#ubuntu-desktop 2008-09-15
<mscottputman> HI!  I'm moving over from Windows to Ubuntu and there's only one thing holding me back.  I used a dual-monitors setup with Windows and cannot get Ubuntu to work properly with it.  It clones easily, but I want it to extend instead.  I have been using "Screens and Graphics" to tweak things, but it hasn't worked.  I'm running on an Intel 845 and the monitor is an HP w17e on Ubuntu Hardy Heron
<mscottputman> #ubuntu-helpteam
<mscottputman> HI!  I'm moving over from Windows to Ubuntu and there's only one thing holding me back.  I used a dual-monitors setup with Windows and cannot get Ubuntu to work properly with it.  It clones easily, but I want it to extend instead.  I have been using "Screens and Graphics" to tweak things, but it hasn't worked.  I'm running on an Intel 845 and the monitor is an HP w17e on Ubuntu Hardy Heron
<huats> morning everyone !
<seb128> lut huats
<huats> hey seb128
<glatzor> morning mvo!
<glatzor> mvo, packagekit now supports running a distro upgrade hook in the user's desktop session
<glatzor> mvo, which command would be best? do-release-upgrade -m desktop?
<glatzor> mvo, would be nice to have an import gtk try and error to find the corresponding frontend automatically
<mvo> glatzor: re upgrade tool: yes, run that for now
<mvo> glatzor: we should probably add something that shows the initial download with a GUI, but it should be good for now
<gicmo> seb128: morning
<seb128> hey hey gicmo!
<seb128> how are you?
<gicmo> I think I am catching a cold
<gicmo> and I am a bit worried about gvfs' state
<seb128> :-(
 * seb128 hugs gicmo
 * gicmo hugs seb128 back
<gicmo> I need to fix http, which involves a lot of code change
<seb128> gicmo: alex seems to be coming back, he said he will try fix this gtk fileselector crasher thing today
<gicmo> not much tume
<gicmo> time
<gicmo> and then we have this stupid gvfsd-trash heisenbug
<seb128> it's not only gvfsd-trash
<seb128> but that's the most noticable because that the one everybody is running
<gicmo> seb128: sigh
<seb128> did you try to mail alex about it? maybe he has some good idea ;-)
<gicmo> seb128: that monitor split was a bit ... well
<seb128> right, my opinion too
<gicmo> seb128: I will in a few secs, mabe I can convince him to log into IRC even ;-)
<seb128> and I'm not sure to understand what it brings exactly
 * gicmo nods
<gicmo> well the idea is that basically you only have once process per session doing the HAL foo and the monitoring of /etc/fstab
<gicmo> which indeed is a good diea
<gicmo> idea
<gicmo> not nautilus + the file selector + anybody interested in volume changes
<seb128> right
<seb128> let's say the implementation is not perfect yet then ;-)
<gicmo> seb128: quite that, yes ;-)
<gicmo> This bug has 102 duplicates
<gicmo> ups
<seb128> hey NCommander
<NCommander> seb128: hey seb128
<seb128> NCommander: any news about gtkmm? ;-)
<NCommander> seb128: didn't I give that to you?
<seb128> gicmo: waouh, alex commited to svn ;-)
 * NCommander remembers giving you the debdiff
<seb128> NCommander: I didn't get it if you did, and that's why using we use bugs for sponsoring ;-)
<NCommander> seb128: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/revu1-incoming/gtkmm2.4-0809112350/gtkmm2.4_2.13.8-0ubuntu1.dsc - I had the brains to save a backup before I wiped my HDD :-)
<gicmo> seb128: woho!
<seb128> gicmo: he just commited to trunk though, stupid earlier split for this cdtext thing
<gicmo> yeah
<gicmo> tell hadess about that
<gicmo> I got angry
<gicmo> nobody asked me about that
<gicmo> redhatters doing what they want
<seb128> right
<gicmo> seb128: I will make sure it gets into stable
<seb128> gicmo: thanks
<andreasn> mpt: hi! do you have a moment to take a peek at a brasero bug?
<mpt> andreasn, sure
<andreasn> mpt: http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=551938
<ubottu> Gnome bug 551938 in general "Image burning dialog" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
 * mpt realizes that nautilus-cd-burner's equivalent dialog has a useless "Information" header
<mpt> andreasn, +1 to your suggestions
<mpt> I don't have anything else to say :-)
<andreasn> ok, thanks!
<seb128> hello pedro__
<pedro__> salut seb128!
<pedro__> mm why i'm having a double _
<seb128> mvo: hum, bug #261990
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 261990 in evolution "Upgrade dapper -> hardy fails (because of evolution-plugins?!)" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/261990
<mvo> seb128: yes, see my "needinfo" there
<seb128> mvo: I was going to say that 2.6.1-0ubuntu7.4 is not an ubuntu version but that's a security update version so ignore that ;-)
<mvo> seb128: I suspect local corruption, but it might be something really strange with the upload :)
<mvo> seb128: aha, ok. my first impuls on the version number was "invalid, not us" but rmadison convinced me otherwise :)
<seb128> mvo: I'm ready to bet that's another case where the issue is not a package one though ;-)
<mvo> local corruption I think
<mvo> I have seen a lot of this today, strnge, must mean that the normal bugs are almost all gone :P
<seb128> ;-)
<mvo> maybe we need a component "dubios-reports" or so :)
<seb128> mvo: btw there is something weird going on with gconf, we got several bugs since your uploads
<seb128> mvo: does gconf create the new directory if you try to write system defaults and it doesn't exist?
<mvo> the directoy is included in the new gconf
<seb128> mvo: is it possible that some people tried your new "set system default" button before getting the new gconf which creates the dir using the right permissions?
<mvo> yes, that makes sense
<seb128> ok, will ask that on the bug
<mvo> if the dir is not there, it seems to be created with 0700 permissions
<mvo> I will update the dependency and add a version
<seb128> thanks
<mvo> seb128: do you have a bugnumber for me to close?
<seb128> mvo: no, bug #269215 might be due to it but that's just a guess at the moment I asked on the bug
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 269215 in gconf "There is a problem with the configuration server. (/usr/lib/libgconf2-4/gconf-sanity-check-2 exited with status 256)" [Medium,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/269215
<mvo> thanks
<mvo> I commited a gconf2-common (>= latest-in-ubuntu) dep now
<seb128> thank you
<mvo> thanks
<seb128> NCommander: you are being too lazy to describe your changes in the changelog now? ;-)
<NCommander> I didn't?
 * NCommander explodes from overwork
<seb128> NCommander: not the shver update and the build requirements update
<NCommander> argh
<NCommander> I'll respin it
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> NCommander: so?
<NCommander> seb128: sorry, was respinning a samba4 patch
 * NCommander is currently multitasking
<seb128> NCommander: I'll sponsor the other one don't bother
<NCommander> seb128: I'm going to be a little busy this coming week, so I don't think I can handle any more updates for a little big
<james_w> thanks seb128
<seb128> james_w: you're welcome, keep up the good work you are doing ;-)
<james_w> I'll try :-)
<pedro_> seb128: do you know if the retracers are working?
<seb128> pedro_: the machine where they are running is moving between datacenters
<pedro_> seb128: ok!, thanks you
<seb128> no problem
<seb128> pedro_: and the 8.04 retracers are still not fixed
<seb128> the intrepid ones should be back soon though
<mvo> is it just me or do you see bug #269805 with metacity too (in addition to compiz?)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 269805 in gnome-control-center "gnome-window-properties gives error about configuration tool not being "registered"" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/269805
<pochu> mvo: yeah, I see it here with metacity
 * mvo nods - thanks
<pochu> mvo: btw, I have metacity's compositing manager enabled, in case that matters
<seb128> mpt: hi
<seb128> mpt: the gnome-session alignment issues are icons variant not available in the human theme
<seb128> mpt: do you think we should use the icons gnome-session was using in hardy?
<tedg> seb128: I believe that mpt went home with a bad headache.
<seb128> tedg: ok, no hurry anyway, thanks for letting me know
<andreasn> seb128: I thought things were just scaled up ()
<andreasn> seb128: I thought things were just scaled up (badly) if a bigger size was missing
<seb128> andreasn: they are not, look at the session dialogs
<andreasn> guess it's just the other way around (scale big one down if small is missing)
<nxvl> is there any package with gtk for bash?
#ubuntu-desktop 2008-09-16
<Ng> is it just me, or is the workspace switcher a bit borked in intrepid atm?
<glatzor> morning mvo
<mvo> hey glatzor!
<mvo> thanks for your message yesterday
<mvo> glatzor: did you get my reply?
<glatzor> mvo, sorry, which one?
<mvo> glatzor: that do-release-upgrade -m desktop is a good method for the pk
<glatzor> mvo, right. this one.
<glatzor> mvo, I already pushed this into git.
<mvo> heh :) nice!
<glatzor> mvo, thanks for all your help!
<glatzor> mvo, debian does not have the metapackages section, rigth?
<mvo> glatzor: no
<glatzor> mvo, packagekit now supports collections
<mvo> based on the metapackage?
<glatzor> mvo, currently I emit metapackages as collections
<glatzor> mvo, currently they appear in a separate group in the gtk application and have a different icon.
<glatzor> mvo, but they are handled by the same methods (InstallPackage, RemovePackges and friends)
 * mvo nods
<mvo> glatzor: great news \o/
<glatzor> mvo, the funny thing is, that the yum backend creates virtual packages out of their groups (equivalent to Debian tasks)
<glatzor> mvo, I would prefer not having metapackages at all and these guys emulate them :)
<mvo> :)
<seb128> asac: what startup page is used in firefox nowadays?
<asac> seb128: http://start.ubuntu.com/8.04/
<asac> seb128: i think you should use that too. but better check back with mdke
<seb128> asac: and when there is no internet access? and there is no by locale variant?
<asac> seb128: we are using the offline page that epiphany uses
<asac> seb128: but the ubuntu-docs team wants to change something for intrepid
<asac> seb128: they want to make it clear that the user is "offline"
<asac> seb128: and consider to do that on a error-page-like page
<seb128> ah ok
<seb128> thanks
<asac> seb128: but i told mdke to first figure out what ubuntu-docs team wants
<asac> there appeared to be still unfinished discussions
<lool> seb128: I found out about the pigment-python issue; it was stuck in depwait because the NEW packages had been put in universe instead of main
<lool> slangasek fixed it yesterday
<seb128> lool: ok good
<lool> seb128: I think Riddell isn't around this week, would you mind if I grab you for 3 syncs  O:-)
<seb128> lool: which ones?
<lool> #262805 elisa elisa-plugins-good elisa-plugins-bad
<lool> There was an issue with Debian's ftpmaster and I had to reupload -bad -2 again this morning, hope it's installed now
<lool> It's experimental or incoming
<lool> elisa/0.5.9-1-1/experimental elisa-plugins-good/0.5.9-1/experimental elisa-plugins-bad/0.5.9-1-2/incoming
<seb128> mvo: would be nice if you could fix the white screen on second login issue before next intrepid milestone so the guest account and user switching can get testing ;-)
<seb128> mvo: I just closed some dups about that
<mvo> seb128: its commited to bzr already, I was checking if there is more that needs to get uploaded, its definitely going in today
<seb128> mvo: good, thank you
<mvo> thanks
<seb128> hey tedg
<tedg> Morning seb128
<seb128> tedg: I sponsored your fusa update, does it fix the crasher issue?
<tedg> I was going to download a LiveCD this morning to test.
<tedg> I'm queueing that right now :)
<tedg> Didn't we talk about you waking up later? ;)
<tedg> Wait, there only seems to be manifests in the Live CD directory.
<tedg> No .iso's.
<tedg> An NM, wrong directory.
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> gicmo: do you know if there is an quick way to check if an url is a 404 using command line tools?
<geser> seb128: have you tried HEAD?
<james_w> seb128: HEAD -s https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/asdf | head -n 1 | cut -d" " -f 1
<seb128> geser, james_w: thanks
<geser> james_w: you can replase the "head -n 1" with the option -d to HEAD (and -s is always set for HEAD)
<james_w> geser: thanks for the tip
 * Ng curious if anyone else is seeing intrepid's workspace switcher applet (when using compiz) only occupying half of the height of the panel
<seb128> Ng: it's a classic compiz misconfiguration
<Ng> seb128: oh? is it something I've done? I have poked around a lot in ccsm
<seb128> Ng: yes, your number of viewport and workspaces is not correct
<Ng> in General -> Desktop Size, I have Horizontal Virtual Size = 4, Vertical Virtual Size = 2 and Number of Desktops = 1
<seb128> Ng: you want to speak to mvo
<Ng> mvo: hi :)
<seb128> and in the GNOME applet preferences?
<mvo> Ng: hello! could you please put your export of the configuration somehwere (pastebin etc). ccsm has something like "export to file" IIRC
<Ng> sure
<Ng> mvo: http://pastebin.com/f48b49c25
<Ng> the applet preferences shows 4 columns 2 rows. changing that just seems to affect the half of the workspace applet which has workspaces in it
<mvo> Ng: hm, strange. #
<mvo> s0_number_of_desktops = 1 is one, that looks good
<mvo> Ng: I try after dinner
<Ng> mvo: ok, thanks :)
<gicmo> seb128: any idea when flash will be usable again?
<seb128> asac: ^
<seb128> gicmo: what is broken?
<gicmo> well its prolly due to me being on 64 bit and that ndiswrapper thingy
<gicmo> but I just see gray areas everywhere
<gicmo> nothing more or less
<seb128> gicmo: using swfdec or the adobe plugin?
<asac> gicmo: remove libflashsupport.so
<seb128> asac: how come we still have this crap on intrepid?
<asac> seb128: its still in ia32libs ... should be gone in next upload
<seb128> asac: is that the "ia32libs needs update"?
<seb128> alright
<asac> which _must_ happen before beta
<asac> gicmo: /usr/lib/libflashsupport.so ... you can just remove that (but this is really an exception ;))
<asac> err
<asac> gicmo: /usr/lib32/libflashsupport.so
<asac> gicmo: at least there should be more stability. performance will be fixed by the next flash release we hope
<asac> but thats an adobe bug
<gicmo> ok, now the browser froze ;-/
<asac> gicmo: have you properly restarted everything after removing it?
<dilomo> hey seb128
<dilomo> I'm the New Wave theme developer
<seb128> hi dilomo
<seb128> dunno what wave is
<dilomo> I want to ask if the patch for the Main menu
<dilomo> will arrive in 8.10
<seb128> dunno what patch or main menu you are speaking about
<dilomo> how so?
<seb128> how what?
<seb128> are you sure you want to speak to me and not somebody else?
<dilomo> ok benzea wrote
<dilomo> a patch that gives the Main Menu
<dilomo> in gnome a name so that it can be themed separately
<dilomo> then vuntz in the gnome-art channel
<dilomo> commited it to gnome some days ago
<seb128> ok, so it'll be in the next tarballs
<dilomo> thank you :)
<dilomo> that means alpha 6 or beta ?
<seb128> beta
<dilomo> cool
<dilomo> just for the record that's New Wave:
<dilomo> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Incoming/Intrepid/NewWave
<seb128> interesting ;-)
<dilomo> :) I'm glad you like it
<dilomo> I have to run
<dilomo> bye
<gicmo> hmm /var/lib/flashplugin-nonfree/npwrapper.libflashplayer.so
<gicmo> even when removing the flashsupport it doesnt work
<gicmo> at all
<Keybuk> err
<Keybuk> so the clock time setting stuff has gone a little pessimal
<Keybuk> Right click on clock -> Adjust Time
<Keybuk> it pre filled in the local time (as well as showing me London time)
<Keybuk> if I set that, it winds the block back and claims to be 11am London time!
<Keybuk> it doesn't change the timezone
<james_w> Keybuk: poke seb128 to fix it
<james_w> glad to see you back btw
 * Keybuk tries to remember how to change the timezone the old fashioned awy
 * cody-somerville sneezes.
<james_w> I fixed time-admin to not do something very similar the other day
<james_w> the timezone thing might be a different bug though
<seb128> hey Keybuk, nice to see you back, how are you?
<Keybuk> I'm much better thanks
<seb128> good ;-)
 * seb128 hugs Keybuk
<seb128> the "set" button to change timezone works here
<Keybuk> seb128: which "set" button?
<seb128> the dialog to adjust the time doesn't though, I commited the fix upstream but I've been too lazy to backport it to intrepid, I'm just waiting on the new tarball
<seb128> Keybuk: when you have several locations configured they are listed under the map in the clock applet, on mouseover you get a "set" you can use to change the current timezone
<Keybuk> oh, I didn't know that :)
<seb128> that's there since hardy ;-)
<Keybuk> the button only appears when you point at it
<Keybuk> that's about as discoverable as the secret dwarf door that only appears when you speak certain words at a certain time of day when a nightingale sings
<seb128> ah ah
<Keybuk> sorry, momentarily channeling mpt there ;)
<seb128> in fact it's display when you mouseover the location line here, which is easy to discover if you let you mouse over one location to get the weather details which are in the tooltip
<seb128> but you can argue than the weather details in the tooltip are as discoverable ;-)
<Keybuk> I didn't even know you could get the weather that way!
<seb128> see ;-)
<Keybuk> and I don't think I've ever needed to set my timezone *and* look at the weather at the same time ;)
<cody-somerville> lol
<seb128> Keybuk: btw congrats for being a GNOME foundation member now ;-)
<Keybuk> \o/
<Keybuk> not sure what that entitles me too
<seb128> you can vote the board members
<seb128> and you are in the about GNOME dialog ;-)
<Keybuk> is that the dialog I keep trying to get rid of? :p
<seb128> maybe they accepted you just to make you reconsider that ;-)
<Keybuk> I'd add About dialogs for every other component of Ubuntu :)
<Keybuk> About Kernel
<Keybuk> About X
<Keybuk> About GNU
<Keybuk> About Freedesktop
<Keybuk> About RedHat
<Keybuk> About Canonical
<Keybuk> About Two Guys In A Garage
<cody-somerville> About You
<Keybuk> now that'd be a good dialog box!
<Keybuk> Your favourite colour is Purple
<Keybuk> Your favourite ice cream flavour is Strawberry
<Keybuk> You are currently wearing black boxer shorts
<jcastro> don't forget "About Karl Lattimer"
<jcastro> welcome back Keybuk, congrats on foundation membership!
<Keybuk> jcastro: I feel an easter egg coming on
<tedg> I think it should be "Your favorite color is Brown" and if you try to change it a little dialog comes up "No, I told you your favorite color is Brown!"
<Ampelbein> seb128, james_w: any ideas on bug 140424 ? in the last comments, a user asks if the plugin could be activated by default, but I cannot find an easy way to activate a plugin at install-time without breaking the user's custom chosen plugins to use.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 140424 in eog "eye of gnome: double-clicking to go fullscreen" [Wishlist,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/140424
<seb128> Ampelbein: I would send the request upstream to start and let them decide
<seb128> Ampelbein: should the schemas be modified? that just apply to default when user didn't do any changes
<pochu> wow, I didn't know eog had plugins
<pochu> that "double-click to fullscreen" one looks quite useful
<Ampelbein> seb128: from what i know, the active plugins are described in ~/.gconf/apps/eog/plugins/%gconf.xml so i thought about installing one where the fullscreen-plugin is activated by default.
<Ampelbein> but if we create a gconf.xml that would overwrite the one the user created.
<seb128> Ampelbein: look to the eog.schemas
<pochu> Ampelbein: you have to modify the system-wide one instead, /usr/share/gconf/schemas/eog.schemas
<Ampelbein> i see
<Ampelbein> thanks, will first report upstream, then fiddle around locally. thanks.
<mvo> Ng: I just tried it here and it seems to behave sanely
<mvo> Ng: just to confirm, you have set "integration" to on
<mvo> Ng:  and you use the gconf backend (not the flat file one)?
<seb128> I bet that's again a backend issue
<seb128> see you later
<superm1> Hi guys.  i was wondering if it was now intentional behavior that the power button is bringing up a logout dialog instead of shutdown dialog, or if that was an oversight/bug?
