#ubuntu-classroom 2007-07-18
* Starting logfile irclogs/ubuntu-classroom.log
<HarKoT> ol
#ubuntu-classroom 2007-07-19
<juano__> jrib:
<juano__> jrib: its light blue
<juano__> jrib: the file i mean
<jrib> k
<juano__> jrib
<jrib> it would be red if it were broken
<juano__>  libnvidia-wfb.so.1          libvm86.so      multimedia
<juano__> libddc.so    libnvidia-wfb.so.100.14.11
<juano__> also i have two, see ?
<jrib> ok, see: dlopen: /usr/lib/libGLcore.so.1: undefined symbol: _nv000043gl
<juano__> libnvidia-wfb.so.1
<jrib> that looks like the problem
<juano__> libnvidia-wfb.so.100.14.11
<juano__> i have two
<juano__> that doesnt look good
<jrib> you're using feisty?
<juano__> this libnvidia-wfb.so.100.14.11 is the one i downloaded from nvidia.com
<juano__> yea
<juano__> how can i get rid of every nvidia files
<juano__> and start from scratch
<jrib> ah
<juano__> maybe i need to do that
<jrib> you installed the binary driver from nvidia.com
<juano__> or maybe you know somethin easier
<jrib> that messes things up
<juano__> :P
<juano__> yes
<juano__> lol
<juano__> i noticed
<juano__> :P
<jrib> there's some switch you can pass to the installer for it to uninstall
<jrib> try ./whatever --help
<juano__> ok, wher whatever is my package ?
<jrib> where whatever is the binary installer you used from nvidia.com
<juano__> jrib: mm no option for uninstalling
<jrib> alright, it's in the readme, let me find it
<jrib> how about just trying --uninstall until I find it :)
<juano__> yep that uninstalled it
<juano__> well at least it said so
<jrib> heh ok
<juano__> lol
<juano__> so next step
<juano__> lol
<jrib> now, 'sudo aptitude purge nvidia-glx'
<juano__> ok it asked for Y/n and i gave it Y
<juano__> ok done
<juano__> jrib: now
<juano__> ?
<juano__> jrib: now ? (sorry im in a bit of a hurry, need to go in 10 minutes)
<jrib> sudo aptitude install nvidia-glx
<jrib> and then use nvidia-xconfig to enable it again
<juano__> ok done
<juano__> now a ctrl alt del ?
<juano__> and pray lol
<juano__> jrib: right ? nothing else ?
<jrib> yeah
<juano__> k brb
<juano__> jrib: darn, no luckl
<juano__> jrib: same deal
<jrib> dpkg -S /usr/lib/libGLcore.so.1
<juano__> jrib: the other thing i did was disable nv in restricted modules
<juano__> nvidia-glx: /usr/lib/libGLcore.so.1
<juano__> thats the output
<jrib> hmm
<juano__> darn...
<juano__>  glxgears
<juano__> Xlib:  extension "GLX" missing on display ":0.0".
<juano__> Error: couldn't get an RGB, Double-buffered visual
<juano__> jrib:
<juano__> thats what i get with glxgears
<jrib> right because it can't load it
<juano__> yea
<juano__> any other ideas jrib
<jrib> you could reinstall the restricted modules too
<juano__> and that would be
<juano__> sudo apt-get install linux-restricted-modules ?
<jrib> sudo aptitude reinstall linux-restricted-modules-$(uname -r)
<juano__> ok
<juano__> it reinstalled
<juano__> jrib
<jrib> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=411542 same problem
<jrib> heh
<jrib> ugh I hate nvidia
#ubuntu-classroom 2007-07-20
<juano__> hello jrib
<juano__> im back
<jrib> hi juano__
<jrib> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=411542 same problem, try the hints here
<juano__> jrib: awesome, ill try it out
<juano__> jrib: thanks a lot
<jrib> hmm
<jrib> x_: hi
<x_> hi :-)
<x_> sorry
<x_> i tried linux just 12 hour  :-)
<jrib> k, ready to install flash?
<x_> yeah :)
<jrib> alright, are you at: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/RestrictedFormats/Flash#head-4b931137affcbddef2ac9102a3d9fafde91f869f ?
<x_> !!!
<jrib> hmm?
<x_> yeah
<x_> i am in that page
<jrib> k, first step is to enable multiverse.  have you done that?
<x_> no
<jrib> k, go to  system -> admin -> software sources and check multiverse
<x_> wait .. i shoul find it in
<jrib> k, first is to open "software sources" from your menu.  Did that open up ok?
<x_> it allrady checked
<jrib> k, good
<jrib> now you have to install "flashplugin-nonfree"
<x_> thanks :-) ... next ?!
<jrib> you know how to install packages?
<x_> sudo apt-get install   ?!
<jrib> sure, that works
<jrib> sudo apt-get install flashplugin-nonfree
<x_> let me try  :-)
<x_> Download done.
<x_> md5sum mismatch install_flash_player_9_linux.tar.gz
<x_> The Flash plugin is NOT installed.
<x_> what's wrong ?!
<jrib> heh
<x_> says NOT INSTALLED  :-(
<jrib> what version of ubuntu?
<x_> 7.04
<jrib> k, open up software sources again
<x_> ok ... wait
<x_> yeah ... next plz
<jrib> notice the comment on the wiki about needing proposed updates because of a bug
<jrib> go to the "updates" tab
<jrib> and check "feisty-proposed"
<jrib> don't install any updates at this time
<jrib> we'll turn off this repo after we install flash
<x_> wait
<x_> there are not something like that
<jrib> in the updates tab (3rd one), it should be the third checkbox: "Pre-released updates (feisty-proposed)"
<x_> in 3th check box says : Pre-released updates
<x_> oh
<x_> ok
<jrib> yeah, that one
<x_> ok .. i marked it
<jrib> k after that, close the window and 'sudo apt-get install flashplugin-nonfree' again
<x_> wait ... programe checking for something
<HeaDSHoT> make sure ur system is upto date too :P
<x_> oook ... it says installed flash plugin ... huuurrraaa ... oops .. i should  updating my system :-(
<x_> THANKS :-)
<jrib> ok, I recommend you disable the proposed updates now
<x_> that was BIG help :-)
<x_> after update or befor ?!
<jrib> before
<x_> oops ... my update attension gone :-o
<x_> is i wanna install something for DIVX and XVID and RM and WMA player what should i do ?!
<jrib> yeah, -proposed might contain some broken packages, it's only for people that don't mind testing things and risking a broken package once in a while
<jrib> !restricted | x_
<ubotu> x_: For multimedia issues, this page has useful information: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/RestrictedFormats - See also http://help.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/desktopguide/C/common-tasks-chap.html - But please use free formats if you can: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/FreeFormats
<x_> oh my god
<x_> it's not easy too me reading that p[ages  :-)
<jrib> take it slowly
<x_> how u learned ?!
<jrib> slowly :)
<x_> thanks friend ... u was a BIG help for me :-)
<jrib> the actual instructions are about 3 lines if you skip the intro
<jrib> np, have fun
<x_> oook .. i'll do that
<x_> thanks ...
<x_> u 2 :)
<x_> have a good DAY or Night  ;-)  bye
<HeaDSHoT> hey
<HeaDSHoT> x_
<x_> yeah
<HeaDSHoT> try this site
<HeaDSHoT> sec
<x_> what is that about ?!
<x_> ??!!!! wich site ?!
<juano__> jrib: it worked!!! finally..... i removed all and installed nvidia-glx-new
<juano__> jrib: now im getting fast glxgears
<juano__> jrib: and driver is now nvidia !
<jrib> cool
<juano__> yea
<juano__> seems fine
<juano__> phew
<juano__> jrib: thanks for all your help jrib
<jrib> np, glad you figured it out
<juano__> jrib: how do i make the splashscreen show up at X start ?
<jrib> which splashscreen?
<jrib> gdm?
<juano__> yep
<juano__> nope
<juano__> i mean
<juano__> Nvidia splashscreen
<jrib> oh
<jrib> it should do taht by default unless you disable it in xorg.conf
<juano__> i have a Option         "NoLogo" "True" in screen
<juano__> i commented it out but still the same
<jrib> yeah, comment that out
<juano__> is this correct for device section
<juano__> Section "Device"
<juano__>     Identifier     "nVidia Corporation NV34 [GeForce FX 5500] "
<juano__>     Driver         "nvidia"
<juano__> EndSection
<juano__> just that ?
<juano__> in Screen i got ARGB visuals, etc
<jrib> sure, that's enough
<juano__> cool
<juano__> thanks
<juano__> jrib:
<juano__> jrib: darn, still having the same problem, worked fine but then when i rebooted i got the error again
<juano__> jrib: i formatted lol, now and started ubuntu from scratch, installed nvidia-glx from repos and nothing, same deal
<Urbandale> whu am i banned from #ubuntu ?
<nalioth> Urbandale: why are you asking in here?  #ubuntu-ops is the place
<MikeRotch> hey everyone
* Starting logfile irclogs/ubuntu-classroom.log
#ubuntu-classroom 2007-07-21
<HarKoT> bon allez soire poker bye ;)
#ubuntu-classroom 2007-07-22
<Flannel> Howdy warlocky
<warlocky> heya.
<warlocky> well, this is my problem right now.
<warlocky> I recently (this morning) accidently removed my php.ini file, and we sorted this out aswell this morning - you helped me out. But now it seems that the php.ini file I'm currently am using is different from the one I removed in the morning. Thus results in my webpage not working correctly (UDP packages not working well obviously)
<warlocky> So what we are trying to do, is upgrading to php5.1.6 or such, or just getting our UDP to work correctly. The website seems to go into slow-mo when we load our udp package
<Flannel> warlocky: hmm, There appears to be a breezy mirror (unofficual of course) http://bea.cabarel.com/ubuntu/
* warlocky looks happy
<Flannel> You could use that to reinstall php
<Flannel> http://bea.cabarel.com/modules/PunBB/viewtopic.php?pid=1734
<Flannel> has a sample sources.list
<warlocky> how do I add that to the sources.list?
<warlocky> oh
<Flannel> However, you must have something else going on, since your updates tried to grab hoary too, which wasn't in the sources.list you showed me
<warlocky> I'll double check, a second.
<warlocky> You're correct, I don't have hoary in my sources.list
<warlocky> W: GPG error: http://bea.cabarel.com dargo Release: The following signatures couldn't be verified because the public key is not available: NO_PUBKEY 0E28E8629B4D6E8E
<Flannel> later versions put some stuff in /etc/apt/sources.list.d/[more files] , but I don't think that was around for breezy, do you even have that folder?
<Flannel> http://mirror.math.lsu.edu/ubuntu/dists/
<Flannel> try that mirror, you'll end up changing all the urls (but keeping everything else the same)
<warlocky> kk
<Flannel> er,
<warlocky> I get the point :-)
<Flannel> remove the /dists/ at the end
<warlocky> yea, working on it
<Flannel> but its still very odd that apt is still trying to get hoary stuff
<warlocky> Failed to fetch http://mirror.math.lsu.edu/ubuntu/dists/dargo/main/binary-i386/Packages.gz 404 Not Found
<warlocky> Reading package lists... Done
<warlocky> E: Some index files failed to download, they have been ignored, or old ones used instead.
<nalioth> it's still in the sources.list, Flannel
<Flannel> nalioth: what?
<warlocky> well, I'm still getting errors while apt-get updating, I guess I can't install anything unless I stop getting these errors?
<Flannel> warlocky: I don't know where that dargo thing came from, remove that line.
<warlocky> roger
<nalioth> warlocky: have you pasted your sources.list anywhere?
<warlocky> Yes, to Flannel before.
<Flannel> nalioth: He did last night, there was no hoary
<warlocky> This morning, I've spoken to him
<nalioth> can we paste it again? or give me the pastebin?
<warlocky> well, it's changed now - but I'll give you the old one
<warlocky> !pastebin
<ubotu> pastebin is a service to post large texts so you don't flood the channel. The Ubuntu pastebin is at http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org (make sure you give us the URL for your paste - see also the #ubuntu channel topic)
<Flannel> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/30756/
<warlocky> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/30799/
<nalioth> let me look
<nalioth> it's gotta be in there, cuz apt doesnt download from anything but the sources.list
<warlocky> (offtopic question: I tried to do a apt-get remove php5, and it removes phpmyadmin too - does that remove the sql databases aswell?)
<nalioth> it should leave your databases alone
<warlocky> ok, another question: is there a way to see if theres a newer php5 version available?
<warlocky> apt-get upgrade didn't show me anything with php5
<warlocky> neaither does apt-get install php5
<Flannel> warlocky: if you've kept up to date, then there most likely won't be, you already have the newest one.  Breezy has stopped being updated
<warlocky> ah ,right
#ubuntu-classroom 2008-07-16
<c00l2sv> hi guys, I've got a problem with ubuntu netboot 8.04.1 image
<c00l2sv> I created a usb with it, and I cant see my hdd using it
<c00l2sv> any ideas?
#ubuntu-classroom 2008-07-18
<Lena> hi, was anyone here yesterday? I apparently missed very important meeting, as I am a woman and I use ubuntu...
#ubuntu-classroom 2008-07-19
<Bonfirefliz> ï»¿Hi, I'm using 8.04 and I am trying to forward all traffic on a single port to go through my eth0 interface.  I have vpn turned on, so all traffic is going through the vpn tunnel -> eth0.  I want to bypass vpn for this one port.
<Bonfirefliz> ï»¿I have been looking at the iptables documentation, but have been unable to figure this out
<nalioth> Bonfirefliz: this is a classroom for scheduled classes
<nalioth> Bonfirefliz: #ubuntu is the support channel
<Bonfirefliz> ok sorry
#ubuntu-classroom 2009-07-13
<Traveler9> hey
<ZeBaX> Someone?
<imgoofygoober> yo teach, newbuntu here, Give me one good reason ubuntu is better than windows
<imgoofygoober> just one each
<shanix> imgoofygoober: no virus ?
<imgoofygoober> i never even got a virus on windows....
<imgoofygoober> i've been using it since nt too
<imgoofygoober> reason i got ubuntu was i thought it would run much more efficiently
<imgoofygoober> because i loathe anything that takes up a lot of memory
<imgoofygoober> so i guess in the sense of not having to run a memory intense antivirus, its better
<jarlen> it's mighty nice
<jarlen> safe you the headaches
<imgoofygoober> i never had headaches though...
<nhandler> Guys, please move the discussion to a different channel since no classroom session is currently going on
<imgoofygoober> um no classroom session?
<ikonia> imgoofygoober: not at the moment
<MythbuntuGuest59> I installed myth on a pc, it is working, I want to use it as a media server elsewhere in the house, I have 2 windows machines and 1 ubuntu 9.04, what settings need applied and where are they?
#ubuntu-classroom 2009-07-14
<Kaziu> yo
#ubuntu-classroom 2009-07-15
<oaktownchick> oakland01 tandelia@yahoo.com
#ubuntu-classroom 2009-07-16
<qwebirc13575> .
<qwebirc58483> jh
<SpinachHead> Hi, how can I get a log of the July 16 Mono packaging chat?
 * directhex peeks from behind the curtain
<directhex> so... is there some kind of grand announcement or something?
<directhex> like, an MC?
<antileet> There aren't any ops here either
<directhex> yays.
<dnielsen> it appears not, so let's just be daring rulebreakers and wing it
<pleia2> directhex: nope, you just start :)
<directhex> well, yeah, it's looking that way
<pleia2> there you go
<directhex> hah!
<directhex> okay then
<directhex> MONO PACKAGING. GOOD, BLAH BLAH BLAH.
 * antileet starts tomboy to take notes
<directhex> there are people here with varying degrees of experience, so i'm going to start with the fundamentals, to try and bring everyone up to speed
<pleia2> hehe
<directhex> okay, firstly, a quick discussion of what packaging a Mono app or library means, as compared to a C app
<directhex> Mono apps and libraries are called "assemblies", coming in .exe or .dll files (not to be confused with Windows executables and libraries, which uses .exe and .dll extensions too)
<directhex> assemblies contain cross-platform code, which any Common Language Runtime should be able to execute
<directhex> on Ubuntu, we only have one CLR - Mono. Others include Microsoft Rotor (their shared-source runtime), Microsoft.NET (their proprietary runtime) and dotGNU Portable.NET (FSF's Mono equivalent)
<directhex> Assemblies have properties similar to what we call "native" code (ELF binaries or shared libraries), such as a list of dependencies built in
<directhex> this is handy stuff for packaging, as it means we can automatically build a package's dependencies list based on the real-world dependencies on the library or executable
<directhex> as an example, take a look at "monodis --assemblyref foo.exe" on something like, i dunno, /usr/lib/tomboy/Tomboy.exe
<directhex> you can see 17 entries listed, with a Name, Version, and Public Key as the important factors
<directhex> generally, the "Name" field is the name of the library it needs, e.g. "Name=gnome-sharp" means it uses gnome-sharp.dll
<directhex> the "Version" field determines the ABI version of the assembly, which is a lot like a SONAME version in a native library.
<directhex> Mono (and .NET) have the ability to use backward-compatible data for libraries, so if an app says "I need GTK# 2.8", and you have 2.12 installed, that's okay - as long as you have the compatibility data required. this compatibility data comes in the form of "policy" files. As another example, try doing "gacutil -l | grep gtk-sharp"
<directhex> and you'll see things like:
<directhex> policy.2.10.gtk-sharp, Version=0.0.0.0, Culture=neutral, PublicKeyToken=35e10195dab3c99f
<directhex> that's a compatibility entry
<directhex> actually, a word on the GAC, since I just used it
<directhex> the GAC is a central repository for Mono libraries which are considered stable enough to be offered system-wide
<directhex> if you ever package a library, you want it in the GAC if you want apps to be able to use it
<directhex> for something to go into the GAC, it needs to be cryptographically signed - hence the "PublicKeyToken" value from gacutil, and the Public Key value from monodis
<directhex> they need to match up!
<directhex> and you can see here that they do
<directhex> gtk-sharp, Version=2.12.0.0, Culture=neutral, PublicKeyToken=35e10195dab3c99f
<directhex> 3: Version=2.12.0.0
<directhex> 	Name=gtk-sharp
<directhex> 0x00000000: 35 E1 01 95 DA B3 C9 9F
<directhex> see, app needs library, library in GAC, no problems!
<directhex> okay, that's MORE than enough background, i think. any questions so far?
<directhex> no?
<directhex> okay, on with the packaging specifics
<dnielsen> how and when would one in terms of packaging inject random stuff into the gac?
<directhex> dnielsen, if you're packaging a library (which is much more complex than an app), then we have special helpers to handle the GAC for you
<dnielsen> excellent
<antileet> directhex: So you're suggesting relying on assemblies in the gac rather than package them with your app?
<directhex> antileet, if you're packaging a library, you need a good reason not to use the GAC
<directhex> antileet, if you're packaging an app, then generally, you wouldn't use the GAC for app-related things
<directhex> antileet, now, that gets mildly complex if the app bundles a lib
<antileet> Say I use taglib-sharp in a project which I want to package
<directhex> right
<antileet> taglib-sharp is in my app, which I'm sure that Banshee installed
<antileet> *taglib-sharp is in my gac
<antileet> Now do I package my app without taglib-sharp assuming that the user will have it installed too?
<directhex> use the GAC copy, unless you have a very good reason not to. sometimes this may even involve patching your app's build system
<directhex> and rely on the easy peasy packaging data to take care of the dependencies for you
<directhex> which i'll get onto
<antileet> Okay, I think I'll wait till the end of this first
<directhex> dnielsen, in answer to your earlier one, here's an example of a all the extra voodoo required to GAC a library: http://svn.debian.org/wsvn/pkg-cli-libs/packages/mysql-connector-net-5.0/trunk/debian/libmysql6.0-cil.installcligac
<directhex> right. PACKAGING
<directhex> hopefully people went to james westby's DH7 talk. we love dh7 in Mono-land, as it makes life super easy.
<directhex> what dh7 does is basically automatically do everything you might want to do, based on the input it gets given. where that input would be the usual debian packaging paraphenalia like debian/control
<directhex> and dh7 is extensible - so the difference from a packager perspective between a non-mono app and a mono app is just 1 line (!)
<directhex> "include /usr/share/cli-common/cli.make" in debian/rules
<directhex> this tells debhelper to include that file, which is in the cli-common-dev package - and that file basically injects a bunch of our super secret debian mono team into dh7's usual list of operations
<directhex> and those new operations include things like "generate package dependencies based on Assembly chain"
<directhex> so... a real-world example, right?
<directhex> my example for the day is "bansheelyricsplugin" which is a simple enough package, prepared by the lovely hyperair here, which still includes a few things for packagers to be aware of
<directhex> http://git.debian.org/?p=pkg-cli-apps/packages/bansheelyricsplugin.git;a=tree;f=debian;h=936154ed82960f01961d4a760fe90bb81c9008ac;hb=HEAD is the url to click to see the packaging data for this
<directhex> it's a super-minimal example, so you'll see there are only 6 files here.
<directhex> changelog is boring, you should know about that already
<directhex> compat is just "7" because we're using dh7
<directhex> copyright is even more boring than changelog, although you might want to take a peek here as it uses an approximation of the new machine-readable DEP5 format that the debian folks keep going on about
<directhex> this leaves three interesting files - watch, rules, and control
 * hyperair waves
<directhex> now, the watch file here isn't mono-specific, but as a team, we're HUGE fans of them within the debian mono teams - and this is an interesting one, as it performs magic to make version 0.6 higher than version 1 (stupid upstreams)
<directhex> if you want to get a mono-related package into debian (and the ubuntu mono folks do all the work we can in debian primarily, so more people can benefit from the work), then a watch file is mandatory
<directhex> next, control, which is the first file with any mono specifics you need to know
<directhex> click on it (raw for those using the web interface), and you should see the list of build-depends on the source package, and the depends on the resultant binary package
<directhex> the latter first - notice how as well as the ${misc:Depends} entry you should be used to from other packaging systems, we have a ${cli:Depends} entry. this is the entry which we auto-populate with the real deps.
<directhex> things like libmono-system2.0-cil and so on
<directhex> and, here's part of the magic - if we ever move anything around (as we often do, in our never-ending quest to save space), then all your package needs is a recompile, and it'll pick up the new deps
<directhex> simple, easy, yay.
<directhex> now, the build-depends
<directhex> first thing you need to notice is the debhelper dependency. the version here, 7.0.50, is needed to use some of the features in debian/rules which we'll get to in a bit. i'll explain why when we get there
<directhex> cli-common-dev is needed for all the magic we use to do the dep auto-completion
<directhex> mono-devel is the "master" package which pulls in things like our current preferred compiler, and other assorted tools that mono builds use. this is the mono equivalent of build-essential or default-jdk or something - just pull it in to build things
<directhex> lastly we have some libraries specific to this app - in this case it needs banshee (as it's a banshee plugin), gconf# (for storing settings) and gtkhtml# (for displaying html). generally, when packaging an app or lib, you just need to list the things your lib needs to build here.
<directhex> so, what ties this all together? debian/rules - the debian package's makefile. take a look at the rules file now
<directhex> ( http://git.debian.org/?p=pkg-cli-apps/packages/bansheelyricsplugin.git;a=blob_plain;f=debian/rules;hb=HEAD )
<directhex> so. this is a reasonably simple dh7 file, with some special features.
<directhex> firstly, you'll notice the include at the top - like i said, this include is what makes a dh7 file a mono-specific dh7 file
<directhex> next is a bunch of scri[ting to fill in version number details. this is used by the get-orig-source rule, another thing we insist on as a team
<directhex> when we come to sponsor a package, we want to just say "okay, download the upstream source for me" and get an orig tarball ready for use - so we want a get-orig-source rule to do it. if you look closely you'll see that most of this rules file is actually taken up with get-orig-source things
<directhex> next, the dh7 "magic rule" which James will have covered earlier - that's the "%: dh $@" rule
 * meebey mumbles: only the packagers prefere it super easy, some sponsors like that too ^^
<meebey> +not
<directhex> what that means is whenever the build server says "debian/rules foobar", then this rule means "dh foobar" gets executed, and dh will use its big list of operations to run everything associated with the foobar task
<directhex> things like "build" or "install" or "configure"
<directhex> lastly, we have something found only in recent dh7, i.e. the reason for the 7.0.50 requirement - we have some overrides
<directhex> the latest dh7 allows you to have a "override_dh_somecommand" rule, and it'll run your rule instead when it would normally run the named command
<directhex> in this case, we have two - dh_installchangelogs is being overridden to not include the ChangeLog file it would normally include, and dh_auto_configure is being overridden to change the MCS variable passed to ./configure
<directhex> that's one last thing we insist on as a team - we've been trying to work towards a situation where you can have a "default" c# compiler, the way you have "cc" for C or "c++" for C++
<dnielsen> I assume the latter is part of the much touted space savings feature
<directhex> a build system which hard-codes, say, gcc-4.2 for not good reason is broken - it should use your system's preferred C compiler. we're trying to enforce the same thing
<dnielsen> ah
<directhex> in the future this should make it much easier to use Portable.NET if you so wish, as it'll offer an alternative for the csc (C# compiler) command
<directhex> right, so that's pretty much it for packaging an app (!)
<directhex> there's the question of patching, of course
<directhex> I'd suggest you look at http://svn.debian.org/wsvn/pkg-cli-apps/packages/themonospot/trunk/debian/#_packages_themonospot_trunk_debian_ in your own time for an example of dh7+mono+patching
<directhex> that just leaves libraries, really.
<directhex> and the specifics for libraries are pretty much as I told dnielsen earlier - see http://svn.debian.org/wsvn/pkg-cli-libs/packages/taglib-sharp/trunk/debian/#_packages_taglib-sharp_trunk_debian_ for an example
<directhex> there's a .install file (which says which files should be installed where), and a .installcligac file (which says "put the named files into the GAC)
<meebey> oldschool packaging! :)
<directhex> and that's more or less all there is to it, until you need to patch things up the wazoo to get them to be signed, or need to build your own policy files because upstream are stupid, and so on
<directhex> if you're feeling insane, look at ikvm's packaging for a journey into madness
<directhex> or feel free to update our db4o packaging, as nobody's been brave enough yet
<directhex> but I think that's all the topics covered in mind-numbing detail, with 15 minutes left over for Q&A
<directhex> so. any questions on mono packaging?
<meebey> how come the mono packages are the most awesome?
<directhex> well, we have a very sexy person in charge of the debian mono group. it's all their doing
<antileet> meebey: I've never packaged anything for debian before, can you point me to a document where I can start?
<dnielsen> looking at the example packages it seems a lot of the hackarounds are for upstream insanity. Would it maybe be prudent to have documentation for upstreams on how to making packaging easier. It seems to me that there is a trend of common mistakes
<directhex> that and we have lots of things at our disposal which make life much easier than other guys - e.g. i'd be amazed if the java folks wouldn't go mad for things like assembly reference lists & policy versioning in libraries
<meebey> dnielsen: from time to time we try to educate upstream, but its very time consuming task
<directhex> and some upstreams can be hostile
<directhex> or uninterested
<directhex> or lazy
<directhex> or drunk
<directhex> so we try not to be pushy with upstreams
<meebey> antileet: for deb packaging or especially debian?
<antileet> meebey: The basics of deb packaging please
<meebey> new maintainer guide should be a good start I guess
<directhex> oh, and whilst they're here: meebey is head of the debian mono group, and essentially "the boss" for all this stuff. Laney is my peer within MOTU who does general mono nonsense too, amongst other things (e.g. he does haskell too, the poor fool). hyperair is the ubuntu banshee packager, mainly. sebner packages assorted mono things he finds fun, and is also from ubuntuland.
<meebey> antileet: http://www.debian.org/doc/maint-guide/
<directhex> anyone i missed, /trout me at will
<directhex> antileet, and see http://pkg-mono.alioth.debian.org/cli-policy/ for the group policies in painful detail
<directhex> okay. no more packaging questions?
<Laney> how can I best get involved with the team?
<directhex> Laney, why, you'd come to #debian-cli on OFTC, and make a nuisance of yourself for a while!
<antileet> meebey: Okay, seems detailed enough. I want to initially try and package MD trunk for ubuntu. I'll let you know if I find any trouble
<directhex> that's where most of what we do is coordinated - there's also a mailing list somewhere
<Laney> but aren't debian developers scary and mean ubuntu-haters?
<directhex> aha, http://lists.debian.org/debian-cli/
<meebey> antileet: MD is a bitch ,) as little advance warning :-P
<sebner> directhex: tell about git!
<antileet> meebey: there are like seven or eight assemblies that I see
<dnielsen> the MD fedora spec made me cry.. I definitely do not recommend using MD as a first anything.. not without ample amounts of drugs handy
<directhex> Laney, the debian folks are all lovely ubuntu lovers (*cough*), who have been shown that we're not all useless layabouts. more importantly, #debian-cli is full of people who know their stuff, so package quality will be best if you coordinate with the clever folks in there
<directhex> remember, a package in debian is a package in debian AND ubuntu. everybody wins
<antileet> dnielsen: Okay, I package something simple then.
<Laney> *and* a better package from being gazed at lovingly by people who care for its area
<meebey> antileet: the bad part is the build system, upstream is buggy there
<meebey> antileet: see the patches I have to apply/update with each release: http://svn.debian.org/wsvn/pkg-cli-apps/packages/monodevelop/trunk/debian/patches/00list
<directhex> indeed. MOTU is great, but generalists might not know about specifics of mono packaging, and might miss, say, bad policy data breaking transitions, or something
<sebner> Laney: debian with bugs meebey says *cough* *cough*
<antileet> meebey: why don't you just get the patches into the trunk?
<directhex> sebner, it is though!
<Laney> the magic "just" ;)
<directhex> ANY OTHER MONO QUESTIONS WHILST WE'RE HERE? WHEEEEE!
<meebey> antileet: because upstream preferes being broken in some cases
<sebner> directhex: debian with cool bleeding edge software ftw! :P
<dnielsen> thank you directhex for this enlightening hour
<sebner> \o/ directhex
<directhex> dnielsen, well, most of it is only possible thanks to meebey, so round of applause for meebey
<sebner> \o/ meebey
<meebey> :-P
 * sebner is meebey's only fanboy evidently :P
<directhex> he's also the mad person who sponsors 99% of mono package uploads in debian, and takes care of the "mono" and "monodevelop" source packages all by himself
<directhex> 2 minutes! no last-minute heckles?
<meebey> and smuxi *cough* *cough* a very cool next generation IRC client (compared to irssi at least)
<directhex> yes, he's upstream for smuxi. cross-platform irc client!
<directhex> ding ding, time's up!
<directhex> anyone who cares, or has more questions, #debian-cli is that way -->
<directhex> peace out, y'all
<meebey> watch out for the network bumps, it's on OFTC
 * hyperair yawns
<hyperair> looks like i missed the fun
<hyperair> oh well
 * hyperair goes back to sleep
<JoaoSantana> mono packaging is over?
<JoaoSantana> hi all
#ubuntu-classroom 2009-07-17
<TTxT> anyone knows how to create a deb with diferent cflags and cxxflags?
#ubuntu-classroom 2009-07-18
<jawnsy> 5 days until Packaging Perl Modules ;-)
#ubuntu-classroom 2010-07-19
<organic4you> can someone help me install nvidia drivers it says not with x server
<pleia2> organic4you: you'll want #ubuntu for support (this channel is used for scheduled classes, not many support folks here)
<dart> i saw a tweet....the session is goin to start in a few minutes????
<pleia2> dart: no, next class isn't until thursday
<pleia2> where did you see the tweet?
<dart> oops
<dart> in google updtaes
<pleia2> hmm, last tweet was friday
<dart> unixlandâ: RT @tribulinux: âº @ubuntuclassroom: Starting in 10 Minutes in #ubuntu-classroom: How To Help With Edubuntu - highvoltage
<dart> this was the tweet
<pleia2> ah, looks like they're retweeting an old tweet
<dart> ah
<pleia2> that was days ago :)
<dart> too bad...anyway i m looking forward to next session....wats the topic
<pleia2> if you're interested, the logs for that session are online with the rest of the dev week topics
<dart> can u give me the link plz
<pleia2> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDeveloperWeek just click on the subject in the table
<dart> thnx
<pleia2> and the upcoming schedule is in the topic http://is.gd/8rtIi
<dart> installing a lamp server on 28th is gud ;)
<delcoyote> hi
<alien_> hi guys
<alien_> if i clean up my sistem will my ipod come back to show in rythmbox
<alien_> clen var cache and all that
<alien_> is not showing but it opens when u plug it to pc
<alien_> i mean by that rythmbox
<alien_> it opens when i plug the ipod
<pleia2> alien_: you'll want #ubuntu for support (this channel is used for scheduled classes, not many support folks here)
<alien_> where can i go
<alien_> any suggestion
<delcoyote> #ubuntu
<Esquire> alien_: please type "/join #ubuntu"
<Esquire> Without the quotes just incase :)
<Esquire> Oh and press enter when you are done..
<Esquire> Gota run folks have a nice day/evening
#ubuntu-classroom 2010-07-20
<delcoyote> hi
<mhall119> hello
<Omega> Hey.
<sysadm1977> hi, any pointers on the best load-balancer for ubuntu?
#ubuntu-classroom 2010-07-21
<delcoyote> hi
<delcoyote> hi
#ubuntu-classroom 2010-07-22
<mohit_> hi all i am new to linux
<mohit_> please tell me how to get package from net
<delcoyote> hi
<delcoyote> hi
<Rhonda> Just to be sure noone is here too early - my talk is at 18:00 UTC, which is in two hours earliest. :)
<SvenG> ah!
<SvenG> Thu Jul 22 17:51:46 CEST 2010
<SvenG> cest = utc+2
<Rhonda> Also, I'd like to point out to not make this too messy, this channel will get muted at that time with only me being able to speak up. Be invited to also hang out in #ubuntu-classroom-chat and ask your questions in there. If you prefix them with QUESTION ClassBot will pick them up and offer them to me for relaying into here.
<pleia2> make sure you don't forget the colon, so QUESTION:
<czajkowski> aloha
<Robi_> yo ppl
<mistrynitesh> nameste
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || Event: Packaging Training Session - Current Session: Working with Debian BTS for (not only) Ubuntu Contributors - Instructor: Rhonda
<Rhonda> Like mentioned before, this channel will become moderated soonishly, so be reminded again to take questions prefixed with QUESTION: to #ubuntu-classroom-chat so that the ClassBot can pick them up.
