#ubuntu-discuss 2012-09-02
<bobo37773> acemeister: Hello.
<TechnodicT_> Ways the discusion?
<TechnodicT_> Hello room
<bobo37773> TechnodicT_: hey
<TechnodicT_> Hello ubuntu user!
<bobo37773> Nope. Used to. What Ubuntu version?
<TechnodicT_> 12.04 ltd ura?
<bobo37773> ah okay
<bobo37773> Why doesn't Ubuntu use a text boot instead of a grapical one? Seems pointless and endlessly problematic
<TechnodicT_> U quit ubuntu?
<bobo37773> yeah. using arch now probably switch to funtoo / gentoo soon
<TechnodicT_> Arch is always the best one..
<bobo37773> I used to think so but the more I learn about gentoo the more I am liking about it
<TechnodicT_> Have used it for a while...but  needed a stable system so switched
<bobo37773> used what? arch or gentoo?
<TechnodicT_> Arch..+ kde
<TechnodicT_> Gentoo couldn't even install..! Lol
<TechnodicT_> ?
<bobo37773> oh okay
<bobo37773> I have had the opposite experience as you
<TechnodicT_> As in?
<bobo37773> my arch install has been much more stable then I remember ubuntu
<bobo37773> sometimes there is special stuff you have to do but it is usually in the news feed
<TechnodicT_> Yes..
<TechnodicT_> Arch is still better than ubuntu...I guess
<bobo37773> well I don't know. better is a pretty subjective word. but I like it more for sure
<TechnodicT_> Yea
<bobo37773> all the old computers I refubish I am using crunchbang though. really easy and pleasant experience
<acemeister> hrey
<bobo37773> hrey!
<bobo37773> haha
<acemeister> How is Ubuntu better than windows aside from the security?
<acemeister> hi there
<bobo37773> I did not switch to gnu/linux for better security. It was just an added benefit
<bobo37773> I switched because of code transparency
<acemeister> what added benefit?
<acemeister> explain the code transperency please
<acemeister> how's it better?
<bobo37773> do you understand what closed and open source code means?
<bobo37773> meaning you do not have to blindly trust that the application developers have your best interests in mind.
<bobo37773> you can see the code yourself
<bobo37773> I do not trust microsoft or apple
<bobo37773> they are both in bed with those who would spy on and take advantage of me
<bobo37773> for no real reason other than to further control and their own selfish ends
<bobo37773> there is more to that story though.
<bobo37773> I guess it's important to understand the beginning if you are to understand the end / present
<bobo37773> Learn the origins of gnu/linux. Listen to people like richard stallman speak, etc.. You can find his videos on youtube and all over
<bobo37773> but yes I would definitely say that the operating system is inherantly more secure on many levels.
<bobo37773> To answer your question though more directly originally for me aircrack was all it took to get me to switch. when I realized this type of thing could never be done in windows because of how closed everything was I didn't look back
<bobo37773> they have probably made some more progress in that area but that is only one small example
<bobo37773> Why are you thinking about switching anyways? For security reasons?
<bobo37773> No one can make up your mind for you. Not only that but setting up a dual boot is a pretty simple thing these days
<bobo37773> alright I'm outta here
<bobo37773> take care guys'
<TechnodicT_> Bye
<TechnodicT_> Hii
<acemeister> i dont understand bobo
<acemeister> the downside is you cant run most games and apps that are compatible with windows
<acemeister> I don't dig apple either
<acemeister> And I don't like how they sell overpriced hardware for a sleek shine
<acemeister> they are the epitome of superficial pcs
<acemeister> comps
<acemeister> A pc should be built for function not artwork
<acemeister> I can design my own artwork and paint my chasis
<acemeister> why pay for the name
<acemeister> ubuntu is just as secure as mac os
<acemeister> why didnt ubuntu creator sell his os?
<acemeister> bill gates is overrated he stole an idea from another developer to create a brainless OS and wipes his ass with 100 bills
<acemeister> but how come linux didnt make anything
<TechnodicT_> Hello world
<acemeister> hey
<acemeister> the earth we call the world
<acemeister> and whats bad is evil and good is holy
<acemeister> and the brain is the mind
<acemeister> im so proud of a blank tape as a baby recording
<acemeister> I can't fanthom why the hell
<acemeister> please god if you're out there stop the pain
<acemeister> show yourself and dont let me suffer one mroe minute
<acemeister> Do you want to burn in hell?
<acemeister> lol
<acemeister> Windows XP has tourettes and gives me nightmares about burning in hell
<acemeister> I'm a brave soul but that was one fucked up nightmare
<acemeister> I swear to god i thoght i was being chopped up wtih a cahinsaw
<acemeister> I woke up sweating
<acemeister> and after I woke up even after 6 hours I was still afraid that someone was going to come busting through my door with chainsaws
<acemeister> I went in my room and pissed in a cup because I thought the robots inside the TV were trying to measure the frenquency of the piss hitting the cup
<TechnodicT_> Nice
<acemeister> drank the potion woke up the next morning
<acemeister> the piss was solid purple
<acemeister> You can drink piss and its perfectly sanitary
<acemeister> the indians drank it after their mushroom trips because all the psilocybin collects in the piss
<acemeister> they would dig holes and let all the contaminates evaporate so when they ran out of shrooms instead of going back to camp
<acemeister> just scrape all the pislocybin up and snort that shit
<acemeister> Ubuntu
<acemeister> Discuss
<acemeister> No one is discussing nayhting about it
<acemeister> prolly cause only 26 peeps
<acemeister> but I asked some legitimate questions
<acemeister> and no one cares
<acemeister> cant get help in windows
<acemeister> its free help
<acemeister> bad advice
<acemeister> No, I don't enjoy every response being countered with another useless question
<acemeister> the frogs copmletely seared my eyeballs out of freaking out with the wine right
<acemeister> its like being crushed by a crocodile dude
<acemeister> I just dont want to suffer im underneath a crushing blow
#ubuntu-discuss 2013-08-26
<anonym624> help
<anonym624> leph
<anonym624> hello all
<hrnz> hello
<anonym624> how do long use ubuntu
<hrnz> i don't
<hrnz> and i've never used ubuntu in my entire life
<anonym624> ok
<hrnz> why do you ask?
<anonym624> do you like ubuntu?
<hrnz> nope
<anonym624> and what do you like OS
<hrnz> debian, arch, gentoo, fedora, exherbo, funtoo
<anonym624> I like debian and arch too
<hrnz> that's nice.
#ubuntu-discuss 2013-08-27
<gavin19> hi
#ubuntu-discuss 2014-08-25
<Guest44384> hello
#ubuntu-discuss 2014-08-31
<salar> hi. i have a problem with my virtual machine...i used these commands to install kvm(   http://paste.ubuntu.com/8197258/    ) then when i run virtual machine manager and press create new virtual machine there is a warning saying : KVM is not available. this may mean the KVM package is not installed or the KVM kernel modules are not loaded. yout virtual machines may perform poorly.I have ubuntu 12.04 and Sony Vaio E Series VPCEA35FG, core i3-370M 2.4GHz
<salar>  4GB of ram
<salar> sry my msg didnt send completely.. i have a problem with virtual machine i used commands as link ablove and that error pops up
<hrnz> bb
<Lazza> Hello everybody
<Lazza> is this the right chan to discuss some suggestions for improvements in the default ubuntu configuration (regarding fonts) or should I switch to #ubuntu-devel?
#ubuntu-discuss 2015-08-24
<ObrienDave> has it become, let's troll #ubuntu with the most asinine situations we  can invent, day? ;P
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> i'm always amazed by these guests that i give commands, they don't realise that the commands spat out URLs that i need back
<Bashing-om> daftykins: Some need spoon (hand) feeding; you do it so well .
<daftykins> ;D
<ObrienDave> and a pat on the back and a kick in the butt LOL
<daftykins> "geroff my planet"
<ObrienDave> beam me up, scotty. there is NO intelligent life!
<Bashing-om> daftykins: Not only had fed, pureed, no less .
<daftykins> yep i practically chewed that up and dribbled it into Guest's mouth
<daftykins> still there were questions :P
<Bashing-om> lol !
<daftykins> *facepalm*
<ObrienDave> now, you're supposed to be nice to the mentally challenged ;P
<Bashing-om> any idea how much lower you can go, and how finer it must get ?
<ObrienDave> rock bottom? LOL
<ObrienDave> seriously, it must be troll day. sheesh
<Bashing-om> I was going to retire for the evening, now I just got to see how this works out .
<ObrienDave> LOL masochist ;P
<daftykins> =]
 * ObrienDave is thinking cluelessperson_ is an appropriate nick in this case LOL
<pauljw> i'm thinking you're right ObrienDave, time for some sleep.  gnite all
<daftykins> go bazhang, defender of the nothing
<daftykins> unjust bans for all seasons++
<ObrienDave> yea, power mad OP ;P
<ObrienDave> and even worse in ##chat
<daftykins> i thought i was for the chop then
<daftykins> i feel like PMing kadiro with a "Hackers" quote
<ObrienDave> he's in OT
<daftykins> ah that chan is my kryptonite
<daftykins> i vowed never to return
<ObrienDave> o i c ;p
<daftykins> :D
<dragon21> hii
<dragon21> someone know the best way for crack wpa2 network?
<ObrienDave> we don't discuss illegal activities here
<dragon21> not illegal... but ok corry
<dragon21> sorry*
<dragon21> exit
<daftykins> yes illegal
<daftykins> idiots
<ObrienDave> takes all kinds :S
<daftykins> everyone and their dog is installing Kali and having a crack these days
<ObrienDave> not illegal to crack your own. but very illegal to crack someone else's. it's called 'theft of services' LOL
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<daftykins> \o
<lotuspsychje> hey daftykins
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: o/
<lotuspsychje> hey Bashing-om
<lotuspsychje> how was the support like this evening
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Good day to ya, about ready for shift change for me .
<lotuspsychje> ive had many users for eolupgrades
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Been a lot of spoon feeding .
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> windows10 might change alot for the ubuntu community
<lotuspsychje> as more and more users get awake from its spyware techniques
<daftykins> only if the tinfoil articles keep coming
<lotuspsychje> there might be a major switch
<daftykins> heh i'm afraid that's all been blown out of proportion
<lotuspsychje> well still many ppl will do it anyway as its 'free'
<daftykins> it's quite nice y'know :D
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: My Wife upgraded her graohics station to 10, she likes Windows 10 .
<lotuspsychje> i hear MS will sell user behaviour to other companys
<lotuspsychje> im sure the Os itself feels good
<lotuspsychje> but whats happening under the hood
<daftykins> ;)
<lotuspsychje> daftykins: ok
<lotuspsychje> lol
<daftykins> lotuspsychje: i made you a tinfoil crown
<lotuspsychje> daftykins: im gonna need a tinfoil wifi pringles extender aswell!!
<lotuspsychje> to h4xxor my neighbourhood
<daftykins> D: that's naughty
<lotuspsychje> https://www.google.be/url?sa=i&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=images&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CAcQjRxqFQoTCLPerb7rwMcCFYqXGgodTN0FOA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.forosuse.org%2Fforosuse%2Fshowthread.php%3Ft%3D28849&ei=3ZfaVfP7LYqvasy6l8AD&psig=AFQjCNGidng_wWiw9ew6m4fVrMeAqZFq2w&ust=1440475454116565
<lotuspsychje> lol
<daftykins> biggest URL evar
<lotuspsychje> https://e2ywrq.bay.livefilestore.com/y1mPTN9UVbmh1dpSv8MRSTJhPUYsnMRzRgwLtBjivtV7Qg_OXciojE5ctxCbimLN-aRKVZFaM5__eeOqepcIUAGv1E6oqWJQMUB-8hq4lqAe-Q/detalle%20general%5B3%5D.jpg
<lotuspsychje> sorry :p
<daftykins> i did find it a bit weird you linking to a foreign post about turning a router into a WAP :>
<lotuspsychje> yeah copy pasting a google pic wasnt a smart idea :p
<lotuspsychje> lucky im in an ubuntu support channel :p
<daftykins> ^_^
<Bashing-om> OK, I have had all the fun I can stand, I can not stand any more. Shifting to a vertical position .
<daftykins> same ^
<daftykins> g'night folks \o
<lordievader> Good morning.
<lotuspsychje> morning ObrienDave :p
<ObrienDave> hiya :) how goes it?
<ObrienDave> you missed the asinine trolls earlier LOL
<lotuspsychje> great mate bout you?
<lotuspsychje> lol
<ObrienDave> it was one of those, let's invent the most asinine situations we can and troll #ubuntu, day. sheesh
<lotuspsychje> some n00bs need lifes
<ObrienDave> or, they need to listen and do research LOL
<lotuspsychje> research and noobs dont go togheter :p
<ObrienDave> LOL so i've learned :)
<ObrienDave> oh boy, i think i'll have another slug of booze LOL
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> ObrienDave: you come in, and the noobs start to troll
<ObrienDave> OH! blame it on me! ;P
<lotuspsychje> you have this bad influence ObrienDave heh
<ObrienDave> i'm good at that ;P
<lotuspsychje> !winusb | ObrienDave new factoid for support volunteers :p
<ubot5> ObrienDave new factoid for support volunteers :p: WinUSB is a tool for preparing bootable Windows Instalation USBs. Please see http://en.congelli.eu/prog_info_winusb.html for instructions on installation and use. #ubuntu does *not* provide support for this tool, so please do not ask for help here if it doesn't work for you.
<ObrienDave> oh, cool! thanks :)
<lotuspsychje> sorted by newest: http://ubottu.com/factoids.cgi?db=ubuntu&search=&order=added%20DESC&page=0
<lotuspsychje> no real big changes otherwise
<ObrienDave> hmm, winusb link down for now :(
<lotuspsychje> oh, lemme report that
<lotuspsychje> tnx :p
<ObrienDave> MySQL error
<lotuspsychje> ObrienDave: lol you might have found a h4xxed sqlinjection on it
<ObrienDave> just my luck *sigh* ;P
<ObrienDave> Erreur Ã  la connexion Ã  MySQL
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> hackeurs francais
<ObrienDave> i don't speak french
<lotuspsychje> bbl :p
<ObrienDave> *waves*
<lotuspsychje> !winusb
<lordievader> Yayy, a new very small super computer is born :D
<lotuspsychje> lordievader: whats happening mate?
<lordievader> Made a beowulf cluster.
<lotuspsychje> lol thats huge lordievader :p
<lotuspsychje> lordievader: whats gonna be the purpose of it?
<lordievader> It is a small cluster.
<lordievader> Was more a learning experience.
<lotuspsychje> cool
<lordievader> Would be nice if I could run theano on it though.
<lordievader> 16 cores (12 physical), 24 Gb ram.
<lotuspsychje> wow :p
<lordievader> Spread over 4 machines ;)
<TJ-> What is this epidemic of users who think they know best, when they know nothing, and go against everything the distro provides!?!
<OerHeks> they miss the 'win together' mindset
<daftykins> heh
<daftykins> more idiots setting a root pass is it?
<TJ-> that user 'choice' was on about $HOME .. now in #debian trying to roll his own encryption without using LUKS
#ubuntu-discuss 2015-08-25
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<lordievader> Good morning.
<lotuspsychje> hie lordievader
<lordievader> o/
<lotuspsychje> hows the cluster :p
<lordievader> Haven't really played with it yet.
<lotuspsychje> can you come to irc with that beast?
<lotuspsychje> to see whats inside
<lordievader> It's just multiple Linux pc's hooked together.
<lotuspsychje> would lshw not show all machines content then?
<lordievader> No.
<lotuspsychje> ah ic
<lordievader> http://www.tldp.org/HOWTO/html_single/Beowulf-HOWTO/
<lotuspsychje> whats the 'normal' purpose for this kind of layout?
<lordievader> Slave nodes boot an pxe image to make it easy.
<lordievader> No idea.
<lordievader> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i_r3z1jYHAc
<lotuspsychje> kind of strong linux network?
<lordievader> ?
<lotuspsychje> lol what a machine
<lotuspsychje> https://nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beowulf-cluster
<lotuspsychje> nvm got it :p
<lordievader> Jup, there you go.
<ObrienDave> i see the quality of intelligent questions in #server are comparable to #ubuntu LOL
#ubuntu-discuss 2015-08-26
<perpe> Hola
<perpe> Ciao
<daftykins> mmmk
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: HiYa; Looks like it is going to get off the wall. and it is not even a Friday .
<lotuspsychje> yayy
<daftykins> any of you folks got a 14.04.3 box with perl 5.18.2-2 installed?
<daftykins> 64-bit
<lotuspsychje> i got latest trusty 64bit but no perl
<daftykins> got this guy in a Kodi channel whose apt-get upgrade is spitting all kinds of issues with the files in the perl folder
<daftykins> http://pastebin.com/edfMbpvS
<daftykins> i supplied my 32-bit ones tar'd up but it doesn't seem to work
<lotuspsychje> !info perl trusty
<ubot5> perl (source: perl): Larry Wall's Practical Extraction and Report Language. In component main, is important. Version 5.18.2-2ubuntu1 (trusty), package size 2122 kB, installed size 11509 kB
<lotuspsychje> wowo what a list of errors on perl
<daftykins> mmhmm
<daftykins> proper funky
<lotuspsychje> maybe its because of the hold back packages?
<daftykins> i feel like it won't function to upgrade even if instructed to update those, though
<daftykins> ah apparently a softlink in the folder stopped the untar from working or something, it's going ahead now
<lotuspsychje> yayy
<daftykins> nothing like a good file swap
<lotuspsychje> :p
<daftykins> DJ idiotface would be a better nick
<daftykins> *sigh*
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> daftykins: Welcome to #ubuntu-discuss. This channel is publicly logged :p
 * lotuspsychje wonders why the discussion channel gets logged
<lordievader> Good morning.
<lotuspsychje> morning lordievader
<lordievader> o/
<Bashing-om> I going vertical for a while. See yall tomorrow my afternoon .
<FiZaZue> good morning
<lotuspsychje> hi FiZaZue
 * daftykins checks TJ- 's basement
<TJ-> best to check the grain store :)
<daftykins> didn't realise you were up on the mainland thar
<TJ-> ooooaaar :)
<daftykins> ^_^
 * daftykins glances up from the Channel Islands
<TJ-> reminded me of Mark Steele in St Anne, recently
<daftykins> Alderney folk?
<TJ-> BBC Radio 4 Mark Steele in Town, was a classic
<lotuspsychje> evening to all
<pauljw> hi
<lotuspsychje> hi pauljw and daftykins
<daftykins> \o
 * lotuspsychje_ hates connections drops
<daftykins> :>
<lotuspsychje> isp acting weird today
<daftykins> https://www.dropbox.com/s/hi9psnk5ba26jol/IMG_20150826_175248.jpg?dl=0
<daftykins> good one on the local paper today
<lotuspsychje> scary leads lol
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> "take them away from me!"
<lotuspsychje> there's a hacker inside my tv
<lotuspsychje> well i like paranoid users for sure, because their most close to reality
<lotuspsychje> so many tv's and satelites get sploited over eth
<daftykins> satellites? o0
<lotuspsychje> daftykins: you heard about those dreamboxes satelites?
<daftykins> nope
<lotuspsychje> daftykins: linux based and connected to eth 24/7
<lotuspsychje> daftykins: they all use default l:p over remote satelite connect
<daftykins> i don't even know what kind of devices you mean though
<lotuspsychje> daftykins: you know a sattelite right, to watch tv
<daftykins> so set top boxes?
<lotuspsychje> daftykins: dreamboxes are used to share cards and watch satelite tv and connected to internet also
<lotuspsychje> daftykins: http://ne.anuncioo.com/viewpaphoto-276379-dreambox-satelite-receiver
<daftykins> sounds naughty?
<lotuspsychje> daftykins: yeah you can remotely watch the pink channels on someones box :p
<daftykins> heh
<daftykins> i dunno i don't use any broadcast TV
<lotuspsychje> just to make my point, smart devices connected to the web, are bad idea
<daftykins> i don't believe on living in fear with tech
<lotuspsychje> because you have nothing to hide?
<daftykins> life just needs to go on
<daftykins> don't get me wrong, i explicitly avoided buying a smart TV with a webcam built in :D
<daftykins> or silly gimmicks like voice control
<lotuspsychje> or smell control
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> movies with odor spraying
<daftykins> XD
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: good evening mate x :p
<EriC^^> lotuspsychje: good evening :p
<daftykins> aww you got a kiss on your greeting, what favouritism!
<daftykins> ;)
<EriC^^> with tongue too
<lotuspsychje> thats usual over-seas, dont laugh :p
<lotuspsychje> french guys also kiss 3 x to each other
<EriC^^> lol
<lotuspsychje> you arent modern daftykins :p
<EriC^^> same here, usually people greet like that
<lotuspsychje> you see
<daftykins> wat
<lotuspsychje> hehe
<daftykins> EriC^^: i thought you were in the US? :)
<EriC^^> (we were occupied by france for a long time though)
<lotuspsychje> think again
<EriC^^> nah, Lebanon, i was born in the US :)
<lotuspsychje> belgian waffles here
<daftykins> ah ok
<daftykins> still shopping for TVs for a client
<daftykins> tum te tum
<lotuspsychje> daftykins: what your gonna do?
<daftykins> i'm thinking avoid curved, avoid 4K - just pick some cheap 1080p things
<daftykins> he's only after a 40" and a 50" for his Spain flat
<daftykins> :>
<lotuspsychje> go for samsung
<lotuspsychje> best quality ever
<lotuspsychje> i have ue 8000 samsung 40"
<EriC^^> better than LG?