<superm1> (on up to date intrepid)
<superm1> ah well it's marked as bug 252795 at least.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 252795 in gnome-power-manager "pressing the "Power" button shows a logout dialog" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/252795
<Ng> mvo: definitely using gconf..... integtraion?
<mvo> Ng: under preferences (lower left corner) "enable integration in the desktop environment"
<Ng> mvo: yeah that's ticked
<mvo> Ng: ok, the next step would be to go to gconf-editor, then /apps/panel/applets
<mvo> then search in the apps_%i for the name with bonoboo_iid "...WorkspaceSwitchApplet"
<mvo> and look for preferences under that
<mvo> eh, "prefs"
<mvo> and there "num_rows"
<mvo> unfortunately its that complicated as that key has no static location
<seb128> mvo: you know that gconf-editor as a search feature? just search for the key name there
<Ng> mvo: aha, yeah that was set to num_rows=2
<Ng> changing it to 1 makes the switcher DTRT
<Ng> but I don't know what would have changed that
<mvo> seb128: *cough* that clearly shows that I need to go to bed
<seb128> ;-)
<Ampelbein> seb128: ok, i managed to activate the eog-fullscreen plugin by editing the schemas. is this something "worth" changing so i could provide a debdiff or should we wait for upstream-comments on the issue?
<seb128> Ampelbein: that's something I would wait for upstream comments before changing, we have no reason to hurry into changing to be different on ubuntu
<Ampelbein> ok, thanks.
#ubuntu-desktop 2008-09-17
<seb128> hello mvo
<mvo> hey seb128
<leenuks> Hello everyone
<seb128> hi leenuks
<leenuks> Can someone direct me to where i can change my panel bar auto hide speed. they are too slow and not snappy enough.
<leenuks> ive opened the configuration manager but as yet havent found the setting
<seb128> leenuks: gconf-editor
<seb128> search for animation_speed
<seb128> change this one to fast and the delays to lower values too
<seb128> you can disable animations too
<seb128> that should make things smoother
<leenuks> turning animations off in ccsm does nothing
<leenuks> as for animation_speed a search with find in gconf editor gives nothing
<seb128> did you select the option to search in key names?
<leenuks> there we go.. that found it.. hehe
<leenuks> thanks btw
<leenuks> 20
<leenuks> oops wrong keyboard
<leenuks> doesnt matter what i set it to the panel speed stays the same.
<leenuks> should i restart GDM
<leenuks> nah that did nothing as well
<seb128> dunno then
<seb128> vuntz might know
<leenuks> *pokes vuntz* oi
<leenuks> lol
<vuntz> lalala
<leenuks> oh hi vuntz
<vuntz> leenuks: is the animation slow or the time before the animation starts too long?
<leenuks> it takes 2 seconds to show and changing the speed from 500 to 20 does nothing
<vuntz> which speed?
<vuntz> and 2 seconds sound awfully anormal
<leenuks> also if i turn off visual effects and set them to none it does the same thing so i dont think its compiz
<leenuks> i want it to snap up not slowly slide up
<vuntz> leenuks: what did you change?
<leenuks> just a sec. i just restarted gdm
<vuntz> leenuks: /apps/panel/toplevels/bottom_panel_screen0/hide_delay and unhide_delay is what you want
<vuntz> (where you replace bottom_panel_screen0 with something else)
<leenuks> i changed /apps/panel/global/panel_animation_speed
<leenuks> there we go the one you suggested worked a charm. thanks bud
<leenuks> instand pop up
<leenuks> one more setting for the notebook
<fta> seb128, would you mind have a look at http://www.sofaraway.org/ubuntu/debdiff/fontconfig_2.6.0-1ubuntu3--2.6.0-1ubuntu4.debdiff ?
<seb128> fta: looks good, some people already changed the makefiles directly in the diff.gz which is a bit ugly though
<fta> yep, i agree. i wanted the change to be minimal so it did it that way. i should be cleaned-up at some point
<fta> -i+it
<seb128> the diff looks good to me, can you attach it to the bug and subscribe the sponsor team?
<fta> sure
<fta> seb128, done
<seb128> mvo: bug #271147, what do you ask for such issues?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 271147 in deskbar-applet "package deskbar-applet 2.22.3.1-0ubuntu1 failed to install/upgrade: subprocess post-removal script returned error exit status 139" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/271147
<mvo> seb128: that is one of the anyoing ones, 139 is a segfault I think (128+11) - I usually ask for files in ls -l /var/crash in the hope to find the crashed thing
<mvo> seb128: but it looks reproducable for him (a lot of those crashes)
<mvo> seb128: so we could ask for "sudo sh -x /var/lib/dpkg/info/desktbar-applet.postinst configure"
<seb128> mvo: do you want to do it or should I add a comment?
<mvo> seb128: I can take it
<seb128> mvo: thanks
<mvo> seb128: its either scrollkeeper-update or update-icon-caches that fail I think, the postrm is pretty short
 * mvo suspects scrollkeeper
<seb128> mvo: would not be the first time ;-)
<mvo> heh :)
<seb128> mvo: would it be possible to somewhat detect what crashed during the upgrade time to provide extra informations in such bugs?
<seb128> mvo: usually when a software crashes there is a message on stdout or strerr, is apt filtering those out?
<mvo> apt should not filter them out, it should print exactly what the users sees on his terminal into the log (this is why there is this whole crazy pty code in dpkgpm.cc now)
<mvo> extra information> good point, I can check if it is possible to detect that can scan /var/crash or something
<pochu> hi all
<MacSlow> does a "apt-get upgrade" imply a configure of previously unfinished package-installs?
<tedg> MacSlow: I'm not sure, but usually if I keep tying "apt" and "dpkg" eventually it usually tells me the command I need to type :)
<mvo> MacSlow: please try sudo apt-get install -f
<tedg> mvo: I think that my way is less to remember long term ;)
<MacSlow> tedg, mvo: ok
<mvo> MacSlow: out of curiosity, what happend?
<MacSlow> mvo, nothing on my systems
<MacSlow> mvo, a girl-friend just did a panic-called ... she interrupted an automatic update *cough*
<mvo> MacSlow: aha, ok. if it is hardy, then update-manager should be able to recover, she may want to try that first
<mvo> (all with UI etc)
<andreasn> MacSlow: a girl-friend? one of several? bigamist all of a sudden?
<andreasn> :P
<MacSlow> mvo, well she told me that everything except fonts seem to work.
<MacSlow> mvo, so the system does not seem to be that badly damanged
<MacSlow> andreasn, not my girl-friend ... just a girl-friend
<andreasn> ah, a friend who is a girl
<andreasn> sorry, just couldn't resist :)
<mvo> andreasn: "all of a sudden" :P
<andreasn> mvo: overnight you know...
<mvo> heh :)
<andreasn> there is also this tv-series, hm, Big Love from HBO that could have been a source of inspiration
<andreasn> anyway, I should stop being silly and get back to work
<MacSlow> mvo, xfonts-scalealbe seems to be the only broken package
<mvo> excellent, then it should be little damage
<MacSlow> outch ... her network is gone *sigh*
<mvo> mpt: could you please have a look at https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-app-install/+bug/263982 ?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 263982 in gnome-app-install "Maintenance text is very hard to read" [Undecided,New]
<mvo> mpt: what can we do to make it easier to read?
<MacSlow> mvo, larger font ;)
<andreasn> mvo: you want some way to imply that the support part is less important than the description of the package, right?
<mvo> andreasn: yes
<andreasn> mvo: if this was a website, I would have made the support text black, but using a smaller font
<andreasn> I think we use that in various parts of the desktop as well, where description text is smaller than the regular text
 * mvo nods
<mvo> I will try that
<mvo> and see what it looks like
<andreasn> smaller text is of course harder to read than normal-sized text, but it don't look inactive and I guess it reacts to the system font settings (ie. if you have a hard time reading small stuff because you're old or something it's fixable)
<Ng> who would be a good person to pester about bug 271305 when main is unfrozen again? the patch is a one-liner that shouldn't afaics be able to break anything at all
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 271305 in libgphoto2 "[intrepid] Apple iPhone 3G not supported" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/271305
<seb128> Ng: subscribe ubuntu-main-sponsors?
<Ng> seb128: oki doki, ta :)
<seb128> Ng: and to reply to the question, usually pitti looks after libgphoto updates
 * Ng nods, thanks for the pointers :)
<Ng> seb128: I think bug 196757 exists in Intrepid too
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 196757 in gvfs "camera automount prevents import" [Low,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/196757
<Ng> I've only tested with one device so far though
<seb128> Ng: yes it does, not building the gvfs-gphoto backend was a workaround for hardy
<Ng> seb128: should I re-open it or something?
<seb128> Ng: no, that's the right bug
<seb128> Ng: let me have a look
<Ng> ok
<Ng> thanks :)
<seb128> Ng: ah, found it, bug #258083
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 258083 in f-spot "F-Spot - Error connecting to camera.  "Could not lock the device"" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/258083
<Ng> seb128: yeah that sounds right
<seb128> tedg: hi
<seb128> tedg: are you working on the gnome-screensaver 2.23.90 update?
<tedg> seb128: It hasn't come up on the GNOME FTP RSS feed yet.
<tedg> seb128: But, I can, I didn't realize it's out.
<seb128> tedg: it's available since aug 28, I think you rather missed it
<seb128> tedg: I doubt it'll show on the rss now ;-)
<seb128> tedg: thanks
<tedg> Ah, okay.  That makes more sense :)
<mvo> seb128: did you had a chance to test the guest login fix for compiz btw?
<seb128> mvo: I didn't upgrade yet today but I'll give it a try and let you know
#ubuntu-desktop 2008-09-18
<seb128> vuntz: hi
<seb128> lool: hey, how busy are you? there is a new glib available ;-)
<seb128> Ampelbein: hi, thanks for the cairo patch, technically the changelog entry is not exact, you changed the depends too ;-)
<Zdra> seb128: Hi, there is *big* problem with intrepid for Empathy: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ffmpeg-debian/+bug/254201
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 254201 in ffmpeg-debian "feature regression: ffmpeg lacks some video encoders (like h263+, MPEG4, maybe more...)" [Undecided,Triaged]
<seb128> hi Zdra
<Zdra> seb128: h263 is the only video encoder supported so far for Empathy
<Zdra> I hope ubuntu will add that codec
<Zdra> (sorry if it's not you I should tell, but that problem should be solved before the release, I think)
<seb128> Zdra: the maintainer commented on the bug and read the debian bug for reference
<seb128> apparently mpg encoders are not free and can't be distributed this way
<seb128> Zdra: that's being discussed on #ubuntu-devel
<vuntz> seb128: hey
<seb128> brb
<seb128> lut vuntz
<seb128> vuntz: that was about the gtk adjustement changes but I mailed the GNOME lists since
<seb128> vuntz: that's breaking spin button ranges all over the board
<vuntz> seb128: I'm hardly surprised :/
<seb128> vuntz: I suggest reverting the change ;-)
<tedg> seb128: I went ahead and updated GNOME Panel to move the FUSA applet to the right corner, I hope you don't mind.
<Ampelbein> seb128: thanks for the info on bug 271278 . reuploaded the debdiff
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 271278 in cairo "Build dependency outdated" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/271278
<NCommander> seb128: morning
<seb128> hey NCommander
<NCommander> seb128: so Debian accepted pangomm -1 which I think still has the broken conflict/replaces :-/
<seb128> NCommander: right
<NCommander> I hope the -2 goes through the NEW queue relatively quickly
<NCommander> (they both got uploaded)
<NCommander> so anyway, how goes it in general
<seb128> no need to go through new again
<seb128> Ampelbein: arg, sorry about that but I've already the GTK update ready on my disk
<seb128> Ampelbein: you can usually ignore pango, glib, gtk, we have people already looking at the platform and such updates are not trivial and need quite some testing so usually we don't let those to contributors
<Ampelbein> seb128: ok, will note that.
<seb128> Ampelbein: we need to work a better organisation
<Ampelbein> seb128: thanks anyway. can you have a quick-look at bug 271278, i reuploaded a corrected debdiff
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 271278 in cairo "Build dependency outdated" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/271278
<seb128> norsetto started on some wiki changes
<seb128> Ampelbein: did you do a lot of work on the gtk update? you managed to update the patches?
<seb128> Ampelbein: better, if you could just list the launchpad bug number in the changelog so the bug is closed on upload now ;-)
<seb128> Ampelbein: I'll sponsor it once it has the bug reference ;-)
<Ampelbein> seb128: narf. yeah.
<Ampelbein> seb128: the relibtoolize one had brought me headaches.
<Ampelbein> (talking about gtk now)
<Ampelbein> seb128: just to make sure i got the procedure right, i applied all patches up to 070_mandatory_relibtoolize, used quilt new to create a new patch, "quilt add" on all Makefile.in, configure and the other files mentioned in the original patch, ran the commands in the patch-comments and quilt refreshed.
<Ampelbein> seb128: just to make sure i got the procedure on gtk right, i applied all patches up to 070_mandatory_relibtoolize, used quilt new to create a new patch, "quilt add" on all Makefile.in, configure and the other files mentioned in the original patch, ran the commands in the patch-comments and quilt refreshed.
<seb128> urg?
<seb128> export QUILT_PATCHES=debian/patches
<seb128> quilt push -f 070_etc
<seb128> copy the commands
<seb128> quilt refresh
<seb128> quilt pop -a
<Ampelbein> so i can run push -f and this will do no harm? ok, another thing i learned.
<Ampelbein> i thought -f would leave some half-modified files and those will disturb the diff-operation.
<Ampelbein> btw, reuploaded the cairo-one.
<seb128> looking
<seb128> Ampelbein: uploaded
<Ampelbein> thanks
<seb128> tedg: re
<tedg> seb128: re?
<seb128> tedg: sorry you said something before and I was not around and I closed IRC since, that was about a gnome-panel update? do you need sponsoring?
<seb128> tedg: "hi-again"
<tedg> seb128: Well, yes.  But I thought the archive was frozen right now, so I wasn't asking.
<seb128> tedg: dunno if there is an english abreviation for that ;-)
<tedg> I just didn't want you to do that update also, duplicate effort type of thing.
<seb128> tedg: archive is soft frozen
<seb128> could you open a sponsoring bug, I'll take care of it later or tomorrow
<seb128> thanks for letting me know
<tedg> seb128: Sounds good, I'll open one for gnome-panel and gnome-screensaver.
<seb128> thanks
<davmor2> guys should log off be replaced by power off now that power off and restart etc works again?
<rizzo> where might one go to discuss problems with ATI Radeon support in hardy?
<rizzo> fixed by using the latest Catalyst 8.9 instead of the fglrx in hardy
<pochu> davmor2: that makes sense. there's already abug report about it I think
<seb128> davmor2: what log off are you speaking about there?
<davmor2> seb128: top right of the desktop
<davmor2> it used to be power of restart log out etc but it now just log out
<seb128> there is a pending uploading changing the layout to use the switch user applet there
#ubuntu-desktop 2008-09-19
<huats> morning here !
<seb128> mvo: can you look at bug #271108?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 271108 in gnome-control-center "http_proxy environment variable is not being updated" [Low,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/271108
<mvo> seb128: sure, thanks
<njpatel> mvo: ping
<njpatel> i need some help with debian patches :-)
<mvo> njpatel: hello! sure, I tell me more (I was at lunch)
<njpatel> mvo: hey, no probs -- I figured it out!!!
<njpatel> :-D
<njpatel> I was stuck with multiple patches which touch Makefiles, I couldn't get them to apply or unapply cleanly, but somehow I've fixed it now
<mvo> ok
<seb128> mvo: do you plan to do a gnome-control-center upload today?
<mvo> seb128: very soon, hopefully with a fix for 271108
<seb128> bug #271108
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 271108 in gnome-control-center "http_proxy environment variable is not being updated" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/271108
<mvo> seb128: why? anything oyu need?
<seb128> mvo: ok thanks
<mvo> seb128: if its urgend, just go ahead, bzr is fine for upload
<seb128> mvo: no, I just look daily at the sponsoring list and I would like to get the 2 gnome-control-center lines you commited to bzr to get cleaned ;-)
<mvo> heh :)
<mvo> ok
<seb128> and one is a string change so better for translators to get the right string early
<seb128> anyway nothing urgent, it's just pending upload for a while now so I was wondering
<seb128> maybe I can add that as a reason to not like bzr :-p fixes are delayed ;-)
<seb128> hey tedg
<fta> seb128, the new cairo now requires pixman >= 0.12.0
<tedg> Good morning seb128
<seb128> tedg: I've sponsored some of the updates waiting on your ppa
<fta> seb128, btw, thanks for fontconfig yesterday
<tedg> seb128: Awesome, thanks, I haven't looked yet, but did the UIe get processed for FUSA?
<seb128> fta: thank you for working on the change ;-)
<seb128> fta: since when is this new pixman version available?
<seb128> tedg: that was required? GNOME has a standing exception, I just uploaded ;-)
<fta> seb128, 2 days ago
<fta> seb128, want me to do it ?
<tedg> seb128: :)  Thank you.
<seb128> fta: no, I'm pinging the debian guys, they usually prefer to be notified so they can do the update and ubuntu can stay in sync
<fta> ok
<fta> seb128, same for cairo ?
<seb128> fta: btw is there still any change in cairo we need or can we sync on debian?
<tedg> seb128: Did you do xscreensaver also?
<seb128> tedg: no
<fta> seb128, still our freetype/fontconfig debps/build-deps versions that are higher
<seb128> fta: that's not required, hardy or intrepid have the required versions
<fta> seb128, everything else is minor, i guess sync is ok. i'll stop my 1.7.6 update then.
<fta> btw, debian doesn't have it yet so there's nothing to sync at the moment
<seb128> fta: you can still work on the cairo update if you want, not sure how reactive is the cairo debian maintainer at the moment
<fta> considering i need the new pixman, either i do both or i wait for debian
<seb128> wait for debian
<fta> ok
<glatzor> mvo, hi, packagekit 0.3.3 freeze exception was approved. the packages are in the ppa. do you have got the time and willing to upload them?
<glatzor> mvo, https://edge.launchpad.net/~packagekit/+archive
<glatzor> mvo, https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/packagekit/+bug/268466
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 268466 in packagekit "Freeze Exception for PackageKit 0.3.2" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<glatzor> mvo, I have to leave now, since I am approaching my home town. See you.
<discobiscuit> hi everybody
<discobiscuit> just trawling the irc channels looking for some help on usb sticks and grub if anyone has the time?
<Ampelbein> discobiscuit: #ubuntu is a good start
<discobiscuit> yeah going to learn for the linux+ exam from it
<seb128> re
<seb128> mvo: did you do your quota of sponsoring for this week yet? ;-)
<mvo> seb128: no, why
 * seb128 is trying to dispatch some sponsoring work there ;-)
<mvo> I'm currently reviewing/sponsoring packagekit
<seb128> mvo: kwwii has some artwork packages to get sponsored, he pinged me about those yesterday because pitti which usually look at those is away for the week
<mvo> but I have cycles I think
<mvo> is there a bugrpeort for them?
<seb128> but I did spent too much time on sponsoring today and it would be nice if somebody else could look at those
<seb128> mvo: no, it's on his ppa on launchpad
<seb128> mvo: maybe ping him on irc to confirm the list?
<seb128> asac: could you look at the devhelp sponsor request? ;-)
<mvo> hm, looks like he is not now currently
<seb128> mvo: he's on #canonical, not sure why he's not hanging there though
<mvo> seb128: ok, I /msged him
<seb128> mvo: thank you
 * seb128 is trying to get some GNOME work before the weekend, new version again on monday
<tedg> seb128: I'm kinda confused.  I changed the defaults of the FUSA schema file, but still seems like they're being used on a new account I created.  Is there some other thing that needs to be done?
<mvo> tedg: depending how/were you changed it you need to run update-gconf-defaults I think (but dh_gconf should take care of it)
<seb128> tedg: how did you change those?