<Rhonda> Welcome everybody. Todays topic for this talk is the Debian BTS.
<Rhonda> BTS stands for Bug Tracking System. Some might question themself, why being bothered? We are Ubuntu, right?
<Rhonda> Wrong. ;)
<Rhonda> As lined out in last weeks devweek talk that Laney gave together with me it is important to work together with the Debian people.
<Rhonda> If you might want to catch up on the why - read up its log from the archive: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/devweek1007/WorkDebian
<Rhonda> I'd like to start off with the basic web interface that the BTS offers. Contrary to what launchpad offers, this is a readonly interface, so it only offers query possibilities.
<Rhonda> http://bugs.debian.org/ redirects you to a basic page in which you have some few forms that allow you to query the web interface. But there are very handy shortcut options that are useful to keep in mind.
<Rhonda> If you would be a package maintainer, or might want to track the open bugs of a specific maintainer, you would query e.g. http://bugs.debian.org/rhonda@debian.at (this is my own overview)
<Rhonda> Please notice that this doesn't contain co-maintained packages - this is a wishlist bugreport that is open against the BTS.
<Rhonda> If on the other hand as user you would like to know which of the bugs you have reported are still open, you would use the from: keyword, like http://bugs.debian.org/from:rhonda@debian.at to get an overview of the still outstanding bugreports that you opened, to be able to remind yourself of the status and potential send a followup to question what's going on.
<Rhonda> There is also the posibility to query for bugreports against specific packages one is interested in. One approach would be to query for a specific binary package, like e.g. http://bugs.debian.org/wesnoth-1.8
<Rhonda> To refer to a specific _source_ package (which would list all bugreports against the individual binary packages) you use the src: prefix, like http://bugs.debian.org/src:wesnoth-1.8
<Rhonda> Finally, if you know a specific bugnumber, you would just query http://bugs.debian.org/459935
<Rhonda> These are the most important shortcuts for querying the webinterface, at least the basic ones. You can see at the end of the overview queries a form with which you can tweak the overview a bit, too.
<Rhonda> Also in the overview you have for each bugreport several information listed:
<Rhonda> First of all obviously the unique bug number by which the bug is referenced. Next is a group of flags which give information about the bug status. If you hover with your mouse over the individual entries you'll receive a tooltip expansion what they stand for.
<Rhonda> Also you can click into that part to get a bit more information about the bug at hand. Next would be the binary package the bug is filed against, and then the subject. The rest of the information should also be pretty self explaining.
<Rhonda> Please notice that package maintainers (or maintenance teams) can tweak the grouping of the bugs in their overview page, like you can see on e.g. http://bugs.debian.org/qa.debian.org or on http://bugs.debian.org/ftp.debian.org
<Rhonda> How to do that would explode the context of this session though, so I won't cover it here.
<Rhonda> This covers the webinterface pretty well me thinks, let's move on to reporting some bugs, won't we. :)
<Rhonda> I mentioned that the web interface is read-only, so how to report bugs? While the web interface is pretty useful, you might have noticed download links for mailbox files in individual bugreports.
<Rhonda> This gives somehow the impression as wether it would work by emails - and you are right on that! The real main interface to the BTS is email based.
<Rhonda> The webpage http://www.debian.org/Bugs/Reporting gives a short guide how to use it, I'll cover a few bits of here though.
<Rhonda> There is are some helpful tools that I can encourage to report bugs with, they though depend on a local running mailserver. Laney encourages you to use ssmtp which is pretty easy to set up and get used to for sending out mails.
<ClassBot> nigelb asked: Is there any plan for a web manipulatable interface for BTS?
<Rhonda> There is a GSoC project proposed since a while, unfortunately noone signed up to do it, especially since the BTS depends so heavily on emails and would require some sort of login mechanism or challenge-response style things.
<Rhonda> So plans are there, noone though did pick up on it to work on it. Most people are happy enough with the email approach.
<Rhonda> Anyway, about the tools for reporting, there is reportbug to be run in a terminal, and reportbug-ng for a graphical interface.
<Rhonda> Personally I have to admit that I didn't use the later so I can talk about the former. To not have a confusion for regular Ubuntu users reportbug is changed in Ubuntu to _not_ send mails to the Debian BTS by default.
<Rhonda> One either has to use the "-B debian" switch, or put "bts debian" into the .reportbugrc (thanks for mentioning that, cjwatson)
<Rhonda> Even though reportbug is a textbased interface it is extremely helpful in the way that it gathers additional information that the package maintainer might want to know, like dependencies or debconf answers that were given on installation.
<Rhonda> reportbug has different operating modes that one can set - those tweak what kind of additional information the user is asked about. The default mode is set to novice and can also be tweaked through the .reportbugrc file.
<Rhonda> Another very very handy tool is called "bts" (nomen est omen) and is included in the devscripts package.
<Rhonda> It can be used to change meta information of different bugreports from the commandline. If you more regularly have to change bugreports you really should get used to this tool, it can increase your performance a fair bit. Just in case, if you do, please don't forget to also leave a helpful comment with adding "# some remark" on why the change was done so it's more obvious.
<Rhonda> But like said, the main interface is emails, and all these tools only actually craft emails in the background for you.
<Rhonda> Thus, I also like to mention the format of said emails. There are three important mail addresses that the BTS recognizes:
<Rhonda> submit@bugs.debian.org - mails sent to this address will open a new bugreport.
<Rhonda> These mails require some additional "Pseudo" headerlines at the start of your email body to do something useful. ;)
<Rhonda> The subject of the mail itself will be taken as subject of the bugreport, so be sure to make it as clear as possible (like you try to do with all your emails anyway, right? ;))
<Rhonda> The most important pseudo header is "Package: foo". This means that this newly submitted bugreport is for the package named foo.
<Rhonda> Second important pseudo header is "Version: 1.2.3". This is important because the Debian BTS has this special thing called version tracking.
<Rhonda> Through the version information it knows which bugs apply to which release, and it is also an important information to the package maintainer obviously.
<ClassBot> sense asked: In Ubuntu we have a lot of packageless bugs that are reported by people who don't know against what package to report the bugs. The Bug Squad has to find time and people to assign these bugs against the correct package. Does Debian have packageless bugs?
<Rhonda> Yes, there is. There are several different approaches here. One thing is the "Package: general". Bugreports against that pseudo package gets sent to debian-devel and get addressed though that.
<Rhonda> Also bugreports against non-existing packages aren't lost or go to the void, there are people explicitly hunting those down, and I think also bugreports with no Package: header do land in some special place where interested people can check on them.
<Rhonda> There are also some more things in the submit mails that can get set: "Severity: important" for the importance of the bugreport (known values are critical, grave, serious, important, normal (default), minor and wishlist)
<Rhonda> So a wishlist type report is also filed through the same interface as "bugreport".
<Rhonda> Also, one can set "Tags: patch" on a bugreport when one adds a patch to it to make it easy for people who like to check patches and fast-track such bugreports (so adding patches is always a good idea ;))
<ClassBot> mistrynitesh asked: won't every reporter set the Severity: Critical? Is there a way to govern this?
<Rhonda> No, they don't. :)  Most users don't bother at all setting a severity and have the bugs dropped in as normal.
<Rhonda> Also, tweaking these things is easy and is usually done quickly, which I want to come to now. :)
<Rhonda> There is also the control@bugs.debian.org mailaddress which is the one that the former mentioned "bts" tool sends its mails to.
<Rhonda> It can be often seen when package maintainers followup to a bugreport that they send a Cc to this address in addition to the bugnumber mailaddress (which is <bugnumber>@bugs.debian.org btw.) and add some other pseudo headers.
<Rhonda> The control facility take a tiny bit different syntax than the submit one.
<ClassBot> There are are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
<Rhonda> And it is mainly documented on http://www.debian.org/Bugs/server-control
<Rhonda> Things that are often used is "reassign <bugnumber> <otherpackage>". This will reassign the given bugnumber to a different package.
<Rhonda> Please notice that this will lose the bugs version information so if you are aware that this affects a specific version of the other package add it as additional argument.
<Rhonda> Quick strawpoll question: What I feared happened - the time did run faster than I was able to type, and I still have stuff on my agenda to adress.
<Rhonda> Do people prefer if I continue the session (there is nothing planed after this one) or if we cut it and continue another time?
<Rhonda> I will in the meantime continue anyway so that we don't lose time by this dilemma. Please raise your voice on this topic in #ubntu-classroom-chat
<Rhonda> Addressing mistrynitesh's question there is the "severity <bugnumber> <newseverity>" command which can fix the severity in case a bugreporter has a non-fitting opinion in comparison to the package maintainer. ;)
<ClassBot> There are are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
<Rhonda> Please also notice that anyone can change bugreports - so at times it happens that bugreports switch the severity back and forth, this is not a good style, please respect the package maintainer's opinion on it and try to convince them with reasoning - repeated severity inflation have resulted in getting banned from the control address in the past.
<Rhonda> If you notice that the bugreport is found in a specific version you can use the "found <bugnumber> <version>" to mark that.
<Rhonda> Please notice that this is often enough only useful when you have found it in an _older_ version too, like in the stable release when a bug was reported against the version in Debian testing.
<Rhonda> forwarded is also a pretty useful control command to mark that a bugreport has got forwarded. You set it to the URL or email address where you forwarded the bug to.
<Rhonda> If you set it to a URL it can be pretty helpful because there is a service that checks known upstream bug trackers and can set specific tags as notification for the maintainer.
<Rhonda> Which brings me to the "tags" command. With this one can set some helpful marks onto a bugreport.
<Rhonda> The syntax is "tags <bugnumber> + tag1 tag2 - tag3 tag4" - so one can add tags and remove in a single line.
<Rhonda> Or set the tags explicit to a specific set with =
<Rhonda> Often used tags are moreinfo when the user is asked to submit additional information, unreproducible if the maintainer isn't able to reproduce the issue, pending when the bug is fixed within the maintainer's VCS but not uploaded yet, security for bugreports that are relevant for the security team, upstream to mark bugreports that aren't happening just because of the packaging, confirmed, and many more.
<Rhonda> Also there are tags for each release. Please notice that those have change its meaning since version tracking got implemented, so please don't use them unless you know what you are doing. I will mention an example for them a bit later. ;)
<Rhonda> There are more commands that control accepts, you can find them all listed in the former mentioned URL, http://www.debian.org/Bugs/server-control - and usually these control mails are ended with "thanks" or "stop" to tell the control server to stop processing the mail here so it doesn't produce errors.
<Rhonda> This ending markers are especially useful when following up to bugreports and sending a cc to control@
<Rhonda> One _very_ common problem people stumble into is using the <bugnumber>@bugs.debian.org mail address.
<Rhonda> Often enough people expect this such mails to get sent to the bug reporter - but they won't.
<Rhonda> These bugs only go the maintainer of the package (and people subscribed through the http://packages.qa.debian.org/ to the according package)
<Rhonda> If one want to reach out to the submitter of the bugreport they have to explicitly be put in the to line, but there is a helpful bugs address: <bugnumber>-submitter@bugs.debian.org
<Rhonda> This will get to the submitter of the bugreport then too. Keep that in mind, otherwise you will fall into the pit that many package maintainers did fall into and wonder why you don't receive any response from the submitter at all.
<Rhonda> Alright. This is the main part of my talk. Thanks for your attention!
<Rhonda> â¦ though, I won't end here, because I mentioned in my announce that there is the question pending why some bugreports won't get archived.
<Rhonda> And you want to know why so, right?
<Rhonda> Some part of this is rooted in the version tracking, which I want to try to explain now.
<ClassBot> mistrynitesh asked: When one reports a bug, is he/she subscribed to that bug and receive updates on it?
<Rhonda> To some degree yes, to some no.
<Rhonda> Like mentioned, <bugnumber>@bugs.debian.org doesn't reach the submitter of the bugreport.
<Rhonda> But one thing that _always_ reaches the submitter is closing a bugreport.
<Rhonda> Closing a bugreport is either done by adding a "Closes: #1234" into the debian/changelog and uploading the package (the way to do it when the bug requires changes to the package)
<Rhonda> Otherwise people can send mails to <bugnumber>-done@bugs.debian.org explaining why the bugreport is closed. If it was closed in a former upload already but reported later or forgotten to be closed with the upload, this mail should contain a "Version: 1.2.4" in its first line so that the version tracking can do its good for this bugreport, too.
<ClassBot> yofel asked: there is a possibility to subscribe to bug reports.. <bug>-subscribe@b.d.o - what mails do you get if you do that?
<Rhonda> From what I perceived this makes one receive all mails that are sent to <bug>@b.d.o, including control@ processing mails, but don't pin me down on that.
<Rhonda> So, back to version tracking: When you go to an individual bug page, let's take http://bugs.debian.org/580391 as example here, you'll notice a graph in the upper corner.
<Rhonda> That graph shows the information that version tracking works on.
<Rhonda> You will notice that there is a green box with (testing, unstable) in it, and a red circle with (stable) in it.
<Rhonda> green means good versions, the bug is fixed in those, red means bad versions, the bug is not fixed in those.
<Rhonda> On the left hand side you see the information of the bug, like Severity: grave, Found and Fixed in versions, and that the bug actually is Done.
<Rhonda> Usually a bugreport gets archived after being done for 28 days in testing.
<Rhonda> Given that this bugreport is of severity grave, it is considered release-critical.
<Rhonda> release-critical means that Debian doesn't want to release with a package that contains such a bugreport.
<Rhonda> So how did this bugreport happen to be affecting stable, then? It was reported after stable was released, that's why.
<Rhonda> Actually though, this bugreport doesn't really affect stable, because the cause of this happened after the release, squeakvm did still exist in the stable release. It's just that the found version was the same in unstable at the time this was reported.
<Rhonda> so this is where the release tags come into play. I am going to mark this bugreport as not affecting stable by tagging it with squeeze sid, like this:
<Rhonda> bts tag 580391 + squeeze sid '# not affecting stable'
<Rhonda> We will have to wait for the mail to arrive at the BTS to se its reult.
<Rhonda> If you click on the "etoys" link at the top now you see the overview of the bugreports against the etoys package.
<Rhonda> Like mentioned when you click on the [G|+|âº] part in that page you get the additional information.
<Rhonda> You'll see that there is no information about archival in there currently. We'll come back to this in a few minutes,.
<Rhonda> When you look at http://bugs.debian.org/581337 now, which is another release critical bugreport, you can see it also be seen as affecting stable.
<Rhonda> You will notice that this bugreport doesn't has any found version.
<Rhonda> This makes the BTS think that the bugreport affects every version it is aware of.
<Rhonda> The root of this is that the bug got reassigned without any version information. This is also easy to fix because the version information in the original report is actual correct.
<Rhonda> bts found 581337 0.18-1 "# readd found version lost in reassign"
<Rhonda> This will fix the version information for this done bugreport and mark get it closed for real and archiveable. :)
<Rhonda> This now is a more difficult issue now to decypher: http://bugs.debian.org/src:isync - who gets an idea why there are so many resolved bugreports that doesn't get archived?
<Rhonda> If we choose any individual bugreport of those, e.g. http://bugs.debian.org/177280 the graph has some interesting content.
<Rhonda> You can click on it to receive a larger version in case you still don't see it. ;)
<Rhonda> The topmost green box contains (testing, unstable, stable) while the topmost red circle contains (unstable)
<Rhonda> Now how is that possible? Having unstable both fixed and not-fixed?
<Rhonda> Here the packages interface comes handy: http://packages.debian.org/unstable/isync gives us some more information on this confusing graph.
<Rhonda> You will notice that almost all architectures have the same version - except one.
<Rhonda> Given that hurd-i386 is in a special state, it's not part of testing and not a release architecture, the way to fix the isync issues is to request removal of the package for this architecture.
<Rhonda> I found the same issue last week in another package: wormux. You can see still some not-yet archived bugreports on http://bugs.debian.org/src:wormux - but when you click on the informational part there you'll see that they "Can be archived in 8 days" now that the removal of the outdated package on the hurd architecture was processed.
<Rhonda> If we now look back at http://bugs.debian.org/etoys ypi
<Rhonda> If we now look back at http://bugs.debian.org/etoys you'll see when you click on [G|+|âº] after a reload that the bugreport is set to be able to get archived in 28 days and also the added squeeze sid tags.
<Rhonda> Likewise in http://bugs.debian.org/581337 you see the fixed adjusted version graph, it doesn't contain the stable version in there anymore and will be able to get archived.
<Rhonda> I guess this should cover the most confusing things that can happen with version tracking and how to get them fixed. Please don't refrain to ask when you are unsure - even though almost all changes can be undone easily it might annoy someone.
<Rhonda> â¦ and I hope I didn't bore you too much and you all fell asleep in the meantime!
<Rhonda> I guess we can start a final round of questions, if I didn't overflow your brains with too many information in too short time.
<Rhonda> As final reminder, there are some Debian Developer still hanging out in #ubuntu-debian which are working on better collaboration so if you don't want to expose yourself on more specific Debian channels feel invited to come by and ask in there if unsure.
<Rhonda> â¦ scratch that "still", we won't run away when you come. ;)
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - http://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi
#ubuntu-classroom 2010-07-23
<laughter> hey ubuntu-classroom, i might have the oppurtunity to teach a seminar class to high school age students.  I am a science teacher.  I would love to do a seminar about the open source community and the ubuntu experience.  do any of you know of any good resources to develop a curriculum?
<SvenG> laughter: good question.  dont know any off-hand.  google?!
<pleia2> laughter: the ubuntu learning project (which classroom is part of) is working to develop some courses, right now we just have ones focused on sysadmin stuff
<pleia2> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Learning/Materials
<pleia2> laughter: you might also be interested in checking out http://spreadubuntu.neomenlo.org/ - it's mostly promotional stuff like banners and handouts, but there are also some slides and things here and there
<laughter> cool
<SvenG> :-)
<pleia2> regarding the learning team, we're alwys looking for pepole to help out, so even if you don't find us useful, contributing the class you write back to the project would help us a lot
<pleia2> we hang out over in #ubuntu-learning
<pomb> hello
<cjohnston> Rhonda: fwiw, you can hang out in backstage if you like. :-)
<Rhonda> Oh, right, I'm still in here, too. Thanks for reminding.
<delcoyote> hi
#ubuntu-classroom 2010-07-24
<kermiac> JoeMaverickSett: see http://people.ubuntu.com/~nhandler/classroom.html for the current schedule
<JoeMaverickSett> kermiac, thanks.
<jagan185> hi everyone
<JoeMaverickSett> is the next class about "LAMP server" at 18:00,July 28 according to UTC time?
<pedro3005> yes,  I think so
<nhandler> That is correct JoeMaverickSett
<JoeMaverickSett> so, it means that as i'm in Malaysia, it would be around 2am on July 29? is that correct?
<JoeMaverickSett> according to the current UTC time and my time is 9hrs difference.
<pedro3005> indeed
<pedro3005> yeah, I think that's it
<JoeMaverickSett> pedro3005, thanks. nhandler , you too.
<delcoyote> hi
#ubuntu-classroom 2010-07-25
<delcoyote> hi
<jagan185> Hi everyone
<jagan185> What is SSH?
<rork> jagan185: ssh (SSH client) is a program for logging into a remote machine and for executing commands on a remote machine.
<jagan185> rork: thanks
<delcoyote> buenos dias
<jagan185> Hi all
<jagan185> Where are the files recieved over bluetooth stored in Ubuntu 10.04
<jagan185> IN ubuntu netbook remix.
#ubuntu-classroom 2011-07-18
<roy_> can anyone help me here?
<Wilczek> roy_: Whats up?
<roy_> fine
<roy_> hey can you help me here installing open source drivers over fglrx?
<roy_> the fglrx locks up my system whe playing
<roy_> giving two boom errors in kernel log
<roy_> and then locking up
<Wilczek> I never do it
<roy_> so i want to install the open source drivers which i also heard give a better performance
<Wilczek> What problem?
<roy_> that right now tthis is the status: OpenGL renderer string: Software Rasterizer
<roy_> and i want hardware support for my hd3850
<roy_> can you help me with that?
<Wilczek> Unfortunately, I can't help you. Ask on #ubuntu
<roy_> ok thanks anyway, thats what im doing now
<husofar> hi
<rrnwexec> hello we'll be starting UCW shortly. please standby.
<husofar> ok thnx
<rrnwexec> and soon the Classbot will change the topic and give you some flashy slides to look at... hopefully ;)
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || Event: Ubuntu Community Week - Current Session: An Introduction to Ubuntu Community Week - Instructors: rrnwexec - Slides: http://is.gd/R2etxs
<rrnwexec> :)
<ClassBot> Slides for An Introduction to Ubuntu Community Week: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuCommunityWeek/oneiric/slides?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=session01.pdf
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/07/18/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
<rrnwexec> Before I start I want to thank all of you for taking time out of your busy schedules to join us for our our first ever Ubuntu Community Week.
<rrnwexec>  I know you have many competing demands on your time. Thank you for giving Ubuntu priority.
<rrnwexec> An introduction is in order. I'm Randall Ross, the Community Manager of the Ubuntu Vancouver LoCo (local community) in Vancouver Canada.
<rrnwexec> [SLIDE 1] (see slide 1)
<rrnwexec> If you haven't already, Please open my slides and follow along.
<rrnwexec> So... I'm Randall :)
<rrnwexec> I'm also often called the "Ubuntu Buzz Generator" as my personal mission is to ensure that Ubuntu remains on the minds of as many people as possible at all times.
<rrnwexec> (and that's often)
<rrnwexec>  In an age of attention scarcity, that requires buzz. If you google "Randall Ross Ubuntu", you'll get more information than you ever asked for on ways that I am trying to do that.
<rrnwexec> I almost forgot: If you have Lernid installed on your Ubuntu system, you should be able to use it as an alternative to IRC. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lernid (it's optional, and we're testing it, so be patient if things aren't 100%)
<rrnwexec> Also, if you want to ask a question please type your question in in #ubuntu-classroom-chat as follows:
<rrnwexec> QUESTION: <Your question here (city/town)>
<rrnwexec> You can ask a question at any time but I will save the questions for after my presentation, so please be patient.
<rrnwexec> Please ask questions that are relevant to Ubuntu community and please include your city/town name as I love to hear where Ubuntu people are.
<rrnwexec>  It's one of the most fun parts of hosting sessions like this. :)
<rrnwexec> So, how did we get here?
<rrnwexec> "It was a bright cold day in April, and the clocks were striking thirteen."
<rrnwexec> Oops, wrong story ;) But more on that later.
<rrnwexec> Actually back in May 2011 I attended the amazing "Ubuntu Developer Summit" (Oneiric) in Budapest
<rrnwexec> Hungary and met a bunch of great people that help make Ubuntu what is is.
<rrnwexec> One of them was Jono Bacon. (A real nice guy!)
<rrnwexec> Over several discussions Jono and I talked about ways to continue to make Ubuntu community bigger, stronger and faster!
<rrnwexec> (see slide 2).
<rrnwexec> One part of this vision was to have a whole week of online learning sessions that just focus on the community aspects of the project.
<rrnwexec> I can't take credit for this idea though. It was Jono's :)
<rrnwexec> An idea that what was later to be called "Ubuntu Community Week". Pretty original huh?
<rrnwexec> (I had several earlier working titles for the week, but Ubuntu Community Week seemed to sum it up nicely.)
<rrnwexec> * And I wanted to avoid the word "LoCo" in our title, as it tends to make people giggle in Spanish-speaking parts of the world.
<rrnwexec> The word community is tossed around a lot, and it will be used extensively throughout the week.
<rrnwexec> To prevent confusion I'd like to offer up my definition and the one that will be used for the purposes of these sessions.
<rrnwexec> (You can get a lot more info in Jono's book by the way. "The Art of Community")
<rrnwexec> Community is a "gathering of people that share a common space and purpose, usually in close physical proximity to one another.
<rrnwexec> Communities collaborate and share amongst members."
<rrnwexec>   It's a pretty simple definition, but also a subtle one. Let me explain:
<rrnwexec> In the world of software projects (like Ubuntu), we tend to think of community as the collection of developers that collaborate to write code, to package, to test, and to work on other technical stuff.
<rrnwexec> This is a valid definition (especially when a project is just starting), but for our purposes it is too constrained.
<rrnwexec> In Ubuntu, there is a broader community that includes developers but also artists, designers, project managers, translators, managers, marketers, and many more. However even this description is too constrained.
<rrnwexec> It nicely sums up what we might call "Ubuntu contributors" but it still excludes the largest group: people who "just" use Ubuntu and love Ubuntu.
<rrnwexec> So as we go through this session and this week, please keep that definition in mind.
<rrnwexec> Community includes *everyone*. It includes your mom, your neighbour, your spouse, your grocer, your teacher,...
<rrnwexec> ... and even your kayak instructor. If they use Ubuntu, they're a part of it.
<rrnwexec> ;)
<rrnwexec> [SLIDE 11]
<rrnwexec> (see slide 11)
<rrnwexec> sorry, i may bounce around a bit on the slide ordering.
<rrnwexec> So here we are. From our dimly lit rooms, we're watching text flow across the screen.
<rrnwexec> Seems a bit lonely, doesn't it?
<rrnwexec> That's another reason I wanted to have UCW (I'll call it that from now on because I'm a slow typist).
<rrnwexec> Part of UCW is about inspiring people to get out of their basements, away from their terminals and chat screens, and out into the real-world, that place sometimes referred to as "meatspace".
<rrnwexec> Now that 20 million people worldwide enjoy Ubuntu, there literally are Ubuntu humans everywhere.
<rrnwexec> There are people using and enjoying Ubuntu in your town.
<rrnwexec> Depending on who you ask, free operating systems (based on a free kernel) enjoy about 1% market share (on client computers).
<rrnwexec> Of those about 50% run Ubuntu.
<rrnwexec> That means 0.5% of the people in your town or city are running Ubuntu.
<rrnwexec> So some easy math should tell you that you are not alone.
<rrnwexec> If your town has 10,000 people in it, you'll likely be able to find 50 people just like you. Well, maybe not exactly like you ;)
<rrnwexec>  Pretty cool huh? If your town has more than 200 people, you are not alone!
<rrnwexec> how many of you live in towns bigger than that? Congratulations.
<rrnwexec> I wanted to provide some tips and pointers for finding these people. So I themed the first part of UCW "Find".
<rrnwexec> Sessions were chosen to help you find your community, or to start one.
<rrnwexec> Or to get the word out to others in your community that an Ubuntu group exists.
<rrnwexec> Alan Bell is going to share some ideas he has about mapping our local communities to make them easier to find.
<rrnwexec> [SLIDE 4]
<rrnwexec>  (see slide 4)
<rrnwexec> Charlene Tessier is going to talk about using community events like farmers' markets to raise awareness.
<rrnwexec> I've had the pleasure of working with Charlene at some of these markets and believe me, it's interesting and illuminating to hear what people say when they encounter Ubuntu for the first time.
<rrnwexec> Today, Martin Owens is going to teach you how to make quality Ubuntu promotional materials to print and poster your city.
<rrnwexec> By the way, this one is near and dear to my heart as Ubuntu Vancouver has been out on the streets many times postering and flyering the city. And, it works!
<rrnwexec> [SLIDE 5]
<rrnwexec> (see slide 5)
<rrnwexec> When you locate your Ubuntu community, good things can happen. First, you'll have a support network.
<rrnwexec> People that you can meet that can help you out, share tips and tricks, and generally make your Ubuntu experience even better.
<rrnwexec> Secondly, you'll get past that hesitation to recommend Ubuntu to <insert favorite example of a person that doesn't understand free computing here>.
<rrnwexec> When there's no peer support around, people are reluctant to recommend something new as they fear being the perpetual "support person".
<rrnwexec> That constrains Ubuntu's growth. Bad. Very bad.
<rrnwexec> Also, it's fun to hang out with the Ubuntu crowd. When I do, I tend to hear less complaints about computers and more enthusiasm about technology and progress.
<rrnwexec>  Less griping. More fun. Try it.
<rrnwexec> [SLIDE 8]
<rrnwexec> (see slide 8)
<rrnwexec> It really happens!
<rrnwexec> Speaking of growth, at UDS-O in Budapest, Mark Shuttleworth (sabdfl) announced our 4-year goal:
<rrnwexec> 200 million Ubuntu users worldwide.
<rrnwexec> It's lofty but I feel it's achievable if we *all* push hard.
<rrnwexec> We need to set big goals if we want to be big.
<rrnwexec> With 20 million users currently, that means a factor of 10 growth, or an order of magnitude.
<rrnwexec> One of the best ways I know to grow the use of Ubuntu is to grow the community that is exposed to it and thrilled by it.
<rrnwexec> [SLIDE 2]
<rrnwexec> (see slide 2)
<rrnwexec> Word of mouth and social marketing are powerful.
<rrnwexec> So, from a community management perspective we should be thinking in terms of our communities growing ten-fold and having 10 times as many people out spreading the word.
<rrnwexec> This is why I themed a part of UCW "Grow". Growth is good.
<rrnwexec> But what if you're not a community leader/organizer/manager? Is there still a role to play? Absolutely!
<rrnwexec> As an Ubuntu user and advocate you can still help find people,
<rrnwexec> gather them together and identify people that like to lead (and hopefully are good at it.)
<rrnwexec> [SLIDE 3]
<rrnwexec> (see slide 3)
<rrnwexec> This can start very simply.
<rrnwexec> Nathan Haines is going to talk about ways to start simple "Ubuntu Hour" events in your town.
<rrnwexec> (Do you have his card?)
<rrnwexec> ;)
<rrnwexec> Alan Pope is going to talk about podcasting to spread the word about your community.
<rrnwexec> Speaking of podcasting, check out the most recent episode of "Linux Outlaws" to hear an interview about UCW.
<rrnwexec> Also this week, Jono Bacon will share some tips about what you might need to make a community.
<rrnwexec> He's going to teach you how to "Bake a LoCo", which is super-cool, givien the fact that he literally wrote the book.
<rrnwexec>  And a little later, Omar Almahmoud is going to tell you how he started a community in Dubai.
<rrnwexec> It starts with one man's dream :)
<rrnwexec> Once an Ubuntu community has started, the journey begins.
<rrnwexec> How do you get the most from your community?
<rrnwexec> How do you ensure its health?
<rrnwexec> How do you reach out to other groups in your area and work constructively with them?
<rrnwexec> We have sessions for all those!
<rrnwexec> How do you make your community as large as possible?
<rrnwexec> From experience, there are distinct benefits from living in a place that has a vibrant and active local community.
<rrnwexec> [SLIDE 9]
<rrnwexec> (see slide 9)
<rrnwexec> You can even enjoy an Ubuntini with people that live near you!
<rrnwexec> (sorry, couldn't resist.)
<rrnwexec> From time to time though, communities will encounter "bad behaviour" ... :(
<rrnwexec> usually from a lone member or a small group of members.
<rrnwexec>  No community is exempt from this.
<rrnwexec> Later this week, Joseph Liau is going to talk about how to recognize it, what to do when you see it, and how to get beyond it to keep a community healthy.
<rrnwexec> Moving along... How do you assemble a star team of Ubuntu community contributors?
<rrnwexec> Leandro Gomez is going to present (in Spanish) ways to train "ninjas" in your community to keep it vibrant.
<rrnwexec> (if you don't speak Spanish, don't worry... there's Google translate)
<rrnwexec> And, Chris Crisafulli of Ubuntu Florida Fame is going to share his ideas on how to make strong teams.
<rrnwexec> [SLIDE 10]
<rrnwexec>  (see slide 10)
<rrnwexec> Princess Leia (Elizabeth Krumbach) will teach us how to work with other groups in our towns/cities to help one another and make community stronger as a result.
<rrnwexec> (I still can't believe she snagged that domain name. Great job on that.)
<rrnwexec> A short little pause so you can think up some questions
<rrnwexec> If you want to ask a question please type your question in in #ubuntu-classroom-chat as follows:
<rrnwexec> QUESTION: <Your question here (city/town)>
<rrnwexec> (that tells me to pay attention)
<rrnwexec> We're just over half way through this session, and I'm very happy that so many of you have joined us today.
<rrnwexec> I hope this little intro I've presented gives you a glimpse into what's going on this week.
<rrnwexec> Of course there's so much material that I couldn't possibly even begin to summarize it all here.
<rrnwexec> Please tune into all the sessions and check out what all the fuss is all about.
<rrnwexec> Also, please take a look at all the Ubuntu Community Week Collector Cards as they will give you the faces and personalities behind the presentations.
<rrnwexec> You can find them all here: http://randall.executiv.es
<rrnwexec> (It's like Pokemon: Gotta Catch em All)
<rrnwexec> So, before Q+A (which is real soon now)...
<rrnwexec> would anyone like their "Ubuntu Community Week Collector Card" signed?
<rrnwexec> If so, please type: QUESTION: "Please sign for Firstname Lastname" (substituting your names of course) and I'll be happy to sign it here for you ;)
<rrnwexec> Maybe one day you can eBay it :P
<rrnwexec> [SLIDE 12]
<rrnwexec>  (see slide 12)
<rrnwexec> I will now answer all your questions, or try to
<rrnwexec>  Reminder: If you want to ask a question please type
<rrnwexec> QUESTION: "Your question here" in #ubuntu-classroom-chat
<rrnwexec> standing by
<rrnwexec> AlanBell asks: [QUESTION] so what did happen to card #16?
<rrnwexec> thanks Alan. Well, it's out there ;)
<rrnwexec> it's created and will be released into the wild shortly
<rrnwexec> just waiting on a certain rock star to help me do that!
<ClassBot> sipherdee asked: "Please sign for Eric Beaurivage" (Montreal/Canada) <g> - thanks for the UCW!
<rrnwexec> Eric! It is duly signed. Thank you so much for joining us :)
<rrnwexec> It's nice to see my friends from Quebec online.
<ClassBot> Uxthui asked: "Please sign for Uxthui Toxth"
<rrnwexec> Uxthui: what a mysterious name? I wonder where you are from?
<rrnwexec> I'll sign it though :) Thanks for joining!
<rrnwexec> still with me :)
<ClassBot> Uxthui asked: "What kind of events are most likely to attract people unfamiliar with open software? (Dubai)"
<rrnwexec> great question!