<lotuspsychje> yes EriC^^
<EriC^^> i want to get one for the living room soon
<daftykins> i haven't seen any of the WebOS running LGs
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: if you put a hd 1080p on the samsung you will see major difference
<lotuspsychje> EriC^^: got a friend who mis-bought a big 60" LG and came home and his 1080p got blurry
<daftykins> i was looking at samsungs since i already own a 55" 6800, also got the 40" model on this guys boat
<daftykins> i'm wondering what we'd really sacrifice if i picked a 2014 model, hrmm
<lotuspsychje> nothing can beat samsungs quality
<daftykins> i'm not sure on that
<daftykins> but i'm not hugely fussed on shopping elsewhere :>
<lotuspsychje> im 100% sure daftykins
<lotuspsychje> you cant see quality in the store itself
<lotuspsychje> you need to bring own usb with 1080p mkv to the store
<lotuspsychje> and test yourself
<daftykins> meh
<daftykins> http://www.amazon.co.uk/Samsung-40J5510-Smart-1080p-Model/dp/B00VBUYHZM/
<daftykins> that's a tempting choice for a 2015 model
<lotuspsychje> good price for sure
<daftykins> heh take the 20% tax off that for us too ;)
<lotuspsychje> nice
<daftykins> one benefit to not being under the UK government
<lotuspsychje> i have an older model, but expensive one
<lotuspsychje> still have an old smart tv
<lotuspsychje> the newer smart tv is much better
<lotuspsychje> 2015 version will have it
<daftykins> it's going down to Spain anyway so anything would have to be VPN'd to provide British services
<lotuspsychje> the higher hertz, the better quality of course
<lotuspsychje> i got 800 cmr
<daftykins> mmm there's a fair element of marketing to that
<daftykins> since i put it into movie mode which cuts that bit off - but i think mines still 200Hz after :)
<lotuspsychje> i also use mede8er media hd on it
<lotuspsychje> and rocknrolls
<lotuspsychje> worlds best media hd
<daftykins> o0
<daftykins> an app, or?
<lotuspsychje> no, media harddisk
<lotuspsychje> plays all codecs
<daftykins> meh ;)
<daftykins> i like my Kodi HTPC
<lotuspsychje> dont know that1
<daftykins> used to be called XBMC
<lotuspsychje> ah
<lotuspsychje> nite nite all
<daftykins> EriC^^: heh i wonder if you can plant wim's on install media of a vanilla disk and try as-is, guess it wouldn't work :)
<EriC^^> i was wondering if he could use ubuntu to extract it
<EriC^^> but with windows he can use dism to extract it
<daftykins> no idea, i know on a Windows machine you need some SDK gubbins to do it?
<daftykins> mmm never tried
<EriC^^> i just remembered it uses indexes though, like dism /extract /index:4 or so so i don't think it's that straight forward to extract it with ubuntu
<EriC^^> if he can get a command prompt that has dism it can work
<daftykins> the way this guy pasted that it's "onekey recovery" - are we saying boot config has been hosed so a physical button on this acer laptop won't boot straight into it?
<EriC^^> i had a recovery usb thing from windows, it's like 200mb you put on a fat32 and it boots a recovery with a command prompt and dism diskpart etc. quite handy
<daftykins> ah yeah
<daftykins> i suspect this is one of those machines that can boot directly from powered off with a button though
<EriC^^> i dunno i think when the partitions change the recovery gets all fussy about booting and extracting stuff
<EriC^^> i could boot mine but not extract after i installed ubuntu and it toasted windows by mistake
<EriC^^> ah
<daftykins> ah ok
<daftykins> probably has some super basic non-UUID method of referring to partitions
<EriC^^> yeah
<daftykins> weird though, we were told this guys client updated to 10 - so if he wants 8 back, reverting should be easy
<daftykins> though i've no clue how to do it 'cause i'd never want to go back / use an upgrade :D
<EriC^^> hmm yeah
<Bashing-om> EriC^^: From oldfred - ubuntuforums- " If you have an Acer and in UEFI mode must enable "trust" for Ubuntu/grub's efi boot files. You have to set supervisory password "
<EriC^^> yeah daftykins pointed that out earlier
<EriC^^> wouldn't let him do ls in grub even
<Bashing-om> EriC^^: Yuk ! Partition table hammered ?
<EriC^^> no i think he upgraded windows and it's not booting and he wants win8 back
<daftykins> and is going about it ass-backwards, as is tradition for #ubuntu
<EriC^^> haha:D
<OerHeks> err unremovable uefi too?
<EriC^^> hmm that gives me an idea..
<daftykins> ruh roh
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> wow i can't believe that permissions change worked for the flash drive mount
<daftykins> how does that even happen - udisks mount without group perms
<EriC^^> ah i learned something about that today
<EriC^^> if it's an ext partition if you mount it from nautilus it mounts as the root file system's permissions
<daftykins> wow even when a user invokes it?
<EriC^^> i didn't even know a fs had a root dir with permissions, i thought it just used the mountpoint's permissions, TJ- pointed that out
<EriC^^> yeah
<daftykins> ah the fun i miss out on from not even using desktop 8D
<EriC^^> hehe
<daftykins> wb TJ-
<TJ-> Thanks... stand well back, I'm spitting right now, fed up with hitting pathetic bug after bug on 14.04 this evening!
<Bashing-om> But, TJ- I have long noted that you are a BUG magnet !
<daftykins> guys i think we ought to stop suggesting people go to ##hardware
<TJ-> Grrrrrr
<daftykins> i just had a guy screaming at me that you can't dd an ISO
<daftykins> *facepalm*
<TJ-> These are stupid bugs though
<TJ-> Like in virt-manager (the GUI for libvirt) if you attach a Host USB device to the Guest it has you select the device by its (unique) position on the USB bus (1 device = 1 position) *but* it saves the config to libvirt by the device's Vendor:Product ID ... so when there are multiple identical devices attached the Guest then fails to start since it doesn't know which one to use! I mean, that is under-graduate level facepalm failure!
<daftykins> =
<daftykins> =]
<TJ-> I hit this because I was creating encrypted USB 16GiB images via the installer, and have a couple of identical Flash USB mass storage devices attached
<Bashing-om> TJ-: Yeah, that one drives me up the wall sometimes also / 3 internal hard drives all with same same nomenclature. Real pain sometimes to know what I am doing . ( just about got the bus IDs memorized).
<TJ-> The other bug I hit is in the xorg-xserver. I'm temporarily not using my primary 6-monitor 3xGPU config, just using the laptop GPU with a HDMI screen connected in portrait mode. However, the xserver miscalculates the screen DPI to be 245x93 across the 2 1920x1200 (1920x1200 + 1200x1920) displays because although it rotates the pixel dimensions it doesn't rotate the physical millimetre dimensions, but it uses those to calculate DPI!
<TJ-> The HDMI monitor is physically large compared to the laptop LVDS, so I've got massive text on the portrait monitor and miniscule text on the smaller laptop screen, grrr
<TJ-> It really gets my goat when so-called developers throw code out without actually thinking about how it works, or what it will actually do. I'd fire dev's of mine  if they carried on like that.
<Bashing-om> TJ-: Old cliche, if the developers had to work on what they produced, things would be done diffeent .
<TJ-> It reminds me of another KDE bug I found when I first started using multiple X screens. When locking the screenlock only appears on the primary X screen, anything on the other X screens continues to be displayed. I wrote a patch for it which works, but the KDE dev's NAKed it. In discussions it turns out that the core devs that work on multi-monitor code don't actually have or use multi-monitor configs and don't test on such either!
<TJ-> Bashing-om: Yeah, so true. Dog-food and all that.
<Bashing-om> Then there are those like you, who do know what thy are doing and why, that make the patches that make it work . :)
<TJ-> It's got to the point that I could spend my entire time just hunting down and fixing bugs in the packages we use, and still be behind the times. I'm afraid F/OSS is starting to trip over its own feet in this regard. 10 years ago you could actually get something useful done between fixing other people's mistakes :)
<TJ-> It actually disappoints me, since when I tackle something I want to be professional and deliver a decent solution. This slip-shod code depresses me greatly.
<Bashing-om>  that I have complete empathy. System evolving faster than I can keep up with . What I think I know was just a thought as it no longer applies .
<TJ-> Funny thing.. I'm trying to fix the virt-manager issue right now as we chat. I'm using the CLI 'virsh' interface to libvirt to be able to gather the correct info to use "virsh edit <domain>" to manually edit the XML. There are guides on gathering the USB device info using virsh. However, the info it outputs doesn't include one of the vital address values required, the device number, in order to do that! So I'm wasting 1/2 hour so far trying to figure out h
<TJ-> ow to get that info from it!
<TJ-> Yeah, we're running too fast just to keep up now.
<TJ-> I'm expecting I'll be switching away from Ubuntu soonish; the way Canonical is behaving and the directions it's taking without true community input has killed the appeal it once had.
<TJ-> The issue over Copyrights to binary package (re)distribution for example, the fuss and time over clarity that saw Jonathan Riddell 'booted' from the Kubuntu Council, the whole Snappy packaging thing
<Bashing-om> TJ-: I grant you that the future is bleak for us ole die hards. I came to ubuntu from other linux distros due to my comfort level/ Backthen ubunbtu wss initab, and verry readable and inderstandable. Back then ubuntu worked real well for my use case and I did devotes some time learning it. Now there is too much for any one person to know -> specialization .. and A does not relate well with C anymore .
<daftykins> two TVs bought \o/
<TJ-> Yes, there's that too. The Dictator obviously wants to create in Canonical another Thawte after all the bank-rolling he's done, but that is the crux of the issue for Ubuntu. He got it going with money + a vision for Debian devs and created the illusion of Ubuntu under 'community' direction... but if that direction didn't fit with his vision it has been ignored and changes forced. I think it affected me earlier than most. I used to be part of the "Ubuntu Ke
<TJ-> rnel Team" which was then a handful of people all but me paid by Canonical. Then, without warning or announcement, it suddenly became the "Canonical Kernel Team" and the rest of us were frozen out, not party to team plans, etc.
<Bashing-om> TJ-: Yeah ; Situations such as that makes one think real hard how he fits into the "Big Picture" . The little I have messed about with DSL and Tiny Core sure makes me consider them as a next move .
 * daftykins facepalms at MrJones
<TJ-> I've been thinking about DSL, but one of my major focuses is secure fully encrypted systems, and them being easy to install. I've been working on the debian-installer to add services like encrypted /boot/, detached LUKS headers, plausible deniability with inner containers that are invisible, and so on.
<TJ-> I was thinking of contributing to Kubuntu development but since the spat with Jonathan Riddell, its future is far from certain beyond 15.10
<daftykins> it's quite embarassing in a way wanting to suggest open source at all given how all of its' development seems full of drama
<daftykins> i even feel bad for prefering Firefox now given all the crap going on at Mozilla
<daftykins> but don't get me wrong, it's the 'product' that matters obviously
<TJ-> daftykins: You get that in any organisation of size though, internal politics in most companies is worse... even though there it is accepted that direction is dictated from 'above'
<daftykins> ah, probably my lack of experience with the workplace then
<TJ-> I know what you mean... the 'little' issues are often tip-of-the-iceberg kind of indicators
<wileee> handfuls of hierarchies, some personal some group
<Bashing-om> K; And it is using that product to make it do what you want it to do. Getting real tough to make adjustments .
<TJ-> I've done a lot of consulting and been really glad I've never worked for anyone else as an employee; I'd go berzerk at some of the things I've seen :D
<daftykins> :)
<TJ-> Ha! Only took me 45 minutes to figure out the libvirt-doc XML docs give the wrong info on how to specify a USB device pass-through!
<daftykins> :(
<daftykins> that's some fine documentation
<Bashing-om> TJ-: An Now ya got to read the code, figure out the hooks, and how to make it tell you what you need to know . OH what fun .
<TJ-> when these things happens its a good thing I live in the middle of fields... the screams of frustration I let out make the dogs go hide at the bottom of the yard :)
<TJ-> It's just such a damned waste of time, all due to some dev's laziness in not keeping the docs up to date
<daftykins> XD
<daftykins> yeah :/
<daftykins> it's a shame i don't do dev, 'cause i enjoy documentation writing
<Bashing-om> TJ-: My pet peave ! The docs no longer apply and/or someone did not think enough of me to make up the documentation !
<daftykins> come to think of it, i should put some time into updating some of the ones we link to over in #ubuntu
<daftykins> it's quite an embarassing state when we link someone and the guides go up to 10.04
<Bashing-om> daftykins: Now that would cause some kind of confusion. 10.04 in a 15.10 world .
<daftykins> *nod*
<TJ-> Bashing-om: I think we could have a bonfire party with all the out-of-date/incorrect docs :)
<TJ-> daftykins: I was once thinking of how to do a massive kull of obsolete/wrong/dangerous info in the help/wiki but the task is so immense it'd need every active dev that knows the current score to spend a week on it
<daftykins> yeah :(
<TJ-> I think we waste huge amounts of time being misled by obsolete docs... that's why when I'm helping people I try to duplicate their issue locally, with a VM or whatever, to ensure the commands I suggest actually do what I expect them to :)
<Bashing-om> TJ-: Amen to -do it yourself 1st - . I have become a firm believer .
<daftykins> same, though often i'm not on a GUI system to repeat things
<daftykins> since i don't run desktop *buntu apart from *rarely* on this old junker laptop downstairs in my lounge :)
<TJ-> I find if I don't do that I, and the user, get confused over what to expect. User communication, even with pastebin, lacks a lot compared to being there and using your intuition, gut-feeling from the way the system behaves
<TJ-> daftykins: You should try using that ASCII GUI driver for the X server :D
<daftykins> XD
<daftykins> can't tell if you're teasing
<TJ-> Well, it'd be 'fun' :)
<TJ-> I doubt you'd get 3D acceleration though :p
<daftykins> that's ok, i was that teenager playing with compiz - no sorry, beryl way back ;)
<Bashing-om> reminiscence ?
<TJ-> When I started programming, there was BASIC and machine-code (no assembler), but I'd have loved to run a GUI in 4KB of RAM :)
<daftykins> Bashing-om: more thinking of the fashionable trends :)
<daftykins> amusing that we still get kids coming in wanting wobbly windows, cubes and to play counter-strike
 * daftykins cringes
<OerHeks> 16 kb wobbly rampack
<TJ-> OerHeks: oh yeah!
<OerHeks> Who remembers Baud?
<TJ-> the computer?
<daftykins> o/
<Bashing-om> I had a machine with 512 KB - at the time a whopping amount, and It was the 1st I am aware of that had a true GUI . Was amazing !
<TJ-> my first modem did 110 baud half-duplex
<daftykins> though i'm quite young relatively so my dialup era once i was allowed a modem, was quite late on
<TJ-> Bashing-om: that is an amazing amount of RAM :D
<TJ-> Was that an Amiga or Atari ST?
<Bashing-om> At the time .. there was the TI16 !
<TJ-> I had a TI99/4A ... along with about 15 other different types of computer
<Bashing-om> Oh was the Amiga .. I sure had my share of distain for the Atari .
<OerHeks> our friends circle decided on the zx81, and later spectrum
<Bashing-om> ^ now that one you sure learned assembly !
<TJ-> Anyone remember the Jupiter Ace, which ran Forth?
<TJ-> I started with a ZX80 and ZX81
<OerHeks> Now i have so many machines, nobody wants them, all duo cores ..
<TJ-> back then I think I collected ZX80, ZX81, Spectrum, QL, BBC Micros, Acorn Atom, Jupiter Ace, Oric-1, Atari 520ST, Commodore Vic20, Amigas, Dragon 32 and 64, TI99/4A ... wow the names come flooding back!
<TJ-> I know when they were all on and the CRTs running it was like a sweatshop in the office :)
<TJ-> oh, Superbrain too, that all-in-one
<Bashing-om> Talk about memories. I bought that miga1000 to remote into the work servers. Accomplished that, and along the way i figured out how to remote into my machine, No one had done that before to a PC, used to really blow people away that I had a machine one could do that - though I will admit it would crash sometimes and I never did get it right .
<TJ-> It was relatively easy back then to do anything you wanted - hardware was much simpler, usually very well documented too
<TJ-> Now it seems to be all about 'protecting our IP'
<daftykins> there's you guys talking about the old kit, whilst i download a 1.1GB firmware update for a TV i just ordered for someone
<daftykins> what a brave new world of inefficiency ;)
<TJ-> well, that's 2 bugs detailed and reported. I'll check back in 4 years someone might have looked at them by then :)
<TJ-> daftykins: seriously; it makes me cry when I see that kind of thing. The total lack of awareness of the underlying technology in most devs now is frightening. So many rely on some blackbox framework API with no idea of the underlying consequences of choosing one operation over another
<daftykins> *nod*
<TJ-> Like this SuperTalent/Asmied controller Option ROM PICe SSD boot hang I'm working with them on.
<daftykins> octacore TVs
<daftykins> ah yeah, how's that going?
<TJ-> I've reverse-engineered the O-ROM almost totally now, so much so I know how it works... I still have to send questions via a 1st-line support agent who relays them to engineers who relay them to Asmedia engineers, who reply back through the chain... 3 times now I've asked a highly technical specific question that demonstrates I probably know their code better than they do, to get the reply "have you tried it in Windows?" ... I just scream, really!
<daftykins> >_<
<daftykins> good they even reply though i guess, i'd imagine some manufacturers wouldn't even permit that
<TJ-> When I get some spare time (hah!) I'm going to patch a few bytes in the O-ROM image to give me feedback as to where it is executing, and iterate that until I hit a place where it has hung the PC, and work backwards from there. The flash is programmable using SPI so it's easy to reprogram it. It doesn't even checksum the flash image, amazingly
<daftykins> ouch!
<daftykins> guess they never intend to release an update
<TJ-> daftykins: That's it, there was a time when if you could see you were dealing with a highly technical customer you'd deal with them on that level, but  organisational politics has since got in the way of engineers talking to engineers
<TJ-> It is using an unmodified Asmedia 106X controller BIOS so this is more widespread than the SuperTalent SSD,
<TJ-> I think it is hitting because Asmedia asume the BIOS is embedded in a PC system with the controller on the motherboard, and they've never tested it fully when the OROM is self-contained on a hot-pluggable PCIe device
<TJ-> What is scary is, with the SSD in a mini-PCIe <> PCIe adapter, plugged into a Gigabyte motherboard, the power supply refuses to power on!
<daftykins> :S
<TJ-> If I hotplug a moment after the PSU starts, it is fine though :S
<Bashing-om> Now where is that O'scope we were talking about the other evening ? Be nice to look at the timing .
<TJ-> I've been doing that; nothing obvious
<TJ-> But I don't care too much about that - it only went in there to test if it would work someplace else than the laptops
<TJ-> I've still got the failed ServerTech 0-U (vertical) CDU master to diagnose/fix too - run out of space to have everything disassembled on the workbench at once :s   I bought another identical pair that were on eBay so I have a known good device
<TJ-> daftykins: great oenvpn issue you're diagnosing... making me laugh :D
<TJ-> " so essentially, you don't actually have a VPN server you want to connect to?" --- classic
<daftykins> :)
<daftykins> this is one of my very patient times, they're quite rare
<daftykins> this guy definitely saw the acronym and believes 'VPN will solve all my problems'
<TJ-> I find that the commercialisation on openvpn.net is causing many users confusion
<daftykins> mmm, linking to another site for the service provision is a bit odd
<daftykins> i'm a newbie though, i just setup a digitalocean droplet in London the other day and followed their guide for 2048-bit easy-rsa based functionality :)
<TJ-> :) that easyrsa tooling is useful
<daftykins> i'd like to say i'd normally learn the proper way but on this occasion i was doing one of those rushed proof-of-concept tasks
<daftykins> someone i know wants to watch British TV from their Spain holiday home ;)
<TJ-> it makes sure you get it correct; which is extremely important with crypto
<daftykins> *nod* it does look very complex - quite the longwinded guide too, although maybe only 40 mins from start to finish thanks to VPSs such as digitalocean
<daftykins> plus if i repeated it in other countries i could use all kinds of services ;)
<TJ-> I like those kind of scripts ... they can be used as an educational tool to show best-practice, so when you have time you can read them and get an idea of the underlying commands and parameters
<daftykins> :D
#ubuntu-discuss 2015-08-27
<TJ-> Got a really strange issue here, in a QEMU/KVM guest running the Kubuntu Wily Live ISO. Opened a terminal and wanted to type the single and double quote characters. I have to press the key twice to get the character, and it looks visually to be correct, but I'm guessing it is actually a UTF char because the command fails
<TJ-> daftykins: ablest has turned up in offtopic now still asking about openvpn :)
<daftykins> haha typical
<daftykins> <ablest's brain> 1) Install OpenVPN 2) ... 3) Profit.
<TJ-> some folks just shouldn't be allowed near a computer without a proficiency test... many of them, devs :p
<daftykins> :)
<daftykins> doing things at your level i have no idea how you cope with the trivial queries
<Bashing-om> Twiddling thumbs while cogitating on greater matters ??
<TJ-> You may notice I try to only pick the low-level stuff where the person has some signs if intellect :)
<daftykins> :D
<TJ-> I actually find it theraputic... I'm usually stuck on something locally and need to distract my brain from it for a while
<daftykins> sometimes i fall astray like now, but i tend to prefer to avoid the gaming ones - after all what use is that o0
<daftykins> ah :) i like the warm fuzzies of problem solving
<TJ-> hahaha I agree with you
<TJ-> ooo, Pratchett's latest is out today.... goes to check Audible for a download :)
<TJ-> may not be sleeping tonight
<daftykins> impressive Posthumous release o0
<TJ-> grrr, still on pre-order
<TJ-> ok, release today, but timezone must be US so probably won't be available until mid-morning
<daftykins> that's always a pain
<TJ-> I need to clear some books off, the sd card is running out of space. Hate when that happens because I always end up taking off a book I want to listen to a few days later
 * daftykins looks at TJ- then back at #ubuntu
<daftykins> gadmin is just some friendly frontend for the openVPN client XD
<daftykins> the guy still has no damn service i bet
<TJ-> Have you ever noticed you can guess the real skill of a user, because it is usually inversely proportional to how 'l33t' or 'genius' their nickname is?
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> absolutely
<TJ-> As soon as I see h4x0r and so on... !
