntu packaging stuff on that list
<nxvl> nixternal: that's fine, we are going to do it every thursday
<nxvl> nixternal: rotatin hours like it said there
<nxvl> nixternal: i'm just trying to file the white space of the 23th
<nixternal> let me find someone for you
<nxvl> nixternal: \o/
<nxvl> nixternal: even a 15 minutes session + Q&A is welcomed
<AnAnt> heimdal-dev is a virtual package ?!
<AnAnt> what's wrong with pbuilder ?!
<cody-somerville> nothing
<cody-somerville> pbuilder uses apt
<DktrKranz> AnAnt, it's not
<AnAnt> pbuilder is failing to build a package because it thinks that heimdal-dev, libfsplib-dev, libmozjs-dev and libtre-dev are virtual packages !
<jpds> AnAnt: Do you ave universe enabled in your pbuilder setup?
<AnAnt> yup
<AnAnt> and done pbuilder update
<fabrice_sp> Hi DktrKranz. It seems Bug #345263 is stuck. What should be the next step?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 345263 in ubuntu "Sync php-mdb2 2.4.1-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)." [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/345263
<AnAnt> how does it get the notion that those packages are virtual ?
<fabrice_sp> AnAnt, try to login to pbuilder, and check what is the content of source.list
<AnAnt> fabrice_sp: I just done that, found that universe & multiverse are enabled there, so I logged using --save-after-login, and enabled them, and now running apt-get update
<fabrice_sp> ok
<AnAnt> thanks
<fabrice_sp> good luck with pbuilder :-)
<AnAnt> thanks
<cjwatson> ahasenack: 309042> surely getting bugs fixed is a function of development, not QA
<ahasenack> cjwatson: I was under the impression QA was the first step: they would triage it and assign it the right milestone
<cjwatson> ahasenack: yay paperwork
<ahasenack> cjwatson: :)
<cjwatson> I'll deal with it, I might actually get it right
<cjwatson> the keyboard subsystem is difficult and I'm not aware that QA is deeply familiar with the ins and outs of it (I wouldn't blame them)
<ahasenack> cjwatson: \o/ thanks!
<cjwatson> ahasenack: but just as a basic comment, the set of layouts and variants that exists is actually under the control of xkeyboard-config, not console-setup
<cjwatson> ahasenack: the reason it wasn't changelogged in console-setup is that console-setup just gets updated from xkeyboard-config on each rebuild
<ahasenack> aha
<cjwatson> I'll make sure that it isn't getting left out for some other reason before reassigning the bug
<maco> is there a way to specify to dh_make whether its gplv2 or v3?
<maco> or does it not have to be that specific?
<marnold> maco, iirc no
<maco> is that to both?
<cjwatson> maco: why not just edit it after dh_make has finished? it's only meant to be a first pass
<maco> cjwatson: well the second question was to ask if the control file has to say which gpl version or just "gpl"
<cjwatson> maco: licensing goes in debian/copyright rather than debian/control; but yes, it should say which GPL version is involved, although that might be "v2 or later" or similar
<maco> oops. ok thank you
#ubuntu-motu 2009-04-01
<maco> both authors and artists go in debian/copyright, right?
<RAOF> maco: Anyone with copyright on files that you're distributing goes in debian/copyright.
<maco> ok
<RAOF> maco: There are quite frequently non-code files for which artists have copyright in packages we distribute; those files are treated no differently to code files.
<maco> alright
<dtchen> generally, if it's distributed, it needs to be documented.
<jdong> oh audio gods, any hints on skype spinning a 2.4GHz core 2 duo and glitching sound in Jaunty?
<jdong> in fact even totem seems to induce high CPU usage
<jdong> I'd like to point my finger at pulseaudio?
<mrooney> jdong: yeah, I have similar problems with skype :)
<jdong> mrooney: yeah, it's kinda absurd a 2.4GHz modern CPU can't do videoconferencing without dying :)
<vadi2> Hi. I have a question semi-related to packaging. Are configure.ac scripts in bash?
<Snova> No.
<Snova> They are technically M4, the macro language that Autoconf uses. (At least I'm 99% sure)
<Snova> Autoconf basically runs M4 on configure.ac to produce configure.
<vadi2> I see
<vadi2> is the `which file` equivalent available in them?
<Snova> Yes. You can write shell script in them directly.
<vadi2> I need to fix a script to detect where a file path is hardcoded to instead locate it
<vadi2> Alright, thanks
<cjwatson> you should read 'info autoconf'
<cjwatson> it's in the autoconf-doc package
<lifeless> Snova: writing shell directly is usually the wrong thing to do though
<cjwatson> there are macros specifically for finding programs
<Snova> lifeless: Probably, but I don't use Autoconf, I just remember how it works. :)
<cjwatson> for example, AC_CHECK_PROG
<cjwatson> (or AC_PATH_PROG, or various others depending on exactly what you're doing)
<vadi2> where can I find a list of AC_CHECK's?
<vadi2> I need to find out where is dh_make on the system
<cjwatson> 02:30 <cjwatson> you should read 'info autoconf'
<cjwatson> 02:30 <cjwatson> it's in the autoconf-doc package
<vadi2> Reading..
<cjwatson> you might want to spend a bit of time figuring out how to use info if you aren't used to it; or the manual is on the web at http://www.gnu.org/software/autoconf/manual/index.html
<vadi2> it's ok just want to fix one thing
<cjwatson> autoconf is not easy to dip into unless you know it well; I really do strongly recommend familiarising yourself with it rather than trying to monkey-patch
<cjwatson> you don't have to read it cover-to-cover, but you do need more of the basics than can be guessed
<cjwatson> it's worth learning about for packaging purposes anyway
<vadi2> well, fine, since this is for an app that makes packages I suppose that is necessary knowledge then
<RAOF> You will undoubtedly at some point be required to patch someone's broken configure, so... ;)
<mistya> I just installed ubuntu. it's fantastic! Thank's dev. Good Job
<jdong> mistya: always great to hear happy users :)
<dholbach> good morning
<iulian> Good morning dholbach.
<dholbach> hi iulian
<Toadstool> good morning
<verwilst> hellow!
<verwilst> i've compiled the zabbix-1.6.3-1 deb, but it seems like the debconf zabbix-frontend-php/zabbix-server doesn't exist
<verwilst> how can i check/add it?
<verwilst> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=522076 for more info
<ubottu> Debian bug 522076 in zabbix "zabbix-frontend-php postinst FAIL" [Unknown,Open]
<verwilst> i want to PPA it, so :)
<goshawk> what is the command to generate manpages from program --help?
<maxb> help2man? :-)
<goshawk> maxb: thanks
<directhex> hm. mythbuntu april fool's is a bit mean
<Elbrus> directhex: does the deb do anything?
 * Elbrus not living in the states and not on 64bits.
 * Elbrus doesn't even have a tv
<theseinfeld> did you see the bugmenot april's fool! Hilarious!!!
<theseinfeld> directhex
<directhex> no
<bddebian> Heya gang
<jpds> 729
<jpds> Grrr.
<white> hi, anyone here knows how I could make a kmail template that invokes a shell script to parse the body of an email?
<jpds> http://tuxradar.com/content/ubuntu-rewrite-linux-kernel-using-mono
<directhex> jpds, awesome. now let sabdfl know about it in #ubuntu-devel ;)
<directhex> jpds, i can offer you a statement from Novell
<directhex> "that t-shirt is ugly"
<jpds> directhex: Heh. :)
<sistpoty|work> hm... can someone sponsor me an upload of faumachine? (got my signing key not around at work) http://spooky.informatik.uni-erlangen.de/~sistpoty/faumachine/faumachine_20090302-0ubuntu1_to_0ubuntu2.debdiff
<fidji> didrocks: hi, didier, have you some times for me ?
<sistpoty|work> OTOH I could wait until I get home, of course *g*
<jpds> sistpoty|work: Sure.
<sistpoty|work> jpds: oh, thanks :) (/me is a little bit embarrased to not have seen the missing dependency on the -data package earlier on *g*)
<jpds> sistpoty|work: All done.
<sistpoty|work> jpds: thanks a lot :)
<jpds> Machts nicht.
<sistpoty|work> heh
<DktrKranz> sistpoty|work: re bug 329042, we're catching each other :)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 329042 in boost "Boost 1.38 in Jaunty" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/329042
<sistpoty|work> DktrKranz: heh
<quentusrex> Does anyone know how to program a listener for /dev/input/* devices?
<ScottK> DktrKranz and sistpoty|work: I think the answer for 1.38 is no.
<ScottK> We'll get it from Debian in Karmic and no need to sweat it.
<sistpoty|work> ScottK: yes, agreed... and we can backport it then
<ScottK> Yes.
 * DktrKranz agrees
<sistpoty|work> (which I think we *should* do, to allow porting of applications in case the api changed)
<ScottK> Yes.  It's boost.  The API changed.
<sistpoty|work> heh
<ScottK> 1.38 will be the boost for squeeze, so we'll get most of that from Debian anyway.
<sistpoty|work> ah, cool :)
<DktrKranz> ScottK: sistpoty|work, we have only eight packages remaining to finish python 2.6 transition (wrt uninstallability), is it fine to file bug reports (if not already present) and milestoning them for RC or Release?
<sistpoty|work> DktrKranz: makes sense to me
<ScottK> DktrKranz: Just put them as Medium priority since we aren't proposing the release be delayed for them.
<DktrKranz> ok. I'll have a round at them to see if I can fix some this evening and eventually mark the other ones accordingly, thanks.
<vadi2> Is it possible to make dh_make not ask for a confirmation?
<kees> ScottK, nhandler, DktrKranz, sistpoty|work: anyone around to approve a feature-freeze-exception?  (bug 352801)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 352801 in ubuntu "FFe: Ubuntu-specific SELinux policy package from Tresys" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/352801
<sistpoty|work> kees: already looking at it ;)
<ScottK> kees: You've got an archive-admin lined up to review it?
 * kees hugs sistpoty|work
<sistpoty|work> kees: well, that's only 50% of a granted FFe :P
<kees> ScottK: yeah, I was poking slangasek about it earlier.
<kees> sistpoty|work: heh.
<kees> (this should also solve 345801)
<ScottK> kees: Isn't jdstrand one now?
<kees> ScottK: he is, yes.
<ScottK> You're probably in a better position to convince him.... ;-)
<ScottK> kees: Approved.
<kees> \o/
<kees> though I need 2 +1's, is that right?
<sistpoty|work> kees: yep
<sistpoty|work> kees: unless a delegate handles it
<ScottK> kees: Yes and I was the 2nd.
<kees> oooh, and there it is.  *reload*  *dance*
<vadi2> How would one go about packaging an app that uses the waf build system instead of autotools? update the 'rules' file by hand?
<azeem> vadi2: you'll have to change your rules for it, yes
<vadi2> is there a programmatic way available for changing it?
<azeem> I don't think so
<vadi2> alright
<DktrKranz> ScottK: is your syncs processed with syncpackage script?
<DktrKranz> s/is/are/
<ScottK> DktrKranz: yes.
<DktrKranz> you're archive-admin, are other MOTUs entitled to use it (if in a hurry)?
<nixternal> the time has come for me to step down from the MC and MOTU, thank you everyone for all of the fish. My reasoning is in my last email concerning the MC Meeting today that went to the motu-council mailing list...enjoy and best wishes
<DktrKranz> nixternal: from MOTU too?
<ScottK> DktrKranz: We aren't supposed to.
<DktrKranz> ScottK: good, thanks.
<maxb> Looking at the ubuntu-docs postinst... why does it need to dpkg --compare-versions at all? (Asking -motu not -devel because I'm asking in a "packaging technique" context and -devel is full of a debate at the moment)
<nixternal> maxb: can you pastebin the postinst?
<nixternal> DktrKranz: nah man, having fun with april foolz
<maxb>         if [ -d "$link" ] && ! [ -L "$link" ] && dpkg --compare-versions "$2" lt-nl 9.04.6; then
<maxb>                 rmdir "$link"; ln -s ../../ubuntu-docs/libs "$link"
<maxb> is the interesting bit
<maxb> oh, and that is in a case block for "configure" invocation of the postinst
<maxb> The point being, if you're configuring a version of a package that ships $link as a symlink, and you want to clear out empty directories that might be stale on the system, why do you care about the previous version?
<nixternal> you are not lying, that is an interesting bit
<nixternal> maxb: in #ubuntu-doc there is a fellow by the name of mdke, he could probably answer that best for you
<james_w> congratulations bdmurray
<bdmurray> thanks james_w!
<bobbo> congrats bdmurray!
 * dholbach hugs bdmurray
<nxvl> where was the MC meeting? a call?
 * sebner waves at dholbach and nxvl :)
<ivoks> alert: broken python-pastescript in jaunty
 * ivoks is testing solution
<geser> nxvl: it was in #ubuntu-meeting, an impromptu MC meeting to process bdmurray's application due to bad scheduling the last time
<nxvl> mm, it should by the time my internet was down, i don't have the logs
 * nxvl opens irclogs.ubuntu.com
 * sebner waves at dholbach and nxvl and geser of course :D
 * geser waves back to sebner
<ivoks> yep, works
 * nxvl waves with no aparent reason
<ivoks> who do i have to surbscribe to allow ffe for universe package? :)
<sebner> nxvl: waving back is the reason :P
<nxvl> motu-sru
<LucidFox> http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=latest+ubuntu+release <-- o_O
<LucidFox> (probably common knowledge here already, though)
<ivoks> nxvl: motu-sru is for stable releases, right?
<ivoks> nxvl: jaunty isn't stable yet, but requires a sync from debian
 * ivoks goes to wiki
<nxvl> MM
<nxvl> IIRC it does the exceptions too
<nxvl> let me re-check
<ivoks> motu-release
<nxvl> ivoks: yup, motu-release
<nxvl> ivoks: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess
<ivoks> nxvl: thanks', i'm already at it :)
<ivoks> there
<jdong> any sound gods around with experience on why skype in particular acts badly with jaunty pulse?
<jdong> the two combined spin a core when playing sound, even the ringtone, about 25% user and 25% system time on a core 2 duo
<jdong> (it used to use 20% combined CPU on intrepid but in jaunty it causes stuttering and is more or less unusable)
 * hyperair never knew that cores spin
<_ruben> hyperair: nowadays the fans are fixed, and the cores spin
<hyperair> _ruben: interesting eh
<mbana> hi, who packs adobe reader for intrepid?
<sebner> mbana: nobondy?
<mbana> no there's a channel
<sebner> mbana: channel? adobe reader is not available in the official sources and it won't be in future
<mbana> no it's available in a repo, i forget which
<sebner> mbana: this is the channel for *official* ubuntu packages ;) not for someone's repo with someone's packages
<mbana> no it's an official ubuntu repo
<sebner> mbana: I even can think of partner?!
<mbana> never mind i found it; http://www.medibuntu.org/
<sebner> mbana: medibuntu != official ubuntu
<cody-somerville> Canonical might provide it via the Partner repository
<sebner> cody-somerville: but it isn't available *for now* IIRC, right?
 * cody-somerville isn't sure.
<cody-somerville> But I wonder where the correct place to ask question about the partner repository is
<sebner> cody-somerville: -devel?
<cody-somerville> Probably but I don't think thats really the right place
<sebner> cody-somerville: well, there isn't something like ubuntu-partner yet AFAIK ^^
<Amaranth> That is not the right place
<sebner> I refer to a channel
<Amaranth> the guys working on partner are completely separate
<Amaranth> I don't think there is a place, honestly
<cody-somerville> AFAIK, partner is powered by contractors from the community for the most part
<cjwatson> cody-somerville: I don't think that's true, no
<cjwatson> Brian Thomason does most of it, I believe (though often in conjunction with the partner in question); he's "iamfuzz" on IRC
<cjwatson> I think generally you can file bugs in Ubuntu about packages in the partner repository, though
<cody-somerville> Thats probably the case now
<cody-somerville> but I think ScottK did some work on it at one time
<mbana> what are you guys talking about
<cjwatson> cody-somerville: yes, ScottK helped out with a review at one point (I was the manager for that contract ...)
 * cody-somerville nods.
<cjwatson> cody-somerville: but I think he would be the first to deny that he powered the partner repository :-) I don't know of any other similar instances
<cody-somerville> lol
<cody-somerville> Maybe "powered" was a bit strong
<vadi2>  Is it possible to make dh_make not ask for a confirmation?
<hyperair> vadi2: why would you want to do that?
<vadi2> I need to call it from a script
<vadi2> where I do the confirmation already on my own
<Elbrus> vadi2: I am not sure, but why would you want to run dh_make from script.
<vadi2> that is a different topic :)
<Elbrus> it needs manual attention afterwards anyway
<Elbrus> IIRC
<vadi2> no, I provide it all the arguments it needs, so it doesn't need attention.
<quadrispro> savvas: ping
<savvas> quadrispro: hey :)
<quadrispro> savvas: nice to meet you :) i'm taking a look at bug 341258
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 341258 in gpixpod "Depends: python (< 2.6) but 2.6.1-0ubuntu3 is to be installed" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/341258
<savvas> same here hehe
 * savvas refreshes his memory :P
<quadrispro> savvas: I have some questions
<savvas> sure :)
<savvas> ask away!
<quadrispro> I think there's 2 way to follow to make the package ready for python 2.6: 1) by fixing the makefile 2) by using setup.py script
<quadrispro> is it right, isn'it?
<quadrispro> looking at your patch it seems you're trying to follow both those ways! :D
<savvas> oops, let me check
<quadrispro> savvas: perhaps I'm wrong eh :)
<quadrispro> but you touched both the Makefile and debian/rules
<quadrispro> by disabling the use of make in debian/rules (it could be ok) and, in the same time, tuning the Makefile :P
<savvas> um hold a sec
<savvas> I think I removed the direct changes and made patches instead
<savvas> hm..
<savvas> is this package from debian? I'll check
<savvas> wheow no :p
<quadrispro> no no, -0ubuntuX
<savvas> quadrispro: ok, the direct changes in http://launchpadlibrarian.net/23813555/gpixpod_0.6.2-0ubuntu6_fixed.debdiff revert to the original files, that are in orig.tar.gz
<quadrispro> (sometime I could go away for some moment, Italy's playing :))
<savvas> ok :)
<quadrispro> savvas: ah! ok, now I understand but... why??
<quadrispro> :)
<savvas> lintian-happy
<savvas> it had dpatch in its build-depends
<quadrispro> yes, savvas but it may be good only rebuild (by patching all the necessary things), then submitting all other changes to debian
<quadrispro> in this way we'll sync them later
<savvas> but.. gpixpod is not in Debian :\ http://packages.qa.debian.org/g/gpixpod.html
<quadrispro> savvas: sorry LOL
<quadrispro> ok
<quadrispro> then ok
<quadrispro> lol
<savvas> but wait!!
<didrocks> hyperair: around?
<savvas> I think I didn't check the Standards-Version update
<savvas> quadrispro: I made it 3.7.3 -> 3.8.0 without going through the checklist, give me 5 minutes and I'll let you know :)
<quadrispro> ok, perfect
<savvas> quadrispro: ok, I think no changes required for standards-version changed, except for "Homepage:" inclusion in debian/control :P
<quadrispro> ok
<quadrispro> savvas: could you prepare new patch?
<savvas> sure
<savvas> a few seconds :)
<savvas> quadrispro: http://paste.ubuntu.com/142339/
<savvas> ( this the difference between the old _fixed.debdiff and new.debdiff patch: http://paste.ubuntu.com/142339/ )
<savvas> er sorry
<savvas> ( the difference between the patches is: http://paste.ubuntu.com/142341/ )
<quadrispro> looks good
<quadrispro> building
 * savvas crosses fingers :)
<quadrispro> savvas: http://paste.ubuntu.com/142347/
<quadrispro> ciao tseliot
<savvas> in pbuilder?
<savvas> applying patch 01_about-window to ./ ... ok.
<savvas> applying patch 02_new-album to ./ ... ok.
<savvas> applying patch 10_gpixpod_python to ./ ... ok.
<savvas> applying patch 20_imgconvert_Makefile_fix to ./ ... ok.
<tseliot> quadrispro: ciao ;)
<savvas> aaaaah
<savvas> got it
<savvas> hold a sec
<quadrispro> savvas: no no, it happens before giving the package to pbuilder, anyway I'm working on it by getting your previous patch and tuning it
<savvas> quadrispro: try this one: wget http://paste.ubuntu.com/142349/plain -O plain
<savvas> (must be an extra line or something?)
<quadrispro> savvas: just working :)
<savvas> oki doki :)
<quadrispro> savvas: in debian/changelog would be better using *. - and + as shown here: http://paste.ubuntu.com/142351/
<quadrispro> savvas: building in progress -> http://localhost/jaunty/pool/gpixpod_0.6.2-0ubuntu6/gpixpod_0.6.2-0ubuntu6.buildlog
<quadrispro> eh, savvas, sorry -> http://home.alessiotreglia.com/jaunty/pool/gpixpod_0.6.2-0ubuntu6/gpixpod_0.6.2-0ubuntu6.buildlog
<savvas> quadrispro: oops, sorry, is it too late? should I change the - and + in changelog?
<quadrispro> savvas: just done
<quadrispro> * already
<quadrispro> and uploaded too :)
<savvas> I didn't know we had a policy about changelog and -/+, good to know :)
<quadrispro> savvas: only style-guidelines :)
<savvas> ok, still, good to know :P
<savvas> damn this cough is killing me, brb
<quadrispro> bye guys
<quadrispro> savvas: bye!
<savvas> bye !
<savvas> oh left :\
<savvas> FYI: Launchpad will be going offline for maintenance in three minutes.  :)
<savvas> this is weird.. my memory card reader stopped working
 * savvas wrong channel, ubuntu+1 :P
<savvas> why does openoffice.org-math have NoDisplay=true ?
<jpds> savvas: Best talk to calc about that.
<savvas> jpds: ok, thanks - I guess they're not online currently :)
#ubuntu-motu 2009-04-02
<savvas> hmm
<fmarier> I've got a question about LP#350732: I subscribed universe-sponsors to it in the hope that it will be picked up for Jaunty, however someone else marked it as "confirmed".  Does this mean that it will not be seen by the motu?
<fmarier> bug 350732
<fmarier> is this supposed to trigger a bot response?
<savvas> fmarier: yes, either that or bug #350732 (I also think LP: #350732 triggers it)
<savvas> anyway, you've followed the correct process :)
<fmarier> so "confirmed" is fine? I remember someone telling me that it was better for some reason to leave it as New until it was acked by a sponsor...
<savvas> I'm really not sure, but if I remember correctly the status shouldn't be changed after the sponsors are subscribed to it
<fmarier> ok, well as long as the bug is considered for Jaunty then I'm happy... the version of asterisk that's currently in there is pretty useless for anybody wanting to use encryption :(
<LucidFox> If a Debian package has the same upstream version but adds a new binary package, I suppose it's better not to merge it after FF?
<dtchen> there's no explicit reason not to if there are bugfixes
<dholbach> good morning
<Adila01> Depending where you are
 * nixternal hugs dholbach 
 * dholbach hugs nixternal back
<nixternal> hey, check the planet...could someone take a look at python-coherence bugs and see if you can help with that during the personal emergency please? if you can, please ping me and let me know...if I don't hear anything by morning, I will ask again
 * nixternal has an interview bright and early
<Hobbsee> nixternal: if you're going to play april fools day jokes, i wish you'd do it while it's actually april fools day in forward-countries.
<nixternal> porthost is going through a personal emergency and has 2 bugs #352653 and #338963 that he would like someone to look after while he is gone, looks like he will be gone for more than a week
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 352653 in coherence "python-coherence: /usr/share/dbus-1/services/org.Coherence.service should be included" [Low,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/352653
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 338963 in coherence "Totem: loading "Coherence DLNA/UPnP Client" results in: "ImportError: No module named coherence.ui.av_widgets" " [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/338963
<nixternal> Hobbsee: why? it is more fun that way, plus I am tired of this whole international thing, everyone just needs to get over it and set their clocks to CST (Chicago Standard Time) :p
<maco> or to UTC
<nixternal> GMT
<nixternal> do it right
<maco> nah, UTC
<maco> cuz the UK has summer time, like DST
<Hobbsee> heh
<nixternal> GMT!
<Adila01> EST
<nixternal> there is no such thing as 00:00 or Zero Hours...silly UTC
<maco> yeah there should be 00:01 through 24:00
<nixternal> that is what the Astronauts use, so we should use it too
<maco> though apparently at 00:00 UTC it's tomorrow, not still today
<maco> which cnfuses me
<nixternal> there should be 24:00 to 24:00
<maco> nixternal: wait! you were in the military! you should be used to Zulu
<nixternal> GMT is the civilian version and Zulu is the military version
<nixternal> the funny thing is, they all mean the same damn thing :p
 * nixternal goes to bed
<nixternal> g'nite
<dholbach> nightie nixternal
<maco> i thought GMT still observed summer time?
<dholbach> no
<dholbach> BST
<dholbach> British Summer Time
<maco> ooo
<dtchen> there's often confusion between the original measurement and the more colloquial timezone usage
<dtchen> in the former, utc is an approximation within 0.9 secs of gmt
<dtchen> in the latter, you have the infamous "but utc isn't gmt" junk
<dtchen> regardless, i trust `date -R'
<maco> not date -u?
 * nixternal trusts his clock in his vista task bar
<nixternal> ok, didn't go to bed yet, pkg updates :p
 * maco steals nixternal's clock
<maco> neener neener!
<nixternal> zsh + dpkg -l are not friends
<dtchen> packaging convention uses `date -R'
<maco> oh that
 * Hobbsee hands nixternal a \
<maco> dtchen: also, *why* do you know that 0.9 seconds of gmt thing?
<Toadstool> good morning
<mcnicholls> hi
<mcnicholls> what group do i subscribe if i want to get sponsorship on a package in multiverse?
<dholbach> mcnicholls: ubuntu-universe-sponsors
<mcnicholls> thanks Daniel ;-)
<dholbach> no worries
<mcnicholls> have got a package that needs rebuilding because of an NBS dep, but the package FTBFS. Would a merge be considered at this point in the cycle or would taking a specific patch from upstream and making a new ubuntu version be better?
<bddebian> Heya gang
<cody-somerville> hi
<bddebian> Hi cody-somerville
<cody-somerville> :)
<Pollywog> when I look for kmail bugs in launchpad, it replies "There is no project named 'kmail' registered in Launchpad"  Does that mean I cannot use Launchpad to find bugs in kmail or am I possibly using the wrong name for the project that includes kmail?
<Pollywog> that's it, I found kmail within kdepim
<fidji> hi
<fidji> how I can make a package for all distrib ?
<fidji> in changelog
<savvas> I don't think you can :) different distributions use different package versions
<savvas> you could build one for hardy and then use it for the rest, but I'm not sure
<savvas> rest = intrepid, jaunty
<fidji> for all ubuntu
<fidji> actually I use intrepid
<fidji> I see in some ppa, package for all ubuntu (intrepid, jaunty, ...)
<fidji> I wish do the same in mine
<fidji> https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-fr-scripts/+archive/ppa
<dyfet> fidji: In my case, I simply named each source set with ~distroname appended
<dyfet> fidji: hence, xxx~ppa1~hardy1, xxx~ppa1~intrepid1
<fidji> I must do one ppa for each ditroname ?
<fidji> distroname*
<dyfet> That seems to be the case, or at least it is what I did.
<fidji> ok thank's
<dyfet> Unless someone else has an alternate solution to offer :)
<fidji> there is a delay to see the latest build  package in synaptic ?
<dyfet> You mean from ppa dput and build, to finally being able to see and access newly built packages?
<fidji> I have 2 packages in the ppa
<fidji> but in synaptic I see only one
<dyfet> https://launchpad.net/~fidji+archive/ppa ?
<fidji> yep
<fidji> I see only ufrs-toolbox
<fidji> https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-fr-scripts/+archive/ppa
<dyfet> Ah...that one has packages...
<dyfet> I notice that even though it shows build status complete, there is a delay before it adds it into the repo...
<fidji> ah ok, I mean that too
<fidji> so I waiting for ;)
<dyfet> If you go to http://ppa.launchpad.net/ubuntu-fr-scripts/ppa/ubuntu/ you can see if it made it all the way through...
<dyfet> And then you need to do a new apt-get update to refresh your machine after the repository is updated...
<fidji> I see Status Published
<dyfet> and http://ppa.launchpad.net/ubuntu-fr-scripts/ppa/ubuntu/pool/main/u/ seems to have both packages now
<fidji> yes
<dyfet> I think if you do reload package info in synaptic (under edit) you should see both now
<fidji> I do the reload but always onlys one packqge
<dyfet> hmm...
<fidji> I make a mistake with the name of the first release
<dyfet> Which one do you see?
<fidji> urfs-toolbox
<fidji> I whish see ufrs-math
<fidji> http://ppa.launchpad.net/ubuntu-fr-scripts/ppa/ubuntu/pool/main/u/ufrs-math/
<fidji> but I make a mistake with the first relase
<fidji> bad name
<fidji> ufrs-jeux_0.9.4-1_all.deb
<fidji> perhaps it's better if I delete an redo ?
<dyfet> I did not see your jeux one...
<dyfet> Oh yes, I do...
<fidji> ufrs-jeux_0.9.4-1_all.deb ufrs-math_0.9.4-2_all.deb
<fidji> I mean that's the problem
<dyfet> It could be...
<fidji> ok I delete and redo
<fidji> thank's for the help
<dyfet> Hmm...
<dyfet> ufrs-math - Pack ubuntu-fr-scripts Math
<dyfet> ufrs-jeux - Pack ubuntu-fr-scripts Math
<dyfet> ufrs-toolbox - BoÃ®te Ã  outils bash, perl, python
<dyfet> I get that from apt-cache search when I add your repo...
<fidji> yes I see that too
<fidji> I delete the 0.9.4-1
<dyfet> Both (maybe all 3) are installable from apt-get...
<fidji> work with apt-get
<fidji> so I wait for the deletion
<dyfet> okay
<maco> Can anyone force a rebuild on seahorse-plugins 2.26.0-0ubuntu2 for hppa?  There were broken dependencies at the time
<dtchen> hobbsee: / Riddell:  ^giveback, please
<dtchen> d'oh
<ScottK> Did it build or FTBFS?
<ScottK> Got it
<ScottK> dtchen and maco: done.
<ScottK> dtchen: Anyone with upload rights for the package can do that now.
<maco> ScottK: thanks
<maco> ScottK: it failed to build only on that arch because epiphany was broken at the time
<ScottK> maco: That's not a rare thing.
<maco> ScottK: dtchen said hppa gets behind because it's a port
<ScottK> hppa gets behind particularly because the hppa buildd's are VERY slow and that particular port is the least well maintained.
<ScottK> You'll see generally that powerpc (for example) keeps up reasonably well.
<maco> dtchen: are built-in mics still busted all over the place?
<dtchen> yes
<dtchen> well, if one is extremely unlucky
<maco> so if someone reports that everything but built-in mic works with a certain quirk on Jaunty, does that still mean "wrong quirk" or is it "right quirk, just busted"?
<maco> (mine works right now, but I can't figure out how to make Wengo or Ekiga use PulseAudio's capture device)
<dtchen> err
<dtchen> "just busted" implies wrong qurik
<dtchen> quirk*
<dtchen> those two things are non-orthogonal
<dtchen> meaning jack sensing and quirks are tied
<maco> i thought there were many cases happening in jaunty only where internal mics regressed
<dtchen> there are, and they're due to quirk regressions
<dtchen> not *just* jack sensing regressions
<maco> so do they mean it's the wrong quirk to use or that its the right quirk to use bt that the quirk is slightly broken and will be fixed?
<blueyed> Can you debug apport hooks of a package, without actually sending a bug? (e.g. by using staging.launchpad.net) I could fake an entry for launchpad.net to the staging IP in /etc/hosts maybe.. - anything better?
<dtchen> maco: they're the same in this case
<maco> dtchen: so assuming those quirk regressions were caused by trying to fix something else, would the correct solution be to have 2 similar quirks (1 old behaviour, 1 new behaviour) and divide up the quirks table entries between them?
<maco> (based on what worked only in intrepid v. only in jaunty)
<dtchen> maco: err, meaning the foo_cfg_tbl[] or a wiki table?
<maco> foo_cfg_tbl[]
<dtchen> division would be bad
<dtchen> step one is to fix the jack sense regression
<dtchen> step two is to filter the quirk regressions
<maco> what does jack sensing have to do with the internal mic? shouldnt that only break the plugin type?
<jdong> directhex: what are your feelings on MD 2.0 final?
<dtchen> maco: jack sensing is everywhere now
<jdong> dtchen: do you have any magical insight on jaunty + skype's insane CPU usage?
<jdong> skype almost certainly shares the blame but it's regressed from Intrepid
<dtchen> geez, when it rains it pours
<jdong> dtchen: haha I'm sorry :)
<directhex> jdong, i have a standing feature freeze. it's a dead cert for jaunty.
<dtchen> no, i'm just being bombarded on all sides by alsa questions from eric sandeen, you guys, etc., etc.
<jdong> dtchen: I figured ;-) but that's what happens when you spring to life.
<dtchen> yeah, well, i'm going back to work
<jdong> directhex: awesomeness; yeah I've been screwing around with the new release and it's quite nice.
<dtchen> lunch spent doing bug stuff isn't really lunch
<jdong> no, it isn't :)
<jdong> I'll ambush you at a later time
 * jdong retriggers the script
<directhex> jdong, it's waiting on 3 things: meebey getting home from work, some gentle bumping of changelogs, and a dinstall run in debian which i can sync from
<jdong> directhex: ok, awesome; didn't mean to prod you, was just curious
<directhex> [18:51] <directhex> meebey, can i schedule some of your time for MD2.0 before the 9th? by all means, focus on smuxi for now, but that's FinalFreeze, and after that the paperwork gets messy
<directhex> was already on my TODO ;)
<asac> ScottK: could you check whether http://paste.ubuntu.com/143010/ is Kubuntu compatible please? .... hmm libbonobo..?
<ScottK> asac: Looking (and thanks for asking).
<asac> ok assume libbonobo* is not in there. anything else?
<ScottK> OK.  What package is this for?
<asac> ScottK: thunderbird
<asac> (without -gnome-support)
<ScottK> OK.  Looking.
<asac> liborbit2?
<asac> seems its gnome specific
<leonel> ScottK python-clamav for jaunty is done right ?
<ScottK> leonel: I haven't reviewed it yet.  It builds is all I can say for it.  If you'd review and provide any needed improvement, that'd be great.
<leonel> yesterday got time to work on it and found it was already fixed ..
<leonel> I'll test it
<ScottK> Great.
<ScottK> asac: It does.  I had it installed only for gtk-qt-engine
<asac> ScottK: ok. good so without libbonobo and liborbit the list looks kubuntu compatible, right?
<ScottK> asac: I think so. libart-2.0-2 I have installed due to klamav, but nothing in Main, so I think it's OK.
<asac> ScottK: right libart isnt a dependency of current tbird, so its likely gnome specific too
<ScottK> I can't promise there's nothing else, but it seems OK to me.
<MTecknology> There's a bug in vim, when you update, it wants to update a file in /etc that a user never changed, but the update process thinks that the user made a change. What makes this happen?
<MTecknology> if this is the right place to figure it out
<jpds> MTecknology: Do you know which file it wants?
<MTecknology> jpds: I want to create a patch for this - but I have no clue where to start
<sbeattie> jpds: it's /etc/vim/vimrc.tiny
<MTecknology> sbeattie: should I not bother touching the issue?
<jpds> MTecknology: You'd have to download the source package, make changes to it, and upload a debdiff to a bug report on Launchpad; https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/HowToFix - outlines the process.
<sbeattie> MTecknology: not at all, I don't know what causes it, either.
<jpds> sbeattie: Is there a bug report already?
<MTecknology> 354111
<MTecknology> bug 354111
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 354111 in vim "vim-tiny postinst asks about changes to an unmodified /etc/vim/vimrc.tiny file" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/354111
<jpds> How odd.
<MTecknology> jpds: I've been looking at the source of vim-tiny, but I don't know how to package or what would cause that :p
<MTecknology> it did happen to me too
<jpds> MTecknology: I guessing a changed checksum in the configuration files.
<jpds> sbeattie: Does debconf let you view the difference between the file and the proposed one?
<sbeattie> jpds: yes, the difference in that is what's in the description.
<GuyFromHell> So the wiki says I am to seek a developer after uploading a patch, i assume that would be here? this is in reference to #337394
<sbeattie> jpds: I have both files in the vm available (I had it install the maintainer's version), if you'd like me to attach them to the bug report.
<james_w> GuyFromHell: I think Mirco is the best person to review that, and he is already assigned to the bug, so he may well review it tomorrow
<GuyFromHell> james_w, alright, i'll leave it as is then for now. thanks
<MTecknology> jpds: are you working on that issue then?
<james_w> GuyFromHell: thanks for working on it
<jpds> MTecknology: No, just thinking what could be the problem. :)
<MTecknology> jpds: care to think out loud in a query?
<jpds> sbeattie: No the diff is enough, thanks.
<MTecknology> anyone wanna help me fix a tiny insignificant bug?
<MTecknology> I'm mostly trying to fix it for experience, but it has been reported
<james_w> which bug?
<MTecknology> bug 354111
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 354111 in vim "vim-tiny postinst asks about changes to an unmodified /etc/vim/vimrc.tiny file" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/354111
<james_w> ah, it may be small, but I don't think it's trivial to fix
<james_w> if you can get an intrepid chroot that causes the problem when upgraded then that will help a lot
<MTecknology> james_w: I'm looking at the 7.1.314 and 7.2.079 versions of README_os2.txt file - I know that's the file it's referring to
<MTecknology> james_w: wanna help me learn how to do that?
<james_w> what's README_os2.txt?
<MTecknology> set path=%path%;C:\vim\vim71 ; set path=%path%;D:\editors\vim\vim71
<MTecknology> the two lines changed to vim72 in the latest build
<MTecknology> there's a few other lines that changed, but that's the jist of it
#ubuntu-motu 2009-04-03
<james_w> that's not the file that it is complaining about though?
<MTecknology> no, I assumed that's where it was happening at
<MTecknology> would you be willing to help me fix this in a query? - like I said - /me is noob to this stuff
<james_w> in here is better
<MTecknology> I want to learn how this whole process works and I figured practice is the best place :)
<james_w> partly so others can help or learn
<MTecknology> ok
<MTecknology> so - the chroot
<james_w> and partly because I'm supposed to be doing something else :-)
<james_w> do you understand what conffiles are?
<MTecknology> oh
<james_w> in the dpkg sense that is
<MTecknology> I've never seen the word conffiles before
<james_w> ok, no problem
<james_w> a package can mark certain files as "conffiles"
<james_w> this means that dpkg will handle them differently to any other file
<james_w> normally when a package is upgraded all the old files are overwritten with the new versions
<james_w> this means that if you modify them your changes will be lost when you upgrade
<james_w> if that was to happen for configuration files that you are *supposed* to edit, then it would be bad
<james_w> so dpkg treats these files differently
<MTecknology> ok - I know where you're going now :)
<james_w> when it installs the first version of the package it records the md5sum of the file that it puts on disk
<james_w> it does that in /var/lib/dpkg/info/*.conffiles
<james_w> have a look at that now
<james_w> then when it upgrades the package it first checks if the new version of the file in the .deb is different to the old one. If it is the same it does nothing with it.
<james_w> if it has changed then it starts the process of installing it
<james_w> but first it has to check if you modified the file
<james_w> it gets the md5sum of the file on disk
<james_w> if that matches what it recorded originally then it overwrites the file, as you haven't modified it
<james_w> and writes the new md5sum in to the .conffiles file so that it can do the same next time
<MTecknology> so the md5sum that it's keeping for what the old copy was is probably wrong?
<james_w> if the md5sum doesn't match then you have modified it
<james_w> so it prompts you
<james_w> exactly, the file isn't modified, but what is on disk isn't what is recorded
<james_w> that could be a few things
<MTecknology> I have the md5sum of what the old file should be
<james_w> such as another package editing the file in its upgrade scripts(which is forbidden)
<james_w> or the sequence of upgrades that Steve did led to inconsistency for other reasons (such as a mistake when changing the "owner" of the file)
<james_w> you are in an intrepid chroot?
<MTecknology> no - no idea how
<MTecknology> but I did have this same error happen to me and I saw it pop up a few other places - jsut fyi
<james_w> that's fine
<james_w> when was the last time you installed fresh?
<MTecknology> about a month ago w/ 9.04
<MTecknology> I did a fresh 9.04 vm today
<james_w> and you saw it upgrading that?
<MTecknology> no updates to it yet
<james_w> I'm interested because Steve started from hardy, and the more we can narrow it down, the less work that it is
<james_w> you said that you saw this prompt?
<MTecknology> I'll do updates on the vm
<MTecknology> ya
<MTecknology> I'm botting up the vm
<MTecknology> I'll do updates to it
<MTecknology> dloading 270 updates
<MTecknology> james_w: anything I should grab an md5sum of prior to letting the update finish?
<james_w> MTecknology: extract the md5sum recorded in /var/lib/dpkg/ and md5sum of the file on disk
<MTecknology> james_w: I just grabbed /var/lib/dpkg/info/*
<binarymutant> should I add a line to my changlelog for every bug I fix or are minor bugs not worth a changelog entry?
<cody-somerville> Put 'er all in
<cody-somerville> No need to have one per line though
<cody-somerville> You can have multiple on one line
<binarymutant> thanks for the info cody-somerville :)
<cody-somerville> np
<MTecknology> james_w: ran off for supper - apparently things went good this time
<james_w> ah
<Ampelbein> hi. i need help with a package upgrade, gnome-nds-thumbnailer to version 1.2.1. the current version is synced from debian and got a patch in debian/patches which doesn't seem to get applied. 'debian/rules patch' gives an error (dh: Unknown sequence patch (chose from: binary binary-arch binary-indep build clean install)) should i ask the debian-maintainer if that's intentional or just add the patch-target in the new version myself?
<MTecknology> james_w: so... how should I handle that bug report?
<MTecknology> james_w: do I need to now do a dist-upgrade from 8.10 -> 9.04 ?
<james_w> I think that would be useful
<james_w> if you install an intrepid chroot and then grab the information, then dist-upgrade, that will start to help
<james_w> have a look at debootstrap for creating a chroot
<MTecknology> create a chroot for an entire installation?
<james_w> do that, chroot in, and then install ubuntu-desktop
<james_w> they don't install everything by default
<james_w> actually, you may not need ubuntu-desktop
<dtchen> james_w: (thanks again for package-import- quite time-conserving)
<MTecknology> ubuntu-minimal ?
<james_w> dtchen: ah, cool, what do you use it for?
<cody-somerville> minimal is pulled in by bootstrap
<dtchen> james_w: everything
<james_w> MTecknology: ubuntu-standard perhaps
<MTecknology> ok
<james_w> dtchen: ah, cool :-)
<james_w> MTecknology: you need at least vim-tiny installed :-)
<MTecknology> james_w: any idiots guid to doing it?
<james_w> there's probably lots on debootstrap, it's pretty old and well used
<james_w> nothing to hand I'm afraid
<james_w> and I'm heading to bed
<james_w> g'night all
<MTecknology> james_w: but but but... what about when I get to the error? :P
<james_w> heh
<MTecknology> g'night - thanks for the lessons :)
<james_w> np
<james_w> thanks for working on the bug
<dtchen> bigon: Ampelbein has a question regarding dh7 and not-applied 01schema.patch in the cdbs -> dh7 conversion
<dtchen> bigon: err, for gnome-nds-thumbnailer
<dtchen> Ampelbein: probably a missing /rules hunk
<Ampelbein> oh. didn't see he was in here, sorry.
<MTecknology> I used debootstrap to install 7.04 - but networking isn't working
<MTecknology> I used debootstrap to install 7.04 - but it's not working right - http://pastebin.com/mb8317b2 ***
<MTecknology> that's a better question
<Ampelbein> dtchen: thanks. i changed debian/rules to http://paste.ubuntu.com/143206/ , is this ok or is there a new "way to go" with dh7?
<MTecknology> I'm curious - is there a point where people that are motu's start getting revenue from their work?
<binarymutant> MTecknology, motu is a volunteer job as far as I know
<binarymutant> MTecknology, looks good on a resume though :)
<ScottK> MTecknology: 7.04 is long out of support.
<MTecknology> binarymutant: how can people devote so much time to ubuntu and still have a job?
<MTecknology> ScottK: right?
<binarymutant> MTecknology, love of the community? or love of code maybe
<ScottK> A lot of the people involved are students.
<MTecknology> I'm sophmore in college
<ScottK> So you've got lots of free time.
<binarymutant> :P lols
<MTecknology> ya... a whole lot of it... :S
<MTecknology> oh! sarcasm :P
 * ScottK works a ~60 hour a week job and has a wife and 3 kids.  Trust me.  He has a lot of free time.
<MTecknology> oh! sarcasm :P
 * imbrandon yawns
<binarymutant> an hour a day could go a long way I think
<MTecknology> sry for repeat
<MTecknology> I've been pushing about 8+hr/day on this - blowing off work and homework
<MTecknology> and working on crap during classes
<binarymutant> :/
<binarymutant> MTecknology, made motu yet?
<MTecknology> nope
<imbrandon> MTecknology: thats not sustainable though
<imbrandon> :)
<MTecknology> imbrandon: it has been for about 1yr :P
<MTecknology> binarymutant: I'm not going for motuy
<binarymutant> MTecknology, have you applied for it yet? 8+ hours seems like a lot
<ScottK> OTOH, stuff that used to take me an hours or two is sometimes the work of minutes now that I know more.
<MTecknology> binarymutant: not working on motu
<imbrandon> ScottK: :)
<binarymutant> MTecknology, oh
<imbrandon> ScottK: work smarter, not harder ! right ?
<MTecknology> launchpad.net/ubuntu-drupal launchpad.net/drupal-projects launchpad.net/~mtecknology
<MTecknology> binarymutant: ^
<ScottK> Absolutely, but you've got to get up the learning curve first.
<ScottK> MTecknology: It seems very strange to me to call something ubuntu-drupal when it's not in Ubuntu?
<MTecknology> binarymutant: I'm going for bug control
<MTecknology> ScottK: hm?
<imbrandon> MTecknology: good work, i'd love to see ubuntu's drupal support come upto snuff before the next LTS, lord knows its sadly lacking
<imbrandon> would make my package management for work manytimes lighter :)
<MTecknology> imbrandon: ScottK: wiki.profarius.com/UbuntuDrupal
<ScottK> This topic does not exist yet
<binarymutant> MTecknology, the TOS on your site is pretty long :/
<MTecknology> binarymutant: profarius.com?
<binarymutant> ya
<MTecknology> err.....
<imbrandon> bad link
<MTecknology> wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDrupal
 * imbrandon wonders why he got pointed to the wiki
<imbrandon> heh
<MTecknology> explaining that ubuntu-drupal isn't it's own package
<imbrandon> great goals , only one huge huge huge missing one that keeps fortune 500 companies like the one i work for from using the Drupal in Ubuntu vs a Ubuntu Server + Drupal from drupal.org
<imbrandon> MTecknology: yea i'm pretty familiar with how ubuntu packages drupal, its my "day job" per se
<imbrandon> basicly that its 7 major revisions behind, a no no for security. so we roll our own for our clients like cartoonnetwork.de that just launched
<imbrandon> and others
<MTecknology> imbrandon: my drupal installs use latest source
<MTecknology> imbrandon: but ubuntu-drupal is an installation profile
<ScottK> Which gets back to a thing called ubuntu-drupal that doesn't use the Ubuntu Drupal.
<ScottK> It seems wrong to me.
<imbrandon> hrm, yea very wrong
<MTecknology> ScottK: oh, that's what you meant
<ScottK> Yes.
<MTecknology> ScottK: it doesn't matter whether use use latest or ubuntu version
 * ScottK suspects that if all the people doing work to not use the Ubuntu Drupal package put a small fraction of that effort into maintaining the Ubuntu package, it'd be quite usable for everyone.
<MTecknology> ScottK: what?
<imbrandon> ScottK: exactly, one thing i've had on my "todo" for 6 motnhs
<imbrandon> bus alas back to the time thing :)
<imbrandon> s/bus/but
<ScottK> I hear pretty regularly about "We use upstream drupal because the Ubuntu package is x, y, z ..."
<imbrandon> ScottK: yea, its not even useable
<ScottK> If those people would help out with the Ubuntu package, they would save time and effort in the long run and make things better for everyone.
<MTecknology> I think you're confused - the Ubuntu-Drupal package is a set of modules and a theme (installation profile) for drupal sites - aimed at LoCo teams
<imbrandon> MTecknology: yes we did at first, i think thats a very wrong name
<MTecknology> It used to be called Drupal-LoCo
<ScottK> MTecknology: You also mentioned using upstream drupal for your installs and not the Ubuntu package.
<MTecknology> but it's not a loco thing anymore so that's the name that everyone agreed on
<imbrandon> it should be like ubuntu-drupal-modules and ubuntu-drupal-themes , and be targeted to the version in the repos
<imbrandon> for ubuntu-drupal
<ScottK> Agreed.
<MTecknology> ScottK: I moved most of my drupal hosting to 1&1
<imbrandon> right but your project is just some modules and themes, thus a very wrong project / package name has been choosen
<imbrandon> IMHO
<MTecknology> launchpad.net/ubuntu-drupal-theme ; code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-drupal-modules
<imbrandon> ok so it looks like its been started
<imbrandon> whats the problem ?
<MTecknology> ?
<MTecknology> i never said there was
<MTecknology> you guys started attacking it :P
<imbrandon> not attacking, dont take it that way
<imbrandon> irc is hard to convey feelings, no feelings, just sugestions
<MTecknology> not exactly the word I meant
<imbrandon> but that project/wiki for /UbuntuDrupal is named wrong IMHO, makes confusion
<imbrandon> hrm, all this talk has me motivated to update the package
<ScottK> \o/
<imbrandon> ScottK: what point are we in the freeze/cycle ? i've been out for a few months
<ScottK> imbrandon: Post beta.  Feature Freeze.
<imbrandon> k, i'll make the updates now, but an upload looks like it will have to wait
<ScottK> imbrandon: For a drupal update I can wave a magic wand over it and make it OK.
<imbrandon> ahh nice , ok
<MTecknology> lol
<imbrandon> yea 6.3 is far too old to be usefull
<ScottK> imbrandon: Just file a bug asking for a feature freeze exception with a little whining about how broken the current package is an ping me.
<imbrandon> ScottK: kk
<MTecknology> imbrandon: fyi - 99.999% of the time, I'm a "go with repo" guy - but with drupal, the way I set it all up just made more sense
<imbrandon> MTecknology: understood, just trying to give a little advice from a long time ( and reciently inactive ) core-dev :)
<imbrandon> nice its actually broken out into drupal{5,6} for jaunty :) makes updates MUCH easier it looks like
<MTecknology> imbrandon: ya, I figure you know your stuff when every single change to the wiki gets emailed to you
<imbrandon> MTecknology: hahah you noticed ?
<MTecknology> ya
<MTecknology> did you actually sign up for (.*) ?
<imbrandon> actually i think i deavtivated all but a few pages a week or so ago
<imbrandon> no not .* but i had ALOT
<MTecknology> any reason for all of them?