<rrnwexec> thanks for telling me you're in Dubai too :)
<rrnwexec> I' will speak from experience. Parties and social events
<rrnwexec> They are less intimidating to those on the other side of the chasm
<rrnwexec> Try to make them fun and inclusive.
<ClassBot> roscoeyvr asked: Are there any plans afoot for Canonical to do any advertising globally with something like "Ubuntu | software worth looking at" aimed at End Users? That would make our job easier if the name was out there.....RoscoeYVR
<ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
<rrnwexec> wow. good question, and maybe not one i can answer from my vantage point, but i'll tell you one thing
<rrnwexec> i've seen a marketing position posted on the Canonical jobs site.
<rrnwexec> so that's a focus.
<rrnwexec> and, from an Ubuntu Vancouver perspective, we have our Marketing Maven trying to rally support and ideas from the community about a good Ubuntu slogan
<rrnwexec> that's Charlene Tessier, presenting in just over 1 hour.
<rrnwexec> so i recommend that you talk to her too during her presentation.
<rrnwexec> Any more questions?
<rrnwexec> and... does anyone else want their card signed ;)
<rrnwexec> We have about 8 minutes to go.
<rrnwexec> Ok, let me put a question out for everone that is listening
<rrnwexec> *everyone
<rrnwexec> How many people are in your Ubuntu community, and where is it (city/town?)
<rrnwexec> You can tell me in #ubuntu-classroom-chat
<ClassBot> nhaines asked: How can I not get my card signed?  ;)  Sign it to Nathan Haines (Los Angeles, California)
<ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
<rrnwexec> hi Nathan! I'll gladly sign your card here
<rrnwexec> (did you see how I just did that?) ;)
<rrnwexec> also, come on up to Vancouver anytime and we can grab an Ubuntini.
<ClassBot> Uxthui asked: "While I can understand why parties and similar social events are less intimidating to the general populace, it is difficult to convey the relation of technology to informal parties."
<rrnwexec> Good point, and that's a benefit.
<rrnwexec> People will come to social events and will have a good time
<rrnwexec> and when they do, the curiousity will grow
<rrnwexec> and the desire to hang out, come back, and be part of something great will grow.
<rrnwexec> Technology will follow.
<rrnwexec> well we're pretty much out of time here. I want to thank everyone again for joining.
<rrnwexec> Please enjoy Ubuntu Community Week!
<rrnwexec> Thanks for all your questions.
<rrnwexec> I'm available by email if you have more.
<rrnwexec> randall (at) executiv [dot] es.
<rrnwexec> Send me a note and say hi.
<rrnwexec> [SLIDE 13]
<rrnwexec> (see slide 13)
<rrnwexec> Bye for now my wonderful Ubuntu friends... See you in meatspace :)
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || Event: Ubuntu Community Week - Current Session: Find Your Local Community - Instructors: alanbell - Slides: http://is.gd/k6Fdeb
<ClassBot> Slides for Find Your Local Community: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuCommunityWeek/oneiric/slides?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=session02.pdf
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/07/18/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
<AlanBell> yay
<AlanBell> good $timeofday everyone
<AlanBell> thanks rrnwexec for the first session and kicking off the event in style
<AlanBell> a tough act to follow, but I will do my best :)
<AlanBell> so we are going to talk about finding LoCo teams
<AlanBell> making this easier is something that has been discussed many times over many years
<AlanBell> at the Ubuntu Developer Summit in May there were a few sessions covering the topic
<AlanBell> the main website we have for all information about LoCo teams is loco.ubuntu.com
<AlanBell> the home page of loco.ubuntu.com http://loco.ubuntu.com shows as it's main feature a map of the world
<AlanBell> and some tweets and other stuff we can come back to
<AlanBell> the idea is you click your continent to help you find your local team
<AlanBell> whichever continent you click on you end up on http://loco.ubuntu.com/teams it just scrolls to roughly the right place
<AlanBell> in Europe there are I think 46 teams
<AlanBell> 50 or so in North America
<AlanBell> some teams are not obvious in their names or where they are sorted
<AlanBell> for example if you live in St Petersburg, you might go looking for a Russia or Russian Federation team without realising there is a St Petersburg LoCo team
<AlanBell> some teams map neatly to a country
<AlanBell> some don't. Some are to a region of a country
<AlanBell> others are non-geographic and focus on a language, wherever speakers might live
<AlanBell> in some places people are members of multiple adjacent LoCo teams depending on the language they speak
<AlanBell>  so countries such as Belgium and Switzerland where there are regions within the country that speak distinct languages people might want to join a more language appropriate team than a locality team
<AlanBell> so it is much much more complex than it initially sounds
<AlanBell> after looking at it in some detail I came to the conclusion that whoever organised the planet did a spectacularly bad job of it
<AlanBell> however we are not here to fix the world, just to make sense of it
<AlanBell> so, there are some proposals to sort this out
<AlanBell> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/loco-contacts/2011-June/005445.html
<AlanBell> this proposal is to rename LoCo teams so that they follow a consistent naming convention based on ISO country codes
<AlanBell> in itself, not a bad idea
<AlanBell> but it doesn't go all the way to make things findable, the ISO country codes are not all that logical and unambiguous
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || Event: Ubuntu Community Week - Current Session: Find Your Local Community - Instructors: AlanBell - Slides: http://is.gd/k6Fdeb
<ClassBot> Slides for Find Your Local Community: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuCommunityWeek/oneiric/slides?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=session02.pdf
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/07/18/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
<AlanBell> the ISO code for the UK is actually "GB", although "UK" is also reserved
<AlanBell> and there are plenty of other oddities in it
<AlanBell> plus the language thing and the not quite perfect mapping of countrys and teams
<AlanBell> onderbakirtas asks: Is it possible to create a LoCo even if there is another one?
<AlanBell> if your LoCo team exists and is a bit dormant, try to contact them in various ways and then take it up with the LoCo council
<AlanBell> who can be found in #ubuntu-locoteams
<ClassBot> skellat asked: If we go to naming communities based on ISO codes, will that result in change elsewhere such as localization packages?
<AlanBell> not really, localisations are different things and based on locale settings such as en_GB
<ClassBot> skellat asked: Further to my previous question, ISO codes typically refer to nation-states and other such entities.  What do we do for LoCo groups at the level below that of the nation-state such as my own state's LoCo here in Ohio?
<AlanBell> that would be ubuntu-us-oh or something, the proposal does allow regional loco teams to be named
<AlanBell> however I don't think it fully solves the problem of findeability
<AlanBell> so I think a naming convention would be a good thing to try to approximately follow
<AlanBell> however the big list of team names is going to be a big list of team names however you cut it
<AlanBell> what I want to do is click the world map, then see a map of Europe, then click the UK and find out about the teams here
<AlanBell> which would be ubuntu-uk, the main approved team, plus ubuntu-cym, which focusses on the welsh translation and events in wales
<AlanBell> the LoCo directory, loco.ubuntu.com is an open source website, and we can contribute improvements to it
<AlanBell> so I did a bit of a proof of concept I would like to show you
<AlanBell> might be a bit slow
<ClassBot> skellat asked: To do a drill-down world map, would it perhaps be necessary to create a hierarchy of descriptors?  If we're going to use ISO codes for the nation-states, entities below that level should build off the main descriptor.  ubuntu-uk would be a United Kingdom-wide descriptor while ubuntu-uk-cym would focus on Wales, perhaps.
<AlanBell> skellat: yes
<AlanBell> http://libertus.co.uk:8000/europe/
<AlanBell> so putting the teams on a map does take a bit of work
<AlanBell> I got a map of europe from wikimedia commons
<AlanBell> the path for the area of each country is tagged with the iso code of the team
<AlanBell> and as it is an svg we can use javascript to highlight it and pop up information about the teams associated with that country
<AlanBell> so with this we can do a hierachical set of maps, and teams can be associated with multiple countries
<AlanBell> and countries can have multiple teams
<AlanBell> so this looks like a workable approach to me
<AlanBell> I think we should have the list of all teams in europe below the map
<AlanBell> and obviously need to do the same for the other continents
<AlanBell> however the map is a bit slow to load as it is rather detailed
<AlanBell> and the awesome doctormo has drawn some other maps http://divajutta.com/doctormo/locomap/usa/locomap-fill.svg
<AlanBell> which look rather nice
<AlanBell> http://divajutta.com/doctormo/locomap/map.svg
<AlanBell> and that is a world map that zooms to continent level
<AlanBell> so at this point I would like to take some feedback
<AlanBell> what do you think of the different maps?
<AlanBell> what information would you like on each country or state when you click on it?
<AlanBell> who wants to help make this work?
<AlanBell> 18:35 < tusuze> having the popup for the state name, website, irc, forums, and wiki is very concise , and it looks nice.
<AlanBell> yeah I like that too, exposing some of the key contact info from the team page right on the map seems useful
 * AlanBell goes to fix the problem
<AlanBell> does http://libertus.co.uk:8000/europe/ work now?
 * AlanBell sees people loading stuff :)
<AlanBell> so that is my version, perhaps not as pretty as the other one
<AlanBell> so http://people.ubuntu.com/~alanbell/Screenshot-Europe%20|%20Ubuntu%20LoCo%20Team%20Directory%20-%20Mozilla%20Firefox.png is a screenshot of it
<AlanBell> I just wanted you to see the difference in appearance
<AlanBell> so what we need is lightweight SVG maps of the continents
<ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
<AlanBell> each broken down into countrys with a sane naming convention or ISO codes as the ID of the shapes
<AlanBell> and we need to do some tweaks to the loco directory data to associate teams with countries better
<AlanBell> HTML5 would be great, do we have maps in such a format?
<AlanBell> SVG is nice because maps exist in it
<AlanBell> yes, countrys could be broken down into regions
<AlanBell> however it might be best not to do that (except for North America)
<AlanBell> just list all the teams that might be relevant to a country in the popup for that country
<AlanBell> SVG is an HTML5 element is it not?
<AlanBell> I don't think the naming convention is that great for associating teams with countries, however the database behind loco.ubuntu.com can easily accomodate such information
<ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
<AlanBell> so we are heading towards the end of this session now
<AlanBell> the general principal is that we want to make it easy for someone who does not already know the name of their local team to find it
<AlanBell> and I think the way to do that is with maps to country level
<AlanBell> I have done a working prototype, and there are some prettier map concepts
<AlanBell> we can discuss further in #ubuntu-locoteams and #ubuntu-website
<AlanBell> if anyone wants to get the loco directory up and running locally we can help you do that
<AlanBell> and what we really want is a set of maps
<AlanBell> the workgroup involved is the loco council and the loco contacts really
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || Event: Ubuntu Community Week - Current Session: Organic Software: Marketing Ubuntu At Your Local Farmer's Market - Instructors: cmmtessier - Slides: http://is.gd/egnNvm
<AlanBell> o/
<ClassBot> Slides for Organic Software: Marketing Ubuntu At Your Local Farmer's Market: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuCommunityWeek/oneiric/slides?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=session03.pdf
<AlanBell> thanks everyone
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/07/18/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
<cmmtessier> Hello Everyone
<cmmtessier> Just to let you know this is my first time doing this so let me know if I go off the track
<cmmtessier> I do have slides unfortunately due to time constraints I didn't get a chance to upload them. I will post them to the planet later today though.
<cmmtessier> So I guess I just begin
<cmmtessier> This talk is about Marketing to your Local Festivals and Markets
<cmmtessier> not solely farmer's markets - I should have changed that.
<cmmtessier> Grow Your Community with Diversity
<cmmtessier>     Marketing Materials that Fit
<cmmtessier>     Feet on the Street
<cmmtessier>     Cost of Marketing
<cmmtessier>     Be Consistent
<cmmtessier>     Measuring Your Success
<cmmtessier>     A Supportive Home
<cmmtessier>     Start Now
<cmmtessier> I'm going to very quickly cover these topics - questions are welcome at the end
<cmmtessier> Grow Your Community with Diversity
<cmmtessier> Many people think that when we are doing marketing our goal is to find people already using ubuntu
<cmmtessier> as we know the OS market share ubuntu holds is about 1%
<cmmtessier> When I'm thinking about marketing I'm looking at that 99%
<cmmtessier> the ones not using Ubuntu
<cmmtessier> And so the first places we avoid marketing are tech based events/conferences
<cmmtessier> At these events we are merely hitting that 1%
<cmmtessier> So where can you find and market to that other 99%
<cmmtessier> The best place to start is to grab as your local newspaper, listen to local radio, look for adverts for local festivals.
<cmmtessier> Every city/town has them you may have already attended them in the past.
<cmmtessier> Select ones that would attract a diverse crowd- examples in Vancouver
<cmmtessier> Car Free Day, Greek Day, Free outdoor summer concert series, folk fest, and farmer's markets
<cmmtessier> Before you hit the streets you will need a common marketing message and marketing material
<cmmtessier> For example we give out small business card size info with a catch phrase like: Technology driving you crazy? Take Back Control - website to your local community
<cmmtessier> simple non- technical easy to understand messages work best. Remember you will be speaking to people who's first question is going to be What is ubuntu?
<cmmtessier> Trying to explain that in one concise sentence is a challenge but if you can then the next step would be to get them join the your local community where you can provide more support, education, help etc.
<cmmtessier> Feet on the Street
<cmmtessier> The only way to market - increase your local is to get physical people out on the street.
<cmmtessier> When we hit a festival/market our #1 goal is to talk to and hand out  as much information as possible
<cmmtessier> Not to get into long and lengthy conversations. Why? because generally those that are engaging you in a lengthy conversation probably won't join and most likely will eat up your time if not be frustrating to talk to.
<cmmtessier> An example.
<cmmtessier> In June we went to hit Car free day
<cmmtessier> we started at about 2pm and finished at about 6pm
<cmmtessier> In that 4 hrs we gave out about 250-300 info cards
<cmmtessier> and probably spoke to close to 400 people
<cmmtessier> Oh I forgot to mention this in Marketing Materials - if you are able to get a banner even better - it draws a lot of attention and its great for opening conversations with people
<cmmtessier> Now I have classified 3 types of people to watch out for when marketing
<cmmtessier> The first is called: I'm using that
<cmmtessier> ok that's great but why are we here on the street?
<cmmtessier> On of the things we don't do is give out disks or even information besides the website during marketing
<cmmtessier> why?
<cmmtessier> because we are not here promoting on the software  we are here to promote the community.
<cmmtessier> huge difference - if it was only about the software then I wouldn't bother directing you to a website and I would just hand out free disks.
<cmmtessier> So if that person says I'm using it - then say to them that's wonderful - did you know there is a community behind it and you are welcome to join it.
<cmmtessier> The person we either A) be surprised and very pleasant about it  - taking the information or
<cmmtessier> B) sarcastic possibly even rude with comments - if so - my rule is smother them with kindness - Say to them well have a nice day hope to see you again soon. Don't argue or confront them this is not your target market
<cmmtessier> The second type of person is called the Talker, talker, talker
<cmmtessier> This is the person who merely wants to get into a lengthy conversation with you and really has no interest in what you are marketing. Make up every excuse to end the conversation. Say you are busy, say you really don't know anything, keep redirecting to the website. If all else fails say you need to use the bathroom and walk off for a while. Don't waste your time-
<cmmtessier> The third type of person is called the Hater
<cmmtessier> I have not met very many but they are out there - they are very loyal to their windows or mac and will try to get in a comparison arguing match with you. Again smother them with kindness - and say that's wonderful that works so well for you. I guess this just isn't for you. Have a nice day and if necessary treat them like a type 2 talker to end the conversation.
<cmmtessier> Cost of Marketing
<cmmtessier> Ok everyone knows marketing can be very expensive and time consuming and not very rewarding if you target the wrong place.
<cmmtessier> First off community festivals are generally held in public space and there for you can go do there and hand out market material its freedom of speech.
<cmmtessier> If the festival is fenced off or requires entrance fees then you probably just can't show up and start marketing.
<cmmtessier> Contact the festivals and farmer's markets in advance - be sure to tell them you are a non-profit orgs
<cmmtessier> generally they are more than happy to offer free or extremely low cost tables during the event.
<cmmtessier> Business card size marketing material - get more bang for your buck
<cmmtessier> don't make or give our large marketing material it will generally be wasted - in addition I go with the rule to not just give the material if the person says no or doesn't want it - don't give it.
<cmmtessier> Be Consistent
<cmmtessier> This is a challenge and one the more important points
<cmmtessier> if you do nothing else -
<cmmtessier> make a few easy to say and remember marketing messages - have people saying the same message.
<cmmtessier> Once you start to allow everyone to explain it their own way they may explain in a way that is either A) overly technical B) mis-informative C) confusing.
<cmmtessier> Generally we have found that if you can find people that our out going, smile and have the least amount of technical background they will be able to connect more with those at markets and festivals.
<cmmtessier> Measure Your Success
<cmmtessier> It great to give out and tonnes of info but if they aren't turning into new members in your local then maybe you'll need to look at your strategy.
<cmmtessier> We use our website as a means to measure our success - seeing if the hits to the homepage increased shortly after the marketing
<cmmtessier> We also have a questionnaire that you fill out upon joining and it asks where you found out about UVLC and that will generally indicate if the marketing we did was a success or not
<cmmtessier> A Supportive Home
<cmmtessier> the initial contact at the market or festival is only that - initial
<cmmtessier> Once a new member has joined, reach out to that member - ask them why they joined. What do they need help with. Nurture the new member. Its very likely this person will not be running Ubuntu and so they will have alot of questions.
<cmmtessier> If you are able to provide them with a guide or a presentation to answer these questions that would be great.
<cmmtessier> And of course the last step is to take action! Feet on the Street!
<cmmtessier> I'm now open to any questions you may have.
<cmmtessier> No questions?
<cmmtessier> ok - and as stated I will have a slide show that will summarize the entire presentation given here today.
<cmmtessier> sorry first time using this class bot
<ClassBot> tusuze asked: Street marketing is fun, but are there any guidelines in setting up presentations?
<ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
<cmmtessier> ok for the presentations
<cmmtessier> that's more of another talk-
<cmmtessier> however we have a created a Ubuntu Vancouver User's Guide
<cmmtessier> And this guide essentially answers many common questions that a new member would ask- from this we have built a condensed presentation based on the guide
<cmmtessier> If you like I can post the our guide to my blog as well later and you can check it out.
<ClassBot> tusuze asked: If we wanted to present how to install an extra hard drive & dual boot a windows box with Ubuntu, is there some sort of protocol we need for permission?
<cmmtessier> ok this isn't really question for this talk - I'm only talking about street marketing and how to capture 99% of the market place. This would be a specific talk that your local community would set up.
<ClassBot> tusuze asked: If we wanted to get disks to hand out at this presentation, and get swag too (like lanyards) who do we talk to?  I don't have a loco...
<cmmtessier> I not the community manger for Vancouver- Randall Ross manages it- so I don't know who is contact is.
<ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
<cmmtessier> Randall is the organizer for community week so maybe it would be best to contact him for that info
<ClassBot> tusuze asked: If I had a plan to add 200 extra members per session that I give, who do I talk to about getting the swag & the discs?
<cmmtessier> wow- 200 members
<cmmtessier> that's very optimistic. Just to let  you know that day we gave out 250+ info we only got 5 new members
<cmmtessier> and from those 5 new members to get them to come to new comers night we may get 1
<cmmtessier> discs are great- but remember what is your goal
<cmmtessier> its to build a support community- so focus on  building that- if you give out cd's without info or support you won't have a local
<cmmtessier> you'll have a lot of people coming to get disc but not contributing.
<cmmtessier> its a fine line and we do give out cds at all our local events however- it always comes with information and a conversation from a local member.
<cmmtessier> looks like we are out of time nearly
<cmmtessier> if there are more questions- send me an email through my blog and I'll be happy to help
<cmmtessier> Happy Summer Marketing Everyone!
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || Event: Ubuntu Community Week - Current Session: From Graphic to Printed Poster - Instructors: doctormo - Slides: http://is.gd/fOf70z
<ClassBot> Slides for From Graphic to Printed Poster: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuCommunityWeek/oneiric/slides?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=session04.pdf
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/07/18/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
<doctormo> Welcome
<doctormo> My name is Martin Owens and I'm going to take you round a lot of the practical know how that i've picked up doing production work and getting prints done at high quality.
<doctormo> There isn't a presentation, so no graphics. This is going to be a strait talk of all the points and then we'll do questions.
<doctormo> Can I have a show of hands from all my listeners out there using irc or lernid?
<doctormo> So consider for a moment production.
<doctormo> Production is a job which is often overlooked when we want to make quality media prints. It's not the creative part, but the other administrative part.
<doctormo> You need to make sure you're using the right tools, that you have good workflows that get you to a happy result.
<doctormo> And understanding how to source and how to export data in the right formats, with the right filters to make your printer (business or machine) happy too.
<doctormo> The first part to really get your head around is file formats
<doctormo> This is important when doing printing because the file format of your source media will impact directly on what you are able to export to and how you're able to edit the media later on.
<doctormo> For example, using jpeg files in your posters is ok, but your dealing with a raster image. A raster image is an image which is made up of indervidual dots.
<doctormo> You can load and edit a raster image in gimp and it can print quite well, but it must have a very good resolution for it's print size.
<doctormo> For instance 300dpi (dots per inch) would require your image to be 3,000px by 4,500px aprox to print on a small A4 sheet.
<doctormo> Most jpeg photos you find online are not going to be available in those sorts of sizes.
<doctormo> Worse for jpeg, it's a lossy format, which means that the compression used distorts the image.
<doctormo> If you are going to use raster images, stick to PNG and TIFF files which have lossless compression and won't distort.
<doctormo> The same rules about resolution applies for png and tiff files too.
<doctormo> You can take a number of png files and import them into gimp and make artworks which are printable. But you will need a LOT of ram for the high resolutions and it is not recommended for serious quality.
<doctormo> Instead we want to use vector formats for our designs.
<doctormo> Vector formats are svg and scribus files. These instead of saving each pixel dot, save the mathamtics which describe how all the shapes are drawn and filled.
<doctormo> These formats take a fraction of the space of raster formats for printing and best of all have no dpi, they are resolution indipendant and can be printed at any resolution.
<doctormo> But just because you make your poster in Inkscape or Scribus doesn't mean you can't include photographs which will be raster images.
<doctormo> Embedding these images in your work, you have to be aware of the physical size of the image as it will appear in the final print and make sure that this slice of the page will have enough dots inside the photograph to print at a good resolution.
<doctormo> Say for example if we have a A4 page and a 10cm x 10cm photograph.
<doctormo> We don't need 3k by 4.5k photos, we need much less, only 300px by 300px will do the trick.
<doctormo> OK, so you know how to make your poster in your vector editor of choice and you've made something awesome. Embeded a few photos and have worked out that everything will export at the right resolution.
<doctormo> Now comes the white elephant! the scary notion of colour correction.
<doctormo> Colour correction is the process of modifying the colours your screen, printer, camera or scanner show or import to make sure they are true reprisentations of what the colour really should be.
<doctormo> Every single device is inaccurate to some degree, and normally you won't know by how much.
<doctormo> My own screen has a weird blue tint that used to make a lot of my designs more red and yellow than they appeared on my screen.
<doctormo> It also made a lot of my works darker than they should have been.
<doctormo> There is an excellent technical article on how to achieve this in the ubuntu wiki, but I will explain generally what you need to do.
<doctormo> For screens, you need to use a screen profiling device which plugs in via usb, it calibrates the screen and generates an icc file. You then import this icc profile into Xorg (using the gui tools provided) and you'll see magically your screen change and become more realistic.
<doctormo> The devices can cost $120 or so, so perhaps you'll want to borrow one.
<doctormo> Scanners require a sheet which shows a set of standard colours, you scan it in and use a program which understands the standard colours to generate an icc profile.
<doctormo> You then use that with the device, which makes sure all future scans are right.
<doctormo> Once you have a calibrated scanner, you can print out a sheet on your printer and scan it in.
<doctormo> You can use another program to generate an icc profile for your printer from the scan to correct the printer.
<doctormo> You only can do that with a colour corrected scanner though.
<doctormo> All these devices should be colour corrected if you want to produce nice prints.
<doctormo> OK, now you know how it works, it shouldn't be so scary!
<doctormo> It's just a matter of how much effort you want to put into the job of making your computer an excellent tool for making prints.
<doctormo> Now we have our lovely colour corrected poster, we should consider exporting to a nice format to make our printer happy.
<doctormo> a lot of printers accept ai (adobe Illustrator) files, very few of them accept svg files (although I find it silly that they don't)
<doctormo> Most printers will however accept postscript (.ps) and pdfs, since we can't make ai files.
<doctormo> The problem we have with pdf is that our free software programs are not 100% reliable at making them.
<doctormo> If your poster contains gradients, semi transparencies and especially if it contains raster filters, then you'll need to export to a raster format first.
<doctormo> If not, then you should export to ps or pdf to keep the size down and improve printing quality.
<doctormo> If you find yourself with a complex poster, then you should export to PNG at at least 300dpi. Make sure you export the page and not the drawing.
<doctormo> Make sure your page size configured is actually the size you want to print. It's no good exporting at 300dpi an A4 sheet only to ask the printer to print it at A2, you might as well be handing in a 75dpi image.
<doctormo> Now for posters you're getting done at a print shop, you're going to have the option of printing all the way to the edge.
<doctormo> If this is required then the printer will ask you to include a bleed. This is an area of colour over the poster designed page size which the printer uses incase the rollers misalign slightly and prevents white lines appearing at the edges.
<doctormo> In this case, you should keep your page size correct, extend the design to the required bleed size and then export the drawing at 300dpi instead of the page.
<doctormo> Scribus actually has a way to handle this all for you so you should just be able to configure it in when you make your document.
<doctormo> If you get a professional print done and you're getting lots of copies. They'll want to make sure you get a proof.
<doctormo> These proofs are not an opportunity to change the design or art but a way for you to check the colour balance, the positioning of the design on the page and how the whole thing looks.
<doctormo> You can correct and if your order is big enough, request more proofs to make sure you get it right.
<doctormo> You can even use the proofs to develop an icc profile (if you're fancy like that) to atomatically correct your drawing for the printer. Although most printers will have good calibration already.
<doctormo> The printer will be entering into the relationship with a set of expectations.
<doctormo> He'll expect you're using a Mac or at least windows, they'll expect you're using Adobe software. We want to break these expectations softly.
<doctormo> We let them know directly what formats we're able to give them and we ask for templates or details in formats we can understand.
<doctormo> Lets assume that everything goes well. You should have the printer sending the prints to you though the mail.
<doctormo> Standard delicate transportation rules apply. Make sure they have boxes which fit the page size, make sure you get it shipped directly to where they're going to be used (if possible) paper can get heavy when you've just got 6,000 prints.
<doctormo> If you need to reuse prints (posters, flyers, etc) then make sure to keep the packaging around, store the prints in fitting boxes or if you don't have many of them, poster tubes are quite safe.
<doctormo> There's nothing like a ragged poster at an event to really make Ubuntu seem like the dogs ear was it's breakfast.
<doctormo> OK, that concludes the information dump, I'm opening up for questions.
<doctormo> I should add: part of the process of getting things printed is selecting the right paper. The paper thickness, texture and colour can reflect a great deal on the quality of the final print.
<doctormo> This can even go so far as selecting the right material for a banner design. Most LoCo teams will get a vinel banner from Canonical, but some will still opt for making their own. Choosing between flexible and solid sign materials can mean a lot. I recommend a good white laminate vinal banner.
<ClassBot> tusuze asked: Do you have issues with printing on non-standard sizes with Linux-based programs?
<doctormo> Great question tusuze
<doctormo> Non-standard sizes are not so much an issue as mis-matched sizes.
<doctormo> Your image size should match the page size exactly, and when printing be aware that most printers add on their own margins and attempt to resize your image to fit inside those.
<doctormo> Most home printers can not print edgeless.
<doctormo> But I've never had a problem with printing odd sizes (and even shapes) so long as the printer settings have the new size correctly added in the custom sizes section and you make sure to eliminate or account for printer margins.
<ClassBot> tusuze asked: So just add the size of the page and the printer margins, then add these as a custom page definition in the printer?
<ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
<doctormo> tusuze: Yes, so your printer driver should be configured with the correct sizes of the margins of the printer, although you can remove the margins and account for them in your designs instead. It depends if you want the printer to protect you and resize your image (potential distortions) or DIY with the margins in inkscape/scribus.
<doctormo> Any more questions before the session ends
<doctormo> deuxpi said "In my experience, asking what the print shop needs (size, resolution, formats) at the beginning of the project"
<doctormo> When dealing with a printer there will be a dialog. You'll be the one to request a certain size and specify what kind of resolution. The printer will come back and specify what sizes they can do, what resolutions they need and what formats they can accept.
<ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
<doctormo> OK before we go, hands up everyone who listened in and enjoyed my rambles!
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/07/18/%23ubuntu-classroom.html
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat ||
<ubuntupower> did i miss it?
<EgyParadox> I think the instructor just left
<Spadassin> hi all
<S1l3nz> Hi
<S1l3nz> Searching for a Community near Kiel
<naveen> hi room
<nhaines> hi naveen
<naveen> how r u
<naveen> ?
<nhaines> naveen: doing well, thanks.  Preparing for my session tomorrow.  :)  How are you?
<naveen> just complete exam's on 14th july looking for new stuff for learning
<nhaines> Congrats!
<naveen> thanks
<naveen> u from dear friend
<nhaines> This channel is used for prescheduled sessions.  Right now the first day of Ubuntu Community Week has finished, but there will be more sessions this week.
<nhaines> You an find a list of sessions here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuCommunityWeek
<naveen> yeah i checked it
<naveen> http://www.naveensheoran.webs.com/
<nhaines> Nice tractor.  :)
<naveen> thanks
<naveen> i am learning java so tried some stuff
<naveen> to write on one blog
<naveen> ok bye room
<naveen> it's time to sleep
<naveen> take care every body
<naveen> 4 o'clock in the morning ehere
<naveen> here *
<naveen> bye
<tc_> anyone there?
#ubuntu-classroom 2011-07-19
<davinmei> hai all
<fyrfaktry> o/
<orion_> hi
<JeThroHD> well how can I help out?
<desgua> Am I logged?
<aneesh1> Hi all
<G0B1IN5486> Hi!
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || Event: Ubuntu Community Week - Current Session: How I Started an Ubuntu Group in My City and How You Could Too - Instructors: the-technopreneu - Slides: http://is.gd/lizd5u
<ClassBot> Slides for How I Started an Ubuntu Group in My City and How You Could Too: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuCommunityWeek/oneiric/slides?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=session05.pdf
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/07/19/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
<the-technopreneu> Hi everybody and thanks for attending the session!
<the-technopreneu> I will be talking about How I started an Ubuntu community in Dubai and I will walk you through some of the tools and methods I used
<the-technopreneu> [SLIDE 1]
<the-technopreneu> [SLIDE 2] So for today I have a couple of points to cover
<the-technopreneu> How it all started - Get Organized - Tools for you - Online Message Board - Practical Application - Presenting Ubuntu - Community Management
<the-technopreneu> Most these points are for those who are planning to start their own communities or for communities that have alread started and would like to learn from best practices
<the-technopreneu> Well before that a brief overview of myself and Ubuntu
<the-technopreneu> Back in early 2010 I was introduced to Randall Ross "Buzz Generator" over a conference call between Dubai and Vancouver
<the-technopreneu> He explained what Ubuntu is and the community part of it
<the-technopreneu> He shared with me a presentation on Ubuntu and showcased some of the activities were
<the-technopreneu> that were taking place in Vancouver, as for me it was another tech concept to learn about and didnt really get my attention
<the-technopreneu> [SLIDE 3]
<the-technopreneu> It was till about a couple months later is when I saw Ubuntu in action when I was organizing a tech seminar and one of the speakers John Wacklawsky Chief Information Officer at Motorolla was running his slides and notes of an Ubuntu PC
<the-technopreneu> I was flabbergasted with the speed in which he fliped his PC on and started presenting
<the-technopreneu> Thats when I started asking and gave Ubuntu a go the same day back at home.
<the-technopreneu> Ever since then I thought that this is too good to be true and too bad I didnt know about this great OS
<the-technopreneu> So I took one a personal oath to get every one to use Ubuntu and start a community
<the-technopreneu> With that said
<the-technopreneu> I moved quickly to start a local community with another Open Source advocate
<the-technopreneu> I suggested an easy tool without knowing much about community setup or even governance
<the-technopreneu> [SLIDE 4]
<the-technopreneu> we used meetup.com to put together an interface for the community quick and easy
<the-technopreneu> Customized to look Ubuntu-ish
<the-technopreneu> and put all the necessary info about what Ubuntu is in general
<the-technopreneu> All the tools are there to set up your community instantly and makes the job of managing events and organizing members very very easy
<the-technopreneu> Its being used by other Linux groups in addition to the Vancouver Local community
<the-technopreneu> Here's a snapshot of what our website looks like [SLIDE 5]
<the-technopreneu> those who dont have the slides visit www.meetup.com/emiratesloco
<the-technopreneu> to have an idea of how the local community looks like
<the-technopreneu> As a community manager there various tools to manage for example
<the-technopreneu> You can schedule one off or periodic events for your group
<the-technopreneu> [SLIDE 6]
<the-technopreneu> Show the venue location with a builtin Google Maps API
<the-technopreneu> Manage attendees with RSVP settings to know how much Pizza to buy ^.^
<the-technopreneu> You get many other tools such as Sponsor management tools for event sponsors, you can show case there logos online , there is a tool to manage that.
<the-technopreneu> Also as a community owner you can of course create custom pages
<the-technopreneu> The meetup.com tool also has a polling tool for memebers to cast votes on a certain topic plus you get a community message board
<the-technopreneu> The community message boards creates an online buzz in addition to other tools to integerate with Linkedin, Facebook and Twitter.
<the-technopreneu> [SLIDE 7]
<the-technopreneu> moving on to slide [SLIDE 8]
<the-technopreneu> A practical example of what we manage to put together using the meetup.com in person and online
<the-technopreneu> was the United Arab Emirates' first InstallFest
<the-technopreneu> you can see the event's page here http://www.meetup.com/EmiratesLoCo/events/15940104/
<the-technopreneu> The planning took place in person and some discussions were held online, sponsors and partners were also involved online, namely the IEEE chapter at the university where we held it.