<daftykins> in fact the guy with 6's earlier i think i've scared off before by pointing out their advice is terrible
<TJ-> xubuntu666 ? Yes, he seemed well-meaning but seemed to have a familiar attitude
<daftykins> *nod*
<daftykins> i should probably have started simple like that ;)
<TJ-> I'd be fuming by now, the user is either using English as their 2nd language and misses the inferences, or is trolling us
<daftykins> :D
<TJ-> They aren't clueless, they've got a freenode cloak
<OerHeks> ... wait... then i am not clueless too
<daftykins> yay \o/
<TJ-> I want to go to the kitchen and snack... but if I do 3 dogs join me and stare woefully as if they've never seen food before
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> i only just had a pizza
<daftykins> i need to stop living on Central time in the US, despite being in BST
<daftykins> the peace of the night is so good though
<TJ-> yeah, me too. I was up at 7am with 3 hours sleep... had a nap from 6-9ish, and now ready for supper and bed
<daftykins> \o/
<TJ-> wow! I think ablest1980 got it .. no wait for it... can't be that simple
<daftykins> :)
<daftykins> i was just thinking that
<daftykins> Tune in tomorrow: <ablest> so i got a second PC and i am ready to CONNECT!
 * daftykins cries in advance
<TJ-> :P
<OerHeks> .. then he ends up with a free-vpn-service ...
<TJ-> I'll have to be careful not to feel too sorry and offer that :)
<OerHeks> me too,room policy
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> quite liking that digitalocean one, $5/mo works out like what - Â£40 a year?
<daftykins> think it has 1TB a month transfer
 * OerHeks electronically signed his butt for that
<OerHeks> I would install the vpnservice at my place, and use the neighbour wifi to test
<daftykins> ah i had something even easier! there's this TV service that lets you stream UK TV (tvcatchup.com) which a friend of a friend runs, it was blocked in my home island
<daftykins> but then of course, just visiting whatismyip.com works :>
<TJ-> there's a neat DNS reflector that you can query and it returns your IP... really useful compare to using a HTTP service
<daftykins> hmm
<daftykins> aaah this guy and updated drivers, seriously
<daftykins> these people act like running the latest version number will make your computer open up and hand you 1,000 (local currency units)
<Bashing-om> Again; Had all the fun I can stand; can not stand any more. Good night .
<daftykins> nn Bashing-om :)
<TJ-> yeah. I am quite happy staying with 14.04, with mainline kernel to fix some bugs that would break the system
<TJ-> VMs/schroots for anything more recent
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> someone did confuse me last night with why ubuntu's repos have got filezilla x.11 but only way older versions show up
<daftykins> !info filezilla trusty
<ubot5> filezilla (source: filezilla): Full-featured graphical FTP/FTPS/SFTP client. In component universe, is optional. Version 3.7.3-1ubuntu1 (trusty), package size 1250 kB, installed size 3102 kB
<daftykins> !info filezilla
<ubot5> filezilla (source: filezilla): Full-featured graphical FTP/FTPS/SFTP client. In component universe, is optional. Version 3.9.0.5-1ubuntu1 (vivid), package size 1540 kB, installed size 5282 kB
<daftykins> yeah
<TJ-> how do you mean, "x.11" ? I'm not seeing a problem
<daftykins> 3.11.x sorry
<daftykins> i forgot the first digit
<daftykins> they found a manual link to a repo with /pool/ and all that, listing debs for 3.11 yet they're not even listed for vivid
<daftykins> !info filezilla wily
<ubot5> filezilla (source: filezilla): Full-featured graphical FTP/FTPS/SFTP client. In component universe, is optional. Version 3.9.0.5-1ubuntu1 (wily), package size 1540 kB, installed size 5282 kB
<daftykins> i was confused as to why it's there if it's not referenced
<TJ-> that's wrong!  filezilla (3.12.0.2-1ubuntu2) wily; urgency=medium
<TJ-> there's no 3.x.11 in the pool; there is 3.3.1-1
<TJ-> http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/universe/f/filezilla/
<daftykins> ooh but a 3.12 there
<TJ-> Yes, from Wily as above
<daftykins> TJ-: hey you're the resident boot magician, do you know which versions work with the 32-bit EFIs?
<daftykins> assuming it got fixed
<TJ-> I've not looked into the 32 bit UEFI, didn't realise there was an issue. Is some manufacturer actually using it!?
<daftykins> http://askubuntu.com/questions/392719/32-bit-uefi-boot-support
<daftykins> yeah these machines that come with "Windows 8.1 with Bing" are shipped with them to prevent people buying cheap machines to use with Linux
<daftykins> i found the above about it
<daftykins> nevermind perhaps legacy will do
<TJ-> Really? hmmm!
<daftykins> it came about quite a while ago, so i didn't think it was even a thing still
<TJ-> OK, there's an easy workaround
<TJ-> install in legacy mode, use GPT and reserve an ESP. Create an 0exEF02 BIOS BOOT partition about 1MiB. GRUB will install into that.
<TJ-> Boot the new system in legacy mode, force-install grub-efi-ia32  and remove grub-pc
<daftykins> funky!
<TJ-> install grub-efi and it'll ensure that the dependencies for grub-efi-ia32 are always met
<TJ-> *Your Mileage May Vary *Colours May Run *No Dry Cleaning
<TJ-> right, time for sleep and book :)
<daftykins> ta-ra o/
<TJ-> don't stau up too late, and don't forget to put the cat out :)
<OerHeks> such boatanchors can be a fire risc, 2005 hardware
<daftykins> this lofty guy?
<OerHeks> yeah
<daftykins> ah - started in another channel?
<OerHeks> not sure, seen him before
<daftykins> sounds like that one that i've had a feeling has been deprecated now for some time
<daftykins> oh hopefully not the same asshole thatkeeps coming in with the same damn poulsbo netbook :P
<OerHeks> ugh cedar trail ?
<daftykins> i really don't understand these historians
<daftykins> why waste time with such rubbish old kit?
<OerHeks> drop it, door stop, ..
<daftykins> ok i'm clocking out
<daftykins> OerHeks: g'night \o
<daftykins> and anyone else still lurking :)
<OerHeks> :-)
<lordievader> Good morning.
<EriC^^> hey everyone
<Bashing-om> EriC^^: o/ ; Pleased to see ya !
<EriC^^> o/ :)
<TJ-> mmmm egg n chips time :)
<Bashing-om> sustenance .
<daftykins> ugh this Nikesh guy, tell him he's got a 32-bit EFI quirk due to having a windows 8.1 with Bing laptop... totally ignores me
<Bashing-om> daftykins: One can lead a horse to water, but can not make that horse drink .
<daftykins> :) too right
<TJ-> daftykins: I'm not convinced the UEFI is 32-bit. According to the Acer specs for the E11-111 it has a 64-bit OS
<daftykins> i definitely concede that there's room for variation, but are you looking at a machine with Windows 8.1 with Bing?
<daftykins> regardless, this guy does not help himself to let us help - so i'm sure a standard boot diagnosis would be worthwhile if anyone were brave enough ;)
<TJ-> Aspire ES1-111M-P2YU
<TJ-> http://us.acer.com/ac/en/US/content/model/NX.MSNAA.003
<TJ-> Aug 27 03:20:56 <Nikesh>        daftykins: It's an Acer Aspire E11-111
<TJ-> I've downloaded the 'BIOS' update and will extract it to check
<daftykins> hrmm guy says it works now, ah well.
<daftykins> ho-hum i have my own fire to work on today :)
<daftykins> seems i'm staring at an SSD failure
<Bashing-om> daftykins: Wow; Nikesh took a sip !
<ItsAdam> hello
<daftykins> Bashing-om: :D
<daftykins> ItsAdam: hello
<daftykins> TJ-: i think it's your go ;)
<OerHeks> "Alibaba routers nextdoor pushing your wifi away" *hips*
<daftykins> XD
<TJ-> back from dinner
<TJ-> After several rounds of extraction and decompression I have the firmware update Capsule
<TJ-> Strings indicate the UEFI is based on the open-source EDK2 as most are:
<TJ-> d:\edk2\MdeModulePkg\Library\UefiHiiServicesLib\UefiHiiServicesLib.c
<daftykins> so standard after all?
<TJ-> It could still be 32-bit
<daftykins> ah har
<daftykins> well he got it booting but has to hit the boot menu then select the hard disk manually right now
<TJ-> It's the InsydeH2O:  http://www.insyde.com/products
<daftykins> despite the BIOS order being set to HDD, then Windows BM
<TJ-> Right... sounds like the NVRAM has lost the Ubuntu entry
<daftykins> so he might need a manual entry being added, but you're the expert there ;)
<daftykins> seems to have gone quiet too
<TJ-> UEFI won't boot unless there's a Simple Boot Path loader at /EFI/BOOT/BOOTX64.EFI
<TJ-> That's how removable media can boot... for fixed storage there needs to be an entry in the firmware's boot menu NVRAM if the boot loader is at any other location in the ESP
<daftykins> *nod*
<daftykins> i think i've seen the command around before that lets you add an entry
<TJ-> efibootmgr ....
<TJ-> I've found the ACPI DSDT table, there may be some tell-tale strings in it
<TJ-> Copyright (C) 1983-2011 Insyde Software Corp.
<TJ-> SYS CORE
<TJ-> 5.31.DT
<TJ-> 12/06/05
<daftykins> hmm
<TJ-> It's very nasty! It has a replacement Windows ntdll.dll Core file embedded!
<daftykins> oh wow, i wonder if it's doing the same thing as those Lenovo's and injecting a file replacement
<daftykins> TJ-: you might be onto something big there
<TJ-> That's just what I was thinking ... not about the 'big' :)
<daftykins> hehe
<TJ-> I don't know why anyone is surprised when it comes to Windows; use it, and you've compromised yourself intentionally
<EriC^^> heh
<daftykins> i believe everything has issues of one type or another, it just depends which OS you'd rather clean up after
<daftykins> TJ-: can you dump that ntdll.dll out separately at all?
<TJ-> January 12, 2002, Bill Gates sent a public email to all MS employees announcing the "Trustyworthy Computing Initiative" - 13 years later and first Tuesday of every month MS releases fixes for more 0-day vulnerabilities, and still issues out-of-band emergency patches too. If Windows didn't already have a monopoly hold, *no one* would touch it with a barge pole
<TJ-> daftykins: probably, I'm just looking at the 'strings' content for now
<daftykins> okie dokie
<TJ-> There's a heck of a lot of PXE/TFTP network boot code repeated
<TJ-> StorageSecurityCommandDxe
<TJ-> 02.01.03.0122.00
<TJ-> UEFI Crypto Library default seed
<TJ-> That sounds scary! If a crypto seed is embedded in the firmware that suggests the crypto (SecureBoot ?) may be compromised
<Bashing-om> Years back I was into what the hardware was doing and the software interacing. I really wanted/needed to know. I ask Eindows peiple for info and get told " proprietary info " . I do not like Windows !
<TJ-> That was the main reason why I walked away from Windows - I did deep technical work on obscure bugs and not having access to the source-code made it 1000x more difficult, and then actually getting MS to release a patch for a known bug could take years.
<TJ-> Was awful having to tell customers "we've identified the bug, it's in Windows OS, but MS won't commit to fixing it"
<daftykins> :( that's no fun
<daftykins> all my support work is very basic, users tie themselves into their software 'cause they're so married to MS Outlook for email
<TJ-> It looks as if that firmware is for 64-bit long mode instructions, so a standard build of the EDK2
<daftykins> ho-hum
<TJ-> MS's modus operandi has always been Embrace, Extend, Extinguish ... they used 'free' to get MS Office/Internet Explorer/MS SQL Server adopted and then when they had everyone by the short and curlies put the licensing costs way up and continue milking it to this day; it's their biggest cash cow
<TJ-> Although I don't like Apple, at least they sell something people genuinely want, rather than feel forced to buy
<daftykins> they have some lovely option ROM firmware issues too y'know :D
<daftykins> pluging in a thunderbolt or firewire device i think it was, can overwrite firmware onboard permanently - undetectably
<TJ-> :) Lack of forward planning... should always have an efuse to make things read-only
<daftykins> i've had enough, they're all idiots
<daftykins> :D
 * daftykins clocks out
<Bashing-om> EriC^^: the_count is a 15 year old, with a lot of promise for our future - so I think .
<EriC^^> i admire his laziness
<daftykins> genuinely competent, or? :)
<EriC^^> he asked how to get pastebinit's link into the clipboard
<daftykins> oh dear, there is no hope
<EriC^^> | pastebinit | something_to_send_to_clipboard
<EriC^^> so i said | pastebinit | xsel , then pres shift+insert
<EriC^^> it's actually pretty cool, he has a dead mouse so yeah, it's handy
<daftykins> oh ok
<daftykins> kids today don't type
<EriC^^> lol
<Bashing-om> but he do ask some intelligent questions, and seems to have a genuine "want to know" .
#ubuntu-discuss 2015-08-28
<daftykins> i hear kadiro is being kadiro
<Bashing-om> OerHeks: Appreciate the boost and interest .. instruct me; where did you come up with ' xserver-xorg-core-udeb ' requirement ?
<OerHeks> as the package relies on both, but the real issue with touchpad is really unclear to me.
<Bashing-om> OerHeks: Trying to install ' xserver-xorg-input-synaptics ' for the op's touchpad .
<Bashing-om> OerHeks: Sorta stuck - http://paste.ubuntu.com/12210140/ - can not get past the "Depends: xorg-input-abi-20" requirement .
<OerHeks> maybe he should do a dist upgrade, sudo apt-get update && sudo apt-get dist-upgrade ...
<Bashing-om> that ^ is a thought !
<OerHeks> yay
<daftykins> what happened?
<OerHeks> xserver-xorg-imput-synaptics is the newest
<daftykins> D:
<daftykins> input? :)
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<lotuspsychje> http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2015/08/canonical-to-business-skip-windows-10-use-ubuntu
<lotuspsychje> !info firefox
<ubot5> firefox (source: firefox): Safe and easy web browser from Mozilla. In component main, is optional. Version 39.0+build5-0ubuntu0.15.04.1 (vivid), package size 41015 kB, installed size 99262 kB
<lordievader> Good morning.
<daftykins> anti-virus? *blinks*
<EriC^^> he was using windows i think :D
<daftykins> O_O
<EriC^^> back story his cat erased his dir
<EriC^^> rm -R dir/
<daftykins> oh that old chestnut :)
<EriC^^> he watched the cat for some days to see how it types on his keyboard
<daftykins> lmao
<EriC^^> i want a cat that can do that :(
<daftykins> that's pretty cool, it even managed to type the password for sudo
<daftykins> ;D
<EriC^^> he thinks it might have been involved, inconclusive evidence though :P
<daftykins> that's probably one of the channels best stories
<daftykins> right i must get food shopping, i hope you are well today sir!
<EriC^^> yesterday somebody came and he had a problem with.. i forgot, his /etc looked like user user
<EriC^^> he said he had to do sudo firefox to get firefox to launch, so he decided to do sudo chown -R user: /etc
<EriC^^> instead
<EriC^^> :D
<EriC^^> ok, have a good one :)
<tahr93571> hello!
<daftykins> phew i thought that said Nikesh joined for a moment
<Bashing-om> Panic not, just proceed on a orderly fashion - maybe someday he will learn better .
<daftykins> :D
<Bashing-om> To be honest to protect my sanity , I mentally put the case on ignore .
<daftykins> :>
#ubuntu-discuss 2015-08-29
<daftykins> yay ablest is back
<daftykins> TJ-: yay ablest is back
 * TJ- runs 
<Bashing-om> I am getting out while the getting is good . Good night !
<TJ-> It looks like we may have a subtle but extremely serious LVM regression; PV metadata created in 14.04 isn't being recognised in 15.10, but not sure if it is chroot related as yet
<daftykins> ah har
<TJ-> It is so subtle I'm sure I'm just tired and missing something obvious, but can't see anything!
<TJ-> Trusty:
<TJ-> $ sudo losetup -a
<TJ-> /dev/loop0: [fc17]:2613 (/var/lib/schroot/metadata-test-2.bin)
<TJ-> /dev/loop1: [fc17]:2612 (/var/lib/schroot/metadata-test.bin)
<TJ-> /dev/loop2: [fc17]:1056349 (/var/lib/schroot/metadata-test-3.bin)
<TJ-> They are available in the 15.10 chroot too. loop0/1 are created in 14.04, loop2 in 15.10
<TJ-> In 14.04, file -s , blkid, *and* pvs all recognise every loop as a PV
<TJ-> In 15.10 loop0/1/2 file -s and  blkid recognise the PV metadata, but for loop0/1 'pvs' doesn't see any
<TJ-> loop0/1 were 'pvcreate'-ed in 14.04, loop2 in 15.10
<TJ-> usually if there is going to be a difference you'd expect the more recent tools to see all of them, and the older tools to only see older metadata
<daftykins> indeed
<TJ-> weird. pvck (PV check) recognises them
<TJ-> 2 hours later... finally worked it out! On 15.10 lvm installs/starts a service, and this is apparently interfering in some way. Solution: "service lvm2-lvmetad stop"
<daftykins> weird that something would get in the way by design
<TJ-> There's a redhat mailing list post about the same issue... apparently the devs acknowledge it's a bug because some special udev rules aren't implemented.
<TJ-> probably not helped in a chroot where no init/udevd is active, but then the lvmetad shouldn't be started
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<daftykins> \o
<lotuspsychje> hi daftykins
<lotuspsychje> all ok here?
<daftykins> ah yeah, usual noob users for the weekend :)
<lotuspsychje> and hi to you TJ-
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> is that time again :p
<TJ-> I hate it when I lose 24 hours! Just discovered it is Saturday
<lotuspsychje> loool
<daftykins>  -!- hypermist [~lick.my@ballsacks.neosstore.com]
<daftykins> *groan*
<lotuspsychje> welcome to the digital labyrinth TJ-
<TJ-> I swear this stuff is really a vortex
<lotuspsychje> neo was right all the way!
 * daftykins follows the white rabbit
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: yous sure you didnt take both pills lol
<TJ-> Hmmm, I think its the naps... got up just after midnight and thought I'd do an hour with this lvm/crypt/15.10 chroot installer... and got stuck for 2 hours with the weird missing PV issue... and its dawn!
<daftykins> so help those birds if they try and sing, that's all i'm saying
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> TJ-: hows wily so far?
<TJ-> I have no idea, I don't use it :)
<daftykins> lotuspsychje: bit personal
<daftykins> ;)
<lotuspsychje> ok now you lost me
<daftykins> get used to the jokes people, we're going to have soooo many of them.
<lotuspsychje> 15.10=wily
<daftykins> yep
<TJ-> I'm working on some low-level installer code the needs the 15.10 lvm2 packages, so using a minimal chroot
<daftykins> which is very close to 'willy'
<lotuspsychje> !willy
<ubot5> It is spelt !wiLy :)
<daftykins> ;)
<TJ-> If you've got a wily werewolf close to your willy ... well wear a box!
<daftykins> hehehe
<lotuspsychje> lol
<TJ-> I've got 2 huskies... it's almost the same :D
<lotuspsychje> i was wondering..can a wolf be made a pet too?
<lotuspsychje> im always dreaming of walking down the street with more dangerous species
<lotuspsychje> tigers, wolves, aligators
<TJ-> any animal can be Pet material if you bring it up from a youngster
<lotuspsychje> i dont think a croc will listen to his master :p
<TJ-> These 2 just made me laugh... every time I get the milk jug out and pour they hear it, come running to the kitchen, and stand there with their tongues going in and out just as if they are sucking on their mother's milk teat.
<lotuspsychje> ancient dinosaur behaviour
<lotuspsychje> huskies are a beauty, those different eyes
<TJ-> yes their blue eyes are amazingly striking
<TJ-> Pepper ran off whilst out walking yesterday... was eventually picked up and returned after bringing traffic to a stop on a nearby A road by a kindly driver
<lotuspsychje> wow
<lotuspsychje> those dogs have real curious and bit wild behaviour right
<lotuspsychje> and need long, long walks
<daftykins> arr-arr-aroooooo
<TJ-> Yes, and Pepper has tunnel vision and gets ultra-focused straight ahead and once she goes it is hard to break her focus.
<TJ-> We also have a collie that rounds them up but he sometimes can't force Pepper to turn even when he runs into her and knocks her off her feet :)
<daftykins> you shouldn't direct all the great unwashed here, lotuspsychje ;)
<lordievader> Good afternoon.
<OerHeks> blub ..
<pauljw> yikes!!
<TJ_on_Wily> Wily is a mess!
<OerHeks> oh
<TJ_on_Wily> Bluez 5.3 has no support for Pin Codes (so no Keyboard pairing possible) or Headset profile, Bluez 4.x on 14.04 was fine. Another example of bored devs reinventing the wheel but not providing the previous level of functionality.
<Bashing-om> TJ_on_Wily: systemd ?
<TJ_on_Wily> I'm without my password storage right now, hence can't identify with NickServ
<TJ_on_Wily> systemd is no problem, as long as I remember to use systemctl and journalctl :)
<TJ_on_Wily> Been working through bugs since midnight trying to get a stable Wily install equivalent to the Trusty installation. We're past feature-freeze; I foresee a lot of unhappy users when Wily is released.
<TJ_on_Wily> Seems like gb.archive.ubuntu.com has lost all its mirrors. It just delivers some Javascript, breaking the package manager
<OerHeks> so .. do not install Werewolf without Winternet for updates?
<TJ_on_Wily> I'm about to try a reboot to enable the Nvidia drivers.
#ubuntu-discuss 2015-08-30
<Bashing-om> EriC^^: Can I pick your brain on xserver requirment in HWE ?
 * daftykins coughs
<OerHeks> LoLz, Mate 15.10 lets Softwarecenter go .. but still offers wubi
<Bashing-om> So now we can beat Mate users over the head with a large wubi ?
<OerHeks> We demand an wubi install, in windows 10.
<OerHeks> paid drivers, and remove terminal like gparted after install.