<MTecknology> I'm guessing you didn't read them all
<imbrandon> at one point in time ( about 8 months ago ) i was a very active dev
<imbrandon> easy to keep tabs in email IMHO
<MTecknology> oh
<MTecknology> almost done dloading updates for 8.10
<imbrandon> job stole alot of my time, and i've slowly been ramping back up to speed
<MTecknology> job in a year is going to rip away all my time
<MTecknology> I've been trying to learn to code for drupal professionally so I can find a job either there on in it admin when I graduate
 * ScottK imagines 'guy who maintains drupal for Ubuntu' would be a decent resume bullet.
<imbrandon> yea, i'm a "professional" drupal module develoepr and wordpress plugin developer, if you can call it that, i get paid to code custom modules/plugins , so i guess i'm a "pro"
<wgrant> ScottK: Bullet as in a way to kill it?
<ScottK> Bullet as in item on a list, but maybe.
<imbrandon> wgrant: bullet , as in a UL item
<imbrandon> err <ul>
<wgrant> I know, I know, I was just expressing my dislike of PHP.
<imbrandon> ahhh :)
<MTecknology> I like php
<imbrandon> php pays the bills, so i cant compalin ( much )
<imbrandon> i wish it would fix my typing
<wgrant> Our development platform at $WORK is a nice combination of Python, PostgreSQL and Ubuntu. No PHP. It is good.
<imbrandon> isnt ajmitch still makin a living with php too ?
<ScottK> wgrant: dislike/realistic assessment
<MTecknology> I don't like pgsql
<wgrant> ScottK: Perhaps so.
<wgrant> MTecknology: Why not?
<imbrandon> ours is ubuntu LTS + apache + php5 + mysql/oracle ( and a standard eclipse ide with pdt installed )
<imbrandon> wgrant: ^^
<wgrant> It is hugely better than MySQL.
<MTecknology> wgrant: they way it works feels akward
<ScottK> I've consulted on some projects with really serious SQL people and they always prefer pg over mysql.
<ScottK> wgrant: Consider he likes php and it all falls into place.
<wgrant> ScottK: That's what I thought.
<wgrant> MTecknology: How?
<imbrandon> yea , mysql is still really young, its getting better with Sun's support, but still has a year or so to catch up to pg
<MTecknology> wgrant: when I played with it everything I read was talking about creating a user for it and using a certain user to interact with it, etc
<wgrant> MySQL claimed that it was a relational database for years before it had reasonable foreign key or transaction support.
<wgrant> MTecknology: It happens to have a pluggable security model, the default mode of which uses local user accounts (ident) authentication.
<imbrandon> yea no transactions and/or stored proc was a killer for a long time
<MTecknology> wgrant: oh - so if I changed that it woulda behaved the same?
 * ScottK recalls being in a conversation with a customer that was an all mysql shop and the project was being prototyped using pg.  They wanted to switch.  The answer was double the development time and the number of developers essentially.
<imbrandon> wow
<ScottK> IIRC it was lack of a CIDR data type that was the killer for that project.
<wgrant> MTecknology: It can behave almost identically to MySQL  with regard to authentication, but it's more flexible.
<MTecknology> oh
<MTecknology> maybe someday I'll play with it again
<MTecknology> atm - mysql does the job very well for me
<imbrandon> wget http://ftp.drupal.org/files/projects/drupal-6.10.tar.gz
<imbrandon> errr
<ScottK> Oh, forgot.  Also twice as much hardware too.
<MTecknology> why more hardware??
<MTecknology> is'mt pgsql supposed to be lighter/faster?
<ScottK> Because pg was substantially faster at what we were doing.
<wgrant> Does anybody know of any benefits that MySQL has over PostgreSQL? Apart from some rumoured PG speed issues that go away with tweaking...
<wgrant> Plus, until yesterday, there weren't a dozen approximately equal PostgreSQL forks.
<imbrandon> wgrant: project support, if your not doing it from scratch most everything support ( only sometimes ) MySQL
<ScottK> wgrant: You can only install one version at a time in Debian, so those multiple version transition issues go away.
<wgrant> ScottK: What version issues?
<ScottK> wgrant: That was sarcasm.  I think a great feature of the pg packaging in Debian/Ubuntu is you can have multiple versions installed at the same time.
<wgrant> ScottK: Ahhh, I see.
<ScottK> I think the mysql packaging is more basic.
<imbrandon> ScottK: well yea but MySQL runs multi instances with one ( set of ) binaries
<imbrandon> so no real need for more than one
<wgrant> MySQL packages are versioned, but 4.1 and 5.0 weren't coinstallable IIRC.
<ScottK> Yes.
<wgrant> That is, the package names are versioned.
<wgrant> That was very WTFy.
<ScottK> And 5.0/5.1 are in Ubuntu, but not Debian and I doubt that will last.
<imbrandon> ahh you ment diffrent versions not just diffrent instances of it
<ScottK> Yes
<imbrandon> debian has no 5.x ?
<imbrandon> ouch
<ScottK> Debian has 5.1 in experimental.
<imbrandon> wow, now i rember why i run ubuntu lts vs debian
<imbrandon> 5.x has been out and stable for AGES
<MTecknology> I have asp.net - it makes idiots think they have a clue how to write code
<MTecknology> http://pastebin.com/d3647f3b3
<savvas> what does that code do? :)
<imbrandon> asp.net isnt too bad
<MTecknology> savvas: right now, it breaks horribly
<imbrandon> savvas: nothing, thats the html markup , the real code is in the accompanying .cs filer
<imbrandon> files*
<MTecknology> http://www.dsustuff.com/cbarne/Lab8/Default.aspx
<savvas> imbrandon: so there's a <script> somewhere in the html file that the server processes?
<savvas> aaaah wait
<savvas> I got it :P
<imbrandon> not really, its named the same as the aspx, like Default.cs , and the webserver looks for it on run, and compile Default.dll and uses is like a MVC kinda thing
<imbrandon> asp.net is its own beaste
<imbrandon> ( or Default.vb , if you want VB.net vs. C#.net code )
<imbrandon> etc
 * wgrant stabs VB a few times.
<imbrandon> or Default.php if using PHP.net or Default.py for IronPython, etc. any .net compatable lang )
<imbrandon> you get the point
<savvas> yep :)
<savvas> thanks
<wgrant> PHP.net?
<wgrant> I want to go and kill somebody.
<imbrandon> 99% of asp.net code is done in c# though from what ive seen personaly
<MTecknology> i did asp.net coding for a year and never saw its worth
<imbrandon> wgrant: yea PHP and Python and Ruby etc all have .net counterparts/msil compilers
<imbrandon> dunno why one would use them, but they exist and are "supported"
<imbrandon> so really asp.net can be any language as long as it can be compiled into msil
<MTecknology> GAH!
<MTecknology> did this thing already get patched?
<MTecknology> I've been trying to reproduce and fix this thing for about 8hr today
<MTecknology> hopfully 8.10 -> 9.04 reproduces the error and I can pause the thing, create a snapshot, and then fight with it more
<AirBender> Hello guys
<AirBender> I'm having problems with some documentation packages
<AirBender> I think they're all from universe repo
<AirBender> the problem is triggered with a mal formed install-info command in the postinst script of the packages
<AirBender> the command lacks an argument with the destination directory
<ScottK> AirBender: What packages?
<AirBender> for example...
<ScottK> Please pastebin the exact errors.
<AirBender> texlive-base-bin-doc
<AirBender> ok
<AirBender> I will reproduce the last one, executing the command)I've commented it in the postinst script=
<AirBender> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/143246/
<AirBender> I have install-info 4.9 in my system
<AirBender> running jaunty, but I have the problem since intrepid
<AirBender> amd64
 * hyperair_ wonders what install-info is
<MTecknology> !info install-info
<ubottu> Package install-info does not exist in intrepid
<MTecknology> !info install-info jaunty
<ubottu> Package install-info does not exist in jaunty
<hyperair_> lol
<AirBender> the package is texinfo
<MTecknology> !find install-info
<ubottu> File install-info found in ddskk, dpkg, manpages-zh, texinfo
<MTecknology> oh
<hyperair> ooh cool
<AirBender> I think it manages how the information for the info "package" command is installed
<hyperair> ah
<hyperair> so what's this about anyywa
<DanMcGoo> hi
<DanMcGoo> I have a litlle problem with dpkg-buildpackage
<AirBender> for me is quite useless so far, but it's really anoying having to manually edit the postinst files anytime them fail
<DanMcGoo> it build my package correctly, but its exit code seems to be an error
<DanMcGoo> does anyone know why ?
<dtchen> DanMcGoo: you'll need to provide full output from the dpkg-buildpackage invocation
<dtchen> some of us are good at guessing, but you probably don't want that
<DanMcGoo> ok, so how can I provide the full output ?
<dtchen> e.g., pastebin
<hyperair> !pastebin
<ubottu> pastebin is a service to post multiple-lined texts so you don't flood the channel. The Ubuntu pastebin is at http://paste.ubuntu.com (make sure you give us the URL for your paste - see also the channel topic)
<DanMcGoo> yep I found it
<DanMcGoo> actually should I provide you evrything or only the last lines ?
<dtchen> full output
<DanMcGoo> I don't think the make ouput will help you so much as far as my package builds correctly
<DanMcGoo> ok ^^
<AirBender> ScottK: nano is another example, but I think this isn't from universe, so I was wrong about that.
<ScottK> Also nano is in the default install, so if it was generally broken and not just on your system, I think someone would have noticed.
<AirBender> yes, that's what can't understand, since I have seen some other reports about that, but not as much as I think there should be
<ScottK> AirBender: Does /usr/share/info/dvips.info exist?
<AirBender> it's gzipped but yes
<MTecknology> Hurray, finally installing the 8.10->9.04 updates in my vm
<MTecknology> I'm getting really excited to hit this error
<DanMcGoo> done it, here it is: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/143249/
<AirBender> oh my God!!
<DanMcGoo> I'm going out for lunch< i will be back in 1 hour I think
<AirBender> I found it
<DanMcGoo> c u
<AirBender> after a year
<AirBender> the problem is I have manually compiled texinfo a year ago
<dlynch> hi, this morning my jaunty install hard locked up without warning, and it no longer boots from the ext4 partition in which it was installed. This seems like a serious bug worth investigating, but to be frank, I don't know how to approach this the best way. Should I boot from the most recent live CD of jaunty and try to take a look at some log files or something?
<AirBender> and it seems the newer version needs the directory to be explicitly given
<AirBender> I have renamed the /usr/local/ version of install-info and now it doesn't fail
<AirBender> the compiled version is from 2007 and the ubuntu version is from 1995
 * imbrandon goes to check on the wordpress versions
<ScottK> dlynch: You should ask in #ubuntu+1
<dlynch> ScottK ok, thanks and sorry for the noise
<MTecknology> !info texlive
<ubottu> texlive (source: texlive-base): TeX Live: A decent selection of the TeX Live packages. In component main, is optional. Version 2007.dfsg.1-2 (intrepid), package size 24 kB, installed size 120 kB
<AirBender> ScottK: what do you think about this issue?
<MTecknology> How do list dependencies for a package?
<ScottK> AirBender: It sounds like you installed something that caused a problem and removed it.
<AirBender> sure, it's clear, but why is ubuntu using such an old version of install-info
<imbrandon> AirBender: no one in debian or ubuntu has taken the time to update it :) go for it , heh
<AirBender> haha lol
<AirBender> but the problem isn't that simple, because all the packages should be updated first
<AirBender> and dh_install-info script
<imbrandon> exactly why it prob hasent been done yet
<AirBender> I think a good starting point could be to change the dh_install-info behavior, since the packagers use it to automatically generate this commands
<AirBender> and then on the next release, all the packages will be correctly generated for the use of the newer install-info versions
<AirBender> but I'm not a "Master of the Universe", so I could be missing some important details lol
<AirBender> Ok, time to Sleep, many thanks for your time ScottK
<ScottK> AirBender: I think that's the start of a plan, but it takes someone to work on it.  Good night and you're welcome.
<AirBender> I'll be glad to help, but think I don't have the nedded skiils yet
<ScottK> Guess how you get them ....
<ScottK> Note that this isn't something we'd consider now.  It'd be for Karmic.
<StevenK> ScottK: So, why does clamd suck so memory? :-)
<dtchen> DanMcGoo: there's nothing really wrong per se. it failed to sign (because you probably didn't specify an explicit key), but the deb is still there.
<ScottK> StevenK: Which one?
<AirBender> well, I will continue learning how to create my own packages, and will see if then I feel like I can do something useful for ubuntu
<AirBender> Good night guys
<StevenK> ScottK: 0.92.1
<ScottK> StevenK: Because you should be using backports.
<StevenK> But backports make me cry
<ScottK> StevenK: I know that can be the case sometimes but for clamav you really want the latest.
<ScottK> Actually once we update the 0.94.2 already in hardy-backports with a couple of security patches from the 0.95 release, I'm going to recommend it gets pushed to -security/-updates anyway.
<StevenK> ScottK: That sounds like a plan
<StevenK> Does 0.95 use less RAM?
<DanMcGoo> dtchen: yes I know that the deb is here. And the signature failure is supposed to be only a warning...
<ScottK> StevenK: Dunno.  I've been focused on does it crash and does it find virii (no and yes) and do all the rdepends build/work.
<DanMcGoo> so is there a a way to bypass this problem ?
<StevenK> ScottK: Heh. I've been trying to figure out if ClamAV has found anything. If it hasn't I was going to stop using it.
<MTecknology> hrm - I'm starting to think that handling/fixing bugs isn't in my realm of should do's
<ScottK> MTecknology: Why not?  It's generally a good path for getting started as an Ubuntu developer.
<wgrant> It's a much better path than drowing us in new packages.
<MTecknology> wgrant: new packages?
<MTecknology> ScottK: I've been negleting my loco some(a lot)
<MTecknology> ScottK: and I'm not really getting this stuff - but I suppose it's one of those massive learning curves and no realy easy way to start picking it up
<ScottK> MTecknology: There is a significant learning curve.  Bug fixing is one way to get the smallest learning curve as you don't have to learn everything all at once as you do with packaging new stuff from scratch.
<MTecknology> ScottK: I meant a huge learning curve with just bug fixing
<ScottK> Right.
<balarka> maco,  hi
<maco> hi
<balarka> just created a/c in launchpad and looking for bugs
<balarka> could you help me find simple ones
<balarka> plzz
<balarka> maco, as yesterday daniel was mentioning we need to search in launchpad
<balarka> maco, right?
<maco> balarka: http://qa.ubuntu.com/reports/launchpad-database/unfixed-bugs-with-patches.html
<maco> take a look at that link
<balarka> maco, sure..
<maco> those bugs have patches attached but not necessarily debdiffs
<maco> you can create debdiffs out of the patches
<maco> just like last night
<balarka> maco, how do you know if the patches are attached to them?
<balarka> maco, did they mentioned anywhere?
<maco> when you add an attachment there's a checkbox that says "this attachment is a patch"
<balarka> ooh
<balarka> got it
<balarka> let me pick one
<balarka> maco, what does the status field indicate?
<maco> ...the status?
<maco> of the bug
<balarka> oh
<maco> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/Status
<balarka> so they confirmed it as a bug
<balarka> right?
<maco> yes
<maco> triaged means there's enough info there to work on fixing it
<balarka> ooh
<AnAnt> Hello, if upstream got a NEWS & Changelog file, which is better to install as upstream changelog ?
<AnAnt> usually NEWS has a summarized list of changes (which I think is more interesting to users), and Changelog has detailed changelog (that I think is more interesting to those interesting in development itself)
<balarka> maco, so i picked this one https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/sepolgen/+bug/352610
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 352610 in sepolgen "audit2allow fails with traceback in access.py" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<balarka> maco, from this how to proceed.. i could not find any resources like source
<maco> balarka: apt-get source sepolgen
<dholbach> good morning
<maco> hi dholbach
<dholbach> hi maco
<balarka> hi dholbach
<dholbach> hiya balarka
<balarka> good morning too
<balarka> dholbach, i am on my way to fix a bug.. (my first bug ever!)
<maco> dholbach: is it summer time or are you up early?
<balarka> dholbach,  i failed to do it yesterday :(
<maco> eh, practice, right?
<dholbach> maco: summer time, 7:47
<dholbach> balarka: enjoy it :)
<balarka> dholbach, just want to know if you guys can help me a bit
<dholbach> just ask
<balarka> dholbach, maco  i picked this bug: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/sepolgen/+bug/352610
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 352610 in sepolgen "audit2allow fails with traceback in access.py" [Undecided,Confirmed]
 * dholbach might be on and off though
<balarka> dholbach, sure.. thanks!
<maco> dholbach: the dog?
<dholbach> maco: and other stuff I need to get done today
<maco> ah! gsoc proposals,,,right
<dholbach> eh?
<maco> dholbach: summer of code proposals are due today. i need to write mine
<dholbach> ah ok
<Kamping_Kaiser> hi all. is there an easy way to determine if the debconf settings on postgres changed between the version in hardy and hardy-backports?
<balarka> dholbach, maco i did sudo apt-get source sepolgen
<balarka> and got the source
<maco> balarka: not sudo
<balarka> but sudo worked
<maco> but it set the permissions all to root
<balarka> i mean i got the source downloaded
<maco> which means you cant operate on it
<balarka> oh
<dholbach> Kamping_Kaiser: which source package?
<balarka> oh ok
<balarka> deleted and got it again
<balarka> without sudo
<maco> ok
<balarka> and whatz next
<maco> get the patch
<maco> and pull up the logs from last night
<Kamping_Kaiser> dholbach, er, not sure. I'll have to go and check. (thought there might be a generic thing, not package specific)
<balarka> you mean use patch -i ?
<balarka> right?
<dholbach> balarka: did you check out  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Recipes ? there should be some helpful stuff in there too
<balarka> dholbach, nope.. i am going through it now
<balarka> dholbach, thanks
<dholbach> rock on
<balarka> dholbach, will be back to chat after reading it
<balarka> :)
<maco> balarka: i meant download the patch thats attached to the bug
<balarka> maco, oh ok
<dholbach> Kamping_Kaiser: there's this diff functionality on https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/postgresql-8.3 for example
<dholbach> Kamping_Kaiser: if you know which package to look for, it would give you the quickest results, I guess
<Kamping_Kaiser> dholbach, thanks. I'll go and have a play around.
<dholbach> super
<Kamping_Kaiser> i thought they'd fixed launchpad timeouts. *mutter*
<balarka> maco, how can i download the patch.. its not attached to the bug from the bug link
<balarka> maco, i am sorry if you told me how to do that before
<maco> balarka: yes it is. look on the right side
<maco> there's a "bug attachments" section
 * Amaranth wonders what the trick to building the wine package on 64-bit is
<balarka> oh ok
<maco> Amaranth: that's possible?
<Amaranth> maco: sure, it gets built as a 32-bit binary
<maco> oh
<Amaranth> but it still puts libraries in lib for me instead of lib32
<Amaranth> so dh_install fails
<balarka> maco,  i got the patch now ?
<balarka> i need to get the diff right?
<Amaranth> maco: There is sort of support for 64-bit too but you can't run 32-bit apps on a 64-bit build so it is a bit worthless
<balarka> dholbach, do you have a page where we get all the steps we did yesterday?
<balarka> i mean web link for that
<maco> balarka: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Packaging/Training/Logs/2009-04-02
<dholbach> balarka: just the log, but the stuff in PackagingGuide/Recipes should be similar
<maco> balarka: a patch is a diff
<maco> usually it's "diff -uN"
<balarka> dholbach, the recipes doesnt show how to appoly a patch
<balarka> *apply
<dholbach> right, but other than that the "Debdiff" one should be fairly similar
<balarka> dholbach, so i got the source package from apt-get source
<balarka> dholbach,  and the command dget -xu that we used
<balarka> dholbach, yesterday are both of them same?
<maco> essentially, yes
<balarka> becoz on apt-ge source also got me .dsc
<balarka> and other fiels
<balarka> maco, ooh cool
<maco> apt-get source gets the ones for whatever version of ubuntu you're running
<balarka> oh perfect
<dholbach> check out "man dget" for more info too
<maco> the dget way is how you do it for versions other than the one you're running, so if you're on intrepid and wantto work on jaunty's package...
<maco> of course, dget requires that you know where the dsc is online. you can find them on packages.ubuntu.com
<balarka> oh ok
<balarka> yes.. for that we need to know the link of package
<balarka> and one another ques.. i want to install bzr
<balarka> can u suggest a latest version of it
<balarka> yesterday i am pretty sure.. i could not proceed after that
<maco> dholbach ditched bzr on the howto yesterday when he realized there were intrepid users
<balarka> i would like to use bzr now and thereafter
<balarka> maco, ooh
<maco> but anyway, look in the log, there's a link to the bzr ppa
<balarka> bzr doesnt work for intrepid is it?
<maco> there's bzr going pretty far back, its just that the new version on the server and the old version in intrepid are incompatible
<balarka> you mean https://launchpad.net/~bzr/+archive/ppa
<maco> yes
<balarka> oh ok
<maco> go to that website and itll tell you how to add it
<balarka> oh ok
<maco> next week's lesson is on a particular bzr feature, so its good to install it
<maco> you'll be prepared
<balarka> maco,  yes
<balarka> true
 * maco can't wait for the lesson on the 23rd
<balarka> maco, one fundamental ques.. i use ubuntu 8.. so its draper drake?
<maco> no
<balarka> maco, pardon my ignorance
<maco> 8 which?
<maco> 8.04 or 8.10?
<balarka> 8.10
<maco> there is no "8"
<maco> ok thats intrepid
<maco> dapper is 6.06
<balarka> oh ok
<balarka> how to check the ubuntu version?
<balarka> at command line
<balarka> ?
<dholbach> lsb_release -a
<maco> balarka: lsb_release -a
<balarka> oh ok
<balarka> oh.. it says mine is hardy :P
<balarka> its 8.04
<maco> ok then
<balarka> where will be the sources.list located?
<maco>  /etc/apt/sources.list
<balarka> oh ok
<balarka> thanks
<balarka> maco,  i got bzr 1.13
<balarka> so how to proceed with it?
<balarka> from here
<maco> well you dont need bzr for what you're doing because the patch is its own file
<maco> so anyway, see where the logs talk about "patch -p1"?
<maco> do that stuff
<balarka> maco, patch -p1 < ~/patch
<balarka> can you explain me this command
<balarka> what it does
<balarka> i know patch is keyword command
<balarka> what is p1
<dholbach> check out   man patch
<balarka> ok
<balarka> dholbach, do i need to copy the patch into the package dir to appoly it?
<dholbach> balarka: no
<balarka> File to patch: sepolgen-ubuntu.patch
<balarka> patching file sepolgen-ubuntu.patch
<balarka> Hunk #1 FAILED at 313.
<balarka> 1 out of 1 hunk FAILED -- saving rejects to file sepolgen-ubuntu.patch.rej
<balarka> i got this when i tried to do:
<balarka>  patch  < /home/balarka/bug1/sepolgen-ubuntu.patch
<balarka> dholbach, can you tell me what wrong i did here
<dholbach> balarka: it's a problem we had in the session too - if you read up in the log you'll see what I said about patches not applying cleanly any more
<dholbach> balarka: in that case you need to review the patch and apply the changes manually in the code
<maco> or at least fix the context lines of the patch so itll apply
<balarka> dholbach, so patches not applying cleanly means is there err from our side?
<maco> it means the patch was made against a different version of the code than we have
<maco> so you need to massage it a bit to make it apply
<balarka> maco, oh
<balarka> oh ok
<balarka> and the diff patch says:
<balarka> @@ -313,7 +313,7 @@
<dholbach> balarka: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Packaging/Training/Logs/2009-04-02 - at around 07:57
<balarka>  
<balarka>      def __len__(self):
<balarka>          """Return the unique number of role allow statements."""
<balarka> -        return len(self.roles)
<balarka> +        return len(self.role_types.keys())
<balarka>  
<balarka>      def add(self, role, type):
<balarka>          if self.role_types.has_key(role):
<balarka> oh ok
<balarka> dholbach  so you said "I updated it to apply cleanly"
<balarka> dholbach, so you massaged it right?
<mrooney> What is the proper way to get a packaging branch into a source package to build it? doing something like "bzr export sourcepackage lp:package/packaging" doesn't work because you can't seem to export to an existing directory
<balarka> dholbach, as per yesterdays lo
<balarka> log
<dholbach> mrooney: try installing bzr-builddeb and see if     bzr bd -- -S works for you :)
<dholbach> balarka: yes, as I said https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Packaging/Training/Logs/2009-04-02 - at around 07:57 :-)
<balarka> yes.. i read that
<mrooney> dholbach: oh okay, how does that know where the packaging branch is?
<dholbach> mrooney: just check out the branch, then try that command
<balarka> dholbach, so you suggest any editor to dig into python's code to edit manually
<dholbach> right-o
<balarka> dholbach, i heard in pythong a tab plays major role
<mrooney> dholbach: checkout, or export?
<dholbach> mrooney: checkout
<dholbach> balarka: yep
<balarka> dholbach, can you suggest an  editor pls
<dholbach> any will do
<balarka> oh ok
<dholbach> just go and play with it for a bit
<balarka> sure..
<balarka> and in the diff file .. as you said how can we identify which one needs to be
<balarka> replaced with
<balarka> the existing code
<mrooney> dholbach: missing changelog error?
<dholbach> mrooney: which branch?
<mrooney> lp:wxbanker/0.5
<dholbach> mrooney: erm... that's not a "packaging branch" - there's no "debian/" in there :)
<mrooney> oh I do that from the packaging branch?
<mrooney> I see :)
<dholbach> if you keep it all in a branch anyway, I'd just add another branch that includes the debian/ stuff - WDYT?
<maco> balarka: its possible the comment line before it changed or maybe the line after the changes. look for things like that
<maco> oh he's gone ok
<mrooney> dholbach: I see, this seems functional, but I want to grab the upstream
<dholbach> mrooney: you still can...  "bzr pull <upstream branch>"  and you should be all set
<mrooney> so that I can build it for ubuntu
<dholbach> mrooney: you won't even get conflicts if all you do in that packaging branch is just adding debian/ :)
<mrooney> dholbach: okay let me take a step back, I check out the packaging into say, build/, so I have build/debian
<mrooney> now I pull the upstream into build, then run bd?
<dholbach> as far as I know, "bzr bd" will first try getting an upstream tarball via debian/watch, then try to see if the orig tarball in the archive fits
<dholbach> james_w is a good person to talk to about this :)
<mrooney> dholbach: oh I see, I don't care about an upstream tarball here, I want to get trunk
<dholbach> I personally think I'd just get branch off of upstream, add the packaging in there and use that branch as a basis
<mrooney> I want to say automate a nightly build
<dholbach> if you track upstream in a bzr branch anyway, I don't think it makes sense to have a branch that just contains "debian/"
<mrooney> oooh
<mrooney> dholbach: where should the packaging go then?
<dholbach> bzr checkout upstream; bzr branch upstream jaunty-package; cd jaunty-package; cp -r ~/packaging/debian .; bzr add debian
<dholbach> does that make sense? :)
<mrooney> ...maybe
<mrooney> dholbach: can you check out my short script at http://paste2.org/p/176741 and tell me if I am doing anything stupid
<dholbach> or just    bzr branch lp:upstream jaunty-package
<mrooney> the idea is you would run it like ./builder.sh 0.5 ~ppa1
<mrooney> so $1 is the series and $2 is the version modifier
<dholbach> then you should always be able to bzr pull from lp:upstream
<dholbach> you can do that, of course - I just think the other thing might be easier
<mrooney> lines 5-7 is basically my original question, of if there was a better way to do that
<mrooney> dholbach: okay, it feels backwards to generate the orig.tar.gz from the source, is that the correct way to do this in this case?
<dholbach> once you have it set up, you'd just run:       bzr merge lp:upstream; bzr commit -m "merge with upstream"; dch -v `bzr revno` "New Upstream checkout."; bzr bd -- -S; cd ..; dput ppa *.changes
<dholbach> mrooney: but if your approach works, just go ahead with it
<dholbach> there's also some autoppa project in LP somewhere which does something like this
<mrooney> dholbach: oh right yes
<mrooney> well I will try this and see how it works, thanks for letting me know at least it isn't insane
<dholbach> it could absolutely be worse ;-)
<mrooney> I am thinking of making a testing ppa, and setting up a server which gets notified on commits, runs the tests, and if they pass, builds and uploads to the ppa
<mrooney> it seems like a fun continuous deployment adventure!
<Toadstool> good morning
<savvas> good morning!
<iulian> Morning
<savvas> there's a problem with python3.0 and python3.0-minimal in jaunty: http://paste.ubuntu.com/143374/plain/
<dholbach> savvas: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/python-central/+bug/354228
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 354228 in python-central "package python2.6-minimal 2.6.1-1ubuntu8 failed to install/upgrade: " [High,Triaged]
<savvas> ah cool, thanks :)
<savvas> about bug 337696 - there's a patch, but ubuntu foundations team is assigned to it, do I have to subscribe ubuntu universe sponsors?
<ubottu> Error: Could not parse data returned by Launchpad: The read operation timed out (https://launchpad.net/bugs/337696/+text)
<savvas> https://launchpad.net/bugs/337696
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 337696 in wxwidgets2.8 "package python-wxgtk2.6 2.6.3.2.2-3ubuntu1 failed to install/upgrade: trying to overwrite `/usr/lib/python2.6/dist-packages/wxPython/__init__.py', which is also in package python-wxgtk2.8" [High,Triaged]
<savvas> DktrKranz: about bug #340901, can I ask for an FFe instead? I made a 0.0.3 release: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/24733041/gapti-dsc_and_tar-gz.tar.gz
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 340901 in gapti "needs python 2.6 transition and porting" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/340901
<DktrKranz> savvas: are changes related to Python 2.6 only?
<savvas> DktrKranz: I don't know what you mean, but there are no improvements, other than proper packaging for python 2.6 :) here are the changes introduced: http://paste.ubuntu.com/143395/
<wintellect> Hi all
<wintellect> I'm looking at giving back to the ubuntu community by getting involved in pkgs. I have been reading https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Basic but do not understand something. Which file(s) are submitted for approval for a pkg? Is it the .dsc?
<directhex> wintellect, a "debian source package" is made from three files. the dsc is essentially useless on its own - but it the file which you sign with your GPG (when relevant) and contains shortcuts to the other two (for simplicity)
<directhex> the "orig" is the original upstream tarball, repackaged as a .tar.gz if required. you should submit it so people can verify that the source is definitely legal & licenses followed, and that there are no undistributable parts in it
<directhex> the "diff" is a patch containing all changes you make - which should usually mean all the packaging specifics (the debian/ folder)
<wintellect> directhex: thank you - that is very helpful to know and understand. I have a small app I wrote that i am looking to learn pkg building with and perhaps I'll submit it one day. Again, thank you.
<mok0> DktrKranz: ping
<DktrKranz> savvas: no features, no need for FFe then
<DktrKranz> mok0: pong
<mok0> DktrKranz: hi, just wanted to ask you to translate an italian bug report
<DktrKranz> fire it
 * mok0 tries to find it
<mok0> bug 339965
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 339965 in stellarium "installation problems" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/339965
<savvas> DktrKranz: thanks, but what's the process? should I rename the title to use that new version?
<mok0> DktrKranz: what does "l'archivio del pacchetto Ã¨ rovinato" mean?
<DktrKranz> mok0: it's "package archive is broken"
<mok0> DktrKranz: ah. This is not a bug then
<mok0> DktrKranz: now I have you, I need an FFe :-P
<DktrKranz> it seems not
<DktrKranz> a partial download, probably
<DktrKranz> mok0: and I need money! :)
<mok0> DktrKranz: you have a paypal account??
<DktrKranz> savvas: just find a sponsor, in the meantime you can rename it
<DktrKranz> mok0: bank transfer, more clean ;)
<mok0> Cayman Islands?
<DktrKranz> luxembourg
<mok0> DktrKranz: bug 334405
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 334405 in stellarium "[jaunty] Please merge Stellarium 0.10.2" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/334405
<mok0> DktrKranz: Actually, this can be sync'ed, I found out.
<savvas> DktrKranz: cool, thank you  :)
<DktrKranz> mok0: which qt version we ship right now? (/me is not a KDE guy)
<mok0> qt4
<mok0> DktrKranz: It's using the latest qt version
<DktrKranz> 4.5?
<ScottK> Yes
<mok0> DktrKranz: it's not a versioned depends, so the default version
<DktrKranz> it has some rdependencies (as commented in the report), any impact on those?
<mok0> DktrKranz: Stellarium 0.10 series is a serious update of the graphics interface. We have 0.10.0 in jaunty's archive, but it's really a beta version
<mok0> DktrKranz: stellarium has no rdepends
<mok0> DktrKranz: celestia is a standalone app, it Suggests: stellarium. Science-astronomy is a meta package that Recommends: stellarium and a bunch of other apps.
<DktrKranz> mok0: indeed
<DktrKranz> mok0: acked
<DktrKranz> uh... kde3bindings needs adjustment for Py2.6, do we still support it?
<iulian> mok0: Could you please give me the bug #?  I can have a look at it as well.
<iulian> Oh, got it.
 * iulian was looking in the wrong place.
<iulian> mok0: Do you have a ChangeLog/NEWS file of stellarium?
<iulian> I'd like to see what features brings this new upstream version.
<ScottK> DktrKranz: I thought for KDE3 the Python bindings were in a seperate package?
<iulian> s/features/new features/
<DktrKranz> ScottK: after a quick look, kde3bindings has a python-dcop package, which needs love
<ScottK> Ah.  Right.
<DktrKranz> I don't know if it has to be managed separately, though.
<ScottK> I'm not sure that even works anymore.
<mok0> iulian: will check
<ScottK> Kubuntu has no need of kde3bindings.
<ScottK> It's only not removed in case of 3rd party scripts.
<mok0> iulian: I think the 0.10.0 -> 0.10.2 change is mainly bug fixes
<ScottK> There should be no rdepends in the archive at all.
<DktrKranz> ScottK: so it could be demoted at this point
<ScottK> It has been.  It's in Universe.
<mok0> iulian: upstream's changelog is copied into the 2 comments by Jesper and Christ
<DktrKranz> $ rmadison -u ubuntu -s jaunty -a source kde3bindings
<DktrKranz> kde3bindings | 4:3.5.10-1ubuntu2 |        jaunty | source
<DktrKranz> $
<DktrKranz> it seems not
<ScottK> Urgh.
<ScottK> Should have been.  I'll look into it.
<iulian> mok0: Oh, sorry, haven't noticed.
<DktrKranz> ScottK: anyway, we're almost there. IIRC, only 5 package remaining, but they all FTBFS.
<ScottK> Yep.
<DktrKranz> They need NCommander strong hands :)
<iulian> mok0: Accepted, please go ahead.
<mok0> iulian: thanks!
<ScottK> DktrKranz: Could you look at the gapti update?  From what I saw in the bug it seems like it might be a good idea.
<mok0> I'm off into the sunshine, see you later!
<DktrKranz> ScottK: sure
<DktrKranz> savvas: is gapti in Debian?
<ScottK> DktrKranz: IIRC it is, but hasn't been touched there in a LOOONG time.
<savvas> DktrKranz: not as far as I can see: http://packages.qa.debian.org/g/gapti.html http://packages.debian.org/search?keywords=gapti
<ScottK> DktrKranz and savvas: Nevermind.  I was thinking of a different package.
<savvas> I honestly don't know if I should drop the whole gapti thing
<savvas> I wonder if anyone is using it :)
<ScottK> Dunno, but if there's a new upstream that addresses Python 2.6 compatibility we should probably have it.
 * DktrKranz agrees.
<savvas> ok, I guess it can last a bit longer hehe
<DktrKranz> savvas: so it only needs pushing in Ubuntu, an easy one :)
<savvas> true, I don't mind, at least I've learned how to use setup.py - useful for another project :)
<savvas> how to write *
<DktrKranz> savvas: :)
<atrejut1> \join #ubuntu-devel
<bddebian> Heya gang
<ScottK> heya bddebian.
<ScottK> directhex: Did you know monodevelop-java is currently uninstallable?
<bddebian> Hi ScottK
<directhex> ScottK, it's on my todo - meebey should upload 2.0-final packages this evening for most of monodevelop, which i prepared yesterday. they've been designed to be syncable despite some build-dep differences
<ScottK> directhex: OK.  I've been going through uninstallables and wanted to make sure you knew.
<directhex> ScottK, afaik the problem is an error in tightened binary deps, which don't allow for +dfsg in the binary-version
<imbrandon> morning all
<directhex> ScottK, i definitely fixed an issue with monodevelop-java hating +dfsg monodevelop last night in svn, so it's on the todo ;)
<ScottK> OK
<directhex> problem is, 3 of the monodevelop plugins are maintained in git, and i'm struggling to deal with those. git confuses my feeble brain :(
<atrejut> hello all... I followed dholbachs packaging training session yesterday and decided to try what I learned on a separate bug (LP: #338158) which has an upstream patch, but somehow I'm running into trouble and need some help... is this the right place to ask?
<jpds> Yes, absolutely.
<atrejut> ok. so unlike the example bug in dholbachs session the package uses cdbs. so I used cdbs-edit-patch to add the patch. but when I run debuild it always tells me 'Patch debian/patches/egg-endless-loop.patch is not applied.'
<atrejut> but manually I could apply it just fine, it's not that the patch doesn't apply really...
<ScottK> DktrKranz: apt-cache unmet shows more that 5 for python 2.6 for me.
<imbrandon> morning bddebian
<bddebian> Heya imbrandon
<DktrKranz> ScottK: xulrunner is going to be dropped, two need a-a to sync and one uploaded recently.
<ScottK> DktrKranz: OK.
<DktrKranz> there's a obsolete package too
<ScottK> Did you file for removal?
<DktrKranz> pyqwt, I need to figure out if it can be replaced by pyqwt5
<DktrKranz> and the same for pyqwt3d
<DktrKranz> they all FTBFS, though
<ScottK> OK.  Well if it's broken and unfixable, then I'd say just remove it.
<ScottK> Particulalry if it's Qt 3 and has no rdepends.
<DktrKranz> two in a not sane way, and upstream is dead
<ScottK> Out with them I say then.
<DktrKranz> they've no rdepends
<DktrKranz> (IIRC)
<DktrKranz> for csound, its maint asked me to upgrade scons in debian (move from exp to unstable, actually), and we could sync it
<atrejut> jpds: any ideas?
<jpds> atrejut: Are you sure there's a patch system included in debian/rules?
<atrejut> it lists 'include /usr/share/cdbs/1/rules/simple-patchsys.mk' (amongst others)
<jpds> Hmm, odd.
<ScottK> atrejut: Did you get the 'not applied' when making the source package only or also when building the .deb?
<imbrandon> atrejut: are you shure it dident just inform you it hadent been applied yet and then applied it ? do you have the full output of the build ?
<hyperair> easy way to test: run debian/rules patch
<atrejut> hyperair: yes, that gives a success message
<hyperair> atrejut: then it should work fine during build
<imbrandon> ScottK: you know , i had an idea for a new "blueprint" i think you might be intrested in putting your 0.2c on ( i havent drafted it yet, it just came to mind last night )
<ScottK> ?
<atrejut> ok, so I can just ignore the debuild message? (http://paste.ubuntu.com/143527/ in case you want to look over it)
<imbrandon> ScottK: ok background, you know we have 6month + LTS cycles, and a full rolling release is bad(tm) [ like gentoo ]
<ScottK> atrejut: Yes.  Not applied is what you want for the source package.
<atrejut> ScottK: ok, thanks, I was getting confused there...
<ScottK> atrejut: No problem.  Better to ask.
<imbrandon> ScottK: so the nightly build spec got me thinking why not have a subset ( maybe a special component ) for "rolling release packages" like clamav et al
<imbrandon> or does backports fill that "ok" enough
<ScottK> imbrandon: The problem with that is rdepends and you need differences between Ubuntu releases.
<ScottK> I think it fills it OK enough.
<imbrandon> ScottK: yea , i hadent thought it through yet, just came to me
<ScottK> For example, with clamav you need different configs for Dapper, Gutsy/Hardy, and Intrepid/Jaunty.
<ScottK> What we really need is a better way for people to install just a few select packages from backports.
<imbrandon> true, that would be best
<ScottK> mvo did some work on that for Jaunty, but it didn't quite make it.
<imbrandon> cool ok
<imbrandon> yea if we coudl get it in place before the next LTS it would rock
<imbrandon> :)
<ScottK> On my list for UDS.
<imbrandon> adobe flash and a few webapps come to mind also, but you got the idea
<ScottK> DktrKranz: kde3bindings is still in Main on purpose as it turns out.
<DktrKranz> ScottK: oh, what it the reason?
<ScottK> [11:20:35] <Riddell> ScottK: kde3bindings is in main for libsmoke1 used by perl-qt used by debconf
<DktrKranz> yeah
<imbrandon> libsmoke1 is used by php-qt too ( if i ever get arround to fixing it )
<MTecknology> So, I want to use debootstrap, but I don't know where to grap the stuff for a mirror to keep the files on my system - anyone know where to get these files?
<ScottK> DktrKranz: Have you got a list of bugs for the Python packages that still need doing?
<DktrKranz> ScottK: I can sort it out very quicly
<ScottK> DktrKranz: Thanks.  I got asked for a list at the release team meeting.
<hyperair> MTecknology: pbuilder --create
<hyperair> MTecknology: if you want a list of debian mirrors, it's in /usr/share/python-apt/templates/Debian.mirrors, and for ubuntu, it's in /usr/share/python-apt/templates/Ubuntu.mirrors
<MTecknology> hyperair: thanks
<hyperair> MTecknology: np
<MTecknology> hyperair: oh... so I'd need to grab an entire repo(parts of it I want) to do that?
<hyperair> MTecknology: what?
<hyperair> no wait what are you attempting to do?
<DktrKranz> ScottK: http://paste.ubuntu.com/143555/
<ScottK> DktrKranz: Thanks.
<DktrKranz> some haven't bugs (such as swig1.3), I plan to test them sooon
<ScottK> DktrKranz: I actually uploaded imgseek today (rebuild) so it should be off the uninstallable list.
<ScottK> OK
<MTecknology> I want to use debootstrap to create a little testing ground. I don't want to download everything every time since I might do it a couple times, so I just want to grab whatever I need to create a local mirror for debootstrap
<DktrKranz> ScottK: ah, fine
<ScottK> DktrKranz: I find more than that.  For example mgltools-scenario (which I will do).
<ScottK> DktrKranz: How are you generating your list?
<DktrKranz> edos-debcheck with some UNIX tools
<ScottK> OK.  I'm using apt-cache unmet and finding stuff you aren't.
<DktrKranz> such as?
<DktrKranz> so I can check why I have these differences
<ScottK> The mgltools-scenario is one exaemple
<DktrKranz> amd64?
<sbeattie> MTecknology: apt-cacher or apt-cacher-ng will let you cache locally without mirroring everything.
<DktrKranz> ScottK: maybe I realized, my edos-debcheck run doesn't include multiverse
<ScottK> Ah.
<ScottK> Yes.  That's in multiverse.
<MTecknology> sbeattie: I'm playing with debmirror right now
<sbeattie> DktrKranz: do you check multiple arches? I've found at least one that's uninstallable on amd64 only (pose-skins) because the dependency (pose) FTBFS on amd64.
<MTecknology> hrm - I forgot how to find the fastest mirror without using synaptic
<DktrKranz> sbeattie: only i386, but I can run for every arch
<MTecknology> Any ideas what's wrong with this?  debmirror --nosource --method=http --arch=i386 --section=main,restricted,universe,multiverse --host=astromirror.uchicago.edu/ubuntu -d intrepid,intrepid-security,intrepid-updates,jaunty,jaunty-security,jaunty-updates /home/michael/UbuntuMirror/
<DktrKranz> MTecknology: which error do you receive?
<MTecknology> DktrKranz: 404
<kees> MTecknology: http://astromirror.uchicago.edu/ubuntu/dists/  doesn't have jaunty
<kees> I recommend se.archive.ubuntu.com
<MTecknology> oops - thanks
<MTecknology> Download of dists/intrepid-security/Release failed: 404 Not Found Download of dists/intrepid-security/Release.gpg failed: 404 Not Found Download of dists/intrepid-updates/Release failed: 404 Not Found Download of dists/
<MTecknology> I'm still getting that
<MTecknology> closer, but not quite - http://pastebin.ca/1381023
<MTecknology> I just made an rsync script to do it :P
<slytherin> does anyone know how can I make use of rsync to update daily CD?
<mathiaz> slytherin: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/RsyncCdImage
<slytherin> mathiaz: does it work for alternate CD as well?
<mathiaz> slytherin: yes
<slytherin> trying now.
<slytherin> mathiaz: doesn't seem to be working for me. It is downloading complete CD I believe, the progress status is not very helpful.
<ScottK> I'd appreciate it if some motu who knows about GTK stuff would look at Bug #205218.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 205218 in glife "[unmet dependencies] glife requires libglade-gnome0, but that doesn't exists" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/205218
<slytherin> ScottK: I will take a look
<mathiaz> slytherin: do you already have a local copy of th e iso?
<ScottK> slytherin: Thanks.
<slytherin> mathiaz: yes I have
<mathiaz> slytherin: did you adjust the path correctly for the image you wanna get?
<slytherin> mathiaz: Yes, I did.
<mathiaz> slytherin: I usually double-check by browsing http://cdimage.ubuntu.com
<slytherin> mathiaz: I usually update the image using jigdo.
<slytherin> damn, I messed up something
<fabrice_sp> Hi. Is there a way to get the previous source of a package, before a patch? Since I upgrade xserver-xorg-video-intel, this morning, my computer freeze when screensaver comes up, and I 'd like to compile and test the previous version
<slytherin> fabrice_sp: I don't think so.
<ScottK> fabrice_sp: You can both source and binary off Launchpad.
<fabrice_sp> ScottK, also previous version of binary?
<ScottK> Yes
<fabrice_sp> I have to chenge my glasses then, because I've not been able to find it... I'll look better then
<fabrice_sp> thanks for the tip
<fabrice_sp> :-)
<maco> ScottK: 1:2.4.12+dfsg-1.3ubuntu1 <-- not a sensible version number, right? should just be 1:2.4.12-0ubuntu1?
<LaserJock> that's sensible, not sure it it's right
<ScottK> maco: What's the current version and what are you updating?
<ScottK> ... to
<maco> openswan from 2.4.12+dfsg-1.3 to 2.4.14
<maco> like i said in -devel, bunch of security and bug fixes
<ScottK> Then you'll want 1:2.4.12+dfsg-0ubuntu1
<ScottK> You'll need to figure out what got removed due to non-freeness, remove it and repack the tarball.
<maco> with 2.4.14 insted of .12 :P
<LaserJock> shouldn't that be 1:2.4.14+dfsg-0ubuntu1
<LaserJock> stupid numbers
<maco> what does +dfsg mean? they ripped out non-dfsg-free stuff?
<LaserJock> yes
<maco> i see...
<LaserJock> it means that the .orig.tar.gz has been modified specifically
<maco> i didnt think orig could be modified....ok
<LaserJock> well, that's why we make it clear that it has been modified
<LaserJock> because that's about the only time you ever should mess with the .orig.tar.gz
<maco> Remove additional non-free draft RFCs from upstream tarball. <-- found
<directhex> Subject: 	monodevelop_2.0+dfsg-1_i386.changes REJECTED
<directhex> fiddlesticks
<savvas> any main sponsors here? I would like your opinion on bug #315679 - should I try to merge the new version of libmtp in Debian?
<ubottu> Error: Could not parse data returned by Launchpad: The read operation timed out (https://launchpad.net/bugs/315679/+text)
<iulian> savvas: You'll find more main sponsors in #ubuntu-devel rather than here.
<savvas> thanks for the tip :)
<timClicks1> hi all, new to packaging etc - am interested in https://bugs.launchpad.net/sahana/+bug/271260 - is there anything I can do to help move this along?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 271260 in ubuntu "Sahana - disaster management application - for inclusion to repos, deb uploaded" [Wishlist,Confirmed]
<directhex> timClicks1, a per-reviewed source package is an ABSOLUTE minimum
<directhex> timClicks1, an attached deb may as well be an attched conficker.exe
<timClicks1> *nod*
<timClicks1> okay,  cheers for the heads up
<directhex> timClicks1, google for "ubuntu revu"
<savvas> timClicks1: also read https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide :)
<timClicks1> :) ta all
<ScottK> !revu > timClicks1
<ubottu> timClicks1, please see my private message
<ScottK> Also, we're just a few weeks from a release right now, so we aren't taking new packages at the moment.
<timClicks1> no, i recognise that
<timClicks1> i just thought i would get things on track as much as possible before the 9.10 cycle
<timClicks1> revu looks like a great tool
<directhex> it provides a convenient packaging pedestal for people to throw balls at
<directhex> in the coconut shy analogy in my mind
<savvas> directhex: you package monodevelop-java, right? do you happen to know why the binary dependencies are so restrictive? bug #347702
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 347702 in monodevelop-java "monodevelop-java not installable" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/347702
<directhex> savvas, because the beta/alpha versions were not forward-compatible, the dependencies were tightened so only monodevelop 1.9.3 could be used with monodevelop-java 1.9.3.
<directhex> savvas, minor oversight: monodevelop is not version 1.9.3, it's version 1.9.3+dfsg
<directhex> savvas, this is fixed in pkg-cli-apps svn
<directhex> savvas, but we need to get the packages in svn pushed to debian, for syncing.
<savvas> I see :)
<directhex> savvas, it's a huge change - change the "a" to "." in control
<directhex> savvas, problem was meebey forgot that "+" > "a" - fortunately, "." > "+"
<directhex> savvas, http://svn.debian.org/wsvn/pkg-cli-apps/packages/monodevelop-java/trunk/debian/changelog?op=file&rev=0&sc=0
<savvas> directhex: wait, so this is going to be fixed, as soon as it is sync'ed from Debian?
<directhex> savvas, yep
<savvas> cool, thanks for the quick fix though :)
<directhex> savvas, we need to upload monodevelop (and plugins) 2.0. this needs coordination with debian-release (because apparently monodevelop is blacklisted until evolution-data-server enters squeeze, or somesuch craziness)
<savvas> understood, I'll comment that bug with the link you gave me
<savvas> ah you have :P
<james_w> one to add to the python list: bug 342916
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 342916 in ruledispatch "Syntax errors in python-dispatch" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/342916
<mrooney> what do people use for managing upstream changelogs? I want to create one and it looks like I can use dch with -c, but I don't know what to put in for the UNRELEASED section
<jpds> 'Changes go here.'
<mrooney> jpds: is that an answer to my question?
<jpds> mrooney: Well, I usually put that instead of a blank "* ..." line in my UNRELEASED entries.
<mrooney> interesting
<mrooney> I am just trying to figure out how to create and maintain a changelog for an arbitrary project, basically
<mrooney> I figure dch is a good tool
<wintellect> Good evening all
<wintellect> I am reading through https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Complete but am unsure on something...
<wintellect> a command is given to create a pbuilder environment - fine. However, does a new pbuilder environment need to be created after using said environment to create a pkg with? Or is there a command to "clean" the envirnoment before using it on another environment - or is cleaning not necessary?
<wintellect> s/another environment/another pkg/
<jpds> wintellect: The pbuilder cleans up the chroot environment automatically after a build.
<jpds> wintellect: You have use the same base pbuilder environment as many times as you like with multiple packages.
