#ubuntu-motu 2006-02-13
<marcin_ant> anyway our brilliant idea is to create ... 3 packages
<ogra> youre not allowed to run apt from postinst ... (and it wouldnt work anyway)
<Kyral> guy on GNOMEFiles asked for feedback on a debpack he made. I think I'll run lintain on it and send him the results :D
<marcin_ant> ogra, v-c + v-c-mysql-local + v-c-mysql-remote
<ogra>  v-c-mysql-local || v-c-mysql-remote -> dependency on v-c
<marcin_ant> ogra, so then user could first run apt-get install vtiger-crm-mysql-local if he want to install vtiger locally and mysql-server as dependency
<marcin_ant> ogra, exactly
<ogra> that will work ...
<marcin_ant> ogra, but then what if user will run apt-get install v-c first?
<ogra> he can ... but will only have the plain non working frontend
<marcin_ant> aaaah..
<ogra> see cacti ...
<marcin_ant> so depencency is not v-c -> v-c-mysql-local..... but v-c-mysql-local -> v-c :) ?
<ogra> yup
<marcin_ant> so cacti needs cacti-mysql-local ;)
<ogra> heh
<ogra> other way round ;)
<ogra> cacti-mysql-local needs cacti ...
<ogra> but cacti can be installed alone and you modify the config manually ...
<marcin_ant> sure but that's not the "debian way" right?
<marcin_ant> or ubuntu - "just works"
<ogra> dunno ... it sounds sane and wont violate the policy ...
<raphink> phanatic: in case you didn't recieve the mail, nanoweb is NEW
<ogra> since cacti-mysql-local will still follow the policy and cacti itself is no DB app that has automatic configuration ...
<phanatic> raphink: thanks. i didn't receive any mails, just see nanoweb on my launchpad acc
<raphink> phanatic: hehe
<marcin_ant> ok so.... I will create few packages - v-c-mysql-local - with mysql-server as dependency and with autoconfiguration stuff
<raphink> phanatic: which is always nice to see :)
<marcin_ant> so it will get admin password from default maint account in /etc/mysql/debian.cnf
<ogra> yup ... but note that it must be possible to override the autoconfig with a higher debconf priority
<marcin_ant> 100% automagic setup for user
<marcin_ant> and then v-c-mysql-remote that should allow user to define remote host with mysql up and running
<phanatic> raphink: yeah, now there are two of them :)
<ogra> so admins who dont want autoconfig are able to override
<ogra> yup
<raphink> phanatic: :)
<marcin_ant> and finally v-c as just something that will install php/html/jpg/etc. stuff
<marcin_ant> ogra, vtiger is pretty weird because they cannot avoid autoconfig to use thins
<marcin_ant> this
<marcin_ant> ogra, because when you just unzip sources to apache directory and try to login to vtiger than it goes to 'install.php' page
<marcin_ant> ogra, that examines system settings and then sets up database connection
<marcin_ant> ogra, the thing with debian package is that it can only move this magic to debconf
<ogra> sounds like mediawiki ... have a look at that one
<marcin_ant> ogra, so if you configure 'connection.php' with some postinst script then this 'install.php' will be filled with these values
<raphink> that was my idea too marcin_ant
<raphink> this install.php thing is annoying
<raphink> ideally it would have to be launched as root
<raphink> but that can't be done safely
<marcin_ant> raphink, I know that this install.php is annoying but I don't want to modify too much php code
<raphink> I totally agree marcin_ant
<marcin_ant> raphink, it's enough to generate connection.php from postinst script
<raphink> that's where this package is kind of a mess
<raphink> yes, agreed
<marcin_ant> raphink, then if you got database configured and you got these settings in connection.php
<marcin_ant> raphink, then on install.php you only click "ok" and the only thing you can change is vtiger admin name and password
<raphink> yes
<raphink> that's the idea
<sistpoty> why don't I get karma for uploading packages? *g*
<marcin_ant> raphink, I got it already but I had to decide what to do with mysql-server
<raphink> ok
<raphink> sistpoty: lol
<raphink> sistpoty: karma is for people who need it, you don't ;)
<marcin_ant> sistpoty, wanna buy my karma ;) ?
<sistpoty> raphink: hrhr
<sistpoty> marcin_ant: no, I want my own... maybe I should file a bug against LP *g*
<dolson> I love karamel
<marcin_ant> sistpoty, just a joke ;)
<sistpoty> same here ;)
<marcin_ant> sistpoty, but in fact ppl sell stupid things such as weapon in games... so maybe add 'karma shop' to launchpad ;)
<sistpoty> oh, maybe I could sell some of my karma on ebay :)
<sistpoty> 100 pts of karma and one free wireless network cable ;)
<marcin_ant> raphink, another thing is that I got problems with this connection.php stuff... my scripts that generate values are ok
<raphink> marcin_ant: one thing that worries me with generating this connection.php stuff from a script is when we'll have to update the package
<marcin_ant> raphink, but when trying to install or reinstall package
<raphink> marcin_ant: are we sure we can still generate this file in the next version of v-c ?
<marcin_ant> raphink, apt-get says that "Not replacing deleted config file ...../connection.php' and it refuses to regenerate it
<marcin_ant> raphink, anyway I'll try to resolve this
<raphink> marcin_ant: did you add this file as a config file in debian/ ?
<sistpoty> now a serious question for a difference: worlded is in dep-wait on amd64, but I get no clue from the "buildlog": http://librarian.launchpad.net/1559726/buildlog_ubuntu-dapper-amd64.worlded_0.1.3-7build2.txt.gz
<marcin_ant> raphink, well not
<sistpoty> really weird in it is: "sh: /dev/null: Permission denied"
<marcin_ant> raphink, because I got connection.template and I do some magic trick from dbconfig to generate connection.php
<marcin_ant> raphink, I'll try to work on this later
<raphink> marcin_ant: ok
<raphink> marcin_ant: I guess the package builds already?
<marcin_ant> raphink, now I want to try this mysql-server things
<raphink> marcin_ant: upload it to REVU now imo
<raphink> so we can begin to have a look at some stuff, even small details
<marcin_ant> raphink, yup but there is a lot of things I want to do and change - I got separate packages for themes - but not fully functional. and language packs... etc
<raphink> and while you're working on this, some parts will already be fixed so you can be quite sure to have it in dapper
<marcin_ant> raphink, I'll upload it tomorrow
<raphink> marcin_ant: do you use separate source packages ?
<raphink> or do you have one big package source that generates lots of binaries ?
<marcin_ant> raphink, hmm propably for lang packs
<raphink> I don't remember whether upstream had one tarball per module
<marcin_ant> raphink, but themes are from "big source"
<raphink> good
<raphink> marcin_ant: btw, what do you think of my answer to tim?
<marcin_ant> anyway I want to work on it for a few hours and then I'll upload to revu today at night or tomorrow morning
<raphink> ok sure :)
<raphink> marcin_ant: ping me when it's done
<raphink> marcin_ant: if you can add debian/watch files, that'll help, too :)
<raphink> to review mostly :)
<phanatic> to all motus except raphink: could you have a look at http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=1628 ? :)
<marcin_ant> raphink, about answer - it's nice and I hope that I'll upload to revu soon and then we tim should decide what to do with bounty
<raphink> phanatic: :p
<raphink> marcin_ant: sure :)
<marcin_ant> raphink, afair he considered more money for this bounty so he could do something to make you and me feel better ;)
<raphink> marcin_ant: would be nice to file an ITP on it, too
<raphink> so all your work doesn't get lost when it's packaged for Debian
<phanatic> raphink: you already gave it a go ;)
<marcin_ant> raphink, another thing is that this is only beginng for me
<marcin_ant> raphink, I mean - my work with vtiger
<raphink> marcin_ant: sure, and I hope you will maintain it
<marcin_ant> raphink, package is only first stage
<marcin_ant> raphink, what is ITP?
<raphink> Intend To Package
<raphink> this is in Debian
<raphink> to tell that you're working on a package to be included in Debian
<raphink> so people don't begin to work on it
<raphink> marcin_ant: most of the programs we have in universe come from Debian
<raphink> marcin_ant: so it someone in Debian packages v-c before you get it in
<raphink> marcin_ant: your package will be overriden by the Debian one in Ubuntu
<raphink> which would be a shame, after such a great work
<marcin_ant> raphink, heh it sucks ;)
<raphink> so you better file an ITP or an RFP in Debian
<marcin_ant> raphink, it's by default?
<raphink> ITP means you wna to get your packag ein Debian and maintain it there
<sistpoty> phanatic: I'll take a look (in 15-30mins)
<raphink> RFP means you wnat this package to be in Debian an dproposes your version, but they have to find a maintainer that is free to modify it before uploading it
<phanatic> sistpoty: thanks a lot
<marcin_ant> raphink, for example if my package in ubuntu is much better than debian one?
<raphink> marcin_ant: there are about 16000 packages in universe, we are 40 MOTUs or so
<raphink> we can't maintain them
<phanatic> raphink: can i use ubuntu's reportbug to file an ITP?
<raphink> marcin_ant: we might make exceptions, but it's much better to just file an ITP or at least a RFP
<raphink> phanatic: nope
<raphink> phanatic: you have to be in a sid chroot ;)
<ogra> marcin_ant, if its a ubuntu bounty i'd simply package a -1ubuntu1 version
<marcin_ant> raphink, SABDFL could hire me - I could work as MOTU (I think so ;) )
<raphink> ogra: how about if Debian packages it and then upgrades to -2 ?
<ogra> so it wont be overridden by a debian package
<phanatic> raphink: that's bad news...
<raphink> marcin_ant: MOTU is volunteer work
<raphink> marcin_ant: it' snot paid ;)
<ogra> it still wont be overrridden
<raphink> ogra: why?
<marcin_ant> raphink, I know that... unfortunately ;)
<raphink> marcin_ant: well there's a hope to be taken in as core deve
<raphink> :)
<raphink> dev
<ogra> raphink, did you do manual merges the last weeks ?
<raphink> ogra: no
<raphink> hmm I did before UVF
<ogra> see
<raphink> ogra: so what?
<ogra> manual merges result from XubuntuX versions ...
<raphink> it'll be overriden in dapper+1 that's all?
<ogra> they wont just get synced
<marcin_ant> ok anyway back to work.. and I'll upload package to revu tomorrow and I'l file this ITP
<raphink> s/?//
<ogra> nope
<marcin_ant> raphink, is there some url where I could read about ITP procedure?
<raphink> ogra: unless we don't want it overriden, as this is the case with wesnoth for ex
<ogra> XubuntuX versions never get overridden unless you told the ftpmaster to do it ..
<raphink> marcin_ant: you'll need a sid chroot or system to do that first
<raphink> ogra: oh ok :)
<raphink> ogra: unless you take the new version from debian, check the diff and decide to apply the patches or not
<marcin_ant> raphink, hmm definetly not today...
<ogra> thats why we want to keep the amount of xubuntuX packages small ..
<raphink> marcin_ant: not urgent at all
<ogra> raphink, or just sync the debian version ... but it wont get autosynced
<raphink> ogra: so theorically, packages that got in from REVU should not be overriden
<ogra> exactly
<raphink> ogra: how about klibido then?
<raphink> Tonio got a great verison in through REVU
<ajmitch_> who wants to write up an f-spot UVF exception request for me?
<raphink> then the Debian version replaced it
<raphink> with a trashy package like I hardly ever saw
<raphink> before
<ogra> and if you guys work on a bunty package i think your interest is not to have it automatically overwritten
<raphink> of course ogra  :)
<marcin_ant> ehh I also got a lot of pretty nice emacs packages... but they are not ready for revu yet - I use them... anyway need to go from irc now
<marcin_ant> reboot to dapper and try to fight with this mysql stuff
<raphink> marcin_ant: great :)
<raphink> hehe
<raphink> marcin_ant: you know you could use a dapper pbuilder
<raphink> instead of another system
<raphink> marcin_ant: see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebootstrapChroot
<marcin_ant> raphink, sure I know but I installed dapper so want to use from time to time ;)
<raphink> takes about 10 miinutes witha good connection
<raphink> marcin_ant: you could also set a dchroot with your installed dapper system
<raphink> ;)
<raphink> so you don't have to reboot
<raphink> ;)
<phanatic> raphink: could i use this for reportbug? :)
<raphink> phanatic: you can install a sid chroot
<raphink> phanatic: and run reportbug from within it
<raphink> works, I've done it
<raphink> :)
<marcin_ant> raphink, sure but dapper is now my 'workstation'
<raphink> ok
<phanatic> ok, i'll try to do that then :)
<raphink> same on my comp marcin_ant :)
<phanatic> hope it doesn't use much disk space
<marcin_ant> raphink, I had to move systems few days ago so
<marcin_ant> raphink, so I had dapper + windows 2000 on one machine and mandriva on another...
<raphink> marcin_ant: right now I work on tiber, sshed from my dapper machine, sshed from my sister's machine on which I'm connected in XDMCP from this laptop running knoppix in telinit 2
<raphink> that's the best option I found
<raphink> lol
<marcin_ant> raphink, but then some ugly bastard broken udev packages in dapper so I had to install breezy
<phanatic> lol :)
<ogra> that'd be Keybuk ...
<marcin_ant> raphink, and now I got dapper + breezy on one machine and moved windows to my old machine...
<phanatic> i have both, using a common /home dir :)
<raphink> phanatic: beah, not a good idea ;)
<marcin_ant> phanatic, of course - the same here...
<marcin_ant> raphink, who cares ;)
* raphink used to share a /home between Ubuntu and Mac OS to get the same settings on XChat
<raphink> lol
<marcin_ant> anyway... I need to go... and package, package, package ;)
<marcin_ant> see you
<raphink> cya :)
<raphink> good luck marcin_ant :)
<phanatic> raphink: why not?
<raphink> phanatic: why not what?
<phanatic> why isn't the shared /home dir a good idea?
<raphink> phanatic: because different systems with different versions of programs generate different settings
<raphink> that might not be inter-compatible
<phanatic> okay, that's right
<raphink> :)
<phanatic> now i'm using breezy only for grub management anyway :)
<raphink> ok
<raphink> phanatic: you're on K/X/Ed//Ubuntu ?
<raphink> well frmo your packages I'd guess Kubuntu actually
<phanatic> wrong guess ;)
<raphink> hmm
<raphink> yeah I thought you were the one doing kblogger
<raphink> but no, you did gnome-rdp
<raphink> so ubuntu
<raphink> ;)
<phanatic> that's right ;)
<raphink> I guess ;)
<raphink> hehe
<raphink> talking about grub, would you like to package a ubuntu-grubsplashimages?
<phanatic> i have xfce installed, but that's for dapper only (gnome gets broken sometimes)
<raphink> phanatic: I made a kubuntu-grub-splashimages package some time ago
<raphink> and the idea that I have is that many people have double boots, at least with windows
<raphink> and get a B&W boot screen, when there are great grub splashs around
<phanatic> i also use one found on ubuntuforums :)
<raphink> so for dapper+1 (too late for dapper) I'd like to have ubuntu and kubuntu grub-splashimages by default
<raphink> phanatic: yes you can install some because you're an advanced user
<raphink> but most users won't hack their menu.lst
<raphink> and we don't want them to
<phanatic> you're right
<tseng> there isnt much reason to have a splash image for 2 seconds imo
<tseng> unless you will only show it with the menu
<tseng> not the default boot
<raphink> tseng: I'm not speaking of the auto boot
<raphink> I'm talking of people with doublt boots
<phanatic> raphink: so i could use your package to create one for ubuntu?
<tseng> well more power too you, if its just as readable on all screens
<raphink> many people still have windows
<raphink> phanatic: I guess
<raphink> phanatic: if you want to do it that is
<sistpoty> phanatic: for sysinfo: there is still old fsf-adress in source, please talk to upstream to fix it (no packaging issue though)
<phanatic> i have to get some splashimages for gnome-look, right?
<phanatic> sistpoty: okay
<raphink> phanatic: yes, there are some listed on the ubuntu wiki too
<raphink> phanatic: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork migh thave some
<phanatic> raphink: i think i'll have a look at your package
<raphink> phanatic: it's archived on REVU, you can have a look at it there
<raphink> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=1163
<phanatic> i already apt-get source'd it :)
<raphink> hehe
<raphink> any comment is welcome :)
<sistpoty> phanatic: sysinfo is fine... I'll upload in a minute ;)
<phanatic> raphink: i've never been a regexp expert, so i have to understand all that first :)
<phanatic> sistpoty: thanks for your time
<sistpoty> np
<raphink> phanatic: hehe
<phanatic> everytime i see a sed command, i think of magic :)
<raphink> hehe
<phanatic> but this one seems quite easy to understand
<phanatic> fortunately :)
<raphink> good :)
<raphink> it's not too complicate a set of scripts
<phanatic> omg, it's cdbs... another thing i have to learn :)
<phanatic> i used to package some years ago, and there wasn't cdbs that time...
<raphink> phanatic: cdbs is very easy
<raphink> leave it as such and it'll work ;)
<raphink> I think this debian/rules has only 2 lintes
<raphink> lines
<raphink> iircx
<phanatic> yeah :)
<raphink> iirc all you have to do to make a package for ubuntu splashimages
<phanatic> but i like the verbose one... i like to see what it does you know :)
<raphink> is to put the splashimages as xpm.gz in the root
<phanatic> yes :)
<raphink> and update the name of the default one in the postinst script
<raphink> rename the package to ubuntu-grub-splashimages
<phanatic> i'll collect some tomorrow, and upload the package to revu
<raphink> and that's it
<raphink> ok
<raphink> :)
<phanatic> i also have to work on my app :)
<phanatic> still under heavy development
<raphink> what is your app phanatic ?
<phanatic> gbzr
<phanatic> gui for bzr
<phanatic> :)
<raphink> nice
<phanatic> :)
<phanatic> W: Failure trying to run: chroot /var/chroot dpkg --force-depends --install
<phanatic> i get this while trying to build a sid chroot
<phanatic> debootstrap
<phanatic> any ideas how to workaroung this? simply running as root?
<psusi> eh?
<phanatic> i'll try
<sistpoty> phanatic: you won't be able to chroot as non-root, will you?
<phanatic> yeah
<phanatic> debootstrap doesn't use sudo
<phanatic> i run it now as root
<phanatic> done :)
<phanatic> when i file an ITP against my package in ubuntu, shall i point them to the source package in ubuntu?
<ajmitch_> if you file an ITP, it means you want to maintain it in debian
<phanatic> ajmitch_: then i also have to find a dd to support it right?
<ajmitch_> to sponsor uploads for you
<phanatic> last time i tried (3 yrs ago), it was really hard to find a sponsor :(
<Amaranth> phanatic: file a RFP
<phanatic> Amaranth: ok
<chillywilly> is there any way to just download a package and all it's dependencies as debs?
<sistpoty> chillywilly: apt-get has an option to do only the download (--download-only iirc)...
<sistpoty> chillywilly: these will go to usual place /var/cache/apt/archives
<chillywilly> right.......and if I do --reinstall it will grab the dependencies fresh if they're not in the cache?
<sistpoty> chillywilly: I guess so, but I'm not sure about that one
<chillywilly> fudge
<LaserJock> anybody around?
<sistpoty> LaserJock: sure
<LaserJock> hmm, I've been asking some questions in #macosx and #darwinports and nobody has answered. I though maybe they couldn't see me :(
* Kyral bops LaserJock
<sistpoty> Kyral: what's about LaserJock... did he write s.th.? *g*
<Kyral> no
<LaserJock> well, I'm having a heck of a time with OSX
<Kyral> I was proving I could see him by bopping him
<Kyral> Because usually to bop someone you need to be able to see them, right?
<sistpoty> I guess so
<LaserJock> argghh, I can't get X11 to work/install right
<LaserJock> and everybody refuses to answer my questions it seems
<chillywilly> is there an easy way to rebuild the kernel source for our existing kernel but not actually make  deb for it but just have a configured and built source tree, e.g. 'make dep modules' ?
<chillywilly> I have built this wanpipe driver but one of the modules complains about versions
<chillywilly> driver/module
<chillywilly> af_wanpipe: disagrees about version of symbol stock_register, af_wanpipe: unknown symbol sock_register
<chillywilly> hmmm, actually it's probably missing something
<sistpoty> chillywilly: you can install linux-source (or linux-source-VERSION)...
<sistpoty> chillywilly: not quite sure if it contains the .config though (but I found it at least somewhere) and then you can make oldconfig
<chillywilly> ok, I did that
<chillywilly> and I also copied over the .config from /bot/config-BLAH
<chillywilly> then ran
<chillywilly> make menuconfig and saved it
<chillywilly> then did sudo make dep modules and built the wanpipe drivers
<sistpoty> chillywilly: and the built succeeded?
<chillywilly> yea
<sistpoty> chillywilly: and with your rebuilt kernel you can't load it? have you tried depmod -a?
<chillywilly> well I am not acutally rebuilding the kernel
<chillywilly> just configuring it and building it but it's not being installed or anything
<chillywilly> just built enough so I can build the wanpipe drivers against the source
<chillywilly> but I am not sure the build I made matches the kernel 100%
<sistpoty> chillywilly: did you change anything in .config?
<chillywilly> I think I remember having to remove one wan driver because it failed to compile
<chillywilly> unselect it
<chillywilly> cycx.c had errors
<chillywilly> not sure how I am supposed to fix that
<chillywilly> if I grab the source package for my running kernel and use the same .config shouldn't I get the same kernel?
<chillywilly> *sigh*
<chillywilly> this has been one hell of a day
<sistpoty> chillywilly: you should, if you use same compiler as well
<chillywilly> I should just build the kernel and istall it?
<chillywilly> is that what you're saying?
<sistpoty> I'd give that a try...
<chillywilly> yea I was hoping to avoid that
<sistpoty> if you change anything within the .config, you'll get a slightly different kernel (and thus may have other symbols exported from the kernel)
<chillywilly> can I tell what compiler my running kernel was built with?
<crimsun> cat /proc/version
<chillywilly> I would think it would be gcc-3.3
<chillywilly> different than the one I have instaled
<shaya> just wondering if there's an eta on a new beagle?
<sistpoty> hi crimsun btw ;)
<crimsun> 'lo sistpoty :)
<chillywilly> gues I probably shouldn't be trying to take shorcuts
<chillywilly> shortcuts too
* sistpoty hopes my connection won't break down again after greeting crimsun
<sistpoty> shaya: when it's ready :P
<chillywilly> alright I'll buil the kernel, install it, and then rebuild my wanpipe stuff
<sistpoty> lol, the best package FTBFS message so far: "make: Entering an unknown directory"
* ajmitch_ returns
<ajmitch_> chillywilly: you usually just need the appropriate headers package installed, unless the module does wacky things
<chillywilly> well I have version mismatches
<chillywilly> or some such thing
<chillywilly> maybe I need to compile something else in, I don't know all I know is this sucks a lot :)
<ajmitch_> dapper? breezy?
<chillywilly> 2 days down no website no email
<chillywilly> breezy
<chillywilly> wouldn't run dapper in production
<ajmitch_> heh
<ajmitch_> you're just not brave enough ;)
<chillywilly> nope
<Hobbsee> hehe!
<Hobbsee> especially if you need a wireless card!
<ajmitch_> Hobbsee: nothing wrong with wireless in dapper
<ajmitch_> nor in breezy, for that matter
<Hobbsee> ajmitch_: only the fact that ndiswrapper wont run unless you compile it yourself...apart from that, no, wireless is fine in dapper
<chillywilly> when I run the Setup.sh script it wants the configured linux source tree apparentl
<Hobbsee> it needs updating, and i couldnt get it to work
<ajmitch_> oh, who uses ndiswrapper though?
<ajmitch_> chillywilly: strange, you should be able to use the /usr/src/linux-headers-$(uname -r)
<chillywilly> I do have that installed
<ajmitch_> maybe it wants /usr/src/linux to point there?
<chillywilly> I would need to point it to the right place using --with-linux
<ajmitch_> /usr/src/linux-headers-$(uname -r)/.config exists for the headers also
<chillywilly> ok
<chillywilly> hmmm, I don't have those
<Hobbsee> ajmitch_: i do, my card isnt supported!
<Hobbsee> lol
<ajmitch_> chillywilly: install the package
<chillywilly> I have linux-kernel-headers insalled
<chillywilly> installed too
<ajmitch_> wrong one
<crimsun> l-k-h is for libc6
<ajmitch_> that's for userspace apps needed headers
<crimsun> you want linux-headers-$(uname -r)
<chillywilly> ok
<chillywilly> linux-headers-2.6.11-1-amd64-k8-smp
<chillywilly> I can't win today
<crimsun> oh good god, not /that/ package.
<chillywilly> sorry...
<crimsun> I really hope that's not for linux-image-2.6.11-1 from universe
<ajmitch_> chillywilly: you really shouldn't have that kernel running on breezy
<chillywilly> probably a backport
<chillywilly> well I can istall a new one now
<ajmitch_> as in, it's a _really_ bad idea that was regretted from hoary
<chillywilly> which one should I get?
<ajmitch_> breezy has 2.6.12
<chillywilly> k
<ajmitch_> so 2.6.12-10 is current in breezy-updates, iirc
<sistpoty> args... ubuntu did it again (import of a newer upstream version than debian which breaks stuff at the other end) :(
<ajmitch_> sistpoty: hm?
<ajmitch_> which package?
<sistpoty> openh323
<ajmitch_> and was it MOTUs doing bad things, or main developers on crack?
<chillywilly> last time I tried a more up to date kernel 2.6.12 the thing oops'd on me right away
* sistpoty doesn't want to blame anybody
<sistpoty> *g*
* ajmitch_ does
<ajmitch_> chillywilly: that's a Bad Thing
<sistpoty> ajmitch_: you know where to look ;)
<ajmitch_> sistpoty: ah, I see who to point fingers at now
<chillywilly> linux-image-2.6.12-10-amd64-k8-smp
<chillywilly> I'll try that one
<ajmitch_> chillywilly: grab linux-headers-2.6.12-10-amd64-k8-smp
<ajmitch_> if those are the package names
<chillywilly> well eveything works right now with this card but as soon as there's more traffic during the day I lose packets
<freeflying|sleep> I can not upload package to REVU now , may anyone help me
<ajmitch_> freeflying|sleep: what's the problem?
<freeflying|sleep> ajmitch_:
<freeflying|sleep> Uploading via ftp skim_1.4.4-0ubuntu2.dsc: Error '553 Could not create file.' during ftp transfer of skim_1.4.4-0ubuntu2.dsc
<freeflying|sleep> Note: This problem might be caused by files already existent on the server.
<ajmitch_> we have the resident REVU guru here to fix things
<freeflying|sleep>       For the official Debian upload queues, the dcut(1) utility can be used
<freeflying|sleep>       to remove stale files from unsuccessful uploads.
<ajmitch_> aha
<ajmitch_> don't use dcut
<freeflying|sleep> ajmitch_: I've not used dcut
<chillywilly> off peak hours I get like 1, 3, and 11% loss and during peak hours I get 40-60% packet loss
<ajmitch_> freeflying: try again now
<sistpoty> freeflying|sleep: dcut won't work, but I'll take a look at the "incoming queue" ;)
<ajmitch_> sistpoty: I just cleared it
<sistpoty> :)
<freeflying> ajmitch_: sistpoty : thx a lot . it works now
<ajmitch_> ok, I see the orig.tar.gz being uploaded, looks ok
<chillywilly> here goes noting
<chillywilly> nothing to
<chillywilly> o
* ajmitch_ hands chillywilly a working keyboard
<chillywilly> thanks buddy :)
<freeflying> will anyone review skim for me , this package is already in universe ,
<ajmitch_> take care of it, it's the only one I have :)
<chillywilly> too much crap on this big server takes forever to boot
<chillywilly> seems like every component has its own BIOS
<chillywilly> there we go
<chillywilly> big fugly stack trace of shit
<chillywilly> no, dice man
<chillywilly> it just crapped all over my screen
<chillywilly> :(((
<sistpoty> freeflying: I'll take a look
<ajmitch_> nasty
<ajmitch_> chillywilly: can you grab the oops & report a bug on that?
<chillywilly> how?
<freeflying> sistpoty: and need UVF ?
<ajmitch_> fingers are for typing ;)
<chillywilly> heh
<sistpoty> freeflying: is it another new upstream version?
<chillywilly> in the mean time I am back to building my own kernel
<freeflying> sistpoty: no , just fix something
<ajmitch_> just dist-upgrade to dapper
<ajmitch_> it'll solve all your problems
<sistpoty> freeflying: then there is no need for an UVF exception
<chillywilly> ajmitch_: I really don't want to be here all night though
<freeflying> sistpoty: thx
<sistpoty> np
<ajmitch_> chillywilly: any clues from the oops as to what it was doing?
<chillywilly> no, not really but I didn't look close
<chillywilly> I can easily reproduce this some other time
<ajmitch_> might be some boot options for workarounds
<chillywilly> probably
<chillywilly> looked like it was in SMP code actually
<chillywilly> IIRC
<ajmitch_> you could try booting a UP kernel for fun
<ajmitch_> all the dapper kernels are SMP now, iirc
<chillywilly> I really have to get this new sangoma card installed and working
<ajmitch_> I know
* ajmitch_ is looking forward to a dual-core box :)
<chillywilly> hopefully dapper will fix my problems
<Lathiat> ajmitch_: as am i :)
<psusi> ajmitch_, it's nice... but not worth the money
<Lathiat> ajmitch_: ordered my case yesterday :)
<chillywilly> in the mean time I'll just build this kernel and see if it will work :(
<psusi> my previous two boxen were SMP
<psusi> this one I decided to save the money
<chillywilly> then try to build the sangoma crap again
<psusi> so... anyone feel like testing out my fixed up udftools package on revu?
<ajmitch_> Lathiat: excellent :)
<psusi> lets you format a cdrw so you can mount it
<sistpoty> freeflying: debdiff looks sane... if it builds fine, I'll upload
<sistpoty> weee... colored build-output *g*
<freeflying> sistpoty: it builds fine
<ajmitch_> sistpoty: I hate coloured build output - it can cause terminal problems :)
<sistpoty> freeflying: k.... but I'm always rebuilding before uploading... I'm a little bit paranoid there ;)
<ajmitch_> sistpoty: as you should
<sistpoty> ajmitch_: hehe
<ajmitch_> I'd have to get siretart to speak firmly to you if you didn't ;)
<freeflying> sistpoty: y
<sistpoty> (and I usually discover some errors just _after_ I uploaded a package I touched)
<sistpoty> :/
<freeflying> sistpoty: :)
<freeflying> sistpoty: would you mind review eva ?
<sistpoty> freeflying: not today any more... it's 4 am here (and I'm getting a little bit tired)
<freeflying> sistpoty: thx
<sistpoty> np
<sistpoty> freeflying: I'm just taking a short look at eva: you should copy config.sub/config.guess in the config.status rule and remove them in clean rule to get them out of .diff.gz
<freeflying> sistpoty: got it , thx
<freeflying> sistpoty: and skim is ok ?
<sistpoty> freeflying: it just got built, I'm taking a further look ;)
<sistpoty> freeflying: for skim: the pkgconfig files (usr/lib/pkgconfig/*.pc) should go into libskim-dev instead of skim, shouldn't they?
<freeflying> sistpoty: no , it should be in skim
<sistpoty> freeflying: why? they refer to libs/headers from the -dev package, or did I miss s.th.?
<freeflying> sistpoty: it in libskim-dev in 1.4.4-0ubuntu1, but skim will not work unless libskim-dev installed
<raphink> yeah!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
<raphink> sorry couldn't help it
<raphink> anyone feels like being a tester here?
<freeflying> raphink: test for what ?
<raphink> revu-tools 0.4
<sistpoty> freeflying: sorry I don't get this... skim won't work if it doesn't have the pkgconfig files?
<sistpoty> (maybe lack of sleep is already showing it's first signs)
<staqen> why doesn't ubuntu include qvm86 (the open source "accelerator" for qemu)? they say it's become very stable by now.
<sistpoty> staqen: because nobody packaged it yet?
<staqen> sistpoty: any idea who's the maintainer for qemu?
<ajmitch_> a debian developer
<sistpoty> staqen: the debian quemu team
<raphink> nobody wants to test it? :'(
<sistpoty> s/quemu/qemu/
<sistpoty> raphink: run it on the eva package plz ;)
<raphink> siretart: ping
<raphink> sistpoty: I mean the package
<freeflying> sistpoty: let me check it
<raphink> sistpoty: I'm not planning on adding 0.4 to REVU SVN this time
<sistpoty> raphink: ah, I see... not tonight, maybe tomorrow
<raphink> as siretart proposed I'm packaging it then it'll be installed on REVU
<ajmitch_> though I'm not sure how well kernel module packaging will be shared across debian & ubuntu
<raphink> sistpoty: I can run 0.3 on eva though :)
<sistpoty> do it ;)
<ajmitch_> staqen: the module would have to be rebuilt for every kernel ABI change
<raphink> sistpoty: I just have to find a url to the current upstream tarball
<staqen> ajmitch_: i see. any solution that you can think of, for the future?
<sistpoty> staqen: is the source available/can you point me to it? (I'm not going to package it but have personal interest in it)
<Tonio_> re all
<ajmitch_> staqen: providing a source package, so that people just have to build it themselves - that's an easy option
<ajmitch_> there are examples of this in debian like alsa-source
<staqen> sistpoty: this is the cvs access: http://savannah.nongnu.org/cvs/?group=qvm86
<sistpoty> staqen: cool, thx
<ajmitch_> it looks stagnant
* raphink is almost asleep 
<ajmitch_> last commit was 5 months ago
<freeflying> sistpoty: u r right , and I correct it ,reuploading
<ajmitch_> mailing list says it needs patches to work against 0.8.0
<raphink> sistpoty: first comment : 0.4.1 is out
<staqen> sistpoty: or this: http://cvs.savannah.nongnu.org/viewcvs/qvm86/?root=qvm86
<sistpoty> freeflying: k, thx... you can also hand me a debdiff, if you prefer
<raphink> sistpoty: second comment : having a watch file would be nice
<freeflying> sistpoty: finsh uploading
<staqen> ajmitch_: i don't know... the qemu folks are all recommending it to me and say it's very stable by now
<ajmitch_> staqen: it worries me that it's seen no active development for awhile though
<sistpoty> staqen: to my knowledge qemu is written quite crude and the kernel module isn't well documented (but this is word in the street from some time ago)
<staqen> ajmitch_: right
<raphink> sistpoty: http://revu.tauware.de/revu1-incoming/eva-0601172210/REVU_report
<sistpoty> raphink: cool... freeflying for eva see ^
<raphink> sistpoty: and commented it on the fly ;)
<raphink> sistpoty: how do you like these reports?
<sistpoty> raphink: they are great, rocking work!
<raphink> :D
<freeflying> raphink: failed to build ?
<sistpoty> raphink: my favorite is stuff done for the upstream tarball, since verfiying it annoys me most
<raphink> yes
<raphink> sistpoty: I insist on debian/watch lately because I've implemented uscan support in my scripts
<raphink> so having a debian/watch allows to have it all automated
<raphink> and this report can be generated by simply running `revu-report`
<sistpoty> raphink: I don't insist on it, but I strongly appreciate it ;)
<raphink> without any argument
<sistpoty> cool
<raphink> sistpoty: well my specification for this set of scripts was :
<raphink> I've got a reveiwing guide on the wiki, with all the steps to be achived. The goal is to have only 1, maximum 2 commands to launch in the console to achive the review.
<freeflying> raphink: build dependency of eva are in dapper , why can't be build ?
<raphink> freeflying: check the buildlog, as indicated
<raphink> all the files are on REVU
<sistpoty> freeflying: buildlog is there as well: http://revu.tauware.de/revu1-incoming/eva-0601172210/eva_0.4.0-0ubuntu1.buildlog
<raphink> :)
<sistpoty> freeflying: you seem to be missing automake1.6 (iirc automake1.6 is also gone from the archives)
<raphink> yep
<raphink> it's gone
<sistpoty> raphink: well, you'll always have to look "by hand", but with your rocking scripts you can focus on only the important stuff :)
<raphink> with some packages to fix
<raphink> sistpoty: no, I mean
<raphink> with REVU, you can look on the web interface which imo is much nicer
<raphink> running revu-scripts on REVU just completes the whole stuff
<raphink> so after running revu-report
<raphink> all you should have to do is read the reports and the package components on the web interface
<raphink> that's what I mean by not running anything else in a console
<raphink> next step is to use mdt to check for the presence of the package in any versions of Debian and Ubuntu
<raphink> and then try to check for bugs reported on Debian or Ubuntu that might explain that is was nuked, or reveal that an ITP was already filed on Debian for it
<raphink> quite a lot of work to go, but useful imo :)
<sistpoty> raphink: ah, well... (maybe I'm still used too much to look at files via vim... *g*)
<raphink> hrhr
* raphink is a pico fan
<raphink> I see Riddell uploaded scim-anthy
<raphink> it's not latest version though
<raphink> the version uploaded today from REVU is 0.8.0
<raphink> although latest version is 0.9.0
<psusi> raphink, omg... you're kidding?  try emacs... if you're doing anything more than editing one or two lines, it's a must
<raphink> psusi: I shall
<raphink> been using nano for years now and quite happy with it so far
<raphink> say, choosing an editor is really not a priority for me
<raphink> as long as I can edit with it
<raphink> but then I understand I could do much more with emacs or even vim ;)
<psusi> pico/nano is fine if you just need to quickly edit one or two settings in a conf file or something
<psusi> but if you are coding, emacs is a godsend
<raphink> psusi: believe it or not, I'm developping revu-tools in nano ;)
<psusi> omg.... you NEED to learn emacs ;)
<raphink> haha
<raphink> ok I will, when I get time for that
<raphink> :)
<raphink> btw, wanna test my package psusi ?
<psusi> fire it up, hit ctrl-h t and it will walk you through a basic interactive tutorial... takes like 10 mins
<psusi> what package?
<psusi> you want to test mine? ;)
<raphink> revu-tools 0.4
<psusi> hrm... what is it?
<raphink> hmm it's 5 AM I was planning to go to bed ;)
<raphink> psusi: reviewing tools
<sistpoty> psusi: bah, interactive tutorial... we wouldn't be nerds if we wanted this? :P
<psusi> hrm... sounds interesting... tell me more
<raphink> psusi: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU/REVU-Tools
<psusi> sistpoty, hey... don't knock info pages ;)
<sistpoty> hehe
* psusi is attempting to get sourceforge.net to hand ownership of the linux udf project to him since the original author appears to have abandoned it and vanished
<ajmitch_> good luck :)
<psusi> I'd rather not maintain ubuntu patches indefinately ;)
<ajmitch_> they'll probably want you to register udftools-ng or something ;)
<raphink> psusi: and here is latest changelog http://revu.tauware.de/~raphink/revu-tools/Changelog
<raphink> psusi: and if you want to make me happy and test the best, it's on http://revu.tauware.de/~raphink/debs/ :)
<raphink> s/best/deb/
* raphink is tired
* raphink is gonna test the bed rather than the deb
<psusi> hehe
<psusi> I'm still trying to figure out exactly what the revu process is ;)
<psusi> and cracking a beer
<raphink> psusi: how do you mean?
<raphink> what revu process?
<raphink> you mean how the tool works?
<psusi> the one that this package automatizes
<raphink> ok
<raphink> well
<raphink> as I said to sistpoty before
<psusi> yea... I'm reading about it now... but don't really know what the old way of doing things was, so... I've got some reading to do
<raphink> ok
<raphink> psusi: it refers to the reviewing guide I wrote earlier : https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/Reviewing
<psusi> ohh, don't you have to be a revu admin to test this?
<psusi> yea, I'm reading that now
<raphink> psusi: basically the idea is that after running revu-report, all this reviewing guide could be followed with steps on REVU
<raphink> without having to type any thing else in a console
<raphink> psusi: no, the deb is revu-independant now
<raphink> it works on any machine :)
<raphink> with a pbuilder, lintian and linda
<raphink> and devscripts of course
<raphink> I'm hoping it can also be used by packagers to check their own packages
<psusi> interesting.... I'm hoping I can learn exactly what all that means and become a revu admin ;)
<sistpoty> psusi: are you motu already? if not you should first become a motu ;)
<psusi> wait... what's the difference?
<raphink> sistpoty: or first question should be : are you a member already?
<sistpoty> hehe
<raphink> ;)
<psusi> anyone can package and upload to revu... need an admin to review and it upload to the archive right?
<raphink> sistpoty: oh well can't you be a revu admin without even being a member in some cases ? ;)
<psusi> well, according to launchpad, I'm an ubuntaro... and I have upload access to revu
<raphink> psusi: that doens't mean anything
<raphink> ubuntero means you've signed the CoC
<sistpoty> raphink: you can be a reviewer at least in some very special cases ;)
<raphink> this is pre-membership
<psusi> raphink, right...
<raphink> and you can upload even not being an ubuntero
<raphink> as soon asyour key is added to the REVU keyring
<raphink> REVU not even being officially part of Ubuntu
<raphink> ;)
<raphink> psusi: so if you're not a member, first step is to be one :)
<psusi> ok... so what's being a motu officially mean?
<sistpoty> raphink: btw.: do you have super-cow-powers on tiber?
<raphink> to be a motu you need to be a dev psusi
<psusi> ohh, right... the proposing myself to the CC right?
<raphink> sistpoty: I have pbuilder and svn powers on tiber iirc
<psusi> yea... I need to do that at some point....
<raphink> psusi: yep
<psusi> still need to figure out exactly what is required of me for that
<raphink> psusi: there are Howto on the wiki for that
<sistpoty> raphink: root-rights? (would that help you)?
<raphink> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NewMemberHowto psusi
<psusi> yea... I need to read that again...
<psusi> takes a few times to sink in
<raphink> sistpoty: I don't think I hvae them right now
<raphink> course it would help though sistpoty
<raphink> I had to ask siretart to install libwww-perl a few days ago
<raphink> and now I plan to upgrade revu-tools through my deb
<raphink> so at least on the install stuff
<sistpoty> raphink: I'll propose that to siretart ;)
<raphink> but this is high rights
<freeflying> raphink: after being a member , what can I do then ? :)
<raphink> freeflying: work
<raphink> ;)
<raphink> freeflying: so you get to apply for dev if you want
<raphink> then once you're dev you just need to ask to be in the MOTU team
<raphink> and then you can still work....
<raphink> so you get to apply for core-dev later
<raphink> if you want
<freeflying> hmm
<raphink> and if you're accepted, of course, for each step
<sistpoty> freeflying: just uploaded skim ;)
<raphink> or you can join the secret MOTU-main-takeover team
<raphink> so you don't have to be a core dev, just prepare the revolution ;)
<ajmitch_> raphink: secret?
<raphink> hmm ajmitch_ if it's not secret officially then it's not a true revolution, is it?
<freeflying> sistpoty: nice ,
<ajmitch_> raphink: there are already enough MOTUs in the core-dev team :)
<sistpoty> freeflying: another small note: please try to be more verbose in the changelog in the future, i.e. what exactly did you change to packaging/what files did you move etc.
<raphink> ajmitch_: that was just a 5:30AM joke
<ajmitch_> raphink: poor you :)
<raphink> ajmitch_: :p
<freeflying> sistpoty: right
<ajmitch_> raphink: I count 8 MOTUs who can upload to main
<raphink> great :)
<ajmitch_> currently not enough MOTUs who are DDs as well
<raphink> mhm
<raphink> I'm not to apply for NM any soon I guess
* sistpoty never needs to ask in -devel to get uploads for his main package sponsored
<raphink> got other things to do
<ajmitch_> same here :)
<raphink> I've got DDs to sponsor my packages if needed
<raphink> anyway
* ajmitch_ knows some friendly DDs & main devs
<sistpoty> ajmitch_: but quite some are in NM (and maybe I'll go for NM soon as well) ;)
<psusi> raphink, one feature of emacs that I find very handy when working on packages is it's diff mode.... I usually make changes, test, then diff with the original directory... open it in emacs and it colorizes the files
<ajmitch_> sistpoty: but that could take a year or more
<psusi> raphink, and you can copy/paste hunks or all hunks of a file with one keystroke
<raphink> psusi: nice
<psusi> so I can pick and choose which parts I need to put into a debian/patch-x-foo.diff
<sistpoty> ajmitch_: yes, that's just one of the problems of debian imho
<psusi> cut and paste real easy
<raphink> :)
<sistpoty> (but what do i know ;)
<psusi> hell, pico doesn't even have undo does it?
<raphink> psusi: not even
<raphink> psusi: that forces you to think before doing stuff
<raphink> ;)
<psusi> outch
<raphink> lol
<ajmitch_> raphink: it's broken my design
<raphink> yeah it's painful
<ajmitch_> s/my/by/
<raphink> ajmitch_: as I said to psusi, believe it or not, I've developped revu-tools in nano so far
<raphink> in nano _only_
<raphink> about 1000 lines of bash in nano ;)
<raphink> or so
<psusi> folding is another really cool feature that I really need to get into the habbit of using... emacs can hide/unhide blocks of code based on the block nesting kind of like a tree
<raphink> and no I'm not totally masochist
<ajmitch_> raphink: that's not too much
<sistpoty> raphink: do you think you get extra karma because of this? :P
<raphink> sistpoty: no :p
<raphink> ajmitch_: it's too much in nano
<raphink> not too much in total
<ajmitch_> raphink: anything more than 1 line is too much in nano
<raphink> haha
<freeflying> who can tell me something about ubuntu.com's website
<ajmitch_> freeflying: it exists?
<psusi> searching, moving, replacing, everything is so much nicer in emacs
<ajmitch_> freeflying: define 'something'
<raphink> freeflying: maybe whois can tell you
<raphink> freeflying: if you're talking about the DNS that is
<raphink> if you're talking about the programming language, I can't tell
<psusi> though I find myself sometimes hitting emacs key bindings while editing code at work in the proprietary windows IDE I have to use and wondering WTF it isn't working ;)
<raphink> if you're talking about the colours, it's mostly brown
<raphink> as ajmitch_ said freeflying it's just about what you mean by "something"
<freeflying> I need the theme of website for hosting kubun-cn
<psusi> usually c-a and c-e to go to the start/end of the current line
<sistpoty> freeflying: you could adress this issue in a CommunityCouncil-meeting... I'm quite sure there won't be problems
<freeflying> sistpoty: ok
<LaserJock> lol, I just realized my iMac doesn't have a floppy drive.
<psusi> I don't have a floppy drive... floppies suck hairy balls
* psusi wrote a floppy driver for ReactOS once... horrible, horrible hardware
<sistpoty> raphink: I just flew over your reviewing guide... and found two minor things
<raphink> sistpoty: what are they?
<raphink> sistpoty: feel free to correct them of course :)=
<ajmitch_> LaserJock: floppy drive? what's that?
<LaserJock> psusi: well, unfortunately I had to put some data on a floppy disk. I'll have to go home and put it on a usb stick
<sistpoty> raphink: multiple entries in changelog: Sometimes they are there for purpose, like giving credits to a source where you get an almost good sourcepackage from
<crimsun> I'm fond of floppy diskettes.
<crimsun> they've saved my arse more than once in the many years I've run Sid
<LaserJock> ajmitch_: yeah, yeah. I'm just glad it was a 3 1/2" floppy and not the 5" ;-)
<psusi> LaserJock, you can use a cdrw or dvdrw too if you grab the udftools package ;)
<raphink> sistpoty: yes
<psusi> crimsun, cd >>>>> floppy
<ajmitch_> LaserJock: I think I've still got a working 5&1/4" drive in the cupboard :)
<raphink> sistpoty: then thing slike [Original Author]  [Ubuntu Pakager]  can be used in the initial release entry
<LaserJock> psusi: the machine I was collecting data from can only store data on a floppy :(
* psusi remembers modifying the format of floppies to fit 1920 KB on them... like 8 years ago ;)
<sistpoty> raphink: the other one is stuff outside of debian-dir in .diff.gz... some ppl. prefer to use a VCS to manage their package and adding a patch-system would also seem overkill in some places (like few lines changed in makefile or so)
<psusi> LaserJock, outch....
<sistpoty> raphink: but generally it's a very good guide :)
<raphink> ty
<raphink> sistpoty: well just feel free to update/correct it
<ajmitch_> raphink: I really do like having multiple changelog entries rather than having only 1
<sistpoty> raphink: not now... too tired ;)
<raphink> hehe
<raphink> same here
<ajmitch_> raphink: and stating that changes not in the archive must not be mentioned.. I find that to be silly
<raphink> ajmitch_: the idea I got when I learned to review was that only the versions officially in Ubuntu or Debian should appear int he changelog
<raphink> otherwise you might think some versions existed before but can't find a track of them
<sistpoty> raphink: oh, and I found that in some notes from you: x.y.z-rc should be x.y.(z-1)+rc... imo x.y.z-rc is also good (at least ajmitch_ told me it was)
<raphink> I'll check with dpkg --compare-versions then :)
<ajmitch_> sistpoty: only if you make sure the final is named something like x.y.z-rel
<raphink> although I'm pretty sure if ajmitch_ said it it must be true :)
<ajmitch_> or something that is higher than rc :)
<sistpoty> ajmitch_: thx for pointing that out ;)
<ajmitch_> raphink: :P
<raphink> ajmitch_: oh yeah sure
<ajmitch_> eg 0.5.2rel-2 > 0.5.2rc8-9
<ajmitch_> it's nicer than sticking an epoch on front
<raphink> ajmitch_: but then the reason why I prefer to use (z-1) is tha tyou never know what numbering scheme upstream is gonna use after rc
<raphink> ;)
<ajmitch_> raphink: umm, you put the rel on yourself
<raphink> that's an option for sure
<ajmitch_> you don't have to stick absolutely to whatever braindamage upstream spews out
<raphink> hehe
<raphink> can be a good idea to mention that option
<sistpoty> raphink: for the changelog you could see pyfribidi, which I made (and got adopted to unstable before ubuntu)... the maintainer explicitely kept the changelog for credits ;)
<ajmitch_> upstream developers aren't always so good at release management :)
<ajmitch_> sistpoty: that's how it should be done, IMHO
<psusi> oh crap... the CC already met today
* raphink used to have release management questions from upstream
<sistpoty> hehe
<raphink> psusi: yep
<psusi> would have been nice if I made it in that one... tomorrow is my birthday ;)
<raphink> psusi: and we welcomed two MOTU-Hopefuls as almost-members
<psusi> almost-members?
<raphink> psusi: indeed
<ajmitch_> no quorum for voting?
<raphink> psusi: mako was not here, so there were only 2 members of the CC
<raphink> while 3 are required
<psusi> ahhh
* sistpoty missed it again
<ajmitch_> raphink: who were the new members to be ratified?
<psusi> question... what's the deal with bazaar?  why make yet another vcs?  what's wrong with svn or git? ( though I've not used git before )
<raphink> ajmitch_: for the MOTU Hopefuls, jpatrick and gloubigoulba
<ajmitch_> psusi: they have different purposes
<ajmitch_> psusi: svn is centralised
<sistpoty> psusi: bzr is not centralized and branching is much better supported in there
<psusi> sistpoty, isn't that what git is for?
<crimsun> git is still centralised of sorts
<ajmitch_> git was started after bzr was, and is focused on specific use cases (kernel)
<ajmitch_> bzr is more general purpose, and a lot nicer than git imho :)
<psusi> I thought that was git's whole point?  full decentralization... you can push/pull between anywhere... repository and workign copy are unified... no?
<sistpoty> psusi: I've never used git before... but imo git deals with patches, whereas bzr can deal with e.g. local commits/commits from merging another branch
<psusi> hrm.... damnit... now I'm going to have to learn both so I can compare them
<ajmitch_> http://bazaar.canonical.com/SCMComparisons
<psusi> it sounds like git can do all kinds of neat stuff...
<ajmitch_> sure
<crimsun> psusi: full always depends on the use, though. For those of us who feed patches, it's not quite as decentralised as it may seem.
<ajmitch_> and bzr can do all that & more
<psusi> hrm...
<raphink|sleep> gn8
<ajmitch_> psusi: you might as well ask why git was started when bzr already existed
<psusi> crimsun, by the sound of it, everyone and their mother has a git tree, and patches get pushed back and forth betwen them
<sistpoty> gn8 raphink|sleep
<ajmitch_> and bzr was started based on lessons learnt from bazaar 1.x
<crimsun> psusi: to some extent, yes. But I can't push to benc's, zul's, fabbione's, infinity's, etc.
* psusi just likes svn because you can connect to it via ssl and authenticate with a client certificate... no need for passwords
<crimsun> (nor does benc automerge for that matter)
<psusi> crimsun, you could if you had permission couldn't you?
<crimsun> psusi: theoretically
<psusi> well, there you go ;)
<crimsun> again, use, as I mentioned above ;)
<psusi> I've been trying to figure out how to track the current status of some patches I sent in to lkml.... I think they got put into either the -mm or linus tree... I'd like to figure out how to make sure and check if they have made it into the ubuntu tree
<ajmitch_> gitk is a nice visual frontend once you have a branch checked out
<crimsun> I normally use a combination of ``git pull'' and http://kernel.org/git/
<psusi> heh... I usually learn from bottom up... try to figure out the most minimalistic bare mettal way of doing things to really understand it... then work up to simpler methods from there
<crimsun> you can certainly do that. git's all plumbing.
<psusi> yea... I like to learn the plumbing first, then appreciate the porceline
<ajmitch_> one thing about git is that it is fast on big trees
<psusi> hrm...
<ajmitch_> we do have bzr developers in this channel though :)
<sistpoty> isn't bzr also based on some git-technology (imo I read this somewhere) ;)
<psusi> well... I'm going to have to learn both.... ubuntu uses git for the kernel, and bzr for everything else?  or have I read some things use svn?
<sistpoty> revu development uses svn :P
<ajmitch_> sistpoty: git was started after bzr, so not so likely
<crimsun> afaik only ubuntu-kernel uses git
<ajmitch_> and the kernel uses git solely because git is the tool for the kernel
<ajmitch_> it was written for that use
<sistpoty> ajmitch_: ah, k... then my memory is wrong ;)
<ajmitch_> lifeless can correct me if I'm wrong
<ajmitch_> which is quite likely
<sistpoty> same goes for my memory at this time ;)
<psusi> am I weird for disliking gpg?
<psusi> openssl just seems so much nicer
<ajmitch_> they're completely separate things?
<psusi> seperate yes... but do many of the same things
<psusi> and I don't like the way gpg does things
<ajmitch_> they do a few of the same things
<psusi> many.... encryption.... signing... secure email.... authentication...
<psusi> openssl does most of what both gpg and ssh combined do
<ajmitch_> only if you look at it from a 10-mile view ignoring any & all details ;)
<psusi> well... with reguard to email... openssl does s/mime... which is well... actually a standard.... unlike gpg, which I find annoying because it's just inline text for signatures for instance
<psusi> and x.509 digital certificates make more sense to me than bare RSA keypairs that gpg uses
<psusi> doesn't require key servers for instance
<psusi> and can gpg encrypt an email for multiple recipients?
* ajmitch_ doesn't know why you're trying to argue this here
<psusi> I get the impression that it directly encrypts the message with their public key rather than a random symetric cipher whose key is then encrypted using the recipient's public key
<crimsun> that's normally something done by an MUA, psusi
<psusi> probably because I've had a fair amoutn to drink
<crimsun> many commercial packages like Lotus Notes use certificates
<psusi> yes.... and so does openssl... gpg doesn't... it's the weirdo
<sistpoty> psusi: gpg is about web of trust, can s.th. do this w.o. keyserver?
<psusi> a "web of trust" doesn't make sense to me.... trust comes from chains, not webs
<jamessan> isn't a web just a bunch of chains?
<sistpoty> psusi: what's the difference?
<psusi> I still don't quite get the web
<psusi> with x.509, you have a CA that both parties trust and signs their certificates
<psusi> then the two parties exchange certificates and they can verify that they are talking to the right person and encrypt their communication
<sistpoty> psusi: it's about a signed key of b and trusts him... I trust a to a certain amount so I trust b to a (less certain) amount because a signed b
<sistpoty> (sorry for not using foo and bar here)
<psusi> sistpoty, so if I sign your key.. and you sign foo's key.. and foo sign's bar's key... and bar sends me an email, my email client can see that chain and decide the message comes from a trusted source and has not been tampered with?
<sistpoty> psusi: to my knowledge mua's can't do that (yet?)... but you can track exactly this path of trust
<psusi> see, mua's can do that with s/mime
<psusi> or rather, they can see that the message has not been tampered with since it was signed by the sender's certificate... and that that certificate is signed by a trusted CA
<sistpoty> psusi: and that's the difference... you don't need a CA with gpg
<psusi> then you can reply and encrypt that reply so only they can read it... and without the need for any key servers
<psusi> yea, but you need key servers
<psusi> also... the gpg generates signatures appear as inline garbage to mua's that dont understand it... with s/mime, it appears as an attachment
<ajmitch_> and gpg signatures can be attachments too.. so what?
<psusi> they can?
<ajmitch_> if the MUA isn't broken
<sistpoty> sure... iirc using inline signatures is deprecated (and has to do s.th. with outlook which I just don't remember any longer)
<psusi> s.th?
<ajmitch_> something
<psusi> what do non inline signatures look like to non gpg aware muas?
<psusi> I see inline ones from time to time on mailing lists, but that's it
<psusi> and when I signed the coc on malone, it sent me an email with the signature inline
<sistpoty> psusi: iirc outlook can not (or could not) display mails with gpg attachments right... (but I don't recall exactly the details)
<ajmitch_> probably because outlook is a rather broken MUA :)
* psusi uses thunderbird
<psusi> malone definately sent a single part mime message plain text... I looked at the source
<psusi> with s/mime, I believe there is a header that says this is an encrypted message or something... then the encrypted mime part...
<ajmitch_> which is what should be done with gpg
<psusi> thunderbird transparently decrypts it and shows you the message.... non s/mime aware clients though would just see the little part about this being an encrypted message, and an attachment
<ajmitch_> psusi: where did you see signed email from malone?
<sistpoty> psusi: I get quite some "wrong" stuff (signature is wrong) from malone/LP... which says LP touched the msg.
<psusi> ajmitch_, it was encrypted actually, not signed... when I asked to sign the coc
<ajmitch_> right
<ajmitch_> so launchpad, not malone
<psusi> err... yea
<psusi> I see that sort of thing from some people on mailing lists too
<psusi> but thunderbird, outlook, and probably several others understand s/mime just fine.. and I can see who sent the message and reply with an encrypted message if I choose... all without a keyserver
<ajmitch_> that's great
* ajmitch_ has to run away now, bbl
<sistpoty> cya ajmitch_
<sistpoty> psusi: (w.o. knowing what exactly s/mime is): how can s/mime make sure the msg is not tampered with?
<psusi> sistpoty, s/mime is a mime standard for secure email... openssl supports it... it generates a hash of the message ( MD5 or SHA, etc ) then encrypts that using the signer's private key ( RSA or DSA )
<psusi> sistpoty, the recipient then can decrypt the encrypted hash with the sender's public key, and compute their own hash of the message and make sure it matches
<sistpoty> psusi: where do the private/public keys come from?
<psusi> x.509 certificates ( ISO standard )
<sistpoty> psusi: I want to send and encrypted s/mime msg... where can I get the public key of the receiver?
<sistpoty> oh, got it wrong... sorry
<psusi> have them email it to you is one way
<psusi> just have them send you a signed message
<sistpoty> you know what i mean? ;)
<psusi> ?
<sistpoty> (you explained it differently than I replied;)
<sistpoty> psusi: but how can I make sure, the sender *is* the sender of the msg in the first place, when I don't have his key yet?
<psusi> sistpoty, because his certificate is signed by an authority that you trust who verified his identify...
<sistpoty> psusi: then how do I know I trust that very authority?
<psusi> like verisign, or... eventually it would be nice if the gov't set up their own CA ot issue electronic docmuments and do away with paper ones
<psusi> because you have configured your system to trust them by installing their certificate as a trusted CA certificate
<psusi> because you believe that they do a good job of validating proper documents to be assured of the identity of applicants
<sistpoty> psusi: then this all ends up having s.th. like a "keyserver" ;) (having one authority I trust seems pretty much like having a keyserver, doesn't it?)
<psusi> no... because the keyserver must be accessible to validate a message from a new person... a CA doesn't
<sistpoty> but I can switch to another keyserver pretty quickly, since each keyserver (should be) is syncronised to each other
<sistpoty> but basically, I get the impression... both types have there pro's and con's (like what is when a CA isn't trustworthy?) (or the keyserver must be present problem)... so I think it's good to have them both
<sistpoty> and psusi: thanks for the insights what s/mime is about ;)
<psusi> no problem...
<psusi> they are definately similar... but s/mime is a more widely supported standard, whereas gpg is a home grown solution
<psusi> also... the same x.509 certificate you use for email can be used for IPSec and SSL connections
<sistpoty> he, but homegrown solutions is one thing FOSS stands for, isn't it? ;)
<psusi> no.... FOSS stands for solutions that are free to everyone and come with source
<psusi> if that solution must be homegrown, so be it... but if there's a good standard already... use it
<sistpoty> hehe, another point of view ;)
<psusi> I just find ssl and s/mime to be less kludgey feeling than ssh and gpg I guess
<psusi> and more widely supported
<sistpoty> I can't tell about what's more widely supported... I don't have that kludgey feeling though...
<sistpoty> anyway, it's almost 7am here, and I think I'll open a beer right now and go out for a smoke (before I finally fall into bed)
<psusi> lol....
<sistpoty> brb
* psusi quit smoking
<psusi> but bet does sound good
<sistpoty> you're lucky... I tried several times but failed
<psusi> it ain't easy
<psusi> and yea, this is probably the 4th time I've tried
<psusi> but this time I'm sticking to it... I'm sick and tired of being sick and tired
<sistpoty> :)
<psusi> and it certainly makes working out easier, which is nice
<psusi> well, night...
<sistpoty> gn8 psusi
<sistpoty> gn8 everyone
<lfittl> gn8 sistpoty
<dolson> crimsun: it appears I was wrong.. the packages build, but the SConstruct file has changed, so the -gtk and -gtk-686 packages are not build properly I don't think
<zakame> hello MOTUs
<lifeless> psusi the doc team use svn
<lifeless> git is used by the kernel so we use it too at this point
<lucas> I have some sync requests pending for more than a week
<lucas> somebody know if elmo has a huge backlog those days ?
<zakame> er probably because of the rollout
<zakame> hmm motu-school's been off for a long time :/
<lucas> yeah
* lucas finds UVF difficult to manage from a MOTU POV ...
<lucas> it's a bit frustrating
<siretart> lucas: you are right. I feel the same. but I don't know a better way
<zakame> well yeah there are bits that are quite difficult, but right now we need to do polish :)
<lucas> yeah, we have 1130 packages with newer versions in debian
<lucas> some of them might fix huge bugs
<lucas> and we don't even know about it
<lucas> just because we can't review them all
<dolson> you need more MOTUs
<zakame> hmm yeah, but if we play catchup we'll never finish dapper ;)
<zakame> on all pkgs, that is
<lucas> yeah, but it sucks, since some packages might be of high importance to somebod
<lucas> y
<lucas> and if we release with an outdated verison
<lucas> he could complain
<siretart> dolson: yes, and since we don't have more motus, and are not likley to increase our numbers in short way, this won't work
<zakame> :(
<siretart> zakame: the only reasonable thing to do is to decrease divergence
<torkel> better to get complains about outdated packages than packages that crashes every five minutes
<zakame> siretart+1
<dolson> well I'm attempting at learning how to do packaging, so some day I could possibly help in some way
<siretart> torkel: how do you know that we don't have packages that crash every five minutes which could be fixed by syncing a newer revision of the package?
<zakame> is there any more input on DCT then?
<siretart> the point is that we don't know
<torkel> siretart: on the other hand you don't know if syncing a newer version gives you less bugs
<lucas> siretart: [+1] 
<lucas> zakame: I'll try to work on DCT next week. The problem is that we need more Ubuntu devs to get involved if we want it to be successful
<zakame> lucas: w00t count me in then ;)
<siretart> lucas: I'm quite busy today with other stuff (uni, work, etc.), but I intend to prepare an email to ubuntu-devel, perhaps to u-d-a, describing the problem. I'd like you to review it, okay?
<siretart> perhaps the next days
<siretart> morning dholbach!
<dholbach> hey siretart
<lucas> siretart: I've started a wiki page about it, just to write some thoughts
<lucas> ping me when you start working on this
<lucas> somebody has a source for "we will support dapper for 3 years" on www.ubuntu.com or wiki.ubuntu.com ?
<dholbach> good morning!
* lucas can't find any (strange)
<siretart> lucas: oh, which wiki page is this?
<dholbach> it will be on dapper's release announcement
<dholbach> and on ubuntu-devel@ too
<zakame> heya dholbach :D
<dholbach> hey zakame
<siretart> dholbach: do we already have some place to propose Candidates for removal?
<dholbach> siretart: I think not, it'd be good to list the ones we already requested somewhere.
<siretart> dholbach: okay, I'll start a wiki page: wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/RemovalCandidates, okay?
<dholbach> Did we remove the MorgueCandidates page?
<dholbach> If not, it'd be a good idea to just have one.
* siretart checks
<siretart> dholbach: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MorgueCandidates this one exists
<siretart> but last edit was in November. we could revive that
<dholbach> Yeah.
<lucas> siretart: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LucasNussbaum/UVFManagementInMOTU
<dholbach> What's the deal with flashplugin-nonfree?
<dholbach> Is it a new upstream version we want to include?
<jpatrick> morning dholbach
<lucas> dholbach: no
<lucas> no UVF exception required
<dholbach> Can somebody have a look at this list and tell me, if I forgot something:
<dholbach> not enough discussion: scim-tables, afterstep, gnome-rdp, skim
<dholbach> to pass on: gmime2.1, beagle, ikvm, wine
<dholbach> approved: lyx, ipython, libgettext-ruby, sisu, psi, libgdiplus, liferea, byzanz, jabberd2, soundconverter, bzrtools
<dholbach> GAR, no MOTU report written yet.
* dholbach cries
<siretart> dholbach: I have another request: schroot, but I have to write the report first
<jpatrick> Is this MainInclusion?
<dholbach> No.
<dholbach> UVF = Upstream Version Freeze.
<jpatrick> ok
<ajmitch_> hi
<Pygi> hello
<ajmitch_> dholbach: what do you mean 'to pass on'?
<ajmitch_> I see I was too late with f-spot for this week
<ajmitch_> oh well, I guess it can wait for another 3 weeks until I get back
<dholbach> Mail it to the list.
<dholbach> We'll discuss it and I'll pass it on to Matt and Colin on Sunday/Monday.
<ajmitch_> ok
* ajmitch_ won't be around to discuss from tomorrow
<dholbach> Just prepare and send it then.
<ajmitch_> lucky me is going off to australia for some work
* dholbach -> off, dogwalk
<dholbach> brb
<ajmitch_> ok, bye then
<jpatrick> someone care to look at: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=1690
<lfittl> dholbach: ping
<dholbach> lfittl: pong
<jpatrick> can someone help me with these? http://pastebin.com/544672
<siretart> sbuild rocks
<ajmitch_> siretart: ?
<siretart> ajmitch_: I made sbuild run on my laptop on lvm snapshots
<ajmitch_> great, you must show me how to configure it for that :)
<ajmitch_> is it any faster?
<siretart> I don't feel it runnay way faster. but you don't need to purge your chroot after build anymore
<siretart> and you can guarantee a clean chroot
<ajmitch_> ok
<ajmitch_> but purge & untar aren't the operations that slow it down significantly
<siretart> ajmitch_: in order to make this work, you need the latest schroot from unstable, plus the latest lvm-snapshot capable sbuild version rleigh sent me by email ;)
<ajmitch_> right
* ajmitch_ might not have much net access after about 12 hours from now
<ajmitch_> so it probably doesn't matter
<ajmitch_> unless there's wireless in the area where I'll be (very unlikely)
<azeem> lifeless: my ThinkPad mostly died last Friday, the display flickers at random times and then it freezes :/
<azeem> I thought I found a loose screw after opening up the keyboard, but last night/this morning I couldn't even get it to boot anymore
<lifeless> azeem: :[
<siretart> azeem: :(
<siretart> lifeless: did you read my question yesterday about pybaz vs. python2.4-bazaar? which of them is deprecated?
<lifeless> siretart: did you read my answer
<siretart> oh, I did not. sorry
<siretart> ah, there it is. /me rechecks
<siretart> ah, that seems to be cruft in /etc/apt/sources.list. sorry for bothering
<siretart> lucas: I've just looked at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LucasNussbaum/UVFManagementInMOTU, and I have some comments, why some of your proposals won't work, but I don't have time to answer them right now
<siretart> lucas: could you please just paste https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LucasNussbaum/UVFManagementInMOTU?action-raw to our mailing list so that I can answer via email? thanks
<lucas> siretart: maybe it's better if we discuss it together ?
<lucas> (first)
<lucas> before starting a thread on the mailing list
* netjoined: irc.freenode.net -> brown.freenode.net
<ogra> lucas, it was discussed to extend at UBZ while we made the release schedule ...
<Tonio_> hi
<Gloubiboulga> hello Tonio_
<lucas> I wasn't at UBZ
<ogra> but a lot of MOTUs were and took part in that discussion ...
<lucas> is a video available or something ?
<ogra> additionally it was held on IRC to make it possible to see what we are doing
<zakame> heya MOTUs!
<ajmitch_> hi zakame
<zakame> hi ajmitch_
<ogra> (together with a gobby session, so you could edit the schedule remotely)
<siretart> lucas: short remark about your proposed syncing mechanism
<siretart> lucas: current syncing works via a script which only elmo can access
<zakame> what's this?
<siretart> lucas: it does not only syncing, but does also integrate with mom and perhaps other stuff: short there is currently no other way for syncing
<lucas> yeah, but this is infrastructure
<lucas> most of the infrastructure in Ubuntu/MOTU isn't good enough, but we know that
<siretart> there is a spec for launchpad to inlcude that: https://wiki.launchpad.canonical.com/PackageSourceManagement
<siretart> with that implemented, 'normal' developers will be able to access that script, AFAIU
<Yagisan> yeah, it's not like we can set this up at home. Although with a bit of effort you can set up your own w-b system
<siretart> I think this is rather critical to us, we should mention that to launchpad folks as well as to ubuntu-devel
<siretart> lucas: you proposed some criteria when to sync
<lucas> I personnally think that elmo should work on main packages, and that MOTU should handle syncs inside universe themselves
<siretart> 'test' builds in advance can be quite expensive, but I think it is okay, when queued low priority. this should be done with the launchpad build network, though
<jpatrick> siretart: revu has gone missing
<lucas> seriously, on today's architectures, even building openoffice isn't that expensive
<ajmitch_> jpatrick: looks like tiber fell over :)
<siretart> the installation test could be done with diziets work on debtest (or however it is called)
* StevenK waves to ajmitch_.
<ajmitch_> hi StevenK
<StevenK> ajmitch_: You're up late.
<ajmitch_> moderately so
<StevenK> siretart: Fixed Linda on REVU yet? ;-)
<lucas> siretart: autopkgtest is just the framework
<siretart> other option would be a britney run on universe, which ajmitch is currently working on
<lucas> piuparts does installation checks
<Yagisan> ajmitch_ never sleeps. He just pretends too so he can lurk ;)
<siretart> piuparts is not integrated into launchpad
<ajmitch_> Yagisan: shh
<lucas> there was a life before launchpad
<siretart> lucas: what concerns me most is the last argument: "The updated package has been in Debian sid for ''n'' days, without any severity >= normal bug opened against it"
<StevenK> Yagisan: Oh, spoke to work. The word was 'send in your CV'
<ajmitch_> siretart: I'll try & appear online when I can - I'll be offline for a bit over the next couple of weeks though :)
<siretart> lucas: this won't work like that. You have to check what other packages this would break. again, checked in debian by britney
<lucas> we don't need to get everything integrated in launchpad
<lucas> siretart: the main point of my wiki page is not the example proposal at the end
<lucas> but the list of issues before it
<lucas> the proposal is just an example of what could be acceptable with some tuning
<siretart> thats the reason why I wanted to discuss this via emal
<siretart> email
<siretart> lucas: then I didn't quite get your proposal
<lucas> it's not really a proposal
<lucas> it's a "I'm tired of UVF and the current handling of universe" rant
<siretart> if you want to improve the sync process (what really needs to be improved), then you have to know that the current process is via elmo, and will move to launchpad somewhen
<dholbach> This is a "I'm tired of rants." rant.
<siretart> lucas: I don't think UVF is the culprit. UVF doesn't prohibit updates
<ogra> lucas, you did that rant from the first day in this channel ... we all heard it before ...
<ogra> whats the usecase for putting it on the wiki additionally ? #
<siretart> ogra: discussion
<siretart> thats okay
<ogra> just putting it in more places wont change the facts ...
<siretart> which facts? I don't see many
<lucas> ogra: is it fordidden to use sub-pages of your personal homepage to write stuff about Ubuntu ?
<ogra> lucas, nope
<lucas> ok. then stop complaining.
<ogra> siretart, that we need more time for bugfixing in dapper and this the UVF is more strict this time for example
<siretart> UVF does not prohibit bugfixing
<siretart> you can still upload until the day before release
<ogra> thats not what i wrote
* StevenK has been fixing build failures when he has time.
<StevenK> One to two a night.
<ogra> siretart, UVF is about concentrating on bugfixes instead of looking for the newest shiny features and versions
<StevenK> fort77 -O2  -c -o somnec.o somnec.f
<StevenK> sh: line 1:  3253 Segmentation fault      /usr/bin/f2c -Nn802 -I. <somnec.f >/tmp/fort77-3251-1.c
<StevenK> /usr/bin/fort77: aborting compilation
<StevenK> Wheee.
<ogra> and i guess you agree that it makes sense that we should concentrate more on it this time where users might be stuck with packages for 3/5 years ...
<lucas> (I think supporting dapper for 3 years is a joke too, but this is OT)
<zakame> UVF isn't really a barrier; think of it as a cocoon ;)
<Yagisan> zakame: so we can eat our way out ??
<zakame> or an eggshell, where the yolk slowly transforms into a chick ;)
* ajmitch_ goes off to sleep
<zakame> Yagisan: in a way :)
<Tonio_> dholbach: ping ?
<dholbach> Tonio_: pong
<Tonio_> may I ask you a question about gnome config dholbach ?
<dholbach> gnome config?
<Tonio_> dholbach: I'm currently working on kubuntu default settings, and it appears many users have problems with fonts
<Tonio_> dholbach: while searching, I didn't find ubuntu users complaining
<Tonio_> yep, you'll understand :)
<dholbach> What are those problems with fonts?
<Tonio_> so because the xorg settings are the same, we were asking the way gdm sets the fonts
<Tonio_> dholbach: simply, on many computers, the dpi changes when you reboot, and fonts are completly different
<dholbach> gdm shouldn't have anything to do with it.
<Tonio_> dholbach: we were asking if you were forcing the dpi in gdm in fact :)
<ogra> Tonio_, doesnt KDE use fontconfig as well for this ?
<ogra> we dont
<Tonio_> ogra let me ask Riddell
<Riddell> I think gdm did use a fixed dpi once upon a time but doesn't any more
<Riddell> which is why I'd like kdm to also use the X dpi not a fixed one
<Tonio_> in fact the strange point is that ubuntu users don't mostly complain with fonts, when kubuntu ones seem to have lots of issues...
<Riddell> but yes, we do get more complaints, and I'm not sure why
<Riddell> KDE does use fontconfig
<jpatrick> afternoon raphink
<raphink> hi jpatrick
<raphink> siretart: ping
<siretart> raphink: only if its quick
<raphink> siretart: could you nuke simias from REVU please?
<raphink> siretart: there is a _major_ copyright issue on it, we should have never gotten this on there
<siretart> I'll make you revu admin
<tseng> raphink: uh
<raphink> ok
<tseng> raphink: please stop.
<raphink> tseng: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=1332 read the last comment
<raphink> tseng: what?
<raphink> tseng: the software contains source with headers such as "SECRET PROPERTY OF NOVELL"
<raphink> I don't think we want that
<tseng> raphink: I think we should have them fix it in good faith, not just nuke it and forget it ever happened
<jpatrick> raphink: care to revu-report kdmtheme: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=1690 ?
<tseng> raphink: they already GPL'd flaim, previously SECRET PROPERTY in good faith
<raphink> tseng: sure what do you propose?
<tseng> raphink: Mez has contacts with upstream
<siretart> raphink: you should be able to nuke yourself now
<tseng> Mez could point out the copyright problem
<raphink> tseng: ok then I shall talk to Mez see if he can have this fixed
<tseng> thanks.
<raphink> tseng: :)
<raphink> Mez: ping
<raphink> siretart: so I just have to rm -rf the /var/revu/revu1-incoming/$package-$date to nuke ?
<siretart> raphink: first, archive it, then there is a link for nuking
<siretart> after that, then remove that from /var/revu/revu1-incoming/
<raphink> siretart: another question very quick : as you proposed, I know package revu-tools independantly as deb, so to get v.0.4 on REVU we'd have to install the deb
<raphink> siretart: ok
<siretart> raphink: cool. if you think it is ready, just upload it to ubuntu
<raphink> siretart: hmm, to REVU first then I guess
<siretart> since it is a motu internal tool/package anyway, I don't think we need reviewing via revu
<raphink> hehe
<raphink> ok then
<raphink> I'll just add manpages to it first
<siretart> but better upload the first version before FF
<raphink> yep
<raphink> I'll add manpages today then upload
<sealne> siretart: i'm pretty sure i sent a signed email to keyring awhile ago but i just uploaded a package and its not showing, the package was dcfldd and my email is kenny@duffus.org is it possible to check?
<staqen> what directory contains my desktop menu entry files?
<Gloubiboulga> staqen, .desktop files go in /usr/share/applications/
<staqen> Gloubiboulga: thank you
<sealne> siretart: arg no matter, installing dput after setting /etc/dput.conf the way you want it means it gets splated, bad dput
<Gloubiboulga> staqen, np
<siretart> sealne: whats your keyid?
<sealne> siretart: EEED70F3
<siretart> sealne: done
<sealne> actually uploading to revu might help, time to submit a bug for dput
<zakame> hmm is REVU also affected by UVF? (I'm not subbed to dapper-changes, so I've no idea :/)
<dholbach> NEW packages until Feature Freeze. (Feb 23)
<dholbach> We should have a freeze before, so we only focus on getting stuff in that's on REVU already.
<zakame> ah ok :D
<phanatic> hi people
<Gloubiboulga> hey phanatic, zakame
<zakame> heya phanatic
<Gloubiboulga> hi dholbach :)
<phanatic> hey Gloubiboulga, zakame :)
<phanatic> zakame: nanoweb got uploaded yesterday. thanks for your help :)
<phanatic> raphink: ping
<zakame> dholbach: how about bugs assigned to the motureviewers team? can fixes be made to close these?
<zakame> heya Gloubiboulga
<zakame> phanatic: yeah, no prob :D
<zakame> gaah why is rosetta b0rking tonight? :(
<jpatrick> zakame: updates
<zakame> jpatrick: ah, just now...
<jpatrick>  /topic at #ubuntu-devel
<raphink> phanatic: pong
<phanatic> raphink: i began working on ubuntu-grup-splashimages then
<phanatic> s/grup/grub
<raphink> oh good
<raphink> any issue so far?
<phanatic> i'm in the collecting stage now :)
<phanatic> but did update debian/control
<phanatic> Build-Depends-Indep -> Build-Depends
<phanatic> and compat 5 (debhelper >= 5.0.7)
<raphink> hehe
<raphink> ;)
<raphink> I discovered about the Build-Depends-Indep only later
<raphink> ;)
<phanatic> i know :)
<zakame> why? can't splashimages be arch: all?
<zakame> heya zul Amaranth
<Amaranth> hi
<jamessan> zakame: even arch: all packages will frequently have Build-Depends.  anything needed during the clean target has to be in Build-Depends
<phanatic> zakame: they are
<phanatic> but there was a discussion about this issue on debian-devel as raphink pointed out
<raphink> jamessan: that's the right reason, indeed
<raphink> jamessan: you seem to know quite more than me on the reason why it is so :)
<zakame> so is there something in clean aside from {,build-}essential that should be B-D in that?
<jamessan> zakame: I haven't looked at splashimages packaging, but if it uses cdbs, that'd be needed in B-D
<raphink> well from what I've understood, very few things are acceptable in Build-D-I
<raphink> debhelper and cdbs at least have to go to B-D
<raphink> docbook2x for example could be in B-D-I though
<raphink> when used
<raphink> just trying to find examples
<zakame> jamessan: ah indeed
<zakame> in general build-indep targets need B-D-I
<zakame> so a `debian/rules binary-indep` would run needing only the B-D-I
<jamessan> well, B-D and B-D-I are required when running binary-indep/build-indep
<jamessan> http://www.us.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-relationships.html#s-sourcebinarydeps
<raphink> :)
<jamessan> it's easier to look at it as "Which targets don't need B-D-I"
<zakame> ah
<phanatic> raphink: i upload the package now to revu
<Gloubiboulga> dh_python is supposed to find all python deps ?
<phanatic> raphink: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=1695
<raphink> phanatic: wait
<phanatic> ok
<phanatic> raphink: i have to go now... please leave a comment, i'll read it later :)
<raphink> siretart: manpages done, package checked, double checked and triple checked, and just uploaded to ubuntu :)
<jpatrick> nice
<jpatrick> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=1690 :)
* Gloubiboulga hates dh_python
<raphink> siretart: ultimate test, ran revu-report on the revu-tools package ;)
<raphink> it'll surely be in before FF :)
* raphink is gonna take a shower and will be back all clean :)
<tseng> remind me when FF is?
<Gloubiboulga> Feb 23 iirc
<dholbach> yes
<dholbach> Who helps with writing the MOTU report?
<tseng> no proble, then
<tseng> problem
<Gloubiboulga> may I ask some help to a python stuff packager?
<staqen> i think ubuntu should include gimpshop, which is cool (or, to be more specific, a photoshop-like "front-end" to gimp)! ( http://plasticbugs.com/?page_id=294 )
<lfittl> staqen: This is already filed on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/Candidates
<staqen> lfittl: cool. do you think we'll have it in dapper already?
<lfittl> staqen: I don't think so, see the comment in the "Packaging Information" section
<azeem> staqen: is that just a skin/theme, or do you need to patch/rebuild gimp for that?
<lfittl> azeem: you need to patch/rebuild gimp
<slomo> hm, does someone know a console mail client which can read maildirs?
<jamessan> mutt
<slomo> jamessan: hmm, do you have a working muttrc for me somewhere? mine only want to read mboxes, no maildirs
<jamessan> slomo: the relevant options are mbox_type and mailboxes
<raphink> jpatrick: I don't understand why you uploaded kdmtheme again instead of kcontrol-kdmtheme
<jpatrick> raphink: someone said don't change the original tarball
<raphink> jpatrick: this hsa nothing to do with the name of the package
<raphink> you can keep the tarball as such yet use another name for the package
<jpatrick> * upstream tarball changed. Please just repack the .bz2.
<jpatrick> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=1683
<raphink> jpatrick: yep
<raphink> jpatrick: read the reviewing guide on the wiki about this please
<raphink> jpatrick: this has really nothing to do with the name of the package
<jpatrick> raphink: the package it makes is called kcontrol-kdmtheme
<raphink> jpatrick: you are the one setting up the name of the package :p
<raphink> you don't have to change the upstream tarball to set your package name
<raphink> ;)
<jpatrick> :|
<raphink> jpatrick: ok let me explain if you're not gonna read the guide ;)
<raphink> jpatrick: what you should do is :
<raphink> bunzip2 $upstream.tar.bz2 && gzip -9 $upstream.tar && mv $upstream.tar.gz $theorigyouwant.orig.tar.gz
<raphink> jpatrick: this way the tarball is not changed, and you can name the package the way you want
<jpatrick> that's what I did.....
<raphink> jpatrick: and it made you a kdmtheme package? from a kcontrol-kdmtheme orig?
<jpatrick> the orig is 'kdmtheme'
<jpatrick> downloaded from kde-apps.org
<raphink> jpatrick: why, if we want a kcontrol-kdmetheme package?
<raphink> jpatrick: it was discussed before that is was better to make a kcontrol-kdmtheme package
<raphink> to keep it in the logic of other kcontrol modules
<jpatrick> src package == kdmtheme, binary it produces => kcontrol-kdmtheme
<raphink> ah
<raphink> if you want
<raphink> sorry then, I'm fine with that
<raphink> I'm just used to usoing the same name for src package and binary package it produces
<raphink> since I find that clearer
<raphink> ;)
<jpatrick> debian/control
<raphink> but it's up to you
<raphink> yeah yeah jpatrick ok
<raphink> that's a way of doing it, so it's ok :)
<raphink> jpatrick: uscan says there's a newer version
<jpatrick> I was told not to change orig tarball's name
<raphink> ah no sorry
<raphink> hehe it says you're using obsolete version of debian/watch
<raphink> please use a debian/watch version 3 instead of 1
<jpatrick> odd I copied that one of the New Maintainer Guide
<raphink> hehe
<raphink> the NMG might be a bit old on this
<raphink> obsolete even
<raphink> current version of debian/watch is 3
<jpatrick> I add "version=3" ?
<raphink> jpatrick: here's an example : http://revu.tauware.de/revu1-incoming/kblogger-0602061835/kblogger-0.4.1/debian/watch
<jpatrick> ahh I get it now
<jpatrick> reuploading...
<raphink> ok
<jpatrick> arg
<raphink> jpatrick: what?
<jpatrick> I fixed styleclock's watch file
<jpatrick> not kdmtheme
<raphink> ah ok
<raphink> that's good too ;)
<raphink> whatever you fix is good
<jpatrick> that should do it
<raphink> ok
<jpatrick> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=1698
<jpatrick> btw I think sealne would like it if you looked at his package: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=1697
<jpatrick> raphink: what should I do about the watch?
<raphink> nothing, doesn't matter
<jpatrick> okay :)
<jpatrick> raphink: says old-fsf-address
<raphink> then change it
<jpatrick> raphink: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=1683 <= I was told to put it there :/
<jpatrick> heh, I'll poke upstream
<raphink> ok
<fbond> hello all
<fbond> is it definately too late to get a new package into dapper universe?
<jpatrick> hello fbond
<jpatrick> No
<fbond> ok
<jpatrick> until the 23rd
<fbond> the release schedule made me think otherwise... is that just for main?
<jpatrick> main + universe
<dholbach> Feature Freeze for NEW packages.
<ogra> UVF != feature freeze
<fbond> ah
<fbond> i put together a few packages and have them in an unofficial repository; it's been requested by some that I try to get them into ubuntu proper
<fbond> naturally, i would want to scrutinize them more closely, but i don't have much history with the ubuntu community, and wondered if getting these into dapper is even feasible
<fbond> thoughts?
<ogra> packages we include need to be reviewed and signed off by 2 universe maintainers ...
<ogra> upload the source package to REVU .... to get them reviewed
<fbond> ok
<fbond> i saw the instructions for that on the wiki
<fbond> didn't know if there was a pre-req...
<ogra> there is none ... just get access to upload to REVU and upload the surce package ...
<ogra> if its signed off, someone will upload it to the archive for you
<fbond> ok, i got it -- thanks
<Casanova> hi i have uploaded 2 packages LDTP and LTFX to http://prash.be/ldtp/ubuntu/ can i simply send this link to the mailing list for approval or is there any specific website that i should upload to?
<lfittl> Casanova: Upload them to REVU (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU)
<Casanova> lfittl> how can i get my gpg key added to the keyring?
<lfittl> "Please send a signed email with your GnuPG keyid, asking to be added to the REVU keyring, to keyring@tiber.tauware.de"
<Casanova> ok :)
<lfittl> ;)
<Casanova> i was just wondering if we could get this over with on irc itself :D
<jpatrick> raphink: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=1700
<mhz> ogra: ping
<mhz> oops, sorry ogra
<jpatrick> raphink: uploaded
<Gloubiboulga> If upstream provides a desktop file, a .menu file is really usefull ?
<Gloubiboulga> I mean adding a .menu for the deb package
<LaserJock> Gloubiboulga: menu files aren't to hard to add to debian/ you might just add one for completeness
<LaserJock> Gloubiboulga: I don't think Ubuntu uses them much (other than if you install the Debian menu)
<Gloubiboulga> LaserJock, k
<Gloubiboulga> LaserJock, I had a look at a package on REVU and wondered if it was really needed
<frans-th> hi all
<frans-th> anyone update oo @ breezy with the newest?
<LaserJock> Gloubiboulga: I don't think it hurts :-)
<Gloubiboulga> thanks LaserJock :)
<LaserJock> frans-th: update the OO in breezy to dapper's OO ?
<frans-th> why?
<frans-th> is there a way to make breezy run oo2?
<frans-th> i read that the repo is 18months for breezy
<frans-th> so there will be update for 00 for 18 months
<LaserJock> frans-th: Dapper has the latest OO from Debian unstable I believe
<Mithrandir> we don't upgrade packages in the repositories in the period they're supported for.
<LaserJock> frans-th: when Dapper is released you can update then
<Mithrandir> "supported" means "gets security fixes", not "gets the latest bling".
<siretart> frans-th: use these packages: http://people.ubuntu.com/~doko/OOo2/
<ajmitch_> morning
<LaserJock> hi ajmitch_
<LaserJock> dholbach: ping?
<frans-th> siretart, why the doko never put in the archive?
<dholbach> LaserJock: pong
<LaserJock> dholbach: how's the apt-get.org stuff coming?
<dholbach> LaserJock: not at all.
<dholbach> LaserJock: I'm just too busy with other stuff atm.
<LaserJock> dholbach: :-) I see
<LaserJock> dholbach: just wondered
<frans-th> siretart, what is the distribution name of this? universe?
<ajmitch_> LaserJock: dig in & review some packages for dholbach
<dholbach> http://wiki.ubuntu.com/AptGetOrg
<dholbach> But I'd prefer other people to do more useful stuff.
<dholbach> very much so
<dholbach> like REVUing
<dholbach> so we get in all the good work from you guys until feature freeze
<LaserJock> well, I don't get to REVU so maybe I'll manage to take a look at a few of the apt-get.org packages
<siretart> frans-th: because we don't update stable releases except for very important updates. that ooo2 backport is not that important to put it to breezy-updates. but perhaps you ask him yourself
<ajmitch_> and feature freeze is in 2 weeks, so we don't have much time
<dholbach> LaserJock: As I said, it's better to get REVU packages in.
<ajmitch_> I've got a few packages outstanding that still haven't even been uploaded to REVU
<dholbach> I appreciate the help, but I think it's more sensible to get the REVU packages up to scratch.
<frans-th> siretart, how to try doko oo2?
<frans-th> i add the source, but distribution and section, still dont know
<LaserJock> dholbach: sure, but I can't advocate so I'm not much of a help getting the REVU list down
<dholbach> LaserJock: help people.
<frans-th> http://people.ubuntu.com/~doko/OOo2/dists/breezy-updates/universe/binary-i386/Packages.gz: 404 Not Found
<tseng> wow i have a like 10 kernels installed
<LaserJock> dholbach: but I really should be working on the Packaging Guide so maybe I shouldn't get spread too thin. I also need to finish my PhD some time ;-)
<dholbach> :)
<ajmitch_> tseng: so did I until /boot filled up
<tseng> when i propsed the packaging guide i didnt mean for it to suck up a year of man hours
<Casanova> hello i have uploaded 2 packages ldtp and ltfx to revu... now what do i do?
<LaserJock> tseng: but it is a really cool project
<Casanova> should i send a mail to the mailing list infomring the upload?
<tseng> hi ajmitch_
<tseng> i thought you were gone
<ajmitch_> tseng: this afternoon
<tseng> that means about nothing to me
<tseng> we probably arent even talking about the same day
<ajmitch_> ok, I'll leave here in about 5 hours
<ajmitch_> I just crawled out of bed
<ajmitch_> if I request a UVF exception for f-spot now, I'll need to do it again once a release is made with FlickrNet support
<iBalo> Did anyone manage to get seamonkey 1.0 working in breezy? Or maybe a .deb around?
<dholbach> good night
<lfittl> gn8 dholbach
<Kyral> Yo
<LaserJock> hi Kyral
<Kyral> Here goes nothing
<phanatic> hi people
<Gloubiboulga> hey phanatic
<phanatic> hey Gloubiboulga
<phanatic> raphink: ping
<Kyral> Good lord
<Kyral> my laptop's SBU is like 21 mins...
<chillywilly> how much disk space would it take to properly mirror the ubuntu packages? Can I do a partial mirror of some sort? I ask this because I had a situation where I really needed to be able to install certain things at a location where there was no net connection and this was one of my biggest issues
<chillywilly> the install CD didn't have everything that I needed either
<chillywilly> just trying to do some planning to avoid that in the future
<tiCo89> man debmirror :-)
<azeem> I think there's a DVD image available
<tiCo89> should also work with ubuntu
<chillywilly> azeem: cool
<chillywilly> ok tiCo89
<Amaranth> the dvd has all of main, iirc
<chillywilly> also I installed the am64 k8 smp but I get an oops when I go to boot that thing...where should I send the report? bug tracker?
<chillywilly> the latest
<Amaranth> the -15 kernel?
<chillywilly> yea
<ajmitch> latest breezy kernel, or dapper?
<chillywilly> the latest 2.6.12 kernel in breezy
<chillywilly> -amd64-k8-smp or whatever
<ajmitch> right
<ajmitch> file it on malone with the oops details if you can capture them
<chillywilly> ok
<ajmitch> maybe https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/linux-source-2.6.12/+filebug
<chillywilly> I think I have an account...anyway I would need to install that kernel again on one of our servers and attempt to boot it again and I am not at work anymore
<ajmitch> ok
<ajmitch> how late were you there?
<chillywilly> 3am
<chillywilly> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/linux-source-2.6.12/+bug/29882
<Ubugtu> malone bug 29882 in linux-source-2.6.12 "Oooops when booting on dual amd64" [Normal,Unconfirmed] 
<chillywilly> sounds similar to that
<ajmitch> ouch, 3am?
<chillywilly> yea
<chillywilly> roughly
<chillywilly> I was driving back at around 2:50am or so
<chillywilly> I have shorewall doing proxyarp again and I had to add rules for some of the services, etc.
<chillywilly> wonder if I can find the oops in the syslog
#ubuntu-motu 2006-02-14
<raphink> phanatic: pong
<phanatic> raphink: i was also wondering if i should create a debian native from ubuntu-grub-splashimages...
<raphink> phanatic: this is a debian native package, and that's fine
<phanatic> so no modification needed?
<raphink> no as I said
<raphink> you can ignore the Warning in the report
<raphink> since it's normal that it's a debian native package
<phanatic> that's fine. but is it fine, that it has an -XubuntuX version?
<phanatic> nice sentence, shit :)
<ajmitch> no, a native package shouldn't be versioned like that
<raphink> ;)
<phanatic> shall i correct that and upload a new package?
<raphink> sure phanatic
<phanatic> ok, i'll do that
<dolson> I have a question. I'm following some documentation about making packages. It says to change the debian/rules file in the commands to install into ./debian/pkgname, should I modify that from DESTDIR to whatever the Makefile expects (PREFIX in this case), or should I modify the Makefile to expect DESTDIR?
<azeem> the latter
<dolson> ok thank you azeem! the doc says the former, but I thought that was wrong
<dolson> ah crap, there is no rule to install in the makefile, lol
<dolson> I want to take a piece of software that was debianized by someone and package it for Ubuntu. it is not in debian (and I don't see any ITP either), but the packager gave it a version of 1.0-2. so, because it is not actually in debian, would this become 1.0-0ubuntu1 or would it be 1.0-2ubuntu1?
<crimsun> the former
<dolson> ok, cool. I am still working on getting the lintian output to stop complaining about things that he didn't check, but it's pretty close
<psusi> man... this code is prety WTF'ed up
* Kyral wonders how feasible it would be to use an Expert install to install Debian Sid
<minghua> I have up-to-date dapper, and I have ubuntu-desktop and kde-core installed, no if I start gnome from GDM, I will have the KDE panel on my gnome desktop (in additional to my gnome panel), anybody heard of similar problem?
<jsgotangco> minghua, yeah KNOME heh
<minghua> :-(
* minghua can't find a bug about this
<jsgotangco> i just experienced it a few hours ago too
<jsgotangco> the forum people ahve talked about it already though
<minghua> jsgotangco: at least nice to see it's not my own problem :-P
<jsgotangco> it as deemed "best bug ever"
<jsgotangco> s/as/was
<minghua> lol
<torkel> minghua: bug #30849
<Ubugtu> malone bug 30849 in gnome-session "Kde desktop applications started by gnome-session" [Normal,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/30849
<minghua> ah, against gnome-session, I kept looking in bugs for kde :-)
<minghua> torkel: thanks!
<torkel> np
<zakame> hi MOTUs
<minghua> hello zakame
<minghua> and hello ogra :-)
<zakame> heya minghua :)
<dholbach> good morning
<zakame> good morning dholbach :)
<dholbach> hey zakame
<zakame> hmm does dapper+1 have a name already? pusling in #d-mentors is asking me
<dholbach> Not yet.
<dholbach> HOLY COW!   apt-cache -i unmet | wc -l         =>      656 lines
<dholbach> Sounds like there's still something to do until release :)
<Lathiat> time for me to get busy i think :)
<lfittl> dholbach: I started work on fixing this stuff, ~35 uploads so far
<Lathiat> now that i can actually upload, woo :)
<dholbach> lfittl: Yeah - saw it :-)
<dholbach> Nice work.
<lfittl> and that took only 2 hours, these things are really easy to fix :)
<dholbach> Yeah, most of them should be easy and a good start for newcomers.
<dholbach> We should do a REVU day soon.
<dholbach> So we can get stuff in shape before Feature Freeze.
<lfittl> that would be really good, there is simply too much stuff on REVU
<dholbach> And we should have a No-New-Stuff-on-REVU Freeze too.
<lfittl> do you really think that would make a difference?
<dholbach> Maybe not.
<lfittl> we have only 2 weeks until feature freeze, introducing another freeze complicates the whole thing even more
<lfittl> you also planned a bug day, when exactly?
<dholbach> End of next week. Beginning of next week will be GNOME 2.13.91
<dholbach> Where I'll be completely busy.
<Gloubiboulga> hello zakame
<lfittl> k, that means we could do the REVU day ~3 days before feature freeze
<dolson> if an app I want to package has no man page, and no commandline arguments, do I have to make a man page for it?
<lfittl> dolson: if it has no commandline arguments that should be easy to do ;)
<zakame> heya Gloubiboulga
<dolson> lfittl: so yes, then? :)
<lfittl> make a little man page ;)
<Gloubiboulga> zakame, got a little question for you, about the FSF address :)
<Gloubiboulga> zakame, I don't know how to react when the old address in used in sources
<dholbach> Gloubiboulga: for your package or for packages which we have from Debian?
<zakame> Gloubiboulga: sure, what's it about? :)
<Gloubiboulga> i'm on the phone, brb
<dholbach> lfittl: we could even do it on the weekend - whenever
<dholbach> lfittl: We just need to announce it.
<dholbach> And we still have not MOTU report yet.
<zakame> Gloubiboulga: ??? annoyed? angry? happy? :P
<lfittl> dholbach: I will send a message to the motu mailinglist later today to discuss the REVU day date
<zakame> Gloubiboulga: I believe its best to just tell upstream about it and let them update it by themselves, after all, they are the ones who are applying the GPL as a license, not us :)
<dholbach> lfittl: Thanks.
<Gloubiboulga> zakame, yeah, that's the point :)
<Gloubiboulga> dholbach, it's about http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=1697
<zakame> bbl
<dholbach> Gloubiboulga: What about it?
<Gloubiboulga> old FSF address is used in sources, so I guess upstream should modify it
<dholbach> Yeah, tell them.
<dholbach> You don't need to patch it.
<Gloubiboulga> ok
<dolson> yay, I wrote my first man page ever
<Gloubiboulga> congrats dolson
<dolson> thanks :) I really want to take part in Ubuntu, so I'm trying to learn a bunch of new stuff, and that was one of them. pretty easy though, that was
* dholbach high-fives dolson
<dolson> :) you remember me?
<dolson> ok! lintian only reports 3 issues now. I am getting close here.. native-pkg-with-a-dash-ver, chlog-should-mention-nmu, and src-nmu-has-incorrect-ver-#
<Casanova> hi i have uploaded 2 packages to revu yesterday -- python-ldtp and ltfx how can iget someone to review it?
<Casanova> hello anyone there?
<Gloubiboulga> Casanova, I can have a look at it, but only MOTUs can advocate
<Casanova> Gloubiboulga> thanx a lot
<Gloubiboulga> np
<Casanova> Gloubiboulga> i dont have to send a request or anything? they will view it?
<Gloubiboulga> Casanova, yes, if it's on REVU, that's because you want a review :)
<Casanova> hehe cool :)
<Casanova> Gloubiboulga> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=1701 and http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=1702
<Gloubiboulga> I'm looking at ltfx
<Casanova> thats a very small package.. i packaged it basically bcos ldtp depended on ltfx and ltfx package was not available
<Gloubiboulga> Upstream copyright is not very clear
<Casanova> Gloubiboulga> for ltfx?
<Gloubiboulga> Casanova, the COPYRIGHT file in sources is not enough
<Gloubiboulga> yes
<Gloubiboulga> each file should contain a header, describing the copyroght
<Gloubiboulga> *copyright
<Casanova> Gloubiboulga> what else should be added in the copyright file
<Casanova> oh
<Gloubiboulga> it's an upstream problem
<Gloubiboulga> you could ask the author to add these headers
<Casanova> Gloubiboulga> what does upstream problem mean?
<Casanova> Gloubiboulga> the author isnt responding to my emails :(
<Casanova> Gloubiboulga> by each file do you mean the source files?
<Gloubiboulga> Casanova, yes
<Gloubiboulga> see http://www.fsf.org/licensing/licenses/gpl-howto.html
<Gloubiboulga> the COPYRIGHT file doesn't tell who is the copyright holder, and if the sources are under GPL v.2 or GPL v.2 or later
<Gloubiboulga> that's why the header is needed in the source files
<Casanova> Gloubiboulga> the homepage says GPL doesnt mention the version
<Casanova> Gloubiboulga> http://sourceforge.net/projects/ltfx/
<Gloubiboulga> Casanova, there's nothing on the hompage...
<Casanova> License  : GNU General Public License (GPL)
<Casanova> that is all it says
<Gloubiboulga> but it's not in the source tarball :)
<Casanova> Gloubiboulga> its in the COPYING file isnt it?
<Gloubiboulga> yes, but it's not enough
<Casanova> Gloubiboulga> ok then i will add it manually into the source files
<Gloubiboulga> Casanova, you can't do that, the author has to
<Casanova> oh
<Gloubiboulga> I can't find the source tarball anyway
<Casanova> Gloubiboulga> what is the way out then? the project seem to be dead right now
<Gloubiboulga> Casanova, if it's dead I'm not sure that it's a good idea to package it, but ask MOTUs about that
<Casanova> ok let me try contacting him yet again
<Casanova> Gloubiboulga> is there any thing else that i should change?
<Gloubiboulga> Casanova, yes
<Gloubiboulga> if it's ok, I'll email you my comments
<Casanova> sure that would be great :)
<Gloubiboulga> ok :)
<Gloubiboulga> but we really need to have an available source tarball to accept the package
<dolson> I have a question.. I still get two errors when I run lintian about nmu. num=new maintainer u_____? upload? I looked at the ardour control file and see robert from debian in there, so I left the guy who debianized this software previously in here.. but, I get the nmu messages, so am I really supposed to change it to my name? it feels like I would be stealing all of the credit or something
<Casanova> Gloubiboulga> it is available at http://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php?group_id=123119 isnt it?
<Casanova> Gloubiboulga> are you referring to something else?
<Gloubiboulga> Casanova, there's nothing on the sourceforge page
<Casanova> Gloubiboulga> i downloaded the source form the sourceforge page
<Gloubiboulga> or I have a browser problem
<Casanova> Gloubiboulga> check http://optusnet.dl.sourceforge.net/sourceforge/ltfx/ltfx-0.1.6.tar.gz
<Casanova> thats the direct link
<Gloubiboulga> I guess I have a problem
<Gloubiboulga> ok, got the tarball :)
<Gloubiboulga> sorry
<Casanova> no probs at all :)
<dolson> ok, no more lintian errors
<Casanova> Gloubiboulga> any other changes?
<Gloubiboulga> Casanova, I'll send you a mail in a few minutes :)
<Casanova> kewl
<dolson> ok, I am done my packaging. so now I can upload it to revu. right?
<Gloubiboulga> Casanova, is it your first package ?
<Casanova> Gloubiboulga> yes :|
<Casanova> am i doing a very bad job?
<Gloubiboulga> Casanova, no, but my comments list is quite long :)
<Gloubiboulga> don't be afraid with it
<Casanova> ok :)
<Gloubiboulga> my first package was pretty ugly ;)
<Casanova> Gloubiboulga> i didnt get your mail yet
<Gloubiboulga> it's on its way
<Casanova> k
<Gloubiboulga> Casanova, did you run lintian on you package?
<Casanova> Gloubiboulga> yes
<Lathiat> dholbach: hrm my apt-cache -i unmet -> 225
<Lathiat> dholbach: ah, you missed |grep Package
<Gloubiboulga> Casanova, on the .deb on on the .dsc? because lintian isn't very happy with the .deb ;)
<Casanova> Gloubiboulga> oO let me try again :(
<Lathiat> ajmitch: have you got that bzr archive?
<Casanova> i am making the other changes you mentioned in the mail
<dholbach> Lathiat: 254 on amd64 then
<dholbach> Lathiat: :)
<Lathiat> ajmitch: i need my pkgget.sh altho i probably needs updating for new launchpad buildlogs
<Lathiat> i wonder if someone else has writtten anythign similar
<Casanova> Gloubiboulga> to get the version as "0.1.6-0ubuntu1" i have to do 'dch -v 0.1.6-0ubuntu1' ?
<Gloubiboulga> Casanova, you certainly missed a build-dep, because the package builds fine on my dapper box, but not with pbuilder
<Lathiat> grabs the package, checks versions, grabs buildlogs
<Lathiat> dholbach: thats actually quite good
<Lathiat> dholbach: better than breezy
<Lathiat> W: ctsim source: changelog-should-mention-nmu
<Lathiat> W: ctsim source: source-nmu-has-incorrect-version-number 4.4.2-1ubuntu2
<Lathiat> hrm
<Lathiat> i never noticed that before
<Gloubiboulga> Casanova, I would just change it manually
<Casanova> Gloubiboulga> ok
<Casanova> Gloubiboulga> i havent used pbuilder... let me try installing it and then get back to you some time later?
<Gloubiboulga> Casanova, no problem
<dholbach> Lathiat: never mind that, lintian doesn't know that we don't have NMUs.
<Lathiat> dholbach: yeh but did it atsome point? or is that new?
<Lathiat> i never noticed it before
<dholbach> You maybe just uploaded YOUR packages. :-)
<Lathiat> nah
<Lathiat> maybe im just silly :)
<Lathiat> and never noticed
<dholbach> Maybe. :-p
* dholbach hugs Lathiat
<Lathiat> or is that a new step in debuild -S to run lintian?
<Lathiat> i cant wait till ig et my computer it'l be so much faster than this here laptop
<Lathiat> esp with disk performance
<dholbach> same here. :-)
<dholbach> my x40's 4200 rpm disk is soooooooo slow
<Lathiat> athlon x2 4200+, 2GB ram, 2x 36GB raptors (10,000RPM sata)
<Lathiat> ouch
<Lathiat> mines at least 5400
<Lathiat> and well, i hope my boss doesnt fire me in the next 6 weeks :)
<dholbach> :)
<dholbach> Who can think of stuff to add as "tasks" for the next Ubuntu Bug Day from the MOTU team?
<Lathiat> "fix bugs" ;)
<dholbach> Please add something or nobody will help universe out.
<dholbach> http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuBugDay
<Lathiat> xlibmesa-gl stuff
<Lathiat> .desktop files
<dholbach> I added something for the DektopTeam already.
<Casanova> Gloubiboulga> why does lintian say? E: ltfx_0.1.6-2_source.changes: md5sum-mismatch-in-changes-file ltfx_0.1.6-2.dsc
<Casanova> it did not come last time i ran lintian... though i made a few changes after that
<Gloubiboulga> don't really know, but maybe you've changed someting in the .dsc file
<dolson> what do I use to log into REVU? unless I'm typing this wrong every time, it is not accepting my launchpad user/pass
<Casanova> Gloubiboulga> i havent touched the dsc file.. maybe i should package it again?
<Gloubiboulga> Casanova, just rebuild the source package
<Casanova> Gloubiboulga> also it says W: ltfx: manpage-section-mismatch usr/share/man/man1/digwin.1.gz:5 1 != SECTION
<Casanova> can i ignore this?
<Gloubiboulga> I don't think so ;)
<Casanova> why does it say that?
<Casanova> i men it should come in the 1st sectio right?
<Casanova> *mean
<Gloubiboulga> I'm not a man page specialist :p
<Casanova> :(
<Gloubiboulga> I'm checking manpages i've written
<Casanova> ok
<dolson> hello
<Gloubiboulga> Casanova, `.TH LDTP SECTION "January 30, 2006"' LDTP -> ltfx, and SECTION -> 1
<Gloubiboulga> I think that's the problem
<raphink> Gloubiboulga: did you use docbook?
<Casanova> oops
<Gloubiboulga> raphink, yes, for the last package I've built
<raphink> ok :)
<raphink> good
<Gloubiboulga> hh
<raphink> it's not very easy but it gives good results :)
<Gloubiboulga> raphink, yes, you're right
<Gloubiboulga> as always :p
<raphink> oh it's the hug day!
* raphink hugs Gloubiboulga 
<Casanova> Gloubiboulga> lintian no longer gives any output :)
<dolson> someone freakin hug me
* Lathiat bugs dolson
<dolson> don't touch me there
<Gloubiboulga> Casanova, good. It needs to build with pbuilder now
<dolson> touch me *here*
<Casanova> Gloubiboulga> i will try and get back to you
<dolson> my package builds with pbuilder, how do I log into REVU?
<Gloubiboulga> Casanova, ok. Don't forget that the license issue really needs to be solved
<Gloubiboulga> dolson, did you send your gpg key ?
<dolson> yeah
<Casanova> Gloubiboulga> i your mail you said that i need to have a 'build-indep' rule in the rules file
<Casanova> Gloubiboulga> but i already have it dont i?
<raphink> dolson: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU
<Gloubiboulga> then, just upload, you don't need to login
<Casanova> Gloubiboulga> build-indep: build-indep-stamp
<Casanova> build-indep-stamp: configure-stamp
<Gloubiboulga> Casanova, let me check again
<Casanova> ok
<dolson> raphink: thanks... I think I read every page in the wiki, but this one. lol
<Gloubiboulga> Casanova, better ask a MOTU for this, I'm not totally sure
<Casanova> ok
<raphink> dolson: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/Reviewing
<raphink> dolson: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU/REVU-Tools
<raphink> so you can check your own package
<dolson> thanks, I'm running that now
<dolson> oh geez, it's 7am... time for some sleep
<raphink> hehe
<dolson> but this stuff is so interesting
<dolson> I just don't want to sleep
<raphink> dolzzzon: beware, addiction to packaging comes fast ;)
<Hobbsee> raphink: very true :P
<zakame> evening MOTUs
<Lathiat> hey zakame
<zakame> hi Lathiat :)
<Lathiat> wheres the policy on what needs UVF approval etc
<Lathiat> ?
<ogra> Lathiat, in the version number of your package ?
<zakame> hmm good q I've been asking that to myself earlier this day :/
<Lathiat> ogra: like, is a new debian revision ok?
<Lathiat> or does that need approval too?
<ogra> 1.2.4-27 would need approval for 1.2.5-X
<ogra> but not for 1.2.4-28
<Lathiat> ok, even if -28 adds a new feature?
<ogra> even then ...
<Lathiat> ok
<Lathiat> cheers
<ogra> -28 will need approval past 23rd of feb
<Lathiat> ok
<zakame> hm so I can still fix some motureviewers bugs which keep the same upstream version?
<ogra> yup
<zakame> yay \o/
<Lathiat> 1.2.4-27+really1.2.5evadinguvf
<Lathiat> ;p
* ogra hopes dholbach corrects him if he talks rubbish :)
* Lathiat grins at ogra 
<ogra> Lathiat, yes, i did similar things in breezy :/
<ogra> made mdz very angry ...
<zakame> I thought I'll be stuck doing just l10n after the merges ;P
<ogra> and wont get approved this release ... no way for that
* Lathiat laughs at ogra 
<Lathiat> dapper universe is looking a little more shapely than breezys at this point
<Lathiat> or is it just me being dillusional? :)
<ogra> nope, thats right ...
<Lathiat> cool :)
<zakame> ooh :(
<ogra> would be bad if it werent the fact :)
<Lathiat> indeed
<phanatic> hi people
<ogra> breezy was really sucky ...
<zakame> lol
<Lathiat> would've been worse without the mammoth effort of some at the end
<Lathiat> i think slomo slugged iirc
<Lathiat> the problem with thsi point
<Lathiat> is most of the unbuildable packages are weird applications
<Lathiat> that no one uses or knows how to use
<Lathiat> which makes testing the workability difficult ;p
<phanatic> raphink: ping
<ogra> if they are really this weird and nobody complained yet, they might not be worth the effort
<raphink> phanatic: pong
<phanatic> raphink: i uploaded ubuntu-grub-splashimages as a native package
<raphink> phanatic: cool
<phanatic> raphink: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=1705
<raphink> phanatic: I'll have a look at it later if you dont mind phanatic
<raphink> remind me when I'm less busy :)
<raphink> or send me the link by email
<phanatic> raphink: okay :)
<phanatic> i'll do the latter
<raphink> phanatic: it's hug day today, won't you join?
<phanatic> really?
<zakame> heya phanatic
<phanatic> of course :)
<phanatic> hey zakame
<phanatic> #ubuntu-bugs, right?
<Lathiat> i guess somethign that partially works is better than uninstallable
<zakame> raphink: it is HUG day today?!? :D
<Lathiat> guikachu seems to crash tryign to do anythign with a form altho other stuff works
<raphink> zakame: :)
<zakame> ooh
* ..[topic/#ubuntu-motu:raphink] : Ubuntu Masters of the Universe: Ubuntu Universe Repository Maintainers | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Documentation | Today is HugDay! Everybody is welcom to #ubuntu-bugs to help!
* ..[topic/#ubuntu-motu:raphink] : Ubuntu Masters of the Universe: Ubuntu Universe Repository Maintainers | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Documentation | Today is HugDay! Everybody is welcome to #ubuntu-bugs to help!
<raphink> missed the e ;)
<phanatic> :)
<dholbach> ogra: hm?
<Gloubiboulga> SloMoSnail, I guess we could close bug 4165
<Ubugtu> malone bug 4165 in dnspython "dnspython: merge new debian version" [Normal,Fix released]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/4165
<Gloubiboulga> damned
<Kyral> Morning MOTUish peoples
<Gloubiboulga> never ming, I've too much bugs today ;)
<Gloubiboulga> s/ming/mind
<Gloubiboulga> hi Kyral
<Kyral> hmm
<Kyral> To install Debian on my laptop
<Kyral> Should be fun :D
<Kyral> Poor laptop has been reformatted so many times in the past week as I have been playing
<Kyral> Ironic that it started with Ubuntu and ending on Debian :P
<raphink> siretart: revu-tools is NEW since yesterday. I don't know when it'll be in and it fixes a few things from version 0.3. Do you want to install the package already or wait for it to be in the repos?
<blueyed> \sh_away: wine is broken currently in dapper: https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/wine/+bug/30962
<Ubugtu> malone bug 30962 in wine "Running wine applications instantly outputs "Killed." in the terminal" [Normal,Unconfirmed] 
<blueyed> \sh_away: This is the same for 0.9.7 from winehq. But anyway, I want to suggest requesting a UpstreamVersionFreeze exception for it, because 0.9.7 fixes at least one annoying bug, where the icons in BeyondCompare do not show up. I could search for the upstream bugtracker entry, if needed.
<dholbach> raphink: could you write your mail to the list?
<dholbach> raphink: you just replied to me :)
<raphink> oops sorry dholbach ;)
<raphink> hehe
<raphink> you don't like me writing to you dholbach ?
<dholbach> tssssss :)
<raphink> hehe
<raphink> there
<LaserJock> is there a place to tell when a package has been removed from Universe?
<lucas> hi dholbach
<lucas> dholbach: how much testing did you do on ekiga ?
<lucas> I seem to have alsa/esd conflicts
<siretart> wwaaaaah, this bl***dy gnome-power-manager!! grrrr
<siretart> puh. vim saved a swapfile in my home.. uff
<dolson> Is it even possible to use gpg to sign email through gmail?
<jamessan> if you use their POP3 interface, then you can. it's not possible via their web interface, though
<dolson> bastards.
<dolson> I'm going to email them a feature request
<ogra> siretart, filed a bug for me ?
<siretart> ogra: I'd like to do some more research about it first. and I'm too angry right now to file a bug
<ogra> what happend ?
<siretart> ogra: It just shut down my computer without even a slight warning or notice
<siretart> ogra: I was writing a follow up in slrn/vim on \sh posting, and it just shut down.
<ogra> did you run out of battery ?
<siretart> ogra: shouldn't there be some kind of warning: "please save your work, you are low on power and the computer will shut down soon?"
<siretart> ogra: hardly. I was at more than 50% battery
<ogra> how are the adjustments in your power preferences ?
<siretart> but I was not on ac, right
<siretart> shutdown at critical, critical mark set to 3%
<ogra> g-p-m is pretty dumb, it only does what you tell it, i suspect rather a hal bug that the values get reported wrong ...
<siretart> ogra: what's this 'low battery' slider about? I don't see what action can be triggered when battery is low?
<ogra> i agree that there should be a saver yourself command for open apps ... but thats a task gnome-session should do
<ogra> look at the second tab
<ogra> yu can select the action
<siretart> ogra: I see only a slider for 'when battery is critical' not for 'when battery is low'
<siretart> lets move this to #ubuntu-devel
<LaserJock> azeem: ping?
<lfittl> dholbach: ping
<pollo> hi
<pollo> i have some doubts about ubuntu starting system
<LaserJock> pollo: what do you mean?
<pollo> wich files contains kernel modules that start at boot system , i was seeing /etc/modules , and i add son lines to /etc/hotplug/blacklist , but it until load some modules like bluetooth , also i don't  see where is file that load system services like ntp it isn't on /etc/rc2.d , i don't if it is the correct channel for these doubts
<LaserJock> pollo: you should probably ask in #ubuntu
<pollo> ok thanks
<pollo> i will go to ubuntu
<lucas> can sbody reproduce 30578 ?
<lucas> bug 30578 sorry
<Ubugtu> malone bug 30578 in ekiga "Ekiga uses ALSA layer, but sound card is blocked by esd" [Major,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/30578
<siretart> lucas: I think I can
<dholbach> Isn't that something like  https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/gnomemeeting/+bug/22488 ?
<Ubugtu> malone bug 22488 in gnomemeeting "When gnomemeeting is running no other programs can play sound" [Normal,Unconfirmed] 
<lucas> ah probably, but that kind of the opposite bug :-)
<dolson> holy crap slowkeys is annoying
<sebest> hello
<sebest> slomo: ping
<dolson> alright, now I have completed the package properly
<dolson> hope that works
<sebest> siretart: hello
<sebest> could you please create me a revu account?
<siretart> sebest: pass me your gpg id
<sebest> siretart: ok gimme a second
<sebest> siretart: 2105BB87
<sebest> should be on keyserver.ubuntu.com
<siretart> sebest: done
<sebest> siretart, you sent the informations to my email?
<siretart> sebest: no. you may proceed with uploading packages now. use the recover link to learn your password, it will be created after your first accepted upload
<sebest> siretart: thanx a lot, i'll read the wiki page :)
<dolson> hmm, can you do mine next?
<Kyral> oy...I think its time for a fresh reinstall...
<dolson> thanks siretart
<siretart> dolson: you're welcome
<siretart> dolson: nice job on http://ubuntustudio.com
<dolson> siretart:  thanks :)
<siretart> dolson: I assume you want your studio launcher script be included into dapper, right?
<dolson> siretart: I don't think it's complete enough yet. I still need to add a lot of functionality to it, such as auto-detecting what apps are installed and only listing them in the list, and mostly adding a lot more apps
<siretart> I see
<dolson> but I can work on it soon if you think it's a good thing to do
<siretart> dolson: how about grepping through /usr/share/applications/*.desktop for audio applications?
<siretart> dolson: I don't understand that much about professional audio stuff. My brother is interested in that, but currently he does not do much more than a bit recording with audacity
<dolson> siretart: that's a good idea, I'll have a look at that. I'm not sure how I would script it to allow zenity to return the results.. I supose I could change it a lot and make it just loop through the results. I'l have to do some testing with that
<dolson> siretart: I used only audacity to record all of my songs on my site, and I didn't ever want to use anything more than audacity until a couple weeks ago.. I started reading a lot about realtime, preemption, ardour, seq24, etc.
<dolson> it's like a whole new world
<sebest> slomo: i think that the upload worked
<dolson> woo, Successfully uploaded packages.
<sebest> siretart: what is the delay to have the password
<sebest> i did the upload
<sebest> and the try the "recover" thing
<sebest> but no password in the encrypted text
<sebest> just "None"
<siretart> sebest: which package did you upload?
<sebest> mod_dnssd
<sebest> mod_mime_xattr
<sebest> and nautilus-share
<siretart> nautilus share was ignored because being an binary upload. please do sourceful uploads only
<siretart> oh, in fact, this is for all uploads
<sebest> ah, how can i do a sourceful upload?
<siretart> sebest: you have to upload a *_source.changes file, NOT an *_i386.changes file
<sebest> because it said "successfully uploaded"
<sebest> ok
<dolson> woo, my pkg is there. I am so pumped
<siretart> use -S -sa options for dpkg-buildpackage/debuild
<sebest> siretart: sorry to bother you again, but dput complains about .dsc being already on the serveur :)
<siretart> sebest: rm *.upload
<siretart> or use -f
<sebest> i'm using -f
<sebest> siretart: http://pastebin.com/547422
<siretart> sebest: retry, I removed your previous upload
<sebest> siretart: thanx it worked
<dolson> hmm....
<LaserJock> siretart: so is raphink's revu-tools on tiber?
<raphink> LaserJock: version 0.3 is
<raphink> version 0.4 is in NEW right now
<raphink> I don't plan to get it in the REVU svn this time
<raphink> but to install it as a deb
<LaserJock> ah, ok
<LaserJock> do you have to be a MOTU to use it?
<siretart> LaserJock: it will be in the archive as soon as it gets through new
<raphink> LaserJock: yo have to have sudo rights for pbuilder
<raphink> <~~~   raphink sur tiber  17:37:39 #1 : ~   ~~~>
<raphink>  $ sudo -l
<raphink> User raphink may run the following commands on this host:
<raphink>     (ALL) NOPASSWD: /usr/sbin/pbuilder
<sebest> siretartl: it seems that upload worked except for "nautilus-share"
<raphink> LaserJock: you need that to run it
<raphink> LaserJock: if you want it run on some packages, you can ask me though :)
<dolson> I hope I did this right... at first there was no .orig.tar.gz, even though I followed the instructions and used -S -sa..  but I put it up again and it's there
<LaserJock> raphink: np, I was just thinking I might try to look at some packages on REVU (reviewing is good practice, as you well know) but I can do it on my local machine too.
<dolson> it said Package includes an .orig.tar.gz file although the debian revision suggests that it might not be required. Multiple uploads of the .orig.tar.gz may be rejected by the upload queue management software.
<raphink> LaserJock: the deb I provide should work on your machine :)
<Gloubiboulga> LaserJock, raphink's deb works perfectly on my machine :)
<LaserJock> raphink: yes, but it would be more convenient to do it on tiber. I'll just do it on my machine.
<raphink> yes I know that LaserJock
<raphink> that's why I propose you to give me the name of the packag eand the url of the tarball
<raphink> so I can run it there
<raphink> if youdon't have the rights to do it
<raphink> :)
<raphink> LaserJock: did you check if you had them?
<LaserJock> well, I can just scp it my local machine, I think
<LaserJock> no I don't
<raphink> ok
<LaserJock> they are afraid I'll break REVU ;-)
<raphink> otherwise, ping siretart to get them ;)
<raphink> haha ;)
<raphink> do you think they're right to be afraid of that LaserJock ?
<siretart> dolson: ignore that messages
<dolson> ok cool
<LaserJock> raphink: I doubt I would do anything bad but I don't really need that kind of access to REVU until I'm a MOTU.
<raphink> yep
<raphink> LaserJock: so just ask me
<raphink> it takes me no time to run them
<raphink> if yo ugive me the name of the package, the date and the url to the usptream tarball if required
<raphink> if there's a debian/watch this is not even required
<LaserJock> ok, I don't have anthing at the moment
<raphink> ok
<raphink> :)
<LaserJock> I'm still just trying to get used to OSX
<dolson> ah crap. I just noticed that the md5sum of the upstream tarball is different than my orig tarball and I didn't mention it in the changelog
#ubuntu-motu 2006-02-15
<siretart> dolson: just make another upload. try to not change the upstream tarball unless absolutely necessary
<dolson> well, the tarball extracts everything into Mx44/ and my modified one extracts to mx44-1.0
<dolson> other than that, the files inside are identical
<dolson> okay, I am an idiot. should be good now... I will sit and wait and stop messing around
<sistpoty> hi folks
<dolson> hi
<siretart> hey sistpoty !
<sistpoty> hi siretart
<dolson> i wish i was translucent
<jsgotangco> scary
<lucas> <dolson> well, the tarball extracts everything into Mx44/ and my modified one extracts to mx44-1.0
<lucas> you don't need to change the tarball to fix this
<dolson> oh
<lucas> the directory name doesn't matter
<dolson> I was getting complaints from one of the tools.. can't remember which now, let me try again
<dolson> ;.//////////
<dolson> ' ''''''''''' p] ] ] 
<dolson> sorry... my ferret walked on the keyboard
<lucas> the only things that matter is the source package name and the name of your ../*.orig* file
<dolson> ok, so I downloaded the upstream file, Mx44.tar.gz, and I renamed it to mx44-1.0.orig.tar.gz. then I extract it and it goes to Mx44/ and I can just go in there and build as normal and it doesn't matter
<lucas> yes
<Hobbsee> dolson: your ferret?  i didnt know anyone had them as pets!
<dholbach> good night
<sistpoty> gn8 dholbach
<dolson> night dholbach
<lucas> dolson: try :
<lucas> apt-get source hello
<lucas> mv hello-2.1.1 foo
<lucas> cd foo
<dolson> Hobbsee: yeah, my ferret rules :D http://aslan.homelinux.com/dana/maximus for a couple pics
<lucas> rm ../*2.1.1-4*
<Hobbsee> :) ok, i'll check it in a sec
<lucas> dpkg-buildpackage
<LaserJock> cya dholbach
<lfittl> gn8 dholbach
* lucas goes to bed too
<lucas> good night everybody
<Hobbsee> argh!  why does doing a dch -i open the changelog in vi?  i cant use vi for goodness sake!
<sistpoty> gn8 lucas
<lfittl> gn8 lucas
<lucas> Hobbsee: check $EDITOR and $VISUAL
<LaserJock> cya lucas
<dolson> lucas: thanks for your help!
<LaserJock> Hobbsee: it's giving you a hint to learn vi ;-)
<lfittl> Hobbsee: update-alternatives --config editor ;)
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: urgh!
<dolson> lfittl: thanks! I needed that too :D
<Hobbsee> lfittl: ah, thankyou!
<lfittl> np :)
* Hobbsee will not go so insane  over changelogs
<LaserJock> Hobbsee: what would you like to use?
<Hobbsee> nano
<Hobbsee> or maybe even kwrite, but usually nano
<LaserJock> ah, that makes sense
<LaserJock> I usually use nano/pico for those kinds of things
<dolson> ok, NOW for really this time it's the last fix.
<dolson> oh wtf am I doing wrong here? it didn't upload the .orig again
<hub> hello from France ! :-)
<dolson> ok, time to walk away for a while
<Hobbsee> hi hub from australia
<hub> Hobbsee: just that usually I'm in Canuckistan :-)
<Hobbsee> ah ok
<Hobbsee> and where the heck is that?
<dolson> Canada
<Hobbsee> ah ok
<Hobbsee> and why didnt you take me in your suitcase?  france sounds fun!
<dolson> you must be a very small person
<dolson> or else you assume hub has a very large suitcase
<Hobbsee> dolson: well, yeah, i am rather
<Hobbsee> hehe
<hub> dolson: I have a large suitcase. but airline limit it to 23kg
<hub> and airline seat size limit tallness
* hub is compressed in coach
* Hobbsee considers - i think i'm slightly heavier than that...pity
<dolson> heh
<ajmitch> afternoon
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: hi from australia ;)
<LaserJock> hi ajmitch
<Hobbsee> hehe - you're in sydney somewhere arent you?
<ajmitch> no, brisbane
<Hobbsee> ah, ok
<ajmitch> I live in dunedin, NZ
<Hobbsee> ah....
* Hobbsee always gets confused with where everyone lives, as they seem to move around a lot!
<ajmitch> I haven't moved from dunedin for > 5 years :)
<jsgotangco> camper
<ajmitch> :P
<Hobbsee> then why are you in brisbane, if you havent moved from dunedin?
* Hobbsee 's brain explodes in confusion
<jsgotangco> work
<jsgotangco> heh
<sistpoty> hi ajmitch
<Hobbsee> ah...
<Hobbsee> right
<phanatic> hi people
<azeem> LaserJock: pong
<LaserJock> azeem: oh hi! I was wondering if you were still working on the gchempaint ITP
<azeem> LaserJock: heh
<azeem> LaserJock: so Daniel Leidert has packages which should get uploaded
<Kyral> hmm
<azeem> I setup a svn repo for Debian, but I didn't find the time to contact him again (he's not on irc)
<Kyral> Could I make a case to have gnome-splash-manager installed by default..
<LaserJock> azeem: so are you going to sponsor his upload? or does it still need work?
<ajmitch> Kyral: you could
<Kyral> ajmitch: but how would I go about it?
<ajmitch> the usual way, main inclusion reports, talking to the right people
* Kyral blinks
<Kyral> Main Inclusion report?
<ajmitch> yes
<azeem> LaserJock: I think it is good for an initial upload
<Kyral> Jeez, while I have been bogged down by school, you guys have been going...sorry I havent been helping much as of late
<azeem> LaserJock: the problem is that he keeps his own CVS repo and I am not sure whether he wants to give that up, we had some unconclusive email exchange about it
<LaserJock> azeem: np, I was just curious where it was at
<ajmitch> Kyral: I haven't done anything
<LaserJock> azeem: I'm a little unclear as to what that means. You mean he doesn't want to give you CVS access?
<Kyral> Don't worry, when Flight 4 comes otu with the new Installer, I'll be all over it
<Kyral> I said I would write the Documentation and I will
<azeem> LaserJock: not really, we were just not really clear on which source version should get uploaded and how
<azeem> or rather, how to modify his current version changelog-wise to get it into unstable
<azeem> it's a rather minor issue I guess
<LaserJock> azeem: ah, I see
* sistpoty is off again... gn8
<LaserJock> cya sistpoty
<Mez|ZzZ> sighs
<Mez|ZzZ> I'm faced with a tough decision here
<jsgotangco> sleep?
<Mez> well - no -
<Mez> people are requesting a backport
<Mez> it's a biggy - and well - its buggy as hell in breezy
<Mez> backporting it from dapper would fix it
<Mez> actually
<Mez> jsgotangco, you use scim right ?
<jsgotangco> not on this machine at the moment
<Mez> but you're a user of it - yes?
<jsgotangco> yes
<Mez> what do you think about the version in breezy?
<Mez> i've heard it breaks like mad
<jsgotangco> it does
<jsgotangco> the ones upstream is much better
<Mez> what if the dapper vesion was backported?
<jsgotangco> i haven't tried the dapper version (i can try now) but a lot of ubuntu people got involved with it and had lots of tests
<Mez> yeah and apparently it's a lot better
<Mez> now
<jsgotangco> yes
<Mez> I could make it backportable
<jsgotangco> because we now have test data
<Mez> but that'd mean creating a delta from debian
<jsgotangco> oh
<Mez> so im stuck between fixing it and making people happy and creating a delta with debian
<jsgotangco> a lot of people want a backport now?
<Mez> well yeah
<Mez> a lot of people want a workin version in breezy
<Mez> jsgotangco, still here?
<jsgotangco> yeah
<jsgotangco> im in dapper now
<jsgotangco> well the other laptop
<Mez> would you mind hopping onto -devel and explaiing the problems with scim in breezy
<jsgotangco> hmm i don't think i'm the right person for this, i don't know the software that deeply, can you try freeflying?
<jsgotangco> i'll grab someone from hanirc too
<Mez> ok
<freeflying> looking for review on this http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=1721
<freeflying> Riddell: ping
<Hobbsee> freeflying: i think Riddell went to bed
<freeflying> Hobbsee: y , it's 3:00 am now for him
<Hobbsee> true
<Mez> freeflying, and for me
<Mez> I'm going to sleep after I've uploaded this
<freeflying> Mez: would u like review my package
<Mez> will do in a sec
<LaserJock> hmm, where is the proper place to have something started at boot?
<Mez> hmm
<Mez> why is this package trying to run config.status again
<dolson> Linda: Unable to find a suitable .mo file! <-- is this something to worry about?
<dolson> not any info on google that I can see
<dolson> only two links, both back to revu
<minghua> dolson: not really, everybody else has that too.  linda in dapper seems to be broken
<dolson> ok then that's good. lintian is happy, and I guess linda. thanks. :)
<dolson> when I get changelog-should-mention-nmu, I have to change the control file to me as the maintainer, is that the only way or proper way to fix it?
<dolson> it says that he last entry in the changelog should be byte-for-byte identical if I didn't mean to nmu, but there are changes made to the package from the debian version
<minghua> no don't do that
<minghua> that warning is mostly for Debian and doesn't really apply to ubuntu
<minghua> keep the Debian maintainer's info in the debian/control file
<minghua> and add your changes in the changelog entry for -XubuntuY
<LaserJock> hi minghua
<dolson> oh ok.. so I should leave the maintainer as the debian guy.. I think we need a fixed lintian and linda for ubuntu
<minghua> ignore the NMU warning
<minghua> hi LaserJock
<dolson> minghua: ok, I uploaded a package to revu earlier, and I had changed it from someone else to me in the control file.. it's not in debian though, he did the debianization.. shouldI change it back to him and re-upload that one?
<minghua> dolson: Hmm, depends on whether the "someone else" plan to get the package in Debian and whether you want to keep maintaining it for ubuntu or not, I suppose
<minghua> kind of hard to answer for a package not in Debian
<dolson> ok, well I don't mind. he said he's really busy and stuff too, so I don't know. there's no ITP for debian for that package
<ajmitch> dolson: if it's uploaded to debian, the person listed as maintainer has to handle bug reports :)
<dolson> ok, so I can't take this package (seq24) and patch in the .desktop file and a man page and upload -Xubuntu1 to revu?
<dolson> because if I can't, then I am wasting time, and I could be doing something else
<crimsun> then go ahead and package it as -0ubuntu1
<dolson> crimsun: I am confused, sorry. isn't -0 for software not in debian?
<crimsun> didn't you say it's not in Debian?
<dolson> crimsun: mx44 isn't in debian, I did pack that as -0ubuntu1. the seq24 package is 0.7.0-1 and I was going to upload -1ubuntu1 to revu with the .desktop file and man page
<crimsun> right, so do -1ubuntu1
<dolson> alright, I did that. I have a question.. am I wasting my time with such trivial things as non-existent man pages and adding .desktop files?
<Kyral> no
<Kyral> because people will complain about those
<crimsun> no, and they're hardly trivial
<Kyral> and nroff isn't that hard to learn :D
<Kyral> Actually...
<dolson> what's nroff? that's for making man pages? I was using nano
<Kyral> I should make a .desktop template for the Packaging Guide if LJ hasn't already
<Kyral> nroff is the language
<Kyral> or was it troff?
<LaserJock> Kyral: I haven't yet
<LaserJock> Kyral: nroff or xml might be nice
<Kyral> Oh you are here lol
<Kyral> I can bang out a template tomorrow in the lab
<LaserJock> cool
<Kyral> for both Menu and .Desktop
<Kyral> Oh LJ, tomorrow (once I figure out Docbook Syntax) I'll make a quick list of "Gotchas"
<dolson> I noticed a bunch of packages that were not added to the gnome menu before.. I thought about making a script that took the menu files and generated .desktop files
<Kyral> I think there is one
<LaserJock> docbook is easy if you know a little HTML
<Kyral> LaserJock: I know, I meant the specifics
<Kyral> I just glanced at it today
<LaserJock> lots of <para> tags ;-)
<Kyral> lol
<Kyral> is there a tag for bulleted lists (like the <li> tags)
<LaserJock> <itemizedlist> i think
<dolson> if a package I uploaded to revu closes one or more bugs, should I assign the bugs to me in launchpad? the helping with bugs page in the wiki only says to get the fix in and close the bug. nothing about the in-between time
<dolson> if I am asking too many questions, feel free to tell me to bugger off
<LaserJock> don't assign it to yourself
<LaserJock> because then you will be the only one getting bug reports
<dolson> ah, ok. should I change the status at all. put a note in, etc though?
<LaserJock> I think the current practice is to assign it to motu-reviewers
<LaserJock> if you have a patch/fix
* minghua agrees with LaserJock
<minghua> dolson: pasting a debdiff to the bug in additional to the REVU upload may help, too
<dolson> I am so new at this, I don't want to piss anyone off if I'm making mistakes here.. but this package has two open bugs. one has a patch from persia (Emmet Hikory), and the other is an uninstallable report also from persia. I took his patch from the first bug and patched the package, and then I added the manpage I wrote and built the source and upped to revu. if it is approved and built it will also close the second bug because it just n
<dolson> eeds a rebuild to be installable. is what I did wrong?
<crimsun> no
<dolson> mepis may switch to ubuntu? cool
<Lathiat> ajmitch: ping
<ajmitch> Lathiat: pong
<ajmitch> what's up?
<LaserJock> minghua: heah, are you back?
<minghua> LaserJock: yeah, just got home :-)
<tiCo89> goddamn am i tired :-(
<tiCo89> 07.36 in the morning at work :-( (+0100)
<LaserJock> minghua: are you going to be around for the HUG Day (17th)?
<minghua> LaserJock: yes, but I doubt I can help much
<LaserJock> hmm, I went through the list of MOTUScience pacakges and found the ones with open bugs (34)
<LaserJock> I am planning on making it for the bug day but I would like to drum up a little help from other MOTUScience members ;-)
<minghua> LaserJock: oh cool, is it all recored on the wiki page?
<LaserJock> not yet
<LaserJock> I'm working on it
<LaserJock> but don't worry if you don't have time
<minghua> LaserJock: My problem is I don't have an ubuntu box at school
<LaserJock> I would just like for people to be aware
<minghua> LaserJock: But I'll try my best to help for sure
<LaserJock> minghua: I just lost mine to an Intel iMac this week :(
<LaserJock> but I set up a dapper chroot on an old sarge install on one of the other computers in the lab :-)
<minghua> LaserJock: then install ubuntu on the iMac :-)
<LaserJock> can't\
<LaserJock> because it's the new Intel chip
<LaserJock> it doesn't have a BIOS
<minghua> Hmm, no debian-installer for EMI yet?  that's going to be tough
<minghua> but I believe someone will write something to support it eventually :-)
<lifeless> see, I knew apple would not make commodity hardware a feature
<LaserJock> plus the graphics card isn't supported yet
<LaserJock> but I'm having fun learning how to use OSX. it is pretty cool
<minghua> s/EMI/EFI/
<minghua> OS X is wonderful
<minghua> my iBook is currently broken though :-(
<LaserJock> minghua: the list of MOTUScience packages with bugs is at http://tiber.tauware.de/~laserjock/bug_list.html . I'll try to clean it up and send an email to ubuntu-science.
<minghua> LaserJock: great, will help you on this
<LaserJock> a few of them are from main so I don't know how much we can do with those
<LaserJock> the other thing I've been thinking about is trying to get a list of science related packages that are outside of the math, science, and tex sections that I've been using to make my lists
<LaserJock> I think it will require us going through the other sections and finding them individually
<minghua> It's always a fuzzy line to draw, I suppose
<LaserJock> yeah, but for instance ghemical is not in the list but libghemical is.
<LaserJock> it will be a "fill in as you go" kind of thing I think, but I think it is worth starting
<Lathiat> ajmitch: yo
<ajmitch> ah, he lives
<Lathiat> ajmitch: have you got that bzr repo with my pkgget.sh handy?
<ajmitch> yes
<Lathiat> sorry, working ;p
<ajmitch> so am I :P
<Lathiat> pff "working" ;p
<lifeless> working shirking
<ajmitch> http://tiber.tauware.de/~ajmitch/scripts/
<ajmitch> lifeless: never!
<zakame> hi MOTUs
<ajmitch> hello zakame
<zakame> heya ajmitch :)
<dholbach> good morning
<Gloubiboulga> hello dholbach
<dholbach> hi Gloubiboulga
<Gloubiboulga> dholbach, texmaker in dapper FTBFS, and the new upstream release fixes this. Is it a good reason for UVF exception?
<dholbach> Gloubiboulga: send to the mailing list please - but yes, it sounds like a good candidate. :-)
<Gloubiboulga> dholbach, ok, writing a mail right now :)
<ajmitch> morning dholbach
<zakame> hetya dholbach
<dholbach> hey zakame
<zakame> hmm, does malone #3477 fall under the need for a UVF exception report, or can I upload directly fixing asegfault?
<Ubugtu> malone bug 3477 in makeztxt "makeztxt segfaults" [Normal,In progress]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/3477
<dholbach> Upstream Version Freeze is just about Upstream Versions.
<dholbach> So no, this is just fine with uploading.
<zakame> ooh k then :D
<zakame> heya raphink
<raphink> hi zakame
<Toadstool> heya MOTUs and other guys here ;)
<Gloubiboulga> hi again Toadstool ;)
<Toadstool> can someone have a look at http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=1710 and tell me if it's ok ?
<Toadstool> it's the same package as http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=1686 with a different name, because upstream has changed its project name and way to work
<Toadstool> i've only added a debian/watch file and removed the ugly get-orig-source rule in debian/rules
<Gloubiboulga> dholbach, do I upload the new texmaker package on REVU now?
<dholbach> Gloubiboulga: Matt and Colin will have to confirm - I'll send this out on monday
<Gloubiboulga> dholbach, ok thanks
<raphink> dholbach: is 1.0 a good verison number for a debian-native package? or should it be 1.0-1 ?
<dholbach> However you like it.
<raphink> dholbach: really?
<dholbach> Yeah
<raphink> ok then :)
<dholbach> For ubuntu-docs I have <year>.<month>.<revision>
<raphink> ok :)
<raphink> dholbach: which is good since it follows the distro versionning :)
<freeflying> may i change my passwd on revu
<siretart> raphink: native packages should not have a dash ('-') in version
<raphink> siretart: ok :)
<raphink> thanks
<siretart> freeflying: write a signed and encrypted mail to keyring@tiber.tauware.de
<freeflying> siretart: with the passwd I want ?
<siretart> freeflying: yes.
<Yagisan> G'day All
<sebest_> Lathiat, slomo: png
<sebest_> ping
<Lathiat> sebest_: pong
<sebest_> Lathiat: could you please review the packages taht i submitted on revu?
<Lathiat> sure :)
<Lathiat> good thing you reminded me
<Lathiat> i forgot ;p
<sebest_> i set an "at" job  to remind me to remind you
<Lathiat> haha
<Lathiat> hrm
<Lathiat> siretart: ping
<Lathiat> siretart: if i try to recover my password it is 'None', and that doesnt work
<dholbach> There wasn't much response on the REVU day yet.
<Lathiat> yay for 'fetchpackage'
<dholbach> same for https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Report/Draft :-/
<Lathiat> sebest_: Depends: avahi-daemon -> Recommends? seems to be what everything else does
<Lathiat> also should it necesarily a2enmod itself?
<Lathiat> do other packages do that?
<Lathiat> also does that apxs=/bin/true thign get used in other packages?
<Lathiat> seems a bit dodge :)
<Lathiat> hrm
<Lathiat> i jsut accidentially stuck my kde panel at the top of the screen
<Lathiat> and i think i like it there
<Lathiat> i love good accidents :)
<Lathiat> hrm
<Lathiat> whats a .mo file
<Lathiat> Linda: Unable to find a suitable .mo file!
<Lathiat> sebest_: apart from above, moddnsd looks good
* Lathiat wonders how to test mod-mime-xattr
<sebest_> Lathiat, about the apsx and the a2enmod, yes and yes
<sebest_> mod_mono does this
<Lathiat> cool
<sebest_> the problem with apxs is that it always try to install in the real "/"
<Lathiat> works
<Toadstool> hi again
<Lathiat> sebest_: ah right
<Lathiat> both packages work
<Lathiat> and look fine
<Lathiat> i'd comment but my revu account is fscked
<Lathiat> qaplaH:~/devel/ubuntu/libapache2-mod-mime-xattr> lintian *.deb
<Lathiat> E: libapache2-mod-mime-xattr: description-too-long
<Lathiat> also it does more than just mime types
<Lathiat> so t
<Lathiat> ahts
<Lathiat> so thats not the best descrption
<Lathiat> i suppose its close really
<sebest_> i copy/paste the description from mezcalero :)
<Lathiat> heh
<Lathiat> well the description needs to be shorter i think
<Toadstool> I've got an upstream tarball in which there are config.{log,status} and Makefile files, I have added a patch for Makefile.in so that the clean rule removes this files
<Lathiat> Description: Apache module for storing a file's MIME type in an extended attribu
<Lathiat> tgat sgirt lo
<Lathiat> wekk
<Lathiat> wekk
<Lathiat> wtf
<Lathiat> i cant type today
<sebest_> Lathiat: why your lintian complains and not the one from revu (about the description)?
<Lathiat> well, cutting the (EA ("user.mime_type") off may be ok
<Lathiat> sebest_: newer lintian?
<Lathiat> oh
<sebest_> of course i do :d
<Lathiat> i know
<sebest_> but mine doesn't complain :)
<Lathiat> lintian *.dsc
<Lathiat> vs *.deb
<Lathiat> different results
<Toadstool> I've also convinced the upstream author to remove these files from the next releases
<Toadstool> but lintian continues to complain about these files :/
<Toadstool> can I do something about that ?
<Toadstool> ok I am too tired, I should really sleep, raphink has already posted a comment about this on REVU...
<raphink> if you remove the config.* from within debian/rules
<raphink> lintian will still complain
<raphink> it's even said in the lintian output ;)
<raphink> and it' snormal
<raphink> and can be safely ignored
<sebest_> Lathiat: i think i have shorten the description
<Toadstool> raphink: yep I've just read that, sorry :/
<raphink> hehe ;)
<zakame> hi MOTUs
<sebest_> there is a funny bug with firefox gnome theme in dapper
<sebest_> i have a dialog with 2 button stop and continue, but the icons are inversed
<sebest_> continue has the red cross and vice versa
<Lathiat> haha
<zakame> heh
<sebest_> it's the "warning unresponsive script" dialog
<Lathiat> sebest_: ok
<Lathiat> sebest_: see
<Lathiat> sebest_: i guess its tryign to say
<Lathiat> sebest_: you shouldnt continue, you should terminate
<Lathiat> so arguably thats not wrong
<sebest_> hummmm it's really misleading
<dholbach> I wonder, if we should have a motu-organisation@ list that's work-based and let the motu list turn into ... something else :-(
<zakame> how come?
<dholbach> There were a bunch of requests for organizing things, there are 10 uvf exception requests, that need somebody to look at them, but still some people prefer to have long debates with questionable outcome
<dholbach> Nevermind me, perhaps I'm just in a strange mood today.
<ogra> dholbach you arent ...
<dholbach> "management of volunteers" - yuck!
* dholbach shuts up
* dholbach gets back to work himself
<ogra> dholbach, i could give flint your phone number, he'd surely raise your mood ... :)
<dholbach> I'm doing bug triage - no point in trying to raise my mood. :-p
<ogra> (and he loves to call around the world since he discovered skype)
<zakame> hmmm
<zakame> gaah
<zakame> well womble has a point earlier: don't force, but do expect some work to be done
<zakame> after all, what's the point of being a volunteer :)
* mode/#ubuntu-motu [+o Mirno]  by ChanServ
<ogra> Mirno, ??
<dholbach> Mirno: We don't need ops in here, please de-op.
<Mirno> hi
<Mirno> sorry
<dholbach> zakame: ++
<Mirno> used an /chanserv op all
* mode/#ubuntu-motu [-o Mirno]  by Mirno
<dholbach> ok
<zakame> JohnnyMast: around?
<Lathiat> \sh_away: ping
<Lathiat> \sh_away: gtkglext   * debian/control: adjusted build-dep to libgtkmm2.0-dev
<siretart> Mirno: still around?
<Mirno> siretart: uh yeah, but not much time thought
<siretart> Mirno: I noticed that http://packages.freecontrib.org/ubuntu/plf/ is broken for quite some source packages. are you aware of the problem?
<Mirno> siretart: uh no ?
<Mirno> siretart: there's quite much binary only packages thought
<siretart> lets continue to query
<Lathiat> siretart: yo
<siretart> hi Lathiat
<Lathiat> siretart: my revu password, if i try recover it it says 'None'
<siretart> Lathiat: gnarf, this perhaps because you didn't use your primary uid
<siretart> Lathiat: write me an encrypted and singed email with your preffered email and login
<Lathiat> oh hrm
<Lathiat> am i supposed to login with my email
<Lathiat> not a username of lathiat
<Lathiat> ?
<Lathiat> ah
<Lathiat> indeed i am
<Lathiat> got it now cheers
<siretart> ah
<siretart> great :)
<Lathiat> someone remind me
<Lathiat> if i want to just rebuild a package
<Lathiat> and it already has ubuntuX
<Lathiat> i just increment X right?
<Lathiat> buildX is only for things without ubuntuX?
<Mez> Lathiat, yes
<Lathiat> cool
<Mez> buildX is for rebuilds that are based from debian
* Lathiat nods
<Lathiat> also sometimes
<Lathiat> i use debuild -S
<Mez> but what you say is correct
<Lathiat> and it doesnt seem to sign the .dsc properly such that dput whignes
<Lathiat> but if i re-run debuild -S it works
<Mez> run it twice then
<Mez> :P
<Lathiat> haha
<Mez> or just do a debsign *.changes
<Lathiat> this seems to happen every time so
<Lathiat> weird
<Lathiat> hrm i tried .dsc and it whinges cus i wasnt the maintainer
<Lathiat> i'll try that
<Lathiat> i cant wait for my new pc :\
<Lathiat> my laptop sucks so bad at building
* Lathiat waits and waits and waits.. :)
<Lathiat> ugh
<Mez> hmm if I want to make a rule based on the output from a command ...
<Mez> I know how to make something run if a condition is true
<Mez> but what about if it's false
<Lathiat> example ?
<Mez>         [ `lsb_release -c -s` = "breezy" ]  && cp debian/control-breezy debian/control
<Lathiat> ||
<Mez> runs the cp command if the output of the previous command is true
<Mez> but if it's false. ..
<Mez> I want to do something like this
<Lathiat> [ `lsb_release -c -s` = "breezy"]   || cp debian/control-breezy debian/control
<Mez> (assuming your || is true)
<Lathiat> || wasnt a typo ;p
<Lathiat> ah
<Lathiat> :)
<Mez>         [ `lsb_release -c -s` = "breezy" ]  &&         dh_shlibdeps -L libscim8 -l debian/libscim8/usr/lib ||         dh_shlibdeps -L libscim8c2a -l debian/libscim8c2a/usr/lib
<Mez> would that work
<Lathiat> what are you tryign to do
<Lathiat> that says to be
<Lathiat> if lsbreease is breezy
<Lathiat> then run dh-shlibdeps (1)
<Lathiat> if that fails, run the second one
<Mez> yeah
<Mez> pretty much
<Lathiat> however my sh parser is not proven and that may be incorrect
<Lathiat> true && false || echo hi
<Lathiat> true && true || echo hi
<Lathiat> woudl test that
<Lathiat> ?
<Mez> true &&echo true || echo false
<Mez> false  &&echo true || echo false
<Mez> surely to test
<Lathiat> no
<Lathiat> aren tyou trying to depend on the result of the middle command
<Lathiat> well
<Lathiat> i guess it depends on precednece
<Lathiat> is it
<Lathiat> (false && echo true) || echo false
<Lathiat> or
<Lathiat> false && (echo true || echo false)
<jamessan> (false && echo true) || echo false
<Mez> depending on the result of the first command
<Mez> I could just call it twice
<Mez> may be easier
<doko_> Lathiat: do not change the control file at build time
<zakame> wow
<Lathiat> uh
<Lathiat> i did that?
<Lathiat> doko_:
<doko_> <Lathiat> example ?
<doko_> <Mez>         [ `lsb_release -c -s` = "breezy" ]  && cp debian/control-breezy debian/control
<doko_> <Lathiat> ||
<Lathiat> oh
<Lathiat> i was focussing on the technical side of things
<Lathiat> and ignoring what he was catually doing ;p
<Lathiat> but tell mez
<Lathiat> im not doing it :)
<Mez> doko_, I've been given permission to :D
* Lathiat laughs
<Lathiat> is this because the backports stuff
<Mez> I went through all this last night with mdz and he cleared it
<doko_> Mez: how do these files differ?
<Lathiat> has this seemingly silly policy of only syncing packages and not taking uploads?
<Lathiat> because it results in ugly hacks like that?
<Mez> doko - change of binary package name (revoking C++ ABI package name change for breezy)
<Lathiat> W: libapache2-mod-mime-xattr: description-synopsis-might-not-be-phrased-properly
<Lathiat> wtf does that mean
<Mez> your short description probably begins with "a" or "the
<Lathiat> it does because it begins with "Apache" :)
<Mez> *shrugs*
<Mez> just add an override
<ogra> please dont override such errors
<ogra> thats easy to solve
* Mez doesnt know what the error is :D
<ogra> just rephrase the description ...
<Lathiat> how should it be phraesd?
<Lathiat> Description: Apache module for storing a file's MIME type in an extended attribute.
<ogra> store a file's MIME type in an extended attribute with this apache module
<ogra> for example
<ogra> i guess there are 1000 ways to rephrase ;)
<doko_> Lathiat: dot at the end
<Lathiat> is that really what it is? heh
<ogra> ah, yes
<ogra> missed that ...
<Lathiat> yargh i try to fix one package, which eneds another package fixed to build, which needs another package fixed to build
<Lathiat> gah
<sealne> raphink: question re your comment on dcfldd on revu, so should i change watch back to being belnet or whichever mirror?
<raphink> sealne: the best would be the usptream website if they release tarballs on it
<sealne> its sf.net
<raphink> sealne: otherwise try to find a mirror that works with debian/watch, but most mirrors provided by sf won't work
<sealne> so better to just remove the watch file?
<raphink> sealne: if you wan't do it otherwise yes
<raphink> it's useless as it is
<sealne> k, i didn't really know anything about watch
<raphink> np
<raphink> !=
<raphink> :)
<sealne> thanks
<Toadstool> sealne: you can use http://qa.debian.org/watch/sf.php?project=something something-(.+)\.tar\.gz in your watch file
<raphink> Toadstool: oooh interesting :)
<raphink> Toadstool: thanks for pointing that out, I have to remember it :)
<sealne> Toadstool: what goes between project=something and something-(.+)\.tar\.gz in the url?
<Toadstool> nothing
<Toadstool> look at man uscan for more info
<raphink> Toadstool: are you sure this works with uscan v3?
<Toadstool> I don't know ^^
<raphink> hehe
<raphink> oh yes should work
<Toadstool> you can directly put http://heanet.dl.sourceforge.net/sourceforge/package-name-(.+)\.tar\.gz if you want
<raphink> Toadstool: I'm not sure that works
<raphink> because http://heanet.dl.sourceforge.net/sourceforge/ can' tbe accessed
<raphink> so the list of files fitting this regexpr can't be stated
<sealne> Toadstool: and where you said nothing between them i guess you ment a / ?
<raphink> taht's why they created http://qa.debian.org/watch/sf.php?project=something imo
<Lathiat> gah
<Lathiat> revu using GET requests is annoying
<raphink> Lathiat: gah?
<Lathiat> i refresh a page and it adds more comments :(
<Lathiat> thank god for the delete button
<Lathiat> :)
<Toadstool> raphink: check the watch file in wide-dhcpv6 ;)
<raphink> Lathiat: indeed
* Lathiat -> bed
<Lathiat> night lal
<jamessan> Lathiat: it's pretty handy to lintian checks like "lintian foo.deb | lintian-info". gives a description of what the warning/error is
<raphink> Lathiat: this is fixed in revu2 I believe
<raphink> Toadstool: I will
<Lathiat> jamessan: oh cool cheers
<Toadstool> <sealne> Toadstool: and where you said nothing between them i guess you ment a / ? <-- nope
<Toadstool> nothing at all
<raphink> Toadstool: seems to work in wide-dhcpv6 :)
<Toadstool> yep
<sistpoty> hi folks
<Gloubiboulga> hey sistpoty
<sistpoty> hi Gloubiboulga
<sistpoty> Gloubiboulga: I just sent you an reply...
<Gloubiboulga> sistpoty, I check
<sistpoty> Gloubiboulga: but I guess it's easier to discuss on irc ;)
<Toadstool> hi sistpoty
<sistpoty> hi Toadstool
<Gloubiboulga> yes, let me read again the policy
<adn> hey guys
<sistpoty> hi adn
<Toadstool> sistpoty: if you have time, could you check http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=1726 ?
<sistpoty> Toadstool: not right now... but I'll look at it later this evening
<Toadstool> thanks :)
<Gloubiboulga> sistpoty, "Since ocaml 3.06-13, the ocaml and ocaml-base
<Gloubiboulga>      package now provide virtual packages called ocaml-3.08 and
<Gloubiboulga>      ocaml-base-3.08 respectively."
<Gloubiboulga> I can't can't find this packages in ubuntu nor in debian
<Gloubiboulga> so if a lib depends on this, it won't be installable
<sistpoty> Gloubiboulga: these are virtual packages from ocaml... which are named ocaml-base-<version>, so they are ocaml-base-3.09.1 right now
<sistpoty> Gloubiboulga: but everything that's no ocaml core package (i.e. not coming from ocaml sourcepackage) shouldn't be provide virtual packages with version-suffix.. at least that's how I understand the policy
<Gloubiboulga> Ok, got it
<Gloubiboulga> I should have run `apt-cache search ocaml-base-3.09.1' sooner
<sistpoty> hehe
<Gloubiboulga> sistpoty, I'll take care of the others packages if that's ok with you
<sistpoty> Gloubiboulga: sure, that would be great :)
<sistpoty> Gloubiboulga: I guess most of them only need a rebuild...
<Gloubiboulga> sistpoty, yes, I think so
<Gloubiboulga> sistpoty, have you only uploaded libsqlite-ocaml, or an other packages too ?
<sistpoty> Gloubiboulga: only libsqlite-ocaml from the ocaml-packages
<Gloubiboulga> ok
<LaserJock> dholbach: I added some MOTUScience info to the UbuntuBugDay wiki. Hope you don't mind.
<dholbach> slomo_: thanks
<dholbach> LaserJock: excellent
<slomo_> dholbach: thanks? what have i done? :)
<dholbach> instant-replied to a mail :)
<slomo_> dholbach: oh... i haven't expected the mail to arrive so soon :)
<dholbach> hehe :)
<sistpoty> hi slomo_ and dholbach
<dholbach> hey sistpoty
* dholbach hugs sistpoty
<slomo_> hi sistpoty
<sistpoty> phew... I got another bunch of patches from lfittl... I need a faster machine for building :/
* dholbach just got himself a faster disk
<dholbach> hmmmmmmmmhhhh :-)
<LaserJock> hi setch
<LaserJock> seth I mean
<seth> hi LaserJock
<LaserJock> seth: are you going to be around on the 17th for the Bug Day? I'm drumming up MOTU Science volunteers for https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuBugDay
<seth> LaserJock, hmm, 17
<seth> i'll be around... after 1800 GMT
<seth> probably too late :(
<LaserJock> whatever, we are flexible
<LaserJock> ;-)
<LaserJock> I just wanted MOTU Science to be aware. It would really be cool to squash a bunch of bugs or at least get everythin tiaged
<LaserJock> last night I went through the ~450 science related packages and found the ones with bugs. It took a while but I was actually suprised that there weren't more
<LaserJock> about half way through I was wondering how much I would have to pay the LP devs to get xml-rpc support in Malone ;-)
<sistpoty> LaserJock: you would have to be *very* kind to elmo... afaik he manages the xmlrpc whitelist of LP ;)
<LaserJock> sistpoty: hmm, I don't know then. I have bugged him enough. He probably hates me. I'm sure I'll be blacklisted ;-)
<sistpoty> LaserJock: everybody is blacklisted by default... (we try to get tiber whitelisted for revu-account handling via LP) ;)
<sistpoty> LaserJock: but perhaps you are very-blacklisted, as in darkest black *g*
<LaserJock> black hole maybe :-(
<sistpoty> hehe
<jpatrick>  /dev/null
<LaserJock> lol
<LaserJock> man, ubuntu-dev has a ton of proposed members https://launchpad.net/people/ubuntu-dev/+members maybe the list could be cleaned up?
<dolson> good morning all
<dholbach> lfittl for MOTU
<sistpoty> dholbach: yay!... and there will go in more fixes from him rsn ;)
<ogra> dholbach, lfittl for Mr.GnuStep :)
<dholbach> :-)
<dolson> dolson for smelly wannabe
* jpatrick for MOTU (Kubuntu)
<dholbach> have a nice weekend
<sistpoty> cya dholbach
<dholbach> bye sistpoty
<Gloubiboulga> sistpoty, last question for today: for each rebuild needed, I have to add Xbuild1 to the debian version, right?
<sistpoty> Gloubiboulga: exactly
<Gloubiboulga> ok thanks :)
<slomo_> Gloubiboulga: unless it already has a -XubuntuY version... then increment the Y by one
<Gloubiboulga> slomo_, ok
<pef> hello
<Gloubiboulga> hello pef :)
<pef> Gloubiboulga: comment va ? :)
<Gloubiboulga> trs bien, et toi ?
<pef> is there a problem with build daemons ? I can see my updated package on archive, but not its logs on build daemons' logs (viewmol, mgp)
<pef> Gloubiboulga: trs bien aussi :)
<pef> http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/v/viewmol/ https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/dapper-changes/2006-February/006057.html
<sistpoty> pef: soyuz (and thus LP) knows about the buildlogs now
<pef> sistpoty: ohh ok :) and what is exactly the problem ?
<sistpoty> pef: there is no problem... the buildlogs just aren't in lamont's folder any longer
<sistpoty> pef: https://launchpad.net/people/loic/+packages (and the buildlogs are just a few clicks away)
<pef> sistpoty: very nice feature, thanks for the info
<sistpoty> np
<blueyed> I've built a custom kernel (with make-kpkg). How would I now build the nvidia-glx module for it?
<sistpoty> blueyed: make-kpkg modules_image (after having install nvidia-kernel-source)?
<blueyed> sistpoty: don't ask me.. ;) Thanks. I'll search in that direction.
<dolson> blueyed: apt-get install nvidia-kernel-source ; cd /usr/src ; tar zxf nvidia-kernel-source.tar.gz ; then in your kernel src dir, do make-kpkg modules_image
<dolson> blueyed: it should make a deb in /usr/src for you
<blueyed> Thanks dolson. But I wonder if it works with the vanilla 2.6.15.3 sources?!
<dolson> blueyed: it does for me... well, using .2
<dolson> blueyed: see here: http://www.ubuntustudio.com/wiki/index.php/Breezy:Vanilla_Kernel_With_Realtime_Preemption
<dolson> the -rt patch you probably won't want.. but that procedure worked for me
<dolson> and wow, they have 2.6.15.4 now
<blueyed> Thanks. I've followed: http://wiki.suspend2.net/DistroAndHardwareSetup/Ubuntu_Breezy_Badger
<blueyed> -rt sound cool. I might try it, when rebuilding the kernel.. :D
<dolson> it's great for JACK and other music apps
<blueyed> dolson: both patches do not apply cleanly together.
<dolson> not a surprise
<segfault> can anyone close bug #29571? it's kinda easy.
<Ubugtu> malone bug 29571 in clamav "tmpfs /var/run/clamav does not exist after reboot" [Normal,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/29571
<crimsun> oh man, e-mail backlog hell
#ubuntu-motu 2006-02-16
<Kyral> Guys I have a question about the UVF
<crimsun> shoot.
<Kyral> Okay, remember GTKEdit?
<Kyral> Upstream just emailed me and said he would be releasing a new version soon
<slomo_> Kyral: rule number 1: don't say you have a question... ask the question :P
<Kyral> Now do I have to file a UVF Exception for it?
<crimsun> I'm going to take a guess that you want to file a UVF exception
<slomo_> Kyral: yes
<Kyral> okay
<Kyral> Maybe I should calm down first
<LaserJock> Kyral: calm down from what?
<Kyral> Nothing, just me in a social funk
<Kyral> It doesn't concern any of you
<Lathiat> whos lukas fittl on irc?
<LaserJock> FSF membership not doing it for you? ;-)
<Kyral> ..Can it LJ..
<LaserJock> Lathiat: lfittl
<Kyral> I'm happy to support the FSF
<Kyral> I just don't want it to be my entire life
<LaserJock> I'm glad you are too, I just had to make a stupid, sarcastic joke to liven the mood
<Kyral> Lets put it this way, I'd rather wind up well adjusted like Linus then to wind up like RMS
<LaserJock> Kyral: I didn't know Linus was well adjusted *grin*
<slomo_> ..well adjusted... :)
<Kyral> He has a wife + kids
<Kyral> better than RMS can say :P
<slomo_> hm, it's a matter of priority imho ;)
<Kyral> If I had to choose between the best damn Hacker on the planet and having a family, I'd chose having a family
<Kyral> Even if it meant I could never touch code again
<LaserJock> hmm, I prefer both
<slomo_> and i would prefer only a girlfriend over a whole family ;)
<Kyral> slomo_: you have to understand, I'm Italian. I grew up around a massive extended family
<slomo_> LaserJock: btw, stupid, sarcastic jokes are always good... as well as sarcasm :) it makes life more interesting
<Kyral> I may delude myself and thikn I like to live alone, but at the end of the day its me alone curled up in my bed
<slomo_> but well... a whole family could me more annoying than one person ;)
<LaserJock> I suppose it depends on the family
<dolson> argh, this is frustrating
<LaserJock> yes it is, I don't even know what your talking about :-)
<dolson> LaserJock: sorry, heh...
<dolson> I'm working on a script, and I'm having some issues with it. I am storing some stuff into a variable, APPLIST, and then trying to make Zenity display it in a list
<dolson> problem is, Zenity sees all the spaces and ignores the "s
<crimsun> what's the value of $APPLIST?
<dolson> well, I've tried a lot of different ones.. it's a loop that pulls info out of all the .desktop files in the Audio category. I've tried enclosing app names and descriptions in double quotes, single quotes,  no quotes, but it doesn't put the columns properly
<dolson> I tried delimiting the spaces in the descriptions and names as well
<crimsun> pastebin your script somewhere?
<dolson> crimsun: here it is as I have it now: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/8462
<dolson> I guess my scripting is really bad :)
<zul> heylo
<dolson> hi zul
<bmonty> evening everyone
<crimsun> dolson: got it
<crimsun> dolson: you need to change $IFS
<crimsun> dolson: you also need to change the way \"s are used, which means you can get rid of the sed expressions, too
<crimsun> dolson: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/8467
<dolson> crimsun: right when I was giving up on this for the day, you say you figured it out. cool.. checking link now
<crimsun> dolson: (note that I hard-coded "/usr/share/applications/")
<dolson> ah, I left that out when I pasted it eh
<crimsun> that's ok, that was just a local hack
<dolson> crimsun:  thanks a lot man! I never even heard of $IFS before, this is great.. thanks for helping me out with this
<crimsun> np
<crimsun> dolson: this was the clincher: http://www.tldp.org/LDP/abs/html/quotingvar.html#FTN.AEN2024
<crimsun> dolson: "word splitting"
<crimsun> out for the evening
<dolson> take care... and thanks again
<gus> yo
<dolson> hi gus
<gus> hi dolson
<gus> hey dolson did ya try installing vmware-player ?
<moonade> i have some apt-get / openssh issues and some openssh issues... i get a "S20ssh" file instead of a symlink in /etc/rc2.d (which i have to manually delete); unless i restart computer, i can't access openssh. it either does not run (and says "Read from socket failed: Connection reset by peer"), or it simply "unexpectedly" refuses any connection. the two problems seem to be connected to one another, as they only occur together.
<moonade> also, they might be triggered by my attempts to connect to the ssh server from a logical networking card (from both qemu and vmware).
<moonade> "from both qemu and vmware" != "when using qemu and vmware symultaneously"
<moonade> i would also want to know if there's anyone here.
<moonade> :)
<crimsun> yes, but many people are away
<crimsun> (I'm on the 'phone)
<moonade> crimsun: please consider this when you can take some time
<dolson> gus: nope, sorry
<dolson> gus: sorry for the hour+ delay in my reply... I went for coffee with a buddy
<crimsun> moonade: breezy?
<moonade> crimsun: yes. forgot to mention.
<crimsun> 1:4.1p1-7ubuntu4?
<moonade> crimsun: yes. latest.
<crimsun> moonade: and you're missing /etc/rc2.d/S20ssh?
<moonade> crimsun: it gets replaced by the file itself (or another file? haven't checked)
<moonade> crimsun: then i remove the file and manually create the symlink to /etc/init.d/ssh
<moonade> crimsun: then the apt-get install / remove processes work just fine, until trying to access openssh again.
<crimsun> moonade: no, remove your manually created symlink, then execute: update-rc.d ssh defaults
<moonade> update-rc.d: warning: /etc/rc2.d/S20ssh is not a link to ../init.d/ssh
<moonade>  System startup links for /etc/init.d/ssh already exist.
<crimsun> remove them with -f
<crimsun> update-rc.d -f remove ssh
<crimsun> err, syntax flipped
<crimsun> update-rc.d -f ssh remove
<moonade> update-rc.d: /etc/init.d/ssh exists during rc.d purge (continuing)
<moonade>  Removing any system startup links for /etc/init.d/ssh ...
<moonade> update-rc.d: warning: /etc/rc2.d/S20ssh is not a link to ../init.d/ssh
<moonade>    /etc/rc2.d/S20ssh is not a link to ../init.d/ssh; not removing
<crimsun> um...
<crimsun> what is the symlink, then?
<moonade> @S20ssh actually *does* point to "/etc/init.d/ssh"
<crimsun> that's incorrect, which is why update-rc.d is barfing
<crimsun> it _must_ be ../init.d/ssh
<moonade> oh...
<moonade> it need is relative?!
<crimsun> crimsun@mika:~$ ls -l /etc/rc2.d/*ssh*
<crimsun> lrwxrwxrwx  1 root root 13 2005-04-13 15:31 /etc/rc2.d/S20ssh -> ../init.d/ssh
<moonade> *(it needs it relative?!)
<crimsun> yes, it _must_
<crimsun> that's the way update-rc.d works
<moonade> right
<moonade> update-rc.d ssh defaults
<moonade>  System startup links for /etc/init.d/ssh already exist.
<crimsun> did you remove all the ones that you manually created, then run -f ssh remove, then run that command?
<moonade> i did
<crimsun> you've got dangling symlinks in /etc/ for ssh, then
<moonade> no, i meant "i just did it"
<moonade> (after you told me)
<moonade> now all of them are added
<moonade> still says "Read from socket failed: Connection reset by peer"
<crimsun> that's not an ssh issue; now you're hitting networking issues w/ vmware/qemu
<moonade> crimsun: no, i can't even ssh into the ssh server
<moonade> crimsun: ... from the very box i am on
<moonade> crimsun: forget about vmware or qemu
<moonade> crimsun: on default setup and no borked firewall
<crimsun> iptables active? How about tcp wrappers setting?
<moonade> crimsun: i never played with either the iptables or hosts.deny (etc.) settings...
<moonade> crimsun: and i don't think vmware and qemu would play with them in the same way
<crimsun> but is there an active iptables ruleset?
<crimsun> furthermore, we need to migrate this to #ubuntu
<moonade> crimsun: yes, there is one... i am using firestarter, after all
<moonade> crimsun: but i get the same results on firestarter firewall stop
<crimsun> -> #ubuntu
<persia> I'd like to clean up the lists on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/NoDesktopFile to match the current archives, as there has been significant improvement since it was first created.  Could anyone suggest a better method than for each $i in dpkg -l * do apt-file list | grep menu.... to update this?  I'm hoping there's a nifty method involving grep-dctrl or something.
<crimsun> moonade: /join #ubuntu, this is the wrong channel
<moonade> i guess it's not the wrong channel. i suspect the problem is not qemu- or vmware-specific (why should they coincide?); also, i suspect it's not a server-related; neither could it be a connectivity problem. i master them quite well and i honestly don't think i'll get a magical solution in #ubuntu.
<crimsun> moonade: no, I'm in #ubuntu. This channel is MOTU-specific (RE: discussion), and since this is not MOTU-related, I'm migrating it.
<moonade> crimsun: i think it's a problem with the way ubuntu deals with logical networking cards
<moonade> i see
<zakame> hi motus
<LaserJock> hi zakame
<zakame> hey LaserJock
<crimsun> 'lo
<zakame> gaah brownout again here :( resorting to go to net cafes just to hack :/
<crimsun> ouch
<crimsun> I used to pay $6/hr at airports to ssh in
<crimsun> had putty on a usb thumb drive and all
<dolson> hi persia... do you make packages at all?
<persia> I don't, but I make patches & desktop files.  I've mostly been working on desktop files, as I want my menus nice.  About the above - I found a solution using the Contents.gz.
<dolson> persia: ok, I was just wondering why you didn't up the seq24 fix to REVU, that's all :)
<persia> dolson: I'm just too lazy to register.  If you don't mind uploading, I've a heap of bugs with supplemental files or patches ready, and I'm not concerned about changelog credit.  Take a look at my subscribed list in Malone.
<crimsun> do you plan to apply for membership or MOTUship?
<dolson> persia: that's awesome. to be honest, I only got into packaging a couple days ago and my main concern is music stuff. the fact that seq24 is currently uninstallable is what made me discover your two open bugs, and so I noticed there was no man page, so I learned how to write those too and did the upload
<crimsun> those changelogs come into play then
<persia> crimsun: Not any time soon, but I like to help out.
<zakame> persia : ooh, rock on then! just keep track of your touched packages in your wikipage then ;)
<dolson> persia: I have been in discussions through email with mark and some of his team about things that would make ubuntu great for musicians
<persia> crimsun: just to check, membership or MOTUship just gives me the right to upload, right?  Are there any plans to restrict Wiki or Malone access?  I don't think I need anything else for the sort of work I usually do (and I like having someone check things before they are uploaded).
<persia> dolson: Cool!  I'd like to see more integration.  My personal pet peeve is that jack & ALSA won't play nice with dmix with the default asound configuration.  I don't do professional work, but would it make sense to use dmix as an ALSA input, and route that through JACK by default to make the JACK apps easier to start / configure / etc.?
<persia> zakame: Do you know a way to track closed Malone bugs?  There's some history I'd need to recover :)
<dolson> persia: I don't even know what dmix is yet. I just started getting into this stuff late january when I set up my wiki. I hadn't even touched JACK or anything other than Audacity until very recently
<persia> dolson: dmix is an ALSA input plug that allows multiple clients to request the same output.  It allows software mixing without running a sound daemon.  My memory is that it used to be hidden in the libasound2 docs, but later moved to be default for Ubuntu, although sound servers seem to be coming back into fashion in order to support XTerms...
<dolson> persia: Is this only good for sound cards that don't already support this? because I'm pretty sure the emu10k devices support that, as I've never had any issues
<dolson> from what I'm reading on the ALSA page, it sounds like it's a replacement for the various sound daemons, including JACK. I don't know how it would benefit someone trying to record stuff with a few softsynths running and trying to record them into Ardour, for example
<persia> dolson: You're probably using dmix already.  If you have time (and want to learn more), start with /usr/share/alsa/alsa.conf.  At least on my system, this eventually uses dmix.
<crimsun> persia: anyone can feed patches, but only ubuntu-dev and ubuntu-core-dev can upload
<persia> dolson: ALSA dmix is *not* a replacement for JACK.  JACK allows low-latency routing between applications, HW, etc.  There are no restrictions about startpoints and endpoints.  ALSA controls the sound HW, and allows basic configuration, but it is not very good for connecting your MIDI master device to a softsynth, and routing this and your virtual drum machine to different tracks in ardour for mixing and effects processing.
<crimsun> dmix was made default as of ALSA 1.0.9 for most cards
<dolson> doesn't appear in the EMU10K1.conf file, but it is in the EMU10K1X.conf file
<crimsun> I'm utterly of the opinion that dmix shouldn't enter into the picture for jack, but that's just my $0.02
<dolson> it's not in the Audigy2.conf either
<persia> crimsun: That's what I thought.  No worries then - I usually get distracted by something else before I reach more than about 1200 Karma, and end up dropping to <200 before I come back.  The gaps interfere with communication too much for me to be confident uploading.
<crimsun> dolson: that's because emu10k1 supports pcm multiplexing, thus obviating dmix and dsnoop
<crimsun> dolson: on the other hand, emu10k1x (dell's hack of emu10k1) and ca0106 don't
<dolson> I figured as much
<dolson> persia:  what hardware do you have?
<persia> crimsun: Is there a reason why ALSA shouldn't accept everything to dmix, and send it as a jack client for processing (or dropping), as the user likes?  It's frustrating to kill all the supplementary sound using programs when in a jack session, when they could just be muted or dmix temporarily disconnected.
<crimsun> persia: what you're asking is an architectural question, and honestly, I don't think jack is the answer for it
<persia> dolson: I'm currently using ICE1724 for sound.
<persia> crimsun: You're probably right.  I've not found a configuration that frees me from thinking about audio subsystems yet :)
<crimsun> dmix doesn't need to be "disconnected" in that sense; as soon as jackd grabs hw:X,Y, dmix is bypassed
<zakame> persia : you said erlier you subscribed to some bugs,
<crimsun> (just as any app grabbing oss emulation /dev/dsp* bypasses dmix)
<zakame> gaa my spelling :/
<persia> crimsun: I've not made myself clear.  The libasound2-plugins package contains a jack plugin, which would allow dmix to be routed through JACK, if desired.  I'm taking only about this.
<dolson> persia: I see you are subscribed to a lot of audio apps
<persia> zakame: https://launchpad.net/people/persia/+subscribedbugs.  The desktop or menu bugs are most likely to contain stealable patches.  Not all patches are mine.
<crimsun> persia: oh, that foul piece
<persia> dolson: There were a lot of universe packages that missed the last jack transition.  I like to keep them installed, and suggested changes that would allow them to work with the new jack.
<persia> crimsun: Yes.  It doesn't work so well today, but I've been experimenting, hoping I could come up with a configuration that would allow me to forget about the details, and just run apps.
<dolson> persia: as I mentioned, I am hoping that I can help contribute to make audio better. if they are missing desktop files, then my launcher script won't detect them, so I think it's important as well to get them in. I can work to get them patched and uploaded to REVU, and if there are missing man pages, I would write some basic ones up as well.
<crimsun> there are a couple lower-level details that I feel would be better resolved first, like eliding hw:{X,Y,...} into virtuals so that a user doesn't have to think of discrete devices
<crimsun> I haven't had much time to think of how Van Jacobson's latest LCA TCP channels talk could be applied
<dolson> persia: I convinced someone else named forest to try getting his packages into ubuntu as well because I don't want to use 3rd party repositories (just don't like them). I see he upped DSSI to REVU yesterday too
<persia> crimsun: That would certainly make more of a difference, but requires more coding effort, as opposed to configuration effort.
<crimsun> persia: yeah, but ultimately we can only hack so much configuration onto it
<dolson> a lot of people who visit my wiki email me and suggest I set up a repository, and I think that's the wrong approach
<dolson> I get emailed checkinstalled packages of things like ardour.. lol. doesn't even have dependencies, conflicts, etc
<persia> dolson: Best of luck with things.  If you haven't already, you might want to take a look at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Teams/Audio.  There's not been much activity lately, but it is more likely to draw attention and assistance.
<dolson> persia: ah yeah, I emailed Jeff Buchbinder and he joined the wiki and said he wanted to help on stuff.. I will contact him again about this
<persia> crimsun: This is only Ubuntu MOTU :)  Configuration is the key.  Real audio improvements (so we start seeing ALSA libs for the hardware effects processors, etc) require effort from another forum.
<crimsun> of course, that's why I'm doing ALSA in another job :)
* zakame makes himself busy with l10n-ing vlc and motureviewers
<persia> crimsun: My apologies then.  Thank you for the efforts, as it does seem to have gotten better and easier over the past couple years.
* crimsun cherry-picks parts from wpa supplicant 0.4.8
<crimsun> persia: it has only gotten better thanks to everyone's involvement
<dolson> I hope rjo updates ardour soon.. I checked back and he has a history of updating the packages in <7 days, avg. about 3 days
<persia> dolson: Ubuntu is in an upstream version freeze.  It may take longer before updates flow, as they have to be investigated.
<dolson> persia: I know.. crimsun mentioned that to me
<dolson> there are a lot of little problems with 0.99 that were fixed in 0.99.1 though.. so I'm really hoping :)
<Kyral> Anyone else have GRUB stop loading in the recent Dapper updates?
<zakame> heya Kyral
<Kyral> hjey
<Kyral> Its like stupid
<crimsun> boots fine here
<Kyral> It starts to load, but then panics saying it cannot find /dev/hda2
<Kyral> Which I have verified is there
<Kyral> Ah screw it
<Kyral> I cannot deal with it now
<Kyral> I need sleep
<Kyral> I'll mess with it later
<zakame> hmm geg doesn't seem to install its pixmaps :/
<dolson> crimsun: I finished my launcher script, thanks for your help
<crimsun> np
<crimsun> off to bed
<dolson> nn
<fbond> Hi
<fbond> my package is in REVU, and is marked as "Needs Work"
<fbond> linda has apparently complained that it "Linda: Unable to find a suitable .mo file!"
<fbond> I'm not able to find much information on what would trigger this
<fbond> any ideas?
<fbond> could there be some other reason it "Needs Work"?
<dolson> fbond: hey
<dolson> fbond: I asked that yesterday, and someone told me to not worry about it.. can't remember who it was, but someone who knows more than I do
<dolson> wow, I am so tired that I am forgetting where the # is on my keyboard :\
<Lathiat> man that sthe second time i've collided with one of fittls uploads
<Lathiat> heh
<Lathiat> wow down to 186 uninstallables
<Lathiat> was 230 yesterday
<persia> Lathiat: What's the easiest way to find the list of uninstallables?  I'm up for chasing a few :)
<dolson> seq24 is still uninstallable :(
<Lathiat> persia: apt-cache -i unmet|less
<ajmitch> evening
<Lathiat> hey aj	
<Lathiat> ajmitch
<Lathiat> :)
* ajmitch is at a humbug meeting, tunnelling ssh via https
<ajmitch> rather annoying :)
<jsgotangco> ?
<jsgotangco> ahhh
<ajmitch> jsgotangco: lathiat will know :)
<Lathiat> hehe
<ajmitch> so what's up?
* ajmitch has been getting out of touch with the MOTU universe lately
<Lathiat> ajmitch: you think your out of touch? :)
<ajmitch> of course, I've been in australia for a couple of days now ;)
<Lathiat> oh
<Lathiat> cool
<Lathiat> where bouts
* ajmitch was off irc for > 24 hours! ;)
<ajmitch> brisbane
<sivang> hi ajmitch  :)
<sivang> >24 hours
<sivang> wow
<sivang> but being on irc doesn't neccessarily mean you know what's going on :)
<sivang> ajmitch: that's a humbug meeting?
<phanatic> hi people
<ajmitch> sivang: what?
<sivang> ajmitch: 09:44  * ajmitch is at a humbug meeting, tunnelling ssh via https
<sivang> :-)
<ajmitch> sivang: lookup humbug & brisbane on google
<ajmitch> and then you'll see
<persia> Lathiat: Thanks.  I see 333 uninstallables, though :(
<sivang> ajmitch: ah cool, and powered by php ;-)
<sivang> ajmitch: would you be able to help me out with a threading design question?
<ajmitch> sivang: possibly, though I'm certianly no expert on it
<ajmitch> since I rarely use threading
<sivang> ajmitch: Well, would be good to have any feedback :)
<sivang> I have 1 function that calcs directory size if instantiated with something like "$dirpath"
<sivang> s/function/class/
<sivang> and another class that uses this class, to create an array of ["$dirpath",size]  per each non system user home
<sivang> currently instantiation is the calucaltion trigger
<sivang> (you can glance at it in http://mercury.linuxguru.net/~sivan/home-user-backup/ , do a 'branch' since I'm not using rsync to push)
<sivang> the module is fsInfo.py
<sivang> now, I want to be able to run calcs in background, and block the gui only on progress indication,
<sivang> that is user cannot do anything, but he can see progress being made in a small progress window
<sivang> mvo suggested to use a threading contoller module, which is fine, however, I feel something must be changed / merged between DirInfo and UserHomesInfo for that to be possible
<sivang> since now, the code the calac is ouside UserHomesInfo , which is a problem if UserHomesInfo is the one that's gonna be threaded in the gui
<ajmitch> ok, I haven't had enough caffiene to think about this (in a room with many noisy people)
<gus> hi master of puppets ;)
<sivang> ajmitch: heh :)
<sivang> ajmitch: understood, anywhoo, shall you have an opinion or insight, just let me know, I'm going to experiment with several approaches
* sivang is going to put threading into the utility classes. calcing sizes is such time consuming it deserves inherent threading usage.
<jsgotangco> Build instructions for Songbird 0.1 Proof-of-Concept:
<jsgotangco> Step 1. Don't.
<jsgotangco> lol
<sivang> this is nice, constructing smart dictionaries in python that also has extra methods but seem regular dicts when referenced as such
<phanatic|away> hey raphink :)
<phanatic|away> hey Gloubiboulga
<Gloubiboulga> hello phanatic|away
<Gloubiboulga> hi everyone
<raphink> hi Gloubiboulga
<Gloubiboulga> salut raphink :)
<Tonio_> hello all
<Gloubiboulga> hello Tonio_
<raphink> et voil encore trois francophones qui se parlent en anglais `parceque c'est la langue du chan`
<Gloubiboulga> :D
<Gloubiboulga> raphink, tu t'es lev du pied gauche ce matin ? ;)
<raphink> ben non
<raphink> c'est juste une remarque
<raphink> :)
<raphink> je prpare un ubuntu-dev french team take-over
<raphink> hehe
<Gloubiboulga> hh
<raphink> on est bien parti l ;)
<Tonio_> okay, on dclare "the french channel day" ?
<raphink> huhu
<Tonio_> perso, je le sens bien comme ca ;)
<Tonio_> Riddell parle un peu franais, et les autres, bah ils vont apprendre :)
<Riddell> oui
<raphink> a va Riddell ?
<Riddell> tres bien merci
<raphink> :)
<raphink> c'est #ubuntu-motu-fr ici aujourd'hui :)
<raphink> je propose que tous les jours on change de langue
<raphink> sur ce chan
<raphink> demain on fait une journe en allemand
<raphink> pour nos confrres germaniques
<raphink> :)
<raphink> yop apachelogger
<apachelogger> hi raphink :-)
<Tonio_> lodlu apachelogger
<Riddell> je voudrais un jour pour ecossais s'il vous plais
<raphink> ah
<raphink> si tu veux Riddell :)
<ogra> quoi ? le jour de cannel franais ? non ! attendez pour dholbach !!!
<raphink> :)
<ogra> (he will be very diasappionted to miss it ;) )
<Riddell> ah, c'est vrai, dholbach est francais
<raphink> dholbach est franais ???
<Mithrandir> ogra: Multiple exclamation marks, he went on, shaking his head, are a sure sign of a diseased mind. -- Terry Pratchett, Eric
<Mithrandir> :-)
<ogra> *g*
<Riddell> raphink: oui. il est maintenant.  nous avons decide
<raphink> Riddell: ahah ok :)
<ogra> son couer est franais :)
<ogra> ergh
<ogra> coeur
<Tonio_> bonjour ogra
<raphink> :)
<ogra> bonjour Tonio_ :)
<Tonio_> raphink: daniel est allemand
<raphink> oui je sais Tonio_ ;)
<raphink> mais Riddell a dcid qu'il tait franais aujourd'hui
<Tonio_> raphink: ah! d'accord ;)
<Tonio_> Riddell: je fais le patch pour bluez-utils aujourd'hui
<Riddell> Tonio_: ooh, supercool
<Tonio_> ;)
<Tonio_> Riddell: tu as dcid si knemo serait par dfaut avec dapper ou pas ?
<Riddell> bof, je sais pas.  jr regarderai quand il y a un bon knemorc
<Tonio_> Riddell: j'ai fait un knemorc dans kubuntu-default settings, je t'envois le fichier ?
<Riddell> Tonio_: oui, avec les autre kubuntu-default fichiers
<Tonio_> Riddell: okay, mais ce n'est pas fini pour le moment, je prfre prciser ;)
<Tonio_> Riddell: le mail est parti
<Toadstool> bonjour les MOTUs francophones ^^
<Tonio_> Toadstool: salut !
<Toadstool> j'ai cru que je m'tais tromp de chan quand j'ai lu les derniers logs :p
<Tonio_> hehe
<Gloubiboulga> hmm
<Gloubiboulga> glade a des problmes il me semble
<raphink> bah voil, on fait un french day et du coup personne ne parle ;)
<zakame> hi MOTUs :D
<raphink> zakame: hi :)
<Yagisan> raphink: um - about the only word I understood was french
<raphink> lol
<Toadstool> hh raphink, j'aurais bien dis des trucs, mais de l  ce que ce soit intelligent... :p
<Yagisan> hi zakame
<raphink> Toadstool: hehe
<ogra> Yagisan, il est  le jour de channel franais
<raphink> :)
<Toadstool> :D
<zakame> heya raphink Yagisan :D
<ogra> du ? ou "de" ?
<Yagisan> ogra: 
<sistpoty> hi folks
<raphink> ogra: plutot du ;)
<raphink> Yagisan: entirely agreed
<ogra> Yagisan, :)
<raphink> sistpoty: hi
<Yagisan> ;)
<sistpoty> hi raphink
<Toadstool> hi sistpoty
<sistpoty> hi ogra
<ogra> hi sistpoty
<sistpoty> hi Toadstool
<sistpoty> Toadstool: sorry, didn't have time yet to review your package
* Yagisan waves at everyone
<Toadstool> no problem sistpoty
<raphink> Yagisan: !
* freeflying seems that I'd learn many other languages  :)
<zakame> gaah, ano bang nangyayari dito?  Kanya-kanya atang wika ah...
<Yagisan> raphink:  ? (I hope that's right)
<raphink> Yagisan: shaden, da ich nich Korean sprechen kann
<sistpoty> Gloubiboulga: I'm just looking at the ocaml-patches
<raphink> s/nich/nicht/
<Toadstool> now I'm a little lost, at least when you guys were all speaking english, I could pretend I understand your MOTU language but now... :p
<Gloubiboulga> hey sistpoty
<sistpoty> Gloubiboulga: if you change anything other the debian/changelog, it's not a rebuild
<raphink> zakame: oh really ?
<sistpoty> hi Gloubiboulga btw ;)
<Gloubiboulga> sistpoty, hum...
<sistpoty> Gloubiboulga: and the change of build-deps to a stricter ocaml-nox is not really necessary, since there is only one ocaml-nox (or ocaml) in dapper
<Yagisan> raphink: 
<raphink> Yagisan: mhm :)
<sistpoty> Gloubiboulga: if you don't mind, I'll just drop that part of your debdiffs and upload the rebuilds... ok?
<Gloubiboulga> sistpoty, np
<Gloubiboulga> there's just one package which needs more love :)
<zakame> raphink: don't tell me you can grok tagalog? ;)
<raphink> zakame: you'd have to teachme ;)
<zakame> lol
<sistpoty> Gloubiboulga: cairo-ocaml?
<raphink> zakame: at least now I know it was tagalog
<Gloubiboulga> sistpoty, mlgtk
<sistpoty> Gloubiboulga: ah, didn't come to that one yet
<zakame> raphink: that's `what's happening? Seems everybody's speaking their own language...'
<Gloubiboulga> sistpoty, those packages are strange, really
* Yagisan wonders how many languages we all speak here ?
<sistpoty> hehe, yes
<raphink> Yagisan: wanna count?
<Gloubiboulga> some of them have rules to avoid hardcoding, but versions are hardcoded anyway
<Yagisan> zakame: 
<Yagisan> crap I stuffed if
<Yagisan> it
<Gloubiboulga> sistpoty, I'm testing the other packages, I'll soon tell you if they are all ok with a rebuild
<freeflying> Yagisan: 
<sistpoty> Gloubiboulga: ok, great!
<Yagisan> zakame: 
<sistpoty> Gloubiboulga: btw.: you'll need to modify the cairo-ocaml patch again
<Gloubiboulga> ah
<Gloubiboulga> what's the problem ?
<Yagisan> freeflying:  ;)
<sistpoty> Gloubiboulga: you can't rebuild debian/control file during build, this is considered evil... the rule in there is for convenience to just type make -f debian/whatevertheruleis and have control file updated
<Yagisan> hmm - it is actually not so easy to type in gaim with an IME running
<Gloubiboulga> ok
<Yagisan> press "enter" to quickly while looking for the right character and you message is gone
<Gloubiboulga> that's why they dropped the `ocamlinit' rule
<zakame> Yagisan: watashi wa Firipinjin desu, Nihonjin dewa arimasen (heh I don't have input methods on ;)
<sistpoty> Gloubiboulga: yes, I guess so
<Gloubiboulga> sistpoty, actually mlgtk is ok, cairo-caml is the package which needs love ;)
<Yagisan> brb - burglar in my car space - I'm going down to investigate
<sistpoty> Gloubiboulga: it is?
<sistpoty> Gloubiboulga: no, there are two distinct source-packages cairo-ocaml and mlgtk
<Gloubiboulga> sistpoty, yes, I was wrong when I told you that mlgtk needs more attention
<sistpoty> Gloubiboulga: ah... k
<bert_> Anyone got Klik to work?
* Tonio_ never answers to personns who don't even take a second tu say hello.....
<zakame> gaah
<bert_> Didn't say hello because most times no one responds
<freeflying> bert_: at least you'd give some useful information
<Yagisan> re
<Yagisan> scared him off. Little prick - there's broken glass everywhere now. Now my little girl can't play outside
<Yagisan> dumb idiot even broke the security gates
<bert_> Eh??
<ogra> Yagisan, hope tha glass wasnt from your car ...
<ogra> *the
<Yagisan> ogra: I don't have a car - it was the "secure" building entrance that had the glass get busted
<ogra> ah
<Yagisan> ogra: neighbours car doesn't look so luck though :(
<Yagisan> lucky
<ogra> :(
<Yagisan> bert_:  vandal/thief downstairs
<Yagisan> note to would be thieves - don't have personalised number plates. Black car with NAR-OON plates, can't be too hard to find
<ogra> heh
<Yagisan> zakame: Filipino ?
<zakame> Yagisan: yup
<Yagisan> zakame: you understand Japanese ?
<bert_> Haven't got a upstairs
<zakame> Yagisan: I took up basic Nihongo at college :)
<sealne> how important is debian/watch in a package?
<Yagisan> sealne: new or existing package ?
<azeem> it is not required, but recommended, I guess
<ogra> you should use it if you can
<sealne> Yagisan: new
<sealne> its hosted on sf.net and nothing i've tried so far seems to work
<Yagisan> sealne: If possible put one in then
<Yagisan> sealne: I saw a thread about that on debian-mentors. Sorry can't find a link at the moment
<azeem> sealne: there should be a template for sf watch files somewhere
<ogra> in the watch.ex file there is a link to a script
<ogra> and an explanation how to use it
<sealne> ah, thats a different url from what had been sugested before
<Toadstool> sealne: http://qa.debian.org/watch/sf.php?project=truc truc-(.+)\.tar\.gz
<sealne> i had http://qa.debian.org/watch/sf.php?project=dcfldd dcfldd-(.*).tar.gz debian uupdate
<sealne> every time i've asked about watch i get a different answer :)
<zakame> try http://prdownloads.sourceforge.net/dcfldd/dcfldd-(.*)\.tar\.gz debian uupdate
<zakame> that works for me
<sealne> so "http://people.debian.org/~lolando/sfdlr.php?project=dcfldd dcfldd-([\d.] *).tar.gz" or "http://qa.debian.org/watch/sf.php?project=dcfldd dcfldd-([\d.] *).tar.gz" or "http://prdownloads.sourceforge.net/dcfldd/dcfldd-(.*)\.tar\.gz debian uupdate" ?? :)
<Toadstool> i have got another one if you want :p
<ogra> just pich the right one :P
<ogra> *pick
<Yagisan> zakame: can you read Japanese well ?
<zakame> Yagisan: not really, but I'm trying to :)
<sealne> prdownloads one would appear to not rely on another url continuing to exist so it seems "safer"?
<Yagisan> zakame: I try too. My www site is being translated and I was wondering if you could read it
* sistpoty is off again
<sistpoty> cya
<zakame> Yagisan: ooh!
<Yagisan> zakame: I'll that that as a yes. http://www.eyagiconsulting.com click on the little japan flags to get a translation.
* freeflying is away: go to bed . night all!
<raphink> when a package source builds various binaries, is there way to build only one ?
<raphink> oh doh
<raphink> don't answer that question
<raphink> ;)
<phanatic> hi people
* apachelogger isn't here, but don't cry, he'll be back
#ubuntu-motu 2006-02-17
<dolson> hi phanatic
<phanatic> hi dolson
<phanatic> hey raphink
<phanatic> raphink: thanks for having a look at ubuntu-grub-splashimages :)
<raphink> hi phanatic
<raphink> you're welcome phanatic
<dolson> quiet day
<LaserJock_away> yes
<minghua> people taking a break when almost all servers are down, perhaps? :-)
<Hobbsee> oh, *those* servers being down - they were working for me earlier
<dolson> my guess is people just have a life
<dolson> whereas I haven't left my PC in over 72 hours
<dolson> oh no, I did, I went for coffee last night, that's right heh
<dolson> oh sweet, Forest just uploaded fluidsynth-dssi to revu
<LaserJock> yes, I suppose a life might have something to do with it but my bet is on the servers being down ;-)
<dolson> heh
<fbond> hey
<fbond> fbond = forest
<fbond> what's up, Dana?
<dolson> minghua: was it you who mentioned I should grep through the desktop files for my ubuntu studio launcher? I think it was, but I'm still learning people's names
<dolson> oh hey man
<dolson> I didn't know you were on IRC :)
<dolson> fbond: I packed mx44 and my ubuntustudiolauncher and I did a man page for seq24 and a patch from persia, and uploaded to REVU
<fbond> yeah, i saw that.  things are looking up for ubuntu music :)
<fbond> i'm hoping to get a few more packages in there
<dolson> fbond: I am thinking of packing om and omins next. I think willem did the debianization, so I'll have a look at them next
<fbond> dolson: cool.  i'm going to power through hexter and xsynth-dssi, and see if I can figure out some legal way to do dssi-vst
<dolson> fbond: that is awesome.. even if all we need is a tutorial on dssi-vst, then it's still great to have all else in Ubuntu directly
<dolson> fbond: I saw that LMMS 0.1.4 came out not long ago.. as well as ardour 0.99.1. I don't know how likely it is that these would be approved, but I sure hope at least ardour is because it has a lot of fixes.. people getting stuck in the export dialog box, for example
<fbond> dolson: agreed.  ardour should be all set in dapper?  I've been tracking the ardour email lists, and 0.99.1 seems to have introduced a new bug.  is the maintainer aware?  who is the maintainer?
<fbond> dolson: yes, ardour 0.99.1 fixes many bugs as well.
<dolson> fbond: it did? hmm.. the maintainer is rjo from debian
<fbond> dolson: yeah, i would guess that a quick 0.99.2 may be put out to correct the problem, which several users have run into
<fbond> dolson: huh.  I just looked at LMMS.  hadn't heard of it before.
<dolson> fbond: it is supposed to be really good... it is developing fast, and when I first tried it, it sucked, crashed, didn't even give me sound
<minghua> dolson: no, that's not me
<dolson> fbond: it has VST support as well, at least in CVS.. btw, several people I know that I won't name have whispered about forking ardour.. they claim that paul is hostile toward debian and has no clue about UI design
<fbond> dolson: bad idea.  i feel that paul knows what he's doing.
<fbond> dolson: ui stuff seems like an obvious no-no.  ardour ignores gnome theme.  i think they are working on it.
<dolson> fbond: I advised against it.. I can't code very well myself (Battle Pong is proof of that, although someone took the effort to port it to Xbox) so I couldn't help.. and yeah, I really hope that the GTK2 port follows the theme
<fbond> dolson: i think the "hostility" stems from the fact that paul is critical of the debian devs' decision to compile against system libs instead of using included versions
<fbond> dolson: yeah, ardour is huge and complex
<fbond> dolson: "fork" is barely a credible concept there
<fbond> dolson: and paul is really smart
<dolson> fbond: I don't doubt it. I would rather they contact him and discuss contributing.. although, the ardour site recommends against debian and ubuntu.. and ONLY those two. for some reason.
<fbond> dolson: this is true.  many people feel that debian's commitment to libre software is a bit suffocating
<fbond> dolson: some have carried that attitude to ubuntu
<fbond> dolson: (i find that ubuntu is much more pragmatic)
<fbond> dolson: debian tends to be out-of-date, and not include support for hardware for which no OS driver exists
<dolson> fbond: well, if he has an issue with the politics, he should leave it off of the site.. I am not sure though, because he claims that the "initial setup" is not good for newbies. whatever that means. I found Ubuntu way easier than Mandrake, and I used to maintain a Mandrake site before I switched to debian 3 years ago
<fbond> dolson: i think that paul probably hasn't used ubuntu, and ubuntu lacked a lot of audio software (until three months from now)
<fbond> dolson: fact remains that, if you want to run an ubuntu DAW, you have to compile stuff
<fbond> dolson: as opposed to FC, where you can just point your system at PlanetCCRMA
<fbond> dolson: and the politics have practical consequences
<dolson> fbond: yeah, but that's no different than, say, Gentoo, where you compile everything.. no major distros are out-of-the-box DAW ready
<fbond> dolson: it's a bit different when the whole point of your distro is to compile everything :)
<fbond> dolson: spend some time lurking on #ardour, you will be impressed.  the devs react really fast to bugs, etc, and really know the software well
<dolson> fbond: well, I know! but how could you recommend against Debian and Ubuntu? Debian, you could just point your system to DeMuDi. :) but I know what you mean. I just think that the message is unneeded on his site, that's all. I don't know how to really use ardour much, but the bit I experimented with was quite impressive
<fbond> dolson: i tried DeMuDi.  Idunno, it was lacking something in the quality dept., I thought.
<fbond> dolson: I guess you can just point Debian at DeMuDi repos.  But I stopped using Debian on my desktop for a reason. :)
<LaserJock> raphink: ping?
<raphink> LaserJock: pong <><
<dolson> fbond: Yeah, I know. I said as much on the LAU list, and it got a little warm :) anyhow, my background is highly in favor of hardware... I was anti-software-based music creation for a long time, and swore I'd never do it. but I got interested in it for some strange reason. weird how that works... I was using my PC only for a digital multitrack via Audacity. I have used it for years.. but there is just so much that it can't do in compar
<dolson> ison to JACK and everything else
<fbond> dolson: yeah, virtual reality is always more flexible. :)
<fbond> dolson: with music, though, limitations are not always bad things
<LaserJock> raphink: I think that the bug day is on the 17th
<raphink> LaserJock: really?
<dolson> fbond: I still really like hardware, so I am kinda conflicted about the whole thing. I don't know how to get really decent results from softsynths yet, but with my Yamaha RM1x, I can get the sounds I like easily
<raphink> propose another date LaserJock :)
<LaserJock> raphink: yeah, it was in dholbach's annoucement
<raphink> oh yeah
<raphink> LaserJock: then propose another day and that's fine :)
<fbond> dolson: my guess is that it's a matter of knowing your gear.  then again, DSSI/LADSPA is far behind VST stuff, so sound quality may reflect the ... limited ... state of the art with Linux soft synths
<fbond> dolson: i've heard music written with nothing but software.  it can be quite good. :)
<dolson> fbond: I haven't heard anything back from Mark or Daniel or anything since last time regarding the kernel or packages. Mark just told Daniel to link me to REVU and he said to get the software we need from DeMuDi into it asap
<fbond> dolson: do we need to get a RT kernel in there ourselves?
<fbond> dolson: i already have a 2.6.12-ck6 package
<fbond> dolson: would that be useful?
<dolson> fbond: the last word was Mark knows some people who have the muscle to pull it off, and he ended with "More in due course:
<fbond> dolson: i'm not sure if anyone thought REVU would be a route for kernel package upload :)
<crimsun> well, there's always the stop-gap solution of realtime-lsm
<dolson> no, realtime-lsm is something totally different
<crimsun> Lee's working on getting the necessary pam patches in shape
<crimsun> dolson: I do know.
<fbond> yeah, fully preemptible kernel is what we'd like
<dolson> fbond: I don't think it is.. I recommend to just work on apps for now. I'll hear from Mark soon enough. I don't expect an -rt kernel with full preemption in Dapper, but probably Dapper+1
<LaserJock> raphink: what about the 15th. We have a MOTU meeting on that day, maybe if everybody is around for that they can do some REVUing as well ;-)
<dolson> crimsun: I thought that mdz approved the patch already and it went through?
<fbond> hmmm.  that does sound reasonable...
<crimsun> dolson: got a link to the approval?
<dolson> crimsun: no, but I can get a link to lee telling me that on the LAU list
<dolson> fbond: besides, what's a -rt kernel without the apps? :)
<fbond> dolson: true
<crimsun> I don't see anything in our pam indicating it has been merged
<dolson> fbond: the dapper kernel has CONFIG_PREEMPT=y which is a big improvement over Breezy performance-wise, coupled with realtime-lsm, set_rlimits, or patched-pam, and it's almost decent to do some non-pro work
<raphink> LaserJock: sure, that's a good date
<raphink> LaserJock: in the middle of the week, so noboby is away in their week-end
<raphink> LaserJock: you can propose that, I'll +
<crimsun> raphink: what meeting?
<raphink> ok I'm off to bed
<raphink> later people :)
<raphink> crimsun: it's for REVU day
<crimsun> ah
<dolson> crimsun: http://music.columbia.edu/pipermail/linux-audio-user/2006-February/031249.html
<crimsun> these silly workweek things.
<raphink> announced by dholbach
<dolson> cya raphink
<raphink> but no date was chosen yet
<raphink> and it's qutie urgent
<crimsun> I'll ping pitti regarding pam, then
<dolson> crimsun: in that thread, I mistyped Breezy instead of Dapper, in case you were confused
<crimsun> no, I did the necessary substitution
<dolson> :)
<dolson> he said it was on the -devel list, but I didn't see it and I didn't pursue it further
<crimsun> relevant link I see is https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2006-February/015008.html
<dolson> crimsun: I posted in that thread last. I didn't see where mdz sent it out to get it worked on, as lee said
<dolson> fbond: do you have any of your music online?
<fbond> dolson: i could get it there, but won't :)
<dolson> :(
<fbond> sorry, my stringer quality standards prohibit virtually everything i've ever done from going anywhere
<fbond> s/stringer/stringent/
<dolson> bah, my music is crap, but I still put it on my site, and even try to sell a demo CD
<fbond> both routes carry certain risks, i suppose
<dolson> oh man, I'm watching King of the Ring '98 and Mick Foley took a dive off the top of the steel cage, through an announcer table.. what an idiot
<fbond> erm what.. who.. is that?
<dolson> lol, it's some old old wrestling stuff
<dolson> what a way to spend my saturday night
<fbond> :) my gf is into wrestling, mostly as a form of social exploration
<dolson> does she watch it on TV or does she actually wrestle?
<fbond> heh, a) shes's been to live events, b) she occasionally watches on TV, and c) that's none of your goddamn business
<fbond> jk
<dolson> haha
<dolson> tell her she should watch TNA iMPACT! in about 45 minutes on SpikeTV :) if she doesn't already have a timer set
<fbond> well, we lack cable TV these days... it's part of a concerted effort to improve productivity
<dolson> tell her about pwtorrents.net then ;)
<dolson> and hey, I thought the productivity thing was none of my business
<fbond> pwtorrents.net -> wow... and ... it still isn't
<fbond> k, gotta run
<fbond> let me know if you get any more news on RT kernel
<fbond> -Forest
<dolson> hello janm and robertj
<janm> hi dolson
<LaserJock> are there any MOTUs awake? I need to get some syns requested
<LaserJock> syncs that is
<crimsun> sure, what's up?
<LaserJock> plotdrop and easychem need to be synced and gausssum added
<LaserJock> also, if there are new Debian version and there wan't a previous Ubuntu version can we just sync those or do we need to verify that they build ok?
<crimsun> those can be synced, but they probably need to pass through dholbach requesting them (already in Debian but NEW in Ubuntu due to sync)
<LaserJock> gausssum should be the only one new to Ubuntu or am I misunderstanding you?
<jah_raztah> hi, is this the channel were one can request for a package to be added to dapper?
<crimsun> LaserJock: that's correct. As a sanity check, are the orig.tar.gzs identical for plotdrop and easychem in Ubuntu and Debian?
<LaserJock> crimsun: plotdrop, yes (I'm the debian maintainer), gimme a sec to check easychem (Kyral's)
<crimsun> they need to be identical, or the sync attempt will be rejected, and elmo will have my head
<LaserJock> of course
<LaserJock> but then you could always blame me, he will understand I'm sure.
<crimsun> yeah, but that doesn't excuse us for not checking prior :)
<dolson> jah_raztah: I think you can do it on the wiki, but I am interested in what package you want added because I'm nosy
<LaserJock> md5sums are the same for easychem and plotdrop
<crimsun> great, thanks.
<jah_raztah> oh, beep-media-player develpment is dead, thus a new project called audacious has began to pick up where bmp left off, and it's very solid so far and has built in support for mp3, wma and other codecs
<jah_raztah> mp3 sound much better on it then they do on xmms or beep-media-player
<LaserJock> jah_raztah: that right, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/Candidates is probably what you want, although it might be there already
<dolson> jah_raztah: I have heard of it.. someone in another channel recommended it to me the other day
<LaserJock> I see BMPx is there but not audacious
<jah_raztah> though it is under heavy development, all of the major releases are complete and everything works
<jah_raztah> unlike bmpx
<crimsun> jah_raztah: I'm waiting for bmpx can be removed, really. It's in Debian's NEW.
<crimsun> s/I'm waiting for //g
<jah_raztah> bmpx devs release un finished and broken product
<crimsun> we'll sync it, hopefully
<crimsun> jah_raztah: 0.13 is hardly what I'd call finished
<jah_raztah> yes
<crimsun> furthermore, neither descender nor deadchip call it finished or feature-complete
<crimsun> it's known to be in flux
<jah_raztah> but take a look at audacious 0.2, you'll find it to be very much functioning and completed
<crimsun> jah_raztah: I know, I follow its development
<crimsun> I'm just clarifying that no one calls bmpx "complete" or "finished"
<jah_raztah> yes, i did not mean to say it's complete, i was just saying that the releases that are released have alot of unfinished things, and very unstable compared to audacious
<jah_raztah> that is why i prefer to see audacious
<jah_raztah> in the repos
<jah_raztah> that is all
<dolson> jah_raztah:  I would like to see it too. is it in debian?
<jah_raztah> i'm not sure
<jah_raztah> i've installed it in breezy
<dolson> answer is: not as of feb. 9
<jah_raztah> have it running with almost all the feature enabled
<jah_raztah> ubuntu will never have software added to it's repository if its not in debian?
<crimsun> incorrect, it has software not in Debian
<jah_raztah> oh
<crimsun> likewise, Debian has software that will miss getting into Ubuntu due to cutoffs in syncing
<dolson> it's just easier if it's already there
<jah_raztah> oh i see
<jah_raztah> i've been searching through the ubuntu website, trying to find the scheduals for the flight cds
<jah_raztah> but couldn't find it
<LaserJock> I don't think they are scheduled, I could be wrong
<jah_raztah> i'm interested in flight cd 4, due to many improvments and the inclusion of ubuntu express
<crimsun> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DapperReleaseSchedule
<jah_raztah> yes i've been to that webpage
<jah_raztah> doesn't mention anything about the flight cds
<jah_raztah> it does mention a beta release for mar 23rd
<crimsun> flights aren't laid out
<jah_raztah> alright
<jah_raztah> distrowatch does the work for me and reports when it does release
<jah_raztah> thanks for all the help and information
<jah_raztah> good bye
<LaserJock> crimsun: can I get you to request syncs of advi and autoclass ? no ubuntuX versions just bumped Debian versions. they build in dapper and orig.tar.gz files are the same
<crimsun> LaserJock: sure. Any more in the next hourish (so I can batch them to elmo)?
<LaserJock> crimsun: no, I need to get to bed.
<crimsun> ok.
<crimsun> I'll ask for them before I head out (~1 hr)
<crimsun> he's probably asleep after a day at the datacentre
<LaserJock> yeah
<Plug_> Hi.  Anyone know if anyone is packaging mythtv for Debian/Ubuntu since mdz stopped?
<crimsun> it's still packaged
<crimsun> I plan to get the -fixes branch in
<Plug_> for dapper?
<crimsun> yes
<Plug_> What about 0.19?
<crimsun> we've passed UVF
<Plug_> right
<crimsun> it's worth discussing with the rest of the MOTUMedia team, though
<crimsun> there seem to be a fair number of important fixes
<crimsun> unfortunately there also seem to be a huge number of feature additions
<Plug_> Yeah, it wouldn't exactly be considered tested by the time of release.
<Plug_> I'm interested in being bleeding edge, of course. :)
<Plug_> There is currently a thread on mythtv-dev about getting a working debian/ dir for 0.19, using marillat's package: http://www.gossamer-threads.com/lists/mythtv/dev/178703
<Plug_> ..might come in handy.
<crimsun> I'm pretty sure I personally won't push for 0.19
<crimsun> -fixes svn branch for 0.18.1 should be sufficient for Dapper
<crimsun> 3 (5) years is a long time to deal with 0.19 otherwise
<Plug_> true
<Plug_> If I get it all going I'll make sure there is a page in the MythTV wiki about getting newer packages. ;)
<phanatic> hi people
<phanatic> hi raphink
<\sh> did i miss an announcement of the server downtime?
<ogra> obviously ...
<ogra> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-announce/2006-February/000049.html
<\sh> argl...i'm not subscribed to ubuntu-announce, only -deve-announce
<\sh> hmm..so the service window is slightly increased :)
<\sh> moins ogra btw
<ogra> moin :)
<pef> motu-reviewers: is someone against the fact I upload packages with contributed desktop file ? better package them to have user feedback than leaving them on LP :)
<Yagisan> G'day all
<Yagisan> saw something interesting today
<Yagisan> apt-torrent http://sianka.free.fr/index.html it seems to be a way to deliver .debs via bittorrent
<StevenK> That's fairly old.
<StevenK> And from what I remember of the discussion, required changes to the Packages files to maintain the hash of each file.
<Yagisan> does it actually work ?
<Yagisan> I thought it was a nice idea
<StevenK> Personally, I don't care. My downloads from {au.,}archive.ubuntu.com are fast enough.
<Yagisan> StevenK: we are still on for lunch this thursday ?
<StevenK> We certainly are.
<Yagisan> excellent :)
<StevenK> .. did we end up picking a time?
<Yagisan> yes. You said 12:30 was good for you
<StevenK> Ah, right.
* StevenK enters the damn thing in his phone before he can forget again.
* Yagisan will wear my ubuntu t-shirt
* StevenK doesn't have one.
<Yagisan> mines getting old :( I got it at UDU
<Yagisan> if that apt-torrent thing works, it might be good for my repo
<Yagisan> zakame: 
<Yagisan> zakame: hows it going ?
<phanatic> hey zakame
* StevenK watches his machine slow to a crawl.
<zakame> heya Yagisan phanatic :D
<zakame> Yagisan: how do you enable that Japanese IM?
<zakame> hi MOTUs :)
<Yagisan> zakame: I installed uim on breezy, but am looking forward to minghua's work on scim in dapper
<zakame> ooh!
<Yagisan> zakame: uim only works in gnome apps
<zakame> I'll try that then :)
<Yagisan> zakame: and breaks half of universe and things like sun java
<zakame> that's ok, just about everything I do is either in Emacs, or in a chroot ;)
<Yagisan> zakame: you need uim-anthy and you probably want to install a few other uim packages
<Yagisan> zakame: such as uim-xim uim-gtk2.0 uim-applet-gnome
<zakame> ahhh
<zakame> k, grabbing those then (apt-cache seems to suggest those too :)
<Yagisan> zakame: did you see my www site ?
<zakame> not yet, where's that?
<Yagisan> zakame: www.eyagiconsulting.com
* zakame checks
<freeflying_> Yagisan: if you use dapper , why don't u use scim
<Yagisan> freeflying_ I don't use dapper on production boxes
* Yagisan needs to leave for a meeting. meetings at 1am suck - it means something broke :(
<freeflying_> Yagisan: actually , scim can be used in breezy too
<stratus> ajmitch_, ping
<zakame> Yagisan: your page is somehow taking too long to load :/
<zakame> ooh its in plone
<StevenK> Who'd have thunk burning a DVD could cause a load of 12.
<StevenK> I certainly didn't.
<ogra> thunk ?
<ogra> thats .au slang ?
<tseng> thought
<ogra> tseng, i got that, was just wondering :)
<tseng> its a bad conjugation to be cute
<StevenK> ogra: It's some kind of slang - I actually have no idea.
<ogra> heh
<tseng> it bugs me
<tseng> like sink - sunk
* StevenK is just pissed that /tmp got cleared on boot and took an hours work with it.
<ogra> ouch
<ogra> StevenK, complain at Keybuk ...
<tseng> mm it is /tmp
<StevenK> I only have myself to blame - I should have thought before bashing the Reset button.
<Yagisan> re
<Yagisan> StevenK: dvd burning can cause quite high loads on my box too - but my burner is crap. the box locks up when it tries a cd-rw
<StevenK> Ugh.
<StevenK> I've never seen it do that before.
<apachelogger> re
<Yagisan> StevenK: some gigabyte dual layer POS
* StevenK manages to burn a coaster with cdrecord, so throws the ISO at nautilus instead.
* Yagisan prefers k3b
<StevenK> My DVD burner is some no-name single layer thing
<Yagisan> I should have bought a lite-on like my cd-rw and dvd-rom
* StevenK nods. Lite-On can actually make optical media
<Yagisan> anyone else have troublewith dvd+rw media. my burner seems unable to erase and re-write them :(
<nlindblad> evening masters
<Yagisan> zakame: wb
<zakame> thanks Yagisan :)
<Yagisan> zakame: yeah my site is a bit slow. it's link is saturated today :(
<Yagisan> zakame: so, can I interest you in an Ubuntu migration ;)
<zakame> Yagisan: what's it about? :)
<Yagisan> zakame: something you probably don't need if you are here. I come in and switch your windows boxes to Ubuntu gradually, and train you to use your new (now working) system for work.
<zakame> ooh
<zakame> huh? what's with the devel ML today? spam detector spamming?
<Yagisan> zakame: well, it's more enjoyable then fixing the windows boxes. No one has called to say their Ubuntu box is broken.
<xhaker> the spam is not triggering the removal.. it's spam with low rating
<zakame> Yagisan: yes, I can imagine you'd be able to do more ubuntu dev work too :)
<Yagisan> zakame: that would be nice, but as my www site indicates, I'm more interested in Ubuntu security
<zakame> yea
<sistpoty> hi folks
<zakame> heya sistpoty
<sistpoty> hi zakame
<kyral> Whee, time to recover GRUB
<Kyral> Victory is mine :D
<jpatrick> ok
<Kyral> Once again I recover my system from a situation that normal people would have reinstalled ;P
<sistpoty> Kyral: what is reinstalling? :P
<Kyral> Thats my point ;P
<Kyral> GRUB went wonky and said it couldn't load /dev/hda2 (my /)
<Kyral> So, I chrooted in with a LiveCD, upgraded to the latest Dapper updates, reinstalled GRUB, and unprelinked(which I think had something to do with it)
<jpatrick> which is what I would of done
<Kyral> Yes, but like the rest of my friends would have just given up :P
<Kyral> I'm riding a Geek Ego Boost, gimme a break ;P
<sistpoty> Kyral: you're lucky... my friends would have called me for help *g*
<jpatrick> My friends would of have installed Windows :(
<jpatrick> raphink: uploaded new kmplayer package
<Toadstool> sistpoty: hi, I've put a new wide-dhcpv6 package with po-debconf and a french translation on REVU
<sistpoty> hi Toadstool: hopefully I'll have time to review it tonight ;)
<Toadstool> cool :)
<Kyral> ..I unprelinked
<fbond> anyone have time to check out a few packages i've uploaded to REVU?
<Kyral> but I forgot I still had prelink set to run after Apt operations,,
<raphink> fbond: give me the name, url on REVU and url of the upstream tarball unless you have a debian/watch in the package
<raphink> fbond: and I'll run a report on them
<fbond> there are debian/watch files for both packages: dssi, fluidsynth-dssi
<fbond> raphink: thank you, btw
<fbond> raphink: dssi is at (http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=1749), and fluidsynth-dssi is at (http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=1750)
<raphink> gbo, Toadstool, jpatrick : check your packages in a few minutes as I'm running revu-report
<raphink> I'll have a look at them "manually" in a while
<Toadstool> ok
<jpatrick> raphink: thank you :)
<fbond> raphink: "manually" ? as opposed to...?
<Toadstool> revu-report I suppose
<fbond> ah
<jpatrick> yahoo. kmplayer built
<phanatic> raphink: if it's not too late, please run revu-report on http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=1751 as well, please :)
<phanatic> raphink: another thing: is there a problem with the packages you uploaded last week (nanoweb, sysinfo)? they didn't appear in the archives, just on launchpad...
<sistpoty> phanatic: probably these are still in the new queue
<phanatic> sistpoty: does it take so long to get into the archives?
<sistpoty> phanatic: sometimes...
<ogra> NEW needs manual processing
<ogra> its queued until someone unleashes it
<phanatic> sistpoty, ogra: thanks for the info... then i'll be waiting patiently :)
<raphink> fbond: your packages seem to have FTBFS. Check the REVU pages
<raphink> at least ddsi FTBFS
<raphink> and fluidsynth-dssi fails because it can't find dssi
<phanatic> raphink: i'll corrent mine as well
<raphink> good
<sealne> raphink: any chance of looking at my latest dcfldd (http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=1745) only change is to debian/watch?
<fbond> raphink: ah.  thanks.  packages build fine under breezy.  didn't know i needed to check things with pbuilder.
<phanatic> cool... i cannot test with pbuilder, coz it's unable to fetch one package from the archives...
<ogra> fbond, in any case you need to package for dapper, not for breezy
<sistpoty> phanatic: try updating your pbuilder
<sistpoty> (sudo pbuilder update)
<phanatic> sistpoty: thanks
<raphink> fbond: breezy is frozen, we don't add new software to it
<sealne> raphink: sorry just uploaded a new version of dcfldd that uses the correct Homepage: format in debian/control hadn't noticed that before
<raphink> your debian/watch doesn't work either, sealne
<sealne> bah
<sealne> i hate debian/watch
<raphink> lol
<raphink> then give me the url to the upstream tarball please :)
<raphink> oh well nm I'll find it :)
<raphink> sealne: I see a new version of dcfldd on the website : 1.3.4
<raphink> is there a reason why you're packaging 1.3.3 ?
<sealne> i had been testing it by running "uscan" in the source directory which produced no output, how should i test it?
<sealne> oh great 1.3.4 of dcfldd just came out today
<raphink> hehe ;)
<raphink> can you update your package and upload again sealne ?
<phanatic> sealne: uscan --verbose?
<sealne> yep grrr :)
<raphink> uscan --report
<sealne> phanatic: still didn't complain
<sealne> k
<raphink> sealne: new version = new features + bugs fixed
<raphink> so be happy
<sealne> heh
<sealne> should i just pretend that i never did anything with 1.3.3 or mention in changelog?
<phanatic> sealne: empty changelog
<raphink> you pretend you never knew it
<raphink> ;)
<raphink> in the changelog
<sealne> k
<sealne> btw:
<sealne> kd@napier-01:~/dev/ubuntu/dcfldd/dcfldd-1.3.4$ uscan --report
<sealne> dcfldd: Newer version (1.3.4) available on remote site:
<sealne>   http://prdownloads.sourceforge.net/dcfldd/dcfldd-1.3.4.tar.gz
<sealne>   (local version is 1.3.3)
<fbond> ogra: yeah, my package is for dapper, i've just been doing basic verification of packaging under breezy
<sealne> raphink: what do you get from uscan --report?
<raphink> I get the same as you sealne
<raphink> so it works
<raphink> it's revu-report that doesnt detect newer versions proprely and I know why ;)
<raphink> but I'm waiting for revu-tools to be in dapper
<sealne> ah i was getting confused about that
<phanatic> raphink: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=1757
<sealne> raphink: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=1758
<siretart> hi folks
<phanatic> hi siretart
<siretart> hi phanatic
<phanatic> siretart: could you have a look at this one: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=1705 ?
<sealne> raphink: actually new version incomping had an old date in copyright
<sistpoty> hi siretart
<siretart> huhu sistpoty
<fbond> does pbuilder create take a really long time?
<sealne> depends on your connection and machine, its creating a basic install so has to get a fair amount
<sistpoty> stratus: I am just looking at pyspf and want to drop 2.2 support and enable 2.4 support for ubuntu, since we don't have 2.2 any longer and 2.4 is the default. any objections?
<raphink> sealne: uscan gets the HTML page, not the tarball
<fbond> if things were not configured properly, pbuilder should just fail without delay, correct?
<stratus> sistpoty, i'll do that in Debian tonight. Do you want to wait my upload and sync? There's already a bug about that in Debian BTS.
<raphink> fbond: pbuilder does take a long time to creat
<sistpoty> stratus: I'll happily wait for your upload... thx!
<siretart> lets see if removing gnome-power-manager fixes my suspend problems
<stratus> sistpoty, np, i think it will hit the archive in the dinstall run tomorrow.
<sealne> raphink: still?
<sealne> grr
<sistpoty> stratus: cool
<raphink> sealne: yeah :(
<siretart> phanatic: http://revu.tauware.de/revu1-incoming/ubuntu-grub-splashimages-0602081940/lintian
<phanatic> siretart: please read raphink's comment about this
<siretart> ah, this is cdbs, right
<siretart> but wait, this is an arch: all package
* siretart looks up policy
<siretart> hi lucas
<phanatic> siretart: this was discussed recently on debian-devel (as raphink told me)
<lucas> hi all :-)
<raphink> not recently, but it was discussed on d-d phanatic ;)
<phanatic> raphink: sorry... then you told me about this recently (that's the correct statement maybe) ;)
<raphink> siretart: from what I understood, dependencies that are called during clean should nto be in -Indep because clean is not indep
<siretart> raphink: so this would be a bug in lintian
<raphink> yes siretart
<raphink> siretart: lintian can be ignored on this
<raphink> sealne: report is fine on dcfldd
<raphink> sealne: i'll havea look at it later ;)
<raphink> I have to go now
<raphink> ++ people :)
<sistpoty> cya raphink
<phanatic> bye raphink
<siretart> bye raphink
<jpatrick> bonsoir raphink
<siretart> phanatic: I'm happy with the package, but I'm a bit undecided with the name. ubuntu-grub-splashimages sounds like something rather for main than for universe
<phanatic> siretart: see kubuntu-grub-splashimages :)
<phanatic> Section: universe/admin
* siretart sees only kubuntu-artwork-usplash
<siretart> hm. and it touches /boot/grub/menu.lst without any warning..
<phanatic> hmm... it's there for me
<phanatic> siretart: i just modified the appropriate parts of the kubuntu-grub-splashimages package to fit
<siretart> interesting. it is listed in lp, why not on my system?
<phanatic> dunno
<ogra> NEW ?
<phanatic> ogra: surely not
<siretart> ogra: do you have it in your apt-cache?
<phanatic> siretart: i do have it
<ogra> i only have grub-splashimages ...
<ogra> nothing edubuntu, kubuntu or ubuntu specific ...
<siretart> intersting
<phanatic> Filename: pool/universe/k/kubuntu-grub-splashimages/kubuntu-grub-splashimages_1.0-0ubuntu1_i386.deb
<phanatic> snippet from apt-cache show output
<siretart> http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/universe/k/kubuntu-grub-splashimages/
<siretart> it is there
<ogra> i'm on amd64 ... is it build i386 specific (would be silly) ?
<siretart> ha, thats it
<siretart> it is i386 only
<ogra> heh
<ogra> no need for that
<siretart> phanatic: why no amd64?
<phanatic> yeah, it's not all for some reasons (see it's revu page)
<ogra> ppc doesnt have grub it wont get built anyway
<ogra> and amd64 has grub ...
<phanatic> siretart: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=1163
<ogra> just make it [i386 amd64]  then :)
<ogra> but "all" should do no harm either
<phanatic> ogra: my package has 'all'
<siretart> phanatic: no. it is potentially build for 'any' architecture listed in your architecture line
<siretart> phanatic: I don't see any architecture specific bits in your package, though
<ogra> yeah, make it "any" and make the binary package depend on grub ...
<siretart> ok. /me gets pissed
<siretart> either gnome-powermanager or gnome-screensaver is the culprit
* siretart just purged both
<siretart> ogra: sounds sensibe. I agree
* ogra fears the new bugflood from siretart ...
<siretart> ogra: sorry, I had nothing but problems since I tried to use it
<ogra> siretart, yes, i saw that, but i wonder why
<siretart> the most annoying thing is that it looses focus
<ogra> it seems to work for the majority ... and as i said before, g-p-m is totally dumb ... it calls only pmi
<siretart> so I don't even see a password window
<siretart> hm
<ogra> oh, youre talking about g-s-s
<siretart> the current problem was this:
<siretart> I press my suspend hotkey, the laptop suspends
<siretart> I want to wake it up, but the laptop immediatly resuspends (1.5 seks)
<phanatic> siretart: sorry for disturbing you with my little problems :) so i only have to change "Architecture: all" to "any", right?
<siretart> I wake it up again, and the screen gets garbled
<siretart> :/
<ogra> hmm, are you sure its not an ibm thing with the scpi scripts and pmi ?
<ogra> *acpi
<siretart> phanatic: change it to 'all', it currently has a list of supported architectures
<siretart> ogra: this is an ibm thinkpad R40
<ogra> do the ibm lappies have any specific tool ?
<ogra> apart from acpi-scripts
<siretart> they have an ibm-acpi.ko for enabling hotkeys, but they work fine for me
<ogra> i have had probs with pbbuttonsd on my ibook, since it tried to do the same pmi did
<ogra> pitti sorted that ...
<siretart> let me try pmi from the shell
<ogra> just try it from logout
<siretart> thats my next problem:
<dolson> could someone help me with this? http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=1743
<siretart> when I want to logout, the complete gnome-session gets frozen for 5 mins
<siretart> this seems unrelated (at least I hope)
<ogra> thats a known bug many people see
<siretart> and my local loopback IS okay, I checked that many many time
<siretart> s
<phanatic> siretart: my package has "all": http://revu.tauware.de/revu1-incoming/ubuntu-grub-splashimages-0602081940/ubuntu-grub-splashimages-1.0/debian/control
<ogra> i see it during liveCd tests as well ... its something in the session that doesnt shut down properly
<siretart> phanatic: your's does have. kubuntu-g-s does not
<siretart> ok. 'sudo pmi action suspend' works like a charm
<phanatic> siretart: are there any other issues then regarding ubuntu-grub-splashimages?
<ogra> then it might be a problem with the hal pmi helper or you have something left from the old acpi-scripts stuff
<siretart> phanatic: well, I'm not convinced about the postinst. It should be save, but I don't have a good feeling with that
<ogra> did you edit the defaults at some point ?
<siretart> well, I did edit in /etc/acpi/scripts, yes
<siretart> mainly in order to integrate whereami
<phanatic> siretart: i see...
<ogra> so they probably didnt get overwritten
<siretart> how can I check if there is some cruft left over
<phanatic> i just thought that kubuntuz
<ogra> dpkg -S `
<ogra> ?
<phanatic> i just thought that kubuntu-grub-splashimages was accepted with these scripts
<ogra> siretart, you clearly have two apps trying to perform the same action ...
<siretart> phanatic: not by me ;)
<siretart> ogra: yes, it looks like. But which and why?
<phanatic> siretart: that's right ;)
<ogra> siretart, no real clue ... but i suspect there is a leftover from the old acpi-scripts ... try purge and look whats left ...
<siretart> ogra: I've just seen some '.dpkg-old' files lying around. I try to diff/merge them
<ogra> ah
<siretart> after I filed a bug agains k-grub-splashimages
<ogra> :)
<siretart> bug filed, raphink subscribed
<ogra> hmm, Riddell and slomo approved it ...
<jpatrick> what about ppc?
<ogra> ppc has no grub
<jpatrick> ah right
<ogra> and yaboot cant do any graphical stuff
<siretart> the files itself are architecture independant, there is no point in wasting space for every arch on the mirrors
<raphink> siretart: the arch line in k-g-s is the same as grub
<raphink> siretart: it's nonsense to use all for this package since it won't be of any use for ppc for ex
<ogra> but it doesnt get built for amd64
<raphink> wel then there has to be seen why
<raphink> i'll check the buildlogs
<phanatic> raphink: but it depends on grub
<phanatic> so it will be installable only on i386 and amd64
<raphink> the reason why build failed on amd64 seems to be cdbs
<raphink> funnily enough
<raphink> debian/rules:3: /usr/share/cdbs/1/rules/debhelper.mk: No such file or directory
<raphink> make: *** No rule to make target `/usr/share/cdbs/1/rules/debhelper.mk'.  Stop.
<raphink> that's what made it fail
<raphink> although package explicitely depends on cdbs
<siretart> raphink: anyway, what architecture dependant parts are in the package?
<ogra> there is nop binary data at all in the package ... its fine to make it arch all ...
<ogra> this architecture line in the control file is insane
<raphink> ogra: it had been chosen together with MOTUs to fit the grub build-deps
<ogra> raphink, but what for ?
<raphink> i'm fine to change it as all if you all think it's better
<ogra> its a picture and a bunch of scripts ...
<raphink> ogra: so that it's not available on archs that don' thave grub
<raphink> such as ppc
<siretart> raphink: grub is a bootloader, which is fairly architecture dependant. your artwork package is not
<siretart> raphink: make the package depend on grub, so it is uninstallable on ppc
<ogra> if it depends on grub its not installable without grub
<ogra> siretart, it already does
<ogra> :)
<raphink> it won't be installable
<raphink> but it'll be selectable
<raphink> so people on ppc might complain it doesn't work
<raphink> since they can select it for installation
<ogra> thats great :)
<raphink> but installation fails
<raphink> ogra: what do you mean?
<ogra> once one rewrites yaboot to display images, he can use the source ;)
<raphink> hehe ok
<siretart> raphink: thats no problem. we have other shit like this in the archive
<raphink> ;)
<raphink> good point ;)
<raphink> well then i'm fine to fix it
<siretart> err, ignore that part with 'shit'. I mean 'lovely and a bit strange packages'
<phanatic> lol :)
<ogra> i also doubt there are ${shlibs:Depends} needed in the deps line :)
<raphink> siretart: yeah that's what i thought ;)
<raphink> didn't sound like you somehow siretart  ;)
<raphink> ogra: indeed :)
<siretart> :)
<raphink> ok I'll review it :)
<raphink> I'l do that later tonight
<raphink> thanks for reporting siretart :)
<raphink> ++
* ogra growls at the buildds
<thierry> hi could someone help me with https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/geg/+bug/5399 ? I don't know what's wrong with my patch
<Ubugtu> malone bug 5399 in geg "[PATCH]  adding a .desktop file to geg" [Normal,In progress] 
<siretart> ogra: I see that doko uploaded a new gcc. perhaps the chroots are being updated?
<ogra> siretart, i uploaded a new ubuntu-meta this afternoon... its not even on the launchpad source page ... something is broken
<ogra> and the buildlogs show no build attampts at all
<siretart> hm. sounds strange
<sistpoty> at least it appears on your +packages page
<ogra> but not on https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/dapper/+source/ubuntu-meta
<ogra> i guess the incoming queue isnt processed ...
<ogra> filed a rt ticket already
<siretart> Edgy Earthworm... hmmm
<ompaul> edgy emu
<ompaul> :)
<sistpoty> I'm just trying to fix gnome-apt, which needs updated autotools files... however it makes distclean in the clean rule. Is it better to rerun autotools locally and change make distclean to make clean or to run autotools during build time?
<siretart> sistpoty: there is no real consensus on that. infinity said once that he prefers to run autocrack at buildtime
<sistpoty> siretart: ah, k... but that would be an more intrusive change (new build-depends more changes in rules), so I'm a little bit undecided yet
<sistpoty> ah... maybe the change isn't needed at all :)
<siretart> sistpoty: I see. hm. thats not an easy question. I think I'd go with the less intrusive patch
<nictuku> hey
<nictuku> I'm writing this software that is officially wanted by ubuntu - nwu
<nictuku> the thing is I have to discuss with ubuntu "officials" some important issues like - could it go to main? if it does, what about it's dependencies, is it possible to bring other packages to main?
<nictuku> or better, who should I talk to?
<siretart> nictuku: the first step is to bring it into universe
<nictuku> hmm indeed
<siretart> nictuku: after that, you have to write a MainInclusionReport so it gets reviewed if it fits the criteria for main. for universe, the critieria are way lower
<LaserJock> azeem: ping?
<nictuku> I see. would it be harder to accept in main if it currently depends on universe-pacakges?
<nictuku> specifically I could not find any soap implementations for python in main
<sistpoty> nictuku: if you want to get it into main, you'll need to have all dependencies in main as well. so: yes, it's harder
<lucas> what's the current status of sync requests lag ?
<sistpoty> lucas: quite big I assume (at least I didn't see one of my syncs make it yet)
<LaserJock> hmm, is there a site like http://ftp-master.debian.org/new.html or something for Ubuntu?
<sistpoty> LaserJock: none that I would know of... and if there was one, it's certainly not valid for soyuz any longer
<LaserJock> sistpoty: do you know if soyuz has any similar feature?
<sistpoty> LaserJock: no idea actually
<LaserJock> I suppose I could ask #launchpad, but I'm afraid I know the response already
<sistpoty> hehe
<lifeless> we explicitly designed in queues like that
<lifeless> I don't know if they are visible to $random user or not
<raphink> siretart: fix uploaded for k-g-s
* sistpoty is off again... cya
<siretart> raphink: :)
<raphink> siretart: changed a few little things at the same time ;)
<raphink> doesnt cost much, and makes the package nicer :)
<siretart> yes. changelogs looks good
<raphink> :)
<Toadstool> thanks to raphink, sistpoty and REVU, wide-dhcpv6 has been uploaded to Debian's NEW :)
<Toadstool> thank you very much
<raphink> Toadstool: huh?
<Toadstool> I hope it will be included in dapper
<raphink> how is it thanks to REVU?
<Toadstool> you've helped me improve it
<raphink> oh great :)
<Toadstool> good night everybody
<raphink> gn ToadZzZztool
<fbond> raphink: sorry about the troubles earlier.  dssi, fluidsynth-dssi, and hexter are all ready to go.  i've tested all three in pbuilder.  both hexter and fluidsynth-dssi build-depend on dssi-dev (from dssi).  do you have some time to build them?
<raphink> Ilet me see
<raphink> it's building
<fbond> thanks, raphink.  much appreciated.
<fbond> raphink: when building fluidsynth-dssi and hexter using pbuilder, i had to do a login.  is there a better way to build them, given that they build-depend on dssi, which is not available from the repos?
<raphink> what do you mean by a login?
<fbond> pbuilder login
<raphink> what is that?
<raphink> I'd use a local repository
<fbond> ah
<fbond> is that how it is done on the REVU machine?
<raphink> no, we don't have anything to do it so far on REVu
<raphink> I'm thinking of a way to do it nicely
<fbond> yes, my method was quite awkward
<fbond> i had to install build-depends manually
<fbond> i don't know pbuilder that well...but you can bindmount a dir containing debs, and have that dir specified in sources.list as a local repo?
<raphink> wait I'm still reviewing the package
<raphink> wait a min ;)
<fbond> sorry
<ajmitch_> hi
<ajmitch_> looks like my box at home has shut down or otherwise died
<raphink> there fbond, a few comments :)
<raphink> some not mandatory, some more important
<raphink> ajmitch_: argh :s
<raphink> ajmitch_: I knwo how this feels :S
<fbond> raphink: thanks
<dolson> fbond: hey man :D
<dolson> fbond: Im packaging qmidiarp right now, just fyi
#ubuntu-motu 2006-02-18
<ajmitch_> raphink: yeah, and my home box is in NZ
<ajmitch_> I'm in australia
<raphink> argh :s
<ajmitch_> a good thing I can collect my email on my laptop
<ajmitch_> & that my gpg key is on the usb mem stick with me
<raphink> yes
<ajmitch_> still very very annoying
<fbond> dolson: sounds good :)
<dolson> fbond: I looked at om and omins, but Willem's debianizations have a ton of source patches for whatever reason, so I'm putting it off for a while
<fbond> hmm.  om looks good.  i bet most of those patches could be scrapped at this point.  om will see a new release (0.3.0) soon, anyway.  might as well wait, for now.
<dolson> yeah, I read that, but I don't know how soon soon is.. will it hit before it's too late for dapper?
<fbond> dolson: probably.  there's not much time left :)
<fbond> raphink: "it is a good practice (although not compulsory in any way) to install into debian/tmp/ and use this path in .install files"
<ajmitch_> about a week
<fbond> raphink: i don't follow this entirely
<fbond> my package does install into debian/tmp.  You would like my install files to reference this dir explicitly?
<raphink> fbond: using the --prexid argument for configure
<raphink> or DEBHELPER variables iirc
<raphink> oh well then
<ajmitch_> raphink: eh? --prefix for configure should never need to mention debian/tmp :)
<raphink> you should use debian/tmp/ in your install files
<raphink> ajmitch_: I still need to learn morea bout that ;)
<raphink> I use cdbs ;)
<tseng> hi ajmitch_
<ajmitch_> raphink: if you did use that I would send it back for fixing
<ajmitch_> hello tseng
<raphink> ajmitch_: hehe
<ajmitch_> raphink: it can break things
<raphink> ok
<raphink> good to know ;)
<fbond> i would assume some build systems hard set paths in programs to --prefix prefix
<fbond> sorry if i'm being daft
<ajmitch_> yes, they can
<ajmitch_> which is why DESTDIR is generally used with make install
<fbond> 'dh_install -A --sourcedir=$(CURDIR)/debian/tmp' is not ideal?
<fbond> it is better to leave off --sourcedir?
<fbond> and put debian/tmp/file/to/install in .install file?
<azeem> it is equivalent
<azeem> --sourcedir is useful when you migrate old dh_movefiles packages to dh_install
<LaserJock> azeem: got a minute?
<azeem> LaserJock: argh, sorry
<azeem> saw your ping, but got distracted
<azeem> LaserJock: what's up?
<dolson> how would I properly put the Copright Holder: line in debian/copyright if the single author of the program says written by him, and (c) 2004 Novell ?
<azeem> LaserJock: btw, I had another look at the ghemical amd64 bug today, and saw that current CVS no longer has that file nor that function
<azeem> so that will make it a bit more difficult to fix it
<azeem> I should try my look on the Debian amd64 porting machine
<LaserJock> hmm, did they say why the removed it?
<azeem> code restructuring I think
<azeem> it wasn't the only file
<LaserJock> hmm
<crimsun> well that's interesting.
<crimsun> Dapper's libpqxx's debian/control clearly has Conflicts/Replaces on Breezy's libpqxx-2.5.5c2, but they're not showing up at all in apt-cache
<minghua> crimsun: strange indeed, I looked at the build log at http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/libp/libpqxx/2.5.5-2ubuntu1/libpqxx_2.5.5-2ubuntu1_20051201-1015-i386-successful.gz, the Conflicts/Replaces with -2.5.5c2 is not there either
<minghua> crimsun: I think I got it
<minghua> # Make sure debian/control is up-to-date.
<minghua> debian/control: debian/changelog debian/control.in
<minghua>         sed $(SEDPATTERN) <debian/control.in >debian/control
<crimsun> ah, d'oh
<crimsun> I didn't even look for .ins
<minghua> crimsun: we didn't patch control.in
<crimsun> right
<crimsun> that's the gotcha
<crimsun> silly me, the tab-completion on debian/control should have been a clue
<minghua> Hmm, maybe a bug should be filed about not shipping the debian/control file at all
<crimsun> minghua: thanks for the quick check
<minghua> crimsun: no problem
<freeflying> raphink: hi
<raphink> hi freeflying
<ajmitch_> hi
<LaserJock> anybody here ever use svn.debian.org?
<MarioMeyer> ajmitch_, ping
<ajmitch_> MarioMeyer: pong
<MarioMeyer> can i pvt u? about py packages
<ajmitch_> about what packages?
<MarioMeyer> do you have any docs about making it?
<MarioMeyer> i have a couple of py apps to package
<ajmitch_> docs? no, I just do it :)
<MarioMeyer> i'd like to learn how ;)
<ajmitch_> it's easiest if they're using distutils & you use cdbs
<MarioMeyer> nope.. we're developing them..
<MarioMeyer> for NetworkWideUpdates
<ajmitch_> ok, do you have anything like distutils, or are they just files in a directory?
<MarioMeyer> just files
<nictuku> damn that developer
<nictuku> oops that's me =] 
<MarioMeyer> lol
<MarioMeyer> nictuku, all your fault
<MarioMeyer> ;)
<minghua> LaserJock: I do
<wasabi> o I'm trying to make a init script... start-stop-daemon, with a python daemon. It starts fine, but can't stop it. Says it's not running
<wasabi> Lock file is created fine.
<wasabi> ahh got it.
<wasabi> --name bad.
<ajmitch_> :)
<LaserJock> minghua: hmm, I was trying to commit to a project on svn.debian.org but it wasn't working. But then I saw on the Debian wiki that sometimes it takes a while so maybe I will just try tomorrow
<ajmitch_> it can take awhile for account data to sync
<ajmitch_> maybe a day or so
<LaserJock> I guess I just need to chill out ;-)
<minghua> LaserJock: yes, svn.d.o syncs the account data from alioth once per day
<minghua> ah ajmitch_ already told you that :-P
<LaserJock> would that include being added to a project?
<LaserJock> cause I can ssh into svn.debian.org
<LaserJock> I just can't seem to commit
<minghua> LaserJock: yes, you need to be added to a project to write to its svn repo, I suppose (I never tried otherwise)
<LaserJock> makes sense, otherwise anybody with an account could commit to any project
<LaserJock> I'm just getting excited, azeem has got a chemistry CDD called debichem. He added me today and I wanted to commit something
<LaserJock> crimsun: ping?
<LaserJock> ajmitch: around?
<ajmitch> LaserJock: yes?
<LaserJock> ajmitch: will you be at the next TB meeting?
<ajmitch_> probably not
<ajmitch_> what time is it?
<LaserJock> 20:00 UTC
<LaserJock> on the 14th
<ajmitch_> 6am local time, iirc
<LaserJock> ouch
<ajmitch_> so I won't have net access
<LaserJock> ok, I was thinking of trying for MOTU so I was wondering who all could make it
<ajmitch_> sorry, I'm away from home, working :)
<LaserJock> oh, that's right your in Australia
<ajmitch_> MarioMeyer: what was your question?
<MarioMeyer> about that python package creation
<MarioMeyer> just files on the dir
<ajmitch_> MarioMeyer: that's not a question really
<MarioMeyer> i wanted to know how to package it
<ajmitch_> or it's one that's vague enough that I could spend lots of time stepping you through packaging it
<MarioMeyer> basically i need a package that puts it in site-packages/pkgname/
<MarioMeyer> or smth
<ajmitch_> ok
<ajmitch_> so put them in there, debian/rules is just a makefile
<nictuku> MarioMeyer, we need to package it in python first using distutils, preferably
<MarioMeyer> making debian/rules to move them there is enough, then?
<ajmitch_> if it's done right, you have to put them in a directory under debian/
<zakame> hi MOTUs :)
<ajmitch_> hello zakame
<zakame> hello ajmitch
<ajmitch> someone should really kill that epiphany vs firefox thread
<ajmitch> hm, another kiwi
<zakame> heh
<zakame> gmail clogger
<ajmitch> I go to that folder, hoping to see important mail
<ajmitch> and then get sorely disappointed
<jsgotangco> Debian Search disabled
<jsgotangco> The Debian search engine has been disabled for now. We're working on it.
<jsgotangco> ?
<ajmitch_> hello dholbach
<zakame> good afternoon dholbach
<dholbach> hello andrew! :)
<dholbach> hey zak!
<jsgotangco> :P
<zakame> jsgotangco: packages is down, try pdo.debian.net
<dholbach> hey jerome
<jsgotangco> zakame, err i'm not looking for packages :P
<dholbach> good morning everybody else :)
<jsgotangco> i'm looking for a friggin' HCL similar to what RHEL has and its quite in-depth
<zakame> jsgotangco: all the same, the search thing I think is on the same as the packages.d.o server
<jsgotangco> hi daniel how's berlin?
<jsgotangco> zakame, site search is different from package search it seems
<dholbach> jsgotangco: i'm glad to be back, after my parents' place, luxemburg and london :-)
<dholbach> jsgotangco: althought I enjoyed the other parts too. :-)
<dholbach> jsgotangco: but it's cold - longon was at least 15 warmer
<jsgotangco> oh you went to luxenbourg?
<Kyral> ...I'm gonna have to trim up my Hackergotchi tomorrow (today?)
<jsgotangco> luxembourg
<jsgotangco> there
<dholbach> jsgotangco: oh, i wanted to write to sounder@ about it - i was at linuxdays.lu
<dholbach> did a booth and a talk
<jsgotangco> must be tiring to be travelling a lot lately
<dholbach> The travelling was ok, it's just nice to be home again - and to be able to try all the records I bought in London. :-)))
<dholbach> jsgotangco: how is life for you?
<ajmitch_> dholbach: ah, the life of the international traveller ;)
<jsgotangco> yeah jetsetter
<dholbach> hahaha
<dholbach> you guys are funny :)
<jsgotangco> dholbach, pretty stressful  lately
<dholbach> why is that?
<ajmitch_> work == stress?
<jsgotangco> deadlines and stuff, im just a common server admin
<ajmitch_> ah
<ajmitch_> don't worry, I'm writing C# code
<dolson> hey, question.. I'm trying to test a package in pbuilder, but it fails with "no rule to make target /usr/share/dpatch/dpatch.make"... question is, do I have to copy the contents of that file into my debian/rules for it to work properly? right now I have it as an include and it works with debuild..
<jsgotangco> we're not like someone who just roams around europe and do sprints and talks
<dholbach> dolson: you build-depend on dpatch?
<dolson> dholbach: !!! thanks
<dholbach> dolson: de rien :-)
<dolson> no idea what that means, but ok!
<dholbach> french for: "anytime" - "don't worry" :-)
<dolson> cool, cool :) I will have this uploaded soon.. I just gotta fix the build-deps because there was no configure or anything good like that.. the makefile alone is crap, has no install, clean, etc.
<zakame> gaah
<dholbach> As I said, I'll be quite busy with GNOME 2.13.92, but just tell me when I need to take a look
<zakame> using CDBS' buildcore?
<dholbach> dolson: I really want to help you guys get going.
<dolson> dholbach: it's super appreciated.. I don't know any other distros that have the PAM/glibc/bash patches for rlimits yet, but I'm told dapper will. you guys have been great to me, and I have learned a lot in just a couple days
<dholbach> dolson: that's my impression to - you're doing very well! :)
<dolson> dholbach: one week ago, my only hope was checkinstall. thankfully, it's broken on dapper, so the temptation is gone, lol
<dholbach> haha!
<whiprush> hi guys
<dholbach> It's great being able to not fix stuff for just oneself, but for everybody
<ajmitch> hey whiprush
<dholbach> hey whiprush
<zakame> hello whiprush
<zakame> dholbach++
<ajmitch> dholbach: at the moment I can't even do that
<whiprush> wow, don't I feel popular. :)
* dholbach hugs whiprush
<dholbach> ajmitch:  busy?
* ajmitch rushes up to whiprush & begs for an autograph
<whiprush> heh
<ajmitch> dholbach: yes, and with no net access outside work
<dolson> dholbach: yeah, I have had many people suggest I put up a repository.. but wtf is the point of that? we can help improve and expand ubuntu... seems like a better idea to have it all in officially, rather than some 3rd party stuff. and I've had a few submissions of packages.. naming conventions are screwed up and lintian flips out because they were all done in checkinstall. I don't want to be a part of something like that, with a bunch
<dolson> of fundamentally broken packages.. but that's just me :)
* dholbach high-fives dolson
<dholbach> That's the spirit! :)
<dolson> hardcoded incorrect qt lib paths suck
<zakame> dolson++
* ajmitch_ has a bunch of hacked up packages
<dolson> uploaded. next!
<jsgotangco> whiprush, fridge!
<whiprush> heh
* ajmitch_ needs more fridge news
<floam> dolson: think you're too cool for #io?
<dolson> floam: lol
<dolson> floam: I am only in this channel because the xchat panel notifier thingy shows up whenever someone types, and I don't care right now if anyone says anything other than what is said in here
<zakame> lol
<floam> dolson: panel notifier? are you on xchat-gnome?
<dolson> yeah
<floam> just go into preferences and turn off that plugin
<floam> there's like notification, and on-screen display
<floam> maybe it's one of them
<dolson> floam: I like the plugin
<floam> oh.
<dolson> floam: I just don't like that it's not very configurable.. like, "ignore all channels, but this one"
<floam> so,
<floam> dolson: think you're too cool to get nofifications from #io?
<dolson> floam: yes. the thing would be blinking all the time from Mongoose
<floam> it should only blink up if you are addressed
<floam> at least that's what it does here
<dolson> well, there's different icons
<floam> oh, the notification icon
<floam> I only have the OSD thing on, which uses libnotify
<dolson> yeah, when I see the icon, I come in here and read what's going on
<dolson> because it is important! to me
<floam> and pops up telling me what someone said to me
<dolson> yeah it does that too
<floam> it works nice because it can popup over a fullscreen game without messing that game in the bottom corner for a few seconds
<floam> s/game/game up/
<dolson> but sometimes people spell names wrong and whatnot, or don't always address me, and I like to follow everything that's said in here anyhow
<dolson> it's how I learn things :)
<floam> I didn't realize you were a master or prospective
<floam> I just joined here because I hope to see someone mention it when compiz gets into universe
<dolson> I am no master
<dolson> I'm just trying to get some music apps packaged for dapper
<floam> s/prospective/prospective master/
<floam> oh, like what?
<dolson> well, there's a list I'm slowly picking from on my wiki. but so far I have packaged mx44, a fixed seq24, a launcher util I wrote, and qmidiarp
<dolson> floam: did you realize that there is a channel called #io?
<floam> literally #io?
<floam> I guess there is
<zakame> yeah
<floam> there will always only be one true io in my mind
<dolson> I only joined it because I figured someone wouldn't know what you were referring to :) and I was right
<zakame> heh /me would be that someone :P
<floam> hah
<dolson> has there even been any new Linux games lately?
<zakame> well anyhow I've nothing much to do except hack up a linux 101 presentation :P
<dolson> the last one I bought was Lugaru
<floam> dolson: coldwar I guess
<floam> you can download a linux demo, it's pretty and fun
<floam> oh
<dolson> I promised them I'd buy it if they had a Linux port, and then like the next day Ryan had one out.. so I was like, damn.
<floam> ryan just ported second life
<floam> and there's a beta you can download
<dolson> second life.. sounds like a FPS
<floam> MMORPG
<dolson> ah. pay-for?
<floam> http://secondlife.com/
<floam> free
<floam> unless you buy land
<floam> it's very weird
<floam> it's not really a game per-se
<floam> it has it's own economy and stuff
<floam> and you can make things
<floam> it's really weird
<floam> it's like a second real life
<floam> you can directly exchange cash in the game for real currency
<dolson> then it is a fitting name
<floam> yes
<dolson> I don't even have a first life...
<dolson> I think I have a half life
<zakame> hoho
<floam> hm, there's a northland demo for linux
<floam> and lgp is beta testing x2 which I've been playing which is a bit fun
<dolson> I had to get Lugaru because a game where you play a killer kungfu bunny rabbit is just the ideal thing for fans of Donnie Darko
<dolson> oh yeah, I'm on that beta
<floam> dolson: I bought lugaru
<floam> it's fun
<dolson> but it doesn't work on my system very well.. I need an upgrade I think
<floam> well, was fun
<floam> for a week
<floam> dolson: have you gotten the newer betas?
<floam> the first was was very very slow
<floam> it's gotten better
<dolson> Lugaru needs MP
<floam> like 80% better
<floam> as far as framerate
<dolson> floam: nope.. been busy. I started a site for ubuntu musicians and then got into packaging, so I haven't had time
<dolson> plus I'm looking for a job :\
<floam> dolson: do you know lee revell
<dolson> yeah
<dolson> he's on the LAU list
<floam> he's been trying to get a bunch of latency related stuff done for music people
<dolson> yeah, I'm pretty sure he linked to my wiki when he sent the emails in
<floam> ah
<dolson> I am running a patched pam right now, and it works very well
<dolson> although the patches he is pushing for are for allowing apps to request realtime access. the latency stuff is more at the kernel level, and we can't get any better than having CONFIG_PREEMPT=y in the dapper kernel without further patches that may cause issues
<floam> yeah
<floam> I follow lkml a lot
<dolson> Mark has said it will happen, but I'm not sure exactly any details he has planned
<floam> it'd be interetesting if some of ingo's -rt stuff got in
<dolson> I am running it, and it is fantastic... 95% pre-emption vs 50%
<floam> rad
<dolson> I was compiling a kernel, running a cpuburn program, surfing in firefox, chatting in gaim, all while listening to some MP3s through XMMS plugged through JACK-Rack with 0 xruns
<zakame> ooh haven't touched -rt and kernel-backing for some time now
<dolson> I managed to patch the -rt over ubuntu's kernel source, with a whole ton of failed hunks that I patched in by hand.. but in the end, it didn't compile. some function had too few parameters and it errored out, so I gave up
<dolson> what the crap
<zakame> waah
<dolson> this package doesn't even have a Makefile :|
<zakame> go buildcore.mk then ;)
<dolson> mmm, I don't yet know what that means
<dolson> ah, there appear to be make files, but not named that
<dolson> it's the first time I've seen that. I'm such a n00b
<nomed> dholbach, how is  the galago stuff  going?
<dholbach> nomed: I cancelled the operation
<nomed> does this mean dapper will not have galgo's pkges ?
<dholbach> nomed: the problem was, I had to have packaged svn, which has a soname change in the library - unfortunately we're not in a period of our release cycle, where I'd rather not do a transition
<dholbach> It's Dapper+1 material, I'm sorry.
<dholbach> apart from having a difficult discussion to get SVN packages in after UpstreamVersionFreeze
<nomed> do you think it's better if ChipX86 will remove those debian dirs from svn ?
<dholbach> Absolutely.
<dholbach> It messes up the .diff.gz every time and I had to patch out the debian/Makefile* by hand (and out of configure.*)
<nomed> yep
<dholbach> They make no sense.
<nomed> i would try to figure out if xfce-galago can be fixed ...
<nomed> and how ...
<nomed> i'll pkge *galago* by myself so ..
<dolson> man, this guy was on crack
<dolson> there is no install, and the readme doesn't say what files need to be where
<dolson> it wouldn't be bad if it was just the app, but there's the app, several xml files, a couple png files, an ams file... a desktop file that references a non-existant icon..
<dolson> ..and so does the source code. wow. just wow.
<zakame> lol
<dolson> argh. litter-training-ferret--
<dolson> fbond: did you say you had packages for linuxsampler?
<sealne> what is the way to debify a package that dosen't use auto stuff, it has a makefile with /usr/local specified do i need a patch to change that to debian/tmp or something?
<dolson> sealne: you need to use a patch. what I do is copy the directory, make the changes I need, then diff -ru on them both.. then follow the process in the debian maintainer's guide about patches
<zakame> hi all
<dolson> wb zakame
<sealne> is debian/tmp what i want to change it to?
<zakame> thanks dolson
<zakame> there's also debdiff too
<sealne> ah $(DESTDIR)/usr/bin ?
<dolson> yeah, that's what you would want
<sealne> ta
<dolson> np :)
<sealne> should i change mkdir and cp to install?
* Se7h is now away
<dolson> sealne: not sure what you mean
<dolson> sealne: if the makefile has the paths hardcoded, then yeah, I'm sure you have to put destdir in
<dolson> 645am.. bed time
* Yagisan waves hello
<freeflying> Yagisan: hi
<Yagisan> hows it going freeflying ?
<freeflying> Yagisan: are u from Japan ?
<Yagisan> freeflying: no, I'm from Australia. My wife is from Japan however
<Yagisan> freeflying: What about you ? where are you from ?
<freeflying> Yagisan: hehe , I just look for some guys from CJK
<freeflying> Yagisan: I'm from China PRC
<Yagisan> freeflying: I only know one chinese word. Nihow (probably spelt wrong, and most likely wrong dialect too). It's either cantonese or mandarin for hello
<freeflying> Yagisan: cool , hehe
<Yagisan> freeflying: It comes from having my wife mistaken for being Chinese or Korean everywhere she goes. I can also say hello in Korean too now.
<freeflying> Yagisan: we chinese also being mistaken as Japnese and korean too
<Yagisan> freeflying: actually I had a similar situation, when I was in Japan, I was mistaken as someone from the USA quite often.
<Yagisan> freeflying: I don't know why so many people make mistakes, you all are quite clearly different looking
<jsgotangco> ni hao :D
<freeflying> Yagisan: that's because you know we clearly , but others will not
<freeflying> jsgotangco: hi , from korea ?
<jsgotangco> nope, i've been there frequently though
<Yagisan> freeflying: he spelt my nihow differently ;)
<Yagisan> freeflying: hi in korean (womens dialect TTBOMK) is un yu ha say o (typed as I, a native english speaker, would pronounce it)
<freeflying> Yagisan: hehe  :)
<zakame> hi MOTUs :)
<gypsymauro> hello
<gypsymauro> sorry I can do a mirror of universe and multiverse repositories without having legal troubles?
<zakame> hello gypsymauro
<rob^^^> dholbach, could you take a look at https://launchpad.net/malone/bugs/31244 real quick if you aren't too busy?
<dholbach> rob^^^: error: page not found
<rob^^^> dholbach, hrmm, I got that in an email
<rob^^^> basically byzanz would compile cleanly on breezy if it's dephelper req was lowered to that of breezy
<dholbach> rob^^^: i dunno if we backport NEW stuff to breezy
<rob^^^> I wasn't suggesting that, just to lower the dep in case someone wanted to
<dholbach> hrm
(dholbach/#ubuntu-motu) and i got a bug report for that? :(
(rob^^^/#ubuntu-motu) hehe
<stratus> dholbach: can you tell me about the UVF exceptions processing status?
<jsgotangco> good night
<dholbach> stratus: let me look for the link
<stratus> dholbach: oh, is there a status page in the wiki?
<dholbach> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-motu/2006-January/000177.html
<dholbach> that's the process
<dholbach> i usually try to pass new uvf requests weekly to matt and colin
<dholbach> (just sent a bunch of them today)
<stratus> oh no, i'm aware about the process really
<stratus> i asked the status, because i requested bzrtools and you replied but i see it wasn't processed
<stratus> i think it was at least two weeks ago
<stratus> is there a status page with the requests or something like that?
<dholbach> ah right
<stratus> I can help you starting one if you agree, let me know
<dholbach> i said it's ok, but i'm not sure, if somebody requested a sync from debian
<dholbach> i just talked to slomo_ on #ubuntu-desktop - if sync take too long from debian (because elmo is very busy at the moment), we shouldn't hesitate to upload a -0ubuntu1 version ourselves (if we have uvf exception approval)
<dholbach> it's better to get stuff included asap, so it gets more testing until release
<stratus> i agree, let me know, i'm the bzrtools maintainer in debian
<dholbach> if it's a no-change -0ubuntu1 -> -1 sync, we can always do that before release
<dholbach> stratus: i'll write elmo today (regardless if anybody else asked in the meantime) and if it's not done soon, i'd sponsor you an upload - does that make sense?
<stratus> dholbach: sure, thanks.
<dholbach> Cool.
<stratus> dholbach: btw, what we can do about the others UVF ? Are they all processed ? Don't we need a wiki page to post the 'pending' stuff?
<dholbach> i have a file on my disk where i keep track
<dholbach> but i can put it on the wiki for sure
<stratus> dholbach: it would be cool because the first thing i did was seek in the wiki for something like that.
<dholbach> i just look at the mailing list, see if there are changelog/diffstat and somebody else who seconds the decision - with that info i'm happy to talk to matt and colin about it
<dholbach> right
<stratus> dholbach: I can help you listing the messages-ids from motu ML in the article if you don't have too much time to process it yourself
<dholbach> i'll just do it
<dholbach> it's a great idea
<dholbach> thanks
* dholbach hugs stratus
<stratus> heh
<stratus> so, drop me a message when you list the stuff there in the wiki, after that i'll start posting the package name, who asked the exception and the message-id.
<dholbach> cool
<stratus> ;)
<dholbach> stratus: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/UVFStatus
<dholbach> stratus: nothing fancy :)
<stratus> dholbach: you're fast! :)
<dholbach> i had the file on my disk already :)
<stratus> dholbach: you said, heh. btw, i'll start reviewing the ML to see if there's some package missing, thanks!
<dholbach> Cool, thanks.
<dholbach> There were 2 or 3 which didn't have any diffstat/changelog attached
<dholbach> I should have asked back on those
<dholbach> stratus: i mailed James about bzrtools
<dholbach> I'll get going on the MOTU report now.
* dholbach silently whines about the lacking interest.
* dholbach stops and writes it. :-)
<stratus> dholbach: heh
<dholbach> it's the 12th edition of the motu report!
<dholbach> it's the BIRTHDAY edition
<tseng> 1 year of dholbach !
<tseng> (and me)
* dholbach hugs tseng
<dredg> is it a year?
<dredg> holy crap
<dholbach> 11 months
<dholbach> damn, it's not the birthday edition yet
* dholbach grudgingly rewrites the first paragraph
<dholbach> I'm going to announce the REVU day (wednesday, yes THIS wednesdays :)) with the motu report
<Toadstool> heya MOTUs o/
<dholbach>  hey Toadstool! o/ *high five*
<Toadstool> :)
<dholbach> Does anybody remember some exciting packages we got through NEW in the last time?
<ogra> dholbach, many went from REVU to debian directly .....
<dholbach> Ah.
<Toadstool> dholbach: you mean, packages that were reviewed on REVU and which are waiting in Debian's NEW ?
<dholbach> in Debian's NEW?
<dholbach> did I miss something?
<ogra> Toadstool, nope, the ones in our NEW
<dholbach> why don't they wait in Ubuntu's NEW?
<Toadstool> no I misunderstood something, I'm a little tired, sorry :)
<dholbach> Toadstool: don't worry. :)
<ogra> Toadstool, note that we're less than 10 days from feature freeze, if debian NEW approval is slow, packages from there might not get into ubuntu
<lucas> also, elmo is currently slow too, so packages which got out of NEW in Debian might not get into Ubuntu very fast
<lucas> (ie: sync requests are not processed)
<ogra> thast why you should uplaod to ubuntu ...
<ogra> NEW in ubuntu *will* be processed before ff
<Toadstool> that's why I'm looking forward the REVU day, my package's been accepted in Debian's NEW yesterday but there's no chance it will get out of NEW before ff :p
<JavaGeek> hello
<JavaGeek> what is the correct sources.list setup for having multiverse and universe, along with the usual updates?
<dholbach> JavaGeek: just enable the sources in synaptic
<JavaGeek> dholbach: is there a console equivalent?
* JavaGeek is on a remote session
<dholbach> just remove the # from the stock /etc/apt/sources.list
<JavaGeek> well, that's the thing... my sources.list appears to have been... edited. :(
<hub> JavaGeek: add "universe multiverse" to the line with "main"
<dholbach> JavaGeek: you had another question? :)
<JavaGeek> yes... where is the place to ask for new packages?
<JavaGeek> in particular, lincity-ng
<JavaGeek> :)
<dholbach> http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UniverseCandidates
<dholbach> Afaik it should be on there already.
<Kyral> lincity-ng is in the repos
<dholbach> ah cool
<Kyral> Universe
<Kyral> 1.0.2-1
<JavaGeek> ah, then my first question applies... I had my sources list wrong :)
<dholbach> ROCK ON
<JavaGeek> thx
<Kyral> *hugs apt-cache policy*
<dholbach> :-)
<hub> same here
<hub> I have it
<Kyral> Eh its not a good SimCity clone...
<Kyral> If I really wanted to play SimCity I'd just fire up WINE
<hub> Kyral: I prefer freeciv
<Kyral> Eh I don't really use my computer for gaming in the first place
<Kyral> Thats what my GameCube and GBA are for ;D
<hub> I don't use anything ofr gaming
<hub> unless it involve dices and a board
<Kyral> I have an addiction to Mega Man :D
<hub> or dsomething else
<Kyral> and Harvest Moon, strangly enough
<Kyral> but I digress
<Kyral> I'm hungry
<Kyral> and hungry Hacker != Happy Hacker ;P
<hub> me too
<hub> it is diner soon
<Kyral> lunchtime :D
<hub> diner soon here :-)
<JavaGeek> well, hopefully someone will port it to PSP
<JavaGeek> :)
<Kyral> Ick PSP
<Kyral> tries to do too much
<Kyral> Gimme my good ol' GBA or DS :D
<ogra> hub, oh, youre in .fr ?