<daftykins> WUBI :S
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<daftykins> o/
<lotuspsychje> hellow daftykins :p
<lotuspsychje> extreme thunder n lighting here : O
<daftykins> ooh dear
<daftykins> you best unplug for eletronic safety!
<lotuspsychje> yeah i have protected wires
<daftykins> o0
<daftykins> from what? :)
<lotuspsychje> those anti lightning power extenders
<daftykins> 0o
<lotuspsychje> daftykins: something like this: http://home-shopper.nl/product/veiligheid/veiligheid-thuis/408I.htm
<lotuspsychje> cfhowlett: nihao :p
<daftykins> hmm an electrician told me they're all a joke, once
<cfhowlett> lotuspsychje, yowza^2
<lotuspsychje> daftykins: yeah its hard to believe its gonna stop 11.000 volts
<daftykins> :D
<cfhowlett> WHY does this dude insist on using an obsolete/unsafe OS /rant
<lotuspsychje> its like saying cars are 'safe' from lightning because their on tires
<lotuspsychje> cfhowlett: some users will never get it right
<daftykins> is that what typing #osdev meant?
<lotuspsychje> cfhowlett: ive seen its a human habbit, to avoid/ignore updates
<daftykins> i thought it was an idiot not knowing how to join a channel
<daftykins> oh now i follow you
<cfhowlett> and the same users are all "Ubuntu suks" FUD spreaders.   grrrr
<daftykins> <-- too much beer
<lotuspsychje> lol
 * daftykins sips more
 * lotuspsychje starts his day wth coffee :p
<cfhowlett> I guess I have partial add cuz I apt full-upgrade daily and install LTS at the first point release.
<lotuspsychje> same here, always up to date :p
<lotuspsychje> cfhowlett: recently looked at usn per ubuntu version...its scary
<lotuspsychje> !usn
<ubot5> Please see http://www.ubuntu.com/usn for information about Ubuntu security updates.
<daftykins> i swear we get so many users nowadays that don't even read the download page to understand LTS vs. non-LTS
<daftykins> that's one of my earliest understandings of Ubuntu, was learning that distinction
<lotuspsychje> yeah alot of users go for 15.04 this time
<cfhowlett> daftykins, I think it fair to say that new users read damn near nothing.
<daftykins> hehe, too true
<lotuspsychje> maybe its because many users need alternatives, but dont know differences yet
<daftykins> in fact i was discussing this with a young lady in the pub tonight, she thinks youngsters are better just because they grew up with it
<daftykins> i suggested that they won't learn as much because most are stuck with Apple products that have plenty of limitations
<daftykins> such as having a walled-garden ecosystem
<lotuspsychje> apple get h4xxed daily worldwide...
<lotuspsychje> ubuntu has also fixxed alot of security holes this year, so best to be very updated
<daftykins> it's more that a kid playing with an apple product is limited on what they can do
<cfhowlett> they don't have to do much as the system is pretty dumbed down to point/click.  not necessarily a bad thing for most users.
<daftykins> that limits their learning though
<cfhowlett> learn?  most users don't want to learn.  they just want to .. use.
<lotuspsychje> yeah but underground their iphones get rooted hard
<lotuspsychje> remember that security flaw where they can steal online celeb pics
<lotuspsychje> they still can do that, thats why i never trust any cloud
<daftykins> cloud services in general are a bit different to fruity tech products :)
<lotuspsychje> i only trust mu usb data burried under the ground :p
<lotuspsychje> with a big cross + RIP kittycat
<daftykins> my cat heard that
<daftykins> ;)
<lotuspsychje> lol
<daftykins> https://www.dropbox.com/s/gl2am3hjwzyrz4v/IMG_20150829_054828.jpg?dl=0
<lotuspsychje> nice blackn white
<cfhowlett> I get FB, twitter and most blog platforms being blocked.  I don't agree, but I get it.  Inexplicably the Great Firewall also blocks Dropbox!  grrrrrrrrrrrr
<daftykins> d'aww
<lotuspsychje> social media is a growing nest for h4ckers
<daftykins> she's a lovely monochrome cat ;)
<cfhowlett> is he serious?!!
<daftykins> utter idiot
<cfhowlett> obstinate to be sure.  I had to /ignore ... just too frustrating to explain again
<lordievader> Good morning.
<Bashing-om> Even though I have not had my quota of coffee; strapping myself in for this ride anyway .
<OerHeks> Double-espresso for Bashing-om
<Bashing-om> ^^ Wired and strapped now !
<OerHeks> oh, i did a wrong ignore gambl0re
 * OerHeks goes print out the irc comands
<Bashing-om> Yep - gambl0re - Nothing worthwhile there .
<altoidnerd> does anyone know of a good 'google search from the command line' application
#ubuntu-discuss 2016-08-29
<NoSee> I <3 Ubuntu Touch
<NoSee> It is best
<BluesKaj> Hiyas all
<Bashing-om> meanwhile 2 hours later, we find that the OP is still trying to boot a liveUSB . nothing to do yet with the install .. pulling teeth !
<OerHeks> you mean bray<number> ?
<Bashing-om> OerHeks: Uh Huh .. bray be the one I referring to , patience Bashing-om is a virtue .
#ubuntu-discuss 2016-08-30
<Bashing-om> Back from local power failure :)
<OerHeks> yay \o/
<Bashing-om> Only a bit worse for the wear . looks like bios is unhappy .. but fsck says 'buntu is happy .
<OerHeks> We have a pretty solid powernetwork, but i should use an UPS to keep hardware healthy
<OerHeks> little flucturations and power-ticks like elevator and such ..
<Bashing-om> ^^ just another reminder to get my UPS repaired and back in service !
<OerHeks> i love to read this .. <veek> how do you use the launchpad ppa thingy.. it's created a file in sources.list.d <veek> but i get  Failed to fetch http://ppa.launchpad.net/shutter/ppa/ubuntu/dists/jessie/main/binary-amd64/Packages  404  Not Found
<Bashing-om> Yall have the fun without me for a spell . G nite
<OerHeks> 13 Bn ... almost 2 dollar per worldcitizen http://www.bbc.com/news/business-37220799
<NoSee> Ubuntu Touch is underrated
<ducasse> why the hell is the irish gov going to appeal that? the commission says apple owes them â¬13bn - does the irish gov think it's even more?
<OerHeks> + interest ..
<OerHeks> .. yeah, from 1991 to now, 1% tax is killing business, they claim
<ducasse> serious amount of money, though. tbh, it's disgusting of apple to do stuff like this.
<OerHeks> if europe does not grab it, obama will
<ducasse> maybe, i know nothing about this. but a business the size of apple should bloody well pay their taxes like normal people need to. somebody should go to prison for this, for a long time.
<Ben64> they never do
<OerHeks> demandatory update to 16.10 alfa
<ducasse> ooooh - shiny! :)
<ducasse> anyone know when the first beta is scheduled?
<OerHeks> sept 22 https://wiki.ubuntu.com/YakketyYak/ReleaseSchedule
<ducasse> thanks, OerHeks! i think i'll wait until then to upgrade, i'm not _that_ adventurous.
<OerHeks> me too, i have plenty screens but not enough machines...
<ducasse> i could set up a spare machine, but helping to find problems before release is probably more helpful on a machine that is actually being actively used.
<JanC> I agree that massive tax fraud should result in prison time; it's the only way to stop it  :)
<Ben64> but they're the ones writing the laws
<BluesKaj> Hiyas all
#ubuntu-discuss 2016-08-31
<kabe> Hi, I was curious... is there any other alternatives to LibreOffice that are out there?
<OerHeks> OpenOffice, and tons more https://apps.ubuntu.com/cat/department/office/
<kabe> thanks
<lotuspsychje> good afternoon to all
<ducasse> \o lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> hey ducasse how are you mate
<ducasse> good, thanks - and you? finished work for the day?
<lotuspsychje> ducasse: have 3 days off, ad sunny weather
<lotuspsychje> and the last week of september holiday
<ducasse> good, make sure to enjoy it :)
<lotuspsychje> tnx
<lotuspsychje> http://thehackernews.com/2016/08/dropbox-data-breach.html
<lotuspsychje> the ara of mass exploit
<ducasse> here we go again...
<lotuspsychje> hey BluesKaj
<BluesKaj> Hiyas all
<lotuspsychje> ducasse: yeah i know..security is HOT item these days
<BluesKaj> Hey lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> i wonder how many dropbox users got passwords stolen, have linux boxes?
<lotuspsychje> a not updated firefox hijacked
<BluesKaj> I haven't used dropbox in a while, probly at least a year...I did receive an email the other day about resetting/changing my password,
<lotuspsychje> better do
<lotuspsychje> BluesKaj: http://thehackernews.com/2016/08/dropbox-data-breach.html
<ducasse> what is kind of alarming is that it says this data was grabbed in 2012, and they only alerted users this week. what good is that? four years is not an appropriate response time.
<BluesKaj> I don't have much there, just a few pics ...anyway I changed my pw
<BluesKaj> and I haven't had it linked to dolphin for a long time either
<lotuspsychje> cool
<lotuspsychje> i was never a dropbox fan
<lotuspsychje> dont like things moving in the cloud too much myself
<BluesKaj> we use picasa to share family pics etc
<ducasse> i don't think i even had an account there in 2012, all i have there anyway is a few gpg encrypted tarballs. not much to worry about.
<lotuspsychje> the time they dechiper that ducasse , their old :p
<ducasse> exactly - i'll be dead long before that happens :) i'm really glad i didn't trust their security, though.
<lotuspsychje> :p
<BluesKaj> I don;t store anything sensitive on the cloud ...I don't have much that's sensitive anyway
<lotuspsychje> the whole internet is kind of a cloud
 * Exterminador brb
#ubuntu-discuss 2016-09-01
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<OerHeks> Gooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooood keyboard
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> troll hour?
<OerHeks> yeah, lonely people
<OerHeks> he'll be back
<Ben64> dude lives in texas
<Ben64> he's got it bad enough
<Ben64> :(
<OerHeks> I live in Haarlem, please don't send me money.
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> good afternoon to all
<lotuspsychje> http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2016/08/quick-look-new-features-nautilus-3-22
<lotuspsychje> hey there BluesKaj
<BluesKaj> Hiyas all
<BluesKaj> hi lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> category tiles have been added to my site: http://www.lotuscomputers.be/
<BluesKaj> looks good lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> tnx BluesKaj
<ducasse> afternoon lotuspsychje, BluesKaj
<lotuspsychje> hey ducasse
<BluesKaj> hi ducasse
<ducasse> seems quiet in #ubuntu today?
<lotuspsychje> yeah not very active
<ducasse> good, i *need* to play with my powerline setup ;)
<lotuspsychje> :p
<lotuspsychje> bbl guys pancakes time
<lotuspsychje> re
<daftykins> :O
<daftykins> a wild lotus!
<lotuspsychje> hey daftykins
<lotuspsychje> daftykins: http://www.lotuscomputers.be/ how you like the category tiles?
<daftykins> :D
<lotuspsychje> hey Bashing-om
<daftykins> \o
<daftykins> someone came in -uk so i can help like i used to, oh the memories ;_;
<lotuspsychje> :p
<Bashing-om> A good day to IRC ! .. A good one for you daftykins ? ( 1 week to state side ) .
<daftykins> Bashing-om: :D yeah not bad thanks, keeping busy though until the last minute
<daftykins> just received a phone screen for a lass, so need to swap that over before i leave
<daftykins> how are things in Bashing-om land? who is winning, you or the grass?
<lotuspsychje> lol
<Bashing-om> Right now the grass is ahead . Things I should attend to, but At this time I prefer to be here . I am fortunate in that all things are optional within bounds .
<daftykins> :D
<lotuspsychje> alot of black intel screens on recent updates both trusty and xenial in main
<daftykins> o rly
<daftykins> is that using HWE kernels or the original 3.13?
 * daftykins doesn't like HWEs
<JanC> lotuspsychje: make sure you have the legal right to use those images
<lotuspsychje> JanC: that could get me in trouble?
<lotuspsychje> daftykins: regular kernels
<daftykins> i always install from 14.04.1 media then update to stay on the original ;)
<JanC> if you don't have the rights to them and the copyright owner gets your webshop taken down, then that would be trouble, I think?  :)
<lotuspsychje> yeps
<daftykins> mmm i think JanC raises a fair point, worth clearing them for use
<lotuspsychje> JanC: problem is, ive been searching for opensource icons, but not real relevant for what i need
<lotuspsychje> all hints welcome
<JanC> some might be okay to use, I don't know
<daftykins> have you guys seen this one where an ELAN touchpad is causing trouble? http://termbin.com/k60u
<JanC> the alternative is to create new ones yourself (maybe with the help of an experienced photo/graphics person)
<lotuspsychje> JanC: good idea
<JanC> usually you can use certain artwork from the manufacturer of products that you actually sell
<lotuspsychje> JanC: i think ill try to make some myself
<JanC> also, another place to get photos/images is stock photography/artwork websites
<JanC> which might be surprisingly cheap or even for free
<lotuspsychje> free sounds nice
<JanC> WikiMedia Commons has over 33mln free images/photos  :)
<JanC> and there are others
<lotuspsychje> lets have a look, tnx JanC
<JanC> e.g. https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Ubuntu_Phone_(16928839277).jpg
<JanC> or https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Ubuntu_Phone_3_devices.png
<lotuspsychje> free to share heh
<JanC> (not sure if GPL is a good license though)
<JanC> and make sure you honour attribution requests
<lotuspsychje> JanC: what does that mean
<daftykins> lotuspsychje: you have to write on the same page linking to the source of the image
<lotuspsychje> oh
<JanC> âattributionâ means you have to mention or point to the copyright owner somehow (there might be several ways to do that)
<lotuspsychje> unless its a free copyright icon?
<lotuspsychje> ok ill break my head about it tomorrow guys
<lotuspsychje> tnx for the hints
<lotuspsychje> and have a good evening all
<JanC> there are some good explanations on the creative commons website
<lotuspsychje> kk
<JanC> for things that are CC-something licenses
<JanC> -licensed
<Bashing-om> !info gcc
<ubot5> gcc (source: gcc-defaults (1.150ubuntu1)): GNU C compiler. In component main, is optional. Version 4:5.3.1-1ubuntu1 (xenial), package size 5 kB, installed size 44 kB
<Bashing-om> !info gcc-5
<ubot5> gcc-5 (source: gcc-5): GNU C compiler. In component main, is optional. Version 5.4.0-6ubuntu1~16.04.2 (xenial), package size 8358 kB, installed size 24522 kB
<Bashing-om> !info gcc-6
<ubot5> Package gcc-6 does not exist in xenial
<BluesKaj> Bashing-om, gcc-6-base perhaps
<BluesKaj> !gcc-6-base
<BluesKaj> !info gcc-6-base
<ubot5> gcc-6-base (source: gccgo-6): GCC, the GNU Compiler Collection (base package). In component main, is required. Version 6.0.1-0ubuntu1 (xenial), package size 13 kB, installed size 60 kB
<Bashing-om> BluesKaj: Not at sll sure of this, as : http://packages.ubuntu.com/search?searchon=contents&keywords=gcc-6-base&mode=exactfilename&suite=xenial-updates&arch=any >> Sorry, your search gave no results .
#ubuntu-discuss 2016-09-02
<Bashing-om> Eyes are crossing, time to call it :(
<OerHeks>  unity7 low graphics mode, finally someone making improvements http://www.whizzy.org/2016/09/unity-7-low-graphics-mode/
<BluesKaj> Hiyas all
<EriC^^> got me a a new ext hdd
<EriC^^> ah the look of a fresh smart data :D
<ducasse> nothing like fresh bits that haven't been used before ;)
<daftykins> ^_^
<EriC^^> ducasse: yeah :)
<daftykins> \o
<ducasse> \o daftykins
<daftykins> isn't it crazy that disks don't even store binary though, but an analog wave form?
<EriC^^> hey daftykins \o
<EriC^^> *mind blown*
<ducasse> i guy on a mailing list used the term 'recycling' today in the context of cleaning up his disk, and i got this image in my mind of him cutting up bytes with a scissor and dropping the bits into the bit bucket for re-use.
<ducasse> _a_ guy, that is.
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> they gotta be reused!
<ducasse> *clip* *plonk* *clip* *plonk* :)
<ducasse> btw EriC^^ - what kind of disk did you get?
<EriC^^> ducasse: a seagate backup slim 2tb
<EriC^^> it's a normal hdd
<EriC^^> it vibrates like crazy though, compared to the older one i had, seagate expansion 500gb
<daftykins> http://www.seagate.com/gb/en/consumer/backup/backup-plus/ ooh
<daftykins> hmm put it on a sponge :D
<EriC^^> that's the plus one i think, i got the smaller slim one
<daftykins> ever see that video of a guy in a data centre / server room, where shouting into a drive shows it slowing down?
<EriC^^> it's very tiny, like 3/4 the size of the older 500gb one O.o and slimmer
<ducasse> i've seen those, small and practical for carrying around. i've had so many bad experiences with seagate, personally, although i hear they have gotten better.
<EriC^^> oh yeah, the link the is correct
<EriC^^> personally i love seagate, my old one lasted a good 7 years or so, and i've dropped it maybe 10 times or more
<ducasse> sure, my 'evidence' is all anecdotal. only have one seagate now, one of the dreaded 3tb barracudas, and it has been working for many years now :)
<daftykins> a friend is buying one of these old core 2 duo PCs i have, i put my old 150GB WD raptor HDD, one of those 10,000RPM suckers in it - oh my word the scratchiness from boot is insane
<EriC^^> :)
<daftykins> proper trip down memory lane
<daftykins> shall i video it? :>
<EriC^^> :D
<ducasse> daftykins: i had a 10.000rpm seagate cheetah scsi-ii disk maaaaany years ago, sounded like a jet when it spun up.
<daftykins> :>
<EriC^^> it's hard to imagine there's a disk in my hdd spinning at 5400rpm or so
<daftykins> indeedy
<daftykins> i get really gentle when i deal with a laptop with a mechanical in now XD
<daftykins> love having solid state only, then i fling them around like they're nothing ^_^
<daftykins> kinda feel like i should put in a better drive...
<ducasse> <3 ssd's, got two 850 evo's in my desktop. kind of regret not getting m2 instead, but... *shrug*
<EriC^^> i've yet to experience a ssd
<daftykins> !
<daftykins> EriC^^: once you do, you can never go back
<EriC^^> :D
<ducasse> i've actually got too many, have three cheap 120gb ssd's that have been replaced. not sure what to do with them, maybe a new root mirror on the server.
<daftykins> post one to EriC^^ ;)
<EriC^^> tonight i'm going to go try to take some nights pics of lebanon
<daftykins> maybe i will put this SSD i have in that white macbook in, then i can put a 40GB spare in there which is much more bearable for Linux - i don't think i'm ever going to sell that macbook because it's too rubbish now
<daftykins> yay pics \o/
<EriC^^> i got the nikon camera i wanted :D yesterday i went to take some pics at night and some security guy pulled over and told me i couldn't take pics from there cause it's a private area
<EriC^^> lol, i was literally at the side of the road, but there's a gate to a still to-be-built resort/village kind of thing, pretty stupid
<daftykins> o0 sounds like a guy on a power trip
<ducasse> here on norway the most common security firm is often called 'the berry police'. :)
<ducasse> _in_ norway.
<EriC^^> yeah, i think he was bored or something and thought some teens were parked on the side of the road making out or something :D
<daftykins> playing pokÃ©mon go
<EriC^^> :D
<EriC^^> anyone playing noman's sky?
<daftykins> i watched some twitch guys stream it, wow huge drama surround that one
<EriC^^> yeah lots
<daftykins> saw one travel to the centre of the galaxy in the game to see the end... wow.
<SonikkuAmerica> When did #ubuntu-discuss become #ubuntu-offtopic-v2 ?
<daftykins> i think they have a chance to improve it still, but oof
<EriC^^> i haven't yet, i'm like mid journey or something
<daftykins> SonikkuAmerica: problem?
<EriC^^> SonikkuAmerica: like 2 years ago or something, couldn't been before too :P
<SonikkuAmerica> daftykins: Nah, not the biggest problem, just seems weird :P I thought this was on-topic Ubuntu-related discussion, is all
<daftykins> it becomes that when someone raises a relevant topic.
<ducasse> and honestly, there's a fair amount of on-topic discussion here too. just not right now :)
<daftykins> ^+1
<SonikkuAmerica> Oh
<SonikkuAmerica> lol
<daftykins> we've kinda turned it into a volunteer chat base
<SonikkuAmerica> cool
<SonikkuAmerica> I'm kind of interested in discussing how the new Ubuntu core apps would work in an Xorg fallback situation as probably 90% of Ubuntu users will have to deal with (since Intel is not supporting Mir)
<daftykins> i don't even know where Mir is at right now, in regard to when it will become the norm
<daftykins> not sure what you mean by core apps either
<SonikkuAmerica> I wish I had a machine to test Mir on, but all my stuff has Intel integrated graphics
<ducasse> i've decided to give mir a wide berth. could probably test it on my laptop, i just can't find any reason to.
<SonikkuAmerica> Me too. I prefer Wayland
<ducasse> +1. more fragmentation when reinventing the linux desktop is Bad.
<daftykins> might work in a VM then?
<SonikkuAmerica> daftykins: Haven't tried in a while, but I think I ran into a problem with VBox. Might try with VMware or KVM though
<daftykins> can't wait until we're no longer having to deal with the kind of rubbish X.org requires, i was dealing with xorg.conf modelines just yesterday - on the other hand, i won't have a clue how to support anyone in the future :D
<daftykins> yeah virtualbox is a mess in my experience
<ducasse> i'm sure the mir devs test on at least some vm platform.
<ducasse> i'd guess kvm.
<daftykins> http://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2013/09/intel-rejection-of-ubuntus-mir-patch-forces-canonical-to-go-own-way/
<daftykins> you sure the intel no support thing is XMir and not Mir?