<wintellect> jpds: perfect. Thanks for clarifying that
<jpds> wintellect: So when you build a package: the base tarball with the base distribution is unpacked and the necessary build dependencies (specified in the source package) are installed. The package builds itself as defined by the maintained, afterwards, pbuilder rm -rf's the build chroot.
<jpds> maintainer*
<wintellect> jpds: that's a sweet setup :)  As it should be :D
<wintellect> is "debuild" now called "debuild-pbuilder" or am I missing a pkg? The doc says to use "debuid" but I don't have it on my system
<wintellect> s/debuid/debuild/
<jpds> debuild should be in devscripts.
<wintellect> jpds: again, thanks. The docs didn't make that clear
<nhandler> wintellect: You also might be interested in installing ubuntu-dev-tools (which also causes devscripts to be installed)
<wintellect> nhandler: thanks
<wintellect> I have now successfully created the hello_2.1.1*.deb file  :D
<nhandler> Very nice wintellect.
<wintellect> nhandler: thanks. I'd like to get involved with pkgs - and contribute to the community in this way (somehow)
<wintellect> Love Ubuntu and would thoroughly enjoy being parft of it
<nhandler> wintellect: I would suggest reading through https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/GettingStarted
<nhandler> We also have a mentoring program that you might be interested in: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Mentoring
<nhandler> We are also having weekly packaging training sessions: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Packaging/Training
<wintellect> yeah, I'd like to be mentored at some point. I think it's fantastic that ubuntu has that program!
<hyperair> at least it's easier to find sponsors in ubuntu than debian.
<savvas> eh? :)
<hyperair> really.
<savvas> no I mean... who were you commenting? :P
<hyperair> <wintellect> yeah, I'd like to be mentored at some point. I think it's fantastic that ubuntu has that program!
<hyperair> that.
<nhandler> mentoring != sponsoring
<dtchen> ok mister pedantic.
<hyperair> =p
<savvas> ok :)
<hyperair> hehehe
<savvas> sponsoring is a kind of mentoring, sponsors always tend to point you at the right direction, isn't it? :)
 * hyperair nods
<savvas> at least that's what I've noticed so far
<hyperair> and once you get everything right, they upload your package =)
<savvas> and most importantly, I got two "savvas: ROCK!" comments by dholbach :P
<hyperair> now, either debian lacks DDs, or DDs who sponsor.
<hyperair> if you thought revu was bad, see how many outstanding packages there are on debian-mentors.
 * hyperair envies savvas
<hyperair> well i got a hug from dholbach =)
 * nhandler gives savvas a hug to make things even ;)
<savvas> on "embrace thy ubuntu neighbour" day? :P
<hyperair> nope
<hyperair> it was something to do with nautilus-share
<hyperair> about getting an update uploaded before i could get nautilus-share into debian.
<savvas> it's really great how you show your appreciation to each other :)
<hyperair> hahah
<savvas> ok, I now understand what I've said, but think of it in a kind way! :P
<hyperair> kind way?
 * hyperair is confused
<savvas> never mind, I have a nasty cold
 * savvas coughs and spreads influenza through chips and bits and bytes
 * hyperair fans his notebook
<hyperair> ugh my eyes are closing on their own.
<hyperair> oh my, it's daybreak!
 * hyperair jumps into bed
<hyperair> ziroday`: wtf are you doing here so early
<hyperair> nevermind, bedtime for me.
<savvas> The peer has reset their connection :p
<nhandler> Darn peer, always kicking people offline :P
#ubuntu-motu 2009-04-04
<mrooney> anyone know of a way to pass in the "Michael Rooney <mrooney@ubuntu.com>" aspect to dch?
<mrooney> currently it pulls stuff from the local machine and gets it wrong
<maxb> mrooney: DEBEMAIL, DEBFULLNAME
<mrooney> maxb: ah okay, just export those first?
<maxb> yup
<maxb> See also 'man dch' :-)
<mrooney> maxb: yeah I noticed it when you said it, I read every argument figuring it was there
<mrooney> maxb: I am not an expert basher, what does that look like? DEBFULLNAME="Mike Rooney"; export DEBFULLNAME ?
<mrooney> ahh I think I see
<maxb> that'll work. Alternatively, export DEBFULLNAME="Mike Rooney" for a slightly shorter way of writing it
<Pollywog> can someone help me with bzr whoami?  It will not accept my email address, I think it is possibly a bug in Jaunty
<Pollywog> I am running Jaunty in virtualbox
<dtchen> which version?
<Snova> What error do you get? (Also, you might get more help in #bzr)
<dtchen> bzr 1.13.1-1 works here
<Pollywog> oh thanks I did not know there was a #bzr
<Pollywog> the error is no such file or directory
<dtchen> ah, you're probably missing ~/.bazaar/bazaar.conf
<Pollywog> I thought bzr whoami would make that file
<Pollywog> thanks
<Pollywog> I will try #bzr
<savvas> calc: ping :)
<savvas> you wouldn't happen to know why openoffice.org-math menu item is hidden, would you?
<wgrant> savvas: I believe it's because Math isn't used very often on its own.
<savvas> hm.. true, it can be run through File > New > Formula from the word processor heh
<mok0> ScottK: wow that was quick :-) Thanks
<directhex> arseweasels. monodevelop may need to be 0ubuntu1'd
<directhex> when's the next freeze?
<Laney> FinalFreeze on Thursday
<mok0> Laney: that's 12 o'clock UTC, right?
<Laney> not sure
<directhex> damn
<directhex> i think 0ubuntu1 is the right thing to do then
<Laney> :(
<Laney> get it done son
<directhex> it's ready in pkg-cli-apps
<directhex> barring the git-based addons
<mok0> hmm, the wiki seems to be dead
<jpds> Yep, known problem.
<vadi2> Hi. I'm trying to make dpkg-buildpackage accept a password for signing non-interactively, and I see that there is a bunch of options available. Where can I read up on how exactly each works? I'm also not so familiar with the signing process
<jpds> You coyld run gpg-agent to do it.
 * hyperair uses seahorse-agent
<vadi2> I think seahorse is installed by default so would like to go with that
<vadi2> hyperair: what would be the syntax for it? -pseahorse-agent didn't work: "Unknown signing interface seahorse-agent; please specify -spgp or -sgpg"
<bencrisford> Guys, say in terminal i'm editing ".examplerc" how do i save and exit it when im done, im a little embarrassed I don't know :P
<hyperair> vadi2: well, if i'm not mistaken, seahorse is run upon startup
<vadi2> it is
<vadi2> how can I make debuild use it?
<vadi2> and not ask for the password
<hyperair> you need to register your key in seahorse
<hyperair> is it?
<Laney> wow
<vadi2> yeah I think it is
<hyperair> and make sure GPG_AGENT_INFO is set
<Laney> I imported the whole Debian keyring into seahorse and now it's incredibly slow
<Laney> what a terrible idea that was
<hyperair> heh
<bencrisford> Guys, say in terminal i'm editing ".examplerc" how do i save and exit it when im done, im a little embarrassed I don't know :P
<vadi2> bencrisford: ctrl+o
<bencrisford> cheers ;)
<Laney> depends what you're editing with
<jpds> bencrisford: With which editor?
<bencrisford> vim, inside terminal
<Laney> :wq
<hyperair> :wq
<vadi2> hyperair: yes, that is set to some seahorse
<jpds> :wq!
<bencrisford> i thought it were that
<bencrisford> but it didnt work
<hyperair> vadi2: then it should work =\
<vadi2> "/tmp/seahorse-lt1AXh/S.gpg-agent:6410:1"
<Laney> you need to press escape first
<Laney> if you're in insert mode
<bencrisford> cheers!
<vadi2> hyperair: but I'm not totally sure that seahorse has the right key. how can I make sure?
<bencrisford> thanks loads ;)
<vadi2> hyperair: although I remember making it on seahorse to begin with
<hyperair> vadi2: then it should be the correct key
<hyperair> vadi2: check the ID
<vadi2> yes, it is the correct ID
<vadi2> but, debuild is still lazy. :(
<hyperair> vadi2: more like gpg
<vadi2> well gpg
<hyperair> vadi2: check your gpg config file..
<vadi2> where can I find it?
<hyperair> vadi2: ~/.gnupg/gpg.conf
<hyperair> vadi2: make sure there's an uncommented line "use-agent"
<vadi2> it is empty!
<vadi2> vadi@ubuntu:~/.gnupg$ cat gpg.conf
<vadi2> # FILE CREATED BY SEAHORSE
<vadi2> vadi@ubuntu:~/.gnupg$
<ScottK> That bug is fortunately fixed, but it bit a bunch of people.
<hyperair> ScottK: what bug?
<hyperair> vadi2: echo use-agent >> ~/.gnupg/gpg.conf
<ScottK> seahorse-agent making an empty gpg.conf.
<ScottK> hyperair: There's a better solution.  Just a sec
<hyperair> hmm
 * Laney eyes seahorse
<ScottK> vadi2 and hyperair cp /usr/share/gnupg2/gpg-conf.skel ~/.gnupg/
<Laney> I think I broke it
<bencrisford> Laney: How can I get back into edit mode now, I am editing a different file
<Laney> bencrisford: Press i or a
<bencrisford> cheeers ;)
<Laney> insert or append
<vadi2> ok, now seahorse is the one asking
<vadi2> much better at least
<vadi2> I'll do the cp
<Laney> you should go through vimtutor really
<hyperair> vadi2: yeah, after that it should remember ;)
<bencrisford> ill check it out
<vadi2> ScottK: I don't have such a file
<vadi2> hyperair: no it actually didn't :x but that is not my worry for now.
<hyperair> vadi2: it didn't?
<vadi2> hyperair: good enough that it asks via gui and not terminal
<hyperair> vadi2: ah that can be configured.
<jpds> vadi2: /usr/share/gnupg/options.skel
<ScottK> Yeah.  That one.
<hyperair> vadi2: system->preferences->encryption and keyrings
<ScottK> jpds: Thanks.
<hyperair> vadi2: ...->PGP Passphrases
<vadi2> I see
<hyperair> you can set it to timeout
<hyperair> or remember infinitely, depending on how secure you think your system is.
<ScottK> Yeah.  Don't do that.
<ScottK> Nobody's system is that secure.
<vadi2> It's already set to 300 minutes
<vadi2> I guess that's the default, i don't remember setting that
<hyperair> ScottK: if my system's in my house, i'd set it to infinite =)
<hyperair> ScottK: nobody's going to break into my house just to grab my GPG key
 * ScottK wouldn't and doesn't.
<vadi2> So now about the buggy people. I can detect them by checking of use-agent is present in gpg.conf, yes?
<ScottK> OTOH, my gpg key lets you do stuff too.
<hyperair> ScottK: either way my key's on my notebook, so i have it wait 10 minutes and then forget
<hyperair> vadi2: egrep ^use-agent $HOME/.gnupg/gpg.conf
<vadi2> and would fixing their gpg.conf by adding the line in for them would be OK or a huge no-no?
<vadi2> hyperair: yes
<hyperair> no-no imo.
<hyperair> vadi2: not everyone wants to use an agent
<vadi2> what would be the recommended method then?
<ScottK> hyperair: OTOH, it is the Ubuntu default.
<hyperair> umm i don't know
<vadi2> I need to run debuild from a script
<vadi2> well, program really
<ScottK> I'd look for the "CREATED BY SEAHORSE" string (or whatever it was)
<hyperair> ScottK: yes, but i don't want any postinst script or anything automatically setting use-agent on my gpg.conf if i personally disable it.
<ScottK> Yes.
<vadi2> ScottK: ah, yes, you have a point. thanks
<hyperair> # FILE CREATED BY SEAHORSE
<ScottK> There was a bad gnupg bug in Feisty were no gpg.conf got installed at all.  When we fixed it in Gutsy we decided not to try and backfit the fix because we couldn't come up with a really sane way to do it for all users.
<vadi2> so if created by seahose and no use-agent, because of a bug, I can fix it
<hyperair> actually i think you should check that the file only contains that line
<ScottK> Yes.  That line and only that line.
<vadi2> if not made by seahorse then... eh, my program would freeze not knowing debuild is requesting a password. but that's another topic :)
<vadi2> ScottK: yep. thanks a bunch!
<hyperair> vadi2: [ `cat ~/.gnupg/gpg.conf` = "# FILE CREATED BY SEAHORSE" ]
<vadi2> right
<hyperair> oh wait it doesn't work
<vadi2> (that's ok, I'll be doing this from C anyway)
<hyperair> ah
<hyperair> i see
<hyperair> that's fine then
<hyperair> what are you working on anyway
<vadi2> I'll let you know in due time
 * hyperair dies from suspense
<vadi2> haha :)
<hyperair> =p
<bencrisford> haha, how you do that?  is it a "/me" or something?
<hyperair> bencrisford: sure iti s
<hyperair> bencrisford: try it
 * bencrisford is happy
 * bencrisford is gonna be really annoying and wont stop using this if he is not careful...
<bencrisford> hehe, cheers
<wintellect> Hi all
<wintellect> going through the packaging tutorial for "hello" - when using pbuilder with its fake environment - I presume it errors in an obvious way if it fails for some reason?
<bencrisford> wintellect: which tutorial?
<jpds> wintellect: Yes, it'll complain and fail.
<hyperair> and barf.
<wintellect> bencrisford: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Complete
<bencrisford> ah, I think I have seen that yes, thank you anyway ;)
<wintellect> If I make changes to files (eg. the Makefile) to resolve lintian issues - I presume I go back and run debuild then pbuilder?
<hyperair> wintellect: debuild -S
<hyperair> wintellect: or pdebuild
<wintellect> ahhh, k. Thanks
<wintellect> Think I'm finally beginning to understand the process :)
<hyperair> wintellect: =)
<wintellect> I'm appreciating all the help BTW :)
<hyperair> =)
<wintellect> I'm confusedf
<wintellect> the wiki guide says:
<wintellect> "There is one other file, compat which just contains a version number for the debhelper scripts. Occationally new versions of debhelper are released, the current version is 6 so you should set compat to 6"
<wintellect> so I set it to 6
<wintellect> lintian seems to complain:
<wintellect> I: hello source: package-lacks-versioned-build-depends-on-debhelper 6
<wintellect> N:
<wintellect> N:   If a package sets debhelper's compatibility version to >= 5, either
<wintellect> N:   via DH_COMPAT, or via debian/compat, or via dh_testversion (which is
<wintellect> N:   deprecated), it should declare a versioned Build-Depends on the needed
<wintellect> N:   version of debhelper.
<wintellect> Is this safe to ignore?
<jpds> wintellect: Make sure you have debhelper (>= 6.0) in debian/control Build-Deps.
<ivoks> Build-Depends: debhelper (>=6)
<ScottK> Actually the current version is 7
<ScottK> But unless you are using dh 6 or 7 features, compat can be set to 5 and the build-dep unversioned.
<wintellect> How will I know if I need v6/7 features?
<hyperair> wintellect: man debhelper
<hyperair> wintellect: see your debian/compat level. that usually says it
<wintellect> the default debian/compat was set to 5
<wintellect> but i'll check the manpage at somepoint soon
<wintellect> You guys are ace!
 * hyperair feels flattered
<wintellect> Well, it's nice not to get flamed down - as I'm genuinely trying to learn
<hyperair> hahaha that's what happens when you ask in the correct channel =p
<wintellect> I'm going through the docs and trying to understandf it all
<wintellect> :)
<hyperair> good for you =)
<wintellect> YAY - all built and lintian happy :D
<hyperair> congratulations, wintellect
<wintellect> thanks. I feel like I'm a step closer to being part of the community
<hyperair> you already are =)
<wintellect> just to confirm - the files that would be uploaded would be *.diff.gz *.dsc *.orig.tar.gz - just the 3, correct?
<wintellect> And from those the "official" deb package would be made by the server, right?
<hyperair> correct.
<wintellect> :D
<hyperair> one more thing.. you need a *_source.changes file in order to upload
<wintellect> yep, I have one of those
<hyperair> also, did you run lintian on your debs?
<wintellect> I did the "lintian -Ivi *.dsc"
<hyperair> you should do the same on the .debs
<hyperair> *.deb
<wintellect> hmmm...
<wintellect> seems to complain:
<wintellect> N: Setting up lab in /tmp/ZkcuXpudVf ...
<wintellect> error: cannot find binary, udeb or source package *.deb in dist or lab (skipping)
<wintellect> wintellect@backup:~/debian_pkg/hello/hello-2.1.1/debian$ N: No packages selected.
<wintellect> N: Removing /tmp/ZkcuXpudVf ...
<wintellect> ignore me
<wintellect> my bad
<wintellect> in wrong directory :P
<hyperair> hahah
<ScottK> Someone with a wiimote and some free time might want to look at seeing if gtkwhiteboard can be made to work with libbluetooth3.
<ivoks> ScottK: wiimote is a bluetooth device?
<ScottK> ivoks: I have no idea.
<ScottK> I just looked at the package and it build-dep on the no longer existing libbluetooth2 and uses a wiimote
<bencrisford> im'a give that tutorial wintellect did a go
<bencrisford> u guys'll help me yeah?
<hyperair> bencrisford: just ask your questions, and whoever's around will answer
<bencrisford> :)
 * bencrisford is happy to be on this IRC channel
<hyperair> you should be ;)
<bencrisford> ^^
<bencrisford> i'm doing the packaging from scratch hello tutorial here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Complete
<bencrisford> it told me to get the source of hello-debhelp so i do what it said (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Complete)
<bencrisford> (apt-get source hello-debhelper) thats what it told me to get
<bencrisford> and i got this error:
<bencrisford> E: Could not open file /var/lib/apt/lists/download.tuxfamily.org_syzygy42_dists_feisty_avant-window-navigator_source_Sources - open (2 No such file or directory)
<bencrisford> :S
<hyperair> sudo apt-get update
<bencrisford> ok
<bencrisford> W: Failed to fetch http://download.tuxfamily.org/syzygy42/dists/feisty/avant-window-navigator/binary-i386/Packages.gz  404 Not Found
<bencrisford> W: Failed to fetch http://download.tuxfamily.org/syzygy42/dists/feisty/avant-window-navigator/source/Sources.gz  404 Not Found
<bencrisford> E: Some index files failed to download, they have been ignored, or old ones used instead.
<bencrisford> hat explains it
<bencrisford> that*
<bencrisford> :'(, how can i make it work then?
<hyperair> fix your sources.list
<bencrisford> ok
<jpds> Feisty isn't supported anymore.
<bencrisford> how? :P
<hyperair> you should drop something that says deb-src http://download.tuxfamily.org/syzygy42 feisty avant-window-navigator
<bencrisford> ok
<bencrisford> i've got something important and personal to do now, so ill come back to it later
<bencrisford> thanks for all your help :)
<atrejut> mhm, I have a question: after dholbachs packaging training I patched and packaged my first real package yesterday, and it was accepted today... but now I got mail from rosetta saying that it could not import pt_BR and oc translations because I did not update the time stamp - but I never touched these files. so what am I supposed to do about this?
<jpds> atrejut: I think, you can ignore it.
<atrejut> jpds: ok, thanks
<RainCT> Heya
<nhandler> Hey RainCT
<RainCT> lol
 * hyperair wonders what RainCT's laughing about.
<RainCT> nixternal: great april fool joke :)
<nhandler> RainCT: You just saw the emails?
<Snova> ?
<RainCT> nhandler: yes, I've just arrived back from Italy a few hours ago :).  Still have over 150 e-mails in the inbox :/
<nhandler> Snova: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/motu-council/2009-April/002080.html
<hyperair> lol
<nhandler> Mythbuntu also had a nice April Fools joke
<sebner> RainCT: strg + a and then press entf .... guarantees less work and stress :P
<RainCT> hehe
<hyperair> "Hey I want back in!"
<hyperair> hehehe
<smitty__> .join #dpkg
<smitty__> Hey guys.  I'm trying to build my first package but I'm running into problems.  I'm following the tutorial here: http://women.debian.org/wiki/English/PackagingTutorial but when I go to actually build the package with debuild I get the following error: dpkg-source: cannot represent change to wmforkplop-0.9.3.tar.gz: binary file contents changed.  Can somebody help me out?
<dtchen> smitty__: sure, what changes did you make?
<smitty__> dtchen, changes to the source or to files in the debian/ folder?
<dtchen> smitty__: both.
<smitty__> dtchen, nothing to the source.  I edited the control, copyright, docs, init.d, and manpage.1 files in the debian/ folder
<dtchen> smitty__: ok, i'll run through the above url
<dtchen> smitty__: what will also help is if you pastebin the entire debuild output
<smitty__> dtchen, Here's the output: http://pastebin.com/m358894be
<dtchen> hmm
<dtchen> smitty__: what's the output from find /home/smitty/debian/wmforkplop-0.9.3
<smitty__> dtchen,  http://pastebin.com/m28729bbc
<dtchen> smitty__: can walk you through it in #ubuntu-classroom
<dtchen> smitty__: if you don't mind starting afresh, that is. i presume you're doing this on a current jaunty system?
<smitty__> dtchen, okay.  I'm still running hardy actually
#ubuntu-motu 2009-04-05
<vadi2> Hi. I put a backported package into my ppa, and made the build-depends and depends field depend on the version >= in the ppa. But launchpad, when building, is not linking to my package in ppa but ubuntus. how can I rectify this?
<savvas> vadi2: try #launchpad :)
<vadi2> Yeah
<savvas> ah, both fronts, hehe
<savvas> when did you build the backport?
<savvas> maybe it's not in the repository yet?
<vadi2> I built it in my ppa
<vadi2> https://launchpad.net/~mudlet-makers/+archive/ppa
<vadi2> when installing the upgraded mudlet package, it -did- properly pull in the updated qscintilla
<savvas> hm, no idea then
<vadi2> however mudlet is linked against qscintilla 2.so.3, which is ubuntus version. my updated qscintilla is 2.so.5
<vadi2> savvas: this one is annoying too. qscintilla in hardy is unusable, it crashes on newlines (qscintilla being an editor widget)
<savvas> vadi2: if no-one replies ask it as a question at http://answers.launchpad.net/launchpad :)
<szabgab_> hi,
<szabgab_> I have been asking for a long time and finally the Debian team has included Padre, the Perl IDE in Debian Sid
<szabgab_> would it be possible to pull it over to Ubuntu at this late time of the release process?
<Kamping_Kaiser> for the next release? doubt it
<Kamping_Kaiser> (read its to late)
<szabgab_> yeah I thought so but someone told me to come here and beg you ppl
<hyperair> file an FFe, and see if it gets accepted =p
<szabgab_> I have this ticket https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/326353
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 326353 in ubuntu "[needs-packaging] padre-perl" [Wishlist,Confirmed]
<szabgab_> what is an FF ?
<hyperair> Feature Freeze.
<hyperair> that's a package request.
<hyperair> a needs-packaging bug
<hyperair> for this you'll need a sync-request + FFe request
<hyperair> but for FFe you need a good reason
<szabgab_> I don't think I have, besides that it is already in Fedora and Mandriva too :-)
<Kamping_Kaiser> szabgab_, wait 2 months and it'll be in Ubuntu too ;)
<szabgab_> yeah I think that will be the action plan :-(
<hyperair> well blame the bad timing =p
<hyperair> i've got a few packages waiting out the freeze
<szabgab_> yeah but at least it is now in Debian so I hope thing will be smooth next time
<szabgab_> and the IDE will be much more mature too
<hyperair> should be
<hyperair> auto-sync will pull it =)
<szabgab_> so do you mean I don't even need to ask for a sync ?
<hyperair> nope
<hyperair> probably not
<szabgab_> FWIW it runs find on 8.10 (and is being developed mostly on it)
<szabgab_> s/find/fine
<hyperair> no i mean it'll autosync when karmic opens
<hyperair> which is ubuntu 9.10
<szabgab_> that's ok
<szabgab_> At least that means I can point people there if they ask what about Ubuntu packaging
<hyperair> yeah
<hyperair> well if you're impatient you can set up a PPA for it
<szabgab_> I think we are better off with a plain binary executable distribution for the impatient
<szabgab_> thanks for your pointers anyway
<maxb> Does anyone know of a script to merge debian/changelog files? Intelligently combining entries in version number order?
<bencrisford> no, sorry :|
<maxb> maybe I should write one :-)
<Laney> yes
<Laney> hold up
<geser> as MoM does it for the proposed merges, perhaps you can re-use that code
<Laney> maxb: http://orangesquash.org.uk/~laney/merge_changelog
<maxb> yay! Thanks - and it's written in Python, even better :-)
<soc> hi
<soc> can someone help me?
<soc> ~/Entwicklung/Quelltexte/m/merkaartor-0.13.1$ debuild -S -sa
<soc> This package has a Debian revision number but there does not seem to be an appropriate original tar file or .orig directory in the parent directory; (expected merkaartor_0.13.orig.tar.gz or merkaartor-0.13.1.orig)
<soc> my downloaded archive is named merkaartor_0.13.1.orig.tar.gz, my dir merkaartor-0.13.1
<soc> somehow debuild thinks there is a debian revision somewhere ...
<soc> what should i do?
<azeem> soc: probably you have 0.13 in debian/changelog, as opposed to 0.13.1
<sladen> A package I uplaoded has just gone 1.0 (with most of the delta in Ubuntu commited upstream)
<sladen> is it worth doing the UVF?
<Laney> what's new in it?
<sladen> Laney: bug fixes rather than new features
<Laney> then yes
<Laney> no exception needed
<sladen> Laney: ta for the confirmation
<soc> azeem: thanks!
<skarn> I have a package that does not build, it seems the compiler exits with a segfault
<skarn> here's the log from one of the compilers
<skarn> http://dl.getdropbox.com/u/529363/arkn11745.scidavis_0.2.1-1-skarn86_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt
<skarn> I have a package in my PPA that does not build, it seems the compiler exits with a segfault
<skarn> however it builds under intrepid
<skarn> er.. lupdater-qt4 segfaults
<ScottK> mok0: libglw1-mesa-dev: Depends: mesa-common-dev (= 7.4) but 7.4-0ubuntu1 is to be installed
<ScottK> mok0: Do you want to take care of it or should I?
 * andol is rather new to working with deb packages, and is rather confused by the ntop package.
<andol> I can see that the ntop packages has a debian/patches, with a bunch of diffs, but I can't find any references to patching inside debian/rules.
<nhandler> andersk: If you have ubuntu-dev-tools installed, type 'what-patch' to see what patch system is being used
<nhandler> andol: ^^^
<nhandler> andol: Then follow https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/PatchSystems to learn how to add/modify a patch using that patch system
<andol> nhandler: Seems like the famous "unknown patch system" :)
 * nhandler goes to look
<nhandler> andol: What exactly are you trying to do with that package? After looking at it, that package is a huge mess
<nhandler> It also hasn't been touched by the DM in nearly a year (even though the BTS has plenty of bugs and patches)
<andol> nhandler: Figured I'd take a crack at bug #325393 and implement the simple patch applied by Fedora.
<ubottu> Error: Could not parse data returned by Launchpad: The read operation timed out (https://launchpad.net/bugs/325393/+text)
<andol> nhandler: Later on I'd also like to do something about bug #355127, and see if I can make debconf ask for that password during the installation.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 355127 in ntop "ntop admin user not created during install" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/355127
<andol> nhandler: But if the package is a mess, perhaps it should get "cleaned up" in Debian first, before we start doing any major things with it?
<nhandler> andol: What I would suggest doing is contacting the Debian Maintainer to see if they are still interested in the package. If so, try and work with them to clean it up as well as incorporate some of these patches (as well as the ones on the BTS) into the package. Then, we can sync this package in Karmic
<andol> nhandler: Did I mention that I'm rather new to working with packages? :) But hey, I guess it can be a learning experience...
<nhandler> andol: A lot of the clean-up stuff is relatively simple. However, they are the types of changes that we like to avoid making for packages that are also in Debian. That is why I recommended contacting the DM
<andol> nhandler: makes sense.
<bluefoxicy> aww, the geramik engine no longer exists
<bluefoxicy> why does evolution take like 10minutes to start up?
<MTecknology> bluefoxicy: because it's bloated
<bluefoxicy> MTecknology:  switching to evo was probably a mistake, also they deleted the "unmatched" search folder which has made it practically useless
<MTecknology> Hey, if there's a good reason for 2.6.0 to be included in Ubuntu once it's released, how hard is the to get pushed?
<bluefoxicy> evolution's strange sorting method only works because of the "unmatched" folder
<MTecknology> bluefoxicy: I used it a few times and hated every on eof those experiences. I have no trace of anything e-d-s on my system
<MTecknology> hrm - that's not my problem... If I make a patch to change the SSL back end of pidgin, how hard is that to get pushed through?
<bluefoxicy> hey that's cool
<bluefoxicy> when Jaunty locks up I can push numlock and the kernel wakes up
<MTecknology> interesting
<bluefoxicy> Jaunty has a habit of halting all disk access
<bluefoxicy> and then everything freezes for 5 minutes
<andol> nhandler: Hey, the debian maintainer for ntop just happens to have been a member of the same academic computer soceity which I have connections to :) That should makes things a bit easier...
<MTecknology> There's an issue with the timing in gnutls inpidgin, so I want to make a patch to making it use something different, but of course - that'll be a massive pita.
<MTecknology> http://developer.pidgin.im/ticket/8594
<nhandler> andol: That is always nice. You might make a new friend out of this ;)
<goshawk> what does dfgs means in a package name?
<ScottK> dfsg stands for Debian Free Software Guidelines.  It means some non-free bits had to be removed from the tarball and the tarball repacked.
<Laney> Does the MonoDevelop 2 FFe still stand?
<Laney> actually, it might even be bugfix
<mok0> ScottK: Thanks for message, I didn't notice. I'll take care of it
<ScottK> mok0: OK.  Thanks.  I've got a depwait I'm trying to clear that I need that for ....
<mok0> ScottK: I can use 7.4~ right?
<ScottK> mok0: The problem is th =
<ScottK> th/the
<ScottK> 7.4 != 7.4-0ubuntu1
<mok0> ScottK: yes... but I'd like it to ignore the release
<mok0> ScottK: there's no wildcard afaik
<ScottK> I'd just do >= 7.4, =< 7.5 (or whatever number is approprate)
<james_w> >= 7.4~ , < 7.5~
 * ScottK high fives james_w.
<mok0> ScottK, james_w: thx
<ScottK> Not =<, <
<Laney> isn't it <<?
<mok0> Using  mesa-common-dev (>= 7.4~)
<ScottK> Isn't mesa-common-dev (>= 7.4~), mesa-common-dev (< 7.5) what you want?
<mok0> ScottK: oh
<maxb> Isn't < a deprecated alias for <= ?
<hyperair> maxb: where did you get that from?
<maxb> Good question :-)
<maxb> The deprecated forms < and > were used to mean earlier/later or equal, rather than strictly earlier/later, so they should not appear in new packages (though dpkg still supports them).
<maxb> sez policy
<ScottK> So I guess it should have been <<
<wintellect> I have an app that I wrote a while back that I am trying to pkg-ise. It supports both MySQL and PgSQL, but only needs one DB to work. Do I build it with support for one DB only? Both DBs? write it as two seperate pkgs that are mutually exclusive?
<james_w> wintellect: hey, checkout dbconfig-common
<wintellect> james_w: ok... but I'm new to this, do I download the source with "apt-get source" to check it out?
<james_w> of course :-)
<wintellect> james_w: k, thanks
<maxb> wintellect: and use "apt-cache rdepends dbconfig-common" to show a list of packages using it, that you might look at to see examples of its usage
<wintellect> maxb: thanks
<wintellect> How do I get dbconfig-common to add "--enable-mysql" to the "./configure" command?
<neversfelde> Hello, I'm trying to package bilbo, a KDE blogging app. It uses a modified version of KBlog, which is included in the source, I splitted it into a package called libbilbokblog0, but no I ran into a problem with dh_shlibdeps. Error is like that: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/145175/
<neversfelde> I guess I have to write a shlib.local , but I cannot figure out, what to put in there. Can somebody help me?
<neversfelde> mhh, I may be wrong, only a debian/shlib?
<RAOF> If you're making a library from the same source, you'll need do be calling dh_makeshlibs first, I think.
<neversfelde> RAOF: cdbs should call it, or?
<neversfelde> it is
<RAOF> Oh, cdbs? :(
<neversfelde> mhh, this is really complex :)
<RAOF> Yeah; library packaging _is_ complex.
<neversfelde> mhh, should sleep, will try tomorrow again
<neversfelde> RAOF: thank you
<pochu> neversfelde: do you really want to make the modified kblog library public?
<pochu> I doubt it
<neversfelde> pochu: lintian complained. Should it stay in the main package?
<pochu> yes
<pochu> and don't install any .la, .a, .so, or .h for it
<neversfelde> mhh, ok. Than my first package was the best :). But I learned a bit^^
<pochu> just the .so.X.Y.Z and .so.X, I guess
<neversfelde> pochu: thank you, I will look into it again.
<pochu> since you don't want to make a public library...
<pochu> the public library would be the real kblog :)
<pochu> neversfelde: np
#ubuntu-motu 2010-04-05
<DiegoTc> hi
<DiegoTc> Is someone available right now?
 * mhall119 is available but not a motu
<nigelb> !ask | didrocks
<ubottu> didrocks: Please don't ask to ask a question, simply ask the question (all on ONE line and in the channel, so that others can read and follow it easily). If anyone knows the answer they will most likely reply. :-)
<nigelb> ugh!
<nigelb> !ask | DiegoTc
<ubottu> DiegoTc: Please don't ask to ask a question, simply ask the question (all on ONE line and in the channel, so that others can read and follow it easily). If anyone knows the answer they will most likely reply. :-)
<wrapster>  in the postinst script i cannot execute how do i execute shell commands?coz one in particular called 'update-ca-certificates' fails if written inside the postinst scrip
<wrapster> but anywhere else if i write its working fine.
<wrapster> http://pastie.org/900511
<sistpoty> wrapster: got the package a depends on ca-certificates?
<wrapster> sistpoty: one sec let me see
<wrapster> yes there are quite a few pkgs that depened on ca-certificates
<wrapster> sistpoty: but why is that important?
<sistpoty> wrapster: if the packages uses a command found in ca-certificates (i.e. update-ca-certificates), it needs to have the package providing the command installed prior to it
<wrapster> sistpoty: apt-get install ca-certificates is giving me this error http://pastie.org/903294
<wrapster> hmm.. ok let me verify that .. one sec pls.
<wrapster> sistpoty: yes that pkg is already installed.
<sistpoty> wrapster: then, s.th. went wrong? not too sure how to debug that in the first place, I guess running the commands of the postinst by hand could shed further lights
<sistpoty> s/lights/light/
<wrapster> sistpoty: yes i kinda did that and was able to see that the shell command here ' http://pastie.org/900511 ' that is update-ca-certificates is the probelm.. I was able to deduce so by actually removing that line from the postinst script .. then the pkg was installed cleanly. so its definitely the case with this cmd.
<sistpoty> wrapster: did you check what went wrong with that command yet?
<wrapster> sistpoty: i cannot find that out.. coz i ran the cmd independently and it works fine.
<wrapster> its only within the script.
<wrapster> and secondly 'update-ca-certificates' binary comes from 'ca-certificates' pkg .. and this pkg's postinst script itself is calling the update-ca-certificate cmd ... Will this cmd be initialized by the time postinst is run?
<wrapster> could that be the reason?
<sistpoty> wrapster: there's no state of initialized/uninitialized for a *command*, however the command might need data provided by a package
<wrapster> hmm..
<wrapster> but i see it working on a lot of debian machines already.
<wrapster> my own ubunutu has it working.
<wrapster> this pkg working.. its on another machine im trying to install this and its failing.
<sistpoty> wrapster: just a wild guess, but maybe update-ca-certificates checks some data and fails if e.g. a certificate is not in the right format?
<wrapster> hmm.. let me check that..
<wrapster> thanks..
<sistpoty> yw
<DiegoTc> I got this erro https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Complete when I  am doing the debuild command
<DiegoTc> I am really lost here :S
<ScottK> What error?
<DiegoTc> Scottk this one http://pastebin.com/qSuibTZR
<DiegoTc> sorry i got confuse of link
<ScottK> No problem.  Looking
<ScottK> DiegoTc: Does your package build-depend on qmake?
<DiegoTc> Scottk yes it does, its a small app I did using QT4c++
<ScottK> Is qmake installed?
<ScottK> What is "No hay ninguna regla para construir el objetivo" in English?
<DiegoTc> "there is no any rule for building the objective"
<DiegoTc> Scottk I suppose its build because I am compiling it on my computer right now
<ScottK> I'm not sure exactly what the problem is.
<DiegoTc> :S
<ScottK> What happens if you run make -f debian/rules clean from the source directory of your package?
<DiegoTc> ScottK, you mean to do this  make -f debian/rules
<ScottK> DiegoTc: Close.
<ScottK> make -f debian/rules clean
<ScottK> That should just run the clean rule.
<ScottK> Which is where the error you showed me was.
<DiegoTc> ScottK,  HERE http://pastebin.com/hhbWMJWn
<DiegoTc> i put the translation down
<ScottK> Right.
<ScottK> So I guess there is some qmake problem here.
<ScottK> Unfortunately it's not something I know about.
<DiegoTc> ScottK, so what you will recommend me ??
<ScottK> Figure out why you don't have the Makefile parts that qmake is saying are needed.  I have no idea what those are.
<ScottK> Sorry I can't be more help.
<DiegoTc> thanks
<DiegoTc> ScottK,
<DiegoTc> ScottK, I found this link http://pkg-perl.alioth.debian.org/debhelper.html#module__build__compat
<DiegoTc> and i add this to the rules debhelper 7.0.17.
<DiegoTc> and when i do the  sudo make -f debian/rules clean I got this message http://pastebin.com/VVjqTa6A
<thewho> hi all
<kobrien> hey guys
<kobrien> looks like debian fixed the public_html problem Bug: 554903
<kobrien> how exactly do their fixed get into our builds?
<ScottK> Bug 554903
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 554903 in apache2 "apache2 with mod php5 does not execute index.php" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/554903
<kobrien> I can make a patch if that helps?
<ScottK> kobrien: Generally once the new package is in Debian, someone would prepare an updated merge.
<ScottK> kobrien: It would.
<ScottK> The most preferred patch would be a merge debdiff (unless their upload has other invasive changes).
<ScottK> But any form of patch attached to a bug would be a help.
<kobrien> ScottK: how would I go about "merge debdiff". take their debdiff and apply?
<ScottK> !merge
<ubottu> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/Merging
<ScottK> Have a look there.
<kobrien> ScottK: will do. thanks
<kobrien> ScottK: when I run grab-merge it fails
<kobrien> with "unexpected operator"
<RoAkSoAx> kobrien, as ../grab-merge.sh <package_name> ?
<kobrien> yes
<kobrien> well
<kobrien> ./grab-merge.sh php5
<kobrien> in an empthy dir, correct?
<kobrien> empty*
<RoAkSoAx> kobrien, yep. But check in merges.ubuntu.com/universe.html or merges.ubuntu.com/main.html for which packages are available for ".grab-merging"
<kobrien> it's really libapache2-php5 I'm after, but it's not listed
<RoAkSoAx> kobrien, libapache2-mod-php5 ?
<ScottK> RoAkSoAx: That's only work for things in Testing.
<ScottK> He's looking for something just uploaded.
<kobrien> ScottK: please advise
<kobrien> RoAkSoAx: yes
<RoAkSoAx> ScottK, since he was using grab-merge that's why I thought he was looking to merge a package from debian in testing :)
<ScottK> kobrien: You mean libapache2-mod-php5?
<kobrien> ScottK: yes
<ScottK> That's part of the php5 source package.
<RoAkSoAx> kobrien, poh o just read backlog. You would have to do: 'apt-get source libapache2-mod-php5', which is actually in php5 source package. So it will download the source package and you can start working from there
<kobrien> RoAkSoAx: ok so
<kobrien> that's how I'd normally patch, but debian have released a fix, I was gonna merge their fix, but I can easily just implement it in a patch
<kobrien> of my own
<ScottK> Better to get Debians.
<ScottK> (for consistency)
<RoAkSoAx> yep
<kobrien> right, so can I apply their debdiff directly?...how to proceed?
<ScottK> kobrien: I don't see anything new uploaded yet: http://packages.qa.debian.org/p/php5.html
<ScottK> "There are 64 open security issues, please fix them."
<kobrien> basing off this: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=571714
<ubottu> Debian bug 571714 in libapache2-mod-php5 "apache 2.2.14 doesn't parse php5 in public_html" [Normal,Fixed]
<ScottK> kobrien: We should have that in Lucid already
<ScottK> Are you wanting a fix for Karmic?
<kobrien> nope, Lucid
<ScottK> We already it then (at least in theory).
<ScottK> It could have been a bad merge.
<ScottK> So I'd grab the Ubuntu source (apt-get soure php5) and then check too see if it's there already.
<kobrien> righteo
<kobrien> 2 secs
<kobrien> ScottK: It appears that in the current lucid version, the behaviour of not serving php from public_html is known. It gives details of how to enable it, but it's not default. surely it should be
<kobrien> do you agree?
<ScottK> kobrien: I'd ask zul on #ubuntu-server when he's working tomorrow.
<ScottK> Personally I've never failed to avoid dealing with php and prefer to keep it that way.
<kobrien> ScottK: ;) no probs. I'll see what I can do. The fix is easy, but I'll consult zul. thanks
<nigelb> ok, so in my .pbuilderrc I have this line UBUNTU_MIRROR="http://ubuntuarchive.hnsdc.com/" unfortunately, pbuilder is not using that mirror even after source .pbuilderrc
<nigelb> any thoughts on what I'm doing wrong ?
<ScottK> I don't see any mention of UBUNTU_MIRROR in man pbuilder
<nigelb> I use this https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto#Multiple%20pbuilders
<ScottK> OK.
<nigelb> and its still not working :D
 * kobrien compiles the hell out of php
<ScottK> nigelb: If you want to figure out how to get this one to build, that'd be nice too: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/php-imlib/0.7-1build1
<nigelb> ScottK, was that for me or kobrien ?
<kobrien> probably me, I'll look into ot
<ScottK> nigelb: Actuall kobrien.  Thanks.
<ScottK> ../
<ScottK> y
<kobrien> :)
 * ScottK goes to bed.
<kobrien> nn
<ScottK> Good night.
<nigelb> good night :)
<kobrien> thanks for the help
<kobrien> ooh, that bug looks good.
<wrapster> vi and vim are not a part of any pkg?
<nigelb> it is
<wrapster> dpkg -S didnt show anything.
<wrapster> why so then?
<nigelb> you dont have it installed?
<kobrien> it lists fine when it's installed
<kobrien> wrapster: install with "sudo apt-get install vim"
<wrapster> kobrien: and how about vi?
<kobrien> hmm, can't vim work in vi mode
<nigelb> vim-tiny perhaps?
<wrapster> no..
<wrapster> Im acutally curious to know about 'update-alternatives' for my own reasons.. thats why asking you guys.. as i see that both vi and vim point to the same file eventually.
<wrapster> and that is 'vim.basic'
<kobrien> :set compatible?
<kobrien> I think that'll put vim in vi mode
<wrapster> kobrien: no i dont have issues using the editor nor do i want info on using it.. I want to know just how both vi and vim manage to point to the same file.
<wrapster> i need to just take a look at it thats all.
<kobrien> oh...cause vi isn't packaged. only vim is availible but it acts just like vi
<kobrien> if you want it to. that's why both point to it
<wrapster> ah.. ok..
<wrapster> I got that..
<wrapster> kobrien: so by default debian does not ship vi at all.. Is that what your telling me?
<nigelb> yup
<wrapster> thank you.
<wrapster> guys
<kobrien> yup
<kobrien> cool
<kobrien> there's no need as vim provides its functionality
 * kobrien still compiling...
<kobrien> if I make a patch, is it useful for me to upload more than a debdiff?
<persia> kobrien: Not really, no.  Also, does your patch fix an issue generally, or is it just an aggregation of currently available patches?
<kobrien> it is a single fix for default configuration of apache2
<persia> Ah, for that just the debdiff is fine then.
<kobrien> cool, thanks.
<nigelb> how do I unapply a patch?
<nigelb> is there a way?
<maco> nigelb: diff -r, i think
<persia> What sort of patch?
<nigelb> well, I was going to patch with quilt, but forgot quilt add
<nigelb> so, now I have to remove applied patch and do a quilt add and then patch again
<persia> How did you apply the patch?
<nigelb> patch -p1 < blablabla.pach
<maco> brain not working sorry
<nigelb> maco, I did wonder
<maco> nigelb: have you learned about "quilt import" yet?
<nigelb> um, no
 * nigelb goes to man pages
<nigelb> ah, never knew this one.. this is cool :)
<persia> diff -r ought work for that case, but quilt import is better.
<nigelb> so no need to do a quilt new when using quilt import?
<persia> Right.
<persia> Instead, you need to use -f or -d when you want not to have a new patch.
<maco> persia: you mean like if you want to combine 2 or 3 external patches into 1 quilt patch?
<persia> maco: Or you want to merge/overwrite some quilt patch with some external patch.  man quilt :)
<maco> ooh alrighty. i only ever used it for adding 1 patch at a time
 * nigelb glares at maco 
<nigelb> you taught me quilt :D
<maco> nigelb: what?
<maco> nigelb: i taught you a long way round?
<nigelb> yeah
<maco> nigelb: was possibly before i learned about import
<nigelb> ahhh
<maco> ive only done the new, add, edit, <manually edit things without the patch command>, refresh thing once, i think
<maco> having a patch to import is much more common
<nigelb> generally I did new, add, (then manually patch -p1...), quilt refresh
<maco> yeah thats what i did til i learned about import
<nigelb> so if the patch is improperly formatted, I guess I have to manually do it
<maco> hmmm? well i hope you dont normally add patches that dont apply...
<nigelb> I'm doing patch review... well.. a lot of patches dont apply properly
<maco> yeah
<maco> patch --dry-run
<nigelb> I do that first always
<nigelb> I guess I have to manually correct the directory structure
<persia> Did you use the right -pN argument?  That's my most frequent mistake.
<nigelb> naah.  the patch author hasn't referenced the file (s)he wants to patch correctly
<nigelb> instead of share/applications/vlc.desktop its just vlc.desktop
<nigelb> someday, someone will write a script to properly tag patches
<nigelb> until then, I'll just crib about it I guess
<nigelb> is normal for series file to have $patch_name -p$ ?
<nigelb> i.e. after importing
<maco> if the patch has a p number other than 1, sure
<maco> (1 is default i believe)
<nigelb> I think if I specify something it turns up there
 * maco waits for persia to say she's wrong
<nigelb> 1 is default :)
<persia> maco is wrong
<nigelb> persia, which part?
<persia> No, the default is not to do nested trees.
<nigelb> -p num - Number of directory levels to strip when applying (default=1)
<nigelb> ^ from man quilt
<persia> The default is for the directory hierarchy in the patches to be ignored, and for it to apply to patches in the local directory.  Under certain circumstances, this is indistinguisable from p1
<persia> Oh, sorry.  I'm describing patch behaviour.  quilt is likely saner
<nigelb> ah :)
<nigelb> why is my pbuilder not accepting a mirror from the .pbuilderrc file :(
<nigelb> is this part of a mirror problem? http://paste.ubuntu.com/409379/
<persia> nigelb: That does indicate a mirror problem.  I recommend adding *multiple* entries to sources.list for each component.  Put the ones network-closest to you first, followed by those further away, and with archive.ubuntu.com/ports.ubuntu.com at the end of the list.
<nigelb> persia, well, its from my pbuilder build log
<persia> apt will try them in order, so you get the advantages of mirroring where the mirror works, and fall back to something trusted if the mirror doesn't work.
<persia> There too :)
<nigelb> I set the mirror as my closest one, but it just refuses to accept that one :x
<nigelb> persia, pbuilder seems adamant on using the mirrors.kernel.org one
<nigelb> I did a source .pbuilder and still didn't change
<persia> That's hacked into pbuilder-dist
<nigelb> no no
<nigelb> I use this https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto#Multiple%20pbuilders
<persia> No idea then.
<persia> Have you considered sbuild?
<nigelb> no
<nigelb> is there a how-to somewhere?
<persia> Are you running lucid?
<nigelb> nope... ugh.. sbuild needs lvm?
<persia> Not in lucid.
<nigelb> I'm running karmic
<persia> Upgrade!
 * kobrien slaves over lucid bugs
<nigelb> I'm not a fan of Upgrade.  I always do clean installs
<persia> lucid is stable enough that if there's anything that doesn't work, you want to know *now* so you have a chance of fixing it.
<persia> Mind you, I run karmic on some of my machines, but most certainly not on my development machines.
<persia> upgrade should just work.  If something doesn't work, that's a fixable bug.
<kobrien> lucid is quite stable
<nigelb> still I'm curious as to why pbuilder doesn't work
<persia> I can't help you with that.  My experience with pbuilder is limited to patching pbuilder-dist a couple times.
<nigelb> I'll just try override-config and if that doesnt work pbuilder-dist
<persia> pbuilder-dist hardcodes the mirror in a way I think non-optimal
<persia> And I believe lool was working upstream to try to obsolete pbuilder-dist
<nigelb> sigh.  I guess I have to upgrade then
<geser> lfaraone: http://paste.ubuntu.com/409383/ I hope this finally fixes it
 * kobrien face palm. a static type, qualified by static when declared in a function.
<kkszysiu> is package freeze now? Or I can upload new packages?
<nigelb> kkszysiu, we are in feature freeze for lucid now.  If you really want your package in, you need a feature freeze exception
<kobrien> ScottK: successfully compiled https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/php-imlib/0.7-1build1
<nigelb> kobrien, you work magic :)
<kkszysiu> nigelb, ah
<nigelb> kkszysiu, I would suggesting getting the package into debian, it will be synced into lucid then
<nigelb> urm... lucid+1
<kkszysiu> yeah, thats my plan :P
<kobrien> nigelb: I just code C. :). It compiles anyway.
<nigelb> kobrien, :)
<kobrien> nigelb: I'm unsure as to how to proceed. It's not like there's a report I can attach a patch to. How do I commit my change?
<nigelb> just make a bug report
<kobrien> nigelb: cool
<nigelb> attach a debdiff and subscribe sponsors
<nigelb> if you're unsure how to make a debdiff.. attach a simple patch and ping me I'll make a debdiff for ya :)
<kobrien> I can debdiff :), cheers
<nigelb> cool :)
<kobrien> oh wait
<kobrien> no, I can debdiff
<kobrien> :D
<kkszysiu> hmm anyone have idea how to change libexecdir in package? I mean it should be /usr/telepathy/telepathy-sunshine but is /usr/telepathy-sunshine/telepathy-sunshinee. Its strange because if I compile it uusing make & make  install it  see that llibexecsir is /usr/lib/telepathy/telepathy-sunshine
<geser> kobrien: for php-imlib?
<geser> there is a patch from me waiting in the Debian BTS
<geser> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=569118
<ubottu> Debian bug 569118 in src:php-imlib "php-imlib: FTBFS with php 5.3" [Serious,Open]
<nigelb> geser, for the vlc bug, I got hit with glibc error
<geser> have you an error message?
<nigelb> ouch...lost it... 2 mins
<kobrien> geser: didn't see that. my patch does the same thing...
<geser> kobrien: just a hint for the next time: look if there is a bug (with patch) in LP or in the Debian PTS just waiting on someone uploading it, it can save you time
<kobrien> geser: noted
<geser> kobrien: can you test if the package still works? I don't have a setup ready to test it and didn't had time yet to setup one.