<hub> ogra: I leave tomorrow
<ogra> ah
<Kyral> oh, IMO, we should abolish Timezones and make everyone use GMT ;P
<JavaGeek> Kyral: try VNC'ing to your box with GBA ;)
<Kyral> JavaGeek: this is what my laptop is for
<Kyral> <<< Nintendo Fanboy since his first Game Boy back in 1990
<JavaGeek> anyway, we digress
<Kyral> *now I eat!*
<JavaGeek> thank you all
<JavaGeek> mmm... what's the package name? lincity-ng?
<phanatic> hi people
<dholbach> hi phanatic
<JavaGeek> ahh... it's in dapper
<JavaGeek> well, anyway, gotta go. Thanks again
<LaserJock> dholbach: ping?
<dholbach> LaserJock: pong
<LaserJock> dholbach: I need to get gausssum into Ubuntu. I got it into Debian unstable but it needs to be synced over to Dapper. Can you request that for me?
<dholbach> why didn't it go into ubuntu in the first place?
<dholbach> I think we should start collecting sync requests again
<LaserJock> because I decided to package it for Debian and let it sync to Ubuntu so I wouldn't have to do it twice ;-)
<dholbach> and mail them to James every now and then
<dholbach> but I'd be *REALLY* happy, if it wasn't me, who had to do this
<LaserJock> yeah, I already had crimsun do a few for me but it would probably be better to batch them
<LaserJock> but he said to ask you about gausssumm since it would be NEW in dapper
<dholbach> doesn't matter
<dholbach> everybody who's known to James should be able to ask a sync
<dholbach> Ok, how do we do this?
<LaserJock> but if it hasn't been in Ubuntu before it isn't as easy, is it?
<dholbach> it is
<ogra> its very easy if you get it into ubuntu NEW
<dholbach> do a wiki page and have a    || Who || Package || Justification || Requested (yes/no) ||     table for syncs?
<Mithrandir> \sh_away: you might want to do a s/ooffice/&2/ in the config to actually make your ooqstart change useful.
<dholbach> Mithrandir: it wouldn't work anyway, I guess - I tried to get it working before breezy release - seems that Linux OOo doesn't have the "preload" stuff
<LaserJock> dholbach: do we need a justification for non-UVF breaking syncs?
<dholbach> Mithrandir: (at least that's what i found out that time)
<Mithrandir> dholbach: I'm basically forwarding a request from _rene_ about it.
<dholbach> Oh, ok.
* dholbach shuts up then.
<dholbach> LaserJock: i think it's good to have it.
<dholbach> LaserJock: but we don't have to be as dead-serious as about uvf
<ogra> LaserJock, nope, but it generates far less work if you dont push it to debian and sync from there, but upload directly to ubuntu, elmo is *very* busy it puts extra workload on everybody ...
<ogra> (for NEW packages that is)
<ogra> additionally it might hang in debians NEW for to long to make the freezes ...
<LaserJock> ogra: it's already in unstable
<LaserJock> and testing I guess
<ogra> LaserJock, understood ...
<dholbach> then it's just a sync
<LaserJock> ok
<ogra> i'm just a bit worried that suddenly everybody pushes his packages into debian instead of ubuntu
<LaserJock> well, I took over an ITP so I was going to put it in Debian anyway
<ogra> it raises the load ...
<LaserJock> ogra: but it creates less delta if we don't have an 0ubuntuX version about, right?
<ogra> i doubt it since it slows down everything ...
<dholbach> we can always do a -0ubuntu1 -> -1 sync
<dholbach> (if it contains no changes but the changelog)
<LaserJock> but then why not just send -1 over
<ogra> you need to push your change into debian first ... that takes extra time
<dholbach> if we're blocked on syncs, we shouldn't wait for them :)
<dholbach> and it's good to expose stuff to our users early
<dholbach> soon we'll have a shiny request-your-sync-through-launchpad in place
<dholbach> but at the moment we haven't
<dholbach> :/
<dholbach> which is sad, but we have to deal with it
<ogra> and i guess even in launchpad it will need a human intervention to check ...
<dholbach> maybe
<dholbach> depending on the team you're in and the state of the release cycle
<LaserJock> anyway, I am going through the MOTU Science packages and looking for sync/merges that need to be done. So should I just ask for syncs if the package has some real improvement or what?
<LaserJock> there are quite a few -1 -> -1.1 kind of things
<dholbach> sounds like a good idea, if it's stuff that works for us
<LaserJock> but how hard do I need to justify the syncs/merges?
<dholbach> not so much
<LaserJock> I realize that elmo is very very busy so I guess I'm thinking that I don't want to create problems by requesting a bunch of syncs/merges for trivial things, is that a correct thinking?
<LaserJock> on the other hand, why not have the latest Debian version that we can in Dapper?
<dholbach> no, just do
<dholbach> it makes perfect sense
<LaserJock> ok, so are we going to do a wiki page?
<dholbach> I had wished somebody else would take it.
<dholbach> But I'm going to do it and ask everybody on the mailing list
<LaserJock> do you want me to make the wiki page?
<dholbach> yeah, that'd be great - although we should have one already around
* dholbach thinks
<LaserJock> it might have been cleaned out, I don't know
<dholbach> hm, it seems we don't
<dholbach> :)
<dholbach> if you tell me the name, ill mail the mailing list
<LaserJock> so should this just be syncs, or merges too?
<dholbach> syncs
<dholbach> merges is nothing we have to batch or request - or did i get your intention wrong?
<LaserJock> oh, that makes sense. you understood me right ;-)
<dholbach> ok, cool.
* dholbach pings the whole audience: Who wants to be starring in a little interview? :)
* phanatic was invited for today to a radio station to speak about ubuntu, so he cannot take the chance now :)
* ogra will be staring at it afterwards :P
<tseng> dholbach: a what?
<tseng> :P
<ogra> tseng, for the monthly report :)
<tseng> ah
<dholbach> phanatic: WOW!
<dholbach> ogra: afterwards?
<ogra> if you realeased it :)
<phanatic> dholbach: i'm already after 2 appearences on tv as well ;)
<dholbach> phanatic: stuff about Ubuntu?
<phanatic> dholbach: right. first i spoke about history and general stuff, then about installing/upgrading
<phanatic> was quite fun :)
<dholbach> Coool.
<phanatic> the hunagrian ubuntu site was launched recently
<phanatic> Gauvain just called me "the Hungarian Ubuntu guy" :)
<dholbach> haha :)
<dholbach> nobody for a quick interview?
<LaserJock> dholbach: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/SyncRequests
<LaserJock> dholbach: I'd do it but you probably want somebody more prestigious ;-)
<dholbach> LaserJock: thanks a lot
<LaserJock> hi seth|lappy
<dholbach> LaserJock: Everybody doing work in here is 'prestigious' in my eyes. :-)
<seth|lappy> hi LaserJock
<seth|lappy> is udev still deadly? :P I'm thinking of trying an upgrade again
<dholbach> seth|lappy: atm there is some network interface rename messing :)
<seth|lappy> dholbach, alright, that was what I was referring to :)
<seth|lappy> thanks
<dholbach> but i was told, that a   1) look up in /proc/net/dev; 2) sudo ifconfig <funny interface name> up; 3) sudo dhclient &   can cure it :-)
<dholbach> (at least it did on two boxes, I came across) :-)
<seth|lappy> I fear network death, since then it would be considerably harder to get the box up-and-running again with new packages
<dholbach> yeah
<ogra> the manual way is pretty reliable though ...
<ogra> its just that you have to do it every boot ...
<ogra> and the iface name might change every time
<phanatic> if any of you has some time, could you have a look at this one, please: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=1757 ?
<dholbach> How does this look: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Report/Draft ?
<dholbach> (still saving) /me whistles
<ogra> dholbach, nice
<dholbach> ogra: Thanks.
<dholbach> If somebody else could proof-read, I'd be happy and mail it.
<crimsun> dholbach: in Jordan's statement regarding what he likes about MOTU, it should probably read "A person can come to the MOTU" instead of "I person can come to the MOTU"
<dholbach> crimsun: ah right :)
<crimsun> dholbach: sorry, been away in meetings most of the day
* dholbach hugs crimsun ... a lot
<ogra> ah, missed that one ...
<LaserJock> hmm, seems like LaserJock got kinda wordy  :-)
<Kyral> I just realized that the first "u" in uupdate and uscan stands for "upstream" lol
<dholbach> So I can send it? Really? :)
<dholbach> stratus: nice work on the wiki page :)
* dholbach seeeees coooloooooors
<tseng> dholbach: hm wherE?
<stratus> lol
<dholbach> MOTU/UVFStatus
<stratus> dholbach: i just ripped off my internal table scheme (we use moinmoin here too), that turned out to be ripped off from early days of the ubuntu wiki =)
<tseng> am i meant to do my reports on the wiki now?
<stratus> i doubt
<stratus> dholbach: btw, i'll just go through the UVF mails, populating more the article if necessary
<dholbach> tseng: no... this is just an overview
<dholbach> stratus: that's very nice of you - thanks.
<stratus> i updated the article to inform that if you want to ask for a UVF exception you should mail ubuntu-motu ML and not update the wiki
<lucas> dholbach: did you package ekiga from scratch, or did you use an existing package ?
<stratus> dholbach: you're welcome and that was trivial for me. :)
<dholbach> lucas: I think I mentioned it in the changelog - I used Kilian's package.
<dholbach> lucas: same goes for the necessary libraries
<dholbach> lucas: kilian's ekiga package was heavily based on the existing gnomemeeting package
<lucas> ah yes
<dholbach> stratus: cool
<lucas> I missed that
<stratus> in a side note, kids running debian sid should take a look at initng package in experimental.
<lucas> dholbach: the esd bug was fixed in upstream's CVS
<dholbach> lucas: oh nice
<dholbach> lucas: thanks for the pointer
<lucas> I think we can wait until another beta gets released
<lucas> http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=330586
<stratus> i'm still shocked with the boot speed up and ngc (the initng control util)
<Ubugtu> gnome2 bug 330586 in general "Doesn't work if esd is enabled" [Major,Resolved: fixed] 
<Kyral> InitNG?
<dholbach> I'm very busy with today's gnome release, so I won't do it today.
<Kyral> My boottime is fine lol
<Kyral> 49 secs
<stratus> Kyral: i'm sure it's don't use it in dapper, it's just for debian sid users.
<dholbach> but if somebody prepares an update to the momentary package, I'll happily sponsor an upload
<Kyral> stratus: hmm, I should try it on my laptop
<stratus> Kyral: my sid machine (faster than my ibook) is booting faster than the laptop for the first time.
<Kyral> It's in Main yes?
<dholbach> yes
<stratus> Kyral: you will see just udev populating stuff and after that X will appear like magic.
<Kyral> good..I'm trying to stay FSF complient
<stratus> heh
<stratus> great
<Kyral> Look on the Forums for the topic called "How Free Are You"
* tseng hugs dholbach for new gnome
<Amaranth> the FSF is worthless :P
* Kyral stabs Amaranth
<Kyral> whats up in the new GNOME anyway?
* tseng seconds Amaranth 
* Kyral shrugs
<Amaranth> i mean, wtf is up with the GPL3?
<Kyral> Yah that is funky...I mean they HAD to throw something about DRM in it, but in doing so they made it GPLv2 incompatible
<lucas> Kyral: your understanding of "incompatible" is wrong
<Kyral> oh
<lucas> compatible means that you can follow terms of both licenses at the same time
<Kyral> I've been focused on schoolwork ;P
<Amaranth> lucas: how can you follow 2 and 3 at the same time?
<lucas> by using GPLv2 or later, for example.
<lucas> but you can't import code under GPLv3 in a GPLv2 app
<stratus> GPLv3 is evil
* Kyral makes a note to actually read the GPLv3
<stratus> GPLv2 or later is just a notice, not part of the license
* lucas once made a promise to stop discussing licenses on IRC
<Amaranth> from the sound of it the GPL3 might not even be DFSG-free
<Amaranth> which would be sad
<lfittl> dholbach: ping
<dholbach> lfittl: pong
<Windkracht8> Hi all, no sure if this is the right place so please redirect me if I'm wrong. 'GOK' depends on 'at-spi' but it doesn't told me when I installed it today
<Windkracht8> can someone correct this?
<dholbach> Hm?
<dholbach> Windkracht8: this is rather not the right place, but it's ok - what happened? I mean, what's the problem?
<Windkracht8> I installed gok just now with synaptic and it didn't work, so I started to google, I found it needs 'at-spi-registryd', so I installed 'at-spi' and now it works.
<dholbach> oh, thanks
<dholbach> i'll fix it just now
<Windkracht8> So my conclusion is: gok needs 'at-spi' so that should be marked in the respertory
<Windkracht8> ok, thanks by
<dholbach> What's your name?
<Windkracht8> Bart Vullings
<Windkracht8> why?
<dholbach> I'll put your name in the changelog - thanks! :-)
<Windkracht8> thanks
<Windkracht8> I saw a post on the forum about this, I'll answer him
<dholbach> That'll be fixed in Dapper.
<dholbach>  gok (1.0.6-0ubuntu2) dapper; urgency=low
<dholbach>  .
<dholbach>    * debian/control.in:
<dholbach>      - gok depends on at-spi - thanks Bart Vullings.
<dholbach> cheers :)
* dholbach needs a break now
<dholbach> I'll be back later
<ajmitch_> hi
<Windkracht8> bye all
<LaserJock> azeem: ping?
<azeem> pong
<LaserJock> azeem: I was able to commit to debichem, I just needed to wait a day for svn.debian.org to sync to alioth
<azeem> ok
<LaserJock> azeem: got a minute? or is it time for bed for you?
<azeem> sure, I'm going to be up for a while
<dolzzzon> fbond: ping
#ubuntu-motu 2006-02-19
<dolson> if there is a bug in a package, and the latest version in Debian unstable fixes it without any changes needing to be made, then what is the process to request to get that into Dapper? The bug in question is #28560, package is freewheeling. it currently segfaults with the Dapper version
<ajmitch_> as it doesn't break UVF, it should be no problem for someone to request a sync or merge the ubuntu changes in
<dolson> the ubuntu changes are not needed, from what I can tell
<dolson> Loic changed the build deps and that's all, and this is changed in Debian now from what I can see
<dolson> so can I request a sync? or does someone else higher up have to do it?
<ajmitch_> a MOTU needs to
<LaserJock> if you want a sync you can use our new wiki page https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/SyncRequests
<dolson> done.
<dolson> dholbach: hey, I just read your MOTU report. :)
<dholbach> good night guys
<LaserJock> cya dholbach
<dholbach> bye LaserJock
<dolson> cya later
<dsas> dolson = dana olsen?
<dolson> olson, yeah
<dsas> Are you the person who wrote mandrake tutorials years ago?
<dolson> I deny everything!
<dolson> I am innocent!
<dolson> http://pgshopping.com/mdkxp is not my old site!
<dsas> :D, You were a great help back when I was starting with Linux, thanks a lot.
<dolson> Thanks! that means a lot to me.. and I'm glad to see you're on Ubuntu now :)
<ajmitch_> how long ago was this?
<dsas> Uhm five years ago, roughly.
* ajmitch_ used to use mandrake, starting with 5.3
<dolson> I started it in 2001 I think.. ended in 2003
<ajmitch_> ah
<dsas> I think it was when I was using mdk 7.2 or 8.0
* ajmitch_ stopped using it at the start of 2001
<ajmitch_> hard to believe I've been on debian & now ubuntu for that long
<dolson> I used to spend all my spare time helping people on MSN and AIM, and some people sent me free stuff like Mandrake manuals, Linux video games, one guy took me out for lunch, and one guy even sent me a free MP3 player
<dolson> I had to sell the MP3 player because I wanted to get one that actually worked in Linux instead, heh
<dsas> ha :D, oh well.
<dsas> I posted on some forums occasionaly that you frequented too, mandrake-users.org or something.
<dolson> dsas: so who are you? maybe I would recognize the name
<dolson> yeah, I remember the good ol' MUB
<fbond> dolson: pong
<dolson> fbond: hey man.. do you have packages for linuxsampler?
<fbond> ah... no ...
<dsas> yeah the mub that was it. I was probably dean, sas or dsas back then too. (I've never been very creative with names)
<fbond> i was thinking that would be a good idea, though
<fbond> although i'll admit, i fell in love with NI Kontakt (non-free) a few years ago
<fbond> and that runs using dssi-vst
<dolson> fbond: do you wanna tackle it? I am slow
<fbond> i'll see if i can get to it
<dolson> it uses libs and stuff, and I'm not at that level yet
<fbond> ok
<fbond> what's the deadline for dapper again?
<dolson> soon
<dolson> :)
<ajmitch_> for new packages? in about a week
<fbond> yup ...
<fbond> ok, thanks
<fbond> anybody want to help me with a copyright file?
<fbond> i have a package with three different licenses
<dolson> ouch
<fbond> (for different components)
<fbond> yeah ... that's actually dssi
<fbond> is it okay to basically say "program xyz license\nlicense\n\nprogram abc license\nlicense text\n
<fbond> takers?
<dolson> sorry man, I don't know.. is there anything about license stuff in the debian maintainer guide?
<fbond> a bit, nothing complex, though
<fbond> i'll check the debian policy manual
<fbond> yeah, policy manual is not much help ... throwing all the copyrights in there makes sense to me
<dolson> I guess I'd just do it and get it up to REVU and someone will correct you if it's wrong
<fbond> yup
<Mez> ogra: ping
<dolson> ahahahahah http://www.flurl.com/featured/Scare_Your_Kid_1082.html
<dsas> does anyone know the difference between eric and eric3 in the repos?
<ajmitch_> one of them should have been removed
<ajmitch_> I can't remember which :)
<dsas> presumably eric3 it has an older revision number.
<dsas> I'll change the docs to reccomend eric then :)
<psusi> man that Joerg Schilling is a jackass
<psusi> I wish that thread would die finally
* ajmitch_ doesn't know what thread
<ajmitch_> and I don't know if I want to know :)
<odla> man xfce is messed up right now on dapper ;)
<psusi> the completely massive thread on lkml over the last week or two where Joerg has basically been shooting his mouth off about how linux is broken because it does not conform to his world view of all scsi type devices being addressed with bus:device:lun numbers
<ajmitch_> ah right
<ajmitch_> I think everyone knows to ignore him anyway, or at least I could hope so :)
<psusi> he has been soundly smacked down on everything he has had to say but he keeps dodging and repeating himself because he refuses to accept that /dev/cdrom is just as good if not better than scsi:1:2:0 and the kernel isn't going to change
<psusi> well there's something like 1000 posts in the thread ;)
<whiprush> psusi: it's been like that for like ... at least 5 years.
<psusi> makes me wish they'd just ban the asshat
<whiprush> hi aj
<whiprush> and hi jsgotangco
<jsgotangco> jorge!!!!
<jsgotangco> wow my fonts in dapper are crap
<psusi> 0xDEADBEEF
<whiprush> jsgotangco: try removing ttf-arphic-uming (worked for me)
<jsgotangco> hmm my connection drops
<jsgotangco> race?
<psusi> that's nice... a trusted CA, 'geotrust' issued an SSL certificate to a phisher for a credit union's web site.... it seems they don't perform any kind of verification when issuing certs beyond an automated script that checks if the domain name is similar to known banks, and a WHOIS
<ajmitch_> psusi: and that's a fairly ftal problem with those 'trusted' CAs
<psusi> ftal?
<ajmitch_> s/ftal/fatal/
<ajmitch_> sorry, lagged ssh :)
<psusi> yea... when you trust someone to perform due dilligence, and they don't.. that's a problem
<psusi> time to remove them from the list of trusted CAs
<jsgotangco> yeah
<crimsun> heh, nice "Rent" quote in udev 079-0ubuntu11.
<LaserJock> ok, so what happens after Feature Freeze? only new ubuntuX versions?
<crimsun> only new package revisions; no new versions
<crimsun> only exceptions are kernel and gnome desktop
<crimsun> (and of course anything meeting an uvf/ff exception)
<LaserJock> so no new Debian versions? I'm not sure what the difference betwen revisions an version would be
<crimsun> revisions == packaging, or A.B.C-Y or A.B.C-YubuntuZ
<crimsun> versions == A.B.C
<LaserJock> but isn't that UVF
<crimsun> yes. What isn't clear?
<ajmitch_> feature freeze for us means no new packages
<LaserJock> I'm talking about Feature Freeze
<crimsun> we can NEW anything up until FF
<ajmitch_> for main, it means no new features
<LaserJock> so only new ubuntuX version not 0ubuntuX or upstream versons, correct?
<ajmitch_> for us, it's generally the same as before
<ajmitch_> with the exception that for dapper we're stopping accepting new packages off revu
<LaserJock> ok
<dolson> geez, why doesn't debuild -S -sa see the .orig file?
<minghua> dolson: it should
<dolson> hmm, that time it did... that is weird
<dolson> the first time it didn't and I haven't changed anything
<dolson> very strange.. oh well, dput time
<minghua> Mez: ping
<dholbach> good morning
<dolson> morning dholbach
<dholbach> hey dolson
<dolson> I whipped up a script to check the breezy, dapper, and sid package lists against the list of apps that we think we need, and there are only 15 packages left that I or forest have not done yet
<dolson> only one of the missing apps is in sid
<Gloubiboulga> morning
<dolson> morning Gloubiboulga
<Gloubiboulga> hey dolson
<Gloubiboulga> dholbach, hello!
<dholbach> hey Gloubiboulga
<Gloubiboulga> dholbach, do you have some news about the Texmaker UVF exception ?
<dholbach> it's all on the mailing list
<Gloubiboulga> oh ok
<dholbach> i requested it yesterday
<dholbach> afaik
<dolson> dholbach: I've uploaded a couple more, and fixed the one you said to fix. working on another one now. this is fun. :)
<dholbach> Cool.
<dholbach> I'm currently quite busy with GNOME updates
<dholbach> as soon as i get a break, i'll take a look
<dolson> yeah, I noticed a whole whack of updates today
<dolson> aww, thanks! will you be my valentine?!
<dholbach> Sure. :-)
* dholbach hugs dolson
<dolson> hah, hope my wife doesn't mind
<dolson> meh, she's visiting her mom right now anyhow, who cares
<dolson> another one bites the dust
<viviersf> gyts
<viviersf> * guys
<viviersf> any1 have an idea why i cant setup a localle in a chroot ?
<viviersf> ok nm
<dolson> aw crap, it's 6am :( bed time.
<sebest_> anyone using vmware-server on ubuntu breezy, i'm looking for libssl.so.4
<Yagisan> sebest_: have openssl installed ?
<sebest_> Yagisan, yes
<sebest_> i had to do a link :s
<sebest_> to libssl.so.0.9.7
<sebest_> the httpd from vmware-server webui needs libssl.so.4
<Yagisan> sebest_ I've never actually tried vmware sever, so I just took a guess. Hope it turns out well for you
<sebest_> it's working
<tepsipakki> hey, I'd like to be able to comment on REVU, but the damn login still doesn't work for me (or, recovering the password)... I've had gtkpod-aac there for a while now
<siretart> tepsipakki: what is your email?
<tepsipakki> tja@iki.fi
<tepsipakki> I can see the gpg-message, but there's nothing in it
<siretart> not even a 'None'?
<tepsipakki> well yes, but that apparently doesn't work
<tepsipakki> are there any MOTUs who use VDR, or are in the debian vdr-team?
<siretart> ok
<tepsipakki> the current version of VDR doesn't start when an UTF8-locale is in use.. the init-script needs to be hacked ;)
<siretart> tepsipakki: you're right, there went something really strange with your account
<siretart> tepsipakki: what package did you upload?
<tepsipakki> gtkpod-aac
<tepsipakki> it's just that the freeze is upon us =)
<tepsipakki> that package is for multiverse, I believe..
<siretart> gnarf, you didn't use tja@iki.fi in your changelog, thats the problem
<tepsipakki> oh? isn't that e-mail taken from the gpg-key?
<siretart> well, you have several uids on your key, and I made some bad assumption which I wanted to fix in revu2
<siretart> wenn I find time to code it, that is :/
<siretart> I just mailed your pass to you, btw
<siretart> check your email
<tepsipakki> yes, thanks!
<siretart> crimsun: around?
<zakame> evening MOTUs
<jpatrick> hello zakame
<zakame> hello jpatrick :) how's everything?
<jpatrick> fine :)
<jpatrick> just trying to get kubuntu-es.org back up
<jpatrick> you?
<zakame> prepping up for a couple of talks this thursday, about FOSS and Linux, general stuff
<fbond> hello all
<fbond> does anyone have time to build/review package dssi:
<fbond> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=1783
<jpatrick> fbond: wow, looks good to me
<fbond> jpatrick: thanks!
<fbond> does anyone have REVU admin access, and wants to build dssi?  sorry to pester, just got some other packages that i need to finish up and build-depend on dssi-dev
<LaserJock> man, it's quiet this morning
<seth|away> fbond, set up a local apt repository
<sistpoty> hi folks
<jpatrick> hello
<ompaul> there was a little note on the wiki about turning up in #motu if you thought you had an idea for improving ubuntu - so here goes - imagine a situation where the machine could be turned back to the way it was when it started, killing off all gnome configuration, all additional packages, and then it provides a list of packages that were removed to get to this state of post install- this would include removing all patches all packag
<ompaul> es other than the base and reverting the .gnome2 for users to its original state
* ompaul leaves the idea there to fester
<ompaul> go back a kernel version or two interesting?
<dholbach> http://wiki.ubuntu.com/IdeaPool might be more appropriate or even better https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+addspec
<dholbach> #ubuntu-motu is about maintaining the Universe component of Ubuntu
* ompaul goes to edit wiki to kill that idea :)
<Riddell> raphink: motu-reviewers mailing list?
<raphink> yes Riddell
<Riddell> where's that?
<Riddell> hmm, the super secret tauware.de domain
<raphink> haha
<raphink> no its no secret
<Riddell> is that advertised anywhere?
<raphink> it's even advertised on the main page of REVU
<LaserJock> yes, super secret, only sabdfl knows where it truely is ;-)
<dholbach> tauware.de/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/motu-reviewers
<raphink> Riddell: on revu it says :
<raphink> raphink@raphink.net      Pass: okioyouk     Login
<raphink>  BREAKING NEWS:
<Kyral> Is the issue about the boot sequence broken known?
<Riddell> ahem
<raphink>  The system now works and sends the notifications to motu-reviewers@tauware.de.
<raphink> ooops
<raphink> bad konqui
<jpatrick> :/
<raphink> huhu
<Riddell> how the heck did konqi put a password in the clipboard?
<raphink> ajmitch_: could you please change my REVU password :s ?
<raphink> Riddell: good question ...
<Riddell> that's quite a significant security issue
<raphink> Riddell: indeed
<raphink> Riddell: they were starts on the page though
<Riddell> wow, it does it for me too
<Riddell> that's insane
<raphink> very insane Riddell
<raphink> and I guess it works on all websites
<raphink> this must be reported
<raphink> all the more as konqui remembers passwords
<Riddell> yes, checked on random other website, happens there too
<Riddell> can't non MOTUs get commenting rights if they ask now?
<LaserJock> well, I think they can but it would take a really good non-MOTU that has shown that they know what they are doing
<Riddell> allee would be a good example
<Riddell> being a debian packager who likes to comment on revu packages
<sistpoty> Riddell: revu1 is just too messy to hack in comments from non-motu's... but if comments go to motu-reviewers, i usually post them on revu
<dolson> dholbach: thanks for the reviews,  I will look up debian/install now and fix the packages asap
<Riddell> right
<dholbach> dolson: rock! :)
<sistpoty> raphink: password updated
<raphink> sistpoty: thanks
<sistpoty> np
<raphink> sistpoty: maybe I could learn to change passwords, since I'm a REVU admin :s
<raphink> could be useful
<LaserJock> lol, I guess I won't be putting any passwords in konqi for a while
<sistpoty> raphink: in /srv/revu1/scripts see alter_user.py ;)
<raphink> LaserJock: hehe
<raphink> thanks sistpoty :=)
<Riddell> I've never noticed this konq password clipboard issue, I wonder if it's a new problem
<raphink> I'll havea look
<sistpoty> (so I still do it directly in the database *g*)
<sistpoty> s/so/though/
<Kyral> LJ is going for MOTU?
<LaserJock> Kyral: we will see
* Kyral sighs
<Kyral> I feel so outta touch now
<LaserJock> Kyral: don't worry I just decided to make a try
* Kyral goes to package GNOME Advanced Preferences
<LaserJock> hmm, that didn't go too bad, I guess
<jpatrick> LaserJock: it's going quicker than mine
<LaserJock> jpatrick: yeah, but you got +1s in the end ;-)
<sistpoty> LaserJock: actually I thought you were a motu already :/... if I knew it earlier, I could have taken a look at some of your packages
<sistpoty> :(
<Spec> apt-cache showpkg <package> should show the package maintainer, right?
<LaserJock> no problem, it was somewhat of a spur of the moment thing
<thesaltydog> who is in charge of synch-ing from debian?
<jpatrick> LaserJock: I got the spanish inquisition
<sistpoty> thesaltydog: elmo does the syncs... what package are you referring to?
<ogra> and note we are in UVF ...
<thesaltydog> few weeks ago I have fixed a bug on BUM, but maybe it came out on debian when dapper was already frozen
<thesaltydog> malone bug 29831
<Ubugtu> malone bug 29831 in bum "BUM leaves lock file around after failing to start" [Normal,Fix released]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/29831
<thesaltydog> if synching could be  a big problem, don't care.
<sistpoty> thesaltydog: it's a new upstream release... I'll take a closer look (and will call for UVF-exception)
<thesaltydog> sorry but my line went down and I haven't got any answer.
<sistpoty> thesaltydog: it's a new upstream version, so I'll need to request and UVF-exception... but I'm just taking a look at bum ;)
<thesaltydog> sistpoty: thanks. As I said, if it is too much work, don't care. Users could download deb from my site...
<thesaltydog> or from debian.
<sistpoty> thesaltydog: if it's bugfixing, than it's just work that needs to be done anyway ;)
<thesaltydog> ok. thanks!
<sistpoty> thx for informing us ;)
<thesaltydog> sistpoty: np.
<sistpoty> thesaltydog: lintian complains: "W: bum: menu-command-not-in-package /usr/share/menu/bum:4 /usr/bin/gksudo"... is this an issue? (I don't know anything about sudo menu entries actually...)
<thesaltydog> sistpoty: no. bum starts with gksudo. This warning just came out now, and I don't know why. For sure I cannot include gksu in the package!
<phanatic> hi people
<Kyral> hmm
<Kyral> CDBS worked...
<sistpoty> thesaltydog: yes, that for sure... but the menu entry changed from the last version: "command="/usr/sbin/su-to-root -X -c /usr/bin/bum"... (and I just don't know what should be there, that's what i mean)
<thesaltydog> sistpoty: I have also tested with su-to-root, and the warning is still there. Putting gksudo in the menu is more standard then su-to-root, so I have changed.
<Kyral> Why did I half expect CDBS to fail...
<sistpoty> thesaltydog: ah, thanks
<Kyral> ..gak...
<Kyral> Its alright for me to modify the Orig tarball so that the dir inside is all lowercase right...
<thesaltydog> goddnight sistpoty, and thanks again!
<sistpoty> goodnight thesaltydog
<sistpoty> Kyral: no
* Kyral falls down
<sistpoty> Kyral: why would you need to change the .orig for that reason?
<Kyral> dh_make complains if its not in lowercase, yet I cannot modify it
<Kyral> because the build is expecting it in lowercase
<Kyral> but it comes out of the orig in "normal"
<sistpoty> Kyral: do you mean the root-dir of the orig-tarball?
<Kyral> so the build fails
<Kyral> yah
<sistpoty> Kyral: that usually shouldn't be a problem... you can rename it, call dh_make and still have the orig.tar.gz unchanged... dpkg-source will usually take care to rename the root-dir correctly if the sourcepackage is extracted
<Kyral> hmm
<Kyral> I wonder why its failing then...
<sistpoty> Kyral: do you have the package publicly available? then I might take a look
<Kyral> yah I'll put it on my server
<Kyral> Keep in mind its no where near clean
<Kyral> I make sure it builds first, then I clean it :D
<sistpoty> Kyral: sure, I'll just take a look at it to get it building in the first place ;)
<ajmitch_> hi
<sistpoty> hi ajmitch_
<LaserJock> hi ajmitch_
<Kyral> http://azuredream.homelinux.org/aptwork/
<Kyral> its in a subdir
<LaserJock> sistpoty: wow, elmo spam ;-)
<LaserJock> would replacing a b-d on xlibs-dev with the explicit packages be worth a merge?
<sistpoty> LaserJock: sure
<sistpoty> LaserJock: and for your question: sure... if we can have a package back autosynced, it's less work during next merges
<Kyral> sistpoty: the sourcepack was made fine, and there was minimal lintian warnings
<sistpoty> Kyral: just taking a look at it...
<Kyral> ty
<Kyral> Its my first time using CDBS so I wasn't expecting it to go smoothly
<sistpoty> Kyral: but dpkg-source does it's job well... the mixed case dir from .orig.tar.gz is gpixpod-0.2.3/ after I do dpkg-source -x *dsc
<Kyral> okay...then why didn't it find setup.py?
<LaserJock> Kyral: why wouldn't you expect CDBS to work?
<Kyral> LaserJock: I don't expect my first time doing anything to go smoothly ;P
<LaserJock> oh, well that makes sense
<dolson> can someone think of a simple example off the top of their heads that uses a .install file and dh_desktop?
<Kyral> EasyChem?
<Kyral> GTKEdit?
<dolson> thanks
<Kyral> I had to write those files from scratch for both ;P
<Kyral> Actually I have to file a UVF Exception for GTKEdit...
<dolson> I just don't see anything about them in the DNMG and the man pages don't tell me what I need to know
<LaserJock> dolson: as far as what?
<dolson> using a .install file or dh_desktop
<Kyral> .install is easy
<Kyral> as is dh_desktop
<dolson> for instance, the man page for dh_desktop says it doesn't install the .desktop files
<dolson> so I don't understand why to use it
<Kyral> Yah you use dh_install
<Kyral> because it registers them
<dolson> but I don't know what that means... because my .desktop files show up in my menu when I install the package, even without using dh_desktop
<LaserJock> dolson: it runs update-desktop-databse
<sistpoty> Kyral: if you just use debhelper.mk and python-distutils.mk in your makefile, it builds fine... might be either the variables you define or tarball.mk
<Kyral> sistpoty: okay
<sistpoty> s/makefile/debian\/rules/
<Kyral> I'll try that after dinner
<Kyral> and also simplepatchsys has to go
<Kyral> since I don't use it
<Kyral> But I found it odd that although I left all the .ex files in the package...lintian didn't pick up on them
<sistpoty> Kyral: lintian must leave some work for manual inspection :)
<Kyral> sistpoty: I'm used to it complaing about that :P
<sistpoty> *g*
<Kyral> I mean I knew they were there ;P
<sistpoty> Kyral: don't forget to run lintian on the generated debs as well... (and fix the issues there) ;)
<Kyral> sistpoty: I know my stuff. EasyChem wouldn't have wound up in Sid otherwise
<sistpoty> :)
<Kyral> That did it
<Kyral> Built fine in my PBuilder
<Kyral> ty sistpoty
<sistpoty> np
<Kyral> ...gah I need to clean out my PBuilder Result dirs...
<Kyral> Lintian is completely ignoring those .ex files, even with the built deb
<Kyral> Did cdbs remove them or something?
<sistpoty> they aren't in the built deb ;)
<Kyral> anyway I'll polish it later...I'm hungry
<sistpoty> cdbs didn't install them... (and neither debhelper), because they are called .ex and not anything else
<sistpoty> good appetite
<dholbach> good night guys - we'll have a ROCKING REVU DAY tomorrow!
<ajmitch_> oh right, revu
* ajmitch_ might skip this one :)
<LaserJock> hmm, I was kinda hoping to help. I'll have to work on syncs/merges instead. :-)
<sistpoty> LaserJock: you can just post reviews to motu-reviewers list ;)
<ajmitch_> eek, doko on the warpatj, dropping many python 2.3 packages
<ajmitch_> s/patj/path/
<ajmitch_> I wonder how many zope products might break now
<LaserJock> ajmitch_: zope uses a lot of 2.3?
<sistpoty> ajmitch_: btw.: what should packages, that used to depend on zope3 depend now? (and might there be issues?)
<ajmitch_> LaserJock: zope <= 2.8 only uses 2.3
<ajmitch_> sistpoty: huh?
<sistpoty> ajmitch_: oh, it's zope3 that has an unmet dependency... I just noticed zope3 being unmet in (at least one package)
<ajmitch_> sistpoty: yes, it depends on python2.4-mechanize, which needs dragged in from sid
<sistpoty> ajmitch_: do you care about that? ;)
<sistpoty> s/care/take care/
<ajmitch_> it's in main, so I could, I suppose
<ajmitch_> though doko has been handling that side of things
<sistpoty> ah, k
<ajmitch_> I think it's a sync for elmo to handle, after clearing it with mdz/kamion
#ubuntu-motu 2007-02-12
<bigon> Do you think that bug #66292 worth an update to proposed?
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 66292 in sylpheed "Please bump sylpheed to 2.2.9" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/66292
<sistpoty> bigon: if you backport the individual fixes, I see no problem with an SRU. however a new upstream version should go to -backports
<bigon> sistpoty: ark
<mohammad> bddebian: hello 
<mohammad> bddebian: I have applied all comments you gave me on zekr, would you please kindly review it?
<sistpoty> gn8 everyone
<bddebian> mohammad: Yep, give me a little bit
<mohammad> :)
<jdong> !seen jdong
<ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about seen jdong - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
<jrib> Hi, I had a question regarding the policy on packages in universe.  The upstreamdev package is currently a bit old and I'd like to see a more recent version packaged (which fixes a lot of bugs).  My question is, is it possible to have the new version included in feisty at this point in time in the schedule?
<jdong> !where seen went
<ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about where seen went - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
<jdong> ^^ Seveas ..... :(
<geser> jrib: as we are in UVF now, it depends which bugs are fixed. the more severe the more likely to get it included
<Hobbsee> geser: it's still pretty early.   file a UVF exception
<geser> Hobbsee: I've already filed one :)
<Hobbsee> ah
<jrib> geser: I see, well the current package in feisty won't be able to use ubuntu-nl's pastebin since that has been updated since we released the version that got packaged.  That's probably the biggest issue.  Should I make sure I find a packager or create a suitable package myself before filing a UVF exception?
<Adri2000> yes
<geser> jrib: you should have a package ready
<Adri2000> "Please note that we expect requesters to have an updated package already prepared and tested!" https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess#head-9523bc4076ff011324d67cddc97969ec609618d6
<geser> jrib: that's a good reason to include a new version
<jrib> ok, last question:  The package in feisty was brought over from debian.  We've been unable to contact the original packager.  Are there any issues with a new packager maintaining the new package?
<Hobbsee> bah.  cant we just say "can we have a new version of basket"  "yes"
<geser> jrib: that should be no problem
<jrib> geser, Adri2000, Hobbsee:  thank you all very much
<mohammad> vil: Hello vil I have applied the comment you gave me about using cdbs instead of Makefile. would you please review http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=4350 [zekr]  now?
<vil> mahammad, i will take look at it, though i don't promise it will be any soon now (like tomorrow)
<mohammad> vil: ok thank you :)
<vil> mohammad, sorry for mistyping your name
<mohammad> see you all :)
<jdong> anyone see irony on multiple levels in bug 666?
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 666 in malone "can't file a bug on Ubuntu" [Medium,Rejected]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/666
<ajmitch> no
<bddebian> Ack, 666
<jrib> jdong: ha wow, that's a nice find
* Lathiat laughs
<jdong> well apparently some of us don't have a sense of humor... :)
<tsmithe> jdong, that wasn't your find :P
<tsmithe> i mean jrib
<tsmithe> bah
<tsmithe> whatever
<tsmithe> now revu my packages :P
<jdong> tsmithe with his devilish mind first came across that :)
<tsmithe> :)
<jdong> in a flood storm of #ubuntuforums with bug commands :D
<tsmithe> hehe
<jdong> I did file bug 84647 against Ubugtu for that :)
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 84647 in ubuntu-bots "Ubugtu not throttled -DoS/flooding" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/84647
<vil> hi, I would like to be added as a REVU reviewer. what can i do for it?
<bddebian> vil: Become an MOTU :-)
<vil> bddebian, i am :)
<bddebian> Then you already are :-)
<ajmitch> bddebian: no, it requires some DB tweaking
<bddebian> Oh really?
<ajmitch> yes really
<bddebian> I thought they were synced.  Hmm, sorry
* bddebian shuts up
<ajmitch> the uploaders keyring is
<ajmitch> revu accounts in the db aren't
<ajmitch> vil: revu email address?
<vil> ajmitch: vladimir.lapacek@gmail.com
<ajmitch> Altering vladimir.lapacek@gmail.com to level reviewer
<ajmitch> k, done
<vil> ajmitch, thx
<tsmithe> i uploaded a new package to revu, only to find out that it was not new there.
<tsmithe> it's a new upstream version however
<tsmithe> but i did the packaging completely from scratch
<tsmithe> it's not currently in ubuntu
<tsmithe> and it's name is enblend
<Hobbsee> tsmithe: apparently thta's not in the archives at all?
<tsmithe> no it's not
<ajmitch> oh, hub did the original package..
<tsmithe> yes i see that
<tsmithe> however, is what i've done ok?
<ajmitch> hijacking a package generally isn't appreciated
<tsmithe> ajmitch, i know
<tsmithe> as i said, i hadn't realised i had until five minutes ago
<tsmithe> hub, are you here?
<tsmithe> well - i'm going to bed
<tsmithe> i'll pm hub
<tsmithe> done
<tsmithe> night all
<bigon> n8
<alephant> Hi all... I need to rebuild the stock kernel with a slight tweak to the .config -- I need the version numbers to match $(uname -r) so that my modules-nonfree can modprobe.  Is this make-kpkg, or dpkg-buildpackage, or something else altogether?
<alephant> I know I'm slightly off-topic, please have mercy :-)
<hub> ajmitch: it is actually the second time somebody tries to hijack it.
<hub> ajmitch: actually said package would already be there if I could compile it
<hub> ajmitch: but with 512MB I can't
<ajmitch> hub: a rather heavy package?
<hub> ajmitch: just g++ being a hog
<ajmitch> ah
<hub> the official answer is "get more RAM"
<Laser_away> binary packages should be smaller than the corresponding source package generally, shouldn't they?
<white> the bad thing about living in australia is probably the fact that there is always a huge mail backlog on the mls in the morning :(
* white waves in and says hi
<Fujitsu> Hey white.
<Fujitsu> Laser_away, generally.
<Laser_away> I'm just having fun watching my mirror of Feisty grow
<white> Fujitsu: have you read debian-melbourne@ ?
<white> Fujitsu: anibal suggested to catch up on wednesday night
<Laser_away> trying to figure out if I have enough space on this partition or not
<Fujitsu> white: I can't do Wednesdays, I have TAFE. Plus the parents probably wouldn't let me go :(
<white> bah
<Laser_away> I'm up to php in Universe :-)
<Fujitsu> Laser_away: Why are you mirroring it?
<ajmitch> crazy person
<Laser_away> for fun, kinda
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: parents won't let you meet strange, slightly disturbing geeks at night?
<ajmitch> how annoying
<Fujitsu> Heheh.
<Laser_away> I have enough machines that I thought it might be good
<Laser_away> plus I wanted to be able to get source packages fast :-)
<Fujitsu> I'd like to have a source mirror, but it'll take a couple of months to mirror, I think.
<Laser_away> but the main reason is I'm learning how to use reprepo
<Fujitsu> Reprepo for mirroring?
<Laser_away> yep
<Laser_away> I'm grabbing i386 and source for Feisty Main and Universe
<Laser_away> I'm almost 7GB into it
<Laser_away> that'll feed 3 machines
<white> Fujitsu: well just go ahead and write your answer on debian-melbourne, I am sure we find a date where we can catch up
<white> at least we still need to catch up for keysigning anyway :)
* ajmitch should try & get over to melbourne sometime
<Laser_away> me too ;-)
<Fujitsu> white: I'll write a reply in a sec.
<Fujitsu> ajmitch, how long since you've been here?
<Laser_away> it's just across the trench for ajmitch and I
<Laser_away> my trench is just a bit bigger ;-)
<Fujitsu> Laser_away, hah.
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: july 
<white> time to come back
<ajmitch> I don't think I visited at all in 2005
<Fujitsu> white: Definitely.
<Fujitsu> Melbourne == goooood.
<ajmitch> was there for nearly 2 months in 2004
<Fujitsu> Better than Dunedin
* Fujitsu ducks.
* ajmitch would need to check the passport to remember when he's been 
<Fujitsu> Laser_away, you realise that i386+source feisty main/universe is a few MiB under 30GiB?
* Fujitsu kicks debootstrap for being so slow.
<Laser_away> Fujitsu: I'll find out
<Laser_away> I'm not sure why source seems sorta smallish so far
<Fujitsu> `Download all files that we need to get (29976 MiB).'
<Laser_away> I was expecting 30-40GB
<Laser_away> when this partition gets full I'll just make a new one and move everything over there
<Laser_away> I just hit the trigger before thinking "Oh, I should check to see if I have enough space" ;-)
<Laser_away> but I'm suprised that I'm almost to "r" for Universe source (no Main yet) and I've only got 7.0GB
<Laser_away> but I'm guessing Gnome+KDE+Kernel+Xorg will take a bit
<Fujitsu> universe is about 21GB, so it can't be doing it in order...
<Laser_away> it is though
<Laser_away> I'll just have to see
<bddebian> @#$^$%@$#^ hard drive :-(
<Laser_away> bddebian: is it dying?
<_ion> 29976 MiB is actually 744 MiB less than 30 GiB.
<Laser_away> heh
<_ion> Of course the filesystem overhead may add a lot to it. :-)
<bddebian> Laser_away: Either that or it's just tired of doing reviews :-)
<Laser_away> bddebian: my drive died suddenly  not long ago
<Laser_away> I was trying to install OpenSuse
<Laser_away> I think it was a sign
<bddebian> heh
<Laser_away> so it was a good excuse to buy a bigger drive
<Laser_away> I hadn't bought any computer parts for over a year
<Laser_away> so I went all out and got a 160GB ATA drive ;-)
<Ademan> laserjock: you have a blog? haha, i searched for REVU and found your blog
<LaserJock> Ademan: I do yes
<Ademan> anyways, is there any way to snag binary packages off of revu in any way?
<ajmitch> they're not autobuilt
<Ademan> figured
<ajmitch> tiber is not a fast box
<Ademan> where DO packages get built? out of curiosity?
<LaserJock> on my machine
<LaserJock> for REVU
<Ademan> geeze, really? are you just a volunteer LaserJock?
<LaserJock> yes
<LaserJock> that's how we do it
<LaserJock> we build on our own machines
<Ademan> oh, the submitter builds on their machine?
<LaserJock> once it goes into Ubuntu proper it get's sent to the the Ubuntu build farm
<ajmitch> most of us are 'just volunteers'
<LaserJock> Ademan: reviewers too
<Ademan> oh so the packages going into the repositories are built at the "Ubuntu build farm" though?
<Fujitsu> There are no Canonical-employed people who work primarily on universe, are there?
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: no, dholbach works mostly on main now
<LaserJock> nope
<LaserJock> and ogra on Edubuntu
<ajmitch> Ademan: any upload to ubuntu from us is source-only
<Fujitsu> I thought so... :(
<ajmitch> & by any canonical developer too
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: that's the point, that there be community support for it
<ajmitch> debian manages alright
<Ademan> oh ok, i guess i didn't phrase my question, cause when i said "where do packages get built" i meant, the ones that go into the repositories, oh well
<LaserJock> but you were talking about REVU
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: I guess.
<Ademan> yeah sorry, geeze couldn't you read my mind? lol
<TheMuso> ajmitch: But the vast majority of debian's packages have dedicated maintainers.
<ajmitch> TheMuso: sure, and we have teams who maintain things in ubuntu as well
<TheMuso> We are responsible for a large chunk of debian, all 60 odd of us.
<Fujitsu> TheMuso: And there are actually a significant number of active DDs.
<TheMuso> Fujitsu: True that.
<TheMuso> ajmitch: True.
<Fujitsu> TheMuso, a lot of that 60 are main-only, and a lot aren't active.
<TheMuso> Fujitsu: Right.
<LaserJock> anybody know if gparted handles lvm ok?
<Fujitsu> What do you mean by OK?
<LaserJock> I'm just not so great with lvm yet
<LaserJock> I *think* I might have an lvm partition
<Fujitsu> gparted won't destroy it, but you can't use it to adjust it.
<Fujitsu> You think?
<LaserJock> gparted sees an "unknown" partition and under flags it says lvm
<LaserJock> that's the thing
<LaserJock> I don't really remember creating it
<LaserJock> it's not in fstab or mounted
<Fujitsu> Ah, it handles it worse than it did in Dapper... It used to at least show the LVs at separate devices.
<Fujitsu> Are your other partitions there?
<LaserJock> my regular partitions are there
<LaserJock> I don't know if I even have a volume group
<Fujitsu> Try running sudo vgdisplay, and see if it does anything.
<LaserJock> what package is vgdisplay in?
<Fujitsu> lvm2
<Fujitsu> (not installed by default since Edgy, grrr.)
<Fujitsu> Once you've installed that, you'll probably need to run vgscan before vgdisplay will see anything.
<LaserJock> I'm guessing not having lvm installed probably was an issue ;-)
<LaserJock> bah
<LaserJock> something's not right
<LaserJock> maybe it needs a reboot or something
<Fujitsu> It may have installed something in the initramfs, yes.
<Fujitsu> Hey Hobbsee.
<LaserJock> bah, I'll do it when my repo mirroring finishes/dies
<dholbach> good morning
<Fujitsu> Hi dholbach.
<Lure> hi dholbach
<Hobbsee> hi Fujitsu!
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: what do you use for building your repo?
<Lure> dholbach: what is the plan with motu council in regards to new members?
<Hobbsee> morning dholbach 
<Lure> dholbach: am I to go with TB still this week, or is Motu  council fully in charge now?
<dholbach> Lure: the poll will finish on 15th
<dholbach> the MC is not ready yet
<dholbach> hi Hobbsee, hi Fujitsu
<Lure> dholbach: ok
<LaserJock> Hobbsee: reprepo
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: which isnt in the repos?
<LaserJock> it is
<Hobbsee> sarah@LongPointyStick:~$ search reprepo
<Hobbsee> sarah@LongPointyStick:~$    
<Hobbsee> !info reprepo feisty
<ubotu> Package reprepo does not exist in feisty
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: where?
<LaserJock> doh, did I spell it wrong
<LaserJock> reprepro
<Fujitsu> !info reprepro feisty
<ubotu> reprepro: debian package repository producer. In component universe, is extra. Version 1.3.1-1 (feisty), package size 199 kB, installed size 500 kB
<LaserJock> the only thing I hate about it so far is the name
<Hobbsee> ehhe
<TheMuso> Is it at all possible to use/control network manager from the CLI?
<LaserJock> heh, you can get rid of it from CLI ;-)
<Hobbsee> yay, TheMuso hasnt drowned!
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: This weather rocks!!!
<ajmitch> & why would TheMuso have drowned?
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: because it's very wet
<ajmitch> is it slightly wet there?
<ajmitch> that's good
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: as long as you dont have to go out in it, yes :D
<ajmitch> I understand it's been a bit dry :)
<Hobbsee> hehe
<TheMuso> Ok, so what launches network manager?
<TheMuso> Either I can use it in the CLI, or it goes.
<ajmitch> magic
<TheMuso> What???????? dbus?
<ajmitch> yeah
* TheMuso choaks.
<TheMuso> Bah and so does dhcdbd
* TheMuso now has full control of his network devices once again.
<Hobbsee> dholbach: you couldnt just grant us a UVFe for basket now, could you?  (between 1.0rc1 and 1.0 final)  or do i have to file it properly?
<dholbach> there's no UVF yet
<dholbach> not for universe
<dholbach> I thought it was the 22nd?
<dholbach> no?
<Fujitsu> No.
<Fujitsu> 22nd is FF.
<Fujitsu> 8th was UVF.
<dholbach> I thought it was delayed for Univerese.
<Hobbsee> dholbach: it's gone feb 8.  but if you say i can put it thru, then please ack the sync :P
<Hobbsee> dholbach: no, that was only FF, not UVF.  which is kinda silly
<dholbach> Hobbsee: what is the launchpad bug no?
<Hobbsee> dholbach: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/basket/+bug/84678
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 84678 in basket "Please sync basket (universe) from unstable (main)" [Undecided,Confirmed]  
<Hobbsee> dholbach: havent done the diff and all of that yet
<dholbach> gracias
<dholbach> done
<Hobbsee> dholbach: thanks
<Hobbsee> dholbach: does that mean you'll do the same for ksynaptics/libsynaptics?
<Hobbsee> dholbach: i dont think the bug's filed yet
<dholbach> if you have a good reason to update it - we're fairly early in the cycle still
<Hobbsee> dholbach: how about "the current version doesnt work too well"
<dholbach> if you can attach bits of the changelog i'm sure it's going to be alright
<dholbach> I can't say "sure it'll be alright", but i'll sure have look at it
<Hobbsee> dholbach: okay.  will have to wait on the debian bit to update
<dholbach> ok
<dholbach> cool
<Hobbsee> bah.  ksynaptics will need a merge, but libsynaptics is a sync
<Sp4rKy> hi
<Sp4rKy> does ${python:Depends} should add python-gtk2 & python-glade2 to Depends if software needs it ?
<StevenK> Sp4rKy: I doubt it.
<Sp4rKy> k, so i add them 
<Hobbsee> dholbach: ping?
<dholbach> Hobbsee: pong
<Hobbsee> dholbach: can you ack https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libsynaptics/+bug/84681 too please?
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 84681 in libsynaptics "Please sync libsynaptics (universe) from unstable (main)" [Undecided,Confirmed]  
<Hobbsee> dholbach: we work with debian for all this stuff - yay :)
<dholbach> +* rewriting singleton pad class (breaks compability!)     ???
<Hobbsee> dholbach: please ignore hte ubuntu versoin on that changelog - it's a sync.
<Hobbsee> dholbach: means that the new ksynaptics will need to come in too
<dholbach> please take a look at what it breaks there
<dholbach> hm
<dholbach> ok
<dholbach> acked
<dholbach> please refer to the normal process for the other stuff
<dholbach> i'm out for lunch and buying hardware now
<dholbach> see you later
<Hobbsee> dholbach: okay.   FYI, i'ts only ksynaptics that depends on that, which we'll bring in the new versoin.
<Hobbsee> (sorry, was being talked to)
<dholbach> yeah, I checked
<dholbach> it's ok
<fernando> moin all
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: was it you who did the reports on kde, and MOTUscience, with debian/ubuntu packages?
<white> when is the next MOTU meeting btw? i am curious if my suggestion will be discussed
<Hobbsee> white: which suggestion?  :)
<white> (suggestion = automatically writing a mail to everyone who just uploaded a new package to universe which is not in debian if they might want to consider bringing it into debian as well or at least looking at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ContributingToDebian )
<Hobbsee> ahhh
<white> or in other words i do not have to do it semi-manually anymore :)
<tsmithe> Hobbsee, you able to do a revu? (tis for the good cause of ubuntustudio ;) )
<Hobbsee> tsmithe: right now, i'm fighting madison-lite
<tsmithe> hehe ok
<white> Hobbsee: well i am still looking for an answer or do you reckon it is not worth to discuss? :)
<Hobbsee> white: sounds good to me
<Hobbsee> white: but then you have to find an elusive DD, no?
<white> what do you mean?
<Hobbsee> white: as in, it's known that there arent terribly many DD"s around.  at least not around in #ubuntu-motu
<Hobbsee> seems that way, whehter it's true or not, though
<white> if you are looking for a sponsor you can go via #debian-mentors (oftc), debian-mentors@l.d.o. or utnubu-discuss@l.alioth.d.o. (exclusively for MOTUs and ubuntu folks :) )or ask the DDs in this channel if they are around
* white is horrible
<white> at least a horrible cook
<Hobbsee> hehe
<Hobbsee> yes, i'm starting to see that you arent so high and mighty and perfect, and wouldnt come talk to us lowly ubuntu people :P
<StevenK> Hah!
<white> rotfl
<white> Hobbsee: well actually i am just here for you ;)
<white> . o O(i was never good at flirting ...)
<Hobbsee> hehe
<StevenK> white: Don't give up your day job, that's dreadful. :-P
<white> :)
<Hobbsee> hehe
<Hobbsee> white: if you say things like that, then i'll tend to utilise it.  ask StevenK how many packages he uploaded for me before i got MOTU :P
<tsmithe> StevenK is motu eh...
<tsmithe> could he do a revu for me?
<Hobbsee> tsmithe: if you convince him...
<white> Hobbsee: go ahead, i feel like i want to take this challenge
<tsmithe> good good
<tsmithe> StevenK, are you up for a review? as i said to Hobbsee, it's for the great and just cause of UbuntuStudio ;)
<Hobbsee> white: but then i'd have to find something to upload to debian.  and i got beaten, for basket.
<StevenK> Now look what you've done!
<Hobbsee> tsmithe: make white review it :P
* white is wondering what UbuntuStudio is
<tsmithe> http://ubuntustudio.org
<tsmithe> but, erm, it's pretty elusive
<StevenK> tsmithe: Is it on REVU?
<tsmithe> StevenK, yup
<tsmithe> wired ;)
<StevenK> In that case, I'll think about it.
<tsmithe> white, it's just a theme, a tweaked installed, and different packages
<tsmithe> StevenK, that's very definitive of you :P
<tsmithe> thanks
<white> ah so it is like the theme and stuff as you said
<tsmithe> yeah
<white> i thougt it is a music studio 
<tsmithe> and a choice of the lowtency kernel
<tsmithe> hum
<tsmithe> !info ubuntustudio-audio feisty
<tsmithe> eth
<ubotu> ubuntustudio-audio: Ubuntu Studio Audio Package. In component universe, is optional. Version 0.1 (feisty), package size 2 kB, installed size 32 kB
<tsmithe> *etc
<tsmithe> and then there's one for video, graphics
<tsmithe> we're gonna expand in v2, do more cool stuff like tweaking settings, portaudio with jack perhaps
<tsmithe> interesting things
<tsmithe> oh and white, you can help me get my packages into debian!
<StevenK> Shhh, don't tell him a DD
<StevenK> tsmithe: I'd suggest you make friends with http://mentors.debian.net/ for that purpose.
<tsmithe> hehe ok
<white> http://paste.debian.net/21782
<white> if somebody needs to know what the suites in debian are
<white> we just figured that out :)
<StevenK> Bwahaha
<StevenK> There's two states on archive.debian.org, though
<tsmithe> white, hehe
<tsmithe> wooo! cinelerra has finished pulling from bzr... now i can get to work sorting out the licence
<tsmithe> but it's a pita to push
<tsmithe> 483MiB... :(
<StevenK> tsmithe: What's the link to the REVU thing you want me to look at?
<white> tsmithe: yeah if you need anything, just tell me
<white> . o O(i hope this wasn't a mistake)
<Hobbsee> hahaha
<tsmithe> StevenK, http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=4354
<white> tsmithe: and if you ever need sponsoring StevenK is a DD
<tsmithe> white, cool
<tsmithe> StevenK, cool
<StevenK> white: Commonly known as "Don't make me regret this!"
<StevenK> BAH!
<tsmithe> hehe
* StevenK kicks white
* white hides
<tsmithe> StevenK, now your in for it too! mwhaaha
<Hobbsee> white: and you arent?
<white> . o O(i need to get rid of my cloak)
<Hobbsee> tsmithe: i can attack StevenK with my Long Pointy Stick of DOOM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  too, so that's even better
<tsmithe> hehe ok
* StevenK raises an eyebrow
<tsmithe> Hobbsee, you need that  on the lart ;)
<tsmithe> and more !!!!s
<Hobbsee> tsmithe: yes, but i didnt make the lart.
<tsmithe> hehe ok :)
<StevenK> ARGH, you Build-Depend on cvs
<tsmithe> yeah! very argh
<tsmithe> but it dies unless i do
<StevenK> Oh what?
<tsmithe> the "autogen.sh" script that generates configure dies if it can't find cvs
<StevenK> Why does debian/manpage.1 exist?
<tsmithe> as the manpage...
<tsmithe> ?
<StevenK> You'd call it wired.1
<StevenK> And stuff wired.1 into debian/manpages
<tsmithe> hmm ok
<lastnode> Fujitsu, ping please
<tsmithe> i'll update that then
<StevenK> Build-Depending on cvs concerns me
<tsmithe> it concerns me too
* StevenK plays
<tsmithe> but there's not really i can do...
<tsmithe> and debian/manpages just contains one line: wired.1x (as i will rename it)
<tsmithe> right?
<StevenK> Looks fine
<StevenK> Right, autopoint -f is too blame
<StevenK> s/too/to/
<tsmithe> yeah it is
<tsmithe> but i don't really know what to do about it
<StevenK> And you can't depend on Internet access to build, which it currently does.
<tsmithe> i don't even know what that does :S
<StevenK> The Ubuntu buildds, for example, can't access the Internet.
<tsmithe> ok
<tsmithe> but i don't even know if it uses it to do anything internety
<tsmithe> as i said, i'm not sure what it does...
<StevenK> root@liquified:~/wired-0.4# sh -x /usr/bin/autopoint -f >../log 2>&1
<StevenK> root@liquified:~/wired-0.4# grep '+ cvs ' ../log
<StevenK> + cvs -d /tmp/buildd/wired-0.4/tmpcvs3792 init
<StevenK> + cvs checkout -rgettext-0_14_4 archive
<StevenK> BAD
<tsmithe> yes
<tsmithe> that is very very bad
<tsmithe> very very very bad
<tsmithe> hum
<StevenK> I'd daresay hacking autogen.sh to not call autopoint
<tsmithe> StevenK, yeah
<tsmithe> i'll see if i can do a patch
<tsmithe> i'll also poke upstream
<StevenK> ajmitch, siretart, etc: Can you fix it so I can comment on REVU?
<pochu> hey guys, I have a problem with a build and a menu entry: dh_installmenu: Compatibility levels before 4 are deprecated.
<pochu> any idea?
<white> you are using a debhelper compat lever smaller than 4 ?
<white> s/lever/level/
<pochu> white: how can I know that?
<pochu> :)
<white> debian/compat
<white> or debian/rules
<pochu> let me see
<pochu> white: # This is the debhelper compatibility version to use.
<pochu> export DH_COMPAT=3
<pochu> in rules
<Hobbsee> pochu: that'd be it
<pochu> should I change it to 4?
<white> pochu: you might want to remove that line and use debian/compat
<white> and put in 5
<lastnode> Hobbsee, do you have Fujtsu on IM?
<pochu> white: ok, I'm going to try it, ty!
<white> or 4, depends on what you want
<Hobbsee> lastnode: no, sorry :(
<Hobbsee> lastnode: i'd imagine he's gone to bed though - it's a school night
<StevenK> Heh
<white> . o O(good that small students like me are still on holidays)
<pochu> white: why it depends? I want to fix a menu entry
<white> pochu: the compat lever is important for debhelper's behaviour
<white> s/lever/level/
<Hobbsee> white: how old are you?
<white> *narf*
<white> Hobbsee: 20
<Hobbsee> white: bah.  oldie :P
<white> you?
<pochu> white: there would be any problem if I put 5?
<lastnode> Hobbsee, i see, i keep missing him. damn timezones
<white> pochu: then you use latest compat level and can use the current features of debhelper and stuff
<Hobbsee> white: 18
<white> jeffey
<pochu> Hobbsee: as me ;)
<pochu> white: thanks :)
<white> no worries
* Nafallo feels old
* StevenK does too
* Hobbsee steals StevenK's walking stick
* Hobbsee steals Nafallo's walking stick too
* StevenK falls in a heap
* Hobbsee picks StevenK up, and duct tapes him to his chair
<white> Hobbsee: where abouts are you located?
<StevenK> Hah
<Hobbsee> white: sydney, australia
<Hobbsee> white: close enough to be able to thump StevenK if he doesnt do what i want, you know?  :P
<white> Hobbsee: come over here to Melb :)
* StevenK doesn't take orders from no-one. Uh, sir
<white> . o O(more keysigning ...)
<Hobbsee> StevenK: much.
<tsmithe> bah
<tsmithe> aussies
<Hobbsee> StevenK: even if they carry a Long Pointy Stick of DOOM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ?
<Nafallo> hmm
<white> tsmithe: i am certainly not
<StevenK> Hobbsee: Heh
<tsmithe> :)
<Nafallo> eskilstuna, sweden...
* tsmithe is in the UK
<StevenK> white: You just happen to be in Melbourne?
<white> yes, i am an international student
<StevenK> We won't hold that against yuou
<StevenK> s/yuou/you/
<white> rotfl
<tsmithe> wooo!
<Hobbsee> StevenK: which?  the fact that he's in melbourne, not sydney, or an international student?
* tsmithe is happy cos he can fix the autopoint problem
<white> first of all Melbourne rocks
<tsmithe> why does autopoint even exist when /usr/share/gettext/archive.tar.gz does?!
<white> second point is that the aussies love internationals
<StevenK> Hobbsee: The latter
<Hobbsee> ah
<StevenK> tsmithe: Because /usr/share/gettext/archive.tar.gz might, heaven forbid, be out of date.
<StevenK> Hence the update from CVS.
<tsmithe> that's crazy :P
<StevenK> Just like the rest of autotools
<tsmithe> hehe ok
<white> you are just all jealous cos i have my super cow international power
<Hobbsee> white: that depends on where you're originally from, of course
<white> well start to tell me from where it is good?
* Hobbsee shrugs
<tsmithe> hmm
<white> hehe ... i am fully listening
* StevenK uses his leet DD skills and finds out
<white> bah
* white hurries to change settings
<tsmithe> how do i use archive.tar.gz? all the files have `,v` appended to their filenames...
<StevenK> That's because it's under RCS control
<tsmithe> but, but,...
<tsmithe> sooo... how do i fix it?
<white> well debian ldap does not have any natioanlity field
* tsmithe looks at what autopoint does
<white> s/natioanlity/nationality/
<StevenK> No, but I've made a guess.
<white> bah yeah you can find it out
<white> well let Hobbsee guess a bit :)
<StevenK> Does your Jabber ID lie?
<white> i can't use my jabber here, but yes my jabber id tells you about my nationality
<StevenK> Right.
* StevenK waits for Hobbsee to guess, too.
* Hobbsee isnt guessing.
* tsmithe leaves
<white> :(
<white> so how do i sound like?
<white> well actually i do not use my voice here at all ... 
<StevenK> Like text, duh.
<Hobbsee> white: well, the ISP is german
<white> ?
<white> you mean user.skolelinux.no ?
<Hobbsee> btw, you have a LP page.  https://launchpad.net/~steffen-joeris
<Hobbsee> steffen.joeris@skolelinux.de
<Hobbsee> sorry, yoru email is
<white> damn my mails ...
<StevenK> Hah
<white> Hobbsee: yes i do have a LP page, cos i wanted to look things up ...
<Hobbsee> ditto jabber, blog...
<StevenK> Hobbsee: Nicely done, I did the same thing with db.debian.org
<white> bah bad google
<Hobbsee> hehe
<StevenK> Actually, I think you have stuff in Debian with that e-mail
<white> stratus: hi, i was just told that my mails are marked as spam, can you maybe check that?
<StevenK> Yup, you o.
<StevenK> s/ o/ do/
<white> stratus: nion pointed me to you
<white> right i did not reupload all of my packages so far
<StevenK> Most of them appear to be skolelinux.de, actually
<white> well they did not need an upload
<white> or maybe i was too lazy
<white> stratus: bah just forget about it, i somehow mixed things up, sorry
<white> Hobbsee: so you still have to say if that is any good or not
<Hobbsee> white: hrm?
* Hobbsee is very sleepy
<white> 14:23 < Hobbsee> white: that depends on where you're originally from, of course
<white> . o O(the time might be a bit confusing)
<Hobbsee> white: yes, i got it.  but i never found otu where you were from, although apparently nto germany
<Hobbsee> oh wait.
<Hobbsee> .no, presumably?
* white gives up
<Hobbsee> smart.  i'm half asleep
<white> go to bed, we continue that tomorrow ;)
<esaym> Anyone have any tips for installing amule on dapper from the backports?
<esaym> I've never installed from the backports befors
<gpocentek> !backports
<ubotu> If new updated Ubuntu packages are built for an application, then they go into Ubuntu Backports. See https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuBackports
<Q-FUNK> hmm... not quite
<Q-FUNK> heh
* LongPointyStick DOOMS white 
* LongPointyStick DOOMS Q-FUNK too.
<Q-FUNK> hm.  where did Hobbsee go?
* Nafallo wishes LongPointyStick could come and DOOM the workers who've been drilling all day :-/
<Q-FUNK> and doom the homeland security too.
<Q-FUNK> while you're at it, dig out your Dubya-like voodoo doll and make it suffer a painful death.
<esaym> ok so to get a backported package I just download the deb file and install it and run apt-get -f update?
<gpocentek> esaym: that's a question for #ubuntu
<esaym> oh sorry
<bddebian> Heya gang
<Q-FUNK> heya
<Q-FUNK> (and greetings from a jetlagged Q-F in Cannuckistan)
<bddebian> Heh
<geser> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Heya geser
<AnAnt> bddebian: thanks for reviewing zekr
<white> zekr?
<white> that sounds like an illness (no offense)
<bddebian> white: :-)
<bddebian> AnAnt: NP
<AnAnt> white: nope, a software
<white> AnAnt: if you are the author, please excude i did not want to offend you
<white> s/excude/excuse/
<white> LongPointyStick: bad Hobbsee
<tsmithe> bddebian, sorry to be so mean, but could you... wait.. no - i need to update it first.
<tsmithe> :)
* tsmithe detests autopoint
<AnAnt> where's LaserJock ?
<bigon> Could someone review bug 84732, it's a SRU?
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 84732 in python-pam "SRU: python-pam contains no binaries (edgy)" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/84732
<jdong> How does one resolve a symlink in a shellscript?
<jdong> i.e. I have a symlink /path/foolink and want to know where it points to.
<Nafallo> jdong: readlink
<jdong> Nafallo: thanks!
<jdong> that's exactly what I need
<sistpoty> hi folks
<_ion> Hi
* ..[topic/#ubuntu-motu:sistpoty] : to: Ubuntu Masters of the Universe: Universe Repository Maintainers | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Documentation | Add yourself to http://tinyurl.com/fgpgy to upload to REVU | Check these packages for syncs/merges: http://ajmitch.net.nz/~ajmitch/missing-fixes-rc.html
<sistpoty> hi _ion
<geser> Hi sistpoty
<sistpoty> hi geser
<bddebian> Heya sistpoty
<sistpoty> hi bddebian
<pl0pix> why does a pythons based package, which builds and runs under debian sid fail to run on a ubuntu edgy box? Msg: ImportError: No module named... 
<pl0pix> why dosn't edgy's default python version 2.4 read packages python modules from /usr/share/python-support/<package-name>/ ?
<imbrandon> heya bddebian sistpoty Nafallo jdong etc etc etc
<jdong> :)
<jdong> good mass ping :)
<imbrandon> lol
<Nafallo> hi imbrandon :-)
<imbrandon> mass >5
<imbrandon> heh
<bddebian> Hi imbrandon
<jwhitlark> hi imbrandon :-D
<imbrandon> hey hey jwhitlark , long time
<imbrandon> hows it been going in cali
<jdong> mass > 5 except in the case of Rosie O'Donnell
<jdong> in which cases it's much bigger
<imbrandon> ouch
<imbrandon> you watch too much daytime tv
<imbrandon> ;)
<jdong> ;-)
<jdong> I actually don't
<jdong> I actually don't have a TV right now
<jdong> should've brought my 32" LCD
<jdong> didn't think my dorm would be big enough
<jdong> but boy was I wrong
<jdong> empty space everywhere
<imbrandon> heh i have a 22in lcd monitor, and a few crt's 19 21 and 17 but only a 13 in TV
<imbrandon> lol
<imbrandon> i dont watch much tv
* jdong doesn't either
<imbrandon> or if i do its on the computer
<jdong> he may or may not torrent Family Guy and Office, depending on if MIT IS&T is listening in on this conversation.
<jdong> ;-)
<jdong> well, off to Calc
<jdong> have fun everyone
<jdong> someone please figure out for me why avidemux is weirdly FTBFS
* jdong doesn't have many brain cells left to figure that out
<jwhitlark> hey imbrandon,  I've been sooo slammed..  Was hoping to see you at SCALE this weekend, but I guess you couldn't make it.  jono thought you were going to show, but...
<imbrandon> yea i was definately trying , but i dident make it
<imbrandon> i told seele and jono i probably would but work happened
<jwhitlark> heh, that never happens to me.:-!
<imbrandon> the next time i "plan" on getting out is to ubuntu live in portland
<imbrandon> but something else wiill probably catch my eye before then
<imbrandon> ;)
<jwhitlark> hmm.  I'm not sure if I'm going to that one.  I've got pycon in a week, and I'll be 8 days there, not sure if my boss will let me go to another.  And I want to try to get to UDS in Spain...
<jwhitlark> Do we know where in spain it will be?
<imbrandon> not yet iirc
<imbrandon> but i'll be going top that too
<imbrandon> s/top/to
<imbrandon> where is pycon? google?
<jwhitlark> Dallas.
<imbrandon> ahh
<jwhitlark> 1 day of tutorials, 3 days of talks, 4 days of sprints.  I think I'll be sprinting on trac.
<imbrandon> thats only a few hours from here , i might try to take a day trip or something one of the days
<imbrandon> dallas is aobut 7 hours if i rember right from here
<jwhitlark> that'd be tight.  It's a good conf.  
<imbrandon> somewhere close to that
<jwhitlark> let me know, and we'll set you up with a room share, if you like.
<imbrandon> kk cool
<imbrandon> i still have your number in my old cell i think
<imbrandon> if not i'll hit you up before then
<imbrandon> if my old cell is charged up LOL
<imbrandon> hum hum hum, man yea now i'm wishing i would have went to SCALE
<imbrandon> did you catch seele's talk ? i heard it was good
<jwhitlark> k.  I've been off irc lately, but I'm back.  I had weird stuff happening around the holidays, my wife had a friend over from Turkey, and we bought her a new car, ...
<jwhitlark> seele's
<jwhitlark> ?
<imbrandon> ummm celeste at UDS
<imbrandon> seele == irc name
<imbrandon> http://weblog.obso1337.org/2007/more-on-the-scale-women-in-oss-mini-conf/
<jwhitlark> thanks, just a sec.
<imbrandon> KDE useability person
<jwhitlark> ah, she was in the mini-conf. on friday.  I flew down on Sat. morn.  (wayyyy to early)  so no.
<jwhitlark> s/to/too/
<imbrandon> ahh
<imbrandon> yea
<jwhitlark> Funniest part was when the Xen source was giving a presentation on a XP laptop, and while he was in powerpoint, outlook crashed and popped up a huge error msg on the screen.  O:-)  Of course, we didn't boo, jeer, and laugh.
<imbrandon> hahahah rock on
<imbrandon> yea actualy that was one of the big reasons i wanted to go is see the XEN guys
<imbrandon> but they will be at Ubuntu Live / OSCON
<imbrandon> see i just need a job like jono and get paid to come to conf's ;)
<jwhitlark> It was a good overview of the architecture of Xen.
<jwhitlark> me too.
<zul> imbrandon: or get a sugar mommy
<imbrandon> zul, hahah exactly
<imbrandon> zul, you gonna try to make it to portland? not many people i have talked to are
<jwhitlark> my work doesn't force me to take vacation for conferences, but I'm on call during them, and I have to pay my own way.
<zul> immwhen is portland again?
<imbrandon> jwhitlark, same here, i get all the time off i want and a small ( not normal ) ammount of pay IF they are intrested in the conf
<imbrandon> zul, july
<imbrandon> 22-26 or some such 
<imbrandon> www.ubuntulive.com , its piggybacking OSCON
<zul> imbrandon: nope ill be taking 3 weeks off in march or my wife would kill me
<jwhitlark> man, I so want to go to oscon, not sure I can afford it...
<imbrandon> ahh 22-24 not 26
<asimon> Hello, lintian will report an outdated-autotools-helper-file error for cdbs packages, even through the package depends on autotools-dev and cdbs will update the obsolete config-guess file automatically. Is this right?
<imbrandon> jwhitlark, thats why ubuntu live is at the same time same place
<imbrandon> less cost
<zul> imbrandon: besides the baby is going to be in hospital during my "vacation"
<imbrandon> ahhh
<imbrandon> dosent sound good
<zul> could be worse
<imbrandon> hum
<jwhitlark> hope everything goes well.
<imbrandon> i need to reload my mac today , osx + linux or linux only? ( that rehtorical )
<zul> it should..
<jwhitlark> good.  keep us posted.
<imbrandon> how was herding cats ?
<imbrandon> man where is whiprush when you need him
<jwhitlark> have you seen the version online?
<imbrandon> not yet, been busy busy busy at work
<imbrandon> today starts my 4 days off 
<imbrandon> so i'll probably check it out
<jwhitlark> he said he changed it only a little, so I saw something else.
<jwhitlark> it's good.
<jwhitlark> do ya know if feisty herd 3 is stable enough to use for day to day?
<imbrandon> i still am trying to convince him for a LugRadio LIVE in the USA
<imbrandon> jwhitlark, i am using it day to day, there are some quarks but its ok if you are already use to ubuntu
<imbrandon> i wouldent recomend a newb using it
<imbrandon> Tonio_ and Riddell have done some amazing stuff on the KDE side this time , making things much more intergrated and such
<jwhitlark> that would be cool.  LugRadio rocks.
<imbrandon> everythging kinda flows now
<ajmitch> morning
<jwhitlark> I'm going to install and test today, but wasn't sure if I should point it at my home dir, or just do a standalone install with a separate home dir.
<jwhitlark> sounds like there's not any show stoppers.
<imbrandon> i would defiantly backup your ~/ but should be fine
<jwhitlark> k.
<jwhitlark> jono said boot flies now.
<jwhitlark> ajmitch, morning
<imbrandon> beryl is kinda unstable on it, but i dunno if thats feisty or beryl itsself
<imbrandon> yea boot and shitdown both fly
<imbrandon> shutdown*
<jwhitlark> beryl?, unstable?? Noooo.....
<imbrandon> lol
<imbrandon> leaste now when it crashes it falls back to kwin
<imbrandon> thats nice
<imbrandon> heya ajmitch 
<jwhitlark> I've really gotten used to beryl, though.  makes vdesktops intuitive for me.
<imbrandon> yea there are somethings i almost cant do without now, but overall i turn most of it off
<imbrandon> and it helps when i woo and ahh the vista moonites at work with it
<imbrandon> ;)
<jwhitlark> yup.  very nice when you turn off the pointless stuff.
<jwhitlark> oops.  time for our weekly meeting. catch ya'll in 3 hours :-[
<imbrandon> l8tr
<dholbach> if you didn't vote yet, vote: http://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-dev/+polls
<dholbach> good night
* ajmitch should probably vote for the motu council
<ajmitch> or at least check if I put in a vote for everyone :)
<bluefoxicy> Is there a debian whatever recind software packaging notice for amap?
<bluefoxicy> it's not in feisty's repos anymore.
<bluefoxicy> (I wish nmap would just eat amap)
<crimsun> http://packages.qa.debian.org/a/amap/news/20060214T220807Z.html
<bluefoxicy> thanks
<ajmitch> hello crimsun 
<bluefoxicy> oh, gpl with subclauses
<bluefoxicy> didn't know that.
<bluefoxicy> crimsun:  that's dumb
<bluefoxicy> it's non-free but they pulled it completely
<ajmitch> complain to debian, we can't fix it for them here
<bluefoxicy> Yes I know, but it's debian
<bluefoxicy> last time I asked a question in #debian I got banned for 2 years
<ajmitch> I wonder why
<bluefoxicy> because I was running mandrake and trying to figure out how some random command worked on debian but didn't have it in front of me probably.
<zul> bluefoxicy: i think that was a rhetorical question :)
<bluefoxicy> zul:  Usually when people ask me rhetorical questions, they're followed up by, "Oh, ok, my fault for asking"
<bluefoxicy> for example, "Why do you keep talking about Josh?" can end in something very graphic
<ajmitch> I think we'd just tune you out
<ajmitch> or kick you, whichever is more effective at the time
<bluefoxicy> XD
<bluefoxicy> ajmitch:  I've actually had someone threaten to kill me, and then ban me from life
<ajmitch> I can understand that
<bluefoxicy> anyway I have class
<rmjb> Hey guys
<rmjb> apt-get update on feisty and now I can't install anything
<_ion> Perhaps it's just a temporary problem with your mirror.
<rmjb> maybe... I'll check back later
* rmjb suspends feisty vm
<Burgwork> ajmitch: they are clammering for your blood on sounder
* Laser_away goes to look
<ajmitch> huh?
<Burgwork> ajmitch: they want your network auth client
<ajmitch> oh well
<bddebian> heh
<ajmitch> Burgwork: it may make it into the archive in a month or two :)
<Burgwork> ajmitch: right
* Burgwork whips ajmitch :)
<ajmitch> don't whip me
<ajmitch> I can't push it any harder
<_ion> Network auth client?
<Burgwork> _ion: making it easy to connect Ubuntu to LDAP servers
<_ion> Wow, sounds great
<ajmitch> just some stuff to screw up config files
<_ion> Although i find configuring the actual server more annoying than configuring the clients. :-)
<Burgwork> yes, but you only have to do the server once or twice, usually
<_ion> True.
<Fujitsu> Hey LaserJock.
<LaserJock> morning
<bddebian> Heya LaserJock
<rmjb> my isp's dns server isn't responding :(
<rmjb> anyone has an ip of a dns server I can use?
<sistpoty> hi folks
<rmjb> hey sistpoty
<sistpoty> hi rmjb
<bddebian> Hi sistpoty
<sistpoty> hi bddebian
<rmjb> bddebian: I didn't backport the world, I upgraded
<bddebian> rmjb: Good man :-)
<rmjb> can I have your dns server ip?
<crimsun> 208.67.222.222 208.67.220.220
<rmjb> thanks much
<bddebian> Just grab some root level dns servers ;-P
<crimsun> disclosure: that's provided by opendns.
<rmjb> that'll work for me :)
<_ion> I have my own DNS server i use from my network.
<rmjb> me too... but it's dnsmasq, so it needs an upstream dns server to work
<LaserJock> wahoo, Seville
<ajmitch> LaserJock: you just heard?
<LaserJock> not exactly, but I had to say it
<ajmitch> haha
<ajmitch> I hope you have a good time there :)
<LaserJock> it'll be tricky
<LaserJock> my brother is getting married May 12th
<bddebian> ??
<ajmitch> and it starts when?
<sistpoty> gah... and I guess I'll still be programming on my thesis :(
<LaserJock> UDS ends on the 11th
<ajmitch> sistpoty: that's annoying
<LaserJock> I think I might have to cut out early again
<ajmitch> LaserJock: ah, cutting it close
<LaserJock> I guess I really shouldn't go at all
<ajmitch> why?
<LaserJock> I've got a lot to do here, and these UDSs suck me in too much ;-)
<ajmitch> heh
<ajmitch> that's ok, I don't plan to go
<LaserJock> that's too bad
* ajmitch shrugs
<ajmitch> won't make much difference really
<LaserJock> we need uber MOTU support
<ajmitch> I'm sure 1 or 2 MOTUs may be sponsored
<ajmitch> but not me
<bddebian> not me
<ajmitch> lies
<imbrandon> Seville?
<Burgwork> LaserJock: seville?
<imbrandon> heya ajmitch LaserJock Burgwork 
<LaserJock> did I spell it wrong?
<sistpoty> hi imbrandon
<Burgwork> no
<imbrandon> heya sistpoty 
<Burgwork> LaserJock: where is the announcement?
<LaserJock> users-announce
<sistpoty> Burgwork: on ubuntu-announce
<ajmitch> hey LaserJock 
<ajmitch> they only just announced today?
<bddebian> Later gang
<LaserJock> not, sure
<imbrandon> i guess so i havent seen it yet
<tsmithe> bddebian, bye
<LaserJock> cya bddebian 
<sistpoty> later bddebian
<imbrandon> but i havent checked my mail today yet either
<LaserJock> I uh, found out by other means
<ajmitch> LaserJock: well it's been known in edubuntu circles for a little while :)
<ajmitch> & it was on the wiki several days ago
<LaserJock> yeah
<Lutin> hay there
<sistpoty> hi Lutin
<Lutin> hi sistpoty 
<LaserJock> that's why I'm suprised Burgwork didn't see it
<Burgwork> LaserJock: I was majorly busy this weekend with other things
<Lutin> a little question about debian/copyright .. if I have several files licensed under GPL, but one is (C) 2006 and the other (C) 2005, do I need to separate them in debian/copyright
<sistpoty> Lutin: being verbose is never wrong ;)
<LaserJock> but is often not fun ;-)
<Lutin> sistpoty: I'm packaging mlt, and a grep -Rin copyright | wc -l returns about 310 lines. sounds important for me ;)
<ajmitch> hello Hobbsee 
<LaserJock> sistpoty: you're assigning bugs to sabdfl?
<ajmitch> LaserJock: sure, sabdfl can fix all bugs
<sistpoty> LaserJock: erm... look at the bug ;)
<ajmitch> bug 83348
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 83348 in gnome-app-install "Need more applications" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/83348
<Lutin> sistpoty: is it required, or just a 'could be good' thing ?
<sistpoty> Lutin: if it's all from the same authors, it's imo not required, though I'm no copyright guru
<Hobbsee> hey ajmitch!
<sistpoty> hi Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> hey sistpoty!
<Fujitsu> Hey Hobbsee.
<Hobbsee> sistpoty: StevenK was asking to be added to the reviewers group, if no one else picked that up please - on REVU
<Hobbsee> hey Fujitsu!
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: lastnode was looking for you yesterday
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: does he deserve it?
<Lutin> sistpoty: ok
<sistpoty> Hobbsee: will be fixed in a minute ;)
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: he's a MOTU and a DD.  on that basis, no :P
<LaserJock> maybe we should have a 3 week vote on it ;-)
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: haha
<Hobbsee> yay, UDS is announced :)
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: done anyway
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: cool, thanks
<Hobbsee> now we can make him review more :P
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: I'm a MOTU & DD, and I don't deserve it
<LaserJock> bah
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: you forgot core.  heh
<ajmitch> that doesn't matter
<LaserJock> when did ajmitch turn into bddebian? scary
<sistpoty> ajmitch: ah, cool then I don't need to mangle the db... strange enough I never use the scripts siretart and /me wrote once for this purpose
<sistpoty> hehe
<Lutin> sistpoty: btw, don't really know what to do with bug 77977 ://
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 77977 in evolution-jescs "[SRU] [ftbfs]  typo in evolution-jescs-2.8.2/debian/rules" [Medium,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/77977
<ajmitch> sistpoty: it's quicker to use the script as long as I ignore the usage warning that lies ;)
<ajmitch>   -l LEVEL, --level=LEVEL
<ajmitch>                         0 = contributor, 1 = reviewer, 2 = admin
<ajmitch> of course you can't pass 0,1 or 2
<ajmitch> but you have to spell out the level
<Fujitsu> Hobbsee: I do read my scrollback when I've been pinged :)
<Fujitsu> (I think I know what it was about, though)
<ajmitch> LaserJock: I'm not bddebian
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: cool :P
<ajmitch> LaserJock: bddebian actually does stuff :)
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: just checking
* Fujitsu grumps about the lack of encryption support in the Ubuntu installers.
<sistpoty> Lutin: for the evolution-jesc bug, it would be good if you did some bug triage...
<Hobbsee> white: presumably you've seen The next motu-meeting will be on Wednesday, Feb 14th, 10.00h UTC.?
<sistpoty> Lutin: just try to figure what difference kdm has than you... maybe that might give some clue what goes wrong
* Fujitsu will probably be about 30 minutes late to the meeting, due to TAFE.
* ajmitch might try & make it to the meeting
<Fujitsu> (it'll probably be finished by the time I get there, of course)
<ajmitch> depends on what people want to argue about
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: what is it in local time?
<Lutin> sistpoty: ok, thanks
<Fujitsu> 1000+1100 = 2100, Hobbsee.
<LaserJock> 2:00am here
<Hobbsee> nice
<Hobbsee> so tomorrow night, hrmmm
<ajmitch> yes
<ajmitch> means I'll have to stay up late
<sistpoty> Lutin: I'd prefer it if I had the info if the new bug was caused by the update (bad) or is an entirely different issue (than we could do the update anyways) 
* sistpoty will have to get up early for the meeting *g*
<Adri2000> sistpoty: early = 11am? :p
<sistpoty> Adri2000: before noon == early for me :P
<Hobbsee> that's my form of early
<Adri2000> heh
<ajmitch> back later
<sistpoty> later ajmitch
#ubuntu-motu 2007-02-13
<cbx33> hey guys, which pacakge contains the gthread libs?
<crimsun> libglib2.0-dev
<cbx33> thanks crimsun 
<cbx33> did i hear you're pacakging up ardour2?
<crimsun> I don't know; did you? :)
<cbx33> hehe ithought I did
* cbx33 is compiling it now
<cbx33> did it earlier at work too
<cbx33> someone said there were some problems with it though
<crimsun> cbx33: what sort?
<cbx33> i don;t know, someone said it was proving tricky
<cbx33> to pacakge
<crimsun> well, yes, it's a PitA.
<cbx33> what's the problem with it?
<cbx33> if you have time to tell me
<cbx33> I'm curious
<cbx33> is it scons?
<crimsun> nope
<crimsun> meaning, scons is the manageable portion
<cbx33> heh
<cbx33> what's it's problem?
<crimsun> upgrading cleanly
<_MMA_> crimsun: From Ardour1 to Ardour2?
<crimsun> yes, so I'm debating making it parallel installable
<_MMA_> I would think people would want to install them along side each other.
<_MMA_> Ardour 1 sessions dont work the same in Ardour2.
<_MMA_> So I could see people wanting both.
<crimsun> yes, so I get to have fun with install paths.
<crimsun> back to LP for me
<cbx33> hmm
<cbx33> yeh parallel makes sense
<cbx33> I'd not want an upgrade
<_MMA_> I assumed that was the plan. I shoulda asked. :)
<cbx33> heh
<cbx33> hi _MMA_ 
* _MMA_ waves.
<cbx33> ok with the lowlatency kernel
<cbx33> if i try to run jack in realtime mode it dies
<cbx33> is that normal
<cbx33> but if i run without....the load is AWFUL
<_MMA_> I think you have to edit your limits.conf
<crimsun> /etc/security/limits.conf
<_MMA_> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuStudioPreparation
<cbx33> thanks
<_MMA_> I hope we can patch that at some point.
<cbx33> hmmm still dying
<_MMA_> cbx33: I know Ive had it working. Just cant remember how atm.
<_MMA_> I had it working at one point without touching anything.
<_MMA_> Lately it doesnt work though. :(
<cbx33> yeh i had it working
<crimsun> have you found the bug on LP and added your debug info?
<_MMA_> cbx33: Are you starting JACK thought qjackctl?
<cbx33> _MMA_, yes
<_MMA_> cbx33: PM
<cbx33> ok ardour is now working ;)
<cbx33> compiled fine
<cbx33> just need to get jack goign now
<pete> nice
<pete> jack's working
<pete> needed to login and out again
<ajmitch> hi pete :)
* crimsun punches cbx33 with a permissions popup bubble
<cbx33> hey ajmitch 
<cbx33> sorry crimsun 
<ogra> heh, pete incognito
<cbx33> hey ogra 
<cbx33> howz it going
<cbx33> I'll be fixing up TCM later this week
<ogra> me too 
<cbx33> nice
<cbx33> well....
<cbx33> shall I wait till you're done
<LaserJock> hi cbx33 
<cbx33> cos I'll need to hack up all my bits when you're finished
<cbx33> hey LaserJock 
* cbx33 has been fiddling with opengl the past few days
<cbx33> crimsun, do you mean the bug with qjackctl where it often doesn't have a taskbar bit?
<ogra> cbx33, i will fix the vnc side of ltsp ... dont wait on me 
<cbx33> ogra, ok dude
<cbx33> howz it going anyway?
<crimsun> cbx33: too many bugs to track
<cbx33> in qjackctl
<cbx33> or in general?
<crimsun> the latter.
<TheMuso> cbx33: Do you mean qjackctl not being accessible via alt-tab when switching between apps?
<ogra> well, doing the last urgent upoads for herd4 preparation ... i'm terribly tired but have to wait for a metapackage update to come down the drain
<cbx33> TheMuso, yup, can't alt+tab
<cbx33> and can't see it in the taskbar
<TheMuso> cbx33: Thats really annoying.
<cbx33> TheMuso, yes
<cbx33> damn annoying
<cbx33> and turning on the panel applet icon seemed to cause A LOT of problems
<TheMuso> right
* TheMuso reckons a few of us should create a GTK jack control program.
<cbx33> yeh me too
<_MMA_> lol
<_MMA_> I plan on having a bounty for it. ;)
<crimsun> just make the qjackctl source to generate another binary
<LaserJock> me thinks you all should just rip the sound cards out of your computers and be done with it ;-)
<_MMA_> Hopefully someone bites.
<_MMA_> :)
* cbx33 pokes LaserJock 
<cbx33> :p
<crimsun> he's just jealous because he's deaf
<cbx33> heheh
* cbx33 writes gtk apps
<LaserJock> tbh, I'm never in an enviroment where I can listen to sound much
<_MMA_> cbx33: Using what?
<TheMuso> cbx33: Yeah we could probably just separate the backend and write a new frontend.
<cbx33> yeh
<cbx33> python mainly
<LaserJock> what no php-gtk? :-)
<cbx33> yuk
<_ion> eww
<_MMA_> cbx33: Lets take this to #ubuntustudio.
* LaserJock sends subliminal messages to #ubuntustudio, "Remove your soundcard and all will be well"
<LaserJock> and grabs $20 from crimsun's hand
<_MMA_> lol
<_MMA_> Go listen to your Belle and Sebastian CD.
<_MMA_> :)
<Lutin> heya freeflying :)
<freeflying> Lutin: hi
<Lutin> how are you ?
<freeflying> preparing for the coming chinese traditional spring festival
<ajmitch> Burgwork: I guess mdz didn't know that authtool is bitrotting in NEW :)
* ajmitch is not subscribed to sounder so can't really reply right now
<LaserJock> ajmitch: like he didn't know the Ubuntu Packaging Guide existed ;-)
<ajmitch> heh
<ajmitch> if I'm lucky it'll get accepted through NEW before release
<LaserJock> is it in binary NEW?
<ajmitch> nope
<ajmitch> still source NEW
<ajmitch> of course I was in a slight rush before FF, so I expect I'll have to revise it a couple of times before it'll get accepted
<ajmitch> so maybe feisty+2
<LaserJock> :-)
<LaserJock> I don't know if I'll be even around for feisty+2
<TheMuso> LaserJock: Sure you will. :)
<LaserJock> once I graduate I'll probably be gone :/
<_ion> Gone?
<sistpoty> LaserJock: just don't graduate :P
<LaserJock> heh
<LaserJock> I've been at uni 9 years
<tritium> LaserJock: judging from my experience, I'd agree that you'll find little time.
<LaserJock> sometimes you gjust gotta graduate
<LaserJock> tritium!!
<tritium> HI LaserJock :)
<sistpoty> LaserJock: hm... 8 years for me I guess *g*
<sistpoty> (though I stopped counting)
<LaserJock> I'd stop too if people didn't keep asking me ;-)
<LaserJock> tritium: how have you been?
<sistpoty> t'was quite embarassing when I registered my thesis and didn't know in which term I was *g*
<tritium> LaserJock: fine, thanks.  Busy, of course.  You?
<_ion> sistpoty: Hehe
<LaserJock> sistpoty: lol
<LaserJock> tritium: really busy, as always
<tritium> I can imagine.
<LaserJock> tritium: I had a postdoc inquiry from a guy at Sandia (Livermore) at a conference a couple weeks ago
<ajmitch> hey tritium 
<tritium> LaserJock: Any follow up?
<tritium> hi ajmitch 
<LaserJock> research has been slow. partly my fault (too much Ubuntu) and partly collaborators taking forever
<LaserJock> tritium: not yet, need to get a paper or 2 out
<tritium> LaserJock: that would be rather cool if that works out.
<LaserJock> I'm not crazy for Livermore, but the pay's good
<tritium> I'm out there quite regularly.
<LaserJock> to the combustion research lab?
<bddebian> Heya
<tritium> bddebian: :)
<sistpoty> wb bddebian
<tritium> LaserJock: oh, no, not ther.
<bddebian> tritium: !
<tritium> there
<bddebian> Heya sistpoty
<tritium> LaserJock: inside the gate
<LaserJock> tritium: I visited the combustion research facility once
<LaserJock> it was nice, lots of good equipment
<tritium> LaserJock: cool.
<tritium> Yeah, I can imagine.  I've toured it once, but I don't remember much.
<sistpoty> gn8 everyone
<LaserJock> man, my reprepro mirroring is still going
<ajmitch> hm
<ajmitch> I really wonder how /usr/local is mounted at the moment
<ajmitch> everything *seems* to be there
<ajmitch> but /dev/md1 is marked as inactive
<LaserJock> md1? what kind of device is that?
<ajmitch> raid 0
<ajmitch> so it needs all 3 disks to be active
<jdong> anyone feel it's their calling to answer a stupid Python question?
<jdong> ;-)
<jdong> I might allow a lease of my soul to that person for some time
<jdong> or maybe just a restricted shell account on my soul
<ajmitch> depends on how stupid it is
<jdong> what would be a good test for determining if a variable is of a numeric type?
<jdong> (i.e. float, int, etc)
<jdong> i.e. not a sequence
<RAOF> (isinstance(variable, float) or isinstance(variable, int)) ?
<jdong> that seems awkward though
<jdong> to list every numeric type
<RAOF> Yeah.
<jdong> (float,int,complex,long)
<RAOF> Anything else is going to be a bit indirect, though?
<jdong> I was hoping for a function that tested it
<jdong> well, conversely, how would you test if something is a sequence?
<jdong> well, I guess if len() doesn't bork with an exception
<RAOF> That'll work :)
<jdong> wait, no that way wouldn't work
<jdong> because I'd get infinite recursion with strings
<RAOF> Why?
<jdong> all terms of a string are sequences
<jdong> 'a'[0]  = 'a' which_is sequence
* Hobbsee waves
<RAOF> Obviously there's some context here.
<jdong> >>> 'a'[0] [0] [0] [0] [0] [0] 
<jdong> 'a'
<jdong> recursive algorithm
<RAOF> Oooooh, you want to unpack a sequence into atoms, right?
<jdong> for adding up all the elements of an arbitrary dimension (nested) list
<jdong> i.e. simple: [[1,2] ,[3,4] ] 
<RAOF> I've got some code lying around which does that.
<RAOF> Let me drag it up :)
<jdong> more complicated: [[[[[[1] ] ] ] ] ,2,[3] ,4] 
<jdong> write a function that's able to sum up any such list :)
<jdong> i.e. sum of those previous two examples should return 10
<jdong> should *both* return 10 I should say
<_ion> If python had been object-oriented from the beginning, int, float etc. would have a common superclass.
<jdong> _ion: but do they?
<RAOF> Yes, but it's "object" :)
<jdong> class int(object)
<jdong>  |  int(x[, base] ) -> integer
<jdong> pfft
<jdong> a bit less cheesy than Java
<jdong> but nonetheless... pfft
<RAOF> def isAtomic(x): return not isinstance(x, (list, tuple))
<_ion> "pfft" sums up python quite well. ;-)
<jdong> _ion: "(((((((pfft)))))))))" sums up Scheme/LISP too.
<jdong> RAOF: but what about a dict...
<jdong> maybe it's easier to list numbers
<RAOF> Indeed.
<jdong> wait
<jdong> wait
<jdong> operator!
<jdong> module operator
<jdong> operator.isNumberType!
<jdong> whee!
<RAOF> Awesome!
* jdong loves you all
* RAOF squirrels that nugget away.
<jdong> from operator import isNumberType
<jdong> def addElements(a):
<jdong>    if isNumberType(a):
<jdong>       return a
<jdong>    sum=0
<jdong>    for item in a:
<jdong>       sum+= addElements(item)
<jdong>    return sum
<jdong> ^^ that works!
<_ion> raof: If by "awesome" you mean "pfft, ugly" :-)
<jdong> _ion: pfft.
<jdong> :)
<jdong> _ion: how would YOU do it oh great master
<jdong> and if it starts with os.system('perl -e.........
<jdong> ;-)
<_ion> n.is_a? Numeric
<jdong> and what magical language is that?
<_ion> ruby
<jdong> pfft
<jdong> so that's os.system('ruby.....
<jdong> (I'm sure this would be considered cheating....)
<_ion> Or just #!/usr/bin/ruby ;-)
<jdong> some kid already cheated the online homework system :)
<jdong> _ion: well, it strips (safety strips) and evals() the answer you submit
<jdong> and sends it thru some unit tests
<jdong> we were having fun cracking the system last week :)
<_ion> Heh.
<jdong> I made a MagicAnswer class that overloaded operator == to always return True :)
<_ion> :-)
<jdong> another friend of mine uuencoded and compile()'ed a os.system() statement :)
<jdong> file() and compile() weren't stripped.
<_ion> :-)
<jdong> that lead to more interesting results :D
<jdong> unfortunately it was FC6 with SELinux "jailed" apache
<jdong> so it wasn't as fun as it could've been
<LaserJock> 16GB ... I need a faster connection
<bddebian> Don't we all? :)
<jdong> :)
* jdong would love a faster connection
* ajmitch returns
<Hobbsee> yay, ajmitch :)
<ajmitch> yay?
* ajmitch wonders what he's in for now
<bddebian> heh
<RAOF> What's the protocol for getting a second advocate for a package on REVU.
<RAOF> New packages need two acks, right?
<LaserJock> beg
<RAOF> Ok.
<LaserJock> bribe
<white> RAOF: which package?
* RAOF begs for someone to be the second advocate of specto http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=4323
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: bribe lots :P
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: REVUing, of course.
<LaserJock> bang your fists and scream
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: oh right
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: can't do that, sorry
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: why not?
<LaserJock> he's not qualified ;-)
<white> RAOF: do you also intend to bring the package into debian?
<ajmitch> LaserJock: exactly!
* white tries to save a mail :)
<RAOF> white: I suppose that I should, yeah.
<white> RAOF: you might want to have a look at this: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ContributingToDebian
* ajmitch looks at how to contribute to debian
<Hobbsee> white: recruiting more debian devs :P
<Hobbsee> i see
<white> RAOF: and feel free to ask on debian-mentors@l.d.o. , utnubu-discuss@alioth.l.d.o. or the DDs who are around here
<RAOF> It might as well be in debian, too :)
<white> Hobbsee: well he would have gotten a mail from me anyway :)
<Hobbsee> white: true
* ajmitch hides
<white> RAOF: in other words you can ask ajmitch or StevenK for sponsoring if you want :)
<RAOF> :)
* white tries to hide now
<LaserJock> do DDs track ubuntu bugs at all?
<white> yes and no, depends
<TheMuso> LaserJock: Depends on the package.
<ajmitch> RAOF: but first, you should ask white for all DD stuff :)
<TheMuso> and the maintainer I think.
<white> ajmitch: bah 
<RAOF> ajmitch: I've browsed though it before, but now that I've got something to which it might actually *apply*...
<LaserJock> It would be good to get more bugs upstream, I haven't figured out the best way of doing that yet :/
<LaserJock> other than a ot of man power I guess
<LaserJock> *lot
<white> LaserJock: well you can use reportbug and send the stuff to debian bts
<LaserJock> I was thinking more like a Malone -> BTS interface
<LaserJock> but maybe reportbug is sufficent for most people
<white> LaserJock: i reckon it is the best to educate people to send the stuff directly to debian bts and maybe keep malone for ubuntu specific things
<LaserJock> but does Debian really want all kinds of "this crap doesn't work in Ubuntu" bugs :-)
<white> depends on the way
<white> if somebody writes me : "see this does not work here because of ... and can you maybe change it" then i do it if it does not break anything for debian
<white> if somebody writes: "your crap does not work with ubuntu, fix it soon" then i am about to pipe it to /dev/null
<bddebian> heh
<LaserJock> I just wonder with the difficulty  we have with getting good bug reports if you really want it sometimes
<ajmitch> white: how about "how dare you release such a buggy piece of crap with ubuntu?!?"
<ajmitch> when it's an ubuntu change that has broken it
<white> LaserJock: yes, there are some DDs around who explode if they see that the submitter uses ubuntu
<white> and i think they just make the situation they want to change worse
<white> ajmitch: then i ask here and bounce the mail to a MOTU
<ajmitch> yay, flaming users
<ajmitch> white: yes, sometimes it's an unrelated change that broke it
<ajmitch> ie, zope3 is broken in ubuntu because twisted-web2 doesn't work with twisted which was upgraded to work with python2.5
<white> well it is obvious that i am all for bringing everything (especially universe stuff) into debian and then simply sync it from there
<ajmitch> so 4 packages involved to break things
<ajmitch> bringing everything into debian & syncing doesn't always work so well
<white> well i guess it depends on the debian maintainer you have to work with
<ajmitch> debian can move slowly in some areas
<ajmitch> or not just that
<white> well mostly people can step into the existing debian teams
<ajmitch> we make changes in ubuntu that don't apply to debian yet
<white> sometimes NMUs are appropriate
<white> ajmitch: i get your point and know that there are parts where you maybe have to go ahead with ubuntu only things
<ajmitch> hm,  my ~/debian dir (which includes ubuntu stuff) is a mere 96GB
<white> but i guess there are also areas where things can be improved, just like bringing new packages into universe (which should be done the other way around)
<ajmitch> sure, as long as the barriers for contribution aren't too high
<white> what do you mena?
<ajmitch> I know I can easily get a package into debian
<ajmitch> as long as debian-mentors is active, there are sponsors, NEW doesn't take too long, etc
<white> so can everybody i reckon, some people just need a sponsor
<white> here MOTUs have to advocate as well
<ajmitch> at the moment, there are packages ~1 month old in debian NEW
<white> and it is a shame i agree
<ajmitch> we generally don't have to wait as long in ubuntu
<ajmitch> though sometimes it gets too long
<ajmitch> or differing freeze tims
<white> so what about bringing them into debian NEW queue and then uploading to ubuntu already?
<ajmitch> s/tims/times/
<white> re freeze times: stuff can afaik be synced even from experimental
<ajmitch> I'm not arguing against getting stuff in debian
<ajmitch> and I know that things can be synced
<white> i know :)
* ajmitch even has a couple of packages in debian still
<white> a couple = 24
<white> :)
* ajmitch shrugs
<LaserJock> sometimes it just takes too long
<LaserJock> to put stuff in Debian then get sync back
<LaserJock> and many Ubuntu users have never used Debian
<ajmitch> doesn't mean we can't try & help where possible
<LaserJock> sure
<LaserJock> but it takes me longer to figure out how to get things into Debian and get them synced back in
<ajmitch> of course
<ajmitch> especially when you need a fix in quick
<LaserJock> that's what is tough
<LaserJock> it's sort of hard to motivate unless you are already in Debian
<LaserJock> is there some sort of "Debian for Ubunteros" wiki page on the debian wiki?
* ajmitch shrugs
<LaserJock> how would I find if something is run a suid?
<RAOF> You mean "running as suid", or has the suid bit set?
<RAOF> LaserJock: Because you can check the later with "ls -lah" and it looks something like "-rwSr-Sr--"
<bddebian> Gnight folks
<white> Laser_away: >
<white> > regards
<white> > Margaret
<white> bah
<white> Laser_away: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ContributingToDebian
<white> that's what you are looking for i reckon
<dholbach> good morning
<ajmitch> hi daniel
<dholbach> hey andrew
<Laser_away> white: I meant on Debian's wiki
<zakame> linux-image-2.6.20-8-generic hasn't hit the archives yet?
<coNP> seems so
<coNP> zakame: I updated now, and can get that
<zakame> coNP: thanks, I'll update again
<coNP> zakame: yw
<AnAnt> LaserJock: ping
<AnAnt> LaserJock: got my message ? 
<LaserJock> hmm
<LaserJock> which one?
<AnAnt> LaserJock: the one about gplcver package
<AnAnt> I sent it to Laser_away
<AnAnt> 2/3 days ago
<LaserJock> yep, I see it now
<LaserJock> so you need to do a sync request
<AnAnt> me ?
<AnAnt> how ?
<AnAnt> me how ... sounds chinese
<LaserJock> file a bug
<AnAnt> where ?
<LaserJock> and follow https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SyncRequestProcess
<AnAnt> LaserJock: what should the summary be for a sync request ?
<LaserJock> the title of the bug?
<ajmitch> Please sync foo 1.2.3-4 (unstable) from Debian (main)
<ajmitch> or similar
<ajmitch> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SyncRequestProcess
<AnAnt> ajmitch: thanks
<AnAnt> ajmitch: what if I see that it is classified well
<AnAnt> it's in devel
<ajmitch> hm?
<ajmitch> the package section doesn't matter, but the component does
<AnAnt> I see that it should be in sciene
<AnAnt> science
<AnAnt> oh, ok
<AnAnt> how do I know if it is in main or whatever there ?
<ajmitch> apt-cache madison
<ajmitch> there's a useful script linked on that page there
<AnAnt> what page ?
<ajmitch> the url I gave you a few minutes ago
<AnAnt> oh
<LaserJock> ajmitch: do you know if Debian NEW is being processed?
<LaserJock> it seems kinda backed up, but I don't know if that's because of Etch or just generally being backed up
<ajmitch> processed, very slowly
<LaserJock> hmm, there's a package on there that I want to get into feisty
<LaserJock> maybe I should just grab it and put it on REVU
<ajmitch> grab it from where?
<LaserJock> well, the author
<ajmitch> ah
<ajmitch> I thought you may have meant NEW
<ajmitch> which is impossible
<LaserJock> yeah
<LaserJock> azeem is the sponsor and it's a data package
<LaserJock> so I wouldn't think it'd be hard to get it through revu
<AnAnt> LaserJock: according to the https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SyncRequestProcess , if a change would be made to the package, then sync request should be done
<LaserJock> it no changes need to be made, do a sync request
<LaserJock> *if
<AnAnt> LaserJock: I see that sync is in 'devel' section, yet I think it should be in 'scientific' section
<LaserJock> well, we can change that later if we really want to
<white> LaserJock: yes there is as well, but i reckon it is more a place for the ubuntu wiki though
<white> LaserJock: there is a whole team inside debian dedicated to help ubuntu people
<white> it is called utnubu
<AnAnt> ok, I ran: requestsync gplcver unstable
<white> and that is pretty much why i am here :)
<LaserJock> I suppose, although I would expect to find documentation on Debian to be on the Debian wiki ;-)
<AnAnt> I got this: apt-cache madison does not contain gplcver/unstable
<LaserJock> I know, I'm fairly familiar with utnubu
<white> ah great
<white> LaserJock: well if you have anything, just nudge me
<LaserJock> unfortunately I think my dislike for BTS is my biggest problem, not something someone else has done
<white> well i presonally prefer BTS, but i fully agree with you that other bugtrackers, e.g. bugzilla, are easier for others, because of their nice web interface
<AnAnt> BTS of Debian ?
<LaserJock> I can appreciate the power of BTS
<LaserJock> as I struggle with the web interface of Malone
<LaserJock> but it took me a while to figure out how to get reportbug to send and email
<LaserJock> it took a couple of hours to even know if my first bug made it
<LaserJock> and in the end I think it created a dup
<LaserJock> so I felt kinda silly
<LaserJock> I have no clue how to control bugs
<AnAnt> ajmitch: ok, I ran: requestsync gplcver unstable
<AnAnt> ajmitch: I got this: apt-cache madison does not contain gplcver/unstable
<LaserJock> white: that's where more of a "This is how you would do X in Debian" page would be handy
<AnAnt> ajmitch: although the package does exist: http://packages.debian.org/unstable/devel/gplcver
<ajmitch> you need the deb-src lines in your sources.list
<LaserJock> AnAnt: I think you have to have a deb-src line for unstable in your sources.list for that to work
<LaserJock> bah
<ajmitch> and the target is feisty, not unstable
<AnAnt> oh !
<AnAnt> ok, I still dunno wether it is in main or what
<AnAnt> ok, I found out
<ajmitch> is it in ubuntu already?
<AnAnt> ajmitch: no
<ajmitch> then it will go into universe
<ajmitch> whether it's main/universe only matters for the ubuntu side of things
<ajmitch> since only ubuntu has universe
<AnAnt> so I should subscribe ubuntu-universe-sponsors to it ?
<AnAnt> I don't see subscribe option, only assign
<ajmitch> subscribe
<ajmitch> once the bug is filed
<ajmitch> don't subscribe ubuntu-archive
<AnAnt> what does filed mean ?
<ajmitch> submitted
<AnAnt> I did submit it 
<AnAnt> ajmitch: here it is https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/84857, is there anything else I should do ?
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 84857 in Ubuntu "Please sync gplcver 2.11a-3 (unstable) from Debian" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  
<AnAnt> that's mine !
<white> LaserJock: k 
<white> bah
<white> LaserJock: i mean like there is the new maintainer guide and other stuff which explains all the basic things in debian
<ajmitch> AnAnt: you haven't subscribed ubuntu-universe-sponsors
<white> http://www.debian.org/doc/maint-guide/
<AnAnt> ajmitch: I didn't see any subscribe field
<AnAnt> oh, Subscribe someone else ?
<LaserJock> white: well, I was thinking more like "Here's how to get a new package into Debian (ITP, debian mentors, etc.)
<ajmitch> yes
<LaserJock> white: or, "Here's how to file a bug (with a few easy examples of common cases"
<LaserJock> or maybe I'm just blind and want things to easy ;-)
<AnAnt> ajmitch: ok, done, thanks
<AnAnt> ajmitch: I shouldn't subscribe ubuntu-main-sponsors, right ?
<ajmitch> no, you shouldn't
<AnAnt> ok, thanks
<ivoks> dholbach: hi
<dholbach> hiya ivoks
<ivoks> how are you?
<dholbach> ivoks: a bit tired and quite busy, but else good :)
<dholbach> ivoks: how are you?
<ivoks> same here :/
<ivoks> at least, classes at faculty are over now, so i can prepare some things i was working on
<vil> hi, just a quick question. how do i control if a package goes to universe or multiverse?
<ogra> you dont
<ogra> oh, he's gone
<Kagou> hi
<_MMA_> hallo
<white> hi
<white> someday i really want to have a talk to the linda developer
<white> white@katha:~/white/debian/debs/sponsoring/videomanager$ linda videomanager_0.5-1_i386.changes
<white> Roses are red, violets are blue,
<white> lintian is dead and Culus goes moo.
* StevenK waves.
<StevenK> Hi!
<Hobbsee> StevenK: i dont think white saw you.  you might be in luck
<white>  -- Steve Kowalik <stevenk@debian.org>  Tue,  8 Aug 2006 18:25:09 +1000
<white> waaaaaaaaaaaaaah
<white> StevenK: got ya
<white> from debian-edu channel:
<white> 15:02 < white> one day i really want to drink a beer with the linda developer
<white> 15:05 < Werner> white: then you did go the wrong way to study .. he lives in .uk :)
<StevenK> No, I don't
* white goes to db.debian.org
<StevenK> white: Sydney, .au to save you the trouble
<white> :)
<bddebian> Heya gang
<lionel> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Hello lionel
<tcurdt> hi there!
<tcurdt> I would love to see spread updated to the latest version http://www.spread.org/
<tcurdt> anyone I could somehow bribe to upgrade the package? :)
<tcurdt> is there a issues tracking system or something to keep track of such requests?
<lionel> tcurdt: yes, the bug tracker is a good option for this : https://launchpad.net
<lionel> tcurdt: note that we are in UVF
<lionel> if you want to introduce a new upstream release, you will need to ask for a UVF
<tcurdt> lionel: sorry, but what's a UVF? :)
<lionel> Upstream Version Freeze : https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UpstreamVersionFreeze
<tcurdt> lionel: so IIUC atm no new upstream packages can be added? ...until the freeze is over?
<lionel> tcurdt: it can be added if you get an exception
<lionel> but you have to justify it, etc.
<lionel> Otherwise, it whould be for feisty+1
<AnAnt> will there be a sync soon from Debian ?
<AnAnt> I mean before feisty release
<lionel> AnAnt: automatic sync from Debian are stoped since late December
<AnAnt> ok
<tcurdt> well, 3.x is old and I need version 4 ....but I doubt that qualifies for an exception ;-)
<AnAnt> lionel: can I request a sync from a package that is in experimental ?
<lionel> AnAnt: yes, no problem with that
<AnAnt> lionel: I mean thru the launchpad
<AnAnt> ok, thanks
<tcurdt> lionel: couldn't the new package go somewhere else? ...say experimental?
<lionel> Yes, open a bug saying "sync from experimental", please include the changelog from latest Ubuntu version
<lionel> tcurdt: experimental is Debian :)
<AnAnt> lionel: ok
<lionel> tcurdt: if the Debian maintainer packahe the spread 4, I think it would be easier for everybody
<tcurdt> ok ...will try to ping him and see how that goes. Thanks
<lionel> tcurdt: wackamole depends on spread, if we update to 4, we should not break it.
<lionel> (they have the same Debian Maintainer)
<lionel> tcurdt: no problem :)
<AnAnt> lionel: I should file the bug for the aircrack-ng package ? that's the package I want to sync
<AnAnt> or should I leave the I don't know option checked ?
<lionel> yes, file the bug on the source package that you want to sync
<lionel> and scubscribe Ubuntu Sponsor for Universe
<AnAnt> ok
<AnAnt> thanks
<lionel> Huch
<lionel> too late, he left :)
<sistpoty> hi folks
<ivoks> hi
<bddebian> Heya sistpoty
<sistpoty> hi bddebian
<ajmitch> morning 
<geser> hi ajmitch
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch, geser
<ajmitch> hm, there's a small & growing stack of universe UVF exceptions
<zul> ajmitch: get to it then :)
<ajmitch> not in motu-uvf
<geser> hi bddebian
<geser> are slomo and dholbach already looking at UVF exceptions?
<slomo> geser: i'll look through the 6 or something open ones tonight
<ajmitch> our loyal, hardworking team of uvf handlers ;)
<Adri2000> http://ajmitch.net.nz/~ajmitch/missing-fixes-rc.html yay, no bug!
* ajmitch shrugs
<ajmitch> I guess something broke, oh well
<bddebian> heh
<ajmitch> Adri2000: you have bugs to fix again
<Adri2000> ah great, thanks :)
<zakame> did anyone experience something similar to bug #84668?
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 84668 in devmapper "adds misleading double entry to swapon" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/84668
<ursula_> just testing... bug #84668
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 84668 in devmapper "adds misleading double entry to swapon" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/84668
<ursula_> uia
<TheMuso> Hey MOTUs.
<ajmitch> hello MOTU
<neutrinomass> geser: Thanks for the uploads :)
<bddebian> Heya TheMuso
<TheMuso> Wow.
<TheMuso> Powerpc support dropped.
<hub> ?
<ajmitch> it's a 'community-supported port'
<ajmitch> see ubuntu-announce
<ajmitch> the other decision is no binary drivers by default
* TheMuso is happy with that.
* ajmitch is slightly disappointed about the ppc decision, but it's not surprising
<TheMuso> ajmitch: Yeah me too.
<TheMuso> If I had a faster ppc, I'd probably join the team and help out.
<ajmitch> a 400mhz g3 that runs osx 99.9% of the time is all I have access to at the moment :)
* TheMuso has a 300Mhz G3.
<TheMuso> Running as a small file/DNS/DHCP server.
<TheMuso> I'd run GUI stuff, but the video card plays funny buggers with my KVM, and I couldn't be bothered tracking down another PCI Mac video card.
<bddebian> Later gang
<LaserJock> hmm, when is our motu meeting?
<ajmitch> 10:00UTC
<LaserJock> like 12 hrs or so from now
<ajmitch> 11 hours & a bit
<LaserJock> man, this is going to suck, I'm not sure if I'll make it or not
<ajmitch> aw
<ajmitch> try & make it, please :)
* sistpoty distrusts his skill of disabling the alarm clock *during* sleep *g*
<ajmitch> haha
<ajmitch> but that'll be nice & late for you, the day will be half over ;)
<sistpoty> :P
<LaserJock> I was up until 3:00am last night
<LaserJock> got up for a 9:00am dentist appointment
* ajmitch was up until nearly 1AM
<LaserJock> that lasted 3 hrs
<ajmitch> fun!
<Lutin> sistpoty: could you have a look at the mlt package on revu when you have some time ? I get a lot of linda errors, and don't really know how to deal with them :/
<sistpoty> Lutin: sure
<Lutin> sistpoty: thanks :)
* TheMuso notes that the MOTU meeting is at a convenient time this time around.
<TheMuso> I'll be there.
<LaserJock> I suppose it's good to get the other half of the world to the meeting ;-)
<LaserJock> for some reason I seem to be in an odd TZ
<LaserJock> not too many West Coasters in MOTU
#ubuntu-motu 2007-02-14
<sistpoty> Lutin: actually linda/lintian doesn't tell me anything about mlt
<sistpoty> Lutin: and the package looks nice
<sistpoty> Lutin: well apart from the linda easter egg *g*
<lionel> geser: you mark #76967 as fix released, did you notice that it FTBS on ia64 ? (I have really no idea of the problem)
<Lutin> sistpoty: the linda easter egg 
<Lutin> ?
<sistpoty> Lutin: is it valentine's day in your tz? then just run linda
<Lutin> sistpoty: ahhh nice :)
<Lutin> sistpoty: fine if you have no problem with it. 
<Lutin> maybe it was hapening because I was running the edgy linda on packages builded in a feisty pbuilder 
<sistpoty> Lutin: well, maybe... feisty ones are all quiet here.
<Lutin> sistpoty: cool then ;
<Lutin> :) *
<sistpoty> btw.: any c++ guru around, who could happen to know how I could find out the typename of the type a pointer points to?
<slomo> sistpoty: almost no c++ knowledge here... but afaik you need rtti
<slomo> sistpoty: http://www.cpp-tutor.de/cpp/le16/le16_03.htm looks good
<sistpoty> slomo: thanks for the hint, but I guess rtti is not exactly what I need...
<slomo> sistpoty: what's the difference to what you want? :)
<sistpoty> slomo: actually I want to convert a std::list of a derived class to a std::list from a base class... give me a sec and I'll put sample code on a pastebin
<sistpoty> slomo: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/5639/
<sistpoty> slomo: and I don't want to simply reinterpret_cast (both are lists of pointers, so that *should* work), because I want to know if I change my class hierarchy to be no longer compatible during compile time
<slomo> sistpoty: hm what about the n other casts of c++? ;) sorry, i don't really know much about c++... it just looks confusing to me ;)
<sistpoty> slomo: the problem is that the lists are distinct types, so I can either reinterpret_cast them or not cast them at all :( (so I try the trick with the template to look if the elements can be type-converted implicitely)
<Lutin> LaserJock: could you have a look at mlt on revu when you have some time ?
<sistpoty> slomo: ha, got it :) http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/5643/
<slomo> sistpoty: congrats :) what are you doing btw?
<sistpoty> slomo: writing my thesis... a VHDL to c compiler for the faumachine project
<sistpoty> slomo: the idea is to translate e.g. a pci-card modelled in vhdl into c-code that can be used as a component in the virtual machine
<slomo> sistpoty: wah, vhdl... the ugliest language i ever saw :) but other than that this sounds like fun
<sistpoty> slomo: vhdl is *really* ugly... :(
<sistpoty> btw.: http://faumachine.informatik.uni-erlangen.de/cgi-bin/viewcvs.cgi/FAUmachine/fauhdlc/
<ThunderFox> Yeah, I do agree with everyone, VHDL is a little obsolete in it's design.  However, getting engineers to stop using Fortran is dificult enough.
<LaserJock> but Fortran rocks
<ThunderFox> *laugh* for limited use . . . newer structured scripting languages are better.
<LaserJock> tell that to my advisor ;-)
<ThunderFox> Fortran was revolutionary in it's time . . .  I guess that's when your advisor was young.
<ThunderFox> ;-)
<ThunderFox> It's like I have an affinity for c-form basic variants.
<ThunderFox> I know they suck, but I can't help it.
<ThunderFox> I grew up with later DOS variants, there is no helping it.
<ThunderFox> Anyways, has anyone started considering making a Universe package for the Doom engine OdaMex yet?
<ThunderFox> It recently got it's first public release (Mixed license issues prevented it earlier.  They didn't want a Doom Legacy issue set.)
<crimsun> ThunderFox: no, but feel free.
<ThunderFox> Good, I'm sure the folks back at the OdaMex community will like that as a contribution.  It should get them lots of good developers.
<ThunderFox> Should I put it in /usr/local, where it is designed for using hacked level files, and is considered a beta-stability Alpha (prevents glitches with degunkers, and makes degunking easier if packages switch out uncleanly)
<ajmitch> never put any packaged stuff in /usr/local
<tsmithe> now i've got my membership, i'm gonna work really hard to get motu
<ThunderFox> ajmitch, Yes, I noticed most packages use a remote /usr/local directory storage if they look for extra binaries there.
<ThunderFox> ajmitch, they tend to only create the directory in those cases.
<ThunderFox> ajmitch, thanks for the tip.
<pochu> hi guys! I have a small question: what's the best way to not apply a patch (.patch system) in debian/patches, rename it? and if so, what's the best?
<Lutin> pochu: why would you want not to apply a patch ?
<pochu> Lutin: fixed upstream
<Lutin> pochu: just delete it then
<sistpoty> pochu: fixed upstream --> remove the patch
<pochu> Lutin: and of course I say that in the changelog, right? :)
<Lutin> pochu: sure
<pochu> thanks :)
<Lutin> np :)
<pochu> another question: if a patch applied in a file which no longer exists now, what should I do? (it's about a .desktop entry)
<Lutin> pochu: nuke the patch :)
<Lutin> pochu: if doesn't apply to any actual file, there's no point keeping it
<pochu> Lutin: ok, thanks :)
<Lutin> pochu: you might want ot make sure the 'issue' hasn't been moved elsewhere though ;)
<pochu> Lutin: I think that was a desktop entry, which was on the source code, however I think now it's managed into debian/ subdirectory, is that possible? but that file doesn't exist anymore, now it has a menu entry
<Lutin> pochu: menu entries are for debian, you need a desktop file for ubuntu. if none is provided in the upstream tarball, create one in debian/whatever.desktop and install it in /usr/share/applications :)
<pochu> Lutin: I've just found it! It's been moved into misc/ directory. The problem was that nautilus didn't show the correct name, but the app name ?
<pochu> instead of listen.desktop, it says Listen Music Player
<pochu> hehe
<pochu> but an ls in the terminal shows listen.desktop :)
<pochu> I'll see if this is well now, or if the patch should still be applied, thanks for your help Lutin !
<Lutin> pochu: nautilus diplays the 'name' field of the desktop instead of the actual filename :)
<Adri2000> pochu: you are working on the new upstream release of listen?
<pochu> Adri2000: yes, but I'm very noob, so if you are also doing it, do it, as I'm doing it just for learning
<pochu> Adri2000: but if you want to review my work, you can do it :)
<Adri2000> yep, and upload it, if you file an UVF exception request and if it is accepted, no problem :)
<pochu> Adri2000: ok :)
<pochu> do you know why de .desktop entry should not have the "Encoding=UTF-8" line?
<Adri2000> should not?
<pochu> Adri2000: the patch of the desktop entry removes it, don't know why (I know about nothing hehe)
<Lutin> can't see th reason either .. ubuntu has been using utf8 for ages
<pochu> Lutin: sure :)
<pochu> there is nothing else interesting in that patch, do I drop it? I think I should :)
<Adri2000> (testing with a .desktop file without Encoding) gtodo.desktop: error: required key "Encoding" not found
<Adri2000> desktop-file-validate says that
<Lutin> pochu: what does the changelog says about that patch ?
<pochu> the other things are typos (fixed upstream)
<pochu> + Added 15_desktop.patch to improve desktop entry
<pochu> it changes the description and that
<pochu> and an [fr]  comment which no longer exist in the new upstream version
<pochu> do you want me to put the patch in a pastebin?
<Lutin> pochu: no need to do so ;)
<pochu> ok, then I'll drop it. thanks a lot :)
<Lutin> pochu: you can check the the desktop file with desktop-file-validate if it's ok
<Lutin> to see if it's ok*
<pochu> Lutin: thanks! is this a semicolon? ";"
<Lutin> pochu: can't tell, I never remember that
<pochu> Lutin: hehe, np :)
<Lutin> pochu: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Semicolon
<pochu> Lutin: hehe, thanks :)
<Lutin> np ;)
<Lutin> well, need some sleep. g'night guys
<Adri2000> me too
<Adri2000> night
<Lutin> 'night Adri2000 
<pochu> night guys! :)
<Lutin> thanks
<pochu> and thanks 4 your help :)
<Lutin> np :)
<bddebian> Heya gang
<LaserJock> hi bddebian 
<bddebian> Heya LaserJock, what's happening?
<LaserJock> ohh, I think I'm going to head home
<LaserJock> try to get some food and recover from the day before the MOTU meeting
<bddebian> Damn, an MOTU meeting?
* bddebian is so out of touch lately again :-(
<bddebian> Heya siretart
<LaserJock> it's at 10:00UTC
<LaserJock> so something like 5am for you maybe
<bddebian> Uhm, that ain't gonna happen :-(
<LaserJock> 2am for me
<bddebian> Eeks
<LaserJock> oh come on
<LaserJock> I made a 4am Launchpad meeting
<bddebian> Well 2am I could do 'cause I'm usually up
<bddebian> 5am, forget it, I'm like the dead
<LaserJock> surely you can suck it up and do 5am ;-)
<ajmitch> take one for the team
<bddebian> Gah, I'm pretty useless anymore anyway
<ajmitch> LaserJock: it's really at 2AM for you?
<LaserJock> yeah
<ajmitch> bddebian: don't make me swear at you
<LaserJock> bddebian: we're all pretty useless
<LaserJock> but we keep trying
<ajmitch> LaserJock: you're in the pacific timezone?
<LaserJock> and somehow it seems to work in the end
<LaserJock> ajmitch: yep
<bddebian> ajmitch: C'mon, I don't think I've ever heard you swear
* ajmitch thought you were one over
<ajmitch> bddebian: I'm sorely tempted at times :)
<LaserJock> nah, I'm pretty close to San Fransicko
<LaserJock> I have to finish some glade/c++ stuff tonight
<LaserJock> so I'll probably be up late anyway :/
<bddebian> Whoa, go LaserJock.. I though you weren't gonna get in that deep? :-)
<LaserJock> it's really small
<LaserJock> but since I have to learn glade/gtk/C++ concurently to do it it's been taking some time
<bddebian> LaserJock: Now, wanna help me with glibc? :-)
<LaserJock> lol
<LaserJock> I'm just figuring how to put buttons in a GUI
<LaserJock> I don't dare touch the real stuff ;-)
<LaserJock> anyway, off to home
<bddebian> Gah, come on.. :-)
<bddebian> Later man
<LaserJock> the wife is waiting
<zul> heh ive heard ajmitch swear
<LaserJock> "Holy Battle Cat He-man!"
<ajmitch> zul: never
<bddebian> LaserJock: hehe
<ajmitch> sigh, valentines day today
<ajmitch> how sickening
<RAOF> I'll just ping again.  Anyone want to provide the second ACK to http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=4323 ?
<LaserJock> good thing we had a valentines weekend
<bddebian> ajmitch: Did you send me flowers? :)
<LaserJock> this is the only day I'll be home before 7pm this week
<ajmitch> bddebian: hah!
<ajmitch> bddebian: not going to happen
<sistpoty> RAOF: I'll take a look
<RAOF> Yay!
<bddebian> RAOF: Don't get too excited, sistpoty will catch all the shit I missed :-)
<RAOF> Even better.  A cleaner package for when I get around to posting a Debian ITP
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: oh damn.  
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: i'd forgotten about that, with regards to having to leave the house today
<TheMuso> Heya Hobbsee, ajmitch, bddebian.
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: yeah, well, you can probably avoid the worst of it
<bddebian> Hi TheMuso
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: hopefully
<Hobbsee> hey TheMuso :)
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: you could always send bddebian some flowers :)
<bddebian> hehe
<TheMuso> Valentine's day is very much a commercial thing IMO.
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: hehe
<ajmitch> definitely
<pochu> hi guys! I have a small question: with .patch patch system, should I apply them manually before building? I think so, but I'm not sure...
<ajmitch> depends on debian/rules, if it has a patch system to apply them
<sistpoty> RAOF: looks good, uploading
<pochu> ajmitch: it hasn't, they are just diffs
<RAOF> sistpoty: Thanks muchly.
<crimsun> nixternal: / Amaranth: commit 0a70404517448b8d3176f47798765baad52a6c70: UBUNTU: sound/pci/hda/: More Conexant HDA fixes (patch_conexant.c)
<ajmitch> pochu: no matter whether the patches are just diffs, what does debian/rules have?
<Amaranth> crimsun: is that after -8?
<crimsun> Amaranth: will be, yes
<pochu> ajmitch: I think it hasn't any patch system
<Amaranth> alright, because -8 broke it :)
<ajmitch> crimsun: post herd-4?
<crimsun> ajmitch: yes
* ajmitch hopes that the freeze doesn't go over a week this time
<pochu> ajmitch: while building: if [ "reverse-patches" = "reverse-patches" ] ; then rm -f debian/stamp-patched; fi
<pochu> patches: debian/patches/21_listen_desktop_entry.patch
<pochu> Patch debian/patches/21_listen_desktop_entry.patch is not applied.
<pochu> mmm: Build-Depends: cdbs
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: me too
<ajmitch> pochu: so it has some patch system at least
<pochu> ajmitch: it seems like that :)
<ajmitch> probably simple-patchsys
<pochu> ajmitch: don't know how it works :(
<Amaranth> pochu: simple-patchsys is just drop a patch in debian/patches/ and go
<pochu> Amaranth: then it should be applied... going to ensure :)
<Amaranth> make sure you name them 01-patch-name.patch and etc
<Amaranth> so they get applied in a sane order
<ajmitch> important if the patches overlap
<ajmitch> not so important otherwise
<Amaranth> ajmitch: if they don't overlap just name them all 01-* :)
<pochu> Amaranth: if there is just one patch, should it be 01? or can be other number, as 10?
<ajmitch> pochu: whatever you feel like
<Amaranth> pochu: i'd go with 01
<ajmitch> 01 is best
<Amaranth> never know when you'll want to add more
<Amaranth> want/need
<ajmitch> easier to add 02 than 10003
<ajmitch> :)
<pochu> there were another 01, and I removed it, so I don't know if I should use 01 or other number :)
<pochu> hehe
<ajmitch> it's just for patch ordering, nothing magical
<pochu> ajmitch: ok :)
<pochu> it's called 21_listen_desktop_entry.patch (a little large) :(
<Amaranth> nah, that's about average
<pochu> I'm gonna rename it, but it's fine (if hasn't been applied)
<pochu> it*
<Amaranth> but if the package is listen i'd call it 01_add_desktop_file.patch
<Amaranth> or something like that
<pochu> :)
<pochu> any idea why it isn't applied? :S
<pochu> include /usr/share/cdbs/1/rules/simple-patchsys.mk
<pochu> include /usr/share/cdbs/1/rules/debhelper.mk
<pochu> include /usr/share/cdbs/1/class/makefile.mk
<pochu> that's in debian/rules
<pochu> you were right :)
<RAOF> pochu: It's possible that the patch has been previously unapplied, but the patch-stamp file hasn't been removed.
<RAOF> That's happend to me a bit.
<pochu> RAOF: I've added the patch, and I haven't applied it. I thought it would be applied while building. What should I do then?
<RAOF> It depends on the rest of the environment, I think.
<RAOF> I haven't used simple-patchsys before, but I have used dpatch, and that' s similar.
<RAOF> Maybe if you pastebin the entire output of trying to build the package, it'd help?
<pochu> RAOF: sure :)
<pochu> hi fernando :)
<pochu> RAOF: http://pastebin.ca/354639 :)
<fernando> hi pochu =)
<RAOF> pochu: I don't suppose you could pastebin that in English? :(
<pochu> RAOF: sorry :(
<pochu> RAOF: any idea to get the output in english? :)
<pochu> RAOF: I don't want to translate line by line :)
<pochu> hehe
<RAOF> I *think* you can set an environment variable.
<RAOF> I'm not sure which.
<RAOF> it might be something like LOCALE="C" dpkg-buildpackge, or something.
<fernando> export LC_ALL=C; dpkg-build...
<fernando> ;-)
<RAOF> Ta.
<Amaranth> arg libwnck got updated
<ajmitch> Amaranth: is that bad?
<RAOF> Have those patches to make compiz work made it upstream yet?
<Amaranth> yes it upgraded over my version with viewport support
<Amaranth> RAOF: no but i've fixed all the problems the maintainer had
<RAOF> They're still bitrotting on bugzilla, then :(
<Amaranth> if i don't get a response before the feature freeze for 2.20 i'll try to force it
<pochu> wow! fernando thanks :)
<fernando> pochu: you're welcome
<pochu> RAOF: here it is :) http://pastebin.ca/354660
<RAOF> Ta
<RAOF> pochu: That seems to have worked fine.
<RAOF> It tries to unapply the patch first, but it's not applied.  Which is ok.
<RAOF> Then it builds the source package.
<RAOF> Then it applies the patch, and builds the binary.
<RAOF> Lines 64 & 65.
<pochu> mmm...
<pochu> RAOF: sure, it seems to have been applied :)
<RAOF> Oh, and I notice that docbook2x-man doesn't segfault for you.
<RAOF> Be careful when building it in a pbuilder, I had problems with it segfaulting for no obvious reson.
<pochu> RAOF: I don't know how to use pbuilder :)
<pochu> RAOF: I think it hasn't been applied...
<RAOF> pochu: Why not?
<pochu> the listen.desktop entry in /usr/share/applications/listen.desktop looks like the upstream one...
<pochu> maybe the patch isn't right...
<TheMuso> lol at linda
<RAOF> pochu: It seems the build process probably updates listen.desktop.  About line 124
<RAOF> And 121.
<RAOF> You need to patch listen.desktop.in, if you're not already doing that.
<pochu> mmm
<pochu> RAOF: hehe, thanks! I was patching listen.desktop, instead of listen.desktop.in :)
<RAOF> (I've been bitten by that *so* many times)
<pochu> RAOF: going to try that right now!!
<pochu> hehe
<RAOF> NP
* sistpoty is off to bed
<sistpoty> gn8 everyone
<keescook> who do I need to talk to about universe UVFEs?
<keescook> I want to get libfilter-template-perl into Ubuntu, and it was recently added to Debian... gah!
<ajmitch> keescook: motu-uvf, file a bug & assign to them
<ajmitch> and uvf exceptions aren't needed for new packages yet
<ajmitch> so you should be fine :)
<keescook> ajmitch: really?  uvf universe on the schedule says the 8th??
<ajmitch> yeah, but new packages can get in later, since they tend not to break other packages
<ajmitch> so you should be able to get away with just a sync request & some fast talking
<bddebian> OMG can the news PLEASE shut up about Anna Nicole Smith
* bddebian jumps off a cliff
<jdong> bddebian: didn't she stay at a hard rock hotel or something?
* jdong not following news
<bddebian> I don't really care.. :)
<jdong> oh well
* jdong goes away puzzled
<TheMuso> bddebian: Its in the news here.
<TheMuso> as well.
<ajmitch> TheMuso: it's in the news everywhere
<TheMuso> ajmitch: Right.
* TheMuso doesn't give a crap.
* jdong obviously needs to watch the news
<ajmitch> no, you really don't
<bddebian> jdong: Believe me, no, you don't :-)
<jdong> lol
<jdong> ok
<jdong> good enough for me
<bddebian> It's one of the few things even I'm ashamed of the US
* ajmitch doesn't even know who she is
<TheMuso> heh me neither.
<LaserJock> ajmitch, TheMuso: you guys are missing out
<bddebian> Hah, not hardly
<ajmitch> LaserJock: I'm sure I am
<ajmitch> but I don't care at all :)
<LaserJock> I don't either
<LaserJock> and I don't see much news
<TheMuso> I don't care, so I don't want to know.
<LaserJock> and I still can't get away from her
<TheMuso> Ok. Time to see what jobs are around that I don't want to do. :)
<ajmitch> lots of them!
* ajmitch is glad we have someone willing to sacrifice himiself for the project
<TheMuso> ajmitch: I am referring to employment related searching.
<ajmitch> oh right
<ajmitch> I thought you were volunteer to do various ubuntu jobs
<jdong> LOL
<jdong> TheMuso: you mean you're not merging reiser4 into the kernel?
<TheMuso> jdong: I am not that skilled.
<TheMuso> And for the record, I stay way from reiserfs of any kind.
<jdong> pfft :)
<TheMuso> s/way/away/
<jdong> so he killed a wife or two....
<jdong> :)
<jdong> you've done worse
<jdong> everytime you touch a non-open device God kills 3 penguins
<TheMuso> ROFLMAO
* ajmitch waits for jdong to stop
<jdong> ajmitch: it'll stop when I collapse from exhaustion
<jdong> *thud*
<ajmitch> oh what a shame
<jdong> that's what she said!
<jdong> (ok sorry sorry I'll stop)
<TheMuso> c
<TheMuso> bah
<pochu> night!
<RAOF> night
<RAOF> Hope the desktop.in patch worked :)
<pochu> RAOF: sure, bug #84946
<pochu> RAOF: thanks a lot :)
<pochu> RAOF: I hope the archive admins accept the upload :)
<pochu> hehe
* LaserJock kicks reprepo and his DSL connection
<ajmitch> ah, finished work for the day
<Q-FUNK> well, pretty nice office space they have, at the ubuntu tech.support office
<LaserJock> in Montreal?
<ajmitch> yeah, there are some photos of it online
<Q-FUNK> yup
<Q-FUNK> I just got back from there
<ajmitch> Q-FUNK: you been visiting, or interviewing for a position?
<Q-FUNK> visiting
<ajmitch> nice
<ajmitch> hi viviersf 
<Q-FUNK> although rumour has it that they do have more openings coming up
<nixternal> boo
* ajmitch tries to remember who put up photos of the montreal office recently
<ajmitch> hey nixternal 
<nixternal> hiya ajmitch 
* nixternal head>kb
<ajmitch> heh
<nixternal> I have had my head stuck in code all night and just realised I have a chapter due tomorrow for Kubuntu :\
<nixternal> argh, and the release notes for Herd 4
* nixternal jumps into a snow bank
<ajmitch> ouch
<jwhitlark> imbrandon, wasup?
<jwhitlark> wasn't there a motu meeting soon?
<viviersf> alo ajmitch
<Lathiat> yeh in 5 hours i think
<LaserJock> hi nixternal 
<jwhitlark> tnx
<jwhitlark> Laserjock, in the last 2 days, I haven't signed on when you haven't already been on, and I've been working waaaayyy too  hard...
<jwhitlark> don't you ever sleep?
<ajmitch> of course not
<ajmitch> it's LaserJock 
<ajmitch> LaserJock is not human
<jwhitlark> I guess so.
<LaserJock> jwhitlark: me?
<crimsun> of course, one-third of the motu trinity.
<LaserJock> well the last few days I've been on ~20 hrs/day
<ajmitch> sick
<LaserJock> well, I gues more like 18
<ajmitch> still sick
<LaserJock> anyway, way too much
<ajmitch> yeah
<crimsun> I think lj should be on the mc
<ajmitch> I agree
* ajmitch steps down
<LaserJock> lol
<jwhitlark> heh
* LaserJock give ajmitch his crown back
<ajmitch> dunce cap you mean
<LaserJock> heh
<crimsun> ouch, apport is killing performance here
<LaserJock> really? how so?
<ajmitch> LaserJock: I hope you'll spend time with your wife tomorrow :)
<crimsun> I'm getting _severe_ cpu spikes
<LaserJock> ajmitch: actually not, we both have a bunch of stuff to do, I won't see her till ~ 10:00pm
<ajmitch> aw
<crimsun> audio hiccups despite RT privileges, visible mouse cursor hitching and the like
<LaserJock> ajmitch: we did Valentines this weekend
* ajmitch briefly managed to catch up with a friend at lunchtime
<ajmitch> he's in about his 6th year (or more) of his phd 
<LaserJock> crimsun: that's no fun
<LaserJock> I'm starting to see the light
<nixternal> hiya LaserJock 
<LaserJock> but it requires more time on research and les on Ubuntu
<ajmitch> so is he - only another year or so of experiments :)
<LaserJock> my advisor started seriously talking about what I need to do to finish up
<LaserJock> that's a pretty major step for me
<ajmitch> he's not only married & studying, but has 4 kids as well
<LaserJock> yikes
<ajmitch> that's a good step
<LaserJock> it's just hard when I'd rather be working here than on research :/
<ajmitch> temptations lie in wait..
<crimsun> you have to be glutton for punishment if you enjoy bug triaging more than research ;)
<crimsun> to be a, even
<LaserJock> depends on the research actually
<ajmitch> heh
<LaserJock> my problem is I'll have a PhD and never get to do the research I signed on to do
<ajmitch> that's ok
<ajmitch> you can be a fulltime ubuntu celebrity
<ajmitch> crimsun: going to try & get to UDS Sevilla?
<crimsun> can't, time already spoken for
<ajmitch> I thought it may be
<ajmitch> you'll be fairly busy over the next few months?
<crimsun> yeah
<LaserJock> I'm still not sure
* ajmitch won't be there
<LaserJock> a free trip to Spain for Ubuntu stuff is awefully hard to pass up
* ajmitch won't be sponsored
<LaserJock> but I need to sort of step back and focus on research and home
<LaserJock> so I don't know if it would be a good idea or not
<LaserJock> on the other hand, one of these days I'll have a "real" job
<LaserJock> so I should travel while I can ;-)
<ajmitch> at least you'd get sponsored to go :)
<ajmitch> since you're active
<Amaranth> I don't have a chance at being sponsored this time
<Amaranth> and i'm still in some financial pain from the last trip
<Amaranth> too many $100 cab rides
<ajmitch> yeah, lots of pain
<crimsun> we need an motu/uds fund ;)
<Amaranth> hehe
* Amaranth needs to get back into development
<ajmitch> pass the hat round on planet ubuntu ;)
<Amaranth> or get the things i toy with included in ubuntu ;)
<ajmitch> crimsun: maybe the motu council can setup a fund & select worthy people :)
<crimsun> that's an idea :)
<ajmitch> (which would exclude the council members from being selected)
<crimsun> aye
<ajmitch> there was a rather long discussion in the CC meeting about conflicts of interest, etc
<ajmitch> & there were 5 people nominated for 3 CC places
<ajmitch> (dholbach, mdke, mikeb, jsgotangco, burgandavia)
<LaserJock> I've dicusses a MOTU fund for sponsorships and other needs before with others
<Amaranth> So, my goal for feisty+1 is compiz being installed by default and being almost completely indistinguishable from metacity except for the extra "bling".
<ajmitch> LaserJock: yes, especially for things like hardware for those that really need it
<Amaranth> Stating this here so you can make fun of me when I fail.
<ajmitch> Amaranth: I'd expect that anyway for feisty
<ajmitch> Amaranth: why isn't it like that right now?
<Amaranth> ajmitch: driver issues and stability problems
<ajmitch> ok, we know that drivers suck
<Amaranth> i think nearly all of the stability problems are, in fact, driver issus
<Amaranth> issues*
<ajmitch> what differences are there between compiz & metacity in some of the functionality like viewports?
<ajmitch> or all the little things?
<Amaranth> all the little things
<Amaranth> doesn't help that ideas for the window placement code are coming from kwin
<ajmitch> I'd welcome compiz if it integrates seamlessly & doesn't get in the way
<ajmitch> (ie, no burning windows)
<Amaranth> apparently since kwin itself has a bunch of different window placement options
<Amaranth> ajmitch: sudo apt-get install desktop-effects, it's like that now
<ajmitch> it'd be nice, if it worked properly
<Amaranth> it even uses plain old workspaces by default and uses every metacity settings that applies to it
<ajmitch> & doesn't cause unclickable hidden windows or other stupid things
<Amaranth> don't have minimized windows when you start it :)
<ajmitch> well that's a bit stupid
<Amaranth> indeed
* ajmitch also doesn't want to have to hack xorg.conf with arbitrary magic & restart X
<Amaranth> the worst case is when it throws a window offscreen
<ajmitch> it's always rhythmbox that tends to disappear on my laptop
<ajmitch> or on my desktop..
<Amaranth> probably went offscreen
<ajmitch> "Desktop effects do not work with xinerama"
<ajmitch> real useful
<Amaranth> that's a lie
<Amaranth> 0.3.6 has xinerama support, last time i checked
<ajmitch> that's what it claims
<ajmitch> and so I can't turn it on
<ajmitch> this is just boring old nvidia twinview
<Amaranth> you can, just not with the big button
<ajmitch> no real xinerama
<ajmitch> I don't want to have to fiddle to turn it on :)
<Amaranth> turning it on doesn't register it in autostart anyway
<ajmitch> I want it to be like things in OSX, and Just Work
<Amaranth> but it does make it restart when it dies
<ajmitch> not be like the typical half-assed linux desktop :)
<LaserJock> :-)
<Amaranth> which is real fun, right now it restarts itself no matter _how_ you kill it
<Amaranth> metacity --replace? screw that, compiz is coming back on
<LaserJock> ajmitch: you should try science apps for linux ;-)
<Amaranth> how is gchemutils?
* ajmitch values his shreds of sanity
<LaserJock> Amaranth: good actually
<LaserJock> I'm working on that tonight actually
<Amaranth> ajmitch: anyway, my goal is Just Works
<LaserJock> worked last night til 3am on it
* ajmitch was going to hack on authtool again tonight to make it Shiny
<Amaranth> and a sane UI with at most 5 tabs to configure it
<ajmitch> yeah, I'm trying to minimise UI clutter :)
<LaserJock> but we are planning a release for the weekend or next week
<Amaranth> LaserJock: cool
<Amaranth> i lost interest once i couldn't work on the shiny bits :P
<LaserJock> hehe
<Amaranth> was only working on gallium because learning cairo was _fun_
<LaserJock> I'm learning C++ and a bit of GTK
<Amaranth> and i get off on efficient XML parsing ;)
<LaserJock> well, we do quite a bit of XML stuf
<LaserJock> not sure how efficient it is
<Amaranth> i'm sure it's pretty good
<Amaranth> the real problem is I/O
<LaserJock> but gchemtable is a heck of a lot faster than kalzium
<Amaranth> but kalzium does a lot of neat things
<LaserJock> on the other hand kalzium has some wicked cool stuff
<LaserJock> ;-)
<Amaranth> did you see the new element layout?
<LaserJock> yeah
<Amaranth> oh, i think you blogged about it
* Amaranth can't remember
<LaserJock> me neither
<LaserJock> I think I did
<Amaranth> that reminds me, how do i get myself on planet ubuntu?
<Amaranth> think i might blog more if i knew more than 100 people were reading it
<LaserJock> Amaranth: follow the direction
<LaserJock> +s
<Amaranth> and those 100 people are using RSS clients to poke it
<Amaranth> what directions?
* ajmitch doesn't blog, for that reason :)
<LaserJock> whatever
<Amaranth> it was fun when everyone was reading it looking for new pymusique info
<Amaranth> or new alacarte releases
<LaserJock> we need to bask in ajmitch's wisdom
<ajmitch> LaserJock: I'm sure you'll just drown in the depth of my wisdom
<LaserJock> blogging is good for people who want to talk and not work
<ajmitch> if you could drown in something barely ankle deep
<ajmitch> Amaranth: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PlanetUbuntu
<Amaranth> LaserJock: but if i talk a lot the things i do work on get more attention ;)
<nixternal> hrmm, I just did lspci and now my wifi card is totally different than what it really is
<Amaranth> there is no way http://steelgryphon.com/blog/?p=98 is real
<Amaranth> i thought only new england worked like that
<LaserJock> ajmitch: they say you can drown in 1 inch of water
<ajmitch> LaserJock: now slice that water as thin as you possibly can
<ajmitch> that's how deep my wisdom is
<LaserJock> ajmitch, you are so full of crap
<ajmitch> I agree
<Amaranth> hmm
<Amaranth> now to decide: my whole blog or just a certain tag?
<Amaranth> i don't think i've ever posted something that wouldn't fit the planet
<ajmitch> if I blogged, I wouldn't put my whole blog on planet
<ajmitch> since I *know* that I'd want to blog stuff that people wouldn't want on planet :)
<Amaranth> i suppose it can't hurt to have to tick an extra checkbox to make it go on planet
* ajmitch might put up something once this plone 2.5 setup is up & running
<LaserJock> I separate Ubuntu from others
<LaserJock> I'm also on another planet
<ajmitch> heh
<ajmitch> hi Burgundavia 
<LaserJock> so I try to keep things separated and relevant
<Burgundavia> hey ajmitch, LaserJock
<Fujitsu> Hey Burgundavia.
<Burgundavia> hey Fujitsu
<LaserJock> hi Burgundavia and Fujitsu 
* ajmitch wonders when CC voting will open :)
<Fujitsu> Hey LaserJock.
<Fujitsu> Has the Council Grayskull voting closed yet?
<Burgundavia> I urge you all to vote for me, as a for Corey is a vote for tyranny
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: tomorrow
<Burgundavia> ;)
<LaserJock> Fujitsu: ends the 15th
<ajmitch> Burgundavia: we need more tyranny
<Burgundavia> clearly
<ajmitch> keep certain people in line
<ajmitch> who needs consensus when you can rule by decree?
<LaserJock> consenus really stinks a lot of the time
<ajmitch> yeah
<LaserJock> not that it's bad in and of itself
<ajmitch> it's a fine line to try & keep people going in the same direction
<LaserJock> it just takes forever and in the end you have something that nobody feels passionate about
<LaserJock> of course a less-than-benevolent tyranny is no fun
<ajmitch> mmm, design by commitee
<ajmitch> did you read the latest CC meeting log?
<LaserJock> I didn't yet
<ajmitch> the issue of people being on multiple councils, especially
<ajmitch> there was a spirited discussion, mainly sabdfl, mako & ubuntugeek :)
<Burgundavia> and what was the conclusion?
<ajmitch> that people on multiple councils will recuse themselves from decisions in certain situations
<ajmitch> you'd need to read the logs to see
<Burgundavia> seems reasonable
<ajmitch> yeah, that was mostly sabdfl being persistent
<LaserJock> well, I honestly don't see how we can keep all the councils/governance orthogonal
<ajmitch> the other side was that someone serve on only one council
<LaserJock> unless we start voting in people just because they aren't on a team yet
<LaserJock> s/team/council/
<ajmitch> which gets pretty stupid
<ajmitch> it's not like there are that many active MOTUs, yet we'll have a council of 5
<LaserJock> well, as long as nobody nominates me for anything
<LaserJock> I don't care what they do so much ;-)
<ajmitch> aren't you already on the edubuntu council or something? :)
<LaserJock> yes, and I don't think I need more
* ajmitch nominates LaserJock for TB
<LaserJock> my term there will be up with Feisty
<LaserJock> lol
<ajmitch> though only sabdfl nominates
<LaserJock> that would be the stupidest thing ever
<ajmitch> almost as bad as me being on the TB :)
<ajmitch> they tend to have their meetings at awful times, too
<LaserJock> yep
<LaserJock> like the Launchpad meetings
<ajmitch> :)
<ajmitch> how's that going?
<LaserJock> oh, ok
<LaserJock> our bug for getting preloaded tags is in review
<ajmitch> are some are our pet bugs getting addressed?
<ajmitch> great
<LaserJock> or rather the cod for it is in review
<LaserJock> *code
<ajmitch> that's for setting a tag with +filebug?
<LaserJock> well, I gave kiko the full list that I have
<LaserJock> yeah
<ajmitch> cool
<LaserJock> I also gave him a Top 5 list
* ajmitch is tired
<LaserJock> and he said he was putting people on it
<ajmitch> I wonder if anyone will miss me if I skip this motu meeting ;)
<LaserJock> yes
<ajmitch> I don't think they'll notice
<LaserJock> of course they will
<LaserJock> you're like the MOTU Godfather or something
<ajmitch> nah
<ajmitch> more like the senile old grandfather sitting rocking on the porch
<LaserJock> lol
<LaserJock> I feel like a monkey trying to figure out this code
<LaserJock> I just see something similar and copy-n-paste and change the variable names
<ajmitch> hehe
<ajmitch> code monkey
<LaserJock> and see how it breaks
<LaserJock> then change something, see how it breaks
<LaserJock> ad infinitum
<ajmitch> fun
<LaserJock> I'm starting to get a little better then that
<LaserJock> but not a lot better
* ajmitch just thrashes around & hopes for the best with code
<ajmitch> Daniel!!
<dholbach> good morning
<dholbach> hi Andrew
<ajmitch> hi :)
<LaserJock> hi dholbach 
<dholbach> hi LaserJock
* LaserJock votes we start the meeting now
<LaserJock> :-)
<ajmitch> sure, I'm awake now :)
<Amaranth> @schedule Chicago
<Amaranth> Ubugtu: ?
<ajmitch> that'll only work in -meeting
<Amaranth> works in -offtopic too
* ajmitch shrugs
<Amaranth> ooh, MOTU meeting in 3 hours
<Amaranth> first one?
<ajmitch> no
<ajmitch> we've been having them for a couple of years now
<ajmitch> not always very regular
<ajmitch> there was one 3 weeks ago
<Amaranth> err
<Amaranth> is the council stuff done yet? :)
<ajmitch> no
<ajmitch> voting is still open
<Amaranth> ah, i thought this was the first meeting with the council in place
<ajmitch> nope
* ajmitch decides to depart for a couple of hours
<siretart> morning folks
<LaserJock> hi siretart 
<Kagou> hi
<LaserJock> \o/
* LaserJock does the "it freaking builds" dance
<LaserJock> can anybody tell me what an & is in C++?
<Lure> LaserJock: reference?
<Lure> LaserJock: in front of variable?
<crimsun> it could be a bitwise AND.
<crimsun> it depends on the context
<Lure> crimsun: right, but that is also in C...
<thill2708> why isn't mountiso in the repos?
<crimsun> do you want a serious answer to a contextless question?
<thill2708> can we do both? 
<thill2708> whichever you like first
* Lathiat puzzles
<Lathiat> did you read "to a" as "or a" ?
<thill2708> ;)
<thill2708> or a, apparently
<thill2708> heh
<Lathiat> you suck :)
<thill2708> so it seems
<thill2708> ok, so how would I ask that question better?
<LaserJock> thill2708: the problem is your question is sort of rhetorical
<LaserJock> mountiso isn't in the repos because it isn't in the repos
<crimsun> 1) no source package of that name exists in Debian
<crimsun> 2) no source package of that name exists in REVU
<crimsun> 3) no source package of that name exits in Ubuntu
<thill2708> do I have to be the author to request it into the repos?
<LaserJock> no
<thill2708> how does this usually work?
<LaserJock> but it's generally better if you do something more than "I want mountiso"
<crimsun> ---->  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/New  <----
<LaserJock> thill2708: we have a wiki page where you can request an app
<thill2708> ah, yeah, looking now
<crimsun> look, linked from the topic!
<crimsun> which people obviously never read
<thill2708> just thought I'd blurt out something before researching
<LaserJock> crimsun: context is: if (family & 1){
<LaserJock> of course, that's what we all do ;-)
<LaserJock> except crimsun of course :-)
<StevenK> LaserJock: What type is family?
<LaserJock> int
<StevenK> LaserJock: It's bitwise AND.
<LaserJock> so what is that doing then?
<StevenK> LaserJock: Which is silly, because it's the same as 'family == 1'
<LaserJock> ok, that's sort of what I thought it was
<LaserJock> but I'm not quite sure how an AND would do that
<Lure> StevenK: not precisely, it checks if family is odd number
<LaserJock> hmm, how would I do "if family == 1 or family ==0"
<StevenK> Yup, Lure is correct. I didn't check closely enough.
<LaserJock> do I just do if (family == 1 || family == 0){
<StevenK> LaserJock: No, because that isn't it. family & 1 returns true if family is odd.
<LaserJock> StevenK: can you explain for my poor chemist brain why it returns true if family is odd?
<Lure> LaserJock: bitwise AND 1 means that it checks the lowest bit in integer (bits go for 1, 2, 4, 8,...), therefore if you do bitwise AND 1, it will return true if lowest bit is 1 and since only this bit can give you odd number (all other bits give you multiple of 2 or sign (this is highest bit for int)
<Lure> LaserJock: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bitwise_operation
<Lure> LaserJock: this may be much better explaination than mine ;-)
<LaserJock> Lure: wow, ok. Interesting
<LaserJock> oh my goodness, it all works!!!!!
<siretart> bigon: re: bug #84604 
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 84604 in sylpheed "[UVF exception request]  sylpheed 2.3.1-0ubuntu1" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/84604
<siretart> bigon: I'm at work right now, so I cannot sponsor your upload ATM. perhaps you manage to find a faster sponsor than me
<LaserJock> ok guys
<LaserJock> I don't think I'm going to make it
<LaserJock> I really have to go to bed :/
<siretart> slomo: re: UVF: we did agree that the 2nd ack upload the package, didn't we?
<sistpoty> morning
<TheMuso> Hey sistpoty.
<TheMuso> Are you coming to the MOTU meeting?
<sistpoty> hi TheMuso
<sistpoty> TheMuso: sure
<siretart> huhu sistpoty!
<sistpoty> hi siretart
* TheMuso looks at the agenda.
* ajmitch drags his carcass back to the keyboard
* sistpoty needs more coffee... much more coffee *g*
<StevenK> ajmitch: Who'd you kill?
<slomo> siretart: we did? hm, maybe... will do in the future and later for the remaining ones i ack'd yesterday
<ajmitch> myself
<ajmitch> slomo: yes, it was Decreed
* ajmitch wonders if there's enough people here for the meeting, or if he can go back & sleep :)
* TheMuso is going.
<ajmitch> hi tmarble 
<tmarble> ajmitch, hello!
<ajmitch> good to see you here & congrats on your ubuntu membership now :)
<tmarble> thank you very much
<ajmitch> you're wanting to get further into the java areas?
<tmarble> i dropped in to #ubuntu-meeting as I am most keen on becoming a MOTU (looking for advice on the next steps)
<tmarble> yes, now that more and more software is being (re)licensed under open source licenses (esp. Java) I'd like to get it packaged
<ajmitch> right
<ajmitch> the next steps generally consist of doing the work & getting uploads sponsored
<ajmitch> maybe we could trade something for MOTU status, like a T2000 :)
<tmarble> hahahaha
<siretart> slomo: ajmitch: I remember we agreed on that for SRU, not sure about UVF, but that's probably a good idea anyway
* tmarble sees fabbione has been bragging about his machines :)
<ajmitch> tmarble: I installed dapper on one awhile back :)
* siretart thinks a MOTU Metting on a valantines day is a bit unfortunate
<siretart> not sure if I'm gonna make it
<ajmitch> siretart: right, it may have only been for SRU, not UVF
<ajmitch> since for UVF you may not have the whole thing to upload
<ajmitch> tmarble: a local startup got some T2000s to play with, and I ended up setting up ubuntu on one
<ajmitch> not bad machines
<ajmitch> siretart: alright, we'll understand :)
<siretart> ajmitch: T2000?
<tepsipakki> sun hardware
<tepsipakki> i guess :)
* ajmitch had the model with 16GB RAM, 8 cores
<tepsipakki> we had one too, but I never saw it
<ajmitch> I saw 4 of them in the rack (and heard)
<StevenK> They're 1 or 2RU, I can't remember which
<StevenK> And noisy as hell
<ajmitch> 2U, iirc
<tepsipakki> heh, we have a rack of 1U HP opteron-servers.. they are mighty loud :)
<tepsipakki> glad that I don't have to visit the server rooms that often anymore..
<tmarble> well, yes, they *are* loud (at the advantage of being rather energy efficient).... on the SWaP metric (including space, heat and power along with performance) they outperform the competition 5x to 8x
<ajmitch> they're also quite fast (for certain tasks) :)
<siretart> ah, this remembers me, I did talk to michael at the local departement here, looks like we could setup a sprac dev machine for MOTUs
<ajmitch> that's good
<ajmitch> it's still officially supported (for server at least)
* tsmithe wonders why sparc is supported but not ppc
<ajmitch> tsmithe: canonical deals, perhaps?
<tsmithe> sounds likely
<ajmitch> sabdfl isn't likely to drop sparc after making a big show of supporting it
<tsmithe> guess not
<tmarble> well, and i think ubuntu has benefited from our partnership (lot's of media attention shared both ways)
<ajmitch> certainly
<ajmitch> and there are likely to be customers who run ubuntu on sparc
<tmarble> it's actually quite nice
* tmarble is not a solaris evangelist :)
<tsmithe> well, i wouldn't know (:
* ajmitch certainly preferred having a familiar linux system on sparc 
<siretart> however, there is still no sun java jre for linux/sparc. a showstopper at least for our departement
* ajmitch ran into that as well
<tmarble> siretart, i am exquisitely aware of that (and we are working on it)
<siretart> tmarble: cool! great to hear!
<geser> lionel: didn't notice it (only checked on packages.ubuntu.com) but as I don't know how to fix this ftbfs on ia64 I'll leave it like this for now
<lionel> geser: ia64 is not officialy supported btw
<lionel> (and not a current arch I think...)
<geser> should we sync iceape for replace of mozilla-browser?
<sistpoty> geser: imo we should... but feel free to ask on -devel maybe s.o. has a different opinion there
<ajmitch> ok
<ajmitch> now I can get to bed before midnight :)
<ajmitch> yay
<sistpoty> hehe
<ajmitch> I'll try & get lists & bugs filed asap
<sistpoty> :)
<TheMuso> heh
* TheMuso commences minutes work.
<ajmitch> night all :)
<TheMuso> night ajmitch.
<Fujitsu> Night ajmitch.
<TheMuso> Heya Fujitsu.
<Fujitsu> Hi TheMuso.
<sistpoty> gn8 ajmitch
<Fujitsu> Hey sistpoty.
<sistpoty> hi Fujitsu
<dholbach> sistpoty: thanks (motu/faq)
<dholbach> :)
<sistpoty> dholbach: you're welcome ;)
* Fujitsu blinks.
<Fujitsu> 4400 {un,mult}iverse bugs... Not much fun.
<Fujitsu> Hey Hobbsee.
<Hobbsee> hey Fujitsu!
<Hobbsee> how's the meeting?
<TheMuso> Finished.
<sistpoty> hi Hobbsee
<sistpoty> Hobbsee: we're done already 
<Hobbsee> ah, fair enough
<Adri2000> hi
<Adri2000> did anyone log the meeting? (I hope so :)) I was at school... :/
<Hobbsee> !logs
<ubotu> Channel logs can be found at http://people.ubuntu.com/~fabbione/irclogs
<Fujitsu> Hobbsee, they're probably not there yet.
* TheMuso did, as well as ajmitch.
<TheMuso> I'm doing the minutes now.
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: some of them might be
* tsmithe waves at everyone
<TheMuso> Hey tsmithe.
<Adri2000> TheMuso: can you put it at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/MOTU ?
<Adri2000> hi tsmithe 
<Hobbsee> hey tsmithe!
<tsmithe> :)
<TheMuso> Adri2000: Once I have written it, and posted to the ML, I will wikify it and put it up.
<Adri2000> ok
* tsmithe wishes for his shiny new cloak
<Hobbsee> NO SHINY CLOAKS FOR TSMITHE!
<tsmithe> can i have a matt cloak then?
<Hobbsee> nope
<tsmithe> :'(
* Fujitsu graffitis tsmithe's future cloaks.
* tsmithe grabs a past cloak
<tsmithe> hehe you didn't think of that
<Fujitsu> Damnit.
* Fujitsu thinks of a better plan.
* tsmithe steals Fujitsu's brain
* tsmithe fails cos he couldn't find it
* sistpoty heads off to uni
<sistpoty> later folks
<fernando> moin all
<tsmithe> hi fernando 
* TheMuso sends minutes to mailing list.
<TheMuso> Now to prepare for wiki upload.
<Hobbsee> siretart: can you ack https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ksynaptics/+bug/84738 please, per the last comment?
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 84738 in ksynaptics "UVFe request: ksynaptics" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  
<enyc> Hrrm I wonder who is going to test 77485 / 78005 SRU updates.... they definitely work.. using both the new packages on machines of my own... and 'sheer' uses them too...
<Hobbsee> oh damn, i wanted to give feedback over UVF
<Hobbsee> thanks TheMuso 
<enyc> I dont know what the proceuder is when there seems to be limited-use of a simple SRU fix that does work but not enough testers !
<Hobbsee> !logs
<ubotu> Channel logs can be found at http://people.ubuntu.com/~fabbione/irclogs
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: np.
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: YOu can always reply to the relevant part from the minutes on the mailing list.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: true :)
<TheMuso> THeres a big email I need to reply to on the accessibility list actually, but I need a fully awake brain to do so. :)
<TheMuso> How do logs usually get put on the wiki for meetings? Automatically, or manually? If manually, where does one get the log in the format all the other logs are in?
<TheMuso> Ah I see
<TheMuso> depends on who uploads them.
<TheMuso> Anyways, I'm outa here folks.
<TheMuso> gah! How does one make sure new lines are new lines?
<TheMuso> If anybody could please fix up the formatting on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/MOTU_2007-02-14, I'd much appreciate it. I am no wiki guru, and just don't know how to do it right. :)
<Lutin> ajmitch: the file mlt++_0.2.2+cvs20070214-0ubuntu1.dsc seems to be stuck in revu, could you nuke it ?
<xerxas> Hi all 
* enyc looks for replies above...
<enyc> hrrm
<enyc> I dont know what the MOTU SRU procedure is for whet there seem to be limited users of a working fix and there is trouble getting sufficent testers ;-)
<enyc> which is a problem for 77485 / 78005 bugs
* proppy hugs dholbach
<bddebian> Heya gang
<geser> Hi bddebian
<Ursinha> Ursinha, hi hi
<bddebian> Hello geser, Ursinha
<Q-FUNK> do we have a feisty BSP channel?
<crimsun> #ubuntu-bugs is the "bug channel"
<Q-FUNK> crimsun: ah yes, that's the droid I was looking for :)
<bddebian> heh
<Q-FUNK> weird bug with pulseaudio on feisty.  no sound and when launching an audio ap from commandline, some complaint about starting as  suid root withotu being a member of pulse-rg group.
<crimsun> purely diagnostic
<crimsun> you can add your user to pulse-rt
<Q-FUNK> me senses it's gonna be a dist-upgrade issue for many
<Q-FUNK> (rhythmbox:5919): GStreamer-CRITICAL **: gst_element_dispose: assertion `GST_STATE_PENDING (element) == GST_STATE_VOID_PENDING' failed
<Q-FUNK> crimsun: yup, I added all users there.
<Q-FUNK> I still get the above.
<Retardedpope> I would like to see "GPRS easy connect" in feisty, could anyone pack it?
<Retardedpope> (before the feature freeze for univers)
<lionel> Retardedpope: could you add it to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/Candidates
<Retardedpope> lionel: I'll do that...
<Retardedpope> lionel: or not, it's there already
<lionel> :)
<geser> oh, an other bddebian :)
<bddebian2> mwuhahaha
<jdong> aah! singular identity!
<jdong> NO NO NO NO NO!!!
* jdong burns philosophy homework
<jdong> bddebian: are you the integration with zombie bddebian2?
<bddebian> heh
<geser> two bddebian can do twice as much work as one bddebian
<bddebian> Are you kidding, two bddebians can suck twice the intelligence out of this room :-)
<zul> heh sven luther as dpl....that will be the day
<Laser_away> dholbach: do you think the "packaging" and "bitsize" tags are a bit too generic?
<dholbach> no, I don't :)
<Laser_away> how will be separate Main from Universe, or bitsize for docs/artwork/etc. ?
<Laser_away> dholbach: seems like we should use motu-*
<dholbach> assign or subscribe motu and then mark 'bitEsize'
<Laser_away> but then how do can't just search for motu tags
<dholbach> https://launchpad.net/~motu/+subscribedbugs?field.searchtext=&orderby=-importance&search=Search&field.status%3Alist=Unconfirmed&field.status%3Alist=Needs+Info&field.status%3Alist=Confirmed&field.status%3Alist=In+Progress&field.status%3Alist=Fix+Committed&assignee_option=any&field.assignee=&field.owner=&field.status_upstream=&field.status_upstream-empty-marker=1&field.omit_dupes.used=&field.omit_dupes=on&field.has_patch.used=&field.tag=bites
<dholbach> ize
<dholbach> you can search for tags
<Laser_away> I guess
<Laser_away> seems overly complicated but it would keep the number of tags down
<dholbach> what do you you suggest?
<dholbach> I don't think that tagging bugs is complicated
<dholbach> we can have  tinyurl  for those canned searches on MOTU/Bugs
<Laser_away> I just wonder how much people will really pay attention to them
<bdmurray> dholbach: I think tagging bugs is harder than it should be though
<dholbach> I think it's a lightweight process of indicating "here's a problem that lies in packaging"
<Laser_away> sure
<Laser_away> I just think people might search for motu-* tags
<Laser_away> to see what different things are going on, etc.
<Laser_away> but as you say, assigning or subscribing motu would fix that I guess
<dholbach> I think we should have ONE specific tag across the distro
<Laser_away> along with the canned searches
<dholbach> you can still search for universe bugs among them
<Laser_away> I just wonder how useful a tag is if it's so general that you have to then do more searching to narrow down the results
<Laser_away> but I see your point
<dholbach> because a new contributor wants to see bitesize tasks because she wants to help out
<dholbach> at the moment there is NO bitesize task at all
<dholbach> and I guess she doesn't care if it's in Universe or Main :)
<siretart_> bitesize? what's that?
<dholbach> siretart_: a thing that you can fix "in one bite" :)
<siretart_> wow
<siretart_> :)
<dholbach> siretart_: if you don't want to "bite off more than you can chew" :)
<siretart_> so I can mark all my bugs which I'm to lazy to upload just as bitesize, and hope somebody else does it :)
<dholbach> yeah
<dholbach> i wrote a mail to bugsquad and motu to mark bugs as bitesize and packaging
<dholbach> I think it's a good way to get bugs fixed and people involved
<dholbach> we have some in the bughelper project too
<Laser_away> dholbach: I understand what you are saying, but people "do" care if it's in Universe or Main
<siretart_> "'bitesize' if you think that it's suitable for a beginner."
<siretart_> that sounds really useful
<Laser_away> perhaps the approach from ~motu works fine
<dholbach> Laser_away: you can still make the distinction if you care
<dholbach> if you feel strong about it, let's discuss on the mailing list
<dholbach> i'll approve your mails on ubuntu-bugsquad@.
<Laser_away> I just need to think about it
<siretart_> with 'beginner' you mean a MOTU hopeful
<dholbach> yeah
<Laser_away> hmm, I guess I'm not on that list
<Laser_away> I should be I suppose ;-)
<siretart_> espc. if the package is already in bzr :)
<superm1> bddebian, you around?
<herzi> what's the ubuntu way of doing an RFP (request for package)? is there a meta-package so I can file those requests as bugs?
<mr_pouit> herzi, you can add it on this page: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/Candidates
<keescook> I'm still confused about universe UVF; it seems to be listed twice on the Feisty schedule (8th and 22nd)
<LaserJock> nope
<LaserJock> 22nd is Feature Freeze
<keescook> LaserJock: ah, okay.
<sistpoty> hi folks
<fernando> hi sistpoty 
<sistpoty> hi fernando
<ajmitch> morning
<sistpoty> hi ajmitch
<LaserJock> hi ajmitch 
<LaserJock> hmm
<LaserJock> I wonder how a "Software freedom is highly overated" planet post would go over? :-)
<zul> afternoon ajmitch
<zul> LaserJock: you will probably burst into flames
<ajmitch> LaserJock: it'd be a great way to invite flames
<LaserJock> hmm
<LaserJock> maybe I could tone it down a little bit
<_ion> We'll have to limit the freedoms of your software, otherwise the terrists win.
<sistpoty> lol
<LaserJock> as long as I don't get RMS goonies at my door  I'd probably survive ;-)
<ajmitch> even the slightest concessions will get raving hordes beating down your door ;)
<zul> of course if no one reads your blog then you are probably ok
<LaserJock> yeah, that too
<LaserJock> just seems like there could be some balance
<zul> you can do it
<ajmitch> go for it
<ajmitch> we'll cheer you on
<LaserJock> hehe. until you flame me :-)
<ajmitch> I'd never
<ajmitch> ooh, 4h45 until motu council votes close
<LaserJock> sweet
<LaserJock> that has been like the longest vote ever
<ajmitch> CC will be longer
<ajmitch> about 3 months to get nominations, how long to get votes?
<LaserJock> oh geeze, that's going to be fun
<zul> LaserJock: I might flame you....I might not ;)
<zul> most likely not..
<ajmitch> can you resist it?
<sistpoty> LaserJock: I'd wait until the vote is done before you post :P
<LaserJock> I'm not being voted on so I don't care
<LaserJock> it'll take me 5-6 hrs to write the stupid thing anyway
<zul> ajmitch: nope
<ajmitch> sistpoty: why would the vote have anything to do with LaserJock trolling? ;)
<sistpoty> ajmitch: because I thought LaserJock would also be in MC... I blame the lack of sleep tonight *g*
<LaserJock> ajmitch: trolling? surely not ;-)
<ajmitch> nah he can troll away to his heart's content
<ajmitch> heh
<zul> trolling = giving an alternate point of view
<sistpoty> hehe
<LaserJock> zul: of course
<TheMuso> Hey MOTUs and hopefuls. :)
<Ademan_> is there any way to see previously revu-ed packages?
<Ademan_> or more importantly, just a list of the packages that will be in fiesty
<mr_pouit> Ademan, you can see archived packages on this page : http://revu.tauware.de/index.py?archived=true
<Ademan_> thanks
<bddebian> OK, shoveling snow sucks.  Bring on the Global Warming!!
<TheMuso> haha
<Ursinha> bddebian, hahahah :)
<imbrandon> moins all
<bddebian> Heya imbrandon
<imbrandon> heya bddebian 
<sistpoty> hi imbrandon
<bddebian> Heya sistpoty
<jdong> is nickserv not talking ot me or something?
<sistpoty> hi bddebian
<imbrandon> heya sistpoty 
<LaserJock> hi *
<imbrandon> ello LaserJock 
<bddebian> Heya LaserJock
<imbrandon> bddebian, i'm righht with you there, tooo much snow here for my taste
<imbrandon> and ICE, i hate ICE
<imbrandon> i did a 360 on the highway comming home from work yesterday
<imbrandon> luckly i dident wreck
<LaserJock> imbrandon: the joys of living in rural Montana, we used to go ice-skating with out cars ;-)
<LaserJock> s/out/our/
<jdong> LaserJock: ice skating is more fun in cars
<jdong> LaserJock: I call it SUV skating
<jdong> you can get like 21 mpg while skating
<imbrandon> roflmao
<jdong> (in city that is)
<jdong> and a very nasty hospital visit in highway.
<imbrandon> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BcRMmA3oKxA&feature=PlayList&p=D985A2229718FA8D&index=0
<jdong> and imbrandon , I know how you feel, I still remember when I spun out on the highway
<jdong> from tapping the brakes on a non-ABS car
<imbrandon> i drive a chevy blazer suv
<imbrandon> with abs , and still spun
<imbrandon> heh
<TheMuso> Heya imbrandon.
<imbrandon> hey TheMuso 
<jdong> imbrandon: ouch then that's just slick weather :)
<jdong> imbrandon: find a slipping rabbit (hmm, what do you call the ice-testing equiv of a rabbit?)
<ScottK> Sorry I couldn't make the MOTU meeting.
* ScottK has read the minutes/irc log and is happy with the results on his adgenda item.
<ScottK> Thanks.
<sistpoty> ScottK: could you please check MOTU/FAQ if that's clear enough?
<ScottK> Will do.
<sistpoty> thx
<sistpoty> oh, and TheMuso: excellent minutes, thanks a lot :)
<TheMuso> sistpoty: np.
<ScottK> sistpoty: I think that "may lead to problems" is, um, problematic.  Assuming the audience is people who don't know a lot about packaging, I think the FAQ should either say what bad thing will happen (and let the packager decide/ask if it's a problem) or be directive and say "If you need to remove a file from the upstream debian dir, you need remove it and repack the original tarball instead".
<sistpoty> ScottK: oh, right... would you mind correcting this?
<ScottK> I'll take a shot at it and then ask you to review.
<sistpoty> ScottK: great, thanks
<ScottK> sistpoty: How's that?
<sistpoty> ScottK: nice. thanks!
<ScottK> NP
<enyc> hrrm
<enyc> bother
<enyc> meep moop
<enyc> Somebody please tell me what the right thing todo is where there seem to be limited users of a working SRU universe fix and there is trouble getting sufficent testers to 'Works_For_Me' -- which is now a problem for 77485 78005  bugs.
<sistpoty> enyc: try to find more testers... e.g. you could ask around on #ubuntu, or you could write into the forums (well, I want to make a forum thread tonight anyways, once I've written the next sru-report)
<sistpoty> enyc: well, I guess we could make exceptions for really non-breaking SRU's like these two... but I don't want to make a decision on this yet, and rather wait two more weeks to see if the testing situation will improve
<mattb> hi there, I've just added myself to the team in launchpad, so that I can upload to REVU
<mattb> apparently I ask someone here to sync the keyring now?
<jdong> ajmitch: ^^?
<sistpoty> mattb: I'm on it
<mattb> cheers :)
<sistpoty> mattb: will take a few minutes until the script is finished
<mattb> ok, I'll sit patiently 
<sistpoty> mattb: done
<mattb> excellent, many thanks
<sistpoty> you're welcome
<Lutin> rexbron: ping
<rexbron> Lutin: hey
<rexbron> Lutin: I take it you got my email?
<Lutin> rexbron: I actually didn't understand why you mailed me ;)
<rexbron> Lutin: cause you packaged it, wondered if you did the debian/copyright by hand, or with a script
<Lutin> rexbron: I've never packages cinelerra
<rexbron> Lutin: you also changed the upstream debian files
<rexbron> Lutin: it was in regard to one of your packages that had many entries into debian/copyright
<rexbron> Lutin: WE are packaging Cinelerra, but do not look forward to having to comb through all the files manually for copyright info
<rexbron> also by we, I mean Ubuntu Studio
<Lutin> rexbron: sorry, I checked all the files manually when packaging mlt
<rexbron> damn
<rexbron> ok
<Lutin> rexbron: it's really difficult to script such stuff
<Lutin> it assumes all the (C) are written the same way in all the files, which is likely not going to happen
<rexbron> It would be a nice tool to have
<Lutin> indeed
<Lutin> it's really painful to check every single file
<LaserJock> it's probably more painful when we have to remove the package from the repos because it's undistributable
<LaserJock> but yeah
<Lutin> missing licenses in some files are also painful
<tsmithe> hum. anyone wanna put a word in, or help out with the UbuntuStudio project's review of cinelerra licences (so we can get it into universe) https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuStudio/CinelerraReview
<LaserJock> tsmithe: what is there to do exactly?
<LaserJock> have you put it on REVU yet?
<tsmithe> some of the files are not under the same licence that the LICENSE file implies
<tsmithe> and there are even non-free fonts distributed
<rexbron> LaserJock: we need update the debian/copyright to reflect everything
<tsmithe> (even in a gpl app)
<rexbron> cinelerra = mess
<rexbron> for licencing
<LaserJock> hehe, I know
<Lutin> multimedia = mess actually
<LaserJock> but what are you doing about it?
<tsmithe> read the spec :)
<LaserJock> has -cv decided what to do?
<tsmithe> upstream are indifferent
<LaserJock> so are you removing the fonts?
<tsmithe> of course
<tsmithe> amongst other things
<tsmithe> (*urges to read the spec*)
<LaserJock> does the unlicensed code come from heroine?
<tsmithe> i don't know yet
<tsmithe> probably
<tsmithe> *sigh*
<LaserJock> I feel better if it comes from heroine
<LaserJock> if it's code from elsewhere it's a bigger mess
<tsmithe> well
<tsmithe> they include libquicktime, etc
<tsmithe> it's all in bzr if you want to check it out
<LaserJock> but are those parts that don't have licenses/copyrights ?
<tsmithe> some... some just aren't GPL and aren't noted down as such
<tsmithe> (as i said, the LICENSE suggests everything is GPL, which is plainly isn't)
<LaserJock> are the licenses compatible?
<tsmithe> i'm not 100% sure of the entire situation yet. this is why we're running this review
<Lutin> sistpoty: ping: even with debian policy, I don't really understand when the lib soversion has to be appended to the package name in a -dev package (eg libfoo1-dev vs libfoo-dev). any clues ?
<LaserJock> well, I have doubts if cinerella will ever make it
<tsmithe> why?
<tsmithe> pessimist :P
<LaserJock> I'm almost positive it's won't make it in Feisty
<tsmithe> really?
<LaserJock> I think heroine and -cv are illegaly distributing code
<tsmithe> that's sad
<bddebian> Lutin: Have you read the library packaging guide?
<tsmithe> they are
<tsmithe> they just don't care
<Lutin> bddebian: yes
<tsmithe> (hence multiple *sigh*s)
<sistpoty> Lutin: usually you don't append it to the -dev package, unless you plan to have two incompatible versions of the same library in the archives
<LaserJock> I don't think Ubuntu wants to have that
<tsmithe> LaserJock, that's what we're out to fix)
<LaserJock> tsmithe: but only the author can fix it
<LaserJock> that's the problem
<tsmithe> why?
<Lutin> sistpoty: ok, thanks :)
<LaserJock> because the author is the only entity that can change the license
<LaserJock> you can't just relicense things for people ;-)
<tsmithe> we're not changing anything, i hope
<LaserJock> I think heroine is the root of the issue
<LaserJock> you'll have to
<LaserJock> you have to have license/copyright info
<LaserJock> unless you can convince heroine to look at their code and fix it I think it's not going to get anywhere
<tsmithe> bahrgh
<LaserJock> unless -cv steps up
<LaserJock> but it doesn't sound like they are very willing to do it
<rexbron> LaserJock: cv is lazy
<LaserJock> but even then, I don't know that they can relicense the stuff
<LaserJock> since they got it from heroine, I'm assuming
<tsmithe> i don't think they can
<LaserJock> well, the only thing I can really see (if sending a patch doesn't work) is asking the FSF to step in
* _MMA_ kick LaserJock in the butt for the disheartening remarks. :(
<LaserJock> sorry _MMA_ 
<_MMA_> :)
<LaserJock> I just don't want you guys to waste your time
<LaserJock> if it's not going to work
<tsmithe> come on LaserJock!
<tsmithe> it's only 5200 files! :P
#ubuntu-motu 2007-02-15
<LaserJock> yeah, 5200 files of possibly illegaly distributed code
<_MMA_> It gonna work. Probably just not in the time frame we wanted.
<LaserJock> awesome :-)
<LaserJock> that's my assesment
* tsmithe spent all that time on getting that process documented as well. better not be wasted. took aaaagggges
<ajmitch> mattb: good to see you getting stuck in
<mattb> I'm having a competition to see whether this package gets through NEW or REVU faster :p
<ajmitch> hm, good luck there
<ajmitch> what's the package?
<mattb> libtrace3
<ajmitch> right, I see it
<mattb> http://research.wand.net.nz/software/libtrace.php
<ajmitch> we'd usually want the first ubuntu version to be -0ubuntu1, but this is probably a special case since it's in NEW
<ajmitch> ah, a WAND project?
<TheMuso> Morning ajmitch.
<ajmitch> hi TheMuso 
<TheMuso> Or for you I should be saying good afternoon.
<LaserJock> anybody know where an .xsession-error would be in a RHEL system?
<mattb> ajmitch: yep a wand project
<ajmitch> mattb: one main problem
<ajmitch> +libtrace3 (3.0.0-1ubuntu1) fiesty; urgency=low
<ajmitch> it's feisty, not fiesty
<mattb> I debated over the version, but as you say, given it's already in new 1ubuntu1 seemed to make most sens
<mattb> ajmitch: oh, bugger
<ajmitch> LaserJock: what do you suggest for DDs uploading to REVU? 1 ACK is ok? :)
<LaserJock> wouldn't that make syncing a problem in the future
<LaserJock> depends on the DD :p
<mattb> next debian revision will be -2, which is > 1ubuntu1 
<mattb> so syncs should be fine?
<LaserJock> well, but syncing -1 wouldn't work
<TheMuso> ajmitch: dd or MOTUs?
<ajmitch> LaserJock: but he doesn't want to sync -1
<ajmitch> since it's stuck in debian NEW
<LaserJock> mattb: will there be Ubuntu changes in the future?
<ajmitch> TheMuso: DDs
<mattb> highly unlikely
<TheMuso> ok
<LaserJock> ajmitch: but we'd want to get rid of the ubuntu1 if we could
<LaserJock> so we'd sync -1
<mattb> the point of this upload is to get it into feisty asap
<ajmitch> but we don't want to miss the freeze
<LaserJock> either way it's not a big deal
<mattb> rather than having to wait for it to get through NEW and then sync
<ajmitch> debian NEW is crawling at the moment
<LaserJock> well, I was just saying, if you have to change fiesty -> feisty
<ajmitch> it may not get out for another couple of weeks
<LaserJock> why not 1ubuntu1 -> 0ubuntu1 for completness
<ajmitch> LaserJock: are you suggesting it be uploaded with -1build1?
<LaserJock> no, althought that's not a exactly the worst idea ;-)
<LaserJock> s/a//
<LaserJock> any recovering RHELers want to help me find .xsession-errors?
<LaserJock> Gnome and KDE won't start up
<LaserJock> I'm guessing something must be going wrong at login
<LaserJock> but I can't figure out where to look
* LaserJock curses RedHat under his breath
<TheMuso> LaserJock: I thought they were in the home directory.
<LaserJock> TheMuso: I can't find it
<TheMuso> hmmm
<TheMuso> I guess you could always do a find / -name .xsession-errors :)
<ajmitch> LaserJock: /tmp or /home full? :)
<LaserJock> not even close
<LaserJock> that's what the KDE login says
<LaserJock> I tried moving .gnome* and .gconf*
<LaserJock> but both Gnome and KDE have the problem
<LaserJock> it just gives me a blue screen and a cursor
<mattb> so, shall I upload again with feisty spelt correctly, and 0ubuntu1 ?
<ajmitch> mattb: you may as well
<ajmitch> & then it can sit & bitrot in ubuntu NEW
<mattb> heh
<ajmitch> though the oldest things in there are only 9 days
<bddebian> heh
<imbrandon> 
<imbrandon> quiet night
<lotusleaf> starry night
<_ion> hungry night
<sistpoty> I'm tired, right?
<imbrandon> sistpoty, yea
<sistpoty> hi imbrandon
<imbrandon> heya
<_ion> No, you're suffering from caffeine deficiency.
<sistpoty> hehe
<Hobbsee> imbrandon!!!
<sistpoty> hi Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: i'm grabbing various fixes for amarok upstream at the moment, FYI
<Hobbsee> hey sistpoty :)
<imbrandon> heya Hobbsee 
<imbrandon> Hobbsee, rockin
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: :)  i am useful for something, i think
<imbrandon> hehe
<superm1> hey imbrandon, ya didnt get the mythtv and mythplugins uploaded by uvf...... i filed a uvfe for them
<imbrandon> superm1, sorry slipped my mind
<imbrandon> i'll try to help it get pussed
<superm1> imbrandon, not a problem as long as motu-uvf gets them approved :)
<imbrandon> pushed*
<superm1> awesome thanks
<imbrandon> hrm
<LaserJock> I'm so close to having my mirror done :-)
<lotusleaf> LaserJock: who is the fairest fawn of all?
<LaserJock> Feisty of course
<lotusleaf> !chocsnack
<ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about chocsnack - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
<LaserJock> until the cruel hunter kills Feisty's dad
<imbrandon> LaserJock, you makin a mirror at the edu too?
<imbrandon> full rsync ?
<LaserJock> imbrandon: I'm using reprepo to make a mirror of i386/source main/universe at home
<imbrandon> ahh cool
<LaserJock> it's a bit of an experiment
<LaserJock> but as I'll have 3 feisty machines tonight, I thought it'd be nice
<LaserJock> also having all of the source locally will make packaging a bit more fun
<sistpoty> well, I used apt-proxy as a cache for several machines... worked quite nice until apt-proxy switched to twisted. however that was some years ago
<LaserJock> sure
* imbrandon just runs a full rsync mirror ;)
<LaserJock> but I'm investigating repo stuff
<sistpoty> mini-dinstall is ... kinda ugly, but it works for me :)
<LaserJock> yeah, I did that too
<imbrandon> falcon ftw as far as making a repo
<LaserJock> well, I can't use falcon exactly
<imbrandon> why?
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: once you find hte easiest and most useful, do tell me about it :)
<Hobbsee> or come to think of it, i wonder if imbrandon can do repos on buntudot, so i wouldnt have to figure it out...
<Hobbsee> :P
<bddebian> WTF???
<bddebian> bdefreese@bdubuntu1:~/revu/acroread-asianfonts$ linda ../../pbuild-feisty/result/acroread-asianfonts_7.0.1-0ubuntu1_i386.deb
<bddebian> Roses are red, violets are blue,
<bddebian> lintian is dead and Culus goes moo.
<Hobbsee> bddebian: haha
<imbrandon> ll
<imbrandon> +o
<LaserJock> imbrandon: well, falcon isn't in the repos
<LaserJock> imbrandon: and for what I'm doing I need to just use stuff that's in the repos
<imbrandon> i supose i could talk Seveas into letting me upload it ;) its a little late now though
<imbrandon> what are you doing anyhow?
<LaserJock> oh, a little something
<LaserJock> reprepo was really easy though
<LaserJock> I'm not sure what the speed was
<LaserJock> it took something like 4 days or so
<LaserJock> ok, back to the blog post, it's only taken me like 7 hrs
<imbrandon> heh
<LaserJock> silly work, don't they know I have more important things to do, like blog about FLOSS
<imbrandon> hrm anyone know how to make a dhcp server ( ubuntu ) serv a certain ip based on MAC
<imbrandon> or where i can find the docs, google sucks
<imbrandon> hrm , i think i found it
<sistpoty> imbrandon: man dhcpd.conf... it's really straightforward
<LaserJock> man, I can't wait to get home and upgrade my server desktop to Feisty
<LaserJock> hmm, I wonder if update-manager would accept my mirror
<LaserJock> I'm guessing not
<LaserJock> heh, update-manager doesn't have a man page
<LaserJock> tsk tsk
<bddebian> heh
<imbrandon> lol
<ajmitch> ah, computers
* ajmitch hates them
* bddebian too
<LaserJock> ajmitch: they are aweful aren't they
<ajmitch> yes
* ajmitch should take up a life of gardening or something
<LaserJock> the more I use them the more I hate them
<LaserJock> one of great curses on geeks everywhere
<crimsun> and on non-geeks, too.
<imbrandon> heh beowolf cluster of veggies
<bddebian> I need to look for a new job and I'm thinking construction or something
<LaserJock> I wouldn't even be good at McDonalds
<LaserJock> if I don't get a job as a Chemist I don't know what I'll do ;-)
* imbrandon wants to wonder the world going to FLOSS confrences
<bddebian> I found some Linux jobs around here but I ain't gonna make what I do now :-(
<LaserJock> bddebian: what do you do now?
<bddebian> My title is IT Manager but I'm really a "jack of all trades, master of bation"
<bddebian> Sometimes DBA, ERP implementation, help-desk, programmer...
<bddebian> network admin, foo, bar...
<ajmitch> man, and you stoop down to our level & help with ubuntu?
* ajmitch is just a code monkey 
<imbrandon> bddebian, sound like my job
<ajmitch> bddebian is probably earning 3x what I do
<imbrandon> probably 2X me
<imbrandon> hehe
<bddebian> Not quite at 6 figures yet unless you count bonuses :-(
<ajmitch> 'not quite'?
<ajmitch> man
<LaserJock> sesh
<ajmitch> mine's only 6 figures if you count the zeros after the decimal point
<ajmitch> so bddebian probably earns > 4x what I do
<imbrandon> yea about 2X me
<LaserJock> bddebian: I make 20k :/
<bddebian> I'm also old, married and have 3 kids guys :-)
* ajmitch earns about 26K (in USD)
<imbrandon> i make arround 60K there abouts, plus bennies
<LaserJock> bddebian: I'm married and my wife is currently unemployed. No kids though
* sistpoty is just a poor student
<LaserJock> me too
<LaserJock> what a sob story
<bddebian> :-(
<sistpoty> LaserJock: but you earn money... I don't ;)
<LaserJock> "Destitute MOTUs go on strike for higher wages" :-)
* ajmitch is working fulltime for that 26K
<bddebian> LaserJock: Well I wasn't smart enough to finish College until I was about 30 :)
<sistpoty> *cough*
<ajmitch> LaserJock: which means that bddebian probably got his phd in something :)
<LaserJock> sistpoty: true, my school is nice that way
<bddebian> ajmitch: Hah, I don't even have a masters :-(
<ajmitch> bddebian: so we know who to ask for donations when we are starving :)
<imbrandon> hehehe
<bddebian> Sure :-)
<ajmitch> hey, we were just talking about a MOTU fund yesterday...
* ajmitch passes the hat around
<imbrandon> i'm still paying off everything though, from the 12+ months i dident work 
<bddebian> OK damnit, I have gotten that goofy linda "error" now twice and I've never seen it before
<bddebian> ajmitch: Well remember I've also sold my soul to M$ :-)
* TheMuso is still looking for employment, just something entry leve at this point, due to not having a hell of a lot of IT quals, but was sick of studying.
<ajmitch> bddebian: that's ok, I'll remember that when I'm starving & broke ;)
<LaserJock> TheMuso: do people hire for accesability work at all?
<bddebian> TheMuso: Just go get an MSCE, they don't care :-)
<bddebian> Err MCSE even
<TheMuso> LaserJock: THere isn't the market for Linux accessibility atm.
<TheMuso> bddebian: I said I was sick of studying, and don't really want to go back to the books for another year at least.
<bddebian> :-)
<TheMuso> LaserJock: And the Windows accessibility market is rather ted up already, and since I haven't used those technologies for a while, I wouldn't be able to get a job doing that.
<TheMuso> s/ted/tied/
<TheMuso> Including my standard school education, I was studying for 16 years.
<ajmitch> that's not long
<TheMuso> From when I first started school, to when I finished an IT related course last year.
<bddebian> TheMuso: There's always the military :-)
<TheMuso> bddebian: um............. no..........
<TheMuso> And that also included a music degree.
<bddebian> Something wrong with the military?
<TheMuso> But I don't want a music career either.
<TheMuso> bddebian: If you didn't know already, I have a vision impairement.
<bddebian> Oh, no, I didn't know that
<ajmitch> it doesn't really show over irc :)
<TheMuso> Of course it doesn't.
* ajmitch has a sanity impairment
<TheMuso> People who haven't got a disability being involved with acecssibility related work is rather rare.
<TheMuso> accessibility even
* bddebian is intelligence impaired
* sistpoty is the only normal guy of the world *g*
<bddebian> sistpoty: :-)
<LaserJock> TheMuso: I'm still amazed sometimes at how much you are able to do and how fast
<LaserJock> heno too
<LaserJock> it's really cool
<ajmitch> sistpoty: yes, I'm sure you're normal ;)
<LaserJock> well, impairment isn't cool
<TheMuso> LaserJock: Heno is truely amazing.
<LaserJock> but people still being able to use computers is
<TheMuso> Yeah.
* bddebian isn't touching netbeans5.5
<TheMuso> LaserJock: Its always an uphill battle for people like myself, but we get by with what we have.
<TheMuso> In terms of things in life not being thought through for accessibility reasons.
<TheMuso> Like visual verification on websites for one.
<imbrandon> hum
<TheMuso> Sites do offer alternate means to do what you want, but its not always the best alternative.
<ajmitch> TheMuso: how impaired is your vision?
<ajmitch> ie, how do you manage with something like irc?
<TheMuso> ajmitch: Well I am legally blind, am a Braille reader, can read large print slowly.
<TheMuso> Can't exactly remember how much vision I actually have.
<ajmitch> right
<TheMuso> And I also use synthesized speech.
* ajmitch had a friend who is completely blind, it was impressive watching her use a computer
* TheMuso is using irssi on the console, with a very much screwed speakup atm.
<TheMuso> ajmitch: WHo was that?
<ajmitch> just a student at the hall of residence I was at
<LaserJock> TheMuso: that's what I find amazing, I would never know from your irc converstions
<LaserJock> it seems like it would take me forever to be able to "read" and write like that
<imbrandon> yea i never knew untill it was popinted out
<TheMuso> LaserJock: Since I have been vision impaired since birth, I have grown up learning alternative ways for reading and writing.
<TheMuso> SO I started learning Braille when I started school, and also learnt to read print concurrently.
<TheMuso> Then started learning to type in my third year of school.
<TheMuso> That was 1990, and have been typing ever since.
<TheMuso> I can also write braille if the need arrises.
<LaserJock> how good is the the synthesized speech? what happens if there is a typo or non-standard word?
<_ion> I'm curious; if you change the irssi window, will the speak synth read the whole "new" contents aloud?
<TheMuso> LaserJock: Depends on the typo, and it also depends on the speech synthesizer.
* LaserJock imagines half of his text get's "missed" as a typo
<TheMuso> At the moment, I have three different speech synthesizers in my posession.
<TheMuso> All sound completely different.
<TheMuso> Sorry, make the five, if you include the free software speech synthesizers.
<ajmitch> that's quite a few
<TheMuso> But I prefer to use hardware speech synthesizers.
<TheMuso> Three of those are ISA cards.
<TheMuso> I also have two serial synthesizers, which are both the same, and have the same speech as one of the ISA cards.
<ajmitch> scary, ISA cards
<imbrandon> heh
<TheMuso> No actually, make that 6. I just remembered another proprietary synth for Linux that I have, but don't use much.
<ajmitch> it's hard to find motherboards with those
<imbrandon> i havent seen ISA in quite a while
<TheMuso> ajmitch: Thats why I'm holding onto my dual celeron.
* ajmitch doesn't miss ISA
<LaserJock> I have a number of ISA cards around the lab
<_ion> Abit BP6?
<TheMuso> _ion: Yep.
<LaserJock> we "just" upgraded to PCI boards for data aquisition
<imbrandon> wow
<TheMuso> There is *ONE* PCI synth, but not supported in Linux yet.
<imbrandon> might as well have went PCIe or something
<LaserJock> imbrandon: I don't think they make PCIe boards yet for what we do
<_ion> It's a nice motherboard, but it has a *horrible* ATA66 controller. :-)
<LaserJock> the latest and greatest is USB and Ethernet
<TheMuso> _ion: Thats why I don't use it.
<TheMuso> I threw in an IDE card.
<bddebian> USB r t43 suXX0r
<_ion> When i had one, i bought a PCI SATA controller.
<TheMuso> And flashed a BIOS into it not containing the highpoint BIOS.
<LaserJock> bddebian: I'm using GPIB right now, USB would be a definate step up ;-)
<imbrandon> bah just use a c64 1541 floppy
<TheMuso> lol
<bddebian> LaserJock: BTW, help me fix that on REVU ;-P
<bddebian> imbrandon: :)
<LaserJock> bddebian: I've got to run home
* TheMuso has been wanting to teach himself more c code, but hasn't got around to it.
<bddebian> Were you even alive when C64's were around imbrandon?
<LaserJock> maybe tonight I'll have a look
<LaserJock> I doubt I was
<bddebian> LaserJock: Well it's been up there for a few weeks :-)
<imbrandon> lol yea bddebian 
<LaserJock> I almost missed the DOS age
<_ion> You mean C64s aren't around anymore? :-)
<_ion> There's a whole active demoscene around C64. ;-)
<bddebian> Probably on E-Bay
<TheMuso> Ideally, I'd love to write kernel drivers for all ISA/PCI synths so they appear as standard serial like devices in /dev, and then interface them with Orca.
<sistpoty> I've even read some docs about making the c64 display 256 colors... with some nasty and amazing asm tricks
<TheMuso> wow
* bddebian peeks and pokes
<LaserJock> hmm, I usually don't use "love" "write" and "kernel" so close together
<bddebian> hehe
<sistpoty> lol
<TheMuso> haha
<TheMuso> Well as much as software speech is good, hardware will always be better.
<TheMuso> Less CPU load.
<LaserJock> I'm just figuring out how to write a GUI in something other than python
<LaserJock> that low level stuff is going to take me forever
<sistpoty> oh... I've even had a speech synth on c64... I'm still amazed that this was actually possible
<crimsun> sure. "I love bug triaging sound issues in linux-source-2.6.12, linux-source-2.6.15, linux-source-2.6.17 and linux-source-2.6.20."
<_ion> It shouldn't be *very* straining on CPU.
<TheMuso> _ion: It isn't but I have found that dedicated hardware synths are more responsive.
<TheMuso> And it leaves CPU for more important things.
<bddebian> LaserJock: How about .NET.. Just drag and drop some controls :-)
<LaserJock> bddebian: probably not
<LaserJock> my brain is only going to take in so many programming languages
<bddebian> I'm having to play with it for work.. Sheesh...
<bddebian> I used to like ASP
<LaserJock> right now Fortan, Python, and C++ are more than enough to keep me busy
<sistpoty> LaserJock: know one, know them all, that's what I experienced until I learned functional programming
<LaserJock> hmm, I don't know any then :(
<LaserJock> I could probably use a programming course
<LaserJock> I tend to do much better in an academic setting
<bddebian> Define "know".  I can write "Hello World" in several languages but I wouldn't say I "know" them :-)
<LaserJock> exactly
<sistpoty> the compiler construction course helped me a lot. If you think how the compiler does it, you suddenly understand even issues that seem weird at first.
<LaserJock> I've read through the books and tutorials
<_ion> Re: programming courses, some amazing lectures from the 1980s: http://johan.kiviniemi.name/blag/2007/02/13/structure-and-interpretation-of-computer-programs/
<LaserJock> but I still feel really really unprepared when I try to do anything real
<bddebian> Actually I know the C syntax very well but get into linking, macros, and all that shit, I get blown away :-(
<TheMuso> The only way I learn programming related stuff, is applying it to something practicle.
<LaserJock> I got an autotools book out of the library the other day
<LaserJock> it's been pretty good
<TheMuso> I now know bash fluently, because I've had to use it a lot.
<LaserJock> applies well to packaging as well, which is nice
<LaserJock> my bash is good enough to be dangerous :-)
<sistpoty> hehe
<TheMuso> I can do php with the reference manual handy.
* bddebian can't learn from books :'-(
<Laser_away> really away now
<bddebian> Later man
<sistpoty> cya Laser_away
<TheMuso> I struggle most with languages where one has to import/include header files/libraries, as I don't use them enough to remember what I need to include.
<TheMuso> However, I am able to look at some c code, and if variables/functions are named well, can work out what it does.
* sistpoty needs definitely to go to bed now
<sistpoty> gn8 everyone
<bddebian> Gnight sistpoty
<imbrandon> bbiab
<Hobbsee> any core devs around?
<ajmitch> nope
<TheMuso> heh
* ajmitch is off home now, bbl
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: darn you.  :P
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: now what did you want, and why?
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: an amarok upload sponsor.
<ajmitch> main is frozen
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: but i'd forgotten that we were in freeze.
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: it can wait and sit in the queue, cant it?
<ajmitch> I think the preference is to check first
<LaserJock> is apt-get or aptitude better for a full dist-upgrade?
<LaserJock> update-manager is throwing an error
<jmillikin> I prefer apt-get, since it's only one line
<imbrandon> apt-get imho
* RAOF uses aptitude all the time
<imbrandon> aptitude tries to be too smart
<RAOF> You just need to read what it says it'll do.
<LaserJock> heh
<imbrandon> and half the time i dont want it to do what it says ;)
<LaserJock> I haven't had a ton of success with it
<LaserJock> you really have to stay on top of it or it gets way too messy
<imbrandon> yea
* ajmitch likes aptitude most of the time
<imbrandon> anyhow off to work for a few hours , see yall when i get there
<ajmitch> bye imbrandon :)
<LaserJock> hmm, my karma is going to be 0 in a few weeks
<bddebian> heh
<ajmitch> mine is already close to 0
<LaserJock> mine has been cut in half since their change
* ajmitch has ~11K
<LaserJock> I've barely go 2k
<imbrandon> mine went from 16K to 4K
<imbrandon> bbiab
<ajmitch> surprising, I only had 7K last week
<ajmitch> I didn't think I'd get that much in a week
* ajmitch obviously needs to work harder to catch up with motu superstars
* LaserJock needs to join some super bug processing team ;-)
<bddebian> LaserJock: Nah, just write some specs ;-P
* Fujitsu had 12k immediately after the Great Reduction(tm), and it has significantly dropped now :(
<Fujitsu> bddebian: Or use the support tracker!
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: it's 13K now, what are you complaining about?
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: make a new translation, and do lots of it.
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: Is it!?
<Fujitsu> How odd.
<Fujitsu> It was 9.5k when I last checked.
<ajmitch> yes, and mine was about 7.2K last week
<LaserJock> specs are good
<TheMuso> Do you get karma when you upload?
<Fujitsu> It'd be nice if it didn't fluctuate like that.
* ajmitch is shocked
<Hobbsee> 18K now.  pathetic.
* Fujitsu sends Launchpad back to school.
<Fujitsu> 1022+1165 != 13139
<ajmitch> launchpad.net/~ubuntu-dev/+polls
<ajmitch> people actually voted no for dholbach
<LaserJock> TheMuso: no
<ajmitch> 1 person voted no for me :)
<Hobbsee> oh yes, i need to vote on that
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: too late
<Hobbsee> Support Tracker  	773
<Hobbsee> you're kidding, right?  i filed one support request, maybe two...
<TheMuso> SO what was the result?
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: MC voting closed, you had 2 weeks
<ajmitch> TheMuso: look at the url
<Hobbsee> heh
<Hobbsee> 3 disapproved, it seems
<Hobbsee> of dholbach
<ajmitch> count the approved/disapproved for each candidate
<ajmitch> I'm worried about that
<ajmitch> why would 3 people disapprove of dholbach?
<TheMuso> Rightr
<TheMuso> Yeah.
<TheMuso> Why would they?
<Hobbsee> because he's doing the CC
<ajmitch> cc nomination was only public yesterday
<ajmitch> I doubt it would have changed peoples minds
<Hobbsee> where do we vote for CC nominations, btw?
<Hobbsee> true
<Hobbsee> enough troubles with the forums stuff, though
<bddebian> Shit, I forgot to vote too :'-(
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: you don't vote yet
<ajmitch> polls are not open
<Hobbsee> darn :(
<LaserJock> I'm amazed we had that many votes then
<TheMuso> ajmitch: Shame for anybody disapproving you
* Hobbsee is *definetly* going to vote on that one
<LaserJock> if Hobbsee and bddebian missed it
<ajmitch> TheMuso: it was expected
<TheMuso> well thats settled.
<ajmitch> oh well
<ajmitch> I guess I have to do stuff now
<LaserJock> well, we at least have to have the *appearence* that there was a reason to vote
<LaserJock> ;-)
<ajmitch> what's funny is that I had the most votes
* LaserJock voted against all the candidates
<TheMuso> LaserJock: Bull****
<LaserJock> Long Live the MOTU Trinity!
<ajmitch> 31 votes in total for me, yet dholbach had 30, crimsun 29, sistpoty 27, gpocentek 21
<LaserJock> TheMuso: fine, you caught me
<ajmitch> you'd think that people would try & vote for everyone
<TheMuso> Yeah.
<ajmitch> screwy people
<LaserJock> ajmitch: I think you can cast a "I don't care" vote
<ajmitch> even so..
<ajmitch> strange
<TheMuso> Well I said yes to all.
<TheMuso> I have had packages reviewed by all of those people at some point.
<ajmitch> hehe
<ajmitch> so that was your criteria for voting?
<TheMuso> Not at all.
<TheMuso> But I have worked with you all, which gives me an insite as to what you are like with MOTU work.
<TheMuso> SO it was based on having worked with the candidates previously.
<TheMuso> Ok, what do we do if our membership is about to expire?
<TheMuso> I know we have to contact Denis, but where from there?
<Fujitsu> It was discussed at the last CC meeting.
<TheMuso> Right.
<Fujitsu> (note that your membership won't actually vanish until your ubuntu-dev membership does, as ubuntu-dev is a member of ubuntumembers)
<TheMuso> Right so I don't need to worry about it, or should I contact Dennis anyway?
<ajmitch> talk to him
<TheMuso> Yeah ok
<TheMuso> ok thanks
<bddebian> Gnight gang
<LaserJock> welcome Prince Daniel!
<dholbach> good morning
<dholbach> good morning Seor LaserJock :)
<Fujitsu> Hey dholbach.
<Hobbsee> hey dholbach 
<dholbach> heya Fujitsu, hey ho
<dholbach> Hobbsee :-)
<dholbach> lalala :)
<Lutin> hay there
<dholbach> heya Lutin
<Hobbsee> dholbach: hehe, i dont get a title?
<Lutin> heya dholbach 
* dholbach hugs Hobbsee
* Hobbsee hugs dholbach back
<LaserJock> Hobbsee: She-Ra, Princess of Power
<LaserJock> so says google
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: heh, oookay then!
<LaserJock> I think it goes well with the DOOM stick
<TheMuso> haha
<Lutin> I see some packages install their man3 pages in /usr/share/doc/<package>/man/man3. what's the difference with the packages installing them in /usr/share/man/man3 ?
<joejaxx> hello all
<joejaxx> :)
<LaserJock> hi joejaxx 
<joejaxx> hello LaserJock 
<matt_good> I think there's a problem with the REVU password recovery
<matt_good> see http://revu.tauware.de/lostpw.py?email=abcd
<matt_good> I get the same message with my email address
<matt_good> some instructions for using GPG, and "Now paste the text below,", but there's no more text
<tonyyarusso> Query:  Why is Livejournal (blogging software) not in the repos?  It seems to be GPL2+, btw.
<RAOF> Because no-one's packaged it?
<RAOF> Is it in Debian?
<tonyyarusso> RAOF: Not sure - I'll check
<tonyyarusso> RAOF: No.
<RAOF> tonyyarusso: So, the reason is because no-one's packaged it :)
<RAOF> (that's your cue)
<tonyyarusso> RAOF: Cool, simple enough.  I've been meaning to teach myself how to package anyway - maybe I'll give it a whirl.
<RAOF> The Ubuntu packaging guide is cool.
<LaserJock> it'
<RAOF> Also, CDBS is awesome if the program doesn't do anything crazy.
<LaserJock> it's getting there
<tonyyarusso> CDBS?
<RAOF> Common Debian Build System.
<LaserJock> it's a build helper
<RAOF> Basically, a whole series of makefile scripts that you include into debian/rules
<LaserJock> debhelper is the other common one
<tonyyarusso> Is it better to read the debian new maintainers guide first (what I tried before) or the Ubuntu guide first?
<RAOF> Which takes care of everything for you.
<RAOF> I read the Ubuntu guide first.
<LaserJock> *cough*Ubuntu Packaging Guide *cough*
<RAOF> Debian's good for actual policy things.
<tonyyarusso> So that's two votes for Ubuntu.
<LaserJock> tonyyarusso: I wrote the packaging guide as basically a replacement for the new maintainers guid
<tonyyarusso> LaserJock: Hopefully it's less confusing?
<LaserJock> I personally think the packaging guide and the Debian Policy are good places to go
<LaserJock> I hope so
<LaserJock> let me know if you hit snags
<RAOF> I *certainly* recommend the packaging guide.
<LaserJock> I think it's really tough to make a packaging doc that is both easy to read/learn and comprehensive
<RAOF> Yeah, there's a lot to learn.
<tonyyarusso> Yup
<RAOF> Just ask if you run into snags, though.  I'll be happy to help.
<tonyyarusso> sure thing - thanks
<LaserJock> you can file bugs at https://launchpad.net/ubuntu-docs/+filebug for the packaging guide too
<tonyyarusso> btw, how is it done that things are built for multiple architectures?  Is that just a compile option, or do you need different machines?
<LaserJock> tonyyarusso: when a packag is uploaded it is sent to the Ubuntu build machines
<LaserJock> we only upload source packages
<tonyyarusso> (Also, I assume at this stage in the game I should shoot for Feisty+1 inclusion, if anything?)
<tonyyarusso> aaaah
<LaserJock> unless you are very quick
<LaserJock> deadline is 22nd
<tonyyarusso> Hmm, ok.
* tonyyarusso starts reading
<RAOF> I need to push gandalfn to get gnome-compiz-manager reviewed and fixed.  Sooon!
<tonyyarusso> um, where IS the packaging guide these days?
* tonyyarusso hasn't learned the reorganized help yet
<LaserJock> tonyyarusso: use doc.ubuntu.com
<LaserJock> on the bottom right
<tonyyarusso> LaserJock: Can I install it, pretty please?
<LaserJock> not presently, actually
<LaserJock> I'm splitting it off into a seperate binary package
<tonyyarusso> hoh boy
<LaserJock> so far in feisty it's not installed
<tonyyarusso> LaserJock: Quickly, preferably.  ;)
<LaserJock> because of the help reorganization
<tonyyarusso> LaserJock: Reason being, every time I want to go to the next page, I'll need to grab a snack while it loads.
<LaserJock> lol
<tonyyarusso> dialup is FUUUNNN
<LaserJock> you *could* get the pdf of the edgy version
<LaserJock> from help.ubuntu.com
<tonyyarusso> pdf isn't too great either
<LaserJock> hmm, maybe I should build my own .debs of it
<LaserJock> I've got to have some excuse to have my own repo ;-)
<RAOF> LaserJock: I suggest building debs for random SVN snapshots.  That's why my repository exists :)
<LaserJock> RAOF: how is the packaging subforum of the subforum going? :-)
<RAOF> It's been ages since I've been there, frankly.
<LaserJock> me too
<RAOF> LaserJock: Do you want to review gnome-compiz-manager, while I ask the packager if he'd be ok with me handling the packages :)?
<LaserJock> sorry, I actually have to get to bed right now
<LaserJock> good night all
<RAOF> Curse you and your sleeep!
<RAOF> Night.
<Laser_away> sorry RAOF, even the best of us have to sleep
<Laser_away> except crimsun of course
<Fujitsu> Night, Laser_away.
<tonyyarusso> dude, is irssi ignoring nickchanges?
* tonyyarusso pokes around
<tonyyarusso> oh, yep
<tonyyarusso> Please tell me you're kidding...
<tonyyarusso> "Creating a pbuilder environment will take some time as debootstrap essentially downloads a minimal Ubuntu installation."
<tonyyarusso> It would probably take me until the 22nd to do that...
<tonyyarusso> :(
<Fujitsu> Well, that's what it does.
<tonyyarusso> oh boy
<tonyyarusso> This is going to get interesting.
<tonyyarusso> Public library, here I come.
<janm> tonyyarusso, have you tried cowbuilder? It's quicker but a li'l bit trickier than pbuilder. 
<tonyyarusso> janm: Haven't tried anything yet.
<tonyyarusso> Basically, anything is going to be slow here.
<tonyyarusso> We have dialup :P
<janm> tonyyarusso, :)
<tonyyarusso> Well, that's all for tonight.
<StevenK> cowbuilder looks neat. I'm just not sure how to update a cowbuilder build place.
* ajmitch returns for some more chaos
<janm> StevenK, I use this to update mine (adjust it accordingly) -> "sudo cowbuilder --update --basepath=/pbuilder/base.cow --buildplace=/pbuilder/build"
<imbrandon> hum
* imbrandon returns
<RAOF> The peasants run in confusion.
<imbrandon> lol
<lucas> if someone was planning to write an article for debaday.debian.net, please do so now, as we don't have any article ready in the queue
<imbrandon> heya lucas 
<imbrandon> hum i dont have time to tonight, i have been meaning to try to get one up
<imbrandon> maybe the next day or so
<Kamping_Kaiser> this may not be the correct place to ask - but how does ubuntu get the 'translate this app' and 'get help online'  into every app. are they manually patched in, or is there an automated way?
<imbrandon> its patched into the kde libs ( and i assume gnomelibs too )
<jwhitlark> hmm. doesn't look like there's ever been an article done on multitail...
<imbrandon> Kamping_Kaiser, look at launchpad-intergration iirc ( the package )
<Kamping_Kaiser> imbrandon, thanks, i'll check it out.
<imbrandon> heya jwhitlark 
<jwhitlark> heya,  what's up.  how was the motu meeting?
<imbrandon> i missed it, durring my sleep time, i have to catch the minutes today
<jwhitlark> ah.  what's new since UDS?  anything interesting?
<imbrandon> a few things, not alot
<imbrandon> motu wise or with me?
<jwhitlark> life treating you ok?
<imbrandon> hehe
<jwhitlark> you.
<imbrandon> with me, new job, new car, divorced wife, ummmm and ummm yea
<imbrandon> :)
<imbrandon> took a packaging break for a few weeks , but i've been catching back up the last month or so
<jwhitlark> heh,  when you were talking about work, I was thinking, 'I thought he was self employed...'
<imbrandon> working on ways to get to the various confrences, even got a talk scheduled at one heh
<jwhitlark> divorce is final now then, huh.
<imbrandon> yup yup, 1000% done
<jwhitlark> cool, which one and what talk?
<jwhitlark> good for you.
<imbrandon> ubuntu live, and about the use of Ubuntu in a Corp env
<jwhitlark> oooohhhhh.  shiny....
<imbrandon> other than that alot of the same old same old
<jwhitlark> heh, considering how bad I screwed up V. Day, I might be joining you....
<imbrandon> hahah hows that?
<imbrandon> brb one sec, phone 
<imbrandon> re
<jwhitlark> well, what I said was 'I'll cook dinner', what she heard was 'I'm going to server you a four course meal with champagne, candlelight, flowers, gifts, a fire in the fireplace, and everything will be perfect and you won't have to do a thing.'
<imbrandon> hahahah that sounds so right
<imbrandon> been there
<ajmitch> hah
<imbrandon> heya ajmitch 
<ajmitch> for me, it was just sitting at home in front of irc ;)
<jwhitlark> so now I'm going to take friday off and surprise her with what she thought she was getting, otherwise I'll here about it for weeks...
<imbrandon> for me it was sleeping off a hangover
<ajmitch> hi
<jwhitlark> hehe
<imbrandon> lol
<imbrandon> right on, good .plan
<StevenK> For me, it was a candlelit dinner.
* ajmitch is still rather single, so doesn't have to worry about those death threats
<imbrandon> StevenK, alone? just teasin
<jwhitlark> she's asleep now, but I'm kinda annoyed about it, so I was playing python challenge for a while...
<jwhitlark> ajmitch, there's something too that...
* StevenK kicks imbrandon
<imbrandon> zomg http://digg.com/tech_news/U_S_senator_It_s_time_to_ban_Wikipedia_in_schools_libraries
<imbrandon> how clueless is the goverment
<jwhitlark> saw it.  that jerk with the pipes again.
<imbrandon> s/the/our
<imbrandon> yea the pipes / truck intarweb dweeb
<ajmitch> heh
<ajmitch> everyone knows the internet is done by wet pieces of string
<jwhitlark> this is pretty tight, look how many people have conquered the middle east: http://mapsofwar.com/ind/imperial-history.html
<ajmitch> at least to NZ
<jwhitlark> ajmitch, I though it was dixie cups and dry string?!  Are you giving away trade secrets!!!
<ajmitch> no, wet string for us
<ajmitch> there's too much ocean to keep it dry
<ajmitch> though they are upgrading the piece of string to 1.2Tbps, I heard
<jwhitlark> heh
<jwhitlark> imbrandon, any more thoughts about pycon?
<ajmitch> so good to see NEW still stalled
<TheMuso> Hey all once again.
<imbrandon> heya TheMuso 
<ajmitch> hi TheMuso 
<imbrandon> jwhitlark, yea i'm gonna take a day trip mostlikely unless something crazy pops up
<imbrandon> i have the time/money to doso
<jwhitlark> cool, catch ya there.
<imbrandon> ok bbiab , i have to get some real work done ( back in 1 hour or so )
<ajmitch> imbrandon: cool, want to sponsor a trip for me?
<imbrandon> new nagios server here i come
<jwhitlark> let me know when you're going, we'll set ya up in a room share.
<imbrandon> ajmitch, i totaly wish i could, maybe when it gets closer to time i can for ubuntu live
<ajmitch> hehe
<imbrandon> ;)
<jwhitlark> you use dapper or edgy for nagios?
<ajmitch> it's ok, it'd cost a fortune :)
<imbrandon> edgy , its the only one with the perc 5/i raid controller drivers
<jwhitlark> ah, that's what I'm running mine on too.
<imbrandon> so we use edgy on almost all our servers because most dell's ( mostly 2950's ) have the perc 5/i
<jwhitlark> now if only I could get that NT4 domain to samba migration working...
<imbrandon> i have them all on win2k3 AD auth
<imbrandon> ;)
<jwhitlark> @^$%^$%^# thing has been giving me fits!
<Kamping_Kaiser> jwhitlark, samba4's vampire looks pretty cool
<ajmitch> should be trivial
<imbrandon> should be simple
<imbrandon> i dident have much problems
<StevenK> Kamping_Kaiser: Now with longer fangs!
<ajmitch> Kamping_Kaiser: sure, but samba4 is a long way off
<jwhitlark> except I can't get it to join the bloody domain!
<Kamping_Kaiser> ajmitch, unfortunately so
<jwhitlark> at all!
<Kamping_Kaiser> StevenK, woot ;)
<imbrandon> jwhitlark, lemme get this nagios thing done for work then i'll shoot you the doc we use inhouse for setting it up
<imbrandon> should be simple
<jwhitlark> cool, thanks.  
<imbrandon> takes me less than 10 minutes to get a new box on the domain
<jwhitlark> as PDC?
<imbrandon> no as a member, our pdc and bdc are true 2k3 servers
<jwhitlark> ah.
<imbrandon> but pdc should be easier than a member
<jwhitlark> want to email it to me? jwhitlark@zentek.com
<imbrandon> yea give me a few, might be at the end of my shit but i'll get it out to ya
* ajmitch should go & sleep & play with python stuff & AD tomorrow
<imbrandon> shift*
<ajmitch> hehe
<ajmitch> nice typo
<imbrandon> haha yea
<jwhitlark> no prob.  I'm going to bed anyway.
<ajmitch> anyway, night all
<imbrandon> gnight ajmitch 
<jwhitlark> nite
<TheMuso> Good evening Princess of power. :p
<TheMuso> The title bestoed upon Hobbsee by Laserjock I think.
<Hobbsee> hehe :)
* Fujitsu shakes fist.
* tsmithe shakes cloak
<Fujitsu> Aha! I graffitied that one, remember?
<TheMuso> hahahahahahaha
<StevenK> Fujitsu: Unidentify, it'd drop the cloak. :-P
<TheMuso> hahahaha
* TheMuso injects enjoyable music directly into the brain.
* coNP notices now tsmithe 's shiny new cloak
<tsmithe> :)
<geser> dholbach: about bug #85135: is it important that I become bug contact because I don't speak haskell? I wouldn't be much help
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 85135 in gtk2hs "[UVF exception]  Sync gtk2hs (0.9.10.5-1) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,Needs info]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/85135
<geser> dholbach: gtk2hs was first uploaded in feisty and ftbfs because we have ghc 6.6 already so we don't have any binaries yet
<dholbach> geser: gtk2hs doesn't have that many bugs... I think it's important to have somebody who can liaise with upstream once we get a new version in that is broken
<dholbach> daniel@lovegood:~/bzr/bughelper.dev$ ./bugnumbers --stats gtk2hs
<dholbach> Total Bugs: 1
<dholbach> Status:  {'Needs Info': 1}
<dholbach> Importance:  {'Undecided': 1}
<dholbach> daniel@lovegood:~/bzr/bughelper.dev$ 
<dholbach> I can't force you to do it... I just think it'd be a good idea :)
<geser> it doesn't have any bugs because it never got build successfully
<dholbach> right
<dholbach> I appreciate you working on it
<coNP> is it a gtk-binding for haskell?
<geser> gtk2hs is blocking the removal of the old mozilla suite as the gtk2hs build-depends on mozilla-dev
<dholbach> It's ok if you decide to not be bug contact for a while.
<geser> coNP: yes
<coNP> geser: that sounds very nice :)
<fernando> moin all
<TheMuso> One more logn email to reply to, and then thats it for me tonight.
<imbrandon> heh
<gpocentek> hello Universe
<phanatic> hi gpocentek 
<gpocentek> hi phanatic :)
<bddebian> Heya gang
<phanatic> hey bddebian 
<bddebian> Heya phanatic
<pochu> hello everybody! I've a problem with the dependencies: listen needs python-mutagen, but if I add it to the build-deps, when it's built, it doesn't have python-mutagen in the normal build-deps, do I need to put it in both build-deps and deps?
<ScottK> pochu: Does it need python-mutagen to build or just to run?
<pochu> ScottK: both
<ScottK> Then I'm pretty sure you have to list it both places.
* ScottK is relatively knew at this, so don't take it as gospel.
<pochu> ScottK: ok, thanks. I thought it would be put automatically in build with ${misc:Depends}
* pochu is a noob :)
<ScottK> I'm pretty sure not.  Otherwise you'd never have build-deps that weren't runtime deps when you used it.
<pochu> ScottK: ok, thanks a lot!
<pochu> is universe frozen?
<bddebian> For Upstream Version bumps, yes.  Not for NEW
<pochu> bddebian: and for bug fixes?
<pochu> I mean: -0ubuntu1 ---> -0ubuntu2 :)
<bddebian> NOpe that's fine
<pochu> ok, thanks :)
<matt_good> bddebian: are you or someone else here able to re-sync the REVU keyring?
<bddebian> matt_good: Not me, sorry
<cbx33> anyone ever experienced a problem with network-manager
<cbx33> it's just lost all my network interfaces
<cbx33> reboot does nothing
<giskard> did you read /usr/share/doc/n-m/README.Debian?
<cbx33> not yet
<cbx33> it was woring fine
<Lutin> hay there
<cbx33> yeh read that
<cbx33> no help ;)
<Lutin> any doxygen master around ? :)
<Laser_away> stink
<Laser_away> I dist upgraded my desktop last night and I lost USB
<crimsun> nice, that's about as vague as one can be.
<ogra> crimsun, nah ... "upgraded, now doesnt work" is vague ...  :)
<ogra> you have at least a pointer what doesnt work ... thanks to developer experience on the reporters side *g*
<Laser_away> hehe
<Laser_away> well, all I know is devices are dead
<ogra> check dmesg and the other usual suspects ... if nothing helps blame Keybuk :)
<Laser_away> I'm checking dmesg
<Laser_away> gotta figure out what it's IP address is first (n-m blew away my network setup)
<Laser_away> wha???
<Laser_away> how did I end up with Xen kernels
<Laser_away> grrrr
<Laser_away> ok, I got USB back by not using the Xen kernel
<Laser_away> although I have no idea why I have a Xen kernel
<Laser_away> but still no networking as it seems that n-m still doesn't play well with static IPs
<crimsun> known issue, thanks for playing!
<Laser_away> I thought they fixed that
<Laser_away> guess not
<Laser_away> so now I've got to remove n-m and ubuntu-desktop :/
<Laser_away> is there a way I can just turn it off without removing it?
<zul> Laser_away: why are you using the xen kernel?
<zul> and edgy or feisty? :)
<Laser_away> zul: feisty, and I'm not using it
<zul> ok..
<Laser_away> I have no idea why it's there
<zul> weird...
<Laser_away> I dist-upgraded and it was the default in my grub
<Laser_away> what package provides it?
<zul> xen-image-2.6.19
<Laser_away> why the heck do they have a "Static Configuration" button if it doesn't even work??
<ajmitch> good morning all
<LaserJock> morning andrew
<gpocentek> hello ajmitch, hello LaserJock 
<LaserJock> hi gpocentek, congrats on MOTU Councilship
<LaserJock> congrats to ajmitch as well
<ajmitch> ugh
<ajmitch> more slavery 
<gnomefreak> they results from the voting is out?
<ajmitch> of course
<ajmitch> they were out yesterday
<gnomefreak> just ajmitch  and gpocentek made it?
<ajmitch> no
<ajmitch> everyone made it
<gnomefreak> ah cool
<cbx33> do we have a procedure for remastering a live cd yet?
<gpocentek> LaserJock: thanks :)
<LaserJock> cbx33: Reconstructor and UCK, what do you mean by "we". The MOTU don't care about live cd remastering ;-)
<cbx33> oooooh
<ajmitch> we just grovel in the dirt looking after the scraps that others don't want ;)
<LaserJock> lol
<LaserJock> we just have the real deal
<ajmitch> gpocentek: so, thoughts on how you'll begin your reign of terror?
<zul> i welcome our new overlords
<gpocentek> ajmitch: not really, maybe just write a "you have to do this" script :)
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: You are master of the Ubuntu Zopeness... I've added a zope3 Ubuntu task to a bug previously in SchoolTool (bug #80195). It's fixed in Feisty, but not in Edgy. Care to accept the Edgy task?
<ajmitch> heh
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 80195 in zope3 "Edgy Bug" [Undecided,Fix released]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/80195
* ajmitch looks
<ajmitch> depends on what it is
<Fujitsu> A two line fix.
<Fujitsu> For working with Python 2.4.4.
<ajmitch> ooh, SRU
<ajmitch> it looks worthwhile, you want to prepare the SRU magic debdiff?
<Fujitsu> Sure.
<ajmitch> ok, approved bug
<ajmitch> once LP responds
<Fujitsu> I'll do it some time in the next few hours, I've got to prepare for school.
<ajmitch> sure
<Fujitsu> So it's not just me thinking LP is horribly slow?
* ajmitch is running off to work now
<ajmitch> oh no, LP is a dog most of the time :)
<ajmitch> a malnourished dog with a broken leg
<Burgwork> which has been whipped
* Fujitsu looks up the main SRU process
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: oh it is in main, isn't it?
<ajmitch> how annoying
<Fujitsu> It is, I discovered to my horror.
<LaserJock> schooltool?
<ajmitch> it'll need to be demoted for feisty if it stays broken
<ajmitch> zope3
<ajmitch> which schooltool needs
<Fujitsu> LaserJock, SchoolTool is, and it breaks SchoolTool, but zope3 is the package in question.
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: I am able to get a SVN checkout working on Feisty fine.
<ajmitch> oh good
<ajmitch> I was afraid the API would have changed too much
<Fujitsu> SVN checkout of zope3, that is.
<ajmitch> oh
<Fujitsu> Not twisted web2.
<Fujitsu> I haven't tried that yet.
* ajmitch thought you meant a svn co of twisted-web2, with zope 3.3.0
<Fujitsu> I realise that.
<ajmitch> the only way forward might be to cut out patches & graft them onto 3.3.0
<ajmitch> talk with doko about it
<Fujitsu> Will do. I want Zope working :)
* ajmitch also
<ajmitch> I mainly use 2.9 though
<ajmitch> plone don't work with 2.10 yet :)
<doko> ajmitch: 3.0alpha2 should ...
<ajmitch> sure, but I won't want to run an alpha on a production site just yet
* ajmitch has been following 3.0 from a distance
<LaserJock> hmm, so why don't we have a "Welcome MC" email to -motu ?
<ajmitch> LaserJock: because there's no need
<LaserJock> ajmitch: why not? we've waited for a long time
<ajmitch> email the list if you think it's important :)
<LaserJock> I was looking for something more official, but maybe
<ajmitch> dholbach may mail the list once it's all sorted out
<LaserJock> maybe I'll just blog it ;-)
<LaserJock> I still haven't finished my blog from yesterday
<ajmitch> haha
* ajmitch will put a blog up soon, honest
<zul> ajmitch: dholbach maybe on holiday as well
<ajmitch> hm, he said he'd be off for the weekend
<ajmitch> I didn't think he'd leave already
<TheMuso> Hey MOTUs.
<bddebian> Hello TheMuso
* pochu isn't a motu, but waves anyway
<TheMuso> I almost forgot. Hey MOTU hopefuls.
<pochu> hey TheMuso :)
<pochu> TheMuso: can you upload to universe, now that it's frozen (I think)
<TheMuso> pochu: It depends on what there is to upload.
<pochu> TheMuso: bug 84264 (they are 2 bugs)
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 84264 in ltris "some games do not install gnome menu items: lmarbles, ltris, pingus" [Low,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/84264
<jharr> pbuilder build *.dsc should spit out some .debs right?
<jharr> err "a .deb"
<LaserJock> yep
<jharr> pbuilder seems to be running fine, however I get no package back when I run it
<ajmitch> jharr: it sticks it in the results dir
<ajmitch> by default, /var/cache/pbuilder/result, I think
<jharr> ahh
<pochu> TheMuso: can you upload that?
<jharr> Maybe i was using a different tool when I got the .deb in $PWD.
* jharr is glad he's not going crazy
<ajmitch> maybe straight debuild
<TheMuso> pochu: Sorry mate, I'm currently busy with more important things for me atm.
<pochu> TheMuso: np :) just if you have time to review it, I would appreciate it, but do the more important things first ;)
<shawarma> pochu: I don't know if anyone told you yet, but you should rather subscribe ubuntu-universe-sponsors rather than -contributors.
<shawarma> pochu: I already did it for you for this bug. :-)
<shawarma> pochu: And sorry, I don't have the time to upload it for you either. 
<shawarma> pochu: -contributors is everyone who can upload to REVU. I'm guessing most of them won't care much about this bug. :-)
<pochu> shawarma: oh, thanks a lot!
<pochu> I'll remember that :)
<Marsmensch> when will herd4 be released? 
<pochu> Marsmensch: tonight, I think
<pochu> or tomorrow morning
<Marsmensch> so i have to wait another day ...
<Marsmensch> :-(
<LaserJock> Marsmensch: what do you want it for?
<shawarma> pochu: no problem.
<Marsmensch> LaserJock: i wanted to reinstall my laptop and thought i could test feisty
<LaserJock> Marsmensch: well, you *could* get the latest daily if you wanted
<Marsmensch> hmmm, yeah, but i think i will wait another day ... i also need some time to backup the old files
<Adri2000> pochu: I'll look at your debdiffs tomorrow (UTC afternoon) if no one does it until then
<pochu> Adri2000: thanks :)
<crimsun> pochu: uploaded.
<Adri2000> pochu: ^ ;)
<keescook> crimsun: you're too fast!  I was just looking at that, and suddenly everything was uploaded.  :)
<pochu> crimsun: thanks!
#ubuntu-motu 2007-02-16
<sistpoty> hi folks
<LaserJock> hi sistpoty 
<sistpoty> hi LaserJock
<TheMuso> Heya sistpoty.
<sistpoty> hi TheMuso
<LaserJock> sistpoty: wow, ambitious agenda for the MOTU Council ;-)
<sistpoty> LaserJock: just a first draft ;)
<LaserJock> anybody know of a simple multiple-binary CDBS package?
* sistpoty only uses debhelper
<LaserJock> well you aren't any help
<LaserJock> :-)
<geser> LaserJock: grep-dctrl -sBinary -F Build-Depends cdbs /var/lib/apt/lists/*Sources | grep ,
<LaserJock> geser: well, I was hoping for a little bit more experienced ;-)
<LaserJock> experienced response, that is
<geser> LaserJock: do you search a library or non-library package as an exmaple?
<RAOF> LaserJock: The banshee package is kinda what you're after, I think.
<LaserJock> non-library
<RAOF> It produces banshee + banshee-daap.
<RAOF> And is quite simple.
<LaserJock> yeah, that might work
<LaserJock> man, I love having my own local source mirror
<LaserJock> instant source package lovin'
<LaserJock> RAOF: yep, banshee is what I'm looking for, thanks
<RAOF> No problem.
* ajmitch returns
<ajmitch> LaserJock: where is this ambitious agenda?
* ajmitch knows the banshee package well
<LaserJock> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Council
<ajmitch> yeah, I just saw that :)
<ajmitch> it's quite an impressive agenda
* ajmitch should add to it
<ajmitch> woohoo!
<ajmitch> +  * During freezes, uploads are sometimes held in a queue for manual approval. A [http://people.ubuntu.com/~tfheen/unapproved-queue/ mirror]  of this queue is
<ajmitch> available to ease coordination during these periods.
<LaserJock> but .... it's empty
<ajmitch> sure
<ajmitch> but it'll hopefully be there
<Fujitsu_> ajmitch: I've got a debdiff for bug #80195. Should I write up the stuff as in StableReleaseUpdates on the wiki, and comment on the bug?
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 80195 in zope3 "Zope readline call fails in Edgy" [Undecided,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/80195
<ajmitch> yes
<ajmitch> no doubt you'll need approval from the people in charge
<ajmitch> ah, the fun of SRUs
<Fujitsu_> I'll subscribe ubuntu-sru... But won't I need a -core-dev ack?
<sistpoty> sheesh... /me still needs to write the motu-sru report 
<ajmitch> Fujitsu_: ACK for what?
<Fujitsu_> Are MOTUs allowed to request main SRUs?
<ajmitch> they should be able to
<LaserJock> Fujitsu_: they are
<ajmitch> if they supply a fix, there shouldn't be a reason why they can't get it in
<Fujitsu_> OK.
<LaserJock> Fujitsu_: I did one, you just need a core-dev to sponsor the upload
<ajmitch> Fujitsu_: at least I've only got to do the zope2.9 SRU :)
<ajmitch> which is universe
* Fujitsu_ growls a bit.
<ajmitch> hey Hobbsee 
* Fujitsu_ wonders if Hobbsee always responds to growls.
<ajmitch> sistpoty: haha, great mail
<sistpoty> ajmitch: thx
<Hobbsee> hey ajmitch, Fujitsu_!
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu_: growls?
* Hobbsee wonders what mail
<ajmitch> sistpoty: we need tshirts
<sistpoty> hehe
<Fujitsu_> Hobbsee: You entered approximately 1.5 seconds after I growled at zope3 being in main.
<ajmitch> no problem about it being in main
<ajmitch> apart from being broken :)
<Fujitsu_> Plus main SRUs are annoying.
<ajmitch> quite
<Hobbsee> siretart: as a rule, the kde related syncs are being filed, having asked various members of #kubuntu-devel
<Fujitsu_> You need to deal with main gods, rather than universe ones.
<Hobbsee> siretart: it's only that we were slow in requesting the syncs
<Hobbsee> siretart: (for universe)
<ajmitch> Fujitsu_: and special QA people
<LaserJock> wow, CSS is kinda fun
<Fujitsu_> ajmitch, == gods.
<Fujitsu_> LaserJock: You've not dealt with it before?
<Hobbsee> siretart: also, they're usually being maintained by a big group of kde people in debian, so they're fairly well tested
<ajmitch> Fujitsu_: I don't think he's core-dev, just special
<LaserJock> Fujitsu_: no, my website design days were before CSS
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: a pile of UVF requests
<ajmitch> ?>
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: about 6 so far, iirc.
<LaserJock> Fujitsu_: I'd rather deal with Main SRUs, they are easier
<ajmitch> that's not many
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: there may be more.
* ajmitch has a pile more to file
<ajmitch> maybe 20+ :)
<LaserJock> I've got 2 more
<LaserJock> I've got 2 in -proposed, and I'm not sure they will get out
<ajmitch> unless I can get a blanket exception for certain things
<ajmitch> LaserJock: SRU or UVF?
<LaserJock> SRU, sorry
<LaserJock> I might have a few UVFs too
<LaserJock> goffice is one from Main
<LaserJock> not sure if I can swing that or not
<Fujitsu_> Stupid LP... It OOPSes if I try to assign myself to that bug.
<ajmitch> LP is special like that
<ajmitch> it's probably some broken check
<ajmitch> I'll try & assign it to you
<LaserJock> at least it has the courtesy of saying "OOPS" instead of "I hate you, leave my poor database alone you sick freak!"
<ajmitch> Fujitsu_: I'll wait until spiv has looked at the oops
<Fujitsu_> I tried a few times, and it OOPSed... Now it doesn't. How strange.
<ajmitch> it's LP
<Fujitsu_> True.
<lifeless> its software
<Fujitsu_> lifeless: LP seems to be a lot worse than most, unfortunately.
<ajmitch> it's a large, complex project
<pochu> Fujitsu_: have you told it to LP devs? #launchpad ;)
<ajmitch> one that we happen to use as its developed
<Fujitsu_> pochu: Yes, I did.
<lifeless> rule #1, all software sucks
<Fujitsu_> ajmitch: I suppose...
<LaserJock> some more than others
<LaserJock> I'm not sure why all software sucks though
<LaserJock> I guess it's just one of those "forces of nature"
<LaserJock> ;-)
<sistpoty> software I wrote doesn't suck... it was just never finished :P
<ajmitch> hah
<lifeless> software has the ability to generate combinatorial interactions very easily
<lifeless> whereas its hard to e.g. mix acid and bases and /not/ get something neutralish
<sistpoty> I blame the stochastic theory... if some software has two bugs, they just don't neutralize each other :(
<ajmitch> sistpoty: I agree with the mail, we have done badly with actually carrying things through to a final decision
<sistpoty> ajmitch: yep, that's why I think we need MC to be able to react fast... I guess some stuff will be discussed e.g. on ubuntu-motu ml and thus already are in a waiting state, so MC should be able to react fast
<ajmitch> I think recent motu meetings haven't been too bad
<ajmitch> like the one where we decided on things like UVF, release dates, etc
<sistpoty> ajmitch: yep
<sistpoty> I guess it also helped that we didn't start deferring decisions to the mailing lists ;)
<ajmitch> it showed that a small group could make decisions if we  were willing & didn't just look for MOTU-wide consensus :)
<sistpoty> :)
<xstasi> hi
<xstasi> i would like to package some software for ubuntu, to be hopefully included in the official repos..
<xstasi> how can i do that? :)
<TheMuso> !packagingguide
<ubotu> The packaging guide is at http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/index.html - Other developer resources are at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DeveloperResources
<TheMuso> !revu
<ubotu> REVU is a web-based tool to give people who have worked on Ubuntu packages a chance to "put their packages out there" for other people to look at and comment on in a structured manner. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU
<TheMuso> xstasi: Hope that is of some help.
<xstasi> seems to be
<xstasi> well i actually already created some debs
<xstasi> so i think the first links are not so useful, but i'll take a look anyway
<TheMuso> How did you create the debs?
<xstasi> took sources from debian
<xstasi> edited something on debian/
<TheMuso> Oh so its a package update then.
<xstasi> and debuilt them
<TheMuso> What have you changed?
<xstasi> you know, dependencies, version...
<TheMuso> No I don't know actualyl.
<xstasi> i made it for personal use, i prefer not to just "make install" things
<TheMuso> actually
<xstasi> but i would like to see some stuff in the distro
<TheMuso> Ok, what would you like to see?
<xstasi> audacious for example..
<xstasi> it's a very valuable media player, a fork of xmms
<xstasi> i can't live without it from the day i knew it from debian :)
<TheMuso> Is it already in Debian?
<xstasi> yeah
<TheMuso> Well what is the version in Ubuntu missing?
<xstasi> it's not in ubuntu afaik
<TheMuso> When did it enter Debian?
<xstasi> i don't know exactly
<ajmitch>  audacious | 1.2.2-3ubuntu1 | http://apt-proxy feisty/universe Packages
<ajmitch>  audacious | 1.2.2-3ubuntu1 | http://apt-proxy feisty/universe Sources
<ajmitch>  audacious |    1.2.2-4 | http://apt-proxy sid/main Sources
<ajmitch> we have it
<xstasi> oh, so it's in feisty
<xstasi> :)
<xstasi> that's good
<xstasi> i only have edgy installed
<xstasi> well, if i find something that's not there, how could i help it to get to the mainstream?
<ajmitch> depends if it's in debian or not
<xstasi> what happens in both cases?
<ajmitch> if it's in debian, we just have to file a sync request as long as it's before freeze
<ajmitch> otherwise the package needs to be created, reviewed & uploaded within the next week or less
<xstasi> i see
<xstasi> how does this happen?
<ajmitch> which?
<xstasi> the 2nd
<ajmitch> for creating a package, well the packaging guide url that TheMuso gave you before gives some tips
<ajmitch> & then the packages are uploaded for review, and if approved, into the distro
<xstasi> i see
<xstasi> thanks :)
<xstasi> i like your work
<xstasi> i run debian, but i suggest and install ubuntu to everyone who wants to run linux :)
* ajmitch runs both, depending on what is needed
* TheMuso runs Ubuntu, but keeps a sid chroot around for whenever it is needed.
<xstasi> well, i have edgy installed too, to better help people when it comes to :)
<xstasi> thanks for the info..
<xstasi> see you :)
<ajmitch> ok, see you later
* TheMuso wonders whether they will be back.
* ajmitch shrugs
<TheMuso> Lets hope so.
<ajmitch> I'm here to scare them off
* TheMuso disagrees.
<ajmitch> it's what I do
<TheMuso> You never managed to scare me off. :)
<Laser_away> TheMuso: that's because is scary faces didn't work on you ;-)
<Laser_away> *his
<TheMuso> But people who may get scared off by ajmitch don't see his face either.
<Laser_away> hmmm, it's a mystery then
<ajmitch> TheMuso: probably a good thing people don't see my face
<TheMuso> Probably a good thing people don't see mine either. :)
<ajmitch> Laser_away still bears the mental scars
<TheMuso> haha
<ajmitch> he love & dedication for ubuntu won through in the end & he kept on hacking
<ajmitch> though he did run away from mt view quite quickly
<zul> TheMuso: his face is the worse part
<ajmitch> scary to think of a mini-zul running around soon
<zul> yep...he'll be as cynical as I am 
<ajmitch> hehe
* sistpoty did it: http://www.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=362624
* ajmitch watches firefox disappear
<ajmitch> useless windows XP
<ajmitch> sistpoty: thanks!
<sistpoty> we really need more testers, hopefully this helps
<ajmitch> maybe in the edgy forum?
<sistpoty> edgy forum?
<ajmitch> yes
* sistpoty just asked on #ubuntu-forums, because he has no clue about the forums at all
<sistpoty> ajmitch: which edgy forum? *g*
<ajmitch> it's there somewhere, i think :)
<sistpoty> hehe
<jdong> there is no edgy forum :)
<ajmitch> I could be wrong, I don't really read the forums
<ajmitch> oh well
<jdong> the general forum encompasses every distro
<jdong> development release gets its own section though
<jdong> but those get locked/archived once a release comes out
<jdong> sistpoty: if where you posted it isn't attracting enough attention after a bit, poke me
<sistpoty> jdong: will do, thanks
<ajmitch> jdong: you should give sistpoty the big shiny developer tag too ;)
<jdong> ajmitch: lol ok :)
* ajmitch saw Laser_away had it
<sistpoty> omg *g*
<ajmitch> hah
<jdong> sistpoty has shiny dev tag now
<ajmitch> yay
<ajmitch> now sistpoty is important :)
<jdong> LOL
<sistpoty> lol
<sistpoty> thanks jdong
<jdong> np anytime :)
<ajmitch> well we know that the forums are the only important part, right?
<Hobbsee> of course.  and arnieboy is god.
<jdong> ajmitch: yes, we encompass a far majority portion of the community compared to all other support mechanisms combined.
<jdong> </flamewar> :D
<ajmitch> because the forums accomplish *so much* in pushing the distro forward
<jdong> ajmitch: of course :) We're a bugtracker, spec targeter, and FAQ/HOWTO warehouse too :D
<zul> i note a tinge of sarcasm
<jdong> lmao
<jdong> and we have a Resolution Center where people pay a unique e-mail address to throw rotten fruit at the staff.
* jdong grumbles
<jdong> we just had a user register 5 user accounts in the span of a few minutes to have 'supporters' for his protest :)
<ajmitch> impressive
<jdong> it says something when I carry a greppable copy of a few proxy lists on my HDD :)
<jdong> but of course, life would be boring otherwise, no?
* ajmitch tends not to post on the forums that often
<ajmitch> there's very little I can contribute
<jdong> ajmitch: it's ok, your time is best spent developing the distro :)
<jdong> ajmitch: we'll look after the new users for you :D
<ajmitch> hah
* ajmitch doesn't develop
<ajmitch> I just sit & complain
<TheMuso> Ever since I discovered mailing lists, I have not liked forums very much.
<jdong> well.. your time is best spent syncing the revu keyring? :D
<jdong> and sit & complain is my job :)
<ajmitch> cron does that for me
* ajmitch thinks zul should be tagged a developer on the forums ;)
<Hobbsee> yes, he should be
<zul> meh..
<jdong> lol ok
<Fujitsu_> TheMuso: I haven't liked forums since... I discovered anything at all.
<ajmitch> zul: all the better to drop  you in it
<jdong> and I'd like to take this time to complain about the vbulletin admincp UI....
<jdong> there's more config buttons than beryl
<Fujitsu_> Any requirements for getting such a tag?
<zul> more like an incentive to not
<Fujitsu_> jdong: hahah.
<jdong> Fujitsu: you have to be a dev :D
<jdong> Fujitsu: that's about it
<ajmitch> Fujitsu_: you get rotten fruit thrown at you & 'bug reports' as soon as you talk up on the forums
<jdong> ajmitch: no you dont :)
* Hobbsee doesnt
<jdong> a dev tag actually gets you better treatment....
<jdong> people know you know what you're talking about.
* Hobbsee got to fire off a lovely reply yesterday, then pricechild closed the thread :D
<ajmitch> ooh, "Is it worth filing feisty bugs yet?"
<Fujitsu_> I lurk on the forums a little, occasionally posting in the Science one.
<Fujitsu_> ajmitch: You saw that somewhere?
<jdong> ajmitch: :)
<ajmitch> no, it's best to wait until 2 minutes before release, so that developers have more pressure to make them work better
<ajmitch> http://www.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=362012
<Fujitsu_> ajmitch: of course.
<Hobbsee> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=359979
* Hobbsee likes ^
<Hobbsee> :P
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: the trick about the forums is to only look at the vaguely sensible things
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: and the edgy version was far better than the feisty version
<jdong> Hobbsee: lol
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: the problem is trying to find something vaguely sensible
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: look at the subjects.
<Hobbsee> :P
<Hobbsee> jdong: seriously!
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: and click through 10 pages to find something?
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: show more entries per page :P
<jdong> Hobbsee: it is pretty true
<jdong> ajmitch: well what are we supposed to do ? ban people for stupid questions?
<jdong> ajmitch: we can't ban people for raging holy religious war
<jdong> our hands are firmly tied behind our backs
<jdong> with CoC's taping our mouths shut.
<ajmitch> educate them
<Fujitsu_> Ban them to an education forum.
<jdong> LOL
<Hobbsee> jdong: yes, banning for stupid questions is quite acceptable :P
<ajmitch> we know that release snapshots *must* be out at 00:00 on the day they're meant to be there, right?
<jdong> lol I wish banning/infracting/locking were as easygoing as irc kicks
<Fujitsu_> ajmitch, 00:00 UTC-[whatever the most negative offset is] 
<ajmitch> LaserJock!
<jdong> ajmitch: no they're supposed to be released 5 minutes earlier the day before so that mirrors have it already
<ajmitch> Fujitsu_: no, + the most positive offset
<jdong> ajmitch: and there better be 20+ complete seeders on the torrent swarm!
<Fujitsu_> ajmitch, yes, that one. Oops.
<ajmitch> Fujitsu_: so as soon as it's 00:00 in NZ
<LaserJock> ajmitch: I was petrified for sure.
<ajmitch> LaserJock: hm?
<LaserJock> ajmitch: Laser_away still bears the mental scars
<ajmitch> ah right
<ajmitch> even Hobbsee has met me in person
<jdong> ok zul what on earth is your forum nick?
<zul> zulcss
<jdong> ok
<zul> but i kind of like my anonimity
* Hobbsee is still traumatised.
<ajmitch> stay anonymous then, like me
<jdong> lol I love how Developers is right above Disabled Users
<ajmitch> you can flame people easier
<jdong> ajmitch: lol
<Hobbsee> haha
<jdong> ajmitch: and point to random statements in the CoC as your defense! it's failproof!
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: that's why you have a second account
<ajmitch> exactly!
<jdong> apparently locking threads is disrespecting someone's right to post.
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: true, I'll go & set that up
<ajmitch> jdong: violating the 1st amendment?
<jdong> free ipods, anyone? :D
<jdong> ajmitch: yeah. The CoC says Be Respectful :P
<jdong> and that means everything (tm)
<ajmitch> no matter whether anyone involved is american or not, we know that the US constitution is a global document
<jdong> ajmitch: it definitely is
<jdong> ajmitch: iraq didn't follow it and look what happened to them.
* ajmitch thinks of some random & unrelated username for a throwaway account
<jdong> lol
<jdong> not_ajmitch
<Fujitsu_> andrewm
<Fujitsu_> How unrelated can you get?
<jdong> ajmitch: you gonna find an anonymous proxy too? :D
<ajmitch> true!
<jdong> and throw rotten tomatoes at us in the res center?
<Fujitsu_> ajmitch: Is this a see-how-fast-you-get-banned thing?
<jdong> join anticommie1877's zombie force!
<Fujitsu_> Hahah.
* Fujitsu_ goes to class... IT. Terrific.
<bddebian> Heya gang
<andrewm> hello mr.bddebian
<bddebian> Hello andrewm
<sistpoty> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Heya sistpoty
* andrewm wants to try & get some packages updated 
<jdong> andrewm: how about a recent svn snap of ffmpeg!
<jdong> LOL
<andrewm> no I don't want that
<andrewm> bddebian: you will help me?
* bddebian runs and hides
<jdong> andrewm: lyx 1.4.4
<LaserJock> hehe, I think I need another forums account
<LaserJock> I think son-of-bddebian should do
<bddebian> andrewm: What are you trying to do?
<bddebian> hah
<jdong> ajmitch: how about azureus 2.5.0.4?
<bddebian> ack
<LaserJock> mwuahaha
<LaserJock> I think I tricked N-M
<andrewm> why are people asking me to update these things?
<sistpoty> LaserJock: ?
<Hobbsee> andrewm: which people?
<bddebian> andrewm: What did you want updated?
<andrewm> Hobbsee: jdong!
<Hobbsee> andrewm: you'd have to ask him that :P
<andrewm> bddebian: some packages
<bddebian> That's specific
<jdong> andrewm: because you said you want to update some packages :)
<LaserJock> sistpoty: I have a static IP on my desktop (home server) but network manager doesn't play nice with static IPs
<jdong> andrewm: so I decided to go into sit and complain mode
<jdong> LaserJock: and now evolution will always start offline!
<sistpoty> LaserJock: ah... N-M as in network-manager
<jdong> LaserJock: congrats :)
<andrewm> bddebian: first I want all the zope packages upgraded
<LaserJock> sistpoty: so I think I got the dhcp server on the router to always give my desktop the same IP
<sistpoty> ajmitch: libtrace3 needs another +1 ;)
<bddebian> andrewm: Well get to it ;-P
<LaserJock> so it's static dhcp ;-)
<ajmitch> sistpoty: that's something I want to bring up at the meeting
<jdong> anyone know how to check quota on openAFS?
<ajmitch> sistpoty: it's essentially a straight sync from debian, the REVU uploader is a local DD 
<ajmitch> sistpoty: so maybe the MC can decide on whether DDs need 2 MOTU acks on REVU
<jdong> OpenAFS wasn't amused by me running pdf2ps on a 22-page book scan PDF
<sistpoty> ajmitch: delicate question, at least for libtrace3 since it hasn't passed new yet iirc
<jdong> HP Laserjet 8100's do not print 22MB/page documents
<jdong> well, it spit out one page in a 26 hour period
<_ion> Hehe
<ajmitch> sistpoty: yes, but it's more of a general thing - DDs aren't just the normal people, we can trust them more
<sistpoty> ajmitch: and I guess that's quite a corner case, if a DD uploads a new package to revu
<jdong> other students werent' amused at the 300-long lpr queue resulting from that....
<ajmitch> jdong: bad you
<jdong> ajmitch: I know :( MIT printers are too hard to operate for me....
<sistpoty> ajmitch: otherwise it would be DD uploads to debian and just requests a sync
<ajmitch> sistpoty: which I'd usually do
<sistpoty> ajmitch: however I guess what we shouldn't forget to make it easier for DD's to become motu's due to their debian work
<ajmitch> but at freeze times like this, or when things are very slow in debian..
<ajmitch> yeah, something to take into account in the new new developer process
<sistpoty> ajmitch: for the corner cases like libtrace3 imo one ack should suffice
<ajmitch> ok, upload it :)
<sistpoty> :)
<ajmitch> mattb: hopefully someone will work through NEW tomorrow 
<bddebian> Yeah, I need my tilp libs :-(
<mattb> cool :)
<mattb> muchos gracias
<ajmitch> no problem
<LaserJock> hmm, is anybody going to be up for a quick revu tonight?
<ajmitch> LaserJock: yeah, possibly
<ajmitch> depends on what it is
<bddebian> kind a like gpib, or bibus, or... ;-P
<bddebian> LaserJock: Is it up already
<bddebian> ?
<LaserJock> it's a data package, really easy
<sistpoty> mattb: uploaded ;)
<LaserJock> nah, I gotta Feistyize it real quick
<LaserJock> it's in Debian NEW right now
<ajmitch> sistpoty: archived on revu
<sistpoty> :)
<sistpoty> bddebian: I'll take a look in a few minutes (just out for a cigarette)
<bddebian> sistpoty: Look at what?
<jdong> "Server is going to be <StatusType instance at 0xb7962a74> for 5-7 hours due to None/usr/bin/co:  No such file or directory""
<jdong> err
* jdong switches hosting providers immediately
<_ion> Haha
<jdong> that's gotta be one of the best borked e-mails I've gotten
<ajmitch> jdong: python
<jdong> ajmitch: yeah no kidding :)
<LaserJock> hmm, what the heck should I version this
<LaserJock> Debian is going to be 5-2
<ajmitch> 5-2ubuntu1
<ajmitch> or 5-2~ubuntu1 :)
<LaserJock> right
<LaserJock> eww
<ajmitch> exactly
<crimsun> eh, initramfs-tools's versioning is more hairy
<sistpoty> bddebian: gpib, bibus?
<ajmitch> sistpoty: I think bddebian was hinting that someone review his packages
<sistpoty> ajmitch: yep, that's what I thought and I'll look at it ;)
<ajmitch> can't imagine why he wants that
<sistpoty> hehe
<ajmitch> did we decide that it wasn't needed?
<sistpoty> ajmitch: nope, deferred to MC
<sistpoty> however tfheen was happy unless the reject rate wouldn't increase extraordinarily
<ajmitch> then the MC should decide :)
<sistpoty> *g*
<ajmitch> considering that 3 of the MC were active in the meeting, out of about 4 people active
<LaserJock> I kinda like the 1 vote for MOTU unles they are trivial packages
<sistpoty> ajmitch: MC still needs to decide how to decide *g*
<LaserJock> oh geeze
<ajmitch> haha
<ajmitch> LaserJock: we'll get it sorted for feisty+1 ;)
<bddebian> sistpoty: They are a mess. gpib doesn't even build and bibus is hideous.
<bddebian> I clean it up in a newer version but then it doesn't install/configure the databases
<bddebian> cleaned..
<sistpoty> bddebian: I'm just looking at gpib... I'll put a debdiff somewhere if I make it build
* ajmitch fires up outlook express
<LaserJock> so you guys need a subcommittee to decide how the council will decid how many votes it takes to decide that a package can go into Universe
<LaserJock> I'm sure glad there isn't any red tape around here
<sistpoty> hehe... well I wrote a mail earlier stating that I'd like to see MC in a position to decide fast.
<ajmitch> sistpoty: cage fight?
<sistpoty> hehe
<LaserJock> I was thinking less viloent
<LaserJock> like rock-paper-scissors
<ajmitch> poker!
<sistpoty> damn, I've got a bad poker face
<ajmitch> heh
<LaserJock> poker can take a long time though
<ajmitch> but it's fun
<LaserJock> oh this is cool
<LaserJock> dpkg-source: error: Version number suggests Ubuntu changes, but Maintainer: does not have Ubuntu address
<tonyyarusso> It's smart enough to want an @ubuntu address?
<ajmitch> yes
<ajmitch> and I can imagine it'll be very annoying
* ajmitch will have to maintain a separate debian/control for debian & ubuntu for f-spot
<LaserJock> so what am I supposed to do
<ajmitch> sprinkle magical fairy dust over it & change the maintainer field
<ajmitch> & preserve the old one
<LaserJock> I thought that broke ome buildds
* ajmitch shrugs
<ajmitch> read the devel team minutes from earlier
<tonyyarusso> LaserJock: got that pkg guide in repos yet?  It's been a whole, like, 24 hours!  :P  (kidding)
<LaserJock> well, getting there
<tonyyarusso> LaserJock: cool enough.  I'm going to have to go to the library or a friend's house to do this though, since I've read pbuilder downloads an entire installation...
<sistpoty> bddebian: for gpib, have you looked at the old version? imo the package on revu somehow tries to build the kernel modules and thus fails. maybe patches/dont-build-modules.patch from the old version will give you a hint
<bddebian> sistpoty: Hmm, no I don't remember seeing that. :-(
<LaserJock> yeah, I don't think the old one built the modules
<LaserJock> I tried them once
<bddebian> Stupid :-(
<matt_good> ok, I've tried following all the instructions for getting registered to upload to REVU, but when I upload a package it keeps getting rejected: "Signer has no upload rights at all to this distribution."
<matt_good> the distribution in the package is set to feisty
<ajmitch> you're probably uploading to ubuntu, not to revu
<matt_good> ah, hrm
<matt_good> let's see
<matt_good> yeah, I think that was it
<LaserJock> doh
<matt_good> yeah, I skipped editing dput.cf since the wiki mentioned that it was already configured for REVU since Dapper
* Hobbsee is fairly sure that the wiki is wrong
<matt_good> well, it's in there, it's just not the default
<matt_good> but I skipped ahead because of that
<tonyyarusso> Speaking of uploading, I'm currently reading the Packaging Guide with the hope of being able to package Livejournal (strictly "because it's there...and not packaged yet").  If I do, what do I do next to get it to somethingorother?
<LaserJock> !revu
<ubotu> REVU is a web-based tool to give people who have worked on Ubuntu packages a chance to "put their packages out there" for other people to look at and comment on in a structured manner. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU
<tonyyarusso> gotcha
<LaserJock> ajmitch, bddebian, or sistpoty: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=4373
<ajmitch> I didn't do it!
<ajmitch> oh
<sistpoty> LaserJock: I'll look at it tomorrow... right now I'm falling into bed
<sistpoty> gn8 everyone
<LaserJock> sistpoty: hopefully you won't need to look at it
<LaserJock> cya
<sistpoty> hehe
<bddebian> LaserJock: Give me a few
<tonyyarusso> ajmitch: I just added myself to the -universe-contributors LP team.  Could you resync the REVU uploaders keyring?
<tonyyarusso> or any other REVU admin if he's gone away
<LaserJock> tonyyarusso: it just takes a while to sync
<tonyyarusso> LaserJock: of course
<tonyyarusso> automated?
<tonyyarusso> (figured it might not be instant - hence doing that now, not after I have the package done, if I succeed)
<LaserJock> it has to go out an grab *every* gpg key
<LaserJock> including MOTUs and core-devs
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: it's not automated, iirc
<tonyyarusso> It's funny that that sort of thing can't do a diff sort of deal
<Hobbsee> tonyyarusso: resyncing now
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: it is automated
<ajmitch> called cron
<tonyyarusso> Okay, so far the most confusing part of this doc is rules file.  I have no idea what most of that means.
<Hobbsee> oh.  i was told that it wasnt in cron, i think
<tonyyarusso> The rest looks pretty straightforward.
<ajmitch> LaserJock: guess what!
<LaserJock> what?
<ajmitch> I added a blog
<LaserJock> OH MY GOSH!!!
<ajmitch> now I need to learn how to configure it nicely
<ajmitch> & I hope it's not incredibly slow
* Hobbsee dies of shock
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: don't die please
<tonyyarusso> ajmitch: type?
<ajmitch> quills
<tonyyarusso> In this example, are they just naming it hello-debhelper to differentiate from before?  You don't actually do that for real do you?
<LaserJock> no
<tonyyarusso> k
<LaserJock> that's the name of the package
<bddebian> LaserJock: Isn't the AUTHORS file supposed to be in debian/docs?
<tonyyarusso> so, you could make the same program two ways, and have it in the repos under different names?
<LaserJock> well, hello is a specific example to how different build methods
<tonyyarusso> right
<LaserJock> normally we don't have packages with the same source
<LaserJock> you are the 2nd person to bring this up in the last few days
<LaserJock> I had never thought that it would be a problem
<LaserJock> but obviously it's not necessarily clear why there is hello and hello-debhelper
<tonyyarusso> Well, it's clear why there is hello and hello-debhelper.  What is not clear is if the thing I make should be livejournal or livejournal-debhelper, if made with debhelper but without there existing a from scratch version.
<LaserJock> right
<tonyyarusso> A "Note:" may be in order
<LaserJock> I need to make it clear that it's named that to differentiate it from hello, not that you have to append -debhelper to packages using debhelper
<ajmitch> LaserJock: yay, it failed when adding a blog entry "_
<ajmitch> :)
<ajmitch> so no blog for me now
<LaserJock> dude, you gave up waaaaay to easily ;-)
<ajmitch> haha
<LaserJock> bddebian: I don't see anywhere where I *have* to include AUTHORS
<ajmitch> LaserJock: having a blog means having to write coherently
<bddebian> LaserJock: Well I did advocate anyway :-)
<LaserJock> ok, I'll upload it then
<ajmitch> back later
<tonyyarusso> How many of you use CDBS vs debhelper vs just do it?
<LaserJock> basically all new packages are done using CDBS or debhelper
<LaserJock> I think debhelper is more common
* tonyyarusso nods
* ajmitch returns
<RAOF> If anyone wants some work, there's http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=4300 to review :)
<RAOF> It's not my package, but I'd like to get it in.
<RAOF> It seems to be lintian & linda clean (I've just debuilt it), except for the build-dep on debhelper >=4.1.0
<LaserJock> anybody have an idea what "Any source code review performed ?" means in a MIR?