<seb128> tedg: the usual way is to add a .gconf-defaults
<tedg> mvo: Do I need a dh_gconf in the rules file?  There isn't one there now.  But gnome.mk is included.
<seb128> if gnome.mk is being used no need no
<tedg> seb128: I put it in a patch.
<mvo> ok, thanks. gnome.mk should be enough
<seb128> did you patch the schemas.in?
<tedg> seb128: Yes.
<seb128> usually you don't want to patch the schemas
<seb128> but add a debian/binary.gconf-schemas which set those
<tedg> I'm not sure what you're saying in the second line there.  Is this a file or a line in my rules?
<seb128> tedg: that's a file
<tedg> And that has the whole schema, or just the diff?
<seb128> tedg: locate .gconf-defaults
<mvo> tedg: check /usr/share/gconf/defaults/10_compiz-gnome for a example
<seb128> tedg: that's a debian think, if dh_gconf is used which is the case there you have nothing to do, just add a .gconf-defaults in the debian directory
<tedg> Is there a difference between "gconf-defaults" and "gconf-schemas" ?
<seb128> yes
<tedg> Which should I use?
<davmor2> guys an ideas why the screen saver isn't kicking in?  It starts to fade then almost immediately wakes again
<seb128> the schemas are upstream gconf files to set defaults
<seb128> the .gconf-defaults one are debian specific files to override upstream defaults without having to patch the schemas
<tedg> Okay, so if I'm adding a GConf item, I should patch the schemas?  And if I'm changing a value I should use the defaults in the packaging.  Is that correct?
<seb128> no
<seb128> you can still use a .gconf-defaults in the new key case but it'll not have a description, etc
<seb128> but right if you add upstream keys you can edit the schemas yes
<seb128> just make sure to edit the right .in or .in.in so they are in the schemas after build
<seb128> I've to run for a bit, bbl
<tedg> Okay, I will those seem to be getting added more reliably.  Value changes I think are getting caught up in the layers of settings.
#ubuntu-desktop 2008-09-20
 * pochu just switched from firefox to ephy
<pochu> bah, I can't believe you have to use filters to configure multiple accounts in Evo so that they use different Inbox/Sent/etc folders
<pochu> hmm, looks like I can manually create the folders then set those as default in the account prefs
<pochu> not ideal, but it's not that bad as I thought
<pochu> s/that/as/
<pochu> hmm, there's defaults only for drafts/sent, not for inbox :/
#ubuntu-desktop 2008-09-21
<salty-horse> hi. I'm using intrepid and noticed the new separate shutdown/logout menus. they have the buttons in a vertical list, and the buttons is very wide. each button also has a different height, and the differences in icon sizes for "restart" and "shutdown" make for an unpleasant and unpolished look. should I file a bug against gnome-session?
<pochu> salty-horse: that's the right package, but I think mpt was redesigning or reviewing it
 * salty-horse waits for mpt to reply :)
<salty-horse> oh, he's away
<salty-horse> pochu, does he have some blog or docs about it?
<salty-horse> (not: http://thebuzzatmpt.blogspot.com/ )
<salty-horse> found it
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-09-14
<mac_v> Amaranth: hi... why is the login/logout compiz plugin not enabled by default?
<Amaranth> mac_v: hmm
<Amaranth> mac_v: well, it was meant for KDE to replace kwin's logout effect
<mac_v> it works well in gnome too
<mac_v> since we now dont have that effect at all
<mac_v> Amaranth: >  is this right >   (class=X-session-manager & type=Dialog) | (class=Gtk-logout-helper & type=Dialog)
<mac_v> that works for me
<mac_v> I'm thinking of confirming this Bug 429132 ...
<Amaranth> eep
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 429132 in hundredpapercuts "Compiz logout effekt" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/429132
<Amaranth> it made everything gray
<Amaranth> and it didn't go back when I canceled the shutdown
<mac_v> hmm... works fine here , no probs
<Amaranth> oh, I had a broken rule
<Amaranth> it was doing it whenever a gnome-session window was around
<Amaranth> which is...always
<mac_v> ;p
<Amaranth> mac_v: that rule doesn't seem to match anything
<mac_v> hrm...
 * mac_v wonders why it works here
<Amaranth> mac_v: karmic?
<mac_v> yup
<Amaranth> mac_v: GNOME?
<mac_v> yup
<Amaranth> weird
<mac_v> ok, ,just this alone works too> (class=Gtk-logout-helper & type=Dialog)
<Amaranth> nope, class for the logout and shutdown windows are Gnome-session
<mac_v> Amaranth: hrm , i grabbed the class from compiz
<Amaranth> so did I
<Amaranth> from ccsm
<mac_v> yeah, me too , weird
<Amaranth> did you switch to upstream dialogs?
<mac_v> i dont understand ^
<Amaranth> hmm, that option is gone
<Amaranth> we must be using upstream dialogs now
<mac_v> indicator-applet-session 0.1
<mac_v> oh , let me check for updates
<mac_v> (class=X-session-manager & type=Dialog)
<mac_v> this works too! , :(
<mac_v> Amaranth: nope , i only have PA updates... ok , shall i confirm the bug and we can figure it out in  due course ?
<Amaranth> I guess so
<mac_v> ok.
<Amaranth> if we get it working we'll want to modify the decoration plugin to not show decorations for those windows too
<Amaranth> we also need to disable unredirect fullscreen windows
<mac_v> Amaranth: hrm.... why no decorations for those windows? but sounds good  :)
<mac_v> Amaranth: yup , looks sexy without decorations
<pitti> Good morning
<didrocks> hello pitti
<MenZa> morning
<didrocks> hey MenZa
 * MenZa sips his coffee, checks his morning IRC.
<mvo> robert_ancell: new compiz uploaded!
<robert_ancell> mvo, yay!
<pitti> crack!
 * pitti hugs mvo
<pitti> hey robert_ancell, good morning
<robert_ancell> pitti, hey
<mvo> pitti: haha - good crack!
<mvo> loads of fixes :)
 * mvo ticks off another item from his todo list
<seb128> hello desktopers
<didrocks> lut seb128
<seb128> salut didrocks
<pitti> hey seb128
<seb128> hello pitti
<chrisccoulson> hey seb128
<seb128> hello chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> did you have a good weekend?
<seb128> yes, too short but very good otherwise
<seb128> you?
<chrisccoulson> yeah, same really ;) had some friends round yesterday but spent most of saturday trying to get karmic to work on my desktop
<seb128> oh, did you manage to get it working?
<seb128> what was the issue you had?
<chrisccoulson> i made a silly error with my BIOS - it was trying to boot from the wrong disk. i only realised when i couldn't get jaunty to boot again too
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> i made some changes in the BIOS to turn off the onboard raid before i started the reinstall
<chrisccoulson> hey pitti
<seb128> 318 unread bug emails during the weekend
<didrocks> seb128: good luck ;)
<seb128> weekend email backlogs are not fun nowadays
<seb128> didrocks, thanks ;-)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, oh ok
<didrocks> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hey didrocks!"
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - about bug 424511 - does gnome-session-bin need a Breaks on the earlier version of gnome-session (to force it to de-configure first)?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 424511 in gnome-session "gnome-panel and window manager do not start on login" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/424511
<seb128> what was the issue? upgrade broken in the middle of unpacking?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - the issue is because the schema moves between packages. gnome-session-bin gets fully configured before gnome-session is deconfigured. when that happens, gnome-session unregisters the schema that gnome-session-bin just registered
<seb128> that's a question for mvo I guess
<chrisccoulson> yeah, possibly
<chrisccoulson> i wasn't sure how else to fix it
<chrisccoulson> because it is the old prerm script that unregisters the schema, it is difficult to stop that from happening
<seb128> I'm not sure in which order maintainer scripts are ran
<seb128> I need to open the documentation
<seb128> but I'm trying to fight some thousand emails from the weekend right now
<seb128> so it will be a bit later ;-)
<seb128> using a conflicts or break seems to make sense
<seb128> though apt tends to be stupid on breaks and that leads to removing things
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - that's ok, i'll let you check your e-mails ;)
<chrisccoulson> and get some coffee!
<seb128> coffee!!
<seb128> good idea ;-)
<didrocks> coffee is always a good idea :-) (or tea as well for the minority here ;))
<chrisccoulson> heh, yeah, i don't drink tea;)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: everytime you need to know in which order scripts are launch, just give a shot at http://women.debian.org/wiki/English/MaintainerScripts
<mvo> tea!
<didrocks> launched*
<chrisccoulson> didrocks - yeah, i find that quite useful also
<didrocks> mvo: the end of my sentence about tea was dedicated to you :-)
<chrisccoulson> thanks:)
<mvo> didrocks: I know ;)
<mvo> didrocks: nice page - I always used the reference manual, but the diagrams are neat
<chrisccoulson> pitti - bug 426501 is fixed upstream now. i'm not sure when upstream plan to do a tarball, but it might be worth cherrypicking the patch if it's going to be a while
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 426501 in devicekit-power "gnome-session crashed with SIGSEGV in g_str_hash()" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/426501
<pitti> chrisccoulson: nice! thanks for following this
<pitti> chrisccoulson: are there many dupes?
<pitti> but no prob to cherrypick it, they don't do releases often
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i'm not sure if there are many dupes. some bugs might get reported against Xorg, as the symptoms are fairly similar, and I'm not subscribed to the g-p-m bugs
<pitti> chrisccoulson: looks like http://cgit.freedesktop.org/DeviceKit/DeviceKit-power/commit/?id=a09005a0a3a61537e8f34a0db2fec990a5333bd4
<pitti> chrisccoulson: seems there are other worthwhile fixes there, I might just do a git snapshot
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, that probably makes sense
<chrisccoulson> pitti - it looks like it is http://cgit.freedesktop.org/DeviceKit/DeviceKit-power/commit/?id=8cb468ce64b0e1b21198744977d8a14e17ff5efe which fixes the crash
<chrisccoulson> + /* finalise the object */
<chrisccoulson> + g_object_unref (device);
<asac> mvo: can we access the "Sources" or "Packages" files on a buildd? or is it not-defined?
<mvo> asac: I think that is possible (but a bit hacky)
<chrisccoulson> mvo - did you see the earlier conversation i had with seb128 about gnome-session upgrade issues? (sorry, I have no scrollback now)
<mvo> chrisccoulson: yes, but I did not look closely - it looked complicated ;)
<chrisccoulson> heh, yeah, it's a bit wierd
<mvo> chrisccoulson: if its still relevant I can have a closer look when I'm finished with my current round of update-manager fixes
<chrisccoulson> mvo - if you don't mind please:) i was going to propose adding a "Breaks: gnome-session (<< 2.27)" on gnome-session-bin, or something like that. We just need to make sure that the old (Jaunty) version of gnome-session is deconfigured (ie, its prerm script already ran) before the new gnome-session-bin is configured
<asac> mvo: ok so rather not?
<mvo> asac: well, depends on how important that is and what other options there are
<seb128> ok, took me the morning to go through weekend emails
<mvo> asac: something about automatically adding something, right?
<mvo> asac: :)
<mvo> asac: maybe it could be done a "dpkg-buildpackage -S" time?
<mvo> asac: the buildds for for main will e.g. not have universe Packages lists available
<asac> hmm ok
<asac> feels like something we cannot rely on ;)
<asac> mvo: yes. i am thinking about "-S" ... feels ugly too
<hyperair> hmm for some reason i can't get ubuntuone to load the webpage for adding my computer
<hyperair> why is that, i wonder?
<mvo> asac: well, some packages (like ubiquity, update-manager) use something like that, they create a private apt sources.list and get data
<mvo> asac: what was the problem again that this solves?
<asac> mvo: are those used in debian too?
<mvo> asac: (sorry, I think you told me, but I forgot)
<mvo> asac: I see no reason why it could not work for debian as well :)
<asac> its basically because we have firefox etc. and debian has iceweasel etc.
<asac> ok. seems we would neeed to check if the developer has main/contrib/non-free in debian and in ubuntu all four components
<asac> i think that might be doable
<asac> not sure how to best check that though
<mvo> asac: we can have a quick phonecall after lunch and I might be able to help?
<asac> why not ... ;)
 * soren is fascinated by this discussion..
<soren> asac: What are you trying to do?
<mvo> magic! its asac ;)
<soren> asac: I've tried looking at scrollback, but I can't find it.
<asac> soren: we have supermagic ${xpi:depends} in mozilla-devscripts
<soren> asac: Ok.
<mvo> (oh, even supermagic!)
<asac> and want to assemble the right depends ...
<asac> currently we maintain a list in the sources ... but thats suboptimal and would prefer to assemble that on the fly
<soren> I see.
<soren> Are they the same for all extensions, but still dynamic somehow, or are they completely different for all extensions?
<asac> soren: extensions ship a install.rdf that refers to the applications (with min/max version) they work on.
<asac> so completely different (in theory)
<asac> most will have firefox of course
<soren> Right.
<soren> Oh, so it's based on that?
<asac> yes.
<soren> And that info is in Packages?
<asac> not yet.
<asac> but could be added
<soren> Ah.
<soren> That would make sense.
<asac> for now we maintain a superset of applications
<asac> but would like to add two meta fields: ApplicationId, ApplicationVersion:
<asac> in that way we could make this 100% accurate
<asac> the other option would be to require developers to install _all_ dependencies during build
<asac> but thats bad
<asac> ;)
<asac> and not needed i hope
 * soren ponders
<asac> so anyone found where the "retry" button is hiding in new edge launchpad?
<asac> oh
<asac> its that tiny recycle icon
<asac> seb128: can you NEW those https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/network-manager/0.8~a~git.20090911t130220.4c77fa0-0ubuntu1 ?
<asac> thx
<seb128> asac, newed
<pitti> asac: oh, new N-M? another polkit-1 migration thing done then \o/
<seb128> mvo, newed compiz too
<pitti> asac: curious, the applet still needs to b-dep on libpolkit?
<asac> seb128: rock.
<asac> pitti: i will check that. might be an oversight or will land soonish i would hope
<pitti> asac: usually you shouldn't need to have any polkit code client-side any more
<asac> in configure.ac it now uses polkit-gobject-1
<asac> so at least the packaging can be adjusted
<asac> pitti: i thikn  its a bit different because the applet provides a user settings service on its own
<asac> but i will check with dan
<soren> asac: From what I can tell, debian-installer build-depends on apt, and grabs Package lists from the same place as the buildd and uses the information from there to do its magic. If debian-installer uses it, I'd say it's likely to not stop working anytime soon. You can look at debian-installer/build/util/get-packages to see how it calls apt-get (look for APT_GET).
<pitti> asac: the applet runs as user, though?
<pitti> asac: anyway, it's not a blocker, I just wondered
<asac> pitti: just saw that we properly depend on polkit-1 ... at least. i will check if that can be dropped
<asac> but i think we want the user settings to be controllable by certain other users
<pitti> ah
<mvo> seb128: cool, many thanks
<seb128> mvo, np, I'm eager to try the update ;-)
<mvo> seb128: it rocks :)
<mvo> seb128: and puts the policykit dialogs on top
<mvo> seb128: and needs new libcompizconfig and new plugins that are not build yet and apparently have a low build-score :(
<mvo> would it be possible to get a private ppa so that I can ask for ppa->archive copies?
<seb128> you can maybe bribe pitti to bump build score ;-)
 * mvo offers green tea to pitti as a bribe
<pitti> mvo: which source packages?
<pitti> mvo: libcompizconfig is in depwait
<seb128> it's waiting for compiz publishing apparently
<mvo> yeah, same for the plugins- packages, waiting for compiz-core-dev
<seb128> the changelog is impressive
<seb128> lot of issues and crashes fixed ;-)
<mvo> yeah, the compiz upstream guys are just great
<mvo> lots of valgrind and gcc -Wall
<seb128> ;-)
<mvo> and sparse I think
<mvo> tseliot: do you have a idea how much space dkms (roughly) needs?
<mvo> tseliot: for building I mean in /tmp ?
<tseliot> mvo: for building a module?
<mvo> tseliot: yes
<seb128> wb chrisccoulson
<mvo> tseliot: a rough estimate is good enough, I want to add code a update-manager to ensure there is enough space in /tmp for building and that it does not fail because of this
<tseliot> mvo: I don't know but wouldn't it depend on the module?
<seb128> mvo, did you read the gnome-session question earlier?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, did you work on making totem use libgdata?
 * tseliot -> lunch
<mvo> hey chrisccoulson - I had a quick look at your question and I think break is ok
<mvo> chrisccoulson: what does the prerm do btw?
<mvo> tseliot: I guess it would, I just need a number :) I can then use it as a lower bound
<tseliot> mvo: ok, I'll give you a number when I'm back
<mvo> thanks tseliot
<seb128> mvo, it's standard dh_gconf calls
<seb128> mvo, old schemas unregistered and new one registered
<seb128> to make sure you don't have deprecated keys in the config and get the new ones too
 * mvo nods
<chrisccoulson> hi seb128 - no, i didn't work on that, as the MIR has not been approved yet. should i wait for that though?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, no need to wait on the mir, that's a chicken egg issue ;-)
<chrisccoulson> mvo - thanks for looking at that issue. the prerm script contains a hook generated by dh_gconf to unregister the schema
<seb128> chrisccoulson, the eariler we ger the change the better if we want it for alpha
<chrisccoulson> and the schema is registered in the postinst script. so there appears to be a race if you move the schema between packages
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - ok, i'll work on that later then:)
<seb128> pitti, sorry about the apport bug, I got confused I think yes, the thing is "get a crash, click to report it, get the error about whatever being deprecated you don't care about"
<pitti> seb128: right, it it's definitively an issue
<seb128> chrisccoulson, ok thanks
<pitti> seb128: but Kmos' patch is wrong
<chrisccoulson> mvo, i just saw seb128 already answered your question ;)
 * chrisccoulson should look at scrollback more often
<seb128> pitti, right, that was a reply to " or don't collect information from the Apport notification which opens automatically "
<pitti> seb128: I figured; thanks for confirming
<seb128> pitti, I do click on it because I want to report the bug and I don't know that have pulseaudio not uptodate will prevent me reporting a bug on nautilus for example
<pitti> seb128: I think you should just add it to your ~/.bashrc or so
<pitti> sorry, ~/.profile
<pitti> the one that's read by GNOME
<seb128> pitti, well I do want to be told about outdated versions
<seb128> so I can decided according to what is outdated
<pitti> seb128: if that's really hurting you, I can spend some 20 minutes to fix it properly
<seb128> ie if the software is outdated no point to report the bug, if that's some stupid lib ...
<seb128> pitti, no that's ok, I understand the issue now, thanks ;-)
<seb128> pitti, can I gedit the .crash by hand to drop the UnreportableReason?
<pitti> seb128: yes
<seb128> ok, that's good enough for me
<seb128> thanks:
<seb128> !
 * seb128 hugs pitti
 * pitti hugs seb128
<pitti> seb128: FYI, current retracer crash is again a "AssertionError: Could not find package for ExecutablePath"
<pitti> it's looking for /usr/lib/firefox-3.5.2/firefox which doesn't exist any more
<pitti> I'll just fix it to close them as obsolete
<seb128> pitti, ok thanks
<chrisccoulson> pitti - do you remember that i spoke to you just before feature-freeze about getting libgda4 in to main, but then i put it off because the package that requires it (glom) was not going to be ready for FF?
<chrisccoulson> the currentl version of glom in karmic is completely busted now though...