<kobrien> geser: other than installing it, how can I test?
<geser> http://packages.ubuntu.com/lucid/i386/php-imlib/filelist shows that it contains some examples
<kobrien> geser: ok, I'll have a look now.
<geser> with apache + php + php-imlib you should be able to run them
<kobrien> geser: yeah, I'll copy them and see if they work
<geser> thanks
<nigelbabu> geser, so this error I got had something to do with glib c and I got a trace output, etc
<nigelbabu> I'm rebuilding right now to get a log
<kobrien> geser: package is broken
<geser> kobrien: :(
<kobrien> geser: it's "fatal error" in the logs is that it can't "imlib_create_image" which is kinda necessary for it, as an image library, :(
<nigelb> geser, something strange just happened... twice.. everytime I build vlc again, my system shuts down :(
<geser> oh
<nigelb> any clue whats going wrong?
<kobrien> nigelb: weird
<nigelb> kobrien, definitely
<geser> sorry no idea
<nigelb> I'll try pushing to a PPA
<nigelb> that should give an idea if somethings wrong only locally :)
<geser> have you checked your logs for a kernel oops or a out-of-memory case?
<nigelb> how do I do that?
<geser> check /var/log/messages or /var/log/syslog
<geser> and hope your system was still enough alive to log something
<geser> anyone interested in merging "xpdf"? It contains some security fixes and would be nice to have in lucid.
<nigelb> neither exists
<nigelb> oh, success.. vlc builds :)
 * hyperair tickles james_w. banshee-community-extensions is NEW again :-)
<cnd> I've got a fix for gnome-settings-daemon bug 484186, I've proposed merging my fix branch, and linked the bug to the branch
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 484186 in gnome-settings-daemon "Cannot switch Monitor configuration CRTC 58" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/484186
<cnd> should I also be subscribing ubuntu-sponsors?
<dyfet> cnd: I gather you have a patch?  I have seen this issue also, and had wondered about it :)
<cnd> dyfet: I've actually created a bzr branch in lp with the fix
<cnd> it's ready to be merged
<persia> cnd: Yes, subscribing ubuntu-sponsors is potentially helpful, although you'd want to check the sponsoring report source to be sure.  You might also see if anyone is around in #ubuntu-desktop who can push it quickly (most of us don't have upload rights to that package).
<cnd> persia: check the sponsoring report for what? (and where is the sponsoring report?)
<persia> cnd: Check the code to see if subscribing ubuntu-sponsors does anything at all, and https://code.launchpad.net/~dholbach/ubuntu-sponsoring/trunk
<cnd> persia: I'm not following you, what should I be checking in this code for?
<nigelb> persia, the bug does show up in the sponsoring report
<persia> nigelb: So subscribing ubuntu-sponsors when performing a merge request is superfluous?
<cnd> if you're referring to here: http://qa.ubuntu.com/reports/sponsoring/, then the merge request is enough to get on there
<nigelb> persia, I believe so, yes
<cnd> is that all I need to do then? (outside of maybe bringing it up in #ubuntu-desktop)?
<persia> If it appears at qa.ubuntu.com/reports/sponsoring then yes.
<cnd> persia: ok, thanks!
<c_korn> does the source format 3.0 (quilt) need an explicit build dependency for quilt ?
<ScottK> c_korn: No.
<ScottK> (mostly)
<persia> ScottK: mostly?
<c_korn> because lintian warned me that a quilt is missing in build-depends. but maybe because I had "include /usr/share/quilt/quilt.make" in the debian/rules file. is this also required or is patching now done automatically ?
<james_w> not unless you call quilt while building
<james_w> c_korn: you should be able to drop that
<ScottK> persia: Depending on the exact version of dpkg(-dev) involved if you ship a quilt .pc file (I think that's it), the build-dep on quilt is still required.
<ScottK> I think, but am not certain, that's not an issue anymore.
<persia> ScottK: Ah, yes.  That's not an issue anymore in sid/squeeze/lucid
<matttbe> Hello james_w
<matttbe> I've a question about this branch https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/lucid/cairo-dock/lucid : cairo-dock packages have been updated but not this branch, is there a problem?
<c_korn> is README.source required in 3.0 (quilt) ?
<ScottK> Not due to having quilt and patches
<matttbe> (cairo-dock-plug-ins branch has been updated => https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/lucid/cairo-dock-plug-ins/lucid )
<persia> c_korn: And please don't reference quilt in the build for format 3.0(quilt) : if you rely on some obscure behaviour related to how patches are applied at build time using quilt, use format 3.0(native).
<james_w> hyperair: you never replied to my mail, is the part without any license statements sorted?
<james_w> matttbe: probably
<hyperair> james_w: ah sorry about that. yes, everything's now documented in debian/copyright.
<james_w> matttbe: yeah, there's a bug in the importer that this package is hitting
<hyperair> james_w: lirc still is missing copyright statements, but i've mentioned in a comment where the original code came from, plus a debian/copyright that upstream did before  b-c-e was founded.
<c_korn> persia: ok, thanks for the warning
<matttbe> james_w: ok, I'd seen this problem and somebody tells me to ping you
<matttbe> I also have another question: I've added 'apport' support in 'cairo-dock' packages but all needed informations are located in a private bug report. How can I access to this private bug? e.g. bug #553265
<ubottu> Error: Could not parse data returned by Launchpad: list index out of range (https://launchpad.net/bugs/539889)
 * Pici looks at bot error
<persia> matttbe: Your best plan for getting access to that class of bugs is to work with the bugsquad long enough to gain Bug Control.  They usually hang out in #ubuntu-bugs and are always happy to help new folks learn the processes.
<persia> matttbe: Alternately, I believe you can subscribe to *all* bugs for the package of interest, but I'm not absolutely sure that works.
<matttbe> I subscribed to all bugs for these packages but it didn't work
<persia> Yeah, then you need to be in bug control.
<persia> I can inspect that bug in particular, and maybe make unprivate, but that's not a general solution.
<matttbe> yes but can I only access to cairo-dock's bugs ?
<persia> No, bug control is for access to *all* apport bugs.
<matttbe> :) strange
<lfaraone> Hm. Does updating a packages' protocol support count as "new features"? I'm eyeing http://www.wireshark.org/docs/relnotes/wireshark-1.2.7.html right now.
<persia> lfaraone: Can it introduce new bugs?
<persia> matttbe: bug #539889 is no longer private
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 539889 in cairo-dock "cairo-dock crashed with SIGSEGV in cairo_dock_initialize_opengl_backend()" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/539889
<soren> I'm trying to use mk-sbuild to build me a debian chroot. It fails because apparantly apt is not build-essential in Debian. I can't get that to make sense to me.
<persia> soren: Which part doesn't make sense?
<soren> persia: Good question :)
<persia> soren: And I believe the solution was in debootstrap, although if I'm wrong, I'm happy to hint apt in mk-sbuild.
<soren> persia: Probably that apt is not build-essential in Debian (even though it is in Ubuntu).
<persia> It won't be in Ubuntu much longer, I think.  Personally, I don't see any reason for it to be build-essential.
<soren> persia: Except that buildd's won't work very well without it.
<persia> It's not safe to call apt *during* a build, after all.
<persia> That's an artifact of how the buildds are configured.
<soren> I suppose.
<persia> There's no reason one can't set the right apt arguments, and complete the build-deps in the chroot *before* entering the chroot to run the build.
<persia> It just doesn't happen to be implemented that way.
<ScottK> lfaraone: I'd call it bug fix.
<ScottK> We definitely want the latest wireshark anyway.
<lfaraone> ScottK: okay then :)
<DktrKranz> I prepared a list of orphaned packages with Ubuntu changes: http://merkel.debian.org/~dktrkranz/ubuntu_QA   It could be interesting uploading such changes to Debian as QA uploads if feasible, thoughts?
<ScottK> It's a good idea.  I've been doing that as I run across such packages.
<DktrKranz> some packages could be candidate for removal as well, but at least there's a chance to reduce deltas a bit. Any idea how to spread it?
<nigelb> DktrKranz, I've been uploading to debian and requesting sync when debian qa is the maintainer
<DktrKranz> nigelb: do you have uploads yet to be sponsored?
<nigelb> nope.  all done and synced
<DktrKranz> good .)
<DktrKranz> _=
<DktrKranz> :) (\o/)
<nigelb> I can try and help with this btw, giving back upstream is nice :)
<DktrKranz> definitely :)
<nigelb> DktrKranz, anyway to agree to fix a particular package?
<nigelb> i.e. mark as I will be fixing it
<DktrKranz> nigelb: wiki page? upload on mentors.d.n, so PTS is informed?
<nigelb> DktrKranz, ah, I wanted to delay uploading to mentors.  well, I guess I'll have to do it sooner than later
<DktrKranz> nigelb: no need to use it, I can sponsor them as well, just give me a pointer to a .dsc or a debdiff :)
<nigelb> ok, I'll get to work :)
<DktrKranz> thanks!
<nigelb> DktrKranz, I'll move that table onto a wiki.  some of the ubuntu changes need not be moved back upstream
<nigelb> DktrKranz, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Debian/QADelta
<wrapster> in the postinst script i cannot execute how do i execute shell commands?coz one in particular called 'update-ca-certificates' fails if written inside the postinst script
<wrapster> but anywhere else if i write its working fine.
<wrapster> http://pastie.org/900511
<wrapster> i've been at it with no result.. would really appreciate help
<geser> wrapster: then find out why it fails (edit that shell-script to show you what it's doing and where it fails)
<geser> even if you post it once more, we can't tell you what's wrong because we don't know why the script fails
<stevecrozz> I've just built a new package 'uwsgi' which provides one binary, should I copy the binary to /usr/bin in debian/rules?
<stevecrozz> and how would apt no to remove it during apt-get remove?
<geser> why would you want to remove the package but not the binary?
<stevecrozz> geser: you wouldn't want that of course, but I don't know how to provide that
<stevecrozz> if I just "cp uwsgi26 $(CURDIR)/debian/$(package)/usr/bin" in install: build ... will that work?
<geser> yes, that will make it part of the deb
<DktrKranz> nigelb: nice, thanks
<wrapster> geser: i did all those.. i was able to find out that command 'update-ca-certificte' was failing
<wrapster> and thats about it.
<nigelb> DktrKranz, some changes are not required to be sent to debian, so people can comment :)
<wrapster> I tried with 'set -x' to figure it out but nothing was helpful
<wrapster> geser: I can also confirm that this cmd is the problem as i removed this from the postinst script and the pkg was installed cleanly.
<geser> wrapster: you added "set -x" to update-ca-certificates? that should show you where it failed so you can try to figure out why
<stevecrozz> geser: Is there any reading you can point me to on how to do this right? I'm seeing this type of stuff: mkdir: cannot create directory `/home/stevecrozz/src/uwsgi/uwsgi-0.9.4.3/debian/uwsgi/usr/bin': No such file or directory
<wrapster> geser: yes i added it to that command.. as such in the postinst script.. I cannot add it else where.
<wrapster> geser: and it didnt work.. http://pastie.org/904051
<geser> stevecrozz: either mkdir $(CURDIR)/debian/$(package)/usr/bin or put "usr/bin/" debian/dirs and use dh_installdirs
<slytherin> Can anyone think of any reason why liboscache-java is missing from archive even though it is listed on LP - https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/oscache
<geser> wrapster: you have to add "set -x" to update-ca-certificates to see where it fails. without this nobody can help you as we don't know where and why it fails
<wrapster> but thats a command right and its provided by the same pkg that is failing.. namely 'ca-certificates'
<geser> slytherin: see the mail from slytherin on u-d-a (see also https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/lucid/i386/liboscache-java)
<geser> wrapster: you have to temporarily modify that script else you don't figure out why it fails (once you know why it fails, you can undo those changes again)
<geser> I don't know an other way to debug this
<wrapster> ok thanks.. i try to do something and get back to you.
<slytherin> geser: Thanks. I missed the mail.
<geser> slytherin: once you resolved the FTBFS the package can come back
<slytherin> geser: Checking why it FTBFS
<wrapster> geser: yes got it.. thanks .. here is the problem..
<wrapster> http://pastie.org/904060
<geser> wrapster: now you have to figure out what c_rehash does and why it fails
<geser> slytherin: http://people.ubuntuwire.org/~lucas/ubuntu-nbs/32/oscache_2.4.1+dak1-1_llucid32.buildlog
<slytherin> geser: Found that. Looks like problem with target JVM version set during compilation.
<slytherin> Or probably problem with GCJ
<stevecrozz> geser: it looks like this works: "cp uwsgi26 $(CURDIR)/debian/tmp/usr/bin"
<stevecrozz> I was using "cp uwsgi26 $(CURDIR)/debian/$(package)/usr/bin
<geser> stevecrozz: depends on which debhelper level you use
<stevecrozz> geser: is that why I'm getting these messages? "Compatibility levels before 5 are deprecated."
<geser> yes
<slytherin> geser: We now have uninstallable circular build-deps. :-( oscache build-deps on libhibernate3-java which in turn depends on liboscache-java.
<stevecrozz> geser: how do I change that?
<geser> put the debhelper level you want to use in debian/compat. Current is 7
<geser> slytherin: crap
<slytherin> checking if it build without hibernate
<geser> ScottK: on the next round of binaries removals in universe we should be more careful with -java packages as they like to have circular build-dependencies
<ScottK> geser: There was all kinds of warning for people to check this stuff.
<geser> I know
<geser> and yet slipped it though but we should try to not make it worse
<ScottK> Agreed.
<stevecrozz> geser: that works great thanks.. now if I want to provide a symlink to uwsgi26 named uwsgi should I do "ln -s /usr/bin/uwsgi26 $(CURDIR)/debian/$(package)/usr/bin/uwsgi"
<ScottK> stevecrozz: dh_link is preferred.  See man dh_link for details.
<slytherin> geser: oscache fixed.
<geser> \o/
<ScottK> accepted too
<slytherin> ScottK: Thanks
<slytherin> ScottK: FYI... Package built and is in NEW queue now.
<ScottK> OK.
<ScottK> Hopefully slangasek will have a chance to work on New today.
<slytherin> ok
 * slytherin moves on to other packages.
<slangasek> oh, ace is back?
<ScottK> slangasek: Yep.  Debian had a fixed revision.
<ScottK> That's the one I hit that made another package unbuildable.
 * slangasek nods
<simar> bound mara
<mhall119> when does the window for FFe close?
<simar> fuck u aassss holes
<simar> i ama asshole
<mhall119> yeah, that doesn't really answer my question, but thanks for trying
<simar> i am an asshole
<simar> fuck u assholes
<lfaraone> geser: Does Debian also use pkgstriptranslations for handling ".mo"s? (I'm considereing whether to submit https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/rbot/0.9.14-1ubuntu1 upstream)
<mhall119> when does the window for FFe close?
<mhall119> is it open until Beta2 is released?
<arand> mhall119: I think it's open until the very final, just increasingly stricter..: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess
<mhall119> arand: thanks
<mhall119> now I just need someone to review my packages
<mhall119> any Motu's willing to help?
<mhall119> no compiling required, honest
<RoAkSoAx> mhall119, which ones
<mhall119> qimo-session, qimo-games and qimo-wallpaper
<RoAkSoAx> mhall119, where are they
<RoAkSoAx> revu?
<mhall119> yes
<mhall119> I've also created bugs for each, with needs-packaging, and attached orig.tar.gz and diff.gz
<RoAkSoAx> i'll try to take a look on them later today
<RoAkSoAx> but I dont usually woprk with new packages
<mhall119> there's not a whole lot to them
<mhall119> mostly graphics and config files being copied into the filesystem
<RoAkSoAx> mhall119, i'll take a look at them, but wouldn't have been easier to create one source apckages with several binary packages?
<mhall119> in theory, maybe
<mhall119> in practice, I have no idea what that even means
<mhall119> this is my first time making packages, so I'm pretty green
<RoAkSoAx> mhall119, i.e. qimo-extras source package, which means only 1 .tar.gz and several binary packages that install the necessary from the source
<RoAkSoAx> unless ytou maintain those differently
<RoAkSoAx> (or in different sources)
<geser> lfaraone: pkgstriptranslations is Ubuntu-specific
<arand> joaopinto: Hia, currently checking out bloodfrontier from playdeb, is there currently anything blocking that from making it into the debian and ubuntu repos? (For 10.10 in ubutnus case...)
<joaopinto> arand, nothing that I know
<joaopinto> it's Sauerbraten based, there should be no problem with the license
<arand> joaopinto: Would you mind if I took a stab at it at some point?
<joaopinto> feel free
<arand> joaopinto: By the way, is the current playdeb version based off 0.85-beta2 (dates seem to indicate that), I didn't find any references in the package.
<joaopinto> it is
<arand> joaopinto: Okay, cheers for info.
<mhall119> RoAkSoAx: I'll look into that for the M cycle
<tsimpson> anyone want to apply a fix to a 3 year-old bug? (bug #86685)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 86685 in trac "trac BROKEN on AMD64: "neo_cgi.so: undefined symbol: Py_InitModule4"" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/86685
<bencrisford> ive created a patch for bug #555422 and uploaded the debdiff, set status to confirmed, unassigned myself and subscribed the ubuntu-sponsors
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 555422 in gbrainy "Typo in gbrainy" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/555422
<bencrisford> is that correct?
<bencrisford> because i havent submitted any fixes for a few months
<ScottK> Sounds right.
<bencrisford> ScottK: :)
#ubuntu-motu 2010-04-06
<lfaraone> porthose: hey, would you mind reacking on bug 555948 (if it is needed). I mistakenly requested a sync from unstable when I meant to perform one from sid. (that was what I had tested)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 555948 in wireshark "Sync wireshark 1.2.7-1 (universe) from Debian testing (main)" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/555948
<crimsun> lfaraone: err...
<crimsun> unstable <-> sid. Did you mean testing for one of them?
<lfaraone> crimsun: squeeze/testing, sorry.
<lfaraone> porthose: s/unstable/testing/g
<crimsun> lfaraone: doesn't need a re-Ack, but I updated the description
<crimsun> bdrung: WRT #555891, please use linux-alsa-driver-modules-$(uname -r) from ppa:ubuntu-audio-dev
<bdrung> crimsun: ok, i will try that tomorrow
<Semitones> hello guys! I was trying to install planetpenguin racer, and I found something curious
<persia> What?
<Semitones> Does it seem strange that planetpenguin-racer-extras is included in lucid and karmic
<Semitones> but planetpenguin-racer is not? http://packages.ubuntu.com/search?keywords=planetpenguin-racer
<Semitones> it seems like you'd need the game for the -extras to be useful
<persia> Indeed.
<Semitones> so... any guesses to why the game isn't there?
<persia> You want to install extremetuxracer
<Semitones> oh, I didn't realize it was a continuation of tux racer, but I did see it
<Semitones> thanks persia
<dholbach> good morning
<geser> good morning
<stefanlsd> morning!
<dholbach> hey geser, hey stefanlsd
<\sh> moins
<jetienne> q. is there a way to know the dependancy of a .deb ? i got only the .deb fiel
<Rhonda> jetienne: dpkg --info foo.deb
<jetienne> Rhonda: thanks
<m4rtin> hi all; I've written a bugfix patch for bash-completion, as requested by a member the sponsor team, but am struggling to get a debdiff up. I've got the lucid source package and it uses quilt. There is also a diff file listed. Should I apply this before running any quilt commands?
<Rhonda> m4rtin: I'd do a "quilt push -a" before starting to patch, and "quilt new my-bash-completion-fix" (or some more suiting name) before you start "quilt edit"ing the files.
<m4rtin> Rhonda: thanks; so: 1. untar apt source; 2. quilt push -a; 3. quilt new; 4. apply lucid source diff; 5. do my edits?
<m4rtin> hmm, seems not
<m4rtin> the lucid patch places the series patches in the dir
<persia> m4rtin: When you get the .dsc file, use dpkg-source -x to extract it.  This will apply the diff.gz.  Inside that, export QUILT_PATCHES=debian/patches and run quilt push -a
<persia> !patch
<ubottu> Patches are files describing the changes in code to achieve some results.  There are a number of ways these can be produced, but https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/HowToFix and https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/PatchSystems may provide some useful guidelines.
<persia> Check the second link for more details
<m4rtin> persia: thank you -- that's what I needed :) one further q if I may: does my changelog have to be inside the quilt edits, or is the packaging process outside of quilt?
<persia> Please *don't* put the stuff in debian/ inside quilt patches: this just confuses the next person.
<m4rtin> persia: excellent. So I've done my edit. quilt refresh; quilt pop -a; do the packaging
<jetienne> q. i would like to create a user in the .deb, how can i do that ? "sudo adduser slotaaa" keeps asking for interactive question. i dont want interactive stuff
<joaopinto> jetienne, check on how it's done on other packages, eg. postfix
<persia> Or check debian policy 9.2: http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-opersys.html#s9.2
<Rhonda> jetienne: â¦ and sudo isn't needed, the maintainer scripts run as root. :)
<jetienne> ok trying to get postfix example
<m4rtin> could someone take a look at a patch I've attached and tell me if it looks ok please? It's at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/bash-completion/+bug/435055 ; last comment
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 435055 in bash-completion "Bash completion for wget -o doesn't escape spaces." [Undecided,Confirmed]
<persia> m4rtin: It looks sane, but you may want to advertise in #ubuntu-devel, as there's a better chance someone there will be able to upload.  Also, did you submit the bare patch (not debdiff) to Debian?
<hyperair> bash completion? i remember it failed for spaces for everything sometime back.
<m4rtin> hyperair: no, I didn't... should I have?
<m4rtin> hyperair: it still fails that for scp; that's my next task
<hyperair> m4rtin: didn't what?
<hyperair> m4rtin: oh i mean cat blah<tab> didn't work, for example.
<m4rtin> sorry that was to persia
<hyperair> i mean it'd complete up to the first space and stall
 * hyperair goes back into lurk mode
<m4rtin> persia: I didn't submit to debian... should I (and how?)
<hyperair> mentors.debian.net
<persia> m4rtin: http://www.debian.org/Bugs/Reporting and https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Debian/Bugs and https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Debian/Usertagging : short form "use submittodebian"
<persia> hyperair: Not best for a well-maintained package, usually, unless one has a prior relationship with the maintainers.
<hyperair> persia: oh whoops. sorry i wasn't thinking (my mind was thinking new package)
<hyperair> m4rtin: regarding bash-completion perhaps it's best to poke some people in #bash-completion on irc.oftc.net
<persia> Indeed.
<persia> Getting the patch there helps *everyone*.
<m4rtin> the problem is that they have fixed most of these bugs with a massive rewrite in their version control
<m4rtin> however, they don't release frequently
<m4rtin> it seems better to fix these bugs for lucid/debian and then when bash-completion team decide to release their next stable it will be solved anyway
<NCommander> ScottK: ping, do you think a FFE for openttd would possibly fly? I'd like to see if we can sync it from sid
<ScottK> Depends on why and what the differences are.
<NCommander> ScottK: loads of bug fixes, and its now possible to put it in universe versus multiverse
<ScottK> Any new features?
<ScottK> Sounds promising.
<NCommander> ScottK: better AI I think, haven't compiled it yet
<NCommander> ScottK: the version in Ubuntu is fairly old compared to the version in sid
<NCommander> 0.7.5 to 1.0
<ScottK> It sounds worth looking into.
<NCommander> ScottK: that's what I thought, hence why I wanted to ask if a FFE was out of the world of possibility
<ScottK> It's not.
<slytherin> Any archive admins present here?
<persia> slytherin: Usually, but except in special cases, it's best to ask archive-admin questions in #ubuntu-devel
<slytherin> Ok. Will ask there.
<slytherin> ScottK: Hi. Can you please explain what was the reason behind adding explicit libtalloc-dev build-dep to evolution-mapi?
<ScottK> slytherin: It uses the talloc headers (as evidenced by the shlibs generated runtime depends)
<slytherin> ScottK: A simple grep -r talloc.h in source yields nothing. Also check this text from build log - warning: dependency on libtalloc.so.2 could be avoided if **** were not uselessly linked against it (they use none of its symbols).
<ScottK> slytherin: The fact is that it is linked.
<ScottK> slytherin: It's possible it's not needed.
<persia> That would involve a buildsystem patch.  Adding another build-dependency is the easy (and safe) way out at this point in the release cycle.
<persia> File a bug and fix it right for maverick.
<slytherin> ScottK: Right. That is what I meant. It may be unnecessarily linked.
<slytherin> ScottK: I was actually planning to file a sync request for version in Debian (2.28.3) which a bug-fix update. Hence I was checking with you if Ubuntu changes are important to keep.
 * ScottK isn't saying that's the best solution, just made sense as part of doing the NBS rebuilds for libtalloc0
<ScottK> slytherin: I'll leave it for you to decide.
<slytherin> In any case libtalloc-dev gets pulled in because of other build-deps.
<ScottK> Yes, but one shouldn't rely on that
<ari-tczew> jdong: did you talk with SRU team about my objections?
<slytherin> ScottK: In this case the (build)dependency seems unnecessary, so I suggest we drop this and make it a sync.
<ScottK> slytherin: Your call.
<lfaraone> ScottK: would you be willing to review bug 556483? james_w said you felt that it might need a FFE.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 556483 in xpdf "Merge xpdf 3.02-2 from Debian Unstable" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/556483
<lfaraone> ScottK: (it already has the debian changelog attached, there were no upstream changes)
<lfaraone> jdstrand: bug 552720 in squeak-vm needs a FFE, right?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 552720 in squeak-vm "please merge 3.11.3+svn2147-1 from Debian testing" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/552720
<jdstrand> lfaraone: squeak-vm is in universe, so based on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess I'd say 'no'
<jdstrand> lfaraone: plus, as it stands, it is totally unuseable
<james_w> lfaraone: please make the request. Unusable as it is will probably make it very likely to get it, but we shouldn't circumvent the process.
<lfaraone> james_w, okay.
 * jdstrand (re)rereads FreezeExceptionProcess and sees it would need it
<lfaraone> jdstrand: I can't seem to find the upstream changelog for that revision, the best I could find was http://squeakvm.org/unix/platforms/unix/doc/RELEASE_NOTES_3.11.3.2135
<jdstrand> lfaraone: I see platforms/unix/ChangeLog in the source
<jdong> ari-tczew: I was under the understanding you were going to write something up to us
<ari-tczew> jdong: [Sunday 28 March 2010] [19:51:51] <jdong> ari-tczew: I'd start with mailing the ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list, cc'ing the SRU team members, about your concern that the related bugs display in launchpad isn't a satisfactory radar map for what SRU tasks remain needing attention.
<jdong> ari-tczew: poor wording, I meant if I were you, I'd start with..
<persia> That looks like a request to receive mail to me
<jdong> sorry
<jdong> language barrier, lost in translation :)
<ari-tczew> jdong: so what's the final decision?
<jdong> ari-tczew: you start mail, please :)
<jdong> it is your concern, so I think you'd be the best to voice it
<ari-tczew> jdong: okay, but currect I don't have time, maybe in the second half of april
<ari-tczew> s/currect/current
<jdong> I am similarly scheduled :)
<ari-tczew> hehe
<kklimonda> how to request a removal of the unbuildable package?
<geser> file a removal bug
<geser> why is the package unbuildable?
<mhall119> jdstrand: can you check the copyright files in the qimo-* packages in revu please?
<kklimonda> geser: it depends on evo 2.30
<kklimonda> I
<kklimonda> I'm trying to find out if any previous package builds on lucid
<geser> kklimonda: what about the last build debs which are still published? do they still work?
<kklimonda> geser: they don't install
<kklimonda> geser: it's anjal
<geser> I assumed it's anjal as there aren't that many packages in depwait on evo 2.30
<kklimonda> geser: the ubuntu3 package that is build doesn't install, it has to be rebuilt - I should (1) request package removal and then.. ask to upload no-change ubuntu4 to rebuild it?
<kklimonda> (there is another option - to remove anjal from lucid completely as the 0.0.1 release we have is old one)
<geser> kklimonda: I'm not sure if LP would allow that and the next question is if the archive admins are OK with this solution as they have to NEW the source again
<kklimonda> mhm
<kklimonda> I'll ask on #-devel then
<kklimonda> ah, you are already on it ;)
<geser> it's only related to this
<geser> as I've noticed that the old debs are still published but only the new source version
<kklimonda> right, that's also a problem - well, there is 0.0.1...ubuntu3 source downloadable but you have to dig -changes list for the link
<kklimonda> probably not easy enough
<geser> yeah, LP has still the old source but it's not on archive.u.c anymore
<jdstrand> mhall119: done
<lfaraone> Hm. Does http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=548551 look severe enough to justify a sync?
<ubottu> Debian bug 548551 in dancer-services "dancer-services: Incorrect dependencies in init.d LSB header" [Serious,Fixed]
<bobbo> evening MOTUs!
#ubuntu-motu 2010-04-07
<ScottK> kklimonda: What you have to do is upload the older version as a new upstream tarball with a higher version number, e.g. [newversion]+really[oldversion]-0ubuntu1.  Removing it and readding it won't get you around this.  See the ldb package for an example.
<kklimonda> ScottK: thanks
<ScottK> You're welcome.
<mhall119> jdstrand: thank you
<mhall119> jdstrand: the qimo-games package was updated too, it includes a few images now
<kklimonda> ScottK: what do I have to attach to the bug report in this case? a debdiff between debian/ directory from the newer tarball and the one I'm reverting to or the full debdiff?
<ScottK> kklimonda: Probably best to push the entire mess to REVU and link it to the bug rerport.
<kklimonda> right, I was wondering what to do with the tarball itself
<ScottK> REVU solves that.
<kklimonda> *nods*
<kklimonda> ScottK: can you take a look at it if when you have time? bug 518788
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 518788 in anjal "cannot install in lucid" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/518788
<ScottK> Perhaps.  Not sure how soon I'll have time.
<kklimonda> hmm.. I'll poke chrisccoulson then :)
<chrisccoulson> moi?
<chrisccoulson> you want somebody to sponsor work?
<kklimonda> hmm, now that you call it like this I think I should subscribe sponsors :)
 * kklimonda is too tired already
<chrisccoulson> kklimonda, i will look at that in the morning if nobody else has done already
<chrisccoulson> i'm going to get some sleep now
<ripps> geez, a damn bug in gcc (or something) keeps getting fixed, than broken again. gmpc fails on amd64 gob files. Earlier in the Lucid cycle, it wouldn't build, then it worked, now it doesn't anymore... this is getting ridiculous
<jdstrand> mhall119: re qimo-games> I peeked at the licensing there and it seemed fine (you did the same there as the others)-- I'd get others to comment on the rest though
<ajmitch> ScottK: a freeze exception will be required for bug 556407 I guess? it's a mix of a security fix & new upstream features
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 556407 in mahara "Sync mahara 1.2.4-1 (universe) from Debian sid (main)" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/556407
<ScottK> ajmitch: I saw the DSA, we want that.
<ScottK> ajmitch: Approved.
<fabrice_sp> Hi. What should I do with a branch that appears in the sponsorship view, but has been rejected? Delete merge proposal? It's https://code.launchpad.net/~philippe-gauthier/ubuntu/karmic/gw6c/gw6c-validation-client-v4.lp418176/+merge/14835
<dholbach> good morning
<iulian> Morning dholbach.
<dholbach> hey iulian
<jetienne> q. i need to install mysql without interaction and then setup a default password, this is for a dependancy of one of my package. where should i look ?
<joaopinto> jetienne, you want to use DEBIAN_FRONTEND=noninteractive apt-get install mysql
<jetienne> joaopinto: tahnks trying
<joaopinto> but you can't set up that as regular dependency
<geser> jetienne: you are packaging an application which needs a mysql database?
<jetienne> i got another dependancy which cause trouble. this is a .deb which has no repository. i planned to do a wget and then dpkg. but i cant do that in the postinst. how can i handle it
<jetienne> geser: yepm
<joaopinto> include that .deb to the same repository you are providing your package from :P
<jetienne> joaopinto: not that simple :) i got only the .deb of the other package and no .changes.
<geser> jetienne: perhaps "dbconfig-common" helps here and check how similar packages do it (do shouldn't depend on the mysql-server as it can also be installed on an other host)
<jetienne> geser: not sure what you mean here. what should i do with "dbconfig-common" ? what is it
<geser> !info dbconfig-common
<ubottu> dbconfig-common (source: dbconfig-common): common framework for packaging database applications. In component main, is optional. Version 1.8.41 (karmic), package size 452 kB, installed size 1820 kB
<geser> jetienne: and for the other problem: you should try to get the source package for it and include it in your repo (or package it yourself)
<jetienne> geser: any simpler way ?
<jetienne> for mysql
<jetienne> i will do a "in 1 min, try to install, and loop until you can"
<jetienne> this is ugly and crappy but so is my job
<joaopinto> I hope you are not doing that from a posinst
<geser> don't know of any but I didn't have to look at such packages yet
<joaopinto> jetienne, I am not sure what you are doing, but it looks you are doing it the wrong way :P
<jetienne> joaopinto: with a "at" or "cron" this is possible
<jetienne> joaopinto: and i agree with you :) this is just the easy way
<jetienne> both, thanks for you help tho
<joaopinto> jetienne, not an easy eay, it's a bad way, that may hurt the system
<joaopinto> running a dpkg -i from a cron is a bad idea
<joaopinto> I really don't see the advantage on trying to do something to work out of the box that may randomly break the system
<jetienne> joaopinto: dont get me wrong, i DO agree with you
<jetienne> joaopinto: it get the silly boss off my back :)
<joaopinto> jetienne, it is bad in the sense that it may break the system, if you loop trying to dpkg -i from a cron
<jetienne> joaopinto: you dont believe me when i tell you i agree :)
<joaopinto> if I were your boss I would kick you :P
<jetienne> if you were my boss, you would not advocate for crappy solutions :) i hope at least
<jetienne> joaopinto: just last example "sql is no reliable, i want us to handle db via flat file in json"
<jetienne> joaopinto: if you are able to say this sentence without laughing you could be my boss :)
<jetienne> why he is asking me to install mysql now is left as an exercice to the reader :)
<joaopinto> :P
<sistpoty|work> ScottK: can I convince you to do source-new for the openttd related packages? (bug #556593)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 556593 in openttd "sync openttd 1.0.0-1 from Debian unstable" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/556593
<wgrant> sistpoty|work: I actually count 5 new sources.
<sistpoty|work> wgrant: right, looks like I counted lines
<sistpoty|work> wgrant: btw thanks for testing :)
<wgrant> Yep, all 6 build and work fine in Lucid.
<wgrant> And I've just gardened that SDL bug, although it seems to not affect OpenTTD.
<Rhonda> Someone around with the sdl mouse click issue (in e.g. wesnoth) in sdl on Debian/Ubuntu? Someone prepared a potential fix and would like to have it tested â¦
<sistpoty|work> wgrant: ^^
<wgrant> Rhonda: Yeah, I saw that on the Debian bug and was tempted to test it.
<Laney> bah
 * wgrant PPAifies.
<Laney> sistpoty|work: pandoc got two NEW build-deps
<Laney> but at least it has now been uploaded
<Laney> and it got a versioned b-d on a newer CDBS
<sistpoty|work> Laney: newer cdbs is very bad, I wouldn't like to get that in :(
<Rhonda> wgrant: Would be great if you could test it - if it works it might be an good idea to push it into lucid, if that's still possible. :)
<Laney> sistpoty|work: Yes, but we can probably get around that one
<sistpoty|work> :)
<wgrant> Rhonda: yeah, we probably shouldn't have a broken Wesnoth...
<Laney> sistpoty|work: so we need haskell-texmath and haskell-xml now
<Rhonda> wgrant: Actually I think people will complain enough that we won't have 1.8 already - which only came out last week. ;)
<wgrant> Rhonda: Of course; they are users!
<Rhonda> So we shouldn't give them broken mouse clicks also.
<sistpoty|work> Laney: can you prepare a FFe?
<Rhonda> wgrant: I was slightly amused that someone filed a bug about purging wesnoth wouldn't remove /home/$user/.wesnoth1.6 directory. ;)
<sistpoty|work> Laney: side note: didn't come around hmake yet, and probably won't come around it until Friday :/
<wgrant> Rhonda: Ew.
<Rhonda> wgrant: Someone else did close it as invalid before I had the chance to lay my hands on it. :)
<wgrant> :(
<hyperair> cjwatson: got a moment to look at banshee-community-extensions (in NEW)?
<cjwatson> hyperair: accepted
<hyperair> cjwatson: thanks
<hyperair> sebner, directhex: ^^ \o/
<directhex> awesomes!
 * sebner ^5 hyperair 
<hyperair> =)
<directhex> hyperair, isn't it binary new now rather than source new, though? :p
<ScottK> sistpoty|work: If they are all from Debian, yes.
<cjwatson> directhex: that's easier
<directhex> cjwatson, do you need to be independently asked to remove the obsolete source packages from lucid for individual odds & sods which have been integrated into banshee-community-extensions, or do they appear automagically on some list somewhere?
<cjwatson> the latter
<cjwatson> oh, wait
<cjwatson> source packages
<cjwatson> please file a bug about those and subscribe ubuntu-archive
<lfaraone> sistpoty|work: I'm confused by your response to bug 552720; I stated in the bug description that I tested squeak-vm with Scratch and Etoys, two squeak applications, and they both ran fine while I performed their respective smoketests.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 552720 in squeak-vm "please merge 3.11.3+svn2147-1 from Debian testing" [Wishlist,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/552720
<sistpoty|work> ScottK: yes, thanks in advance!
<sistpoty|work> lfaraone: ah, thanks. didn't see that.
<lfaraone> sistpoty|work: okay, just checking whether I misunderstood and you meant further testing was required.
<sistpoty|work> lfaraone: no, I simply didn't read the description thouroughly enough, sorry
<lfaraone> sistpoty|work: no worries, I'm guilty of much of the same :)
<Rhonda> wgrant: About that patch, please check wether the change doesn't reopen the issue why ubuntu did pull in 1.2.14 instead of 1.2.13 in the first place. :)
<Rhonda> wgrant: There is an upstream bug mentioned in the diff for the changelog there, it should get decided which of those is the more severe issue, me thinks.
<directhex> cjwatson, there we go, Bug #557284
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 557284 in bansheelyricsplugin "Please remove from Lucid - superseded by banshee-community-extensions" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/557284
<Laney> sistpoty|work: bug 557285
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 557285 in ubuntu "FFe: Sync haskell-xml 1.3.5-2 (universe) from Debian testing (main)" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/557285
<sistpoty|work> james_w: would you volunteer to source-new haskell-xml (already passed new in debian)?
<sistpoty|work> and eventually the haskell-texmath as well?
<james_w> sure
<james_w> sbeattie: do you think the super issue has anything to do with the -extension thing?
<sistpoty|work> james_w: thanks!
<lfaraone> james_w: I've written a script to automate the updating of a package in merge mode to a new upstream git/bzr/hg snapshot, extracting the upstream changelog from the intermedate vcs commits. Would this be useful to submit somewhere?
<james_w> lfaraone: can I have a look?
<lfaraone> james_w: well, right now it's very very alpha, as in "hard coded for a specific package I use, with git" but it should be generalizable. Hold on, I'll post what I have.
<james_w> yeah, I'd just like to get a better idea of what it is doing
<lfaraone> james_w: sure, http://sprunge.us/GfBY?py
<james_w> lfaraone: cool
<james_w> I guess ubuntu-dev-tools would make sense?
<lfaraone> james_w: sure. I'll branch off it and work this into a usable state.
<lfaraone> james_w: in the same vein as uupdate, would uupdate-vcs be an apt name?
<james_w> yeah
<james_w> maybe -snapshot?
<lfaraone> good.
<james_w> uupdate-vcs-snapshot
<Laney> sistpoty|work: bug 557323 for you
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 557323 in ubuntu "FFe: Sync haskell-texmath 0.2.0.3-1 (universe) from Debian testing (main)" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/557323
<Laney> I should update my ubuntu-dev-tools
<Laney> my requestsync is subscribing motu-release
<sistpoty|work> Laney: approved as well
<Laney> thanks
<Laney> washngo should get building soon too â someone cabalised it
<Laney> then we really will have an all green graph (on some arches at least)
<sistpoty|work> :)
<bilalakhtar> hello MOTUs please check out this package which I publiched a week ago http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/gnome-media-player and the needs-packaging bug is https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/551702
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 551702 in ubuntu "[needs-packaging] gnome-media-player" [Wishlist,In progress]
<james_w> lfaraone: how did you do the squeak-vm merge, the results are rather odd
<james_w> oh, I see
<lfaraone> james_w: oh? did I mess something up?
<james_w> I don't think so
<sistpoty|work> Laney: oh, armel build of ghc6 was restarted (on a different buildd)
<bilalakhtar> is it still possible for packages to get into lucid repos?
<Laney> sistpoty|work: I saw that, and lamont wants to leave it running for some reason
<lfaraone> bilalakhtar: if you have a good reason, thourough testing, and go through REVU
<Laney> if it's the one that has been going for nearly a month now
<sistpoty|work> bilalakhtar: quite unlikely, unless you have a very, very good reason
<lfaraone> james_w: would it be a good idea to have the user store the URL of the upstream repo in a "XS-Upstream-{Git, Hg, Bzr, Svn}:" field, or somewhere else?
<bilalakhtar> sistpoty|work: The project page is here: https://launchpad.net/gnome-media-player
<james_w> lfaraone: yeah, except that proposing that as a standard will draw some complaints
<james_w> lfaraone: are you involved in Debian at all?
<lfaraone> james_w: I'm a Debian Maintainer.
<bilalakhtar> sistpoty|work: Why so? Lucid didn't release yet (not the stable atleast)
<sistpoty|work> Laney: might be since different armel buildds use different kernels, and jaboticaba was needed for a different package
<lfaraone> bilalakhtar: end of the month, or so.
<sistpoty|work> *shrug*
<james_w> lfaraone: proposing the idea to Debian would be useful then
<persia> bilalakhtar: We're well into the freeze cycle though, and past the deadline for new packages.
<bilalakhtar> lfaraone:
<sistpoty|work> bilalakhtar: everyone's busy fixing bugs at the moment, or should be busy fixing bugs, not adding new features ;)
<bilalakhtar> persia: lfaraone: So is it possible to upload for maverick?
<persia> bilalakhtar: Absolutely, but you probably won't get someone to review until early next month.
<lfaraone> bilalakhtar: is it a new package? probably no.
<james_w> lfaraone: how did Debian get rid of the epoch in this package?
<bilalakhtar> lfaraone: It is a new package
<persia> lfaraone: Why not, for maverick?
<lfaraone> james_w: they didn't ship it officially.
<james_w> ah
<lfaraone> persia: not familiar. I looked, it's an existing package, so my comments do not apply.
<lfaraone> (I didn't know what it was)
<bilalakhtar> lfaraone: My package is a new package. Do you mean to say the gnome-media-player package?
<bilalakhtar> lfaraone: Yes that is my package and there's no such package in the repos
<lfaraone> bilalakhtar: okay. expect to ship it in lucid+1.
<bilalakhtar> lfaraone: ok then I am uploading it for maverick. I am ready to wait for a longer time
<lfaraone> persia: oh, i'm really out of date, didn't realize lucid+1 had been named :)
<bilalakhtar> so long, guys, have to leave now
<persia> lfaraone: Less than a week ago, so not that out of date :)
<sistpoty|work> we could speculate about the name of maverick+1 though :P
<persia> nifty newt!
<lfaraone> persia: heh. that's a good name, you should tell the sabdfl ;)
<lfaraone> james_w: just to confirm, the bugfix release 1.5.1 of barnowl does not require a FFe, correct? http://sprunge.us/geOD
<persia> I suspect it's already on the page of suggestions, but I've also not seen much correlation between the page of suggestions and the actual names, so don't put anything there anymore.
<james_w> lfaraone: we already have 1.5?
<lfaraone> james_w: correct.
<james_w> then that looks fine to me
<lfaraone> done, bug 557346.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 557346 in barnowl "Sync barnowl 1.5.1-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/557346
<lfaraone> james_w: re squeak, I submitted a wishlist bug upstream asking them to include the epoch, but it'll be a tough thing to convince them to add a useless epoch. (from their point of view)
<cnd> ep
<psusi> how do I clone the existing package branch so I can fix it and link it to the bug for a sponsor to merge?
<geser> psusi: see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DistributedDevelopment/Documentation
<psusi> heh, thanks... I was actually kinda figuring it out stumbling around with bzr and lp ;)
<psusi> already got the branch uploaded... looks like now I just need to link it to the bug and get a sponsor
<geser> if you commit your changes with "bzr commit --fixes lp:123456" your branch gets autolinked to the bug
<psusi> hrm.... that page says to set the reviewer to ubuntu-sponsors, but the default is ubuntu-branches... is the documentation out of date or should I really change it?
<psusi> hrm... ok, hope that does it... now all bug #534743 needs is someone to bzr merge ; bzr commit ; dput, hoepfully in time for beta 2
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 534743 in dmraid "dmraid causes udev event feedback loop in Lucid" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/534743
<psusi> is there anyone I should subscribe or assign this to since it is a serious regression from karmic that renders some systems unbootable?
<arand> psusi: Reviewers team possibly, since it's udev, I think #ubuntu-devel might be the place...
<MTecknology> Any of you in here happen to know about mailman lists?
<MTecknology> wrong channel - sorry
<c_korn> is there no orig tarball when using source format 3.0 (native) ?
<hyperair> c_korn: native packages have no orig tarballs.
<hyperair> c_korn: that's the very definition of a native package.
<c_korn> hyperair: so I have to use 3.0 (quilt) even if I do the patching in debain/rules ?
<slytherin> ScottK: Do you mind approving jboss binaries from new queue? Other archive admins in #ubuntu-devel seem to be busy.
<hyperair> c_korn: er. what are you doing that involves patching in debian/rules?
<hyperair> c_korn: why don't you use a proper patch?
<hyperair> well actually as long as you restore your build tree to the original state in your clean rule, you're free to use anything
<c_korn> hyperair: ok, there is no conflict using 3.0 (quilt) and using quilt in debian/rules. this was my actual question. sorry for the confusion.
<hyperair> c_korn: get rid of quilt in debian/rules.
<hyperair> c_korn: why are you using quilt in debian/rules?
<slytherin> c_korn: If it is native package then you should use 3.0 (native)
<hyperair> there is practically no point in using 3.0 (quilt) format if you're going to put quilt things in your debian/control and debian/rules[
<hyperair> slytherin: he wants an orig tarball. that's no native package.
<hyperair> c_korn: if you must use quilt in debian/rules and debian/control, then go back to source version 1.0
<c_korn> I am doing some other things before the dh_quilt_patch target. so I just need to move those changes to the dh_auto_configure target
<hyperair> i see. just use source 1.0 then
<hyperair> or do you need 3.0 (quilt) for something else?
<hyperair> besides patches and bz2/lzma tarballs, there isn't much to 3.0 (quilt)
<c_korn> well, it creates a debian.tar.gz file which I find more aesthetic :)
<hyperair> c_korn: that's not really a good reason =_=
<c_korn> not unless you get nightmares filterdiff'ing through a diff.gz file :)
<joaopinto> aren't the general guidelines to use 3.0 (quilt) unless there is a good reason to not do so ?
<joaopinto> http://lintian.debian.org/tags/missing-debian-source-format.html -> If you don't have a good reason to stick with the old format, you should switch to "3.0 (quilt)" (for packages with a separate upstream tarball) or to "3.0 (native)" (for Debian native packages).
<slytherin> One good thing about 3.0 is it standardizes patch system.
<ari-tczew> is it possible to applicate both for MOTU and UUC?
<ari-tczew> at the once meeting
<cnd> I'm bisecting an older kernel, but when I build I get this at the end:
<cnd> dpkg-deb - error: (upstream) version (`unknown') doesn't contain any digits
<cnd> woops, wrong channel
<geser> ari-tczew: yes, but if you get approved for MOTU you don't need to apply for UUC anymore (MOTU is a member of UUC)
<ari-tczew> geser: I know, but my plan is following: I'm going to join MOTU -> if my application will rejected, then I'll join to UUC
<kklimonda> hmm.. the next meeting is in 6 days - is it fine to apply right now?
<ari-tczew> applicate to UUC isn't hard, right?
<geser> ari-tczew: can be handled in one application
<ari-tczew> nice
<geser> ari-tczew: UUC has the same requirements as ubuntu-members
<geser> kklimonda: yes, this should still give the DMB enough time to review your application and the agenda isn't full yet (/me updates the agenda since it still shows the last meeting)
<kobrien> When packaging with debuild, how do I ensure that the package is compiled from source on the system I install to?
<micahg> kobrien: the package gets built from source on the launchpad build farm, not on the client machines
<kobrien> micahg: is it possible to force it to build on the client machine?
<hyperair> go use gentoo.
<micahg> kobrien: I don't think it's suggested for anything in the archive as that would require build dependencies on the client machines, if you want to do this outside the archive, I would suggest asking in #ubuntu-packaging
<hyperair> you could look into dkms-styled packages
<kklimonda> kobrien: not really - I think the only exception are kernel modules
<micahg> hyperair: I was thinking the same thing :)
<hyperair> =)
<kklimonda> heh, same here
<kobrien> ok, right, I'll pop over to #ubuntu-packaging, thanks people
 * hyperair honestly doesn't see the point of getting everything built on the client machine
<kobrien> my code is hpc stuff and I want it optimized for the particular processor
<kobrien> as much as possible
<kklimonda> kobrien: but there is still no infrastructure other than dkms (which, I think, is only for kernel modules) for building sources on the target machines. I guess you could use postinstall script to do that.. but it's really ugly and kitties cry when you thibk about it
<kobrien> i'm coming from a FreeBSD world :)
<mdomsch> kobrien, there is also very little that compiler optimizations for a specific CPU do these days
<kobrien> mdomsch, this is true
<fabrice_sp> lfaraone: please remember to use Ubuntu sponsors team and not uus
<lfaraone> fabrice_sp: sorry, I think requestsync does that by default.
<fabrice_sp> oh, right
<fabrice_sp> I think a afixed version has been backported
<fabrice_sp> As I'm not anymore member of u-u-s, can someone unsubscribe u-u-s from 557346?
<micahg> fabrice_sp: I think it was fixed in teh last upload to lucid but not backported
<geser> right, there was no SRU yet for changes to sponsoring
<fabrice_sp> it annoy me only because I can't unsubscribe sponsors anymore with u-u-s ;-)
<lfaraone> Hm. Do the changes described since .5 in http://code.google.com/p/autokey/source/browse/trunk/debian/changelog merit a request for a FFe?
<fabrice_sp> maybe Ubuntu Sponsors team should be made member of u-u-s?
<fabrice_sp> lfaraone: not clear (especially the 'Configmanager uses version from common.py). I would subscribe release team, just  in case
<lfaraone> fabrice_sp: mk. I already got a FFe for the inclusion of .5, so I feel bad to have to bother the release team again about this <_<;
<lfaraone> fabrice_sp: oh, that's just using "APP_VERSION = common.VERSION" rather hard-coding the string in the file.
<fabrice_sp> lfaraone: just attach an upstream debdiff then, and subscribe sponsors. That's maybe just some lines
<fabrice_sp> and what about "Slight improvement to installation"?