<Amaranth> LaserJock: is the code sane?
<LaserJock> Amaranth: hehe, I don't know that I could tell
* Fujitsu thinks that waiting for a good 40 seconds for a package bug page to load is doubleplus ungood.
<LaserJock> but the code has been around for over 10 years so I'd think it would be fairly sane by now
<Amaranth> LaserJock: what is it?
<LaserJock> rasmol
<Amaranth> !info rasmol
<ubotu> rasmol: Visualize biological macromolecules. In component universe, is optional. Version 2.7.2.1.1-4ubuntu1 (edgy), package size 667 kB, installed size 1568 kB
<Amaranth> Does it run as root? Install an init script? Any other similarly invasive things?
<LaserJock> nope
<LaserJock> it's just a simple GUI window that you can open up molecule files in
<Lathiat> im not sure 10 year old code could always be classified as 'sane' ;)
<Amaranth> I'd say it's probably alright then but you've been asked to do a code review so I'm not sure how you should respond.
<LaserJock> Lathiat: I realize that, but people don't seem to have issues with it
<ajmitch> LaserJock: impressive version number
<Amaranth> That's a SkyOS version number
* Fujitsu goes crazy and shreds a few people
<Fujitsu> `I installed Feisty's prevu on Breezy, and it doesn't work'
<Fujitsu> What a great bug.
<bluefoxicy> In bed with a ninja on fire.
<bluefoxicy> Fujitsu:  we actually have a package called pervu?  Is that the new pornview?
<bluefoxicy> (by 'we' I mean 'users of ubuntu' or something)
<LaserJock> prevu bluefoxicy not pervu
<bluefoxicy> .... oh o.o
<bluefoxicy> LaserJock:  CMU says that the order of letters doesn't matter as long as the first and last are the same
<bluefoxicy> I guess it works for freudian interpretation of new vocabulary too
<LaserJock> wahoo, pitti rocks
<ajmitch> LaserJock: yes, he does, but why this time?
<LaserJock> he's doing a archive/MIR day I think
<ajmitch> yes, he is
<ajmitch> ah, has he approved MIRs for you?
<LaserJock> maybe ;-)
<ajmitch> :P
<imbrandon> moins
* imbrandon yawns
<LaserJock> hi imbrandon 
<imbrandon> heya LaserJock 
<imbrandon> woot gmail rocks once again, the pop retreival works for all accounts now
<Amaranth> crimsun: what was that patch to make conexant hda work again?
<ajmitch> hey imbrandon 
<imbrandon> heya ajmitch 
<qiyong> is ubuntu alwasy depends on debian?
<qiyong>  i think i should run a newest ubuntu in order to develop it, like debian sid
<Amaranth> qiyong: did you go to every ubuntu channel and ask this question?
<qiyong> Amaranth, :p
<qiyong> Amaranth, i get the answer now
<qiyong> thanks
<qiyong> Amaranth, you answered me
<Amaranth> qiyong: happy to help
<Amaranth> but try to show a little patience
<qiyong> Amaranth, ubuntu seems the best linux disto i ever see
<qiyong> i plan to move from debian to ubuntu
<TheMuso> c
<TheMuso> bah
<ajmitch> :)
<imbrandon> root@kshafw01:~# ls -la /usr/local/nagios/libexec/check_disk
<imbrandon> -rwxr-xr-x 1 root root 72956 2005-01-26 05:28 /usr/local/nagios/libexec/check_disk
<imbrandon> crap
<cbx33> where do i log bugs for network manager?
<ogra> there is this thing called malone :P
<lionel> cbx33: someone open the bug you had on malone
<lionel> I do not remember the bug number but I saw it yesterday night
<cbx33> lionel: which bug?
<cbx33> ogra: ha ha.....i try and it says network manager doesn't use malone
<cbx33> https://bugs.launchpad.net/network-manager/+filebug
<ogra> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/network-manager/+bugs
<cbx33> if that is the real network manager
<cbx33> hat's silly
<ogra> unless you want to file it upstream :)
<cbx33> no
<lionel> cbx33: #85443
<cbx33> :p
<ogra> your link is the upstream link
<lionel> oups... no the comment says it is not a bug :-(
<cbx33> hh
<cbx33> no mine is a different bug
<cbx33> I'm just about to file it
<Kano> hi, could someone update fuse-utils to a recent cvs snapshot?
<Kano> would work better with ntfs-3g
<givr1> Kano: what's wrong with the current one
<Kano> with a current snapshot (2.6.3+cvs) you can even use mount -a with uuids in the fstab, also you get no errors with media:/ protocol in konqueror anymore
* givr1 look at what changed in cvs
<Kano> you have 2.6.2 in rep. 2.6.3 is current (but would not be new enough)
<Kano> ntfs-3g is new enough
<Kano> i made a test last week
<Kano> not from today
<Kano> but if you want to try
<Kano> http://kanotix.com/files/fix/ntfs-3g/fuse_2.6.3+cvs20070209-0.dsc
<Kano> do you use ntfs-3g?
<givr1> Kano: fuse is in main so until you convince ogra to use a cvs version of fuse, i suggest you to take the bits who fix your issue from cvs and make a patch for 2.6.2
<givr1> Kano: yes i use it
<Kano> a patch for 2.6.3?
<givr1> Kano: but didn't try uuid on my feisty box
<Kano> why do you still have the broken 2.6.2?
<Kano> it is not recommended at all by ntfs-3g
<givr1> Kano: the problem with ntfs-3g was in the kernel module. We don't care in feisty since we use 2.6.20 ones
<Kano> the problem is NOT the kernel module
<givr1> Kano: but i agree that it should be good to update to 2.6.3
<Kano> the user space tools are the problem
<Kano> you dont need 2.6.3 kernel module
<Kano> the one from 2.6.20 is ok
* givr1 saw a bug with 2.6.3 and sshfs on debian bugzilla
<Kano> therefore i would go over to cvs
<Kano> btw. do you need a script to convert your fstab to uuid?
<Kano> i worte that lately
<ogra_> Kano, there are tons of filesys5tems using fuse ... i'd only go with cvs if it's guaranteed that nothing else breaks ...
<givr1> Kano: i don't see any change related to uuid added since 2.6.3 in cvs
<Kano> givr1: it is not diretly for uuid, it is a generic fix
<Kano> can you mount a partiton by uuid?
<ScottK> I'd appreciate it if someone would take a look at my patch for Bug #85444
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 85444 in python-dns "Multiple Upstream Python-DNS Bugs" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/85444
<Gabrielote> sorry...
<Gabrielote> how to build a package?!?1
<DarkMageZ> Gabrielote, http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/index.html might be useful :)
<Gabrielote> o thanks
<Gabrielote> i'll read it
<geser> ScottK: are the patches for the  windows bugs needed on Ubuntu? I'm just curious
<ScottK> Not needed, but the library is effectively unmaintained upstream at the moment (working on that) and so thought it would be nice to have a place where the most fixed version lives.
<ScottK> I did it in the interest of making open source software better...
<geser> ok, have read the bug now completely :)
<crimsun> (upon my suggestion)
<crimsun> doesn't make any sense to exclude them if we're not dealing with SRU/security errata
<geser> ScottK: for the future: set the maintainer field according to the DebianMaintainerSpec
<geser> I'll do this before uploading, no need to create a new debdiff
<ScottK> Ah.  I forgot we had that resolved.  Will do.
<ScottK> Thanks.
<geser> the current dpkg-buildpackage doesn't let you build a source package with ubuntu changes and a wrong maintainer anymore
<ScottK> I see the update sitting there, so I expect it won't come up again. 
<Gabrielote> please can you make a package for me!?
<geser> ScottK: uploaded
<Gabrielote> because i don't understand...
<ScottK> Thanks.
<Gabrielote> i have the folder that i have to build
<Gabrielote> please....
<ScottK> What are you trying to package?
<Gabrielote> i have a folder that i have to package to configure my modem
<ScottK> Why do you think you need to do that?
<Gabrielote> because i'm doing steps of a howto for package...
<ScottK> Where is the how to?
<Gabrielote> it's a text file
<Gabrielote> i'm sendind a part of it
<Gabrielote> THE SCRIPT WILL CHECK FOR ALL THE ABOVE AND GIVE YOU AN ERROR MESSAGE IF
<Gabrielote> #    ANYTHING IS MISSING.  ONCE EVERYTHING IS OK, IT WILL UNPACK
<Gabrielote> #    conexant_192-1ubuntu-1.tar.gz AND MOVE IT TO modem-hsfpci-0.1/ AND THEN
<Gabrielote> #    BUILD THE PACKAGE.  THE PACKAGE WILL BE IN THIS MAIN DIRECTORY.
<ScottK> Where did you get this text file?
<Fujitsu> Gabrielote, you just need to run that file.
<Gabrielote> do you mean the makefile?!
<jdong> Gabrielote: are you packaging the Linuxant drivers?
<Fujitsu> Gabrielote, run whatever `THE SCRIPT' is.
<Gabrielote> i got this file inside the file modem-hsfpci_0.1-0ubuntu1
<Gabrielote> yes
<Gabrielote> the script?!
<jdong> yes, run whatever file had that content
<jdong> and I thought they offered debs
<Gabrielote> hold on... let me try something
<jdong> Gabrielote: tried following http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=190728?
<imbrandon> whoops forum thread urls, time for me to hit the bed, gnight all
<jdong> imbrandon: pfft :D
<jdong> I love you too......
<Kano> is there a mc user?
<Gabrielote> hi people
<Gabrielote> i'm back again
<Gabrielote> here's the thing
<Gabrielote> i installed the modem driver sucessfully
<Gabrielote> well... at least i guess... but i'm heaving some problems with the GNOME PPP conection... whe i try to Auto-Detect my modem driver it says that the driver doesnt exist... does anyone knows what should i do?
<ScottK> Gabrielote: You should probably ask in #ubuntu
<Gabrielote> ohh ok
<Gabrielote> sorry =O)
<bddebian> Heya gang
<ScottK> Heya bddebian.
<bddebian> Hi ScottK
<ScottK> What tool would people recommend for unpacking a .rpm file?  I'm not trying to install it, just open it up so I can get a file out of it.
<azeem> ScottK: rpm
<ScottK> OK.  Makes sense.  Thanks.
<azeem> there's also some rpm2cpio util or something, I think
<ScottK> Thanks.  Looking now.
<daviey> ScottK, once the package rpm is installed you can use file roller / archive manager
* ScottK doesn't want to install it, just get a file out of it so I can see what, if anything, Red Hat changed...
<shawarma> ScottK: You misunderstood. When the package "rpm" is installed, you can use file roller to inspect an rpm file.
<ScottK> Ahh.  Thanks.
<shawarma> np
<Adri2000> hi :)
<Adri2000> can someone explain me this: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/griffith/+bug/85441 ? :/
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 85441 in griffith "Please sync griffith 0.9.1-1 (universe) from unstable (main)" [Undecided,Fix released]  
<geser> Adri2000: you might want to ask seb128 about it
<Zic_> I have a question => In Feisty, their is a package named ubuntu-restricted-extras ... But for Kubuntu, their no equality ... It's planed ?
<Zic_> because ubuntu-restricted-extras is link to gstreamer (and not xine)
<LaserJock> boy, is it hoppin' in here or what? :-)
<ajmitch> morning!
* ajmitch just crawled out of bed
<LaserJock> ajmitch: I got my MIR approved and it's already seeded \o/
<ajmitch> yay!
* ajmitch got stuff through NEW!
* ajmitch hugs the absent pitti
<LaserJock> sweet
<tepsipakki> ajmitch: whoa, authtool!
<ajmitch> yeah, now I'll upload the tons of fixes it needs
<tepsipakki> haha
<Adri2000> dpkg-source: error: Version number suggests Ubuntu changes, but Maintainer: does not have Ubuntu address
<Adri2000> XSBC that's it?
<LaserJock> Adri2000: what do you mean?
<Adri2000> XSBC-Original-Maintainer
<LaserJock> put the current Maintainer as that, and put Maintainer: Ubuntu Universe Maintainers <ubuntu-motu@lists.ubuntu.com>
<geser> yes
<Adri2000> LaserJock: I thought it was Ubuntu MOTU Developers
<ajmitch> that field is going to get so annoying
<LaserJock> yep
<LaserJock> I thought they were going to automate it
<LaserJock> I'm not sure what happened there
<geser> not for source packages
<lucas> window list
<LaserJock> mdz was going to have somebody do it
<lucas> oops
<geser> Adri2000: Ubuntu MOTU Developers <ubuntu-motu@lists.ubuntu.com>
<LaserJock> oops
<LaserJock> I put in Maintainers last night
<Adri2000> okay
<LaserJock> we should edit the wiki page for that
<Adri2000> the LP team associated with this email is https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-motu maybe it'd be better if it was ubuntu-dev (the real motu team)
<LaserJock> does it matter?
<ajmitch> yes
<ajmitch> :)
<LaserJock> I suppose, I just can't imagine a situation where it really would
<Adri2000> yes, because LP says the maintainer for these packages is MOTU-Media, link to ~ubuntu-motu
<LaserJock> what?
<Adri2000> example: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gem
<Adri2000> the name of the ubuntu-motu team is currently MOTU-Media...
<LaserJock> what the ....
<LaserJock> why would it link to ~ubuntu-motu
* ajmitch has no idea
<LaserJock> ubuntu-motu isn't even a real team
<Adri2000> because ubuntu-motu@lists.ubuntu.com I guess
<ajmitch> since I'm sure we used 'motu' as the team name
<LaserJock> yeah
<LaserJock> we have ~motu and ~ubuntu-dev
<ajmitch> https://launchpad.net/~motu
<Adri2000> the ubuntu-motu team was created automatically when a package with Maintainer: *ubuntu-motu*@... has been imported
<Adri2000> I think...
<LaserJock> and motumedia is the MOTU Media LP id
<ajmitch> yep
<Adri2000> read https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-motu : "when the mythplugins package was imported into Dapper", and then apt-cache showsrc mythplugins:
<Adri2000> Maintainer: MOTU-Media <ubuntu-motu@lists.ubuntu.com>
<Adri2000> that's all
<ajmitch> heh
<ajmitch> or this: https://launchpad.net/~pkg-zope-developers
<Adri2000> so LaserJock, you should ask an LP admin to associate the ubuntu-motu@lists.ubuntu.com email with the ubuntu-dev team
<geser> shawarma: are you going to merge spamassassin?
<shawarma> geser: I can, but if you want to, go right ahead. :-)
* shawarma wanders off to eat
<LaserJock> ajmitch: could we use a separate address for that?
<LaserJock> ubuntu-motu-discuss ;-)
<ajmitch> means getting another list
* ajmitch just wants to merge the 2 zope teams 
<LaserJock> I just don't want to have ubuntu-motu spammed :-)
<Adri2000> LaserJock: binary packages have already ubuntu-motu@l.u.c as maintainer, so I don't think it will change anything
<geser> shawarma: ok, I will do the merge
<LaserJock> :(
<LaserJock> stupid Debian ;-)
<LaserJock> stupid LP
<bddebian> stupid bddebian
<LaserJock> so I wonder what happend to the Main packages
<LaserJock> I also wonder MOTU Science
<LaserJock> should it be listed as maintianer on science packages?
<Marsmensch> has herd 4 already bean released? 
<lionel> Marsmensch: yep
<Marsmensch> :-D where to get? here it isn't linked: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FeistyReleaseSchedule
<lionel> Marsmensch: http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/releases/feisty/herd-4/
<Marsmensch> thx
<geser> Marsmensch: http://www.ubuntu.com/testing/herd4
<gnomefreak> feisty-security only opens after relase right?
<keescook> gnomefreak: correct
<gnomefreak> cool ty
<keescook> np.  :)
<_ion> seveas: Hi. Do i remember right, are you the owner/programmer of Ubugtu?
<Seveas> yes
<Seveas> _ion, they're one of my worst projects ever :)
<daviey> Seveas, one of your most addictive - i'm sure
<_ion> seveas: A feature idea: #ubuntu-changes, on which the bot would list the accepted packages in realtime-ish. (Please excuse my ignorance if such a channel exists already) :-)
<Seveas> daviey, not really
<_ion> (as in e.g. https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/feisty-changes/2007-February/date.html)
<Seveas> _ion, that's quite useless since that info can be grabbed via email and rss as well and the links it generates are all 404 due to launchpad being slow in publishing the source after uploading
<_ion> Oh well, i guess i have to setup a RSS reader. :-) I don't like using email for passing things i don't want to keep.
<Seveas> heh
* Nafallo keeps them all :-P
<daviey> _ion, i use a bathroom for passing things i don't want to keep ;)
<_ion> Yeah, bathroom is definitely better than email for that.
<TheMuso> Hey MOTUs.
<Seveas> hey TheMuso 
<Seveas> _ion, liferea is a nice rss reader 
<Seveas> you could read planet ubuntu with it as well, and the fridge, and ubuntu security notices :)
* keescook loves liferea
<Seveas> liferea in feisty is nice
<_ion> I want one that keeps fetching the feeds even when my desktop box isn't on, and synchronizes what i've already read between the computers. I probably should look at Google Reader or whatever it's called.
<Seveas> I upgraded yesterday :)
<Seveas> _ion, yeah, google reader or your own planet install
<Nafallo> _ion: centericq supports RSS I think :-)
<_ion> The Google Reader interface actually looks quite nice.
<_ion> And i don't need to run Yet Another piece of software with this amount of RAM.
<gnomefreak> arnt mian devels members automaticly?
<Nafallo> baah. centericq in a screen, and handles IM as well :-)
<Nafallo> on a server or something ofcourse ;-)
<Lutin> TheMuso: around ?
<TheMuso> Lutin: Yeah.
<Lutin> TheMuso: do you know what happened to purrr ? I can't find it in the queue nor in the archive, and I got no mail telling it's been rejected
<TheMuso> Lutin: I don't know. I haven't received anything to state that it was rejected.
<TheMuso> Only the upload accept which I posted to the list.
<Lutin> TheMuso: ok, thanks
<geser> Lutin: according to https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/feisty/+queue?queue_state=4&queue_text=pur it got rejected
<Lutin> geser: ok, thanks.
<geser> but I can't tell you why
<Lutin> I can't either, didn't get any mail :/
* ScottK got a very nice e-mail from Tollef when his package got rejected.  Did you look in your spam folder, etc...
<Lutin> ScottK: spam folder == /dev/null :)
<ScottK> Ah.  Well that makes it a little tough to check....
<Lutin> indeed. TheMuso : no email either ?
<TheMuso> Lutin: no
* TheMuso now goes back to have another look at the package.
<Adri2000> ahah, the XP CD key
<lionel> :)
<lionel> How we should manage Maintainer field in packages in REVU ?
#ubuntu-motu 2007-02-17
<geser> ajmitch: looking at your list of missing bugfixes from Debian: do you know from where your script got the fixed debian version for cacti?
<ajmitch> yes
<ajmitch> dbconfig-common
<geser> it looks like it misparsed the fixed in versions line from the bug. it contains two packages
<ajmitch> I know
<geser> ajmitch: can your script also scan the tags in Debian bugs?
<ajmitch> I guess so
<geser> can you search for Tags: security like in Debian bug #409296?
<Ubugtu> Debian bug 409296 in mpg123 "CVE-2007-0578: http_open function in httpget.c can get into infinite loop" [Important,Closed]  http://bugs.debian.org/409296
<ajmitch> yeah, they're in the same summary file
<ajmitch> sure, I'll try & get it to play along
<geser> it would be good if security bugs be also included in the list
<geser> thanks
<bddebian> Heya gang
<LaserJock> hi bddebian 
<bddebian> Heya LaserJock
<LaserJock> la la la MIR MIR MIR
<bddebian> LaserJock: :-)
<bddebian> la la la gpib build sucks.. :-)
<LaserJock> sorry dude
<LaserJock> I use the proprietary (must use 2.4 kernel) crap for a reason
<imbrandon> hum
<matt_good> hrm, I uploaded a package to REVU and it shows as uploaded by "matt@devi" which is my local Linux login & host instead of my email
<matt_good> so I can't comment on it since it doesn't think I'm the uploader
<matt_good> I tried setting DEBEMAIL and reuploading it, but that doesn't seem to have an effect
<imbrandon> fix the debian/changelog ( should have been signed anyhow ) and reupload
<bddebian> What did you use in debian/changelog?
<imbrandon> heya bddebian 
<bddebian> Heya imbrandon
<LaserJock> hi imbrandon 
<matt_good> bddebian/imbrandon: doh, yeah that seems to be the problem
<imbrandon> heya LaserJock 
<matt_good> I forgot to set DEBEMAIL in my .bashrc on my pbuilder machine
<matt_good> imbrandon: yeah, it should have the right signature though, I guess REVU just check the changelog though
* Hobbsee waves
<LaserJock> Hobbsee!
<LongPointyStick> LaserJock!!
<LaserJock> yikes!
<Hobbsee> haha
<LaserJock> I say hi to Hobbsee and LongPointyStick comes after me
<matt_good> is REVU using an old lintian?
<LaserJock> must be jelousy ;-)
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: haha
<imbrandon> lol
* LongPointyStick hugs Hobbsee 
<imbrandon> matt_good, possibly
<matt_good> it shows a "newer-standards-version 3.7.2" error, but I know that's supported on Edgy
* LaserJock waves goodby as he heads home
<imbrandon> yes ignore that on tiber
<crimsun> crimsun@tiber:~$ lsb_release -r
<crimsun> Release:        6.06
<imbrandon> heya crimsun 
<matt_good> imbrandon: how about "source-nmu-has-incorrect-version-number 0.2.0-2"?
<matt_good> what should I use for the revisions on new packages?
<imbrandon> we dont worry about nmu error but that is the wrong versioning for ubuntu
<imbrandon> depends , it goes like this ......
<imbrandon> <package>-upstreamXubuntuY where X is debian rev and Y is ubuntu rev
<imbrandon> like upstream 3.4 would be 3.4-1 in debian and 3.4-1ubuntu1 in ubuntu , and if it wasent in debian it would be 3.4-0ubuntu1
<imbrandon> etc
<imbrandon> thats the short of it, there are exceptions etc
<imbrandon> thus ignore the nmu warning BUT the versioning is wrong
<imbrandon> ...
<matt_good> imbrandon: so should I stick to -0ubuntu1 even if I make changes before it's accepted, or should I add new changelog entries for those?
<Hobbsee> matt_good: keep at -0ubuntu1
<imbrandon> no, always version it what you intend to be uploaded
<imbrandon> but -0ubuntu1 implys its not in debian, where did the package start from ?
<imbrandon> heya Hobbsee 
<Hobbsee> hey imbrandon :)
<matt_good> imbrandon: it's my application which I've packaged
<imbrandon> ok, just checking ;)
<matt_good> and I think Debian's missing the packages for pygobject, so I can't package it there yet
<matt_good> ok, one more lintian error: build-depends-without-arch-dep
<matt_good> it mentions changing Build-Depends to Build-Depends-Indep, but there's an exception for debhelper
<matt_good> I'm using debhelper, but should I move other dependencies into -Indep?
<imbrandon> now python packaging isnt my stong point, you'll have to poke someone else for that
<imbrandon> strong*
<matt_good> imbrandon: well, REVU thinks that the 0.2.0-2 version I uploaded is the latest, but that needs replaced with 0.2.0-0ubuntu1, is there any way to fix this?
<matt_good> also despite fixing my email in the changelog it still thinks "matt@devi" is the uploader
<matt_good> oh, it's still just showing the files from the earlier bad upload
<matt_good> oh, n/m
<matt_good> I just realized I was just viewing that particular upload and that the others are separate pages
<bddebian> Gawd I hate CDBS
<imbrandon> lol bddebian 
<bddebian> I can't figure out where the fsck this build-tree dir is supposed to be coming from.. :-(
<ajmitch> ah, cdbs magic
<ajmitch> it's great
<imbrandon> hum
<ajmitch> using tarball.mk?
<imbrandon> sudo apt-get install ubuntu-desktop
<imbrandon> gah wrong damn keyboard, not jsut window
* imbrandon needs a kvm
<bddebian> ajmitch: Yes :-(
<bddebian> ajmitch: But after all the clean crap, the first couple errors I get are:
<bddebian> dh_clean
<bddebian> cd build-tree/linux-gpib-3.2.08 && python2.4 language/python/setup.py clean -a
<bddebian> cd: 1: can't cd to build-tree/linux-gpib-3.2.08
<bddebian> make: [python-clean-2.4]  Error 2 (ignored)
<matt_good> imbrandon: if you have two monitors try synergy -- synergy2.sf.net
<imbrandon> i have many monitors ;)
<matt_good> synergy's a software KM switch
<matt_good> basically you move the mouse off the edge of the screen and it controls the mouse & keyboard on the other computer
<matt_good> over then network
<matt_good> but of course each box needs a monitor
<imbrandon> ahh, wouldent be pratical for me, but sounds cool
<imbrandon> wb LaserJock 
<LaserJock> hi all
<LaserJock> bddebian: I feel your pain, I'm trying to figure out how to work with the CDBS in ubuntu-docs
<bddebian> heh
<bddebian> This is frickin' craziness.  I get a different problem building locally
<crimsun> mm, libflashsupport has all sorts of cruft
<RAOF> Does anyone want to review: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=4300 (gnome-compiz-manager
<RAOF> )?
<RAOF> It's not my package, I'd just like to make sure it gets in :)
<Q-FUNK> do we get to have any beryl package for feisty?
<RAOF> I've looked at it, and it seems OK (except for needing a depencency on 4.1.0)
<RAOF> I've looked at it, and it seems OK (except for needing a depencency on debhelper 4.1.0)
<LaserJock> Q-FUNK: not that I know of yet
<esaym> anybody know where a changelog would be for the ubuntu kernels?
<Q-FUNK> LaserJock: we seem to have the beryl config tool, but not beryl-core, for some strange reason
<imbrandon> esaym, http://changelogs.ubuntu.com/changelogs/pool/main/l/linux-source-2.6.20/linux-source-2.6.20_2.6.20-8.14/changelog
<imbrandon> and the like
<imbrandon> ( e.g. debian/changlog )
<esaym> ok thanks you!
<esaym> I would like to meet this ben collins guys ;)
<esaym> guy*
<imbrandon> yea BenC is a nice guy
<imbrandon> but i'm still gonna beat him in bowling next conf
<imbrandon> ;)
<LaserJock> Q-FUNK: I think beryl-core was rejected
<RAOF> imbrandon: is that Wii bowling?  'Cause I rock at that :)
<imbrandon> real bowling ;)
<RAOF> :P
<bddebian> OK obviously this is over my head :'-(
<crimsun> you need combined powers of the motu trinity.
<bddebian> crimsun: No one ever wants to help me :'-(
<crimsun> ping me tomorrow mid-afternoon EST
<bddebian> OK, if I can.  Thx
<LaserJock> hmm, maybe some sort of Power Rangers combination of powers is what we need
<bddebian> heh
<bddebian> Man, between .NET at work, glibc for Hurd, and Ubuntu stuff I feel like a complete failure these days :-(
<LaserJock> actually, Transformers might be more appropriate for MOTU ;-)
<imbrandon> haha i cant wait for the new transformers movie
* ajmitch should probably find some food sometime today
<bddebian> imbrandon: Aye, the trailer looks cool
<imbrandon> hum is the evolution exchange connector packaged?
<imbrandon> guess so
* poningru hugs bddebian 
<poningru> you'll always be a success in our eyes :)
<bddebian> Hah, right, but thanks :-)
<ajmitch> bddebian: you still do more than me :P
<ajmitch> bddebian: how long are you sticking around for?
* ajmitch uses cdbs+tarball.mk in a couple of packages
<bddebian> I'm probably up for at least a couple of hours
<ajmitch> right
* ajmitch is heading out for an hour or so now
<ajmitch> so I may be able to look at it
<bddebian> ok, thx
<RAOF> Oooh.  bddebian, can you summon me when ajmitch gets back and explains tarball.mk?  I've always wanted to know what the hell that does :)
<bddebian> RAOF: You can have a tarball embedded inside a source tarball.  So foo-1.0.orig.tar.gz unzips to /debian + foo.tar.gz or so
<bddebian> tarball.mk unzips foo.tar.gz before building
<bddebian> I'm probably oversimplifying it a little but that's the gist of it
<RAOF> Why would you want to do that, though?  So much that it's the default in dh_make?
<bddebian> RAOF: I wouldn't.  I frickin' hate packages that have tarballs in the source package :-)
<RAOF> I thought it was against policy to have tarballs in the source package, too :)
<bddebian> Well pull the gpib source for an example if you don't believe me :)
<RAOF> :(
<bddebian> Why :(?
<bddebian> Gah, is this new?
<bddebian> dpkg-source: error: Version number suggests Ubuntu changes, but Maintainer: does not have Ubuntu address
<bddebian> pbuilder: Failed autobuilding of package
<imbrandon> what? thats strange, ubuntu revisions dosent mean a ubuntu-dev did it
<LaserJock> bddebian: that's the new Maintainer spec
<LaserJock> you need to adjust the Maintainer field
<LaserJock> bddebian: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebianMaintainerField
<bddebian> LaserJock: Ah, I didn't know it was decided, thx
<LaserJock> hmm
<bddebian> Gah, what package is /lib/modules/linux-foo/ from?
<RAOF> bddebian: Can't you just "dpkg -S /lib/modules/linux-foo" ?
<nixternal> boo
<bddebian> RAOF: Hmm, I didn't think it would work but it did, thx
<RAOF> bddebian: You could return the favour by fixing python-pyinotify on AMD64 :P
<bddebian> RAOF: Send me an amd64 and I'll be happy to try :)
<RAOF> Failing that, could you point me to the debian-maintainer spec LaserJock gave you, so I could builld the sources and see what's breaking?
<bddebian> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebianMaintainerField
<RAOF> Thanks muchly
<RAOF> Anyone know how to fix linking problems in python, I'm trying to fix bug #85705
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 85705 in pyinotify "Undefined symbol error when importing pyinotify" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/85705
* ajmitch returns
<tonyyarusso> Anyone know how many megs the minimal install that pbuilder needs actually is?
<RAOF> -rw-r--r--  1 root root  82M 2007-02-09 11:28 feisty-base.tgz
<RAOF> That's a minimal feisty pbuilder chroot.
<LaserJock> that's tar'd up though
<RAOF> True, but that's how much it takes up on disc.
<RAOF> When it's not being used.
<tonyyarusso> So,, probably 100ish.  hmm
<RAOF> Hey, Amaranth.  You're a python god, right?
<ajmitch> bddebian: still alive?
<tonyyarusso> Well, I could probably get that by about Sunday afternoon if I let it run, but it's a weekend so the family needs on too.  Dang.
<Amaranth> RAOF: sure, why not
<bddebian> ajmitch: More or less.
<RAOF> You don't need a pbuilder to package properly.  Although it is helpful
<ajmitch> bddebian: still having issues?
<RAOF> Amaranth: How would you debug a linking error in a python module?
<bddebian> ajmitch: I sort of figured out my problem but I'm debating whether to try to get it to build the modules or add the patches back in to not build them :-(
<RAOF> Amaranth: Or rather, how would you fix it so it's correctly linked.
<Amaranth> RAOF: you're building a C extension and getting linker errors?
<ajmitch> bddebian: ah alright
<tonyyarusso> RAOF: First crack at it, figured it might be a good idea.
<Amaranth> RAOF: what are the errors
<RAOF> Amaranth: I'm talking about bug #85705
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 85705 in pyinotify "Undefined symbol error when importing pyinotify" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/85705
<Amaranth> tonyyarusso: pbuilders _always_ has to get more stuff
* ajmitch checks
<ajmitch> RAOF: only on amd64?
<Amaranth> tonyyarusso: afaik that 82M is just "essential" packages
<RAOF> ajmitch: Only tested on AMD64.
<ajmitch> RAOF: right
<tonyyarusso> Amaranth: right
<RAOF> ajmitch: I suppose I could try and fire up my i386 pbuilder.
<Amaranth> RAOF: rebuild the package please
<RAOF> ajmitch: I'll go check :)
<bddebian> But damn, neither linux-headers-foo, linux-restricted-modules-common, nor linux-source-foo puts stuff in /lib/modules :-(
<RAOF> Amaranth: Have done.  Same result.
* ajmitch installs pyinotify
<RAOF> Amaranth: I've also just installed it with "sudo python setup.py install --prefix=/usr", and the same thing's happening.
* ajmitch tests on x86
<RAOF> So it doesn't seem to be a problem with the packaging per-se
* Amaranth stabs that package name
* RAOF would love it to be renamed python-inotify
<Amaranth> /var/lib/python-support/python2.5/pyinotify/inotify.py:49: RuntimeWarning: Python C API version mismatch for module _inotify: This Python has API version 1013, module _inotify has version 1012.
<ajmitch> RAOF: probably some change in python2.5
<Amaranth> this is what i get
<ajmitch> how special
<Amaranth> i'll try to fix it
<ajmitch> so it needs updated, should be trivial
<RAOF> Except I've just built it on my AMD64 box.  And it gives *me* a different error.
<ajmitch> RAOF: not necessarily rebuilding
<Amaranth> Py_InitModule4 probably doesn't exist anymore
<Amaranth> python doesn't guarantee extension api/abi
<ajmitch> Amaranth: so it fails for you on x86?
<RAOF> Sorry, I seem to have read "updated" as "rebuilt" :)
<ajmitch> there are certainly some amd64-only bugs out there, eg bug 83551
<Amaranth> ajmitch: yeah
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 83551 in rhythmbox "python plugins don't work in amd64" [High,Fix committed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/83551
<Amaranth> damn i need to update my pbuilder more often
<ajmitch> hehe
<Amaranth> it's 80MB and i have to get 40MB of packages :P
<ajmitch> import pyinotify worked fine on x86 laptop, which is out of date
<ajmitch> but it's still py 2.5
<Amaranth> interesting
* ajmitch upgrades to the latest & greatest feisty
<Amaranth> dpkg-source: error: Version number suggests Ubuntu changes, but Maintainer: does not have Ubuntu address
<Amaranth> i am going to stab someone
<RAOF> Hm.  inotify.c uses Py_InitModule3, but that never hits the object code.
<Amaranth> why does the maintainer have to have an ubuntu address?
<RAOF> Amaranth: Debian-maintainer spec.  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebianMaintainerField
<Amaranth> yeah but what if i want to use my gmail address? :)
<RAOF> :)
<Amaranth> wtf
<ajmitch> Amaranth: to inconvenience us
<Amaranth> i still get the API warning after building :P
<Amaranth> the version warning, i mean
<RAOF> Oh.
<RAOF> I *think* it might be building 2.4 modules only.
<Amaranth> does inotify work if you use python2.4?
<RAOF> Yup.
<RAOF> :(
<RAOF> Or, at least, it imports.
<Amaranth> it almost looks like it's building the python 2.4 version and calling it the python 2.5 version...
<Amaranth>         for python in $(PYVERS); do \
<Amaranth>                 $$python setup.py install --root=$(CURDIR)/debian/python-pyinotify; \
<Amaranth> hrm
<Amaranth> i think it installs the 2.4 version on top of the 2.5 version
<RAOF> Oh, it also doesn't clean between building different versions.
<RAOF> for python in $(PYVERS) ; do "$${python}" setup.py build'
<RAOF> Do you want to fix that Amaranth, or shall I give it a try?
<Amaranth> go ahead
<Amaranth> i was trying to convert it to cdbs :P
<RAOF> Hm.  That *would* be easy :)
<RAOF> Amaranth: Done.  Shall I add a debdiff to the bug?
* Fujitsu wonders if we can collect some people and revolt against the debian-maintainer spec.
<TheMuso> Fujitsu: ??
<TheMuso> WHy?
<Fujitsu> It's inconveniencing (it's no longer possible to create packages unless you're an Ubuntu Member, some maintainers (such as myself) don't use @ubuntu.com, so have to have the field mangled)... There's no option to have it unmangled.
<Fujitsu> With the binary-mangling, there was at least a method to opt-out.
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: it won't be hard to find annoyed people
<ajmitch> but I doubt it'll do much good
<ajmitch> did you see that doko has uploaded a fixed zope3?
<LaserJock> it's not really that bad though
<TheMuso> I guess it won't bother me, as I use themuso@ubuntu.com
* ajmitch uses ajmitch@debian.org for some packages
<LaserJock> they idea is that we are supposed to use ubuntu-motu@lists.ubuntu.com
<LaserJock> so it shouldn't matter
<Fujitsu> ajmitch, nice. How'd he fix it?
<ajmitch> from the changelog, looks like he just had some patches
<ajmitch> & it's 3.3.1
<Fujitsu> Ah.
<Fujitsu> I'm not up-to-date with feisty-changes since Herd 4.
* Fujitsu gets up to date.
<TheMuso> Fujitsu: Oh you mean for the maintainer field.
<TheMuso> I thought you meant for the changelog entries.
<Fujitsu> TheMuso, ah.
<TheMuso> but I guess it still causes the same problems.
<RAOF> Right.  #85705 now has a fix attached.
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: It seems to just be 3.3.1. That patch was already existing (it's the one that fixes that issue in Edgy).
<ajmitch> ok
<ajmitch> hm
<TheMuso> bug 85795
<ajmitch> we'll see how well 3.3.1 goes :)
<TheMuso> bug 85705
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 85705 in pyinotify "Undefined symbol error when importing pyinotify" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/85705
<ajmitch> http://svn.zope.org/*checkout*/Zope3/tags/3.3.1/doc/CHANGES.txt
* Fujitsu tests if 3.3.1 will actually start.
<ajmitch> I hope so
<Fujitsu> `Fixed issue 535: make HTTPInputStream work with Python 2.4.4.'... That should obsolete the patch the changelog says he updated.
<Fujitsu> Soyuz seems to have eaten that upload.
<Fujitsu> There's an accepted message, but that's all.
<bddebian> Gnight gang
<Fujitsu> Night, bddebian.
<Fujitsu> Ah, the publisher is probably still on manual.
<ajmitch> shouldn't be
<Fujitsu> Well, there are 62 items in Accepted.
<Fujitsu> They're not being published.
<ajmitch> you may be right
<ajmitch> how inconvenient
<Fujitsu> And it's a weekend too.
<Fujitsu> No Zope for me.
<ajmitch> sigh
* ajmitch fetches the source to build
<ajmitch> or not
<ajmitch> not even the source package is published this time
<TheMuso> hahaha
<Fujitsu> No.
<Fujitsu> Exactly.
<ajmitch> I had other stuff go through earlier
<Fujitsu> Everything since 7am AEST this morning is still there.
<Fujitsu> s/this morning //
<ajmitch> probably something broken, rather than the publisher being disabled intentionally
<Fujitsu> Like someone not starting something after the last rollout, which happened last time?
* Fujitsu ponders asking in #launchpad.
<ajmitch> is beta running?
<Fujitsu> No.
<Fujitsu> beta is still 503ing.
<ajmitch> sigh
<ajmitch> been like that for hours
<Fujitsu> I would presume a rollout would take somewhat less than 10 hours.
<Fujitsu> (it's been broken since I got up)
<ajmitch> yes, same
<ajmitch> & I repointed my bookmarks towards beta.lp
<Fujitsu> Yep, all my keyword bookmarks do too.
<Fujitsu> I'm sure they impressed upon their devs a couple of weeks ago that beta.lp was now a critical service, and should have similar uptime to production.
<ajmitch> hah
<ajmitch> funny
<imbrandon> lol 
<ajmitch> you are too cynical sometimes :)
<Fujitsu> I do that.
<TheMuso> heh
<LaserJock> well, that wasn't nice
<ajmitch> no, it wasn't, was it?
<LaserJock> I was KDE and it just shut my computer off
<imbrandon> LaserJock, huh?
<LaserJock> I've had very bad luck with KDE and power managment
<ajmitch> turn back to GNOME
<LaserJock> I did
<ajmitch> it's a sign
<LaserJock> but I keep trying KDE
<imbrandon> heh , thats funny because they both use the same backend
<imbrandon> for PM
<LaserJock> well, must be the frontend or something
<LaserJock> but KDE was randomly hibernating last time
<imbrandon> if its a bug in the frontend UI Riddell and Sebas are upstream , hint hint
<imbrandon> :)
<LaserJock> well, they'll just laugh at me I guess
<Fujitsu> LaserJock, I had KDE hibernate on me a few times during Dapper development, when I had a GNOME session at the sa me time.
<imbrandon> although i did install gnome on a box at home last night, just to have one pure ubuntu box
<imbrandon> shhh
<Fujitsu> :O
* Fujitsu tells... Hobbsee!
<Fujitsu> (*jarring chord*)
<ajmitch> Hobbsee won't mind
<imbrandon> heh hobbsee plays with gnome now and then too, and SuSE and stuff hehe
<ajmitch> what a confused individual
<LaserJock> well, I just can't trust KDE unfortunately on my laptop
<Fujitsu> SuSE? Ick.
<imbrandon> LaserJock, i would look deeper into it serouisly, not to start a KDE / Gnome thing, but they are using the same PM backends
<imbrandon> that is if you have the time
<LaserJock> imbrandon: I know
<LaserJock> I just can't have my "production" machine randomly quiting
<LaserJock> I'm not sure if I get any data loss
<LaserJock> but I was in the middle of a lengthy build
<imbrandon> haha i dont have any "production" machines anymore
<imbrandon> lol
<imbrandon> other than the servers
<LaserJock> well, my "production" machine runs Feisty
<imbrandon> LaserJock, start long builds on aurora with screen :)
<imbrandon> tis what i do
<LaserJock> it's not a pbuilder build
<imbrandon> ahh
<zakame> screen screen screen, we all screen for ice screen
<imbrandon> i was this >< close to getting jokosher running on windows this morning
<TheMuso> zakame: lol
<LaserJock> I'm working on upstream stuff
<zakame> hi all btw :D
<LaserJock> I finally got some working C++
<imbrandon> heya zakme
<LaserJock> I'm so proud of myself ;-)
<TheMuso> Heya zakame.
<imbrandon> zakame*
<zakame> woo LaserJock :D
<zakame> hi TheMuso, imbrandon :)
* zakame is playing upstream lately
* Fujitsu pulls zakame back downstream.
<LaserJock> it's kinda fun
<zakame> hehe
<LaserJock> I think I like upstreaming better than distro'ing
<Fujitsu> I prefer them in different ways.
<Fujitsu> And I prefer Python to C++ in most situations.
<LaserJock> imbrandon: well, I was starting to get the hang of some KDE stuff, and got some customization done
<Fujitsu> Python == good.
<zakame> quite quite
<LaserJock> Fujitsu: I'm learning both
<LaserJock> I think it's handy
<imbrandon> LaserJock, rockin, dont give up now ;)
* ajmitch is not qualified to be an upstream
<ajmitch> it requires having users
<LaserJock> imbrandon: it's too bad I use my laptop so much
<imbrandon> i did the upstream thing for a long time , its tireing
<ajmitch> imbrandon: as what?
<imbrandon> ajmitch, what do you mean as what?
<imbrandon> heh
<ajmitch> imbrandon: what upstream?
<imbrandon> what project ?
<zakame> holy upstream, bzrman
<imbrandon> ahh , mono mostly ( some kde cruft where i could )
<ajmitch> interesting
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: only very occasionally.  and then reverts.
<imbrandon> Hobbsee, ohh i know, same here, i was just making a point :)
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: :P
<imbrandon> although like i said i did set aside a 1.8ghz celeron just for a pure ubuntu / gnome box last night 
<imbrandon> so i would have one arround
<imbrandon> to test / play with stuff
<imbrandon> only has 512mb ram , but its still ok to use, just not compile on
<imbrandon> ;)
<LaserJock> well, I was reading about some of LInus' comments (please don't flame me) on KDE and so I thought I'd try it :-)
<TheMuso> imbrandon: 512MB of ram is ok for compilation.
<LaserJock> grrrr, I can't get svn.debian.org
<imbrandon> TheMuso, yea but i'm spoiled ;)
<imbrandon> leaste in that respect
<imbrandon> LaserJock, hahaha
<imbrandon> LaserJock, it all depends on what you want, here is how i explain it to people , kde is more like windows, gnome is more like osx ( out of the box for both ) , kde == customizeable to the tilt but dialogs etc a little more complex, gnome == silmpler interface but at the expense of customization
<ajmitch> hobbsee left us :(
<imbrandon> thats just my 0.2c
<LaserJock> imbrandon: maybe that's why I like OS X more than Windows
<imbrandon> but little things you notice like gnome / osx , in a dialog you change something it takes effect imeadately, kde / windows it dosent untill you hit apply or OK, and lots of other little things like that, i'm not talking just the placement of the pannels
<LaserJock> imbrandon: I just can't get around my feeling that KDE is less polished, more of a "lets see what crack we can do"
<imbrandon> LaserJock, hahah see i feel the exact other way about gnome, it just dosent feel "done" to me
<TheMuso> To each their own.
<imbrandon> yup yup
<LaserJock> imbrandon: what parts?
<TheMuso> I will be able to make a better decision once KDE is accessible.
<imbrandon> i dont knock the other, just dont use it day to day :)
<lotusleaf> Kubuntu > Jesus
<imbrandon> TheMuso, there is lots of QT KDE accessability tools
<imbrandon> LaserJock, mostly UI elements
<Fujitsu> lotusleaf, to me, that's not saying much. :P
<TheMuso> imbrandon: But they don't integrate the way the GNOME accessibility tools do.
<imbrandon> LaserJock, to me GTK is only half done
<lotusleaf> Fujitsu: Kubuntu > *
* Fujitsu finds GTK well done.
<lotusleaf> Fujitsu: I love the driving differences between the two
<imbrandon> Fujitsu, you have never seen QT toolset then
<LaserJock> imbrandon: can narrow it done any? I'm curious
<LaserJock> *can you
<imbrandon> LaserJock, like as if the dev said "ok it works ..." and went on to the next thing, instead of finishing it out totaly
<imbrandon> its justa feeling 
<imbrandon> feels like a VB6 app on windows does to me
<imbrandon> no offence , cant find a better word, but amitureish
<imbrandon> but not exactly
<LaserJock> imbrandon: like code wise?
<LaserJock> or actual look?
<Fujitsu> The new original-maintainer prefix is XSBC-, right?
<imbrandon> no like look / feel / use , wise
<imbrandon> code wise i could get over
<imbrandon> looks and interface to me is 70% of my computing experince
<imbrandon> code i can look past and cleanup later etc etc etc
<imbrandon> but as we've said in the past, its all personaly prefrence at this point, a few years ago there was alot of diffrences, but today they are both great desktops
<imbrandon> its just where you choose your "home"
<imbrandon> and the driving forces behind each one
<TheMuso> imbrandon: WHen is KDE 4 due?
<elkbuntu> ooh, gnome vs kde rants... noice
<imbrandon> like i personaly beleave in the kde way vs the gnome way in that KDE you shouldent "hide" a option from a user but you should make it not a cluster FSCK of a dialog box either, Gnome will make a simpler dialog box at the expence of too many options for the user
<imbrandon> just as a general rule on them both, there are exceptions obviously
<imbrandon> elkbuntu, no rants
<imbrandon> just BS'ing
<TheMuso> imbrandon: I really wish I could check out the KDE experience.
<imbrandon> TheMuso, the first bets's have been out a few months, sometime 2Q 2007 iirc
<imbrandon> beta's *
<TheMuso> awww
* TheMuso hasn't heard any word on accessibility.
<TheMuso> I am on the kde accessibility list.
<TheMuso> Which has been quiet for weeks.
<TheMuso> Heh. Not since 2 December has there been a post.
<LaserJock> imbrandon: hmm, I just don't know how you can see a difference between the look of gtk and qt
<elkbuntu> personally for me, i find that whenever i try kde, i spend a crapload of time trying to make it gnome-like, so i just stick with gnome
<LaserJock> imbrandon: if anything I've found qt less "polished" in the sense of not being so smooth and having artifacts
<LaserJock> it seem odd that people can find so much difference
* Fujitsu gets annoyed at the ksycoca having to rebuild on each Qt application start. Lots of delay!
<imbrandon> Fujitsu, you must be running a kdeapp not qt app , and also not have kded or someting running
<imbrandon> it shouldent rebuild everytime
<imbrandon> hum
<imbrandon> gmail just rocks
<imbrandon> oh wow LaserJock 
<imbrandon> is that thing on linux.com what you were talking about from linus?
<LaserJock> imbrandon: yes
<imbrandon> ahh i just seen it, yea he has alot of the same bitches i do it looks like
<imbrandon> ( plus i have a few astetic ones too )
<imbrandon> i might have to use that gnome computer a little more and give it a try ( i'm still keeping my kde apps LOL )
<imbrandon> amarok <3
<imbrandon> ;)
<imbrandon> brb smoke break
<zakame> bitching?
<imbrandon> zakame, seems Linus drudged up the Gnome vs. KDE debate again
<imbrandon> http://applications.linux.com/article.pl?sid=07/02/16/1937237&from=rss
<LaserJock> for me I rarely *need* to change anything in Gnome that I can't so it's not a problem
<zakame> buwahaha
<imbrandon> LaserJock, yea and see i find stuff all the time i cant change without chaging code/recompile
<imbrandon> and that irks me
<LaserJock> yeah, I bet
<zakame> can't we all get along with the Aero thing? :P
<imbrandon> "usability through obscurity" IMHO sucks
<imbrandon> zakame, hehe
<zakame> he ought to lurk moar in 4chan
<LaserJock> imbrandon: "usability through infinite configurability" sucks as well ;-)
<imbrandon> LaserJock, well imho yes a dialog that you cant make heads or tails of ( the beryl config boxes come to mind ) sucks balls, BUT on the same had i dont think you should take away options just to make it easier, you should make it useable AND keep the options 
<imbrandon> thats good design
<Fujitsu> I think GNOME could do better along the lines of configurability, but the simple, non-confusing options are also good. A `power user' or similar mode would be nice.
<imbrandon> Fujitsu, exactly and KDE gives me that , simple , sane defaults, but still configureable
<zakame> why, oh why, did desktops got so complex?
<Fujitsu> imbrandon: But wading through all of the options is going to drown a lot of people.
<LaserJock> imbrandon: simple and sane defaults? how come the first thing I hear when I talk about KDE is "Oh, the defaults suck, you gotta configure it right before it's really good"
<imbrandon> Fujitsu, there are ways to make things useable , very useable without the traditional 10000 checkboxes
<LaserJock> anyway, gotta get to bed
<imbrandon> LaserJock, i never say that about Kubuntu ( KDE yes , not kubuntu )
<imbrandon> :)
* Fujitsu kicks LP and hopes the publisher will switch on.
<imbrandon> thats the main reason i use Kubuntu or SuSE , they have great defaults for KDE OOTB
<imbrandon> Laser_away, ^^
<imbrandon> Laser_away, gnight
<imbrandon> kubuntu just wins over SuSE for package-management ( ala Debian ) :)
<Fujitsu> Not a fan of RPM, then?
<imbrandon> hell no
<imbrandon> errm no Fujitsu 
<imbrandon> hehe
<Fujitsu> I used Red Hat 7 and 8 for my first year of Linuxing... Been much better since I left RPM behind :)
<imbrandon> hrm
<imbrandon> X over SSH isnt that slow
<imbrandon> not as slow as i thought it would be
<imbrandon> hum ajmitch how do you start a just a gnome session e.g. not X/startx or gdm ( i'm trying to start a gnome session via ssh on a local X server )
<imbrandon> KDE ther eis a startkde command like startx
<imbrandon> but there dosent seemto be a startgnome
<Laser_away> gnome-session
<imbrandon> hum , duh
<imbrandon> thanks Laser_away 
<imbrandon> ln -s gnome-session startgnome
<imbrandon> hehe
<TheMuso> imbrandon: heh
<mr_pouit> could someone resync revu keyring (I've added a new email address to my gpg key, so it need resync, right ?). Thanks :)
<Hobbsee> mr_pouit: going....
<Hobbsee> mr_pouit: assuming you've sent your key to the keyservers, yes
<Hobbsee> mr_pouit: done
<Adri2000> how can I add a dot (without underlining it) after ".I http://an.url/" in a man page?
<StevenK> \.
<Adri2000> StevenK: it's underlined :(
<StevenK> My *roff skills escape me at the moment.
<StevenK> My zgrep over /usr/share/man/man1/*.gz also shows that the dots in the URL shouldn't be escaped.
<mr_pouit> Hobbsee, thanks for syncing
<Hobbsee> mr_pouit: no problem
<Adri2000> StevenK: found it: .IR http://an.url/ .
<bddebian> Heya gang
<lionel> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Hello lionel
<MetaMorfoziS> hi all, i think, the libkonq4-dev package is broken
<MetaMorfoziS> in kubuntu edgy with 3.5.6 kde
<MetaMorfoziS> Az albbi csomagoknak teljestetlen fggsgei vannak:  libkonq4-dev: Fgg ettl: libkonq4 (= 4:3.5.6-0ubuntu1~edgy1) de csak 4:3.5.6-0ubuntu1 telepthetE: Trtt csomagok
<MetaMorfoziS> It means something like this: The following package have undone dependancies, it depends on this: libkonq4 (=4:3.5.6-0ubuntu1~edgy1) but only  4:3.5.6-0ubuntu1 installable 
<MetaMorfoziS> i'm don't know what is the problem, but the only difference in "~edgy1" suffix
<Adri2000> sounds like -backports
<MetaMorfoziS> what is backports?
<MetaMorfoziS> and, how can i solve this?
<Adri2000> can you try 'grep backports /etc/apt/sources.list' please?
<MetaMorfoziS>  deb http://de.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ edgy-backports main restricted universe multiverse
<MetaMorfoziS>  deb-src http://de.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ edgy-backports main restricted universe multiverse
<MetaMorfoziS> what is the backport?
<Adri2000> repository with newer packages backported from the development version
<mr_pouit> Adri2000, iirc, backport do not handle libraries
<MetaMorfoziS> so i need to comment that out?
<Adri2000> mr_pouit: yes, it's unlikely to come from -backports, since the source package is kdebase
<mr_pouit> Adri2000, maybe kubuntu.org repository ?
<Adri2000> yep, that's what I was thinking of
<Adri2000> for kde 3.5.6
<MetaMorfoziS> i'm don't really understand what yours saying, so is this problem solvable?
<MetaMorfoziS> and how:)
<Adri2000> MetaMorfoziS: 'grep kde /etc/apt/sources.list' please :)
<MetaMorfoziS> deb http://kubuntu.org/packages/kde-latest edgy main
<MetaMorfoziS> that is manually rewrited to kde-latest
<MetaMorfoziS> on kubuntu org kde-3.5.6 written..
<MetaMorfoziS> but i don't want to rewrite that every version of kde
<Adri2000> MetaMorfoziS: first, did you try sudo apt-get update?
<MetaMorfoziS> a 10minute ago...
<Adri2000> ok, you should go asking in #kubuntu, which is a support channel and where people might be able to help you
<MetaMorfoziS> but i tryed again, nothing changed
<MetaMorfoziS> yep i know, but i thought in this room are more people who can help me...
<MetaMorfoziS> not this room is packager's room?
<Adri2000> we (MOTUs) take care of universe and multiverse, kdebase is a main package and is kde specific
<MetaMorfoziS> hm, okay, but thank yours
<Adri2000> no problem
<MetaMorfoziS> in kubvuntu nobody answers:/ as never
<MetaMorfoziS> in kubuntu no helpers, i think i asked about 10questions in the last month, but i never getted answers:/
<imbrandon> MetaMorfoziS, Riddell will update the symlink to kde-latest when he gets a chance
<imbrandon> its probably still pointing to 3.5.5
<MetaMorfoziS> okay
<Lathiat> easy-codec-installation is sexy
<Lathiat> just worked (tm)
<caravena> Lathiat: : -D
<ajmitch> yay, zope3 still doesn't work
<caravena> Lathiat: ubuntu-calendar is "SEXY"
<imbrandon> lol
<Lathiat> hee
<imbrandon> ajmitch, rockin, sounds like some work
<Lathiat> still i have a list of 8 immediately obvious bugs from herd4, doh!
<caravena> package ubuntu-calendar is COOL! : -D
<ajmitch> imbrandon: bah
<ajmitch> imbrandon: the bug of course isn't even in zope3
<imbrandon> of course
* ajmitch isn't entirely sure why doko uploaded this new version of zope then
<doko> ajmitch: I'm not sure which bug you are talking about ...
<nixternal> imbrandon: what's up homey :)
<ajmitch> doko: bug 83053
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 83053 in twisted-web2 "AttributeError: components.Interface" [High,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/83053
<ajmitch> doko: btw I talked to salgado about the teams issue, he'll hopefully look at it this week
<doko> ajmitch: thanks
<imbrandon> nixternal, heya
<imbrandon> nixternal, nadda just finishing up my shift then off to the phone store to buy a new phone ( dropped mine in the snow and it died )
<imbrandon> probably grab one with bluetooth to try it out in linux
<nixternal> hehe
<somerville32> imbrandon, Did you figure anything out for me yet?
<nixternal> Laser_away: when you get around, need to figure out what needs to be done for the Edubuntu docs package
<fuoco> i have a question: i have a package that uses an included python script to do the building and installation. the install path seems to be hard coded in it - what should i do then - change it to hard code the right path ?
<superm1> hey keescook you around?
<shawarma> bddebian: Do you happen to have the build log from building network-manager-openvpn? The build works just fine here..
<bddebian> shawarma: You have the maintainer set to Ubuntu MOTU Developers?
<shawarma> bddebian: No.
<shawarma> bddebian: I thought I'd fix the FTBFS first.
<shawarma> bddebian: And you say maintainer should be set to "Ubuntu MOTU Developers <ubuntu-motu@lists.ubuntu.com>" ?
<bddebian> Yep.  That is the only FTBFS for me :)
<shawarma> bddebian: Huh? You wrote "pbuilder: Failed autobuilding of package "
<shawarma> bddebian: Oh... You have a version of pbuilder that fails if maintainer is not @ubuntu.com ?
<bddebian> That's the pbuilder error due to the maintainer error
<bddebian> Yes
<shawarma> Interesting.
<bddebian> It just started happening to me yesterday :-(
<shawarma> I'm not as such againt moving targets, but sheeesh! You look away for a couple of days and all your packages start to ftbfs. :-)
<bddebian> Tell me about it :)
<ajmitch> yay, massive breakage
<shawarma> So... When we're merging.... WE should change the maintainer or what?
<bddebian> It's starting to look that way
<ajmitch> more work for you
<shawarma> ajmitch: Yay!
<somerville32> bddebian, :D
<somerville32> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=4392
<somerville32> Please :)
<Adri2000> somerville32: we are in UVF
<somerville32> Noes!
* somerville32 cries.
* somerville32 shall file a FFE.
<coNP> UVF means that new package software go to feisty-updates | -backports | #deisty+1 ?
<keescook> superm1: in and out
<superm1> keescook, i was just wondering what came of that uvfe?
<poningru> somerville32: catfish?
<keescook> superm1: well, two motu-uvf folks said it was okay, but didn't change the bug to "confirmed", which is what the Wiki says they're supposed to do... so I commented on both, wondering if it was okay to upload.
<somerville32> poningru, yes.
<superm1> well in the meanwhile, did you grab the bzr sources so its ready tehn at least
<superm1> *the bzr branch and upstream tarball
<keescook> superm1: I checked out your bzr stuff, but didn't do a build yet.  :)
<keescook> it'll be quick, though.
<superm1> mkay, well i have a fresh build if you wanted at my personal repo (http://home.eng.iastate.edu/~superm1)
<superm1> if you dont feel like going through the build locally
<superm1> i tested it the other day in a feisty VM, looks good to me :)
<keescook> superm1: excellent.  :)
<keescook> Yeah, I'm assuming it's all been okay'd, but I want to follow process as much as possible.  :)
<superm1> yea i certainly wouldnt want to be on the bad side for all the motu brethern....
<superm1> dont blame you
<superm1> siretart, could you comment on the bug, is it ready to be marked confirmed?  or does slomo still need to ack it too?
<somerville32> poningru, Seems like there are some issues with it
<siretart> superm1: which bug is that?
<somerville32> (just telling you in case you were looking at it)
<superm1> bug 85172
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 85172 in mythtv "UVFe: for newer upstream version" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/85172
<superm1> and its compliment  bug 85205
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 85205 in mythplugins "UVFe: for newer upstream version" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/85205
<Adri2000> hi siretart, if the wormux UVFe is ok, can you confirm it and unassign motu-uvf please?
<siretart> Adri2000: bug no?
<Adri2000> bug #84595
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 84595 in wormux "[UVF exception request]  wormux 0.7.9-2" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/84595
<shawarma> bddebian: I've uploaded the network-manager packages again with the updated maintainer field as the only change.
<shawarma> bddebian: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=4393 and 4394
<siretart> gnaa, bah, I'm tired. I just mixed SRU from UVF :/
<Adri2000> siretart: ahh, actually it's already confirmed, so I can subscribe ubuntu-archive for the sync?
<siretart> Adri2000: I'd say yes!
<Adri2000> ok :)
<keescook> siretart: if you're happy with 85205 and 85172, I can do the uploads.
<TheMuso> Hey MOTUs.
<crimsun> somerville32: why did you title 85881 a feature freeze exception request?
<crimsun> we're still five days out from FF
* somerville32 dies.
<_ion> I really, really, really hope http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=4133 gets in before the freeze.
<siretart> hm, since superm1 is bug contact, and actively looks after mythtv, I'm okay with both mythtv uploads
<superm1> siretart, wonderful thanks :)
<poningru> ooh
<poningru> superm1: I had couple of suggestions
<poningru> superm1: how about a mythtv standalone package
<superm1> poningru, what do you mean standalone package?
<crimsun> does it take the unanimous approval of the LP MOTU UVF team or just one member's?
<poningru> superm1: that includes the backend+frontend+mysqlconfiguration
<superm1> poningru, i'm working towards that
<superm1> slowly
<superm1> there are a few metapackages that are being introduced here
<poningru> superm1: woah dude I can help... learning to package in ubuntu right now
<superm1> poningru, come to #ubuntu-mythtv
<superm1> we can chat there so we dont clutter up motu
<shawarma> Who is daemon@poleboy.de? sistpoty?
<crimsun> yes.
<shawarma> Ok.
<shawarma> crimsun: so.... are you up for reviewing a couple of packages? FF is getting dangerously close.
<crimsun> tonight, if after I finish alsa triaging and packaging ardour2, sure.
<shawarma> Wicked.
<shawarma> crimsun: It's network-manager-{vpnc,openvpn} if you want to put them on a list of some sort.
<shawarma> Who can change stuff in the REVU code?
<shawarma> don't be shy. It's a really tiny change..
<fdoving> siretart maybe? 
<shawarma> perhaps
<shawarma> siretart: ^^ ?
<poningru> shawarma: omg thank you
<poningru> rexbron: vpnc and openvpn
<poningru> err re
<poningru> sorry rexbron 
<crimsun> (it'd be nice if our NM had the requisite LEAP patches, but whatever)
<shawarma> poningru: Ah, you need them too? As I wrote on the mailing list. There's a *LOT* of demand for them. :-)
<poningru> crimsun: LEAP?
<poningru> http://www.gatorlug.org/node/122
<crimsun> proprietary cisco junk used by a lot of businesses and universities
<poningru> right
<poningru> including ufl.edu
* poningru shakes fist at his uni
<poningru> if only they used openvpn
<shawarma> crimsun: I was under the impression the vpnc plugin did the trick for most people?
<crimsun> I have not tried it
<shawarma> crimsun: What about vpnc alone?
<crimsun> up until last week, I've used interfaces(5) and wpa_supplicant.conf alone
<poningru> it does but it does not use mga iirc
<shawarma> crimsun: Ah, we're not talking vpn?
<crimsun> no.
<poningru> oh...
<shawarma> crimsun: I just assumed so given the context. :-)
<shawarma> crimsun: I'm on the nm mailing list. I think there has been some discussion about LEAP recently.
<shawarma> crimsun: Either that, or I'm on crack again.
<poningru> crimsun: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lightweight_Extensible_Authentication_Protocol ?
<crimsun> I'd assume there was at least a bit of discussion, as trunk has the patches, and people have blogged about using it
<crimsun> poningru: yes
<shawarma> crimsun: Ok.
<poningru> ah thankfully our uni doesnt use it
<shawarma> Neither does ours. They just only allow access to a Cisco concentrator from the wifi so vpnc suffices which is semi-OK.
<shawarma> If you're studying at the right faculty they even give out the group password for vpn on the intranet. :-)
<sjh24> I was wondering where I go to ask that two packages are updated?
<coNP> sjh24: you want newer versions of packages ?
<sjh24> coNP: yes
<sjh24> listen and music-applet
<coNP> gnome?
<sjh24> yup
<coNP> hey, we need some gnome expert :)
<zul> enter a bug in launchpad
<sjh24> listen just released 0.5 and music-applet just went 2.0.0
<coNP> I guess it will be synced anyway
<sjh24> they aren't in debian yet
<coNP> if gnome 2.18 ships them
<sjh24> they aren't gnome proper
<coNP> then file bugs
<TheMuso> It is upstream version freeze, so there would have to be good reasons to update them.
<sjh24> I think music-applet has good reasons... maybe less so for listen
#ubuntu-motu 2007-02-18
<Hobbsee> \sh_away: did you see that you've got comments on your REVU pages?
<ajmitch> hi Hobbsee 
<Hobbsee> hey ajmitch 
<Hobbsee> oh, it's been changed since then
<Hobbsee> shawarma: poke
<Hobbsee> oh, it's shawarma, not \sh_away 
* Hobbsee must be going insane...
<bddebian> Heya gang
<Hobbsee> heya bddebian!
<bddebian> Hi Hobbsee
<ajmitch> hi bddebian 
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<bddebian> I hate upstream authors some times
<shawarma> Hobbsee: Er... Huh?
<LaserJock> evening MOTU
<shawarma> bddebian: Hey! Could you take another peek at my network-manager packages? I've changed the maintainer (and nothing else), so it should be a quick review.
<bddebian> shawarma: Hobbsee and I already have ;-)
<bddebian> Heya LaserJock
<shawarma> bddebian: So you have. Sorry.
<bddebian> NP :)
<Hobbsee> shawarma: see the typo alert :)
<bddebian> Did you not get what Hobbsee wrote/
<bddebian> ?
<coNP> How is it possible to commit a bugfix to a Ubuntu package that has a maintainer with no @ubuntu.com address?
<Hobbsee> the maintainer address in debian/control needs to be a ubuntu address - not the changelog one
<coNP> Hobbsee: okay, I know
<LaserJock> and I'm not sure if that will even cause a problem or if it's just a warning
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: it ftbfs, apparently
<coNP> But it is not, and it is a *ubuntu* package
<coNP> it says: "debuild: fatal error at line 1228:"
<coNP> and exits, of course
<LaserJock> really? that sucks :(
<LaserJock> ah well, I guess it'll make us fix it :/
<coNP> I allready feisty that might be a problem
<shawarma> bddebian: I was just a bit confused by the sh_away/shawarma confusion. :-)
<bddebian> Ah :-)
<Fujitsu> coNP, as long as a package has XubuntuY, it won't let you build without @ubuntu.com in the Maintainer field... Isn't this new policy great?
<Hobbsee> shawarma: yes, so was i :P
* Hobbsee would have thought a !*@debian.org address would have sufficed...
<coNP> Fujitsu: it is, however what to do with "legacy" packges?
<LaserJock> Hobbsee: but that's the point
<Fujitsu> Hobbsee, I would have thought that you would be able to opt out, at least.
<LaserJock> the whole point is that Ubuntu packages should have ubuntu-motu@lists.ubuntu.com or ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: ie, ftbfs on a XubuntuY version, with a *@debian.org email address - not ftbfs on anything that's not a *@ubuntu.com address
<coNP> actually this suffix is neither debian.org nor ubuntu.com
<LaserJock> well, the spec is to move away from actual people listed as Maintainer
<LaserJock> so it shouldn't really even have @ubuntu.com addresses
<LaserJock> to reflect that we team maintain packages
<Fujitsu> LaserJock: But a number of packages are maintained by certain people.
<LaserJock> but they aren't technically
<Fujitsu> In reality they are, though.
<LaserJock> we have no NMU
<LaserJock> any MOTU can upload any package in Universe
<LaserJock> and core-dev can upload any package in Main and Universe
<Fujitsu> It's not a matter of whether they can. It's whether they do.
<Fujitsu> There are some packages for which it is a given that only one or two people touch them.
<bddebian> somerville32: ping (catfish)
<LaserJock> Fujitsu: sure, but there is no Policy to govern that
<LaserJock> so a person should look at the changelog rather than Maintainer:
<shawarma> bddebian, Hobbsee: Fresh version of the nm packages are uploaded the typo fixed. 
<Hobbsee> shawarma: nice
<Fujitsu> shawarma, do you need someone to look at them? I use both a bit.
<Hobbsee> bddebian: can you ack, upload them please?
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: if you like
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: bddebian's pretty much done the second ack
<shawarma> I can also just upload them myself..
<bddebian> shawarma: I would just upload them both at this point
<LaserJock> Fujitsu: Debian wants us to remove them from Maintainer: , the only way for us to replace that since we have team maintainership is to set MOTU or core-dev as maintainer
<shawarma> Fujitsu: bddebian has checked it numerous times. For now I actually just want to get them in before FF.
<shawarma> bddebian: Excellent. Will do.
<LaserJock> Fujitsu: if somebody wants to be known as the Ubuntu maintainer they can put in a @ubuntu.com address
<shawarma> bddebian, Hobbsee: Yay! Uploaded. Thanks a lot!
<Hobbsee> shawarma: :D
<zul> there...xen updated
<bddebian> shawarma: No, thank YOU :-)
<bddebian> Gawd reviews sucks wit this stupid maintainer thing :-(
* Hobbsee emails motulist @ the REVU's
<shawarma> Right, I'm off to bed. G'night guys.
<Hobbsee> night shawarma 
<LaserJock> cy shawarma
<bddebian> Gnight shawarma
* LaserJock stabs adept_update
<LaserJock> grrr, what the heck is it doing/
<LaserJock> *?
<somerville32> bddebian, pong
<Fujitsu> What is it doing?
<bddebian> somerville32: Did catfish get rejected?
<somerville32> I'm not a motu
<somerville32> I can't upload
<bddebian> Jereme said he already uploaded it.  Did it never get uploaded?
<somerville32> He said it in here or on the comments?
<bddebian> On the comments
<bddebian> But I don't see it in the new queue
<somerville32> That got uploaded a long time ago
<somerville32> This is a new version
<bddebian> Ohh, OK
<LaserJock> Fujitsu: adept_update was complainging about some debconf niceness and said to change it but gave no option to do so
<LaserJock> so it ended up not installing anything
<LaserJock> apt-get dist-upgrade FTW
<LaserJock> imbrandon!!!!!
<LaserJock> seriously uncool
<LaserJock> it did it again
<LaserJock> and it took 2 reboots to get it back to life
<LaserJock> I suspect KDE is overheating my machine or something
<imbrandon> hum
<jdong> wow... the basement of the library is REALLY peaceful....
<jdong> guys, in about 20-30min kick me out, please :)
<jdong> staying here too long probably isn't healthy :)
<LaserJock> the library?
<LaserJock> I love libraries
* jdong in the basement of the Hayden Memorial Library
* jdong found a nice LaTeX book
<LaserJock> cool
<jdong> I don't see why people whine about LaTeX so much... so far I've found it less cumbersome than a WYSIWYG editor
<LaserJock> it depends
<jdong> maybe I'm just not deep enough into it
<LaserJock> I once did a 4ft x 5ft poster entirely in LaTeX
<jdong> for typing up EECS homework... LaTeX wins
<LaserJock> took me about a month
<jdong> going in and out of monospace codeblocks in OOo ain't no walk in the park :D
<LaserJock> but it was beautiful
<Fujitsu> LaserJock: Dad once did an A0 one. Cost some AUD200 to print.
<jdong> LaserJock: sounds like fun :D
<Fujitsu> jdong: Plus, OOo is a bloated POS.
<LaserJock> these days I use PowerPoint for posters though
<LaserJock> it's faster and cheaper
<jdong> interesting
<imbrandon> koffice ftw
* imbrandon is afk
<jdong> imbrandon: lol :)
<LaserJock> koffice seems quite good
<LaserJock> but even openoffice doesn't have good enough compatibility for me
<imbrandon> you mean MS office doesnt have good enough compat with the other two major players?
<imbrandon> heh
<imbrandon> spin, got to love it
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: btw, changing components.Interface to Interface in twisted-web2's iweb.py lets zope3 start
<imbrandon> its like the diffrence from when MS says "... make sure your laptop is ready for Vista ..." vs " .. is linux ready for your laptop ... " its all about word smithing
<jdong> lol
<LaserJock> imbrandon: it's true, but as long as MS Office is on all the computers I have to present on there isn't a ton I can do
<imbrandon> MS isnt a software company , its a marketing company that markets software
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: seems that it can make do with zope.interface
<imbrandon> LaserJock, true
<LaserJock> it's really been sad to see my advisor's computer usage over the years
<LaserJock> when I first started working for him he was a die-hard Linux user
<LaserJock> wouldn't touch MS
<LaserJock> installed OpenOffice on all the dept's lab computer
<jdong> imbrandon: http://www.freesoftwaremagazine.com/node/2075 << that's a joke, right?
<jdong> the more I read it the more I get the feeling the author was serious
<LaserJock> now he's all OS X and MS Office
<Fujitsu> ajmitch, nice... I'll look at later and try to use it a lot to break it.
<bddebian> jdong: He sure sounds serious, even if crackful
<imbrandon> hahah no idea, some people are just dense and view "slave" as a bad word when it has a real meaning
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: yeah, I've just tried starting it - there are a bunch of other changes in SVN, it's hard to pick out only the ones that are needed
<imbrandon> that would be like changing ide drives from master-->slave
<jdong> imbrandon: that was up for discussion
<imbrandon> people need to get over it, it has no racial conotaions
<jdong> imbrandon: in San Fran IIRC
<bddebian> That sounds about right
<jdong> imbrandon: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Master-slave_%28computers%29#Controversy
<jdong> sad but true
<imbrandon> jdong, maybe by one company, but thousands of compansy in many countries use those terms 
<imbrandon> it would be inpratical to change
<jdong> no kidding :)
<imbrandon> and it figures it was on the left coast
<imbrandon> anyhow, bbiab
<jdong> I find it amusing to find people complaining about that
<LaserJock> well, at some level it does make sense
<jdong> and also , a Christian group objected to *nix being taught in some school district
<jdong> due to the use of 'daemons'
<imbrandon> i dont i find it sick that in todays world people look for something to complain racialy about when its way offbase
<ajmitch> jdong: idiocy
<jdong> ajmitch: was that directed at me or the article? :D
<jdong> ajmitch: either one would be correct :D
<ajmitch> heh
<LaserJock> people ask Ichthux and Ubuntu CE if they've replaced all daemons
<jdong> lol
<LaserJock> I think it's a bit entertaining, but whatever
<imbrandon> as long as there is a human race SOMEONE will complain about something, you have to choose your battles and these people obviously have no clue 
<jdong>  /etc/cron.daily/50-exorcise-daemons.....
<jdong> LaserJock: IMO it's funny when people do it as satire, really concerning when people seem serious
<LaserJock> well, if it was actually spelled demons I could see it
<jdong> LaserJock: daemon/demon are interchangeable
<imbrandon> im gonna make a distro thats call "redhead step-child"
<jdong> isn't that kubuntu?
<bddebian> hehe
<jdong> oops
<LaserJock> lol
* imbrandon /kicks jdong 
<jdong> LOL
<imbrandon> thats edubuntu
<LaserJock> ouch!!
<imbrandon> ;)
<imbrandon> {,k}ubuntu satanic edition .... http://parker1.co.uk/satanic/
<imbrandon> :)
* imbrandon stops
<LaserJock> Edubuntu rocks so just leave it alone :p
<jdong> anybody getting a Cannot Unmount volume: Can't remove directory error?
<jdong> when unmount stuff?
<jdong> (GNOME)
<LaserJock> I haven't
<jdong> aha bug 85424
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 85424 in gnome-mount "Unmount fails every time " [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/85424
<jdong> what's the etiquette with Confirmed?
<jdong> should developers set that or can I set it if I'm reasonably confident of a confirmation?
<LaserJock> I think you can
<crimsun> if you've experienced the precise symptoms, set it.
<LaserJock> you might have to be in ubuntu-qa
<LaserJock> I can't remember
<jdong> crimsun: ok, there's in total like 8 people reporting identical symptoms
<crimsun> I have not been able to reproduce those symptoms either from a dist-upgrade (from Breezy) or on a fresh daily.
<jdong> crimsun: do you have an iPod?
<crimsun> e.g., not reproducible on three different iPod models
<jdong> hmm
<jdong> interesting
<jdong> it happens on my system.. dist-upgraded from edgy....
<crimsun> nor is it reproducible on six different other usb mass storage devices.
<crimsun> in other words, you all just suck.
<jdong> LOL
<crimsun> ;)
<jdong> crimsun: when do you think tickless will happen?
* jdong still irked about C3/C4 buzzing on his laptop...
<crimsun> err, best ask Ben/Matthew ...
<jdong> ok
<crimsun> at this stage, it's fairly unlikely for Feisty
<jdong> right, I realize that :)
<jdong> and speaking of that, is it likely that ext4dev would be enabled?
<crimsun> (see above)
<crimsun> I'm a measley community contact for a tiny kernel subsystem
<jdong> crimsun: since when was ALSA small?
<crimsun> I take the inverse of its bug count
<jdong> lol
<ajmitch> hello crimsun 
<crimsun> hello ajmitch 
<paulproteus> I'm a Debian maintainer and I'd like my Debian package to be merged into Ubuntu for the Feisty release.
<paulproteus> This is about the alpine package; I talked to some people around here a week or so ago, and I wanted to make sure I didn't miss a deadline for a freeze.
<paulproteus> I also am not sure where to find the freeze timeline.
<crimsun> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FeistyReleaseSchedule
<paulproteus> Sweet, thanks!
<jdong> paulproteus: probably not too sweet ;-)
<jdong> I think it's already age of the UVF Exception Requests?
<Fujitsu> jdong, 4 days until the new package deadline.
<jdong> ah, ok
<Fujitsu> UVF was a little while ago, but that's just new upstream versions, not whole new packages.
<jdong> ah, ok
<jdong> I thought new packages would've gone under the same category
<Fujitsu> Oddly enough, no.
<jdong> well I guess it kinda makes sense
<Fujitsu> It's probably because there's less chance of a regression.
<jdong> right
<Fujitsu> It can't break worse than not existing.
<jdong> since it didn't exist before
<paulproteus> Hah. (-:
<jdong> Fujitsu: you have no idea how many backports tickets I've supported with that logic!
<Fujitsu> Hehe.
<Hobbsee> paulproteus: which package?
<jdong> Hobbsee: alpine I think he said
<Hobbsee> ah, missed that bit
<jdong> Hobbsee: attentively read scrollback you must :)
* paulproteus nods
<crimsun> (just file a sync request for it, sub ubuntu-universe-sponsors, then move along)
* Hobbsee read almost all of it
<paulproteus> It hasn't been built by the autobuilders yet, so it's not on packages.debian.org, but it's in the process of that right now.
<keescook> hiya paulproteus 
<paulproteus> Hah!  Hi keescook. (-:
<Fujitsu> paulproteus, has it passed through NEW?
<zul> ls
<crimsun> Permission denied.
<paulproteus> Fujitsu, Months ago; this is just a new version of a package I put in Debian a few months back.
<jdong> Password:
<bddebian> crimsun: hehe
<paulproteus> "File a sync request" you say, crimsun?
<crimsun> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SyncRequestProcess
<paulproteus> crimsun, Thanks, I appreciate the patience. (-:
<jdong> aack that's 3La^2 not 31a^2
<jdong> pffft
* jdong files "Maxima stupid font costed me 7 extra minutes doing my physics"
<LaserJock> :(
* Fujitsu shudders at the mention of Maxima.
* crimsun files damned backports cost me my sanity
<paulproteus> In what package do I file sync requests?
<paulproteus> Against what package, that is; I'm at Launchpad now.
<crimsun> leave it blank.
<jdong> crimsun: lol someone say flashplugin? :D
<crimsun> (the source package isn't in Ubuntu yet)
<paulproteus> Thanks. (-:
<jdong> anyone else feel latex leaves a mess in one's workspace?
<jdong> all these intermediate files...
<LaserJock> well, it can be messy
* jdong figures out what to glob to get rid of all the crap
<LaserJock> but it can also be helpful
<jdong> LaserJock: helpful? all these log and aux and whatnot files?
<LaserJock> yeah, bibliographic material, etc. gets used in there
<jdong> vim couldn't be more annoying if it created 5 extra randomly-named backups!
<jdong> LaserJock: ah , ok I see...
<LaserJock> not all of it is just useless junk ;-)
<jdong> lol that's news to me
<jdong> baw I broke latex :(
<jdong> wait no, wrong terminal
* jdong needs to find closest coffee shop
* paulproteus grins
<jdong> oh dear paulproteus please don't start the latex innuendos :D
<Mez> jdong, you broke latex? you should go get the morning after pill
<jdong> MEZ!!!!
<Mez> jdong, yes?
<jdong> Mez: I love you.
<Mez> jdong, why ?
<jdong> Mez: that was sarcastic.
* Mez feels hurt
<jdong> I don't really like you. I was just saying that for comedic effect
<jdong> ;-)
* Mez cries
* ajmitch wonders if we can start banning people
<paulproteus> jdong, Those didn't even occur to me, though I see others here are more creative than I. (-;
<jdong> paulproteus: it's not creativity... I get it from everyone in CSAI lab that I asked a latex question to
<jdong> paulproteus: it was amusing the first once or twice... but 3 hours later.... not so much
<paulproteus> Duly noted, jdong. (-:
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: banning which people?
<Mez> ajmitch, who, me or jdong?
<jdong> Mez: probably all of us :D
<ajmitch> Mez: both
<ajmitch> hey bmonty 
<Fujitsu> Let's ban the whole channel!
<ajmitch> aw
<Fujitsu> ... quick visit.
<LaserJock> oh please do ban the whole channel
* Mez sets mode _b *!*@ubuntu/*
<Fujitsu> And he left #ubuntu-devel a few seconds later.
<ajmitch> probably because of you wanting to ban him :)
* Mez sets mode +b *!*@ubuntu/*
<LaserJock> jdong: wheren't we supposed to kick you out?
<jdong> LaserJock: never! being in a basment rocks!
<ajmitch> actually yes
<jdong> LaserJock: especially one that has wifi!
<zul> heh...i suggest a wordban
<jdong> like prevu, backports, reiser4.....
<zul> ubuntuforums
* jdong kicks zul
* jdong looks for a Vista Premium logo to set as zul's avatar
<ajmitch> I don't think he'll care
<ajmitch> bmonty: stay this time, k?
<bmonty> sure :)
<bmonty> sorry about that
<bmonty> hows it going?
<ajmitch> good to see you, how's it going?
<ajmitch> heh, alright :)
<crimsun> heya bmonty 
<Fujitsu> Hi bmonty.
<bmonty> hi crimsun
<jdong> whoa! it's Kano!
* Mez saw a windows vista poster the other day and thought it was advertising World of Warcraft
<nox-> moin
<jdong> Mez: lol
<Fujitsu> Mez: They're everywhere.
<Mez> it was like 
<Fujitsu> What a great slogan it is, too.
<Mez> "WOW starts here..."
<Kano> hi
<Mez> Fujitsu, my lug has plans to subvertise those adverts
<bmonty> ajmitch: things are good...you?
<Kano> did someone try to change to a dir with a "_" and mc?
<LaserJock> bmonty!!!!
<ajmitch> bmonty: doing alright here
<bmonty> hi LaserJock
<ajmitch> LaserJock: I blinked a couple of time, too
<LaserJock> bmonty: how's Gabe and the rest of the family?
<bmonty> LaserJock: Gabe is doing well....walking around now.  We have another one on the way now too :)
<LaserJock> bmonty: congrats!
<bmonty> thanks :)
<crimsun> Kano: what's the issue?
<ajmitch> bmonty: congrats :)
<ajmitch> seems like half the people round here are married with kids..
<bmonty> :)
<bddebian> w00t bmonty.  Now you can suffer like me! :)
<bmonty> heh...hi bddebian
<nox-> crimsun, says Warning: Cannot change to <dir>.
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: so when will you become one of them?
<nox-> and tarring up the dir via mc fails too
<crimsun> nox-: got an strace -fF?
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: oh I might get married in a couple of weeks, got nothing better to do :P
<nox-> it works when run via strace... :-O
<LaserJock> Hobbsee: do you know if konqi works with mozilla plugins?
<LaserJock> or rather if mozilla plugins work in konqi
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: it may.  i think it does, actually
<nox-> Kano told me about it, and i was able to reproduce it using the feisty-desktop-i386.iso in qemu
<nox-> it also works when starting mc with SHELL=dash
<LaserJock> lol, I've got more KDE apps than Gnome apps open right now
<LaserJock> although I've only got 4 things so that's not saying much I suppose
<crimsun> Kano: / nox-: I'm looking at https://savannah.gnu.org/bugs/?18136  ( -> http://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=153925 )
<Ubugtu> bugs.gentoo.org bug 153925 in Applications "app-misc/mc wont work with new bash-3.2 propeply with all directories" [Normal,Resolved: fixed]  
<Kano> fixed?
<nox-> aah
<nox-> yeah that seems to be this bug
<Kano> does not really be fixed in universe
<nox-> so bash needs to be updated?
<crimsun> mc.
<nox-> i c
<crimsun>   mc_4.6.1-6ubuntu1_source.changes: done.
<crimsun> Successfully uploaded packages.
<crimsun> Kano: / nox-: thanks.
<nox-> yw
<Kano> crimsun, fine
<Kano> i really started to hate ubuntu because of not working mc ;)
<Kano> now i can use it again
<Kano> just compiled my own version with that patch,worked too
<Kano> bye
<crimsun> paulproteus: ACKed.
<crimsun> please remember that in the future, you need to include the Debian component and the Debian changelog entries.
<paulproteus> crimsun, ls
<paulproteus> Gah, sorry.
<paulproteus> crimsun, Thanks.
<paulproteus> crimsun, Also, were you involved in #debian-kde like four years ago?
<crimsun> something like that.
<paulproteus> Well, rehi then. (-:
<crimsun> w/ kosh, roey, etc.
<crimsun> re
* paulproteus nods enthusiastically
<paulproteus> I remember Roey; I think I saw him around recently.
<LaserJock> yikes, I was getting close to a full hard drive on my laptop :/
<pochu> hey, do you know what's the way to log the terminal output into a file?
<crimsun> what do you wanted logged, stdout? stderr? both?
<crimsun> foo -flags >file.txt 2>&1
<pochu> crimsun: thanks!
<jdong> or foo &>file.txt
<jdong> if you're a bash user
<jdong> faster to write :)
<pochu> :)
<pochu> and to have it logged but also show the output in the terminal? with that, it just logs it, but I can't see what's happening :)
<pochu> I want it for a dpkg-buildpackage :)
<crimsun> then add tee(1) into the mix
<pochu> mix?
<nox-> or use script(1)
<crimsun> e.g., foo -flags |tee shite
<pochu> crimsun: ok, thanks!
<pochu> mmm... what's an install log? the output of "dpkg -i"? :)
<crimsun> essentially.
<pochu> hehe, ok!
<pochu> ty
<TheMuso>  /c
<TheMuso> bah
<nox-> gnite
<RAOF> Hm.  What's the etiquette for fixing someone else's package on REVU?
<elkbuntu> depends who you ask
<RAOF> So, say that I ask you :)
<elkbuntu> then i'd have no clue, but if in the situation i'd at least try contacting the packager
<RAOF> I've fired off an email to the original packager, saying that I'd like to help him get the package ready.
<elkbuntu> how long ago?
<RAOF> 3 days. 
<elkbuntu> factor in the weekend effect. and ask the next person to show signs of life. im not even a packager ;)
<RAOF> :)
<bddebian> RAOF: Which package?
<RAOF> gnome-compiz-manager :)
<RAOF> You've recently reviewed it :)
<bddebian> Ah
<crimsun> you could just link to your debdiff
<crimsun> (against the latest source package on revu)
<RAOF> How?  I'm not a MOTU, so I can only comment on my uploads.
<RAOF> I suppose I could send the debdiff to one of you fine MOTUs :)
<LaserJock> there really needs to be more coordination around beryl packaging
<LaserJock> aren't there like at least 3-4 people working on it?
<crimsun> hopefully they've all integrated the changes from the comments made by Debian's ftpmasters
* Fujitsu wonders if anyone has any experience with CDBS, distutils, and multiple binary packages.
<pochu> night everybody!
* LaserJock runs
<crimsun> Fujitsu: quodlibet may help
<Fujitsu> crimsun, thanks.
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: fix bzr, kthnksbye!
<LaserJock> Hobbsee: what's wrong with it?
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: it's too darned slow
<Fujitsu> Can I have some opinions as to what to do with upstreamdev? The Debian maintainer basically packaged the first version 3 months ago, and hasn't been contactable in a bit over 2 months. Since then, 2 versions have been released. 0.3 uses an entirely different build system (distutils-based). Is it appropriate in such a case to switch from an ugly debhelper-based debian/rules?
<Fujitsu> Hobbsee, I agree.
<RAOF> So, I've got a debdiff to fix the problems you found in gnome-compiz-manager, bddebian.  Linked http://www.raof.dyndns.org/gnome-compiz-manager.debdiff
<crimsun> Fujitsu: if you feel the benefits for maintainability outweigh the cost of carrying a delta, then yes.
<Fujitsu> crimsun: The delta would be greater if I were to retain the debhelperness, as it would need to be literally entirely rewritten.
<crimsun> seems like a fairly straightforward decision, then
<imbrandon> hum 
<imbrandon> i love when people make a server with a 1GB /
* imbrandon grumbles
<Fujitsu> imbrandon, that sounds a bit big.
<imbrandon> just a tad *rolls eyes*
<imbrandon> esp when /var isnt seperate
<imbrandon> man i'm gonna just fskin reimage this thing
<imbrandon> ho hum
<Fujitsu> Oh, /var not seperate.
<Fujitsu> I normally have <= 1GiB, but with seperate stuff.
<imbrandon> yea only /home and /opt are seperate on this box
<imbrandon> who ever installed it is an idiot looks like
<imbrandon> would have been better off makin one big /
<Fujitsu> Yeah.
<Fujitsu> That's crazy!
<imbrandon> doh
<imbrandon> my blog post errored, took me 2 hours to write it ...... /me cries
<imbrandon> guess i'll just make a shorter post ....
<crimsun> silly users and their blogs.
<imbrandon> heh
<crimsun> ;)
<crimsun> even Andrew has a blog configured, though I don't know if it's active yet
<imbrandon> well i tried to wrap up a quote from jdub, vista thoughts, gnome/kde/linus ramblings , buildd farm announcement and update and ummm some other misc stuff all in one post
<imbrandon> because i've been blog slacking 
<imbrandon> ohhhh he does ? nice
<imbrandon> ohh and some jokosher on win32 info
<imbrandon> gah, yea i really should make seperate posts
<imbrandon> when do we see a crimsun blog?
<imbrandon> :)
<crimsun> I hate blogs.
<crimsun> besides, I have lp.net/~
<imbrandon> hehe yea
<Amaranth> there is a reason the blog program i use is called 'drivel' ;)
<poningru> I had a question re: launchpad.net
<poningru> when someone puts needs info
<poningru> is there a field to put what info is needed?
<Amaranth> comment :)
<poningru> lamezorz... cause lots triagers just leave that alone and put in need info
<imbrandon> when you choose need info there is a comments field
<asimon> Hello, there seems to be a new change in dpkg-source. It errors out because "Maintainer: does not have Ubuntu address". So whats the new policy for people without ubuntu addresses regarding packages for REVU? Should the maintainer field be set to ubuntu-motu@lists.ubuntu.com or can this check be disabled? Thanks.
<RAOF> asimon: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebianMaintainerField
<RAOF> It kinda sucks.
<asimon> ok, thanks
<StevenK> Drat, I'm going to have to remember it when I next do a bug fix. :-/
<StevenK> RAOF: I'm looking at your debdiff now, by the way.
<RAOF> Oh, hurrah!  Which one :)
<Amaranth> if you actually change the package you should change that field
<StevenK> 85705
<Amaranth> what sucks is when you just want to do a rebuild
<StevenK> RAOF: If you want me to look at others, throw me the bug numbers.
<RAOF> Wooo!  Working python-pyinotify!  apt-zeroconf will work again :)
<RAOF> Nah, the only other one I've got is for a package on REVU which isn't mine.
<Amaranth> RAOF: what did you change?
<Amaranth> RAOF: rules fuckery?
<RAOF> Amaranth: Yeah.
<Amaranth> RAOF: be sure to give those back to the debian maintainer
<RAOF> If you want to know, it turns out that the _inotify.so file wasn't being segregated based upon the python-version
<Amaranth> i said that :P
* StevenK does a test build.
<RAOF> Amaranth: No, you said that the 2.4 version was being installed over the 2.5 version :P
<Amaranth> err, yes
<Amaranth> because it was?
<StevenK> Yummy, the clean rule wants python2.5
<RAOF> Amaranth: Well, no.  The 2.5 version was never *built*, because the _inotify.so file was already there from the 2.4 build.
<coNP> Amaranth: sorry, is that if I want to fix a bug in a package, I also should change the maintainer to ubuntu-dev / ubuntu motu?
<asimon> Hm, the DebianMaintainerField only speaks about packages relative to Debian, What about new packages for REVU? They need to have the maintainer field set to MOTU too?
<RAOF> asimon: If you want them to build, yes.
<Amaranth> coNP: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebianMaintainerField
<Amaranth> asimon: why not? the MOTU are responsible for them
* RAOF gives up on trying to play Civ4 in wine.
<asimon> RAOF: Okay, thanks.
* Hobbsee waves
<asimon> Amaranth: Yes, I have nothing against this policy, I just wanted to be sure. :-)
<Hobbsee> kind of scary, for us MOTU's
<coNP> Amaranth: yes, I am looking at this page, that only states that "the field will be set <whatever>"... I am a newbie, and not sure if I should set it or "it will be set by someone / some tool"
<Amaranth> you set it
* Hobbsee can picture the mail - "you havent updated $mypetpackage yet - YOU ALL SUCK!!!!!oneeleventyone!
<Hobbsee> "
<RAOF> Ok, so how should I share my newfound ability to build a working python 2.5 version of pyinotify with Debian?
<Amaranth> RAOF: file a bug
<RAOF> Amaranth: Where :)
<RAOF> Amaranth: Never done the Debian thing before!
<Amaranth> RAOF: http://www.debian.org/Bugs/Reporting
<RAOF> I suppose I *could* go to the debian site, rather than ask google for "debian bugzilla".  :/
<StevenK> Debian doesn't use bugzilla, thank $DEITY.
<Amaranth> debian has a hand-rolled email-based bug tracker
<StevenK> >>> import pyinotify
<StevenK> >>> 
<StevenK> RAOF: ^
<Amaranth> StevenK: that makes it works
<Amaranth> err, means
<RAOF> Indeed.
<geser> Amaranth: changing the maintainer is only necessary if the version contains ubuntu, rebuild gets usually XbuildY
<StevenK> You don't say.
<RAOF> Now, for completeness.  python2.4 >>>import pyinotify
<StevenK> ImportError: No module named threading
<Amaranth> ouch
<RAOF> Isn't that in the python stdlib?
<Amaranth> that's stdlib
<Amaranth> sys.path is getting trashed?
<StevenK> Only python2.4-minimal was installed.
<StevenK> Now it's fine.
<Lutin> siretart: have you tried the script that updates the maintainer field ?
<StevenK> RAOF: Uploaded.
<RAOF> Huzzah!  Thanks muchly.
<geser> Lutin: have you already updated your script to use XSBC-O-M?
<Lutin> geser: yep
<geser> Lutin: thanks for the url, you missed the change of the mail address for main. it's now ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com
<Lutin> heh, wasn't aware of that. thanks a lot
<Lutin> geser: ok, updated. thanks
<geser> Lutin: I'd say IGNORE_MAINTAINER can also be removed as these addresses wouldn't pass the check in dpkg-source
<Lutin> geser: what does this check actually checks ?
<Lutin> the email for main or motu ?
<geser> if ($fi{'C Maintainer'} !~ /ubuntu/) {
<Lutin> ok
<geser> it simply checks if the Maintainer value contains ubuntu
<Lutin> ok, so the domains in canonical should also be replaced
<geser> yes
<Lutin> ok, done
<geser> does every update of a native package need an UVF exception?
<asimon> I have another question regarding the new maitainer field policy and new packages for REVU. Should the address in debian/changelog also be set to the MOTU address? Otherwise lintian thinks the package is a NMU and gives warnings.
<imbrandon> asimon, no
<imbrandon> and nmu wanrnings are fine in ubuntu
<asimon> imbrandon: Okay, thank you.
<Fujitsu> geser, I don't think there's a policy on that. I've seen a few native uploads post-UVF, so I think it's fine.
<andreseso> hello, do you know if there is a repo for ubuntu edgy with subversion 1.4 ?
<Hobbsee> andreseso: try #ubuntu
* Hobbsee test
<andreseso> no luck there at this time
<asimon> Hobbsee: Thank you for reviewing kde-style-qtcurve. I uploaded a new version.
<Hobbsee> asimon: yay :)
<imbrandon> ho hum
<Tonio_> imbrandon: hey ;)
<imbrandon> heya Tonio_ 
<Tonio_> imbrandon: just bought a macbook pro fyi
<imbrandon> fskin NICE
<imbrandon> bout time bro LOL
<Tonio_> as good a the ibm, but half the price in france....
<imbrandon> dual booting ?
<Tonio_> the ibm machine is 4400 fyi..... 1700$ in the us....
<imbrandon> better than the IBM :)
<Tonio_> can you imagin that price difference in europe ?
<imbrandon> wow
<Tonio_> that's unbelievable
<imbrandon> i love my mac, infact the next new notebook i get to replace this one will be another mac
<Tonio_> imbrandon: well I know that the mac support is not as good as ibm (acpi etc...)
<Tonio_> but as lots of linux devs are using macs, that's getting better
<Tonio_> so I'm not that affraid
<imbrandon> yea 
<imbrandon> i have had no problems with mine and support
<imbrandon> even wireless works
<imbrandon> :)
<imbrandon> the only thing i cant get working on my old ibook in linux is the built in microphone
<imbrandon> but i never use that anyhow
<imbrandon> and i bet if i messed with it or proded crimsun enough i could get it working
<imbrandon> everything else works flawless OOTB
<imbrandon> well since dapper, breezy had soem issues with the touchpad etc :)
<imbrandon> hum how can i pin the kernel ver?
<imbrandon> anyone wanna give me a fast rundown?
<gnomefreak> imbrandon: theres a wiki on it but last i tried it didnt work for me. i might have done something wrong though
<gnomefreak> !pinning | imbrandon 
<ubotu> imbrandon: pinning is an advanced feature that APT can use to prefer particular packages over others. See https://help.ubuntu.com/community/PinningHowto
<imbrandon> thanks
<coNP> do you think gnome-app-install will be fixed to install recommended packages by feisty -- bug #75026 ?
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 75026 in gnome-app-install "gnome-app-install needs to install recommends" [Undecided,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/75026
<imbrandon> ok bash freaks why isnt ....... elif [ $OS_TYPE -eq "Ubuntu" ]        working ( $OS_TYPE == Ubuntu via lsb_release )
<imbrandon> has me stumped
<imbrandon> something about intger expression expected
<imbrandon> s/-eq/=/g maybe ?
<Lathiat> -eq = integer
<Lathiat> man test
<imbrandon> um ok ... so , == ?
<Lathiat> you'll want quites on the "$OS_TYPE" = "Ubuntu via lsb_release"
<Lathiat> its single = not double ==
<imbrandon> right got it, thanks
<tsmithe> am i supposed to use "XSBC-Original-Maintainer" ?
<Adri2000> tsmithe: yes
<tsmithe> cool
* tsmithe uploads
<Adri2000> Maintainer: Ubuntu MOTU Developers <ubuntu-motu@lists.ubuntu.com> and XSBC-Original-Maintainer: you
<tsmithe> yes
<tsmithe> :)
<shawarma> What does XSBC stand for anyway?
<_ion> Excess bullcrap
<shawarma> Just as I thought. :-)
<geser> shawarma: http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-controlfields.html#s5.7
<shawarma> geser: Oh. Clever.
<shawarma> geser: thanks.
<muzzol> hi
<muzzol> i get lot of "no utmp entry available and LOGNAME not defined" errors
<muzzol> seems that are not critical but is very annoing
<muzzol> i am missing something?
<lionel> muzzol: just ignore them. This warnings are normal
<muzzol> ok
<muzzol> but can i get rid of?
<shawarma> muzzol: It's in pbuilder, right?
<muzzol> yes
<shawarma> muzzol: Well... You *could* set LOGNAME to root or something, but that wouldn't be very nice, I think.
* tsmithe is having trouble with manpages
<muzzol> what is that variable for?
<shawarma> it holds your username.
<muzzol> i see
<tsmithe> "wired.1x: No such file or directory at /usr/bin/dh_installman line 120.". i have debian/manpages containing one line "wired.1x", and the wired.1x file is in debian/
<_ion> tsmithe: Try debian/wired.1x
<tsmithe> aha
<tsmithe> also, my package installs a default set of plugins to /usr/lib, and lintian gives me "E: wired: no-shlibs-control-file" and "E: wired: postinst-must-call-ldconfig", but they're not really libraries in the traditional sense
<bddebian> Heya gang
<lionel> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Hi lionel
<tsmithe> ah bddebian, you reviewed wired! i have a question
<tsmithe> it installs a default set of plugins to /usr/lib, and lintian gives me "E: wired: no-shlibs-control-file" and "E: wired: postinst-must-call-ldconfig", but they're not really libraries in the traditional sense
<bddebian> tsmithe: Then why aren't they in /usr/lib/wired/foo ?
<tsmithe> hmm
<tsmithe> good point
* tsmithe fixes
<tsmithe> urgh that's annoying. some are and some aren't
<bddebian> Fun huh? :)
<tsmithe> *sigh*
<tsmithe> :P
* tsmithe gets out dpatch
<tsmithe> would you hate me if they went into /usr/lib/wired/wired?
* tsmithe thinks not
<tsmithe> yipee for the easy way out
<bddebian> Laser_away: If you happen to come around, you use gpib right?
<tsmithe> could i ask for a couple of reviews?
<tsmithe> aka is anyone free?
<tsmithe> anyone want to review some ubuntustudio packages?
<ajmitch> morning
* tsmithe will hug anybody who will give him a review (that hug is worth a lot)
<tsmithe> also, could someone archive a few uploads for me?
<tsmithe> (to revu)
<tsmithe> sonata (in ubuntu now; old package), libresample (obsolete), libfooid (same)
<geser> tsmithe: done the archiving
<geser> tsmithe: looking at wired: is there a reason why you build-depend on portaudio19-dev and call configure with --disable-portaudio?
<Q-FUNK> http://packages.qa.debian.org/c/cups-pdf/news/20070214T164703Z.html
<Q-FUNK> any time to get this into Feisty?
<Q-FUNK> it's in unstable already
<Q-FUNK> just needs a sync
<geser> file a sync request
<siretart> Lutin: I think I did have a look at it, but in the specific case I wanted to use it, it didn't do what I wanted
<shawarma> Any idea what an underscore before the keyname in a .desktop file means?
<shawarma> Ah... Never mind.
<tsmithe> geser, yes
<tsmithe> --disable-portaudio disables static building of the bundled library
<shawarma> siretart: Have you got time to fix a tiny thing in revu?
<shawarma> siretart: when showing the debdiff between two versions, could you please set the mimetype to text/plain ?
<ptitdav69> hi here, for a package on REVU (gnono), I need to have a look at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebianMaintainerField for an error with the maintainer field
<ptitdav69> can you confirm that I need to put thjs in debian/control :
<ptitdav69> Maintainer: Ubuntu MOTU Developers <ubuntu-motu@lists.ubuntu.com>
<ptitdav69> XSBC-Original-Maintainer: David Valot <ptitdav69@gmail.com>
<ptitdav69> ?
<imbrandon> yes
<ptitdav69> thanks imbrandon 
<imbrandon> if you are making ubuntu only changes
<ptitdav69> it's a new package for ubuntu
<imbrandon> is it in debian ?
<ptitdav69> nope
<imbrandon> k then thats correct iirc
<ptitdav69> ok, thanks :)
<ajmitch> which means that anyone building packages on ubuntu, whether they mean for them to be in ubuntu or not, have to set something ubuntuish in the Maintainer: field
<tsmithe> so when my tsmithe@ubuntu.com address is set up, it's ok to use that not ubuntu-motu@l.u.c ?
<tsmithe> hi bddebian 
<imbrandon> tsmithe, if it is "your" package i guess
<tsmithe> cool
<imbrandon> but as ajmitch said in this case it sucks
<bddebian> Heya gang
<imbrandon> heya bddebian 
<bddebian> Hi tsmithe, imbrandon
<imbrandon> man i got to go home early from work today, but it sucks
<tsmithe> it sucks?
<imbrandon> i broke my hand/fingers
* tsmithe hugs imbrandon 
<tsmithe> how?
<imbrandon> and had to goto the ER
<tsmithe> :S
<imbrandon> now i have 2 fingers in a cast, kinda hard to type
<tsmithe> poor guy
<imbrandon> heh
<imbrandon> i was racking a server and got my hand caught in a metal rack fan
<tsmithe> urgh
<imbrandon> was not cool
<tsmithe> nasty
<tsmithe> very nasty
<jdong> ow
<imbrandon> got me all pumped up on vicodin though heh
<imbrandon> and demoral ( sp )
<jdong> heh vicodin never worked for me
<jdong> at least not during the peak of my arthritis
<imbrandon> it does when you take 2 500mil tabs ever 2 hours
<jdong> Hmm I was on 12.5/1000 every 4hrs
<jdong> and it didn't really do anything but make me loopy
<ajmitch> imbrandon: that was a bit silly, wasn't it?
<jdong> how do you get KVM working??
<imbrandon> ajmitch, a bit
<jdong> obvious it isn't (1) install kvm (2) run kvm
<tsmithe> jdong, make && make install
<imbrandon> jdong, start it
<jdong>  /dev/kvm didn't exist
<tsmithe> mknod ?
<jdong> jdong@severance:~/tmp$ kvm -cdrom puppy-2.14-seamonkey-fulldrivers.iso 
<jdong> open /dev/kvm: No such file or directory
<jdong> Could not initialize KVM, will disable KVM support
<tsmithe> modprobe kvm major=1
<jdong> oh
<tsmithe> ?
<imbrandon> modprobe kvm
* tsmithe isn't sure - that's a switch for kqemu so it might still apply
* ajmitch wouldn't mind having a box recent enough for kvm
* tsmithe neither
<jdong> it probed in
<jdong> but didn't make /dev/kvm
<tsmithe> hmm
<imbrandon> kvm isnt any better than quemu imho
<ajmitch> imbrandon: it's supposed to be faster than straight unaccelerated qemu
<jdong> OH kvm-intel
<shawarma> Has anyone compared kvm and kqemu? How do they compare?
<tsmithe> jdong, "Are you sure the kvm_intel & kvm modules are loaded?
<tsmithe> Maybe you're bios does not support virtualization.
<tsmithe> Please check your dmesg."
<imbrandon> yea it is, but not faster than kqemu , and more hassle ( just imho , i have no numbers to back it up )
<tsmithe> http://lkml.org/lkml/2006/12/28/100
<tsmithe> imbrandon, well, now that kqemu is open, they should just merge (along with [defunct]  qvm86)
<ajmitch> imbrandon: which reminds me, we still have the old non-GPL kqemu in multiverse
<jdong> tsmithe: got it
<tsmithe> :)
<imbrandon> the only advantage that i see is kvm is floss and kqemu is closed source
<tsmithe> imbrandon, not any more
<jdong> didn't kqemu open?
<tsmithe> yeah
<ajmitch> yes, it did
<tsmithe> you can get the sources and specs on the qemu site
<imbrandon> ahh nice i dident know that
<ajmitch> just a couple of weeks ago
<tsmithe> probably cos of vbox competition
<ajmitch> was uploaded to debian a few hours later
<imbrandon> been a while since i last used it
<jdong> yeah it's not terribly fast
<jdong> it's slower than vmware for sure
<tsmithe> could it be autobuilt for the kernel? i mean, module-assistant is such a chore
<tsmithe> jdong, tried virtualbox?
* tsmithe finds that quicker than both
<jdong> tsmithe: no, not yet
<ajmitch> tsmithe: unlikely
<tsmithe> ajmitch, mrgh
<jdong> tsmithe: no way
<jdong> tsmithe: I don't believe that
<tsmithe> i do
<ajmitch> there's no mechanism to force rebuilding of other packages on a kernel upload
<tsmithe> plus, virtualbox doesn't have clock problems, which vmware does on this pentium-m
<jdong> vmware is probably still the fastest
<imbrandon> sure it could, like nvidia-glx and vmwareplayer modules etc
<tsmithe> yeah... that's what i was thinking
<jdong> heck xen doesn't beat vmware by much
<tsmithe> doesn't apt support that kind of event hook?
<ajmitch> tsmithe: no
<tsmithe> oh ok
<imbrandon> hrm
<ajmitch> imbrandon: they are rebuilt by forcing new packages in
<tsmithe> that's sad
<ajmitch> like l-r-m
<ajmitch> so you'd need to do the same for universe/multiverse
<imbrandon> thats terrible
<tsmithe> very
<imbrandon> benc must hate life at times
<tsmithe> apt needs hooks!
<jdong> http://www.linux-gamers.net/smartsection.item.56/virtualbox-vs-qemu.html
<ajmitch> tsmithe: it's *not* an apt thing
<jdong> there does seem to  be some evidence that virtualbox is faster
<tsmithe> dpkg needs hooks!
* ajmitch sighs
<imbrandon> it would be a soyuz thing
<tsmithe> vbox seems very much snappier
<ajmitch> as imbrandon said
<imbrandon> or dac
<imbrandon> or falcon
<imbrandon> or what ever is used to make the repo
<ajmitch> soyuz would have to handle it
<imbrandon> right for the official repo
<imbrandon> falcon for mine
<imbrandon> ( that i need to update )
<imbrandon> and dac ( is that the rtight name ) for debian
<imbrandon> man this cast is gonna get on my nervs
<imbrandon> i cant tab complete correctly anymore
<imbrandon> ( its on my pinky and ring finger of my left hand )
<imbrandon> kinda strange
<tsmithe> move your hand?
<imbrandon> yea , but its not the same
<imbrandon> hehe
<lifeless> 'dak'
<imbrandon> sides the tab key is way weay over on a apple keyboard
<imbrandon> ahh thanks lifeless 
<ajmitch> then don't stick your fingers where they shouldn't be 
<imbrandon> btw heya long time no talk/type
<imbrandon> ajmitch, i've heard that somewhere before :)
<imbrandon> lifeless must have a hilight on soyuz ;)
<lifeless> a:)
<Simon80> hey, bddebian, what of logitech-applet?  am I supposed to be able to see it in feisty's repos?
<imbrandon> hrm does blue-utilz make any menu entries? or how do you admin your bluetooth devices in gnome ?>
<Simon80> imbrandon, what kind of device?
<tsmithe> gnome-bluetooth ?
<imbrandon> a usb bluetooth dongle
<imbrandon> Simon80, ^^
<shawarma> imbrandon: What would you like to do to your bluetooth devices?
* tsmithe thinks gnome-bluetooth is poor, but then, i haven't written any patches to help improve, so i can't talk
<Simon80> ah, plug it in
<imbrandon> well its pluged in silly
<Simon80> there's a bluetooth wiki page that I cleaned up that implies that mice and other hci devs need to be added from the CLI
<Simon80> but for obex file sharing, there's a gui
<Simon80> :(
<tsmithe> imbrandon, bluetooth-applet ?
<shawarma> imbrandon: ie. what do you mean "admin your bluetooth devices" ?
<Simon80> at least the page claims it's a one time add
<tsmithe> should have an icon in the tray
<imbrandon> well i want to use my cellphone as a dialup adapter ( that is suported in osx )
<tsmithe> ah you can...
<tsmithe> /methinks
<imbrandon> nope no tray icon
<tsmithe> imbrandon, is bluetooth-applet running?
<imbrandon> not that i can see
<imbrandon> ps ax|grep bluetooth
<Simon80> what peripheral do you want to connect to the dongle?
<imbrandon> err
<imbrandon> Simon80, my cell phone
<Simon80> ah
<Simon80> for file trans? or connectivity?
<tsmithe> look up ;)
<imbrandon> both hopefully
<Simon80> I think gnome-bluetooth does the file transfer
<imbrandon> brandon@hood:~$ ps ax|grep bluetooth
<imbrandon> 31871 pts/1    R+     0:00 grep bluetooth
<tsmithe> run bluetooth-applet and see
<imbrandon> guess its not running
<Simon80> though you can also manually use obex-ftp
<Simon80> sorry, no hyphen, obexftp
<Simon80> for file transfer
<imbrandon> hrm
<imbrandon> gnome-bluetooth wasent installed
<Simon80> bluetooth support needs a solid gui
<imbrandon> i love the way kde handles it 
<Simon80> get their gui then!
<Simon80> nothing stopping that
<imbrandon> but my box with i wish to use bluetooth is gnome ;)
<Simon80> I mix kde apps freely
<bddebian> Simon80: Did I upload it?
<tsmithe> kde bluetooth support is much better
<imbrandon> i like to keep my kde and gnome seperate
<Simon80> bddebian, doesn't look like it
<Simon80> from my point of view
<bddebian> Did I say I did?
<tsmithe> also, could yous take look-sees at wired and enblend ?
<Simon80> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=4341
<Simon80> yes
<bddebian> Hmm, so I did.  it's sitting in NEW:  http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=4341
<bddebian> Gah, damnit
<bddebian> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/feisty/+queue?queue_state=0&queue_text=logitech
<Simon80> lol, upped it to revu?
<Simon80> oh
<Simon80> what does that mean?
<bddebian> Means it hasn't been processed by an archive admin
<Simon80> ah
<Simon80> well, thanks
<bddebian> NP
<Simon80> it's not in any danger of missing a freeze, is it?
<bddebian> Hard to say :-(
<bddebian> Shouldn't be
<bddebian> Unless it gets rejected by the archive admins
<imbrandon> wow evolution on feisty is very stable *rolls eyes*
<Simon80> lol
<Simon80> I've never used it seriously
* tsmithe needs uploading for wired and enblend and alsa-firmware and alsa-tools!!
<Simon80> it makes me feel dirty to even consider it
<tsmithe> evo is really nice!
<Simon80> I use gmail
<tsmithe> Simon80, not when you get >200 emails per day
<imbrandon> i like evolution esp evolution-exchange but this version is very unstable
<tsmithe> weird - rock solid here
<imbrandon> tsmithe, i use gmail for my personal mail and i get >1000 a day
<Simon80> tsmith, I agree, I dislike the sluggishness
<tsmithe> imbrandon, you must have spent some time setting that up
<Simon80> but it depends, I do get quite a bit of mail
<tsmithe> imbrandon, and i probably get nearer that figure
<Simon80> I get a lot of lists
<imbrandon> tsmithe, yes i spend most of my time online in email and irc
<tsmithe> bugmail should be destroyed. people just shouldn't be allowed to file bugs
<Simon80> I hate bugmail
<imbrandon> hum this gnome-bluetooth all but sucks
<imbrandon> there is no gui only an applet
<imbrandon> no options , no nothing
* imbrandon grumbles
<Simon80> kde it up!
<Simon80> I'm all for mixing stuff, lol
<tsmithe> imbrandon, see told ya
<Simon80> maybe I'll make my own desktop env and call it incoherence
<imbrandon> i hate mixing, i'll use one or the other
* tsmithe dislikes qt though. it's a terrible prejudice
<Simon80> I love mixing
<imbrandon> i use kde 99.999% of the time, the one box i wanna use gnome on bites
<Simon80> and qt, why dislike it? it has better resize performance than gtk, I'd say
<imbrandon> lol
<crimsun> ah, to live the simple life of only one desktop env.
<Simon80> there is only one desktop env... it's called Incoherence
<Simon80> it's about 2 mins old, and in heavy conceptual development
<imbrandon> lol
* tsmithe hugs gnome and it's terrible bluetooth support
<Simon80> you can test drive it by conversing with me
<Simon80> apostrophe abuse!
<Simon80> I stick with gnome, but hate all its apps
<imbrandon> lol
<imbrandon> thats just silly
<Simon80> I use firefox for browsing, kopete for IM, and amarok for music
<imbrandon> you dont get the intergration
<Simon80> I get the hotkeys, and I like gnome-terminal
<Simon80> and I absolutely need gnome's sysmon applet
<Simon80> whatever its real name is ;)
<Simon80> System Monitor
<Simon80> for cpu + mem + net + swap in real time with no lag
<Simon80> I really could be doing better with this desktop though
<Simon80> I live in firefox and terms anyway though, so meh
<tsmithe> fer christ's sake! i plug in the charger and it tells me it's been unplugged!
<crimsun> you're lucky. On some hardware, plugging in the adapter would cause the machine to power off.
<tsmithe> haha
<Simon80> ow
<mr_pouit> I had 1996 hours remaining some times ago :]  I didn't know the battery was so powerful ^^
<tsmithe> oh no
<tsmithe> i've had 4008
<imbrandon> time for a nap, the doc's pain killers have finaly got the best of me
<imbrandon> gnight all
<tsmithe> get well soon!
<ajmitch> night imbrandon :)
<crimsun> tsmithe: wrt alsa-tools, please check Debian BTS for the ld10k1 fixes
<tsmithe> crimsun, ok
* tsmithe hates tracking bugs over many places, and i have hardly any places
<crimsun> but insanity is /fun/
<tsmithe> :S
<tsmithe> crimsun, what fixes do you refer to (it's been a while since i did anything with alsa-tools)?
<zul> crimsun: yes....it...is fine....
* tsmithe really really needs to get on top of this
* zul needs to eat brains.
<crimsun> mmm chilled monkey brains
<zul> brains....brains...BRAINS!!!
<tsmithe> _ _
<crimsun> tsmithe: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/pkgreport.cgi?src=alsa-tools;dist=unstable
* tsmithe looks
<tsmithe> crimsun, i must really be insane, cos i'm still uncertain as to which bug you are referring (/me feels like a right idiot now). do you mean the lintian error "E: ld10k1: shell-script-fails-syntax-check ./usr/share/ld10k1/init_live", and if so, debian 344777 ?
<Ubugtu> Debian bug 344777 in ld10k1 "ld10k1: doesn't work well on startup to restore soundcard to a good state" [Wishlist,Closed]  http://bugs.debian.org/344777
<crimsun> tsmithe: I'm referring to merging any/all fixes for ld10k1 from Debian BTS
<tsmithe> oh right :)
<Kano64> hi, what to do to get ndiswrapper 1.37?
<Kano64> 1.30 does not work with usb wlan devices
<Kano64> -> system lock
<zul> not a support channel dude
<crimsun> main/restricted are in UVF/FF as of Feb 8th.
<Kano64> in what?
<crimsun> upstream version freeze & feature freeze.
<crimsun> aka, no newer versions, no new packages
<Kano64> then your system is unable
<crimsun> propose an UVF exception request
<crimsun> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess
<ferret_0567> Why no Frozen Bubble 2 in universe? I had to add another repo to get that
<Kano64> crimsun: whats the channel for kernel building support?
<crimsun> Kano64: there is none.
<ferret_0567> Frozen Bubble is pretty popular
<crimsun> Kano64: as you probably know, -kernel is solely for development
<Kano64> crimsun: well i made a kanotix target, but dont know how to build udebs
<lionel> ferret_0567: frozen bubble 2.1 is in Universe (in Feisty)
<lionel> a backport to Edgy has been asked
<Kano64> (i dislike ubuntu config)
<ferret_0567> Wow...can't even add the latest Frozen Bubble 2 to edgy...
<crimsun> ferret_0567: see what lionel just said.
<ferret_0567> It does take time though
<crimsun> i.e., there's an edgy-backports request
<ferret_0567> I know, a backport has been asked for, it's just not here yet
<crimsun> good christ, be patient then
<lionel> ferret_0567: request has been rejected #86068
<crimsun> what do you think this is, a store?
<Kano64> ferret_0567: install pbuilder and use sid's source file
<Kano64> most easy way
<ferret_0567> I already have Frozen Bubble 2
<crimsun> then you need to request a backport for libsdl-pango-dev, too.
<Kano64> als long as it does not depend on sh scripts it is easy
<crimsun> (src:sdlpango)
<Kano64> with a recursive pbuilder
<lionel> crimsun: IIRC, backports for lib are not allowed
<crimsun> lionel: see libvisual-0.4-0 in dapper-backports.
<crimsun> (required for amarok)
<lionel> crimsun: you're right
<hub> ok, I have a new problem with dpkg-source
<hub> dpkg-source: error: Version number suggests Ubuntu changes, but Maintainer: does not have Ubuntu address
<hub> debuild: fatal error at line 1228:
<hub> I use MY email address. wtf?
<RAOF> hub: It's the DebianMaintainer spec.
<geser> hub: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebianMaintainerField
#ubuntu-motu 2008-02-11
<DaveMorris> persia: before I goto sleep, whats your opinion on my package re superm1 comments, he said to ask you
<persia> DaveMorris: Pass me a link?  I wasn't sure what I should be looking at from scrollback
<superm1> well someone more seasoned at library packaging at least
<DaveMorris> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=gtkglextmm is the link
<persia> DaveMorris: I think you already had a discussion with slangasek about the package naming and splitting.  Do you remember the results of that?
 * persia vaguely remembers that there was no advantage to splitting due to interdependencies affecting ABI, and that lintian was more correct than linda about SONAMEs with '-' characters.
<DaveMorris> yeah, he was happy to have the 2 of them in the same package, would prefer 2 packages.  Just wanted it to see them changed from the old name.  I'd prefer them in 1 since they depend on each other
<persia> Makes sense to me to have one package to avoid circular dependencies.
<mok0> I'm fading... but a first rough draft of the upstream guide can now be seen at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UpstreamGuide
<mok0> I encourage all to contribute
<persia> superm1: Do you have a strong opinion either way?  Shall we push this through, or did you want something else adjusted?
<superm1> persia, that was the only thing i saw wrong with it
<superm1> well iffy is a better word than wrong
<superm1> and without having a ton of experience with libraries i didn't want to advocate on that basis
<persia> superm1: I'm still catching up on my communications, but if you add advocating, I'll push it if I don't encounter something else.
<superm1> okay will do
<rjmyst3> superm1: don't know if you saw my message from awhile ago
<rjmyst3> superm1: i uploaded another fixed one
<DaveMorris> mok0: does case stories become a name and shame ;)
<superm1> rjmyst3, after i left a comment?
<rjmyst3> hmm
<rjmyst3> dunno
<rjmyst3> :)
<rjmyst3> sorry
<superm1> one more thing regarding licensing that was sticking out
<steveire> hexmode: Thanks for the help. The package is up waiting to be built.
<mok0> DaveMorris: I imagine they could be illustrative. In any case, I think a humerous tone would be fitting
<DaveMorris> start of with a "The names of packages has been changed to hide their identities"
<mok0> DaveMorris: hehe
<hexmode> steveire: cool
<mok0> DaveMorris: yeah why not
<DaveMorris> hmmm, hardy is stuck trying to setup gnome-settings-daemon anyway I can get more info on why it's stuck?
<rjmyst3> superm1: do i past the entire contents of those licenses?
<superm1> rjmyst3, yes in this case
<rjmyst3> there is also the wxWindows License
<superm1> that was GPL2
<rjmyst3> yes, ok
<superm1> from what I saw though
<rjmyst3> right
<persia> mok0: That's a great start.  Thank you very much.
<rjmyst3> how do i introduce those licenses in the copyright file?
<HighNo> hm, am I having a big lag or did you two just chat faster than normal people would talk?
<rjmyst3> or no intro, just paste them one after the other?
<mok0> persia: I think it may be quite useful
<persia> mok0: Yes, both for upstreams who come here to ask for help, and as a reference for packagers discussing with upstreams.
<superm1> rjmyst3, well a small description saying something like "the source for boost is included as well, and covered by XYZ"
<mok0> persia: We can fill in as the ideas arise..
<superm1> and then i like to add some dashes in between the licenses so you know when one starts and one ends
<HighNo> rjmyst3: in debian/copyright you would not post the complete licenses, that is for upstream COPYING only, right superm1?
<superm1> HighNo, well in this case the license isn't available in common-licenses
<persia> debian/copyright needs to have the complete text of any licenses not included verbatim under /usr/share/common-licenses
<superm1> HighNo, additionally the COPYING file needs to be included by upstream in the root of the source package
<HighNo> superm1: Ah ok, I should have startet reading ealier... OK - got that
<superm1> which will be a bullet in that upstream guide that is being authored
<HighNo> superm1: you know I do know that by now :-)
<superm1> HighNo, ah yeah i mentioned that on revu, that's right
 * HighNo has learned many packaging things the hard way, upload by upload ;-)
<persia> sistpoty: In case you want backscroll, I don't want =${binary:Version} for arch:all depending on arch:any because it would break if this were Debian.
<rjmyst3> superm1:  did you notice the exception notice at the end of the wxWindows License?
<rjmyst3> superm1: this is the gist of it "The exception is that you may use, copy, link, modify and distribute  under your own terms, binary object code versions of works based on the Library."
<rjmyst3> then that is no longer verbatim GPL, and needs to be copied into debian/copyright, right?
<superm1> rjmyst3, you are correct.  i just looked at the wxwidgets source, and its entire license is included verbatim in its source package
<superm1> good catch.
<rjmyst3> ok
<rjmyst3> cool
<Hobbsee> emgent: sorry?  if you like, srue
<TheMuso> Is anybody having problems with launchpad atm?
<emgent> Hobbsee, heheh thanks
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: always.  any in particular?
<crimsun> TheMuso: topic of #launchpad.
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: the oops perhaps? :p
<TheMuso> crimsun: Thanks.
<TheMuso> Well an oops is not the best way to say, we're down.
<TheMuso> Hrm. I must not have read very well, because I missed the announcement.
<emgent> people one question
<crimsun> don't worry, I completely wouldn't have noticed if it weren't for elmo changing the topic while I was watching the buffer.
<persia> emgent: That sentence no verb
<emgent> hehe
<emgent> ok sorry persia :)
<TheMuso> crimsun: I'm not worried at all.
<emgent> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/lastfm/+bug/190819
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 190819 in lastfm "Please merge lastfm 1.4.2.58240.dfsg-1 (universe) from Debian unstable" [Undecided,New]
<emgent> we introduced libgpod-nogtk-dev and libgpod-nogtk in =>hardy
<emgent> i should work in backports ?
<emgent> in merge i adopt debian changes
<emgent> (with libgpod-nogtk-dev && libgpod-nogtk)
<emgent> imho it'snt necessary work to gutsy backport, it's true ?
<emgent> some idea?
<emgent> s/idea/opinion/
<zul> evening
<rjmyst3> superm1: i've updated debian/copyright and uploaded another one
<superm1> ok
<n3t_decrip70r> !httpflood
<ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about httpflood - try searching on http://ubotu.ubuntu-nl.org/factoids.cgi
<n3t_decrip70r> !help
<ubotu> I am ubotu, all-knowing infobot. You can browse my brain at http://ubotu.ubuntu-nl.org/factoids.cgi - Usage info: http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuBots
<n3t_decrip70r> !login ubuntu bot
<n3t_decrip70r> !login ubuntubot
<ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about login ubuntubot - try searching on http://ubotu.ubuntu-nl.org/factoids.cgi
<Hobbsee> n3t_decrip70r: what are you trying to do?
<rhpot1991_laptop> anyone have a few minutes to do an easy revu?
<rhpot1991_laptop> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=atomicparsley if anyone is interested
<hexmode> could I get a motu to look at http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=php-xdebug ??
<hexmode> did additional dputs to fix lintian errors but they don't seem to take... so I must be confused.
<persia> tsmithe: You have 10 hours to update fluid-soundfont on REVU, or I will, as that is a great find, and should really be in hardy :)
<superm1> persia, what's with the sudden interest in audio related things (that midi thing and soundonts now)?
<persia> superm1: Not a sudden interest.  The lack of working MIDI out of the box has been bothering me for a while.  During hardy, there was enough interest from others to get enough done that there is a chance that MIDI will work out of the box for once.
<superm1> ah yeah
<persia> I'm just noisy about it now because of pending Feature Freeze :)
<persia> mok0: Is a watch file or get-orig-source impossible for clipper?  Why?
<mok0> persia: because the version is not encoded in the tar file. It's called clipper20ac-current.tar.gz or some such
<persia> mok0: That explains the watch file.  How about get-orig-source?
<mok0> I could make that target I guess
<mok0> I already tried to persuade upstream to change his ways but to no avail
<persia> mok0: OK.  Given the deadline, please add my soon pending comments to REVU on your TODO list.
<mok0> persia: I will
<persia> (unless I find something else)
<mok0> thx
<persia> Bah!  I give up.  Anyone else want to try something with bug #111555?
<persia> superm1: Just in case you get a FTBFS after gmyth-dev gets in, my fix was only http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/4421/.  I was never successful in getting the patch to unpatch cleanly.
<superm1> persia, okay thanks.  hopefully it gets in soon.  my free time will be dwindling fairly quickly
<persia> superm1: Heh.  Any chance you'd like to try to integrate wildmidi as well?  The docs indicate that it should just work, but there seems to be some strange coordination between the configuration of wildmidi and timidity in the autotools configuration that keeps stumping me, compounded by http://paste.ubuntu.com/4422/ once I finally got it built.
<superm1> persia, sure if i get this lirc patch that i've been stumped on working, i'll give it a run
<persia> superm1: Would another pair of eyes help?
<superm1> persia, possibly.  let me finish the current train of thought and i'll push it to bzr
<superm1> persia, okay yeah my last thought process didn't work out. https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~mythbuntu/lirc/ubuntu
<superm1> so what i'm looking to do is let the modules be built via dkms
<superm1> so that people can patch the source files with local patches in between releases and have the drivers automatically rebuilt
<superm1> they are automatically shipped with linux-ubuntu-modules normally
<persia> superm1: OK.  I've gotten a bit of a look at the source, and dkms (I'm more used to module-assistant).  So the issue is that the new modules need to conflict with the modules provided by linux-ubuntu-modules?
<superm1> persia, well the issue was dkms wasn't building properly
<superm1> i appear to have configured a few things wrong
<superm1> which i am catching now going in verbose
<superm1> persia, don't worry about it, i should be able to resolve these now
<persia> superm1: OK.  Glad to hear it.
<ScottK> superm1 and persia: The upstream packager for dkms is in channel ( mdomsch ), FYI.
<superm1> ScottK, i sorted out the issue
<ScottK> OK.  Just saying ...
<superm1> ScottK, so i'll just need to grab kees or another core-dev to sponsor at some point.  thanks though :)
<TheMuso> Wow. Nautilus is not even mounting the DVD/CD drive on /media/cdrom0 when its in the fstab.
<method> Do the Ubuntu build servers sometimes take an incredibly long time after building to transfer the debs over, or do they tend to get lost?
<superm1> persia, you sure you uploaded wildmidi?
<superm1> its not in NEW
<persia> superm1: I'm sure I uploaded it.  I also uploaded a couple other things today, and am still waiting for either Accepted or NEW messages.
<superm1> persia, hm interesting.
<persia> superm1: Aside from textual changes to changelog, copyright, and control, http://mentors.debian.net/debian/pool/main/w/wildmidi/wildmidi_0.2.2-1.dsc ought to work if you just want to dget.
<superm1> persia, very good i'll build it locally then and see if anything stands out on gst
<superm1> persia, when you build with my gmyth, which one was it?
<superm1> there are two in NEW
<superm1> one was a follow up after upstream let me know of something that needed to be in it
<persia> svn916
<superm1> okay yeah that's the latest
<persia> For gmyth, there was just the extra '/'.
<jdong> anyone know of a simple and dirty CLI burning frontend that takes syntax like "burncd file_1 dir_2 file_3" before I go out and write one for a script?
<persia> superm1: http://paste.ubuntu.com/4423/ is the complete debdiff of where I got stuck.
<jdong> I realize it's almost a trivial layer of genisofs | wodim.
<Aloha> is motu in charge of backports?
<persia> Aloha: No, but the leaders of the backport team are coincidentally MOTU.  You might try #ubuntu-backports
<Aloha> persia, thnx
<Aloha> persia, heh its me and chanserv in there
<persia> jdong: Umm.  Oughtn't you be there too?
<Aloha> anyway links in browser for firefox 3 in backports give 404
<Aloha> where do i file bug?
<jdong> persia: hehe.
<jdong> Aloha: can you elaborate?
<LucidFox> Aloha> eh?
<Aloha> jdong, yeah for example: file->help->release notes goes to 404 page
<LucidFox> That's by design.
<Aloha> oh....
<LucidFox> Mozilla doesn't have a release notes page for 3.0b3 yet.
<Aloha> gotcha
<Aloha> startup page is 404 too
<jdong> Aloha: right, it's probably due to the fact 3.0b3 doesn't even exist
<Aloha> is that by design?
<jdong> Aloha: hardy has a 3.0b3 prelease
<LucidFox> Probably not, let me check in my compiled from source version
<Aloha> oh its a prerelease gotcha
<jdong> it's a prerelease of a prerelease :)
<Aloha> jdong, gutsy has prerelease now too :)
<jdong> Aloha: yes, that was by design too :)
<LucidFox> yes, it's a CVS snapshot
<Aloha> gotcha
<Aloha> why did they put a cvs snapshot of a prerelease of a prerelease on backports?
<Aloha> just because its so popular?
<jdong> Aloha: I did it because it's better than the granparadiso prelease earlier
<Aloha> jdong, gotcha
<jdong> Aloha: and for several users who requested it, a better experience than FF2
<jdong> Aloha: the native look and feel is improved, and perforamnce is dramatically improved too
<jdong> since it installs side-by-side with and safely copies the profile of the existing ff2, I figured it couldn't hurt
<Aloha> jdong, cool i just installed it, looking forward to experience
<jdong> :)
<jdong> enjoy
<Aloha> they need to build firefox off webkit ;)
<superm1> persia, i think i got it sorted out
<superm1> the build is continuing through at least
<superm1> so as long as it wasn't failing at the end i cleaned that patch up
<persia> superm1: What was it?
<jdong> Aloha: :)
<LucidFox> Aloha> there's epiphany-webkit
<LucidFox> it's for some reason disabled in Ubuntu, though
<Aloha> LucidFox, is that in the repos?
<superm1> persia, it seemed to be some mixups from tabs and spaces
<LucidFox> no :/
<Aloha> LucidFox, linkage?
<superm1> i'll dput it provided i dont get a ftbfs for some reason at the end
<LucidFox> it's enabled in Debian, though
<LucidFox> actually, it isn't
<persia> superm1: Thanks for sorting that.  I was getting a failure to initialise the plugin.  Are you on amd64?  Maybe there's an architectural issue as well.
<superm1> persia, i'm on i386
<LucidFox> oh wait, it is: http://packages.qa.debian.org/e/epiphany-browser.html
<LucidFox> http://packages.debian.org/epiphany-webkit
 * persia adds verification of 64-bit cleanliness to the gstreamer-midi todo list
<superm1> persia, if nothing else, as long as its enabled, even if the plugin doesn't initialize i say that it should go in now (to beat FF), and then sort out the bug when convenient
<persia> superm1: I'd agree, but couldn't see the difference between a 64-bit issue and bad upstream code breaking the build for everyone.
<Aloha> LucidFox, cool
<Aloha> LucidFox, does it have a lot of deps?
<superm1> yeah. well i'll see in a little bit
<persia> LucidFox: Aloha: You might also try midori
<Aloha> persia, i tried midori from stemps ppa but it said it couldn't find symbols or something like that
<LucidFox> I tried midori, it's too raw yet :(
<persia> Aloha: Likely release skew.
<Aloha> persia, whats that mean?
<persia> Aloha: build environment and install environment were likely different releases, or used different libraries.  If both are hardy, the PPA needs a rebuild (and the archive might).
<Aloha> persia, gotcha
<awen_> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=imapsync <-- if anybody is up for a review; got it in at the last moment last monday, so hope to get it reviewed today :)
<Aloha> whens featurefreeze? valentines day?
<persia> awen_: For updates to packages already in the repositories, please attach a diff.gz to a bug and subscribe the sponsors queue, rather than uploading to REVU.  It is otherwise likely the package will be ignored.
<persia> Aloha: Yes.
<awen_> ahh, somebody should've told me that last monday... i'll do that
<Aloha> how ironic
<Aloha> frozen hearts
<Aloha> woohoo http://phorolinux.com/how-to-install-epiphany-with-the-webkit-backend-on-ubuntu-710.html
<LucidFox> Aloha> SWEEY!
<LucidFox> * SWEET!
<LucidFox> Wait, it tries to remove KDE4 :(
<LucidFox> or, actually, not
<Aloha> kde4 should be removed anyway
 * Aloha is waiting for 4.1
<LucidFox> I use GNOME, but there are two KDE4 applications that I use: Okular and Konqueror (the latter mainly for web page testing)
<awen_> done: bug #190854
 * awen_ don't think ubotu is really well today... "Error: Could not parse data returned by Launchpad: The connect operation timed out"
<persia> ubotu is normally healthy.  Launchpad is ill.
<LucidFox> no, sadly, epiphany-webkit is also too raw :(
<Aloha> woah IE8 passes acid 2 browser test
<LucidFox> Aloha> It doesn't.
<Aloha> lucid http://www.webstandards.org/2007/12/19/ie8-passes-acid2-test-2/
<LucidFox> Passing with a special compatibility tag added is not considered passing.
<awen_> could also be the case
<lifeless> is that like a disabled parking spot ?
<LucidFox> lifeless> What?
<superm1> persia, is this what you were coming down to http://paste.ubuntu.com/4424/
<superm1> or is that a little different
<persia> superm1: That was my issue.  I'm guessing that the wildmidi plugin isn't quite ready yet.
<superm1> persia, did you consider updating the wildmidi plugin from CVS?
<Aloha> heh epiphany-webkit fails acid2
<superm1> the one for myth was rather outdated
<superm1> so i updated that in my patch too
<persia> superm1: I'm very much not familiar with gstreamer, and didn't want to pull from VCS based on guessing.
<superm1> persia, understandably
<persia> superm1: If you know the code well enough to judge it, and would be willing to give it a try towards closing bug #111555, I (and others) would appreciate it.  If not, it can wait another release or two.
<superm1> persia, i'll see if i can grabit from cvs and make any more luck, but if not i do need to do a follow up build on the gmyth build depend, i directly modified debian/control rather than debian/build-deps.in (didn't realize it used that)
<persia> superm1: Yep.  debian/HACKING is a useful read, but one of the big reasons I'm not entirely comfortable playing with that package :)
<LucidFox> heh, midori does pass acid2
<LucidFox> (webkit svn29844, midori 0.0.17)
<superm1> persia, after exploring the code some more, simply pulling in some newer stuff from cvs isn't going to do.  its a pretty significant chunk that would need to come in.
<superm1> and then of course that doesn't guarantee functionality
<superm1> only thing it guarantees is to make future versions much harder to merge
<persia> superm1: That's fine.  Thanks for looking.  Maybe drop it for now.  I've advised the Debian team about wildmidi, so maybe we'll see something for lenny.  If not, we can target hardy+1.
<superm1> yeah
<superm1> sounds like a plan
<persia> (and, yes, hardy+1 comes out around the same time as lenny, but lenny will be frozen then)
<persia> LucidFox: Do we not need iceowl for gobuntu?
<LucidFox> persia> If that was the case, we'd need all the other ice* packages as well, and they're not in Ubuntu.
<persia> LucidFox: Hmm.  OK.  Let's see what an archive-admin says.
<LucidFox> iceape was originally in Ubuntu, but was replaced by seamonkey
<persia> Anyone interested in openVZ?  bug #183774 needs a little process help.
<ScottK> Is soyuz eating uploads tonight?
<persia> ScottK: It seems to have been doing that for at least 6 hours.
 * persia is uploading anyway, but keeping all uploaded files in a special extra directory for re-upload if required
<persia> ScottK: Also, thank you for checking the licensing so carefully for things.  It helps to get it right :)
<RAOF> persia: Thanks for the review.  I'll just remove one of the unlicenced files, since it's unused, and grab the header for the other.
<persia> RAOF: Excellent.  Should be good after that.
<persia> Also, what about all the AssemblyInfo.cs files?  Are they supposed to be unlicensed?
<ScottK> persia: No problem.  I actually think that's the most important thing to get right at this point (licensing).
 * persia is curious for future reference for CIL stuff
<RAOF> persia: That's a fair point.  They're so trivial that no one cared about them.
<persia> ScottK: Maybe.  I'm more focused on what still needs to get in to meet my feature goals (and have recently dropped once as not ready for hardy).
<RAOF> Where's Tomboy's license headers, gosh darn it!
<persia> On the other hand, I have to agree that the orig.tar.gz files shouldn't change after FF, which makes licensing also key.
<persia> RAOF: File a bug :)
<ScottK> persia: I'm more thinking as long as the technical aspects are in the ballpark and the package is distributable, the rest can be bugfixed as needed.
<ScottK> But, of course, I've met my feature goal, so there's no pressure...
 * RAOF wonders idly how we have tomboy 0.9.5, when tomboy's downloads page only goes up to 0.9.4
<persia> ScottK: Ah.  I'm still two features short.  I'd agree with the bugfix-later plan, but still have four packages I'd like to see in NEW this week.
<persia> (and unfortunately, build-deps for three of them are stuck in NEW, complicating things)
<persia> Err.  Two now.  The situation improves :)
<persia> RAOF: Does tomboy's watch file debian/copyright, or get-orig-source provide any hints?
<RAOF> grep -i copyright Tomboy/*.cs... chirping crickets.
<persia> You could always request removal for lack of licensing...
<ScottK> Of course my goals for this release were modest since I kicked the development cycle off by quitting. ;-)
 * RAOF files a frikkin bug.
<RAOF> Share the licensing hate around!
<persia> Yep.  Everything should be licensed.  That's part of why we have the guideline about three pairs of eyes for every new package.  Unfortunately, some things slip through...
 * persia is willing to review something: anyone have anything stuck in the REVU queue that should be in hardy and a convincing reason why?
 * ScottK is doing poppler-data right now.
 * persia looks forward to being able to read PDF files again
 * ScottK suggest lib-apache2-asp=perl as perhaps worthwhile.
<RAOF> Lack of licensing comes under the "High" importance, yes?
<ScottK> Yes
<persia> RAOF: I think so.  Affects all Ubuntu users in a severe manner.
<ScottK> Actually, I'd consider critical as a possibility.
<persia> Note that this is for tomboy.  If an obsolete package with 3 users had licensing problems, it is likely Medium or Low (Importance is for the distro, not for the package)
<ScottK> Right.
<RAOF> Yeah.
<ScottK> So probably Hig
<ScottK> High even
<persia> ScottK: I don't think critical, just High.  Falls under " Makes a default Ubuntu installation generally unusable for some users" and " Has a moderate impact on a large portion of Ubuntu users (estimated)", but not quite "A bug which has a severe impact on a large portion of Ubuntu users".
 * persia notes that no bug in Universe can be "High", but tops off at "Medium".
<ScottK> Well a court injunction to stop distributing Ubuntu because it was distributing copyright packages with no license, while unlikely, would certainly affect all users.
<ScottK> And with that...
<ScottK> Good night all.
<RAOF> Night1
<persia> Good night ScottK
<dholbach> good morning
<persia> hey dholbach
 * persia seeks Dan Sheridan
<dholbach> hey persia
<persia> Regarding libapache2-asp-perl, it seems to be a merge from Debian, adjusted to use apache2 (Hurrah!).  Any objections to changing the source name back to match Debian and processing as a merge, rather than REVU?
<dholbach> persia: that sounds like a very good ifdea
<dholbach> idea
<persia> dholbach: Thanks, but I hope to hear from the person who prepared the package before hijacking it :)
<dholbach> hehe
<RAOF> Huzzah for "GPL 2.1 or later".  That's incorporatable into a GPLv3 package, right?  Do I need to bump the GPL version to 3?
<persia> RAOF: It may be incorporated.  Only bump the licensing on the source if you are making other changes that you are licensing under GPL3 only, otherwise just reference it in debian/copyright.
<RAOF> Score.  I suppose, to be safe, I should reference
<RAOF> Whoops.
<persia> The main idea being that if someone wants to later reincorporate back into something GPL2.1 they may, as long as they only take from that file.
<persia> (otherwise you are forcing your license choice on the end-users, which doesn't grant them the same rights you were granted under the license, which isn't nice)
<persia> Of course, if you change it, then it's your code, to license as you like :)
<RAOF> So, this file has no copyright headers, and is taken from Tomboy (which has no copyright headers).  It's GPLv2.1+, but who (if anyone) to put as the copyright holder?
<persia> RAOF: Check tomboy VCS commit history?  Ask upstream?  Kick the tomboy maintainers?
<RAOF> Hm.  VCS commit history!  Good idea.
<LucidFox> GPLv2.1? o_O
<persia> RAOF: Are the copyright holders really not listed in tomboy's debian/copyright?
<RAOF> persia: Yes.
 * persia is stunned that such a package made it into the archives
<RAOF> There are a bunch of people listed in AUTHORS, though.
<RAOF> It's obvious that debian/copyright hasn't been touched in *some* time.  Since well before tomboy was a part of Gnome.
<persia> They probably have copyright, but no guarantees.  A couple packages I've been working with recently had clearly separated copyright attribution and authorship.
<RAOF> And Tomboy's in main, too.
 * RAOF puzzles with persia.
<RAOF> Quick!  To the bat-svn-blame!
<persia> LucidFox: Good point.  There doesn't appear to be a GPLv2.1
<persia> RAOF: Maybe LGPL?
<RAOF> Yes.
<LucidFox> Well, LGPL contains an explicit conversion clause to GPL.
 * persia enjoys that there actually is a "svn blame" command
<RAOF> But described as the GPL 2.1.
<LucidFox> Therefore, if it's "GPLv2.1+", it de facto means GPLv3+
<LucidFox> because it excludes GPLv2 :)
<persia> RAOF: If upstream describes as "GPL 2.1", then maybe they have a special secret license, which ought be included entire in debian/copyright, and for which nobody can give advice about GPL-3 integration.
<RAOF> Ah, whoops.  No, LGPL.
<persia> That's a good thing.  It's not quite as bad as it might have been.  Still, the main difference between LGPL-2 and LGPL-2.1 is that LGPL-2.1 is GPL-3 compatible.
<LucidFox> persia> Aren't modifications to the GPL themselves forbidden and make the code unredistributable?
<persia> LucidFox: No.  They just make it a different license.  It depends on who modified it.
<persia> If a software author modifies the GPL, and releases under a modified GPL, this is acceptable, but the license must be reviewed for suitability as with any new license.  If these modifications go beyond certain permitted criteria, the author is asked not to call it "GPL", and cannot incorporate other GPL software.
<persia> Common cases are things like the classlib exception or the libssl exception.
<persia> Less common cases are things like linuxsampler, which is deemed undistributable due to contradictions in the license.
<LucidFox> Additional permissions can be added to the GPL, but the GPL itself is immutable.
<LucidFox> " Everyone is permitted to copy and distribute verbatim copies of this license document, but changing it is not allowed." ~ GPL
 * persia would be curious to see case history of precedent for successful prosecution of a copyright claim for a legal document.  Law is inherently open-source.
<RAOF> Why thank you, janderson, for touching every line of XKeybinder.cs with your "spaces-to-tabs" commit. :(
<LucidFox> lol
<slangasek> persia: one would think so, but AIUI there have been US states with rulings to the effect that contracts are proprietary -- ah, the disadvantages of trusting lawyers to argue the case for what they should be allowed to do... :)
<LucidFox> persia> Apparently, smplayer-themes didn't upload
<persia> slangasek: Really?  Do you happen to have a link?  I'm rather interested.
<slangasek> persia: no link, just anecdote from several years ago; so feel free to ignore my hearsay
<persia> slangasek: I'll not ignore, just turn to google for help.  Makes me wish I still had LEXIS/NEXIS access.
<persia> Heh.  "All Rights Reserved" only means anything in Nicaragua and Honduras.  The rest of the world assumes that.
<persia> slangasek: Citing from the decision in FEIST PUBLICATIONS, INC.    v. RURAL TELEPHONE SERVICE CO., 499 U.S. 340 (1991): "Notwithstanding a valid copyright, a subsequent compiler remains free to use the facts contained in an another's publication to aid in preparing a competing work, so long as the competing work does not feature the same selection and arrangement."
<persia> I'm fairly sure someone could successfully argue their way out of liability when confronted with using the GPL as a base for their new license, at least for any state court, and few GPL-covered works meet the $100,000 minimum liabilty for federal court.
 * persia is unable to find the anecdotal case mentioned, and goes back to pushing new orig.tar.gz files for FeatureFreeze
<persia> slangasek: Do you know if there will be another run of the removed-from-debian removal script before hardy release?
<RAOF> Dear beagle: surrender to me your keybinding logic, so I can replace Do's use of tomboy with yours.
<slangasek> persia: I'm not aware that it's on any kind of checklist, but it does rather seem like a good idea
<persia> slangasek: I'm just encountering a few "Please remove: was removed from Debian" bugs in the U-U-S queue, and I'd think that using the script to autoremove (assuming no Ubuntu changes or rdepends) would be a cleaner solution than pushing these bugs on to the archive-admins.
<LucidFox> Speaking of removals from Debian, what do you all think about bug #190684?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 190684 in xmms "Remove xmms from Ubuntu" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/190684
<slangasek> well, the script doesn't remove very "auto"ly, but going through the whole list of candidate removals seems like a better idea than picking them off as bugs, yes
<persia> LucidFox: Given the fuss about trying to remove xmms for gutsy, I'd rather wait for the Debian removal to happen in that case.  It's special.
<LucidFox> Okay.
<persia> slangasek: Shall I reject bugs like https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/sql-editor/+bug/190045/ for now, telling the submitter that the archive-admins will take care of these are part of normal archive maintenance?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 190045 in sql-editor "[Remove] Please remove sql-editor from Hardy, it depends on Gnome 1.x" [Undecided,New]
<LucidFox> Can packages be removed after FF?
<persia> Hurrah!  Ubotu is reporting bugs again!
<LucidFox> It didn't?
<persia> LucidFox: Yes, but they need a better reason.
<persia> LucidFox: It had been having issues with LP being slow for the past several hours.
<LucidFox> Ah.
<slangasek> persia: for now, if you think the removal is appropriate how about sending it on to ubuntu-archive anyway and I'll talk to the other guys about making sure we get a full process-removals run in before FF
<persia> slangasek: OK.  Makes sense.  Thanks.
<RAOF> AAARGH.  Beagle has taken _their_ keybinding stuff from tomboy, lack of license header and all.
<persia> heh.  Nothing like sharing code without a license.  Maybe all the developers thought they lived in Nicaragua or Honduras?
<RAOF> persia: It's probably not archive-material without a XKeybinder header, is it :(
<LucidFox> "Gentoo's (mis)handling of PR during this transitional time has resulted in a lot of negativity towards audacious and several lame attempts to find security holes in Audacious with the explicit purpose of trying to get XMMS back." <-- .......
<persia> RAOF: I'd think not, but tomboy got in somehow...
<LucidFox> They should have a "Don't disrupt development to prove a point" policy, like Wikipedia does.
<RAOF> And beagle, too :)
<slangasek> nothing worse than a distro that mishandles Puerto Rico
<persia> LucidFox: That's precisely the sort of reason why it would be nice to have it disappear because it didn't work (based on GTK+ 1 going away for lenny), rather than taking a position in Ubuntu.
<LucidFox> Ack.
<LucidFox> slangasek> Now reading that Debian mailing list discussion, well said about 6-year-old abandonware and idiots :)
<warp10> Good morning!
 * RAOF grumbles about licensing again.
<RAOF> warp10: I'll pay you the "morning" part, at least :P
<warp10> RAOF: eheh :D
 * persia is impressed to see 1700 bugs closed in the last week
<soren> O_O
<crevette> superm1, around ?
<persia> crevette: In 90% of cases, you'll do better to ask a question rather than seeking a person.
<crevette> persia, yeah okay, this is because superm1 has managed to reviewed my package
<persia> crevette: Which package?
<persia> ls
<crevette> soren, my problem is one of the source file of my package does not contain header
<crevette> I contacted the upstream author, but he doesn't want to fix that because the files is autogenerated
<crevette> persia, http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=obex-data-server
<crevette> what can I do ? for me all source files must have an header; I wanted a reference to the debian policy
<persia> crevette: For the changelog, you have to pass an argument to dh_installchangelogs (or use DEB_INSTALL_CHANGELOGS_ALL for CDBS).
<crevette> persia, yeah I found
<persia> which file is missing the license header?
<crevette> persia, src/ods-marshal.c
<crevette> look the 1st set of comments, point 6
<crevette> persia, I opend a bug http://bugs.muiline.com/view.php?id=43
<persia> crevette: It's fine if that file doesn't have a header.  It is listed as a target in src/Makefile.am.
<crevette> persia, could you add a comment to revu ?
<persia> To be extra explicit, you could delete that file in debian/rules clean.
<persia> crevette: My comment wouldn't help you as much as your comment with a new upload.  The changelog bit is still annoying.
<crevette> persia, I'm going to fix that tonight
<persia> crevette: Great.  Just fix that, and consider deleting the offending file in debian/rules clean just to make a point, and you should have addressed the outstanding issues.
<crevette> okay, do you have a ref to do the clean function
<persia> crevette: You'd add a clean:: rule to debian/rules, and use use rm to delete the file.
<crevette> okay
<crevette> thanks
<spiekey> hi
<spiekey> how can i search and install stuff from the backports repository?
<persia> !backports | spiekey
<ubotu> spiekey: If new updated Ubuntu packages are built for an application, then they may go into Ubuntu Backports. See https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuBackports - See also !packaging
<spiekey> looks like libnss-ldap is not in packports, right?
<persia> spiekey: In only very rare cases do libraries go in backports: too great a chance of breaking things.
<jpatrick> spiekey: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/55588/
<soren> persia: libnss-* is sort of special, though.
 * persia continues to ignore mozilla packaging exceptions as much as possible :)
<spiekey> jpatrick; what do you want to tell me with that link?
<soren> Er.. Not that sort of nss :)
<soren> persia: It's the libraries that libc uses for looking up users, groups, etc.
<jpatrick> spiekey: that it's not in backports
<persia> soren: Ah.  RIght.  Still, I'd think that'd have a great potential to break something without careful integration testing.
<soren> persia: Nothing links against them. libc loads the dynamically depending on the contents of nsswitch.conf.
<persia> soren: links vs. dlopen still requires reliable behaviour and testing, no?  Anyway, it would still be rare for these to go in backports, but the backports team might consider a request (I'm not a backporter)
<spiekey> i think i best install gutsy and see if the problem still exists there. If yes, then it canÂ´t be a nss_ldap version problem
<persia> spiekey: What's the problem?
<soren> persia: Sure it needs testing. libnss-foo is just sort of special, IMO.
<persia> soren: I have to agree that it's special as compared to other libraries.
 * persia wonders if Debian bug #425379 affects gutsy
<ubotu> Debian bug 425379 in libnss-ldap "libnss-ldap: Can't connect to ldap server anymore" [Important,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/425379
<soren> persia: Probably.
<zuch> Hi! I need some packaging help. I hope this is the right place to ask questions?
<dholbach> zuch: absolutely
 * persia notes that bug #190888 just got a good patch, and would be an easy fix for anyone wanting to generate a debdiff.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 190888 in drscheme "/etc/init.d/mzscheme does not start web-server" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/190888
<zuch> I use java-gnome for gtk development. Apparently it's not in the repos but standard with some other repos. I though I would help or suggest it to be added. What's the procedure for that?
<LucidFox> zuch> I think it's too late to get packages into Hardy - there are three days before the freeze
<LucidFox> so it will have to go into Hardy+1, after Hardy is released
<persia> zuch: First, open a needs-packaging bug on launchpad (bug #177672 is a handy example)
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 177672 in ubuntu "[needs-packaging] wildmidi" [Wishlist,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/177672
<persia> zuch: Next prepare a candidate package (or convince someone else to do so), and submit to REVU.
<persia> !revu | zuch
<ubotu> zuch: REVU is a web-based tool to give people who have worked on Ubuntu packages a chance to "put their packages out there" for other people to look at and comment on in a structured manner. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU
<persia> Unfortunately, FeatureFreeze for hardy is in 3 days time, so there is very little chance a new package can be included at this time.  The next window for package inclusion will open in late April or early May.
<zuch> Is that 3 days for submitting packages or 3 days for submitting/reviewing them to be added. If I am able to get a candidate package submitted in a few hours will that be too late?
<geser> zuch: is libgnome-java the wrong package?
<geser> !info libgnome-java hardy
<ubotu> libgnome-java (source: libgnome-java): Gnome bindings for Java. In component universe, is optional. Version 2.12.7-3ubuntu1 (hardy), package size 92 kB, installed size 160 kB
<persia> zuch: 3 days for submission/review/acceptance.  On the other hand, libgnome-java may well be the better solution.
<zuch> That is very old. Java bindings have been re-written from scratch and the current version is 4.x
<zuch> Anyway I think what is most important is that a deb package is not availabel at all. So I will push the java-gnome people to publish a .deb package even if it can't be included in the latest version of ubuntu as long as people can download it from somewhere.
<zuch> The only way right now is to compile from source.
<persia> zuch: Best path is likely for upstream to work with the Debian Java Maintainers to get the new version in Debian sometime in the next few months.  Thereafter, Ubuntu will pull from Debian, and it can be in backports, if nothing else.
<zuch> persia: Ok that sounds good. I will work on it. Thanks
<Aloha> is there a website that lists backports?
<persia> Aloha: packages.ubuntu.com might, but archive.ubuntu.com is more reliable.
 * persia is happy to see Soyuz processing packages again!
<Aloha> persia, thnx
<persia> tsmithe: You've taken too long: hijacking fluid-soundfont
<Aloha> whats the difference between gutsy-backports and gutsy-updates?
<jpatrick> !backports > Aloha
<Aloha> so whats updates?
<jpatrick> bug fixes
<Aloha> gotcha
<dholbach> !sru
<ubotu> Stable Release Update information is at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates
<Aloha> so updates is bugfixes and backports is new releases
<Aloha> woah firefox3 passes acid 2
<Aloha> data:image/png;base64,iVBORw0KGgoAAAANSUhEUgAAAGAAAAAYCAYAAAFy7sgCAAAGsUlEQVRo3u2ZbWwcZxHHf3s%2B7LNbO3ZjXBtowprGODRX0qpNQCjmJKuVKhMl1P2AkCwhFOIKkCBSm9IXavGFKAixIAECwkmWo5MrhRI3Ub40IEwQgp6aIDg3Cd6eEqyIHEteah%2B1E69vhw%2BZtTaX8704ZzkKjHS6271nZ56ZZ%2BY%2F%2F%2BdZKF%2FCwYshx3EkkggLsD1v4FQkEZZYLCbAKyG9%2Ba9EIsG6hnUAf8x74K3aUC3j4%2BM54HcsR2oAIomwZOezkv%2FnSHpYNh%2BNCmAE7xv94zvFdd1bHsjMZmQkPSxAJP%2B%2FfuBLwK54PC7JZFKAVJmzXLBt2w%2FMvcDLwIb8QS8CeJ
<Aloha> 4nkURYIomw7J%2FYJ8BvSiiXptGGxWds2%2Fa9%2Bnaxh%2BYAD%2Bgt04NDgABTpQY2cvvSFLzw86gWeBVwC8SzlOSv2YeBPfmDBoBHgKmR9LBEEmHZfDTqGykqfkUE0nA78BzQGfSgUeP3wNeTXwXg7MwZDhw4UHL6ra2ti79%2FOvljgG8AZ4H64Lhm4MvAocxsRppGG%2FxcXihlwLIs6R%2FfKV2HO%2F26uA94pdDYUKUZUU7W1RQYXA98Gnhaf5%2FXWX0HeAHYoQonqa4sZSOsSWMCWeC9Yko%2BCQwBe4E6oNc0Tc91XTl1%2BaTsn9gnI%2Blhyc5nZWxsrBIkKSbl2tiic3tW53YDEwOKaoFBrcOfqKee53lG9xsPMjV784r%2F4lO%2FpPvyJ9iyZcuvFSaXK5XYeAZ4CDgGvB3MS4B54L
<Aloha> QuWYPeuy4iRFsevsXqpuYoqVQKIH2bK1CuDQNo11o4XUzh%2FcDWYIe1LEtyuZx4niee54njOGKapgfsqlL%2Bl2OjEXg8nxrc1dJ0h3hbtL%2BGCtz7KPBF4CuBe9uB15VafE8hr9qylI3HgG8C2%2FK7VyHZoJj7MrBRm30qFotJMpkU27YlHo%2F7Ha5a%2BV%2FKRkSJ4KuKRLVLKapTjB1SzAVIjY2NSXY%2BKyPpYdk%2FsU9OXT4pruv6BdZbBQfKsVGnvWlIe1VB6VQO8JxC1vZYLCbZ%2BaxsPhpdZDyRRFhG0sPiOE6ldKBg2lRg4xF1YCDIIIKN7DGgD3gH%2BBXwejKZfPrs2tPs%2FvPN2bKuYR1nd7xLKBSSJeqoXKnERjPwNWAG%2BLn2rZuM%2B4Tpml6vaWlp4eLcxVusZq5lCgVg
<Aloha> OVKJjRqdX86ffL4D5wIoZACnTpw4wRMdT96i%2FImOJxERAs4uVyqxUacF%2FPdiCj%2BjdRBRGFtwXVdG0sPSdbhTmkYbpH98p2RmM2JZlig1vl0GWo4NQ%2Fn%2Bs5pKRXfwjweaxy7TND3HcRZbfC6X8xVPVQlGy7WxVWlO5XRXFXm6EZmrQuSXYyPE3SiVoEhE6Wyr0u2rumO6zv%2B21AFdQAswC1wCMuUCXCmyWQus103Qg8qlDO0lxwOb%2Fl4FiK3AB3VS%2FuKKLtK%2FgbeAnwG%2FvUODuRw%2FFrR0H1UC75fwu8oJ%2FhFsW5VIG%2FBUgEIN6Y65O4AHu4Ap0zQ9y7LEcZyb9lRBUHQcRyzL8unZVBW5bFWAvAp%2BhDQ2g4F47dUYtlU6obXA54DnVdFLekjUGGifh4AFy7LEdV3xj3
<Aloha> X9I66m0QZpGm2QrsOd0j%2B%2BU0bSw5KZzYjrun6HWlAd961i4FfCj0aN1Usau%2Bc1lmuXPFwvAEumUut7tQQvAb%2FXb%2FT0bCAej9cODg7yt%2Bm%2F8q2%2F7OUHZ76PnZ1k2p0mJzlykmPancbOTnL0whHs7CQfb%2B5mx2d3sH79%2BtCRI0c6FeaOr9ICrIQfLvA%2B8BGNXxi4R6HrisJVUWrxAVW2oMFf0Aczim8o3kV6enowDIPjF9%2Fk%2BMU3S3rrjzMMg56e
<azeem> Aloha: eh?
<Aloha> crap sorry
<Aloha> wrong button
<HighNo> hi MOTUs - I need a second advocate on http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=blueproximity please
 * persia seeks second advocates for http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=libnb-platform7-java and http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=libini4j-java
<\sh> moins
<Hobbsee> bad Aloha!
<Hobbsee> interesting "button" there
<Aloha> Hobbsee, sorry.. didn't do it on purpose... had that in my clipboard and dumped it on accident
<geser> Hi \sh
<Hobbsee> Aloha: strange clipboard content :)
<Hobbsee> unless you're decrypting or something
<persia> It's a PNG file
<Aloha> Hobbsee, its the eyeballs off acid 2 test in base 64
<Hobbsee> ahhhh
<persia> Looks like a PNG file :(
<slytherin> persia: Can we make a decision on the j2sdk debconf preseed on buildd? I am 'for' it as it will at least fix batik and consequently fop.
<HighNo> Ah, Hobbsee is around. Would you trust superm1's advocation? If you do could you have a quick look at  http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=blueproximity if you find a little time? It's not a very big package :-)
<persia> slytherin: Only the buildd admins can make such a decision.  I'm not opposed, but I also don't have any special influence.
<persia> I'd like a working batik, as fop is fun, but I haven't looked at whether that's the best way to get it.
<Hobbsee> slytherin: ask elmo
<Hobbsee> or lamont
<slytherin> persia: as of now that is the best way to get it.
<slytherin> Hobbsee: What do I need to do to convince them?
<persia> slytherin: I trust you on that.  Ask for the people Hobbsee mentioned on #ubuntu-devel
<slytherin> join #ubuntu-devel
<\sh> ScottK, could you resolve the problem with klamav?
 * persia passes out free '/' characters
<Hobbsee> slytherin: say what it does, and why it's needed, i think
<persia> slytherin: Be warned that that channel has long lags, with people sometimes replying days after a question is asked.
<french1> Hi All
<french1> If I have a package in Ubuntu that was previously synced from Debian but am unable to locate my Debian uploader ... do I have any options to get it into Hardy before feature freeze?
<slytherin> persia: :-)
<Hobbsee> french1: there are various DD's around here, too
<slytherin> french1: Is it not currently present in hardy?
<french1> It's only been 3 days since he went AWOL ... but time's running out.
<french1> Yep, it's in Hardy.  Just a real only (more buggy) version.
<french1> *real old
<persia> french1: You could always submit an Ubuntu-only update, if you can't get it updated in Debian in time.
<french1> So the best idea is to get in-touch with another Debian developer, hey?
<slytherin> french1: Best idea is to package it yourself. :-)
<french1> persia: Thanks, that's what I was asking.
<french1> slytherin: I do.
<french1> slytherin: But I don't have upload priv.
<french1> slytherin: I'm a maintainer.
<slytherin> french1: Ordinarily I would have asked you to upload the package to revu. But since we are this close to FF, I am not sure what should be your next step. Better wait for someone else to answer
<persia> french1: Yes.  Best solution is to find another sponsor for now.  If all else fails, submit a diff.gz for an Ubuntuised version to the sponsors queue (best to send that in the next 24 hours to be sure of getting it in pre-freeze)
<persia> slytherin: Package updates shouldn't go to REVU: they just get ignored there.
<slytherin> persia: Ah, I didn't know that. :-)
<french1> slytherin: persia: Thanks.
<persia> REVU is for NEW packages.  Updates get debdiffs or diff.gz files sent to the sponsors queue.
<sistpoty|work> hi folks
<persia> sistpoty|work: Hey.  Thanks for wildmidi :)
<mruiz> morning all
<sistpoty|work> hi persia... thank you for packaging it ;)
<sistpoty|work> hi mruiz
<mruiz> hey sistpoty|work
<persia> Hobbsee: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=fluid-soundfont might be interesting to you...
<Hobbsee> persia: \o/
<DktrKranz> mruiz, I was busy these days and I didn't check your new revision, sorry :(
<zul> morning
<sistpoty|work> hey zul
<zul> hi sistpoty|work
<mruiz> DktrKranz, ;-) ... what about today or tomorrow?
<DktrKranz> mruiz, I guess so :)
<mruiz> :)
<DktrKranz> mruiz, I start to hate trains and subways...
<mruiz> hahaha
<persia> Dan Sheridan: If you are about, please let me know that you object to me changing the libapache2-asp-perl REVU entry into a libapache-asp-perl merge incorporating your changes.
<DktrKranz> I spent two days on those traps...
<geser> Hi sistpoty|work
<sistpoty|work> hi geser
<effie_jayx> Hey all
<sistpoty|work> hi effie_jayx
<mruiz> hi effie_jayx
<effie_jayx> I have upgraded a package (kipina), however the changelog from upstream is missing
<effie_jayx> the changelog hasn't been updated since 2004.
<effie_jayx> the last version he released was in 2006. this would make the package unfit for distribution?
<effie_jayx> I managed to make it work and I fixed some directories that got placed wrong
<persia> effie_jayx: No, it just makes the changelog useless.  If you haven't already, please complain upstream
<effie_jayx> persia,  in the meantime the package is worth anything?
<effie_jayx> also should I add a watch file
<effie_jayx> ?
<persia> effie_jayx: Why not?  If the code is useful, it is useful, even if the documentation isn't up to date.  If the code is not useful, don't bother updating.
<effie_jayx> persia,  great stuff. Now I need to go through sponsoring for the package?
<persia> Watch files are good, although they should be added in Debian if the package is available in Debian and has a maintainer.  It is only worth carrying an Ubuntu diff for a watch file for things that will appear on UEHS, which is limited to packages that either are not in Debian or have the Debian QA team as the maintainer.
<persia> effie_jayx: Until you have been granted permission to upload, anything you want to submit to the archive should be submitted to the sponsors queue.
<effie_jayx> persia,  great. I am finishing the changelog for my update
<hexmode> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=php-xdebug # could I get a motu to look at this?
<Hobbsee> wow, didn't realise the open week was so close
<dholbach> Developer week! :)
<jdong> same thing ;-)
 * jdong posts dholbach's sticky
<dholbach> noooo, it's not :)
<dholbach> thanks jd
<dholbach> jdong:
 * dholbach hugs jdong :)
<AstralJava> gross, we don't wanna see dholbach's sticky!!
 * jdong smacks AstralJava 
<jdong> AstralJava: that's not until April 1st's wallpaper!
<jdong> don't ruin the surprise
 * AstralJava shuts his trap
<sistpoty|work> hi dholbach and jdong
<dholbach> hey sistpoty|work
<jdong> hi sistpoty|work :)
<dholbach> Ubuntu Developer Week will be great
<mruiz> dholbach, funny post about UDW ;-.)
 * dholbach just knows it
 * mruiz hugs dholbach
 * dholbach hugs mruiz back
<hexmode> so much luvin!
<Hobbsee> FWIW, i'm on VAC from this wednesdy to next wednesday, inclusive.
<zul> get a room!
<hexmode> could I get a motu to look at http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=php-xdebug ??
<Hobbsee> so i'll have to find out about the MOTU release team after i get back
<hexmode> fwiw, jdub asked me to submit php-xdebug... it someone would take a poke at it I'd really appreciate it.
<tuxmaniac> can some please review http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=alliance
 * tuxmaniac has a question (will be dubbed stupid for sure)
<tuxmaniac> why is packaging session called packaging "101"
<tuxmaniac> google does not give any pointers
<hexmode> tuxmaniac: because it is aimed at beginners?
<AstralJava> I think it stems from academic circles, where beginner type classes begin from that number. Or something to that effect anyhow.
<mruiz> tuxmaniac, is a beginner class :-)
<tuxmaniac> "Packaging for stupids and dummies" will be nice too :-)
<hexmode> tuxmaniac: some of us hate the whole "for dummies" meme
<hexmode> at least, I do
<elkbuntu> 'for dummies' is so 1990
<hexmode> elkbuntu: in that case "101" is so 1980! ;)
<elkbuntu> hexmode, 101 isnt trying to be funny
<hexmode> true
<elkbuntu> (and more like 1880)
<hexmode> which makes it tons better
<AstralJava> Yeah, why not really go back in time and everybody just dig out their abacuses.
<AstralJava> See how your UDS turns out to, huh?!
<hexmode> Can anyone tell me why lintian doesn't like http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=1919 but will look at http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=1859 (two different versions of my php-xdebug package)
<sistpoty|work> hexmode: the first link is an upload w.o. the orig.tar.gz (please don't do this, unless the tarball is very, very, very, very big)
<hexmode> sistpoty|work: so how do up dput the orig tar when the rev > UPSTREAM-1 ??
<hexmode> that is the first link is version 2.0.2-3 of my build and the second is 2.0.2-1.  aren't orig.tars included by default only on -1 ?
<hexmode> (just trying to make sure I've understood you correctly)
<geser> hexmode: only a very quick look at php-xdebug: 1) wrong versioning and distribution in debian/changelog 2) I don't know if the license can be called "BSD license" in debian/copyright
<sistpoty|work> hexmode: your dsc needs to reference the orig-tarball, and dpkg-buildpackage can do this with -sa
<hexmode> geser: thanks wasn't sure about license
<hexmode> sistpoty|work: tyvm
<sistpoty|work> np
<geser> hexmode: it's probably better to include the full license text in debian/copyright
<hexmode> (Though, I am using bzr buiddeb... and sometimes it doesn't carry over the dpkg-buildpackage options...)
<geser> hexmode: 3) removed the comment out lines from debian/rules if you don't need them 4) you can probably also remove debian/changelog.xsl as the call to xsltproc in debian/rules is comment out
<effie_jayx> I have finished with my package and I would like it to go through the sponsoring process. how different is it from the merging process or the bug fixing process?
<hefe_bia> Could a MOTU have a look at http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=tomboy-blogposter? (I already fixed the errors from a previous review) It's a small package and the upstream author was quite excited about the deb packaging.
<effie_jayx> it is an update
<sistpoty|work> effie_jayx: then just attach the .diff.gz from your updated package to a bug and subscribe the sponsor team
<effie_jayx> sistpoty|work,  what should the bug state... please update bla bla bla
<effie_jayx> ?
<effie_jayx> ahhh to an existing bug ... righto
<mruiz> effie_jayx, ?
<effie_jayx> thanks sistpoty|work
<sistpoty|work> np
<effie_jayx> mruiz, sorry ;)
<sistpoty|work> (I guess, you could also use a new one, and do the same as with merging)
<effie_jayx> sistpoty|work,  is it a good practice?
<sistpoty|work> effie_jayx: no idea... /me is not in the sponsoring team, and has lost knowledge of the current best practices
<effie_jayx> sistpoty|work,  right... then I should hold a little longer to see if we can get some back up :D
<sistpoty|work> heh
<hexmode> geser: should maintainer be ubuntu-motu or me?
<effie_jayx> sistpoty|work,  it's my first update :D
<mruiz> effie_jayx, what's the question ?
<effie_jayx> mruiz,  I have an update. to request sponsorship. I upload the diff.gz to an existing bug or I open a new bug stating "please update bla bla bla "
<mruiz> effie_jayx, what's is your "existing" bug ?
<effie_jayx> mruiz,  gimme a sec
<effie_jayx> mruiz, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/kipina/+bug/95842
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 95842 in kipina "kipina crashes on launch" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<mruiz> effie_jayx, for this case the bug is related to a problem... not an update/upgrade request. You should open a new one requesting the update
<dcordero> hi
<mruiz> hi dcordero
<effie_jayx> mruiz, do you have any samples of update bugs ?
<mruiz> effie_jayx, sure. Let me check...
<effie_jayx> mruiz,  I feel a little jittery about submiting it
<mruiz> ;-)
<geser> hexmode: it's usually ubuntu-motu as Maintainer and you as XSBC-Original-Maintainer
<mruiz> effie_jayx, an example ... bug 184125
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 184125 in mail-notification "New upstream version: 5.0" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/184125
<\sh> dholbach, I'll answer the questions this evening and send it to you by email :)
<dholbach> \sh: gracias
<mruiz> effie_jayx, if you have worked on it, just attach the diff.tar.gz /debdiff , pbuilder log, etc ...
<effie_jayx> mruiz,  diff.gz or debdiff or both
<mruiz> effie_jayx, as persia told me weeks ago: debdiff: orig.tar.gz unchanged / diff.gz: orig.tar.gz changed ;-)
<ScottK> \sh: I have a package I'd like to have you test build if you can (klamav). http://revu.tauware.de/revu1-incoming/klamav-0802082120/klamav_0.42-1.dsc
<ScottK> It would be a great help if you could.
<\sh> ScottK, one sec :)
<ScottK> Thanks
<RainCT> Hey
<hexmode> sistpoty|work, geser: updated  http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=php-xdebug based on your comments.  Changing maintainer to motu generates a bunch of lintian noise...
<hexmode>  lintian complains about config.guess but that is in the upstream tarball... I can't remove it from the upstream: is there a way to tell lintian to hush-up?
<sistpoty|work> hexmode: you should use the ubuntu versioning, and you don't need to increase the version for each upload to revu
<hexmode> sistpoty|work: kk
<sistpoty|work> hexmode: and for the autotools file, you should build-depend on autotools-dev and copy the relevant files from there in debian/rules
<hexmode> sistpoty|work: still, it will complain about that file in the upstream
<hexmode> those files
<sistpoty|work> hexmode: it should be quiet, if you add the autotools-dev build-dependency... at leasts that's what I guess. Others than that, lintian isn't always right as well ;)
<geser> hexmode: it complains that config.guess is too old (6 years old). It will go away if you use an uptodate version from autotools-dev.
<\sh> ScottK, see mail
<hexmode> giving it a try... still, seems like it would continue to carp about the upstream tarball
 * ScottK doesn't like the sound of that.
<ScottK> It reads better though.
<ScottK> \sh: Thank you.
<\sh> ScottK, surprise surprise upload to debian ;)
 * ScottK dput's to mentors and pings the DD that promised to upload it.
<\sh> ScottK, hopefully I have the time to code on my local build service so that special people can upload to it and it builds those packages automatically
<ScottK> That's be great.
<leonel> hey ScottK good day
<ScottK> Hello leonel
<dholbach> can somebody comment on bug 184186?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 184186 in ubuntu "Please sync Easytag-AAC from Debian-Multimedia" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/184186
<frafu> Hello, could anybody from ubuntu-universe-sponsors have a look at the following sync request: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mousetweaks/+bug/190957
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 190957 in mousetweaks "[Sync Request] mousetweaks-2.21.91 (interdiff supplied)" [Undecided,New]
<frafu> I have also supplied the interdiff and if it has a problem, I will try to fix it right away.  (I nevertheless hope that it is ok  ;-))
<dholbach> RainCT: you can directly file sync requests for universe now, you're a MOTU :)
 * dholbach unsubscribes ubuntu-universe-sponsors and subscribes ubuntu-archive
<warp10> MOTUs, my package gbemol (a graphical frontend for MPD) is on REVU and waits for your reviews. http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=gbemol
<RainCT> dholbach: I know :). Where did I subscribe u-u-s?
<dholbach> RainCT: oh... on some sync request I filed - I already did it
<dholbach> don't have the bug number at hand right now
 * RainCT wonders wheter it's an old bug or it was a lapse :P
<RainCT> dholbach: ok, nvm then. thanks
<dholbach> RainCT: bug 190415
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 190415 in ubuntu "Please sync lightyears 1.3a-2 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)." [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/190415
<RainCT> dholbach: Btw, I got both mails from you about the interview. Will answer when I get a moment... :)
<dholbach> RainCT: rock on, thanks
<dholbach> RainCT: erm - both?
<RainCT> dholbach: you send it to me twice, one the day (or the day after, dunno) I became a MOTU and another one today
<emgent> heya dholbach :)
<dholbach> hey emgent
<dholbach> RainCT: oh... good I did that ;-)
<RainCT> dholbach: ah, and something more.. I haven't tried it but some dev on #launchpad told me that get-branches doesn't work
<dholbach> RainCT: oh - maybe I'll ask lool, I think he used it somewhere
<dholbach> I personally haven't used it in a while, but wrote it for seb128
<frafu> dholbach: An overwrite is needed for mousetweaks as far as I understood the doc in the wiki; there were no changes done for ubuntu in the previous upload.
<LucidFox> Looking for a second advocation for http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=tovid
<dholbach> frafu: the version in ubuntu is 0ubuntu1 - can you check there are no side-effects? also which version do you want synced? http://packages.debian.org/src:mousetweaks lists nothign
<dholbach> frafu: are you talking about a sync from debian at all?  http://wiki.ubuntu.com/SyncRequestProcess ?
<frafu> It is from gnome, not debian
<frafu> http://ftp.gnome.org/pub/GNOME/sources/mousetweaks/2.21/
<frafu> dholbach:  upstream is GNOME http://ftp.gnome.org/pub/GNOME/sources/mousetweaks/2.21/
<dholbach> frafu: OK, then please follow up with that information
<dholbach> a sync in Ubuntu land always refers to copying source packages from debian over to ubuntu
<mruiz> dholbach, can you give review some packages, please? (bug 187726 and 186397)
<frafu> dholbach: ok; sorry for the mistake; what would have been the proper term? (I understand sync as synchronize with upstream)
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 187726 in doc-debian "[FTBFS] doc-debian (gs: not found) / failed to upload" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/187726
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 186397 in gpredict "Please add Gpredict 0.9 to Hardy" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/186397
<ScottK> frafu: Upgrade.
 * ScottK is reviewing tovid.
<jdong> ScottK: I should take another look at that too when classes let out
<frafu> What about the interdiff: is it still valid? I used the following to prepare the interdiff: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/Interdiff
<tbutter> anyone could give my package at http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=jodviewer a review?
<RainCT> asac: if you have a moment, can you have a look at http://launchpadlibrarian.net/11869282/scrapbook_1.3.1-1ubuntu1.debdiff please? (if it's ok now I'll merge it with the new version from Debian and upload)
<dholbach> mruiz: no sorry, for today I'm completely booked out
<geser> mruiz: re doc-debian: the last source upload was accepted but not the binary upload of the buildds.
<dholbach> frafu: just say 'update' or something
<RainCT> frafu: it's still valid, you are free to upload it the way you want (but the prefered format is now .diff.gz)
<asac> RainCT: you have the bug id?
<geser> mruiz: your fix for the problem looks correct but it should be uploaded as 3.1.5ubuntu2 (the ubuntu1 changes are already in the archive)
<RainCT> asac: bug #184115
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 184115 in scrapbook "iceweasel-scrapbook should be firefox-scrapbook" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/184115
<mruiz> geser, thanks... I asked on #launchpad and kiko said: just upload it again :-)
<mruiz> geser, I'll change the version number
<frafu> dholbach: I already replaced the sync term with upgrade in the title of the bug
<mruiz> dholbach, thanks anyway
<dholbach> thanks frafu
<asac> RainCT: its ok
<RainCT> asac: cool, thx :)
<ScottK> persia: For tovid: It looks to me like the build-depends should be build-depends-indep (except debhelper and cbds).  Is there a reason against that I'm missing?
<frafu> RainCT:  I can also add the mousetweaks_2.21.91-0ubuntu1.diff.gz that was created by debuild to the bug; this way the sponsor can choose what he wants. Should I do it?
<RainCT> frafu: why not? :)
<frafu> RainCT: ok
<tuxmaniac> is somebody able to access http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/multidistrotools/science.html ?
<LucidFox> tbutter> commented on jodviewer
<frafu> RainCT: diff.gz attached to bug; I hope that this time everything is correct for review by a sponsor
<tbutter> LucidFox: thanks
<tuxmaniac> can somebody review http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=alliance
<RainCT> frafu: give me the URL and I'll look at it later
<warp10> tuxmaniac: looks like ubuntwire is still down. :(
<tuxmaniac> warp10, aah ok
<tuxmaniac> warp10, hello btw
<warp10> tuxmaniac: hey, how are you doing? :)
<tbutter> LucidFox: it does not work without the jodviewer.dirs
<frafu> RainCT: here is the url with the upgrade bug https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mousetweaks/+bug/190957 Thanks for looking at it
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 190957 in mousetweaks "[Upgrade from GNOME] mousetweaks-2.21.91 (diff.gz supplied)" [Undecided,New]
<tbutter> install -m 755 jodviewer.sh debian/jodviewer/usr/bin/jodviewer
<tbutter> install: cannot create regular file `debian/jodviewer/usr/bin/jodviewer': No such file or directory
<tuxmaniac> warp10, inching closer and closer towards your karma! slow but steady :-)
<warp10> tuxmaniac: I have seen you did a lot of good work for MOTU science. Well done! ;)
<frafu> RainCT: and here is the url of the upstream source: http://ftp.gnome.org/pub/GNOME/sources/mousetweaks/2.21/mousetweaks-2.21.91.tar.gz
<LucidFox> tbutter> try install -m -d
<LucidFox> (although I won't object if you want to just leave the dirs files)
<geser> LucidFox: wouldn't be -D better than -d?
<tbutter> it must be -D
<geser> if I understand the manpage correctly -d will create a directory named debian/jodviewer/usr/bin/jodviewer
<tbutter> works. thanks
<mruiz> geser, I've uploaded a new revision ;-) (bug 187726)
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 187726 in doc-debian "[FTBFS] doc-debian (gs: not found) / failed to upload" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/187726
<LucidFox> ScottK, reuploaded tovid with your objection addressed
<geser> mruiz: looks ok, just curious: why the bump of standards?
<mruiz> geser, to avoid lintian warnings
<ScottK> There are very few 3.7.2.2/3.7.3 differences, so the bump can almost always be done without change.
<geser> mruiz: did you check if any of the changes in the new policies affect this package?
<geser> ScottK: that one was from 3.6.2.0 to 3.7.3
<mruiz> geser, well I can maintain the version and minimizing the changes for the future sync/merge
<ScottK> Ah
<geser> mruiz: I'm just checking if you checked if any on the policy changes affect this package.
<geser> mruiz: imho a change from tetex to texlive in the build-depends would be also welcomed (but's that no request that you must do it)
<mruiz> geser, I didn't check them :-(
<mruiz> geser, but in most cases the policy should be updated to the latest
<geser> mruiz: yes, I don't expect that the package needs any changes for the new standards version but it's better to check
 * mruiz reading
<mruiz> geser, I prefer to maintain the policy version (and wait for Debian changes)
<effie_jayx> mruiz,  I think I dunnit https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/kipina/+bug/190992 :D
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 190992 in kipina "New Upstream version: 0.2.2" [Undecided,New]
<mruiz> geser, then my last revision includes only the change to obtain the binary upload :-)
 * mruiz -> lunch!
<geser> mruiz: uploaded
<mruiz> thanks geser ... time for lunch!
<kdub> packaging jam in half an hour?
<rhpot1991_laptop> anyone have some time to give me a 2nd revu on a package?
<sboden> Is there actually an order of reviewing submissions? or a deadline or so?
<linux__alien> hi LucidFox
<LucidFox> hi linux__alien
<rhpot1991_laptop> either of you have revu powers?
<jcfp> hi all
<jcfp> when I have a source that creates three binary package (a main program and two extra themes that depend on the main package), is it ok to use a single copyright file and link to that from the theme packages?
<linux__alien> LucidFox, any other thing that i could start working on
<sistpoty|work> jcfp: no, the copyright file must always be uncompressed in the corresponding binary package
<linux__alien> LucidFox,I ve an idea. I feel the kchmviewer could be ported to Gnome i dont mind in which release it would come but just thought that would be a good idea . i am aware of the fact that gnome has got xchm and gnome chm viewer but the kchm viewer has got added functionality
<linux__alien> what do you think about this ?
<jcfp> sistpoty|work: in that case, should there be one copyright file covering all of the source package or a seperate one targeted specifically at the content of each binary package?
<LucidFox> linux__alien> I'm going to sleep soon, sadly... However, I have an easy bug for you to try uploading a patch for: bug #189584
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 189584 in ddtp-ubuntu "Typo" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/189584
<linux__alien> LucidFox, are you from india?
<LucidFox> no, from Russia
<LucidFox> why did you think I was from India? o_O
<linux__alien> In India its night time so thought :)
<sistpoty|work> jcfp: the copyright file must represent the copyright for both the binary package(s) and the contents of the source package. While you could then have different copyright files for the binary packages, you'll almost always want to have just one for all.
<linux__alien> LucidFox, Thanks for that i ll start working on it :)
<linux__alien> LucidFox, it will be a real good learning for me :)
<linux__alien> LucidFox, i ll take a day's time for this and hopefully i should have something good. :)
<frafu> I will be back in about an hour
<jcfp> sistpoty|work: thanks. in that case I'll use a single copyright file describing all files in the source package, with copies of that file included in and installed by all binary packages.
<linux__alien> LucidFox, I am having problems with banshee music player all of a sudden its stopped playing songs
<linux__alien> i want to know how to correct the problem
<asac> RainCT: ?
<crevette> hello
<RainCT> asac: I've the upgraded scrapbook package ready but if I try installig it Firefox (2 and 3) don't list it in the Add-ons window (after restarting). Is this normal, or any idea what the problem could be? Here is the list of files that it installs: http://paste.ubuntu.com/4435/plain/
<LucidFox> linux__alien> Why ask me?
<LucidFox> I never even used Banshee
<linux__alien> ok sorry
<linux__alien> just wanted to know the idea of porting kchmviewer to gnome ?
<asac> RainCT: no thats not normal
<asac> RainCT: you see anything in Tools error console?
<asac> RainCT: otherwise please post the install.rdf
<asac> and the chrome.manifest
<bddebian> Heya gang
<sistpoty|work> hi bddebian
<RainCT> asac: the only error I've there that is from no website is "bc is null" in chrome://global/content/console.js
<bddebian> Hi sistpoty|work
<asac> RainCT: post install.rdf then
<RainCT> asac: install.rdf: http://paste.ubuntu.com/4436/plain/
<RainCT> asac: chrome.manifest: http://paste.ubuntu.com/4437/plain/
<asac> RainCT: the name of the link you create in the extensions directory _must match_ the em:id
<asac> RainCT: in your case it must not be scrapbook, but "{53A03D43-5363-4669-8190-99061B2DEBA5}"
<asac> e.g. ./usr/lib/firefox-addons/extensions/scrapbook -> ../../../share/scrapbook
<asac> oops
<asac> e.g. ./usr/lib/firefox-addons/extensions/{53A03D43-5363-4669-8190-99061B2DEBA5} -> ../../../share/scrapbook
<asac> RainCT: then it should work
<RainCT> asac: oh, okay. thanks!
<linux__alien> ok LucidFox got to go will work on this and will let you know tomorrow and thanks for your help
<RainCT> asac: is there any reason why they use such ugly names? :P
<asac> no ... just for legacy reasons
<crevette> superm1: I did the change you requested yesterday
<crevette> hello by the way
<crevette> :)
<geser> Hi bddebian
 * sistpoty|work is on the way home
<sistpoty|work> cya
<kdub> from within pbuilder, i get an permissions error when it is trying to install the package to the fakeroot system. can you put a 'sudo' command in the debian/rules file to work around this?
<geser> kdub: please pastebin the error message
<kdub> geser: http://pastebin.ca/900158
<crevette> some can review my package ? this is obex-data-server
<crevette> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=obex-data-server
<bddebian> Heya geser
<kdub> geser: it uses 'jam' to build the package as opposed to the standard make
<rhpot1991_laptop> can I get a 2nd revu when someone gets a chance: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=atomicparsley
<geser> kdub: 1) you shouldn't install outside the build dir (here /usr/local) and 2) you shouldn't install packages into /usr/local
<kdub> geser: do you think this is too complicated for a first package?
<geser> kdub: I don't know jam and how hard it is to fix the paths
<geser> kdub: the package should install files below /usr and during the build the package gets build from the files in debian/<pkgname>/
<kdub> geser: i'm just going to try another package
<nxvl_work> did someone uses google calendar?
<AstralJava> nxvl_work: Sort of. Why do you ask?
<nxvl_work> AstralJava: i can't open it on my ubuntu box
<nxvl_work> using firefox
<AstralJava> What are the symptoms?
<AstralJava> Opens fine on Fluxbuntu+Kazehakase.
<nxvl_work> mm
<nxvl_work> on the source code it says my firefox isn't compatible
<nxvl_work> i will report it
<AstralJava> Weird.
<kdub> geser: could you elaborate a little more on what you said about where files are installed within the fakeroot environment?
<hefe_bia> If somebody could have a look at http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=tomboy-blogposter that would make me very happy ;)
<geser> kdub: all debs should install their files below /usr/ but not /usr/local
<kdub> so if i wanted to, then "cp <anything> /usr/bin" should work?
<geser> kdub: during build (e.g. with pbuilder or on the buildds) the installation doesn't happen to the "final" directory but into a "temporary" directory below debian/<pkgname>. From there the deb in then packed/build.
<geser> kdub: no, if you want to install a file in /usr/bin/ then "cp <anything> debian/<pkgname>/usr/bin" and the deb will install it later correctly in /usr/bin
<kdub> geser: thanks, i think i understand, but we'll see for sure in a minute
<geser> kdub: you can always "spy" how other package do it, packages similar to yours are better suited to look at
<kdub> geser: i'm trying to understand better with a simple little package i've been looking at now
<goobsoft> When creating a python package that loads a glade file for the interface via a hard coded path that does not comply with the debian python policy, it is best to change the source code directly or is there some other way of pointing to resources like glade files and images?
<kdub> now it looks like it build a package, but i can't find a deb anywhere...
<geser> kdub: how did you build the package? with pbuilder?
<kdub> geser: yes, and thanks for being so patient
<geser> kdub: pbuilder puts the build debs to /var/cache/pbuilder/result
<cody-somerville> by default
<kdub> geser: thanks! there they all are...
<Nightrose> hey tricia :)
<tricia> ello
<kdub> and so now that i have a package, i should clean up all the lintian messages before submitting it to revu?
<ScottK2> Yes
<geser> kdub: yes please, as one of the reviewers will point you to them anyways
<goobsoft> In python programs are absolute paths to images usually hard coded into the source?
<cbx33> hey all, just out of interest what window managers do you guys use?
<_MMA_> cbx33: You here to pimp OpenBox again? :P
<cbx33> no
<cbx33> thinking of trying out a tiled window manager
 * cbx33 is all over the shot
<cbx33> ;)
<_MMA_> Yeah, I forget what that was called.
<cbx33> howz it going _MMA_ ??
<cbx33> there's one called awesome
<_MMA_> Fine. :)
<cbx33> good good
 * _MMA_ just uses Terminator and uses the CLI apps but wanted to tinker with a tiled WM.
<cbx33> Terminator?
<_MMA_> Ng's multi-pane terminal app.
<_MMA_> Its on LP. Grab trunk and build it. Super easy.
<cbx33> cool
<cbx33> i guess I should try out more terminal apps
<cbx33> but how do you like copy and paste between them?
<_MMA_> It actually made me like them more for some reason.
<_MMA_> Works like gnome-terminal.
<_MMA_> ctrl+shift+v and or c.
<cbx33> hmmm
<cbx33> cool
<cbx33> so
<cbx33> what terminal program do you use?
<cbx33> maybe I'll get awesome
<cbx33> it looks pretty.....awesome
<_MMA_> He has a channel also. #terminator.
<cbx33> cool
<cbx33> you can tag windows
<cbx33> seemed pretty cool
<cbx33> what do you use to browse the web?
<cbx33> links lynx ?
<cbx33> does terminator use it's own terminall app ??? like gnome terminal....do you still use a mouse?
<_MMA_> I just use it for cli apps. I havnt gone as far as to try lynx.
<_MMA_> terminator *is* a terminal. It just uses panes instead of tabs or anything.
<_MMA_> Try it. Its nice.
<msix> is this the right place to ask : can i speedup pbuilder in a way like make-kpkg with CONCURRENCY_LEVEL ?
<emgent> hehya ernesto! :D
<mok0> Would someone please change the status of bug 173507 to "Fix committed"?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 173507 in ubuntu "[needs-packaging] torque" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/173507
<rulus> mok0: anyone can change bug statuses :)
<mok0> They can?
<cody-somerville> If you're logged in, yes.
<rulus> sure, as is anyone who has a LP account
<mok0> Heh, you're right
<rulus> s/is/in
<mok0> I'll do it myself, heh
<mok0> Just trying to clear out my bug list on LP :-)
<HighNo> Hi y'all. could any motu please check http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=blueproximity ? There's still one advocate missing...
<mok0> HighNo: yay, you got one
<sboden> Is there an order in which uploads to revu are reviewed, or is it just at random?
<HighNo> mok0: yes, finally. They like to integrate it into mythbuntu too
<cbx33> is it possible to get coloured syntax highlighting in nano?
<cbx33> and to stop it wrapping lines when they reach the edge of the window?
<tsmithe> hey persia, thanks for the work on fluid-soundfont :)
<tsmithe> cbx33, nano -w for the latter
<HighNo> cbx33:  nano -w
<cbx33> cool
<cbx33> thanks
<HighNo> tsmithe:  beaten my by a second :)
<tsmithe> heh
<hexmode> geser: could you look at http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=php-xdebug one more time?
<cbx33> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=62250 - how come we don't have the examples directory in gutsy?
<blueyed> hexmode: I just wanted to look at it, too - if you don't mind.. ;)
<hexmode> blueyed: the more the merrier!
<blueyed> hexmode: please indent the license, and put the copyright to the Copyright line.
<blueyed> (in debian/copyright)
<hexmode> blueyed: could you clarify "put the copyright to the copyright line"??
<hexmode> move it up?
<tsmithe> is anyone reviewing? if so, could someone take a look at fluid-soundfont. it's a very simple package, and has one advocation already: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=fluid-soundfont
<blueyed> yes, write "Copyright: ....\nLicense: ..." or similar (and the license indented by e.g. 4 spaces)
<hexmode> arg... gotcha
<blueyed> hexmode: I've seen that you had some changelog xml file and a commented out xsltproc for it. Didn't it work out? Would be nice to have an upstream changelog. Regarding this, the file for dh_installchangelog (debian/Changelog) does not seem to exist?
<blueyed> hexmode: for (your) debian/changelog, just write "Initial release" and refer to a needs-packaging bug in LP.
<hexmode> blueyed: the changelog is generated from the upstream using dh-make-php's pecl parser
<hexmode> is the convention for talking about LP bugs something like "Fixes LP #..." ???
<blueyed> hexmode: great, haven't checked closely, sorry.. just write "Initial release (LP: #189928)"
<hexmode> np ty
<amarillion> Question: can I use reportbug on ubuntu to file Debian ITP's?
<amarillion> When I try " reportbug --email my@emaill wnpp"
<amarillion> It complains that wnpp is not found
<blueyed> amarillion: try "reportbug -B debian"
<amarillion> ah
<amarillion> cool that seems to work, thankx
<geser> hexmode: php-xdebug commented
<hexmode> geser: tyvm
<hexmode> geser: tyvm
<hexmode> oops ;)
<tsmithe> geser, could you check out fluid-soundfont, please? it's got one advocation already from persia
<blueyed> Is it ok to advocate own packages? Or is it considered bad practice? I've done for "jedit" now..
<tsmithe> blueyed, i think it's ok for motus
<rhpot1991_laptop> geser: if you have time atomicparsley should be an easy revu too, superm1 already helped me out with it
<tsmithe> blueyed, (if you're reviewing... fluid-soundfont?)
<geser> blueyed: MOTUs need only one ACK
<tsmithe> i'll shut up now; gotta kill X to check for power usage
<rhpot1991_laptop> hmmm I thought they needed 2 ACK's
<blueyed> rhpot1991_laptop: yes, but they can give one ACK themselves it seems.
<rhpot1991_laptop> ah ok, I get it
<HighNo> blueyed: do you have bluetooth or trust in superm1? :-) I'm still looking for the second advocate for my package... And since your name is so close to my package's name (blueproximity)
<mok0> slangasek: ping
<slangasek> mok0: moo
<mok0> slangasek: hey, I was thinking about merging dbmail, is that ok with you?
<HighNo> mok0 is back! You've been away too quick. My answer was: yes, finally. They like to integrate it into mythbuntu too
<HighNo> mok0: now guess what the question was... :-)
<leonel> mok0: please !!!
<blueyed> HighNo: nice try :) - I have no bluetooth though.. I'll look into some package in the next days though, so don't fear.. ;)
<mok0> leonel: please what?
<leonel> mok0: i was going to ask for that merge  even  there are issues with the new postgresql 8.3
<HighNo> blueyed: all i fear is the 14th of feb...
<mok0> leonel: what are the issues?
<mok0> HighNo: you'll make it
<slangasek> mok0: my only change to that package was to rebuild it against the newer ldap, so from my POV, feel free
<HighNo> mok0: thanks for the support :-)
<leonel> mok0: http://www.dbmail.org/mantis/view.php?id=678
<mok0> slangasek: cool, I'll give it a whirl
<mok0> leonel: thx
<amarillion> grrr reportbug doesn't work
<amarillion> Why can't debian use a web interface like normal people?
<geser> amarillion: how doesn't reportbug not work?
<slangasek> amarillion: if reportbug doesn't work, it's possible to write email bug reports by hand too...?
<geser> amarillion: because Debian is special
<slangasek> (because Debian doesn't want bug reports from people they aren't guaranteed to be able to send questions back to, really...)
<RainCT> why is this failing to build? http://launchpadlibrarian.net/11876178/buildlog_ubuntu-hardy-hppa.scrapbook_1.3.2.5-2ubuntu1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<sboden> anyone wants to give kmess a spin?
<ScottK> slangasek: Makes me wonder what Debian is doing to prevent forged email addresses then.
<slangasek> ScottK: in practice? discarding the bug reports when the replies bounce :)
<ScottK> Makes sense I suppose.
<jcfp> MOTUs, please review http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=sabnzbdplus - based on new upstream release with lots of improvements, package should be in good shape now.
<geser> RainCT: could it be the new dpkg? it seems to break also other builds
<blueyed> RainCT, geser: yes, seems so.. I've also broken builds..
<ScottK> sboden: If I'm an MSN user, why do I want kmess instead of Kopete?
<ScottK> sboden: I'm also a bit confused ...  Is this package in Ubuntu already?
<sboden> in ubuntu it's now v1.4.3... update is for v1.5
<sboden> v1.5 of kmess fixes some bugs and completes the MSN functionality... you can do nudges, custom icons, ... which you can't do with kopete. It's also the last version of kmess before v2.0 which is KDE4
<ScottK> OK.  Sounds reasonable.
<sboden> I followed the upgrade template ... use v1.4.3 of ubuntu, copy debian log to v1.5 and repackage. It should be pretty straightforward
<ScottK> sboden: For a new upstream version, the preferred method is .diff.gz attached to a bug, not REVU.
<jpatrick> geser: should I add it to /topic (broken builds?)
<ScottK> jpatrick: Do you have time to help sboden with getting Kmess upgraded?
<method__> what does something like this mean? dpkg-source: error: source package has two conflicting values - libzoom-ruby and zoom
<jpatrick> ScottK: don't think so...
<geser> method__: do debian/control and debian/changelog agree about the source package name?
<method__> Good call, geser, thanks.
<ScottK> sboden: I believe someone will be along to help you shortly.
<sboden> k thx
<leonel> mok0: will you do the dbmail  merge  ?
<method__> What does it mean when pbuilder/apt complains about : Depends: libyaz3-dev which is a virtual package.
<method__> ?
<crevette> hi there, what happening to my package ? http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=obex-data-server
<apachelogger_> method__: basically that it doesn't exist, I guess
<apachelogger_> sboden: hey, I am the promised someone ;-)
<sboden> apachelogger_: lol ... go ahead
<apachelogger_> sboden: you created the package already?
<HighNo> crevette: maybe it just got approved? will approved packages just vanish from REVU?
<sboden> I uploaded it a couple of days ago to revu (it's under updates)... I just used the general distribution of kmess 1.5
<apachelogger_> hm
<sboden> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=kmess
<crevette> HighNo: it is not possible no one has advocated it
<apachelogger_> sboden: did you testbuild it?
<sboden> yes
<crevette> jsut before It tried to upload it, but the upload was stucked for 10 min
<apachelogger_> sboden: saved the log? ;-)
<sboden> apachelogger_: mmm, not from terminal... is it logged somewhere
<apachelogger_> not by default, well, I have to build it anyway
<sboden> I followed the "upgrade template" for packaging and it went through without problems
<sboden> I also run kmess 1.5 on this computer
<HighNo> persia: could you check for the missing obex-data-server - might be a mess on REVU?
<apachelogger_> sboden: usually you would create a bug report and attach the diff.gz (maybe also the .dsc) and a pbuilder log, subscribe ubuntu-universe-sponsors and that should be it
<sboden> ah.... that was not mentioned in the docs
<HighNo> crevette: did you check the error message?
<HighNo> crevette: maybe it works if reuploaded?
<apachelogger_> sboden: yeah, I just looked, didn't find anything either
<crevette> HighNo: no error message, "Successfully uploaded packages"
<persia> HighNo: How is it "missing"?
<apachelogger_> sboden: bug 179931 is a good example in my opinion
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 179931 in gnome-compiz-manager "gnome-compiz-manager new upstream version: 0.10.4" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/179931
<HighNo> persia: check the error on http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=obex-data-server
<sboden> apachelogger_: do you want me to create a "wishlist" for kmess 1.5?
<HighNo> persia: but it might be gone with the next refresh cycle as dput now managed to upload it successfully (as dput calls it)
<persia> HighNo: Yes.  A new upload will almost always fix that.
<apachelogger_> sboden: probably a good idea to keep track of the process
<HighNo> persia: cool, thanks.
<crevette> persia: I should reupload ?
<crevette> persia: and afterward you'll advocate my package :)
 * persia is now confused
<persia> crevette: I certainly don't have time for a review now, sorry.
<RainCT> good night
<pochu> night RainCT
<HighNo> crevette: hehe - nice trick. but you see, persia can't do that because he would be advocating my package first :-)
<crevette> persia: no problemo :)
<persia> But, I would like to see the package shown on REVU.  Was there an upload since 21:30 UTC?
<HighNo> persia: it should be there in ca. 2 minutes
<apachelogger_> sboden: version would be 1.5-0ubuntu1
<apachelogger_> since it is the first ubuntu revision of 1.5
<apachelogger_> and not yet available in debian
<HighNo> apachelogger_: so the 0 means no debian ?
<apachelogger_> HighNo: well, actually it means no debian revision of this version/package
<apachelogger_> debian would use 1.5-1 for the first revision of this version/package
<HighNo> apachelogger_: so it would be filled for debian synced packages, right=
<apachelogger_> well, a _synced_ package will have exactly the same version as in debian
<HighNo> crevette: maybe you should try to upload it once more. It did not correctly show up during this refresh cycle...
<apachelogger_> if debian has 1.5-6 then a sync would have 1.5-6 as well
<apachelogger_> but if it is a merge, or the package gets changed post-sync it gets an ubuntuX attached
<sboden> apachelogger_: in debian they now have 1.5 rc2 in experimental, I launched some requests to go to 1.5 as well in debian, but debian is harder to "reach"... so maybe better wait for debian to go to v1.5 first?
<HighNo> ahaaaa, /me feels some enlightenment
<apachelogger_> :)
<ScottK> Since feature freeze is Thursday, I wouldn't wait.
<apachelogger_> +1
<slangasek> apachelogger_: you seem to have subscribed ubuntu-archive to bug #191023, but aren't listed as a member of ubuntu-backporters?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 191023 in gutsy-backports "Please backport dragonplayer 2.0-0ubuntu1" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/191023
<HighNo> crevette: if you upload it now and it won't show up in 7 mins you have to ring the operator again :-)
<apachelogger_> after that you need to file a featurefreeze exception request
<apachelogger_> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess#head-30ede7e753a6b6f62916161755507d4cc5d99e20
<crevette> HighNo: okay
<ScottK> slangasek: Riddell asked him to do that earlier today.  Given that the package turned out to FTBFS (IIRC), I'd suggest usubscribe the archive.
<apachelogger_> slangasek: Riddell saied i just should assign ubuntu-archvie so he can take care of it tomorrow
<persia> HighNo: crevette: It didn't appear to refresh on the 10-minute mark.  Perhaps something useful can be rescued from http://revu.tauware.de/revu1-incoming/obex-data-server-0802111920/ and something reuploaded?
<slangasek> ScottK: ah, ok; done then
<HighNo> persia: I think crevette has reuploaded it afterwards already once
<persia> Looks like the immediate upload was a .dsc file, but didn't include the relevant .changes file.
<HighNo> persia: for the records - dput had broken the upload - it froze
<gilir> hi
<gilir> REVU is still broken for me :( http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=awn-extras-applets
<sboden> Made launchpad request for kmess 1.5: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/kmess/+bug/191092
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 191092 in kmess "Upgrade Kmess to v1.5" [Wishlist,Confirmed]
<persia> gilir: You're in the same situation.  reupload based on http://revu.tauware.de/revu1-incoming/awn-extras-applets-0801100020/
<gilir> persia: I already reuploaded it, I had the same error
<persia> Any REVU Hackers around who might be able to investigate?
<crevette> persia: this is still not work
<crevette> who can I contact ?
<dcordero> hi
<persia> crevette: It's beyond me.  Needs a REVU Hacker to look into the source of the error, and likely a patch.  Asking here is best (as has been done).
<crevette> too bad, I've found someone to advocate me
<crevette> :)
<apache|mobile> sboden: can you please change the version number and attach the diff.gz to the bug report?
<sboden> apache|mobile: ok, I'm rebuilding the package now wih changed version number
<apachelogger_> sboden: oh and please attach (LP: #191092) to your changelog entry, so it gets closed automatically
<HighNo> crevette: they won't forget you - obex-data-server is an important package
<crevette> HighNo: arf
<crevette> this is a brand new one, I'm not sure someone cares
<crevette> :)
<HighNo> crevette: it is brand new? how come I think to know it for years? It's taking the server-part for filetransfers via IR and bluetooth, right=
<crevette> yeah for obex protocol, but it's anew one
<crevette> it's a new dep for bluez-gnome for bluetooth-sento
<crevette> this is just a DBUS service
<HighNo> crevette: ah, ok.
<HighNo> crevette: so it's a dep for bluez-gnome? then it should be even more important?!
<hexmode> blueyed, geser: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=php-xdebug fixed up the copyright file for multiple copyright/licenses.  Looked at apparmor's copyright file for clues.
<crevette> HighNo: I guess
<HighNo> crevette: just posted the request in #ubuntu-mobile again but that is more of an idle channel...
<crevette> HighNo: thanks
<crevette> butIt's gonna be hard if my package is not available on revu
<crevette> :)
<sboden> apachelogger: just uploaded a new version of kmess to revu (http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=kmess), diffs attached the launchpad request
<emgent> heya people
 * persia notes that there is little value to the duplication.  Just attaching the diff should be sufficient.
<apachelogger_> sboden: persia is quite right there :)
<HighNo> crevette: do you know when the upload before the broken upload has taken part?
<apache|mobile> sboden: please change "launchpad request 191092" to "(LP: #191092)" otherwise the bug will not be closed
<apache|mobile> looks good otherwise
<jussi01> where did that page go that listed things to do to help, including links to bitesize bugs etc?
<sboden> apachelogger: I just used dput ... do I make a diff then on the original, or on the changes?
<apachelogger_> sboden: just do debuild -S -sa
<apachelogger_> ...within the source tree
<apachelogger_> ...this will generate the dsc and diff.gz
<apachelogger_> then just upload the diff.gz
<sboden> via manual ftp?
<apachelogger_> sboden: no, just attach it to bug report :)
<apachelogger_> persia: so much about diff.gz is less confusing than interdiff ;-)
<sboden> apachelogger: and still as 0unbuntu1?
<apachelogger_> sboden: of course
<persia> apachelogger_: Yes.
<apachelogger_> sboden: the revisions only get changed if the package has been uploaded to the ubuntu archives
<crevette> HighNo: no
<CarlFK> what is the cause of this? (so I can bugreport it) juser@averatec:~/src/transcode/transcode-1.0.5$ debchange --nmu updeb.carl
<CarlFK> utf8 "\xF6" does not map to Unicode at /usr/bin/debchange line 963, <S> chunk 1.
<sboden> apachelogger: changed comment, ran debuild and attached new diff to LP
<HighNo> crevette: I'm sorry I can't help any further. I just noted that while it should give you a directory and no error http://revu.tauware.de/revu1-incoming/obex-data-server-0802112200/ gives a 404, while checking that with my package gives a nice directory index. So there is a severe problem in revu handling that broken upload. We need help of a REVU god in here...
<persia> HighNo: No, just a REVU Hacker to compare the database state against the code and determine what happened.
<crevette> I'm trying to update once to se what happen
<TheMuso> ember: I have orca covered.
<ScottK> Do we need to add something like dpkg broken, don't upload to /topic?
<ember> TheMuso cool
<ember> i was about to poke you about it
<ember> lol
<apachelogger_> sboden: are you sure you uploaded the correct diff.gz? ;-)
<slangasek> ScottK: no reason not to upload, any uploads will just become part of a mass-giveback
<ScottK> slangasek: OK.  Thanks.
<sboden> appachelogger: to launchpad yes, should I also upload it to revu manually?
<sboden> apachelogger: log is now "+  * Upgrade kmess from v1.4.3 to v1.5 (LP #191092)" (from the latest diff)
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 191092 in kmess "Upgrade Kmess to v1.5" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/191092
<apachelogger_> sboden: ah, my fault :)
<persia> sboden: There's no point in uploading to two places: it just confuses the reviewers.  If you've attached it to the bug, use that.
<sboden> persia: I originally did a dput (which puts it on revu), but a some messages ago I was told to attach it to launchpad ;)
<HighNo> persia: OK, that's what I tried to say. I didn't know the REVU hackers are seperated from a (un-)known REVU god... ;-)
<persia> sboden: Right, so once you start attaching to launchpad, there's no reason to also push to REVU (it just makes me press the archive button again)
<sboden> persia: ok, so the original upload is still at revu, and I only added the latest diff to LP
<apachelogger_> sboden: or not my fault, download the diff.gz and have a look at it ... it still doesn't say (LP:...
<persia> sboden: Right (although the REVU upload is archived)
<gaspa> sorry all, i can't resist... :)
<gaspa> [_slightly_ OT] http://maps.google.com/maps?client=safari&q=Strada+dei+Campi,+34072+Gorizia,+Friuli-Venezia+Giulia,+Italia&ie=UTF8&oe=UTF-8&ll=45.910317,13.506725&spn=0.004337,0.007864&t=h&z=17&om=0
<jpatrick> gaspa: ?
<RAOF> crimsun: Any results on multiarch alsa-plugins?
<crimsun> RAOF: not until fixed dpkg hits the archives.
<RAOF> crimsun: Oh, snap.
<gaspa> jpatrick: it's a hymn to the gentle sex... :P
<slangasek> so by "slightly OT", you mean "entirely and without equivocation, OT"
<jpatrick> !ot > gaspa
<DarkSun88> !ot | gaspa
<ubotu> gaspa: #ubuntu is the Ubuntu support channel, #ubuntu+1 supports the development version of Ubuntu and #ubuntu-offtopic is for random chatter. Welcome!
<jpatrick> DarkSun88: did that :-)
<crevette> HighNo: it seems my updates are uploaded in http://revu.tauware.de/revu1-incoming/-yymmhhmmss
<crevette> look at http://revu.tauware.de/revu1-incoming/-0802112250/
<ScottK> \sh_away: New octave in Debian Experimental ....
<gaspa> DarkSun88: :)
<sboden> apachelogger/persia: now I double checked, I had attached the original one again before
<apachelogger_> sboden: see comment :)
<sboden> apachelogger: I don't even see the entry anymore under updates :(
<persia> sboden: Check the LP bug :)
<sboden> apachelogger: thank you :D
<crevette> HighNo: I'm going to sleep no, if you can make someone figures out and correct that I'll be thanksfull
<sboden> also going to bed, cu later guys
<DktrKranz> I'm having this FTBFS http://launchpadlibrarian.net/11875848/buildlog_ubuntu-hardy-i386.etoile_0%2B20060914%2Bdfsg-2_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz and I'm unable to reproduce in pbuilder. Does anyone know a workaround?
<soren> DktrKranz: I broke it..
<soren> DktrKranz: It's the new dpkg. I uploaded a fix 18 minutes ago. You need to wait until it's built and published. Sorry.
<DktrKranz> soren, thanks for the pointer, you saved me plenty of time! :)
<DktrKranz> soren, is version 1.14.16.6ubuntu1 the buggy one?
<soren> DktrKranz: Yes.
<DktrKranz> soren, I guess I'm unable to see your new revision due to the discussion in -devel
<soren> DktrKranz: Right. It appears to have gotten lost somewhere.
<DktrKranz> ok, I'll wait for ubuntu2 then, thanks again.
<soren> DktrKranz: No worries. Sorry for the trouble.
<RAOF> persia: New gnome-do release on revu, now with honest-to-goodness Tomboy license header.
<persia> RAOF: I'm tight on time now.  I'll hit it in ~12 hours if nobody else has.
<RAOF> persia: Absolutely fine.  I'll get the plugins package up there to and ping the room.
<dcordero> hi
<dcordero> hi DktrKranz
<DktrKranz> hola dcordero :)
<dcordero> :)
<dcordero> did you see the warning message on my bug?
<Flare183> !es
<ubotu> Si busca ayuda en espaÃ±ol por favor entre en los canales #ubuntu-es o #kubuntu-es, allÃ­ obtendrÃ¡ mÃ¡s ayuda.
<bddebian> So what's going to be the drop dead date for syncs from Debian?  The 14th?
<dcordero> Flare183, was only a hi for me that i am spanish, DktrKranz speak english :)
<leonel> scottK:  here we go again  :   WARNING: Local version: 0.92 Recommended version: 0.92.1    checking  if there's some thing to fix for  the ubuntu  versions
<Flare183> ok just making sure
<DktrKranz> :)
<DktrKranz> dcordero, I didn't receive any bugmail... I though to be subscribed...
<dcordero> ups
<DktrKranz> let me check
<dcordero> ok
<DktrKranz> dcordero, I'm subscribed *NOW* :)
<dcordero> haha better
<DktrKranz> dcordero, I'll test build myself
<dcordero> ok, the warning messages are only showed on hardy
<slangasek> DktrKranz: Flare183 ya se fue, podemos charlar en apaÃ±ol sin molestias \o/
<DktrKranz> slangasek, my spanish stops at "hola" :)
<dcordero> slangasek, el espaÃ±ol soy yo :)
<slangasek> DktrKranz: pff, what a tease you are then
<slangasek> :)
<DktrKranz> slangasek, my italian rox, though :P
<emgent> lol
<slangasek> mine doesn't, it flounders
<DktrKranz> sudo apt-get install language-support-it
<dcordero> i wish to learn language just with an apt-get install :)
<dcordero> it's like matrix haha
<leonel> scottK * libclamav/pe.c: fix possible integer overflow (CVE-2008-0318)
<ubotu> ** RESERVED ** This candidate has been reserved by an organization or individual that will use it when announcing a new security problem.  When the candidate has been publicized, the details for this candidate will be provided. (http://cve.mitre.org/cgi-bin/cvename.cgi?name=CVE-2008-0318)
<mok0> ubotu, bug 191096  > leonel
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 191096 in ubuntu "[needs-merge] dbmail_2.2.9-1" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/191096
#ubuntu-motu 2008-02-12
<mok0> leonel: I patched it according to the bugreport
<leonel> mok0:   Great ..
<leonel> mok0: that means that it will be or  is merged to hardy ?
<leonel> mok0:  that change don't affect  other DBs ?
<mok0> leonel: it shouldnt
<mok0> leonel: we'll have to test it
<leonel> mok0: paul said that  the table  dbmail_aliases needed a change  ..
<ScottK> leonel: I'm looking at hardy.  Please look at Dapper/Feisty/Gutsy.
<leonel> scottK i'm on it
<leonel> scottK do you have the LP bug # ?
<mok0> leonel: I changed it
<mok0> leonel: I mean the code, not the table itself
<mok0> leonel:  I just uploaded the patch, it hasn't been merged yet
<leonel> mok0: do you need help to test it ?
<mok0> leonel: please
<leonel> mok0:  let me finish with clamav  ..  and i'll test that diff
<mok0> leonel: cool thx
<kdub> can i license the packaging under the GPL if the software is licensed under apache?
<blueyed> hexmode: I've commented php-xdebug, only minor issues left.
<TheMuso> Nice. New nautilus shoudl see new windows for sbuild mounts no longer popping up.
<soren> \o/
<superm1> TheMuso, how'd that get resolved?
<TheMuso> superm1: In the new upstream version. I'm not 100% sure that it is, but from the changelog, it looks to be.
<TheMuso> We'll see once it arrives on my local mirror.
<superm1> ah
<protonchris> quick question:  I have a bug that I am about finished with.  After I attach the debdiff to the bug, what should the bug status be and should it still be assigned to me?
<superm1> TheMuso, can you look at this FTBFS: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/11878063/buildlog_ubuntu-hardy-i386.gmyth_0.7%7Esvn915-0ubuntu1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<superm1> i'm frazzled at why it failed
<TheMuso> superm1: dpkg?
<mok0> protonchris: status: confirmed, unassign yourself, subscribe u-u-s
<protonchris> mok0: Thanks.
 * TheMuso referrs superm1 to -devel.
<slangasek> superm1: because soren broke the world, we should see a mass-giveback soon
<superm1> slangasek, ah, someone should set that in /t
<TheMuso> Theres always one dpkg issue per cycle. :p
<jdong> superm1: the entire world is broken
<jdong> superm1: sit still and wait for the deities to debootstrap you :)
<jdong> (wait that sounded questionable)
<mok0> wait... if dpkg is broken, how can he create a new dpkg package to upload :-P
<TheMuso> jdong: ROFL! )
<slangasek> mok0: because it's only the interaction with pkg-create-dbgsyms which was broken, and it's possible to bypass that in the source package
<mok0> slangasek: phew
<crimsun> soren: nice!  That's as nice as when I broke the toolchain and the archive with alsa-lib.
<jdong> slangasek: I'm pretty sure it's possible enough to break dpkg enough to cause some interesting problems when trying to fix it? :)
 * mok0 is not upgrading for a while...
<TheMuso> crimsun: Howd you do that?
<jdong> mok0: nonsense, as long as they didn't break dash, ar, and tar, you'll be fine ;-)
<crimsun> TheMuso: oh, the gory details are somewhere in the ubuntu-devel IRC logs from a few releases ago.  Basically, broken path for 32-bit libs on 64-bit that screwed gcc.  Cue broken toolchain and archive for 64-bit arches.
<TheMuso> crimsun: oh lovely
<crimsun> heh, not precisely one of my brighter moments  :=)
<TheMuso> heh
<zul> crimsun: not as bad as breaking ata_piix at one point
<crimsun> zul: :=)
<zul> those were the days
<TheMuso> I don't know whts worse. Broken IDe drivers, broken toolchain, or broken dpkg that affects users.
<crimsun> it's fun and games until any one of them, and then it's just no fun and lots of beer.
<zul> you just go whoops and move on
<zul> and hopefully someone wont cane your ass :)
 * Hobbsee gets out the Long Pointy Stick of DOOM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! â¢
<zul> hi Hobbsee
 * Hobbsee pokes zul with the Long Pointy Stick of DOOM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! â¢ in greeting
<emgent> argh
<zul> ouch i already got beaten up today stop it..
<pochu> What's wrong with this? http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=obex-data-server
<leonel> scottK MANY differences  in  libclamav/pe.c   from  clamav.0.92.1 and  0.91.2   I guess the  patch should be  de diff between  0.92  and 0.92.1  right ??
<slangasek> jdong: possible yes, but this community has lots of clever folks with plenty of experience recovering from self-induced disasters ;)
<jdong> slangasek: that's always good :)
<jdong> "This one time, at Debian camp..."
<ScottK> leonel: 0.92 to 0.92.1 at most.  Even less if you can isolate the fixt.
<ScottK> Fix
 * asantoni is looking for an advocate for LP #190589
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 190589 in mixxx "New upstream release (in REVU)" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/190589
<leonel> that's what I thought
<nixternal> superm1: what's up?
<ScottK> leonel: clamav 0.92.1 is about to be uploaded to Debian, I'll sync it from there once it is for Hardy.
<leonel> scottK: Great   already have the gutsy patch  making the package to test it
<leonel> scottK do you have the LP # ?
<ScottK> leonel: I haven't filed a bug.  Feel free to file it and I'll accept your release nominations.
<leonel> scottK ok
<superm1> nixternal, okay take a look at atomic parsley
<superm1> and blueproximity
<superm1> those both looked good
<nixternal> k
<emgent> malone 189459
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 189459 in meta-gnome2 "Please merge meta-gnome 2.20.2.1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Low,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/189459
<RAOF> What was that piece of CDBS magic to make dh_install list missing files again?
<ember> --list-missing?
<nixternal> superm1: blueproximity...has version 1.2.4, which hasn't been released yet, so he is using a SVN checkout, which makes his versioning wrong
<superm1> nixternal, he is releasing it this weekend provided it is accepted
<superm1> nixternal, he is the upstream
<RAOF> ember: That'd be for dh_install.  There's some black magic to make cdbs add that to the dh_install calls.
<superm1> he adjusted some thing i had asked him to regarding what needed to be in the .orig.tar.gz
<superm1> and in case anything else cropped up he didnt want to make the upstream release until things got in here
<nixternal> well, I will approve it, but will note not to upload until 1.2.4 is released, or he fixes the version so we can upload it..how does that sound?
<nixternal> other than that, it looks good
<superm1> yeah that sounds good
<nixternal> groovy
<superm1> just tell him to ping me or you to upload it once he "does" release 1.2.4 this weekend
<superm1> in your revu comments
<nixternal> superm1: umm...aren't we like a day or 2 away from freeze?
<superm1> yeah...
<superm1> lets see if he's on right now :)
<superm1> HighNo, you here?
<nixternal> FF on Valentines day, how romantic :)
<superm1> look at the comments above ^
<nixternal> ahh, HighNo, I am adding the comments to REVU as well...so when you are ready to release the final, get it into revu so we can double check it and upload it...looks good
<leonel> scottK bug 191150
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 191150 in clamav "possible integer overflow" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/191150
<TheMuso> superm1: Have your seeds been poked at?
<TheMuso> superm1: By Colin?
<superm1> TheMuso, no should they have been?
<superm1> you mean regarding the alternate disk building?
<TheMuso> superm1: No, re making seeds more modular.
<TheMuso> Take a look at the Ubuntu seeds, and pull the latest bzr. You can work it out by looking at the STRUCTURE file.
<superm1> TheMuso, i started to this weekend
<superm1> and got rather confused by what should be put where
<TheMuso> Right, perhaps the latest ubuntu.hardy bzr may help some./
<superm1> as in some stuff has changed since the weekend?
<superm1> or as in read the docs more, i likely overlooked things?
<TheMuso> superm1: As in stuff has changed... a lot.
<superm1> TheMuso, okay then i'll pull after revu party 08 is done tonight :)
<superm1> TheMuso, you want to join?
<superm1> its just me and nixternal right now
<RAOF> Oh, dear.  CDBS was a mistake, it seems.  How do I fix the new "symlink all the docs" behaviour so that copyright will always be installed?
<TheMuso> superm1: Unfrotunately, I have some higher priority work that needs doing, but I'll do what I can if I have time once I'm done with that.
<superm1> TheMuso, sounds good :)
<nixternal> hrmm, is it recommended to use * as an unordered list starter in debian/control?
<nixternal> I thought it was recommended to use -
<superm1> its because the pdf has a space i think
<superm1> rhpot1991, ^?
<rhpot1991> for that darn rtf?
<rhpot1991> I couldn't get it to take by name cause of the space
<nixternal> no no, in the debian/control file
<nixternal> *iTunes-style metadata into .mp4, .m4a, .m4p, .m4v, .m4b files
<nixternal>   *3gp-style assets (3GPP TS 26.444 version 6.4.0 Release 6 specification
<nixternal>     conforming) in 3GPP, 3GPP2, MobileMP4 & derivatives
<nixternal> that stuff
<nixternal> I think it should be
<rhpot1991> ah ok
<nixternal>   - blah blah blah blah
<superm1> oh is there a spec for that ?
<nixternal> 2 spaces and then -
<rhpot1991> I'll hit that up in a sec, let me get my laptop up
<nixternal> superm1: not that I know of, but I remember getting a package shot back at me a couple of years ago in Debian because of it
<superm1> nixternal, ah i see.
<nixternal> just s/*/- /
<superm1> well
<nixternal> put a space after the -
<superm1> s/*/\-/g
<nixternal> TheMuso: can you second that?
<nixternal> ie. not using * but - instead when listing out features in the control file
<superm1> and if you need space than s/*/\-\ /g
<TheMuso> nixternal: Sorry I haven't been paying attention.
<nixternal> sleeping on the job :p
<ion_> \s\u\p\e\r\m\1\:\ Why is everything in the substitution part escaped?
<superm1> ion_, need to escape spaces and the - do you not?
<nixternal> superm1: haha, I just noticed something, you don't want to s/*/\-\ /g
<nixternal> more like s/\*/\-\ /g
<superm1> haha
<superm1> yeah
<nixternal> oops, there went the control file :)
<ion_> nixternal: Depends on the regexp dialect/.
<nixternal> ion_: true
<ion_> In any case, you donât need to escape the chars in the substitution parameter.
<nixternal> with that, you would get a pattern not found more than likely anyways
<ScottK> leonel: Does the bug not apply to clamav 0.88?
<rhpot1991_laptop> should I s/*/-/g in my manpage too?
<leonel> scottK don't know yet   still fighting with gutsy
<ScottK> OK.
<ScottK> leonel: Did you look at Feisty yet?
<leonel> scottK not yet
<ScottK> leonel: I'm getting the 0.90.1 patch from etch-security for us.  That should work for Feisty (or very close).
<ScottK> leonel: I'll take care of Feisty.  I get the Debian patch.
<leonel> scottK Great
<leonel> scottK the bug is in the function  cli_scanpe   does that is too on  0.90.1 ?
<ScottK> looking
<rhpot1991_laptop> nixternal: should I s/\*/- /g the manpage too?
<nixternal> I was trying to look, but silly Konqi 4.0.1 decided to crash...looking now
<rhpot1991_laptop> has the same *'s in the list there, I copied them over from the website
<rhpot1991_laptop> its easy to do, so I can just do it as a precaution
<nixternal> the manpages file looks good to me
<rhpot1991_laptop> alright
<nixternal> oh
<nixternal> ummm
<nixternal> I was looking at the wrong file
<rhpot1991_laptop> AtomicParsley.1
<rhpot1991_laptop> also for the record you need to escape in the match section, and not in the replace section, in perl at least
<nixternal> I don't think you need the * or the - in a manpage when you use the .TP, as that indents it and brightens its color I believe...
<rhpot1991_laptop> alright, uploaded the fixes
<nixternal> groovilicious
<nixternal> mmm, fergilicious!
<ScottK> leonel: clamav 0.92.1 uploaded to Hardy.  I'm taking feisty now.
<avoine> How a package can succefully build but not be in the archive?
<ScottK> If it's removed?
<avoine> how can I see if this append?
<Hobbsee> avoine: failed to upload?
<ScottK> Is it a new package that was recently uploaded for the first time?
<ScottK> Still in New is another possibility
<avoine> it's this one: https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/sugar-calculate-activity/16-0ubuntu2/+build/507905
<avoine> no it's a update
<avoine> the source are there: http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/universe/s/sugar-calculate-activity/
<avoine> but not the .deb
<avoine> It could be that they not pass linda and litian test?
<RAOF> Dear CDBS: please don't link to files in packages that need not be installed together.
<Hobbsee> avoine: i've bugged cprov in #launchpad.  he'll be asleep, but hopefully he'll find out
<avoine> thanks Hobbsee
<cprov> avoine: what's the problem with that build ?
<Hobbsee> apparently he isn't asleep
<avoine> for some reason the packages have build successfully but the .deb are not in the archive
<StevenK> avoine: It's in ACCEPTED. It will hit the archive soon.
<StevenK> avoine: Check when it says (DONE), as opposed to (ACCEPTED)
<cprov> avoine: https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/hardy/+queue?queue_state=2&queue_text=sugar
<avoine> ok
<avoine> I understand know, thanks and sorry for the noise
<avoine> Usually, how long does It for a package to get into universe after been build?
<avoine> Ok I see, It's because of the translation process
<StevenK> avoine: Roughly an hour, but could be more.
<avoine> ok, this one have been build february 6
<avoine> but It's the first time the po file are add I think
<avoine> *files
<cprov> avoine: it was probably waiting in the NEW queue since them. New binaries require manual approval from archive-admins
<cprov> avoine: it's very unlikely that it would be related to the translations.
<avoine> ok
<ScottK> Doing all these updates for Feisty on a slow computer is a definite reminder of how nice triggers are.
<kdub> so, i made a package (to resolve bug 116147) using pbuilder. i'm a little confused about how to upload to revu though
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 116147 in ubuntu "[needs-packaging] tv_grab_dvb" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/116147
<rhpot1991_laptop> nixternal: should I be worried that its taking a while, or did you get sidetracked with something else(which is OK, if thats the case)?
<ScottK> rhpot1991_laptop: Bugging the reviewer isn't generally encouraged.
<ScottK> If he found a problem, he'd have likely quit, so I'd guess no news is good news.
<rhpot1991_laptop> ScottK: thats why I said its OK, trying not to be buggy and wasn't sure if I should keep paying attention or not
<rhpot1991_laptop> just trying to figure out if I should keep checking back here or not, nothing more
<ScottK> K
<rhpot1991_laptop> whats the deal with the po folder in debian, I see an example with templates in debian and in debian/po
<jcastro> mgunes: around?
<mgunes> jcastro, hi, yep
<ScottK> persia: Are you around?
<ScottK> persia: Did your java goals get met already?
<ScottK> keescook or jdstrand: Fixes for Bug #191150 for Gutsy/Feisty are in the bug.  Dapper will be along shortly.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 191150 in clamav "possible integer overflow" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/191150
<apetrescu> Hey, guys
<apetrescu> I have a patch that I wrote for a package in Universe
<apetrescu> I had two modify two files (a .h file and a .c file)
<apetrescu> How do I properly create a patch file for these?
<apetrescu> Anybody? :(
<ScottK> apetrescu: File a bug in LP.
<apetrescu> ScottK, file a bug for what?
<ScottK> apetrescu: Make an updated package with a new revision number in debian/changelog
<ScottK> The problem your patch solves
<apetrescu> There's already a bug report for the problem my patch solves
<ScottK> OK
<ScottK> That step is done then
<apetrescu> It's why I wrote it :)
<ScottK> Makes sense
<ScottK> Make the new package then with a new revision number in debian/changelog
<ScottK> Then use debdiff to make a difference between the old and new packages.
<ScottK> Attach that debdiff to the bus and subscribe ubuntu-universe-sponsors.
<apetrescu> "Make the new package"? :( I am not actually a MOTU, I just asked here because it seemed the right place for it, I don't know much about Debian packaging.
<\sh> grmpf
<\sh> looks like level3 has problems to reach canonical...
<apetrescu> level3?
<ScottK> apetrescu: I thought you'd made the package you were updating.  My mistake.
<apetrescu> ScottK, no, sorry, I just have the modified source code that I wrote, and I'm trying to create a patch that I can presumably add to the bug report
<apetrescu> That's the usual process, right?
<ScottK> Yes
<StevenK> \sh: My route goes through level3 and reaches Canonical
<apetrescu> If it's just one file I know I can use diff -u, but it's two files, so I'm not sure how to create one patch file for two files
<ScottK> If you don't want to go to the trouble of packaging the patch, you can diff the old and new files with diff -ruN and attach tat
<ScottK> tat/that
<ScottK> Then add the tag 'patch' to the bug.
<\sh> StevenK, 15:  ae-1-100.ebr1.London1.Level3.net (4.69.132.117)       41.144ms asymm 12
<\sh> 16:  no reply
<\sh> StevenK, and then it ends...
<\sh> StevenK, while pipex, datahop it works
<\sh>  5:  canonical-gw.datahop.net (195.72.130.230)            asymm  8  18.089ms
<\sh>  6:  gw0-0-gr.canonical.com (91.189.88.10)                asymm 12  21.002ms
<StevenK> 20. ae-1-100.ebr1.London1.Level3.net  0.0%    13  318.9 310.1 306.3 318.9   4.1
<StevenK> 21. ae-2.ebr2.London2.Level3.net      0.0%    13  306.9 310.1 305.0 318.7   4.6
<\sh> -ESTRANGE
<ScottK> StevenK: Up for a requestsync feature request?
<apetrescu> ScottK, how do I pass it if there's MULTIPLE files that need to be diffed?
<apetrescu> Say file1.c and file1.h
<StevenK> ScottK: I could be tempted to consider it
<ScottK> apetrescu: Diff the dir
<apetrescu> Oh, okay
<apetrescu> So:
<apetrescu> diff -ruN dir1 dir2 > my.patch
<apetrescu> ?
<\sh> StevenK, there could be 2 reasons: 1. my upstream ISP (with the level3 way) just fcked up it's BGP4 routing...OR...2. Dr. Who exists
<ScottK> StevenK: If one has gone to the trouble of specifying the -k option, could requestsync perhaps not complain about the lack of the DEBEMAIL environment variable and just use the address from the GPG key?
<StevenK> \sh: I'm guessing ae-1-100.ebr1.London1.Level3.net can't find it's way back, or the router next down the chain can't
<\sh> StevenK, yeah some kind of broken BGP4 table...
<StevenK> \sh: In other words, probably not level3's problem :-)
<StevenK> ScottK: And how do you suggest we get the address, I'd rather not parse gpg's --list-key output
<\sh> StevenK, do you know how to deal with public accessible core routers?
<ScottK> StevenK: Implementation detail?
<StevenK> \sh: I try not to :-)
<ScottK> If it's hard, it's not worth the trouble.
<StevenK> \sh: I prefer core routers to not be publically accessible
<\sh> StevenK, well, public bgp4 query router ;)
<StevenK> \sh: My BGP4 skills have since leaked out of my ears
<\sh> I'm doomed
<\sh> it's a level 3 problem
<StevenK> With your netblock?
<\sh> StevenK, looks like
<\sh> inetnum:        91.89.0.0 - 91.89.127.255
<\sh> StevenK, could you try to reach buildserver.homelinux.net?
<StevenK> 22. 172.30.22.2                       0.0%    10  392.8 379.3 323.3 490.7  54.7
<apetrescu> ScottK, I went ahead and created the patch and attached it to the bug report :)
<StevenK> 23. ???
<StevenK> \sh: ^
<apetrescu> Would you mind taking a quick look to make sure I did everything right? (It's my first time)
<ScottK> apetrescu: Did you add a bug tag 'patch'?  That will get it noticed more quickly.
<apetrescu> ScottK, yes
<apetrescu> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnushogi/+bug/131017
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 131017 in gnushogi "xshogi leaves gnushogi running after exit" [Undecided,New]
<apetrescu> Tags:  patch
<\sh> StevenK, so it's broken in bgp4 on isp site...
<\sh> StevenK, or a router injects wrong routing informations (most propably the 172.30.21.xx site)
<StevenK> Mmmm, right
<ScottK> apetrescu: The next step would be to learn how to package the fix and make a debdiff.  It's past time for me to go to bed, so someone else would need to help you with that.
<apetrescu> ScottK, say I learn how to make a debdiff on my own -- then what
<apetrescu> >
<apetrescu> *?
<ScottK> Then attach the debdiff to the bug and subscribe ubuntu-universe-sponsors to the bug and someone will get to it and upload it.
<apetrescu> Beautiful
<apetrescu> Thanks, ScottK!
<apetrescu> (This will happen even though i am not a maintainer for this package?)
<\sh> StevenK, i'll talk to my upstream provider...needs to rush to the office now
<ScottK> Yes.  We do team maintenance here, so it's all the same.
<apetrescu> Excellent, thank you :)
<apetrescu> Then I'll try to figure out the debdiff stuff on my own using documentation, and hopefully by tomorrow my very first patch will be up :D
<apetrescu> Unless the package maintainer beats me to it with the .patch I already attached to the bug report, hehe
<q_a_z_steve> Can someone help me fix my screen res? It used to be able to handle my 21" monitor, now not so much.
<q_a_z_steve> *used to be able to handle... was under dapper, I've just installed gutsy
<q_a_z_steve> help?
<TheMuso> q_a_z_steve: #ubuntu for support.
<warp10> Good morning!
<TheMuso> damn kvm
<RAOF> TheMuso: What's it not doing?
<TheMuso> RAOF: Its locking a key occasionally when switching between machines.
<RAOF> Oh.  You're probably thinking of kvm-the-not-virtualisation technology :)
<TheMuso> No, a keyboard video mouse switch
<TheMuso> i.e between physical machines.
<RAOF> Yeah.
 * TheMuso grumbles at KVM the virtualization stuff. What an annoying conflict.
<TheMuso> namespace wise.
<RAOF> Absolutely.
<jscinoz> Evening everyone.
<jscinoz> I'm working on two packages, urbanterror and urbanterror-data, both are on revu, and currently there is a problem with urbanterror requiring its own embedded libjpeg62 (attempts to patch it to use the system library cause the game to render incorrectly), emmet.hikory recommended bringing the topic up for discussion here and to see if we can get any additional motu's to accept the use of the embedded library, the package in question
<jscinoz>  is located at http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=urbanterror
<rhpot1991_laptop> if I have a note in a template I am trying to display to a user after they install a deb, how should I call that to display in postinst?
<rhpot1991_laptop> like you call a string with db_get, what do I use to call my note
<HighNo> rhpot1991_laptop: hi again. just for my understanding - the installation can be localized too?
<rhpot1991_laptop> huh, not sure what you are asking about, might be thinking of something you talked to someone else about?
<HighNo> rhpot1991_laptop: you were mentioning a po folder within debian dir - po is not for translations there?
<rhpot1991_laptop> ya I think it is, though I'm a little confused about it, trying to copy an example to get a notice to show up
<HighNo> btw, as you mention 'example' - I've heard there is a packaging example 'hello world' available somewhere?
<rhpot1991_laptop> there is, though I don't think it does any debhelper
<rhpot1991_laptop> superm1 pointed me at one of his that I am trying to copy off of
<rhpot1991_laptop> s/debhelper/debconf/
<vemon> hmh. how should i call the get-orig-source target in debian/rules? like this?: debian/rules get-orig-source
<RAOF> Exactly.
<RAOF> Or ./rules get-orig-source, or my-package-dir/debian/rules get-orig-source (get-orig-source should be callable from any directory)
<jscinoz> I'm working on two packages, urbanterror and urbanterror-data, both are on revu, and currently there is a problem with urbanterror requiring its own embedded libjpeg62 (attempts to patch it to use the system library cause the game to render incorrectly), emmet.hikory recommended bringing the topic up for discussion here and to see if we can get any additional motu's to accept the use of the embedded library, the package in question
<jscinoz>  is located at http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=urbanterror
<RAOF> If anyone is interested in useful, keyboard-driven desktop-navigation bling I'd encourage you to revu gnome-do and do-plugins (http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=gnome-do)
<RAOF> The main package should be good to go; I've addressed persia's concerns, and the plugins should be easy.
<HighNo> If upstream has created an AUTHORS file or something alike, do I still need to create a debian/copyright file or can I link somehow to the upstream version?
<RAOF> HighNo: You *always* need a debian/copyright.
<RAOF> The AUTHORS file can be a useful reference, but they're often out of date.
<emgent> heya
<HighNo> RAOF: that's interesting and good to know. I was just reading the new UpsteamGuide and thought about howto improve my upstream package.
<AnAnt> persia: thanks
<RAOF> HighNo: Right.  The single biggest thing you can do is to make sure *every* file has a license header, preferably one of the GPLs.  It takes a lot of other craziness to use up the goodwill generated by easy licensing.
<RAOF> NOTE: my priorites may be skewed by having to fight licensing issues with every package I've recently touched.
<jonnymind> Hello
<jonnymind> I receive this log from launchpad:
<jonnymind> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/11878791/buildlog_ubuntu-hardy-ia64.falconpl_0.8.8-0ubuntu1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<jonnymind> where a new error suddenly appeared:
<jonnymind> Error: parsed ddeb section or priority is empty
<emgent> debian #434725
<ubotu> Debian bug 434725 in xsupplicant "xsupplicant - FTBFS: error: header file <iwlib.h> is required for Xsupplicant" [Serious,Fixed] http://bugs.debian.org/434725
<AnAnt> I need to discuss the matter of native packages, what's the problem with them ?
<Hobbsee> jonnymind: known problem.  it'll get given back
<jonnymind> Hobbsee: thnx; in other words, I have not to worry?
<Hobbsee> yeah
<jonnymind> Hobbsee: Ok, thanks. Anyhow, I'll stick around in case you need me.
<AnAnt> I am making packages for UbuntuME (a derivative distro) artwork, why is it not liked that the packages be native in that case ?
<RAOF> AnAnt: Is that artwork only ever interesting for a Debian system?  It seems the answer would be "no", so it shouldn't be a native package.
<AnAnt> RAOF: ubuntu's artwork is native
<LaserJock> most artwork packages are native
<HighNo> hm, offtopic: does anyone know how to link to a certain heading/section or how to set an anchor in the wiki?
<AnAnt> RAOF: besides, it maybe only interesting for  a Ubuntu system, for example, the GDM theme has the word "ubuntume", would that be of interest for a non-Ubuntu (or actualy non-UbuntuME) system ?
<HighNo> never mind - reading helps... *lalala* ;-)
<goobsoft> Is there more documentation for python-support other than "man dh_pysupport"?
<slomo__> ScottK: saw you uploaded poppler-data to revu... you know that it's not possible to redistribute it (ugly adobe license)?
<Hobbsee> oh, ewww, not more poppler?
<AstralJava> Anyone of the launchpad-buildd-admins present? I've got an issue with buildd on a package (gigedit) that builds fine on my Hardy setup.
<dholbach> good morning
<LaserJock> morning
<dholbach> hey LaserJock
<rhpot1991_laptop> if anyone can look at http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=mythexport and leave me a comment about why I never get my debconf note that would be great.  Thanks.
<\sh> dholbach, moins...could you fix the sentence: "where we could dial in using Kernel" with "where we could dial in using Kermit", pls? :)
<dholbach> \sh: done
<\sh> dholbach, thx a lot :)
<HighNo> \sh: now that would be killer feature or not?
<HighNo> dial-in kernels :-) hehe, Kernel panic? no prob, Linus' gonna call in :-)
<\sh> HighNo, in the beginning there was only the kernel...even with kermit, you needed to advice the kernel to recognize your serial interfaces correctly ,-)
<HighNo> I even guess it would be possible to create something like a hardend mini-environment containing a tcp/ip subset and network drivers. just for remote debugging purpose :-)
<HighNo> \sh: I know although I didn't use linux back at those days
<\sh> HighNo, these days there was a software, running as client and server, which could tunnel an ip session over a normal plain dial in line (without having ppp or something like that)
<emgent> heya people :P
<HighNo> \sh: you mean slip, right?
<\sh> HighNo, no slip ...:)
<HighNo> \sh: more like rawIP as it has been later on with isdn lines?
<\sh> HighNo, slip you used when you had non-pap/chap auth for ppp...you logged in via normal unix login and started ppp on the other side..
<\sh> HighNo, I need to get the name of the software...a cool technology these days
<HighNo> \sh: just checked slip - it does exactly that - putting the raw packets on the line. the only change is that there is a packet end marker being included which has to be escaped if it would be in the packet. Other than that it is just raw IP
<\sh> HighNo, yes..but it wasn't slip :)
<HighNo> \sh: btw, putting raw packets on the line - would one call that still a tunnel?  :-)
<\sh> HighNo, this didn't work..we had to call in via kermit, on a terminal server which was connected via serial to the sun
<\sh> HighNo, so there was no tcp/ip or raw packets over this line...I think it used mosaic or something on the remote server and was pushing the data as plain ascii back to the client where a mosaic was started and received the data via lo0 ... you had to map some local ports actually...
<HighNo> \sh: yeah, that's the usual way. All it misses is a way to reboot that thing - wait, rebooting it was just impossible for pc's. One can reboot a hanging sun via the serial interface, right?
<HighNo> \sh: ahh, so you are talking plain terminal transfer then
<\sh> HighNo, you can jump into the bootloader of a hanging sun, yes
<\sh> HighNo, yepp
<HighNo> \sh: that is such a cool feature. I miss it on my pc every time I see a sun :-)
<\sh> HighNo, well, difference between good and bad hw/bios design ;)
<HighNo> \sh: I know. I am wondering if linuxbios would change things. I never had a machine to try that. It would remind me of old c64 times. Turn it on, wait 2 secs, there you go :-) (I know that linuxbios is no complete linux system...)
<\sh> ok...meeting
<Laibsch> good morning
<Laibsch> I wonder how to include original source for the upload to my ppa.  I am sure it must be a switch to debuild, but the man page says nothing about it
<CarlFK> how do I find what is causing this: $ debchange --nmu updeb.carl
<CarlFK> utf8 "\xF6" does not map to Unicode at /usr/bin/debchange line 963, <S> chunk 1.
<CarlFK>   * Add a patch from Jï¿½rn Reder to fix an issue with filters that have long
<HighNo> Laibsch: Include the source where? in the .deb file?
<Laibsch> in the upload
<Laibsch> I think it is the -sa switch
<Laibsch> Unfortunately, not mentioned in "man debuild"
<HighNo> Laibsch: hm, could be, cause creating a signed .changes file is debuild -S -sa
<HighNo> Laibsch: that would include the source
<HighNo> Laibsch: man  dpkg-buildpackage  - the debuild options go there
<Laibsch> well, the man page should mention that for complete reference you should also look into $foo
<HighNo> Laibsch: it does - hidden somewhere somehow: line 4 of description: "passed on).  Parameters can be passed to dpkg-buildpackage, li..."
<geser> good morning
<dholbach> hey geser
<geser> Hi dholbach
<psavva> hi all
<psavva> got a question if anybody knows anything about ffmpeg ???
<crevette> hello people
<crevette> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=obex-data-server is broken
<psavva> hey crevette
<crevette> can someone solve this
<crevette> hello psavva
<goobsoft> I've used ffmpeg before
<psavva> getting a error message
<psavva> Unknown encoder 'h264'
<psavva> got ffmpeg from mediabuntu repo
<goobsoft> What command are you issueing?
<goobsoft> ./configure --enable-libmp3lame --enable-liba52 --enable-libgsm --enable-libogg --enable-libtheora --enable-libvorbis --enable-libfaac --enable-gpl --enable-libx264 --enable-pthreads
<goobsoft> use that before making
<psavva> ffmpeg -i INPUT -s 176x144 -vcodec h264  -ar 48000 -ac 2 -acodec aac -r 25 OUTPUT
<goobsoft> sudo apt-get install liba52-dev libdts-dev libgsm1-dev libvorbis-dev libxvidcore4-dev libdc1394-dev libfaac-dev liblame-dev libx264-dev libfaad2-dev libtheora-dev libsdl1.2-dev
<psavva> from src
<goobsoft> need to get the dependencies first though.
<psavva> recompile then?
<goobsoft> yes, get the library dependancies, then get src, then configure, then make
<psavva> cool
<psavva> thanks
<goobsoft> np
<psavva> libogg not recognised
<goobsoft> sudo apt-get install libogg-dev
<goobsoft> liba52-0.7.4-dev
<psavva> all ready newest version
<goobsoft> maybe this one too x264-bin
<CarlFK> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UpdatingADeb  sudo apt-get build-dep <package> will take care of all that
<psavva> all deps are all ready installed
<goobsoft> That's all I know.
<psavva> 0 upgraded, 0 newly installed, 0 to remove
<psavva> i think i need to see if a new version of ffmpeg has been released
<CarlFK> psavva: do the steps on that page
<goobsoft> oh, I got my ffmpeg from subversion
<psavva> ok CarlFK
<psavva> all ready got the builds working, got the installs working... just not the encoding
<psavva> going to try and find the subversion of mmpeg
<psavva> ffmpeg
<CarlFK> psavva: did dpkg-buildpackage build?
<psavva> there's no source for ffmpeg in the repos
<CarlFK> "got ffmpeg from mediabuntu repo"
<CarlFK> i would be surprised if the source isn't there
<psavva> yip, only the binary available from there
<psavva> I'm getting the source from svn
<psavva> then i'll try the build that goobsoft suggested
<psavva> got subversion, gonna try build now :D
<psavva> still got the problem of --enable-libogg...
<psavva> should i just remove it?
<goobsoft> It's worth a shot
<psavva> configured ok
<crevette> whi can I contact for my problem on http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=obex-data-server;
<HighNo> crevette: hi again - so it still is broken?
<crevette> HighNo yes
<Highno_phone> Crevette that is bad. I saw the broken upload - it looks strange
<crevette> the problem is I fixed all the reamaining problem of my package
<crevette> and I found people to advocate it
<crevette> we need it in hardy
<slytherin> psavva: you don't have headers installed probably
<Highno_phone> Did you file a bug already?
<slytherin> oops, wrong channel
<crevette> no, were ?
<crevette> where
<geser> crevette: try ask siretart for help
<Highno_phone> Launchpad
<crevette> siretart, around ?
<HighNo> crevette:  https://launchpad.net/revu/+filebug
<tbutter> anyone would like to give http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=jodviewer a review?
<psavva> looks cool tbutter... i'm just a visitor here :D
<psavva> so is anyone here from South Africa?
<HighNo> psavva: there is #ubuntu-za
<psavva> just curious :D  I'm a Ex-South african....
<psavva> well still at heart :D
<HighNo> :-)
<Hobbsee> bug #188130
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 188130 in moblin-image-creator "Update moblin-image-creator to 0.39" [Wishlist,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/188130
<HighNo> crevette: I've applied to become a REVU hacker - let's see who wins the race :-) Anyway, can't you just put them somewhere else like in your ppa or such? So reviewers could download it from there
<HighNo> I don't know the complete revu infrastructure but I guess motu's can manually upload your package once two of them agreed on advocating.
<DaveMorris> HighNo: congraz on getting your package accepted
<psavva> well done :D
<HighNo> DaveMorris: I did?
<sistpoty|work> hi folks
<HighNo> DaveMorris: Whooooohoooo
<psavva> no ide
<sistpoty|work> sparky's disk is full :( (still need to find out why, because there was quite some space left yesterday, unless I completely misread the numbers there)
<sistpoty|work> -> REVU won't accept new uploads atm.
<RAOF> iwl3945 is spewing hundreds of megabytes worth of kernel log for me, but that's unlikely to be affecting sparkey :)
<HighNo> sistpoty|work: I am willing to join REVU hackers to help if I can. Do you need help? I applied via Launchpad...
<frafu> Hello, I am looking at the build log of a package for universe and there are a lot of warnings (and a few errors) concerning the schemas; could anybody please have a look at it and tell me whether it is normal or if I have to do anything to fix it?
<sistpoty|work> HighNo: for improving the codebase of REVU? (that's what revu-hackers is about)
<frafu> http://paste.ubuntu.com/4489/
<sistpoty|work> HighNo: of course, I'm always interested in revu improvements :)
<frafu> And here is the complete log.  http://launchpadlibrarian.net/11886840/buildlog_ubuntu-hardy-i386.mousetweaks_2.21.91-0ubuntu1_FULLYBUILT.txt.gz
<HighNo> I'd like to help out wherever possible. I got so much help around here. I feel the need to do something :-)
<frafu> HighNo: you might have a look at the log that I pasted above ;-)
<frafu> or anybody else, of course :)
<Hobbsee> sistpoty|work: erk!  need a bigger hard drive
<sistpoty|work> Hobbsee: or clean up more often (currently 30Gb only used by revu uploads)
<Hobbsee> ouch
<HighNo> frafu: I am still too unexperienced to check for a problem - sadly I never used gconf (on my list...)
<sistpoty|work> crevette: please reupload obex-data-server
<frafu> HighNo: thanks nevertheless
<HighNo> sistpoty|work: how can I see revu's code?
<sistpoty|work> HighNo: the currently codebase of revu1 is at https://code.launchpad.net/~revu-hackers/revu/trunk
 * sistpoty|work has just free'd a tiny amount of space on sparky... still need to clean up later after lunch break
<HighNo> DaveMorris: hey, thanks to the fast releases and the audience BlueProximity made it on rank 127 of sourceforge today. That's my best rank so far :-)
<HighNo> sistpoty|work: I'll have a look
<Hobbsee> persia: FYI, MIC is crack.  let them have it as native if they want - just make sure it doesn't point a maintainer address to MOTU
<HighNo> sistpoty|work: do we still have that directory with the broken obex-data-server upload? I would dive into that problem then as I seems to happen more than once. Or maybe - was it a problem of low disk space? I saw the problem arrises in clusters.
<sistpoty|work> HighNo: it was a problem with low disk space (of course revu could handle out of space problems more gracefully, but currently the entire upload processing is only some ugly shell scripts)
<HighNo> sistpoty|work: ok, well I'll still have a look at it, maybe I can add some graceful error message there and at least an unbroken old package...
<HighNo> superm1: I have done the file release. Will it be uploaded automatically now?
<persia> ScottK: Not quite.  Still two packages to go.  libini4j-java and netbeans itself.  lashwrap would be nice, but the rest of my new packages lust is satisfied.
<crevette> sistpoty|work, okay I'll do tonight
<crevette> I'm at work now
<emgent> heya
<HighNo> sistpoty|work: you probably know it too - after two advocates, the next step is what exactly?
<persia> HighNo: Someone uploads it.  THe packager may relax in confidence.
<HighNo> persia: then I'll relax in confidence :-)
 * HighNo is enjoying an interesting, learningful but successful week, and even passed the exam he couldn't learn for because he was constantly debugging his package...
<persia> Does anyone have a working mdt installation running?  I'd like to catch up on my syncs :)
<geser> persia: I've one setup, let me run the update
<persia> geser: That would be great.  Thanks.
<persia> slomo__: Can we not distribute poppler-data even in multiverse?
<geser> persia: http://members.ping.de/~mb/universe-versionslist.html
<persia> geser: Excellent.  Only 2130 packages to investigate tonight :)
<slomo__> persia: imho no... (and if i remember the license correctly)
<persia> slomo__: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/revu1-incoming/poppler-data-0802101530/poppler-data-0.2.0/debian/copyright seems to indicate we can distribute as long as we don't modify, patch, or support it.  Am I reading it incorrectly?
<jdstrand> ScottK: ack bug #191150
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 191150 in clamav "possible integer overflow" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/191150
<HighNo> how's not supporting it possible? do they have blacklists in #ubuntu which packages they can answer?
<Hobbsee> HighNo: it should be "no making changes to the code, at all, even if there are bugs"
<HighNo> Hobbsee: ah, I see - although that's not a nice license is it? It seems even more strange as someone else might be able to fix your bugs for zero bucks - I can't understand some people
<Hobbsee> HighNo: it's adobe.  enough said.
<jcfp> Anyone in for reviewing http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=sabnzbdplus? (latest revision of the package is based on a new, improved upstream release)
<persia> blueyed: jedit FTBFS for me!  I'll comment when I can fix REVU not telling me my password, but if you want to fix and reupload in the meantime, that might be good...
<sistpoty|work> persia: more revu probs?
<persia> sistpoty|work: no output from recover.  Waiting for a keyring sync to fix it :(
<persia> Currently up through 'j', so shouldn't be too much longer...
<sistpoty|work> persia: ah... k (you could have also done a revu-key import <keyid> for the fast way)
<persia> sistpoty|work: My thought was that if it was broken for me, it was likely broken for others.  I can certainly do a lot of pre-review work prior to getting comment access.
 * persia seeks a second advocate for http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=libini4j-java and http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=lashwrap
<sistpoty|work> persia: heh, good point
<persia> The first is a build-dep for netbeans 6, which would be a really nice upgrade from netbeans 5.5: now with support for more languages.  The second allows any package to use LASH to maintain session for audio work.
<HighNo> sistpoty|work: I setup my revu here - it seems to work though I did not try an upload there yet. upated the readme a bit, but it pointed my always in the right direction
<geser> oh, a third REVU now :)
<HighNo> sistpoty|work: I'll try uploads and afterwards I need to know what processes should be in the crontab
<HighNo> geser: yepp, and I can advocate everything I want to :-)
<JonReagan> do any of you folks know who the REVU admins are?  I just joined the universe contributors group, and was hoping to get my GPG added to the keyring
<HighNo> JonReagan: I think a keyring update is in process right now
<JonReagan> ah
<JonReagan> well, that takes care of my question!  Thx
<HighNo> If I understood persia right
<persia> JonReagan: Asking for a keyring sync in this channel is your best chance.  How long ago did you join the team?
<JonReagan> a couple of min. ago
<HighNo> sistpoty|work: I didn't search too far but is there some kind of admin-page or maintainance page?
<persia> Then the last sync likely missed you :)  I'll run again in a few minutes.
<JonReagan> thank you so much!
<HighNo> persia: a running keyring sync does not influence the normal processes, right?
<persia> sistpoty|work: running a sync didn't fix my lack of a password.  Help!
<persia> JonReagan: Umm, please wait a bit: I don't want to collide with sistpoty sorting my password before I sync.  Soon...
<persia> HighNo: Slows them down a bit, but LP is so slow that it's not significant impact.
<JonReagan> no problem... I wont be attempting to upload stuff until this afternoon anyways.
<HighNo> persia: hehe
<persia> JonReagan: Depending on your local time of day, it should be fine then :)
<JonReagan> thanks!  yeah, its 7:30 am where I'm at
<JonReagan> well, I better get back to work.  Thanks, guys!
<ScottK> slomo__: Urgh.  I guess I misread the license.  I thought it'd work for multiverse.  I actually uploaded it to the archive, not to REVU.
<ScottK> persia: Did your java goals get met already or do you need me to look at something still?
<slytherin> ScottK: If you are one of the build admins, I still have a request pending. :-D
<ScottK> No, I'm a MOTU, but not a build admin
<sistpoty|work> persia: sorry, was afk for a moment
<sistpoty|work> persia: /me looks
<geser> slytherin: you mean the jbossas4 package?
<slytherin> geser: Completely forgot that. I was actually only thinking about batik
<persia> ScottK: If you have time to look at libini4j-java, that would be great.  My goal is upgrading netbeans from 5.5 to 6, but I still need to review the netbeans package myself (although I'd be happy to be the second advocate if you feel like manually installing all the build-deps).  If libini4j can get in within a few hours, I believe netbeans will be able to build without manual arrangements tomorrow, making it less hard to review.
<persia> sistpoty|work: Thanks.
<geser> slytherin: for jbossas4 you will need to manage to reach infinity and ask him about the status of the bug
<sistpoty|work> persia: hm... your key (0x00FD4057) is in the keyring
<dcordero> h
<dcordero> hi
<persia> sistpoty|work: Unfortunately, both http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/lostpw.py?email=emmet.hikory@gmail.com and http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/lostpw.py?email=persia@ubuntu.com have somewhat limited output :(
 * persia preferrs the first address for REVU, but may well have both registered
<sistpoty|work> persia: both are registered... /me looks what lostpw actually does
<sistpoty|work> persia: trying to encrypt a message on sparky with the first email, gpg says "gpg: [stdin]: encryption failed: unusable public key"
<persia> My key hasn't changed recently.  Did sparky?
<sistpoty|work> persia: hm... actually I get the same gpg problem here as well, so this is probably not a sparky problem
 * persia is confused, and wonders if gpg had an incompatible upgrade recently.  Worked locally just 13 hours ago
<ScottK> Not that I've seen.
<persia> ScottK: Be especially strange for sparky: it'S feisty
 * sistpoty|work is at a debian/stable box btw.
<geser> persia: sub  4096g/41AF13DC  created: 2007-01-15  expired: 2008-01-14  usage: E
<ScottK> Which would also be strange to have suddenly break.
 * persia checks again, and updates :(
<sistpoty|work> persia: heh, oh... what geser wrote: your encryption key has expired
 * persia is fixing
<persia> geser: Thank you very much.  I completely missed it.
<sistpoty|work> persia: as a workaround, you could lookup in the sql database (/srv/revu-production/revu.cfg should be readable for you, which contains the credentials)
<sistpoty|work> persia: then it's just psql -Urevu revubase
<sistpoty|work> persia: and there
<slytherin> Can anyone confirm bug 189953
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 189953 in icedtea-java7 "Inconsistent 'Provides' for different java compilers/runtimes" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/189953
<sistpoty|work> persia: select * from users where email='youremail';
<persia> sistpoty|work: Thanks.
<sistpoty|work> np
<persia> geser: updated key pushed.  Would you mind checking to make sure that it stops showing expired in about 10 minutes?
<persia> jonReagan: Running another sync, you should be sorted in about 20 minutes.
<vorian> heya sistpoty|work, can you please remove http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=kdiamond-kde4
<vorian> :)
<slytherin> persia: geser: Can anyone of you please mail buildd admins for this preseeding? 'j2re1.4/license: true' and 'j2sdk1.4/license: true' I don't have access to my gmail account. :-( (damn these security policies in office) Thanks in advance.
<HighNo> slytherin: security policies are always getting worse - next thing they do is actually try to make you work - eek :-)
<_ruben> thats the good thing about being an sysadmin, you dont get to set them policies, but do get to implement them, with all 'benefits' of that ;-)
<slytherin> HighNo: gmail pop was working till yesterday now they have blocked even that. What is worse we don't have access to blogs which are many a times source of technical troubleshooting tips
<persia> RAOF: gnome-do advocated, but not uploaded.  Needs at least a one-line patch, but otherwise looks good.
<geser> slytherin: they block gmail but let you still use IRC?
<Hobbsee> geser: you can tunnel irc.
<_ruben> and pop as well ;)
 * persia thinks one can tunnel http more easily than irc: request/response and all...
<_ruben> irc is actually easier to tunnel
<slytherin> geser: fortunately I am on client ip tunnel and I can bypass proxy. But this is true only for non standard ports. :-P
<persia> slytherin: If you can get through on non-standard ports, just hit a web proxy somewhere.  There are lots around on the internet.
<geser> slytherin: or if you have a shell account somewhere use ssh for tunneling
<slytherin> Proxy seems nice idea. :-D No shell account.
 * persia tends to think of 22 as a "standard port", but that's another issue :)
<_ruben> proxy the ssh session? ;-)
 * slytherin thinks the security policy is perfect example of 'security by obscurity' attitude. 
<norsetto> peace everybody
<persia> _ruben: Depending on the intelligence of the filter, may be easier to proxy http than ssh.  synchronicity can raise alarms.
<persia> Hey norsetto.
<norsetto> heya persia
<HighNo> slytherin: if you have a root server I would install ssh to listen on port 80 :-)
<HighNo> slytherin: I can even give help on installing gnu http-tunnel - that way everything gets out somehow
<_ruben> HighNo: i'd use 443 instead .. when going through a proxy 443 uses CONNECT .. port 80 standard GET ;)
<HighNo> _ruben: depends on what you want to do :-)
<_ruben> HighNo: true ;)
<slytherin> nah, I don't want to try too many things and risk loosing my job over 'tried to bypass security measures' blame.
<_ruben> slytherin: just bribe a sysadmin then .. or steal neighbour company's wifi ;)
<HighNo> _ruben: the most working setup I usually do is a) have a gnu httptunnel running with it's end connected to a ssh server and b) always having a working setup of dnstunnel going
<_ruben> HighNo: sounds good
<slytherin> Ok. I think that now the discussion is an off-topic for this channel. :-)
<HighNo> _ruben: dnstunnel is very cool as many hotspots are installed in a stupid way, I can surf on almost any hotspot for free if I wanted to
 * _ruben expected a similar comment much earlier to be honest
<HighNo> slytherin: true - back to work now
<mok0> _ruben: thy neighbors wifi is a honeypot... waiting to rip off your creditcard...
<_ruben> ;)
<Hobbsee> dnstunnel...i've not herad of that one
<HighNo> Hobbsee: very cool - sets up a fake dns server, tunneling is not too slow
<geser> persia: did you already updated your key? http://pgpkeys.pca.dfn.de/pks/lookup?search=0x00fd4057&op=vindex still lists the subkey as expired
<HighNo> Hobbsee: apt-get install nstx
<persia> geser: Yes, but I only pushed to MIT and LP.  Thanks for pointing out that page: I'll watch it.
 * persia may need a new key, and a better expiry notification system
<Hobbsee> HighNo: later :)
<geser> persia: http://keyserver.ubuntu.com:11371/pks/lookup?search=0x00FD4057&op=vindex looks the same
<sistpoty|work> vorian: done
<vorian> thanks sistpoty|work :)
<vorian> you are awesome
 * persia checks again, and tries to sync harder
<sistpoty|work> np
 * geser goes now writing an exam
<sistpoty|work> good luck geser!
<dholbach> geser: we have our fingers crossed!
 * Hobbsee waves goodbye to all
<slytherin> geser: I just confirmed that libxstream-java builds and marked bug 187606 as confirmed.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 187606 in ubuntu "Please sync libxstream-java 1.2.2-1 (multiverse) from Debian unstable (contrib)" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/187606
<Hobbsee> don't have too much fun without me!
<sistpoty|work> HighNo: can you actually read what I wrote in the query?
<HighNo> yes
<HighNo> ehm
<HighNo> no
<HighNo> i was all into the source - thought of sql :-)
<HighNo> no, can't read your messages sistpoty|work
<sistpoty|work> HighNo: hm... seems like freenode won't let me privmsg (since I'm not registered user here at work... and always forget to bring my pw from home *g*)
<HighNo> i think i could switch it off if i wouldn't have forgotten how :-)
<sistpoty|work> HighNo: let's move to #ubuntuwire then
<lar2> Hi - wondered if anyone would care to give http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=sun-javadb a review?  Hoping to have it in hardy :)  Cheers, and thanks.
<mruiz> hi all
<Iulian> Hey
<leonel> scottK good morning ...
<ScottK> Heya leonel.
<vorian> sistpoty|work: it seems I am doomed with this one, still shows up stale http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=kdiamond-kde4
<sistpoty|work> vorian: /me looks
<vorian> thanks :)
<leonel> scottK I can't get a complete debdiff      http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/55724/
 * ScottK looks
<leonel> scottK this is what I got  when I run  debuild -S -sa : http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/55725/
<ScottK> leonel: Pastebin me your other changes and I'll look at it.
<effie_jayx> hey mruiz
<mruiz> hola effie_jayx :-)
<leonel> but the patches are  in  :   http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/55726/
<theseinfeld> question for builders
<leonel> scottK Ok paste the 2 patches
<theseinfeld> I get this error when building for HARDY
<theseinfeld> kpathsea: Running mktexmf ptmr8t
<theseinfeld> ! I can't find file `ptmr8t'.
<theseinfeld> any idea why is it doing this? It used to work :((
<ScottK> leonel: Are you going to paste the actual patches?
<leonel> scottKyes
<leonel> scottK yes  http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/55727/   first
<theseinfeld> I guess I need to add also texlife-fonts-recommend?
<leonel> scottK http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/55728/   second
<ScottK> Thanks
<sistpoty|work> vorian: I've hand extracted the package for now... /me will need to free yet more space
<vorian> sistpoty|work: thanks, I'll wait a bit before re-uploading it
<sistpoty|work> thanks
<vorian> :)
<ScottK> leonel: I get the same error.  I think it's a problem in the dapper toolchain.  I think I know how to work around it.
<leonel> ScottK any thing I can do ??
<ScottK> Try the debdiff I'm about to give you.