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I remember
<chrisccoulson> it's not installable due to missing dependencies, and I can't rebuild it because it requires pygda3, which no longer exists in the archive either
<pitti> eww
<chrisccoulson> (that used to come from gnome-python2-extras)
<chrisccoulson> so, i'm not sure what to do ;)
<pitti> I assume it neither builds with the new 4 API, nor is there a newer upstream version which does?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - it won't build with pygda4 either, as the API has changed a fair bit
<chrisccoulson> the newer upstream version will do though
<pitti> oh, brilliant
<chrisccoulson> is that enough justification for a FFe? ;)
<pitti> absolutely
<pitti> it can hardly get any worse, after all
<pitti> so updating it is a no-brainer
<pitti> (I mean -release wise)
<chrisccoulson> yeah, that's what i thought. we still need to get libgda4 in main though, so that we can build pygda4
<chrisccoulson> but i can work on a MIR for that
 * asac lunch
<seb128> mvo, libcompizconfig built now
<seb128> mvo, the new version sort of fix the focus issue with seahorse gpg agent dialogs
<seb128> they get on the first plan now which is good
<seb128> but they still look unfocussed, ie decorations not colored
<mvo> seb128: hm, it seems that it gets it right for software-store - is that the same polkit1 dialog?
<seb128> mvo, no, I'm speaking about the gpg agent dialog
<seb128> mvo, design *.changes, esc, debsign *.changes
<mvo> seb128: btw, do you happen to know if there is a way to avoid the blocking when the polkit1 dialog comes up? in the past I brought up the dialog, so I had a (addtional) gtk main loop running, but now its the doing of polkit
<mvo> seb128: oh, ok. I have a look
<seb128> mvo, no idea, maybe james_w` or pitti know
<james_w`> no idea, sorry
<james_w`> you could mail polkit-devel
<seb128> mvo, when starting a guest session I always get gnome-panel opacity not correct with the new compiz, did you notice that too?
<seb128> ie the top bar is transparent and only displayed when clicking on it
<mvo> seb128: I need to test this on my other machine, with nvidia the guest session does not work for me with compiz :(
<seb128> mvo, could be the same with a normal session start but I didn't want to close mine ;-)
<asac> seb128: what app would be a good candidate to test gio modules?
<asac>  /usr/lib/gio/modules/libgvfsdbus.so
<asac>  /usr/lib/gio/modules/libgioremote-volume-monitor.so
<asac>  /usr/lib/gio/modules/libgiogconf.so
<seb128> the gtk fileselector in gedit for example?
<seb128> try browsing a ssh or smb share from there
<asac> what does the giogconf thing do?
<asac> thx
<seb128> it allows gio to use gconf
<seb128> gio is under gconf in the stack
<asac> seb128: how can i trigger that code path?
<seb128> so it can't use libgconf, they have to trick
<asac> ah
<seb128> same for gvfs
<asac> would gedit file selector trigger it?
<seb128> yes
<seb128> browse a share with nautilus
<asac> ok ... why are all those modules separate?
<seb128> ssh, smb, ftp, anything non local
<seb128> and open the gedit fileselector
<asac> e.g. can one use gvfsdbus without giogconf?
<seb128> and see if you can browse those
<asac> felt like thats not possible
<asac> thanks. i think thats enough for our purpose
<seb128> you can probably use giogconf to access gconf settings from gio
<seb128> but I doubt we have anything doing that
<seb128> the real "customer" for those is to make gio be able to use gvfs backends
<kenvandine> seb128, i saw some chatter about compiz earlier, is there a known issue with it not starting?
<seb128> kenvandine, no but you might have caught a partial upgrade
<kenvandine> ok
<seb128> kenvandine, ie upgraded the core while the plugins were not update
<seb128> what error do you get?
<kenvandine> Couldn't find a perfect decorator match; trying all decorators
<kenvandine> Found no decorator to start
<seb128> mvo is well known to screw those every time ;-)
<seb128> hum
<seb128> did you get any package remove?
<kenvandine> yes
<seb128> ie did you validate a dist-upgrade without reading or something?
<kenvandine> it removed some plugins and the compiz package
<seb128> hum
<kenvandine> but upgrade compiz-core
<seb128> the goal is to make you wait
<seb128> not to make you remove
<pitti> mvo: sorry, closed IRC over lunch; what was your PK question?
<seb128> it's basically your fault
<kenvandine> :)
<seb128> ie don't confirm package removal
<seb128> what it said is "you are in the middle of a transition, do you want to wait or screw your system to get new crack"
<seb128> and you went for the new crack ;-)
<kenvandine> hehe... ok
<seb128> wait for the next publisher run now and reinstall those
 * kenvandine thought it would have held those back
<seb128> upgrade would so
<seb128> upgrade would do
<seb128> dist-upgrade go the other way and remove to get you new cracks if you really want
<kenvandine> certainly not important... just glad there isn't  a bug :)
<seb128> you should be using upgrade rather than dist-upgrade
<kenvandine> hummm.. someone told me it would be better to test dist-upgrade regularly
<kenvandine> hey rickspencer3*
<kenvandine> :)
<seb128> hey rickspencer3
<seb128> kenvandine, well read what dist-upgrade do in any case, conflicts often lead to removal during transitions
<seb128> ie it's fine to remove old lib sonames
<seb128> but you usually don't want to remove your decorator
<kenvandine> i read it, just tested that upgrade path
<kenvandine> i have the decorator... not sure why it isn't finding it
<seb128> ok
<seb128> what did get uninstalled exactly?
<kenvandine> rickspencer3: fyi... you shouldn't dist-upgrade this morning :)
<kenvandine> compizconfig-backend-gconf might be the culprit
<kenvandine> that was removed
<seb128> ups, wrong focus
<kenvandine> it removed compiz and compizconfig-backend-gconf
<seb128> try reinstalling those?
<kenvandine> the decorator is in compiz-core, so i suspect compizconfig-backend-gconf
<kenvandine> yeah
<kenvandine> doing that now
<kenvandine> dep errors
 * kenvandine just waits
<kenvandine> i know rickspencer3 does dist-upgrades every morning.. so i want to stop him :)
<seb128> let's see if he does read what dist-upgrade do before acking ;-)
<kenvandine> hehe
<seb128> I usually use update-manager which does the right thing
<kenvandine> i was suspicious of the upgrade... but knew it wouldn't completely hose me :)
<pitti> hey kenvandine
<Laney> aptitude did the right thing on compiz for me, FWIW
<kenvandine>     compiz | 1:0.8.3+git20090914-0ubuntu1 |        karmic | source
 * kenvandine waits for binaries
<Laney> "Keep the following packages at their current version:
<Laney> compiz [1:0.8.2-0ubuntu16 (now)]
<Laney> and so on
 * rickspencer3_ reads up
<seb128> rickspencer3: summary; don't ack compiz removal if you dist-upgrade
<rickspencer3_> kenvandine, are you getting an issue where you window frames kind of dissapear?
<kenvandine> no
<rickspencer3> oops, my other computer is on
<mvo> (did that happen in the middle of publish run? - on my test machine compiz wants to upgrade complettly)?
<seb128> the goal is to make people wait to get all the binaries but dist-upgrade junkies might have issues ;-)
<kenvandine> rmadison says it isn't published yet
<seb128> compiz is published for 2 hours
<kenvandine> humm
<seb128> but other things were waiting for it to build
<seb128> ie libcompizsettings
<seb128> libcompizconfig
<seb128> so those might still be pending publishing now
<seb128> mvo, should bug #414170 be closed too?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 414170 in compiz-fusion-plugins-main "ability to re-enable scroll-wheel desktop switching in compiz" [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/414170
 * popey wonders if anyone is aware of bug 412125, and that it makes flash unusable (comments about flash being unusable by default to /dev/null) on karmic..
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 412125 in nspluginwrapper "Controls in video player no longer work" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/412125
<mvo> seb128: yes, I merged that one
<mvo> seb128: thanks :)
<popey> it may well not be an nspluginwrapper issue, but given it only seems to affect 64-bit ubuntu..
<seb128> mvo, np ;-)
<seb128> popey, no clue about that, maybe try #ubuntu-mozilla rather?
<popey> ok
<popey> that channel is empty
<seb128> I've no clue about that and I use only i386 installs
<seb128> asac, what is the channel for ubuntu mozilla?
<james_w> #ubuntu-mozillateam
<asac> yep
<popey> thanks!
<mvo> so seriously, what would it take to get ppa->archive copy for compiz so that we can ensure the thing goes in in one go?
<seb128> mvo, wrong channel, would rather be a soyuz question I guess
<pitti> kenvandine: bug 412601 is marked fixed upstream, but open in karmic; is there a new release we can package which drops the old policykit bits and incorporates lool's fixes?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 412601 in indicator-session "[MIR] indicator-session" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/412601
 * kenvandine will look
<pitti> kenvandine: btw, I uploaded all the farsight/upnp stuff on Saturday, should be all set now
<kenvandine> yeah thx!
<Keybuk> after today's updates, all my window manager keybindings have been lost
<kenvandine> rickspencer3 and i did our weekly 1:1 with it today :)
<pitti> kenvandine: rock
<james_w> Keybuk: compiz?
<Keybuk> james_w: yes
<james_w> Keybuk: did you upgrade compiz and remove a compiz related package?
<james_w> -gconf or something?
<Keybuk> james_w: I did a dist-upgrade
<james_w> yeah, it probably forced the removal of some plugin packages due to skew
<Keybuk> james_w: compizconfig-backend-gconf is installed
<Keybuk> though it's a different version
<Keybuk> 0.8.2 vs. 1:0.8.3+git...
<james_w> maybe it's just broken
<lool> Keybuk: For the other packages there are ABI depends to prevent this from happening; compiz-core-abiversion-2009xxxx
<lool> But I was told by upstream that this wasn't needed for these
<Keybuk> I don't have any -abiversion- packages installed
<lool> Keybuk: it's a virtual provide
<Keybuk> lool: ah ok
<lool> apt-cache show compiz-fusion-plugins-extra |grep compiz-core-abiversion
<Keybuk> two such packages show up in "dpkg -l" as uninstalled
<lool> But this system is not used for the compizconfig backend; perhaps it should; upstream told me not in the past
<lool> mvo: ^  do you know?
<mvo> Keybuk, lool: do you have the "compiz" metapkg still installed?
 * asac out for 2-3h
<mvo> or did apt helpfully remove that for you?
<Keybuk> mvo: no
<Keybuk> mvo: apparently
<Keybuk>   compiz: Depends: compiz-fusion-plugins-extra (>= 0.8.3) but it is not going to be installed
<mvo> its currently building
<mvo> sorry, for the trouble
<cassidy> seb128, kenvandine: would be good to ship farsight2 0.0.15, that's a bug fix release
<seb128> cassidy, what about telepathy-gabble 0.8.3?
<cassidy> yep, that one too
<seb128> ok
<cassidy> I opened https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/telepathy-gabble/+bug/429378
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 429378 in telepathy-gabble "Sync telepathy-gabble 0.8.3-1 (main) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,New]
<cassidy> but didn't for fs2 as there is an ubuntu delta
<seb128> ok thanks
<cassidy> not sure if we should drop it or not
<cassidy> bigon, ^
<seb128> we can't
<seb128> debian doesn't have farsight in gst-good I think
<cassidy> oh right
<cassidy> papyon would be good to but has been refused : https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/428779
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 428779 in papyon "FFE: Merge papyon 0.4.2-2 (main) from Debian unstable (main)." [Undecided,Incomplete]
<rugby471> hello
<seb128> cassidy, seems this one has not been refused but pitti has valid concern on code copy
<rugby471> mvo: hi
<seb128> cassidy, do you know why upstream moved to use a private copy rather than the system version?
<seb128> hey rugby471
<pitti> seb128: the code copy can be easily reverted, as it seems, so when that's done (as a package patch or upstream), it looks fine indeed
<cassidy> seb128, not sure; I'll ask. I guess that's because it's not pkged
<seb128> cassidy, the usual way is to have both, use the system version if available otherwise use the copy as fallback
<mvo> hey rugby471!
<mvo> rugby471: I saw your branch, many thanks! what did change in the status icons?
<cassidy> seb128, I'll ask him
<rugby471> mvo: you mean the progres icons?
<mvo> rugby471: yeah
<cassidy> seb128, we just release tp-butterfly with audio/video support btw :)
<rugby471> mvo: just changed them to be 24x24
<mvo> rugby471: aha, cool
<seb128> cassidy, how well is that working?
<rugby471> and the names of them to be softwarestore-progress-n.png
<mvo> rugby471: I have not merged yet, but I will today (I think)
<rugby471> mvo: rather than software-store ...
<rugby471> mvo: kl
<cassidy> seb128, surprisingly well when I tested it
<rugby471> mvo: I would also have a look at the other branches (like stuart landridges)
<cassidy> not sure if it should be shipped in Karmic though
<rugby471> mvo: he has a useful feature that is implemented in my branch, but not as well :-)
<cassidy> oth, I expect most people will use pkg from the PPA if it's not
<seb128> I expect most user don't know what a ppa is
<seb128> your userbase vision seems to be a technical users corner ;-)
<cassidy> good point. I still think that most Empathy users are people with some technical experience but that's not true any more
<seb128> at least it will not be in karmic if it's default
<cassidy> you are using haze for MSN ?
<pitti> cassidy: not any more
<pitti> we recently switched to install butterfly by default
<cassidy> cool
<mac_v> rugby471: mvo: In software store... when an install is in progress  , i switch to that section , now once the install has completed the window just becomes empty :( , the "In progress" section disappears and nothing is shown in the right display window.... wouldnt it be better if the view automatically switched to the last completed install/remove?
<Zdra> Karmic should definitely ship with MSN a/v !
<mvo> mac_v: yeah it would - I think there is even a open bug about that
<mac_v> oh.. ok.. good to know :)
<rugby471> mac_v: that is a question to ask mpt who is not here right now :-)
<cassidy> Zdra, you didn't even test it yet :p
<mac_v> rugby471: yeah lucky him ;p
<mvo> rugby471: yeah, I saw it, today I was pretty occupied with other stuff
<mvo> rugby471: but its on my merge agenda :)
<Zdra> cassidy: ... and I won't use it... but that's a really good sell argument
<rugby471> mvo: hehe
<rugby471> mvo: would it help if I summarise what I did in my branch , here?
<seb128> Zdra, if it's working
<mvo> rugby471: if you would write debian/changelog entires, that would help me
<rugby471> sure
<mvo> many thanks!
<seb128> Zdra, upstream tends to be enthousiastic about new features without always noticing the stability issues
<cassidy> yeah
<Zdra> bah, stable software is not something important, all that we care is the buzz of announcement
<Zdra> see google's business plan
<Zdra> add a little "beta" next to ubuntu and that's it
<mac_v> rugby471: mpt has already answered ; > Bug #426278
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 426278 in software-store ""In Progress" section sometimes appears empty" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/426278
<Zdra> seb128: more seriously, we shipped a/v for jabber even if doesn't work that well... and no other client does msn a/v, so it can't be a regression
<seb128> Zdra, the issue is not only that, it's also the stability of your im client
<seb128> Zdra, and shipping broken things or things not working correctly usually give a bad image of the product, better to not enable a feature that giving the impression it's a working one if it will create frustration for most users for example
<Zdra> seb128: seems you are the last sane people in IT :p
<Zdra> usually it is "works for me, so ship it"
<seb128> ;-)
<pitti> mat_t: hey, welcome back!
<seb128> pitti, hum so I've some gettext for desktop files wondering
<seb128> pitti, I noticed that the message indicator applet launchers are not translated
<seb128> seems to be due to the fact that we strip translations from the desktop file
<rugby471> mvo: I have pushed the debian changelog
<seb128> pitti, how are applications supposed to get translated desktop names nowadays?
<kenvandine> pitti, about bug 412601
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 412601 in indicator-session "[MIR] indicator-session" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/412601
<kenvandine> i think the upstream bug got marked as released because it was moved to main
<kenvandine> the PK bug is 418643
<mvo> rugby471: thanks, I have a look once I'm finished with some update-manager work
<kenvandine> which i think is on deck to be completed this week
<rugby471> mvo: cool
<rugby471> mvo: oh by the way here is a very easy to fix bug :-) https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/software-store/+bug/428324
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 428324 in software-store "Software Store needs branding on Launchpad" [Undecided,Fix committed]
<mvo> rugby471: :)
<mvo> rugby471: I check it out after lunch
<mvo> eh
<mvo> dinner
<MenZa> !lasmen
<ubottu> Sorry, I don't know anything about lasmen
<MenZa> er.
<MenZa> hmm.
<MenZa> I was wondering why I'd been highlighted in here. Turns out I had 'help' on highlight.
 * MenZa grumbles.
<seb128> pitti, ok, it's bug #371399
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 371399 in glib2.0 "Gettext support for GDesktopAppinfo" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/371399
<seb128> pitti, I've added a karmic task, that's very visible for the message launchers
<Amaranth> mvo: yay compiz upload :)
<mat_t> hey pitti :)
<chrisccoulson> it is very thoughtful of gdu-notification-daemon to tell me that my disk is failing, every time i log in
<mac_v> chrisccoulson: just turn it off from start up list ;)
<chrisccoulson> mac_v - yeah, i might do that. but it needs fixing properly really ;)
<mac_v> yup , there is a bug about it already :)
<mvo> Amaranth: yay, the changelog is impressive too :)
<mvo> rugby471: meh, I don't think I manage the merge today, I do it tmorrow (sorry for that)
<rugby471> mvo: no problem
<rugby471> mvo: there is no rush :-)
<pitti> seb128: hi (sorry, was at dinner)
<pitti> seb128: they should have X-GNOME-Gettext-Domain: in the .desktop file and the translations in the .po/.mo files
<seb128> pitti, cf my most recent messages
<pitti> kenvandine: ah, and Loic's changes?
<pitti> seb128: looking
<pitti> seb128: right, thanks; will look into that
<kenvandine> pitti, don't know about that
<dpm> pitti: seb128, there's some information I collected here on .desktop files as well, you can also tell me if you spot any errors -> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/Internationalisation#Desktop%20Entries
<dpm> (re: seb128's question earlier)
<pitti> dpm: nice, thanks! edited to use X-GNOME-... (the preferred name now)
<dpm> ok, cool, thanks
<dpm> pitti: out of interest, howcome has that changed to X-GNOME-...? Has the functionality been accepted at freedesktop.org upstream?
<pitti> dpm: it's used in OpenSUSE as well now, and proposed upstream
<pitti> dpm: X-Ubuntu- still works, of course, but we shouldn't perpetuate it
<pitti> I hope that one day it just becomes Gettext-Domain:
<dpm> right, ok
<rugby471> sorry guys I know this is off-topic but could anyone tell me whether the SM_CLIENT_ID of a window needs ot be specific to the process (ie. main_window) or to the session manager (ie. softwarestore_main_window) ?
<rugby471> ot > to
<seb128> vuntz, hey, did you update your langpack patch for gdesktopapp apis too?
<chrisccoulson> rugby471- i'm not sure i completely understand the question. the sm_client_id should be unique to the main window, and is allocated by the session manager
<rugby471> chrisccoulson: hi chris
<chrisccoulson> hi:)
<rugby471> chrisccoulson: basically does the ID need to be main_window
<rugby471> or softwarestore_main_window
<rugby471> I am trying to solve bug 426294
<chrisccoulson> i'm still a bit confused - what are you doing with it?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 426294 in software-store "Store doesn't "support 'save current setup'" - No SM_CLIENT_ID" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/426294
<chrisccoulson> ah
<rugby471> chrisccoulson: so I need to use .set_role() to fix this
<rugby471> chrisccoulson: or am I wrong?
 * rugby471 is clueless about session manager/application interaction
<chrisccoulson> oh yeah. right, software-store needs to connect to the session manager (using something like eggsmclient or gnomeclient). the session manager will allocate the client ID, which you would then set as a property on the leader window with gdk_set_sm_client_id (in C)
<chrisccoulson> but i don't know if you need to do the second step really
<chrisccoulson> i don't see other applications do that, and they work fine
<rugby471> chrisccoulson: ok, so I need to connect to the session manager first, and then (maybe) set the role
<rugby471> chrisccoulson: know of the python module to connect to the session manager?