<lfaraone> fabrice_sp: documentation updates, http://code.google.com/p/autokey/source/diff?spec=svn233&r=233&format=side&path=/branches/autokey-combined/INSTALL
<fabrice_sp> add this documentation to hte bug report: that would help sponsors to decide if FFe is required or not
<fabrice_sp> (because if it's not clear => Ffe :-) )
<fabrice_sp> lfaraone: barnowl FTBFS here, because of dh_strip
<lfaraone> fabrice_sp: re autokey, documented in https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/autokey/+bug/556453/comments/1
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 556453 in autokey "Sync autokey 0.61.7-2 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Medium,New]
<lfaraone> fabrice_sp: intersting. the build succeeded at https://edge.launchpad.net/~lfaraone/+archive/ppa/+build/1654884 and https://edge.launchpad.net/~lfaraone/+archive/ppa/+build/1654885, can you send the log?
<fabrice_sp> sounds good re autokey. Will attach the log to the bug report
<fabrice_sp> this is why it buils in the ppa: WARNING: not running pkgbinarymangler for this package, as requested
<fabrice_sp> I have it installed in my chroot
<fabrice_sp> and this is what fails
<fabrice_sp> lfaraone:
<fabrice_sp> so, it seems pkgbinarymangler is desactivated in ppa's. What about the archive?
<lfaraone> hm. I'm not too sure. I'll admit I am unfamiliar with pkgbinarymangler.
<fabrice_sp> dh_strip also is not run in ppa's. I'll check with another sync, to check my sbuild installation
<fabrice_sp> autokey builds fine (I just ack'd it :-) ), so it's really something with barnowl
<lfaraone> hmmm.
<geser> what's the problem with pkgbinarymangler?
<geser> some things like translations stripping, -dbgsym package creation it not done for PPA but only for the main archive
<geser> ah, found the log and could reproduce it
<fabrice_sp> ok: I'll mark the bug as incomplete,  then
<geser> looks like a bug in pkg-create-dbgsyms
<fabrice_sp> Last time I ahd a problem in dh_strip, it was because the package declared debug, but strip the symbols
<fabrice_sp> it was Bug 340737
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 340737 in im-sdk "im-sdk FTBFS with a return code 256 in pkg-create-dbgsym" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/340737
<geser> this times it tripped over -O-X... but I've yet to look in detail at it
<bdmurray> siretart: I added a possible apport hook to bug 538719
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 538719 in vlc "Please include vlc dependencies in apport" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/538719
<geser> fabrice_sp: a fixed pkg-create-dbgsym waits on merging and sponsoring
<AnAnt> Hello, what has happened to guile-gnome2-* packages ?
<geser> AnAnt: the binary debs got removed; FTBFS: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/foundations-lucid-supportable-binaries
<geser> see the mail on ubuntu-devel-announce about it
<AnAnt> oh, that was one of them ?
<AnAnt> so, it's not about being deprecated or so
<geser> the source package (guile-gnome-platform) is still published in lucid, just the debs are gone
<geser> see http://people.ubuntuwire.org/~lucas/ubuntu-nbs/32/guile-gnome-platform_2.16.1-2ubuntu1_llucid32.buildlog for the FTBFS error
<geser> if you get this FTBFS fixed they can come back
<AnAnt> ok, thanks
<AnAnt> geser: it built
<AnAnt> geser: I got latest package from Debian
<AnAnt> geser: I will upload it to my PPA
<bjsnider> there might be a problem with lucid's vlc mozilla pugin
<bjsnider> xulrunner 1.9.2 was sent into the archive 1 week ago. vlc is currently built against 1.9.1. there are no working patches to build vlc against 1.9.2 yet, and the differences are large enough that the build fails. that means i suppose that the plugin might not work at all.
<micahg> bjsnider: that must have slipped under the radar
<bjsnider> micahg, the vlc guys blame the mozilla guys
<micahg> bjsnider: I haven't tried it, seems to work for me in 3.
<micahg> 3.6
<bjsnider> the build fails so thoroughly that you wouldn't think it would work
<bjsnider> a whole bunch of symbols are affected
<micahg> bjsnider: I'm saying it's FTBFS, but the binary seems to work
<christoph_debian> hm has ubuntu somewhere a per-package popcon graph like the debian one web-accessible?
<micahg> bjsnider: does the plugin from the archive work?
<micahg> bjsnider: if yes, I'll worry about the FTBFS later
<ScottK> christoph_debian: I think it's just text data at popcon.ubuntu.com.
<bjsnider> micahg, i don't use it. i know about this for other reasons than that.
<christoph_debian> ScottK: ok works just hoped there'd be some nice pictures ;)
#ubuntu-motu 2010-04-08
<funkyHat> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/38689741/buildlog_ubuntu-lucid-i386.anjal_0.3.1-1_MANUALDEPWAIT.txt.gz this is failing to build because it needs evolution-data-server-dev >= 2.29.0. What's the normal course of action when that happens? Will 2.29.0 or above be in Lucid? I'm guessing not...
<funkyHat> Do we need to revert to an older version of anjal?
<ScottK> funkyHat: We need to revert it.
<ScottK> funkyHat: See ldb for a recent example of how you have to do that.
<funkyHat> ScottK: thanks
<funkyHat> ScottK: do I need to do the +really<version> bit, or just the epoch?
<funkyHat> Not quite clear on how to do either, but I'll figure it out â¢)
<ScottK> funkyHat: Do the really bit.
<voss749> Could someone tell me how we get a freeze exception?
<wgrant> Avoid epochs at all costs.
<ScottK> An epoch will mess us up with Debian.
<funkyHat> Ok, so is it as simple as grabbing the old package and messing with the version?
<voss749> Freeciv, released 2.2 three days after the freeze window.
<ajmitch> wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess
<voss749> It would probably be easier for freeciv to be added to backports
<funkyHat> Ah, someone has already packaged a fix for anjal, it seems. https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/anjal/+bug/518788
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 518788 in anjal "cannot install in lucid" [High,Triaged]
<MTecknology> !info irssi
<ubottu> irssi (source: irssi): terminal based IRC client. In component main, is optional. Version 0.8.14-1ubuntu1 (karmic), package size 1120 kB, installed size 3024 kB
<MTecknology> So- is there any reason truecrypt couldn't be apckaged in Ubuntu?
<MTecknology> It has it's on license which means I'm guessing you'd need to have the user accept the terms of use when installing
<ScottK> Depends on what the license says.
<ScottK> It has to permit distribution.
<ScottK> At best it might be a multiverse candidate.
<MTecknology> ScottK: as far as I can tell it does - It does say you can't modify the source and still call it truecrypt
<ScottK> That's fine.
<MTecknology> I was asking because I'm sure I'm not the first to consider it
<MTecknology> It could be fun to package this too whenever I finish up with the project I've been working on.
<AnAnt> Hello, I have filed a sync request manually LP 557827 (since there is a problem with requestsync, for which I filed a bug), the question is: what should I do other than putting the latest changelog entries & subscribing motu-release ?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 557827 in pyfribidi "FFe: Sync pyfribidi 0.10.0-2 (universe) from Debian testing (main)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/557827
<ScottK> AnAnt: You need to explain why we need to update it.  Also, ubuntu-release, not motu-release.
<AnAnt> sorry, I meant ubuntu-release
<AnAnt> ScottK: I did do the explanation, but not yet upload build logs
<AnAnt> build log uploaded
<daurnimator> link to how to make a needs packaging bug?
<micahg> daurnimator: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/NewPackages
<daurnimator> cool... the library I'm trying to compile just sent my box into a kernel panic
<daurnimator> howw does that even happen
<daurnimator> how do i say one bug depends on another?
<micahg> daurnimator: no way to do it in launchpad
<micahg> daurnimator: add a note in the description
<daurnimator> k
<daurnimator> filed a trio of needs-packaging: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/557860
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 557860 in ubuntu "iup" [Undecided,New]
<dholbach> good morning
<iulian> Heya dholbach!
<iulian> How's it going?
<dholbach> iulian: good
<slytherin> ScottK: Just FYI ... I can not request sync of evolution-mapi. There are package name changes in Debian. I will have to do simple upstream version update in Ubuntu.
<dholbach> how are you?
<iulian> dholbach: Doing fine as well.  I have just had breakfast.
 * dholbach didn't yet :)
<mrcurrington> o
<jetienne> q. i need to add a path in the default PATH of the computer, how can i do that ?
<jetienne> (in a postinst)
<Laney> that sounds like a bad idea
<hyperair> that sounds like a *very* bad idea.
<jetienne> ok so nothing is done for that i guess, thanks
<jetienne>  /etc/profile.d/*.sh got it!
<hyperair> ._. but it's a very bad idea.
<hyperair> what package is this?
<hyperair> why do you need to add things to the PATH?
<hyperair> i know i'd be annoyed if any package modified my PATH.
<hyperair> hmm speaking of /etc/profile.d, does anyone know why gvfs's bash completion is lying around in /etc/profile.d instead of /etc/bash_completion.d?
<jetienne> hyperair: and i do understand
<jetienne> where PATH is set ? this seems misterious
<dholbach> Packaging Training session in #ubuntu-classroom with geser in 10 mins: Q&A about the Developer Membership Board
<persia> jetienne: What are you seeking to accomplish by setting PATH?
<jetienne> persia: i try to require the use to modify their path by hand.
<jetienne> persia: i try not to require the user to modify their path by hand.
<jetienne> better :)
<persia> Why would the user need to modify their path?
<jetienne> persia: ok 42 :)
<persia> No, really.  Where are you putting something that requires a specialised PATH?
<jetienne> persia: i dont want to enter on a lesson on "what is PATH"
<persia> I won't give you one then :)
<persia> But I'm still curious.
<jetienne> hehe i wasnt willing to give it :)
<jetienne> this is cool, i have a workaround. but im trying to do it as clean as possible
<persia> Understood, but why?
<persia> Because it's not required by any of the current packages in the archive, which makes me think there's a different solution.
<jetienne> persia: well you are mistaken :)
<geser> jetienne: is there a good reason why you can't put it into a directory which is in PATH?
<jetienne> guys guis ok
<jetienne> this is cool, no religion here
<jetienne> forget this PATH stuff
<persia> No, what are you trying to do?
<persia> PATH may be the right solution, in which case we'll share suggestions on how to do it cleanly/safely
<persia> But it's usually not the right solution, which is why we're asking.
<jetienne> persia: this is cool, thanks for your help
<MTecknology> If a new version of something is released right now (drupal) - can that still find it's way into 10.04?
<MTecknology> I'm guessing not - just making sure
<persia> MTecknology: Exceedingly unlikely at this point in the cycle.
<MTecknology> persia: ok, thanks
<persia> MTecknology: That said, if some upstream releases a new version that contains *only* stability bugfixes, and it's well documented, etc. that is a good candidate for inclusion.
<persia> But this tends to be uncommon.
<MTecknology> persia: The only thing that's significant that I can see would be the security fix - http://drupal.org/node/731710
<ScottK> persia: I had an idea for another class of automatic packcage checks perhaps we should do.  Something like "If there is an Ubuntu diff and the package doesn't get merged for two relase cycles, just sync over the Ubuntu changes because better an maintained Debian version than an old unmaintained Ubuntu one."
<persia> I don't think that's a fair test.
<persia> I'd be happy if the merge had been outstanding for two release cycles, kinda
<geser> ScottK: have you a rough number of affected packages?
<hyperair> it would be nice if these said merges could be highlighted, so that priority can be given to them
<ScottK> geser: I didn't do the analysis yet, just hit a case where that had happened and syncing was clearly better.
<persia> And "kinda" because I had a counterexample, where I attemtped to adopt a package in Debian, someone else decided to adopt it after reviewing my work, included about 75% of the patches, ended up breaking it, orphaned it after 6 months, and then someone synced it (which I had to then go fix in Ubuntu)
<hyperair> lol
<hyperair> that sounds painful
<ScottK> persia: I'd think along the lines of what we did with supportable binaries where first you announce a list and give people a chance to reduce it.
<persia> ScottK: What I want to avoid is someone uploading an abandoned package in Debian for a library transition two days before the list is generating causing a sync that kills good Ubuntu changes for a well-maintained package.
<persia> My counterexample is painful, but I could have done better than getting annoyed and refusing to work with Debian for several months when that happened.
<ScottK> persia: Perhaps I didn't communicate my criteria well: I meant to say it had been needing a merge for two cycles.
<persia> Oh, I'm fine with that.
<ScottK> I think that would exclude packages that had any kind of maintenance in Ubuntu
<persia> needing a merge for two cycles != hasn't been merged in two cycles.
<persia> Agreed.
<ScottK> The package I tripped over was in the class of "Main packages that no one actually looks after."
<persia> Yeah.  Those get frustrating after a couple years.  Did you file the MainExclusion bug?
<ScottK> I discussed it with the RM who's hunting down if it can be demoted.
<ScottK> Also got an FFe for updating.
<bilalakhtar> Hello MOTUs can anyone over here review my package for maverick????
<bilalakhtar> you people will think I am out of my mind :)
<ScottK> bilalakhtar: It's unlikely to happen before Lucid release.  Most of us are focused on bug fixing.
<ScottK> No, you aren't out of your mind (good to work ahead), just optimistic.
<bilalakhtar> ScottK: And, at the same time, no one knows whether the packages in maverick will have the same names or not :)
<persia> bilalakhtar: The vast majority of packages will have the same names.  Things that often change (libraries) should be automatically set dependencies.
<bjsnider> micahg, this should allow you to rebuild vlc against xulrunner 1.9.2: http://bugs.gentoo.org/attachment.cgi?id=217289
<micahg> bjsnider: thanks, will have a look
<bilalakhtar> BTW, What are the reqs for becoming a MOTU?
<bjsnider> micahg, they made several small changes that break backwards compatibility. such as utf8length becomes UTF8Length
<bjsnider> and uint16 becomes uint16_t
<persia> bilalakhtar: The basic guideline is contribute as a MOTU sufficiently that MOTU tell you to apply to be MOTU.
<persia> I know that's vague, but if you just do a bunch of work, especially archive-quality related work, this will happen.
<bilalakhtar> persia: But no one is there to see who is contributing how many times
<nigelb> bilalakhtar, well, people do sponsor your fixes
<persia> Actually, lots of folk see, and lots of folk watch :)
<Ciemon> you never know who's watching :)
<incorrect> sorry to ask in here, i am trying to figure out what i am missing when trying to use auto confugre "autoreconf: running: aclocal -I autotools/m4; aclocal: couldn't open directory `autotools/m4': No such file or directory"
<dholbach> does anybody know how often the rcbugs page is update?
<geser> dholbach: if you don't get here an answer, try in #ubuntuwire
<dholbach> ah ok
<nigelb> so, what does ~motu-swat do?
<hyperair> we swat bugs
<hyperair> er i mean they
<nigelb> i.e. are they subscribed to bugs, etc?
<mok0> The swat team is security oriented
<mok0> They fix security issues
<mok0> nigelb: ^
<nigelb> mok0, are they subscribed to security issues in universe packages?
<wgrant> Not automatically.
<mok0> nigelb: I guess... that seems to be a good thing
<nigelb> ok, context would help
<nigelb> I'm trying to figure out which of the bugs with patches can be ignored by ~ubuntu-reviews
<nigelb> so if ~motu-swat is subscribed, can we folks safely ignore?
<wgrant> I believe you are interested in ~ubuntu-security-sponsors.
<mok0> nigelb: what bug?
<nigelb> mok0, no no, i'm editing the script which subscribes ~ubuntu-reviews to bugs with patchse
<nigelb> removing out redundant teams like u-u-s and u-m-s and adding any relevant teams
<mok0> nigelb: ah... and bugs in that script will make you very unpopular :-)
<nigelb> yeah
<nigelb> hence proceeding with caution
<nigelb> so if ~motu-swat is subscribed, can we folks safely ignore?
<mok0> nigelb: you may want to test it on the staging server
<nigelb> mok0, it works great already
<nigelb> I'm just making edits
<nigelb> brian wrote the script :)
<mok0> nigelb: ask wgrant he owns the yeam
<mok0> team
<nigelb> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-bugcontrol/ubuntu-qa-tools/master/annotate/head%3A/launchpadlib-scripts/patch-subscriber.py
<nigelb> wgrant, thoughts?
<nigelb> will you folks manage bugs subscribed to motu-swat?
<nigelb> mok0, ^ that is the script
<wgrant> nigelb: You could ignore bugs with ~ubuntu-security-sponsors subscribed.
<wgrant> ~motu-swat -- not so much.
<nigelb> wgrant, okay, will do :)
<mok0> Looks like motu-swat is a subteam of security sponsors anyway
<mok0> wgrant: is that team going away along with universe?
<wgrant> It is unclear.
<datag> could anyone please tell me how to get attention to bug #542185 ? there's a proposal patch to apply. the maintainer seems to be MOTU devs
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 542185 in holdingnuts "holdingnuts GUI badly affected by a bug in Qt 4.6.2" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/542185
<persia> wgrant: As the team owner, you have huge say in whether the team stays or goes :)
<ScottK> If there's someone with some understanding of autofoo, it would be useful to make our taktuk package in lucid work with the autotools-dev package we have so the build-dep version requirement can be relaxed.
<MTecknology> If I built a script that would make working with mutliple chroots really brain deadly simple, is it something other people would use? I'm building it for myself and as I'm approaching line 200, I'm starting to wonder if it would be something others would like.
<nigelb> MTecknology, isn't there already something for it?
<MTecknology> nigelb: is there? ...
<MTecknology> I looked but didn't find one; I hope I didn't miss something
<nigelb> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto#Multiple%20pbuilders
<nigelb> MTecknology, ^
<MTecknology> nigelb: I found that page and assumed it's for pbuilder only
<ScottK> MTecknology: There is also the pbuilder-dist script in ubuntu-dev-tools
<nigelb> MTecknology, oh, sorry, confused multiple pbuilders with multiple chroots
<persia> And there's schroot which is specially designed for the case of working with chroots, rather than having anything to do with building stuff.
<persia> and lucid has a fancy mk-schroot script to generate all classes of schroots.
<nigelb> Oooh.  Nice\
<MTecknology> so I could just as well stop now :P - that sounds like what I'm trying to do :P
<persia> (well, except I didn't manage to do the schroot-from-pbuilder-chroot bit before FF)
<persia> So maverick will *really* handle all classes of schroots :)
<MTecknology> this kinda stinks - I looked for it before I started and didn't find it :P
<MTecknology> would it help if my script worked with schroot and setup an X session before going into it and launch metacity once in it?
<persia> You mean something like `schroot -p` ?
<MTecknology> "Preserve user environment" ?
<persia> Yeah.  Let's you launch X stuff in your primary environment.
<MTecknology> oh, no - like xnest
<persia> Handles all the little tricky bits like setting Xauthority, etc.
<MTecknology> afaik, xnest launches a window for a new X session
<persia> So, `schroot -p sh -c 'apt-get -qy install xnest && xnest &'` ?
<persia> Err.
<MTecknology> xnest on host
<persia> `schroot -p -- sh -c 'apt-get -qy install xnest && xnest &'` ?
<persia> How do you export that display into the chroot?
<MTecknology> Xnest -ac :1 &  export DISPLAY=localhost:1;  schroot -- sh -c 'metacity'
<persia> You'd need a -p in there.
<persia> otherwise DISPLAY gets ignored.
<MTecknology> oh, then toss that in there
<persia> Nifty script.  Thanks :)
<MTecknology> So maybe it won't be too horrible to finish this script
<persia> And actually, you'd want ` Xnest -ac :1 &  export DISPLAY=localhost:1;  schroot -c dapper  -- sh -c 'metacity'`
<persia> Well, refactor it a bit.  We've gone from 200 lines to 1 already :)
<MTecknology> no, not even close
<MTecknology> I wasn't that far yet :P
<persia> Ah, good.
<persia> Yeah, start with what schroot and mk-sbuild give you.  From there, consider adding options to schroot to enable other stuff (like xnest or launch chroot in qemu/kvm, etc.)
<MTecknology> I'll have you check it out when I'm done :)
<ScottK> have you/ask you to ...
<MTecknology> I'll beg you to check it out when I'm done and be very thankful if you do and for any input you provide
<sistpoty|work> ScottK: having taken a glimpse, autofoo doesn't seem to be the problem for taktuk, only dh need to be taught to call ./bootstrap manually before callling make
<sistpoty|work> (/me admits to be still a debhelper v5 user *g*)
<ScottK> sistpoty|work: Could you deal with it?  I asked lucas_, but he doesn't seem to have the time.
<persia> MTecknology: In that case, let me give you my wishlist as input: please allow Xnest with configurable resolution (so I can easily emulate e.g, 800x480), and add support for qemu/kvm so I can easily test odd X startup configs, etc.
<sistpoty|work> ScottK: not too sure if I come around to it today yet, but I guess I should have time tomorrow or at least on saturday
<lucas_> ScottK: I'm in ENOTIME mode until tomorrow evening. but I'm fine if someone else fixes my packages :-)
<ScottK> sistpoty|work: Sounds good.  lucas_ will be happy too.
<sistpoty|work> heh
<lucas_> ScottK: also, doing an archive rebuild is higher on my todo list, and still not done
<james_w> sistpoty|work: override_dh_auto_configure:\n\t./bootstrap or something
<ScottK> lucas_: Yes, we could use that.  Thanks again for those.
<sistpoty|work> james_w: thanks, that was the rune I was looking for :)
<james_w> sistpoty|work: depending on whether you want configure to be called too
<sistpoty|work> james_w: makes some sense, yes ;)
<james_w> if you want configure too then + "\n\tdh_auto_configure"
<MTecknology> persia: resolution will be easy enough - kvm i'll need to read into more - my laptop doesn't support that so I might need to figure out some way to test
<persia> MTecknology: Test with qemu then.  If you get qemu working, getting kvm working is just a matter of testing if the HW supports KVM, and swapping the command name.
<MTecknology> ok
<MTecknology> how do I set Xnest display resolution?
<persia> And you said that was easy :)
<MTecknology> I lied :D
<MTecknology> persia: Is there some magically easy way to create/delete chroots?
<persia> Create, yes.  Delete, not yet implemented.
<persia> Delete would require parsing schroot.conf, removing the target {file,LV,directory}, and then deleting the config stanza.
<MTecknology> I have ~1/2 of that done
<sistpoty|work> lucas_: ok with that? http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/~sistpoty/taktuk.debdiff
<lucas_> sistpoty|work: probably :-)
<lucas_> sistpoty|work: if it works, I'm fine with it
<sistpoty|work> heh :)
<MTecknology> persia: A person should be able to run apache inside a chroot too and use xnest to open a web browser?
<sistpoty|work> at least it builds fine in an completely unclean chroot (need to do a test once I'm home, signing key is at home anyways)
<persia> MTecknology: Sure, as long as it's the same chroot, but lots of services have a detect-if-this-is-a-chroot-and-don't-start facility.
<MTecknology> persia: oh.. they break inside of it?
<persia> Some just don't start.  Check your logs inside your chroot.
<persia> (this is part of why I'd like to be able to launch a virtual environment based on the contents of a chroot)
<MTecknology> ok
<persia> (extra points for snapshot support)
<MTecknology> :P - This is starting to sound like just using virtualbox :P
<persia> Actually: I don't care about snapshot: can be snapshot, union filesystems, etc.  Just something that lets me start from a fresh state on demand.
<persia> Well, except the idea is to *reuse* the same chroot for several purposes: build-testing, app testing, virtual environments, etc.
<jetienne> q. i install a /etc/init.d script with dh_installinit, it got installed as expected. but it doesnt get delete when i remove the package, how come ? is that normal ? if not, how can i fix it ?
<persia> Saves disk space.
<persia> jetienne: Try purging the package
<jetienne> persia: ok
<ScottK> It looks like dh_link will only symlink files, not directories (unless I'm doing it wrong).  Any suggestions on a sane way to do directory symlinking?  Package is DH 7 based.
<persia> ScottK: The general advice is don't.  If that doesn't work, do it in your install rule.
<persia> "override_dh_auto_install:\n\tdh_auto_install\n\tln -s ..." would be the model.
<ScottK> It's that or archive bloat with duplicate files in different binaries.
<persia> Or a huge input file to dh_link.
<superm1> well just build that input file to dh_link each time
<ScottK> The problem is that the file list would change relatively frequently, so that wouldn't be very maintainable.
<superm1> ScottK, hence why you could just build it dynamically each time you run that rule.  you can just pass the output of find -type f or so into it
<persia> ScottK: Well, if you generate it at build time, it can be.  override_dh_auto_install:\n\t${generate-dh-link-file}\n\tdh_auto_install
<mok0> hiya RainCT
<sebner> ScottK: axiom builds?
<ScottK> sebner: No.  A different one.
<jetienne__> persia: sudo apt-get purge, does remove the init.d script, while sudo apt-get remove doesnt.... but this is a fully unmodified init.d script. how come it is not removed on apt-get remove ?
<sebner> ScottK: "different"?
<ScottK> jetienne__: That is the difference between purge and remove
<jetienne__> ScottK: even if the config is unmodified ?
<ScottK> sebner: My question wasn't about axiom
<slytherin> jetienne__: I believe the files under /etc are removed only in case of purge
<ScottK> jetienne__: Yes.
<ScottK> As slytherin says.
<persia> jetienne__: It7s still a configuration file.
<persia> slytherin: There are ways around that, but generally, yes.
<sebner> ScottK: what question? xD
<jetienne__> ScottK: ok, and a new reinstall be be ok if the new script is the same as the previous install, correct ?
<persia> Right.  Make sure the init script doesn't assume the package is actually installed.
<jetienne__> cool
<ScottK> jetienne__: Yes.  If it's different and the previous was unmodified, it'll be updated.
<jetienne__> persia: ScottK: slytherin: thanks all for the help
<sebner> ScottK: I just noticed that you synced a new axiom version and the axiom I remember didn't build for years so I was wondering if this is really fixed now
<ScottK> sebner: It managed a test build.  We'll see.
<sebner> :)
 * sistpoty|work heads home... cya
<slytherin> ScottK: If you are not too busy can you please approve jboss binaries from new queue?
<RainCT> Hey mok0 :)
<mok0> RainCT: long time
<RainCT> mok0: yeah, how are you?
<mok0> RainCT: Oh, pretty good... busy
<ScottK> slytherin: Done.
<slytherin> ScottK: thanks
<ScottK> np
<ScottK> Could someone please beat configure in libuser into realizing that "checking for python script directory... ${prefix}/lib/python2.6/site-packages" is not true.
<MTecknology> persia: well - I wrote the script - now I need to try it and make sure it works - so far the only thing I tested is --help :P
<persia> heh.
<persia> URI?
<MTecknology> persia: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~mtecknology/scripting/personal-scripts/annotate/head%3A/devroot
<MTecknology> persia: It definitely won't work - but it's getting there - most of the stuff is there
<persia> MTecknology: schroot -l
<persia> MTecknology: Also, your script doesn't seem to support LV or file schroots.
<persia> MTecknology: What's ARCHIVE for?  Can't you rely on the schroot's apt-cache?
<persia> MTecknology: delete looks *really* unsafe, especially for non directory schroots
<persia> MTecknology: Please use mk-sbuild to make the schroots: it supports all sorts of options well beyond those in your create function.
<MTecknology> persia: ok
<persia> MTecknology: And schroot should already be bind-mounting /proc, etc. : unless you have a test failure, you should be able to skip that.
<MTecknology> oh
<persia> Oh, and don't force running as root.  If you need root, use sudo for that (one) command.
<MTecknology> does schroot not require root?
<persia> Nope.
<MTecknology> oh
<MTecknology> so showing you was an awesome idea :D
<persia> It requires root to *create* a chroot, or to update a source, but not to use a schroot.
<MTecknology> cool
<persia> You also want to use getopt to process your options.  Take a look at mk-sbuild for an example.
<bjsnider> http://packages.debian.org/sid/sound/madfuload
<MTecknology> #bash said you shouldn't directly call getopt - I probably misunderstood - I'll check that out
<persia> You *shouldn't* directly call getopt :)
<bjsnider> i think that should be synced asap since lucid and karmic's version is broken
<MTecknology> persia: thanks for the review :D - I'
<MTecknology> I'll work on that when I finish my report and classes (tomorrow) - times up for the day
<persia> bjsnider: I'm inclined to agree.  Have you submitted a sync request?
<bjsnider> persia, negative
<bjsnider> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=547336
<ubottu> Debian bug 547336 in madfuload "Various fixes to madfuload from Ubuntu" [Grave,Fixed]
<bjsnider> that's the debian bug report that explains the problems and fixes though
<persia> Right.  It clearly needs fixing.  Do you plan to file the sync request?
<bjsnider> i can if you want. it's through launchpad right?
<persia> Either that, or run requestsync if you have ubuntu-dev-tools installed.  If you don't want, I will: but if you do want, you may as well.
<persia> The idea being that if you notice stuff like that, you're a useful person to be filing syncs :)
<persia> !sync
<ubottu> Helpful information for filing a sync request can be found at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SyncRequestProcess
<bjsnider> persia, i'll take acare of it. seems easy enough
<persia> bjsnider: Thanks :)  If you see more like that, please also request those.
<bjsnider> persia, don't tempt me
<persia> Be aware that often when there is Ubuntu variation it needs a merge (but not when the Ubuntu stuff is merged back like that)
<persia> bjsnider: Please, especially for Grave stuff.  Ideally we'd like to address all of that stuff pre-release.
<persia> Just take care, test, etc.
<randomaction> persia: hi, could you please renew my sponsorship team membership?
<persia> randomaction: No, but I'll add you to the new sponsorship team :)
<randomaction> persia: That'll do for me
<randomaction> so we're migrating to a single team as memberships expire?
<persia> Excellent :)
<ScottK> persia: It's still useful to have people in the old team also so they can unsubscribe bugs.
<persia> ScottK: We have a script that autounsubscribes the old teams and subscribes the new ones.  Apologies that it doesn't run often enough.
<ScottK> Ah, OK.
<ScottK> Nevermind then.
<persia> http://people.canonical.com/~dholbach/resubscribe for the curious
<ScottK> sebner: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/axiom/20091101-7/+build/1681921
<MTecknology> persia: what package does mk-sbuild come in?
<persia> ubuntu-dev-tools
<MTecknology> persia: oh- I was trying to keep the dependencies pretty light, then you can load up junk in the vm; I'm going to add an option to do just that actually. after chroot installs prompt for loading up with ubuntu dev tools
<persia> MTecknology: Except you need ubuntu-dev-tools *outside* the chroot.
<MTecknology> why's that?
<persia> I don't expect to be able to get that script somewhere else until maverick+1.
<persia> Because you want to have mk-sbuild to create your schroot.
<MTecknology> I'm looking at that script
<MTecknology> persia: what benefits are there in having a single file chroot or the LV?
<persia> file schroots take up almost no space.  LV schroots use LV snapshot rather than aufs/unionfs
<persia> directory schroots are fastest, but take up more space, and get a little odd when updated.
<persia> (and may actually break if lots and lots of stuff is installed on low-memory systems)
<MTecknology> oh
<persia> So if you're low on disk-space, you want file schroots.  If you're low on memory (or need it for something else), you want LV schroots.  If you have bundles of both and want speed, you want directory schroots.
<persia> Note that low-on-disk-space can also be interpreted as want-schroots-for-i386/amd64/powerpc/armel/lpia for dapper/hardy/jaunty/karmic/lucid/etch/lenny/squeeze/sid
<MTecknology> ok
<persia> (not that anyone really *needs* 39 schroots on one machine, but ...)
<persia> Err, 37.
<soren> Oh, 37 is perfectly reasonable. 39 is nuts.
<persia> soren: Indeed.  39 requires that someone have something unsupported configured.
<Rhonda> wgrant, persia: wesnoth upstream confirmed that the patch from the Debian BTS fixes the SDL issue for wesnoth. It just takes back parts of another fix that sdl upstream wanted to fix with that, I'm not sure which one is the more relevant, though.
<persia> (actually, two things)
<MTecknology> persia: would it be ok to say have it a config option so they pick one and that's what's used for all of the chroots?
<persia> No.
<Rhonda> persia, wgrant: http://bugzilla.libsdl.org/show_bug.cgi?id=716 seems to be the issue that would get reverted with the mouse click fix.
<ubottu> bugzilla.libsdl.org bug 716 in events "Application doesn't receive SDL_ACTIVEEVENT when dragging from other window" [Normal,Resolved: fixed]
<persia> Lots of folk want several releases or several architectures.  All 37 is a bit excessive, but ...
<persia> Rhonda: Do we know what software uses SDL_ACTIVEEVENT?
<sebner> ScottK: nice!
<MTecknology> persia: once you build the schroot, does the chroot command change between how it's built or does schroot just handle it?
<persia> MTecknology: schroot just handles it.
<persia> But for foreign schroots, you need qemu-kvm-extras-static installed on the host.
<MTecknology> foreign?
<persia> Hm.  3dwm seems to use it, but I'm not sure that's as important as wesnoth :)
<persia> MTecknology: e.g. powerpc schroot on i386.
<MTecknology> oh
<MTecknology> wait... --config doesn't let you specify a config but rather dumps the whole config..
<persia> Ugh.  ffmpeg uses it: anyone know if drag'n'drop is critical for ffmpeg?
<MTecknology> persia: schroot --config dumps its config instead of letting you specify a different config...
<persia> Why would you want to use an alternate config?
<MTecknology> different users  that want to have chroots
<persia> So, you set up the base schroots for the environment.
<persia> And users create snapshots based on those that are private to the user.
<persia> I use http://people.ubuntu.com/~persia/update-schroots to update my source chroots daily.
<MTecknology> now I'm wondering if keeping notes about things will be better than just making a script to run those commands - I was going for simplicity but I'm not sure if I'm going to overly complicate things to do everything
<persia> For the case of running Xnest, I think there's a one-liner once you have a schroot set up.
<persia> For the qemu/kvm case, I'd be very excited to know a way to do it.
<persia> I think schroot already does just about everything else.
<MTecknology> My original thought was, you can run ./devroot lucid || ./devroot -X lucid
<MTecknology> then I thoguht, well - maybe I can make it make/delete them
<persia> And then it got complicated :)
<MTecknology> ya, it the complicated I want to avoid :P
<MTecknology> is mk-sbuild pretty simple?
<persia> Except for stuff like testing low-resolution UI or testing how boot happens, `schroot -p -c lucid` probably handles 90% of what you need.
<persia> In the simple case, it's called with `mk-sbuild lucid` and does everything for you.
<persia> It also handles as many of the complex cases as are well understood by those who contribute to it.
<persia> The man page is fairly comprehensive.
<Rhonda> persia: No clue, no. And I am not aware of an extracted source site â¦
<MTecknology> persia: thanks, I think I figured out that part
<persia> Rhonda: Yeah.  extracted-source just takes lots of disk space :(
<persia> Rhonda: But if it doesn't break ffmpeg, then I think we ought apply it.  If it does, I think we need to look at that use case carefully, and see if we can find another way around.
<Rhonda> persia: There was source.debian.net, no clue what happened to that â¦
<persia> wesnoth likely has tens of thousands of users, and ffmpeg likely has millions, which makes it tricky :(
<Rhonda> Maybe just extracting the reverse-depends of libsdl1.2?
<Rhonda> That should be doable with not too much overhead, me thinks. One could even delete the sources after the grep -R again â¦
<persia> I've a local mirror with a mostly idle processor, if someone wants to write a quick script for me to run :)
<Rhonda> If I wouldn't be so seriously distracted by this small living creature in my lap I would give it a shot. %-)
<persia> heh
<Rhonda> HE'S SOOOOOOO CUTE!!!
<persia> Actually, find -exec zgrep is probably enough.
 * persia tries that
<Rhonda> grep-dctrl -FBuild-Depends,Build-Depends-Indep libsdl -sPackage /var/lib/apt/lists/*_Packages
<Rhonda> â¦ or something like that?
<Rhonda> .. rather *_Sources of course.
<persia> Rhonda: to find SDL_ACTIVEEVENT?
<persia> Oh, to get a smaller set of sources to zgrep.  RIght.
<Rhonda> To find the relevant source packages to extract. :)
<Rhonda> persia: If that wasn't the issue why sdl 1.2.14 was pulled into lucid I wouldn't think that it would be that relevant, to be honest.
<persia> I'd agree.
<persia> Still, due dilligence, etc.
* persia changed the topic of #ubuntu-motu to: Feature Freeze in effect | Lucid Beta 2 Released | Want to get involved with the MOTU? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing | Sponsor queue: http://is.gd/2y76G | http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/ftbfs | http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/NBS/ | http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/debcheck | latest rebuild failures: http://udd.debian.org/cgi-bin/ubuntu_ftbfs.cgi
<persia> why do all the SDL users have to be the *huge* packages ...
<soren> persia: qemu isn't that big.
<persia> soren: No, that one is one of the small ones.
<soren> persia: It doesn't exercise much of the SDL framework, though.
<persia> Well, my grep is still running...
 * persia grumbles.  *everything seems to use SDL_ACTIVEEVENT :/
<persia> OK.  So there are 114 packages (including wesnoth) that use SDL_ACTIVEEVENT (based on grep of the sources of the packages that depend/build-depend on sdl).  Anyone have any suggestions for determining which (if any) of these would be affected by a regression of http://bugzilla.libsdl.org/show_bug.cgi?id=716
<ubottu> bugzilla.libsdl.org bug 716 in events "Application doesn't receive SDL_ACTIVEEVENT when dragging from other window" [Normal,Resolved: fixed]
<lifeless> persia: perhaps they are all affected ?
<lifeless> persia: however if its a drag and drop issue; perhaps looking for that api instead?
<persia> lifeless: I'm fairly sure wesnoth isn't, or Rhonda wouldn't be encouraging the application of the patch that causes the regression.
<persia> You don't happen to know a grep term, do you?
<lifeless> ah
<lifeless> no, sorry.
<persia> Yeah.  The only bit of SDL I know about at all is the Joystick API (which has some issues and doesn't support all my joysticks), but I've not dug around in it in years, and I'm mostly lost for the rest.
<persia> But I *do* have unpacked local sources for all the potentially affected packages against which I can run queries if given guidance :)
<lifeless> DragAcceptFiles perhaps
<lifeless> or try just Drag
#ubuntu-motu 2010-04-09
<persia> lifeless: That helped some.  DragAcceptFiles had no matches.  Drag and SDL_ACTIVEEVENTS have 85 common matches.  Thanks.
<lifeless> de nada
<wgrant> http://people.ubuntuwire.org/~wgrant/rebuild-ftbfs-test/test-rebuild-20100407-lucid.html is now updating hourly from the in-progress archive rebuild.
<wgrant> Now http://qa.ubuntuwire.org/ftbfs/test-rebuild-20100407/.
<micahg> wgrant: I'm curious, were the rebuilds on udd not sufficient?
<wgrant> micahg: An LP rebuild was started yesterday.
<wgrant> lucas' don't cover them.
<wgrant> (I don't know why it was started; I just organised the report)
<micahg> wgrant: ok
 * ScottK thinks it's because there's a item in the Beta release checklist to do it.
<wgrant> Maybe London's a bit cold and needs a buildfarm of heaters.
<lifeless> very cold - gulf stream moved, no ?
<fabrice_sp> Linux000: got 5 minutes?
<Linux000> Sure
<Linux000> fabrice_sp: Sure
<fabrice_sp> cool :-)
<fabrice_sp> Linux000: it's about the DEP-3 header: it has to go into the patch you created, not as the header of the debdiff
<Linux000> Ahh, then I've probably been uploading patches wrong too, the patch is the debdiff, right?
<fabrice_sp> oh: I've just seen that you didn't do a patch with your change, but a direct source change. As the package uses quilt, you need to create a patch for that
<fabrice_sp> the debdiff is a kind of patch, yes :-) I was speaking about the change in glock.py
<Linux000> Okay, so how would I make the patch for this?
<fabrice_sp> do you know how to use quilt?
<Linux000> not really
<fabrice_sp> ok. You first need to add a patch to the list pf patches managed by quilt. This is done by running 'quilt new <patch-name>'
<fabrice_sp> as patch-name, check in debian/patches what are the name that are used
<fabrice_sp> and use something similar
<alkisg> Hi all. I'm the developer of a project with various files; shell scripts, images, desktop files etc, and it also has some python modules & executables. Could someone propose to me a similar package that I could use as a template to package mine?
<fabrice_sp> Linux000: for example fix_glock_error.diff
<Linux000> fabrice_sp: Thanks, trying to be short is not a strong point
<fabrice_sp> Linux000: what do you mean?
<fabrice_sp> alkisg: I don't have any in mind right now
<alkisg> Thank you. Someone else?
<Linux000> the name I was going for was to long for comfort
<fabrice_sp> Linux000: ok :-) The name doesn't need to be long, as you will have a header in the patch that will explain it
<Linux000> okay
<fabrice_sp> alkisg: aubio ?
<alkisg> fabrice_sp: no, no audio
<alkisg> aah, aubio? heh
<alkisg> OK, looking...
<alkisg> (basically what I'm looking for is a simple, nice packaged package that also has some python modules included - I can mostly do the rest of the stuff...)
<Linux000> pychess has python modules, if you need an example of that
<ScottK> alkisg: If it's just the python stuff, pypolicyd-spf.
<ScottK> Although if I were doing it now, I'd use debhelper 7 and not CDBS.
 * alkisg is using debhelper 6 atm...
<ScottK> Then pypolicyd-spf is not a bad basis for Python stuff.
<alkisg> Thank you all, /me looks...
<ScottK> You could also look at pyspf for an example of multiple binary packages.
<alkisg> Hmm yeah, that would be useful as well, I do need 2 binary packages.
<Linux000> fabrice_sp: I have the new patch in quilt and my source, do I add the file(glock.py) to the patch, then patch it, or vice-versa
<fabrice_sp> yes: you first need a clean glock.py file, and then, you can add you file, patch it again, and use quit refresh to add the modifications to the patch
<Linux000> great
<fabrice_sp> when done, you just have to add at the beginning of the patch, the header you want
<fabrice_sp> Linux000: by the way, origin should point to the svn commit entry with
<fabrice_sp> s/with//
<Linux000> should this patch also have the changelog updated?
<fabrice_sp> you should name the patch in the changelog, like 'fix_glock_error.diff: fix .... (LP: #534761)'
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 534761 in pychess "pychess in Lucid doesn't start" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/534761
<fabrice_sp> with the LP: stuff, the bug report will be fixed as soon as the fix will be uploaded and accepted into the archive
<fabrice_sp> makr as fixed, I mean
<Linux000> fabrice_sp: Where can I find the svn, and with what?
<fabrice_sp> Linux000: http://code.google.com/p/pychess/source/browse/
<fabrice_sp> and browsing by source, you will find the commit that makes this change. Let me check
<fabrice_sp> Linux000: seems to be this one: http://code.google.com/p/pychess/source/detail?r=1653
<Linux000> Okay, I see now, that goes in as origin, also, how do I get the file from quilt? I can't seem to find it.
<fabrice_sp> you don't have it created in debian/patches ?
<Linux000> from the root of the source tree, I ran '
<Linux000> '
<Linux000> sorry
<Linux000> i ran quilt new glock_error_fix.diff
<fabrice_sp> then you ran "quilt add lib/pychess/System/glock.py" ?
<Linux000> yes
<fabrice_sp> made modifications to the file and ran quilt refresh ?
<Linux000> yes
<fabrice_sp> so it should be in debian/patches
<fabrice_sp> hmm, what is the value of QUILT_PATCHES variable?
<fabrice_sp> by default, patches goes into patches and not debian/patches, IIRC
<Linux000> How would I find that?
<Linux000> NVM, I found it, it was under patches, not debian/patches
<fabrice_sp> ok: that's why you need to set QUILT_PATCHES to debian/patches next time
<Linux000> understood
<fabrice_sp> so you need to move the patch to debian/patches
<fabrice_sp> and update the series file
<Linux000> Ok
<fabrice_sp> and delete the roo patches directory, to avoid having it in the debdiff twice
<Linux000> so, that patch file gets the headers and is uploaded to lauchpad?
<fabrice_sp> you can upload the patch to launchpad, or generate a debdiff between your package and the actual one and uplaod it to launchpad. The latter is prefered from a sponsor point of view as it's less work :-)
<Linux000> debdiff the compiled package, right?
<fabrice_sp> the source package
<Linux000> Good, my computer just got wiped (some mountall error in lucid) so I have no cdbs, devscripts, or anything
<fabrice_sp> what sponsors do is download the actual source, review and apply the debdiff, and if ok, upload the resulting source package
<Linux000> ok, I thought the built packages were uploaded to the repository
<fabrice_sp> Linux000: I have a dual boot for that reason :-) (and looking after kvm right now)
<Linux000> I had windows, so I lucked out and got ubuntu back, I needed a reminder as to why I use ubuntu:)
<fabrice_sp> :-)
<fabrice_sp> no windows at all here: only live-usb's to recover things :-)
<fabrice_sp> (and dual boot now!)
<fabrice_sp> with karmic
<Linux000> Well, I wish I could get rid of windows, but I also program some WAGO PLC's and they need windows to program, and oddly enough, my debian touchscreen wants a windows IDE
<Linux000> How would I get the debdiff of the source?
<fabrice_sp> you have to generate a dsc file first with debuild -S
<Linux000> ahh, okay
<fabrice_sp> and then debdiff the 2 dsc files
<Linux000> I don't have to sign it, right?
<fabrice_sp> no
<Linux000> this will have to wait until tomorrow, to late for me, it should be up around 4~5 CST
<fabrice_sp> np: I have to go to work now :-)
<micahg> siretart: will you be looking into the vlc build failure, bjsnider gave me a patch earlier which I was going to try over the weekend to port it to xul192
<siretart> micahg: I just noticed the build failure, but am currently very short on time
<siretart> micahg: if you could just fix it, that would be really great!
<micahg> siretart: ok, so I'll take it then
<siretart> thanks
<micahg> siretart: critical?
<dholbach> good morning
<siretart> micahg: without having it fixed, we cannot do any updates, including security and other important updates. I consider that pretty critical
<micahg> siretart: it's a universe package...that's the same for any other FTBFS
<siretart> micahg: oh, are severities now distro global (again)? did I miss something? - anyways, feel free to downgrade
<micahg> siretart: maybe I'm missing something idk
<siretart> I wanted this bug to appear at the top of the vlc bugs
<micahg> siretart: does MOTU have different severity settings as opposed to triagers (like status)?
<siretart> micahg: I hope not
<micahg> siretart: it would seem then it's not severe until we need an update...I'm going to throw up a test build tonight
<xteejx> bug 559054, can someone take a look at this please, think there's dependency problems with the new metacity package
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 559054 in ubuntu "compiz-gnome needs to be removed during partial upgrade" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/559054
<xteejx> may affect upgrading users to beta 2
<joaopinto> xteejx, I believe that is a known issue already being looked at
<xteejx> ahh ok joaopinto, didn't see a duplicate in LP thought it wasn't made aware
<pmcenery> Hi motu's. I filed this one this morning in the hope that it is seen as important enough to be included. bug #558946
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 558946 in ubuntu "FFe: Sync ipheth 1.0-1 (universe) from Debian sid (main)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/558946
<pmcenery> After a long slog... I have finally managed to get the package sponsored.
<hyperair> doesn't look sponsored to me.
<pmcenery> Do we have any MOTU's with iPhones to be able to test it?
<pmcenery> Sorry... Debian sponsored.
<hyperair> aah i see.
<pmcenery> You dont need a sponsor for a sync from what I can tell. Or do you?
<hyperair> you do.
<hyperair> but first you need the FFe acked.
<hyperair> go poke some #ubuntu-release people =)
<pmcenery> I guess it would need someone with an iPhone to test. Do we have MOTU's with such evil devices?
 * hyperair shrugs
<pmcenery> hyperair: thanks. Will give it a try
<hyperair> i've got friends with them, and i wouldn't be opposed to getting one myself, if i didn't already have a good, working phone already.
<pmcenery> hyperair: understood. I'm not religious about them as some people are. I have one, it works, and ipheth works quite well, so I thought I'd package it up properly.
<pmcenery> A google of popcon and ipheth shows that my PPA package has been quite popular
<hyperair> pmcenery: i'd imagine so.
<hyperair> pmcenery: and i saw your RFS on debian-mentors sometime back. congrats on getting it into debian =)
<hyperair> i know how hard it is, first hand.
<pmcenery> hyperair: lol. Yes. It seems that once you have worked with a couple of DD's, it gets easier. They come to trust your work...
<hyperair> pmcenery: yes, of course. it's the same everywhere
<hyperair> pmcenery: also, it's easier to get things that have a team with DDs watching over the set of packages
<hyperair> e.g. CLI packages are easy to get in as we've got two DDs in the team
<hyperair> python packages are also fairly easy to get in
<pmcenery> hyperair: Yes. I ended up joining the debian-perl team during the process of getting slimrat sponsored. Although in the end I had a non perl DD sponsor me. The perl team were not too interested in sponsoring apps, only modules.
<hyperair> heh i see.
<pmcenery> I'll hang around here a while... hopefully someone will be brave!
<hyperair> i would if i had an iphone =\
<hyperair> feel like donating one to me? ;-)
<pmcenery> lol. I've only got one. And I think the wife will be getting it when I get the next one...
<pmcenery> Well, next phone! Not guarantee it will be an iPhone
<hyperair> heheh
<Aquina> can someone lend me an ear? It's because I started to use Bazaar with Launchpad.
<joaopinto> anyone experienced with reprepro ?
<Rhonda> joaopinto: Just ask your question - that will get you a better propability of helpful answers. :)
<joaopinto> except that I maybe talking to the wind ;)
<joaopinto> the reprepro man page is not very clear
<Rhonda> You may that even if someone claims to be experienced with $foo.
<joaopinto> is copysrc expected to copy also the source package ?
<Rhonda> Actually it doesn't "copy" anything, the package stays in the pool at the same place. It just "copies" the medatdata in its database and the Sources file.
<joaopinto> right, I am refering to the meta data
<joaopinto> is it expected to copy the source metatada to the target release Sources file ?
<Rhonda> I would very much think so that that's its job, yes.
<Rhonda> Though an reprepro export run afterwards never can hurt.
<joaopinto> no, according to the man page its job is to copy packages whose source (Source:?) match the specified name
<joaopinto> it does so for binary packages produce from a given source, but is not clear if it does or should do the same for the source package
<joaopinto> produced
<Rhonda> It doesn't "every package be it dsc, deb or udeb"
<Rhonda> The dsc part is pretty clear source package. :)
<Rhonda> s/It doesn't //
<joaopinto> ok :P
<mhall119> jdstrand: are you around?
<jdstrand> mhall119: yes
<mhall119> jdstrand: is there anything you need to get a FFe for the other 2 qimo packages?
<mhall119> qimo-games isn't terribly useful on it's own
<jdstrand> mhall119: they all need an FFe. I think it would be fine to have them all in one bug
<mhall119> okay, there are currently 3 needs-packaging bugs for the 3 packages
<jdstrand> mhall119: since they are small and dependent on each other, aiui
<mhall119> do I need to make an additional FFe bug?
<jdstrand> mhall119: oh, if there are already 3 bugs open, then you probably should do the one more for qimo-games
<jdstrand> mhall119: since they are already separated. do mention how they relate to each other though
<mhall119> qimo-games has already been accepted, the other two have not
<jdstrand> I think I am confused
<mhall119> ok, I'll add comments to the other 2
<jdstrand> there are 3 total
<mhall119> yes
<jdstrand> 1 accepted, two not?