<ScottK> leonel:  http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/55733/
<ScottK> leonel: I get the same .po file errors when I build the source package, but I'm not worrying about it.
<ScottK> keescook or jdstrand: I think we are about ready with fixes for Bug #191150 (just testing the Dapper fix now).
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 191150 in clamav "possible integer overflow" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/191150
 * jdstrand nods
<ScottK> jdstrand: I'd appreciate it if you would get started on Gutsy, because once that's published, I need to backport it to feisty-backports
<norsetto> sistpoty|work: Long-time MOTU Stefan Potyra will talk about the bread and butter !?
<jdstrand> ScottK: it's going to be a few minutes
<leonel> scottK Great  Thank YOU !
<ScottK> jdstrand: OK.  Understand.
<norsetto> sistpoty|work: ahhh, there was a following: of almost all packages: libraries and how to package them right
<dcordero> hi
<sistpoty|work> norsetto: heh... the bread and butter session, right *g*
 * persia notes for anyone else using date-based expiry for GPG keys that each subkey needs to be signed with a new expiry date to say alive, and that changing the expiry for only one subkey doesn't help.
 * persia syncs the keyring again, just for fun
<ScottK> leonel: Dapper debdiff works.
<ScottK> jdstrand: Dapper tests out so Dapper/Feisty/Gutsy fixes are ready when you are.
<jdstrand> ScottK: thanks!
<ScottK> Nothing like dist-upgrading to Hardy and having that be your 30th reboot and now waiting for the fsck to see if the upgrade actually succeeded...
<persia> ScottK: Consider it an enforced break :)
<ScottK> It's not the stopping (I've got other boxes), it's the not knowing.
 * persia advocates running fsck before dist-upgrade
<lar2> Re: my review request for http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=sun-javadb: Java DB is a brilliant - of course - full-featured 100% java database for both embedded and client/server application.  It is used and supported by other splendid players like NetBeans, the GlassFish application server and Sun's JDK.  With both NB and GF in Hardy, Java DB should be there, too, so I hope some kind person(s) would review/advocate the package... :)
<CarlFK> Marillat says " 1.0.6rc1 is the latest package on my repository." - but I can't find the url for sources.  did it become .debian-multimedia?
 * persia notes that the NetBeans currently in hardy is outdated, crufty, and non-free
<leonel> scottK great  yesterday i tested too the debs     and worked fine
<ScottK> persia: I've got a package won't build twice in a row problem with a patch.  I was wondering if you'd have time/be willing to have a look at it?
<slytherin> persia: what do you mean by non-free?
<persia> ScottK: Do you need it done pre-FF?  I've a list.
<persia> slytherin: Look at the licensing for the netbeans5.5 source.  Compare to netbeans on REVU.
<ScottK> persia: No.  It's for Debian, so it can wait.  I'll ping you after FF if I don't have it sorted.
<persia> ScottK: Thanks.  Given FF, I'm expecting to have some time this weekend, as RCbugs is still down...
<dcordero> DktrKranz, did you check kannel warnings on hardy?
<persia> pochu: emesene commented.  Minor packaging, and yet more licensing
<DktrKranz> dcordero: I had a test build and I got the same results you did, let's see if it can be fixed somehow, but I don't think it's blocking
<dcordero> DktrKranz, i was searching about similar bugs, but i can't found anything :/
<rhpot1991_laptop> anyone have some time to help me figure out why debconf isn't working with my package?
<DktrKranz> dcordero: in the meantime, you should adjust your debdiff in order to have Homepage field in Source stanza only, you should not repeat if for each binary packages.
<dcordero> yep i read it on pdebuild but i dont know what is souce stanza :/
<persia> dcordero: The stanzas in control are separated by a blank line.  The "source stanza" is the one that begins with "Source:"
<DktrKranz> dcordero: it's a paragraph in debian/control which begins with Source:
<dcordero> i see thanks
 * DktrKranz is slow, persia is quick
<mruiz> DktrKranz, !
<persia> Nah.  Just not distracted at that moment :)  Anyway, it's not a "paragraph": each line in control is a "paragraph".  "stanza" is a better word.
<DktrKranz> mruiz! :D
<mruiz> DktrKranz, how are you today?
<DktrKranz> mruiz: good, Milan is far away in my memory. Could you please point me to that bug?
<mruiz> DktrKranz, bug 180625
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 180625 in mnemosyne "Request Mnemosyne package upgrade to version 1.0" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/180625
<DktrKranz> ok, as promised a century ago, I'll have a look :)
<mruiz> thanks DktrKranz
<DktrKranz> mruiz: I like complex things (so I like interdiffs...), but we recently switch to .diff.gz to review new upstream candidates. You may want to use it in future revisions or in outstanding bugs to attract sponsors.
<pochu> persia: thanks for the emesene review. I'll get that sorted out (the copyright issues with upstream).
<persia> pochu: Good luck on a fast turnaround.
<persia> pochu: Any chance you'd like to look at lashwrap or libini4j?
<mruiz> DktrKranz, I prepared an interdiff too :-)
<pochu> persia: what are those? :)
<mruiz> DktrKranz, Do you need the diff.gz ? I can upload it right now
<DktrKranz> mruiz: no, I like interdiffs
<mruiz> :)
<rhpot1991_laptop> I could use some debconf help if anyone is available
<persia> pochu: lashwrap is a little wrapper that allows one to add (limited) Linux Audio Session Handler support to any application, and libini4j is a java library for reading ini files that is the last dependency for updating netbeans for hardy.
<ScottK> If anyone wants practice with security fixes or working with python packages, Bug #191198 is available ...
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 191198 in python-cherrypy "[python-cherrypy] [CVE-2008-0252] missing input sanitising, remote vulnerability" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/191198
<jdong> DktrKranz: where is it documented on the wiki our current sponsorship preferences?
<pochu> persia: I can have a look, but I've never looked at a java package, and I don't know much regarding sound :-)
<DktrKranz> jdong: it was decided in latest MOTU meeting, IIRC
<pochu> persia: looking into them
<persia> jdong: It's not.  Please feel free to update the docs before I get to them :)
<persia> pochu: Thank you.
<jdong> DktrKranz: ah ok. A good decision IMO, because we reviewers can still interdiff it ourselves...
<pochu> Oh they are even advocate :-)
<pochu> +d
<jdong> no loss of information
<DktrKranz> jdong: there's a wiki page where we discussed review methods, probably under UbuntuDevelopment/CodeReviews
<DktrKranz> or Interdiff itself
<persia> jdong: I think the original idea of interdiffs (way back) was that they were supposed to be smaller than diff.gz.  During my effort to automate the production of packages from interdiffs, I was advised that this was not the case.
<persia> Places needing updates are the package update recipie, the Interdiff page, MOTU/Contributing, and there likely needs to be a new page describing the process for generating a source package from a diff.gz
<DktrKranz> persia: it depends on .diff.gz size, I guess. With small .diff.gz's, .interdiffs usually get bigger
<jdong> persia: oh, ok
<persia> DktrKranz: Actually, due to the lack of hunking support in combinediff, an interdiff is always the size of the old diff.gz plus the size of the new diff.gz, and possibly uncompressed.  gzip helps a little with the duplication for interdiff.gz, but I'd be surprised to find a case where interdiff.gz was smaller than diff.gz and the package could be reconstructed from the interdiff.
<HighNo> ScottK: Is tells us a fix is already released for hardy?! What would there be to be done?
<ScottK> HighNo: Dapper/Edgy/Feisty/Gutsy fixes
<HighNo> ScottK: ok, so I would have to 'backport' the patch, right?
<DktrKranz> persia: no hunks? I wasn't aware of that (probably because I never read an interdiff directly), so you are right.
<persia> DktrKranz: Yep.  interdiff -z -p1 would be smaller, but it often doesn't work to reconstruct, which is why moving to diff.gz makes sense.
<ScottK> HighNo: Yes.  You'd get the fix and then package it with a security changelog entry, test it, and attach a debiff to the bug.
<persia> DktrKranz: Also, I'd recommend reading the output of interdiff -z -p1 in a pager.  It's a good indication of the packaging changes for a new upstream.
<HighNo> ScottK: sounds interesting though I would need a lot of guidance in that
<persia> (but not actually a valid patch)
<\sh> hmm...
<\sh> is there anywhere a policy how to name perl module packages?
<ScottK> HighNo: I can probably coach you through at least parts of the first one.  After that you'll have it.
<ScottK> \sh: Yes.  AFAIK it's in perl policy
<persia> RAOF: I can't get the build-deps for do-plugins installed in a clean chroot today (even manually).  I'll take another look tomorrow, in the hopes that something will change.  Sorry.
<ScottK> But it may just be debian-perl team policy.  Not sure
<\sh> ScottK got it :)
<\sh> http://www.debian.org/doc/packaging-manuals/perl-policy/ch-module_packages.html#s-package_names
<DktrKranz> mruiz: I don't know if this is one of the cases persia referred to, but:
<DktrKranz> Reversed (or previously applied) patch detected!  Assume -R? [n]
<DktrKranz> Apply anyway? [n]
<DktrKranz> 1 out of 1 hunk ignored -- saving rejects to file /tmp/interdiff-1.Drt1l0.rej
<DktrKranz> interdiff: Error applying patch1 to reconstructed file
<mruiz> ups
<DktrKranz> mruiz: erm... my fault. I got mnemosyne_0.9.9-1.dsc instead of mnemosyne_0.9.9-1.diff.gz :)
<mruiz> :)
<persia> heh
 * DktrKranz hates TAB key
<HighNo> ScottK: I got the source, now I would like to get the patch for hardy but I can't see a way in launchpad to download that as I don't see a link to that file there
<HighNo> ScottK (I'd start with a feisty fix as I have it installed)
<DktrKranz> mruiz: looks good, but I have not X to test it ATM, so I'll have to delay detailed review for a couple of hours
<ScottK> HighNo: Go to the Debian Security Notice linked in the bug and you'll see packages for etch linked.  Diff those against the released etch package and you'll know the fix. http://ftp.debian.org/debian/pool/main/p/python-cherrypy/
<ScottK> HighNo: http://packages.qa.debian.org/p/python-cherrypy.html may also be useful.
<HighNo> ScottK: thanks
<mruiz> DktrKranz : thanks... we're improving ;-)
<DktrKranz> mruiz: you implemented debian/patches/01_python_shebang_fix.dpatch, did you use dpatch?
<linux__alien> Hi LucidFox
<mruiz> DktrKranz, no . Do I need to rename the patch ?
<DktrKranz> mruiz: also, watch file isn't accurate. Try with http://sf.net/mnemosyne-proj/mnemosyne-(.*)\.tgz
<LucidFox> hi linux__alien
<DktrKranz> mruiz: It seems you forgot to implement a patch system, so your patch won't be applieed, no matter which name you choose
<linux__alien> i ve started working on the bug LucidFox
<LucidFox> great!
<mruiz> DktrKranz, any suggestion about patching ?
<bddebian> Heya gang
<DktrKranz> mruiz: if you have to setup a packaging system from scratch, dpatch is the simplest one, I prefer quilt just because it's more difficult :)
<DktrKranz> s/packaging/patch/
<mruiz> :)
<linux__alien> LucidFox, i am sorry again i am struggling i made a mistake
<linux__alien> LucidFox, i need your help
<linux__alien> LucidFox, I am not able to download the package . The link in launchpad does not have the package where should i download it from
<LucidFox> linux__alien> what do you mean? There is a link
<DktrKranz> mruiz: this page is very simple, but it tells you everything you need to know about dpatch: http://matrixhasu.altervista.org/index.php?view=use_dpatch (point No. 4), unless you want to use quilt :)
<sistpoty|work> hi bddebian
<linux__alien> LucidFox, this is the link i am looking at
<linux__alien> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/avidemux/+bug/189584
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 189584 in ddtp-ubuntu "Typo" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<mruiz> thanks DktrKranz ... I'll read it
<bddebian> Heya sistpoty|work
<LucidFox> linux__alien> yes, then click the overview link
<LucidFox> which will bring you here: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/avidemux
<\sh> hopefully I'm lucky to push some new packages to hardy today
<LucidFox> linux__alien> and then click the latest version number
<sistpoty|work> \sh: why did you join ubuntu-universe-contributors?
<linux__alien> ok there you have development,current,supported etc
<linux__alien> i should select hardy
<linux__alien> right?
<linux__alien> but here i ve a doubt where does the bug actually prevail does it exist in all versions of ubuntu or only in hardy?
<\sh> sistpoty|work, just because I saw too late, that I was an indirect member :)
<sistpoty|work> \sh: heh
<\sh> ok my first upload to revu after a long long time :)
 * ScottK2 cheers.
 * \sh needs some packages to rollout ubuntu servers in his new company ,-) nice sideeffect building new packages ;)
 * sistpoty|work hopes that the packages will be small *g*
<LucidFox> linux__alien> you should select the last version in hardy - that is, 2.4.0-0.3ubuntu1
<linux__alien> yes ve selected that but what does ubuntu1 and ubuntu3 stand for ?
<LucidFox> linux__alien> let me explain
<\sh> sistpoty|work, the first is just 16k with all debian stuff I think
<linux__alien> ya thanks :)
<LucidFox> the Ubuntu package version is (upstream-version)-X if the package was synced verbatim from Debian
<LucidFox> where X is a number
<HighNo> ScottK: OK, now I have the diff
<\sh> sistpoty|work, when does the frontend updates its list?
<sistpoty|work> \sh: as soon as the package got accepted by the cron job (*/10 iirc)
<LucidFox> for example, f-spot 0.4.1-4 means that the upstream version is 0.4.1 and this is the fourth revision of the Debian package
<\sh> sistpoty|work, cool thx :)
<LucidFox> if there are Ubuntu modifications, it gets an additional "ubuntuY" qualifier: -XubuntuY
<LucidFox> for example, the current Hardy version of F-Spot is 0.4.1-4ubuntu3; it means that the package is based on Debian version 0.4.1-4 with 3 Ubuntu modifications
<HighNo> ScottK: and the apt-get source for the ubuntu version. I guess I now have to change the source and have to run debdiff afterwards?
<ScottK2> HighNo: If the package already has a patch system, use that.
<ScottK2> Then make your debdiff.
<LucidFox> linux__alien> so, for avidemux, if you create a debdiff, you will bump the Ubuntu version number from 1:2.4.0-0.3ubuntu1 to ubuntu2
<linux__alien> LucidFox, i understood it but does that mean as far as the author of the software is concerned its 0.4.1-4 but in Ubuntu its got 3 modifications and hence ubuntu3 is it?
<sistpoty|work> \sh: there now..., I just triggered the upload queue manually
<ScottK2> HighNo: When you make your debian/changelog entry, use dch -S (I think it's a big S).
<\sh> sistpoty|work, http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=libdaemon-generic-perl => directory (/var/revu/revu1-incoming/libdaemon-generic-perl-0802121656/) of upload (1963) not found
<sistpoty|work> grml
<\sh> sistpoty|work, you broke it ;)
<LucidFox> linux__alien> as far as the author of the software is concerned, the version is everything before the dash - that is, 0.4.1
<linux__alien> yes
<linux__alien> got it
<linux__alien> then ?
<LucidFox> but the package may be modified in Debian and Ubuntu
 * ScottK2 will be back in a bit.  If someone else could help HighNo with his security fix, I'd appreciate it.
<linux__alien> Ok got it but does it include the modifications done in K/X/buntu families too?
<LucidFox> so in -XubuntuY, X is the number of Debian uploads before the package was synced/merged into Ubuntu, and Y is the number of Ubuntu uploads since then
<LucidFox> no, all Ubuntu variations are maintained in the same repository
<\sh> sistpoty|work, reupload?
<sistpoty|work> \sh: if you don't mind, I'd rather like to see why this happened (again) today... this time it is not the free space
<linux__alien> ok so if its incremented in Ubuntu it would be same across the other families too so how does it get incremented more than once in the same release? is it possible?
<LucidFox> linux__alien> the Ubuntu increment is global for all of its subprojects
<\sh> sistpoty|work, done
<linux__alien> got it
<LucidFox> linux__alien> for example, Dolphin is part of Kubuntu, but the version number is  	0.9.2-0ubuntu4, not kubuntu4
<linux__alien> oh ok
<LucidFox> the 0 before ubuntu4 means that the package is not based on a Debian upload, and instead packaged directly for Ubuntu
<sistpoty|work> \sh: same problem as before
<DktrKranz> HighNo: I'm more comfortable with SRUs, but I prepared a couple of security updates, if you have questions, feel free to ask :)
<sistpoty|work> \sh: /me takes a look at the strange process_uploads script
<linux__alien> LucidFox, thats interesting :)
<\sh> sistpoty|work, take your time...you'll revu later anyhow ,)
<sistpoty|work> heh
<LucidFox> linux__alien> and avidemux was merged from debian-multimedia.org, which uses a dotted versioning notation. The original package was 1:2.4.0-0.3, and it was modified for Ubuntu once, hence 0.3ubuntu1
<HighNo> DktrKranz: great. I know there is a command for creating a patch in a package which will setup everything, i can do my changes, and on exit it created the patch. Now how on earth was that beast called... ?
<linux__alien> Oh thanks i was searching for 0 in a package as an example :)
<DktrKranz> HighNo: could you please point me to the bug? My backlog filled up and I missed it
<HighNo> https://launchpad.net/bugs/191198
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 191198 in python-cherrypy "[python-cherrypy] [CVE-2008-0252] missing input sanitising, remote vulnerability" [Undecided,Confirmed]
 * persia wonders if anyone uses Rails, and whether they feel like investigating about an upgrade from 1.2.6 to 2.0.2 (and the associated libraries, etc.) in the next couple days.
<\sh> persia, you'll break all apps using rails 1.2.6
<HighNo> DktrKranz: I just need that patch create command right now
<\sh> persia, you need to update all config files when doing an update...(that happened to me last time in my last company)
<sistpoty|work> while still unsure of what exactly is going wrong, I guess it won't hurt blaming StevenK, as linda's rfc822 parser produces backtraces *g*
<\sh> s/update/upgrade/
<LucidFox> persia, could you please readvocate tovid?
<DktrKranz> HighNo: I'm getting the sources to see what patch system is implemented
<persia> \sh: Yep.  I'm not interested enough to do that, but was just reviewing upstream variance with Debian, and thought I'd mention it in case anyone really wanted Rails 2.0 for hardy.
<persia> LucidFox: I'll take a look once I get through the mdt list.  Maybe you can find another advocate?
<\sh> persia, how did debian solved the problem? introducing a rails2 package?
<LucidFox> persia> All right.
<persia> \sh: Etch didn't have rails.  Lenny will have 2.x.  There is no problem :)
<\sh> persia, ok...so I think we are good with rails1 and for hardy+1 we can inject rails2 and blow up youtube ,->
<\sh> or whatever will use ruby+rails *harhar*
<\sh> oh no..youtube is using python ;)
<LucidFox> linux__alien> So, if the number before ubuntuN is something other than 0, it means that this upstream version got into Ubuntu from elsewhere (generally Debian). And if there's no ubuntuN, it means the package wasn't modified within Ubuntu.
<persia> \sh: I'm happy with that.  Like I said, I don't really have an opinion, just know that there's some buzz about it, and significant version skew
 * persia is rather happy to no longer be a rails programmer
<linux__alien> oh ok thanks
<DktrKranz> HighNo: you may want to use cdbs-edit-patch patchname
<linux__alien> i am looking in the bug . The bug says there is a typo the version has to be version
<sistpoty|work> \sh: how did you generate your changes-file?
<linux__alien> and it affects cli, qt and GTK
<LucidFox> linux__alien> right
<sistpoty|work> \sh: because it doesn't contain a "Description" field
<\sh> sistpoty|work, debuild -S -sa -k'0xC098EFA8!' because my gpg cardreader is in the company :)
<\sh> what
<LucidFox> linux__alien> so you'll have to edit debian/control and correct the typo
<\sh> ?
<linux__alien> ok i found it by grepping for it ;)
<sistpoty|work> \sh: I guess someone broke dpkg-source... that's why revu is bailing out
<linux__alien> but what version shoud i put in for qt and gtk
<\sh> sistpoty|work, wtf?
<linux__alien> where do i find the version numbers for it
<DktrKranz> crimsun: around?
<joejaxx> :\
<HighNo> DktrKranz: Yepp, that was it
<joejaxx> \sh: did i hear cardreader? :D
 * joejaxx wants to play with smartcards on linux
<\sh> sistpoty|work, that's serious
<sistpoty|work> \sh: 5.5 of the policy says, there needs to be a description field in a .changes file. linda's rfc822 parser produces backtraces, if there isn't and that's because revu won't do the right thing with your upload
<\sh> new dpkg package is coming
<\sh> grmpf
<\sh> who the heck did that
<sistpoty|work> \sh: so since you used debuild, I assume that it calls dpkg-genchanges (or whatever it is called) which does the changes file wrong
<\sh> joejaxx, aeh yes, I have an usb smartcard reader
<\sh> joejaxx, but never inserted a different card then my gpg card :)
<joejaxx> \sh: :D would you be able to point me to a specific model? :)
<joejaxx> \sh: oh
<joejaxx> lol
<AnAnt> Hello, I've uploaded ubuntume-themes & ubuntume-gdm-themes to revu about 2 hours ago, yet when I access their page on revu I get something like: directory (/var/revu/revu1-incoming/ubuntume-gdm-themes-0802121510/) of upload (1955) not found
<\sh> joejaxx, I can send you an email tonight when I'm at home :) looks like that I left it at home and not in my rucksack :)
<sistpoty|work> AnAnt: /me checks
<joejaxx> \sh: ok sure :D
<linux__alien> LucidFox, you there?
<sistpoty|work> AnAnt: same problem as \sh... I'll try to find the real problem (which is from a broken dpkg-dev package, I believe)
<LucidFox> linux__alien> yes
<\sh> sistpoty|work, just installed the update...no change
<linux__alien> how do i get to know the exact version of the qt, GTK and CLI
<\sh> sistpoty|work, it's been wished
<\sh>   * Some code refactoring on dpkg-genchanges and bug fixes in the generation
<\sh>     of the Description: field. As a result, source only uploads will no more
<\sh>     have Description fields.
<linux__alien> which version numbers should i place it in control file
<\sh> sistpoty|work, says changelog dpkg (1.14.16) unstable; urgency=low
<LucidFox> linux__alien> The version is the same for the entire source package, and it is managed via debian/changelog, not debian/control.
<sistpoty|work> \sh: that's against the policy! and there is a reason why... it breaks revu!
<LucidFox> linux__alien> The bug is in a typo: the word "version" is spelled "verison"
<linux__alien> :-o
<\sh> sistpoty|work, tell raphael herzog that
<linux__alien> i thought i ve to put the version numbers there :(
<sistpoty|work> buxy: you broke revu >P
<sistpoty|work> :P
<linux__alien> LucidFox, the spelling is right in the control file
<buxy> sistpoty|work: 1.14.17 will have it back
<sistpoty|work> buxy: wohoo, thanks!
 * vorian was afraid he broke revu
<linux__alien> ok got it
<buxy> it's still impressive to see how many people are using fields which are not really normed
<linux__alien> in the control file
<buxy> and how removing it can break lots of stuff
<buxy> (in unexpected ways)
<sistpoty|work> buxy: erm... it's in policy (which told me linda, which is the real reason for the breakage *g*)
<LucidFox> linux__alien> Since you're into it, please also change QT and GTK to Qt and GTK+ respectively
<linux__alien> grepped for verison and changed it in all necessary places
<linux__alien> :)
<linux__alien> now i ve to build it right
<linux__alien> debuild -S
<LucidFox> wait
<linux__alien> right?
<linux__alien> ok
<LucidFox> linux__alien> in the control file, please also replace the text "QT4" with "Qt 4" and "GTK" with "GTK+"
<linux__alien> done
<LucidFox> linux__alien> excellent, now create a debian/changelog entry for your changes
<spiekey> Hello!
<LucidFox> linux__alien> what is your favorite text editor?
<linux__alien> vim
<linux__alien> dch -i
<linux__alien> right?
<LucidFox> hello spiekey
<LucidFox> linux__alien> you can use EDITOR=vim dch -i
<LucidFox> this will open debian/changelog in vim instead of nano
<spiekey> any idea how i could get a recent nss_ldap onto my dapper box?
<linux__alien> ok so if its just dch -i it uses nano is it?
<jpatrick> LucidFox: EDITOR=vim should be enough (works here)
<LucidFox> linux__alien> by default, yes; you can also add the line "export EDITOR=vim" to your ~/.bashrc file to avoid typing it in the future
<LucidFox> (this change will apply after you reopen the terminal)
<linux__alien> ok thanks
<linux__alien> i ve edited the file and saved it
<linux__alien> with dch -i and saved it also
<HighNo> DktrKranz: how exactly should the dch call look like and what to put in the entry so the launchpad bug is registered?
<linux__alien> now debuild _S right?
<linux__alien> sorry debuild -S
<LucidFox> linux__alien> please make sure that you set the distribution to "hardy" and referenced the LP bug number using (LP: #xxx)
<AnAnt> sistpoty|work: so are the packages on revu (ie. can they be reviewed somehow) or not ?
<rhpot1991_laptop> can anyone tell me if they see any reason why my debconf note in here isn't launching: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=mythexport
<DktrKranz> HighNo: dch -s -D release-security (where release is the one you want to propose your security fix for)
<linux__alien> LucidFox, have one doubt is it ok if i make 2 entries in the changelog file
<linux__alien> i by mistake saved it without updating the BUG ID in the changeLog
<sistpoty|work> AnAnt: revu's codebase needs to be fixed first... I hope to have it accept the new changes files soon
<LucidFox> linux__alien> no, there should be only one; don't use dch -i for the second change
<DktrKranz> HighNo: gutsy, for instance, would have dch -s -D gutsy-security
<LucidFox> linux__alien> for the second change, just open debian/changelog directly
<linux__alien> ve done it now :(
<linux__alien> what do i do delete it manually by opening the changelog file ?
<LucidFox> linux__alien> yes
<linux__alien> ok
<LucidFox> delete one of the entries and correct the other
<linux__alien> ok
<\sh> sistpoty|work, buxy : so we need it fast ;) before the 14th...and someone needs to merge it properly or re-introduce the description field in source.changes again
<DktrKranz> HighNo: for good changelog templates, you can find useful examples here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SecurityUpdateProcedures
<linux__alien> LucidFox, ok got the package but again fails in the signing part
<buxy> \sh: it's rather unlikely that dpkg will be released in two days
<sistpoty|work> \sh: I'll do a hotfix on linda's parser for now (locally only on sparky), so that it can cope with a changes file w.o. description
<buxy> http://git.debian.org/?p=dpkg/dpkg.git;a=commit;h=15fa75bd7143d6ec54f0a77c482ff0cfb72bf440
<buxy> ^that's the commit to cherry-pick if you want to make a special upload in Ubuntu
<LucidFox> linux__alien> correct the signing part in debian/changelog as well
<\sh> buxy, I think this is necessary, regarding the time
<linux__alien> LucidFox, how do i do that i ve given the proper entries in that file but it fails
<linux__alien> i ve given my email address and my name
<linux__alien> is there anything else should i give
<LucidFox> linux__alien> no; just verify that it matches the output of gpg -K
<linux__alien> LucidFox, should i give the comment also in the file ie when i do gpg -K it says MyName (Comment) <Email>
<linux__alien> should i give it in the same order in the changelog file ?
<buxy> \sh: necessary or not, I'm not an Ubuntu developer... :)
<\sh> buxy, I'm taking care of it :)
<LucidFox> linux__alien> leave the comment out
<linux__alien> but other than that everything else is the same but it still fails
<linux__alien> the changelog has the date in the same line
<linux__alien> apart from that
<\sh> buxy, and you should become one ;)
<joejaxx> \sh: did you get your gpg smartcard from fsfe?
<\sh> joejaxx, nope
<\sh> joejaxx, as a present from a former colleague :)
<joejaxx> is there a general place you can get them?
<LucidFox> linux__alien> Okay, try adding the comment...
<joejaxx> ah
<\sh> joejaxx, looks like it.
<LucidFox> (I have no idea why it would fail, though)
<buxy> \sh: thanks but my work on the debian side benefits both :)
<\sh> buxy, hehe...so you are able to sponsor some perl packages which I wanted to post to revu now ,)
<buxy> \sh: come in #debian-perl @ OTFC, lots of nice people to sponsor perl packages :)
<\sh> buxy, will do when I'm home :)
<\sh> and now I'm going home :) bbl
<LucidFox> linux__alien> Or you can ignore the whole signing part for now; the dsc was created, so you can generate the debdiff anyway
<linux__alien> now it works its asking for the PassPhrase is it possible to find out the pass phrase ?
<linux__alien> i forgot it i believe
<linux__alien> :(
<mruiz> DktrKranz, dpatch rules :-)
<DktrKranz> mruiz: quilt more :)
<jeromeg> DktrKranz: hello, I upload the debdiff for klavaro feisty, and gpocentek will test it too, thanks to you both :)
<DktrKranz> jeromeg: GOOD!
<jeromeg> DktrKranz: I thought this SRU would never be accepted ;)
<DktrKranz> jeromeg: recently we had a policy change, so even minor patches have a chance to be SRU worthy. But this is not the case since it isn't a minor bug :)
<DktrKranz> jeromeg: I tested it both for italian and english locale, two segfaults
<DktrKranz> so it is definitely SRU-worthy
<jeromeg> DktrKranz: after the patch or before ? (i'm worried :) )
<DktrKranz> jeromeg: of course before
<jeromeg> oh ok ! :)
<linux__alien> Ok done
<linux__alien> LucidFox, its signed
<linux__alien> now whats to be done
<linux__alien> the debdiff right?
<DktrKranz> after your patch, a nice recap showing me I was not fluid :)
<jeromeg> DktrKranz: i might try to proceed other SRUs
<jeromeg> DktrKranz: lol :)
<LucidFox> linux__alien> right
<jeromeg> DktrKranz: i've a few patches for gnumeric but there's one important missing and upstream doesn't want to provide it, and I can't find it on the svn
<DktrKranz> jeromeg: since I typed "little test." in less than a second, I guess what the heck mean "fluid" for it
<linux__alien> avidemux_2.4.0-0.3ubuntu3.dsc
<linux__alien> is this right?
<jeromeg> DktrKranz: :)
<LucidFox> linux__alien> no, should be ubuntu2
<DktrKranz> jeromeg: if those are well-defined and it is easy to isolate single test cases for each, they are good
<LucidFox> linux__alien> look at debian/changelog again
<jeromeg> DktrKranz: ok
<linux__alien> i ve only one entry
<linux__alien> +--  6 lines: avidemux (1:2.4.0-0.3ubuntu3) hardy; urgency=low -- Balaji (My Key)  -------------------------------
<linux__alien> +-- 16 lines: avidemux (1:2.4.0-0.3ubuntu1) hardy; urgency=low -- Matvey Kozhev  --
<linux__alien> this is what i ve
<mruiz> DktrKranz, is correct this line as unpatch target: rm -rf patch-stamp debian/patches ?
<linux__alien> should i do it again from scratch ?
<pochu> persia: emesene has been accepted (I uploaded it to the archive instead of to revu by mistake) but I'll get your points sored out for the next svn revision
<LucidFox> linux__alien> no, just change the version of the most recent entry from ubuntu3 to ubuntu2
<hexmode> anyone else want to be my second on http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=php-xdebug ?
<persia> pochu: If an archive admin accepts it like that, please correct their interpretation of licensing (and fix it).
<DktrKranz> mruiz: usually unpatch lies near clean:
<tuxmaniac> can somone please review http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=alliance
<persia> pochu: For extra points, fix it quick, and reupload before the archive-admin gets to it.  superceded uploads are almost never reviewed :)
<pochu> persia: err, the archive-admin *already* got to it, and accepted it
<persia> pochu: Err.  Point them at the REVU comment: we need less of that :(
<linux__alien> LucidFox, ok now i ve done the debdiff too
<linux__alien> what do i do now
<LucidFox> linux__alien> upload it to the LP bug
<linux__alien> last time i stopped here :)
<linux__alien> ve to click on add attachment  is it?
<linux__alien> and comment should be the corrected the typo errors in the file something like that right?
<linux__alien> and attachment should be the diff file right?
<linux__alien> is this all i need to do ?
<jdstrand> ScottK2: fyi looking at clamav now
<linux__alien> LucidFox, is this fine ?
<linux__alien> whatever i ve mentioned above
<linux__alien> can i upload it ?
<LucidFox> linux__alien> wait
<linux__alien> am sorry i had by mistake clicked on Save what do i do ? :-o
<LucidFox> linux__alien> yes, now you can subscribe ubuntu-universe-sponsors to that bug
<LucidFox> the sponsors will review your debdiff and upload it
<linux__alien> i ve uploaded it in LP thats ok right?
<LucidFox> linux__alien> yes
<linux__alien> how do i subscribe that sponsors
<linux__alien> where is that option
<linux__alien> is it in LP?
<sistpoty|work> launchpad
<pochu> persia: I have a patch/request for emesene upstreams to fix the licnese issues. I'll upload a new tarball as soon as they commit it (which should happen in one/two days hopefully). Is that OK with you?
 * persia decides to test requestsync again
<pochu> persia: http://emesene.org/trac/ticket/373
<linux__alien> i ve clicked on subscribe someone else option its asking for a name
<linux__alien> so i ve to give ubuntu-universe-sponsors as the name of the person is it?
<persia> pochu: Sure.  I can't test it (no MSN account), and I'm not motivated enough to file a removal request for emesene when there are so many more deserving applications to remove :)  Thanks for working to fix it.
<DktrKranz> jeromeg: got mail for klavaro SRU, I'm test building and in a couple of hours I'll be able to test it on Feisty box
<jeromeg> DktrKranz: thank you very much
<pochu> persia: my pleasure. Thanks for your review ;-)
<persia> pochu: Now about libini4j or lashwrap :)
<Riddell> superm1: do you know why liberation font is in multiverse?
<LucidFox> linux__alien> yes
<RainCT> linux__alien: yes
<DktrKranz> jeromeg: if gauvain has feisty too, mind asking him to check bug 124896 ?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 124896 in spe "spe 0.8.2a+repack-1 fails with python-wxgtk2.8" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/124896
<sistpoty|work> \sh_away: revu can cope with the new changes files now
<persia> RainCT: Are you swamped for FeatureFreeze?
<sistpoty|work> \sh_away: I've put back your upload
<sistpoty|work> \sh_away: and removed the stale ones
<linux__alien> LucidFox, done
<linux__alien> thats it ?
<RainCT> Riddell: if it helps, on Debian they rejected the liberation fonts because they don't like some of the clauses added by RedHat.. there's a discussion about it somewhere on the mailinglist
<mruiz> hi all... I got this lintian error: no-description-in-changes-file ...how can I fix it ?
<HighNo> DktrKranz: hm, the changes in debian/changelog should not be part of the patch, right?
<LucidFox> linux__alien> good work, now wait until a sponsor reviews and uploads your changes
<Riddell> RainCT: how strange, it's gpl
<DktrKranz> HighNo: do you refer to DebianMaintainerField?
<HighNo> DktrKranz: and waht's about the maintainerfield change?
<LucidFox> Any idea what could cause this FTBFS? http://launchpadlibrarian.net/11876047/buildlog_ubuntu-hardy-i386.subtitleeditor_0.20.0-1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<HighNo> DktrKranz: no, i was referring to the changelog entry
<LucidFox> dpkg-gencontrol: failure: cannot read -: No such file or directory
<DktrKranz> HighNo: oh... I misunderstood. No, changelog entry has to be done *outside* of the patch
<LucidFox> Error: parsed ddeb section or priority is empty
<linux__alien> Thanks LucidFox for your help and advice
<linux__alien> what next :)
<linux__alien> ?
<LucidFox> linux__alien> now wait :)
<Riddell> RainCT: hmm, I see, the "exception" is actually a limiting trademark clause
<RainCT> persia: swamped?
<HighNo> DktrKranz: came to my mind a little too late. I have to patch my patch...
<persia> RainCT: Do you expect to have some free development time?
<linux__alien> i ll have to wait until this is closed is it ? is it something like that in Ubuntu ie a bug fixer fixes a bug and only when its uploaded he can start working on the other bug is it?
<linux__alien> just to know the process
<LucidFox> linux__alien> no, you can work on multiple bugs at once
<linux__alien> so can i ?
<linux__alien> :)
<linux__alien> very eager to start an other one :)
<LucidFox> of course!
<linux__alien> something in the code as such ?
<linux__alien> ie in a small gnome application or stuff like that
<RainCT> persia: hm.. depending for what
<linux__alien> so that i can download it compile it try fixing it and then do the same :)
<DktrKranz> HighNo: no big trouble... cdbs-edit-patch patchname
<persia> RainCT: Adding a script to ubuntu-dev-tools to turn a diff.gz file into a Debian-format source package.
<LucidFox> linux__alien> When I find an easy bug, I'll let you know; you can also try looking yourself
<LucidFox> which will probably be faster :)
<linux__alien> ok sure :)
<linux__alien> so now i ve fixed one bug in Ubuntu is it
<linux__alien> ?
<linux__alien> :)
<RainCT> persia: do you have such a script or does it need to be written?
<HighNo> DktrKranz: now again - the maintainer field - which one should I change to what value?
<linux__alien> Hey LucidFox Thanks for your help and time i am ready for the next bug but now a little bit tired and really happy that i ve contributed in a very small manner to this wonderful project and want do more to this
<linux__alien> so will log in back tomorrow :)
<linux__alien> my first patch to this MOTU happened today :)
<persia> RainCT: I have a non-robust script for interdiffs.  Dropping the combinediff bits ought reduce to the diff.gz case.  Something like filterdiff -z -i '*/debian/*' diff.gz | patch -p1 && (debian/rules get-orig-source || uscan --force-download) && rm -r debian && $(insert nifty .dsc file creation code here)
<DktrKranz> HighNo: now it is Maintainer: Gustavo Noronha Silva <kov@debian.org>
<DktrKranz> HighNo: your change must replace it with:
<DktrKranz> Maintainer: Ubuntu MOTU Developers <ubuntu-motu@lists.ubuntu.com>
<DktrKranz> XSBC-Original-Maintainer: Gustavo Noronha Silva <kov@debian.org>
<HighNo> DktrKranz: it already has been before
<linux__alien> Ok cya all
<linux__alien> cya LucidFox
<persia> RainCT: It7s the last part that stumps me.  One needs to create the target directory, enter it, run tar --strip -1 -xzf ../orig.tar.gz && zcat ../diff.gz | patch -p1 or something.
<persia> Then dpkg-source -b ought do it.
<DktrKranz> HighNo: you don't have to change it, then
<persia> On the other hand, there ought be a way to do it directly, perhaps based on the dpkg-source source
<HighNo> DktrKranz: ok, so now I do the debdiff ?
<mruiz>  no-description-in-changes-file is a lintian bug ?
<persia> mruiz: Or a dpkg bug, depending on your viewpoint
<mruiz> persia, I was reading about it on debian ML... It seems that lintian 1.2.43 will fix this issue
<mruiz> ups, 1.23.43
<persia> mruiz: Yes, for Debian, a new lintian will fix it.  I don't remember the outcome of the discussion for hardy.
<DktrKranz> HighNo: sure
<mruiz> DktrKranz, I'm finishing with mnemosyne fixes ;-)
<DktrKranz> mruiz: good
<RainCT> persia: so what's the problem? that you don't know the name of the files or what?
<RainCT> *the name the files will have
<persia> RainCT: That, and having smart orig.tar.gz handling to cover the case where the directory name doesn't match what is desired, or there is no top level directory.
<persia> Also, having some nice robust error handling, so the user knows what to tell the diff.gz submitter if it doesn't work.
<persia> And lastly, having time to write & test it in the next 43 hours :)
<persia> RainCT: For the file names, that ought be somewhat discoverable from the output of lsdiff -z diff.gz.
<RainCT> persia: I don't think I can be of much help with that (I never used many of those commands you listed), sorry :(
<AnAnt_> Stefan Potyra: thanks
<jpatrick> AnAnt_: that'll be sistpoty|work :)
<AnAnt_> sistpoty|work: thanks
<DktrKranz> gpocentek: I saw you update debdiff in bug 41491. If you want, please go ahead and upload.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 41491 in wzdftpd "Dapper: Broken dependencies for some wzdftpd modules" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/41491
<sistpoty|work> AnAnt_: no problem, and again sorry for the inconvenience
<AnAnt_> sistpoty|work: no probs
<persia> AnAnt_: You asked about native packages earlier.
<crevette> hello
<tbutter> anyone would like to give http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=jodviewer a review?
<crevette> thanks to the person who have fix my upload on revu
<AnAnt_> persia: yeah
<AnAnt_> persia: btw, I re-uploaded GDM themes package
<persia> The reason I don't like them for derivatives is that typically the derivative team wants to maintain the branding, etc, in some external VCS, which is then packaged for the distribution.
<AnAnt_> persia: and uploading ubuntume-themes now
<crevette> superm1: hello, If you can review my package (as you have already started), I would be thanksfull
<persia> I think the mythbuntu team is a good example of how this can be done well.
<mruiz> DktrKranz, do you prefer an interdiff?
<DktrKranz> mruiz: this time a .diff.gz would be advisable
<mruiz> :)
<DktrKranz> so anyone can review it following our new procedures
<RainCT> am I the only one having problems with launchpad.net and *ubuntu.com?
<jpatrick> anyone else unable to get a experimental pbuild with: "pbuilder-dist experimental nolog create" ?
<jpatrick> RainCT: it's your modem, yes
<geser> jpatrick: could it be that experimental isn't self-hosted?
<persia> RainCT: Yes
<jpatrick> geser: well, I kinda need a experimental pbuild for KDE 4 packages :-)
<persia> jpatrick: Create an unstable chroot, and dist-upgrade to a combination of unstable and experimental
 * RainCT gets "Connection to 91.189.90.* Failed" :S
<crevette> if someone can review http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=obex-data-server
<crevette> thanks for your time
<jpatrick> persia: ok, but will that work for pbuild?
<mruiz> DktrKranz, mnemosyne is ready for another review
<persia> jpatrick: Maybe.  experimental+unstable is expected to be broken regularly.
<gpocentek> DktrKranz: ok thanks, I was just wondering if dapper-proposed is the correct target?
<persia> pochu: You're uploading libini4j-java, or you're fine with an upload with a couple tweaks?
<DktrKranz> gpocentek: it is.
<jpatrick> persia: hmm, so no way to check if a kde4 may/may not build?
<persia> jpatrick: empirically?
<jpatrick> s/kde4/kde4 package/
<DktrKranz> gpocentek: you'll receive a "waiting for distro manager" mail, so you will have to wait an archive-admin to approve it before it begins to build and to be spread to the world.
<DktrKranz> mruiz: good
<DktrKranz> mruiz: I'll have a look in a couple of hours, now let's get out of the office :)
<gpocentek> DktrKranz: ok
<jpatrick> persia: I know it works on Ubuntu, however all kde4 packages in Debian live in experimental
<mruiz> thanks DktrKranz ... I learned how to patch with dpatch ;-)
<DktrKranz> mruiz: and now, you'll have to learn yada :D
<DktrKranz> and please, teach me once you have learned it :)
<persia> jpatrick: Right.  experimental doesn't live by itself, it lives in combination with unstable.  The names should give some indication of how likely it is that any given combination of build-dependencies will work.  You might seek a debian KDE channel for better guidance.
<mruiz> DktrKranz, hahaha
 * persia notes that yada packages are an exception to the minimal diff rule, and may be repackaged at will
<lakin> Maybe this is the wrong place to ask, but I'll ask anyways.  A friend of mine need to compile a new PHP package for Ubuntu due to a known bug with using different gd versions or some such, is there a good tutorial or howto for something like that?
<AnAnt> persia: sorry I got disconnected
<persia> AnAnt: No worries.  You didn't miss much.
<pochu> persia: I prefer someone else to do the upload, as I'm not very confident with java packaging. Feel free to do those changes, as long as they aren't very intrusive
<jpatrick> persia: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/55768/ - but I haven't... yet :)
<tbutter> lakin: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UpdatingADeb
<persia> pochu: I'll check with Marek, but likely use my watch file and get-orig-source rule from an earlier comment.  If you're happy excepting that, I'll upload once I get confirmation from Marek.
<pochu> persia: of course. Did you seem my comment? ;-)
<RainCT> RAOF: do-plugins has a typo in debian/control :P
<AnAnt> persia: so what mythbuntu did is that they hosted their packages in LP ?
<persia> jpatrick: Create a sid chroot.  Add the experimental repos (not replace, add). with pbuilder --login or something.  pdebuild
<persia> pochu: Yep, just asking to be sure, as typically changes after the second advocation are frowned upon :)
<RainCT> RAOF: line 45, s/albumb/album ;)
<jpatrick> persia: gotcha, thanks
<persia> AnAnt: Rather that mythbuntu made non-native packages for everything.
<AnAnt> persia: problem is that the repository has both the work & the packaging
<geser> jpatrick: check also with the Debian Qt/KDE Team which pachage from experimental they use for building as normally not everything available from experimental is used during build
<persia> AnAnt: One can work around that with a suitable process to generate the tarball.
<persia> geser: jpatrick@freenode is davies@OFTC (see pastebin above)
<geser> jpatrick: you probably need also to use /usr/lib/pbuilder/pbuilder-satisfydepends-experimental for PBUILDERSATISFYDEPENDSCMD
 * persia gains deeper appreciation for the relative simplicity of sbuild
<geser> persia: how does sbuild do it to prefer unstable over experimental and use only packages from experimental when really needed (not in unstable or wrong version)?
<persia> geser: versioned build-dependencies
<persia> Err.  versioned build-dependencies + setting apt-policy to prefer unstable over experimental.
<Riddell> DktrKranz: about?
<Riddell> DktrKranz: you uploaded dspam (3.6.8-4ubuntu1.1) to feisty-proposed, but there is already a package with that version in the archive
<jpatrick> persia: wow, that pbuilder --login's useful
<AnAnt> sistpoty|work: can you remove ubuntume-themes_1.1.dsc, as I am not able to upload
<geser> persia: that works? then jpatrick should be able to use the same trick in pbuilder
<DktrKranz> Riddell: was it the same upload?
<sistpoty|work> AnAnt: done (btw. the next cron run would have moved it out of place anyways ;)
<AnAnt> sistpoty|work: what's the time between cron runs ?
<sistpoty|work> AnAnt: every 10 minutes
<sistpoty|work> (and yes: it's moved in a way so that an upload taking longer than 10 minutes won't break)
<persia> geser: It works, but only if you have a dedicated "experimental" chroot.  The pbuilder stuff you mentioned might allow a single "unstable/experimental" chroot to be used for multiple purposes (but I really have no idea, not being a pbuilder person).  sbuild just calls out to apt, which uses the system apt-policy.
<Riddell> DktrKranz: yes but you still shouldn't use the same version number
<DktrKranz> Riddell: curious. I uploaded it once and there was no other 3.6.8-4ubuntu1.1. Could we look at it later? I'm leaving now.
<RainCT> does Feature Freeze affect syncs that were ACK'd before it started?
<persia> RainCT: Quite likely, although that ends up being an archive-admin decision.
<Riddell> I'd expect archive admin to be lenient on that since the sync script is currently broken
<persia> Bah.  The script is usually broken.  syncs should be filed manually.
<\sh> re
<cody-somerville> tard
<cody-somerville> :]
<Riddell> gpocentek: ping
<gpocentek> Riddell: pong
<geser> persia: I guess Riddell means the sync-source script used by the archive admins, see bug #191230
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 191230 in soyuz "sync-source broken by recent cherry-pick" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/191230
<persia> Ah.  I thought it was the other script.  Thanks.
<Riddell> gpocentek: your upload of wzdftpd to dapper-proposed is not minimal, it includes updates to config.sub and .guess
<Riddell> gpocentek: could you upload one that's just the debdiff?
<webwolf_27> I'm planning (engineering) a graphical alternative for pppoeconfig, are there any other connection methods that use pppoe besides DSL
<gpocentek> Riddell: yep I will, sorry for this upload
<cody-somerville> webwolf_27: Hardy already has a graphical alternative to pppoeconfig
<Riddell> gpocentek: ping me when you do that
<webwolf_27> cody-somerville, someone beat me to it :-( then I'll have to work on something else
<persia> webwolf_27: pppoe over fiber
<RainCT> persia: thanks
<sistpoty|work> woooohooo... REVU survived my bzr activities, so now the description hotfix is merged from trunk, instead of the local hack :)
<cody-somerville> webwolf_27: Why not work on something that already exists to make it better? :)
<sistpoty|work> and pochu's comment's patch is now also on production, thanks!
<LaserJock> RainCT: you around?
<RainCT> LaserJock: pong
<webwolf_27> cody-somerville, also a point, but then I'm already working with a few others in adding support for more brother printers in hardy
<LaserJock> RainCT: ok, I just have nothing but problems with pbuilder-dist
<RainCT> \sh: ^
<LaserJock> RainCT: how do I do a i386 pbuilder on a amd64 machine?
<RainCT> LaserJock: latest version from Hardy?
<LaserJock> yeah, I grabbed it from bzr
<geser> sistpoty|work: REVU only waits till you go home before it breaks :)
<RainCT> LaserJock: ok, it's broken :P
<\sh> LaserJock, pbuilder --debootstrapopts --arch --debootstrapopts i386 ;)
<LaserJock> hmmpf
<\sh> LaserJock, and yes it's my fault that pbuilder-dist is broken ;)
<tuxmaniac> can somone please review http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=alliance
<LaserJock> what's the point of having this script if it's constantly broken :/
<sistpoty|work> geser: heh, *crossing fingers*
<persia> tuxmaniac: What is it, how is it good, and why should it be in hardy?
<LaserJock> sorry, just venting a little as it seems like I always use pbuilder-dist when it's not working
<\sh> LaserJock,  it's broken by design ;)
<persia> LaserJock: sbuild is nice...
<RainCT> \sh: btw, any progress with the rewrite you started?
<LaserJock> persia: does it work without LVM?
<\sh> RainCT, I'm missing my time, catching up with the new job etc. :( and I think we are thinking to complex
<geser> persia: can you reproduce the FTBFS of mediatomb in your sbuild? (http://launchpadlibrarian.net/11884727/buildlog_ubuntu-hardy-i386.mediatomb_0.10.0.dfsg1-1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz)
<tuxmaniac> persia, its a VLSI CAD Tool used by several hundred students.
<persia> LaserJock: Sure, if you have some chroots around, but it doesn't clean up after itself without LVM
<LaserJock> hmm, it can't just untar a clean chroot?
<persia> geser: I don't have any i386 chroots.  Should it be reproducible on amd64?
<AnAnt> persia: I re-uploaded ubuntume-gdm-themes to http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=ubuntume-gdm-themes
<geser> persia: the same error happens on amd64
<pochu> sistpoty|work: cool :)
<tuxmaniac> persia, Fedora already has them in the repos and it would be nice if Ubuntu also get it through. Till date there is no .deb available for it. (rpm package is already available)
<persia> AnAnt: Now you need reviewers.  I don't have any build resources available just now, and a bit of a queue.  Try seeking someone else first.
<AnAnt> persia: ok
<persia> tuxmaniac: That's a better advertisement than "please review this URL" :)
<sistpoty|work> AnAnt: there still seems to be a stale upload of ubuntume-themes... did you interrupt an upload of this?
<tuxmaniac> persia, debian is also very much interested in getting this package through
<AnAnt> sistpoty|work: dunno what's the problem here
<AnAnt> sistpoty|work: I may re-upload later from a faster link
<geser> persia: see als Debian bug 465177
<ubotu> Debian bug 465177 in mediatomb "FTBFS: configure: error: unable to configure inotify support" [Serious,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/465177
<sistpoty|work> AnAnt: ok, then I'll clean up the stale files now (looks just like an incomplete upload though)
<geser> persia: the interesting thing is that mediatomb builds on i386 and amd64 in Debian but fails on powerpc while in Ubuntu is reversed
<tuxmaniac> persia, I know I have spammed this channel. But I dont want to disappoint so many people who are eager to see this pakcage in Hardy
<RainCT> AnAnt: wasn't it uploaded already by superm1?
<thekorn> hi, I've got a small packaging question,
<RainCT> (or at least that's what he says on his last comment..)
<AnAnt> RainCT: the gdm theme ? yes
<thekorn> I would like to add examples to the python-launchpad-bugs package,
<persia> geser: Hmm.  Sounds like it needs attention of the buildd admins who might understand how our buildds work better than you or I.  They may have special kernels or use interesting virtualisation or something.
<thekorn> this packages is using cdbs, I added a debian/python-launchpad-bugs.examples,
<thekorn> with the path to the example scripts,
<AnAnt> RainCT: I just fixed some issues the reviewers weren't so happy about
<thekorn> When I install the package, all samples are created in /usr/share/doc/py-lp-bugs/examples,
<AnAnt> RainCT: 1 issue actually
<persia> thekorn: CDBS calls dh_installexamples by default.  `man dh_installexamples` for information about how to indicate what should be installed.
<geser> persia: aren't the builds done inside a xen instance?
<thekorn> persia, but they are all gzip'ed, is this common policy or did I miss a switch or something
<persia> thekorn: In short, you need debian/python-launchpad-bugs.examples to have the right contents.
<RainCT> AnAnt: Oh ok. The right way to get this into Ubuntu then would be posting a debdiff on Launchpad and subscribing ubuntu-universe-sponsors
<RainCT> AnAnt: but as LP isn't working right now for me I think I'll have a look at it ;P
<persia> thekorn: That's policy.  If you have a good reason, you can pass -X to dh_compress.
<AnAnt> RainCT: after the package passes out of the Queue or while it is still in the queue ?
<persia> geser: I remember something like that, but don't really know.
<thekorn> persia, ok thanks, I thought I did something wrong
<AnAnt> RainCT: can I do a debdiff against a native package ?
<persia> thekorn: No, just that CDBS gets extra confusing when you want to violate policy for some reason.  It's designed to make that hard :)
<thekorn> heh
<persia> thekorn: For CDBS, set DEB_COMPRESS_EXCLUDE := .py or something.
<RainCT> AnAnt: dunno..
<RainCT> Can I upload a new revision for a package that's still in the NEW queue?
<thekorn> persia, ah,ok, thanks, I'm personally fine with having them gzip'ed, but good to know
<sistpoty|work> RainCT: iirc yes
<sistpoty|work> AnAnt: looks, like you've got some ftp troubles (at least from what the logs say)
<persia> AnAnt: You can do a debdiff against a native package, sometimes, as long as there were only certain sorts of changes (another of the reasons I don't like native packages, especially ones containing graphic or sound files)
<AnAnt> sistpoty|work: yeah
<sistpoty|work> AnAnt: test-wise, you can try to upload the files with a different ftp-client, just make sure to get the .changes file uploaded last
<sistpoty|work> AnAnt: however you cannot resume on a file (because it will get mv'ed every 10 minutes, but since the inode doesn't change, the upload can continue, as long as you don't close the ftp-client)
<AnAnt> k
<sistpoty|work> AnAnt: if it weren't a native package, I could simply put the old orig.tar.gz back into the incoming directory, but this won't work here of course :/
<AnAnt> nope
<AnAnt> freezed @ 0%
<AnAnt> sistpoty|work: bah, I'll just do it from a fast connection tomorrow
<sistpoty|work> AnAnt: or you could post a debdiff somewhere and have it uploaded from someone else
<webwolf_27> Night folks I need to put the kids in bed
 * sistpoty|work is now heading home
<sistpoty|work> everyone cross fingers that murphy-geser is wrong *g*
<\sh> sistpoty|work, would you like to remove the source.changes file, just because it's annoying if someone can't access it ;)
 * persia would like to retain the source.changes file for reference by REVU Admins
<sistpoty|work> \sh: no .changes file is accessible (that's the upload ticket)
<\sh> sistpoty|work, yeah that's what I meant, can't we get rid of it after the package occurs on the list?
<sistpoty|work> \sh: and what persia said, sometimes it's good to have these still around (e.g. like for your upload)
<\sh> sistpoty|work, hmm..ok, just don't print it then ;)
<persia> \sh: The issue is that one can sponsor uploads to REVU, and only examination of the .changes file can determine the sponsor.
<pochu> persia: will you upload lashwrap if I advocate it? My only concern is copyright not listing the years and the upstream email. If you are going to fix&upload, I'll advocate. Otherwise I won't until the packager fixes that.
<persia> vemon: You around?
<\sh> if someone wants to do me a favour: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=libdaemon-generic-perl ;)
<vemon> persia, i'm here
<sistpoty|work> \sh: well, not too sure... if I could easily find the point where the files are definitely safe on the list, yes. (but the whole incoming-processing is a crude, crude hack, so it's quite tough to say that everything went fine(
<persia> vemon: Can you fix the issues pochu found please?
<sistpoty|work> <- now really afk
<sistpoty|work> cya
<\sh> sistpoty|work, interessted in changing revu into a django app? ;)
<pochu> vemon: commented.
<vemon> persia, yes i can. what's the problem with the email?
<vemon> ok i'll check
<sistpoty|work> \sh: why not... but that would probably mean a complete rewrite (actually siretart started with some django stuff already for revu2ng, but maybe this will also be vaporware for quite some time)
<persia> pochu: Thanks a lot for looking at those.
<stani> ScottK: can I debug pychecker on gutsy or do I need a hardy machine for it?
<pochu> persia: anytime
<pochu> hey stani
<ScottK> Gutsy should be fine AFAIK.  The real issue is Pyhton 2.5.
<\sh> sistpoty|work, I was working on an app for doing some autobuilds with separated sbuild daemons ;) well, just a rewrite of dak actually but understandable for the human being ;)
<stani> ha pochu!
<sistpoty|work> \sh: heh :)
<\sh> sistpoty|work, I'm just worked  on the archive management system...
<stani> pochu: did you receive my spe tarball?
<persia> smagoun: We were discussing bug #188130 earlier.  If you could respond to lool's question, I'd be willing to upload...
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 188130 in moblin-image-creator "Update moblin-image-creator to 0.39" [Wishlist,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/188130
<vemon> pochu & persia, made the changes to lashwrap and re-uploaded to revu
<pochu> stani: heh, I didn't see it was attached to the mail :) I was going to ask you where was the tarball, or just to repackage it myself ;)
 * persia seeks another willing volunteer to review http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=lashwrap in 7 minutes
<pochu> stani: I'll see if it still happens with that tonight. Thanks for it.
<pochu> persia: with your +1 and mine, isn't that done?
<\sh> persia, I can do, if you review libdaemon-generic-perl, pls :)
<persia> pochu: New upload trumps advocations.
<ScottK> persia: What is lashwrap?
 * asantoni is looking for an advocate for LP #190589 (fixed version tag)
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 190589 in mixxx "New upstream release (in REVU)" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/190589
<pochu> persia: does that mean you won't re-advocate it?
<pochu> persia: (I know)
<persia> ScottK: A small wrapper program that enables Linux Audio Session Handling for non-compliant applications.
<afflux> a package I requested a sync for FTBFS on all architectures with 'dpkg-gencontrol: failure: cannot read -: No such file or directory'. It builds fine in my hardy pbuilder. Is that a known issue?
<sistpoty|work> cya folks
<persia> pochu: I'll re-advocate if the changes aren't insane, but my queue is currently full enough that if someone else went first, it would simplify things :)
<ScottK> afflux: When did it FTBFS?
<AstralJava> afflux: I got a notification from one of the admins that a new dpkg got in recently, and things should work now again.
<geser> afflux: pkgname?
<ScottK> afflux: ^^^ If it happened ~18 hours + or - a few, then it's  likely the dpkg issue
<pochu> persia: ah, ok. I was thinking on a one-line-change on debian/copyright, so it would be pretty straightforward. :)
<geser> afflux: there was a bug in dpkg which broke packages during dh_strip
<afflux> geser, ScottK: it's libotr, one build was: https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libotr/3.1.0-2/+build/511614 - it says "15 hours ago"
<persia> pochu: If that's the debdiff, certainly.
<smagoun> persia: I can repack moblin-image-creator and fix the maintainer. I've already added the ubuntu-specific changes to the package. Is that what you mean?
<ScottK> It should get retried automatically as there is supposed to be a mass giveback.
<persia> afflux: That would be during the broken time.  It likely got rebuilt since.
<\sh> pochu, i'm on it :)
<persia> smagoun: Yes, assuming the Ubuntu-specific changes include the changelog changes.
<mruiz> hi all
<afflux> persia: ah, didn't check that. It's been successfully built (again, 15 hours ago according to launchpad)
<geser> afflux: there was a massive give-back today night or morning and it build now successfully
<pochu> \sh: on what? :)
<afflux> thank you
<smagoun> persia: I think the Ubuntu-specific changelog entries made it in, but I don't remember. I'll be sure to check. I need a day or so to fix it, I have some deadlines today
<vemon> persia, it actually is a one-line-change to copyright + linebreak arrange to fit control to 80 chars width :)
<\sh> pochu, lashwrap
<smagoun> persia: thanks, by the way!
<pochu> \sh: I guess you want to wait for the update then ;)
<pochu> \sh: thanks anyway :-)
<\sh> pochu, yes...
<\sh> pochu, what else? I would need some reviewers too ;)
<persia> smagoun: OK.  I'm just worried about FeatureFreeze, which would then require a freeze exception making it more difficult.  I think you have about 29 hours, but I can't promise to be able to upload that whole time :)
<smagoun> persia: Understood. thanks.
<mruiz> I got a lintian error: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/4510
<vemon> is it ok to use wget instead of uscan in get-orig-source? i'm having a hard time extracting the version number from the uscan download :/
<\sh> mruiz, https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/dpkg/+bug/191324
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 191324 in dpkg "dpkg-genchanges.pl missing the "Description" field in *_source.changes files" [Undecided,New]
<\sh> mruiz, fix is in the report :)
<mruiz> thanks \sh
<\sh> mruiz, just waiting for the upload...so it'll resolve by itself in time :)
<mruiz> hehehe
 * mruiz hugs \sh 
<\sh> if slangasek would be cool, he could do it ;) because he has main powers ;)
 * persia hopes someone remembers the uscan --dehs | sed ... trick and can provide vemon a pointer
<vemon> well i'm trying to use it :) but it doesn't work for some reason
<vemon> haven't fooled around with makefiles that much so i'm not really sure about the notation/syntax
<jdong> persia: is sed supposed to be used to parse XML? :D
<persia> vemon: Look through some of the recent archived double-advocated packages on REVU.  I've seen it often in the past couple days, but don't remember
<vemon> jdong, yes.. "parse" :)
<persia> jdong: Why not.  XML is text, isn't it?
<jdong> persia: are there not better tools for this, though?
<jdong> persia: seems a bit low-level to me
<vemon> it works ok when executed from the shell but not in the makefile
<ScottK> jdong: The best tool is the one you have in hand and know how to use.
<vemon> ScottK, agree :)
<vemon> though now always
<persia> jdong: The advantage of sed over all other XML processors is that it is installed on every developer's workstation.
<jdong> persia: true :)
<vemon> it's also installed on every non-developers linux desktop'
<persia> That means that any given developer is more likely to be able to get the newest upstream with debian/rules get-orig-source, which helps us work as a team.
<persia> vemon: Yes, but non-developers aren't expected to use get-orig-source :)
<\sh> persia, what is wrong with <url> \ debian uupdate?
<persia> \sh: Fails for non tar.gz.  --repack helps for .tar.bz2, but .zip or stripping files for DFSG, etc. requires get-orig-source.
<\sh> persia, phew...good to know that many perl packages are in tar.gz format ;)
<\sh> bah...this IS BAD
<jdong> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Examples/ChangingTheOrigTarball
<\sh> Copyright (C) 2003 Uri Guttman <uri@stemsystems.com> but according to cpan the actual author is someone else...what to write in debian/copyright now...
<jdong> it's the 2nd example listing there, vemon
<vemon> jdong, that's the one i've been trying to use
<HighNo> can debdiff compare a .deb file with a file structure or do I have to generate the package via debuild first and afterwards do a debdiff between both deb's ?
<vemon> jdong, i think i just (finally!) got it working. still can figure out what was wrong in the first place :)
<vemon> can't
<mruiz> bye guys
<crevette> persia have you some time today to look at http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=obex-data-server ?
<vemon> persia, what was the directory i was supposed to put the whysynth licensing patch?'
<pochu> vemon: advocated
<persia> vemon: I think I suggested debian/upstream-patches because the patch was from upstream, and you were applying it to the orig.tar.gz (upstreams should actually release code rather then sending patches).  Different directory names might also work: there's no guideline for this.  Be sure to write about it in README.Debian-source
<persia> crevette: Unlikely, but I'll take a look if I do.
<vemon> persia, ok. thanks! i think i'll have a new upload soon
<vemon> pochu, thanks to you too! :)
<crevette> persia: at least, thanks
<stani> ScottK: pychecker in hardy seems still at -3, which is incompatible with spe. Is it possible to sync it to -7? I'll see if I can fix the FTBS of -3 for now, but it would be better to have -7 in the repos.
<ScottK> stani: -7 still FTBFS.  Figure the fix for that.  Give me a patch, and I'll upload it.
<ScottK> stani: Don't worry about -3
<geser> RainCT: your scrapbook FTBFS on !i386 is because iceweasel-scrapbook is arch:any instead of arch:all
<ScottK> bddebian: How come your testresources fix FTBFS in Ubuntu?
<RainCT> geser: Oops. And why does it fail because of that? :/
<bddebian> ScottK: I didn't know it didn't.  I'll try to look at it
<DktrKranz> Riddell, have you a couple of minutes to look at dspam upload?
<ScottK> bddebian: I'm building it again now (it built when I asked for the sync).  It may have gotten caught in yesterday's dpkg mess.
<bddebian> Aye, I know my lordsawar sync did :-(
<geser> RainCT: on !i386 the binary-arch target is used which doesn't do anything useful
<ScottK> bddebian: It builds for me.  I'm gonna ask for a give back.
<bddebian> OK, thanks man
<geser> stani: pychecker fails to build with python2.5 so syncing doesn't improve the situation
<RainCT> geser: ok, thanks!
<Riddell> DktrKranz: where?
<paas> Hi, can someone have a look at http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=libtuxcap, It's ready for advocation, thanks
<DktrKranz> Riddell, feisty-proposed, the one you rejected some minutes ago
<\sh> guys, again, I'm not sure I understand our advocating system now, even when a motu uploads to revu, he shouldn't be able to advocate itself for the package, right or wrong?
<Riddell> DktrKranz: nothing in there currently
<DRebellion> Hardy feature freeze is on the 14th. Does this mean packages can still be submitted on this day (14th)?
<DktrKranz> Riddell, I know. It has been rejected (https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/dspam/+bug/158252/comments/29). You stated gutsy already has 3.6.8-4ubuntu1.1, but I'm unable to see it on LP.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 158252 in dspam "dspam won't start:  /var/run/dspam missing in tmpfs" [Medium,Confirmed]
<ScottK> DRebellion: They can be uploaded on that day, but they have to be approved first.  They are rarely approved on the first try.
<Riddell> DktrKranz: ah, looks like I'm entirely wrong
<DRebellion> ScottK, its just that i have one in revu that ftbs and i'm waiting on upstream for a fix.
<ScottK> Well you'll need to ask them to get moving then ...
<persia> DRebellion: Not really.  That's the deadline for packages to be pushed to the archives.  My my count, there are about 28 hours left, which is a very tight timeframe to get two advocates from the already very busy MOTU.
<\sh> DktrKranz, gutsy  	current  	release  	3.6.8-5ubuntu1   	 None defined
<\sh> 		updates 	3.6.8-5ubuntu1.1 	
<\sh> DktrKranz, in updates it is
<Riddell> DktrKranz: accepted
<DktrKranz> \sh, feisty-proposed would have 4ubuntu1.1
<\sh> DktrKranz, ah feisty :)
 * DktrKranz hugs Riddell
<\sh> I wonder why we can't go with -4ubuntu07.04.1 or something like this for updates
<DktrKranz> \sh, it is often used when base versions are the same
<ScottK> \sh: You can, but I personally find it unattractive.
<\sh> ScottK, well, yes it looks strange, I agree...
<HighNo> DktrKranz: I think I have done it now - could you have a look at it?
<DktrKranz> \sh, basically you can use ubuntu1, as a normal upload. The rule is "don't clash with past, present or future versions"
<HighNo> DktrKranz: Please tell me where to put the debdiff generated file
<DktrKranz> !paste | HighNo
<ubotu> HighNo: pastebin is a service to post large texts so you don't flood the channel. The Ubuntu pastebin is at http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org (make sure you give us the URL for your paste - see also the #ubuntu channel topic)
<cbx33> hey all anyone know if deskbar can run in openbox?
<cbx33> in pypanel?
<\sh> DktrKranz, na I always think when I see "ubuntuX.Y" as of "security fix update" and not "normal update"
<DktrKranz> \sh, I think there are issues when releasing a security update after a SRU or viceversa
<DktrKranz> having a "common" versioning is simpler
<ScottK> I find it helpful when they use the same numbering scheme to keep things straight.
<keescook> DktrKranz: -update and -security need to not clash their version numbers
<keescook> the way it is supposed to work is that -security builds on top of -updates
<keescook> this allows people that only want the -security pocket to still get sane updates.
<geser> \sh: xmds depwaits on octave2.1-headers. Will it build/work without it? (it b-d also on octave3.0-headers)
<keescook> and -updates must include -security, so the latest release of any given package should always have all security updates applied.
<\sh> geser, what? I tested the xmds sync and it build cleanly...I wonder what's that now...
<ScottK> \sh: I think you typoe'd the build-depends and left the old one.
<\sh> ScottK, it was a sync...
<\sh> ScottK, and changelog said explicitly: * debian/control:
<\sh>     + Build-depends on octave3.0-headers instead of 2.9
<\sh>     + Use ${octave-3-0:Depends} in Suggests field
<ScottK> OK.  Then the Debian maintainer did.
<DktrKranz> keescook, is it why there are some XubuntuY.5 uploads in -security?
<\sh> fixing
<\sh> ScottK, could you do me a favour and review two small perl packages? :)
<keescook> DktrKranz: for which package?
<DktrKranz> keescook, don't remember right now, let me check
<ScottK> \sh: sure. I know more about perl packaging than I really want to.
<\sh> ScottK, libdaemon-generic-perl and libfile-flock-perl on revu :)
<HighNo> DktrKranz: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/55786/ - I don't feel god about it as it seems too long and has many filenames in there whereas I only changes the debian/changelog and filters/sessionfilter.py
<ScottK> \sh: Link me.  I'll look at them while I wait my tern in the tech board meeting.
<ScottK> K
<ScottK> tern/turn
<\sh> ScottK, http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=libdaemon-generic-perl
<\sh> ScottK, http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=libfile-flock-perl
<ScottK> Thanks
<\sh> ScottK, oh big day tonight? :)
<ScottK2> Yes
<rhpot1991_laptop> can anyone translate this for me "* open a needs packaging bug and close it in the changelog "
<rhpot1991_laptop> I opened a bug, assigned it to myself
<rhpot1991_laptop> do I change the status now too?
<DktrKranz> HighNo, that is probably due because you used debuild in a gutsy (or hardy) environment while preparing a revision for feisty
<persia> rhpot1991: If you are working on it, change the status to "In-Progress".  Unfortuantely, do to weak support for sponsoring workflow, when you are done, set the status to "Confirmed", and subscribe the sponsors.
<DktrKranz> HighNo, if you didn't touch these files, you can omit from your debdiff
<HighNo> DktrKranz: the strange thing is - I only used feisty :-)
<rhpot1991_laptop> persia ok thanks
<rhpot1991_laptop> was just dputing stuff up and not opening any bugs
<HighNo> DktrKranz: or does setting up a pbuilder environment for hardy involve changes for the normal debuild ?
<geser> \sh: see http://launchpadlibrarian.net/11885637/buildlog_ubuntu-hardy-amd64.xmds_1.6.4-1_MANUALDEPWAIT.txt.gz
<DktrKranz> HighNo, no, if you executed debuild outside of the pbuilder environment.
<\sh> geser, yeah saw it...I know now why it build these days...because octave2.1 was still in the archives :(U
<\sh> geser, just fixing it and uploading
<AstralJava> packages.ubuntu.com inaccessible to anyone else?
<geser> \sh: thanks
 * persia wants an LP Preference "Yes, I always want the complicated bug filing form: it's less complicated".
<ScottK2> \sh: As a rule, I think it's nice when you just use the same licensing for the packaging that the package uses.  It simplifies things.  Just kvetching.
<persia> AstralJava: rmadison -u ubuntu packagename and apt-cache search packagename are likely more useful anyway.
<persia> ScottK: Sometimes people use packaging from samples that complicates that.
<\sh> ScottK, actually the upstream source can use both...on cpan it says "the same as perl" and perl is dual licensed, when I understood it correctly
 * persia advocates writing all packaging files from scratch
<HighNo> DktrKranz: then I don't understand the difference but at least the debdiff is done. I am to put it somewhere with the bug in LP and is there a naming convention for these patches?
<ScottK2> \sh: True.  Interestingly enough Perl is still GPL V1+
<AstralJava> persia: Thanks, I'll look into them. In this particular case I was worried the mirror I used was out-of-date. Turns out it wasn't, though.
<persia> AstralJava: packages.ubuntu.com is often out of date :(
<AstralJava> Ahh... gotcha.
<AstralJava> So it's been a while since I last setup pbuilder, if my base system is gutsy, didn't its pbuilder have scripts for hardy?
<rhpot1991_laptop> persia: you don't have a second to poke at a package and see why debconf isn't working how it should, do you?
<\sh> ScottK, when you are on it...I wasn't quite sure about the copyright in libfile-flock* because the version I packaged was uploaded to cpan by dave rolsky, but the original author is someone else...I put both authors in copyright but the next line in copyright I wasn't sure if this is write...if you have a clue about this, please enlighten me :)
<\sh> s/write/right/
<ScottK2> \sh: I think what's in the code matters.
<geser> AstralJava: you need the debootstrap from gutsy-backports to be able to debootstrap hardy
<persia> rhpot1991: Not really.  Best to describe the issue and paste the error to a pastebin.
 * ScottK2 is mostly paying attention to the tech board meeting right now.
<\sh> ScottK, well, I put both in...just to be sure...
<ScottK2> \sh: Right.  I'll look at it.
<AstralJava> geser: Okay, thanks. I have no recollection of doing that before, but like I said, it's been very long from the last setup. Thanks for the help!
<rhpot1991_laptop> persia: thats the problem, no errors, just the note never shows up on install
<DktrKranz> HighNo, attach it to the bug in LP and subscribe ubuntu-security
<RainCT> \sh: about your review question before, the wiki says Â«MOTUs can upload new packages directly to the archive. However they are greatly encouraged to have a new package reviewed prior to uploading. (cf. MOTU/Council/Meetings/2007-02-23)Â».
<\sh> RainCT, well, but it doesn't answer the question :)
<ScottK2> jdstrand: You mentioned that you might be able to show up for my core-dev application at the tech board meeting.  It's just started (I should be up 2nd).
<LaserJock> \sh: what's your question?
<\sh> RainCT, even motus are making mistakes, and regarding revu it should be a standard to have another or better 2 more pair of eyes looking over the package
<\sh> LaserJock, if motus should advocate their own packages...
<LaserJock> oh, I probably shouldn't say anything then :-)
<LaserJock> I've usually just poke another MOTU to give an IRC ack and then upload
<LaserJock> but I usually don't upload "high risk" stuff
<ScottK2> LaserJock: If you have the time/interest, I should be up for core-dev shortly in #ubuntu-meeting.
<LaserJock> ScottK2: how shortly?
<ScottK2> LaserJock: As soon as they get done torturing TheMuso.
<ScottK2> Dunno
<LaserJock> ah
<\sh> lol
<HighNo> DktrKranz: attached, bug status set to "fix comitted" but I am to assign the bug to me or ubuntu-security?
<LaserJock> I've gotta teach in 30min or so
<LaserJock> I'll hang out as long as I can
<persia> \sh: I typically advocate my package if I think it's all set, and don't advocate if I'm just looking for a review and I'm not sure.  Depends how many packages of that type I've touched before.
<DktrKranz> HighNo, mark it as Confirmed, do not subscribe anyone and subscribe ubuntu-security
<\sh> ScottK, you'll make it...it only looks painful :)
 * persia notes the inherent conflict, and notes s/subscribe/assign/1
<HighNo> DktrKranz: ehm, "do not subscribe anyone and subscribe ubuntu-security" ?
<HighNo> persia: ahh, thanks
<HighNo> persia: ubuntu-security = "Ubuntu Security Team"?
<DktrKranz> HighNo, my fault, sorry
<persia> HighNo: Quite possibly.  I'm not really a good person to ask about security processes.
<\sh> HighNo, just add "it's a security bug" checkbox under the very first entry point and remove the "private" flag afterwards when the CVE already be known for the public
<\sh> HighNo, and yes, it's ubuntu-security and motu-swat (if it's a universe package) please :)
<HighNo> ok, that was already set
<\sh> geser, xmds uploaded
<rhpot1991_laptop> I wait till I get 2 sponsors before I set the bug to confirmed, correct?
<HighNo> so that was it then - I submitted my first security fix ?! :-)
<rhpot1991_laptop> learning the week before a feature freeze sure is stressful
<\sh> oh wow...they cook TheMuso ;)
<leonel> how do I test this  DIFF https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/dbmail/+bug/191096  ??
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 191096 in dbmail "[needs-merge] dbmail_2.2.9-1" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<RainCT> \sh: heh. good that I don't want to become core dev, they are scaring me :)
<\sh> RainCT, ah come on..it's fun :)
<paas> RainCT: Thanks for advocating!
<geser> leonel: dget -x http://ftp.debian.org/debian/pool/main/d/dbmail/dbmail_2.2.9-1.dsc; wget http://launchpadlibrarian.net/11877122/dbmail_2.2.9-1ubuntu1.debdiff; cd dbmail-2.2.9; patch -p1 < ../dbmail_2.2.9-1ubuntu1.debdiff
<persia> leonel: Run dbmail with postgres 8.3 before and after application.
<RainCT> \sh: hehehe
<leonel> geser: Thanks
<leonel> persia: before it's done there are bugfixes that need  from upstream  and that diff appears to fix them
<RainCT> paas: np, thanks for contributing to ubuntu :)
<leonel> thank you
<paas> your welcome :-)
<rhpot1991_laptop> RainCT: I have an easy package that could use a 2nd sponsor
<\sh> RainCT, and spending more time with ubuntu, and fixing more packages even for main, you have to become a core-dev someday...because the sponsors don't have the time anymore to sponsor your package fixes ;)
<geser> RainCT: you missed the old times where you have to go to a CC meeting to become a MOTU (which included some grilling there)
<HighNo> CC meeting?
 * persia wonders if being a member shouldn't still be a requirement for being MOTU, but is distracted by FeatureFreeze prep
<LaserJock> TB meeting
<LaserJock> persia: it's not a requirement?
<RainCT> \sh: Yes, sure. I meant I don't want to become one soon, we will see what I do long term.. :)
<persia> LaserJock: Not since me
<leonel> geser: after patched  just rebuild the package  right ?
<LaserJock> persia: ummm, that's not cool
<persia> LaserJock: Please raise it at a MOTU Meeting.  I won't make this weeks, but I'll back you up on the 29th if you are available then.
<RainCT> LaserJock: no, if you are accepted as MOTU you also become a member, I think
<RainCT> geser: :D
<LaserJock> hmm
<geser> HighNo: Communit Counsil
<LaserJock> with the new structure I don't know how it would work
<HighNo> geser: ahh, thx
<persia> RainCT: That is the current process.  Previously, you had to be a member to apply (which I thought was good).  There was a timing mixup with the new process, and a non-member was accepted.  Since then, the requirement has been waived.
<RainCT> LaserJock: and LoCo Council will also be able to appoint members soon
<LaserJock> it used to be you could get simultaneous membership in some cases, but certainly not the normal
<geser> leonel: yes, as usual
<leonel> geser: thanks
<DktrKranz> keescook, I'm unable to find any example of XubuntuY.5, probably I am wrong.
<LaserJock> well, but many teams require Ubuntu membership prior to team membership
<persia> RainCT: Not LoCo Council: Regional Membership Councils.
<keescook> DktrKranz: well keep an eye out -- you never know if something went goofy.  :)
<LaserJock> so MOTU could actually be less strict, which doesn't make sense in terms of the importance of MOTU
<persia> LaserJock: Raise it at a meeting.  Discussion here can't change anything.
<LaserJock> sure, but that seems to be a TB/CC issue, IMO
<TheMuso> ScottK2: I would call it challenging me. I'm enjoying this.
<persia> LaserJock: Not really.  Delegated to MC.  MC takes guidance on policy from MOTU.  A MOTU Meeting discussion followed by mailing list discussion would likely result in MC comment.
<LaserJock> but the TB is ultimately in charge of MOTU membership and CC of Ubuntu membership
<persia> LaserJock: Yes, and both groups have delegated to MC.  MC is able to take the decision.  I suspect MC would listen to MOTU Consensus about it.
<\sh> LaserJock, the MC can now approve motus themselves, when I'm not wrong...and you can only become a core-dev after having some cheering from MC and other core-devs
<persia> \sh: Yes and no.  MC doesn't cheer, so much as administer the core-dev application process.
<persia> (although some members of MC are core, and may also be sponsors)
<LaserJock> persia: yes, I realize they have delegated, but they have not delegated requirements for MOTUship, as far as I know
<geser> LaserJock: dholbach adds the new MOTUs to ~motu if there are enough +1 from the MC members
<LaserJock> uggg
<LaserJock> I *know* how MOTUship is granted
<persia> LaserJock: Any MC member can add members to MOTU at will.
<persia> The MC follows the MC process to grant MOTU based on TB and CC direction.
<LaserJock> I'm saying that MC acts only upon delegation from TB/CC and are subject to their requirements
<\sh> persia, yeah, cheering wasn't meant like "uh his good..why not" more that they give the advice or much better a councelor for the TB
<LaserJock> I believe that the TB/CC set MOTUship requirements, MC is supposed to be "executive" branch instead of a "legislative" branch when it comes to MOTUship, as I understand it
<persia> \sh: MC only compiles the application for core-dev, but makes the decision for MOTU applications.  There are cases of MC turning down core applications, but more because it was incomplete than because of MC decision.
<persia> MC is not executive.
<persia> If anything, MC is judicial.
<LaserJock> hmm, yeah, judicial is better
<LaserJock> in any case, my understanding was that MC was to figure out how to apply the requirements, not necessarily make them up
<persia> MOTU as a body propose/discuss/plan/initiate and individual developers (MOTU+Contributors) execute.
<RainCT> rhpot1991_laptop: oops, oversaw your message. URL?
<\sh> oh ... when I
<rhpot1991_laptop> RainCT: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=atomicparsley should be good to go
<LaserJock> anyway, I don't really care so much
<\sh> I'm reading the discussion now on -meeting, I wonder how people actually would want to package software at all ;)
<persia> LaserJock: Not even enough to raise it at a meeting?
<LaserJock> I'm just surprised that Ubuntu membership is not a requirement for MOTUship
<LaserJock> I might enough for an email
<LaserJock> hopefully I can make the MOTU meeting, but I can't guarantee it
<crevette> rhpot1991_laptop: are you a motu ?
<crevette> and are you available for a review
<rhpot1991_laptop> nope :(
<rhpot1991_laptop> its questionable as to if I even know what I am doing :P
<persia> LaserJock: Understood.  Mail would be a step.
<RainCT> superm1: you might want to advocate atomicparlsey again, since your last advocation the only change was in debian/control formatting (http://revu.tauware.de/diff.py?upid1=1917&upid2=1945)
<rhpot1991_laptop> RainCT: he knows whats going on, but is at work now
<\sh> LaserJock, I wonder if it makes a change...
<LaserJock> persia: hmm, MC granting membership could provide a "we think your on your way to MOTUship" step that might be helpful
<\sh> LaserJock, the former method of becoming a member first then a motu and hopefully then a core was a hard way...and frightend some people to stay away from ubuntu at all...
<LaserJock> well
<rhpot1991_laptop> LaserJock: I have this one too (http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=mythexport) but it has a debconf issue that is driving me crazy
<LaserJock> frankly if you can't do "significant and sustained contribution to Ubuntu" then you shouldn't be a MOTU
<vemon> hi! the whysynth pkg with modified get-orig-source & Readme.debian-source is now in revu: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=whysynth
<persia> LaserJock: I very much agree with that.  I've been thinking about ways to better organise the Contributors into a team with some identity, and think that is part of the solution, but don't have a good plan yet.
<\sh> LaserJock, which doesn't mean it's bad in the first place...but people come people go noone can say what's the best for the project at all...
<vemon> could someone also check out my package which already has one advocation: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=lashwrap
<LaserJock> so the basic technical requirements for MOTUship should be 1) signed CoC 2) signed gpg key 3) Ubuntu memebership (needs 1. for this but it's a useful separation)
<\sh> vemon I'm on it
<persia> \sh: Or just ignore the process.  I wasn't a member for two years because it was too much trouble (despite pushing patches).
<LaserJock> alrighty, I gotta run to lab
<persia> \sh: The issue is that now MOTU is sometimes seen as the first step, and it can be frustrating to take 6-12 months to become MOTU.
<geser> persia: do you believe you would have applied earlier with the current process?
<\sh> persia, the problem I see actually is that people stay focused ...
<\sh> persia, which is one of the difficult problems...
<persia> geser: Yes.  I had three MOTU advocates in Dapper.
<\sh> persia, and a simple process or a difficult process doesn't really solve this
<persia> \sh: Yes.  That's a separate problem.  I just think giving out Membership earlier to those who are showing sustained effort and ask would help keep more of the Contributors active.  Keeping people longer-term is harder.
<\sh> vemon, uploading now :)
<RainCT> rhpot1991_laptop: please convert the binary and manpage names to all lowercase
<\sh> persia, and that's the problem actually...what is "sustained efford"
<zul> TheMuso: congrats..
<vemon> \sh, great! :) this was my first uploaded package
<TheMuso> zul: THanks.
<rhpot1991_laptop> RainCT: its ok to do that when thats how the author has it happening?
<\sh> vemon, good work :) thx :)
<HighNo> hm, how long does it take from upload to being available via apt-get ? [universe is enabled]
<goobsoft> Are menus best implemented with the freedesktop's Desktop Entry Specification rather than menufile(s) now?
<persia> \sh: Used to be two months of solid work.  Last I heard it was getting closer to six.  Not really well defined.
<\sh> HighNo, depending on the time your build needs, depending on the syncs of the mirrors you use, between 15 mins and 8 hours ,->
<slangasek> TheMuso: congrats :)
<jpatrick> TheMuso: congrats :)
<sboden> \sh: or longer...  1 package that was uploaded yesterday doesn't even show up now
<\sh> persia, well until this isn't resolved and until we don't have any clean standards on this, I think right now, it's for many contributors much easier to become a vital part of ubuntu (actually for the software part) ... others are doing different work, but this I don't see actually...
<\sh> sboden, a new one? so it's in the new queue most likely
<persia> \sh: For development types, yes.
<geser> TheMuso: congrats :)
<sboden> \sh: no an update, "kmess" from v1.4.3 to 1.5 ... but 1.5 is not yet available it seems
<geser> sboden: if the package has to pass source (and/or binary) NEW it takes longer
<RainCT> rhpot1991_laptop: I think so, unless you have a good reason to don't change it
<rhpot1991_laptop> I wasn't cause thats how the author did it
<rhpot1991_laptop> I suppose I can change it as long as I get the install file to copy the file like I say
<rhpot1991_laptop> already working on it
<\sh> sboden, https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/hardy/+source/kmess/1.5-0ubuntu1
<\sh> sboden, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/hardy/+source/kmess/1.5-0ubuntu1
<sboden> \sh: cool... doesn't show in apt-get though? Or am I missing something?
<TheMuso> thanks folks
<RainCT> rhpot1991_laptop: ok. you'll need to do something in debian/rules to rename them as install only copies files (doesn't rename)
<RainCT> s/install/dh_install
<rhpot1991_laptop> is it really a big deal to keep it with the caps?
<\sh> sboden: it's there. https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/hardy/+source/kmess/1.5-0ubuntu1
<\sh> argl
<\sh> Inst kmess (1.5-0ubuntu1 Ubuntu:8.04/hardy)
<\sh> Conf kmess (1.5-0ubuntu1 Ubuntu:8.04/hardy)
<rhpot1991_laptop> I would think that would be better for cross platform results, say my script calls AtomicParsley, now it breaks on ubuntu cause we have ours as atomicparsley
<vemon> how much time until the feature freeze now?
<RainCT> hm.. what do you other guys think about this (is it ok for a binary to have capital letters)?
<rhpot1991_laptop> which mythexport does
<\sh> sboden: which mirror and did you do an apt-get update? ,-)
<rhpot1991_laptop> and the manpage just matched the binary
<persia> RainCT: There are a few that do, although it is not preferred.  Depends on why.
<rhpot1991_laptop> persia: thats what the source did, and I didn't want to change it
<persia> rhpot1991: It would be your responsibility as the packager to convince upstream that mixed-case is namespace-confusing, but it's not an absolute block to archive inclusion.  On the other hand, mixed-case package names are an absolute block.
<HighNo> RainCT:from the users point of view it is quite annoying. If I were to decide I'd vote against it. My original package name is mixed case - but the executable has to be all lower case
<sboden> \sh: deb http://be.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ hardy-updates multiverse ?
<RainCT> TheMuso: congrats :)
<TheMuso> RainCT: Thanks.
<rhpot1991_laptop> I'll change it then, seems to be the consensus
<\sh> sboden, it's there: http://be.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/universe/k/kmess/ but only the amd64 one
<persia> rhpot1991: If you change it, and upstream doesn't, you'll be incompatible with all other installations, which is not preferred.
<sboden> \sh: ok... I have time, I already have kmess 1.5 on my kubuntu :D
<rhpot1991_laptop> ok, so don't change it then?
<persia> rhpot1991: Convince upstream to change it.  Once they do, apply a debdiff flattening the name to hardy (it will be after FeatureFreeze)
<\sh> sboden, well it's the mirror...de/be doesn't have the i386 package actually..but archive.ubuntu.com has it
<rhpot1991_laptop> ok, I'll try that, that good RainCT?
<sboden> \sh: ok, I'll try uninstalling and restalling from the main one
<sboden> Does this group also apply the patches in launchpad for ubuntu fixes, or is that another group?
<RainCT> rhpot1991_laptop: if you'll try to convince upstream, yes
<TheMuso> ScottK2: Congrats!
<geser> ScottK2: congrats
<slangasek> ScottK: muhahaha, sucker
<slangasek> oh, er
<slangasek> ScottK: congrats!
<TheMuso> lol
<zul> ScottK: congrats...no sweat
<ScottK> geser and slangasek: Thanks.
<ScottK> zul too
<RainCT> ScottK: congrats
<vemon> persia, going to bed now. check out whysynth if you still have an empty time slot somewhere :)
<\sh> ScottK, you did it :) nicely done :)
<ScottK> Thanks
<RainCT> rhpot1991_laptop: Section: unknown
<persia> vemon: Sleep well.
<RainCT> rhpot1991_laptop: choose a section for it (you can find a list of all sections with their description on http://packages.ubuntu.com/hardy), and also let the short description in debian/control start with lowercase
<RainCT> rhpot1991_laptop: and close a LP bug in the changelog
<\sh> ScottK, now break kde4 ,-)
<TheMuso> \sh: lol
<\sh> well, I meant: break gnome and fix kde4....this way
 * ScottK is more worried about kde4 not breaking KDE3.
<sboden> I have another small (ubuntu specific) bugfix ready, this time for amarok mp3 : https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/amarok/+bug/187406
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 187406 in amarok "[hardy] Amarok install-mp3 fails silently" [Undecided,New]
<Nightrose> apachelogger__: ^
<Nightrose> sboden: nice :)
 * apachelogger__ should adopt sboden
<sboden> lol :D... Is this the right group to get such a bug fix applied, or is there another one?
<\sh> Apachelogger to Sboden: "I'm your father" ,->
<Nightrose> *lol*
<apachelogger__> sboden: technically it would be kubuntu-devel since amarok isn't part of universe, but main
<apachelogger__> sboden: is adept_batch installed?
<sboden> apachelogger_: on kubuntu yes... the line before the fix checks whether it's installed executable
<sboden> apachelogger_: it's in fact an ugly script to do all kinds of update managers, but right now the kubuntu bits are broken
<apachelogger__> yeah, the script is not what I would like to see on a sunny day
<apachelogger__> sboden: why is the patch so big?
<sboden> apachelogger: don't know... I took original dget -x ...dsc; change script; dch -i; debuild -S -sa
<crimsun> DktrKranz: pong
<apachelogger__> sboden: oh, for such a change, please only attach a patch for the file
<DktrKranz> crimsun, do you plan to have a look at bug 55706 soon?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 55706 in python-uncertainities "python-uncertainities python2.3/2.4 breakage." [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/55706
<apachelogger__> sboden: or create a debdiff in case you also add an changelog entry etc.
<persia> So...  There's a netbeans on REVU.  It now builds with stuff in the archive or in NEW.  It's a lot cleaner than the netbeans we have.  Anyone object to me just uploading?  It won't pass REVU easily, as it still isn't 100% packaging clean (although this can be fixed post-feature freeze).
<crimsun> DktrKranz: I can look now
<persia> I think the licensing is good, but there are 3000 source files, and I have to admit I've not read them all carefully.
<persia> If anyone has time now to give it a look, and make any suggestions for things to fix before I might upload, I'm more than willing to listen.
<crimsun> DktrKranz: oh, that's just missing administrivia; feel free to "hijack" it from me as necessary
<crimsun> DktrKranz: i.e., no, I don't plan to do anything further with it presently.
<frafu> RainCT: thanks for reviewing, correcting and uploading the upgrade of mousetweaks yesterday :-)
<DktrKranz> crimsun, debdiff seems good, I need to check if it is still valid and eventually "sponsor" you (I know, it sound weird)
<RainCT> frafu: yw :)
<rhpot1991_laptop> RainCT: just uploaded those changes, gotta drive home through the snow now, hit up rhpot1991 if you see anything else and I'll respond when I get home, thanks
<crimsun> DktrKranz: still valid, yes.
<DktrKranz> crimsun, ok. I'll go for the upload, then
<slangasek> lool: congrats
 * persia wants an Apache Derby package to replace sunwderby and sun-java6-javadb and the sun-javadb on REVU.
<lool> slangasek: Thanks!
<TheMuso> lool: Congrats!
<sboden> apachelogger_: debdiff now also attached to LP #187406 (+ additional change to use absolute path for adept_batch)
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 187406 in amarok "[hardy] Amarok install-mp3 fails silently" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/187406
<lool> TheMuso: Thanks again!
<persia> pochu: I can't get the get-orig-source for libini4j to work.  Would you mind if I upload with just a watch file?  While uscan seems to talk to sourceforge just fine to check the version, it won't download the zip file.
 * persia , rapidly running out of functional attention, uploads libini4j-java and netbeans, expecting to address any complaints post-NEW.
<warp10> MOTUs, please review my package gbemol (a graphical frontend for MPD). http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=gbemol
<mr_pouit> mmh, I forgot the "REVU:", too bad ;/
<persia> mr_pouit: No issues.  At least the package got in :)
<mr_pouit> ^^
<ScottK> \sh_away: I'd prefer to see your packages with less restrictive licensing (i.e. put all the possible options in debian/copyright and not just Artistic).
<persia> AnAnt: My apologies, but I've run out of time.  I won't be able to review ubuntume-gdm-themes for at least another 14 hours, which may well be far too late.
<RainCT> lool: gratz
<RAOF> persia: Thanks very much for your review.
<persia> RAOF: Sorry I couldn't get anywhere with do-plugins, but you've other fans :)
<RAOF> persia: That's fine.  It needs gnome-do to build, so it's harder.
<persia> RAOF: If also needs some combination of things that cannot be satisfied by the current archives.  I was getting snakeoil related errors trying to manually install the build-deps in a clean chroot.
<persia> I'm sure it's fine for an already installed system, but the buildds might choke.
<RAOF> I built it in a schroot yesterday.
<RAOF> So it can work.  Maybe the archives are a little bit churned this close to FF :)
<persia> Very likely.  We need more freeze deadlines to spread out the load :)
<RAOF> Hm.  The new FSF address is 51 Franklin st, yes?
<persia> RAOF: less /usr/share/lintian/checks/copyright-file.desc
<RAOF> Ah.  Cool.
 * RAOF was using common-licenses/LGPL-2.1
 * persia notes that the world will break between when the FSF moves and that file is updated.
<crimsun> RAOF: for GPLv2, yes.
<RAOF> crimsun: Thanks.  Found time to test the multiarch alsa? :)
<DktrKranz> does anybody know if python-support is able to substitute ${python:Depends} with "python2.4" instead of "python (<< 2.5)" ?
<crimsun> RAOF: no, sorry, not yet.
<crimsun> RAOF: between work and commuting, getting a reliable update is rather difficult
<RAOF> That's fine.  Just curious.
<POX__> DktrKranz: use hardcoded python version in hashbang
<RainCT> rhpot1991: only a little detail and you have my advocation :); see my comment on REVU.
<POX__> or try dh_pysupport's "-V" option
<POX__> (dunno if the second one will work)
<DktrKranz> POX__, I wanted to avoid hardcoded dependencies
<POX__> DktrKranz: so why do you want python2.4 in Depends ?
<RAOF> pysupport -V should give depends of python >> 2.3 and python << 2.5, right?
<DktrKranz> POX__, because package is compatible with python2.4 only, and it won't install because Ubuntu ships python >= 2.5
<RainCT> DktrKranz: well, so you need to hardcode the shabang to python2.4 anyways, as else it would execute it with 2.5 even if 2.4 is installed
<persia> DktrKranz: Depending on what the package does during build, you may need to hardcode python2.4 in debian/rules anyway, or end up with #!/usr/bin/python in your script files.
<DktrKranz> IIRC, shebangs are already OK, but I'll have a look.
<persia> RainCT: Even hardcoding in the source doesn't always help if you use distutils and build on a system with python2.5 installed (like the Ubuntu buildds)
<DktrKranz> FYI, package is python-wsgiref
<POX__> python2.4 setup.py
<POX__> and you have hardcoded hashbangs
<POX__> oh, wsgiref :)
 * POX__ sponsored this one
<POX__> DktrKranz: replace "python (<<2.5) | python2.4" with "python2.4" (or fix sbuild)
<POX__> in build depends
<DktrKranz> POX__, yes. I already did it since it FTBFS
<POX__> and do some cdbs magic to force python2.4
 * DktrKranz needs to study cdbs...
<POX__> DEB_PYTHON_COMPILE_VERSION=2.4 or something like that
<POX__> dont remember exactly
<DktrKranz> me too
<RAOF> DktrKranz: Check out Miro, I'm pretty sure that does what you want.
<DktrKranz> RAOF, thanks for the pointer, I'll have a look at it
<RAOF> Well, not quite.  It hardcodes for the version of python that boost-python is built against.  Still, it uses CDBS and does that sort of magic.
<RainCT> good night
<DktrKranz> night RainCT
<DktrKranz> POX__, do you plan to switch to 2.5 soon?
<DktrKranz> or is it too late for Lenny?
<POX__> Lenny will have 2.5 as default
<DktrKranz> so, wsgiref has to be adjusted in Debian too soon. I'll contact Debian maint about it to coordinate efforts
<POX__> no need, we already know what's wrong
<POX__> (sbuild mainly)
<DktrKranz> mh... "Depends: python (>= 2.3) | python2.3, python (<< 2.5), python-support (>= 0.7.1)"
<RAOF> "Albumb.  It's like plumb"
<dcordero> hi
<blueyed> persia: regarding the jedit package, you've said that debian/rules is no shell script and I should use make vars and syntax there.. I'm not entirely sure, what you mean.. as far as I can see it would make the whole target more ugly.
<RAOF> Can anyone cast their eyes over gnome-do (http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=gnome-do) for (what should be, really really) the final time?  It should only need a brief check; it's had 2 advocates in the past.
<RAOF> I'm prepared to offer reciprocal review/advocation at this point :)
<blueyed> RAOF: the Homepage field should have a trailing slash.. ;)
<HighNo> hm, my package blueproximity is accepted and according to REVU it has been uploaded already about 12h ago. It does not show up in the repository though. It can't be found on the webpage http://packages.ubuntu.com/hardy/allpackages and it can't be found by apt-get. The bug for inclusion LP# 137339 is also 'in Progress'
<RAOF> blueyed: Really?  OK.
<blueyed> you may clean the head of debian/rules
<RAOF> HighNo: It'll take some time to build/negotiate NEW.
<RAOF> blueyed: The dh-make boilerplate comments?
<blueyed> RAOF: at least I think so. hostname+path.
<Nafallo> Fujitsu: ping
<blueyed> yes
<RAOF> HighNo: Basically, your work here is done.  For the moment :)
<blueyed> RAOF: you should use cdbs, too, for the future. at's a less more verbose in debian/rules!
<RAOF> blueyed: At the expense of being totally impenetrable :P
<RAOF> blueyed: You'll notice do-plugins uses CDBS, because I presumed it'd be a simpler package.
<RAOF> I quite like having all the steps laid out in front of me ;)
<blueyed> omg.. s/less more/lot less/
<blueyed> yes, but most are all the same, e.g. patch/unpatch.. just depends on what you include.
<RAOF> Yeah.  CLI packages have quite a lot of non-CDBS-magic in them.
<blueyed> changelog should only list "Initial Package"?
 * blueyed does not know cli (just command line interface for that)
<emet> hello
<RAOF> Common Language Infrastructure, aka CIL aka mono/.NET/gnudotnet/etc.
<geser> HighNo: it's still in source NEW: https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/hardy/+queue?queue_state=0&queue_text=blue
<blueyed> ah.. heard about mono quite a bit.. ;)
<emet> I read the Ubuntu packaging guide, and I am confused, how can I have a shell script execute on package install and a different one on package remove?
<RAOF> emet: You'd be after the postinst/postrm maintainer scripts.
<geser> emet: it's done in the postinst and prerm scripts
<emet> does the flashplayer-nonfree use those?
<emet> it seems to download flash when you install the package
<emet> flash is not actually in the package
<RAOF> Yes; flashplugin-nonfree is almost entirely postinst/prerm scripts.
<blueyed> RAOF: a comment in the desktop file would be nice. gets displayed nicely in kde4
<emet> nice
<emet> I'll take a look at that package then
<geser> emet: if you interested in the "documentation" for those scripts see http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-maintainerscripts.html
<RAOF> blueyed: There already *is* a comment in the desktop file?
<emet> speaking of the flashplayer-nonfree package
<emet> it seems adobe changed their installer slightly, causing flashplayer-nonfree to fail because of MD5 mismatch
<emet> this was about a week ago
<geser> emet: gutsy?
<emet> yes
<RAOF> blueyed: Anything else?
<blueyed> RAOF: yes, sorry. I've only looked at the patch and thought you added a desktop file..
<geser> does someone remember the status of the flashplugin-nonfree for gutsy?
<RAOF> blueyed: Ok.  I'll add a comment to the patch then.  I thought it would have been obvious by the name, but it clearly isn't.
<geser> emet: there should be a new flashplugin-nonfree in gutsy-updates (9.0.48.0.2+really0ubuntu12.2). Does it still have a problem with the md5sum?
<blueyed> RAOF: I've only looked at the patch chunk, without realizing that it's not just added. the name is clear I think.
<emet> geser, no, this was last week, I havn't checked again
<emet> geser, I figured you guys would find it very fast
<emet> :o
<emet> reboot
<RAOF> blueyed: I'll add a comment anyway.  It's simple to do and uncommented patches annoy me sometimes.
<blueyed> RAOF: your copyright file is sweet. /me obviously has not fully read the proposal. I've only used Files, Copyright, License fields.
<RAOF> Heh.  Yes, I think that proposal actually makes writing copyright files easier, too.
#ubuntu-motu 2008-02-13
<up_the_irons> in my debian/rules, i have: http://p.caboo.se/151263, but when i run debian/rules build, I get this error: http://p.caboo.se/151269.  I think it's simple, but i'm new to this.  anyone can point me in the right direction?
<superm1> Riddell, licensing
<superm1> Riddell, its not an entirely free license on it
<blueyed> up_the_irons: that's bash code.
<RAOF> up_the_irons: That's quite crazy.
<up_the_irons> blueyed: i've seen bash code in other debian/rules files
 * StevenK tries to stop his eyes bleeding
<RAOF> up_the_irons: The main problem is that you don't have enough ';'s, I think.
<RAOF> up_the_irons: And I don't believe you can use fi there.  Because this is a *single* line being run by sh.
<up_the_irons> RAOF: thanks, yeah, someone in #debian just pointed that out
<up_the_irons> RAOF: i'm looking at the debian/rules for xen-linux-system-2.6.18-4-xen-686, and it indeed uses 'fi'
<up_the_irons> RAOF: as an example
<RAOF> Fair enough.  I'm not a sh fiend by any means.
<up_the_irons> nor am i, but seems i keep running into it
<blueyed> up_the_irons: you need additional semicolons.. after commands, and before fi probably.
<StevenK> You certainly can use 'fi' in one-liners, you just need to be mindful of where you put your semicolons
<RAOF> Also, you should spell confirm CONFIRM, not ONFIRM :)
<up_the_irons> RAOF: yeah, it *is* $CONFIRM, but somewhere it got lost in the paste ;)
<up_the_irons> blueyed: thanks
<RAOF> up_the_irons: Oh, yeah.  You actually want $$CONFIRM, otherwise make thinks you're referencing the variable $C
<up_the_irons> RAOF: aah
<up_the_irons> RAOF: good catch
<up_the_irons> oh man, maybe i should just make a shell script
<up_the_irons> this is getting weird
<up_the_irons> i guess in the packages i'm looking at, the if's are indeed oneliner's
<RAOF> up_the_irons: Your problem is that you're trying to write a shell script inside a make file.  So you're fighting your tools, which is never fun.
<up_the_irons> yup, that was it
<up_the_irons> RAOF: i know, i know...  i'm just not very good at makefiles; and i'm trying to learn the packaging thing at the same time.  so i'm tripping over myself
<RAOF> For example, it looks like you could make a linux-2.6.18-xen.hg target, and make build-stamp depend on that.
<up_the_irons> RAOF: yup that's exactly what i'm typing right now ;)
<up_the_irons> i saw shell in other debian/rules files and i figured "yay, i can use shell in makefiles".  i was wrong
<up_the_irons> just simple 1-liner shell
<up_the_irons> now *that's* better:
<up_the_irons> http://p.caboo.se/151279
<up_the_irons> so question
<up_the_irons> when i run dpkg-buildpackage, and it does its thing, is that when any changes I made into the source tree get reflected in the diff.gz ?
<azeem> depends on the option
<RAOF> I don't *think* you have to even have those shell ifs there.  You should be able to declare a linux-2.6.18-xen.hg target.
<blueyed> up_the_irons: now you could depend on the file, instead of the if.. :)
<up_the_irons> blueyed: dood, i tried that
<up_the_irons> blueyed: it said unknown target
<up_the_irons> RAOF: yeah, i figured the same, but it said unknown target
<RAOF> up_the_irons: You'd need to have a "linux-2.6.18-xen.hg:" line, containing the hg clone command.
<up_the_irons> so I can merrily make changes in the source tree, and it'll automatically become part of the diff?
<up_the_irons> RAOF: oh
<up_the_irons> RAOF: ok
<RAOF> blueyed: Are you still looking at gnome-do?
<up_the_irons> RAOF: the last time I wrote my own makefiles from scratch was in the Turbo C++ 3.0 for DOS days ;)
<blueyed> RAOF: in my free time during fixing my own package, I'll try a build now and then probably advocate, looks good!
<RAOF> blueyed: I can upload a new candidate with the changes you've requested if you like.
<RAOF> But they won't affect the build, so if you just want to advocate I'll upload the changed package to universe :)
<blueyed> RAOF: sounds good :)
<up_the_irons> RAOF: that worked, now I have a much cleaner: http://p.caboo.se/151282
<RAOF> blueyed: To the new revu upload, or the advocate-and-me-upload approach? :)
<RAOF> up_the_irons: Things look *much* cleaner when you don't fight your tools :)
<blueyed> both indeed.. but persia has also looked at my package. you might want to check out debian/copyright, but I'll have to add more headers and preambles there.
<blueyed> The package is jedit.
<up_the_irons> RAOF: indeed :)
<RAOF> blueyed: Ok.  The new candidate should show on revu shortly.  I'll check out jedit.
<RAOF> blueyed: I see why persia suggests using make variables for your get-orig-source target.  It seems you could define version & uversion as make variables, and possibly split get-orig-source into get-upstream-source & repack-upstream-source targets.
<RAOF> Something like "version=$(shell dh_testdir && uscan --dehs | sed ..etc)"
<RAOF> I'm also not a big fan of the side-effect of setting version being that the tarball is downloaded.
<blueyed> that from the tarball? it's a check only there.
<RAOF> blueyed: "version=$$(uscan --force-download ...)"
<blueyed> RAOF: would it be ok to be called from "anywhere" then?
<RAOF> blueyed: With the make variables?  You'd still need to cd ${DEBIAN_DIR}/.. first, yes.
<RAOF> I haven't worked it through, but I believe it'd end up looking cleaner.
<blueyed> RAOF: but still shell like? with && and on the same line? (because of e.g. the "cd")
<RAOF> Yeah.  You'd need to have it shell-like.  The difference would be that you would have a bunch of smaller, split up shell lines.
<RAOF> blueyed: Oh, actually, no!  "version=$(shell cd ${DEBIAN_DIR}/.. & uscan --dehs | ...)" would be callable from anywhere.
<blueyed> wow.. there's even a version hardcoded currently.
<blueyed> With a single "&"?
<RAOF> Ahem.  && :)
<blueyed> should I not get the version/uversion from the sourceball? Just define them at the top of the rules?
<RAOF> That *will* get the version/uversion from the sourceball.  Make variables defined with "=" are pretty much recursive text-substitution (IIUC), so it's evaluated only where you dereference it.
<RAOF> IE: when you go "$(version)", make will replace that with "$(shell foo)", then evaluate $(shell foo).
<blueyed> in contrast to ":="?
<RAOF> Yes.  ":=" means "evaluate right now".
<emgent> heya people
<up_the_irons> <phew>...  the package finally built, now to see what are conffiles
<blueyed> RAOF: better? http://pastebin.com/m2c01a479
<blueyed> up_the_irons: you define them in "conffiles", that are those where you're asked during upgrade when you have changed them yourself, and the maintainer, too.
<up_the_irons> blueyed: ok thanks.  what do you mean by "and the maintainer, too" ?
<blueyed> the package maintainer: you're only asked, if the maintainer changed the default conffile, to merge your changes or take his (or keep yours).
<RAOF> blueyed: That doesn't actually work, does it?  Sorry, I've been unclear.  I was thinking of defining version=$(shell foo) just above (and outside of) the get-orig-source target, or even at the top of the file.
<RAOF> And you won't need to cd ${DEBIAN_DIR} in your get-orig-source; the only reason you needed to do that is to make uscan work, yes?
<up_the_irons> blueyed: ok thanks for the info
<up_the_irons> regarding the generated diff.gz, that is the difference between the <package>-orig.tar.gz and the build directory?
<up_the_irons> actually, looks like there is a directory that should not be represented in the diff (b/c it is downloaded by hg), is there a way to ignore it, or should that in fact remain in the diff?
 * StevenK gets confused. I build gnome-games, and it has undefined references to things that are defined in the same file
<up_the_irons> mm.. and why is it trying to diff build files (like *.o)..
<up_the_irons> crap "dpkg-source: unrepresentable changes to source"
<blueyed> up_the_irons: clean them in your clean target.
<up_the_irons> blueyed: ok
<blueyed> RAOF: yes, it totally not works currently. and ${DEBIAN_DIR} does not seem to work for ./rules binary anyway?!
<up_the_irons> blueyed: but is there a way to just ignore certain directories?  b/c if i clean them, the next time i build this package, say to add a single kernel module, it will want to rebuild the entire kernel
<up_the_irons> blueyed: what is the way to do this so i don't fight my tools? :)
<RAOF> up_the_irons: Those are restrictions of the debian-source-package format.  You can use dpkg-buildpackage -nc to try to build without cleaning first, but debian/rules clean should take you back to a pristine build directory.
<up_the_irons> maybe i should just cp -a them out of the tree, and put them back when i need them. ghetto style ;)
<up_the_irons> RAOF: ok, i kinda thought so
<up_the_irons> RAOF: i could just save the build directories somewhere, and copy them back when i need them, as if they were always there.  this package is for my use only, not gonna distribute it
<up_the_irons> RAOF: i just really hate to recompile the whole kernel just for a simple change
<up_the_irons> RAOF: if I *didn't* use a package syste, i could do it no problem.  So I want to stay package friendly, but hopefully not lose the benefits of a build system (that only builds stuff that has changed)
<up_the_irons> *system
<RAOF> up_the_irons: Have you checked out the ubuntu-kernel buildy thing?  That might be what you're after.
<up_the_irons> brb
<up_the_irons> RAOF: you mean build-kpkg, or something
<up_the_irons> *make-kpkg
<RAOF> No; there's some new infrastructure in the Ubuntu kernel source pacakages.
<up_the_irons> no i haven't tried that
<up_the_irons> but this package is from xen-3.2.0 tarball
<up_the_irons> i have a feeling it will be hard to integrate
<up_the_irons> not a vanilla kernel
<up_the_irons> what I'm aiming for is, a single .deb that contains everything I get when I do 'make install' from the Xen tarball
<up_the_irons> so far, I've gotten close
<up_the_irons> in fact, debian/xen does contain the entire built tree
<up_the_irons> now it's just a matter of packaging it
<up_the_irons> ok, been sitting down too long, brb in 10 mins
<RAOF> Aw, man.  What with the nouveau testing I'd forgotten how awesome compiz is.
<StevenK> RAOF: What the?
<StevenK> I find I can't drag windows between viewports anymore, which is irritating me.
<RAOF> I've been using metacity's compositor.  Changing workspaces is supremely ugly, compared to cube.
<RAOF> WorksForMe(tm)
<StevenK> I have to expose out using Super-e, drag and them go back in
<RAOF> Hm.  You're using wall or cube?
<pochu> persia: I'm fine with the watch file
<RAOF> StevenK: You might want to check out the various "edge flip" options in ccsm?
<blueyed> RAOF: gnome-do is similar to katapult, isn't it? It also does not support "f1" for help at least.. ;)
<blueyed> RAOF: advocated.
<RAOF> blueyed: I don't know, I've never used katapault.  Also, correct.  No f1-is-help yet :)
<RAOF> blueyed: Thanks.  Yay!
<jdong> what is the "this is a merge" heuristic
<blueyed> when activating it again here on kde4, it does not display, but grabs input..
<jdong> it seems like if I say the D word anywhere in the changelog it's officially a merge :)
<RAOF> blueyed: Don't tell me that kde4's compositor is broken, too?
<blueyed> RAOF: I've no desktop effects enabled..
<RAOF> blueyed: I saw that behaviour on Metacity, but it's been partially fixed.  It should work fine without a compositor or with xcompmgr or compiz.
<RAOF> blueyed: Really?  Hm.
<blueyed> it's the same with desktop effects..
<RAOF> up_the_irons: Have you checked out the ubuntu-kernel buildy thing?  That might be what you're after.  February 13 01:44	 MOTU chalserogers@gmail.com  	  Addressed comments from blueyed in #motu   	 Yes  	 [del] [remove advocating]
<RAOF> Frikkin touchpad!
<blueyed> i have to click somewhere around to get the input back.. it actually starts programs, but I can't see it before..
<RAOF> blueyed: I've only seen that with broken compositors, but I haven't tried it in KDE, either.
<StevenK> RAOF: I know that as slammermaus, based on when I first starting using IRC. A guy was nicknamed slammer (not his actual nick), and he kept blaming his mouse for pasting large gobs of text into the channel.
<RAOF> I should find the irssi knob that disables pasting.  It already saves me from accidentally pasting in *huge* ammounts of text..
<RAOF> For those in the audience, paste_verify_line_count is the irssi variable I'm looking for.
<ember> paste_detect_keycount
<StevenK> RAOF: You set that to one, and it asks you for even one line?
<blueyed> RAOF: re-uploaded jedit (a new upload with only minor licensing indenting and re-order ("*" to top), uploaded afterwards (should appear at 2utc then)
<RAOF> StevenK: Yup.  Just checked.
<RAOF> blueyed: Ok.  I'll keep looking.
<up_the_irons> in the clean: target, what is the minus sign before "-$(MAKE) clean" for?
<up_the_irons> (this is in the generated template)
<slangasek> for generating a lintian error
<up_the_irons> slangasek: ok
<RAOF> up_the_irons: It means "ignore errors from this command", and what you actually *want* is [ ! -f Makefile ] || $(MAKE) clean
<RAOF> Which translates to "If the makefile doesn't exist, do nothing.  If it does exist, run make clean"
 * asantoni looks for advocate for LP #190589.... :) (any MOTU with a few spare moments?)
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 190589 in mixxx "New upstream release (in REVU)" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/190589
<up_the_irons> RAOF: ah ok
<RAOF> ls
<RAOF> What, you mean that won't list all the files in #ubuntu-motu?  Soft!
<RAOF> blueyed: jedit fails to build a source package for me - is this likely to be a build-dep lack on my part?
<blueyed> RAOF: do you have ant installed?
<RAOF> It would seem the answer is "no".
<blueyed> RAOF: I've just uploaded a new version (and messed around quite a bit in the meantime)
<RAOF> blueyed: Ok.  Does it really depend on java5-runtime?
<blueyed> RAOF: icedtea-java7-jdk, ant, ant-optional
<RAOF> blueyed: I mean, debian/control lists java5-runtime as a dependency of the binary package.  Did you mean icedtea | java-v-m | java5-runtime?
<RAOF> Right.  I'll check out the new, new package then :)
<blueyed> RAOF: yes, indeed. Should I put j-v-m last even?
<superm1> isn't there a nice way to say use a virtualpackage that represents a jre?
<RAOF> That should surely be java-virtual-machine, no?
<RAOF> Or is it java-runtime?
<RAOF> There was a page somewhere with a non-exhaustive list of virtual packages, but I can't remember where.
<superm1> i think its java-virtual-machine
<superm1> yeah it is, but it doesnt list icedtea yet
<jdong> unless he has a specific list of VM's he wants to try in order of preference...
<superm1> it lists sun-java6, sun-java5, sun java 1.4, etc
<superm1> so icedtea | java-virtual-machine should do it
<blueyed> superm1: but it's not really versioned, is it? Will take it as such though.
<superm1> well icedtea is the only one that doesn't provide java-virtual-machine it looks like
<blueyed> I'm also removing the ${shlibs:Depends} which is not needed for java packages, correct?
<superm1> so it should cover your bases
<RAOF> blueyed: If you'd like this to be backportable, you might want to drop the debhelper dependency (and compat) down to 5, unless you use any of the new behaviour.
<blueyed> well, e.g. ant has java-gcj-compat-dev | java-virtual-machine, java-gcj-compat | java1-runtime | java2-runtime - so it's something different?!
<blueyed> RAOF: yes, thanks, forgot about that..
<ScottK> Fujitsu: Thanks.
<Fujitsu> ScottK: No problem.
<ScottK> I figured I was doing enough security work I might as well sign up for the official club.
<Fujitsu> Heh.
<ScottK> Which reminds me ...
<ScottK> jdstrand: How clamav going ...
<blueyed> RAOF, superm1: therefore it was correct already I think.. (icedtea-java7-jre | java-virtual-machine, java5-runtime)
<superm1> yeah :)
<RAOF> Yeah, fair enough.  All the *jre packages provide java5-runtime.
<blueyed> icedtea-java7-jre should provide java-virtual-machine though.. this is probably the reasond why gcj gets pulled in for the build..
<RAOF> Oh, dear lord licensing sucks.
<RAOF> Cosmetic: you may want to put each file on a separate line, and they should be comma-delimited.
<blueyed> RAOF: that would make it much longer.. I've probably missed something minor, but heard that it would be ok. Only that all different licenses are important.
<RAOF> Also, if the files are uniquely named you don't *have* to use the full path, */name is implied.
<blueyed> Yes, I've copied and pasted them.. I should it could not hurt to be explicit there.
<RAOF> Yeah.  It's really cosmetic.
<LaserJock> RAOF: did you file that licensing bug on tomboy?
<RAOF> LaserJock: Yes.
<blueyed> bug 189953
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 189953 in icedtea-java7 "Inconsistent 'Provides' for different java compilers/runtimes" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/189953
<LaserJock> RAOF: did you happen to see mjg59's comment in -devel about it?
<RAOF> blueyed: But, as I understand it, it's not properly conformant to the proposed machine-readable format unless the lists are comma-delimited.  That's not going to block my advocation at all though.
<blueyed> RAOF: I'll check that in the next round of changes.
<blueyed> Re-uploaded with compat and shlibs:Depends minor change. I'll have to catch some sleep now..
<LaserJock> dang, I may end up with way more Multiverse uploads than anything else for Hardy :/
<RAOF_> LaserJock: Sorry, my buildbox is thrashing thanks to jEdit.
<jdong> anyone here into blog-ranting about usability related issues?
<jdong> I found an amusing one from Leopard's recent update
<RAOF_> LaserJock: No, I didn't see the comments, should I?
<jdong> http://www.dslreports.com/r0/download/1274378~d987d620159d1c354525056af832b2b1/Picture%201.jpg
<jdong> prizes go out to those who explain what that charge status actually means....
<RAOF_> jdong: That's *awesome*.
<jdong> lol
<LaserJock> RAOF_: he just basically said that in his opinion a blanket license is sufficient when it's clear, like there aren't inconsistent licenses
<RAOF_> LaserJock: So the licensing is OK, how about copyright holders?  That makes things easier, though.
<LaserJock> not sure
<LaserJock> but you tend to get different answers depending on which archive admin you talk to ;-)
<LaserJock> just thought you might be interested
<RAOF_> Oh, certainly.
<RAOF_> It seems there's no end to the things you can learn about licensing :)
<LaserJock> s/learn/get incredibly, horribly confused/
<bddebian> Heh, amen to that
<RAOF_> Damn you bugzilla.  Why must you make me work so hard to file bugs?
<joejaxx> has anyone here tried using minicom in Gutsy?
<superm1> i did
<superm1> but i didn't have luck with it when i tried
<joejaxx> yeah i had to run minicom -s
<joejaxx> and had to change the defaults
<dendrobates> joejaxx: I used it sucessfully to connect to a serial console interface on a Sun T2000
<tonyyarusso> Thanks to whoever uploaded my kompozer diff - the new version just hit my mirror.  (Meanwhile, I found a LP bug...)
<joejaxx> dendrobates: NICE :D
<joejaxx> i am trying to reset the password on a Cisco Router :P
<joejaxx> with minicom
<joejaxx> :P
<joejaxx> but i got it to connect now
<superm1> hey if another motu wouldn't mind giving this a quick once over: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=libnet-upnp-perl
<warp10> Good morning
<rhpot1991> revu down for everyone else?
<vemon> if motus still have access to revu then could someone check the latest version of whysynth. it's already been advocated a few timces but i've needed to adjust the package due to licensing issues
<vemon> the latest version is done according to sistypotys comments
<Fujitsu> The machine is alive, but it appears fairly sick.
 * Fujitsu wonders if it's out of disk space again.
 * RAOF finishes his 2 hour update-miro's-copyright stint.
<RAOF> Ha!  I speak too soon :(
<LucidFox> slomo, could you please comment on bug #191307?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 191307 in f-spot "f-spot man page missing mono warning" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/191307
<LucidFox> I think it's not a bug, but the submitter sternly disagrees
<slomo> LucidFox: it's just that the reporter doesn't like mono?
<slomo> or do i miss anything
<LucidFox> seems so
<slomo> close please
<LucidFox> closed
<slomo> thanks
<dholbach> good morning
<gpocentek> Riddell: I've reuploaded wzdftpd, the diff is cleaner
<tbutter> revu seems to be broken (timeout)
<\sh> yepp
<ScottK> slangasek: Are you still up and about perhaps?
<ScottK> \sh: Did you see my IRC comment on your Perl packages?
<\sh> ScottK, nope...revu is down somehow
<ScottK> OK.
<ScottK> \sh: It was about debian/copyright.  I think it's better to redistribute on as generous of terms as possible.
<norsetto> morning folks and folkettes
<\sh> ScottK, you mean that I should explicitly write in debian/copyright that the upstream source could be licensed as GPL or artistic as perl does?
<ScottK> \sh: That's what I think would be better.
<DktrKranz> norsetto: folkettes? are you hungry? :)
<\sh> ScottK, ok...changing it...anything else? I think packaging wise is everything in order
<ScottK> \sh: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libtree-perl has what I'd consider to be a good example.
<norsetto> DktrKranz: neah, just being politically correct (its the gender equality era....)
<ScottK> \sh: I only had to to review the diff, not test build so far.  If you can stuff the packages somewhere and give me a .dsc link, I'll give them a final review.
<DktrKranz> norsetto: so it's better saying "morning folkettes and folks"
<ScottK> \sh: The debian/copyright thing we all that stood out from reviewing the diffs.
<ScottK> Good morning norsetto.
<DktrKranz> ScottK: congrats!
<\sh> ScottK, ok...I'll change the debian/copyright and push some packages on my webserver ...
<ScottK> \sh: Thanks.
<ScottK> DktrKranz: Thanks
<norsetto> ScottK: heck, what do you do here? Don't you have a bed somewhere!?
<\sh> ScottK, no thank you :)
<ScottK> norsetto: We're having an ice storm here and about 45 minutes ago one of our dogs was stuck out in the back yard (couldn't get up the steps to get back in) and so after a trip out in the cold rain to rescue her, I'm not able to get back to sleep.
<norsetto> ScottK: oh, do you know by any chance if it is so bad in minnenapolis too?
<ScottK> norsetto: It's February.  You can generally figure it's very cold there. ;-)
<ScottK> norsetto: We're far enough away that it's a different weather pattern.  They probably had this precipitation in the form of snow two days ago.
<ScottK> norsetto: You aren't coming this way to visit are you?
<norsetto> ScottK: My wife is headed there right now
<ScottK> norsetto: Ah.  Excellent reason to worry.
 * ScottK checks the weather.
<ScottK> norsetto: It's cold and snowy, but nothing unusual for Minneapolis.  No severe storms.
<norsetto> scottk: ok, thanks, I was hoping to hear that
<ScottK> norsetto: What's in Minneapolis?
<norsetto> ScottK: a friend of her
<ScottK> Ah.  Well they get lots of snow this time of year (I was there last December) and they generally know how to deal with it.
<\sh> scottK, please check out http://buildserver.homelinux.net/src/ there are both packages
<norsetto> scottk: yeah, they might, I'm not so sure about my wife though, she can hardly drive here and she absolutely wanted to rent a car, oh well....
<ScottK> norsetto: One thing they are good at is plowing and salting the streets.
<ScottK> \sh: Will do.
<ScottK> \sh: If I'm satisfied with them do you want me to just upload them or do you want the pleasure?
<\sh> SCottK: well, if you are satisfied, just upload straight away :)
<ScottK> Will do.
<\sh> and dpkg is fixed, too ... wow
<TheMuso> Congrats other -release members.
 * ScottK looks to see if that applies to him ..
<dholbach> scottK, TheMuso, norsetto, hobbsee (absent), sistpoty (absent): congratulations!
<ScottK> dholbach: Thanks.
<dholbach> I'll set up the team and send out the mail in a bit
<dholbach> need to fix up something else before
<norsetto> dholbach: what for? We haven't started already :-)
<TheMuso> norsetto: Better to be ready when the flood gates open. :p
<ScottK> TheMuso and norsetto: we should probably find a time to conspire on rules.
<TheMuso> ScottK: Sounds like a plan.
 * norsetto wears his frost-proof hat
<TheMuso> ScottK: I'm surprised you are awake actually.
<norsetto> errr, where is that link btw?
<ScottK> TheMuso: Scroll back about 25 minutes for an explanation.
<TheMuso> ScottK: Ah, that sucks.
<ScottK> Any MOTU hopeful want to work on a bug fix (I'll provide guidance).  There's a patch, it just needs to be packaged.
<isaac> ScottK: what's the package?
<ScottK> isaac: https://bugs.launchpad.net/debian/+source/pdns/+bug/191506
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 191506 in pdns "TXT records truncated" [Low,In progress]
<isaac> not interested :P
<ScottK> Feel free to assign it to yourself instead of me if you want to try it.
<ScottK> OK
<dholbach> bug 125658 might be interesting to work on too - it seems to block the blender folks
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 125658 in openexr "please update openexr version" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/125658
<dholbach> (I realise that openexr is in main, but most of the rdepends that would need to go through a small transition are in universe)
<AnAnt> hello
<AnAnt> is there something wrong with REVU's website ?
<ScottK2> AnAnt: Yes
<AnAnt> ScottK2: ok
<AnAnt> thanks
<AnAnt> I thought something wrong with my connection
<\sh> scottK: you mean http://wiki.powerdns.com/cgi-bin/trac.fcgi/changeset?old_path=trunk%2Fpdns%2Fpdns&old=996&new_path=trunk%2Fpdns%2Fpdns&new=996 ?
<gaspa> there was been some discussion about sudo policies? ( i'm lookin at bug #191210)
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 191210 in sudo "[hardy] exit out of sudo -i doesnt really exit" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/191210
<ScottK> \sh: Yes.  I haven't checked to see if it applies to our current version directly or needs a bit of work.
<\sh> scottK: I set it on my todo
<ScottK> \sh: Great.  Thanks.
 * ScottK is looking at your packages now.
<geser> good morning
<ScottK2> Good morning geser.
<\sh> ScottK, reassigned the bug
<ScottK> OK.  Thanks.  \sh: I have someone who runs pdns who will test the package when it's done (if you don't).
<AnAnt> hmmm, can anyone tell me where I can get help about makefiles ?
<TheMuso> ScottK: Just got my first uplaods to main in, due to a spec I was working on. I felt rather nervous. :)
<\sh> scottk: cool :) I think the bug is also annoying pdns users in dapper/edgy/feisty/gutsy...
<ScottK> TheMuso: Congratulations.  I haven't done it yet.
<ScottK> \sh: I'm not sure if it's SRU worthy or not, but since I'm not in motu-sru, I guess I don't need to have an opinion.
<TheMuso> ScottK: We'll see if everybody's boot succeeds first, then congratulations are likely in order. :p
<TheMuso> In all seriousness, I tested and re-tested my changes, so there shouldn't be a problem.
<\sh> scottk: well, backporting is always an alternative
<ScottK> Sure
<DktrKranz> \sh, which one?
<\sh> DktrKranz, pdns
<HighNo> hm, revu is down?
<ScottK2> Yes
<HighNo> ff tore it apart or is it just 'closed' because of ff?
<DktrKranz> \sh, if you mean bug 191506, when you have a patch, we can discuss at it briefly, but it looks a good candidate.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 191506 in pdns "TXT records truncated" [Low,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/191506
<ScottK> It was having hard drive troubles yesterday.
<HighNo> ouch
<Tonio_> dholbach: ping ?
<dholbach> Tonio_: pong
<Tonio_> dholbach: hey ;) I hope you're doing well
<dholbach> Tonio_: thanks, yes I am - how are you?
<Tonio_> dholbach: my team membership for ubuntu developpers is expiring in a few days, I'm supposed to ping you to get it renewed :)
<Tonio_> dholbach: very well :) currently working on the kde implementation of sudo for kde4, good progress so I'm a happy guy :)
<dholbach> Tonio_: let it expire, as long as you're in ubuntu-core-dev and/or motu all is good
<dholbach> Tonio_: in the end ubuntu-dev will only consist of ubuntu-core-dev and motu
<Tonio_> dholbach: oki ;)
<Tonio_> dholbach: true that core-dev is sufficient for everything ;)
<TheMuso> /c/c
 * pochu waves
<Ng> hey pochu :)
<Ng> thanks for your msg :)
<pochu> Ng: anytime, thanks for the fix!
 * pochu hugs Ng 
<Ng> I'm going to risk flames from my gf tonight and cut a release. I've fixed all the bugs I can in time, and FF is tomorrow ;)
<tjaalton> Ng: I do it all the time ;)
<Ng> hehe
<tjaalton> speaking of which, I'd like to let the MOTU Release Team to know that I'm about to upload a new version of vdr (1.4.7 -> 1.5.13) soon
<tjaalton> and some new plugins too
<tjaalton> upstream decided to do a stable release before plunging in the HDTV world, so 1.6.0 should be out in a couple of weeks
<theseinfeld> dholbach i think the libdc1394 should be ready for inclussion? what do you think?
<tjaalton> and I have upgraded my box with the new packages, works like a charm
<theseinfeld> dholbach check it here: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=libdc1394-22 and the compiled PPA here: https://launchpad.net/~libdc1394-dev/+archive
<Ng> tjaalton: ace :)
<tjaalton> Ng: I should update the spec too
<Ng> ugh, and I should apologise for not having been near the spec since UDS :/
<tjaalton> me neither, until last week ;)
<tjaalton> we should decide the name for the meta-package :)
<ScottK2> tjaalton: Do it before Feature Freeze and we don't need to know ;-)
<tjaalton> ScottK2: that's what I'm aiming for ;)
<theseinfeld> so anybody on MOTU that could advocate the libdc1394-22 package inclussion?
<theseinfeld> it is ready, just needs someone to advocate it...
<geser> theseinfeld: it is a different package than in Debian unstable?
<theseinfeld> yes
<theseinfeld> as I am one of the developers, I am closer to the truth
<theseinfeld> :D
<geser> any reason for being different?
<theseinfeld> I have been working with the Debian people
<theseinfeld> Stubborness of Debian?
<theseinfeld> :D
<geser> can't we sync the package from Debian?
<theseinfeld> No
<theseinfeld> you do that and you get crap
<theseinfeld> it is missing things
<theseinfeld> it has some problems with the naming
<theseinfeld> the debian was lagging alot behind with this library
<theseinfeld> i have been trying for one year with them to get them involved and when I got their attention they wanted just to have minor changes and still using the old framework
<theseinfeld> you can sync, but you will lose some of the added features
<theseinfeld> so, geser, what shall it be
<geser> theseinfeld: I was just asking as I've seen it in Debian and we usually take packages directly from them
<theseinfeld> I know
<pochu> superm1: around?
<pochu> superm1: 11:48 <     slomo> pochu: any other changes for -bad? btw, you could tell superm1 that the gst-plugins-bad gmyth plugin doesn't support gmyth 0.7
<pochu> superm1: 12:00 <     slomo> pochu: ok, so still... you have 0.7 in hardy and upstream gmyth only works with gmyth >= 0.4 gmyth <= 0.4.99
<pochu> superm1: 12:00 <     slomo> pochu: if there's a fix to work with the new version i'll be happy to get it upstream ;)
<pochu> superm1: have it worked for you? :)
<theseinfeld> geser, the thing with them is that they made clear that us, the developers, should not interfere with the packaging. Something that I find outrageous
<slomo> superm1: if it did work with 0.7 for you without any additional changes to what is in cvs that would be great news ;)
<theseinfeld> geser they are not on the dev lists and they don't know many of the things that should be included. Now they know, after my lobby, but still insist on some of the things that we didn't agree (like the use of both old API and new one)
<theseinfeld> geser we spent quite much effort to make this happen, and the debian just don't want to remove one damn line (conflict: libdc1394-13) :))
<pochu> superm1: oh and: 11:45 <     slomo> pochu: iirc the mythtv stuff is not acceptable in Debian (license, patents, no idea)
<pochu> superm1: that's bad news :(
<theseinfeld> geser, you must agree that i needed a more friendlier environment :)
<slomo> pochu, superm1: ok, i tested it with 0.7 now and i get unresolved symbols
<theseinfeld> geser so, using ppa and revu was the way to put our dev ideas into packages
<geser> theseinfeld: I can understand your pain
<geser> theseinfeld: are there any packages in hardy which could use the new lib already?
<theseinfeld> geser, not yet. There is coriander, that will come soon...
<theseinfeld> thanks geser :)
<theseinfeld> I was already comforted by cprov for this :)
<slomo> superm1, pochu: nevermind... builds and does not have unresolved symbols if done properly ;)
<theseinfeld> so, geser, the coriander is dependent of libdc1394-22 and once it is stable enough for a new release (couple of weeks) I will let you know
<geser> theseinfeld: as feature freeze is tomorrow (which includes also no new packages anymore) perhaps also talk to the motu-release team if they give you an exception
<theseinfeld> maybe I will do the packaging for them too
<slomo> superm1, pochu: OTOH libgmyth-dev or whatever should depend on libmysqlclient-dev stuff (and gst-plugins-bad should not directly build depend on it)
<geser> theseinfeld: feature freeze also include new upstream version freeze so it would also need an exception if the new version should get included in hardy
<enyc> Hrrm I would like to know why  ZoneMinder package in Ubuntu is 1.22.3 (2006 release) and not 1.23.1 (2008 release) --  I suspcet I need to be asking the question in debian ......
<theseinfeld> geser yes, but how can I ask them if so far, this package has not been revu-ed by anybody?
<promag> anyone can help me using cbds?
<promag> I did make dist on my source package
<theseinfeld> promag, what is the problem?
<promag> then I extracted it
<promag> is this the correct way?
<theseinfeld> ye
<promag> after extraction I did dh_make -b -createorig
<promag> correct again?
<theseinfeld> what are you trying to do promag?
<theseinfeld> you make dist, get the tar.gz, and then what?
<promag> well this is not relative to ubuntu packaging
<promag> because the it's a software I'm making
<promag> anyway
<geser> theseinfeld: try getting the package revued and a FF exception in parallel.
<promag> my project is using autotools
<promag> after tar zxvf I do dh_make --createorig -b
<theseinfeld> cdbs is basically a wrapper for debhelper
<promag> then I don't know what to do
<theseinfeld> geser how do you get the package reviewed?
<geser> theseinfeld: so you don't get dissappointed if you don't get an exception after putting much work into this package and people revuing know it will make it in (normally revuing slows down massively after FF).
<geser> theseinfeld: first wait till REVU is up again :)
<slomo> pochu, superm1: ok, configure in gst-plugins-bad cvs is adjusted to also work with gmyth 0.7, nevermind ;)
<promag> theseinfeld: so what's next dh_make?
<pochu> slomo: cool :)
<pochu> slomo, superm1: would be cool to get this in Debian too :)
<slomo> pochu: if gmyth is in debian i see no problem with adding it to gst-plugins-bad
<geser> norsetto, TheMuso, ScottK: First congrats for motu-release and second what's the process to get an FF exception to complete the ongoing ghc6 transition?
<slomo> pochu, superm1: it seems to be possible to get it into debian... it's only mythtv that had (has) problems
<pochu> slomo: that's great news
<ScottK> geser: Thanks.  How about finish by tomorrow?
<ScottK> geser: I'd suggest ask for a general FF exception and list the affected packages, but of course the team hasn't had a chance to meet and discuss process yet.
<geser> ScottK: till now I've synced the packages in the correct order so they build successfully
<geser> ScottK: I could request synced the remaining packages and clear the FTBFS later but this doesn't look clean to me
<ScottK> geser: I'd say file one bug with the exception request that also affects the relevant packages and then ask us to look it over.  I'm assuming we'll say yes, but ..
<ScottK> Agreed.
<ScottK> I was kidding about the finish by tomorrow.
<theseinfeld> promag why would you use cdbs if you just want to make dist?
<persia> Anyone feel like looking at last-minute merges?  There are currently 17 universe packages with a newer upstream version listed on merges.ubuntu.com that might benefit from attention.
<theseinfeld> geser how do I contact the motu-release team? launchpad?
<geser> ScottK: what's your opinion for the clamav-data package after FF: should I ask for a general FF exception for it, ask everytime for a new exception, ask for removal from hardy or ignore it?
<persia> DktrKranz: Do you have an opinion about aolserver?  I'm tempted to sync all the latest Debian updates and hope we can forget about it, but wouldn't mind your opinion on the matter.
<theseinfeld> geser qa.?
<ScottK> geser: Ask for a general exception.
<cody-somerville> Can someone please review http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=thunar-svn-plugin ?
<geser> ScottK: last question: should the bug be subscribed or assigned to motu-release?
<ScottK> geser: I think clamav-data we should take up until the final freeze.
<promag> theseinfeld: well I thought I would need to make dist because dh_make says "The directory name must be <package>-<version> for dh_make to work" in the original source directory
<persia> cody-somerville: That URL doesn't load for me.  Have you tried it recently?
<ScottK> geser: Last time it was subscribed.  I assume it'll be the same this time.
<cody-somerville> hrmph...
<geser> theseinfeld: file a bug and subscribe the motu-release team
<theseinfeld> ScottK geser so, I submit a bug to motu-release
<theseinfeld> geser ok
<ScottK> theseinfeld: Why?
<cody-somerville> persia: Revu is down the day before FF?
<theseinfeld> geser when does revu go up?
<theseinfeld> :D
<persia> cody-somerville: Last REVU day was 4th February, but this is a coincidental outage.
<promag> theseinfeld: for instance https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Howtos/CDBS explains how to setup the configuration/build files but doesn't mention the required steps t actually build the package
<geser> theseinfeld: it depends when the REVU admins fix it (I'm not a REVU admin)
<promag> or maybe just maybe I'm dumb
<persia> Anyone who can upload: please take a look at the sponsors queues.  There are 24 bugs in the UUS queue that look like package updates: it would be good to accept or reject these today, rather than pushing for Freeze Exceptions.
<promag> I would go for the second.. :) so please give me an hint
<theseinfeld> promag you just make the debian things ok, then use dpkg-buildpackage
<persia> geser: Even REVU Admins can't fix it: needs a local admin at the hosting site :(
<sistpoty|work> hi folks
<theseinfeld> promag use your Launchpad PPA to submit the source changes
<theseinfeld> like  dpkg-buildpackage -S -rfakeroot -sa
 * ScottK cheers the arrival of sistpoty|work.
<sistpoty|work> ScottK: thanks for sending the note... /me takes a look
<norsetto> hi geser
<geser> Hi norsetto
<promag> theseinfeld: it's a package for course work (we thought giving a package to the teacher would be cool)
<theseinfeld> geser persia ScottK how do I submit the bug to go to MOTU-revlease team?
<promag> theseinfeld: thank you!
<persia> theseinfeld: subscription
<promag> I'll try that
<theseinfeld> persia: so, Distribution: Ubuntu, Package: my package, where does it go the motu-release team :))?
<ScottK> theseinfeld: For a new package it'll need to have significant justification why it can't wait for Hardy +1
<tjaalton> sistpoty|work: argh, I found out that the nvidia-settings that the drivers ship write all sort of crap on the xorg.conf.. so, it might be worth it bring back the old version and patch the sources to do the right thing :/
<tjaalton> goes around comes around
<persia> theseinfeld: Do you not have a needs-packaging bug?  You'd need to follow the freeze-exception process and justify the need for your update in hardy.  If it were a compatible replacement, it would be easy.  As it isn't, the value is somewhat arguable.
<sistpoty|work> tjaalton: with my upload (which I guess is still in new), I only disabled the nvidia-settings binary, so I guess you could simply uncomment the binary package in debian/control and have it back
<persia> tjaalton: Also, I've now two different launchers without icons :(
<tjaalton> persia: two? how's that possible?
<tjaalton> persia: the icon thing will be fixed.. the drivers could just ship that and Suggest nvidia-settings..
<tjaalton> ..which would ship the desktop file
<theseinfeld> hmm
<persia> tjaalton: nvidia-settings.desktop + NVIDIA-Settings.desktop (and no, I haven't had nvidia-settings installed for a couple releases now, and neither is a local .desktop, or I'd have an icon)
<theseinfeld> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/184834
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 184834 in ubuntu "libdc1394 version 2.0.1 (new API version 2)" [Undecided,Fix committed]
<theseinfeld> persia: can you call this request for packaging?
<tjaalton> sistpoty|work: ok, I can fix that
<persia> tjaalton: The icon can be shipped from restricted, but not from universe.  nvidia-settings would need to be repromoted to use the icon (see nvidia's art licensing)
<sistpoty|work> tjaalton: excellent, thanks!
<tjaalton> persia: right, the drivers would ship it so it shouldn't be a problem
<persia> theseinfeld: I'm unable to parse the question.
<persia> tjaalton: I'm confused then.  I thought you were going back to the independent nvidia-settings.
<tjaalton> persia: the drivers should only ship the .png :)
<persia> tjaalton: Ahhhh...  I believe that's a violation of some part of debian policy about icons and menu items, but it has the vast benefit of being legal :)
<tjaalton> screw the policy then ;)
<theseinfeld> persia, the question was if 184834 bug can be called as "request for packaging"
<persia> bug #184834
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 184834 in ubuntu "libdc1394 version 2.0.1 (new API version 2)" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/184834
<TheMuso> persia: What does that break?
<persia> theseinfeld: Well, it's certainly not fix committed, or we wouldn't be having the conversation.  Aside from that, you could either tag it "upgrade" in which case it should replace the existing library, or tag it "needs-packaging" in which case it would be a new package (with a correspondingly higher barrier to entry)
<persia> TheMuso: Something about menu policy.  I forget exactly, and am too tired to hunt google well (too many leftovers for feature freeze, and no mdt all weekend)
<TheMuso> persia: Oh I meant API wise. Never mind, unfortunately my hands are rather full atm.
<theseinfeld> persia god dammit is both :)
<persia> TheMuso: Wait, are you talking about lib1394 or nvidia-settings?
<sistpoty|work> persia, TheMuso: imo it doesn't break anything (for a desktop-file). Menu policy iirc has the requirement of a xpm icon (which we don't really need to care about in Ubuntu, if we've got a desktop file)
<persia> theseinfeld: Either you want to replace the existing library, or you want to create a new package.  Both is not usefully feasible.
<theseinfeld> persia i changed the status in progress
<theseinfeld> I'll go with the new package
<TheMuso> persia: No that bug you referred to above, it said it had a new API or some such.
<theseinfeld> as it should be new from now
<persia> TheMuso: No idea.
<persia> theseinfeld: TheMuso may be well qualified to have an opinion.  Please explain.
<theseinfeld> TheMuso, basically it is libdc1394 with a new API. The old one can work in parallel with the new one, as there are some packages depending on it, until we get people to move to the new one
<\sh> scottK: libfile-flock-perl is updated: http://buildserver.homelinux.net/src/libfile-flock-perl/
 * ScottK looks
<TheMuso> theseinfeld: What packages does it break?
<theseinfeld> TheMuso so we have libdc1394-13 and now libdc1394-22
<\sh> scottK: thx
<TheMuso> theseinfeld: Whats the source package name?
<theseinfeld> TheMuso, don't remember exactly, but ones that have to deal with Firewire camera - like Coriander, libav, etc.
<theseinfeld> TheMuso the old one is libdc1394...wait
<theseinfeld> let me check
<jdstrand> ScottK: clamav is still stuck on dapper (I ask someone about it again)
<theseinfeld> old one: Source: libdc1394 TheMuso
<TheMuso> theseinfeld: And the new one?
<theseinfeld> the new one is libdc1394-22 after a long discussion with Debian guys and agreeing on this convention TheMuso
<theseinfeld> TheMuso you can get the new package from the ppa (https://launchpad.net/~libdc1394-dev/+archive)
<ScottK> jdstrand: Thanks.
<TheMuso> theseinfeld: I don't have an opinion either way.
<theseinfeld> TheMuso, I have to go to a meeting now :( sorry... I will get back
<theseinfeld> TheMuso, I should be back in 1-1
<slytherin> Now that lucene2 builds with icedtea, should I log a bug for moving it to universe?
<persia> slytherin: Please do so.
<slytherin> persia: Have you finished your review work on netbeans6?
<persia> slytherin: We decided to just have "netbeans", and not bother with all the silly version-in-name hassles.  It's in source NEW now (http://launchpadlibrarian.net/11904872/netbeans_6.0.1-0ubuntu1.dsc)
<slytherin> persia: Cool. :-)
<persia> Once it gets accepted, I'll be filing a removal request for the netbeans5.5 multiverse package.
<persia> I haven't looked recently, but I think lucene is one of the last pieces that would keep netbeans in multiverse, so I'd be happy to see it move to universe.
<\sh> guys, what to do with this bug http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=428760 when the package is not found in debian until today?
<ubotu> Debian bug 428760 in wnpp "ITP: zend-framework -- High quality framework for Web Development" [Wishlist,Open]
<persia> \sh: You could file a sync request, but you may well need a freeze exception.  How badly do you want it?
<\sh> persia, the package is not even packaged by this guy
<\sh> persia, and it's still 13th ;)
<\sh> persia, and I have it finished right now :) wanted to upload this to ubuntu
<persia> \sh: Not everywhere.
<slytherin> persia: done, bug 191536
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 191536 in lucene2 "Please move package to universe" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/191536
<persia> \sh: Then upload it.
<\sh> persia, well, all timezones I think that means 13th 23:59:59 UTC and yeah, it's badly needed :)
<persia> \sh: No, all timezones means UTC+14 through UTC-11.
<\sh> yack...
<\sh> I think I need to add an lintian.override for this?
<\sh> W: zend-framework: executable-not-elf-or-script ./usr/share/php/zend-framework/library/Zend/View/Helper/FormCheckbox.php
<bddebian> Heya gang
<geser> Hi bddebian
<bddebian> Hi geser
<persia> bddebian: I've been trying to keep up, but I don't have changelogs handy for any of etw, qonk, or dd2.  I don't suppose you'd be up for filing some more sync requests...
<sistpoty|work> hi bddebian
<geser> \sh: why is this file executable at all?
<bddebian> Hi persia, sistpoty|work
<bddebian> persia: Sure
<sistpoty|work> REVU is back online
<persia> bddebian: Thanks :)  Also, the mdt I was using last night for my catch-up run didn't show NEW packages.  If you know of anything recently uploaded that isn't in Ubuntu yet, syncing those might be good as well.
<bddebian> persia: Games wise, or in general?  I've been doing a "few" QA uploads and NMUs these days ;-)
<persia> bddebian: Yes.
<slytherin> man-di: Just FYI ... I have fixed w3c-dtd-xhtml and lucene2 build in Ubuntu. I believe all the changes except icedtea build dependency are suitable for adoption in Debian.
<persia> bddebian: Actually, only "New Feature", "New Upstream", and "New Package" stop tomorrow.  Most of the QA stuff can be pulled a little later.
<persia> I just saw your name on three .changes in my mail queue today, and you appeared before I got around to digging up the changelogs to request syncs.
<geser> has somebody what to do with ingimp? it has currently unmetdeps and a sync could fix it but I found now Debian bug #432765. ingimp includes a whole copy of gimp :(
<ubotu> Debian bug 432765 in ingimp "ingimp: Cannot be included in Lenny" [Serious,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/432765
<bddebian> Ugh, that's hideous
<persia> Erm.  Hacksaw patch time?
<bddebian> persia: OK.  Well I hope to have a new upstream of lordsawar today ;-)
<man-di> slytherin: in debian it builds fine also
<jdstrand> ScottK: something goofy is happening on the security buildd, so I just pushed out clamav for feisty and gutsy since they were done
<jdstrand> it'll hit the mirrors in a couple hours
<sistpoty|work> jdstrand: out of interest, do the security buildds have the new kernel installed, but not yet rebooted? (s.th. goofy happened to sparky under that situation, but it might as well be a hw failure)
<sistpoty|work> (as in kernel w. the vm_splice thingy)
 * persia cheers bddebian's ceaseless energy and massive improvements to the distribution
<slytherin> man-di: Yes, they have disabled the unit tests that was causing problem. :-)
<tbutter> anyone would like to give http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=jodviewer a review?
<promag> theseinfeld: great it works!
<bddebian> persia: Heh, thanks but I've felt soo disconnected from Ubuntu lately :-(
<persia> bddebian: You've been doing wonderful things.  That others have been playing "chase the merge" to keep up only indicates how much :)
<vemon> persia, hi! i uploaded yet a new version of whysynth
<vemon> persia, it's modified according to sistpoty's comments about the licensing
<vemon> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=whysynth
<persia> vemon: Excellent.  I'm not going to have time to look at it again before feature-freeze, but maybe you can find some other advocates?
<vemon> i'd be grateful if other motu's would care to take alook at it also
<jdstrand> sistpoty|work: not goofy in the sense you are thinking.  it seems it isn't handling updated translations introduced in the dapper clamav update quite right
<sistpoty|work> jdstrand: ah, thanks.. then sparky must have been bitten by a HW failure ;)
<persia> sistpoty|work: I'm also curious why adjusting an orig.tar.gz as directed by upstream with a get-orig-source rule is considered inappropriate.  I would have thought that putting the relevant documentation for the repack in README.Debian-source was sufficient.
<sistpoty|work> persia: because you cannot change licensing as maintainer, or at least shouldn't do this under any circumstances.
<persia> sistpoty|work: Even when upstream specifically instructs you to do so, and provides a patch?  Hmm.  OK.
<sistpoty|work> persia: then upstream could easily produce a new release
<persia> sistpoty|work: I'd agree with that, but upstream didn't feel like it.
 * persia points at http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/revu1-incoming/whysynth-0802122140/whysynth-20070418/debian/README.Debian-source
<bddebian> persia: Do you happen to know if stormbaancoureur already got synced?
<persia> bddebian: Yep.  Just pushed it last night.
<bddebian> Ah excellent, thanks
<geser> bddebian: Published in hardy-release 1 hour ago
<bddebian> Damn you guys are goood :-)
<persia> bddebian: You can see my sync list from the top of https://launchpad.net/~persia/+packages.  Please hit anything I missed :)
<persia> Also, did you ever find a good solution for newpki-client?  That didn't seem to be an available sync candidate, and still needs a rebuild or a drop.
<bddebian> persia: I have a patch on BTS and the maintainer mailed me saying he couldn't apply it but I told him it was probably a cr/lf issue and I never heard back from him :-(
<persia> bddebian: OK.  I suspect we can get a FF exception to remove cruft, so I'll chase that next week.  Thanks.
<persia> jdong: Have you looked at the new Debian azureus?  Should it be updated?
<persia> Anybody use wifi-radar, and want to look at the new upstream in Debian?
<rexbron> persia, the only thing I can think of is that we would need to transition the libraries for anything that depends on libopenexr
<persia> rexbron: That might be a big transition.  Have you investigated it, and done test builds with the rdepends?
<rexbron> persia, not as of yet
<persia> rexbron: That ought be a first step before considering an update of a library at this point.  If you can test everything in the next few hours, it might be worth looking at a sync.  Otherwise, it might not be appropriate for hardy inclusion.
<rexbron> persia, hmm.... kdelibs depends on openexr
<persia> That makes it even more unlikely.  Sounds like a hardy+1 feature.
<jdong> persia: it can't be updated, swt-gtk 3.3 is needed, which we pull from eclipse (>= 3.3) while Debian pulls from a separate swt-gtk package
<persia> jdong: Ah.  As long as you've looked, I'll drop it from my list :)
<jdong> ok :)
<jdong> I mean, I'd LOVE to have Azureus updated, but Eclipse 3.3 just isn't happening
 * persia declares grab-merge to be pointlessly slow and goes back to the nice fast manual process.
<LucidFox> jdong, could you please re-advocate tovid?
<slytherin> is anyone getting crashes in javaws binaries from Sun JDK? I am getting this error - java: xcb_xlib.c:82: xcb_xlib_unlock: Assertion `c->xlib.lock' failed.
<dcordero> hi
<persia> slytherin: That's a known bug in Sun Java.
<persia> There is an environment variable that is supposed to help, and there is a sed script which when run against the binaries is supposed to help.
<slytherin> persia: any links?
<slytherin> I am unable to launch any JNLP based applications
<persia> slytherin: bug #87947
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 87947 in libx11 "xcb_xlib.c:50: xcb_xlib_unlock: Assertion `c->xlib.lock' failed." [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/87947
<slytherin> persia: thanks. I am using the environment variable workaround.
<jdong> LucidFox: looking
<nixternal> mornin'
<frafu> Hello, mousetweaks for the hppa architecture is given as pending in the hardy heron build: https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/hardy/+builds?build_text=mousetweaks&build_state=all  Does that mean that it is waiting to be built?
<nixternal> frafu: that's correct
<geser> frafu: yes, it's in the build queue and waiting for it's turn
<geser> hi nixternal
<nixternal> howdy geser
<jdong> LucidFox: tovid advocated
<LucidFox> Thanks!
<jdong> :)
<jdong> go tovid :D
<jdong> LucidFox: have you told upstream about it yet? They'd be quite happy
<jdong> they came here two release cycles or so ago wondering how to package for Ubuntu
<LucidFox> Ah.
<LucidFox> Okay, I'll tell upstream.
<LucidFox> As well as suggest to them some of my patches.
<rexbron> hey, I have subscribed u-u-s to a bugreport with a debdiff attached, is there anything more to do? bug 191546
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 191546 in ilmbase "libilmbase-dev should conflict with libopenexr-dev (<< 1.6.1)" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/191546
<frafu> And what does "Build for superseded Source" mean? That night a more recent version is also in the build queue?
<frafu> s/night/
<jdong> frafu: correct
<geser> rexbron: why did you change the standards-version and why didn't you mention it in the changelog?
<frafu> Thanks to all for the confirmations
<jdong> lifeless: poke; why isn't bzr 1.1 in Hardy?
<rexbron> geser, sorry, forgot to mention that. I did it as the debian maintainer had added Homepage: and Vcs-Bzr: which iirc were introduced in 7.2.3
<rexbron> (or have I got the verson numbers wrong?)
<rexbron> 3.7.3 rather
<geser> rexbron: the debdiff has it right, could you a comment that you changed it any why to the changelog (the reason will be helpful to understand the change in the next merge)?
<rexbron> geser, sure
<rexbron> geser, fixed
<bddebian> persia: OK, sync requests in for etw, qonk, and dd2.  I'll do another lordsawar one shortly
<persia> bddebian: Excellent.  Thanks.
<\sh> guys, does anyone know a tool (not ooffice impress) which could convert powerpoint files into flv/swf? (good if this doesn't need wine and it should run on the cli)
<\sh> scottK: still not sleeping? :)
<jdong> \sh: why, out of curiousity, not ooimpress?
<\sh> jdong, because I don't want to have a Xnest or Xlibs at all on a server
<jdong> \sh: ah, ok :)
<jdong> \sh: so you're trying to make a clone of http://www.fileformat.info/convert/doc/ppt2swf.htm
<rexbron> Ok, updated the debdiff on ilmbase. bug 191546
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 191546 in ilmbase "libilmbase-dev should conflict with libopenexr-dev (<< 1.6.1)" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/191546
<\sh> jdong, and because ooimpress converts the ppt to swf with keystrokes..so nothing for having it in a video presentation
<jdong> \sh: maybe take a closer look at http://www.artofsolving.com/opensource/jodconverter?
<jdong> though I have a feeling it's using the Java API for OOo
<jdong> and hence useless
<\sh> well...nothing really useful I think...
<\sh> the other alternative is to present a customer with a commercial plugin for powerpoint...
<persia> so...  the sponsors queue has a bunch of stuff that needs to get accepted or rejected before feature-freeze.  Please take a look at http://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-universe-sponsors/+bugs
<asantoni> :)
 * jpatrick wishs he had more time
<CarlFK> shouldn't there be a libusb meta package that points to the current version of  http://packages.ubuntu.com/hardy/libs/libusb-0.1-4
<mruiz> morning all
<tbutter> \sh: keynote on the mac
<tbutter> \sh: or use a java applet to present an odp ;)
<mruiz> \sh, lintian & linda without errors ... thanks ;-)
<\sh> tbutter, nothing really useful for webtv ;)
<\sh> mruiz, :)
<tbutter> does webtv support MHP?
<rexbron> CarlFK, it would be better to do it via a Provides: field in debian/controls
<_MMA_> siretart: PM when you are around.
<CarlFK> rexbron: should I put that in a launchpad ticket?
<rexbron> CarlFK, filing bugs is always a good way of keeping track of problems
<\sh> sistpoty|work, i found a bug in revu , while recovering passwords ;)
<sistpoty|work> \sh: what's the problem?
<\sh> sistpoty|work, the recover source doesn't use the main key, but the signature key, which is wrong ;)
<\sh> s/signature key/subkey for signing/
<\sh> gpg: encrypted with 1024-bit RSA key, ID E4967E90, created 2007-10-14
<\sh>       "Stephan Hermann <sh@sourcecode.de>"
<sistpoty|work> \sh: ugh... never touched that one yet... can you file a bug please?
<\sh> sistpoty|work, which is my subkey for signing
<\sh> sistpoty|work, yepp
<sistpoty|work> thanks!
<vemon> sistypoty|work, could it be possible for you to re-ckec whysynth with the new debian/copyright?
<vemon> i modified the package according to your comments
<vemon> re-check
<sistpoty|work> vemon: sorry, not from work (though the copyright file looks great now, thanks!)
<\sh> sistpoty|work, oh well...
<\sh> pub  1024D/C098EFA8  created: 2005-03-20  expires: never       usage: SC
<\sh>                      trust: ultimate      validity: ultimate
<\sh> sub  1024g/31A7EF3B  created: 2005-03-20  expires: never       usage: E
<\sh> sub  1024R/5D12B6BA  created: 2007-10-14  expires: never       usage: S
<\sh> sub  1024R/E4967E90  created: 2007-10-14  expires: never       usage: E
<theseinfeld> promag glad to help
<promag> theseinfeld: thanks! do know a good place to learn more? for newbies like me...
<promag> theseinfeld: also, it's normal to add debian/* to EXTRA_DIST?
<promag> or atleast some of them?
<theseinfeld> promag don't add that to EXTRA_DIST
<promag> don't add at all?
<\sh> sistpoty|work, it's not actually wrong...
<sistpoty|work> \sh: heh, actually I wouldn't also know which of the two elgamal keys should get selected then
<promag> theseinfeld: so I always need to update the debian/* files?
<dendrobates> anyone that would like to take a look at likewise-open it is in my ppa https://launchpad.net/~dendrobates/+archive
<dendrobates> You need an AD server for it ot be of any use, of course.
<dendrobates> It's also currently in the queue waiting for an AA to approve it.
<\sh> sistpoty|work, the problem is just that, that working on remote, having the smartcard reader here at my company...is worse for decrypting then :)
<\sh> zend-framework uploaded...
<\sh> send mail to this debian guy
<theseinfeld> promag debian folder is for packaging, the rest of the project is another thing
<sistpoty|work> \sh: seems like you've got a typo on your from field in the mail
<theseinfeld> if you do the packaging, you add the debian thing
<theseinfeld> if you do the real code, you use autotools promag
<theseinfeld> quite straight forward
<\sh> sistpoty|work, yes ;)
<\sh> sistpoty|work, I saw that now too :(
<sistpoty|work> \sh: sure... but I don't really see a solution to that problem... however I'm absolutely no gpg expert :(
 * \sh is old, can't even write his own name
<sistpoty|work> heh
<theseinfeld> TheMuso, me is back :)
<promag> theseinfeld: so cdbs will determine dependencies, changelog, etc etc from autotools project files?
<TheMuso> theseinfeld: Well I'm about to go to bed I'm sorry.
<theseinfeld> TheMuso see you tomorrow...
<theseinfeld> promag no
<theseinfeld> promag debian folder contains the way you do the packaging that include the cdbs scripts that are aiding you in making clearer debhelper calls
<theseinfeld> promag and you don't need to use debian to install the thing
<promag> theseinfeld: but I want to provide a package, not the source for other to build it
<promag> theseinfeld: I don't want to provide a source package
<theseinfeld> promag, then you just build the packages with dpkg-buildpackage and give them the binaries
<theseinfeld> so, you don't need to do make dist in source
<theseinfeld> you just add the debian folder with the proper files
<theseinfeld> you need dh-make lintian linda pbuilder cdbs devscripts ubuntu-dev-tools, promag
<promag> and these files can be versioned with svn?
<theseinfeld> promag you can use pbuilder
<theseinfeld> promag have to go now
<theseinfeld> promag cheers
<durapraxis> Hi, everyone. Can anyone point me on a clear howto for signing a package of my own to put on an internal repository and have other machines doing apt-get from it without having authentication warnings (i.e. doing the authentication correctly)
<sistpoty|work> durapraxis: not too sure... maybe the docs of mini-dinstall might contain a howto
<dholbach> congratulations LucidFox :-)
<LucidFox> dholbach> heh, thanks!
<dendrobates> dholbach: I would be honored if you would take a look at likewise-open.  Soren, mathiaz and zul have already looked at it, but it is a hairy package, so the more eyes the better.
<dendrobates> dholbach: https://launchpad.net/~dendrobates/+archive
<dholbach> dendrobates: I'm a bit busy right now, I'll add it to my TODO list but wouldn't mind if somebody else checked it out in the meantime
<dholbach> LucidFox: welcome - you're member of the team now :)
<LucidFox> Sweet!
<mruiz> congrats LucidFox !
<LucidFox> May I join u-u-s right away, or do I need a separate approval for that?
<persia> LucidFox: You need a second approval, but it's typically easily granted.
<dholbach> I'm very happy with that
<nixternal> LucidFox: congrats! sorry I didn't respond sooner, but I was totally used to only responding if I was included :)  getting used to the new job still :)
<mruiz> hi DktrKranz ... I uploaded a new revision ;-) . Thanks for your comments
<DktrKranz> mruiz: nice!
<DktrKranz> mruiz: it should be ok, now
<mruiz> DktrKranz, I hope so ...
<\sh> bah
<\sh> mssql db backup is fcking broken
<soren> \sh: I'm shocked!
<\sh> soren, just for the record...I'm switching to ubuntu, and I need the data from old mssqls :(
<soren> \sh: Oh.
<\sh> soren, again thx for the dpkg upload :)
<soren> No worries :)
<homer> is there any way to sense a user's locale?
<homer> eg en-US
<geser> homer: what are you trying to do?
<homer> I need to know a user's locale in order to download locale specific files from the net
<persia> homer: Often you can collect it from the user's environment variables.
<geser> homer: see the locale output
<homer> awesome, thanks
<LucidFox> Hmm. I recently filed a sync request for subtitleeditor, after which it FTBFS, despite building successfully in Hardy PPA
<geser> homer: pick the correct env variable you need
<slytherin> LucidFox: What is build error?
<LucidFox> oh, wait... the build process seems to have been rerun, and now it did build
<persia> LucidFox: The PPAs don't quite match the production archives, although they are very, very close.
<geser> LucidFox: that happens sometime when hardy changes between filing the sync request and the sync itself
<LucidFox> the original error was something like: dpkg-gencontrol: cannot parse '-'
<LucidFox> but as I mentioned, now it's been resolved
<geser> LucidFox: transient error in dpkg breaking pkg-create-dbgsym, already fixed
<persia> LucidFox: That might have been timing: there was a dpkg oddity recently.
<homer>  locale | grep LANG= | sed s/^LANG=//g | sed s/.UTF-8$//g
<geser> LucidFox: and subtitleeditor build successfully now
<slytherin> I was just wondering that when new release of gstreamer0.10-plugins-bad comes out will it need FFE. It will contain the VCD plugin which was not ported until now to GST 0.10
<homer> that works :)
<LucidFox> yes, it did
<persia> slytherin: Any new upstream requires FFE.
<persia> superm1: I'm reminded: did you have any luck getting gst-plugins-bad to build the wildmidi plugin, or should I be chasing that if I want it?
<LucidFox> just performed my first sponsor upload, by the way
<geser> homer: echo ${LANG%.UTF-8} is shorter
<homer> damn I got rid of one of my sed's and you go and get rid of the whole statement :o
<homer> thanks geser
<geser> homer: another hint: some people might still be using something like de_DE.ISO-8859-15
<homer> true
<homer> I am no good at regular expressions though, I am trying to figure out which one will match anything after the period
<slytherin> Is anyone interested in bringing thoggen latest version in Ubuntu real fast? If so then I will file a needs-packaging bug. Else I will wait for Debian to package it and file a FFE
<jdong> slytherin: real fast as in within 15 hours? :D
<Kano> hi, could somebody update em8300 package? current version from sid will do
<jdong> is there a sync request on launchpad yet?
<Kano> only .4 compiles with 2.6.24, so .3 is useless
<persia> Kano, it needs a sync request with the updated changelog from Debian and a bit of testing.  Unfortunately, my card is not in my current workstation, so I couldn't do the second part.  Would you mind filing the bug?
<Kano> persia: please test it yourself.i do not own the card myself anymore.
<sistpoty|work> slomo: did you have a chance to look at the sync request for boo yet (bug #191394)?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 191394 in boo "please sync boo (0.8.0.2730-5) from unstable to universe" [Wishlist,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/191394
<persia> Kano: I won't have time before the new upstream deadline :(
<homer> geser, hah! found one that works :)  echo ${LANG%%.*}
<Kano> persia: update it now before you forget it...
<persia> Anyone have an em8300 card to test the new upstream?  The current version is apparently useless for us.
<slomo> sistpoty|work: let's get it ;)
<sistpoty|work> slomo: :)
<sistpoty|work> slomo: can you subscribe ubuntu-archive and set it to confirmed (don't have credentials here right now... otherwise I'll do it once I'm home)
<jdong> persia: if it's useless then I dont think much testing is required other than install the module doesn't explode your computer
<slomo> sistpoty|work: already done
<persia> pochu: You beat me by seconds: remember to unsubscribe UUS before the ACK to avoid collisions :)
<sistpoty|work> slomo: thanks!
<pochu> persia: ah, I'm the fastest! ;-)
 * pochu wins
<Kano> persia: i tested that it compiles fine
<jdong> pochu: you know, from my personal experience, that's not ALWAYS a good thing ;-)
<jdong> (kidding)
<persia> jdong: Sure, but if .4 doesn't work with our kernel, it's better to fix it and get an FFe later, rather than doing a sync now and forgetting about it.  That's why I won't sync untested.  Maybe you have different guidelines?
<jdong> persia: I thought it would be easier to get fixes to .4 to make it work after FFe than to realize we need .4 after the fact and go through a FFe
<persia> jdong: I've never had an issue with an FFe that would otherwise qualify for a UVF.  Feel free to sync if you like :)
<jdong> persia: haha with that said I'm scared to be on the blame trail ;-)
<persia> !jdong
<ubotu> <Hobbsee> jdong: yes, but you're FULL OF CRACK!
<persia> See, no change involved :)
<Kano> ntfs-3g is still outdated btw..
<Kano> even sid has the new version
<pochu> woha 5/5 in the MC call
 * pochu hugs *his* MC ;)
<\sh> siretart, ping mplayer...would you kill me if I say, that mplayer-skins should be moved from Depends to Suggests?
<\sh> siretart, just because on a server, you can use mplayer to generate small thumbnails from videos and you don't need mplayer-skins at all ;)
<DktrKranz> mruiz: mnemosyne is on its way to the archives :)
<mruiz> thanks DktrKranz ... I learned many things during your sponsoring :-)
<DktrKranz> mruiz: now it's time to learn quilt, then!
<mruiz> DktrKranz, I'll do
 * DktrKranz used to hate quilt, but he quicly changed his mind when he really used it
<persia> quilt is very powerful, but awkwardly documented
<nixternal> very awkwardly I might add
 * bddebian thirds that
<DktrKranz> persia: that's why I like it, you have to fight against it, and when you win, you rule the world! :)
<nixternal> we are using it for the kde 4 apps, and it tends to confuse the hell out of me at times, causing me to go old school on it :)
<nixternal> hahaha, I guess I just give up easily on it...god I am a loser :p
<DktrKranz> nixternal: I always forget to export QUILT_PATCHES=debian/patches, *always*
<nixternal> I believe we have that set in our cdbs file we use for kde4 apps, so I get lucky there :)
<DktrKranz> rexbron: oh, you beat me!
<DktrKranz> rexbron: erm... sorry.
<rexbron> DktrKranz, :P
<DktrKranz> nixternal: it was you to beat me :)
<DktrKranz> rexbron: the real issue was related to bug 191546, does it happens during gutsy -> hardy upgrade?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 191546 in ilmbase "libilmbase-dev should conflict with libopenexr-dev (<< 1.6.1)" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/191546
 * persia likes seeing race conditions in sponsoring, and encourages more.  First person to get 50 sponsored bugs between now and FeatureFreeze wins.
<DktrKranz> persia: do SRUs count?
<persia> DktrKranz: If they are sponsored :)
<rexbron> DktrKranz, That will fix a potential upgrade breakage when we transition to openEXR 1.6.1. It is too late in the cycle to make such a disruptive change.
<Kano> persia: did you add em8300-headers to mplayer to use it with it?
<rhpot1991_laptop> is revu still broken?
<persia> Kano: Nope.  I'm not an mplayer person.
<Kano> persia: without it is hard to test em8300...
<sistpoty|work> rhpot1991_laptop: no, it's broken *again*... (and my guess is that sparky's hardware starts to die of age :/)
<persia> Kano: Depends on how you use the card...  Anyway, it's not in my current workstation, and I'm doing other things.  Better to ask someone else.
<rhpot1991_laptop> sistpoty|work: what do I do about getting my changes up there and reviewed then, just wait?
<slytherin> jdong: yes, by 'real fast' I meant before FF. :-D
<Kano> well: minimally update the package
<DktrKranz> rexbron: potential? Do you mean Hardy is not affected at the moment, but Hardy + 1 will?
<rhpot1991_laptop> sistpoty|work: it starting failing while I was uploading a change last night and I haven't seen it back since
<Kano> nobody can even try to use it that way
<sistpoty|work> rhpot1991_laptop: I'll walk down to the server room in a few minutes and reboot that thing... So I guess you just cross fingers that it will stay up alive longer then ;)
<rhpot1991_laptop> heh, ok
<rhpot1991_laptop> thanks :)
<rexbron> DktrKranz, it affects hardy but only if one tries to install libilmbase-dev . What has happened with openEXR is the latest upstream source has moved from one tarball to several tarballs
<rexbron> ilmbase has been synced from debian unstable, but only the new openEXR needs it. openEXR 1.6.1 has not been synced from debian experimental for the reason above
<slytherin> jdong: FYI ... It was updated in Debian by slomo, so you will have to wait only few hours. :-)
<geser> persia: I've updated http://members.ping.de/~mb/universe-versionslist.html in case you want to overflow the archive-admin queue :)
<persia> Could someone else please look at the drupal5 merge?  I'm not sure I understand the new upstream well enough to be sure if we still want those changes.  (emgent)
<persia> geser: I'm planning to sleep tonight.  I'm chasing a few more merges, but I'm not sure how much more I'll get done.
<jdong> slytherin: what luck :)
<DktrKranz> rexbron: I see now. My main doubt is if a universe package can Conflict/Replace a main one
<persia> geser: I don't suppose you could populate http://members.ping.de/~mb/universe-versionslist.html#notinB: that's probably one of the more interesting targets.
<emgent> persia, ok just a moment :)
 * persia encourages people to check http://members.ping.de/~mb/universe-versionslist.html#outdatedinB and review anything that has a new upstream.
<geser> persia: I'll try
<persia> geser: Thanks.
<persia> emgent: Great!
<geser> persia: how much night it left for you before the morning comes?
<rexbron> DktrKranz, I don't see why not. As it stands right now, it is broken. You must uninstall libopenexr-dev before you can install libilmbase-dev
<persia> geser: My alarm goes off in 4 hours, and I skipped last night.  I'm not around much longer.
<geser> ouch
<emgent> debian #464876
<ubotu> Debian bug 464876 in drupal5 "drupal5: New upstream version 5.7 available, fixes several bugs" [Normal,Fixed] http://bugs.debian.org/464876
<persia> If you get a solution, I'll see it in backscroll, and submit inclusion requests.  If you get a solution and want to file inclusion requests for useful things not previously removed from Ubuntu, that'd be even better.
<persia> emgent: Exactly.  We want that, but it needs to get merged in the next few hours.
<emgent> persia, for me in hardy we can sync
 * slytherin suggests geser to add persia's location in the new shiny clock applet to track his time zone. :-)
<persia> emgent: If you're sure, please file the sync request (it's your merge).
<emgent> wait i'm re-see debian patch :)
<persia> emgent: If it's not a clean sync, please file the merge bug and subscribe the sponsors.  There are extra sponsors helping to get new upstreams in right now.
<emgent> persia, sure thanks
<soren> persia: The kvm bits of https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/qemu/+bug/156085 are assigned to you... Not sure how to interpret that.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 156085 in qemu "Could not open /proc/bus/usb/devices" [Low,Confirmed]
<Kano> well isomaster should be updated too
<Kano> iceape
<persia> soren: Note that the bits assigned to me a supposedly "Fix Released".  That's the result of me sponsoring TJ's work so that you can ask me about it rather than hunting TJ.
<persia> soren: If I remember correctly, https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/qemu/+bug/156085/comments/10 was the debdiff I uploaded (which apparently didn't fix it hard enough).
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 156085 in qemu "Could not open /proc/bus/usb/devices" [Low,Confirmed]
<persia> Err.  https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/qemu/+bug/156085/comments/8 rather (same patch, different package).
<soren> persia: Ok. Thanks.
<persia> soren: From you asking, I'm assuming it shouldn't be "Fix Released"?
<soren> persia: Right.
<sistpoty|work> rhpot1991_laptop: revu is back
 * persia updates, and unassigns to reflect reality
<soren> persia: Lovely. Thanks.
<rhpot1991_laptop> thanks sistpoty|work
<sistpoty|work> sorry for the inconvenience
<persia> soren: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/hardy/+source/kvm/+bug/156085 is open for your assault :)
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 156085 in qemu "Could not open /proc/bus/usb/devices" [Low,Confirmed]
<soren> "Yay"
<pochu> Does anyone know of a good application to screencast your own desktop?
<mgunes> hi all, anyone know why freeloader was removed from Hardy? the changelog and Soyuz page do not indicate any reason, and I can't find a relevant bug to the removal.
<\sh> pochu: ask MacSlow (Mirko Mueller)
<pochu> istanbul - Desktop session recorder producing Ogg Theora video
<pochu> \sh: that looks good, will try it :)
<pochu> mgunes: maybe it was removed from Debian?
<\sh> pochu: hmm...:)
<pochu> \sh: I was using deskscribe and when I finished I realized it just recorded the mouse movements o.O
<pochu> \sh: well I think it did that. I'm not sure as when I tried ot open the log (4kB) it crashed :P
<mgunes> pochu, it wasn't in the list of orphaned packages but indeed seems gone from Sid, with no indication why
<mruiz> hey LucidFox ... I have uploaded the diff.gz to the bug 186397. I attached the interdiff only
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 186397 in gpredict "Please add Gpredict 0.9 to Hardy" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/186397
<LucidFox> mruiz> I've already reconstructed it from the interdiff :)
<mruiz> LucidFox, thanks for review it
<LucidFox> mruiz> the orig.tar.gz doesn't need repackaging, I assume? (It was better to include get-orig-source even if it doesn't)
<mruiz> LucidFox, I'm not familiar with get-orig-source
<sistpoty|work> mgunes: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=454907
<ubotu> Debian bug 454907 in ftp.debian.org "RM: freeloader -- ROM; obsolete; abandoned upstream; few users" [Normal,Open]
<mgunes> sistpoty|work, just found it, thanks.
<LucidFox> Could a REVU admin please archive tovid, or give me REVU access so I can archive it myself? :)
 * persia hopes someone will look at the libaudio-flac-header-perl merge.  The new upstream fixes a lot of bugs, but it needs re-insertion of the conflicts/provides/replaces stuff to handle upgrades from Dapper.
<persia> LucidFox: Granting you reviewer rights...
<persia> LucidFox: Try reloading the page
<LucidFox> Yes, I see the new buttons now, thanks. Archived.
<persia> Nobody wants libaudio-flac-header-perl?  Easy merge?
<mruiz> persia, I can do it :-)
<persia> mruiz: Great.  Just check to make sure you preserve the transition handling for Dapper, as it looks like a sync at first glance.
<persia> \sh: gfpoken baffles me, but I think Bas integrated equivalent changes.  When you have a moment, could you take a closer look, and maybe sync?
<jdong> ugh looks like I broke apt
<jdong> fortunately unofficially to a small user base
<jdong> so none of you guys have to sweat. just point and laugh at me
<persia> Anyone around know the piuparts codebase?  There's a huge patch for Ubuntu, and we're 9 releases behind, with what looks like good work by the Debian QA team.
<linux__alien> Hi LucidFox
<LucidFox> linux__alien> I've uploaded your avidemux debdiff, thanks for your work!
<linux__alien> is it great thanks :) and i should thank you for your help and co-operation and i am looking forward for more
<sistpoty|work> persia: Lars Wirzenius (liw?) should know
<linux__alien> LucidFox, i ve a doubt i read through today's motu mailing list and found that they used the word REVU
<linux__alien> whats that
<linux__alien> i found something like that what does that mean?
<LucidFox> !revu | linux__alien
<ubotu> linux__alien: REVU is a web-based tool to give people who have worked on Ubuntu packages a chance to "put their packages out there" for other people to look at and comment on in a structured manner. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU
<persia> sistpoty|work: Doesn't seem to be about, and I'm not sure it would merit FFe, but I'd like to see the newer one available for testing hardy archive stability later in the cycle.
<linux__alien> so when i create a new package i will have to upload it there is it?
<LucidFox> linux__alien> yes, REVU is a place where packages for software not currently in Ubuntu are uploaded for review
<paas> Hi Guys, I know everybody is terribly busy right now but I just need one more advocate http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=libtuxcap, thanks
<linux__alien> LucidFox, ok thanks so now is there any bug that i could work on ?
<linux__alien> i ve just started to try porting kchmviewer to Gnome :) and package it and give it to Ubuntu :)
<LucidFox> linux__alien> I don't have any for you at the moment, but you can look for them yourself
<LucidFox> linux__alien> it's too late for new packages, really
<LucidFox> we've almost hit feature freeze
<linux__alien> ya i understand but i can add it later even after the Hardy release
<linux__alien> right ?
<linux__alien> can it be done
<RainCT> Hi
<linux__alien> Hi RainCT
<rexbron> linux__alien: it can be, but you must file an upstream freeze exception
<linux__alien> rexbron, what does that mean ?
<rexbron> linux__alien: read the MOTU page on wiki.ubuntu.com
<persia> linux__alien: You can add them to the next release after hardy freeze is complete.
<linux__alien> ok
<linux__alien> and i want the bug list in Ubuntu where could i find it
<linux__alien> i mean the list where i can filter those are opened , closed etc
<persia> So, my last outstanding merge help request is for someone to look at crystalspace to see if we can pull from Debian.  Any volunteers?
<linux__alien> persia, i am ready
<linux__alien> persia, if someone can guide me i am ready to do it
<persia> Anyone want to help linux__alien for this?
<linux__alien> as you might know or might now i am new just fixed couple of bugs in Ubuntu :) with LucidFox 's help
<mruiz> persia, talking about libaudio-flac-header-perl, the main difference in debian/control is Conflicts and Provides fields. Debian version doesn't include them
<persia> mruiz: Right.  It would be a sync, except we might still need them for Dapper upgrades.  Your job is to investigate Dapper to see whether we need them, and either add them back, or request a sync.
<mruiz> persia: thanks
<linux__alien> persia, anything i could do for this ?
<jdong> quick poll: is bug 190461 considered a new feature requiring a FFe or not?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 190461 in clutch "Lighttpd support" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/190461
<persia> linux__alien: I'm too tired to help in detail.  Sorry.
<linux__alien> ok
<RainCT> LucidFox: congrats!
<linux__alien> fine
<linux__alien> congrats for ?
<LucidFox> for joining MOTU, presumably :)
<persia> RainCT: Any luck with the diff.gz -> .dsc script, or will it be a hardy+1 feature?
<slytherin> linux__alien: That will just need the adjustment to 'Depends' right?
<linux__alien> Oh Great LucidFox
<linux__alien> Congrats
<mruiz> persia, Dapper uses 1.4-1. 1.9-1  removed all control references (Provides, Conflicts, Replaces) to the old libaudio-flac-perl package, as that was not included in the last stable Debian release anymore. (from the changelog)
<emgent> one problem to merge drupal5
<emgent> http://rafb.net/p/VOFcC067.html
<linux__alien> slytherin, i am new to packaging so if someone could just guide me i could work on it
<emgent> patch dont work, and i dont work in this
<emgent> some idea?
<persia> emgent: Are you the wrong person?  My apologies, I thought you had the last upload.
<emgent> i should remove this and re-apply with systempatch?
<slytherin> linux__alien: wait, does clutch needs php?
<emgent> persia, yep, i was upload this, but in this merge there is a problem
<linux__alien> slytherin, i dont know whats clutch
<persia> emgent: OK.  It is your merge then.  If you can do it now, great (and ask for help).  If not, the variance gets larger, and you'll have a bigger job for hardy+1.
<slytherin> linux__alien: It is a web interface to transmission bittorrent client. I believe it needs php, at least the dependencies specify so. So I am not sure if you will be able to run with lighttpd
<persia> mruiz: I haven't investigated in detail.  Check the upgrade path.  Maybe they are requried, maybe it's a sync.
<RainCT> persia: (yesterday 18:41:54) RainCT: persia: I don't think I can be of much help with that (I never used many of those commands you listed), sorry :(
<emgent> ok persia i will apply with other metod thanks persia
<persia> RainCT: Sorry.  I missed that.  Thanks anyway.  I'll put something together for hardy+1 then (I'm not expecting many more new upstreams for hardy :) ).
<linux__alien> slytherin, ok thanks
<linux__alien> slytherin, can you help me on this ?
<linux__alien> on that packaging
<slytherin> linux__alien: It is trivial provided you verify clutch runs on lighttpd
<linux__alien> slytherin, oh i thought you were talking about crystalspace :)
<linux__alien> slytherin, i am sorry was out of context
<linux__alien> whats that i ve to do for this
<jdong> Does anyone know where bluekuja is?
<jdong> I haven't seen him for weeks and motu-p2p is kind of his thing
<LucidFox> mruiz> gpredict uploaded
<mruiz> thanks LucidFox :)
<persia> jdong: He's been on-and-off jabber (although I haven't chatted)
<linux__alien> LucidFox, i want the link to the bugs in Ubuntu
<linux__alien> LucidFox, so that i could look into whatever i can
<LucidFox> linux__alien> http://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu
<linux__alien> Oh Thanks
<emgent> persia, merge is ready, i go to open bug.
<LucidFox> the entire content of the orig.tar.gz for vips consists of a single tar.gz, what kind of borked upstream release is that? :/
<persia> emgent: Great.
<persia> LucidFox: tarball-in-tarball was popular for a while.
 * persia has completed personal FeatureFreeze preparation, and wishes others luck: please try to hit all the FF critical bugs in https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-universe-sponsors/+bugs , and review http://members.ping.de/~mb/universe-versionslist.html#outdatedinB for any new upstreams that have hardy-worthy features.
<emgent> done, subscribed u-u-s too.
<linux__alien> arent there any open bugs in Gutsy
<linux__alien> all bugs i see in LP are more for Feisty and the older releases?
<linux__alien> or am i looking at the wrong place /
<linux__alien> ?
<geser> linux__alien: where are you looking?
<tsmithe> hi, my alsa-firmware package was uploaded from revu just over a week ago. i have since received a rejection notice, as there were a couple of issues with copyright and distributability. i have now uploaded to revu a fixed version, and am consequently looking for a motu to sponsor it. presumably i only need one motu this time? the url is http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=alsa-firmware
<RainCT> apachelogger_: you might be interested in advocating http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=oxygen-cursor-theme
<geser> bddebian: stormbaancoureur has already the first bug :)
<linux__alien> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?start=225
<bddebian> geser: The endianness one?
<geser> linux__alien: it's due to the sorting, I usually use "newest first" to see new bugs at the top
<tsmithe> RainCT, geser, bddebian, can i pester you, wrt the above?
<geser> bddebian: bug #191620, I didn't check further
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 191620 in stormbaancoureur "stormbaancoureur segfaults" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/191620
<LucidFox> tsmithe> well, superm1 is here, you can ask him to readvocate him
<LucidFox> given how he was one of the original advocates
<tsmithe> ah yes, superm1, can you?
<linux__alien> LucidFox, there are lot of crash kind of bugs in the bug list which i cannot reproduce coz i dont have the same environment in these cases what do i do
<linux__alien> LucidFox, there are few bugs which i could work on or even try to reproduce coz i run Gutsy
<LucidFox> then don't touch them :)
<LucidFox> simple as that
<linux__alien> how do you people generally manage to simulate and fix bugs . Do you all run those many versions of Ubuntu in you comp or you have an other comp to be used as secondary for all these purposes ?
 * sistpoty|work heads home now
<sistpoty|work> cya
<durapraxis> Hi. Is there a possibility to have an apt repository password-protected e.g. via .htaccess? Can apt be configured to provide this type of authentication?
<pochu> dfiloni: FF is tomorrow, in case you want to get wx2.8.7 in ;)
<dfiloni> pochu: what?
<dfiloni> pochu: FF?
<pochu> dfiloni: Feature Freeze
<\sh> re
<tsmithe> (hence my hurry :p)
<dfiloni> pochu: oh damn, I think it's impossible to fix all wxwidgets2.8 bugs for tomorrow
<\sh> dear Ubuntu Release Team :) Do we get a blank UVF exception for wine? :)
<mruiz> persia, libaudio-flac-perl only exists on dapper, edgy and oldstable  in Debian. For me is a sync
<dfiloni> pochu: I had fix only a little number of bugs, however I will post it this night
<pochu> dfiloni: well you don't need to fix bugs for tomorrow, just get the new stuff. Bugs can be fixed in the next month ;)
<ScottK> Dear \sh: One has to ask first.
<ScottK> ;-)
<dfiloni> pochu: yes, I know, for this reason I will upload in revu this night
<pochu> dfiloni: alright, ping me when you are done.
<dfiloni> pochu: ok
<\sh> ScottK: *g* I don't think that we get a 0.9.55 from YokoZar and I'm asking myself, if I push a 0.9.55 this evening to ubuntu but then I'm feeling bad for YokoZar
<ScottK> \sh: I'm fairly certain you get it for the usual reasons. but just file a bug and subscribe the team so we have it all documented.
<\sh> ScottK: for sure...nothing without paper
<durapraxis> Hi. Is there a possibility to have an apt repository password-protected e.g. via .htaccess? Can apt be configured to provide this type of authentication?
<\sh> emgent: how far did you get with the drupal 5.7 merge?
<LucidFox> How many hours remain before FF?
<blueyed> LucidFox: ~29 as far as I understood it.
<linux__alien> LucidFox, i am upset that i am not able to find anything with the resources that i ve :(
<linux__alien> any help on this regard would be very much helpful
<linux__alien> i really like contributing here and staying here but my resources are a stopping factor :(
<Moniker42> linux__alien, what kind of resources do you mean?
<promag> durapraxis: nobody cares about you :D
<linux__alien> Moniker42, i ve only one laptop where i ve installed 7.10 and want to contribute to Ubuntu but am not able to fix or look into issues as i dont have an other system to play with . This is my only sytem that i ve got
<linux__alien> Moniker42, how do i go about doing it
<Moniker42> linux__alien, dual-boot?
<Moniker42> or get a job
<LucidFox> o_O
<Moniker42> :)
<linux__alien> Moniker42, i thought i could fix some small application issues like something not working stuff like that
<linux__alien> Moniker42, please
<Moniker42> linux__alien, what is it that you want?
<linux__alien> really curious to know this. there would be many people in the same situation that i am in . Having one system and not enough resources. so those people are not encouraged to contribute to Ubuntu ?
<\sh> durapraxis: did you try deb http://<user>:<password@<host> in sources.list?
<apachelogger_> RainCT: please archive the upload, this package is already in debian, and I merged it with the one on revu
<tsmithe> apachelogger_, are you able to check out a new revision of a recently rejected package?
<tsmithe> (for me)
<RainCT> apachelogger_: ok, done
<apachelogger_> tsmithe: just toss it over
<linux__alien> Hey Ok guys got to go now cya tomorrow
<apachelogger_> I'll be out for the next couple of hours though
<tsmithe> apachelogger_, http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=alsa-firmware
<linux__alien> thanks LucidFox for uploading the package
<slangasek> linux__alien: I think the vast majority of Open Source contributions come from people with more than one computer, particularly for distributions like Ubuntu.  I don't mean to discourage you from contributing, but you're certainly working with a handicap
<apachelogger_> tsmithe: please mention in a comment why it got rejected
<linux__alien> slangasek, so i need an other system is it
<linux__alien> any other alternative ?
<tsmithe> ok
<apachelogger_> afk
<RainCT> linux__alien: I also have only 1 PC but this is no problem for contributing to Ubuntu
<linux__alien> slangasek, why do you say particulary for distributions like Ubuntu
<linux__alien> RainCT, how do you do it
 * linux__alien listens 
<slangasek> linux__alien: I don't say "need" - but having a dedicated development system makes a big difference in not having your life disrupted when you break your development environment :-)
<linux__alien> ok but how does RainCT do it :)
<slangasek> linux__alien: I say "particularly for distributions" because when the *distribution* breaks while you're doing development, and it's your primary system, rebootstrapping yourself can be painful
<RainCT> linux__alien: what are you having problems with?
<linux__alien> slangasek, so it applies to all the distros then
<slangasek> linux__alien: yes
<linux__alien> RainCT, i ve only one laptop where i ve installed 7.10 and i just want to know how to fix bugs with this system alone ie for hardy how do you do it
<linux__alien> i ve 7.10 installed
<tsmithe> apachelogger_, done
<linux__alien> now its hardy which is gonna be released so how do you contribute with just one system
<Moniker42> linux__alien, why would you need two systems in the first place?
<linux__alien> so that if i break one i would still have an other to connect to the internet and the normal routine does not get affected
<LucidFox> Hmm, my @ubuntu.com address doesn't seem to work
<LucidFox> or do I have to do something explicitly to enable it?
<geser> LucidFox: it takes some time till it gets activated
<RainCT> linux__alien: well, just choose bugs in programs that have still the same version in gutsy as in hardy or are easy to upgrade to (eg, don't need lots of dependency upgrades and such)
<ScottK> jdong: It is fitting that my first 'core-dev' upload would be a clamav source backport ...
<\sh> ScottK: pdns bug #191506 is already fixed in hardy...
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 191506 in pdns "TXT records truncated" [Low,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/191506
<ScottK> \sh: Thanks.
<linux__alien> RainCT, thats how you do it is it
<\sh> ScottK: I checked our source and the changeset is longtime applied
<\sh> ScottK: so, question is, worth an SRU?
<RainCT> linux__alien: for stuff that needs testing, yes
<linux__alien> ok for other stuff like fixing ?
<linux__alien> i mean testing after fixing
<linux__alien> you would use the same machine to do it which might not produce the actual results sometimes right?
<RainCT> linux__alien: then there is also other stuff you can do (fixing / adding .desktop files, manpages, etc. for example) that doesn't necessary need the resulting package to be installed for testing
<linux__alien> hmm thats there true
<ScottK> \sh: Then I think that's not the right change set as the person who had that bug is running the current version.
<ScottK> Argh.
<linux__alien> Ok RainCT Thanks for the info
<RainCT> linux__alien: and as someone already said above you also have the dual-boot option
<linux__alien> RainCT, like downloading hardy and using it
<linux__alien> is it
<linux__alien> right?
<\sh> ScottK: regarding http://wiki.powerdns.com/cgi-bin/trac.fcgi/ticket/112 the revision is 996 and this is applied
<RainCT> linux__alien: yes, having Gutsy and Hardy installed at the same time (in different partitions) so that you can use Hardy for development but have Gutsy as a backup if you need it
<ScottK> \sh: I'm verifying the version now to make sure.
<linux__alien> RainCT, how about VMWare or something like that ?
<linux__alien> RainCT, do you have it in that way ?
<\sh> ScottK: and browsing svn there is nothing to see more about TXT records
<ScottK> \sh: Thanks.  I'm checking.
<LucidFox> hellboy195> I had a lame start, really :)
<hellboy195> grml
<hellboy195> everybody give it up for LucidFox the newest MOTU (since 4 hours) :D
<LucidFox> I learned about REVU, read the packaging guide and uploaded 3 packages, one of them (psi) really badly done
<LucidFox> (and not even based on the Debian one)
<pochu> LucidFox: I didn't know you were Sikon. Congrats :-)
<hellboy195> LucidFox: ^^. and next steps? I supposed it took 8 months until now
<LucidFox> I didn't do much for Gutsy, admittedly
<LucidFox> Packaged videotrans from scratch
<\sh> ScottK: and it looks like that the bugger is in pdns-recursor, reading the debian bug
<ScottK> \sh: Yes.  That's what I'm discovering too talking with the person that had the bug.
<LucidFox> Also packaged kink, but then I realized upstream was dead - so I forked it and became upstream, and another person packaged the fork for Debian faster than I did for Ubuntu :)
<\sh> ScottK: I pinged pkern...:)
<tsmithe> LucidFox, hey, as new motu induction, you could upload alsa-firmware for me?
<LucidFox> tsmithe> well, you need two advocates first
<tsmithe> even if it has already had two advocates?
<LucidFox> I don't know, really
<hellboy195> LucidFox: nice
<hellboy195> LucidFox: so you did ~30 packagings?
<RainCT> tsmithe: http://revu.tauware.de/diff.py?upid1=1715&upid2=2006 I guess changes in makefile, autom4te.cache/output.0 and such are just a side effect of re-building?
<LucidFox> no, far fewer than that
<hellboy195> LucidFox: but other things like ... ?
<tsmithe> RainCT, oh crap. is that in there? i had to rebuild configure, but forgot to remove that. hang on
<LucidFox> hellboy195> some packages listed on my +packages page are Debian syncs
<LucidFox> others are minor modifications
<hellboy195> LucidFox: so what and how ~ many contributions did you in generel to become a motu?
<LucidFox> there are only four packages I packaged for Ubuntu from scratch: videotrans, inkblot, smplayer-themes, and tovid
<LucidFox> however, I did quite a few Debian merges
<ScottK> \sh: Here's another clue http://mailman.powerdns.com/pipermail/pdns-users/2008-February/005130.html
<hellboy195> LucidFox: I have now 22 merges and 3 sync requests ^^
<ScottK> \sh: None of those files happen to appear in pdns-recursor they (it references the same commit)?
<RainCT> tsmithe: I'm away for ~1 hour. If LucidFox doesn't upload it ping me later
<LucidFox> RainCT> so, readvocation isn't needed for reuploaded NEW rejections?
<\sh> ScottK: right, the changeset is in pdns itself...and this is already applied
<\sh> ScottK: so pdns is correct...
<ScottK> \sh: It appears and the problem is just in the recursor
<mruiz> bye all
<\sh> ScottK: and we don't find any fix in recursor :(
<\sh> ScottK: I'm downloading the 3.1.5 preview and check what's changed against 3.1.4
<ScottK> Yes.  The guy that's having the problem is asking on #powerdns.
<ScottK> \sh: Sounds good.
<\sh> ay
<\sh> ScottK: now I understand the system ;)
<rhpot1991_laptop> if anyone has any time I could use a revu on: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=mythexport
<\sh> ScottK: pdns-recursor is sharing some code with pdns itself...and funny that are the same filenames
<\sh> ScottK: fixing
<ScottK> \sh: Great.
<\sh> ScottK: I can fix the 4.3 stuff too ;)
<ScottK> \sh: I'd say just fix this one bug and then we consider updating to the snapshot after.
<tsmithe> LucidFox, well, i guess RainCT meant just that, soo... (now i've uploaded a new revision cleaning up the patches)
<hellboy195> LucidFox: btw, nice post on ubuntu planet ^^
<\sh> ScottK: yepp
<AnAnt> persia: hello, I don't understand why ubuntume-themes didn't build for you
<AnAnt> persia: in Build-Depends it has: xcursorgen | x11-apps
<LucidFox> tsmithe> uploaded
<tsmithe> LucidFox, excellent :D
<tsmithe> apachelogger_, looks like you're off the hook :)
<norsetto> congrats lucidfox!
<tsmithe> oh, yes, and of course, congratulations :)
<rhpot1991_laptop> RainCT: Thanks for doing the revu for me yesterday, I got another one ready to go if you have time later
<AnAnt> how do I submit a debdiff to the "sponsors queue" ?
<\sh> ScottK: what arch do your friend need for testing?
<ScottK> i386
<AnAnt> hello?
<\sh> ScottK: ok...I'll compile one package for i386 and where do I send it?
<ScottK> \sh: Actuall it's i386 Sid.
<AnAnt> ok, where/what is the sponsors queue ?
<\sh> ScottK: grmpf
<ScottK> \sh: You want to just give me a link to it?  Or join #spf on irc.perl.org and we can chat directly.
<ScottK> \sh: I've got a sid pbuilder set up if you want to link me the .dsc
<\sh> ScottK: ok...give me a sec...put it on my webserver :)
<ScottK> K
<\sh> ScottK: just doing a testbuild...
<ScottK> OK.
<vemon> does anyone have a moment to spare for a great softsynth ready for advocation? :) http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=whysynth
<ScottK> \sh That was close.  You do want #spf and Julian is the individual in question.
<\sh> ScottK, what is SPF actually? ;)
<\sh> ScottK, don't answer :) I know what it is ;)
<cody-somerville> Can someone please review http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=thunar-svn-plugin?
<cody-somerville>  It requires one more advocation :)
<ScottK> \sh: Then you know why someone involved in that project would find obscure TXT record bugs.
<ScottK> BTW, Julian is in Germany too.
<\sh> ScottK, yeah :)
<LucidFox> Hmm. It seems that some archive admins have tendency to ascribe synced packages to the ACKer of the sync request and not to the original requester
<asantoni> persia: What do you think the odds are that LP #190589 will get in before the freeze?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 190589 in mixxx "New upstream release (in REVU)" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/190589
<LucidFox> Roll back to old upstream versions? Is that even possible?
<Moniker42> LucidFox, anything's possible - if only you believe in it!
 * LucidFox believes that it's possible that Microsoft and Apple will simultaneously go bankrupt today
<zul> only if i crush tehm
<hellboy195> LucidFox: dreamer :P
<ScottK> LucidFox: The reason they do that (with sync's) is they want to tag them to someone who's more likely to care/know what to do if it goes bad.
<AnAnt> Hello, I am submitted a debdiff to a package that is currently in Queue for Hardy, should the Status of LP be New or Confirmed ?
<hellboy195> AnAnt: confirmed and subscribe u-u-s
<AnAnt> hellboy195: thanks
<hellboy195> np
<LucidFox> Great. My blog post has been on Planet Ubuntu for an hour and already I got porn spam.
<hellboy195> rofl
<hellboy195> LucidFox: yeah I heard that many people with @ubuntu mail adresses are suffering from a lot of spam
<ScottK> LucidFox: Is this good news or bad?
<\sh> LucidFox, you mean trackback and comment spam?
<LucidFox> comment spam in blog
<cody-somerville> I get lots of spam on my blogs :)
<LucidFox> hellboy195> my @ubuntu.com email doesn't even work
<LucidFox> no idea why
<hellboy195> LucidFox: hmm. just wait until tomorrow?
<LucidFox> maybe
<geser> LucidFox: you could ask in #launchpad how often new @ubuntu.com addresses are generated
<LucidFox> I'll try after I get some sleep first
<LucidFox> night all
<jpatrick> geser: after a week at least I believe
<\sh> ScottK, did you see http://www.securityfocus.com/bid/27751 ? :)
<ScottK> Looking
<ScottK> \sh: Fixed in all supported Ubuntu releases (except the package for feisty-backports is waiting to build).
<ScottK> So, yes.
<\sh> ScottK, you are fast :)
<ScottK> It helps to have help.  leonel did Gutsy/Dapper and I did Hardy (grabbed the new upstream out of Debian incoming) and Feisty (stole Debian's patch for Etch).
<ScottK> That and now that I can upload source backports myself, that part's faster too.
<\sh> ScottK, your core application was overdue...
<cody-somerville> ScottK: Would you be able to review thunar-svn-plugin on revu?
<cody-somerville> http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=thunar-svn-plugin ? :)
<ScottK> cody-somerville: Perhaps later.
<ScottK> \sh: Thanks.
<\sh> siretart, did you get my ping from this afternoon? regarding mplayer and moving mplayer-skins to suggests ?
<siretart> \sh: I didn't read the context yet, but from the line, Recommends seems appropriate
<\sh> siretart, yepp..that would be also possible..and telling apt not to install Recommends in the first place...
<\sh> siretart, the thing is you can use mplayer in a server environment to extract thumbnails of videos..therefore mplayer-skins pulls in a lot of not used and not needed x stuff
<siretart> \sh: either that, or blacklisting xserver related packages
<\sh> siretart, well, actually you don't need the skins to start mplayer...so I think Recommends: is a better solution
<\sh> siretart, but you are the right person to answer this question :)
<siretart> you proposed suggest at first ;)
<siretart> \sh: btw, did you do something with fai on hardy?
<\sh> siretart, not right now...neither used nor put my hands on the source
<siretart> \sh: I'm currently considering pushing my merge to hardy right now, and fix broken things after FF
<\sh> siretart, please do..I think there are some bugs with the old version in hardy because of the new kernel world order
<siretart> allee: do you agree? (pushing fai into hardy right now)?
<\sh> siretart, and yes, I said suggests, because I know that this won't be installed by default...I forgot that you can train apt to not install recommends..so recommends is the better solution
<siretart> \sh: you could even pin down individual packages
<\sh> siretart, I did rebuild the ubuntu package for etch and fixed it in our local repo ;)
<\sh> but pinning down because of this doesn't make sense, and moving it to recommends is more logical, because you can use mplayer without it
<siretart> I mean moving the skins to recommends, and pin down the xserver. this way you don't need to turn of recommends
<\sh> siretart, sure...but disabling installing recommends is a good think so you know much better what's on your server, when apt is following only the main dependencies...well I'm lazy that's all ;)
<siretart> indeed
<dfiloni> pochu: done, wxwidgets2.8 2.8.7.1 is in revu
<pochu> dfiloni: cool. I'll have a look at it later.
<pochu> persia, DktrKranz ^ perhaps you can have a look at it too and with all our eyes we can get it in tomorrow.
<dfiloni> pochu: I don't know if it works, I didn't test it, my pc wan't to kill me :)
<pochu> dfiloni: I'll do that for you ;)
<DktrKranz> pochu, sure. Last upload went good (at least they didn't shoot at me or dfiloni)
<pochu> dfiloni: thanks for the good work
<dfiloni> pochu: great! thanks!
 * pochu hugs dfiloni :)
<pochu> DktrKranz: cool. I have to leave soon. I'll leave wx building...
<afflux> Should I provide a rule for get-orig-source if the source can be obtained with uscan?
<RainCT> afflux: it isn't necessary if upstream's tarball is ok
<afflux> RainCT: the reason why I'm asking is lucidfox' comments on bug 190671
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 190671 in gdecrypt "new upstream version available (0.7.1)" [Wishlist,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/190671
<crimsun> hmph, my irc server is sinking.
<hendrixski> Anybody know a good resource on how to make apt.conf files?
<james_w> hendrixski: is "man apt.conf" not sufficient?
<hendrixski> james_w, nope
<hendrixski> james_w, I'm trying to get apt-ftparchive to make a packages.gz file of the .ddeb files in a directory (normally it only picks up debs)... and you need to pass it a conf file to do that... the only examples i've found are confusing, and I'm looking for a manual
<hendrixski> and the man page doesn't have a lot of the key things that are in the example
<\sh> hendrixski, apt-ftparchive has a good docu..but man apt.conf is the wrong help ;)
<\sh> hendrixski, http://cihar.com/publications/misc/debian-repository-howto/ as one pointer with examples
<hendrixski> nice
<hendrixski> ah, I guess I googled the wrong things
<hendrixski> \sh, thanks :-)
<\sh> hendrixski, another pointer where apt-ftparchive is used you'll find here: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/InstallCDCustomization?action=show&redirect=InstallCDCustomizationHowTo
<hendrixski> \sh, nice.  I'll read through more of that stuff. .. I thought those conf files being passed were in the style of apt.conf files so I was kind of scratching my head
<\sh> hendrixski, nope
<\sh> hendrixski, but the mentioning of apt.conf(5) looks like a bug to me
<csomerville> Is ubuntuwire down?
<blueyed> RAOF: I've re-uploaded jedit on revu.
<RainCT> csomerville: seems so
<RainCT> well, good night
<blueyed> csomerville: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/ works..
<csomerville> yes
<emgent> lastfm   	 Ubuntu Hardy   	 1:1.4.2.58240.dfsg-1ubuntu1   	2008-02-12  	 Not yet built
<emgent> uhm.. some idea?
<emgent> xsupplicant   	 Ubuntu Hardy   	 1.2.4.dfsg.1-5   	4 hours ago  	 Not yet built  	
<emgent> problem with buildt ?
<geser> emgent: lastfm build successfully
<emgent> ok
<emgent> my launchpad have some problem
<emgent> https://edge.launchpad.net/~emgent/+packages
<geser> emgent: https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/hardy/+source/xsupplicant/+builds and https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/hardy/+source/lastfm/+builds
<rhpot1991> anyone available for a revu?
<geser> emgent: probably because some arch are still pending
<emgent> ok cool.
<emgent> thanks geser
<jumpkick> Hello all
<jumpkick> asantoni and I (original authors of Mixxx) are trying to get our package in before the freeze, we are facing from resistance from the fact that a old version was synced from Debian into Universe...
<jumpkick> the debian package was authored by a 3rd party
<jumpkick> and there is now some problem with change-logs being divergent
<pwnguin> when you say 3rd party, do you mean a DD, or an NMU?
<jumpkick> we could use the MOTU mojo in resolving this issue
<jumpkick> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mixxx/+bug/190589
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 190589 in mixxx "New upstream release (in REVU)" [Wishlist,New]
<jumpkick> pwnguin: there are debian maintainers who ported the ubuntu package to Debian Sid
<jumpkick> http://packages.debian.org/sid/mixxx
<jumpkick> when universe was synced from Debian it pulled their version of our ported package
<jumpkick> I should say ported and updated from trunk
<jumpkick> beta 2 has since been released and is quite a bit more stable and feature complete
<jumpkick> http://mixxxblog.blogspot.com/2008/02/mixxx-160-beta2-released.html
<jumpkick> but we the original authors of the package are shut out of the loop
<jumpkick> so we are unable to get it updated
<steveire> Hi I'm still confused about version numbering in my ppa. I've named the package 1.1.10-1ubuntu1~ppa1. That should be upgraded if a new version of libxine appears in -backports. Is that what will happen with the current version name
<steveire> ?
<jumpkick> so can someone do whatever MOTUs do and advocate the acceptance of our beta2 package plz
<jumpkick> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=mixxx
<_MMA_> jumpkick: I think the possibility of getting it into Debian and then syncing to Ubuntu are slim. But I might be able to get someone to do a package you can host for users if nobody has the time to do something in Ubuntu.
<pwnguin> _MMA_: but the situation is a bit strange, in that upstream to debian is/was ubuntu
<jumpkick> _MMA_: no, no, no...  someone (not us) took the Ubuntu package for 1.5.2 and updated it against trunk to 1.6.0b1 and put into Debian
<jumpkick> Ubuntu synced against debian
<_MMA_> Ok. I see. You have a package in REVU. Ill poke around to see if I can get it attention.
<jumpkick> and now we are pooched
<jumpkick> thanks
<jumpkick> _MMA_: help is much appriecated...
<pwnguin> i thought there was a list of software not to import from debian
<pwnguin> for situations like this
<jumpkick> Debian never had the package before
<nityad> Hello, I am planning to upload new packages for GlassFish V2 UR1 (multiverse) to the REVU queue later today. LP: # 191658 . Is there any other process that I should be aware of other than following the instructions on uploading to REVU - Thanks
<jumpkick> poor asantoni has been trying to get the package in for feature freeze since last week
<_MMA_> jumpkick: Still too late in my experience. :P
<TheMuso> jumpkick: I know what the portaudio problem is, and it has to do with the fact that portaudio v19 used to be in main, which is where all the core Ubuntu softwrae is. However, jack is still in universe.
<TheMuso> So portaudio is not currently built against jack.
<persia> nityad: That the deadline for new source packages (and hence REVU) is today, and that glassfish is already in the repository.  You'd do better to submit the diff.gz to the sponsors queue in an upgrade bug.
<jumpkick> We can probably live without jack if we have to...  We also support ALSA and OSS
<TheMuso> Right.
<jumpkick> or package up unofficial bins to support jack for the hardcore folks who want it
<TheMuso> I'm surprised you use jack via portaudio.
<TheMuso> Thats... um... somewhat messy
<TheMuso> IMO
<jumpkick> TheMuso: I thought the point of using portaudio was to not care what the underlying api is for sound
<TheMuso> Yes, but that introduces latency.
<jumpkick> I'm not down at that level of dev, so perhaps I have it wrong
<jumpkick> TheMuso: yeah, there's a trade off there
<jumpkick> we already compensate for latency to some extent as it is
<TheMuso> fair enough
<TheMuso> I'm seeing what I can do to squeeze it in now.
<jumpkick> TheMuso: thanks
<jdstrand> ScottK: dapper clamav pushed.  should hit mirrors in a couple hours
<cody-somerville> Can someone please review http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=thunar-svn-plugin ?
<steveire> Is there anywhere else I can ask my version question? Launchpad is silent.
<jumpkick> pwnguin: where can I find info about this don't-sync-from-Debian list of packages?
<jumpkick> is there a keyword or something I can google
<nityad> persia: GlassFish V1 relase is in the repository. This is going to be a completely separate package glassfishv2ur1 (and its dependencies) so that both versions are installable in parallel.
<steveire> Hi I'm still confused about version numbering in my ppa. I've named the package 1.1.10-1ubuntu1~ppa1. That should be upgraded if a new version of libxine appears in -backports. Is that what will happen with the current version name
<rhpot1991> Can I get a review on this (http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=mythexport), been looked at a few times, should be pretty good by now
<persia> nityad: In that case, your chances of getting it into hardy are slim to nil.
#ubuntu-motu 2008-02-14
<persia> mruiz: It is precisely because the old package lives in Dapper that it would need a merge instead of a sync.  If you have time for it, great.  If not, no worries: 1.4 is likely good enough.
<steveire> Anyone? Surely this is obvious to the experienced?
<nityad> Keeping my fingers crossed.
<TheMuso> mixxx almost ready for upload. Only a test build needed.
<cody-somerville> persia Can you review thunar-svn-plugin, please with a cherry on top :)
<cody-somerville> http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=thunar-svn-plugin
<jumpkick> TheMuso: thanks man... Is there anything else asantoni_ and I need to take care of?
<TheMuso> not that I know of
<jumpkick> okay...
<jumpkick> I'm new to the whole process, so I appreciate the help
<jumpkick> do we have to do anything with this "advocating" thing?
<TheMuso> no
<jumpkick> TheMuso: okay thanks
<TheMuso> jumpkick: Just doing a test build, and if thats ok, and it instalsl properly, I'll go ahead and upload it.
<TheMuso> installs
<JonReagan> anyone here?
<RAOF> JonReagan: Yes, many people.
<RAOF> !ask > JonReagan
<JonReagan> lol... now I see... 200 people
<JonReagan> I feel smart.
<JonReagan> So, would anyone know a little about the feature freeze coming tomorrow?
<TheMuso> Its more like today.
<RAOF> I'd suggest asking your actual question.  The answer to the question you asked is "yes" :).
<TheMuso> i.e first thing Thursday.
<cody-somerville> RAOF: Can you review http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=thunar-svn-plugin please? :)
<JonReagan> so, basically, uploads will not be allowed after today/tomorrow?
<RAOF> cody-somerville: Not really, sorry.  I'm at work(/Uni), and FF has already sapped a little too much time.
<JonReagan> alright, I'll get to the point:  I've got a package in REVU.  Since it is in REVU, will it make it into the hardy repos even after the feature freeze?
<pochu> JonReagan: uploads - yes. New packages - upload, yes. Accepted by archive-admins... depends.
<JonReagan> thanks!
<pochu> JonReagan: so if it's a new package, you need more than a very good reason to get it accepted.
<JonReagan> ah
<pochu> JonReagan: what package is it?
<pochu> JonReagan: your best bet right now is to make a perfect package and to find someone interested... as everybody is busy because of the freeze
<JonReagan> it's openproj
<JonReagan> after the feature freeze, are the MOTU folks going to stop accepting packages for Hardy?
<pochu> JonReagan: after the freeze we concentrate on fixing things.
<pochu> JonReagan: so no more new packages
<JonReagan> ah. crud.  Well, thanks for letting me know.
<rhpot1991> can anyone do a quick ack?  I have one just need one more, should be easy: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=mythexport
<cody-somerville> pochu: Can you review http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=thunar-svn-plugin please? :)
<pochu> cody-somerville: I'll review the debian/ dir, but better ask an Xfce guy to test the package. I'm a GNOME fan :)
<cody-somerville> pochu: I'm an xfce guy :)
<cody-somerville> And mr_pouit (Xubuntu team lead) already acked it
<pochu> Ah, cool
<rhpot1991> pochu: if you have time after that mine is just a simple script (http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=mythexport), already has one sponsor
<pochu> rhpot1991: which prog. language?
<rhpot1991> perl
<pochu> rhpot1991: I guess superm1 reviewed it, did him?
<rhpot1991> yep
<pochu> alright, I'll have a look too.
<rhpot1991> thanks
<pochu> I don't know perl though ;)
<cody-somerville> pochu: thanks :)
<rhpot1991> its pretty straight forward and short, comments in there too :)
<leonel> scottK hello !     Just installed  an ubuntu dapper  and  clamav 0.88 was installed  what I suppose to enable to get clamav 0.92 ??
<blueyed> leonel: should be in -backports, IIRC.
<blueyed> "dapper-backports" repository.
<leonel> blueyed: thanks
<cody-somerville> pochu: How does it go?
<leonel> we tested the new clamav  and its rdepends  to be included in universe
<leonel> or in dapper-updates ??
<leonel> don't remember  that's why I'm asking
<leonel> I'm testing the upgrade  from Dapper  to  Hardy  with a test  'almost' real server
<rjmyst3> superm1: wxformbuilder FTBFS on ppc, but the debs for lpia, i386, and amd64 are in the NEW queue
<rjmyst3> what does that mean?
<superm1> look at the build log
<superm1> and see why it failed
<rjmyst3> it appears that it failed because the premake-linux binary built on i386 does not work on ppc
<rjmyst3> makes sense
<superm1> so should this package not be available on ppc?
<superm1> or can that be fixed
<rjmyst3> it could be fixed - but without access to a ppc machine, i wouldn't be able to
<superm1> well i know some folks in here have ppc machines
<superm1> perhaps you can get someone to let you ssh in to work on it
<rjmyst3> that would be fantastic - anyone here interested?
<superm1> i forget who had them other than imbrandon
<superm1> imbrandon, you have one right?
<pochu> cody-somerville: haven't started it yet. I'm buuuuuuuuuusy ;)
<pochu> cody-somerville: but it's opened in firefox. That's a start ;)
 * TheMuso has a PowerPC.
 * wpk too. two actually. stacked under bed
<superm1> so perhaps would one of you guys be able to help rjmyst3 out with a shell account to help fix that?
<TheMuso> Whats the problem exactly?
 * TheMuso has two, one mini, and one powermac G3 300.
<rjmyst3> never tested building on ppc
<TheMuso> What package?
<rjmyst3> wxformbuilder
<rjmyst3> it uses a build file generator called "Premake" - premake.sf.net
<TheMuso> rjmyst3: Would you like me to take a look, or would you rather do it yourself?
 * wpk has powerbook pismo and powerbook lombard
<rjmyst3> i think all i need is a premake-pcc binary
<rjmyst3> so wxfb can execute it during the build process
<TheMuso> Riht, so premake is not available on PPC.
<rjmyst3> or, wxfb's build process could build premake first, then use it
<TheMuso> I'm assuming thats a separate package.
<rjmyst3> it is not a package at all
<rjmyst3> as far as i know
<TheMuso> Oh right.
<rjmyst3> but it is cross platform (mac, linux, windows), which is why wxFB uses it
<TheMuso> let me get my mini updated, and I'll take a look.
<rjmyst3> great!
<blueyed> Re dspam: there's a 3.8.0 release and 3.8.1~cvs... - both not in unstable. So I could either create a new upstream package using 3.8.0 or use the 3.8.1~cvs (from outside of unstable, but likely to land there). Would uploading the ~cvs version be ok?
<rjmyst3> TheMuso, superm1, or anyone - would you advise that wxFB just build premake during the build process, then execute it?
<rjmyst3> that would make the build architecture independent
<rjmyst3> (probably)
<TheMuso> rjmyst3: I'll have a look in a sec.
<TheMuso> And then see what might be better.
<rjmyst3> TheMuso: I just got a ppc mac user to build a linux-pcc binary of premake for me
<rjmyst3> the mac user is a linux novice, so setting up and opening ssh for me, or building wxfb for me would be not easy
<rjmyst3> but, i can extend the arch check in my debian/rules to use this premake
<rjmyst3> if you would test if it builds
<TheMuso> rjmyst3: Sur.
<TheMuso> sure
<rjmyst3> how many architectures does wxformbuilder need to build on to be accepted into hardy?
<LaserJock> one I would assume
<blueyed> TheMuso: bug 190589 is fixed now, after your upload?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 190589 in mixxx "New upstream release (in REVU)" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/190589
<TheMuso> blueyed: gah I wish I knew that existed. Thanks, I'll close it./
<LaserJock> hmm, I wish I had seen that I downloaded gutsy 64bit *before* I installed it
<StevenK> % uname -m
<StevenK> x86_64
<StevenK> LaserJock: Come to the dark side!
<LaserJock> I did, I just didn't know it until I was setting up pbuilder
<LaserJock> and then I had to download hardy 32bit for virtualbox/vmware
<LaserJock> and then rebuild packages I wanted to test
<LaserJock> ah well
<StevenK> LaserJock: man linux32
 * TheMuso will be joining the dark side in a few weeks hopefully.
<cody-somerville> LaserJock: Would you be able to review http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=thunar-svn-plugin please? :)
<rjmyst3> TheMuso: i have a new dsc
<rjmyst3> should I upload it to revu
<rjmyst3> or give it to you somehow
<TheMuso> rjmyst3: A .diff.gz is better
<rjmyst3> right
<rjmyst3> got that too
<TheMuso> rjmyst3: And if there is a bug for this, attach it to the bug, and give me the bug number
<TheMuso> I can't do anything with a .dsc
<rjmyst3> right, sorry
<TheMuso> np
<rjmyst3> TheMuso: there is no bug for this
<rjmyst3> i'm a bit confused as to what is going on in the process
<TheMuso> rjmyst3: Ok, how do you want to get the .diff.gz to me?
<TheMuso> what process?
<rjmyst3> the wxformbuilder as a new package in ubuntu process
<TheMuso> Well the package has built, and is awaiting he binaries to be reviewed, this doesn't stop us uploading a new revision.
<TheMuso> The archive admins have approved it to be in the archive, so once the binaries are clear, no more checking needs to be done, unless the package intorduces a new binary package.
<rjmyst3> so i should not be freaking out about rejection of the wxformbuilder package on the day before the feature freeze?
<TheMuso> jrib: `Hang on, le tme check something, and I'll be able to say for sure yes or no. :)
<TheMuso> ugh jrm
<ScottK> leonel: Did it get resolved?
<TheMuso> ugh rjmyst3
<rjmyst3> lol
<TheMuso> rjmyst3: No, the package has been accepted, it will not be rejected from here.
<rjmyst3> big sigh of relief over here
<rjmyst3> ok
<leonel> scottK no it didn't
<rjmyst3> the source archive is 2.4 megabytes
<rjmyst3> email work for you?
<ScottK> leonel: You may have a stale mirror then.
<TheMuso> rjmyst3: If it uses the same orig tarball as in the archiev, just the diff is fine
<TheMuso> archive
<TheMuso> damn slow box and keyboard neding a replacement.
<rjmyst3> the premake binary is in the orig tarball
<TheMuso> Ok thats alright.
<leonel> scottK just by having  dapper-updates  universe  will do  right ?
<TheMuso> Is it a new orig tarball?
<rjmyst3> (i'm an upstream dev as well as the package maintainer, its confusing)
<ScottK> leonel: And security
<rjmyst3> it is a new orig, and a new diff
<TheMuso> rjmyst3: Right yeah email is fine.
<TheMuso> rjmyst3: themuso@ubuntu.com
<ScottK> leonel: The dapper-security fixes just got pushed about half an hour ago ...  https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/dapper/+source/clamav/0.92~dfsg-2~dapper1ubuntu0.1
<LaserJock> anybody know of anything special that needs to be done to get Hardy firefox to see plugins?
#ubuntu-motu 2008-02-15
<HighNo> jpatrick: hehe, gotcha! I was just wondering if the main channel for backporters would be #ubuntu-backports - if so backporters are IRC lazy :-)
<jpatrick> HighNo: no, it's here
<persia> No, it's #ubuntu-backports, and the backporters are IRC lazy.
<persia> (although most of them idle here even when absent there)
<jpatrick>  /cs info #ubuntu-backporters -> not registered
 * persia notes that MOTU cannot upload to -backports as justification for the above remark
<persia> jpatrick: #ubuntu-backports not #ubuntu-backporters
<jpatrick> persia: opps
<sistpoty|work> pochu, jdong: /me is confused about amule... is this actually a release (as the topmost changelog entry seems to indicate this)?
<HighNo> :-) I was just trying to make sure I have someone to ask if anything will go wrong. But this time I will start by completely reading the wiki, trying hard, failing hard and then keep asking dumb questions :-)
<pochu> sistpoty|work: no, not yet
<pochu> sistpoty|work: it's a tarball generated from a svn snapshot
<sistpoty|work> pochu: so this is a prerelease, and they're working towards a release? (as in have entered bug fixing mode)? Or are they planning to first add many new features?
<pochu> sistpoty|work: I don't expect new features from now on (and from some time)
<pochu> sistpoty|work: from this thread, you can see they were preparing the release a long time ago... http://forum.amule.org/index.php?topic=13194.0
<DktrKranz> RainCT: did you receive any feedback about bug 187743?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 187743 in youtube-dl "[SRU] youtube-dl doesn't work anymore" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/187743
<RainCT> DktrKranz: I have preparing a candidate revision on my TODO list for today :)
<DktrKranz> \o/
<pochu> nxvl_work, Ng: will any of you write a freeze exception request for terminator 0.8? I'd love to get it in the archive
<pochu> Otherwise you can package it in your team's ppa :)
<nxvl_work> pochu: yep, i have already talk yo pitti, i think it will be included
 * DktrKranz is curious if there is a list of unapproved packages available to the masses.
<pochu> nxvl_work: cool, keep me posted :)
<nxvl_work> pochu: i'm just waiting for 0.8.1 (0.8 comes with some bugs) to upload it to debian and then sync it
<pochu> nxvl_work: oh, I didn't know it was buggy
<pochu> DktrKranz: what do you mean with unapproved?
<persia> Otherwise we'd already have it :)  There was a definite plan for 8.0 to be pre-FF.
<DktrKranz> pochu: packages waiting to be approved by archive-admins, such as SRUs
<nxvl_work> pochu: some little bugs, and also en empty changelog :D
<DktrKranz> we have NEW queue, unapproved queue for hardy, but I'm unable to find it for stable releases too.
<persia> DktrKranz: There's the pending SRU page
<DktrKranz> persia: that page is for approved SRU waiting for verification, I mean packages uploaded to -proposed still waiting to be approved by archive-admins.
<persia> DktrKranz: Wouldn't that be in the NEW queue for -proposed?
<nxvl_work> pochu: http://mentors.debian.net/cgi-bin/sponsor-pkglist?action=details;package=terminator
<DktrKranz> persia: I thought so, but I was wrong. Anyway, they aren't NEW, just "unapproved"
<persia> DktrKranz: That's just an annoying LP bug (I forget the number) that https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/gutsy/+queue?queue_state=1&queue_text= doesn't work.
<jeromeg> DktrKranz: speaking of SRU, I tested klavaro from gutsy-proposed, runs fine for me
<DktrKranz> jeromeg: good. I'm in sru-verification now, so I can check if package runs fine, but feedbacks from users are welcome :)
<DktrKranz> persia: I'll dig into soyuz bug then
<jeromeg> DktrKranz: i just want to check one last thing and will add a comment to the bug report
<Ng> pochu: I'm gonna do my best to get 0.8.1 out tonight. I kinda screwed up making 0.8 :/
<jeromeg> DktrKranz: ok, everything is fine
<DktrKranz> RainCT: did you reupload aumix to -proposed? If so, I can check if I see it listed somewhere, but I think it won't.
<RainCT> DktrKranz: yes
<DktrKranz> bug 152884
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 152884 in soyuz "If you accept packages from the UNAPPROVED queue, it says they're accepted, and takes you back to the NEW queue." [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/152884
<jpatrick> HighNo: best place to stalk backporters is probably here
<RainCT> anyone here familiar with python-soya?
<persia> RAOF: How familiar do you need?
<jeromeg> RainCT: i had to work a bit on it during feisty -> gutsy development cycle
<jeromeg> it's really a pian !
<jeromeg> *pain
<RainCT> jeromeg: Do you remember how to set the icon for a window?
<jeromeg> RainCT: no idea :)
<jeromeg> RainCT: and it's not really documented :)
<andy2> Can someone point me in the right direction, I am trying to make a metapackage and I can't seem to figure out how to create the source packages.  All the docs seem to start with an upstream tarball.
<persia> andy2: For a metapackage, just create a directory of the right name, and then populate debian/changelog, debian/control, debian/copyright, and debian/rules.  You may find it easier to use something like germinate and seeds to manage the metapackage, depending on the size and complexity.
<andy2> It would be very simple.  But I would like to upload it to my PPA.  I can't do that unless I create a .dsc and a tar.gz, correct?
<persia> For a traditional metapackage, there is no tar.gz, and nothing but the debian/ directory.  For a germinate-based metapackage, there is content in the package, so you could choose native or non-native as you like (there are derivatives using both models in the repositories)
<persia> andy2: Right.  Once you have created the four files I mentioned, running `debuild -S` in the directory containing debian/ would build you the .dsc and .tar.gz
<bddebian> Heya gang
<andy2> I guess it's my debian/rules that is giving me a problem.
<persia> andy2: For a traditional meta-package arrangement, take a look at the meta-gnome2 package.  For a germinate-based meta-package arrangement, ubuntu-meta is the best model.
<RainCT> jeromeg: I agree with you :P
<jeromeg> RainCT: :)
<jeromeg> got to go
<jeromeg> bye
<andy2> persia:  Thanks, that's very helpful!
<RainCT> cya
<persia> andy2: That's the point of free software: use the best out there.  Note that you'll need to follow the licensing for those packages if you base yours from them.
<andy2> persia | andy2: For a metapackage, just create a directory of the right name, and then     . _MMA_
<andy2>                           populate debian/changelog, debian/control, debian/copyright, and debian/rules.    . _ruben
<andy2>                           You may find it easier to use something like germinate and seeds to manage the    . _stink_
<andy2>                           metapackage, depending on the size and complexity.                                . a7p
<andy2> [12:39:59]        andy2 | It would be very simple.  But I would like to upload it to my PPA.  I can't do    . Adri2000
<persia> Err.  Pastebin might be easier to read, if that wasn't a mistake.
<slomo_> superm1: i'll look at gmyth later (totem plugin i mean) and sponsoring gmyth to debian if youdidn't find someone yet
<slomo_> superm1: bbl now though ;)
<mario_limonciell> slomo_, yeah I do need someone to help get into debian.  I'll touch bases with you later.  thanks :)
<ScottK> sistpoty|work: I suggest we discuss amongst ourselves via email.
<sistpoty|work> ScottK: ok, sounds sensible
<ScottK> sistpoty|work: It's been two acks in the past.
 * persia likes 2 ACKs as it reduces the chance that any one person making a mistake causes an issue
<jdong> ok, now, to scrape hardy-changes
<persia> jdong: Why scrape?  Download the mbox tar, and once you have something working, subscribe your bot.
<persia> That gives you headers, etc. and further doesn't break the GPG signatures.
<HighNo> wow, we even have debian sponsors here? coolest channel on earth...
<jdong> persia: mbox would be more reliable, but I just want something to pipe to less to see the X recent uploads
<persia> jdong: Ah.  I think you can get just the current month as mbox, but in that case, yes scraping might be easier :(
<jdong> persia: yeah scraping is indeed ugly, but it lets me get away with a 10-line script that does the job
<persia> jdong: curl $(mbox.url) -o changes.mbox && mailx -H -f changes.mbox | head -10
<persia> Your 10 lines likely use less bandwidth than my one line, and mine might benefit from the applicaiton of sed.
<tuxmaniac> Hi folks. Is there a good guide on splitting up packages?
<tuxmaniac> I am now stuck with a comment "Consider splitting the package" because of arch-dep-package-has-big-usr-share 14965kB 46%
<jdong> persia: ooh interesting
<DaveMorris> tuxmaniac: basically stick the arch dependent stuff in 1 package, and the non arch depend stuff in the other
<DaveMorris> and have the arch depend stuff depend on the other package
<jdong> persia: I guess the downside of my method would be the terrible hammering of the server with 10 separate HTTP connections
<ScottK2> jdong: I'll sponsor the FF3 backport and upload it if you get an ack from asac that you've implemented his intent.
<jdong> ScottK2: ok, cool :)
<persia> tuxmaniac: There's some documentation on wiki.debian.org, but I find it easiest to just add the necessary bits to control, create the debian/package.install files, and pass --list-missing to dh_install until I've gotten the mix right.
<tuxmaniac> hmm I will look into it
<ScottK2> sistpoty|work: It might be nice to add a notice to REVU's front page indicating that no more new packages are being accepted for Hardy.   I see some uploads stil going on.
<sistpoty|work> ScottK2: will do
<rexbron> Ok, I just pushed a branch of ubuntu-dev-tools that separates ppaput into a module and a the script and updated the packaging. Anyone want to take a look? https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~rexbron/ubuntu-dev-tools/python-ppaput
<persia> jdong: The downside of mine is that the download gets big at the end of the month :)
<rexbron> s/the//
<persia> rexbron: Do you have a bug open for discussion and possible merge? (note that you can associate a branch and a bug)
<rexbron> persia, I have filed a bug and mentioned it in the changelog but have not proposed a merge yet
 * RainCT looks
<rexbron> Ok, filed a merge report
<persia> rexbron: Ah.  I usually encourage linking the branch to the bug, so that the bug becomes a place to exchange comments on the branch until it can be merged.
<jdong> asac: seems like xulrunner-1.9 already has USE_SYSTEM_* checks; are these valid/reliable to detect Gutsy properly or should I hardcode them to 0?
<rexbron> persia, I also just linked the bug to the branch
<rexbron> :)
 * sistpoty|work heads home
<sistpoty|work> cya
<asac> jdong: right if the version is two low it should auto disable it
<jdong> asac: alright, let me try in a gutsy pbuilder to make sure it detects this properly :)
<rexbron> Opps, forgot to put a license header on the top of the new script
<rexbron> fixing
<ScottK2> Arghhh! - So the day AFTER feature freeze I get a bug against python-clamav and the solution to the bug is a new package (python-clamd).
<persia> ScottK: That's why we have an exception process :)
<ScottK2> Yeah.  Well.   Urgh.
<jdong> :)
<pochu> How many ACKs do we need from motu-release? 2?
<zul> ScottK2: its called irony
<jdong> asac: unrelated question, do you think Mozilla's gonna switch to something other than CVS anytime soon?
<RainCT> rexbron: I think I'd be better have a "python-ubuntutools" like dholbach proposed (if possible with a better name :P) instead of python-ppapu, so that more stuff can be added to it later
<ScottK2> pochu: Historically it's been two.  We are still nattering amongst ourselves for this release.
<asac> jdong: http://hg.mozilla.org (-> for mozilla 2.0)
<rexbron> RainCT, sure, not a problem
<ScottK2> RainCT: Why put the word python in the package name?  It's not a Python module is it?
<RainCT> ScottK2: it is now
<jdong> asac: sweet!
<ScottK2> It's a module?
<rexbron> ScottK2, I factored out the backend code from ppaput
<ScottK2> OK.  So I import ppaput and use that in my application?
<rexbron> That is why I did it :)
<ScottK2> OK.
<RainCT> rexbron: also, I haven't looked at ppaput.py yet but if it does what you wrote on debian/control perhaps just "ppa" would be a better name (import ppa)
<ScottK2> Fair enough then.
<RainCT> or, forget my last sentence
<RainCT> s/or/ok
<ScottK2> Personally, I think MOTUs should have better things to do with their time than encourage 3rd party repositories, but whatever you feel is important ...
<pochu> ScottK2: you can use ppas to call for testing :)
<ScottK2> \sh: Dunno if you saw, but I had pdns-recursor sync'ed from Debian (with your patch plus some other stuff).
<pochu> ScottK2: look at asac's ppa
<RainCT> rexbron: but what would be nice are docstrings, if you have time to add some
<\sh> ScottK2: yepp...
<ScottK2> pochu: Sure, but developers don't need ppaput and such.
<\sh> ScottK2: debian maintainer was fast with the upload...good :)
<ScottK2> \sh: I think he was only fast because pkern threatened an NMU.
<rexbron> RainCT, I am not sure what that would entail, but I will look into it
<\sh> ScottK2: I love pkern ;) we owe him at least a beer :)
<ScottK2> Julian owes him a beer and is much better placed than me to deliver.
<hellboy195> \sh: ping
<\sh> ScottK2: so it's up to me to serve him a cold one ;)
<\sh> hellboy195: hi :)
<ScottK2> Unless you can talk him into going to UDS and I get sponsored ...
<hellboy195> \sh: hoi :) Have you already heard about the seg faults of wine 0.9.55 (including me) ?
<\sh> hellboy195: yepp
<\sh> hellboy195: my inbox is full of crashing wine spam
<\sh> hellboy195: and I'm on it
<hellboy195> \sh: ah k ,sry :)
<\sh> hellboy195: my problem is that my time is limited at this time, because of new job etc...have a lot to do
<hellboy195> \sh: no stress ;)
 * RainCT gives up trying to give the balazar window an icon and decides that soya is crap :P
<persia> RainCT: Well, mostly, but balazar can be confusing as well
<ScottK2> RainCT: Feel like doing a quick Python package instead?
<RainCT> ScottK2: for what?
<ScottK2> RainCT: http://xael.org/norman/python/pyclamd/
<RainCT> ScottK2: ok, but let me finish a youtube-dl SRU first
<ScottK2> RainCT: Thanks.  It's the only solution I see to Bug #192130
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 192130 in python-clamav "update to 0.4.0-1build1~dapper1 breaks programs" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/192130
<ScottK2> RainCT: I'll file the needs-packaging bug for it.
<RainCT> great, even soya's author doesn't know if it is possible to give windows an icon lol
 * festor is away: Estoy ocupado
<vemon> how can i really remove a package from a launchpad ppa?
<persia> vemon: Ask in #launchpad
<pochu> vemon: there's a button for it in the UI
<vemon> pochu, doesn't go all the way with the button
<pochu> vemon: it takes a while
<vemon> pochu, i'm still not able to re-upload with a same name+version
<festor> RainCT, what is the problem?
<vemon> ah ok..
<RainCT> DktrKranz: uhm.. is youtube-dl failing for you?
<ScottK2> RainCT: Bug #192205 is you get to it.  If not, I'll do it later tonight.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 192205 in ubuntu "pyClamd : Clamav with python needed to replace functions removed from python-clamav" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/192205
<ScottK2> is/if
<DktrKranz> RainCT, do you refer to the patch I suggested?
<RainCT> DktrKranz: if it fails before applying the patch.. I can't reproduce it anymore with the unpatched source :S
<DktrKranz> d'oh
<ScottK2> So I just now noticed that my Dapper desktop that I've been using since before Dapper was actually released (about Dapper Beta) is running the server kernel.  Odd.
<frafu> Hello, the mousetweaks module in the launchpad buildd system says "pending (355)" for two days. Is the 355 its position in the build queue and should it not get smaller over the time?
<RainCT> DktrKranz: oh, never mind
<RainCT> DktrKranz: I don't know how but I got the Hardy sources :P
<ScottK2> frafu: I lot of stuff got shoved on the buildd's in the last couple of days.  Universe is prioritized lower than Main, so it may be a while, but it'll get there.
<DktrKranz> RainCT, heh :P
<RainCT> SRU version for a -1 is -1ubuntu0.1, or?
<ScottK2> RainCT: I'd suggest -1ubuntu0.1, but there's no hard and fast rule.  They main thing is to be sure you won't collide with the version number in another release.
<persia> frafu: 355 is the priority, rather than the position in the queue.  It doesn't typically decrease in any understandable way, but rather based on age and buildd admin attitude.  Generally it's best to just wait for a while, and it gets built.
<ScottK2> slangasek: I've got something I'm going to request a freeze exception on, but since it requires additional New processing, I thought I'd run it by you (in addition to getting another motu-release ack).  If you have a moment, please look at Bug #192205.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 192205 in ubuntu "pyClamd : Clamav with python needed to replace functions removed from python-clamav" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/192205
<ScottK2> slangasek: It's a very simple one file python module, so I don't think it will be hard to New, but thought I should check.
<slangasek> ScottK2: yeah, that looks reasonable to me
<RainCT> should the maintainer field be updated for SRU's?
<frafu> ScottK2: thanks for the reply; now I know that it is not because I have missed to do something (for example asking for its reintegration because I previously got a buildfailure due to a missing dependency that was not yet available for the corresponding architecture)
<frafu> persia: thanks for the explanation about the meaning of the number 355
<slangasek> RainCT: you mean for an SRU of a package that was previously synced?
<RainCT> slangasek: yes
<ScottK2> slangasek: Thanks.
<slangasek> RainCT: yes, it should
<RainCT> slangasek: thanks
<jpatrick> how do I use diffstat? manpage isn't very good, do I compare dirs or what?
<slangasek> jpatrick: you feed it a diff on stdin, typically
<jpatrick> slangasek: that only gives me changes in debian/
<slangasek> jpatrick: "feed it a diff" - meaning, whatever you want to see the diffstat of, you generate the diff in the appropriate manner and feed it to diffstat
<jpatrick> slangasek: ok, ah, now I see
<slangasek> so that could be zcat $package_$version.diff.gz, or it could be debdiff $package_*.dsc, or diff -uNr $package_$upstream1/ $package_$upstream2/, etc
<txwikinger> what the matter with http://qa.ubuntuwire.com?
<jpatrick> slangasek: now, I've got it
<ScottK2> txwikinger: Server's down.  Not sure until when.
<txwikinger> Ah... I hoped it was not me :)
<RainCT> txwikinger: that's evil :D
<ScottK2> It's not you.
<txwikinger> RainCT: I need to become more evil ;)
<RainCT> DktrKranz: ah, candidate uploaded :)
<DktrKranz> great, thanks
<hellboy195>  Are monodevelop (1.0 release soon) or/and mono 1.9 release (also in a few days/weeks) important enough for a FF exception?
<promag> I have a php project which is a website. whats the best approach to package it? how can I add the virtual host?
 * RainCT just realized he has patched a .desktop file that is inside debian/ (with a patch system) and runs with the head against the wall :P
<pochu> hellboy195: ask slomo_ :)
<pochu> RainCT: lol
<hellboy195> slomo_: ping. question above ^^
<hellboy195> pochu: thx :)
<\sh> I hate patches from upstream which are not clean
<persia> \sh: That is why distributions have maintainers...
<\sh> promag: include a file in /etc/apache2/sites-available/<websitename> with the correct configuration
<LaserJock> RainCT: lol
<\sh> promag: but I wouldn't install it like this...because the configuration of the website in general is the job ob the sysadmin...and not of the package and not of a website designer ;)
<\sh> promag: the configuration should be held in svn or bzr or whatever vcs but not in a package
<RainCT> btw, Debian is going to remove ttf-bitstream-vera. Is the same planned for Hardy?
<ScottK2> RainCT: Why?
<LaserJock> in favor of dejavu perhaps?
<RainCT> yep
<persia> I'd suggest wating for the Debian removal to be complete, and then looking at a removal.  It may be worth spending some time testing the results of adjusting dependencies to make that possible in the meantime.
<LaserJock> I was looking at fonts the other day and it seemed like they were all the same
<pochu> hellboy195: or bigon
<ScottK2> At this point I'd suggest unless there's a strong reason to remove it, we should let it be.
<pochu> later folks
<hellboy195> pochu: k, next try ^^
<\sh> oh well....
<persia> pochu: If you have some time this weekend, please ping me re: gstreamer-midi.  I need help :)
<\sh> wine will bang..I mean it's already banging like hell...but after that ;)
<hellboy195> bigon: ping
<LaserJock> Fujitsu: I emailed debian about python-scipy and it looks like we should have a version built on gfortran shortly
<hellboy195> \sh: whats going on with wine? :)
<\sh> hellboy195: there are some reports on winehq which tells me, that dejavu is still missing some important parts regarding other glyphs then latin1 etc. so all kyrillic and japanese stuff will break, that's why they are not sure to bundle dejavu with wine in this very moment..
<ScottK2> LaserJock: I was looking into pulling their changes from svn and making an update to our package, but it can wait if you think we should.
<\sh> hellboy195: and after looking into the crashing of wine, I'm not sure if it's wine or some other lib which is giving this result
<hellboy195> \sh: k. thx for the info :)
<\sh> hellboy195: and wine is really hard to debug, in the normal sense of debugging ;) gdb just failes
<hellboy195> \sh: yeah. interesting piece of software :)
<\sh> bah...what was the gcc switch to disable the stack-protector?
<ScottK2> bddebian: Are you going to fix the testresources FTBFS?
<\sh> -no-fstack-protector   that was it
<\sh> just trying to rebuild it
<ScottK2> \sh: Once you get WINE fixed up, how about we do a backport of it?  It's easier to find a core-dev interested in backports these days.
<\sh> ScottK2: well, first of all it needs to be fixed...and really, I'm not sure if it's wine or something else (glibc or whatever)
<\sh> but as there was no glibc update after last wine upload..
<ScottK2> Let's discuss it when you think it's ready.
 * \sh fixes cacti in the meantime
<\sh> hmmm...is it still valuable to make updates for edgy?
<ScottK2> \sh: My Hardy box still has the previous WINE version on it if there's any testing I could do that would help.
<ScottK2> \sh: I'd be inclined to call it a very low priority.  It goes out of support in ~2 months.
<DktrKranz> \sh, if you have fixes for other supported releases, you could consider one for edgy too, otherwise, keep it low prio.
<ScottK2> Odds of getting it tested and into -updates before the release expires are probably low.
<hellboy195> DktrKranz: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=465986
<ubotu> Debian bug 465986 in wmxres "wmxres: missing build-dependency: libxext-dev" [Normal,Open]
<DktrKranz> hellboy195, \o/
<hellboy195> DktrKranz: ?
<DktrKranz> it worked :)
<hellboy195> DktrKranz: look at it and tell me if the whole bug report is ok ;)
<DRebellion> FF is over, but i heard that new packages can still be added to 'hardy+1' or backports or something. Could someone please explain this?
<DktrKranz> hellboy195, it seems, even if Debian does not need our DebianMaintainerField change, but our change is reported.
<HighNo> DRebellion: Hardy+1 is the next release
<hellboy195> DktrKranz: k
<HighNo> DRebellion: if it is added there it might be ported to the older versions via the backports team
<DRebellion> HighNo, ah i see. I have a new (not in debian/ubuntu) package to contribute to ubuntu. So could I upload it for hardy+1 now?
<slangasek> DRebellion: it's not possible to add packages to 'hardy+1' until a) it has a proper name, b) hardy itself is released.
<HighNo> DRebellion: I am new too :-) I came "just in time"
<DRebellion> :(
<jpatrick> DRebellion: no, hardy+1 is not open for a long time
<slangasek> DRebellion: on the other hand, if it's a completely new package it will have to go through a review process by the MOTU anyway, so you needn't wait idly in the meantime :)
<HighNo> slangasek: I didn't know that. is that because the name would be needed for the package's control file (among other reasons...)?
<ScottK2> OTOH, bug fixing and testing are very good ways to learn packaging, so you've shown up at a perfect time to learn.
<slangasek> HighNo: well, until hardy+1 has a name, it doesn't exist in the launchpad config, so there's no archive to upload it to
<ScottK2> It's actually possible that if you put yourself to work, learn fast, and do well, you may be MOTU when there is a Hardy +1 and you upload it yourself.
<HighNo> slangasek: OK, but I guess uploading to REVU would still be possible?
<slangasek> HighNo: correct
<ScottK2> HighNo: Possible, but pointless.
<HighNo> :-)
<slangasek> ScottK2: well, it gets feedback, no?
<slangasek> or maybe not :)
<DRebellion> Well, I guess I'll just hold onto the packge until 8.04 comes by :|
<jpatrick> HighNo: you could try getting it into Debian and syncing it across later
<kdub> how do you upload to revu?
<jpatrick> kdub: https://wiki.kubuntu.org/MOTU/Packages/REVU
<HighNo> DRebellion: start studying the package guides... I took the fast (but hard) lane but doing as ScottK suggested will definetly help you. Start by fixing bugs in packages - you have plenty of time to try :-)
<HighNo> jpatrick: right - that would be another way though I haven't heard of a 'fast debian package integration' before - so I think it is unlikely to get it into debian before hardy+1 accepts packages
<kdub> jpatrick: all you upload is the .changes file?
<DRebellion> kdub, you specify the .changes file to dput and it will upload the nessecary files.
<jpatrick> kdub: yes, and it pulls everything else with it
<kdub> ah, alright
<jpatrick> HighNo: http://mentors.debian.net will help you and #debian-mentros @ OTFC
<RainCT> ScottK2: what do you prefer for pyclamd: native, lp branch...?
<\sh> kdub: important you give dput the *_source.changes file and not the *_<arch>.changes file
<jpatrick> #debian-mentors*
<HighNo> ScottK: btw, bugfixing... I tried to do it with the cherrypy bug you mentioned like earlier this week. I could only do it for feisty so far - what is the next thing? can anyone have a lok at that debdiff file to check if I did things correct?
<HighNo> jpatrick: I'll try later. I think I delegated the debian packaging to the 'debian packaging bug' creator
<kdub> \sh: i will keep that in mind
<RainCT> HighNo: You'll definitely get it into Debian before Hardy+1 if you want, it isn't that difficult :)
<HighNo> jpatrick: hm, is that channel on freenode? because there are 5 people in there, 1 is a bot, 1 is me... See what I mean - 3 vs. 223 ppl ? I like Ubuntu :-)
<ScottK2> RainCT: Debian source package
<HighNo> RainCT: Actually that's just what I heard but you know rumors...
<ScottK2> HighNo: It's on OFTC
<ScottK2> HighNo: Yes.  Ask attach the debdiff to the bug and then subscribe ubuntu-universe-sponsors to get it reviewed
<RainCT> ScottK2: ?
<jpatrick> HighNo: /connect irc.oftc.net
<RainCT> ScottK2: native? or what do you mean?
<HighNo> jpatrick: got it now :-)
<ScottK2> RainCT: You asked me what format I wanted for pyclamd.  What I want is a regular (non-native) debian source package (.dsc, diff.gz, and orig.tar.gz)
<sistpoty> anyone who minds some downtime of REVU right now?
 * ScottK2 would prefer it actually.
<ScottK2> sistpoty: While you're here, would you please ack Bug #192205
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 192205 in ubuntu "pyClamd : Clamav with python needed to replace functions removed from python-clamav" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/192205
<RainCT> ScottK2: upstream releases just a single .py. repackaging then?
<slangasek> jpatrick: aka 'irc.debian.org' for those purposes
<ScottK2> RainCT: Yes
<jpatrick> slangasek: same thing in the end
<ScottK2> RainCT: Then you can include the license file and the changelog with it.
<HighNo> /connect irc.debian.org
<HighNo> hehe
<HighNo> ooops
<ScottK2> RainCT: Then the instructions for use on the web site would make good content for a man page.
<HighNo> gaim seems somewhat limited ...
<sistpoty> ScottK2, RainCT: acked
<ScottK2> RainCT: If you run out of time, let me know.
<ScottK2> sistpoty: Thanks.
<sistpoty> ScottK2: anything else I need to do (bug status or s.th.)?
<RainCT> ScottK2: what should the version number be? YYYYMMDD-ds1-<...>? (just seen that ds in another package, is that right?)
<ScottK2> sistpoty: No.  Normally you set them to confirmed, but since RainCT already has it in progress, no point in it.
<sistpoty> ok
<ScottK2> RainCT: 0.1.1 from his changelog: http://xael.org/norman/python/pyclamd/CHANGELOG
<RainCT> ScottK2: ah, ok. but with -ds or what else?
<ScottK2> RainCT: Why -ds?
<RainCT> ScottK2: don't I need to add anything if I repack?
<ScottK2> Since this is packing, not repacking, I think not.  What you need to do is document how you constructed the tarball in debian/copyright.
<ScottK2> RainCT: ^^
<RainCT> heh
<RainCT> ok, thx
<\sh> oh heaven
<sistpoty> \sh: what's up?
<\sh> sistpoty: well, wine is hurting me a lot
<sistpoty> oh
<\sh> sistpoty: actually it's not wine, but something which is triggering wine crashes
<Yasumoto> Heya guys, I'm following along with the Packaging Guide, and when I run "sudo pbuilder build ../*.dsc" I get this error:
<Yasumoto> gzip: debian/tmp/usr/share/man: No such file or directory
<sistpoty> persia: just saw your upload of nvidia-settings... did you also add conflicts?
<sistpoty> (wanted to do this yesterday, but -ENOTIME :(=
<HighNo> ScottK - did you get my lines on Bug #191198 ?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 191198 in python-cherrypy "[python-cherrypy] [CVE-2008-0252] missing input sanitising, remote vulnerability" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/191198
<RainCT> how can I delete (within a script) everything from the start of a file until it reaches a certain line (checking by content, not line number)
<RainCT> ?
<LaserJock> ScottK: sorry, was afk, were you talking about scipy?
<ScottK2> LaserJock: Just that I'd been looking at the changes in the Debian svn and considering updating our package.
<ScottK2> HighNo: Did you add your debdiff to the bug and subscribe UUS?
<HighNo> ScottK: I think yes
<LaserJock> ScottK2: well, i don't think it matters if we wait for Debian, I just think we should do it before release :-)
<ScottK2> LaserJock: OK.
<HighNo> ScottK: but as I mentioned, I have done that for feisty only - though the fix should work with all versions...
<ScottK2> HighNo: Then please make debdiffs for the other versions too.  You can at least make them and test build them using pbuilder.
<RainCT> ScottK2: did you indeed mean manpage or rather a file in /usr/share/doc/python-pyclamd/?
<ScottK2> RainCT: Yes.  I think a man page is the preferred method.
<ScottK2> RainCT: I'm willing to discuss it.
<RainCT> ScottK2: do you have some example manpage (to see how it looks, not the code)?
<sladen> RainCT: they'll be a better way, but    grep -A999999 foobar file
<ScottK2> RainCT: How about pyspf source package?
<RainCT> sladen: great, thanks :)
 * LaserJock attempts a bzr branch of Debian's scipy
<RainCT> ScottK2: (I'm away for 20 minutes)
<ScottK2> K
<ScottK2> LaserJock: From svn or the package?
<LaserJock> svn
<ScottK2> OK.
<LaserJock> neato, it worked
<ScottK2> Cool
<LaserJock> my gosh the python-modules svn has a lot of packages
<ScottK2> Yes.  It's a pretty big repo (last I counted it was over 200)
<LaserJock> how many DD sponsor it?
<sistpoty> persia: I'm still unsure about the "virtual package support" thingy... imo it might work for the l-r-m upgrade path, but most probably it would lead to problems on fresh installed (which could then be worked around...)
 * \sh goes off
<\sh> good night
<hellboy195> \sh_away: hf
<sistpoty> persia: since there are file conflicts, I'm adding the (very defensive) conflicts now to nvidia-settings, and also add an alternate recommends, together with correct version numbers...
<sistpoty> persia: hopefully nvidia-glx won't be virtual package, otherwise I don't have a clue about fixing the upgrade path... maybe you do?
<ScottK2> LaserJock: two regularly and a few others from time to time.
<ScottK2> LaserJock: It's generally very easy to get sponsored
<LaserJock> ScottK: wow, that's not very many though
<ScottK2> LaserJock: There is also Debina Python Applications Team for Python apps.
<LaserJock> I suppose now having DMs helps
<ScottK2> Yes.
<ScottK2> They're pretty efficient and expend a fair amount of time on it.
<ScottK2> RainCT and pochu can vouch for it.
<LaserJock> ScottK2: is there a core python team that looks after python itself
<LaserJock> ?
 * RainCT is back
<ScottK2> LaserJock: Yes, but I'm not familiar the details of it.
 * RainCT agrees that the python-apps/python-modules team is great
<RainCT> ScottK2: hm.. I'm being unsure if it's even necessary to include the documentation separatly.. exactly the same is available as docstrings
<RainCT> ScottK2: so python -c "import pyclamd; help(pyclamd)" shows it all :)
<ScottK2> RainCT: OK.  Fair enough.
<ScottK2> RainCT: The reporter of the bug I'm trying to resolve with this new package says you need to change the socket location for clamd in python-clamd for Ubuntu.  FYI.
<Fujitsu> LaserJock: Very good. Thanks.
<sistpoty> any gnome user with a nvidia card around, who'd like to test a debdiff for sensors-applet?
<NorthernLights> Hello all
<NorthernLights> I've uploaded a package (gtkvncviewer 0.2) half an hour ago, and it doesn't show up on revu. Should i upload it again ?
<sistpoty> NorthernLights: let me check (revu was down due to a dist-upgrade)
<NorthernLights> yes i saw that right after my upload the web site was down
<sistpoty> NorthernLights: nothing in any queue... so if it's not there, you'll need to upload again
<NorthernLights> ok, i'm uploading again then, thank you
<sistpoty> NorthernLights: however we're in feature freeze now, so don't expect it to get much attention (and you'll need to file a feature freeze exception)
<NorthernLights> yeah... i noticed that when entering the channel
<NorthernLights> i'm leaving, thanks again
<ScottK2> RainCT: Starting in ~15 minutes I'll be AFK for some time.  Any questions before I go?  If you get the package done, link me a .dsc for it and I'll have a look later.
<RainCT> why doesn't this work ${VERSION##*-}? :'(
<RainCT> (in debian/rules)
<slangasek> because debian/rules is make, and that's shell syntax?
<RainCT> slangasek: any idea how I could do that then?
<sistpoty> $(shell thatthingwithdollaresacped)?
<RainCT> then I don't have $VERSION there
<slangasek> RainCT: not without more context
<sistpoty> RainCT: you have $VERSION there... (which gets replaced by make before getting passed to the shell)
<sistpoty> or rather $(VERSION=
<sistpoty> hrmpf... $(VERSION)
<sistpoty> but that thing looks pretty much like a bashism to me anyway, right?
<RainCT> uhm.. and now why am I trying ${VERSION##*-} if what I want is exactly everything except that? what a day.. lol
<RainCT> slangasek: how can I get the upstream version number from the changelog?
<RainCT> sistpoty: it's POSIX
<sistpoty> RainCT: d'oh
<sistpoty> RainCT: SOMEVAR=$(eval head debian/changelog -1 | cut -d '(' -f 2 | cut -d ')' -f 1)
<sistpoty> RainCT: maybe? (didn't try it though)
<slangasek> eew cut
<slangasek> :)
<RainCT> I have VERSION=$(shell dpkg-parsechangelog | grep --max-count=1 -F "Version:" | cut -d" " -f2)
<RainCT> but I don't know how to get only upstream version number
<sistpoty> RainCT: err.. replace the eval with shell... /me is also mixing shell and make again
<RainCT> as it might have more than one -
<sistpoty> RainCT: add a | cut -d'-' -f -1 (or s.th.)?
<slangasek> dpkg-parsechangelog | sed -n -e'/^ / { s/.*(\(.*\)).*/\1/; s/-[^-]*$//; p; q }'
<sistpoty> wow
<RainCT> o_O
<slangasek> well, you can use head and cut if you prefer, but why fork if you don't have to :-)
<RainCT> slangasek: have you patented this? :P
<slangasek> uh? :)
<slangasek> it's just a bit of sed
<slangasek> if you know you always have a debian revision for the package in question, you can reduce the two s// to one
<RainCT> uhm... but it doesn't work here VERSION=$(shell dpkg-parsechangelog | sed -n -e'/^ / { s/.*(\(.*\)).*/\1/; s/-[^-]*$//; p; q }')
<sistpoty> RainCT: why do you want to find out the upstream version anyways? maybe just for an get-orig-source rule?
<RainCT> sistpoty: yes
<slangasek> RainCT: you have to double the $ within a makefile
<sistpoty> RainCT: oh, I made one once for trigger (depending on a watch file)... which should always give you the latest version.. must be somewhere (either in the archive or on LP)
<RainCT> slangasek: oh, works now. thanks!
<dcordero> hi
<sistpoty> RainCT: I guess "uscan --dehs" might be useful, too ;)
<RainCT> sistpoty: it has no watch file
<RainCT> (upstream just releases a .py)
<sistpoty> oh, heh
 * LaserJock starts a server install, how exciting ;)
<ScottK2> Shouldn't take long.
 * sistpoty is off to bed... gn8
<LaserJock> anybody have any good recommendations for a FS for a 500GB backup drive?
<LaserJock> should plain-old ext3 work fine?
<jdong> LaserJock: my general policy is unless you have a REALLY REALLY good reason to choose another FS, go with ext3
<jdong> LaserJock: it's not the fastest or most advanced, but it definitely has the most followers and most people to bail you out should you get into FS-hell
<LaserJock> hmm, so no reiserfs? ;-)
<jdong> LaserJock: well he has bail problems himself ;-)
<RainCT> ScottK2: is python-clamav still useful or does this replace it?
<RainCT> well, good night
<LaserJock> hmmpf
<LaserJock> anybody know how to bail out of the text installer?
<selckin> :q!
<LaserJock> I thought it'd be C-x C-c
<selckin> i have no idea :)
<Fujitsu> LaserJock: Reset button? Why would an OS installer have a cancel button?
<Yasumoto> Heya guys, I'm following along with the Packaging Guide, and when I run "sudo pbuilder build ../*.dsc" I get this error:
<Yasumoto> gzip: debian/tmp/usr/share/man: No such file or directory
<LaserJock> Fujitsu: I just want to "go back"
<LaserJock> Fujitsu: I selected the wrong network device and now the installer is "stuck" on setting up the mirrors
<LaserJock> I was hoping to avoid having to reinstall
<Fujitsu> Ah, it should give up after a few minutes.
<Fujitsu> I've struck that a few times when the .au mirror has been down during installation.
<Fujitsu> If not, killing a couple of apt-gets might fix it.
#ubuntu-motu 2008-02-16
<LaserJock> it's been sitting here for like 20 minutes
<LaserJock> I'm just gonna start over
<selckin> alt-f something should give you a console, try killing something
<LaserJock> ah hah
<LaserJock> I had to kill debian-installer and start a new one up
<LaserJock> now we're cookin'
<DarkMageZ> jdong, any chance of backporting libgpod 0.6 to gutsy and building amarok against that? missing support for new ipods ã
<isaac> DarkMageZ: isn't that done already?
<isaac> in the ipod-touch ppa?
<DarkMageZ> oh. yay for ppa ã
<isaac> https://launchpad.net/~ipod-touch/+archive
<isaac> there
<DarkMageZ> tho realistically i think it should atleast be in backports so it's findable
<pochu> persia: I will.
<jdong> DarkMageZ: I believe I responded to one of those tickets reasoning that it cannot be done in a safe and not intrusive manner for -backports
<jdong> for now I'd have to recommend the ipod-touch PPA too
 * Hobbsee waves
<persia> Hey Hobbsee
<RAOF> Hey Hobbsee, persia.
<RAOF> What was this abount: " persia)) RAOF: How familiar do you need?"
 * persia misses ubuntulog
<RAOF> persia: I looked in backscroll, but that didn't seem to help much :)
<persia> My vague memory was that you had asked "Is someone familiar with foo", and someone more familiar also volunteered, and said something, but it may be a case if missed nick completion.
 * LaserJock goes to read the FF exception wiki pages
<RAOF> Actually, yes.  Now that I look at it.
<RAOF> Again.
<Hobbsee> oh yay, feature freeze should be done
<LaserJock> I hate it when I don't make the deadlines :(
<persia> Hobbsee: It's been frozen for a while.  About 3 hours late here, and maybe 5 on #ubuntu-devel, and possibly even more on ubuntu-devel-announce, but fairly solidly at this point.
<LaserJock> one of the things I dislike about Ubuntu development, it's so fast there's always a deadline looming :-)
 * minghua simply hates deadlines, whether he makes it or not.
<persia> LaserJock: There's two ways to think about it: either the deadlines for getting things done, or the freeze times as windows to relax because you don't need to finish the feature for another 10 weeks or so.
<LaserJock> persia: what are you feelings on getting a MOTU ack for NEW packages if it's just switching packaging?
<Hobbsee> persia: i'm on VAC.
<LaserJock> I'm afraid no one is gonna wanna look at these packages
 * Hobbsee has been on VAC since the 13th
<persia> LaserJock: How do you mean?  I'm happy to give a generalised answer, but need either more context, or a specific example from which to generalise.
<LaserJock> ok, so I'm redoing the squeak packages from Multiverse
<LaserJock> they all have different names so they need to go through NEW
<LaserJock> but it's just different packaging, not different sources
<LaserJock> do I need a MOTU review?
<persia> LaserJock: Can you do it in such a way that it is binary NEW but not source NEW?
<LaserJock> kinda
<LaserJock> but that would defeat the purpose
<LaserJock> I'm trying to sync up with "official" packages
<LaserJock> but it's 5 new source packages :/
<persia> Ah.  We have odd orig.tar.gz files, and you're fixing that, but to do so you need new source packages?
<LaserJock> well, the problem originates because Debian doesn't have it
<Hobbsee> i would have thought that source name changes shouldn't have to go thru again
<Hobbsee> that being siad, running a diff thru the entire source wouldn't be hard
<LaserJock> we originally got the packages from some Spansih distro back in like hoary/breezy
<Hobbsee> or is it more than a name change?
<Hobbsee> oh, the crack...the crack...
<persia> I'm not convinced just changing a source package name needs MOTU ACK (although I think it needs FFe at this point), but getting another person to take a look might be a good idea, just in case there is some oddity in the upgrade or install path.
<LaserJock> but there's actual a couple guys that maintain the official "unofficial" packages now
<LaserJock> and our old packages were not the best
<LaserJock> but they use a different naming scheme
<LaserJock> well, the upgrade is totally screwed
<LaserJock> I gotta figure out something
<LaserJock> but I wanted to get something in the archive first
<persia> LaserJock: I think that's the point of FeatureFreeze: at this point you have to figure it out before putting it in the archive.  Maybe playing with a PPA could help?
<LaserJock> hmmpf
<LaserJock> well, I guess since I missed the deadline I might as well spend a couple more weeks working on upgradability
<LaserJock> I'm just so sick of these packages
<persia> I suspect motu-release will be failrly lenient through Alpha 6 soft-freeze or so, but I'm just guessing.  I'm also assuming that the package shuffle will fix a number of real bugs.
<LaserJock> yes
<LaserJock> I'll kill of around 10 bugs
<LaserJock> *off
<LaserJock> and OLPC people want the packages
<LaserJock> although I'm a little annoyed that OLPC is using this stuff since it's non-free
<persia> There you have it then.  Just keep fighting it, and when you're done, ask for an FFe.  I did a bunch of exceptions for gutsy, and as long as they remained somewhat sane, never had an issue with approval.
<LaserJock> there's nothing sane about squeak, but yeah
<LaserJock> ;-)
<Hobbsee> yay, insanity!
<ScottK> Hobbsee: Since you're on VAC, I gather motu-release should get itself organized without waiting for you?
<LaserJock> it took me several weeks to figure out the licensing
<persia> Ah.  s/remained somewhat sane/fixed verifiable bugs/ then.  Thinking about it, the aolserver4 mess wasn't actually sane either.
<LaserJock> In a single directory there was a LICENSE, COPYING, and COPYRIGHT file
<Hobbsee> ScottK: i'm back on wednesday
<LaserJock> and all 3 were different licenses
<Hobbsee> ScottK: that being said, i'm mostly around now
 * persia prefers upstreams who use better naming conventions when they have mixed-source licensing.
<ScottK2> Hobbsee: Did you read my proposal to the MOTU ML on bugfix only upstream releases?
<Hobbsee> ScottK2: i'm still sorting thru my *inbox*, let alone other mail.
<LaserJock> squeak is an opposite case of java
<LaserJock> the VM is GPL, but the language is non-free
<LaserJock> or something like that
 * Hobbsee is getting there...
<persia> Huh?  How can a language be non-free?
<ScottK2> Hobbsee: OK.  I think that's the only potential point of discussion.  I'd appreciate your feedback.
<LaserJock> persia: well, not the language itself
<LaserJock> I'm gonna confuse myself
<LaserJock> but there's these images that you run on the VM
<LaserJock> and those are non-free
<persia> LaserJock: Sounds like far too many Games packages.
<LaserJock> yeah, probably
<LaserJock> thing is, I don't have a clue about what this stuff is even for, and I don't really care
<LaserJock> makes packaging not as fun
<persia> Typical model for Games is to have separate (often repacked) sources for the free and non-free bits, to encourage people to generate free content.  Yes, annoying.
<ScottK2> Then why are you packaging it?
<LaserJock> user demand
<persia> ScottK: Also, repackaging: we already have squeak
<ScottK2> LaserJock: Users you particularly care about?
<LaserJock> and I once wrote a zenity script to start the bloody thing from the menu and I became the "maintainer"
<LaserJock> ScottK2: I guess
<ScottK2> Ah.  Touched it once and stuck with it forever.
<LaserJock> a lot of edu people like it
<LaserJock> yeah
<persia> Is it that much better than gnu-smalltalk?
<LaserJock> in fact that's something that I have to deal with for the upgrade path
<LaserJock> I wrote the script to do sane things
<LaserJock> sent it upstream
<LaserJock> but now they have a different script
<LaserJock> which works
<LaserJock> but works totally differently
<LaserJock> persia: I haven't a clue
<ScottK2> TheMuso: Are you still around?
<persia> LaserJock: If it's a mess and in multiverse, you might want to have a look.  If the free alternative is good enough, users are better served by redirection than maintenance.
<TheMuso> ScottK2: Yep.
<TheMuso> Do we wanna go somewhere to have a chat?
<ScottK2> TheMuso: I wanted to know what you thought about my proposal for bugfix only upstream releases?
<ScottK2> Do we need to?
<TheMuso> ScottK2: Probably no actually. Yeah I like your proposal.