<chrisccoulson> rugby471 - i'm not sure of how to do it in python. i will try to find an example
<rugby471> chrisccoulson: thanks
<chrisccoulson> my python knowledge isnt that great;)
<rugby471> hehe
<chrisccoulson> you can just use raw dbus calls if you're in gnome, but that wouldn't work with other session managers
<rugby471> chrisccoulson: I shall ask mvo if you cannot find anything as he will be more intouch with it than I am :-)
<rugby471> mvo: I am looking at bug 428417, should I just open this with eog?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 428417 in software-store "screenshots are too small" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/428417
<rugby471> chrisccoulson: don't worry about it, I thought it was just a simple thign but it seems like it is something that needs some more thought. Thanks for your help :-)
<chrisccoulson> rugby471 - that warning shouldn't be presented normally now btw, due to a recent metacity update. are you still seeing it?
<vuntz> seb128: no. Did something change?
<rugby471> chrisccoulson: no I am not
<chrisccoulson> it should only appear at the moment if you try to log out and you've got session saving enabled
<chrisccoulson> which is not the default
<rugby471> on a fresh karmic it did not happen for me
<seb128> vuntz, the original patches we have are for gnome-menus and g_key I think
<chrisccoulson> but i disagree that a warning should be shown at all anyway - there are lots of clients that don't do session saving
<seb128> vuntz, g_app_* was added after those and is not using gettext
<rugby471> chrisccoulson: I agree and it looks like upstream as well, however they have got to get around to doing it first :-)
<seb128> vuntz, I was just wondering if you worked on that before we dup efforts ;-)
<rugby471> upstream > upstream do
<vuntz> seb128: nope
<vuntz> seb128: but I'll be happy to use your patch ;-)
<vuntz> seb128: (else, I'll do it... hrm... in a few days)
<seb128> vuntz, ok, let's see who is slower ;-)
<vuntz> seb128: I would expect g_app* to use gkeyfile, though
<seb128> vuntz, it doesn't work
<seb128> vuntz, python -c "import gio; print gio.app_info_get_default_for_type('image/jpg', 0).get_name()"
<seb128> try that for example
<seb128> for some reason it doesn't use translations
<seb128> I didn't look at the code yet
<seb128> asac, there?
<pitti> good night everyone, Taekwondo o'clock
<seb128> pitti, have fun
<chrisccoulson> i'm pleasantly surprised at the boot speed of my desktop with karmic
<seb128> lucky you
<seb128> I'm not impressed at the one on both my laptop and desktop configs
<seb128> it takes some 35 seconds to go to gdm
<chrisccoulson> 35 seconds is just slightly longer than my desktop took with jaunty
<chrisccoulson> i get 22 seconds now
<jcastro> seb128: you need an ssd
<jcastro> :)
<chrisccoulson> jcastro - my 22 seconds is just on a standard 7200rpm hard drive ;)
<Amaranth> jcastro: still getting 8 second boots?
<seb128> I've a ssd on my mini config
<chrisccoulson> 8 seconds?
<jcastro> Amaranth: no, down to 4
<chrisccoulson> nice:)
<chrisccoulson> i must invest in one!
<Amaranth> I'm getting 30 seconds even with ubuntu-boot staging
<Amaranth> jcastro: holy crap
<seb128> jcastro, but I like to have medium configs so I know what the average user experience is
<Amaranth> jcastro: that means login time is at least 4x boot time now
<jcastro> dude you'd be surprised how many annoying things get fixed with a fast disk, heh
 * Amaranth has a 5400rpm drive
<seb128> jcastro, you can't require everybody to have a ssd to have a decent user experience
<jcastro> seb128: I have an older laptop with a 4200rpm drive that I keep just to keep me honest
<chrisccoulson> jcastro - i could save 18 seconds of my life every day by investing in a SSD;)
<Amaranth> no but the 10 second boot/login is meant for SSDs
<jcastro> well, it's a slow ssd
<Amaranth> jcastro: thought you had the X25
<jcastro> I do
<jcastro> no, I meant the "10 second boot" machine has a slow ssd
<Amaranth> oh, right
<Amaranth> jcastro: So if a slow SSD and a slow CPU get a 10 second boot you should get a 5 second boot :P
<jcastro> seb128: even on the slow laptop it's been improving for me
<Amaranth> at that point suspend is kind of pointless unless you have something you want to keep open :P
<jcastro> Amaranth: I was getting 5 counting couch launching xulrunner(!) so it should get faster
<Amaranth> my boot time has more than doubled since a clean install of jaunty :/
<Amaranth> and I even did a clean install of alpha 4 recently
<seb128> jcastro,right, I'm a bit concerned about the "xorg will start so fast that we will not need a splash to not be true on normal non-ssd config"
<jcastro> well, I always keep old machines around for testing
<jcastro> seb128: one day we should all boot up with 256mb of ram or something and see how much pain we endure
<seb128> there is no point to do
<seb128> but using normal machines to do testing makes sense
<seb128> ie your ssd doesn't reflect the average user configuration I think
<ccheney> cool someone just fixed the OOo icon theme fallback code to not display not installed themes and to not fallback to ones that don't exist :)
<NCommander> ccheney, please do not upload OOo
<ccheney> everything except arm builds in time and arm is totally broken for OOo atm (going to fix a debug issue for arm with the next upload as well)
<ccheney> or is the some other reason not to upload?
<NCommander> ccheney, you upload OOo and you cause the buildds to spin out, and you break the arch all packages on armel
<NCommander> livefs's will then fail to build
<NCommander> and completely break images
<NCommander> on armel
<NCommander> We *need* an arm release for A6
<asac> seb128: pong
<ccheney> NCommander: oh ok, i thought OOo was currently not installed on arm at all since its broken, no problem, won't do the upload
<NCommander> ccheney, thanks. The OOo-less arch code broke a few alphas ago, but its been a moot point since its building on ia64, and sparc's d-i is very broken ATM
 * NCommander has to fix the later at some point
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - it seems that gnome-session-bin is actually just missing a conflicts on gnome-session
<chrisccoulson> i'm just testing the upgrade path now
<ccheney> NCommander: oh cool, ia64 isn't dead anymore :)
<NCommander> ccheney, my desktop is an ia64
<NCommander> :-)
<ccheney> NCommander: yea, ia64 buildd was out of space for a while though, heh
<NCommander> ccheney, yeah, I had prodded lamont on that
<ccheney> ok
<Amaranth> NCommander: does compiz work on there?
<seb128> asac, hey, libnm-glib breaks build but I didn't investigate
<seb128> did the .pc changes name or something (in which case renaming the package would have be nice)
<asac> seb128: hmm. what build did it break?
<asac> we bumped soname in binary package, but not d-ev
<NCommander> Amaranth, I'm stuck on the framebuffer, its got a ATI video card w/ no graphics
<Amaranth> NCommander: oh, dang
<NCommander> Amaranth, wanting to see if compiz works on obscure architectures? :-)
<Amaranth> NCommander: yeah, I know it works on x86, x86-64, and powerpc but it'd be cool to know it works on space and ia64 too :P
<Amaranth> dunno about arm
<NCommander> Amaranth, I'll tell you on ARM once I have a SoC with 2D/3D accelaration ;-)
<NCommander> Amaranth, I have SPARC hardware ... :-)
<NCommander> Amaranth, give me a good recommendation on a PCI video card that has no binary blobs, and I'll look into it
<Amaranth> NCommander: I guess anything ati older than Radeon HD cards
<Amaranth> NCommander: perhaps http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814161010
<seb128> asac, empathy
<seb128> asac, I didn't build try but if the pc name changes I expect that's normal
<NCommander> Amaranth, hrm, maybe my ia64's card is supported
<NCommander> Amaranth, its c. 2002-ish
<asac> seb128: its a bug. the pc files changed, but instead of a new packagename we should just ship compatibility .pc files
<seb128> asac, the name probably changed for a reason? ie the api is not compatible?
<Amaranth> NCommander: as long as it a Radeon 7000 or newer and not a Radeon HD it should work
<seb128> in which case it doesn't make sense to have compatibility
<seb128> Amaranth, the new compiz makes some gnome-panel bars to be transparent until clicked, known issue?
<asac> seb128: its a soname transition yes. but the .pc file was just changed because dan wanted to finally shift from _ to -
<Amaranth> seb128: Haven't seen that, no
<seb128> asac, ah ok, bug then
<Amaranth> oh man, that's probably because of my patch too :/
<seb128> Amaranth, I get it every time in a guest session
<NCommander> Amaranth, where's the idiots guide to setting up the free driver ;-)
<Amaranth> seb128: don't suppose you can try building it without 015_draw_dock_shadows_on_desktop.patch?
<Amaranth> seb128: you'll only have to install 3/4 of KDE to do so :)
<Amaranth> NCommander: should be as simple as installing the ati driver package
<Amaranth> brb, going to test guest session
<Amaranth> seb128: hrm, I don't have a guest session
<Amaranth> and I think I remember something about a bug right before jaunty where this happened but only with the guest session
<seb128> Amaranth, install gdm-guest-session?
<Amaranth> it is installed, or at least it was
<Amaranth> although I just saw the problem with my bottom panel on my regular session
<Amaranth> yeah, gdm-guest-session is installed
<seb128> and you don't have "Guest session" in the fusa menu?
<Amaranth> building without my patch now, it's the only one that touches any code that should have an effect on drawing docks
<Amaranth> seb128: oh, I don't use fusa
<seb128> Amaranth, I'm doing that too
<Amaranth> isn't it supposed to show up in gdm?
<seb128> Amaranth, well add it it you want to try guest session
<Amaranth> that seems silly but ok
<seb128> Amaranth, no, for security reason only logged-in users can give you access
<seb128> that's a design decision
<seb128> no open login for anybody want to try to crack your box
<Amaranth> are there two user switcher applets?
<seb128> yes
<Amaranth> because the one I added just opens the gnome-control-center shell
<seb128> the upstream one and the ubuntu one
<Amaranth> what is the name of that one?
<seb128> session notification
<seb128> or something similar
<seb128> the icons is "i" with a circle
<Amaranth> indicator applet session
<seb128> right
 * mac_v thinks canonical ran out of labels ;p and is naming everything indicator-*
<Amaranth> ok, installed my rebuilt compiz-plugins
<Amaranth> still happening
<Amaranth> going back to my laptop, I can test with guess session now
<Amaranth> hrm, when you go back from a guest session compiz messes up just like resume from suspend
<Amaranth> that'll make it easier to debug that problem
<Amaranth> the panel thing also happens when you restart compiz
<Amaranth> hrm, panel isn't coming back...
<Keybuk> bratsche: +        /usr/bin/xsplash --gdm-session &
<Keybuk> urgh, could you not add a --daemon flag instead/
<bratsche> Keybuk: Sure.. and then the user session just tells it to display again?
 * Amaranth blames all of this on intel
<Keybuk> bratsche: no, I mean instead of the "&"
<Keybuk> "&" means that xsplash will begin spawning in the background while Init carries on
<bratsche> Keybuk: Oh I see.
<Keybuk> a --daemon flag would mean Init waits for xsplash to actually be spawned and enter its main loop
<bratsche> Keybuk: Sure.
<Keybuk> part of the reason xsplash doesn't quite appear so quickly is the kernel /tends/ to give a little more priority to the parent rather than the child in these situations
<seb128> Amaranth, it was working before the update though ;-)
<bratsche> Keybuk: https://bugs.launchpad.net/xsplash/+bug/429602  <-- I'll let you know when I get a branch ready.  Would you be able to review it for me?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 429602 in xsplash "Add support for running as a daemon process" [Undecided,New]
<seb128> Amaranth, 1:0.8.3+git20090825-0ubuntu1 didn't have the issue if that's useful
<Amaranth> seb128: just the last update even
<seb128> Amaranth, and I updated only compiz binaries
<Amaranth> yeah, even the 0907 package didn't do it
<Keybuk> bratsche: sure
<Keybuk> no urgency, but it's a would be nice :)
<Amaranth> so we've got 7 days of commits to compiz or one of the plugin packs
<seb128> Amaranth, I updated only compiz
<seb128> Amaranth, ie none of the other sources
<Amaranth> ok
<Amaranth> in that case http://git.compiz.org/compiz/core/commit/?h=compiz-0.8&id=4477f537c43a3abc75aebc8af8ff1f28b8cf36a5
<Amaranth> *shrug*
<Amaranth> it's the only commit that seems to even get close
<seb128> can you try or do you want me to try?
<Amaranth> I can try
<seb128> ok thanks
<Amaranth> everything else is plugin changes
<Amaranth> no luck, trying http://git.compiz.org/compiz/core/commit/?h=compiz-0.8&id=85ba708cb894658c9bf9862a311010a9b79ec6f2
<Amaranth> if that isn't it I'm going to start tearing hair out
<Amaranth> wait, that can't be it
<Amaranth> holy crap I think that was it
<Amaranth> yep, that was it
<Amaranth> seb128: if you back out http://git.compiz.org/compiz/core/commit/?h=compiz-0.8&id=fc83fcd8b9866c19416323e17e82e4e4e9fb14d2 and http://git.compiz.org/compiz/core/commit/?h=compiz-0.8&id=85ba708cb894658c9bf9862a311010a9b79ec6f2 (in that order) it should start working correctly again
<Amaranth> just snag the patch files for them from cgit and patch -R
<seb128> Amaranth, is that useful if I do testing?
<Amaranth> seb128: yeah, just to make sure that is the problem commit
<seb128> ok
<Amaranth> I just tried guest session 3 times and didn't get invisible panels while before I was getting one every time
<Amaranth> but confirmation would be nice
<bratsche> Keybuk: https://code.launchpad.net/~bratsche/xsplash/daemon/+merge/11731
<seb128> Amaranth, the second one fails to apply
<Amaranth> seb128: you applied the other one first?
<seb128> yes
<Amaranth> oh, whoops, I left one out
<Amaranth> http://git.compiz.org/compiz/core/commit/?h=compiz-0.8&id=4477f537c43a3abc75aebc8af8ff1f28b8cf36a5
<Amaranth> that needs to go before the 85ba one as well
<Amaranth> the 85ba one is the cause, the other two are cleanups of the code added in that commit
<seb128> Amaranth, ok, applied now
<seb128> building
<Amaranth> I think gcc 4.4 must be a lot faster than 4.2 because I remember compiz taking forever to build and it flies now
<Amaranth> </random>
<seb128> Amaranth, that fixes the issue indeed
<Amaranth> alright, will let danny know and try to find a fix
<seb128> thanks
<Amaranth> if I can't figure anything out I'll see if mvo or robert-ancell can upload a package with those pulled out
<seb128> Amaranth, other issue, when triggering the gpg agent twice you get the focus but the decoration is not colored
<Amaranth> hrm
<Amaranth> you mean with bzr builddeb?
<seb128> ie it comes to frontend but looks like it would not get focus
<seb128> start a session
<seb128> debsign .changes
<seb128> esc
<seb128> debsign .changes
<seb128> the second call displays the dialog to front
<Keybuk> bratsche: that looks fine to me
<seb128> (it used to be in background, good job to fix that)
<Keybuk> bratsche: though I'd put the fork() after all the _init () functions
<seb128> but the decoration indicates it's not colored
<seb128> not sure if that's a clear description
<bratsche> Keybuk: Okay cool.
<Keybuk> usually you put it at the "if we get this far, everything's ok" point
<Keybuk> personally I'd put it after you've actually loaded the logo and stuff
<Keybuk> since that way, "xsplash is ready and has painted the screen"
<Keybuk> (and thus the next line in the gdm script is run under xsplash
<bratsche> But wouldn't it be blocking gdm from continuing if I do it that way?
<Keybuk>  which happens to be an Upstart notification in the ubuntu-boot PPA :p)
<Keybuk> yes
<Amaranth> seb128: I think I understand
<Keybuk> but that's not a bad thing
<Keybuk> for a start, it'd encourage you to make sure it doesn't take you very long at all to display the screen ;)
<bratsche> I'm trying to keep it quick :)
<Keybuk> ironically, sometimes it's faster to do things in series than in parallel
<bratsche> Okay.. I'll shift the fork() stuff until later.
<Amaranth> the moblin 5 second boot was more focused on making sure things didn't interfere with each other than anything else, from what I could see
<Keybuk> exactly
<Keybuk> it so happens that the very next line in that script is "initctl emit ..."
<Keybuk> which is a signal to upstart that it's ok to start some things now, because gdm is up
<Amaranth> Keybuk: btw, was there a reason you needed the .tgz of my boot chart or were you asking everyone?
<Keybuk> Amaranth: I still haven't figured out what the strange "exe" process is at the end of the initramfs
<Amaranth> ah
<Amaranth> Keybuk: also, it seems like sreadahead isn't actually doing anything
<Keybuk> we've been debugging that
<Amaranth> ah, alright
<mac_v> Amaranth: wrong , it does something for me , ;) it eats my cpu for 1min after session start :(
<Amaranth> heh
<mac_v> Keybuk: is the boot Mailing list an open ML or a canonical one?
<Keybuk> a Launchpad one
<mac_v> oh , lp , i'v been searching in the wiki ...
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i've just pushed a change to fix the gnome-session upgrade issue
<Keybuk> mac_v: https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-boot
<chrisccoulson> it's difficult to test properly though without doing a full jaunty-> karmic upgrade
<mac_v> Keybuk: lol , nice boot ;)
<bratsche> Keybuk: Okay, resubmitting the merge request.. I moved the fork fu until after the resources are loaded.
<Keybuk> bratsche: looks ok to me
<mac_v> kenvandine: hi... is this empathy bug fixed> Bug #409828 , or does it need a patch? looking into it it seems that a new image define needs to be created
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 409828 in empathy "Empathy shows wrong icon for notifications" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/409828
<bratsche> Keybuk: If you don't mind, could you mark it approved on https://code.launchpad.net/~bratsche/xsplash/daemon/+merge/11734 ?  David is really into doing the review/merge request procedure.
<mac_v> s/fixed/commited upstream
<seb128> chrisccoulson, thanks
<seb128> chrisccoulson, we will see what user testing will do
<bratsche> Keybuk: Thanks!
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - is gnome-system-monitor usable for you?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, define usable
<chrisccoulson> it hammers the session bus here causing dbus-daemon to hog the CPU
<chrisccoulson> and it won't exit
<chrisccoulson> other than that, it seems to function ok
<seb128> chrisccoulson, no such issue there
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, that's odd
<seb128> I didn't upgrade that afternoon though
<seb128> what signal do you get on the session bus?
<chrisccoulson> it seems to be repeated calls to org.gtk.Private.RemoteVolumeMonitor.List and org.gtk.vfs.MountTracker.listMounts
<seb128> could be due to your disks
<seb128> or something similar
<chrisccoulson> i'll run it in GDB and see if i can figure out whats happening
<chrisccoulson> ccheney - i only just noticed from my bugmail that dianewalker980 messed up a lot of tasks again on bug 345189
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 345189 in pidgin "MASTER regression after switching system font size to 13.333 pixel - fonts appear too large in some apps that do hand made font sizing - treating pixel units as point units" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/345189
<chrisccoulson> i've just requested their account is suspended now
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - gnome-system-monitor here is continuously creating and finalizing volume monitors, although i havent figured out why yet. explains all the dbus spam though ;)
<ccheney> chrisccoulson: ok
 * ccheney thinks it should be changed so only bugsquad can change the status
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - just building the youtube plugin in totem now
<chrisccoulson> the BBC iplayer plugin doesn't work though, as it's missing some dependencies
<chrisccoulson> python-feedparser, which is in universe
<chrisccoulson> and also python-beautifulsoup
<Laney> beautifulsoup? it does screen scraping?
<chrisccoulson> Laney - no idea. but the plugin wouldn't load until i installed it ;)
<chrisccoulson> Laney - "error-tolerant HTML parser for Python"
 * Laney gets suspishus
<Laney> there's no proper iPlayer API?