<mhall119> qimo-games was accepted
<mhall119> yes
<mhall119> qimo-wallpaper and qimo-session have not
<jdstrand> I see, then wither wait for review of the other two, are ask someone in ubuntu-release to look at them (I am not a member of ubuntu-release)
<mhall119> qimo-games was accepted a couple months ago, you rejected the other two because I needed to expand on the copyrights
<jdstrand> s/are/or/
<mhall119> so I don't think qimo-games needed an FFe
<mhall119> is there a channel for ubuntu-release?
<jdstrand> I think qimo-games maybe didn't get uploaded? I don't remember looking at it specifically, but I might not remember correctly
<jdstrand> mhall119: #ubuntu-release
<mhall119> they were all uploaded
<mhall119> qimo-games is in the repo already
<mhall119> the other two have been uploaded, but not accepted
<Ciemon> afternoon all, having just put my first debdiff on a bug using https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/HowToFix I wonder if there's a similar guide that explains using bzr and launchpad? I can't seem to find one.
<nigelb> Ciemon, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DistributedDevelopment/Documentation
<evilshadeslayer_> dholbach: ping
<evilshadeslayer_> whom should i talk to in order to adopt rekonq ?
<evilshadeslayer_> ill be in and out.. so can someone please point me to the right people? ( ive already read the wiki links )
<dholbach> evilshadeslayer_: pong
<dholbach> I'm not sure I'm the best person to talk about rekonq
<Laney> there is too much cdbs magic in pandoc
 * Laney goes cross-eyed figuring it out
<evilshadeslayer_> dholbach: ok so who then? :)
<evilshadeslayer_> dholbach: i already do the docs for them... so i can easily adopt this package...
<evilshadeslayer_> ( thats my opinion )
<Ciemon> nigelb: thanks
<nigelb> np :)
<evilshadeslayer_> Tonio__: i see that your the last person to update the package :)
<dholbach> evilshadeslayer_: can you try to explain what you want to do? :)
<evilshadeslayer_> dholbach: i want to adopt a upstream ( rekonq )
<dholbach> ahhhhh nice
<evilshadeslayer_> dholbach: ive been meaning to do this since some time
<dholbach> evilshadeslayer_: a good first step might be to have a look at the changelog of the package and get in touch with the people who worked on the package before, so you get to know ubuntu and debian maintainers which is a good start
<dholbach> evilshadeslayer_: also check out the web page I mentioned - it should give you a few good practical tips
<evilshadeslayer_> dholbach: lol... i work with the rekonq devs on a daily basis... i practically know all the dev work they do.. also i build rekonq everyday :P
<dholbach> awesome
<dholbach> :-D
<evilshadeslayer_> dholbach: ok but how do i officially adopt it? like do i subscribe a ML or something?
<dholbach> it's a good idea to track the bug reports - you can subscribe to the package
<dholbach> also have a chat with the people in #ubuntu-bugs
<evilshadeslayer_> dholbach: ive subscribed to the meta kubuntu bugs list
<dholbach> wow
<evilshadeslayer_> hehe.. yeah i just deleted about 13MB's worth of bug mail :P
<evilshadeslayer_> from my mail box that is :)
<evilshadeslayer_> i guess i should just wait for Tonio__ ...
<ScottK> maco: You ought to have a look at Debian Bug #577087.
<ubottu> Debian bug 577087 in wnpp "ITP: spim -- MIPS R2000/R3000 emulator" [Wishlist,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/577087
<jdstrand> mhall119: hey. sorry about this, but I need to reject the packages that were uploaded to the archive. I don't know what happened, but the source are like a source within a source. you can see what I mean by viewing the packages at https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/lucid/+queue?queue_state=0&queue_text=qimo
<jdstrand> mhall119: eg, a dpkg-source -x ...dsc results in:
<jdstrand> qimo-wallpaper/qimo-wallpaper_2.0.0-ubuntu1.dsc
<jdstrand> qimo-wallpaper/qimo-wallpaper_2.0.0-ubuntu1.diff.gz
<jdstrand> among other things
<zgreg> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/compiz/+bug/559005
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 559005 in compiz "Compiz won't start after the 10.04 Beta 2 update (dup-of: 558998)" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 558998 in compiz "[lucid] compiz-gnome broken because of metacity update" [Undecided,In progress]
<zgreg> this is annoying...
<jdstrand> mhall119: perhaps this is due to highvoltage's upload? I don't know
<jdstrand> mhall119: you want an orig.tar.gz, a .dsc, a .diff.gz. a dpkg-source -x on the dsc will untar the orig.tar.gz and apply diff.gz to it (which ideally will only touch the debian/ dir). if you are aware of all that, just take it up with highvoltage and/or revu
<jdstrand> mhall119: this does not affect the FFe. upload new packages and we'll get the processed
<Tonio__> evilnhandler: hey
<Tonio__> we won't go with rekonq right now
<Tonio__> evilnhandler: we probably will switch to rekonq one day
<Tonio__> evilnhandler: there are still too many bugs of features lacking with it right now
<zooko`> Folks: we had a critical performance bug in Tahoe-LAFS (actually in foolscap) and we think we fixed it, but we have one report that it still exists after the upgrade, but we can't reproduce it.
<zooko`> Anybody else want to try?
<zooko`> maco uploaded the update of foolscap which I think fixed the bug.
<zooko`> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/foolscap/+bug/548993
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 548993 in foolscap "please upgrade foolscap in Ubuntu Lucid to v0.5.1" [Undecided,Fix released]
<zooko`> The details about the attempts to reproduce the problem are in http://tahoe-lafs.org/trac/tahoe-lafs/ticket/983
<zooko`> Basically, if you can upload, say, a 500 GB mutable file to your localhost with the current version in Lucid, then we're good. :-)
<zooko`> In a different topic, how do I tell launchpad that this is a bug in pycentral, not in foolscap: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/foolscap/+bug/388855
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 388855 in foolscap "package python-foolscap 0.3.2.dfsg-2 failed to install/upgrade: subprocess post-installation script returned error exit status 1" [Undecided,New]
<ScottK> zooko`: Just change the affected package.
<zooko`> ScottK: there doesn't appear to be a package for pycentral.
<zooko`> I could at least *unset* it from foolscap.
<zooko`> There I set it to "invalid".
<ScottK> zooko`: How about python-central
<zooko`> I looked for that! I'll look again.
<zooko`> " There is no project in Launchpad named "python-central". Please search for it as it may be registered with a different name."
<maco> zooko: python-central package, not project
<ScottK> zooko: Actually I suspect that's not a bug at all.  I suspect the user played with the symlink for /usr/bin/python.
<maco> zooko: i just added a python-central task to it
<maco> zooko: for future reference, click "also affects distribution" to set the package within a distro that is affected
<zooko> Okay. Anything else I should do about it?
<zooko> maco: I don't get it. Isn't a "distribution" a version of Ubuntu such as Karmic, Lucid?
<maco> zooko: ubuntu is a distribution
<maco> zooko: baltix linux also uses launchpad
<maco> so if you want to mark a package within ubuntu or baltix, you click "also affects distribution", select which distro from the drop down, and put the package name in the textbox
<zooko> Ah, so if I click on "also affects distribution" I'll then be able to find python-central-as-part-of-ubuntu ?
<zooko> Or are you just saying I should have marked it as also affecting Ubuntu?
<maco> zooko: the first one
<maco> but i just did it for you
<zooko> Thanks.
<zooko> The parts about different people trying to reproduce that performance bug are here: http://tahoe-lafs.org/trac/tahoe-lafs/ticket/983#comment:7
<delimiter> hi folks. I'm trying to backport puppet and facter from lucid to hardy. facter builds fine but puppet gives me this error from pbuilder build: pbuilder-satisfydepends failed - presumably because it needs the newer version of facter and that's not in the base.tgz. How can I fix this?
<kirkland> is it possible to have a symlink installed in /etc be treated like a conffile?
<kirkland> nevermind, cjwatson answered that in #ubuntu-devel
<kirkland> short answer: DFDT
 * hyperair kicks dpkg-source's @ubuntu.com check
<xteejx> Hey guys
<hyperair> hello.
<xteejx> Noticed another dependency problem in today's updates, hasn't been reported. bug 559447
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 559447 in samba "[lucid] samba is to be removed during update" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/559447
<ScottK> xteejx: Are you on amd64?
<xteejx> yeah ScottK
<ScottK> xteejx: The package isn't fully built.  Just wait.  No need to report bugs on stuff like that.
<xteejx> ScottK: Ahh I'll close it, sorry didn't realise. For future reference...in cases like these is it safe to just close and do normal updates?
<ScottK> xteejx: Generally I'd wait and try again later.
<ScottK> These things are a normal part of running the development release.
<xteejx> I haven't actually came across it yet to be honest, been lucky updating at the right time I guess :)
<cnd> if you're creating a package based on the state of the sources in a git tree on a certain date, what version string is suggested?
<cnd> say for today's date?
<kklimonda> cnd: hmm.. for example last_version+git20100409.<first eight characters from the commit hash>-XubuntuY
<cnd> kklimonda: that seems very long and obtuse, is that really suggested?
<cnd> also, there's no "last_version"
<cnd> I rememberd mtd-utils doesn't put out releases either, so I see that it's version is 20090606-1
<kklimonda> cnd: well, the problem with using only the current date is that if they ever release stable package you'll have to use epoch. of course epoch is exactly for situations like that
<kklimonda> cnd: I don't think there is a single, official way of naming releases from various repositories - the one I've given you is the one I like the most
<cnd> ok
<cnd> there's not a huge amount of commits on a given day
<soren> POX: Hey, man. Do you have a copy of the .dsc and .debian.tar.gz from the python-cloudfiles upload?
<cnd> really, it goes quite some time without commits
<soren> POX: Thanks for that, by the way!
<cnd> so I think I'll leave off the git hash
<kklimonda> cnd: you can grep though /var/lib/apt/lists/ to see what are others conventions
<kklimonda> cnd: I think hash may be useful to regenerate the orig tarball
<cnd> kklimonda: it's slightly more useful, but if there weren't any commits on that day it's unnecessary
<cnd> and not many people are going to download the orig tarball based strictly on the version string
<kklimonda> cnd: sure - as I said, the final decision is up to the maintainer
<cnd> ok
<POX> soren: http://people.debian.org/~piotr/python-cloudservers_1.0~a5-1.d{ebian.tar.gz,sc}
<POX> (I didn't check/upload python-cloudfiles, IIRC)
<persia> soren: If you upload that, consider -0ubuntu1 or similar just in case there is an issue.
<arand> An SRU for universe (Bug #510571), would it be prudent to poke someone from the SRU team? If so who/how?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 510571 in virtualbox-ose "Lucid guest won't boot with acpi in virtualbox" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/510571
<soren> soren: Sorry, that was a typo.
<soren> Hehe..
<soren> Good one.
<soren> POX: Sorry, cloudfiles was a typo. I meant cloudservers. Thanks!
<soren> persia: Hmm... Yeah, I guess that's a good point.
<soren> persia: Done so. Very good point. Hadn't thought of that.
<persia> soren: 99% of the time the ftp-masters don't reject it, but that 1% hurts :)
<ScottK> It goes either way.  I've rejected stuff that was accepted by Debian.
<persia> Sure, but that doesn't cause issues with version numbers.
<POX> ScottK: (just curious) which package was it?
<ScottK> No.  In the cases I was involved in the Debian maintainer uploaded a fixed version and we sync'ed that.
<ScottK> POX: I don't recall exactly, it was something R related.
<ScottK> Two of them.
<POX> ok then (/me rejected every single Ubuntu accepted package so far :P)
<Laney> I thought that AAs didn't review packages already in Debian
<sebner> baaad POX
 * sebner throws rotten tomatoes at POX :P
<POX> but I also rejected (almost) every single NEW mentors.d.n package (DktrKranz was one of two guys who managed to get it in)
<POX> I mean, NEW without serious comments
<Laney> I've not had a NEW package rejected (yet)
<POX> sebner: still waiting for you to join DktrKranz :P
<Laney> :cool:
<sebner> POX: with that attitude you can wait long :P
<sebner> Laney is teehh geek!
 * Laney releases sebner under the WTFPL
 * sebner is FREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEe
 * soren admires POX' keen eye
<sebner> soren: pfff, he's just EVIL :P
<soren> "delightfully picky"
 * sebner uploads *any* package that's lintian clean even if it does rm -rf / in postinstall. lintian is god \o/  *muahahahahhaha*
<POX> soren: there's another competition, BTW - uploads without a comment in a row - DktrKranz and Jonathan Wiltshire have 4 (but DktrKranz decided to quit the game)
 * Laney coughs
<sebner> DktrKranz: pussy!
<Laney> He got @debian.org and ftp team powers
<Laney> I'd call that pretty hardcore
 * Laney bows down
<sebner> DktrKranz: haha, I told ya ;)
<sebner> Laney: I expect from him to become president of the world, nothing less
<lfaraone> cnd: do still intend to submit rinputd to Debian? I noticed you filed debbugs 569042 two months ago, and was wondering if you wanted someone to maintain it.
<cnd> lfaraone: I'm very new to all this, but it's already been sponsored and uploaded to ftp-master
<cnd> it's in the NEW queue, so I assume now I wait for an ftp-master to review it?
<cnd> been waiting for 5 days
<lfaraone> cnd: ah, didn't check there :)
<cnd> lfaraone: how long do packages usually sit in the NEW queue
<lfaraone> cnd:  NEW can take anywhere from a few days to a month. For my packages, it's been an average of 10/12 days
<cnd> ok
<ScottK> hyperair: What version of sugar is Lucid supposed to have.  It appears to have pieces of several at the moment.
<lfaraone> ScottK: Debian packages a bunch of versions.
<hyperair> ScottK: sugar has versions?
 * hyperair only cares about sugar levels in his blood
<lfaraone> hyperair: http://sugarlabs.org/ :)
<hyperair> aha!
<hyperair> *that* sugar.
<hyperair> i'm assuming a wrong ping then
<ScottK> Ah.  I think I meant that for highvoltage.  Sorry.
<hyperair> np
<lfaraone> right now in karmic we have python-sugar-toolkit-0.88, sugar-0.86, sugar-activities at 0.83, sugar-artwork-0.88, sugar-browse-activity-0.86, sugar-chat-activity-0.86, sugar-emulator-0.88, sugar-read-activity-0.86, sugar-presence-service-0.88,  sugar-session-0.88, and sugar-tools-0.88
<lfaraone> s/karmic/lucid/
<ScottK> yep.
<lfaraone> ScottK: it's complicated. 0.88 is the latest stable, 0.84 is in most deployments, but 0.86 will be on the next OLPC XO laptop.
<ScottK> lfaraone: Someone needs to sort out what we have.
<lfaraone> ScottK: upstream ideally would like to have 0.88 shipped, as we'd rather not support .84 for all eternity.
<ScottK> There are bits of 0.84 and 0.86 that aren't buildable.
<ScottK> lfaraone: Are you involved upstream with sugar?
<lfaraone> ScottK: yes, I'm a systems administrator.
<lfaraone> (I maintain some of their servers, that is)
<highvoltage> ScottK: would it be possible to bring it up to .88 via SRU?
<ScottK> lfaraone: OK.  Someone who understands all the sugar packages ought to sort through what we have/need/don't need.
<ScottK> highvoltage: Generally not, but as different sugar versions are packaged to be co-installable, we could have more than one.
<lfaraone> ScottK: well, I'm in pretty good contact with the development team.
<ScottK> The thing is it doesn't appear to me that we have ANY version that is complete and buildable right now.
<lfaraone> yes, it is rather a mess.
<ScottK> So it would be great if you and highvoltage could put your heads together and figure out the best path forward.
<ScottK> I don't care some much WHICH version as that we have at least one.
<lfaraone> ScottK: in theory, we would be fine if we only shipped the shell, artwork, presence service, browse, and the toolkit. Users can download activities (Sugar Applications) through the prefered means of distribution, http://activities.sugarlabs.org/, a la Mozilla Addons.
<highvoltage> ScottK: one of the sugar developers (or at least he was until a few months ago) lives quite close to me and he was quite enthusiastic about the ubuntu packages until he got a new job and adopted a baby, I'll also check if he has more free time now and try to reel him in
<lfaraone> highvoltage: dfarning, right?
<highvoltage> at the very least he could help bring me up to speed and fill some gaps
<highvoltage> lfaraone: morgs (Morgan Collett)
<ScottK> lfaraone and highvoltage: I've got a few hundred other packages to sort before release, so please figure it out.  Ping me if you need an FFe for something.
<lfaraone> highvoltage: ah. I haven't heard from him since Intrepid.
<lfaraone> ScottK: understood, we'll ask if we need something :)
<ScottK> Excellent.
<highvoltage> lfaraone: I think that's about when he officially stopped working as an employee for the sugar project, he was still involved for a bit afterwards though
<lfaraone> highvoltage: would you agree my assessment of the bare-minimum is accurate, and a good base to start towards?
<highvoltage> lfaraone: to be perfectly honest, my knowledge of sugar is very minimal, but that does sounds like a very rational and pragmatic approach, so yes
<lfaraone> highvoltage: take a look at https://launchpad.net/~sugarteam/+archive/ppa , by the way. I haven't tested the packags, but they're supposed to work :)
<highvoltage> lfaraone: nice, we should probably link to it somewhere on the edubuntu site if anyone adventurous wants to try it out and file some bugs
<lfaraone> highvoltage: mk. I was never clear on this: where should PPA bugs be filed? :)
<ScottK> Somewhere other than Ubuntu.
 * lfaraone thinks he's asked this before, and I often get different answers.
<ScottK> You can make an LP project with it's own bug tracker if you want
<lfaraone> highvoltage: I guess we could use https://edge.launchpad.net/usr
<lfaraone> highvoltage: and I can add you to ~sugarteam if you want.
<highvoltage> yes I think creating a project and filing bugs against that is the right way to do it
<highvoltage> lfaraone: that would be great
<lfaraone> highvoltage: done, ~jonathan added
<highvoltage> lfaraone: great, I think it would be a good addition to the edubuntu dvd's as an optional install when the packages are nice and ready
<xteejx> How do I grab the source code for a specific arch?
<lfaraone> xteejx: all arches have the same source code tarball...
<soren> xteejx: Source code is the same across architectures.
<jpds> xteejx: Erm... they're the same for all arches?
<xteejx> oops :)
<xteejx> thanks guys
<xteejx> Guys, bug 557556, is that right about ppc64/PS3? Gives me the impression that it won't be worked on, although I think I might have found the problem
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 557556 in pitivi "pitivi crashed with RuntimeError in __init__() on Playstation 3 (PPC64)" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/557556
<xteejx> something to do with the gst.GhostPad part of mixer.py
<lfaraone> xteejx: well, it has a priority assigned. if someone knows about it, they'll propose a fix.
<ScottK> Even better if you figure it out, you can attach a patch.
<ScottK> The odds of it getting fixed go WAY up then.
<xteejx> Well to be honest all I know is that the gst.GhostPad is part of gstreamer, but other than that I'm no use I'm sure plenty of others know that
<lfaraone> xteejx: well, try to replicate the problem with a smaler testcase to isolate the bug.
<ScottK> Put what you know in the bug and that'll help the next person to take a shot at it..
<xteejx> Will do, and hope so!
#ubuntu-motu 2010-04-10
<ScottK> lucas_: I was looking at tokyocabinet-ruby.  It needs libtokyocabinet-dev (>= 1.4.37) and we don't have sufficient version.  Should I reject it (it's New for Ubuntu) or will you look into getting libtokyocabinet updated?
<lucas_> ScottK: bah. please reject it
<Laney> Can someone update the freeze exception in 309528 for 1.5.1.1-1, please? I've tested that it works (with some packaging changes).
<alkisg> I'm trying to create a debhelper 7 package by following https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Python... did I understand correctly that I need to create a setup.py which essentially duplicates the info that I already have in debian/control and debian/install?
<Laney> it expects your application to come with a setup.py file]
<alkisg> I'm the author of the application, so... hm... I need to learn how to write a setup.py file. I'm googling for it, but it seems weird to me that I need to put the same info in two places...
<alkisg> I mean, I can't automatically create a minimal setup.py from debian/*, right?
<wgrant> If your upstream setup.py is correct, you should not need a debian/install.
<alkisg> (I'm the upstream author) thanks, so I'll just move what I have in debian/install to setup.py.
<Ciemon> Morning all, I've been doing some work on the package predict which is cuurently linked to the same package in Debian. Is there anything written down about who/when/how etc of linking upstream?
<Ciemon> that should be not currently linked
<Ciemon> I may be able to write that in English if it's not clear enough :)
<joaopinto> is there a "regular" case in which /var/lib/dpkg/info/*md5sums are expected to be missing for an installed package ?
<Laney> Ciemon: I don't know what you mean by linking upstream. Can you elaborate?
<lifeless> joaopinto: yes, if they aren't included
<joaopinto> lifeless, I am not aware of such an option when building a package, there is one ?
<lifeless> joaopinto: of course, debs can be built many many ways
<lifeless> see debbugs 155676
<joaopinto> lifeless, aren't all official packages built with dpkg-buildpackage ?
<Ciemon> Laney: sure.. we have Predict in Ubuntu, as do Debian. The patches I've been working on applying over the last week should really be passed to Debian too. I want to get the info right so that I can tell the patch author what he should do to get these patches into Debian
<lifeless> joaopinto: yes, and ? :)
<lifeless> joaopinto: dpkg-buildpackage doesn't do most of the building
<joaopinto> hum, isn't dpkg-buildpackage automatically adding the md5sums ?
<Laney> Ciemon: Have you spoken to the upstream author about including them in the next release?
<joaopinto> or it's a debian/rules task ?
<Laney> Ideally you file upstream bugs and also forward your patches to Debian including both bug links (LP + upstream) and the patches themselves
<sistpoty> joaopinto: it's a debian/rules task, usually done with dh_md5sums
<lifeless> joaopinto: man dh_md5sums
<joaopinto> ah ok
<joaopinto> that explains the missims md5sums :P
<Ciemon> Laney: the author isn't answering mail, which is why I was suggesting pushing to Debian
<Laney> Ciemon: That's fine, just give all the info you have in the Debian bugs
<Ciemon> Sure, but at https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/predict there seems to be some sort of link available, that's kinda what I was asking about.
<Laney> I don't know what that does
<Ciemon> :)
<Ciemon> Thanks.. I think ;)
<Laney> but I'm pretty sure it makes no difference to what you want to do here
<Laney> ;)
<Ciemon> Gonna talk about this a lot on MOnday when we record the show
 * Laney trembles
<Ciemon> :)
<Laney> general advice about working with Debian is here https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Debian/ForUbuntuDevelopers
<RunePhilosof> Where does the source code for evolution-mapi come from? The homepage listed in the package description contain version 0.26.1 while the latest ubuntu package is 0.28.2
<Laney> Ciemon: More seriously, if you're finding it difficult to get involved then these are problems which should get fixed, so don't just let them lie
<Laney> RunePhilosof: ask whoever did the last update where they got it from
<RunePhilosof> of course
<Laney> or check the watch file, maybe that's more current
<Laney> or... *cough* http://ftp.gnome.org/pub/gnome/sources/evolution-mapi/0.28/
<Ciemon> Laney: not finding it hard as such, there's lots of mentors around. Actually I'm off to see Daviey shortly for some guidance
<sistpoty> iulian: mind taking a look at bug #559959 (I'm still not 100% sure if the hat build failure is not a bug in hmake, but given that hat has always been troublesome, I think it's not related)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 559959 in hmake "FFe: hmake 3.14-2 (unstable/main -> universe)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/559959
<sistpoty> (and hat's build system is ugly at best, as I'm crawling through it atm.)
<sistpoty> Laney: huh, ghc6 did make it on armel in just one day, 10 hours :)
<Laney> sistpoty: WHAT?!
<sistpoty> Laney: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ghc6/6.12.1-12/+build/1526050
<sistpoty> maybe one of the gcc fixes, or a different kernel of a different buildd helped it :)
<Laney> I don't believe it!
 * sistpoty neither
<Laney> which buildd did it go to
 * Laney looks
<Laney> hm, not heard of that one
<Laney> right, now we urgently need to get all of the builds done
<Laney> sistpoty: can you grant the FFe of pandoc 1.5.1.1 too? I'll upload it into depwait
<sistpoty> Laney: sure, give me sec
<sistpoty> +a
<Laney> there's already a bug open for the sync, I'll just repurporse that
<Laney> -r
<Laney> bug 309528
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 309528 in pandoc "Please sync pandoc from debian unstable" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/309528
<Laney> sistpoty: http://orangesquash.org.uk/~laney/haskell-installability/armel.png is our target
<Laney> this should be solvable with give-backs
<sistpoty> Laney: excellent :)
<Hew> I've made a darkstat sync request at bug 549351, and have been asked for a lucid build log. How can I get this? Do I use a PPA?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 549351 in darkstat "[FFe] Sync darkstat 3.0.713-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/549351
<Laney> Hew: pbuilder can save a log with the --logfile (iirc) option
<Laney> or a PPA upload will do
<Hew> thanks Laney I'll give the PPA upload a go
<sistpoty> Laney: pandoc: go for it
<Laney> sistpoty: thanks, uploading
<Laney> It's a bit of a brutal upload to be honest - I just chopped out the new cdbs bits
<Laney> but it works
<sistpoty> heh
<sistpoty> Laney: just gave back the top row on armel... that was lots of clicking :)
<Laney> sistpoty: good work!
<Laney> (but in future, there is a buildd script in ubuntu-dev-tools that will save you that)
 * sistpoty likes to click that button *g*
 * sebner agrees with sistpoty *g*
<sistpoty> sebner: haskell-haskeline should need a rebuild, if I can follow the arrows on http://orangesquash.org.uk/~laney/haskell-installability/armel.png correctly... want to click?
<Laney> some of the green ones are false positives too
<Laney> so you should verify those manually
<sebner> sistpoty: only armel?
<Laney> yes
<sistpoty> sebner: yep, since ghc6 only made it recently on armel
<Laney> ia64 is broken so much
<sistpoty> Laney: do you agree to remove ghc6 and haskell packages on ia64
<sistpoty> ?
<Laney> In fact I was thinking about getting those binaries removed
<Laney> ha
<persia> Does anyone have ia64 hardware these days?
<jpds> persia: Yes.
<persia> jpds: Are small desktops available, or just big iron?
<sebner> sistpoty: done, that's fun :)
<sistpoty> last thing I heard was that the ghc6 build failure on ia64 wasn't always reproducible on the debian porter boxes, which makes debugging not exactly easier
<Laney> sistpoty: kaol could build it on the porter boxes, but it always fell over on the buildds
<Laney> and the ia64 porters couldn't come up with anything
 * sebner is afraid of armel.png though
<Laney> don't be
<sistpoty> it can't break more than not build
<persia> Once gh6 works, it's just a matter of following the graph.
 * sebner is AFRAID of that graph xD
<Laney> for Karmic we had a similar situation with ppc
<Laney> that installability was fixed by throwing all of Haskell/ppc against the wall multiple times until it all stuck :)
<sebner> hahah
<Laney> this approach has a little more finesse than that
<Laney> although I'm sure I could modify the script which generates the graph to tell me which packages to give back next
<persia> You could probably even modify the script to give back the next set that needs give-backs.
<Laney> yes, that's what I meant
<Laney> oh, to actually do the give backs. Indeed.
<persia> Actually, if you find a way to make it generalisable over the full package set, I'd be happy to run it daily after my mirror sync completes (for all arches).
<Laney> it doesn't test buildability
<persia> Ah, good point.
 * sistpoty doesn't like the idea that a script will get all the pleasure that I have pressing on this button :P
<persia> Well then.  Clearly the script needs to have a mail gateway with a list of URLs getting sent to sistpoty then :)
<sistpoty> heh :)
<persia> But for the script: I'd actually like to have something that lets us build a tree once the base is fixes: fpc needs bootstrapping on armel/powerpc after which there's a heap of stuff that can be built.
<Laney> That would be useful indeed. Generally with Haskell transitions we only need to care about installability, so I haven't bothered to do that here
<Laney> and the script which powers those graphs isn't particularly general either, sadly
<Laney> http://pastebin.com/YRUZCk3i
<persia> Such is life.  There's only ~30 pascal packages, and most of them are properly DEPWAIT, so that's perhaps less painful.
<persia> Oh, that is very specific :)
<Laney> Certainly the tree-building / installability testing could be split out though
<think> HI ALL
<joaopinto> hi
<sistpoty> nhandler: mind taking a look at bug #559959
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 559959 in hmake "FFe: hmake 3.14-2 (unstable/main -> universe)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/559959
<nhandler> Sure
<sistpoty> thanks
<nhandler> sistpoty: So it FTBFS due to a hat problem right now?
<sistpoty> nhandler: no, it FTBFS since to haskell-utils was removed
<sistpoty> nhandler: however hat FTBFS with the new hmake (most probably with the old hmake as well, even if haskell-utils would still be available and working)
<nhandler> sistpoty: Can you at least attach a diff for the merge?
<sistpoty> nhandler: sure
<sistpoty> nhandler: attached (diff based on debian package)
<nhandler> sistpoty: Granted
<sistpoty> nhandler: thanks!
<ScottK> Laney:  libghc6-hsql-mysql-doc is a new bianry package in your upload.  It's empty.  Please fix it and upload again.  Also, when you build the source package for a merge, please use the -v option to include all the new debian/changelog entries in the .changes file.  (do that for your fixed upload too since I'm going to reject this one).
<ScottK> lucas_: Thanks.  Rejecting.
<ScottK> Laney: Actually, I'm accepting it so the architectures don't get skewed, but it still needs fixint.
<evilshadeslayer> Tonio_: ping...
<iulian> sistpoty: Hey.  Do you still want me to take a look at that bug?
<sistpoty> iulian: no, Nathan already gave me an ack, and I've already uploaded it :)
<iulian> Ah.  It has already been acked.
<sistpoty> iulian: btw, are you subscribed to ubuntu-release@l.u.c?
<iulian> Sorry for the delayed response.  I have just arrived home.
<sistpoty> no problem
<iulian> sistpoty: I don't think so.
<sistpoty> iulian: oh, can you subscribe? (have started a discussion about FinalFreeze for universe, see https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-release/2010-April/000043.html, and had hope to reach everyone from the release team there *g+)
<sistpoty> nhandler: are you subscribed to ubuntu-release@l.u.c? ^^
<sistpoty> ScottK: same question to you ^^?
<ScottK> sistpoty: I'm not.
<ScottK> I probably should.
<ScottK> Give me a moment.
<sistpoty> ah, so I guess it wasn't the most brilliant idea from me to think I can reach everyone from the release team via ubuntu-release@l.u.c *g+
<ScottK> sistpoty: No problem.  Done.  Just need for slangasek to accept my subscription.
<ScottK> Now I know why he was talking about your mail.
<ScottK> We had a brief discussion about it at the end of yesterday's release meeting.
<iulian> sistpoty: OK, done.
<sistpoty> ah, yes, have read that... sorry, once again couldn't make it
<ScottK> No problem.
<ScottK> In any case we agreed to your proposal.
<ScottK> He was going to include it in a u-d-a post he was writing.
<sistpoty> excellent!
<sistpoty> cjwatson: are you subscribed to ubuntu-release@l.u.c?
<ScottK> sistpoty: Why don't you just ask slangasek to see if all the release team members are subscribed rather than ask one by one?
<sistpoty> ScottK: oh, does mailman allow that? if so, slangasek: ^^ :)
<ScottK> Yes.  The list admin can do that.
<sistpoty> cool
<sistpoty> ScottK | iulian: I'd like to hear a second opinion on bug #523433
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 523433 in ubuntu "[need-packaging] [FFe] pcmanfm2" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/523433
<ScottK> sistpoty: Since it's wanted for a derivative, I'm inclined to say go ahead as long as they can find an archive admin (I don't have the time to commit to it).
<sistpoty> ScottK: I guess I don't like the idea to add it for lucid and then drop it for lucid + 1 again, but I can't really say I'm decided on it (otherwise I hadn't asked *g*)
<ScottK> sistpoty: I can see the sense of having both versions available for a transitional period.
<ScottK> I'd have n'acked if they wanted to replace the old one.
<ScottK> It's not ideal, but life rarely is.
 * iulian agrees with ScottK.
<sistpoty> ok, then let's ack it under the condition that an archive admin finds time
<sistpoty> thanks for looking!
<ScottK> Sounds good to me.
<sistpoty> ScottK: yet another question: I'm inclined to ack munin (bug #538594), however as it's server related maybe you have some comments?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 538594 in munin "[FFe] Please merge munin 1.4.4-1 from Debian testing" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/538594
<ScottK> Looking
<ScottK> sistpoty: I'd approve it.  Wnat me too.
<sistpoty> ScottK: yes, please
<ScottK> Done.  Thanks for pointing it out.
<sistpoty> porthose: can you follow up on bug #540583 please and do at least minimal testing? thanks!
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 540583 in yaws "Sync yaws 1.87-1 (universe) from Debian testing (main)" [Wishlist,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/540583
<ari-tczew> is MOTU Council dead? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Council/Meeting is not fresh
<sistpoty> ari-tczew: yep
<geser> yes, MC is out of business
<nigelb> anyone on the D-M-B available for a chat?
<geser> yes
<nigelb> geser, I was wondering.. is it possible to have ~ubuntu-dev be a member of ~ubuntu-reviews?
<asac> anyone running karmic?
<asac> does firefox work for you will all the latest updates?
<asac> ;)
<nigelb> asac, yes
<ari-tczew> I think that MOTU/Council/Meeting wiki page should be cleaned up. Just have information about MC is dead.
<nigelb> I'm updating... gimme 10 minutes test out
<asac> nigelb: do you use firefox?
<asac> cool
<asac> nigelb: not running the latest nss?
<nigelb> asac, nss?
<geser> nigelb: what would be the benefit if ~ubuntu-dev is a member of ~ubuntu-reviewers?
<nigelb> geser, helps with patch review, since they'd be able to unsubscribe reviewers (i.e. no excuse for not going into it)
<asac> nigelb: just upgrade everything ... and let me know if firefox still works after relogging into X etc.
<ari-tczew> so who is responsible for MOTU meetings? where can I find meetings calendar - I'm interested to join MOTU
<nigelb> ari-tczew, apply to developer membership board
<nigelb> ari-tczew, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DeveloperMembershipBoard
<geser> ari-tczew: DMB handles MOTU applications, the next DMB meeting is Tue, April 13th 2010 15:00 UTC
<ari-tczew> hm, so I'm poiting to next meeting after April 13th
<geser> nigelb: I'm not sure this is a good idea (because of other reasons). As ~ubuntu-reviewers is subscribed to all bugs with patches, ~ubuntu-dev would get notifications for all those bugs (but I'm not sure about this)
<nigelb> geser, notifications go into the patch review mailing list
<geser> ari-tczew: that would be Tue, April 27th 2010, 15:00 UTC
<geser> nigelb: members don't get any bug email if they aren't subscribeed to the ML?
<nigelb> geser, I'm yet to get any
<nigelb> geser, well, I did subscribe last week and just started getting mails
<asac> nigelb: update finished ;)?
<nigelb> asac, 8 minutes more to go
<asac> oh
<asac> big one ;)
<nigelb> nah, slow connection
<geser> nigelb: ok, I guess it's like with the sponsoring team where ubuntu-dev isn't a member too. If a dev is interested in sponsoring or patch review he should join the team, but I don't have a strong opinion. An explicit membership has the bonus that I can look up which dev is really interested in patch review (as I assume that only a few would join explicitly if they are a member implicitly).
<nigelb> geser, ah, that is reasonable too :)  But I was thinking more in the likes of bug control
<geser> I guess bug control is a little different as a dev should be able to update status and importance (it's part of their work).
<nigelb> hm, It was just an idea :)
<geser> although I'd like if more devs care about sponsoring and patch review (don't know how the situation is there).
<nigelb> now I have to manually get the review leads into ~ubuntu-reviews
<nigelb> the situation here is pretty bad... less than 10 active folks.
<nigelb> asac, you want me to log out and log in back?
<asac> nigelb: yeah. thats safe
<asac> and then try to use firefox with ssl etc.
<nigelb> i.e. https://www.somesite.com?
<nigelb> brb... logging out
<asac> launchpad
<asac> ;)
<asac> or something
<geser> interesting, www.somesite.com has a DNS entry :)
<asac> heh
<nigelb> asac, just loggged into my netbanking account.  No issues yet
<asac> ok
<geser> nigelb: your money still there?
<asac> let us know if you get ssl issues ;)
<ari-tczew> does wiki.ubuntu.com have multilanguage support?
<asac> thanks nigelb
<nigelb> geser, Oh no! asac stole it! hehe :D
<nigelb> asac, no problem :)
<nigelb> geser, anyway continuing on what we were talking.  My idea was if some dev did want to help, it should be super easy.  (well, that was the dream anyway)
<geser> nigelb: is it currently that hard for a dev to join?
<nigelb> geser, apply and accept
<geser> that doesn't sound hard
<nigelb> but there is also prove that you do review and a +1 from existing member
<geser> anyways as this involves joining a team to an other, an admin of ~ubuntu-reviewers IIRC has to initiate it. so you need to talk to them too.
<nigelb> geser, I only wanted your take on it :)
<nigelb> I was unsure if it was the way to go.  I'm still unsure.
<geser> me too
<nigelb> I talk to dholbach to hear his take on this.
<nigelb> Anyway, I think I'll have to formally approach the dmb for this anyway
<nigelb> dmb, I think you might want to change your nickname :D
<ari-tczew> would be nice
<nigelb> geser, thanks for your time :)
<ari-tczew> is word "deprecated" good instead "dead" on wiki.ubuntu.com? context about MC end of life
<RainCT> ari-tczew: what's the sentence?
<ari-tczew> MOTU Council is dead and handled by [[#DeveloperMembershipBoard|Developer Membership Board]]. For meetings please read [[#https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DeveloperMembershipBoard/Agenda|DMB Agenda]].
<sistpoty> ari-tczew: why not write "out of business"? (though I'm not a native speaker as well)
<nigelb> or just say replaced by the DMB
<ari-tczew> nigelb ^^ +1
 * ScottK looks at http://blog.brettalton.com/2010/04/10/installing-openarena-in-ubuntu-and-applying-patches/ and suggests someone update our package.
<ScottK> sistpoty is, I'm sure, happy to test before granting FFe.
<sistpoty> ScottK: oh, yes... it'd need very severe testing though :P
<ScottK> Yes, so  someone please take care of that ....
<ari-tczew> what is Next Chair on Agenda?
<nigelb> ari-tczew, next person to chair the meeting
<ari-tczew> ok
<ari-tczew> what is "TBD" on wiki?
<nigelb> to be declared
<sistpoty> ScottK: updating openarena is a pretty hairy business, due to debian bug 523323 ... I'll try to see if I can catch fuddl at work, and ask him for details
<ubottu> Debian bug 523323 in openarena-data "missing source code" [Serious,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/523323
<ScottK> sistpoty: Excellent.
<ari-tczew> is MOTU going to full move as DMB?
<nigelb> no no, only MOTU council is replaced.
<ari-tczew> so current "MOTU mettings" should be called "DMB meetings" right?
<bjsnider> will there be sun-java6 packages in lucid?
<ScottK> ari-tczew: No.  MOTU will still be around, just no MC.
<ScottK> bjsnider: In Canonical's partner repo, not formally in Ubuntu.
<bjsnider> ScottK, it's not there now. eta?
<ScottK> bjsnider: No idea.  I don't work for Canonical.  Partner generally gets populated at or after release.
<ari-tczew> what a mess on wiki.ubuntu.com! so what's the different between MOTU meetings and DMB meetings? please show me where are informations about this difference on wiki?
<ScottK> ari-tczew: MOTU meetings are a meeting of all the MOTU.  We haven't had one in a long time.  It has nothing to do with membership in stuff.
 * hyperair thinks that ubuntu should undergo daemon-cleanup sometime
<hyperair> i've got too many processes running >_>
<nhandler> sistpoty: I should be subscribed. I'll double check
<sistpoty> thanks nhandler
<ScottK> sistpoty: I am subscribed now.
<sistpoty> :)
<ari-tczew> ScottK: with this approach wiki.ubuntu.com is going to /dev/null because will be useless
<nhandler> sistpoty: Turns out I wasn't subscribed. I am now
<sistpoty> :)
<ScottK> ari-tczew: Wiki's need maintenance.  Someone needs to do it.
<hyperair> does anyone know why erlang needs so much rubbish running?
<hyperair> there's a beam.smp, an ssl_esock, some heart.smp, ....
<hyperair> i wouldn't care so much if they're all lightweight, but added together they take over 30MB, and all that is *just* for desktopcouch.
<hyperair> and this ridiculous couch thing takes an additional 10MB, not counting all the erlang processes started solely for it.
<hyperair> and on top of that, the only thing that uses this useless couch is gwibber.
<hyperair> i think i'll just stop using gwibber >_>
<ari-tczew> ScottK: I'm going to invite more user for contribute to Ubuntu with new development cycle (maverick). I don't want give them confusing wiki pages. More professionaly please!
<ScottK> ari-tczew: It's a wiki.  Go for it.
<ari-tczew> ScottK: wiki.ubuntu.com is too messed, so I don't distinguish a lot of terms, concepts etc. Someone from administration and moderation should clean wiki - once and good.
<ScottK> It's been done before and not so successfully.
<ScottK> For MOTU stuff there is no "administration and moderation" it's just us.
<ari-tczew> bordello, nobody for nothing is not responsible. wiki is siking
<sistpoty> ScottK: FFe bug #503616 also looks server related ;)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 503616 in mondo "mondo package doesn't cope with grub2" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/503616
<sistpoty> (avoided looking at it yet, due to incompetence in this regard)
<ScottK> sistpoty: Commented.
<sistpoty> thanks
<ScottK> sistpoty: I'll be AFK for several hours.  Ping and I'll read the scrollback when I return.
<sistpoty> ScottK: sure, thanks for the notice
<sistpoty> ScottK: and *do* get some sleep somewhen ;)
<ScottK> sistpoty: Sleep is for the weak.
<sistpoty> haha
<sebner> ScottK: bash
<sistpoty> <- weak
<sebner> ScottK: I wanted to write exactly the same! (citat from you of course :D)
 * sebner pets sistpoty 
<sistpoty> *g*
<sebner> sistpoty: you are simply getting old :P
<sistpoty> sebner: well, turned 31 very recently (actually yesterday)
<crimsun> i used to be old. then i took some pills and now i'm ancient.
<sebner> sistpoty: ujj, congratulations then :)
<sistpoty> thanks sebner
<sebner> crimsun: Â¬_Â¬
<lfaraone> I noticed that xulrunner was dropped in Lucid, but I couldn't find a bug explaining the rationale. If upon testing, it builds properly and runs on Lucid, would it be suitable to request it to be synced from Debian? (this is needed to get sugar-0.88 working)
<sistpoty> ajmitch: around? Do I recall it correctly that you have good knowledge of the zope stack? (as I'm a little bit clueless about FFe bug #542634)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 542634 in zope.security "Add python-zope.security-untrustedpython metapackage" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/542634
<crimsun> lfaraone: eh? xulrunner-1.9.2 | 1.9.2.3+nobinonly-0ubuntu1 |         lucid | source, amd64, i386
<lfaraone> crimsun: aha. there's just no longer an unversioned "xulrunner", it seems. nor is there a python-xpcom (previously provided by "xulrunner")
<lfaraone> *built by
<sistpoty> DktrKranz: got a sec to look at FFe bug #551526, as I'm totally clueless about what's requested there, and what goes wrong
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 551526 in transmissionrpc "Package is incompatible with repository version of the main Transmission app's RPC" [Unknown,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/551526
<sebner> sistpoty: I'm not sure if he will be online today again
<sistpoty> sebner: oh
<sistpoty> well, there's always the option to leave a comment at the bug report in question :)
 * sebner ^5 sistpoty :)
<sistpoty> :)
<sistpoty> menesis: around? can you give some further insights into bug #542634? thanks!
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 542634 in zope.security "Add python-zope.security-untrustedpython metapackage" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/542634
 * abogani waves
<abogani> I'm looking for sponsors: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/AlessioIgorBogani/linux-rtPPUApplication
<abogani> Thanks
<sistpoty> ScottK: one for you (main): bug #555235
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 555235 in phpmyadmin "[FFe] sync phpmyadmin 3.3.1-1 from debian testing" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/555235
<ari-tczew> !seen av`
<ubottu> I have no seen command
<sistpoty> ScottK: re bug #545690... do you want the new version in? if so, don't hesitate to acknowledge it ;)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 545690 in eric "[FFe] Please sync eric 4.4.1-1 with Debian testing" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/545690
<ari-tczew> is phpmyadmin a server package?
<sistpoty> ari-tczew: I'd very much say so, yes
<ari-tczew> exactly! security team has pointed phpmyadmin as desktop package. ridiculous!
<sistpoty> ari-tczew: hm?
<ari-tczew> sistpoty: phpmyadmin is ignored for dapper as desktop package. you can look at UCT
<ari-tczew> dapper desktop is eol
<sistpoty> ari-tczew: aha, it's in universe
<sistpoty> ari-tczew: to my knowledge, packages in universe don't enjoy the extended support period that -server has
<sistpoty> (but I might be wrong)
<ari-tczew> sistpoty: for discussion you can join #ubuntu-hardened, as you are a member of motu-swat anyway
<sistpoty> ari-tczew: I'm the laziest member of motu-swat (only being still a member since one late night I had the idea together with nafallo to found a security team for universe)
<sistpoty> ari-tczew: just joined
#ubuntu-motu 2010-04-11
<ScottK> sistpoty: I discussed Eric with lex79 on #kubuntu-devel.  He's going to look into 4.4.2 from Unstable.
<sistpoty> ScottK: excellent, thanks!
<pmcenery> bug #558946
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 558946 in ubuntu "FFe: Sync ipheth 1.0-1 (universe) from Debian sid (main)" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/558946
<pmcenery> How do I create an install log? piuparts?
<pmcenery> I have a sbuild install log which I can attach, but I wasnt sure of the best way to create an install log. Any pointers would be much appreciated...
<iulian> pmcenery: dpkg --install the package and attach the log to the bug report.
<pmcenery> iulian: thanks. Is that log just the output to the terminal, or was there some /var/log file you refer to?
<iulian> pmcenery: The former.
<pmcenery> iulian: ok. thanks. will do that
<iulian> You're welcome.
<xteejx> Hey guys, is the package wallpaper-tray going to be in Lucid, there is no publishing data for it.
<geser> no, it got removed from lucid: (From Debian) ROM; reimplemented upstream; Debian bug #553167
<ubottu> Debian bug 553167 in ftp.debian.org "RM: wallpaper-tray -- ROM; reimplemented upstream" [Normal,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/553167
<xteejx> geser: The website for the project is just a placeholder, doesn't look like it's developed anymore
<kklimonda> probably
<xteejx> Better off setting a bug in Jaunty as Won't Fix then I guess
<kklimonda> which one?
<xteejx> bug 237738
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 237738 in wallpaper-tray "wallpaper-tray crashes (often) when adding new (large) folders" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/237738
<Laney> ScottK: Good catch on that empty binary package, fixing now
<Laney> (and I had used -v correctly)
<ScottK> OK
<Laney> that uncovered a bug in haskell-devscripts, which is a win
<ScottK> Nice.
<micahg> when cherrry picking upstream VCS commits, is it better to do it as 1-1 patch or 1 patch for everything upstream?
<hyperair> 1-1 patch.
<hyperair> use quilt
<micahg> hyperair: package already uses quilt :)
<micahg> hyperair: for patch naming can I do XXX-reason-I'm-patching-1.patch XXX-reason-I'm-patching-2.patch ?
<hyperair> micahg: right.
<hyperair> micahg: wait a sec.
<hyperair> micahg: this is a series of commits fixing one issue?
<micahg> hyperair: well, I'm cherry picking the xulrunner 192 port fixes from upstream vlc
<hyperair> =\
<hyperair> 1-1 would be good then, i think
<hyperair> especially in the case of git format-patch kind of patches
<micahg> hyperair: with the naming convention I proposed or should I do XX1-reason.patch XX2-reason.patch?
<hyperair> i think i'm not seeing the whole picture here.
<hyperair> exactly what patches are these?
<hyperair> like can i know their original names, for example?
<hyperair> is upstream using git?
<micahg> hyperair: well, there are a series of commits that fix different issues with porting to xul192
<micahg> hyperair: yes
<hyperair> if the patches are git-formatted i'd just use theo riginal names.
<hyperair> just quilt import them all in
 * micahg checks the original name
<micahg> hyperair: they don't have names
<ScottK> hyperair: IIRC, upstream mozilla uses Hg.
<hyperair> ...
<hyperair> okay, i give up
<hyperair> this is turning my brain into spaghetti
<hyperair> furst one says git, then another says hg
<micahg> hyperair: one example: http://git.videolan.org/?p=vlc.git;a=commitdiff_plain;h=6dbe4986f7c11370c2bc275491d4502f5f4c3c60
<hyperair> then they don't have names
<micahg> ScottK: this is for vlc :)
<hyperair> but format-patch names all the patches nicely
<ScottK> Oh.
<hyperair> so what. the. **** is going on?!
<ScottK> Nevermind then.
 * micahg never used format-patch before
<hyperair> ...
<hyperair> okay, that explains it
<hyperair> go use format-patch and take those patches to shove straight into quilt
<micahg> hyperair: silly question...where do I get/use format-patch?
<hyperair> you install git-core, and you run "git format-patch blah blah"
<micahg> hyperair: ah, it's a git thing :)
<micahg> ScottK: do you know who's spearheading the get Sugar into Lucid effort?
<ScottK> micahg: IIRC it was lfaraone and highvoltage.
<micahg> ScottK: thanks
 * lfaraone waves.
 * abogani waves
<abogani> I'm looking for sponsors: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/AlessioIgorBogani/linux-rtPPUApplication
<abogani> Thanks!
<geser> abogani: who sponsored your linux-rt work till now? those person are the best to judge on your application
<abogani> geser: Since Gusty until Hardy(included) Ubuntu Kernel Team since Intrepid until Lucid (included) Luke Yelavich. I think that Luke don't sponsor me.
<geser> abogani: have you asked him?
<abogani> geser: Yes he said me that he don't trust on my packaging knowledge.
<geser> without any sponsored contributions/uploads it will be hard to get PPU rights for a package and your current sponsor(s) are in the best situation to judge if you are ready or not
<geser> abogani: and you don't trust his assessment of your packaging skills and try nonetheless to apply? I don't want to anticipate the results of your application but if your sponsor doesn't trust you why should the DMB grant your PPU rights?
<abogani> geser: No one have ever worked on this package. Neither Ubuntu Kernel Team nor Luke have worked on/changed my (upload) works. So linux-rt package is result of *only* my work. If you think that I don't deserve PPU rights you should know that 1) I push realtime kernel in Ubuntu 2) unilt Feisty I triage bugs I backported upstream fixed 3) I working on packaging when sine Intrepid linux-rt became a standalone universe package.
<abogani> geser: In any case I'll accept your choice.
<ari-tczew> is there any person works or got expirence in backports?
<persia> Several folks: ask a question, and someone will answer :)
<ari-tczew> I want to backport trac package to karmic, jaunty, intrepid :)
<ari-tczew> for security fix reason
<persia> backports aren't for bugfixes.
<persia> If there are security issues, you might want to drop by #ubuntu-hardened and talk about the best way to get them resolved.
<Laney> DktrKranz: I think I recall you doing an empty binary scan over the Debian archive recently. Do you still have the scripts you used to do it?