 * persia doesn't see enough activity here to block a motu-release meeting
<TheMuso> fair enough
<LaserJock> heh, Randal Schwartz has a bit on GNU smalltalk vs. squeak
<LaserJock> he recommends not using GNU smalltalk because you can't contribute code to squeak
<ScottK2> persia: Additionally, I prefer discussion in public rather than private when feasible.
<TheMuso> nah its fine.
<TheMuso> ScottK2, Hobbsee, how are both of you for a general exception for ubuntustudio-* packages?
<persia> LaserJock: In that case, best of luck with your effort :)
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: fine with it.  they don't break anything else.
<Hobbsee> persia: motu-release meeting will have to wait till i get back :)
 * ScottK2 too, but It needs to be written and acked
<Hobbsee> ScottK2: so, write it.
<ScottK2> I think we need a wiki page listing the bugs for the general wave throughs.
<ScottK2> Hobbsee: If I cared about ubuntu-studio I would.
<persia> TheMuso: How about "flavour coordination packages maintained by the specific flavour team" rather than ubuntustudio-*
<Hobbsee> ScottK2: my only feedback is that it sounds like a good idea, but that people should be thinking about whether something is suitable before they sign it, and before they upload it automatically, rather than having to file a bug, encouraging them to actually use a brain.
<TheMuso> persia: Yeah that sound sreasonable.
<Hobbsee> ScottK2: but you do care about having a list
<ScottK2> Hobbsee: Yes.  I'll make the list.
<Hobbsee> good.
 * ScottK2 wants to put clamav on that list too.
<Hobbsee> fine.
<Hobbsee> just make sure you get the rdeps
<ScottK2> Yeah.  Hobbsee did you see I got clamav updated in Dapper (with all the rdpends)?
<ScottK2> I'm pretty thoroughly familiar with the rdepends now.
<persia> Given the complexity of clamav, and the number of rdeps, wouldn't it be better to get a second pair of eyes when updating?
<Hobbsee> nice work!
<Hobbsee> persia: we have to have it.  but, those interested in clamav might check it, sure
<ScottK2> persia: It will need some consideration, but we've got a small team of people working clamav and rdepends now.
<persia> Hobbsee: I'm just arguing against putting clamav on the wave-through list, as it likely gets one guaranteed motu-release ACK anyway.
<ScottK2> persia: Also I've got a good working relationship with the Debian maintainer too.
<persia> ScottK: That's what I thought: I just like to avoid things where a single person can push something through late in the cycle.
<Hobbsee> persia: if it's a guarenteed ack, and we have to have it, then what's the point in creating more red tape to put it thru?
<ScottK2> So given what I'd already do for a clamav update, I don't think a motu-release ack will add much.
<persia> Hobbsee: one guaranteed ACK.  One optional ACK.
<Hobbsee> persia: and the chances of anyone deciding to say "no, we don't want a security fix in our repos" is?
<ScottK2> persia: We updated Feisty less than a week before release and it was the right thing to do.  Unless the break the ABI at the last second, we're going to want it..
<persia> Hobbsee: Not rejecting completely, just saying something like "Umm..  I know you haven't slept in 72 hours, but I think you want a tighter versioned Conflicts: there".
<Hobbsee> persia: so you're suggesting starting to use 360 deg reviewing for all motu's - or at least for complex packages?
<persia> ScottK: I agree with the "we're going to want it", but like apps.  sistpoty and I have been playing ping-pong with a package finally getting it in shape over the past 12 hours just because we've had timezone skew.
<ScottK2> persia: If it was really close to the relase, I'd definitely get second looks.
<persia> Hobbsee: No, just suggesting that for a complex set of packages primarily watched by a member of motu-release, adding to the "free pass" list might be dangerous in case of over-commitment on the part of that person.
<ScottK2> If it's on the free pass list it doesn't matter if I'm on motu-release or not.
<persia> Ah.  True.  Maybe I'm arguing against putting complex packages with lots of rdepends on the free-pass list then.
<persia> (although you're all welcome to override me: there are reasons I didn't apply for the team)
<Hobbsee> persia: perhaps so
<ScottK2> Perhaps I'll put a "as long as there's no soname bump in libclamav" caveat in the request.
<LaserJock> run!
<bddebian> Heh
<bddebian> Heya gang
<crimsun_> 'lo
<bddebian> Hi crimsun_
<ScottK2> Heya
<CyberMatt> unmeat deps are a pain in the butt
<ScottK2> The unmet ones aren't so fun either.
<CyberMatt> lol
<bddebian> Hi ScottK
<ScottK2> Heya bddebian.
<ScottK2> bddebian: You see my ping about testresources?
<bddebian> ScottK2: No sorry, what's up?
<ScottK2> bddebian: Your fix from Debian ftbfs in Ubuntu.
<bddebian> Oh, it wasn't the buildd issue?
<ScottK2> Nope.  I asked for a give back and it died again.
<bddebian> Frick
<ScottK2> Over to you maestro.
<persia> Does anyone have grep-dctrl magic in their grimoire to recursively find all rdeps and rbuild-deps for all binary packages built by a given source package?
<bddebian> shiester
<bddebian> grep-dctrl -F Build-Depends "$1" -s Package /var/lib/apt/lists/*_Sources
<bddebian> Oh, never mind
<ScottK2> grep-dctrl -FBuild-Depends,Build-Depends-Indep,Depends -s Package $BINARYPACKAGENAME -n /var/lib/apt/lists/*_Sources
<ScottK2> Doesn't have the recursion though
<persia> ScottK2: Also looks for $BINARYPACKAGENAME, rather than pulling all the binary packages from the source package.  I suspect I'll need a bit of a pipelne, but will chase it.
<ScottK2> Yes.  It's not the answer to your question, but a step in the right direction.
<ScottK2> persia: I suspect if you get a reasonable answer to your question it'd be worth adding to devscripts.
<persia> ScottK2: Why?  It's a one-line shell script.  $BINARYPACKAGENAME can be replaced with an $() expression generating the list from the apt-cache.  The recursion is a bit more frustrating though.
<ScottK2> persia: For those of us who can't do the one line shell script.  The answer to your question is sufficiently non-trivial you asked rather than just doing it.  I think it qualifies.
 * ScottK2 has been wanting just such a think recently.
<persia> ScottK: I guess, but to me it's sufficiently trivial that it's not worth fighting with bzr.  I'll at least file it in a bug for consideration.
 * ScottK2 has also been wanting a --build-twice-in-a-row uption for pbuilder.
<ScottK2> persia: Agreed (about bzr).  If you put it in a bug, I suspect it'll get there.
<persia> Personally, I have a short list of nifty shell commands (like grep-dctrl -FBuild-Depends $(BINARY) -sPackage /var/lib/apt/lists/*hardy_universe_source_Sources, and was hoping others didi and would paste.
<LaserJock> does reverse-build-depends in ubuntu-dev-tools work?
<ScottK2> Maybe that's the answer
<persia> LaserJock: no /usr/bin/reverse-build-depends (although there is a manpage)
<ScottK2> Good night all.
<CyberMatt> question why doesn't firefox have Provides: iceweasel seems like a good idea we could squash a few unmet deps
<CyberMatt> or is there somthing I'm missing
<persia> CyberMatt: Ubuntu FireFox and Debian iceweasel aren't always in sync.  It's often better to look at things, and many should likely be using xulrunner by preference.
<Megaqwerty> Does anyone know what part of an apt repository apt-listchanges and update-manager pull changelogs from?
<persia> (of course, asking in #ubuntu-mozillateam would get an official answer)
<persia> Megaqwerty: I believe http://changelogs.ubuntu.com/
<persia> Megaqwerty: But I'm wrong: that seems the old way it was done.
<CyberMatt> ok i just wondering
<Megaqwerty> persia: alright. I'll keep looking. I'm basically trying to figure out if it's possible to implement the same thing in another apt repository, for obvious reasons.
<CyberMatt> there like three or four unmet deps on my list http://thegnuguru.org/stuff/hardy-unmet-deps.txt  (ubuntuwire is being slow) that result from iw instead of ff
<minghua> persia, CyberMatt: I'm rather sure apt-listchanges doesn't need netword access.
<minghua> Megaqwerty: ^^
<minghua> CyberMatt: Sorry for using the wrong nick.
<persia> minghua: Yes, but that's for already downloaded binary packages.  `aptitude changelog foo` downloads an updated changelog without downloading the package.
<CyberMatt> np
<persia> Megaqwerty: Check the aptitude source for the answer, or possibly even the aptitude changelog
<Megaqwerty> persia: I was just going to say that ;)
<Megaqwerty> persia: thanks
<minghua> persia: Yes, I'm just saying they use different sources.
<Megaqwerty> minghua: that's good, because I couldn't figure it out from the apt-listchanges.py file ;)
<persia> minghua: Ah.  Right :)
<CyberMatt> so to unbreak iceweasl and icedove deps all that needs to be done is to depend on xulrunner instead
<persia> CyberMatt: Depending on the reason for the dep, one of xulrunner, xulrunner1.9, or some set of browsers is correct.
<persia> In some cases, the package further needs a rebuild to link against the correct libraries (xulrunner1.9 is preferred in these cases, I believe: seek confirmation on #ubuntu-mozillateam)
<CyberMatt> persia, thanks
<persia> bddebian: I'm pulling WX2.4 patches today, and ran into a FTBFS for survex.  Have you tried these before, or should I just dig into them myself?
<bddebian> persia: An FTBFS with my patch?
<bddebian> Oh, survex
<bddebian> Did it ever get applied?
<persia> Ah.  You've seen it before then? (trying yours now...)
<persia> Not in Debian, but I'm not waiting any more, as I want to drop wx2.4 before the freeze gets too hard.
<LaserJock> bddebian: do you actually have a Debian install?
<bddebian> LaserJock: I do since I started doing games team stuff :-)
 * persia notes that bddebian is responsible for at least 60% of the improvements to the games for hardy (judging by list volume)
<LaserJock> bddebian: do you run unstable?
<LaserJock> hmm, I wonder if they speak much english in Prague
<bddebian> LaserJock: That's all I've ever run :-)
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: i was wondering that. you're going?
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: i can't imagine they have too many czech speakers around ubuntu
<LaserJock> Hobbsee: well, I just don't know
<LaserJock> it's kind of a bad time for me
<persia> LaserJock: There's a large expat community, and a fair amount of local study, but as long as you remember to always answer "No" when offered a drink, you'll be fine.
<LaserJock> but I didn't go to Boston
<LaserJock> persia: you been there?
<persia> (for those not familiar with Czech, "No" is the appropriate pronunciation of the bare affirmative)
<persia> LaserJock: Yes.
<Hobbsee> right then.
 * Hobbsee is enlightened.
 * CyberMatt thinks he would never in the Czech Rupublic
<CyberMatt> live*
<persia> CyberMatt: Why?  Nice place.  Good robots.  Flexible night buses.  Best clock in the world.
<Hobbsee> persia: is there anywhere you *havent* lived?
<persia> Hobbsee: Yes.  Lots of places :p
<LaserJock> I doubt it
<CyberMatt> It'd be to confusing
<Hobbsee> antarctica?
<Hobbsee> iceland?
 * persia has never been to at least two continents
<Hobbsee> and mars.
<LaserJock> I've been outside the US for 4 weeks altogether, 2 weeks in Mexico, 1 week in Paris, 1 week in Sevilla
<Hobbsee> impressive
<LaserJock> hmm, that's kinda cool/sad (depending on how you look at it), half of my "outside the US" experience has been for UDSs
<persia> LaserJock: Which free software conference took you to Mexico?
<LaserJock> none
<LaserJock> that's my non-UDSs trip
<LaserJock> when I was like 13
<LaserJock> I would have liked to have made Debconf in Mexico perhaps
<LaserJock> have they done a debconf in the US
<LaserJock> ?
<persia> bddebian: Do you have newpki_wx2.6_3.diff somewhere accessible to wget?
<persia> bddebian: Never mind.  Quoting helped :)
<bddebian> persia: You might have to run that through dos2unix
 * Hobbsee goes back on vac
 * Hobbsee hopes any other decisions will wait till she gets back
 * persia installs tofrodos, and wonders how a patch in the BTS needs dos2unix to apply
<bddebian> Because I sent it through my windows box ;-P
<StevenK> persia: flip!
<persia> StevenK: ?
<Megaqwerty> persia: Well, I finally found it in the debian/patch/04_changelog.dpatch you were right, changelogs are pulled from http://changelogs.ubuntu.com
<persia> StevenK: OOh.  Much better.  Thanks.
<persia> Megaqwerty: Ah.  Good.  I was confused by the dates from http://changelogs.ubuntu.com/changelogs/
<Megaqwerty> I've seen this now in c and python, so I've got to ask, does anyone know the significance of "%s" ?
<persia> bddebian: Doesn't apply even with dos2unix or filp :(
<persia> Megaqwerty: man printf
<bddebian> Gah, WTF
<Megaqwerty> persia: thanks!
<Megaqwerty> persia: am I blind? I don't see it mentioned there.
<LaserJock> man this squeak stuff doesn't make any sense
<persia> Megaqwerty: Sorry.  `man -S 3 printf` under "conversion specifier"
 * persia didn't know there was a coreutils printf, and is abashed
<LaserJock> the -sources package contains a single file, which is all the code for a series
<LaserJock> and then there are .changes which are a diff against -sources
<Megaqwerty> persia: bah, "No manual entry for printf"
<Megaqwerty> persia: Is there an online manpage for it?
<bddebian> Are recommends getting installed now?
<persia> Megaqwerty: Either install manpages-dev or do a web search for "man printf".
<Megaqwerty> persia: danke
<persia> bddebian: Ought be.  It was on the feature list for hardy, and we're past FF, although it may be late (I've not been tracking the spec)
<persia> LaserJock: Just like orig.tar.gz and diff.gz, no?
<LaserJock> persia: well kinda
<LaserJock> which is a bit unusual for an upstream
<LaserJock> all the source in a single file
<LaserJock> easy to package though :-)
<persia> Maybe licensing issues prevent direct modification of the file?  Also, all source in one file was once popular, although that is often considered the dark ages these days...
<LaserJock> no, license is fairly open
<LaserJock> the 1 file is 14MB
<LaserJock> it maybe just historical
<LaserJock> *may be
<bddebian> Is there any way to use --force all with apt or is that dpkg only??
<persia> bddebian: apt-get --force-yes might help, but it is somewhat dangerous...
<persia> The (cleaner) alternative is to use `aptitude download foo` and then `dpkg --force-quux foo_baz.deb.
<persia> (By "dangerous", I mean, "Could leave the system is an unbootable and unrunnable state")
<bddebian> persia: Pfft, that's hardly dangerous ;-P
 * persia misses the IBM 5150, when "dangerous" meant "could cause permanent physical damage to surrounding people and objects"
<bddebian> heh
<LaserJock> the use of DH_COMPAT in debian/rules is deprecated isn't it?
<bddebian> yep
<persia> LaserJock: Replaced by debian/compat
<LaserJock> hmm, I wouldn't think I'd need configure-stamp and build-stamp rules if I'm not configuring or building anything
<persia> LaserJock: Nope.
<LaserJock> this is silly to have such a large debian/rules when *all* it is is cp'ing a single file
<persia> (but packages should build from source, for some definition of build)
<LaserJock> :-)
<persia> LaserJock: Use CDBS, include debhelper, and put the file in debian/install.  Four lines total for rules, compat, and install.
<minghua> The only required targets are clean, build, binary-arch, binary-indep, and binary.
<LaserJock> persia: yeah, I might do that and send it upstream to see if they'll take it
<Megaqwerty> Okay, MOTU question. How can I get involved? Also, this would be something I'd only be able to do in my free time between school and homework, so is it even a good idea for me to help out knowing I won't always have time to participate? (Currently I just package for getdeb.net in my spare time simply because it was pretty easy to figure out how everything there worked.)
<persia> Megaqwerty: Best way is to help fix bugs and close release targets.
<persia> When you have a fix, attach a debdiff for your new candiate version to a bug, and subscribe the sponsors to request upload.
<persia> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing has more (but could use a refresh)
<persia> When you have questions, ask here.
<persia> Current big targets are unmetdeps and NBS, although bugfixes are always welcome.
<Megaqwerty> persia: I haven't finished learning programming yet, just packaging. Is there anything in that realm?
<persia> Also, if you come from getdeb, you might be interested in new package preparation, although that won't really get going again until May, and various sorts of updates to previous releases (SRUs and backports)
<Megaqwerty> cool. Where on launchpad should I look for package update/creation requests?
<persia> Megaqwerty: Lots.  https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.tag=packaging is an incomplete list of bugs that only need packaging changes, and https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.tag=patch is an incomplete list of bugs for which someone else already prepared a patch, but the patch may need packaging or testing or something.
<Megaqwerty> persia: Awesome! Thanks. One more question, how do I subscribe the sponsors when done?
<persia> New packaging requests are listed from https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.tag=needs-packaging, and backports from https://bugs.launchpad.net/gutsy-backports/+bugs.  I recommend working on packaging bugfixes first, to get even more experience with all the different ways packages work before creating too many new packages.
<persia> Megaqwerty: The "subscribe someone else" link.  See the MOTU/Contributing link for some links to process docs, etc.
<Megaqwerty> persia: So it would be ubuntu-main-sponsors or ubuntu-universe-sponsors respectively?
<persia> Megaqwerty: Exactly.  UMS also handles restricted, and UUS also handles multiverse.
<persia> Note that we're in feature freeze, which means that some classes of bugs can't be closed now, and must be deferred until the next release, but there's still heaps of stuff to do for hardy.
<LaserJock> persia: dude, thanks for the cdbs recommendation
<LaserJock> I had two of those packages
<Megaqwerty> persia: Thanks a lot! Is there any obligation after you've submitted a new revision? Like...do I actively have to watch that package's main site for new versions, or actively watch for bugs that might affect the package I worked on? Or is this more of an, finish this task, and you're only really obligated to do something if you screwed up your specific task (i.e. forgot a build-dep or something.)
<persia> LaserJock: Just don't get addicted.  While CDBS is nice for packages that fall into certain common classes, remember that you can always fall back to a less intrusive use case once you start needing heaps of special variables and overrides, etc.  I find the debian/rules for sendmail to be an excellent argument against CDBS.
<persia> Megaqwerty: Generally it's a good idea to check bugs for a bit after you've submitted a new revision to make sure you didn't break anything.  Also, if you are the last uploader, you are responsible for merging the Debian changes for the next cycle.
<LaserJock> persia: oh, you don't have to convince me of that ;-)
<persia> If you concentrate on just a few packages that interest you, you may find watching them fun: it feels really good to close the last bug in a package, or get everything integrated with Debian.  If you concentrate on targets (e.g. unmetdeps, .desktop files, etc.) you may find that you only want to pay a little attention to each package after the update.
<Megaqwerty> persia: what does merging the Debian changes entail?
<persia> Megaqwerty: For example, let's say you work on a bug to fix a documetation issue in a manpage.
<persia> After you submit the debdiff to Ubuntu, you also send the manpage patch to Debian so they can also use it.  Unfortunately, the Debian maintainer was on holiday, but someone from the security team uploaded a security update (without your fix).
<mdomsch_> where can I find the version of lintian that's running on revu?
<mdomsch_> it seems to have newer checks than what's in hardy atm
<persia> At this point, you would work to make a new candidate that included both the fix from Debian, and your documentation patch.
<persia> mdomsch: Looking now...
<LaserJock> mdomsch_: hi ;-)
<mdomsch_> ah, maybe not
<crimsun_> it shouldn't be newer.  IIRC, it's backported.
<mdomsch_> I was running only on the deb, not the .dsc
<persia> mdomsch: REVU is currently running  1.23.32ubuntu1, and hardy has 1.23.42.  The host running REVU was upgraded recently, so the version generating the output you see might be something different than the 1.23.32ubuntu1 currently available.
<persia> Ah.  Yes, that would do it.  REVU only runs on the .dsc.
<Megaqwerty> persia: Oh well. It looks like it's going to be too much work for me (factoring in the school and homework.) I guess I'll just have to wait until I graduate to contribute. :(
<persia> Megaqwerty: Maybe.  Personally, I started because I had a bug on my local system that annoyed me, and I could fix it.  Even if you just upload the fixes for your own bugs, it would be a great help.  Merging only happens once a cycle, and if you don't have time, people are typically happy to help.
<persia> About 320 people have contributed to hardy so far, and most of them only had time for one or two updates.  Every bit helps.
<mdomsch_> boo hiss @ linda.  lintian complains I haven't upgraded Standards-Version, linda complains it's too new
<persia> mdomsch: linda reports that either you or she is wrong.  Is this case, it is her.
<mdomsch_> indeed
<AnAnt> Hello, what's u-u-s ?
<persia> AnAnt: Ubuntu-universe-sponsors.  The queue is visible from https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-universe-sponsors/+bugs
<minghua> Linda is more often wrong than right these days.
<persia> minghua: I haven't seen much bad advice from linda excepting the standards-version and the oddity about shlibs (although I grant there are a number of open bugs).  On the other hand, I find lintian to miss a number of things.
<LaserJock> I find I just need to run both
<minghua> persia: Yeah, I remember you giving some examples last time we talked about this.
<minghua> persia: But she's just not that useful to me anymore.  So I only run lintian these days.
<persia> LaserJock: That's my experience as well.
<persia> minghua: Maybe.  For my last package, I was lintian-clean from the start, but had a few linda issues to clean up.  Not having run linda would be a less good package.
<minghua> Sure, let's just just keep each one's own way of doing things, then.
<persia> minghua: Sure, and please feel free to fix anything you notice outstanding from something I've touched :)
 * minghua has too many bugs of his own to look at persia's packages, unfortunately. :-(
<persia> heh.  I only "have" two packages, most of my stuff is on various random packages.
<minghua> Actually, I haven't touched many Ubuntu packages recently, most of the stuff I've done in the past few months are Debian stuff.
<persia> Makes sense.  Lenny freeze is coming soon.  I expect we'll see you back a bit for hardy+1 and a fair amount for hardy+2.
 * minghua leaves for now, be back later.
<AnAnt> persia: oh, how are you ?
<persia> AnAnt: recovering.  You?
<AnAnt> persia: 2 ubuntme artwork packages are in repos now
<AnAnt> persia: thanks !
<persia> Should be three.  What is missing?
<AnAnt> persia: the third is still in queue
<persia> Also, Do you guys have an ubuntume-meta package pending?  We're past feature-freeze, but I think you'd want to submit it quick and ask for a freeze exception, as otherwise it will be hard to install ubuntume-desktop.
<AnAnt> persia: btw, is it late to request a sync from Debian ?
<AnAnt> persia: no, I still didn't start working on a ubuntume-meta
<AnAnt> persia: some ubuntume packages can't enter in Ubuntu repos yet anyways, due to unresolved copyright issues
<persia> AnAnt: syncs may be requested up through the end of the cycle, but the freeze rules apply.  If the changes meet the freeze guidelines, or there is a freeze exception, a sync is safe.
<AnAnt> persia: it's a request to add a package
<persia> Ah.  copyright can be frustrating.  I understand.  If hardy won't have ubuntume-desktop due to external dependencies, I guess we're looking at hardy+! :(
<persia> AnAnt: Is the package necessary for hardy in some way?
<AnAnt> persia: yes indeed, hardy+something !
<AnAnt> persia: I don't think so
<AnAnt> persia: it's sorta like, good to have
<persia> If you can, try for inclusion from May.  That gives the best chance of being able to have a clean install for the next release.
<AnAnt> ok
<persia> Ah.  "good to have" packages are unlikely to get freeze exceptions at this point, but you could request one if it was "really good to have".
<AnAnt> I see
<AnAnt> persia: another thing, I am making a package that makes use of update-alternatives
<AnAnt> persia: oops, wrong question
<persia> AnAnt: Make sure to work with the other providers for the alternatives to make sure you don't hit a conflict.  It can be frustrating if not everyone is using the same plan.
<AnAnt> persia: I got a problem with a postinst script  (http://pastebin.com/m2f1953e2)
<AnAnt> persia: it gives me an error when I install the package, hang on till I get it
<warp10> Good morning
<AnAnt> persia: here's the error:
<AnAnt> debconf: DbDriver "config": /var/cache/debconf/config.dat is locked by
<AnAnt> another process: Resource temporarily unavailable
<persia> AnAnt: That's not something I know about.  You might ask more generally, or send email to ubuntu-motu-mentors@ubuntu.com requesting help.
<AnAnt> Hello, can anyone help me with this postinst script: http://pastebin.com/m2f1953e2
<AnAnt> I am using debconf in it, and I got this error when I install the resulting deb file: debconf: DbDriver "config": /var/cache/debconf/config.dat is locked by another process: Resource temporarily unavailable
<LaserJock> persia: now 3 out of 5 packages using simple cdbs :-)
<persia> LaserJock: You say that like it's a good thing :p
<LaserJock> oh it is
<LaserJock> all 3 just install 1 file
<LaserJock> no need to make things complicated
<LaserJock> I should really just use no build helper at all
<persia> LaserJock: I agree.  The simpler the debian/rules the better, but you might be amused at a buildlog run with DH_VERBOSE :)
<LaserJock> but that'd require some work
<persia> No, using debhelper is better than no build helper, as that means your package doesn't have to be manually updated if there is a significant change.
<persia> Which reminds me: we should probably try to drop debmake for hardy
<LucidFox> What is debmake?
<persia> LucidFox: Very old and obsolete mechanism to build binary packages
<man-di> persia: Debian dropped debmake already in unstbale/testing so it should not be unpossible
<persia> man-di: That was the motivation :)
<man-di> my personal next target would be yada...
<persia> man-di: Do you happen to have some time to migrate those candidates?  I'm sure it would be welcome :)
<man-di> haha
<man-di> I have talked with some maintainer who uses yada some time ago
<man-di> he still insists its the best packaging helper ever
<persia> man-di: On a more serious note, do you know anything about the Apache Derby library?  There seem to be two or three copies of the code in Ubuntu, and there were two new candidates submitted to REVU just near the freeze.  I'm wondering if development is fractured, or if there is one derby to rule them all that everything should target.
<man-di> persia: like bist hing since sliced bread
<man-di> persia: sorry, I dont know
<persia> Yes.  I've seen some blog posts to that effect :)  Still, I consider it a valid target for Ubuntu variation, as we don't document yada practices in the Ubuntu packaging guide.
<persia> Do you know who might?
<man-di> persia: noone perhaps
<persia> OK.  Since all the names on all the changelogs I've seen seem to be Sun people, maybe it's their problem.  Thanks.
<man-di> persia: you know, left and right hand and so on...
<persia> Unfortunately :(  If I can find the one true derby, I'll try to have someone send it to you so we're in sync.
<man-di> perhaps its similar to the jdom situation
<persia> JDOM?
<man-di> we have 3 versions of it in the archive to make everyhthing work
<warp10> persia: regarding bug #192248, thanks for the pointer about the versioning. About the libumlib0-dev issue, it looks like to be available in universe for hardy to me. I just did another rebuild and it built fine.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 192248 in fuse-umfuse-iso9660 "Rebuild for libiso9660-4 -> libiso9660-5 transition" [Low,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/192248
<man-di> persia: libjdom-java, libjdom0-java and libjdom1-java
<man-di> persia: the funny thing is that they are ABI compatible but still incompatible
<persia> That just provides a poor taste.  Upstreams need smacking (if only the Java team had enough left over time to chase them all)
<persia> warp10: Might just be architecture skew.  Either check the state for other architectures, or push back to the queue and hope the next sponsor to review has your arch.
<warp10> persia: hmmm... there isn't an amd64 .deb for it, indeed.
<persia> warp10: Maybe there's something else needs fixing first?  Another library push, a FTBFS?
<warp10> persia: I'll try to figure out how to fix that before re-attaching the debdiff. Thank you!
<persia> warp10: No, thank you for chasing NBS.  It's always frustrating when there is a release and we discover we forgot to rebuild something.
<warp10> persia: Indeed. That was the first NBS I worked on out of two, but I have to say It is someway satysfing to shorten the NBS list. :)
<persia> Could someone take a look at bug #183446?  That doesn't seem an ideal way to solve the problem to me, but I'd like a second opinion before either accepting or rejecting the patch.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 183446 in mysql-query-browser "mysql-query-browser doesn't appear after connection is made" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/183446
<NCommander> Hola
<persia> NCommander: Welcome
<NCommander> I've got a package that I'm a maintainter for Debian
<NCommander> (nrss)
<NCommander> But the version in debian is incredibly dated
<NCommander> But I can't get a sponsor to let me update it
<NCommander> And it just got synced into Ubuntu, and I'd like a newer version uploaded
<persia> Most of us can't upload to Debian either, but we may be able to sponsor an update to Ubuntu.
<NCommander> Right
<NCommander> That's what I'd like to do
<persia> Unfortunately, we've just entered Feature Freeze, so any new upstream versions need a Feature Freeze exception.
<NCommander> Damn it
<NCommander> The version in Debian quite buggy
<NCommander> I don't even think it works properly in Ubuntu due to the updated wget
<persia> NCommander: I sympathize: I've seen a couple packages I watch get new upstreams yesterday that won't be in hardy :)
<NCommander> How can I possibly get a freeze exception?
<NCommander> Because the package author just blasted me for not updating in a considerable time (long story there)
<persia> Anyway, if it really fixes bugs, and is a good improvement, it will likely get approved for an exception.  Feature Freeze is documented at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FeatureFreeze, and there is a link on that page to the exception process.
<persia> Once you have been granted the exception approval, subscribe ubuntu-universe-sponsors to get it uploaded.
<NCommander> Can I upload it to REVU?
<persia> NCommander: You may, but nobody is likely to pay any attention to REVU until May.
<NCommander> Ouch
<persia> Better to attach the new diff.gz to the bug (your watch file works, right?), and the submit the FFe documentation.  The reviewers and sponsors will reconstruct the package from that.
<NCommander> watch file?
<persia> NCommander: http://dehs.alioth.debian.org/maintainer.php?name=nrss&Display=Submit+Query may help, as will the uscan manpage.
<NCommander> Thanks
<NCommander> Oh
<NCommander> He doesn't use FTP, or anything watch can make head or tails of :-/
<persia> Does upstream have an internet accessible download location?  You might be able to grab it with wget in a get-orig-source rule
<NCommander> a what?
<persia> NCommander: A get-orig-source rule to download and repack the latest upstream source.  See http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-source.html#s-debianrules
<NCommander> Neat
<NCommander> Very cool
<persia> We tend to encourage working watch files and/or get-orig-source rules when adding new packages or upgrading before Debian because the person who upgrades it next is not always the person who upgraded it last, and it's a good way to document the process.
<NCommander> You know where I can find an example?
<persia> NCommander: There's a few in our packaging guide, but each is different, depending on the nature of upstream
<persia> !packaging
<ubotu> The packaging guide is at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide - See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/NewPackages for information on getting a package integrated into Ubuntu - Other developer resources are at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment - See also !backports
<NCommander> persia: Can't find it
<persia> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Complete#head-f8241e4bf5c67fe8c76350a1fb3ef9cf2f926c62
<NCommander> persia: Your totally awesome
<NCommander> I've learned more about debian packaging in the last ten minutes then a month of lurking in d-mentors
<persia> NCommander: We've a few thousand bugs on various packages that need fixing, if you want practice.  Please don't let that interfere with your Debian maintaining activities though: over 80% of Ubuntu is unmodified from Debian, and so we very much appreciate work done there.
<NCommander> I'd be glad to help a little
<NCommander> But I felt kinda intimidated looking at how to do syncing and such
<persia> That's the hard stuff.  Better to chase easy stuff like unmet dependencies, library rebuild version skew, documentation bugs, etc. to get a feel for workflow.
<NCommander> ?
<persia> Stuff like the bugs listed at https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.tag=packaging, where there's something wrong with the packaging that needs fixing.  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing provides some guidance on how to submit new candidate for sponsoring.
<NCommander> Let me get nrss taken care of
<NCommander> Then I'll see about helping
<persia> Absolutely.  maintaining your own packages should always take priority.
<NCommander> Yeah
<NCommander> I also need to update cvsps
<NCommander> But it doesn't have any "must have" patches to warrent a freeze wavier
<persia> For cvsps you're better off just updating in unstable then.  Ubuntu will pull a sync in May.
<NCommander> Yeah
<NCommander> persia: I'm rebuilding the new nrss
<NCommander> er
<NCommander> Wrong chatroom
 * persia suspects it was the right "chatroom" :)
<NCommander> :-P
<NCommander> I finally found someone to sponsor me on Debian for the new package
<NCommander> I just bitched loudly
<AnAnt> Hello, can anyone help me with this postinst script: http://pastebin.com/m2f1953e2
<AnAnt> I am using debconf in it, and I got this error when I install the resulting deb file: debconf: DbDriver "config":
<AnAnt> /var/cache/debconf/config.dat is locked by another process: Resource temporarily unavailable
<persia> NCommander: That makes it easier.  Just upload there, and request a FFe for the sync.  If you get stuck with process, ask here for help.
<AnAnt> persia: well ubuntume-gdm-themes get into queue or directly into repos ?
<NCommander> Thanks
<persia> AnAnt: Last I saw it was in Accepted.  Takes a bit to build and distribute.
<AnAnt> k
<AnAnt> persia: I meant 1.2 btw
<persia> AnAnt: Also, you likely want to send email to ubuntu-motu-mentors@ with your debconf issue.  Asking here every several hours won't likely get you a better answer faster.
<AnAnt> persia: I wonder if debian-mentors will help me with a ubuntu-related package
<AnAnt> persia: regarding sync request, if a package in Debian has an FTBFS fixed, would it be accepted ?
<AnAnt> how do I request a package syn ?
<persia> AnAnt: I think you'd do better with ubuntu-motu-mentors for Ubuntu packaging, but debian-mentors might help.  For a sync request, fixing an FTBFS is good.  Is there also an upstream update, or just packaging fixes?
<persia> !sync
<ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about sync - try searching on http://ubotu.ubuntu-nl.org/factoids.cgi
<persia> !syncrequestprocess
<AnAnt> persia: just packaging fixes
<persia> AnAnt: Likely be accepted then.
<AnAnt> persia: unfortunately upstream is frozen for years for that package (acon)
<AnAnt> !syncrequestprocess
<persia> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SyncRequestProcess is the page for the sync request process.  Subscribe a sponsor for approval.
<AnAnt> persia: who would I subscribe ?
<persia> For acon, ubuntu-universe-sponsors, because acon is in universe.  You can check whether a package is in main or universe with `rmadison -u ubuntu $(PACKAGE)`
<AnAnt> ok
<AnAnt> requestsync script doesn't work !
<isaac> cool, I have gvfsd-http using 900Mb of RAM
<isaac> to copy three 150Mb files
<warp10> umview FTFBS on amd64. Build log is at http://launchpadlibrarian.net/12034829/buildlog_ubuntu-hardy-amd64.umview_0.4a-2%7Ewarp10_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz Any Idea about how fixing this issue?
<geser> warp10: I've tried to understand why it FTBFS but I didn't find out why gcc sees there a duplicate value
<geser> warp10: it's also known in Debian but with no solution (see Debian bug 417047)
<ubotu> Debian bug 417047 in umview "umview: FTBFS [amd64] error: duplicate case value" [Important,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/417047
<warp10> geser: looks like I can't do anything to fix that, so. Anyway, I need that build to go ahead with bug #192248
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 192248 in fuse-umfuse-iso9660 "Rebuild for libiso9660-4 -> libiso9660-5 transition" [Low,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/192248
<persia> Aren't __NR_chown and __NR_lchown dupes because  it's a 64-bit arch?
<geser> persia: I couldn't find where both symbols are defined as the same value
 * persia is reading include/libummod.h
 * persia blames um-viewos/defs_x86_64.h line 223
<geser> /usr/include/asm/unistd_64.h mentions them too
<persia> It collides with line 218
<persia> Line 212 indicates to me that it is also unsolved upstream :(
<warp10> persia: if we can't fix that, is my debdiff for bug #192248 acceptable, or ftbfs on amd64 is a good reason to reject it?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 192248 in fuse-umfuse-iso9660 "Rebuild for libiso9660-4 -> libiso9660-5 transition" [Low,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/192248
<persia> warp10: I won't sponsor it because I use amd64, and the package you are updating is broken on amd64, needing more work.  Someone else might sponsor it (I won't reject it again, assuming you fix the version numbers, etc.).
<persia> More generally, I think it's best practice to try to fix the issues recursively, but if you are completely stuck, it shouldn't block something else that is important.
<warp10> persia: ack. As a more general situation, I was just wondering if a debdiff that ftfbs on an arch, for for a reason we can't workaround, is acceptable or should be rejected in any case.
<persia> warp10: I think it's unacceptable for a sponsor to upload something they cannot build or test, but I don't think an issue specific to one architecture should block release critical bugs (like NBS).  It's better to fix the FTBFS, but if you can't, it's not worth releasing hardy with NBS.
<persia> More generally, fixing an issue on several architectures is better than not fixing it because three architectures are still broken
<warp10> persia: yeah, makes sense. I have fixed the version number and I'm uploading the debdiff again, maybe a sponsor using i386 or sparch will accept it.
<geser> persia: looking at the defines in that header: how can the the *32 defines cause the error as there aren't any *32 defined on amd64?
<persia> geser: __NR_chown32 and __NR_lchown32 are both defined as __NR_doesnotexist
<persia> This makes them identical (if identically invalid)
<persia> Alternately, I don't understand syscalls well enough :)
<persia> Then, include/libummod.h defines __NR_chown as __NR_chown32 and __NR_lchown as __NR_lchown32
<geser> persia: where does defs_x86_64.h get included?
<albert23> wouldn't putting #if __NR_chown != __NR_lchown before case __NR_lchown: solve this?
<persia> geser: Sorry.  DIstracted.  Looking now...
<persia> albert23: Worth a try.  Does that work for you?
<albert23> persia: yes, just tested. However, it fails later with a different error
<persia> geser: Good call.  It only gets included for um-viewos, rather than um_viewfs, and so is not the source of the issue.  Deeper the in the stack than I understand, I'm afraid :(
<geser> persia: looking at the pre-processed source both __NR_lchown and __NR_chown are replace with -1
<persia> Ah.  Hmm..  I wonder from where that is defined: perhaps just a report of the nonexistence of __NR_chown32 and __NR_lchown32 on x86_64 ?
<geser> persia: #define __NR_chown __NR_chown32 only happens when __NR_chown32 is defined
<persia> Which means that when it's not defined, it stays undefined, which the preprocessor likely reports are -1, which generates the duplicate.
<geser> persia: it's include/module.h which breaks it :(
<persia> hah!  Maybe those should be -1, -2, -3 ... ?
<persia> Alternately, one could do something like http://paste.ubuntu.com/4641/
<albert23> persia: in my opinion the #if is ok to fix viewfs.c. The new error I get is in another file (scmap.c:225: error: '__NR_mmap2' undeclared here (not in a function))
<albert23> persia: you will get the same error if you just change the value
<geser> persia: changing the order of including module.h and libummod.h should do it too
<RainCT> Morning
<persia> albert23: The issue with ./um-viewos/scmap.c is likely due to um-viewos/defs_x86_64.h
<geser> amd64 has __NR_lchown and __NR_chown defined
<persia> geser: Is that all?  Excellent!  What about um-viewos ?
<geser> persia: I didn't try compiling it yet, but my test with the preproccessor shows that both keep there values
<persia> albert23: Could you pastebin your build error so we could see?
<albert23> __NR_mmap2 is defined in /usr/include/asm/unistd_32.h but not in /usr/include/asm/unistd_64.h
<persia> Hmm..  Can that be wrapped in an #ifdef ?
<albert23> persia: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/4642/
 * persia notices the " /* TO DO! */" on line 220
<geser> perhaps mappging __NR_mmap2 to __NR_doesnotexist in defs_x86_64.h could fix it
<persia> That sounds like a sane plan.
<persia> albert23: Does that work for you?
<albert23> persia: I am trying the #ifdef you mentioned.
<albert23> persia: that goeas much further, but now a link error: /tmp/buildd/umview-0.4a/um-viewos/um_mmap.c:312: undefined reference to `r_llseek'
<geser> I'm there too
<persia> Hmm....
<persia> Odd.  I'd think the presence of __NR_llseek would allow a call to r_llseek.
<geser> amd64 seem to only have __NR_lseek
<persia> geser: Then how did it get past line 310?
<geser> good question
<persia> I would expect it to jump directly to line 315, without the error
<albert23> include/module.h:163:#define __NR__llseek __NR_doesnotexist (and that means -1)
<geser> I've commented that line out and add an #ifdef __NR__llseek around the use in scmap.c
<geser> persia, albert23: -rw-r--r--  1 root root   4648 Feb 16 11:51 libumlib0_0.4a-2_amd64.deb
<geser> but don't ask me if it also works
<persia> geser: Congratulations!  Nice work.
<persia> warp10: Can you identify a test case for geser to use before uploading?
<warp10> persia: could rebuilding fuse-umfuse-iso9660 be enough?
<persia> warp10: That just tests the headers though.  Do you know any use cases for um-viewos?
<persia> In the worst case, it could just be uploaded, as having something buggy but available is better than having something FTBFS.
<warp10> persia: no ideas, sorry. Maybe we can go ahead uploading it and hope it works fine, or even contact upstream and see if he likes this solutions, since he is not able to find a better one
<warp10> gaspa: since you know libumlib0 very good, maybe you can help us finding a test case for the solution geser and persia just found to fix ftfbs on amd64
<DktrKranz> persia, liw mailed and piuparts merge in progress, changes are less intrusive since most is due to a piuparts~ backup file
<persia> DktrKranz: Cool.  I'm looking forward to having systematic tests once we can get everything together.
<persia> (and life will be much easier with hardy+1, as we'll only have to support upgrades from hardy)
<DktrKranz> persia, that would be great. I'd like to study AutoUpgradeTools to have something quick than piuparts
<persia> DktrKranz: I only like piuparts because I've heard it is good.  Any other tools would also be welcome.  There are two use cases I'd like to see: 1) a quick test for a developer to test install/upgrade/remove/purge with a log to demonstrate it working, and 2) some means for mass-testing which would allow for someone to build a nice front-end to identify problems (in the spirit of the FTBFS page).
<albert23> geser: did you also have to tweak wrap_in_statfs64?
<persia> Ideally one could have two targets for the upgrade test, to demonstrate it working both against the last release, and the last LTS release.
<DktrKranz> persia, when I was playing with pbuilder and some scripts, I was unable to have preseed working. Other than that, it does what piuparts do in half the time (at least on some old hardware)
<persia> DktrKranz: Excellent.  That sounds like it is becoming almost a soluable issue.
<geser> albert23: http://paste.ubuntu.com/4643/ has all the changes I did
<geser> the modified package builds now on amd64 and still on i386
<albert23> geser: thanks
<DktrKranz> pbuilder has --execute option, we can pass a script to basically do any test we want (upgrade, install, purge). If anyone is comfortable with preeseding (since I'm not), I'd like to dig into it.
<persia> DktrKranz: You might write to ubuntu-motu@ to ask for preseeding help, or liw might be interested if you can really demonstrate half the time for almost the same results, as he runs piuparts against main regularly.
<geser> DktrKranz: what do you want preseeded?
<geser> I've done some presseeding in my pbuilder to get sun-java-* automatically installed
<DktrKranz> geser, there are some packages which asks for some input from users during install phase, pbuilder is unable to skip them and answer the default option.
<geser> warp10: fuse-umfuse-iso9660 build with the modified umview package on amd64
<persia> DktrKranz: Which packages?  Surely those are bugs, no?
<DktrKranz> when I tested multiverse some months ago, I encountered some packages which require a manual intervention to be processe
<DktrKranz> persia, hard to remember, basically because they're on ubuntuwire...
<DktrKranz> (the results)
<geser> DktrKranz: the most packages should install fine with DEBIAN_FRONTEND=noninteractive
<persia> DktrKranz: Ah.  Makes sense.  Let's continue this conversation when ubuntuwire comes back :)
<geser> DktrKranz: the exception is sun-java-* from multiverse
<DktrKranz> geser, http://www.wgdd.de/?p=36
<persia> Also j2sdk1.4 (Blackdown Java)
<geser> yes, that's what I've done inside my pbuilder
<warp10> geser: that's a step forward. If you are going to upload libumlib0 I'll wait until it builds to resubscribe u-u-s to bug #192248
<geser> j2sdk uses an other debconf question so it must be preseeded seperately
<geser> persia: any reason not to upload umview?
<geser> warp10: umview on amd64 need to go through binary NEW too
<persia> geser: I don't have any reservations, although if gaspa had a use case to verify it worked beforehand, that would be better.  Otherwise, we release it, and get bug reports to tell us what else to fix.
<jpatrick> ScottK: with three acks  I can upload?
<geser> persia: any idea what to do with the depwait of netbeans? it build-depends on libini4j-java which itself build-depends on jetty from multiverse
<persia> geser: bug #192336
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 192336 in jetty "Please migrate jetty from multiverse to universe" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/192336
<persia> jpatrick: It's early there yet.  With context, maybe someone else could advise you.
<jpatrick> persia: bug #192350
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 192350 in semantik "[Feature Freeze Exception] New upstream release" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/192350
<RainCT> ScottK, ScottK2: ping
<jpatrick> persia: he just commented so I thought he'd be around :)
<RainCT> jpatrick: Â«Go ahead and upload.Â» pretty obvious :)
<persia> jpatrick: Historically, it was 2 motu-release acks (and you only have two), so I'd assume that safe unless motu-release arranges for approval of a new policy for hardy.
<jpatrick> RainCT: doulbe-check before I get bashed
<jpatrick> persia: I count three :)
<persia> jpatrick: Riddell and dholbach only admin the team, they aren't members.
<jpatrick> persia: ah ok, I'll upload
<pochu_> persia: that's pretty confusing
<RainCT> ScottK, ScottK2: pyclamd is ready (should appear soon on REVU) but I can't get it working here (I've installed and started clamav-daemon but trying to do something raises ScanError)
<persia> pochu_: Blame it on LP.  I suppose we could transfer admin from those people to MC, which as a group, would more clearly not be members.  Feel free to raise it in the next MOTU meeting if you'd like to request adjustment.
<RainCT> >>> pyclamd.init_network_socket('localhost', 3310)  [...]  ScanError: Could not reach clamd using network (localhost, 3310)
<pochu_> persia: I will.
<pochu_> persia: so motu-council being the team owner would solve the issue. they don't need to be members
<pochu_> that only confuses people
<persia> pochu_: The Administrator is required to be a member, but by having the Administrator be a team, it may be less confusing.
<pochu_> persia: really? at least some time ago it wasn't needed
<persia> The individuals who happen to be members of MC would not need to be members of the team.
<pochu_> persia: i.e. the team owner can do whatever he wants without being a team member
<jpatrick> persia: we could make ~motu-release-admins and put them down as owner
<persia> pochu_: Really?  That's different than my understanding.  You may want to get an official answer from the LP team before raising it at a meeting.
<pochu_> jpatrick: I think the council should be the admin
<pochu_> jpatrick: since the admin would be mainly to add/remove members, and that's a -council task
<persia> jpatrick: That could work too, although then we get to discuss who belongs to ~motu-release-admins, which is why I suggested MC.
<jpatrick> ah, ok
<RainCT> ScottK2: oh ok, it works
<RainCT> :)
<pochu_> persia, jpatrick: proposal added to the agenda. I'll make sure about the needed of being a member.
<persia> pochu_: Thanks.
<jpatrick> pochu_: you don't have to - look at ~kubuntu-es and ~kubuntu-es-admins
<persia> jpatrick: https://launchpad.net/~kubuntu-es/+members lists "Kubuntu Spanish Admins" as a member.
<jpatrick> persia: yes, but it's indirect :)
<persia> jpatrick: No, it's direct: see https://launchpad.net/~kubuntu-es-admins/+participation
<persia> jpatrick: Specifically, the admin team is a member of the administered team.  The individual members of the admin team are not.  My claim is that the adminstrator (in this case a team) is required to be a member of the administered team.
<jpatrick> persia: yes, I'm in that, and it says "You are the owner of this team, but not currently an active member."
<persia> jpatrick: Yes, but you as an individual are not the administrator, you just happen to currently belong to the team which is the administrator.  The point being that LP requires the designated administrator (which may be a team) to be a member of the administered team.  It doesn't care about the individuals involved.
<jpatrick> ah
<ScottK> RainCT: Thanks.  Having a look.
<tuxmaniac> any reference package that I can look into for "splitting up a package"
<ScottK2> RainCT: Why the versioned dependency on pysupport?
<ScottK2> tuxmaniac: What are you trying to do?
<tuxmaniac> ScottK, I am trying to split a package. For closing the review point http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=alliance
<ScottK2> So you want to break one source package up into multiple binary packages?
<ScottK2> tuxmaniac: Having to do that with games packages (a separate data package) is quite common, so I'd look in that section.
<tuxmaniac> ScottK, aah thanks.
<RainCT> ScottK2: policy
<RainCT> ScottK2: that's what http://wiki.debian.org/DebianPython/NewPolicy says
<ScottK2> RainCT: I'd like it if this package was backportable to Dapper (which IIRC has pysupport 0.1).  Let me look into it a bit then.
<ScottK2> RainCT: Also it needs MOTU as maintainer.
<ScottK2> RainCT: I'm going to check and see if pysupport 0.1 builds a sane package.  I expect for this it will (it's so simple).
<geser> I see that we should add the FF to Current Freezes on our wiki page. Has someone a few suggestions to put into "Current Work Mode"?
<RainCT> ScottK2: btw, will this replace python-clamav in Hardy or are they for different things?
<ScottK2> They are for different things.  They complement each other.
<ScottK2> There were some functions removed from python-clamav in it's most recent version and python-clamd is the recommended way to replace them.
<RainCT> ScottK2: ok. they have the same description, should I add something to pyclamd's?
<RainCT> *s/description/description right now
<ScottK2> RainCT: I'd use the about description from the upstream page: pyClamd is a python interface to Clamd (Clamav daemon). By using pyClamd, you can add virus detection capabilities to your python software in an efficient and easy way.
<ScottK2> Short description would be python interface to Clamd (Clamav daemon)
<RainCT> ScottK2: that's more or less what it has
<RainCT> Python interface to the ClamAV daemon          This package adds virus detection capabilities to Python software in an efficient and easy way, thanks to the ClamAV antivirus toolkit.
<RainCT> uh.. should bug 192322 be rejected?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 192322 in acon "Please sync acon 1.0.5-5 from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/192322
<RainCT> it is to fix a FTBFS, but it doesn't fail in Hardy (https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/hardy/+source/acon/1.0.5-4)
<ScottK2> Are you sure it wouldn't fail if it were built now?
<RainCT> I'm trying
<ScottK2> K
<ScottK2> Nevermind about the versioning of pysupport.  Dapper pysupport doesn't have dh_pysupport in it, so it'll need to be a source backport no matter what.
<ScottK2> RainCT: You need to set DEB_PYTHON_SYSTEM=pysupport in debian/rules.
<RainCT> ScottK2: ah, right. thx
<RainCT> ScottK2: about the maintainer, wasn't any @ubuntu.com ok?
<RainCT> ScottK2: anyways, changed. should I reupload to REVU or to Ubuntu?
<ScottK2> REVU please.
<ScottK2> I missed that it was an ubuntu.com address.  It was fine.
<ScottK2> If you intend to personally maintain it and not have the team maintain it that is.
<RainCT> ScottK2: ah ok. Yes, I'll get it into Debian too :).
<ScottK2> Great.  Did you upload an updated package to REVU?
<ScottK2> RainCT: ^^^
<ScottK2> RainCT: Also don't forget to do an ITP for Debian.
<bddebian> Heya gang
<LucidFox> hello bddebian
<\sh> moins
<CyberMatt> lo
<geser> Hi bddebian
<geser> Hi \sh
<bddebian> Hi LucidFox, \sh, CyberMatt, and geser :-)
<LucidFox> wow, four merge bugs, all by the same submitter
<LucidFox> hellboy195, you should only re-add Ubuntu debian/changelog entries since the last sync
<hellboy195> LucidFox: what package? or in generel?
<\sh> bah...debugging wine on amd64 isn't a good idea
<hellboy195> \sh: how's the progress ^^
<LucidFox> hellboy195> libdvdread
<LucidFox> hellboy195> plucker seems to be OK in this respect, looking at the remaining two
<\sh> hellboy195: compiling with -fno-stack-protector didn't help...
<\sh> hellboy195: I just upgraded my i386 desktop to hardy and try to debug there
<hellboy195> \sh: if you need a tester or something like that just ping me
<hellboy195> LucidFox: k
<\sh> emgent: cacti is fixed ... (dapper, feisty, gutsy, hardy) with edgy i deal later...because of its EOL
<ScottK2> RainCT: I'll be back later.
<\sh> and gnucash has ofx support again...
<calc> anyone happen to know what the command is to turn off buffering on the command line?
<calc> i have a program that writes lots of data to stdout and i want it not to buffer it
<hellboy195> LucidFox: this means that I should remove every ubuntu entry in the changelog before 0.9.7-2=
<hellboy195> s/=/?
<LucidFox> hellboy195> yes
<LucidFox> hellboy195> since that version was synced with no Ubuntu changes
<hellboy195> LucidFox: but 0.9.7-2ubuntu1 has ubuntu changes
<LucidFox> hellboy195> yes, but it was uploaded later
<LucidFox> look at the upload history: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libdvdread
<LucidFox> 0.9.7-2, followed by 0.9.7-2ubuntu1
<hellboy195> LucidFox: though it was a sync I did over 20 merges and never removed previous ubuntu entries :\
<LucidFox> Once a package has been synced, along with the original unmodified debian/changelog, all information about Ubuntu changes is discarded, and the history of said Ubuntu changes begins anew.
<LucidFox> If it's merged with existing Ubuntu changes and a modified version is uploaded, then Ubuntu entries are kept.
<hellboy195> LucidFox: interesting. It's the first time I heard this. nvm. new debdiff uploaded
<LucidFox> hellboy195> all right, I'm currently processing xcin; commented on apt-watch
<hellboy195> LucidFox: argh. But if have to say that the last merge also has this mistake and I only copied it :\ But I suppose that's no NEW remaining change. just correcht version number in changelog right?
<LucidFox> hellboy195> If the version in control is correct, then yes, change it in changelog
<RainCT> ScottK2: it's up now
<LucidFox> Holy!.. That's one huge diff.gz that xcin has
<hellboy195> LucidFox: I don't suppose this is my fault?
<LucidFox> of course not, it's Debian's fault :)
<LucidFox> uploaded
<hellboy195> fine
<LucidFox> hellboy195> now processing apt-watch; the change for xcin is trivial enough that you might consider pushing it back to Debian
<LucidFox> it's not like one extra build-dependency would hurt them
<hellboy195> LucidFox: ^^
<LucidFox> and for apt-watch in Debian, the diff.gz is actually _bigger_ than the orig.tar.gz
 * LucidFox headdesks
<hellboy195> LucidFox: if you have finished ^^ http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=451135
<ubotu> Debian bug 451135 in xcin "Please add libxext-dev to build depends" [Normal,Open]
<LucidFox> Thanks!
<LucidFox> Ah, it wasn't you
<hellboy195> LucidFox: yep and because of that I wanted to show it to you
<hellboy195> LucidFox: Ã¤hm this sounds stupid but can you explain me what the diff.gz shows us?
<LucidFox> hellboy195> The diff.gz stores all changes between the maintainer's source tree and the orig.tar.gz
<LucidFox> which is at least the debian/ directory
<hellboy195> LucidFox: from the previous and actual version?
<LucidFox> hellboy195> erm...
<LucidFox> do you understand what the orig.tar.gz is?
<hellboy195> LucidFox: sry. missunderstood it ^^
<hellboy195> LucidFox: that means the debian directory must be very big to be bigger than the orig.tar.gz
<LucidFox> That diff.gz stores not just the debian directory
<LucidFox> the debian dir is small, there are lots of changes outside it
<LucidFox> that's one borked package
<hellboy195> k
<cbx33> hi all
<LucidFox> DktrKranz, since you're on plucker, maybe you could process libdvdread as well?
<LucidFox> hellboy195> (uploaded apt-watch, by the way)
<hellboy195> LucidFox: already saw it ;)
<hellboy195> LucidFox: and if you wonder why I did 4 merges. I was bored ^^ hmm shouldn't be next time. 4 merges and 6 debdiffs so far :\
<LucidFox> heh
<DktrKranz> LucidFox, no problem, I'll assign it to me
<LucidFox> I'm not really a fan of merges - when I do a merge, or new Ubuntu changes, I prefer pushing as much stuff to Debian as possible
 * hellboy195 will now do his 5. merge today
<DktrKranz> hellboy195, on incoming.debian.org there's a new plucker revision, mind checking?
<hellboy195> DktrKranz: np
<DktrKranz> hellboy195, it's a sync, look at their changes :)
<hellboy195> DktrKranz: true
<hellboy195> DktrKranz: may I tranform the merge to a sync bug?
<hellboy195> *transform
<DktrKranz> of course :)
 * hellboy195 is on the way
<hellboy195> DktrKranz: but
<hellboy195> DktrKranz: finished. I hope it's ok
<DktrKranz> hellboy195, you can delete your debdiff, if you want
<hellboy195> DktrKranz: how ^^
<hellboy195> DktrKranz: ah found it
<hellboy195> Can somebody tell me if a libgif-dev (>= 4.1.6-3~) is ok as Build-Depend? What does this ~ mean?
<broonie> It's part of the version number - it's a separator that sorts before anything else.
<hellboy195> broonie: and it's also acceptable in ubuntu? because this is in debian and I haven't seen that in ubuntu so far
<geser> why would somebody add a ~ there?
<DktrKranz> typo?
<broonie> hellboy195: It's just relatively new is all.
<hellboy195> broonie: k, thx
<tsmithe> hi, is anyone on the backports team available to take a look at https://bugs.launchpad.net/gutsy-backports/+bug/192440 ?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 192440 in gutsy-backports "Please backport mscore 0.9.1d+dfsg-0ubuntu1 from Hardy" [Undecided,New]
 * broonie would suspect a typo too.
<tsmithe> builds and runs fine on a vanilla gutsy system
<james_w> I can't find a clear guide on the wiki for this. I have a debdiff for a bug available, what are the steps to get it sponsored?
<tsmithe> ScottK, maybe? ^^
<james_w> I guess it is attach it to the bug and subscribe u-u-s, is that correct?
<geser> james_w: exactly
<james_w> geser: thanks.
<DktrKranz> 3.7.3 policy named something about ~, but I don't remember what
<tsmithe> thanks jdong
<jdong> yeppers
<ScottK2> RainCT: I'm back.  Looking.
<tsmithe> jdong, when will i know if mscore has been uploaded to gutsy-backports, so i can tell upstream to publicise it?
<jdong> tsmithe: subscribe to the bug and when it's processed, the archive admins send out a mail on it
<tsmithe> excellent, thanks
<ScottK2> RainCT: I'm gonna upload it unless you want to.
<RainCT> ScottK2: go on :)
<ScottK2> OK.
<ScottK2> RainCT: I'm going to make one small change (see my revu comment).
<AnAnt> Hello, can anyone help me with this postinst script: http://pastebin.com/m2f1953e2
<AnAnt> I am using debconf in it, and I got this error when I install the resulting deb file: debconf: DbDriver "config": /var/cache/debconf/config.dat is locked by another process: Resource temporarily unavailable
<RainCT> What should I do if I'm installing a package with a license that isn't in /usr/share/common-licenses? Installing it with debian/docs lets linda and lintian complain..
<ScottK2> RainCT: The full copy of it you put in debian/copyright should be sufficient.
<RainCT> argh. 470 lines?!
<ScottK2> Yes.  It's a requirement.
 * RainCT has seen at least 1 package that doesn't do this
<ScottK2> Then I'd file a bug.
<ScottK2> Policy requires it.
<ScottK2> RainCT: pyclamd is uploaded.  Thanks for jumping right on that.
<RainCT> well, the package I remember is going to be removed anyway
<ScottK2> RainCT: Interested in trying to make a version of pyclamd that works in Dapper?
<RainCT> ScottK2: how would I do that?
<ScottK2> You'd have to change your package to use dh_python and creatively get the file into the right spot.
<ScottK2> If you don't have a Dapper box it might be kind of hard to test.  I've got one, so I could check anything you came up with.
<ScottK2> I can do it if you don't find the idea interesting.
<RainCT> ScottK2: uhm.. better you do it
<ScottK2> K
<ScottK2> RainCT: I notice (now of course) that you have neither a pyversions file, nor the XS/XB python versions foo in debian/control.  I think that's still required.
<RainCT> ScottK2: I checked python-support's docs before and there it says that if you don't use it it'll supose the current python version
<ScottK2> OK.  Maybe it's not needed.
<ScottK2> RainCT: I'd say time to get it into Debian then.
<RainCT> ScottK2: yes, just filled an ITP
<ScottK2> Great.
<ScottK2> BTW, I'm not 100% sure modifying the file in get-orig-source is going to fly in Debian.  Policy says you can't repack a tarball with files you've modified.  Since this is packing and not repacking, I'm really not sure.
<ScottK2> I'd be sure and ask about it when you're being sponsored.
<crimsun_> james_w: thanks for the debdiff.  As a note, when modifying source packages, please make sure that https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebianMaintainerField is followed and that the distribution is correct.
<james_w> crimsun_: thanks. I'll upload a new diff.
<crimsun_> james_w: no need, I've tweaked it and uploaded already.
<james_w> crimsun_: ah, great, thanks.
<ScottK> RainCT: If you're interested in what changes were needed for the Dapper toolchain, I've put a test version of the package in the ubuntu-clamav PPA: https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-clamav/+archive
<norsetto> howdy all
<ScottK> Heya norsetto.
<norsetto> heya scottk
<ScottK> norsetto: I've been wanting to catch up with you to discuss FFe policy.  Got a minute?
<norsetto> scottK: even 5
<ScottK> K
<ScottK> norsetto: I'm hoping to get agreement on the proposal I made to the MOTU ML about bugfix only upstream changes.
<norsetto> scottk: ok, I'm all for it
<ScottK> norsetto: So far Hobbsee and TheMuso are in agreement and I'm trying to catch you and sistpoty to see what you think.
<ScottK> OK
 * ScottK marks off another one.
<ScottK> norsetto: The other thing I think we need is a list on the wiki of blanket FFe's so people aren't confused about what's allowed and what's not.
<ScottK> That was the cause of some confusion last time.
<norsetto> scottk: ok, I can understand
<superm1> ScottK, what about if the bugfixes aren't listed locally in launchpad, but only on upstream's tracker?
<ScottK2> Is there an upstream changelog?
<ScottK2> superm1: ^^^
<superm1> ScottK2, only in svn logs
<ScottK2> It's a snapshot or a release?
<superm1> ScottK2, we're on snapshots right now, and upstream feature froze already
<superm1> so its just tracking bug fixes till release
<ScottK2> When is release expected?
<superm1> ~1-1.5 months
<ScottK2> Argh.
<superm1> yeah i know :(
<ScottK2> How about this for a plan ...
<ScottK2> File a standing FFe request for the package, including when you expect a release and when you're going to stop updating, release or not.  Then if that gets approved, you just add a comment each time you take a snapshot and upload that describes the changes for that upload?
<ScottK2> superm1: ^^^^ ?
<superm1> yeah i can do that at least
<ScottK2> Does that sound fair and reasonable from your end?
<superm1> well the one thing would be that i'd like to keep updating release or not up until the cutoff on hardy - if its just bug fixes, there should be no harm there
<ScottK2> Is the package used outside mythtv?
<ScottK2> What package?
<superm1> i'll get an FFe together and you guys will be able to look it over though
<superm1> it's mythtv, mythplugins, mythtv-theme-*, nuvexport
<ScottK2> Don't worry about the diffstats and stuff, just the plan.
<superm1> all of them come as a bundle and are only used together
<ScottK2> My opinion is that if I can trust you not to mess that one up, we've got a lot of trouble.
<ScottK2> Just lay out a plan and ask for approval.
<superm1> okay, will do :)
<ScottK2> norsetto and TheMuso: I've started the page for standing FFe's https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StandingFeatureFreeze
<norsetto> scottk: bookmarked
<ScottK2> I'll write mail on the subject too.
<jdong> grumble
<jdong> try #4 of firefox-3.0
<jdong> apt has broken so much I feel like an automatix developer
 * ScottK declined to accept that update yesterday.
<ScottK> First updates after freeze milestones tend to be a bit ugly.
<jdong> hehe
<jdong> surprisingly, nothing blew up too badly when I tried it on my macbook
<jdong> well the kernel was a big ugly
<jdong> bit*
<ScottK> So far I'm running Hardy on an old Dell laptop that had enough kernel problems with Gutsy that it got an honorable mention in the distro release notes.
<ScottK> Hardy is much better.
<jdong> AAH! Stupid symlinks!
 * jdong smacks firefox-3.0
<jdong> ok I don't nearly begin to trust myself when it comes to these packaging changes, I'm gonna go with the 3-acks-from-testers path.
 * jdong primes the backporter ppa
<jdong> asac: for bug 191796, bug 191800, I've attached debdiffs and uploaded to PPA's my testing packages. Locally I've made sure they install properly without clobbering firefox 2. When you get a chance, help me glance that over. Thanks
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 191796 in gutsy-backports "Please backport firefox-3.0 3.0~b3 final" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/191796
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 191800 in gutsy-backports "Please backport xulrunner-1.9 1.9~b3 final" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/191800
<norsetto> time to go testing ...
<DRebellion> what does "CVE" stand for?
<Nafallo> DRebellion: http://cve.mitre.org/
<DRebellion> thanks
<pochu> ScottK: #
<pochu> ScottK: Upstream microreleases of applications are usually fine after this point if they only fix bugs. This should be verified by reading the detailled upstream changelog and (cursory) reading the diff between the version in the Ubuntu development release and the new upstream version. If in doubt, ask the release team for advice.
<pochu> From https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FeatureFreeze
<ScottK2> pochu: usually.  Who decides if it's a usually or not.
<pochu> (we were discussing whether it's ok to upload bug-fix-only new upstream releases after FF without needing to do paperwork)
<pochu> ScottK2: the developer himself
<pochu> ScottK2: if he needs to ask the release team, then what would have changed from the past?
<ScottK2> I've proposed how we will deal with this on the MOTU list and so far I've got 4 of 5 motu-release members to agree.
<pochu> But nothing has officially changed yet.
<ScottK2> pochu: It's a question of documentation.  A full FFe has diffstats and other stuff.
<ScottK2> Right.  And in the past all upstream releases past UVF needed an exception.
<ScottK2> So I'm trying to get that relaxed.
<pochu> But we are talking about policy. And current policy says it's ok if the new upstream is bug-fix only
<pochu> ScottK2: that was when UVF existed. And it was relaxed with the UVF -> FF change.
<ScottK2> But we have no process for this policy change yet.
<ScottK2> That's what I'm trying to get worked out.
<pochu> When it was UVF, every new upstream release needed an exception. That was changed to FF by pitti's proposal so bug-fix only releases have a general exception.
<pochu> ScottK2: the process is "if it's bug-fix only, upload" IMHO.
<ScottK2> So far no one agrees with that.
<pochu> ScottK2: if you want to add paperwork again, well, that will look like UVF again.
<ScottK2> All I want is it written down in a bug what the changes were.  No diffstat, no approvals.  Still much simpler.
<ScottK2> For your proposed sync we were originally discussing, the difference is you'd have to add the upstream changes too.  Very minor.
<pochu> So with "you need to do FFe exception paperwork" you meant writting the changelog entry in a bug?
<pochu> which is covered by "requestsync spe hardy" anyway...
<ScottK2> Today (until my proposal is approved) I think you need a full FFe.  If my proposal is adopted, then it's just adding the upstream changes to the sync bug.
<pochu> I disagree.
<ScottK2> No, request sync just has the debian/changelog entries.
<pochu> Today it would be a bug fix only so it's OK to upload.
<pochu> Your proposal only adds paperwork AFAICS
<ScottK2> pitti doesn't unilaterally set MOTU policy/procedure.
<ScottK2> We do that ourselves.
<pochu> ScottK2: I had assumed it was applying to universe too. In that case, the wiki is really unclear in that regard.
<pochu> ScottK2: and why not stick with the main procedure?
<pochu> i.e. bug-fix-only -> upload
<ScottK2> pochu: I can see how that might be.  I wish we'd had motu-release team in place more than a day before feature freeze to get all this clear.
<ScottK2> Because we have a lot more variability in experience level in MOTU than they do in core.
<pochu> I see. That makes sense.
<superm1> "they", ScottK2 aren't you a core now :)
<ScottK2> I am.
<ScottK2> But I'm talking about Universe versus Main policy here as a motu-release person.
<pochu> Well I guess it isn't that bad as long as it's only the changelog||news diff
<pochu> ScottK2: sorry if I've been rude
<ScottK2> pochu: No trouble.  All's well that ends well.
 * pochu updates the wiki to make clear that's only Main policy
<ScottK2> pochu: Why don't you leave it for now.
<ScottK2> I hope sistpoty will appear soon and we can have an agreement shortly.
<ScottK2> superm1: Did you see the comments on the mythTV FFe?
<superm1> ScottK2, yeah, and laga responded to each of them before I had a chance
<superm1> did you look over his responses?
<ScottK2> I did, but I've no idea who he is.
<pochu> ScottK2: ok.
<superm1> ScottK2, oh he is part of ~ubuntu-mythtv
<superm1> he has been managing parts of the trunk build and our diskless stuff
<ScottK2> superm1: OK.  Would you please comment in the bug supporting what he said since you're the requestor and who I'm going to lean on if it goes bad.
<superm1> of course
<pochu> ScottK2: this is my second mistake with universe FF in one day... I thought dholback and Riddell were motu-release members, as in fact they are members of ~motu-release. And now this...
<pochu> ScottK2: is it known how many ACKs does one need to get a FFexception for Universe?
<ScottK2> pochu: It's no trouble.  This is your first release as MOTU, so no problem.
<ScottK2> It's been two in the past and no one has proposed changing it.
<pochu> ScottK2: but not my first FF exception ;)
<pochu> Ok, thanks.
<ScottK2> That's part of what I'm trying to get nailed down.
<pochu> ScottK2: for the members issue, what do you think about the proposal in the 3rd point in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Meetings ?
<geser> pochu: if a ~motu-release member set your ff exception request from new to confirmed, I'd say it got accepted.
<ScottK2> pochu: Sounds sensible to me, but I'm not up on the LP foo enough to know if that would work as expected or not.
<pochu> ScottK2: it worked in the past for me, but I'll get cleared it anyway from a LP developer, or will do that myself with in staging.lp.net
<ScottK2> pochu: I like the idea of MC being the owner of motu-release and not two semi-random Canonical employees.
<ScottK2> K
<ScottK2> superm1: I just acked (still need a 2nd) for uploads up the the Beta release.  I did that as much as anything to give you leverage with upstream to cut the release.
<superm1> great thanks ScottK2
<james_w> geser: hi. I don't know if you're still around, but I was wondering what http://patches.ubuntu.com/b/binutils-avr/binutils-avr_2.18-1ubuntu1.patch is saying, i.e. "Update the symlink to the binutils source archive."
<james_w> geser: there is no obvious change in the diff, but it sounds like the sort of thing that may not show up in a diff.
<james_w> geser: there is a new upload to be merged, so I was wondering if a sync was safe.
<geser> james_w: all I changed was a symlink to the binutils-source.tar.gz inside the package (it's a native one)
<geser> james_w: if it builds in hardy, it can be synced
<james_w> geser: i'll try it, thanks.
#ubuntu-motu 2008-02-17
<pochu> ScottK2: what would happen if upstream doesn't have a ChangeLog/NEWS file? Would a diff of the upstream source be ok?
<ScottK2> I'd rather you read the diff and sumarize what you think the changes are than you make me do it.
<pochu> ScottK2: hmm, right. It's just in case I need to do it, as stani doesn't have one ;)
<james_w> geser: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=460362 seems to have fixed it. At least it builds on current hardy.
<ubotu> Debian bug 460362 in binutils-avr "binutils-avr: FTBFS: Applying patch debian/patches/dollars.patch failed!" [Serious,Fixed]
<james_w> geser: shall I request the sync?
<TheMuso> ScottK2: I just added ubuntustudio to that page, thanks for the pointer to it.
<emgent> heya *
<bddebian> Hello emgent
<emgent> :)
<ScottK> TheMuso: Did motu-release give a standing FFe to ubuntu-studio this time around?
<TheMuso> ScottK: I don't know, but ubuntustudio was given one last cycle
<ScottK> TheMuso: I think it's fine that they have one myself, but we have new people on the team, so I think it should be asked each cycle.
<TheMuso> Fair enough
<TheMuso> I know Hobbsee was fine with it.
<TheMuso> I'll ping norsetto and sistpoty when they're around alter.
<ScottK> TheMuso: Perhaps a bug with also affects for the relevant packages would be the best way?  That way there's no confusion.
<TheMuso> Right.
<netzmeister> slomo_, ping
<james_w> nxvl: hi. I've just realised it's our talk tomorrow (in my TZ at least). I've got to sleep now, but I'll send you some notes in a few hours.
<nxvl> james_w: ok, for me it's past tommorrow :D
<james_w> ah, you've got longer to prepare then :)
<nxvl> james_w: kind of
<nxvl> i'm at gmt-5
<rmjb> Hello all
<rmjb> just looking for a little advice on how you all handle python programming, on an individual level...
<rmjb> for those of you that read dive into python that is
<jdong> is this the right place?
<rmjb> well it's not a motu question, but I just wanted to get some advice on how you all work as individuals... it's not a python question per se but more a personal style question
<rmjb> I'm dragging it out too long
<rmjb> do any of you find "dive into python" a good reference book to go back to after you've read it through once?
<rmjb> oh and happy new year to anyone that recognizes me... I've not been in here in ages
<jdong> rmjb: I've read bits of it, and I think it's a good python book but not a good reference
<rmjb> yeah me too, it doesn't seem to be... I want to support the author, but I guess I wont buy the book
<jdong> I like the Python Cookbook as a purchased python book
<jdong> it's just a huge library of examples, worth looking at time and time again
<persia> Using package (>= version~) as a dependency or build-dependency is a workaround to also allow backported versions to meet the dependency.
<jdong> yes.... yes it is. but *looks at scrollback*
<rmjb> jdong, cool, I'll look at that one when I'm finished with this one. Thanks
<LaserJock> Fujitsu: have you looked at octave3.0 lately?
<nixternal> ahh, LaserJock just who I wanted to bug :)
<LaserJock> nixternal: regarding PG?
<nixternal> haha ya
<nixternal> stupid ass LP
<koolkat> what is MOTU?
<LaserJock> Masters of the Universe
<LaserJock> maintainers of Universe and Multiverse repositories of Ubuntu
<nixternal> masters of the universe...universe being the repositories we maintain
<nixternal> ya, I forget about multiverse repos, only cuz I don't work on anything in them...
<LaserJock> pfft
<nixternal> err, except the openttd upload I did I guess
 * persia stresses "Masters", as there are many non-MOTU maintainers of universe software
<koolkat> what skills do I need?
<nixternal> a couple
<nixternal> like, being able to compile software
<koolkat> like what?
<LaserJock> koolkat: patience mostly
<nixternal> hunt out application dependencies
<LaserJock> :-)
<nixternal> patience like LaserJock said, and a lot of it :)
<koolkat> LaserJock: that seems easy
<koolkat> :-)
<nixternal> obviously you have the english language down :)
 * koolkat thinks about joining
<nixternal> debian packaging
<nixternal> how to efficiently drink beer and dance while building a package...simultaneously I might add :)
<koolkat> uhhh....about the packaging part.....is it hard?
<nixternal> if I can do it, anyone can
<nixternal> then again, who is to say I can even do it
<koolkat> where do I learn?
<nixternal> I just play like it
<nixternal> http://www.oasis-open.org/docbook/xml/4.3/docbookx.dtd
<nixternal> err
<nixternal> that isn't going to help
<nixternal> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide
<nixternal> that will though :)
<nixternal> obviously I was working on some docs...much earlier though..odd that was still in my klipper
<LaserJock> nixternal: ok, so about the PG bugs
<nixternal> seems there are only 3 of them
<LaserJock> some of the could be closed already
<koolkat> nixternal: do are you a member?
<koolkat> so*
<nixternal> ya, I was thinking the same, with a reference that it has been moved to the wiki and is no longer a package
<LaserJock> I count 8 bugs
<nixternal> koolkat: yes I am
<nixternal> err, where did I miss 5 of them
<LaserJock> nixternal: you have to look at both the ubuntu-docs package and project
<superm1> TheMuso, with these changes to the seeds, how do you *not* include stuff from hardy.platform?
<superm1> there is lots of stuff in there that we dont want
<nixternal> ahh ya, the project
<nixternal> is there going to be a rewrite or something of the PG on the wiki?
<LaserJock> nixternal: what do you mean?
<nixternal> LaserJock: I think what I will do, is close the bugs, take out the contents, and add them to the Maintenance page of the PG on the wiki
<nixternal> LaserJock: nevermind, I was thinking of something else
<LaserJock> nixternal: yeah, we might do that
<LaserJock> it'd be nice if we had a way to deal with the bugs
<nixternal> I can do that really quick
<nixternal> well it is on the wiki now, so maybe adding a section to the Maintenance page for people to file an issue
<koolkat> nixternal: what are the tasks that you do?
<koolkat> in MOTU?
<LaserJock> nixternal: yeah, that makes sense
<nixternal> koolkat: I mostly help maintain Kubuntu/KDE packages, but I also help others with packaging when they need it, and help anyway I can
<nixternal> really don't have a "single" task perse
<nixternal> LaserJock: OK, I will finish that up right now then
<koolkat> what do you mean by "maintain"
<LaserJock> nixternal: thanks
<koolkat> nixternal: what do you mean by "maintain"
<LaserJock> generally things like making sure we're updated, incorporating bug fixes
<persia> koolkat: There are three main thrusts of activity: fixing bugs in the software, making sure that all the software works together, and making sure the software is mostly up to date.  The third part is done for hardy, but the first two would benefit from your assistance.
<koolkat> I guess I could join...i think
<koolkat> i hope
 * koolkat worries
<persia> koolkat: Best way to start is to find a couple bugs that need fixing, prepare patches, and submit debdiffs of new candidate revisions.  See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing.
<koolkat> persia: Is there a specific place to join MOTU?
<persia> koolkat: Joining MOTU is not really the first step.  Only about 1/3 of the people who have uploaded packages to hardy are MOTU.  You'll want first to be a Contributor, and if you are dilligent and active, you will be encouraged to apply for MOTU.
<koolkat> Oh
<nixternal> bug 116757
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 116757 in ubuntu-docs "Packaging Guide not clear on "rules" having to be executable" [Low,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/116757
<nixternal> ahh, that's teh link :)
<persia> koolkat: On the MOTU/Contributing page there are links to some of the teams that you might want to join to start the process.
<koolkat> are there anyother projects that need more people?
<persia> nixternal: Is that really a bug?  debuild/dpkg-buildpackage set executable anyway, even if it wasn't that way when they were called.
<nixternal> persia: I will check it out further after I finish moving them
<nixternal> not necessarily a bug maybe, but unclear to someone obviously
<persia> Makes sense.
<LaserJock> koolkat:  the actual MOTU can upload any package in Universe and Multiverse and requires a lot or trust and experience. There are only 80 MOTU
<persia> koolkat: There surely are other projects that also need more people, but we'll all encourage you to participate in universe work, as that's what we do :)
<LaserJock> koolkat: contributing to Ubuntu though is fairly easy and defiantly encouraged
<koolkat> In motu what should I start out doing?
<LaserJock> nixternal, persia: some people actual were getting errors I believe because of the rules thing
<koolkat> I dont know that much(or if any) programming.....i think thats bad
<LaserJock> koolkat: well, do you have an interest in a particular area of software?
<LaserJock> koolkat: many don't when they start
<persia> LaserJock: It prints a message complaining about it, but it fixes it when it complains.  Maybe better to change the language of the warning then to make everyone try to remember chmod +x debian/rules
<koolkat> what do you mean?
<koolkat> LaserJock: What do you mean?
<LaserJock> koolkat: I didn't know how to program when I started contributing
<LaserJock> I still don't know much ;-)
<persia> koolkat: Assuming you run Ubuntu, which are your favorite pieces of software, and which are your most annoying bugs?  Those are typically good places to start.
<koolkat> I like firefox
<LaserJock> persia: how long has that been? seems like people complained about it erroring out
<LaserJock> maybe it was just a complaint
<koolkat> I like gimp also...
 * koolkat confused
<LaserJock> hehe, pick the easy ones :-)
<persia> It reports an error, but it doesn't stop the process.  Looking for the change now (as I don7t ever remember it being a new feature).
<LaserJock> koolkat: for Firefox Ubuntu has a whole Mozilla Team
<koolkat> Thats what i figured
<LaserJock> they always like help :-)
<koolkat> Where do i go for that?
<persia> koolkat: For working with Firefox and related packages, you might want to check for things need doing on #ubuntu-mozillateam.  For gimp, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gimp/+bugs is a list of things to do.
<koolkat> Ill try to work with gimp
<koolkat> firefox probably has alot of people
<LaserJock> koolkat: actually, basically *any* area of Ubuntu needs help
<LaserJock> there's always things needing doing
<LaserJock> even if it's testing and bug triage
<persia> koolkat: There's also a lot of firefox work: lots of packages need adjustment to work well with the newest firefox, and there are lots of other xulrunner applications they handle.  On the other hand, gimp always appreciates love.
<koolkat> So I if contribute anywhere and I am deemed useful I will hopefully eventually become a MOTU?
<LaserJock> koolkat: also note that Firefox and Gimp are in Main, not Universe
<persia> LaserJock: I believe the "must be executable" warning comes from pkg 0.93.9 (from 1994).
<koolkat> Oh....
<LaserJock> koolkat: that's fine of course
<LaserJock> it's just not MOTUs specific responsibility
<persia> koolkat: Exactly.  It was about two years for me, but some people become MOTU in as little as six months.  It depends on how much time you have, and how much work you do.
<koolkat> persia: even if i contribute to firefox?
<koolkat> I have ALOT of time
<LaserJock> heh
<persia> koolkat: Likely.  If you have an interest in FireFox, you'll probably expand to helping work on all the different applications that work with firefox, and a number of them are in universe.
<koolkat> Is chatzilla in the universe?
<persia> koolkat: We call it "seamonkey-chatzilla", but yes.  You can always get the answer to that question with `rmadison -u ubuntu $(package)`
<koolkat> I have to boot to my ubuntu partition.....so ill be back
<koolkat> IM BACK....!!
<koolkat> So .......what do I do again....to get into the bugs stuff?
<koolkat> anyone?
<nixternal> whew, that was a lot of copying/pasting...there were a total of 10
<nixternal> and LaserJock left
 * koolkat lauges
<nixternal> koolkat: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU  <- you will probably find a good deal of the answers you are looking for from that page and its subpages..there is a bugs page somewhere in there :)
<nixternal> bbiaf, gotta catch the news
<koolkat> an launch pad I joined the "Contributors of packages for ubuntu universe" thingy
<persia> koolkat: Welcome.  I'd recommend also joining the bugsquad (see #ubuntu-bugs), and subscribing to the ubuntu-devel@, ubuntu-devel-announce@, and ubuntu-motu@ mailing lists.
<koolkat> I joined.... :-)
<koolkat> So eventually.....if i contribute alot.....ubuntu will invite me to be a MOTU?
<persia> Excellent.  Now you just need some bugs to hunt.  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs lists a for you to examine.
<persia> Yes.  After a while of working on the packages, people will start telling you to apply.  Once you have enough sponsors prepared, you can submit an application.  For now, better to concentrate on the actual bugs.
<ember> talking about gimp..
<ember> can someone from main take a look at bug #189758
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 189758 in gimp "[hardy] Menu entry should be named "GIMP Image Editor" Instead of only the "GNU Image Manipulation Program"" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/189758
<koolkat> persia: how do I know how to fix a bug?
<persia> koolkat: That's the fun part.  Based on the bug, examine the application and the source code, and read various documentation to fix it.  Once you've hunted a couple, you'll have some solutions you know, and can apply that to other packages.  The first one can be a little tricky, but ember's example is good: demonstrating a fix for a bug.
<persia> ember: All the right people are subscribed & assigned.  You just have to wait for a -desktop sponsor.
<koolkat> persia: what do I read?
<persia> koolkat: Depends on the bug.
<koolkat> Ok...for example on this link https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gimp/+bug/186345 what would i read to try to fix it?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 186345 in gimp "histogram disappears in gimp's curves tool" [Low,New]
<persia> ember: Actually, looking at that bug, the updated .desktop file isn't valid.  Please patch it harder so that desktop-file-validate doesn't complain.
<persia> koolkat: Do you understand the problem, and why the graph doesn't appear?
<koolkat> uh....let me think......no
<ember> my bad persia i forgot to follow fd.o
<Fujitsu> ember: Also, the application's name is not GIMP, but The GIMP.
<persia> koolkat: in that case, I'd start by reading about GNOME theme definitions, and looking at the gimp code (especially the file mentioned) to understand how the graph could disappear.  After you have an understanding, you will likely have developed some pointers to other documentation suggesting possible fixes.  Once you have a couple candidates, you can check with upstream to see which would be the least intrusive, and submit that.
<ember> Fujitsu looking at the old patches the change is from The Gimp to GIMP image editor.
<blueyed> koolkat: you can get the gimp source with "apt-get source gimp". Then you could try to find the place where the theme colors get used. Then add a check there if they are the same and use others instead.
<Fujitsu> ember: Well, that's probably wrong.
<Fujitsu> I'd say `The GIMP Image Editor'
<koolkat> I think that i shouldnt of joined.....i know some c++ for Win 32 API but this stuff is confusung
<persia> The GNU Image Manipulation Program Image Editor seems just odd :)
<ember> Fujitsu well that's "THE" is odd on desktop files and stuff
<Fujitsu> persia: It does, true.
<ember> you don't see "The Text Editor"
<ember> and etc
<Fujitsu> ember: Most applications don't have `The' at the start of their names.
<Fujitsu> The GIMP does.
<blueyed> koolkat: then just look at another bug, something easier.
<koolkat> Ugh :-|
<persia> koolkat: There are lots of easier bugs.  Take a look at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.tag=bitesize or https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.tag=packaging or https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.tag=desktop-file
<koolkat> ill try
<ember> Fujitsu where?
<Fujitsu> Hmm, I know it used to be the policy that it must be prefixed with `The', but their website seems to indicate otherwise now.
 * persia thinks they gave up correcting people
<danielm> where patches are submited? launchpad?
<persia> danielm: Yes
<AnAnt> persia: regarding bug #191662 what fix is committed ?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 191662 in ubuntume-gdm-themes "New package for ubuntume-gdm-themes" [Wishlist,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/191662
<persia> AnAnt: It means it got uploaded.  The next step is "Fix Released", which means it is closed.
<AnAnt> persia: uploaded where ? to the queue ?
<AnAnt> persia: btw, do you know why new upstream versions of gpm aren't packaged  (not even in Debian) ?
<persia> AnAnt: To Soyuz.  Once uploaded, it gets put in one of the queues by the upload processor (usually takes a few minutes), and then, depending on the queue, it may be a manual or automatic process to get into the repositories.
<persia> And, no, I don't know anything about gpm packaging
<warp10> Good morning
<LucidFox> How do I exclude a single library from being added to dependencies by dh_shlibdeps?
<LucidFox> (specifically, this is to be able to explicitly depend on libxine1-x | libxine1)
<persia> LucidFox: For that special case, duplicated dependency on libxine1 is acceptable.
<LucidFox> Hmm, but libxine1 pulls all the unneeded stuff, including libxine1-x
<LucidFox> Or will it be changed after the migration is complete?
<persia> It oughtn't.
<persia> Ah.  Right.  I requires libxine1-x, but not xineui.  Hmmm..
<persia> Aha.  libxine1-x depends on libxine1-bin.  libxine1 is the thing that shouldn't be required anymore.
<LucidFox> Indeed. I looked at what you did for codeine, but it depends on both libxine1-x and libxine1.
<LucidFox> as does klear
<persia> Maybe once the transition is complete, the libxine-dev shlibs file can be changed.
<siretart> libxine1-x dependency will be dropped after lenny is released
<siretart> I'd like to keep it at least for hardy for dapper->hardy upgrades.
<persia> siretart: So hardy release will be mid-way through the transition?  If we upload a few things, can we push it all the way for Ubuntu, and catch up later?
<siretart> persia: which transition are you talking about?
<persia> libxine1 -> libxine1-bin
 * siretart confused
<siretart> but I just woke up, so...
<persia> siretart: LucidFox was looking at the leftovers of bug #159338, and noticed that it generated a double-dependency.  Maybe that is right, but if there is anything we can do to make hardy clean, I'd like to do that, just so we don't have too many leftovers for the next LTS.  You certainly know the code best thought.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 159338 in oxine "Re: Heads-up: small xine-lib transition in hardy" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/159338
<persia> s/thought/though/
<siretart> persia: LucidFox: the duble dependency is absolutely correct, no problem here
<geser> james_w: yes, you can file a sync request
<siretart> however, the packages need to manually depend on either libxine1-console or libxine1-x, whatever they actually need
<siretart> perhaps -ffmpeg, if they need to play mp3 files
<LucidFox> siretart> but if a package depends on both libxine1 and libxine1-x, then libxine1 pulls libxine1-x AND libxine1-console and a ton of other stuff
<LucidFox> which is, from what I can discern, is precisely what everyone was trying to avoid
<persia> siretart: The thing being that libxine1 depends on libxine1-x and libxine1-console, so these parallel dependencies aren't actually used.
<james_w> geser: thanks for the ack.
<Tonio_> hello
<Tonio_> someone here to that one ? http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=kdesudo-kde4
<Tonio_> very important on the kubuntu/kde4 side !
<persia> Tonio_: Have you filed a freeze exception?
<Tonio_> persia: nope, I'm waiting for the packaging to be accepted before filing this ;)
<warp10> I'm rebuilding grisbi for libofx3 -> libofx4 transition. Current version is 0.5.9-0ubuntu1, but Maintainer has not been set to MOTU. Should I set it now?
 * stdin sees "Maintainer: Ubuntu MOTU Developers <ubuntu-motu@lists.ubuntu.com>" in grisbi 0.5.9-0ubuntu1
<warp10> stdin: Where did you see that?
<stdin> warp10: from 'apt-cache show grisbi'
<warp10> stdin: mmm... weird. I downloaded the source, and debian/control has a field Maintainer: Benjamin Drieu <benj@debian.org>
<emgent> heya norsetto :)
<norsetto> hiya all
 * norsetto bows to the master of security
<stdin> warp10: hmm, you're right
<warp10> ciao norsetto! good to see you around
<norsetto> stdin: warp10 is always right
<stdin> warp10: wouldn't do any harm to set it correctly now anyway
<warp10> norsetto: heh :)
<warp10> stdin: indeed. Anyway, I'm wondering how this can happen
<persia> stdin: warp10: The binary package carries the restrictions, as it gets set by the pkgbinarymangler script on the buildds.  The source package needs to be updated.
<stdin> I think one of the many scripts the buildd runs can check if the maintainer has an ubuntu.com address
<stdin> ah, so I was mostly right in my assumption there :)
<persia> stdin: Completely right, just missing the package name :)
<warp10> persia, stdin: Ok, I'll update the debian/control therefore
<persia> warp10: There are about 100 other packages that need that sort of attention as well.  Patches appreciated.
<persia> Tonio_: Examining the package now, but you'd do best to get your FFe approved as soon as possible.  Once approved, the upload can always happen a bit later.
<Tonio_> persia: sure, but I plan to release a tarball in between as we are also maintaing the code
<Tonio_> persia: reviewing is another way to get something clean on kde-apps :)
<persia> Tonio_: Then my current review is fairly pointless :)
<warp10> persia: are you speaking about packages needing a transition or about the maintainer issue?
<persia> warp10: Maintainers
<warp10> persia: any tool to find them all?
<persia> warp10: wget -O - http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/hardy/universe/source/Sources.gz| gunzip | grep-dctrl -sPackage,Maintainer -FVersion ubuntu  | grep-dctrl -sPackage -FMaintainer -v -n ubuntu | sort -u
<persia> 183 pending today
<warp10> persia: Good. I'll try to shorten the list.
<persia> warp10: Thank you.  For every package in that state, we're not complying with our agreement with Debian about variation.
<persia> Note that most of them haven't been touched in a while, and would probably benefit from other things, like menu file transition, .desktop cleanup, etc.
 * norsetto -> lunch
<persia> Tonio_: Your package doesn't build in hardy.
<warp10> persia: Indeed! I'll try to find out what every package need and fix accordingly
<Tonio_> persia: hu ??????
<Tonio_> persia: lemme check..... I was asked to update the cdbs content, maybe that causes the issue
<persia> That would be it.  Fails to find /usr/share/cdbs/1/rules/patchsys-quilt.mk, which points at a missing build-dependency.
<Tonio_> ah......
<Tonio_> so stupid....... I don't use patches so removed quilt from builddeps
<Tonio_> that's a cdbs files issue
<persia> Tonio_: Testing is key :)
<jpatrick> Tonio_: blame debian-qt-kde
<Tonio_> jpatrick: I do, I HATE quilt !
 * jpatrick hugs Tonio_ 
<persia> Shouldn't whatever is including that depend on quilt so that the packages don't need to do so individually?
<Tonio_> jpatrick: what's better ? changing cdbs files or adding a stupid builddep to override ?
<Tonio_> jpatrick: I think the builddep is better, as I won't have to consider changing cdbs files everytime
<jpatrick> Tonio_: I just suffer and add quilt to build dep
<Tonio_> persia: it'll be fixed on revu in a few minutes
<jpatrick> persia: some of the debian-qt-kde guys have a thing for quilt
<persia> jpatrick: No issue with that, but isn't there some package that provides the CDBS snippets?  That package ought depend on quilt.
<jpatrick> persia: personally I have no idea why quilt is needed
<persia> Because the recommended CDBS bits include the quilt.mk which means it FTBFS without quilt even when quilt isn't being used.
<Tonio_> persia: you can review again, should be okay this time
<Tonio_> jpatrick: because quilt is horribly powerfull and complex
<Tonio_> jpatrick: exactly what debian likes :)
<persia> Tonio_: I'm going to bed, and I don't see the point of a review when there will be a new upstream before it gets accepted and there's no FFe.
<jpatrick> Tonio_: well, I've always perfered simple-patchsys
<Tonio_> jpatrick: of course now quilt is there, there is absolutly no way to use simple-patchsys, it won't be able to do the job....
<Tonio_> persia: I'm upstream maintainer
<Tonio_> persia: so there won't be another upstream release ;)
<LucidFox> What advantages does quilt have over dpatch, apart from not using non-standard headers?
<persia> It's a little easier to avoid patch conflicts with quilt, because it's a little smarter about these things.
<albert23> I have a package (gcal) that built fine a week ago, but now fails, see http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/4681/. CFLAGS from debian/rules are now passed to configure and make it fail, which didn't happen with the old dpkg.
<albert23> Downgrading dpkg to the old version solves the problem. With the new dpkg I have to remove the single quotes from CFLAGS='-O2 -Wall $$(INC) -pg'
<albert23> Is that a bug in dpkg or is it a bug in gcal that now became visible?
<RainCT> Hey
<persia> albert23: It's a bug in gcal unless you can find more than 20 packages that now FTBFS, in which case it becomes a bug in dpkg for now, and a bug in gcal for hardy+1.
<albert23> persia: ok, then I will make an update for gcal
<james_w> Hi. Could someone clarify a couple of points about imports from Debian for me please?
<james_w> firstly are new packages in Debian auto-synced? Or do they require a sync request the first time?
<RainCT> james_w: they are auto-synced before DebianImportFreeze starts
<james_w> RainCT: thanks. You've answered my second question as well.
<RainCT> james_w: and after DebianImportFreeze they require a manual request (and right now for Hardy they would also require a Freeze Exception as there is Feature Freeze)
<RainCT> heh
<james_w> Would it be correct to say that a synced package has no changes made to it in Ubuntu.
<Nafallo> yes
<james_w> I guess things like pkg-striptranslations kind of break this don't they?
<james_w> and is Maintainer automatically changed for syncs?
<Nafallo> not sure I'm involved heavily enough to answer any more.
<james_w> the answer to the second part is yes according to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebianMaintainerField
<Nafallo> pkg-striptranslations were only for main last time I checked, which was ages ago.
<james_w> I've gone with "the source package is just rebuilt in the latest development version of Ubuntu. Any changes that are made are purely automated."
<persia> There have been slips in the past.  Check your buildlog to be sure.
<james_w> I'm only talking in general, so I'll ignore any mistakes.
<geser> james_w: during the sync the source package is taken as is from Debian (and stays unmodified)
<geser> the maintainer change, pkgstripstranslation and pkg-create-dbgsym only happen during build of the binary debs (and also only affect them).
<james_w> geser: thanks.
 * norsetto <- lunch
<LucidFox> warp10, thanks for opting to take care of the libofx transition!
<RainCT> asac: ping
 * RainCT is looking for something to do
 * maikeru is looking for lunch
<jpatrick> RainCT: fix bug #1
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 1 in ubuntu "Microsoft has a majority market share" [Critical,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1
<RainCT> :D
<warp10> LucidFox: my pleasure! grisbi builds fine, now I'm checking the others
<warp10> LucidFox: kmymoney2 has been rebuilt two days ago, so it got libofx4 already. (http://people.ubuntu.com/~ubuntu-archive/NBS/libofx3)
<shirish> hi all, I want to file  a feature-freeze exception, I have a question about a command.
<shirish> This is the command given in the wiki of feature freeze exception process
<shirish> diff -ruN <package>-{old-version,new-version} | diffstat > diffstat.txt
<shirish> warp10: if u can help me it would be nice.
<geser> shirish: what question do you have?
<shirish> now I have 2 upstream tarballs which are both .tar.gz , now do I need to gunzip both of them to different directories or how?
<warp10> shirish: I'm sorry, I'm going away for a while. I'm sure someone else can help you
<geser> shirish: usually they should unpack to different dir names but you can check before doing it
<shirish> geser: right, so the first thing is to unpack them to different directories right?
<shirish> geser: the tarballs are swfdec-0.5.5.tar.gz & swfdec-0.4.5.tar.gz
<geser> shirish: yes, and usually the tar.gz already create a subdir
<slicer> Does PPA not support multi-package packages? (ie: one source package produces several different binary packages).
<jpatrick> slicer: yes it does
<slicer> jpatrick: Odd. I can see both packages being built in the buildlog, but only the first is put in my archive.
<jpatrick> slicer: prehaps it's lagging
<slicer> jpatrick: Indeed it is. It just appeared now :)
<shirish> geser: are u there m8?
<geser> yes
<shirish> geser: I have untarred both the upstream versions, now how I do run the command
<shirish> geser: both are in different directories
<shirish> diff -ruN <package>-{old-version,new-version} | diffstat > diffstat.txt
<james_w> shirish: diff -Nru swfdec-0.4.5 swfdec-0.5.5 | diffstat
<geser> I assume the dirs are named swfdec-0.4.5 and swfdec-0.5.5
<shirish> geser: yes, right.
<shirish> what is Nru for?
<shirish> geser: or it should be ruN
<geser> man diff: -N: also diff new files, -r: recursive, -u: unified diff
<geser> the order of the options doesn't matter
<Nafallo> run is easier to remember :-)
<pochu> alias diff='diff -ruN' is even easier :)
<geser> shirish: and <package>-{old-version,new-version} expands to <package>-old-version <package>-new-version
<shirish> right
<dcordero> hi
<netzmeister> hi
<bobbo> Could a MOTU have a look at http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=torrentinfo ?
<jpatrick> !nickspam > UbuCat_
<UbuCat_> oops :P
 * RainCT > comments(bobbo)
<RainCT> bobbo: are you upstream?
<bobbo> RainCT: no
<RainCT> ah I see
<protonchris> It was recommended to me that I add a get-orig-source target to a package.  Can anyone in here point me to an example or documenation for that target?
<bobbo> RainCT: its my first proper packaging attempt so ive probably done some bits wrong
<RainCT> bobbo: was it intended to be a native package?
<RainCT> s/was/is
<bobbo> RainCT: no
<hellboy195> jono our community hero is here :P
<jono> hellboy195:  :)
<hellboy195> jono: btw, I'm also trying to become a MTOU *awaitingforjonoscongratulations* but I hope it's ok that I don't want to expose me like Efrain Valles
<hellboy195> s/me/myself
<RainCT> bobbo: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=torrentinfo you've a bit of work :)
<RainCT> bobbo: also, if you haven't noticed it, there is Feature Freeze now (no new packages can get into Hardy unless you get an exception)
<bobbo> RainCT: so all packages now go into Hardy+1?
<jpatrick> bobbo: no, hardy+1 is not yet opened
<geser> bobbo: the packages currently on REVU will wait till hardy+1 is open for development, so don't expect a quick review
<RainCT> geser: already reviewed ;)
<emgent> gentoo #203265
<emgent> ubotu argh
<ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about argh - try searching on http://ubotu.ubuntu-nl.org/factoids.cgi
<RainCT> protonchris: still want to know about get-orig-source?
<protonchris> RainCT: yes, please
<RainCT> protonchris: I don't know how good they are, but here you have 2 examples: http://paste.ubuntu.com/4684/
<protonchris> RainCT: thanks.  I'll take a look.
<netzmeister> hello
<netzmeister> Are there reasons why Songbird isn't packaged yet?
<crimsun_> netzmeister: see debian #412437
<ubotu> Debian bug 412437 in wnpp "ITP: songbird -- desktop Web player, a digital jukebox and Web browser" [Wishlist,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/412437
<netzmeister> crimsun_, Everybody want be a Co Maintainer. So i am right if i think that there is no "Maintainer"?
<crimsun_> netzmeister: I'm sorry, but I don't understand the context behind that question.  Are you referring to that bug report (in Debian) or to Ubuntu MOTU?
<james_w> netzmeister: no, there is a "Maintainer", but you can have more than one person looking after the package. It is even possible to have a team as Maintainer.
<netzmeister> crimsun_, sorry for confusing you.
<netzmeister> james_w, Thx.
<netzmeister> crimsun_, i asked myself why there is no songbird package in feisty, gutsy etc..
<Lamego> netzmeister, read the bug reporte
<crimsun_> netzmeister: right.  Getting the package into Debian will benefit both Debian and Ubuntu, so that is the preferred mechanism.
<netzmeister> crimsun_, okay
<jdong> vorian: looks like your beloved KTorrent4 has just released 3.0.0
<jdong> you should request a FFe on it
 * RainCT is preparing a new ubuntu-dev-tools release for Hardy
<hellboy195> RainCT: nice :)
<superm1> RainCT, you should add a check to it for if there is a bzr branch and debian/changelog hasn't been committed you can't debuild....
<superm1> (while your at it)
<superm1> i've been meaning to sort that out for ages :)
<netzmeister> RainCT:  What are the changes?
<RainCT> netzmeister: more or less this http://paste.ubuntu.com/4688/plain (I'm sorting out the biggest changes from the branch)
<RainCT> superm1: what do you mean?
<superm1> RainCT, well all too often people will go and upload changes without committing them to the branch
<superm1> so a check to make sure that if VCS-Bzr or VCS-Git etc are set
<superm1> then make sure that changelog is committed there
<RainCT> superm1: where..?
<superm1> RainCT, well i guess thinking more about it, that is probably more appropriate for devscripts
<superm1> nvm :)
<RainCT> superm1: mustn't that go into dpkg-buildpackage?
<superm1> RainCT, i was thinking same place that the check for the Maintainer with ubuntu.com in the email addy went
<RainCT> that's in dpkg I think
<RainCT> but I don't see how your idea would work..
<superm1> RainCT, well something along the lines of doing a "lite" checkout
<RainCT> (beside the difficulties to determine wheter it's committed or not, for each build ssytem)
<superm1> well just checking if its committed to the branch listed in debian/control
<RainCT> a) what happens if the Vcs- fields are from Debian? How would you do an Ubuntu revision?
<superm1> well there would have to be exceptions for that i suppose.
<superm1> or a local branch would have to be made from debian
<superm1> which actually wouldn't be a "horrible" idea, but then you're right you run into cases of projects using the bzr branch/git branch differently
<RainCT> b) what's if you don't want to commit it? (eg, I'm not going to commit the upload that I'm getting ready now, as it's a checkout from the branch with some stuff removed as I'm not sure if it would need a Freeze Exception)
<superm1> well I guess i'll need to get a nice spec together for this then to cover cases like that
<RainCT> :)
<RainCT> or perhaps just add a warning
<RainCT> wow, I think I fixed pbuilder-dist
<RainCT> anyone up for desting?
<RainCT> *testing
<mok0> RainCT: I'd be interested if you would make it use cowbuilder
<RainCT> mok0: what's the difference?
<mok0> cowbuilder is a lot faster
<mok0> RainCT: you don't need the packing/unpacking of base.tgz
<RainCT> mok0: oh, cool. is it just pbuilder but without compressing or is there some other difference?
<mok0> RainCT: it uses cowdancer, allowing copy-on-write file access
<mok0> http://packages.ubuntu.com/hardy/utils/cowdancer
 * RainCT will have a look at it some day :)
<ScottK2> RainCT: Are you interested in hacking on the pbuilder package itself?
 * geser uses pbuilder on a tmpfs and it is really nice and fast :)
<ScottK2> geser: I was thinking it'd be nice for pbuilder to have a --build-twice-in-a-row option.
<superm1> ScottK2, what for?
<ScottK2> In Debian there is a requirement for packages to build twice in a row to make sure the archive is rebuildable.
<ScottK2> It does ensure things are clean at the end of the build.
<ScottK2> So it's an additional QA check that I suspect would be easy to integrate into pbuilder.  Currently I use pbuilder login and debuild is twice.
<geser> ScottK2: couldn't you do it through hooks?
<ScottK2> I suspect you could, but part of the point of pbuilder is to make it easy to build in a clean environment.
<superm1> ScottK2, ah so that allows for sane circular dependencies if necessary too
<superm1> correct?
<kdub> looking at either of these would be appreciated: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=tv-grab-dvb and http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=ocropus
<RainCT> kdub: you know there is Feature Freeze?
<ScottK2> superm1: I don't think so.  I think the first build would still fail, but I'm not sure.
<kdub> nope im a newb to the whole motu thing
<RainCT> kdub: well, I'll look at one, but recently the so called "Feature Freeze" started; this means that no new packages can get into Hardy unless they get a Feature Freeze Exception (ie, two members of the motu-release team accept it)
<ScottK2> And for new packages there needs to be a really good reason.
<kdub> RainCT: thanks, im just trying to get started, im not hellbent on getting anything into hardy...
<ScottK2> kdub: Your best bet for learning now is to look for bugs tagged bitesize and packaging and see if you can work on any of those.
<kdub> ScottK2: thanks, i think ill go start that now...
<ScottK2> kdub: Another option is to look for bugs tagged patch and see if you can package the patch and produce a good debdiff.
<RainCT> kdub: I'm looking at ocropus. First impressions: Remove README.Debian; the syntax to close the bug in debian/changelog is wrong, it should be just "LP: #nnnn"; you probably want priority: optional in debian/rules; short and long descriptions in debian/rules are wrong, check the packaging policy; debian/copyright: "It was downloaded from <url://example.com>", list full names of authors and their email (between <and>, next to the name) if possible;
<kdub> RainCT: thanks! tv grab probably needs those fixes too...
<RainCT> is it possible to "whitelist" a command so that sudo doesn't ask the password for it?
<ScottK> RainCT: I think the answer was even if you could, you really almost certainly don't want to.
<RainCT> ScottK: I want :). It's very anoying having to write the password for pbuilder each time, and I often forget to do so as it needs some seconds to ask it. Also, this computer is only used by me (and like 95% of time when I'm away the screen is locked), so the biggest danger is that one that I might write the password somewhere else (like here) insted of on the terminal.
<ScottK2> There is always sudo -i then run pbuilder, but no guarantees on the results.
<RainCT> Wasn't there some file where you could specify commands that can run as root without password? Or did I dream that? :P
<TheMuso> RainCT: There is also sbuild.
<TheMuso> Once set up, no root password is necessary.
<vorian> jdong: thanks for the heads up :)
<jdong> vorian: certainly :)
<geser> RainCT: you can whitelist a command (incl. options) in sudoers
<ScottK2> norsetto: I'd appreciate it if you'd ack Bug 192535 and Bug 192622
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 192535 in usplash-theme-ubuntustudio "FF: General exception for Ubuntustudio packages." [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/192535
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 192622 in kdesudo "[Feature Freeze Exception]New upstream release (kde4 port)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/192622
<ScottK2> norsetto: Bug 192486 too
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 192486 in nuvexport "MythTV 0.21 Suite FFe" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/192486
<ScottK2> TheMuso: Or you ^^^
<norsetto> scottk2: to tell you the truth I would feel kind of silly to ack tonio/jr
<bmhm> hi, I'd like to request an update of "pioneers", so I can play with my friends (they're on windows) again
<ScottK2> norsetto: Someone has to do it.
<bddebian> Heya gang
<ScottK2> Heya bddebian.
<bddebian> Hi ScottK2
<norsetto> bidibibodibidou bddebian
<bddebian> Heh, hi norsetto
<hellboy195> norsetto: thx for looking at my stuff :)
<norsetto> hellboy195: my pleasure ;-)
<ScottK> superm1: Would you mind filing a general FFe bug like Ubuntu Studio did (see Bug #192535) so we can get a MythTV FFe for this cycle documented.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 192535 in usplash-theme-ubuntustudio "FF: General exception for Ubuntustudio packages." [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/192535
<bmhm> hi, I'd like to request an update of "pioneers", so I can play with my friends (they're on windows) again
 * RainCT wonders what ScottK thinks about bmhm's question
<bmhm> yeah
<bmhm> there are no .deb-packages at all
<ScottK> bmhm: No .deb for pioneers at all or none for the updated version?
<bmhm> at all
<bmhm> hardys packages wont work
<ScottK> So there is a Hardy package, but it's incompatible with the current version?
<ScottK> bmhm: ?
<bmhm> yeah because of libpango and libc6
<bmhm> ScottK: I was typing
<ScottK> In general, I think that it's reasonable to update networked games for multi-platform compatibility.  If someone were willing to package the newer version, I'd personally be inclined to approved the request.
<bmhm> ScottK: I can try, but I never created .deb-packages other than by checkinstall
<bmhm> additionaly, I just got amd64-installations
<ScottK> That won't get accepted.
<ScottK> So the trick would be to find  MOTU that's interested in the game.  Maybe RainCT qualifies?
<bmhm> i might want to apply for canonical if my girlfriend is beeing sent to africa. I am an application developer, but just did mainframe-assembler so far ^^
<Nafallo> ehrm
<Nafallo> what?
<bmhm> IBM's z/OS High level Assembler
<Nafallo> why would your gf have to be an african? :-P
<bmhm> that's what I do at work
<bmhm> noooo
<norsetto> scottk: might I be so bold as to ask why the beta condition for mythtv?
<bmhm> you didn't get it.. she studies theology here in germy, and german protestant churches might send her to africa
 * RainCT doesn't know the game but might have a look at this some day this week if he gets subscribed to a bug explaining the issue
<bmhm> then I would follow her
<ScottK> norsetto: Sure
<RainCT> bmhm: Canonical's offices aren't in africa :P
<bmhm> damn ^^
<Nafallo> I was about to say that :-)
<RainCT> afaik they have administration in Isle of Man, servers in London (UK) and support team in Canada, and developers work from their home
<bmhm> home? sounds good enough to me
<RainCT> also, most MOTU's aren't from Canonical but just volunteers
<bmhm> I wouldn't want to be a motu
<ScottK> norsetto: Two reasons: 1. The myth packages aren't used just by mythbuntu, so I'm not comfortable with a complete waiver like I am with the meta packages.  2.  To give the mtyhbuntu packagers leverage with upstream to say it must be released by X date or I don't know if it gets in.  That way there's some wiggle room if last minute problems ocurr.
<bmhm> I'd apply as a application developer
<Nafallo> RainCT: not entirely true, but lets not talk about that now :-)
<bmhm> :-)
<RainCT> Nafallo: which part?
<norsetto> scottk: right, but what if we have a problem by beta? We end up having a semi-completed suite which seems worst than sticking to 0.20?
<ScottK> norsetto: We probably waive it through after taking a close look at it, but I think having the free pass expire before release is sensible.
<Nafallo> RainCT: dunno how confidential they want to keep things.
<Nafallo> RainCT: so can't really tell
<norsetto> scottk: just trying to be pragmatic here, I think it makes sense to either grant it or not
 * norsetto is not well known for mental flexibility after all
<ScottK> norsetto: I can see that, but I'd like to have an end to a free for all on packages that complex (same reason, BTW, why I haven't asked for a general waiver on clamav).
<bmhm> RainCT: I am pretty sure hardy's packages would work if you'd just drop dependencies to gutsy's
<ScottK> bmhm: So Hardy is up to date, it's a backport to Gutsy you want?
<bmhm> yeah
<bmhm> exactly
<ScottK> That's different.
<norsetto> scottk: thats right, and is the same reason why I don't feel very confortable in acking it
<bmhm> I installed hardy already on my laptop... some crashes but in general it works flawlessly
<ScottK> norsetto: I'm pretty sure we do it this way they'll release before the beta and it's no trouble, but OK if you aren't comfortable.
<bmhm> I was about to make some requests for kernel compile options so my battery lasts longer...
<ScottK> bmhm: Then what you want is backports and the prevu tool.
<ScottK> !backports | bmhm
<ubotu> bmhm: If new updated Ubuntu packages are built for an application, then they may go into Ubuntu Backports. See https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuBackports - See also !packaging
<emgent> heya all
<bmhm> ScottK: sorry, I now what backports are, but just forgot about them
<ScottK> No problem.  I suspect what you are wanting is a source backport since the packaging will have to be changed.
<bmhm> source backport? So no binaries are being shipped?
<bmhm> just because some motus set false dependencies? I did take a look at pioneer's webpage - deps didn't change at all
<bmhm> so why not lower dependencies at all?
<bmhm> also, ScottK, the wiki is not up to date. there is no link to gutsy's request page :P
<ScottK> bmhm: It may be that the dependencies are a result of what it was compiled against and if you build it against the Gutsy tool chain using prevu it will be just fine.
<ScottK> bmhm: It's a wiki.  Feel free to fix it.
<bmhm> ah i see
<bmhm> ScottK: I don't know the link, so I cannot fix it ;-)
<bmhm> I created some pages already
<bmhm> erhm... one to be honest. My laptop's page.
<ScottK> bmhm: No, a source backport is when the package has to be changed when backported.  Binaries still get built, just it takes a source upload to make the change rather than just a straight copy from the existing Hardy package.
<bmhm> ok thanks for the info, ScottK
<ScottK> No problem.
<bmhm> I will see if I can do that on my own. Can't be that hard, can it?
<ScottK> I've heard people say prevu is pretty easy, but I've not used it.
<bmhm> I just don't know about cross-compiling. But I'll see.
<ScottK> RainCT: You might want to look at a message in debian-devel subject MBF: Debian upstream version higher than watch file-reported upstream version - a couple of your packages appear.
<RainCT> ScottK: is it a problem?
<ScottK> Perhaps.
<RainCT> and which are they? afaik it's only one
<ScottK> Â glest (U) andÂ  Â lightyears
<RainCT> ScottK: glest's watch file is broken; I already fixed it in SVN some hours ago (and it isn't mine, I'm co-maintainer) :)
<ScottK> OK.  I'm just reading the message.
<RainCT> ScottK: but thanks for the warning :)
<emgent> jdstrand, ping
<RainCT> btw, CC By-NC is non-free, or?
<ScottK> RainCT: NC = Non-commercial, right?
<RainCT> yes
<ScottK> RainCT: Then it's non-free/multiverse
<RainCT> ScottK: thx
<RainCT> (ubuntu-dev-tools 0.26 uploaded)
<RainCT> hm.. anyone knows it it's easy to get new scripts into cdbs?
<RainCT> bah nvm, I would be unable to create one anyways :P
<siretart> RainCT: most likely it depends on the scripts
<norsetto> shouldn't we use an ubuntu version also for rebuilds!?
<bmhm> RainCT: so will it be updated or do I have to register for launchpad or so?
<Nafallo> norsetto: buildX
<ScottK> norsetto: No.  If it's a no change rebuild, use build1 so it'll get sync'ed over in Hardy +1
<bmhm> s/register/sign up/g
<norsetto> so if its -1 it becomes -1build1, ok, thanks
<ScottK> norsetto: Yes
<bmhm> ScottK: : so will it be updated or do I have to sign up for launchpad or so?
 * ScottK grumbles about improvments in requestsync...  Spawning an editor is really more trouble than was needed.
<ScottK> bmhm: Did you test it?
<bmhm> Hardys packages worked well, I used --force for testing purposes
<ScottK> bmhm: The backports process starts with someone asking for a backport by filing a bug against gutsy-backports (so yes, you need to sign up on Launchpad).
<bmhm> :-(
<bmhm> ScottK: OK, I'll see
<ScottK> Also you need to build the package against the Gutsy tool chain for the testing to count.  Forcing the Hardy package doesn't cut it.
<ScottK> (hence my earlier comments about prevu).
<bmhm> ScottK, RainCT: Here you are: https://bugs.launchpad.net/gutsy-backports/+bug/192751
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 192751 in gutsy-backports "Backport of network game "pioneers"" [Undecided,New]
<bmhm> I hop I did it right
<bmhm> *hope
<ScottK> bmhm: That's a proper request.  To get approved/done it needs someone to build/test it.
<bmhm> fine
<bmhm> thanks for helping
<RainCT> What name do you suggest for the package that will contain Python modules (from ubuntu-dev-tools source package; that is, right now, the new ppaput module)? python-ubuntu-devtools?
<TheMuso> RainCT: Why add --no-changelog for update-maintainer?
<RainCT> TheMuso: because I can't never remember if it is --nochangelog (which was the only accepted option before) or --no-changelog.
<pochu> RainCT: -n ? :)
<TheMuso> RainCT: Ok, fair enough, but it seems rather pointless IMO.
<RainCT> :P
<TheMuso> RainCT: You didn't document it in the usage either.
<RainCT> TheMuso: listing both was to long :P
<RainCT> (in the --help, dunno, why I didn't list it in the manpage; adding it there)
<RainCT> s/dunno,/dunno
<RainCT> TheMuso: any suggestion for the python-* package naming?
<TheMuso> RainCT: Nope.
<norsetto> RainCT: you could have added it as a --oh-god-I-forgot-it-again option (fairly easy to remember too)
<norsetto> this is a good candidate for the most unpronounceable package name: sabnzbdplus
 * RainCT names it python-ubuntu-utils for now
<RainCT> norsetto: heh
 * RainCT votes for it
<ScottK> RainCT: Why are you making a separate package?
<RainCT> ScottK: Andrew Hunter split ppaput into a module and the command per see, which should get into a python- package (dholbach is happy with this)
<RainCT> (er, the module should get into a python- package, not the command)
<ScottK> So you can make a 2nd binary pakcage out of the current source package.  Since it's a python module, Pyhon policy tells you what the binary package name should be.
<RainCT> ScottK: the idea is to later add more modules to this package (if policy allows this)
<ScottK> Right.
<ScottK> Source package name can be whatever you want (I recommend leaving it in the ubuntu-dev-tools source package)
<bmhm> hmm I will try prevu now
<bmhm> perhaps I can contribute, too. Or at least help.
<ScottK> bmhm: Great.
<bmhm> german wiki at ubuntuusers is pretty good
<bmhm> hmm I should request a package "prevu-doc" =)
<bmhm> no man-pages, no --help...
<ScottK> bmhm: Feel free to pick on jdong.  It's his baby.
<bmhm> :D it's ok
<bmhm> enough trouble for today ;-)
<RainCT> jdong: add a manpage, I like them ;)
<bmhm> xD
<bmhm> I am off, gn8
 * norsetto remembers telling jdong about manpages about 6 months ago ....
<RainCT> jdong: have a look at POD if you don't like groff :P
 * norsetto wonders who is the scotty in bmhm's last comment and why he did that ....
<TheMuso> RainCT: I like manpages also.
<TheMuso> I think in general, people find manpages tedious to write.
<hellboy195> TheMuso: normal users don't use manpages ;)
<jdong> norsetto: yeah yeah yeah manpages, on my todo list :)
<RainCT> jdong: do you know POD? I'd write a post about it, but the last Wordpress upgrade broke my block :P
<TheMuso> hellboy195: I know, but technical users do.
<jdong> I was gonna write it earlier but when I got started writing it, I thought about doing some UI changes :)
<jdong> RainCT: heard of it, yeah. I personally have no problem using groff just need to find the time to do it
<hellboy195> TheMuso: there aren't a lot out there ^^
 * RainCT just needed to say that wordpress is evil :D
<TheMuso> hellboy195: In any case, its policy that we write them.
<hellboy195> TheMuso: yeah, sure
 * RainCT announces that he won't advocate any package without manpage :P
<jdong> prevu was packaged way in the historical times
 * ScottK remembers someone grumbling just yesterday about pyclamd man pages ...
<RainCT> *any package cointaining executable commands without manpage ;)
<protonchris> can anyone point me to an example get-orig-source that uses uscan/uupdate?
<persia> protonchris: http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-games/2008/02/msg00135.html is a recent example of one of mine.
<pochu> hey persia. I had forgot about the gstreamer plugin. I have some time now, do you want to explain me what it is about?
<persia> pochu: I'm a little time-limited, but I noticed your name in a bunch of changelogs, so wanted to ask for your help.  I was trying to include the wildimidi gstreamer plugin to address bug #111555, but kept getting stuck because the plugin was unable to initialise.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 111555 in timidity "package gstreamer sw midi playback plugin" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/111555
<persia> I added libwildmidi0-dev to build-depends, patched the makefile to build wildmidi without timidity, and included it in the .install file.  Am I missing some essential piece to make it work?
<protonchris> persia: thanks.
<RainCT> good night
 * norsetto thinks he is going to bed
<pochu> persia: not that I know of
<persia> protonchris: There's a couple bugs in that code, e.g. it should generate $(package)_$(version).orig.tar.gz rather than $(package)-$(version).orig.tar.gz, and it doesn't check to make sure the temporary directory doesn't exist before repacking.
<persia> pochu: Hmm.  My problem was that gst-inspect had trouble loading it, but perhaps I'll have to dig through the symbols.  Thanks.
<pochu> persia: what's the problem with b-d on a daemon?
<persia> pochu: Because the daemon can't launch in the buildds (plus, it's messy).
<pochu> persia: slomo is the gstreamer mister. I'm just learning, btw :)
<pochu> s/mister/master/
 * norsetto IS going to bed
<norsetto> see you all
<hellboy195> gn8 @all
<pochu> persia: I don't understand what the daemon issue is. Does libtimidity ship a daemon? And what's the conflict issue? There's no libtimidity in the archive...
<DktrKranz> does anybody know where I can get a copy of multidistrotools?
<DktrKranz> nevermind, found
<persia> pochu: libtimidity is a different source than timidity, and is an overlay library.  Gstreamer is written against timidity directly.  Earlier discussion on the issue (resulting in your comment on the bug) was about extracting a hypothetical libtimidity out of timidity, but I now believe this would be a confusing solution because of the different existing upstream libtimidity, and further find that the timidity package doesn't really have an extrac
<pochu> persia: your message was cut, "package doesn't really have an extrac"
<persia> an extractable library, as such, and would likely need a serious rewrite to expose an embedded library.  (Also, I'm not really here now)
<persia> (and really not here now... )
#ubuntu-motu 2009-02-09
<sven777> would a MOTU be so kind as to review my package? Thanks in advance! http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=lmalinux
<jsmidt> How do you convert a patch, my.patch, into a format dpatch will understand?
<ScottK> jsmidt: Use dpatch-edit-patch.  See it's man page.
<ScottK> it's/its
<jsmidt> ScottK, thanks
<ScottK> txwikinger: Would you please update ichthux-meta to drop arts.  We're trying to get it removed from Jaunty: https://wiki.kubuntu.org/RemoveArts
<ScottK> Please mark on the wiki page when you've done it.
<txwikinger> ScottK: ok.. will do
<ScottK> Thanks
<txwikinger> np
<chrismurf> I just started trying to package a new package today for Universe - is Jaunty still worth targeting? Is it possible to add new packages to Jaunty?
<nhandler> chrismurf: New packages can still be added. But Feature Freeze is coming up soon. So if you want to get it into Jaunty, you might want to get it finished and uploaded to REVU asap
<chrismurf> nhandler, thank you -- first package, so I will do what I can -- just wondering if I should try and target Jaunty or go +1
<nhandler> chrismurf: You can try and target Jaunty. Worst case scenario is that you have to change one word in your changelog for Jaunty+1
<chrismurf> Fair enough :-)
<nhandler> chrismurf: You could also upload it to your PPA until the Jaunty+1 repositories open up
<chrismurf> done for intrepid ;-)
<chrismurf> Can somebody recommend an MIT licensed package to use as a reference for 'debian/copyright'?  All examples seem to be GPL/GPL.
<chrismurf> better yet, a way to use apt-cache or otherwise to find such a package :-)
<chrismurf> Anybody up for reviewing a first package?  It's a python library for doing geographical projections, pyproj.  http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/pyproj
<dholbach> good morning
<chrismurf> good morning
<dholbach> hi chrismurf, hi iulian
<iulian> Morning dholbach.
<fabrice_sp> Hiya dholbach !
<dholbach> hi fabrice_sp
<fabrice_sp> Morning iulian
<iulian> Hey fabrice_sp.
<dholbach> how's life, guys? :)
<fabrice_sp> dholbach, as usual (even if a bit colder than usual, with snow some days ago in Madrid :-) )
<chrismurf> life's good - just got my first package into REVU, getting towards bedtime, and had a pleasant weekend :-)
<dholbach> chrismurf: nice
<dholbach> fabrice_sp: it's snowing here too right now
<fabrice_sp> dholbach, but it's more normal, in your case, isn't it?
<fabrice_sp> :-)
<dholbach> I guess so :)
<fabrice_sp> How are you doing?
<dholbach> good good, thanks :)
<chrismurf> If any MOTU's have an interest in reviewing said package, it'd be much appreciated : http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/pyproj (it's a python library for doing geographical / map projections)
<fabrice_sp> chrismurf, please don't ask each hour for a review
<chrismurf> fabrice_sp, I'm off to bed soon, figured I'd try one more time before crashing
<chrismurf> apologies if I'm over exuberant, I promise not to saturate motu with "pay attention to ME" :-)
<chrismurf> thanks for the friendly reminder
<chrismurf> take care all, thanks for the guidance today
<fabrice_sp> chrismurf, the more you request attention, the less you will have :-)
<fabrice_sp> I'll try to have a look at your package this evening
<chrismurf> OK - not what the tutorial left me thinking - I'll bear that in mind
<fabrice_sp> (even if I'm not a MOTU)
<chrismurf> the tutorial suggested it was beneficial to ask in MOTU
<chrismurf> is it better to just leave it sitting in REVU?
<chrismurf> let people get to it when they do?
<fabrice_sp> chrismurf, yes, but no more than 2 times a day, I think
<chrismurf> okay, well I've used my two ;-)
<fabrice_sp> lol
<chrismurf> thanks - take care
<fabrice_sp> bye
<didrocks> good morning
<quadrispro> hi dholbach
<slangasek> RainCT: hrm, why are you writing 'acked' in your own sync requests? :-)
<iulian> slangasek: For karma? ;)
<slangasek> heh
<dholbach> Laney: does the new openarena need the new -data?
<quadrispro> dholbach: have you read my messages? :)
<dholbach> quadrispro: yes and I replied :)
<quadrispro> dholbach: doh, my connection was lost :(
<dholbach> just replied again
<quadrispro> dholbach: thank you very much ;)
<dholbach> anytime :)
<stefanlsd> Does anyone know when debuild stopped ignoring .bzr directories?
<soren> did you pass -i<something> to it?
<stefanlsd> soren: i am doing -i.bzr now, but it always used to work without it. so was just wondering when it changed
<soren> stefanlsd: How exactly were you invoking debuild before?
<soren> keyword being: "exactly"
<stefanlsd> soren: debuild -S -sa
<soren> In that case, I'm clueless.
<soren> :)
<stefanlsd> soren: hehe. yeah. wierd. cause i've always made bzr trees of packages im working with, it always used to ignore the .bzr stuff. now it fails. shrug
<Laney> dholbach: I don't think it needs it, but there is a sync coming up for that anyway
<Laney> actually I can't request it until tonight, so it'd be good if you could
<Laney> (it works fine)
<lamothe> Hi all, if there's a package that I have in Debian but it's way old because Debian has been in freeze for a while, is it too late to ask for universe to be updated with a more recent release?
<jpds> lamothe: Not at all, you have until the 29th.
<mok0> lamothe: what is it
<lamothe> mok0: jpds: me-tv.
 * mok0 looks
<lamothe> I've been kinda keeping experimental up to date ... but I'm not a DD ... and my uploader is AWOL.
<rocco> wow.......this room seems bigger than I remember
<mok0> lamothe: it's in experimental?
<lamothe> mok0: Debian experimental.
<mok0> rocco: this is not a room, it's achannel ;-)
<lamothe> mok0: Did I say the wrong thing?
<mok0> lamothe: no
<cbx33> ahh that's better
<cbx33> maybe it's not a room in the physical sense
<mok0> lamothe: why do you think that?
<lamothe> mok0: Oh, no reason, I think that you couldn't find it in experimental.  I misinterpreted your question.
<lamothe> *though
<mok0> lamothe: he, I found it. OK, you need to file a sync-request bug on LP, see here:
<lamothe> You wouldn't guess but English is my first language. ;)
<mok0> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SyncRequestProcess
<lamothe> mok0: Ta!
<mok0> lamothe: Ah, well that explains it :-)
<mok0> lamothe: plz check to see that it builds on Jaunty also
<mok0> lamothe: because we are well past DIF
<lamothe> mok0: Sure, without a doubt I will do that.  I think that it's always a good idea to build it on the target system.
<mok0> lamothe: great! Thanks!
<lamothe> But should I then use Utnubu ... is it still around.
 * lamothe looks
<mok0> lamothe: eeerr?
<lamothe> http://wiki.debian.org/Utnubu
<mok0> lamothe: your app is already in Debian
<lamothe> mok0: I thought that Utnubu synced changes back into Debian.
<james_w> ScottK: could you explain what you mean by "tame ezsetup"?
<mok0> lamothe: but are there changes? I thought you just want to bring the version from Debian experimental to jaunty
<lamothe> mok0: Oh .. yeah, I didn't think of that
<lamothe> I just thought that I could build one for Jaunty.
<lamothe> mok0: Either way, I'm easy.
<mok0> lamothe: I already checked to see that there are no Ubuntu-specific changes in me-tv, so what we need to do is a straight sync. Archive admins have scripts for that
<ScottK> james_w: Sure.  ezsetup will try and download updates from the internet if they are missing.  In my case I didn't have python-setuptools installed on my system where I was building it, so it tried to install it from cheeseshop.
<lamothe> I'm mostly on Ubuntu nowadays and sometimes I lose my Debian uploader.
<ScottK> james_w: Generally we patch packages to not do that.
<james_w> ScottK: so what not add python-setuptools as a Build-Depends?
<ScottK> No, just disable the ezsetup part.
<mok0> lamothe: theres a cli-tool called requestsync if your'e into that sort of thing
<ScottK> james_w: You'll see I just commented out two lines in setup.py.
<mok0> lamothe: if you invoke that with the --lp switch it talks directly to LP
<james_w> ScottK: yeah, I can see it, but ezsetup is about more than just downloading dependencies
<lamothe> mok0: Wow that's pretty neat.
<mok0> lamothe: yep :-)
<ScottK> james_w: If it's trying to download updated packages from outside the repositories, then it's wrong.
<james_w> ScottK: I agree.
<mok0> lamothe: I think the default is to sync from "unstable", you have to thrown another switch to say "experimental"
<james_w> I'm not suggesting that we let it
 * lamothe is foofling
<ScottK> That's what I was trying to prevent, if there's a better way, I'm quite OK with it.
<jpds> lamothe: Add: -d experimental
<mok0> There you go
<mok0> jpds, the online manpage :-P
<lamothe> jpds: Thanks ... I'm just trying to find the actual script ... not in repos?
<jpds> lamothe: It's in the ubuntu-dev-tools package
<freeflying> anyone try the latest alternate cd with hd-image?
<jpds> mok0: Morning to you too :-p
<mok0> jpds: heh
<lamothe> jpds: Thanks again
<mok0> I am looking at a blue sky for the first time in weeks
<mok0> Makes me all cheery
<lamothe> mok0: Thanks for your help also.
<mok0> lamothe: I don't think Utnubu is active
<mok0> lamothe: np
<lamothe> Ok, off to find a uploader
<Rafik_> hello. I'm trying to merge wordpress_2.7-1 from debian experimental with our 2.5.1-8ubuntu1... I'm learning yet (first merge tentative). I'm trying to view the diffs with Meld. but before that I have to apply the debian's diff first.. can any one please help me on that ?
<Laney> Rafik_: Do you mean 11ubuntu1?
<Laney> You should just look at the diff that was applied between -11 and -11ubuntu1 and then see which of those changes we still need
<Laney> (also, thanks for letting me know that this was uploaded. /me runs off to update his blog)
<Rafik_> Laney> apt-get source downloaded from intrepid-updates/universe wordpress 2.5.1-8ubuntu1.1
<Rafik_> Laney> btw, thanks for your blog post, I was reading it :)
<Tonio_> hi there :) someone to revu this please ? http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/skrooge
 * mok0 takes a look
<mok0> Tonio_: The shared object libraries are not meant for development work, right? In that case, we might prefer them to go into /usr/lib/scrooge
<mok0> Tonio_: I can't yet see if it's possible to make that happen
<Tonio_> mok0: I can ping upstream about the issue, indeed, and will make it
<Tonio_> mok0: but I'm not ready to maintain such a patch, to be honnest :)
<mok0> Tonio_: heh, well just a thought
<Tonio_> mok0: and btw, it should go /usr/lib/kde4/
<Tonio_> mok0: but you're right, upstream has to be notified on that point :)
<mok0> Tonio_: yes I guess you're right
<Tonio_> mok0: how's the packaging appart from that ? :)
<mok0> Tonio_: It looks alright, I am putting the final words into the review now
<Tonio_> mok0: super, thanks :)
<mok0> Tonio_: OK, have fun ;-P
<Tonio_> mok0: thanks fot the revu :)
<Tonio_> mok0: one thing I don't understand is about the man page
<mok0> Tonio_: np!
<mok0> Tonio_: ok?
<Tonio_> mok0: when was it decided that desktop apps should have a super-overdocumented man page ?
<Tonio_> mok0: they already have docs btw and are not intended to be used the command line way ;)
<mok0> Tonio_: at least it wasn't decided that the manpage is a formality
<Tonio_> of course it's fine to describe all options when they are to be used that way, but writting a complete book about generic kde/qt options...
<mok0> Tonio_: no that's not the point, you don't need to explain options, but what the program can do
<Tonio_> hum oki :)
<Tonio_> and about lintian, that drives me nuts :)
<mok0> Can you use it for business? What are the principles it works on? Does it rely on a database? Webpage?
<Tonio_> oki :)
<mok0> What banking system does it communicate with
<mok0> etc
<Tonio_> everyone has different expectations, override/no-override, etc.... this is very likely to the guy revuing :)
<Tonio_> mok0: is there is clear policy for this ?
<mok0> Tonio_: those are things I want to know as a user, explained in a plain language
<mok0> Tonio_: Well, I think it's up to the disgression of the MOTUs and I like to see well written man pages
<Tonio_> mok0: well as a user, you would go in the app documentation :) but that's just a personal feeling ;)
<mok0> Tonio_: I always check the man page
<Tonio_> mok0: but I get your point, sure :) I just have the feeling that everyone has different expectations with packaging on revu :)
<mok0> Tonio_: We all have our favourite horses to whiip
<mok0> whip
<Tonio_> mok0: sure :)
<Tonio_> mok0: that's not personal, just that for example, when I package, I NEVER know if I have to override or not lintian warnings
<Tonio_> cause some people like it, some don't, some expect it etc...
<mok0> Tonio_: Sometimes lintian warnings are not relevant
<mok0> Tonio_: but I just prefer to switch them on when the package is finished
<Tonio_> mok0: so do I
<mok0> Tonio_: and one of yours is not used by lintian anywat
<Tonio_> mok0: I just get lost are packaging expectations.... changing every 2 weeks... I'm packaging for 4 years, and I'm still lost when it comes to revu :)
<mok0> N:    Lintian discovered an unused override entry in its database. Please
<mok0> N:    remove it from the overrides file if it is not needed anymore.
<Tonio_> mok0: anyway, let's fix te points :)
<mok0> Tonio_: It's obvious that you are experienced. You just have to roll with the punches
<mok0> :-P
<mok0> Tonio_: We have to find out if it's relevant to make a .symbols file for plugins
<Tonio_> mok0: I have no opinion on that point to be honnest...
<mok0> Tonio_: Yeah... it's only a recommendation so far, anyway
<Tonio_> mok0: about debian/watch, the issue is the debian side.... sometimes working sometimes not
<mok0> Tonio_: just use sf.net/
<mok0> Tonio_: oh, and use ([\d.]*) instead of what you have
<Tonio_> mok0: stupid man pages :) hehe
<Tonio_> mok0: http://sf.net/skrooge/skrooge-([\d.]*)\.tar\.gz this way ?
<mok0> Tonio_: yeah looks right
<Tonio_> mok0: won't be relevant with the 403, since that's random :)
<mok0> heh
<Tonio_> mok0: just tried twice, one 403, and one working :)
<mok0> Tonio_: ydrk, what a nuissance
<mok0> Tonio_: I've never had the Debian PHP service work for me
<Tonio_> mok0: yup, I'll ping debian if that continues all day long
<stefanlsd> Anyone seen this ftbfs before - http://launchpadlibrarian.net/22389029/buildlog_ubuntu-jaunty-i386.gromacs_4.0.3-1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<stefanlsd> essentially libtool: Version mismatch error.  This is libtool 2.2.6 Debian-2.2.6a-1ubuntu1, but the libtool: definition of this LT_INIT comes from an older release
<Tonio_> mok0: http://pastebin.com/m7ef2029d not working
<mok0> Tonio_: sh*t
<Tonio_> mok0: http://pastebin.com/m618428fe works :)
<Tonio_> mok0: just need to be patient, I'd say :)
<mok0> Tonio_: Guess so :-/
 * mok0 wishes Debian would get Lenny off the shelf so we could all get on with things
<Tonio_> what I don't get is the 403.... that's an authorization issue, not an overloaded service or so...
<mok0> For example, fix webservices that are borken
<Tonio_> a 500 error would be more understandable
<mok0> stefanlsd: hmm, strange
<mok0> It's libtool acting up
<mok0> stefanlsd: libtool issues some warnings in the beginning
<mok0> libtoolize: Consider adding `AC_CONFIG_MACRO_DIR([m4])' to configure.ac and
<mok0> libtoolize: Consider adding `-I m4' to ACLOCAL_AMFLAGS in Makefile.am
<stefanlsd> mok0: mm. we dont have a m4 directory. will make it and try add that stuff tho
<mok0> stefanlsd: well, ok, wonder why it issues that statement then
<mok0> stefanlsd: perhaps you should avoid libtoolize
<stefanlsd> mok0: yeah. thanks. not doing that seems to "fix it".
<mok0> stefanlsd: great
<mok0> stefanlsd: There are some issues with libtool 2.2 and aclocal
<sven777> would a MOTU be so kind as to review my package? Thanks in advance! http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=lmalinux
<sven777> oh mok0 - thanks for advocating!
<mok0> sven777: you're welcome
<sven777> is revu supposed to send out emails when comments are posted?
<sven777> nm - didn't realize you have to set the preference before emails happen
<sven777> I thought the "subscribe" was enough to make it happen
<slicer> Hi. I could use a bit of help with a build failure report. http://launchpadlibrarian.net/22413534/buildlog_ubuntu-jaunty-powerpc.mumble_1.1.7-1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz seems to indicate the problem is in the libqt4-opengl-dev package. The package has successfully built on lpia, and the other archs are still "needs to be built". The package did build successfully on i386, amd64 and lpia in my PPA. I don't have personal access to a PPC machine, so I can't try to
<dholbach> nixternal: THANKS :)
<dholbach> hey huats
<huats> hey dholbach
<dholbach> how's life in France? :)
<bddebian> Heya gang
<ScottK> slicer: Likely you need to wait until the package is built on ppc and then ask a MOTU to retry the build.
<slicer> ScottK: Ah, so the packages I'm depending on might not be built yet? That explains a lot :)
<ScottK> Yes
<ScottK> I didn't actually look, but from your decscription that's what it sounds like.
<slicer> ScottK: Hmm. Googling around and looking at other packages didn't reveal anything. I'll wait and see how the other builds go, and if they work fine, I'll request a rebuild. Thanks for your help :)
<henrik-hw0> Hi. Need a second advocate for libmirage.
<mok0> henrik-hw0: *sigh*
<mok0> :-)
<henrik-hw0> mok0: hi.
 * henrik-hw0 attempts bribing with waffles & jam. 
<mok0> henrik-hw0: I don't think there are any MOTUs in revuing mode present ATM
<savvas> er.. how do we specify in the changelog the changes used in Ubuntu? Something like "* Kept Ubuntu changes:" and I start laying them out?
<savvas> (talking about a merge)
<Amaranth> savvas: Something like "Remaining Ubuntu changes:" and this a list under that
<savvas> Remaining! And I was wondering about that, thanks Amaranth :)
<savvas> I thought remaining meant the changes that had to be done, which didn't make much sense heh
<nixternal> dholbach: no problemo!
 * nixternal hugs #ubuntu-motu 
<DktrKranz> mok0: re latest motu-meeting, did you have chance to obtain REVU db?
<mok0> DktrKranz: yes I did
<mok0> I have it now :-)
<DktrKranz> cool!
<mok0> DktrKranz: working on my mockup
<DBO> does anyone know why OO.o is packages with a shell script (/usr/bin/ooffice) that simple calls soffice with the same arguments.  That is all the script does (well it also obfuscates other applications ability to identify OO.o)
<mok0> DktrKranz: I have a few issues with the schema, however. Some relations are _very_ complicated to extract
<mok0> DktrKranz: ... which also makes them quite slow
<DktrKranz> mok0: do you know if mysql or postgres is required?
<mok0> DktrKranz: postgresql
<mok0> DktrKranz: fortunately
<DktrKranz> for REVU yes, not for my hosting
<DktrKranz> it only has mysql :(
<mok0> DktrKranz: don't you have an account on spooky?
<DktrKranz> no
<mok0> You'll have to run a server on localhost
<RainCT> like me ^^
<DktrKranz> I can setup a VM for that
<mok0> ... and me
<DktrKranz> VM with sid...
<RainCT> DktrKranz: You don't really need a VM for that (unless you want to imitate the setup on spooky so that the incoming uploads processing scripts work)
<hyperair>                                   -czf codelite_$(UPSTREAM_VERSION)+dfsg.orig.tar.gz \
<hyperair>                                   codelite-$(UPSTREAM_VERSION)+dfsg
<hyperair>  <-- what could possibly make this end up as codelite_+dfsg.orig.tar.gz followed by codelite-1.0.2579+dfsg?!
 * hyperair curses
<hyperair> it's the same damn variable why doesn't it substitute the same damn value?!
<RainCT> hyperair: calm down :P
<mok0> hyperair: It's not our fault :-(
<DktrKranz> RainCT: so, only apache and postgres is needed to run a REVU instance?
<hyperair> yeah yeah it isn't.
<mok0> hehe
 * hyperair yells at the wall and hammers on it
<RainCT> DktrKranz: for the web interfaces, yes
<mok0> DktrKranz: yes
<DktrKranz> mmmh
<RainCT> DktrKranz: and you can configure apache and pg to only run when you start it (that's how I have it on my laptop)
<DktrKranz> I see
<DktrKranz> RainCT: are you able to process uploads with that instance?
<RainCT> DktrKranz: No, but if necessary you can import them semi-manually :P.
<DktrKranz> a feature I'd like to see is sending mails about preferred procedure to upgrade a package
<DktrKranz> which is attaching .diff.gz to bug repotrs
<RainCT> DktrKranz: fixing the scripts is on my TODO (actually, I've already started doing some work on them)
<RainCT> DktrKranz: Uhm.. Like a "Hurray! You upload has been sponsored! Now don't forget to continue watching for it, and .. <instructions for fixed/upgrades here>"
<RainCT> DktrKranz: or rather when someone uploads a package which is already in Ubuntu?
<DktrKranz> both :)
<DktrKranz> but REVU is designed for NEW packages, using it for already available packages is a waste of time/resources
<RainCT> Hehe. Oaky. So the first one is blocking on detecting when a package is sponsored, and the second one is blocking on the new/upgrade detection code properly working ;)
<DktrKranz> so, we should encourage contributors to use LP instead
<RainCT> *Okay, even
<chrismurf> Will a MOTU please peek at pyproj?
<chrismurf> I'd certainly pay you homage
<chrismurf> it's my very first .deb
<chrismurf> but my excitement will ebb
<chrismurf> if nobody responds to my barrage
<DktrKranz> LP is not the right place itself, but that's it
<RainCT> DktrKranz: I've heard of people (don't remember whom) that at some cases prefer to look at packages on REVU
<mok0> DktrKranz: yeah, or ppa's
<chrismurf> (http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/pyproj) :-)
 * DktrKranz proposes to use mentors.debian.net
 * RainCT proposes Debian to use REVU for mentors.debian.net *g*
<DktrKranz> RainCT: TBH, I prefer REVU too. But we need an unique place to manage such things
<DktrKranz> REVU for all
<DktrKranz> REVU for NEW only
<DktrKranz> core-devs from Canonical usually look at LP only, though
<RainCT> Actually, making revu.ubuntuwire.com more Debian friendly (like showing DDs as such and giving them review permissions and the like) is something I've been thinking about a bit.. Not sure if anyone would make use of that, though
<DktrKranz> well, REVU is free software, I think they could use it as well, even if I heard of some issues with mentors
<DktrKranz> *mentors.d.n
<mok0> REVU FTW
<RainCT> DktrKranz: Anyway, so you want to contribute to REVU? :)
<DktrKranz> REVU would fix a recent discussion on debian ML about using a new Debian revision to fix sponsor's comments
<RainCT> heh, right
<DktrKranz> RainCT: I'd like to
<DktrKranz> this cycle I'm more code-oriented :)
<DktrKranz> less packages, more commits
<RainCT> (They also have that GSoC thing, though. But I've no idea what is happening with it)
<RainCT> DktrKranz: that's good for your LP karma ;)
<mok0> DktrKranz: we were chatting about the advantages of having the REVU source packages in bzr repo
<DktrKranz> RainCT: I used to have > 35 million karma, I had karma stomachache :)
<RainCT> lol
<RainCT> DktrKranz: About wanting to contribute, that's great :). Just ask if you have any question (and if you don't know what to do just ask, too, and I'll give you something from my TODO :P).
 * mok0 thinks as long as a source package has revision -0ubuntu* we should maintain them in bazaar
<DktrKranz> RainCT: do you have anything stupid enough to be fixed by a dumb Ubuntu developer like me? :)
<DktrKranz> mok0: mmmh... explain it better
<mok0> DktrKranz: ok
<mok0> DktrKranz: source package is sitting in a repo in LP. Uploader fixes stuff in own branch, pushes to repo
<RainCT> DktrKranz: There is a syntax eror in your messsage. "dumb", "Ubuntu developer" and "you".. how can those concepts be related? ;P
<mok0> DktrKranz: REVUer pulls changes evaluates, posts comment on REVU
<mok0> DktrKranz: Reviewer can fix tiny bits and pieces if necessarty
<DktrKranz> I think REVU itself is similar to VCS
<mok0> DktrKranz: sometimes you feel cruel by asking for a tiny fix before advocation, e.g. spelling mistake or something
<mok0> DktrKranz: It is
<mok0> DktrKranz: we just need to have revu on top of bzr instead
<mok0> DktrKranz: this is a proposal for the long term though
<DktrKranz> if distributed-development stage5 takes place, it's not that long term :)
<mok0> DktrKranz: I think there's a bunch of MOTUs who still does not want to work that way
<DktrKranz> RainCT: no syntax error, it's core language now :)
<mok0> DktrKranz: What's the current status of distrib-devel?
<RainCT> DktrKranz: bug #172895 should be easy
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 172895 in revu "have link to dsc file in mails" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/172895
<DktrKranz> mok0: I don't know, james_w is the rockstar there.
<mok0> DktrKranz: I can grep the mailing lists
<RainCT> btw, does someone know which month the next UDS will be?
<DktrKranz> RainCT: mind subscribing myself?
<james_w> it is progressing
<mok0> RainCT: Isn't it usually about a month or two after a release?
<RainCT> DktrKranz: done
<james_w> should have some more announcements soon I hope
<mok0> james_w: exiting!
<mok0> james_w: ... err exciting is what I wanted to say :-)
<RainCT> mok0: yep, but I'd like to know something more exact to see how it fits my schedule :P
<james_w> heh :-)
<RainCT> but well, nvm
<mok0> james_w: So, is the idea to have one "upstream" trunk, with a branch off that containing debian/ and other branches containing patches?
<RainCT> uhm.. what's the URL of that ubuntu-nl uploads feed?
<james_w> mok0: that's one possibility
<james_w> mok0: the main effort at the moment is to get an "upstream" branch, then a "debian" off that, then an "ubuntu" off that
<mok0> james_w: ah cool
<james_w> once we have that then we can start to get more adventurous
<mok0> james_w: what about branches originating in Ubuntu?
<mok0> james_w: they only have the debian branch I guess
<RainCT> james_w: Ah, I wanted to ask.. Why is the NoMoreSourcePackages spec called like that? Is it that source packages will continue existing, but being generated by bzr-buildpackage; or is there something more?
<mok0> james_w: how do you achieve that in practise? You need a separate directory for each branch?
<james_w> debian native packages won't have the upstream branch, ubuntu native packages will just be an ubuntu branch
<james_w> RainCT: that's one proposal for what could happen. We're not directly working towards it right now.
<james_w> RainCT: though some plans may make it that most Ubuntu developers never really touch source packages, they are just created by launchpad as needed
<james_w> mok0: yeah, you currently need one directory per branch.
<mok0> Yeah, source package are just a transport mechanism anyway
<mok0> james_w: Hm, ok, I am used to working with git, where you check out branches in the same directory
<mok0> james_w: so you need another level of directory to contain the branches for a project, I guess
<james_w> mok0: that's the way most people do it
<mok0> ok
<james_w> there is a proposal currently for how to do the git-style branching
<RainCT> that is, the loom stuff?
<mok0> Another problem we have is that more and more upstream don't have regular releases, because they ask users to pull from their VSCs
<mok0> james_w: that would be cool
<mok0> So the whole concept of "watch" files etc. is in trouble
<james_w> RainCT: nope, different to that, but looms allow you to simulate it in certain situations
<hefe_bia> mok0: Thanks for uploading tomboy-blogposter!
<james_w> mok0: they may still be useful as notification that upstream has released something, but there may be other ways to do it
<mok0> hefe_bia: it still has to go through an archive admin
<mok0> james_w: yes, perhaps some kind of tagging convention
<hefe_bia> mok0: I know. Just got another package rejected a few days ago... ;)
<mok0> hefe_bia: which one was that?
<hefe_bia> mok0: gebabbel. But it is back in. It was an error in the copyright file.
<mok0> hefe_bia: ah, yes, I think I uploaded it myself
<hefe_bia> Just when it was already in the queue I read an interview about "how to not make archive admins unhappy". Right after that I spotted the error...
<mok0> hefe_bia: It's called "Murphy's law"
<DktrKranz> mok0: exactly "If a package could be REJECTed(tm), it's sure it will be"
<mok0> DktrKranz: he, yeah
<hefe_bia> ;)
<RainCT> Uploads aren't announced on jaunty-updates@ once they passed NEW, or?
<jpds> RainCT: They are, why?
<chrismurf> hefe_bia, where is said interview? :-)
<hefe_bia> chrismurf: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/devweek0809/Archives
<RainCT> jpds: Oh, OK. I was looking on the ubuntu-nl feed and didn't see any package from REVU, but now that I look right I see that the last sponsored package is already to old to be on it
<hefe_bia> Its with Steve Langasek
<slangasek> hmm, not so much an interview as a presentation. :)
<hefe_bia> slangasek: Yes right. I mixed things up ;) Anyways - an informative read...
<james_w> the sponsors' queue is getting out of control again
<mok0> james_w: you mean with > 180 entries?
<james_w> yeah
<mok0> james_w: you're right
<iulian> We should have a UUS day.
<mok0> iulian: good idea.
<iulian> Instead of one REVU day, let's have a UUS one.
<mok0> A lot of those are sync requests though
<mok0> and aRts stuff
<iulian> A lot of them are package upgrades.
<mok0> iulian: like "oh, upstream has changed the name of a variable, please upgrade"
 * mok0 wonders why "Unknown Importance" sorts first in the UUS list
<mok0> james_w: why is bug 325076 in High status?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 325076 in mahara "Please sync mahara 1.0.9-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)." [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/325076
<Laney> mok0: security problem
<mok0> I se
<mok0> e
<james_w> mok0: I just bumped it off the -archive list, I'd agree with Laney though
<mok0> james_w, Laney, don't you think we should ask for the bugs list to be changed to "Unknown Importance" sorts _last_ ??
<Laney> mok0: Think of it as a "needs triage" list ;)
<mok0> We can't do anything about them anyway
<Laney> a lot of contributors can't change bug importance
<mok0> They belong to other projects
<Laney> ah, then you need to refine your search
<mok0> Laney: this is just the default bug page of uus
<mok0> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-universe-sponsors/+bugs?start=0
<Laney> I agree that it should only show bugs which affect Ubuntu packages
<Laney> but that's an LP bug, and for now you can bookmark a custom search
<james_w> mok0: do you know http://people.ubuntu.com/~dholbach/sponsoring/ ?
<RainCT> DktrKranz: On bug #109289 you ask "What about change in src/main.c? You dropped it, is there a reason behind this choice?", but I don't see that it has been deleted
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 109289 in naim "Naim returns erroneous error messages" [Wishlist,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/109289
<Laney> james_w: With your archive admin hat on, what do you think to pulling some packages from Debian NEW that aren't likely to make it in before FF but we want anyway?
<mok0> james_w: ah nice! I didn't know that one
<RainCT> DktrKranz: Actually, only the changelog is touched. Did you just post that by mistake or was there some reason for the comment?
<maxb> I thought it was impossible to download packages in NEW?
<Laney> yes
<Laney> but you can get them through other means
<james_w> Laney: they're still knitting the hat
 * Laney fails to comprehend
<james_w> Laney: but I think it would be appropriate to upload them if it makes sense
<james_w> Laney: are these NEW leaf packages, or NEW libraries?
<RainCT> DktrKranz: err wait, I can't read :P
<Laney> one of each
<Laney> also would they need to be REVUed?
<james_w> Laney: probably ok
<james_w> Laney: I'm not sure
<Laney> moonlight because that's the kind of thing we should have and sublib because it blocks gnome-subtitles
<james_w> wow, who wants to fix a three-digit bug?
<james_w> bug 334
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 334 in gnupod-tools "otg_sync not called" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/334
<quadrispro> nixternal: thanks for your feedback!
<RainCT> Someone already working on 334?
<DktrKranz> RainCT: I'll look at that bug when I come back home
<RainCT> james_w: I see why nobody has fixed #334..    $ ls    debian  gnupod-0.99.7.tgz
<james_w> urgh
<RainCT> Anyway, I'll have a go at it :)
<james_w> \o/
<RainCT> james_w: I guess we should also SRU this?
<james_w> RainCT: probably appropriate, but I'm not sure it's worth it, given how long it has been broken :-)
<RainCT> hehe
<henrik-hw0> It's nuking time! rt28xx-linux-sta, rt2860-linux-sta and rt2870-linux-sta. i have it on good authority that there will be updated drivers in the jaunty kernel (staging area).
<RainCT> Meh.. Already fixed in Intrepid. Now I can't upload my fix :(
 * Laney fixes RainCT 
<RainCT> :)
<savvas> fix him on Friday, it's the 13th :p
<superm1> henrik-hw0, that's good but too bad since all the packaging was in shape :)
<Laney> woah, someone made the bash-completion for pbuilder-dist better
<Laney> RainCT: !!! was it you?
<henrik-hw0> superm1: it makes sense to have the drivers in kernel. in any case... libmirage needs some love. *hopeful*
<jpds> zsh > *
<Laney> I keep meaning to try it
<RainCT> Laney: if "better" means recognizing *-jaunty and cowbuilder-*, then yes :)
<Laney> jaunty, that's probably it
<RainCT> Laney: bah, I fix the auto completion for *you* and you don't even give me a hug?   :P :P
<Laney> First I fix you, now you expect a hug
 * Laney cuddles RainCT
<RainCT> heh
<henrik-hw0> i like the "archive" feature, is it a new one?
<RainCT> henrik-hw0: on REVU?
<henrik-hw0> rainct: yes. used it to archive 3 now obsolete packages.
<jpds> Can we upload new package versions, even though they have not been uploaded to Debian first?
<RainCT> henrik-hw0: Nope, it has always been there, but I think it was only available for MOTUs until I reworked it like 1 month ago.
<RainCT> jpds: just check how many upgraded packages with -0ubuntu1 revision there are :)
<jpds> RainCT: Just check before someone hunts me down.
<RainCT> jpds: oh, if someone complains kick him from #ubuntu-motu ;)
<hyperair> supposing i'd like to submit a new upstream release to a packaged i submitted through revu (and is already in ubuntu) i just file a bug and then create a debdiff for it right?
<hyperair> though admittedly it is kinda big
<hyperair> and there are some files which are binary
<ScottK> hyperair: Not a debdiff, the updated diff.gz.
<hyperair> okay then
<ScottK> Whoever uploads the package will fetch the tarball from upstream.
<hyperair> it requires repacking
<hyperair> there's a get-orig-source target so i guess it should be fine
<ScottK> get-orig-source rules are good for this reason.
<ScottK> Yes.
<hyperair> ScottK: do i need to put the bug number in the changelog?
<ScottK> Yes.
<Laney> how does calling a get-orig-source from a diff work?
<Vest84> hello, guys. I've got many similar messages: /var/revu/revu1-incoming/gnome-quod-0902052312/gnome-quod-0.2.2/src/statistics.h: GPL (v2 or later)    [Copyright: 2006-2009, Vlad Volodin <vest.84@gmail.com>]
<Vest84> what's wrong with my code?
<hyperair> Laney: you patch it onto an empty directory then call get-orig-source?
<Laney> fair
<hyperair> can someone try accessing http://qa.debian.org/watch/sf.php/codelite and see where it redirects to?
<hyperair> sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't
<hyperair> bah
<hyperair> uscan's messing up big time here
<Vest84> http://heanet.dl.sourceforge.net/sourceforge/codelite/
<ScottK> hyperair: The Debian SF redirector is not the most reliable thing in the world.
<hyperair> ScottK: so i should avoid it?
<ScottK> hyperair: No.  Use it, but don't worry if it's not working at the moment.
<hyperair> alright
<Vest84> hyperair: for me it works, I've sent you the link above
<hyperair> Vest84: ah i see thanks
<hyperair> right now debian's redirector is sending me to garr.dl.sourceforge.net
<hyperair> which throws up a 403 error
<hyperair> probably sf's fault
<hyperair> ScottK: after i attach the diff.gz i subscribe ubuntu-universe-sponsors?
<ScottK> hyperair: For Universe/Multiverse packages, yes.
<hyperair> ScottK: okay then
<hyperair> bug #327216 =p
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 327216 in codelite "[needs-upgrade] CodeLite 1.0.2759" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/327216
<directhex> hyperair, some sf mirrors are broken
<directhex> garr is known-buggered
<mok0> hyperair: did you manage your troubles?
<RainCT> Vest84: The messages on the "legal" page on REVU don't necessarily say that there's something wrong.
<RainCT> Vest84: What that page does is try to autodetect what license each of the files has (using "licensecheck")
<nixternal> quadrispro: no problemo, good work, keep it up! :)
<Vest84> RainCT: oh, I see. But I can't find the corrent template for GPL v3. yes, I use this license in COPYING file, but I don't know what and how should I write in *.[ch]?? files
<RainCT> Vest84: http://paste.ubuntu.com/116166/plain/ (without the #'s)
<Vest84> RainCT, should I write the new adress of the FSF, too?
<Vest84> 51 Franklin Street, Fifth Floor, Boston, MA 02110-1301 USA.
<RainCT> Vest84: no, the GPLv3 header doesn't include that address, but instead the URÃ
<RainCT> * URL
<hyperair> mok0: yeah i figured out it was something to do with uscan acting up on me
<hyperair> mok0: by the way, could you sponsor #327216 for me please?
<mok0> hyperair: good
<hyperair> it's a new version of codelite
<mok0> hyperair: I'll take a look later
<hyperair> mok0: alright thanks
 * hyperair is off to bed
<hyperair> night
<mok0> g'night
<jpds> nixternal: You around/have time for a main upload?
<nixternal> jpds: unfortunately no...at work
<chrismurf> quadrispro, if you've got some time to review http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/pyproj, I'd much appreciate it.  Thanks for your help yesterday.
<Vest> RainCT: thank you, I'll change my sources
<fabrice_sp> chrismurf, I'm not able to build your package
<fabrice_sp> dpkg-source: error: File ./pyproj_1.8.5-0ubuntu1.diff.gz has size 2075 instead of expected 2052
<chrismurf> fabrice_sp, well that does seem like a negative.
<fabrice_sp> chrismurf, I think you should build again the package (debuild -sa -S) and upload it again to revu
<chrismurf> doing it right now
<chrismurf> fabrice_sp, done
<fabrice_sp> chrismurf, also, it seems the copyright is not given to the right persons: the copyright in src/PJ_aea.c is claimed by Gerald Evenden, but in debian/copyright, it appears Frank Warmerdam
<chrismurf> Okay - Frank Warmerdam claims copyright over everything in the PROJ distribution
<chrismurf> but he acknowledges that Gerald Evenden wrote a lot of the code
<chrismurf> should I list both as copyright holders for src/*
<chrismurf> or give explicit file copyrights for the ones claimed by Gerald E
<fabrice_sp> I would say gives the copyright to the right person, but let's see if someone else answer
<chrismurf> fabrice_sp, http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/revu1-incoming/pyproj-0902092157/pyproj-1.8.5/LICENSE_proj4
<chrismurf> Actually, the right answer is probably to copy from the PROJ package itself
<chrismurf> I will look at what the copyright file for that says
<fabrice_sp> yes, but according to Franck: Essentially all work was done by Gerald Evenden
<fabrice_sp> so Gerald's name should appear :-)
<chrismurf> agreed :-)
<fabrice_sp> check if src/* is is copyrigthed to Gerald
<chrismurf> well, src/* is a static copy of a particular version of PROJ, which is a seperate library
<chrismurf> and the debian/copyright for that library is an old-style free-flowing copyright
<fabrice_sp> I still ahve the same problem with diff.gz size :-/
<fabrice_sp> did you run again debuild -sa -S?
<chrismurf> ??? I've deleted everything and did that, yeah
<fabrice_sp> ?! I'll try to delete everything also
<chrismurf> the .changes file lists 2052 for me, and that's the size of .diff.gz on my filesystem
<chrismurf> both .changes and .dsc list the size as 2052
<chrismurf> so - the real problem with the copyright is that Gerald wrote 99% of the src/* files, but in his own words: "The software was developed by the USGS and has no copyright nor license.  Do with it what you will.  :-)"
<RainCT> good night
<chrismurf> so I'm going to list them both as copyright holders, with an X-comment explaining.
<fabrice_sp> chrismurf, can you try to open the one in revu? I'm getting garbage when downloading it
<chrismurf> It's definitely 2075B on REVU ...
<chrismurf> is there a "JUST DELETE IT" button on REVU?
<chrismurf> seems like it's getting messed up in the transfer, or didn't replace it
<fabrice_sp> let's wait for a REVU admin
<fabrice_sp> and about copyright: some sources claims to be MIT like licensed, but other are 'public doamin' like
<chrismurf> okay - I'm fixing the copyright bugs
<jpds> What do you want deleted/archived?
<chrismurf> I am going as close to the PROJ package as possible
<chrismurf> jpds, could you kill pyproj please?  It seems to be corrupted, and isn't taking the .diff.gz correctly
<jpds> chrismurf: Nothing by that name in the FTP queue.
<jpds> Upload in  /srv/archive/revu1-incoming/pyproj-0902092157 appears to be fine.
<chrismurf> what's the size on that file?
<jpds> http://paste.ubuntu.com/116197/
<jpds> chrismurf: You should be able to reupload.
<ScottK> At least in US copyright laws, works created by the US federal government cannot be copyrighted and are public domain.
<ScottK> Of course in many countries authors have certain 'moral' rights, so listing both the author and public domain is probably correct.
<asac> ScottK: btw, are you on the (new) ~ubuntu-mozilla-security archive for your dapper install? or didnt i inform you about that change ;)?
<asac> previously i did previews in ~asac
<ScottK> asac: I don't think I am, but I'll check when I get back to my desk.
<ScottK> asac: Thanks for mentioning it.
<asac> thanks. there is a new build available ... we plan to roll out later. if you have a chance to run a quick test that would be awesome
<ScottK> Should be able to do that tonight or tomorrow.
<asac> https://edge.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-mozilla-security/+archive/ppa
<asac> yeah. we probably will roll that tonight.
<asac> if you dont get to it ... next time ;)
 * ScottK is seriously considering finally upgrading that machine.
<directhex> ScottK, workds subcontracted by the govt to private companies are not covered by that exemption. yay!
<asac> ScottK: heh ;) ... you are my best tester ;)
<asac> ScottK: well ... at least the only one i know how to reach ;)
<ScottK> directhex: It depends on the terms of the contract.
<asac> but dapper will be EOL in jun ... so well. hopefully there will be only one more round (or maybe two)
<ScottK> directhex: In the case that the contractor owns the work it's not then a USG produced work.
<ScottK> asac: Yes.  I do wonder though, after desktop LTS EOL, are such packages going to be removed from the archive?
<asac> ScottK: not sure. i am leading the upstream long-term support effort somehow ... so i will try to keep 1.8 branches alive as long as possible
<asac> at best 4 more years ;)
<ScottK> If they aren't removed, then they'll still need 'support' of a kind.
<asac> maybe i can still upload to dapper. will ask security team, but since i usually do most work i doubt they have any issues
<ScottK> I'm running into problems now with my clamav backports where some rdepends upstream is dead a the package doesn't work with the current.
<ScottK> So in extreme cases I turned the package into a transitional package to another one that was still supportable.
<ScottK> And that was on Hardy.
<ScottK> Now it looks like on Dapper it'll be several.
<directhex> sounds like fun :(
<ScottK> directhex: We got a while wiki page on it. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Clamav
<chrismurf> fabrice_sp, thanks for your review and comments, I've now updated pyproj to reflect your feedback.  Take care.
<Vest> Guys, I've uploaded my package without any errors. Can anybody of you review my project? or maybe tell me whom should I ask and possibly when (if the meeting of reviewers starts periodically)
<asac> ScottK: you made a transition in a SRU ?
<asac> thats interesting ;) ... except for first bumps of firefox-3.0 beta 5 to final (which were sort of transitions), I didnt feel brave enough for that yet
<asac> i should do that for intrepid NM actually ... but well ..
<ScottK> asac: It was a backport (so far).  The path I've been taking with major clamav updates is backports -> proposed -> security/updates.
<ScottK> Also I've only done this for releases where clamav is in Universe.
<asac> yeah.
<asac> where is clamav in main?
<asac> is that installed by default on server seeds?
<ScottK> Intrepid and later.
<ScottK> Yes.
<ScottK> For the mail server task.
<ScottK> All the GUI front ends are in Universe, but I still have to tend to them.
<asac> back a few years when i worked a bit in universities anti-virus lab clamav was quite miserable ... especially finding new virus through heuristics (e.g. without signature)
<asac> but i guess that has improved now
<ScottK> We've got a major new upstream hitting in ~ one month that will break everything and so eventually I'll need to deal with 0.94 -> 0.95 in Intrepid.
<ScottK> I think it has.
<ScottK> It's definitely the best FOSS solution available.
<ScottK> Essentially it's the only one.
<asac> yeah. i dont doubt that ;)
<lfaraone> vorian: hi, can you sponsor https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/sugar/+bug/327097 ?
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 327097 in sugar "Remove "sugar" menu option" [Low,Confirmed]
 * gaspa looking for a sponsor of a sync...
<ScottK> gaspa: Just subscribe ubuntu-universe-sponsors.
<lfaraone> ScottK: Don't syncs require ubuntu-archive?
<ScottK> lfaraone: After approval by a MOTU.
<ScottK> The MOTU will subscribe the archive.
<EagleScreen> hello, i try to fix a bug in qtparted making a patch :D
<EagleScreen> i have downloaded qtparted sources, but it has seven patches in debian/patches, and I need no know how to apply that patches to the sources before modifying it
<EagleScreen> patch -p1 debian/patche_name.dpatch hangs
<geser> which patch system does it use?
<geser> ah, dpatch
<geser> use dpatch-edit-patch
<EagleScreen> but that is for edit a patch isn't it?
<ScottK> EagleScreen: Read man dpatch-edit-patch
<EagleScreen> reading man
<EagleScreen> great tool
<EagleScreen> i have run dpatch-edit-patch patch debian/patches/00list, now i am in the "fake" shell, but i am reading the sources, and patches does not seem to be applied
<EagleScreen> i have to leave now, see you later, thanks
<NCommander> ScottK, ping?
<ScottK> NCommander: Pong
<NCommander> ScottK, I was going to ask you to REVU a package, but I need to check some things before hand
<ScottK> K
<kolby> ScottK you can revu md4sum while you wait, if you like.
<ScottK> kolby: First explain to me why we want this in the archive?
<ScottK> From the name it sounds like the thing that came before md5sum and that's already obsolete.
<kolby> ScottK This program creates archives for eDonkey P2P networks
<kolby> It uses a protocol that appearantly wasn't offered in md5sum
<huats> Tonio_: you should go to bed my friend... you need to sleep !
<directhex> short version: edonkey sucks?
<Tonio_> huats: je sais putain........
<kolby> Md4sum generates or checks MD4 checksums applying the algorithm specified in RFC 1320
<Tonio_> j'ai 38.7 de fiÃ¨vre et je fais le geek.....
<Tonio_> je suis sur le packaging de koffice la.....
<Tonio_> huats: ca craint a ce stade la non ? :)
<kolby> directhex: incorrect.  Nice try though.
<huats> Tonio_: indeed :)
<huats> Tonio_: go to bed...
<Tonio_> huats: hehe, promises, in 6 minutes, at 1 am, I'm gonna sleep
<huats> Tonio_: I hope...
<Laney> kolby: md4 is broken
<kolby> Laney: Why would you say that?
<kolby> Laney: I packaged the program wrong?
<Laney> No, there are collision attacks against it
<directhex> kolby, as in "the hash is worthless, it's trivially circumvented these days"
<Laney> although md5 is heading that way
<kolby> It could be a tool for learning how to circumvent hashed files.
<StevenK> md5 has already been broken, but it isn't trivial
<kolby> A person could learn the techniques of how encryption works / breaks
<directhex> this fast md4 collision generator i found takes ~7 seconds to generate a collision
<kolby> I think that's a great reason/
<kolby> directhex: what's it called?
<directhex> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MD4
<kolby> directhex: look for an md5sum breaking tool
<directhex> collision attacks section
<directhex> kolby, there are some, but they take >7 seconds
<kolby> directhex: lol.  Maybe for your pithy not-a-supercomputer.
<directhex> kolby, wrong person to say that to.
<Laney> MD5 is in use now, and I'm sure people will move away from it in time.
<kolby> directhex: You have a super computer?
#ubuntu-motu 2009-02-10
<kolby> directhex: Can I borrow it?
<directhex> jms@orac:~> grep -c ^processor /proc/cpuinfo
<directhex> 256
<maxb> !
<kolby> I like
<Laney> But I don't know why you'd deliberately introduce a known broken hashing algorithm
<Laney> kolby: If you want an educational tool then make a nice GUI for learning with it
 * kolby runs  "grep -c ^processor /proc/cpuinfo"  returning 4.
<directhex> jms@orac:~> free -g | grep Mem
<directhex> Mem:           985         30        955          0          0         19
<kolby> 4<256... except today. It's opposite day
<kolby> Laney: what would possibly be the benefit of adding a GUI to a hashing algorithm program?
<Laney> to make it an educational tool
<Laney> which is the use you want it for
<kolby> example use:  gdb md4sum *.avi hashy
<directhex> thing is, the day md4sum hits the archive, the security team launches a tactical nuke at your house
<kolby> education is therefor born.
<Laney> this is most unconvincing
<kolby> It's a great package!
<kolby> md4sum is faster.
<kolby> most people don't know how to break it.
<kolby> most people have _no_idea_ what it is.
<Laney> who cares about most people?
<kolby> so it's fine to include in the repos
<Laney> most people don't want to break your software
<kolby> Yes, further justifying our point.
<Laney> but the fact is you cannot trust md4 because it is *so easily broken by anyone who takes two seconds to find out how*
<kolby> directhex has a super-computer.  He doesn't count.
<directhex> 7 seconds was on my laptop.
<directhex> i don't feel like vexing the itaniums this evening.
<kolby> directhex: laptop with 256 processors...
<kolby> directhex: try breaking md4sum's daughter: md5sum with your mighty processing power.
<directhex> no, laptop with a core 2 duo. office machine with 256 cores.
<kolby> If PS3s can do it, your set up should work.
<directhex> and i think you underestimate the cost of electricity
<kolby> directhex: I don't have to pay it actually.
<kolby> directhex: I'm living on a military base.
<kolby> directhex: good luck with your bomb
<Laney> ask them about using md4
<Laney> they should know a thing or two
<kolby> why bother the IT dep. over something so abviously simple?
<kolby> md4sum is a great experience.
<kolby> like swimming.
<kolby> how are you not convinced?
<Laney> We are not about to deliberately introduce a program with security flaws
 * Laney -> shower
<kolby> lol.
<kolby> fine...  md4sum breaker-ers
<kolby> I'll go bother debian.
<Laney> haha
<Laney> good luck!
<kolby> it's not like I packaged a virus.
<kolby> just a great historical application.
<kolby> who will know of md4sum and it's wonderful eDonkey powers now?
<kolby> ...debian...
<kolby> lol
<kolby> alright that was my last try.  Thanks for participating.  Sincerely.
<kolby> I was packaging this program to learn how to make Ubuntu packages.
<kolby> I realized it could be part of Jaunty and it made feel a great sense of pride in my labor.
<kolby> I'm pretty sure the packaging is flawless by now, though.
<ScottK> kolby: You do realize the arguments against it have nothing to do with the quality of your packaging, right?
<kolby> ScottK, *sigh* yes.  I just want someone to review it.
<ScottK> kolby: I'll look at it to give you feedback on your learning experience, but I won't advocate it goes in the archive.
<kolby> ScottK thanks. ^^
<kolby> ScottK, where will it go?  Bad-package heaven?
<kolby> it will more than likely stay on my hard-drive.
<kolby> I should probably uninstall it.
<kolby> weak-hashing-algorithm-haters...
<kolby> thank you all.
<directhex> all the cool kids use quadruple rot13 these days
<kolby> directhex: thanks for your feedback, btw
<ScottK> kolby: Reviewed.  Generally technically good, but licensing is a disaster.
 * ScottK needs to run.
<kolby> thank you
<Dante_J> Greetings room.
<nhandler> Hello Dante_J
<Dante_J> I have a question regarding patches. I'm using 8.04.2 and wondering why are the patches so delayed? None a all or February so far.
<Dante_J> Under Fedora there has been the security patch for Firefox, sudo & Nss. For Ubuntu so far nothing. Is there a problem? Here's an example:
<Dante_J> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-security-announce/2009-January/date.html
<Dante_J> https://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-package-announce/2009-February/date.html
<Dante_J> I'm just curious and a little concerned, not attempting to apportion blame.
<Dante_J> Please do let me know if this question should be addressed elsewhere. I was thinking of preparing a Digg story about this situation, but wanted to understand it first before posting anything.
<Dante_J> I really hate being the whiner, seriously. I'd just like to get a handle on the current status.
<Dante_J> nhandler: Thank you for your greeting.
<Dante_J> I guess I should leave you all in peace. Cheers. :/
 * RAOF has obviously missed the start of this.
<nhandler> Dante_J: I would suggest coming back here at a different time. Most developers are gone right now
<Dante_J> thanks nhandler
<nhandler> RAOF: He is wondering why fedora got a security update for sudo and we haven't
 * nhandler doesn't know enough about the update
<Dante_J> that was my question
 * RAOF doesn't know _anything_ about the update.
<RAOF> But sudo's firmly in main; #ubuntu-devel should contain more people who know about it; there might even be an #ubuntu-security.
<Dante_J> Also under Ubuntu is Firefox is unpatched at 3.0.5
<Dante_J> among other packages.
<RAOF> It's _actually_ unpatched, or just doesn't have a version bump?
<Dante_J> Not patched.
<nhandler> Dante_J: firefox 3.0.6 is actually in jaunty
<Dante_J> Insecure.
<Dante_J> http://secunia.com/advisories/33799/
<Dante_J> not patched in Hardy
<Dante_J> which is often used in labs, & by corporates.
<nhandler> Dante_J: I would talk to some of the people on the security team. They would have more knowledge about this stuff
<Dante_J> thank you nhandler
<RAOF> Both firefox & sudo are in main; #ubuntu-devel is where you'll have people who deal with main.
<Dante_J> thanks RAOF :)
<afner> hi
<Dante_J> Hello afner
<nhandler> Hi afner
<Dante_J> Have a great day.
 * Dante_J waves
<afner> how are you?
<afner> you too have a grat day
<afner> great
<afner> nhandler hi
<jmarsden> Anyone able to review webgui for me please?  http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/webgui
<nhandler> jmarsden: I'll take a look
<jmarsden> Thanks!
<chrismurf> If someone has a chance to look at pyproj (http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/pyproj) I'd appreciate it - I believe I resolved issues that fabrice_sp identified this afternoon.
<dholbach> good morning
<ScottK> Good morning.
<dholbach> hi scottK
<fabrice_sp> Good morning dholbach. Morning ScottK
<dholbach> hiya fabrice_sp
<ScottK> o/
 * nixternal hugs dholbach 
 * dholbach hugs nixternal back :)
<didrocks> good morning :)
<c_korn> hello. is it likely that scilab-5 makes it into jaunty? https://bugs.launchpad.net/debian/+source/scilab/+bug/272264
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 272264 in scilab "Please sync scilab-5.0.3 (multiverse) from PPA" [Wishlist,Confirmed]
<c_korn> there are a few missing dependencies which have to be synced before (jeuclid for example which is not in debian, yet)
<directhex> c_korn, NEW joy? that one rings a bell
<directhex> yeah. 7th in NEW
<c_korn> jeuclid, xmlgraphics-common, fop and java-wrappers would need to be synced before scilab-5 can be used.
<c_korn> FF is not far off. that is why I ask
<directhex> NEW is also going to kick my ass r.e. FF
<directhex> yay for NEW
<directhex> hanska, shouldn't you be in class, learning about teeth?
<hanska> directhex: no, I'm home to study -- and am studying really :)
<RAOF> You can fakesync from NEW, right? :)
<savvas> human teeth or animal? :P
<directhex> RAOF, depends on whether those happy slappy MOTUs will let a little thing like "not going through REVU" happen
<RAOF> What's in NEW that needs revu?
 * RAOF notes that _he_ is a slap-happy motu, should push come to shove.
<directhex> RAOF, the main items stuck in limbo are moon and sublib.
<directhex> sublib is needed to finish the mono 2.0 transition
<hanska> savvas: human ;)
<savvas> hanska: I really hope it's not histology or anatomy and doesn't involve innervations and their pathway/origin (been there :P) Good luck, I won't disturb anymore! :)
<hanska> savvas: well, I already gave those two :)... and yes, I know what you're talking about :P. No, I'm doing gastroenterology, internal medicine, haematology, odontostomatologic pathology.
<hanska> savvas: exam is on Thu :/
 * hanska goes to study Scleroderma.
<DktrKranz> scleroderma, medical stuff. let's call dr. house (tm)
<hanska> DktrKranz: /me is House. :P
<DktrKranz> cool, dr. house is a Debian Maintainer! \o/
<hanska> \o/
<hanska> DktrKranz: if you happen to come in Palermo, come to Policlinico and I'll see your teeth :P
<DktrKranz> quite far away for a dentist's checkup :)
<hanska> DktrKranz: we could sign each other's GPG keys. ;)
 * iulian looks around.
<DktrKranz> hanska: ping me if you come near reggio em., mantua, bologna or thelike :)
<savvas> hanska: I'm studying medicine as well, 3rd year.. and still hating the long hours I have to sacrifice :p
<savvas> on the other hand, it really pays back in more ways than one
<savvas> A question about libmtp merge bug #315679 - debian/control file says "Breaks: udev (<< 136-1)" which makes libmtp work only for 9.04 jaunty or later releases. In libmtp postinst and preinst scripts there are some checks for older libmtp versions, which are for ubuntu hardy or older. Should those libmtp older version checks be removed?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 315679 in libmtp "Please merge libmtp 0.3.0-1ubuntu3 (main) to 0.3.6-1 from Debian (experimental)" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/315679
<mok0> savvas: sounds like you could remove them
<mok0> savvas: what does the package history say about the reasons for adding these checks?
<Tonio_> mok0: I'll have all the points you noticed with skrooge fixed today, fyi
<mok0> Tonio_: super
<Vest84> Can anybody who is free now review my package? (gnome-quod) http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=gnome-quod
<Tonio_> mok0: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/skrooge <- should be okay now
<Tonio_> and if anyone has a couple of minutes for a very quick revu -> http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/kcometen4
<Tonio_> just a screensaver, so that's very basic kde packaging
<mok0> Tonio_: I'm busy atm, will look later
<Tonio_> mok0: thanks :)
<quadrispro> could someone take a look at http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/nfoview ?
<mruiz> hi all
<EagleScreen> hello
<EagleScreen> i want to fix a bug in QtParted, for it i am goingo to make a patch, qtparted has seven patches in debian/patches in dpatch format, i dont know if I must make a dpatch patch or a debdiff patch
<directhex> make a dpatch first & foremost. then consider making a debdiff of your new package which contains the dpatch
<EagleScreen> okay, I need to learn how to apply and make dpatch patched then, any guide?
<dholbach> EagleScreen: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/PatchSystems#dpatch
<mruiz> if I want to upgrade a package, do I need to prepare a Freeze Exception?
<dholbach> mruiz: we're not in Feature Freeze yet
<dholbach> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/JauntyReleaseSchedule
<mruiz> dholbach, hi !
<dholbach> hiya
<mruiz> I have a package to review : https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gtranslator/+bug/292253 . It would be great if someone could give me a comment
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 292253 in gtranslator "Gtranslator is too old in Ubuntu, please upgrade it" [Undecided,In progress]
 * surfaz is away: Estoy comiendo, escribir mi nombre para que el Xchat me avise
<Pici> !away > surfaz
<ubottu> surfaz, please see my private message
<sven777> I just need one more advocate for my package - would a MOTU be so kind as to review it? Thanks in advance! http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=lmalinux
<quadrispro> hi guys! anyone on this? http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/nfoview
<EagleScreen> I have a dude. I am going to do a change in package qtparted, it uses dpatch patches in debian/patches, so I fisrtly will make a dpatch patch with my changes, and later a debdiff with the difference between old and new package, my question is if the changes in the changelog file must go in the dpatch patch, or only in the debdiff patch
<mterry> EagleScreen: only in debdiff
<mterry> EagleScreen: Ideally nothing under debian/ will go in the dpatch
<EagleScreen> thanks
<bddebian> Heya gang
<Juli__> Hi MOTUs, thank you for spending your time making Ubuntu better! It would be great if someone could help me with updating netbeans package to a new upstream version - 6.5:   https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/netbeans/+bug/251173 . I've got many requests for this update from Ubuntu users and now all needed diff files (for netbeans and corresponding libs) are ready. Please, have a...
<Juli__> ...look. Thanks in advance!
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 251173 in netbeans-ide "Update NetBeans to 6.5" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<postalchris> Is there a way to get debuild to fork multiple compile processes, like "make -j 2"?
<mok0> postalchris: I believe there is some environmental variable you can set
<mok0> postalchris: ah, no it's a switch: dpkg_buildpackage -j2
<mok0> postalchris: or use parallel=jobs in DEB_BUILD_OPTIONS ... my memory is not completely off
<ara> hey guys, I am packaging ldtp1.5 to be included in jaunty, and I have some questions about the process. I hope that you will be able to help.
<ara> the changes include a new upstream version (jaunty now contains ldtp 1.4) and some basic changes in the control file: new dependency and original-maintainer field
<ara> the package builds correctly and it has been successfully tested
<ara> I will file now a bug in LP requestion the upgrade
<ara> my question is:
<ara> what should I add as attachment to the bug? the debdiff with the former version?
<hyperair> ara: diff.gz
<jpds> ara: Debdiff, .diff.gz, and .dsc.
<hyperair> jpds: eh? the other day someone told me all i needed was a diff.gz
<jpds> hyperair: Today someone told me I needed those three.
<hyperair> bah
<hyperair> well my debdiff is miles long, including a few unrepresentable changes
<jpds> hyperair: debdiff makes viewing upstream changes easier to see if it's worth the update.
<hyperair> .png stuff
<ara> jpds, hyperair: the .diff.gz between 1.4 and 1.5 upstream? and what about the packaging changes?
<jpds> ara: No, the .diff.gz for the 1.5 source package.
<hyperair> jpds: are sponsors really going to stare at a mile-long debdiff?
<jpds> hyperair: Possibly.
<hyperair> jpds: good grief.
<ara> jpds: ah, ok, thanks :)
<ara> hyperair: thank you too
<hyperair> ara: np
<jpds> hyperair: bug #319182 was where I was asked.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 319182 in python-gdata "Package Update Request: python-gdata" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/319182
<jpds> ara: De nada.
<hyperair> bug #327216 -- a package update request. i didn't attach a debdiff
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 327216 in codelite "[needs-upgrade] CodeLite 1.0.2759" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/327216
<Laney> I find it hard to believe that anyone is going to review that debdiff
<Laney> the NEWS file would be more useful
<hyperair> Laney: lol yeah
<hyperair> eventhough launchpad is being a bitch over here so i can't see it
<jpds> I didn't want to upload the debdiff really.
<james_w> .diff.gz allows us to sponsor the update
<james_w> anything else that makes it easy to review is more likely to get your package sponsored sooner
<james_w> a mile long debdiff doesn't really fall in to that category, but the NEWS file might
<jpds> possibly wanted to diffstat it or something.
<ara> well bug is now there: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ldtp/+bug/327666
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 327666 in ldtp "Please upgrade to LDTP 1.5" [Undecided,New]
<ara> I guess next step would be to subscribe to sporsors, isn't it?
<jpds> Yes; ubuntu-main-sponsors.
<ara> jpds: well, universe, in this case ;-)
<jpds> ara: Oh, I thought it was in main...
<jpds> That would be ltsp confusing me.
<henrik-hw0> need a MOTU to look at libmirage.
<huats> Laney: I am handling the bakery update
<huats> (just so that you know=
<huats> )
<huats> :)
<Laney> what update?!
<Laney> in debian?
<huats> Laney: a new release has been done today by the upstream
<Laney> oh cool
<huats> cannot do it in debian because of the freeze...
<broonie> habtool: You can upload to experimental.
<broonie> huats: You can upload to experimental.
<Laney> only a few days left
<huats> broonie: I know
<huats> but I 'd rather wait...
<huats> Laney: yep
<huats> Laney: be sure I'll put the bakery2.6 in debian too (so that you can put glom)
<huats> :)
<Laney> \o/
 * broonie uploaded some stuff anyway, it'd never have time to migrate and the chances of a RC bug that needed fixing in testing were minimal.
<jdong> directhex: man I'm getting itchy enough that I want to fix monodevelop-boo upstream :)
<cedricv> oh guys, if you could have a look to include boo 0.9 before feature freeze too that would be awesome!! :)
<jdong> cedricv: doesn't it require Mono 2.x?
<cedricv> no 1.9 is ok
<jdong> ah ok, well the only other concern I'd have is about all the apps that use Boo scripting
<jdong> Banshee I believe is one of em
<jdong> whether or not this change breaks anything
<cedricv> yeah, well 0.9 broke not much (the main potential issue would be the enforcement of the earlier only-recommended syntax for generic definitions..)
<cedricv> but then of course i'm not even sure banshee plugins use generics in the first place, even less defined them with the 'not-recommended' syntax
<jdong> right
<jdong> directhex would probably be the mono wrangler to speak with on this matter
<jdong> but yes, it would be nice to get 0.9 in safely :)
<cedricv> indeed! well actually we could even release in time a 0.9.1 with the latest bugfixes
<cedricv> as a maintenance release
<cedricv> what is the problem you have witn monodevelop-boo btw?
<jdong> cedricv: mainly code completion support / stetic support
<jdong> and in the process I understand there's some nastiness in how Boo loads assemblies into the MD process
<cedricv> hmm so in the end is it crashing? or having incorrect behavior?
<jdong> cedricv: incorrect behavior; see monodevelop-list archives today, I seem to have started a dirty laundry list about the Boo binding
<jdong> btw I just recently started playing with Boo and I absolutely love it. Keep up the great work
<cedricv> great! welcome then :)
<cedricv> jdong: have read the thread on the list, not sure i get the prb though, is it boo that is loading the assemblies? or the md addin itself that is?
<jdong> cedricv: oh sorry for the unclear explanation; it's the implementation of the MD addin, not anything wrong with Boo itself :
<cedricv> jdong: yeah I think Luiss pointed out the issue correctly (addin using BooCompiler API directly instead of forking another process (or AppDomain maybe))
<jdong> cedricv: yeah the compiler part looks simple to solve, though I'm not so sure aout the parser side for codecompletion.
<jdong> I don't understand enough about Boo's interactive abilities to know the best approach for this :)
<jdong> I understand the interactive interpreter has a suggest code complete API call but that probably needs to load referenced assemblies to know what it's talking about?
<cedricv> yeah, so it would have to be done out-of-MD-process too (maybe you can have a look at the [something]Messenger.boo that Monolipse [the boo plugin for eclipse] is using)
<jdong> k, I'll look at that
<jdong> speaking of Monolipse, does it have code completion for Boo right now? I was playing with it and couldn't find that ability
<cedricv> jdong: yeah it has a *very limited* one.. you have to press alt+/            monolipse is really in pre-pre-alpha stage ;)
<jdong> cedricv: yeah it was playing mind tricks on me, sometimes alt/ does something, other times it just sits there :)
 * hyperair has just noticed the shiny new revu graph
<hyperair> pretty cool
<Chris`> Laney: "Stage"?
<Laney> place
<Laney> install them into debian/package/
<Chris`> Oh right I'll give it a shot
<Chris`> Laney: So apply a quilt patch I'm guessing?
<chrismurf> Anybody able to review pyproj for me? I've made revisions suggested by fabrice_sp_, and hoping for more feedback.  http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/pyproj
<fabrice_sp_> Hi chrismurf, did you succeed in getting the correct diff file?
<fabrice_sp_> about the point 2, the warning is because you have to change the content of the compat file to match the required debhelper version
<fabrice_sp_> I have seen your comments. Trying to build the package (and crossing the finger :-) )
<chrismurf> fabrice_sp_, I believe I did
<chrismurf> Thanks :-)
<fabrice_sp_> s/finger/fingers/
<chrismurf> fabrice_sp_, so I guess the question is whether or not I should need a specific compat level
<fabrice_sp_> you should lower it, anyway
<chrismurf> okay - to what? 6? 5?
<fabrice_sp_> chrismurf, to 6, at least (last package I did, I put 5, because of dh_icons)
<fabrice_sp_> the lowest you can, the better
<chrismurf> okay -- I'm doing nothing special, so I shouldn't need particularly advanced versions
<chrismurf> looks like python-support requires debhelper >=5
<chrismurf> so I'll switch to that
<fabrice_sp_> great
<chrismurf> so -- education question; is this because I'm making a source DEB which ideally will be usable with as old a version of debian as possible -- ie, this has little to do with targetting Jaunty specifically
<chrismurf> It's just good practice to not require things that aren't required
<fabrice_sp_> both :-) It's good to package something that can be more 'easily' backported and also, it's good practice to use the minimum
<fabrice_sp_> required
<chrismurf> noted
<chrismurf> fabrice_sp_, dputting version with new compat / debhelper version.
<chrismurf> and... fantastic - .diff.gz is getting creamed by dput again
<chrismurf> what is with that?
<chrismurf> has anybody else ever had their .gz get corrupted to binary junk during upload?
<jpds> Chris`: You have mail.
<chrismurf> jpds, my .diff.gz is fairly consistently being corrupted upon upload.  If I look at a diff of the binary streams, it's actually only in a few places.  I have the actual copyright sign in the file -- is it possible that either dput or revu is not handling utf-8 characters well?
<chrismurf> does REVU unpack/repack the .gz at all, or would any bug have to be in dput?
<fabrice_sp_> chrismurf, the same old problem with matching size...
<chrismurf> fabrice_sp_, fixed now
<chrismurf> I think I figured out what it is
<chrismurf> I switched the UTF-8 copyright signs in 'copyright' to be (C)
<chrismurf> problem now gone
<chrismurf> so... maybe dput or REVU has unicode issues? ASCII only?
<chrismurf> the one up there  now should be good
<jpds> G'evening mrooney
<mrooney> jpds: allo!
<mrooney> it is morning for me :)
<jpds> mrooney: You're in SF now, right?
<chrismurf> fabrice_sp_, better?
<Chris`> jpds: Thanks for the mail btw, how do I patch without using cdbs (There is no  configure) ?
<jpds> Chris`: Use quilt, see: pidgin-facebookchat for example.
<Chris`> jpds: Heh you always refer to facebookchat, thanks again
<mrooney> jpds: I am indeed!
<jpds> mrooney: Nice.
 * fabrice_sp_ try again to build pyproj
<jpds> Chris`: Because it has an example rules file with patching, no configure and example patches in debian/patches :)
<maco> can anyone tell me why spim mysteriously disappeared after Hardy?
<quadrispro> hi guys, could someone review this? http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/nfoview
<Laney> maco: It was removed from Debian
<maco> Laney: any idea why *that* happened?
<Laney> The maintainer orphaned it
<maco> and can we get it back?
<Laney> and nobody wanted to maintain
<maco> :(
<Laney> sure, if you want to maintain it
<jpds> maco: https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/spim
<maco> jpds: oh i installed from hardy's binary
<chrismurf> maco, http://wiki.debian.org/NonFreeTrackingSystem/SourcePackage/spim
<maco> but it used to be that if your school made you learn mips it was a nice apt-get away...now it's a hunt
<chrismurf> maco, sounds like gxemul may do what you want
<maco> oooh ok
<maco> is gxemul by any chance Free (with a big F) too?
<chrismurf> maco, yes, see http://www.linux-mips.org/wiki/Emulators
<maco> ok so i guess i ought to figure out how to use this thing, then tell the TA
<maco> thanks
<fabrice_sp_> Do someone else have a problem with building a package with 404 error on autoconf ?  (Failed to fetch http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/main/a/autoconf/autoconf_2.63-2ubuntu1_all.deb  404 Not Found [IP: 91.189.88.31 80])
<iulian> fabrice_sp_: Try to update your pbuilder.
<Chris`> jpds: "debian/rules:12: /usr/share/quilt/quilt.make: No such file or directory" yet quilt is in the build-deps :-/
<maco> actually it doesnt look like gxemul does what spim does at all...
<maco> gxemul seems to be more like a vm
<maco> spim is for running or stepping through assembly files
<maco> gxemul's docs say you need to cross-compile code to run it, and you're supposed to install a guest OS
<fabrice_sp_> iulian, it's with sbuild, and I autoupdate before building. I've checked, and in packages.ubutnu.com, I have 2.63-2ubuntu1, but in archive.ubuntu.com, it's not greater than 2.61-7
<jpds> Chris`: Weird.
<Chris`> jpds: I've debuilded several times just to make sure, shall I upload to see if you can spot anything?
<fabrice_sp_> Chris`, if you get this error when building the source package, it's because you miss quilt in your computer
<Chris`> fabrice_sp_: It is installed both locally and via pbuilder
<Chris`> Using control for pbuilder ofc ^
<jpds> Chris`: Sure.
<iulian> fabrice_sp_: That's odd.  I've also got some 404s when building packages with pbuilder.  After updating, it worked.
<fabrice_sp_> iulian, yeah. The same for me. In this case, it seems that archive is not in sync
<fabrice_sp_> or some chacing with my internet provider
<fabrice_sp_> caching
<Chris`> http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?upid=4981 -- Uploaded jpds
<Chris`> Oh snap
<Chris`> I see what I did wrong!
<Chris`> I put in depends not build-depends
<jpds> Chris`: http://tinyurl.com/ao8q5b
<Chris`> jpds: What am I looking for in that link?
<jpds> Chris`: It's $(DESTDIR). Not: {DESTDIR}.
<Chris`> Oh OK
<jpds> Chris`: And you've modified the source: +++ star-merchant-1.1/Makefile
<Chris`> I haven't touched that dir :-/
<Chris`> Is that an effect of quilt?
<fabrice_sp_> chrismurf, still having the same pb with sizes
<chrismurf> seriously?!
<Chris`> jpds: Locally .orig.tar.gz is the same as upstream
<fabrice_sp_> yeah. I'm closing my browser, just to avoid caching problems
<chrismurf> fabrice_sp_, with which file
<fabrice_sp_> chrismurf, diff file
<chrismurf> if I wget the latest .diff.gz, it's the correct size
<chrismurf> whoah... but if I download it through firefox it's wrong
<jpds> Chris`: Oh, yeah, you have to add to rules: "clean: unpatch" and "build-stamp: patch".
 * Chris` will look into it :)
<jpds> Chris`: You might want to remove th configure: and configure-stamp: rules cos they're not doing anything.
<fabrice_sp_> chrismurf, i'm downloading through firefox :-/
<chrismurf> fabrice_sp_, yeah - clicking on the link in the browser ensures that it's the wrong size.  wget gets the right size.
<fabrice_sp_> ok
<chrismurf> this is bad magic
<fabrice_sp_> strange, isn't it?
<chrismurf> REVU admin, help?
<jpds> Again? :)
<fabrice_sp_> yeah. I think RainCT was updating REVU some time ago
<chrismurf> jpds, yeah, I'm hopeless
<chrismurf> jpds,  the .diff.gz file from http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/pyproj downloads incorrectly through firefox for both fabrice_sp_ and I, but correctly with wget
<chrismurf> any ideas?  headers / content-type badness?
<chrismurf> it gets corrupted during transfer
<jpds> Hmm, odd.
<chrismurf> fabrice_sp_, it does work with wget for you, correct?
<fabrice_sp_> I'm trying with another package :-)
<fabrice_sp_> but yes: sze is correct with wget
<fabrice_sp_> size
<fabrice_sp_> and I'm having also that problem with another package (Chris`'s one)
<chrismurf> works through links too.  So... yeah.  ;-)
<chrismurf> fabrice_sp_, firefox 3?
<chrismurf> 3.0.5
<jpds> Hmm, maybe it's something with mod_deflate.
<fabrice_sp_> 3.0.5, yes
 * Chris` is trying to fight the errors like a good detective
<chrismurf> jpds, that seems not unreasonable
<fabrice_sp_> jpds, is it something RainCT changed few tiem ago?
<jpds> fabrice_sp_: Yes.
<RainCT> chrismurf,fabrice_sp_: What's up?
<Chris`> make[1]: Entering directory `/tmp/buildd/star-merchant-1.1'
<Chris`> cp starmerch /tmp/buildd/star-merchant-1.1/debian/star-merchant/usr/bin/starmerch
<Chris`> cp: cannot create regular file `/tmp/buildd/star-merchant-1.1/debian/star-merchant/usr/bin/starmerch': No such file or directory
<Chris`> jpds: Same error diff dir
<fabrice_sp> Hey RainCT!
<chrismurf> RainCT, wget on http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/revu1-incoming/pyproj-0902102030/pyproj_1.8.5-0ubuntu1.diff.gz is the correct size, downloading through firefox is not.
<chrismurf> Hi :-)
<jpds> chrismurf: Hmm, freaky.
<Chris`> I've been having lots of Firefox errors lately when downloading
<Chris`> Sometimes the download does not even start
<Chris`> and refuses to
<chrismurf> Been kicking myself for incompetence with creating .diff.gz
<chrismurf> I feel slightly better now :-)
<fabrice_sp> lol
<RainCT> Weird.. Now that I think about it, it can't be mod_deflate as it doesn't touch .gz files
<chrismurf> RainCT, we're both running FF 3.0.5
<fabrice_sp> it only affect diff file
<chrismurf> but I can't imagine what the bug would be
<RainCT> yeah, I can reproduce it
<chrismurf> wget or links works fine
<chrismurf> kk
<fabrice_sp> and was working fine one week ago, I think
<RainCT> must be some Firefox weirdness..
<RainCT> uhm
<RainCT> (to be sure, I've just tried disabling deflate - still doesn't work)
<chrismurf> kk
<fabrice_sp> is there a way to compare to binary files?
<chrismurf> fabrice_sp, I did using diff
<chrismurf> it's only a couple of places it gets mangled
<chrismurf> RainCT, I thin it's on the server
<chrismurf> because I'm getting sent a Content-Encoding of gzip
<chrismurf> looking at the header
<RainCT> chrismurf: .diff.gz is a gzip encoded file
<RainCT> :P
<chrismurf> but wouldn't that be content-type, not content-encoding?
<RainCT> Uhm.. Right :P
<chrismurf> http://pastebin.ca/1333005
<chrismurf> Firefox Live HTTP Headers for the download
<chrismurf> so - the server is listing the content-length as 2691 for firefox
<chrismurf> RainCT, http://pastebin.ca/1333006
<porthose> iulian: the requested diff.gz has been posted for Bug #300445, if you have some spare time would you please have a look , thanks ;-)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 300445 in qtsmbstatus "Updating QtSmbstatus" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/300445
<chrismurf> RainCT, fabrice_sp, wget has different headers sent to it than Firefox does
<fabrice_sp> chrismurf, I'm trying to build with the wget version of diff file
<chrismurf> fabrice_sp, I'll leave you alone then ;-)
<Chris`> Before I cry -- Can someone have a look at this for me? -- http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?upid=4991
<RainCT> with epiphany it also fails..
 * Laney gets gnome-shell
<Laney> I spied your name there RainCT
<RainCT> Laney: :)
<Laney> is it usable?
<alex_muntada> james_w: I was asking RainCT about bug #280381 and he suggested that I should better ask you
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 280381 in bzr-builddeb "fails to import vlc 0.9.4 into ~lp:motumedia/vlc/vlc" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/280381
<fabrice_sp> Chris`, what do you want others to look at?
<alex_muntada> james_w: how can i bzr import-dsc a debian .dsc on a previous ubuntu branch (no upstream-debian tag exists)
<chrismurf> RainCT, only difference I can see (besides length) is the ETag + Content-Encoding are .gzip
<chrismurf> which seems like mod_deflate (?)
<RainCT> Laney: Depending on the graphics card, perhaps (although I wouldn't recommend you to replace compiz/metacity with it :)). Here it runs rather slow.. :(
<Laney> :<
<RainCT> Laney: according to the developers it works best with Intel 9xxx cards
 * Laney has ATI
<RainCT> chrismurf: About point 2 on REVU, you have to specify a minimum debhelper version, but it can be >= 5.x, 6 or 7
<chrismurf> RainCT, thanks :-) It's now 5
<chrismurf> RainCT, Also, I just realized that if I gzip -d the downloaded file, I get the correct file
<chrismurf> so - it's getting gzipped twice
<chrismurf> and not ungzipped once by the browser
<hyperair> is it me or is revu down?
<hyperair> no wait, it's up again
<Laney> RainCT: Oh my god it's ruined my desktop!
 * Laney wonders how to get back to metacity
<RainCT> Laney: LOL. Just Ctrl+C
<Laney> haha
<RainCT> hyperair: I'm restarting Apache ^^
<Laney> I could barely even read the text
<Laney> that was fun
<hyperair> RainCT: lol
<hyperair> RainCT: why?
<hyperair> RainCT: should be force-reload
<hyperair> also i'm curious to know where jpds got my surname from =O
<chrismurf> hyperair, https://wiki.edubuntu.org/hyperair? ;-)
<RainCT> hyperair: https://wiki.edubuntu.org/hyperair
<RainCT> heh
<hyperair> huh why edubuntu O_o
<Laney> google
<hyperair> lol
<hyperair> huh there's a hyperair on lenovo forums
<hyperair> identity theft!
<EagleScreen> i want to submit a bug to Universe Sponsors Queue
<RainCT> EagleScreen: just subscribe ubuntu-{universe,main}-sponsors to it
<quadrispro> hi RainCT, could you take a look at http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/nfoview ? :)
<soren> hyperair: It's in your GPG key.
<chrismurf> RainCT, any luck?
<alex_muntada> james_w: i figured it out... "bzr tags" shows upstream-1.32 so i copy it to the expected tag "bzr tag upstream-debian-1.32 -r tag:upstream-1.32" and then the "bzr import-dsc --distribution debian ...." runs smoothly
<Laney> omg sabnzbd got in
<Laney> nice one jcfp!
<jcfp> wow it actually did happen
<maco> what's the maintainer supposed to be on packages in multiverse which are not in debian?
<RainCT> maco: MOTU
<maco> but i mean whats the actual line supposed to say then?
<Laney> Ubuntu MOTU Developers <ubuntu-motu@lists.ubuntu.com>
<maco> and where can i find info about Standards-Version?
<mok0> maco:  google
<maco> heh ok
<mok0> :-)
<mok0> maco: current version is 3.8.0.1
<mok0> maco: specified as 3.8.0
<maco> so thats the one in use for jaunty?
<mok0> maco: yep
<maco> since im not sure how this works...if i set it to 3.8.0 and it turns out the package im working on *doesn't* comply properly, does lintian tell me that?
<chrismurf> RainCT, any luck on the gzip bug, or should I file something in LP for Revu(?)
<RainCT> chrismurf: I'm trying, but no luck so far :/
<chrismurf> RainCT, anything I can do to help?  Happy to peek at the apache.conf site if that's shareable information.
<RainCT> chrismurf: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/revu1-incoming/pyproj-0902102030/pyproj_1.8.5-0ubuntu1.diff.gz
<RainCT> err
<RainCT> chrismurf: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/~rainct/revu  :)
<chrismurf> heh
<mok0> chrismurf:  what bug is that?
<RainCT> mok0: .diff.gz is compressed twice (once because it already is, and apparently a second time by Apache)
<chrismurf> a wget downloaded version is fine
<chrismurf> but a firefox downloaded version is too big and compressed twice.
<chrismurf> (as a result)
<mok0> weird
<mok0> is it some apache plugin?
<mok0> Well as long as dget works I don't care :-)
<chrismurf> mok0, how do you use dget with REVU?
<RainCT> chrismurf: dget <url of the .dsc>
<RainCT> chrismurf: and there's even a deb-src repository :)
<mok0> chrismurf: dget -u -x http://.... path to .dsc file
<chrismurf> RainCT, I see :-)  I'm very new to all of this.
<chrismurf> and the current documentation is no replacement for experience ;-)
<mok0> chrismurf: I just copy-paste the URL from the browser to the terminal
<chrismurf> kk
<mok0> The person that writes a plugin for firefox to do it will be a hero
<chrismurf> RainCT, what's in /etc/apache2/mods-available/deflate.conf ?
<RainCT> chrismurf: AddOutputFilterByType DEFLATE text/html text/plain text/xml
<chrismurf> do you know offhand how apache determines MIME type?
<RainCT> nope
<chrismurf> wonder if it sees the .diff.gz as text/plain or something
<mok0> AFAIK the new strategy is to snoop the first bytes of the file
<chrismurf> is lp:revu trunk the version that's running atm?
<RainCT> chrismurf: yes
<RainCT> chrismurf: but there isn't anything related to this there
<chrismurf> ok - not familiar with revu, so I wasn't sure if these files were static or not
<chrismurf> I take it they are
<chrismurf> no headers being sent by revu
<RainCT> chrismurf: yes, they are put into revu1-incoming when the upload is processed
<chrismurf> k
<RainCT> quadrispro: looking
<quadrispro> RainCT: thanks, I'm going away now, if you will finding some issue, please add a comment :)
<quadrispro> bye!
<RainCT> see you
<maco> haha
<postalchris> Anybody free to look at http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/cvc3 ?
<maxb> postalchris: There are lintian warnings....
<postalchris> It's just the short description of 2 binary packages. Fixed in my wd
<RainCT> kirkland: Hey. I've just installed screen-profiles from your PPA :)
<maxb> yeah, but an upload to revu is cheap (unless you're particularly bandwidth restricted) and the first thing a potential reviewer is going to notice is that big red !
 * RainCT notices that kirkland is away and saves his complaints for another day :P
<postalchris> maxb: OK, I fixed that one. I still have a warning about not closing a LP bug
<maxb> I'm uncertain whether people really care about that one
<postalchris> I fixed that and reuploaded, but now I get "This package could not be extracted"
<maxb> did you forget to include the orig.tar.gz in the upload?
<postalchris> maxb: No, it got uploaded.
<postalchris> maxb: I'm doing a version bump and re-upload.
<maxb> MOTUs, where is it documented that a REVU package should contain only a single debian/changelog entry and not document its history in REVU? I'm sure I've read that somewhere but can't find the reference to back it up.
<pochu> maxb: not sure if it's documented, but that's indeed pretty much a requirement for it to be uploaded
<pochu> for the REVU history, you can look at the debdiffs REVU offers
<postalchris> OK, now it's clean, no lintian warnings... Anybody free? http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/cvc3 (CVC automated theorem prover)
<maxb> There's absolutely no difference between ${source:Version} and ${binary:Version} except in the case of Debian automatic binary rebuilds, right?
<maxb> REVU seems to be down?
<maxb> postalchris: I wrote you some comments but REVU seems to have broken
<maxb> So they're here instead: http://rafb.net/p/cyfdDd76.html
<maxb> Oh, it's back
<maxb> comments posted
<porthose> would a kind motu have a look at http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/quickplay :)
<Caesar> Hi
<Caesar> We've got three backport requests for Hardy that we're interested in getting some movement on
<Caesar> We're happy to do as much of the labour as possible
<maxb> Are they filed yet?
<Caesar> Yes
<Caesar> #320220 #320656 #320660
<pochu> ScottK: ^
<maxb> bug 320220 bug 320656 bug 320660
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 320220 in hardy-backports "Please backport trousers from Intrepid" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/320220
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 320656 in hardy-backports "Please backport xl2tpd from Intrepid/Jaunty to Hardy" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/320656
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 320660 in hardy-backports "Please backport opencryptoki from Jaunty to Hardy" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/320660
<pochu> Caesar: the work basically involves building/installing/testing the package in the requested release, but I'm not a backporter...
<maxb> Caesar: Have you seen https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuBackports ?
<Caesar> maxb: yep
<pochu> and I'm off to bed... good night all!
<Caesar> We're currently running the packages
<Caesar> We'll rebuilding them in pbuilder just to follow the steps as documented
<Laney> huh
<maxb> Looking at the trousers one - a sourceful backport is not required for that. hardy-backports has debhelper 7
#ubuntu-motu 2009-02-11
<Caesar> Even better then, right?
<maxb> Caesar: Well, you can get as far as item 7 of the "Backport Process" before you need a backporter to approve the final stages
<maxb> So doing that will undoubtably help
<Caesar> Yep, we're working on that
<maxb> ewww
 * maxb expresses disgust at the opencryptoki backport which states "No source changes" in the changelog, and then proceeds to make sourceful changes.
<maxb> :-)
<maxb> Anyway, do everything the wiki page says, and you'll be well on the way to a backport actually happening
<Caesar> What I don't want to have happen is the request sit in limbo after we've done the hoop jumping
<maxb> I think it's *slightly* unreasonable to be nagging for expedited handling of the request's final stages when none of the earlier stages have been done yet
 * Caesar reviews the stages
<Caesar> 1 done
<Caesar> 2 there was some quibbling about whether the debian directory constituted "source modification" or not
<Caesar> As has been pointed out, with debhelper 7 in hardy-backports, that makes it a non-issue
<Caesar> 3 not an issue
 * Caesar sees the actual process
<Caesar> So we're at step 4
<Caesar> But sure, we will continue through the process
<Caesar> and I'm not asking for expedited handling, I just don't want it to be any slower than necessary
<aboudreault> Is there a consequence if i change the debian/compat: 7 to 6 ? (just to solve this error: Sorry, but 6 is the highest compatibility level supported by this debhelper)
<RAOF> aboudreault: The consequence is that your package won't be able to depend on behaviour introduced in compat level 7.
<RAOF> aboudreault: That said, all the debhelper versions you need to care about support compat level 7, I believe.
<aboudreault> i'm under hardy, and i've got this error message, so i don't think so
<aboudreault> hardy = debhelper version 6.x..
<RAOF> Right.
<RAOF> But debhelper in hardy-backports is 7.something.
<aboudreault> ha
<aboudreault> Is it good to build packages that needs *-backports ?
<RAOF> Oh.  I suppose my advice is only relevant if you're working to get something official.  If you're just messing around in a PPA, then you'll either want to make the PPA depend on hardy-backports, or drop the compat, yes.
<aboudreault> yes, i'll upload my package on launchpad, so i simply dropped the compat 7 to 5 (for gutsy)
<RAOF> As long as the package doesn't use any of the compat level 7 features (see man debhelper), that'll be fine.
<aboudreault> all right. thx.
<RAOF> Although I believe if the package has set compat = 7, it should also be build-depending on debhelper >= 7.
<aboudreault> yes, i changed the dependency version also.
<mrooney> Can anyone give me a tip on lintian-overrides?
<aboudreault> RAOF: btw... do you know how the launchpad procedure ? I'd have a simple question
<mrooney> is it "wxbanker binary: extra-license-file usr/share/pyshared/wxbanker/COPYING.txt" or "binary: wxbanker: extra-license-file usr/share/pyshared/wxbanker/COPYING.txt" ?
<mrooney> got it, the first one :)
<RAOF> mrooney: When I packaged specto, I just added a patch to make it look in common-licenses rather than shipping its own copy of the GPL; is that not an option here?
<mrooney> RAOF: nope, upstream is cross-platform
<mrooney> and it seems silly to diverge for that
<RAOF> mrooney: But the Debian package isn't.
<RAOF> Maybe.
<mrooney> that would be the only diff
<mrooney> hmm, I dunno, it was suggested that I override it
<mrooney> so as not to diverge
<mrooney> I could see either side, I guess
<RAOF> I, personally, would be patching it to make it use the licence already on the system.  Other people obviously disagree; it's a bit of a wash.
<mrooney> I've been trying to package this for about two months, I am hoping to get a second advocate and get it into Jaunty
<mrooney> and as I've never done patches before
<mrooney> I think that would kill my aspirations
<RAOF> But that would depend on how easy it is to patch, too.  Specto was a one-line patch.
<mrooney> ahh
<milos_> There are no pidgin and pidgin-facebook packages for Feisty. Is it posible to make them with pbuilder for example?
<aboudreault> milos_: have you tried to simply install the pidgin-facebook package ? (even if it's made for hardy or ...)
<aboudreault> like this one: http://code.google.com/p/pidgin-facebookchat/downloads/detail?name=pidgin-facebookchat-1.47.deb&can=2&q=
<milos_> aboudreault, it's for my friend, I am running jaunty. He tried but dependecies were broken
<aboudreault> off course.... it still named "gaim" in feisty
<milos_> yup
<mrooney> Oh no, I lost my advocation!
<mrooney> I didn't realize a new upload did that but I guess it makes sense
<aboudreault> milos_: he could try to install libpurple, finch, libpurple from hardy manually.
<aboudreault> but i don't know.
<milos_> aboudreault, Well it is his fault, he is to lazy to upgrade.
<aboudreault> how can he be too lazy to upgrade ? that's so easy.
<aboudreault> let him with his gaim then ;)
<milos_> hehe
<milos_> He has 256kbps, put that is now an excuse!
<aboudreault> :P
<milos_> *not
<jdong> "Our packages are first made using the Debian Packager tools, then we use alien to convert these packages to .rpm. As a result, we need lots of people to test our packages!"
<jdong> ^^ I just pulled out some of my initial FOSS contributions back when Ubuntu 4.10 was a preview
<jdong> kinda amusing to read in retrospect
<jdong> or disturbing.
<ScottK> jdong: Please look at backports.  Lots of stuff needing approving....
<ScottK> Speaking of crack.
<jdong> on my todo list
<mrooney> ScottK: I've got a manpage now for http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/wxbanker and all the issues should be resolved (and mok0 advocated), any chance you'd be able to give it the second advocation for me? :)
<mrooney> or anyone else for that matter, would also be greatly appreciated. I hope to get it in before feature freeze for Jaunty!
<postalchris> maxb: I've addressed your comments on http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/cvc3
<ScottK-desktop> mrooney: Maybe.
<ScottK-desktop> Tonight is pretty busy for me.
<d-b> hi i'm trying to (i'm a noob) modify apachetop so i can run it (without compiling it with hardening off) i modified a few lines in src/apachetop.h and i get a ton of errors pastebin is http://pastebin.com/d23619d4
<d-b> i was following https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Recipes/Debdiff
<d-b> but i probably screwed up.
<fabrice_sp_> d-b, you screw the apachetop.h file :-)
<fabrice_sp_> up
<Zetto> To update NetBeans in Ubuntu+1 we need that someone sponsor the paths on the following bugs:  Bug #316744, Bug #316784, Bug #316793 , bye all, please update it before feature freeze
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 316744 in libnb-svnclientadapter-java "Update SvnClientAdapter" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/316744
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 316784 in libnb-javaparser-java "New upstream version (6.5) for javaparser" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/316784
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 316793 in libnb-platform-java "Update libnb-platform-java to 6.5" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/316793
<ScottK> Zetto: You need air.  You want stuff uploaded.
<tonyyarusso> how would you write a version number for an alpha release in debian/changelog?  Upstream calls it 0.8a1.
<lifeless> 0.8~a1
<lifeless> offhand
<dholbach> good morning
<tonyyarusso> lifeless: sounds plausible - ty
<fabrice_sp> Morning dholbach !
<dholbach> hiya fabrice_sp
<tonyyarusso> also, could someone remind me what the implications are of the release codename in the changelog lines?
<StevenK> tonyyarusso: As in (version) codename; urgency=low ?
<tonyyarusso> StevenK: right.
<StevenK> tonyyarusso: It's the codename of the release you're targetting
<tonyyarusso> StevenK: what does "targetting" mean exactly though?
<StevenK> tonyyarusso: It's meant to build, install and work on release.
<tonyyarusso> StevenK: but is allowed to possibly do so on others still.
<RAOF> tonyyarusso: The the buildds will only build it for the release targetted, but apart from that, I don't think there's much effect.
<tonyyarusso> ah, ok
<RAOF> Oh, apart from all the launchpad stuff which'll change based on the release :)
<tonyyarusso> My main point was "will it build on hardy for testing even if it's not goign to actually be released until at least jaunty, so I put that"
<tonyyarusso> so that sounds like a yes.
<RAOF> Yes.
<didrocks> morning
<maco> if anyone's around, can someone review http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/spim ?  It was in Ubuntu before but Debian & Ubuntu dropped it when the maintainer stopped maintaining it.  I'm willing to pick up maintenance. This is a new release after 2 years of no releases--the first bug the developer received in those 2 years was a recent "doesn't work with the newest flex" so this was the release to fix that
<tonyyarusso> Can I make a patch that will change the permissions on a file?
<maco> tonyyarusso: adding a chmod to the postinst?
<tonyyarusso> Building is throwing errors like "/bin/sh: /tmp/buildd/kompozer-0.8~a1/mozilla/build/autoconf/config.guess: Permission denied", since they're -x.
<tonyyarusso> maco: files for building, not after installing.
<RAOF> No; chmod them in debian/rules
<tonyyarusso> Okay, excellent.
<tonyyarusso> I figured that would work, but wasn't sure if it was the "right way".
<tonyyarusso> crap, now I have to try to remember the format of debian/rules :P
<tonyyarusso> Is there a way to say in debian/rules "if ubuntu, do this, if debian, do that", so we don't have a constant delta?  (They have different configure settings upstream for some reason)
<soren> tonyyarusso: Yes.
<tonyyarusso> soren: how?
<soren> tonyyarusso: Hang on :)
<jpds> dholbach: What should I do about the changed md5sum?
<soren> tonyyarusso: I believe e2fsprogs does it.
 * soren checks
<dholbach> jpds: just let me know what you changed there - did you repack the tarball?
<soren>         if test -f /etc/lsb-release && \
<soren>                 grep -q DISTRIB_ID=Ubuntu /etc/lsb-release; then \
<soren> tonyyarusso: ^^
<jpds> dholbach: Yes, upstream is called: gdata.py-1.2.4.tar.gz.
<tonyyarusso> soren: nice
<dholbach> jpds: can't you just rename it?
<jpds> dholbach: I replied to the bug report too.
<dholbach> to python-gdata_1.2.4.orig.tar.gz
<dholbach> jpds: I'd prefer it we can just take the upstream tarball
<dholbach> as it is
<jpds> dholbach: Won't teh gdata.py-1.2.4/* affect it?
<jpds> dholbach: Appears to work, I'll reupload.
<dholbach> jpds: gracias - will check it out in a bit
<mrooney> Are you not supposed to upload after an advocation?
<somaunn> hello
<jpds> mrooney: After two, if you'd like.
<slytherin> somaunn: hello
<mrooney> jpds: I meant, upload a new version of the package
<jpds> mrooney: Bug #?
<mrooney> jpds: bug 297289, is that what you mean?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 297289 in ubuntu "[needs-packaging] wxBanker" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/297289
<mrooney> jpds: for example someone said "I'm advocating but fix this tiny detail" then unsubscribed themself, so I fixed it and lost the advocation
<mrooney> and now he won't know as he unsubscribed himself, haha
<mrooney> PS that is some even karma that I have
<pochu> mrooney: REVU link?
<mrooney> pochu: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/wxbanker
<pochu> mrooney: ping mok0 when he's around, I guess he wont have any problem to advocate it again
<mrooney> hahaha
<pochu> :-)
<mrooney> pochu: but was my workflow correct?
<mrooney> or should I have waited for a second advocation and then addressed it?
<pochu> mrooney: what mok0 meant was to fix it directly when uploading to the archive, but what you did is fine too
<somaunn> slytherin: whats really a problem with mscorefont package
<DktrKranz> pochu: could you please give me six numbers between 1 and 90? I plan to win "superenalotto" (> 30 million euros), you can predict future! :P
<pochu> DktrKranz: hah, sure! but I want 10% if you win ;)
<mrooney> mok0: I was just asking what I should do after uploading the fix and losing your advocation :)
<DktrKranz> pochu: I give you 20%!
<pochu> :)
<pochu> DktrKranz: 2 27 9 80 48 87
<mok0> mrooney: You haven't lost it :-)
<somaunn> because i'm always having problem with that package
<mok0> DktrKranz: 1 2 3 4 5 6
<DktrKranz> mok0: highly improbable :)
<pochu> mok0: that's not gonna win. The good combination is mine :)
<soren> DktrKranz: Exactly as improbable as any other numbers.
<mok0> DktrKranz: (just as likely as any other outcome :-))
<pochu> DktrKranz: actually as improbable as mine ;)
<mok0> heh
<mrooney> mok0: well I just meant technically in REVU I did
<DktrKranz> heh
<mrooney> by uploading a new version
<jpds> mrooney: I'll upload the package, just test building at the moment.
<mok0> mrooney: well, usually it doesn't matter
<mrooney> mok0: ahh okay. this is my first package and interaction with motu so, it's all new and magical to me
<mok0> mrooney: I'm ok with the next MOTU uploading
<mok0> mrooney: it's one of the akward things about revu that we are trying to sort out
<DktrKranz> pochu: If I manage to win, I'll come in murcia personally to give you money :P
<slytherin> somaunn: what problem? how am I supposed to know without any context?
<somaunn> each time i'm trying to install  the package mscorefont it's giving me problem
<slytherin> somaunn: I don't understand why are you asking me this question? I am not involved with the package anyway.
<jpds> mrooney: The debian/ packaging is in the upstream source right?
<mok0> somaunn, like Balmer throwing chairs at you?
<mrooney> jpds: yeah
<mrooney> that source is a bzr export
<mrooney> clean as a whistle!
<somaunn> but now i have this problem: dpkg was interrupted, you must manually run 'dpkg --configure -a' to correct the problem; E:_cache->open()failed, please report.
<jpds> mrooney: Uploaded!
<mrooney> jpds: excellent!
<mrooney> thanks!
<somaunn> MS is dead now, i have the confirmation
<geser> somaunn: can you please put the whole output when you try to run "sudo dpkg --configure -a" into a pastebin and give us the link?
<pochu> DktrKranz: I'll be glad if you come!
<somaunn> it's fine now
<somaunn> not giving me the problem anymore
<somaunn> i hope
<somaunn> geser: tell how me can do what you're asking me to do /
<geser> good
<geser> open a terminal (like gnome-terminal), paste the command I mentioned, copy the output into http://paste.ubuntu.com/ , msg the resulting url here
<somaunn> geser: here is the link http://paste.ubuntu.com/116728/
<geser> this doesn't look good
<geser> how did you manage to get into this state?
<Milyardo> D: and I thought I was screwed
<Milyardo> It says you don't have package libfreemarker-java installed
<Milyardo> liblucene2-java as well
<mok0> apt-get -f install
<geser> somaunn: my suggestion would be to see what output "sudo apt-get -f install" would give (pastebin it again), but read it *carefully* before proceeding
<somaunn> geser: ok
<somaunn> geser: http://paste.ubuntu.com/116732/
<somaunn> it hink in this report every thing is fine
<somaunn> just need to update the system
<geser> yes, the second pastebin looks ok
<geser> but you still shouldn't have that many unconfigured packages
<somaunn> geser: not every thing it's fine
<somaunn> i say thank to God, torvalds & you guys also by making linux to be better day after day
<somaunn> because if i try to imagine the same problem happening in Microshit Winplode
<geser> somaunn: let's try to resolve this mess: please try "sudo dpkg --configure libnb-ide9-java" (pastebin only in case of error)
<somaunn> it's saying: package libnb-ide9-java is already installed and configured
<geser> hmm, that's really interesting as you first pastebin mentions that this package could be configured
<geser> did the output from "sudo dpkg --configure -a" change compared to your first pastebin?
<somaunn> yes
<somaunn> it's sending me back to the prompt
<geser> than everything is ok now
<somaunn> i think nothing to configure
<geser> yes, the problems from the first pastebin are fixed
<slytherin> Koon: I didn't know you were working on geronimo packaging. :-)
<maco> can someone please review http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/spim ?
<jpds> maco: Section: non-free/electronics ?
<maco> jpds: not a valid section? that's what it was in the old package. is there a list of valid ones?
<maxb> The canonical list of valid section names is in the Policy manual
<Koon> slytherin: well, just the free implementation of the spec things
<Koon> slytherin: to replace the sun things with the strange licensing
<jpds> maco: I don't think we use the non-free part, but the electronics looks good from http://debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-archive.html#s-subsections .
<maco> it does say main, contrib, non-free, but should that be changed to say multiverse then?
<mok0> Those sections are useless anyway :-/
<slytherin> maco: does the package contains any non-free parts?
<maco> slytherin: yes, modifications are not allowed to be redistributed
<maco> and no commercial distribution
<maco> the developer clarified to the previous maintainer that debianization was fine though
<jpds> maco: Remove the non-free bit, it gets multiverse automatically prepended.
<slytherin> maco: I doubt that kind of package will be allowed. specifically the 'no commercial distribution' part.
<maco> slytherin: http://changelogs.ubuntu.com/changelogs/pool/multiverse/s/spim/spim_7.3-1/spim.copyright
<slytherin> I might be wrong though
<Laney> that's right
<Laney> the archive admins put it in one afaik
<maco> slytherin: it was allowed through Etch and Hardy...
<maco> slytherin: in multiverse, not in univere
<slytherin> maco: you say 'ï»¿modifications are not allowed to be redistributed'. Was that the case for previous versions as well?
<maco> yes
<maco> the copyright hasnt changed
<slytherin> ok. I just saw the note
<maco> that link is to the copyright file from the one in hardy
<maco> er, i mean the license hasnt changed
<slytherin> maco: if the package already exists in archive and you are providing new version why is that done on revu?
<slytherin> shouldn't that be a part of bug?
<maco> slytherin: it was removed from debian and ubuntu when the last maintainer stopped maintaining it
<maco> so now it needs to be re-added to the archive
<maco> dholbach said to submit it as a new package
<slytherin> ah, ok
<maco> see: http://wiki.debian.org/NonFreeTrackingSystem/SourcePackage/spim
<maco> (that link is wrong about gxemul covering all the functionality though...gxemul requires compiled code, can't handle assembly, which is what spim was made to do)
<maco> jpds: so just make the section say "electronics" you're saying?
<jpds> maco: Yep.
<maco> jpds: the policy manual says that it assumes main if there's no segment listed though
<jpds> maco: Ubuntu automatically puts universe or multiverse depending on where the package is,.
<maco> hmm? how?
<maco> how does it know which to put, i mean?
<maco> do the archive maintainers do this manually?
<somaunn> i have this problem: http://paste.ubuntu.com/116746/ i'm trying to install openoffice 3
<maco> jpds: ok, so i'll change that and upload a new source package. should it use the same package version since it never hit archive or will revu want the number to increment anyway?
<jpds> maco: I reckon the buildds do it, and keep the package version as it is. :)
<jpds> maco: Actually, ignore what I said about the section:, looks like ubuntu-restricted-extras has it set in the source package. :/
<maco> doh
<maco> so which should it be?
<jpds> Just electronics.
<maco> ok
<maco> ok edited and re-uploaded
<maco> anything else?
<maco> (prob wouldve made sense to ask that first...)
<slytherin> maco: archive admins usually place the package in appropriate section by looking at copyright file.
<maco> slytherin: hey i guessed right!
<jpds> maco: Looks good to me now. :)
<maco> yay
<maco> jpds: thank you
<jpds> maco: No problem. :)
<slytherin> TheMuso: 3 uploads of linux-ports in one day. :-D
<ScottK> slytherin: No commercial distribution is fine for Multiverse.
<henrik-hw0> anyone online feel like doing a REVU?
<Juli_> ScottK: Hi, I've just read your message to Zetto. ([08:29]<ScottK>Zetto: You need air. You want stuff uploaded.)  I'm afraid I don't understand it could you, please explain what it means:)
<ScottK> Juli_: It means that we have a sponsoring process that I've explained to him before.
<ScottK> Personally I find impatience and dumping a lot of bug info in the channel demotivating about do I want to sponsor that person's work.
<Juli_> ScottK: hmm.. I understand you and very sorry about that. But it is not his work.
<ScottK> OK.
<Juli_> Do I understand correctly, if ubuntu sponsors for universe are subscribed to those bugs does it mean that someone sponsor them before feature freeze? If not, is there something I can do to help?
<ScottK> It means that we'll try.
<ScottK> All of us are volunteers who help out here as we can.
<ScottK> There are no guarantees.
<ScottK> Also, while still no guarantee, personally (and I am a member of the motu-release team) be inclined to be somewhat more favorable to FF exception requests if the stuff was in before the freeze, but just didn't get sponsored.
<Juli_> Yes I know you are volunteers and thank you a lot for that.
<Juli_> Ok I understood, thanks!
<ScottK> Probably more than I should be I tend to react negatively to pressure on how I ought to be doing that volunteering.
<Juli_> actually yes, I totally agree with you. But I know that many people want to see new NetBeans in Ubuntu and I believe Zetto just wanted to help:) Please be patient to us:)
<ScottK> OK.
<Juli_> Thanks.
<sven777> Would a MOTU kindly review my package?  (I already have one advocate)  Thanks!  http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/lmalinux
<slytherin> Juli_: are you just looking for sponsor? Or do you also want someone to review the package?
<ScottK> slytherin: There are sponsorship requests in the queue.
<slytherin> ScottK: I was specifically considering netbeans package. I will take a look.
<directhex> ScottK, a package in need of updating has a new dependency. the new dependency is languishing in debian NEW. what're the chances of 0ubuntu1ing the package, to give it a little nudge?
<Laney> (would it need to be fully REVUed?)
<mok0> Hmm I wonder why I can't connect with pidgin
<mok0> freenode seems dead
<geser> mok0: how can you chat than here?
<mok0> geser: through irssi :-)
<pochu> mok0: huh, are you gonna replace irssi with pidgin!? :)
<mok0> pochu: I normally use pidgin, as I'm also on jabber
<pochu> huh, do you use pidgin for jabber!? ;)
<mok0> ... and pidgin uses less screen real estate than irssi
<slytherin> Juli_: I don't see any get-orig-source target or watch file in the diff provided in bug 316793. From where am I supposed to get the .orig.tar.gz?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 316793 in libnb-platform-java "Update libnb-platform-java to 6.5" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/316793
<slytherin> persia: DktrKranz: can either if you add me to u-u-s? my launchpad id is onkarshinde.
<persia> slytherin, Sure.  Doing it now.
<slytherin> I hope to clear up few bugs from the u-u-s queue today
<persia> Excellent!
<Juli_> slytherin: please find at copyright  file the link with tar.gz file. You just need to rename it. If it is required I'll create orig-tar-gz for this package.
<persia> Juli_, There was a working solution for nb6.1 : can those not be reused?
<slytherin> Juli_: No need. I checked the link in copyright file. I was just checking if you forgot to add get-orig-source
<Juli_> slytherin: I thought in this case it was not necessary.
<slytherin> Juli_: It is always good to have watch file or get-orig-source target.
<Juli_> slytherin:  ok, I'll always do this in future, thanks for noticing!
<mok0> Back on pidgin. Funny
<slytherin> persia: do you have a jaunty installation handy?
<persia> slytherin, Yes, but I'm about to be idle for an extended period, so only want to do something quick :)  If you need testing for 251173, I'd rather do it tomorrow.
<slytherin> persia: nah, leave it then.
<gaspa> dholbach, james_w: Sorry, our server is often down ( the one which runs edos ) in these days, we had problems with ... erhm ... our hosting.
<gaspa> I'm searching another server that could host our scripts. when we're ready I'll let you know.
<dholbach> gaspa: OK
<ScottK> directhex: At this point I'd recommend that (uploading the package here directly).
<james_w> gaspa: cool, thanks for the information
<dholbach> thanks for working on it
<james_w> gaspa: let me know if I can help
<gaspa> james_w: sure, actually I've not yet think anything...
<anakron> HI all
<bddebian> james_w: I got plenty for you if you are bored.. ;-P
<james_w> heh, if only :-)
<binarymutant>  can someone help me understand why this rule file wants to install to the /usr directory and to /usr/local ? http://pastebin.com/d3b44ebbf
<huats> persia: hello
<huats> are you around ?
<bddebian> binarymutant: Do you have a .install file?
<binarymutant> bddebian, no, and I'm not sure what that is
<bddebian> debian/install or debian/<package>.install
<binarymutant> bddebian, no I don't have that :/
<bddebian> The same file is going in both dirs or just one?
<binarymutant> both directories unfortunately
<binarymutant> bddebian, http://pastebin.com/d496f0d6c here's a list of where it's installing to
<binarymutant> could it be that I'm using dpkg-buildpackage -r  to build the package?
<bddebian> Well you specifcy dh_install to install in usr/share/charm but maybe setup.py is installing in usr/local/..?
<binarymutant> bddebian, I read somewhere that distutils installs to /usr/local by default is this true? if so how can I change that?
<maxb> I don't think it does it by default, though it can be configured to do so by a distutils.cfg, which I do on my servers to ensure ad-hoc installations don't land in /usr
<binarymutant> thanks maxb I'll look up distutils.cfg, that might be helpful
<binarymutant> it's confusing me because the version of this package in the Jaunty repos installs to /usr/ only and not /usr/local and the only difference in the rules file is the dh_install line
<aboudreault> When using launchpad... we should set the dependencie versions that are IN the oldest ubuntu codename, (gutsy i think). And upload the package. Am I wrong ? or we need to upload package for every codename ?
<AdamDH> hey all
<AdamDH> for a package where there is no upstream version should I just use msp430-libc-0.1-msp430-cvs.0.0.timestamp some varriant of that?
<AdamDH> essentially msp430-libc-0.1-msp430-cvs.0.0.20090211
<ScottK> aboudreault: The oldest supported Ubuntu version is Dapper.  Dependency versioning should be for the lowest version that meets the requirement.  If all supported releases have the version, you don't need to version the depends.
<aboudreault> ok, thanks. I wanted to be sure that i was in the good way.
<aboudreault> and if i decided to just support gutsy and higher... is there a problem if i upload my package like that in launchpad ?
<ScottK> aboudreault: When you say in Launchpad, do you mean in a PPA?
<aboudreault> yes, sorry.
<ScottK> aboudreault: PPAs are not part of Ubuntu, so you can do whatever you want consistent with their terms of use.
<aboudreault> Ok. so i suppose that when i upload a package in a PPA, it will try to build it for every supported ubuntu version, if the build fails, if simply doesn't include this codename in the ppa.
<ScottK> aboudreault: No, it has to be uploaded for each release you  want it for.  PPA questions are better in #launchpad.
<aboudreault> kk thx.
<AdamDH> can you use $(shell dpkg-architecture -qDEB_HOST_GNU_TYPE) etc inside control?
<slytherin> AdamDH: nope
<slytherin> is it ok to unsubscribe u-u-s once u-a has been subscribed to a bug?
<DktrKranz> slytherin: yep
<geser> slytherin: yes, for sync request I unsub u-u-s and sub u-a and myself, so I can track syncs I acked
<binarymutant> I'm having dh_pycentral problems can someone help? When I try to install this package http://mentors.debian.net/debian/pool/main/c/charm/ dh_pycentral uses python2.6 but should be using python2.5...anyone know why?
<surfaz> Hi! mime files works also in KDE?
<surfaz> I want associate a file type to a command
<geser> binarymutant: can you pastebin the error message you get?
<binarymutant> geser, ty http://pastebin.com/d18dfa88
<quadrispro> RainCT: thanks for your suggestions! I've uploaded new package:
<quadrispro> RainCT: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/nfoview
<maco> are subscriptions on REVU broken for others or just me?  i have no "preferred email address" listed, and i cant edit that. i also dont see the comments on my package coming to my email, so...
<Turl> hi :)
<Turl> anyone else experiencing this bug? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/328156
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 328156 in ubuntu "There is a big delay between logging in in GDM and getting the desktop fully loaded" [Undecided,New]
<geser> binarymutant: this looks like a packaging error to me? how did you come to python2.6 as the error source as it isn't mentioned in your paste?
<maco> Turl: everyone, since feisty...
<binarymutant> geser, I use XS-Python-Version: >=2.5 in debian/control but the debian/control in the actual deb says Python-Version: 2.6
<maco> Turl: feisty was the last fast-login. gutsy onward takes nearly as long to login as it does to boot
<Turl> maco: well, but this is different. it's way slower than intrepid, on the same hardware
<geser> binarymutant: in which environment did you build your pkg? I've just build it in my jaunty pbuilder and it has: Python-Version: >=2.5
<binarymutant> geser, I'm using dpkg-buildpackage from Ibex
<geser> btw: is python2.6 already packaged?
<maco> Turl: maybe try #ubuntu+1?
<Turl> ok maco
<binarymutant> geser, I had someone else build it with dpkg and they got Python-Version: 2.5 too, so I know it's my own environment messing up. But I don't know why
<geser> binarymutant: what python versions do you have installed?
<binarymutant> geser, 2.4 - 2.6
<geser> where did you get python 2.6 from?
<binarymutant> geser, I think it was from python3 but not sure
<AnAnt> Hello, what's the preferrable license for packaging ?
<binarymutant> geser, actually I have no clue now where I got it
<geser> where is it installed? "which python2.6"
<binarymutant> local install, so is that my problem :) hopefully
<geser> binarymutant: it's a good idea to use also pbuilder for build testing, as it helps you to check if you have listed all build-depends and also to avoid "problems" like you have now :)
<binarymutant> geser, if I remove python2.6, will everything work again? I'll check out pbuilder
<geser> binarymutant: my guess is that calling python calls your locally installed python2.6 as /usr/local/bin is before /usr/bin in $PATH
<geser> binarymutant: it should
<binarymutant> Thank you so much! :)
<AnAnt> GPL2 or GPL3 ?
<geser> AnAnt: -EMISSINGCONTEXT
<AnAnt> what's the preferrable license for packaging ?  GPL2 or GPL3 ?
<geser> it's suggested to use the same license as the source to avoid license problems (of course only if you are okay with it)
<slytherin> AnAnt: preferable is same as upstream source unless upstream license is non-free.
<AnAnt> ok, thanks
<pochu> slytherin: well, that would be ok too, wouldn't it? as your package is not going to end in main ;)
 * pochu hides
<slytherin> :-)
<Vest84> Hello everybody. would a MOTU be so kind as to review my project? Thanks in advance! http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=gnome-quod This is my first package, I will be glad if you spend some time for me.
<c_korn> hello. I would like to see scilab-5 which requires fop-0.95 in jaunty. which debdiff should I provide actually? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/fop/+bug/326171
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 326171 in fop "Please sync fop-0.95 (universe) from debian experimental" [Wishlist,Incomplete]
<geser> c_korn: the current packages has ubuntu changes. So they need to be reapplied to the new debian package, if they are still needed (that's called merging) and then you need to attach the debdiff between the debian package and the new merged one
<c_korn> ok, so I first have to find the changes.
<geser> c_korn: http://patches.ubuntu.com/f/fop/fop_1:0.94.dfsg-2ubuntu2.patch
<c_korn> ah, so I have to apply the changes to the debian version and debdiff this patched debian version with the unpatched version, right?
<geser> c_korn: yes, if the changes are still needed
<geser> they can be either obsolete now (for what ever reason), still needed or incorporated by debian
<geser> so it's your task to figure for each change which case it is
<c_korn> it seems the only difference between ubuntu and debian is this line in debian/rules: http://pastebin.com/d41d34132
<c_korn> unfortunately I have no idea if this change is necessary
<c_korn> the package compiled well with the debian version.
<slytherin> c_korn: how did you compile the package? did you use pbuilder?
<c_korn> I compiled it in a ppa. https://launchpad.net/~getdeb.packages/+archive/ppa
<c_korn> (there I used the debian version)
<ScottK> c_korn: Generally at this point it's good to review previous debian/changelog entries and see if you can determine why the change was introduced.
<cody-somerville> Would a tool that updates a bios's firmware be in the admin section or the util section?
<ScottK> I go util, but that's just a guess.
<slytherin> c_korn: debian/ant.properties file was changed in Ubuntu to fix java home to correspond to the one in debian/rules. I see that in Debian version they differ. So this is the change I was referring to in my comment in the bug.
<slytherin> cody-somerville: I agree with ScottK. util seems more appropriate.
<c_korn> in debian the line in debian/ant.properties is also: javahome.jdk14=/usr/lib/jvm/java-gcj
<c_korn> they fixed it too
<slytherin> c_korn: but it is not same as the one in debian/rules
<c_korn> in debian rules it is also: JAVA_HOME            := /usr/lib/jvm/java-gcj
<c_korn> I just downloaded the debian sources: dget -ux http://ftp.de.debian.org/debian/pool/main/f/fop/fop_0.95.dfsg-2.dsc
<slytherin> let me check
<slytherin> c_korn: Ok. My mistake. I was checking version from unstable. :-(
<slytherin> c_korn: let me try building the package and then I will update the bug accordingly
<slytherin> c_korn: I verified again. the java_home is indeed different at both locations. Now I will try building the package.
<c_korn> ok, thank you
<slytherin> damn, I can not build package unless xmlgraphics-commons is synced.
<c_korn> yes, xmlgraphics-common is required. also java-wrappers (but only runtime dependency). when fop has been built there is only a dependecy for jeuclid missing to make scilab-5 compile
<c_korn> I have made a diff on these DEB_JARS: http://pastebin.com/d6133dafc
<c_korn> this debian bug report says that jimi is not required for fop any longer: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=271654
<ubottu> Debian bug 271654 in fop "fop: build with free tools (was: Re: Migration of fop to testing)" [Wishlist,Closed]
<c_korn> (all packages can be found in the ppa, btw) https://launchpad.net/~getdeb.packages/+archive/ppa
<c_korn> thanks for your support. I will be back in about half an hour.
<slytherin> c_korn: I will wait for the packages to get synced before I try building fop.
<directhex> ScottK, having always been a good little boy in the past & done things the right way, what's the procedure i should follow to short-circuit getting sublib into the archive without REVU? i can throw together a -0ubuntu1 from -1 in svn
<ScottK> directhex: I've lost track, are you a MOTU?
<directhex> ScottK, nay, but i can rustle one up
<ScottK> OK.  MOTU are not actually required to get their packages advocated on REVU (most do).
<directhex> aha
<ScottK> I imagine you can figure out the rest.
<directhex> Laney, who's awake and a motu and a pkg-mono associate member?
<vorian> ScottK: I thought we needed an ack from a fellow developer
<Laney> erm
<Laney> nobody :(
<ScottK> Last I looked it was merely highly recommended.
 * vorian could be completely wrong
<Laney> It has been acked by a DD!
 * ScottK is fairly certain "double check package was properly advocated on REVU" is not on the archive admin New review checklist.
<Laney> haha
<Laney> excellent timing RAOF
<directhex> mornin' RAOF!
<Laney> (moon too ^_^)
<directhex> Laney, weren't YOU planning on becoming MOTU?
<Laney> sure, the meeting is on friday
<directhex> ooh, is sebner about? his nick is autocompleting...
<Laney> idle     : 3 days 6 hours 26 mins 51 secs
<ScottK> Laney: Agreed.  That's why I think it's quite all right for a single MOTU to upload it.
<geser> directhex: the best time to reach sebner is probably on weekends as he is doing his military service now
<directhex> geser, yeah, i thought someone was. hm...
<tobi_> will Chinese simplified and traditional have to share the same folder in /usr/share/locale/?
<postalchris> Anybody free to look at http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=cvc3 ? It's the CVC automated theorem prover
<RAOF> directhex, Laney: Yo!  What's up?
<Laney> RAOF: We are looking for a willing MOTU to upload sublib from Debian NEW (transition enablement)
<Laney> would you be that MOTU?
<RAOF> That's sublib, the new package, yes?
<Laney> yup
<directhex> yes
<quadrispro> anyone on http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/nfoview?
<quadrispro> without '?' at the end :)
<RAOF> I'll have a look-see.
<Laney> consensus is that it's OK to just upload it without REVUness
<Laney> DD ack is enough
<directhex> especially a DD as sexy as meebey
<RAOF> I was going to give it another once-over, but consider DD's ack as the other advocate, yeah.
<RAOF> GIT IS COMPOSED ENTIRELY OF SHARP EDGES!
<directhex> RAOF, it is?
<RAOF> To be fair, the particular edge I hit then is also sharp in all other VCSs.
<directhex> i have no git-fu :/
<RAOF> Pop quiz: what does 'git diff' in a working tree show? :)
<directhex> a steam train going "choo choo" across the screen?
<directhex> wait, that was 'sl'
<Laney> heh
<Laney> RAOF: Also, do you mind if I do the merge of miro 2?
<Laney> it is the hotness
<RAOF> Laney: Go for it.  Miro is all yours
<Laney> wicked
<jreinhardt> Hi
<Chris`> jreinhardt: Hey
<jreinhardt> I just updated Firefox to 3.0.6+nobinonly-0ubuntu0.8.10.1 and then everything broke
<jreinhardt> especially firefox broke and only shows an empty window
<jreinhardt> anyone else experienced this?
<Laney> did you restart it?
<Laney> also #ubuntu for support
<jreinhardt> no
<jreinhardt> no reboot
<jreinhardt> ok, then I will try to reboot, and if this does not help I will file a bug on launchpad
<jreinhardt> thanks
<Laney> no, not reboot, just restart firefox
<jreinhardt> ah
<jreinhardt> yes I restarted firefox
<jreinhardt> that is when it only showes an empty window
<jreinhardt> I then tried to downgrade to 3.03
<jreinhardt> but that didnt help
#ubuntu-motu 2009-02-12
<postalchris1> Anybody free to look at http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=cvc3 ?
<ScottK> postalchris1: You've got a typo in debian/copyright.  There's an incorrect GPL reference at the end.
<maxb> postalchris1: I haven't managed to do a full re-review, but I still disagree with the weird version clause that I comment on
<maxb> *commented
<maxb> I don't think it accomplishes what it claims to
<postalchris1> maxb: That's is possible
<postalchris1> maxb: I failed to Google the source of the, because "(<< ${binary:Version}.1~)" looks like it has search operators in it, and I don't know how to escape them.
<ScottK> postalchris1: Are you in contact with upstream for this package?
<postalchris1> ScottK: Good catch. Looking up the proper boilerplate now...
<postalchris1> ScottK: Upstream is my academic advisor. So yes.
<ScottK> postalchris1: The license is technically Free by our terms, but I would not recommend this go in the Ubuntu archive with the current license.  Others may have a different view.
<ScottK> The requirement to get permission to modify or rename is technically acceptable, but very difficult to deal with.
<ScottK> Consider what happens if someone discovers a security issue and he is on vacation?
<maxb> The packaging of a CVS snapshot from a CVS repository that is not publically accessible also is.... remarkable
<ScottK> postalchris1: I would ask you to encourage him to use a less restrictive license.
<ScottK> That's another interesting issue.
<ScottK> It's not a legal problem though.
<postalchris1> ScottK: We're working on relicensing, but who knows when it will go through...
<ScottK> With the current license I don't think the package is maintainable.
<postalchris1> maxb: You know what? I'm dumb. We publish daily snapshots at http://www.cs.nyu.edu/~barrett/cvc3-latest/
<ScottK> correction:  With the current license and name it's not maintainable.
<ScottK> postalchris1: Basically if you're Firefox you can, just barely, get away with must have permission to modify without renaming as it's technically DFSG Free, but it's sufficiently onerous that I don't think we want to deal with it.
<postalchris1> ScottK: That makes sense. It's unfortunate. We have the intention to relicense *and* the firm assurance of all parties involved that Clause 3 wouldn't be invoked in the case of routine maintenance.
<ScottK> postalchris1: Could they publish some kind of addendum or exception and add it to the source tree?
<postalchris1> ScottK: Not sure what you mean.
<ScottK> If there was something in the upstream source that said 'normal maintenance is ok', perhaps we could call that good enough.
<postalchris1> ScottK: I'm sure I could swing that. Seems pretty weak, legally, though.
<ScottK> postalchris1: My thought is if that 'firm assurance' could be reduced to writing in the tarball, then maybe it's good enough.
<ScottK> The thing is it's DFSG Free and legal for the archive as it is, just very uncomfortable.
<ScottK> So I'm trying to reduce that uncomfort.
<postalchris1> ScottK: Cool. I'll look into it.
<dholbach> good morning
<iulian> Morning dholbach.
<dholbach> hi iulian
<quadrispro> hi guys
<didrocks> good morning o/
<dholbach> hey di
<dholbach> didrocks :)
<didrocks> Hi dholbach :)
<geser> good morning
<mok0> morning geser
<pochu> would a kde3->kde4 port be considered bugfix or new feature (in terms of FF)?
<pochu> package is minirok
<geser> I'd consider it as both: bugfix and new feature (but I'm not from ~motu-release so you can ignore me :)
<dolanor> I have a question about encoding
<dolanor> I've got a tar.gz with every file in it in iso-8859-15 encoding ... With french accent Ã©Ã¨Ã Ã¢, etc
<dolanor> does it cause a problem ? May I "patch" the source to get everything in utf8 with iconv ?
<liw> it shouldn't cause a problem, but you could still talk upstream into converting to utf8
<dolanor> okay
<dolanor> because i have added some manpages totally in utf8... the fact that some files are in utf8 and others in iso-8859-15 doesn't cause any problem too ?
<liw> as long as your editor can deal with it, it should be fine
<dolanor> liw: btw, is there a utility to give encoding of a text file ?
<geser> try file
<liw> dolanor, not fully reliably; moreutils has isutf8 to see if it is syntactically valid utf8, file makes some guesses, but on the whole, you have to look at the file in various encodings and decide which is most likely
<dolanor> ok
<mok0> I just had to clean up a major mess caused by schroot's use of logical lvm volumes.  Anyone else has experiences with that?
<quadrispro> hi mok0, I've followed your suggestions -> http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/mandvd
<quadrispro> I've uploaded the package now
<mok0> quadrispro: good
<mok0> quadrispro: I need to test-drive my sbuilder after messing with the lvm's, might as well use mandvd as an example
<quadrispro> ok ;)
<mok0> yay it works
<quadrispro> yeah :)
<Laney> mok0: If you want jeuclid in Ubuntu you better upload it yourself - it might not get into Debian in time. (I think it was you that wanted it)
<mok0> Laney: we still have a week :-P
<Laney> hmm
<Laney> I dunno, it's cutting it fine
<mok0> Too close for comfort, huh?
<Laney> but it might start moving after lenny releases
<Laney> up to you
<mok0> k
<ScottK> mok0: I've got the package that's #2 in the Debian New queue among the packages not obviously on long term hold and it's been there for at least a couple of weeks.  With a release is two days, I seriously doubt New is going to be on ftp-masters TODO before our FF.
<mok0> ScottK, you're probably right
<mok0> I'll take a look at jeuclid then. Laney, have you tried building it?
<ScottK> Worst case is there's an additional sync, which is not a big deal.
<Laney> mok0: No, I'm not interested in it. I just thought you were so I let you know
<mok0> ScottK, can we ask the archive admins to sync from the NEW queue?
<Laney> no, it's opaque
<ScottK> No.  New isn't publically accessible.
<Laney> You can't get at the files
<mok0> Huh?
<ScottK> Their theory is they don't know if it's distributable until after it's reviewed.
<ScottK> So they want to make sure it isn't being distributed.
<mok0> d'Oh
<mok0> uhm, I seem to remember it was in a ppa somewhere
<Laney> It's maintained by debian science team, so they probably have it in svn
<ScottK> Generally one can fish the packaging out of a VCS somewhere or worst case mail the maintainer and construct and equivalent package.
<ScottK> mok0 probably even knows where that one is.
<mok0> So, I should probably send it to revu
<ScottK> ;-)
<mok0> Yes I think so
<ScottK> If you upload it in your name it's not strictly required.
<ScottK> Last I checked anyway ....
<Laney> mok0: Do your own review, and take the DD uploading as the other one
<slytherin> Koon: did you pickup libjcip-annotations-java directly frmo new queue?
<Laney> unless you want to seek further input
<mok0> Laney: It's java right?
<mok0> I don't know much about java
<Laney> yeah
<directhex> Laney, RAOF went into hiding without sorting sublib :(
<Laney> psh
<Laney> wait until tomorrow (hopefully)
<Laney> or else sebner should be around
<quadrispro> mok0: if you would see the buildlog -> http://home.alessiotreglia.com/jaunty/result/mandvd_2.5-4-0ubuntu1/mandvd_2.5-4-0ubuntu1.buildlog
<mok0> quadrispro: thx
<mok0> quadrispro: you should document in debian/changelog that you have authored a manpage
<mok0> I know there's some confusion about this so I write it here
<quadrispro> mok0: ah ok, I'm workin on it now
<mok0> Also .desktop file
<mok0> Anything that is user visible in the package, that you add, should be documented in debian/changelog
<quadrispro> ok
<quadrispro> so, manpage and .desktop files...
<quadrispro> ok
<mok0> quadrispro: :-) yes
<mok0> I am rehashing it in the channel in the hope that the misunderstanding can go away
<mok0> It'a policy Â§4.4
<quadrispro> mok0: upstream provides a .desktop file, but it needs to be fixed. What solution could be better? Add a new .desktop or fix that shipped with the original tarball?
<mok0> quadrispro: err, well, since there's no patch system used in the package, it's perhaps a bit much just to fix a .desktop entry
<mok0> quadrispro: When the new source package format comes into use, there's an implicit patch system, that will help a lot
<quadrispro> mok0: yeah, I think it's not good introduce a patch system only for a .desktop file, then I will fix mandvd.desktop
<mok0> quadrispro: ok, perhaps send the corrected file upstream
<quadrispro> of course
<mok0> ScottK, I'll make you a sweet deal: if you review some of my advocated packages in revu, I'll review/upload the plasma_widget ones B-)
 * ScottK looks
<mok0> ScottK, there are two libraries that have dependents stuck in the pipeline
<ScottK> mok0: OK, but it may be Saturday before I have time.
<mok0> ScottK, NP
<mok0> Has anyone looked at my mock-up revu site?
<quadrispro> mok0: new package uploaded to REVU
<mok0> quadrispro: super
<quadrispro> :)
<quadrispro> mok0: don't hate me :) http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/nfoview
 * mok0 is confused... is it REVU day :-P
<ScottK> Should start in about 6 minutes, right?
<mok0> Heh
<mok0> yes
<quadrispro> mok0: that package is very simple, and I think it's ready really
<quadrispro> :)
 * mok0 is looking
<mok0> Hm, never heard of nfo format before now
<mok0> quadrispro: tsk tsk not lintian clean
 * quadrispro nooooo
<quadrispro> it's true :(
<mok0> heh
<quadrispro> working on it
<mok0> don't upload yet there might be more
<quadrispro> mok0: all the fans of emule/bittorent services know well .NFO files :)
<quadrispro> mok0: ok
<mok0> Ah, perhaps my son knows about it
<quadrispro> maybe :)
<quadrispro> mok0: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.nfo
<mok0> quadrispro: I'm gonna use that for my next personal homepage :-)
<mok0> quadrispro: the "retro" look
<quadrispro> yeah, it's very "cool" :D
 * mok0 wonders why the .desktop "Encoding" statement is deprecated...
<mok0> Seems rather sensible /me thinks
<mok0> quadrispro: for you next package, use this:  http://wiki.debian.org/Proposals/CopyrightFormat
<quadrispro> ah good
<mok0> quadrispro:  Take a look at http://packages.debian.org/changelogs/pool/main/g/git-cola/current/copyright for an example.
<quadrispro> mok0: I could try to apply now that format
<quadrispro> * template
<mok0> quadrispro: just curious, why didn't you choose a cdbs rules file?
<mok0> quadrispro: great
<quadrispro> mok0: mmm I don't know why, I prefer to use setup.py...
<mok0> quadrispro: so does cdbs
<quadrispro> in fact
<quadrispro> ok, i'll use cdbs and apply that template :)
<mok0> quadrispro: http://pastebin.com/f64a2d3ca
<quadrispro> ok
<mok0> quadrispro: ... and you don't need to tussle with reviewers about debian/rules :-)
<quadrispro> lol :)
<quadrispro> ok
<mok0> quadrispro: your rules file was fine though, no problems
<quadrispro> mok0: http://paste.ubuntu.com/117226/
<mok0> quadrispro: yes, but remember the format is like debian/control. You need " ." to specify a line-break
<mok0> quadrispro: (at lines 13 and 18)
<mok0> quadrispro: that makes it RFC822 format, and it can be read by the standard tools
<quadrispro> ah ok
<mok0> quadrispro: so, perhaps someone will write a nice "copyright-viewer"
<quadrispro> mok0: http://paste.ubuntu.com/117228/
<mok0> quadrispro: TBH, I am unsure if it is correct
<mok0> quadrispro: AFAIC, the text will only be wrapped correctly if it starts in column 2
<quadrispro> you're right
<mok0> quadrispro: ... and if it is indented 2 spaces or more, it will not be wrapped
<mok0> I am?
<mok0> :)
<quadrispro> eh
<quadrispro> :D
<quadrispro> I'm doing a lot things at the same time
<mok0> OK, I am going to lunch, see you later
<quadrispro> ;) bye
<Koon> slytherin: I had to merge it to fix a default-jdk/gcj mismatch. It's published now. libjboss-cache2-java can now build too.
<quadrispro> mok0: I've uploaded nfoview to REVU, I didn't change copyright/rules because a lot of lintian warnings
<quadrispro> see you later, I'm going to lunch
<slytherin> Koon: I had seen that problem. I was planning to log bug in Debian.
<Koon> slytherin: I'll push it back there. Though I'm not sure they are affected by it
<slytherin> Koon: They are not. But the problem in my opinion is that when you specify default-jdk as build dep you should use default-java as java_home
<Koon> slytherin: definitely.
<Koon> note that for libhibernate3-java I'll fix it the other way around. Doesn't build with openJDK so it requires gcj ;)
<Koon> slytherin: bug 328391 if you want to follow that story
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 328391 in libhibernate3-java "Please merge libhibernate3-java 3.3.1.GA+dak1-3 (universe) from Debian unstable" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/328391
<slytherin> Koon: right.
<Koon> i'll push that one as soon as libjboss-cache2-java clears binary NEW
<slytherin> Koon: meanwhile if you are not too busy, can you please file movetouniverse bugs for remaining jboss/hibernate related packages?
<Koon> slytherin: will do if I can enjoy some free time. Unfortunately it's been 10 days that I rush, not sure I can do that before FF
<slytherin> Koon: Ok. If you don't do it by weekend I will take care of it.
<geser> slytherin, Koon: for moving libhibernate3-java to universe see also my last comment in bug 252318
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 252318 in ehcache "Please move to multiverse" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/252318
<geser> (yes, the bug should be retitled)
<slytherin> geser: and also we should add 'also affects' for oscache, libhibernate3-java
<Koon> geser: interesting. I missed that. Thx !
<dolanor> I've reuploaded new version of hexdiff, a tool to visualize the hexadecimal differences between 2 files (http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=hexdiff). If it could get some REVU before the 19th :p
<mok0> quadrispro: lazy huh? ;-)
<mok0> quadrispro: I don't like the way you are fixing the .desktop entry
<quadrispro> mok0: I've uploaded new version (using cdbs)
<mok0> quadrispro: you need to put some dependencies in control, did you do that?
<quadrispro> http://home.alessiotreglia.com/jaunty/result/nfoview_1.2.1-0ubuntu1/
<quadrispro> mmm
<quadrispro> it needs python-gtk2 and python-glade2
<mok0> binary-install/nfoview::
<mok0> 	dh_desktop -pnfoview
<mok0> quadrispro: huh?
<mok0> you need to depend on cdbs and python
<quadrispro> mok0: eh, the package build-depends on cdbs and python...
<quadrispro> mok0: dh_desktop is necessary, otherwise it doesn't update the MIME cache
<mok0> quadrispro: right, so you can add a rule binary-install/nfoview:: that calls it
<mok0> quadrispro: http://pastebin.com/f7e14efad
<quadrispro> done
<quadrispro> dputting to revu
<mok0> quadrispro: and in copyright, after the GPL license text, add the following:
<mok0> X-Comment: On Debian GNU/Linux systems, the complete text of the GNU
<mok0>  General Public License can be found in /usr/share/common-licenses/GPL-3
<mok0> oops
<mok0> 2 lines
<quadrispro> there's "On Debian systems, the complete text of the GNU General\nPublic License can be found in `/usr/share/common-licenses/GPL-3'.
<quadrispro> isn't it right?
<mok0> yes. there is?
<quadrispro> yes
<quadrispro> mok0: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/revu1-incoming/nfoview-0902121433/nfoview-1.2.1/debian/rules
<quadrispro> and http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/revu1-incoming/nfoview-0902121433/nfoview-1.2.1/debian/copyright
<mok0> quadrispro: I was talking about the other copyright file you made
<quadrispro> ah ok ok
<mok0> http://pastebin.com/f3b4f627
<quadrispro> mok0: but I've tried to make the copyright file according with that new template, but lintian gaves me a lot of warnings :(
<mok0> quadrispro:  ^
<quadrispro> gave *
<mok0> quadrispro: I just tried building with the above file, it gives no warnings
<quadrispro> oh ok :) thanks
<mok0> quadrispro: I was wondering about your message before lunch
<mok0> quadrispro: so I tried it
<soren> quadrispro: The call to dh_desktop is there automatically if you include the gnome cdbs class.
<quadrispro> ah good
<mok0> soren: yeah but we're not building a gnome app, so why add the builddepens?
<soren> Ah, sorry, I thought it was a gnome-ish thing. What's it for, then?
<mok0> s/ns/nds
<mok0> soren: just a python program
<mok0> soren: with a python-gtk2 gui
<soren> mok0: the gnome class is in cdbs itself.
<mok0> soren: ah, ok
<mok0> :)
<mok0> soren: I stand corrected and humble
<soren> :)
<quadrispro> I've started to build with calling gnome class
<quadrispro> mok0: uploading to REVU again
<quadrispro> mok0: done
<quadrispro> soren: thanks!
<soren> sure
<mok0> quadrispro: is it there already?
<quadrispro> eh, no
<quadrispro> mok0: REVU's showing it
<mok0> quadrispro: k
<mok0> quadrispro: FAILED [dpkg-buildpackage died]
<quadrispro> =-O
<quadrispro> http://home.alessiotreglia.com/jaunty/result/nfoview_1.2.1-0ubuntu1/nfoview_1.2.1-0ubuntu1.buildlog
<mok0> quadrispro: can't explain that, but the gnome think pulls in some autoconf checks that I think you don't want
<mok0> s/think/thing
<mok0> quadrispro: let me go back to your penultimate upload
<quadrispro> ok
<quadrispro> sure
<mok0> quadrispro: your upload from 12 Feb 2009 14:39 builds perfectly
<quadrispro> mok0: ok, is it necessary anohter upload?
<mok0> quadrispro: unfortunately, yes
<mok0> quadrispro: you should not have listened to soren ;-)
<quadrispro> preparing another upload.... uff! :)
<soren> mok0: build log?
<quadrispro> soren: http://home.alessiotreglia.com/jaunty/result/nfoview_1.2.1-0ubuntu1/nfoview_1.2.1-0ubuntu1.buildlog
<mok0> soren: I can pastebin some of it
<soren> ...from the failed build.
<quadrispro> ah sorry :D
<mok0> soren http://pastebin.com/f729544d
<mok0> soren: it wants to do some autotools fun
<soren> where's the configure script?
<mok0> soren: there isn't any
<soren> Ah.
<mok0> soren: It probably assumes there is one because it thinks its a gnome project
<mok0> soren: in any case, the extra binary-install:: rule works perfectly :-)
<soren> Right.
<mok0> In fact the dh_desktop thing is the subject of a flamewar on a bug in BTS
<mok0> 439717
<mok0> ubottu, can you please give me a BTS link?
<ubottu> Error: I am only a bot, please don't think I'm intelligent :)
<mok0> ubottu: oh, I forgot
<ubottu> Sorry, I don't know anything about oh, I forgot
<quadrispro> mok0: uploaded
<mok0> quadrispro: +1
<quadrispro> thank you mok0
<dolanor> I've reuploaded new version of hexdiff, a tool to visualize the hexadecimal differences between 2 files (http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=hexdiff). If it could get some REVU before the 19th :p
<mok0> quadrispro: now go fix some bugs
<quadrispro> yes :D
<mok0> No more new package from you  ;-)
<quadrispro> ok ok. I will work hard only on bugufixes :)
<mok0> hehe
<mok0> dolanor: I'll give it to you straight: there is no COPYING file giving us the permission to distribute the source tree. Without it, we can't distribute :-(
<mok0> dolanor: :'( rather
<mok0> dolanor: can you contact upstream?
<dolanor> mok0: i'm in direct contact with him ^^
<mok0> dolanor: cool
<dolanor> mok0: I'll do the patch myself and give it to him
<mok0> dolanor: errrr, ok, but you can't patch a license file into Ubunut
<mok0> Ubuntu
<dolanor> mok0: He hasn't time to reupload the new version, but when I'll harrass him to upload the new version on his site, I think he can take time for this :)
<mok0> dolanor: good
<dolanor> no no, I take the orig.tar.gz, increment the version, add a COPYING, and base my ubuntu package on it :)
<dolanor> and mail the new tar.gz to upstream
<dolanor> I always ask him first
<mok0> dolanor: sounds reasonable :-)
<dolanor> so a COPYING file is missing in the root oif the archive ?
<dolanor> is there any COPYING sample for a really simple source package ? :)
<mok0> dolanor: if you look in the file fileinfo.c, there's a URL to the license text
<mok0>  http://sam.zoy.org/projects/COPYING.WTFPL
<mok0> dolanor: ... so you need to change debian/copyright accordingly
<mok0> I guess WTFPL is DFSG compliant
<mok0> Hi RainCT, how did your exam go?
<dolanor> mok0: do I put COPYING into the debian/doc ?
<mok0> dolanor: no, it will be installed automatically when dh_installdocs is called
<dolanor> ok
<mok0> dolanor: as long as it's called COPYING
<dolanor> mok0: and, for the debian/copyright, Do i have to put that the packaging is under GPL ?
<pmjdebruijn> probably yes
<mok0> dolanor: it's up to you
<mok0> dolanor: either that or the same license as the software
<dolanor> mok0: So I must precise it in the copyright : upstream is wtfpl and packaging is gpl ?
<dolanor> with copy of each license in it
<mok0> dolanor: yes, if you use the new copyright format, you just need a section for Files: debian/* with your license details
<bddebian> Heya gang
<dolanor> mok0: didn't find the new copyright format, do you have any links ?
<mok0> !copyright
<ubottu> Sorry, I don't know anything about copyright
<mok0> http://wiki.debian.org/Proposals/CopyrightFormat
<dolanor> thank you, modifying the stuff :) I didn't see your remarks on revu :o
<mok0> dolanor: ah :-)
<mok0> dolanor: I always put them there even when doing IRC reviews
<slytherin> slomo: is there any plan to sync/merge libdvdread/libdvdnav from Debian experimental?
<mok0> dolanor: you don't have fixes for all of my comments
<slytherin> does anyone know what speeds up the boot time, is it building most of the things as modules or building everything 'build-in'?
<mok0> slytherin: I don't think it makes a lot of difference
<mok0> slytherin: most of the boot time is starting services
<mok0> slytherin: ... and the fact they are started serially
<slytherin> mok0: I have built a custom kernel. And now I plan to tweak it to remove unnecessary parts.