<chrisccoulson> i'm not sure really, i haven't had a proper look at it yet
<Laney> anyway if it relies on something as brittle as that, i'd be a bit dubious
<Laney> this is all without looking though ;)
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i think it's best to just disable it for now. it doesn't work without those dependencies anyway
<chrisccoulson> i suppose i could move it to totem-plugins-extra
<seb128> chrisccoulson, right, I was going to suggest that too
<chrisccoulson> i'll do that then - it's working ok with the extra dependencies
<seb128> thanks
<davmor2> asac: bug 411476 is still in place and also so is bug 423438 on iso 20090914.2 (just to let you know)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 411476 in ubuntu-sounds "Firefox 3.5 should not use the ubuntu logout noises as default sounds" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/411476
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 423438 in ubufox "apturl crashed with SyntaxError in unknown()" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/423438
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-09-15
<rickspencer3-afk> robert_ancell, hi
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3-afk, hi rick
<rickspencer3-afk> gotta run, but checking in on that empathy in the message menu thing
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3-afk, working on it, battling git :)
<rickspencer3-afk> bug #340180
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3-afk, should be finished by today
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 340180 in indicator-messages "Please provide indicator-applet support in empathy" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/340180
<rickspencer3-afk> aah, git
<rickspencer3-afk> ok, just making sure  you didn't need anything from me or anyone else
<rickspencer3-afk> enjoy!!
<rickspencer3-afk> :)
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3-afk, no, should be ok
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: Can I be of any help re git?
 * TheMuso is no master of it, but is used to working with it now.
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, hopefully :) So I need to pull James' branch from github, merge it with the head, then push it to my github - what is the process?
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, I got the merge working but format-patch doesn't show my changes and I can't work out how to push
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: I haven't had to deal with merging yet, but probably something along the lines of, fetch the branch you want to merge as a remote, so "git remote add james git://git.address/of/git-repo.git". Then use git log to see the diference between them.
<TheMuso> then probably something like git merge james/master
<TheMuso> and deal with conflicts
<robert_ancell> and I do that with a git remote add first?
<TheMuso> Well I find that itas easier to have remote branhes I pull from as remotes. Origin is a remote so you can have as many remotes as  you like.
<TheMuso> So when you clone a branch, origin is the remote of the branch you cloned, so you only need to update origin in order to work with it.
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, ok, can you show me the exact commands in a pastebin?
<robert_ancell> head is: ssh://rancell@git.gnome.org/git/empathy
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: Since I've never worked with git merging I don't know how to use it, but adding a remote is simply "git remote add remotename git-repo-address"
<robert_ancell> remote is: git://github.com/james-w/empathy.git
<robert_ancell> ah, ok
<robert_ancell> so I added the remote, made a new branch, merged the changes, fixed conflicts, 'git add' on the fixed files, 'git commit', but my new changes don't show up in format patch. And I have no idea how to push all that to a new git repo
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: How are you calling git-format-patch?
<robert_ancell> git format-patch origin/new_branch
<TheMuso> Is origin/new_branch what you originally used to base your changes and merge james' branch on?
<robert_ancell> I think so?
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: You might find it easier to call git format-patch with the has of the last common commit, i.e the last commit before your changes and the merge.
<TheMuso> hash
<robert_ancell> ok
<TheMuso> Git-format-patch can either work by giving it individual hashes for commits you want as patches, or the last commit as a base, which then makes all the subsequent commits hashes.
<TheMuso> s/hashes/patches/
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: And finally to push, you can either set up another remote to point to a branch you want to push to, and push using "git push remotename branchname", or use an URL, "git push url://to.repo/git-repo.git branchname"
<robert_ancell> ok, thanks
<TheMuso> If you want to push the contents of another branch in your repo, i.e one thats not checked out, you simply change branchname to localbranchname:remotebranchname
<Amaranth> yay, found a fix for the invisible panels
<kenvandine> robert_ancell, hey man... how's the empathy hacking?
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, coming along, git is the hardest part :)
<kenvandine> i know... i hate git
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: How did you go?
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, working on the code at the moment, will do the git bit later
<kenvandine> i still swear it is linus' way of seeing how much people are willing to endure just because he said it is cooler
<robert_ancell> totally
<Amaranth> kenvandine: it's smokin' fast
<kenvandine> for most projects the difference isn't that big... but i can see that for the kernel
<Amaranth> and it calls PAGER automatically when showing `git log`
<kenvandine> well that is nice
<kenvandine> it is like the only thing it makes easy :)
<Amaranth> I always forget that then lose all my scrollback in my terminal when using bzr
<kenvandine> otherwise it seems to me it is designed to torture users
<Amaranth> the only really hard part is dealing with remote branches
<robert_ancell> which is what I'm dealing with now...
 * Amaranth tries to remember the magic
<kenvandine> robert_ancell, i had figured that out at gcds.. but forgotten now
<Amaranth> robert_ancell: git checkout --track -b mybranch origin/remote-branch-name
<Amaranth> that'll make git pull automatically update from the remote branch too
<robert_ancell> Amaranth, do you need to make mybranch first? What is the naming format for mybranch?
<Amaranth> if you leave out --track you get a one-time pull from the branch
<Amaranth> robert_ancell: no, you don't need to make it first
<Amaranth> robert_ancell: I usually do git checkout --track -b compiz-0.8 origin/compiz-0.8
<Amaranth> for a real life example
<robert_ancell> Amaranth, is there a 'git info' or similar that will show me what I've got checked out and what is being tracked/linked etc?
<Amaranth> robert_ancell: git status
<robert_ancell> Amaranth, doesn't tell me a lot :(
<Amaranth> just what branch you're on
<Amaranth> a `git info` would be really helpful, I know git has that information
<robert_ancell> yeah
<Amaranth> because otherwise you'd have to give full URLs for push and pull
<Amaranth> robert_ancell: also this might help you: http://www.gnome.org/~federico/misc/git-cheat-sheet.txt
<robert_ancell> Amaranth, I've never had a problem with full URLs in other VCSs.  There's nothing wrong with being explicit (and you can always add an alias system on top)
<Amaranth> robert_ancell: sure
<Amaranth> robert_ancell: although in this case you'd want to do git push origin/compiz-0.8
<Amaranth> although it should handle that for you and `git push` should work but that would be considering being explicit for git
<Amaranth> s/considering/considered/
<Amaranth> robert_ancell: btw, the change you made to compiz to disable constrain_y is very bad
<Amaranth> you can now freely move windows in a way that requires you to use alt-click to get them back
<robert_ancell> Amaranth, yes, I've been working on some patches to fix that behaviour properly
<robert_ancell> (i.e. behave like metacity)
<Amaranth> robert_ancell: The move plugin should ignore contrain_y when the window is either taller than the work area or you're using alt-click
<robert_ancell> The resize plugin has the same problem as it has no panel detection
<Amaranth> ouch, yeah
<Amaranth> robert_ancell: I'm going to have mvo revert that change to disable contrain_y though. If we can't get a proper fix having that bug is better than the bug we have now
<robert_ancell> Amaranth, sure, no prob.  The compiz work keeps getting displaced by higher priority stuff but I plan to have the patches ready by Karmic
<RoAkSoAx> Keybuk, ping
<Keybuk> RoAkSoAx: yes?
<RoAkSoAx> Keybuk, is the webapp for requesting sponsorship supposed to stay like this: http://img223.imageshack.us/img223/1645/screenshot1th.th.png, after finishing?
<Keybuk> RoAkSoAx: you'll need to talk to jcastro
 * Keybuk isn't involved with UDS this time
<RoAkSoAx> Keybuk, oh ok, since there was a message that was saying that if there was any problem with the webapp we should contact you
<jcastro> RoAkSoAx: hmm, all you get is that blank page?
<RoAkSoAx> jcastro, yes, and in the botton bar keeps changing from "waiting for login.launchpad.net" and "waiting for summit.ubuntu.com"
<jcastro> hmm, lame
<jcastro> RoAkSoAx: ok, well at least your submission went through
<RoAkSoAx> jcastro, here's a better screenshot: http://img223.imageshack.us/img223/1645/screenshot1th.png
<RoAkSoAx> jcastro, ok cool thanks for the confirmation :)
<jcastro> RoAkSoAx: I'll have someone look at it tomorrow, but it looks like the requests are coming in
<RoAkSoAx> jcastro, ok :)
<jcastro> I'll make sure we change the address too so Keybuk doesn't get all the spam
<mac_v> robert_ancell: hi... regarding Bug #409828 , are you fixing that as well along with the other empathy stuff?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 409828 in empathy "Empathy shows wrong icon for notifications" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/409828
<robert_ancell> mac_v, no plans at the moment - it doesn't appear to be in the indicator code
<mac_v> robert_ancell: hrm... i'v tried to look into the empathy bzr code , and it seems it needs a new image define , is such a patch allowed ?
<robert_ancell> new image define?
<mac_v> empathy uses > EMPATHY-IMAGE-NEW-MESSAGE as the image for the notifications
<mac_v> that points to im-message-new
<robert_ancell> mac_v, which file?
<mac_v> just a sec
<Zdra> libempathy-gtk/empathy-images.h
<Zdra> what's wrong with im-message-new ?
<mac_v> robert_ancell: /src/empathy-event-manager.c , /src/empathy-chat-window.c
<mac_v> Zdra: that is not what notify-osd has to use for the notifiations :)
<robert_ancell> mac_v, that is pointing at "im-message-new"
<mac_v> yeah
<mac_v> so if we are to use the notify-osd icon we need to use a new image define
<mac_v> pointing to > notification-message-im
<robert_ancell> mac_v, hmm, I guess it would require a freeze request https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UserInterfaceFreeze
<robert_ancell> mac_v, so if you want to do the freeze request then the change can go in
<mac_v> yeah , but its very minor and not having it would make the default to look awkward
<mac_v> can a new one like > EMPATHY_IMAGE_NOTIFY_MESSAGE   , be used?
<Amaranth> mac_v: is that public API/
<Amaranth> ?
<mac_v> Amaranth: hehe , i'm not sure , i came up with that ;p
<Amaranth> mac_v: Right but if the empathy-images.h file gets shipped as something other apps use when using libempathy-gtk you can't add API in an Ubuntu patch
<Amaranth> you'll have to make the define somewhere private or just skip the define and use the right icon directly where needed
<Zdra> mac_v: why isn't im-message-new correct for notification?
<Zdra> mac_v: what looks like that notification-message-im ?
<mac_v> Amaranth: hrm... thats what i thought first , but the image is called by the define so , ok will see how to set the image itself :)
<mac_v> Zdra: thats a color one and notify-osd uses greyscale icons
<Zdra> mac_v: should be notification-im-message-new IMO
<Zdra> to respect naming of icons
<mac_v> hehe , thats what naming human theme comes with ;)
<mac_v> s/what/the
<Zdra> mac_v: ok, so if you want an ubuntu specific patch for that (I don't think it makes sense upstream) you just have to add a define in empath-images.h and use that in empathy-event-manager.c
<Zdra> mac_v: but what if I don't use the human theme?
<Zdra> mac_v: that icon name won't exist, so it will break all other themes
<mac_v> Zdra: notify-osd uses the human theme as a fallback , if the custom theme doesnt have the icon then it will use the human's icon
<Zdra> ah
<mac_v> all the labels notification-* are ubuntu specific only ,since we are the proud users of notify-osd ;p
<mac_v> Zdra: so a new define can be used in the ubuntu patch?
<Zdra> mac_v: Hm, Amaranth's remark is correct, that would mean that ubuntu adds API
<mac_v> :(
 * mac_v finds it easier hacking stuff for personal use ;p
<Zdra> mac_v: so probably you should just change in empathy-event-manager and set there the new name
<mac_v> hmm... ok
<Amaranth> the define is only useful because multiple things are using the same icon and you don't want redundant code
<Amaranth> that way if you want to change the icon you change one place
<Amaranth> but this new icon will only be used in one place so there is no reason for a define anyway
<mac_v> ^ that makes sense , guess i was just try to make it uniform^
<mac_v> Amaranth: any luck with the logout plugin?
<Amaranth> mac_v: haven't looked at it again
<Amaranth> mac_v: we're probably not going to be able to do it, user interface freeze and all
<mac_v> ah, there are several papercuts , that havent been done yet
<mac_v> so are we just going to stop?
<mac_v> Amaranth: this was an easier one than most others which havent even been looked into , hence i had i confirmed... so if freeze is blocking :(
 * mac_v not updating compiz , worried it might break the plugin ;p
<mac_v> i think david was banking on the global bug jam , to finish the papercuts
<Amaranth> I wish you could stop accepting bug reports for a project
<Amaranth> the "hundred papercuts" has over 400 open bugs :P
<Amaranth> it should only have like 10 or 20 left assuming things have gone well in previous rounds
<Amaranth> hey mvo
<mvo> hey Amaranth
<mac_v> Amaranth: > https://bugs.launchpad.net/hundredpapercuts/+bugs?field.searchtext=&orderby=-importance&search=Search&field.status%3Alist=FIXRELEASED&assignee_option=any&field.assignee=&field.bug_reporter=&field.bug_supervisor=&field.bug_commenter=&field.subscriber=&field.omit_dupes.used=&field.omit_dupes=on&field.has_patch.used=&field.has_cve.used=&field.tag=&field.tags_combinator=ANY  , so really havent gone well in previous rounds ;p
<mac_v> so things* really
<Amaranth> mvo: got a couple compiz related things
<Amaranth> mvo: most important is that we get http://git.compiz.org/compiz/core/commit/?h=compiz-0.8&id=d8285f4f8c6ca50b69965a225c36cdad1e456d24
<Amaranth> otherwise you get invisible panels at login
<Amaranth> mvo: everything else I actually want to work on some more tomorrow, just wanted to make sure you saw that before I went to bed
<mvo> Amaranth: yeah, I noticed the panels already, thanks for the git link
<mvo> Amaranth: thanks, I will do a update on this today
<Amaranth> took me and cornelius a bit of poking to figure out that fix but seb128 made it really easy by letting me know a snapshot from 7 days ago worked
<Amaranth> only had to roll back the latest 3 commits and bam, working fine again :)
<mvo> heh :) yeah, good thing that I packaged the snapshots (and that seb tested them so careful)
 * mvo hugs Amaranth and cornelius
<Amaranth> cornelius is still working on another bug that only affects nvidia users that is similar, he thinks it may have a similar fix
<Amaranth> but it is less important since it only happens when you have a bunch of windows open when you start compiz
<Amaranth> oh, and mac_v wants us to finally use the logout plugin
<mac_v> Amaranth: wasnt it having the same effect in hardy too? without the plugin?
<mvo> interessting idea, it does need a update I think, its currently not working
<mvo> well, config needs update :)
<Amaranth> mac_v: yeah but that was the dialog itself
<Amaranth> mvo: and we should probably disable unredirect fullscreen windows
<Amaranth> it causes more issues than it fixes and intel seems to run 3D apps fine without it now
<mac_v> Amaranth: oh , thanks , i thought i was dreaming it up ;)
<mvo> Amaranth: ok
<mvo> Amaranth: fixed in bzr
<mvo> Amaranth: anything else you noticed? any strange bugreport or anything?
<Amaranth> mvo: nope, seems to be good so far
<mvo> cool
<Amaranth> I want to do some work on move and resize since robert_ancell is busy with empathy but that'll take a bit more time
<mvo> speaking of resize: I seem to be unable to get a resize handle in my emacs22 window
<mvo> but only for right and bottom
<robert_ancell> Amaranth, I'll send you the part patches if you want
<Amaranth> robert_ancell: that'd be great, send them to amaranth@ubuntu.com
<mvo> what are they about?
<robert_ancell> Amaranth, sent
<robert_ancell> mvo, the resize doesn't take panels into account at all so you can resize the top of the window under the panel
<Amaranth> mvo: fixing constrain_y to work like metacity and fixing resize to work the same way (don't resize under panels)
<mvo> nice
 * Amaranth goes to curl up with a box of tissues
<Amaranth> dang cold
<Amaranth> see you guys in a few
<mvo> get well!
<pitti> Good morning
<seb128> hey pitti
<seb128> pitti, I started looking at the glib gettext issue yesterday
<seb128> pitti, just so you don't duplicate work
<mvo> asac: I had a quick look at the auto-install thing we talked about yesterday and it seems jaunty behaves the same
<mvo> :/
<seb128> hey mvo
<pitti> seb128: ah, thanks
<mvo> hey seb128
<seb128> pitti, it seems that's just the current gettext patch which is buggy
<seb128> pitti, gdesktopapp uses g_key
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone!
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hey pitti
<seb128> hello chrisccoulson
<seb128> I will sponsor gnome-session and totem after getting coffee
<chrisccoulson> hi seb128
<chrisccoulson> thanks:)
<chrisccoulson> i just went to get some coffee too!
<asac> mvo: too baq
<asac> bad
<seb128> hey asac
<asac> hi
<seb128> asac, any chance that you fix this libnm-glib pc naming compat thing today?
<Ng> asac: re bug #411894 it doesn't get confused atm because the on/off menu options don't appear, and bluetooth-properties won't start ;)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 411894 in gnome-bluetooth "rfkill support gets confused" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/411894
<Ng> "sudo rfkill {un,}block bluetooth" seems to work perfectly though
<seb128> wb asac
<asac> hi seb128
<asac> ;)
<seb128> asac, did you get my question before?
<asac> i committed your workaround
<asac> bug 429523
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 429523 in gnome-bluetooth "bluetooth-wizard will not run - assertion failure" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/429523
<asac> err
<asac> ;)
<asac> not that one
<slomo> seb128: could you sync pitivi from unstable? :)
<seb128> asac, any chance you upload today?
<asac> yes
<seb128> slomo, will do now
<asac> i will upload right after coffee is finished ;)
<seb128> asac, thanks
<slomo> seb128: thanks :)
<asac> wanted to take a quick look if there is any other gression or something i should fix for alpha-6 ... now that i am at it
<asac> seb128: empathy failed?
<seb128> slomo, I did sync the gst* yesterday but not gst-ffmpeg ... is that worth having too?
<asac> i can reupload that for you
<asac> or at least test ;)
<slomo> seb128: yes, fixes some annoying bugs :)
<seb128> asac, yes, and the upload has a change we want for alpha if possible
<slomo> seb128: s/some/many/
<seb128> slomo, ok good, doing that too then
<asac> seb128: but you didnt upload the new one yet?
<slomo> seb128: also gnonlin if you didn't update that yet ;)
<seb128> asac, I did that's the one which failed to build
<seb128> slomo, I was just looking at the versions for this one ;-)
<asac> kk
<slomo> seb128: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gstreamer0.10/+bug/428987  <--- this one has a upstream bug somewhere but i can't find it right now ;) it's a problem with playbin2 iirc
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 428987 in totem "Disabling visualization while playing audio hangs Totem" [Low,New]
<seb128> slomo, ok thanks
<asac> urgh ... make crashed ;) memory decay i assume. not nice
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I'm wondering if you didn't confuse the iplayer and bbc plugins
<seb128> chrisccoulson, the bbc one is the ubuntu specific one made by collabora and didn't change since jaunty and is working out of the box no?
 * seb128 is checking
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, you might be right there
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I'm fixing that now
<seb128> bug #384767
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 384767 in totem "Totem BBCiPlayer plugin can't be enable due to lack of depends" [Low,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/384767
<chrisccoulson> thanks
<chrisccoulson> yeah, thats the one
<chrisccoulson> so, i did get a bit confused then ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I've changed to move iplayer, trying build now
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - thanks, sorry about that!
<seb128> no problem, no reason you would be the only one there never doing a small error
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> you would make us look like monkeys otherwise ;-)
<chrisccoulson> heh;)
<seb128> wb chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> my 3G connection is a bit unreliable today!
<chrisccoulson> keeps disconnecting me
<seb128> slomo, we got some bugs from users where libgstlibvisual.so screws things, any hint on how to debug?
<seb128> slomo, ie bug #429732
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 429732 in gst-plugins-base0.10 "Nautilus won't start, DBUS error" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/429732
<seb128> slomo, or bug #429231
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 429231 in gst-plugins-base0.10 "Pidgin does not start, problem with /usr/lib/gstreamer-0.10/libgstlibvisual.so" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/429231
<seb128> pitti, there for a quick question about the glib gettext change?