<the-technopreneu> For a small community it was a great achievement were 100s of students came by to the event and were exposed to the first time to Ubuntu
<the-technopreneu> Some asked us to install Ubuntu on their PCs almost immediately from seeing it and giving it a go on a demo PC
<the-technopreneu> have a look at the photos
<the-technopreneu> [SLIDE 9]
<the-technopreneu> and
<the-technopreneu> [SLIDE 10]
<the-technopreneu> Before moving on to another topic
<the-technopreneu> Meetup.com is not a replacement of the official structure of a Loco community website but a community management tool that you can use to kick-start one
<the-technopreneu> there were suggestions to have multiple websites for the community such as Facebook, Linkedin, Twitter, official etc.
<the-technopreneu> but you're just starting believe me you dont need them.
<the-technopreneu> If members do bring this up, the easiest way to reach a conviencing conclusion to a matter is to ask the "What problem are you trying  to solve?"
<the-technopreneu> Alright so moving on
<the-technopreneu> [SLIDE 11]
<the-technopreneu> When presenting Ubuntu to an audience, a black stage and a turtle neck might make you look good but there is a tool out there which will sure will
<the-technopreneu> Prezi
<the-technopreneu> The zooming Presetation tool its a great tool to show case Ubuntu
<the-technopreneu> It will make your dull static slides come alive.
<the-technopreneu> I know I am not using it here but I usually present Ubuntu using it theatrically
<the-technopreneu> Here's a prezi I put together
<the-technopreneu> [SLIDE 12]
<the-technopreneu> It shows you the bigger picture and you can zoom in on the details to emphasis a point at a click of a button
<the-technopreneu> You can see my prezin online here http://prezi.com/80mhgs_kxczb/ubuntu-overview/
<the-technopreneu> Moving on
<the-technopreneu> A couple points about community management [SLIDE 13]
<the-technopreneu> This might be the hardest part about setting about a community because this depends on you as person.
<the-technopreneu> First of all you've got to know that in any community relationships matter and not just any relationships personal ones especially
<the-technopreneu> Running a community you've got have passion not jus for technology but for the soft side the human skills side of it
<ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
<the-technopreneu> A community is a place of learning, socializing and sharing.
<the-technopreneu> A place to meet cool and smart people in tech just like you guys
<the-technopreneu> Its not run by a corporation with a salesy pitch , there is a finer thing about Ubuntu communites is that they are run by volunteers with the spirit of Ubuntu in them
<the-technopreneu> As an organizer
<the-technopreneu> you're going to be the center of attention so be nice
<the-technopreneu> be friendly and welcoming and be someone that other people want to be around
<the-technopreneu> Be respectful and constructive
<the-technopreneu> Communites are made up of people of all walks of life so they're not going to agree all the time.
<ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
<the-technopreneu> Be colloaborative, work together we learn a whole lot from Peer-to-Peer mentorship
<the-technopreneu> Also as a community leader try Delegate [SLIDE 14]
<the-technopreneu> sometimes we as leaders are too afraid to let go
<the-technopreneu> but thats alright
<the-technopreneu> no one's perfect nor are you
<the-technopreneu> so to get people to show there best is to get the involved just be asking
<the-technopreneu> This will lead to more people being involved in community building
<the-technopreneu> The more people the more sustainable and this will prevent burn out as you as single individual.
<the-technopreneu> I think I will wrap up time is almost up.
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || Event: Ubuntu Community Week - Current Session: Starting an Ubuntu Hour Near You - Instructors: nhaines - Slides: http://is.gd/BP8AXP
<ClassBot> Slides for Starting an Ubuntu Hour Near You: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuCommunityWeek/oneiric/slides?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=session06.pdf
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/07/19/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
<nhaines> Hello everyone!  I'm Nathan Haines and today I'm going to talk about Ubuntu Hour, and how you can start your own event and make it successful.  You can read more about Ubuntu Hour and get a list of active hours here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Hour
<nhaines> I don't actually have slides for this session, so the URL above must've been some placeholder in the pious hope that I might make some.  :)
<nhaines> I've put together and run a lot of events, from booths and presentations at shows and expos to Ubuntu Global Jams, to smaller get-togethers, so I have some experience with events of all sizes.  Today we'll talk about a simple event that anyone can start up.
<nhaines> You don't have to be an expert in Ubuntu or computers to host an Ubuntu Hour, and you don't have to be an expert in running events either.  You just have to really like Ubuntu and want to meet others that share this interest.
<nhaines> I can't wait to answer your questions throughout this session.  If you /join #ubuntu-classroom-chat, then you can post your questions there.  Be sure that "QUESTION: " is the first thing you type when asking.
<nhaines> I'm often asked, "What exactly is Ubuntu Hour?"  This is a good question.  The wiki page is pretty vague about this, and that's because Ubuntu Hour can be something different for every group.  As I give advice today I encourage you to think about what will work best in your locality and make the best Ubuntu Hour you possibly can!
<nhaines> I'd say that Ubuntu Hour is a method to get together with local Ubuntu users on a regular basis.  There are a lot of great groups out there that do this.  Linux User Groups (LUGs) and computer clubs, as well as expos and other shows.  But they can be more organized and intimidating for newcomers.
<nhaines> Ubuntu Hour is a hour-long meeting that anyone can drop in on.  When you think about it, an hour isn't a huge time commitment.  If you're curious about something, an hour seems like a good investment.
<nhaines> I love my local Linux User Group, but their meetings last for four hours.  Of course, on Saturdays I like to sleep in so I often come late and everyone can come and go as they please.  It's perfect for having free time and presentations too!  But when I was first curious about joining, it seemed like a big commitment.
<nhaines> So the reason Ubuntu Hour is only an hour long is to make things easy and simple.  And Ubuntu Hours work best when they're kept simple.
<nhaines> Let's talk about Ubuntu Hour Lake Forest.  It's one of the very first Ubuntu Hours to start up and I've been running it for about a year now.  It takes place every two weeks on a Thursday evening.  We meet in a bakery-cafe chain restaurant called Panera Bread, that serve slightly over-priced but tasty sandwiches, soups, baked goods, and drinks.  They offer free wifi Internet access and welcome groups.
<nhaines> We meet at 18:00 which is about an hour after the typical work day ends and is also enough time that I can usually make it there even if I have to keep working a few minutes late or if traffic is really bad getting there from my office building.
<nhaines> Every week I get to meet people who want to thank me for Ubuntu, people who like computers are want to talk about Ubuntu news, people who want to discuss whether or not Unity is the end of computing, and people who need help with their computers or have questions about Ubuntu.
<nhaines> I never know how many people are going to show up and at any Ubuntu Hour meeting there are usually 2 â 4 others who show up.  Occasionally no one shows up, but I stay for the entire hour anyway.
<nhaines> So that's our example Ubuntu Hour experience.  Let's break it down and talk about how everything comes together and what you'll need to decide if you want to start your own Ubuntu Hour.
<nhaines> The secret to any successful event is planning and research.  No one wants to hear that but it's true.  ;)  Fortunately it's not hard at all!  The very first thing you should do is check to see if there are any Ubuntu Hours near you.  If there are, you may want to join them, even if it's just to get an idea of what Ubuntu Hour is like.  You should also look for Linux User Group or other special interest meetings that are related.  Sometime
<nhaines> If you still want to run your own, make sure your events don't conflict with the existing ones.  If possible, try to make your Ubuntu Hours compliment the existing ones, by being in a more accessible location or at a time that might be more convenient for some.  Remember that providing more choices for people helps everyone!
<nhaines> Once you know what events are around you and where, it's time to find a venue.  There are a few places to consider.
<nhaines> These are just some examples to get you started, but feel free to be creative when planning your events.
<nhaines> The easiest thing to do is to find a coffee shop or cafe that isn't too busy.  They often have free wifi and are used to small groups of people coming in and hanging out.  If you are considerate about not using too much space and buy food or drinks from them, they will probably welcome you.  These locations are good for all ages.
<nhaines> College or university campuses sometimes offer rooms to the public and you can check with the Computer Science department to see if they can host an Ubuntu Hour.  Internet access can be tricky at these places, too, so you'll want to discuss that.
<nhaines> Local businesses will sometimes host events and especially small IT or Internet service providers can be eager to give back to the community in this way.  Make sure that you discuss and respect any security issues with physical or Internet access there.
<nhaines> No matter where you host your first Ubuntu Hour, you'll want to choose a place that's easy to get to.  I chose a location right off the freeway, and if the 5 Freeway is a pain to drive around 17:00 and 18:00 when the meeting starts, at least it's a lot nicer at 19:00 when the meeting ends.  :)
<nhaines> The other thing that is closely related is your schedule.  You'll want to choose a time that makes sense for the people you are trying to attract.  In Irvine, California and the surrounding communities, work shifts are often from 8:00 to 17:00.  This means that if I host an Ubuntu Hour at 17:00 right next to my office, no one is going to show up until at least 17:30 and I'll be late a lot.
<nhaines> I chose 18:00 because that gives people a chance to arrive (including me).  And a lot of people don't make it until 18:45!  Some of them are driving from further away and I really appreciate that they still make the journey.
<nhaines> In addition to a time, you'll also need a date.  When I first started, I had no idea what would work.  I made some announcements on the local LoCo and LUG mailing lists and said that I'd be there each Thursday for all of June 2010 and July 2011, and then I'd decide on a permanent schedule.  I felt that monthly was too seldom and biweekly was too hard to advertise.  So I thought weekly would be the easiest for others to remember and then I 
<nhaines> After two months, I changed the schedule to biweekly, or every other week.  I didn't want to spam the LUG mailing list with weekly reminders and also giving up that much free time every week was slowly driving me crazy.  :)  With every announcement I announce the next two meeting dates to help people prepare for that.  You can see a recent announcement here: http://nhaines.livejournal.com/61453.html
<nhaines> I actually don't recommend "every other week" or "every second Monday" or anything that would require someone to look at a calendar.  The simplest schedules are the easiest, but as long as you are very consistent and very clear, you can make it work.
<nhaines> So after all that, you'll need some visitors.  Ubuntu Hours are very informal.  They're not like clubs where there are members, but more like informal gatherings where newcomers and passersby are welcome.  This creates small challenges but is well worth it.
<nhaines> For one thing, they're hard to describe.  What do you do at an Ubuntu Hour?  Well, mainly you just hang out and get to know one another.  But that's not so catchy on a flier.  :)
<nhaines> You'll need to advertise.  Find some local user groups and ask if you can post announcements on their lists.  Make up little fliers and post them on community boards at coffee shops and universities or colleges.  Here's an example flier I started working on.  Feel free to customize it for your own event: http://ubuntuone.com/p/AtJ/
<nhaines> Post on Craigslist if that's big where you are, and check out places like Meetup.com.  Use your blog or personal Web site to post details so that it's easy for others to have all the details on one page they can print or bookmark.
<nhaines> Make it clear that this is a group of Ubuntu users getting together to chat, ask questions, and hang out.  Make it sound fun.
<nhaines> After all, once everyone's together it *will* be fun.  :)  So get everyone in the mood beforehand.
<nhaines> Don't forget to use the official resources!  Once you get started, add yourself to the wiki page at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Hour.
<nhaines> Once you have the word out, all you have to do is show up for an hour.  It'll probably be slow at first, with one or two people showing up and sometimes no one will show up.  That's okay and every group starts out this way.  Eventually word will spread and people will have time to make it.
<nhaines> Wear an Ubuntu shirt or hat if you can, or put up a small sign.  I like to wear an Ubuntu shirt and hang my Ubuntu backpack on a chair.  If you have a computer to bring, then running Ubuntu on it is an obvious choice as well.  I keep the default background on my computer because the purple is very distinctive.
<nhaines> Eventually people will start showing up.  Some will be experienced Ubuntu users and some will be novices.  Others will want to learn more about Ubuntu, and occasionally someone will just be curious about who are this happy group of people discussing computers.  :)  Eventually you may get a group like this: http://people.ubuntu.com/~nhaines/images/events/2010/uh-lakeforest/group-20100923.jpg
<nhaines> You want to encourage discussion and asking of questions, no matter how simple they might seem.  But you'll also want to keep things civil as well.  You'll be representing the Ubuntu community while you're there.  I think the Ubuntu Code of Conduct is a great guideline and I link to it in my announcements.  http://www.ubuntu.com/community/conduct
<nhaines> The better your group are at being civil and being good guests at your location, the better it reflects on you and Ubuntu as well.  That means clean up any trash, don't leave food or wrappers behind, and push in the chairs when you leave.  ;)
<nhaines> We get a lot of regulars dropping in as well as one-timers.  Everyone is very friendly and inviting and the meetings go well.
<nhaines> Usually we talk about different software packages, Ubuntu and Linux news, and general topics like that.  I keep on top of Ubuntu development because users have a lot of questions about past releases and what's happening in the upcoming release.  Planet Ubuntu can be a great way to keep up with oneiric news thanks to dholbach and his weekly series of posts! :)
<nhaines> If anyone hasn't seen Planet Ubuntu, it's an aggregate feed of blog posts from Ubuntu members.  My blog is there, too, and my Ubuntu Hour announcements show up there.
<nhaines> I didn't mention it above because only Ubuntu members can post there.  Plus, it seems like the LUG mailing lists are where most visitors find out about my Ubuntu Hour, which surprised me.
<nhaines> Also I should probably remember to give the link!  :)  It's at http://planet.ubuntu.com/ and is a great way to keep up with Ubuntu news, as are sites like http://ubuntu-news.org/ and OMG! Ubuntu at http://omgubuntu.co.uk/
<nhaines> If you read these sites every couple of days, you shouldn't feel too nervous when Ubuntu Hour visitors turn to you as their souce of Ubuntu news.  ;)
<nhaines> I chose Panera because it offers meals as well as coffee, tea, chocolate, and pastries.  Not everyone buys food when they visit but several eat dinner there and most get a drink or a roll.  Because you can choose from a meal, a drink, or a snack, it's not very expensive and can be quite convenient.  So most people get some kind of food, the cafe is happy, and no one feels obligated to spend money.
<nhaines> After my two month trial I was ready to make adjustments but other than the meeting frequency I've found that nothing needed changing.  I'm looking for ways to enhance the meeting but things seem to be very comfortable.
<nhaines> There are definitely some regulars who really apprecate the Ubuntu Hour and are very supportive of it, and at least one member wants to start his own closer to him.  I think that's excellent.  :)
<nhaines> The very last thing I want to talk about is consistency.  There is nothing that will kill an event faster than being unreliable.  If you advertise that you're going to be somewhere at a certain time then you need to be there.  That's why it's important to do a little research and make sure your location and time will work for you as well as for others.
<nhaines> Pick a location that is reliable.  If you have two regular locations that's one thing, but if you constantly change locations then you're going to have trouble retaining visitors and attracting new ones.  If a visitor sees my Ubuntu Hour announcement and can't make it that week, he can see when the next meeting is and plan accordingly.  This helps everyone know what to expect.  The time always stays the same as well.
<ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
<nhaines> When you ask others to give up their time, you have to respect that time commitment as well.  Time is valuable and if you cancel meetings without notice (or too short notice) then people will spend their time more wisely--away from your meetings!
<nhaines> I'm always at the restaurant by 18:00 and earlier if I can manage it.  If no one else shows up, I stay there until 19:00 and then I leave, but I always stay for the full hour because I've advertised a full hour.  A lot of times we're there until 20:00 or even 20:30 because we're having so much fun, but I treat the first hour as a serious commitment.
<nhaines> When you have online resources with details like a wiki page, a blog, or a static web page, make sure that you keep it current and up to date at all times.  The other thing that will kill interest in a group is if it looks like it was abandoned.  So if you have a simple schedule like "every Tuesday evening" then keep dates off the page.  But if you do need to specify dates, then make sure you update it at the end of every Ubuntu Hour meeti
<nhaines> Just make it part of the routine to keep it up to date and you'll do well.  :)
<nhaines> I think I've made myself clear.  Make sure you follow through on your commitments and pick consistent, reliable locations and times and you'll be successful.
<nhaines> I'm more than happy to answer any questions now in #ubuntu-classroom-chat.  After this session (or for those of you following along on the Web) you can email me at nhaines (at) ubuntu.com and I'll do my best to help out.
<ClassBot> bauwan asked: Do you think that Ubuntu Hour is only an idea for big cities? Does Your experience maybe show that there is minimum requirement to the surrounding area? (Sorry i dont know your area :) )
<nhaines> I'm about 30 miles south of Los Angeles and Irvine, California is a pretty big tech area.  So there's a large population for sure.  :)
<nhaines> I don't think it's an idea only for big cities.  I think the informalness lets it be a good idea even for smaller locations, even though that might take a little longer to pick up steam.
<ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
<nhaines> It's okay to bring friends along too... a couple of my coworkers have joined me for Ubuntu Hour as well.  :)
<nhaines> In closing, I'd like to say that Ubuntu Hours are a great way to jump in and find a very local community.  I hope you all find success in your community.  I wish you the very best of luck and remember, be excellent to each other!  :D
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || Event: Ubuntu Community Week - Current Session: Baking a LoCo Team - Instructors: jono - Slides: http://is.gd/JBY9Zo
<jono> hi everyone!
<ClassBot> Slides for Baking a LoCo Team: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuCommunityWeek/oneiric/slides?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=session07.pdf
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/07/19/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
<jono> for those of you who don't know me, I am Jono Bacon, and I work as the Ubuntu Community Manager - my job is to help build a fun, productive, and enjoyable Ubuntu community where everyone can feel like they can put their brick in the wall in bringing Free Software to the masses
<jono> before I start, I just want to give a big shout out to Randall Ross and the Ubuntu Classroom Team for doing an excellent job in putting together Ubuntu Community Week - I am really proud to see such a stunning schedule of sessions!
<jono> so, on to my own session
<jono> today I want to talk about how you can create your own Ubuntu LoCo Team
<jono> I am going to talk for a while and explain how to do this, and then we will wrap with some Q+A
<jono> before we start, we should explore why you would want to create a team
<jono> for those who are unfamiliar with LoCo teams, they are local groups of Ubuntu users who get together to spread the word about Ubuntu, share new ideas, learn things, and more
<jono> these groups are spread throughout the world, and you can see the list of teams at http://loco.ubuntu.com/teams/
<jono> so why would you want to create a team?
<jono> there are lot of reasons, including:
<jono>  * fun - LoCo teams are great to meet new people, enjoy interesting conversations, and generally have a lot of fun
<jono>  * advocate - LoCo teams are a great way to spread the word about Ubuntu, and put your brick in the wall in taking Ubuntu to the masses - our LoCo teams are a key piece in how we will get the word out
<jono>  * events - LoCo teams often organize events, both online and face-to-face where the teams get together to meet each other, have fun, and spread Ubuntu
<jono>  * learning - LoCo teams are a great place to learn more about Ubuntu, working with the community etc
<jono>  * networking - if you are keen to get to know people, LoCo teams are a great place to start - I have met so many awesome people at LoCo meetings. :-)
<jono> as you can see, there are lots of reasons to start a LoCo team, so how to we get started?
<jono> before you do anything, take a look at http://loco.ubuntu.com/teams/ and see if there is a team near you
<jono> we always want to avoid having duplicate teams in the same area - so if a team exists, join that team instead - duplication of effort is never good for anyone
<jono> ...I just want to re-iterate that, what do we need to do folks? :-)
<jono> ...go to http://loco.ubuntu.com/teams/ and see if a team already exists :-)
<jono> if no team exists near you, it is time to start creating one - woo!
<jono> the first step is to find some other folks to start the team with
<jono> creating a team by yourself is a lot of work, so dividing up the work with other people is highly recommended
<jono> ask your friends and family if they would like to help out, or tweet/dent/blog about your interest in setting up a team and see if someone is interested in helping
<jono> when you have a few people who are interested in helping out, there are a few things you will want to do first...
<jono> first, you need to name it - see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LoCoTeamRegions for some details on how to name your team - this is pretty simple, and you will get the hang of it
<jono> you should then register your team in Launchpad - ask in #ubuntu-locoteams for the details of how to do this
<jono> registering the team in Launchpad will help bring it into http://loco.ubuntu.com - just make sure your team is a member of the https://launchpad.net/~locoteams team
<jono> with your team set up, the next step is to get a communication channel set up - we recommend you set up a mailing list and an IRC channel
<jono> an ubuntu-CC (CC is the ISO country code) mailing list for general discussion about Ubuntu in your language should be created - email rt@ubuntu.com to request the creation of a mailing list
<jono> the list should be created within 2 weeks - if it is not, please contact the LoCo council to find out whether there is a problem with the request
<jono> United States teams should append the two-letter US Postal Code abbreviation for the relevant state (e.g. ubuntu-us-ca)
<jono> for IRC, be sure to register your nickname on Freenode (details about how to do this are at http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#userregistration)
<jono> now create your channel - help is available at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IrcTeam/CreatingChannels - and use the same name format (e.g. #ubuntu-us-ca)
<jono> with your communication channels set up, it is recommended you create some simple wiki pages on wiki.ubuntu.com where you can note down how people can join your team and where you can plan projects
<jono> so, any questions so far?
<jono> to ask a question, type in QUESTION and then your question in #ubuntu-classroom-chat
<jono> e.g. QUESTION: what is a mailing list?
<ClassBot> shobuz99 asked: Will this chat be strictly text, or is there a GUI applet running and I can't see it?
<jono> shobuz99, this session is all text, there are no slides for this particular session
<jono> any questions?
<jono> alrighty, no questions, moving on
<jono> so at this point you have your team, your mailing list and IRC channel, and some wiki pages
<jono> here's a tip that affects some LoCo teams:
<jono> there will be some people in your team who will want to set up a comprehensive website
<jono> something in Joomla!, Drupal, Wordpress etc
<jono> resist the urge
<jono> at the beginning of a team you have no content, and so many teams spend weeks debating which CMS they want for a website and don't actually do anything as a team
<jono> stick with the wiki at first - when your team is up and running then start thinking about more comprehensive systems
<jono> the next step is to put together some regular meetings
<jono> when creating a new community you need to bootstrap it
<jono> that is, get it up and running, get people's juices flowing, and start doing active work
<jono> unfortunately, for some teams they get started and then it all just fizzles out
<jono> regular team meetings are a good antidote to that happening
<jono> I recommend you organize a team meeting at least once every two weeks or once a month
<jono> organizing a meeting is simple - host it on IRC, decide on a time and place and let your team know
<jono> e.g. have it on Tues 26th July at 6pm Pacific time
<jono> in #ubuntu-us-ca
<jono> I also highly recommend that you create a wiki page where people can add agenda items
<jono> in the build-up to the meeting invite the team to go and add agenda items for topics they want to discuss
<jono> these can be added as bullet points
<jono> the benefit of doing this on the wiki is that everyone is able to add content, and this will make the meeting feel very open and transparent
<jono> when it comes time to have your meeting, go through the agenda items one by one and have a discussion
<jono> when running your meetings always strive to find outcomes to the agenda items - strive to make decisions and keep the ball rolling
<jono> there is one big risk to meetings - people spending an hour of their time and then no conclusions happening
<jono> as a loco leader, always try to make people feel like the meeting was worth there time
<jono> remember, everyone is a volunteer...folks are taking time away from their friends and family for the meetings
<jono> also, one final tip on meetings, there will often be one person who tends to ramble or takes things off topic, try to politely keep those folks on topic and cut off their rambling if needed
<jono> everyone meeting has one of those folks, yours will too :-)
<jono> with your team all set up and meetings running, you now need to do something as a team
<jono> there is one key difference between successful LoCo teams and unsuccessful ones - successful teams have members that feel fulfilled in their membership of the team
<jono> to feel that sense of fullfillment, your members need to be actively engaged in projects that they feel are worthwhile
<jono> in other words...teams that work on team projects are generally happier, because the members feel that the team is doing worthwhile work
<jono> so lets discuss a few projects you can work on
<jono> computer-related fairs and exhibitions can certainly benefit from an Ubuntu presence!
<jono> representing Ubuntu at local events is a wonderful way to contribute
<jono> it is also something everyone in the team can contribute to
<jono> a good howto on how to do this is at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LoCoComputerFairHowto
<jono> Canonical can help with CDs too :-)
<jono> another great type of event is a release party
<jono> release parties are held after each Ubuntu release is a great way to share with others!
<jono> another great guide on this is at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LoCoRunningReleaseParty
<jono> another possibility for advocacy is to help ensure that Ubuntu gets coverage in your regional press
<jono> there are Linux magazines all over the world that highlight and review distributions in every issue, sometimes even distributing CDs
<jono> help us get Ubuntu in the magazines you read! Those magazines also sometimes want to interview local people who are using the distribution - be sure tp share your success stories
<jono> another fun thing to do is to just burn a stack of Ubuntu CDs, wear some Ubuntu t-shirts and go out into your local town center or main street and talk to people about Ubuntu
<jono> take a laptop to demo Ubuntu, and if possible give people a business card that points them to http://www.ubuntu.com
<jono> the key point here is to think of projects that your specific team would be interested in and ensure everyone gets to participate
<jono> for each project you should identify what work needs to be done and divide it up between the different members
<jono> to finish up, I want to talk about Approved Teams
<jono> in the LoCo community we have the concept of new and approved teams
<jono> new teams are teams who are in the process of getting up and running and have probably not run many projects and have less experience
<jono> approved teams are teams who are making significant and sustained contributions and actively doing great work
<jono> one problem we have in our community is that some folks see Approved teams as a badge of honor they have to have
<jono> the way in which we assess whether you are an approved team is if you do good work
<jono> just trying to get approved status is not enough
<jono> in fact, teams that only want the honor of being an approved team present a bit of a red flag
<jono> you should focus on getting your team doing good work, and if that is the case, you will naturally get approved
<jono> this process is outlined at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LoCoGettingApproved
<jono> so in a nutshell from this session:
<jono>  * LoCo teams are really fun and awesome places, and there are lots of good reasons to be in a LoCo
<jono>  * before setting up a team, see if a team already exists in your local area in http://loco.ubuntu.com/teams
<jono>  * if no team exists, find some friends to start a new team with
<jono>  * next, name your team, register it in Launchpad, set up your mailing list and IRC channel, and set up regular meetings
<jono>  * now choose some projects to work on and ensure all the work is spread throughout the team so it feels like a real team effort
<jono>  * if you keep doing awesome work, you will get approved as an approved LoCo team
<jono> and that about wraps it up :-)
<jono> so lets do some Q+A now
<jono> to ask a question, join #ubuntu-classroom-chat and ask a question with QUESTION at the beginning
<jono> e.g:
<jono> QUESTION: What is a mailing list?
<jono> and then I will go through the questions one by one
<jono> get 'em in, folks!
<jono> any questions?
<ClassBot> pyrocyon asked: how big should a group be before it attempts to apply for loco status?
<jono> pyrocyon, there is no fixed number, but I would say a loco should have a fairly sizable membership before it applies as an approved team
<jono> in my mind 20+ members
<ClassBot> designbybeck__ asked: any thing about Loco's going to TV/Radio and other public communications outlets to help raise awareness of Ubuntu and OSS in the general population?
<jono> designbybeck__, that is great work to do - I think the key thing is that you want to distill the key benefits of Ubuntu for a general audience
<jono> if you get a TV or radio spot, what are the three or five bullet points that will get the general public interested in Ubuntu?
<jono> remember that TV and radio is a general medium, so don't get too techie there too :-)
<ClassBot> Morgen asked: Loco Teams seem to be state wide are there more local groups?
<jono> Morgen, we generally prefer to keep it state wide - if we have too many teams, things get dilluted
<jono> what I recommend is that a statewide team has regional sub-teams
<jono> e.g. California with a Northern and Southern sub-teams
<ClassBot> designbybeck__ asked: any thing about Loco's going to TV/Radio and other public communications outlets to help raise awareness of Ubuntu and OSS in the general population?
<jono> already answered this :-)
<ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
<ClassBot> pyrocyon asked: how knowledgeable should the members be about Ubuntu?
<jono> pyrocyon, you don't need to be an expert, and you don't need to be technical, you just need to be passionate about Ubuntu
<jono> and passionate about helping others to enjoy Ubuntu too :-)
<jono> any more questions?
<jono> alright
<jono> I think we are all done
<jono> thanks, everyone!
<jono> thanks for joining my session today!
<jono> and let me know if you set up a new LoCo team in your area! :-)
<ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || Event: Ubuntu Community Week - Current Session: We Party Grande! You Can Too - Instructors: huats - Slides: http://is.gd/3J7K97
<jono> huats, all set?
<ClassBot> Slides for We Party Grande! You Can Too: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuCommunityWeek/oneiric/slides?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=session08.pdf
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/07/19/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
<huats> Yes I am jono
<jono> huats, :-)
<huats> thanks for warming the mic !
<huats> So
<huats> like the previous session that Jono brilliantly gave
<jono> :-)
<huats> please you #ubuntu-classroom-chat to ask your questions
<huats> First a little introduction. My name is Christophe Sauthier, and I am the leader of Ubuntu-fr, the french loco.
<huats> I am going to talk about : "We Party Grande! You Can Too"
<huats> well behind that title
<huats> you need to know that for the past few years we (Ubuntu-fr) are getting famous, for many actions
<huats> and in particular our parties which gathered many people :
<huats> between 4000 and 5000 people for various party in Paris (on a WE laps)
<huats> or almost 800 in Toulouse  (in the city I live) on a single saturday afternoon.
<huats> I will detail our "receipes" in this session, feels free to ask all your questions on the dedicated channel.
<huats> oh and forgive my english which is not always good :)
<huats> I will try to answer them inside the session or at the end, in a dedicated time, with the help of others members of the team and in particular YoBoY who is the coordinator for the organisation of the main event in Paris.
<huats> So first Ubuntu Party ? What is it ? and first of all what do we organize ?
<huats> It is important to say that for us, the interest is not to do a simple release party with coders.
<huats> No, we want to share Ubuntu around us, and even more since we want to help to promote free software and free culture by promoting Ubuntu. I think these goal will please jono :)
<huats> So it is important for us to gather some other communities during our event.
<huats> As a result many of our events there are conferences from the mozilla community, some free software french supporters, some free culture conferences and workshops.
<huats> So what is the first thing to decide when you want to plan an event ? Date and Venue
<huats> The first step is not necessary the most simple : to set the perfect date and the perfect place.
<huats> Based on our various experiences, it is a crucial step.
<huats> You have to decide them a long time before the event.
<huats> By instance our next event in Paris(18th to 20th November), dates have been decided in last May, right after our previous party !
<huats> arg 11th to 13th (I have mixed the the envisaged one in Toulouse)
<huats> It is important  for your audience to find a place with good public transportations, parking. And many stuffs that might help them to come easily
<huats> Even if the place is not famous for its technical conferences, we rather have a place that is know to people, so that they can say "if it happens there, in this place that I know, I might find something interesting for me".
<huats> We are very lucky because we can do our event in Paris in a place that combined both
<huats> A place called the city of sciences
<huats> Oh and when it is possible and stick with that venue over the time...
<huats> We are doing our party in Paris in the same place since feisty
<huats> So now our audience know the place. But we also know the place, which help us to improve from one event to another. But I'll continue with that later.
<huats> Building a team
<huats> Once you know where and when your event will take place, you can ask yourself :
<huats> who will be there to organize ?
<huats> I am sure you have lots of people in each of your teams willing to help.
<huats> So finding a group of core organizers should not be a real problem.
<huats> But keep in mind that you have to pick people you can rely on
<huats> there is nothing worst than ask someone to do something and to have to do it instead at the last minute
<huats> This group is in charge of leading/planning the event from this moment.
<huats> Each tasks should be done by pairs, so that you have backup is someone cannot participate anymore for any reasons.
<huats> And most of all every actions should be trackable on a common repository (we have used many tools to achieve that in the Past).
<huats> Each aspect of the event should be lead by someone designated before the event.
<huats> During our last event there was around 100 people willing to help for each day...
<huats> It was a necessity to have them driven/assigned before the event.
<huats> Here is an example of the todo list that we have define : http://todo.ubuntu-party.org/projects/paris-natty/issues
<huats> (for the natty Ubuntu Party)
<huats> It is also important to notice that we are doing all our event with the help of LUGs (especially regarding the install party part).
<huats> Any questions so far ? It sounds like a monologue :)
<huats> well I'll continue and see it anyone ask something
<huats> How to get the word out to a large number of people?
<huats> We do rely on LUGs for a large part of it
<huats> (especially for the install party which is really people consumming)
<huats> we have big forum we also have a lot of volunteers to help that are getting in touch thanks to our forums
<huats> in fact we do have a great thing : since we are french speakers, a lot of our community is using our forums (the french speaking one) which clearly helps to gather the people, and it ease the broadcasting of the informations
<huats> Planning the Event
<huats> like many geeks we spend most of our time on IRC, but we really think that there is a need for at least 4 real life meetings for each party : 3 before and 1 after.
<huats> It helps to work on the project but also to allow people to know more each other, which is great for the community.
<huats> Each meeting is separated by a month at least. IRL meeting are very important because you can express more directly than IRC one. Also, it's a good excuse to take a beer too
<huats> Other point : Creating a conference Planning
<huats> Since our event is not only an install party, but also filed with  conferences, we have to set up a real conferences planning.
<huats> We start by putting down names of conferencers we like and themes that we would like to have. On the first of the IRL meeting, the conferences are selected.
<huats> Then the people in charge of dealing with it contact each envisaged conferencer to explain him the idea and the date.
<huats> We want to have the conference program (with schedule and the conferencers agreement) finalized at least 1 month before the event.
<huats> Remember (well I am sure you will since you are all captivate by my talk) : we try to enlarge the targetted audiences
<huats> in fact we try to interest many kind of audiences.
<huats> People without any backgrounds can come and enjoy our introductions sessions, or our first time hands-on workshops.
<huats> We are also doing some improvements tutorials for advanced users. Bugs Jams also...
<huats> And of course we are doing a install party !
<huats> Which is a huge event party during the whole event.
<huats> People who are here to help for the install party wears badges explaining in which part of Ubuntu they have the best chance to help you (ubuntu ? kubuntu ? xubuntu ? network ?...)