<mok0> slytherin: I've tried that several times. Never could get it to work right :-P
<mok0> slytherin: now I just use ubuntus generic kernel
<slytherin> mok0: what problems did you face?
<mok0> slytherin: ah, can't remember, it was several years ago
<mok0> slytherin: kernel panic was one of them
<superm1> jdong, siretart wgrant_ can one of you merge  lp:~andreas-wenning/vlc/ubuntu into ~motumedia/vlc/ubuntu?  I was going to upload andreas merge (builds fine and solves the bug), but then i realized i cant merge into ~motumedia (What's that team for, shouldn't ubuntu-dev own it?)
<geser> slytherin: last time I did my own kernels (all needed modules built-in), I had to either still use an initramfs (because of the UUIDs) or use the /dev/sdXY in the grub menu
<slytherin> geser: I have just started to play with it, so can't really say I understand all the things involved. Anyway, will do the experimenting at home now.
<superm1> dtchen, too about vlc^
<geser> slytherin: I used to build my own kernels in the past. The only real benefit was a smaller kernel deb. And you need keep track of kernel updates yourself.
<dolanor> mok0: I'm not sure about which keys to press to get a minus instead of hyphen ...
<mok0> dolanor: just press - on your keyboard, but prefix it with backslash in the file, like so: \-v
<mok0> dolanor: it's because in nroff, - means hyphen and \- means minus
<mok0> dolanor: when typeset on the screen, you can't tell the difference, but when rendered for a printing device, you can
<dolanor> mok0: ok, thanks :)
<henrik-hw0> does feature-freeze apply to packages in the advocation queue?
<ScottK> It has to be uploaded to Ubuntu by Feature Freeze.
<mok0> Where can I find the script that does the merging on DaD?
<dolanor> mok0: the Copyright review seems very cool :) I hope it will facilitate the revuing :)
<iulian> mok0: http://dad.dunnewind.net/grab-merge.sh?
<mok0> iulian: errhm not that, the script that generates what grab-merge fetches
<Laney> mok0: launchpad.net/dad
<iulian> Ah
<mok0> Laney: hah, but of course! Thanks!
 * mok0 kicks self
<Laney> looks like a massive bash script
 * Laney dies /o\
<chrismurf> Would a MOTU mind reviewing http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/pyproj?  It's a python wrapper for PROJ.4 (a map projections library).  I've already corrected some initial problems found by fabrice_sp__.
<siretart> superm1: you're right, that branch should probably be in ~ubuntu-dev. feel free to push the merge there!
<mok0> chrismurf: pyproj reviewed...
<chrismurf> mok0, thank you
<mok0> chrismurf: you're welcome :-)
<chrismurf> the debian/watch I basically copied
<chrismurf> Is there actual documentation on that someplace?
<chrismurf> a manpage or anything?
<mok0> chrismurf: intersting...
<chrismurf> google is frustratingly useless
<mok0> man uscan
<chrismurf> ah - thank you
<mok0> chrismurf: oh, yes, google for watch :-)
<chrismurf> ah!  wonderful
<mok0> chrismurf: the man page has bad practice in the examples, though
<chrismurf> lol - fantastic
<mok0> chrismurf: it mentions (.*) which can give problems
<chrismurf> ok
<mok0> chrismurf: it's better to do what you are doing
<mok0> chrismurf: then you make sure it is fetching a revision number like 1.2.3
<chrismurf> makes sense
<mok0> chrismurf: anyway I'll keep an eye on pyproj and +1 it
<chrismurf> thanks - making those changes now
<chrismurf> one more random question -- how do I setup gpg/debuild to use the correct signing key by default?  I have to specify -k* each time
<chrismurf> mok0, you suggest replacing pyversions with XS-Python-Version, but python-distutils says that XS-Python-Version is deprecated and suggests doing the opposite?
<mok0> chrismurf: you have a url for that?
<chrismurf> well, it throws a warning on compile
<chrismurf> and reading : http://wiki.debian.org/DebianPython/NewPolicy
<chrismurf> "For that you should create debian/pyversions" under Using python-support
<chrismurf> might be something they've gone back and forth on
<mok0> I can't see that in the debianpython document?
<mok0> The addition of the XS-Python-Version/XB-Python-Version fields is required.
<chrismurf> #3 under "Using python-support"
<mok0> The addition of the XS-Python-Version/XB-Python-Version fields is appreciated.
<DktrKranz> chrismurf: to avoid -k, edit /etc/devscripts.conf,  DEBSIGN_KEYID
<mok0> appreciated?
<chrismurf> DktrKranz, thanks
<chrismurf> mok0, interesting
<chrismurf> and confusing
<mok0> chrismurf: appreciated != deprecated
<chrismurf> in the top section, under "Using python-support"
<chrismurf> not the notes for packaging with private modules
<chrismurf> I see where you're pulling from further down too though
<chrismurf> which is confusing
<DktrKranz> chrismurf: you're welcome
<chrismurf> but then when I compile, python-distutils issues the following: http://pastebin.ca/1334955
 * mok0 looks
<mok0> pysupport... hm
<mok0> chrismurf: pysupport is deprecated :-)
<chrismurf> haha - I thought pysupport >> pycentral, n'est pas?
<jcfp> chrismurf: iirc, python-support uses debian/pyversions, and if that's missing falls back to XS-...; that other python helper uses only the XS-Python-Version thing.
<chrismurf> jcfp, thanks - good to know
<mok0> jcfp: yes that's right
<chrismurf> is pycentral a better way to go for the future/
<mok0> chrismurf: I've heard people say so
<chrismurf> fair enough - I'll bear that in mind next time
<chrismurf> for now -- include both and ignore the warning?  Include just one?
<mok0> chrismurf: but both work and are supported
<mok0> chrismurf: hm, it seems what you've done is legal for pysupport...
<chrismurf> fair enough - thanks for the education though
<mok0> chrismurf: I like it better when you can see stuff like that in debian/control, instead of having to browser any number of files to get that info
<dolanor> mok0: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/hexdiff
<chrismurf> mok0 That makes sense; should I just do both?  Having the info in two places doesn't seem great either
<dolanor> I think it may be good
<mok0> chrismurf: no it will get out of sync
<dolanor> My lintian is oldish ... I'm developing from my server on 8/04
<dolanor> 8.04
<mok0> dolanor: don't worry, my lintian is brand new :-)
<chrismurf> mok0, alright- I'll probably leave it as is then, and chock that up as a -1 for pysupport
<mok0> chrismurf: alright
<mok0> dolanor: "changed the watch file to work" :-)
<RainCT> (lintian on REVU is also the latest version)
<mok0> RainCT: yes, but unfortunately it only checks the source package
<ScottK> dolanor: Newer lintian (along with other updated tools) can be found in hardy-backports if you haven't checked.
<dolanor> ScottK: ok, but I think i'll use the base.tar.gz from pbuilder and chroot into it. I don't wanna backports version on my public server ;)
<chrismurf> mok0, updated
<dolanor> mok0: yes, because, right now, only a hexdiff.tar.gz exists. but upstream will upload my new version with hexdiff-x.y.z.tar.gz
<ScottK> dolanor: Just selectively update from -backports, don't accept everything.
<mok0> Hm, I wonder if there's a policy against foul language in licenses....
<mok0> dolanor: wrt to the new copyright format, it is exactly the same as for debian/control. The long passage of the licenses should be indented 1 space, and with ' .' representing empty lines
<dolanor> ScottK: I have to use pin in apt, no ? Or do you have a command-line to safe-upgrade without using backports?
<mok0> dolanor: just download the lintian .deb and install it
<dolanor> okay
<ScottK> That'll work.
<ScottK> More generally, I add the repo to sources.list, apt-get update. apt-get upgrade (but say no when asked to confirm) and then pick the list of packages I want, apt-get install the list, then then comment it out in sources.list.
<ScottK> For just lintian, grab the .deb as mok0 says.
<mok0> ScottK, that kind of defeats the whole purpose of apt, don't you think?
<ScottK> Yep.
<ScottK> mok0: Hopefully we have a change for Jaunty that'll make it safe to leave enabled.
<mok0> Hm, I haven't met any problems with backports yet
<ScottK> I haven't in some time.
<ScottK> I find on servers it's quite safe as I'm generally the only one approving serverish backports and I'm careful.
<ScottK> We went through a period where some archive admins felt they could just backport at will without going through the backports team and some stuff did get broken.
<dolanor> mok0: updated :)
<mok0> dolanor: ah, but I have more comments :-)
<dolanor> damn, missed them ^^
<dolanor> I 'll look at it
<mok0> dolanor: still working on them
<dolanor> mok0: ok, then i'll come back home :)
<mok0> dolanor: ok comments are there, take a look
<genii> Hi. Trying to compile arora (webkit/qt based web browser. debian/control states maintainer is ubuntu-motu. Getting this error: http://paste.ubuntu.com/117356/
<slomo> slytherin: no idea
<slytherin> genii: how are you compiling the package?
<genii> slytherin: The git pull provides a builddeb.sh file, contents of which are this: http://paste.ubuntu.com/117359/
<ScottK> genii: That just means you tried to sign the package.  If you need to sign the package use -k to tell it what key to use, if not, use -us -uc so stuff doesn't get signed.
<ScottK> genii: Then you aren't trying to compile something that we are the maintainer of.
<ScottK> Nothing maintained by this group is on github.
<genii> ScottK: dpkg-buildpackage -D -b -uc -us         seems to be the flags
<genii> Sorry, slytherin ^
<ScottK> Yes.
<genii> ScottK: Interesting. I wonder why the control file lists here as maintainers.
<ScottK> That's what you would want, but really you should ask someone on github for help if that's where it's coming from.
<ScottK> genii: Probably someone took an Ubuntu package, put it on github, and modified it.
<ScottK> We can't control that, but it's really nothing to do with us.
<genii> ScottK: Do you know if there is a freenode github channel? I'll go bother them there if so :)
<ScottK> No idea.  Sorry.
<genii> OK, thanks
<ScottK> genii: Why not try with the actual Ubuntu package?
<slytherin> does anyone have any idea what is this file urlclassifier3.sqlite in firefox profile?
<ScottK> slytherin: I'd suggest #ubuntu-mozillateam.
<genii> ScottK: There seems no package for it yet that I can find
<ScottK> genii: What package?
<genii> ScottK: arora ...it's a qt based web browser. http://arora-browser.org/ is the homepage if more info is needed
<ScottK> Right, you said that.
<ScottK> genii: Exists in Intrepid and Jaunty: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/arora
<ScottK> genii: If you are interested in getting it on Hardy, we have a backports process.
<ScottK> !backports > genii
<ubottu> genii, please see my private message
<genii> ScottK: Ah, OK, explains why this 8.04 box can't find it :) . I'll try build from 8.10 sources or so
<genii> ScottK: Thanks again.
<surfaz> Anybody could look this?
<surfaz> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/amule/+bug/328321
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 328321 in amule "amule_2.2.3-1ubuntu1 that fixes (LP: #214100) and (LP: #89672) bugs" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<Vest84> Hello guys. would a MOTU be so kind as to review my project? http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=gnome-quod m? please...
 * mok0 looks
<Vest84> o-o-o... thanks in forward
<dolanor> back
<dolanor> mok0: I think i've corrected every things you've commented. To correct the lintian, I preferred correcting in the upstream version and create a new upstream version ;)
<dolanor> http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/hexdiff
<mok0> dolanor: ah ok, well I guess you are upstreams proxy
<mok0> dolanor: will take a look later
<mok0> Q: What is the best thing about reviewing?
<mok0> A: You get to type "less rules" a lot of times :-P
<tgm4883> Come one, come all, step right up and Revu http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/mythnettv
<mok0> tgm4883: what is it?
<tgm4883> it's a program for mythtv that downloads online shows from places like revision 3 and puts them in your recording list
<mok0> tgm4883: you in contact with anyone from Ubuntu Studio?
<tgm4883> no
<tgm4883> should I be?
<tgm4883> This is more of a mythbuntu type app
<mok0> tgm4883: or mythbuntu... they might be interested in an app like that
<tgm4883> ah yea, i'm a mythbuntu dev.
<mok0> tgm4883: I can review the packaging
<tgm4883> superm1 was suppose to revu this a few days ago, but we overwork him ;)
<mok0> tgm4883: ah ok
<mok0> heh
<tgm4883> i've corrected all the lintian warnings, you may want to take a look at the debian/watch file as I wasn't entirely sure how to handle that but believe it to be ok
<mok0> tgm4883: ok wil ldo
<superm1> tgm4883, yeah yeah.  okay how about now i've finally got all the other stuff in order for mythbuntu-default-settings, xfce, mplayer, mythtv, transcode, libmjpegtools, the seeds and ubiquity i think i will finally have time to look at that revu
<tgm4883> yay :)
<superm1> tgm4883, yesterday was a long night trying to track down the fixes for all that other stuff....
<mok0> superm1: wait a sec I am revuing it atm
<superm1> mok0, okay, i love being revu'er #2 anyway, so much easier :)
<tgm4883> superm1, well if you think tracking down bugs is more important than revuing this I suppose that is ok
<mok0> superm1: heh, well there are lots of other packages you can amuse yourself with :-)
<tgm4883> I also have mythnettv-gui which is the gui frontend for that app, if you guys want to revu the packaging for that too
<tgm4883> http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/mythnettv-gui
<tgm4883> but no rush, there is always tomarrow too ;)
<Vest84> mok0: thank you for your review... I'm going to work on it :)
<mok0> Vest84: cool
<mok0> tgm4883: you have a bunch of myth* packages sitting in the "needs-work" section...
<tgm4883> ah yes, hopefully I will be tackling those shortly
<tgm4883> its all the mythstream ones right?
<mok0> tgm4883: yep
<directhex> RAOF hasn't crawled out of bed yet has he? seems not
<mok0> ScottK, how is it possible to get mail when a package is uploaded to the archive
<mok0> ?
<ScottK> mok0: About what?
<ScottK> ENOCONTEXT
<mok0> When a new package enters the archive
<ScottK> You mean any package?
<mok0> Yes, a package from revu
<ScottK> You could probably scrape that from -changes.
<mok0> ScottK, I want to explore your idea of automatically archiving packages
<ScottK> You'd need to just look for ones that claimed they were New.
<mok0> ScottK, ok, I just need to get the info stream somewhere
<ScottK> Subcribe to either jaunty-changes or the ubuntu-nl RSS feed.
<mok0> ScottK, ah there's a feed, I was hoping that
<jreinhardt> Hi. I packaged a tex package, and lintian tells me:
<jreinhardt> E: pgfplots source: missing-build-dependency-for-dh_-command dh_installtex=tex-common
<jreinhardt> But tex common is in the Depends list:
<jreinhardt> Depends: ${shlibs:Depends}, ${misc:Depends}, pgf (>=2.00), tex-common
<jreinhardt> And the package is building fine in pbuilder.
<jreinhardt> What shall I do?
<directhex> built-depends != depends
<directhex> dh_ commands are run at build time, i.e. build-depends
<jreinhardt> ok
<jreinhardt> thank you
<chrismurf> mok0, you there?
<superm1> ScottK, can you take a look at something on the sponsorship queue?  i was helping clean up some of the arts transition and there is a kde bit in there i don't want to upload without someone in that pod agreeing: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/21903091/basket_1.0.2-5ubuntu1.debdiff
<superm1> (bug 320915)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 320915 in libsdl "Remove aRts from the archive - rebuild all dependencies" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/320915
<ScottK> superm1: Since it's awen's debdiff, you can be confident in the KDE stuff.
<ScottK> It looks correct to me too.
<superm1> ScottK, okay i'll sponsor after i verify it builds then
<ScottK> Great.  Thanks.
<DktrKranz> RAOF, do you plan to upgrade gnome-do{,-plugins} for gnome-sharp2 transition (bug #314516)?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 314516 in tomboy "gnome-sharp2 transition" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/314516
<RAOF> DktrKranz: Yes, but I was planning to fix that by uploading 0.8
<RAOF> Which is pretty much ready.  I should probably claim that bug.
<DktrKranz> RAOF, really a good news! I look forward to see new 0.8 :)
<chrismurf> I asked a question on debian-mentors about packaging, and they're now trying to convince me to work with the DPMT to start with because then the package will get "pulled in" to ubuntu anyway.  I have no interest in politics or flames, but can somebody explain to a complete packaging newbie why that's a reasonable or bad idea?
<chrismurf> I'm just trying to get a first package accepted, and growing confused
<Laney> why did you ask on debian-mentors if you don't want it in Debian?
<chrismurf> because debian-mentors is advertised as a place to ask questions about packaging
<chrismurf> this (to my knowledge) is not
<Laney> it is
<chrismurf> I was attempting to stay on-topic
<chrismurf> rather than bombard with questions about dh_install
<RAOF> To be fair to debian-mentors, we'd like you to contribute to Debian, too :)
<chrismurf> I'd love to
<Laney> and to answer your question, we automatically get all new packages in sid at the beginning of every release cycle
<chrismurf> I'd love to contribute to both
<Laney> so getting it into Debian helps more people
<chrismurf> but for now, I'm having a hard enough time contributing to one ;-)
<Laney> and you're likely to get more specialist help in their python team
<chrismurf> (nothing against MOTU/Ubuntu, just learning packaging)
<Laney> contributing to Debian is contributing to Ubuntu
<directhex> contributing to debian is contributing to freedom and world peace!
<chrismurf> haha
<Laney> also that <3
<RAOF> You might find #ubuntu-motu a bit more welcoming than debian-mentors; feel free to ask packaging questions here.
<chrismurf> okay - mok0 suggested I split out some data from http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/pyproj into a new package
<pochu> chrismurf: you can ask Python packaging questions in #debian-python on OFTC
<Laney> chrismurf: tbh, if you want it in Debian then you'd be best getting reviews for them
<directhex> chrismurf, one source package can produce many, even hundreds, of binary packages
<chrismurf> It's about 150kB of data once compressed, which doesn't seem like a big deal, but regardless I can't figure out how to do it while using python-support
<chrismurf> yeah - the guy in debian-mentors is suggesting I go there
<pochu> but I don't think asking on debian-mentors is okay if you're not targetting Debian
<Laney> from*
<chrismurf> so maybe targetting debian-python is the way to go?
<chrismurf> they've been friendly so far :-)
<pochu> that would be like asking MOTUs to review something on REVU that is for a private repository or some downstream
<pochu> chrismurf: that's good, yes
<pochu> chrismurf: I maintain several packages there that are in Ubuntu too
<pochu> several people here do
 * Laney cuddles Debian
<directhex> i do!
<pochu> directhex: liar!
<chrismurf> so - there's not really any reason to contribute a python module direct to ubuntu then?  Isn't it always better to just go to debian and let it get sucked down?
<pochu> directhex: (liar as in you don't in DPMT ;))
<chrismurf> I realize that sounds flameish- I'm just confused
<directhex> pochu, it's troo! i'm not officially a DD or DM or core-dev or MOTU, i'm merely a shadowy puppeteer
<pochu> directhex: but you don't maintain Python modules... do you? :)
<directhex> pochu, and i don't touch python nonsense. well, ironpython...
<pochu> heh
<directhex> ooh, i should package ironclad
<RAOF> chrismurf: You can do both; maintaining a package in Ubuntu and Debian simultaneously works fine, and sometimes you'll need Ubuntu-specific patches.
<directhex> which in theory allows ironpython to use cpython libraries
<pochu> chrismurf: it's your choice, but maintaining it in Debian is a reasonable option
 * pochu heads to bed, 'night everyone
 * chrismurf is so confused
<chrismurf> gnight pochu
<RAOF> chrismurf: You can choose either, or both.  Maintianing it only in Debian is fine, and will benefit Ubuntu.  Maintaning it in Ubuntu is also OK, but it would be better to push to Debian as well.  Maintaining it primarily for Ubuntu, but pushing it up to Debian, is what I do for much of my stuff.
<chrismurf> okay - that makes sense.  What's the timelag?  Should I pursue both in order to try and make jaunty?
<chrismurf> or will that just make for headaches later?
<RAOF> Jaunty's feature-freeze in in a couple of days; it makes sense to push for that first.
<directhex> jaunty you'll need to hurry hurry
<RAOF> Once it's in Jaunty, you can push to Debian.
<RAOF> Then for jaunty+1 you can just sync from the Debian package, and maintain it primarily there.  You get free Ubuntu updates until Debian Import Freeze, after which you file manual sync bugs.
<mrooney> Where can I examine the Jaunty upload queue?
<StevenK> In Launchpad
<StevenK> http://launchpad.net/ubuntu/jaunty/+queue
<mrooney> StevenK: thanks!
<mrooney> there is so much to learn, apparently my package has been automatically split up into an i86 translations tar.gz as well?
#ubuntu-motu 2009-02-13
<mok0> mrooney: don't worry about it
<mrooney> mok0: ahh I see, those are the individual debs for each arch?
<mok0> mrooney: yes, they need to be approved too
<mrooney> I see, how glorious
<mrooney> I should start checking out other needs-packaging requests when I have time
<mrooney> is that a good place to start MOTU contributions?
<mok0> mrooney: yes packaging from scratch is good, but so is doing bug-work
<mok0> mrooney: the current trend is to move focus away from packaging-new-packages to maintaining what we have
<mok0> mrooney: merges, syncs...
<mrooney> ahh okay, I guess I should learn about harvest more, that would help in finding bugs and patches and such?
<mok0> mrooney: getting -0ubuntu* packages into Debian
<mrooney> yeah also that, is there a guide for getting an ubuntu package into Debian? I haven't been able to find one on my own
<mok0> mrooney: yes that should be an important part of your application
<mok0> mrooney: you should maintain a MOTU diary so you can keep track of what you've done
<mrooney> ahh okay, I guess I can blog and tag them with 'motu'
<vorian> mok0: thanks for reviewing all those plasmoids <3
<dolanor> back
<dolanor> mok0: updated the hexdiff package with your comments solved :)
<dolanor> http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/hexdiff
<mok0> dolanor: great
<mok0> vorian: you're welcome :-) ScottK owes me now
<mok0> vorian: or you perhaps  8)
<vorian> :)
<xoox> How can I automatically backport a package that requires many (backported) dependencies?
<rhpot1991> hey guys question about debian/watch file, I made this code just for ubuntu and its host on bzr, do I need a debian/watch file?
<lifeless> rhpot1991: yes, at this point
<lifeless> rhpot1991: because, there are automated tools that read the package and look for updates
<rhpot1991> lifeless: any way for it to play nice with bzr?
<lifeless> rhpot1991: not yet, though I'm sure patches would be appreciated :)
<lifeless> james_w: which reminds me, upstream integration++
<nhandler> You can also use a get-orig-source rule which might work better with bzr
<lifeless> nhandler: good point
<nhandler> I think there are some examples on the wiki about how to do that
<rhpot1991> nhandler: you can do that within the watch file?
<rhpot1991> I have that in my debian/rules already
<nhandler> lifeless: Correct me if I'm wrong, but I do not think a watch file is a strict requirement. It is just recommend that you have a watch file *or* get-orig-source rule
<rhpot1991> nhandler: its reported as a "wishlist" from lintian
<lifeless> nhandler: I don't recall; I was wondering what REVU will say myself
<lifeless> I'm also not sure what the automated analsis tools do
<lifeless> do they try get-orig-source, or only look at watch
<nhandler> lifeless: I know the REVU warning says get-orig-source or watch file
<nhandler> lifeless: The stuff on qa.ubuntuwire only uses the watch files iirc
<RAOF_> lifeless: The UEHS only looks at the watch file; bzr-buildpackage uses either.
<nhandler> The issue with get-orig-source is that developers have different opinions about how it works. This means that it is not consistant accross all packages
<lifeless> nhandler: when it even exists :P
<RAOF_> Yes; that is annoying.
<lifeless> it would be nice for watch to handle vcs *upstreams*
<RAOF_> lifeless: Why?  Presumably there's a new upstream revision almost immediately.  Doesn't that make the watch file much less useful?
<RAOF_> Hooray for capped internet.  apt thinks it'll be another hour before it's finished updating the package lists.
<lifeless> RAOF_: I don't see why an upstream release branch would be any less frequent than an upstream tarball site
<RAOF> That's not the normal case of VCS packaging, though.  I don't think I've ever touched a packaged-from-VCS package that pulled from a release branch.
<lifeless> RAOF: maybe because we make packaging from VCS harder than it should be, so its only used with 'give me crack' packages
<rhpot1991> this may be silly but how the heck do I get a file in the downloads section of my LP project then?
<lifeless> RAOF: certainly some upstreams do daily tarballs and we tend to ignore those in watch files :P
<lifeless> rhpot1991: there is an upload button in the series
<RAOF> lifeless: Fair enough.  And having a nice, standard way to describe 'tarball is pulled from release branch' would be a step in that direction.
<nhandler> RAOF: You can specify a vcs branch in debian/control
<lifeless> rhpot1991: or I thought there was
<lifeless> rhpot1991: ask on #launchpad :)
<RAOF> nhandler: No, you're thinking of packaging-in-vcs, not packaging-of-vcs-upstream, right?
<RAOF> rhpot1991: You first need to make a release, then you can upload to that release.
<nhandler> RAOF: Right
<RAOF> nhandler: Whereas we're talking about pulling the upstream source from a vcs branch.
<nhandler> Yeah, I caught that after I sent the message
<RAOF> Although, strictly speaking, I don't think you _can_ specify an (abritrary) branch in the VCS field; there's no format for git.
<xoox> How can I automatically backport a package that requires many (backported) dependencies?
<rhpot1991> thanks RAOF, lifeless
<RAOF> xoox: You need to first backport the dependencies.
<xoox> RAOF: That's not very practical is it?
<nhandler> xoox:
<nhandler> Are you sure all of the Dependencies need to be backported for it to work?
<xoox> nhandler: Yes
<RAOF> xoox: In what way is it impractical?
<xoox> RAOF: There are many dependencies. I detest unnecessary work (backporting each package manually). Proof that the work is unnecessary is that other package managers do it automatically.
<RAOF> xoox: Maybe you're talking about something different to what we think you are talking about.
<RAOF> xoox: What is it that you actually want to do?
<xoox> RAOF: I want to backport a package that has dependencies that need to be packported. If there a N packages in total I want to do 1 'manual' step, not N.
<RAOF> xoox: What package?  What, exactly, do you mean by 'backport'?  Why do you need to backport the dependencies?
<xoox> RAOF: It doesn't matter but the package is sagemath.
<xoox> It is in jaunty I want it in Intrepid.
<RAOF> Ok.  And what dependencies need backporting
<RAOF> So, we are talking about the same thing.
<xoox> I imagine all the math libs. But I guess that is the first problem. It seems I have to manually determine that (I shouldn't have to).
<rhpot1991> "Warning! This package could not be extracted; there's no browseable directory for it on REVU"
<rhpot1991> do I need to worry about that?
<xoox> RAOF: We are talking about the same thing but seemingly have different expectations on how things should work.
<RAOF> xoox: So, what I would do is take the Jaunty source package and try to build it in an Intrepid environment.
<RAOF> xoox: If that works, great, no further backporting required.  If it doesn't, then we need to backport one or more dependencies.
<RAOF> xoox: How would you expect this to work?
<xoox> RAOF: package-builder sage-math -> fetches and builds all dependencies. Have you ever used pacman or emerge?
<RAOF> No, and it's not a good fit for Ubuntu.
<RAOF> I'm not sure why you'd want to (re)build all the dependencies.
<xoox> RAOF: I'm talking about a very narrow feature (not the entire packaging system). When packaging dependencies should be retrieved and built automatically.
<xoox> RAOF: I only want to rebuild the ones that need to be rebuilt.
<RAOF> How do you determine the ones that need to be rebuilt?
<xoox> RAOF: A first stab would be intrepid depends on version X and jaunty depends on version Y > X.
<rhpot1991> if there are any motu's around this should be a pretty easy one: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?upid=5082
<nhandler> rhpot1991: I'll take a look
<xoox> therefore package source needs to be fetched and rebuilt.
<RAOF> xoox: Sounds like a prevu feature request.  You can probably provide a patch :)
<rhpot1991> nhandler: thanks
<xoox> Everytime I bring this up people seem to get defensive and 'apologist'. I can't understand why this doesn't appeal to anyone else.
<RAOF> Because it's not something that we do a lot, and generally needing to backport dependencies rules out actually doing the backport.
<RAOF> xoox: It might be a useful feature for prevu.  But it's just not very commonly useful, at least for us.
<jdong> I've considerd that idea
<RAOF> That's why it hasn't been implemented already.
<xoox> jdong: And rejected it?
<jdong> it's always failed in my imagination because I can think of and find in the repo, cases where it'd result in a chain of dependencies
<jdong> a chain that will basically pull in half of Jaunty
<jdong> the alternate approach I've considered is forcibly ignoring build-deps and seeing if the build fails
<jdong> if not then good
<xoox> jdong: A chain that wouldn't happen by manually backporting?
<jdong> if so, then follow to next level of deps
<jdong> and repeat.
<jdong> xoox: a human backporter is assumed to be smarter at figuring out if a build-dep is serious or a transition-tool during development of the distro
<rhpot1991> I see some typos on the details.py page, is there someone who I should alert about these?
<jdong> I'm open to the above recursive level-by-level giving in of pulling build deps from Jaunty
<jdong> but I'm not open to just-follow-the-build-deps-till-it-stops
<jdong> there's something called dist-upgrade for that ;-)
<nhandler> rhpot1991: The details.py page on REVU?
<rhpot1991> nhandler: yes
<rhpot1991> nhandler: I see an issue in lintian for what I just pointed you at too, I'm gonna fix that quick now
<nhandler> rhpot1991: File a bug about it on Launchpad. launchpad.net/revu
<xoox> jdong: I think following the deps would be okay as long as it prompted you: "You are going to fetch and build X packages. Yes/No"
<nhandler> rhpot1991: Good, I was going to comment on that ;)
<rhpot1991> nhandler: should it be 1.0 there?
<nhandler> rhpot1991: version=3
<xoox> In an ideal world it would just be like apt but building from source.
<nhandler> rhpot1991: Read the uscan man page
<rhpot1991> nhandler: on it, thanks
<jdong> xoox: the problem right now is prevu does not have its own dep parser.
<xoox> Ignoring build-deps seems imprudent. They are there for a reason and the package creator probably expects those dependencies to be fulfilled.
<jdong> xoox: I can tell you as a backporter that 95% of build deps are for transitional rebuilds
<xoox> jdong: There is a python apt library no?
<xoox> What is a "transitional" rebuild exactly?
<jdong> xoox: what good does that do for build-deps?
<jdong> xoox: it's when I just uploaded libfoo 1.0->1.1, and now I want to rebuild foo using libfoo-1.1
<jdong> if I just say "rebuild foo", depending on archive propagation state it could build against the old 1.0 or new 1.1
<jdong> so I put in an explicit build-dep on >=1.1 to make sure the build waits until it can build against the new version.
<jdong> the only reason I put in the build dep is for that force-rebuild. Other than that the old 1.0 would work just fine.
<xoox> jdong: I see.
<jdong> in cases where a build-dep is intentional, the ./configure script should check for it explicitly and the changelog should yell.
<jdong> at least I've been asking for the changelog to yell and people have been nodding :)
<jdong> and python-apt really doesn't get me much further, I still have to parse build-deps
<jdong> It's not too much work to grab diff.gz's for build-dep lists and implement a parser
<jdong> I mean, that's what pbuilder-satisfydepends is
<jdong> but I guess so far I haven't been troubled by hunting down build-deps to the poitn that I want to invest my effort towards this feature
<xoox> jdong: What is the probability of try-build-without-deps-rebuild scheme being implemented?
<jdong> xoox: lim(P_implement(year), year -> +infty) = 1.000
<jdong> until someone blesses me with free time, I don't know at what point the 0->1 transition occurs :)
<jdong> (read: Contribute patches for this behavior)
<jdong> xoox: at the same time I'd like the diff.gz's to be grabbed first for a dry-run dependency check before the entire source package is grabbed.
<jdong> that way we don't have things like downloading 50TB for OpenOffice to figure out build-deps fail
<xoox> jdong: Do you work for canonical?
<jdong> no, I don't :)
<xoox> Well, thanks for explaining the issues to me. Here's hoping free time blesses us all.
<jdong> :) anyimte.
<jdong> time.
<jdong> stupid new keyboard
<dholbach> good morning
<dholbach> persia, soren: awake? :)
<persia> Yes.  Where are we having this meeting?
<dholbach> #u-meeting
<dholbach> geser, nixternal: I know you're likely not going to be there, but I'll try anyway: there? :)
<RAOF> Oh.  motu meeting?
<dholbach> MC Meeting
<RAOF> Ah.  Not so immediately interesting to me, then :)
<persia> RAOF, You want a MOTU meeting?  I think the next one isn't scheduled, so if you've something to discuss, please call for one.  It's been a couple weeks.
<RAOF> persia: No, not really.  Its just that if there was one on, I could actually turn up!
<persia> heh.
<ScottK> dholbach: What time is the meeting?
<dholbach> ScottK: 7 utc
<ScottK> Who's on the agenda for this one?  Is it vorian or is he the next meeting?
<dholbach> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Council/Meeting
<persia> He's for the next meeting.
<dholbach> ScottK: didrocks, huats and Laney
 * dholbach gets another cup of coffee
<ScottK> Thanks
<didrocks> hey dholbach !
<dholbach> hiya didrocks
<emgent> morning people
<huats> morning
 * iulian waves
<didrocks> morning emgent & iulian
<a|wen> how is it, that you split a bug out to track the status for multiple releases at a time? ... do you need to do a nominate for release, or is there another way?
<ScottK> That's it.
<ScottK> With that, /me goes to bed.
<a|wen> thx
<pochu> bah I'm late for the meeting :(
<dholbach> arnegoetje asked me for help with the ibus-* packages on REVU
<dholbach> I'll poke a few of them today - can anybody else help out too?
<pochu> dholbach: you were right! I got 85/120 in the TOEFL (and I needed ~80 or even +70)!! :)
 * dholbach hugs pochu
<dholbach> ROCK
<dholbach> congratulations!
<pochu> my reading and writing saved me ;)
<pochu> thanks :)
<didrocks> pochu: really? TOEFL in not on 990?
<didrocks> oh, it was TOEIC, not TOEFL :)
<pochu> didrocks: I hope it's not ;)
<didrocks> pochu: :D
<pochu> or you will make me sad
<pochu> :)
<didrocks> no no, it was for TOEIC (I had to pass both of them :))
<pochu> didrocks: I arrived late for the meeting... have you been processed already?
<didrocks> pochu: yep, it's done for me :)
<didrocks> and everything was all right ;)
<pochu> didrocks: cool! congrats :)
<didrocks> pochu: thanks ^^
<pochu> didrocks: and Laney is last?
<didrocks> pochu: exactly
<dholbach> Laney: awake?
<jono> headed to bed, night everyone!
<dholbach> night jon
<dholbach> jono :)
<lidaobing> dholbach, hello, I am the packager of ibus-*
<dholbach> lidaobing: ah great
<lidaobing> I want to reply some question (not all)
<lidaobing> 1. why don't package ibus 1.1, ibus 1.1 change too much from ibus 0.1.1.*, and there is not enough time to package it for ubuntu 9.04
<lidaobing> so I will package 0.1.1 for ubuntu 9.04 and ibus 1.1 for ubuntu 9.10 and 9.04-backport
<dholbach> ok
<lidaobing> dholbach, and any suggested repos position for packaging?
<lidaobing> I use lp:~lidaobing/+junk/<pkgname>, and I have no idea for any better postion
<dholbach> lidaobing: I dunno... +junk just seemed like temporary :)
<lidaobing> dholbach, I think it just means this repos does not link to a project
<dholbach> is there a team already that takes care of the packaging of those input methods
<dholbach> lidaobing: maybe talk to Arne about it
<dholbach> it's not a blocker, just something I wondered about
<lidaobing> it should be link to ubuntu project, but ubuntu does not support this
<lidaobing> dholbach, I will fix other problems soon, thanks for your review.
<dholbach> ~inputmethod-pkg/ibus-hangul/ubuntu maybe? I'll leave it up to you :)
<lidaobing> dholbach, I will have a look
<lidaobing> dholbach, whois Arne?
<dholbach> lidaobing: oh, I thought you had worked with ArneGoetje already
<lidaobing> dholbach, got it, Arne Goetje <arne@ubuntu.com>
<ara> didrocks: congrats!
<didrocks> ajmitch_: thanks :)
<Laney> dholbach: ...
<Laney> I had it in my head that it was 7pm
 * dholbach hugs Laney
<dholbach> persia, soren: ^
<soren> Laney: Aw.. Well, you're up again in two weeks :)
<dholbach> I was just about to ask if you guys had time for an impromptu meeting :-)
<Laney>  no worries if you don't, completely my fault
<Laney> sorry chaps
<soren> If we keep it under 20 minutes, I'm cool with it.
<dholbach> persia: SeÃ±or Hikory? :)
<dholbach> geser: maybe you're available now too? :)
<persia> Estoy muy distraÃ­do
<proppy> persia: ukeru
<persia> (and I'm secretly glad because I only reviewed about half as many patches as I would have preferred).
<Laney> I thought "Man I'll have a nice lie-in so I'm fresh for the meeting this *evening*"
<directhex> :(
 * Laney sprints off into the sunset, never to be seen again
<geser> dholbach: yes, I'm available
<dholbach> geser, soren, Laney: shall we take the plunge and head to #ubuntu-meeting?
<persia> OK.  That's 3 1/2 of us.  Let's do it.
<dholbach> rock on
 * Laney shreds
<pochu> dholbach: whereabouts?
<dholbach> pochu: hu?
<pochu> dholbach: Laney's application :)
<pochu> or is it already done?
<dholbach> pochu: there's the IRC Council meeting going on right now
<Laney> noe, at 11
<pochu> oh, so 45 minutes
<pochu> ok :)
<DaveMorris> Hi, I'm trying to track down the cause of a problem in Ubuntu with the QtBrowserPlugin example.  It works fine on Debian but not on Ubuntu.  Is there an easy way (rather than manually) to see which libraries it uses (from ldd) are different from the Debian ones.  IE Which packages have had modifications rather than been direct copies from Debian?
<persia> DaveMorris, The version numbers would tell you, as Ubuntu libraries tend to have "ubuntu" in the revision string.
<DaveMorris> cheers, I've no idea whats causing it not to work on Ubuntu but would be nice to fix it.  Since we are creating a 3D browser plugin for Geko based browsers
<Laney> DaveMorris: You can see the patch Ubuntu applied on http://patches.ubuntu.com
<Laney> (or linked from the PTS afaik)
<Koon> didrocks: congrats!
<Koon> huats: congrats!
<huats> thanks Koon
<jpds> huats: congrats, mate :)
<huats> jpds:  thanks my friend
<Rafik> huats> toutes mes fÃ©licitations  !
<huats> Rafik: thanks !
<mok0> huats: felicitations!
<huats> thanks mok0
<mok0> didrocks: congrat!!
<james_w> congratulations didrocks
<james_w> et tu huats
<huats> merci james_w
<lidaobing> dholbach, can you review ibus-hangul again, http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?upid=5090 (I have come back home from work, so I can response ASAP)
<huats> persia: are you still around ?
<persia> Not really, but I should be around in about half an hour.
<dholbach> hum
<dholbach> does Mootbot still spit out meeting summaries?
<dholbach> www.novarata.net/mootboot has no meeting entries from Feb-2009
<Laney> I never figured it out when we used it for u-uk meetings
<dholbach> I just asked in #ubuntu-scribes
<lidaobing> dholbach, ibus-anthy is also been uploaded again, http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?upid=5091
<jpds> dholbach: I've contacted the person who runs it in #ubuntu-irc.
<dholbach> lidaobing: I'll take a look in a bit - can you make the same changes to the other packages as well? was ibus-table unarchived again?
<dholbach> jpds: perfect - thanks muchly
<lidaobing> dholbach, OK
<dholbach> Laney: seems I'm not admin of ubuntu-universe-sponsors
<dholbach> sorry
<Laney> no probs
 * Laney pokes TheMuso
<Laney> can you add me to u-u-s?
<directhex> so... is it done? is Laney infused with added awesome?
 * Laney is positively effervescent
<a|wen> if I have a package in the archive (varnish on hardy) that i want to prepare an SRU for; but the package is (probably in error) uploaded as a native package (varnish_1.0.3-2.tar.gz), how should i then go about it? ... keep it as a native package, or do i have other optoins?
<huats> hey Laney
<huats> what happened this morning ?
<Laney> I got the time 12 hours wrong
<huats> dholbach: persia is the one who can add to u-u-s ?
<huats> because I'd like to be added to it...
<Laney> and TheMuso and DktrKranz
<huats> Laney: oh :(
<Laney> huats: It's ok now!
<huats> congrats !!!
<huats> I haven't seen it :)
<Laney> thanks muchly
<huats> you deserve it !
<mok0> Laney!!! Woot!
<huats> Laney: do you take care of the glom update or do you want me to do it ?
<Laney> huats: I don't mind
<Laney> but what do you think to VCS packaging for it?
<huats> Laney: I am in favor :)
<Laney> cool beans
<huats> I know didrocks did quite a lot of stuffs based on james_w work
<huats> we should ask him...
<Laney> probably a good idea
<huats> Laney: I have some stuffs to finish
<james_w> congratulations Laney
<mok0> Laney: congrats
<huats> if by the middle of next week you haven't touched it, I will have a look
<Laney> thanks!
<directhex> yay Laney
<Laney> and from my LP profile it looks like I've been a member for ages
<Laney> since I was accidently added in August
<didrocks> hum? :)
<Laney> didrocks: We want to get the glom package into VCS
<didrocks> Laney: you can have a look to the email announcing my MOTUship, there is the log of the conversation and we discussed about that
<didrocks> Laney: if you need more clue, do not hesitate :)
<huats> didrocks: we won'"t hesitate... you know that :)
<Laney> \o
<didrocks> huats: from you? I'm sure of it :)
<didrocks> dholbach: persia : same question as huats for u-u-s :)
<dholbach> didrocks: not an admin, excuser-moi
<didrocks> dholbach: *excusez* :p
<persia> Adding both of you now...
<Laney> (and me please)
<didrocks> (dholbach: and don't ask me to speak Deutch as a revenge ^^)
<dholbach> didrocks: thanks for the correction :)
<mok0> james_w: more and more often, people have their sources in VCS's and do not release tarballs, so the whole idea of the debian/watch file is defeated. Right now I am look at a package where the sources are in LP, and it is quite unsatisfactory that there is no way to do a "uscan --report-status" to see if the code is current. Do you have an idea on how to deal with this?
<dholbach> maybe I'll get it .......... one day
<huats> thanks persia
<persia> Laney, Sure.
<didrocks> dholbach: everyone can understand, that's not an issue :)
<james_w> mok0: the VCS can tell you if it is current, so perhaps we should come up with a way to allow the VCS to tell you
<mok0> james_w: that would be really nice
<mok0> james_w: in the current case, I can see that the ~bzrNN number which is part of the package name corresponds to the latest commit.
<broonie> but then you're back to requiring some intelligence to assess if upstream should be packaged.
<mok0> broonie: yes it is a whole new ballgame
<dholbach> a world without tarballs........... one day :)
<mok0> broonie: I predict more and more projects will have sliding releases
<mok0> dholbach: exactly
<dholbach> mok0: I don't think it's a necessarily a frightening scenario - WDYT? :)
<mok0> dholbach: oh, no, not frightening, it just doesn't fit very well into our current methodology
<dholbach> that's definitely right
<mok0> and we might as well start to think about alternative strategies
<dholbach> it'd just be sweet if we eliminated the "no shared history" problem wrt branches as we approach them today :)
<mok0> Yes
<dholbach> even if future debian/rules (or whatever it might be) have to call auto tools or something
<mok0> I agree
<mok0> Well, we need an abstraction layer on top of all the various building methods people use; rules is as good as any
<didrocks> persia: thanks :)
<dholbach> it'll be a glorious and sun-shiny day that happens :)
<mok0> Ah, Question: What is the best thing about reviewing packages from REVU???
<mok0> Answer: You get to type the following often: "less rules" and "less control"
<vorian> didrocks, Laney, contrats :)
<dholbach> mok0: haha :)
<didrocks> thanks vorian ;)
<mok0> Of course that's another reason for using "less" over "more" :-)
<Tonio_> mok0: got a response from skrooge upstream, last update should fix the issue.... I'll look and let you know for revu
<mok0> Tonio_: Super!
<Laney> vorian: thanks
<Laney> good luck to you next time!
<mok0> Skrooge upstream = Uncle Scrooge" ??
<vorian> Laney: danke!
 * mok0 < lunch
<vorian> didrocks: if you truely want to help us on our next release, we will start work on Feb 25/26th on 4.2.1
<vorian> i will need to walk you through our work flow :)
<didrocks> vorian: just after the bug jub? Great! Which channel you advise me to join? ninja's one? :)
<TheMuso> Laney: ?
<Laney> TheMuso: Never mind, it's sorted now
<Laney> (I just saw that you were an admin of u-u-s)
<vorian> didrocks: see your server window "_
<freeflying> how can I advocate a package on revu? thanks
<Vest84> mok0: hi, you've asked me to add manpage to my package (using manpage.1.ex). if I'm a developer of my software, can I add the page into .orig. package, or I still should use as you said debian/quod.1 directory?
<freeflying> Vest84: prefer to add it into upstream
<freeflying> :)
<persia> freeflying, If the account system is working properly, you should get an advocation checkbox next to the comment box.
<Vest84> freeflying: thanks. it means it's better to add man for other distributions, not only to ubuntu. yes?
<freeflying> persia: I login, but no such chechbox :)
<persia> freeflying, Hrm.  Let me check.
<freeflying> Vest84: if you can add it into upstream, then any other distro may benefit from it
<freeflying> persia: thanks, dude :)
<persia> What's your LP ID again?
<freeflying> persia: zhengpeng.hou@gmail.com
<Vest84> freeflying: "thanks, dude" :) (again)
<freeflying> Vest84: welcome :)
<persia> freeflying, You have *three* LP accounts.  You ought merge them :)
<persia> freeflying, Try reloading the page, and tell me if the advocation option appears now.
<freeflying> persia: got it, thanks
<hyperair> i never knew it was possible to have multiple LP accounts, let alone merge them
<vorian> hyperair: i think they are talking about REVU accounts
 * vorian was guilty of having two
<nhandler> hyperair: You can merge multiple LP accounts here https://launchpad.net/people/+requestmerge
<persia> hyperair, You do it by doing things with LP with multiple email addresses, and not telling LP about them beforehand.  Merging just cleans up.
<hyperair> vorian: i never knew that you could even have multiple revu accounts
<persia> vorian, No, multiple LP accounts.
<vorian> okie
<persia> hyperair, When REVU switched to using LP accounts, people with legacy accounts needed to merge.
<hyperair> i see
<nhandler> persia: You saw that REVU admins can now merge accounts for people, right?
<persia> nhandler, I didn't, but that only helps with REVU.  The multiple accounts I discovered was in LP.
<persia> nhandler, Only one of the accounts is used for REVU, but tracking down which took me a couple minutes.
<a|wen> if I have a package (varnish on hardy) that is in error uploaded as a native package (varnish_1.0.3-2.tar.gz) ... what should i then do with the next version; keep it as native, or get the original tarball to make it a non-native package?
<hyperair> blargh geeez why is evolution taking so long to compile
<pochu_> Laney: congrats!
<Laney> thanks pochu!
<freeflying> dholbach: you would like have a look at http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?upid=5103 and http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?upid=5102 again?
<persia> a|wen, Make it non-native with the next upstream version.
<dholbach> freeflying: can you ask ArneGoetje to review them too, right now I'm a bit hammered, but willing to check them out later today
 * dholbach is really crazy busy
<a|wen> persia: thx... i'll do that
<freeflying> dholbach: ok
<persia> Oh, excellent.  Issue 222 is resolved!
<a|wen> persia: oh, new upstream relese. it is on hardy, so that want happen... so for an SRU i shoud keep it as native?
<persia> a|wen, SRU for new upstream is rare and hard, but do keep that native: the goal is to minimise the debdiff for SRUs.
<a|wen> persia: i thought so ... but there will be no debdiffs with a native version, so you could call that minimal ;)
<persia> a|wen, You can generate a debdiff on a native package.  It is more likely to fail to apply due to binary blobs, but it can be done.
<persia> The goal is to minimize the changes, to address known issues.  Exactly what that means is open to intepretation, but changing the method of packaging is usually not recommended.
<a|wen> persia: oh, i didn't know that, i'll give it a try
<mok0>  Vest84, I was AFK for a while... of course, you can put your manpage in the tarball! Good idea!
<Vest84> mok0: ok, I'm working on it :) studying
<mok0> Vest84: let me know if you need any help
<pochu_> looks like we are on a killing spree!
<pochu_> 4 MOTUs in a row ;)
<Vest84> mok0: thank you in forward
<mok0> pochu: are they killing MOTUs now? Oh, the horror!
<mok0> pochu: users are getting more and more demanding
<mok0> Who has admin rights to ubuntu-motu mailing list?
<soren> I do.
<mok0> soren: can I ask you to approve a message I sent? I used my ubuntu email address and I am not subscribed with that
<soren> mok0: It's not in the queue.
<soren> dholbach might have already approved it. He's like that.
<mok0> soren: huh? It sent me a message that it's held for approval
<soren> This is where you say: "But it's only been two minutes since I sent it", and I go: "Yes, he's like that. I just told you."
<dholbach> nothing in the queue
<dholbach> sorry guys
<mok0> I sent it 2 hours ago
<dholbach> didn't it go through?
<pochu> mok0: was it a reply to nhandler's mail?
<pochu> If so, I saw it
<mok0> Ah it did, sorry
<pochu> mok0: too much ET for me :)
<mok0> No it was a reply to the guy who sent a patch to ical2sqlite
<pochu> that one too ;)
<mok0> Where's quadripro? I want to shake his virtual hand
<c_korn> is there a dput option to ommit the upload of the orig.tar.gz file?
<persia> c_korn, No.  Whether the orig.tar.gz is uploaded or not is determined by the content of the .changes file.
<c_korn> ok, but uploading to the PPAs of launchpad I do not have to upload the orig.tar.gz again when it is already uploaded. but it has to be listed in the changes file to compare the checksums
<a|wen> persia: if i try to do a debdiff on the native package i just get a lot of "Use of uninitialized value ... in /usr/bin/debdiff ..."
<slytherin> c_korn: when you do 'debuild' use only argument -S instead of -S -sa.
<mok0> c_korn: I was gonna suggest that too
<persia> a|wen, How are you calling it?
<a|wen> persia: "debdiff varnish_1.0.3-2.dsc varnish_1.0.3-2ubuntu0.8.04.dsc"
<persia> c_korn, the checksum needs to be listed in the .dsc file, but not in the .changes (unless you're uploading it).
<persia> a|wen, And both unpack cleanly with dpkg-source?  Very odd.
<persia> a|wen, What happens if you unpack both trees, and run diff -urN on the top-level directories?
<directhex> Laney, how does the MOTU wizard's robe & hat feel?
<a|wen> persia: both unpack fine, and i get a diff out by running the command
<c_korn> I don't know what the difference is, but when I now run dput -f ... it wants to upload the orig.tar.gz
<persia> c_korn, Look at your source.changes file.  Is the orig.tar.gz listed therein?
<c_korn> yes
<mok0> c_korn: _What_ file are you trying to upload?
<persia> How did you call debuild?
<c_korn> debuild -S
<c_korn> dput -f ppa-getdeb scilab_5.1-1~ppa2_source.changes
<persia> What is the revision number?
<persia> I suspect you've hit a condition designed to reduce mistakes in Debian :)
<persia> c_korn, Try calling debuild -S -sd
<c_korn> I tried that before. then the orig.tar.gz is not uploaded but the PPA rejects the package because the orig.tar.gz is missing, (the entry in sources.changes [or dsc] is required for checksums I presume)
<slytherin> c_korn: was orig.tar.gz ever uploaded to your PPA?
<c_korn> yes
<a|wen> ugly... the source contains a .svn directory, which doesn't get included in the new .tar.gz ...gives me a huge diff
<c_korn> oh, wait
<c_korn> damn, I am dumb. I deleted the package in the PPA. the orig.tar.gz does not exist so. sorry for bothering you
<a|wen> persia: is there any way i can get the .svn directory to stay in the source when the .tar.gz is being rebuild by debuild? or is it okay to let the .svn directory go?
<persia> a|wen, How are you calling debuild?
<a|wen> persia: just "debuild -S"
<persia> Try debuild -i/^$/
<persia> Sounds like someone turned on -i with the default string by default, which would normally be a rather reasonable thing to do.
<a|wen> persia: no luck, still the same
<soren> a|wen: Native package?
<a|wen> soren: yes
<soren> a|wen: Then -i doesn't factor into it.
<soren> -i specifies stuff that should be left out of the diff.gz.
<soren> -I is for leaving stuff out of the orig.tar.gz.
<soren> Well.. Or the tar.gz, anyway
<soren> (it's not an orig.tar.gz in the case of native packages)
<a|wen> soren: thanks a lot, that was the trick
<soren> Any time.
<a|wen> now it at least only fiddles with the config.sub and config.guess; that should be okay i suppose
<soren> I'm curious... Why do you want to leave the .svn directory in there?
<a|wen> soren: it is an update to a hardy package ... build in error as a native by debian
<persia> a|wen, If config.sub and config.guess are copied at build time or clean time, yes, it's safe to ignore that part of the debdiff.  If someone complains, point out that it's automated, and changing the automation would be a larger change.
<a|wen> persia: they are copied at build-time, just checked debian/rules ... so agreed
<slytherin> can any archive admin please process sync of xmlgraphics-commons from experimental? I am waiting for it to happen to work on fop merge. Bug 326172.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 326172 in xmlgraphics-commons "Please sync xmlgraphics-commons 1.3.1 (universe) from debian experimental" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/326172
<persia> For those watching, it's traditional to request actions of the archive-admins in #ubuntu-devel, rather than here.
<directhex> and to offer them a pint as a reward
<quadrispro> hi guys
<devfil2> quadrispro: congrats
<quadrispro> thank you :)
<mok0> quadrispro, congratulations!
<quadrispro> too nice, thank you very much
<Laney> directhex: Dunno, no gpg key here
<directhex> :o
<Laney> quadrispro: congrats
<Laney> it is a day of new MOTUs!
<directhex> how many of those new MOTUs are going to upload sublib, though? :o
<quadrispro> Laney: congrats to you too!
<Laney> just one
<Laney> who is just awesome
<DktrKranz> Laney: didrocks, quadrispro: congrats \o/
<devfil2> Laney: congrats
<devfil2> Laney: now you are a MOTU, so you can upload your miro merge :)
 * Laney shreds his axe
<Laney> heh
<Laney> I will
<Laney> (after reviewing it carefully.....)
<DktrKranz> Laney: no review, just crack! :)
<Laney> those damn contributors, you can never be too thorough
<Laney> u-u-s queue is huge
<mok0> quadrispro: just in time for REVU day!
 * Laney is scared
<quadrispro> yes
<devfil2> Laney: please remember that you can upload it until FF
<Laney> of course
<DktrKranz> and remember, first upload *must* be
<DktrKranz> 1) a sponsor request
<DktrKranz> 2) a SRU
<Laney> both of these things?
<DktrKranz> one of these :)
<Laney> actually I have a long-standing GHC SRU
<Laney> ...........
 * Laney cackles
<persia> Extra points if it's not only both those things, but also for a bug that affects multiple packages because it's fixing a dependency.
<DktrKranz> I started with a request for sponsorship for a SRU bug
 * devfil2 too
<nxvl> huats: congratulations!
<huats> Thanks nxvl !
<mok0> vorian?
<DktrKranz> huats: indeed! congrats (I forgot about "older" MOTUs)
<devfil2> huats: congrats
<vorian> mok0: yus?
<mok0> vorian, bug 328321  should that be closed?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 328321 in amule "amule_2.2.3-1ubuntu1 that fixes (LP: #214100) and (LP: #89672) bugs" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/328321
<vorian> yes
<pochu> quadrispro: congrats!
<mok0> vorian: thx I'll do it then
<vorian> mok0: thanks
<quadrispro> thank you pochu
<mok0> vorian: heh funny he closed two bugs bug not his own
<vorian> that's what I was just checking, mok0 :)
<mok0> ok, another one gone from uus
<mok0> hyperair: bug 328063 are you still on it?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 328063 in codelite "CodeLite FTBFS on hppa" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/328063
<hyperair> mok0: no it's done.
<hyperair> mok0: could you sponsor it please?
<mok0> hyperair: will do it right awayyy
<hyperair> okay thanks =)
<mok0> another one bites the dust
<RainCT> heya
<mok0> Hi RainCT, we have 4 new MOTUs with us today
<RainCT> mok0: Uhm.. EMENOTUNDERSTAND :P
<mok0> RainCT: go back to sleep
<RainCT> -.-
<mok0> ;-)
<RainCT> oh
<RainCT> huats, didrocks: congrats!
<RainCT> and quadrispro :)
<quadrispro> thank you RainCT :)
<RainCT> and Laney
<RainCT> o.O
<RainCT> MOTU flood XD
<huats> RainCT: thanks !
<mok0> he woke up
<Laney> <3 the MC
<RainCT> mok0: I've just arrived from school, I've headache and I'm still catching up with mail :P
<mok0> RainCT: j/k
<dolanor> Hello
<dolanor> If an upstream package doesn't have any COPYING but every source file has the LGPL header, is it packageable ?
<mok0> dolanor: no
<dolanor> even if the website tells so ?
<dolanor> http://www.hawksoft.com/hawknl/
<mok0> dolanor: we need a file that allows us to distribute the directory tree
<superm1> wow 4 new MOTUs. congrats quadrispro Laney huats and didrocks.  sounds like between the 4 of you, you can easily complete the undocumented MOTU initiation tradition of knocking out all the packages on REVU your first day :)
<mok0> dolanor: ... you are not packaging the website. Just sayin'
<dolanor> mok0: ok, I understand
<huats> ;)
<RainCT> dolanor: you can repackage the tarball and add the COPYING, as a last resource
<huats> BTW, who is no yet involved in the mentoring program  ?
<mok0> RainCT: ooh, that is on the edge
<huats> so that I can add all the new MOTUs :)
<dolanor> RainCT: the probleme is : the developer doesn't reply to email. Maybe he is dead :/
<RainCT> mok0: if there is evidence that they want that license then it is accepted
<mok0> RainCT: well it makes sense, I agree to that
<mok0> RainCT: but in 5 years, the package might still be around and the website is closed donw
<mok0> maybe... that's a risk
<quadrispro> superm1: thank you :) Do you remember of w-scan? Do you think we should wait until 16-17th Februray?
<superm1> quadrispro, didn't that email say it was headed into experimental?
<huats> quadrispro: are you interested in joining the MOTU mentoruing program ?
<huats> superm1: same question :)
<RainCT> mok0: Not sure which effects that would have, but archive admins don't seem worried about this. I think I even have/had some package in Debian where I had to do this..
<mok0> dolanor: if at all possible, you should try to get upstream to put a COPYING file in $topdir and package a new tarball
<superm1> quadrispro, if you dont see it in experimental, go ahead and build the package from his svn as we discussed before and we'll sync it later when it gets into experimental.  i think now is fine at this point
<mok0> RainCT: I see. Well be glad I am not archive admin :-P
<quadrispro> huats: it could be exciting, but at the moment I have too many things too, Perhaps, later :)
<huats> quadrispro: ok
<quadrispro> superm1: ok, thank you
<superm1> huats, i'm far too preoccupied with other ubuntu related things to be a mentor, sorry.
<huats> superm1:
<quadrispro> (huats: congrats to you too :))
<huats> and quadrispro: ok
<huats> please do not hesitate to contact me if you change your mind
<huats> quadrispro: thanks ! and congrats to you too !!
 * RainCT glances at huats 
<huats> RainCT why glances ?
<mok0> RainCT: I was just thinking this morning, to insert another stage between "Unreviewed" and "In progress", namely "Copyright", so all packages that pass through reviewing have to pass a stage where the copyright is affirmed
<mok0> RainCT: so they would not enter reviewing before the copyright is clarified
<mok0> PRobably overkill
<RainCT> mok0: not sure. perhaps that could be done with tags (copyright-pending, copyright-verified, ..). I'll add support for tags soon
<mok0> RainCT: cool!
<quadrispro> could someone add me to universe-sponsors?
<mok0> RainCT: you have some code for that?
<RainCT> huats: I'm waiting for someone to be assigned to me :). I'm also happy without a mentee, though :P
<RainCT> mok0: no, but I'll probably get to it today or this weekend
<huats> RainCT: i know
<huats> you are on the list
<Laney> why should copyright be separate from review?
<huats> I have a bit too much things to handle
 * vorian cheers for huats and quadrispro 
<RainCT> okay, just checking :)
<quadrispro> vorian: thanks a lot!
<huats> so I deal with them in lots :)
<Laney> that is one of the major parts of review that people get wrong, isn't it?
<huats> RainCT: but don't worry
<huats> :)
<dolanor> RainCT: So right now, I try to recontact the upstream dev, and if he doesn't reply, I may be OK to add a COPYING myself and package frome that ? (and email the orig.tar.gz to the dev ?.)
<persia> quadrispro, Sure.  Doing so now.
<Laney> dolanor: It's a bit dubious to add copyright information to someone else's work, imo
<mok0> Laney: I agree
<RainCT> dolanor: If it's clear enough (based on headers in files in the tarball, statement on the website, etc), yes. Just asking upstream to add the COPYING file to the next release (or release a new revision of the current one adding it, but NOT replacing the current one if is has already entered a distribution) is enough, personally I'd find receiving a tarball annoying.
<quadrispro> I see, thank you persia :)
<dolanor> Laney: yes, for sure ... But it is written nearly everywhere that it is LGPL, but no COPYING file
<dolanor> I understand because of the source tree
<dolanor> but I began this package 3 years ago ... still no answers
<slytherin> quadrispro: Laney: huats: didrocks: Congratulations. :-)
<persia> There's no requirement that there be a file called "COPYING", but the LGPL source preface does say "You should have received a copy of the license with this code..." (or similar veribiage).
<Laney> thanks slytherin
<huats> thanks slytherin and vorian
<dolanor> persia: hmmm, yes, right
<RainCT> persia: afaik the package would be rejected without a COPYING file
<RainCT> (at least in the case of GPL, but I guess LGPL is the same)
<slytherin> AFAIK, COPYING or LICENSE is required.
<persia> RainCT, Nope.  It would be rejected for failure to include the license.  Doesn't matter if it's called "COPYING" or "LGPL" or "LICENSE" or what have you.
<RainCT> persia: Right.
<slytherin> persia: pm?
<bddebian> Heya gang
<Laney> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Hi Laney, congrats :)
<sladen> are there any of the ubuntu-mono packagers here
<sladen> libtaoframework is still FTBFS;  does it need to depend on cil-2.0 to get System.Windows.Forms?
 * ScottK looks around for directhex...
<ScottK> He's the one you want.
<quadrispro> superm1: 20081106-3~ubuntu1 could be a good version ?
<directhex> hm?
<quadrispro> superm1: about w-scan
<quadrispro> superm1: remember that it will be auto-synced since jaunty+1
<dolanor> what to do with upstream package with this tree
<superm1> quadrispro, i thought we had decided it would be something that would still need to be manually synced?
<dolanor> project_v2.0.1/project/<root>
<dolanor> I put the debian dir at the same levec of project ?
<chrismurf> hi all, would a MOTU mind reviewing http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/pyproj?  mok0 worked with me on it yesterday and advocated for it, I think it's ready.
<RainCT> nhandler: merged your branch
<mok0> hi chrismurf
<chrismurf> mok0, heya!  Thanks again for the help
<chrismurf> in hindsight, I think splitting it was the right approach
<chrismurf> modifying the debian version now to be split as well
<mok0> chrismurf: I think so too... did the DDs arrive at the same conclusion?
<chrismurf> haven't bugged them about it - just gonna do it and poke them again ;-)
<chrismurf> like you said, I doubt they'll say no
<directhex> sladen, tao hasn't seen any love for a while
<nxvl> !nixternal | nixternal
<ubottu> nixternal: Oh no!  The pointy-clicky Windows7 lover has arrived!  He's rumoured to be giving out free money, and help on the MIRC client too! <nixternal> I LOVE MIRC!!!
<mok0> chrismurf: yeah
<nxvl> heh
<nxvl> it has been updated
<mok0> !nxvl
<ubottu> Sorry, I don't know anything about nxvl
<mok0> ubottu: neither do we
<ubottu> Sorry, I don't know anything about neither do we
<mok0> heh
<DktrKranz> it's not that funny being on ubottu's list
<directhex> sladen, gah, it's a mess tbh
<directhex> hm, nope, it's worse than i thought
<tgm4883> mok0, I've fixed most of the issues that you commented on http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/mythnettv  about COPYING.GPL missing, i'm assuming you are asking that because it is referenced in the COPYING file, but that file does not exist anywhere in the orig.tar or on the authors site.  Am I suppose to get that from elsewhere?
<mok0> tgm4883: It is supposed to pre-exist in upstream's tarball
<tgm4883> ah
<mok0> tgm4883: it is that file that gives us the permission to distribute the source tree
<tgm4883> let me contact upstream then, and see what I can find out
<mok0> tgm4883: perfect!
<Laney> [ubuntu/jaunty] miro 2.0-1ubuntu1 (Accepted)
<Laney> good times \o/
<tgm4883> cause he just says use GPL or LGPL in that COPYING file
<mok0> tgm4883: oh yes he does actually
<ScottK> tgm4883: It must have a full, verbatim copy of the license.
<mok0> tgm4883, yes so he should include both GPL and LGPL licenses
<jdong> ok, RMS lord, forgive me, but I am about to willfully order a Broadcom wifi chipset....
<tgm4883> mok0, ScottK ok, i'll see what I can do
<mok0> jdong: does it work with Ubuntu?
<jdong> mok0: the wl.ko works flawlessly with Linux all the way up to full N speeds
<jdong> mok0: but it is a pure blob of evil.
<mok0> jdong: inserting trojans, malware and what not
<jdong> mok0: from what I understand the driver derives from the same blob used on Broadcom routers that run Linux (like 90% of the market...)
<tgm4883> mok0, i've also fixed http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/mythnettv-gui per your request, so you can give it a +1, but if mythnettv doesn't get in it's a irrelevant, so you may want to wait
<jdong> which probably explains its maturity/stability
<ScottK> tgm4883: If upstream won't fix it, you can repack the tarball and add the file (documenting what you've done) as long as it's clear in the context of the package what upstream intended.
<mok0> tgm4883: ok, thanks
 * ScottK had to do that on his very first package.
<jdong> but the ath9k based card I have right now is just... awful under Linux
<tgm4883> ScottK, ok thanks
<jdong> I had it when it took 10 minutes to associate to a node 3 feet away.
<ScottK> jdong: Intel?
<jdong> Atheros
<ScottK> jdong: I'm suggesting why not get Intel?
<ScottK> WFM.
<jdong> the other complicating factor is that this is an Apple notebook and I am still interested in the ability to dualboot its proprietary OS
<jdong> if it were pure-Linux I would get an iwl4965
<jdong> and Apple's HCL consists of... two wifi cards? :)
<ScottK> Yum.
<jdong> yea funny how people complain about Linux and hardware
<jdong> stupidly enough the card works flawlessly under OS X
<ScottK> Apple is a special case.
<jdong> but I feel somewhat... bad... for going around running OS X on campus
<broonie> jdong: Linux claims to work on rather more hardware than OS X does.
<ScottK> Since they are really the only purveyors of an integrated hardware/software set.
<chrismurf> oh crap - how does one "un"-archive?
<chrismurf> found a new button... should NOT have pressed that.
<RainCT> chrismurf: on REVU? click on Unarchive :P
<chrismurf> oh hey :-)
 * chrismurf will not be tempted by other pretty icons
 * mok0 finds a button labelled "Do not press, danger!"
 * mok0 thinks it is a pretty button
<soren> mok0: What colour is it?
<mok0> soren: red
<soren> Those are the best.
<mok0> hehe
<mok0> It is behind a small window of glass
<Laney> mok0: http://orangesquash.org.uk/~laney/wallpapers/1200682311225.jpg
 * chrismurf thinks that's what the little hammer is for
<mok0> hehe
<DktrKranz> mok0: what about a "click here to have all MOTUs pulled out of the beds to review your package" button?
<mok0> DktrKranz: ugh me no like
<chrismurf> haha - that seems like a horrible idea for all involved
<chrismurf> "Your package has been EXPLODED."
<ScottK> I guarantee any package reviewed after that button would not get advocated.
<mok0> "Your package has been dissolved and the bytes scattered all over the Internet. You are free to use Google or other service at your disposal to attempt a recovery. Good Luck".
<Laney> sounds like charlie and the chocolate factory
<RainCT> lol
<DktrKranz> mok0: just add "if you ever be able to gather them all again, don't remember to push the button again"
<DktrKranz> s/remember/forget/
<mok0> Laney: that's your wallpaper? Are you red-green colour blind?
<Laney> mok0: I have it on a rotation
<Laney> colour blind?!
<mok0> Laney: the color is so vivid it makes me want to start a fire
<Laney> haha
<mok0> Laney: well, if you're colorblind, it would appear to be a nice greyish color, possibly quite soothing
<Laney> I like the red
<Laney> gets me fired up!
<mok0> Laney: I'd hate to see your bedroom decor
<jpds> dholbach: Meeting logs should be back.
<jpds> dholbach: ^in case you didn't see the above ;-)
<dholbach> jpds: THANKS
<quadrispro> can a .desktop file use a .SVG as icon?
<RainCT> quadrispro: depends on the menu application
<RainCT> quadrispro: I think gnome-panel does, but I'm not really sure about this. (btw, in case you don't know, the name of the Icon in the .desktop file should have NO extension - the menu will figure it out by itself)
<quadrispro> RainCT: I talk about a .desktop which should be installed in the Applications menu
<RainCT> quadrispro: .desktop files are universal (a FreeDesktop.org standards). KDE, XFCE, etc. use them too
<quadrispro> ok perfect
<quadrispro> thank you
<RainCT> quadrispro: I think that if you have a SVG somewhere in /usr/share/icons gnome-panel will pick it up, but you'd better ask on #ubuntu-desktop
 * directhex declares it gohometime
<persia> The .desktop file *shouldn't* specify a filetype for the icon: only an icon name.
<quadrispro> yes, I know it
<persia> The menu system will select the appropriate icon from the available icons based on that name.
<quadrispro> ok
<quadrispro> thank you
<persia> the default menus for Xubuntu, Kubuntu, and Ubuntu Desktop can all handle SVG icons.  I'm less sure about other launchers.
<pochu> I think I'm going to love this /ignore * PARTS QUITS JOINS :)
<pochu> the ":)" is not ignored though :)
<pochu> otherwise I'd ignore myself :(
<vorian> /ignore pochu
<vorian> oops
<vorian> :P
<pochu> :)
<AndrewGee> Hey all. Any MOTUs available to review my package - gpxviewer - It's an application that allows users to look at GPS traces files in GPX format. Thanks :) http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=gpxviewer
<Laney> ember: I thought you were a MOTU :O
<iulian> Laney: Congratulations!
<Laney> thanks iulian!
<directhex> rar, i am back
 * Laney blinks at bug #95444
<sebner> Laney: congratulations!
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 95444 in nvidia-graphics-drivers-180 "No Screen Backlight Control; Notebooks (Vaio, Macbook, HP/Compaq, Samsung, Zepto et al.) with Nvidia Geforce8/Geforce9/Quadro series graphics" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/95444
<Laney> rawr
 * Laney pounces sebner
<dolanor> Any MOTU available to revu/advocate my hexdiff package ? Tool to visually see differences in hexadecimal between files : http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/hexdiff
<dolanor> AM I the only one to get errors with ubuntuwire ?
<dolanor> nevermind, I had to restart firefox because of an update
<chrismurf> Is there a second MOTU who could review pyproj?  It's a python wrapper for PROJ.4 (map projection library).  mok0 advocated, looking for one more.  http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/pyproj
<henrik-hw0> MOTUs: your #1 uploader needs a 2nd advocate on libmirage.
<Laney> boo @ cowbuilder
<Laney> (-dist). Doesn't work if /home and /var are on separate partitions
<henrik-hw0> MOTUs: your #1 uploader needs a 2nd advocate on libmirage.
<lfaraone> How hard would it take to get a debdiff accepted for a package in main?
<lfaraone> (string fix mostly)
<Laney> not very
<Laney> subscribe ubuntu-main-sponsors instead of u-u-s
<lfaraone> Laney: Ah, I expected a multi-level obsticle course upon completion it would be reviewed by the tech board and signed by the sabdfl. :)
<lfaraone> *which upon
<asomething> Laney: thanks for the upload! Glad to see a new u-u-s
<Laney> no problem!
<Laney> the queue is of quite a scary size
<slytherin> yes, 140+ is big size for any queue. :-)
 * Laney is judiciously unsubscribing u-u-s
<asomething> if any one wants an easy one out of the queue, i've got a sync that could use an ACK ;-) Bug #316305 builds in jaunty pbuilder, available in my PPA for testing
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 316305 in deluge "please sync deluge/1.1.2.dfsg-1 from debian-experimental" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/316305
 * Laney is processing in order
 * slytherin is processing java packages.
<asomething> heh, worth a shot
<asomething> Laney: anyways, congrats on becoming a MOTU
<Laney> thanks
<Laney> your turn soon, eh?
<slytherin> asomething: I never saw ttf-rufscript in repositories. Did you drop plans to package it outside your PPA?
<asomething> slytherin: should be in jaunty, I got into debian
 * slytherin checks
<asomething> http://packages.ubuntu.com/jaunty/ttf-rufscript
<slytherin> asomething: yes it is. Don't know how I missed it.
<slytherin> :-)
<lfaraone> I added a .patch file to the debian/patches folder, dch -i'd, and debuilt the source. Why is it then that debdiff says there were no changes made to the dscs other than the changelog addition?
<slytherin> lfaraone: what patch system does the package use?
<asomething> what's the point of the Enhances field in debian/control? does it actually do anything? how does it get used?
<Laney> probably in package managers
 * ScottK mentions ##1234567890 on the off chance people want to join.
<chrismurf> asomething, "This field is similar to Suggests but works in the opposite direction. It is used to declare that a package can enhance the functionality of another package. "
<asomething> ya, that's what the policy man says, but I guess I'm wondering how it gets used by say synaptic, not very important, just wondering for something I'm working on
<dolanor> Any MOTU available to revu/advocate my hexdiff package ? Tool to visually see differences in hexadecimal between files : http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/hexdiff
<slytherin> how can I create a watch file that parses latest version of a package from this page - http://java.netbeans.org/servlets/ProjectDocumentList ?
<dolanor> need 1 more advocate
<slytherin> found out already
<sistpoty> hi folks
<dolanor> hi sistpoty
<sistpoty> hi dolanor
 * ScottK waves to sistpoty.
<sistpoty> hi ScottK
<sistpoty> ScottK: any tought tasks for me this friday night?
 * sebner winks sistpoty =)
<sistpoty> huhu sebner
<iulian> Hiya sistpoty.
<sistpoty> yay, water pipe broken in our road, so no water until tomorrow afternoon
<jdong> what are g-p-m battery warning levels determined by?
<jdong> it is kinda silly on netbooks to do the whole DANGER WILL ROBINSON: YOU HAVE 35 minutes of battery left!!
<chrismurf> jdong, gconf-editor: /apps/gnome-power-manager/thresholds
<maxb> why silly?
<sistpoty> hi iulian btw
<slytherin> Is it necessary to remove hidden files from upstream archives?
 * sistpoty could still put big buckets of water aside for the night :)
<jdong> maxb: it makes it sound a lot more urgent than it should
<jdong> maxb: i.e. for some systems 10% of battery lasts quite a long time
<jdong> while on my large notebook 10% is hurry or openoffice wont close before the system ZAPs
<maxb> Well.... yeah, but you said an absolute time, not a % :-)
<slytherin> Is it necessary to remove hidden files from upstream archives?
<sistpoty> jdong: I assume it's some acpi magic?
<chrismurf> jdong, sistpoty, it's a user setting in gconf.  /apps/gnome-power-manager/thresholds.
<jdong> I guess that is a gracious definition of "user setting" but thanks :)
<ScottK> jdong: KDE if you want user settings ....
 * sistpoty coughs at 4.* *g*
<sistpoty> but maybe I just haven't properly adjusted yet to the new kde world order *g*
<jdong> ScottK: grin :)
<ScottK> sistpoty: It's getting there pretty well with 4.2.
<sistpoty> ScottK: good to know... I'll check (as in upgrade) every now and then ;)
<sistpoty> (and btw.: back when 3 was out, I felt 2.? somewhat better, but funnily, I wouldn't want to look back at 2.* nowadays)
<sistpoty> ScottK: I assume it's not possible to sync from debian/new?
<ScottK> sistpoty: No, since packages in New aren't publically available.
<sistpoty> ah, just what I thought, thanks
<ScottK> It's usually possible to fish the packaging out of a VCS somewhere or ask the maintainer for it.
<ScottK> Then make a -0ubuntu1 version  of it.
 * sistpoty asks myself as maintainer and even better myself as upstream as well *g*
<ScottK> ;-)
 * sistpoty gives himself OK
<ScottK> I did this myself for one package.
<sistpoty> heh
<ScottK> It's still in New after over a month.
<ScottK> So I'm glad I didn't wait.
<sistpoty> ok, then I guess you're in the queue above me
<sistpoty> (only 1-2 weeks)
<sistpoty> crap... I uploaded the *wrong* orig.tar.gz (a local built one instead of the released one)
<sistpoty> always these upstream maintainers *g*
<ScottK> sistpoty: I can reject it. What package?
<sistpoty> ScottK: fauhdlc
<sistpoty> ScottK: thanks a lot... I'll respin with the proper tarball
<ScottK> sistpoty: Rejected.
<sistpoty> thanks ScottK
<ScottK> You're welcome.
 * sistpoty looks at http://www3.informatik.uni-erlangen.de/Research/fauhdlc/downloads/MD5SUMS.asc to be safe :)
<slytherin> ScottK: do you have time to process a sync?
<ScottK> slytherin: I can't do sync's from the lP U/I.
<slytherin> ScottK: What other ways are possible?
<ScottK> Yes, just follow the regular process.
<sistpoty> ScottK: can you new a package? fauhdlc (now with proper orig.tar.gz) would be waiting and is completely uncontroversial in regards to copyright, as I wrote all files (and only a co-worker touched a few files recently)
<slytherin> ScottK: The package is already in the ubuntu-archive queue. But I am waiting for the package to be synced to evaluate fop merge/sync. That is why I asked you.
<slytherin> asomething: deluge sync acked
<asomething> slytherin: thanks!
 * Laney spied some more ajax on LP just now
<Laney> (subscribers list)
<ScottK> I see.
<ScottK> I may be abel to get to them in a bit.
<RainCT> Laney: Uhm, did they get ride of the tags?
<Laney> wha?
<RainCT> I don't see the tags list anymore
<RainCT> great :D
<Laney> I still see them
<Laney> might be the greasemonkey scripts though
<AndrewGee> Hey all. Any MOTUs available to review my package - gpxviewer - It's an application that allows users to look at GPS traces files in GPX format. Thanks :) http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=gpxviewer
<Laney> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/22559597/gtranslator_1.9.4-1.build2 why would this ftbfs happen, anyone?
<Laney> (I know that adding liblaunchpad-integration-dev fixes is, but why is that necessary for a synced package?)
<Laney> s/s is/s it/
<sistpoty> Laney: I assume seb128 would now the answer
<Laney> mm
<Laney> pochu is subscribed to the bug anyway ;)
<Laney> he knows all about gnome
<sistpoty> Laney: probably on a rdepends of liblaunchpad-integration-dev (or a different binary from launchpad-integration) is wrong in regards to depends
<sistpoty> hm... somehow dist-upgrade wasn't kvirc friendly *g*
<sistpoty> (and I timed out)
<maxb> Laney: I suppose one of the .la files pulled in directly or indirectly via the -l options eventually references launchpad-integration
<maxb> grep in the pbuilder environment, maybe?
<Laney> maxb: Yeah. Does that indicate a missing depends?
<sistpoty> Laney: did you get my response?
<Laney> sistpoty: I did, thanks
<sistpoty> Laney: that one that a depends was missing from a rdepends of lp-integration? or the former one?
<Laney> I need that pbuilder hook that drops you into the environment on a ftbfs
<Laney> sistpoty: both!
<sistpoty> ok :)
 * Laney will grep it up
<sistpoty> different question at everyone: the current list where motu-release delegates power is http://paste.ubuntu.com/117858/... is s.th there outdated/do we need more delegations?
 * sistpoty admits to have lost oversight over derivatives
<ScottK> sistpoty: There's a wiki page somewhere.
 * ScottK doesn't recall where
 * sistpoty checks google
<vorian> Laney: http://paste.ubuntu.com/117866/
<Laney> vorian: I found a similar one on the wiki, thanks
<Laney> (will that cd line work with pbuilder-dist?)
 * sistpoty gets angry at the wiki for *not* hiding what he looks for
<sistpoty> erm. for *hiding*
<nhandler> Do we have any real policy about what types of packages can be added to the repositories? Somebody uploaded a meta package to REVU that simply installs all of the packages they like to use. I would love to be able to point them to some wiki page that explains what types of packages are appropriate instead of just archiving the upload
<sistpoty> nhandler: I assume meta-packages are reserved for derivatives (now don't ask me what derivatives are... as I'd appreciate a pointer myself on this *g*)
<sistpoty> nhandler: but in general: package w.o. files in a binary package -> reject
<nhandler> sistpoty: Did you send a message before "nhandler: but in general: packages w.o. files in a binary package -> reject"?
<sistpoty> nhandler: yep...
<sistpoty> nhandler: I assume meta-packages are reserved for derivatives (now don't ask me what derivatives are... as I'd appreciate a pointer myself on this *g*)
<ScottK> I think there's a general requirement that a package be potentially interesting/useful to a range of people.
<nhandler> sistpoty: Is there actual policy saying that? Or is it more of an unwritten policy?
<ScottK> George's favorites isn't in that catagory.
<ScottK> nhandler: The other option is to just choose to ignore it.
<ScottK> In 6 days, it's not a concern for months.
<sistpoty> nhandler: binaries w.o. files -> archive admins choice (and I recall rejects for it). derivatives allowed meta-packages: no written policy AFAIK. So no, there's nothing written... at least to my knowledge
<sistpoty> nhandler: but maybe debian policy nowadays says s.th. about binaries w.o. files
 * slytherin plans to upload a package which pulls all java packages. :-P
<savvas> java-splatter
<sistpoty> haha
<savvas> :)
<slytherin> actually it is a long term plan. I am going to create a jubuntu-desktop package. :-D
<sistpoty> slytherin: I guess you should first find out how to get a derivative accepted (and then tell me where the *.....* list of official derivatives is *g*)
<savvas> in a long term plan, I see Sun acquiring slytherin :)
<maxb> "binaries without files" .... even a metapackage needs a changelog, though?
<slytherin> savvas: I wish
<sistpoty> maxb: I mean w.o. files as in "/usr/share/doc/<package>/<common_files> excluded"
<savvas> maxb: I think you can link one changelog for all the resulting binaries, I'm not sure though
<ScottK> We have metapackages for derivatives that are not built out of the official build system.
<sistpoty> maxb: otherwise it couldn't even enter the archive (e.g. w.o. changelog.Debian.gz or copyright()
<ScottK> So I don't think there is a list of official derivatives.
<ScottK> Ichthux and Ubuntu Muslim Edition are two I know of.
<savvas> metapackages derived from dummy packages, right?
<sistpoty> ScottK: that's the term found on ubuntu.com.... not my idea :P
<ScottK> OK.
 * directhex starts work on zoroastrian edition
<ScottK> We have Ubuntu, Ubuntu Server, Kubuntu, Xubuntu, Mythbuntu, and Ubuntu Studio that do their CD images out of the Canonical infrastructure (plus MID, netbook remix, etc).
 * sistpoty starts to wonder if motu-release needs greater power to reject wherever MOTU packages want to go where no other MOTU packager went before *g*
<ScottK> Those are all definitely 'official' for most any definition of official you'd want to pick.
<ScottK> sistpoty: I think for New packages we can leave that to the archive admins.
<sistpoty> hehe
<ScottK> Where MOTU release, I believe, may need to weigh in is on stuff they'd never see.
<sistpoty> as in new upstream versions uploaded w.o. ack?
<sistpoty> ScottK: do we care about linking against openssl w.r.t GPL-2+ in ubuntu?
<sistpoty> (i.e. w.o. exception)
<ScottK> I think we do.
<ScottK> I've certainly downchecked packages for it on REVU.
<sistpoty> ScottK: ok, then fqterm is out
<sistpoty> is Brendt Wohlberg <osspkg@gmail.com> around?
#ubuntu-motu 2009-02-14
 * sistpoty goes to bed... gn8 everyone
<Laney> "# If the package does not have a packaging system and the patch is small, you can modify the source. It is an Ubuntu goal to keep diffs with Debian small and so if modifying the source makes a smaller diff than adding a patch system you should generally modify the source. " Oh really?
<nhandler> Laney: This caused a big discussion on the mailing lists a couple of months ago
<Laney> must have missed that one
<nhandler> I'll try and find it. One second
<nhandler> Laney: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-motu/2008-August/004426.html
<Laney> thanks
<slicer> Hi. Can someone start a rebuild of mumble-1.1.7-1? It failed on a number of platforms (basically everything but i386, amd64 and lpia) due to dependency errors, but I just got my hands on a powerpc machine and built it successfully in pbuilder.
<dolanor> HAPPY 1234567890 everyone !!
<DktrKranz> slicer, which ports do you want to give-back?
<slicer> DktrKranz: Err.. Under the assumption "give-back" means "have the build daemons try it once more", all of them but i386, amd64 and lpia.
<DktrKranz> slicer, give-back is exactly that
<slicer> DktrKranz: If they still fail, I don't know what's wrong, as they complain about "libqt4-dev: Depends: xlibmesa-gl-dev but it is not going to be installed or libgl-dev", but the same build worked just now in a pbuilder on powerpc (which was the first arch that failed).
<DktrKranz> given-back on failed ports, let's see what happens now
<slicer> DktrKranz: Thanks :)
<DktrKranz> you're welcome
<DktrKranz> james_w, do you plan to process some NEW during your a-a duties? There are gnome-desktop-sharp2 binary NEW which I'd like to see in the archives soon.
<vorian> nellery: root-system is at 5.18.00-2.3 on debian if you want to look at your merge again
<Laney> vorian: What do you think to bug #306592? Do we want to make this change?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 306592 in plasmoid-weather "plasmoid-weather displays incorrect temperature" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/306592
<Laney> (iirc you are a kubuntu kinda guy)
 * vorian looks
<nellery> vorian: Must've just been uploaded, I'll update it
<nellery> thanks
<vorian> Laney: yes, BUT
<vorian> it's now known as plasma-widget-weather
<ScottK> slicer and DktrKranz: That's not going to work on ia64, sparc, or hppa.  Should be OK on powerpc though.
<vorian> nellery: no problem, I HATE it when that happens :)
<nhandler> vorian: Should we invalidate the plasmoid-* bug reports and file them against plasma-widget-* ?
<ScottK> nhandler: Just change the package.
<vorian> nhandler: well, we could just rename it
<vorian> there is a valid SRU update that can be used in the same bug report
<slicer> ScottK: Ok? Why won't it work on ia64, sparc and hppa?
<nhandler> scottk: That is what I meant.
<Laney> it's not a valid SRU debdiff
<ScottK> Because the qt4-x11 version is older than the -dev package (which is built on 1386)
<Laney> He's done it as a backport
<ScottK> Until yesterday mesa was broken on all those archs.
<ScottK> I'm working on getting them rebuilt, but it needs doing in a certain order.
<vorian> ScottK: which ones have the base-stack done?
<ScottK> armel and lpia are fully up to date.
 * vorian checks recent uploads
<slicer> ScottK: Aha :) That explains why my pbuilder worked, that was updated less than an hour ago. And I guess you fixed powerpc already?
<ScottK> Yes
<ScottK> power pc has all the central node packages built for KDE.
<ScottK> Many of the leaf packages are still un queue to get rebult.
<vorian> ScottK: can you press this button then https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/soprano/2.2.1+dfsg-0ubuntu1/+build/866511
<ScottK> qt4-x11 on sparc is caught in some kind of soyuz induced groundhog day situation on artigas (just builds it over and over).
<vorian> :)
<ScottK> Looking
<ScottK> mesa is built now on ia64 and I think qt4-x11.
<ScottK> It's a mess.
<ScottK> vorian: Did librdf and mysql get built and did they finish before the last publisher run?
<slicer> ScottK: Would it be possible to have the builders postpone building a package if something it Build-Depends: on is already in the build queue (or otherwise "out of date")?
<vorian> ScottK: both are fully built on all archs
<ScottK> vorian: Mashed the button.
<vorian> excellent
<ScottK> slicer: If a build-dep is missing, it will go into a dep wait status.
<ScottK> slicer: but if the build-dep is uninstallable (as is the case here - the -dev package is the build-dep and its version mismatches with the arch specific main package) it fails the build.
<ScottK> So I think this is a bug.
<ScottK> Others consider it a feature, I'm not quite sure why.
<slicer> ScottK: Ah, ok. Because when a build fails on an arch I don't have access too, I feel I'm on really thin ice when it comes to figuring out why it failed.
<ScottK> For uninstallable build-dep like this one you can look and see when it's caught up and then ask to have it tried again.
<ScottK> If it fails in the middle of compiling, that's different.
<Laney> asomething: Lintian error on your quick-lounge-applet update: quick-lounge-applet source: build-depends-on-x-metapackage build-depends: xorg-dev
<ScottK> slicer: If you look in the kubuntu-devel ML archive, you'll see a couple of recent mails from me on this.
<maxb> qt4-x11 on artigas looks like it's succeeded this time :-)
<slicer> ScottK: Ok. Thanks for clearing this up :)
<ScottK> maxb: Cycled back to needs building.
<ScottK> Wait, nevermind
<ScottK> maxb: Sure enough.  Third time's the charm I guess.
<ScottK> vorian and slicer: Now the trick for sparc then is that the publisher runs at 3 minutes after the hour.  Sometime shortly after that, the package should be available to build against.
<vorian> fantastico
<vorian> :)
<vorian> Laney: i went ahead and adjusted the package name/version to get it into jaunty
<Laney> vorian: That's cool, nice one
<ScottK> slicer and vorian: Also remember that if you do a retry and it fails, the person that uploaded it gets mail in their inbox.  Don't blindly retry stuff you didn't upload.
<lidaobing> is sistpoty here? can you help recheck http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/fqterm, thanks
<vorian> ScottK: i uploaded soprano
<vorian> plus we'll need it for other goodness to build
<ScottK> vorian: You packaged it.  Your sponsor uploaded it.  They'll get mail too.
<vorian> ah, yes
<ScottK> But that was just a general comment and we aren't blindly retrying it.  You checked that the needed things were built.
<lidaobing> Hello, who can help review http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/fqterm ? thanks.
<vorian> lidaobing: what's it do?
<lidaobing> vorian, a BBS client
<lidaobing> vorian, BBS is still widely used in Mainland China, Taiwan and other places.
<lidaobing> vorian, for example, ptt.cc has more than 100k people online (at the same time).
<vorian> yowzer
<ScottK> power pc is down to just over 200 binaries out of date.  It was almost 500 two days ago.
<lidaobing> vorian, and ptt.cc does not belongs to any company, it is maintained by several students.
<maxb> ScottK: where do those numbers come from, ooi? (people.ubuntu.com/~ubuntu-archive/testing-ports/ says 355 main 1 restricted 364 universe 26 multiverse)
<vorian> lidaobing: i see no "credits" file
<ScottK> http://people.ubuntu.com/~ubuntu-archive/testing-ports/jaunty_outdate.html at the bottom.
<ScottK> maxb: ^^^
<vorian> lidaobing: nevermind
<lidaobing> vorian, in res/credits, and it will be installed to the same directory with copyright after install :-)
<vorian> lidaobing: don't you think it would be better to just add the authours to the debian/copyright?
<vorian> authors, even
<maxb> oh,right. The script generating the _all.txt variant must not be cronned as often
<lidaobing> vorian, I don't think credits is not copyright holder
<lidaobing> vorian, it's like "THANKS" file
<lidaobing> vorian, I don't think credits IS copyright holder
<lidaobing> vorian, some of them update the po file (many package does not add translator to copyright file)
<vorian> i didn't say contributors
<vorian> the credits file lists the authors
<lidaobing> vorian, no the fqterm said fqterm is copyright by fqterm development group, not individual authors
<lidaobing> vorian, just like gcc is copyrighted by FSF, not authors
<ScottK> lidaobing: I think I remember someone mentioning earlier that fqterm links against openssl and is GPL.
<ScottK> Is that correct?
<lidaobing> ScottK, yes, then they change the license
<lidaobing> ScottK, wait a minute, I can find out the bug number
<ScottK> What's the license now?'
<ScottK> vorian: You know what the problem with that is, right?
<vorian> the license included in the source is plain old GPL2
<lidaobing> ScottK, http://code.google.com/p/fqterm/issues/detail?id=165, it's in Chinese, by maybe google translation can help you.
<ScottK> That's a fail then.
<vorian> ScottK: opensll? nope - but I have a feeling i'll soon be smarter
<ScottK> vorian: Does the package license have the openssl exception like shown in that bug?
<lidaobing> ScottK, yes, in the end of LICENSE file
<asomething> Laney: ya, I saw that, but if you look at the changelog xorg-dev was specifically added in 2.12.4-0ubuntu2 by DktrKranz to fix a FTBFS. Should I add an over-ride?
<ScottK> OK.  If it has the openssl exception, then it's OK.
<vorian> it does indeed
<ScottK> vorian: Generally any code you link against has to be compatibly licensed.
<ScottK> OK.  Then that's OK now.
<vorian> the package is otherwise perfect
<ScottK> GPL code linking against openssl is a common mistake, but we can't allow it in the archive without the exception.
<lidaobing> ScottK, yes, it depends on libqt4, which has a openssl exception too
<ScottK> Sounds fine then.
<lidaobing> ScottK, total depends of fqterm:  libc6 (>= 2.4), libgcc1 (>= 1:4.1.1), libqt4-network (>= 4.4.3), libqt4-script (>= 4.4.3), libqtcore4 (>= 4.4.3), libqtgui4 (>= 4.4.3), libssl0.9.8 (>= 0.9.8f-5), libstdc++6 (>= 4.1.1)
<ScottK> lidaobing: Has it been tested with qt 4.5?
<lidaobing> ScottK, only qt 4.4 has been tested
<ScottK> We will probably go to 4.5 for Jaunty although it's not decided for sure.
<ScottK> OK.  I'd suggest testing with 4.5 sooner rather than later.
<lidaobing> ScottK, where can I find a qt 4.5 ubuntu repos? I don't want to build from source
<ScottK> That won't block archive inclusion, but if you've got 4.5 compatibility problems....
<lidaobing> ScottK, like ppa
<ScottK> ~roderick-greening
<lidaobing> thanks
<ScottK> His ppa.
<Laney> asomething: Have a look at `aptitude show xorg-dev'. I doubt that was the right thing to build-depend on. It'd be good if you could find the correct subset of those -dev packages that are needed to get it to build
<Laney> asomething: Especially read the note in the package description
<Laney> this is a good time to fix the mistake
<asomething> Laney: will do
<Laney> thanks
<lidaobing> vorian, thanks
<vorian> lidaobing: no, thank you for your contribution
<lidaobing> vorian, :-)
<asomething> Laney: I just tried building quick-lounge-applet without the xorg-dev build-dep, and it built fine in a jaunty pbuilder without it. New diff.gz attached to bug Bug #309529
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 309529 in netbook-launcher "Rebuild for libgnome-desktop-2-7 -> libgnome-desktop-2-11 transition (reversenbs) " [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/309529
<Laney> asomething: Does it work?
<asomething> I'm on a intrepid box right now, so I can't actually test it. Some time latter tonight I can get on Jaunty
<Laney> OK well I am going to bed soon
<Laney> I can have another look tomorrow
<asomething> cool
<quadrispro> jdong: hi, could you add me to ubuntu-backporters?
<pochu> how can I report a bug in GMail? :)
<RAOF> pochu: In gmail, or from gmail?  One's (near) impossible, the other's merely annoying.
<pochu> (in)
<RainCT> Hey pochu
<directhex> hm, looks like boycott novell is planning a shocking expose on corrupt ubuntu developers closing bugs about removing mono without acting upon them
<RainCT> o.O
<mok0> directhex: url?
<directhex> mok0, reading yesterday's irc logs
<directhex> mok0, http://boycottnovell.com/2009/02/14/irc-log-13022009-1/#tFeb%2013%2016:52:31
<mok0> directhex: thanks!
<directhex> mok0, before doing anything, be sure to consider occam's razor and hanlon's razor, in that order
<mok0> directhex: oh, I just want to read it
<directhex> mok0, be careful the stupid doesn't avalance & crush you
<mok0> directhex: I guess you remember I'm no mono fan ;-)
<directhex> mok0, which is your prerogative. but don't fall into the trap of believing that site has any credibility, the way you couldn't ally yourself with jack "disbarred for life for gross misconduct" thompson if you felt videogames are a bit too violent
<tuxmaniac> directhex: :)
<mok0> heh
<mok0> I've never seen the site before
<directhex> lucky you. it's where most anti-mono stuff tends to link back to. a world where "reality" is a microsoft shill
<mok0> directhex: my anti-mono stance comes from my own thinking, so I wasn't indoctrinated by anyone
<directhex> mok0, which is why i don't point at you and call you an idiot. i have the utmost respect for anti-mono sentiment from intelligent human beings, but there are none to be found on that site
<mok0> directhex: heh, well they are a bit conspiratorial in their discussion, aren't they?
<mok0> A decision has been made to include mono in Debian and Ubuntu, that's basically it, so closing those bugs is natural.
<mok0> I just think it makes us vulnerable to actions MS might take, that's why I think the inclusion is a bad idea
<directhex> perhaps. but i'd say our "supports more than vorbis and theora" ffmpeg is a much bigger danger
<directhex> and even then, the "no patents at all on theora & vorbis" thing is naive - patent trolls & broken patent systems are designed to attack "safe" things
<mok0> Didn't canonical purchase a license to distribute those technologies?
<directhex> no. have you seen the price?
<mok0> no
<directhex> mok0, just mp3 playback costs $0.75 per app. $2.50-$5 for encoding.
<directhex> mpeg2 or others are FAR more
<mok0> yuck
<directhex> fluendo will sell you licensed codecs, and the gstreamer "install codecs" window has a button to do so
<directhex> â¬16 for wma and wmv, â¬16 for mpeg2 and mpeg4, â¬28 for both the above plus h264, aac. they bundle mp3 decoding for free.
<mok0> h264 is free I think
<directhex> mpeg-la would disagree
<mok0> Isn't h264 Apple's technology? I thought they decided to let everyone use it for free
<directhex> free for <100k users
<directhex> $20 per unit for 100-200k users
<directhex> $0.20, even
<directhex> $0.10 for >200k
<mok0> wicked
<mok0> Stupid way to make money
<directhex> don't look at me, i just report the facts
 * mok0 hugs directhex 
<directhex> now, here's the funny thing. you know the â¬16 licensed wma/wmv codecs from fluendo?
<mok0> err well no but you just told me about them
<directhex> there's a company who will give you licensed wma/wmv/mp3 codecs free of charge
<mok0> what's the catch?
<directhex> they're licensed only for use in a web browser, i.e. not for desktop apps
<mok0> so you can just make your mp3 app contain a webbrowser
<mok0> distribute your mp3's from a webserver on localhost
<directhex> that could work. or you could use fluendo's free licensed mp3 decoder (gstreamer0.10-fluendo-mp3 package). or ignore the patent & just use your favourite app
<directhex> free as in price, mind
<mok0> Right
<directhex> short version: media sucks ^_^
<mok0> I agree
<mok0> TBH, I am a sucker, I purchase or rent DVDs and watch them on my dvdplayer
<directhex> but if you want to do it "legit", then mpeg-la need to get paid. which means either fluendo (free for mp3, paid for others), or the mysterious benefactors covering mp3 & ms codecs in a web browser context
<mok0> I also purchase CDs, rip them for mp3s
<directhex> i'm sure you've guessed who the latter are by now
<mok0> Google?
<directhex> http://ossguy.com/moonlight/microsoft_media_pack_eula.xhtml
<mok0> Ha!
<pochu> hi RainCT :)
<mok0> Novell again huh
<directhex> mok0, MS are the ones paying the fees, but essentially
<directhex> silverlight-media-pack-linux-x64-5-1.so
<directhex> now, i don't actually USE it. i just build against ffmpeg and damn the patenta
<directhex> but it's a funny old world
<Tonio_> mok0: thanks for the kcometen4 revu, uploading including the lintian override.
<mok0> directhex: it is
<mok0> Tonio_: great!
 * Tonio_ doesn't like to override btw ;)
<directhex> mok0, my aim is not to tell you steve ballmer is a big fluffy teddy bear. it's to tell you it's a funny old world :)
<Tonio_> but that's a 3 years ago long debate, so.... time to change the inhabits :)
<mok0> Tonio_: It makes sense to use it when Lintian reports something you can't fix
<mok0> or wont, for a reason
<Tonio_> mok0: ho sure, nevermind, just that a couple of years ago, people most of the time suggested not to override, and I had to change that once, hehe :)
<directhex> mok0, but (big but) i think it's a reasonable sign that attacks against mono aren't currently considered a worthwhile avenue of revenue generation by some in power in MS - considering they're actively paying for people to have codecs in moonlight
<mok0> Tonio_: There are automated Lintian reports made on all packages, and for the sake of the sanity of those, it's good to exclude bogus lintian errors that the packager "knows about"
<mok0> Tonio_: ... but I always run lintian with -o :-)
<Tonio_> mok0: :)
<Tonio_> mok0: it's also true that the number of tests lintian performs right now is at least the double....
<mok0> Tonio_: so, when an automated lintian report will be made on your package, you don't need to be embarassed for not including a watch file :-)
<james_w> DktrKranz: I can do binary NEW for sure.
<Tonio_> mok0: point ! :)
<mok0> Tonio_: that said, we need to come up with a watch file concept that works for VCSs
<Tonio_> mok0: concerning skrooge, upstream is gonna fix, last udate still had the /usr/lib no soname issue, btw
<mok0> Tonio_: I'm not settled on the question if it's a blocker
<Tonio_> it'll be fixed before FF, so it's fair...
<DktrKranz> james_w, cool! If you could manage gnome-desktop-sharp2, that would be great :)
<mok0> Tonio_: Sure, otherwise, plz get a second opinion from someone in the kubuntu team
<mok0> Tonio_: it'd be cool to get it in jaunty
<directhex> yes, g-d-s2 please
<directhex> part of the messy "our ABI sucks. let's break it!" from upstream
<directhex> worse, "our API sucks too"
<Tonio_> mok0: hum, I know the kubuntu guys, they won't accept it with the soname issue :)
<mok0> Tonio_: ok
<mok0> Tonio_: that was my inclination too
<Tonio_> mok0: well, eventually if that was a critical app, like k3b for example... but since that one is really optional...
<mok0> Tonio_: Right
<Tonio_> k3b would have given: ping upstream and upload, since we really have to replace our old kde3 version
<mok0> Tonio_: Although the kubuntu team is really working hard to make jaunty shine
 * Tonio_ notices he still has to split out the k3blibs package for multiverse deps...
<Tonio_> mok0: I am too, hehe
<mok0> Tonio_: thumbs up to you!
<Tonio_> mok0: and we'll make it, believe me !
<mok0> 1Tonio_: as a kubuntu user I salute you
<Tonio_> mok0: and if you're still interested in revuing my packages : http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/frescobaldi
<Tonio_> mok0: the manpage was written especially for you, hehe
<mok0> Tonio_: heh
<Tonio_> mok0: /me hugs mok0 for being a kubuntu user
<Tonio_> oups... I still lhave to get used to quassel, it seems
 * directhex installs libqyoto4.3-cil on mok0 
<mok0> Tonio_: ah, nice!
<sebner> directhex: waah, gtk# ftw! :P
<mok0> directhex: ouch! that hurt :-P
<Tonio_> mok0: pain to write the deps, since that's python and using cmake, not pycentral...
<mok0> Tonio_: uh-uh
<Tonio_> mok0: but I think it should be okay..
<mok0> Tonio_: I'll  take a look sometime today
<directhex> sebner, it would be nice to see some decent mono apps gain "native" qt frontends. meebey designed his irc client to be able to do so, for example
<sebner> directhex: I know but sebner just can't tolerate kde/qt :P
<directhex> sebner, well, don't blame you on that ;)
<sebner> hehe
<DktrKranz> hoi sebner !
<sebner> DktrKranz: !
<mok0> Tonio_: aren't you s'posed to use lists and stuff for lists when you use the docbook dtd?
<Tonio_> mok0: you mean ?
<Tonio_> mok0: well I usually write docbook files by hand (vim rules...) and honnestly I'm not an expert in the docbook format
<Tonio_> mok0: if you have suggestions to make that a better way, please say !
<Tonio_> mok0: as you have understand, man page for desktop apps isn't for me a priority, but I'll make an effort ! ;)
<mok0> Tonio_: well you have some lists in the page with "*" and "-" bullets, that will look awful if someone typesets the manpage for the printer
<Tonio_> hum, true, that
 * Tonio_ reads manpages with konqueror, so didn't figure out :)
<mok0> Tonio_: just being picky :-)
<Tonio_> mok0: know about a good docbook editor (gui prefered), on that point ?
<mok0> Tonio_: no I don't. I think docbook is a blemish on the face of the planet, myself
 * Tonio_ searches for a good editor
<mok0> <reply>Why<interrobang /> <statement>you might say it's impossible to read</statement></reply>
 * RainCT finds the source of hand-written roff manpages easier to read than docbook ones
<mok0> .SH me too
<mok0> :)
<geser> james_w, ScottK: just read your mail on the MOTU ml, what do you propose for the pending sync requests so we don't pull in possibly unwanted changes from Debian unstable because of bad timing?
<RainCT> uhm.. svn.debian.org is timing out here :S
 * mok0 thought the point of the FF was to limit the number of uploads after that date, not before...
<RainCT> is it down or does it just hate me? :P
<mok0> RainCT: it's _not_ down...
<DktrKranz> mok0, I'm inclined to think about FF some days before of it, just to make sure I'm not rushing too much
<geser> mok0: but we don't want to start possible transitions now because the flood gates open in Debian again and we sync it from unstable
<mok0> geser: true
<mok0> In fact, there are loads of silly sync requests sitting in the uuc queue
<mok0> already
<Laney> don't be afraid to reject them!
<mok0> Laney: well it takes time to reject them... I just ignore them...
<Laney> but then someone else has to spend time looking at it
<mok0> Laney: we can just mass-reject them after FF
<mok0> Laney: but otherwise... point taken
<DktrKranz> if there are silly ones, just remove u-u-s with a rationale behind it
<directhex> accept them if they're from me :<
<Laney> we should try to get to any good ones before FF
<mok0> DktrKranz: yes, that's an option.
<Laney> actually, I don't see a reason to do mass rejections
<Laney> either we should upload now if they're good (+ new features), reject now if they're bad
<Laney> and bugfix uploads are still OK
<DktrKranz> Laney, I proposed a possible workaround: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-motu/2009-February/005432.html
<Laney> yep, that's good
<Laney> mass rejecting bugs just because we didn't get round to sponsoring is *not* good
<geser> I usually ask the reporter why it should be synced now if it's not obvious from changelog or bug description
<Laney> sounds fair
<mok0> The problem is that sync-requests are not automatically closed when auto-sync resumes
<Laney> but there shouldn't be any outstanding sync requests at that time
<Laney> they should have either been done or closed
<Tonio_> mok0: fixing the manpage using docbook templates...
<DktrKranz> ugh, queue is 74 packages long! :(
<Laney> it was much worse than that ;)
<DktrKranz> really?
<geser> Laney: it's still possible to sync after FF, but either is has to be the same upstream version or a exception was granted
<Laney> I know
<mok0> Tonio_: amazing
<geser> it was over 130 a few days ago
<Laney> so if it's not valid then we reject => off the sponsors radar
<DktrKranz> OMG!
<Laney> or accept => off the sponsors radar
<DktrKranz> if no-one objects, I'll have a run at queue and tag bugs with a "ff-aware" tag
<iulian> DktrKranz: Please go ahead.
 * DktrKranz will be back in a couple of hours
<iulian> I will have a look at the queue later on as well.
<DktrKranz> iulian, 9.04-pre-ff sounds good?
<iulian> DktrKranz: Yes.
<Tonio_> mok0: should fit what you expect now, uploaded on revu and available in a couple of minutes.
<mok0> Tonio_: thanks!
 * Tonio_ will become what he never wanted to be: a manpage expert... ^^
<Laney> wtf is the MOTU reviewers team?
<mok0> directhex: are you dealing with the moonlight sync?
<directhex> mok0, define "dealing with". i'm not a motu, but it's my request
<mok0> directhex: It's finished?
<mok0> ah
<Laney> it should be good to upload
<directhex> mok0, #329376
<Laney> check out the epic copyright file
<directhex> meebey wrote the epic copyright file
<directhex> and counts as an advocate, since he submitted to debian NEW
<directhex> and it's only epic due to embedded copies of pixman & cairo
<james_w> DktrKranz, directhex: why is libgnomeprint2.18-cil_2.24.0-1ubuntu1_all.deb?
<james_w> I mean, why "_all"?
<directhex> james_w, should it not be? generally speaking, pure mono packages (i.e. ones containing only c#) are fully cross-platform
<james_w> directhex: just querying as the other new binary is any
<james_w> gnome-panel
<directhex> james_w, mono packages are only non-all if they contain some C (e.g. C helper libs) or if they contain poorly-handled wrappers around variable-size system types. if you want to check, look at the package contents - if there's a .so, any is right, if there's only dll, then all is right
<directhex> make sense?
<james_w> thanks, accepted
<Laney> james_w: what do you think about the snes9express removal? I want to recommend getting it done in Debian (along with getting the new emulator packaged there too)
<james_w> Laney: I'm not sure, as I haven't really looked at it. If you think it's a good idea then go ahead
<Laney> right
<Laney> same for the NES ones too
<ScottK> geser: I think as long as people are aware and have due consideration it is suffiicent.
<danielm> Hi, good evening.
<danielm> If i need a MOTU to review a package-update, i need to subscribe 'universe sponsors' and just wait.. right?
<jpds> danielm: Yes.
<danielm> ok, thanks
<quadrispro> mok0: ping
<dolanor> not a ubuntu-motu question, but how can I get a cloak ?
<dolanor> on freenode
<Laney> check the freenode website
<jpds> dolanor: Make sure you've setup your nick as per http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#nicksetup and ask in #freenode for a cloak.
<_16aR_> ok jpds, thanks :)
<ScottK2> mok0: pyproj uploaded, so I've started.
<DktrKranz> james_w, thanks!
<mok0> ScottK: thanks a bunch
<mok0> quadrispro: pong
<ScottK> mok0: Thank you that package was definitely it good shape.
<mok0> ScottK: yeah we worked hard on that one
 * ScottK is currently waiting to see if threats to killfile someone are effective on -devel-discuss.
<loic-m> -devel-discuss has been a spamlist lately
<ScottK> The discussion has not been very helpful.
<loic-m> with both the C-A-B and another one i can't remember now
<loic-m> I had to spend my time deleting emails (like 20 times a day)
<loic-m> And there was indeed no point, plus there was the same discussion month ago, and that should have been over with
<mok0> Hey cool I won a cash prize of â¬600.000 and a brand new Toyota Prius
<ScottK> Yep.
<ScottK> I think the decision not to include a GUI preference for re-enabling c-a-b is a bit bizarre, but then I use KDE, not Gnome.
<loic-m> -thunderbird needs the ability to blacklist a whole thread
<loic-m> ScottK: AFAIK there's xorg-options-configurator
<ScottK> loic-m: It didn't make it.
<ScottK> And the alternative to provide an option in another context was rejected.
<loic-m> I just got an update from the blueprint today. Only the new interface didn't make it AFAIU
<ScottK> I see.
<ScottK> Withouth the new interface how do you change c-a-b?
<loic-m> "2009-02-13 bryce: Uploaded to universe for Jaunty."
<loic-m> ScottK: AFAIU it's the interface makeover that's on hold for J+1, the app should still come with one
<ScottK> OK.  We'll see.
<loic-m> tseliot, can you correct me if I'm wrong?
<loic-m> xorg-option-editor should be the name, we just have to wait till it gets in the repos
<loic-m> Oh yeah, the other oh so useful discussion was going from 2.6.28 to 2.6.29 just like 5 days before FF ;)
<tseliot> loic-m: yes, it was uploaded yesterday but the current UI is not final
<tseliot> s/final/very good as regards usability/
<loic-m> tseliot thanks a lot. Is the name "xorg-options-editor"? I tried the one on your ppa, but the jaunty repos doesn't show it yet
<tseliot> loic-m: the one you tried wasn't the final release. Let me see if I can find it
<loic-m> As for usability, the Don't zap option was easy to set up last time I tried, and didn't blow up my xorg.conf
<tseliot> loic-m: I can't find it right now. You can simply type "dontzap --disable" to do it from the command line
<ScottK> tseliot: So there's still not gui for it in Gnome?
<tseliot> ScottK: bryce wrote that it uploaded that package to universe
<tseliot> (yesterday)
<ScottK> So there's a package in Universe you can install if you want a GUI way to reenable c-a-b in Gnome.  Is that right?
<quadrispro> ScottK: hi! how can I advocate packages in REVU?
<ScottK> quadrispro: You just got MOTU, right?
<quadrispro> it seems I'm logged in as contributor
<quadrispro> ScottK: yes :)
<tseliot> ScottK: yes, it's not as immediate as the one for Kubuntu as it's more general purpose
<_16ar_> quadrispro: Hello
<ScottK> You need a revu admin to change you.
<iulian> quadrispro: Talk to RainCT_.
<quadrispro> ah thanks!
<quadrispro> _16ar_: hi
<_16ar_> quadrispro: I have a question about debhelper version and debian/compat
<ScottK> tseliot: I see.  Is there a K/Q U/I for the configurator too?
<quadrispro> iulian: anyway, I would upload a package which looks good
<tseliot> ScottK: no, not yet
<_16ar_> debhelper version may be incompatible with the compat version, no ?
<loic-m> tseliot: thanks for looking
<tseliot> np
<quadrispro> _16ar_: can you send me an email? I'm going away in 3-4 minutes :)
<quadrispro> iulian: can I write a comment ("advocating") then upload it?
<iulian> quadrispro: Sure.
<iulian> quadrispro: Does it have two advocates?
<quadrispro> iulian: thanks, anyway I'll leave a message to RainCT_
<ScottK> tseliot: Are you still planning it?
<quadrispro> iulian: I'm giving the second vote
<iulian> quadrispro: Ah-ha, go ahead then.
<iulian> And congratulations. ;)
<ScottK> quadrispro: I think it's quite reasonable for you to comment 'advocating' and upload.
<quadrispro> ScottK: just done, uploading now (http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?upid=5115)
<tseliot> ScottK: maybe. I worked on that patch for Kubuntu because I wasn't sure as to whether the KDE ui for xorg-options-editor could be ready in time for Jaunty
<ScottK> quadrispro: For your comment on cairo-dock-plugins, I would just change it an upload if that's the only issue you found.
<ScottK> tseliot: Personally I think if it only misses FF a bit an FFe for such a thing would be reasonable.
<RainCT_> quadrispro, iulian: yes?
<tseliot> ScottK: the problem is that I lack the time to do it. But I should have more after Jaunty's release
<ScottK> tseliot: I see.  OK.
<ScottK> tseliot: Thanks for the KDE patch.
<quadrispro> ScottK: eh.. I'm not sure if it was the only issues, I should find the time to check better
<tseliot> ScottK: you're welcome ;)
<ScottK> quadrispro: Would you?
<ScottK> quadrispro: You've already partly reviewed it, so I'd rather spend my time on another package.
<RainCT> quadrispro: ok, you're reviewer now
<quadrispro> eh ScottK, at the moment I have to go away :)
<quadrispro> RainCT: thank you ;)
<quadrispro> see you soon
<quadrispro> bye!
<RainCT> I've also changed Laney and didrocks to Reviewer. If you have commented possitively on some package don't forget to add an advocation to the comment so that it does't pull it into "needs work"
<Laney> thanks
<Laney> RainCT: Could this be made automated by checking for ubuntu-dev membership on LP?
<ScottK> Laney: Are you doing some package review?
<Laney> no
<Laney> I'm on u-u-s
<ScottK> OK
<ScottK> Laney: At this point, it's probably best to leave anything that's bugfix until after FF and focus on stuff that would need an FFe if it's not done before.
<RainCT> damn screen.. why does it die if I make the window small? -.-
<Laney> probably a good idea
<Laney> RainCT: bug?
 * Laney tries
<Laney> made mine 5x3 and it didn't die
<RainCT> it says "suddenly the dungeon collapses and you die" and then dies, happened already several times -.-
<iulian> It's working fine here.
<RainCT> grr
<RainCT> try with Terminator, moving the separator slide so that screen has 0x0 px
<didrocks> RainCT: thx :)
<RainCT> To iulian or whoever asked about automatically making MOTUs reviewers, yes, this is on my TODO. I have started writing a script (well, it's basically nothing yet :P), if someone feels like finishing it please poke me
<jpds> Laney: ^
 * Laney refrains from poking
<iulian> It wasn't me.  But yeah, that sounds good.
<Laney> but good
<RainCT> it should be pretty trivial.. (if nobody steps up I may even finish it myself later today/tomorrow)
 * Laney cuddles interdiff
 * RainCT deletes bzr-pager because it makes "bzr status" slow :/
<Tonio_> Adri2000: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/frescobaldi http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/socnetv
<Adri2000> Tonio_: not that I have a lot of spare time, but I'll try to take a look :)
<Tonio_> Adri2000: socnetv revu should be quick
<Tonio_> Adri2000: frescobaldi is a bit longuer though, since that's a python one
<Adri2000> nothing kde-ish I hope? :p
<Laney> is $(...) a bashism?
<RainCT> Laney: nope
<Laney> good
<Tonio_> Adri2000: all kde/qt, of course :)
<Laney> oh hey, it's your script RainCT ;)
<Laney> qtparted-root
<RainCT> Laney: you can try it out yourself, just enter a terminal and type "sh" :)
<RainCT> heh
<RainCT> Laney: That's an old one.. :). Is there some problem with it?
<Adri2000> Tonio_: ;s
<Laney> RainCT: Just uploading a fix to it
<Tonio_> Adri2000: socnetv is a pure qt app, not related to kde, btw :)
<Laney> bug 257220 if you care
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 257220 in qtparted "Qtparted launch error" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/257220
<RainCT> Laney: Uhm, I don't like that script :P. It relies on gnome-panel, which is not necessarily used on all GNOME environments.. And neither on XFCE, etc
<RainCT> and why is it twice in the file? XD
<Laney> heh
<Laney> you wrote it!
 * Tonio_ wonders if qtparted should or not get removed from the archives....
<Laney> is it obsolete?
<Tonio_> Laney: it is unmaintained for years, and in jaunty we'll have partitionmanager, which is a lot better
<Tonio_> Laney: pretty mich, yes
<Tonio_> and unmaintained for.... 4 years at least :)
<Laney> it is orphaned in Debian too
<Tonio_> Laney: I just hope debian will drop it one day :)
<Laney> Tonio_: You can be the one to make this happen!
<directhex> is its replacement qt4?
<Tonio_> Laney: I personaly let debian do the debian job, according to the debian policy, related to the debian archives :)
<Laney> heh
<Tonio_> directhex: it is kde4 replacement, yes, not qt4
<RainCT> Btw, is there some more policykit usage, in Jaunty, or still only the core GNOME apps?
<Tonio_> Laney: not that I don't want too, but they have different archives policy that I don't know about specially, and ubuntu is already a lot of work, btw..
<Tonio_> Laney: and I don't think debian has partitionmanager since they don't have kde4 in stable right now
<ScottK> Tonio_: Considering qtparted is actively dangerous in some respects I think removal in Ubuntu might be quite a reasonable thing to d.
<pochu> RainCT: apt-cache rdepends libpolkit2 ;)
<Tonio_> Laney: so they'll probably keep it until kde4 reaches the archives
<RainCT> pochu: I'm not on Jaunty :)
<Tonio_> ScottK: I'm not archive admin, but my opinion would be to get rid of it :)
<directhex> RainCT, sudo DIST=jaunty pbuilder login
<Laney> Tonio_: ok then
<Laney> Tonio_: You are a MOTU, right? Then you can have packages removed
<RainCT> directhex: uhm, right :P.   /me runs  cowbuilder-jaunty login
<ScottK> Tonio_: Then file a bug and subscribe the archive.  Need to say source and binary package names and say it has no rdepends (make this true first if it's not).
<Tonio_> Laney: I'm core-dev, but to blacklist a package from the debian sync requires archive admin I guess
<Laney> yeah
<Laney> but you can make this happen
<RainCT> Tonio_: file a bug and ask for removal + blacklisting
<Tonio_> yup, doing this right now :)
<RainCT> I don't see any new policykit usage.. :(
<RainCT> When will they finally have the python bindings done? at the end I'll have to write some myself :P
<directhex> RainCT, are there cil bindings? ^_^
<RainCT> directhex: doesn't look so
<directhex> :(
<directhex> :<
<RainCT> Afaik you can still use it through D-Bus, but.. Who wants to use D-Bus? :P
<Tonio_> ScottK: bug 329439
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 329439 in qtparted "QtParted should be removed from the archives" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/329439
<mok0> Uhm, we were talking about major transitions earlier today... just noticed that python2.6 hit the build queue...
<ScottK> Tonio_: I marked it confirmed, but you could have too.
<ScottK> mok0: Yep.
<Tonio_> ScottK: a confirmation shouldn't be added by the reported right ? ^^
<ScottK> Tonio_: For process bugs like this it's fine.
<mok0> ScottK: isn't that a bit late? We'll have hundreds of python packages to check
<ScottK> mok0: I want to argue with you slightly about sybmbols files including the debian revision.
<RainCT> mok0: the default is still python2.5, I think
<mok0> ScottK: alright, go ahead
<ScottK> mok0: For a new package I agree, but patches can introduce symbol changes, so I don't think it's generally correct.
<mok0> ScottK: oh, that would be highly irregular for a patch to do that
<ScottK> The Debian gensymbols tools generate files with the revision included and I think it's somewhat pointless to remove them by hand.
<ScottK> mok0: I've seen it happen.
<mok0> ScottK: yes, and lintian complains about it...
<ScottK> Good point.
<ScottK> Perhaps the lintian maintainers and the dpkg-gensymbols maintainers should talk.
<mok0> ScottK: well, I'll give in to the realities of life...
<mok0> ScottK: perhaps they should :-)
<mok0> ScottK: The idea of having a .symbols file in libraries is in principle a good one, but perhaps the introduction is a bit pre-mature
<ScottK> It's a young technology.
<mok0> Indeed
<ScottK> At this point I think including them is good and eventually we'll figure out what to do with them.
<mok0> ScottK: exactly. I advise people to include it, it's easier to do it right away than if we have to go back sometime and fix all the packages that don't have it
<ScottK> RainCT and mok0: There is still some intent to go for Python 2.6 as default.
<ScottK> There's a spec about this.
<RainCT> ScottK: Is there a 2.6 package for Intrepid available?
<mok0> ScottK: Oh, well then we know what to do after FF ;-)
<ScottK> In a PPA some where.
<mok0> RainCT: building as we speak
<ScottK> mok0: Intrepid.
<ScottK> doko also promises Python 3 support in pycentral.
<mok0> ah intrepid
<RainCT> doko: is your PPA safe? :P
<mok0> I for one is looking forward to playing with "Python 3000"
<RainCT> mok0: I see it's in his ppa :)
 * ScottK plans to do it all in chroot.
 * mok0 looks
 * RainCT adds it to sources.list
 * RainCT is sat that he couldn't just press an "Enable PPA" button in Launchpad *g*
<RainCT> *sad
 * RainCT hides
<mok0> RainCT: uh-oh it has build failures
<ScottK> There's an ubuntu2 in queue now.
 * RainCT blames the author of python-config for not providing a manpage
<mok0> RainCT: that package didn't go through my reviewing hands...
<RainCT> hehe
 * mok0 is known to uploaders as Mr. Manpage
 * RainCT hugs mok0 
 * mok0 hugs RainCT  back
<mok0> Maybe I'm just too much of a CLI guy and not one of these pointy-clicky types
<RainCT> uhm.. now why did I install python2.6 if I have no modules compatible with it anyway? :P
<mok0> RainCT: ... rebuild the modules?
<mok0> RainCT: are you installing it on spooky :-P
<RainCT> Doesn't work, I guess I need a newer pycentral/pysupport
<RainCT> lol
<mok0> Is it acceptable to upload a package which depends on another package in the new queue?
<RainCT> RFF (Request for Feedback :)): Who should be able to add/remove tags to packages on REVU?
<mok0> RainCT:  motus
<Laney> what are tags used for?
<RainCT> Laney: nothing :)
<mok0> Laney: yet
<Laney> alright, what will they be for?
<Laney> will there be a static list?
<mok0> there should be
<mok0> Laney: one uses would be to tag it for particular Ubuntu teams
<Laney> reviewers then
<Laney> unless, hmm
<Laney> if it's a kind of triaging, then maybe the bug squad might like to help
<mok0> Laney: copyright-checked, copyright-undetermined
<mok0> fast-track
<mok0> python, mono, c++
<mok0> stuff like that?
<ScottK> Laney: I don't think bugsquad is at all suited.
<Laney> I don't know if I like the idea of the copyright ones, but the rest are reasonable
<Laney> ScottK: Probably not, was just a though
<Laney> t
<RainCT> Okay, I'll allow it to Reviewers and Moderators then
<mok0> Laney: perhaps, it came out of a discussion RainCT  and I had about a step of triaging the copyright of uploaded packages before actual reviewing begins
<mok0> There often are uploads without COPYING files and it would be good to have a way to keep those out of the list until the problem is solved
<Laney> This is just a part of normal reviewing IMO - each package should be taken as a whole
<mok0> I've a few times seen packages with that problem that have gone through several cycles of review/upload. The uploaders become quite frustrated when you tell them that it won't be accepted without the license
<mok0> understandably so
<mok0> Laney: you are right of course, but in the heat of battle, reviewer do forget to check everything
<Laney> we should get to this problem sooner then
<AndrewGee> Hey all. Any MOTUs available to review my package, gpxviewer? It's an application that allows users to look at GPS traces files in GPX format. Thanks :) http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=gpxviewer
<Laney> educating reviewers and uploaders to check copyright basics first
<Laney> AndrewGee: Did I see this on planet recently?
<AndrewGee> Laney: Yeah. Probably :)
<mok0> Laney: I suggested a separate step for copyright checks before reviews, and then rainct proposed the tag idea
<Turl> hi, can you help me with some lintian warnings? I'm new to packaging
<mok0> Laney: just throwing ideas around
<RainCT> And a more technical question, my first idea was to store them in a varchar (in the form "tag1;tag2;tag3;" in the SourcePackages table). Is this reasonable or does someone see some reason why having two new tables instead (tid|tag, tid|usid)?
<Laney> mok0: Don't use a database like that :(
<RainCT> * would be better?
<Laney> RainCT: *
<mok0> RainCT: just store sid, text
<mok0> RainCT: or sid, tagid
<Laney> mok0: I can see the problem happening the other way round with this copyright step
<mok0> RainCT: then you can have as many keywords as you like on a source package
<RainCT> mok0: uhm right, one new table would be enough (sid|tag, for everything else we have GROUP BY :))
<Laney> people ping upload for changes
<Laney> upstream*
<Laney> and then we decide we don't want the package after all
<Laney> but maybe that will be more rare
<RainCT> mok0: the amount of keyboards isn't really a problem.. I checked and with VARCHAR(255) I could get around 50 tags to fit
<mok0> Laney: yes, that's true
<RainCT> *keywoards XD
<mok0> RainCT: :-D
<Turl> how can I check if I can remove export DH_COMPAT=4 safely?
<mok0> RainCT: but it's much simpler to scan a table for sid's
<ScottK> Turl: If you have the file debian/compat and it has a number 4 or higher in it.
<RainCT> Turl: You can. "export DH_COMPAT" is deprecated, create a file called debian/compat with content "4" isntad
<RainCT> *instead
<Turl> thanks ScottK, RainCT :)
 * mok0 thinks compat should be a field in rules  O:) 
<RainCT> mok0: But it requires an additional query in details.py. It will probably simplify other stuff later, though, so I think I'll go with it :)
 * ScottK thinks put your Debian hat on and have a flamewar about it there.
<mok0> ScottK: Perhaps now is a good time, when everyone is worked up and happy after celebrating Lenny's release
<RainCT> mok0: I agree, but perhaps they will get angry at you because debian/control is requried by policy but debhelper is not :P
<ScottK> Well I think they moved from debian/rules to debian/compat for some reason.
<sebner> mok0: yeah, good idea. have an extra file just for one number in it ... :D
<mok0> sebner: :-)
<Laney> makes it easy for dh to parse it
<mok0> sebner: another two-byte file
<sebner> ehehe
<mok0> Laney: AFAIK debelper knows how to parse control :-)
<Laney> ah control
<Laney> you said rules ;)
<RainCT> cat|grep|cut (or cat|awk)
<RainCT> isn't that difficuly to get a value from debian/control
<mok0> I did :-/ I meant control of course
<mok0> A field in control
<Laney> yes, very easy to do it there
<mok0> Laney: it definitely does _not_ belong in rules
<Turl> now, a binary lacks its own manpage :/. but its mentioned on the main binary manpage. Lintian says I can make a symlink, how?
<Laney> Turl: use dh_link
<Laney> man dh_link
<Turl> Laney: which package is it in?
<RainCT> Laney: debhelper
<Turl> I don't seem to have it installed :/
<Laney> debhelper
<RainCT> err, Turl :)
<Turl> stupid me, I installed devscripts and not devhelper after reinstalling Jaunty :p
<Turl> dh_link usr/share/man/man1/proxychains.1 usr/share/man/man1/proxyresolv.1
<Turl> would that be ok?
<iulian> That should do it.
<Laney> I prefer to make a package.links file, but that's right too
<Turl> another one, FSSTND-dir-in-usr usr/etc/
<RainCT> Turl: config files go to /etc,  not /usr/etc
<Turl> how can I change that RainCT?
<Turl> in debian/rules I guess?
<RainCT> Turl: yes, using mv in debian/rules is usally the easiest way
<RainCT> Turl: but don't forget to patch any file referring to /usr/etc so that it looks in /etc
<sebner> Turl: and squashing upstream :P
<Turl> upstream is quite dead :p
<RainCT> (you can do this with a normal patch or using sed in debian/rules, but if you do the later don't forget to revert the change in clean:)
<Laney> #
<Laney> If there are Ubuntu changes apart from debian/changelog or if FeatureFreeze is in effect:
<Laney> * A copy of the entries from debian/changelog corresponding to the changes relative to the current version in Ubuntu
<Laney> Anyone object to removing the first line of that?
<Laney> (from w.u.c)
<Turl> can I use a normal patch with quilt RainCT?
<RainCT> Turl: sure
<sebner> quilt \o/
<Laney> sebner: can you look at the moon upload?
<Laney> btw how was service this week?!
<RainCT> mok0: suggestions on where to show the tags in details.py are welcome :P
<RainCT> below "subscribers:" was my first idea, but if I want to convert the tags list into an input it looks ugly there
<_16ar_> mok0: I have put the Debian GPL2 information in X-Comment now, I'm sorry I misguided quadrispro
<dolanor> 3
<mok0> ScottK: I've been trying to dist-upgrade my home intrepid box to jaunty, but I get the following conflict:
<mok0> ... got any ideas on how to solve that?
<dolanor> (oops)
<sebner> Laney: it was ok since we had theoretic lessons mostly ... next week will be a little more tougher :\ , moon upload?
<ScottK> mok0: What conflict?
<Laney> bug 329376
<RainCT> mok0: which conflict?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 329376 in ubuntu "[sync from Debian NEW] moonlight" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/329376
<mok0> ScottK:  ugh it started with a / so IRC ate it
<Adri2000> is it possible a request a FFe before FF and before the upstream version is out? :p
<mok0>  /var/cache/apt/archives/kde-window-manager-4%3a4.2.0-0ubuntu4_i386.deb is trying to overwrite /usr/share/kde4/apps/kconf-update/plasma-add-shortcut-to-menu.upd which is also in package kdebase-workspace-data
<sebner> Laney: ahaha! with more feeling
<Laney> moonlight is sexy and we want it!
<ScottK> mok0: Let me look into it.
<sebner> Adri2000: well, ask motu-release folks! :D
<sebner> Laney: pfff beta, tell directhex to update to final and sync/upload that stuff :P
<Laney> it is final
<Laney> check the version number
<ScottK> mok0: Looks like a missing conflicts/replaces.  It should be safe to force it.
<ScottK> Adri2000: You can always ask.
<sebner> Laney: aha! I was wondering
<Laney> heh
<Adri2000> ScottK: actually the situation is: there is a new version upstream with new features, but I don't want to upload it now because there are known bugs. these bugs will be fixed in the next version (which will be bugfix only) probably released just after FF. what should I do?
<sebner> Laney: BTW! just wondering .. you are MOTU now ^^
<mok0> ScottK: ok, thanks
<Laney> sebner: Yeah but I did a sync from NEW yesterday ;)
<sebner> Laney: and?
<ScottK> Adri2000: When is the bugfix release expected?
<Laney> wanted to share the joy with you
 * Laney is sponsoring other things atm
<sebner> Laney: heh, well ... it's approved by meebey right? I'll look at it and upload it later then if you are fine with that?
<Laney> yep
<Adri2000> ScottK: the rc is out since yesterday, and upstream told me final is expected 6-7 days later
 * pochu waves at sebner 
<ScottK> Adri2000: Is the RC the known buggy one?
 * sebner hugs pochu :D
 * pochu hugs sebner back :)
<sebner> Laney: good boys also attach the .dsc file :P
<Laney> nahhhh
<Laney> you actually look at that?
<Adri2000> ScottK: nope, the previous stable release is the buggy one. that rc should fix the known bugs
<sebner> Laney: hm?
<RainCT> sebner: if you're talking about a new upstream version, you're supposed to download
<ScottK> Adri2000: I'd upload the RC then.
<Laney> sebner: Apply the diff to an empty directory and then run the get-orig-source
<RainCT> * the .orig.tar.gz yourself to ensure that it wasn't modified, so a .dsc wouldn't make anything easier anyway
<Laney> then you can make the dsc
<sebner> Laney: I know, me is just lazy
<sebner> :P
<sebner> RainCT: dget :P
<Laney> naughty
<Laney> you need more military service
<Laney> they haven't disciplined you yet!
<RainCT> hehe
<ScottK> sebner: It's not funny.  It's a potential security risk.  If you take a tarball from a non-developer it breaches the chain of trust.
 * directhex flings betas @ sebner 
<sebner> ScottK: of course it is. At least if the uploaders are unknown to me
<sebner> directhex: ahahaha!
<sebner> Laney: NAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
<Laney> wow
<Laney> even more javascript on edge
<ScottK> sebner: If the uploaders need sponsoring, it's a security risk.  You may trust them, but Ubuntu has not chosen to.
<RainCT> Laney: where?
<pochu> Laney: Launchpad 3.0 will switch from Python to JS
<Laney> RainCT: bug titles
<directhex> (use get-orig-source then)
<RainCT> Laney: in links?
<Turl> pochu: JS... on the server? :p
<Laney> RainCT: No, editing bug titles
 * Laney likes this not reloading business
<RainCT> Laney: oh, for projects too :)
<sebner> ScottK: understood :)
<pochu> Turl: hola emilio :)
<Adri2000> ScottK: given that I'm the co-maintainer of that package in debian, I wanted to package it in debian and then sync. I'm not sure debian wants me to upload a rc and a few days later the final, just because of ubuntu FF :p
<RainCT> if they only got ride of that evil red thingie :P
<Turl> hola pochu :)
<RainCT> uhm.. now ScottK will kill me for saying "evil" :)
<pochu> Turl: s/emilio/tocayo/ ;)
<ScottK> Adri2000: Particularly not right in the post-lenny rush.
<ScottK> Adri2000: I'd upload the RC here and then sync the final from Debian when ready.
<directhex> sebner, that's why there's a get-orig-source rule on moon, if it bothers you
<ScottK> RainCT: That particular individual has a history of being obnoxious.
<ScottK> And yes, he didn't get and I will killfile him now.
<Turl> asi que te llamas emilio tambien pochu? :p
<directhex> ScottK, obnoxious people? on the internet? :o
<Adri2000> ScottK: yep, that's a good idea
<ScottK> Well they're welcome to be obnoxious, but I'm not obligated to listen.
 * RainCT gets ride of the "reset" button in REVU's comment form
<k0p> folks when is the freeze features of ubuntu 9.04?
<RainCT> k0p: this tuesday, iirc
<ScottK> The 19th
<k0p> :-/
<k0p> ok
<k0p> thanks anyway
<RainCT> ah, so thursday
<k0p> yeap
<Turl> guys, where should I put the mv command in debian/rules?
<Turl> I need it to move a config file
<geser> Turl: where is it currently and where do you want it?
<RainCT> Do non-CDBS packages have a "install" target?
<geser> yes
<Turl> geser: its on /usr/etc/proxychains.conf and need it on /etc/proxychains
<RainCT> then in the "install" target, Turl
<Turl> any specific point RainCT?
<imbrandon> r
<Laney> s
<geser> t
<imbrandon> lol
<Turl> u
<RainCT> o.O
<jpds> v
<Nafallo> g
<RainCT> c
<DktrKranz> l
<RainCT> (key next to G using Dvorak :P.. and no, I don't use Dvorak yet :P)
<sebner> schalalalala!
<sebner> !OT
<ubottu> #ubuntu is the Ubuntu support channel, for all Ubuntu-related support questions. Please use #ubuntu-offtopic for other topics. Thanks!
<jpds> What a jammy bunch we are.
<RainCT> :9
<RainCT> * :)
<DktrKranz> a bit of crazyness between some uploads...
<sebner> Laney: /me is wondering if I should eliminate the only lintian warning: W: moon source: dh-clean-k-is-deprecated
<ScottK> sebner: You should.
<sebner> DktrKranz: before Debian release! :D
<Laney> sebner: Why not? Do it in SVN too
<sebner> Laney: /me supposed Debian folks are lintian clean :P
<sebner> ScottK: as you wish master =)
<Laney> probably running an older lintian
<Laney> that one is pretty new afaik
<DktrKranz> sebner, yeah!
<sebner> Laney: kk
<sebner> DktrKranz: and then "penetrate" all the good stuff into ubuntu before FF ^^
<Turl> what paths should I use in the mv in the install target in my debian/rules in my deb package of proxychains? :)
<Turl> (to move the config file I talked earlier about)
<RainCT> Turl: $(CURDIR)/<pkgname>/usr/etc  $(CURDIR)/<pkgname>/etc
<DktrKranz> sebner, mmmmm
<Turl> thanks RainCT
<RainCT> where <pkgname> is the name of the binary package
<RainCT> you're weÃ±come
<RainCT> *welcome
<Turl> RainCT: spanish too?
 * RainCT can't type anymore since he uses the laptop :P
<RainCT> Turl: Catalan :)
<Turl> well, near
<sebner> DktrKranz: bad idea?
<DktrKranz> sebner, look at ubuntu-motu ML :)
<Turl> next one, non-dev-pkg-with-shlib-symlink usr/lib/libproxychains.so.3.0.0 usr/lib/libproxychains.so
<Turl> any thought on that one?
<sebner> DktrKranz: ah that mail about the Debian release and the FF? I think I hardly read the content :P
<RainCT> Turl: btw, of you run  lintian -iI *.changes  you'll get more details
<Turl> it's not a development library afaik
<Turl> RainCT: I have the details :p
<Turl> but idk what to do, as it isn't a devel library, afaik proxychains loads it on everything you "proxychain" so it uses the proxy
<Turl> can I omit it?
<ScottK> sebner: Uploads done immediately post-release in Debian are not famous for being well considered.  Do be careful.
<sebner> ScottK: I know, It was more like a joke (I think I matured in that case) .. besides I only have inet access on weekends :(
<ScottK> sebner: OK.
<Turl> any idea how can I easily fix ancient-libtool ltconfig?
<dolanor> Any MOTU available to revu/advocate my hexdiff package ? Tool to visually see differences in hexadecimal between files : http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/hexdiff
<ScottK> Turl: Easily no.  Google relibtoolize
<Turl> ok ScottK
<ScottK> mok0: Fixed in bzr, so it'll be in the next upload.  The conflicts/replaces we there, just not correctly versioned.
<mok0> ScottK: good to hear... btw my system upgrade worked and I now have a working KDE4.2! Woot!
<ScottK> mok0: Excellent.
<mok0> ScottK: the only thing I've discovered so far that's not working is my TV tuner card
 * ScottK looks at the kernel then ....
<dolanor> mok0: kde 4.2 under ubuntu 8.10 ?
<mok0> dolanor: no unfortunately... 9.04
<ScottK> dolanor: There are experimental packages for 8.10 in the kubuntu-experimental PPA.  Use at your own risk.
<mok0> I tried those a few weeks ago and hosed my intrepid system...
<ScottK> Hmm.  The only issue I know of with them is with plasma stuff that didn't get rebuilt?
<mok0> I honestly can't remember the details, as I recall I could find no way to log in
<ScottK> That doesn't sound promising.
<mok0> I didn't have a lot of patience that day
<ScottK> Understand.
<Turl> ScottK, I think I'll leave the relibtoolize for a far, far future :p
<Turl> fixed everything but it
<ScottK> As I said, no easy way.
<dolanor> mok0: I've fixed the debian/copyright problem with the X-Comment, if you could look at it ^^'
<_16aR_> mok0: Thanks for advocation :)
<_16aR_> (don't know if advocation is english, though ^^)
 * RainCT realizes that he has never used Ajax, but AHAH :P
<mok0> _16aR_: errr... what package?
<mok0> RainCT: it's the big fad these days
<_16aR_> need 1 more advocate on hexdiff package, utility to visually see differences between 2 files in hexadecimal : http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/hexdiff
<mok0> _16aR_: ah, new nick?
<dolanor_> Sorry mok0 :)
<RainCT> mok0: yeah, that's why REVU is getting it :P
<dolanor_> yes, I use both of them on IRC
<Turl> RainCT: AHAH? I'm a web dev, and never heard that :p
<mok0> dolanor_: the current one is easier to type
<mok0> dolanor_: the other one sounds like a password
<dolanor_> Yes, the problem is I can't begin IRC name with number ...
<mok0> what's wrong with starting with a letteR?
<RainCT> Turl: Me neither (until now :P). Seems like it is what Ajax is called when you directly use the data received from the server (ie, it's not XML/JSON/whatever, which you have to parse, but directly text or HTML)
<dolanor_> no that's just a wordplay in french
<RainCT> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AHAH
<Turl> cool RainCT. So I have been using a new technology without even knowing its name? :p
<RainCT> hehe
<Turl> anyway, that's quite unstandard :p
<Turl> unless you use mootools' Request.HTML and then use DOM to insert it, but as that can be considered to be client-side parsing, it's AJAX again. what a dilema :p
<dolanor_> 16 is pronounced : sayze (http://swac-collections.org/index.php?page=snd_info&idx=259281), and ar is pronounced : are == Cesar in french
<dolanor_> mok0: the problem is to begin with 1, for 16aR. So I need to begin with another char. I choosed _
<Turl> so in the end, it means you're 16-yo?
<dolanor_> yes
<dolanor_> and I'm packaging hotbabe :p
<Turl> well, I'm 16-yo too :p
<Turl> dolanor_: I won't be able to use your package, my cpu is always idle :(
<dolanor_> install folding@home :p
<Turl> I might install it on my old pentium3
<Turl> :p
<Turl> they don't work OK on jaunty, they rise the CPU clock even with schedtool :/
<Turl> and cpu @ 2Ghz = burnt laptop :p
<dolanor_> In fact
<dolanor_> my f@h let the clock a 1Ghz on intrepid
<Turl> I used to run them, but I can't anymore
<Turl> btw dolanor_, the package you're making is already on medibuntu :P
<Turl> and it has a little note on the end of the description: "This package is in Medibuntu because of its explicit content."
<dolanor_> what package ? hexdiff ?
<dolanor_> you're kidding ? :(
<dolanor_> ah no hotbabe
<dolanor_> I was joking :)
<dolanor_> I know it isn't in ubuntu, and that's sad :/
<Turl> cool. the new f-spot package wants to delete half my system :p
<Laney> Turl: Pastebin the output please
<ScottK> It's a feature.  Gnome doesn't want to confuse you with too many choices.
<dolanor_> lol
<sebner> gnome!!!!!
<sebner> even linus switched to it
<sebner> he knows what's good :P
<Laney> to, and from, and to
 * Laney is tempted to try xfce
<Turl> Laney: http://dl.getdropbox.com/u/553461/Pantallazo.png
<DktrKranz> Turl, work in progress (tm) ;)
<Turl> Laney: xfce is good, but isn't as featured as GNOME
<Laney> Turl: Er, that looks right to me
<Laney> how is that half your system?
<Turl> tomboy, what's doing tomboy there :p
<Laney> tomboy isn't transitioned yet
<Turl> Laney: it's a way of saying
<Laney> i thought it was something serious :(
<Turl> Laney: the other day, for example, updating apt-get required to delete ubuntu-desktop, network manager, a bunch of gnome apps, ...
<Turl> waiting solved it :p
<Laney> this is what you get for running the dev release
<Laney> all good fun!
<Turl> so, should I install this f-spot thing? I can wait, I haven't ever launched it :p
<Laney> it's a good application
<DktrKranz> ubuntu hasn't bugs. we introduce some just to have something to fix
 * Turl still wonders why does ubuntu bring tomboy. it's crap :p
<Laney> how is it crap?
<blueyed> Where can I get previous Debian packages for "experimental"? (I want to have a patch between the current version in experimental and the previous one, for merging into Ubunu)
<Turl> blueyed: on debian packages page I guess? try packages.debian.org
<Laney> I don't think snapshots does exp, does it?
<blueyed> no, Laney.
<blueyed> Turl: there's only the current version on e.g. http://packages.debian.org/experimental/virtualbox-ose
<ScottK> blueyed: If the package is maintained in a VCS, that's probably your best bet.
<blueyed> ScottK: it is, and I've thought about it, but would be nicer to have the "real release".
<geser> blueyed: try google, perhaps it's still on some slow mirror
<blueyed> how does MoM handle it? does it keep the old releases to create the patches?
<ScottK> I think that's the only place you're likely to find it unless geser's low mirror theory works.
<ScottK> blueyed: MoM doesn't look at experimental.
<blueyed> ScottK: yes.. but does it use snapshots for unstable?
<ScottK> I don't think so.
<ScottK> I think it just uses whatever is current.
<txwikinger> Is slocate substituted by mlocate in jaunty ?
<geser> wasn't it already done in intrepid?
<txwikinger> well.. could be :D
<geser> http://packages.ubuntu.com/intrepid/ubuntu-standard lists mlocate as recommended
<RainCT> guuuuuys.. REVU has tags now! :)
<RainCT> (well, you can set them, but they aren't useful for anything yet :P)
<txwikinger> well.. slocate does not install... I think I should change my dependency
<AndrewGee> Hey all. Any MOTUs available to review my package, gpxviewer? It's an application that allows users to look at GPS traces files in GPX format. Thanks :) http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=gpxviewer
<c_korn> hello, I try to make scilab ready for universe: http://pastebin.com/d7a1bb1e1 what dies binNMUable mean?
<directhex> c_korn, it's a debianism
<directhex> c_korn, essentially, on debian, you can upload binaries to the archive (on ubuntu you can only upload source). so if you have an arch-all package like libfoo which depends on an arch-any package like libfoo-native, then someone uploads a new binary version of libfoo, then there's no guarantees that libfoo-native will match up if the version numbers fall out of sync
<directhex> it's a bit messy
<c_korn> hm, ok
<c_korn> which linitian warnings/errors should I fix?
<Laney> c_korn: Have you spoken to the science team about thsi?
<Laney> it would be better if you could do the update with them
<c_korn> I am in contact to the sylvestre ledru who maintains the package in debian-science
<c_korn> -to +with -the
<Laney> cool
<Laney> can you do the update in their VCS
<Laney> ?
<c_korn> unfortunately not
<Laney> why so?
<c_korn> I can mail him the changes that would be required.
<dolanor_> need 1 more advocate on hexdiff package, utility to visually see differences between 2 files in hexadecimal : http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/hexdiff
<Laney> c_korn: It would be ideal if you could hang out in their IRC channel and do the changes directly in Debian
<Laney> then both distros benefit
<c_korn> ok. btw. is there actually a chance for scilab-5.1 to come in jaunty? https://bugs.launchpad.net/debian/+source/scilab/+bug/272264
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 272264 in scilab "Please sync scilab-5.1 (multiverse) from PPA" [Wishlist,Confirmed]
<c_korn> there is fop and jeuclid missing
<c_korn> jeuclid is in the debian queue
<c_korn> the debian developers are busy because of the new release.
<c_korn> so I don't think it will come out of the queue before jauntys FF
<loic-m> I'm not at home these days, and i can't for the life of me remember where I got the script to have pbuilder-jaunty-i386, pbuilder-intrepid-amd64, etc...
<loic-m> I've googled for a while and looked at the MOTU wiki, but with no success
<directhex> loic-m, a pbuilderrc on the wiki?
<Laney> loic-m: pbuilder-dist
<loic-m> something like that, yes
<Laney> in ubuntu-dev-tools
<loic-m> ok, thanks a lot Laney
<RainCT> loic-m: if you're in Intrepid get the version from intrepid-backports, pbuilder-dist there has been highly improved (that is, rewritten in Python :P)
<RainCT> (and unlike what it may seem, the Python version is actually faster than the previous Bash one)
<loic-m> RainCT: thanks. Since I had to make a USB disk install to use Ubuntu, I went for Jaunty, but I'll remember that when I'm on my computer again
 * directhex runs RainCT in ironpython
<RainCT> :/
<Laney> the version in jaunty has it too
<RainCT> what's actually the point for ironpython?
<directhex> RainCT, python syntax w/ access to all mono libs
<directhex> RainCT, .net's designed to be multi-language
<RainCT> (omg.. have you seen the guy complaining about ctrl+alt+backspace being removed because this way he can't know if the login screen is real...? o_O!!)
<RainCT> what's actually the point for .net?
<RainCT> ^^
<Pici> (well thats certainly original)
<RainCT> hehe
<directhex> RainCT, like i said, it's a question of multi-languageness. you can write a library in ironpython, and one in vb.net, and use them in your c# app without knowing the difference. there's also ironscheme & ironruby... hell, boo & nemerle. and java, through ikvm
<directhex> RainCT, rather than the usual "to use a lib in any language, gotta write in c" thing made of suck
<RainCT> ah, nice concept
<RainCT> but.. isn't that slow as hell?
<directhex> RainCT, that's the "cil" part of the package names. "common intermediate language" is the bytecode that *all* .net languages compile to - and once it's in that form, the original language is irrelevant
<directhex> RainCT, compared to what?
<pochu> to C :)
<RainCT> directhex: running interpreters for like 5 different languages for a single app
<RainCT> or are they all first compiled to that bytecode you just mentioned?
<directhex> RainCT, everything is compiled to cil. once there, it's JITted on execution.
<RainCT> OK, makes sense. Thx
<directhex> pochu, compared to c, yes, it's usually slower. i wouldn't write a computationally intensive piece of code in c#. or python, or java, or etc etc etc
<Turl> how was the sponsors group named in launchpad?
<RainCT> Turl: ubuntu-{universe,main}-sponsors
<Turl> thanks RainCT :)
<Turl> subscribed them, hope they update proxychains now
<RainCT> Alright, REVU has a tag cloud and you can filter the index using a tag
<RainCT> And it's now also possible to see both archived and unarchived packages at once, or only archived updated packages, etc.. with updated={true,false,both} and archived={true,false,both} in the URL
<RainCT> (tag filters from the tag cloud default to show new and updated packages which are unarchived, but you can override this using what I've just told + tag=<tag name>)
<RainCT> nhandler, mok0 ^
<mok0> RainCT: /me looks
<dolanor_> mok0: is there konversation in Qt4 in kde4.2 now ?
<mok0> dolanor_: I think the new IRC client is quassel
<ScottK> dolanor: The kde4 Konversation is not released yet.
<ScottK> Konversation (the KDE3 version) is still on the Kubuntu dvd, but it not the default IRC client anymore.
<mok0> RainCT: "Number of tags: 0" :-)
<pochu> talking about IRC, anyone using irssi and ignoring JOINS/QUITS/PARTS? If so, how do you do to not read the whole screen when you switch channels? Now that I ignore those, sometimes I start to read a few lines before the last message and then I realize that was written some hours before...
<pochu> since without joins/quits everything is together :) perhaps some sort of "red line" as XChat has marking the last lines you read (i.e. where was the channel when you switched to another window)
<dolanor_> by the way, does a jabber chat/conference for ubuntu somewhere ?
<RainCT> mok0: I've send a mail about this to ubuntu-motu@
<c_korn> is there a command to install the build-depends when I am in a chroot?
<RainCT> c_korn: apt-get build-dep <pkgname>
<mok0> RainCT: nice!
<c_korn> ehm, I want to build a package in a chroot? but manually because I know it will fail at some point.
 * mok0 likes
<c_korn> -? +.
<RainCT> mok0: :)
<RainCT> c_korn: use --bindmounts to get the package's source into the chroot and then build it normally.. dpkg-buildpackage
<c_korn> dpkg-checkbuilddeps: Unmet build dependencies: ...
<c_korn> I want to install those dependencies
<RainCT> dolanor_: http://brainstorm.ubuntu.com/idea/18041/ :)
<dolanor_> I was wondering, does it exists some apt-get/aptitude command to download every .deb for 1 package except for the base package ?
<dolanor_> hÃ©hÃ©, thanks RainCT :)
<RainCT> c_korn: as I said,  apt-get build-deps, or if the package is new (so that apt doesn't know them):    sudo /usr/lib/pbuilder/pbuilder-satisfydepends
<dolanor_> that's one of his cool usage :)
<RainCT> c_korn: (outside the chroot, or there if you install ubuntu-dev-tools, you can use get-build-deps)
<RainCT> dolanor_: get-build-deps, but it will install them
<Laney> c_korn: are you using pbuilder?
<c_korn> no
<Laney> You can set up a pbuilder hook that will drop you into a shell...
<Laney> ok
<Laney> never mind!
<c_korn> get-build-deps just output some text:  -> Creating pbuilder-satisfydepends-dummy package
<c_korn> I just want to have the build dependencies in debian/control installed so I can run debian/rules build
<RainCT> c_korn: and it doesn't install them?
<RainCT> get-build-deps is a wrapper around pbuilder-satisfydepends-dummy which is the application used by pbuilder to install the dependencies
<c_korn> http://pastebin.com/dc7b8b06
<mok0> c_korn: I uploaded jeuclid today
<c_korn> mok0: upload? where did you upload it to?
<Laney> RainCT: broken control parser? ;)
<c_korn> sorry, I am new to this ubuntu package upstream things ;P
<mok0> c_korn: ubuntu archive
<RainCT> c_korn: can you paste the debian/control file too?
<c_korn> http://pastebin.com/d825a6fc
<c_korn> mok0: ok. can you update the bug report please? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/326179
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 326179 in Ubuntu Jaunty "Please sync jeuclid 3.1.4 from debian-science" [Wishlist,New]
<c_korn> I need to know the status of jeuclid for scilab
<nhandler> RainCT: I like the new tags. Would it be possible to automatically set certain tags on packages?
<mok0> c_korn: it's still in the new queue
<c_korn> hm, ok
<RainCT> nhandler: everything is possible :)
<mok0> c_korn: fortunately turn-around time in the new queue is not Debianish 8 weeks
<RainCT> + patches are welcome ^^
<nhandler> RainCT: I'll try. But as you probably saw from my last attemp, my python is pretty bad
<c_korn> I am installing the dependencies manually now
<RainCT> mok0: pbuilder-sat.. fails to parse the #
<RainCT> are they even allowed by policy?
<mok0> RainCT: you mean in control files?
<dolanor_> RainCT: yes, but I think get-build-deps will only take the non-already installed package, right ?
<dolanor_> I was meaning taking the whole dependency tree without the base package since it is already in every ubuntu
<dolanor_> the goal : I have an offline server, I want to install some new package without getting every .deb by hand, and verifying dependencies myself
<RainCT> mok0: yes
<RainCT> dolanor_: perhaps you can create a download script with Synaptic
<dolanor_> I want to package some game ... But it needs 1 library. But in the upstream package, it packages the dependency and build it ... Do I need to create a lib package for the dependency ? It is a static library right now
<mok0> I've occasionally seen fields commented out with '#'s, it works that way
<RainCT> mok0: so we should fix pbuilder?
<loic-m> Laney: ping
<Laney> hi
<loic-m> Laney: did you try to build e-uae i386 on an amd64 OS?
<Laney> yep
<Laney> i386 pbuilder
<loic-m> I think that's the problem ;)
<Laney> how so?
<loic-m> your error message has "asm" in it
<loic-m> It builds fine on an i386 OS using pbuilder
<Laney> does it build on real i386 hardware?
<Laney> right
<Laney> can you upload to a PPA to convince me? :)
<loic-m> I'm not home, and I didn't take my key with me on my external HD
<loic-m> I'm on holidays atm
<Laney> hm
<loic-m> The problem is the same with Jaunty e-uae packages already
<mok0> RainCT: I'm fading, let's discuss pbuilder tomorrow
<dolanor_> need 1 more advocate on hexdiff package, utility to visually see differences between 2 files in hexadecimal : http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/hexdiff
<mok0> Of course we all read diffs in hex,  ascii is for sissys
<mok0> :-)
<Laney> loic-m: I will build on amd64 and trust you then
<loic-m> Laney: Thanks. If you look at the diff, the only change is the addition of a .desktop file, the source is left same as before
<directhex> hex is for sissys
<directhex> octal!
<Laney> loic-m: I know, but I can't upload a broken package
<loic-m> Laney: But I'll upload them to my PPA is the packages haven't entered the repos when I get back home.
<loic-m> Laney: if it can help, I've built the package on a Jaunty i386 pbuilder two times between your post and now, just to make sure, and checked the program run
<dolanor_> mok0: :p
<Laney> loic-m: building
<dolanor_> By the way, why dh_make still suck with XSBC-Original-Maintainer etc
<dolanor_> it should be patch for ubuntu :'(
<loic-m> Laney: Good. On the machine I'm on atm, it takes aaaages
<Laney> loic-m: Uploaded. I just removed a / from /usr/share/applications in your dh_install call
<Laney> thanks for your contribution
<Laney> double thanks for forwarding it to Debian
<loic-m> Laney: thanks a lot
<Laney> rock on \m/
<dolanor_> nobody got an idea for packaging a static lib dependency directly in the game itself ?
<loic-m> Laney: about the / you removed, you mean I should use usr/share/applications instead of /usr/share/applications ?
<Laney> yes, that's right
<Laney> check man dh_install
<loic-m> Laney: thanks, I've learnt something ;)
<RainCT> the CFLAGS stuff in debian/rules can be removed if make isn't used, or?
<Laney> Suite: stable
<Laney> Version: 5.0
<Laney> Codename: lenny
<Laney> !!!
<directhex> ftp://ftp.debian.org/debian/dists/stable/Release
<directhex> :o
 * Laney dist-upgrades
<ia> hello. could you tell me, please, how should looks like line in "install" section of "rules" file, if for installing app in top directory needs to execute script "script.sh install"? I've tried "$(CURDIR)/script.sh install", but it doesn't work.
<RainCT> ia: does it give some error?
<RAOF> Probably it doesn't respect DESTDIR, and you'll need to patch the script.
<RAOF> You want to install to $(CURDIR)/debian/somewhere, rather than /.
<c_korn> someone I spoke with here wanted to compile fop when xmlgraphics-common 1.3.1 is in jaunty. it is in jaunty now and fop should compile now. https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/fop/+bug/326171
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 326171 in fop "Please sync fop-0.95 (universe) from debian experimental" [Wishlist,Incomplete]
<c_korn> bye
#ubuntu-motu 2009-02-15
<ScottK> Dear everyone: Please testbuild before you upload.  I just 'love' it when I see FTBFS that there is no way could ever have worked.
<ScottK> kthnxbye
<directhex> i'm getting better at that!
<dolanor_> (that's so a real pain to find email for the debian/copyright file !!)
<dolanor_> 30 min to find a mail of a developer for 1 .h ... :(
<directhex> dolanor, welcome to debian/copyright
<directhex> please enjoy your stay
<ScottK> directhex: In the case that caused me to save that the uploader had inexplicably added a new patch name to debian/patches/series when all the changes in the revision where in the debian dir (no patch).
<ScottK> So it FTBFS when it couldn't find the non-extant patch.
<dolanor_> directhex: thanks ^^'
<ScottK> There is no way in God's green Earth that was test built.
<ScottK> Unfortunately Daniel Hahler lives in +0100, so I imagine he uploaded and went to bed.
<ScottK> If you see him, let him know I want that 15 minutes of my life back.
 * ScottK steps off the soap box.
 * Laney snoops
 * directhex burns soapbox for warmth
 * directhex also wonders the chances of a motu in the UK having an intel core i7 processor
<Laney> Good god, how can I still *never* remember to run update-maintainer?
<Laney> also, how does my housemate not understand that running your torrents at full upstream is not a good idea?
 * Laney mutters
<directhex> fire him into the sun?
<directhex> also, bedtime
<Laney> I think I will
<Laney> nn
<dolanor_> and when some people do captcha for email, that's even harder !
<dolanor_> http://www.smilax.org/101
<dolanor_> (love the area code of his)
<ScottK> Laney: This will make your snooping easier: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/22618531/lighttpd_1.4.19-5ubuntu2_1.4.19-5ubuntu3.diff.gz
<dolanor_> but when you see what 123people do, you understand why some become paranoid ...
<Laney> ScottK: Yeah, I found it
<Laney> why test build locally when you have several powerful buildds to do it for you?
<ScottK> Yes, why confine the breakage to your system when you can break the archive.
<ScottK> dolanor: Captcha for email?  You mean like Challenge and Response?
<directhex> ScottK, "click this url and fill in the captcha for your mail to be relayed"
<ScottK> I take stuff like that as a sign they don't actually want mail from me.
<directhex> heh
<directhex> anyway, bed
<dolanor_> ScottK: yes some captcha
<dolanor_> not automatic, though
<dolanor_> You have to understand english to determine his mail or physical address
<dolanor_> hmmm, is the mail in copyright mandatory ? I've search for 30 min for 1 email, and can't find any clue for that ...
<nhandler> dolanor_: I don't think it is mandatory
<dolanor_> nhandler: ok, so i'll skip this one :o
<dolanor_> lucky me, he was the last one
<dolanor_> what is the command to avoid typing gpg password at each debuild ?
<ScottK> dolanor: Install gnupg-agent.
<dolanor_> i have gpg-agent running, is it that ?
<tgm4883> dolanor, I followed this https://help.ubuntu.com/community/KMailGPGAgent
<tgm4883> F me
<tgm4883> dolanor, and by that link, I meant https://help.ubuntu.com/community/GnuPrivacyGuardHowto
<tgm4883> sorry about that
<quadrispro> dolanor_: hi! hexdiff looks good, I'm test-building it now
<dolanor_> sorry quadrispro, I misguided you with X-Comment
<dolanor_> you were right !
<dolanor_> I was too lazy to read the entire RFC :o
<quadrispro> :)
<quadrispro> it builds fine -> http://home.alessiotreglia.com/jaunty/result/hexdiff_0.0.53-0ubuntu1/hexdiff_0.0.53-0ubuntu1.buildlog
<dolanor_> I'm reading it tgm4883, thanks :)
<quadrispro> dolanor_:  there's just a little thing -> I: hexdiff: hyphen-used-as-minus-sign usr/share/man/fr/man1/hexdiff.1.gz:7
<dolanor_> quadrispro: oh, I thought I corrected that one
<dolanor_> hmmmm, that's the original manpage
<dolanor_> I didn't modify it at all
<dolanor_> must I provide a patch ?
<quadrispro> dolanor_: no no
<quadrispro> dolanor_: it's not very important
<dolanor_> tgm4883: hmmm, the pinentry-gtk doesn't work for me
<dolanor_> I can't use the graphical gpg manager of gnome
<quadrispro> dolanor_: the application name is Visual Hexdiff -> http://tboudet.free.fr/hexdiff/
<dolanor_> don't know why ...
<dolanor_> I can't type in
<quadrispro> dolanor_: why upstream doesn't provide the last release?? :-/
<dolanor_> Not sure :) google for it. If you type "visual hexdiff", it find some sites speaking of this one. If you type "Visuel hexdiff", you get the official website
<dolanor_> because I'm in close contact with upstream
<quadrispro> ah-ah! you're right
<quadrispro> ok ok
<dolanor_> he wait for me to upload the new version
<dolanor_> since he is quite busy, he hasn't time to upload every minor thing that I change :p
<quadrispro> I understand
<quadrispro> dolanor_: uploaded to Jaunty NEW
<quadrispro> bug 317331
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 317331 in ubuntu "[needs-packaging]hexdiff" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/317331
<tgm4883> doko, did you go though the tips and tricks part of that link/
<dolanor_> quadrispro: \o/
<dolanor_> thanks :)
<quadrispro> you're welcome
<quadrispro> thanks for your work ;)
<ScottK> dolanor: pinentry-gtk you almost certainly don't want.  Try pinentry-gtk2.
<TheMuso> c
<ScottK> dolanor: What release are you running?
<dolanor_> ScottK : the pinentry bug since I use SCIM ...
<dolanor_> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/seahorse/+bug/284044
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 284044 in scim "seahorse passphrase dialogs don't accept input" [Low,Confirmed]
<ScottK> dolanor: seahorse is not much of an agent.  It's pretty broken.
<ScottK> dolanor: The reason I ask is that we removed pinentry-gtk in Gutsy, so either you've upgraded your system several times or you're using an olde release.
<dolanor_> no no, I was using a shortcut
<dolanor_> I don't know exactly what utility it use, but this is the window from seahorse when I have GPGKEY env set
<dolanor_> can't I use the gpg-agent with only terminal prompt ?
<ScottK> You should be able to.  I don't use Gnome, so I can't say how Seahorse gets involved.
<jmarsden> dolanor_: sudo apt-get install gnupg-agent  && man gpg-agent
<dolanor_> jmarsden: already done, the bug is between scim and seahorse
<dolanor_> :)
<ScottK> jmarsden: Part of the problem is that Seahorse is involved.  It's a crap gpg-agent in it and the actual gnupg-agent don't play well together.
<dolanor_> I've killed the seahorse-agent processus, and relaunched gpg-agent --daemon
<jmarsden> OK... so just use gpg-agent in your .profile and forget seahorse... right.
<dolanor_> and now I've got some Qt4 window, lol... But at least... It works :)
<kolby> seahorse could get better.
<kolby> right now it isn't very useful.
<dolanor_> another question ... Any cdbs guru there ?
<ScottK> kolby: As recently as the version in Hardy it would do 'fun' stuff like remove an existing gnupg.conf and replace it with a blank one (except I nice comment confessing it's sins).
<ScottK> !ask
<ubottu> Please don't ask to ask a question, simply ask the question (all on ONE line, so others can read and follow it easily). If anyone knows the answer they will most likely reply. :-)
<ScottK> dolanor: ^^
<dolanor_> ^^
<kolby> World of Goo came out for Linux today
<kolby> it's a game I've never heard of... it has a debian package => it's related to motu.
<kolby> (not really) I just found it interesting.
<dolanor_> In debian/rules with cdbs, it tells : put any env var here (after the makefile.mk include, etc ...) but if I set DEBBUILDDIR after the include ... the options is not passed to make
<dolanor_> kolby: world of goo is a great game
<dolanor_> I don't really like puzzle game, but I think I like this one very much :)
<kolby> Yay !  ^^
<kolby> I have the demo
<dolanor_> yes me too
<kolby> I might buy it then
 * kolby plays games...
<dolanor_> I can't afford the 15â¬ right now (french taxes, ouch), but next month, he is mine
<sbaginov> hi all! got a bug to file... any info on how to do it?
<dolanor_> so I'll play the demo ... And for now I'm blocked by tower of goo
<kolby> launchpad, right?
<dolanor_> sbaginov: just fill the bug description in launchpad :) (But verify if it doesn't exist on launchpad already)
<kolby> Then there's this:  https://help.ubuntu.com/community/ReportingBugs
<sbaginov> thank you
<kolby> I hope I gave you the right info.  I'm new here.
<sbaginov> yes, i found the bugs list and no info on mine, but i did not know how to report it even if i was logged in. i thought that motu had its page to report bugs
<dolanor_> I think I'll buy world of goo for my mother... I just installed ubuntu for her ^^ Must keep her on it by any means :p She is fond of those type of games
<tgm4883> Can I please get a REVU on http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/mythnettv
<dolanor_> tgm4883: looking at it
<tgm4883> dolanor_, thanks
<dolanor_> tgm4883: ftbfs
<tgm4883> :/
<dolanor_> tgm4883: just kidding
<dolanor_> but I'm no expert in python package
<tgm4883> lol, you got me ;)
<dolanor_> from what I see, it is good
<dolanor_> except from the COPYING file
<dolanor_> it is still in the .deb
<tgm4883> what about the copying file?
<tgm4883> hmm
<tgm4883> let me get on that like a pirate getting some booty
<dolanor_> as said superm1 or mok0, there shouldn't be a COPYING file in the .deb, only the source file
<dolanor_> I'm commenting on revu
<dolanor_> did you patch yourself the original source package ?
<dolanor_> without dpatch ?
<tgm4883> dolanor_, when adding the license?
<dolanor_> I speak for setup.py
<dolanor_> hmmmm, I may be dumb
<dolanor_> wait :p
<dolanor_> no I'm not that dumb :p
<tgm4883> all editing i've done should be in either dpatches or done upstream
<dolanor_> so you wrote setup.py in upstream ?
<tgm4883> yea
<dolanor_> ok
<dolanor_> so, 1 more issue with copyright :)
<dolanor_> gflags.py is full of google coder copyright
<dolanor_> and BSD license i think
<dolanor_> you should add it
<tgm4883> hmm
<tgm4883> ok, will do
<dolanor_> Added comment on revu
<dolanor_> and now ... goind to bed ..., already 5:50
<dolanor_> bye
<tgm4883> night
<kpirc> Anyone around who could have a peek at one last issue I'm having with a package on REVU? It's "modglue".
<persia> kpirc, What issue are you having?
<kpirc> persia, another MOTU made a remark concerning re-factoring of debian/rules to account for arch all in the -dev package. I don't understand what that comment means.
<persia> kpirc, Well, packages that are arch-specific or arch-any will run the binary-arch rule.  Packages that are arch-all will run the binary-indep rule.  Your current binary-indep rules doesn't do anything, so it won't build the arch-all binary.
<kpirc> persia, strange, when I build the binary packages I do get a -dev package which contains the relevant files. In any case, should I just copy the stuff below binary-arch to the binary-indep section?
<persia> kpirc, Also, it's recommended to pass -a and -i to debhelper programs when building both arch-dependent and arch-independent packages from the same source.
<persia> Well, you might not need all of them, but yes.
<persia> In fact, you don't need all the ones you have listed now for arch-specific.  Read the manpages: I suspect you'll find that many can just be removed.
<persia> What architecture do you run?
<kpirc> i386
<persia> Try setting up an lpia pbuilder or sbuild chroot in parallel.
<persia> When you build packages on i386, it builds both arch-dependent and arch-independent binary packages by default.
<persia> With lpia, it won't build the arch-independent binary packages by default.
<persia> If you try your current source, you'll find that it builds your -dev package also on lpia, which is the source of the complaint.
<persia> (for those with amd64 environments, the recommendation is to use i386 and amd64 chroots, as amd64 doesn't get arch-all by default either: no lpia required).
<wgrant> persia: Can one not also test just with i386?
<kpirc> ok, so now I'm thoroughly confused. Can you give me a rough guess of what my binary-indep and binary-arch parts of debian/rules should look like? I see no dh_* calls which seem to have anything to do with installing the header files, so I don't understand how to change these sections.
<persia> wgrant, I suppose.  I find it easier to launch two sbuild sessions in separate architectures and examine the results than remember the appropriate flags to pass to override the default behaviour, and build twice.
<persia> kpirc, First lets trim you binary-arch rule.  Do you need each of the helpers?  Also, you want to pass -a as an argument.
<kpirc> I don't think there's any helpers that can be dropped, given that this is building a shared library. Should '-a' be given as an argument to all helpers or only specific ones?
<persia> OK.  Let's look at some specifics.  How are you using dh_installdocs?
<persia> -a should be passed to all helpers in the binary-arch target, and -i to all helpers in the binary-indep target
<kpirc> I don't know whether that gets used. I never understand which files these helpers act on, so I was assuming that READMEs and other related material would get installed by this helper.
<persia> Does reading man dh_installdocs help you determine this?
<kpirc> well, it mentions installing debian/copyright, so I guess I need this one.
<persia> OK.  It would also install a README if your package had one, but it doesn't, so it's not important, and yes, you need this one.
<persia> How about dh_installexamples?
<kpirc> Bad man page for that one. How does dh_installexamples figure out which files count as 'examples'? Does it not do anything without parameters?
<persia> It can either take arguments, or look in the contents of a file named "debian/package.examples".  It does nothing if there are no arguments, and this file doesn't exist.
<persia> In the case of your package, you have a nice examples directory, which you probably want to install as examples.  Given that it's dev examples, you probably want to install it in the -dev package.
<persia> I'd recommend only having `dh_installexamples -i -plibmodglue1-dev` in binary-indep, and not including it in binary-arch.
<kpirc> ok. Why the explicit -plibmodglue1-dev ?
<persia> Because I think you want to include the examples only for that package.  Of course, you could run it for all arch:all packages, and just only have debian/libmodglue1-dev.examples contain anything.  Your choice.
<persia> With the extended argument, I believe you can just use debian/examples.
<persia> Since it doesn't matter which way you do it, please pick the one that makes more sense to you.
<kpirc> ok
<persia> Shall we go through the others individually, or would you like to go through them, and just ask if you have questions?
<kpirc> I would say that for a minimal -dev which only installs the 'examples' directory and the header files, I need
<kpirc> 	dh_testdir -i
<kpirc> 	dh_testroot -i
<kpirc> 	dh_installexamples -i
<kpirc> 	dh_fixperms -i
<kpirc> 	dh_installdeb -i
<kpirc> 	dh_gencontrol -i
<kpirc> 	dh_md5sums -i
<kpirc> 	dh_builddeb -i
<kpirc> (plus the debian/libmodglue1-dev.examples file containing 'examples').
<persia> Well, I'd probably put the manpages in the -dev package, so put dh_installman there, and dh_compress
<StevenK> kpirc: Please use a pastebin
<persia> I'd also suggest putting the changelog there, either with dh_installchangelogs, or with dh_link to the changelog from the actual library.
<kpirc> no, there are some small binary helper programs which go into the non-dev package, and they need manual pages.
<directhex> i'd use dh7, and not manually list any dh_foo stuff
<kpirc> (the library itself is still not properly documented; have been spending my time making debian packages ;-))
<kpirc> StevenK: sorry
<persia> kpirc, So you'd have your section 1 pages in the tools package and the section 3 pages in the -dev package, so you'd put it in both (and need to add a couple package.manpages to get them included with the right binary.
<persia> Where "both" means binary-arch and binary-indep (sorry for the lost referent).
<kpirc> I only have section 1 pages so far, so I'll keep this as-is for now.
<persia> Well, OK, but don't be too surprised if some future reviewer balks at a lack of manpages :)
<kpirc> I know. The problem is that I'm only packaging modglue because it is needed by my cadabra package (also waiting on REVU). If I had known all this I would probably have stuffed the lot into cadabra itself, and made it non-public and statically linked to the binary.
<persia> kpirc, Well, then you would have had complaints about static linking and embedded libraries :)
<persia> Anyway, I'm not sure everyone checks for library-missing-manpage: you might get lucky.
<kpirc> you can never please them all...
<kpirc> It's work in progress, I can't do all at once _and_ get a decent number of users interested.
<kpirc> Release early, release often, so to say.
<loic-m> kpirc: you can also just check a common library man page and use it as a model - it saves a lot of time, and might end up faster ;)
<persia> loic-m, Except that a *good* set of library manpages actually document each function call, which is a bit more documentation than most application manpages.
<kpirc> loic-m: any recommendations for a good C++ library man page? I never use them, they are mostly of the microsoft form: "do_something():  this function does something."
<loic-m> persia: that would be quite a pain then ;)
<persia> loic-m, Which is precisely why not everyone checks for library-missing-manpage.  Pretty much every reviewer checks for binary-missing-manpage, as that's more directly exposed, and much easier to fix in packaging.
<loic-m> kpirc: I can't remember having read any... As long as the doc is there in a way or another (I just checked a bit and couldn't find one ;) )
<kpirc> All in the header files so far. It takes _a lot_ of effort to write good library docs, I'd rather have none than a bunch of useless pages.
<persia> loic-m, The manpages-dev package as some very good examples, as does glibc-doc.
<kpirc> neither of those are C++
<directhex> monodoc!
<persia> kpirc, libcrypto++-doc has some C++ examples (dunno how good).  Anyway, as discussed above, let's skip writing full documentation for a single-user library right now, and focus on your packaging.
<kpirc> persia, ok, I have uploaded a new version to revu, can you give that a look?
<mok0> kpirc, look at doxygen
<persia> kpirc, I thought you had manpages for some of the helper binaries that belonged in an arch-specific package.
<mok0> It can extract documentation from your source files
<AndrewGee> Hey all. Any MOTUs available to review my package, gpxviewer? It's an application that allows users to look at GPS traces files in GPX format. Thanks :) http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=gpxviewer
<kpirc> mok0: I don't like doxygen, it tends to focus on documentation in which each and every function is documented well, but there is no proper overview (I know, you can do that with doxygen too, but it does not really help you in that area).
<persia> kpirc, Also, you either need to install a changelog for your arch:any stuff, or link it with dh_link.
<persia> Lastly, how are you using dh_link for your arch:any packages?
<persia> On another note, why does control specify debhelper (>=5) and compat have "4"?
<kpirc> persia, "dh_link -a". I guess that can go too.
<kpirc> persia, because it took me more than 6 months to have someone look at this package... In the meantime versions bumped several times.
<mok0> kpirc: that depends on how you do the markup
<mok0> mok0: up to you of course
<persia> kpirc, I understand the delay, which is why I'm not suggesting dh7: it's just the inconsistency that stands out.
<persia> kpirc, Reading through the comments, I'm also curious why you haven't included mok0's contributed symbols file.
<persia> kpirc, You probably also want to check the "legal" link from your REVU upload.  I suspect there may be issues with some files (I didn't look in depth).
<kpirc> persia: ok, fixed dh_link, compat version, included the symbols file (was on a different machine, forgot to check it in there). Will now check legal.
<kpirc> persia: legal, ouch, this is a serious pain, will have to go through all files now. Hang on.
<kpirc> persia, ok, have uploaded a new version. Please have a look, and leave a comment on REVU if there's anything else missing (have to run now). Thanks a lot for the help!
 * directhex smiles sweetly @ motu-release
<sebner> DktrKranz: your turn \o/
<DktrKranz> sebner, huh?
<DktrKranz> btw, congrats Debian! \o/
<sebner> DktrKranz: heh, MD2 beta needs motu-release love to make it into the archive ;D
<DktrKranz> md2?
<sebner> DktrKranz: monodevelop 2 :P
<DktrKranz> heh
<DktrKranz> it's not motu-release time already
<directhex> DktrKranz, not until tuesday, but reality has a horrible habit of doing things an expected way... see https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-motu/2008-November/005025.html
<DktrKranz> directhex, which stage is current development?
<directhex> DktrKranz, beta 1 preview packages are building and being tested
<DktrKranz> directhex, has schedule for 2.0 final been defined?
<directhex> DktrKranz, yes, let me find their release schedule...
<mok0> Is it ok if I tag packages on REVU with my nick? It is a useful way to keep track of  packages I've looked at. It does pollute tag-space, though
<sebner> DktrKranz: mid march -> final releaes
<sebner> DktrKranz: http://www.monodevelop.com/Development_Roadmap
<directhex> DktrKranz, http://monodevelop.com/Development_Roadmap
<directhex> hah
<sebner> :)
<DktrKranz> which one should I follow? :P
<DktrKranz> not sebner's ;)
<directhex> DktrKranz, we delayed packaging work until upstream feature freeze, so updating the packages would be 0-effort
<binarymutant> is there a ruby package that doesn't use cdbs?
<directhex> i.e. who knows what would break from alpha1->alpha2 from a packager perspective, but beta1--->final should just be uupdate
<DktrKranz> directhex, if we have 2.0beta1 now, I think we can safely ship 2.0 final before release day
<DktrKranz> the question is if we want 2.0beta1 now
<DktrKranz> I guess there will be several bugs fixed since 1.0
<directhex> DktrKranz, yes, and some major new features
<directhex> DktrKranz, hence worried about feature freeze more than bug fixes, since bug fixes are due in beta2 and final too
<DktrKranz> could we gather some informations and bug fixed somewhere, and make packages available for testing?
<directhex> DktrKranz, trying to get my hands on a source package for ppa love
<DktrKranz> I could test it from a mono-dumb perspective
<DktrKranz> (so I can understand C# a bit)
<directhex> DktrKranz, well MD is a nice IDE for other languages too
 * DktrKranz is basically a Python-lover guy
<directhex> it has a python plugin afaik
<directhex> though c# is the main focus of it, that's true
<DktrKranz> Laney, gnome-do-plugins FTBFS applying 03_buildsystem_respect_mcs.dpatch, removing it should fix it. Mind looking at it?
<Laney> DktrKranz: I am
<Laney> and there's another problem
<DktrKranz> Laney, re bug 328224, it seems package in experimental didn't transition to new gnome-sharp2 packages
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 328224 in muine "Please sync muine 0.8.10-1 (universe) from Debian experimental (main)." [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/328224
<Laney> DktrKranz: is it uninstallable?
<DktrKranz> it is until we ship old gnome-sharp2 packages, which are scheduled for removal before release
<directhex> DktrKranz, the gnome# transition is a mess. experimental doesn't help
<geser> aren't the old gnome-sharp2 packages already on NBS?
<DktrKranz> geser, they are
<directhex> geser, yes
<DktrKranz> directhex, fortunately we're close to finish it
<directhex> DktrKranz, excellent
<Laney> DktrKranz: Then you'll submit all patches to Debian?!
<Laney> ;)
<geser> iirc only package build-depending on it are still to be done (tomboy is in progress)
<DktrKranz> Laney, not sure if they already have new gnome-sharp2
<directhex> problem is there's a little API breakage as well as ABI
<directhex> DktrKranz, in experimental... but experimental is a funny beast
<DktrKranz> heh :)
<Laney> we need to do this transition somehow
<Laney> we = debian
<directhex> DktrKranz, i.e. you cherry-pick version numbers on things, so building against mono from exp but gnome# from sid is possible
<directhex> and infact building against gnome# from exp is hard
<DktrKranz> I noticed ;)
<DktrKranz> but I noticed it in jaunty, which should *not* be a funny beast at this stage
<geser> re Debian experimental: someone set an alias for experimental on the Debian archive: rc-buggy :)
<c_korn> http://pastebin.com/d38c51efc lintian message misses the important part. do you know what is going wrong?
<geser> remove build-essential from your Build-Depends line in debian/control
<DktrKranz> directhex, Laney: except for b-d mangling, there aren't many changes. I just faced some GnomePrint routines (obsolete) to be removed
<DktrKranz> I use sed to make this transition ;)
<DktrKranz> sed -i 's/libgconf2.0-cil/libgconf2.24-cil/;s/libgnome2.0-cil/libgnome2.24-cil/;s/libgnome-vfs2.0-cil/libgnome-vfs2.24-cil/;s/libart2.0-cil/libart2.24-cil/' debian/control
<c_korn> geser: I had the build-dependency g++ before there. lintian wanted me to replace it with build-essential
<geser> c_korn: you don't need g++ in Build-Depends unless you need it versioned (very unlikely)
<c_korn> so g++ can be expected to be installed in every build environment?
<directhex> DktrKranz, we can start to move things to unstable now, where the "funny" goes way..... but meebey's priority is now MD2 ;)
<geser> yes, it's guaranteed that build-essential (and it dependencies) are always installed
<c_korn> ok, thanks
<DktrKranz> directhex, if I can borrow a hand... I'm definitely not good in C#, but it's a good way to learn things
<directhex> DktrKranz, i've been working hard in the background really at the debian end... if you need specific help with something, let me know
<DktrKranz> sure
<DktrKranz> thanks ;)
<directhex> DktrKranz, i contribute to ubuntu through alioth & LAUNCHPAD ;p
<directhex>  BAH capslock
<Laney> DktrKranz: I will fix muine and muinescrobbler
 * DktrKranz hugs Laney 
<_16aR_> Hello
<DktrKranz> does anybody notice sound issues with jaunty. my audio is quite distorted
<dolanor_> is it possible to have some sort of orig.tar.gz like that : soft_x.y.z-revision.orig.tar.gz ?
<dolanor_> with revision made of text
<pop79> hi
<pop79> im wanting to get involved
<dolanor_> pop79: no problem :)
<pop79> wait
<persia> dolanor, You can certainly do that, although it's only in the rare case you wish to do so.
<dolanor_> Lot of work to be done :)
<pop79> what im wanting to do is design a presentation of ubuntu
<dolanor_> persia: the fact is that the revision is some sort of branch of the original soft. Not already released right now (I've asked upstream to do so). This branch only add Cmake support
<mok0> dolanor: doesn't the 1.2.3.4.5.... scheme give you enough variables for defining your version ;-)
<pop79> i was discussing it on #ubuntu-offtopic, but they didn't like the idea
<persia> pop79, Based on what you've said above, and what you've said on #ubuntu-devel, I'd recommend chatting with the folk in #ubuntu-docs to both build on the work already done, and integrate with future efforts.
<pop79> ok
<persia> dolanor, Hrm.  That's trickier.  It's usually only used for things like ~ppaX or +dfsgX.  Dunno how to advise you.
<pop79> there is only one person there
<persia> mok0, Think multiple parallel trees...
<dolanor_> persia: and since the original Makefile aren't that cool (I have to modify a lot to have shared lib compiling instead of static, with soname support, etc... With cmake, only a 1 line patch do this
<dolanor_> or else, I do a static lib package, but I don't like the idea
<pop79> there is soooo much i want to do to help the ubuntu project
<dolanor_> as it is preferred to have dynamic lib into debian
<dolanor_> (that's a 2d physcis engine in C++)
<persia> dolanor, I'd recommend working with upstream to build a common solution, rather than patching in a branch, and packaging your branch.  It will save considerable coordinate issues later.
<dolanor_> ok... I try to do with my version and see what happens ?
<dolanor_> ok
<dolanor_> because right now, the original upstream is ok to add cmake support. But hasn't done it. So the only package is an embedded archive in the forum. Or else you must get it from a branch in the svn
<iulian> DktrKranz: Yes, I have the same issue.  I believe there is a bug reported, not sure though.
<DktrKranz> iulian, nice to know. If you will remember, could you please subscribe me?
<iulian> Sure
<geser> dolanor_: using x.y.z-revision as upstream is possible but you have to use an pkg-revision also, e.g. x.y.z-revision-0ubuntu1
<geser> as packageversion
<persia> One shouldn't use "-" for that, if it can be avoided, as it's confusing.  "+" is generally preferred.
<dolanor_> no problems if I use + instead of - then ?
<dolanor_> so If I use : box2d_2.0.1+cmake.orig.tar.gz, every body is ok ?
<dolanor_> I can even drop the cmake if wanted. That was just better to track from what source it was since it wasn't the official release available in the download section of sourceforge
<geser> it's a least better than using 2.0.1-cmake
<dolanor_> but i forgot to say that it correct some FTBFS error of the original package n linux :) so it is better anyway :)
<dolanor_> allright, I'll use +cmake then, I'm happy with that :)
<dolanor_> i'm going now, bye
<persia> dolanor, It's still *much* better to coordinate with upstream about it.
<persia> dolanor, Given that box2d isn't in either Ubuntu or Debian now, your best bet is to get it into squeeze sometime in the next couple months, and that gives you enough time for upstream to complete the transition and make a proper release.
<Laney> Miriam has started packaging box2d in SVN
<Laney> (not read context, ignore me if you know this)
<RainCT> If I modify the .diff.gz manually, is there some script to update the .diff.gz and .changes files accordingly?
<geser> why would you want to modify the .diff.gz manually?
<persia> RainCT, Just manually modify the md5sums.
<persia> RainCT, Be *very* careful manually adjusting diff.gz: use editdiff if you are at all unsure, and don't upload the result.
<RainCT> geser: to remove some crap from it to minimize the debdiff to the previous version, without having to touch debian/rules (as this would allso increase the diff)
<persia> RainCT, What!  What are you doing?
<RainCT> don't worry, it's not for Ubuntu
<RainCT> :P
<geser> RainCT: why not edit the debdiff?
<persia> No, but trimming diff.gz to minimise debdiff is very rarely actually useful.
<RainCT> right, not really sure why I'm messing with this anyway XD
<Tamass> hi
<RainCT> geser: (because it's not me who is going to look at the debdiff, but someone else who will create it himself)
<RainCT> hi Tamass
<Tamass> :)
<RainCT> uhm.. why did  cowbuilder-hardy login --bindmounts $(pwd)  just delete everything I had in $(pwd)? -.-
<pochu> RainCT: I hope $(pwd) wasn't ~ :(
<RainCT> heh nope, only half an hour of work but I can redo it in 5 minutes :P
<ia> hello. I have set of scripts, which can be installed via "./acpi-scripts.sh install" command. But I would like to make deb package for it. So, could you tell me, please, which the best way to do it? for additional info see http://pastebin.com/m6bf2f60b
<RainCT> ia: does that script allow to specify the root dir?
<RainCT> ia: you must tell it to install the files into $(CURDIR)/debian/<pkgname> instead of /
<ia> RainCT: 1. looks like no. 2. yes, i've tried "$(MAKE) DESTDIR=$(CURDIR)/debian/eeepc-acpi-support install" in "install" section of "rules", but the result was the same (
<RainCT> ia: that's for make, not for the script
<RainCT> if it doesn't you'll have to patch the script, or do whatever it does yourself in debian/rules
<quadrispro> nellery: about bug 329495, I've just prepared a patch :)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 329495 in digikam-doc "Please merge digikam-doc 0.9.5-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/329495
<mok0> RainCT: Is it OK if I use my nick as a tag on REVU to mark the packages I am following?
 * RainCT won't complain, mok0 
<mok0> RainCT: perhaps there's a better way to achieve the same, though
<RainCT> mok0: you don't want e-mail notifications, or?
<mok0> RainCT: I am thinking of listing all the packages I'm involved in
<RainCT> because packages to which you are subscribed are displayed in your profile..
<mok0> ah
<RainCT> you can also have a feed for them but then you've to modify the URL every time you want to add a new package
<RainCT> revu.ubuntuwire.com/feeds.py?package=pkg,pkg2,pkg3  it's something like that iirc
<RainCT> * feed.py
<RainCT> I'll add a "Packages which I've commented:" option to the profle
<mok0> RainCT: If you click the "mok0" tag, you can see what kind of thing I am lookign for
<RainCT> or a filter in index.py even
<mok0> RainCT: yes
<RainCT> for packages where you've left a comment.. then i'd achieve the same as a tag
<mok0> RainCT: right
<RainCT> mok0: ok, let me eat something and then I'll get to it
<mok0> RainCT: amazing!
<superm1> mok0, can you look at tgm4883's other package, mythnettv? it's paired with mythnettv-gui, so i'd like to be able to upload the pair?
 * nhandler still thinks the automatic package checks should tag the packages (i.e. bad-maintainer, missing-watch, no-bug-closed, etc)
<mok0> superm1: will do
<RainCT> mok0: ready, uploading now :)
<RainCT> Â«WHERE sp.sid IN (SELECT sid FROM Upload WHERE upid in (SELECT upid FROM Comments WHERE usid IN (SELECT usid FROM Users WHERE nickname IN ('mok0','rainct'))))Â»
<RainCT> nice, eh? :P
<RainCT> (and yes, you can now do /tag/tag1,tag2,tag3 and ?user=user1,user2, etc.)
<RainCT> ok, it's up
<RainCT> mok0: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/?user=mok0 (and you can combine it with &tag, &archived and &updated, of course)
<nhandler> RainCT: You have no idea how much better you made my REVU life with that feature
<mok0> RainCT: cute
<mok0> RainCT:  I just deleted the "mok0" tags, and discovered that when you edit the tags, you get a strange string with part of an url
<nhandler> RainCT: One more suggestion, add a message at the very top of REVU that says "Showing [archived/unarchived] [new/updated] pacakges [commented on by foo]
<RainCT> nhandler: hehe great :)
<RainCT> mok0: uhm.. where? that shouldn't happen
<RainCT> oh
<RainCT> ah, right
<RainCT> because I linkified them
<mok0> You see it?
<RainCT> now I don't know how to fix this properly :(
<mok0> I still works
<mok0> heh, IT still works
<RainCT> does someone know how to get the text between <a ..>HERE</a>, for serveral links, with JS?
<Laney> innerText isn't it?
<RainCT> Laney: perhaps, but to get it for all of them?
 * RainCT is sad JS has no nice list comprehensions :P
<Laney> document.getElementsByTagName('a') will give you all of the 'a' tags
<Laney> RainCT: And you can use map on that like a good functional programmer
 * RainCT grumbles about a   <script language="text/python"   support in Firefox :P
<Laney> to get a list of all the innerTexts
<Laney> https://developer.mozilla.org/En/Core_JavaScript_1.5_Reference:Objects:Array:map
 * RainCT wonders why nobody has though of adding Python scripting support to webbrowsers before! :P :P
<kpirc> persia, are you able to advocate the modglue package you helped me with earlier today? (provided, of course, you don't see anything else wrong with it).
<kpirc> Is anyone here able to advocate a package for me? (modglue, on REVU) I went through the final bits of cleanup earlier today, just need a second MOTU to ok it.
<AndrewGee> Hey all. Any MOTUs available to review my package, gpxviewer? It's an application that allows users to look at GPS traces files in GPX format. Thanks :) http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=gpxviewer
<RainCT> Laney: so, how can I convert the result of document.getElementById('tags-list').getElementsByTagName('a') into an array?
 * danielm thinks that is already an array
<RainCT> directhex: but I save that as  var tags  and then try tags.map but that says that it doesn't have "map"
<danielm> i'm not sure but you can try ".length" to check if there is elements on it
<RainCT> there is
<RainCT> I've now got around this with:   var tags = document.getElementById('tags-list').getElementsByTagName('a'); var tags = Array.prototype.map.call(tags, function(x) { return x.innerText });
<RainCT> but the content of tags becomes just ",,"
<RainCT> oh, now it works
<RainCT> ah
<RainCT> innerHTML works, innerText not
<danielm> :)
<ajmitch_> RainCT: javascript is an evil language to be dabbling in :)
<ajmitch_> or maybe it's just my recent struggles with it at work that have made me annoyed with it
<RainCT> hhehe yeah
<RainCT> at the end I got it working with jquery.. $('#tags-list a').map(function() { return $(this).text(); }).get().join(' ');
<tgm4883> can I get a 2nd revu on http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/mythnettv
<RainCT> mok0: got something nice for you
 * RainCT waits for LP to process his commit -.-
<RainCT> http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/?search_name=py  :)
<nhandler> RainCT: I still think having a search box is the way to go.
<RainCT> nhandler: that's on my TODO ;)
<andersk> Is there a MOTU sponsor available to review a quick fix in bug 34376? I fixed a regression introduced by the last patch.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 34376 in debmirror "missing main/debian-installer in repo causes debmirror to fail" [Medium,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/34376
<andersk> I think that it can then be closed, because the original problem has been addressed.
<nhandler> RainCT: Would the search box allow you to restrict the results in the same way as the current URL parameters do?
<RainCT> nhandler: yep
<RainCT> (it would not be a single box, but a form -hidden by default like the help- with inputs for the different filters)
<nhandler> RainCT: Sounds awesome. Would it be possible to get RSS feeds for these custom lists?
<RainCT> yeah, I'll work on that too (..somewhen :P)
<RainCT> (Now you can also do exclusive searches based on tags, with ?exclude-tag=)
<RainCT> this way we can ignore mono packages :D
 * RainCT runs away from directhex 
 * directhex chases after RainCT with a sharpened gpg signature
<nhandler> Could we automatically tag packages based on language?
 * directhex tags nhandler "visual basic 6"
 * nhandler filters all non perl packages and nukes them
 * directhex deletes nhandler's kernel
 * RainCT helps directhex 
<ajmitch> RainCT: so how are they tagged? :)
<RainCT> ajmitch: above the comment box there is "Tags: [edit]"
<RainCT> mok0: caution, games is catching up with python :P
<ajmitch> RainCT: I'd take a look, but firefox has decided to die
<RainCT> :(
 * ajmitch wonders if it'd be possible to encourage the use of debtags
<RainCT> here Firefox is stable like a rock since I'm using Flash through ndiswrapper :P
 * ajmitch has flashblock enabled, but firefox can still hang
 * nhandler wishes pbuilder would behave as well as Firefox does
<ajmitch> maybe having 100+ tabs open is a bad thing
<RainCT> and most of the times I look at a flash thingie (I also have flashblock, btw) it's greyed out (=crashed) or crashes in the middle, so I don't want to imagine how Firefox would behave without ndiswraper :P
<RainCT> nhandler: uhm? It never crashed for me
<RainCT> the only weird thing it did was delete a folder a while ago, but that was cowbuilder :P
<nhandler> RainCT: It doesn't crash for me. It just refuses to create a Jaunty chroot (works fine for intrepid and sid)
<RainCT> nhandler: are you using the script from ubuntu-dev-tools?
<ajmitch> create an intrepid chroot & login, --save-after-login & dist-upgrade ?
<RainCT> and do you have installed the backported <Idon'trememberwhat>
<nhandler> RainCT: No. I have separate .pbuilderrc files for intrpeid, jaunty, and sid. I tried using pbuilder-dist with the same result. And I do have backports enabled
<binarymutant> how do I go about asking for a debian sync request? Anyone have any links to that info?
<directhex> requestsync
<geser> binarymutant: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SyncRequestProcess
<directhex> from ubuntu-dev-tools
<binarymutant> thanks :)
<RainCT> good night
<dolanor_> re
<dolanor_> back
<dolanor> If use box2d-2.0.1+cmake.orig.tar.gz, do i need to work under the box2d-2.0.1+cmake/ directory too ?
#ubuntu-motu 2010-02-15
<paissad> guys, i'm really really confused about the get-orig-source target , actually  i want to remove some files & dirs, but they get removed ... i still can see the files i want to remove in the get-orig-source dir created during the run of  debian/rules http://pastebin.com/d12c75187
<paissad> even if i do a "touch test_file" before the "rm $(RemoveFromSource)" ... i don't have that file in the source dir !
<paissad> that means i canno do any operations
<paissad> cannot*
<kamalmostafa> paissad: You've got "GET-ORIG-SOURCE" where you meant "GET_ORIG_SOURCE" on that rm -rf line.   (Hyphen's aren't allowed in Makefile variable names in any case).
<kamalmostafa> paissad: And I don't think "cd" command there is going to work as you intend either (as placed, it will have no effect at all, actually.   I think you're trying to make it apply to the following "rm" command but it won't.  If you can figure out how to do what you want without using "cd" at all, that'll be best, but if not, you'll need to cram the "cd" and whatever it should affect into a parenthesized block on one line, somethin
<kamalmostafa> paissad: The fact that the "cd" has no effect explains your issue with "touch test_file" also...  That file does get created, but in the "current" directory, not down in the directory you tried to cd into.
<lfaraone> How do we handle package renames between releases?
<lfaraone> like, let's say autokey is renamed to autokey-gtk.
<lifeless> binary or source
<lifeless> myself I don't usually bother with small source renames; I just ignore em :)
<lifeless> binary packages, same as usual, start building the new binary, add a transitional package, put the right depends:replaces:breaks: in place.
<lfaraone> lifeless: binary. should it be arch all or arch any?
<lifeless> lfaraone: the transitional package? all of course.
<lifeless> persia: hey, do we have canned docs  for this?
<lifeless> persia: its muscle memory for me :P
<lfaraone> lifeless: okay, just checking. I apt-get'd the source for qemu-kvm, and I saw that "qemu", in section "metapackages", was arch "any" <_<;
<lfaraone> lifeless: that's why I asked.
<lifeless> thats...unusual ;)
<lfaraone> lifeless: should autokey-common "Replace:" autokey, since autokey-common contains files previously in autokey?
<lfaraone> lifeless: in Debian autokey is currently qt-based, and I'm going to upload a dummy package which transitions to autokey-qt. Should I divert from that in Ubuntu and transition to -gtk, so that users of Karmic will continue to use the gtk version/
<lfaraone> *?
<lifeless> lfaraone: I don't know the answer to that question
<lifeless> I suggest discussing in ubuntu-desktop if its a main package, or doing what you think best otherwise.
<lfaraone> lifeless: fortunately, it's in Universe :)
<ScottK> lfaraone: If upstream switched to Qt as their main U/I, then I think that should be what happens by default.
<ScottK> (unless you have a very good reason to diverge from upstream)
<lfaraone> ScottK: well, upstream still develops the gtk version, and I'm working with them to merge them into one tree. (where none is provided "as default")
<ScottK> lfaraone: Right, but which is their default/primary?
<lifeless> lfaraone: well default should be 'current desktop' surely?
<lfaraone> lifeless: yes, of course.
<lfaraone> ScottK: well, currently they ship autokey_VER.tar.gz (qt) and autokey-gtk_VER.tar.gz (gtk), so I guess you might consider qt their default. ideally they want to have them be feature-identical and supported evenly.
<lfaraone> ScottK: the only reason we'd provide a transitional package in Debian is so that current users of testing/unstable continue using the version they've elected to install.
<ScottK> lfaraone: I guess my view is the "version they've elected to install" is uptream's default.
 * ScottK thinks users in general care a lot less about what toolkit is used to make a program than developers tend to.
<lfaraone> ScottK: I mean so that current users of autokey in Debian (which is qt) will continue to use the version the users installed.
<ScottK> OK
<lfaraone> ScottK: actually, when I switched autokey in Debian from gtk to qt I had a few people write annoyed bug reports as to why it was pulling in "all these KDE dependencies".
<lfaraone> but hey, they're using testing, so they're not "users in general" :)
<lifeless> I would say
<lifeless> that you should go for autokey-qt and autokey-gtk as binary packages
<lifeless> use autokey as a transitional package to -gtk, if it currently installs gtk binaries
<happyaron> can anybody review ubuntu-tweak? http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/ubuntu-tweak
<happyaron> persia: ailurus is updated, please check
<happyaron> http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/ailurus
<suji11> Anyone advocate/review my package http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/iok ..
<rlp10> I'm on 9.04, and need an up-to-date package for irssi-plugin-xmpp.  I'm willing to learn how to do the update, to try to contribute something back.  Can someone point me in the right direction please?
<toabctl> hi
<rlp10> toabctl: hi
<jmarsden> rlp10: I'm about to go to bed, but the Packaging Guide is at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Complete and is *the* place to start to learn about Ubuntu packaging.
<rlp10> jmarsden: That's great.  Thanks for your help.  And, good night too
<jmarsden> You're welcome.  BTW this channel will have a lot more people in it once Europe wakes up, in a couple of hours or so...
<jmarsden> So do ask questions in here once you have read the guide and started trying things out.
<rlp10> jmarsden: Got it; again thanks for your help
<jmarsden> rlp10: You're welcome, and goodnight :)
<dholbach> good morning
<\sh> moins
<suji11> Need advocate/review for my package http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/iok
<rlp10> tseliot: nice nick
<tseliot> rlp10: thanks
<abogani> Hi All, I'm looking for a reviewer for my package (http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/arduino). Thanks in advance!
<DmitryKurochkin> hi guys. I am working on getting new polygraph package (http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/polygraph) to Lucid. There was one review of old upload for Karmic. And all comments from it are fixed now. Can someone review it please?
<Daviey> How can i get deb source v3 in hardy?
<Rhonda> Don't.
<Rhonda> deb source v3 has even in lucid still issues.
<Rhonda> At least the quilt format.
<Rhonda> Oh, wait, no, dpkg in lucid seems to be in sync now. :)
<Rhonda> hardy has too old dpkg to support source v3.
<happyaron> Rhonda: could you review ailurus now?
<Daviey> Rhonda: yeah.. I was hoping there are a ppa of backports someone knew of.
<Rhonda> happyaron: Pardon? :)
<happyaron> Rhonda: could you review "ailurus" package on revu?
<Rhonda> happyaron: I'm no motu so I'm not sure wether my review would be able to help you much - and besides work is requiring its attention too. :)
<happyaron> oh thanks
<Rhonda> happyaron: Do you have a link for me? Maybe I could squeeze it in and comment on it?
<happyaron> Rhonda: here you are revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/ailurus
<Rhonda> happyaron: You write License: GPL-2+ but the text doesn't mention "or later".
<Rhonda> happyaron: And given that GPL-2 (without or later) is incompatible with GPL-3 this is a real issue and not distributable.
<Rhonda> .. on the other hand, the GPL-3 part is only an image, so I guess that wouldn't be an issue here. Still, GPL-2+ means "or later" and that option isn't in the text.
<Rhonda> happyaron: Also, for the fedora copyright part you only show the short snippet and say it's gpl-3+, is there more that could be added about that?
<Rhonda> â¦ and actually, I'm not really a fan of cdbs. But that's a personal thing and I'm not sure wether it's discouraged in the ubuntu area?
<happyaron> Rhonda: okay, thanks
<Rhonda> The other thing I'd do is run it through "lintian -IE --pedantic" and check for its output and fix it if it sounds reasonable. Didn't try to build it.
<happyaron> many thanks, :)
<\sh> grmpf how does someone link upstream bugtracker e.g.
<\sh> http://savannah.nongnu.org/bugs/?28397 to a lp bug report?
<\sh> without having another distro
<jpds> \sh: Link to project instead?
<\sh> jpds: project: libunwind resolves to DEB packaging libunwind (regarding edge)
<\sh> I wonder if this is the correct way of doing that ;)
<abogani> Hi All, I'm looking for reviewer for my package (http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/arduino). Thanks in advance!
<\sh> wow...fixed libunwind ;)
<lbrinkma> Does anyone know why libaprutil1-dev is uninstallable on amd64?
<lbrinkma> the anjuta package FTBFS because of that lib http://launchpadlibrarian.net/39209795/buildlog_ubuntu-lucid-amd64.anjuta_2:2.29.90.0-0ubuntu2_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<BlackZ> should I use "Standards-Version: 3.8.3" or "Standards-Version: 3.8.4" in the debian/control file? lintian mark it as error (not updated?)
<sebner> BlackZ: 3.8.4
<BlackZ> sebner: ok, so I ignore the lintian notice?
<sebner> BlackZ: aye
<BlackZ> sebner: ok, thank you :)
<slytherin> BlackZ: It depends on what you are doing. Updating a package? Doing a minor change to a Debian package? Doing a merge? etc.
<BlackZ> slytherin: I'm doing a package
<slytherin> then 3.8.4
<sebner> slytherin: hmm, I should ask those questions too ^^
<slytherin> :-)
<BlackZ> slytherin: ok, thank you too :D
<BlackZ> W: autotrash: unknown-section utilis <- which section should I use for an utility program?
<randomaction> BlackZ: utils
<BlackZ> randomaction: yes, syntax error
<Laney> you can see the sections here: http://packages.ubuntu.com/lucid/
<BlackZ> Laney: thanks, it will be useful :)
<BlackZ> W: autotrash: binary-without-manpage usr/bin/autotrash <- how can I indicate where is/how install man page?
<Laney> dh_installman
<slytherin> BlackZ: I think creating a file debian/packagename.manpages and listing all the manpages should be sufficient. Not sure though if it works with debhelper. I only used it with CDBS.
<BlackZ> I will try with dh_installman
<BlackZ> I'm reading how to do
<BlackZ> slytherin: yes, that's also a method :)
<BlackZ> Laney: if I do debian/package.manpages should I use dh_installman in debian/rules file too?
<Laney> dh_installman has to be run, yes
<Laney> but you might not have to list it explicitly
<paissad> guys i'm confused about something , actually, the software i'm packaging has 2 conf files i "cannot" move to /etc/ i'd better et them in /usr/share/$package/ knowing if ever i decide to change the place of that conf files, i would have to modify a lot , huge modifications in the source .... it's a huge java software ...  i know it' not really linux common having conf files in /usr/share/$package_name/ ... but i would like
<paissad> to know if this may cause trouble ?
<paissad> i will create debian/conffiles of course
<paissad> even upstream developer recommended me not to change the path of the 2 related conf files ! ... i tried but i got some inconveniences
<paissad> what do you think about that ?
<paissad> may i ?
<Laney> if you symlink to them from /etc
<DmitryKurochkin> I am not a ubuntu developer, but perhaps it is better to put real files to /etc and symlink them from /usr/share... ?
<Laney> sure
<paissad> Laney, DmitryKurochkin yeah, i think about that, but if ever the package is remove, then dpkg remove the conf files  from /usr/share/$package_name
<Laney> no, put them in /etc and make a symlink to where the program wants them
<paissad> oh, i got it .... ^^
<paissad> you're right
<Laney> dpkg will do the right thing there
<paissad> thanks
<ryanakca> Could someone sponsor http://revu.tauware.de/p/turnin-ng please? turnin-ng_1.0.1-0ubuntu1_*.changes are lintian clean.
<BlackZ> Laney: http://paste.ubuntu.com/376868/ that's ok?
<Laney> no
<BlackZ> Laney: how can be it?
<Laney> put the path to the manpage in a file called autotrash.manpages
<Laney> in debian/
<BlackZ> Laney: done, doc/autotrash.1
<Laney> ok
<BlackZ> Laney: should I modify dh_installman in debian/rules file or is it ok?
<DmitryKurochkin> Laney: could you review polygraph package (http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/polygraph)?
 * Rhonda was asked why there is no translated CoC. I wonder how much sense that would make actually given that one has to sign the english document anyway - but I would be willing to invest some time into a German translation for it if people would consider that helpful?
 * Rhonda . o O ( Of course with the usual disclaimer: "Only the English original is binding in case of doubts." )
<dpm> Rhonda, actually on the technical side, it wouldn't be difficult to make it translatable in Launchpad.
<Laney> BlackZ: maybe
<Laney> (depends on your rules file, pastebin it)
<Laney> DmitryKurochkin: I don't have time now, sorry
<Rhonda> dpm: Putting it into the wiki might be a good starting point. Actually I am quite surprised that launchpad doesn't seem to be i18n'ed at all.
<DmitryKurochkin> Laney: ok, hopefully I am able to find two reviewers before the deadline.
<BlackZ> Laney: http://paste.ubuntu.com/376877/
<Laney> O_O
<Laney> remove that random dh_installman target
<dpm> Rhonda, that's a longstanding discussion, which was mentioned on the launchpad-users list some weeks ago as well. In short, for the moment it won't be i18n'ed unless someone steps up and is willing to lead the effort
<Laney> and you probably need %: to be last
<Laney> (maybe)
<Laney> and delete line 3
<BlackZ> Laney: done, so dh_installman -a ?
<Laney> no, nothing
<Rhonda> dpm: I rather think I should play around with i18n in something else than launchpad first to get some expertise. ;)
<BlackZ> Laney: ok, so I suppose autotrash.manpages is sufficient
<Laney> right
<Rhonda> Precisely spoken, there already is aewan and glob2 on my agenda for digging into that area.  %-/
<dpm> Rhonda, yeah, good plan, small steps first :-)
<BlackZ> Laney: thanks for all :)
 * BlackZ gives a coffee cup to Laney  
<BlackZ> :P
<paissad> guys, i hope this time it's ok ^__ ^ http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/pms-linux
<paissad> it's really really hard to package AND respect debian/ubuntu policies , lol
<paissad> harder if it's a java software ^^
<paissad> i did my best to make i lintian error & warning free, to clean correctly the source from windows binaries & such stuffs ( get-orig-source target in the debian/rules file )
<paissad> well, i just need someone who has enough time tell me if i have to worry about something else again
<paissad> thanks for all :)
<Laney> there are java teams that probably would be better
<PATX> i made a needs packaging bug a couple months ago but nothing has really been done... how could i get someone to look at it? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/416634
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 416634 in ubuntu "[needs-packaging] fastpatx - quick and simple web browser" [Wishlist,New]
<paissad> guys, i've been told that i should check if Depends: in control file exist in ubuntu repositories, ..... so i would like to know if this repository is in Ubuntu by default
<paissad> http://fr.archive.ubuntu.com karmic-updates/multiverse
<paissad> in other words, may i add in Depends: field, some softwares which are in this repository         http://fr.archive.ubuntu.com karmic-updates/multiverse
<paissad> ?
<ari-tczew> sebner: could you merge/sync belpic?
<rmunn> I need one more advocate for http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/python-nltk to get it into Lucid. Since O'Reilly recently published book on NLTK (http://oreilly.com/catalog/9780596516499), I'd like to make "apt-get install python-nltk" possible... but that means I need one more MOTU to review and advocate for this by Thursday. Anyone interested?
<rmunn> I've gotten great advice (and one advocation) from people last week -- thanks! -- and the technical stuff should all be ironed out, so it shouldn't take too long.
<sebner> ari-tczew: /me looks
<lbrinkma> Why is libsvn-dev uninstallable? This causes the anjuta package to FTBFS:  http://launchpadlibrarian.net/39209795/buildlog_ubuntu-lucid-amd64.anjuta_2:2.29.90.0-0ubuntu2_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz This is only an amd64 issue, it installs fine on i386.
<lbrinkma> I think the issue is caused by libaprutil-dev
<geser> lbrinkma: known problem, libmysqlclient16 from mysql-cluster-7.0 broke libmysqlclient-dev on amd64
<lbrinkma> geser: bug #521815 status is fix released, so thats wrong?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 521815 in mysql-cluster-7.0 "breaks all builds requiring libmysqlclient-dev" [Critical,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/521815
<lbrinkma> geser: so why building still fails?
<geser> lbrinkma: the package doesn't build the package anymore but the archive has still the one from the previous upload
<geser> the "real" libmysqlclient16 from mysql-5.1 has to be uploaded with a higher version that the current one
<lbrinkma> so mysql-dfsg-5.1 must be reuploaded
<geser> yes (with a proper version to unbreak things)
<lbrinkma> geser: what version number does the package need?
<geser> greater than the current version libmysqlclient16 on amd64 has
<lbrinkma> geser: higer than 7.0.9-1, so something like 2:5.1.41-3ubuntu5? or could the package removed manually?
<oojah> Hi, could someone please review http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/sqlite3-pcre ? Even just a small amount of feedback would be great.
<lbrinkma> Could a core developer please reupload the mysql-dfgs, so that anjuta and all the other packages that depending on libmysqlclient are working again?
<Laney> oojah: looks like you uploaded a .pc directory :)
<Laney> i'll give another review in a minute when I get my pc booting again
<geser> lbrinkma: that would work (adding an epoch but it's a last effort and this can't be undone)
<geser> lbrinkma: ask slangasek or zul about the status (as I know they were discussing how to best unbreak it)
<oojah> Laney: Damn, that's annoying
<maxb> geser: Presumably it's going to be a matter of overriding the version of that binary package to 7.0.9really5.1.41-3ubuntu5
<asbin> Hi everybody
<asbin> Is ther some Ubuntu Developer free to advocate a package ? ;)
<asbin> My package enna http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/enna has already 1 advocation ! Can someone review it please ?
<highvoltage> asbin: I've opened it in a tab, if no one else has looked at it by the time I finish work today I'll take a look at it
<asbin> highvoltage: thank you ! :D
<rmunn> REVU question: I accidentally clicked the "Archive" link next to python-nltk on the main http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/ and now it's no longer listed on the front page. I still want to get a second advocate for it so it can get into Lucid; how can I un-archive it?
<highvoltage> asbin: you're welcome
<rmunn> It's still visible at http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/python-nltk and http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/?archived=true but if it's not on the "main" page fewer people will see it. Can I un-archive it myself, or does it take someone with REVU admin rights to do that?
<rmunn> ... never mind, just found the un-archive link. I'm blind sometimes. :-)
<DmitryKurochkin> highvoltage: if you will have some more time, can you please review polygraph package (http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/polygraph)?
<v0xel> hi MOTUs! I made my first attempt at packaging a new package yesterday, if somebody finds time, feedback is very appreciated. REVU link is: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/colormath
<highvoltage> DmitryKurochkin: I saw your message on the list and also have that open in a tab, so I might be able to look at it a bit later!
<DmitryKurochkin> highvoltage: thank you!
<asbin> highvoltage: Thank you very much for your ACK !! :)
<abogani> Hi All! Could anyone review my package Arduino www.arduino.cc http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/arduino? Thanks!
<asbin> highvoltage: do you know when a package with 2 ACK is being uploaded in universe ?
<hyperair> iirc it should be uploaded by the person who gives the second ACK
<dooooomi> fabrice_sp: thank you for your comments on gtklick. i made the changes you suggested, maybe you could take another look? (http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/gtklick)
<fabrice_sp> Hi dooooomi
<fabrice_sp> sure: let me check
<fabrice_sp> dooooomi, as a side comment, if you would have used source format 3.0 (quilt), you wouldn't need README.source and dependency on quilt ;-)
<superm1> fabrice_sp, i still got a warning that I didn't include README.source when i switched a package to format 3.0 (quilt)
<fabrice_sp> superm1, in REVU or in lucid?
<superm1> fabrice_sp, i ended up just including a symlink to the README.source that's shipped w/ quilt
 * fabrice_sp converted somes packages to get rid of README.source
<superm1> fabrice_sp, oh that was from lintian on karmic I suppose...
 * superm1 stabs lintian
<fabrice_sp> :-D
<superm1> and you don't need to build-depend on quilt anymore either when you do dh --with-quilt?
<superm1> that's something else i guess I can fix too then :)
<fabrice_sp> this is what I did, following the Debian's instruction on how to convert a package to 3.0 format :-)
<Laney> you sdon't need to do with-quilt at all
<bdrung_> highvoltage: did you upload enna or should I do it?
<fabrice_sp> superm1, by the way, I think that a comment of mine made loose your advocate on some package (don't remember which one, actually)
<fabrice_sp> dooooomi, ack'd. You only need another advocate :-)
<fabrice_sp> persia perhaps? gtkclick is interesting for ubuntustudio
<superm1> fabrice_sp, yeah you looked a little more thoroughly than i was looking :)
<superm1> fabrice_sp, i think that rhpot1991 is working out a solution yet
<dooooomi> fabrice_sp: awesome, thanks :)
<fabrice_sp> superm1, ok. As soon as it's fixed, I'll check again, and if its ok, shall I uplaod it or wait for your advocate?
<fabrice_sp> dooooomi, yw :-)
<superm1> fabrice_sp, go ahead and upload as soon as he's got that fixed i say
<superm1> rhpot1991, ^
<fabrice_sp> ok
<rhpot1991> superm1: fabrice_sp waiting for my ppa to build so I can make sure all is good, then I'll push to revu
<phanatic> hi, it's been a long time i've been doing packaging for ubuntu, so i don't understand dholbach's note about LGPL-3 in debian/copyright here: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/zope.browserresource - could anyone help me with that, please?
<crimsun> phanatic: debian/copyright is missing a reference to /usr/share/common-licenses/LGPL-3
<crimsun> phanatic: i.e., source packages provide a link to the same license on the local Ubuntu install
<mok0> Is python-libxml2dom packaged?
 * mok0 is puzzled
<phanatic> crimsun: but upstream is licensed under the Zope Public License
<crimsun> phanatic: right
<crimsun> phanatic: I don't think you actually need a reference to that file, since it isn't LGPL 3
<phanatic> crimsun: thanks. in that case i think i've addressed all his points in the new upload :)
<crimsun> phanatic: yep, just commented
<phanatic> crimsun: thank you
<rmunn> Any MOTUs have a moment to look at http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/python-nltk? All the minor issues from last week should be fixed now, and I have one advocate already. One more advocate and it can go into Lucid.
<abogani> Hi All! Could anyone review my package: Arduino www.arduino.cc http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/arduino? Thanks!
<fabrice_sp> abogani, license for libraries/* is PD. What's that?
<abogani> fabrice_sp: Public Domain
<fabrice_sp> you should add the text
<abogani> fabrice_sp: Upstream don't release it: simply write " Released under Public Domain". Where I can find text?
<fabrice_sp> tbh, I don't know
<fabrice_sp> abogani, there is no disclaimer?
<abogani> fabrice_sp: Some of these files don't contains other than C source... (No author, no date, no license _nothing_).
<abogani> Only C/C++ source code
<fabrice_sp> pfff: will have a look tomorrow (too complexe for me right now)
<abogani> fabrice_sp: Thanks anyway! :-)
<abogani> Hi All! Could anyone review my package Arduino www.arduino.cc http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/arduino? Thanks!
<abogani> Hi All! Could anyone review my package Arduino www.arduino.cc http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/arduino? Thanks!
<lfaraone> abogani: why is arudiuno.png UUEncoded?
<lfaraone> abogani: re your get-orig-source rule, rather than hardcoding the svntag in debian/rules, could you extract it from the changelog verrsion a la http://wiki.debian.org/SandroTosi/Svn_get-orig-source ?
<abogani> lfaraone: I'l take a look! Thanks!
<rmunn> Anyone have time to be a second advocate for http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/python-nltk? Should be a pretty straightforward review, the quirks have been hammered out by now. I'd like to get it in before the freeze.
<v0xel> lfaraone, could you also look at http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/colormath, I'm new at this and eager to get a review ;)
<lfaraone> v0xel: sure, I'm not MOTU, but I'll be glad to take a look.
<v0xel> lfaraone, thanks!
<lfaraone> abogani: fyi, files in src/processing/xml/* are under zlib/libpng according to licensecheck, not "MIT style"
<lfaraone> abogani: libraries/Ethernet/utility/w5100.c is "(c)COPYRIGHT" and "ALL RIGHTS RESERVED", therefore unfree.
<lfaraone> v0xel: I'll brb in a bit, but I'll get to it by the end of today.
<bdrung_> rmunn: work for you to do ;)
<rmunn> bdrung_, Thanks.
<rmunn> P: python-nltk: copyright-refers-to-symlink-license usr/share/common-licenses/GPL - thought I fixed that, argh. Checking now...
<bdrung_> nope ;)
<bdrung_> rmunn: let me know once you are finished
<rmunn> Hah - yeah, I fixed it... but in the wrong VM. Too many tabs open. :-)
<bdrung_> :)
<oojah> bdrung_: If you've got time whilst you're waiting, could you take a look at sqlite3-pcre?
<asbin> bdrung_: I l*** you ! Thanks (for enna) !! :)
<bdrung_> rmunn: drop debian/pycompat
<rmunn> As for the CDBS question - I'm just starting, and CDBS looked simpler than debhelper. Haven't had time to look at dh 7 yet. I'll probably switch it over in a -0ubuntu2 package or once I package it for Debian, but so close to feature freeze I don't want to make any major changes.
<bdrung_> rmunn: it's not a major change (drop cdbs and rewrite debian/rules)
<bdrung_> rmunn: file:///usr/share/doc/debhelper/examples/rules.tiny
<bdrung_> rmunn: man dh
<rmunn> bdrung_, where can I read about pyversions? I can't find it mentioned anywhere in http://www.debian.org/doc/packaging-manuals/python-policy/
<rmunn> (which is where I got XS-Python-Version from)
<bdrung_> rmunn: i looked in /usr/share/doc/python-support/
<bdrung_> rmunn: in your case the file contains "2.4-"
<rmunn> bdrung_, Thanks, reading it now... and just created a pyversions file
<abogani> lfaraone: get-orig-source and ZLIB (instead of MIT) fixes. Reiman: arduino.png uuencode, strange disclaimer of w5100.c. How do you suggest me to handle this file?
<bdrung_> oojah: i recomment to use dpkg-source 3.0 (quilt) format and DEP-5 for debian/copyright, DEP-3 for patches, you should add a link to debian/watch, run update-maintainer
<bdrung_> oojah: do you want to bring this package to debian, too?
<abogani> Lucid's dpkg support 3.0 ?
<bdrung_> abogani: yes
<bdrung_> i moved already many packages
<abogani> bdrung_: Thanks
<rmunn> bdrung_, Thanks for your help, uploading new version to REVU now. Should appear in 2-3 minutes.
<oojah> bdrung_: Yes, debian would be good as well.
<rmunn> bdrung_, Okay, new upload is up at http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/python-nltk now with your suggested changes.
<rmunn> bdrung_, If there's anything else that would prevent you from advocating it, please let me know. :-)
<doctormo> How can I check to see if a package is installed and only if it is call sudo apt-get purge packagename?
<doctormo> basically I don't want to ask the user to become root if they don't need to
<rmunn> bdrung_, you around? You asked me to let you know when I was finished with http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/python-nltk. It's ready now.
<hggdh> doctormo: for example, dpkg -l <package> | egrep ^ii
<geser> doctormo: can you explain the problem a little more?
<geser> why should the user need to remove a package?
<bdrung_> rmunn: yes, i am looking at it.
<rmunn> bdrung_, Thanks. I feel like I've been inches away from the finish line for a week now on this package, so I'm eager to get it finished. Your help is much appreciated.
<bdrung_> rmunn: i will add a newline to debian/rules and remove the empty line from debian/watch, if you are ok with that.
<rmunn> bdrung_, Sure.
<doctormo> geser: If they want to develop groundcontrol, I require that they remove any groundcontrol deb packages so the plugins don't get confused.
<bdrung_> rmunn: why did you need python-yaml in the clean rule?
<rmunn> bdrung_, Because setup.py does "import nltk" and nltk/__init__.py does (somewhere in its import structure) "import yaml"
<bdrung_> k
<rmunn> bdrung_, I discovered this because the first version of my package didn't have python-yaml in build-depend, and it FTBFS'ed once I put it up on REVU.
<rmunn> (I have python-yaml installed on my system, so I'd failed to notice the problem. Taught me to always test with pbuilder first, saves time.)
<geser> doctormo: then the snippet from hggdh should do it
<doctormo> http://pastebin.com/m70407a55geser: What do you think of this other snippet I was just passed?
<doctormo> damn irc, geser: http://pastebin.com/m70407a55
<geser> looks even better
<oojah> bdrung_: For sqlite3-pcre, what link should I add to the watch file given that there's only a git repo available and I have a get-orig-source in rules?
<bdrung_> oojah: for example a link to the web interface of git
<rmunn> bdrung_, Thanks for the +1! Do I need to get sistpoty to re-advocate this, since the REVU software considers his previous advocation obsoleted by the new upload, or are the differences minor enough that it doesn't matter?
<bdrung_> rmunn: i don't care about it. the rule is that two motu have to vote for the package, then it can be uploaded. sistpoty was fine with the package. the changes will probably not change his mind.
<rmunn> bdrung_, Understood, thanks.
<lfaraone> doctormo: fyi, python-xdgapp was REJECTED from Debian.
<doctormo> lfaraone: Bah, oh well
<bdrung_> rmunn: can you link bug #514936 to debians ITP bug?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 514936 in ubuntu "[needs-packaging] nltk (Natural Language Toolkit)" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/514936
<rmunn> bdrung_, Sure, one sec.
<doctormo> lfaraone: Rationale?
<lfaraone> doctormo: quoth the installer, "sorry, we cannot add a full source package for every small script. Please try to get it added to python-xdg or a similar package."
<rmunn> bdrung_, Now that I've gotten it in before the Lucid freeze deadline, my next step is to submit it to Debian.
<doctormo> lfaraone: It's not a small script, but I'll take it into groundcontrol, the jerks.
<bdrung_> rmunn: yes ;)
<lfaraone> rmunn: you'll want to get it in DPMT (if it's a module) or PAPT, and then ask POX to sponsor :P
<doctormo> jono: python-xdgapp was rejected from debian
<rmunn> bdrung_, But since the Lucid deadline was so close, I focused on getting an acceptable package into Ubuntu first. Afterwards I can get it into Debian and lucid+1 can just have python-nltk sync'ed.
<bdrung_> rmunn: one thing before uploading it. why do you call the source package python-nltk instead of nltk?
<rmunn> lfaraone, I'm unfamiliar with those acronyms... Still new to this.
<lfaraone> rmunn: well, you can get it into debian NEW, and then ask an Archive Admin to sync it :)
<rmunn> bdrung_, Because python-(foo) seems to be the naming convention for Python libraries: python-yaml, python-elementtree, python-lxml, and so on.
<lfaraone> rmunn: in fact, it's policy!
<lfaraone> rmunn: you can call the source package nltk however.
<bdrung_> rmunn: yes, the binary package must be called python-mltk, but not the source
<bdrung_> rmunn: the source name should be the upstream name. (for example matplotlib is the source for python-matplotlib)
<rmunn> lfaraone, bdrung_, This is my first package; I haven't yet learned how to make the binary package name differ from the source package name. Feel free to make the change if you want.
<lfaraone> rmunn: http://wiki.debian.org/Teams/PythonModulesTeam == DPMT, http://wiki.debian.org/Teams/PythonAppsPackagingTeam == PAPT. You want the former. They hang out in debian-python, and manage their packages using svn-buildpackage. (which can be a PITA in itself, but whatever)
<lfaraone> rmunn: the source package name is the first line in your control file.
<bdrung_> rmunn: k, will rename the source to nltk
<lfaraone> rmunn: example: http://paste.ubuntu.com/377213/
<rmunn> bdrung_, That should make future maintenance simpler, as the upstream tarball is named nltk-###.tar.gz
<rmunn> lfaraone, Ah, I see. Elegantly simple (as most things in Debian are) once you know how to do it. :-)
<bdrung_> rmunn: the upstream tarball name is irrelevant for making packaging simpler/harder. uscan handle it.
<bdrung_> rmunn: and don't forget the changelog
<rmunn> It's just quite a bit to learn at once. I thought at first I had done a rather good job making the package, checking copyright issues carefully, etc.... and look how many different uploads and comments ended up on http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/python-nltk before I was through. :-)
<rmunn> bdrung_, Speaking of the changelog -- should it have the source or binary package names in the "python-nltk (2.0~b8-0ubuntu1) lucid; urgency=low" line?
<lfaraone> rmunn: everybody makes mistakes their first time :P
<lfaraone> rmunn: source.
<rmunn> lfaraone, Naturally. That's why the review process is in place.
<bdrung_> rmunn: that's the source name (imaging multiple binary package made out of one source)
<rmunn> If it weren't for more experienced packagers looking at my code, I would have ended up with a package version like "2.0b8" (no ~ in there) and been forced to use an epoch once NLTK came out of beta.
<doctormo> lfaraone: It strikes me that if python-xdgapp was rejected, then it's highly likely that groundcontrol will be too.
<oojah> bdrung_: I've made your suggested changes to sqlite3-pcre.
<doctormo> lfaraone: So I was wondering your opinion on if we should bother?
<rmunn> Among the many other potential problems that they helped head off...
<lfaraone> doctormo: why would groundcontrol be rejected?
<oojah> Conversion to quilt 3.0 was much less painful than I expected.
<lifeless> doctormo: why was xdgapp rejected?
<doctormo> lifeless: Too similar to python-xdg
<lfaraone> lifeless: "sorry, we cannot add a full source package for every small script. Please try"
<lfaraone> "to get it added to python-xdg or a similar package."
<doctormo> lifeless: Even though it wraps around it, we're advised to upstream the features into python-xdg
<lfaraone> doctormo: which is reasonable long-term advice anyway, probablyt.
<lifeless> doctormo: was that on mentors?
<lifeless> cause mentors isn't the end-all, archive admins are the actual arbiters
<lfaraone> lifeless: archive admins.
<lifeless> [and it may be reasonable advice, though I'd need to study more to know]
<rmunn> Okay, LP #514936 has been linked to the Debian ITP.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 514936 in ubuntu "[needs-packaging] nltk (Natural Language Toolkit)" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/514936
<lfaraone> lifeless: it's already synced into Ubuntu, so it's not a big deal. (I bribed an *ubuntu* archive admin for that :) )
<lifeless> hmm, well I'd probably argue that, but it wouldn't necessarily be pretty
<lifeless> (the rejection I mean)
<doctormo> I love how there is already a coherence.extern.xdg module that duplicates xdgapp code for another project.
<lifeless> ciao
<bdrung_> oojah: you should grab the ownership and update the title (to the new source name) of the ITP
<bdrung_> rmunn: ^
<rmunn> bdrung_, Right, taking care of the Debian ITP is next on my todo list. Was going to grab ownership, now I'll also update the source name as well.
<lfaraone> lifeless: you're welcome to, I'm too shy to irk the wrath of archive admins.
<doctormo> lfaraone: I've emailed the guy behind python-xdg and I've sucked in xdgapp into groundcontrol for now, since it's very unlikely upstream will move quickly enough.
<lfaraone> doctormo: mk. it's very possible btw that we can get a FFe for GC
<doctormo> lfaraone: what is an FFe?
<doctormo> feature freeze extention?
<lfaraone> doctormo: feature freeze exception.
<doctormo> ah
<lfaraone> !ffe
<ubottu> uvf is Upstream Version Freeze.  For an exception, see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess
<doctormo> OK, then we'll plan to revert it if we get it sorted out.
<oojah> bdrung_: I'm not quite at that point yet - I'm keen to get it into debian but haven't done anything to that end yet (including reading up on their procedures).
<jono> doctormo, thats a shame
<bdrung_> oojah: my comment was targeted at rmunn, but it fits for you too. ;)
<doctormo> jono: For me it's only a shame for code reuse.
<jono> doctormo, yeah
<Laney> ohhhhhhhh
<bdrung_> oojah: getting the package in debian guarantees that it will get in ubuntu
<Laney> I was supposed to review that package
<Laney> let's do it! go!
<oojah> Ok.
<oojah> I realise that - thought it would be friendlier getting it past here first :)
<Laney> oojah: why 3.0 (quilt)?
<oojah> Laney: Because bdrung_ recommended it.
<Laney> it's backport unfriendly
<Laney> but i dont mind really
<bdrung_> Laney: 3.0 (quilt) rocks. why not use the latest techniques for new packages?
<Laney> au contraire, why use the latest crack without a compelling reason?
<lfaraone> rmunn: first step, register in https://alioth.debian.org/ , then apply to join https://alioth.debian.org/projects/python-modules/. Explain "I want to help maintain Python modules, specifically NLTK" or something similar.
<Laney> I don't see a major benefit in just removing the --with=quilt stuff and a b-d
<bdrung_> Laney: reasons: http://wiki.debian.org/Projects/DebSrc3.0
<Laney> I know what it does, but I also know that for most packages those benefits aren't needed
<Laney> so if one of them (not the quilt stuff) is there then go for it, otherwise don't IMO
<Laney> for backport unfriendliness
<bdrung_> Laney: eclipse benefits from it.
<Laney> I'm sure some packages do!
<bdrung_> Laney: it will be backport frienly once lucid is released ;)
<Laney> but I don't recommend it universally, that's what I'm trying to say here
<rmunn> Interesting, it seems ca.debian.org is in Firefox's default list of trusted CA's, so https://alioth.debian.org/ gives me a scary-looking security warning... Wonder if there's room for an improvement somewhere here.
<Laney> (I'm thinking of Debian too)
<lfaraone> rmunn: once you're accepted, do http://wiki.debian.org/PAPT_Howto , substituting "python-modules"  for "python-apps"
<bdrung_> Laney: backportability is a valid argument against it.
<Laney> yes
<Laney> after squeeze and lucid and bpo are all done, then fine
<Laney> but until then, be conservative
<Laney> that's my guideline :)
<lfaraone> Laney: that's my argument against dh7 too :)
<oojah> Laney: When I try to get it into debian, I can revert the quilt 3.0 format if needed, it's a trivial change.
<bdrung_> lfaraone: dh simple rules and it's overrides rock!
<bdrung_> oojah: you don't have to.
<lfaraone> bdrung_: I don't disagree :)
<Laney> but that's in hardy-backports and bpo
<Laney> *and* it is a massive massive win over the old style
<lfaraone> rmunn: then add your package name to the topic in #debian-python (on irc.oftc.net) in the appropriate place at the end of the queue.
<bdrung_> oojah: look at http://upsilon.cc/~zack/stuff/dpkg-v3/
 * oojah nods
<lfaraone> rmunn: confused yet? :)
<BlackZ> hello, in a old-package that has karmic should I use lucid, right?
<BlackZ> I'm updating a package
<lfaraone> BlackZ: use lucid's version of the package, yes
<BlackZ> lfaraone: so emesene (1.5-1ubuntu2) lucid; urgency=low is right?
<lfaraone> BlackZ: if you're doing a new upstream version, it should be 0ubuntu1, no?
<lfaraone> BlackZ: what exactly are you "updating"?
<bdrung_> rmunn: finally upload nltk
<bdrung_> s/upload/uploaded/
<BlackZ> lfaraone: 1.5-1ubuntu1 to 1.6-0ubuntu1 is right?
<BlackZ> it's a new upstream version
<lfaraone> BlackZ: yes, that is correct, assuming 1.6 is the new release.
<bdrung_> BlackZ: if the new upstream version is 1.6, yes
<rmunn> bdrung_, Excellent, thanks.
<BlackZ> ok, so I'm right
<BlackZ> thanks!
<lfaraone> BlackZ: hint, you can use "dch -v 1.6-0ubuntu1" to quickly modify the changelog.
<BlackZ> lfaraone: I'm editing it manually
<lfaraone> BlackZ: that's fine, dch just makes it easier I've found.
<bdrung_> BlackZ: at least dch -me '' updates the timestamp
<jcfp> BlackZ: emesene is already at 1.6-1 in lucid though, in case you're really working on that.
<lfaraone> bdrung_: is it worth mentioning to people that "(C)" isn't valid in copyright files, and that they should use Â©?
<BlackZ> jcfp: ah ok
<bdrung_> lfaraone: yes
<bdrung_> or use Copyright
<lfaraone> bdrung_: well, they use "Copyright (C)". I'll say it's a wishlist bug :)
<Laney> oojah: test building
<BlackZ> jcfp: however look at autotrash's upload, I have fixed the issues
<BlackZ> jcastro: if there's again issue(s), please let me to know :)
<BlackZ> ops
<BlackZ> jcfp: if there's again issue(s), please let me to know :)
<BlackZ> jcastro: sorry, tab mistake
<jcastro> no worries!
#ubuntu-motu 2010-02-16
<Laney> oojah: Cool. I have a couple of comments but I'll give you a conditional advocation
<oojah> Laney: Ok, thanks.
<oojah> What's the condition?
 * Laney is writing it on REVU now
<oojah> Duh, yeah
<rmunn> lfaraone, thanks for the advice on Debian package submission about 15 minutes ago. (Was AFK for a bit). Saved an IRC transcript and I'll read it over later -- only mildly confused at this point, which probably goes to show that I don't have my head wrapped around the process yet. :-)
<lfaraone> Short descriptions  should almost always start with a lowercase letter, right?
<lfaraone> rmunn: no problem. for "normal" non-python packages (or those where you just feel like "being a rebel"), you can upload to mentors.debian.net (like REVU), and search for a sponsor, but with DPMT you're spared the sponsor search and get the benefits from group-maintenance. :)
<BlackZ> good night guys ;)
<Laney> oojah: go go go
<Laney> you can ping me to re-advocate after you fix it if you want
<Laney> but it's not really necessary
<oojah> Laney: Thanks very much.
<oojah> Very good point about the copyright which ought to have been obvious.
<Laney> That's fresh in my mind because I did something with some PD work recently
<oojah> I'll have to deal with them tomorrow now.
<PATX> i made a needs packaging bug a couple months ago but nothing has really been done... how could i get someone to look at it? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/416634
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 416634 in ubuntu "[needs-packaging] fastpatx - quick and simple web browser" [Wishlist,New]
<Laney> !revu
<ubottu> REVU is a web-based tool to give people who have worked on Ubuntu packages a chance to "put their packages out there" for other people to look at and comment on in a structured manner. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU
<Laney> PATX: use revu if you have a package to submit
<lfaraone> PATX: you should submit it to REVU :)
<PATX> Laney, thanks :)
<PATX> thanks everybody :)
<oojah> Laney: Come out some time, I'll buy you a beer.
<Laney> oojah: I will and maybe even can now that nlug seems to have moved to Wednesdays
<lfaraone> hopefully the next US UDS will be on the East Coast <_<;
<Laney> I think I'm doing something this week, but maybe that's lies because I don't actually remember what it is
<Laney> oh, going to Fun in the Afternoon in London
<james_w> lfaraone: if xdgapp is going to be pulled in to groundcontrol and the package is already in Ubuntu then we should remove xdgapp from Ubuntu for this release IMO
<oojah> I rarely make it to nlug, but will be meeting former nlug peeps for drinks at some point in the next few weeks.
<Laney> oojah: let me know if it's not a monday/thursday and I'll see what I can do
<oojah> Will mention it in #nlug.
<PATX> How do I upload to REVU?
<oojah> Night!
<lfaraone> james_w: well, we're still on appeal on that one :)
<Laney> cool
<Laney> see ya
<lfaraone> PATX: see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU
<DmitryKurochkin> I am repeating myself, but if someone has time to review a package, please take a look at http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/polygraph. The is one advocation already.
<bdrung_> oojah: the link in debian/watch should be a comment, too
<Laney> oh, rats
<Laney> I noticed another thing >:(
<bdrung_> Laney: ?
<Laney> get-orig-source should always download the same thing
<bdrung_> it will get more complex
<Laney> so?
<Laney> its purpose is to reconstruct the upstream tarball
<Laney> oh shit
<Laney> !language
<ubottu> Please watch your language and topic to help keep this channel family friendly.
<Laney> that's actually a lie, and me misremebering policy
 * Laney thinks that policy is wrong here
<bdrung_> Laney: it has to grep the upstream version from debian/changelog and get the right git revision to checkout
<bdrung_> (and not the other way around)
<Laney> actually it has to get the most recent version
<Laney> but I would rather it got the version that we want to upload
<Laney> dpkg-parsechangelog can make this easy enough
<PATX> Ok, so how long will it take for two MOTUs to review http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/fastpatx ?
<Laney> a long time :)
<Laney> you might try PAPT in Debian
<PATX> PAPT?
<bdrung_> PATX: fix all lintian reports and then ask again
<PATX> bdrung_ ok...
<lfaraone> PATX: example, apparently you're building a debian-native package. Did you forget to include the orig.tar.gz file above where your package directory is?
<lfaraone> Laney: oh, that's what policy says? screw policy, then.
<lfaraone> Laney: that's really odd.
<Laney> yes, it sucks
<lfaraone> Laney: here's the get-orig-source rule I used for a git-using package I work on: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~lfaraone/gtksheet/debian/annotate/head%3A/debian/rules#L19 , that might be useful to borrow from.
<Laney> lfaraone: tell it to oojah
 * Laney is a mere reviewer here
<lfaraone> oojah: here's the get-orig-source rule I used for a git-using package I work on: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~lfaraone/gtksheet/debian/annotate/head%3A/debian/rules#L19 , that might be useful to borrow from.
<PATX> ok one error is that my email is not @ubuntu.com how can i fix this?
<persia> PATX: Run update-maintainer in the package directory
<PATX> ok thanks then i can use my email?
<persia> How do you mean?
<StevenK> I think he wants to set the maintainer address to his own e-mail address
<PATX> well i do not have a patx@ubuntu.com so when i upload the pkg to REVU i need to use my gmail correct?
<PATX> StevenK, could i do anything else?
<PATX> but yea thats what i want
<persia> PATX: If you're submitting something to be included in Ubuntu, you want to set the maintainer to be an Ubuntu team (all the developers is the default).  The common practice is to set one's own name and email as XSBC-Original-Maintainer.  If you already have your own name and email as the Maintainer, update-maintainer will do this automatically.
<PATX> ok
 * persia wonders if this remains appropriate default behaviour given the proliferation of third-party repositories for which nobody in Ubuntu wishes to claim any responsibility
<PATX> do i run that before or after buildng?
<persia> At any point, but you'll want to have run it before you prepare the source package for upload.
<PATX> ok
<PATX> Ok now how would I go about fixing "This package has no debian/watch file or get-orig-source rule."?
<persia> PATX: man uscan to read about watch files
<PATX> ok ty
<PATX> persia, so i have to make a debian/watch???
<persia> That's the best practice, yes.
<PATX> would my pkg have any chance of getting in w/ out one?
<persia> PATX: How would anyone know when the package needs to be updated without one?
<PATX> idk
<persia> But that aside, since FeatureFreeze is in a couple days, your application has a decidedly low chance of making it anyway.
<persia> But yeah, the watch file is an important component of our ability to make sure the archive is in reasonable shape.
<PATX> ok
<PATX> so should i just wait to do this untill the next version of ubuntu?
<persia> Actually, now isn't a bad time to get a package in shape.
<persia> But don't be surprised if it doesn't make the lucid deadline.
<persia> My recommendation would be to get the package in the best shape you can, and submit it to Debian.
<persia> That way it can be synced when archive opens for the next release.
<persia> if it doesn't get into Debian in that time, you can go back to chasing REVU.
<PATX> ok
<Gaming4JC> I wasn't quite sure where to ask this, but the BZFlag client is out dated in the main repos - since they came out with an entirely new client today. http://sourceforge.net/projects/bzflag/
<persia> Today?  Ugh.  That doesn't leave much time.
<persia> Please file a bug against bzflag requesting an upgrade.
<Gaming4JC> using launchpad?
 * Gaming4JC goes there...
<persia> ubuntu-bug bzflag is probably the easiest way to file it.
<Gaming4JC> ok thanks, and what about another substantially outdated one... Blender?
<Gaming4JC> file a bug report for that too? 2.49b has been out for almost a year
<Gaming4JC> lol
<persia> Blender is kinda special.
<wgrant> 2.49.2 is in Lucid.
<wgrant> And yes, Blender is a very special thing.
<Gaming4JC> really? o.O
<wgrant> Ah, and 2.49.2 is actually 2.49b
<Gaming4JC> persia: This correct? :) https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/bzflag/+bug/522448
<ubottu> Error: This bug is private
<nigelb> I've been working on fixing a small bug, but I run into issues because the quilt patch is applying changes on a file that gets deleted at build time.  So, how do I go about fixing it?
<persia> Gaming4JC: Except I don't know why you've made it private.
<persia> nigelb: Why are you patching a file that gets deleted at build time?
<Gaming4JC> persia: hmm, I'm unsure as well considering I never checked that option anywhere lol o.O
<persia> Gaming4JC: If you make it less private, I'll tell you if it works.
<nigelb> persia: I'm still unsure where its being deleted at build time or renamed
<nigelb> s/where/whether
<persia> nigelb: The build log should tell you.
<nigelb> where do I see the build log?
<nigelb> ah, the .build file
<persia> How did you build it?
<nigelb> debuild -S -sa
<nigelb> yes, it is getting deleted "rm -f rules/evdev rules/evdev.xml.in"
<Gaming4JC> persia: made it public. :)
<nigelb> so that means, I can ignore the mistake in that file since its going to be deleted anyway?
<persia> nigelb: Maybe: it depends on whether it gets used before it is deleted.
<nigelb> Is it possible to figure that out from the logs?
<persia> Usually.  Look for previous uses of the filename in the log.
<nigelb> only the rm -f statement
<persia> Then it's probably not used.
<nigelb> so, I can skip patching that file and its okay?
<persia> Gaming4JC: Did bzflag do their usual thing and not allow older clients?
<persia> nigelb: Test and see :)
<nigelb> thank you.  Checking now :)
<Gaming4JC> persia: sort of, they still allow the old client but keep telling me to update all the time
<persia> Gaming4JC: Hrm.  That's better than it used to be, but still a clear hint.  Thanks.
<Gaming4JC> np :)
<Gaming4JC> well, 'tis late here
<Gaming4JC> ttyl and thank man :D
<Gaming4JC> thanks*
<nigelb> how do I know pbuilder successfully built a package? lack of errors?
<suji11> how to create package for hunspell-ta ? i'm having the dic file and aff file.
<suji11> how to i review the packages in revu.ubuntuwire.com
<nigelb> I'm looking for a main sponser to review a patch I have submitted :)
<nigelb> anyone around?
<nigelb> persia: ^^
<nigelb> bug 398873
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 398873 in xkeyboard-config "Typo in gnome-keyboard-properties" [Low,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/398873
<micahg> any ubuntu-sru members around to see if something is SRU worthy?
<micahg> nigelb: main sponsors are in #ubuntu-devel
<nigelb> oh, thanks micahg
<eagles0513875> hey guys i have read through the packaging documentation. how does one determine out of the various packaging methods available which one is the best for that particular package or situation?
<toabctl> i try to fill a syncrequest with: requestsync -d unstable -n --lp -s python-pisa lucid
<toabctl> but the error is: E: The package 'python-pisa' does not exist in the Debian primary archive in 'sid'
<toabctl> but the package is available: see http://packages.debian.org/sid/python-pisa
<randomaction> toabctl: this package is very new
<toabctl> randomaction, yes. that's a problem?
<randomaction> try again in several hours
<toabctl> ok
<toabctl> thx
<randomaction> yes, PTS has no information on it yet: http://packages.qa.debian.org/p/pisa.html
<eagles0513875> randomaction: im just wondering. i read through all the packaging guide and im a little lost. how does one determine which method is correct to use or does it depend on what the type of package is
<randomaction> eagles0513875: What's your problem?
<eagles0513875> randomaction: not a problem im just trying to understand the purpose of having so many different packaging methods and how to choose the right one. im hoping to eventually become an motu but i need to get my packaging skills up to snuff first.
<dholbach> good morning
<eagles0513875> good morning dholbach
<dholbach> hi eagles0513875
<eagles0513875> dholbach: are motus responsible for all repos? or just in charge of the packages
<dholbach> eagles0513875: as a MOTU you can upload packages to universe and multiverse
<eagles0513875> im not motu yet im still trying to figure out packaging. i read through the complete packaging guide yet im confused as to how to determine which out of all the options available for packaging is ideal to use, or is it dependent on the type of package that needs to be created?
<dholbach> there's lots of different ways to get a package done
<eagles0513875> so it is dependent on what i get used to
<dholbach> I learned the most by working on existing packages
<dholbach> so you just modify small bits here and there in order to fix a bug and you get exposed to whatever the maintainer thought they'd use for packaging
<dholbach> that way you learn multiple approaches
<eagles0513875> ok kool will give that a try :)
<eagles0513875> question about mentoring. it is where someone takes me for ex under their wing and shows me how to fix the bugs etc?
<dholbach> AFAIK the mentoring programme is having difficulties at the moment
<dholbach> so it's probably better to start off on your own and just ask questions in here
<dholbach> there's always somebody around to help out
<iulian> G'morning dholbach.
<dholbach> oi iulian! how are you doing?
<iulian> dholbach: I'm doing fine.  How about you?
 * iulian is doing his physics homework now.
 * eagles0513875 is doing programming hw
<dholbach> iulian: good - thanks :)
<eagles0513875> dholbach: last question. whose in charge over all of maintaining the repositories? cuz im trying to upgrade from karmic to lucid and im getting a 403 on one of the repos
<dholbach> eagles0513875: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+archivemirrors
<dholbach> some mirrors might be a bit out of sync
<eagles0513875> this one hasnt been working since yesterday though
<slytherin> Does anyone know what does 'Apply to be an official mirror of this distribution' mean when registering new mirror?
<eagles0513875> slytherin: you got me curious as well about that
<slytherin> eagles0513875: If I understand correctly the official mirror (whichever it is) will be used by installer when doing a fresh install.
<eagles0513875> slytherin: i dont quite understand
<slytherin> eagles0513875: When I install Ubuntu from scratch the installer will have a list of official mirror for each country. So if the country I selected ininstaller has a official mirror assigned that mirror will be set in /etc/apt/sources.list.
<eagles0513875> slytherin: i know that but the one i have i hate using it cuz its on such a slow connection. and there is only one for my country. im wondering if i could setup a virtual machine with another mirror for my country
<slytherin> eagles0513875: Or you could buy some hosting space through community funding and manager a mirror.
<slytherin> s/manager/manage
<eagles0513875> i have a monster desktop that i can run a vm on. thats not a problem for me
<slytherin> eagles0513875: Do you own a domain and static IP?
<eagles0513875> i do own a domain but its pointed at another server atm :(
<slytherin> eagles0513875: you can use services such a sdyndns
<slytherin> http://www.dyndns.com/
<eagles0513875> slytherin: i already do
<slytherin> then setting up the mirror should not be a big trouble.
<eagles0513875> slytherin: do you have any documentation or anything for that
<slytherin> I believe Ubuntu wiki does have some documentation.
<slytherin> eagles0513875: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Archive/Mirroring
<eagles0513875> thanks slytherin
<oojah> Laney: I've uploaded a new sqlite3-pcre if you wanted to check the get-orig-source.
<Laney> advocated
<oojah> Ta
<oojah> I'm looking for a second advocate for http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/sqlite3-pcre Can anybody help?
 * Laney adds a ticker to the agda-stdlib build
<Laney> Agda + armel are not friends
<persia> Laney: How does the ticker work?  I think schroot suffers from the same issue (although it may be that it's trying to build stuff that shouldn't be built for arch:any)
<Laney> persia: it just generates some output so the build isn't timed out
<persia> Laney: Does one do this with a parallel process, or just extra noisiness in the part that hits the timeout?
<Laney> a parallel process (it's just a simple shell script)
<Laney> watches for the build's PID and the creation of the build-stamp file, typically
<Laney> http://git.debian.org/?p=pkg-haskell/agda.git;a=blob;f=debian/watcher.sh;h=0de582d7162cd262e89a43dbd19c154d460ca294;hb=HEAD
<Laney> like that
<persia> Laney: And how does one call it?
<Laney> sh debian/watcher.sh "$$PPID" "$(CURDIR)" "$(CURDIR)/build-stamp" 'ghc' &
<Laney> the locking part was added by me because I couldn't figure out how to get cdbs not to call it multiple times
<persia> So PPID is the PID of the make executing debian/rules?
<Laney> yes
<persia> Nifty.  I'll definitely have to give that a shot.
<Laney> you could definitely make it more specific to your failure case, but this is general enough to work without much effort
<Laney> even if it adds some noise to the build output
<persia> Laney: That's why I asked :)  I wanted something that didn't require thought to get stuff to compile.  Actually optimising to make it not need to take so long is step two.
<lbrinkma> What's the status about the libmysqlclient problem?
<persia> lbrinkma: last I saw there was still discussion about how to fix it in an sane manner.  I thought it only affected building packages.
<lbrinkma> persia: yes, it's true. But i want to upload a package to REVU that depends on anjuta and anjuta depends on libaprutil, and that on libmysqlclient. So it won't work
<persia> REVU doesn't build anything, so it'll be fine.
<lbrinkma> persia: but it's hard to test it when i can't build it
<persia> lbrinkma: Indeed, and hard to review for the same reason :)
<paissad> i know it's not a question related to the channel, but  i just would like to know if ppa lauchnpad accepts uploads of freewares ( i packaged a software whose source code is not available .... it's already built)
<slytherin> paissad: The Launchpad usage policy forbid that.
<paissad> slytherin, ok thanks
<persia> Does it?
<persia> I know Ubuntu accepts some freeware under certain conditions (but we don't like it, and drop it if it's buggy)
<slytherin> paissad: persia: I remember reading the usage conditions some time back. Can not find a link to it now. Asking on #launchpad for clarification is best.
<persia> Generally :)
<slytherin> paissad: Found this - https://help.launchpad.net/PPATermsofUse
<paissad> ok
<om26er> if it want to update a package in lucid what should I do? open [needs packaging] bug or needs update/or something like that?
<slytherin> om26er: Are you going to work on update?
<persia> om26er: It's not a "needs packaging" bug.  It's an "upgrade" bug.  Just identify the target version, the rationale, and add the upgrade tag.
<om26er> persia, ok, thanks
<om26er> slytherin, I will try :)
<slytherin> as persia said, it is upgrade bug. But if the package exists in Debian then first check if anyone is working on upgrade.
<om26er> slytherin, it just released
<om26er> like an hour ago
<slytherin> om26er: that does not mean you have to update it in Ubuntu first. :-)
 * Laney is going to kick off the haskell transition later, probably
<Laney> fun fun fun :)
<Laney> later = now
 * Laney uploads ghc6
<persia> Go, Go, Go!
<Laney> http://people.canonical.com/~pitti/scripts/syncpackage is a useful script
<persia> Laney: Take care: I've seen requests that people not use that.
<persia> Laney: It's usually not *too* hard to get a friendly archive-admin to do a batch together.
<Laney> persia: how come?
<Laney> I will be requesting a *lot* of syncs in the next days
<persia> Because, although it does mostly the right thing, it does it in a way that is messy within Soyuz somehow.
<Laney> oh
<persia> Just find an archive admin, and tell them the plan, and have them run the syncs.
<persia> I believe the current script is similar to the one you referenced, but it's designed to be run inside Soyuz, from what I understand.
<Laney> it will just look like a normal upload
<Laney> maybe syncs have some special processing
<persia> They do.
 * persia doesn't know the details, but suspects an archive-admin would be willing to explain.  Might ask in -devel
<Laney> james_w: ^^^ ?
<james_w> Laney: I'd be happy to bulk-sync things for you
<Laney> cool. Is it really not advised to use that script?
 * Laney mainly does it to avoid hassling people
<ripps> Hey, any broken packages that need some packaging fixed? I looking to help a bit
<Laney> subject: ghc6_6.12.1-9_source.changes rejected
<Laney> :(
<Laney> james_w: could you do that sync? ghc6 from unstable
<james_w> Laney: I'd only be repeating what others told me if I said that it wasn't advised. I don't know the details
<Laney> it's a big orig
<james_w> Laney: I can try
<Laney> thanks
<directhex> what's the best way to turn a normal bug into a requestsync?
<Laney> edit the title and description, i'd have thought
<Laney> or invalid it and requestsync again
<Rhonda> And add the appropirate team.
<directhex> & subscribe archive admin, since i'm motu & it's in loonyverse?
<Laney> yes
<Laney> + confirmed
<sebner> persia: urgh, cjwatson is on holidays this week, we have to find someone else to backport it on the buildmachines :\
<persia> sebner: Check with jdong about the base backport: he is the backport master (but first make sure a backport to hardy works locally for you)
<sebner> directhex: + wishlist if you are motivated :P
<sebner> persia: aye
<directhex> if --lp is recommended, as per --help, then why isn't it the default behaviour?
<Laney> it requires setting up credentials, I guess
<Laney> higher barrier to entry
<sebner> Laney: funnily that never worked for me Â¬_Â¬
<Laney> ~/.udtrc would be good though
<Laney> sebner: what's that?
<slytherin> ripps: take a look at FTBFS page. http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/ftbfs
<sebner> Laney: setting up credentials
<slytherin> sebner: What problem did you get?
<geser> directhex: mostly historic reason, as requestsync was using mail at first, then later used python-launchpad-bugs (still before the LP API) nobody wanted to change the default of "mail"
<sebner> slytherin: hmm, can't remember but I'll give it another try so we can discuss that. Btw, what benefit do I have from it?
<slytherin> sebner: When you use --lp it retrives info from Launchpad and hence will skip a few questions.
<geser> sebner: you could use "ubuntu-build" for give-backs :)
<slytherin> geser: I believe the command is buildd
<sebner> ah, yes that's quite something useful :D
<geser> slytherin: no, it got renamed to ubuntu-build in lucid since it conclicted with buildd from the package buildd (and I'm sure about it as I did the rename :)
<slytherin> Oh. I haven't moved to lucid yet and do not plan to until it becomes final.
<sebner> slytherin: ok, how do I set this stuff up? =)
<sebner> geser: what about "package-rebuild" or "ubuntu-rebuild" :P
<geser> sebner: "man manage-credentials" and c&p the example from there
<slytherin> sebner: man manage-credentials, simplest form - manage-credentials create -c ubuntu-dev-tools
<sebner> what level of access is common?
<geser> write non-private
<geser> you need it for filing sync requests
<sebner> persia: argh, I just realized that dpkg itself is now also debsrc3.0 -.-
<sebner> slytherin: geser: seems to have worked :D
<persia> sebner: Well, in that case, find some recipe that allows you to handle the backport.  Passing someone a working recipe and asking them to execute is surely smoother than "Please do this hard thing" :)
<sebner> heh
<slytherin> sebner: backporting 3.0 package should not be hard. Try changing the 3.0 in format file to 1.0.
<sebner> slytherin: well, it's not that easy with dpkg I suppose :P
<slytherin> sebner: How do you know, did you try? :-)
<sebner> slytherin: I'm currently looking at it
 * Laibsch hopes we don't miss the boat again for http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/ffgtk
<Laibsch> porthose: maybe you can take another look if it meets your requirements now?
<oojah> Could someone please take a look at sqlite3-pcre? I'm looking for a second advocate.
<Jeeves_> Hi all
<shadeslayer> Jeeves_: hi
<Jeeves_> I'm building a private package for sophie (sophos libsavi virusscanner)
<Jeeves_> that package depends on libsavi, for which there isn't a package available
<Jeeves_> now dh_shlibdeps is byting me.
<Jeeves_> Any hints on skipping dh_shlibdeps?
<geser> Jeeves_: is libsavi part of sophie?
<Jeeves_> geser: No
<Jeeves_> It is part of a non-packaged piece of software
<Jeeves_> I've tried adding --dpkg-shlibdeps-params=--ignore-missing-info to dh in the rules file
<geser> then you need to package it first? else how should your sophie package work with it?
<Jeeves_> geser: I install the software before building the package
<Jeeves_> I cannot package the other software, which is closed source and dynamically updated
<geser> Jeeves_: and your user? the expect that "apt-get install sophie" gives them a working software
<Jeeves_> geser: We are the only users.
<Jeeves_> It's a private package in a completly controlled environment
<geser> the best solution would be to also package libsavi for your use (even if it's closed source, you can skip the compilation part)
<ari-tczew> please take a look for clean sync @ bug 522700
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 522700 in convirt "Sync convirt 1.1-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/522700
<Jeeves_> geser: There's no way to skip shlibdebs?
<geser> Jeeves_: I don't know of any (which would a hack anyways)
<jcastro> hyperair, congratulations!
<hyperair> jcastro: thanks. =)
 * hyperair just saw jcastro's retweet
<jcastro> ok so that means I'll get new banshee in lucid ... ? :p
<tsmithe> persia, you around?
<mr_steve> Hey MOTUs, if someone could have a look at http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/cnetworkmanager I'd sure appreciate it. Thanks in advance.
<persia> tsmithe: Kinda, but in the middle of three different things.
<persia> tsmithe: I presume this is because I didn't actually upload musecore yet?
<tsmithe> ok. pisa has just been uploaded to debian; i was wondering if it could be synced; how should i request that?
<tsmithe> oh, and yeah :p
<persia> tsmithe: File a sync request bug (requestsync is a good tool for this).
<tsmithe> ok.
<tsmithe> if it gets in before you upload musescore, hold on, and i'll make a new package which employs pisa to generate the offline manauls
<tsmithe> *manuals
<tsmithe> (do you think that's likely?)
<persia> Let's do that as a bugfix later if it all works by feature-freeze.  Adding more coordination increases the risk of failure prior to that.
<persia> I presume we can use the same orig.tar.gz?
<tsmithe> that's what i thought
<tsmithe> and yes
<persia> Yeah, let's do it that way then: so we don't hit the wall in 21 hours.
<persia> Err, 31 hours.
<tsmithe> cool; i was just concerned that you'd "waste" an upload :)
<tsmithe> persia, sync request done; thanks. it's bug 522718
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 522718 in ubuntu "Sync pisa 3.0.32-1 (universe) from Debian sid (main)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/522718
<mhall119|work> can someone point me to where I can learn about what a package branch is, and how it should be maintained?
 * popey also has a question..
<popey> I'm looking at packaging something which is mostly just a shell script and a few other support files - source only - is there a package in the repo that i could learn from in terms of debian/rules and debian/install ?
<james_w> hi mhall119|work
<james_w> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DistributedDevelopment has some information
<james_w> basically a package branch is just using bzr to do packaging
<james_w> or indeed any other VCS
<james_w> therefore it's basically using bzr, with a few extra commands layered on top for packaging-specific operations
<james_w> popey: try ubumirror
<popey> thanks
<mhall119|work> thanks james_w
<mhall119|work> trying to learn the right way of doing all this
<hyperair> https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-motu <-- "Ubuntu MOTU Developers does not use Launchpad ..."
<hyperair> heheh
<mhall119|work> ok, I'm making package for Qimo (https://launchpad.net/qimo), it has no upstream package, so what should I put in debian/watch to satisfy lintian?
<hyperair> # lintian sucks
<abogani> mhall119|work: IMHO You should explain it into debian/watch!
<james_w> mhall119|work: if you make it a "native package" then lintian shouldn't complain
<mhall119|work> james_w: what's the difference in a "native package"?
<Laney> I'd just explain it in README.source or elsewhere
<Laney> (I presume you are package as a snapshot)
<jbernard> james_w: thanks for sync'ing liblua-iconv
<mhall119|work> abogani: explain it how?  a # comment?
<hyperair> yeah, a # comment
<mhall119|work> Laney: I'm the original developer
<james_w> mhall119|work: it's a package that is only intended for Debian-based systems, and so doesn't have an upstream releasing tarballs etc.
<Laney> mhall119|work: can't you make a release?
<mhall119|work> Laney: you mean just a tarball?
<Laney> sure
<mhall119|work> it has to copy files into /etc/xdg, /etc/X11 and /usr/share
<mhall119|work> could I do that with just a tarball?
<mhall119|work> the project is hosted on launchpad
<mhall119|work> james_w: how do I make a native package?
<james_w> a release can just be making a tarball from your bzr branch
 * mhall119|work hasn't a bzr branch
<mhall119|work> which is why I was asking about making package branches
<james_w> however, if there is no reason why anyone would use it outside of Ubuntu then you can just make a native package
<mhall119|work> ok, how do I make a native package?
<james_w> which you just do by changing the version number to have no "-" in it, so if it's 1.0-0ubuntu1 currently just make it 1.0
<mhall119|work> oh, ok, I'll try that
<mhall119|work> I get this warning:
<mhall119|work> W: qimo-wallpaper: latest-debian-changelog-entry-changed-to-native
<mhall119|work> is that okay?
<james_w> mhall119|work: that sounds like lintian trying to protect you, but yeah, that's what you intend
<mhall119|work> james_w: could you have a look: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?upid=7831
<mhall119|work> it says it has no .orig.tar.gz, but it's in the file list
<persia> hyperair: Just FYI, there's a bit of a technical glitch: you'll be a MOTU soon.
<hyperair> persia: okay. take your time =)
<DmitryKurochkin> Looking for a second advocate for polygraph package - http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/polygraph. Can somebody review it, please?
<bdrung_> can one motu have a look at yofrankie: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?upid=7812
<sebner> bdrung_: uhh, you will win the money :D
 * hyperair clicks
<hyperair> DmitryKurochkin: the current policy version is 3.8.4.0
<DmitryKurochkin> hyperair: lintian compleined about it (I suppose it was not updated), so I uploaded with standards-version 3.8.3. No problem to update it again, no changes required.
<hyperair> DmitryKurochkin: this is more of an aesthetic thing, but were the last two lines of debian/copyright intentionally wrapped like that? it looks like premature wrapping
<hyperair> DmitryKurochkin: "Documentation, test results, ... available at www.web-polygraph.org" <-- i think you should put the http:// there
<lightnin> Please help: I've got a programming language for kids called "Scratch" developed at MIT Media lab that I'm trying to get into multiverse. Needs to be revu 'ed..
<DmitryKurochkin> hyperair: wrapping in debian/copyright is intentional, "see" can be moved to the previous line but the file name will have to stay on the second line anyway.
<lightnin> http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/scratch
<hyperair> DmitryKurochkin: ah i see.
<DmitryKurochkin> hyperair: I would prefer to leave www.web-polygraph.org without http:// in the description. I think it looks better without http:// in sentences, and better with http:// in tables, etc.
<hyperair> hmm
<DmitryKurochkin> hyperair: it is a subjective thing, but if there is a policy on it, or recommended style, I will change it.
<hyperair> i don't think there's a policy on it, nor do i know if it's a recommended style, but i prefer to have the http:// there, due to strange issues that can arise from stuff ripping out descriptions and linkifying stuff on web pages
<hyperair> you know, without the http://, www.web-polygraph.org linkified would end up as http://the-site-you-saw-this-at.com/www.web-polygraph.org which would likely yield 404
<randomaction> hyperair: congrats!
<hyperair> randomaction: thanks!
<hyperair> DmitryKurochkin: that said, i think having the url in the description again is kind of redundant since it's in the Homepage: field. i think it would be better to rephrase the description to remove the url, if possible.
<DmitryKurochkin> hyperair: that is not true, take a look at http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/polygraph
<DmitryKurochkin> it is linked to http://www.web-polygraph.org./ there.
<DmitryKurochkin> that is not correct, but http:// would not help here
<hyperair> DmitryKurochkin: that's REVU. what about other not-known, crappily-written, not-well-maintained utilities out there that also rip out descriptions from packages?
<hyperair> but then again i know of any such utility out there
<hyperair> it isn't a major issue, just more of me nitpicking
<hyperair> DmitryKurochkin: oh yeah, one more thing.. your debian/copyright is fine as is, but it'd be better if you could follow http://dep.debian.net/deps/dep5/ in the future.
<DmitryKurochkin> I can fix it if you insist, removing the link is a better option perhaps.
<DmitryKurochkin> hyperair: yes, I have seen dep5 (after I packaged polygraph) and liked the idea. But I hope we can leave copyright as is for the initial upload and fix it later.
<hyperair> it's completely up to you. i'd advocate/upload it as is (when my advocating/uploading privileges arrive) already.
<DmitryKurochkin> hyperair: thanks! I was worried that I miss the deadline.