<daftykins> as usual with FOSS it's as clear as mud :>
<SonikkuAmerica> Well, let's turn on the mud vision goggles and have a look
<daftykins> maybe that's why ubuntu was always brown... :D
<SonikkuAmerica> Well, here's the Ars Technica article where it all started: http://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2013/09/intel-rejection-of-ubuntus-mir-patch-forces-canonical-to-go-own-way/
<daftykins> that's the same link.
<SonikkuAmerica> The idea is that Intel would not support Mir in xf86-video-intel (which we know as xserver-xorg-video-intel)
<daftykins> but they're saying XMir, not Mir
<SonikkuAmerica> So it looks like Canonical will set up a way to get XMir running, but they're going to have to do that work in-house
<daftykins> when i read that, i see XMir as an intermediary half way house that's not necessary
<SonikkuAmerica> kind of like how ArchLinux handles Intel microcode updates (as a separate initial ramdisk)
<daftykins> EriC^^: https://www.dropbox.com/s/mlmolbvsh6idbgk/M.2-SSD_vs_150GB-WD-raptor.png?dl=0
<daftykins> hilarious ^
<ducasse> EriC^^: did you get the hp printer working?
<daftykins> might need more sacrifices :)
<ducasse> wave a chicken over it :)
<ducasse> headless, if necessary.
<EriC^^> ducasse: nope
<ducasse> EriC^^: it won't show up if you scan for network printers?
<EriC^^> wow daftykins that's pretty substantial when you put it side to side
<EriC^^> ducasse: nope, it says no devices could be found
<EriC^^> if i press print in gedit it can kind of see it, and says gathering information but hangs at that
<ducasse> interesting. everything seems to be good on the printer side of things? does it have a display/menu?
<EriC^^> yup it's working fine
<EriC^^> it says it needs the usb to be connected temporarily to set it up, then it can use the wireless
<ducasse> weird. thinking...
<ducasse> i guess it's using the typical printer usb b plug?
<EriC^^> i think so
<ducasse> the almost square plug?
<EriC^^> yup that's it
<ducasse> they're easy enough to find, but annoying to buy one to use for five minutes.
<EriC^^> yeah
<EriC^^> i'll give this a go http://askubuntu.com/questions/635753/hp-envy-4500-wifi-printer-not-found-using-wifi
<EriC^^> connect it to the wlan and try to ping it
<ducasse> just entering the url was what i was thinking of too.
<ducasse> i've got an epson wifi printer where you just configure networking in the display, then it should be auto-discoverable. can't see why the pc would need to talk to it over a cable first. if so, the cable should be included.
<EriC^^> hmm right now the printer is connected to the android phone
<EriC^^> i'm tethering the internet from it for the pc
<ducasse> well, if there's anything you want me to check about how mine is configured i'll look, a lot of stuff should be the same although these are different makes.
<EriC^^> thanks
<EriC^^> it seems that the printer is 192.168.43.59
<ducasse> same subnet as pc?
<EriC^^> i think so
<EriC^^> i did hp-setup then wireless/ethernet then advanced and put the printer's ip
<EriC^^> seems to have found it
<ducasse> \o/
<EriC^^> yay!
<EriC^^> now for a test page :D
<EriC^^> awesome, it's working :)
<ducasse> goodie :) how's the print quality?
<EriC^^> pretty decent
<EriC^^> nice to see the gedit font on paper :D
<ducasse> :)
<ducasse> thinking of buying a hp laser, i'm fed up with inkjets. what they charge for the ink for mine is just laughable.
<daftykins> i've had the misfortune of setting up wireless printers like that, often there's a crazy button press combo to use WPS connections that's easy, otherwise yeah it can be hassle over a cable to begin to configure
<ducasse> i don't get why they can't just include the cable with the printer...
<EriC^^> how much do the ink costs?
<EriC^^> yeah, i was wondering the same thing, it's kind of silly
<ducasse> over Â£100 for all six cartridges.
<EriC^^> yikes
<ducasse> that's about half of what the printer itself cost.
<EriC^^> hehe
<daftykins> because they sell these Â£30 things that are destined for the landfill now, a cable would probably add a lot if you mass produce the machine
<EriC^^> my last printer was back in 1998 when i first got a pc, so i'm looking at this one like it's a piece of magic right now
<daftykins> XD
 * daftykins avoids them
<ducasse> i was just typing exactly that, daftykins
<ducasse> :)
<EriC^^> i never really use them as well
<EriC^^> back in the day i used to like to print guides and stuff and take them to the bathroom to read sometimes
<EriC^^> now i just carry the laptop with me :D
<daftykins> XD
<daftykins> i get a lot of RSS feed news read in there ;)
<ducasse> i want a small tablet to use for reading docs and such. would be nice to have lying on the desk with reference books, etc.
<ducasse> btw EriC^^, if you have a use for a cheap kingston 120gb ssd i'd be happy to send you one. they've all been in use for about six months, after that they've mainly just been powered on.
<EriC^^> i'm getting a new laptop next week that comes with a ssd, i appreciate the offer though :)
<ducasse> okidoke, let me know if you change your mind. they're just collecting dust :)
<EriC^^> ok :)
<ducasse> i absolutely love solid-state storage. best thing to happen for computing in a long time :)
<EriC^^> yup, can't wait to try it out!
<ducasse> i mean, with the speed of memory, system bus and cpu's these days, storage was really the bottleneck.
<EriC^^> yeah
<EriC^^> i wish they'd made bigger and faster cpu's for laptops soon
<EriC^^> *make
<daftykins> wrong choice imo
<ducasse> i'd guess power is the main issue.
<EriC^^> why
<dax> i'd rather have same speed more efficiency
<dax> than faster and same efficiency
<dax> haven't been CPU-bound in ages
<EriC^^> i read the 2 core and 4 core basically use similar power
<EriC^^> sounds kind of silly now that i think of it, but i read it somewhere :D
<ducasse> this laptop is just an old i3, but even that is plenty fast for much of what i do.
<EriC^^> seems the power consumption is pretty higher on the i7 than i5
<EriC^^> like 30w vs 50w
<daftykins> desktop for performance, laptop for mobility and battery life - is my approach :)
<ducasse> +1
<EriC^^> they should make something like the mercedes 600 v12, it had a button that could use 6cylinders or 12cylinders
<EriC^^> that would be pretty nice
<daftykins> you can get so-called 'DTR' laptops, desktop replacement, but they're a bit mad
<daftykins> i never understand how anyone that does IT work seriously can cope with owning just a laptop at home :D plenty around though
<EriC^^> the first laptop i got was an i7 4 core, i didn't even know what i was buying, i thought it was like pentium 1 2 3 4, i3 i5 i7
<daftykins> :D
<EriC^^> so now i think if i get a 2 core it'll be slow or something
<ducasse> actually had a dual pentium ii-400 just around the time linux gained smp support, good times :)
<daftykins> not all i7s are even quad ;)
<daftykins> (in the mobile space)
<ducasse> quad + ht, right?
<daftykins> no some i7s are dual
<ducasse> oh, ok.
<daftykins> so you can never go by number - got to dig up the spec sheet on ark.intel.com :)
<EriC^^> yup
<EriC^^> i5 and i7 6500u are like 10% difference
<daftykins> lol a guy in #kodi just wanted to use it on a phone to share videos to a desktop "because i cba to get the cable" uuuuugh
<EriC^^> some i5 are 4 core too
<daftykins> yarr
<ducasse> daftykins: cba?
<daftykins> can't be bothered, lazy
<EriC^^> nothing beats the guy who wanted linux to turn on his light in the room
<EriC^^> "i want to turn my pc on and have it turn the light on too, and turn it off when i shutdown"
<ducasse> "get an rpi"
<daftykins> i put two Pis in as network music streamers at a clients the other day, after having that test one at my place
<daftykins> synced up FLAC playback in 4 rooms from the basement file server :) all controlled by smartphone app
<ducasse> daftykins: what software? i want something similar.
<daftykins> picoreplayer on the devices and logitech media server on the file server
<daftykins> http://downloads.slimdevices.com/nightly/index.php
<ducasse> ok, i'd probably just share the music over nfs, was thinking maybe mpd on the player(s)
<daftykins> these are great because pcp runs from RAM only after booting tinycore Linux, so no card corruption
<daftykins> at theirs i had to use analog, but i use HDMI audio into my AV receiver here
<daftykins> i'm married to the LMS software though because i own an actual squeezebox device
<ducasse> ah. i've never looked at it, i don't believe in streaming music. i prefer access to the actual files.
<daftykins> that's what i am doing, it's just coming from the file server on the LAN
<daftykins> i also do not touch any of this internet based streaming malarkey :)
<ducasse> no, i want direct access to the metadata etc. it's the only sane way to do things, imo. :)
<daftykins> yes that's what this allows
<daftykins> the tags in the files which they're playing...
<ducasse> exactly. i've heard so many good things about mpd, and it would integrate nicely into the rest of my (pretty weird) setup.
<daftykins> that picoreplayer handles the 24/96 FLAC nicely, too
<ducasse> daftykins: have you looked at beets?
<daftykins> nah
<ducasse> just looks like a tool i'd like :)
<daftykins> mmm i'm very much in the latter stages of the library angle, mines fine already
<daftykins> though i do check everything new i rip
<ducasse> mine too, actually, but beets can do some small things that's be nice, like dl artwork, lyrics, generate playlists etc. a few small things i haven't done yet.
<ducasse> at 400gb it's too much to manage by hand.
<daftykins> mmm i've got something similar already
<ducasse> i've still got a lot to rip, it's just not something i love spending time on...
<daftykins> heh this 500GB WD blue laptop drive from my sandybridge asus laptop purchased ~2010/2011 is twice as quick as the 10,000RPM 3.5" i benchmarked earlier
<daftykins> mmm, i just throw it on in the background on my file server, done a lot for my client
<ducasse> hope you fleeced him :)
<ducasse> well, getting too late for me - good night, all
<daftykins> cya sir \o
<daftykins> !find caja
<ubot5> Found: caja-dropbox, caja, caja-actions, caja-actions-common, caja-actions-dbg, caja-actions-dev, caja-common, caja-dbg, caja-extensions-common, caja-extensions-dbg (and 16 others) http://packages.ubuntu.com/search?keywords=caja&searchon=names&suite=xenial&section=all
<daftykins> !info caja-dropbox
<ubot5> caja-dropbox (source: caja-dropbox): Dropbox integration for Caja. In component multiverse, is optional. Version 1.12.0-3 (xenial), package size 84 kB, installed size 274 kB (Only available for amd64; i386)
<Bashing-om> !info wine
<ubot5> wine (source: wine1.6): Microsoft Windows Compatibility Layer (meta-package). In component universe, is extra. Version 1:1.6.2-0ubuntu14 (xenial), package size 0 kB, installed size 6 kB (Only available for i386; amd64)
#ubuntu-discuss 2016-09-03
<ducasse> morning, all
<EriC^^> morning ducasse :)
<ducasse> hey, EriC^^ - take any photos while i was sleeping? :)
<EriC^^> hehe no :)
<ducasse> just thought you mentioned last night you wanted to take some night pics :)
<ducasse> what kind of camera is this new one you bought, anyway?
<EriC^^> yeah i do, maybe today :)
<EriC^^> it's a nikon 5300d
<ducasse> wow, that looks nice :) i was into photography when i was back in school, they had a darkroom that they let me use. haven't kept it up, though.
<EriC^^> it seems like a nice hobby, sometimes when i drive in the morning or sunset the sky looks really nice and i think i wish i had a camera or something
<ducasse> yes it does, i really liked the darkroom work as well. not much of that these days :)
<EriC^^> sounds interesting
<EriC^^> i recently just read about camera's and pictures and stuff
<EriC^^> iso aperture and shutter speed
<ducasse> a friend of mine is a professional photographer, he used to do some really impressive work with making prints on highly specialized paper in various ways, it's a real art.
<EriC^^> that's cool
<ducasse> i need to reinstall my server now, so i'll need to set up my mail services again. was thinking of putting it into an lxc container on a loop device to make it easy to back up and move around, any thoughts on that?
<EriC^^> i've never used lxc containers, no idea
<EriC^^> but it sounds simple enough?
<EriC^^> you transport the whole mail service then transport it back?
<ducasse> ok, i'll ask for tips in #ubuntu-server, but since it has just one user i don't think performance should be a problem.
<EriC^^> aha
<ducasse> no, i just replicate the config into a container so it is easy to move if i need to later, or for the next time i reinstall.
<EriC^^> oh i see
<ducasse> the ideal scenario on a fresh install is to just let the installer run, set up zfs, and just start all my containers.
<EriC^^> i've yet to delve into containers and virtualization and such
<EriC^^> pretty eager to learn about these stuff, maybe some day
<EriC^^> deployment, etc. after all if i hope to get a job in linux one day i'd need these stuff for sure
<ducasse> i really like both kvm and lxc, just started looking at lxc about six months back. it works really well.
<ducasse> i wish we had virt back when i was working in the indestry :)
<ducasse> *industry
<EriC^^> cool, yeah it seems to open a lot of possibilities and stuff
<ducasse> yes, things like libvirt are just soooo nice to work with, also. /me <3 libvirt and zfs :)
<EriC^^> :)
<ducasse> knowing how to work with libvirt would certainly help you get a job. lxd as well.
 * EriC^^ will look into them
<EriC^^> sometimes i wish we could do like the movie matrix and plug in all those info to our brains
<EriC^^> lol, so much to learn, so little time
<ducasse> tip for EriC^^: one of the fedora sites, the one with all the docs, has a really good one on virtualization, how to work with virt-manager etc.
<EriC^^> thank you :)
<EriC^^> i'll check it out
<ducasse> all of the #ubuntu* collective knowledge would be really awesome :-D
<ducasse> lots of smart people here
<EriC^^> yeah
<ducasse> what kind of laptop are you getting next week, btw?
<EriC^^> i was thinking the msi prestige pe60 6qe , or the msi leopard pro gp62 6qe
<EriC^^> i wish i could get both, it's a little difficult deciding on the color
<EriC^^> i've never had a silver laptop before so i kind of want it, then again i'm used to good black laptops
<ducasse> is this a problem? https://forum-en.msi.com/index.php?topic=271163.0
<ducasse> EriC^^: see discussion at bottom: http://www.linlap.com/msi_gp62_leopard_pro
<EriC^^> seems doable
<EriC^^> the nvidia/intel hybrid thing might be a hassle though
<ducasse> yes, it seems the 960m has/had a few problems with linux, but all the posts i can find are ~6 months old or older, so it might be fixed now.
<EriC^^> yeah, many people come to the channel cause of hybrid graphics problems
<EriC^^> amd is more straightforward i think
<ducasse> yes, but are you planning to game under linux? are the amd drivers good enough now?
<EriC^^> nope no gaming
<EriC^^> i want it for the i7 4 core honestly
<ducasse> oh, then you should be fine, i'd expect. i'd still probably avoid amd, but that's just me.
<EriC^^> yeah amd isn't that great right now i think
<BluesKaj> Hiyas all
#ubuntu-discuss 2016-09-04
<Bashing-om> I may not have overstayed my welcome, but I still must depart . Sleep calleth .
<BluesKaj> Hiyas all
#ubuntu-discuss 2017-08-28
<lordievader> Good morning
<ducasse> morning, all
<lordievader> Hey ducasse
<lordievader> How are you doing?
<ducasse> morning lordievader! all good here, and you? at work?
<lordievader> Doing good here. Indeed at work.
<ducasse> i'm going to set up a few lxd containers on my server today, move the services that run on it into them.
<lordievader> From a vm to there, or services running on the server itself?
<ducasse> both.
<lordievader> Cool
<lordievader> I should move some stuff too, to vm's and/or containers.
<lordievader> My server does way to much next to being a hypervisor.
<ducasse> nice if you later need to move services to another machine etc.
<ducasse> easy to manage.
<ducasse> why do people think #ubuntu is a good place to whine about not enough people using linux?
<lordievader> People think `#*ubuntu*` is good for whining about anything.
<ducasse> *nod*
<ducasse> looks like this will be a good day to start off with extra caffeine :)
<ducasse> "its a package developed by a developer" - talking about being willfully obtuse.
<Ben64> over in ##linux doing the same crap
<ducasse> i know, i warned him about crossposting but he just ignored it.
<Ben64> i don't know how they expect it to get resolved like that
<Ben64> its like going to a mechanic "hey my car is making a noise"
<Ben64> "oh, what car, can i see it? whats the noise"
<Ben64> "it has 4 wheels"
<ducasse> it shouldn't be that hard to get them to post the bloody details, why are they being so secretive about them?
<Ben64> no idea
<Ben64> jim is trying for some reason
<ducasse> best of luck to him :)
<BluesKaj> Hey folks
<ducasse> hi BluesKaj, wb. all well i hope?
<BBMAsk> All function for Xorg it's can be reconfigure by xorg.conf - there is another better options, like app that can be lunch from contro center i Ubuntu in section display ?
<BBMAsk> Or plan to write it ?
<BluesKaj> Hi ducasse, yes fine here, and you?
<BBMAsk> There is possible injection/parse Configure parameter to Xorg server ?
<ducasse> BluesKaj: good, thanks :) setting up containers on my server today, moving a couple of very light services to the rpi.
<BluesKaj> well, goodbye to debian, i refuse to run  anOS whose support is run by anti-social geeks who can't even tolerate a common ciourtesy greeting, who make up ridiculous rules to keep unnecessary chatter like saying hello out of their precious support chat.
<daftykins> ouch, so it's even worse than #ubuntu ? :)
<BluesKaj> yes, much worse. more like arch
<BluesKaj> hi daftykins , btw :-)
<daftykins> heya :)
<ducasse> BluesKaj: here or on oftc?
<BluesKaj> ducasse, here on freenode
<Bashing-om> I happen to like to carry on a line of chatter, If I can not I wont, but I wont be there ( ask ubuntu ) .
<BluesKaj> the devel and debian testing chats oare on oftc , but they have practically all the same ops there too
<BluesKaj> Hi Bashing-om, chatter is one thing but just saying hello is not chatter in my book
<ducasse> BluesKaj: was not aware of that, thought the official chans were all there - until i asked alis just now
<BluesKaj> think I'll give neon a try on the old hdd
<BluesKaj> bblk
<Bashing-om> I give in - Nap time - Be back later .
<Bashing-om> !info linux-image-generic xenial
<ubot5> linux-image-generic (source: linux-meta): Generic Linux kernel image. In component main, is optional. Version 4.4.0.93.98 (xenial), package size 2 kB, installed size 13 kB
<Bashing-om> New kernel is out for xenial ^^ .
<oerheks> zesty too, 4.10.0-33-generic #37-Ubuntu
<daftykins> sheesh 3.13.0-129 here on trusty
<nacc> daftykins: well, that'd be because you've chosen not to use hwe :)
<daftykins> yep, don't need hardware support on a server in a VM!
<nacc> daftykins: :)
#ubuntu-discuss 2017-08-29
<JanC> daftykins: there _might_ be support for more/better virtual devices or virtualisation features (assuming the host also supports these)
<ducasse> hi everyone
<lotuspsychje> bbl work
<lotuspsychje> hey ducasse have a nice1
<BluesKaj> Hiyas all
<nicomachus> having some trouble there BluesKaj?
<BluesKaj> yeah, trying out neon , and it is buggypw setting doesn't stick, vpn connection to freenode fails etc etc
<nicomachus> all from a DE change?
<BluesKaj> nope i installed the actual OS, it's some what different than just adding the desktop
<nicomachus> oh I see
<immu> hi
<Bashing-om> Hi guys - here we go again .
<ducasse> wb Bashing-om, ready for another session? :)
<immu> like whats fancy
<Bashing-om> ducasse: Getting there - hope not as nutso as yesterday :P
<ducasse> Bashing-om: today starte off very quiet here, but it seems busier now. not my problem, though, i'm not staying around that much longer :)
<Bashing-om> ducasse: A pause for the cause . I see what I can do to keep your seat warm :)
<ducasse> Bashing-om: always interesting, though - learn something new every day :)
<Bashing-om> ducasse: Yepper, When I am stumped - when I learn the most . Glad I have this resource of great minds at my disposal .
#ubuntu-discuss 2017-08-30
<lotuspsychje> morning guys :p
<Bashing-om> I resemble that ! Hey lotuspsychje :)
<lotuspsychje> hey hey Bashing-om
<Bashing-om> gnite all
<ducasse> hi all
<BluesKaj> howdy folks
<ducasse> morning BluesKaj
<BluesKaj> 'Morning ducasse
<BluesKaj> dumped debian switched to kde-neon on the spare hdd
<ducasse> what do you think of it? didn't it have problems before?
<BluesKaj> ducasse, debian is fine, but I'm not gonna an OS with idiots running their support chat
<BluesKaj> use
<ducasse> i heard you said they were being a bit weird, but isn't that a common problem in the linux community?
<BluesKaj> or allows idiots to run their support chat
<BluesKaj> not that common in my experience, very few actually, only debian and arch supports come to mind
<BluesKaj> there are nutters , but these guys were off their rockers in my opnion.
<ducasse> i've heard arch support was bad, but haven't used it yet - the wiki normally provides answers. but i agree with you, saying 'hi' shouldn't be a capital offence.
<BluesKaj> yup
<ducasse> maybe you came in at a bad moment :)
<BluesKaj> arch support was more elitist and insulting to new users, like kids in a playground with new ball , no one else was allowed to play
<BluesKaj> well the whole debian chat experience wasn't good, it was also immature and silly
<ducasse> that's basically what i've heard (about arch support), but imagined it was more a 'rtfm' thing..
<ducasse> btw, you don't use netflix, do you? any idea what a good solution is for us kodi users to get access? do we need to get a chromecast or something?
<ducasse> *kodi/rpi
<BluesKaj> ducasse, used netflix a couple of yrs ago when my daughter let us sue her pw, it needs a browser like chrome or the new FF
<BluesKaj> it ran fine in chrome
<ducasse> yes, or something with an app, which was more what i was thinking of. i want access on my non-smart tv...
<ducasse> i'll probably just get a chromecast and use the tablet, as it's likely the cheapest option.