<huats> We also try to have dispatching reception to organize a bit the install party
<huats> and it is really a good thing to do so. All our survey proved that !
<huats> Is there any questions ?
<huats> Ok then I'll go on
<huats> So you have plan your event and have a team to organize
<huats> the next thing is that you want a large audience to attend it : it is where the Marketing side enters the game
<huats> a great event won't be a success if there is no public and to have some you need to do some marketting !
<huats> I said previously that the conference planning have to be done 1 month before the event
<huats> You might ask yourself (or myself), "why one month ?"
<huats> Because it is the time where we start the biggest part our marketing strategy :)
<huats> I say the biggest part since we have started to briefly announce it to some medias : linux or computer oriented, and "small" media corporations.
<huats> This announcement have been done on the time frame event - 8/7 weeks, in a press communicate that we have validate during one of our IRL meeting (it have to be written before).
<huats> 5 weeks before the event (and up to the event),  we start to annouce the event on personnal blogs.
<huats> 4 weeks before the event (and up to the event), we contact again the media that were already contacted before (weeks 8 and 7 before the event).
<huats> 1 week before the event we contact all mass media to announce the event. And the week of the event every national medias.
<huats> Of course it is needed to get some contacts with them before that dead line in order to know who to contact...
<huats> We have someone who is the media point of contact for many years know, it helps to have a continuation in that area so the press know who to contact...
<huats> This year we had a 3 minutes report on an evening news on a national television...
<huats> So patience is the key regarding medias
<huats> Also we do not hesitate to do flyers if there is an event where there is a potential audience that might be interested in our party.
<huats> Oh and a final word :after the event you do need to contact every media you have contacted before it to tell them the result of your event.
<huats> It is a great asset for the next time you'll contact them to announce an event. In the same idea, you need to publish on various blog/website pictures/summary of the event.
<huats> Logistics
<huats> You plan to sell some stuffs to earn some money for your team ?
<huats> Great we do so. But you must dedicate a pair of people for handling that. Looking for the best rates, harassement of the good producer is really time consuming...
<huats> We have someone who is taking care of ordering the CDs, the Tshirts and of the goodies that we have...
<huats> We are doing more than 10000 CD for each release so it needs some organisation to find good prices...
<huats> Do not forget food for your staff. We have the chance to have an Ubuntu lover who is a cook, and he is doing food for all of us during our event (it is some work to feed 200 staffs on 2 days)
<huats> Finally The event !
<huats> Just 2 words : smile and enjoy... Smile because it will be a hard day. Enjoy once it is done, and smile because it has been a success..
<huats> The needed step would be the debrieffing : Each organizer have the right to express his feelings. And it helps to improve for the next time...
<huats> It is what is done during the IRL meeting after the event and it helps us to set some areas of improvements
<huats> That is it
<huats> you are now able to do party that can gather 1000s of people !
<huats> any questions ?
<ClassBot> computa_mike asked: I'm wondering - how can we measure the success of an event?  Is it enough to just have a good time, or are there any metrics we can measure?  How can we measure?
<huats> There is not a single defintion
<huats> We have started in Toulouse to dosurvey of the people who were attending the event
<huats> But as I said, do not neglect the pleasure and the feedback from the staff
<ClassBot> maiatoday asked: Do you have template todo lists with timescales? I find people are keen to do stuff but they don't know what to do and I don't always know either.
<huats> I have put our ToDo list for the Natty Ubuntu Party we had in Paris
<huats> but it is in French
<huats> and quite oriented with our needs
<huats> So the answer will be no
<huats> But I do beleive it is an action that the LoCo Council might try to do for you
<huats> (I am seating at the LoCo Council)
<huats> maiatoday, please ask that to a next LoCo Council
<ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
<huats> by adding that to our agenda
<huats> actually we have a meeting right after that session
<huats> and like YoBoY pointed out : here is the gantt chart we use in Paris http://todo.ubuntu-party.org/projects/paris-natty/issues/gantt
<huats> any other questions ?
<huats> so I think that is it
<huats> thanks everyone for listening to me
<huats> I hope you'll have great parties after that
<huats> please let us know !
<ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/07/19/%23ubuntu-classroom.html
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat ||
<ubuntupower> hello?
<THE_Grosser> hi
<ubuntupower> did i miss the session?
<cvillaco> ubuntu power ftw!
<ubuntupower> lol
<cvillaco> =)
<ubuntupower> ok so how do i build a community guyz?
<cvillaco> kinda missed the sessions for today i think
<nhaines> Yup, they're over for today, but they begin again tomorrow.
<cvillaco> check out the event time for the community week table https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuCommunityWeek
<cvillaco> time flies during the sessions
<THE_Grosser> à² _à²  . . . . so whats going on in here?
<CaptWho> i have a build of eeebuntu that i want to install, but the iso image that i have is bigger than 700mg.  is there a way to break the iso into two disks?
<EgyParadox> CaptWho: #ubuntu
#ubuntu-classroom 2011-07-20
<Krasslig> evening
<PythonPup> Has anyone here been participating in the Ubuntu Community week?
<PythonPup> Sorry, I put that in the wrong channel.
<coolteen> Hey everyone, what's this thing about?
<chandrageetha> how can i type malayalam in office writer?
<coalwater> chandrageetha, is that a language?
<coalwater> maybe u could install it
<chandrageetha> i have ubuntu 11.04 Natty Narwal, and malayalam is the language in Kerala state in India
<chandrageetha> it supports east asian languages, no?
<coalwater> 1 sec im checking
<chandrageetha> coalwater, it supports east Asian languages, no? Malayalam is the language in Kerala, one of Indian states
<coalwater> do u want to type that language or do u want to have menus and stuff with that language
<chandrageetha> s, i want to type in that language in office writer
<chandrageetha> could i have private chat with you?
<coalwater> i think u should check the keyboard settings
<cvillaco_> Hey, where you members from?
 * popey waves
<popey> anyone around?
<jp_Hranice> CZ here !
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || Event: Ubuntu Community Week - Current Session: Podcast Your Way to a Bigger Community! - Instructors: popey - Slides: http://is.gd/y1BcxA
<ClassBot> Slides for Podcast Your Way to a Bigger Community!: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuCommunityWeek/oneiric/slides?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=session09.pdf
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/07/20/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
<popey> Hullo!
<popey> (PS. There are no slides)
<popey> I'm Alan Pope and I'm here to talk a bit about podcasting in my talk which is titled:-
<popey> 16:23:45 < popey> that would do it
<popey> bah!
<popey> "Podcast Your Way to a Bigger Community!"
<popey> "You have great community-building ideas. You want the world to hear them. Join your host to learn how the UK LoCo team created an Ubuntu podcast to help spread the word everywhere, and how they continue to do so."
<popey> I'm talking from my experience in making Ubuntu UK Podcast with my friends. I'm not a professional podcaster, none of us have had any training for this. This is just what we've learned.
<popey> Your experience may differ. :D
<popey> Lets start with the basics..
<popey> **** What is a podcast ****
<popey> It's a downloadable and/or streamable radio/TV type programme on the internet.
<popey> They can be audio or video files, of any duration and quality.
<popey> They can be HD video or low-bit-rate audio.
<popey> There could be one regular person presenting, a rotation of presenters or a zoo full of people..
<popey> The content can be speaking only, music, a blend of the two or anything else you can think of.
<popey> There's already a whole bunch of Linux and Ubuntu specific podcasts listed at:-
<popey> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Podcasts
<popey> and an even bigger list at:-
<popey> http://www.thelinuxlink.net/
<popey> People who run Ubuntu already have a platform on which they can download podcasts.
<popey> Built in music applications for downloading and listening to podcasts include:-
<popey> Built in music applications for downloading and listening to podcasts include:-
<popey> bah!
<popey>  Rhythmbox
<popey>  Banshee
<popey>  Amarok.
<popey> Plus there are additional apps in the repository tailored specifically for this:-
<popey>  hpodder
<popey>  gpodder.
<popey> All great apps. Plus there's other ones like bashbodder, and for the Windows/OSX users there's obviously iTunes (and others).
<popey> ( some people hate iTunes, but it brings in the listeners, more on that later)
<popey> Moving on...
<popey> **** Why do it ****
<popey> Because it's fun!
<popey> It's a great way to pass on the good news about Ubuntu to people in your community, your LoCo team.
<popey> It's also a fantastic way for people in the community to feed back.
<popey> People who wouldn't normally contribute to something in Ubuntu can contribute to the podcast very easily.
<popey> How hard is it to talk into a microphone for a while and record it? *
<popey> * Not hard at all.
<popey> **** Who should do it ****
<popey> Anyone & Everyone :)
<popey> or
<popey> Anyone who thinks they have something useful to say, and believes there might be an audience willing to listen.
<popey> There's a common thought that there isn't "room" for more Ubuntu / Linux podcasts.
<popey> This is false.
<popey> At the link above you can see a lot of Linux / Ubuntu podcasts. Most are English language.
<popey> There's clearly room for plenty of non-EN ones, especially in LoCo teams where English isn't the first Language.
<popey> Of course that doesn't mean there's no room for English language ones.
<popey> :D
<popey> There's specific subject areas that could be covered (that currently aren't well serviced).
<popey> This includes Gaming on Linux, Support for end users, Ubuntu in the business space, Non-Governmental Organisation targetted podcasts.
<popey> The list is endless. There is plenty of room for quality podcasts about Ubuntu.
<popey> Think about how many Radio stations there are near you, and how many there are in your country.
<popey> Note how many radio stations there are on the planet, and how many languages there are.
<popey> Each has a demographic, a target market, and that market is huge.
<popey> So room for everyone!
<popey> **** How to do it ****
<popey> There's plenty of ways to podcast. Here's some ideas to get started, with some ideas on technically how to record and the positive (+++) and negative (---) aspects
<popey> Method A - "Quick and dirty"
<popey> Just record something on your own, put it out there on some free/cheap hosting and see who comes along to listen and help out.
<popey> Sit down with a laptop, sound recorder and press record.
<popey> +++ - Quick and easy to record
<popey> --- - Usually not great audio quality
<popey> --- - No good for remote users
<popey> (where remote users might participate in the show)
<popey>  
<popey> Method B - "A little bit of planning"
<popey> Put a call out to some friends and agree on a recording time, record it and put it out there.
<popey> There's a few ways to actually do this.. here's some options...
<popey> Use a dedicated audio recording device (such as Zoom H1 http://www.samsontech.com/products/productpage.cfm?prodID=2053)
<popey> +++ - Quick and easy to record
<popey> +++ - Portable device so can easily take to other locations than your basement :D
<popey> +++ - Great for interviews / discussion
<popey> --- - Not great for remote participation
<popey> --- - Not great when multiple people are talking at once
<popey> (you have to wave the mic around to point at who is talking)
<popey>  
<popey> Another option...
<popey> Use Skype or other multi-party VOIP client with only one participant recording
<popey> +++ - Generally "Just works"
<popey> +++ - Great for multiple remote participants
<popey> --- - Lose the visual cues of seeing remote participants body language
<popey> --- - Skype is Non-Free (if that matters to you)
<popey> --- - Can be variable audio quality if remote participants have rubbish hardware or dodgy connections
<popey>  
<popey> and another option...
<popey> Use Skype or other multi-party VOIP client with every participant recording (parec or skyperec for example)
<popey> (similar to above, but..
<popey> +++ - Audio quality is great because each person has a recording from their local microphone
<popey> --- - Significant overhead of getting the audio files to one person, and mixing the audio files together
<popey>  
<popey> Linux Outlaws use the above method, and it works well for them.
<popey> Method C - "Planned for every eventuality!"
<popey> The following is what we do on Ubuntu UK Podcast.
<popey> We decided to do "seasons" - 20 or so episodes a year, then take a break, and start again the following year.
<popey> We all go out for a social evening a month or so before the season starts to chat about what format we'll do this year.
<popey> (usually Curry)
<popey> We also agree on whether we're actually going to do it again or not. So far we're half way through our 4th year.
<popey> We agree a schedule, and put into a Google calendar the recording dates and release dates.
<popey> This year we decided to record on a Tuesday whilst streaming live, and release on a Wednesday.
<popey> (sometimes (like this week) we change the recording day to accomodate availability of people, but that's rare)
<popey> During the week before the episode recording we put a shared Google document together to plan the episode.
<popey> We organise interviews, reviews, news etc in the week before the recording.
<popey> On the day of recording we finish off the show prep and arrive at Studio A (Tonys house) or Studio B (my house) to record.
<popey> We each bring our own microphone, cable and stand, and laptop.
<popey> Tony sets up all the audio equipment and does an audio test.
<popey> Laura (or I) make some tea, and we eat some cake.
<popey> (this is not a lie)
<popey> We stream using icecast via our server kindly donated to use by Bitfolk (http://bitfolk.com/)
<popey> Once the show is over Tony will tidy up the audio (briefly) and upload it to the server.
<popey> We collaboratively work on the show notes on our wordpress+podpress blog, and then sync the podcast out to the mirror network.
<popey> (note: The mirrors are servers run by community members who donated their space to us - we don't pay for any hosting at all)
<popey> (Daviey setup the mirror system of scripts, which works brilliantly.
<popey> Once the pages are done on the site we release the podcast.
<popey> We start promoting the show via blogs, facebook, identica, twitter, Google+ and spamming IRC channels :D
<popey> We rest for a week and then do it all over again :D
<popey> That's our "Method"..
<popey> 17:14:01 < Newbster> Question for popey : how many podcasts did you do until you had enough practice and routine, so that editing, uploading etc.  did not take you days anymore
<popey> Great question!
<popey> We actually changed the way we do it because the editing became a pain
<popey> We used to record a bit, have a break, record a bit, have some cake, record a bit, have some tea
<popey> we'd end up with 8 chunks of audio that needed editing and mixing
<popey> in Season 3 we decided to try doing it "as live" - we didnt stream - but we recorded the whole episode in one go
<popey> if there were mistakes we generally left them in
<popey> I think by then we were getting better at it
<popey> now in Season 4 we do it live and record the whole thing in exactly one hour
<popey> (we have a timer on the telly reminding us when to stop)
<popey> But we're still far from perfect, just a bunch of people chatting in a room really :D
<ClassBot> nigelb asked: How do you manage the live podcasts that UUPC has been doing lately?
<popey> Good question! :D
<popey> We have Icecast running on our server - you can probably see it idle at http://podcast.ubuntu-uk.org:8000/
<popey> when we start streaming tonight has a laptop with icecast client on it which connects to the server and streams audio to it
<popey> people click a link on the website or paste the url into their audio player (like vlc) and they hear everything from the studio
<popey> simples ;D
<popey> We have quite a bit of audio kit, but that's built up over the years
<popey> We didnt all go out and buy hundreds of pounds worth of equipment
<popey> but we did each buy our own microphone (we generally use Shure SM58), mic cables and stands
<popey> I have two mics so if we have a guest in the studio we set that up for them
<popey> Clearly I could go all the way up to:-
<popey> Method Z - "Build a recording studio..." :D
<popey> and we have considered building a little dedicated studio (in my garage) but we're not there (yet)
<popey> So that's some of the ways people can podcast..
<popey> All of which are valid and potentially successful ways to get a podcast out there however I'll go over some lessons we've learned.
<popey> * Do some research
<popey> Put a call out to your LoCo for help.
<popey> Perhaps community members can help out with equipment, a venue for recording, infrastructure or bandwidth.
<popey> With Ubuntu UK Podcast I contacted a few good friends and asked if they wanted to get involved.
<popey> Find a web developer and/or designer who can help with a web presence
<popey> See if anyone has past experience of podcasting or audio engineering. Perhaps they have equipment or advice to offer.
<popey>  
<popey> * Set your expectations accordingly
<popey> Most podcasts don't get millions of downloads, and especially don't get loads of downloads on the first episode
<popey> Don't let this put you off from making more episodes!
<popey>  
<popey> * Audio quality _does_ matter
<popey> Whilst you could just pick up a $2 microphone from Wallmart and record yourself whilst sat on a train station platform during rush hour, the audio quality would probably be painful to listen to.
<popey> Most listeners do care about audio quality. If they can't clearly hear what you're saying they may stop listening altogether.
<popey> That doesn't mean you have to spend thousands on a professional recording studio setup, but some sensible precautions can help:-
<popey> 1. Do test recording and listen back on heaphones to see how the recording came out.
<popey> 2. Make adjustments to improve things. Don't just think "that'll do", it probably won't.
<popey> 3. Stay close and fixed distance to your microphone to avoid volume levels fluctuating wildly
<popey> 4. Consider post-processing the audio to clean up any sound mess before releasing the show
<popey> 5. Consider editing the audio before publishing to remove bloopers, long pauses or mistakes.
<popey>  
<popey> (although you will get better with practice)
<popey>  
<popey> * Make it available in various formats
<popey> It's my opinion that (Linux Specific) podcasts should be made available in both free formats (such as Ogg Vorbis) and also in a format that plays on non-Linux platforms.
<popey> Some will argue that we should advocate and only make shows available in free formats. I disagree.
<popey> Around 50% of the listeners of Ubuntu UK Podcast use iTunes.
<popey> So that's _half_ our audience _don't_ use Ogg
<popey>  
<popey> Tony Whitmore (from our podcast) made a script called 'Podcoder' which makes the creation of MP3 and OGG audio files from a master easy.
<popey> http://darcs.tonywhitmore.co.uk/cgi-bin/darcsweb.cgi?r=podcoder;a=summary
<popey>  
<popey> * Make it easy for listeners to feedback
<popey> An easy to remember email address which is given out _in_ the show itself is vital.
<popey> People will want to correct you when you're wrong (and you will be wrong sometimes) and tell you what they think. Make it easy for them to do that.
<popey> Perhaps register a twitter / identica ID specifically for your podcast.
<popey> Maybe create a Facebook page or dedicated forum.
<popey> Maybe have a Skype ID or other VOIP setup so people can easily leave audio feedback.
<popey>  
<popey> (Whilst you might not want to use non-free systems like Facebook, Twitter and Skype, the fact is your listeners probably do.)
<popey> Letting them have a way for them to feedback to you the way _they_ want is essential.
<popey> Forcing people to use an invite-only social network *cough* Diaspora *cough* to contact you is probably not going to get you much feedback.
<popey>  
<popey> * Listeners _like_ a regular schedule
<popey> Perhaps surprisingly, people actually set aside time to listen to podcasts. Often on their commute or in the evening after work.
<popey> Many users will get their downloads via RSS feeds, so as soon as you upload it, they can get it.
<popey> You might think "I can put out episodes when I like, people will still listen because they'll just get it when their RSS reader polls"
<popey> What people actually do is go looking for episodes on a specific day and at a pre-determined time. They get used to episodes coming out, and want to get it right away.
<popey> If you leave it too long the users forget you exist and will stop polling, and may even remove your feed from their clients
<popey>  
<popey> * Promote it
<popey> If you're an Ubuntu Member then you can blog about your show, and even syndicate the episodes on Planet Ubuntu - http://planet.ubuntu.com/
<popey> (if you're not a member, then get someone else who is to do it for you) :D
<popey> Ask other podcasters to promote your show, maybe you can create a trailer for them to play. That gives them instant content to play.
<popey> Put your show on iTunes (requires an iTunes account, get someone else to do submit it if you don't want to)
<popey>  
<popey> Finally...
<popey> * Keep doing it!
<popey> As I mentioned before, keep doing a show regularly and people will tune in!
<popey>  
<popey> That's all I have to say really. Questions/comments welcome :D
<ClassBot> mhall119 asked: How did you become so awesome?
<popey> I follow jono around.
<popey> some of it rubs off.
<popey> Right, I'm done then, thanks!
<ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
<JoeVancouver> Hello everyone! Thanks, popey for a great presentation. As ClassBot has mentioned, I will begin my session in about 10 minutes.
<ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || Event: Ubuntu Community Week - Current Session: Haters Gonna Hate: Grow Your Community With Less Negativity - Instructors: JoeVancouver - Slides: http://is.gd/yDkxjL
<ClassBot> Slides for Haters Gonna Hate: Grow Your Community With Less Negativity: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuCommunityWeek/oneiric/slides?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=session10.pdf
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/07/20/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
<JoeVancouver> Hello everyone!
<JoeVancouver> Thanks again to popey for a great session.
<JoeVancouver> My name is Joe Liau. I'm from the Ubuntu Vancouver Local Community.
<JoeVancouver> oday I will touch the surface of an issue that I feel needs more awareness.
<JoeVancouver> Please hold your questions until the end.
<JoeVancouver> Below are more in-depth references to topics that I will mention:
<JoeVancouver> The Art of Community by Jono Bacon (http://www.artofcommunityonline.org/)
<JoeVancouver> Producing Open Source Software by Karl Fogel (http://producingoss.com/)
<JoeVancouver> Community Anti-Patterns by Dave Neary (http://conference2010.meego.com/session/community-anti-patterns)
<JoeVancouver> Ubuntu for Human Beings by Disposable Joe (http://bit.ly/otbnlt)
<JoeVancouver> Ok. Let's begin!
<JoeVancouver> "Fear is the path to the dark side. Fear leads to anger. Anger leads to hate. Hate leads to suffering." --Yoda
<JoeVancouver> Hate is an obvious hindrance in any community.
<JoeVancouver> But, as in the quote above, there are many things that lead to hate that we need to be aware of.
<JoeVancouver> We'll call this "negativity".
<JoeVancouver> It is easy for communities to overlook negativity in an attempt to be open, friendly, and satisfy the hunger for resources.
<JoeVancouver> This is especially true for Ubuntu, where friendliness is part of the project's DNA. (Code of Conduct).
<JoeVancouver> Community membership policies need to be structured in a way that they are the best for the community as a whole instead of satisfying people individually.
<JoeVancouver> We need to be aware that negativity exists, know how to identify it, and defuse it at an early stage.
<JoeVancouver>  If we don't , we run the risk of being hijacked.
<JoeVancouver> We will now take a look at a few patterns of negativity and possible solutions.
<JoeVancouver> But, while we go over these things, I would like you to keep a two thoughts in mind. These are simple questions that you can ask yourself with every community interaction:
<JoeVancouver> 1. If I am not building up the community, then am I tearing it down? (Community-demolition-technician or CDT, because we all love and need acronyms)
<JoeVancouver> 2. Even if I am not hating on anyone, could I still be a source of hate? (Hate emitter or hate-o-tron)
<JoeVancouver> --Fear Patterns--
<JoeVancouver> "Cookie Lickers" --  This type of CDT follows the âThis is mine... for laterâ philosophy
<JoeVancouver> -Identification: I really want to help so I will volunteer, but in reality I don't have time to work on the project. Little or no progress in assigned task.
<JoeVancouver> -Downfall: Fear of failure or letting go
<JoeVancouver> -Negative Impact: Roadblocks in the project(s)
<JoeVancouver> -Solution(s): Set deadlines. If not met let people know that it's better to give up, than to hold us up. Please help out again when you have time.
<JoeVancouver> (I have been guilty of this ... :( )
<JoeVancouver> "Help Vampires" -- Hold my hand, and don't let go!
<JoeVancouver> -Identification: I need you to install Ubuntu for me (on my wristwatch). Oh, and Thunderbird. How do I add my e-mail account? What's smtp mean? How do I change my background? Where's the wifi switch on my laptop? Oh, one more thing...
<JoeVancouver> -Downfall: Fear of trying new things or not knowing everything
<JoeVancouver> -Negative Impact: Sucks time from your local community, and from your support resources, crowds your forum or mailing list etc.
<JoeVancouver> -Solution(s): Teach people how to fish. Have good documentation and community orientation. Try to encourage them to get a few basics down before dropping in. Pair them with other vampires  ;)
<JoeVancouver> In the Vancouver LoCo we created "Support Saturdays" to focus tech support issues to one event.
<JoeVancouver> "OADIs" -- Occasional Anonymous DropIns
<JoeVancouver> (This is a term invented by UVLC, home of my favourite local community :P)
<JoeVancouver> -Identification: You probably don't know me. I saw your event and wanted to check it out. No, I didn't RSVP. I lurked but never introduced myself. I am so anonymous.
<JoeVancouver> -Downfall: Fear of commitment; fear of revealing something, fear of truly becoming part of a community.
<JoeVancouver> -Negative Impact: No accountability. Could cause fear in others. Can disrupt events that have specific goals. Can impact event expenses. Can cause organizers to pull out hair and burn out.
<JoeVancouver> -Solution(s): Encourage and enforce RSVPs for events. When an OADI arrives, ask them if they RSVP'd. Introduce them to the group. Have them introduce themselves.
<JoeVancouver> We use meetup.com for RVSPs and attendance records
<JoeVancouver> "The Water Cooler" -- A place to talk about things. No one else needs to know.
<JoeVancouver> -Identification: Projects that seem to appear or progress with very limited input.
<JoeVancouver> -Downfall: Fear of community or inefficiency
<JoeVancouver> -Negative Impact: May cause shock or resentment in others who are part of the project.
<JoeVancouver> -Solution(s): The "glass house". Keep what you're doing open and visible, but you don't have to listen to everybody.
<JoeVancouver> There are many fears that can cause negative behaviour.
<JoeVancouver> Those are but a few.
<JoeVancouver> Keeping the community informed and educated is a good start to eliminate some of these fears.
<JoeVancouver> Why would we want to eliminate them?
<JoeVancouver> We want our community to thrive and grow beyond Mark Shuttleworth's wildest dreams. We want to do the right thing for the world. We want to fix bug #1.
<JoeVancouver> This leads us to our next section:
<JoeVancouver> --Anger Patterns-- (Often results of fear patterns)
<JoeVancouver> "The Black Hole" -- I'm currently travelling through time to finish a project. You won't see me again until last month.
<JoeVancouver> -Identification: Projects that seem to disappear for long periods of time.
<JoeVancouver> -Downfall: Angry at all the noise and bother
<JoeVancouver> -Negative Impact: Can lead to duplication of work (...from a month ago), project abandonment
<JoeVancouver> -Solution(s): Community outreach. Stay informed, and keep others informed.
<JoeVancouver> "RTFMers" -- Don't bother me unless you've read *everything*
<JoeVancouver> -Identification: Shut up! I don't care about your questions or helping you.
<JoeVancouver> -Downfall: Angry at new members; elitist attitude
<JoeVancouver> -Negative Impact: Discourages growth and diversity of membership
<JoeVancouver> -Solution(s): Code of conduct; delegation of help (assign newer people to simpler questions)
<JoeVancouver> "Headless Chicken" -- We're going somewhere...somewhere
<JoeVancouver> -Identification: Heavy disagreements, bike shed discussions
<JoeVancouver> -Downfall: Angry at other opinions and not being able to get own way
<JoeVancouver> -Negative Impact: Lack of progress and direction
<JoeVancouver> -Solution(s): Leadership; decisive authority. Encourage "doing" instead of "talking."
<JoeVancouver> In vancouver, we have had a few cases with this issue. It was not for lack of leadership, but others who refused to allow leadership.
<JoeVancouver> Some people just want to talk, and they like talking and discussing or arguing.
<JoeVancouver> We need leadership, and need to respect it.
<JoeVancouver> "Broken Record" -- Hi, It's me again...
<JoeVancouver> -Identification: I have reprimanded you countless times. You now filter out my e-mails.
<JoeVancouver> -Downfall: Anger toward the "broken record"
<JoeVancouver> -Negative Impact: Reluctance to contribute; animosity towards those who try to enforce
<JoeVancouver> -Solution(s): Spread enforcement work around. Quote policies; don't use opinions.
<JoeVancouver> --Hate Patterns--
<JoeVancouver> If we become angry enough, then we can start hating. But, there are also haters already out there, and haters gonna hate.
<JoeVancouver> "Broken Window" -- It's already broken...
<JoeVancouver> -Identification: Flame wars, wiki vandalism,  rude language
<JoeVancouver> -Downfall: Gateway for hate. If it already exists, it makes it easier for others to follow
<JoeVancouver> -Negative Impact: Broken windows = broken community
<JoeVancouver> -Solution(s): Document of best practices, policies, guidelines etc. Make it clear.
<JoeVancouver> "Poisonous People" -- We're looking for a fight
<JoeVancouver> -Identification: I'm a true hater. I have nothing good to say.
<JoeVancouver> -Downfall: Loves to hate
<JoeVancouver> -Negative Impact: Death of your community
<JoeVancouver> -Solution(s): Filter your membership. Fight with evidence rather than opinion.
<JoeVancouver> Yes, filter.
<JoeVancouver> There is a misconception in the Ubuntu world that we should let in all comers.
<JoeVancouver> That might not be wise.
<JoeVancouver> Instead, let's let in the community builders first.
<JoeVancouver> Then we can let in more when we are more established.
<JoeVancouver> "Other Bashers" -- Anything you can do, I can do better
<JoeVancouver> -Identification: Hating on other projects
<JoeVancouver> -Downfall: Elitism; hate for "others" ; tribalism
<JoeVancouver> -Negative Impact: Hurts open source philosophy and Ubuntu ethos
<JoeVancouver> -Solution(s): Dispel opinions. Use facts to compare projects.
<JoeVancouver> If you ever get the chance, ask sabdfl how he feels about "tribalism".
<JoeVancouver> In general if you are confronted by a tribal behaviour, the best thing you can do is to highlight what the projects have in common. Get them to see that we are all working together to achieve a common goal.
<JoeVancouver> --Other Solutions---
<JoeVancouver> Negativity exists in your community.
<JoeVancouver> We have to learn to be aware of it, identify it as early as possible, and learn how and when to deal with it.
<JoeVancouver> A few other tips and resources are below.
<JoeVancouver> Communication:
<JoeVancouver> - Ubuntu LoCos often have a strong online component. We are who our words are on the internet
<JoeVancouver> This is unfortunate, but doesn't have to be this way.
<JoeVancouver> Build a truly local community.
<JoeVancouver> Go out and find the 0.5% of your city/town that are using Ubuntu and meet them face-to-face.
<JoeVancouver> If you think that cannot be done, then I encourage you to check out my local community for an in-your-face counter-example.
<JoeVancouver> Talk to Randall.
<JoeVancouver> Otherwise please learn some online etiquette (eg http://www.sighworld.com/intq101)
<JoeVancouver> - Encourage offline gathering. Build your community face-to-face.
<JoeVancouver> And learn proper offline etiquette (possibly defined by your loco's policies)
<JoeVancouver> We host New Members Nights where we go over how our LoCo works, and members have developed a NURG (New Users Resource Guide)
<JoeVancouver> On or offline: -Be careful of your choice of language (eg. Avoid terms like ânerdsâ, âgeeksâ ânoobsâ, etc).
<JoeVancouver> Higher Powers:
<JoeVancouver> - Ubuntu Code of Conduct: http://www.ubuntu.com/community/conduct
<JoeVancouver> Everyone in your community should read this and abide by it.
<JoeVancouver> - Ubuntu Community Council: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CommunityCouncil
<JoeVancouver> If things go really sideways then there is an arbiter. Please use them, but only when you think it's beyond your level to repair.
<JoeVancouver> --Final Word--
<JoeVancouver> Communities are emotional places; they are more human than technical.
<JoeVancouver> It's important to be aware of the human aspects, both positive and negative.
<JoeVancouver> Communities are about working for the whole rather than the individual, but we can start with ourselves. Let's ask ourselves again:
<JoeVancouver> 1. If I am not building up the community, then am I tearing it down? (Am I a CDT?)
<JoeVancouver> 2. Even if I am not hating on anyone, could I still be a source of hate? (Am I a Darth Hater?)
<JoeVancouver> We should do self checkups once in a while as well as community "health" check ups. The point is not to create paranoia, but it is about awareness.
<JoeVancouver> If we want our community to grow, then we can't turn
<JoeVancouver> a blind eye to negative things; we have to deal with them properly.
<JoeVancouver> Remember: "If once you start down the dark path, forever will it dominate your destiny."
<JoeVancouver> References and resources again:
<JoeVancouver> The Art of Community by Jono Bacon (http://www.artofcommunityonline.org/)
<JoeVancouver> Producing Open Source Software by Karl Fogel (http://producingoss.com/)
<JoeVancouver> Community Anti-Patterns by Dave Neary (http://conference2010.meego.com/session/community-anti-patterns)
<JoeVancouver> Ubuntu for Human Beings by Disposable Joe (http://bit.ly/otbnlt)
<JoeVancouver> Ubuntu Code of Conduct: http://www.ubuntu.com/community/conduct
<JoeVancouver> Ubuntu Community Council: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CommunityCouncil
<JoeVancouver> Thank you for joining today. Please feel free to join in with questions or comments.
<JoeVancouver> !q
<ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
<JoeVancouver> I guess that's all from me. Thanks again for joining!
<ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || Event: Ubuntu Community Week - Current Session: How to Train Ninjas (session in Spanish) - Instructors: leogg - Slides: http://is.gd/qUTsTM
<ClassBot> Slides for How to Train Ninjas (session in Spanish): https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuCommunityWeek/oneiric/slides?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=session11.pdf
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/07/20/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
<leogg> hola!
<leogg> (this session is going to be held in Spanish, so if you want to practice your espaÃ±ol, please stay!) ;)
<leogg> hay gente que habla espaÃ±ol por acÃ¡?
<leogg> peguen un silbido en -chat para saber si estÃ¡n por ahÃ­ ;)
<leogg> recuerden que pueden hacer preguntas en #ubuntu-classroom-chat
<leogg> solo ponganles el prefijo QUESTION:
<leogg> yo no muerdo! :D - pregunten sin miedo, no existen preguntas demasiado obvias o tontas
<leogg> para los que no me conocen
<leogg> mi nombre es Leandro y soy de la comunidad Ubuntu en Nicaragua
<leogg> http://www.ubuntu.org.ni
<leogg> desde el aÃ±o pasado estoy en el LoCo Council de Ubuntu
<leogg> y una de nuestras tareas es apoyar a las comunidades locales en su desarrollo
<leogg> por eso esta charla (y tambiÃ©n porque me obligaron a darla) ;)
<leogg> gracias a todo el equipo detrÃ¡s del UCW por esta oportunidad de darla en espaÃ±ol!