<lightnin> Is appropriate control file entry for Section: multiverse/devel when submitting to multiverse?
<hyperair> oho FF is tomorrow.
<sebner> hyperair: that'll be a tough night your you then :P
<sebner> *for
<DmitryKurochkin> Isn't it on February 18?
<hyperair> DmitryKurochkin: it's 17th here.
<hyperair> i'll go get some sleep
<hyperair> hopefully my uploading privileges arrive when i wake.
<oojah> I'm looking for a second advocate for sqlite3-pcre can anybody help?
<hyperair> sebner: or do you want to handle this?
<DmitryKurochkin> Ihyperair: hope they do :)
<hyperair> =)
<sebner> hyperair: I'm working on quite some packages right now, so I didn't read your dicussion. what's it about?
<hyperair> sebner: polygraph
<hyperair> http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/polygraph
<sebner> hyperair: urgh, I usually don't upload any cdbs packages (lack of knowledge) :P but I'll take a look later and upload it if nobody steps up first
<hyperair> sebner: heheh don't worry, that cdbs package is very simple. just three lines.
<hyperair> make that 4, with the #!
<sebner> hyperair: yeah, so I'm making a special exception for you :P
<hyperair> heheh
<sebner> what about these spelling warnings?
<hyperair> oh yeah, i think it'd be better if it could be patched up =\
<sebner> + Standards-Version
<DmitryKurochkin> sebner: it will be fixed in the next upstream release.
<hyperair> but spelling errors are completely an upstream thing.
<sebner> DmitryKurochkin: well, you certainly won't be able to upload a new upstream version (except bugfix only) but such a thing is no stopper bug for now
<james_w> mhall119|work: sorry, got distracted. Where did qimo-session_2.0.0.orig.tar.gz come from?
<mhall119|work> I just created a tarball of what I was trying to package
<james_w> but you don't want to do that in future as an extra step?
<mhall119|work> huh?
<mhall119|work> I don't understand what you're asking
<james_w> we were discussing earlier about whether there was an upstream that does releases
<mhall119|work> oh, right
<james_w> in effect that is what you did by creating that tarball, so you can continue doing it
<mhall119|work> debuild wanted a .orig.tar.gz, so I just make one to make it happy
<mhall119|work> ok
<james_w> ok
<mhall119|work> so is a package branch just a bzr branch of that tarball's content?
<james_w> you can just delete it now that you have changed the version number, rebuild and then re-upload and the warning will go away
<mhall119|work> or does the branch need to contain the tarball, plus the files it contains?
<james_w> or rather, will be less confusing as it won't contradict what is clearly there
<mhall119|work> oh, it was only necessary because it wasn't a native package before?
<james_w> yeah
<mhall119|work> ok, cool, thanks
<mhall119|work> do I need to do that now, or is it okay as is?
<james_w> debuild said (paraphrasing) "your version number suggests this package should have upstream releases, but you didn't give one of them too me, please do so"
<mhall119|work> right, before I changed the version number, makes sense now
<james_w> the content will be the same, so there's no real need
<mhall119|work> I thought it still needed it to create the diffs
<james_w> but if you don't then someone else will probably have this same conversation with you again :-)
<james_w> it would, but if you do a native package then there is no upstream to create diffs against
<mhall119|work> ok
<james_w> it just puts everything in one tarball
<lightnin> Please, oh mighty MOTUs: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/scratch
<mhall119|work> hey, that takes care of needing a debian/watch file too
<mhall119|work> hey lightnin
<highvoltage> for packages that contain cc-by-sa work, the full license needs to be included in the debian/copyright file, right?
<james_w> highvoltage: yes
<quadrispro> hello folks!
<sebner> hio quadrispro
<quadrispro> does REVU support debian 3.0 (quilt) format?
<quadrispro> hi sebner
<highvoltage> thanks james_w
<sebner> quadrispro: nope
<mhall119|work> james_w: how could it be included?
<mhall119|work> a link?
<quadrispro> :-(
<sebner> quadrispro: well, you can upload stuff but you can review it with your browser
<mhall119|work> a debian/CC-BY-SA file?
<highvoltage> mhall119|work: full text inside the copyright file
<quadrispro> sebner, thank you
<james_w> mhall119|work: verbatim
<sebner> quadrispro: *can't review I men
<sebner> *mean
<sebner> *arggh*
<mhall119|work> is it okay to keep the GPLv2 in debian/COPYING?
<mhall119|work> james_w: highvoltage: I'm uploading new packages now
<lightnin> Hiya mhall119|work
<mhall119|work> highvoltage: are you reviewing the latest?
 * abogani is converting to 3.0 (quilt) and find it very cool!
<mhall119|work> cause I fixed those warnings in your comment a while ago
<oojah> bdrung_: You looked at sqlite3-pcre yesterday. Would you have another look today? I could do with a second advocate.
<highvoltage> mhall119|work: I think -wallpapers will be ok now
<mhall119|work> thanks highvoltage
<mhall119|work> bbl, going to get some lunch, then to work on Qimo 2 Alpha 2 ISO
<highvoltage> mhall119|work: ok give me a ping when you're back
<Genscher> hey :) i am creating an ubuntu package and wondering where to install non-shared application data where I need read + write access.
<Genscher> I just don't know the ubuntu way on this. Is it $HOME/.application ?
<Genscher> or /var/lib/application
<lightnin> I'm trying to add a programming environment for kids called Scratch - developed at MIT Media lab. We've recently submitted to REVU, please take a look: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/scratch
<randomaction> Genscher: maybe you're looking for this? http://standards.freedesktop.org/basedir-spec/basedir-spec-latest.html
<Genscher> randomaction, indeed I think i am :)
<lightnin> Is this an appropriately formatted "original maintainer" line? XSBC-Original-Maintainer: Scratch Team <linux@scratch.mit.edu>
<lightnin> I found it here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/â¦iew#The%20control%20file
<lightnin> But Lintian doesn't like it: W: scratch source: unknown-field-in-dsc original-maintainer
<mhall119|work> highvoltage: did you look over the scratch package?
<highvoltage> mhall119|work: no, I lost my browser session yesterday!
<highvoltage> mhall119|work: I think -session will also be fine
<mhall119|work> highvoltage: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/scratch if you wouldn't mind
<sebner> DmitryKurochkin: uploaded. I updated the Standards-Version. I'm a little bit worrying about the source files because not a single one contains a license header but that's up to the archive-admins to decide
<DmitryKurochkin> sebner: thanks. What happens if archive-admins reject it after the freeze? Will I have a chance to fix and reupload the package?
<sebner> DmitryKurochkin: that needs to be fixed upstream and I doubt it'll be reviewed until FF
<sebner> DmitryKurochkin: which means *if* it gets rejected you might have to wait until lucid+1
<Laibsch> Is do-release-upgrade not yet capable of a hardy -> lucid upgrade?
<lifeless> no
<lifeless> (gotta love double negatives)
<DmitryKurochkin> sebner: what a proper license header should look like? License is mentioned in each source file currently, isn't that enough?
<Laibsch> lifeless: when is that scheduled to change?
<Laibsch> oops, wrong channel
<Laibsch> I hope you don't mind, though
<sebner> DmitryKurochkin: I'm not sure but using a full license header is common
<jpds> Laibsch: He meant that it is.
<sebner> DmitryKurochkin: see your copyright file (License:) but it might be enough as it's currently
<Laibsch> jpds: I just tried "sudo do-release-upgrade -d" and it wants to update to intrepid
 * Laibsch moves the discussion to ubuntu+1
<Laibsch> sorry for initial off-topic
<DmitryKurochkin> sebner: ok, I will wait and see. Where should I look at to know when package is accepted/rejected?
<sebner> DmitryKurochkin: I think you'll get a mail
<DmitryKurochkin> ok. sebner, hyperair, fabrice_sp thanks for review and advocating!
<fabrice_sp> kklimonda, ping (about picard)
<kklimonda> fabrice_sp: pong
<lifeless> Laibsch: oh, I see what you're asking. (Try to provide that additional detail in future ;). I suspect thats worth checking with e.g. mvo
<Laibsch> lifeless: what additional detail?
<lifeless> Laibsch: the behaviour you observe
<fabrice_sp> package is good, but lintian is complaining about big usr/share independent files. What do you think about splitting the package in 2?
<fabrice_sp> kklimonda, ^
<kklimonda> fabrice_sp: I didn't really want to divert from debian more than necessary to update it. especially this close to the FF date
<kklimonda> fabrice_sp: I agree that it should be split in two packages
<lifeless> Laibsch: can you pastebin the output ? mvo is here about the d-r-u -d selecting intrepid thing
<mvo> Laibsch: and ~/.update-manager-core/meta-release-lts-development too please
<Laibsch> lifeless: you're saying you were just suspecting it works and would have been more careful had you understood more clearly that apparently it wasn't working (the way I asked the question should have been enough of a hint).  Maybe you should give a less affirmative statement ("I would think so") when you don't really know because you have not tried.
<Laibsch> mvo: just a minute
<Laibsch> mvo: you want to continue discussion here or in ubuntu+1?
<fabrice_sp> kklimonda, that's also my concern. I'll upload it as-is. Could you contact the Debian maintainer about that?
<Laibsch> mvo: no such file
<lifeless> Laibsch: I'm saying I didn't even really understand the question; I thought you meant hardy->intreprid etc staged
<Laibsch> lifeless: OK
<lifeless> Laibsch: the additional detail of what actually happened when you tried made everything much clearer
<Laibsch> I meant the straight hardy -> lucid update
<kklimonda> fabrice_sp: sure - I'll do that
<lifeless> yes, we're clear on that now ;)
<fabrice_sp> kklimonda, thanks ;-)
<lifeless> (its why I grabbed mvo :) - not being able to test this is a bit of an issue :))
<mvo> Laibsch: hm, no file but "do-release-upgrade -d" was run? what is the output of "DEBUG_UPDATE_MANAGER=1 do-release-upgrade -d"  ? could you pastebin that for me please?
<Laibsch> mvo: OK, I will in a minute
<Laibsch> the update aborted anyway because of insufficient space in /var.  I have /var on a separate 1G partition which is usually more than enough.  Is there something that can be done about this or are users like me on their own?  (I don't have a problem recovering from this, others may)
<Laibsch> mvo: ^
<lifeless> Laibsch: I thought it wasn't selecting lucid?
<Laibsch> lifeless: it's selecting intrepid but aborting that update because of insufficient disk space
<Laibsch> I have to say, I didn't mind because I don't want to take the long route ;-)  and I also want to use this single chance I have (last computer running hardy) to test for upgrade for the benefit of all.
<mvo> Laibsch: the logs in /var/log/dist-upgrade/main.log will tell why it needs so much space. the download of the debs can be pretty heavy. if you can still reproduce theproblem that it selects intrepid instead of lucid, please put the debug output in a pastebin or mail it to me
<Laibsch> It's currently running
<Laibsch> So far, the system hasn't changed
<mvo> ok
<fabrice_sp> foolano, ping (about ebox)
<Laibsch> mvo: Here it is: http://paste.debian.net/60079/  Not sure it contains much information, but you be the judge
<bdrung_> fabrice_sp: can you have a look at http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?upid=7812 ? it depends on blender >= 2.49.2~dfsg aka 2.49b
<Laibsch> mvo: let me know if you want anything from /var/log/dist-upgrade/ as well
<fabrice_sp> bdrung_, looking now
<fabrice_sp> 156 Mb?!
<lifeless> Laibsch: is there a ~/.update-manager-core/meta-release-lts-development now?
<lifeless> Laibsch: or /root/.update-manager-core/meta-release-lts-development ?
<Laibsch> lifeless: neither
<mvo> Laibsch: if you ran it with sudo, please check /var/lib/update-manager/
<PATX> can i get some help with making a get-orig-source rule?
<PATX> are there any tutorials?
<Laibsch> PATX: I was looking for the same thing a while ago
<PATX> Laibsch, :) did u find anything?
<Laibsch> let me fetch what I did write after some googling
<Laibsch> PATX: no
<kklimonda> I need a helping hand with bug 482890 - it has to be ACK'd by someone who has supercow powers :)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 482890 in mozilla-noscript "Please merge mozilla-noscript 1.9.9.27-1 (universe) from Debian testing (main)" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/482890
<PATX> ok thanks :)
<Laibsch> PATX: it was piece work
<kklimonda> it's actually a sync - stupid ubottu
<PATX> yea...
<Laibsch> PATX: but ultimately, it's not hard
<Laibsch> hang on for a minute
<PATX> i cant find any help either lol... ok ty
<Laibsch> PATX: http://git.debian.org/?p=collab-maint/sqliteman.git;a=commitdiff;h=fabff284aa02e5a967ebdd142b18922b43f4a5fc
<Laibsch> ask if you have any further questions
<PATX> thanks dude :)
<Laibsch> but I think that diff should be enough
<Laibsch> Maybe I should write a short tutorial
<Laibsch> I was missing it at the time
<PATX> yea that would be a good idea
<Laibsch> mvo: http://paste.debian.net/60084/ and http://paste.debian.net/60085/ being /var/lib/update-manager/meta-release(-development).  The latter does contain a lucid and the former has no intrepid.  So, I'm not sure what's happening there.
<Laibsch> mvo: I'll file a wishlist bug about better handling of situations where space is tight.  Maybe there is something that can be done.  700MB-1G isn't always available in /var for your typical upgrade.
<Laibsch> mvo: actually that could be as simple as augmenting the error message with the suggestions a-c) from https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/update-manager/+bug/152580/comments/8
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 152580 in update-manager "Upgrade to gutsy beta crashes because of insufficient disc space" [Medium,Triaged]
<Laibsch> I'll see if I can come up with a patch
<mvo> Laibsch: thanks
<mvo> Laibsch: does "DEBUG_UPDATE_MANAGER=1 do-release-upgrade -d" as a normal user give any hints? I just tried that in a hardy vm and it gives me useful output before the sudo prompt about what its doing
<mvo> Laibsch: I'm still puzzled that it wants to upgrade you to intrepid
<Laibsch> OK
<Laibsch> I'll let that run
<Laibsch> normal user, no sudo?
<Laibsch> or
<mvo> normal user
<Laibsch> normal user, gaining root with sudo
<Laibsch> OK
<Laibsch> I'll leave out sudo
<mvo> it will automatically ask for sudo
<Laibsch> I see
<mvo> yeah, please leave sudo out
<mvo> it will call it when it needs it
<dooooomi> hi, i'm looking for a second advocate for gtklick, a metronome for JACK, written in python: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/gtklick
<Laibsch> mvo: could it be that a line like "deb-src http://ubuntu.intergenia.de/ubuntu karmic main restricted universe" in sources.list throws the update-manager off course?
<Laibsch> but even then the next logical step would be lucid and not intrepid
<mvo> Laibsch: I doubt that, it looks at the lsb_release output to figure out what version you are on
<mvo> Laibsch: nothing useful in the debug output?
<Laibsch> OK
<Laibsch> still running
<Laibsch> it's a slow computer running as a LAN server
<DmitryKurochkin> is there a web page where I can see what is in Ubuntu NEW queue? similar to http://ftp-master.debian.org/new.html?
<mvo> ok
<Laibsch> I'll let you know when it's done and give you the pastebin
<Laibsch> mvo: just as we spoke, the program finished: http://paste.debian.net/60091/  and the file you've been asking about is still not there
<Laibsch> JFTR, update-manager is the version from hardy-updates
<Ubuntuxer> Hi, is it possible to update the exaile package for Lucid yet?
<cjwatson> sebner: I'm told that mvo is taking care of it
<cjwatson> (dpkg)
<lifeless> Laibsch: mvo: fwiw on my hardy server:
<lifeless> DEBUG_UPDATE_MANAGER=1 do-release-upgrade -d
<lifeless> ...
<lifeless> authenticate 'lucid.tar.gz' against 'lucid.tar.gz.gpg'
<Laibsch> interesting
<lifeless> so its choosing lucid.
<Laibsch> thanks for testing
<mvo> cjwatson, sebner if we can find someone who enjoys perl more than me I would not mind at all to not do it (dpkg)
<mvo> lifeless, Laibsch: same for me in my vm (chosing lucid)
<mvo> Laibsch: I need to go to bed soon, can we continue debugging tomorrow?
<Laibsch> probably
<Laibsch> just try to catch me anytime
<Laibsch> I may not be in this channel and I don't run this nick 24/7, but I'm frequently in IRC
<lifeless> perhaps file a bug
<Laibsch> yeah
<cjwatson> mvo: I am happy to do it at some point this week, despite holiday; it shouldn't be hard
<cjwatson> mvo: in fact the perl bits of the existing hardy-cat patch apply cleanly, with only a one-line offset
<mvo> cjwatson: oh? I must have done something wrong then, when I briefly looked at it, the patch gave me loads of rejects
<Laibsch> mvo: one thing that may be different in my installation than on others; I have so far always used aptitude for upgrading to a new release.  It's the first time I use update-manager for it.
<mvo> probably some wrong version or something
<Laibsch> But it's quite possible that this machine never ran anything but hardy
<Laibsch> I don't remember
<cjwatson> mvo: lots of rejects, but not in the perl bits, afaics
<cjwatson> the man/Makefile.{am,in} changes can be dropped
<mvo> Laibsch: that should be ok, lsb_release -a gives you hardy there, right?
<Laibsch> yepp, it does
<cjwatson> mvo: although I think the Dpkg::Vendor changes may need some tweaks anyway
<Laibsch> http://paste.debian.net/60096/ is the full output
<mvo> Laibsch: hm, shold be fine. lets continue tomorrow
 * mvo waves
<Laibsch> sure
<Laibsch> thanks
<Laibsch> good night
<mvo> cjwatson: thanks, I can check it out tomororw, also FF is pretty pressing currently :/
<PATX> can someone tell me what the first problem on this page means? http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/revu1-incoming/fastpatx-1002160248/lintian
<PATX> i am not getting this i thought i defined this in debian/control...
<PATX> Build-Depends: cdbs (>=0.4.49), debhelper (>= 5), python-central (>=0.5.6), python
<PATX> debhelper (>= 5)
<PATX> ^^^
<geser> what value is in debian/compat?
<PATX> checks
<POX> 7
 * POX knows without looking
<PATX> 2
<PATX> oh...
<POX> that's debian/pycompat
<PATX> oh
 * POX knows without looking
<POX> ;)
<PATX> yea
<PATX> lol
<PATX> i dont have a compat...
<PATX> should i make one and put 7 in there?
<PATX> would that solve problem?
<PATX> oh wait nvm
<PATX> i have compat
<PATX> geser, so the value is 7 now...?
<Laibsch> some kind MOTU soul around to review (and hopefully endorse) http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/ffgtk ?
 * Laibsch is hopeful
<Laibsch> porthose?
<geser> PATX: depends on what debhelper level you want to use
<PATX> geser, 5...
<PATX> debhelper (>= 5)
<PATX> oh should there be a space there... does it matter?
<geser> than put 5 in debian/compat
<PATX> ah ok
<PATX> debhelper (>= 7)
<PATX> or should i use that?
<sebner> PATX: you can use it when you delete cdbs and update rules accordingly ;)
<PATX> ok
<PATX> and then the error:
<PATX> W: fastpatx source: native-package-with-dash-version
<PATX> how could i fix that?
<Laibsch> PATX: google for the error string
<PATX> ok
<Laibsch> you will usually find plenty of info for lintian errors
<RAOF> Also, lintian -i (or -I, I forget precisely which) will give you a big block of text about each error, which usually includes how to fix it.
<porthose> Laibsch, I'm busy working on something right now, maybe later if I have time :)
<Laibsch> porthose: I'd really appreciate it.  We already missed karmic, I don't want to miss Lucid again.
<RAOF> Laibsch: I can give a brief once-over.  Looking at the diff of ffgtk, you've modified a bunch of files from the .orig.tar.gz directly; that would usually be done in a patch with a patch system, although if you're maintaining it in git it can be a bit different.
<RAOF> Laibsch: Do you really need the explicit Depends on libgtk2.0-0, libxml, etc?  Why aren't they picked up in ${shlibs:Depends}?
<RAOF> Laibsch: Is the packaging already in collab-maint git?  What's the status with its ITP in Debian?
<Laibsch> RAOF: package maintenance will be in git (as for all my packages).  You're right, the patches should eventually be in a patch system, dpkg v3 is looming.  The things you raise are likely legacy from the person who did the first draft of the packaging.
<Laibsch> I'm sure I already pushed this to git.debian.org
<Laibsch> There is no ITP, yet, I'm shooting for inclusion in lucid now and that keeps me busy enough
<Laibsch> eventually, I intend to maintain this (as my other packages) in Debian since that is best for Ubuntu, Debian and just everybody.
<RAOF> Yup.
<Laibsch> but even under best circumstance, this won't hit Debian before the summer
<lifeless> its summer now
<Laibsch> depends on where you are
<Laibsch> ;-)
<RAOF> Before *next* summer :P
<lifeless> I suggest never ever ever using seasonal terms in global endeavours
<Laibsch> well, I'd say, even for you, summer is coming to an end
 * Laibsch is feelling springy
<Laibsch> lifeless seems to be a little nit-picker, hm?
 * ScottK looks outside at three feet of snow on the ground and is not.
<ScottK> (feeling springy)
<sebner> ScottK: great for staying at $HOME and updating stuff like crazy before FF :)
<ScottK> sebner: Fortunately none of it came in the last week, so I'm not trapped.
<ScottK> School finally resumes tomorrow.
<lifeless> Laibsch: sometimes perhaps. However it really does introduce confusion to say 'summer' or 'winter' in IRC/email etc.
<lifeless> it requires more context for recipients at a minimum
<RAOF> Laibsch: While my pbuilder is hard-a-work grabbing build-depends, I'd also suggest that you'd want to make an explicit call to autoreconf rather than relying on automake to see the right timestamps.
<Laibsch> RAOF: I will check that the dependencies are really necessary. git.debian.org will be updated with git-import-dsc once it has hit either Ubuntu (hoping for the best) or Debian, whichever comes first.  Can you give an endorsement once the dependencies have been double-checked?
<lifeless> I don't think its nitpicky to point this out and suggest that its better not to do it.
<sebner> ScottK: Everytime I read that or see that in TV (your phrase about school) it makes me kinda feel that parents are happy to get their children out of the house ^^
<ScottK> Kinda does not even begin to cover it.
<sebner> heh
<Laibsch> RAOF: you kind of lost me with that autoreconf.  I'm not a buildmaster, some dummy tutorial somewhere?
<Laibsch> RAOF: I promise to fix the issues you raised.  I hope they are not serious enough to block inclusion from lucid and would hope for an endorsement.
<RAOF> Laibsch: Ah, well.  You modify configure.ac & Makefile.am (somewhat unnecessarily, but it'll be nice when you submit that patch upstream); this won't actually have any effect unless configure & the various Makefile.in files are regenerated.
<Laibsch> that's been done by the guy who actually understands that stuff ;-)
<RAOF> Ah.  Your package doesn't build.  Or, rather, it doesn't error but no build system is actually called, so you end up with an empty package.
<oojah> Would a motu consider looking at http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/sqlite3-pcre ? I'm in need of a second advocate.
<RAOF> Oh, of course.  This would be because you don't *have* a configure script, or a Makefile.
<RAOF> You probably want an override_dh_auto_configure: target, calling ./autogen.sh
<Laibsch> ?
<Laibsch> it built fine for me
<Laibsch> Are you testing the latest version?
<RAOF> Did you build it in a pbuilder, from the source package you uploaded to revu?
<Laibsch> http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?upid=7845
<Laibsch> pbuilder
<Laibsch> or in this case pdebuild
<Laibsch> yes
<RAOF> Hm.  Upstream needs to learn to run âmake distcheckâ.
<Laibsch> let me retry, check the depends and ping you after that
<Laibsch> thank you for your input
<RAOF> It's not the depends that are the problem.
<Laibsch> I know
<Laibsch> But you raised it and I want to check
<Laibsch> "in einem Aufwasch"
<Laibsch> "while I'm at it"
<RAOF> Also - where are you getting ffgtk 0.7.91?  The tarballs I can find on your upstream link are for 0.7.3
<Laibsch> there's a watch file?
<Laibsch> there's a watch file ;-)
<Laibsch> Let me take a look
<Laibsch> http://www.tabos.org/ffgtk/download/
<RAOF> True.  It's just not linked from http://www.tabos.org/ffgtk/download.php
<Laibsch> no
<Laibsch> I'm working closely with upstream
<Laibsch> and that tarball was done on my request ;-)
<RAOF> Aaah.  Tell them to run âmake distcheckâ :)
<Laibsch> it's also tar.gz and not .bz2
<Laibsch> OK
<Laibsch> I will
<RAOF> Yeah, I noticed that.  With source v3 .bz2 would be fine, but .tar.gz will be more easily backportable.
<Laibsch> As you can see on revu, I was aiming for inclusion in karmic
<Laibsch> and AFAIK, dpkg v3 wasn't yet widely used back then
<Laibsch> I've only become aware of it very recently
<Laibsch> (and spent some time getting my hardy build host to understand dpkg v3)
<Laibsch> notice about "make distcheck" sent
<bcurtiswx> http://paste.ubuntu.com/377966/  anyone know what package i may be missing?
<Laibsch> bcurtiswx: cdbs
<Laibsch> look at lines 12-14
<Laibsch> install apt-file and then you can search for the package that has the file in question
<Laibsch> in this case, that's cdbs
<bcurtiswx> Laibsch: ty
<Laibsch> Interesting to see this question from somebody with @ubuntu.com ;-)
<bcurtiswx> Laibsch: i got my membership mainly from my bug triage abilites
<Laibsch> nice
<bcurtiswx> Laibsch: im trying to see if I can backport empathy for karmic
<bcurtiswx> not to be annoying or seem noob-ish.. but anyone know what I do to fix this problem http://paste.ubuntu.com/377979/
<Laibsch> RAOF: you're right, I get an empty package, now too
<Laibsch> not sure, why it was working nicely before.
<RAOF> You had probably run ./autogen.sh in there at one point.
<geser> bcurtiswx: either check if your empathy backport work with the versions of the mentioned packages from karmic or backport them too
<bcurtiswx> geser, ok
<bcurtiswx> geser: trying to find which packages these are
<geser> bcurtiswx: line 180-183 of your paste
<geser> the source packages are: telepathy-glib, libindicate and nautilus-sendto
<bcurtiswx> geser: ty
<plars> anyone have time to adv/upload a package (assuming you approve)? I already have one adv
<plars> http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/moserial
<Laibsch> RAOF: can I get an endorsement from you even when not addressing all points (collab-maint, patch-system, ITP)?  The others I consider RC and will of course fix.  I'm quite embarassed about that empty package.
<bcurtiswx> geser: as I keep going back and finding packages to backport to get empathy to build ok.. how do I install them to pbuilder if they build OK so the next package can use it to build ?
#ubuntu-motu 2010-02-17
<geser> I don't have a simple solution at hand
<geser> you probably need some repository software and use this repository inside pbuilder (or use a PPA)
<bcurtiswx> geser: ok so if i upload the successful package to PPA, when it comes time to upload the new ones.. how do I tell THAT to use my repository?
<RAOF> bcurtiswx: I recently discovered that if you're using pbuilder-dist, it'll bind mount & add a /var/cache/archive to your sources.list in the chroot.
<bcurtiswx> RAOF: i see this, but it still didn't recognize my updated package
<RAOF> Did you make a Packages.gz file, and update the pbuilder?
<geser> you can use your PPA with the backported packages in your pbuilder (and your PPA will automatically use your packages from your PPA to build later uploads)
<RAOF> So if you copy the .debs you want to /var/cache/archive/lucid, then build the Packages.gz (running apt-ftparchive packages lucid/ | gzip -9 lucid/Packages.gz should do it), pbuilder-dist will pick them up.
<bcurtiswx> RAOF: im backporting these to karmic so instead would it be /var/cache/archive/karmic  ?
<RAOF> Yes.
<bcurtiswx> RAOF: im guessing Packages.gz is really like empathy*.gz or telepathy-glib*.gz .. right?
<RAOF> No, Packages.gz is the file that lists all the packages in the archive.
<bcurtiswx> pbuilder makes a karmic-base.gz
<RAOF> Yeah, but that's a whole karmic system, zipped up.
<RAOF> This is different; you're making a repository.
<bcurtiswx> RAOF: ok
<RAOF> pbuilder won't pick up random .debs from anywhere; it'll only grab them from a repository.
<bcurtiswx> to have pbuilder-dist save what I do in the login  ... how do i?
<RAOF> pbuilder-dist lucid login --save-after-login
<Nitsuga> hello
<Nitsuga> i think there is a problem with the main Ubuntu mirror
<Nitsuga> it's impossible to download libmysqlclient16 because of a 403 error
<Nitsuga> W: Failed to fetch http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/main/m/mysql-cluster-7.0/libmysqlclient16_7.0.9-1_amd64.deb
<Nitsuga>   403  Forbidden [IP: 91.189.88.46 80]
<Nitsuga> it here the right place to report that?
<Pici> Nitsuga: Theres an issue with the package, the permissions were changed on the repo so that people do not inadvertantly upgrade to a broken package.
<Nitsuga> ohh  I see...
<Nitsuga> ok thank you
<Pici> Sure, np
<paissad> i'm getting overbooked ... actually the software i was packaging uses much other software during the build (softwares that have their own license/copyright ... but fortunately they are totally free & source code available ) .... i'm afraid of the huge work http://code.google.com/p/ps3mediaserver/source/browse/#svn/trunk/ps3mediaserver/lib
<paissad> the package i'm working on uses all these .jar & .zip files .... ^^
<paissad> i've been packaging this soft for almost 3 weeks & i just don't know if  can continue the work to split each software in it's own .deb package
<paissad> i feel so fucked :( !
<maco2> paissad: watch your language, please
<paissad> sorry :)
<bcurtiswx> anyone know why Rejected:empathy_2.29.90-0ubuntu2~bcurtiswx.dsc: format '3.0 (quilt)' is not permitted in karmic.
<bcurtiswx> how i may fix this?
<micahg> bcurtiswx: drop source format 3 :)
<bcurtiswx> micahg: where is it defined?
<micahg> debian/source/format
<bcurtiswx> so to get rid of it..??
<micahg> yeah, you can delete the file
<micahg> for karmic
<micahg> bcurtiswx: if you don't have an .orig.tar.gz, you might have to make one
<bcurtiswx> micahg: http://paste.ubuntu.com/378095/
<bcurtiswx> i removed the format file
<bcurtiswx> and it then gave me that error
<micahg> bcurtiswx: was quilt dropped from the package?
<bcurtiswx> idk
<micahg> bcurtiswx: is there still a debian/patches dir?
<bcurtiswx> yes
<micahg> k
<micahg> idk
<bcurtiswx> :'(
 * micahg had simple cases
<bcurtiswx> anyone else know what i should do?
 * bcurtiswx pokes room
<bcurtiswx> http://paste.ubuntu.com/378095/  anyone?
<bcurtiswx> micahg: is there another format of quilt I can try??
<bcurtiswx> or another format ?
<bcurtiswx> is there a place I can go to find out?  this is the place as far as i know
<bcurtiswx> JontheEchidna: you've seen my problem before.. any suggestions?
<micahg> bcurtiswx: this is the right place
<JontheEchidna> hmm, I don't really touch gnomish things. maybe you have the wrong person?
<bcurtiswx> JontheEchidna: you've seen format '3.0 (quilt)' is not permitted in karmic
<bcurtiswx> do you know how to avoid that ?
<micahg> bcurtiswx: the answer to that is return to source format 1
<bcurtiswx> bug #522381 is what i'm looking at
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 522381 in karmic-backports "Backport for Konversation 1.2.3" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/522381
<JontheEchidna> yes, you cannot use source format 3 in karmic
<JontheEchidna> ah
<JontheEchidna> Riddell thought I wanted a straight no-changes backport
<JontheEchidna> and missed my debdiff
<JontheEchidna> where I ported the package back to source format 1
<suji11> when will be the freezing date for lucid?
<JontheEchidna> I'm not a gnome expert, but popping all the patches and removing the .pc dir may fix your issue
<bcurtiswx> sorry to be newbie.. but how would i "pop" all the patches
<micahg> suji11: feature freeze is thursday
<JontheEchidna> quilt pop -a
<JontheEchidna> unapplies them all, basically
<JontheEchidna> then you'll want to port it back to using quilt.mk or whatever empathy was using before source format 3.0
<JontheEchidna> might not hurt to look in bzr for what changes were made to convert empathy to 3.0, and then reverse those
<suji11> micahg: tomorrow? they add the packages from revu.ubuntuwire.com ?
<bcurtiswx> JontheEchidna: ok thx
<micahg> suji11: not necessaril
<micahg> y
<hyperair> suji11: tomorrow we stop accepting new packages from revu.
<suji11> hyperair: oh! my package iok is in revu. but it is not advocated yet. but one person will advocate in one or two days need another one for advocate.
<suji11> http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/iok
<suji11> then my package won't come in lucid?
<hyperair> suji11: i'd take a look at it, but my upload privs haven't arrived =\
<hyperair> it won't appear in lucid unless another MOTU gives you your second advocate and uploads it before FF
<suji11> hyperair: ok, will you advocate this package?
<hyperair> suji11: i can't until my advocating/upload privs appear.
 * hyperair pokes persia
<hyperair> technical glitches still going on?
<nigelb> how to i apply a git patch to something versioned in bzr?
<nigelb> trying to use the upstream patch to the source maintained in LP
<suji11> hyperair: what?
<hyperair> suji11: i became a MOTU 12 hours ago. my privileges haven't activated yet.
<hyperair> nigelb: patch -p1 -i
<nigelb> hyperair: ah, the -i
<hyperair> nigelb: without the -i, you'd use < patch
<suji11> hyperair: ok , can i ask persia about advocating my package?
<nigelb> hyperair: then I'm running into the same trouble
<nigelb> I'm getting "patch unexpectedly ends in middle of line"
<nigelb> does patch have trouble with blank lines?
<hyperair> suji11: well i'm not sure he likes to be pinged randomly for advocating a package. i'm pinging him because he was the one who told me about there being some technical glitch some hours ago
<hyperair> nigelb: it might.
<nigelb> hyperair: work around is to remove the extra lines or to not use patch command?
<hyperair> nigelb: the patch was probably malformed to begin with if you're getting issues like that.
<suji11> hyperair: ok ok. i just ping him, hope he will help:)
<hyperair> nigelb: i had some issues regarding a patch attached via email once. dunno what happened
<nigelb> hyperair: was posted by upstream dev
<hyperair> nigelb: link?
<hyperair> nigelb: you could remove the last chunk of the patch, and hand-apply it.
<nigelb> https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=605694
<ubottu> Gnome bug 605694 in gnome-volume-control "gnome-volume-control-applet never frees/finalizes PA channel maps." [Normal,Resolved: fixed]
<hyperair> nigelb: http://bugzilla-attachments.gnome.org/attachment.cgi?id=152824 this one?
<nigelb> yep
<hyperair> nigelb: did you save it, or did you copy paste it into a text editor?
<nigelb> save it
 * hyperair tries
<hyperair> er where's the source tree i should be poking?
<nigelb> hyperair: https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/lucid/gnome-media/lucid
<nigelb> you have to branch the code
<hyperair> nigelb: could you try this: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/1987784/patch-patch-unexpectedly-ends-in-middle-of-line
<hyperair> basically echo >> patch
<hyperair> the patch is missing a trailing new line
<hyperair> which is strange, because git always puts a trailing new line.
<hyperair> it must have been truncated by BGO
<suji11> persia: Need advocate my package here http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/iok .
<nigelb> lemme try again
<lightnin> Please check out this package. 100000 kids need to learn to program so we can breed the next generation of FOSS champions. http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/scratch
<lightnin> Anyone around? I have some questions about my package.
<suji11> lightnin: hi
<lightnin> suji11: Greetings! I'm trying to get a package into multiverse in time for feature freeze. Can you take a look and advise? http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/scratch
<suji11> lightnin: sorry, i'm not a MOTU. Just look the description of your package, looks nice. And am also upload my package in revu http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/iok . it's also waiting for advocate.
<lightnin> suji11: Ah, thanks for looking! Nice to speak with someone anyway. :)
<suji11> lightnin: :)
<nigelb> suji11, lightnin: Can you try after say 8 hours or so?  Europe and US would be awake and you'd have better luck here
<suji11> nigelb: ok, thanks for this information :)
<lightnin> nigelb: Thanks for advice! Any tips on how to get help from MOTUs this late in the game?
<nigelb> nope.  I dont really upload to revu, so I dont have much clue about that
<nigelb> I mostly apply downstream patches and the likes
<lightnin> nigelb: Ah, thanks all the same.
<micahg> lightnin: be patient :)
<lightnin> suji11: Cool software you have there! I think scratch may support indic - do you see it here? http://info.scratch.mit.edu/Languages
<lightnin> micahg: I'll certainly try! We'd just very much like to get into multiverse for Lucid. Lots of schools running Ubuntu have asked for this.
<micahg> lightnin: you might want to poke the edubuntu devs then
<lightnin> micahg: Ah, where would I find them? Sorry - very new to this sort of thing.
 * micahg checks
<suji11> lightnin: I would like to translate the scratch in Tamil. What are the steps should i follow for that?
<lightnin> suji11: Wonderful! This page describes how: http://info.scratch.mit.edu/Translation . But first, you can install Scratch from the ppa: https://launchpad.net/~scratch
<lightnin> suji11: Also, I think this project was made by a child who speaks Tamil? http://scratch.mit.edu/projects/ks00007/812597
<lightnin> suji11: That's an example of a project made with the free programming language for kids I'm trying to get into Multiverse:Scratch. Once you have Scratch installed, you can download this project and view and remix the source code.
<suji11> lightnin: ok
<fabrice_sp> rhpot1991, it seems that there is a new upstream version for hdhomerun-config-gui
<superm1> fabrice_sp, i thought the changes were only for non-linux platforms though
<fabrice_sp> superm1, could be: I've not been able to find any upstream changelog :-/
<superm1> fabrice_sp, http://www.silicondust.com/downloads/hdhomerun_software_changelog
<fabrice_sp> it seems I haven't searched enought :-D
<fabrice_sp> superm1, so what is your recommendation? Upload 20100121? (I assume this is the tested version)
<superm1> fabrice_sp, i'd say upload what's on revu.  it's what's been tested and verified working.  no need to go and needlessly go and pull a new version in especially if there is nothing relevant to hit before FF in the new version
<fabrice_sp> ok: you confirmed what I thought
<fabrice_sp> uploaded
<superm1> rhpot1991, ^
<rhpot1991> thanks fabrice_sp and superm1
<fabrice_sp> thank to you ;-)
<abogani> Hi All, I have just converted my package to '3.0 (quilt)' dpkg format and now REVU say me that "Warning! This package could not be extracted; there's no browsable directory for it on REVU. ". Anyone already know what is the problem? I should come back to '1.0' ? Thanks in advance!
<lifeless> REVU doesn't do3.0 yet AFAIK
<lifeless> its  alittle out of date
<abogani> lifeless: First of all thanks! Now what I should do?
<abogani> return to '1.0'?
<RAOF> abogani: You can ignore that warning; people can easily just download your source package from revu.
<abogani> RAOF, lifeless: Ok. Thanks and sorry for disturb.
<RAOF> That's fine.  You don't learn if you don't ask.
<dholbach> good morning
<suji11> dholbach: Good morning...
<dholbach> hi suji11
<suji11> dholbach: my package is here http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/iok need advocate for that.
<suji11> dholbach: will you?
<dholbach> suji11: I have a bunch of other stuff to do right now, I'm sorry
<suji11> dholbach: ok
<oojah> quadrispro: Thanks very much for advocating.
<suji11> Anyone here will advocate my package http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/iok ?
<quadrispro> oojah, thanks for making Ubuntu better :)
<oojah> :)
<eagles0513875> dholbach: that one repo is still off line its like day 4 or 5. whether im on the  main server or us server or local mirror this one server still is giving me an error 403
<eagles0513875> seems like there is an error with one of the canonical servers i just did a who is on teh ip and the origin is the uk
<dholbach> eagles0513875: did you do a "apt-get update"?
<eagles0513875> dholbach: ya
<dholbach> youhttps://wiki.ubuntu.com/Mirrors#Communication
<dholbach> oops
<dholbach> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Mirrors#Communication
<eagles0513875> dholbach: this isnt a mirror this is a main canonical server
<eagles0513875> if you give me a min i can paste u the who is
<dholbach> eagles0513875: please read that wiki page
<dholbach> it tells you who to get in touch with
<dholbach> I can't fix any mirror or help with it
<eagles0513875> ok thanks
<suji11> Anyone around?
<quadrispro> suji11, reviewed and advocated
<suji11> quadrispro: Thanks a lot :)
<suji11> quadrispro: Have one more advocate to get this in lucid?
<slytherin> Any python experts here?
<quadrispro> suji11, you can wait for andrew
<suji11> quadrispro: ok, but tomorrow is the feature freeze , so only
<eagles0513875> slytherin: kinda offtopic for this channel unless its for an app u want revued
<ia> hello. could anyone tell me, please, good link to some [debian/ubuntu] wiki page about debian 3.0 format packaging (except http://wiki.debian.org/Projects/DebSrc3.0)? I guess, that somewhere should be such detailed information, as howto's and recipes about how to build [debV3.0] packages, how to select compression (for example, if i want to use lzma instead tar.gz), etc.
<randomaction> ia: another source of information is `man dpkg-source`, "source package formats" section
<randomaction> building is done as usual
<randomaction> compression is selected by -Z
<ia> randomaction: thanks. looks like i've got it. But if i build package via pbuilder, which the best way to pass compression option into pbuilder environment? (i guess, via dsc file/debuild somehow)
<randomaction> if you use pbuilder, you should already have a source package
<dupondje> What do we need to do with bugs in launchpad that are talking about a bug in a ppa ? Should this be marked as invalid ?
<randomaction> generally yes, though if it an upstream bug it can be reassigned to upstream project, and it can be valid if it's applicable to a version in official archives
<sindhudweep> I'm trying to fix a debian/watch file, and it seems as though uscan is picking up directory permissions, uid, gid as well as the version number. This is over ftp
<sindhudweep> am I missing something obvious?
<sindhudweep> http://pastebin.com/m308614de
<geser> dupondje: have you a concrete example?
<dupondje> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-do/+bug/388626
<geser> as some teams might use PPA for staging and want to have such bugs filed
<dupondje> Install the package from the PPA on Jaunty. Open the app and while typing, the application crashes. ...
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 388626 in gnome-do "Gnome-do crashes while executing native code" [Undecided,New]
<geser> bah, that bug doesn't even mention which PPA got used :(
<dupondje> but its not that if its from ppa, its invalid ?
<dupondje> its sometimes valid ? ;)
<geser> as the "Gnome Do Core Team" has a PPA with gnome-do as is "also notified" to this bug, I'd ask them if they want/care about such bugs before setting those bugs as invalid
<dupondje> anyway it could be set to incomplete and ask which ppa got used right ?
<geser> yes, that at least
<dupondje> done :D
<randomaction> sindhudweep: can you paste the watch file?
<geser> RAOF: do you know if the "Gnome Do Core Team/Q Core Team" cares about bugs filed against PPA packages?
<sindhudweep> sure
<sindhudweep> randomaction: http://pastebin.com/m6b3c1f45
<slytherin> sindhudweep: I don't think you should give brackets for the directory name matching expression.
<sindhudweep> bah i posted the wrong version of the watch file
<sindhudweep> just a second
<sindhudweep> slytherin: randomaction: http://pastebin.com/m9b1d0da this is the watch file giving me the error
<sindhudweep> the watch file i posted before was me fumbling trying to fix it
<slytherin> What error does it give?
<sindhudweep> dpkg: version 'drwxr-xr-x    2 1003     1003         4096 May 07  2006 0.7.1' has bad syntax: version string has embedded spaces
<sindhudweep> it's reading the directory permissions, uid, gid, size and timestamp
<sindhudweep> from ftp!
<randomaction> I get no error when I drop it into debian/ of gnash package: http://pastebin.com/m1cf4d7c2
<sindhudweep> so it seems the ftp lib/client used by uscan is returning more information in the filename and the (.*) is matching everything
<randomaction> (but no files found as well, strangely)
<sindhudweep> randomaction: http://pastebin.com/m308614de
<c_korn> can someone please enqueue scilab again ? build just takes a while. see the last comment. it took 6.5h on Debian: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/scilab/+bug/511864
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 511864 in scilab "Sync scilab 5.2.0-7 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,Incomplete]
<sindhudweep> i see all versions from 0.7.1 - 0.8.7
<sindhudweep> just with extra information :(
<slytherin> sindhudweep: Do you want hard answer or easy answer?
<sindhudweep> hard answers are welcome :D
<sindhudweep> but i can go with the easy one too.
<slytherin> sindhudweep: man uscan. It contains example for this scenario.
<Laibsch> hello
<slytherin> sindhudweep: Let me know when you want easy answer.
<slytherin> Laibsch: Hi
<sindhudweep> slytherin: thanks, will do if i need it
<lightnin> Greetings! I'm trying to get a package into multiverse in time for feature freeze. Can someone please take a look and advise? http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/scratch
<shadeslayer> i dont need : include /usr/share/pkg-kde-tools/makefiles/1/cdbs/kde.mk
<shadeslayer> if i dont have any patches right?
<slytherin> shadeslayer: kde.mk is not for patches. And AFAIK, its use is not recommended these days.
<dupondje> when menu.lst doesn't update after a kernel upgrade with aptitude ... this is a bug in kernel ? :)
<shadeslayer> slytherin: oh ok
<slytherin> shadeslayer: You may want to confirm second statement on #kubuntu-devel
<shadeslayer> dupondje: mm... maybe aptitude too
<slytherin> dupondje: what do you mean by update? Was there a new kernel installation?
<dupondje> a kernel update indeed ..
<dupondje> having this on karmic
<dupondje> update-grub doesn't seem to be triggered
<shadeslayer> dupondje: with 2.6.31-20-generic ?
<dupondje> shadeslayer: not a specific version it seems, just all :(
<shadeslayer> dupondje: 0_o
<dupondje> but I use grub1
<dupondje> guess there it went wrong :)
<slytherin> dupondje: never saw that kind of bug. But I would call it grub bug than kernel bug.
<sindhudweep> slytherin: thanks again. as usual RTFM works wonders :D
<slytherin> sindhudweep: Welcome.
<dupondje> slytherin: its not a kernel bug, but more a 'linux' package bug? as the update should trigger the update-grub ?
<dupondje> just running update-grub works without problems
<slytherin> dupondje: May be it is getting triggered but there is some problem with update of menu.lst
<dupondje> well what does it trigger ? update-grub ?
<slytherin> yes, AFAIK.
<shadeslayer> slytherin: any idea what these warnings mean? : http://pastebin.ca/1799980
<shadeslayer> slytherin: also is it necessary to set the debhelper version to 7?
<slytherin> shadeslayer: not unless you are using the new format for rules file.
<slytherin> shadeslayer: paste your rules file somewhere and I will tell you
<shadeslayer> slytherin: http://pastebin.com/f177f7c6d
<slytherin> shadeslayer: please note the number in compat file should match with debhelper version specified.
<slytherin> shadeslayer: you don't seem to be using debhelper 7 specific features.
<shadeslayer> slytherin: so i can ignore it right?
<slytherin> shadeslayer: You should fix it.
<shadeslayer> ok
<slytherin> check what is version specified in compat
<shadeslayer> slytherin: 7
<slytherin> shadeslayer: change it to 5
<slytherin> also specify the version in build-depends in debian/control file
<shadeslayer> slytherin: ok and one more thing,what if i change the debhelper version to 7 in the control?
<slytherin> shadeslayer: that is fine as well
<shadeslayer> slytherin: ok..
<slytherin> shadeslayer: But you are not really using 7 features.
<Rhonda> slytherin: That would give the same warning. ;)
<Rhonda> shadeslayer: The issue is that you seem to have a Build-Depends: debhelper without any (>= X) after it.
<slytherin> shadeslayer: Also the version you have specified in changelog is wrong. It should be of the format X-YubuntuZ
<Rhonda> shadeslayer: That X should be the same number than the one in debian/compat, or at least not lower.
<Rhonda> And if you use dh_prep in your rules file you need >= 7
<Rhonda> About bad-distribution-in-changes-file, I expect you used either Debian's lintian, or an outdated version.
<slytherin> Rhonda: He is probably building package on karmic and hence outdated version
<shadeslayer> slytherin: ok,and what about the other warnings?
<Rhonda> unknown-field-in-dsc also hints that he's using the Debian lintian â¦
<shadeslayer> ping shadeslayer
<Rhonda> slytherin: Would the karmic lintian also complain about Original-Maintainer? I don't think so. :)
<shadeslayer> oh
<slytherin> Rhonda: you are right. :-)
 * Rhonda does the happy dance.
<slytherin> shadeslayer: quilt-build-dep-but-no-series-file - You are not using any patches but you have quilt as build dependency.
<shadeslayer> Rhonda: yeah that happens with karmic ...
<shadeslayer> slytherin: ok,i forgot to remove that too
<slytherin> shadeslayer: and make sure the version in debian/changelog is correct.
<slytherin> is this a native package?
<shadeslayer> slytherin: nope
<shadeslayer> (im actually doing this after 3 weeks... so ive forgotten a few things :P )
<Rhonda> shadeslayer: dpkg -l lintian - what version do you get?
<shadeslayer> Rhonda: http://pastebin.com/f3ff270ad
<Rhonda> If it isn't a native package the version should have a dash in it.
<shadeslayer> Rhonda: 0.3.92-0ubuntu1~karmic1+ppa2
<Rhonda> That gives a changes file as rekonq_0.3.92_source.changes? That's strange
<shadeslayer> Rhonda: no no... im saying i renamed the version to that
<shadeslayer> ok everything looks fine now :D
<dupondje> shadeslayer: http://packages.ubuntu.com/karmic/grub depends on grub-common, but grub-common is for grub2 ?!
<lbrinkma> zul: what's the status of libmysqlclient #521815 ?
<shadeslayer> dupondje: um actually im having problems of my own
<shadeslayer> will talk later
<zul> lbrinkma: its being worked on hopefully we will have a fix soon
<dupondje> or somebody else ? :)
<lbrinkma> zul: before FF?
<zul> lbrinkma: hopefully
<lbrinkma> zul: ok, thanks. It's very important to fix that before FF.
<zul> lbrinkma: yes i know no
<zul> lbrinkma: yes i know np even
<rhpot1991> anyone have any idea why I'm getting forbidden on: http://us.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/main/m/mysql-cluster-7.0/libmysqlclient16_7.0.9-1_amd64.deb
<geser> yes
<lightnin> Hello - can anyone help answer a question about package version numbers? http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/scratch
<lightnin> I'm told this is not quite right, but not sure how to fix...
<geser> it's on purpose not let the this package spread
<kklimonda> geser: what's wrong with it?
<geser> "hostile" package takeover from mysql-cluster-7.0
<dupondje> ok found it, had a kernel-img.conf file, which set to not update bootloader ...
<rhpot1991> geser: well my pbuilder is failing on it as a dependency issue, anything I can do about it?
<geser> wait, till it's resolved (the main archive is still affected too)
<rhpot1991> geser: ok good enough, thanks
<lightnin> How to indicate multiverse in control file? Section: multiverse/devel ?
<geser> you don't, it's set when accepted into the archive
<lightnin> geser: Ah, thanks! So what should my Section: field say if I'm trying to get into multiverse?
<dupondje> shadeslayer: I had a kernel-img.conf in /etc. This disabled configuring the bootloader @ update
<dupondje> should work now :D
<shadeslayer> dupondje: ohhh.. thats new
<dupondje> dunno what that file was doing there :) the system is running since dapper or so :p
<slytherin> lightnin: Simply devel. The archive admin who accepts the package will put it into multiverse
<slytherin> lightnin: Why is the package oging to multiverse by the way?
<lightnin> slytherin: Thanks! We don't include quite all of the source, because the application interfaces with our website, which acts as a repository for Scratch projects.
<lightnin> slytherin: so Section:devel ?  I was just learning (I think) that that line should refer to education or games...Maybe I indicate devel elsewhere?
<slytherin> lightnin: I don't think that will cause it to go to multiverse (as long as the source needed to build the package itself is included).
<slytherin> lightnin: Got to go. Hopefully someone else will provide answer.
<lightnin> slytherin: Well, it's tricky. Scratch is actually a made in squeak.. thanks for your help!
<lightnin> Uh, how do you view another source packages control file?
<hyperair> how many more hours to FF?
<lightnin> Can someone help me understand package versioning? I seem to have gotten myself in a bit of a pickle..
<hyperair> lightnin: what's up?
<shadeslayer> lightnin: whats the problem?
<shadeslayer> hehe.. :)
<ari-tczew> hyperair: 7,5 h ?
<hyperair> ari-tczew: what's 7,5?
<hyperair> er 7.5?
<lightnin> shadeslayer: Not too sure - people say it's off, but don't recommend a precise fix. http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/scratch
<hyperair> damn weird localized decimal points
<hyperair> still got time, i suppose. else i'd have to start requesting freeze exceptions.
<ari-tczew> hyperair: hours to Ffe :>
<hyperair> ari-tczew: sorry, my floating point parser segfaulted earlier.
<ari-tczew> ah
<shadeslayer> lightnin: youve named the version as app-XubuntuY right
 * hyperair pings persia about upload privs
<lightnin> shadeslayer:Nope... we first worked with a debian developer, but never ended up submitting to debian. But the package version is now: scratch (1.4.0.debian.20)
<ari-tczew> what's the different between white and red versions? http://people.ubuntuwire.com/~lucas/merges.html
<ari-tczew> is new upstream versions in red?
<hyperair> lightnin: is that a native package?
<randomaction> ari-tczew: yes
<lightnin> hyperair: sorry, not sure what that means - very new to this whole process. It's never been part of debian, although I think it corresponds to debian packaging standards.
<hyperair> lightnin: http://wiki.debian.org/DebianMentorsFaq <-- look for difference between a native and non-native package on this page
<lightnin> hyperair: Thanks! Totally non-native .
<hyperair> lightnin: non-native packages need a -<packaging revision> suffix
<hyperair> e.g. 1.4.0-1, or 1.4.0-0ubuntu1
<hyperair> what is your tarball called?
<lightnin> scratch_1.4.0.debian.19.tar.gz
<lightnin> hyperair:http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/scratch
<ivoks_doing_mirs> dholbach: do you have power to override new packages in lucid?
<dholbach> ivoks_doing_mirs: no
<ivoks_doing_mirs> universe, of course
<ivoks_doing_mirs> dholbach: ok
<dholbach> I'm not part of ~ubuntu-archive
<ivoks_doing_mirs> ok
<sebner> ivoks_doing_mirs: ask in #ubuntu-devel
<hyperair> lightnin: why do you have such a strange version?
<BlackZ> can somebody review/advocate this package: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/autotrash ? thanks
<hyperair> lightnin: and that's a native package you're having there.
<hyperair> lightnin: where is your orig.tar.gz?
<lightnin> hyperair:Well, it has to do with the long history of making this package, which has involved help from various different people....
<hyperair> lightnin: that doesn't change the fact that it's a native package when it shouldn't be.
<hyperair> lightnin: fix your version. what is the upstream version?
<lightnin> hyperair: Ah, yes, sounds correct. Well, there are no other linux versions - and the package actually runs on squeak. So I suppose the upstream version is 1.4.0 . How can we change this to non-native?
<shadeslayer> i guess this more of a builder problem than a package problem : http://launchpadlibrarian.net/39306253/buildlog_ubuntu-lucid-amd64.rekonq_0.3.92-0ubuntu1%2Blucid1%2Bppa2_CHROOTWAIT.txt.gz ?
<hyperair> lightnin: where is the upstream tarball?
<lightnin> Not sure that exists.... All source is hosted here: https://www.assembla.com/spaces/scratchonlinux/trac_subversion_tool
<hyperair> i see. it's a snapshot.
<hyperair> then make an orig tarball.
<hyperair> the orig tarball should not have debian directory
<hyperair> and since it's a snapshot, it should probably contain the revision number in it
<randomaction> shadeslayer: yes, the build will be retried automatically
<hyperair> something like 1.4.0~svn<revno>
<lightnin> hyperair: Ok... that's probably beyond my abilities... Very new to this whole process and I essentially inherited the package.  I guess I'll give it a go though. :)
<persia> hyperair: I can't personally do anything about them: I'm hoping that will be sorted soon.
<hyperair> persia: okay, i'll wait then. i'll just get my syncs sponsored in the meantime.
<hyperair> sebner: just a gentle reminder, FF is in a few hours ;-)
<persia> hyperair: Sorry about that.  Unfortunately, it takes a TB person right now :(
<hyperair> ah i see.
<hyperair> it's fine.
<sebner> hyperair: no problem. archive-admins are already subscribed so it doesn't matter when FF is
<randomaction> persia: can remaining members of motu-council add hyperair?
<hyperair> sebner: thanks.
<sebner> hyperair: np, anything else that needs sponsoring?
<hyperair> sebner: nothing, i think.
<sebner> kk
<hyperair> sebner: thanks =)
<sebner> hyperair: It's enough to thank me once ^^ really no big deal ;)
<hyperair> oh i already thanked you before? whoops =p
<persia> randomaction: I thikn so, except none of them happen to be members of the DMB, so while it technically works, I'm not sure of the governance parameters involved.
<persia> (although I'll not complain if someone just does it)
<mok0> Just installed KDE4.4... wow
<james_w> congratulations hyperair
<hyperair> james_w: thanks =)
<sebner> RAOF: uhh, first docky tarball. Just in time :P (nah I guess it will conflict with -do)?
<bcurtiswx_> anyone know how I can get around empathy 2.29.90 using quilt 3.0 in a karmic launchpad PPA upload? is there a specific way I need to edit the debian/sources/format file ?
<lightnin> hyperair:  I think it should probably stay native for this go around - main goal for compatibility is debian / ubuntu. Do I need to change versioning to be ok as native package?
<hyperair> no, it should *not* be native.
<hyperair> *nothing* should be native unless there is a very good reason for it.
<shadeslayer> any ideas as to why : https://launchpad.net/~rohangarg/+archive/kde-extra/+build/1514104
<shadeslayer> all other packages built fine 0_o
<randomaction> bcurtiswx: you need to delete debian/source/format (or change it to "1.0") and reimplement any 3.0 features used in the package
<hyperair> lightnin: i don't think there is a chance of getting your package in for lucid. there aren't any advocates yet, featurefreeze is in a few hours, and your package is not quite uploadable in this condition.
<bcurtiswx_> randomaction: how would I reinplement and 3.0 features used in the package
<bcurtiswx_> s/reinplement/reimplement
<bcurtiswx_> s/and/any
<bcurtiswx_> wow not in the typing groove today
<shadeslayer> any ideas on my problme guys?
<shadeslayer> *problem
<randomaction> bcurtiswx_: it depends on which are used (patch system? replacement of binary files? non-tar.gz tarball? overriding of debian/ directory?)
<lightnin> hyperair: Alas - we do have one almost advocate (highvoltage) that just took a look - I've added their changes in. Seems like the versioning is the last issue?
<hyperair> lightnin: almost advocate? hmm
<hyperair> =\
<lightnin> hyperair: I only say so because a lot of schools that run Linux have asked for it to be included...
<lightnin> I'll see if he is really ready to sign on... :)
<bcurtiswx_> randomaction: there is a debian/patches directory.. so would that assume patch system ?
<randomaction> yes, for that you need to build-depend on quilt and amend debian/rules to use it
<bcurtiswx_> randomaction: may i PM you?
<randomaction> bcurtiswx_: yes
<hyperair> lightnin: well i haven't actually taken a look at the rest of the package, but please get the versioning right. it isn't hard. just generate a proper tarball out of pristine svn sources (svn export, tar -czf) and amend the version in debian/changelog to use <upstreamversion>-0ubuntu1
<hyperair> where <upstreamversion> is from scratch_<upstreamversion>.orig.tar.gz
<lightnin> hyperair: Ah, thanks for the ray of hope! I'll give it a go.
<persia> hyperair: If you're reviewing stuff, I'll set you as a reviewer in REVU right now (no need to wait for TB)
<hyperair> persia: oh cool. that'll help.
<persia> hyperair: Done.
<hyperair> persia: thanks.
<persia> hyperair: Only 7 hours left though :)
<hyperair> persia: i know :-)
<hyperair> persia: i can provide advocates, but i can't upload, right?
<persia> hyperair: Right, but if you're the second advocate, just make noise here, and someone will probably upload.
<hyperair> persia: okay
<persia> You *should* be MOTU already, except for a technical glitch.
<persia> cody-somerville: Are you merging pyneighborhood for lucid?  Debian has a new upstream.
<persia> ttx: Are you merging xmlbeans for lucid?  Debian has a new upstream
<persia> RainCT: Are you merging zeitgeist for lucid?  Debian has a new upstream
 * persia also points at https://merges.ubuntu.com/universe.html for lots of other packages that might benefit from a merge in the next few hours (those three aren't there)
<RainCT> persia: I tried to file sync requests for zeitgeist and gnome-activity-journal 10 minutes ago but it looks like the mails were send wrong..
<RainCT> Trying to figure out how to use "manage-credentials" to use requestsync with launchpadlib now
<persia> RainCT: Sorry then: my source is older than that, but glad to hear you're on it.
<randomaction> hmm, there's new claws-mail...
<RainCT> persia: Oh, there's no reason to apologize. Thanks for the reminder :)
<persia> I mostly wanted to highlight the ones on the manual list, as these tend to be annoying and fussy.
<persia> So if someone was blocked on time, maybe someone else could help.
<persia> The regular merges are easier (although it's worth trying to push them in the next 6:45, or it requires an FFe
<ttx> persia: not planning to
<persia> ttx: Is the new upstream something we want for lucid, or something we specifically don't want, or do you just not have time?
<\sh> what? 153 outstanding merges?
<persia> \sh: And we have 300 minutes to at least review all the ones where the upstream version differs.
<ttx> persia: something I don't have the time to determine if I specifically don't want it
<\sh> persia: I thought 18th 23:59 and all around the world?
<\sh> anyone with insight about xulrunner merge? :)
<ari-tczew> wrrrr, pbuilder failed because: E: Failed to fetch http://pl.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/main/p/python2.6/python2.6_2.6.4-5ubuntu1_i386.deb: 404  Not Found
<randomaction> ari-tczew: update your pbuilder
<ari-tczew> sudo pbuilder update has been done 5x !!!
<ari-tczew> there is -6ubuntu1 how can I force pbuilder to use new debian revision?
<geser> it should happen automatically if it is uptodate
<geser> pbuilder is only some scripts around a chroot
<persia> \sh: My memory from the last discussion about freeze times was slangasek saying 0:00 UTC on the day of the freeze.
<\sh> oh fck
<ari-tczew> f_cking tool, failed just before FF :-/
<\sh> I mean, I can try to do some more merges right now until my esx is migrated...but all the syncs which will the result of it...#fail :(
<ari-tczew> I'm ready to do 2 merges, but my pbuilder isn't ready
<geser> ari-tczew: no error message during the update?
<ari-tczew> geser: w8, I'll check again
<ari-tczew> geser:
<BlackZ> I get this error when I run "debuild -S": http://paste.ubuntu.com/378551/ what's wrong? debian/rules file: http://paste.ubuntu.com/378552/
<ari-tczew> After this operation, 7791kB of additional disk space will be used.
<ari-tczew> E: Could not perform immediate configuration on 'udev'.Please see man 5 apt.conf under APT::Immediate-Configure for details. (2)
<randomaction> I had this error today, fixed it by reinstalling udev
<randomaction> btw, all builds are failing now because of it
<geser> ari-tczew: that explains why your pbuilder doesn't update, known problem, mvo is on it
<persia> Rumour has it that rebuilding the chroot also fixes this, if one can't wait.
<geser> BlackZ: looks like your setup.py doesn't support clean
<BlackZ> geser: I'm just packaging it, so how to solve? should I contact the upstream author?
<geser> BlackZ: I haven't looked yet at dh 7, but try to figure how to "disable" the calling of setup.py clean if your package doesn't support/need it
<persia> Add an empty override_dh_auto_clean: rule
<persia> for extra points, agressively populate debian/clean to delete all the stuff built on build.
<BlackZ> persia: ok, I'll try, thanks.
<persia> (to test, do a local build, and then run debian/rules clean, and compare that directory state with that of a freshly unpacked source after running debian/rules clean)
<geser> ari-tczew: "sudo pbuilder login --save-after-login", "apt-get update", "apt-get install udev", "apt-get upgrade", "exit"
<lightnin> When exactly is feature freeze?
<randomaction> lightnin: in 4h 36min
<lightnin> Anyone have a minute to look at some code, and advise on changes?
<persia> lightnin: What sort of code?  Also, best to ask a question about it and provide a link.  Nobody is likely to volunteer.
<persia> (whereas several people may look, and a subset of them may have comments)
<lightnin> persia: thanks! It's here: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/scratch I've been trying to convert this format to conform with versioning standards, but I'm getting stuck in several places.
<persia> What's the first place you get stuck?
 * persia can lecture, but it may not be as useful as a Q&A session
<lightnin> I'm told I need to fix versioning, and that the package should be changed to be "non-native"
<persia> OK.
<lightnin> But I'm not sure how that directory structure will change the way the rules / etc. files work.
<persia> It won't.
<persia> So, do you have an unpacked source, and a tarball?
<lightnin> So: If I tar up the original source directory (called scratch), what will unpack it? Must I add that to rules as well?
<lightnin> That's not how things were originally laid our unfortunately.
<persia> OK.  Let's start at the beginning then.  Is there a tarball available from upstream?
<lightnin> Not really. This would be our first "official" linux release. The source code is actually in Squeak, so it runs on an interpreter. All the (up to date) code for the entire package is here: https://www.assembla.com/spaces/scratchonlinux/trac_subversion_tool
<persia> Ah, so you *are* upstream, and you want to do an official release?
<nixternal> persia: what is the tool that allows me to manually merge from say debian experimental into ubuntu? been a long time since I had to do this because MoM or UDD didn't have the latest experimental from debian
<lightnin> Yep. It's us. We just want it to be easily available for kids who use ubuntu.
<lightnin> http://scratch.mit.edu/
<lightnin> Can get code really quick to see structure with: svn checkout http://my-svn.assembla.com/svn/scratchonlinux
<persia> nixternal: set PACKAGE, then `sensible-browser https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/$(PACKAGE)/+filebug?no-redirect`
<persia> lightnin: OK.  I usually advise application developers to release some tarball that can be compiled/used for linux as a separate object, and call that the "release".  This makes a single common file that all distributions can use.
<nixternal> persia: not exactly what I was looking for...there used to be a script that would do what MoM does, but locally, and I can't remember the name of it
<persia> lightnin: So, you'd create this with svn export, perhaps something like `make release` if there are release-time scripts you want to run (often there are none the first time), and then just tar czf
<persia> nixternal: I don't know of anything.  There might be a pull-experimental-source (or it would be trivial to construct), but I usually just grab sources and merge manually when I merge manually.
<lightnin> That svn actually contains *all* files to make debian package... so I need to rearrange so that I call debuild -S -sa -I in a directory that contains my source tarball, and the debian directory with control files?
<nixternal> yeah, I hate doing the manual merge that way, especially with the changelog
<persia> lightnin: You don't need to rearrange anything.  We usually recommend that application developers keep debian/ in a separate branch, but it doesn't matter that much.
<persia> lightnin: The important bit at the first stage is to have some tarball (preferably ${PROGRAM_NAME}-${VERSION}.tar.gz ) stored at the upstream homepage or other location (launchpad, sourceforge, etc.)
<bdrung> fabrice_sp: can you have a look at http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?upid=7874 ?
<persia> bdrung: You need to use -sa for every push to REVU.  I've run get-orig-source, and am just finishing builds of that now to post a review.
<persia> (although the get-orig-source bit cost an extra hour or so, unfortunately)
<lightnin> persia:I think I'm too new to all this. It's probably gauche to offer money for help at this stage, eh?
<persia> lightnin: I always accept money for help, but I think that you're close enough not to need enough help to be worth money.
<persia> lightnin: I'll go over stuff in a bit more depth in a /query, and I suspect your next upload will sort everything.
<lightnin> persia: Doesn't feel that close to me. :) But thanks for the vote of confidence.
<bdrung> persia: why -sa every time when the orig.tar does not change?
<bdrung> (and the source tarball is not small)
<persia> bdrung: Because the easiest way to implement support in REVU for allowing the source tarball to be fixed when it was wrong was to create a new layered subdirectory for each upload separately :)
<persia> But anyway, I have the tarball locally, so unless I find lots of reasons to reject, you shouldn't need to repush to REVU.
<bdrung> persia: then REVU should be enhanced to grab the source from the previous upload and check the md5sum ;)
<persia> bdrung: Sounds good.  Please file a bug and a patch :)
 * persia isn't a REVU hacker, but knows the usual response
<persia> bdrung: Actually, even just the bug is useful, in case someone has time.
<bdrung> persia: where to file it?
<ari-tczew> geser: thanks, it works!
<persia> bdrung: launchpad.net/revu/+filebug
<SevenMachines> hi, can i just check if theres been anything odd going on with the build farm today?  specifically the, could not perform immediate configuration on 'udev' build errors. seems to have affected a few uploads and ppa builds today for a few people
<persia> SevenMachines: Yes.  There is an upgrade bug in lucid.  Wait, force-reinstall udev, or rebuild your chroots.
<persia> (one of these things is likely being done to the buildd chroots)
<SevenMachines> persia: thanks, these are failed uploads to the main archive, will they need to be re-uploaded i take it then?
<persia> SevenMachines: They can just be given back.
<randomaction> they're going to be retried automatically
<persia> SevenMachines: For a PPA, you can probably do that yourself.  For the main archive, someone else will catch it.
<\sh> oh well...I give up about the merges...next run will be fun I think
<SevenMachines> thanks, i dont wont to bother someone to upload again if its automatic :)
<\sh> looks like I need to order another hp c7000 with full fledged bl465c components and build my own LP
<randomaction> or am I mistaken and someone has to request the rebuild?
<\sh> and when I'm looking on the sponsors queue...cleaned it up as far as I could, and now it's full again...
<ScottK> randomaction: Someone has to request it.  The open question is will it be one mass request or done on a package by package basis.
<\sh> ScottK: when I see the ammount of pkgs...I would say one mass request and we are done
<ScottK> \sh: My guess is it'll be mass give back for Main and Universe is on it's own, but that's a guess.
<ari-tczew> please sponsor this merge before FF bug 523357 thanks !
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 523357 in agtl "Merge agtl 0.5.1-1 (universe) from Debian testing (main)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/523357
<\sh> ScottK: oh well
<ScottK> We'll see.
<\sh> ScottK: I really do want to see our merges list down to 30 or so...it's really a mess
<ScottK> I imagine so.  I've had almost no time lately.
<\sh> ScottK: /me neither...I tried to deal with merges with my name tag...but it looks like we have really a problem with people doing merges, but not coming back for the next cycle...
 * ScottK agrees
<ScottK> One of the process consequences of late DIF is that there's very little time between DIF and FF.  Since DIF is when merges are traditionally considered fair game, not much can get done.
<\sh> and regarding our tight schedule for this release, the "merges are open for everyone after DIF" doesn't work out properly
<\sh> you took the words out of my mouth :)
<SevenMachines> excuse me if this is an obvious one, but merges stop on the 25th then?
<\sh> nope..today 23:59:59
<SevenMachines> ah! :)
<fabrice_sp> bdrung, looking
<ScottK> SevenMachines: Only ones that bring in new features.  Bug fix merges can go on.
<SevenMachines> ScottK: where the merge only closes bugs is ok, otherwise the bug fix portion is taken and added to the current ubuntu version?
<ScottK> SevenMachines: Generally this means no merges that bring in new upstream versions (without a feature freeze exception) unless the new version is bugfix only.
<ari-tczew> does autosync will run today? 190 packages are outdated between squeeze
<SevenMachines> ok, i think i see, thanks
<\sh> ari-tczew: DIF was on the 11th..now it's only on manual
<ari-tczew> ah ok thnx
<persia> Um, merges *don't* stop today.  It's just the last day to merge any *new upstream* versions without a freeze exception.
<persia> So, if there's a merge pending that doesn't contain a new upstream, please skip it in favour of one that does (especially where the new upstream is useful or interesting)
<persia> Merges don't stop ever, although after BetaFreeze, there needs to be a good reason for the merge (as with any upload).
 * persia usually tries to schedule time to do merges for RCbugs right up until ReleaseFreeze
<SevenMachines> persia: i think that was where i was confused, thinking merging was over and porting fixes into existing ubuntu versions was preferred instead. i think i've seen the light now
<SevenMachines> though it probably means i should learn to do merges properly in the next week or two :)
<persia> SevenMachines: Indeed, as sponsors tend to get more critical, and are more likely to say "Um, no.  That doesn't include any useful bugfixes: go fix a useful bug"
<\sh> persia: http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/multidistrotools/universe.html#outdatedandlocalinB does multidistrotools have the possibility to graph "different in squeeze and lucid with local changes + new upstream only?"
<randomaction> \sh: http://people.ubuntuwire.com/~lucas/merges.html , red entries
<persia> \sh: I don't know, actually.  I suspect it needs a patch to do so.
<\sh> randomaction: thx...
<\sh> but to see this...it's still a lot of crap to do...especially file FFEs
<ari-tczew> lucas's script should fetching how many packages/merges are outdated
<ari-tczew> lol @
<ari-tczew> $ update-maintainer
<ari-tczew> The original maintainer for this package is: Ubuntu MOTU Developers <ubuntu-motu@lists.ubuntu.com>
<ari-tczew> Resetting as: ari-tczew@tlen.pl
<ScottK> "I'm not doing my merges, go ahead" seems to have worked out reasonably well for me.  No new upstreams on my list to do.
<jpds> ari-tczew: Reading the source, that's what it's suppose to do.
<ari-tczew> ScottK: are you bored? new upstream version by merge: Bug 523375
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 523375 in commons-pool "Merge commons-pool 1.5.4-1 (main) from Debian testing (main)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/523375
<ScottK> ari-tczew: No.  I'm very busy with $WORK.  Just pausing a moment to check.
<persia> ScottK: I have historically found "I don't care if anyone does my merges" to work even better, because it doesn't block one from doing them if one happens to bump into them for some other reason.
<\sh> ok...my esx is migrated...
<fabrice_sp> a package I just uploaded FTBFS with a "Chroot problem" on buildd. (http://launchpadlibrarian.net/39318658/buildlog_ubuntu-lucid-i386.ebox-services_1.5-0ubuntu1_CHROOTWAIT.txt.gz) is it a known pb?
<jpds> fabrice_sp: Yes.
<bdrung> persia: do you found anything that can delay the upload of yofrankie?
<fabrice_sp> jpds, ok. Will the rebuild happen alone, or I'll have to retry them?
<fabrice_sp> (when chroot is fixed, I mean)
<jpds> No idea.
<bdrung> fabrice_sp: thanks for checking
<ivoks> i vote for FF postpone cause of broken PPA :D
<fabrice_sp> bdrung, yw ;-) (and thanks for the get-orig-source target :-D )
<bdrung> fabrice_sp: hopefully i can drop it soon ;)
<ari-tczew> [ new upstream @ merge ] Bug 523357 please sponsor it ;-) thanks!
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 523357 in agtl "Merge agtl 0.5.1-1 (universe) from Debian testing (main)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/523357
 * fabrice_sp is busy with ebox* packages
<fabrice_sp> \o/ for yofrankie :-)
<bcurtiswx_> if backporting packages needed for empathy lucid are now requiring gdm... should I just stop?
<bcurtiswx_> empathy 2.29.90 but for karmic..
<highvoltage> hi, anyone wiling to review some packages? as far as I can tell they're in great shape so they just need one more advocate (nixternal perhaps if you're around and able at this time?)
<highvoltage> http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?upid=7859 and http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?upid=7854 and http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?upid=7853
<sebner> bcurtiswx: I'm just wondering why you want to backport a beta version
<bcurtiswx_> sebner: play around with in karmic.. if it is futile i will stop.. but this also gets me learning the backporting process
<sebner> heh
<bcurtiswx_> im doing this mainly to learn backporting and checking to make sure it all works in the end..
<bcurtiswx_> sebner: am I being stupid?
<sebner> bcurtiswx: hmm, I'm not familiar with empathy I'm sorry
<bcurtiswx_> sebner: irregardless of package.. is this the wrong way to go about learning?
<sebner> bcurtiswx: dunno, have you read the backporting docs?
<bcurtiswx_> yup
<blueyed> glib-gettext in Ubuntu is what?
<blueyed> (mortadelo autogen.sh tells me to install it)
<sebner> bcurtiswx: I guess you are doing stuff right then, it's just some packages are quite easy to backport and some are ... difficult
<bcurtiswx_> sebner: im assuming empathy hasn't been backported for testing because its proving on the very difficult end.. which im ok with.. because i'm learning the backporting process while I'm working through all the depends.. etc..
<sebner> :)
<ari-tczew> sebner: got time for sponsoring?
<sebner> ari-tczew: you are quite impatient ;) anyways, guess you can through your stuff at me
<matttbe> Hello ! I'm part of the Cairo-Dock team (with fabounet). We want to update Cairo-Dock and its plug-ins in Lucid repositories. We already have open 2 bugs for these 2 packages but without any anwser. We have pushed our modifications on 2 other branches and we have done a merge proposal. I think that it only need a little verification
<matttbe> => https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/cairo-dock/+bug/521534
<matttbe> => https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/cairo-dock-plug-ins/+bug/521536
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 521534 in cairo-dock "Please update cairo-dock to 2.1.3-3 version" [Undecided,New]
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 521536 in cairo-dock-plug-ins "Please update cairo-dock-plug-ins to 2.1.3-3 version" [Undecided,New]
<BlackZ> matttbe: I'll look at them later
<ari-tczew> tic-tok tic-tok aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa FF is coming, make me crazy
<matttbe> great ! Thanks for your help !
<BlackZ> matttbe: you're welcome
<matttbe> BlackZ, "later" means "before the FF?" :)
<BlackZ> matttbe: few minutes, I'm a bit busy right now
<matttbe> ok, no problem ;)
<BlackZ> matttbe: ok, I'm on them
<matttbe> great, thanks !
<matttbe> if you want, we (fabounet and me) are also on this channel #cairo-dock
<ari-tczew> new usptream bug 414247
<ubottu> Error: Could not parse data returned by Launchpad: The read operation timed out (https://launchpad.net/bugs/414247)
<ari-tczew> superm1: ping
<superm1> yes?
<ari-tczew> superm1: could you review this package? bug 414247
<ubottu> Error: Could not parse data returned by Launchpad: The read operation timed out (https://launchpad.net/bugs/414247)
<superm1> ari-tczew, i'd just subscribe u-u-s
<superm1> i wont be able to for a bit
<ari-tczew> superm1: but you are an hmm 'main' uploader of firmware-addon-dell
<superm1> ari-tczew, but in ubuntu anyone can upload
<superm1> it's okay if someone else does
<ari-tczew> superm1: ok
<\sh> superm1: you subscribed u-r-t not u-u-s
<superm1> what'd i do?
<\sh> superm1: sorry..I just read: you did subscribe u-u-s ;)
<superm1> maybe ari-tczew did something like that, i didnt do anything
<\sh> if someone tells me what it does? universe can be done
<\sh> oh well...doesn't build anyways
<\sh> site-packages instead of dist-packages
<\sh> superm1: if you see ari tell him that his pkg ftbfs because of the mentioned above reason...commented on the bug
 * \sh really has to leave the office now...
<persia> Are logfiles supposed to be deleted on purge?  I thought we kept them around.
<highvoltage> YokoZar, ogra: any of you perhaps up to review a few packages?
<YokoZar> highvoltage: busy atm
<persia> highvoltage: What do you need reviewed?
 * persia is hip-deep in reviewing right now, but willing to help if something is critical
<highvoltage> persia: awesome, I hear you can go at least up to your neck: it's these three packages from mhall119: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/u/mhall119
<highvoltage> persia: it would be nice if you can, but if you can't get to it, then no pressure
<persia> highvoltage: What sort of build-times do they require?  I'm mostly CPU-bound right now.
<highvoltage> persia: very little, they are small and nothing besides the packages themselves need to be built
<persia> highvoltage: OK.  I'll add them to queue.  I can do the visual & copyright faster, if you want to prep them by leaving comments based on build (both all-arch and one-arch) and lintian runs (I use -iIEv --pedantic, and ignore some of the messages)
 * persia is not certain that the builds will complete, based on the current pending build queue, but will try
<persia> highvoltage: You don't happen to know about log files and purge, do you?
<EzraR> persia: you wouldnt happen to be reviewing mangler would you ;)
<persia> EzraR: It's not on my current list.  I'll put it in the queue, but chances are decidedly weak.
<highvoltage> persia: no, sorry
<persia> Anyway, found a different complete blocker in the package that had that issue, meaning I could just tell the uploader to check policy about the logs :)
<highvoltage> persia: all I know is that when you use --purge it should remove log files, but I'm sure you already know that too :)
 * persia is down to 10 packages and 100 minutes, and senses that this will be insufficient
<persia> highvoltage: Actually, that was the part I was unsure about :)
<highvoltage> persia: if you want to refer him to a web page you can point him to section 10.8 on http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-files.html
<persia> highvoltage: That's more for me: the package was correct (and I wasn't sure).
<highvoltage> ah ok
<RoAkSoAx> at what time is FF
<RoAkSoAx> ?
<james_w> RoAkSoAx: 90 minutes
<RoAkSoAx> james_w, ooh we are almost there. Thanks for the tip :)
<RAOF> Would anyone like a review swap?  I'll trade a lintian-clean Docky for someone's pet package :)
<persia> RAOF: Please just grab some of the ones in the pre-advocated queue.
<persia> Anything without at least one advocate at this point isn't likely to make it.
<RAOF> Yeah.
 * persia is happy to look at docky, but probably won't get to it in time, already having a list of one-advocate packages built locally and needing comment
<persia> bdruYou should have uploaded yofrankie already :)
<persia> Hrm.  tab fail : maybe sleeping?
<sebner> persia: yeah, already in NEW since nearly 1 hour
<persia> Then just failed to get noted on REVU (or I'm behind)
<quadrispro> ehya guys, campcaster is on REVU and it needs an ACK
<quadrispro> http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/campcaster
<persia> quadrispro: RAOF is trading for docky, if you're quick :)
<quadrispro> of course
<sebner> quadrispro: I'll take a look at it
 * persia wishes there was a way to know in advance when a package would get rejected, so as not to waste CPU cycles and eyeball time :(
<highvoltage> heh
<quadrispro> persia, eh eh, it would be great :)
<persia> Grr.  I didn't update my system in the past few hours, and pull-revu-source suddenly doesn't work for me!
<highvoltage> persia: what package is this that's violently pillaging your system resources?
<persia> highvoltage: I'm still running test builds for the set of one-advocate stuff I grabbed a few hours ago (parallel builds for with-arch-any and without-arch-any), but the real killer seems to be the new upstream of musecore.
<persia> Since it contains a new soundfont, and since we only have one right now, this will double the number of choices available for creating MIDI soundtracks from free sources (which helps for games, musicians, etc.), but it's very large.
<persia> (and has been linking (in parallel) for the last hour or so.
<highvoltage> ah yes, totally worth the cpu cycles sacrifice!
<persia> Yeah, but I knew about this earlier, and shouldn't have put off the build :)
<persia> (I didn't know it took so long to build, just that it *must* make FF)
<highvoltage> small packages that just contain a few pieces of artwork shouldn't be too hard to get by feature freeze exception should they?
<persia> I think those are bound by UI FReeze.
<highvoltage> persia: maco2 is going to help with the reviewing of mhall119's packages. so you can take them off your fork :)
<persia> highvoltage: Cool!
<persia> fabrice_sp: apologies for the terse comment, but you understand :)
<RAOF> Lex79: I've reviewed colibri; I'd be willing to advocate & upload if you can commit to resolving the comments I've made.
 * persia waits harder on the dvisvgm, frescobaldi, and libbrowserlauncher2-java builds, and hopes musecore finishes in time.
<quadrispro> g'night guys
<quadrispro> sebner, thanks!
<sebner> quadrispro: welcome, gn8
<persia> quadrispro: Just one or two more reviews before you go?
<persia> Ah :(
<sebner> persia: I uploaded ccsript but I changed the versionsnumber back to -0ubuntu1
<RAOF> Hm.  ccscript seems to be missing a license statement for cmodel.sh; it's not LGPL-3
<persia> RAOF: Ah, in debian/copyright?  I perhaps got overexcited about the correct statement releasing rights in the file :(
<RAOF> persia: Right.
<persia> RAOF: One could perhaps argue it's LGPL-3 + exception?
<persia> But yeah, that deserves to be fixed.  Sorry for missing it.
<RAOF> I guess in the same way that MIT is LGPL-3 + exception, maybe :)
 * persia is *so* tired of "This file is public domain" that a properly worded rights release gets automatic bonuses
<persia> heh :)
<RAOF> Heh.
<RAOF> JontheEchidna: I see that you've beaten me to deciding to advocate & upload colibri.
<persia> randomaction: sorry for the terse comment (but you understand)
<sebner> persia: RAOF should I unarchive it and ask a archive-admin to nuke it?
<JontheEchidna> RAOF: since those were your only niggles, I assumed that I was the second ack
<persia> LucidFox: sorry for the terse comment (but you understand)
<RAOF> JontheEchidna: Pretty much, yeah.  The package can still have a watch file, just with a comment as to why a watchfile won't work :)
<JontheEchidna> ah, yeah. never thought about it that way
<JontheEchidna> luckily upstream is a canonical dev, so we shouldn't have much trouble getting the binary install location correct
<cyphermox> persia, thanks for advocating congruity, but it got in through Debian already, with the changes you suggested. I've just archived it -- I thought it already had been.
<sebner> persia: RAOF should I unarchive it and ask a archive-admin to nuke it?
<sebner> ccscript?
<RAOF> sebner: Maybe the archive admins won't notice? :).  I think you should unarchive + nuke, yes.
<persia> cyphermox: Please ask for archiving if you catch things like that :)  Saves me build cycles, which gets more goodies in the archive :)
<persia> why nuke?
<sebner> RAOF: mind fixing it?
<cyphermox> persia, yeah, sorry. it should have been archive long, long ago, and another I was working on around the same time was, so I got confused
<RAOF> sebner: The debian/copyright?  Ok.
<sebner> RAOF: great
<sebner> RAOF: what about the icon thing in docky we spoke about in -cli?
<persia> cyphermox: It happens.
<RAOF> sebner: It is a packaging problem; it seems I've got the icons installed locally, so I didn't notice.
<sebner> RAOF: kk, if you can fix it within the next 20 minutes I'm glad
<RAOF> Test buliding now; should be fixed in... 4 minutes :)
<sebner> great
 * persia grumbles about people not keeping REVU up-to-date, having discovered that yet another review was pointless because it was already uploaded.  At least commenting would be nice
<lifeless> persia: isn't that a REVU bug ('does not notice archive uploads') ?
<persia> OK.  Which of qimo-*, and kfritz doesn't have a second reviewer?
<persia> lifeless: Well, kinda.  It does notice sometimes.
<RAOF> sebner: You uploaded ccscript as -0ubuntu1?  Can I grab your source package to add a new changelog entry?
<persia> RAOF: Can't you download from NEW?
<RAOF> I could, yes.
<lifeless> persia: so when doesn't it discover?
<fabounet> Hi,
<fabounet> what about the Cairo-Dock-plug-ins package ?
<fabounet> Is there any way to know the progress ?
<persia> lifeless: I'm not sure.  I know only a little about the code (I am one of the biggest REVU *users* but haven't even looked at the code)
<sebner> RAOF: you have to get it nuked from NEW but yes go ahead
<persia> fabounet: Check comments on REVU, check NEW.
<persia> sebner: Why does it need to be nuked from NEW?
<persia> sebner: A new upload (with a higher version) will supercede the version in NEW>
<persia> (Soyuz is smart that way)
<james_w> can't you even upload the same version again?
<fabounet> hmm, does it mean it's already integrated ?
<persia> lifeless: The most common case seems to be when it gets into the archive after it goes to REVU, but there hasn't been any upload or comment since.  I think the DB only gets updated per-package when something happens to the package.
<RAOF> sebner: Not just bump the version & upload as normal?
<lifeless> ah
<persia> james_w: Can you?  I thought NEW blocked that.
<lifeless> persia: so, we just need something to watch the archive feed
<james_w> you can if it is rejected at least
<persia> lifeless: Perhaps.  RainCT or NCommander could probably explain better (they seem to have been the last two most recently active REVU Hackers)
<james_w> give it a go :-)
<persia> james_w: I thought that only worked for rejected.  Care to reject ccscript?
<RAOF> I've already bumped the version and uploaded; if you'd prefer to have -0ubuntu1, reject them & I'll unbump & upload.
<sebner> RAOF: ah I just thought archive-admins only like 0ubuntu1
<ScottK> You can upload the same version again only if it's in Source New.
<ScottK> If it's binary New, then the version has been used.
<sebner> hhu ScottK
<sebner> RAOF: is docky fixed now?
<fabounet> Is there a page we can see the progress of a package ?
<fabounet> the launchpad bug is only marked as "on progress"
<RAOF> sebner: yes.
<persia> ScottK: Thanks for the clarification.
<sebner> RAOF: I'll upload then
<james_w> done
<sebner> persia: mind sponsoring a merge for me? (I just have a debdiff, no bug on LP ,..)
<sebner> persia: it's for main
<highvoltage> persia: maco2 isn't added as a reviewer yet on revu. any chance that you could add her now?
<persia> highvoltage: No chances at all: done :)
<highvoltage> persia: hehe
<sebner> RAOF: uploaded :)
<RAOF> sebner: Ta muchly.
<sebner> RAOF: np
<persia> Anyone else have a half-advocated package they need done?  Of those left, any still unclaimed?
<persia> (mind you, these need to be packages that build *instantly* :)
<sebner> persia: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/jinja2/+bug/523540 *please* :=)
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 523540 in jinja2 "Merge jinja2 2.3-1 from Debian(Unstable)" [Wishlist,Confirmed]
<sebner> persia: builds ;)
<persia> sebner: What do you want me to do with that?
<sebner> persia: sponsor (into main)
<persia> sebner: I can't.
<persia> LP lies about my membership in core-dv
<sebner> persia: ohh
<sebner> james_w: are you free for it?
<james_w> 'fraid not
 * sebner looks for a core-dev sponsoring an easy merge
<persia> sebner: You know that there are more core-devs in -devel, right?
<sebner> persia: sure, 2 minutes left are making me nervous :P
<persia> heh.
<persia> I doubt it *can* be done in 2 minutes.
<persia> I think we're done for lucid.
<sebner> persia: pff, as long as somebody starts with it archive admins are fine :P
<persia> heh.
<sebner> persia: where are all the core-devs when you need one!
#ubuntu-motu 2010-02-18
<persia> sebner: Well, main sponsors are always hard to find.
<persia> You just need to make sure to give enough slack.
<directhex> persia, (or warning)
<highvoltage> *bong*
<sebner> persia: I really have high hopes on the archive-reorg. or at least thinking about becoming generalist developer
 * persia grumbles about permissions irregularities.
<sebner> Aye
<highvoltage> I think archive reorg is definitely making things easier for kubuntu, xubuntu and edubuntu and similar teams
<persia> Could someone who isn't stuck in an approval queue please change the topic to reflect FeatureFreeze?
<sebner> persia: nahh!" As long as the topic isn't changed we are free to upload :P
<directhex> could someone with power over nature turn back time a few hours plz?
<sebner> *pssssssssst*
<persia> highvoltage: Yeah, but I'm complaining about suddenly discovering that I'm not an op in here.
<geser> this seems to have changed with the move of freenode to an other ircd
<ajmitch> sebner: sorry I can't sponsor, I killed my lucid box :)
<RAOF> directhex: Just move London a few thousand miles west!
<geser> ajmitch: perfect timing
<sebner> grrrrrrrrr
<ajmitch> geser: isn't it?
 * sebner waves at geser (my core-dev friend)
 * ajmitch managed to crack the screen on the laptop
<RAOF> Owch.
<sebner> geser: mind sponsoring? /me sees no FF in effect
<ajmitch> RAOF: an expensive ouch, too
<geser> sebner: like persia I'm only an indirect core-dev through DMB
<sebner> * persia grumbles about permissions irregularities.
 * sebner too
<sebner> geser: + apply!
<persia> sebner: You've done developer applications : it takes a while to get it ready.
<ajmitch> I don't think he can become core-dev within the next few minutes
<sebner> persia: not for geser ;-P
<persia> ajmitch: Requires past time, actually.  0:00 UTC was the theoretical cut-off.
<ajmitch> persia: theory & practice don't always coincide
 * sebner doesn't see the topic changed
<ajmitch> especially around release milestones :)
<persia> true :)
 * sebner proposes to make the FF on the last time period of 18th
<sebner> Means in 23 hours and 50 minutes
<persia> sebner: Erm, no.
 * sebner calls it a day and says gn8
<sebner> persia: you are killing the fun :P
<persia> sebner: end of 18th worldwide isn't for about 38 hours.
<ajmitch> 38 hours till FF? excellent
<persia> Um, someone ought run that past slangasek :)
<ajmitch> I'll take your word for it :)
<persia> I really do remember a statement that freezes applied at 0:00 UTC
<persia> (but I'd be delighted to be wrong about that)
<ajmitch> it's usually been the case
<persia> Well, at least since slangasek has been around.  Way back when we used to push it :)
<slangasek> in practice I don't expect to get the mail out until AM Europe time
<slangasek> so you have a grace period :P
<persia> slangasek: But is that grace period a result of policy, or your workload?
<slangasek> the latter
<persia> so, we probably shouldn't press on with a REVU sprint, syncfest, and merging madness?
 * lifeless queues up a bunch of upstream releases for post FF, to test the FFe pocess.
<slangasek> heh
<slangasek> persia: I leave it to the deveolpers' discretion ;)
<persia> Actually, testing the new FFe process will be interesting.  This will be the first time we have an integrated release team.
<ajmitch> I'm guessing the 4 people in ~ubuntu-release will be getting a lot of mail in the next few days then
<persia> There's supposed to be some more members added to help with that.
<ajmitch> will it still be approval from any 2?
<persia> I wouldn't expect a policy change, but I could be mistaken
 * persia tends to avoid release coordination stuff
<ScottK> persia: While new day UTC may be a goal, I don't think FF happens until the release manager says it does.
 * ScottK thinks you are free to press on.
<highvoltage> well, release manager did say it's at the discretion of the developer. I guess that's a nice way to say "please don't *totally* abuse it"
<slangasek> ajmitch: well, the freeze policy for main has always had a quorum of 1
<ajmitch> universe has tended to be 2 for some reason
<persia> Mostly because we don't really trust anyone.
<persia> Moving to 1 makes sense.
<crimsun> wasn't that from the first MC?
<crimsun> seems kinda outdated given main's practice
<persia> Was it even an MC thing?  I thought we decided at a MOTU meeting.
<ajmitch> doesn't really matter, nor should it take much to change
<persia> Doesn't take more than an email from the release team to change.
<persia> We've delegated to a release team, and they get to make decisions.
<PATX> can somebody help me decipher this: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/revu1-incoming/fastpatx-1002180206/lintian
<lifeless> looks like a url to me
<PATX> debian-watch-file-in-native-package << its says no watch filed needed which, really is correct but i put one w/ comments in anyway
<lifeless> why are you doing a native package
<PATX> idk
<lifeless> if its /possible/ to write a watch file, it shouldn't be a native package.
<PATX> how do i not do one
<lifeless> make sure you have the tarball it looks for present, and ensure there is at aleast one - in the version number
<PATX> lifeless, fastpatx_6.0.1-1ubuntu1.tar.gz << thats in ../
<lifeless> thats because its a native package
<lifeless> do you know what I'm talking about, or are you guessing?
<PATX> what are you talking about?
<lifeless> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Complete
<PATX> dpkg-buildpackage -S -sa -rfakeroot -k<my key>
<PATX> i did that to build i thought that did NOT make a native pkg
<lifeless> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Complete#Changing%20the%20Original%20Tarball
<PATX> ok......
<lifeless> the command you ran has nothing to do with native/non-native
<PATX> lifeless, does it need to be a non-native to get into ubuntu
<persia> If there is a separate upstream
<PATX> ok
<lifeless> PATX: generally nothing should be native.
<lifeless> except things that are only developed in-ubuntu-for-ubuntu
<PATX> ok
<lifeless> arguably our dpkg etc packages should be non-native :)
<PATX> ok
<PATX> but now i am kinda confused...
<PATX> fastpatx_6.0.1-1ubuntu1.orig.tar.gz
<PATX> do i just need that?
<persia> PATX: My best recommendation to get the right file is to create a working watch file, and add the correct changelog entry and call `uscan --force-download`.  This will automatically set the correct filename.
<RAOF> It shouw be fastpatx_6.0.1.orig.tar.gz; the upstream code won't change with each package revision, so you just use the upstream version.
<RAOF> Or, what persia said, which solves two problems in one.
<PATX> ok
<PATX> persia, my watch file does not get new version though... its just http://patx.me/paste/77751.html
<PATX> is that bad (what it says is true)
<Laibsch> RAOF: would you be willing to take another look at http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/ffgtk ?
<Laibsch> porthose: Can you do the same? ^
<persia> PATX: That's fine, but it means you can't have a working watch file.
<PATX> yea i know
<Laibsch> anybody other MOTU awake and willing to give to give me an endorsement for http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/ffgtk ?
<persia> PATX: Now, write a get-orig-source rule for debian/rules that does the necessary screen-scraping to get the right upstream, etc, but then you have to name the file in the format RAOF suggested.
<PATX> ok
<persia> Laibsch: We're kinda sorta in feature freeze.  Why is this package so cool it needs to be in lucid?
<Laibsch> persia: I know
<Laibsch> and that's exactly the problem
<Laibsch> Please take a look and see that I've been trying to get this package into Ubuntu since karmic
<Laibsch> It's quite frustrating
<Laibsch> I've put a lot of work into this package
<Laibsch> and isdnutils which is a prerequisite
<Laibsch> only to see things linger
<Laibsch> Same thing I experienced with gjots2
<Laibsch> it lingered so long that eventually my work went to waste
<Laibsch> :-(
<Laibsch> not a cool feeling
<Laibsch> Ubuntu is supposed to be more agile than Debian, but my experience is the complete opposite
<persia> I'm not at all certain we're more agile.
<Laibsch> I usually have no problem getting stuff pushed into Debian, but Ubuntu is always a pain
<persia> We generally recommend everyone put stuff in Debian (although we accept it)
<Laibsch> people make you run around "you open a ticket in LP, people there tell you to upload to REVU, where the entry is closed and you're sent back to LP"
<persia> Hrm?
<Laibsch> persia: I make it a point to usually push to Debian although I don't use it
<Laibsch> Shortly before the window closes for a new Ubuntu release, I ask for syncs, etc.
<persia> If you're using Ubuntu, you're using Debian, plus a thin veneer of patches, and some plumbing changes.
<Laibsch> During the last couple of days, of course, I try to push to Ubuntu directly
<Laibsch> and my experience with the responses there is abyssmal and frustrating
<Laibsch> persia: you know what I mean, I'm really frustrated and not in a mood to nitpick
<persia> The last couple of days is precisely the worst time to try to push to Ubuntu.
<Laibsch> I maintain 6-7 packages in Debian, I know the background
<persia> Because that's when developers have the least time.
<Laibsch> persia: Look at the references I gave you, please
<Laibsch> I start about two weeks before
<Laibsch> persia: let me give you the number of a bug ticket
<persia> I just reviewed your package history on REVU.  The latest upload was 2 days before FF, fixing a heap of stuff you knew about since August.
<Laibsch> persia: or better, instead of arguing, would you be so kind and do a review?
<persia> But I'll look at it if you tell me why it's cool )
<Laibsch> I can tell you about my frustrations in the meantime
<Laibsch> ;-)
<Laibsch> persia: do you live in .de?
<Laibsch> Have you heard about FritzBoxes?
<Laibsch> AVM?
<maco2> he's in .jp
<Laibsch> They have a large market share as all-in-one boxes
<Laibsch> persia: You're in .jp?
<Laibsch> We need to meet next time ;-)
<Laibsch> You're not ??? Plessy, are you?
<lifeless> no
<Laibsch> was ist Charles?
<Laibsch> I see
<lifeless> check /whois
<Laibsch> E.H.
<Laibsch> ^^
<Laibsch> done
<Laibsch> ffgtk allows to control Fritz Boxes
<Laibsch> and fax through them over the network
<Laibsch> that is pretty cool
<Laibsch> and currently not possible with any other solution
<Laibsch> persia: convinced?
<persia> Sure.
<Laibsch> I'm sorry, it may not be anythning you may be able to use
 * persia will look, but it needs two
<Laibsch> I know
<persia> Nope.  I can't use it, and I can't test it.
<Laibsch> But it always needs a first
<Laibsch> It's not completely functional yet
<Laibsch> We also need the changes to isdnutils
<Laibsch> the program itself is done
<Laibsch> but it needs some changes in isdnutils to talk to the Fritzbox
<Laibsch> persia: bug 420918 to see some of the run-around one can be given with 0 progress
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 420918 in isdnutils "please update libcapi" [Wishlist,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/420918
<PATX> I am just not quite getting the non-native
<persia> PATX: You're packaging a shell script, right?  Have you read the wiki page about packaging without compilation?
<Laibsch> persia: bug 406578 isn't much prettier
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 406578 in inkscape "use correct Name and GenericName in desktop file" [Low,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/406578
<Laibsch> sorry, wrong bug number
<Laibsch> bug 406574
<persia> Laibsch: Complaining to me about these won't help much.
<PATX> persia, i am packaging just one .py
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 406574 in gjots2 "please update gjots2 to 2.3.8 (complete patch included)" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/406574
<Laibsch> I need to vent ;-)
<persia> PATX: OK.  Did you read that wiki page?
<PATX> the... https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide ?
<PATX> if so yea
<lifeless> Laibsch: please don't vent here; we try to have a productive channel, and venting is distruptive, even though I can understand the urge.
<lifeless> persia: speaking of productive, do your randr needing packages in main build now?
<lifeless> persia: can I chalk that up to 'done'
<persia> PATX: No, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/School/PackagingWithoutCompiling : that's a shortcut guide to accomplish what you are trying to do quickly.
<PATX> ah OK thanks :)
<persia> lifeless: I don't have packages in main :)
<lifeless> persia: well, wherever they were failing
<persia> lifeless: But I'll try to find the package that needed it, and rebuild.
<persia> lifeless: But I'm 99% sure that you can call it  'done".
<lifeless> persia: I'm a skeptic
<Laibsch> lifeless: I think it may be important for MOTU to understand the frustrations of non-MOTU from time to time look at the links I gave and see I am being productive while I'm being given very unproductive runarounds
<lifeless> its important to understand the problems and issues. Thats very different to venting.
<PATX> persia, ok i think i am getting it... :) thanks... just one question do i need a debian/install (just never used one before when makeing .deb s for my lp ppa)
<persia> PATX: Depends on whether you have a setup.py / Makefile / etc.
<persia> I think it's easier to understand a debian/install file than hacking around in debian/rules
<PATX> persia, i have a setup.py
<persia> PATX: Then you don't need debian/install unless your setup.py is buggy :)
<PATX> persia, ok :) and debian/compat (and pycompat) i have used before. but i do not see them on your page... do i not need these?
<PATX> oh wait nvm
<persia> PATX: debian/compat should appear on that page (somewhere - I should rewrite that page, or do another session in exchange for someone else rewriting it).  pycompat is important for python packages in some way I don't precisely understand: I have no idea if you need it for a single script.
<PATX> ah
<PATX> i see it (its burried)
<ScottK> persia: pycompat is obsolete and not needed.  Thanks to a cdbs bug it's unfortunately common.
<persia> ScottK: Thanks for the clarification.  Is the debian/control field still required, or only for modules?
<PATX> ah ok :)
<ScottK> persia: You mean XS/XB-Python-Version?
<ScottK> Yes.
<persia> For all packages, even just scripts?
<RAOF> That's just for dh_pycentral, right?  My understanding of the Python policy was that you only needed to specify anything about python versions if there are versions of python that won't work (ie: it's an extension, or uses features from 2.4+, or ...)
<PATX> persia, if i wanted to not use setup.py (ill use debian/install) it would still in install in usr/bin correct? not some python location?
<persia> PATX: Depends what you put in debian/install :)  But it could.
<PATX> i was just going to do "fastpatx usr/bin"
<PATX> fastpatx being my package
<paissad> guys, after running apt-get remove, i have some files i did not expected to be conffiles http://pastebin.com/f3d69c901
<paissad>  ... actually i only expected /etc/PMS.conf & /etc/WEB.conf no to be removed
<paissad> is it a new rule for Debian/Ubuntu policy not to remove files in /etc/default  & /etc/init.d & /etc/logroated/ ???
<PATX> persia, http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/fastpatx
<PATX> can u look at that? i think i got it?
<PATX> but maybe you could tell me to do anything that might hold me up getting it passed...
<persia> paissad: Everything in /etc/ gets marked as a conffile by default
<persia> PATX: Maybe in a bit: I've been reviewing for the past 12 hours, and would prefer not to look at yet more right now :)
<PATX> ok thanks a million if you get to it :)
<paissad> persia, do i have to respect that policy ... or may i override the rule & remove some files in /etc/* ?
<persia> paissad: I believe there's a way to mark a preferred subset of files as conffiles, so the rest automatically go away.  I don't know how to do it.
<paissad> persia, if i create a debian/conffiles as said in Maintainer's Guide, i hope that only that files will be considered so
<paissad> ^^
<persia> paissad: Quite possibly.  Test it :
<paissad> files mentionned in debian/conffiles i mean
<paissad> persia, ok i will, thx
<james_w> man dh_installdeb
<persia> james_w: Thanks :)
 * persia reads
<persia> Ah, so it can't be overridden
<james_w> it's not clear
<ScottK> persia: Anything shipped in /etc is a conffile.  If you don't want something in /etc to be a conffile, then generate it in postinst.
<persia> ScottK: Right.
<persia> james_w: It's much more clear in the dh_installdeb source, which works as ScottK just described
 * persia having read it due to the brevity of the manpage
<SoftwareExplorer> I added a ppa in launchpad. I used the correct url/path on the command line but forgot to update ~/.dput.cf. I don't see the package in the ppa, but if I try it again (with an updated ~/.dput.cf) it says that it is already uploaded to launchpad. Am I just being to impatient?
<lifeless> SoftwareExplorer: you're not understanding what dput does.
<lifeless> SoftwareExplorer: dput writes a file when it uploads something.
<lifeless> delete said file.
<SoftwareExplorer> lifeless: Ok, thanks.
<SoftwareExplorer> lifeless: It worked. :)
<lifeless> feel free to file a bug saying 'the already uploaded message should print the file that it checked' or something - to make it more discoverable
<paissad> persia, i have this warning " duplicate-conffile "if i create debian/conffiles
<ScottK> paissad: Don't list anything shipped in /etc in debian/conffiles.  They are conffiles automatically (and unavoidably)
<paissad> though,i guess i have to create a prerm script which removes /etc/logrotate/foo , /etc/default/foo /etc/init.d/foo !
<paissad> ScottK, ok , i understand that now ... but i don't need all files in /etc to be conffiles  ^^
<ScottK> But they are by policy
<paissad> ScottK, By default, they are, but do you agree with that all files in /etc need to be conf files
<ScottK> No.  They don't, but then don't ship them in the binary
<paissad> ScottK, i will remove some of them from prerm script (remove or purge)
<paissad> btw, what must i use ( prerm or postrm ?)
<ScottK> postrm, IIRC
<suji11> what is going on in my package http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/iok ?
<rmunn> So now that feature freeze is over, what's the best thing a not-yet-MOTU can do to help improve Lucid?
<fabrice_sp> rmunn, fix non installable pacakge and non buildable ones
<suji11> what is going on in my package http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/iok ? whether it will come on lucid or not?
<ajmitch> suji11: it was uploaded, it's in the queue for archive admins to check
<suji11> ajmitch: ok
<StevenK> suji11: Accepted.
<suji11> StevenK: where could i check that?
<StevenK> suji11: The queue where new stuff lands is https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/lucid/+queue ; and iok is now at https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/iok
<suji11> StevenK: Ok, Thank you:)
<LLStarks> guys. shouldn't apt-get install deluge install deluged?
<LLStarks> deluge 1.2 requires the daemon.
<LLStarks> by default.
<crimsun> StevenK: would you promote libffado (MIR bug #416778) and jack-audio-connection-kit (MIR bug #510481), please?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 416778 in libffado "[MIR] libffado" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/416778
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 510481 in jack-audio-connection-kit "[MIR] Jack-audio-connection-kit" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/510481
<StevenK> crimsun: Done.
<crimsun> StevenK: thanks!
<SoftwareExplorer> So, I'm working on a package with a quilt patching system.  I added a patch, told quilt what files I would change, changed them, ran quilt refresh. Do I pop the patches before I run debuild?
<LLStarks> bug #523622
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 523622 in deluge "deluged needs to be installed with deluge" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/523622
<nigelb> SoftwareExplorer: I believe yes.
<SoftwareExplorer> nigelb: Hmm, Maybe I'm doing something wrong. When I pop the patches, debuild fails because it's trying to sign with someone else's key.
<nigelb> SoftwareExplorer: did you "dch -i"?
<nigelb> updated change log with your email yet?
<SoftwareExplorer> nigelb: Yes.
<SoftwareExplorer> nigelb: but of course, that's part of the new patch.
<nigelb> okay, so the last entry in debian/changelog has your email ID and your key is set up?
<nigelb> the signing with someone else's key failure happens when one of them is not done
<SoftwareExplorer> nigelb: yes, as long as the latest patch is applied, but I thought debuild automatically work around that
<fabrice_sp> arghhh: I ack'd a sync 2 hours ago, but we are in Feature Freeze now, right? (Topic is not up-to-date, it seems)
<SoftwareExplorer> nigelb: (I got the impression I should pop the patches from the wiki, maybe that was wrong)
<StevenK> It isn't Thursday where the release manager lives ....
<fabrice_sp> oooh: cool
<nigelb> SoftwareExplorer: appologies, lost power.  You still have issues?
<fabrice_sp> a question about Bug 514292 .If it's a sync, how can I upload it? Adding a fake ubuntu entry?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 514292 in ubuntu "Sync mingw-w64 0~20100125-3 (universe) from Debian testing (main)" [Wishlist,Won't fix] https://launchpad.net/bugs/514292
<SoftwareExplorer> nigelb: Um, well unless someone says I shouldn't, I'm leaning toward leaving the patches applied to run debuild
<SoftwareExplorer> nigelb: otherwise debian/control will not have the correct email address
<SoftwareExplorer> nigelb: *changelog
<nigelb> SoftwareExplorer: wait, what does the patch do?
<StevenK> SoftwareExplorer: They shouldn't be applied, the build should do that first
 * fabrice_sp will upload it as build1
<SoftwareExplorer> StevenK: Modifies 2 .c files, changelog, and I just realized it should modify control file to
<nigelb> the patch shouldn
<nigelb> the patch shouldn't be modifying changelog
<StevenK> SoftwareExplorer: Exactly as nigelb says, you should not be modifying files under debian/ with quilt, you should just edit them straight
<SoftwareExplorer> StevenK: Ahh, ok.
<SoftwareExplorer> That's why it wasn't working
<nigelb> quilt is only for the actual source code of the app.
<SoftwareExplorer> nigelb: Ok, Thanks.
<SoftwareExplorer> StevenK: Thanks.
<suji11> StevenK: whats needed now so that I can see iok appearing in search at http://packages.ubuntu.com/
<StevenK> I have no idea, I use Launchpad directly
<eeexception> Hi, guys. I'm trying to make deb package of my qt project and have some troubles. I use this script to make deb http://code.google.com/p/yourownnewsmaker/source/browse/trunk/make-linux-release.sh,
<eeexception> and this rules file http://code.google.com/p/yourownnewsmaker/source/browse/trunk/rules
<eeexception> So during running it I have no errors except warning that I do not have pgp key, but as a result I get an empty deb packages with only these empty roots:
<eeexception> /usr/bin; usr/sbin; /usr/share.
<eeexception> By the way if I manually go to the builddir and run make install, Makefile script creates all needed files in right place.
<eeexception> So I suppose that I have an error in section install: of rules file, but do not understand it at all. Could you help me to fix this problem?
<SoftwareExplorer> I dput a source.changes to a ppa, but nothing seems to happen. I've given it a couple of hours and it doesn't even list anything a building. What could I be doing wrong?
<eeexception> By the way I used this manual to create rules file http://wiki.maemo.org/Packaging_a_Qt_application
<kklimonda> can I somehow build package that is using new source format on/for karmic?
<SoftwareExplorer> Also, launchpad says "               Package counters and estimated archive size temporarily               unavailable.
<SoftwareExplorer> I also tried disabling the ppa and reinabling it, but nothing happend
<dholbach> good morning
<eeexception> morning
<suji11> dholbach:  good morning..
<suji11> dholbach: My package iok was accepted, it is here https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/iok/1.3.9-0ubuntu1 in lauchpad , how could i get this from packages.ubuntu.com
<dholbach> suji11: it might take some time
<suji11> *packages.ubuntu.com
<suji11> dholbach: ok
<dholbach> ah
<dholbach> it hasn't built on all architectures yet
<dholbach> and while the source is in the archive already, the binary (.deb files) are still in a separate queue
<suji11> dholbach: when i search iok here https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/lucid it shows No packages matching 'iok' are published in Lucid.
<dholbach> yes because of what I said above
<dholbach> and I can't fix it
<dholbach> Lucid:   amd64 (New)   armel   i386 (New)   ia64   powerpc (New)   sparc
<dholbach> that's what (New) means there
<suji11>  dholbach: ok, should i do anything for that?
<dholbach> binary new = binary packages (=.deb files) are in a queue for the archive admins
<dholbach> no
<dholbach> the archive admins will get around to it
<suji11> dholbach: ok, then i don't have to do anything now. am right?
<dholbach> yes
<suji11> dholbach: ok
<stochastic> Can anyone with upload powers look at the patch for building xine against jack on Bug #152487 before feature freeze becomes solid?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 152487 in xine-lib "Jack output for xine apps " [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/152487
<hypera1r> you mean it's not solid yet?
<directhex> hypera1r, it's still a little squishy, as long as people don't take the piss
<hypera1r> heh
<hypera1r> squishy eh
<directhex> squishy!
<hypera1r> stochastic: i think that patch is reversed.
<oojah> I guess there are a lot of features to freeze, so it takes some time for them all to cool down.
<sebner> hypera1r: do you got your cowpowers already?
<stochastic> hypera1r, oops, I'll fix that up right now
<hypera1r> sebner: er no.
<hypera1r> sebner: not yet. =(
<sebner> hypera1r: urgh!
<hypera1r> sebner: bad time to become motu huh =p
<hypera1r> stochastic: also, it seems like you chopped off the trailing \n in libxine1-misc-plugins.install
<stochastic> I really didn't mean to.
<stochastic> i.e. I don't know how that happened
<hypera1r> stochastic: nevermind, just put it back =)
<sebner> hypera1r: heh, I can remember .. some years ago the best time was after a release
<hypera1r> sebner: why?
<sebner> hypera1r: Before release is more dangerous, after release you can break anything you want
<hypera1r> sebner: aah i see. heheh
<stochastic> hypera1r, changes made.
<hyperair> well, reading the patch, it looks good to me.
<stochastic> can you upload it or do you not have the powers?
<Laney> nobody pressed the buttons from the DMB yet?
<sebner> hi Laney :)
<Laney> hi hi
<slytherin> do we have any special policy in regards with (against) FFE?
<stochastic> Both Bug #360590  and Bug #152487 were awaiting a MIR approval that went through just 4hours ago.  They both have patches ready to be uploaded and if anyone is willing the entire Ubuntu Studio team would love for them to be uploaded.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 360590 in ubuntustudio "Please compile portaudio with Jack support" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/360590
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 152487 in xine-lib "Jack output for xine apps " [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/152487
<paissad> hi all, i would like to add an interactive mode during the installation of my package to allow  choose a specific directory ( it's for a configuration file ) .... an example is ddclient configuration during installation for those who know it
<slytherin> paissad: you need to use debconf
<paissad> slytherin, ok thanks
<Laney> is there a benefit to allowing this?
<slytherin> Can any oython packaging experts take a look at python-scriptutil package from lucid and tell me why it would cause installation failure?
<james_w> slytherin: is this a test?
<PATX> can somebody review http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/fastpatx ?
<slytherin> james_w: No. libmx4j-java is FTBFS because its build-dep javahelper fails to install because python-scriptutil fails to install.
<james_w> slytherin: do you have a log or anything?
<slytherin> just a sec
<slytherin> james_w: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libmx4j-java/3.0.2-8/+build/1484191/+files/buildlog_ubuntu-lucid-i386.libmx4j-java_3.0.2-8_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<hakaishi> Hi everyone! Anyone up to advocate/review qt-shutdown-p? - I've replaced the multiple start prevention and did some code cleanups. http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/qt-shutdown-p
<james_w> slytherin: it's uninstallable rather than failing to install due to a postinst error or similar
<james_w> so it's probably not python-specific knowledge that is needed
<slytherin> james_w: It has only two dependencies both are satisfiable in lucid. So I am really wondering if this has something to do with python transition. The package has not changed for last 3 releases.
<james_w> it needs a retry since scriptutil was promoted to main
<slytherin> james_w: Can you give it a retry? I don't have permissions.
<james_w> done
<slytherin> james_w: thanks
<hakaishi> Anyone up to review/advocate qt-shutdown-p? http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/qt-shutdown-p
<highvoltage> dholbach: does core-dev imply motu as well?
<highvoltage> dholbach: I generally thought that people become motu first before core-dev, is there a reason why mako wouldn't be able to get revu rights? http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?upid=7876
<Laney> core-dev is a member of motu
<Laney> you need to be made a reviewer by a REVU admin manually
<highvoltage> nhandler: do you perhaps have some time to add mako as a reviewer on revu?
<sistpoty|work> highvoltage: just done it
<sebner> huhu sistpoty|work
<nhandler> highvoltage: One second
<sistpoty|work> hi sebner
<highvoltage> sistpoty|work, nhandler: thanks!
<sistpoty|work> yw
<nhandler> Ah, beat me to it ;)
<wrapster> if i try apt-get install on any pkg i see this error...
<wrapster>  E: Could not get lock /var/lib/dpkg/lock - open (11 Resource temporarily unavailable)
<wrapster> E: Unable to lock the administration directory (/var/lib/dpkg/), is another process using it?
<akheron> wrapster: as it says, another process is using it
<wrapster> but that is the only process using it
<wrapster> i checked for it.. im the only one on that machine as of now.
<wrapster> and it ws working fine all the while...
<akheron> is there an apt-get or dpkg process stopped in the background?
<akheron> did you check ps aux output that there's no other process?
<wrapster> yes...
<wrapster> but i did a ^c on apt-get and after that , Im seeing such issues.
<wrapster> was it wrong?
<akheron> no
<slytherin> james_w: FYI ... libmx4j-java built fine on all arch.
<james_w> score
<highvoltage> "scratch (1.4.0.debian.20)" - that's a valid version number for an Ubuntu native package right?
<sebner> sistpoty|work: it seems this will be the first FF Cycle where we can't do deep QA *hohohohoh*
<hyperair> highvoltage: yes, but i think that package shouldn't be made a native package.
<sistpoty|work> sebner: hm?
<sebner> sistpoty|work: lack of games :\
<sistpoty|work> sebner: ah
<highvoltage> hyperair: what do you suggest?
<hyperair> highvoltage: a non-native package.
<hyperair> highvoltage: svn export it out and tarball it
<bmhm> hi there, can packages for lucid still be changed?
<sebner> bmhm: depending on what you understand under "changed"
<bmhm> just a tiny bug report, bug #200204
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 200204 in linux-libertine "Packaging request: Either replace TTF with OTF or make two packages available" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/200204
<bmhm> would be a big improvement for few effort, I think
<sebner> bmhm: hmm, pretty late for something new
<bmhm> I guessed so, the bad thing is that I found this bug too late :-(
<bmhm> then better remove the nomination if it's too late
<sebner> bmhm: I'm sorry, I don't really know who is the right person for font stuff
<shadeslayer> bmhm: what i would suggest is to leave it like that
<bmhm> seems pretty easy to do, I might upload own packages to my PPA
<bmhm> ok
<shadeslayer> bmhm: dholbach_ is your man :)
<bmhm> I see, thx
<bmhm> I think it should be reported upstream
<rhpot1991> got a general license question, not ubuntu specific but I'd love to hear some opinions.  I have a license header on the top of all my source files, do/should I need to worry about putting this same header into the top of machine generated code?
<sistpoty|work> rhpot1991: no need to do that. However I'd put "generated by <scriptname>" in there, so that it's clear that the code is generated (and I think licensecheck uses "generated by" as a regexp)
<bddebian> Heya gang
<sebner> huhu bddebian :)
<bddebian> Heya sebner
<rhpot1991> sistpoty|work: thanks
<sistpoty|work> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Hi sistpoty|work
 * Rhonda waves to bddebian ;)
<bddebian> Hi Rhonda
<rhpot1991> sistpoty|work: thoughts on machine generated configuration files, say xml?
<cody-somerville> xml sucks for config files
<rhpot1991> well in this batch of code its .net, so this is Visual Studio generated garbage
<sistpoty|work> rhpot1991: I assume visual studio doesn't restrict the distribution of these in any way? if so, just ignore them
<christoph_debian> ubuntu's already in feature-freeze? /me should double check but debbug 567812 should affect ubuntu as well
<Laney> debian bug 567812
<ubottu> Debian bug 567812 in cl-irc "cl-irc: Doesn't load with flexistreams 1.0.$something" [Grave,Fixed] http://bugs.debian.org/567812
<Laney> bug fixes are almost always alright to sync
<christoph_debian> jep and it's minimal
<christoph_debian> I'll probably go and request the sync after verigfying it's there
<Laney> good stuff
<Laibsch> How can I withdraw a request for sponsorship on REVU?
<persia> Laibsch: It can be archived.  Which package?
<Laibsch> I found the knob now, thanks
<Laibsch> your interpretation about the isdnutils situation seems to have been correct
<Laibsch> thank you for preventing me from wasting any further time
<persia> I'm not saying it can't be done, only that it needs review.
<persia> If you think it ought be fixed, please file for a freeze exception.
<Laibsch> I'll build the package locally
<Laibsch> Why expend an increasing amount of effort?
<Laibsch> when that effort mostly does not find an echo in a timely reaction
<Laibsch> and thus bitrot will necessitate even more work next time round
<persia> Laibsch: The other alternative is to just wait until the archive opens, and then push for it to get in then.
<persia> The trick is to not try to get new stuff between FeatureFreeze and Release.
<Laibsch> that's what I did six months ago
<Laibsch> not again
<persia> six months ago was also right after FeatureFreeze.  The secret number is three months.
<Laibsch> persia: OK, OK
<Laibsch> that's what I did eight months ago
<Laibsch> and nothing happening in between
<Laibsch> Thank you for pointing out the knob
<Laibsch> Bye
<BlackZ> how can I make a changelog/debdiff between two upstream versions?
<hyperair> debdiff bla_source.changes bla2_source.changes
<hyperair> or debdiff bla.dsc bla2.dsc
<BlackZ> hyperair: thanks
<hyperair> BlackZ: you can find out more by typing "man debdiff" in a terminal, or searching for man:debdiff in yelp
<randomaction> What's generally preferred, a 99_autoconf.patch or b-dep on autoconf+automake + autoreconf in rules?
<kklimonda> probably depends - desktop team prefers 99_autoreconf patch
<persia> randomaction: maintainer preference.  I prefer the latter, because it auto-ports to new environments.  Some people prefer the former, because it is then possible to repeat a build.
<directhex> mono team prefers the latter
<directhex> since we don't need to refresh the 99_autoconf.patch for every single bloody minor update to the autohell stack
<hyperair> persia: it's also possible to repeat a build for the latter.
<persia> hyperair: Not always, because autotools-dev can have new stuff.
<hyperair> my preference is to patch the autohell generated files individually, if it isn't too much.
<hyperair> stuff like adding new files to Makefile.am can be added to Makefile.in trivially
<hyperair> changing flags as well
<hyperair> and maybe minor changes in configure.ac
<persia> That's harder to submit upstream, or even carry over to the next release though.
<hyperair> i submit my patch upstream, *then* i put it into the package and add the Makefile.in/configure bits
<hyperair> but either way, it's not too hard to just strip away the Makefile.in/configure bits of the patch
<hyperair> vim and the visual line mode works wonderfully for that
<hyperair> or filterdiff or whatever that utility was called..
<persia> filterdiff indeed.
<randomaction> for 99*patch, I like that there are no additional build-deps and build actions, but it's usually a big patch and it needs more maintenance
<persia> But not that much maintainance, if it's just an autoreconf patch.
<persia> On upgrade, delete it and regenerate.
<randomaction> in this case I think I'll settle for build-time autoreconf because I need to modify m4/gettext.m4
<stochastic> Both Bug #360590  and Bug #152487 were awaiting a MIR approval that went through just a few hours ago.  They both have patches ready to be uploaded and if anyone is willing the entire Ubuntu Studio team would love for them to be uploaded.  I realize this is pushing into the FF a little much, do I need to get FFE bugs written up for these?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 360590 in ubuntustudio "Please compile portaudio with Jack support" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/360590
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 152487 in xine-lib "Jack output for xine apps " [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/152487
<hyperair> anyone from motu-release? ^^
<persia> motu-release is no more: long live ubuntu-release
<hyperair> heh right
<sebner> persia: Have the members merged too?
<hyperair> i keep forgetting
<fabrice_sp> Some to update the topic to mention Feature Freeze?
<fabounet> BlackZ : Hi, what about the builds of Cairo-Dock 2.1.3 ?
<fabounet> Is there somewhere I could see the results ?
<BlackZ> fabounet: I'm building it
<fabounet> BlackZ : ok, was there any problem with the build yesterday ?
<fabounet> BlackZ : by the way I've noticed that someone has launched the builds of the 2.0.9. I see no reason for building this old version since it's not maintained anymore. Do you have any info about it ?
<BlackZ> fabounet: I have started to work on it today - no, I haven't
<fabounet> BlackZ : ah ok, I thought you did it yesterday. Do you know how much time it may take ?
<BlackZ> fabounet: it depends, for now I have applied the patch and fixed the build issues
<fabounet> BlackZ : ok, thanks, I'll wait then.
<persia> sebner: Read your mail for the latest updates :)
<BlackZ> fabounet: I think I'll end for sun
<BlackZ> fabounet: if I don't answer here, probably I'm away, btw you can reply to the bug or send me an e-mail
<sebner> hrm ^^
<BlackZ> fabounet: or you can let a pm
<fabounet> BlackZ: yep sure, where is this bug ?
<BlackZ> bug #521536
<BlackZ> bug #521534
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 521536 in cairo-dock-plug-ins "Please update cairo-dock-plug-ins to 2.1.3-3 version" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/521536
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 521534 in cairo-dock "Please update cairo-dock to 2.1.3-3 version" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/521534
<fabounet> BlackZ: have you a mail address where I could contact you when you're away on IRC ?
<fabounet> BlackZ: ok I see thanks. I'll reply them
<BlackZ> fabounet: you can find it on launchpad, by registring yourself
<FLOZz> hello _o/
<directhex> bddebian, what're the chances of taking a look at mono in debian NEW? it's largely what was there before, but with some non-dfsg elements replaced upstream (and, as a result, a new binary package, hence NEW). this is the version i want in lucid, give or take
 * Rhonda wonders, libsdl1.2 1.2.14 was synced into lucid though that has a major bug that affects at least wesnoth â¦
<Rhonda> wesnoth developers discussed it with libsdl upstream and they confirmed that there's something fishy going on. In Debian we managed to keep 1.2.14 out of squeeze through a release-critical bugreport, but like said, it did manage to get into lucid  :-/
<sebner> Rhonda: manually? autosyncs are nasty ...
<Rhonda> sebner: Only could have happened manually because it never was in squeeze and from what I understood autosync only happens from squeeze this time and not from unstable?
<sebner> Rhonda: right
 * sebner looks
<Rhonda> I am not interested in who did request the sync, I'm especially not interested in "blaming" someone.
<bddebian> I think dtchen brought it from experimental
<bddebian> directhex: I'll see what I can do
<sebner> Rhonda: who -> contact -> gives you a reason
<Rhonda> I just want to bring up the issue - but I have no real clue what would be possible to work around that â¦
<bddebian> Fix the bug! ;-P
<Rhonda> sebner: Pardon?
<Rhonda> bddebian: If it would be that easy the bug would have been fixed in Debian since weeks already.
<persia> Does it look like there can be a fix in the next couple months?
<persia> Otherwise we'd have to do 1.2.14+really... or something
<Rhonda> Ah, right, have seen such versioning games in the past.
<Rhonda> I fear the bug isn't easy to fix. :/
 * c_korn found bug 491335
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 491335 in libsdl1.2 "SDL 1.12.13 needs upgrading to version 1.2.14" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/491335
<persia> Rhonda: Do you happen to know the Debian RC bug offhand?
<ajmitch> lucid's sdl was upgraded before the debian bug was filed, by the look of things
<ajmitch> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=565788
<ubottu> Debian bug 565788 in libsdl1.2debian-all "Upgrading SDL breaks Wesnoth" [Critical,Open]
<Rhonda> Yes, 565788
<Rhonda> Thanks ajmitch for being faster. :)
 * ajmitch had it open there :)
 * sebner kicks his router for being laggy again
<ajmitch> looks like it was upgrade for good reasons, and needs fixed/downgraded for good reasons as well
<Rhonda> Interesting, fix released for something undecided?  :P
<persia> Rhonda: People aren't always best about setting status :)
<Rhonda> oh! bddebian!
<Rhonda> bddebian fixed #557711 in debian. bad bddebian :D
<ajmitch> now to find a version that doesn't have a serious regression
<Rhonda> Looks like both versions do have their issues.  %-/
<randomaction> looks like downgrading will break other apps
<randomaction> Ubuntu and Debian have different X, right? Maybe Wesnoth in Ubuntu isn't broken (this needs testing at least)
<Rhonda> randomaction: Sure, that would be something to test indeed.
<ajmitch> the wesnoth problem also looks to be WM-related, according to those bug reports
<persia> WM-related?
<Rhonda> window manager
<ajmitch> only happening on some window managers
<Rhonda> so s/related/specific/ :)
<persia> Which seems confusing to me, because SDL tries to capture everything.
<Rhonda> persia: If you want to have fun take a look at what libsdl-net offers. Then you might understand how "universal" sdl _really_ is.
 * Rhonda . o O ( short story: not much )
<ajmitch> it's only when running the game in windowed mode, upstream report at http://bugzilla.libsdl.org/show_bug.cgi?id=894
<ubottu> bugzilla.libsdl.org bug 894 in events "After SDL 1.2.14 update, wesnoth doesn't accept mouse clicks in windowed mode" [Normal,Waiting]
<persia> Rhonda: I know.  The goal is there, but ...
<Rhonda> There was something that you can't make it bind to a specific interface only: If you give it an interface IP it behaves like a client.
<ajmitch> that's a bit weird
<Rhonda> fun things like that ;)
<jfcg6> hi. i have an external usb hard disk with ext4. when inserted it is auto mounted with (rw,nosuid,nodev,uhelper=devkit). i also want to have "noatime" mount option. how do i add that to "auto mount options"?
<persia> jfcg6: You want to ask that either in #ubuntu or #ubuntu+1 if you're running lucid.
<jfcg6> i did but got an answer for modifying fstab file which is for statis fs info
<jfcg6> i dont think that is what i should do
<jfcg6> should be something about devkit
<persia> You might be right.
<persia> But this channel is just very much not the right place.  We tend to maintain otherwise unmaintained software on the edges of the distribution.
<persia> And the problem you describe doesn't sound like it falls in that area.
<jfcg6> ic thx
<persia> So, either keep pushing at the regular support channels, or file a bug (which may be invalid if it's not really a bug)/
<ScottK> There's also the buy a support contract option.
 * persia always forgets that one
<fabounet> BlackZ : may I know how is going the build ?
<fabounet> Is this page the right one to see when they are finished ? https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+builds?build_state=all&build_text=cairo-dock
<jfcg6> im failing to find "file a bug" link on bugs.launchpad.net, am i looking at the wrong place?
<persia> jfcg6: Try running `ubuntu-bug` locally.
<arand> If there anything in particular that has to be done for pbuilder to change the repo mirror it uses, I've changed the global one but pbuilder still pulls from the old one.
<arand> s/If/is/ s/./?/
<persia> arand: You have to edit pbuilder-dist
<arand> persia: so it "soft-locks" itself on first run?
<persia> hrm?
<arand> persia: Ah, pbuilder-dist is a command.. Though it was just config file that gets set on first-run of pb.
<persia> It may be both.  I know very little about pbuilder, except from running it once, and editing pbuilder-dist once.
<geser> what should work is to login into your pbuilder (with --save-after-login) and edit /etc/apt/sources.list
<arand> When running debuild -S, complaints about nonexistent original tar, should one care?
<arand> (this when using a ~blah-ppa1 rename)
<azeem> arand: does it mean it builds a native package?
<azeem> i.e. no .diff.gz
<lifeless> yes
<lifeless> arand: what is a ~blah-ppa1 rename
<vorian> it's just a renaming for ppa reasons /me thinks
<arand> nautilus_2.28.1-0ubuntu3.1~arand-ppa1, edited in dch -i (doing it wrong?)
<vorian> arand: to andwer your first question, it doesn't matter as long as the builder knows which source to use
<vorian> ie, orig.tar.gz
<arand> Ah, yes, I do get a nautilus_2.28.1-0ubuntu3.1~arand-ppa1.tar.gz, so is there any way to point debuild to the right orig archive?
<vorian> what do you mean?
<arand> vorian: like azeem pointed out, I get no diff.gz, which I guess isn't an ideal situation..
<vorian> you need to make sure your changelog version matches your tar file
<persia> For the upstream part.
<azeem> or make sure the tarfile is actually present
<persia> changelog has ${VERSION}-${REVISION}, and only ${VERSION} has to match.
<arand> hm, ok, seems like it doesn't like the two-part ~arand-ppa1 whereas ~ppa1 works, well well, so be it.
<jariq> I've read that I can use pbuilder on ubuntu to build packages for debian sid. But to test if debian package is functional I need to install sid right ?
<persia> Well, kinda.
<persia> There are ways to access chroots that let you do some testing of some things.
<persia> So it really depends on what you are testing.
<jariq> But when using chroot I am still under ubuntu kernel?
<persia> (but I don't know how to manipulate or share environment with pbuilder chroots, so someone else may have to suggests runes for your grimoire)
<persia> If you're testing anything kernel related, chroot testing can't help at all.
<jariq> ok so I will try to install sid once again
<persia> You can always use a VM
<persia> Or if sid is hard to install, install squeeze and dist-upgrade.
<jariq> i installed lenny and then tried to dist-upgrade to sid but too many packages failed
<ari-tczew> could someone look @ bug 521390 and check my debdiff?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 521390 in junitperf "Merge junitperf 1.9.1-7 (main) from Debian testing (main)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/521390
<sebner> ari-tczew: you have a) a comment b) it's in main so -devel might a better place to ask c) it's not before FF so not super urgent so you might want to wait until a sponsor shows up without asking every time in the chan ;)
<paissad> E: pms-linux source: not-using-po-debconf
<paissad> o0
<paissad> do no tell me that i have to create translations for all languages in debian/po ^^
<ari-tczew> sebner: I asked here, because I hope that someone from MOTU know answer for dholbach question in the bug. I'm not master developer, I just make debdiffs.
<sebner> ari-tczew: then you should specify that and of course you don't need to be master but you should know why you do some changes
<persia> ari-tczew: More importantly, if you don't know why you're changing something, you should think twice about changing it.
<paissad> is there a tool which create debian/po/ files  from a debian/$package_name.template  ?
<ari-tczew> persia, sebner: I only move changes from delta into latest testing revision, lol
<paissad> here is my template
<paissad> http://pastebin.com/f13e19fee
<paissad> but i do  not have a debian/po directory yet
<sebner> ari-tczew: that's certainly not the right attitude.
<persia> ari-tczew: I understand.  But my contention is that if you want to contribute to Ubuntu, you should understand what it is that you are contributing.
<sebner> ari-tczew: a) look at the changes that have been made in the past b) understand them c) look if you can drop them (maybe Debian included them) d) use the changes for the next version if you think it's necessary and/or adjust them if necessary
<ari-tczew> sebner, persia: I can do nothing for Ubuntu and at all and leave more outdated merges for you, do you want?
<persia> ari-tczew: I think there's somewhere between those two values.
<persia> ari-tczew: I strongly suspect that you're capable of understanding some of the changes, or learning to do so.
<persia> And if you do that, then I *very much* want you to keep sending patches.
<sebner> ari-tczew: We are thankful for your help but this is really the wrong attitude
<persia> Getting a patch for every Debian upload is perhaps less interesting, as it distracts the sponsors from other work that is known to fix specific bugs.
<persia> ari-tczew: If you have questions about a given patch, or similar, please ask.
<persia> ari-tczew: But do so *before* bothering with the merge work.
<ari-tczew> persia: I asked @ 23:57
<persia> You asked someone to check your debdiff.
<persia> What I'm suggesting is you might ask something specific about a change.
<persia> For instance "What virtual packages are good for Java for lucid?"
<ari-tczew> I think that dholbach give a suggest for sync package
<persia> Part of the work is in asking that kind of question.
<persia> (because you have to understand how to translate the patch into English)
<ari-tczew> then I asked here, because I'm not sure, because I'm not a developer master, because I don't know ALL
<persia> OK.  Let's try this differently.  What questions do you have about the patch?
<ari-tczew> the delta is:
<ari-tczew> -Depends: default-jre-headless | java1-runtime-headless | java2-runtime-headless |
<ari-tczew> +Depends: default-jre-headless | java2-runtime-headless |
<ari-tczew> is it necessary?
<persia> Well, what does it do?
<ari-tczew> +    - debian/control: Runtime depend on headless JREs
<persia> That's what the changelog says.  What does it do?
<ari-tczew> I don't know
<persia> And that is why you got asked in the bug :)
<persia> So, What does Depends: mean in a control file?
<ari-tczew> Depends is depends on packages needed for work
<persia> OK.  And what does '|' mean in a Depends: line?
<ari-tczew> This is always enigma for me :)
<ari-tczew> I don't know. Maybe do you tell me?
<persia> http://people.canonical.com/~cjwatson/ubuntu-policy/policy.html/ch-relationships.html is worth reading then :)
 * persia is not going to answer dholbach's question, but will help to get it answered
 * sebner also advices to read the packaging guide
<cjwatson> paissad: 'man po-debconf'
<sebner> To know what's living in debian/*
<cjwatson> (install the po-debconf package if you don't already have it)
<ari-tczew> persia: ok what's next?
<cjwatson> I think perhaps ari-tczew's problems may be a symptom of us recommending merging as something that trainee developers can do before they really know what's going on
 * persia agrees
<persia> ari-tczew: OK.  So, waht does '|' mean?
<cjwatson> merging is often not straightforward at all and can require deep understanding - if we're presenting it as a "getting started" task, that's our fault
<persia> We've changed that a couple times, but it inevitably gets added back somehow.
<persia> The issue being that getting people to look at fixing bugs is hard.  We need to get better at building a set of stuff that is easy to fix as candidates.
<persia> But in many cases, it's easier to just fix them.
<sebner> persia: cjwatson We have byte-size bugs to start with
<persia> sebner: Have you looked at the bitesize list recently?  It needs help getting bigger.
<sebner> persia: that's true and most merges are not difficult so it's clear that many start with merges
<sebner> cjwatson: btw, thanks again for fixing dpkg :)
<cjwatson> you're welcome
<persia> well, except, it's really easy to get merges wrong.
<persia> Or to make a change that we *don't* want, just because it's shiny.
<sebner> aye
<sebner> like bumping Standards-Version?
<cjwatson> the problem with the merge queue is that the difficulty level is completely nonlinear
<persia> That's harmless, but useless.
<cjwatson> a bunch of trivial stuff, mixed in with some rocket science, and there's no way to tell in advance
 * sebner thinks about courier and shivers
<cjwatson> perhaps we need a way to note merges as bitesize or hard
<cjwatson> I suppose we have MoM comments
<persia> We do, but distinguishing the two isn't that much harder than doing the merges.
<sebner> + better changelog entries explaining *why* a change was made. /me still seems a great lack there
<sebner> *sees
<ari-tczew> persia: english isn't my native language, but I think that "|" works following: that package can work java1-runtime-headless and can work with java2-runtime-headless ; correct me if I'm wrong
<persia> ari-tczew: That's right.
<persia> ari-tczew: So, what does the diff do?
<ari-tczew> \o/
<ari-tczew> hmm, currect delta prefer to use java2-runtime-headless, not java1-runtime-headless
<persia> No preference, really.  Just dropping support for dava1-runtime-headless.
<persia> Now, does the package *work* with java1, or does it require java2?  Also, do we have a java1-runtime-headless package?
<cjwatson> sebner: *shrug* maybe I'm arrogant, but I've seen newcomers make a thorough mess of installer merges, and I prefer to put this down to inexperience with installer code rather than my poor changelog entries ;-)
<cjwatson> it's often a bit of both
<persia> ari-tczew: Once you dig up the answers to those questions, you should know if this is something we want.
<sebner> cjwatson: I really didn't want to attack anyone personally and especially not *you*, mighty colin ;)
<cjwatson> sebner: I didn't take it as an attack :)
<ari-tczew> persia: packages.ubuntu.com says: Sorry, your search gave no results
<cjwatson> nor am I fishing for compliments - just noting that sometimes it really is OK to put things down to lack of experience from the merger if that's what it is
<cjwatson> anyway, bed
<sebner> cjwatson: totally right. gn8 /me too :)
<ari-tczew> persia: I checked packages.ubuntu.com for java2-runtime-headless and it doesn't exist too! wtf?
<cjwatson> ari-tczew: packages.ubuntu.com won't list virtual packages.  the tools in the dctrl-tools package may come in handy.
<cjwatson> (if you don't know what a virtual package is, go back to the policy document.)
<ari-tczew> cjwatson: I'm very tired after work and I f_ck the policy
<cjwatson> I shan't bother trying to help you again, then!
<sebner> ari-tczew: If you are really that tired and don't care about the policy you should save your time for something else than ubuntu ..
<cjwatson> I'd much rather point people to documentation (which they can read around in and find out more in their own time), rather than repeating little bits of the documentation on demand.  If that doesn't suit you, I'm sorry.  Good night.
 * sebner says gn8 too
<ari-tczew> hmm, other words: maybe I don't f_ck the policy, but a milions clauses are boring
<ari-tczew> and as I said english isn't my native language so sometimes I don't see sense for reading these documentations if I''ll not understand these
<persia> ari-tczew: If you don't understand the policy, you are going to have a hard time understanding how the packaging works, or why it might be done that way.
<ari-tczew> and sorry for bad words
<persia> We will happily answer questions about the policy, but you are expected to read it.
<ari-tczew> persia: can we back into review debdiff?
<persia> ari-tczew: I didn't know we stopped.  You were investigating about the virtual packages, and which were correct for this package.
<ari-tczew> I think that virtual package is a package, which was a normal package but now it name has been changed, is it right?
#ubuntu-motu 2010-02-19
<persia> No.
<persia> Look up virtual package in the policy doc.
<ari-tczew> persia: I can't found, lol
<ari-tczew> persia: I need a break in packaging, bye
<PATX> can anybody review http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/fastpatx
<aboudreault> hi<
<aboudreault> does anyone uses cowbuilder here ? I got strange library path in a chroot: see the last -L option: http://pastebin.com/m1fa5b3ff
<persia> That doesn't seem like an unreasonable place for it to be: is that not the default unpack location?
<aboudreault> don't know where this come from
<aboudreault> the problem is all those spaces in the path
<aboudreault> http://pastebin.com/m2b623a0
<aboudreault> more log
<persia> Those are real spaces, not just artifacts?  Oh my, that is wrong.
 * persia has no idea
<aboudreault> strange :/
<flupke> hi, I'd like to better understand the .debs build process in the repositories, is there documentation somewhere on this subject ?
<persia> Are there any specific aspects that interest you?  I don't know of an overall brief.
<flupke> I'd just like to know what the process is like, for example are the .debs built from the same packages you get from apt-get source ? is this done automatically ?
<persia> Yes, and kinda.
<persia> Developers upload source, and Soyuz dispatches those to the buildds.
<persia> The buildds build, and the upload the binary packages.
<persia> I say "kinda" automatic, because the trigger is a developer uploading something, or pressing the "give-back" button.
<flupke> and is there some kind of standardized build platform ?
<persia> Yes, but I don't know that the details are well documented.  You might get some information from the Soyuz source.  I know that a custom version of sbuild is used at the bottom layer.
<flupke> the reason for my question is that I'd like to kind of automate building customized .debs, and I often have problems on my desktop karmic
<persia> Oh, then you're not interested in that at all :)
<lifeless> use PPA's
<lifeless> :>
<persia> You don't need *anywhere* like the infrastructure required to run a distro for that.
<flupke> so, now I know this must be because of the pile of junk installed on it, I'll look for details on soyuz and sbuild
<lifeless> flupke: just sbuild/pbuilder should be all you need. Though really; PPAs.
<persia> PPA work, of if you need it local, look at any of the mini-archive tools.  deb-o-matic is one that I used once-upon-a-time (but no longer remember clearly)
<flupke> (I was wondering if the .debs were built by hand)
<persia> No.
<persia> Use a ppa, or install pbuilder/sbuild.
<persia> That will take care of 95% of what you need.
<flupke> ok I'll look into PPA and pbuilder/sbuild, many thanks :)
<persia> deb-o-matic or falcon or something would get you to 99%.
<jcastro> plus with a PPA you get other arches for free!
<persia> jcastro: For a very limited definition of "other", being approximately "ones that one can build on the same hardware" :)
 * jcastro loosely changes what "free" means depending on the day
<RAOF> Yeah.  Nothing exotic like PPC or I64.
<persia> PPC isn't exotic!
<persia> But I can't find ia64 in the shops, and the few sparcs I can find seem old.
<persia> (and big and noisy etc.)
<persia> But PPC is widely available in retail.
<lifeless> qemu qemu qemu
<RAOF> It would be nice to have PPC in the PPA; that way people could use nouveau on their slightly exotic hardware.
<persia> RAOF: I thought people could use nouveau on their non-exotic PPC hardware by using squeeze or lucid.
<persia> Did that not happen yet?
<RAOF> They can, yes.
<RAOF> But it would have happened sooner, and they won't be able to test 3D with lucid.
<persia> Oh.
<persia> Well, I suppose packages could be built locally, but yeah :(
<persia> Unfortunately, I have ATI on my PPC, so I can't test anyway.
<RAOF> And they won't be able to verify fixes, because I can guarantee the first thing nouveau upstream will ask of bug reports is âdoes it still happen with git kernel, ddx and libdrmâ?
<PATX> persia, are u busy with reviewing?
<persia> PATX: No, busy with bugfixing
<PATX> ah
 * persia is currently frustrated with make function call semantics
<PATX> will u ever have time to look at http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/fastpatx
<PATX> lol
<persia> PATX: I have that page open in my browser, and have had it so for a while.  It's #2 on my review list for when I'm reviewing again.
<PATX> :) thanks! :)
<PATX> not rushing (or trying to) im just new to this so i am ansois
<PATX> ansois?
<PATX> anxious
<PATX> lol
<kamalmostafa> Hello motu's -- please note bug 524183 -- have I followed the FFE request process properly?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 524183 in hamlib "Sync hamlib 1.2.10-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/524183
<flupke> I have a pbuilder environment (I followed https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto ), but it fails building a package (gdal), saying "Aptitude couldn't satisfy the build dependencies"; how can I investigate on the problem ?
<kamalmostafa> flupke: the problem there looks like you're trying to build a package on Karmic which will only build on Lucid, due to a newer version of a library on Lucid...
<cyphermox> flupke, usually pbuilder will tell you a bunch of things in addition to "couldn't satisfy dependencies", it would be a little higher "up" in the output -- e.g. <package name> is a virtual package, or <package name> will not be installed
<kamalmostafa> scroll back in your pbuilder log there, and you'll see:
<kamalmostafa>     Depends: libhdf5-serial-dev (>= 1.8.3) but it is not installable
<kamalmostafa> Then, you can do    apt-cache policy libhdf5-serial-dev   there on your Karmic system, and you'll get:
<kamalmostafa>   Candidate: 1.6.6-4ubuntu2
<kamalmostafa> Note that the version number there is indeed *not* >= the version 1.8.3 that your 'gdal' package requires.
<kamalmostafa> Lucid does have a version of libhdf5-serial-dev that will work here, and the package looks like it at least proceeds to start building with a pbuilder-dist for Lucid.
<flupke> kamalmostafa, I see "Depends: libhdf5-serial-dev which is a virtual package." in the log
<flupke> (with a bunch of other virtual packages)
<kamalmostafa> flupke: The very next line, I think, will be the "... is not installable" line I mentioned.
<flupke> so I just do : sudo pbuilder update --distribution lucid --override-config ?
<kamalmostafa> That's not the method I use.   I use "pbuilder-dist" (which is just great :)    See the man page for "pbuilder-dist" for instructions on how to set it up.
<flupke> I don't see any "... is not installable" line
<flupke> ok, thanks
<kamalmostafa> flupke: if you want to capture your pbuilder log (with --logfile {filename}) and paste it to a pastebin, I'll be happy to take a look.  I'm correct that you're running on Karmic, yes?
<flupke> yes I'm on karmic
<kamalmostafa> flupke: ok, well, that version of gdal won't build *for* Karmic due to the older libhdf5, but yes, pbuilder-dist will let you build a Lucid-targeted version of gdal on your Karmic system (if that's interesting to you).
<flupke> kamalmostafa, here is the log : http://paste.pocoo.org/show/179981/
<kamalmostafa> flupke: yes, your log does look different than mine.   Have you done?:    sudo pbuilder --update
<flupke> yes
<kamalmostafa> flupke: well, I don't know why our logs differ there -- sorry.
<flupke> kamalmostafa, heh no problem, anyway I'm targeting jaunty, maybe it'll work for it
<kamalmostafa> flupke: well, I haven't actually tried it, but I think pbuilder-dist can build for Jaunty as well -- but if Karmic doesn't have the libhdf5 you need, Jaunty won't have it either I expect.  good luck!
 * flupke tries with pbuilder-dist
<flupke> it's a dev machine I'm working on, maybe it's too broken and I should make a VM
<flupke> I disabled the PPAs that I'm using to get the latest gdal and Qt but maybe there are things left
<kamalmostafa> Oh, actually, we never compared versions.  I'm just testing with "apt-get source gdal" from the Lucid source base:  gdal_1.6.3-3.dsc
<flupke> anyway this is very interesting, I always wondered how it worked, thanks for the infos I have tons of fun things to do now :)
<flupke> I tried on gdal_1.5.4-4.dsc
<kamalmostafa> flupke: ok, well best of luck.  FWIW, my   pbuilder-lucid-amd64 gdal_1.6.3-3.dsc   did build successfully.
<flupke> kamalmostafa, just a last question, I'm going to make a VM to have a clean environment, is it best to use the same platform I'm targeting (e.g. build for jaunty from jaunty) ?
<kamalmostafa> flupke: i don't honestly know.  I use pbuilder-dist (running on my Karmic machine) to build packages for Lucid regularly and it has worked flawlessly for me, but I have no experience building for Jaunty.  But if you're going to make a VM anyway, then you may as well go ahead and just build on the release you're targeting for.  sorry that's not much of an answer.  :-)
<flupke> hem yeah silly question, I could as well just install build-essential
<flupke> but the reason I'm doing all this is that building gdal from sources failed on the jaunty machine
<flupke> I wonder where the .debs come from :)
<kamalmostafa> flupke: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gdal says that your gdal_1.5.4-4 as building successfully in Karmic, but Jaunty has an earlier version of gdal.
<kamalmostafa> (in reference to "where the .debs come from")
<kamalmostafa> oops... I must step away.  good luck, flupke.
<flupke> thanks for all, bye :)
<flupke> kamalmostafa, just to let you know, everything compiles smoothly in the VM... my machines are somewhat broken as an ubuntu build environment
<kamalmostafa> flupke: good news.  congrats!
<dholbach> good morning
<slytherin> Do we have any policy for/against keeping KDE3 apps in universe?
<davidekholm> Hi. I'm the founder of Jalbum (http://jalbum.net). We've just adopted our web photo album software for Ubuntu and packaged it as a .deb package. Can anyone here give me guidance on how to get Jalbum into "Ubuntu Software Center"? We're true freeware, no crippleware, but Jalbum is only 50% open source - generic code under LGPL but still some core code not opened.
<davidekholm> Jalbum is very popular on Windows and Mac with over 5 million downloads and over 26 million published web albums to servers all over the world. Now we want to give Ubuntu users a proper experience of our software. I figure, getting into "Ubuntu Software Center" is the ideal path.
<c_korn> hello, can I get a FFe for scilab ? bug 511864
<c_korn> seems the bot is still sleeping: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/scilab/+bug/511864
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 511864 in scilab "Sync scilab 5.2.1-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/511864
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 511864 in scilab "Sync scilab 5.2.1-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,New]
<c_korn> oh, there it is. I was tabbing fro ubutto :)
<davidekholm> Anyone with input on this?
<dholbach> davidekholm: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/NewPackages
<sebner> dholbach: As MOTU remains after Archiv-reorg, u-u-s remains too am I right? Because I just renewed membership .. :)
<dholbach> sebner: I wanted to discuss it in the next TB meeting
<dholbach> I think it'd make sense to merge the teams
<sebner> dholbach: oh, kk. :)
<shadeslayer> anyone around?
<Rhonda> If you have a question, just ask it and people might answer you, even without your question wether someone is around or not. :)
<slytherin> does anyone know how to know exactly if plymouth is working on an installation or not?
<slytherin> #ubuntu-x
<fagan> directhex: do you package monodevelop?
<directhex> fagan, i've taken care of the past few updates, yes
<fagan> The -java -python..etc cant be installed
<directhex> in lucid?
<fagan> yep
<fagan> Bug #524388
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 524388 in monodevelop "[lucid] Monodevelop plugins cant be installed" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/524388
<fagan> directhex: ^
<fagan> It looks like the version number just needs to be changed
<fagan> for the depends I mean
<directhex> fagan, looks like some missing syncs
<directhex> fagan, monodevelop-boo is fine fr'example
<directhex> let me build the list
<fagan> -boo is fine here too
<directhex> just a bunch of syncs needed
<fagan> ah ok
<fagan> its just -java -python and -database that are broken
<fagan> oh and -vala
<fagan> directhex: cool so at least its easily fixed
<directhex> Sync request filed as bug #524396: https://edge.launchpad.net/bugs/524396
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 524396 in monodevelop-debugger-mdb "Sync monodevelop-debugger-mdb 2.2.1-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,Confirmed]
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 524396 in monodevelop-debugger-mdb "Sync monodevelop-debugger-mdb 2.2.1-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/524396
<directhex> Sync request filed as bug #524397: https://edge.launchpad.net/bugs/524397
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 524397 in monodevelop-debugger-gdb "Sync monodevelop-debugger-gdb 2.2.1-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,Confirmed]
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 524397 in monodevelop-debugger-gdb "Sync monodevelop-debugger-gdb 2.2.1-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/524397
<directhex> and so on
<fagan> directhex: cool thanks for the help
<directhex> fagan, i didn't notice than my request for 2.2.1 had been syned, which is how i missed this
<directhex> there, that's all of them
<fagan> thanks
<slytherin> Do we have anything policy in regards with removal of KDE3 applictions?
<fagan> slytherin: what needs removal?
<slytherin> fagan: kiso, it hasn't seen a release since 2005, KDE3 app and functionality available in other programs.
<fagan> slytherin: well I dont think we have any formal policy for removal but if you ask one of the motu kde people they could maybe do it for you
<slytherin> fagan: That is why I asked here.
<fagan> maco2: you around ^
<directhex> fagan, in the meantime, it *might* be possible to use my karmic ppa without issue. i have all the 2.2.1 stuff from sid in there
<fagan> directhex: I can wait for the sync ill close my bug when its fixed
<slytherin> fagan: Wow. Quick post. :-)
<fagan> slytherin: yep
<slytherin> fagan: In case you don't know, I usually come across such packages when dealing with NBS problems.
<fagan> slytherin: NBS?
<slytherin> fagan: Not Built from Source. Usualy deals with the libraries which are no more built but have rdepends. http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/NBS/
 * fagan hates acronims 
<shadeslayer> fagan: acronyms :P
<and`> fagan: about your blog post: archive "cruft" is something not that easy to get rid of, most of the times there's alwais a reason to keep a package or better people may have different opinions about removing or not a certain software
<and`> fagan: also, it would be nice to check for such packages in Debian first, to avoid work-duplicates
<and`> fagan: it's nice blogging about it, but not easy to fix the current situation :)
<fagan> and`: very true but it is needed IM
<fagan> *IMO
<didrocks> fagan: hey
<Laney> who's the judge of whether a program is worthy?
<and`> fagan: agreed, but the MOTU team is usually overloaded by a lot of things starting from sponsoring to merge new stuff, so it will be hard
<didrocks> fagan: did you advance on Quickly doc side ? ;)
<and`> Laney: usually the maintainer need to give his / her ack before having the package removed
<fagan> didrocks: oh I forgot to ask dpm
<Laney> and`: no, we don't have maintainers
<and`> Laney: Debian side
<didrocks> fagan: also, Mallard can be used now, see my comment on philip's post
<Laney> this isn't a question about Debian
<slytherin> and`: Laney: You can always check certain parameters like if it is maintained upstream, if the functionality is something not easily available in other packages. etc.
<and`> Laney: low popcon, RC bugs, no one caring about it
<Laney> since it's really not possible there
<Laney> slytherin: I don't know if lack of upstream activity is enough
<Laney> buggy, unmaintained maybe
<shadeslayer> does pbuilder just require the .dsc to build a package?
<Laney> but just not having releases, ...
<and`> yes, RC bugs + unmaintained
<shadeslayer> i cant really figure out the wiki
<slytherin> Laney: That is why I specifically asked. The package in question is a KDE3 app. I didn't know if we are still keeping KDE3 apps.
<slytherin> shadeslayer: yes
<Laney> right, the question broadened somewhat from your original one
<shadeslayer> slytherin: nothing else in the chroot?
<slytherin> Laney: That is fagan's fault. :-D
<fagan> didrocks: well I dont have a clue how to use mallard atm
<Laney> slytherin: also, an imporant thing for the one you asked about is that it's an ubuntu-local package
<and`> shadeslayer: pbuilder requires a .dsc target to build a package yes, but before you should debuild it
<Laney> so we have no debian maintainer to lean on
<slytherin> shadeslayer: Have you created a pbuilder chroot?
<shadeslayer> slytherin: its downloading
<didrocks> fagan: neither do I, but you can ask to robert_ancell when he's around, he worked on that
<Laney> I am much less tolerant of those packages
<fagan> didrocks: Ill have a look into it
<and`> Laney: well, usually it's nice to ping the Debian maintainer anyway to see what's going on if the package is not being updated or it is buggy
<didrocks> fagan: sweet, thanks
<shadeslayer> and`: so like first debuild -S -sa and then /path/to/dsc_file_generated ?
<fagan> didrocks: first ill go ask dpm about the translations of what we have
<slytherin> Laney: Right. I had forgot about that. So it is good candidate for removal.
<didrocks> fagan: ok
<and`> Laney: that's why removing packages in Ubuntu is directly related to Debian
<slytherin> and`: In this particular case, package was never present in Debian.
<Laney> and`: I know all of this. I'm a big proponent of convergance
<Laney> we're talking about both a principle and a specific case
<Laney> and actually this case is quite different from the norm
<and`> shadeslayer: debuild -S -sa (depending on orig upload or not) and then pbuilder --build /path/to/dsc/file (or if you use different tarballs use the --basetgz option)
<and`> Laney: sure, wasnt following the specific case, was just telling how this generally works for most packages
<shadeslayer> and`: different tarballs ? i dont understand
<Laney> thanks, although I think I am aware of how best to work here :)
<james_w> didrocks: I've played with Mallard a little too
<fagan> it would require some help from debian but if the package doesnt have a maintainer and hasnt been updated it could be removed
<and`> shadeslayer: e.g if you have a lucid tarball and a sid one
<shadeslayer> and`: oh..
<didrocks> james_w: oh really? Do you have any documentation pointers (<- fagan)
<and`> shadeslayer: but I guess you just have a base.tgz one :)
<shadeslayer> and`: so what does it do with both the tarballs?
<shadeslayer> and`: the one pbuilder creates right
<james_w> didrocks: fagan: http://projectmallard.org/about/learn/index.html
<didrocks> james_w: rock! Thanks
<shadeslayer> and`: some of the packages failed to download... i just run pbuilder update to get them right?
<and`> shadeslayer: if you want multiple chroots with different systems in it you can have them by specifing the distribution, the basetgz location and the mirror you wanna use
<and`> shadeslayer: yes
<james_w> didrocks: fagan: http://gitorious.org/empathy-mallard/empathy-mallard
<and`> shadeslayer: it will update your tarball fetching latest contents
<shadeslayer> and`: ah...
<shadeslayer> and`: ok
<and`> shadeslayer: let's say you want a sid chroot, you will do
<shadeslayer> and`: so it builds against those chroots
<didrocks> james_w: ok, I'm copying the link to the bug report to have it into an handy place (I hadn't the time yet to have a look at it, but I'm sure we should use mallard now)
<didrocks> james_w: thanks a lot
<shadeslayer> like i want to test the package on both karmic and lucid.. so i need both of those chroots
<and`> shadeslayer: pbuilder --create --basetgz /path/to/it/sid.tgz --distribution sid --mirror http://ftp.debian.org or whatever
<shadeslayer> and`: ok i get it :)
<and`> shadeslayer: that will make a sid chroot, if you want a karmic chroot just change the variables above and you're done
<fagan> thanks james_w for the link
<james_w> didrocks: mallard rocks
<shadeslayer> and`: ok im starting to get this :)
<and`> shadeslayer: so, in the end, you can build against multiple distributions :)
<fagan> james_w: im just sad because I only got to grips with docbook in september :/
<slytherin> shadeslayer: wiki has a very nice example of pbuilderrc containing configuration for multiple chroots.
 * Laney just uses pbuilder-dist
<shadeslayer> slytherin: yeah im reading that too... for the past half an hour...just a bit slow on understanding it... first time packager :)
<slytherin> hmm
<shadeslayer> slytherin: i used PPA's till now... didnt actually package something new.. until today :P
<shadeslayer> just did apt-get source blah , copied and modded the debian/ contents.. and then debuild -S -sa
<shadeslayer> and then the final upload
<danblick> Could anyone help me get started with a small project?  I want to try checking out the code for the 'scala' package for Ubuntu, updating it to use the latest version of scala, and then pushing it to my PPA on launchpad.  I thought 'apt-get source scala' would get me the source for this package, but it didn't -- what should I start with?
<Laney> you need a lucid deb-src line
<nigelb> danblick: alternatively, you can go to packages.ubuntu.com and do a dget of the dsc file
<danblick> nigelb: thanks, i'll try that
<danblick> Laney: oh -- right, development build. thanks for point that out.
<danblick> pointing*
<Laney> or there is pull-lp-source and pull-debian-sorce in ubuntu-dev-tools
<Laney> source*
<danblick> ls
<fagan> didrocks: could you grab my pot anyway and start translating it on launchpad?
<didrocks> fagan: will it be compatible if we switch to mallard?
<fagan> well the pot will be similar not the exact same but I could write a script to find and replace the differing syntax
<fagan> its not that different
<didrocks> (that means, are there any <> in the pot?)
<fagan> Well I dont know if the syntax for code segments..etc is the same but the words would be the same
<fagan> It shouldnt be too hard to change afterwards
<fagan> So the pot is the same but the words may move a little and the markup would be different but ill sort it out
<didrocks> fagan: well, I'm just unconfortable if we ship a pot which will be invalid in 10 days because we use mallard and the markups invalidate all strings
<didrocks> fagan: if you can do the job, ok
<didrocks> fagan: where is your pot file, already?
<fagan> didrocks: its in the branch that I submitted for the merge in /data/templates/ubuntu-application/help
<didrocks> fagan: right, I'm asking for your merge proposal link, you removed last one I had
<fagan> didrocks: the default ubuntu docs wont be changed before lucid+1
<didrocks> fagan: simple-scan is in ubuntu and is using Mallard
<fagan> and empathy too
<fagan> but the default docs wont move till lucid+1
<fagan> https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~shanepatrickfagan/quickly/quickly_docbook didrocks
<didrocks> right, but if we can have the right techno in the first launch, that's why I asked you to look at mallard a long time ago :)
<fagan> didrocks: well when you asked no one was using mallard and it was a lot of work just to bring it over to docbook
<fagan> if you want full docs for this release it kinda has to be docbook because I dont have the time rewrite it again
<fagan> but for translations we are fine
<didrocks> fagan: ok, you just need to figure out how the doc can use the mo files once built
<fagan> didrocks: I just asked dpm :)
<didrocks> cool :)
<hakaishi> would anyone be interested in https://launchpad.net/~hakaishi/+archive/qt-program-starter ?
<hakaishi> qt-program-starter is a program to start any command or program. It is able to save any output or error output each into a text file and to start at a certain time, to shutdown or just quit, after the process is finished.
<shadeslayer> i need a better server for pbuilder
<hakaishi> I don't know if I should upload qt-program-starter, this is why I ask.
<sebner> hakaishi: upload where?
<hakaishi> to revu
<sebner> hakaishi: well, we are already past FF so you have to wait for lucid+1 anyways
<hakaishi> sebner: what I wanted to know is if anyone would be interested in such a program, because I am thinking of uploading it to revu. If nobody is interested, why should I upload it?
<sebner> hakaishi: guess you should ask in #ubuntu then ;
<hakaishi> sebner: okay, I'll try. Thank you.
<BlackZ> if I have made a new upstream release of a program, and I have puted lucid in debian/changelog file, how can I upload new upstream version?
<maco2> fagan: i think removal of package needs archive admin
<Rhonda> BlackZ: I fear not anymore because lucid is in featurefreeze
<shadeslayer> http://pastebin.ca/1802675 << error on running pbuilder create
<shadeslayer> any ideas?
<BlackZ> shadeslayer: which ubuntu version do you have?
<shadeslayer> BlackZ: karmic.... Riddle helped me out
<BlackZ> shadeslayer: sudo pbuilder create --distribution 9.10 \
<BlackZ>         --othermirror "deb http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu 9.10 main restricted universe multiverse"
<BlackZ> shadeslayer: then sudo pbuilder update
<lfaraone> BlackZ: that won't work. you have to use codenames, not version numbers.
<lfaraone> BlackZ: so it's sudo pbuilder create --distribution karmic  --othermirror "deb http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu karmic main restricted universe multiverse"
<BlackZ> lfaraone: oh true, that was a my fault :p
<shadeslayer> yay... i finally have a chroot :P
<Laibsch> git-buildpackage in lucid currently does not handle dpkg v3 which I guess is a pretty serious thing.  The version in testing and unstable does.  I think there is a minimal patch available that could be backported to the lucid package but I wonder if it isn't better to still try a merge instead.  Opinions?
 * Laibsch is afraid we may end up backporting just about everything
<hyperair> Laibsch: which feature of v3 doesn't it support?
<hyperair> Laibsch: file a FFe
<Laibsch> just about everything in v3 ;-)
<Laibsch> support was only added 0.4.64
<hyperair> Laibsch: oh yeah? i've got v3 packages maintained in git-buildpackage.
<Laibsch> (see the changelog)
<hyperair> i mean maintained using git-buildpackage.
<hyperair> the only thing that doesn't work is multi-tarball
<hyperair> everything else works.
<Laibsch> Have you tried git-import-dsc?
<hyperair> no.
<Laibsch> try it ;-)
<hyperair> but that's git import-dsc
<hyperair> not git buildpackage
<hyperair> they're different tools, in the same suiet
<hyperair> suite*
 * Laibsch points to http://packages.debian.org/changelogs/pool/main/g/git-buildpackage/git-buildpackage_0.4.65/changelog (entry for 0.4.64)
<hyperair> Laibsch: and you said that it doesn't support anything in v3, which i disproved >_>
<Laibsch> hyperair: you want to split hairs or fix bugs?
<hyperair> hmph.
<hyperair> i said file an FFe, didn't i?
<Laibsch> I was mixing packages (git-buildpackage package) and tools (git-import-*), my apologies
<Laibsch> but look at the changelog
<hyperair> when i asked what didn't it support, i really meant what new things does the debian version mean?
<Laibsch> and trust me, I ran into this problem
<Laibsch> the question remains whether to backport patches or merge 0.4.65
<hyperair> merge it.
<Laibsch> OK
<hyperair> you'd probably end up backporting every thing anyway
<Laibsch> Hehe
<hyperair> and you'll still need a FFe anyway
<Laibsch> I was sort of thinking the same thing
<Laibsch> about backporting everything
<Laibsch> thanks
<hyperair> what's the ubuntu delta anyway?
 * Laibsch hasn't done a merge for at least a year or so
<hyperair> anything we can't shove upstream?
<Laibsch> not much
<Laibsch> yes, ubuntu-specific
<hyperair> i see.
<Laibsch> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/39095621/git-buildpackage_0.4.63_0.4.63ubuntu1.diff.gz
<Laibsch> that's the Ubuntu delta
<Laibsch> but easy to merge
<hyperair> thanks
<hyperair> ah i see
<Laibsch> Can I merge something that's not on merges.ubuntu.com, yet?
<hyperair> yes.
<hyperair> use git
<hyperair> you're a git-buildpackage user aren't you?
<hyperair> just use git merge
<Laibsch> well, there is no lucid branch
<Laibsch> nothing to merge
<hyperair> git import-dsc ;-)
<Laibsch> Oh, I see
<Laibsch> Exactly
<Laibsch> of course ;-)
<hyperair> =p
<Laibsch> does Ubuntu provide git branches by now?
<Laibsch> or still only bazar?
<Laibsch> s/Ubuntu/Launchpad or Soyuz or whatever it's called/
<Laibsch> I think we need something like git.ubuntu.com, the same as git.debian.org (which I'm a heavy user of)
<shadeslayer> Laibsch: hehe
<shadeslayer> Laibsch: i would *love* that
<Laibsch> I guess you and me are not the only one
<Laibsch> Who can we bug about it?
<shadeslayer> Laibsch: hmm
<shadeslayer> Laibsch: well well have to either put it up on brainstorm
<shadeslayer> ( where itll probably be never looked at :P )
<Laibsch> I'd prefer a person to talk to in this case
<Laibsch> The obvious reason it hasn't happened is bzr
<Laibsch> But I wonder how long Canonical wants to ride on that horse
<geser> Laibsch: have you read the discussion on ubuntu-devel ml? https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2009-December/029776.html
<geser> Laibsch: why should Canonical switch to git when they pay the bzr developers and redo all parts where bzr is involved?
<Laibsch> Thanks for the link
<Laibsch> I'll have a look
<Laibsch> I'd turn that question around
<Laibsch> Why should Canonical spend money now that there is git?  I know the situation was still different when bzr got started.
 * Laibsch goes reading
<oojah> Laibsch: Haven't you answered your own question?
<Laibsch> nope
<Laibsch> unless, the answer is "legacy", but Canonical intends to phase out bzr
<Laibsch> and I haven't heard anything to that effect, yet
 * Laibsch goes back to reading
<hyperair> Laibsch: canonical intends to phase out bzr?
<hyperair> where did you hear that from?
<Laibsch> man unless
<Laibsch> ;-)
<Laibsch> read again
<hyperair> Laibsch: i still don't quite see it >_>
<oojah> hyperair: Remove the commas and replace "but" with "and".
<hyperair> oojah: ah!
<oojah> (I presume)
<hyperair> sorry, the fuzzy level of my language parser drops drastically at wee hours
<oojah> It was confusing :)
<hyperair> i still have to walk back to my hostel
 * hyperair sighs
<ivoks> does someone knows; are there plans to build ffmpeg with support for h264?
<ivoks> in multiverse, of course
<geser> siretart: ^^
<om26er> when a package is being uploaded to universe for the first time should Its changelog be changed? (except for 'initial release')
<persia> om26er: How do you mean changed?  If there was prior changelog for some reason, that might be interesting, but might not.  If you mean on changelog creation, I usually note any patches as well as Initial Release, just so there is a referent if I mention the patches in later changelog entries.
<lightnin> Hello! Is there a debhelper script to autogenerate postrm / postinst (and register application / filetype, etc.?)
<persia> lightnin: Many of the debhelper scripts generate maintainer script fragments.  What precisely are you trying to accomplish?
<lightnin> persia: Ah! Good to see you again :)
<lightnin> persia: Register .sb files as associated with scratch. Add scratch to menu system. Install icons.
<persia> lightnin: In reverse order: to install icons, stick them in the directories from which the icon cache is drawn.  There are two ways to add to the menu system: please use both a Debian menu file, and an XDG .desktop file.  To associate .sb files, define a MIME type, and register scratch as a handler for that MIME type in a .desktop file.
<lightnin> persia: ok - thanks! Will look into. In terms of "Section" in control field, what would you recommend? Scratch is a free programming language for kids... I don't see an educational section though.
<persia> lightnin: Debian menu documentation is available from the menu package.  The freedesktop stuff (MIME registration, .desktop files, icon-cache, etc. are on freedesktop.org)
<persia> lightnin: For Section, I'd probably pick "interpreters", if I understand scratch correctly.
<shtylman_> so I have questions about the mysql packages and the dependency chain
<shtylman_> http://packages.ubuntu.com/lucid/libmysql++-dev
<shtylman_> that says it depends on libmysqlclient-dev
<shtylman_> http://packages.ubuntu.com/lucid/libmysqlclient-dev
<persia> shtylman_: You probably want to ask in -devel or -server , although someone here might know.
<persia> And note that packages.ubuntu.com 1) is often out of date, and 2) provides a limited view into the packaging database.
<persia> The tools in dctrl-tools are a bit richer, as is apt-cache if you have a chroot or install.
<shtylman_> the problem I have is that libmysqlclient16 also gets pulled in
<persia> OK.  How is this a problem?  Is a library not required to build against it?
<fabrice_sp> it seems the problem is because mysql 5.0 conflicts with mysql5.1: mysql5.1 provide libmysqlclient15-dev as a virtual package, to ease the migration from 5.0 to 5.1, but mysql 5.0 provide it as real, so even rebuilding package is not enought
<fabrice_sp> anyone know if its planned to remove mysql5.0? Or we should change the 77 packages that still depends on libmysqlclient16-dev ?
<fabrice_sp> s/libmysqlclient16-dev/libmysqlclient15off/
<fabrice_sp> this transition sould be solved by deleting libmysqlclient15-dev
<fabrice_sp> bbl
<hyperair> dh_desktop(deprecated), dh_installmime?
<persia> hyperair: Those do entirely different things :)  But dh_desktop is deprecated because it's been entirely replaced with a cleaner implementation in a trigger.
<hyperair> persia: i know. but lightnin asked for two things, i.e. register application and filetype.
<persia> Right, but in XDG environments, one actually registers MIME types with .desktop files, that are processed by the trigger that replaces dh_desktop.
<persia> dh_installmime does something entirely different.
<persia> (and we have lousy support for that MIME handler in Ubuntu due to ignorance and neglect)
<hyperair> ah i see. the whole mime type handling thing is something that has always kind of eluded me, since i didn't need to do anything.
<hyperair> the upstreams generally appear to do it themselves.
<hyperair> anyway dh_installmime is for adding support for new mime types, right?
<persia> Not precisely.
<hyperair> er basically registering that new mime types exist?
<persia> No.  I was trying to find some docs, but I'm failing.
<persia> Anyway, Debian has a mime-support system, that has a central registry of MIME types for use by applications.
<fabrice_sp> Squeeze will have only mysql-5.1 but Lucid has both mysql 5.0 and mysql5.1. Shall request the removal of mysql 5.0?
<persia> There's an entirely separate XDG MIME DB.
<hyperair> ah i see
<persia> Our primary environments prefer entries in the XDG DB over the Debian system, and we haven't historically paid enough attention to make sure everything works with mime-support.
<hyperair> i see
<hyperair> so dh_installmime is kinda like dh_installmenu in that sense
<hyperair> in the sense that it's debian-specific i mean
<persia> fabrice_sp: Check first with the #ubuntu-server folk, but I don't see why not (although someone might complain and block the removal request).
<fabrice_sp> will do. Thanks persia!
<persia> hyperair: Yes, which doesn't mean it doesn't do useful stuff, and doesn't mean our users won't be happy to use it, but does mean that it's different.
 * hyperair finally understands
<siretart> geser: sorry? ffmpeg supports h264 even in main
<Migi32> Hope this is the right place to ask. I'm a dev of an open-source game that's in the official Ubuntu repo's. We're about to release a new version, but I don't have a clue how to get the .deb in these repo's updated. Ideas?
<Migi32> I know how to build a .deb, I just don't know how to get it updated in the repo's
<persia> Migi32: Last week, the procedure was roughly "Tell us about it".
<persia> We're now in FeatureFreeze, so an update would require a freeze exception.
<persia> we don't upload .deb files: we only upload sources, and the launchpad buildds generate the .deb files.
<persia> So, which game?
<Migi32> Globulation 2
<Migi32> this game is not shipped by default, so why is there a feature freeze on it?
<persia> OK.  So, the best way to get that updated is to work with the pkg-games team to get the source updated in Debian, and then file a FeatureFreeeze exception detailing how much better this version is than the last, an sync the source from the Debian repository.
<persia> There's a freeze on the entire archive: we do this to have some time to try to make sure everything works together.
<Migi32> how long does it last?
<persia> In the case of a game that has no packages that depend on it, and does not require any new versions of any libraries, it ought be fairly easy to get it approved.
<persia> The freeze is from now until release (in late April), when we start pulling new versions of everything for our next release.
<cjwatson> the closer to release we are, the harder it is to get exceptions.  early on (like now) it tends to be "have you actually thought about this?  ok."
<kreuter> hello again, #ubuntu-motu.  am I correct that the only way to run a service as a non-root user under upstart is to have the upstart init script invoke something like a SysV init script?
<Migi32> so from now until late April "apt-get update" will only get me feature-freeze exception?
<Migi32> exceptions*
<cjwatson> Migi32: and bug fixes, which don't come under feature freeze
<Migi32> ah
<Migi32> I thought this feature freeze was only for things that shipped with the Ubuntu CD
<cjwatson> kreuter: the mechanisms for dropping to non-root privileges in upstart jobs are exactly the same as those in init scripts
<kreuter> cjwatson: so I could invoke start-stop-daemon in the upstart script?
<persia> Migi32: No, it's for everything.  Otherwise we'd end up with all sorts of bugs in the rest of the archive.
<kreuter> (that's how I've run things in sysv init scripts)
<cjwatson> kreuter: i.e. use start-stop-daemon (note that it can change user without actually starting a daemon process; read its manual page) if you don't need a PAM session; if you need a PAM session, ask an expert :)
<persia> Migi32: Your software might be perfect, but I'm sure you've encountered some that isn't :)
<Migi32> emm... it's not perfect :)
<cjwatson> kreuter: upstart replaces most uses of start-stop-daemon, but not this one
<kreuter> cjwatson: thanks!
<Migi32> but nothing depends upon it. It's just a game
<cjwatson> Migi32: it's more the other way round, we have to be careful that your game is depending on the same sets of libraries as everything else, etc.
<cjwatson> Migi32: anyway, being a game doesn't excuse a package from feature freeze, but it does mean that getting an exception is not likely to be difficult
<cjwatson> somebody will need to ask rather than Just Uploading It, that's all
<Migi32> we were actually planning to release on friday, to get a weekend of busy servers full of people who got the announcement mail, but are you saying the sooner we release the higher the chances we get our updated .deb in the repo's?
<cjwatson> (and I know that two months seems like a long time for that kind of thing, but imagine doing this for ten thousand packages)
<cjwatson> days won't make a noticeable difference
<persia> Migi32: But, as importantly, the team that maintains Gobulation 2 in Ubuntu also maintains it in Debian, and would certainly prefer to upload to Debian and pull to Ubuntu to make sure it's the same version, because there's no good way to pull from Ubuntu into Debian.
<cjwatson> kreuter: oh, the other thing that sometimes makes sense is to modify the service itself to drop privileges, rather than doing it at the upstart job or init script level
<Migi32> ah ok, I think I got it. Where do I contact this Debian pkg-games team?
<superm1> kreuter, i actually did something like what cjwatson is suggesting for mythtv-backend recently if you want some pointers on how to have the app drop it's permissions: http://svn.mythtv.org/trac/changeset/23521/trunk/mythtv/programs/mythbackend/main.cpp
<persia> Migi32: Our mailing list is debian-devel-games@lists.debian.org : I've not worked with globulation 2 before, so I'm not 100% confident with the update, when I know there are people with greater familiarity.
<persia> But if nobody else gets back with a response in a few days, I'll see how I can help.
<Migi32> ok I'll mail to them. And where do I file a FeatureFreeze exception request,
<Migi32> ?
<blueyed> channel topic is cut at the end?!
<Migi32> nevermind it's on the wiki
<persia> Migi32: You'd file a bug on the glob2 package in launchpad.  We tend to watch games updates fairly closely, so we should be able to do this shortly after the upload in Debian.
<persia> blueyed: Unfortunately, the topic got stuck, and fixing it needs help :(
<blueyed> what's that alternative to MoM again? (MoM does not have miro)
<persia> people.ubuntuwire.com/~lucas/merges.html I think
<cjwatson> superm1: pedantry: for 100% revocation you should run setgroups before setgid
<blueyed> thanks, persia
<cjwatson> just in case root has some supplementary groups for some reason
<Migi32> thanks persia for all your help :)
<cjwatson> blueyed: does not have miro> is MoM stuck again or something?
<persia> Migi32: Thanks for letting us know when you're doing a release.  Close coordination helps us all to deliver the latest and greatest to the users :)
<cjwatson> oh, no, it's just that MoM operates relative to testing not unstable
<geser> blueyed: you want to merge the version from unstable, right? MoM is tracking testing
<cjwatson> I'd hope that lucas' page does the same
<blueyed> oh.. has that been the case for like always?!
<blueyed> yes, it does.
<geser> blueyed: if 'always' == 'for lucid' then yes
<persia> lucas's page is tracking testing.
<blueyed> thanks.. I'll just wait then..
<superm1> cjwatson, hmm. thanks.  i'll make a note to improve that and send it back their way
<persia> blueyed: Tracking testing is new for lucid: I don't know if it's decided if we go back to sid for lucid+1
<cjwatson> persia: I believe that is the understanding
<cjwatson> it's OK to manually pull something from unstable if you know what you're doing and are following bugs on the package closely (both Debian and Ubuntu)
<cjwatson> we're just trying to reduce problems for the bulk of packages
<blueyed> oh.. so for LTS we track testing and otherwise unstable? maybe this should depend more on where in the dev cycle we currently are.. but ok.
<cjwatson> there's no value doing it at an intra-cycle level - once you pull everything in from unstable at the start of a cycle, most of the damage you're going to do is done.
<persia> blueyed: Changing the rules based on timing is tricky: even with the current all-testing-all-the-time model we've ended up with some stuff that is RCbuggy
<persia> Switching at some point would only preserve already uploaded bugs, while not getting updates.
<cjwatson> it's an experiment for this LTS; we'll decide whether to carry on like this for next LTS (or in general, I suppose, but I think more likely for next LTS) based on whether it seems to have been successful
<geser> does someone remember what was the proper replacement for build-depending on "locales-all"?
<cjwatson> depends.  what does your package actually need?
<blueyed> If I understand correctly, it has not entered testing because of build failured on mips?! (http://qa.debian.org/excuses.php?package=miro)
<geser> that I don't know yet, I've just seen that it's in DEPWAIT because of locales-all
<blueyed> cjwatson: makes sense re LTS. good to know. Thanks.
<cjwatson> figure that out first - the replacement will differ depending on the answer
<huats> If I need to do a rebuild without a change (to build against a new lib version), a package that was in sync with debian, do I use the ubuntu1 suffix or build1 ?
<cjwatson> mips> seems plausible, it's a Debian release arch
<cjwatson> huats: build1
<huats> cjwatson, thanks
<lightnin1> persia: Got a minute?
#ubuntu-motu 2010-02-20
<kamalmostafa> hello motu's -- I'm looking for feedback on my FFE request bug 524183 - is it reasonable and complete? - what's a normal ETA for an FFE request?  thanks!
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 524183 in hamlib "Sync hamlib 1.2.10-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/524183
<zooko> Folks: there are some ideas being thrown around about how Tahoe-LAFS ought to be packaged in Ubuntu. #tahoe-lafs
<zooko> Specifically, should a Tahoe-LAFS node be auto-configured on install and auto-started on reboot.
<zooko> Also, should every Ubuntu user get a free 2 GB of space on a Tahoe-LAFS storage grid. :-)
<ScottK> Generally the answer to such questions is yes.
<zooko> :-)
<ScottK> Dunno about the last bit
<zooko> :-)
<zooko> Thanks.
<ScottK> If there is a sane default configuration, the package should provide it.
<zooko> It isn't clear to me if there is one for this.
<zooko> Please join #tahoe-lafs if you are curious what the options are.
<zooko> ScottK: if these folks on #tahoe-lafs converge on a position that they want to configure the Ubuntu package to automatically connect you to a specific storage grid then I'll come back and ask you more about that...
<zooko> It would basically mean them offering free storage service to Ubuntu users, I think.
<patx2> ScottK, could you revu http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/fastpatx ?
<nigelb> does this line correctly copy the file rhythmbox.apport to the apport package hooks folder?  "cp debian/rhythmbox.apport debian/rhythmbox/usr/share/apport/package-hooks/source_rhythmbox.py"
 * hyperair wonders if it's time to upgrade to ubuntu lucid yet..
<c_korn> hello, can someone help me with a FFe ? what am I supposed to do ? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/scilab/+bug/511864/comments/18
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 511864 in scilab "FeatureFreezeException: Sync scilab 5.2.1-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,New]
<iulian> c_korn: Answer Stefan's question.
<randomaction> c_korn: you should check whether listed packages will work with your new proposed version
<FLOZz> Hello
<iulian> Hi.
<FLOZz> Can someone can review my first package (cover-thumbnailer) please ? : http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/cover-thumbnailer
<FLOZz> -can
<randomaction> we had a deadline 2 days ago, so new packages for Lucid will be accepted only in exceptional circumstances
<FLOZz> arf /o\
<randomaction> packages for Lucid+1 will be accepted since early May
<FLOZz> randomaction: ok thanks :)
<AlanBell> hello all
<AlanBell> I am doing my first bit of python packaging, it works but builds just for Karmic. How do I get it to build for Jaunty/Lucid?
<AlanBell> ppa:alanbell/lpod lpod-python is the package
<AlanBell> http://lpod-project.org is the upstream
<shadeslayer> AlanBell: is it already packaged in ubuntu?
<AlanBell> no, it only got announced yesterday
<AlanBell> I would like to get it in Ubuntu proper, but I am not a motu
<AlanBell> so I am practicing in my PPA
<shadeslayer> hmm no idea then :)
<Laney> (ppa support in #launchpad) you can copy the source from Karmic to Lucid in your PPA
<Laney> assuming it builds without changes
<shadeslayer> AlanBell: i just know that youll need to setup pbuilder and then build packages
<AlanBell> Laney: thanks, I will try #launchpad
<danblick> something seems strange about having a different package for different upstream version numbers - i'm looking at jruby, jruby1.1, and jruby1.2
<danblick> i see the reason for doing it, but it seems like it means that if i want to build a package for jruby 1.4, it won't be based off of the jruby1.2 package
<jariq> I am trying to create pbuilder environment for sid but it fails everytime with "chroot: cannot run command `/usr/bin/apt-get': No such file or directory". However I am able to create environment for lucid with any problems. Any ideas what can be wrong?
<azeem> jariq: apt is no longer installed automatically by debootstrap I believe, maybe pbuilder has an option to specify additional packages to include
<azeem> jariq: or create a lenny environment and upgrade
<jariq> azeem: thx I will try "sudo DIST=sid pbuilder create --extrapackages apt build-essential"
<jariq> did not help
<nigelb> jariq: try pbuilder-dist sid create
<deel> join ubuntu
<jariq> Tried "pbuilder-dist sid create" and result is same as before "chroot: cannot run command `/usr/bin/apt-get': No such file or directory"
<nigelb> whats the exact command you gave?
<jariq> nigelb: as you adviced "pbuilder-dist sid create" and it failed to finish
<nigelb> that's surprising.  hold on
<jariq> nigelb: i was executing it as root
<jariq> nigelb: should i wait for any answer? or you're working on something else
<nigelb> woops, getting it
<nigelb> jariq: I have to step out now, can you see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto
<nigelb> there is a section on trouble with pbuilder (or something to that extend)
<nigelb> that might solve your issues
<ari-tczew> is it possible to use 3.0 debian source format by new debian revision? without new upstream release?
<randomaction> ari-tczew: yes
<_Andrew> Anyone know why in my deb when I specify to the debian.install file to glob usr/include/LIB/*.h  it says in doesn't find anything?
<jariq> nigelb: ok thx i will look at it
<sebner> ari-tczew: shouldn't be the only change and especially not without Debian doing it too
<ari-tczew> sebner: I'm doing fakesync for package which is in 3.0 source format
<ari-tczew> but ubuntu's package isn't in 3.0
<sebner> ari-tczew: kk, it's fine then
<ari-tczew> ;-]
<kamalmostafa> hello motu's -- I'm confused about the status of bug 503111 -- ubuntu-sru is subscribed but I do not see it listed in the queue https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/karmic/+source/ubuntu-dev-tools/+bug/503111 -- shouldn't it be listed there?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 503111 in ubuntu-dev-tools "False: The versions in Debian and Ubuntu are the same already during requestsync" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/503111
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 503111 in ubuntu-dev-tools "False: The versions in Debian and Ubuntu are the same already during requestsync" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<kamalmostafa> oops -- pasted wrong link -- shouldn't it be listed in the sru queue:  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.subscriber=ubuntu-sru  ?
<randomaction> kamalmostafa: the only open task is for karmic, so it's showing up only at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/karmic/+bugs?field.subscriber=ubuntu-sru
<kamalmostafa> randomaction: okay yes, that makes sense -- looks like its in the right place then -- thanks.
<randomaction> I don't know whether SRU guys look at that queue though
<kamalmostafa> randomaction:  hmm.  but wouldn't this situation apply to all SRU's (which are already fixed in Lucid)?  Any "SRU guys" around that can chime in here?
<kamalmostafa> I now see that my bug 503111 is unlike the rest of the Karmic-targeted SRU's in the "regular" queue...  E.g. 511868 says "Nominated for Karmic" but doesn't already have a Karmic task -- whereas my 503111 does already have a Karmic task (which Laney created).
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 503111 in ubuntu-dev-tools "False: The versions in Debian and Ubuntu are the same already during requestsync" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/503111
<Laney> i would imagine they should look at the stable release lists
<kamalmostafa> hi Laney -- that one (503111) has been in the karmic sru queue for about 6 weeks -- is that not an unusually long time?
<Laney> it sure is
<Laney> you should ask an sru guy
<kamalmostafa> where can I find one?  :-)
<ari-tczew> e.g. dfiloni
<ari-tczew> cody-somerville
<Laney> check out the team member list on LP
<kamalmostafa> Looking for an ubuntu-sru member -- please check status of bug 503111, pending for 6 weeks (ping cody-somerville cjwatson dfiloni jdong pitti slangasek).
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 503111 in ubuntu-dev-tools "False: The versions in Debian and Ubuntu are the same already during requestsync" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/503111
<jdong> kamalmostafa: one sec please
<jdong> kamalmostafa: patch looks good, ACKed. Sorry it took so long. Must've slipped through the cracks when I did mass bugmail purging
 * jdong kinda wishes there was a needs-sru-attention type tag that magically worked.
<jdong> (not serious wishlist item, too much bug triage manpower to make that actually work)
<kamalmostafa> jdong: no problem at all -- was just checking up on my "lost work" list and found that it had slipped through the cracks here also.  thanks!
<jdong> no problem :)
<kamalmostafa> thanks for the help Laney, ari-tczew
<jdong> once in a while I do attempt to look at all subscribed+open SRU bugs, but the last time I did that I think there's 600-ish and never was terribly productive...
<jdong> most tended to be false-positives
<Laney> jdong: for what reason? Couldn't you unsubscribe the team?
<kamalmostafa> jdong: well, if this is a useful datapoint, I noticed that the "/ubuntu" SRU queue lists 91 bugs, while the "/ubuntu/karmic" SRU queue lists 95.  So maybe the 4 bugs which are only on the Karmic queue need specific investigation to see if they're in this 'lost' state.   (?)
<jdong> Laney: Yeah I suppose I can unsubscribe. Usually it's some unrelated task still held open
<jdong> Couldn't find a LP search option to specify what distro to match status fields to.
<kamalmostafa> jdong: thanks for your ACK on 503111 -- what's the next step for this bug?  Who is supposed to "proceed with upload"?
<jdong> kamalmostafa: any MOTU can do that
<jdong> the official procedure is to subscribe ubuntu-universe-sponsors
<kamalmostafa> jdong: I'll subscribe them then -- thanks again
<jdong> if the response time is not good, feel free to come back here and kidnap the first MOTU to talk ;-)
<jdong> I mean.... shhhhh nobody read that.
<kamalmostafa> jdong: regarding the "match distro search" question...  I imagine that a Launchpad API script could be crafted to do this... (sounds like I have a new project for this morning :-).
<jdong> kamalmostafa: hehehe indeed that's a way to do it :)f
<kamalmostafa> jdong: I'll let you know if I manage to construct anything useful.
<jdong> ok cool
<crimsun> bah, will need an FFe for the rest of this haskell mess
<crimsun> Laney: do you plan to request an FFe for haskell-x11, or do you want to leave it at 1.4.6.1?
<Laney> crimsun: I got some kind of release approval for the transition
<Laney> I didn't imagine having to request exceptions
<crimsun> ok
<crimsun> I'll wait til ghc6 has finished building then toss haskell-utf8-string up
<Laney> oh, no don't do that
<Laney> that package should be removed ;)
<Laney> ghc6 now provides it
<crimsun> mmkay
<crimsun> well, whatever doesn't break my window manager so I can keep hacking alsa, I suppose.
<Laney> if you want to carve a path through to xmonad then that's fine
<crimsun> doesn't make sense to do anything until ghc6 -10 is built, tho'
<Laney> or else aptitude should hold things back for you well enough
<stefanlsd> anyone using pubilder-dist that doesnt listen to .pbuilderrc (seems like http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=567995)
<ubottu> Debian bug 567995 in cowbuilder "cowbuilder doesn't honor my $HOME/.pbuilderrc" [Normal,Open]
<Laney> crimsun: (filed the RM bug)
<cyberix> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pq/+bug/267536
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 267536 in pq "Arbitrary dependency on specific Wine version" [Undecided,Fix committed]
<cyberix> is this a valid way of submitting a patch
<cyberix> or do I need to do something more?
<randomaction> cyberix: quite valid, these days we have slightly more bugs than usual to review, but some sponsor will get to it
<arand> cyberix: afaik https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SponsorshipProcess is the steps to follow, seems like in your case only the "subscribe team" bit is missing..
<randomaction> cyberix: just set status to "Confirmed"
<arand> randomaction: oh, should the subscription be added or not?
<randomaction> arand:  u-u-s is subscribed
<arand> randomaction: cyberix: ah, noevermind then, didn't see that (though sponsors had another icon.. whatever..)
<|sistpoty|> cyberix: looks good, test-building and uploading
<sebner> huhu sistpoty :)
<sistpoty> hi sebner
<sistpoty> cyberix: uploaded
<user007> Hello folks,
<user007> I've uploaded to revu, my package but It doesn't appear, this take some minute to refresh on the web page?
<sistpoty> user007: which package?
<user007> sistpoty: bygfoot
<sistpoty> user007: ah, seeing it in the rejected directory
<user007> opss, what happend? please
<sistpoty> user007: give me a minute, looking at the logs
<user007> ok, thank you sistpoty
<cyberix> sistpoty: thanks
<randomaction> we have bygfoot in the archive, why upload it to REVU?
<user007> it is the last version
<user007> and fix, some bugs
<iulian> Don't use REVU if it's not a new package.
<randomaction> file a bug against bygfoot package and attach .diff.gz
<randomaction> use https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SponsorshipProcess
<randomaction> be aware that we're in the https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FeatureFreeze
<sistpoty> user007: it says incorrect signature. is your key in revu's keyring already?
<user007> sistpoty: yes
<sistpoty> user007: hm, I'll put it back to incoming, let's see if it's processed then
<sistpoty> user007: oh, it's a binary upload, revu will only accept source packages
<user007> ops, I don't know, I think it's similar to debian-mentors
<randomaction> user007: if you manage to get your package into Debian, you can then sync it to Ubuntu
<user007> exactly, but as you know, Debian process is... well,
<user007> but If want to colaborate with bygfoot, How can I updated it? exists similar to NMU?
<randomaction> user007: have you read what I wrote earlier?
<user007> ok, I understand.
<user007> thank you guys,
<nacho_> Hi
<crimsun> I already answered you, nacho_
<crimsun> nacho_: i.e., see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess
<nacho_> ok
<nacho_> also we released gtranslator 1.9.8, 1 week ago and it seems it was not added
<nacho_> and it fixes quite a lot of important bugs
<crimsun> again, the above URL
<sistpoty> nhandler, ScottK, iulian: any objections to sync a new upstream of gpodder (no rdepends) to fix bug #508886?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 508886 in gpodder "gpodder crashed with AttributeError in set_attributes()" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/508886
<nacho_> crimsun, ok thanks al ot
<iulian> sistpoty: Looking.
<sistpoty> iulian: I didn't add a build log (it's still building here *g*), and upstream changelog, just ask if you want one
<iulian> sistpoty: An upstream changelog would be nice.
<lightnin> Hiya highvoltage.
<iulian> sistpoty: Got it.
<sistpoty> iulian: it somehow doesn't diff well :/
<iulian> sistpoty: I'm currently looking at http://gpodder.org/oldnews.html.
<sistpoty> ah, heh
<iulian> sistpoty: Looks good to me.  Ack.
<sistpoty> thanks iulian, I'll give it some testing yet, and then subscribe ubuntu-archive
<iulian> Excellent.
<sistpoty> gpodder works fine, however I had imagined the web 2.0 somehow fancier, it doesn't even have 3d effects *g*
<sebner> sistpoty: xD xD xD, you are the right QA guy ;)
<sistpoty> heh
<iulian> :)
<sistpoty> fta | asac: mind giving some insights on bug #522254
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 522254 in gnash "[MASTER] FFe: please sync with upstream version of Gnash .8.7" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/522254
<Laney> sistpoty: debian just packages gnash btw
<Laney> d*
<sistpoty> Laney: oh, nice, thanks!
<fabounet> BlackZ : Hi, any news on the Cairo-Dock's build ?
<fabounet> yep
#ubuntu-motu 2010-02-21
<ari-tczew> please universe sponsors for review bug 524912
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 524912 in nautilus-image-converter "Fake sync nautilus-image-converter 0.3.0-3 (universe) from Debian testing (main)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/524912
<sistpoty> ari-tczew: I'm inclined to follow randomaction's comment: There are no changes that we need right now, this only wastes time and bandwidth
<ari-tczew> sistpoty: fakesynces for main too wastes time?
<Laney> pointless uploads always waste time
<sistpoty> ari-tczew: *if* these don't bring in changes then yes
<jpds> (and CPU power, bandwidth, ...)
<ari-tczew> great! all my time is wasted! love you!
<sistpoty> not only the upload wastes time, everyone having the package installed will also need to download the new version for no benefit
<crimsun> ari-tczew: don't feel bad. Your efforts are appreciated; it's just that fixes need to be significant from a certain point forward.
<Laney> you should target your efforts where they will have more impact
<ari-tczew> I'm merge-n00b, so I'm useless in FeatureFreeze
<ari-tczew> hmmm recently someone told me that fakesyncs are welcome in FF
<ari-tczew> and merges without new upstream release
<ari-tczew> and today you tell me that this is wasting time!
<ari-tczew> rofl
<Laney> you need to zoom out a bit
<lifeless> it depends on why the fakesync
<Laney> and think about what the upload is supposed to achieve
<sistpoty> ari-tczew: merges without new upstream release *are* welcome, but we don't need to include uploads that are semantically identical to what we have
<lifeless> if there is a bugfix, and to do it 'right' you do a fakesync as part of that; then it fixes a bug
<ari-tczew> love you again <3
<paissad> guys, i'm trying to rebuild trac with a new snapshot from upstream, here is the log of debuild -us -uc --lintian-opts -iIEv --pedantic ---> http://pastebin.com/f121d8915 ..... but the problem is that i don't have the same structure in debian/trac/* as when i extract the created .deb package
<paissad> here is the debian/trac tree --> http://pastebin.com/f40099b75
<paissad> here is the structure when i extract the package (the deb file) --> http://pastebin.com/f36b9a83a
<paissad> i don't understand !:/
<ari-tczew> paissad: why you want to get new snapshot?
<ari-tczew> is it fixes something?
<paissad> ari-tczew, mostly in order to have the translations , but there are many new & interesting features too ^^
<ari-tczew> paissad: no! there is FeatureFreeze!
<ari-tczew> get out here!
<paissad> ari-tczew, o0
<sistpoty> ari-tczew: please calm down a bit
<ari-tczew> sistpoty: I write just only true
<paissad> ari-tczew, you're mad ?
<ari-tczew> paissad: yes :D FeatureFreeze and generally policy drive me crazy
<paissad> ari-tczew, then i think it's you who need to get out of here .... go see a psy mate !
<paissad> well .. does somebody have any idea about my problem
<crimsun> ari-tczew: please step back for a moment and realize that we're all just trying to prepare Lucid. You aren't being flamed. You aren't expected to know the policies immediately.
<paissad> right, i've learning the policies for a month now & i still cannot finish my packaging because i after debhelper, maintainer-guide, i have to learn javahelper & debconf ^^ ... but that's not a reason to get crazy .. that's life
<paissad> i've been*
<Laney> paissad: how did you get to the new snapshot?
<paissad> Laney, from svn
<Laney> svn export?
<paissad> svn export yes !
<Laney> did you tar up the svn export and then uupdate with it?
<paissad> Laney, yeah, i have a orig.tar.gz file created after svn export
<Laney> maybe the build system changed somewhat
<Laney> it might be an idea to just go with it unpackaged in /srv or whatever
<asac> sistpoty: no we dont sync
<ari-tczew> crimsun and other from team: easy man, slacken your tie!
<geser> paissad: do you have a debian/trac.install or debian/install file?
<asac> sistpoty: ok thats a misleading wording
<asac> its just latest gnash
<paissad> geser, no i don't have a debian/install or debian/trac.install
<micahg> ari-tczew: we have xulrunner-1.9.2 in a PPA if you want to test build your package against it
<paissad> geser, i did not created an install file because my debian/rule file handle it  http://pastebin.com/f3a5c4835
<ari-tczew> micahg: great! but I don't know... there's feature freeze and ... :/
<micahg> ari-tczew: which package is it?
<cody-somerville> I just got a bunch of bug mail due to activity by Marco Rodrigues. I thought he was asked to abstain from participating.
<geser> paissad: I guess I understand why. your package uses an old debhelper version which used debian/tmp for staging while you install to debian/trac for staging
<sistpoty> asac: thanks for looking :)
<paissad> geser, and then,what must i do ?
<paissad> i saw that warning " debhelper version lower than 5 ****" but i did not understand ... that's what i said
<sistpoty> cody-somerville: afaict that's still true... did his behavior increase at least?
<geser> either update the debhelper version (as lintian suggest anyway) or "install" to debian/tmp too
<ari-tczew> micahg: libjdic-java
<micahg> ari-tczew: yeah, that's on the list, so go ahead, here's the PPA to set as a dependency: https://launchpad.net/~mozillateam/+archive/ffox35
<paissad> geser, debhelper                7.4.15
<geser> paissad: you need to tell which debhelper compat version your package needs (see the value in debian/compat)
<cody-somerville> sistpoty, He added add bug tasks for the startup-manager project in launchpad to bugs against the startupmanager source package - even for bugs that are already Fix Released.
<Laney> well he was asked by the MC to stop participating, right?
<sistpoty> cody-somerville: *sigh*
<Laney> so really I doubt they have jurisdiction over the whole of LP...
<cody-somerville> sistpoty, It doesn't look like he actually confirmed if they were upstream bugs or not either.
<paissad> geser, you got it mate, you got it ^^ .... i would never find it by myself ... i thought that debian/compat was not so important
<paissad> geser, thanks for all
<ari-tczew> micahg: can I use reason like 'transition for xulrunner -> 1.9.2' for FFe merge libjdic-java?
<micahg> ari-tczew: make sure it builds first, then worry about FFe, but yes, that works
<Laney> bugfixes don't need FFe
<jdong> *looks at clock*
<jdong> did I really just spend the last 11 minutes trying to make the emacs doctor say a sexual innuendo?
<jdong> *goes back to being productive*
<Laney> actually, I don't know if that's true for this cycle
<sistpoty> !jdong
<jdong> I think that factoid is gone :)
<sistpoty> damn :P
<jdong> :)
<Laney> crimsun: I just made this if you want to do any uploads
<Laney> http://orangesquash.org.uk/~laney/graph.png
<Laney> (looks daunting when zoomed out)
<micahg> ari-tczew: please subscribe myself and asac to the FFe bug
<ari-tczew> micahg: sure! but give me a time for test
<micahg> oh wait...no FFe needed :)
<micahg> ari-tczew: yeah, I actually test built it in the PPA it seems to build ok
<sistpoty> Laney: damn, there's too much red and too few green in there :P
<ari-tczew> micahg: I don't know! here is FFe needed for live ; btw. currect Ubuntu's delta works, but Debian's revision doesn't work
<Laney> sistpoty: yes indeed, this is the fun of a Haskell transition
<Laney> luckily it should be completely solved by syncing
<micahg> ari-tczew: FFe is needed is it's new features not bug fix per above
<micahg> *if it's
<sistpoty> Laney: do we need to sync in order, or will packages land in depwait nowadays?
<sistpoty> (or just ftbfs, which just needs more manual intervention, but wouldn't restrict to sync out of order)
<Laney> at least for this first round we need to sync in order
<sistpoty> Laney: ok, thanks
<Laney> debian has the edge here because they can issue nmu and dw commands to wanna-build easily
<Laney> actually you probably could just sync everything straight away
<ari-tczew> sistpoty: could you destroy my work too here? bug 512430 ; bug 524955 ; bug 524957
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 512430 in geronimo-jpa-3.0-spec "Fake sync geronimo packages (main) from Debian testing (main)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/512430
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 524955 in polkit-qt "Fake sync polkit-qt 0.9.3-1 (main) from Debian testing (main)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/524955
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 524957 in polkit-qt-1 "Fake sync polkit-qt-1 0.95.1-1 (main) from Debian testing (main)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/524957
<Laney> if soyuz had bd-uninstallable then it would be nicer
<sistpoty> Laney: oh, so b-d's won't be installable if we sync out of order?
<Laney> that's right, which is an FTBFS in soyuz
<sistpoty> Laney: that's at least cool, because we then can click on retry and sync out of order :)
<Laney> well I'm not sure that this gains anything
<Laney> as james_w has said that I can bother him with lists of stuff to sync ;)
<sistpoty> heh
<Laney> last time we did this for (I think) ppc, as the world was broken there for a number of weeks
<Laney> we just threw all of the FTBFS against the wall multiple times until it all went green
<Laney> bit of a waste of buildd time though
<ari-tczew> how can I add PPA into pbuilder list?
<sistpoty> well, only ia64 and sparc are busy, so ... :)
<Laney> heh
<sistpoty> ari-tczew: pbuilder login --save-after-login
<sistpoty> ari-tczew: then modify /etc/apt/sources.list and add the ppa
<Laney> i'll start syncing stuff tomorrow after ghc6 is built in more places
<Laney> for now, nn
<ari-tczew> sistpoty: heh, but how can I edit file? nano doesn't work
<sistpoty> ari-tczew: just from a glimpse at geronimo-jpa-3.0-spec, this does contain visible changes (e.g. the description), so that's not wasted work
<ari-tczew> impossible!
<sistpoty> ari-tczew: pbuilder should tell you a directory where the build chroot is extracted (right at the beginning)
<sistpoty> ari-tczew: just use your favorite editor in the real system in that directory (and there etc/apt/sources.list)
<ari-tczew> sistpoty: I don't understand. where's the right file?
<Daviey> Hey, What is the highest quilt format supported by karmic?
<persia> Daviey: Could you rephrase, or provide more context?
<sistpoty> ari-tczew: pbuilder --login tells me:
<sistpoty> ari-tczew: File extracted to: /var/cache/pbuilder/build//21606
<sistpoty> ari-tczew: so that would be /var/cache/pbuilder/build/21606/etc/apt/sources.list for me right now
<ari-tczew> ahh, okay, I'll check
<Daviey> persia: sorry, debian/source/format = "3.0 (quilt)", however the lp ppa builders are complainign that version 3.0 isn't supported on karmic.  So what is the highest version that can be used
<persia> Daviey: That's the source format :)  If you can unpack a source on karmic, and LP won't build it, that's an LP bug.
<persia> I know there are some bugs in 3.0(quilt) that weren't resolved until lucid though.
 * Daviey cries.
<persia> Most people generally downgrade to 1.0: 2.0 has weak support in lots of tools.
<sistpoty> I thought 2.0 never made it? only 3.0?
<persia> sistpoty: 2.0 has some support in some tools in an almost entirely untested way :)
<sistpoty> heh :)
<Daviey> there does seem to be perl support for 2.0
 * Daviey is embarrassed to commit http://pastebin.com/d1a11f4f7
<persia> Daviey: Um, that doesn't accomplish ehat you hope.
<persia> There is no Format: 1.0 (quilt).
 * Daviey cries louder
<persia> The way to do quilt with Format 1.0 is to build-dep on quilt, include a fragment in debian/rules (or use dh --with quilt), and put the patches in debian/patches
<Daviey> yeah, i know that! :o
<persia> Daviey: What are you trying to accomplish?  This may be an easier way to solve your issue.
<ari-tczew> sistpoty: how can I fix it? W: GPG error: http://ppa.launchpad.net lucid Release: The following signatures couldn't be verified because the public key is not available: NO_PUBKEY 9BDB3D89CE49EC21
<ari-tczew> in pbuilder
<Daviey> persia: ok..  Have mythtv build scripts that auto build source packages for upstream trunk and a -fixes branch, for karmic and lucid.  For trunk packaging we've just moved over to quilt 3.0, and expected it to "just work" with karmic.  It hasn't.
<Daviey> and incidently version 3.0 doesn't auto pop after a debuild.. I sort of expected it to.
<sistpoty> ari-tczew: there's an apt setting to allow untrusted sources, but I've forgotten the details, sorry
<ari-tczew> maybe someone else can fix it in pbuilder
<ari-tczew> ?
<geser> or you could add the key
<persia> Daviey: Either backport dpkg to the environment you're targeting, or don't switch to Format 3.0
<persia> Daviey: I don't think you can have single-source 3.0 that works in both environments properly with karmic dpkg, except for some subset of 3.0 packages.
<Daviey> persia: yeah, i think backporting is a non-starter because LP PPA will still refuse the karmic package.
<Daviey> i think i'll have to do quilt the old way for karmic packages.. but atm i'm thinking sleep.  Thanks for your help persia
<persia> Daviey: How is it refusing it?  At what point?  I suspect that's a bug in LP that can be fixed, because if you backport/patch dpkg to behave differently, it should allow that.
<persia> Sleep well :)
<Daviey> persia: Rejected:
<Daviey> myththemes_0.23.0~trunk23578-0ubuntu0~mythbuntu1.dsc: format '3.0 (quilt)' is not permitted in karmic.
<ari-tczew> geser: pbuilder is calling to my home dir
<ari-tczew> and it can't add gpg key
<Daviey> persia: ^^ that is the PPA email following dput.  But i really must sleep. nn
<persia> Daviey: Yeah, I'd call that a bug in launchpad :)
<Daviey> >:(
<sistpoty> ari-tczew: you could try that, not too sure if I recall it right though: echo "APT::Get::AllowUnauthenticated 1; " >> /etc/apt/apt.conf.d/allow-unauthenticated
<sistpoty> ari-tczew: (inside the pbuilder chroot)
<ari-tczew> :O
<geser> ari-tczew: "apt-key adv --keyserver keyserver.ubuntu.com --recv-keys 9BDB3D89CE49EC21" inside your pbuilder
<geser> sistpoty: why go the way through "allow unauthenticated" when only the PPA key is missing?
<sistpoty> geser: you've got a point there
<ari-tczew> geser: thanks!
<sistpoty> persia: please unsubscribe u-u-s from bug #402874 (restricted), bug #524982 (already ack'd), bug #503111 (uploaded to proposed, awaiting moderation) thanks!
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 402874 in sl-modem "Sync sl-modem 2.9.11~20090222-3 (restricted) from Debian testing (non-free)" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/402874
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 524982 in frescobaldi "Please sync frescobaldi 1.0.2-1 from Debian unstable/main to universe, ubuntu override ok" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/524982
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 503111 in ubuntu-dev-tools "False: The versions in Debian and Ubuntu are the same already during requestsync" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/503111
<sistpoty> persia: or add me to u-u-s, then I can unsubscribe the team, whatever you prefer ;)
 * persia adds
<persia> sistpoty: Welcome to u-u-s.  I've also unsubscribed the bugs.
<sistpoty> persia: thanks!
<persia> Down to 10!  Wow.
 * persia takes a loot at 507740 and 507741, being related.
<persia> s/ot/ok/
 * hyperair wonders when he can begin sponsoring things.
<sistpoty> persia: make that 9, just uploading 480553
<persia> hyperair: If it's not sorted by Tuesday, I'll ask at the TB meeting.
<persia> hyperair: *soon* :)
<hyperair> yay thanks =)
 * persia wonders if we can clear the queue this weekend
<zooko> Folks: just so you know there is a bug in Tahoe-LAFS v1.6.0 so we are working on releasing Tahoe-LAFS v1.6.1, ETA tomorrow.
<persia> zooko: 1.6.1 is just a bugfix to 1.6.0 ?
<sistpoty> oh, and bug #463019 needs input from patch author (or another one to eyeball the patch, as I've been a little bit slacky)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 463019 in gtk-recordmydesktop "recordmydesktop does not record frames properly in karmic" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/463019
<zooko> persia: yes
<zooko> http://allmydata.org/trac/tahoe-lafs/query?status=assigned&status=new&status=reopened&group=status&milestone=1.6.1
<persia> zooko: Excellent.  Thanks for so closely working with our release schedule and freezes.  It really helps to make sure we deliver quality software.
<zooko> Likewise! :-)
<sistpoty> and bug #511864 needs another ack from iulian, nhandler or ScottK
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 511864 in scilab "FeatureFreezeException: Sync scilab 5.2.1-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/511864
<persia> sistpoty: I thought we were going with single-ack from ubuntu-release this cycle?  Am I not understanding the mail thread?
<persia> or do I misremember you being a release team member?
<sistpoty> persia: until there's consensus about the new policy, we'll be holding the status quo to not block current freeze exception requests
<persia> Makes sense.
<persia> How is that consensus confirmed?  For MOTU, we'd do that with a MOTU meeting, but I'm not sure of the context for confirming it for everyone.  TB meeting?  Release meeting?
 * persia grumbles at bzr branches for packaging making it take extra long to download stuff for sponsoring.
<sistpoty> persia: for MOTU we've switched to ML w.o. objections actually
<persia> When did that happen?
<hyperair> imo debdiffs ftw
<persia> Last I knew we had a complicated sheaparding procss.
<sistpoty> persia: some time ago already, let me dig the thread
<persia> hyperair: Well, even debdiffs can't express everything.  I had a package sponsored last week where my changes couldn't all be expressed by debdiff, and the upload didn't actually do everything mentioned in the changelog.
<hyperair> persia: what changes were they?
<hyperair> then upload a debian.tar.gz. simple enough =\
<persia> hyperair: Actually uploading an orig.tar.gz as part of the package :)
<persia> No, that wouldn't address some classes of thing.
<hyperair> =\
<hyperair> then upload the whole .dsc if necessary
<hyperair> or stick it up a PPA
<persia> That wouldn't do it either.
<hyperair> that's what i've been doing
<hyperair> what wouldn't it address?
<hyperair> i don't see any more problems
<persia> PPAs just really complicate things.  We know that a package compiled in a PPA differs from a package compiled int he archive, so they shouldn't have the same version number, or we can't know what binary gets installed on user systems.
<sistpoty> persia: thread at https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-motu/2008-June/004069.html  (googled an arbitrary mail though, might want to see the full thread)
<persia> Plus, it wastes bandwidth.
<hyperair> persia: and bzr doesn't?
<persia> sistpoty: That's the thread that ended up bringing forward the complicated sheparding process.
<hyperair> persia: imo if i've an orig tarball already, i don't want to download the entire unpacked contents of the tarball again just to sponsor
<sistpoty> persia: yes, do I recall it right that the consensus was to try it out and see if it works? (and that status was imho never changed afterwards)
<persia> hyperair: Sure, but 1) dget and apt-get source already don't do that, and 2) I don't think I've ever personally encountered that situation.
<persia> sistpoty: It was declared to work when used a few times, and then MOTU meetings were suspended, and we never resolved to not do it that way.
<hyperair> persia: a non new-upstream release sponsor should allow you to get the orig tarball from your local mirror
<persia> But now that we have the new shiny MOTU (wgrant put it best at UDS Jaunty "MOTU Is dead, long live MOTU"), we can do things entirely differently :)
<hyperair> which is very much faster than launchpad
<persia> hyperair: I never meant to indicate that uploading everything to LP was a good idea.  I spent an immense amount of time writing tools that would automatically generate packages from diff.gz files to avoid precisely that a number of years ago (which bitrotted, and are now completely obsolete).
<sistpoty> persia: maybe we should do a motu meeting again (though this time I won't try to organize it, due to the epic failure for my last try *g*)
<persia> I just don't like having to download the source *twice* to get the orig.tar.gz *and* the bzr branch.
<persia> sistpoty: Indeed, although I think there are two or three threads that need to happen on the mailing list before it's pointful.
<persia> sabdfl has indicated he'd like to attend the next MOTU meeting, as well.
<sistpoty> persia: however -release practices aren't really matter to motu policies imho, how motu-release came to a decision (be it one or two acks, having delegates or not) was imho a decision of motu-release and was handled that way
<persia> Yes, but it was a MOTU meeting that specifically delegated process decision to motu-release.
<persia> But none of this matters, because motu-release is no more (or should be shortly)
<sistpoty> persia: oh, didn't recall that *g*
<persia> Which is a truly good thing, in my opinion :)
<sistpoty> *nod*
<persia> sistpoty: You only came to 1/3 of MOTU meetings :p
<sistpoty> haha
<hyperair> persia: well if it were maintained i think it would save a lot of bandwidth and time.
<hyperair> persia: unless launchpad were to get mirrors around the world.
<persia> What?
<hyperair> persia: the tools that generate packages from diff.gz files
<persia> Not really.  It's always faster to use a dsc on a local mirror.
<persia> The tools relied on watch files, get-orig-source rules, etc.
<sistpoty> persia: btw, my feeling is that a posts like "that's my suggestion of the new policy", "I'm ok with it", "let's make it so, anyone who has objections, please speak up" should give us a proper base for the new -release policy, granted that it's not done in 1 day
<persia> sistpoty: I think that gives us a good basis for a policy.  I'd like to see that given some official imprimatur, which might just be that it gets an [AGREED] in a release meeting.
<persia> That makes it show up on u-d-a, and what not.
<persia> This is a good thing because it helps address the issue of people feeling like policy is changing and they can't keep up.
<sistpoty> persia: good point, once the policy proposal is agreed on, I'll try to get it routed to the proper channels and have it agreed on (probably asking you again, what you think the proper channels are *g*)
 * persia gives up on using bzr again, after being told that a branch that works from loggerhead doesn't work for bzr merge
<kamalmostafa> persia: thanks for taking on the libti* pair.  if i've completely botched it, i'm available for punches in the nose.  ;-)
<persia> kamalmostafa: Did you botch it?  I can't tell yet, and given the format of things, expect it to be some time before I manage to actually figure out what diff you want sponsored.
<persia> For some reason, the sequence `bzr branch lp:ubuntu/lucid/libticalcs; cd libticalcs; bzr mergelp:~kamalmostafa/ubuntu/lucid/libticalcs/merge-507740` tells me of an invalid branch, so I'm kinda digging through files individually based on timestamps (because I'd like this fixed).
<persia> IF you'd like to toss me a couple debdiffs, it'd make it easier for me :)
<kamalmostafa> persia: Well, I don't *think* I botched it really -- and I have no idea what's going on with bzr there (but I normally stick to branch and pull -- merge scares the heck out of me ;-).  I'll happily send you debdiffs instead.  Should I attach them to the bugs?
<persia> That's probably easiest :)
<persia> Well, without merge, I have no idea how I'd get your intended content into the target branch.
<persia> I suppose I could use push --overwrite, but that probably breaks the importer.
<persia> Easier to just do it the old way, which I know works, and let the importer work or break as it likes.
<kamalmostafa> persia: ok, it'll take me a few minutes to dig up the trees here and generate debdiffs.  I'll holler for you.
<sistpoty> persia, kamalmostafa: oh, libti* is on my radar as well, I was just hesitant to look at it. do we need a transition for that?
<persia> kamalmostafa: Don't worry about libticalcs: I think I got that one.  Just getting a debdiff for libtifiles would make the second one faster.
<kamalmostafa> persia: got it
<persia> sistpoty: We need a couple removals, but kamalmostafa suggests the removals should happen *after* the merges.
<kamalmostafa> but note... kamalmostafa quite likely is clueless about the proper flow here.  :-)  that was just my interpretation of ScottK's wishes
<sistpoty> persia: /me thought there's a library name change involved, correct or did I misread things? (I really didn't look too close yet)
<persia> sistpoty: two different source names for the same package, with two entirely different histories.
<sistpoty> persia: ah, then I obviously misread :)
<persia> kamalmostafa: I *think* http://paste.ubuntu.com/380765/ is right.  Let me know if you see anything obviously missing.
 * kamalmostafa takes a "quick look" at that 1600-line pastebin!
<persia> heh
<persia> pull it, and use lsdiff : I know the changes for each file match your branch, but I just wanted to make sure I caught all the files.
<kamalmostafa> persia: regarding libtifiles (which is a much smaller piece of diff) -- isn't the diff you're looking for actually already available via launchpad?:  https://launchpadlibrarian.net/39077715/eAxA2dm70kBMstFYzoeFWOafsxN.txt
<persia> That is what I want.  Where's that link?
 * persia may suddenly be not at all unhappy about bzr branches on bugs again
<kamalmostafa> On the bug page (or the merge proposal, or the branch, I think):  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libticalcs/+bug/507741    The green text in the "Related branches" block
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 507741 in libtifiles "libtifiles failed to upload: conflicts with libtifiles2" [Undecided,In progress]
<persia> kamalmostafa: Aha.  I missed that the "Diff: 116 lines" bit was actually a clickable link to some javascrpt that gave me yet another link to actual output.  Thanks!
 * persia grabs the real diff for libticalcs, and reapplies
 * persia really appreciates all the effort that has gone into making sure the two alternate workflows don't block each other, and can be transposed at any step in the process.
<kamalmostafa> persia: well, it sounds like it doesn't matter now, but fwiw, yes, I confirm that your pastebin diff does hit exactly the same files as I uploaded.
<persia> Doesn't matter at all, and I've disposed of the packages that I used to generate that diff :)
<persia> But I'm a little confused about libtifiles: the upstream version appears to have changed.
<persia> Should I be using the ubuntu libtifiles2 tarball?
<kamalmostafa> I don't know (again, the actual merge process is quite foreign to me -- you folks always "just take care of it" :-)
<persia> kamalmostafa: OK.  Let me ask that differently.  What tarball did you use for your local libtifiles package?
<kamalmostafa> persia: checking here
<kamalmostafa> persia: I started with the "bzr branch lp:ubuntu/libtifiles" tree, then merged in the ubuntu-changes from the bzr libtifiles2 tree.  (so I didn't manually collect any tarball).
<persia> OK.  Did you build a source package?
<kamalmostafa> yes
<persia> And there was a tarball as part of that source package?
<kamalmostafa> certainly -- the orig tarball (maybe this is what you wanted):  libtifiles_1.1.1.orig.tar.gz
<RAOF> If you're not familiar with it, bzr builddeb can recreate an orig.tar.gz from the package branch + the pristine-tar data that I think is stored in a revision property.
<persia> kamalmostafa: OK.  Then there's an issue: the changelog calls for a orig tarball for a version that doesn't match the provided tarball.  I can't build that package.
<persia> Or rather, I can't upload that package.
<persia> RAOF: That's a really cool feature.  Would it be able to override the standard naming conventions?  If so, is this a bug?
<kamalmostafa> I remember discussing this with ScottK -- the oddity of the "version number jump", which he seemed to think was the right thing to do
<kamalmostafa> but I certainly can't say that I know how we should proceed here
<RAOF> persia: I don't know.  When I've used it, it has Just Workedâ¢.  You'll probably get more joy out of james_w :).
<persia> RAOF: My fear there is that I'll end up in a learning session, and at the end be much more knowledgeable and much wiser, and have lost track of my original query :)
<persia> kamalmostafa: OK.  So, I agree with ScottK that we want to base off 1.1.2, because that's the version we have for libtifiles2, but I'm not convinced you've actually done this.
<persia> kamalmostafa: Please tey building a package with the 1.1.2 tarball, and test it, etc.
<persia> s/tey/try/
<RAOF> persia: :).  I'll have a look at the package branch, shall I?  Maybe I'll spot something obvious.
<persia> RAOF: If you're familiar with the code, sure.  Either way, I have strong doubts that this merge was tested: my concern is mostly that we don't end up with lots more cases like this (although the specific situation should be rare enough to not happen often).
<kamalmostafa> persia: actually, now that I look more carefully at the _source.changes file, it appears that this actually *was* based off of 1.1.2
<persia> So you did test against the 1.1.2 tarball?
<persia> Could you pastebin everything but the signature on your source.changes?
<kamalmostafa> persia: you keep referring to "the ... tarball" -- but remember that I did all of this work using bzr, not tarballs.
<persia> (the reason not to paste the signature is that it acts as a token, so that someone else could perfom an action with that .changes file pretending to be you)
<persia> kamalmostafa: Sure, but the source package shouldn't care.  The .changes file and .dsc file should be tracking a tarball.
<persia> That you happened to use bzr as a workflow aid should be completely immaterial.
<persia> Otherwise there is a bug in bzr-buildpackage.
<persia> (technically, with the new source package formats, it might be a zip file or lha archive or some other such collection, but that's mostly irrelevant, and I'll keep calling them tarballs anyway)
<kamalmostafa> persia: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/380779/
<persia> OK.  Next bit is tricky: we have to figure out how you constructed libtifiles_1.1.2.orig.tar.gz
<kamalmostafa> persia: so I actually did all this work like 5 weeks ago, but its all starting to come back to me....
<persia> Because the checksums don't match the libtifiles2 tarball, and there's no watch file or get-orig-source rule.
<persia> Any ideas?
<kamalmostafa> I think "bzr builddeb -S" must have constructed it for me.
<kamalmostafa> (or download it for me)
<persia> Any idea what source it might have used to do so?
<kamalmostafa> Yes, the "libtifiles2" source
<persia> patched or unpatched?
<kamalmostafa> ... what was coming back to me was...  there was actually only one tiny code change, I think between libtifiles2 and libtifiles (fwiw) -- src/comments.c.
<kamalmostafa> I don't know the answer to "patched or unpatched".
<persia> Right.
<persia> So, I'm going to disregard that file as locally constructed from unknown sources.
<persia> Now, let's see if we can find a trustable file.  debian/copyright suggets that it can be downloaded from http://lpg.ticalc.org/prj_tilp/
<kamalmostafa> persia: are we talking about: libtifiles2_1.1.2.orig.tar.gz ?   apt-get source libtifiles2  fetches a matching tarball to the one I have locally here.
<persia> kamalmostafa: I'm talking about what to use for libtifiles_1.1.2.orig.tar.gz
<persia> libtifiles2-1.1.2.tar.gz provided by upstream has matching checksums to libtifiles2_1.1.2.orig.tar.gz from the archive.
<persia> So I trust that the libtifiles2 1.1.2 package in the archive has the right tarball.
<persia> Does the content of that tarball match the content of your locally constructed libtifiles_1.1.2.orig.tar.gz ?
<kamalmostafa> I can check that -- are we working under the reasoning that bzr somehow contstructed it for me automagically, and that it should match then?
<kamalmostafa> * that it's contents should match then?
<persia> That's my assumption
<persia> I don't trust your tarball because I can't be sure it matches upstream, but I'm hoping that it does, because otherwise there's more work to the merge.
<kamalmostafa> persia: they don't match -- but it looks like the delta is all auto-generated files (that bzr builddeb -S may have removed when it constructed this tarball?):  http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/380786/
<persia> kamalmostafa: OK.  So, now create and test your package using the upstream tarball, and let me know if it still works.
<persia> I suspect the difference is a call to make clean or similar.
<kamalmostafa> persia: yes, that's exactly what I am thinking
<persia> kamalmostafa: Also, please file a bug on bzr-buildpackage: it should be providing a sufficiently obvious warning when doing this that someone will be inclined to go check.
<persia> It would be unfortunate if at the time we finally get support for arbitrary archive formats we end up doing something that causes us to lose the ability to trust package-provided archives.
<RAOF> kamalmostafa: I think that you might have been meant to use âbzr merge-upstreamâ on the 1.1.2 tarball before doing the rest of the work.
<persia> RAOF: The trick being that it wasn't clear that it was a new upstream, because the merge was between two different source packages (due to some unfortunate history).
<RAOF> Aaah.
<persia> But bzr-buildpackage should still warn users when it *constructs* an artifact and calls it *orig*
<persia> Err, that would have been clearer has I used /constructs/ rather than *constructs*
<persia> s/has/had/
 * persia gives up
<kamalmostafa> persia: I'd prefer that you file the bug report against bzr-buildpackage -- your understanding of the issue is *much* clearer than mine here.  :-)
<persia> Well, except I've never experienced it, and don't know how to create a situation where it would occur :)
<persia> I only get annoyed when recommended workflows break trust paths for artifacts.
<kamalmostafa> persia: fair enough -- but I've only "experienced it" because you're telling me that I have, and I don't know how I created the situation either!  ;-)   Let me try to recreate it and we'll see if we can get a clearer handle on the issue.   (Actually, it sounds like RAOF may have a better understanding of all of this!)
<persia> kamalmostafa: Do you understand why it matters that I know how to construct your tarball from trusted sources?
<kamalmostafa> persia: oh yes, certainly!
<persia> (or what I mean by "trusted sources"?)
<persia> Oh, good :)
<kamalmostafa> oh yes
<kamalmostafa> persia: okay, you'll be happy...  I disposed of my local copies of libtifiles_1.1.2.orig.tar.gz, and tried "bzr builddeb -S" again, and it fails, yielding:
<kamalmostafa>    bzr: ERROR: Unable to find the needed upstream tarball: libtifiles_1.1.2.orig.tar.gz.
<kamalmostafa> So how the heck did I get around that 5 weeks ago.  RAOF, what was the deal with that option you were talking about there?
<kamalmostafa> persia: so no bug to file against bzr, I think.
<persia> Excellent!
<persia> Of course, this doesn't explain how you ended up with the file :)
<kamalmostafa> *sigh* I knew it was a mistake letting this one sit in the queue for five weeks!  ;-)   shaking off more cobwebs...  examining "bzr help builddeb"...
<kamalmostafa> Ah, here it is.  Yes, I now remember using:   bzr builddeb --export-upstream={something}    But what was the something?
<persia> By the way, I get "unrepresentable changes to source" if I apply your patch to libtifiles-1.1.1-1 and try to build against libtifiles2_1.1.2.orig.tar.gz
<persia> kamalmostafa: Also, if you had to intentionally run --export-upstream, then I don't think there's a bug in bzr-builddeb that needs investigation.  There may be a documentation issue that you were instructed to run this, but that's minor.
<kamalmostafa> persia: okay, forget my comment about --export-upstream.  Here's what I did (I can recreate it now):    bzr builddeb -S --split
<RAOF> Hah.  Yes.  --split generates the orig.tar.gz from the branch.
<kamalmostafa> what possessed me to use --split?    I imagine that it was "Hey, it works!  Must be right!"  Doh.
<persia> Is there any warning in the --split documentation that this may not be a good idea, or suggesting watch files or get-orig-source rules?
<kamalmostafa> Obviously not enough to have caught my eye.  :-(
<RAOF> There isn't any warning on --split, no.
<persia> I wonder how it might be phrased.  Obviously, for some developer working on their own code and preparing test packages, it shouldn't break anything, or it's just annoying, but for a developer working on a distribution, it should be fairly clear and point them in the right direction.
<persia> And, actually, for an upstream developer, it might be a very handy tool to generate tarballs for general release in the first place.
<RAOF> âbzr exportâ would probably be better for them, I think.
<kamalmostafa> is there a proper way to tell "bzr builddeb -S" to use a particular filename as the upstream tarball (or is it acceptable for me to just copy the .orig.tar.gz to the name I know bzr will look for)?
<persia> Or `bzr tarball` to combine that with construction and compression in a checksum-safe way.
<persia> kamalmostafa: bzr isn't the bit that cares: it's dpkg-source (which is called by bzr builddeb).  You can just rename the file.
<kamalmostafa> persia: okay, I've caught up to where you were 15 minutes ago... I now also get unrepresentable changes (fr.gmo) when I try to build my source package against libtifiles2_1.1.2.orig.tar.gz.
<persia> Hmmm..  It doesn't seem to print any output with --split (based on upstream.py:285-298.  Is there somewhere else that prints output that I'm missing?
<persia> kamalmostafa: OK, so we can't upload that :)
<persia> kamalmostafa: If you know how to construct fr.gmo, delete it on clean, and construct it during the build.  This works around the issue.
<kamalmostafa> does it belong in the source package at all?
<persia> Due to a decision about how dpkg should work, we can't actually delete anything without breaking the tarball.
<persia> But since it's changed, and probably related to an intentional change to fr.po, we need to make sure it's reconstructed properly.
<kamalmostafa> yes, I do remember merging a change to fr.po
<kamalmostafa> okay, let me see what happens if I dispose of it in clean here.
<persia> Or alternately, we could just not change it.
<kamalmostafa> you mean leave out the fr.po change?
<persia> No, the fr.gmo change.
<persia> If it is overwritten on build, we can just use the one from upstream as a base.
<kamalmostafa> well let me see if just trashing it in clean lets it get rebuilt properly -- seems more the right thing to do, yes?
<persia> Try using the upstream one first, and make sure it gets trashed in the build.
<persia> That's a smaller diff.
<kamalmostafa> Oh wait... I think I tried something like this once before (actually maybe it *was* exactly this) and discovered that bzr won't let me commit changes to a binary file -- so I think its not possible to replace fr.gmo.   Yes?  No?
<persia> Right.
<persia> So, you just don't change it.
<kamalmostafa> back to the "trash it in clean" idea then?
<persia> There's lots of ways to do that, but from where you are now the easiest is probably to unpack the upstream tarball in another tree, and copy the upstream file into your working branch.
<persia> Ideally it won't come to delete-on-clean: let's keep that in reserve.
<kamalmostafa> you lost me... I have the "new" fr.gmo but I won't be able to bzr commit it.
<persia> Or at least, I'd do it that way: my preference is to strive for the smallest amount of packaging possible for a given source.
<duanedesign> hmm running the PackagingGuide/Recipes/PackageUpdate i am getting an error
<persia> OK.  What error, for what operation?
<duanedesign> is there a chance that the...oh hi persia
<persia> Yes :)
<duanedesign> debuild -S -sa
<kamalmostafa> persia: hmmm.  well, actually, it looks like bzr will let me commit such a change after all.  I've got a new libtifiles package built here, against the proper .orig -- I'll upload a new branch and we can continue with that.
<duanedesign> dpkg-source: warning: source directory 'brasero-0.6.1' is not <sourcepackage>-<upstreamversion> 'brasero-0.5.2'
<duanedesign> thats where it starts^^
<persia> duanedesign: I'm a bit confused.  My apt-cache shows brasero 2.29.90-0ubuntu1
<persia> Are you working on feisty?
<duanedesign> i was wondering if the problem might be the how-to might need to be updated
<persia> Oh, you're just following the commands in the guide directly?
<duanedesign> persia: yeah i am getting the sources from daniels people.ubuntu,com sftp site
<persia> Oh.  I think that's a waste of your time, but yeah, it probably needs an update.
<persia> I'm not the right person to do it though, because I'd drop all the references to any specific package.
<duanedesign> persia: ok. I think i understand the process though :)
<persia> But the issue you have is probably a lack of an orig.tar.gz file that you need, and some native packages.
<persia> Or else the guide is just completely wrong.
<persia> Personally, I just apply the old diff to the new upstream manually, and tweak.
<persia> And the VCS way to do it is with --import-upstream
<persia> Err, --merge-upstream
<duanedesign> ok. thank you
<lifeless> persia: bzr merge-stream (no --)
<persia> But it doesn't matter how you do it, really, as long as you retain the core packaging, review any patches to the source and rebase them, and use the new upstream.
<persia> lifeless: `bzr merge-upstream` ?
<lifeless> yes
<lifeless> bzr merge-upstream --version=xxx tarball path-to-upstream-release-branch-if-it-exists
<persia> `bzr merge-stream` would be really cool though, with some autodetection to determine if it was upstream or downstream, and appropriate handling of the patches, etc.
<lifeless> indeed
<persia> (although I suspect this would require that the package be Format: 3.0(bzr))
<lifeless> If you want to practice your python I can offer places to hook in.
<lifeless> persia: hell no:)
<RAOF> lifeless: It is immensely cool that bzr can store arbitrary stuff as revision properties.  The use of pristine-tar by bzr builddeb is wonderful.
<persia> lifeless: So, how does one know what to do with downstream stuff being merged?  Analyse the source package to determine a patch system, and make a best-effort application?
<lifeless> RAOF: :>
<lifeless> persia: I'm not sure I'm parsing that right. Can you elaborate
<persia> lifeless: So, if the package is Format: 3.0(bzr), we can easily handle merging of downstream patches with `bzr merge-stream` in a way that doesn't interfere with whatever we have defined as "upstream" within bzr (presumably something that lets us use pristine-tar).
<persia> If it's not Format: 3.0 (bzr), then we need some way to handle downstream patches in a safe manner, and I think that gets complex.
<persia> Because there are N patch standards, plus auto-patching with Format: 3.0 ({quilt,git,foo}
<lifeless> persia: I am missing something
<lifeless> how is a 'downstream' patch different to a patch
<wgrant> I don't particularly like the idea of 3.0 (bzr).
<lifeless> and why would merging a downstream patch be difficult
<persia> lifeless: The only way in which it differs is that we're extracting it from some artifact with `bzr merge-stream`
<persia> And it's trivial to merge in bzr, but it may be complex to merge in a source package.
<persia> wgrant: Any particular reason?  How is it less good than arbitrary Format: 3.0{!native} ?
<kamalmostafa> persia: FYI, new libtifiles branch is attached to bug 507741.  1. corrected the .orig.tar.gz discrepancy 2. refreshed fr.gmo.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 507741 in libtifiles "libtifiles failed to upload: conflicts with libtifiles2" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/507741
 * persia hopes this branch actually downloads, unlike the libticalcs one
<kamalmostafa> remember that you can just grab that diff from the "green text" there if you prefer that.
<persia> Right, but the "diff" is going to require binary patching to encode the differences in fr.gmo, which I'm not going to be able to apply with patch.
<wgrant> persia: At the point where we have everything in bzr, I don't think source packages should exist.
<kamalmostafa> ah yes -- fr.gmo is out to get us one way or another.  well I hope the bzr branch downloads too.
<persia> kamalmostafa: The bzr branch downloaded, but I still get the fr.gmo error.
<persia> kamalmostafa: Could you attach your working diff.gz to the bug?
<kamalmostafa> persia: done
<persia> wgrant: Well, that strongly depends on a definition of "we" :)  Making source packages not exist requires lots of coordination over lots and lots of people.
<lifeless> persia: I still don't get whats hard or likely to fail.
<lifeless> persia: you seem to be saying 'merge-upstream has trouble'
<lifeless> persia: I think I need you to step me through it, line by line if you like.
<wgrant> persia: Indeed. But we will within a few months be at a point where one needn't touch a source package any more.
<persia> lifeless: As I understand it, merge-upstream reads from some artifact, performs bzr merge between the current branch and changes from the artifact, and adds revision properties that would indicate that the merged branch included the upstream artifact.  Is this correct?
<persia> wgrant: Unless one works in Debian as well :)
<lifeless> by artifact, do you mean tarball ?
<persia> Could be a tarball, sure.
<persia> I'd hope it could work for a plaintext script, zip file, etc. as well.
<lifeless> no
<persia> (not that it does, but that the fact that it may not would be considered an absent feature)
<lifeless> it's /intent/ is 'uupdate'
<lifeless> its composed of smaller steps
<persia> Right.
<lifeless> but something that uupdate cannot conceptually do, neither can merge-upstream
<persia> I don't see any conceptual reason why uupdate couldn't handle a zip file or plaintext script if that was how the upstream data was delivered, and appropriate support was in dpkg.
<lifeless> so zip (maybe if we repack, or if debs could use zips)
<persia> But that's a side issue.  Lets talk about tarballs :)
<lifeless> I don't know what you mean by 'plaintext script'
<lifeless> if you mean self extracting uuencoded shell script... there is a hell.
<persia> Some python/perl/shell script
<lifeless> mmm, totally different proposition
<persia> But it doesn't matter.  let's talk about the subset of artifacts that are tarballs.
<lifeless> ok
<persia> Well, the difference between a file and a tarball contianing only that file is only some headers :)
<lifeless> so it imports the tarball onto a 'tarball branch' which is a magic branch carried around as tags by bzr-builddeb
<persia> Right.
<lifeless> it then does a normal merge[optionally an octopus merge] from that branch into your working tree
<lifeless> the import step is what adds the rev props
<duanedesign> persia: what is 'rebase' the patches?
<persia> OK.  So the order of steps was wrong, and the way it really works makes more sense, but the result is similar, right?
<lifeless> note that 'changes' isn't really a concept in bzr; its not a patch based system.
<persia> duanedesign: You might have a patch that applied to some previous file and that file was changed by upstream, so the patch might need to be adjusted to correctly apply to the changed upstream file.
<lifeless> persia: yes, though I worry about what freight you have on 'changes from the artifact'
<duanedesign> persia: ahhh, gotcha. Thanks again :)
<persia> lifeless: BY "changes from the artifact", I only mean that some set of files may differ between revisions of the tarball, and that the set of these changes is brought into the branch.
<lifeless> hmm, my firefox now has a tlh plugin
<persia> lifeless: So, if I release 1.0, and then I fix a bug, and release 1.1, that bugfix gets into the branch after bzr merge-upstream.
<lifeless> just need pitti/scott to do enough translating and we can surf in klingon ;)
<lifeless> persia: ok, sure.
<persia> Needs more support from webpage authors as well, and a good font :)
<lifeless> persia: needs unicode code points in fact
<persia> So, with bzr merge-stream, the source artifact may not be upstream.
<lifeless> kindof a pre-req for the font
<lifeless> persia: uhm, what do you mean by that
<persia> So we don't want to interfere with the magic "tarball branch", and we won't end up with a generated source package that would be based off the artifact from which we're merging.
<persia> lifeless: Consider the case that Mint has a source package including their differences somehow.  That might be sample downstream target.
<persia> Or 64Studio, or any other downstream.
<lifeless> why would you run merge-upstream then ?
<persia> You wouldn't.
<persia> I thought we were talking about how some new nifty `bzr merge-stream` might potentially work.
<lifeless> ok. What is the problem you want to solve w.r.t. mint or 64studio
<persia> merge-upstream seems to work great, as it.
<persia> s/it/is/
<lifeless> persia: I'd like merge-upstream to use watch files to find upstream tarballs.
<kamalmostafa> persia: was the diff.gz that I posted what you were looking for there?  I don't know what to make of the fr.gmo situation -- but its getting close to my bedtime.  :-)
<lifeless> which reminds me, I haven't filed that bug
<persia> kamalmostafa: It looks perfect, but I've been distracted, and haven't tested it yet :)  Pulling now.
<persia> lifeless: Rather than just using a watch file, it ought try first with debian/rules get-orig-source
<lifeless> persia: I thought watch files trumped, because some gos rules do an upstream export
<persia> lifeless: No, g-o-s trumps, because one can have a useful watch file for a source that needs to be cleaned to generate a dfsg tarball.
<lifeless> ah
<persia> kamalmostafa: Here's the sequence of commands I've used to construct a candidate package:  http://paste.ubuntu.com/380821/  Please confirm this matches the package you wish created.
<persia> kamalmostafa: Also, is there a reason this shouldn't be 1.1.2-0ubuntu1 ?
<persia> Oh, there is.  Ignore that last question :)
<kamalmostafa> persia: okay, yes, that looks good to me.
<kamalmostafa> persia: yes, it diff's clean to my working tree (+/- config.{sub,guess})
<persia> kamalmostafa: OK.  Now what you've produced seems *very* close to libtifiles 1.1.1-1, but much less close to libtifiles-1.1.2-0ubuntu1.  Are you sure you aren't patching away some of the upstream changes from 1.1.1 to 1.1.2?
<persia> kamalmostafa: Compare `lsdiff -z libtifiles_1.1.1-1.diff.gz` and `lsdiff -z libtifiles_1.1.2-0ubuntu2.diff.gz` : Is all that intentional?
<kamalmostafa> persia: I was sure of it 5 weeks ago!  ;-)   As I remember it, there really was only *one* actual source difference:  a char array[63] that changed to [64].   All the rest was due to automake 1.10 vs 1.10.1.
<persia> `lsdiff -z libtifiles2_1.1.2-0ubuntu1.diff.gz` is also small.
<persia> kamalmostafa: I'm just a bit confused, because the files changed in your diff.gz almost precisely match the set of files I see if I unpack the old and new tarballs, and run `diff -urN libtifiles2-1.1.1 libtifiles2-1.1.2`, except your patch changes all the upstream changes in 1.1.2 back to the 1.1.1 state.  Is this intended?
<kamalmostafa> Are all the "reverted" changes generated files from the automake 1.10.1 reconfiguration in libtifiles 1.1.2 perhaps?   All except for src/comments.c (the one real source change)?
<persia> Most of it looks like that.  It appears that substantive changes between 1.1.1 and 1.1.2 are Changelog, comments.c, README, fr.po, and tifiles.h
<kamalmostafa> Maybe I actually just cherry-picked the comments.c change (that was that one actual source change [63] to [64]) and fr.po (?) and applied that to 1.1.1 in order to minimize the diff from Debian.   tifiles.h diff was just an rcs comment date iirc.
<persia> OK.  If that's what you want to do, you want to base off the 1.1.1 tarball.  The issue there is that we already have a newer binary, so that will fail-to-upload.
<persia> I think you want to base off 1.1.2 because we already have that in Ubuntu, and try to get Debian updated.
<kamalmostafa> hmmm.  i thought that setting the version number of the new package (my 1.1.2-0ubuntu2) higher than any Debian or Ubuntu version was sufficient (ScottK also thought this was right).   not right?
<persia> It is sufficient, but in that case, you'll want to base off the 1.1.2 tarball.  I guess I just don't really like the idea of shipping a 1.1.2 tarball and patching it mostly back to 1.1.1 in terms of how this may be perceived by the authors of the software.
<persia> "We go to the trouble of making a new release, and Ubuntu undoes all our work!  Why!"
<persia> so, I'd want there to be a really good reason for this decision.
<kamalmostafa> the only work we're "undoing" is automake...  we've carefully retrofitted the one upstream source change.  but you're right that there's no reason why we couldn't base off of 1.1.2 except that we'd then have a big diff from Debian.  If that's not a problem, then lets do that.
<kamalmostafa> (lets base off of 1.1.2)
<kamalmostafa> I agree that there's no "good reason" for such a decision
<persia> kamalmostafa: OK.  So, if I'm understanding the workflow properly, you'll want to do something like the following:
<persia> 1) branch libtifiles, 2) copy the libtifiles2 tarball to the right name, 3) bzr merge-upstream the copied tarball, 4) apply your changes, 5) create a source, etc.
<kamalmostafa> I haven't used "bzr merge-upstream" before, but will investigate it.  I'll let you know if I find myself diverging from that workflow.
<persia> kamalmostafa: I'm very much not an expert on that workflow, so you may want to ask others for better guidance.  I'd just untar the new tarball, apply the packaging from Debian, apply the Ubuntu changes I wanted to preserve, and create a source.
<persia> But this is probably more complicated in the details :)
<kamalmostafa> persia: okay, I think that I have a *much* better understanding of the whole situation than I did 3 hours ago (and certainly much much better than when I first did this work) -- so I think I can probably have another go at it at this point.  But it'll have to wait until tomorrow night, as I'll be busy tomorrow day.
<persia> kamalmostafa: OK.  I'll clear out my local mess.  Just resubscribe the sponsors when you have something ready.  I'll recommend providing some instruction as to how to get the tarball for the sponsor: no matter what workflow they use, the trick of grabbing the libtifiles2 source tarball is going to be non-obvious.
<persia> Oh, and you probably want to detach any branches that don't work, and delete any attachments that don't work :)
<persia> (and cancel any pending merge proposals, etc.)
<kamalmostafa> persia: very good.  thanks, as always, for all your help.  I'll go clean up the LP branches before heading off to bed.  :-)
<persia> Have a good night.
<persia> bdmurray: Just out of curiosity, why did "Ubuntu Reviewers Team" get unsubscribed from bug #524043?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 524043 in graphviz-cairo "dotedit is meaningless in menu; wastes space and misleads people" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/524043
 * persia is currently fixing it, but it seems to clearly be a patch in need of review, rather than a candidate in need of sponsoring
<persia> bdmurray: The same is true for bug #393212
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 393212 in cowsay "cowsay miscalculates length of multibyte-UTF-8-characters" [Low,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/393212
<randomaction> actually, why are sponsors subscribed to bugs with patches, as opposed to debdiffs?
 * persia ignores that one for now, it not actually fixing the bug.
<persia> randomaction: I claim they shouldn't be.
<persia> My assertion is that a patch needs attention by developers doing code review, and sponsoring is only for developers needing to upload stuff to which they have not (yet) been granted upload rights.
<randomaction> I would expect the patches review team to convert patches into debdiffs prior to subscribing sponsors.
<persia> And that patch review ought be about trying to get the best working patch into a package, whereas sponsoring ought be about making sure the sponsorees understand Ubuntu processes and have good practices at integrating code changes.
<persia> Indeed, or, as is the case here, I'd expect a developer with upload rights to just upload if they found a patch they thought was suitable for upload.
<persia> Someone who can upload finding a patch and confirming it works and then subscribing another team to upload it without making a candidate is just shifting work around whlst not accomplishing anything.
<persia> Seems not much harder to run dput than to fiddle subscriptions if a patch has been tested.
<persia> OK.  sponsors queue now down to one bug I don't understand well enough to be able to confirm the solution, and one that isn't sponsorable and annoys me.
<persia> If anyone has familiarity with git-buildpackage, bug #525116 would benefit from inspection
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 525116 in git-buildpackage "please merge git-buildpackage 0.4.65 from Debian unstable (full patch included)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/525116
<randomaction> I think this needs attention from the release team
<persia> Oh, those are all new features, aren't they.
<randomaction> I'd definitely call dpkgv3 support a feature
<randomaction> by the way, is unsubscribing u-u-s ok while the package is waiting for FFe?
<persia> I think so, as long as you leave a comment in the bug inviting it to be resubscribed to the sponsorship queue when the FFe has been approved.
<persia> People get really annoyed when they get an approval, and it doesn't get uploaded, but most of the release team won't both approve and upload in the spirit of peer-review.
<randomaction> ok, I'll take care of this bug (looks like ubuntu-sru was subscribed by mistake)
<persia> Cool, which just leaves the messy cowsay bug, which I'm sorely tempted to just assign to bdmurray (except this would violate the assignment guidelines)
<crimsun> it totally doesn't make sense to assign yet another team just because there isn't a debdiff there
<crimsun> you've upload privileges because you know how to do it
<persia> Indeed.
<persia> But the patch author doesn't deserve to see us complaining to each other about workflow in the bug log.
<persia> And the patch doesn't actually completely fix the issue, either, which makes just uploading it less interesting.
<persia> (or at least that is what is claimed by the developer who didn't upload)
<randomaction> Looks like most or all of "- branch" entries in the sponsoring list are for universe as well.
<persia> Which list?  I think I'm looking at something different than you.
<randomaction> http://qa.ubuntu.com/reports/sponsoring/
<persia> I believe '-' indicates it's not in any packageset, although I could be mistaken.  It ought be worth updating the code to add "MOTU" when there isn't any other packageset.
<persia> This helps define our new role better, and also highlights any packages where either the packageset detection has failed, or we ought have upload access.
<persia> Anyone know anything about KDE .la files?  I'm not sure whether the patch in bug #290304 should be uploaded.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 290304 in skim "Skim has no KMenu icon" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/290304
<persia> Not that anyone seems lively, but I'm getting "error: 'NULL' undeclared here (not in a function)" for http://paste.ubuntu.com/380869/ and have no idea how to address that.  Hints welcome :)
<lifeless> its not a built in in C++ IIRC
<lifeless> need to include the right header
<lifeless> or maybe thats C. either way ;)
<persia> That's supposed to be C.
<persia> So just including headers should do it?
<jariq> jj
<persia> (this explains why it built in feisty, which was the last time this package was uploaded)
<lifeless> wag
<lifeless> but yes
<persia> No, it makes sense.  The toolchain used to automatically include nested headers back then.
<randomaction> for C, stdlib.h
<jariq> Is there something like PPA for debian?
<persia> jariq: Lots of them, actually, but no "official" one.
<jariq> persia: Can you please give me link to any? I am having trouble to create pbuilder environment for sid so I would like to test my package somewhere else..
<persia> jariq: Sorry: I don't know of any that have open joining policies offhand.
<Rirto6> hi
<Rirto6> Could you recommend a good example of what a MakeFile should look like?
<jariq> Rirto6: it is project dependand but it is a good practice to put clean distclean install a uninstall targets into makefile
<persia> Rirto6: It really depends on what you're trying to accomplish.  My current favorite is: "#! /usr/bin/make -f\n%:\n\tdh $@\n"
<Rirto6> hmm
<Rirto6> I'm just looking for a simple makefile which copies a file over to a specific location
<persia> OK.  How are you planning to use this makefile?  If you're packaging something, you probably don't need it.
<Rirto6> It's Java, so no compilation is necessary. However it seems I need a MakeFile to create dpkg
<Rirto6> .deb
<persia> No you don't.
<Rirto6> persia: Okay!
<Rirto6> That saved me some time
<Rirto6> Now to find a good rules file for Java apps
<Rirto6> ...
<persia> /usr/share/doc/debhelper/examples/rules.tiny
<Rirto6> Thanks
 * Rirto6 goes to get red liquorice
<persia> A few idle notes: 1) #ubuntu-java may be as good a place for the discussion, 2) We do recompile all the Java applications in Ubuntu, and 3) If you have Java source, you probably want to be using ant rather than make anyway.
 * Rirto6 is back with red liquorice, juice, toothbrush & toothpaste
<Rirto6> persia: Thanks, wasn't aware of that channel
<dan4dm> hi - lintian stuff, I'm getting "debian-watch-file-in-native-package" but the package is not 'native' - the .orig.tar.gz has no watch file in it - any suggestions?
<azeem_> dan4dm: pastebin the content of your .changes
<dan4dm> http://pastebin.ca/1804500
<azeem_> Â ccf91f882822ff25da008988784247c4c4ef178c 8579903 supercollider_3.3.1-0ubuntu1~karmic1.tar.gz
<azeem_> no .orig.tar.gz
<persia> dan4dm: You've seen artfwo's packages on REVU?
<dan4dm> persia: recent ones? i saw them a while back, just updating the packaging to the latest upstream
<persia> dan4dm: OK.  You might want to collaborate there: I know a bunch of packaging there is in fairly good shape (and recently commented on what I think are the remaining bits to hit)
<persia> http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/supercollider
<dan4dm> azeem_: ah thanks. i have an .orig.tar.gz but its name doesn't quite match
<persia> 3.3.1 is better than 3.3.0, but :)
<dan4dm> persia: great, thanks for the comments, will contact artfwo
<persia> dan4dm: It's looking closer than I've seen it in a very long time :)  I hope to see it back in the repositories soon.
<dan4dm> persia: yes! the recent version supports amd64 properly (no 32libs) too
<persia> dan4dm: Really?  The data structure was changed?
 * persia considers getting up to dance about
<dan4dm> persia: yes. someone (not me) did a nice job of abstracting the sclang access and providing 32 and 64 -bit implementations under the hood
<persia> That's very exciting!
 * sebner looks what supercollider is and why persia is so excited about it :)
<dan4dm> BTW for that minus-sign issue, is it easy to grep for the offending characters? I see some \- in front of args maybe it's fixed
<persia> dan4dm: I usually let lintian check for me, but if there are some \- and \(hy, it may be fixed.
<persia> Some of that comes from code generators, and more and more of those are getting fixed.
<randomaction> dan4dm: lintian gives file name and line number
<dan4dm> artfwo: fancy seeing you here!
 * dan4dm was just chatting about supercollider deb
<artfwo> hi! :)
<artfwo> xchat freaks out when you're performing a /me action
<Rirto6> No it doesn't!
<Rirto6> Upgrade to latest version :P
 * dan4dm freaks folks out
<artfwo> I'm using the one available in lucid repositories
<artfwo> I hope it's the latest
<artfwo> yet I can't see what dan4dm is doing when he uses /me :)
 * dan4dm insults artfwo's family
<persia> !ohmy
<ubottu> Please remember that all Ubuntu IRC channels share the same attitude of providing friendly and polite interaction with all users of all ages and cultures. Basically, this means no foul language and no abuse towards others.
<artfwo> This time it showed: * dan4dm insults artfwo's family
<persia> It's always when one thinks one is safe that one gets caught :)
<persia> Anyway, about supercollider.
<persia> So, 3.3.0 *finally* got to the top of the REVU queue, and 3.3.1 is out, and both of you have been working on it in different ways.
<persia> So, where do we go from here?
<artfwo> aren't we past the feature freeze already?
<Rirto6> 3.3.2
<persia> artfwo: We are, but squeeze hasn't frozen, so it can go there (since it obviously has a dedicated maintainer, even out-of-archive)
<persia> And then we'll sync, and no more REVU madness :)
<dan4dm> ok well the situation is 3.3.1 is out, the sc devs are thinking about putting out 3.3.2 (which is what will have the proper 64-bit support),  ...
<artfwo> that's good
<artfwo> (dan4dm, I haven't followed the mailing lists for the last month)
<dan4dm> ... and artfwo and me are both working on the deb stuff but not exactly out-of-sync since we both work from the deb stuff stored upstream
<artfwo> yep
<artfwo> there are still a couple of unresolved issues
<artfwo> most notably lib-without-soname
<artfwo> brb
<persia> There's an easy way around that one: declare it a private lib, and stick it in a private namespace.
<persia> MInd you, nothing else will be able to compile against it, but ...
<persia> (of course, having a SONAME would be better)
<dan4dm> ok for the REVU process, is it best to wait until 3.3.2 is out, or upload an improved packaging of 3.3.1?
<dan4dm> no wait
<dan4dm> is it best to wait until 3.3.2 is out, or upload an improved package based on a dev snapshot?
<persia> dan4dm: Unless something is unexpected, the packaging and upstream should be separable to some degree, so may as well upload 3.3.1 to REVU (or even 3.3.0) with improved packaging, and get that right, independently of the upstream work.
<persia> Then, when 3.3.2 comes out, revalidate it against the then-perfect packaging, and get it into a repo.
<persia> (either squeeze or lucid+1, depending on the timeframe)
<dan4dm> persia: ok though the packaging code i'm tweaking right now isn't quite applicable to 3.3.1 because of the new 64bittability
<dan4dm> i'm aiming to put a supercollider dev snapshot on my ppa
<persia> dan4dm: My memory was that it FTBFS on amd64 with the older ones: as long as you don't mind the build-failure, just go ahead.
<persia> Once 3.3.2 is available, amd64 will magically build.
<persia> The only folk not supported will be those that wanted to run 64-bit server and 32-bit client (or was it the other way about).
<artfwo> persia, how do we declare a private lib?
<dan4dm> artfwo: i think probably best to jsut set the soname
<dan4dm> i'm working on that right now
<artfwo> ah, then almost everything is set
<artfwo> dan4dm, do you have the latest packaging tweaks in svn?
<dan4dm> artfwo: no not yet, i've done some stuff in the past hour that i'll commit once it works ;)
<artfwo> okay, I'll update my local copy then and try building it here
<artfwo> persia, once we have resolved the issues you've mentioned in REVU, how do we push supercollider in squeeze?
<persia> artfwo: I'd file an ITP, close it with a changelog entry, and send an RFS to the debian-multimedia team.
<artfwo> doesn't it have to go through debian-mentors webiste?
<artfwo> *website
<persia> No, nothing does.
<persia> That's just a convenient place to upload a package for review.
<persia> Similar to REVU in many ways.
<artfwo> but we have to host the package somewhere
<persia> Right, so if you don't want to host it, mentors.debian.net will host it for you :)
<artfwo> REVU is nice, because it has semi-automatic copyright checker etc., I just wonder is it okay to point the ITP to a REVU package
<persia> Should be OK, as long as you set up the package for Debian (-1 rather than -0ubuntu1, real maintainer, etc.)
<persia> But that "copyright checker" is just running licensecheck.  You can do that locally.
<AnAnt> Hello, where does pbuilder-dist put the base.tgz, aptcache & result ?
<AnAnt> for a distro X
<dan4dm> AnAnt: oh it's somewhere like /var/lib/pbuilder/cache isn't it? (IIRC)
<geser> AnAnt: ~/pbuilder
<AnAnt> geser: ~/pbuilder/X ?
<dan4dm> oh /var/cache/pbuilder i see on mine
<AnAnt> geser: or does it put the base.tgz, result & aptcache in same dir for all distros ?
<geser> dan4dm: depends if you use pbuilder or pbuilder-dist
<dan4dm> geser: ok thanks i'll pipe down
<geser> AnAnt: one moment, looking at the source
<geser> yes, all should be below ~/pbuilder
<AnAnt> hmmm, ok
<AnAnt> ~/pbuilder/X_....
<Laney> james_w or StevenK: Could you run these syncs: http://pastebin.com/d3d5046e7 ?
<persia> Laney: You might find https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ArchiveAdministration#Archive%20days a handy reference when finding someone to poke.
<persia> Nobody is ArchiveAdmin on Sundays (although sometimes people do stuff out of turn)
<Laney> persia: yes, that's why I was pinging
<persia> heh.  I guess you might be lucky :)
<persia> Although the rest of the listed archive-admins (excepting al-maisan) are all also in the channel :)
<Laney> those are ones to have offered me help with the Haskell transition
<persia> Ah.  It all makes sense now :)
<james_w> Laney: the release team is happy with this?
<Laney> james_w: I informed them, and there were no complaints ;-)
<Laney> http://orangesquash.org.uk/~laney/graph.png this is the world atm
<james_w> on it
<james_w> whoah
<Laney> oh, I missed haskell-hlist from the list
<james_w> unstable?
<Laney> yes please
<Laney> did I get the syntax right?
<Laney> it doesn't say my LP ID anywhere
<james_w> I added that
<AnAnt> Laney: they still don't use dh7 in haskell ?
<Laney> no
<AnAnt> ok
<james_w> Laney: ldap-haskell is modified
<Laney> oh, yes. Please override that
<james_w> Laney: INCOMING!
<Laney> hoorah!
 * Laney high fives james_w 
<Laney> the next round should be a bit bigger
<Laney> there's also a removal in 524987 if you feel like it
 * james_w goes strangely quiet
 * Laney notices his LP mailbox bulging
 * Laney runs
<shadeslayer> Laney: theres a LP mailbox too?
<shadeslayer> (i bet its really exclusive)
<Laney> shadeslayer: no, not like that
<shadeslayer> Laney: then? by LP i assume you mean Launchpad :)
<Laney> of course
<persia> shadeslayer: Massive volumes of mail flowing from an overabundance of bug subscriptions, package subscriptions, build subscriptions, etc. through a filter into some bucket.
<shadeslayer> persia: oh i have that too :P
<persia> Not exclusive at all :)
<shadeslayer> like 5-6 ML's and one of them is the kubuntu bugs ml and the regular mail :D
<persia> Oh, I was thining even without mailing lists.  Adding mailing lists makes it even more.
<shadeslayer> :)
<james_w> Laney: still around?
<Laney> yeah
<james_w> I'm looking at the mono-tools merge
<james_w> -debian/tmp/usr/share/applications/mprof*
<james_w> is that part of the xsp changes?
<Laney> do you have a bug number?
<Laney> I think that I did this some time ago
<james_w> bug 516260
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 516260 in mono-tools "Merge mono-tools 2.4.3-2 from Debian testing" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/516260
<Laney> let's see
<Laney> james_w: is that from a binary debdiff?
<james_w> no
<james_w> source
<james_w> http://paste.ubuntu.com/380999/
 * Laney just looked at the bzr diff
<james_w> yeah, that's what I'm working from
<Laney> oh
<Laney> james_w: that's an upload which was done since my merge
<james_w> ah
<Laney> I dunno what it is
<Laney> let's see
<james_w>   * debian/mono-profiler.install: Don't install .desktop file for mprof-
<james_w>     heap-viewer. The binary name is incorrect and it requires an input file.
<james_w>     anyway and so must be run from the command line (closes LP: #406909).
 * james_w edits the changelog
<Laney> sounds reasonable
 * Laney checks that debian has it
<ari-tczew> \sh: ping
<bdrung> \o/ the universe sponsor queue is now empty again \o/
<lightnin> highvoltage: Hello
<highvoltage> hi lightnin
<highvoltage> bdrung: \o/!
<lightnin> highvoltage: Hiya. Do you know if scratch made it in time? I haven't heard anything.
<highvoltage> lightnin: it's not in the archive yet, might be because it's weekend, might be because we didn't make it in timme for FF
<bdrung> highvoltage: the main sponsor queue is a mess. 122 items: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.searchtext=&orderby=-importance&search=Search&assignee_option=any&field.assignee=&field.bug_reporter=&field.bug_supervisor=&field.bug_commenter=&field.subscriber=ubuntu-main-sponsors&field.component-empty-marker=1&field.status_upstream-empty-marker=1&field.omit_dupes.used=&field.omit_dupes=on&field.has_patch.used=&field.has_cve.used=&field.aff
<bdrung> ects_me.used=&field.tag=&field.tags_combinator=ANY&field.has_no_package.used=
<highvoltage> lightnin: the topix still doesn't show we're in FF so I'm hoping we'll see it in tomorrow
<lightnin> highvoltage: Ah - thanks! :)
<persia> bdrung: Go complain to the slackers in ubuntu-devel :)
<highvoltage> bdrung: yes hopefully the archive re-org is going to make that better someday! :)
<persia> lightnin: scratch is in the source NEW queue (https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/lucid/+queue?queue_state=0&queue_text=scratch) It likely needs a FeatureFreeze exception to get it out.
<persia> !ffe
<ubottu> uvf is Upstream Version Freeze.  For an exception, see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess
<persia> (UVF is no more: someone should update the factoid)
<bdrung> highvoltage: i doubt that
<lightnin> persia: interesting- on that page the component is listed as "universe", not "multiverse"
<persia> lightnin: Everything is universe by default.  An actual component is assigned by the archive-admins on acceptance.
<Laney> !learn ffe is Feature Freeze
<Laney> erm, oops
<Laney> !learn ffe is Feature Freeze. For an exception, see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess
<Laney> !learn ffe is Feature Freeze Exception. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess for the freeze exception process.
 * Laney pretends that didn't happen
<lightnin> persia: Ah, thanks.
<lightnin> persia: btw - still planning on releasing that source tarball soon, and then submitting to Debian. :)  But Mako and I were hoping to slip by and get into Lucid so we reworked a bunch of stuff on Friday.
<dan4dm> artfwo: supercollider deb tweaks now in svn. mostly i was fixing paths and lintian complaints, not done many of persia's items yet. build in my ppa https://launchpad.net/~danstowell/+archive/ppa/ builds ok, not tried running yet
<artfwo> dan4dm, thanks, will check this asap
<dan4dm> persia: re "supercollider-common-dev probably has overambitious dependencies" - would you say that since that package is just headers etc, all of "libc6-dev, libstdc++6-4.4-dev | libstdc++-dev, libsndfile1-dev" can be simply dropped? i see the logic i think
<dan4dm> artfwo: you're the inventor of sced are you? i forget... if so, maybe i can leave the add-copyright-info-to-sced issue to you
<dan4dm> what's the relationship between .menu files and .desktop files? should always have both?
<dan4dm> my perception is that .desktop spec supercedes .menu in some sense, tho i may be wrong
<sebner> iulian: thx for the ACK, up for another one? ;)
<iulian> sebner: Sure.
<iulian> Bug#?
<iulian> Hey sistpoty.
<sebner> iulian: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/bleachbit/+bug/525376
<sistpoty> hi iulian
<sistpoty> huhu sebner
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 525376 in bleachbit "[FFe] Please sync bleachbit 0.7.3-1 from Debian(Unstable)" [Wishlist,New]
 * sebner huhus sistpoty and makes him his FFe ACK slave ;D
<sistpoty> heh
<sistpoty> cody-somerville, jdong, cjwatson, slangasek: SRU bug #463019
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 463019 in gtk-recordmydesktop "recordmydesktop does not record frames properly in karmic" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/463019
<geser> dan4dm: you can probably drop libc6-dev and those libstdc++*-dev (as those are part of build-essential), but need to keep libsndfile1-dev if a .h file includes a .h file from it or libsndfile is mentioned in .la or .pc files
<sebner> sistpoty: pfff, you are naive ... it's sunday :)
<sebner> huhu geser :)
<geser> Hi sebner
<geser> dan4dm: .menu is for the Debian menu while .desktop is for the Freedesktop menu which is used by Ubuntu
<dan4dm> geser: that makes sense, thanks. so would i add build-essential as a dep? i know in many cases we can assume it, but not always surely?