<ducasse> daftykins: any opinions? ^^
<BluesKaj> ducasse, yes,.,my tv is also a non smart, and the dvi to hdmi connection from this old pc works well
<BluesKaj> my setup here is a basic home theater with video and audio fairly well integrated with the pc
<ducasse> i _could_ do that, but i'd need to connect a computer first, which is something i'd rather avoid for now.
<BluesKaj> heh even a rpi would work
<ducasse> that i've got :) maybe setting up x and a browser would be a solution - i'll check that.
<BluesKaj> Ive had a "home theater" setup since TV was black and white :-)
<ducasse> :)
<ducasse> i'll build a htpc again some time, but for now i haven't got any appropriate spare hw
<BluesKaj> here in NA TV audio was FM quality , connected our 21" Philips tv to my Pioneer amp from the ground side of the volume ctrl ...I used to amaze my friends with the sound quality TV could achieve.
<BluesKaj> forgot to mention that was back in the early 70s
<ducasse> that must have been quite impressive :)
<daftykins> ducasse: yo, the Amazon FireTV is a good way to get subscription services and also have the option of Kodi on the side if you want any local media
<daftykins> essentially it's like adding the smart to a dumb TV
<BluesKaj> kodi tuns a non-smart tv into a smart one IMO
<daftykins> yeah no subscription streaming services though
<daftykins> so if they're a concern...
<BluesKaj> you can if you have paid subscription, some services are available thru kodi if you have user and pw
<daftykins> hmm Netflix still seems to be a work in progress last i saw, suspicious sources to even install the addons
<BluesKaj> iirc some of the pay sports chans are available in kodi
#ubuntu-discuss 2017-08-31
<donofrio> anyone know how I can export user setting's and xfce settings for vlock and such, I have more than one user on this ubuntu install.....would like them all to have the same setup...export config or?
<leftyfb> donofrio: please keep support questions in #ubuntu
<lotuspsychje> good morning guys
<Bashing-om> I be done , headed off to bed now . g nite all \o
<ducasse> morning all
<ducasse> hi lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> hey ducasse
<ducasse> work day?
<lotuspsychje> ducasse: day off
<lotuspsychje> ducasse: and 4 weeks end of contract :p
<ducasse> ah, sweet. any plans, or will you be hanging around here?
<ducasse> yes, i read that. congrats! :)
<lotuspsychje> ducasse: i found new kitchen work, with better terms
<lotuspsychje> ducasse: so more time off for personal life (irc also)
<ducasse> that will be good :)
<lotuspsychje> yeah :p
<lotuspsychje> ducasse: how can one check if its running xorg or wayland?
<ducasse> good question, i guess inspect the environment.
<lordievader> Good morning
<lordievader> lotuspsychje: Search for the running process
<lotuspsychje> morning lordievader
<lordievader> Hey lotuspsychje
<lordievader> How are you doing?
<lotuspsychje> great here
<ducasse> hi lordievader, working hard?
<lordievader> Yesterday my graduation. But I still have a paper deadline the 5th, so yes ;)
<ducasse> :)
<lotuspsychje> gonna install artful on my biz desktop
<lotuspsychje> burning iso
<ducasse> lotuspsychje: are you running artful on all your machines now?
<lotuspsychje> ducasse: no, notebook still got xenial
<lotuspsychje> ducasse: i had a test laptop for artful
<lotuspsychje> ducasse: as its solid already, gonna move my desktop too
<lotuspsychje> and gonna help test towards 18.04
<lotuspsychje> curious how it wil go on my 'older' hardware :p
<ducasse> it seems to be working pretty well for me as well, haven't had any major issues.
<lotuspsychje> cool
<lotuspsychje> going mush better then gnome-shell xenial for sure
<lotuspsychje> wish me luck ducasse iso done
<ducasse> no idea about that, last time i tried gnome was probably trusty :)
<ducasse> have fun! :)
<lotuspsychje> tnx
<lotuspsychje> done :p
<lotuspsychje> lordievader, seems like xorg still shows in processes
<lordievader> lotuspsychje: Then you are probably still running X ;)
<lotuspsychje> lordievader, sidebar(left) has come as default now looking good
<lotuspsychje> and size of dock settings are in display options
<lotuspsychje> placement options not there yet
<lordievader> In what? Ubuntu gnome?
<lotuspsychje> yeah 17.10
<lotuspsychje> installed it on my desktop for business now lordievader
<lordievader> A development release on production?
<lotuspsychje> yep
<lotuspsychje> its not like its a server or something :p
<lotuspsychje> and got good backups
<lotuspsychje> http://imgur.com/a/v7A5y
<lordievader> Still you don't want things to break randomly because of an update.
<lotuspsychje> lordievader, im helping bug out aswell, so if it breaks ill report :p
<lotuspsychje> gnome software is bit laggy
<lotuspsychje> lordievader: lotuspsychje@ArtfullBOX:~$ ps -e | grep wayland
<lotuspsychje>  1857 tty1     00:00:00 gdm-wayland-ses
<lotuspsychje>  1881 tty1     00:00:00 Xwayland
<lordievader> Ah, Xwayland.
<lordievader> Wayland on top of X.
<lotuspsychje> at gdm there's ubuntu as default login and choosable gnome(wayland)
<lotuspsychje> sorry gnome5XORG)
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> lotuspsychje@ArtfullBOX:~$ ps -e | grep X
<lotuspsychje>  1881 tty1     00:00:00 Xwayland
<lotuspsychje>  2278 tty2     00:01:02 Xorg
<lotuspsychje> grocerys bbl guys
<lotuspsychje> and hey EriC^^ :p
<BluesKaj> Hi folks
<BluesKaj> hey ducasse, think you may have hit the nail on the head there with JuJubee...he's famous fro mucking up and compalining as if he didn't make any mistakes
<ducasse> yes, he disappeared right after i asked, so...
<BluesKaj> yeah, exactly :-)
<leftyfb> though to be fair, do-release-upgrade removes ppa's
<ducasse> but not the packages from them
<ducasse> it just comments them out
<leftyfb> true
<BluesKaj> well, he might have done a clean install to / and set the mountpoint for /home
<BluesKaj> why else would he have a messed up installation
<ducasse> something is odd here, or i don't think it would be this borked
<BluesKaj> squid and unity probs
#ubuntu-discuss 2017-09-01
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<Bashing-om> \0 lotuspsychje . S L O W .
<lotuspsychje> hey Bashing-om time for a coffee then :p
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: installed artful on my desktop yesterday
<lotuspsychje> as its rock solid already
<Bashing-om> Testers say they have had nothing to do . Does not break . :)
<lotuspsychje> lol
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: the world stands still at your timezone i think
<lotuspsychje> Bashing-om: meaning its time for a new ubuntu release :p
<lotuspsychje> to get the channel crowdy again
<Bashing-om> Naw . 'buntu has become so solid and user friendly that a new release no longer is a big deal in support :(
<lotuspsychje> also true!
<Bashing-om> The last big fu-fer-all I recall was the 12.04 release .
<lotuspsychje> i think 17.10 will be the bomb
<lotuspsychje> so many gnome changes lately
<Bashing-om> Yeah .. 17.10 will be " somerging else" .. I look forward to what 18.04 is to be .
<Bashing-om> lotuspsychje: Me think me soon " just not detected at all " .
<ducasse> morning all
<lordievader> Good morning
<ducasse> hi lordievader
<ducasse> all well?
<lordievader> Hi ducasse, doing allright here.
<lordievader> Ordered a new keyboard yesterday \o/
<lordievader> How are you doing?
<ducasse> oh, what model? i'm fine, thanks - trying to wake up :)
<lordievader> A Ducky One TKL with blue leds and MX Browns :D
<lordievader> Wanted a smaller mechanical keyboard for easier traveling.
<lordievader> My fullsize keyboard does not fit in my backpack :(
<ducasse> nice :) i've got a das keyboard pro 4 with mx blue - totally love it.
<ducasse> 'tkl' = 'tenkeyless'?
<lordievader> The one I have at home is also a DAS keyboard. One with blank keycaps and mx browns as well.
<lordievader> Yes. Without the numpad.
<ducasse> how much was the ducky?
<lordievader> 90 euros. But I had a gift card.
<lordievader> Originally it was a 114.
<lordievader> The one without the leds at the cheapest place was the same price.
<ducasse> you need blue leds, though ;)
<lordievader> Hahaha, honestly I don't know XD
<lordievader> There is also an RGB version, but that one is about 20-30 euros more expensive.
<ducasse> proper mechanical keyboards are hard to find here, almost everything you find are these cheesy backlit gaming things.
<ducasse> i used to have a razer, but their switches are nowhere near as nice as cherry's.
<lordievader> I had the same feeling when hunting for one.
<lordievader> On the one hand I had the idea that other switches might be okay, but on the other hand, of MX switches I know they are nice.
<ducasse> there are other nice switches, but generally not on gaming keyboards that i've tried. i'm sticking with cherry until i find something i'm certain i like better.
<lordievader> Yes, if you can try them first it is a different story, but spending ~100 euros on something you are not sure about....
<ducasse> exactly. i'm now looking for a good trackball, to take the load off my hands and wrists. not much to choose from, unfortunately, and almost never on display on shops.
<lordievader> No, you rarely see those things. I happen to know our secretary uses one.
<ducasse> i have to wear this support thing for my right wrist, and keep hearing that trackballs can help...
<nicomachus> !eol
<ubot5> End-Of-Life is the time when security updates and support for an Ubuntu release stop, see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Releases for more information. Looking to upgrade from an EOL release? See https://help.ubuntu.com/community/EOLUpgrades
<daftykins> :D
<nicomachus> that wiki page is SO OUT OF DATE
<nicomachus> like every other.
<nicomachus> "specific examples" at the bottom only goes up to 11.04 > 12.04 upgrade
<daftykins> hahaha :D
<nicomachus> trying to help some kid on reddit that is stuck on 16.10 and is getting errors from do-release-upgrade... it'd be nice to have specific instructions. but ok.
<daftykins> you might have to go Lt. Ripley on them
<nicomachus> Lt. Ripley?
<nicomachus> god, this page still shows apt-get instructions too. bah.
<nicomachus> https://www.reddit.com/r/Ubuntu/comments/6xdl7r/cant_upgrade_ubuntu/
<nicomachus>  ^ that's the thread
<nicomachus> I've never seen that output as an error message before, but I've also never seen `update-manager -c` before
<daftykins> yeah Alien, "nuke it from orbit, it's the only way to be sure"
<nicomachus> oh
<nicomachus> well, I did recommend - in bold - that he should backup and do a fresh install. but then I also included the EOLUpgrades instructions.
<nicomachus> when is 17.04 EOL? January?
<nicomachus> I forget.
<nicomachus> !17.04
<ubot5> Ubuntu 17.04 (Zesty Zapus) is the current release of Ubuntu. Download at http://www.ubuntu.com/download - Read the release notes at https://ubottu.com/y/zesty
<nicomachus> Also, this thread is great: https://www.reddit.com/r/sysadmin/comments/6xf6uj/if_people_spoke_to_car_mechanics_like_it/
<nicomachus> U: For some reason my seat got moved. Does that have anything to do with that Volkswagen diesel scam thing?
<nicomachus> M: Sir, your car is a Toyota
<daftykins> :>
<daftykins> i replied to a client about a slow PC with the price of an SSD, not heard anything since
<nicomachus> he actually just wanted an oil change. :P
<daftykins> "it keeps leaking out!"
<ducasse> daftykins: your client probably thought "he's just trying to sell me unnecessary stuff", thinking it would make no difference at all. he would have been surprised :D
<daftykins> :>
<daftykins> could be
<nicomachus> welp. tried to run a script to remove some duplicates from a VERY large spreadsheet in librecalc. RAM immediately filled to max. Everything froze. No response for over 10 mins. Had to do a hard-shutdown. :/
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: Ouch ! .. Massaging/migrating a large data base here also . in small steps ... day 3 for me - in between times :)
<nicomachus> it worked ont he second try, but I highlighted the data instead of just the whole sheet.
<daftykins> :)
<nicomachus> idk why all those empty cells caused problems, but oh well
<daftykins> does smell a bit like bug potential
<Bashing-om> nicomachus: Even empty cells have addressing overhead :)
<nicomachus> it's a third-party librecalc extension, so probably very buggy.
#ubuntu-discuss 2017-09-02
<ducasse> good morning
<lordievader> Good morning
<EriC^^> hey immu
<immu> hey EriC^^
<immu> how di
<EriC^^> how are you?
<immu> i am good
<immu> you? EriC^^
<EriC^^> im good
<EriC^^> hot today here
<immu> really its also hot here :)
<EriC^^> thank god for a/c right
<immu> yup , you in lebanon right?
<EriC^^> yeah
<EriC^^> you're in which part of uae?
<immu> dubai
<EriC^^> cool
<immu> yeah
<EriC^^> what's the driving like there?
<immu> Good
<EriC^^> lots of exotic cars i imagine?
<immu> yup
<EriC^^> how long have you lived there for?
<immu> approx 30+ years
<immu> brb rebooting into Linux
<immu> back
<immu> EriC^^, yo
<EriC^^> wb
<immu> so what else?
<EriC^^> not much going on
<EriC^^> what do you do for a living?
<ducasse> \o
<ducasse> EriC^^: do you know exactly which grub-efi package runs the scripts that executes grub-install etc?
<EriC^^> ducasse: not really
<ducasse> EriC^^: ok, i'll just dig then ;)
<ducasse> looks like grub-efi-amd64...
<immu> i work in trade finance
<EriC^^> immu: cool
<ducasse> oerheks: he joined +1, said 'hi' and quit 11 secs later - not very patient :)
<oerheks> weekend support, best days for irc :-D
<ducasse> there's a reason i only keep a half eye on the irc window during weekends :)
<immu> hmm
<oerheks> uhuh
<pauljw> EriC^^, hi
<EriC^^> hi pauljw :)
<EriC^^> how are you?
<pauljw> good, you?
<EriC^^> good thanks
<pauljw> :)
<immu> hi eric
<EriC^^> hi immu
<immu> hi EriC^^ welcome back to me and you
<EriC^^> yup
<EriC^^> so you said you work in trading finance.. is that like stock market?
<immu> nope
<EriC^^> what is that?
<immu> Dealing with shipment docs for clients
<EriC^^> ah i see cool
<EriC^^> which company?
<immu> hbz services
<EriC^^> aha cool
<EriC^^> you like it in dubai?
<EriC^^> ive never been there, hear it's pretty awesome
<immu> yes good place
<immu> they have worked hard to make it such a good place
<daftykins> shame about the burning buildings
<immu> yeah happens
<EriC^^> heya daftykins
<daftykins> sir \o
<EriC^^> how are you?
<daftykins> not bad thanks :) got a few snaps of what's going on in my house works - http://imgur.com/a/oKCQ5
<immu> oooooo daftykins what am i seeing here?
<EriC^^> nice! looks good
<daftykins> got replaced window lintels in the first pic, there was rotten wood there
<daftykins> next few are the scene in my office where another rotten lintel set is above another window, plus damaged woodwork - and one of the new window i've got ready for my bedroom
<daftykins> final pic is the A-frame beam of the roof, which is very damaged
<EriC^^> cool stuff
<EriC^^> english architecture seems kind of cool, all the houses here are made of cement and just buildings
<daftykins> :) mine's pretty historic though, from the 1600s
<EriC^^> even cooler
<immu> coool
<immu> thanks for the walkthru
<EriC^^> i'm getting an isp connection soon finally
<EriC^^> no more using the phone
<EriC^^> i hope it's fast enough to watch youtube without buffering!
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> when my scaffold comes down i need to call my phone company, they're going to dig up the road and redo my phone connections
<EriC^^> wow google doesn't help much with scaffold
<EriC^^>     1.
<EriC^^>     a raised wooden platform used formerly for the public execution of criminals.   2.
<EriC^^>     a structure made using scaffolding.
<EriC^^> i guess it's the wooden piece over the window in the first pic?
<oerheks> dilatation, to give structural strength
<daftykins> metal frame outside = scaffold
<oerheks> in the old days one used an arch, but nowadays a concrete slab is as strong as iron
<oerheks> scaffolding is my old profession, making workplatforms.. best thing is: when i was done, you see nothing.
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> yep looking forward to that day coming
<immu> cool daftykins we have a in house structural engineeerrr
<immu> yuppy
<daftykins> ooh funky, show him/her that rotten beam pic :)
<EriC^^> i'm thinking what to add to the youtubextras comment fetcher site, hmm
<EriC^^> i added a back to youtube button and scroll to top, also attempted to put a search bar but it isn't all done yet
#ubuntu-discuss 2017-09-03
<ducasse> good morning!
<BluesKaj> Hi folks
<EriC^^> hi all
<Bashing-om> We do Sunday support :)
<daftykins> the #ubuntu Sunday service!
<pauljw> Hi everyone
<EriC^^> hi pauljw
<pauljw> hey eric :)
<EriC^^> :)
<immu> hey EriC^^
<EriC^^> hey immu
<EriC^^> how's your evening going?
<immu> its night time 10:53
<EriC^^> ah
<immu> EriC^^, i heard lebanese women are most beautiful ;)
<EriC^^> well there's people women in all countries
<EriC^^> *beautiful women
<EriC^^> lebanese have a certain look i guess, it's pretty unique i guess
<EriC^^> immu: why you hear? isn't there a ton of lebanese in dubai?
<EriC^^> i think more of my friends from uni work in dubai than in lebanon
<immu> uae has a healthy lebanese community
<immu> yes all women of the world are beautiful ;)
<immu> goodnite all
<immu> friends
<EriC^^> silvian is either retarded or on really good drugs
<EriC^^> just saying
<EriC^^> /rant
<daftykins> :>
<daftykins> the guys remind me how little i'm missing
<EriC^^> i was actually thinking if you were in the channel it'd be more tolerable
<daftykins> d'aww you're too kind!
#ubuntu-discuss 2019-08-26
<lotuspsychje> good morning
<akemlenovo> Hello lotuspsychje.
<akemlenovo> What's up?
<lotuspsychje> hey akemlenovo
<lotuspsychje> big cuppa coffee is up :p
<akemlenovo> Enjoy your morning caffeine dose ;) that's a good idea i'll get one too.
<akemlenovo> You wake up very early.
<lotuspsychje> went to sleep around 21h30
<OerHeks> go to bed, lotus
<lotuspsychje> its now 4h19
<OerHeks> the birds are still sleeping
<lotuspsychje> i have my sleep hours :p
<akemlenovo> Hehe :)
<lotuspsychje> lol OerHeks looks who's talking
<OerHeks> no i am still up
<lotuspsychje> handsome_feng: we got a discuss bug team, if you want to join https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-discuss
<lotuspsychje> trying to add relevant bugs to help #ubuntu better
<handsome_feng> lotuspsychje, Got it !
<lotuspsychje> if you want addy, lemme know your LP nick
<handsome_feng> lotuspsychje, I have submitted my application, and my lp nick is handsome_feng (~feng-kylin)
<lotuspsychje> handsome_feng: want admin (more verbose) or regular user add?
<handsome_feng> lotuspsychje, maybe regular user? I don't think I'm familiar with the work yet.
<lotuspsychje> handsome_feng: admin will give you more emails, when another user joins the team etc
<lotuspsychje> nothing special
<lotuspsychje> but handy if you like it
<handsome_feng> lotuspsychje, oh, got it, so I want admin, :)
<lotuspsychje> https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-discuss/+members
<lotuspsychje> done
<lotuspsychje> if you find relevant big bugs that could matter for #ubuntu support, you can now 'add someone else' to your bug=> discuss team
<handsome_feng> OK!
<EoflaOE> Hello everyone
<akemlenovo> Hey.
<EoflaOE> hello akemlenovo
<lordievader> Good morning
<EoflaOE> good morning lordievader
<lordievader> Morning EoflaOE
<lordievader> How are you doing?
<EoflaOE> I am doing fine. How about you?
<lordievader> Doing good here
<marcoagpinto> The cola demon!
<BluesKaj> Hi folks
<marcoagpinto> BluesKaj!!!!
<marcoagpinto> Hello!
<marcoagpinto> >:)
<marcoagpinto> dear one!
<BluesKaj> hey marcoagpinto
<marcoagpinto> BluesKaj: In the 5-year LeNovo screen failures, were you referring to laptops or desktops?
<marcoagpinto> :)
<BluesKaj> laptops
<marcoagpinto> ohhhhhhh
<marcoagpinto> :((((((
<marcoagpinto> if I win the EuroMillions torrow I would like to move from ASUS to LeNovo... but that scenario scares me
<marcoagpinto> the dead screen
<lotuspsychje> lenovo= update bios right away when you get one
<marcoagpinto> lotuspsychje: but a LeNovo costs 4000+ EUR?
<marcoagpinto> why update the BIOS?
<marcoagpinto> shouldn't it come with all the good stuff?
<lotuspsychje> uh?
<lotuspsychje> wich lenovo are you looking at?
<lotuspsychje> one with diamonds? :p
<marcoagpinto> well, the other day I was looking at a Portuguese store site... they were the most expensive computers there
<marcoagpinto> but specifications were all top
<daftykins> you should always keep firmware up to date
<daftykins> you can get Lenovos pretty cheap, no need for brand new
<marcoagpinto> lotuspsychje: https://www.pcdiga.com/portatil-lenovo-thinkpad-p1-workstation-15-6
<marcoagpinto> I was wrong about the price: 2849 EUR
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> not 4000 EUR
<marcoagpinto> but I could swear I have seen it in a site for a much higher price
<lotuspsychje> i7 yeah
<daftykins> you don't want one of the workstation class laptops, believe me
<marcoagpinto> what?!
<marcoagpinto> :(
<marcoagpinto> what is wrong wth them?
<marcoagpinto> with*
<daftykins> too long a list to go into really
<lotuspsychje> and for that price you can get alot of nice deals
<marcoagpinto> >:)
<marcoagpinto> I just need to win the EuroMillions tomorrow!!!!!!