<seb128> pitti, you use "+  msg_locale = setlocale (LC_MESSAGES, NULL);"
<seb128> pitti, did you mean +  msg_locale = setlocale (LC_MESSAGES, "");?
<pitti> seb128: I probably did mean that, yes
<pitti> seb128: did I write that/
<pitti> ?
<seb128> pitti, ok good, because that fixes the bug
<pitti> anyway, NULL is wrong, indeed
<pitti> cool!
<seb128> pitti, well either you adapted vuntz's version or wrote it
<pitti> seb128: I wonder how it could ever have worked with that
<seb128> pitti, "" fixes the bug
 * pitti hugs seb128
<seb128> pitti, it never did I think but we use gnome-menus for almost everything
<seb128> pitti, ie we didn't notice g_key not working
 * seb128 hugs pitti
<seb128> vuntz, ^
<seb128> vuntz, you might be interested if your change has the same issue
<pitti> ah
<pitti> asac: just gotta love your n-m version numbers :)
<pitti> I wonder if it's some s3kr1t exploit code hex dump
<asac> hey. they are great
<asac> at least for good/robust git/daily integration
<seb128> chrisccoulson, did you try the youtube plugin?
<seb128> I get
<seb128> "gstsouphttpsrc.c(1096): gst_soup_http_src_parse_status (): /GstPlayBin2:play/GstURIDecodeBin:uridecodebin0/GstSoupHTTPSrc:source:
<seb128> 404 Not Found"
<seb128> for all the videos I tried
<seb128> ah, https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=594320
<mvo> asac: I will so use the same schema for the compiz snapshots!
<ubottu> Gnome bug 594320 in YouTube plugin "Playing youtube videos results in 404 in gst_soup_http_src_parse_status()" [Normal,Resolved: fixed]
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i did briefly try it, and didn't get any videos to play, but i didn't debug it yet.i've never had it work properly for me, so i wasn't sure if it was something wrong with my setup
<chrisccoulson> ah, it's already reported
<lool> seb128: Hey!  Did you see empathy was FTBFSing?  It seems libnm-glib isn't pulled in the chroot anymore and a build-dep was missing
<asac> mvo: we have those great snippets
<asac> ;)
<lool> log http://launchpadlibrarian.net/31790611/buildlog_ubuntu-karmic-i386.empathy_2.27.92-1ubuntu2_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<asac> will put them into mt-git.mk or something
<seb128> lool, hey, see discussions with asac yesterday evening and this morning
<mvo> cool
<lool> seb128: Ok, sorry
<seb128> lool, they basically renamed the .pc and will add a compatibility one today
<seb128> I will retry empathy then
<lool> asac, seb128: So this is under control; thanks
<lool> seb128: Ok thanks a lot
<seb128> you're welcome
<asac> lool: fix already landed in ubuntu. (will talk about upstream fix later today) i think retrying empathy is good
<asac> are there more bugs?
<asac> e.g more packages failing?
<lool> asac: Which source package was that in?
<asac> network-manager
<lool> network-manager 0.8~a~git.20090911t130220.4c77fa0-0ubuntu2
<asac> libnm-glib-dev .pc file rename
<asac> yes
<lool> asac: Ok thanks; it's still building on armel
<seb128> asac, retying ... you are being optimistic there, the build and publish game usually takes at least 2 hours
<asac> seb128: yes.
<chrisccoulson> kklimonda - are you going to do the transmission update?
<chrisccoulson> i just had a user e-mail me and ask me when 1.75 will be in karmic for some reason :-/
<chrisccoulson> they obviously assume that i don't have a lite:)
<chrisccoulson> s/lite/life
<kklimonda> interesting, I just got an email when am I going to prepare 1.75 for jaunty ppa..
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson: what about UI freeze/
<chrisccoulson> kklimonda - there's no UI changes are there?
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson: do we have to remove both dialog window that asks users to kill dangling process and donate button?
<kklimonda> oh, so it's not a problem?
<kklimonda> I remember reading that all changes in user interface after 10th of september have to be both consulted with release team and translators
<chrisccoulson> kklimonda - i'm not sure about that dialog. i don't think it would be an issue, but i don't think the dialog should be there anyway ;)
<kklimonda> but maybe I'm wrong
<seb128> chrisccoulson, btw speaking about your workload how is your ubuntu todolist? ;-)
<mac_v> is there a recent known bug , where the /home does not unmount on shutdown?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - my work load is not too bad at the moment. have you got some extra work for me to do then? ;)
<kklimonda> well, neither do I, charles isn't really happy with making it either but it's better than nothing for now until we get some people to actually reproduce it and get backtrace (I couldn't do it myself)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, gnome-disk-utility notification about disk issues uses actions do you think you could look at fixing that before karmic?
<chrisccoulson> kklimonda - yeah, the bug definately should be fixed really
<seb128> chrisccoulson, it's weird to have an "ok" button for that
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i could possibly look at that. i get the popup at the moment, so it's quite annoying ;)
<seb128> I get it too on my desktop, thanks!
<seb128> if you look at it let me know
<seb128> otherwise I might have a look but that will be after beta probably though
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, i was trying to think about it a bit last night. i think it would be nice to "opt-out" of having a notification on every log in (with a checkbutton on the warning or something similar), and only get notified again if the smart status degrades any further. something like that should be possible, seeing as the smart history is stored in a database
<chrisccoulson> i don't know what other peoples opinions are though
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson: according to this page: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UserInterfaceFreeze we need an ACK from release team. I'll prepare update today and poke people ;)
<seb128> I for one know that my disk has issue and I've decided to keep using it for a bit so +1 for a way to opt that out
<chrisccoulson> kklimonda - yeah, i was just about to mention that - it adds new strings doesn't it?
<seb128> it's not brining any value once you know about the issue
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson: yes, that's why I've mentioned it.
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, i agree. and i think it's debatable that i should see the warning for my disk anyway. it's got some reallocated sectors, but it shouldn't really cause an issue until the disk runs out of space to re-allocate them. it's not yet at the stage where the manufacturer would consider it to be failing anyway
<pitti> asac: hm, the "invalid SSL" page now seems broken in firefox, I just get a "nondefined XML entity" yellow page
<asac> pitti: yes. translation bug
<asac> well po2xpi bug.
<asac> would be interesting to check whether its also in firefox-3.0
<asac> one second we have a bug
<pitti> ok, that's fine, if it's known
<pitti> I just stumbled over it
<asac> bug 429835
<asac> we just found it out today
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 429835 in firefox-3.5 "chrome error when using firefox in Dutch ('nl', 'nl_NL', 'nl_BE') locale on karmic" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/429835
<rickspencer3> tseliot, good morning
<rickspencer3> tseliot, thanks for getting on the intel patch!
<tseliot> rickspencer3: good morning to you
<tseliot> rickspencer3: no problem, it's part of my job now ;)
<seb128> hey rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> good morning seb128
<rickspencer3> seb128, my French class was canceled last night, not enough students
<rickspencer3> so I will take the Saturday class
<rickspencer3> how do I  say "oh well" in French?
<seb128> rickspencer3, oh, that's a shame :-(
<seb128> rickspencer3, "tant pis"
<rickspencer3> tant pis
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> Amaranth, could you comment on bug #429969 since you know the status of the bug?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 429969 in compiz "hidden task bar" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/429969
<pitti> oh, just noticed that ^ in the guest session
<pitti> it comes back when clicking on it, though
<mvo> seb128: its fix commited
<mvo> seb128: but there is currently some discussion with upstream
<seb128> mvo, can you update the bug, thanks
<mvo> seb128: I will just upload the fix instead ;)
<seb128> mvo, danke
<bittin> is the meeting 16:30 swedish time?
<pitti> bittin: desktop team meeting is 1630 UTC
<pitti> i. e. 1830 CEST
<bittin> ah ok
<seb128> pitti, how do you cherrypick a bzr commit for packages maintained in bzr like the dxteam ones?
<bittin> thx for the info =)
<seb128> pitti, is there a bzr command for that or just diff and use patch to apply?
<pitti> seb128: the best is usually to merge everything up to a particular revision (bzr merge -r 1234 ../trunk)
<james_w> bzr merge -c <revno> <branch>
<pitti> seb128: for cherrypicking just one particular, non-contiguous, revision, use bzr merge -c 1234 ../trunk
<james_w> or as pitti said if you just don't want later stuff
<seb128> james_w, pitti: thanks
<pitti> seb128: -r is cleaner, since it records the fact that you merged those revs already; -c can't do that (it's more or less like diff | patch
<seb128> well I don't want a bzr snapshot
<seb128> I want to backport a change
<mac_v> Amaranth: hi... are you still having problems with the logout plugin? i have the latest compiz updates too , but i dont see any problems
<mac_v> oh... ops wrong timezone :(
<bittin> timezones sucks :(
<rugby471> mvo: hello
<seb128> re
 * seb128 looks at asac
<seb128> asac, I can't connect to wireless since the nm update
<mvo> hey rugby471 - check trunk/ - all your stuff is merged (+ more :)
<rugby471> mvo: just about to :-)
<asac> seb128: thats odd
<asac> seb128: a) did you restart?
<seb128> asac, but true
<seb128> yes
<seb128> I just did
<seb128> and I did hit a fsck on blank screen again which is confusing
<asac> was that fixed?
<seb128> no
<seb128> I'm on wire right now
<ArneGoetje> seb128: do you know if gdm still uses locale settings from ~/.dmrc ?
<asac> whats the status on that?
<asac> seb128: i mean the fsck bug
<seb128> dunno
<seb128> I got a fsck without any clue on display right now
<asac> seb128: well. so last update came from Keybuk without direct notification ;)
<seb128> but it passed through after some minutes
<seb128> that's just confusing
<seb128> ArneGoetje, it should
<ArneGoetje> seb128: ok, thanks
<seb128> asac, so about my nm issue?
<asac> seb128: which version do you have?
<seb128> asac, ii  network-manager                            0.8~a~git.20090911t130220.4c77fa0-0ubuntu2       network management framework daemon
<rugby471> mvo: about the ShowImage Dialog
<rugby471> mvo: I was working ons something similar :-)
<asac> seb128: and network-manager-gnome is also latest?
<rugby471> mvo: with eog
<rugby471> :-)
<seb128> asac, sorry weekly call with rickspencer3 I brb
<asac> k
<rugby471> I shall have a look your your implementation, it is probably better :-)
<mvo> rugby471: yeah, I merged that - but gnome-open on this is IMO too heavy :)
<mvo> rugby471: its based on your code
<rugby471> oh?
<rugby471> I didn't realise I pushed that :-)
<rugby471> hehe no problem :-)
<mvo> :)
<rugby471> mvo: when does the dialog show itself?
<mvo> rugby471: on click, just as in your implementation (including the zoom cursor)
<rugby471> ah
<rugby471> I shall have a look
<rugby471> mvo: haha I am just looking at rev 251 - simplify the copy/cut/paste
<mvo> (phone)
<rugby471> mvo: I had no idea you could do it that easy :-)
<Keybuk> asac: ?
<pitti> seb128: I regularly get n-m crashes on upgrade nowadays, perhaps it's just that for you?
<asac> Keybuk: all fine. just didnt notice that you did a NM upload. in the past we dont "stop" on shutdown. is it ok to just remove the stop on ( ... ) from the .upstart file to achieve the same?
<seb128> re
<seb128> right, it seems to crahs as soon as I connect
<asac> hmm
<Keybuk> asac: Upstart shutdown is a little different
<Keybuk> (or will be)
<Keybuk> it's acceptable to "stop on runlevel [06]"
<seb128> asac,
<seb128> (gdb) bt
<seb128> #0  0x00cb72a1 in IA__g_object_unref (_object=0x9cd8760)
<seb128>     at /build/buildd/glib2.0-2.21.6/gobject/gobject.c:2370
<seb128> #1  0x080ae53a in ?? ()
<seb128> #2  0x00cb73e3 in IA__g_object_unref (_object=0x9ce2018)
<seb128> not very useful
<Keybuk> that's directly equivalent to being killed by sendsigs
<asac> yeah
<asac> thats what i want
<seb128> and dbgsym don't seem to be there
<Keybuk> asac: I did add an NM task a few days before the upload, so you'd notice I was doing it
<asac> at least until NM doesnt tear down stuff on shutdown
<Keybuk> asac: right, so the upstart job is right, it just doesn't match what you'd expect from the init script
<Keybuk> asac: but that's what you'd expect, because upstart jobs are declarative ;)
<Keybuk> "stop on" => when to send the TERM/KILL signal
<rugby471> mvo: damn it screenshots.debian.net is down :-(
<rugby471> http://downforeveryoneorjustme.com/http://screenshots.debian.net
<asac> Keybuk: ok so we can use "stop on runlevel [06]" ? or are you saying the "stop on (stopping dbus or stopping hal)" already does that?
<Keybuk> asac: it already does that
<Keybuk> basically if dbus gets stopped, you want NM to get stopped first
<Keybuk> otherwise NM is going to exit() inside libdbus anyway
<Keybuk> and Upstart will then try and respawn it
<asac> ok. but hal is kind of wrong
<asac> a) NM doesnt use hal ... and even before it continued to work well even if hal was down
<Keybuk> HAL is a bit more interesting I guess - it'd be worth finding out whether NM copes with HAL not being around when it starts
<Keybuk> and whether NM copes with HAL going away
<Keybuk> ahh
<asac> yes. it works well without hal
<Keybuk> then that's a bug ;)
<asac> i mean in the past
<Keybuk> should be just dbus
<Keybuk> want me to fix that, or will you?
<seb128> asac, do you have some time to help me to fix my laptop wireless or should I just downgrade nm for now?
<asac> no i will do
<asac> seb128: from which package version did you upgrade? from ubuntu1?
<asac> there is zero change in that update ... so if you came from that its probably something else
<Keybuk> asac: probably should be
<Keybuk> start on (filesystem
<Keybuk>           and started dbus)
<Keybuk> stop on stopping dbus
<Keybuk> ?
<asac> yes. sounds reasonable Keybuk
<asac> thanks
<seb128> asac,
<seb128> 2009-09-15 17:04:27 upgrade network-manager 0.8~a~git.20090820t182117.cb60390-0ubuntu3~boot6 0.8~a~git.20090911t130220.4c77fa0-0ubuntu2
<asac> will do that when pulling your debdiff to the branch
<asac> seb128: boot6?
<Keybuk> asac: I commited my changes to the branch
<seb128> asac, ubuntu-boot version
<asac> Keybuk: to the core-dev branch?
<asac> hmm
<Keybuk> asac: to the branch mentioned in debian/control
<Keybuk> oh, maybe I didn't because I didn't have PERMISSION :)
<asac> Keybuk: yeah. think i failed to update it. will figure.
<Keybuk> want me to push now?
<Keybuk> if so, to what URL?
<asac> Keybuk: just anywhere i can merge it in instantly.
<asac> or i can add you to nm team if you want ;)
<Keybuk> lp:~scott/network-manager/0ubuntu3
<asac> thx
<Keybuk> np
 * Keybuk always tries to spot bzr branches and use them
<Keybuk> ok, so the hal thing would explain why NM gets bounced on upgrade
<Keybuk> because HAL is always restarted
<Keybuk> still need to understand why X crashes sometimes ;)
<dobey> Keybuk: did you change the network-manager script to UpStart?
<Keybuk> dobey: no, I changed it to Upstart ;)
<seb128> asac, re, sorry I was playing with it
<dobey> Keybuk: ok, well maybe you already fixed the issue, but there appeared to be an extraneous floating 's' character at the end of the file
<dobey> of /etc/init.d/network-manager that is
<Keybuk> bet there isn;t
<mvo> rugby471: copy-n-paste> well, its just a shortcut, your code was fine too :)
<seb128> asac, http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/log
<seb128> asac, that's the log I get when selecting my wireless
<rugby471> mvo: but isn't it built in :-)
<mvo> rugby471: weh, if screenshots.d.n is down, thats bad - I need we need at least a proxy :/
<dobey> Keybuk: well there isn't now on this machine, because i edited the file and deleted that line...
<Keybuk> dobey: there's an "s" at the end of /lib/init/upstart-job - which is what /etc/init.d/network-manager is a symlink to ? :-)
<asac> seb128: hmm. dhclient seems to not succeed
<seb128> asac, wait, I'm not sure the copy worked right
<dobey> Keybuk: ok well i didn't see it was a symlink. the error talked about /etc/init.d/network-manager :)
<dobey> since i was trying to start network-manager so i could use the internets again
<Keybuk> dobey: but yes, that's long-since-fixed - you just need to update upstart
<dobey> ok
<dobey> long since? measurement of minutes? :)
<seb128> asac, refresh
<dobey> it was there ~2.5 hours ago when i last did an update :P
<asac> seb128: hmm. what do you have in your IP6 tab if you go to your auto linksys in connection editor?
<asac> just Ignore?
<seb128> asac, automatic
<seb128> and everything else in the tab is inactive
<asac> seb128: set it to "ignore"
<seb128> asac, do I need to restart something?
<asac> seb128: i would think no. if nothing changes: better safe than sorry ;)
<asac> i would just try after setting that to ignore and closing editor etc.
<seb128> still the same issue and same "(IP6 Configure Timeout) complete" in the log
<seb128> oh, worked now apparently
<seb128> asac, ok that works now thanks
<seb128> asac, weird, I don't think I ever set automatic in that tab
<asac> seb128: did you ever touch a connection?
<seb128> I did touch the "auto connect"
<seb128> but that's it
<seb128> I never touched the ipv6 config
<asac> sure.
<asac> seb128: want to file a bug: "nm-applet auto wireless connection IP6 method was automatically set to "Automatic" rather than Ignore"?
<asac> and post what you remember about when you modified your connection
<asac> i assume you modified it in jaunty last time=
<asac> ?
<seb128> yes or intrepid
<seb128> probably jaunty
<seb128> asac, I will not bother opening a bug, all my other onnections are on ignore, maybe I did touch it without noticing way back
<asac> hmm
<asac> ok
<seb128> I don't think a bug will be useful about the setting change
<seb128> what is the real bug is that setting to automatic breaks
<asac> i think its ok. if i see a duplicate i will remember that you already had that issue
<seb128> where it working before the update
<seb128> +was
<asac> seb128: IPv6 support was not really there before
<asac> i think a bug would be helpful as there might be buggy corner cases
<asac> we want to fix
<asac> but i can file that on my own
<seb128> asac, I will open one if you think that's useful
<asac> will first talk with other NM folks if they think it might be a consequence of some setting migration
<seb128> asac, I just avoid to flood the bug tracker about one time config changes from users nobody will ever look at ;-)
<asac> seb128: yeah. just the title from above + your vague memory when you edited that connection i what way
<mvo> rugby471: do you have anything pending? otherwise I'm going to upload now :)
<seb128> asac, ok, will do
<asac> seb128: sure. but wireless stopping to work is bad breakage
<mvo> rugby471: we have a impressive changelog again :)
<asac> better safe than sorry ;)
<rugby471> mvo: I am just making the gif spinner with the blue background colour, should be done in a minute
<asac> besides from this i havent heard of much wireless regressions ... so i am really eager to not let any chance of this slip through
<rugby471> mvo: hehe
<mvo> rugby471: sweet, many thnaks
<mvo> rugby471: do you have any idea how a effect like in bug #428414 can be prevented ? that the text flows so strange around the image?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 428414 in software-store ""Not available in the current data" message doesn't make sense / not displayed correctly" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/428414
<mvo> rugby471: I know the problem itself, that is fixable, but I'm not sure how to fix the html
<rugby471> mvo: not really, I havent looked at it
 * mvo really needs a html book :)
 * pitti points mvo to the awesome http://selfhtml.org/
<mvo> pitti: thanks, I shall have a look (after dinner :)
<seb128> re
<rugby471> mvo: 10 more minutes :-)
<mvo> rugby471: sure, I will just check in after dinner :)
<mvo> rugby471: so take your time :)
<rickspencer3> desktop team meeting in 1 min!