<leogg> el dÃ­a de hoy voy a hablarles un poco sobre como construir (y hacer crecer a una) comunidad
<leogg> hay muchas comunidades increÃ­bles en nuestros paÃ­ses
<leogg> con gente realmente asombrosa que le echa muchas ganas y mucho entusiasmo
<leogg> sin embargo, por diversos motivos, algunas comunidades no despegan... no logran desarrrollarse y crecer
<leogg> hay mucha apatÃ­a
<leogg> los miembros no se involucran en las actividades de la comunidad
<leogg> no participan en los eventos y proyectos
<leogg> en algunas comunidades hay grandes conflictos y malos entendidos que terminan destruyendo a la comunidad
<leogg> y como resultado, alejan a toda persona con un genuino interÃ©s en colaborar
<leogg> voy a ser sincero (y desengaÃ±arlos desde un inicio)
<leogg> no hay receta mÃ¡gica o fÃ³rmula misteriosa para una comunidad Ã©xitosa
<leogg> pero sÃ­ hay pasos concretos que podemos tomar para alcanzar nuestro mÃ¡ximo potencial
<leogg> y eso es lo que voy a compartir con ustedes el dÃ­a de hoy
<leogg> (les recuerdo nuevamente que pueden hacer preguntas en #ubuntu-classroom-chat)
<leogg> 1. establecer las reglas del juego desde un inicio
<leogg> es importante contar con un ambiente positivo, en el que de gusto trabajar, y que nos lleve a alcanzar nuestras metas como colectivo
<leogg> en la comunidad de Ubuntu nos regimos por un cÃ³digo de conducta (Code of Conduct o CoC, en inglÃ©s)
<leogg> http://www.ubuntu.org.ve/codigodeconducta
<leogg> que es bÃ¡sicamente un documento que nos recuerda que debemos actuar con respeto y consideraciÃ³n hacÃ­a los demÃ¡s
<leogg> son normas bÃ¡sicas de convivencia y civismo que estÃ¡n plasmadas en un documento oficial
<leogg> el CoC puede ser un poco general, asÃ­ que tambiÃ©n se puede elaborar lineamientos mÃ¡s especificos para prevenir y combatir problemas puntuales...
<leogg> ...como el abuso de los recursos de la comunidad:
<leogg> http://linuxtour.org/Listiqueta
<leogg> o el hostigamiento:
<leogg> http://linuxtour.org/PoliticaSobreAcoso
<leogg> (desgraciadamente algo mÃ¡s comÃºn de lo que se cree en nuestras comunidades)
<leogg> lo importante es dejar bien claras las reglas del juego desde un inicio y asegurarse de que todos las conozcan y las respeten
<leogg> 2. transparencia en el manejo de la comunidad
<leogg> puede sonar como algo elemental, pero es un error bastante comÃºn
<leogg> idealmente, toda decisiÃ³n debe ser discutida y consensuada entre los miembros de la comunidad
<leogg> digo 'idealmente' porque hay veces que toca tomar decisiones unilaterales
<leogg> como regla general; traten de discutir abiertamente los problemas de la comunidad y llegar a soluciones basadas en el consenso
<leogg> sean accesibles
<leogg> mantengan siempre abiertos los canales de comunicaciÃ³n entre los lÃ­deres de la comunidad y la base
<leogg> esto contribuye al manejo transparente de la comunidad y permite a los miembros sentirse parte importante del proceso
<leogg> 3. promover el relevo
<leogg> no se trata simplemente de un cambio de personas en la coordinaciÃ³n de la comunidad
<leogg> es mÃ¡s bien un proceso formativo
<leogg> en donde los miembros mÃ¡s experimentados 'entrenan' a los 'nuevos' para que exista un relevo a mediano y largo plazo
<leogg> una buena forma de 'entrenar' a los 'nuevos ninjas' es asignÃ¡ndoles tareas y responsabilidades dentro de la comunidad
<leogg> algo importante:
<leogg> hay que evitar la tentaciÃ³n de querer hacer las cosas uno mismo cuando el trabajo no se hace correctamente/al ritmo deseado
<leogg> como dije; es un proceso y toma tiempo... hay que tener paciencia
<leogg> tambiÃ©n hay que estar claro de que los errores forman parte de todo proceso de formaciÃ³n y hay que dejar que la gente aprenda de ellos
<leogg> por Ãºltimo, creo que para construir las bases sÃ³lidas de una comunidad se debe:
<leogg> 4. promover la diversidad
<leogg> nuestra comunidad es muy especial
<leogg> en apariencia somos una comunidad formada alrededor de las tecnologÃ­as de la informaciÃ³n y la comunicaciÃ³n
<leogg> somos una comunidad geek; de informÃ¡ticos, por informÃ¡ticos, y en la mayorÃ­a de los casos para informÃ¡ticos
<leogg> y errÃ³neamente pensamos que una persona sin conocimientos o formaciÃ³n informÃ¡tica no tiene mucho que aportar a la comunidad
<leogg> nada mÃ¡s alejado de la realidad!
<leogg> una comunidad sana se nutre y se beneficia de personas con una gran diversidad de conocimientos y habilidades
<leogg> aparte de desarrolladores, se necesitan traductores, escritores, artistas, abogados, diseÃ±adores, etc.
<leogg> facilitar el ingreso de estas personas a la comunidad es muy importante
<leogg> (recuerden que pueden hacer preguntas en #ubuntu-classroom-chat, solo ponganles el prefijo QUESTION:)
<leogg> (si nadie hace preguntas voy a comenzar a auto-interrogarme) :D
<leogg> ok, voy a ir cerrando con un par de consejos finales
<leogg> *el trabajo de un lÃ­der es motivar e inspirar*
<leogg> coordinar y tomar decisiones es solo una parte del trabajo
<leogg> la tarea mÃ¡s importante de un lÃ­der es aprender a motivar a los miembros de la comunidad para que se involucren en las diferentes tareas y proyectos
<leogg> no basta con reconocer el esfuerzo de los miembros de la comunidad (aunque sÃ­ es muy importante!)
<leogg> tambiÃ©n hay que hacerles sentir que estÃ¡n haciendo algo Ãºtil y que les puede resultar beneficioso en el futuro (su futuro)
<leogg> por ejemplo
<leogg> para un estudiante universitario, sin experiencia laboral, el organizar un evento o dar una charla es una excelente forma de sumar experiencia en su hoja de vida
<leogg> para un diseÃ±ador grÃ¡fico, los diseÃ±os que hace para la comunidad pueden servir como vitrina para conseguir algÃºn trabajo relacionado
<leogg> para un abogado que se involucra con la comunidad, aprender sobre licencias libres le puede llevar a especializarse en la materia y conseguir nuevos clientes
<leogg> etc.
<leogg> hay muchos otros aspectos que son importantes en la construcciÃ³n de una comunidad, pero creo que ya los aburrÃ­ lo suficiente, asÃ­ que termino con:
<leogg> *diviÃ©rtete!!!*
<leogg> hacer un solo tipo de evento puede a la larga resultar muy cansado y aburrido
<leogg> planifica actividades sociales con los miembros de tu comunidad
<leogg> no importa si es salir a jugar fÃºtbol, tomar una cerveza, ver una pelÃ­cula, celebrar un cumpleaÃ±os... <INSERTAR_ACTIVIDAD_FAVORITA_AQUÃ> ...las actividades sociales no deben ser subestimadas
<leogg> estas ayudan ENORMEMENTE a crear lazos y promover la cohesiÃ³n del grupo
<leogg> una comunidad feliz es la que se divierte y se siente bien con el trabajo que hace
<leogg> ...
<leogg> si no hay preguntas, terminamos aquÃ­ <-------------
<leogg> muchas gracias!
<ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
<leogg> enjoy the rest of the week!
<leogg> thank you pleia2
<ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || Event: Ubuntu Community Week - Current Session: Working With Other Groups In Your Community - Instructors: pleia2 - Slides: http://is.gd/YbsRzW
<ClassBot> Slides for Working With Other Groups In Your Community: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuCommunityWeek/oneiric/slides?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=session12.pdf
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/07/20/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
<pleia2> Hi everyone!
<pleia2> Today I'm here to talk to you about "Working with Other Groups In Your Community"
<pleia2> My name is Elizabeth Krumbach, I'm the senior systems administrator for a small Linux tech services provider based out of Philadelphia but these days I call San Francisco, California my home (hooray for telecommuting!)
<pleia2> questions throughout the sesssion are welcome, you want to ask them in #ubuntu-classroom-chat and begin your question like with QUESTION:
<pleia2> for instance
<pleia2> QUESTION: Do you like cats?
<pleia2> except they should probably be on-topic for the talk :)
<ClassBot> semitones asked: could you answer your own question regarding cats please?
<pleia2> Haha, sure, I love cats, I have 2 of them :)
<ClassBot> mhall119 asked: Do your cats run linux?
<pleia2> of course! We don't run anything else here at home (well, my fiance might have a macbook...)
<pleia2> alright, so let's get going on this topic of working with other groups!
<pleia2> I first got involved with LoCo teams back in 2007 when I was living in Pennsylvania and am now one of the three leaders of the Ubuntu California team
<pleia2> From this experience I'll talk a bit about some of the tips and challenges related to working with existing tech groups in your area, reaching out to hackerspaces and some success stories from teams who have done work with learning centers and schools
<pleia2> As a bit of an introduction I figured I'd talk a little about how I got to where I am with LoCo teams
<pleia2> Prior to my involvement with a LoCo team I had been running a LinuxChix.org chapter in Philadelphia (PhillyChix) since 2003
<pleia2> This is us! http://phillychix.org/images/chix/meeting03.jpg
<pleia2> And in 2005 I resurrected the Montgomery County Linux Users Group
<pleia2> us! http://www.phillylinux.org/images/buxmontlug_111405.jpg
<pleia2> So I'd been involved with local groups for a while, and when the Ubuntu team came along I added it to my list of cool groups to work with
<pleia2> However, this isn't how everyone feels when they start up a LoCo, I can't count the number of times I've had people tell me that they can't start a LoCo because there is already a LUG or other tech group in their area
<pleia2> So I want to make clear that it's not a competition, LoCos and other tech groups can benefit greatly by collaborating :)
<pleia2> Here are just some ways LoCos I've worked with have helped LUGs I was a part of:
<pleia2>  * You can providing presenters specializing in Ubuntu-related topics for meetings and events
<pleia2>  * Your LoCo team may bring new members into the LUG: a lot of newcomers to Linux find Ubuntu LoCos before they even know what LUGs are
<pleia2>  * You may be providing a supply of Ubuntu CDs to their attendees (whether they be burned or pressed ones that approved teams get)
<pleia2>  * Often times you can offer their members a more diverse set of planned events to attend - many LUGs in my area *ask* me to cross post our Ubuntu events to their mailing lists!
<pleia2> You can also plan coffee/food get-togethers of your LoCo right before a LUG meeting, with a plan to go all to the LUG meeting after
<pleia2> I schedule the San Francisco Ubuntu Hour an hour prior to and across the street from the regular Debian Dinners and it helps attendance at both
<pleia2> plus it's pretty fun to get Ubuntu and Debian folks together :) there is often a lot of overlap and it's fun to hear about how people are using both
<pleia2> I've been really fortunate to work with great LUGs over the years and have never had a problem
<pleia2> However, it can sometimes be a challenge to work with an existing LUG if you don't know them well and they view your group as taking away from their membership, so if this starts to happen to you I recommend:
<pleia2>  * Respect them, they were there first so don't plan things that conflict with their events
<pleia2>  * Show them ways you can help them, as outlined above
<pleia2> Any questions about working with LUGs?
<ClassBot> semitones asked: Is it easier or harder if a LUG is relatively far away
<pleia2> good question, it really depends on the culture of your area
<pleia2> in some areas people don't mind driving an hour+ to get to an event (I did this when I was living near Philadelphia)
<pleia2> so you have to ake considerations for that when you're considering potental event conflicts or how closely you want to work with them
<pleia2> here in San Francisco I find it's pretty rare for people to attend things that are even 30 minutes away :)
<pleia2> Beyond LUGs you also have other tech groups. Last October members from the California Team gave a couple presentations at the The Silicon Valley LAMP Meetup Group on LAMP (Linux Apache Mysql PHP/Perl/Python) in Maverick
<pleia2> Details from that event are here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CaliforniaTeam/Projects/LightingTheMaverickLAMP
<pleia2> At that event not only where there presentations, but also some giveaways and a little session where people could try out the new Ubuntu release
<pleia2> If you have a local hackerspace (hackerspaces.org to find one near you) I highly recommend reaching out to them for event space
<pleia2> For the Lucid release party last year Ubuntu California had our event at a hackerspace in San Francisco: http://princessleia.com/images/journalpics/062010/lynx_release_installfest_03.jpg
<pleia2> Now you may need to have a hackerspace member sponsor your event, rules vary between spaces. For this one we had a member sponsor who was also part of our LoCo
<pleia2> A lot of areas also have computer recycling centers, many of which do some kind of reuse program typically aimed at getting computers to lower income groups or having work programs that allow people to do a certain number work and take home a computer at the end
<pleia2> These computer recycling centers are really awesome for LoCo teams to work with if they're open to the idea of deploying Linux on (some of) their machines!
<pleia2> Back in Pennsylvania we worked with Nonprofit Technology Resources (NTR) in Philadelphia on several projects, including:
<pleia2>  * Putting together dual boot systems with Windows: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PennsylvaniaTeam/CommunityOutreachTeam/NTRDualBootImage
<pleia2> this was a bit of a compromise that the team lived with, we wanted just Linux but couldn't make it happen
<pleia2> but in the process everyone learned a lot and NTR greatly benefited from the open source imaging tools we were using
<pleia2>  * Training them to install lightweight Linux on systems: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PennsylvaniaTeam/CommunityOutreachTeam/NtrTraining
<pleia2>  * Working through their piles of old laptops to help sort and install Linux on the ones Windows wouldn't run on: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PennsylvaniaTeam/CommunityOutreachTeam/NtrLaptopProject
<pleia2> Now I wasn't involved with this project, but I did approach another recycling program in Ephrata (a couple hours from downtown Philadelphia) which, while wasn't open to installing Ubuntu as a default, did have requests from time to time for alternatives to Windows
<pleia2> They had one part-time volunteer who had expertise in Linux, but with the challenges that older hardware brought he frequently needed tips from others - this is where the LoCo team came in! He could drop us an email or forum post at any time and we'd do our best to help
<pleia2> So, hackerspaces, tech groups, lugs, tech recycling programs - are we preaching to the choir? How about going beyond the normal techie crowd?
<pleia2> When I was back in Pennsylvania a couple members of the team reached out to Mt Airy Learning Tree (MALT), an adult education center where they took old PCs from a local computer recycling program and set up a networked Linux Lab for them
<pleia2> In the case someone in the team had a contact with MALT and was able to make the arrangements to bring the team in, but this isn't all that unusual, perhaps you know of a center that could use a computer lab, or someone else in your team has worked with one :)
<pleia2> Ask around, make an introduction and make it happen!
<pleia2> How about schools?
<pleia2> Getting into schools can be a tricky one, but not impossible
<pleia2> Last year the Pennsylvania Team was invited to a roundtable at Millersville University discussing Open Source options, the event was very well-attended
<pleia2> Page about the event: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PennsylvaniaTeam/EventsTeam/MillersvilleUniversityFOSS2010
<pleia2> And a writeup w/ link to photos on facebook can be found here: http://ubuntupennsylvania.org/?p=60
<pleia2> (unfortunately this happened 2 days after I moved, so I couldn't attend!)
<pleia2> Anyway, if your team is approached with such an opportunity I highly recommend taking them up on it! Higher education institutes also often have computer clubs that you can work with whose reach is further into the wider student body
<pleia2> Unfortunately my experience here in the US getting into public primary schools is nearly impossible, they are government run and there is a considerable amount of bureaucracy and funding politics
<pleia2> There are also laws and regulations in place to protect children limiting non-parent adults in schools while they are in session and working with children, some areas even go as far as doing background checks and getting fingerprints of non-parent volunteers
<pleia2> But it's not hopeless! I'm a member of the non-profit partimus.org which works with a few schools in the San Francisco Bay Area to put Ubuntu desktops into schools
<pleia2> How did we do it? We are fortunate to have an out-going leader who approached a couple charter schools in the area about setting up a free lab in their schools
<pleia2> Here in the US charter schools are public schools but outside the realms of the traditional public school, so they have their own funding structure and a lot more flexibility to spend the money they get from the government in creative ways
<pleia2> wikipedia has more information about them: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charter_school
<pleia2> we've found that the schools in our area focused on great teachers and let things like their building and computer facilities languish, so when approached with an opportunity for a non-profit to provide them with a lab they are often very excited about the idea
<pleia2> Through those first couple of schools the word spread and we're now in 5 schools and an after school program, one of those schools is actually a traditional public school and we manage the lab for their library, more here: http://partimus.org/projects.php
<pleia2> When Partimus needs volunteers a call is put out to several local LUG lists and Ubuntu California, our project page about it can be found here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CaliforniaTeam/Projects/Partimus
<pleia2> Most important about this story is that Ubuntu California has teamed up with an existing non-profit to make this happen so even if you don't feel able to approach schools on your own there may be someone inside a school working toward this already! Or some existing non-profit in your area you can work with!
<pleia2> It's really all about connections when working with these kinds of organizations in your area
<pleia2> So, how do you make these connections?
<pleia2> This is one way you can really engage folks in your team who may not know how else they can help!
<pleia2> Ask others in your LoCo whether they know of any local organizations which can benefit from a presentation on open source or help with a computer lab, perhaps some of your members have worked with after school programs or other community centers
<pleia2> From there, ask them to ask their friends and family the same and look around for non-profits in the area specializing in bringing technology to local groups
<pleia2> Even if they're not using open source now, it can be a great way to find people who are on the ground doing work and expose them to the options - and most of all offer them help and support with the open source options
<pleia2> But what if you really can't find anyone with connections?
<pleia2> lcafiero's question fits perfectly in with this!
<ClassBot> lcafiero asked: Speaking about missionary work, how about other areas like farmers markets? In Felton (Santa Cruz County) we have had success promoting Linux in general, including Ubuntu, at a farmers market at the "organic software" table
<pleia2> Earlier this week Charlene Tessier did a great presentation on "Marketing Ubuntu at Your Local Farmer's Markets" which she blogged about here: http://frenchfortunecookie.wordpress.com/2011/07/20/ucw-marketing-ubuntu-at-local-festivals-and-markets/
<pleia2> I highly recommend reading the logs from that session if you're unfamiliar with the work of the Vancouvery LoCo team reaching out to traditionally less technical groups
<pleia2> Off the top of my head I know the New Jersey team has set up booths at a local Flea Market, and North Carolina had a booth at a goat festival
<pleia2> You meet all kinds of people, and while you're at these booths you can offer presentations on open source and system and computer lab assistance to people you meet who are involved with local organizations!
<ClassBot> semitones asked: Any tips on how to get started letting people know about Ubuntu with a small stack of cds and a sign?
<pleia2> I'd recommend taking that small stack of CDs and sign to some kind of event in your community
<pleia2> lcafiero mentioned farmers markets, up in Berkeley every year we also participate in a "main street" event called the Solano Stroll
<pleia2> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CaliforniaTeam/Projects/SolanoStroll2010 is our project page from last year
<pleia2> here's a picture of the crowd: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CaliforniaTeam/Projects/SolanoStroll2010?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=Solano2010_2.jpg
<pleia2> we were just one of those many, many booths :)
<pleia2> now often times these booths can cost money, but if you team up with a non-profit in your area you can often get the booths for much cheaper, or free, in the case of the Solano Stroll the booth is run by Partimus and Ubuntu California folks volunteer
<ClassBot> dscassel93 asked: LoCos can cover large areas. Have you had any luck (or can you share stories) about reaching out to groups outside your city or town?
<pleia2> I know some folks who drive all over their large area to attend events, in Pennsylvania we have two major cities - Philadelphia and Pittsburgh which are about 6 hours apart
<pleia2> we've had folks drive across the state for them!
<pleia2> from Pennsylvania I've driven to New Jersey and New York to attend events, and here in California I flew down to Los Angeles for a booth and ubucon at the southern california linux expo
<pleia2> it can be tricky to help with events if you can't physically make it, but there are administrative tasks involved with events that people can do from anywhere
<pleia2> setting up the event on loco.ubuntu.com, sending out email reminders about the event, recruiting volunteers, following up after the event to make sure the people who took photos get those photos put somewhere online
<pleia2> the FreeGeekPenn group I worked with in Pennsylvania was located about an hour from where I lived, but we mostly helped by giving them online and over the phone support
<pleia2> I only actually visited their location once or twice
<pleia2> any other questions?
<ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
<pleia2> I'll wrap up by saying all the collaborations I've been a part of with other local groups have been very rewarding for everyone involved, your LoCo doesn't have to be alone out there!
<pleia2> and I'll be here through through the end of my time here to answer any other questions that pop up :)
<ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
<ClassBot> semitones asked: are there any materials that are already made like printable cd sleeves that would help with working with other groups?
<pleia2> great question!
<pleia2> http://spreadubuntu.org/ has lots of that kind of materials
<pleia2> my own California team also has a repository of resources, which includes fliers and sleeves in bzr: https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-california
<pleia2> (we should do a better job of contributing these to spreadubuntu)
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/07/20/%23ubuntu-classroom.html
<pleia2> well, that's it! thanks everyone :)
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat ||
<psssss> Ã·Ã¬Ã Ã±Ã¨ÃªÃ¨
#ubuntu-classroom 2011-07-21
<mistifel>  
<mistifel>  
<philipballew>  
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || Event: Ubuntu Community Week - Current Session: How To Raise Your Team's Activity Level. Energize! - Instructors: Cheri703, paultag - Slides: http://is.gd/Tknn6Q
<ClassBot> Slides for How To Raise Your Team's Activity Level. Energize!: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuCommunityWeek/oneiric/slides?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=session13.pdf
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/07/21/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
<Cheri703> Ok, Welcome folks!
<Cheri703> Paultag is having a crazy day at work, so I am stepping in for him
<Cheri703> He gave me his notes, so I'll do the best I can (I found out about this about an hour and a half ago ;) )
<Cheri703> paultag is currently a member of the Massachusetts LoCo, and a former member of the Ohio LoCo
<Cheri703> I'm an Ohio person, I'm on our team's "council", just as a reference point.
<Cheri703> In his notes, I'm told to "give props to those who need props given" so if you need props from paultag, consider them received. :)
<Cheri703> A big thank you to Randall and all of those who have put together this community week as well.
<Cheri703> Ok, so when you have a team that has sort of petered out, people are just stagnant, there are lots of things that can be done.
<Cheri703> The number one thing is to hold *REGULAR* events
<Cheri703> Ubuntu Hours, Global Jams, Conferences, visiting LUGs, etc
<Cheri703> Ohio team encourages ANYONE to start an Ubuntu hour in their area, some of the group is very spread out, so we would rather have 2-3 person events than none because they're too far away
<Cheri703> (oh, also, feel free to ask questions/make suggestions or comments in #ubuntu-classroom-chat as I go along)
<Cheri703> As stated earlier in the week, going to community events is a great way to get participation from members as well.
<Cheri703> The next major area to focus on is building a strong core.
<Cheri703> actually, I'm going to go back to Ubuntu Hours, sorry
<Cheri703> Different areas do things differently, I'm sure, but with our local U-Hours, we try to be very flexible about how they're done.
<Cheri703> Some people don't want to come out if it's purely social, some don't want to come out if it's a "lesson" on something
<Cheri703> We tend to play it by ear, welcoming anyone and discussing whatever is important to someone on that night.
<Cheri703> Ok, back to building a strong core
<Cheri703> Make use of your team's IRC Channel!
<Cheri703> Try to make sure there are 2 or more people in there at all times, so if folks wander through, or someone who has been inactive for a long time logs back on, they see that there is at least some life.
<Cheri703> Even if there's no response right away, it at least feels like there's life.
<Cheri703> Team mailing lists are an incredibly useful tool, even if they can be contentious at times.
<Cheri703> Some people disagree about the level of discussion that is appropriate (ONLY things affecting the entire team as a whole vs things that affect regional areas only)
<Cheri703> but using the list to announce events, welcome new folks, ask questions, etc helps raise activity, raise awareness of what's going on around the LoCo, and keep it on the radar for people
<Cheri703> Folks are busy, things get pushed aside, so having at least some activity on the list helps keep people aware of what the team is doing.
<Cheri703> A good course is to find the "center of mass", find where people tend to communicate most (mailing list, IRC, forum) and push events there, make sure that people know what you're doing.
<Cheri703> Allow people to take the lead on initiating/planning events
<Cheri703> Let people experience the community from different viewpoints
<Cheri703> This allows not only excitement and passion to reinvigorate things, it also lets people see WHY there may have been stumbling blocks, seeing where the sticking points are can lead to ideas and solutions.
<Cheri703> Be sure that the workload is being distributed. DELEGATE!
<Cheri703> Burnout is high among Ubuntu Volunteers, and nothing causes stagnation of a group faster than the ONE person who ALWAYS did EVERYTHING disappearing. No one knows what is going on, what progress has been made on projects, and where to pick up again.
<Cheri703> By including many people in the process, you encourage their participation as well as making sure that if something comes up, the work can continue.
<Cheri703> Another key to building and supporting your core is to THANK people
<Cheri703> Thank EARLY and OFTEN.
<Cheri703> People need validation. Many people get turned off to helping (in any context) if they are not thanked for their efforts.
<Cheri703> As volunteers, the only "payoff" to doing these things is to know that you made a difference in some way, even if it was small
<Cheri703> Whether that is "OMG I couldn't have finished that without your help, thank you!" or "wow, great idea coming up with this event" whatever it is, THANK people for participating
<Cheri703> This is no one's job (well, a few Canonical folks), so do not feel that people "owe" it to anyone
<Cheri703> Fostering a community-wide "attitude of gratitude" can do wonders for the health of a group. Resentment poisons groups very quickly.
<Cheri703> I'm going to pause for a moment, any questions/comments/suggestions so far?
<Cheri703> Ok, moving on. :)
<Cheri703> The next topic is a critical area that all LoCos have to deal with at some point: Poisonous people
<Cheri703> While the Ubuntu Community is open to all, it is important to have HIGH standards for your group.
<paultag> Sorry I'm late, everyone. Crazy day
<paultag> I'll let Cheri703 keep going, she ROCKS!
<Cheri703> The Code of Conduct is a good place to start, and having it a part of the team site is a good introduction for new members.
<Cheri703> Expecting at least a base level of polite/civil interaction amongst members (on IRC, Mailing List, Forum, etc) is important. This helps the members that might be affected by poisonous people feel comfortable speaking up and voicing concerns.
<Cheri703> Paultag mentions ensuring that poisonous people are removed from the community, either on their own, or by force if needed. Since he's here, I'm going to ask him to elaborate on that, as he's probably had more experience than I have.
<paultag> Sure :)
<paultag> The problem with having people around who start these little nit-picks, or other nasty stuff (it's not just limited to being hard-to-work-with) is that you end up spending 90% of your time working with this one person, who basically talks louder then other people
<paultag> examples include people who RE: to every single person who comments on a mailing list (to make it look like there's an argument, when it's just one or two people), not to mention people who FUD any action that might be taken
<paultag> bringing up something (like the color of a Bikeshead next to this *huge* nuclear plant to keep the worker's bikes, rather then the plant it's self) wastes everyone's time
<paultag> the issue then becomes new members don't feel welcome to voice ideas or changes, because they'll get bikeshead-ed
<paultag> these types of people should be told of what they're doing ( make absolutely sure to not take an enthusiastic new member for one of these nasty people, they can be similar, but hugely different )
<paultag> and if the issue remains unresolved, asked to leave. If they will no, instating a ban, or removal from the team is in order. Remember the person will make a big fuss and attempt to bikeshead and FUD what you're doing. Carry on, and involve the whole team.
<paultag> That's really been what I've had to deal with and how I've dealt with it in the past, and it really seems to work :)
<paultag> Cheri703: what's next, captin? :)
<paultag> *captain :)
<Cheri703> Useful link: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-4216011961522818645  "How Open Source Projects Survive Poisonous people"
<Cheri703> Remember: LoCos are an official Ubuntu team. Ensure all functions of the team live up to our community standards
<Cheri703> Final main topic to cover: Fostering a spirit of inclusive collaboration over exclusive clubbing
<Cheri703> LoCos are a fantastic way into the Ubuntu community, be sure  to help anyone who is serious about contributing. You're investing time for a payoff down the road.
<Cheri703> Many people feel more comfortable meeting face to face with people, ESPECIALLY non-technical folks
<Cheri703> They are more likely to go from "hey, I use ubuntu" to "I'm part of the ubuntu community" if they can participate with LoCo events.
<Cheri703> Not everyone likes to hang out on IRC on their lunch break ;)
<Cheri703> Make sure that the smaller regional events are being welcoming as well. There have been many instances where the state-wide group is super welcoming, but the events happening in a particular town are very exclusionary and elitist "oh, you don't know about *that*? psh" type of things
<Cheri703> The more welcome these new folks feel, the more encouraged they'll be to explore further aspects of the community and contributing.
<Cheri703> When there are lots of new members, be sure to hold how-to sessions and regular Q&As with them. Be outstandingly nice, they'll remember it.
<Cheri703> I have to toss in a personal anecdote:
<Cheri703> I had been puttering around the Ubuntu IRC channels for a while, and sort of by chance discovered that there was an Ohio group (didn't know LoCos existed). paultag was one of the first people I talked to on the LoCo IRC channel, and he was SO enthusiastic and welcoming, it made me super excited to find out more and be part of the group. :)
<Cheri703> Oh, and one other note about being welcoming:
<Cheri703> MAKE SURE WOMEN FEEL COMFORTABLE!!
<Cheri703> If you find that a. you don't have many women showing up, or b. they show up and then never come back, get in touch with the Ubuntu-Women project for thoughts, ideas, etc on how to foster an environment that is welcoming to ALL.
<Cheri703> That about wraps it up for my comments, unless paultag has anything else to share, then we can open it up for Q&A. :)
<Cheri703> Thank you for attending!
<paultag> Q/A sounds good to me :)
<ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
<Cheri703> !question
<Cheri703> bah, ok
<ClassBot> JoeVancouver asked: Sorry, I missed most of this presentation, so maybe you answered. Before making women feel comfortable, what is your #1 for attracting them to your events?
<Cheri703> in #ubuntu-classroom-chat: <pleia2> JoeVancouver: the how-to encourage women in linux has a great section about this: http://tldp.org/HOWTO/Encourage-Women-Linux-HOWTO/x168.html#AEN231
<Cheri703> *to clarify my earlier statement, about making women feel comfortable: Make sure that you nip any crappy behavior in the bud, make sure that you don't have *that guy* that corners the women and want to talk and follow her around (I realize that's stereotypical, but it happens), and having non-sketchy locations helps as well. Non-bars, not in bad parts of town, etc.
<Cheri703> Also on welcoming women: http://wiki.ubuntu-women.org/BestPractices
<ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || Event: Ubuntu Community Week - Current Session: An Overview of LoCo Guidance - Instructors: czajkowski - Slides: http://is.gd/gUp4tN
<ClassBot> Slides for An Overview of LoCo Guidance: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuCommunityWeek/oneiric/slides?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=session14.pdf
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/07/21/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
<czajkowski> ah... firstly there are no slides :)
<czajkowski> Aloha!!
<czajkowski> Aloha!!
<czajkowski> Welcome to todays  topic in the Ubuntu Community Week schedule. An Overview of LoCo Guidance
<czajkowski> My name is Laura Czajkowski and am a member of the Ubuntu LoCo Council.
<czajkowski> I'm Irish, living in London at present and currently looking out at the London Eye while it is raining in July! so much for summer eh!  Lets get cracking!
<czajkowski> So we're going to start with a little back ground and history on the council and then teams as it has come to light that not everyone is sure of what the Loco Council (LC) doand how they can help you and your team.
<czajkowski> I'll ask at points if you want to ask questions ok.
<czajkowski> There are 6 of us on the council Laura Czajkowski / czajkowski Alan Pope / popey
<czajkowski> Christophe Sauthier / huats Chris Crisafulli / itnet7  Paul Tagliamonte / paultag
<czajkowski> Leandro Gomez / leogg and we are elected by the CC for a 2 year term. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LoCoCouncil/
<czajkowski> We are elected to help you loco team members help your team be as active and prodcutive as possible.
<czajkowski> You can find most of us on irc either on our home team channels or hanging out in #ubuntu-locoteams
<czajkowski> If you join that channel and need help or want our attention or find out how to contact us you can  use the command
<czajkowski> !lococouncil
<czajkowski> < ubot4> lococouncil is The Loco Council is itnet7, czajkowski, paultag, huats, leogg, popey - they are there to help, just ask! :) You can send them an email at loco-council@lists.ubuntu.com
<czajkowski> PLease be patient , we may not be online and only some of us run screen sessions, you can always email us
<czajkowski> Emails are moderated so don't be alarmed we will get back to you, and you don't need to suscrbibe to the list.
<czajkowski> Each month we meet, mostly to work on approvals and re approvals, but we also encourage team members to add items to agenda so we can disucsss them.
<czajkowski> If you have an issue in your team, or want to discuss something that could be benefical to other teams you can add this to the agenda up to the day before the meeting.
<czajkowski> Each team should have a TEAM CONTACT some call this a TEAM LEADER and some teams have a TEAM CONTACT  *AND* a TEAM LEADER
<czajkowski> If a team has an issue they can contact their team leader/contact and get them to contact us so we can step in and help
<czajkowski> There is no shame or issue or anything to be worried about if people contact us to help.
<czajkowski> We encourage teams to contact us, it's what we are elected here to help and do so don't be shy and please don't be annoyed with members who do contact us.
<czajkowski> any Questions so far?
<czajkowski> okie dokie, moving on
<czajkowski> So how we can help:
<czajkowski> 1) Guidance
<czajkowski> Sometimes people are in charge of a team where they don't know what to do either it's a new team or a team that needs a bit of revamp and that is not a bad thing.
<czajkowski> It can be a case of never having led a team before or working with a diverse team spread over some distance.
<czajkowski> We can help!!
<czajkowski> We do Encourage teams to have some formal ways to operate but do realise this may not be suitable for all teams, however we see it as best practice.
<czajkowski> To make this easier on teams and people if you break it down into a cycle based way to get a team into shape it helps.