<lotuspsychje> lol
<marcoagpinto> 108 000 000 EUR
<lotuspsychje> if you drink less cola, you are millionaire
<marcoagpinto> yes :(
<marcoagpinto> I gambled 50 EUR for tomorrow because it is a big jackpot :(
<marcoagpinto> chances are I will lose all the $$$$ I gambled with
<lotuspsychje> always gamble low
<lotuspsychje> and not every week
<marcoagpinto> I know... but it is the only way to change my life
<marcoagpinto> :(
<marcoagpinto> life leads nowhere
<lotuspsychje> you can change life without money too
<marcoagpinto> I need to retire to dedicate to open-source 100$
<marcoagpinto> 100%
<marcoagpinto> my current job sucks... always angry and cheating customers
<marcoagpinto> :(
<marcoagpinto> but, it is only twice a week and that is why I don't get a better one...
<lotuspsychje> jobhob to the next job
<marcoagpinto> I need the free time for my projects and thesis
<marcoagpinto> I get around 400 EUR per month for working two days... and I live with mum and dad and don't need much money :)
<lotuspsychje> you work 2 days a month?
<marcoagpinto> no, per week
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> on the weekends
<marcoagpinto> Saturday + Sunday
<lotuspsychje> right
<marcoagpinto> as you can see... I take a different path from the normal people... while they work I don't and on their days off I work
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> I do all the opposite
<marcoagpinto> ahhhh... lotuspsychje: on Sunday the supermarket pays double :) that is why I changed my worktime :)
<marcoagpinto> in the past I didn't work on Sundays :)
<marcoagpinto> I changed from 25 hours/week to 16 h/week
<marcoagpinto> which is more 8 + 8*2 =24 hours in practice
<marcoagpinto> difference ~100 EUR since I don't get the extra food money
<EoflaOE> hello everyone
<marcoagpinto> EoflaOE: Hello!
<marcoagpinto> >:)
<Bashing-om> UWN593 is on the street: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuWeeklyNewsletter/Issue593 :D
#ubuntu-discuss 2019-08-27
<lotuspsychje> good morning
<lordievader> Good morning
<marcoagpinto> Hello!
<tomreyn> https://twitter.com/hanno/status/819983093830393857
<tomreyn> "If you're wondering about the security of Tox..."
<BluesKaj> Hey folks
<OerHeks> heya BluesKaj
<BluesKaj> hey OerHeks
<marcoagpinto> BluesKaj! OerHeks! Hello guys!
<BluesKaj> hi marcoagpinto
<hggdh> good morning/afternoon/evening to all
<daftykins> \o
<BluesKaj> 'Morning hggdh
<marcoagpinto> hey
#ubuntu-discuss 2019-08-28
<sarnold> Bashing-om: I'm not sure he's in a graphics environment
<Bashing-om> sarnold: I am only sure he is not all there :P running the Wayland protocol - maybe :D
<sarnold> Bashing-om: hehehe
<Bashing-om> daftykins: Be aware I have so much I could learn :D
<lordievader> Good morning
<tomreyn> !crosspost
<ubot5> Please don't ask the same question in multiple Ubuntu channels at the same time. Many helpers are in more than one channel and it's not fair to them or the other people seeking support.
<BluesKaj> Hey folks
<pragmaticenigma> !bodhi
<EoflaOE> Hello BluesKaj
<lotuspsychje> hey EoflaOE
<EoflaOE> Hello lotuspsychje. How are you?
<lotuspsychje> all good here
<BluesKaj> hi EoflaOE
<EoflaOE> All fine too, lotuspsychje
<EoflaOE> BluesKaj, How are you
<BluesKaj> fine here too EoflaOE
<EoflaOE> Yes. All is fine.
<EoflaOE> Have you seen the new changes about design and GNOME that Ubuntu made?
<lotuspsychje> url EoflaOE ?
<EoflaOE> lotuspsychje: I will get links. In my blog.
<EoflaOE> https://eofla.wordpress.com/2019/08/28/ubuntu-19-10-eoan-ermine-gets-new-beta-version-of-gnome-with-bug-fixes/
<EoflaOE> https://eofla.wordpress.com/2019/08/26/ubuntu-19-10-eoan-ermine-is-updated-with-the-new-yaru-design-changes/
<EoflaOE> How is it lotuspsychje?
<lotuspsychje> looking nice EoflaOE
<EoflaOE> Thanks lotuspychje
<lordcirth_> EoflaOE, the purple lines are on top of the text for me
<lordcirth_> Or at least, they make it quite hard to read
<EoflaOE> lordcirth_: I will fix it soon.
<lordcirth_> EoflaOE, ok. Also, "some users might not appeal it" is incorrect
<lordcirth_> "might not find it appealing", perhaps?
<EoflaOE> lordcirth_: Sounds better.
<EoflaOE> lordcirth_: Fixed it. The incorrect "might not appeal it"
<lordcirth_> cool
<EoflaOE> Thanks lordcirth_, and hello marcoagpinto
<marcoagpinto> hello EoflaOE!
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> I had a date this morning and I updated the GB speller before heading for it
<EoflaOE> Nice, so how are you? And how is the date?
<marcoagpinto> well, my girlfriend arrived 30 minutes late but it's okay
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> any news?
<EoflaOE> marcoagpinto: There has been recent design changes about Ubuntu, and I am finishing KS 0.0.7.
<marcoagpinto> EoflaOE: what? For 19.10?
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> are there any screenshots?
<EoflaOE> marcoagpinto: I had screenshots in my blog.
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> I forgot the link
<EoflaOE> marcoagpinto: The first two blog posts should explain. It's https://eofla.wordpress.com
<marcoagpinto> let me check
<marcoagpinto> EoflaOE: It looks good. I am glad it went back to the old trash-bin image on the desktop :)
<marcoagpinto> and why does the "key" image on authentication keeps changing in every version?
<EoflaOE> ? In my screenshots I have modified the icons in Tweaks, marcoagpinto. Unsure of why would they change the key icon
<marcoagpinto> well, in the last few years the key image has changed
<marcoagpinto> but always ugly
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> sorry for telling my opinion
<marcoagpinto> https://eofla.files.wordpress.com/2019/08/ubuntu1910_alpha_newlook9.png
<EoflaOE> marcoagpinto: OK. By the way, in my screenshots, I have changed the icon theme to the old one.
<marcoagpinto> at least in 19.10 it will look nicer
<marcoagpinto> ohhhhhhhh
<EoflaOE> Yes, and have you seen the newest GDM style?
<marcoagpinto> I don't know what a GMD is?
<marcoagpinto> :)
<EoflaOE> GMD? No, it's GDM3.
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> I still don't know what it is
<marcoagpinto> :p
<marcoagpinto> is it "Gnu something"?
<EoflaOE> GDM3 is the GNOME display manager. It's a login screen. Ubuntu used it by default since the transition to GNOME 3.
<marcoagpinto> ahhhhhhhh
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> basically I only use Ubuntu to compile my dictionary tool :)
<marcoagpinto> I don't have deep knowledge of it
<EoflaOE> OK.
<marcoagpinto> talking about it, I was very stressed and copied to the shared folder the Windows version of PureBasic instead of the Linux version...
<marcoagpinto> when I ran Ubuntu to try it, it was an .exe file in the shared forlder
<marcoagpinto> folder*
<marcoagpinto> :(((((((((((
<marcoagpinto> I have been so stressed
<marcoagpinto> a new version of PureBasic was released last week
<marcoagpinto> or was it two weeks ago? I can't really remember right now
<EoflaOE> Nice. Can you copy the Linux version?
<marcoagpinto> EoflaOE: copy? It is in my PureBasic account for Windows, Linux and Mac
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> so, I copied to a pen drive, turned on the other machine, installed the Windows version and copied the Linux version to the shared folder
<marcoagpinto> then, ran VirtualBox and when I tried to access the file, it was an .exe :(
<marcoagpinto> (Windows)
<EoflaOE> How did you install the Windows version?
<marcoagpinto> EoflaOE: with a double-click in the .exe file
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> I copied both 32- and 64-bit to the desktop and clicked on them
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> but I was so stressed that I didn't notice the pen drive had the "windows" folder open instead of "linux"
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> so, I copied the wrong file to the shared folder :)
<EoflaOE> Try again but copy the correct file to the shared folder. Double check the Windows and Linux versions to ensure that you are copying the correct version.
<marcoagpinto> I know :)
<marcoagpinto> the Linux is a gzip
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> I was stressed and didn't notice the file extension
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> I mean: "tgz"
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> I was just checking
<EoflaOE> OK. Is it copying?
<marcoagpinto> I have the 14'' laptop turned off
<marcoagpinto> :)
<marcoagpinto> so, right now it is not doing anything
<marcoagpinto> :p
<marcoagpinto> I will try it tomorrow or so
<marcoagpinto> I only wanted to test the latest PureBasic to see if they fixed two Linux bugs:
<marcoagpinto> 1) using "&" in pop-up menus get a "_"
<marcoagpinto> 2) the emoji text are always displayed in black
<EoflaOE> OK.
<marcoagpinto> the damn emoji colour used to work in Ubuntu 16.04
<marcoagpinto> now the emoji are always black
<EoflaOE> And you can't change the color?
<marcoagpinto> SetGadgetColour(#TEXT,#Red)
<marcoagpinto> it changes the text colour but not the emojis that are in the text
<marcoagpinto> the emojis are displayed in black
<EoflaOE> OK. If you can, test the latest version, and if the problem is not fixed, tell me.
<marcoagpinto> EoflaOE: thanks
<marcoagpinto> :)
<EoflaOE> marcoagpinto: You are welcome
<marcoagpinto> I am not sure if it is a GTK3 issue since I used GTK2 in the past
<marcoagpinto> :)
<EoflaOE> OK
<marcoagpinto> EoflaOE: https://www.purebasic.fr/english/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=72512
<marcoagpinto> here is my bug report
<marcoagpinto> :)
<EoflaOE> I saw it.
<marcoagpinto> bbl
<marcoagpinto> :)
<OerHeks> yay, https://cloudblogs.microsoft.com/opensource/2019/08/28/exfat-linux-kernel/
<OerHeks> now ext3/4 standard in ms windows ,,,
<tomreyn> https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/win32/fileio/exfat-specification#11-documentation-change-history 2010 -> 2019
<tomreyn> so that's CC-BY-SA 4.0 Intl. apparently. now "just" someone needs to write the code and submit patches to linux.
<tomreyn> + maintain it.
<tomreyn> or maybe we can now use samsungs'
<OerHeks> If i could code, i would.
<leftyfb> OerHeks: your 2nd comment above was meant to be "now we just need ext3/4 standard in ms windows" right? Because that's not what the article says
<tomreyn> hmm it doesn't even support hard or symbolic links, no block journalling. no FS encryption, no data checksumming
<tomreyn> also no offline or online resizing, no sparse files
<OerHeks> leftyfb, yes, that would make it coplete
<OerHeks> c/complete
<tomreyn> basically, exfat seems to lack any form of journalling (other than through the texfat extension, which is hardware specific, and was apparently only used in windows CE)
<tomreyn> so unless they drive the spec and code further i don't see how it helps much other than maybe for a scary data exchange platform with linux.
<OerHeks> azure, kubernetes, lots in my mind for this
<tomreyn> in its current state it's useless for that.
<tomreyn> OerHeks: i guess it'd indeed be good to have ubuntu declare the signing key fingerprints for the default apt sources in sources.list.
<OerHeks> for each one a key?
<tomreyn> i.e.   deb [signed-by=F6ECB3762474EDA9D21B7022871920D1991BC93C] http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu bionic main restricted
<tomreyn> this would prevent any mirror servers from injecting packages
<tomreyn> (which could be signed by keys your system also happens to trust)
<sarnold> but they have complete root on your system
<sarnold> with whatever package they *do* have
<tomreyn> sarnold: you mean a diffierent package you already have installed?
<OerHeks> hoi KOLANICH
<KOLANICH> >the problem the script solves is the following. Let's assumme there are several repos added into sources.lists and several keys. Let's assume that some repos are accessed via an insecure channel and/or hosted on a rogue hosting (but signing InRelease is beyond adversary access because he doesn't know private key). Let's assume that adversary has managed to get access to private key of some other repo installed into system. If all the repÃ¢
<OerHeks> i was looking at debsums too
<sarnold> tomreyn: yeah; eg you install a repo for google to let you install hangouts.. the hangouts pre/post inst/rm scripts have full root. they can do anything. whoever controls that private key has complete control over your computer. you have to trust them. completely.
<KOLANICH> >â¦os are not bound to public keys he can combine compromised key with compromised connection and get RCE. If they are bound, he cannot.
<KOLANICH> >So I wonder why doesn't Ubuntu bind keys to sources by default. It is a trivial to do, I don't see any good reason not to do that.
<tomreyn> sarnold: yes, that's a systemic problem. and not one we can easily solve, i think.
<sarnold> tomreyn: definitely. :) I've thuoght for many years that it'd be nice to have something like apparmor confined apt/dpkg/rpm/zypper etc but .. it's just not the way those tools are written.
<sarnold> tomreyn: snap is close, it was designed with this problem in mind, so it doesn't have full unconfined root pre/post inst/rm scripts. (or at least it didn't, I hope it hasn't gained them since the last time I looked)
<tomreyn> i couldn't tell about snaps, i only know there is a concept of different 'trust' levels there, defaulting to confed, but unconfined is possible if allowed by snap shop operaters.
<tomreyn> s/confed/confined/
<tomreyn> snaps and other similar concepts may be a solution to *this* problem (while introducing others) for 3rd party software repositories.
<tomreyn> KOLANICH: discussion here before you joined the channel https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/Mv84RfGPs2/
<sarnold> yes, unconfined snaps are available; I don't know much about the criteria we use when deciding to allow/forbid those
<OerHeks> unconfined, for offline install?
<KOLANICH> the problem of all self-sufficient packages is overhead. I feel like we need something better, like fine-grained permissions to overwrite certain files. And we definitely should get rid of bash in apt packages and replace them with a declarative manifest.
<KOLANICH> tomreyn: thank you
<tomreyn> https://snapcraft.io/docs/snap-confinement https://snapcraft.io/blog/demystifying-snap-confinement
<tomreyn> KOLANICH: if you're happy to help debian design apt v2, by all means, please do!
<KOLANICH> BTW, Debian manual says to prefer key files over fingerprint. Probably as a mitigation against insecure hash functions.
<tomreyn> sarnold: indeed, documenting criteria for such pretty relevant decision making processes are not the snap ecosystems' strong part.
<tomreyn> this specific part is described here, though: https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/process-for-reviewing-classic-confinement-snaps/1460
#ubuntu-discuss 2019-08-29
<lotuspsychje> morning guys
<guiverc> G'day lotuspsychje :)
<lotuspsychje> hey guiverc
<ducasse> good morning
<Bashing-om> ducasse: WB :D
<ducasse> thank you Bashing-om - still up and active??
<Bashing-om> ducasse: Getting to slow to hold my attention :(
<lordievader> Good morning
<RikMills> RIP KDE4
<RikMills> https://twitter.com/kubuntu/status/1166976430921662464
<guiverc> KDE 4 still lives at my place, it's installed on debian 8 (old-old-stable) -- I was happy on KDE4 for a number of years; fond memories :)
<marcoagpinto> Hello
<BluesKaj> Hey folks
<marcoagpinto> BluesKaj!!!! Hi!!!
<marcoagpinto> >:)
<BluesKaj> hi marcoagpinto
<lordievader> Wasn't there a fork of KDE 4?
<lotus|i5> welcome rcp
<rcp> ty
<rcp> looking for freelance ubuntu admin, someone whos working from home perhaps or wants to earn a bit of extra money.
<lotus|i5> rcp: admin of servers?
<rcp> yea
<EoflaOE> hello everyone
<lotus|i5> hey EoflaOE
<EoflaOE> hello lotus|i5
<lotus|i5> rcp: canonical has also payed support if you like
<leftyfb> rcp: to do what exactly?
<rcp> lotus|i5 i've emailed them
<rcp> thanks
<rcp> leftyfb help monitor nagios alerts across 19 servers, react to alerts and rectify issues.
<rcp> 24/7
<leftyfb> rcp: that is a fulltime job. Try linkedin or monster.com
<rcp> the client has Nagios setup but want to outsource the monitoring
<rcp> yeah I am looking around.
<sarnold> 24/7 might even be five or six full time jobs
<leftyfb> yep
<tomreyn> 24/7 IS >= 6 full timers
<lotus|i5> $$
<tomreyn> trying to save costs there means gambling
<tomreyn> (and abusing workers)
<lotus|i5> can manpower be cut down by tighten security somehow?
<tomreyn> you can reduce response times and not do 24/7
<lotus|i5> i see
<tomreyn> you can set up more services in a HA configuration, reducing likelyness of service outages.
<lotus|i5> rcp: ^
<tomreyn> rcp is likely aware of these options if they manage 20 servers,
<lotus|i5> lets hope :p
#ubuntu-discuss 2019-08-30
<lotuspsychje> good morning to all
<lordievader> Good morning
<marcoagpinto> Hello!
<lordievader> ð
<marcoagpinto> guys, do menus and pop-up menus accept an image bigger than 16x16 pixels?
<BluesKaj> Hiyas all
<marcoagpinto> BluesKaj! Hello!
<marcoagpinto> >:)
<marcoagpinto> doing the exercises
<marcoagpinto> :p
<BluesKaj> hi marcoagpinto
<lotus|i5> https://news.softpedia.com/news/nvidia-releases-new-linux-graphics-driver-with-many-improvements-and-bug-fixes-527209.shtml
<lotus|i5> EoflaOE: UWN material ^ ?
<leftyfb> man, pivot_root is insane
<leftyfb> I just pivoted the running Ubuntu 16.04 and completely re-imaged it's drive with a new OS
<lotuspsychje> pivot_root moves the root file system of the current process to the directory put_old and makes new_root the new root file system
<lotuspsychje> sounds handy leftyfb never used it myself
<leftyfb> it's pretty nuts
<leftyfb> it still had some hold on the drive which prevented me from modifying partitions correctly. I actually removed the drive from the scsi_host and rescanned the bus
<lotuspsychje> neat
<sarnold> leftyfb: crazy indeed :)
<lotuspsychje> whats the deal currently with chromium? is it going snap only or not? i still see apt version too
<leftyfb> I think I heard not until 19.10?
<EoflaOE> hi lotuspsychje
<lotuspsychje> ah
<lotuspsychje> hey EoflaOE
<sarnold> lotuspsychje: yeah it looks a bit like that's pushed to eoan but not the earlier releases
<EoflaOE> lotuspsychje: How are you doing?
<lotuspsychje> from +1  Version 76.0.3809.100-0ubuntu1~snap1 (eoan)
<sarnold> tomreyn: i'm going to guess probably ondrej's openssl is installed too, and afaik the answer after that is "please file a bug report at ondrej's github"
<tomreyn> sarnold: ondrejs openssl would do this then?
<tomreyn> sorry, i only noted this now.
<tomreyn> i assume ondrej's openssl would not behave like a centos one.
<sarnold> tomreyn: heh, I'm not sure what exactly ondrej's openssl does :( I just know that it seems to cause more trouble than it solves
<sarnold> tomreyn: maybe the happy users don't come on irc to report that they are happy users..
<sarnold> the php bits make perfect sense; we're not offering the variety of versions that he does. but openssl.. sigh
<tomreyn> i think the issue here was the virtuozzo hosting provider
<tomreyn> they aparently replaced /usr/lib/ssl's default contents by something they found on a centos system.
<tomreyn> and a user, if they actually knew their trusted CAs was set / overridden that way it, could only fix it by mounting some other directory over this non-writable vtzfs (virtuozzo deduping file system) location.
<tomreyn> sarnold: ^
<tomreyn> vps (in the containers, not proper virtualization sense) are just bad, people should no longer rent them
<sarnold> tomreyn: *wow*
<sarnold> tomreyn: what a mess
<tomreyn> yes :-/
<sarnold> tomreyn: I know I've seen more than a few of *those* messes as well. "why I can't install security updates?" "tell your provider to boot into a kernel from this year"
<tomreyn> http://dpaste.com/3H50XPT
<tomreyn> hardcoded CAs there, provided by hosting provider
<tomreyn> *hardwired
<tomreyn> <thaway> huh, can't move the directory: http://dpaste.com/0S7Y4RS
<tomreyn> <thaway> hmm, / is a "vzfs" mount which apparently is a virtual fs type that allows sharing between containers
<tomreyn> <thaway> tomreyn: openvz
<tomreyn> proper VMs are cheap now, 3 usd / month, there's really no need for doing this to oneself anymore.
<sarnold> no kidding
<sarnold> it's one thing to use containers *yourself* as a density thing
<sarnold> but to have them done *to* you feels pretty mean
<sarnold> I think my irssi aws instance is about that, three-ish bucks a month. it'll never win performance awards but it's cheap :D
<tomreyn> yes, especially the way cheap hosts do them to you
<tomreyn> aws is more expensive, i think t2.nano on demand is 4.17 USD/month
<tomreyn> others got double resources for half the price
<sarnold> oh yes? :) I'm by no means wedded to aws, I just happened to have an account there when I needed this thing on short notice..
<tomreyn> cx11 (default / shared cpu) is said to be very good: https://www.hetzner.com/cloud?country=gb
<tomreyn> they dont seem to actually share those cores, yet
<tomreyn> and you can probably save 20% vat on it soon, too :-/
<sarnold> US here, no VAT :)
<sarnold> I'm not used to seeing english on hetzner pages, hah
<tomreyn> oh, i was thinking you were in uk
<tomreyn> maybe the ping is bad then
<sarnold> yeah, it wouldn't be anyuwhere near as nice as I've got now
<tomreyn> azure is also a lot cheaper than aws
<sarnold> sigh aws drops icmp.
<tomreyn> you forgot to buy premium traffic.