<Laney> (noticed a bug in hlibrary.mk which causes empty binaries to be produced)
<DktrKranz> Laney: there's a lintian check for that already working
<Laney> DktrKranz: Oh, that's cool. I'll do that
<DktrKranz> Laney: http://lintian.debian.org/tags/empty-binary-package.html
<Laney> but lintian.d.o doesn't pick up the case I'm looking at
<Laney> interesting
<DktrKranz> some times ago, we ran lintian checks on Ubuntu packages as well, I don't know if it's still running
<persia> It's not.
<Laney> I want to fix this in Debian anyway
<DktrKranz> Laney: which one?
<persia> I've been meaning to get it running again, but haven't yet found the setting-up-whole-archive-lintian-runs-for-the-unfamiliar guide yet :)
<Laney> DktrKranz: e.g. libghc6-hsql-mysql-dev
<Laney> when I build it lintian picks it up
<Laney> but doesn't appear on that interface
<Laney> (maybe it's only run on the souce packages)
<Laney> no, can't be
<DktrKranz> definitely not
<DktrKranz> it searches the binaries
<DktrKranz> Laney: which lintian version do you use, 2.3.4?
<Laney> I'm running it in a sid chroot, so 2.3.4 indeed
<DktrKranz> gah
<Laney> let me emphasis, I *do* see the warning locally
<Laney> but the website doesn't
<DktrKranz> ah
 * DktrKranz logs in to lintian.d.o to see which version it runs
<DktrKranz> haskell-hsql-mysql (1.7.1-4)
<DktrKranz> that's the same
<DktrKranz> Laney: btw, I processed several haskell NEW uploads, and luckily they were OK.
<DktrKranz> persia: if you need some config, I can try to see if setup for lintian.d.o is available, and eventually pass it
<persia> DktrKranz: I believe it to be on alioth somewhere, although I haven't found it.  If you do find it, it will speed me running lintian over Ubuntu :)
<Laney> DktrKranz: "the same"?
<Laney> as in empty?
<DktrKranz> Laney: I checked if the empty packages in the archive is the same lintian laboratory is know of, and version matches
<Laney> the Lintian version is too old then?
<Laney> you should also spank whichever ftp team member NEWed that package ;)
 * DktrKranz checks if it was him... :)
<DktrKranz> N: Processing source package haskell-hsql-mysql (version 1.7.1-4) ...
<DktrKranz> N: Removing haskell-hsql-mysql
<DktrKranz> W: haskell-hsql-mysql source: changelog-should-mention-nmu
<DktrKranz> W: haskell-hsql-mysql source: source-nmu-has-incorrect-version-number 1.7.1-4
<DktrKranz> mmmh, lintian has the correct version, so why check is failing?
<Laney> root@chicken:/# lintian libghc6-hsql-mysql-doc_1.7.1-4_all.deb
<Laney> warning: lintian's authors do not recommend running it with root privileges!
<Laney> W: libghc6-hsql-mysql-doc: empty-binary-package
<Laney> works here
<Laney> what changesfile is it running over?
<DktrKranz> it shouldn't process changesfile directly, but packages unpacked
<DktrKranz> (at least I see that on lintian.d.o)
<DktrKranz> a manual run on that package reveal W: libghc6-hsql-mysql-dev: empty-binary-package for me too
<nhandler> xkill
<alkisg> In debian/install, "src/*   usr/share/my-package/" was recursive. How can I do the same in setup.py?
<alkisg> Should I be using MANIFEST.in for that?
<persia> If nobody gives you a good answer after a while, try #ubuntu-app-devel which tends to focus more on upstream best-practices, etc.
<alkisg> Thank you, will do
<highvoltage> 17:12 < micahg> ScottK: do you know who's spearheading the get Sugar into Lucid effort?
<highvoltage> 17:13 < ScottK> micahg: IIRC it was lfaraone and highvoltage.
<highvoltage> michas: ^^^ that would be maverick, not lucid :)
<micahg> highvoltage: is that final then for Lucid, no sugar?
<highvoltage> micahg: lucid is in final freeze real soon, I think pretty much everyone (including me) is doing some scrambling atm to get their things working as good as possible in lucid
<bdrung> wasn't the plan to have sugar 0.88 in lucid?
<highvoltage> micahg: so I guess it's pretty much final
<micahg> lfaraone: ^^^
<highvoltage> bdrung: parts of sugar works with older and newer versions of it, parts of it is 0.88 and parts of it is 0.86
<bdrung> there is still enough time to push the missing bits into universe
<highvoltage> bdrung: that is, if someone picks it up and runs with it :)
<lfaraone> micahg, highvoltage, I really am rather unfamiliar with pyxpcom, and Sugar's useless without it unless I decide to package a bunch of new packages.
<micahg> lfaraone: well, my question was is sugar going into lucid...it seems like we're in a circular logic loop
<ScottK> If it won't be on an ISO we have a couple of weeks to get it sorted.
<RainCT> micahg: I have exams this week, but feel free to poke me after that if you need any help with Sugar related stuff.
<micahg> RainCT: thanks, we're trying to figure out about getting it into lucid and what the requirements are for xpcom integration
<RainCT> micahg: By the way, have you talked to David Farning? He was working on a Ubuntu Sugar Remix, but I haven't heard of him for weeks.
<micahg> RainCT: no, not yet
<psusi> how do you have a blank line in the package description in debian/control?  debuild keeps complaining about This is probably a duplicate of bug #534743.  Can you try booting with the nosplash break nodmraid options, then when you hit the busybox prompt, run dmraid -ay then exit.  If the system boots up normally at that point then it's that bug and I will mark this as a duplicate.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 534743 in dmraid "dmraid causes udev event feedback loop in Lucid" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/534743
 * psusi kicks terminal for not copying that automatically like xterm
<psusi> make that complaining about: dpkg-source: error: syntax error in e2defrag/debian/control at line 15: continued value line not in field
<jdong> lol
<psusi> hey jdong... I'm trying to get https://launchpad.net/e2defrag/ into shape ;)
<jdong> was gonna ask about that yesterday :)
<jdong> but then realized how much actual work (tm) I had :-/
<psusi> trying to figure out if I can get a build under the project instead of my ppa
<psusi> hehe
<psusi> well, it seems to work well for me now without uninit_bg and extents
<psusi> tackling extents is going to be a challenge
<psusi> uninit_bg should be easier
<jdong> extents being pretty important
<psusi> then after that I have to try and get it to relocate inodes
<psusi> yea
<psusi> uninit_bg seems like it is going to be pretty important too, especially with lazy_itable_init, which is currently defaulting to off... when I turned that on installing to a 1.5 tb drive went from taking like 15 minutes sitting at 5% complete formatting to like 15 seconds
 * psusi wonders where the hell that dput went
<maco> generally its a good idea to know where you're sending them...
<psusi> lp seems to have a way to link to an ubuntu package, but I can't figure out how to upload a new package from the current bzr branch
<Laney> in the normal way
<Laney> bzr bd -S ... dput
<psusi> maco: I sent it to ppa:e2defrag/0.75, but I don't know where it WENT ;)
<psusi> bzr bd unknown command
<Laney> you need to install bzr-builddeb
<psusi> ohh, I just ran debuild -S
<persia> That ought work just fine as well.
<wgrant> psusi: Um, ppa:e2defrag/0.75 isn't a PPA.
<wgrant> The '0.75' PPA for ~e2defrag does not exist.
<wgrant> psusi: Also, I'm confused. Has e2defrag moved to Launchpad for development? Where was it before?
<wgrant> Are you the upstream maintainer?
<psusi> wgrant, I am now, I took it over and rescued it after it was removed from the archive 2 years ago for not having an upstream
<wgrant> Ah.
<wgrant> So, projects don't have PPAs -- people and teams do.
<psusi> that's what I thought
<psusi> is there a project archive instead of a personal one?
<wgrant> No.
<wgrant> For reasons that I cannot fathom, there is not even a way to link a project to PPAs.
<psusi> I was wondering about that
<psusi> I mean the project links to the branches, why not archive?
<psusi> there's a button to link it to a package in the ubuntu archive, but it isn't there
<wgrant> Well, an archive can contain multiple projects.
<wgrant> Right.
<wgrant> But that is stupid and doesn't handle PPAs.
<wgrant> Even though it was redesigned a couple of months ago.
<psusi> so why can you link it to the ubuntu project's archive, but no other project's archive?  I thought lp was supposed to be more general than ubuntu?
<psusi> so as a separate project, you would think it would have its own archive
<wgrant> Ubuntu is a distribution, not a PPA.
<maco> ubuntu is setup as a distro not a plain old project in lp
<maco> yes, it has a distinction
<psusi> ahh
<wgrant> It is more general, but a distribution is a special class of object.
<lfaraone> maco: well, we *could* link a project to other distributions which *are* hosted in LP
<jpds> IHasDistribution.
<maco> lfaraone: huh what what
<maco> did i say you couldnt?
<lfaraone> maco: you can't, currently.
<maco> i just said that ubuntu gets build-capabilities because its a distro
<lfaraone> (afaict)
<psusi> well, I guess for now then I'll have to use ~e2defrag-maintainters ppa and eventually get it uploaded to universe
<wgrant> The non-Ubuntu linking functionality was somewhat unlinked a couple of weeks ago.
<wgrant> It was not being used.
<psusi> oh by the way, how are you supposed to have blank lines in the description in debian/control?  dpkg-source errors thinking the text following is a new field
<persia> There is a special syntax to have blank lines: http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-controlfields.html#s-f-Description
<ajmitch> by using a .
<ajmitch> a single space followed by a single full stop character, is what policy says is the only way
<ajmitch> but persia is quicker than me at getting the link :)
<psusi> wow, that's what my guess was ;)
<psusi> hrm... bzr bd -S fails since it seems to blindly look for an orig tarball when it shouldn't... seems like a bug
<persia> I suspect there's special syntax you need to get bzr-builddeb to know it's native.
<wgrant> Why is there no orig tarball?
<psusi> because it's a native package
<wgrant> It doesn't seem like it should be.
<psusi> why not?  I AM upstream
<persia> psusi: Because you're a well-meaning upstream who wants to support every potential distribution that will ever be invented :)
<wgrant> What if we need to patch it?
<psusi> persia, I am? :)
<psusi> wgrant, then we patch it
<persia> psusi: Of course you are :)
<wgrant> psusi: We can't, sanely, because it's native and we don't have commit access upstream.
<psusi> wgrant, but there is no upstream
<wgrant> There will be if the project gets anywhere.
<persia> psusi: But there could be.  Project hosting sites abound.
<psusi> I mean I guess you could create a -ubuntu1 package for changes specific to ubuntu, but right now there are none...
<psusi> persia, I'm using lp for hosting
<persia> Then there is an upstream.  The primary upstream contributor happens to be a distro-maintainer, but that's a coincidence.
<psusi> actually I"m not
<psusi> I suppose that it could be some day that ubuntu specific changes will be made, but right now it's an initial upstream release, packaged with zero modification
<ajmitch> unless it's something made only for a specific distro (e.g. ubuntu-dev-tools), then it's best to not have it as a native package
<persia> And truth be told, most of the stuff in ubuntu-dev-tools really ought be pushed into other places
<Laney> That is true. I would have done so, were it alright to have python scripts in devscripts.
#ubuntu-motu 2011-04-04
<dholbach> good morning
<hrw> morning
<Laney> hello
<Laney> argh
<Laney> my PC would lock up just when I'm about to do a few uploads, and it's all the way across town
<Laney> /o\
<KNRO> can anyone take a look at this? http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=650521
<KNRO> is it possible to use pbuilder to build packages for kernel modules?
<Laney> KNRO: I imagine you'd have more success in #ubuntu-kernel
<KNRO> it's a packaging issue though
<Laney> they package the kernel
<KNRO> This is outside the kernel, but I'll ask anyway
#ubuntu-motu 2011-04-05
<dholbach> good morning
<Laney> hiya
<dholbach> hey Laney
<dholbach> hey geser
<highvoltage> good morning
<hrw> bug 745876 is fixed for armel now - can someone take a look?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 745876 in sea-defender (Ubuntu) "sea-defender version 0.9-1 failed to build on armel" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/745876
<ari-tczew> tumbleweed, bdrung: I got this error while using sponsor-patch: http://paste.ubuntu.com/589703/
<ari-tczew> what happended?
<tumbleweed> ari-tczew: looks like the error was in the package build, and it isn't in english
<hrw> ari-tczew: "LC_ALL=C debuild -S"
<ari-tczew> tumbleweed: translated http://paste.ubuntu.com/589707/
<hrw> ari-tczew: and it looks like changed wiimotedev.png file
<ari-tczew> hrw: please note  I;m using script sponsor-patch
<hrw> ari-tczew: never used it
<ari-tczew> off
<micahg> SpamapS: do you have any inherent desire for mongodb 1
<micahg> 1.8 in natty?
<SpamapS> I'm always pro-newer-versions for mongodb :)
<SpamapS> micahg: seems really late though..
<micahg> SpamapS: it would need an FFe, 1.6.5 doesn't
<SpamapS> micahg: does it help at all w/ the mozjs conversion?
<micahg> SpamapS: I don't think so, but I haven't looked yet, I hope I can drop most of our changes in the merge
<SpamapS> micahg: I'd be willing to bet *very* few people run our packages of mongo, so I think we can be aggressive with it.
<micahg> SpamapS: well, I can see how bad the merge is, but you'd have to file the FFe if you want it
<SpamapS> Plus Antonin does a really nice job w/ the packages.. I tend to trust his changes implicitly.
<SpamapS> micahg: its really really low on my list right now, I had planned on visiting it early next cycle.
<micahg> SpamapS: that's fine, I'll pull in 1.6.5 unless it's broken and 1.8.0 is easier
<micahg> SpamapS: no packaging changes for 1.8, just it'll depend on how well 1.6.5 builds :)
<SpamapS> micahg: I'm hoping that during oneiric we can get the right stuff done in Debian where we can push our upstart jobs up to Debian. That should reduce the delta of mongo even further.
<micahg> SpamapS: yeah, that would be nice, I asked chrisccoulson to make our mozjs package provide libmozjs-dev as well to keep the diff down
<SpamapS> micahg: btw, do you have the ability to upload this to maverick/lucid-security: bug #676336
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 676336 in mahara (Ubuntu Maverick) "Blogs get deleted without sesskey check" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/676336
<micahg> SpamapS: ability, yes, but I'm not sponsoring security fixes yet, jdstrand will be back tomorrow, is that soon enough?
<SpamapS> micahg: sure.. I've never done work on security bugs yet so just wondering if my comments are sufficient
<SpamapS> Ugh.. cjwatson has put me to shame.. 4 hours of sponsoring on just 3 bugs.. I think he touched 10 in 3 hours. ;)
<iulian> Heh.
<micahg> SpamapS: you can generally ignore security bugs in the sponsorship queue as the security team needs to review/upload
<micahg> SpamapS: unless you have a specific interest in them
<ari-tczew> tumbleweed: around?
<SpamapS> micahg: I do, in that I was just starting to play with mahara last week. :)
<SpamapS> micahg: and my thinking was that with universe security issues, we need broader base help, right?
<micahg> SpamapS: yep, but for making patches rather than sponsoring
<SpamapS> micahg: that makes me wonder why ubuntu-security-sponsors is included in the sponsoring queue then. :-/
<micahg> SpamapS: so the security team has a list maybe :)
#ubuntu-motu 2011-04-06
<c2tarun> I was building kde4libs and I got this error http://pastebin.com/kGidy8LF, when I looked I found that on the location instead of backend there is folder name helper, file inside helper is kauth_helper_plugin.so can anyone please help :/
<nigelb> stgraber: congrats :)
<stgraber> nigelb: thanks :)
<dholbach> good morning
<Daviey> .
<soren> !
<iulian> ~
<Kano> hi, why has natty fully outdated va-drivers?
<Kano> like: vdpau-va-driver 0.6.3 -> deb exp 0.7.2-1 or xvba-va-driver 0.7.7 -> deb wheezy 0.7.8?
<Kano> for a new release it is old...
<Kano> vdpau 26-Feb-2011, xvba 26-Feb-2011
<Rhonda> Because noone did a syncrequest for that
<Rhonda> And syncing from experimental isn't done automatically neither, someone needs to specificly request that.
<Kano> seems that u users dont care about it, well i dont use u ;)
<Kano> i just see the errors
<Rhonda> What errors?
<Kano> no hybrid mode, outdated software
<Rhonda> Packaged software is always outdated by definition.
<Rhonda> At some point the automatic import has to get stopped to be able to stabilize the thing.
<Kano> whats the option to boot into text mode...
<Kano> maybe single mode works
<directhex> debian import freeze was at the start of january, wasn't it?
<Rhonda> And from that point on someone (which would include e.g. you?) has to specificly request an update if they see the need for it.
<Kano> and why has single mode no effect? how to boot live into text mode?
<iulian> directhex: Yes, it was.
<Rhonda> Kano: Actually this is no support channel for that kind of questions. Please be adviced to use #ubuntu for such questions.
<Kano> Rhonda: xvba-va-driver is broken too, it depends on a not existing fglrx driver
<Kano> you can use the time to update package + depend
<Kano> Rhonda: it is logical that this does not work with an automated import becasue your driver package is not called fglrx-driver
<Rhonda> Kano: The package is in multiverse. I guess there should be some sort of description available somewhere how to generate the fglrx-driver package. That can't be put into the pool because of upstream licensing. Still, these aren't questions for here, please speak about them in #ubuntu
<Kano> Rhonda: the package is just called fglrx
<Kano> fglrx-driver is the debian name
<Kano> but somehow your vlc does not work with it
<Kano> i dont get why u has lots of packages but all i test are broken
<Rhonda> Feel invited to write bugreports about these issues.
<soren> Have you filed bugs about this?
<Kano> soren: i wait till the bug is fixed i reported >1 y ago
<Kano> until then i do not report bugs
<soren> Kano: Then that's why.
<soren> Then you don't get to complain.
<Kano> man, i dont use u, i test it from time to time to optimize my scripts
<Rhonda> Kano: If you don't report the issues it's hard to know whether it's known and someone being able to take care of it.
<soren> Kano: If this is how productive you're going to be about it, don't bother.
<Kano> soren: for example i reported missing hybrid mode > 1 y ago
<Kano> soren: the iso images are not hybrid just because of a missing isohybrid call
<Kano> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-cdimage/+bug/524803
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 524803 in Ubuntu CD Images "isolinux hybrid mode should be used - all other major distributions do so since last year" [Undecided,New]
<Kano> do you see how long this bug exists
<Kano> nothing fixed
<Kano> why should i report bugs when nobody cares about em?
<Rhonda> Isn't there some limitation with respect to certain hardware with hybird?
<soren> Kano: If noone cares, why do you bother complaining on IRC? Why would we care more about it here?
<Rhonda> Because actually it's different packages and different people tracking bugs for them?
<Kano> i do not intent to use launchpad for bugs anmore
<soren> I hardly think Launchpad is the problem. And IRC is a *dreadful* bug tracker.
<Kano> too long response time, no fix
<Rhonda> Right. Because exaggerating from a single bugreport to the complete system is definitely proving a point.
<Kano> thats not the only bug i reported
<Kano> kernel patches i wanted to get removed took >1 year too
<Kano> thats stupid response time
<soren> You're (as always) being unreasonable.
<soren> I'm sure you're talking about the fakeraid sort of kernel patches, right?
<soren> Bah, I can't be bothered wasting more time explaining this. *again*.
<Rhonda> Kano: Because it might look like a simple thing to do for you, it might have deep impact on others, especially in central components.
<Kano> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/380138
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 380138 in linux (Ubuntu) "Do NOT disable HPA by default -> leads to data loss" [Medium,Fix released]
<soren> Right, that on.e
<Kano> do yo see how long that bug was in the system
<Kano> 1 year 7 month
<soren> You're being ridiculous.
<Kano> no, i dont need a bug tracker when fixes take >1 y
<soren> It wasn't just a matter of flicking a switch. There are upgrade scenarios to be considered.
<soren> How do you spell /ignore again?
<Kano> that kernel patch had much more bad impact than good
<soren> Oh, right, here it is:
<soren> Ah.
<Kano> i know ppl which hds with hpa
<Kano> most of em have been to stupid to set the jumpers correctly but used em mirror inverted
<Kano> the others have got gigabyte boards. if you dont use raid thats maybe not that critical, but if you do, your raid will fail on soft reboot - you can not access it without dmraid on your live image anyway
<Kano> basically it is impossible to recommand anybody to use natty when you want to use xvba video accelleration. it just does not work
<shein> Hello, I'd like to be contributing but I am a little confused on the process.  Could I, for example, begin my following the package update recipe on some of the Debian RC bug fixes found here?  http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/bugs/rcbugs/
<lfaraone> shein: well, if they can be synced, then just file a sync request, otherwise merge the packages.
<micahg> shein: keep in mind we're past feature freeze, so anything that's not bug fixes will need a freeze exception https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess
<lfaraone> micahg: if its on the rcbugs list they don't need FFes though :)
<micahg> lfaraone: not true
<micahg> lfaraone: the fix can be cherry picked sometimes
<lfaraone> micahg: I mean, the rcbugs themsleves do not need FFes, if there are other non-rcfixes, then sure.
<micahg> lfaraone: right, but someone doing new version merge/syncing should know about the freeze :)
 * bcurtiswx sees lfaraone is still away :P
<lfaraone> barry: sshhh
<lfaraone> * bcurtiswx
<lfaraone> barry: oops.
<bcurtiswx> tab complete fail, nice
<lfaraone> bcurtiswx: today just isn't my day
<bcurtiswx> as per -us-dc i can't say the same myself (shh)
<lfaraone> hah. I didn't apply for sponsorship this year, I probably can't do UDS.
<shein> lfaraone: So if the ubuntu version of a package does not have the word ubuntu in it then it can be simply synced?  Is this something worth doing?
<maco> yes it can
<maco> and yes it is, though it depends where we are in the release cycle whether it's a good idea
<lfaraone> shein: correct. if we're in feature freeze, we can't include packages with new features unless a Feature Freeze exception is filed, so if a rcfix sync would include new features, its best to cherry-pick the fix instead.
<micahg> lfaraone: well, depending on the feature/package, a sync could still be allowed, you can request one with -e passed to requestsync
<shein> So seeing as natty is past feature freeze, is there less to do in terms of MOTU?  How can I contribute currently?
<micahg> shein: FTBFS fixes or rcbugs are good
<micahg> shein: here's a list of recent rebuild failures: http://people.ubuntuwire.org/~wgrant/rebuild-ftbfs-test/test-rebuild-20110329-natty.html
#ubuntu-motu 2011-04-07
<dholbach> good morning
<ApOgEE> morning dholbach
<dholbach> hi ApOgEE
<ApOgEE> dholbach: how can i start my journey to become motu?
<dholbach> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/GettingStarted should be a good start
<dholbach> it links to all the guides we have and also links to stuff you can do afterwards
<ApOgEE> which ubuntu are you using currently on your desktop to do all this development? is it the latest one?
<dholbach> yes
<dholbach> but if you have a look at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UsingDevelopmentReleases
<dholbach> (which is also linked from https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/GettingStarted) you'll find out how to install it in a safe way
<ApOgEE> i've read that documentation and learning on how can i help in fixing bugs. but i'm not clearly understand the flow yet
<dholbach> best to start with a simple one and ask your questions here
<ApOgEE> can you show an example of a simple bug that i can start with?
<dholbach> there's a bunch of links that can help you find something at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/TODO/Bugs (also http://harvest.ubuntu.com/opportunities/)
<ApOgEE> thank you
<evaluate> Hello.
<evaluate> The package clipit from ubuntu natty has 2 bugs open which I would consider RC bugs. These can be easily fixed by synching the package from Debian (and not applying any patches to it, to force it to build with indicator support). I have sent an email to Andrew Starr like a week ago, since he seems to be the one that is taking care of the package, but I didn't receive any response yet. Could anyone please try and contact him about that or look
<evaluate>  into synching the package?
<lfaraone> Do we still subscribe ~ubuntu-sru to SRU bugs?
<lfaraone> I just uploaded a fix for Lucid for bug 698122, and left it as "in progress". Should it be back to new, or "fix committed"?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 698122 in python-gasp (Ubuntu Maverick) "Backend reports image not found when attempting image import" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/698122
<tumbleweed> lfaraone: I tend to mark them committed when I've uploaded, and yes I subscribe SRU (not sure if that's necessary but it doesn't hurt)
<micahg> YokoZar: why is wine1.3-gecko a native package?
<YokoZar> micahg: because it doesn't actually build on Ubuntu
<micahg> YokoZar: I don't think that makes a difference
<YokoZar> micahg: (older gecko version, still requires a build step on windows).  Note that we've fixed this in Wine for gecko 1.2, but that's not the version needed by the wine1.3 in Natty
<micahg> YokoZar: should be the same as anything else in multiverse
<YokoZar> micahg: regardless it will comfort you to know that wine1.3-gecko 1.2.0 is in fact a nonnative package and does build in all the ways you would expect it to
<YokoZar> and, indeed, can be in universe rather than multiverse
<YokoZar> but that's for O
<micahg> YokoZar: yes, but native has nothing to do with building but rather where the contents origin is (is this an upstream package or one w/out an upstream)
 * micahg wonders if that changed with source format 3...
<petani> all can i ask for php
<RoAkSoAx> '/win 4
<adam__> somebody here ?
<micahg> !ask | adam__
<ubottu> adam__: Please don't ask to ask a question, simply ask the question (all on ONE line and in the channel, so that others can read and follow it easily). If anyone knows the answer they will most likely reply. :-)
<adam__> ok !!
<adam__> Once I've built a package how is it release on the official repositories ?
<adam__> how to sign my package !! i don't have the official private key !! ?
<adam__> :(
<adam__> is this chan active ?
<Pici> adam__: Have you read the Ubuntu packaging guide yet?
<adam__> hum yes but not completely :( ok ... I'll read it completely
<adam__> Pici, answers are inside .. isn't it ?
<Pici> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/NewPackages
<adam__> ok ok :( but it is getting like a big boring encyclopedia
<adam__> thanks anyway
<adam__> bye
#ubuntu-motu 2011-04-08
<csjohn> hey
<csjohn> how's
<csjohn> ** everyone doing?
<poolie> hi, do i have to take any action to get my bzr sru approved from https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/maverick/+queue?queue_state=1&queue_text=bzr ?
<lifeless> thats in main - #ubuntu-devel is a better channel
<lifeless> (sorry to make you follow pointers)
<poolie> ah thanks, i had the idea newbie developer questions would be more appropriate here
<lifeless> newbies are normally motus fodder yes
<lifeless> but the subject matter is the filter
<micahg> poolie: I goofed on that one a while back myself :), in fact IIRC, it was misguiding you into this channel :)
<poolie> np thanks :)
<dholbach> good morning
<laszlok> Hello MOTU, I've just become the maintainer for an upstream project (glipper) which is in Universe. Currently glipper is an applet, but the new version 2.0 uses app indicators (and drops applet support). I want to know how you normally deal with a new version that has a major change in functionality. ie. Should the new version use /usr/share/glipper2 to allow it to not conflict with glipper 1.0, or should the old package be renamed glipper-applet, so
<laszlok>  that users who upgrade can will automatically have the app indicator version installed?
<laszlok> I am assuming that we don't want to drop the old glipper 1.0 package, because there are still people using gnome panel who might rely on it
<hrw> morning
<RAOF> laszlok: That depends a bit on upstream (which you are :)).  If you want to maintain gnome-panel support, then we can do whatever.  If you're going to drop it and just support appindicators, that's also cool.  We can handle either.
<arand> I'm using git-buildpackage making svn-tracking PPA packages, and I'd want to use the version "1.01+svn2530~ppa1". However, this makes git-buildpackage not create an orig tarball, (from my svn branch), is there a way around this or will I need to stick to "1.01+svn2530-ppa1" which does work..
<RAOF> arand: git-buildpackage is correct, there.  A non-native package version consists of $STUFF-$DEBIAN_REVISION.  Since 1.01+svn2530~ppa1 does not contain â-â, it's a native version.
<RAOF> arand: Versioning it as 1.01+svn2530-0~ppa1 would work.
<laszlok> RAOF: I have removed applet support, and I am no longer going to update the 1.0 branch, so essentially there is no support for the applet version. I guess that means it should just be dropped eh?
<RAOF> laszlok: Yup, pretty much.
<laszlok> RAOF: ok thanks, I'll be back when I have 2.0 ready to go in my PPA
<ari-tczew> does anybody know how to fix this FTBFS? https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/clementine/0.7.1-0ubuntu1/+buildjob/2431201/+files/buildlog_ubuntu-natty-i386.clementine_0.7.1-0ubuntu1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<ari-tczew> FYI it was built fine on PPA and pbuilder.
<hrw> because you did not have pkgmangler there
<hrw> and build failed cause translation pkgmangler complains
<ari-tczew> hrw: ok how to fix it?
<hrw> ari-tczew: I would just remove all empty *.po files but no idea is it proper fix
<ari-tczew> hrw: do you use sbuild?
<hrw> no. I use pbuilder but have all pkgmanglers installed
<ari-tczew> hrw: it doesn't matter if you have it installed, pbuilder will build package fine anyway
<hrw> ari-tczew: but this build error for me looks like related to pkg-manglers only
<ari-tczew> hrw: is it a bug in launchpad builders?
<hrw> ari-tczew: I think that message about empty PO files is self documenting
<geser> ari-tczew: you can also have those pkgmanglers which are run on the buildds in your pbuilder (I've them in my pbuilder to catch exactly such errors)
<ari-tczew> geser: how to set up them?>
<geser> and I "fix" such errors in the past by removing those mentioned (empty) .po files
<geser> ari-tczew: login into your pbuilder (and use --save-after-login to keep those changes) and install pkgbinarymangler (and pkg-dbgsym-create if you want .ddebs too)
<geser> you might check the configuration files in /etc/pkgbinarymangler/ if the tools you want are "enabled"
<ari-tczew> geser: what are .ddebs for?
<ari-tczew> used for*?
<geser> .ddebs contain the extracted debug symbols from the binaries (those -dbgsym packages are used to generate the backtraces you can see in bugs)
<geser> (I hope I got the package names right as I'm not my Ubuntu to check)
<hrw> ari-tczew: .ddeb is ubuntu way of providing debug informations for all packages. kind of automatically generated -dbg packages
<hrw> geser: proper names you used
<nixternal> mav+4.6.2 - is there a known issue with shutting down? when I shut down it goes to TTY, so I have to log in and do shutdown -h now
<ari-tczew> hrw, geser: I have installed pkgbinarymangler in my pbuilder and clementine still builds fine :/
<geser> ari-tczew: check /etc/pkgbinarymangler/striptranslations.conf (inside your pbuilder) if it's enabled ("enable: true") as I don't remember the defaults
<ari-tczew> geser: http://paste.ubuntu.com/591411/
<ari-tczew> failed
<geser> you sure you used "login --save-after-login" when installing "pkgbinarymangler" *inside* your pbuilder?
<ari-tczew> geser: yes
<ari-tczew> I can try it again
<ari-tczew> geser: http://paste.ubuntu.com/591420/
<ari-tczew> is it OK?
<geser> yes
<ari-tczew> geser: now just 'exit' ?
<geser> yes, but you might want to check if everything is enabled
<ari-tczew> # pkgstriptranslations will do nothing unless enable is set to "true"
<ari-tczew> enable: false
<ari-tczew> !
<ari-tczew> geser: how to change it? there is no vim, mcedit, nano
<geser> either install an editor (and remove it later if you don't want to have it permanently in the pbuilder) or edit the file from outside (edit /var/cache/pbuilder/build/*/etc/pkgbinarymangler/striptranslations.conf)
<ari-tczew> geser: yeah, install an editor... I'm silly
<maco> sed?
<maco> sed s/enable: false/enable: true/
<ari-tczew> geser: It works!
<ari-tczew> so, the result is FTBFS :p
<ari-tczew> geser: do you know where are these files? http://paste.ubuntu.com/591441/
<ari-tczew> there are not in source directory
<geser> ari-tczew: looks like those files are generated during build but I don't understand enough about translations (and cmake) to tell you how to fix it
<seidos> any ideas why there is a sensible-browser and chromium-browser in /usr/bin?
<micahg> seidos: sensible-browser is a generic one linking to whichever browser meets its conditions which idr at the moment
<Laney> it will try to launch the appropriate browser (or $BROWSER)
#ubuntu-motu 2011-04-09
<seidos> that's what i thought, but when i tried executing it from a terminal, it wouldn't run
<seidos> chromium-browser runs though, i found it trying to set up chromium.gmail as my preferred mail client
<micahg> seidos: it's just a shell script
<seidos> micahg: interesting.  thanks
<anarcat> hi
<anarcat> i am a debian maintaine trying to figure out how to make a Debian package migrate properly into ubuntu. the package is drush, and people are starting to complain about it being out of date on the ubuntu side of things https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/drush/+bug/744065
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 744065 in drush (Ubuntu) "drush version incompatible with Drupal 7" [Undecided,New]
<anarcat> now i understand that we're are in natty's freeze cycle, but i am not sure how that affects backporting or syncing of packages into whatever ubuntu's "unstable" is (if there is such a thing)
<anarcat> any idea?
<anarcat> the last sync was 6 months ago while the new package has been available on debian for more than three months now: http://packages.qa.debian.org/d/drush.html
<StevenK> anarcat: In ubuntu-dev-tools there is a tool called requestsync. Use it to request a sync of drush, and include as much information as you can
<anarcat> StevenK: what if i don't run ubuntu? :)
<anarcat> StevenK: do you think it's realistic to get drush updated for natty now?
<anarcat> i guess i can just tell people to use the PPA of that guy i don't know :P
<anarcat> https://launchpad.net/~brianmercer/+archive/drush
<anarcat> StevenK: what about a backport to lucid LTS? how does that work?
<broder> anarcat: ubuntu-dev-tools is in debian as well
<anarcat> it is? nice
<anarcat> thanks for your help: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/drush/+bug/755172
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 755172 in drush (Ubuntu) "FFe: Sync drush 4.4-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,New]
<csjohn> hey all
<csjohn> anyone awake?
<psusi> I'm on wife deprived caffine and Korn induced auto pilot
<csjohn> :) coffee based caffine or something less traditional?
<psusi> rum and coke
<csjohn> im partial to 'amp
<psusi> and vodka? ;)
<csjohn> haha normally i take the amp straight with some sort of purpose in mind
<csjohn> what have you guys been working on?
<psusi> me?  I tracked down an installer hang bug that got introduced during the natty dev cycle tonight
<csjohn> what was the cause?
<psusi> the new scripts added to partman-auto to allow the choice of replacing an existing install with the new version were trying to unmount the partitions they probed with the device name instead of the mount path, and there is apparently a bug in ntfs-3g where it changes the name of a /dev/mapper/ device to /dev/dm-N instead, and so you can't umount with the /dev/mapper name anymore
<psusi> and you can't umount the /dev/dm-N name either apparently because umount chokes on the dash character, and somehow the installation later hangs if that umount fails... still not sure about that part
<csjohn> ah okay
<psusi> the installation probably shouldn't hang if that umount fails, but the umount shouldn't fail either, so I now have 3 bugs going and forwarded the one for umount upstream
<psusi> hrm.... what to tackle next?
<csjohn> cheeseburger? haha
<csjohn> what field are you in career wise?
<psusi> I can has hot dog?
<csjohn> hotdogz is gud
<psusi> software engineer ;)
 * psusi has two hot dogs... 10 lb and 4 lb
<csjohn> lol
<csjohn> soft eng in what field though? OS? web? disco?
<psusi> medial devices
<psusi> medical
<csjohn> imaging devices?
<psusi> not quite... our primary product is a non magnetic IV infusion pump that is MRI compatible
<csjohn> oh okay cool
<psusi> 3 Tesla magnets do crazy things to magnetic things ;)
<csjohn> lol well, they generate them
<csjohn> :P
<psusi> magnetic objects become deadly projectiles near a 3T MRI magnet
<csjohn> oh i know it
<psusi> even non magnetic metal like a quarter does some crazy stuff in that kind of field
<csjohn> how long have you been doing work on ubuntu for?
<psusi> on and off since 2005
<csjohn> wow right on
<psusi> I had a bit of an MMORPG addition that kept taking me away for a while ;)
<csjohn> lol i was a kid selling computers at a retail store that far back
<psusi> I nearly went that route... then I decided to get serious and finish college ;)
<csjohn> lol well i did that in highschool - im 4 months away from finishing university now
<psusi> even though it didn't teach me jack about computers that I hadn't already learned on my own... silly piece of paper
 * psusi needs to get some more people to sponsor his universe-contributor app he has finally gotten around to putting in
<psusi> membership board meeting is Monday... hrm... where's Keybuk when you need him?
<csjohn> im brand new here, so i couldn't tell ya :)
<psusi> it seems I now know more inactive/former devs than active ones
<csjohn> whats the turnover rate like?
<psusi> I'm not sure... like I said, I kept getting sucked back into MMORPGs instead of paying attention until somewhat recently
<psusi> but it isn't as low as I'd like it to be
<psusi> I'm still not sure what ever happened to Ben Collins Sussman, and Scott James Remnant recently got stolen away by Google... and I think Theodore Tso worked for canonical at one point too
 * psusi loves emacs more the more he uses it
<lifeless> I don't think ted tso ever worked for us
<lifeless> ben collins is doing something else these days, not sure what
 * psusi really needs to get the old e2defrag package put back in the archive soon
<psusi> it's a shame ted tso and remmy card abandoned it all those years ago
<lifeless> filesystems are hard
<lifeless> lets drink beer :)
<StevenK> psusi: Careful, Ben Collins and Ben Collins Sussman are two different people.
<psusi> amen to drinking beer.. but I still want to keep defragging my fs and improving boot times
<psusi> StevenK, true
<StevenK> And Ben Collins Sussman was still at CollabNet, last I hard.
<StevenK> *heard
<psusi> I'm pretty sure that at one time, one of them was one of the Ubuntu kernel leads, and no longer is
<StevenK> Ben Collins was.
<psusi> yea, and the other one was the main guy responsible for svn
<StevenK> Ah, Ben Collins-Sussman has moved to Google.
<psusi> must... get... Ubuntu... booting from hd in under 10 seconds
<c2tarun> why is it that new version firefox is not in maverick and just in natty?
<ScottK> c2tarun: You might ask in #ubuntu-mozillateam.
<c2tarun> ScottK: I thought that micahg is the one who somewhat adopted firefox.
<ScottK> Since the package is in Main, it's not really a MOTU question.
<c2tarun> hmmm....
<ScottK> There are people here who work on it, but the channel I recommended to you is the best one for such questions.
<csjohn> g'day mates
<c_korn> is there a tool to run the command given in a desktop file's Exec entry ?
<c_korn> hm, xdg-open should work â¦ â¦ if there wasn't bug 378783 :/
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 378783 in xdg-utils (Ubuntu) "xdg-open *.desktop opens text editor" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/378783
<ricotz> Laney, hi, could you ack this one? https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/docky/+bug/755766
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 755766 in docky (Ubuntu) "Sync docky 2.1.2-1 (universe) from Debian experimental (main)" [Undecided,New]
<Laney> don't you want to wait until the gio sync is done?
<Laney> ricotz: why don't you go for ppu for docky?
<ricotz> Laney, i stated the dependency on gio in the comment
<Laney> ricotz: I get loads of messages like this http://paste.debian.net/113532/
<ricotz> Laney, hmm weird
<ricotz> Laney, does this happen in pbuilder?
<Laney> dunno
<Laney> don't have gio .3 there
<ricotz> doesnt look like a gio-sharp thing
<Laney> anyway I think you want GCONF_DISABLE_MAKEFILE_SCHEMA_INSTALL=1
<Laney> as in dh_auto_install -- GCONF_DISABLE_MAKEFILE_SCHEMA_INSTALL=1
<ricotz> Laney, is this ubuntu-specific?
<Laney> nop
<Laney> i'll ack the sync but please fix this in git
<ricotz> ok
<csjohn> sup yo
<ari-tczew> debfx: ping
#ubuntu-motu 2011-04-10
<Default11_> Hey all
<csjohn> Anyone awake?
<csjohn> ;
<csjohn> :) Let me know if you're alive out there
<csjohn> Hey psusi, long time no see
<psusi> csjohn, sorry, I'm not very good with names and yours doesn't seem to ring a bell?
<csjohn> no worries, was talking to you last night
<psusi> ohh, lol... I vaguely remember now... I got quite drunk last night ;)
<csjohn> ahhh that explains the rambling about existentialism!
<psusi> oh boy, I didn't realize I was THAT drunk... that would explain the terrible hangover...
<csjohn> just messin' with you, reasonably sober tonight?
<psusi> so far ;)
<csjohn> im trying to get my hands on the natty beta but apparently the mirrors like to not respond at the same time
<csjohn> oh there we go, success
<amirhoshangi> hi guys, its a long time that octave doesnt gets updated from 3.2 to 3.4 in debian and ubuntu , how can i understand if it has a maintainer or not ?
<amirhoshangi> its a shame that such a great software doesnt updates :( !
<amirhoshangi> any Idea ??? 8-)
<amirhoshangi> what an active community.
<arand> amirhoshangi: debians package tracker is usualy a good place to look
<amirhoshangi> k, what about ubuntu ?
<arand> amirhoshangi: Will likely sync from debian, unless someone specifically packages it for ubuntu.
<arand> amirhoshangi: http://lists.alioth.debian.org/pipermail/pkg-octave-devel/2011-February/007699.html seems to be the last word there...
<amirhoshangi> yeah, tnx, thats it
#ubuntu-motu 2012-04-02
<directhex> mfisch: pass the -k flag to debsign foo.changes
<mfisch> but I can't sign with someone else's key unless I have their passphrase?
<ajmitch> mfisch: always sign with your own key
<directhex> mfisch: hence the -k flag, which lets you specify the key to sign with
<mfisch> now I understand
<mfisch> because by default debuild just reads what's in the changelog...
<directhex> yep
<mfisch> thanks guys
<mfisch> and/or gals
<vibhav> good morning
<dholbach> good morning
<chilicuil> Hi, does anyone know of an up to date pbuilder hooks repository?, or http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~kubuntu-packagers/pbuilder/pbuilder-hooks is ok?
<tumbleweed> chilicuil: pbuilder comes with some useful hooks in examples
<chilicuil> tumbleweed: ok, I've seen them, I just wanted to make sure I was uptodate since I'm running lucid, thanks =)
<vibhav> Should I prepare a debdiif for https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libgpod/+bug/789472 or sync it from Debian?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 789472 in libgpod (Ubuntu) "libgpod should only depend on libgdk-pixbuf2.0-dev, not libgtk2.0-dev" [Undecided,New]
<Laney> vibhav: that doesn't sound like it's worth uploading (especially coming out of sync) for, and the version in unstable still has Depends on gtk2. I suggest you just report it to Debian if it's not there already.
<Laney> First confirm for yourself that the bug is correct.
<vibhav> Laney: libgpod-dev has libgtk2.0-dev as dependencies
<vibhav> ah the bug is fixed in precise
<Laney> the bug says it should not have that.
<geser> vibhav: have you talked to hyperair about this bug?
 * Laney was avoiding special-casing
<AnAnt> Hello, I have sync'ed/merged TeXLive pre-2012 package from Debian for Precise on my PPA: ppa:aelmahmoudy/tl2009
<AnAnt> please note that a couple of packages (cm-super & texlive-base) were sync'ed rather than merged, probably I would merge texlive-base on next Debian upload
<AnAnt> btw, I have sync'ed/merged TeXLive pre-2012 package from Debian for Precise on my PPA: ppa:aelmahmoudy/tl2009 , please note that a couple of packages (cm-super & texlive-base) were sync'ed rather than merged, probably I would merge texlive-base on next Debian upload.
<AnAnt> oops
<AnAnt> wrong window
<tarvid> is there a set of tools for ubuntu-server that will configure networking like the network manager on ubuntu-desktop?
<tumbleweed> tarvid: this isn't a support channel. To answer your question: ifupdown?
<tarvid> I understand but ubuntu-server 12.04 static ip networking is broken and I can't even submit a bug report
<tumbleweed> tarvid: broken?\
<jtaylor> does changing to compat 9 and adding hardening flags need a ffe?
<tumbleweed> does changing to compat 9 change the library installation location?
<jtaylor> no its an application
<directhex> 9? ._.
<directhex> i feel so old
<kees> jtaylor: which package is it?
<jtaylor> kees: gimmix
<kees> ah, okay, so in -4 they enabled PIE. I was checking to see if there really was any difference on Ubuntu between -3 and -4.
<kees> jtaylor: I would say, yes, FFe needed. it's not really a bug fix.
<jtaylor> you could consider adding hardening for media applications a bug fix :)
<kees> well, only the PIE bit is new. all the other hardening options are already built in.
<kees> but yeah. maybe ScottK would have a better opinion?
<tumbleweed> jtaylor: I'm not concerned about that, then
<jbicha> any ideas why this build fails or how to fix it? https://bugzilla.gnome.org/671020
<ubottu> Gnome bug 671020 in Miners "tracker 0.14 evolution miner fails to build on Ubuntu" [Major,Needinfo]
<ScottK> jtaylor: I think it's a feature change, but not a hard one to get an exception for.
<micahg> jbicha: --as-needed failure maybe, I assume you have evolution-dev installed?
<micahg> jtaylor: python-qwt5-qt4 generally needs a rebuild in step with python-qt4
<jtaylor> ScottK: did pyqt4 4.9.1 break abi again?
<ScottK> Not AFAIK.
<ScottK> Qt 4.8.1 might have screwed things up if that's been uploaded.
<micahg> that package always seems to be finicky
<jtaylor> better check the remaining rdeps if they work
 * jtaylor loading vistrails
<jtaylor> interesting program
<jtaylor> -sip rdepends work
<jbicha> micahg: I'm using the same tracker packaging as Debian and I tried building with --no-as-needed but it still fails
<jbicha> maybe the problem is with Ubuntu's evolution ?
#ubuntu-motu 2012-04-03
<mfisch> tumbleweed: you awake?
<mfisch> I'd like an opinion on bug #959347
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 959347 in python-djvulibre (Ubuntu) "new python-djvulibre release 0.3.8 fixes ftbfs (but also has new features)" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/959347
<mfisch> python-djvulibre ftbfs and a new release fixes it.  debian fixed it differently, but their fix doesn't help ubuntu...  I think going to the new revision is the best path forward
<micahg> mfisch: have you tried asking jwilk for an upload to experimental?
<micahg> mfisch: oh, sorry, I'm thinking of something else :)
<mfisch> micahg: I just got back to looking at this today...
<mfisch> micahg: the debian changes dont work for us
<micahg> rebuild not looking so good with ~200 failures and only being 1/3 done (the third more likely to work :))
<ajmitch_> micahg: but we can ignore a bunch of chroot problems in that 200
<micahg> oh, hrmph
<micahg> that's slightly more comforting :)
<ajmitch_> 57 chroot failures, at least I think that was due to a misbehaving buildd
<ajmitch_> lib/Makefile.am:1: `pkglibdir' is not a legitimate directory for `SCRIPTS'
<ajmitch_> I've seen a few with that
<RAOF> Stupid automake making backwards-incompatible changes.
<EvilResistance> still leaves you with ~150 errors, ajmitch :P
<ajmitch_> EvilResistance: yes, I know there are a few to fix
<micahg> there's always automake1.4...
<dholbach> good morning
<ajmitch_> dholbach: a belated good morning
<dholbach> hey ajmitch_
<iulian> Morning dholbach. Evening ajmitch_.
<dholbach> heya iulian
<iulian> How's it going?
<ajmitch_> hi iulian
<vibhav> hi dholbach
<dholbach> hey vibhav
<hrw> hi
<vibhav> If libpng15 is synced to Ubuntu, will libpng15-dev be synced too?
<geser> syncing only works on source packages
<dholbach> vibhav, the source package is synced and then built - so yes
<vibhav> ah, thanks
<vibhav> Would a sync of libpng15 to Ubuntu make sense?
<vibhav> Cause qtiplot is also dependendent on libpng15
<dholbach> no it wouldn't make sense
<vibhav> why?
<geser> that's the libpng version from experimental, right? then certainly not
<dholbach> there is a gazillion packages depending on libpng12 - if we take libpng from experimental, all packages depending on it will at least have to be rebuilt
<geser> it will be a library transtion and we don't want it right now before a LTS release
<vibhav> ok
<dholbach> run:   apt-cache rdepends libpng12 on a precise machine to get an idea of how many packages would need modification or at least a rebuild
<vibhav> That list is huge :O
<dholbach> yes
<geser> vibhav: if you build qtiplot with current libpng, it'll get a dependency on libpng12
<dholbach> I would rather check if the new qtiplot can also still build with the old libpng
<dholbach> ok, I'll stop repeating what geser says :)
 * dholbach hugs geser
 * dholbach rushes out to the shop around the corner for a bit :)
<Laney> for what reason did you want to do that sync?
<vibhav> Laney: I was checking the Ubuntu Fix It Friday Pad
<ajmitch_> afaik qtiplot was mentioned there because a version of it FTBFS in debian, however that was due to another library (zlib) that is newer in debian
<vibhav> yeah
<vibhav> dpkg-source: info: 'dpkg-source --commit' is not supported by the source format '1.0'
<vibhav> How Do I fix it?
<tumbleweed> what would that mean with source format 1.0?
<geser> does the package use a patch-system? if yes, use the patch system manually, if not apply the patch inline
<vibhav> tumbleweed: I dont know, I was fixing a bug in munin
<tumbleweed> I recommend getting to grips with quilt anyway. It's faster to do what you want by driving quilt by hand, than using dpkg --commit
<tumbleweed> (but that's unrelated to your query here)
<tumbleweed> ah, it looks like munin uses quilt, so it's not that unrelated :P
<geser> btw: does what-patch works for v3 packages too? (can't check currently myself)
<vibhav> never mind, Im writing the patch myself
<geser> I wonder if one can simulate Ubuntu in "Linux Tycoon" (Distro Build Simulator game; http://lunduke.com/?page_id=2646)
<tumbleweed> geser: yes, it does
<vibhav> Can anyone check my debdiff at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/munin/+bug/598385 ?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 598385 in munin (Ubuntu) "munin plugin exim_mailqueue has incorrect graph configuration" [Low,Triaged]
<vibhav> This is very wierd
<vibhav> Im getting "dpkg-source: info: 'dpkg-source --commit' is not supported by the source format '1.0'" in every package I am fixing
<geser> vibhav: you picked packages which still use the v1 source package format
<vibhav> geser: How DO I create packages then?
<vibhav> s/packages/patches/
<vibhav> Murphy's Law :P
<geser> vibhav: you are doing it correctly, it just that there isn't one source package format but several from which DDs can pick
<vibhav> ah
<vibhav> geser: So Will I need to write patches myself?
<geser> yes (if you pick v1 source packages)
<Laney> Failed to fetch http://localhost:3142/debian/pool/main/r/rmatrix/r-cran-matrix_1.0-6-1_amd64.deb  Hash Sum mismatch
<Laney> I am sure that apt-cacher-ng has gotten worse at this over this cycle.
 * Laney arghs
<PaoloRotolo> Hi all!
<c10ud> hello there, is there still time for universe updates?
<c10ud> we fixed a bunch of stuff in the new version of emesene and a debian package is already available
<c10ud> our ubuntu contact (dfiloni) didn't appear (yet?) hence why i am asking
<tumbleweed> c10ud: yes
<tumbleweed> !ffe
<ubottu> Feature Freeze Exception. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess for the freeze exception process.