<czajkowski> Nothing can be done in one week, one month or even one cycle, just remember that
<czajkowski> Some teams are extremly formal, and it works for them, but it's a case of trial and error, if you are a small team, do you need a council? or are you better off with a team contact and people to help you informally?
<czajkowski>  
<czajkowski> If a team has a monthly meeting, that lets people know how they are doing, create an Agenda page, let ANYONE add items to it, either nominate a set chair for each meeting or have one per
<czajkowski> cycle or in some cases this is the team contact who chairs the meeting.
<czajkowski> Simple thing many people forget to do is let the people who cannot attend know what is going on this also works by A) letting them know what's going on in the team B) encourages them to possbly get involved if possible.
<czajkowski> post these to the mailing list/forums
<czajkowski> I cannot stress how important it is to keep a wiki page with the mins and logs of the meetings, this will help you and your team when it comes to approval or re approval. The council will be able to see how active you are.
<czajkowski>  
<czajkowski> Keeping a monthly team report is a really good idea also, as this helps show you your team how you are doing, if you're going from having 5 events a cycle to 1, then there is something up, but also it helps again when it comes for approval and re approval.
<czajkowski> A suggestion to make it easy is nominate one person to create the wiki page and add the basic content such as IRC team meeting or meet up, the post to the mailing list
<czajkowski> anyone else then did any Ubuntu work or work the team may be interested in can add it to the wiki.
<czajkowski> We have seen people get cranky over wiki edits, it's a wiki, anyone can edit it, add content to it.  Let's all try and get along and work together with one another
<czajkowski>  
<czajkowski> The next thing you can do is set down the goals you want to do each cycle.
<czajkowski> It doesn't have to be something massive like a conference, if it's an outing that's not even geeky related, have a talk something that the team can get behind and work towards.
<czajkowski> *SHARE tasks*, but also remember this is a voluntary work you are doing the same as your team members so if things are slow in happening, offer a hand or suggest they team up with someone else so they can help.
<czajkowski> We have made up a page to help teams and encourage teams to use it and TRANSLATE IT :) https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LoCoCouncil/LoCoTeamsBestPracticesandGuidelines/
<czajkowski> If you create an event use the http://loco.ubuntu.com/ Loco Directory, we want to make this place the home of loco teams where all the contact information is one place.
<czajkowski> PLEASE ENSURE  Team CONTACT is listed for your team as this is how we contact you.
<czajkowski> Ok, any questions so far?
<czajkowski> 2) Be the bridge if you log RT tickets
<czajkowski> From time to time teams have to log RT tickets, if you do, and need a hand with them, and there has been no movement in them, just ask us to have a look and we will try and see if we can help
<czajkowski> but also note Canonical IS are busy people who do a great job so we all need to be patient.
<czajkowski> any questions so far?  as we do get a lot of teams logging RTs and then seem to be lost as to what to do ?
<ClassBot> pleia2 asked: Can you explain what RT is and what it may be used for?
<czajkowski> sure
<czajkowski> So RT is Request Tracker
<czajkowski> it is where teams log issues re DNS or hosting issues
<czajkowski> and Canonical looks after this side of things
<czajkowski> okie dokie so moving on
<czajkowski> 3) Mediation
<czajkowski> From time to time we are called upon to be the middle person, the unbiased person who can help if there are issues in a team.
<czajkowski> Firstly, there is no shame in this, and it often helps to call us in sooner rather than later as we can help resolve the issues.
<czajkowski>  
<czajkowski> This can be from us idling in the team IRC channel, adding ourselves to your Team wiki page meetings agenda, talking to members and it is ok to email us if you have concerns.
<czajkowski> We have bee known to be called in to settle issues and mandate teams to elect team leaders where teams were in need of an outside team to step in, then get a monthly report
<czajkowski> from the contact so we know things are improving.
<czajkowski>  
<czajkowski> At all times remember, we have the Code of Conduct, and everyone should sign it and if you are on Mailing lists you are already bound by it, the same goes for Ubuntu channels.
<czajkowski> We also have a private channel so if you are on IRC and need to talk to us, we invite people in there to talk to us and this helps resolve issues.  Just ask us in #ubuntu-locoteams that you want to talk to us and we'll invite you in
<czajkowski> 4) Bit of advice
<czajkowski> When you organise events, vary it, don't always have them soo geeky, try and have non geeky events, people will come along more often than not if they feel they don't have to be a
<czajkowski> technnology expert, and it also means people can bring along families so vary your venue :)
<czajkowski>  
<czajkowski> WE can only guide you so far, it's up to each team how they operate, some things do work and somtimes teams need to realise when things are not working and need to step back and look at how they can change.
<czajkowski>  
<czajkowski> A LoCo team should have one goal, promote Ubuntu where possible without being over bearing and over powering to people.
<czajkowski>  
<czajkowski> We are an international community with so many teams and we are fortunate to have some fantastic people in them.
<czajkowski>  
<czajkowski> Remember that LoCo Teams are  in many ways the opening into the Ubuntu Community, be welcoming and friendly and we'll get more people on board.!
<czajkowski>  
<czajkowski> If you're not sure if you have a team have a look at http://loco.ubuntu.com/
<czajkowski>  
<czajkowski> That's all for me now
<czajkowski> so does anyone have any questions ??
<czajkowski> well thanks for giving me this oportunity to give you some advice
<czajkowski> 8:27 < JoeVancouver> QUESTION: Are there any examples that you are able to give for when the council had to step in to mediate an issue? (on that note: how  is the privacy of such issues handled?)
<czajkowski> JoeVancouver: good question, we remain discreate about such thing to be honest.
<czajkowski> 8:27 < JoeVancouver> QUESTION: Are there any examples that you are able to give for when the council had to step in to mediate an issue? (on that note: how  is the privacy of such issues handled?)
<czajkowski> this helps with teams being able to come to us to ask for advice knowing we're not going to put it on planet Ubuntu and going into a name and shame kinda thing which isn't what we're here for
<czajkowski> WE're here to help
<czajkowski> and we also appreciate that in some counteries and cultures asking for help or saying there is a problem with their team or members in their teams is not acceptable
<czajkowski> we're not here to judge only to help rectify the suitation.
<czajkowski> I hope that helps
<ClassBot> joru_pt asked: are there occations where you guys have stepped in and split up large loco-teams in order to improve progress? or is this in the ruling of the TL? is there a general feeling for how big teams should be to be productive?
<czajkowski> hmmm
<czajkowski> no we've not stepped in and split any team up
<czajkowski> we are currently in the middle or standardsing naming in the LD and getting loco teams displayed there and fixing lanauge teams under them.
<czajkowski> thats the kind of work we do
<czajkowski> If a team is soo big it needs to be split up are you asking if it's because of numbers or due to geographic area?
<czajkowski> the French loco gets 5K of people to their release parties, they have one team and aren't split up
<czajkowski> USA is split into states
<ClassBot> HakanS asked: Can a loco-team be so inactive so you "delete" it?
<czajkowski> hmm we don't delete teams
<czajkowski> we make them unapproved if they have been approved
<czajkowski> but deleting a team doesn't help anyone
<czajkowski> if people want a hand to get it active again or advice again just ask us
<czajkowski> the 6 of us come from various teams I'm fortunate to be a member in two Teams Ireland and UK
<czajkowski> both teams are different
<czajkowski> Ireland is smaller and UK is larger both operate differnly but efficiently.
<czajkowski> you need to find a way to get your team to work for you
<czajkowski> I hope that helps
<ClassBot> dscassel93 asked: While we're on the topic, there's occasional friction about the policy of LoCos covering larger geographical areas. What's the reasoning behind that, and what do you see are pros & cons?
<czajkowski> at present the policy is this
<czajkowski> USA is broken down into states
<czajkowski> the rest of the world in most cases is broken down into country
<czajkowski> this is done by the Ubuntu -ISO code for counteries
<czajkowski> I suspect down the road which is why we're having to revamp and update and enforce in some cases the naming is that Canada and Australia may go down the road of breaking up into small Locos per state like USA
<czajkowski> brazil is another example of this
<czajkowski> but there is no point in having an Ubuntu-state-city if there is nobody there, you need people there otherwise fall under the country  loco
<czajkowski> does that help ?
<ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
<czajkowski> start small and work from there
<czajkowski> start by meeting in a cafe for a bite to eat
<czajkowski> or just meeting new people
<czajkowski> it works :)
<ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
<jono> thanks czajkowski :-)_
<jono> thanks czajkowski :-)
<czajkowski> jono: np :)
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || Event: Ubuntu Community Week - Current Session: Community Manager Q+A - Instructors: jono - Slides: http://is.gd/kQDKoj
<ClassBot> Slides for Community Manager Q+A: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuCommunityWeek/oneiric/slides?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=session15.pdf
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/07/21/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
<jono> howdy folks!
<jono> hope everyone is doing great today~!
<jono> please make sure you are also in #ubuntu-classroom-chat
<jono> so who is here for the Q+A session?
<jono> you can answer in #ubuntu-classroom-chat
<jono> wow, we are a little silent today :-)
<jono> we are going to need to change some of that to make this session rock :-)
<jono> so before I begin, let me introduce myself
<jono> my name is Jono Bacon and I am the Ubuntu Community Manager
<jono> I work at Canonical and lead a team whose goal is to make Ubuntu a truly fun, inspiring, and productive place to be
<jono> we want to make everyone welcome and know that everyone can help make Ubuntu better and bring Free Software to more and more people
<jono> this session is a general Q+A about LoCo teams
<jono> how they work
<jono> how to join them
<jono> what to do
<jono> etc
<jono> you folks can ask questions and I will answer them one by one
<jono> asking a question is simple:
<jono> TO ASK A QUESTION: (1) join #ubuntu-classroom-chat (2) type QUESTION and then your question (e.g. QUESTION: What is a LoCo team) and I will get to the questions one by one - simple as that!
<jono> so, without further ado
<jono> get your questions in, folks! :-)
<ClassBot> ruig asked: is there a list of all the ubuntu LoCo teams?
<jono> ruig, there is indeed, it is at http://loco.ubuntu.com/teams/
<ClassBot> nathandyer asked: Hey, Jono, I'm a member of a LoCo that seems to be- well, we'll say "under-enthused." The information on the website and Wiki is four or five months old, we don't have any projects or try to reach out to the community, and the only interaction we have is a monthly meeting on IRC where, from what I've seen, we just go through the motions. It's sort of like the people just put their names on the list for
<jono> nathandyer, this is something that some LoCo teams face from time to time
<jono> having projects to work on is *critically* important for a LoCo team
<jono> projects give the team a sense of purpose and focus
<jono> they help spread the work out among different members and when the project is complete, it is really satisfying
<jono> nathandyer, fortunately, I have a great project you can work on
<jono> the Ubuntu Global Jam
<jono> the Ubuntu Global Jam is an event we run in each cycle where we encourage all LoCo teams to organize a local face to face meeting where people can get together to talk about Ubuntu and work on bits of Ubuntu too
<jono> for more details, see http://www.jonobacon.org/2011/07/20/calling-those-to-rock-the-ubuntu-11-10-global-jam/
<jono> I would like to encourage *every LoCo team* to organize an Ubuntu Global Jam event
<jono> I would love to see over 60 events all around the world happening on that weekend - they are a lot of fun, and provides this huge global Ubuntu presence on the same weekend
<jono> :-)
<ClassBot> raginkestrel asked: Are there any other loco podcasts besides the UK one?  Is there a U.S. one?
<jono> raginkestrel, not that I am aware of, but I would love to see more!
<jono> the Ubuntu UK team do a wonderful job with that show, but I think there is plenty of appetite for more :-)
<ClassBot> itisbasi asked: Can there be multiple locos for a city?
<jono> itisbasi, we generally recommend against that - the reason is that if you have multiple teams serving the same area, there can be a lot of duplication of effort
<jono> we instead recommend that people get together in the same team
<jono> before we go on...
<jono> to everyone watching
<jono> which LoCo teams are you in?
<jono> type them in #ubuntu-classroom-chat
<jono> awesome, would you folks be interested in running an Ubuntu Global Jam event?
<jono> awesome :-)
<jono> so, more questions!
<jono> what can I help with?
<jono> TO ASK A QUESTION: (1) join #ubuntu-classroom-chat (2) type QUESTION and then your question (e.g. QUESTION: What is a LoCo team) and I will get to the questions one by one - simple as that!
<ClassBot> dscassel93 asked: Do you see a role for Jams earlier in the cycle? To give people a chance to contribute to coding earlier, maybe?
<jono> dscassel93, absolutely! any event to get people together to work on Ubuntu is a great opportunity
<jono> we have found over and over that getting people together is a great way of encouraging and enthusing people in a community :-)
<jono> so yeah, knock yourself out with the jams - the more the merrier!
<ClassBot> raginkestrel asked: Are loco teams just for evangelizing? What else do they do?
<jono> raginkestrel, good question!
<jono> LoCo teams can serve many purposes
<jono> firstly, they are just great as a place to meet other Ubuntu people - this great for getting to know people in your local area, make friends etc
<jono> then there is definitely the evangelism element - lots of LoCo teams burn CDs, make leaflet and flyers and go out and spread the word about Ubuntu far and wide
<jono> this is great for getting Free Software in the hands of as many people as possible
<jono> LoCo teams also often work on localized derivatives with a local language pack included, testing Ubuntu, triaging bugs etc
<jono> essentially, a LoCo team can do anything that a group of Ubuntu fans is interested in doing
<jono> another wonderful element of LoCo teams is sharing skills - they are a great environment for learning tips and tricks for both using and contributing to Ubuntu
<jono> this is why the Ubuntu Global Jam is so awesome - you can meet folks face to face and share knowledge and work on projects together, it is a blast :-)
<ClassBot> JoeVancouver asked: What are some ideal roles that each LoCo team should have?
<jono> JoeVancouver, a few spring to mind:
<jono>  * Leader - always have a strong leader, someone who will think of ways in which the LoCo team can keep moving forward, suggest and start new projects etc
<jono> a great leader will make decisions - earlier there was a question about how a LoCo team that isn't really doing much and just going through the motions can improve - a great leader will pick projects and get the team excited about those projects
<jono> every team needs a great leader
<jono>  * Bloggers - we always encourage LoCo teams to talk about  the work that they are doing - blogging about your work is a great way of inspiring other members of the team and other teams to participate - really encourage folks to blog, and get your blog entries up on planet.ubuntu.com
<jono> in related news, mhall119 is working on support in loco.ubuntu.com to bring blog feeds in so that loco.ubuntu.com will be a portal to the world of everything going on in the LoCo community
<jono> I cannot wait to see this arrive! :-)
<jono>  * Imaginative Minds - you always want people in your loco who are coming up with cool ideas for the team to work on - advocacy events, installfests, creating advocacy materials, Ubuntu Global Jam events, parties, etc - every team needs people will cool ideas
<jono> those are the main roles I see
<ClassBot> nathandyer asked: Can a small group of people take part in the Global Jam? Most of my LoCo members live 6+ hours away, but I know I could round up some friends locally.
<jono> nathandyer, totally! an Ubuntu Global Jam could be two people if you like :-)
<jono> also, we encourage LoCo teams to have multiple Global Jam events if it makes sense
<jono> so absolutely! get your event set up :-)
<ClassBot> raginkestrel asked: How can a newbie contribute?
<jono> raginkestrel, the first thing is to join a team
<jono> see loco.ubuntu.com/teams, find a team near you and join
<jono> when in the team I recommend you help out with the projects that the team is working on, and if there are no projects or you have a cool idea, suggest the idea to the team and start rocking on it :-)
<jono> simple as that :-)
<jono> any more questions, folks?
<ClassBot> dscassel93 asked: How can I convince more people to get involved and organize events? Bribery? A winning smile?
<jono> dscassel93, good question
<jono> the key to getting people excited about an event or project is to help them see why it would be fun and useful to do it
<jono> as an example, with an event, there are lots of benefits:
<jono>  1. fun - events are great fun to be at, meet people at, and just have a good time.
<jono>  2. growing the team - events are a good opportunity to encourage more people to join the team and start using Ubuntu.
<jono>  3. good for Ubuntu - events are a great way of spreading the word about Ubuntu and Free Software - this helps with the wider mission
<jono>  4. not a lot of work - importantly, it doesn't take a lot of work to organize an event
<jono> so if you get these points over, and present them in a fun and excitable tone, you will get more interest
<jono> another important technique is to make it clear that you will coordinate the project, but you are looking for their help - this will help them get interested as it won't seem as big of a commitment, so they can dip their feet in
<jono> hope that helps!
<ClassBot> raginkestrel asked: Do loco teams have a say in what happens with future Ubuntu releases?
<jono> raginkestrel, LoCo teams as a general rule don'
<jono> oops
<jono> raginkestrel, LoCo teams as a general rule don't feed into stakeholder requirements gathering, but many people join LoCo teams and get really interested and involved in Ubuntu development and then start shaping Ubuntu indeed
<jono> but we don't reach out to LoCo teams and ask them what they feel should be going into Ubuntu
<jono> but in many ways, that is not the main benefit of LoCo teams
<jono> I see LoCo teams as our "troops on the ground" - going out and spreading the word and the good message of Ubuntu
<jono> and of course, spreading Free Software in general
<ClassBot> raginkestrel asked: How does the community's relationship with Canonical work?
<jono> raginkestrel, it is pretty simple
<jono> Canonical is just a collection of community members who are lucky enough to get paid to work on Ubuntu
<jono> we are still a community too
<jono> one key element in Ubuntu is that we have very open governance
<jono> so we have two community governance councils, the Ubuntu Community Council and the Ubuntu Technical Board
<jono> the Ubuntu Community Council makes decisions around community policy
<jono> the Ubuntu Technical Board makes decisions around technical policy in the project
<jono> we then have a series of team councils who report to the Ubuntu Community Council, and these councils provide leadership in specific parts of the project
<jono> for example:
<jono> the Ubuntu Forums Council, Ubuntu IRC Council, Ubuntu LoCo Council etc
<jono> we then have local membership boards in EMEA, Americas and Oceania who review membership applications, and an Developer Board who review MOTU and core-dev applications
<jono> all of these councils and team councils have more non-Canonical than Canonical members on them
<jono> we are a very open community :-)
<jono> any more questions?
<ClassBot> raginkestrel asked: Some times it seems like there is a sense of Canonical vs. Community, but Canonical should be viewed as an extension of the community, correct?
<jono> raginkestrel, well, haters gonna hate sometimes :-)
<jono> it is human nature to look at organizations with a sense of cynicism at times
<jono> Canonical is just a group of people in our community paid to work on Ubuntu
<jono> we are part of the community, and should be subject to the rules of the community
<jono> as well as the opportunities and social capital and gift culture in the community
<jono> of course, Canonical does sometimes make some decisions
<jono> Mark Shuttleworth specifically will sometimes make a specific decision
<jono> but that has always been the culture of Ubuntu, Mark has been a strong leader there
<jono> and I believe that we need that sense of leadership in a project that is striving for mass global adoption
<jono> but yes, Canonical should be seen as part of the community and not as different entity that plays by a different rule-book
<jono> well, folks, I think we are out of questions
<jono> thanks for joining me today!
<jono> I hope it was useful :-)
<ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
<ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || Event: Ubuntu Community Week - Current Session: Don't Kill Your Audience! Enlighten Your Presentation Style! - Instructors: xdatap1 - Slides: http://is.gd/QbDXY7
<ClassBot> Slides for Don't Kill Your Audience! Enlighten Your Presentation Style!: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuCommunityWeek/oneiric/slides?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=session16.pdf
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/07/21/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
<xdatap1> Hi everybody, thanks for coming!
<xdatap1> This will be a presentation with slides.
<xdatap1> Since Learnid has some issues with automatic slide change you'll have to change it manually when I will write the slide number.
<xdatap1> For future reference and if you miss something don't worry, at the end of the session I'll give you an handout with both slides and the script.
<xdatap1> If you have a question please keep it for the end of the session, being a complicated presentation with slide changing I prefer to not have question in the middle.
<xdatap1> Please download the slides from here:
<xdatap1> http://paolo.sammiche.li/UbuntuCommunityWeek/slides.pdf
<xdatap1> I will give you a minute, it's a 3 MBytes pdf.
<xdatap1> Now, let's pretend that this is my voice, and that the slides are projected on the stage.
<xdatap1> And since dreaming it's free, let's pretend that we're in a fancy conference room, and you're comfortably sitting in the first row with a fresh ubuntini in your hand. :)
<xdatap1> Let's start!
<xdatap1> Slide 2
<xdatap1> Hi everybody, my name's Paolo Sammicheli, I'm an Ubuntu Member from the Italian LoCo Team. I work for an Italian IT company and they call me a software architect.
<xdatap1> Slide 3
<xdatap1> Today we'll talk about presentations.
<xdatap1> Have you ever seen a presentation?
<xdatap1> Maybe at work, at a conference or maybe at a Free Software related event.
<xdatap1> Slide 4
<xdatap1> You're sitting in the dark, listening to a guy who stands in front of slides full of text, saying the same words you see in the slide...
<xdatap1> Slide 5
<xdatap1> Every slide you read faster than this guy speaking, you get bored and you start thinking at the next holidays, the next party, the next whatever thing except what this guy is talking about.
<xdatap1> Slide 6
<xdatap1> Guys I HATE this kind of presentation. I'd rather read the slides alone at home than staying there listening to this kind of torture.
<xdatap1> Slide 7
<xdatap1> I've a confession: I was a guy like these.
<xdatap1> I used to write ton of text and bullets point in my slides and I used to torture my audience with this kind of presentation.
<xdatap1> Slide 8
<xdatap1> But one day, preparing a presentation in a break during an Ubuntu-it meeting, a LoCo friend told me:
<xdatap1> "This is not the way to make a presentation".
<xdatap1> I was shocked, I used to think I was a good presenter.
<xdatap1> For my job and for my involvement in Free Software I made tons of presentations before that day.
<xdatap1> I thought I was good, but I was not.
<xdatap1> Slide 9
<xdatap1> So I started a journey in where to learn again how to present.
<xdatap1> And I found a master that lead my journey...
<xdatap1> Slide 10
<xdatap1> This guy has been my master: Garr Reynolds
<xdatap1> I've bought his book and I've started reading his blog.
<xdatap1> Slide 11
<xdatap1> After a while I started following his masters, reading the sources he quotes in his blog and book.
<xdatap1> And after almost 3 year I have started my journey, I can tell you that presenting is a huge thing.
<xdatap1> There's tons of things to learn and whoever you are, you can always improve.
<xdatap1> But it's the most exciting thing I've ever tried, and I love it!
<xdatap1> Slide 12
<xdatap1> The good news is that most of the presentations really suck.
<xdatap1> With few suggestions I will tell you in this session, extracted from these books, you will improve dramatically your presentation skills.
<xdatap1> (Hey Bill, nothing personal, your presentation skill really improved lately, we liked your talks at TED)
<xdatap1> Slide 13
<xdatap1> So, Presentation Zen's approach is simple:
<xdatap1> 1) move all the text and bullets point in the notes, that only you will see (Check LibreOffice Presenter Console, it's awesome!)
<xdatap1> 2) put inspiring images or single sentences in the slides that everybody will see. One Slide, one concept.
<xdatap1> 3) print the slides + notes like a PDF handout where to put all the details.
<xdatap1> Slide 14
<xdatap1> It's an evolving process. Let's start demystifying some concepts:
<xdatap1> 1)A presentation is NOT about TEACHING, it's about INSPIRING.
<xdatap1> 2)A presentation is NOT about EXPLAINING DETAILS, it's about making you audience to TAKE ACTION.
<xdatap1> 3)Do NOT waste their time explaining WHAT and HOW, just start with WHY.
<xdatap1> Slide 15
<xdatap1> Now let's see Garr Reynolds' 10 tips for improving your slides.
<xdatap1> Slide 16
<xdatap1> TIP 1. Itâs not about tools
<xdatap1> âMen have become the tools of their tools.â (Henry David Thoreau)
<xdatap1> Forget the tools, it's all about ideas!
<xdatap1> Slide 17
<xdatap1> TIP 2. Start in analog mode
<xdatap1> If you start planning your idea in front of the computer you will fail.
<xdatap1> This is also what my programming teacher used to say when I was at school learning my first programming language: the Turbo Pascal (yes, I'm that old).
<xdatap1> Start with an empty paper and a pencil! Always.
<xdatap1> (well, post-it works very well too)
<xdatap1> Slide 18
<xdatap1> 3. Take a risk, lose the fear
<xdatap1> Explore all the possibilities, don't simply go with the first idea you got.
<xdatap1> Slide 19
<xdatap1> TIP 4. Look for the story
<xdatap1> Telling stories it's the way the human beings used for communicating effectively since the beginning of the civilization.
<xdatap1> An article from Harvard Business Review from June 2003:
<xdatap1> â...Forget about Power Point and statistics... to involve people at the deepest level, you need storiesâ.
<xdatap1> And if you think about it, even Jesus Christ used stories for communicating!
<xdatap1> Slide 20
<xdatap1> TIP 5. Put yourself in their shoes.
<xdatap1> There's not âone size fits allâ, you have to connect with your audience.
<xdatap1> There's an amazing book about how to connect to the audience:
<xdatap1> Resonate, Nancy Duarte.
<xdatap1> Slide 21
<xdatap1> TIP 6. Show Restraint
<xdatap1> It's about depth vs. scope., inclusion and exclusion.
<xdatap1> You can't tell everything, you have to choice!
<xdatap1> If you want to provide a wide scope of a topic you can't go in the details.
<xdatap1> Slide 22
<xdatap1> TIP 7. Remember: vision trumps all other senses
<xdatap1> We're incredible at remembering pictures.
<xdatap1> Much more than remembering text.
<xdatap1> How to create great slides with just images?
<xdatap1> There's an old photography rule called ârule of thirdâ that works good also for slides.
<xdatap1> After this session you can learn more about this tip here:
<xdatap1> http://goo.gl/AOsGs
<xdatap1> Slide 23
<xdatap1> TIP 8. Aim for a high Signal-to-Noise ratio
<xdatap1> The decoration of a slide can be the noise that disturb the signal we aim to send.
<xdatap1> This slide it's a typical example.
<xdatap1> Slide 24
<xdatap1> This is the same slides with a better ratio noise/signal.
<xdatap1> The signal it's clear and much louder now.
<xdatap1> Slide 25
<xdatap1> TIP 9. Embrace empty space
<xdatap1> Empty space is a design tool, it isn't a wasted area, use it!
<xdatap1> In his book Garr Reynolds quotes the book
<xdatap1> âThe elements of graphic design - Alex W. Whiteâ
<xdatap1> which talking about empty space says:
<xdatap1> âSiena's magnificent piazza is the community's gathering place. Four hundred years after its construction, it remains the city's focal point. Is this wasted space?â
<xdatap1> Incidentally this is the city where I born and I can tell you, it's not wasted space :)
<xdatap1> To learn more: http://goo.gl/i117t
<xdatap1> Slide 26
<xdatap1> TIP 10. Design is everywhere! Learn to see the lessons all around you.
<xdatap1> There's a great article about this topic in the Garr's blog, take a look at it after the session:
<xdatap1> http://goo.gl/7UoZV
<xdatap1> And the best source for presentation is TED.
<xdatap1> In TED's site you will find many incredible presentations from great speakers:
<xdatap1> http://www.ted.com
<xdatap1> You can get an incredible inspiration from these presenters.
<xdatap1> Slide 27
<xdatap1> Let's recap the 10 tips:
<xdatap1> 1. Itâs not about tools
<xdatap1> 2. Start in analog mode
<xdatap1> 3. Take a risk, lose the fear
<xdatap1> 4. Look for the story
<xdatap1> 5. Put yourself in their shoes
<xdatap1> 6. Depth Vs. Scope. Inclusion Exclusion. Show Restraint!
<xdatap1> 7. Remember: vision trumps all other senses
<xdatap1> 8. Aim for a high Signal-to-Noise ratio
<xdatap1> 9. Embrace empty space
<xdatap1> 10. Design is everywhere! Learn to see the lessons all around you
<xdatap1> Slide 28
<xdatap1> Now, I know, doing a presentation like this takes a lot of time.
<xdatap1> You need to find the time!
<xdatap1> You're going to take others time, so you need to respect it.
<xdatap1> Slide 29
<xdatap1> Being a good presenter it's not something that you just learn.
<xdatap1> It's a journey.
<xdatap1> The thing is to keep moving forward.
<xdatap1> Slide 30
<xdatap1> And finally the most important thing:
<xdatap1> SLIDES are NOT the presentation.
<xdatap1> YOU are the presentation!
<xdatap1> Slide 31
<xdatap1> How to keep moving forward: LINKS!
<xdatap1> Presentation Zen Blog: www.presentationzen.com
<xdatap1> Garr's presentations are on slideshare.net:
<xdatap1> http://www.slideshare.net/garr/
<xdatap1> If you haven't time for the above slides I suggest to
<xdatap1> take a look at least at these, I downloaded and put
<xdatap1> in order for you:
<xdatap1> http://paolo.sammicheli.net/garr-slides/
<xdatap1> Also, don't miss this great presentation he made at Google:
<xdatap1> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DZ2vtQCESpk
<xdatap1> And more presentation tips:
<xdatap1> http://www.garrreynolds.com/Presentation/
<xdatap1> Slide 32
<xdatap1> Suggested books:
<xdatap1> 1) Presentation Zen, Garr Reynolds
<xdatap1> 2) Slide:ology, Nancy Duarte
<xdatap1> 3) Brain Rules, John Medina
<xdatap1> 4) Made to Stick, Chip Heath
<xdatap1> 5) A Whole New Mind, Daniel Pink
<xdatap1> 6) Resonate, Nancy Duarte
<xdatap1> Slide 33
<xdatap1> Thanks for your attention!
<xdatap1> The PDF handout with full script and slides can be downloaded here:
<xdatap1> http://paolo.sammiche.li/UbuntuCommunityWeek/handout.pdf
<xdatap1> And now Questions!
<ClassBot> JoeVancouver asked: Great session! Any additional tips for doing online presentations, such as this one?
<xdatap1> Thanks Joe :)
<xdatap1> The approch I used for this kind of presentation is just the same as a normal presentation
<xdatap1> Writing down the script before, read and read for improving
<xdatap1> and then produce the pdf handout so future references would be easy
<xdatap1> any other question?
<ClassBot> pleia2 asked: Did you find the whole process to better presentations an evolution for you? (my presentations are better these days, but bullet points still creep in from time to time...)
<xdatap1> yes, as I said it's a journey. The thing is that the topic it's huge
<xdatap1> one of the suggested books I've listed it's Brain Rules
<xdatap1> that book, like others in the list, haven't to do with presentation
<xdatap1> it's about communicating and how brain works
<xdatap1> so, when you start learning how to better present you learn also how to better communicate, how to better teach and why sometimes the message is not delivered to the destination
<xdatap1> in fact, for being a good communicator you need to understand a little how human brain works
<ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
<xdatap1> and the human brain it's a way more complicated processing unit that what we're used to program ;)
<ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
<xdatap1> a typo in the last sentence "a way more complicated processing unit THAN what we're used to program
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/07/21/%23ubuntu-classroom.html
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat ||
#ubuntu-classroom 2011-07-22
<chronos00> Hello everybody! I have trouble suspending my laptop with ubuntu 10.10, and intel i965 video chipset. I have searched every bit of many Ubuntu and Linux related forums, but only found one workaround that partially worked...
<chronos00> I have read in many places that this is a known issue, but I haven't found a consistent solution.
<chronos00> Does anybody know a workaround for this problem?
<chronos00> for the record, the solution that partially worked was: http://ubuntuforums.org/showpost.php?p=10244071&postcount=6
<chronos00> I have also tried: 'sudo apt-get install hibernate', but it didn't help either
<philipballew> is there a launchpad bug for your issue? chronos00
<chronos00> I think there is, I'll look it up for you now. I could probabluy find it again
<chronos00> philipballew
<chronos00> :p
<philipballew> if there is thats a good place to put all the input so its in one central area
<chronos00> this would be the bug report description closest to my problem
<chronos00> note someone talked about a concurrency problem, and the posibble workaround of disabling all but uno processor
<philipballew> hum. you could create a bug
<chronos00> the bug would be a duplicate of the one I just linked, wouldn't it?
<philipballew> you never linked a bug?
<chronos00> Are you suggesting that a should report a new bug, and link it to the original by marking it as a duplicate?
<pleia2> chronos00: you said "the bug would be a duplicate of the one I just linked" but you didn't give a link (you only linked to a forum post)
<pleia2> chronos00: also you're probably better off asking in #ubuntu, this channel is used for classroom sessions (the next one is tomorrow)
<philipballew> ^agreed
<philipballew> if #ubuntu doesnt yeled anything try #ubuntu-beginners
<chronos00> I am sorry, It happend the same as when you mail someone talking about an attachment, and you forget to attach... :p
<chronos00> this is the link: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xserver-xorg-video-intel/+bug/276943
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 276943 in xserver-xorg-video-intel "Resume from suspend doesn't work on the Mobile 4 Series chipsets" [High,Fix released]
<philipballew> alright! lets go to #ubuntu-beginners to talk to discuss this
<philipballew> that is better for support
<chronos00> I guess you are right
<chronos00> I'd better start a new thread than a new bug report hehe
<philipballew> perhaps, also as pleia2 said, you will get more help on other channels on the ubuntu irc network. the one i mentioned just above is good chronos00
<chronos00> I wouldn't be able to reproduce this problem from a clean installation as I don't remember what application installation or upgrade caused this behavior
<chronos00> ok ok, I get it. Thanks for your time. I'll post on the forums. Regards.
<philipballew> alright, when you go to irc for support chronos00 i recoment #ubuntu or #ubuntu-beginners
<chronos00> thank you philipballew, 'll keep it in mind. Regards.
<philipballew> for sure chronos00! happy ubuntuing!
<farodeAlejandria> hwlo
<farodeAlejandria> hello
<farodeAlejandria> so whats this chat aboiut
<farodeAlejandria> ?
<philipballew> farodeAlejandria, chat related to what?
<farodeAlejandria> this chat room
<farodeAlejandria> I'm interested in learning more about programming
<farodeAlejandria> and I thought I could learn more about ubuntu and how to program for it
<philipballew> this chatroom is for sessions on ubuntu, this week is ubuntu community week. try #ubuntu-app-devel they might help you better or know where you can get help
<farodeAlejandria> is there gonna be session today? I jsut want to attend one
<farodeAlejandria> as well
<philipballew> there was, its tommorow https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuCommunityWeek
<farodeAlejandria> are there recordings to go back and watch them or read them?