<geser> dan4dm: no, it's expected that someone who wants to build something has build-essential (or its dependencies) installed
<dan4dm> geser: k thanks
<geser> dan4dm: "Build-dependencies on "build-essential" binary packages can be omitted." http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-relationships.html#s-sourcebinarydeps
<geser> and also http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-source.html#s-pkg-relations
<dan4dm> geser: it's not a build-dependency though. but if that's the way it's done then that's fine
<geser> dan4dm: right, but the most common use case for a -dev package is to be used as a build-dependency for other packages
<dan4dm> geser: k thanks
<iulian> sebner: Do we really want that version in Lucid?  There are only two changes that are for us, the other changes are specific to Windows.
<fabounet> Hi BlackZ, did you have time to upload Cairo-Dock ?
<iulian> DktrKranz: ^ Do you think it's worth getting bleachbit 0.7.3-1 into Lucid?
<sebner> iulian: FF is pretty fresh and I like the TB support so I don't really see a reason denying
<sebner> DktrKranz: yes, tell us .. what do you think! ;)
<Laney> james_w: did you forget to upload mono-tools/
<jdong> sistpoty: ACKed
<sistpoty> jdong: thanks!
<jdong> sure thing!
<kamalmostafa> persia: fyi, a new cut of libtifiles is ready for review at bug 507741 (attached branch).  I did enjoy bzr merge-upstream" btw -- worked like a charm!  shall I assign to you, or to nobody and u-u-s?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 507741 in libtifiles "libtifiles failed to upload: conflicts with libtifiles2" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/507741
<DktrKranz> iulian: changes are limited to thunderbird cleaner, which is one of the widest app used, so I think it's fine having it in.
<james_w> Laney: network failure
<Laney> alright
<james_w> done now
<james_w> kamalmostafa: hey
<james_w> kamalmostafa: that merge proposal you just made, did you want two reviews done, or just one?
<kamalmostafa> james_w: hiya
<kamalmostafa> um... persia and I worked on it extensively last night, so I would be happy if he took at look at it in particular (but you're most welcome to look at it also)
<james_w> kamalmostafa: I think there may be a bug lurking here, so I'm interested in your intent
<james_w> you clearly wanted to request a review from persia, but did you want a second review, or did you just do it the way that seemed obvious/seemed to be the only option
<kamalmostafa> james_w: I just did what seemed obvious -- I clicked "Propose for Merge", then clicked "Add a reviewer" in order to specially 'notify' persia that I would like him to look at it.
<james_w> kamalmostafa: were you aware that you could have requested the review from persia as you filed the request, hence only requesting a single review?
<quadrispro> hello folks
<kamalmostafa> james_w: no, I wasn't aware of that at all.  tell you what -- I'll start doing another merge proposal (but not complete it) and see if how hard it is for me to find the "single review" thing you're talking about -- and I'll get back to you -- but I need to leave immediately, so it'll have to wait until later.  good?
<james_w> kamalmostafa: I think I have enough for the bug report already, thanks for the help
<kamalmostafa> james_w: very good.  see ya.
<iulian> DktrKranz: Alrighty.  Thank you for the info.
<sebner> iulian: ;)
<iulian> sebner: Acked.
<sebner> iulian: thx :)
<hggdh> kklimonda: here
<kklimonda> We'd like to get another opinion about what to do with anjal in lucid
<kklimonda> currently we have an "ancient version" and the sync was requested to get 0.1 from debian experimental but 0.3.1 got synced instead which won't build with evo/eds 2.28.x
<hggdh> and we will not have anything but evo 2.28 in Lucid
<kklimonda> now we could either cancel this upload and update package to 0.1 or remove anjal from lucid completely
<Laney> just upload the old version
<kklimonda> Laney: and who's going to support it?
<hggdh> Laney: what is the advantage of providing a version that is not supported upstgream anymore?
<Laney> the advantage of providing something over nothing
<hggdh> I would rather go for a PPA with anjal and required evo libraries
<hggdh> and no support?
<Laney> who says?
<Laney> if that sync had been for the correct version, would we be removing it right now?
 * Laney thinks not
<hggdh> kklimonda: ah well. There you go. We will keep, then, anjal 0.1, and no support.
<Laney> i'm just giving a point of view
<Laney> you can do otherwise if you like
<hggdh> Laney: we would rather have a consensus. We do not right now, so we keep with what sould otherwise be done
<hggdh> s/sould/would/
<kklimonda> Laney: I see two problems - if we keep 0.1 we may get emails from developer who's getting reports from people using an outdated version of his software. Or we'll get report from people who are using an outdated version of anjal and who are surprised that it's so outdated.
<kklimonda> of course we may not get any complains at all
<kklimonda> I don't see the reason for shipping software just for the sake of shipping it - we are not debian after all ;)
<pochu> kklimonda: Debian actively removes software that is RC buggy
<kklimonda> pochu: I know, I was just trying to make a joke. Probably shouldn't :)
<pochu> kklimonda: oh, that's the bad thing of IRC, it's harder to get the sarcasm :)
<kklimonda> exactly why I should stop doing that :)
<pochu> why will Lucid ship evo 2.28 and not 2.30?
<dupondje> 2.30 normally no ?
<pochu> yeah 2.30 would be the normal thing, but they may have decided to ship 2.28 if 2.30 is too buggy or whatever
<james_w> I believe 2.30 is too much of a rewrite
<james_w> with evolution not known for it's stability across versions
<pochu> yeah, they have ported it away from various deprecated libraries
<kkszysiu> any people from Poland there?
<dan4dm> hi - REVU question, i have made new debs for supercollider but the stuff on http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/supercollider was uploaded by someone else. do i have a way to add files to that, or do i make a separate upload? actually i'm new to REVU and don't see where i upload the packages at all
<geser> dan4dm: what about contact the other uploader and talk about cooperation?
<ari-tczew> I've got installed lucid. Can I build packages for other releases using pbuilder?
<azeem_> yes
<ari-tczew> do I need to do any changes?
<dan4dm> geser: yes no problem collaborating with him, fine. just thought i could add updated code myself. is it best if one person remains as champion?
<crimsun> ari-tczew: changes from what to what?
<ari-tczew> crimsun: changes needed to able building for other releases like dapper, hardy, intrepid, jaunty, karmic (security updates and sru)
<crimsun> ari-tczew: well, it depends what you're modifying, of course
<crimsun> ari-tczew: (i.e., I don't know whether you're referring to pbuilderrc or the source packages)
<ari-tczew> @ pbuilderrc
<ari-tczew> crimsun: I'm only adding patches, nothing changed in debian/control or rules
<crimsun> ari-tczew: presuming you're using something like pbuilder-dist, no, nothing to really change. It's worth noting that you probably will want to add $release-updates, however.
<ari-tczew> thanks
<randomaction> does OCaml transition have some special approval from the release team? I mean, does jocaml need a normal FFe (bug 522358)?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 522358 in hevea "[OCaml 3.11.2 transition][round 2/6] Please synchronize packages involved in OCaml transition from Debian sid to lucid" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/522358
<geser> dan4dm: your upload would override the previous one and it would be better if the previous uploader knows about it instead of starting an upload war or similar
<geser> randomaction: don't know yet, I only asked about the timing of the OCaml transition and slangasek told me that we could start it and it shouldn't be no problem to get FFes if necessary
<slangasek> geser, randomaction: if the change is only to get it built against the new ocaml, that's a bugfix and needs no exception; if there are other feature changes included in the Debian version you're asking to sync, those still need to go through the usual FFe process
<randomaction> the latter is the case here, so I'll tell the guy about the FFe process
<dan4dm> geser: ok that makes sense, thanks for that detail. have emailed artfwo about my packages
<ari-tczew> \sh: ping
<persia> dan4dm: There's no need to depend on anything in Priority: essential, nor any of the dependencies of build-essential for -dev packages.
<zooko> Ugh. Trying to finish Tahoe-LAFS v1.6.1 today. Running out of time.
<ripps> Gmpc in the gmpc-trunk ppa installs alot of image files these days, so I was thinking of adding a gmpc-data package to save building time. Can simply move everything in /usr/share/* to it?
<persia> ripps: You need to exercise a bit of care: there's some stuff that policy mandates should be in the base package (e.g. /usr/share/doc/)
<persia> ripps: But lintian should help you catch anything: try it that way first.
<ripps> persia: Yeah, I thought that dh7 would automatically make sure things like that were installed in the proper package
<persia> ripps: It will try, but it's always possible to confuse it :)
<ripps> persia: things like .mo locale files are arch-independent, correct?
<persia> I'm actually not sure.  I know they are compiled, but I don't know if the compilation differs between different architectures.
#ubuntu-motu 2011-02-14
<kklimonda> tumbleweed: what tests did fail when you were packagng eventlet? I've just tried 0.9.14, and all pass (or are skipped) on both natty and sid pbuilders.
<c2tarun> can anyone please explain me this error http://paste.ubuntu.com/566833/
<micahg> c2tarun : the problem is probably the line above that
<c2tarun> micahg: http://paste.ubuntu.com/566834/
<c2tarun> micahg: here are the lines above that error ^^
<micahg> c2tarun: nope
<c2tarun> micahg: you mean more lines?
<micahg> c2tarun: yeah, until there's a line with error in it
<persia> That comes when the linker can't find the things to link against.  Might be libraries not installed, or not referenced by the linker.  Might be API changes.  Might be bugs.
<c2tarun> micahg: ya i found the line with error http://paste.ubuntu.com/566835/
<persia> Most common cause is the order of arguments to the linker: you need to add anything linked against before the thing linking against.  This is new behaviour with the recent toolchain, so it's not surprising if some older buildsystems fail.
<c2tarun> persia: are you explaining my error?
<micahg> c2tarun: you might want to move either -lssl or -lcrypto before the bacula libs
<c2tarun> micahg: in rules file right?
<micahg> c2tarun: depends on the package, usually in configure of some sort
<c2tarun> micahg: actually I am not able to understand the error. Can you please explain a bit.
<micahg> c2tarun: you might want to read this: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NattyNarwhal/ToolchainTransition, looks like an --as-needed issue
<c2tarun> micahg: ok, sure :) i'll read it. thanks
<c2tarun> micahg: in the wiki page you gave me they used dpkg -S to search which package contains the particular library. I tried in manual pages but I think there is no information about -S can you please tell why we use -S
<Flannel> c2tarun: dpkg -S in man dpkg is right above OPTIONS (dpkg-query portion), `man dpkg-query` gives you the normal paragraph stuff for -S
<c2tarun> I am getting an error while building binary package, the error is due to some libraries are not directly linked. But I dont know which libraries. How can i find? I tried "dpkg -S TLSv1_method" but got an error that method not found.
<c2tarun> ping
<arand> c2tarun: If you are looking for a specific file, apt-file might be of help.
<c2tarun> arand: here is the error I am getting http://paste.ubuntu.com/566845/
<c2tarun> arand: as we can see that the library libbac.so is trying to use method TLSv1_method. So I have to link the library containing TL* method. but I dont know which lib contains it and where do I put the name of that library in order to link it.
<micahg> c2tarun: it's probably ssl or crypto
<micahg> c2tarun: dpkg -S is when you're looking for a library that's not on the linker line, in this case, I believe you have the library, just not in the correct order
<c2tarun> micahg: ok, so from where can i access the order ? I mean which file is responsible for this?
<micahg> c2tarun: usually configure
<persia> Although it can vary wildly based on the buildsystem: it's often good to examine the logs and see what command has the order, and then backtrack through the variable substitutions.
<c2tarun> persia: where can I find the log files, you just mentioned? ^^
<persia> Your build logs?  Depends how you build it.  There's usually a .build file that is the log or a symlink to the log.
<c2tarun> persia: I build it using pbuilder-dist natty build *.dsc.
<micahg> last_operation.log in pbuider
<micahg> err, pbuilder-dist
<c2tarun> micahg: last_operation.log just tells me that error occured while compiling btape.c but didn't tell from where the command is issued, I mean from which file
<c2tarun> whereas source.build file is kind of a log for creating source package, but not binary package.
<persia> c2tarun, That file will contain some command that had an error.  This command will have been generated by whatever build system the source uses.
<persia> In most cases, the actual command is the result of variable substitution, so you have to backtrack through the various build files from the one that generated the command that had the error to the one that controls how that appears.
<persia> At some point, you'll get back to the files that are available in the source package, and you can modify the appropriate file.
<c2tarun> persia: here is the beginning of error http://paste.ubuntu.com/566849/ I am not getting how to backtrack.
<persia> Look through the buildsystem files to find out what is calling libtool.
<persia> Then look through the buildsystem files to find out what is controlling how libtool is called.
<c2tarun> I am sorry but what do you mean by buildsystem files?
<persia> Then continue until you get to the place you need to change.
<persia> makefiles, cmakefiles, setup.py files, Makefile.PL files, perhaps shell scripts, autotools files, whatever.  It entirely depends on how your source generates binaries.
<c2tarun> persia: ok
<dholbach> good morning
<c2tarun> dholbach: good morning :)
<dholbach> hi c2tarun
<c2tarun> dholbach: hi :)
<micahg> should we be building with -Werror?
<tumbleweed> that will cause issues with all upstream packages that don't take their warnings seriously
<micahg> well, I'm looking at blobwars, and upstream doesn't see to like to deal with the return value of fread
<micahg> s/see/seem
<micahg> tumbleweed: would it be better for me to just add code to catch the return value of frad?
<micahg> *fread
<micahg> tumbleweed: weirdly enough, it doesn't fail in Debian
<tumbleweed> a warning added in gcc 4.5? /me is still pulling source...
<micahg> tumbleweed: fails for me on maverick as well (should be gcc-4.4)
<micahg> tumbleweed: I can pastebin the error if you like
<tumbleweed> micahg: naah, I'll just give up on this and play on a box in EU instead
<micahg> tumbleweed: there are only 4 instances where the return value isn't processed
<tumbleweed> micahg: yeah it does look buggy
<micahg> tumbleweed: so, what should I do?
<tumbleweed> patch it and submit a patch upstream, I guess
<micahg> tumbleweed: does this look ok, or should I actually process the return value? http://paste.ubuntu.com/566871/
<tumbleweed> micahg: catching a return value and not doing anything with it (i.e. hiding the bug) is worse than not catching it
<micahg> tumbleweed: ok, there's one working example in the code, I"ll try to follow that
<tumbleweed> micahg: Many of the things that can go wrong with file handling are very unlikely to happen in normal circumstances, so just aborting can be a sane option.
<micahg> tumbleweed: ok, I think I got it
<persia> Better to retry or something, rather than abort.  A user typically can't tell the difference between an abort and the segfault that would likely otherwise occur from the failed operation.
<micahg> tumbleweed: ok, here's the error now, I seem to be using the variable, but it's not happy http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/566877/
<persia> Mind you, you only want to retry once or twice, or just provide some error message to the user, and go for manual retry, to avoid getting into a non-terminating loop.
<micahg> err, I think I see the issue :-/
<micahg> this is one problem after another
 * micahg wonders why Debian's -Werror doesn't catch this, nor upstreams
 * micahg is glad Firefox isn't built like this
<micahg> first fread, the fseek, now fgets
<geser> micahg: does Debian use -D_FORTIFY_SOURCE=2 by default?
<micahg> geser: idk
<geser> AFAIK Debian doesn't use it and I'm not sure that's the reason for your error but most likely
<micahg> geser: we seem to have some type of option warn_unused_result
<persia> Good to have that option.  I think those are the cause of a majority of our segfaults.
 * micahg will continue fixing this another night
<persia> (well, maybe not a majority: use-before-set is very popular as well)
<Rhonda> Where do I see build logs, I got informed that flightgear gives troubles in natty?
<Rhonda> I might be blind but I don't find it on launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/flightgear â¦
<tumbleweed> Rhonda: linked from the builds https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/flightgear/1.9.1-1.1
<geser> Rhonda: is it for the flightgear package currently in the archive or for a possible sync? I know that sebner was looking at building flightgear 2.0.0-3 and had issues with "ld --no-add-needed"
<ari-tczew> dholbach: around?
<dholbach> ari-tczew, yes, but a bit busy - how can I help?
<ari-tczew> dholbach: sponsors overview has been hanged
<dholbach> I guess I know the reason for it
<ari-tczew> dholbach: btw. could you request to Launchpad remove ~ubuntu-main-sponsors? it's not needed anymore.
<dholbach> can somebody else please do this?
<dholbach> I'm really quite busy
<dholbach> and regarding the sponsoring overview, I hope this will fix it: https://code.launchpad.net/~dholbach/ubuntu-sponsoring/lp-usage/+merge/49648
<ari-tczew> tumbleweed: ^^
<ari-tczew> dholbach: do you mean someone else request remove ~ubuntu-main-sponsors?
<dholbach> yes
<dholbach> you have my ok
<ari-tczew> dholbach: OK will do it.
<dholbach> thanks
<geser> Rhonda: if it was about flightgear 2.0.0-3 see http://pastebin.com/VHvQmEDk for the build failure (solutions seems to be to move "-lsgio" after "-lOpenThreads", at least it worked when I tried it manually inside my pbuilder)
<Rhonda> geser: Yes, sebner did ping me to look at it.
<Rhonda> geser: I'm looking into building the unpatched package and work through his patches after that to see wether it's related to that. :)
<Rhonda> Actually natty currently is synced, not merged, so I wonder if a plain sync would work.
<geser> Rhonda: the pastebin is the error you'll get when you try to build it in natty
<geser> you should be able to get in Debian with binutils-gold too
<ari-tczew> dholbach: FYI https://answers.launchpad.net/launchpad/+question/145351
<dholbach> thanks ari-tczew
<Rhonda> geser: In his PPA he has a ubuntu15 version or such?
<geser> Rhonda: I tried the unmodified Debian package when he asked me for help about the FTBFS
<Rhonda> Ah, alright.
<Rhonda> Got anywhere? :)
<Rhonda> Hmm, there is no bugreport in Debian about binutils-gold. Weren't they all tested and filed?
<geser> when I reordered the libs in the g++ (inside the pbuilder shell) and moved "-lsgio" after "-lOpenThreads" the linking worked
<geser> but I didn't look how to get this into the Makefile
<mvo> hey! I was just looking at some universe packages that look like they haven't been rebuild for py2.7 - mind if I upload them or should I get in contact with someone who coordindates it?
<Laney> mvo: haven't heard of anyone doing that, feel free to do it
<Laney> maybe drop a mail to -motu if it's a lot
<tumbleweed> mvo: go for it, I think. barry was taking care of them last time I looked
<alucardni> 3clear
<alucardni> oopps
<mvo> thanks Laney, tumbleweed
<ari-tczew> kklimonda: don't assign if you're want sponsorship
<kklimonda> ari-tczew: I was asked to
<kklimonda> erm, don't assign to myself
<kklimonda> right
<kklimonda> but I did unassign myself.. hmm
<kklimonda> ok, it didn't work
<ari-tczew> ;)
<ScottK> YokoZar: What does "err:dosmem:DOSMEM_MapDosLayout Need full access to the first megabyte for DOS mode" mean I need to do?
<kees> ScottK: means you need to disable mmap_min_addr, I think.  sudo dpkg-reconfigure wine1.2   should ask you about it.
<ScottK> kees: Thanks.
<ScottK> Gotta love documentation ... They are provided "as is". It is assumed that if you are interested in this, you can pretty well figure out what to do with it.
<ScottK> from a REAME.TXT
<ari-tczew> udienz: you subscribed ubuntu-sponsors to gkamus bug, did you got enough advocates?
<ari-tczew> I have an idea looking on udienz case on sponsors overview
<udienz> ari-tczew, gkamus not advocates by anyone right now
<ari-tczew> when someone is looking for MOTU review @REVU, subscribe ubuntu-sponsors
<ari-tczew> geser, persia: what's the process of update policy?
<ari-tczew> (firstly discussing)
<ScottK> kees: That was exactly it (including dpkg-reconfigure wine1.2).  Thanks again.
<kees> ScottK: cool; you're welcome. :)
<ScottK> (I even remembered to put it back when I was done)
<geser> ari-tczew: which policy?
<ari-tczew> geser: <ari-tczew> when someone is looking for MOTU review @REVU, subscribe ubuntu-sponsors
<geser> ari-tczew: I don't know if we have a process for it, but a first step would be to write a mail describing the change and rationale for it, and wait some time (1-2 weeks) for feedback. I guess mailing ubuntu-motu and ubuntu-devel would be good for asking for feedback.
<ari-tczew> geser: what do you think about this idea?
<geser> not sure myself yet, have to think about it and read your rationale, but my first questions are a) has ubuntu-sponsors the resources for it and b) is this the right path?
<geser> I ask about b) because I'm not sure that REVU helps us in the long run or only attracts hit-and-run packages which MOTU has to maintain and update in the future (and MOTU lacks the resouces for it)
<ari-tczew> but this is good way to get new packages quickly
<geser> yes, but do those packagers stay to maintain them?
<Laney> What are you trying to achieve? Patch pilots looking at new packages?
<geser> (that's just my opinion about REVU and shouldn't stop you)
<blueyed> Is natty currently badly broken? I am thinking about dist-upgrading now.
<micahg> well, I think REVU is good for getting packages in shape, they we should throw them over to Debian once they're ready
<micahg> but for that use case, the sponsoring queue is certainly not appropriate
<ari-tczew> what does it mean? Makefile.am:109: linker flags such as `-Wl,--no-as-needed' belong in `src_liblwmsg_la_LDFLAGS
<ari-tczew> Laney: not exactly patch pilots, just information to MOTUs about packages which needs review
<tumbleweed> ari-tczew: I'm guessing that was from some linker flags in LIBS / CFLAGS rather than LDFLAGS
<Laney> that information is already available on REVU
<Laney> if people wish to review new packages (it's a very differnet kind of review IMO) then they can look there
<ari-tczew> tumbleweed: I'm trying to fix ./common/.libs/liblwsmcommon.so: undefined reference to `lwmsg_handle_type_class'
<ari-tczew> and I guess -Wl,--no-as-needed would be helpful
<geser> ari-tczew: using -Wl,--no-as-needed should be IMHO only be a last effort
<ari-tczew> geser: I can't find any lib related to ftbfs message
<geser> which package is this?
<ari-tczew> likewise-open
<geser> if --no-as-needed works than the link order needs to get fixed
<ari-tczew> geser: as I wrote above: Makefile.am:109: linker flags such as `-Wl,--no-as-needed' belong in `src_liblwmsg_la_LDFLAGS
<ari-tczew> so it doesn't work
<tumbleweed> ari-tczew: that's not that it doesn't help you, it's that you were using it wrong :)
<tumbleweed> but yes as geser said, --no-as-needed isn't the preferred solution
<Raydiation> when is feature freeze?
<geser> Feb 24th
<Raydiation> ty
<kklimonda> nhandler: soren: could one of you accept my email to ubuntu-motu? It got sent from a wrong account.
<soren> kklimonda: Done.
<YokoZar> ScottK: kees is right, and you can blame him for that particular error ;)
<soren> kklimonda: I also approved one to ubuntu-server@
<YokoZar> Although I'm unsure of its future in wine1.3 as there is dosbox integration going on (albeit not a complete sort yet)
<kees> YokoZar: it might be nice to update that error to hint to the dpkg-reconfigure command
<YokoZar> hmm, I suppose
<ScottK> Good idea.
<kklimonda> soren: thanks
<bcurtiswx> if i edit a file outside of quilt, is there any way i can get quilt to catch those changes and add it to my topmost patch?
<bcurtiswx> for those that don't dislike quilt ;)
<geser> bcurtiswx: "quilt add $file" before you start editing and later "quilt refresh"
<bcurtiswx> geser, i meant after i edited the file.. did a bzr diff and added that to a patch.  Thx though :)
<mikeyeates> Hi all, I am having real trouble trying to build a deb with a bunch of php files in it.  Are there any examples of building a deb without any compiling?  I am just trying to copy the files in the dist tarball to /usr/lib/mypackage
<micahg> mikeyeates: zend-framework
<mikeyeates> Thanks micahg Ill have a look at it
<azeem> mikeyeates: you should copy them to the usual staging directory (debian/tmp or debian/mypackage), not /usr/lib/mypackage directly
<azeem> in case you tried that
<mikeyeates> I tried copying the rules and Makefile files from zend-framework but I keep getting permission errors (the same type as when I was trying from scratch)
<mikeyeates> /usr/bin/make install-framework DESTDIR=/home/mike/speedy/releases/cogs-framework-0.9.1/debian/cogs-framework
<mikeyeates> make[1]: Entering directory `/home/mike/speedy/releases/cogs-framework-0.9.1'
<mikeyeates> install -d -o www-data -m 755 /home/mike/speedy/releases/cogs-framework-0.9.1/debian/cogs-framework/usr/share/php/cogs-framework/
<mikeyeates> install: cannot change owner and permissions of `/home/mike/speedy/releases/cogs-framework-0.9.1/debian/cogs-framework/usr/share/php/cogs-framework/': Permission denied
<mikeyeates> make[1]: *** [install-framework] Error 1
<mikeyeates> make[1]: Leaving directory `/home/mike/speedy/releases/cogs-framework-0.9.1'
<mikeyeates> make: *** [install] Error 2
<mikeyeates> dpkg-buildpackage: error: fakeroot debian/rules binary gave error exit status 2
<mikeyeates> This must be something simple, does anyone know what I am doing wrong?
<soren> mikeyeates: Who owns /home/mike/speedy/releases/cogs-framework-0.9.1/debian/cogs-framework/usr/share/php/cogs-framework/ ?
<mikeyeates> mike
<mikeyeates> all operations are done under my user
<mikeyeates> it is chmod 700 though, but I didnt make that directory
<Tobu> do you have a www-data user?
<mikeyeates> yep
<Tobu> huh
<mikeyeates> I thought it was all done under the fakeroot program which should mean it works?
<Tobu> If you use fakeroot debian/rules or debuild, anyway
<mikeyeates> I am using debuild
<mikeyeates> even sudo debian/rules binary fails in the same way
<mikeyeates> sudo install -d -o www-data -m 755 /home/mike/speedy/releases/cogs-framework-0.9.1/debian/cogs-framework/usr/share/php/cogs-framework/
<mikeyeates> even that does not work
<Tobu> Try sudo strace -f install â¦etc
<mikeyeates> This looks like the relavent part
<mikeyeates> mkdir("cogs-framework/", 0700)          = -1 EEXIST (File exists)
<mikeyeates> open("cogs-framework/", O_RDONLY|O_NOCTTY|O_NONBLOCK|O_DIRECTORY) = 3
<mikeyeates> fstat(3, {st_mode=S_IFDIR|0700, st_size=4096, ...}) = 0
<mikeyeates> fchown(3, 33, 4294967295)               = -1 EACCES (Permission denied)
<Tobu> EACCESS and not EPERM, strange
<Tobu> anyway, clean up the whole mess if you can
<mikeyeates> I just had a thought... I am doing this in a virtual machine with the source directory ssh mounted from the desktop machine, maybe that is borking it?
<mikeyeates> ill try from the desktop
<Tobu> oh yeah, fuse would be denying permission to root
<Tobu> to prevent normal users from showing root strange stuff, like setuid files and devices
<mikeyeates> thanks for your help..
<Tobu> :)
#ubuntu-motu 2011-02-15
<c2tarun> the errors in bug 713931 are errors due to source code? What should I do? Should I contact upstream?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 713931 in moserial (Ubuntu) "New version of moserial available upstream" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/713931
<grunthus> Would anyone be available to check that I have proposed a bzr branch for merge in the proper way? ...
<grunthus> https://bugs.launchpad.net/hundredpapercuts/+bug/715820
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 715820 in ubuntuone-control-panel (Ubuntu) "No tooltip for disconnect button" [Low,Triaged]
<wejaeger> Hey, anyone up for reviewing l2tp-ipsec-vpn? It's a little applet to configure and manage L2TP IPsec VPN connections. I've just uploaded a new candidate. http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/l2tp-ipsec-vpn
<alucardni> sync request like LP: #718601 are fixed automatically or need human intervention?
<artfwo> alucardni, they need human intervention, yes: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ArchiveAdministration#Syncs
<alucardni> beside bitesize bugs, are there any other tasks for motu beginners???
<c2tarun> micahg: ping, you remembered about the linker error I asked to you. changing the order of -lssl and -lcrypto didn't worked :(
<micahg> c2tarun: you moved them to the beginning of the linking order?
<artfwo> alucardni: have your read https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing ?
<c2tarun> nope I just changed their order :P do mean that I should move them to the begining?
<micahg> c2tarun: yes, --as-needed enforces that libraries have to be linked before they can be used
<c2tarun> micahg: ok, let me try
<alucardni> artfwo: thanks for the link, I'll check it right now
<c2tarun> micahg: I was trying to install the build-dep for bacula and I got this error. http://paste.ubuntu.com/567191/
<c2tarun> micahg: I tried to copy sources.list from my machine into natty chroot, changed all the occurence of maverick to natty in that file. but now I am getting this error. http://paste.ubuntu.com/567192/
<c2tarun> can anyone help me above two errors ^^
<RAOF> did you run âapt-get updateâ somewhere in there?
<c2tarun> RAOF: not yet, wait
<c2tarun> RAOF: it worked :) thanks
<psusi> I have a question about UDD: launchpad has an upstream project that has a bzr branch that is auto importing from upstream's git repository.  Ubuntu's branch auto merges from debian's.  Shouldn't debian's branch be auto merging from launchpad's upstream auto import branch?
<psusi> also to make a change, can you just do it directly now and let bzr worry about merging, or still use quilt within bzr?
<RAOF> That really depends on the packager.  You *could* make changes directly and let bzr sort them out.
<lifeless> <-does
<RAOF> That's a workflow that would be improved with colocated branches, I think.
<RAOF> Although that's largely a convenience issue.
<psusi> eh?
<psusi> colocated branches?
<RAOF> You might know them as âgit branchesâ
<RAOF> Where the branches aren't physically segregated by directory.
<psusi> ahh
<psusi> handling the workflow locally I don't have a problem with, I'm just trying ot understand the workflow as I see it over the network ;)
<RAOF> It's largely unstandardised, I think.
<psusi> and what I see is upstream has a git repo, lp's upstream project has a bzr repo that auto imports from the git repo, ubuntu has a bzr repo that periodically merges from debian, and debian appears to have a bzr repo that sometimes merges from a terminal branch that is a clean import of an upstream release tarball, plus quilt patches
<psusi> I would think that the way it should work is for quilt to not be used, debian should merge from the upstream project bzr branch on lp, then ubuntu's branch should merge from debian's branch, and you should be able to see in the log any changes debian or ubuntu have made, plus every change made in the upstream git repo
<RAOF> Yeah.  That's a nice workflow.
<RAOF> It *also* means that bzr can do some of the patch-porting for you.
<wejaeger> l2tp-ipsec-vpn? It's a little applet to configure and manage L2TP IPsec VPN connections. I've just uploaded a new candidate. http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/l2tp-ipsec-vpn
<psusi> but since debian isn't merging from the bzr auto import from upstream git branch, and instead is just maintaining quilt patches on top of import branches of upstream tarballs, then I guess I should keep changes in a quilt patch?
<jderose> wondering if someone could walk me through creating a quilt patch... i have debian/ under bzr - https://code.launchpad.net/~pyskein/pyskein/packaging
<jmarsden> jderose: I think the info at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Complete#quilt%20%28Example%20Package:%20xterm%29 should get you started?  I don't really have time to walk you through step by step right now though.
<jderose> jmarsden: awesome, thanks! the right documentation is as good as a walk through :)
<jmarsden> jderose: No problem.  IMO anyone doing packaging should get to know that whole guide -- it's worth reading.
<dholbach> good morning!
<c2tarun> why I am getting this error :( http://paste.ubuntu.com/567235/ the libraries required are there "-lssl and -lcrypto"?
<c2tarun> why I am getting this error :( http://paste.ubuntu.com/567235/ the libraries required are there "-lssl and -lcrypto"?
<udienz> c2tarun, i think ssl lib needed cripto lib first
<Rhonda> c2tarun: That's a pretty short paste, could you paste the whole thing? And did you do an "apt-get build-dep bacula"?
<c2tarun> udienz: ok, let me try.
<Rhonda> What exactly is it that you try to do? bacula is an already existing package and I'm somewhat related to it.
<udienz> c2tarun, Could you paste whole thing? as Rhonda says
<Rhonda> Ah, 5.0.3 upgrade hasn't been done in Debian yet.
<JeanCrien> bonjour!
<c2tarun> Rhonda: ya I did everything and I am working on this since last two days. Problem is somewhere in the order of libraries. micahg suggested to try bringing the two libraries in front, still I got the error.
<Rhonda> Of course you need the build-dep installed before, or I am totally not understanding what you mean by that.
<c2tarun> Rhonda udienz: check this http://paste.ubuntu.com/567239/
<geser> c2tarun: -lssl -lcrypto needs to be and the end of the linker call as -lbac (which comes currently later) needs them
<c2tarun> geser: at end also I was getting error :(
<geser> c2tarun: the same?
<udienz> c2tarun, see http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/natty/bacula/natty/view/head:/src/tools/Makefile.in#L59
<udienz> bacula 5.0.3 has been uploaded this day
<c2tarun> geser: yup
<udienz> and this is familiar bug 687968
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 687968 in bacula (Ubuntu) "[FTBFS] package 'bacula' (5.0.2-2ubuntu1) failed to build on natty" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/687968
<Rhonda> c2tarun: Which source package are you actually using and what's your build environment? This looks strange.
<geser> Rhonda: this looks like a normal "ld --as-needed" link failure
<c2tarun> I was trying to build new version of bacula which was available upstream. My build environment is pbuilder-dist's natty
<c2tarun> Rhonda: ^^
<c2tarun> geser: I too thought so but I was getting the same error with all the possible orders I can think
<Rhonda> c2tarun: There is already 5.0.3 in natty?
<geser> c2tarun: hmm. anyway bacula 5.0.3 got uploaded to natty already as udienz said
<c2tarun> Rhonda: you checked?
<Rhonda> But I hope 5.0.3 will get injected into Debian soonish.
<Rhonda> c2tarun: rmadison bacula; http://packages.ubuntu.com/bacula - yes, I checked
<c2tarun> Rhonda: hmmm.... still I failed to fix that bug :( anyway thanks :)
<Rhonda> The DD maintaining the package was pretty busy with his two kids over the last year, and given that Debian was frozen he didn't see the need to update it in experimental over the time neither.
<Rhonda> Now he even orphaned the package because they don't use a tapelib at work anymore and they are looking at different backup solutions, so the package is looking for a new maintainer. :)
<geser> Rhonda: just curious: could you reproduce the flightgear linking error in Debian with binutils-gold?
<Rhonda> geser: I did reproduce it in my natty changeroot. Not sure how to set my sid chroot to use binutils-gold though.
<c2tarun> can anyone please explain this error http://paste.ubuntu.com/567247/
<artfwo> c2tarun: in the "sock.makefile('rb', 0)" call, sock variable is empty (None)
<artfwo> check the last 2 lines of the stack trace
<c2tarun> artfwo: I tried to pull the source of coin2. where is stack trace?
<artfwo> it's your pastebin log
<c2tarun> artfwo: oh... actually :) I wanted to know why I got this error?
<udienz> c2tarun, what u-d-t version you installed?
<c2tarun> udienz:  let me check
 * udienz checked with 0.116 ant not got any errors
<udienz> *and
<c2tarun> its .104
<c2tarun> hmm... how can i update to .116?
<jderose> if anyone has the chance, would love feedback on this package - http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/pyskein  It's a Python3 extension implementing the Skein hash algorithm (sha3 candidate, of Bruce Schneier fame)
<udienz> c2tarun, do you use natty or maverick?
<c2tarun> udienz: maverick
<Rhonda> c2tarun: I guess it should be possible to directly download the .116 package and install it on maverick. http://packages.ubuntu.com/natty/ubuntu-dev-tools
<udienz> c2tarun, or adding u-d-t-dev ppa https://launchpad.net/~udt-developers/+archive/daily
<c2tarun> why the newer version is not backported in maverick's archive?
<artfwo> is there any difference between "pull-lp-source" and "bzr branch lp:ubuntu/coin2"?
<geser> the first one uses the .dsc file for downloading (similar to dget)
<wejaeger> l2tp-ipsec-vpn? It's a little applet to configure and manage L2TP IPsec VPN connections. I've just uploaded a new candidate. http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/l2tp-ipsec-vpn
<benste> hi, i saw feature freeze is just a few days away, but is it still possible to replace "simutrans 102" by the all new 110 - which features network player mode ?
<ari-tczew> benste: does it require new library upgrade or something?
<benste> ari-tczew: i don't think so, but I could check if you'd like
<ari-tczew> benste: it's needed so please check
<ari-tczew> if only this program has to be update, then probably no problem
<ari-tczew> if it builds fine of course
<benste> ari-tczew: I'll try to launch it in maverick - if it works all would be fine ?
<ari-tczew> benste: no, please test it on natty
<benste> ari-tczew: i don't have natty
<ari-tczew> benste: so we have got a problem
<benste> ari-tczew: if I'd download natty, and install it in Vbox - would it be enough to get the program running ? - they're not publishing debs, but ready build .tar.gz files
<Laney> benste: this package is maintained by the games team, you could ask in #debian-games on OFTC if anyone is working on this update
<benste> Laney: but debain import freeze is already over isn't it ?
<ari-tczew> benste: you have to test .debs dedicated on natty and it could be in VB
<Laney> that only affects automatic imports
<Laney> syncs can still be requested at any time
<ari-tczew> +1, ask first Debian whether they are going to upgrade it
<benste> ari-tczew: Laney thanks for your advises I'll try asking them and come back as soon as there is a deb file
<Laney> even if nobody is working on it, it's a cross-distro team so you should get the update done there first anyway
<Laney> :-)
<benste> feautre freeze = last time to include a new deb ??
<Laney> after that you must seek an exception to the freeze
<ari-tczew> !FFe
<ubottu> Feature Freeze Exception. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess for the freeze exception process.
<benste> Laney: ari-tczeww looks like there will be no exception for a game :-)
<Laney> au contrare, there is probably a good chance initially
<benste> Laney: "au contrare" - french ??
<c2tarun> newer version of coin2 is available upstream. I downloaded it and packed it for natty. but problem it is generating binaries for different libraries. is there any documentation available for packaging libraries?
<micahg> c2tarun: libraries should be packaged separately unless this source is providing them
<c2tarun> micahg: I think they are provided by source. here is the control file http://paste.ubuntu.com/567408/
<c2tarun> micahg: ping
<micahg> c2tarun: so, those packages need to be versioned along with whatever the new library version is
<c2tarun> micahg: how can i know the new library version?
 * micahg is still unclear on parts of library versioning
<c2tarun> micahg: ok :( so I think I should leave this bug?
<micahg> c2tarun: http://www.netfort.gr.jp/~dancer/column/libpkg-guide/libpkg-guide.html
<c2tarun> micahg: buddy thats a 10 chapter document ;(
<c2tarun> can anyone please explain this error http://paste.ubuntu.com/567420/
<ari-tczew> c2tarun: check build-depends in d/control
<c2tarun> ari-tczew: what to check there?
<ari-tczew> whether have you got everything including versions
<c2tarun> ari-tczew: http://paste.ubuntu.com/567422/ this is the control file.
<ari-tczew> c2tarun: which command do you running?
<c2tarun> ari-tczew: pbuilder-dist natty build *.dsc
<ari-tczew> c2tarun: pbbuttonsd-dev (>= 0.7.9)
<ari-tczew> check which version natty has got
<c2tarun> ari-tczew: wait
<c2tarun> ari-tczew: I dont think natty has pbbuttonsd :(
<c2tarun> ari-tczew: I dont think natty has pbbuttonsd-dev :(
<ari-tczew> c2tarun: that's right
<ari-tczew> now you know why pbuilder can't go
<c2tarun> ari-tczew: ya getting :) but still I am not able to figure out the solution.
<ari-tczew> c2tarun: remove it from d/control and try to build
<c2tarun> ari-tczew: but will the package will be able to build without that dependency?
<ari-tczew> c2tarun: sorry I'm not witch. you have to try to build
<c2tarun> ari-tczew: sure :) let me try.
<micahg> c2tarun: no, you can request a sync from Debian though
<micahg> actually, that package might need to be removed
<c2tarun> micahg: sync for pbbuttonsd? it is not in debian as well.
<micahg> c2tarun: it is in Debian, but powerprefs should probably be removed from Ubuntu since it's gone from Debian
<ari-tczew> rofl
<c2tarun> micahg: powerprefs is in debian but pbbuttonsd-dev is not :(
<c2tarun> I checked by rmadison
<ari-tczew> c2tarun: http://packages.debian.org/search?suite=default&section=all&arch=any&searchon=names&keywords=pbbuttonsd-dev
<ari-tczew> only powerpc
<micahg> c2tarun: no, it's the other way around
<micahg> unless persia wants to keep powerprefs for some reason
<micahg> right, both packages are powerpc specific
<c2tarun> guys what is powerpc?
<micahg> c2tarun: it's an architecture, classically used in old Apple machines
<micahg> c2tarun: when filing a new upstream version bug, it's generally good to list what version is available
<c2tarun> ari-tczew: build failed after removing that build-dep :(
<ari-tczew> c2tarun: only thing how can I suggest you is get missing B-D to Ubuntu
<ari-tczew> but it's powerpc only
<c2tarun> I am still not getting why we are discussing powerpc here ? :(
<c2tarun> ari-tczew: how can i use powerpc
<ari-tczew> hmmm buy device something based on powerpc?
<christoph> heya can someone give me a quick link on how to disable --as-needed for the ubuntu builds?
<c2tarun> ari-tczew: hain?
<c2tarun> christoph: why do you want to disable it?
<ari-tczew> christoph: disable? you should fix FTBFS
<christoph> because sbcl wont' build with it
<micahg> c2tarun: because teh package you were discussing is powerpc specific
<ari-tczew> christoph: add missing libraries to LIBS in Makefile.am
<christoph> aeh ja
<christoph> that's a compiler/interpreter/environment package for common lisp -- its a bit more tricky than adding some libs somewhere
<c2tarun> micahg: so this means that I can use powerpc in the place of pbutton*
<micahg> c2tarun: no
<c2tarun> micahg: then?
<christoph> not everything is a cstle library
<micahg> c2tarun: those packages only run/build on powerpc
<c2tarun> micahg: so this mean that I can't pack them ?
<micahg> c2tarun: no, doesn't mean that
<c2tarun> micahg: :P but u said that powerpc is an arch for apple machine. And I dont have that
<micahg> c2tarun: right, qemu might be able to emulate
<c2tarun> micahg: hmm....
<c2tarun> micahg: can you please tell me any upgrade bug? :( I tried few of them, sometimes its my architecture, sometime they are libraries :( what should I do?
<Gangsta> !ops
<Gangsta> !staff
<Gangsta> sup marienenz
<blueyed> Are there known problems in natty regarding cryptsetup/mountall during boot?
<blueyed> I am getting "mountall: non-recoverable fsck-error: /home" because it tries to fsck crypthome_unformatted - where the suffix is wrong apparently.
 * tumbleweed is certainly running into mountall issues during boot (no crypt). But I haven't dug into them, so I haven't been able to file a bug.
<luc_> hi.i just installed ubuntu, but i can't mount my usb memory,any solution, plz? thx
<stevecrozz> micahg: I just wanted to pop on here and let you know that uwsgi is not going to be ready for natty, leo should have it ready for the next debian release
<micahg> stevecrozz: next Debian release or Ubuntu release?
<stevecrozz> next debian release
<micahg> stevecrozz: ok, thanks, feel free to ping me if you need help getting it into Ubuntu when it's ready
<stevecrozz> micahg: right now this bug is the hold-up https://bugs.launchpad.net/uwsgi/+bug/713479
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 713479 in uWSGI Ubuntu package "Only first config file loads for uwsgi-python2.6" [High,In progress]
<stevecrozz> and i haven't had the time to solve it... if it were solved i think we could make a case for including uwsgi in natty
#ubuntu-motu 2011-02-16
<c2tarun> I packed newer version but since it was not in  3.0(quilt) format I didn't get the debian.tar.gz file. I tried to create the debdiff of both the .dsc files but it is HUGE for uploading as an attachement on the bug page. what should I do? Should I get the diff b/w debian folder?
<micahg> c2tarun: .diff.gz is fine
<micahg> c2tarun: you should set to in progress, not confirmed if you're working on something
<c2tarun> micahg: ya, actually I first downloaded the source and worked on it :) since the build was successful I filed a bug and added the attachement :)
<micahg> c2tarun:I don't see any attachment on bug 719715, also you should unassign yourself once you're seeking sponsorship
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 719715 in coin2 (Ubuntu) "Newer Version Available" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/719715
<c2tarun> micahg: I checked, there is an attachement :( please check again.
<micahg> weird, now I see it
<micahg> sorry
<c2tarun> micahg: np :)
<c2tarun> can anyyou please take a look at this error. http://paste.ubuntu.com/567526/
<c2tarun> anyyou=>anyone :(
<micahg> c2tarun: you might want to look at config.status in the build dir of one exists
<c2tarun> micahg: I dont think I have build dir, I was using pbuilder. It must have removed them.
<c2tarun> micahg: ping
<micahg> c2tarun: there should be a pbuilder flag to not delete the directory
<c2tarun> micahg: ok, I looked but failed to find that flag. should I try to build it on my own machine?
<micahg> c2tarun: you can try that
<micahg> or in a chroot
<c2tarun> micahg: ok, i'll login into pbuilder and try :) this will give me the build folder
<c2tarun> micahg: I build that package into chroot of pbuilder, but there is no config.status file :(
<micahg> c2tarun: config.log?
<c2tarun> micahg: yup
<c2tarun> micahg: config.log only have what I got in pbuilder. What to look into it?
<micahg> c2tarun: idr, last time I had a configure error, there was a file there that had more info
<micahg> maybe configure.log?
<micahg> maybe someone else knows :)
<c2tarun> micahg: ok, :) thanks anyway
<wejaeger> Hey, anyone up for reviewing l2tp-ipsec-vpn? It's a little applet to configure and manage L2TP IPsec VPN connections. I've just uploaded a new candidate. http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/l2tp-ipsec-vpn
<c2tarun> How to check reverse dependencies of a package?
<ScottK> c2tarun: apt-cache rdepends <binarypackagename>
<c2tarun> ScottK: I got the message "Handler silently failed"?
<ScottK> That's a bug.  That happens to me sometimes.  No idea why.  Try again later.
<c2tarun> ScottK: Thanks :)
<c2tarun> can anybody please take a look at the attachement of https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mped/+bug/719759
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 719759 in mped (Ubuntu) "Newer Version Available" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<micahg> persia: ping re powerprefs
<persia> micahg, My powerpc machine is headless: I'd suggest asking in #ubuntu-powerpc: someone with a laptop is much more likely to have a valid opinion.
<micahg> persia: ok, thanks
<kaushal> hi
<kaushal> whats the sun java version available in 8.04 and 10.04 LTS ?
<kaushal> I mean the update
<micahg> kaushal: well, it's currently 6.22 in both, but in hardy, it's the default java, in lucid, openjdk is the default
<kaushal> micahg: ok
<kaushal> micahg: how did you find out ?
<micahg> kaushal: the first question, rmadison sun-java6, the second, I just happen to know
<kaushal> ok
<wejaeger> Hey, anyone up for reviewing l2tp-ipsec-vpn? It's a little applet to configure and manage L2TP IPsec VPN connections. I've just uploaded a new candidate. http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/l2tp-ipsec-vpn
<c2tarun> need help with this error http://paste.ubuntu.com/567555/
<persia> c2tarun, Your issue is above that.
<c2tarun> persia: means?
<c2tarun> oh... more pastebin :) wait
<c2tarun> persia: http://paste.ubuntu.com/567556/
<persia> c2tarun, I'm about to head away, but the next step is to look through the ./configure script, and find out what happens after confdefs.h, and then try to replicate the error manually.
<c2tarun> persia: ok, i'll try :) thanks
<persia> Once you find out which specific part of the ./configure run is failing, you should be able to identify the fix fairly easily.
<persia> Good luck!
<dholbach> good morning
<wejaeger> Hey, anyone up for reviewing l2tp-ipsec-vpn? It's a little applet to configure and manage L2TP IPsec VPN connections. I've just uploaded a new candidate. http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/l2tp-ipsec-vpn
<c2tarun> why I am getting this error http://paste.ubuntu.com/567601/ on using rmadison in chroot?
<Rhonda> You haven't enabled/generated the locale inside your chroot.
<Rhonda> c2tarun: unset LANG and you are set. :)
<c2tarun> Rhonda: ya its done :) wow thanks
<c2tarun> Rhonda: can you please explain me this error. http://paste.ubuntu.com/567611/
<Rhonda> Not really because I think the relevant bits are above the start of your paste. There should be a config.log or such file.
<Rhonda> And also please don't hilight me specificly unless you really think I'm the only person who can help you with that question
<iulian> Morning.
 * iulian yawns.
<c2tarun> this is the complete error I am getting on debuilding a package. http://paste.ubuntu.com/567614/ Can anyone please help
<mr_pouit> configure: error: The intltool scripts were not found. Please install intltool or use --disable-nls to ignore.
<mr_pouit> so you're probably missing intltool in b-deps
<c2tarun> mr_pouit: yup intltool is missing.
<c2tarun> mr_pouit: but its missing from previous version in the archive. I copied the debian folder from the older version? Is it possible?
<mr_pouit> it's possible that it was pulled by another package depending on it in maverick, and it changed in natty
<c2tarun> mr_pouit: but sir, when i'll execute the command apt-get build-dep <package name> it will take dependencies from archive or from the local debian folder?
<tumbleweed> c2tarun: from the archive
<c2tarun> so I have to add intltool to control file and than install it manually? I did it and I think it worked.
<c2tarun> do this change have to be mentioned in changelog?
<Laney> there's get-build-deps in ubuntu-dev-tools
<tumbleweed> also, debuild will abort if you have missing build deps
<c2tarun> tumbleweed: ya debuild is working now after I manually installed intltool. Do this change in control file have to be mentioned in changelog?
<c2tarun> debian/changelog
<tumbleweed> yes, you probably should
<c2tarun> tumbleweed: ok, one more thing, by looking at the error how did you know that intltool is missing?
<tumbleweed> c2tarun: line 77 or in th everbose version 427
<tumbleweed> s/verbose version/config.log/
<c2tarun> tumbleweed: got it :) it was in the begining only, I failed to notice it. Thanks :)
<c2tarun> something happened again. I think this is due to chroot. http://paste.ubuntu.com/567618/ can anyone please check
<tumbleweed> c2tarun: looks like it requires X for its tests, you'd better disable those tests
<c2tarun> tumbleweed: ok
<tumbleweed> (or set up a Xvfb / something)
<c2tarun> I am facing one more problem. I use a chroot to build the packages. There is a folder in my main home folder that I mounted onto chroot's folder. The problem is when I create debuild -b from inside chroot the files that are created cannot be accesed from outside chroot without sudo. Any solution?
<hrw> hi everybody
<mok0> hrw: hi
<mok0> hi nhandler
<nhandler> o/
 * iulian waves.
<hrw> can someone point me to doc about pkgsym usage?
<hrw> I mean: what do I need to change in packaging to get -dbgsym package
<mok0>  hrw  I think you just need to install the pkg-create-dbgsym package
<hrw> mok0: I am fixing binutils/cross build now to generate dbgsym package. it works for normal/native packages but not for cross ones
<hrw> and I have pkg-create-dbgsym installed
<mok0> hrw: I see. I don't have _any_ experience with X-compiling... perhaps the dbgsym package doesn't deal with that situation?
<hrw> ok
 * hrw runs test build
<hrw> ../binutils-arm-linux-gnueabi-dbgsym_2.21-5ubuntu1_amd64.ddeb
<hrw> ;D
<hrw> time for debdiff and new bug
<hrw> for source packages with lot of binary packages it gets more complicated but doable
<mok0> hrw, good for you!
<hrw> btw - is there a way to globally set lintian options?
<hrw> so when I do "debuild" it will give "--verbose --pedantic" etc to lintian
<c2tarun> I want my pbuilder-dist and simple chroot to share their cache (because I have slow internet connection). Is it possible?
<tumbleweed> c2tarun: I just feed everything through an apt-cacher-ng, and don't keep a pbuilder cache
<c2tarun> what is apt-cacher-ng? is it an application?
<c2tarun> tumbleweed: there is not much information about this application in man page. How do we use it? do we have to install it in chroot?
<tumbleweed> it's a daemon you run somewhere on your local network (or outside your chroot), and you point all your machines at it instead of at a mirror
<c2tarun> tumbleweed: sorry but not getting. Can you please explain me what do mean by point all my machines at it instead of mirror?
<tumbleweed> c2tarun: http://www.unix-ag.uni-kl.de/~bloch/acng/html/index.html
<tumbleweed> point as in, set it in sources.list.
<c2tarun> tumbleweed: thanks :) I'll go through the reference page.
<c2tarun> tumbleweed: I use maverick, but by chroot and pbuilder are of natty. Will this be a problem for apt-cacher-ng?
<tumbleweed> no
<Laney> what's the standard way of updating a cdbs control from a control.in? clean doesn't work
<ari-tczew> c2tarun: you should be interested in merging with Debian where are included new upstream releases instead upgrading packages for Ubuntu
<Laney> hm, DEB_MAINTAINER_MODE=1 fakeroot ... seemed to work
<c2tarun> ari-tczew: sure i'd love to do that. but the problem is I dont know how to check. is use rmadison and normally look for version in natty
<ari-tczew> c2tarun: https://merges.ubuntu.com/universe.html
<ari-tczew> or there you can look for new upstream releases coloured on red http://people.ubuntuwire.org/~lucas/merges.html
<c2tarun> ari-tczew: in the link you gave, it is not explained how to merge? :( I never did that before. Can you please give me a hint
<ari-tczew> c2tarun: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/Merging
<porthose> ScottK, ping! may I PM you?
<ScottK> Sure
<micahg> ugh, it looks like someone defaced the ubuntuwire rcbugs page
<mok0> micahg: You mean those USA (downarrow) tags?
<mok0> Yeah looks weird
<micahg> mok0: yes, it's just a comment, but there's no easy way to remove it unless you can access whatever's behind it
<mok0> micahg: know what server it runs on?
<micahg> mok0: no, but I think wgrant knows
<BlackZ> micahg: I was able to remove them
<micahg> BlackZ: how?
<BlackZ> micahg: there's a "-" near the text?
<micahg> BlackZ: oh, I thought that removed the bug
<micahg> ah, I see, it only removes the bug from unimportant ones
<BlackZ> micahg: no, that's for comments
<micahg> oh, hmm, did that change recently?
<BlackZ> not as fair as I know
 * micahg feels silly
 * SpamapS feels pretty
<BlackZ> micahg: anyone can add comments to bugs in that page so I guess there hasn't been any deface :)
<paultag> I'd like to bump bug #720431 -- anyone around to give an ACK? :)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 720431 in alexandria (Ubuntu) "Sync alexandria 0.6.6-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/720431
<micahg> paultag: I can take a look
<paultag> thanks micahg :)
<paultag> we can finally drop that delta :)
<micahg> paultag: ACKd, should be sync'd in the morning
<paultag> micahg: great, thanks so much!
<micahg> paultag: no problem
<pgnorth> hi, does any one know how to fix "tcp sequence number approximation vulnerability" in ubuntu 10.10?
<pgnorth> OR which channnel I can get some help on this?
<kees> pgnorth: I know of no such vulnerability. do you have a CVE number for it? (#ubuntu-hardened is generally the best channel to ask about security stuff)
<pgnorth> CVE-2004-0230
<ubottu> TCP, when using a large Window Size, makes it easier for remote attackers to guess sequence numbers and cause a denial of service (connection loss) to persistent TCP connections by repeatedly injecting a TCP RST packet, especially in protocols that use long-lived connections, such as BGP. (http://cve.mitre.org/cgi-bin/cvename.cgi?name=CVE-2004-0230)
<pgnorth> Thanks kees, I will put this question there(#ubuntu-hardened) too
<kees> pgnorth: http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-security/cve/2004/CVE-2004-0230.html
<ubottu> TCP, when using a large Window Size, makes it easier for remote attackers to guess sequence numbers and cause a denial of service (connection loss) to persistent TCP connections by repeatedly injecting a TCP RST packet, especially in protocols that use long-lived connections, such as BGP. (http://cve.mitre.org/cgi-bin/cvename.cgi?name=CVE-2004-0230)
<kees> pgnorth: basically, linux isn't vulnerable.
#ubuntu-motu 2011-02-17
<c2tarun> I checked by rmadison sphinx and I am getting that sphinx ver-0.6.6-1 is in maverick. but on running sudo apt-get install sphinx I am getting unable to find package. why so?
<micahg> c2tarun: that's a source package
<c2tarun> micahg: so what is the package for installation?
<micahg> c2tarun: python-sphinx
<c2tarun> can anyone please explain me this error. http://paste.ubuntu.com/567909/
<c2tarun> there is a doc_src folder in the prev version, and in new version there is doc folder. some files are same and some are different. I am getting the error that doc_src not found. I think renaming the doc to doc_src will do the job?
<c2tarun> I checked, renaming the folder worked. Should I rename this folder? If yes in which changelog should I mention it? debian changelog or somewhere else. Please reply.
<c2tarun> can anyone please explain me this error http://paste.ubuntu.com/567953/
<psusi> c2tarun, looks like a patch failed to apply to debian/rules... which shouldn't have patches touching it...
<c2tarun> psusi: u mean we can't make changes to rules?
<StevenK> c2tarun: Just make the changes directly
<StevenK> Patches are for changes to upstream code.
<c2tarun> StevenK: ok.
<c2tarun> StevenK: Should I mention the change is rules file in debian/changelog?
<psusi> yes
<c2tarun> psusi: ok
<c2tarun> I added a patch which is adding a file to the source tree. What should I write about this in changelog. Just added the patch?
<c2tarun> and in rules file in one line I changed "doc_src" to "doc" its name of a folder. What should I mention about this in changelog? anything like changed line <older-line> to <newer-line> will do or just change doc_src to doc?
<arand> Something like "- added fix_foo.patch: fix foo by doing bar (LP #xx)", maybe?
<c2tarun> arand: but this error was not reported on LP yet, I was fixing an upgrade bug and found this error in new upstream version.
<arand> Reference by file is usually clear and compact: "- debian/rules: doc_src -> doc"
<arand> c2tarun: In that case just omit it, include reference if they are relevant...
<c2tarun> arand: or I should just write "imported file filename.txt from previous version"
<c2tarun> arand: will this be good? ^^
<arand> c2tarun: If it is clear it's good ;)
<vorian> hey hey hey
<vorian> cam anyone spare a shell for me, strictly for irc use?
<broder> vorian: i could probably get you an account on irccloud if one of the devs is around
<vorian> coolio
<arand> c2tarun: Mention version number, where the file goes, and reason for doing so... I guess, I can only give general hints I'm afraid
<arand> Someone else would probably know more specifics
<c2tarun> if anyone free for sponsorship please look at bug 645138  thank you
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 645138 in spyder (Ubuntu) "update Spyder to Version 2" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/645138
 * vorian advocates for $20 us
<church> limitfears.blogspot.com
<RoAkSoAx> eve/win 21
<RoAkSoAx> arrg
<dholbach> good morning
<MTecknology> zul: I know you're incredibly busy.. I was just hoping you maybe could explain why php-fpm was taken out in 5.3.3-2..
<ajmitch> MTecknology: it was because of the squeeze release, I believe the release team wasn't keen on having a new SAPI just before release
<MTecknology> oh
<ajmitch> at least that's what I recall from the mailing list
<MTecknology> It seems it's not back in there yet
<MTecknology> which mailing list was that?
<ajmitch> debian php list & debian-release, I think
<MTecknology> thanks
<MTecknology> Do you know if they're planning on bringing it back?
<MTecknology> as far as I can see, it's not even around in experimental
<ajmitch> http://lists.alioth.debian.org/pipermail/pkg-php-maint/2010-November/008033.html
<ajmitch> yes
<Rhonda> Do you mean php5-fpm?
<MTecknology> ya
<MTecknology> yay, thanks :)
<Rhonda> MTecknology: In the changelog of php5 5.3.3-2 it was removed with "Don't build FPM SAPI now", though no further information on the why.
<Rhonda> You might want to ask ondrej (on irc.debian.org), he signed off that changelog
<Rhonda> Actually it php5-fpm seems to only have been built between 5.3.3-1 and 5.3.3-2, so a single upload.
<Rhonda> Ah, that alioth mail explains a bit more
<MTecknology> Rhonda: `the bug report that caused the mail ajmitch sent me a link to was perfect
<MTecknology> basically a long version of what he just said though :P
<Rhonda> Sorry for jumping in sideways. :)
<MTecknology> :P
<MTecknology> help always appreciated
<Rhonda> Wasn't much help from what I can tell :)
<MTecknology> Rhonda: I'm attempting to build a package with it added pack in :P
<Rhonda> MTecknology: You can fetch the 5.3.3-1 source from snapshot.debian.org
<Rhonda> To take a look at how it was incorporated there
<MTecknology> ooh- another really neat website
<MTecknology> I'll try that out if this doesn't work - fighting my pbuilder environment now - but I think it was just out of date
<Rhonda> I've started to work on a download client, though haven't found the time to clean it up well enough to push it into the devscripts package yet. %-/
<wejaeger> Hey, anyone up for reviewing l2tp-ipsec-vpn? It's a little applet to configure and manage L2TP IPsec VPN connections. I've just uploaded a new candidate. http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/l2tp-ipsec-vpn
<MTecknology> Rhonda: still building..... but have done something right :D
<MTecknology> gah... this has been building for 1/2hr now
<c2tarun> can anyone please tell me how can I convert copyright to dep-5 format?
<c2tarun> anyone up for the sponsorship. please look at bug https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/medit/+bug/719725
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 719725 in medit (Ubuntu) "Newer Version Available" [Wishlist,In progress]
<mok0> c2tarun: Looks like bhavi has handled it up to now. I think we should wait for him
<c2tarun> mok0: ok :) but I dont know how to fix dep-5 problem. Can you please tell me how can I do that?
<mok0> c2tarun: what dep-5 problem?
<c2tarun> mok0: bhavi suggested me to convert copyright file format to dep-5 format. I dont know how to do that?
<mok0> c2tarun: well, it's just editing the copyright file to conform to the spec
<c2tarun> mok0: there is no tool to convert from one format to another?
<mok0> c2tarun: TL;DR the full bug thread...
<mok0> c2tarun: nope
<mok0> c2tarun: vi or emacs :-P
<tumbleweed> c2tarun: the old format is purely text, not machine readable
<tumbleweed> licencecheck can give you an overview of the contents of the package
<c2tarun> mok0: ok :)
<mok0> tumbleweed: make that machine _parseable_
<tumbleweed> mok0: yeah :)
<mok0> c2tarun: TBH, I don't understand why you bother, since the package is already maintained in Debian
<mok0> c2tarun: and your version will be zapped when Debian catches up
<mok0> c2tarun: better to contact the Debian maintainer and offer your help
<c2tarun> mok0: I am not getting what you are saying :(
<tumbleweed> he's saying bhavi is requesting things he shouldn't (we want to keep our packages as close to debian as possible)
<mok0> c2tarun: you want to upload a new version of medit, right?
<c2tarun> tumbleweed: how can i check whether a package is maintained in debian or not?
<c2tarun> mok0: yup
<mok0> c2tarun: ... that package is in Debian, version 0.10-4-1
<c2tarun> mok0: ya that is not latest thats why I tried to pack it.
<tumbleweed> you can also tell from the changelog, or by looking at packages.debian.org/$packagename or rmadison -u debian $packagename
<mok0> c2tarun: ok, it's orphaned, but if someone takes it over, your ubuntu version will be overridden
<mok0> c2tarun: I say, it's better to offer to help maintain it in Debian
<tumbleweed> c2tarun: if you want to, you can take it over in debian, or we can do a QA upload of it in Debian
<tumbleweed> (assuming the new version is something people will want)
<c2tarun> tumbleweed: that's what bhavi said about a QA upload, but I dont understood that. I thought to upload it here first and then look into what QA is.
<tumbleweed> oh, someone already intends to adopt it
<tumbleweed> a QA upload is an upload to an orphaned package (i.e. to fix a bug, or upload a new version, but not much else)
<tumbleweed> you can poke the adopter and ask him what the status is
<c2tarun> tumbleweed: ok, how can i check whether a package is orphaned? and how can i adopt it?
<mok0> yeah, his message is from September 10
<tumbleweed> mok0: there's some more recent retitling below that
<tumbleweed> c2tarun: http://packages.qa.debian.org/m/medit.html
<mok0> tumbleweed: are you a DD?
<tumbleweed> mok0: as of pretty recently :P
<mok0> tumbleweed: ah, congrats!
<mok0> than you could sponsor c2tarun I suppose
<c2tarun> hey guys, I just wanted to contribute via packaging (as I dont know much of coding) What is the best way to do that? by best I mean most effective way.
<c2tarun> mok0: tumbleweed^^
<c2tarun> ping
<mok0> c2tarun: go ahead and fix the package, then ping bahvi
<mok0> c2tarun: and tumbleweed for sponsoring (?)
<c2tarun> mok0: but you said, that my package will be zapped :(
<mok0> c2tarun: not if you get it uploaded to Debian
<mok0> c2tarun: but as we said, contact that guy who wanted to take over the package for maintenance, and ask if he still means it
<mok0> c2tarun: it's great you want to contribute!
<tumbleweed> mok0: thanks, sorry, connectivity issues here...
<mok0> c2tarun: and seemingly tedious stuff like writing emails to people is part of it :-)
<tumbleweed> c2tarun: happy to help, but please contact the person who has stated he's going to adopt it, first
<c2tarun> mok0: yup very tedious :(
<mok0> c2tarun: do you have interest in other packages?
<mok0> c2tarun: have you done merges?
<mok0> c2tarun: sync requests?
<c2tarun> mok0: I am intereseted in other packages, but never done merges and sync.
<c2tarun> mok0: but I would love to do them.
<c2tarun> mok0: can you guide a bit, like from where to start. I am a quick learner ;)
<c2tarun> mok0: ping
<mok0> c2tarun: for merges, look here: https://merges.ubuntu.com/universe.html
<mok0> c2tarun: you know what "merge" means?
<c2tarun> mok0: little bit, like if any package has new version in debian than we can pack it as per ubuntu and merge it into our archive.?
<mok0> c2tarun: not quite
<mok0> c2tarun: a merge applies only to packages that have ubuntu changes
<mok0> c2tarun: when a new Debian version of that package appears, we need to move those changes to the new version
<mok0> c2tarun: that is, the ubuntu modfications need to be merged with the new Debian package
<c2tarun> mok0: ok, and if no modification needed than we call it sync? (I guess)
<mok0> c2tarun: ... and we add "ubuntu1" to the debian release string
<mok0> c2tarun: exactly
<mok0> c2tarun: syncs happen automatically up to a certain point in the cycle
<mok0> c2tarun: after that, you need to make a "sync-request"
<mok0> on LP
<udienz> c2tarun, you should read sync and merge process
<udienz> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SyncRequestProcess
<udienz> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/Merging
<c2tarun> mok0: but for sync we need to know that no change is required. And I guess the only way to check that is to build it on ubuntu machine?
<udienz> tips, look at latest chagelog both ubuntu and debian
<udienz> *changelog
<mok0> c2tarun: udienz said it. In addtion, all packages that do not have ubuntu* as part of the release string, have been sync'ed
<mok0> c2tarun: ... and we don't like to introduce deltas unless there is a very good reason
<mok0> (like bugfixes)
<c2tarun> mok0: sorry to say this, but I never say any package without ubuntu as part of the release string :( can you name some.
<c2tarun> say=>saw
<mok0> c2tarun: dpkg -l on your system lists all installed packages.
<udienz> c2tarun, do you want to make a sync request now? i'm ready
<c2tarun> mok0: wow... there are many.
<mok0> c2tarun: I have i.e. zip_3.0-2
<c2tarun> udienz: sync request for medit?
<mok0> c2tarun: yep, 75% of them
<udienz> c2tarun, no, i guesst xchm package. i want to sync last night but i'm sleepy :(
<mok0> c2tarun: go to the bottom of this page: https://merges.ubuntu.com/universe.html
<mok0> ah, not quite 75%...
<mok0> more like 2/3
<c2tarun> mok0: ya approx 67% still many. ok so its not always necessary to pack. most of the time we request sync. for example as udienz said xchm package.
<mok0> c2tarun: yes, but most syncs happen automatically
<mok0> c2tarun: you see the little purple slice there, these are packages that need "manual" sync
<mok0> (so including that, we're up to 3/4)
<mok0> c2tarun: these may or may not be sync'ed for natty
<mok0> c2tarun: depending whether someone requests a sync
<c2tarun> mok0: ok. so first we should check that a package is in natty or not. If not then we should check whether best option is sync or merge. and then we go for that?
<c2tarun> udienz: ping
<udienz> c2tarun, yup
<c2tarun> udienz: package xchm has newer version in debian. how can we check whether we need a sync or merge?
<udienz> c2tarun, as mok0 saya, sync is no modified in ubuntu, and merge need some modified. so look at xchm in PTS
<udienz> http://packages.qa.debian.org/xchm
<udienz> and lp
<udienz> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xchm
<tarun> udienz: sorry I got disconnected. How can we check whether a sync will be better or merge?
<udienz>  c2tarun, as mok0 saya, sync is no modified in ubuntu, and merge need some modified. so look at xchm in PTS
<udienz>  http://packages.qa.debian.org/xchm
<udienz>  and lp
<udienz> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xchm
<udienz> you can see in LP that xchm not require merge, because no ubuntu delta
<c2tarun> udienz: ya this thing I didn't understand, what is ubuntu delta?
<udienz> c2tarun, ubuntu changes, you can check in ubuntu changelog
<udienz> but from xchm version i believe there is no ubuntu delta
<c2tarun> udienz: ok, just wait a sec, let me check please
<c2tarun> udienz: ok, so last changelog entry is for changeing packaging format, control file and rules file.
<c2tarun> nothing like ubuntu chagne
<c2tarun> change*
<c2tarun> udienz: ping
<mok0> c2tarun: "delta" is slang for a difference, a patch
<udienz> c2tarun, yes but it's debian change
 * udienz agreed with mok0
<c2tarun> udienz: got it. so how can we request a sync?
<mok0> it seems the remaining merges are either difficult or uninteresting
<mok0> c2tarun: ah here is one: epdfview
<mok0> c2tarun: wanna take a look?
<c2tarun> mok0: sure
<mok0> c2tarun: find it on that MoM page I gave you above
<mok0> c2tarun: in the "updated merges" section
<c2tarun> mok0: ya got it.
<mok0> c2tarun: click on the name, and see the merge report
<mok0> c2tarun: the merge generated 2 conflicts
<c2tarun> mok0: oh.. I can see on PTS page, there is a patch fixing a bug
<mok0> c2tarun: indeed
<c2tarun> mok0: and ya in conflicts, there is a change in control file and a patch. control file is not delta but patch is :)
<mok0> c2tarun: put that bug aside for a moment (we'll get back to that)
<c2tarun> mok0: ok.
<mok0> c2tarun: the merge is preprocessed in Ubuntu, but sometimes it can't do everything automatically
<mok0> c2tarun: for example, when there is a conflict
<mok0> c2tarun: which means, the Debian maintainer edited the same line in a file that was edited in the ubuntu version
<mok0> c2tarun: so that needs to be fixed manually, so the merge can be completed
<c2tarun> mok0: ok.
<mok0> c2tarun: there is a script here to help doing the merge: https://merges.ubuntu.com/grab-merge.sh
<c2tarun> mok0: you sure this script? I executed this script and it removed all the files from my folder.
<mok0> c2tarun: yikes
<mok0> c2tarun: I was about to warn you
<mok0> c2tarun: it expects you to create a woring dir
<c2tarun> mok0: woring?
<mok0> working
<c2tarun> mok0: oh :)
<mok0> c2tarun: I actually edited that line from the script
<mok0> in my local copy
<c2tarun> mok0: what else this script do except deleting?
<mok0> c2tarun: :-)
<mok0> c2tarun: it fetches everything you need to do the merge
<mok0> c2tarun: i.e. the debian version, the old ubuntu version and the attempted merged version
<mok0> c2tarun: the latter is what you need to fix
<c2tarun> mok0: ok, how to use this script? I mean any parameters required to pass?
<mok0> c2tarun: the name of the package
<mok0> c2tarun: so create a directory, cd into it, and run the script with the argument epdfview
<c2tarun> mok0: ya did :)
<c2tarun> mok0: its getting what required
<mok0> c2tarun: yep. It creates 1 directory
<mok0> c2tarun: with the merge-attempt
<mok0> cd into that + debian/
<c2tarun> mok0: ya then.
<mok0> c2tarun: so, it seems there is a problem with 2 files: control and patches/series
<c2tarun> mok0: ya.
<mok0> c2tarun: edit control
<mok0> c2tarun: something with build-depends
<c2tarun> mok0: yup, its like in red color, with <<<<<<<<< and >>>>>>> symbols. What are these?
<mok0> c2tarun: it seems debian requires a package "hardening-includes"
<mok0> c2tarun: they are markers delimiting the 2 versions.
<mok0> c2tarun: the ubuntu version is from <<< to ===
<mok0> c2tarun: and the debian version is from === to >>>
<c2tarun> mok0: sorry for this silly question :( but who put those markers?
<mok0> c2tarun: the program attempting to do the merge
<c2tarun> mok0: so there is an automatic program as well trying to merge each an every pacakge? what is its name?
<mok0> c2tarun: diff3 I believe
<mok0> c2tarun: mege-o-matic
<c2tarun> mok0: oh :)
<mok0> merge-o-matic
<mok0> c2tarun: it uses varioous standard tools to do the job
<c2tarun> mok0: ok.
<mok0> c2tarun: but it can't figure out what to do if there are modifications to the same lines of a file
<c2tarun> mok0: so what we can see is debian require hardening-includes while ubuntu req dh-autoreconf?
<mok0> c2tarun: exactly
<mok0> c2tarun: and you have to figure out what's going on
<c2tarun> mok0: so we just update the build-depends according to ubuntu and save this control file
<c2tarun> ?
<mok0> c2tarun: yes, but you should end up with a control file without the <<<< === and >>> lines
<c2tarun> mok0: I should end up, or I will end up? I mean should I remove those markers or leave them as it is?
<mok0> c2tarun: when you figure out what the Build-depends: should look like, remove the marker lines
<c2tarun> mok0: that's easy i guess, we just add line b/w <<< and === after libgtk2.0-dev in Build-Depends?
<mok0> c2tarun: so there are 2 questions you should find out: A) is dh_autoreconf still needed? and B) should "hardening-includes" now be in ubuntu as well?
<c2tarun> mok0: okay...
<mok0> c2tarun: the other conflict has to do with patches.
<mok0> c2tarun: to resolve that, you need to understand if one or both ubuntu patches are now redundant
<mok0> (I'll leave that to you :-))
<c2tarun> mok0: in order to check this conflict we have to build the package with the possible build-depends? and for patch one i'll try :)
<mok0> c2tarun: yes, when you've fixed all conflicts, build the source package (add changelog entry first, to say what the ubuntu diff is)
<mok0> c2tarun: then build the binary package in your pbuilder
<mok0> c2tarun: make sure the package builds
<mok0> c2tarun: and if at all possible, test the program to see that it runs and works
<c2tarun> mok0: sorry to ask this but you said both ubuntu patches, but here there are 6 patches.
<mok0> c2tarun: then you make a debdiff between the new debian version and the new ubuntu version, attach that to a bug on LP, and subscribe ubuntu-sponsors
<mok0> c2tarun: then the bug appears here: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-sponsors
<mok0> c2tarun: and the MOTUs will tak a look at it
<mok0> ... eventually
<mok0> :-)
<c2tarun> mok0: yup :)
<mok0> c2tarun: I noticed..
<mok0> c2tarun: I noticed there are different pathces
<mok0> c2tarun: ... and I could not at a glance see what's going on
<c2tarun> mok0: sure, no prob. I'll try and in case i get stuck i'll ask back on channel :) thanks a lot
<mok0> c2tarun: you probably need to consult the debian version and the old ubuntu version to figure out what has happende
<c2tarun> mok0: yup, I was exactly proceeding in that direction only :)
<mok0> c2tarun: great
<c2tarun> how can i check the dependency of a library?
<c2tarun> mok0: hey all the patches are already applied. should I remove them all?
<mok0> c2tarun: yes if that's the case... then you need a sync request
<mok0> c2tarun: and celebrate that we managed to drop 1 delta :-)
<mok0> c2tarun: in package ubuntu-dev-tools, you will find the program requestsync, that makes it easier
<c2tarun> but what about the issue with control file?
<c2tarun> mok0: ^^ I removed dh_autoreconf and added hardening-includes. It was necessary
<mok0> c2tarun: you didn't figure that out?
<mok0> c2tarun: ok
<c2tarun> mok0: so still this calls for a sync or merge?
<mok0> c2tarun: if all deltas are gone, there is no reason to have a -*ubuntu1 package, that only carries forward changelog comments
<mok0> c2tarun: then the merge becomes a merge
<mok0> ah
<mok0> then the merge becomes a SYNC
<c2tarun> mok0: I am bit sceptic with my changelog file. Can you please take a look at it?
<mok0> c2tarun: pastebin it
<mok0> c2tarun: of course if the package is synced, you don't need it
<c2tarun> mok0: http://paste.ubuntu.com/568156/ here is my changelog
<mok0> c2tarun: there are two entries for natty, the first one was proposed by MoM.
<mok0> c2tarun: did you create a debdiff?
<c2tarun> mok0: sorry, :( I forgot. wait let me create
<mok0> debdiff  old new
<mok0> old == debian
<mok0> new == yours
<udienz> c2tarun, you can use dch -e instead of dch -i to change "MOM <merge@ubuntu.com>" with your nam and email
<mok0> c2tarun: if you look at the changelog, you can see that fabrice fixed a bug, and the patch was sent upstream.
<mok0> c2tarun: so it makes sense that we can now request a sync
<mok0> c2tarun: so unless you just want to learn, there is no reason to do more work on the package
<c2tarun> mok0: here is my debdiff http://paste.ubuntu.com/568158/
 * mok0 looks
<mok0> c2tarun: I am not convinced it is the right debdiff
<mok0> c2tarun: I would expect it to be nearly empty
<c2tarun> mok0: it is the one b/w the two dsc?
<mok0> c2tarun: yes, but which two?
<c2tarun> mok0: debdiff epdfview_0.1.7-4ubuntu1.dsc epdfview_0.1.7-5ubuntu2.dsc
<mok0> c2tarun: thats not the one I want
<c2tarun> mok0: than?
<mok0> c2tarun: I want the debdiff that creates the newest ubuntu version (yours) from the newest debian version
<c2tarun> mok0: ok
<mok0> debdiff  epdfview_0.1.7-5.dsc  epdfview_0.1.7-5ubunt1.dsc
<c2tarun> mok0: http://paste.ubuntu.com/568162/ here is the diff u asked.
<c2tarun> mok0: I did one mistake, dh-autoreconf and hardened-includes both are required, I checked on pbuilder and package build successfully :)
<mok0> c2tarun: did you try to build  epdfview_0.1.7-5 =
<mok0> ?
<c2tarun> mok0: I tried to build  epdfview_0.1.7-5ubunt1.dsc and it build succesfully
<mok0> c2tarun: I am convinced you can drop the delta
<c2tarun> mok0: so changelog is fine or I need to create a new one?
<mok0> c2tarun: i.e. the difference between 0.1.7-5 and 0.1.7-5ubuntu1
<mok0> is not worth carrying forward
<mok0> c2tarun: you don't need to do more. Just request the sync. You can now try the requestsync program
<c2tarun> mok0: ok, sorry but let me gather all this, I fixed the control file problem, removed patches as it was applied upstream. So no patches hence no deltas. right. hence it needs sync not merge. so no need to change changelog. All just mattered is fixing of control and calling for sync?
<mok0> requestsync --lp epdfnew natty
<mok0> c2tarun: during the course of your work, you discovered that all ubuntu changes were now incorporated in the debian version. Therefore, we can go back to sync'ing this package, and drop the ubuntu changes.
<mok0> c2tarun: so you don't need to change anything
<c2tarun> mok0: not even control file?
<mok0> c2tarun: not even that
<mok0> :-)
<c2tarun> mok0: then why we started with control file? :/ we should have started with patch problem. :|
<mok0> c2tarun: the archive admins will respond to the sync request by copying the package over from debian
<mok0> c2tarun: so you could learn how to resolve a conflict
<c2tarun> mok0: ok :)
<c2tarun> mok0: and suppose one or more patches applies succesfully, than what?
<mok0> c2tarun: yes, we should have started with the patch problem, but that was more difficult
<mok0> c2tarun: when the sync happens, there won't be any patches. The ubuntu version will byte-for-byte be identical to the Debian version
<c2tarun> mok0: and suppose one or more patches applies succesfully, than what?
<mok0> c2tarun: if MoM has done something, it should be visible in the debdiff.
<mok0> c2tarun: that's why I wanted you to check that
<c2tarun> mok0: I got this error on requestsync :( http://paste.ubuntu.com/568170/
<udienz> micahg, around?
<mok0> c2tarun: oh, I think it has to do with authentication with LP
<mok0> c2tarun: you need to do something to get it to work
<c2tarun> mok0: I am looking at the manpage of manage-credentials :(
<mok0> c2tarun: good
<mok0> Hm, wft is a consumer
<mok0> Ah, its the program that needs access
<mok0> c2tarun:  manage-credentials create -c ubuntu-dev-tools -l 2
<c2tarun> mok0: I am not getting somethings in man page, like --service,--cache,-o,--level
<mok0> c2tarun: try the line I sent
<mok0> c2tarun: which is from the bottom of the man page
<c2tarun> mok0: its asking for what level of access I do want. ??
<mok0> c2tarun: what are the options?
<c2tarun> mok0: No Access, Read Non-Private Data, Change Non-Private Data, Read Anything, Change Anything
<mok0> c2tarun: Change Anything sound good :-)
<c2tarun> mok0: ok :)
<mok0> c2tarun: I honestly can't remember. I've done it once years ago
<c2tarun> mok0: wow... you didn't format your system since last one year?
<mr_pouit> (fwiw, I don't think that 0.1.7-5 can be synced, it probably ftbfs without the patch from 0.1.7-4ubuntu1, because debian doesn't have the newer poppler yet)
<mok0> c2tarun: but you need to authenticate ubuntu-dev-tools with your LP account, so LP knows it's OK for a program to do stuff on your account (Like filing a bug)
<mok0> mr_pouit: That seems to have been fixed
<mok0> mr_pouit: ah
<mok0> mr_pouit: new poppler, eh
<c2tarun> mok0: I am at a vi text editor with a piece of changelog at bottom and some lines over it. :?
<mok0> c2tarun: that text will be the description of the bug in LP.
<c2tarun> mok0: Am I supposed to write anything there?
<mok0> c2tarun: but hang on, mr_pouit has raised doubts if the package can be synced
<c2tarun> mok0: why so?
<mok0> c2tarun: wait a moment, I will check
<c2tarun> mok0: sure
<mok0> c2tarun: mr_pouit was right, we need a merge after all
<c2tarun> mok0: anything I did wrong?
<mok0> c2tarun: no, not you, me
<c2tarun> mok0: what?
<mok0> c2tarun: the version from debian 0.1.7-5 does not compile under natty
<c2tarun> mok0: who said?
<mok0> c2tarun: I just checked
<c2tarun> mok0: I was using natty chroot for everything and it compiled pretty well :?
<mok0> c2tarun: look here: http://paste.ubuntu.com/568181/
<mok0> c2tarun: I think you compiled the merged version, not the native one
<c2tarun> mok0: yup, not the native one.
<mok0> c2tarun: plz pastebin the debdiff between 0.1.7-5 and your version
<c2tarun> mok0: that debdiff is b/w the dsc files ?
<mok0> c2tarun: yes
<mok0> c2tarun: your version SHOULD be 0.1.7-5ubuntu1
<mok0> c2tarun: (but  before it was 0.1.7-5ubuntu2 which is wrong)
<c2tarun> mok0: I dont have anything line *0.1.7-5ubuntu1.dsc
<mok0> c2tarun: like I said, you probably have 0.1.7-5ubuntu2
<mok0> c2tarun: which needs to be fixed, but lets do that later
<c2tarun> mok0: yup pbuilder failed on native version :( hmm... what to do now?
<mok0> c2tarun: you need to do a merge
<mok0> c2tarun: like we started out
<mok0> c2tarun:  I was wrong in assuming that the package could be synced
<mok0> c2tarun: sorry
<mok0> c2tarun: so we are just rewinding a littlebit, and I would like to see your debdiff
<c2tarun> mok0: I have some questions :(
<mok0> c2tarun: ask away
<c2tarun> mok0: we checked the src in folder epdfview-0.1.7-5ubuntu1 I think this is the new one created by MoM. right?
<mok0> c2tarun: right, but make it yours
<mok0> c2tarun: MoM writes a template changelog entry that you are supposed to finish
<c2tarun> mok0: ok, but when I builded the source package why I didn't got epdfview-0.1.7-5ubuntu1.dsc?
<mok0> c2tarun: because you entered _another_ changelog entry above MoMs
<c2tarun> mok0: ok got it, because I changed the changelog :(
<mok0> c2tarun: with the version -5ubuntu2
<mok0> c2tarun: yes, you added another entry, but we only want 1
<mok0> so just put your name etc. instead of MoMs
<c2tarun> mok0: ok, so now all the patches from debian previous version are already applied. so why it failed on natty pbuilder?
<mok0> c2tarun: then debuild -S
<c2tarun> mok0: ping
<mok0> c2tarun: go ahead
<c2tarun> mok0: ok, so now all the patches from debian previous version are already applied. so why it failed on natty pbuilder?
<mok0> c2tarun: let me check
<c2tarun> mok0: sure.
<mok0> c2tarun: I am having trouble with my build-environment, my machine is running Lucid
<c2tarun> mok0: I can do it. What you want to check?
<mok0> c2tarun: I need to see your debdiff
<c2tarun> between which two files?
<mok0> c2tarun: give me a ls *.dsc
<c2tarun> mok0: epdfview_0.1.7-4.dsc  epdfview_0.1.7-4ubuntu1.dsc  epdfview_0.1.7-5.dsc  epdfview_0.1.7-5ubuntu2.dsc
<mok0> c2tarun: ok thnx
<mok0> c2tarun: debdiff epdfview_0.1.7-5.dsc epdfview_0.1.7-5ubuntu2.dsc
<c2tarun> mok0: http://paste.ubuntu.com/568194/
<c2tarun> mok0: ping
<mok0> c2tarun: tnx
<mok0> c2tarun: something is wrong, I don't know what
<c2tarun> mok0: do you know anyone on this channel that can help? :(
<mok0> c2tarun: heh
<mok0> c2tarun: We're the only ones here at the moment
<mok0> c2tarun: your debdiff doesn't apply
<c2tarun> mok0: that grab script. how did it generated epdfview-0.1.7-5ubuntu1? by extracting epdfview-0.1.7-5.tar.gz and by copying epdfview_0.1.7-4ubuntu1.debian.tar.gz into it right?
<Laney> dpkg-source -x blah.dsc
<c2tarun> mok0: and renaming it to epdfview-0.1.7-5ubuntu1
<c2tarun> Laney: hello :) are you talking to us?
<Laney> yep
<Laney> sorry, I didn't read the previous line so don't know what you are trying to achieve. :(
<c2tarun> Laney: actually I am stuck and I think little bit confuse :)
<mok0> c2tarun: it grabs 0.1.7-4 and 0.1.74ubuntu1, creates a diff between them and tries to apply that to 0.1.7-5
<mok0> c2tarun:  it calls the new version 0.1.7-5ubuntu1
<mok0> c2tarun: all that is store on m.u.c, grab-merges merely fetches the data
<c2tarun> mok0: hmm...
<mok0> that damned source format 3.0... %â¬&%â¬%â¬##
<c2tarun> mok0: what's wrong with that ? :( I feel more comfortable with patches in 3.0
<mok0> c2tarun: it's terrible
<mok0> c2tarun: I can't say enough bad things about it
<mok0> c2tarun: an abomination
<c2tarun> mok0: ok, just give me some time. I want to try everything from beginning :/
<mok0> c2tarun: TBH, I've never done a merge with a 3.0 (quilt) source package, I am afraid it can't be done
<mok0> c2tarun: at least not easily
<c2tarun> mok0: u sure?
<mok0> c2tarun: no
<mok0> :-)
<mok0> c2tarun: the problem is, your debdiff shows differences in the .pc directory (quilts working dir) and that makes me very nervous
<c2tarun> mok0: that may be because I was using quilt push to apply patches and check whether they apply or not. If they fails then I open them and check them manually.
<mok0> c2tarun: hm, perhaps
<mok0> c2tarun: but when you unpack Debians package, it's born with a .pc directory
<c2tarun> mok0: ok just relax :-) let me try again. It will take some time and by that time this place will be crowded :-)
<c2tarun> mok0: This time i'll keep an eye on .pc
<mok0> c2tarun: great
<mok0> c2tarun: you need to fix the changelog
<c2tarun> mok0: I am trying from very begining. right from that script :-) i'll take care of changelog as well.
<c2tarun> ls
<c2tarun> oops :(
<mok0> c2tarun: this is what the top of your changelog file should look like: http://paste.ubuntu.com/568210/
<mok0> c2tarun: you copy forward the (relevant) changelog entry of the last ubuntu merge
<mok0> c2tarun: because those modifications are still true
<c2tarun> mok0: thanks :)  this will help a lot. Just tell me how to use that script again? "./grab-merge.sh epdfview"?
<mok0> c2tarun: exactly
<mok0> (create a directory to run it in)
<mok0> or modify the script so it doesn't zap everything in the current dire
<c2tarun> mok0: ok
<mok0> c2tarun: good luck. I have to walk my dogs now :-)
<c2tarun> mok0: thanks :-) bye.tc
<mok0> see ya
<MTecknology> ok.... I really need some help.... I'm trying to remove an old file that another package employs.. My .postinst, .postrm, .prerm stuff looks like this (the bottom 44-47) http://dpaste.com/426434/ .. Going from version  <= 0.8.54-3  to  == 0.8.54-4  the file doesn't get removed... The file pasted is nginx-full.postinst.
<c2tarun> can anyone please take a look at http://paste.ubuntu.com/568240/ I am having doubt from line 356-360
<micahg> udienz: pong
<c2tarun> micahg: ping
<micahg> c2tarun: pong
<c2tarun> micahg: hi :) can you please look at the above message I posted
<c2tarun> micahg: that pastebin one
<micahg> c2tarun: it looks like all the patches got removed and added as a single patch
<c2tarun> micahg: ya, but I am very sure that there was nothing like debian-changes-* something like that.
<micahg> c2tarun: source format 3 does that, it takes anything applied to the source that's not in a patch or the original tarball and creates a patch with sample dep-3 headers
<c2tarun> micahg: that pastebin was a diff b/w debian and ubuntu version of packages. but debian version is not building on natty.
<micahg> c2tarun: so, i'd start on the merge again, maybe start with the Debian package and apply the Ubuntu diff directly
<micahg> (i.e. the diff between the last Debian version and the last Ubuntu version)
<c2tarun> micahg: I was trying to merge epdfview package. by grab script I got two patches epdfview_0.1.7-4ubuntu1.patch & epdfview_0.1.7-5.patch
<c2tarun> micahg: first one is i think b/w debian and ubuntu version.
<micahg> c2tarun: right, so I'd start with a clean version of the new Debian release and apply the first patch, then see what happens
<c2tarun> micahg: very sorry to ask this, but how to apply a patch?
<micahg> c2tarun: patch -p1 < foo.patch, inside the source dir
<c2tarun> micahg: ok, but from where can i get the new debian release? by that grab script I got only debian.tar.gz
<c2tarun> micahg: ping
<micahg> c2tarun: no need to ping if you highlight me
<micahg> c2tarun: grab-merge should have pulled it for you
<c2tarun> micahg: sorry its due to my connection. sometimes message just dont go :(
<MTecknology> What's the right way to change the permissions on /var/log/foo?
<MTecknology> I want it to be 0640 www-data:root or 0640 www-data:adm; not sure which
<MTecknology> 0750*
<c2tarun> micahg: nope it didn't
<c2tarun> micahg: ya it did :)
<c2tarun> sorry thanks :)
<MTecknology> is it even appropriate at all to set the directory like that?
<MTecknology> looks like it's done in postisnt
<Laney> if anyone has some time/is looking for a fun task to do then there are some rebuilds on http://orangesquash.org.uk/~laney/haskell-installability/amd64.png which can be checked/uploaded :-)
 * Laney won't have time now until monday
<Laney> you need to look for "utf8-string" in the .cabal file and add build-deps on libghc6-utf8-string-{dev,prof,doc} (appropriately versioned) if it's in there
<mok0> Laney: eeeek Haskell...
<Laney> :)
<Laney> it's friendly really
<mok0> Laney: the language perhaps, but the packages...
<Laney> even those, you just have to show them who's boss
<mok0> Laney: oh... I am wimp when it comes to package domination
<udienz> ari-tczew, around?
 * debfx grabs a few haskell packages
<ari-tczew> udienz: yes
<udienz> ari-tczew, i have commented in squid3 sync. it is 3.1.11-1
<udienz> i tested in my ppa
<udienz> bug 720667
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 720667 in squid3 (Ubuntu) "Please sync squid3 3.1.11-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/720667
<ari-tczew> udienz: I really really encourage to improve english. You can't understand comments.
<ari-tczew> e.g.
<udienz> :D
<ari-tczew> "following Debian changelog in 3.1.10-1, i believe that ufw has been included right now"
<ari-tczew> believe? if you're requesting sync, you should be SURE
<ari-tczew> you can believe in better tomorrow, no that changes have been included
<udienz> ah.. sorry about that
<persia> Don't get too caught up on semantics at that level.
<jdstrand> no need to sync ufw
<ari-tczew> udienz: and next, I don't mean that this change in d/control hasn't in Debian. it's missing dependsc
<ari-tczew> jdstrand: it's squid3, no ufw
<jdstrand> ok
<ari-tczew> udienz: Debian now requires higher version of squid-langpack and natty can't satisfy it, do you understand?
<udienz> ari-tczew, ok understood
<ari-tczew> fine
<udienz> ari-tczew, so squid3 must be merge to change Depends?
<ari-tczew> udienz: no, please read once again my comment
<ari-tczew> You have to take care about sync squid-langpack from Debian. Without this one, package won't install.
<ari-tczew> I think it's pretty clear.
<mok0> ari-tczew:  calm down
<ari-tczew> mok0: ?
<mok0> ari-tczew: no need to be rude
<ari-tczew> mok0: I'm easy.
<ari-tczew> mok0: rude? lol
<ari-tczew> mok0: perhaps you don't know how people can be rude
<mok0> ari-tczew: oh, and you are gonna show me?
<ari-tczew> and I'd not show you that behavior
<mok0> ari-tczew: just calm down
<ari-tczew> mok0: [19:20] <ari-tczew> mok0: I'm easy.
<ari-tczew> mok0: where do you see me upset?
<ari-tczew> I don't get it, lol
<ari-tczew> people are too sensitivy
<ari-tczew> mok0: I'm waiting for example
<vish> !botsnack
<ubottu> Yum! Err, I mean, APT!
<vish> err, i should have sent that in /msg :/
<ari-tczew> udienz: do you feel something bad from me?
<udienz> ari-tczew, no. it's fine for me, really
<ari-tczew> mok0: do you see? ^^
<ari-tczew> @all: please stop making me as a bad man.
<ari-tczew> tumbleweed: could you look on https://code.launchpad.net/~ari-tczew/ubuntu-sponsoring/updates/+merge/50205 ?
<ari-tczew> sponsors overview can't update anymore
<paultag> are any sponsors around to check up on bug #720921 for me? Thanks! :)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 720921 in fbautostart (Ubuntu) "Sync fbautostart 2.71828-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/720921
<paultag> clean sync, no delta maintained from Ubuntu's side
<micahg> paultag: unless it's urgent, those syncs are usually processed pretty quickly on the sponsors list
<paultag> micahg: Oh, excuse me. I'm sorry, I had no idea. I'll wait next time. Thanks :)
<micahg> paultag: it used to be pretty bad, but I think at least for syncs/they're usually ACKd w/in 24 hours
<micahg> paultag: if you see it being ignored, feel free to bump it :)
<paultag> micahg: yeah, I recall hearing some grumblings about syncs not getting done a few years ago
<paultag> micahg: sure, sorry for bugging ya'll :)
<ScottK> It's gotten better.
<micahg> paultag: no worries
<micahg> paultag: thanks for getting the diffs upstreamed :)
<paultag> micahg: my pleasure :)
<paultag> thanks porthose ;)
<porthose> paultag, your welcome :)
<LLStarks> when was universe freeze for natty?
<LLStarks> nvm
<ari-tczew> bdrung: ping
<bdrung> ari-tczew: pong
<ari-tczew> bdrung: could you look on https://code.launchpad.net/~ari-tczew/ubuntu-sponsoring/updates/+merge/50205  sponsors overview can't update anymore
<bdrung> ari-tczew: it's merged, but daniel has to pull the update onto the machine running this script. ping him once he get online tomorrow
<ari-tczew> bdrung: I'll leave a MemoServ msg him.
<ari-tczew> bdrung: who has got upload access to this branch? out of curiosity
<bdrung> ari-tczew: it's owned by ubuntu-dev - but i don't know who has access to the machine running the overview
<bdrung> ari-tczew: you can use http://people.ubuntu.com/~bdrung/sponsoring/ in the meantime
<ari-tczew> bdrung: aha so in future if I'm 100% sure can I push changes to branch themselve?
<bdrung> ari-tczew: yes
<bdrung> ari-tczew: (e.g. changes like this one)
<ari-tczew> bdrung: ok :)
<ari-tczew> bdrung: FYI I don't need temp sponsors overview, no time for sponsoring :-)
#ubuntu-motu 2011-02-18
<psusi> how does nautilus decide what to open a given file with and the other menu options?  I thought there was a gconf key that listed that sort of thing for each mime type, but I can't find it
<psusi> I could have sworn that you used to be able to right click on a cd-rw and choose blank, but it looks like that doesn't work now because nautilus thinks it is a "folder" instead of a cd-rw...
<c2tarun> An application epdview. Debian has its new version, I tried to build the native new Debian version for natty but it failed. So sync cannot be possible. I need to merge it. Can anyone please help.
<persia> Why does it need to be merged?
<persia> Does it include a cool new feature?  Does it fix a useful bug?
<c2tarun> persia: well there should be something that made debian included the newer version.
<persia> Sure, but after DebianImportFreeze, there needs to be a reason to do a merge or sync.
<persia> Reasons vary: could be fixing a bug, could be a new cool feature, could be beause you really, really want to merge it.
<persia> Doesn't matter what the reason is, but there needs to be *some* reason.
<persia> So, either find a reason to do this merge, or find something else that needs doing.
<c2tarun> persia: well I am new so I dont know much :( but they applied all the patches that somehow needed a change in the build-dependencies.
 * c2tarun (But I was wondering patches are also there in previous version, they are just applied by upstream, why we didn't added the new build-dependency requirement in previous version?)
<persia> Being new only means you have a greater opportunity to learn :)
<persia> My recommendation would be to start by looking at the upstream changelog and the Debian changelog.  Then compare these to the diff in the code.
<persia> See if any of that looks interesting to you, or like a good reason to merge it.
<artfwo> c2tarun: I see there have been a number of "hardening" changes, debian version is more secure, and that's good for a PDF viewer
<c2tarun> artfwo: this security reason is enough? and there was no change in the source code, can just by importing one library make the application more secure?
<artfwo> building against hardening-includes is supposed to make things harder to break. is this reason enough for you? :)
<micahg> yes, I'd say that's worth pulling in if the FTBFS can be fixed
<micahg> c2tarun: it needs a merge anyways since there's an UBuntu change
<c2tarun> micahg: cool :) so can you help me a bit please in merging?
<micahg> c2tarun: would you like to fix blobwars for me :)
<c2tarun> micahg: sure :)
<micahg> c2tarun: I was half joking, but that one we can fix after feature freeze as well
<c2tarun> micahg: feature freeze means? debian has a newer version and can you please tell me where to find the PTS page for blobwar?
<micahg> c2tarun: just make sure there's a bug filed and I'll milestone it for 11.04 beta
<micahg> c2tarun: I've already started working on blobwars, so don't worry about it, I was just saying, I have my own FTBFS to fix ATM :)
<c2tarun> micahg: what kind of bug I should be? sync or merge?
<micahg> c2tarun: merge since there's an Ubuntu change
<c2tarun> micahg: oh.. :)
<c2tarun> micahg: ok :) i'll file the bug? do I hv to subscribe any team to that bug?
<persia> c2tarun, No, just assign yourself
<c2tarun> persia: myself? but micahg already started working on blobwars.
<persia> c2tarun, for epdview (unless you decided not to do it)
<c2tarun> persia: i'll merge epdfview :)
<micahg> c2tarun: I was suggesting filing a bug for epdfview
<c2tarun> micahg: yeah :) sorry I got it wrong. I am doing that
<c2tarun> micahg: bug 721054
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 721054 in epdfview (Ubuntu) "Please merge epdfview-0.1.7-5 from Debian unstable" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/721054
<micahg> c2tarun: milestoned, thanks
<c2tarun> In uploading the package for a merge bug on LP what files should be attached one is the latest ubuntu1.debian.tar.gz, any other files that might help in reviewing?
<micahg> c2tarun: debdiff from Debian version to Ubuntu version
<persia> I usually request a debdiff between latest Debian revision and the candidate revision.
<c2tarun> ok i'll get the debdiff from current debian version to ubuntu version, persia: what do you mean by candidate revision?
<persia> The revision that you've prepared, which you are presenting as a candidate to be included in Ubuntu.
<c2tarun> persia: ok, done :)
<micahg> c2tarun: no, you're still removing all the patches and adding them back as one big one
<c2tarun> micahg: ya those are already applied. did i miss something?
<micahg> c2tarun: idk, seems something funny about merging with source format 3
<c2tarun> micahg: so what can i do?
<c2tarun> micahg: I mean to fix this?
<persia> c2tarun, Do you understand the nature of the issue?
<micahg> c2tarun: I don't know offhand, I'm having a weird issue myself trying to merge eclipse
<c2tarun> micahg: ok, no prob :) I'll ask it on channel someone will reply thanks :)
<c2tarun> I can fix the indentation problem of changelog + i'll add an entry of dropping all the patches. But I dont know how to remove that big patch, can anyone please help. bug 721054
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 721054 in epdfview (Ubuntu Natty) "Please merge epdfview-0.1.7-5 from Debian unstable" [Wishlist,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/721054
<micahg> c2tarun: no, the patches shouldn't be dropped
<c2tarun> micahg: but they are already applied. I checked.
<persia> c2tarun, You may want to read more about Format: 3.0 (quilt).
<persia> In the dpkg documentation.
<persia> The patches are not applied upstream: they're just applied in the unpacked Debian source.
<c2tarun> persia: I also thought that may be one condition, but I tried to remove all of them first by quilt pop :(
<c2tarun> persia: ping
<persia> Why do you ping me?
<c2tarun> persia: I am not getting, I checked by removing all the patches, and none of them were applied at the time I checked that are they applied or not. Then  why shouldn't I remove those patches?
<persia> c2tarun, So, if you look at your debdiff, you may notice debian/patches/debian-changes-0.1.7-5ubuntu1
<persia> That is produced because of differences between the unpacked source and the source in the original upstream artifact.
<persia> Precisely how you reached that state is something I don't know, but I presume you can reproduce by experimentation.
<c2tarun> persia: ya somehow it didn't makes sense. the patches are included in the new debian version. How can they be applied? If they are applied already than they should have been removed from the debian version as well. And since they are included it means that they are not applied. Can you please explain me one last thing please, how is the patch applied in the version I am working on?
<persia> Which patch?
<c2tarun> persia: all of them
<persia> Are you asking why the patches in debian/patches are applied when you unpack the source?
<c2tarun> persia: No I am asking how to remove the patches that get applied automatically when we unpack the source.
<persia> assuming bash: `export QUILT_PATCHES=debian/patches; quilt pop -a`.  Why would you wish to do this?
<persia> Note that the above line is specific to this type of package.  There are many other sorts of packages that require different treatment.
<c2tarun> persia: quilt pop -a is not working, and unless I dont pop the applied patches how can i build the source package?
 * c2tarun by not working I mean getting the message no patches applied
<persia> That sort of package presumes the patches have been applied when you build the source package.  Unapplying them will result either in them being reapplied or unexpected behaviours, depending on other changes to the package at the same time.
<persia> Did you export QUILT_PATCHES first?
<c2tarun> persia: nope, let me do that
<c2tarun> persia: can I include it in my .bashrc, I think I gonna need it very often
<persia> No.
<persia> If you want to include something to work by default, read the docs on the quilt package, which has some suggested ways to handle it.
<c2tarun> persia: ok sure
<c2tarun> persia: I just checked that export* line is already in my .bashrc. still I was not ablt to pop that patch.
<c2tarun> *pop any patch
<persia> That export line won't work unless used in the right context.
<persia> I believe the correct solution is to modify .quiltrc in specified ways, not .bashrc
<c2tarun> persia: I uploaded a new debdiff, can you please take a look.
<persia> You don't need to upload the debian.tar.gz.  Only the debdiff.
<c2tarun> persia: ok :) from next time i'll get the debdiff only
<persia> That looks well-formed.  Do you see the difference between this and your other debdiff?  Do you understand how it got each way?
<c2tarun> persia: yup :) finally ;)
<persia> So, tell me :)
<c2tarun> persia: can you please sponser it? :)
<udienz> micahg, i try to merge conkeror in bug 720069. seems like its is mozilla seed
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 720069 in conkeror (Ubuntu) "Please merge conkeror 0.9.3+git110213-1 (universe) from debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/720069
<persia> c2tarun, If you tell me about the difference between this debdiff and the other one
<c2tarun> persia: this is a clean diff containing only the info of one poppler patch. This is the actual differece because earlier patches are not applied, somehow I did something that applied them. Since those patches are also in the ubuntu version so they are not the difference ;) hence not in this debdiff :)
<persia> Excellent, and do you know what you did before that applied them?
<c2tarun> persia: all other things are legitimate, as changes for ubuntu releases in changelog.
<c2tarun> persia: sorry not getting what you are asking ?
<persia> Do you know what went wrong the first time?
<c2tarun> persia: yup, everything started with the changes made by mom in series, while fixing that may be somehow I applied those patches, that quilt pop was exectued by me before fixing that series file. so I checked that they are applied and that was wrong.
<c2tarun> *series=> debian/patches/series
<persia> Cool.  Now you know.  I often find that when I make a mistake I have a much lower chance of repeating it if I understand what went wrong.
<c2tarun> persia: yup :)
<persia> And, it's always worth checking your debdiff carefully (even if you're not seeking sponsorship).  make sure you intend all the changes that appear, and if something is confusing, try to sort that first, before sending to sponsors/uploading.
<Yanks> !ops
<Yanks> you know ur motherboard has 250$ worth of gold in it?
<Yanks> !ops
<Yanks> !staff
<Yanks> !ops
<persia> Yanks, May I help you?
<Yanks> who the fuck r u
<persia> !ohmy > Yanks
<ubottu> Yanks, please see my private message
<Yanks> fuck u ubottu
<psusi> someone please boot this jackwaggon spammer that has already bene booted from +1
<Yanks> please fucking ban me
<novicedeveloper> hi. i want to start developing for ubuntu. But not getting the right way to start with. I checked the bug squad but it was confusing. i am confused.
<novicedeveloper> please help
<novicedeveloper>  hi. i want to start developing for ubuntu. But not getting the right way to start with. I checked the bug squad but it was confusing. i am confused. please suggest something.
<artfwo> novicedeveloper, I'd suggest you start by reading https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ContributeToUbuntu#Maintaining Ubuntu
<novicedeveloper> artfwo: thank you. but i hav queries also.
<artfwo> if you have them, ask :)
<novicedeveloper> artfwo:  cant i start wuth coding directly instead of entering into  correcting bugs and then strart coding?
<novicedeveloper> :)
<artfwo> of course
<novicedeveloper> artfwo:  so how can i do that?..:P
<artfwo> but I think, it's easier to start by fixing bugs
<artfwo> that's described in the same page as above: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ContributeToUbuntu#Writing%20Code
<novicedeveloper> artfwo: ok.. :) .. now in bug fixing i would like to go with something related to kernel.
<novicedeveloper> artfwo: so can u please suggest something related to this?.. :)
<artfwo> I am not much into kernel development :)
<mok0> Why would the buildd not be able to find gcc?? See this build: https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/collectd/4.10.1-2.1/+buildjob/2101835
<artfwo> novicedeveloper, but there's a dedicated wiki page as well: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Kernel/Dev
<dholbach> good morning
<mok0> goodmorning dholbach
<novicedeveloper> artfwo: ok. i may find something good there.. :).. thnakyou
<novicedeveloper> dholbach: good morning
<novicedeveloper> artfwo: *thank you
<dholbach> hi mok0
<novicedeveloper> artfwo: thankyou for help.. there is lot given in  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Kernel/Dev.. i will read it.. :)
<novicedeveloper> dholbach: hi. i have read your class of "Getting started with ubuntu development".. it was teally informative.. hope to look forward help from you... :)
<dholbach> novicedeveloper, that's great
<novicedeveloper> dholbach: *really
<dholbach> if you have any questions, just ask in here - there's always somebody around who can try to help you
<novicedeveloper> dholbach: ok. thanks.. :)
<dholbach> ROCK ON! :)
<novicedeveloper> dholbach: yooo.... \o/...
<dholbach> :-D
<mok0> dholbach: what was the idea re: the ubuntu-packaging guide? It still seems to be a stub
<dholbach> mok0, did you check out lp:ubuntu-packaging-guide?
<dholbach> that's where it happens :)
<mok0> dholbach: I did, but I don't see any action
<dholbach> mok0, I contributed 3 guides to it and barry is working on getting UDD docs merged in
<dholbach> some other bugs are assigned and work is in progress
<dholbach> it's not a fast moving target (yet), but there's actually people working on it
<mok0> dholbach: Any coordination going on? I'd like to contribute, but not sure what is needed
<dholbach> mok0, we filed bugs for articles that we'd like to see - we use merge proposals to peer-review stuff that goes in
<mok0> dholbach: Is the idea that it should replace what's on the Wiki?
<mok0> dholbach: I'll go check out the LP project I guess
<dholbach> mok0, in the long run, yes probably - for now we want to create useful articles that are task-based (as opposed to one huge guide) and additional knowledge base articles that deal with more general topics
<dholbach> there's also a spec that explains which old content we could merge in, but what might need updating
<dholbach> let me get the link
<dholbach> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Specs/ImprovePackagingGuide
<mok0> dholbach: I'll grab bug #704845
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 704845 in Ubuntu Packaging Guide "Add article explaining how to work with Debian/Upstream" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/704845
<mok0> dholbach: I drafted something on the wiki for that
<dholbach> sweet
<dholbach> thanks a bunch mok0
<dholbach> Laney, ^
<dholbach> yoohoo! :)
<Laney> :-)
<mok0> Laney, dholbach actually, come to think of it, what I drafted was the reverse: a guide for upstreams on how to work with Ubuntu
<mok0> Laney: dholbach, but perhaps it makes sense to put in the same guide?
<dholbach> that might be interesting as well
<dholbach> yeah, if not in the "task-based" section, it would be an excellent "knowledge-base" article
<dholbach> I'll work with barry to get his huge branch in, then I'll juggle pieces around a little bit
<dholbach> but if you make it a separate article for now, we'll have no problems integrating it
<mok0> dholbach: I might as well start there
<dholbach> thanks a lot mok0
<mok0> dholbach: I guess I should join the team
<dholbach> you already are
<dholbach> ubuntu-dev and ubuntu-core-doc are in there
<mok0> dholbach: heh, indeed
<dholbach> :-D
<mok0> dholbach: so work-flow is to work in a branch ?
<dholbach> yes, branch from lp:ubuntu-packaging-guide, commit, push to a separate branch, propose merge
<dholbach> I'll do my best to review as quickly as possible and get more other folks involved in reviewing stuff as well
<dholbach> Laney, ^ :)
<mok0> dholbach: great
<slomo> hi, is anybody updating gst-plugins-bad0.10, gst-plugins-ugly0.10 and their multiverse variants?
<mok0> dholbach: I also wrote this draft: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/GettingStartedDraft
<mok0> dholbach: but I ran out of ideas and time
<dholbach> mok0, I wrote three articles "Very general introduction to Ubuntu Development", "Getting set up" and "how to fix a bug" - I could imagine that some of the info in your article would be very helpful to get merged in there - what do you think?
<mok0> dholbach: perhaps, but this is more like a self-paced course, with exercises etc
<dholbach> I like the idea of exercises
<mok0> dholbach: yes, it's a good way to get people started
<dholbach> I'm not sure what's the best way of integrating them
<dholbach> if you have a good suggestion, I'm all ears :)
<mok0> dholbach: The three articles you mentioned ^ , where are they?
<dholbach> in the root directory?
<dholbach> err root of the source tree :)
<dholbach> the .rst files
<mok0> dholbach: ah, they are already in the branch, I see
<dholbach> rock!
<mok0> dholbach: I will reformat to rst and add my gettingstarteddraft, then we can work on it together
<mok0> dholbach: perhaps merge etc
<mok0> dholbach: I can't find my upstream guide on the wiki.
<mok0> dholbach: It's lost in the jungle
<mok0> dholbach: and I can't see that I have a link to it... :-/
<mok0> The problem with wikis...
<dholbach> ok, let's start with the gettingstarteddraft
<dholbach> I hope that once we have a lot of content in the branch we can sit together and think of a good structure for it
<dholbach> the way I see it right now, it'd be good to have some kind of simple landing page that links you to the knowledge base articles (common problems to avoid when packaging, DEP-3, how to triple-check your new package, etc.) and lists tasks that people who like to do (fix a simple bug, update a package to a new version, propose a change for sponsorship, etc.) - I realiase that this might not be the perfect recipe for everything, but I feel it's a
<dholbach>  good start
<mok0> dholbach: sounds good
<mok0> dholbach: is there another way to search the wiki? The search field only searches titles.
<dholbach> there should be a link to "full text search" no?
<mok0> dholbach: ah. Google :-)
<mok0> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UpstreamGuide
<dholbach> yeehaw
<dholbach> so who apart from mok0 is interested in helping out with the packaging guide?
<dholbach> it'd be really nice if you all signed up for the team mailing list
<dholbach> and checked https://code.launchpad.net/ubuntu-packaging-guide/+activereviews every now and then
<mok0> dholbach: on the mL now. Can you give me a hint how to render .rst text?
<mok0> dholbach: format seems simple enough
<dholbach> run "make html"
<dholbach> and open the file in _build/html/ in a browser
<mok0> dholbach: ah :-)
<dholbach> there might be an immediate "rst viewer", but I don't know
<dholbach> that's what I did :)
<mok0> dholbach: didn't notice the Makefile in there...
<dholbach> if you prefer pdf, you can run "make pdf" too (and lots of other things)
<dholbach> for .pdf you might need all the build-deps of the package though
<mok0> dholbach: is this packaging-guide meant to go online as HTML sometime?
<dholbach> mok0, yes
<hggdh> what replaces multilib in karmic? gcc-multilib and gcc-4.4-multilib are both phantom packages
<hggdh> bah, just an amazingly restricted sources.list
<Laney> debfx: cheers for the haskell help \o
<c2tarun> what is revision control?
<micahg> c2tarun: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revision_control
<debfx> Laney: you're welcome :)
<c2tarun> I was trying to grab a package for merging or sync ( as needed) I got this warning http://paste.ubuntu.com/568832/ What does it mean?
<micahg> it means the Debian source is maintained in svn
<c2tarun> micahg: so what is so special with it? I mean why a warning?
<micahg> c2tarun: it points people to where the packaging code lives if they want to work on it,
<c2tarun> micahg: ok.
<c2tarun> micahg: whenever we grab a package using the grab script, it unpacks the tarball and applies all the patches. but when I try to remove those patches by quilt pop -a then I always get the message no patches removed. Why so?
<c2tarun> ls
<c2tarun> oops :(
<micahg> c2tarun: no, it doesn't necessarily apply all the patches
<micahg> c2tarun: you probably need to set up .quiltrc
<c2tarun> micahg: do you mean export QUILT_PATCH=debian/patches line in .quiltrc?
<micahg> QUILT_PATCHES
<c2tarun> micahg: yup my bad sorry :( ok i'll do it.
<grunthus> Hi, I have been working on a bugfix, need a little help with commit and push commands
<grunthus> First, after bzr ci, in the text editor, should I describe changes in same fashion as with changelog files?
<lifeless> install bzr builddeb
<lifeless> then you can just use debcommit
<grunthus> Hi lifeless, AFAIK, because its the trunk, there is no deb
<grunthus> bug 715820
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 715820 in ubuntuone-control-panel (Ubuntu) "No tooltip for disconnect button" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/715820
#ubuntu-motu 2011-02-19
<grunthus> Thanks lifeless, found out its like this:
<grunthus> https://code.launchpad.net/~chris-ascentsoftware/ubuntuone-control-panel/fixes_715820
<arand> Do most(all) packages use xpm files for icons?
<c2tarun> I am grabbing a package by grab.merge.sh script and its automatically applying the patch. I updated the .quiltrc file but still nothing happned. I tried to pop the patch but No patches found. When I am pushing I am getting Hunk** failed. What should I do?
<c2tarun> I am grabbing a package by grab.merge.sh script and its automatically applying the patch. I updated the .quiltrc file but still nothing happned. I tried to pop the patch but No patches found. When I am pushing I am getting Hunk** failed. What should I do?
<artfwo> c2tarun, are you trying to undo the patch, which is applied after unpacking source package?
<c2tarun> artfwo: yup
<artfwo> c2tarun, but why do you want to undo the patch?
<c2tarun> artfwo: unless I wont pop the patch I wont be able to create proper source package. I will always get error that hunk failed.
<artfwo> I thought, if a package uses quilt, it should automatically unapply the patch when creating source package
<artfwo> which package are you trying to merge?
<c2tarun> artfwo: freevo
<artfwo> c2tarun, did you fix the conflict in debian/rules?
<c2tarun> artfwo: I think so, the line in ubuntu is just a comment, so all I need to see is how the package responds with debian line.
<artfwo> so, you want to build the base debian version?
<c2tarun> artfwo: I'll do that as well, its the only way to check that I should call for a sync or merge>
<artfwo> (I'm still downloading the source package, so I have trouble figuring your problem)
<c2tarun> artfwo: I can wait :)
<c2tarun> artfwo: in rules file there are two lines including two mk files. They are grabbing them from my system, but they are not present there.
<c2tarun> artfwo: one is debhelper.mk and other is python-distutils.mk
<artfwo> c2tarun, these are files from cdbs
<artfwo> they're supposed to be present in /usr/share/cdbs
<artfwo> and cdbs is a build-dependency for freevo
<c2tarun> yup they were missing, I installed build deps and done. :)
<c2tarun> artfwo: hey pacakge is build succesfully. :/
<artfwo> c2tarun, I've managed to build it too just a moment ago
<c2tarun> artfwo: sorry but I was not aware that packages get automatically unapplied. I ran into a package trouble 2 days ago and I thought I should be careful :(
<artfwo> I only had experience with 3.0 format (quilt) and cdbs, so I can't say that's true for all packaging schemes
<c2tarun> artfwo: BTW you build the package with debian line in rules file or without it?>
<c2tarun> what about this error: dpkg-source: error: File ./freevo_1.9.0.orig.tar.gz has size 34309907 instead of expected 27182867
<c2tarun> ping^^
<c2tarun> can anyone please help me with this error: dpkg-source: error: File ./freevo_1.9.0.orig.tar.gz has size 34309907 instead of expected 27182867
<c2tarun> can anyone please help me with this error: dpkg-source: error: File ./freevo_1.9.0.orig.tar.gz has size 34309907 instead of expected 27182867
<artfwo> c2tarun, sorry I was away
<c2tarun> artfwo: no prob :)
<c2tarun> artfwo: can you help me with that error?
<artfwo> i don't know the reason, why this error occurs
<artfwo> but I'd just redownload freevo_1.9.0.orig.tar.gz and overwrite the file in the merge directory
<artfwo> and to answer your question, I've built the package with the Ubuntu fix
<c2tarun> artfwo: you tested your build on pbuilder?
<artfwo> no, by simply running debuild on my working system
<c2tarun> artfwo: try testing it on pbuilder as well.
<artfwo> I cannot do this right now, because I have a slow internet connection here
<artfwo> does it build in pbuilder for you?
<udienz> c2tarun, conratulation your merge (epdfview) has been approved
<c2tarun> nope I got that error of size mismatch. Can you please tell me the size of your orig.tar.gz
<c2tarun> udienz: thanks :)
<artfwo> c2tarun, my orig.tar.gz is exactly 27182867 bytes
<c2tarun> artfwo: hmm.... that is weird. that means something is wrong with grab.merge.sh script?
<artfwo> unlikely, because I downloaded the merge tree by running grab-merge.sh
<c2tarun> artfwo: but you just said that you redownloaded the orig tarball and overwrote the file in merge directory.
<artfwo> no
<artfwo> I said, I would do that, if I needed to fix the error :)
<artfwo> or just remove the entire merge directory and start over
<c2tarun> artfwo: hmm... that may be a better option, but still my problem is unexplained :( I am going to  try :)
<artfwo> well, I cannot explain it, but maybe someone else here can
<c2tarun> i'll try it from start :) and wait for some to explain my prob :) thanks for helping. I'll request a merge when I'll complete it :)
<c2tarun> artfwo: ping
<c2tarun> can anyone please take a look at this bug for sponsorship bug 721686 Thank you
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 721686 in freevo (Ubuntu) "Please merge freevo_1.9.0-10 from Debian unstable" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/721686
<artfwo> yes, c2tarun?
<c2tarun> need sponsorship bug 721686 thank you
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 721686 in freevo (Ubuntu) "Please merge freevo_1.9.0-10 from Debian unstable" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/721686
<shadeslayer> c2tarun: +	#rm debian/tmp/usr/share/freevo/icons/themes/geexbox/mimetypes/folder.png
<shadeslayer> if we don't need that, remove it
<shadeslayer> and the changelog is wrong
<shadeslayer> -freevo (1.9.0-10) unstable; urgency=high << Why did you remove that?
<shadeslayer> c2tarun: fix the changelog please :)
<shadeslayer> kthxbai
<hakermania> bdrung: Hello, what's going on with wallch's review :) ?
<ari-tczew> bdrung: dget https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+archive/primary/+files/gdk-pixbuf_2.23.0-1ubuntu2.dsc and try to run update-maintainer
 * RainCT wonders if anyone here is using Ubuntu with a touch screen
<hyperair> is there any tool that creates a dsc out of an orig.tar.gz and debian.tar.gz  file?
<ScottK> You could do it by hand, but it'd take a few steps.
<hyperair> hmm yeah
<geser> why can't you "unpack" the source and call "dpkg-source -b" on it?
<hyperair> i could
<hyperair> but then debian.tar.gz would change checksums
<hyperair> though i guess it doesn't really matter
<ari-tczew> hyperair: why are you taking to sponsor a bug assigned to someone else?
<hyperair> ari-tczew: er
<hyperair> which bug?
<ari-tczew> hyperair: bug 721702
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 721702 in systemtap (Ubuntu) "Please merge systemtap 1.3-2 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/721702
<hyperair> oh sorry about that
<hyperair> i guess i didn't refresh the page
<ari-tczew> ...
<hyperair> ari-tczew: also, i didn't realize there was a custom to assign a bug to the sponsor. i thought it was assigned to the sponsoree.
<ari-tczew> hyperair: o_O
 * hyperair shrugs
<hyperair> maybe i'm outdated
<hyperair> but that was the practice before i became motu
<hyperair> and i haven't sponsored stuff for some time as i was pretty busy
<ari-tczew> hyperair: so advices for future: 1st refresh the page before taking a look
<ari-tczew> 2nd check whether bug reported and assigned is the same person
<hyperair> ari-tczew: more like i was already taking a look, but didn't assign the bug to myself.
<hyperair> ari-tczew: but yes, i'll keep an eye out for it in the future[
<ari-tczew> reporter*
<hyperair> thanks
 * hyperair reads through https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Sponsorship/SponsorsQueue again
<ari-tczew> hyperair: and 3rd in future if you're taking bug to sponsor, assign to myself
 * hyperair nods
<c2tarun> need help with this control file entry http://paste.ubuntu.com/569292/
<c2tarun> I think the Maintainer and XSBC* entry will be the one of ubuntu one, but I am not sure about the other two entries. Can anyone please help
<hyperair> update the Vcs- fields
<hyperair> keep the *Maintainer fields
<hyperair> looks like ampache has moved from svn to git.
<ari-tczew> c2tarun: I really encourage to patch d/control manually
<ari-tczew> so get debian source, unpack by dpkg-source -x *.dsc and do merge professionally
 * hyperair stuff everything into git and lets it do the merge
<ari-tczew> sometimes it will get more time but you will get to know how it works
<hyperair> stuffs*
<c2tarun> actually I am new and dont know what git is actually, so even If i do it manually I'll not be able to understand, Can you please give me any documentation on git?
<mok0> c2tarun: better do it manually then
<ari-tczew> +1 ^^
<c2tarun> mok0 ari-tczew: ya I can take a look on control file manually :) but still it will be the same entries separately that are mentioned together in the control file by mom.
<atagar> Hi (again). A package I maintain was just added to natty (https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/natty/+source/tor-arm/1.4.0.1-2) - can I now file a ticket to request a backport or should I wait until natty has been released?
<ari-tczew> c2tarun: changes (delta) will be the same yes but you don't have a mess in d/control
<ari-tczew> atagar: you can do it right now
<atagar> fantastic - thanks
<mok0> c2tarun: It seems the maintainer moved from svn to git for maintaining the package
<c2tarun> mok0: what are svn and git actually?
<c2tarun> !svn
<ubottu> svn is Subversion: an open-source revision control system, which aims to be a compelling replacement for CVS. See http://subversion.tigris.org/
<c2tarun> !git
<ubottu> Git is a distributed revision control/software code management project created by Linus Torvalds. For more information, see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Git_(software)
<mok0> c2tarun: there you go :-)
<hyperair> mok0!
<ari-tczew> c2tarun: looking on ampache example, I guess easier is unpack current natty's source and add Debian changes from -10 revision
<ari-tczew> (*10.patch)
<ari-tczew> but you have to do it manually on unpacked natty's source of ampache
<c2tarun> ari-tczew: after adding the debian changes I have to run update-maintainer that will change Maintainer and XSBC* entries, and as mok0 told that maintainer moved from svn to git, I think those entries will be good in debian's control. so I think these entries will be good for control file http://paste.ubuntu.com/569294/  can you please take a look.
 * hyperair recommends using something like meld
 * ari-tczew wonders if maintainer has switched to git why these changes are not in Debian...
<hyperair> ari-tczew: the Vcs- fields were updated in the debian revision though..
<hyperair> ari-tczew: and the merge is bringing them in
<ari-tczew> hyperair: so what's the problem
<hyperair> ari-tczew: nothing?
<c2tarun> so should I make the changes as I suggested?
<ari-tczew> c2tarun: let me grab-merge ampache
<c2tarun> ari-tczew: sure.
<mok0> hi hyperair
<hyperair> hey mok0
<hyperair> long time no see. =D
<mok0> hyperair: indeed
<hyperair> =)
<mok0> meld is good. /me loves meld
 * iulian nods.
<ari-tczew> old army? :)
<c2tarun> ari-tczew: grabbed the package?
<ari-tczew> c2tarun: not yet, I have to finish some things
<c2tarun> sure :) I'll wait, just ping me.
<ari-tczew> c2tarun: OK grabbed. I had to recreate MoM patches, as well. Why recreate? See more info on bug 711454
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 711454 in Merge-o-Matic "Patches include .pc files and directly changes on files" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/711454
<zooko> So is the 24th of this month -- Thursday -- the deadline for https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/tahoe-lafs/+bug/719092 ?
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 719092 in tahoe-lafs (Ubuntu) "please upgrade to Tahoe-LAFS v1.8.2" [Wishlist,New]
<ari-tczew> c2tarun: OK I see d/controls right now, could you ask me again on what do you wonder?
<c2tarun> ari-tczew: Not getting, what do you mean by wrong patch?
<ari-tczew> .pc files in patches created by MoM
<c2tarun> ari-tczew: actually what do you mean by wrong? How can a patch be a wrong? I mean if it is wrong the package wouldn't compile.
<ari-tczew> c2tarun: this is probably bzr issue, MoM just gives you messed patches
<ari-tczew> if you want to get clear patches, you have to do these commants:
<ari-tczew> debdiff ampache_3.5.4-9.dsc ampache_3.5.4-10.dsc > ampache_3.5.4-10.patch
<ari-tczew> debdiff ampache_3.5.4-9.dsc ampache_3.5.4-9ubuntu4.dsc > ampache_3.5.4-9ubuntu4.patch
<c2tarun> ari-tczew: and I was wondering about Vcs-svn and Vcs-Browser entries, in older version maintainer was using Svn, but in newer it is git, so What the entries should be?
<c2tarun> ari-tczew: I think the entries should be as I mentioned in my pastebin.
<ari-tczew> c2tarun: ampache_3.5.4-9ubuntu4.patch shows current Ubuntu delta and I don't see changed Vcs-* fields, so don't touch this and keep Debian style.
<ari-tczew> udienz: Write in bug 721722 why this sync is necessary point out to bug of sync squid3.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 721722 in squid-langpack (Ubuntu) "Sync squid-langpack 20110214-1 (main) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/721722
<c2tarun> ari-tczew: I have a question, I builded the new native debian version of ampache on natty machine, and it builded succesfully. Is it still necessary to merge? I mean why merge when it is building without any problem?
<c2tarun> ari-tczew: exactly I mean why apply ampache_3.5.4-9ubuntu4.patch when its not needed?
<ari-tczew> c2tarun: builded is english wrong, built is OK
<c2tarun> ari-tczew: sorry :9
<c2tarun> :(
<ari-tczew> c2tarun: fact that package built fine it doesn't mean that you can drop all changes.
<c2tarun> ari-tczew: it means if mom fails we have to merge?
<ari-tczew> c2tarun: I have to know that merging process are not always can be automatically done by MoM. It usually has to be done manually.
<ari-tczew> s/I have/You have
<c2tarun> ari-tczew: actually I was thinking about a sync, if the package is built succesfully than we can also go for sync? am i right?
<ari-tczew> c2tarun: You must understand changes done in Ubuntu and figure out whether and which changes are incorporated in Debian. Then you have to sort out which changes are still nedeed in Ubuntu.
<ari-tczew> c2tarun: Did you check whether changes from Ubuntu were incorporated in Debian?
<c2tarun> ari-tczew: hmm... according to changelog, there are many changes for ubuntu, how can i check whether these changes are incorporated in debian or not?
<ari-tczew> c2tarun: Open ampache_3.5.4-9ubuntu4.patch and ampache_3.5.4-10.patch and compare.
<c2tarun> ari-tczew: I think they are incorporated, please look the debdiff of ampache_3.5.4-10.dsc ampache_3.5.4-9ubuntu4.dsc
<ari-tczew> c2tarun: Yes, all changes have been incorporated in Debian. It's ready to sync,
<c2tarun> ari-tczew: good :) still I dont know how to sync :(
<c2tarun> !sync
<ubottu> Helpful information for filing a sync request can be found at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SyncRequestProcess
<hggdh> why would a quilt patch (first patch in the series) fail, but a 'patch --dry-run' on the patch succed?
<ScottK> Quilt (IIRC) assumes -p1.  Maybe you had it different for the dry run?
<hggdh> no, I had -p1: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/569316/
<hggdh> oops. hum... I dry-ran on a different patch, let me check again
<hggdh> nope dry-run still succeeds
<hggdh_> got it
<c2tarun> need help in filing a sync request. Error: failed to connect mx.launchpad.net. What is mx.launchpad.net?
<jmarsden> c2tarun: mx.launchpad.net is the machine indium.canonical.com, at IP 91.189.90.7
<c2tarun> why did requestsync failed to connect?
<c2tarun> jmarsden: ^^
<jmarsden> c2tarun: Sorry, I don't know the answer to that, I am not anything official at Canonical or Launchpad :)  Do you have good working connectivity to mx.launchpad.net ?  You might want to ask in #launchpad
<c2tarun> jmarsden: thanks :) I'll try once more if it fails again, I'll ask on #launchpad
<zooko> Anybody want to help upgrade Tahoe-LAFS in Ubuntu?
<zooko> There has been much talk recently about Freedom-Compatible tools, including Tahoe-LAFS.
<lifeless> zooko: what help do you need?
<zooko> lifeless: hm...
<zooko> lifeless: take the package v1.7.1 that is already in Ubuntu, upgrade it to the latest release, build a new package. :-)
<jmarsden> zooko: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Complete#Updating%20an%20Ubuntu%20Package
<zooko> I don't have a working linux system at the moment.
<zooko> Although I might soon if this dual boot project works out.
<lifeless> zooko: what system do you have?
<zooko> lifeless: OSX
<hggdh_> ari-tczew: hi, sorry for the delay, bug bug 663925 now has a branch for lucid-updates
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 663925 in ncmpcpp (Ubuntu Lucid) "ncmpcpp (version < 0. 5.4) can cause unexpected deletion of files" [Undecided,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/663925
<lifeless> zooko: doesn't that come with a vm thingy?
<ari-tczew> hggdh_: hi! ok thanks for spending time on it. :-)
<zooko> lifeless: I could install virtualbox and install ubuntu in vbox.
<hggdh_> ari-tczew: also, this is my first branch, so please correct me
<zooko> That is approximately as much work as installing ubuntu dual-boot,...
<ari-tczew> hggdh_: OK.
<lifeless> zooko: I find that having any secondary platforms available as vms makes adhoc fixes on those platforms a lot easier
<lifeless> zooko: thats the only reason I suggest it
<ari-tczew> hggdh_: could you add DEP3 tags to patch?
<hggdh_> ari-tczew: darn! I forgot -- again... will do
<ari-tczew> hggdh_: I pointed out issues on branch review.
<hggdh_> ari-tczew: going there noew
<hggdh_> ari-tczew: same format as my original patch to Maverick? I remember you had some issues there, but I do not remember which -- http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/569371/
<ari-tczew> hggdh_: Generally yes, but would be nice to have a note in description that you have adjusted this patch to 0.4.1.
<hggdh_> ari-tczew: sure, will do
<hggdh_> ari-tczew: no problem is it is an update to the branch?
<ari-tczew> hggdh_: No, but I guess I can't merge branch directly, since there is no lucid-proposed branch.
<ari-tczew> It will be direct upload to archive via dput.
<hggdh_> and -- IIRC -- we cannot set it to lucid-proposed, correct?
<hggdh_> I guess this is what you said...
<ari-tczew> hggdh_: Yes, we cannot.
<hggdh_> ari-tczew: done
<hggdh_> oh hell, indication applet is barfing continuously...
#ubuntu-motu 2011-02-20
<weboide> Hey there, could I have someone's attention about bug 708504 ? php5-fpm got dropped along the way and php5 5.3.5-1 in debian seems to be the only package to have php5-fpm included again.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 708504 in php5 (Ubuntu) "[needs-packaging] PHP 5.3.5 is available." [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/708504
<ari-tczew> siretart: libva for natty: bug 721978
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 721978 in libva (Ubuntu) "Sync libva 1.0.8-3 (main) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/721978
<paultag> I'm having an issue, hackers. I've got a d/rules file that generates the upstream tarball (with some --exclude calls), and I can't get it to match upstream's tarball
<paultag> I've tried extracting upstream, repacking (and they don't match)
<paultag> my generated tarballs don't match, and when I manually remove what I'm excluding and create it, it does not match any of it
<paultag> I have 4 tarballs, and 4 different md5sums. I'm wicked confused
<broder> i don't think tar or gzip are designed to give you the same thing repeatably
<broder> that's why we have things like pristine-tar
<broder> (gzip in particular includes the time it was generated in the header)
<paultag> hummm
<paultag> well when I md5sum `find .` inside the archive, and write that stdout to a file, they all match
<broder> yes
<paultag> so I guess that makes sense
<c2tarun> I was trying to merge a package, the error posted in REPORT is the conflict b/w these lines in a file http://paste.ubuntu.com/569478/ I think both lines will do fine. but debian's new line is more explanatroy than ubuntu's Which line should I add. (I suggest debian's)
<micahg> c2tarun: if we didn't make any changes to that line, we take Debian's, if the reason we changed it no longer applies, we take Debian's
<c2tarun> micahg: so I should take debian's and request for a merge?
<micahg> c2tarun: I would have to look at the package to say for sure
<c2tarun> micahg: actually what should I look in order to check this line.
<micahg> c2tarun: see if it's in the UBuntu patch
<c2tarun> micahg: this line is in the patch that is what creating the conflict. Isn't it?
<c2tarun> :q
<micahg> c2tarun: yeah, so now you have to see why we changed that
<c2tarun> micahg: sorry mate, i got to go now, i'll come back and work on this merge, thank you
<c2tarun> micahg: ping
<c2tarun> there are some packages on this link https://merges.ubuntu.com/universe.html which dont have any problem in merging, still they are there. Why are they not merged automatically?
<ari-tczew> c2tarun: MoM has been crashed and doesn't update anymore. it needs to be fixed by core devs. I pinged cjwatson yesterday for it.
<hakermania> bdrung: In 4 days, the advocation process for Ubuntu Natty 11.04 is over. How is the advocation of  http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/wallch ?
<hakermania> How is it going?
<ari-tczew> hakermania: maybe tumbleweed could give you adocate
<hakermania> tumbleweed: Can you advocate my package?
<hakermania> ai-tczew: Thx, buddy.
<hakermania> tsou re
<hakermania> e
<Adri2000> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/63056953/buildlog_ubuntu-natty-i386.homebank_4.2.1-1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz <- any idea? it seems to be due to some change in natty, as the same package builds perfectly well in maverick...
<ari-tczew> Adri2000: FTBFS due to gcc 4.5.
<ari-tczew> Adri2000: Maverick bases on older gcc, that's works.
<ari-tczew> Adri2000: I encourage to get in touch with upstream.
<Adri2000> ari-tczew: probably won't have enough time to get in touch with upstream, as I'd like to upload a new version before feature freeze. do you know what the problem is exactly? and even how to fix it? :)
<ari-tczew> Adri2000: I guess try to add -Wl, --no-add-needed to LDFLAGS/LIBS. If it won't help, upstream has to fix it in source.
<Leon-Wallch> please make a review to Wallch before 24th of February --> http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/wallch
<ari-tczew> hyperair: 4th suggestion: when you're building source, please use debuild with option -vLAST_UBUNTU_REVISION
<hyperair> ari-tczew: okay.
<hyperair> ari-tczew: i think i might have missed it for one of the packages, but i usually do that when i remember to.
<ari-tczew> hyperair: Sure, mistakes sometimes could occur.
<mr_pouit> ari-tczew: playing with LDFLAGS won't solve an include issueâ¦
<ari-tczew> mr_pouit: so it's place to work for upstream.
<c2tarun> ari-tczew: does changing name in launchpad will also change it while signature?
<c2tarun> ari-tczew: I mean while editing changelog?
<ari-tczew> c2tarun: nope
<c2tarun> ari-tczew: how can i fix that?
<ari-tczew> c2tarun: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Intro/PackageUpdate
<c2tarun> ari-tczew: what is binutils-gold?
<c2tarun> !binutils-gold
<ari-tczew> c2tarun: http://wiki.debian.org/ToolChain/DSOLinking
<c2tarun> ari-tczew: and one more thing, what is feature freeze?
<ari-tczew> !FF
<ubottu> firefox is the default web-browser on Ubuntu. To install the latest version, see https://help.ubuntu.com/community/FirefoxNewVersion Installing plugins: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FirefoxPlugins - See also !firefox-3.5
<ari-tczew> !FFe
<ubottu> Feature Freeze Exception. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess for the freeze exception process.
<ari-tczew> c2tarun: ^^
<c2tarun> ari-tczew: thanks :)
<ari-tczew> np
<Turl> hi all
<Turl> is it still time to sync a debian package to ubuntu?
<hyperair> yes.
<hyperair> feature freeze is on february 24th.
<Turl> thanks hyperair
<hyperair> np
<Turl> hyperair: is there any ubuntu channel with X/video/graphis people and packagers?
<ari-tczew> Turl: #ubuntu-x
<Turl> thanks
<ari-tczew> np
<micahg> c2tarun: merges at this point are done if the benefit of merging outweighs the risk of regressions
<micahg> ari-tczew: it's not about a core-dev for MoM, but rather someone with access to the server
<c2tarun> micahg: risk of regressions? what is it?
<micahg> c2tarun: where uploading a new version breaks itself or a lot of other applications
<c2tarun> micahg: as its too late for merges, how else can I contribute?
<micahg> c2tarun: not too late, just benefit needs to outweigh risk
<micahg> c2tarun: FTBFS would be great
<ari-tczew> micahg: I suggested the same.
<c2tarun> micahg: ok, and yes ari-tczew also suggested me to go for FTBFS, I dont have very good coding background. How can I fix ftbfs?
<ari-tczew> c2tarun: you can fix FTBFS with binutils-gold/linking no-add-needed, it's easy
<ari-tczew> c2tarun: go to udienz or doko LP page and check his uploaded packages how they fixed FTBFS
<ari-tczew> c2tarun: here you can look for FTBFS: http://udd.debian.org/cgi-bin/ubuntu_ftbfs.cgi
<paultag> debfx: finally got around to helping get fluxbox 1.3 out, thanks for taking care of my baby in Ubuntu while I was busy :)
<debfx> paultag: np, want me to sync it to ubuntu?
<paultag> debfx: that'd be awesome! I have a bug open, if you need it
<paultag> debfx: 722232
<debfx> paultag: I take it you have tested that it works fine on natty? :)
<paultag> debfx: an hour ago :) -- https://launchpad.net/~paultag/+archive/fluxbox/+packages
<paultag> oh shucks, that's maverick
<paultag> debfx: yeah, I tested locally. Worth testing again, but it works :)
<paultag> thanks, debfx :)
<weboide> Hey all, would there be anybody available to take a quick look at bug 722007 (and possibly bug 708504)?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 722007 in php5 (Ubuntu) "php5-fpm is missing in natty" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/722007
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 708504 in php5 (Ubuntu) "[needs-packaging] PHP 5.3.5 is available." [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/708504
<micahg> weboide: not happening this cycle
<weboide> micahg: what do you mean?
<micahg> weboide: we're going to stick with Debian WRT PHP
<weboide> micahg: I see, but could just php5-fpm be reintroduced then? since this would be a regression from maverick
<micahg> it's a little too late to introduce a new PHP version
<weboide> micahg: wouldn't it be possible just to enable to php-fpm build?
<micahg> weboide: you'd have to ask the server team
<micahg> weboide: I'll mark bug 722007 as a regression though
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 722007 in php5 (Ubuntu) "php5-fpm is missing in natty" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/722007
<weboide> micahg: thanks for your time
<micahg> weboide: the server team is in #ubuntu-server or you can ask on their mailing list, but you might not get a response until Monday
<weboide> micahg: okay, I will check with them, thanks for help with this!
<c_korn> how can I set the working directory of an application? problem: data files are under /usr/share/2ManDVD and executable is under /usr/lib/2ManDVD. now there is a symbolic link in /usr/share/2ManDVD to the executable. if I call it from there the executable does not find its resources because it says the working directory is /usr/lib/2ManDVD
<zooko> Folks: FYI POX and warner are working on packaging Tahoe-LAFS for Debian over on irc.oftc.net #debian-python.
<zooko> Context: Tahoe-LAFS v1.7.1 is in Ubuntu already, but I hope someone will upgrade it to v1.8.2 for Natty.
<zooko> More context: Tahoe-LAFS is widely thought of as being a good candidate to be part of the new Freedom Box project that Eben Moglen recently spoke about and got written up in the New York Times.
<zooko> This has spurred interest in freshening up the Tahoe-LAFS debian packaging.
#ubuntu-motu 2012-02-13
<TheMuso> What directory is one supposed to upload to on revu? I am using dput in precise, and the default revu config doesn't seem to be working.
<dholbach> good morning
<dupondje> Hi, a depend on "mysql-client-5.1 | mysql-client" should just be fine in precise ?
<dupondje> as mysql-client is meta package for mysql-client-5.5 ?
<micahg> binary depends or build depends?
<micahg> binary depends is fine
 * micahg wonders why he thinks there would be binary depends on mysql-client
<dupondje> micahg: its binary depends
<dupondje> http://anonscm.debian.org/gitweb/?p=users/zigo/automysqlbackup.git;a=blob;f=debian/control
<dupondje> so https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/automysqlbackup/+bug/931123 should be just fine no ?
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 931123 in automysqlbackup (Ubuntu) "Sync automysqlbackup 2.6+debian-1 (universe) from Debian testing (main)" [Wishlist,Incomplete]
<micahg> dupondje: yes, that's fine
<TheMuso> What directory is one supposed to upload to on revu? I am using dput in precise, and the default revu config doesn't seem to be working.
<TheMuso> It seems /incoming doesn't exist, and the dput precise config for review uses /cinoming for uploads...
<cancer> can any one help me in contributing to Ubuntu
<bkerensa> Anyone around for a quick question on low priority values in debian/control?
<bkerensa> :)
<geser> bkerensa: just ask your question
<Rhonda> "It would be nice to update the ubuntu software center with an new high resolution icon, a new description and the latest version of wesnoth."
<Rhonda> â¦ if only I know what's the issue with the current icon or description is in there, and whether wesnoth-1.10 does appear (on precise) in the software center â¦
<mr_pouit> Rhonda: http://imagebin.org/198691
<Rhonda> thats french (and 1.8 â¦)
<Rhonda> thanks :)
<mr_pouit> yeah, it's in French sorry, but at least you can see the icon ;>
<Rhonda> yep :)
<Rhonda> but not understand the issue with the description
<mr_pouit> I guess something in app-install-data is wrongly generated
<mr_pouit> the icon for 1.10 /usr/share/app-install/icons/wesnoth-1.10-icon doesn't have a (.png) extension
<Rhonda> i think i was told to drop the .png part from the desktop file
<Rhonda> might that be the reason?
<Rhonda> hmm, no, that seems to have been dropped from 1.8, too
<Rhonda> but png doesn't scale
<Rhonda> and I fear I don't have any high resolution icon, I'll ask upstream
<Rhonda> what resolution would be needed?  it's 64x64 currently
<Rhonda> and in your screenshot it looks way smaller than that, mr_pouit
<mr_pouit> you should probably ask mvo about that
<raju> ajmitch: hello
<dupondje> Is there a way to see reverse build depends ?
<micahg> dupondje: reverse-depends -b
<dupondje> micahg: in what package is reverse-depends ?
<micahg> ubuntu-dev-toools
<micahg> err.2 o's
<Rhonda> grep-dctrl -FBuild-Depends,Indep-Build-Depends $package -sPackage /var/lib/apt/lists/*_Sources
<Rhonda> dctrl-tools is quite helpful :)
<micahg> yes, but we have a tool that does that and makes it pretty
<dupondje> reverse-build-depends it is no ? :)
<dupondje> getting reverse-build-depends: unable to find sources files.
<Rhonda> dctrl-tools is pretty useful for other stuff too  :P
<Rhonda> dupondje: you need to add deb-src lines to your sources.list file
<dupondje> Rhonda: they are added ... :)
<dupondje> but it looks for precise deb-src's prolly ...
<dupondje> and dev machine is on oneiric ... so sources.list only contains oneiric shizzle
<Rhonda> > grep deb-src /etc/apt/sources.list | wc -l
<Rhonda> 8
<Rhonda> Don't let your current chosen distribution limit your deb-src entries. :)
<Rhonda> oh
<Rhonda> grep -c
 * Rhonda hides for useless use of wc :)
<dupondje> hmz
<dupondje> added precise deb-src's in sources.list
<dupondje> main/universe and multiverse
<dupondje> but it doesn't seem to find universe with reverse-build-depends
<micahg> dupondje: reverse-depends isn't dependent on anything on your local system (aside from the ubuntu-dev-tools from precise)
<dupondje> micahg: it does look at entries in sources.list ?
<micahg> dupondje: no, it uses a service (either LP or something from Debian), not so sure on the implementation details
<geser> doesn't it use a "web-service" on ubuntuwire?
<geser> or do I mix it with an other script?
<micahg> I think it does, but I didn't want to say for sure
<Rhonda> def query_rdepends(package, release, arch,
<Rhonda>                    server='http://qa.ubuntuwire.org/rdepends'):
<Rhonda>     """Look up a packages reverse-dependencies on the Ubuntuwire
<Rhonda>     Reverse- webservice
<Rhonda>     """
<Rhonda> looking at the code it does :)
<tumbleweed> dupondje: reverse-build-depends is the old tool. revese-depends is the new one
<Rhonda> reverse-depends -b :)
<dupondje> found now :) added ubuntu-dev-tools ppa :D
<dupondje> thx
<Rhonda> any backporters around? what's the proper suffix for the version string for backporting from precise to e.g. lucid?
<tumbleweed> Rhonda: backportpackage should do the right thing (and the suffix will be ~lucid1 IIRC)
<Rhonda> source change needed, so that tool is out of scope
<tumbleweed> right
<micahg> Rhonda: yes, ~lucid1 is appropriate, but I think we (backporters) still need a debdiff
<tumbleweed> broder: ^ your backports documentation doesn't mention this
<Rhonda> micahg: sure, but that debdiff has to contain the version in the changelog already :)
<micahg> Rhonda: indeed, I appreciate you trying to do it right the first time :)
<tumbleweed> lol: https://lwn.net/Articles/477096/
<micahg> lol
<eQuiNoX__> lol
<broder> tumbleweed: patches welcome! :)
<broder> i'll take a look at some point
<tumbleweed> broder: thought you might say that :)
<broder> it *is* a wiki
<tumbleweed> I'm also not a backporter. but yes, I should have just fixde it
<PatrickNL> Goodday! Sorry for bothering, but I really need some help with a package. The upstream tarball contains a debian/patches/x.diff file which I want to get rid of (actually, I want to get rid of the whole upstream debian/*). Currently, an older version of the package tries to achieve this in the "get-orig-source" target, but this approach doesn't seem to work. If I upload my results to Launchpad Buildserver (my PPA) the packages fails
<PatrickNL> to build because of the upstream patch file. Any hint is appreciated :)
<jtaylor> 3.0 packages should remove upstream debian/ packages on repack
<jtaylor> but that has other issues, you should repack the orig source
<PatrickNL> it's a 1.0 package :S
<jtaylor> and hit upstream with a large stick
<jtaylor> why do they patch their own source?
<PatrickNL> unfortunate, we don't live in an ideal world :(
<PatrickNL> :)
<PatrickNL> But, your suggestion would be to migrate it to a 3.0 package, and implement a "repack" target in the rules file?
<jtaylor> repacking is not done during the build but before
<jtaylor> you take the orig tarball, remove the debian/ and then consider that your new orig tarball
<jtaylor> with a version suffix like +dsX or  +dfsgX
<PatrickNL> ok, thanks
<Rhonda> micahg: Actually I still wonder whether going through with a source-change upload for wesnoth-1.10 instead of *also* backporting fonts-droid to avoid the source change is really the better path â¦
<dupondje> could somebody check https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/automysqlbackup/+bug/931123
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 931123 in automysqlbackup (Ubuntu) "Sync automysqlbackup 2.6+debian-1 (universe) from Debian testing (main)" [Wishlist,Incomplete]
<dupondje> no idea why it would fail to install
<dupondje> anyone ?
<Ampelbein> dupondje: No idea, works fine when put in an apt repository.
<Ampelbein> dpkg -i .... && apt-get -f install wants to remove the package, as the report says. But that shouldn't matter for installability checks.
<Ampelbein> I would say it's a bug/oversight in apt, it's definitely not a problem with your package.
<dupondje> jtaylor: there ?
<jtaylor> dupondje: yes
<dupondje> you have a log when you tried to install automysqlbakup ?
<jtaylor> no it just says cannot install or removes it again depending on what tool you use
<dupondje> thats odd, as it should just install correctly when you have 'mysql-client' installed ?
<Ampelbein> It works in a apt-archive, so those tools need to get fixed imho.
<jtaylor> maybe but the fix is trivial
<dupondje> its indeed easy to fix, but still it should not be needed
<jtaylor> file a bug against the tools then
<jtaylor> barry: numpy 1.6 merge https://code.launchpad.net/~jtaylor/ubuntu/precise/python-numpy/merge-1.6/+merge/92671
<jtaylor> comments welcome
<dupondje> Ampelbein: jtaylor: any debug output of the installation of automysqlbackup? don't have a native precise system here :)
<barry> jtaylor: putting it on the list
<Ampelbein> dupondje: http://paste.ubuntu.com/840800/
<jtaylor> gdebi log: http://paste.ubuntu.com/840803/
<jtaylor> or Cannot install 'mysql-client-5.1'
<Rhonda> Ampelbein: why would apt-get -f install get the package removed?
<jtaylor> because it can't satisfy the dependency, it probably does not check the or
<Rhonda> then its a bug in the package
<Ampelbein> no
<Ampelbein> Depends: mysql-client-5.1 | mysql-client
<Rhonda> if its dependencies cant be satisfied, how is that NOT a bug in the package?
<Ampelbein> It's a OR dependency.
<Rhonda> so?
<jtaylor> its a bug in the package, its using features not generally supported
<Rhonda> is either possible to get satisfied?
<Rhonda> uh?
<Rhonda> or dependencies are generally supported
<Ampelbein> Yes, rhonda, the latter is satisfieable.
<jtaylor> apparently not if one of the or's does nto exist
<Rhonda> then why claim it cant be satisfied? :)
<dupondje> mysql-client is metapackage for mysql-client-5.5 so :)
<dupondje> Rhonda: see http://paste.ubuntu.com/840800/
<Ampelbein> You'd have to ask apt why it thinks it can't be satisfied when using "apt-get -f install". It works perfectly fine when downloading from a repository.
<dupondje> and if you install mysql-client, you can install it with dpkg ?
<Ampelbein> Yes.
<dupondje> So guess it can be synced then ... :) only need to get the apt-get bug fixed, but thats quite minor no ?
<jtaylor> I'm not going to sync it, I like stuff gdebi installable
<jtaylor> I also get Could not open required defaults file: /etc/mysql/debian.cnf
<jtaylor> is that a chroot issue?
<tumbleweed> Adri2000: here you go: http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/transitions/opencv.html
<jtaylor> opencv is such a small transition? :O
<tumbleweed> vtk5.4 was smaller, and much harder :)
<tumbleweed> oh, actually about the same size
<tumbleweed> those science packages...
<jtaylor> ^^
 * ajmitch is really glad that debian transitioned to boost1.48 after DIF
<highvoltage> tumbleweed: crap. I forgot to give you your power supply last week :(
<Adri2000> tumbleweed: oh, great, didn't know we had that in ubuntu as well
<broder> is there any way to tell sponsor-patch that it should sync from testing?
<tumbleweed> highvoltage: oops. Are you back in canada yet?
<tumbleweed> broder: doesn't look like it. It just uses -V
<broder> ok. i'll file a bug
<tumbleweed> bdrung: I suppose we should do a final u-d-t upload for precise some time soon
<TheMuso> Is anybody else unable to upload to review? Seems the /incoming directory doesn't exist...
<broder> ajmitch: ^
<jtaylor> someone else had that problem a while ago too
<jtaylor> seems to a general issue
<bdrung> tumbleweed: feel free to do the final u-d-t upload
<ajmitch> TheMuso: I can take a look
<micahg> Rhonda: I would tend to say a source name change is worth a sourceful backport upload
<TheMuso> ajmitch: Thanks. When I use lftp to look at ftp://revu.ubuntuwire.com, I see no incoming directory, as required by precise's revu dput config.
<ajmitch> TheMuso: right, I'm just trying to figure out what changed, this appears to have happened when it rebooted last
<tumbleweed> dupondje: your merge request bugs aren't very descriptive
<ajmitch> TheMuso: can you retry?
<ajmitch> no, looks like it won't like the symlink there..
<dupondje> tumbleweed: none are really changing alot, could you give me the one
<ajmitch> TheMuso: ok, incoming/ is a directory now, I was just trying to hide the parent directory contents properly :)
<tumbleweed> dupondje: you mean I need to read the patch before I can see how much work its going to be?
<dupondje> you are talking of what merge now ?
<tumbleweed> the ones that say "Merge!"
<dupondje> well both merges (pdns & snort) are quite small ...
<tumbleweed> you know that, I don't
<tumbleweed> I also can't see how important they are (compared to all the other last-minute-before-FF things in the queue)
<broder> tumbleweed: thanks for grabbing the u-d-t patch
<tumbleweed> broder: np
<dupondje> i'll put some info (changelog + description) in them
<tumbleweed> dupondje: thanks
<dupondje> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pdns/+bug/931133 something like this ?
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 931133 in pdns (Ubuntu) "Please merge pdns 3.0-1.1 from debian testing" [Undecided,New]
<tumbleweed> much better (although I can't help you with that one, it's main)
<micahg> pdns needs to get in, I can take a look later tonight
<dupondje> micahg: its quite (extremely small) patch ;)
<dupondje> only had to fix the multiarch libmysql
<micahg> dupondje: sorry for the bad advice about automysqlbackup, I'm not quite sure why it behaves that way (as in it doesn't install)
<dupondje> no problem! got some info in -devel
<micahg> but if switching the arguments makes it installable, then let's just do that
<dupondje> well 1 can be dropped
<dupondje> doesn't need to depend on mysql-client or mysql-client-xx
<dupondje> just mysql-client is ok
<TheMuso> ajmitch: Thanks, will try now.
<dupondje> going to try to catch the debian maintainer if possible, else i'll put a merge on LP
<dupondje> tumbleweed: pdns is universe?
<dupondje> release (universe)
<dupondje> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pdns/2.9.22-9ubuntu4
<tumbleweed> dupondje: ah. it must have once been main
<tumbleweed> lp lists it as main in some places
<dupondje> yea indeed
<dupondje> but for precise its universe ... :)
<tumbleweed> ok, having a look
<dupondje> updated https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/snort/+bug/931454
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 931454 in snort (Ubuntu) "Please merge snort 2.9.2-3 (universe) from debian unstable" [Undecided,New]
<dupondje> this one is most important :)
<l3on> dupondje, your bug got a comment :)
#ubuntu-motu 2012-02-14
<dupondje> l3on: thx
<dupondje> well it got dropped because it got fixed upstream ... tought it was good to keep the changelog small :)
<l3on> nope.. the general rule is "log everything" :)
<tumbleweed> keep the changelog readable
<tumbleweed> and say what you were trying to do, not every detail of what you did
<tumbleweed> and yes, it's generalyl good to list the bits of ubuntu delta that were dropped
<tumbleweed> (just like you list the patches you kept)
<Adri2000> aren't we supposed to get an email as usual when syncing a NEW package from debian?
<Adri2000> the package correctly appears in the NEW queue, but I'd have expected to get an email saying that...
<micahg> adri2000: yes, but there's a bug right now
<Adri2000> hmm, ok
<dupondje> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/92821119/snort2.debdiff
<dupondje> should be fine now :)
<arand> Hrm, it appears something which built cleanly in pbuilder-sid FTBFSes in ubuntu due to libfreetype6-dev missing... Are there any particular differences there between Debian and Ubuntu?
<arand> (On Debian it is pulled in automatically)
<TheMuso> ajmitch: Hrm so the upload was successful, but I don't see anything on revu... I wonder whether anything has gone amiss with revu and my GPG key...
<ajmitch> quite likely, when did you last log into revu?
<TheMuso> ajmitch: A few days ago to review/download a package.
<TheMuso> Linux-lowlatency is the package in question. I am working with the studio devs to get it cleaned up.
<ajmitch> and the last successful upload to revu from you?
<TheMuso> 2009
<TheMuso> According to my profile page.
<ajmitch> probably before it was changed to fetch keys on log in
<TheMuso> Hrm ok.
<TheMuso> But having logged in a day or so ago would have addressed that, or so I would think.
<ajmitch> that's what I'd think, I'm just digging in the database
<TheMuso> ok thanks
<arand> If I fixed this ubuntu-specific FTBFS (simply adding a missing depend), do I need to reupload to Debian first before sync-requesting?
<ajmitch> 2012-02-14 01:15:02 - linux-lowlatency_3.2.0-15.24~ppa1_source.changes: Incorrect signature, moving to rejected.
<ajmitch> not really useful
<TheMuso> No.
<micahg> arand: well, if the maintainer's responsive and there's no diff, sure, otherwise, let's upload to Ubuntu and submit it to Debian (assuming it's applicable)
<arand> micahg: I'm the Debian maintainer in this case.
<ajmitch> TheMuso: can you confirm the filesize of linux-lowlatency_3.2.0-15.24~ppa1.tar.gz that you uploaded?
<micahg> arand: oh, well, if it's applicable in Debian, I'd suggest uploading there and then sync if we have no diff
<TheMuso> ajmitch: In bytes, 104347701.
<ajmitch> TheMuso: ok, so problably something funny going on with the upload processing due to it moving files out of the way
<TheMuso> ok
<ajmitch> TheMuso: I've reverted the change I did before to bind-mount things. this should let packages be fully uploaded now, afaict
<TheMuso> ajmitch: Ok, should I try again?
 * TheMuso tries.
 * ajmitch hopes you've got a fast connection, that's not a small package to upload :)
<TheMuso> I know. I've got 1.2mbps up.
<ajmitch> ok, it's moved it into the base ftp dfirectory & the size is still increasing, so I guess it's sort of working as intended now
<ajmitch> this part of revu is a bit fragile, it seems
<TheMuso> Ok cool.
<TheMuso> Indeed.
<TheMuso> ajmitch: Thanks for your help.
<ajmitch> no problem, I hope this finally works & you can help them out :)
<ajmitch> sorry for the hassle
<TheMuso> np
<whumphrey> Anyone available to help a newer user to linux? Read the forums and how to's for installing a wireless adapter and have reached a point where I need help
<whumphrey> please?
<whumphrey> I really need help
<whumphrey> Anyone available to help a newer user to linux? Read the forums and how to's for installing a wireless adapter and have reached a point where I need help
<arand> !support | whumphrey
<ubottu> whumphrey: The official ubuntu support channel is #ubuntu. Please be aware that this channel is for development only.
<whumphrey> join #ubuntu
<whumphrey> join /#ubuntu
<whumphrey> join/ #ubuntu
<whumphrey> join #ubuntu
<dholbach> good morning
<Laney> howdy
<nigelb> O Hai Laney!
<Laney> alreeeeeeeeeet?
<nigelb> Not bad. You?
<Laney> there is tea. therefore life is good.
<Rhonda> Laney, micahg: would this be appropriate? http://paste.debian.net/156202/
<Rhonda> Next step would be opening a bugreport against lucid-backports and attach the diff to it, right?
<Laney> WFM, yeah. Same for M and N?
<Rhonda> and O, yes
<Laney> yes yes
<Laney> alphabet fail
<Rhonda> :)
 * Rhonda whispers to Laney: we are at P already â¦ ppsssst.
<tumbleweed> M is getting pretty long in the tooth, only 2 months of support left...
<Laney> good
<Rhonda> hmm, then I guess I'll skip M
<Rhonda> it's such a maverick anyway
<Laney> nah, it's still valid for people to upgrade through it until EOL
<Rhonda> so you only will approve lucid anyway if the full upgrade path through all releases is there?
<Laney> that's what we ask for, yeah. Right now is the most burdensome period in the cycle for backports due to the number of supported releases
<Laney> should just be a matter of changing the version though?
<Rhonda> yes, is
<Rhonda> and since I keep it in git there is not really an overhead involved (besides filing the bugs)
<Laney> you can use one and just add tasks for all the relevant -backports projects
<Rhonda> tasks?  Wouldn't I need to attach all the debdiffs?
<Rhonda> "tasks?" mean I am unsure what you mean with the term in this context :)
<Laney> well, you can have multiple attachments, but if they're all the same and you say they all work then I won't require you to do that
<Laney> in Launchpad a bug can affect multiple projects
<Laney> https://bugs.launchpad.net/maverick-backports/+bug/844697 like this one
<Laney> use 'Also affects project'
<Rhonda> I remember those.
<Rhonda> â¦ which made me unsubscribe from the irssi bugreports because of the perl transition. %-)
<Laney> ^o)
<Laney> these days you can mute mail from certain bugs
<Rhonda> I know, followed that
<Rhonda> Laney: and, <nitpicking>the diffs aren't the same, the changelog carries the release name</nitpick>
<Laney> yeah. But that needs to be right, or the upload won't work. I can trust you on that (since you'll be the one uploading) ...
<Rhonda> I upload?  I thought I just file the bugreport? :)
<Laney> for source change backports, yeah
<Rhonda> the UbuntuBackports wiki page doesn't go into much details for source change backports
<Rhonda> So, I file the bugreport, and upload then, or the other way round?
<Rhonda> If first bugreport, should I add LP:
<Rhonda> If first bugreport, should I add LP: # into the changelog?
<Laney> file report, attach diff (at this point you have the bug number), get approval, upload
<Laney> then it'll be stuck in the queue for ScottK or someone to approve
<Rhonda> k
<Laney> the wiki page does say "If the backport does require source changes and the backports team has approved it, it can be uploaded via the same process as a normal Ubuntu archive upload", which I guess covers it
<Rhonda> could be more to the point (filing bugreport against â¦ and attach debdiff)
<Rhonda> I seem to remember that the page actually _did_ contain the information where to report bugs against for the approval.
<Laney> it got... what's the word?
<Laney> 'rationalised' recently
<Rhonda> doh, a bug number too early
<Rhonda> it's 2011 at the end, so obsolete â¦
<Rhonda> Laney, bug 932011
<Rhonda> hmm
<Rhonda> bug #932011
 * Rhonda peeks at ubottu
<Rhonda> LP #932011
<Laney> http://pad.lv/932011
 * Laney got an email about it too though
<Rhonda>  http://deb.at/L932011 works too, but that's not the point :)
<Laney> just did it for my own clickification
 * Rhonda loves her deb.at redirects
<Laney> we need a statement that it builds/installs/runs on target releases
<geser> Laney: it easier to type it into IRC to be able to click instead of directly into the browser?
<Rhonda> Right, will do that later, just wanted to get it off my chest for now
<Laney> k
<Laney> geser: about equal, and if I do it here then others can click too :-)
 * Laney should play wesnoth one of these days
<dupondje> jtaylor: fix for automysqlbackup got uploaded in debian, will sync later :)
<scott-work> can i get someone to review a kernel package in REVU?  http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/linux-lowlatency
<scott-work> we need one more approval before thrusday to get it into universe
<tumbleweed> reviewing i a kernel package isn't something I'd take on lightly
<tumbleweed> have you asked the ubuntu-kernel people?
<Laney> I am very sure it would be much easier to maintain this package in collaboration with the kernel team indeed
<Laney> for example I understand they use git? If they won't let it be built as a flavour from the main source package then it would be pretty easy to manage it as a separate branch there
<Laney> then you could merge their changes very cheaply
<scott-work> tumbleweed, Laney: i am working with the UKT, however, they maintain that this is a community kernel and therefore maintained by the "community", in this case, the ubuntu studio team
<scott-work> the lowlatency kernel is based on directly on the current -generic kernel with only some flags changed, so no code is really different
<scott-work> but since this is not an "official" kernel and therefore maintained by community, it will reside in the universe repository whcih is the purview of MOTU
<scott-work> hence, getting two advocated is the gate keeper to this kernel being in the repos
<tumbleweed> that sounds reasonable
 * tumbleweed runs off
<scott-work> i should also note, that per the blueprint a person from the kernel team should review the kernel as well, although they are most likely not MOTU (or at least i suspect will be the case)
<Laney> So no kernel developer is willing to review it for you?
<Laney> I expect the number of qualified MOTU to be vanishingly small
<scott-work> Laney:  i haven't checked back in the channel yet, but there is still the issue of needing a MOTU to advocate it, unless an exception is made that a kernel team member would be allowed to advocate for it
<Laney> I don't see why they couldn't
<carif_> question for the channel: what are debian/*.debhelper.log files and are they "source files" or generated files as a result of a build?
<pabelanger> Should I be worry about reformatting of debian/po files in my debdiff for bug 931859?
<pabelanger> not sure why they we're affected
<pabelanger> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/92875057/nagios3_3.2.3.debdiff
<RainCT> didrocks: Hey :). Uploaded new zeitgeist, libzeitgeist and zeitgeist-datahub to Debian (zeitgeist to experimental).
<didrocks> RainCT: excellent, I'll ask for a sync tomorrow morning, thanks! and congrats for the release :)
<Rhonda> micahg, you tagged the ejabberd bug the same time I did call the syncpackage :)
<tumbleweed> carif_: result of the build
<carif_> tumbleweed, ty
<arand> carif_: You can get rid of them with "debuild clean" or equivalent
<carif_> another question, i have a cdbs pkg, but it has a debian/patches/series file; I thought that was only for quilt? is it needed for cdbs? If not, why would it be there?
<jtaylor_> quilt and cdbs are not mutually exclusive
<yofel> carif_: you can use cdbs together with quilt, quilt is just a patch system
<carif_> jtaylor_, yofel, but only 1 patch sys is used in debian/rules? or does that depend on the rules file?
<jtaylor_> in theory you can use more than one, but that would be a bad idea
<yofel> it does depend on which you use, yes
<jtaylor_> 3.0 packages automatically use something quilt like at unpack time
<yofel> dh7 uses quilt by default, and doesn't recommend any other one
<jtaylor_> dh7 not, only source/format 3.0 (quilt)
<yofel> indeed, my error
<carif_> jtaylor_, yofel, still a little confused. if my pkg is cdbs in the rules file, then debian/patches/series exists as a convenience to use quilt and perhaps to synthesize a new .patch file?
<jtaylor_> is it a 3.0 package?
<yofel> well, debian/patches/series is used by quilt to see in which order it should apply the patches that are listed there. And quilt has nothing to do with cdbs per se.If it's a 3.0 (quilt) package you'll be using quilt as patch system no matter what build system you use
<micahg> ScottK: I forget, for backporting security updates for packages in backports, do I have to get someone to do the install/run tests again?
<broder> micahg: my opinion is that you should only have to do b/i/r testing for the package itself, not rdeps
<micahg> I'd buy that
 * micahg will see if they guy that's been doing the puppet backport testing is up for another round
<micahg> s/they/the/
<ScottK> micahg: Install/run isn't very hard usually, but if you can't I wouldn't block on it.
<ScottK> Technically a backport for a security update is just another backport.
<micahg> which should technically require the same testing
<ScottK> Although I'm always willing to be creative if there's a good reason.
<micahg> ok, I think have someone to test, so it hopefully isn't an issue
<broder> any uscan experts want to tell me whether this watch file (for watching a subdirectory of the kernel git tree) works? http://paste.ubuntu.com/842269/
<broder> without really knowing what i'm looking at, i'm suspicious that it has to be updated every time the upstream source version changes
<tumbleweed> broder: eek
<broder> yeeeeaaaahh
<tumbleweed> I don't understand it
<tumbleweed> but your suspiciouns seem grounded. What's with all the hardcoded hashes
<tumbleweed> also, watching hashes with uscan isn't going to work that well
<broder> right
<tumbleweed> I suspect its trying to treat one hash as 0-x and anything newer as 1-x. Still seems pretty crazy
<tumbleweed> rather drop it than do that kind of things
<tumbleweed> thing
<broder> yeah, i'm inclined to agree. whatever - i don't think the package can be sponsored as-is without some additional information anyway, so it's out of the queue now
<broder> also, i should probably stop doing ubuntu stuff during work hours :-P
<tumbleweed> doing that entirely derailed my thesis
<Corey> Is there a sane way to get git-buildpackage to spit out an orig.tar.gz?
<tumbleweed> Corey: git-import-orig
<Corey> tumbleweed: I've got a git repo that's got a debian directory in it, and builds a working package; now I'm trying to sanely hook it up to Jenkins for autobuild.
<Corey> This is for an internal project, not something that'll ever see the public repos, unfortunately.  Although that does lower the bar a bit for package acceptance.
<Laney> git-buildpackage -S?
<Corey> Laney: dpkg-source: error: can't build with source format '3.0 (quilt)': no upstream tarball found at .. It'd seem not.
<jtaylor> pristine-tar gentar?
<jtaylor> asssuming you use --git-pristine-tar to import
<jtaylor> that error is probably caused by that flag not being used :/
<Laney> it should fall back to using the upstream branch in that case
<jtaylor> it can't create the orig from the upstream without pristine information
<jtaylor> I think
<jtaylor> at least not with the same checksum
<Laney> well, of course not that, but it can still do something
<jtaylor> but thats sure not default
<jtaylor> I wouldn't want my gbp to generate a wrong checksum tarball because I forgot to checkout the pristine branch from the remote :/
<broder> Corey: are you saying that you have a debian directory in your main VCS repository?
<broder> as opposed to doing the packaging separately from main development?
<Corey> broder: Yes.
<broder> i suspect that's the point of confusion for Laney and jtaylor
<Corey> Ah.
<Corey> Yes, in my repository's topdir, there's a topdir/debian directory with working package build instructions.
<Corey> If I check that out into a new environment with the buildtools already installed, what do I have to do to create my package? :-)
<jtaylor> git archive to create a tarball, exclude debian
<jtaylor> then debuild or gbp should work
<jtaylor> a native package is probably even more appropriate for autobuilds, then you don't need to exclude debian
<jtaylor> --git-export=WC might also work, skips the tarball creation
<jtaylor> hm no that does not work
<jtaylor> ah yes it does
<jtaylor> I had pristine enabled in my config
<Laney> it does use upstream if you don't give --git-pristine-tar
<Laney> gbp:info: pdfmod_0.9.1.orig.tar.gz does not exist, creating from 'upstream/0.9.1'
<jtaylor> yes git-no-pristine-tar was required in my case
<Laney> anyway I don't know how well merge mode is supported if that's what this is
<Laney> it's not the usual gbp workflow
<Corey> jtaylor: So the exact syntax is what exactly?  You've mentioned three tools and four flags or so. :-)
<jtaylor> why don't you just run your regular release script to create a tarball?
<jtaylor> else try git-buildpackage --git-export=WC --git-no-pristine-tar in your repository and see if that works
<jtaylor> if that does not work: git-buildpackage --git-export=WC --git-no-pristine-tar  --git-upstream-branch=master --git-upstream-tree=branch
<Corey> tumbleweed: Didn't, and the second one throws git-buildpackage: error: no such option: --git-upstream-tree
<jtaylor> hm which version do you have?
<jtaylor> older versions do not have that and must use tags
<jtaylor> so tag your master and use --git-upstream-tag=sometag
<jtaylor> a no you can use HEAD as a tag
<Corey> *sigh*  dpkg-source: error: can't build with source format '3.0 (quilt)': no upstream tarball found at
<Corey> This is on Lucid.
<jtaylor> did gbp create one?
<Corey> It did not.
<jtaylor> let me try iton lucid, but maybe its too old and you're "stuck" with using git archive
<jtaylor> works for me
<jtaylor> keepass2_2.18+dfsg.orig.tar.gz does not exist, creating from 'HEAD'
<jtaylor> my options: git-buildpackage --git-export=WC --git-no-pristine-tar  --git-upstream-tag=HEAD -S -us -uc
<jtaylor> repo has only master branch and no tags
<jtaylor> < off, bye
<Corey> Thanks.
#ubuntu-motu 2012-02-15
<Mattman> hi peoples
<Gleichsnerd> !help
<ubottu> Please don't ask to ask a question, simply ask the question (all on ONE line and in the channel, so that others can read and follow it easily). If anyone knows the answer they will most likely reply. :-) See also !patience
<Gleichsnerd> Gah, shoot. Nevermind.
<micahg> Rhonda: did you test build ejabberd before syncing it?
 * ajmitch syncs another package (yes, test-built locally)
 * micahg hugs ajmitch
<ajmitch> I've still got a lot of catching up to do :)
<ajmitch> still a lot on http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/bugs/rcbugs/ to check over though
<micahg> yeah, oneiric seems to still be the default there
<ajmitch> shouldn't be, I changed it
 * micahg was going to skim for new version RC bug fixes
<micahg> ah, is fixed now, thanks
<ajmitch> was a recent fix :)
<ajmitch> smokeping needs a sync, open CVE
<ajmitch> patiently waiting for pbuilder to process ftpmirror :)
 * micahg test builds chromium in a clean chroot before uploading
 * micahg plans to do another run through the upgrade-software-version bugs tomorrow night to see what can be updated quickly
<ajmitch> I saw a merge of pbuilder waiting in ~ubuntu-sponsors
<ajmitch> it's nice when a debian NMU references an LP bug as well, will a sync using syncpackage automatically close that?
<micahg> I think so, although, I don't remember the final outcome of that discussion
<ajmitch> I'll try it & see
<ajmitch> it's bug 756657
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 756657 in ipcheck (Ubuntu) "ipcheck suffers exception; NoneType object has no attribute 'close'" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/756657
<broder> certainly old-style syncs would close those
<ajmitch> right
 * broder sighs. the sponsorship queue is still getting longer
<ajmitch> broder: how long is it now?
<broder> 63
<broder> in fairness, 1/4 of those are just from today
<ajmitch> people trying to get in before FF?
<broder> seems likely
<broder> and, let's see, only 14 of them are from before 2/1
<ajmitch> so at least people aren't havng to wait very long
<ajmitch> micahg: I see what you mean about ejabberd - I was looking at some other build fallout bugs from the erlang transition in debian, might be a little late to do that for precise :)
<ajmitch> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=653966 was the bug I was looking at - the removal of patches because of a newer erlang got me a bit worried about just syncing it
<ubottu> Debian bug 653966 in yaws "yaws cross site scripting" [Serious,Fixed]
<Rhonda> micahg: duh, the new erlang not in precise, right  %-/
<Rhonda> micahg: So actually, it would need a sourceful upload with dropping the versioned b-d on erlang (reverting git commit c352294)
<Rhonda> .. erlang transition in precise is out of scope, right? :)
<ajmitch> Rhonda: I'm sure there's plenty of time to get it done :)
<Rhonda> I am not that deeply involved in erlang besides ejabberd, and I am uncertain about the required impact
<ajmitch> I think it has potential for a lot of small problems
<ajmitch> http://lists.debian.org/debian-release/2011/12/msg00296.html doesn't look too bad though
<Rhonda> ajmitch: jep, that fix is in ejabberd, and it got uploaded to unstable in debian in the meantime :)
 * ajmitch would be more worried about couchdb
<philipballew> Question: to package a deb for debian/Ubuntu, how much actual coding/programing is required? I have herd different things from different people.
<ajmitch> philipballew: "it depends"
<ajmitch> it's possible to package something with barely touching a thing
<ajmitch> or you may have to end up digging into the code & writing patches to solve some problems
<Rhonda> ajmitch: couchdb got binNMUed and I am not aware of any serious bugreports because of the transition
<ajmitch> this is why you hear different things from different people, the packages are different :)
<ajmitch> Rhonda: ubuntu's couchdb is still stuck at 1.0.1
<ajmitch> debian has 1.1.1
<Rhonda> right
<Rhonda> well, I will do a sourceful upload for ejabberd then, dropping the version
<broder> i'm pretty sure that our couchdb is just a little bit of conffile testing away from being at 1.1.1
<ajmitch> ok :)
<Rhonda> and when you decide to bring e15 into the boat, you always can issue a build1 package :)
<ajmitch> broder: you've managed to dig through that MP?
<broder> i did, and when all's said and done i'm actually satisfied with it
<ajmitch> great
<broder> except that jderose's updates move a conffile between packages, and i want somebody to test whether or not that's going to trigger a conffile conflict
<philipballew> thank you
 * ajmitch does not have a current precise VM for testing, but how bad can it break my laptop? :)
 * broder disclaims all repsonsibility for the state of ajmitch's laptop
<ajmitch> btw, that bug was closed with syncpackage
<micahg> cool, that's the way it should be :)
<Rhonda> ajmitch: 2.1.10-2ubuntu1 would be the proper version, right?
<ajmitch> Rhonda: yep
<Rhonda> ajmitch: So, can I just dput ubuntu, or would it need to go through some approval?
<Rhonda> Guess I just dput because I am MOTU, but this is my first sourceful upload :)
<ajmitch> you're in MOTU, it's in universe
<ajmitch> should be fine
<Rhonda> duh
<ajmitch> as we said, what can possibly go wrong? :)
<Rhonda> hmm, if I doesnt include the orig tarball it fetches it from debian, right?
<ajmitch> no, it uses what's already been synced from debian
<ajmitch> micahg: that's a lot of CVEs for chromium there
<Rhonda> ajmitch, thanks for the headsup, is built now :)
<ajmitch> Rhonda: don't thank me, thank micahg
<Rhonda> oh, right
 * Rhonda hugs micahg :)
<micahg> ajmitch: indeed
<arand> tumbleweed: The Ubuntu-FTBFS for cube2font is fixed in Debian now, would you have time to re-view the sync request?
<bkerensa> https://code.launchpad.net/~bkerensa/ubuntu/precise/liboggz/fix-for-789179/+merge/93191
<geser> bkerensa: can you please forward this also to Debian and/or upstream so we don't have to carry this delta for long (if it didn't already happen)
<bkerensa> geser: I will forward
<geser> thx
<bkerensa> geser: Is there a easy way to turn my changes into a diff to submit upstream
<bkerensa> or will they take a .patch?
<geser> there is a tool "submittodebian" which helps with it, but as I didn't use it yet myself you might want to doublecheck what exactly gets forwarded to Debian
<tumbleweed> it gives you a chance to edit the patch
<tumbleweed> arand: done
<arand> tumbleweed: thanks! :)
<tumbleweed> it was a good test case for bug 931644 :)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 931644 in ubuntu-dev-tools (Ubuntu) "[sponsor-patch] No way to sponsor syncs from a non-default release" [Low,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/931644
<scott-work> ubuntu studio is still working on getting the lowlatency kernel into universe and needs one more advocate :)  http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/linux-lowlatency
<scott-work> anyone who feels capable of reviewing it, please do so, i believe we need another advocate before tomorrow
<tumbleweed> bdrung: fixed a pile of easy bugs, will upload u-d-t now
<bdrung> tumbleweed: thanks. will sponsor-patch bail out for missing binaries before it starts?
<tumbleweed> bdrung: doesn't bail out, just warns
<bdrung> k
<tumbleweed> (probably less than ideal, but it isn't obvious what programs its going to need)
<bdrung> tumbleweed: maybe doing the check after reading the parameters?
<tumbleweed> that still doesn't tell us if its a bzr branch or a patch
<tumbleweed> (and I thought printing out the warning when you do --help isn't a bad idea)
<ockham> hi, i'd like to merge scribus from sid, but i'm a bit confused about merging documentation at the wiki. i'm not a motu, so do i just file a merge request at launchpad? or also build a merged version and upload it to REVU?
<geser> ockham: first you don't need REVU for a merge
<ockham> geser: okay; but i'm not a MOTU, so if I do work on the package, how make it available for upload?
<geser> you can only file a merge request once you have a branch in LP which is ready to get merged (sponsored)
<tumbleweed> ockham: provide a debdiff (against debian) or a bzr branch
<geser> "provide a debdiff" = file a bug and attach the debdiff to it
<ockham> ok, i'll try that
<tumbleweed> ockham: btw, don't forget we have feature freeze tomorrow evening. work fast :)
<geser> or merge a package which doesn't introduce new features
<tumbleweed> or request an exception, if the new features are important
<ockham> i think it's quite straight-forward, so i shouldn't take too long
<ockham> oops, scribus is in main. is that a problem?
<tumbleweed> ockham: no
<geser> ockham: it shouldn't matter for you if you need a core-dev or a MOTU as sponsor
<ockham> yikes. just tried debdiff on debian's and ubuntu's .dsc files, and as debian has a new upstream version, that's quite long.
<ockham> ubuntu has an RC for 1.4.0, debian a post-1.4.0 svn revision
<ockham> will that be a problem?
<ockham> the reason i'd like to update is that some relevant bugs got fixed by upstream in between...
<ockham> tumbleweed, geser: ^
<tumbleweed> ockham: the version in ubuntu is based on a previous version from debian
<tumbleweed> compare against that
<tumbleweed> (or just grab diffs from mom (merges.ubuntu.com, see grab-merge)
<ockham> tumbleweed: ok, i'm not sure i'm getting this right. the merge request will require a debdiff from the debian version i'd like to base it on, right?
<ockham> and grab-merge complains that there is not entry for scribus on m.u.c
<tumbleweed> ockham: yes, that's usually the easiest diff to review
<ockham> tumbleweed: but in my case, it will contain a long list of upstream changes
<tumbleweed> ok, MoM was recently broken and is probably still catching up
<tumbleweed> err, a merge shouldn't end up wit ha long list of upstream changes
<tumbleweed> the diff should show the desired changes between debian and ubuntu
<ockham> but what if, as in this case, debian is based on a newer upstream version?
<tumbleweed> so provide a diff from that
<ockham> tumbleweed: hm, makes sense
<tumbleweed> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/Merging
<tumbleweed> I think MoM is also currently running against wheezy (our default sync source) not sid
<tumbleweed> (our default sync source for LTSs)
<geser> ockham: grab the current delta (mom or from packages.qa.debian.org), apply it on the new debian version (and check if those changes are still needed or perhaps also fixed in debian/upstream), generate new debdiff for you patched version (compare to the unpatched debian version)
<ockham> geser: that sounds good, i'll try it
<geser> that's what MoM does (without the checking, that left for the merger)
<geser> it's not black magic :)
<ockham> geser: ok, i've tried to apply http://patches.ubuntu.com/s/scribus/scribus_1.4.0.dfsg~rc3+svn20110401-1.1ubuntu1.patch to the current debian source, but patch -p 1 fails -- and it's not obvious to me, why, as the .rej files look quite feasible
<tumbleweed> ockham: pull-lp-source -d scribus && pull-debian-source -d scribus 1.4.0.dfsg~rc3+svn20110401-1.1 && debdiff ....
<ockham> tumbleweed: same result. the debdiff that line produces is probably the same as the one found on patches.ubuntu.com, no?
<tumbleweed> yes, it should be
<ockham> well it fails :-(
<tumbleweed> so, yes, the patch probably won't apply cleanly, they almost never will
<ockham> yeah, but it's strange -- see e.g. http://paste.ubuntu.com/843180/ for changelog.rej
<tumbleweed> there'll be a new changelog entry in debian, that clashes with the ubuntu one
<tumbleweed> so, I was wrong, not "almost never will", "never will"
<ockham> ok, so it's copy-pasting stuff from the patch to those files.
<ockham> oh well, not so trivial after all...
<ockham> i'll probably get back to it later...
<ockham> thx so far!
<tumbleweed> look at merge-changelog
<tumbleweed> it'll sort that bit out for you
<pabelanger> mdeslaur: ping
<mdeslaur> pabelanger: hi!
 * pabelanger waves
<mdeslaur> pabelanger: what's up?
<pabelanger> mdeslaur: re: bug 931859
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 931859 in nagios3 (Ubuntu) "chown: cannot access `/etc/nagios3/resource.cfg': No such file or directory" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/931859
<pabelanger> the patch is actually from upstream
<pabelanger> and the file permissions are already changed in the -common package
<mdeslaur> pabelanger: ah!, yeah, reading your update now
<pabelanger> greast
<mdeslaur> pabelanger: ok, thanks for the explanation
<pabelanger> great*
<pabelanger> np
<pabelanger> I should have adding something to the debdiff
<pabelanger> will next time
<mdeslaur> pabelanger: ok, ACK on the debdiff. I'll update the bug and upload it in a sec. Thanks!
<pabelanger> danke
<Corey> Oh what the...  + git-dch --auto --debian-branch=master
<Corey> You are not on branch 'master' but on '(no branch)'
<Corey> Use --debian-branch to set the branch to pick changes from
<tumbleweed> sounds like you aren't on a branch...
<Corey> Sure, but to fix that it suggets passing --debian-branch=master, which I'm doing.
<tumbleweed> I don't think it realises that you aren't on a branch. It just sees that you aren't on the branch that it's expecting to use
<Corey> tumbleweed: Sure, but a "git checkout master" before the git-dch also fails.
<tumbleweed> presumably not with the same error
<Corey> Indeed.
<Corey> (I'm trying to have Jenkins automatically build on commits)
<Corey> With the checkout master beforehand, http://pastebin.com/WKiBMqTL
<tumbleweed> missing a pull?
<Corey> It's Jenkins, it should have pulled automatically.
<Corey> I can explicitly throw it in there.
<Corey> But it seems counterintuitive.
 * tumbleweed doesn't know jenkins, and has never doen what you are trying to do. But I can read error messages / output and give interpretation :P
<Corey> tumbleweed: Yeah, the git pull sorted it.
<Corey> Seems wrong, but if it works, who'm I to argue? :-)
<Corey> But the git-dch --auto now isn't incrementing the version string in changelog
<Corey> Ooh, I may have to throw a -S into it.
<Corey> Man pages, not just for bathroom reading. :-p
<tumbleweed> :)
<_ruben> i have a local repo using mini-dinstall where i push my pbuilder generated packages. what would it take to be able to add downloaded .deb packages to such a repo?
<_ruben> downloaded from 3rd parties that is
<_ruben> no source packages or anything
<tumbleweed> _ruben: I don't know mini-dinstall, but I assume it is driven by .changes files, like the archive
<tumbleweed> so, generate .changes files
 * _ruben tries some google-foo based on that :)
<_ruben> the use of pbuilder got me lazy in that respect, all needed files are generated for me ;)
<tumbleweed> .changes are usually generated by dpkg-genchanges. You can drive it by hand
<_ruben> had just found that cmd in the debian maint guide :)
<_ruben> lets see
<_ruben> hmm .. dpkg-genchanges seems to work on a source tree, and all i got is the binary package
<ockham> geser, tumbleweed: okay, i've produced a debdiff. anyone mind uploading? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/scribus/+bug/932962
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 932962 in scribus (Ubuntu) "Please merge scribus 1.4.0.dfsg+r17300-1 (main) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,New]
<_ruben> guess crafting it by hand it is
<tumbleweed> ockham: I can't, but someone from ubuntu-desktop or a core-dev can
<tumbleweed> !sponsorship
<ubottu> You can find out about the package sponsorship process here http://wiki.ubuntu.com/SponsorshipProcess - For !UDS sponsorship see http://uds.ubuntu.com/participate/sponsorship/
<tumbleweed> ockham: ^
<tumbleweed> _ruben: probably the easiest, although you could cheat and create all the files dpkg-genchanges needs, but that's probably harder
<_ruben> tumbleweed: yeah
<jtaylor> when exactly does feature freeze take effect?
<micahg> jtaylor: per https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PreciseReleaseSchedule, 21:00 UTC tomorrow
<jtaylor> thx
<pabelanger> I have a debdiff for bug 897006 but it's also include another bug fix.  Should I create 2 different debdiffs?  Or can 1 close 2 issues?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 897006 in nsca (Ubuntu) "Build nsca-client package" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/897006
<pabelanger> would like to make sure it gets uploaded before tomorrows freeze for 12.04
<tumbleweed> pabelanger: so would everyone, there's been a big rush on the sponsorship queue
<pabelanger> tumbleweed: ack'd
<pabelanger> always the case
<pabelanger> just want to make sure I make the request easy as possible
<tumbleweed> pabelanger: did you see the comments in the debian changelog wrt nsca-client?
<pabelanger> tumbleweed: yes, I talked to the upstream maintain a while back and at the time they thought it was a waste of resources.  After working with the debian maintainer, the next release in Sid will actually start building the package
<pabelanger> but that package has not been merged into sid yet
<tumbleweed> pabelanger: I see a comment which says "Add possibility to locally build an nsca-client package which cannot be in Debian.
<tumbleweed> do you know the logic behind that?
<pabelanger> right, see my above comment about waste of resources
<tumbleweed> what kind of resources?
<pabelanger> HDD space in the repository
<pabelanger> I know
<tumbleweed> ok, that's probably not an issue :)
<pabelanger> indeed
<tumbleweed> please amend the bug, rather than saying "I don't know why"
<pabelanger> tumbleweed: and done
<pabelanger> thanks
<kklimonda> when did Ubuntu start using 3.0 source format?
<micahg> kklimonda: it's supported in Lucid on
<kklimonda> ah, thanks
<jtaylor> can someone apt-file bin/rsvg in precise please
<jtaylor> my is acting up
<jtaylor> I can't locate that in precise ._.
<jtaylor> a bug 931802
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 931802 in librsvg (Ubuntu) "/usr/bin/rsvg disappeared" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/931802
<Corey> Seeing a pbuilder failure on broken deps, but I can't quite understand why it's breaking: http://pastebin.com/3bFPC6U1
<jtaylor> I prefer PBUILDERSATISFYDEPENDSCMD="/usr/lib/pbuilder/pbuilder-satisfydepends-gdebi"
<jtaylor> tends to give better error messages
 * micahg also prefered the gdebi resolver with pbuilder
<Corey> jtaylor: Toss that into .pbuilderrc?
<jtaylor> yes
<Corey> Or as an environment variable?
<Corey> Ah.
<Corey> jtaylor: http://pastebin.com/Bux5wUup
<Corey> Hmm.  It looks like that package isn't installable in the pbuilder, but clearly exists elsewhere.  Is there a sane way to show whcih repository it came from on the installed box?
<broder> Corey: do you have universe disabled in your pbuilder or something?
<Corey> broder: Not sure.  I didn't do anything magic to create it, which may explain it.
<tumbleweed> Corey: do a pbuilder update and see if it mentions anything besides main
<Corey> tumbleweed: Just main.
<Corey> That'd do it.
<Corey> Time to fix my pbuilderrc
#ubuntu-motu 2012-02-16
 * micahg wonders how tumbleweed got cairo-dock-foo to build
<benonsoftware> This is proberly a silly question but if I wanted to package a Java program could I just folllow the Packaging Guide?
<geser> sure
<benonsoftware> geser: Thanks
<geser> just make sure that you recompile any .jar files instead of using the prebuild upstream ones
<benonsoftware> Ok, thank you very much
<tumbleweed> micahg: given its dependencies, it gave me no trouble (they're in NEW)
<micahg> tumbleweed: ah, I looked :)
<micahg> didn't see them there, but I trust you
<tumbleweed> otoh, bug 923688 is pretty high on the annoyance list atm
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 923688 in bzr-builddeb (Ubuntu) "bzr crashed with AttributeError in tree_unapply_patches(): 'DirStateRevisionTree' object has no attribute 'last_revision'" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/923688
<azeem> so how many hours till feature freeze, or is it frozen already?
<ajmitch> 2100UTC
<azeem> thx
<azeem> requestsyncs from Debian NEW are not possible, right?
<ajmitch> I don't think they are, because it's not accessible
<micahg> well, the only way they certainly are
<micahg> s/only/old/
<ajmitch> if you've got the source package itself, then it's possible
<micahg> you can dget from NEW
<ajmitch> oh you can now?
 * ajmitch guesses it's been this way for awhile :)
 * micahg thinks you can at least
<Laney> ubuntu new, yeah
<Laney> actually that might be the case in which you still need dgetlp
<Laney> there is still one, I forget what it is
<micahg> Laney: no, was referring to Debian NEW
<Laney> but debian new, no I don't think so
<Laney> even if I ssh to ries I can't access the files
<micahg> hmm, must have been confusing it with something else
<tumbleweed> you can get thnigs from incoming.debian.org, but that's not NEW
<tumbleweed> and of course, many packages are in VCS...
<Laney> I would much prefer people to wait and FFE than do fakesyncs
 * tumbleweed too
<tumbleweed> btw, any opinions on the tesseract FFe? Its in the grey area for me
<tumbleweed> much better OCR, but have to remove a reverse-dep
<Laney> will look later
 * Laney begins writing an annoucement of the uninstallable packages challenge
<Laney> http://debian.titanpad.com/7
<tumbleweed> err, requires login
<Laney> i made it public
<Laney> and I am editing it without being logged in right now
<tumbleweed> aha
<Laney> yah boo
<Laney> nigelb deleted his blog post for the ftbfs jam
<Laney> oh, no, just broke old links
<Laney> (or the link in tumbleweed's original email was wrong :P)
 * tumbleweed refuses to beleive that possibility
<Laney> hmm
<Laney> the graphs aren't that convincing that the jam made a difference
<tumbleweed> we were at ~300 FTBFS packages at the time...
<Laney> as in
<Laney> there's a steady downward trend that seemed to start before the jam happened
<tumbleweed> we got one or two new people in, working on it. And they mostly evaporated again
 * tumbleweed discovers a qa-ftbfs cronjob still running on his server, and kills it
<Laney> is there a better link for oneiric-historical.html?
<tumbleweed> no, I couldn't find one
<Laney> didn't know if it moved to ubuntuwire
<tumbleweed> it did, but not at that time
<tumbleweed> http://people.ubuntuwire.org/~stefanor/lp-ftbfs-report/historical/
<Laney> huh, sub-50?
<tumbleweed> primary archive, not rebuilds
<Laney> i suppose the archive rebuild would be worse
<Laney> but still that's better than i would have necessarily thought
<tumbleweed> wgrant isn't using my graph additions in his rebuild-ftbfs-test reports
<tumbleweed> (poke poke)
<tumbleweed> I don't think we should do automated bug filing for the uninstallability issues, just for the jam. So collaborate with an etherpad?
<Laney> ye
<adhorden> Hi all, having a few issues updating a package for Precise, build log is here https://launchpadlibrarian.net/93036528/buildlog_ubuntu-precise-i386.ruby-rvm_1.10.2-0ubuntu4_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz, i am getting permission errors but not sure where to look to get to the bottom of the problem
<Laney> you can't write to the 'real' filesystem when building a package; make the build system install to pkgbuilddir/debian/tmp
<tumbleweed> adhorden: it's no trespecting the DESTDIR provided
<tumbleweed> also, it should not be installing to usr/local at all
<Laney> it's probably a broken install script in this case
<adhorden> Laney: this is what I was thinking the install script seems to be breaking things here, might have to hack that up so that it uses DESTDIR
<Laney> yes, that is the standard interface
<adhorden> I was thinking this would be an easy script to package up, its been nothing but headaches
<Laney> life is made much easier when people use standard build systems
<tumbleweed> ruby packages also seem to have that affect on people
<Laney> i have still managed to avoid it completely
 * tumbleweed too
<adhorden> yup, and in this case rvm does not use a standard build system it uses its own install shell script
<tumbleweed> I thought iamfuzz promisdet o look after rvm? (I seem to remember being hesitant to want it in the archive at all)
<adhorden> not sure who the maintainer is, there was a bug in the package so I took a look into it and bumped the upstream version as it was really out of date, I was going to submit my patches to bring it upto date
<tumbleweed> adhorden: ubuntu packages don't have maintainers, and this one needs some maintainance
<adhorden> ah right, well I am taking a look into it as I am using precise on my systems at present and would be nice to have a native working package for rvm
<pabelanger> tumbleweed: re: bug 408757, I talked to the upstream maintainer and they don't have a problem with what you suggested. I already submitted the patch into Debian, working on updating the debdiff
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 408757 in nsca (Ubuntu) "init sscript has no Usage option" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/408757
<pabelanger> it's actually bug 897006 but the debdiff is in the other issue (trying to close both of them in one shot(
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 897006 in nsca (Ubuntu) "Build nsca-client package" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/897006
<tumbleweed> we've got through "grave" in rcbugs. It'd be nice if we could get through all the serious bugs that are fixed in new upstream versions, but that's a lot for one evening :P
<nigelb> Laney: I did? Looking
<Laney> nigelb: nah, I think it was a wrong link in the initial mail
<nigelb> ah, quite possible.
<nigelb> Laney: http://nigelb.me/ubuntu/2011/06/27/fix-ftbfs-jam.html
<Laney> the link said /07/
<tumbleweed> draft maybe?
<nigelb> Hrm, interesting.
<tumbleweed> ok, I'm through all the low-hanging serious-severity rcbugs that are fixed with new upstream versions (well, one still test-buliding)
<tumbleweed> poor non-x86 buildds
<ajmitch> tumbleweed: nice work with the rc bugs
<ajmitch> tumbleweed: so you did decide to sync yaws in the end? I wasn't sure what the changelog was meaning by removing erlang patches
<jtaylor> so, time for some last minute merging ;)
<ajmitch> still a couple of hours let I think
<ajmitch> s/let/left/
<jtaylor> yes 21:00 utc I was told
 * ajmitch is still getting his laptop back to usable
<jtaylor> meh scipy built a couple minutes to early and did not pick the new numpy :(
<jtaylor> on armel
<ajmitch> ouch
<ajmitch> how long did it take to build?
<jtaylor> 4 hours
<jtaylor> scipy numpy less
<jtaylor> rebuilds of -ubuntuX just increase X? or add a buildY to the version?
<pabelanger> merge, merge!
<jtaylor> hm ok how do I merge a 13.5 mb package with my 11kb/s upload connection?
<jtaylor> I could sync it and then add the diff in a second upload ;)
<stefanct> do you have a time machine at hand? :)
<jtaylor> hm can I dput from alioth? (after I signed it locally?)
<stefanct> what's the latest possible time i could file a sync request and get it merged into 12.04 without exception? also 21:00 utc or does it need to be processed already by that time?
<ajmitch> jtaylor: I don't see why you shouldn't be able to dput from alioth
<broder> stefanct: my understanding is that we will be accepting sync requests without FFes if they are filed before FF
<stefanct> am i allowed to file a sync request even though the debian package has not hit the archives yet? (yes i am quite desperate :/)
<jtaylor> if its new ffe's are usually easier to get
<stefanct> ic
<stefanct> we are preparing a release upstream atm... but i doubt that it gets ready in time
<jtaylor> oh its only an update not completely new?
<ajmitch> what are you updating?
<stefanct> flashrom, app to flash bios chips etc. last release was last summer
<stefanct> jtaylor: not a completely new package, no
<valdur55> Hey. i is possible to patch one package?
<pabelanger> don't want to rock the boat, but another other sponsors care to comment on bug 408757
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 408757 in nsca (Ubuntu) "init sscript has no Usage option" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/408757
<pabelanger> and bug 897006
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 897006 in nsca (Ubuntu) "Build nsca-client package" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/897006
<broder> pabelanger: do you have any sense of when the debian maintainer is planning to release their new version with the split?
<pabelanger> broder: not sure, just pinged him but waiting to hear back.
<pabelanger> The package is not very active, last release was Dec. 2010
<pabelanger> Now that I am using it more for a customer site, I suspect I'll be pushing upstream to help keep it active
<broder> pabelanger: oh, i see. the client just isn't getting shipped at all currently? i assumed that you were taking a monolithic package and splitting it up into smaller packages
<broder> i'm much less opposed to what you're doing
<broder> (splitting up a package - especially when you know debian's about to do it too - has enough risk of introducing subtle differences between debian's split and ubuntu's split that it always makes me uncomfortable)
<broder> pabelanger: anyway, the patch seems conceptually reasonable, but i can't do a full review right now
<pabelanger> Okay, thanks for the look
<jtaylor> hm I want to sync the new plplot, but it requries a mini transition
<jtaylor> 3 packages
<jtaylor> one of them ftbs but fix available in debian testing
<jtaylor> should I file a sync request instead of syncing that? because plplot will not be done building until freeze
<Ampelbein> jtaylor: Is the fix for testing a new upstream version? If not, you are fine, sync plplot now and do the rebuilds after plplot finished on all architectures.
<jtaylor> it is
<jtaylor> new upstream
<jtaylor> though a minor, not sure how extensive
<Ampelbein> It isn't too hard to get a FFe shortly after freeze, especially when it's only a minor update.
<jtaylor> phew all done
<jtaylor> all remaining numpy packages had new versions in debian..., so I pulled them all hopefully I don't have to much mess to clean up this weekend xD
<jtaylor> (they all have very extensive test suites which were successful, so its unlikely)
<tumbleweed> ajmitch: I probably should have tested it, but it built...
<ScottK> jtaylor: Re should you wait on syncing stuff: There's a long (unfortunate) tradition of tons of crap getting uploaded right at feature freeze, so I wouldn't suggest handicapping yoursef.
<tumbleweed> don't know if tulp is worth sneaking in. There's a much newer upstream verison in debian which builds unmodified, but maybe not on all archs...
<tumbleweed> broder: the nsca client is currently being shipped, just in the server pakage
<tumbleweed> *package
<broder> oh, i see
<broder> well, it's still using pre-existing packaging to do the split
<tumbleweed> the pre-existing rules allows building a client-only package
<tumbleweed> but if it's going into the archive, I say let's split it properly...
<ajmitch> so, feature freeze in effect now?
<tumbleweed> yup, but FFes are cheap for the first few days :)
<tumbleweed> ah, I see someone hit the Debian NEW queue this evening
<ajmitch> tumbleweed: so we can bug you or any other friendly release team member? :)
<tumbleweed> that's what we're here for (/me hides)
* Laney changed the topic of #ubuntu-motu to: REVU is back up | Precise: Feature Freeze | Want to get involved with the MOTU? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing | Sponsor queue: http://bit.ly/fz6AyQ | http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/ftbfs | http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/NBS | http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/bugs/rcbugs/
<ajmitch> Laney: thanks :)
<Laney> DENIED
<ajmitch> :'(
 * ajmitch shall go back to lurking instead
<Laney> â¥
 * Laney â pub
 * tumbleweed just got back from the pub
<ajmitch> bit early for the pub for me
<aboudreault> hi, hey how can I pass the -j option (dpkg-buildpackage) via debuild...
<aboudreault> I did it.. but can remember how...
<aboudreault> -j8 directly just fails.
<jtaylor> works for me
<aboudreault> jtaylor, debuild -us -uc -j8
<aboudreault> something similar?
<jtaylor> yes
<jtaylor> it passes it to dpkg-buildpackage which has the option in its manpage
<aboudreault> dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot -D -us -uc -j8 failed
<aboudreault> if I remove the -j8... I see it begins the compilation
<jtaylor> which package?
<jtaylor> no further information?
<aboudreault> shouldn't be related to any package
<aboudreault> general question. using this with our packages.
<aboudreault> will use dpkg-buildpackages directly
<aboudreault> oh well.... even the dpkg-buildpackages fails. will build slowly then
<jtaylor> hm how do I fix this: http://paste.ubuntu.com/845099/
<jtaylor> a figured it out, had to remove a -build-deps
#ubuntu-motu 2012-02-17
<dholbach> good morning
<iulian> Morning dholbach.
<dholbach> hi iulian
<Guest3525> Will Someone Tell Me How To Change My Nickname Please?:)
<dupondje> no package provides xulrunner-dev anymore ?
<jpds> dupondje: mozilla-devscripts ?
<dupondje> guess that contains something else?
<jpds> dupondje: It's what all the xul-* packages seem to build-dep on.
<jtaylor> do I have to go through the release team for evey upload now? also for bugfix only ones?
<ajmitch> no, it's not final freeze time
<ajmitch> new upstream releases don't need approval if they're bugfix-only
<ajmitch> at least that's what the rule was previously :)
<tumbleweed> ajmitch: correct
<ajmitch> tumbleweed: glad I'm not leading people too far astray
<tumbleweed> I had "that chat" with my (acadmeic) supervisor today, and appear to have dropped out of my Masters. Still need to figure out what that means for me...
<tumbleweed> did a fair bit of drinking this evening, so far :)
<tumbleweed> </tumbleweed's personal life>
<ajmitch> oh dear
<tumbleweed> naah, so far I think it's good. I haven't made progress in ages. My interests clearly lay elsewhere
<ajmitch> tumbleweed: so does that leave more ubuntu time, or was it because of ubuntu time?
<lifeless> tumbleweed: what was your masters on?
<tumbleweed> ajmitch: I was filling time with Debian/Ubuntu, so short term: same amount of time, long term: probably less
<tumbleweed> lifeless: don't ask, usability of digital library systems
<ajmitch> I can see why you'd be doing anything other than that  :)
<tumbleweed> yeah :P
<tumbleweed> I picked the supervisor because we had lively arguments together
<tumbleweed> but he pushed me into a different project than the one I'd initially been hooked with...
<jtaylor> how do buildd react on | build depends when the first does not exist?
<jtaylor> will they fail?
<micahg> jtaylor: as long as it's not versioned, it's fine
<jtaylor> Dependency is not satisfiable: debhelper (>= 8.1.0) on my pbuilder-dist armhf chroot
<jtaylor> it installs when I login
<jtaylor> components and mirrorsite is correct
<jtaylor> what else should I check?
<tumbleweed> armhf works with qemu? I thought it didn't (well, many system calls didn't)
<jtaylor> seems to, at least installation of packages
<tumbleweed> hrm, I should try it
<jtaylor> hurray I also got my apt cacher to cache ports
<jtaylor> in the main ubuntu cache => shared arch all pacakges
<tumbleweed> oh, nice
<tumbleweed> I want that (well, an apt-cacher for ports, sharing with my mirror for x86. That's harder)
<jtaylor> problem is, I have been spreading ports.com in every file I could find, which one was the right one now? :(
<jtaylor> great I broke it again and I don't know how
#ubuntu-motu 2012-02-18
<arand> Does a "non-free" Debian package automatically correspond to multiverse? In my case a package which is non-free due to missing "original source" for images and music?
<alkisg> I'm writing a script which launches Xephyr, then waits half a second for it to initialize, and then runs `DISPLAY=:2 myapp` inside it. Is there any way to tell Xephyr to launch that instead, so that I don't have an arbitrary delay in my script?
<Ampelbein> alkisg: You might be better off asking in #ubuntu for user support.
<alkisg> Ampelbein: hmm I'm not sure that's an appropriate channel for programming questions... there was another one about ubuntu-programming (not the -devel one of course) but I don't remember its name... OK, I'll try asking in #ubuntu too, thank you
<tumbleweed> arand: yes
<arand> tumbleweed: Ok, thanks, seems like requestsync doesn't set that automatically...
<tumbleweed> arand: no, probably not, please file a bug :)
#ubuntu-motu 2012-02-19
<jtaylor> hurray powerpc has finally reached the universe queue :)
<l3on> Ampelbein, hey :)
<l3on> about merge proposal number 93715, I have never understood if it's possible update directly my branch or I have to create a new one
<Ampelbein> l3on: Hi! You can push to the old one and repropose for merging.
<l3on> too late, I've already deleted the old branch and created a new one
<l3on> thanks :)
<Ampelbein> l3on: I find it much better if the branch stays the same, so I can just do 'bzr pull' and get the update.
<Ampelbein> But no problem for now.
<l3on> I'll do it next time :)
<jtaylor> if a core-dev is bored, libvigraimpex needs a no change rebuild :)
<jtaylor> for numpy
<tumbleweed> jtaylor: are you doing to do the syncs you got FFes for?
<jtaylor> tumbleweed: yes
<jtaylor> gnudatalanguage still needs to wait for ppc build
<jtaylor> pyzmq will be uploaded to debian today
<tumbleweed> good, just making sure :)
<jtaylor> I wonder what this private job is that is blocking on of the two ppc builders since 2 days
<tumbleweed> I can't see what it is, either. ppc is badly backed up already, without things like that.
<jtaylor> it must be one package as the other one is free, which package builds two days?
<tumbleweed> presumably it's an embargoed security upload. And some of the likely candidates for that have pretty long build times
<jtaylor> ajmitch: did you manage to fix the revu problem?
<jtaylor> "Directory to upload to does not exist"
<l3on>  Hi all... I've a question about packages have files (script) in /usr/lib/NAME/ directory
<l3on> for instance â http://packages.ubuntu.com/precise/all/ivtools-bin/filelist
<l3on> are files in the right place?
<tumbleweed> that's a reasonable place to have them if they won't be invoked directly by users
<l3on> some other packages are affected by bug like this:
<l3on> `pkglibdir' is not a legitimate directory for `SCRIPTS'
<l3on> ok, problem is pkglibdir_SCRIPT is incompatbile with automake 1.11.3
<tumbleweed> well, scripst are probably be architecture-independant, so /usr/share is preferable...
<l3on> ok :)
<jtaylor> thats some weird autotools change
<jtaylor> hit the mono apps too
<jtaylor> directhex: ^ what was the fix again?
<jtaylor> I think using programfilesdir as pkglibdir and programfiles_DATA for the scripts
<l3on> I did this for ivtools:
<l3on> -pkglib_DATA = src/ComUtil/comterp.err Idemo InterViews
<l3on> +pkgdata_DATA = src/ComUtil/comterp.err Idemo InterViews
<l3on> the location changes in this way:
<l3on> -usr/lib/ivtools/Idemo
<l3on> -usr/lib/ivtools/InterViews
<l3on> +usr/share/ivtools/Idemo
<l3on> +usr/share/ivtools/InterViews
<l3on> what do you think ?
<tumbleweed> if they are arch-independant (and the things that call them were also updated), then yes
<l3on> no, I don't think they are arch-independant
<l3on> this is a buildlog â http://debomatic.debian.net/precise/pool/ivtools_1.2.8a1-5build2/ivtools_1.2.8a1-5build2.buildlog
<l3on> ah no, I'm wrong... they are text files
<l3on> here the content of the files â http://paste.ubuntu.com/848626/
<directhex> jtaylor, that was the fix, yes
<directhex> autofoo 1.11.2 forbids use of pkglib_SCRIPTS, and enforces ELF-only got pkglib_LIBS
<directhex> and pkgdata_DATA is wrong, since it installs to the wrong location
<l3on> yep in /usr/share/NAME/
<l3on> so, what may be a reasonable fix for this ?
<directhex> let me find an example git commit for you
<directhex> -pkglib_SCRIPTS = $(ASSEMBLY)
<directhex> +programfilesdir = $(pkglibdir)
<directhex> +programfiles_DATA = $(ASSEMBLY)
<directhex> adapt that as appropriate for your project
<l3on> mm ok
<directhex> i.e. define your own dir (self-defined dirs have no restrictions) which is the same as pkglibdir, then use it
<l3on> anyway, this not fix the problem.. this is just a workaround
<l3on> I mean, effectly /usr/lib/NAME/ is a right place to locate scripts ?
<jtaylor> it depends on the script
<jtaylor> those in the paste look arch independent so share is correct
<jtaylor> assuming the application expects them there
<jtaylor> if not you need to either fix the application or install them in the old path
<jtaylor> you should inform upstream about this autotools change
<jtaylor> they may not know about it
<l3on> directhex, thanks, it works perfectly!
<directhex> l3on, /usr/lib/NAME is a reasonable place to locate things which are not ELF libraries. for example, GRUB .mod files
<ari-tczew> could someone change the status of package in bug 931154 cause it's fixed upstream, not ubuntu?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 931154 in clementine (Ubuntu) "clementine crashed with SIGABRT in raise() (solved)" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/931154
<jtaylor> ari-tczew: done
<ari-tczew> jtaylor: thanks
<jtaylor> ari-tczew: are you going to fix it in precise?
<ari-tczew> jtaylor: yes I can
<jtaylor> thanks
<ari-tczew> when I got time I need to check whether oneiric needs SRU
<jtaylor> Laney: could it the person responsible for transitions be added to the tracker?
<jtaylor> might be useful information
<tumbleweed> we could put it as a note (I see Debian has notes)
<tumbleweed> linking to the tracking bug for the transition would be a pretty sane thing to do :)
<jtaylor> hm I want to file a ffe for spyder there is already a upgrade request bug, should I convert that or just create a new bug?
<tumbleweed> either works
<jtaylor> nice new meld release, looks like its finally a general release
<jtaylor> yet another ffe to file :(
<directhex> poor jtaylor
 * tumbleweed syncs pypy and prays to the buildd gods
<stefanct> is there a way to prepare a bug report in launchpad without filing it yet?
<tumbleweed> in a text editor?
<stefanct> how does the text editor select the package, attach files, sets up affected distributions, subscribe other ppl...? :)
<Ampelbein> stefanct: You can file bugs per mail.
<Ampelbein> stefanct: https://help.launchpad.net/Bugs/EmailInterface
<GCS> Hi! I'd like to ask sync for Debian packages in Ubuntu.
<GCS> Who should I mail to?
<Ampelbein> !sync | GCS
<ubottu> GCS: Helpful information for filing a sync request can be found at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SyncRequestProcess
<tumbleweed> GCS: however, Ubuntu is curretly in feature freeze, so we're only syncing things that fix important bugs without adding features
<tumbleweed> (of course, there are exceptions)
<GCS> OK, as I see ceph was synced meanwhile.
<GCS> For a long time, Ubuntu had 0.38 , even if there was newer versions I've uploaded to Debian.
<GCS> tumbleweed: ... and you sync from testing, right?
<tumbleweed> by default, but that was before Debian Import Freeze, which was a while ago http://wiki.ubuntu.com/PreciseReleaseSchedule
<tumbleweed> we can sync from any release, manually
<GCS> tumbleweed: Do you see chance of syncing syslog-ng ? It contains important fixes, including but not limited to deadlocks and memleaks.
<geofft> I believe Ubuntu syncs from unstable (before DebianImportFreeze) except for LTSes, and this is an LTS
<GCS> geofft: Yes, that's why I've mentioned the testing sync.
<tumbleweed> GCS: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess
<GCS> geofft: That's also the reason why syncing syslog-ng would be advised. Contains important bugfixes.
<tumbleweed> GCS: note that syslog-ng is currently modified in Ubuntu, so it couldn't be synced anyway. It'd be a merge.
<GCS> tumbleweed: Checking...
<stefanct> Ampelbein: thx
<jtaylor> I should probably have put some builds into the ppc queue before pypy :(
<jtaylor> how long will that build?
<tumbleweed> jtaylor: I see why you are concerned, the last Ubuntu build took 13 hours before timing out
<tumbleweed> this'd probably be about the same, if it's going ot time out
<tumbleweed> I don't mind you asking anyone to score it down
<jtaylor> should be ok, I have nothing really urgent
<jtaylor> as long as some slots are free until beta 1 I'm happy
<jtaylor> if just this private job would end ..
<tumbleweed> there's currently no jit on powerpc, so it's for completion more than anything else
<micahg> jtaylor: should finish in ~1hr
<jtaylor> good
<jtaylor> I shoud make use of that an dput in my builds before the canonical guys start working :)
<micahg> jtaylor: it's a 37 hour build :)
<jtaylor> :O
 * tumbleweed fondly remembers insanetoolkit (before it got saner)
<micahg> tumbleweed: does bug 936483 need an FFe?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 936483 in globus-rls-server (Ubuntu) "Sync globus-rls-server 4.9-11 (universe) from Debian testing (main)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/936483
<tumbleweed> no
<micahg> thanks
<jtaylor> micahg: can you do a no change rebuild of libvigraimpex?
<jtaylor> for numpy
<micahg> jtaylor: yeah
<jtaylor> thx
<micahg> jtaylor: libvigraimpex done
<jtaylor> great, then numpy transition is done, only a arm armhf issue of pytables remaining :/
<ajmitch> jtaylor: revu shoudl be fixed, are you having issues with it?
<jtaylor> ajmitch: no but someone else, I'll tell him it should be fixed now
<ajmitch> jtaylor: when were they having problems?
<jtaylor> a few weeks ago
 * ajmitch fixed it middle of last week
<tumbleweed> jtaylor: that test suite seems to be problematic on a bunch of archs https://buildd.debian.org/status/package.php?p=pytables
<jtaylor> yes I saw, was probably always the case it was just never executed before
<jtaylor> it needs a new upload anyway, it has no compressors due to multiarch
<jtaylor> upstream tried patching it with "%s-linux-gnu" % platform.machine() :/
<jtaylor> is there some wiki page for upstreams how to handle multiarch?
<jtaylor> I fear that these kinds of broken patches may start to spread
<RAOF> I'm not aware of any.  Why is upstream doing that madness?
<RAOF> aka: what is it trying to locate?
<jtaylor> libraries
<jtaylor> I told them its wrong and they now use a sane approach (ccompiler.has_function)
<RAOF> Oh, that's a part of the build system?
<jtaylor> yes
<jtaylor> like numpy it just searched a set of constant folders
<jtaylor> if it didn't find anything there it compiled without the feature
<RAOF> Ah.
<RAOF> Can we hit upstream with pkg-config?  Or, I guess, ccompiler.has_function.
<jtaylor> there is no pkg-config integration in python distutils
<jtaylor> so that is not such a good solution
<jtaylor> also pkg-config is quite linux specific
<jtaylor> and many python projects do also target windows and mac
<jtaylor> ccompiler.has_function is apparently not so well known
<RAOF> Perhaps it should be publicised.
<jtaylor> it took me a while to find that in the api :/
<l3on> Hi all..
<l3on> someone knows if this can considered a bug?
<l3on> libxml2-dev has header files in /usr/include/libxml2/libxml/*h
<l3on> but, when you try to use it, problems occur:
<l3on> /usr/include/libxml2/libxml/tree.h:16:31: fatal error: libxml/xmlversion.h: No such file or directory
<jtaylor> did you set -I ?
<jtaylor> -I/usr/include/libxml2/
<l3on> jtaylor...
<l3on> let me explain :)
<l3on> I'm looking at /usr/include/augeas.h
<l3on> it has a:
<l3on> #include <libxml/tree.h>
<l3on> so, when I try to run a configure from an application use that header, I get error
<l3on> "libxml/tree.h" didn't found
<l3on> s/didn't/not/
<RAOF> l3on: It sounds a lot like you don't have the right include paths set.
<geofft> "pkg-config --cflags libxml-2.0" prints -I/usr/include/libxml2
<l3on> RAOF, I forced to use libxml2/libxml/tree.h in augeas.h and I get:
<geofft> l3on: so you should put $(pkg-config --cflags libxml-2.0) in your compiler line
<geofft> l3on: editing augeas.h is wrong
<l3on> /usr/include/libxml2/libxml/tree.h:16:31: fatal error: libxml/xmlversion.h: No such file or directory
<l3on> geofft, ok I now
<l3on> geofft, problem is build fails during configure!
<RAOF> And if augeas needs libxml2, it should Requires.private: libxml-2.0 in it's pkg-config.
<l3on> http://debomatic.debian.net/precise/pool/haskell-augeas_0.4.0-1ubuntu1/haskell-augeas_0.4.0-1ubuntu1.buildlog
<RAOF> l3on: So, I'd fix this by patching configure.ac to use pkg-config, and then submitting it upstream.
<RAOF> l3on: They're using AC_CHECK_HEADER, which, as you can see, is easily broken.
<l3on> mmm ok, so the bug is in augeas ?
<RAOF> l3on: No, the bug is in configure for haskell-augeas.
<l3on> ah ok... :)
<RAOF> haskell-augeas' configure script should use PKG_CHECK_MODULES to find augeas, rather than AC_CHECK_HEADER.  Because AC_CHECK_HEADER will fail when non-trivial include paths are required, such as - as you can see - libxml2.
<l3on> ok, thanks :)
<jtaylor> would it still be possible to get the new git-buildpackage?
<jtaylor> it has a couple of useful new features
<Laney> l3on: ta for looking at it. I'd already fixed it locally but didn't do anything with it. It would be nice if you could submit a Debian bug with the patch and X-Debbugs-CC the upstream author.
<Laney> the other haskell FTBFS (about the threaded runtime) can be closed as wontfix until ghc supports that
<Laney> if you want to do that.
<l3on> Laney, well.. :D actually I'm still studing PKG_CHECK_MODULES manpage :)
<Laney> more valuable experience for you then
<l3on> well I don't uderstand what's wrong:
<l3on>   PKG_CHECK_MODULES([AUGEAS], [augeas >= 0.8])
<l3on> ./configure: line 2625: `  PKG_CHECK_MODULES(AUGEAS, augeas >= 0.8)'
<l3on> ./configure: line 2625: syntax error near unexpected token `AUGEAS,'
<l3on> ok, I'm out. I don't know why I get that error.
<micahg> tumbleweed: are we doing FFe's for dh_python2 conversions again?
<tumbleweed> micahg: they are considered build-system changes, and could generally benefit from extra review
#ubuntu-motu 2013-02-11
<xnox> ESphynx: meh. fair enough =) it's not like it will support arm64 anytime before amd64 and etc.
<xnox> ESphynx: well it's in NEW queue for experimental due to package rename. But yeah, it's almost at the point where it is suitable for sid.
<xnox> Doesn't mater much though becuase, sid is frozen....
<micahgmobile> Sid isn't frozen, wheezy is
<xnox> micahg_mobile: meh
<micahg_mobile> In fact, there's nothing wrong with uploading a new source package to Sid since it won't migrate anyways
<micahg_mobile> Err...brand new source
<dholbach> good morning
<Laney> if anyone has some spare minutes, I'd appreciate some help on http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/transitions/ghc.html
<Laney> in particular there's a haskell-distributive sub transition in there
<Laney> LoganCloud: dholbach: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/lxsession-edit/0.2.0-3ubuntu1
<Laney> lxsession has a lxsession-edit package
<Laney> an
<dholbach> Laney, maybe gilir can help make a decision here?
<Laney> maybe
<Laney> but tab completion says he isn't on irc ;-)
<mitya57> dholbach: I think I have second part of bug 1121795 fix :)
<ubottu> bug 1121795 in Ubuntu Packaging Guide "Fonts in Russian PDFs are broken" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1121795
<mitya57> just disabling the \usepackage{times} makes the code blocks working
<dholbach> mitya57, that's great!
<mitya57> this should be potentially applied to all cyrillic (or even all non-latin) languages, but I'll only add it for ru now
<mitya57> dholbach: I didn't manage to figure out how to use ifeq inside a make target (seems not possible), so I'm going to apply this: http://paste.ubuntu.com/1636159/
 * mitya57 wonders if this should go upstream
<Rhonda> Alright, if ppa is sorta archive, even when I delete packages from there - is it still possible to get to the old sources?
<Rhonda> â¦ to potentially reupload them, reverting the delete?
<dholbach> mitya57, thanks so much for looking into this
<maxb> Rhonda: I think they are retained for a while - expand the detailed information for the package version, and see if the file names are links or not
<Rhonda> maxb: The package version isn't there anymore right after the delete
<maxb> view superseded packages
<Rhonda> superseded packages?
<Rhonda> ah!
 * Rhonda hugs maxb
<mitya57> dholbach: finally managed to make a working if block, pushed
<mitya57> dholbach: thanks, it's my language after all :)
<mitya57> and looks like cmap package is not needed with cm-super fonts
<mitya57> dholbach: also, re http://people.ubuntu.com/~mitya57/ubuntu-packaging-guide-readme.html#translating: did I miss something there?
<dholbach> mitya57, no, looks good to me :)
<mitya57> dholbach: nice
 * mitya57 will be back in 30 minutes
<ESphynx> xnox / micahg:  So what's the status on that conflict bug and SRU guys? :)
<xnox> ESphynx: conflict waiting for debian new queue review or  ubuntu FeatureFreeze which ever comes first. Didn't have time to look at the SRU yet.
<ESphynx> ah ok
<ESphynx> xnox: I made a .debdiff that's ok?
<ESphynx> I also linked to the bzr branch
<ESphynx> speaking of the FF, that's near beginning of March, right?
<ESphynx> I'm hoping to have a new version ready before then, with real 64 bit support...
<xnox> ESphynx: yeah, something like that.
<xnox> ESphynx: He =) well 64bit I expect on all 64 bit platforms include ppc64 & arm64 ;-)))))))
<ESphynx> xnox: well I might not be able to test it in time on those
<ESphynx> xnox: but theoretically it should mostly work
<ESphynx> xnox: afaik it already works on ppc/arm
<ESphynx> I'd be interested to get eC on that 'Quickly' thing :P
<Rhonda> grmpf
<Rhonda> If I upload the same source I don't even get a reject mail. :)
<hrw> ia64 is also 64bit...
<ESphynx> Who tests all these platforms anyways? :P
<alo21> HI. Can someone help on understanding this bug (https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/dovecot/+bug/1117613)...
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 1117613 in dovecot (Ubuntu) "Sync dovecot 1:2.1.7-7 (main) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,Fix released]
<alo21> it says that is not a sync, but a merge. But LJ synced it
<alo21> why? Should I do something or is OK?=
#ubuntu-motu 2013-02-12
<dholbach> good morning
<mitya57> hi dholbach :)
<dholbach> hey mitya57!
<mitya57> I've written an "Ubuntu" CSS for wpgen, you can enjoy the result @ http://people.ubuntu.com/~mitya57/ubuntu-packaging-guide-readme.html
<dholbach> nice
<mitya57> (wpgen is my 50-line script that generates webpages from sources using ReText code)
<dholbach> very very nice :)
<dholbach> I just translated my daily page of packaging guide :)
<mitya57> good :)
<dholbach> everybody: if you speak a language other than English you might want to consider doing the same: https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu-packaging-guide/ :)
<dholbach> we can't let the Spanish and Russian speakers all the fun! :)
<dholbach> ... have all the fun...
<dholbach> and German is ahead of Japanese! woohoo! Brazilian Portuguese is next! :-P
<mitya57> russian on 78% (but that was not me) :)
<dholbach> I'll blog about it later on as well
<dholbach> this is just great :)
<aboudreault> any reason why postgresql 9.2 wont be in the next release?
<jpds> In experimental in Debian.
<geser> aboudreault: I just asked pitti about in #ubuntu-devel. It's because of the Debian freeze and we have to choose either 9.1 with a lot of extensions or 9.2 without any extensions.
<geser> and if you need/want 9.2, it's also in pitti's PPA
<aboudreault> jpds, geser. thanks for the answer. I totally understand that.
<aboudreault> yeah.
 * tumbleweed just wasted hours because I forgot that dpkg-buildpackage in lucid doesn't apply 3.0 (quilt) patches before building
<tumbleweed> ...these things we take forgranted...
<Laney> I'M DEFINITELY EDITING THIS FILE
<Laney> *introduces a deliberate syntax error*
<Laney> <program still compiles>
<tumbleweed> this was javascript, so not a complied language :)
<tumbleweed> it broke at runtime, and I knew I had the patch to make it not break
<tumbleweed> but didn't check that I actually did
<Laney> runs, same diff
<tumbleweed> also, it worked for build-time tests
 * tumbleweed must kill the $work lucid machines
<tumbleweed> but I guess that means killing the hardy ones first...
<xnox> tumbleweed: backport handling 3.0 quilt packages
<xnox> tumbleweed: or use bzr dailydeb which can autoapply and convert 3.0 (quilt) to 1.0 packages.
 * xnox doesn't think it's an amazing feature, but hey it works.
<mitya57> dholbach: here?
<mitya57> do you think we can list translators' names on the home page (or anywhere else)?
<mitya57> launchpad supports that via `msgid "translator-credits"`
<mitya57> (thanks for mentioning /me in the post btw) :)
<dholbach> mitya57, if we can get it done I have no objections
<mitya57> ok. I'll create a new (temporary) series in LP and see if that works
<dholbach> thanks mitya57
 * dholbach goes and calls it a day - see you all tomorrow
<tumbleweed> xnox: I know now (again)
<chilicui1> hggdh: hi, sorry to bother, I'm working on bug #1088131 it seems like an easy to fix one (and not critical), so I've make a ticket in upstream and send them the patch, from the history of upstream I'm sure it'll be added, so should I work in a patch for Ubuntu as well?, how the fix can reach Ubuntu precise? (the version the reporter has in the first place)
<ubottu> bug 1088131 in coreutils (Ubuntu) "ls --color doesn't recognize an arc archive as an archive" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1088131
<hggdh> chilicui1: thank you :-). I thought you would be interested in providing the patch ;-)
<hggdh> chilicui1: the ideal is to wait for upstream to commit the patch, then we add (propose) it for Raring. Frankly, although it is a simple change in dircolors.hin, I do not think it is worth of a SRU
<chilicui1> hggdh: got it, that's what I though too, then I'll wait, thanks
<hggdh> (it does not fix a critical issue. Not even an important one... it is just a cosmetic-ish fix, making sure that ARCes are shown in red
<hggdh> chilicui1: yw. Also, thank YOU for working in it.
<chilicui1> hggdh: my pleasure
#ubuntu-motu 2013-02-13
<dholbach> good morning
<geser> good morning
<murthy> need someoen to sponser pushing libdlna
<murthy> here is the package https://launchpad.net/~murthy/+archive/test/+packages
<jtaylor> why do so many packages have ~exp1 suffix in debian, its so ugly ._.
<jtaylor> is there a reason behind it besides misguided unstable asthetics?
<hrw> jtaylor: Debian is in freeze now. so new stuff goes into experimental - thats why ~exp1
#ubuntu-motu 2013-02-14
<micahg> cody-somerville: are you still interested in catfish?  we'd like to get a new version in Debian experimental and sync to Ubuntu ideally
<ESphynx> micahg =)
<micahg> ESphynx: once I catch up on a little backlog, I'll take a look at the SRU unless xnox beats me to it
<ESphynx> cool, thanks :) I hope I got that .debdiff right :)
<ESphynx> I'm trying to wrap up this 64 bit release before FF :P
<micahg> ESphynx: oh, that needs to be in raring before it can be SRUd
<dholbach> good morning
<geser> good morning
<tumbleweed> hrw: there's no reason to add a suffix for experimental packages
<ScottK> It's for people who later like to remove the experimental changelog entries and pretend the history in Experimental didn't happen.
<ScottK> Seems wrong to me.
<hrw> tumbleweed: but people do
<mitya57> dholbach: so I now have a working debian/scripts/build-list-of-translators @ lp:ubuntu-packaging-guide/translator-credits
<mitya57> will be ready to merge after translations update
<dholbach> woohoo!
<dholbach> thanks mitya57
<mitya57> the question I have is: do you want to move ubuntu-packaging-guide-{readme,translators}.html to developer.ubuntu.com?
<mitya57> the downside is that you'll have to (automatically?) regenerate it every day/week,
<mitya57> the upside is that you won't rely on /me to do that :)
<mitya57> dholbach â
<dholbach> that doesn't sound like a big downside :)
<mitya57> ok ;)
<mitya57> but you'll have to use python3-markups package (in raring) or retext-wpgen (in quantal, not tested with that)
<mitya57> or just rst2odt, but that won't be ubuntu-styled
<dholbach> hmhm
<dholbach> but we can upload it to our ppa I guess
<mitya57> of course
<dholbach> still it will be a bit tough for backporting
<mitya57> it's not needed for build
<mitya57> I'll give you a generation script and a template tomorrow :)
<mitya57> (unfortunately python-markups API is not documented yet, but what it does is reading the .rst/.mkd/whatever, reading template.html and generating output in html directory)
<dholbach> ok, thanks
<dholbach> any tasks any of you would like to get on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuGlobalJam so loco teams can take a look at them?
<ESphynx> micahg: 64 bit support -- I was talking about Raring :)
<cody-somerville> micahg: I've mostly given up maintenance of that to the python-apps teams in Debian.
<cody-somerville> micahg: Happy to help make it happen though if there's something you'd like me to do.
<micahg> cody-somerville: thanks, will be in touch
#ubuntu-motu 2013-02-15
<psusi> how can I search the apt cache for packages based on Priority?
<agrestringere> Hello all, was wondering about a bug regarding Wine https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mesa/+bug/1066599
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 1066599 in mesa (Ubuntu) "Wine is unable to detect OSMesa correctly when compiling from source" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<dholbach> good morning
<geser> good morning
<jokerdino> hi guys. i have requested a needs-packaging bug on lp, can i get some feedback? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/1126433
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 1126433 in Ubuntu "[needs-packaging] unity-tweak-tool" [Undecided,New]
<jokerdino> i checked with desktop devs the other time and they didn't have any issue with unity configuration tool in the repository.
<bobweaver> Hello all I was wondering if anyone knows if there is a tool to add copywrite headers to all files ?  Example:  http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~josephjamesmills/u2t/dailybuilds/view/head:/shell/common/PictureGlowButton.qml         Lines 1-17    but something that does that to all files? or should I just write a script for that ? thanks for your time
#ubuntu-motu 2014-02-10
<teward> are quilt patches allowed to modify items inside the debian/ folder or is that a nono
<Noskcaj> teward, Why would you?
<teward> Noskcaj: the fix for LP Bug #1264674 is to modify a third-party module inside the debian/ folder (nginx)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1264674 in nginx (Ubuntu Saucy) "nginx segfault when adding add_header in configuration" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1264674
<teward> i have an upstream diff (from Debian) that fixes this for the nginx-extras module, but the question is do I manually modify it or have it as a quilt patch
<teward> s/modify it/apply the patch/
<teward> (it's rare I have to touch the third-party modules :/)
<Noskcaj> I'm guessing it's allowed to patch, debian-mentors is usually best for these questions though
<teward> well, i'll see if debuild whines.
<teward> it occasionally does that
 * teward shrugs
<cjwatson> I think you can probably modify files under debian/ in quilt patches in theory, at least with some source formats, but it's really really confusing and you shouldn't.
<cjwatson> I would expect any sponsor who's paying attention to kick that back to you.
<teward> cjwatson: that's what i thought, but it's been a while since i messed with the third-party modules in nginx, I can prep a debdiff for either, then if the sponsor wants to kick back the "This modifies debian/..." thing at me there's an alternate debdiff
<teward> I have a feeling rbasak is keeping an eye on the bug, but I might be wrong.
<cjwatson> I would recommend just preparing the one with the files under debian/ changed directly and not in quilt, rather than wasting a sponsor's time
<teward> meh, that's equally easy
<cjwatson> It's the right thing to do.  Conceptually the quilt patch series should apply to the upstream tarball without debian/ even there.
<cjwatson> Tools such as git-dpm would probably fail if that weren't the case.
<teward> yeah, makes sense.
<teward> in other news, thank god I can have amd64 AND i386 builds within sbuild, it prevents me having to use the PPA builders to build-test things. ^.^
<dholbach> good morning
<rbasak> teward: the debdiff in bug 1264674 looks fine. But before I test/sponsor, could you complete the SRU justification please?
<ubottu> bug 1264674 in nginx (Ubuntu Saucy) "nginx segfault when adding add_header in configuration" [Undecided,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1264674
<fully_human> Stupid question time. When should I write a test case for a bug? What if I don't see a "test" folder for a package?
<rbasak> fully_human: when it would be useful. On a bug-by-bug basis, I'd say. Do you want to describe the bug to get a more helpful response?
<fully_human> An inkscape bug where a color swatch contains an incorrect color. Inkscape does not have a "test" folder already.
<fully_human> But I suppose test folders can be per-branch and the package maintainer will just apply the patch without the test. :-|
<rbasak> Ah. I'm not sure about desktop bugs, sorry. Perhaps a test case that a human can follow will do.
<fully_human> So a little note with the patch saying "See what you expect? This is what the patch returns!"
<rbasak> Are you talking about a test case for an SRU?
<fully_human> SRU?
<fully_human> Sorry, I'm really confused here. I've seen three or four different tutorials on fixing a bug on Ubuntu/Launchpad and they all seem to say different things. For example http://packaging.ubuntu.com/html/fixing-a-bug-example.html has me create a new branch while http://packaging.ubuntu.com/html/fixing-a-bug.html just tells me to create a patch, edit it (should I do it before or after `patch`?) and export to a patch.
<Noskcaj> fully_human, The simplest way is just make a patch however you think and submit it to a launchpad bug
<fully_human> So it's all about diffing...how I go about it is up to me.
<fully_human> Maybe I should write something about that in the docs so no one else is confused. :-\
<rbasak> fully_human: personally I find a debdiff the easiest. Prepare the new source package you're proposing, and then attach the output of "debdiff <old_dsc> <new_dsc>".
<fully_human> Thanks. :)
<fully_human> So, basically I can do: 'cp -R foo foo-bug-1', edit some file in foo-bug-1, then do a 'debdiff foo foo-bug1' ?
<fully_human> And I assume debuild -S and pbuilder just make a debian I can test?
<jtaylor> the non vcs apparoch is: quilt add <files you want to edit>
<jtaylor> edit them
<jtaylor> quilt refresh
<jtaylor> dch -i, write changelog
<jtaylor> debuild -S; debdiff old-dsc new-dsc
<jtaylor> oh quilt new <patch-name> first
<fully_human> When I do debdiff, should I be one level up from the package directory?
<jtaylor> doesn't matter it just needs two dsc
<jtaylor> after debuild they are usually in ../
<fully_human> And so debdiff will automatically try to find them?
<jtaylor> no you need to tell it the path of the dsc
<jtaylor> it will find the rest by itself
<fully_human> Oh, yeah, I suppose since you said "old-dsc." :P
<jtaylor> debuild will create a new dsc if you updated the version with dch -i
<jtaylor> see ls ../*dsc
<fully_human> Okay, I think I'll just see what happens here...I'm still a bit confused but I think I understand what's going on up until dch -i.
<fully_human> Ah, should I test the package before or after I run dch -i?
<fully_human> (well, too late because I'm already writing the changelog. :P)
<jtaylor> you should do it before you debuild, else you overwrite the old dsc
<jtaylor> but its not a big deal just download it again
<fully_human> And pbuilder will create the new deb file to install, right?
<jtaylor> yes
<fully_human> Aha! I think I'm getting it!
<jtaylor> debuild can also do it
<jtaylor> without -S
<jtaylor> you do that to get it right, then test with pbuilder because its slower
<fully_human> Yes, I discovered this. o.O
<jtaylor> there are many tricks to speed up pbuilder
<jtaylor> using eatmydata, special buildplace mountoptions, using apt-cachers etc
<jtaylor> worth looking into when you do more packaging work
<fully_human> Hm...yelling at my computer (expletives included) didn't help...
<fully_human> Your suggestion will probably work better. :)
<fully_human> Which makes sense, because installing modified binaries. Any way to reset the build?
<fully_human> So I tested my patch. It tried doing `debuild -S` to generate dsc files, but I got a bunch of errors like this one: dpkg-source: error: cannot represent change to share/extensions/Barcode/__init__.pyc: binary file contents changed
<fully_human> dpkg-source: error: add share/extensions/Barcode/__init__.pyc in debian/source/include-binaries if you want to store the modified binary in the debian tarball
<fully_human> Which makes sense, because installing modified binaries. Any way to reset the build?
<jtaylor> hm that means the clean target of rules does not do what it should
<jtaylor> that is an unfortunate annoyance
<jtaylor> the easiest way around this is to use version control to reset the build
<jtaylor> without that you could extract a new copy and apply your debdiff on it
<jtaylor> or fix the clean rule for testing (and file a bug in debian)
<fully_human> Even when I do a bzr revert I get the same debuild errors (or does bzr revert revert back to *my* patch?). I must be doing something wrong.
<jtaylor> bzr clean-tree
<jtaylor> make sure your patch is commited first
<fully_human> With 'bzr commit'?
<jtaylor> bzr add <file>
<jtaylor> bzr status will show you what willb e commited
<jtaylor> it should only be stuff in debian
#ubuntu-motu 2014-02-11
<fully_human> I see one problem that's arising. A .tix and .cix file under .bzr/repository/indices is corrupted (part of the file is corrupted).
<fully_human> Oh, explored some others...looks like binary blob or something.
<fully_human> But I'm getting a complaint that some of the files "have no final newline."
<fully_human> Man, this is getting confusing.
<fully_human> Okay, found another guide on packaging.ubuntu.com with more info on quilt. Which diff should I use as a patch for launchpad? the one from the '.pc/' directory or the output I obtain from debdiff
<fully_human> ?
<fully_human> *the one from the './pc' directory I created...?
<fully_human> Oh, the one under .pc is a dir. Never mind.
<dholbach> good morning
<Balwinder> Hello?
<fully__human> So, I have created a patch for a package. How should I get the patch into a form that will be accepted on LP. I already tried doing a debdiff and got a slap on the hand for it. From what I can tell the '.pc' directory has the literal patches, but they're all directories. Thanks!
<jtaylor> why was the debdiff rejected?
<fully__human> The attachment "blah blah blah" seems to be a debdiff. The ubuntu-sponsors team has been subscribed to the bug report so that they can review and hopefully sponsor the debdiff. If the attachment isn't a patch, please remove the "patch" flag from the attachment, remove the "patch" tag, and if you are member of the ~ubuntu-sponsors, unsubscribe the team.
<fully__human> Or is that just a warning in case I didn't mean for it to be a patch.
<fully__human> ?
<jtaylor> its a bot that add tags
<jtaylor> normally if you add a debdiff you add a patch tag and subscribe sponsors
<jtaylor> if you don't a bot will do so for you
<fully__human> Those poor bots. They don't get paid much.
<fully__human> In any case, thanks! :-)
<jtaylor> now you have to wait
<jtaylor> as feature freeze is soon it may take a while
<jtaylor> is it something that needs to go in before that?
<fully__human> The bug was labeled critical.
<jtaylor> whats the bug?
<fully__human> Bug #1248174
<ubottu> bug 1248174 in inkscape (Ubuntu) "The Ubuntu colour palette in Inkscape is different from the one in design.ubuntu.com" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1248174
#ubuntu-motu 2014-02-12
<dholbach> good morning
<howie_> !ops
<howie_> !staff
<ikonia> still not learning are you
<howie_> stuff you
<howie_> in order to be saved, you must live for Christ and you must not live for yourself
<howie_> ÏÎ·Î³Î±Î¯Î½ÎµÏÎµ ÏÏÎ·Î½ ÎºÏÎ»Î±ÏÎ·
<kloeri> howie_: drop that nonsense
<howie_> ÏÎ·Î³Î±Î¯Î½ÎµÏÎµ ÏÏÎ·Î½ ÎºÏÎ»Î±ÏÎ·
<howie_> go to hell in greek
#ubuntu-motu 2014-02-13
<dholbach> good morning
<ESphynx> Hey guys... I can' t seem to get my app to go full screen with _NET_WM_STATE_FULLSCREEN... I always end up with the Unity panel and top menu bar? Any help/direction appreciated. Thanks!
<ESphynx> (Unity)
<ESphynx> override_redirect will just completely ignore FULLSCREEN, won't it?
#ubuntu-motu 2014-02-14
<dholbach> good morning
<jtaylor> mh my chrootis installing gcc-4.9 :O
<jtaylor> trusty will have it?
<jtaylor> uh and transparent huge pages by default :)
<myNameIsWho> hello there why does lintian hate the opt dir ?  I keep on getting these errors
<myNameIsWho> E: irc-touch: dir-or-file-in-opt opt/ircclient/bin/ircclient
<myNameIsWho> and so on for all my qml and well anything that goes under opt
<jtaylor> archive packages don't install into opt
<jtaylor> so it warns
<jtaylor> ignore it if its not for the archive
<jtaylor> or override
<myNameIsWho> jtaylor,  how ?
<jtaylor> http://lintian.debian.org/manual/section-2.4.html
<myNameIsWho> jtaylor,  full lintian errors and warnings  http://pastebin.com/1SgmekFA
<myNameIsWho> thansk
<myNameIsWho> thanks *
<myNameIsWho> thanks again jtaylor  cya
#ubuntu-motu 2014-02-15
<teward> cjwatson: can I bug you for another nginx merge?  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nginx/+bug/1280511
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1280511 in nginx (Ubuntu) "Please merge nginx 1.4.5-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,New]
<cjwatson> teward: Done.
<teward> cjwatson: thank you kindly!
<teward> (I went to bed early, last night, so sorry for the late response)
<jtaylor> mh python-debian still does not support xz in trusty oO
<wookey> I just discovered http://www.ubuntuupdates.org/package/getdeb_apps/saucy/apps/getdeb/*
<wookey> which is very nice but I can;t see how to get a _source_ package
<cjwatson> pull-lp-source in ubuntu-dev-tools
<cjwatson> (which is also in Debian)
<wookey> So that stuff is in lp too? I searched launchpad for 'rbutil' and only found an old lool 1.2 PPA
<wookey> I assumed that stuff was some other repo
<wookey> and was failing to work out where from the web page
<wookey> pull-lp-source: Error: The source package 'rbutil' does not exist in the Ubuntu primary archive in trusty, trusty-security, trusty-updates or trusty-proposed
<wookey> http://www.ubuntuupdates.org/package/getdeb_apps/saucy/apps/getdeb/rbutils has 1.4. If only I could work out exactly where...
<wookey> (so that I can build a debian version)
<cjwatson> oh, getdeb is something else?  I have no idea
<cjwatson> sorry, I assumed that was some insane frontend to Ubuntu proper
<Unit193> wookey: That's an unofficial repo, though all you do is add the deb-src lines.  Also, it seems he hosts the source debdirs on github.
* cjwatson changed the topic of #ubuntu-motu to: Saucy released! | Want to get involved with the MOTU? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing | Sponsor queue: http://bit.ly/fz6AyQ | http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/ftbfs | http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/nbs.html | http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/bugs/rcbugs | LP down for upgrades 2200-2300
<cjwatson> https://twitter.com/launchpadstatus/status/432754992634544128
* cjwatson changed the topic of #ubuntu-motu to: Saucy released! | Want to get involved with the MOTU? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing | Sponsor queue: http://bit.ly/fz6AyQ | http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/ftbfs | http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/nbs.html | http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/bugs/rcbugs
#ubuntu-motu 2015-02-09
<dholbach> good morning
#ubuntu-motu 2015-02-10
<dholbach> good morning
#ubuntu-motu 2015-02-11
<Unit193> Mirv: Hello!  I don't suppose you're likely to sponsor an update for Synergy into universe?
<Mirv> Unit193: sure I'd be likely to sponsor. it'd help up restoring my karma for being a slightly too busy for proper patch pilotting this year so far.
<Mirv> Unit193: just hit me with a link and I'll look at it
<Unit193> Mirv: Slight "problem" with it, I did the update for myself and later sent to the Debian maintainer, so it's a little more extensive: dget http://sigma.unit193.net/source/synergy_1.6.2-0vanir1.dsc (have a debdiff too, and think in a PPA somewhere if that'd help.)  You can back away slowly now if you'd like. :)
<Mirv> Unit193: seems reasonable so far, looking at debdiff :) so the link-with-pthread not needed anymore? if the Debian maintainer accepts it, we could do a full sync from Debian then later
<Mirv> oh no it's actually there, just renamed and brought from Ubuntu
<Mirv> right
<Unit193> Mirv: Anything besides dropping the dbg package need done?
<Mirv> Unit193: well we do have -dbg packages in Ubuntu, I don't think that hurts? so far I've just change the version number to ubuntu1 and changed the maintainer field to xsbc-original-maintainer plus added ubuntu developers
<Unit193> Mirv: Well, if Debian doesn't accept it, it's delta.
<Mirv> oh and added the previous Ubuntu changelog entry back
<Mirv> Unit193: oh, right, then it's better to drop
<Mirv> it's also binary new. if the Debian maintainer wants it, he can have it and we get it via sync
<Mirv> Unit193: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/synergy/1.6.2-0ubuntu1
<Unit193> Wowzers, danke Mirv!
<Mirv> bitte schÃ¶n
#ubuntu-motu 2015-02-12
<Brady4MVP> simple question how to deal with service files with packaging ?
<Brady4MVP> init or systemd
<Unit193> For systemd, dh-systemd.
<Unit193> !info dh-systemd
<ubottu> dh-systemd (source: init-system-helpers): debhelper add-on to handle systemd unit files. In component main, is extra. Version 1.20ubuntu3 (utopic), package size 16 kB, installed size 99 kB
<Brady4MVP> thanks
<Brady4MVP> for systemv, dh_installinit. ?
<Brady4MVP> !info dh_installinit
<ubottu> Package dh_installinit does not exist in utopic
<Unit193> That's default, you only need an addon for systemd, and run  dh --with systemd  in the d/rules file.
<Unit193> Have d/packagename.init  for the init script.
<Unit193> http://manpages.ubuntu.com/dh_installinit
<Brady4MVP> very cool it starts it ?
<Brady4MVP> or ut thta in postinst
<Brady4MVP> put *
<Brady4MVP> that * lol
<Brady4MVP> like the update-rc.d part
<Brady4MVP> defaults
<Brady4MVP> I am also kinda confused about a postinst and postrm with something like dpkg --reconfigure ,  and how to make packages that can reconfigure say 2 files that are altered in the postint with whiptail and then sed
<Brady4MVP> does dpkg --reconfigure look at pre/postinst and pre/postrm
<Brady4MVP> and how to work that all out.  say that preinst gits things and then postinst is for configure. this is due to java and not wanting to package java Rotflol, ... anyways yeah should how do I undo commands and tie it all into dpkg in the d/*
<Brady4MVP> I also have some crazy questions about documentation in-line and making multible binary's based upon the git branch
<Brady4MVP> Example: say I took different classes of qt and exposed them to QML.  Then I documented all of it so that on build it creates qch and html docs.  how to make it so that all the things that are in the make command run ,  like make all ,  or make docs , or make subdir
<Brady4MVP> seems like I should have multiple packages for docs and also the declaritive plugins
<Brady4MVP> Example: https://github.com/JosephMillsAtWork/Qt-Public
<Brady4MVP> look at the files dir one
<Brady4MVP> that is the one that I started with for packaging/..
<Brady4MVP> https://github.com/JosephMillsAtWork/Qt-Public/tree/master/qtdeclarative5-mango-files-0.0.1  << need to also make example files that make debain package
<Unit193> Mirv: Alive
#ubuntu-motu 2015-02-13
<Mirv> Unit193: morning!
<ataalik> Hello, I have done my first packaging yesterday and was wondering if anyone could check it and see it's fine. Am an in the right place?
<Unit193> ataalik: Well, are you intending for it to be in Ubuntu?  Did you need any specific help?  If not Ubuntu, where do you plan on submitting it?
<ataalik> I have uploaded on launchpad. I noticed a good piece of software that was not in launchpad and wanted to see how packaging and maintaining was done. Everything seems to be working and the .deb file builds successfully at launchpad but I might have some mistakes about the meta data and such.
<Unit193> Debian says: The packaging tutorial (http://deb.li/QYyI) and the New Maintainer's Guide (http://deb.li/3DiDA) are good places to start learning  about  Debian packaging.
<ataalik> I went trough the Ubuntu community tutorial but will have a look at these too, thank you.
<Unit193> Well, nobody can take a look without a link.  I'd also run it through  lintian --pedantic -IE  for some tips.
<ataalik> https://launchpad.net/~ataalik/+archive/ubuntu/ppa  here is the link for it. I have run it trough lintian and it only complains about descriptions.
<sladen> ataalik: it builds and compiles, which is a good indication of doing something right :)
<sladen> ataalik: debian/* directory copyright  "2014 Maim Contributors" ?
<sladen> ataalik: probably 2015, and probably yourself
<sladen> ataalik: debian/control::Description: 'a screenshot commandline screenshot program."
<ataalik> Ha.
<sladen> ataalik: two uses of 'screenshot', one full-stop and beginning with "a"
<sladen> ataalik: all of which can be dropped
<ataalik> Copyright (C) 2014 Dalton Nell, Maim Contributors (https://github.com/naelstrof/maim/graphs/contributors)
<ataalik> This is the start of their copyright file
<ataalik> Should I just drop the contributors thingy
<sladen> ataalik: yes, but the debian directory I (presume) is something you just created, and this is the reason you're seeking review?
<Unit193> It's also GPL-3+, I did some fixes.
<ataalik> Yes, should I include myself there. The guy that created the software wanted to group all other contributors with a github link soo?
<Unit193> http://paste.openstack.org/show/foVIIP6QRdhd3ba6pamF
<sladen> ataalik: the main copyright attribution is not wrong
<sladen> ataalik: what I'm querying is the copyright attribution for the debian/ directory (ie. the Debian packaging)
<sladen> ataalik: which I presume was done, today, in 2015, and not by the main contributors
<sladen> maim
<ataalik> Oh I get it
<sladen> since I can't see a debian/ directory in  https://github.com/naelstrof/maim
<Unit193> AKA, your name and email.
<sladen> there was another package called 'main' 13 years ago:  https://lists.debian.org/debian-mentors/2002/05/msg00254.html
<sladen> so calling it  'maim-screenshot' might be safer if you end up with a naming collision
<ataalik> all right. I'm fixing these as we speak.
<sladen> ataalik: the manpage says it is copyright Dalton Nell, so I don't know which spelling of Nell vs. Neil is correct
<sladen> either way, as Unit193 noted, the email from there should be added after the name int he copyright file
<Unit193> My example description isn't the best, but it's an example.  I missed saving befor making the diff, but the correct license seems to be GPL-3+ (light difference in what you marked, GPL-3)
<Unit193> Dalton Nell <naelstrof@gmail.com>
<Unit193> Seems to be, that is: https://github.com/naelstrof/maim/commit/9e101cec430180ffd1005966182ae6c8d4c65cf2.patch
<Unit193> Anywho, as sladen is helping out and far more capable than I, I'll take my leave.
<sladen> not at all...
<sladen> 'apt-cache search screenshot | less -S'  shows the other Descriptions: that people use for screenshot utiltiies, might give some ideas
<sladen> it's not wrong, but might help working out to 'stand out'
<sladen> eg. Description: save screenshots with cursor and masking from command-line
<ataalik> So I've got all of that. I think it look ok now. One last thing before sending it trough lintian again. Does the copyright entry at debian/ has to have my name and the developers name or just one of us ?
<sladen> who did the Debian packaging?
<sladen> it should reflect whodunnit
<ataalik> I did the debian packaging
<sladen> then it should be you
<ataalik> All right then just me
<dholbach> good morning
<Unit193> Howdy, dholbach.
<ataalik> lintian returned no errors, woo
<dholbach> hi Unit193
<ataalik> Source: maim-screenshot Binary: maim
<ataalik> Is binary the actual command line call of the package? If so is it wise to keep it like this or should I change that to maim-screenshot or something similar
<geser> ataalik: Binary is the name of the generated package, for most source packages building only one binary package it's the same name (if no naming policy requires something different)
<geser> if you have no reason to name the binary package only "maim" then keep the name "main-screenshot" (the actual executable can stay "maim", you don't have to rename that to match)
<Rhonda> Can someone look into ejabberd?  Debian has newer upstream versions available. :)
<Rhonda> I think the patches could get dropped, most of them were taken from upstream and are incorporated in the newer releases, but I haven't checked that completely.
<Rhonda> Alright, checked with an ejabberd upstream developer, the only patch that is in there which needs to be kept is the ufw profile one.
<Rhonda> And here I wonder if we can/should carry that in the Debian package already so we can drop the ubuntu diff here. :)
<blueyed> Can I install man pages for x11/xcb somehow?
<blueyed> The ones that are provided in Arch via https://www.archlinux.org/packages/extra/i686/libxcb/files/
<blueyed> I cannot find them using "apt-file search"
<simosx> try "libx11-doc" or "libxcb-doc"
<blueyed> simosx: thanks, but they are simply not installed: https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=751981
<ubottu> Debian bug 751981 in libxcb-doc "libxcb-doc: manpages not installed" [Wishlist,Open]
<blueyed> Should those go into the -dev package? The -doc one is ~42MB (rather large already).
<blueyed> The man pages are ~9MB. So, probably -doc is a good fit, and won't blow up -dev's size.
#ubuntu-motu 2015-02-14
<Laney> tumbleweed: highvoltage: congrats!
<highvoltage> Laney: thanks! hope to see you here!
<Laney> me too :-)
#ubuntu-motu 2015-02-15
<Logan> Laney: can we delete telepathy-farstream-0.4 now? it looks like you forked it for some remaining r-deps, but there aren't any anymore
<Noskcaj> Logan, Could you please review https://code.launchpad.net/~noskcaj/ubuntu/vivid/snappy-player/1.0/+merge/248186 ?
<Noskcaj> This removes the final r-dep on clutter-gst 1.0
<Unit193> Oh if we're pinging Logan today, I could have something for him too!
#ubuntu-motu 2016-02-15
<dholbach> good morning
#ubuntu-motu 2016-02-16
<dholbach> good morning
<roman___> Hello,
<roman___> I'm trying to get though procedur https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/NewPackages
<roman___> to include new package.
<roman___> Quoted: "Join the #ubuntu-motu channel on irc.freenode.net and talk with the MOTU. It's good to do this early on, to get advice on how to package (avoid common mistakes), to find out if your package is likely to be accepted (before you invest a lot of work in packaging it), and to find mentors willing to sponsor your package or to point you in the right direction. "
<roman___> I have created preliminary package, needs-packaging bug is https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/1542258
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1542258 in Ubuntu "[needs-packaging] logdata-anomaly-miner -- lightweight tool for log checking, log analysis" [Wishlist,New]
<roman___> Open questions:
<roman___> * software is python port of existing private software, not yet hosted on opensource platform. Is adding to launchpad as bazaar project sensible?
<roman___> * How to get the review process going (Note: I have passed the review procedure once by myself on the partial package. Has to be redone now)
<roman___> * It would be great, to make it to Xenial, because this is also the release we are goning to use on our machines. Hence if in Xenial, our support of open-source package (bug fixing) via Ubuntu will be better, as we also use the package in house.
<rbasak> roman___: Xenial's feature freeze is on Thursday. If you're not familiar with the process and are only starting now, I don't think it's likely you'll get it into Xenial.
<teward> i was about to say that heh
<teward> rbasak: ninja'd ;)
<rbasak> New packages are given some leeway by the release team though as they're unlikely to regress anything. However, you're still giving less time for testing before release, and we want the release to be good.
<rbasak> Usually the path to get software into Ubuntu is via Debian.
<rbasak> Adding a public VCS is always sensible. It doesn't have to be Launchpad, though that's useful for tighter bug tracking integration.
<rbasak> Launchpad supports git hosting now too.
<roman___> The package is already completed, builds in PPA, is uploaded.
<roman___> My 2nd review is missing
<roman___> and of course the Ubuntu review.#
<rbasak> I haven't seen the packaging, but third party packaging with people unfamiliar with Debian and Ubuntu rarely meets policy requirements.
<rbasak> Sorry I don't have time to look right now. Busy working on stuff with a deadline of two days to feature freeze.
<roman___> @via Debian: I started mentoring procedure there already, but as I do not have so strong links to Debian community, everything is taking quite a while.
<rbasak> Sure, and I appreciate that it's harder than it should be, both for Debian and for Ubuntu.
<rbasak> But asking two days before feature freeze with a goal to get it into Xenial is unrealistic.
<rbasak> Go for Xenial+1 and more people will be able to help at the start of the next cycle. You're asking less of them that way.
<rbasak> (or do Xenial+1 and backports after Xenial's release or something).
<roman___> @rbasak VCS: OK, so I'll push the sources there, Git is better as I'm already familiar with it.
<rbasak> I'm not saying you can't get it into Xenial, just that it's a big ask right now.
<roman___> @make it to xenial/big ask: I'm not so familiar with the procedures. So my first goal is to meet all the requirements for inclusion, no matter if xenial or later.
<rbasak> Inclusion in Debian means automatically meeting the requirements for Ubuntu inclusion. So I'd focus on that side. (I appreciate it's not easy)
<roman___> As package is really small and security was major design goal (e.g. I did the same auditing methods used for detection of last year Ubuntu LXC guest escape reeported by us (have to look up the 3 CVEs).
<rbasak> I see you have filed an ITP. Get the packaging uploaded to mentors and ask for review.
<roman___> It is already uploaded to mentors, but no responses yet.
<rbasak> If it's already on Debian mentors and not making progress, Ubuntu will be more amenable to uploading ahead of Debian.
<roman___> Making it to LTS would be great, but also I do not want to unnecessarily bind MOTU resources. So perhaps we could somehow sort out, what would be the top priorities by me to support MOTU procedure.
<roman___> Is this correct? P0: get source to launchpad hosting; P1 run the 2nd review round; P2: fix issues found, update launchpad PPA and Debian mentoring platform package
<roman___> And then?
<rbasak> I would just focus on the review at mentors.
<roman___> To avoid involving too many MOTUs in parallel, does it make sense to go into P2P comm instead (mail) of broadcast from now on.
<roman___> @mentors: thanks for that, I'll try to wake them up.
<roman___> After mentors completed, how long will procedure on Ubuntu side take to import?
<teward> roman___: if it gets into Debian it will probably autosync into Ubuntu during the next development cycle
<roman___> Ah, OK.
<teward> provided it passes all Debian mentors' concerns, and is actually added *to* Debian
<Rhonda> Anyone got an idea when the update for glibc is expected?
<roman___> @ubottu: Assigned to me. I'll commit the source to launchpad git, add the links to changelog/control files, add the bug number to changelog (to fix the bug) and upload
<rbasak> Rhonda: "no eta yet" from #ubuntu-hardened. I suggest following in there.
<rbasak> roman___: please keep this public, here on IRC or on a public ML. Those not interested can ignore or filter. Otherwise overhead for others to catch up wastes time.
<rbasak> roman___: if in Debian after FF, and the release team grant you an exception, a manual sync for a packager is trivial.
<rbasak> for a package
#ubuntu-motu 2016-02-17
<dholbach> good morning
#ubuntu-motu 2016-02-18
<dholbach> good morning
<justin_time> dholbach: Thank you for reviewing my tomahawk-player sponsoring request! I'm working with the tomahawk developers on a patch for using libjs-cryptojs. Is there anything else I have to fix?
<dholbach> justin_time, that's all I saw for now
<dholbach> ^ can anyone else take a look at this too? https://launchpad.net/bugs/1487729
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1487729 in tomahawk (Ubuntu) "Tomahawk 0.8.4 or newer [needs upgrade]" [Medium,In progress]
<dholbach> I'm going to be a bit busy for the rest of the day
<justin_time> dholdbach: ok, and when is the deadline for a new package? Today, or?
<dholbach> justin_time, feature freeze is going to be some time today
<dholbach> but a new upstream version can be introduced later on with an exception from the release team too
<justin_time> dholbach, ok and so I have to open a request for an exception when the package is ready?
<dholbach> we're not in feature freeze yet
<dholbach> but yeah, a bug with some explanation why the changes are needed and some additional info: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess
<justin_time> dholbach: ok, thank you for your help!
<dholbach> anytime
#ubuntu-motu 2016-02-19
<alkisg> Good morning, about appdata.xml, how would projects using distutilsextra handle the translations of appdata.xml (extract from .xml and put to .pot)?
<alkisg> Could someone point me to a project doing that, so that I could look at its source code?
<dholbach> good morning
<Laney> alkisg: hey
<alkisg> Hi Laney
<Laney> alkisg: look at 'meld', is that any help to you?
<alkisg> Laney: I see it has a manual po/POTFILES.in, with [type: gettext/xml]data/meld.appdata.xml.in
<Laney> sounds correct
<alkisg> Maybe distutilsextra can't handle it automatically and a manual POTFILES.in is needed
<alkisg> I'll give it a try, thank you :)
<justin_time> Hi, if I want to request a FeatureFreeze Exception can I simply subscribe ubuntu-release to the existing bug (LP: #1487729) or do I have to create a new bugreport?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1487729 in tomahawk (Ubuntu) "Tomahawk 0.8.4 or newer [needs upgrade]" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1487729
#ubuntu-motu 2016-02-21
<alkisg> Laney: I ended up filing LP bug #1548056 to ask python-distutils-extra to properly support appdata.xml, so that apps don't have to manually generate a POTFILES.in with all their translatable files.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1548056 in python-distutils-extra "Support appdata.xml" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1548056
#ubuntu-motu 2017-02-15
<Unit193> Mirv: Heya!  So, looks like https://github.com/epakai/synergy-debian/blob/master/debian/changelog - https://mentors.debian.net/package/synergy might fix the ftbfs synergy on those extra arches.
#ubuntu-motu 2017-02-19
* SmellyPirate changed the topic of #ubuntu-motu to: LOL DONGS, OMG! |* g o a t s e x * g o a t s e x * g o a t s e x * g o a t s e x * g o a t s e x *
* grumble changed the topic of #ubuntu-motu to: Yakkety released! | Want to get involved with the MOTU? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing | Sponsor queue: http://bit.ly/fz6AyQ | http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/ftbfs | http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/nbs.html | http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/bugs/rcbugs
<Menzador> Hi everyone. Could somebody please check to see if the topic grumble set is correct?
<mapreri> it is.  (well, it's the same it was before)
<Menzador> Thanks. I was just following up from his post in #ubuntu-ops about it. :) Carry on
<Menzador> He'd noticed someone hijacked
#ubuntu-motu 2019-02-14
<ral> Hello. Feel free to send me to somewhere better to ask this. If an upstream has a deb package in universe, and a snap package, is there any mechanism to remove the deb package from the archive and have it not be imported from Debian?
<rbasak> There is a sync blacklist that could technically achieve that. I don't know if we have any established policy on whether to use the sync blacklist for that particular purpose though.
<rbasak> https://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-archive/+junk/sync-blacklist/view/head:/sync-blacklist.txt
<rbasak> You could file a bug against the (deb) package in Launchpad to explain reasoning and subscribe ~ubuntu-archive to the bug in the first instance.
<rbasak> ral: ^
<ral> rbasak: Thanks, I'll give that a go.
<rbasak> ral: which package, OOI? I'm curious to see how that goes since it might become a general request.
<ral> rbasak: mosquitto
<rbasak> Thanks
<rbasak> ral: ah, a library package? Removing those requires removals of rdeps.
<rbasak> You'd have to remove baresip also.
<rbasak> And not having a library packaged as a deb precludes packaging anything that needs that library.
<ral> A fair point.
<ral> There might be a compromise though.
<ral> Just packaging the library would solve those problems and it's not the library that tends to need the package updates.
<rbasak> That would require either convincing the Debian maintainer to do that, or to maintain a delta in Ubuntu indefinitely.
<ral> I maintain the deb package (not as a dd or dm)
<ral> Maybe I'll just orphan the package and let someone else deal with it :)
#ubuntu-motu 2020-02-11
<ses1984> i'm still trying to wrap my head around ubuntu packaging and launchpad
<ses1984> let's say there is a fix available upstream for a package that isn't available through launchpad yet
<ses1984> can i apply that patch from upstream, and submit it to launchpad, in such a way that i can `pull-lp-source` on another system and the source includes the patch i submitted?
<ses1984> i think i have to follow the flow up to here: http://packaging.ubuntu.com/html/fixing-a-bug.html#submitting-the-fix-and-getting-it-included -- but i think i might be missing something