<c10ud> tumbleweed, thanks
<micahg> jbicha: I suggest using backportpackage in the future to upload to a PPA
<astraljava> Anyone else seeing this in precise? $ svn up
<astraljava> WARNING: gnome-keyring:: couldn't connect to: /tmp/keyring-suqaxB/pkcs11: No such file or directory
<astraljava> I get it both in svn and bzr.
<astraljava> Also, I'm using keychain for managing keys, what would I need to tweak so that the system stopped looking for gnome-keyring?
<ScottK> bdrung: Is there a reason you didn't sync vlc 2.0.1-4?
<tumbleweed> micahg, jbicha: another trick is to replace your dput with a wrapper that checks that the version doesn't mention ppa (I check for a couple of other things, I don't use PPAs much)
<micahg> tumbleweed: he did that already (and blogged about it)
<jbicha> tumbleweed: could you blog that?
<jbicha> I changed my default dput to not upload to ubuntu, but that doesn't fix the dput ubuntu habit :(
<micahg> jbicha: which is why I suggested backportpackage
<jbicha> micahg: in this case, I made a change from Debian to work around the evolution bug that's since been fixed
<micahg> jbicha: you can still use backportpackage on the dsc
<jbicha> oh? that's a non-obvious feature, I'll give that a try next time
<jbicha> that might help with the disconnect between what I intend and the muscle memory for dput
<bdrung> ScottK: i forgot to do it, but did it now.
<ScottK> bdrung: Thanks.
<ScottK> Score one for http://qa.ubuntuwire.org/bugs/rcbugs/
<tumbleweed> micahg, jbicha: ah, I'm behind on the blogosphere
<micahg> tumbleweed: http://jeremy.bicha.net/2012/01/10/accidental-dput-upload/
<tumbleweed> ah, right I also did that [DEFAULT] hack
<tumbleweed> that's recommended in several places
<broder> i hadn't actually heard of doing that until jbicha posted that
<broder> but i still type "dput ubuntu" as something of a finger macro
<tumbleweed> but more recently, after an accidental upload of pypy to unstable (sbuild generated a .changes file with Distribution: unstable, even though the changelog said experimental, because I accidentally used a sid chroot)
<tumbleweed> I added a dput wrapper that checks for that
<tumbleweed> I've been meaning to extend it...
 * micahg wishes backportpackage would have an option to do -S -sd
<tumbleweed> there's a bug report on getting -sd / -sa right
<micahg> probably filed by me :)
<broder> no, i think i filed it
<broder> i knew i got it wrong when i wrote the script but couldn't figure out how to fix it reasonably
<micahg> nope, neither one of us :) Bug #691897
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 691897 in ubuntu-dev-tools (Ubuntu) "[backportpackage] detect if orig.tar.gz upload needed" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/691897
<ajmitch> filed awhile ago, too
#ubuntu-motu 2012-04-04
<ScottK> broder: This just means you should be doing more uploading to Debian.
<vibhav> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libgssapi-perl/+bug/935236 is fixed in Debian
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 935236 in libgssapi-perl (Ubuntu Precise) "libgssapi-perl version 0.28-1build2 FTBFS on i386 in precise" [High,New]
<vibhav> Should I sync or prepare a debdiff?
<micahg> vibhav: does it need an FFe for the sync?
<vibhav> micahg: i dont know
<micahg> well, it's unseeded with 2 reverse-dependencies, so sync would be preferable
<micahg> but check if it needs an FFe
<vibhav> I did not understand what you just said :(
<micahg> it also depends on if the new version needs other things pulled in
<micahg> !ffe | vibhav
<ubottu> vibhav: Feature Freeze Exception. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess for the freeze exception process.
<vibhav> micahg: I know what is a FFe
<vibhav> The "unseeded with 2 reverse-dependencies"
<vibhav> part
<micahg> vibhav: not on any images and only 2 other packages use it
<vibhav> micahg: from where did you know that?
<micahg> vibhav: seeded-in-ubuntu and reverse-depends (2 tools in ubuntu-dev-tools)
<vibhav> ah
<vibhav> So I shall request a sync
<micahg> well, it's not fixed, it's disabled, but that's fine
<micahg> was it decided if hardening enablement needs an FFe or not?
<RAOF> Sounds like a feature (but a pretty safe one) to me.
<micahg> vibhav: I forgot to ask if it builds :)
<vibhav> micahg: Doing it right now
<micahg> vibhav: already replied to your bug
<vibhav> ah
<vibhav> The Ill prepare a debdiif, right?
<micahg> vibhav: yeah, that'll work, just make sure it builds first :)
<vibhav> micahg: I just need to add the patch to debian/patches/ right? (And not modify the source instead)
<micahg> vibhav: and update the debian/patches/series file
<vibhav> ok
<vibhav> uploaded packages, hopes that it builds :)
<micahg> it's a quick package
<vibhav> "start is 24 minutes"
<vibhav> drat, Ill use pbuilder
<micahg> vibhav: right, a local build should be quick
<vibhav> Till now, its fine
<vibhav> dependencies have been installed
<vibhav> done!
 * vibhav attaches debdiff
<vibhav> micahg: Done :)
<vibhav> Could it be backported to oneiric?
<vibhav> micahg: And please review the debdiff
<micahg> vibhav: does an oneiric build fail the same way?
<vibhav> micahg: Not sure, let me ask somebody
<micahg> vibhav: why were you asking me about oneiric?
<vibhav> micahg: Never MInd
<vibhav> I thought/window 7
<vibhav> oops :)
<dholbach> good morning
<ajmitch> morning dholbach
<dholbach> hey ajmitch
<geser> Hi dholbach and ajmitch
<dholbach> hey geser
<vibhav> micahg: ping
<micahg> vibhav: pong
<vibhav> micahg: Did you check my debdiff
<micahg> vibhav: no, I'm working on other things
<vibhav> ah fine
<vibhav> dholbach: Do you have some free time?
<vibhav> kdebase is not present in oneiric and precise
<vibhav> How can it be brought into the distros
<geser> why? what's the problem?
<vibhav> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/kdebase
<vibhav> Its only present in Natty, maverick, lucid and harfy
<vibhav> hardy*
<geser> "In oneiric kdebase source was renamed kde-baseapps" (lp: #814411)
<vibhav> ah
<vibhav> thanks
<vibhav> LP: #814411
<mfisch> tumbleweed: Whet did you mean in your comment for 959347, "It also doesn't close this bug"
<tumbleweed> the changelog entry doesn't include LP: #959347
<mfisch> tumbleweed: oh, ok
<mfisch> tumbleweed: why is the version 0.3.8-0ubuntu1 when we no longer have any patches in there?
<mfisch> is it always 0ubuntu1 for us?
<tumbleweed> mfisch: firstly, it's not a native package so it neends to be dash something
<tumbleweed> http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-controlfields.html#s-f-Version
<tumbleweed> the first upload in debian will be -1. We want to get that when its available, so we want something that sorts before it
<tumbleweed> we also want it to be clear that its an ubuntu modification
<tumbleweed> so we use -0ubuntu1 whenever grabbing new upstream versions and leapfrogging debian
<mfisch> tumbleweed: got it, thx
<astraljava> Hi gang, I'm building ubuntustudio-meta on my precise pbuilder, and stumbled upon a few warnings:
<astraljava> dpkg-gencontrol: warning: Recommends field of package ubuntustudio-graphics: unknown substitution variable ${germinate:Recommends}
<astraljava> I couldn't find much info regarding that variable on dpkg-gencontrol documentation, but I admit I may not know where to look. Any pointers, anyone?
<mfisch> tumbleweed: new debdiff incoming
<Laney> astraljava: that usually means that nothing has put any information into that substvar
<Laney> if that's intentional then you don't need to worry
<astraljava> Laney: Ok, I'll ignore it for now. Thanks!
<jtaylor> yey got a reply from upstream wanting the modified files instead of patches :/
<jtaylor> thats a good sign
<nigelb> jtaylor: Looks like they have a great way to track changes :D
#ubuntu-motu 2012-04-05
<toabctl> ScottK, i'm trying to setup a ppa for bug #972104 but i have no idea how i should sync the python-django package from debian into my ppa. should i just download the package from debian and copy the debian/changelog and fix the changelog with a new entry?!
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 972104 in python-django (Ubuntu) "Sync python-django 1.4-1 (main) from Debian sid (main)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/972104
<Adri2000> toabctl: copying a package from debian to a PPA is possible using copy-ppa-package available at https://code.launchpad.net/~soren/ubuntu-archive-tools/ppa-mgmt
<toabctl> Adri2000, thx
<dholbach> good morning
<iulian> G'morning dholbach.
 * iulian goes downstairs to make some tea.
 * Laney woofs
<dholbach> mmmh tea
<dholbach> hey iulian, hi Laney
<Laney> alright?
<RainCT> morning all :)
<ScottK> toabctl: Yes, but use a lower version number like 1.4-1~ppa1.
<komputes> Hi MOTU folks. Quick question: mypasswordsafe was available in oneiric/universe but is not available precise/universe.
<komputes> does anyone know why?
<micahg> komputes: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mypasswordsafe/+changelog
 * komputes looks
<komputes> micahg: cheers. that explains it, although I'm still looking up the meaning of RoQA and NPOASR
<micahg> komputes: http://ftp-master.debian.org/removals.txt
<komputes> micahg: lovely, thanks
<micahg> MTecknology: FYI, http://askubuntu.com/questions/119274/does-ubuntu-generally-post-timely-security-updates (people are asking about nginx)
<MTecknology> micahg: I'm planning on doing what I can to hammer it out once I get home, but some help would be much appreciated from anyone
<micahg> MTecknology: wasn't saying that you had to do it, I just know you have an interest in it :)
<MTecknology> I'm not sure who else actually has enough interest in it to take care of it...
#ubuntu-motu 2012-04-06
<Whoopie> broder: Hi, could you perhaps have a look at bug 898003? I added a usbip package to my testing PPA, but I'm not sure if it meets the requirements, especially the version number. Thanks!
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 898003 in usbip (Ubuntu) "usbip source is maintained in kernel tree now" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/898003
<hrw> hi
<hrw> how to mention LP bug number in changelog to not get it closed on upload?
<iulian> The bug number without LP in front of it? I haven't tried it but it should work I reckon.
<iulian> For instance, `Changes here. #123456'. Or you could also try `Changes here. Bug 123456'.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 123456 in xine-lib (Ubuntu) "podcast crashes amarok" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/123456
<iulian> I personally use that when I mention upstream bug reports.
<mr_pouit> or remove Launchpad-Bugs-Fixed from the .changes
<arand> Does it not need to be "LP #123456"?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 123456 in xine-lib (Ubuntu) "podcast crashes amarok" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/123456
<arand> Since otherwise it would refer to the Debian BTS..?
<arand> Oh... Nevermind, misread >_<
<hrw> mr_pouit: thx, will do this
<hrw> I prefer to not use #bugnumber as I feel that this is for Debian bts
<micahg> hrw: just don't add the colon (i.e. LP #XXXXXX)
<micahg> like arand mentioned I see
<hrw> ok
* tumbleweed changed the topic of #ubuntu-motu to: Precise: Archive frozen, but still open season for unseeded package bug fixing | Want to get involved with the MOTU? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing | Sponsor queue: http://bit.ly/fz6AyQ | http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/ftbfs | http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/NBS | http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/bugs/rcbugs/ | Fix-It Friday: http://pad.ubuntu-uk.org/KljH7rwo1X
<tumbleweed> Laney: better?
<Laney> ye, looks good
<Rhonda> Anyone got a hint what's needed when moving a conffile from one package to another one?  I have a gut feeling that having a Replaces isn't enough
<Laney> preserving user changes
<Laney> there's dpkg-maintscript-helper though
<Rhonda> Sure, that's a different topic.
<Laney> different to "what's needed?"
<Rhonda> But I have a situation here where the file still seems to be registered with the old package and I wonder why  :/
<Laney> there's something to do with conffiles sticking around later than usual
<Rhonda> hmm, in the replaced package there is the snippet about removing the obsolete conffile â¦
<Amoz> hi, i've got a fix for a bug in Precise, should I just subscribe ubuntu-release to the bug and link my fix (it's in a ppa) to the bug?
<Laney> dpkg won't remove them for you, yeah
<Laney> Amoz: bug fixes don't need release approval, please seek sponsorship as normal
<Laney> diff or branch is easier than ppa
<Amoz> Laney, like this? https://launchpadlibrarian.net/100361095/pidgin_1%3A2.10.2-1ubuntu2_1%3A2.10.3-0ubuntu1.diff.gz
<Amoz> hm. I should probably do a debdiff
<Laney> that is a seeded package
<Amoz> meaning?
<Laney> but new upstream version â .diff.gz or branch
<Laney> meaning that it needs a bit more review
<Laney> should be ok though
<Amoz> it fixes the "contacts not going offline" bug
<Laney> yep
<Amoz> okay I'll put it in a branch and propose it
<Amoz> and follow the normal sponsorship process?
<Amoz> subscribe ubuntu-sponsors to the bug, that's it?
<Laney> yeah
<Laney> mention that you tested it fixes the bug
<Amoz> I will
<geser> does someone remember what the build fix for "rsvg: command not found" was?
<jtaylor> geser: use rsvg-convert
<jtaylor> see unison
<valdur55> Hey. I fixed two items on upstream source. What i should do?
<geser> Ubuntu Mobile Edition is gone, right?
<ockham> what would be the hard deadline for syncing a new version of ocrfeeder (that's not ready yet) which fixes an important bug when using tesseract 3.0? http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=661499
<ubottu> Debian bug 661499 in ocrfeeder "ocrfeeder: Interprets Tesseract's version string as part of the OCRed text" [Normal,Open]
<Laney> why do you want to wait until a hard deadline?
<Laney> the sooner the better.
<ockham> i know -- i've already added a comment to the upstream bug https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=670953 -- but it hasn't been fixed yet, so i thought telling them about a deadline might speed up things ;-)
<ubottu> Gnome bug 670953 in general "Tesseract 3.02 issues" [Major,Resolved: fixed]
<ockham> (my comment is #12)
<valdur55> I fixed #972259  and #972205 on upstream version control system. What i should now do? Should i make patch for downstream ?
<Laney> ockham: the really final deadline is april 24
<geser> valdur55: if you want to see it fixed now, then yes (instead of waiting till a new upstream release, see it packaged in Debian and synced to Ubuntu)
<ockham> Laney: ok. maybe i can think of some comment to ask for a fix for easter...
<Laney> you could take a look at the code yourself :P
<hrw> ok, time to generate arm{el,hf}-cross-toolchain-base 1.80 and upload
<ockham> Laney: well, upstream already said he was going to take care of it, and i'd be much slower, i fear...
<hrw> done. now all in hands of buildders... (but it built fine in pbuilder here)
<ockham> will it also be possible to sync a new version (0.4.4) of a package (ocropus) whose previous version (0.3.x) has been removed from Precise (due to incompatibilities with tesseract 3.0) until the 24th?
<ockham> (somewhat similar situation -- the debian maintainer's still working on an FTBFS bug in a dependency...)
<Laney> possibly
<Laney> it all depends on whether someone can review the fix in time
<ockham> well, i hope it'll get done this weekend, too. if anyone cares, i'm talking about this bug: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=651402
<ubottu> Debian bug 651402 in src:iulib "iulib: FTBFS: Checking for inflate() in C library tiff... no" [Serious,Open]
<hrw> ockham: does this bug exists also in ubuntu?
<ockham> hrw: the iulib one?
<hrw> yes
<ockham> ubuntu doesn't have iulib 0.4.x, only 0.3.3
<hrw> ok
<Laney> you want us to bring in a new library?
<ockham> um, yeah. it's a dependency of ocropus 0.4.4
<Laney> hrm
<ockham> not good, at this time?
<Laney> it has a new SONAME, but apparently no rdepends
<Laney> might be ok
<ockham> yeah, i figured it was only used by ocropus
<ockham> with ocropus currently not in precise, it'd be pretty much useless, wouldn't it?
<Laney> as far as the archive is concerned
<Laney> others may be using it
<ockham> true
<ockham> so i'll hope for that bug to get fixed soonish, then test the new ocropus and file a sync request/FFe?
<Laney> hrw: it will exist in ubuntu when the FTBFS is fixed (at least, that is ockham's plan)
<Laney> ockham: yes, for both packages
<ockham> ok
<hrw> problem may be in scons itself
<ockham> well, as for the FTBFS bug, i think it's largely solved; or do you mean the symbols?
<hrw> ah, right - there was a patch
 * hrw shuts up
<hrw> for me it looks like test for tiff is broken. It checks for existance of tiff.h (which is fine) and is using 'inflate()' from zlib
<hrw> http://code.google.com/p/iulib/issues/detail?id=27 has fix
<valdur55> Ok, I made patch with  [ hg diff -g -r r1 -r r2 > fix.patch ] command output is here: http://paste.ubuntu.com/917450/ . What next?
<broder> Whoopie: i just started a new job, so i don't currently have the time to do anything for ubuntu other than skim irc once a day or so
<tumbleweed> broder: how is stripe? are they letting you go to UDS?
<valdur55> i have binary files on my diff.
<valdur55> Lol.. my first package build is failed :P.... damn.. bad patch ...
<EtienneG> hello everyone
<EtienneG> I would like to know if it is too late to request that nsscache 0.21.17-2 be synced from Debian testing
<ScottK> If it's a bug fix no.
<ScottK> If it's more than that, we can talk.
<EtienneG> the version in precise (0.8.8-1) is awfully out of date, and it would be good to fix bug #901701
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 901701 in nsscache (Ubuntu) "nsscache syntax error in /usr/share/pyshared/nss_cache/lock_test.py " [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/901701
<EtienneG> (which is really just cosmetic, but still)
<EtienneG> ScottK, thing is: I am not sure why 0.8.8-1 was brought in precise, given it is so dated (2009)
<EtienneG> I am neither upstream nor the Debian maintainer, I am just interested in that package
<ScottK> OK.
<ScottK> Please have a look at the changes and see if there's feature changes and if so, file an FFe.
<EtienneG> ScottK, ok, I will file an FFe.  I am just surprised that we didn't synced 0.21.17-2 or -1 (or even 0.21.16-something) in the first place.
<EtienneG> ScottK, actually, it seems like this package was uploaded for the first time in precise.  Would a sync still require an FFe?  That seems overkill.
<ScottK> EtienneG: Yes.
<EtienneG> ScottK, ok then!
<ScottK> That will make it easier to get approved since there's no regression risk, but FFe is still needed.
<EtienneG> ScottK, filed as bug #975373, thanks a lot for the guidance!  :)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 975373 in nsscache (Ubuntu) "FFe: Sync nsscache 0.21.17-2 (universe) from Debian testing (main)" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/975373
<valdur55> :D again fail with packaging... i have cloned upstream source and i wan't build PPA from it...
<broder> tumbleweed: definitely having a lot of fun so far, but also feel like it's going to take a while to legitimately get spun up. i will absolutely be at UDS
#ubuntu-motu 2012-04-07
<highvoltage> nice.
<alkisg> Hi, I've a problem with start-stop-daemon, i.e. I'm probably using the wrong arguments and it tries to run the service even though it's already running, what am I doing wrong?
<alkisg> start-stop-daemon --start --oknodo --exec "$DAEMON" --pidfile "$PIDFILE" --test -- --pidfile "$PIDFILE" --logfile "$LOGFILE" epoptes
<alkisg> Would start /usr/bin/twistd --pidfile /var/run/epoptes.pid --logfile /var/log/epoptes.log epoptes .
<alkisg> # ps -fC twistd
<alkisg> UID        PID  PPID  C STIME TTY          TIME CMD
<alkisg> root      1435     1  0 09:20 ?        00:00:00 /usr/bin/python /usr/bin/twistd --pidfile /var/run/epoptes.pid --logfile /var/log/epoptes.log
<vibhav> Can anybody here help me in packaging a python program?
<tumbleweed> vibhav: sure
<tumbleweed> broder: :)
<Laney> Setting up libomxil-bellagio0 (0.9.3-1ubuntu1) ...
<Laney> env: omxregister-bellagio: No such file or directory
<Laney> oops
<Laney> sigh, that's a circular depends introduced by an Ubuntu change
<Laney> l3on: you last merged this package, can you take a look?
#ubuntu-motu 2012-04-08
<swick> hi, can someone tell me why there is no xvidcap for ubuntu 12.04 anymore?
<JontheEchidna> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/precise/+source/xvidcap/1.1.7-0.2ubuntu12
<geser> Laney, l3on: see also bug #921523
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 921523 in libomxil-bellagio (Ubuntu) "package libomxil-bellagio0 0.9.3-1ubuntu1 failed to install/upgrade: ErrorMessage: subprocess installed post-installation script returned error exit status 127" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/921523
<ajmitch> whoops, bitten by bug 969957 on upgrade, looks like a sync may fix it
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 969957 in libsamplerate (Ubuntu) "package libsamplerate0 0.1.8-1 failed to install/upgrade: Versuch, Â»/usr/share/man/man1/sndfile-resample.1.gzÂ« zu Ã¼berschreiben, welches auch in Paket samplerate-programs 0.1.7-3ubuntu1 ist" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/969957
<Laney> geser: indeed
<ajmitch> I guess we'd better get these upgrade failures fixed :)
<Laney> geser: syncing it
<Laney> i wonder why that's not on rcbugs
<Laney> ajmitch: any clue?
<ajmitch> Laney: about which package?
<Laney> libsamplerate
<Laney> ref debian bug #657414
<ajmitch> probably because it's in main
<ubottu> Debian bug 657414 in libsamplerate0 "libsamplerate0: fails to upgrade from squeeze - trying to overwrite ..." [Serious,Fixed] http://bugs.debian.org/657414
<Laney> also: up late?
<Laney> oh, it doesn't consider that?
 * ajmitch was going to ask about an FFe for that before syncing it, due to the hardening stuff
<Laney> also I didn't notice --- fancy syncing? :-)
<ajmitch> up late, *still* dist-upgrading to precise :)
<ajmitch> I'd be happy to sync it, but I'd need to test it first :)
<Laney> I don't see hardening stuff in the diff
<Laney> oh yes I do
<Laney> $(shell dpkg-buildflags --export=configure) :-)
<ajmitch> ok
<ajmitch> I was only going by the changelog, I didn't look at the diff yet
<ajmitch> do you think that'd need an FFe?
 * ajmitch is being extra paranoid about it because it's close to release 
<Laney> I suppose so, yeah. I tested it and it seems OK though. But I thought I could upload so you'll have to do it again :P
 * Laney hands it over
<ajmitch> hah
<ajmitch> it is 2:30AM, so I'd better not do anything dangerous :)
<Laney> do you know why rcbugs doesn't cover main?
<ajmitch> probably because when it was written back in the dark ages it was only really intended for my use & then for MOTU?
<Laney> hrm
<ajmitch> shouldn't be hard to fix up
<Laney> lunchies, ttyl
 * ajmitch hacks it & sees if it breaks
<ajmitch> Laney: I think I'll need to improve the code somewhat for it to not be quite as horrible
<Rhonda> hmmm, bugfix update for wesnoth â¦
<ScottK> It would be nice if someone looked into gajim.  There's a new upload in Debian that fixes security issues, but it's need a merge and a check to see if an FFe is needed.
<geser> is the "do not touch" message on merges.u.c still valid?
#ubuntu-motu 2013-04-02
<dholbach> good morning
<iulian> Morning dholbach.
<dholbach> hey iulian
<Elfin> hello all
<Elfin> anyone have a link to the official changelog of 13.04?
<jtaylor> packages with ubuntu revisions (> 0ubuntu) are not removed automatically when they are removed in debian?
<jtaylor> I'm considering to fix cssed, but its orphand and dead upstream since 8 years, fixing it is probably a waste of time and may never get removed because I certainly will forget :)
#ubuntu-motu 2013-04-03
<ScottK> jtaylor: Your other option is file a removal bug.
<dholbach> good morning
<geser> good morning
<ScottK> New version of openmsx-catapult needs to be packaged to allow openmsx to transition from proposed.  FFe pre-granted if someone wants to work on it.
<jtaylor> ScottK: removal is an option, but on the other hand besides the easily fixed ftbfs there seems to be nothing wrong with it
<jtaylor> (re cssed)
<jtaylor> oh well with thinking about it probably wasted more time than necessary to fix it, yay me :)
<lfaraone> A new version of libhesiod0 (DNS-based directory information, used by MIT, CMU, and some other institutions) was released that adds IDN support, resolves issues with setuid users, and removes GPL-incompatible code. The MIT Athena team would really like to see it in Raring. Based on the changelog, http://sprunge.us/ZKEN , is this likely to be approved for a FFe?
<lfaraone> ScottK: and before you ask, I'm talking with the fd about Barry :)
<ScottK> jtaylor: Sure.
<ScottK> lfaraone: I hope "talking with FD" isn't something ominious.
<lfaraone> filed as LP: #1164044
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1164044 in hesiod (Ubuntu) "FFe: Sync hesiod 3.2.1-1 (main) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1164044
<ScottK> lfaraone: Look at the output of reverse-depends -b libhesiod-dev and tell me (in the bug) what teting you've done with them.
<lfaraone> ScottK: will do.
<ScottK> If the answer is "not tested" you odds go way down.
<lfaraone> there's also some licencing stuff fixed here. previously libhesiod0 had 4-clause BSD code, which is... probably a problem since pidgin depends on it. (via libzephyr0)
<lfaraone> ScottK: we have tested some but not all of the reverse bin depends.
<ScottK> Right, I'm pretty open to approve it as long as you've tested stuff.
<ScottK> Elbrus: I don't mind sync'ing motif into raring.  If you can get someone to do the initial sync, I'll push it through New (count this as your FFe approval).
<Elbrus> ScottK: great, so I just have to find a motu to sync when motif becomes available?
<ScottK> Elbrus: yes.
<Elbrus> I think I already know somebody...
<Elbrus> ScottK: actually, we are already slightly further in the packaging of motif (collab-maint), if I upload a newer version soon, would that also do?
<ScottK> If you upload it to Debian, yes.
<Elbrus> ok.
<chilicuil> hi there, I'm trying to test a package on pbuilder, but I'm unable because pbuilder doesn't mount sysfs by default, do you know of any way to add sysfs to the fs pbuilder mounts?
<RAOF> chilicuil: You could add it to the list of bind-mounts; I know how to do that with sbuild, but I've forgotten how to do that with pbuilder.
<chilicuil> RAOF: thanks for the fast reply!, that's all need, I'll look further at it
<maxb> ~/.pbuilderrc is a shell fragment, and is probably where you want to do this (unless you only want it as a one-off)
<chilicuil> maxb: yep, I've edit it, the exact syntax was, BINDMOUNTS="/first/path /additional/path" , pretty simple =)
#ubuntu-motu 2013-04-04
<dholbach> good morning
<geser> good morning
<philipballew> greetings geser
<dholbach> who speaks German in here? :)
 * ogra_ hides
<dholbach> just a quick heads-up - the packaging guide is up to 58% of German translations now! https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu-packaging-guide/
<dholbach> if we get it up to 70% it'll be good enough to get it up on developer.u.c (and packaged as well)
<dholbach> just a few strings a day and we'll be done real-soon-now
<benonsoftware> dholbach: I'm currently learning German but don't know enough to be useful. :P
<dholbach> benonsoftware, Sehr gut! Viel GlÃ¼ck! :)
<benonsoftware> dholbach: dDanke!
<dholbach> :-)
<geser> dholbach: you should find many Germans in #ubuntu-de :)
<dholbach> yeah, you too :-D
<dholbach> brb
<Corey> Who runs the Ubuntu MOTU mailing list?
<mitya57> Corey: see in the bottom of https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-motu
<Corey> mitya57: Thanks!
#ubuntu-motu 2013-04-05
<dholbach> good morning
 * Laney returns from hols
<Laney> tumbleweed: did you check that thing out? ;-)
<tumbleweed> Laney: no
<Laney> fair
<tumbleweed> I also haven't looked at the data for seeded-in-ubuntu which has been spamming me for two weeks
<tumbleweed> apparently we changed the structure of cdimage...
 * Laney applies the delete hammer to 95% of his new mail
 * tumbleweed has just been pushing through to the end of a work project. it hasn't left much energy
<Guest43393> got a general question here: if i download (or create my own) source package. What is actually the command to build it ?! :-?
<tumbleweed> Guest43393: debuild
<tumbleweed> (but a lot of the time you want to build in a chroot, rather than on your machine - so look at pbuilder-dist or sbuild too)
<Guest43393> ok. thanks mate.
<TheLordOfTime> am i still able to get a bugfix into raring for a package in universe?
<TheLordOfTime> (the bug priority is high)
<jtaylor> sure
<TheLordOfTime> jtaylor, i just uploaded the debdiff, and since it's an out-of-the-box-config usability bug, i'm tryin to get this included quickly.  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nginx/+bug/1162177
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1162177 in nginx (Ubuntu) "nginx-light: invalid parameter "ipv6_only=on"" [High,In progress]
<TheLordOfTime> (there's a duplicate of that bug too, already marked as a dupe_
<TheLordOfTime> (sponsors already subscribed, I think...)
<TheLordOfTime> ... you know what, i'm surprised I haven't filed for PPU rights for nginx yet... it seems a decent number of the recent debdiffs to fix things've come from me (or been brought in from upstream patches)
<TheLordOfTime> (sorry, minor offtopic, but still :P)
<geser> TheLordOfTime: if you're responsible for preparing most of the recent nginx uploads, you could get PPU rights for nginx.
<geser> Try talking to your sponsors if they think you're ready (and ask them to comment on your PPU application)
<TheLordOfTime> geser, i only prep them for ubuntu, not debian, and most of it's patches, would that still qualify?  (note: i'm still only half done with my PPU application xD)
<TheLordOfTime> geser, i've been actively considering.  Question though, can security debdiffs and patches count towards that as well, or just standard patches/debdiffs?
<geser> TheLordOfTime: sure, if you want upload right to Ubuntu you need to have uploads in Ubuntu (either directly or sync of your sponsored changes in Debian)
<geser> TheLordOfTime: they count too.
<geser> You need to show that you know enough packaging to handle the package(s) you ask PPU rights for and also that you have some process knowledge (e.g. when not to upload (freezes), how the SRU process works, etc.)
<TheLordOfTime> geser, i don't have any Debian patches for the package, but I've worked with SRU and upload freezes before.
<TheLordOfTime> not just on nginx, so i'm relatively fluent in those.
<TheLordOfTime> geser, and i'm smart enough to check when a freeze is in place to ask whether a bugfix can get in during said freeze(s) (case in point: the bug i referenced)
 * TheLordOfTime yawns
<TheLordOfTime> ... note to self: twenty hours of work in a 12 hour day... bad...
<TheLordOfTime> geser, i assume the PPU procedure is the same as it was a few months ago when I started considering applying for PPU rights for nginx?
<geser> you do you co-maintain the nginx package with Debian or is a complete fork? just curious
<TheLordOfTime> PPU application procedure*
<TheLordOfTime> geser, i don't maintain the Debian side of things, I do most of the patch work for the Ubuntu packages though
<geser> I'm not in the DMB anymore but I doubt the procedures has changed much (if at all)
<TheLordOfTime> my concern is that i don't maintain the Debian packages at all, apparently they dump the Ubuntu stuff (as well as bug management for the nginx package) on me.
<geser> working with Debian isn't a strict requirement, but still nice to see
<geser> there is no requirement to also maintain the package in Debian
<geser> it's enough if you work on the Ubuntu package
<_hc> I'm a Debian Developer, we recently pushed a critical fix to wheezy and unstable, and I'd like to make sure this fix gets included in raring.  The easiest way to do this would just be to update the currently included version 0.6.3-5 to the version in debian/unstable: 0.6.3-6
<_hc> shall I file a bug report on this?  what should I include on that bug report?  I'm new to this particular process, tho I've submitted bugs to launchpad before
<geser> _hc: yes, you can use requestsync from the ubuntu-dev-tools package for it (it's also include in Debian)
<_hc> thanks, I'll try that, rebooting back to Ubuntu now :)
<jtaylor> it should work from debian too
<_hc> I'm actually in Mac OS X nowâ¦ where I spent about 10% of my time.  My day-to-day is in Linux Mint, so basically ubuntu.  I think there are a number of Debian Developers who work out of Debian-derivs
<_hc> the Apple Mail program is the last thing that keeps me rebooting, maybe Geary will change that
<_hc> reboot brb
<_hc> ok, I got the requestsync posted: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/olsrd/+bug/1165191  Is there something like "Release Critical" bug tag in Launchpad?  The issue that we fixed was that the program wasn't working on non-i386 platforms, so its severe on those platforms.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1165191 in olsrd (Ubuntu) "Sync olsrd 0.6.3-6 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,New]
<jtaylor> _hc: which versions of ubuntu does it affect?
<jtaylor> _hc: might be worth doing a stable release update https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates
<_hc> jtaylor: it affects quantal and raring for sure, and probably oneiric and precise
<_hc> raring is the easiest fix, just take 0.6.3-5 to 0.6.3-6.  what's the Ubuntu policy on bigger updates? like for quantal, would it be acceptable to do an SRU for quantal from 0.6.3-3 to 0.6.3-6?
<_hc> otherwise, I'd have to prepare separate updates for precise, quantal, and raring
<jtaylor> depends on how invasive the changes are
<jtaylor> for quantal we only need the -6 diff it seems
<jtaylor> if precise is affected it might be easier to go over backports
<_hc> yeah, I think backports makes more sense there
<_hc> jtaylor: yeah, for quantal, the 5->6 diff should work
<jtaylor> hm good it has no reverse depends
<jtaylor> that makes backports easy
<_hc> yeah, its a routing daemon
<_hc> but we're working on all sorts of fun stuff that depends on it, to make mesh networking really easy to use :)
<jtaylor> you can request one with requestbackport if you think its worth it
<_hc> yeah, I do actually, I haven't done backports on Ubuntu, so it would be interesting. I have for debian.
<jtaylor> its more painful in ubuntu than debian :/
<jtaylor> much more painful
<jtaylor> if you have rdepends, without its fine
<_hc> yeah, no rdepends
<jtaylor> ubuntu policy is everything must be tested and nothing must break, not even builds
<_hc> so to backport, should I wait until 0.6.3-6 is in raring?
<jtaylor> yes
<_hc> ok
<jtaylor> I'll have a look right now
<_hc> excellent, thanks :-D
<jtaylor> can you provide a simple testcase that can be used to verify its fixed?
<_hc> it would require two computers with wifi
<_hc> basically run '/usr/sbin/olsrd-adhoc-setup wlan0'
<_hc> actually 'sudo /usr/sbin/olsrd-adhoc-setup wlan0'
<_hc> then 'sudo /usr/sbin/olsrd -i wlan0 -d 1'
<_hc> should I add this to a bug report?
<_hc> its non-trivial, unfortnately, but no too hard
<_hc> the debian package has been well tested, and we've been testing it on our PPA, so I would be shocked if it didn't work once it becomes an official Ubuntu update
<_hc> here's the PPA https://launchpad.net/~guardianproject/+archive/commotion/+packages
<jtaylor> weird issue that was fixed
<jtaylor> doesn't the compiler warn about this?
<jtaylor> something like taking adress of temporary
<_hc> I guess not, it seems like it should have
<_hc> most of the upstream devs run -Werror...
<jtaylor> which won't help if Wall is not on :/
<jtaylor> oh it is just no verbose log
<jtaylor> it would be good if the package builds with make VERBOSE=1
<jtaylor> verbose logs are very helpful when you want to check some issues
<_hc> it should be now, in the latest version 0.6.3-6
<jtaylor> oh good, I just looked at the ubuntu build log which is still -5 :)
<jtaylor> _hc: synced, could you verify the fix on quantal? then I#ll do an SRU
<jtaylor> fixing it in precise via an SRU would also be pretty easy, but maybe also not necessary as it has an older compiler
<_hc> jtaylor: sure, I can verify the fix for quantal, do you mean test the package?
<jtaylor> check if its affected and the patch fixes it
<_hc> yes, its affected, and yes, the patch fixes it
<_hc> the bug was introduced upstream before 0.6.2 and was fixed in 0.6.4, and that fix is the patch in 0.6.3-6
<jtaylor> yes but if its really broken depends on the compiler
<_hc> it was broken on quantal in my 0.6.3-5 uploads to the PPA and then fixed with the 0.6.3-6 uploads to that PPA
<jtaylor> and in precise?
<_hc> I haven't specifically tested there
<_hc> let me double check that, since I'm on precise
<_hc> I do know that 0.6.3-6 works well on precise, since I use the PPA
<jtaylor> what happens after sudo /usr/sbin/olsrd -i wlan0 -d 1 if its broken?
<_hc> I'll have to test whether the precise version is affected.  But I think a backport would be worthwhile anyway, since there have been big improvements in the packaging
<_hc> the olsrd on each computer should start talking to each other, and setting up routes on each computer
<_hc> if the olsrd is affected by the bug, that never happens
<jtaylor> I think the patch is simple enough to be SRU'd to precise in addition to a backport
#ubuntu-motu 2013-04-06
<_hc> jtaylor: I forget, did you say you'd SRU the patch from 0.6.3-6 to the quantal package?
<_hc> or should I do that?
<cleeming[foxx]> hi all.. so after fighting with debian packaging for a while, I figured that id give ubuntu another try as a desktop.. the first thing that really gets me is that there isnt a simple thing like being able to edit the font sizes out of the box.. i had to spend 5 minutes googling, then i had to install gnome-tweak-tool.. this sort of thing used to just work out of the box. why has this been
<cleeming[foxx]> changed?
<cleeming[foxx]> and also, what is with this big side bar on the left hand side? and why when im searching for the word "terminal" do i get shown "terminal 4 - terminal 4" @ Â£7.92
<cleeming[foxx]> it seems a million miles away from what ubuntu used to be 4 years ago :X
<TheLordOfTime> cleeming[foxx]:  the bar at the left is called "Unity"
<TheLordOfTime> when you search for the word "terminal" the shopping lens i think is picking it up as well.
<cleeming[foxx]> i thought unity was that cube thing, the unity3d multi desktop stuff
<cleeming[foxx]> ah, i just found this; https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2012/10/privacy-ubuntu-1210-amazon-ads-and-data-leaks
<TheLordOfTime> cleeming[foxx]:  http://unity.ubuntu.com/
<TheLordOfTime> cleeming[foxx]:  you can disable the online search stuff though
<cleeming[foxx]> ahhh, i hadnt seen the unity url before.. ill have a read now, ty
<TheLordOfTime> http://askubuntu.com/questions/192269/how-can-i-remove-amazon-search-results-from-the-dash
<TheLordOfTime> (sorry about dumping this in -motu, MOTUs.)
<cleeming[foxx]> should i be using a diff channel to talk about this sort of thing?
<cleeming[foxx]> if so my apologies, id used ubuntu-motu before for packaging problems, and everyone was very helpful, so figured it would be the best place to ask
<TheLordOfTime> the questions you just asked weren't packaging problems though
 * TheLordOfTime shurgs
<TheLordOfTime> i'm not a MOTU, i'm just a bugs triager and part-time packager :P
<cleeming[foxx]> got it
<cleeming[foxx]> well, i figured if i asked in #ubuntu, i wouldnt get any quality of response
<TheLordOfTime> i ask my packaging questions here,  and occasionally poke here for getting a sponsor for the universe packages i submit debdiffs for when the bug is "High" priority (unless i'm told otherwise)
<cleeming[foxx]> this might sound like an absolutely stupid question but... would it be considered normal if i was to replace the unity window manager? i.e. is that what most people do?
<jtaylor> I wouldn't say most, but many do
<TheLordOfTime> i didn't
<TheLordOfTime> but for me it's irrelevant:
<TheLordOfTime> most of what I do is command line anyways
<cleeming[foxx]> well exactly, i only wanted ubuntu as a simple terminal window manager.. was considering putting in openbox instead
<jtaylor> there is lubuntu
<cleeming[foxx]> *googles*
<jtaylor> I think it uses openbox or fluxbox
<cleeming[foxx]> oh nice
<cleeming[foxx]> that looks quite clean.. is it kept as up to date as ubuntu?
<jtaylor> so far I  know its jsut ubuntu with different default
<cleeming[foxx]> fluxbox ah yeah i used that too
<jtaylor> packages should be the same
<cleeming[foxx]> nice, thanks man, ill give that a try.. sorry for flooding -motu with user questions, will refrain from it in future!
 * cleeming[foxx] just found where i should have asked these questions.. #ubuntu-offtopic !
#ubuntu-motu 2013-04-07
<mitya57> Rhonda: hey, did you receive my packages.u.c patch?
#ubuntu-motu 2014-03-31
<dholbach> good morning
<j_f-f> guten Morgen..
#ubuntu-motu 2014-04-01
<dholbach> good morning
<l3on> Hello .. someone here could review this ? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/1299015
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1299015 in Ubuntu "[needs-packaging] FFe: please package fluxbox-light-themes" [Wishlist,New]
<l3on> thanks in advance!
<l3on> nevermind .. I will mail motu-list
#ubuntu-motu 2014-04-02
<dholbach> good morning
#ubuntu-motu 2014-04-03
<dholbach> good morning
<Laney> hallo
#ubuntu-motu 2014-04-04
<dholbach> good morning
#ubuntu-motu 2014-04-06
<scarneiro> Hi guys, I have a newbie question about merge proposals with UDD, would anyone help me,  please?
<Noskcaj> scarneiro, what is the question?
<scarneiro> Thanks Noskcaj ! My question is, how can I make a merge proposal against lp:ubuntu/trusty-proposed/aolserver4-nspostgres ?
<Noskcaj> scarneiro, Make the branch lp:~USER/ubuntu/trusty/aolserver4-nspostgres/MERGE and then change the merge target to lp:ubuntu/trusty-proposed/aolserver4-nspostgres
<scarneiro> Awesome! Thanks!
<scarneiro> I will try that. Thank you Noskcaj !
<Noskcaj> no problem. It's great to see someone new here
<scarneiro> Noskcaj: It worked, it is now under review. Thanks for the help, glad to be able to help. ;)
#ubuntu-motu 2015-03-30
<Unit193> micahg: Heya, feeling uploady?
<micahg> Unit193: maybe :)
<micahg> whatcha got?
<Unit193> Just still the xiphos one pending.
<micahg> ah, ok
<micahg> I haven't forgotten, just a bit harder to review a full update
<Unit193> Great, and sure.
<Unit193> Rest will have to wait for Wombat.
<dholbach> good morning
<teward> stupid question, but the packaging pros are here.  Question is as follows: Does `quilt import` accept a `-p1` argument like the `patch` command does?  Github patches like to fail when pulling them in for some packages (also applies to hg upstream patches as well and such for nginx on occasion), so i'm trying to figure out a way to NOT have to redo the patches and make them by hand just to include in quilt.
<teward> are Ubuntu packages supposed to be lintian clean (per Debian policy)?
<Zhenech> debian has no such policy
<Zhenech> neither does ubuntu, afaik
<Zhenech> but a cleaner package is usually better ;)
<teward> well i had a debian package rejected solely on lintian complaints once so meh
<mdeslaur> teward: quilt does, but source format 3.0 doesn't support anything other then p1 I believe
<mdeslaur> teward: "quilt shell" is your friend
<mdeslaur> ie: quilt new newthing.patch, then do quilt shell, then manually apply patch with "patch -p0 < blahblah.patch", then exit, then quilt refresh
<Unit193> What "lintian complaints" though?
<micahg> teward: from reject FAQ (https://ftp-master.debian.org/REJECT-FAQ.html) "Lintian errors and warnings, without a good reason to ignore them, can get you a reject. Sometimes there are valid reasons, but then you should either file a bug against lintian if it's generally wrong, or include an override in your package, giving a reason in the changelog for it."
<teward> mdeslaur: i asked because the github patches need -p1 for `patch` - hence asking
<teward> (laziness prevails xD)
<mdeslaur> teward: p1 is the default for quilt and for sf3.0
<mdeslaur> quilt import blahblah.patch should just work
<teward> mdeslaur: it didn't seem to do that on quilt in trusty :/
<teward> i think maybe i have to do quilt import -p1 to make it recognize :
<teward> but meh
<teward> (ran into it for ZNC in a ppa)
<mdeslaur>   -p num - Number of directory levels to strip when applying (default=1)
 * teward shrugs
<teward> it didn't do that initially :/
<teward> oh well
<ScottK> teward: re lintian, it depends on the maintainer and exactly which lintian check is failing.
<teward> ScottK: so, in the case of 'Missing Man Page' for a package that doesn't need one, what'd be the evaluation there?  (Concurrently is there an override that can make it realize a manpage isn't needed)
<ScottK> teward: The override doesn't mean it's not needed.
<ScottK> Different maintainers feel differently about that one, but the Debian project as a whole tends to view all man pages as "needed".
<ScottK> I'd just write one and send it upstream.  They aren't that hard.
#ubuntu-motu 2015-03-31
<dholbach_> good morning
#ubuntu-motu 2015-04-02
<hallino1> dpm: ping
<dpm> hi hallino1
<hallino1> hi dpm, nice to know you, can I talk you in private for what Trevinho yesterday said to you please?
<dpm> sure
<hallino1> Thank you!
* FatBack changed the topic of #ubuntu-motu to: penis
* teward changed the topic of #ubuntu-motu to: Utopic released! | Want to get involved with the MOTU? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing | Sponsor queue: http://bit.ly/fz6AyQ | http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/ftbfs | http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/nbs.html | http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/bugs/rcbugs
#ubuntu-motu 2016-04-04
<dholbach> good morning
#ubuntu-motu 2016-04-05
<ngaio> I filed an freeze exception request: Bug #1566218 . Please let me know if any more details are needed.
<ubottu> bug 1566218 in gphoto2-cffi (Ubuntu) "freeze exception: change package name" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1566218
<roaksoax> /w/win 4
#ubuntu-motu 2016-04-06
<karstensrage> hi micahg
<karstensrage> I hope it's ok I assigned those backport bugs to you
<micahg> karstensrage: sure, just been a bit busy with other things
<karstensrage> micahg: absolutely understand
#ubuntu-motu 2016-04-08
<karstensrage> micahg: any chance you could get to it sometime next week?
<micahg> it's possible, this week has just been really busy
<karstensrage> I'll be back from vacation and can address any issues or questions
<micahg> ok, thanks
<Unit193> dholbach: Heh, you're younger than I thought too. :)
<dholbach> Unit193, what age did/do you think I am? :-)
<Unit193> Likely mid-upper 30s for some reason before.
<dholbach> mid-upper 30s is correct :)
<dholbach> I'm 37
<Unit193> Heh, well you look young then, congrats on that.
 * dholbach hugs Unit193 
<dholbach> thanks :)
#ubuntu-motu 2016-04-10
<quitte> Hi. this https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/binutils-arm-none-eabi/+bug/1568437 bug has as far as I can tell a very simple solution and would not affect anything but the arm-none-eabi toolchain: use the version from xenial.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1568437 in binutils-arm-none-eabi (Ubuntu) "binutils-arm-none-eabi version does not match gcc" [Undecided,New]
<karstensrage> micahg, im back  so any questions or issues with my backport requests, please let me know
#ubuntu-motu 2017-04-05
<chatter29> hey guys
<chatter29> allah is doing
<chatter29> sun is not doing allah is doing
<chatter29> to accept Islam say that i bear witness that there is no deity worthy of worship except Allah and Muhammad peace be upon him is his slave and messenger
#ubuntu-motu 2018-04-03
<ScottE> I could use some help in getting a package fixed for bionic, referring to launchpad #1755615 - the version of the PCP package in bionic (4.0.0-1) is currently seriously broken in that the package's daemons don't start. I submitted a patch to the upstream repo. That fix went into PCP 4.0.1 and is in debian sid (as 4.0.1-1). This is a universe package with no ubuntu specific changes. How can I help get the
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1755615 in pcp (Ubuntu) "PCP daemons do not start automatically for bionic" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1755615
<ScottE> new version into bionic?
<ScottE> It seems likely nobody else has discovered this, since the current bionic version is broken (artful has an older version that doesn't suffer from the same bug).
<persia> ScottE: You'd need to have someone with upload permissions to universe sync it from Debian.
<ScottE> OK, thanks persia - I wasn't sure exactly how it worked for this case (where there is no patch). Is this the right place, then, or should I ask in #ubuntu-release?
<persia> I *think* this is the right place, but I admit to not being familiar with current best practices.
<persia> There may also be a way to set the bug title just so, add the right comment, and subscribe the right team to get someone to look at it.
<persia> (search the wiki for sync)
<persia> It may be late enough in the cycle that some freeze exception documentation is necessary, but I also can't guide you on that.  Apologies for my limited utility in this matter.
<ScottE> Fair enough, thanks! I did a cursory look through the wiki, but let me look specifically around that keyword.
<ScottE> Yeah, no worries - I know it's late in the cycle. Thanks, I do appreciate your reply, and no apology necessary!
<persia> For people with the right permission, it's a button on LP.  The rest of us need to request it in the right way (and asking on this channel is usually a good way to get instructions how to do it)
<persia> Good luck!
<ScottE> Thank you!
<tsimonq2> ScottE: I'll take care of it, on the condition that I'm sponsoring it for you. ;)
<ScottE> Hi tsimonq2! Thanks, I do appreciate that sponsorship. I just updated the launchpad bug attempting to follow the process for sync plus freeze exception.
<ScottE> That was fast - I see it in the queue per #ubuntu-release
<tsimonq2> Yep. :)
<ScottE> Thank you again, I really appreciate it
<tsimonq2> No problem. :)
#ubuntu-motu 2018-04-04
<handsome_feng> tsimonq2: Hi, Do you know why the kylin-video been rejected?
<tsimonq2> handsome_feng: doko rejected it on the grounds of debian/copyright being incomplete.
<handsome_feng> tsimonq2: Thanks, I will check it then.
#ubuntu-motu 2019-04-05
<ebbex> Anyone got any tips on what settings I need to add to my "unprivileged" lxc container to allow pbuilder to run mknod?
<Kolargol00> Hi there! Can someone help me by sponsoring/reviewing a SRU and a backport requests?
<Kolargol00> https://launchpad.net/bugs/1822069, https://launchpad.net/bugs/1821888
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1822069 in xmltooling (Ubuntu) "SRU: Shibboleth SPv3 for bionic" [Undecided,New]
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1821888 in Xenial Backports "Please backport xerces-c 3.2.0+debian-2 (universe) from bionic" [Undecided,Confirmed]
#ubuntu-motu 2020-04-01
<handsome_feng> Hi, could someone help to upload qt5-ukui-platformtheme, it fix a crash bug, PPA: https://launchpad.net/~feng-kylin/+archive/ubuntu/ukui-debian , thanks in advance!
<RikMills> handsome_feng: sure
<handsome_feng> RikMills: Thanks! :)
<handsome_feng>  You can install kwin to get a more beautify UI, :)
#ubuntu-motu 2020-04-02
<Rhonda> http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/project/ doesn't seem to get updated with the current keyring file, has that moved?
<Rhonda> (tried to create me some chroots and noticed that it only works for xenial with that file)
<Unit193> FWIW, ubuntu-archive-keyring is a package in Debian.
<Rhonda> That would be cheating.  (darn, you're obviously right)
<Unit193> Someone even put the cloud and dbgsym keys in there.