<pleia2> !logs
<ClassBot> Logs for all classroom sessions that take place in #ubuntu-classroom can be found on http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/
<pleia2> farodeAlejandria: ^^
<farodeAlejandria> thansk
<farodeAlejandria> thanks
<stephenthemartyr> hi
<stephenthemartyr> what is bieng discussed here?
<jmarsden> !classroom
<ubot2> The Ubuntu Classroom is a project which aims to tutor users about Ubuntu, Kubuntu and Xubuntu through biweekly sessions in #ubuntu-classroom - For more information visit https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom
<vnetsaper> QUESTION: Is it too late to listen lessons?
<head_victim> vnetsaper: there are always the logs
<head_victim> !classroom
<ubot2> The Ubuntu Classroom is a project which aims to tutor users about Ubuntu, Kubuntu and Xubuntu through biweekly sessions in #ubuntu-classroom - For more information visit https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom
<head_victim> !logs
<ClassBot> Logs for all classroom sessions that take place in #ubuntu-classroom can be found on http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/
<cjohnston> yay mhall119 !
<mhall119> yay!
<mhall119> is everyone here?
<nigelb> o/
<nigelb> cjohnston: why are you opped?
<cjohnston> im not
<cjohnston> o
<cjohnston> i am
<cjohnston> i dunno
<cjohnston> i rock?
<nigelb> Not anymore :P
<cjohnston> :-(
<mhall119> aw, I guess I'll have to lead the class afterall then
<mhall119> alright, I guess we can get started
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || Current Session: Writing Test Cases for the Ubuntu Community Website Project - Instructors: mhall119
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/07/22/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
<mhall119> so this isn't going to be a formal class, but more of an group chat about how to write test cases for loco-directory
<mhall119> the channel is open, so if you have questions or anything just ask them in here
<mhall119> I don't be using ClassBot or monitoring -classroom-chat for this
<mhall119> okay, so I would really like to see us adding test coverage to loco-directory, or really any other community websites we're currently involved in
<mhall119> such as summit, hall of fame, cloud portal, etc
<nigelb> Isn't cloud portal wordpress?
<mhall119> nigelb: some part of it is django
<nigelb> ah, go on :)
<mhall119> https://10.cloud.ubuntu.com/ is django I think
<mhall119> I'm only going to focus on some basic django testing for this session
<mhall119> firstly,the official link: https://docs.djangoproject.com/en/1.1/topics/testing/
<mhall119> like pretty much all django documentation, that gives a very good coverage of what tests are and how to write them
<mhall119> Django supports 2 ways of writing tests, doctests and class-based tests
<mhall119> I've never been a fan of doctests, so I recommend using the class based method
<mhall119> test code can be placed in a tests.py module inside any django app, and it will be available to django to test
<mhall119> you can run those tests from the command line with "python manage.py test $app"
<mhall119> or, for loco-directory, you can run "make check", which will call that command for you
<mhall119> Django will look for any test classes in that module
<mhall119> for each test class, it will run each of it's member functions that start with "test_"
<mhall119> so you can have a method called "test_foo" and Django will consider that a test method and run it
<mhall119> before each test method, Django calls the "setUp" method for the class, and after each method it calls the "tearDown" method
<mhall119> setUp and tearDown are a good place to add data to the database, or files to the filesystem, that will be needed by the test methods
<mhall119> tearDown is where you clean up after yourself
<mhall119> it's important to clean up after yourself, otherwise the remains of one test might cause another test to fail
<mhall119> to make things easier, Django uses a test database, which is based off your normal database settings, except that it prepends "test_" to the database name
<mhall119> so if you have a MySQL database called "locodirectory", Django will create a database called "test_locodirectory" to run your tests against
<mhall119> to make it even easier, Django will reset that test database between every test, so if you add data to the database in setUp, you don't have to worry about deleting it in tearDown
<mhall119> any questions so far on how Django runs tests?
<nigelb> Nope, looks good so far
<mhall119> okay, now let's get into some examples
<mhall119> take a look at the diff for https://code.launchpad.net/~mhall119/loco-directory/fix.806005/+merge/68181
<mhall119> one of our friends in the Ireland team decided to see how many guests he could register in the Attendee registration form
<mhall119> and found out that we hit a database size limitation that throws an error, instead of gracefully validating in the Django form
<mhall119> for bugs like this, it's usually good practice to write your test case first
<mhall119> so I wrote the test case here
<mhall119> in the setUp method, you can see that I'm creating the minimum number of data records needed to reproduce this bug
<mhall119> so I have a country, a team, a venue and an event
<mhall119> and,  because you need to be logged in to access the registration form, I also had to create a user record
<mhall119> on line 72 of the diff is where the actual test starts
<mhall119> it's good practice to include a docstring on your test methods, to tell people looking at it what it will be testing
<mhall119> so on line 76 I create the path that the registration form posts to, and on line 77 I define a dictionary containing the form data I will pass to it
<mhall119> notice that I chose a large number for guests in order to reproduce the error condition
<mhall119> now, since my test class is a child of the Django TestCase class, it inherits some helpful things
<mhall119> among them is the test client: self.client
<mhall119> this lets you mimic a browser accessing your site, without having to implement a full HTTP client or have the Django server running
<mhall119> self.client.get() will mimick an HTTP GET request to your app, and self.client.post() will mimick a POST request
<mhall119> again, since the registration form requires a logged in user, I first have to log the test client in as the user I created, I do this on line 82
<mhall119> this login step is only necessary when you need to test pages that require a logged in user
<mhall119> now that I'm logged in, I can mimick the form submission, which happens on line 85 of the diff
<mhall119> this returns an HttpResponse object
<mhall119> I also inherit several assert methods from the Django TextCase, which is what you use to check that the values you expect are the values that you get
<mhall119> first I want to make sure that my request recieved the HTTP 200 OK response status
<mhall119> so I use assertEquals to check that response.status_code == 200
<mhall119> the assert methods tell Django whether a test is passing or not
<mhall119> it will abort the test method at the first assert call that fails
<mhall119> if none fail, it considers the test method as having passed
<mhall119> another useful assert method we inheris is assertContains, which will check to see if a given string exists in the response HTML
<mhall119> on line 91, I'm checking ot make sure that the error message that the form should generate exists in the response
<mhall119> now again, all of this was written before the fix was implemented
<mhall119> why write the test first?
<mhall119> well, how do you test your test?  You do that by making sure that it fails when it should fail, and the easiest way to do that is to write it and run it before you fix the bug
<mhall119> so I write this test, then run "python mange.py test events"
<mhall119> and sure enough, my response.status_code is 500, and my assertion fails
<mhall119> but now I know that my test will fail if the bug is still there
<mhall119> so now I can fix the code
<mhall119> (actually somebody else fixed this code, so I just had to merge their branch at this point)
<mhall119> then re-run the test.
<mhall119> if the tests pass, you're good to go, you know the bug is fixed
<mhall119> if they fail, the bug is probably still there
<mhall119> now that this test case is in the code, we can run it any time we want to make sure that the bug is still fixed
<mhall119> so if somebody changes something in the form in the future, and it stop's validating the guests number, we'll know right way
<mhall119> ok, so that's how you write a basic test
<mhall119> now for a slightly larger example: https://code.launchpad.net/~mhall119/loco-directory/fixes-805280/+merge/66736
<mhall119> we had a problem using the country name in Venue URLs
<mhall119> and these venue URLs were used in multiple places
<mhall119> some problems were caused by spaced in country names, others by commas in country names
<mhall119> so I had to write multiple tests to cover as many different scenarios and locations as I could think of
<mhall119> you can see that in setUp(), I'm again creating the minumum number of records needed to reproduce this problem
<mhall119> then I have 3 different test methods to check different parts of the site, and difference data scenarios
<mhall119> the first 2 make sure that we're converting the country name into a URL-acceptable slug by replacing spaces with underscores
<mhall119> again I'm using the test client to mimick browser actions, and using assertContains to make sure that the response contains what I would expect it to contain
<mhall119> the 3rd test, test_country_contains_comma, will need slightly different test data, so the first thing I do is change the country name
<mhall119> I'm using the specific example that we had
<mhall119> again, since django resets the database between calls to test_ methods, I don't need to worry about this change breaking other tests
<mhall119> so, that's the 30 minute crash course in writing django tests
<mhall119> are there any questions?
<cjohnston> mhall119: why are the teams tests failing
<mhall119> cjohnston: the teams tests where written long ago, and have probably been failing for most of that time
<cjohnston> you arent helping me here
<mhall119> when you change code that changes functionality or output, you're usually going to cause tests to fail, because the conditions they were checking have changed
<mhall119> when this happens, it just means that you need to update the tests to reflect the new functionality or output
<cjohnston> i cant test my tests if the other tests that are being tested by my test fail when tested without my test
<mhall119> so, the teams tests need to be updated to match what the loco-directory is doing now, not what it was doing way back when they were written
<mhall119> you can test all the django apps at once, or you can specifiy one or more apps to test
<mhall119> for example, "python manage.py test events" will only run the tests for the events app
<cjohnston> can you walk us through fixing the teams test
<mhall119> you can also run individual TestCase classes, or even individual test methods, from the command line
<cjohnston> how
<mhall119> "python manage.py test $app.$TestClass.$test_method"
<mhall119> so, for example you can run:
<mhall119> python manage.py test events.FormTests.test_large_guest_validation
<mhall119> and it will only run that one test method
<cjohnston> list index out of range :-(
<mhall119> as for fixing team tests, I haven't even looked into what's broken, so I wouldn't want to do that in here, but we can do it in #ubuntu-website after I've had a chance to look
<mhall119> cjohnston: okay,  we can debug in the other channel
<mhall119> nigelb Ronnie daker: any questions from you guys?
<nigelb> nope.
<mhall119> okay
<mhall119> now, since loco-directory, summit and the rest all have a large existing codebase, it's not practical for us to try and write tests for all existing features
<mhall119> but, for any new features, and when fixing any new bugs, we should make a habit of including test cases
<mhall119> these both ensure that our fixes actually work, and it lets us easily make sure that future changes don't break them
<mhall119> so I would highly, highly recommend that our merge proposals all contain at least one new test
<mhall119> I'll leave it to the various project leads to decide how strictly they want to enforce that
<nigelb> would you suggest that we set up something like jenkins/buildbot  ?
<mhall119> it might be helpful in the future, but for now we can probably get by just by running the entire test suite before approving an MP
<ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
<mhall119> okay, one last thing I wanted to talk about
<mhall119> while it's important to test that your code works as expected, it's just as important, if not more so, to make sure it fails as expected
<mhall119> so if you're testing a field that can be null, you should write a test for when it has a value, and another test for when it doesn't have a value, to make sure both instances behave properly
<mhall119> the goal is to cover as many possible scenarios as you can think of
<mhall119> so does everybody feel comfortable with making test writing a part of our normal development process?
<cjohnston> on
<cjohnston> no
<nigelb> yes
<mhall119> well, I'll be in #ubuntu-website and I'm more than happy to help if you get stuch on something
<nigelb> after participating in 3 projects tat do that, I think its wort it.
<mhall119> once you get into the habit of it, it'll become much easier
<mhall119> nigelb: definitely worth it
<nigelb> Its trouble alright, but the long-term regression catching potential we have is worth the trouble.
<ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
<mhall119> okay, let's call it a wrap
<mhall119> thanks everyone for taking the time to come
<nigelb> \o/
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || Event: Ubuntu Community Week - Current Session: Preparing for Approval and Re-Approval. Do's and Don'ts - Instructors: czajkowski - Slides: http://is.gd/s3AxPn
<ClassBot> Slides for Preparing for Approval and Re-Approval. Do's and Don'ts: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuCommunityWeek/oneiric/slides?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=session17.pdf
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/07/22/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
<czajkowski> Preparing for Approval and Re-Approval. Do's and  Don'ts
<czajkowski> Aloha and welcome to my 2nd session this week, todays topic is on Preparing for Approval and Re-Approval. Do's and  Don'ts
<czajkowski> So for those of you that don't know me  I'm Laura Czajkowski and I'm currently one of 6 people who sit on the Ubuntu LoCo Council, something which I'm rather passionate about.
<czajkowski> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LoCoCouncil  I've been on the council for almost 20 months now and I've learned a lot about teams and how best to approch the approval and re approval process and
<czajkowski> today I'm going to explain some key things that not only will help you and your team, but also help the council help you and advise you on how best you can perform and where you can improve
<czajkowski> So lets get cracking!
<czajkowski> Firstly for those of you who don't know who we are:
<czajkowski> There are 6 of us on the council Laura Czajkowski / czajkowski Alan Pope / popey
<czajkowski> Christophe Sauthier / huats Chris Crisafulli / itnet7  Paul Tagliamonte / paultag
<czajkowski> Leandro Gomez / leogg and we are elected by the CC for a 2 year term. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LoCoCouncil/
<czajkowski> We are elected to help you loco team members help your team be as active and prodcutive as possible.
<czajkowski> You can find most of us on irc either on our home team channels or hanging out in #ubuntu-locoteams
<czajkowski> If you join that channel and need help or want our attention or find out how to contact us you can  use the command
<czajkowski> !lococouncil
<czajkowski> < ubot4> lococouncil is The Loco Council is itnet7, czajkowski, paultag, huats, leogg, popey - they are there to help, just ask! :) You can send them an email at loco-council@lists.ubuntu.com
<czajkowski> Please be patient , we may not be online and only some of us run screen sessions, you can always email us
<czajkowski> Emails are moderated so don't be alarmed we will get back to you, and you don't need to suscrbibe to the list.
<czajkowski> We're going to start looking at Team going for APPROVAL for their first time, we'd recommend going for this after being active for approximately 6 months, basically a cycle.
<czajkowski> For us to access this we look at what you've done, so Creating a
<czajkowski> 1) Team on Launchpad
<czajkowski> 2) Mailing List
<czajkowski> 3) IRC Channel - you may want to commuicate only via Mailing list and this is fine, each team is different.
<czajkowski> 4) Create a wiki page - for the examples today I'm going to use my Team page Ireland - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IrishTeam
<czajkowski> Store all your information here
<czajkowski> how to email the team
<czajkowski> team contact information
<czajkowski> irc channel
<czajkowski> basically if someone wanted to contact your or see what you are doing what they should see
<czajkowski> All of the teams that are created get added to the Loco Directory (LD) http://loco.ubuntu.com/teams/ubuntu-ie
<czajkowski> Any questions so far ??
<czajkowski> grand
<czajkowski> When that is all done, now you need to grow your community your loco team and get people involved and show us this
<czajkowski> A) Started to communicate with one another, either via the mailing list or IRC
<czajkowski> B) Had a team meeting each month - publish the minutes of the meting to a wiki page
<czajkowski> C) Held an event - Can be anything a face to face meeting, Geeknic, a talk something that shows us you are an Ubuntu group and added it to the loco directory  - http://loco.ubuntu.com/teams/ubuntu-ie/events/history
<czajkowski> D) Have some fun as a team!
<ClassBot> head_victim asked: Do team meeting minutes need to be on the wiki AND the loco page?
<czajkowski> at present the meeting mins should be on the wiki page, we would love in the future for them to be added to the LD and have the summary of them meeting as you can already create the event on there
<czajkowski> not sure what you mean by wiki AND loco page
<czajkowski> your team should have a page called TEAMREPORTS
<czajkowski> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IrishTeam/TeamReports
<czajkowski> we can see at a glance here that each month the team has them all done
<czajkowski> ok moving on
<czajkowski> Now when it comes to your Approval, you can add your team to the Ubuntu LoCo Council Agenda page - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LoCoCouncil/Agenda
<czajkowski> 1) Please do this BEFORE the day of the meeting , it gives us a chance to view them but also makes sure you are prepared.
<czajkowski> 2) TURN up to the meeting if you've added your team to the agenda
<czajkowski> 3) BRING along Team members!!!! WE want to talk to the team contact, but also love to hear from people in the team how they interact and how they enjoy being in the team
<czajkowski> 4) If the time doesn't suit due to timezones, we do fully understand that, just email us and we will email back and we usally as a few questions like we would do in the meeting, just
<czajkowski> know that this option is there for you and it's fine.
<czajkowski> *ON YOUR APPLICATION *
<czajkowski> We love clear detailed wiki pages.  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IrishTeam/IrishTeamApprovalApplication
<czajkowski> Don't think you have to use colour all over the place, it's not easy on the eye to read and in some cases really off putting to try and read, note you won't be the only team we are looking at.
<czajkowski> You would be amazed at the times we see wiki pages with lack of contact details, like your launchpad page, or team details, use the meeting to tell us how your team is doing while
<czajkowski> we read the wiki page, don't have us googling all over the place to find the content for you.
<czajkowski> *useful Tip* Every time you run any event, write up a report on it, and even take a photo, this will help you when it comes to your application as this shows us and tells us how active you are
<czajkowski> it also helps just to keep track of things.
<czajkowski> Create links to  past events stored on the loco directory or photos of events. Pictures make us happy!
<czajkowski> Create links to podcasts team members have done or have taken part in or interviews they've been involved in - this is the time to show case your team
<czajkowski>  
<czajkowski> In the meeting we're likely to ask you,
<czajkowski> 1) How you share things out in your team
<czajkowski> 2) How do you motivate your members
<czajkowski> 3) What being a locoteam means to you
<czajkowski> 4) What have you do to warrant being an approved team
<czajkowski> Be prepared to talk in the meeting, so again if English is not your first language email us that you want the application done via email we do understand this, it is not a problem,
<czajkowski> we're here to help you
<czajkowski> ANy questions so far ??
<czajkowski> Now Lets have a look at **Re Approval Application**
<czajkowski>  
<czajkowski> So, we've been tasked we the reassessment of locoteams that have been approved over 2 years.
<czajkowski> It's a bit of a task and some cycles are quieter than others, this cycle we have 27 teams to get through
<czajkowski> so we're a bit busy so lets look at how to make things easier on all of us shall we! :)
<czajkowski> So similar to creating a wiki page above for your approval you need to create a NEW  Wiki page
<czajkowski> Call it Reapproval and year as again this is going to happen every 2 years https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IrishTeam/IrishTeamReApprovalApplication2011
<czajkowski> We will again want to see all the basic details of your team
<czajkowski> We are trying to establish here how active you've been in the two years since we would last have met
<czajkowski> So you need to show us this
<czajkowski> You will need to list events you've organised or taken part in
<czajkowski> It will be more detailed than your first application as it should have 2 years worth of information.
<czajkowski> Again come prepared and have it submitted to us before hand
<czajkowski> Link to all past events and how you do things
<czajkowski> Questions you are likely to be asked in the meeting are
<czajkowski>  
<czajkowski> 1) how have you done things since you were first approved
<czajkowski> 2) If you've had difficulty how have you over come these issues and what have you learned from them
<czajkowski> 3) how do you share out tasks
<czajkowski> 4) How have you grown in 2 years
<czajkowski> 5) plan for the next 2 years
<czajkowski>  
<czajkowski> Obviously it's re approval so your team should be more established and we will want more detail so bring people along so they can help answer the questions, have your wiki page up to date and have the information on us.
<czajkowski> Each team should have a TEAM CONTACT some call this a TEAM LEADER and some teams have a TEAM CONTACT  *AND* a TEAM LEADER
<czajkowski> We encourage teams to contact us, it's what we are elected here to help and do so don't be shy and please don't be annoyed with members who do contact us.
<czajkowski>  
<czajkowski> Some team mail us or poke us on IRC asking us to have a look over their application, that's fine I'd prefer a team to do that then turn up and be told your wiki page has no information and only shows 1 years worth of activity and come back, where I can tell that to them in a quick pm on IRC
<czajkowski> Any questions ??
<czajkowski> So to Summerise
<czajkowski>  
<czajkowski> 1) CLEAR and CLEAN wiki pages - Less colouring and more writing does help
<czajkowski> 2) Links to events - check your links work folks, don't have it go to a 404
<czajkowski> 3) Detailed wiki pages with current information, if your reapplication is 2011  don't have the wrong dates in the application
<czajkowski> 4) Try and have as much information on the events on the wiki page a short discreption or a link to a blog post on it
<czajkowski> 5) keep a back up of photos - we hear a lot that who ever had the photos their ac was deleted
<czajkowski> 6) Come to us if you want some advice BEFORE the meeting
<czajkowski> 7) If the time doesn't suit email us and we can do it via Email
<czajkowski> 8) Bring along team members, don't come alone as you're a team so show that by having a presence there on the day.
<czajkowski> 9) Be prepared to answer questions, have some information written out about your team, again if this is an issue due to language email us.
<czajkowski> 10) Show up to the meeting!!!
<czajkowski> you'd be susprised.........
<czajkowski> and finally
<czajkowski> 11) Show us how you are a LoCo Team, show us how you promote and enjoy the Ubuntu Community
<czajkowski> we're not out to trick people or not help teams
<czajkowski> we don't want to unapprove teams
<czajkowski> so you have to prove to us you are a LoCo
<czajkowski> you have the content we need to read
<czajkowski> don't have us searching for it
<czajkowski> That's me done folks
<czajkowski> thanks for listening and reading :)
<czajkowski> anyone have any questions....
<czajkowski> I'll post the link to this session on my blog
<czajkowski> with a link to irc logs folks
<sabdfl> hello all
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/07/22/%23ubuntu-classroom.html
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat ||
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || Event: Weekly Q and A - Current Session: Weekly Q+A - Instructors: sabdfl
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/07/22/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
<sabdfl> hello!
<sabdfl> we interrupt your usual programming for a special preview session on ....
<sabdfl> copyright assignment and contribution agreements
<sabdfl> there was a scheduling slipup, and this session will happen properly at a later date
<sabdfl> but since i was originally told to be here, now, to answer questions...
<sabdfl> i blogged this afternoon, and am here now
<sabdfl> but will be back
<sabdfl> when people actually know about it :-)
<sabdfl> nevertheless, if there are questions, we have till the top of the hour
<sabdfl> perhaps i'll riff a little on the subject, then take questions as and when you feel like asking them
<sabdfl> first, my focus is on making a fantastically successful free software ecosystem
<sabdfl> what would that look like?
<sabdfl> well, it would have lots of jobs for free software programmers to work on free software applications full time, on top dollar
<sabdfl> it would also have a very wide range of applications available in the ecosystem, and much more of them under the GPL and related licenses
<sabdfl> i think we have to accept that we have 20 years of data now, the FLOSS experiment is no longer theory, and we should review progress and think hard about what we have learned
<sabdfl> there are some amazing successes. linux on the server is #1 in all the sense we really care about
<sabdfl> and Android is setting the pace on the handset and device world
<sabdfl> but there are also some concerns
<sabdfl> we have a very poor selection of apps, compared to Windows, IOS, Android
<sabdfl> and those last two concern me the most
<sabdfl> we used to say "Windows dominates because it has an illegal monopoly"
<sabdfl> but neither iOS nor Android suffered from that
<sabdfl> so, the scientist in me wants to know how to adapt our thinking so that our ecosystem, the Gnu based ecosystem, could be as successful
<sabdfl> that's the first part
<sabdfl> the second part is that i think hybrids, and interbreeding, and cross-pollination, are all good
<sabdfl> i think purists usually end up shooting themselves in the foot
<sabdfl> and i try to encourage others not to make that mistake
<sabdfl> i think, when we look at the evolution of the ecosystem, we should be open to approaches which grow the Gnu base, even if they are not pure
<sabdfl> instead, what i see is a lot of nastiness; it's much easier to be a proprietary software developer, in our parties, than to work for a company which spans those worlds
<sabdfl> we ignore the proprietary world
<sabdfl> but we're very nasty to companies, like MySQL or TrollTech, which have dual license strategies
<sabdfl> and this, I think, is self-destructive
<ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
<sabdfl> from my perspective, those companies have done enormous amounts for good for FLOSS
<sabdfl> I'd like to have more of them
<sabdfl> and frankly, if the whole ecosystem was driven by projects with a similar slant, that would be OK by me
<sabdfl> because i think it would be energetic, competitive, and ultimately result in much more, much better FLOSS
<sabdfl> now, I know this is extremely controversial
<sabdfl> but someone has to say it :-)
<sabdfl> i find it weird that I end up defending companies that stay silent, because they just don't want to get drawn into the politics
<sabdfl> why, do I do that?
<sabdfl> because in the end, we live or die as Ubuntu by the quality of our ecosystem
<sabdfl> we want millions of people to embrace Ubuntu. they will do so if they have fantastic apps
<sabdfl> i personally want most of those apps to be free
<sabdfl> but i suspect the best way to achieve that is to encourage companies to participate
<sabdfl> and i haven't heard many good answers from the purists on how to do that
<sabdfl> or a response to the fact that the most dynamic focused apps are coming from projects which have institutional backing
<sabdfl> there are of course exceptions
<sabdfl> they key to me is to ask "what will motivate investment in this project"?
<sabdfl> in the case of the kernel, the answer is obvious: as a hw vendor, you HAVE to invest in it
<sabdfl> there are no other projects where that is true
<sabdfl> so it's a false example that the purists often throw out :-)
<sabdfl> any questions?
<sabdfl> ah, that was easy :-)
<ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
<ClassBot> dscassel45 asked: What do you think LoCo teams could be doing that they aren't doing now?
<jono> <anakin_87792> QUESTION What do you think most ubuntu enthusiasts despise Unity and considering switching to other debian based distros like Linux Mint?
<sabdfl> hi dcassel
<ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
<ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
<sabdfl> i think LoCo teams should focus on a balance of fun + ubuntu
<sabdfl> i think it's great we have a structure that brings together a social perspective and a technical one
<sabdfl> loco's thrive when they are well organised and balance entertainment and technology
<sabdfl> at least, that's my assessment, and i've spent time with quite a few :-)
<sabdfl> from an adoption point of view, i think a key shift is happening in the corporate desktop
<sabdfl> loco's *may* be in a position to spot local companies that could really benefit from that
<sabdfl> and in turn, help fuel the revolution
<sabdfl> but that really depends on the nature of the loco, and what its members do from 9-5
<sabdfl> anakin_87792: hi Darth !
<sabdfl> i see your Schwartz is as big as mine
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || Event: Ubuntu Community Week - Current Session: Simple Ways to Help Build a Stronger Local Community Team - Instructors: itnet7 - Slides: http://is.gd/LSqiBN
<ClassBot> Slides for Simple Ways to Help Build a Stronger Local Community Team: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuCommunityWeek/oneiric/slides?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=session18.pdf
<sabdfl> thanks all
<ClassBot> Logs for this session will be available at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/07/22/%23ubuntu-classroom.html following the conclusion of the session.
<nhandler> We will try to get sabdfl back in the near future (since he was cut short due to some confusion on our part)
<itnet7> Thanks sabdfl and nhandler !
<itnet7> Hello everyone!!
<itnet7> Unfortunately, I dont' have any slides, but I will start out with a quick brief introduction :-)
<itnet7> My name is Chris Crisafulli, aka itnet7. I am an IT professional and have been involved with Ubuntu Project since around 2007. I have been using Ubuntu since it was first released. I am currently a leader within the Florida LoCo Team, and a Member of the LoCo Council.
<itnet7> Today I am going to lead a discussion on how to increase the Strength of your LoCo Teams!
<itnet7> bear with me as I check out the Question/Answer functions of the Bot then we'll get started
<itnet7> !question
<itnet7> lol
<itnet7> !q
<itnet7> There are plenty of ideas out there on what you can do to help make your team stronger. I am going to talk about several things that you can do (if you aren't already).
<itnet7> One of the first things I would suggest is to create a semi templated e-mail Welcome Aboard Letter, that you can send out to new team members that join. This by far is one of the things that most new team mates commented on to me in person after meeting them.
<itnet7> Sending out Welcome Aboard letters, actually meets two goals. One.... It lets the newcomers know that you took interest in him/her joining the team, and two, it gives you the opportunity to invite them to IRC and/or upcoming events in the near future.
<itnet7> This is great because in a sense you're helping establish an early sense of inclusion and acceptance. Newcomers will have a smoother transition in joining the team and may really become motivated about wanting to contribute.
<itnet7> The actual welcome aboard letter itself doesn't have to be elaborate.
<itnet7>    1st paragraph could welcome the NC (New Comer/New Contributor). This line can kind of be in template form.
<itnet7>    2nd paragraph could discuss how to join IRC, the Mailing List, Etc. Same with this one.
<itnet7>    3rd paragraph will be freestyle so to speak, there are plenty of things you can say... For example, I often read about their team memberships, or looked to
<itnet7> see what part of our state they were from, and could let them know about members of our team that live near them in case they are wanting to meet members that are local to them.
<ClassBot> DieselDragon asked: Pardon my community ignorance, but what exactly does a LoCo (Local Community?) team do?
<itnet7> DieselDragon: No worries, LoCo Teams are a way of local enthusiasts to come together and advocate the use of Ubuntu
<itnet7> They also provide support for their areas, and do alot of other things. I can send you a few links at the end if you want more info
<ClassBot> dscassel45 asked: Is there a nice automated thing in launchpad, or do you send them out manually when you get new team member notifications.
<itnet7> dscassel69: not at the moment, but when I was drafting this session, I was thinking of asking paultag how hard it would be to automate this a bit whenever someone joins
<itnet7> a team
<itnet7> We want to try and minimize the work, but we still want to give it a little personal feel
<itnet7> if you know what I mean :-)
<itnet7> Much of the info that you would want to include in these Welcome aboard letters can be found pretty easily by searching, but a lot of times, brand new people to the project are hit with a lot at once
<itnet7> so any time we can save them when they first get involved would be great
<itnet7> Another win is to use our team mailing lists to keep others in the loop about events
<itnet7> Most of us have jobs and access to irc, etc. during the day is limited
<itnet7> but we can leverage the Mailing lists to highlight events that are upcoming, communicate upcoming meetings, and let the rest of our team mates know how things went on events that have just passed
<itnet7> Social Media is another way to help your teams flourish
<itnet7> It costs next to nothing to create a facebook group or to create an account on Meetup
<itnet7> Even though you may not really like some of these Social Media sites for self-use, you can use them to reach people that you wouldn't normally have within your audience range.
<itnet7> For example, I use twitter and identica.... I personally prefer identica, but I know that there is a lot of potential for using both
<itnet7> Just remember if you are planning to schedule an event and add it to facebook or something similar, you might have a few extra people you wouldn't expect show up
<itnet7> so be prepared, and if the venue is small I would say you may want to be careful how many places you post the event
<itnet7> Another way you can grow your team is by recruiting from other enthusiast groups
<itnet7> See if some Local Linux User Group Members like Ubuntu. If they do invite them to join the LoCo Team. Let them know early the intent is not to steal them from their Lug or anything.
<itnet7> Often times there are Ubuntu Users in Lugs that would love to do something Ubuntu related, but often they donât have the time or patience to do presentations on say Software Center or quicklists... but Ideally if they join their LoCo Team there is a good chance that they can learn more about Ubuntu, and get some LoCo members involved when doing install fests/presentations.
<itnet7> I have in the past, volunteered to give presentations for local pc user groups (windows users mainly) when they have a last minute presenter back out
<itnet7> and at the end most people really do have some great questions
<itnet7> Just be mindful of your audience, and focus on the strengths of Ubuntu and not the weaknesses of other systems
<itnet7> There are about two more things I'd like to bring up....
<itnet7> There are a lot of local businesses that have community boards, where you can post events and such
<itnet7> So If you are wanting to attract people to your LoCo Team you can put up some fliers, on their community boards. Local libraries and college campuses are excellent places to do this
<itnet7> If you have a team artist, ask them to draw up a great information flier with the tear off tabs at the bottom, put the teams URL and contact info
<itnet7> but be prepared to receive inquiries
<itnet7> If you are contacted for more information, remember to be pleasant and patient, and try and understand that when you are interacting with new people to our community, often there will be a wide range of experience levels, needs, and even to some degree skepticism. Everyone has their reason for choosing to use Ubuntu or OSS, and often they donât match our own reasons
<itnet7> Once you begin growing the team, and you have events, do your team reports and post pictures of the events. Share these with other LoCo Teams
<itnet7> The purpose behind sharing this is to encourage others with idea
<itnet7> and if they see your successful events, they may try to host a few themselves
<itnet7> One final thing, Most of this takes a lot of teamwork. Try to make sure that you collaborate with your other team mates to get an idea of how you can tackle it together
<itnet7> At first when the team is small or beginning to grow, a little extra effort might be necessary by only a couple of people. As the team grows raise up other leaders and contributors to implement your plans of attack!
<ClassBot> There are 10 minutes remaining in the current session.
<itnet7> Does anyone else have any ideas on what we can do to grow strong teams?
<itnet7> er... stronger teams?
<ClassBot> There are 5 minutes remaining in the current session.
<itnet7> Well, Thanks to all of you for your attention, and thanks for being a part of our great community :-)
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* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-classroom to: Welcome to the Ubuntu Classroom - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Classroom || Support in #ubuntu || Upcoming Schedule: http://is.gd/8rtIi || Questions in #ubuntu-classroom-chat || Event: Ubuntu Community Week - Current Session: Spare: Read "The Art of Community" - Instructors: rrnwexec - Slides: http://is.gd/bitMkI
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#ubuntu-classroom 2011-07-23
<nobackstab1> hello
<nobackstab1> I help a help
<nobackstab1> I need a help
<head_victim> nobackstab1: this is not a support channel, it's used for specific learning sessions. I'd try asking for assistance in #ubuntu
<nobackstab1> ok thanks I found a link to post a thread.. thanks
<head_victim> No problem
<luckybunny> brb rebooting
<[ppaul]> is there a Python class today at 17:00 UTC?
#ubuntu-classroom 2011-07-24
<toby> hello
<netbook_helper> I need HELP!!!!!!!!!!!!! 11.04 Setup not working... please message me and I will give more info
<netbook_helper> hello...
#ubuntu-classroom 2012-07-16
<eee444> hi, could someone hwlp me get my dwl650 to work with aircrack?
<pleia2> eee444: you want #ubuntu for support
#ubuntu-classroom 2012-07-18
<MSimo> Hello!
<moon1> hi