<sarnold> lol
<sarnold> itmight be configurable .. but finding out would take time that doesn't *really* help anything :)
<tomreyn> yes, it really exist
<tomreyn> oh you mean icmp may be configurable, not sure there
<tomreyn> maybe the firewall prolicies, yes
<sarnold> yeah
<tomreyn> how about https://www.kimsufi.com/us/en/
<tomreyn> i.e. canada
<sarnold> iirc stgraber uses them
<tomreyn> dedicated server starting at 5 usd ;)
<sarnold> those look pretty good. thanks tomreyn :)
<tomreyn> sarnold: make sure you also read the TOS, though. kimsufi is OVH's lowest support level. "ask in forum"
<sarnold> ouch
<sarnold> granted I almost never *need* support
<sarnold> but if I needed it going to a forum doesn't sound fun :)
<tomreyn> they do handle those requests, but it can take a day or two to have a hdd replaced
<tomreyn> hmm actually they have a control panel there now, so maybe my info is outdated
<tomreyn> yes they have request ticketing now.
<sarnold> yay
#ubuntu-discuss 2019-08-31
<lotuspsychje> good morning
<Talikka> Mood morning.
<Talikka> It seems Linux Mint people are active in Facebook and Ubuntu people in IRC.
<Talikka> I want to build a global community of grassroot support https://aku-opettaa.blogspot.com/2019/06/cooperation-between-ubuntu-communities.html
<ducasse> good morning
<BluesKaj> Hi folks
<Talikka> interested in new business and association endeavours in Scandinavia and neighbouring countries? #ubuntu-nordic
#ubuntu-discuss 2019-09-01
<lotuspsychje> good morning
<guiverc> If a user does `do-release-upgrade`, wouldn't questions be expected?  (I'd say yes; I'm writing a qa-testcase)
<Bashing-om> guiverc: Best I recall - only questions is in repect to replacing config files.
<guiverc> what I was thinking too; user-modified blah, do you want to set to maintainers, keep, view ... etc.. ; thanks Bashing-om
<ducasse> good morning
<OerHeks> hi ducasse
<ducasse> morning OerHeks - how are you and the doggies?
<OerHeks> bad sleepy night :-(
<OerHeks> i try again in a few hours
<ducasse> same here, barely slept at all
<OerHeks> what is wrong with us?
<ducasse> maybe a nap will help :)
<BluesKaj> Howdy all
<lotuspsychje> !info linux-image-generic disco
<ubot5> linux-image-generic (source: linux-meta): Generic Linux kernel image. In component main, is optional. Version 5.0.0.25.26 (disco), package size 2 kB, installed size 15 kB
<EoflaOE> Hello everyone
<daftykins> \o
<EoflaOE> hello daftykins
<akemlenovo_> I think i still have a memory leak but after 30+ days uptime...It's annoying.
<akemlenovo_> With a bit of luck it's still the Wifi chipsets' driver.
<akemlenovo_> The other one was easy to see cause it was growing fast, full RAM in one night, but there it is more complicated to find out where it's originating from...
<jeremy31> akemlenovo_: blacklist the wifi driver
<akemlenovo_> jeremy31, yes that's what i'm trying to do in blacklist.conf, but i need wifi connection so i will use a wifi dongle instead, in last option i could try with a cable and no wifi, but i'd have to move everything and let the computer sits in the living...
<akemlenovo_> jeremy31, what should be the RAM usage on a normal Ubuntu after 30 days of mainly idleing, i mean there is just qbittorent doing things and it reports 7.5% RAM usage only.
<jeremy31> akemlenovo_: no idea what RAM usage should be after 30 days as I shut my computers down every day
<jeremy31> akemlenovo_: rtl8821ce wifi?
<akemlenovo_> No rtl8723be i think, but i don't know what the dongle i wanna use is
<jeremy31> akemlenovo_: I haven't seen any complaints on the forums about a memory leak for that one
<akemlenovo_> jeremy31, It might be something else i'm not sure what it is :/
<jeremy31> akemlenovo_: I think you can use top in terminal to see what is using RAM
<akem-hp> After fresh boot and just running few apps i'm using 953 MB RAM and 0 MB Swap.
<akem-hp> My wifi dongle is r8188eu and i blacklisted the 8723be.
<akemlenovo_> jeremy31, The problem is that the used RAM is not reported, just like the other time with the leak we fixed with TJ-.
<akemlenovo_> I think it's because it's kernel related.
<akemlenovo_> Now this kind of problem is a killer for a server which has to run all the time.
<akemlenovo_> Also the kernel gets more and more complicated over time. With memory management and all...so you don't know if it's normal or not sometimes. :(
#ubuntu-discuss 2020-08-24
<lotuspsychje> good morning
<Alexandrov> morning :D
<lotuspsychje> hey Alexandrov
<Alexandrov> hey
<Maik> good morning
<lotuspsychje> hey Maik
<Maik> hi lotuspsychje
<Bashing-om> UWN645 is on the streets: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuWeeklyNewsletter/Issue645 :D
#ubuntu-discuss 2020-08-25
<lotuspsychje> good morning
<arooni> whats everyones favorite new features of 20.04 that you didnt have in 18.04; it certainly feels snappier and i like that i can login with fingerprint auth
<tomreyn> gnome doesn't break when you remove snapd
<lotuspsychje> arooni: gnome is fast and smooth on 20.04 and i like stacer on the repos
<arooni> what is stacer?
<lotuspsychje> stacer - Linux system optimizer and monitoring
<lotuspsychje> has a handy systemd manager baked in too
<arooni> is that more for a server
<arooni> or for a desktop/laptop
<lotuspsychje> arooni: server manages things more in cli usually
<coconut> tomreyn, can snapd also be removed on ubuntu mate 20.04.1 ?
<arooni> E: The repository 'http://ppa.launchpad.net/oguzhaninan/stacer/ubuntu focal Release' does not have a Release file.
<lotuspsychje> arooni: its on the repos already, sudo apt install stacer
<arooni> oh neato
<arooni> thats a pretty handy app
<tomreyn> coconut: technically for sure, but i have not tried.
<Eickmeyer> coconut: If you do, I think you'll lose the welcome app and the software boutique since that's all in a snap.
<coconut> tomreyn, something like pushing snap onto the user from apt for a few packages comes to my mind for me.(i just banned snapcraft.io from my hosts file now).
<coconut> thnx Eickmeyer!
<Eickmeyer> Bear in mind, Ubuntu Mate is led by one of the biggest snap proponents, so don't be surprised if it becomes tightly integrated.
<coconut> :( i keep disliking snap
#ubuntu-discuss 2020-08-26
<lotuspsychje> good morning
<marcoagpinto> Heya
<ducasse> good morning
<marcoagpinto> :)
<croraf> Ubuntu Bionic (16.04) had "bionic linux-hwe" kernel flavors, which were like "advanced" kernels matching some of the latest mainline kernels?
<oerheks> no, backported kernels from next release
<oerheks> !hwe
<croraf> oerheks, so each time the LTS "point" realese happens an "hwe" version is created?
<oerheks> yes, when next Groovy 20.10 is released, HWE will be available
<croraf> but i dont understand what is the difference, because the "regular" kernel is also updated
<croraf> oerheks, and also the bionic linux is based on 4.13-4.15 mainline kernels
<croraf> bionic linux-hwe is based on 4.18-5.3 mainline kernels
<croraf> and bionic linux-hwe 5.0 is based on 5.0 mainline kernel
<croraf> So there is no rule basically.
<oerheks> don't look at the 'mainline stuff' ..
<oerheks> those are for testing
<croraf> OK. But for example bionic-linux has 4.13-4.15 ubuntu kernel version
<croraf> bionic linux hwe has 4.18-5.3 and bionic linux hwe 5.0 has 5.0 versions
<croraf> there is also hwe 5.4
<croraf> So if I understood correctly each new point version comes with the new kernel "flavor"?
<croraf> Like 16.04.1 came with hwe, 16.04.2 came with hwe 5.0, 16.04.3 came with hwe 5.4?
<croraf> oerheks,
<croraf> Actually from https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Kernel/Support?action=AttachFile&do=view&target=18.04.x+Ubuntu+Kernel+Support+Schedule.svg I see that:
<Maik> croraf: after each new ubuntu release you should get a new kernel with HWE afaik
<Maik> some time after that is
<croraf> Hmmm, I dont think this is how it goes
<Maik> say Ubuntu 20.10 will ship 5.7 or 5.8, you'll get that on the LTS release as update/upgrade
<Maik> well... i don't know any different way it should go
<Maik> i could be mistaken (just woke up)
<Maik> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Kernel/LTSEnablementStack
<croraf> I was checking this link, it is extremely confusing and out of date Maik
<ducasse> every new release means a hwe kernel for older lts releases
<Maik> it's still the same procedure croraf
<Maik> ducasse: so i was basically right?
<ducasse> yeah, you are
<croraf> ducasse, so every major release?
<croraf> not point releases?
<ducasse> the point releases come with hwe
<croraf> So when 18.10 came out the bionic-hwe came out? When 19.04 came out the bionic-hwe-5.0 came out and when 19.10 came out the bionic-hwe-5.4 came out?
<ducasse> yeah
<Maik> yes
<ducasse> but a little after the release
<croraf> Thats why we have only 3 hwe for 18.04 and we have 4 releases after 18.04?
<croraf> 18.10 19.04 19.10 20.04
<croraf> we should have 4 hwe kernel lines for bionic.
<croraf> ducasse, Maik
<ducasse> if the 20.04 kernel has been released yet for bionic, i'm not sure it has
<croraf> I see now that eon ermine (19.10) didnt come with the kernel line
<Maik> https://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2020/08/ubuntu-18-04-5-lts-released-with-linux-kernel-5-4
<croraf> And focal (20.04) came with 5.4 kernel. So it might be that 20.04 is mapping to "bionic linux hwe 5.4"
<croraf> And that 19.10 didnt come with a hwe.
<Maik> bionic should have 5.4 now
<croraf> Yes, it has "bionic linux hwe 5.4" kernel line
<lotuspsychje> ubottu> linux-image-generic-hwe-18.04 (source: linux-meta): Generic Linux kernel image (dummy transitional package). In component main, is optional. Version 5.4.0.42.46 (focal), package size 1 kB, installed size 17 kB
<croraf> Before that there was "bionic linux hwe 5.0" kernel line
<croraf> It might be that only .04 versions come with a kernel line?
<croraf> 18.04 19.04 20.04
<croraf> And if you check this image https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Kernel/Support?action=AttachFile&do=view&target=18.04.x+Ubuntu+Kernel+Support+Schedule.svg
<croraf> Then you have complete mess and confusion.
<Maik> 19.10 had 5.3 and was also HWE, except 5.3 is EOL now and wasn't a LTS kernel
<Maik> so what's your point actually
<Maik> that the documentation isn't up to date?
<croraf> I want to understand how and when these kernel lines come? Maik
<lotuspsychje> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Kernel/LTSEnablementStack
<Maik> as we said a couple of times before now: they come to LTS after a while when a new version of Ubuntu is released
<ducasse> this is really more of a topic for -discuss, it's not really a support issue
<Maik> we are in -discuss? ;)
<ducasse> oh, sorry, me blinking :)
<Maik> hehehe... had that to a while back
<ducasse> i'm following too many things at once
<Maik> no problem, same here :)
<ducasse> there were some changes to how hwe works a while back, you might find that in uwn
<ducasse> i don't recall the details
<ducasse> iirc, they were mostly regarding how hwe is pulled in and when, but they clarified the whole deal
<croraf> lotuspsychje, hehehe, 4th time someone gives me this link :)
<croraf> Maik, if this is true, why are there 4 releses after 18.04 but only 3 hwe?
<ducasse> the latest bionic is .5
<Maik> croraf: ^
<ducasse> .1 did not come with a hwe kernel, that leaves .2, .3, .4 and .5
<Maik> yep, so that makes 4
<ducasse> then we agree on the math :)
<croraf> Buuuut, there are only 3 hwe kernels, not 4.
<croraf> Maik, ducasse
<croraf> the bionic hwe, bionic hwe 5.0, bionic hwe 5.4
<Maik> and 5.3
<croraf> Maik, there is no such: https://people.canonical.com/~kernel/info/kernel-version-map.html
<ducasse> there's a table here - https://www.thomas-krenn.com/en/wiki/Ubuntu_LTS_Hardware_Enablement_Stack_information
<croraf> ducasse, nice that you found this :)
<ducasse> 4.18, 5.0, 5.3 and 5.4
<Maik> 18.04.4 (RN)	5.3	(from Ubuntu 19.10)	HWE Kernel	February 2020	August 2020
<coconut> yes, firefox 80 is now updated in focal :)
<Maik> from that table
 * Maik uses Chrome
<croraf> ^
<croraf> Chrome also updated today to 85
<ducasse> croraf: does that answer your question?
<croraf> But how come this does not match in my table ducasse Maik - which is official
<ducasse> which table?
<croraf> And also the 16.04 only have 4 versions
<Maik> croraf: again, because it hasn't been updated maybe? Volunteers work on the documentation afaik
<croraf> ducasse, https://people.canonical.com/~kernel/info/kernel-version-map.html
<croraf> I posted this before at :04:38
<croraf> Maik, I mean this table is very much up to date always
<croraf> And this Thomas Kren site is unofficial
<Maik> but what's your problem with it? You have the latest kernel and it runs fine doesn't it?
<croraf> It does not
 * Maik doesn't have any issues
<croraf> I do have 20.04 GA latest though
<croraf> let me check my table to see the hwe for 16.04
<Maik> need to get ready for work in a few, see you all later :)
<croraf> xenial has only 1 hwe in my table .... :(
<croraf> ok have a nice day Mail
<croraf> Maik
<ducasse> you need to ask the kernel team about the table, i can't comment on it
<ducasse> if you have a problem with your kernel then that is a support issue :)
<Maik> thank croraf,  but actually night :)
<croraf> ducasse, i know but i want to understand the context to actually be able to solve
<croraf> now i've been suggested to install the oem kernel
<croraf> How does the "oem" line differ from "hwe" line?
<ducasse> lotuspsychje: can you answer this? ^^
<croraf> ducasse, on top of this, if I install this oem kernel, would I be able on boot to choose which kernel to boot with?
<croraf> *will I be able
<ducasse> yeah, you should be able to choose from grub
<croraf> cool, so I'm actually safe to try this, with respect to crashing my system or losing data?
<croraf> ducasse,
<croraf> I can always simply switch to the current kernel
<ducasse> i've never used the oem kernels myself, but i would think it's pretty safe to try one out
<coconut> What kind of privileges do one need to edit !factoids ?
<ducasse> i think only certain ops can do that
<ducasse> maybe all of them, not sure
<coconut> :) i ask this because i saw a typo in one of them coming by
<ducasse> if you report it in -ops they will fix it
<coconut> #ubuntu-quality: !support
<coconut> <ubot5> Ubuntu 20.10 (Focal Fossa) support in #ubuntu+1. This channel is for testing 20.10 and reporting results here: http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/milestones/413/builds
<coconut> ok, will try that, thank you :)
<ducasse> you can also try -offtopic, several ops hang out there
<ducasse> i'll also mention it if i see one
#ubuntu-discuss 2020-08-27
<lotuspsychje> good morning
<marcoagpinto> Hello!
<marcoagpinto> The cola demon!
<lotuspsychje> !support
<lotuspsychje> !test
<marcoagpinto> lotuspsychje: What are you trying to do?
<marcoagpinto> :)
<lotuspsychje> waking up ubot9
<lotuspsychje> think its still sleeping :p
<marcoagpinto> :p
<ducasse> good morning
<marcoagpinto> heya
<marcoagpinto> :)
<croraf_> lotuspsychje, am i banned?
<croraf_> on ubuntu?
<lotuspsychje> croraf_: no, auto anti flood with a time limit
<croraf_> so i was banned for 1 min?
<croraf_> lotuspsychje,
<coconut> CodeLyoko, you have been auto silenced for a minute because of pasting too many lines at ones
<coconut> *at once
<croraf_> thx
<coconut> croraf_, try to use termbin of pastebinit next time for multiple lines, so that the servers don't get in trouble
<croraf_> I know. The newline was obscured when I pasted coconut . So I didnt know it would trigger new line
<coconut> croraf_, well, no problem then (that is one reason why +s is used before banning)
<EMH-Mark-I> Are there any strong opinions of Ubuntu based distributions that still use the Ubuntu main repositories, instead of running and maintaining their own? Such as, could it be considered as âfreeloading?â
<ducasse> we don't support or discuss non-ubuntu distros at all
<tomreyn> EMH-Mark-I: #ubuntu-mirrors might have an opinion on it. my impression is that the bandwidth cnaonical pays for the main mirrors is indeed costly. on the other hand, my impression is that they've never gotten in the way of derivatives - unless when it comes wo the 'brand' name Ubuntu.
<EMH-Mark-I> tomreyn: Oh ok, I could ask there. I figured it would make for some discussion since I'm interested in it.
<tomreyn> if you don't have a use case (say, by developing one of those derivates), then don't bother, i'd say.
<EMH-Mark-I> I really don't have a use case for myself. I'm interested to see what people might think of it. I believe itâs quite charitable of Ubuntu (or other distributions) to extend access to their repositories for others to use, instead of restricting it.
<EMH-Mark-I> Since there is a cost and a lot of orchestration involved.
#ubuntu-discuss 2020-08-28
<lotuspsychje> good morning
<marcoagpinto> Heya
<marcoagpinto> lotuspsychje: Are you sleeping?
<marcoagpinto> >:)
<ducasse> good morning
<marcoagpinto> morning!
#ubuntu-discuss 2020-08-29
<lotuspsychje> good morning
<ducasse> good morning
<croraf__> test
#ubuntu-discuss 2020-08-30
<lotuspsychje> good morning
<Maik> good morning
<lotuspsychje> hey Maik
<lotuspsychje> all the pies ready to get eaten?
<Maik> lotuspsychje: hey, good to see you
<Maik> yep, all done
<lotuspsychje> hi there
<lotuspsychje> good cuz i'm hungry
<lotuspsychje> :p
<Maik> lol, me too :D
<Maik> one week off now
<lotuspsychje> yay
<Maik> time for some fun stuff and.... beer
<Maik> i'm still in doubt if i should use the Pi 4 or the old netbook (that's gathering dust) to set up a server and install quassel core on it
<Maik> downside of the netbook is that it's 32 bit
<lotuspsychje> whats the specs of the netbook
<Maik> Intel Atom 1.6 Ghz processor, 1GB of RAM
<lotuspsychje> can you upgrade the ram?
<Maik> https://www.cnet.com/products/acer-aspire-one-a150/
<Maik> should support up to 1.5GB
<Maik> but it's a hassle to open it and change the RAM, HD and even the fan.
<lotuspsychje> right
<lotuspsychje> well im not a big fan of pi's myself, but for passive servers they are great
<lotuspsychje> i like more the intel nucs
<Maik> just had a look, they seem not too expensive
<lotuspsychje> for your case both devices might be good running server
<lotuspsychje> Maik: yeah i sold very cheapy nucs for server usage already
<lotuspsychje> had a debian guy wanted a fileserver for his home once, got him a cheap celeron nuc
<lotuspsychje> https://image.coolblue.be/max/500x500/products/1370105
<lotuspsychje> 129 euro without ssd & ram
<Maik> ok, only the netbook is 32bit so i could either run Ubuntu 18.04 LTS 32bit server on it or i have to use Debian to keep 32bit support as long as it lasts
<Maik> oh nice :)
<lotuspsychje> this nuc has a 8GB ram limit
<lotuspsychje> Maik: i revived my old acer aspire one netbook with 20.04 lubuntu with lxqt
<lotuspsychje> and it runs better then all previous releases
<lotuspsychje> xenial and bionic lagged it
<Maik> that's great. Is your netbook 32 or 64 bit?
<lotuspsychje> its a 64bit yeah
<lotuspsychje> 20.04 doesnt have 32bit anymore
<Maik> yep, true. Ubuntu dropped 32bit since 19.10
<Maik> i couldn't even find a 32bit iso of 18.04 anymore by the way
<lotuspsychje> should be still there
<Maik> so if i go with ubuntu i could use the netboot/mini iso
<lotuspsychje> never tryed -server much before myself
<Maik> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/releases/bionic/release/
<Maik> no 32bit iso
<lotuspsychje> hmm
<lotuspsychje> maybe ducasse sarnold tomreyn guiverc might know?
<guiverc> know what; what x86 iso are you after?
<Maik> 18.04
<Maik> server iso
<guiverc> Lubuntu 18.04.5 x86 ISOs are available, as are other desktop flavors
<guiverc> net boot iso was created, not sure about server
<guiverc> I think b/c they've moved to subiquity (live installer) for server, it's not i386
<guiverc> http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/bionic-updates/main/installer-i386/current/images/netboot/ for netboot i386 18.04.5
<Maik> then i'll have to use the netboot iso. No big deal
<Maik> yep, already there. Thanks anyway :)
<lotuspsychje> : )
<Maik> now where's my JosÃ© Jalapeno on a stick
<lotuspsychje> lol
<Bashing-om> Time ! Exit stage right \o
<ducasse> good morning
<Maik> ducasse: hey, good morning
<ducasse> hi there Maik
<lotuspsychje> !test
<sonicwind> you failed the test :-P
<guiverc> :)
<lotuspsychje> :p
<lotuspsychje> i keep praying the irc gods for ubottu's return :p
<lotuspsychje> morning Maik
<Maik> o/
<Maik> issues with internet since this afternoon, Telenet says it's a worldwide internet problem.....
<Maik> certain sites can't be reached, wifi doesn't work anymore
<daftykins> i doubt anything going on worldwide is preventing packets being relayed by radios between laptops and smartphones and home routers ;)
<Maik> brb
<Maik> wifi works again, somehow it's name and password changed so i had to manually put back the old ones.
<Maik> which means i can hobby again this night and fool around with quassel core
<daftykins> that's not great, i once had to go to a clients in an emergency because they used an ISP supplied router back then - and the ISP decided to factory reset lots of them around the island, very rude
<daftykins> i was quite happy to disable all that / move off ISP supplied routers soon after