<rickspencer3> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-09-15
 * kenvandine is here
<pitti> o/
<rickspencer3> ArneGoetje, asac ccheney kenvandine pitti Riddell seb128 tseliot
<rickspencer3> hi all
<seb128> rickspencer3, hello
<ArneGoetje> Hi
<tseliot> hi all
<ccheney> hi
<rickspencer3> shall we begin?
 * rickspencer3 taps gavel
<rickspencer3> start with outstanding actions from last week
<rickspencer3> these are on the wiki, but wanted to mention a couple
<rickspencer3> ACTION: rickspencer3 to disuss piddin/empathy with seb128 and pitti and make call for Karmic
<pitti> done, I think
<rickspencer3> after much deliberation, we are not changing the Plan of Record
<seb128> did we discuss after meeting again?
<rickspencer3> # Empathy will be installed in new installs, pidgin won't be
<rickspencer3> # Empathy will be installed on upgrade installs, pidgin won't be removed
<rickspencer3> # Empathy will offer to import pidgin settings on first run
<asac> hi
<seb128> +1
<rickspencer3> pitti, seb128 - yes, I'm just publically announcing the deciscion, and marking the end of discussion on the matter
<rickspencer3> (until the next UDS ;) )
<kenvandine> :)
<rickspencer3> also ..
<rickspencer3> ACTION: pitti to try to repro x freeze and log bug
<pitti> A day of firm decisions!
<pitti> or is it?
<rickspencer3> pitti, shall we open it for discussion again?
<pitti> rickspencer3: done, freedesktop bug 23923
<rickspencer3> j/k
<ubottu> Freedesktop bug 23923 in Driver/intel "[945GM] X freezes some hours after suspend-to-RAM" [Major,New] http://bugzilla.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=23923
<rickspencer3> sweet
<rickspencer3> tseliot, did you see ^
<rickspencer3> is it in the intel blocker list?
<pitti> upstream assigned it to someone, but no response yet
<tseliot> rickspencer3: I'm about to upload a fix for mesa about it
<pitti> tseliot: ooh!
<pitti> so it's that one?
<tseliot> well, it should fix that and some other bugs
<pitti> I do get the occasional screen corruption as well
<tseliot> a kernel patch should be required too though
<pitti> but ctrl-l usually fixes it
<tseliot> pitti: it seems to fix that problem too
<rickspencer3> with x we are always one patch away from perfection ;)
<rickspencer3> see
<rickspencer3> :)
<tseliot> hehe
<pitti> so, I'll try andy's test kernel
<rickspencer3> tseliot, thank you for rocking the X stack
<pitti> and close the upstream bug if it fixes it
<rickspencer3> tseliot, what should folks do if they want to test the fix?
<tseliot> apw: was great too
<rickspencer3> yes, apw is made of awesome :)
<pitti> bug 429241 has a link to test kernels
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 429241 in xserver-xorg-video-intel "[GM45E] i915 graphics corruption and hang" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/429241
<tseliot> rickspencer3: if the chroot of my PPA wasn't broken you could try it: https://launchpad.net/~albertomilone/+archive/x-testing
<bittin> hi
<rickspencer3> tseliot, we need apw's kernel, and a new mesa, right?
<tseliot> and the kernel can be found here: http://people.canonical.com/~apw/lp429241-karmic/ (thank apw about this)
<tseliot> mesa is being uploaded by superm1 as we speak (slangasek agreed)
<rickspencer3> thanks tseliot
<rickspencer3> moving on ...
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, partner update?
<kenvandine> sure
<kenvandine> DX team is getting into a groove of weekly releases
<kenvandine> every thursday
<kenvandine> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopExperienceTeam/KarmicWeeklyReleases
<kenvandine> for a list of plans
<kenvandine> projects with no code changes (and none planned) won't have releases
<bittin> nice =)
<kenvandine> and u1 is about to unleash the cool pairing stuff for desktopcouch
<pitti> Thursday doesn't align well with our freezes, though (just FTR)
<kenvandine> couchdb was uploaded this morning with some oauth fixes
<kenvandine> pitti, ok... noted
<pitti> kenvandine: not a biggie, just saying
<asac> monday or friday sounds better
<kenvandine> so with the oauth features, we can enable that stuff in the related packages
<asac> though i see why those days were not picked
<kenvandine> desktopcouch, couchdb-glib (done) and bindwood
<seb128> not friday, not "break everything and run away for some days" uploads ;-)
<kenvandine> so hopefully this week we will be able to play with the cool stuff
<kenvandine> seb128, exactly :)
<kenvandine> but mondays and tuesdays are rough :)
<kenvandine> maybe wed...
<kenvandine> anyway
 * kenvandine is done
<pitti> kenvandine: should be fine; they release Thu, you package it, we sponsor/upload on Fri
<rickspencer3> lets take the "release day" discussion to UDS
<seb128> right
<rickspencer3> but for now, this is a huge success that there is a drum beat for their releases
<rickspencer3> thanks for making that work kenvandine, and seb128 too!
<kenvandine> :)
<seb128> you're welcome ;-)
<pitti> kenvandine: did you hear about an update about how to disable the system couchdb instance/init script?
<pitti> kenvandine: nevermind, let's discuss after meeting
<kenvandine> pitti, i know statik is working on it... i will follow up
<rickspencer3> we should discuss in the "bugs" section
<rickspencer3> moving on then, Riddell?
<rickspencer3> Kubuntu update
<Riddell> hi
<Riddell>  - KubuntuKarmicXsplash implemented
<Riddell>  - mostly set for alpha 6 but need to upload new python-qt4 to fix bug 428200
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 428200 in ubiquity "Installer crashed in set timezone" [Undecided,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/428200
<Riddell>  - jockey-kde doesn't seem to work until jockey-gtk is installed, need to investigate more
<Riddell>  - kmail has been patched for a mail deletion bug, going through testing
<Riddell>  - netbook taking shape quite nicely but won't have everything we want due to upstream change of plans and will have to be considered a tech preview for marketing
<Riddell> that's me
<rickspencer3> thanks Riddell
 * rickspencer3 waits for agenda to reload in browser
<rickspencer3> next is release status
<rickspencer3> two parts, bugs and work items
<rickspencer3> shall we discuss release targeted bugs first?
<pitti> sure
 * kenvandine thinks so
 * bittin thinks so to
<pitti> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/ReleaseStatus has some of them, too
<rickspencer3> k, I have a list of release targeted bugs assigned to our team on the wiki
<pitti> that has a summary of the ones on the release team radar
<pitti> please speak up if one of it is imprecise/outdated
<rickspencer3> pitti's list is better, actually, because of what he just said ;)
<pitti> rickspencer3: you have more, let's go through the missing one
 * seb128 has quite a list of desktop bugs on his list too
<pitti> s
<rickspencer3> I believe that ccheney is holding back on the OOo bug
<pitti> rickspencer3: I'll add the ones from your list to ReleaseStatus
 * kenvandine is glad to see 388898 as really fixed :)
<seb128> not sure if we should aim at having a list of all bugs we want to get fixed for karmic
<rickspencer3> because it would have kept ARM from building at all
<pitti> rickspencer3: I fixed 425793 two hours ago
<rickspencer3> sweet
<pitti> 223212> linux-firmware-nonfree is in the archive now, jockey stuff on my list (no blockers expected)
<rickspencer3> seb128, are you saying that you don't think we should, or you think we should?
<seb128> rickspencer3, I'm not sure how much you want to be flooded with individual todos
<ccheney> i plan on doing an upload ~ sunday/monday that should have that fix along with kubuntu fixes
<seb128> I mean I've quite a list of GNOME bugs to look at for karmic
<pitti> seb128: well, I'm using https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/ReleaseStatus for tracking blockers, etc., and use it for coordination
<seb128> I'm sure asac have a list for nm and firefox too, etc
<rickspencer3> seb128, right
<seb128> pitti, well my list would be at least 30 bugs
<rickspencer3> I think there is a list of bugs that the release team is driving us to fix
<seb128> ie what I aim to fix in the next month
<asac> nm bugs are fixed while we get them in. nothing really blocking
<rickspencer3> and everyone has a list of bugs that they will apply best effort on
<asac> firefox has a few hard ones. but nothing really critical
<pitti> right, that should be the "have to fix" list, not the "want to fix"
<seb128> well, "indicator-session is not translated"
<pitti> but indeed I don't think we can discuss the bug list a lot here
<seb128> or compiz set transparency on panels
<seb128> those sort of bugs
<pitti> except if someone says he can't work on something and we need to reassign
<rickspencer3> so, what I understood of the Ubuntu process, was that the "have to fix" list was determined by a combination of being targeted, and having a high or critical importance
<bittin> do something needs to be translated to Swedish?
<seb128> do you want to track those?
<pitti> seb128: I want to, and do, but I don't think we need to talk about all of them in the meeting
<rickspencer3> seb128, I track all of our bugs
<rickspencer3> but for this meeting, want to focus on the "have to do" list
<seb128> ok
<rickspencer3> seb128, are there bugs that you are worried about that we should discuss after the meeting?
<seb128> no, that was rather a general wondering
<rickspencer3> hopefully this pause isn't seb128 waiting for Launchpad to load up a huge list
<seb128> not really a meeting topic
<rickspencer3> :)
<seb128> let's discuss that off topic later
<rickspencer3> ok, so did everyone look at pitti's list, and the list of targeted bugs on the wiki?
<kenvandine> yup
<seb128> I've my GNOME list on track and I'm fine with it, I'm just not sure how much that should be shared
<seb128> yes
<rickspencer3> are there any red flags, in terms of work that can't/won't get done without some intervention
<rickspencer3> otherwise, I will assume that a bug assigned to you is on track to be fixed on time
<seb128> I'm not sure what to do with the empathy sounds issue
<pitti> bug 135548 is a bitch
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 135548 in gnome-power "Action on critical battery isn't triggered" [Unknown,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/135548
<asac> pitti: that one is fix released?
<pitti> and bug 401823 seems very fluffy, keeps being ping-ponged between upstreams
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 401823 in xlibs "(firefox:24993): Gdk-WARNING **: XID collision, trouble ahead - overeager XID caching" [Unknown,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/401823
<asac> oh that was upstream task
<pitti> asac: no, ubottu is lying
<asac> current statue of XID bug is "do not hide this too early" ... but most likely will get demoted
<asac> and maybe warning output patched out of gtk for the release version
<rickspencer3> pitti, I'm at a loss
<pitti> asac: it didn't really sound like a kitten killer to me
<rickspencer3> pitti, is this a data loss bug, or do users' computers go to sleep?
<rickspencer3> d'oh, it's set to medium
<rickspencer3> never mind, not even a "have to do"
<pitti> rickspencer3: problem is that it doesn't go to sleep, just runs on and on until the battery browns out
<pitti> anyway, I don't think we can do anything further here about the bug list
<pitti> I propose we review the blueprint list
<rickspencer3> ok, moving on to work items
<rickspencer3> pitti, do want to drive this part?
<pitti> sure
<rickspencer3> I copied open items to the wiki (except for firefox blueprint)
<kenvandine> which blueprint is the evo couch work item from?
<pitti> I do this in conjunction with https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/karmic/+specs?searchtext=desktop-karmic- sorted by delivery
<kenvandine> that is DONE
<pitti> I think we can safely DEFER the wine integration one now
<pitti> any objection?
<pitti> un-karmic-ed
<rickspencer3> pitti, noe
<pitti> desktop-karmic-input-methods
<pitti> ArneGoetje: do we have the upgrade fix now for the scim->ibus switch?
<ArneGoetje> pitti: I think so... for me it worked
<pitti> the rest looks uncritical for alpha/beta, but please do the annonucement/test plan, shouldn't take much time
<pitti> ArneGoetje: nice
<ArneGoetje> pitti: will do
<pitti>    desktop-karmic-network-ui
<pitti> asac: there's mostly QA/testing, but will the WEP dialog still land? or shall we defer?
<awe> pitti: the wep dialog changes were done by upstream
<pitti> kenvandine: "look at feedback from users at feature freeze and decide what to use for karmic" -> that's DONE, isn't it? can you please update the WI?
<kenvandine> sure
<asac> pitti: the applet changes will land in a few days upstream. we are working on it with high prio
<pitti> kenvandine: and "triage the empathy and telepathy bugs" sounds like a perpetual task, I think we should just drop that work item
<pitti> asac: rocking
<asac> not many. just a few nice things
<pitti> ArneGoetje: language-selector changes are as good as they will be for karmic?
<ArneGoetje> pitti: yes, still need some minor tweaks
<kenvandine> pitti, done
<pitti> ArneGoetje: the spec is at "Slow progress"; if the locale category split was deferred, I guess it should be a little further than that
<pitti> kenvandine: "get package into main and default installation" for evo couch sounds done?
<ArneGoetje> pitti: what status do you suggest?
<kenvandine> pitti, i marked it as done
<pitti> ArneGoetje: if the changes are by and large in, "beta avail"
<ArneGoetje> pitti: ok, sounds good
<pitti> ArneGoetje: if there's still substantial stuff missing, keep it
<pitti> rickspencer3: can you please ask TheMuso about "gnome-speech-replacement" in the eastern edition?
<pitti> I think that covers it
<rickspencer3> pitti, yes
<rickspencer3> ok, we just got a lesson in whip cracking, I think
<pitti> anyone has some blocking problems with their specs?
<seb1281> re
<pitti> lots of them are in "beta avail" which is good, but there might be remaining WIs which cause problems?
<seb1281> sorry some upgrade restarted my xorg session
<pitti> seb1281: mine as well; something in the upstartification :-(
<seb1281> and the system froze after login
<pitti> seb1281: apt-get -f install, there's probably a million unconfigured packages left
<seb1281> ie my laptop is rebooting, doing IRC from my netbook now
<seb1281> thanks
<rickspencer3> it's only going to get worse
 * pitti hands mike back to rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> thanks pitti
<pitti> thanks all for the heads-up
<rickspencer3> last item on the agenda ..
<rickspencer3> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/FindRightPackage
<pitti> oh, and @all: please update your WI states
<pitti> http://piware.de/workitems/desktop/karmic/report.html has the completion percentages
<tseliot> what does WI stand for?
<rickspencer3> the QA team and the community are putting together a plan to significantly change the mix of bugs reports with versus without ubuntu-bugs
<rickspencer3> tseliot, Work Item
<rickspencer3> tseliot, I don't think you have any :)
<rickspencer3> ok, so, ubuntu-bugs ...
<tseliot> rickspencer3: ah, ok, thanks
<rickspencer3> their concern atm is that have a complete page telling users how to use ubuntu-bugs
<rickspencer3> so looking at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/FindRightPackage
<rickspencer3> do we have the right packages documented in the right way?
<pitti> argh, this should drop all the "-p"
<asac> was there a reason to not keep the "-p" support with a warning for a while?
<asac> i ran into that today too :)
<pitti> rickspencer3: I add a stanza about storage devices, that has a very useful symptom script now
<pitti> asac: well, we did..
<asac> well. ubufox ran into it to be exact
<asac> hmm
<asac> ok
<asac> pitti: one or two cycles?
<pitti> asac: one, I think
<asac> ok if it already warned us in jaunty its fine i think
<rickspencer3> ACTION: rickspencer3 to remove "-p" from https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/FindRightPackage
 * asac should use it more frequently
<pitti> rickspencer3: too late, already done
 * pitti â¥ editmoin
<rickspencer3> ACTION: pitti to add section to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/FindRightPackage about storage devices
<rickspencer3> anything else?
<rickspencer3> seb1281, anything gnome related?
<seb1281> not really
<rickspencer3> ok
<rickspencer3> any other business?
<seb1281> no
<asac> anyone having 3g modem or phone might want to give current NM/modemmanager package a try
<asac> and report bugs ... especially if there are regressions
<pitti> asac: will do
<rickspencer3> asac, I have a 3g modem for verizon, what do you want me to do?
<rickspencer3> just dist-upgrade and try to connect?
<awe> asac: me too
<asac> rickspencer3: just try to use them
<asac> yes
<rickspencer3> will do
<asac> great
<asac> the more different modems we get tested now the more will work ;)
<rickspencer3> asac, ok
<rickspencer3> mine seems pretty popular in this area
<rickspencer3> any other business?
<rickspencer3> ok then
 * rickspencer3 taps gavel
<rickspencer3> thanks all!
<ArneGoetje> thanks
<pitti> thanks everyone
<seb1281> thanks
<tseliot> thanks
 * awe says good night from taipei
<chrisccoulson> hey seb1281
<ccheney> thanks
<seb1281> those updates closing running sessions are really annoying
<seb1281> hello chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> i just chatted to davidz about the GDU notifications, and he's already implemented an opt-out feature on a per-drive basis
<tkamppeter> thanks
<chrisccoulson> in the latest GIT
<seb1281> chrisccoulson: ah, nice
<chrisccoulson> but it depends on the latest DK-disks too
<seb1281> karmic+1 then I guess
<seb1281> or ffe request
<chrisccoulson> seb1281 - possibly - i don't know how much has changed in DK-disks recently
<seb1281> are the changes complicated ones?
<seb1281> pitti might know?
<chrisccoulson> perhaps pitti has been following it more than me. i've not looked at the other changes yet
<chrisccoulson> yeah
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I just checked yesterday, dk-disks head is trivial change compared to our release in karmic
<asac> thanks
<chrisccoulson> pitti - sounds good then. i'll have a look at the gdu changes compared to what we already have too
<pitti> chrisccoulson: except the "rework smart handling", which I rather not cherrypick, but seems unrelated
<chrisccoulson> i'll have a look and see if thats necessary for the gdu changes
<seb128> re
<seb128> ok, so Keybuk's changes lead to close running sessions after upgrades
<seb128> not nice
<chrisccoulson> pitti - it looks like the "rework smart handling" is part of the changes needed for GDU too
<Keybuk> seb128: no idea why
<Keybuk> seb128: if you can help with that, it'd be useful
<Keybuk> to me, it looks like X *crashes*
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i haven't dared to upgrade yet today;)
<Keybuk> I often lose keyboard and mouse first
<seb128> Keybuk, I would bet on dbus restarting rather but I could be wrong
<Keybuk> I'm not restarting dbus though afaict
<Keybuk> HAL does get restarted, but it did before
<Keybuk> likewise udev
<mvo> does someone has the cycles to look at a language-selector merge? lp:%7Earnegoetje/language-selector/language-selector-karmic/ into the lp:~ubuntu-core-dev/language-selector/ubuntu branch (just checking if it looks all ok)
<Amaranth> whoops, slept too long
<Amaranth> killed my cold though :)
<mvo> Amaranth: excellent!
 * mvo &
<pitti> chrisccoulson: ok, I think we can merge that, but not before alpha-6
<chrisccoulson> pitti - DK-disks right?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: right
<chrisccoulson> excellent. i'll take a look at GDU if you want then
<chrisccoulson> at least users will be able to opt out of the disk notifications then:)
<chrisccoulson> brb (hopefully, if my machine boots again!)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: excellent
<chrisccoulson> that didn't go very well!
<chrisccoulson> Keybuk - is "udevd[1001]: unknown key 'SYMLINK{unique}' in /lib/udev/rules.d/50-udev-default.rules:3" being displayed on startup anything to be particularly worried about?
<chrisccoulson> (the machine doesn't boot btw)
<Keybuk> no, it's nothing to worry about
<Keybuk> we're testing a GIT HEAD version of udev for upstream
<Keybuk> it has a few warnings that I'll sort out at plumbers with him next week
<chrisccoulson> hmmmm, that's the only thing displayed now :-/
<rickspencer3-afk> eeejay, O
<rickspencer3-afk> eeejay, I'm about to head to u-district to meet an old friend, at ...
<rickspencer3-afk> allegro
<eeejay> rickspencer3-afk, cool!
<rickspencer3-afk> eeejay, if you want to meet up, I'll be done talking to this guy around 2:30, maybe
<eeejay> rickspencer3-afk, neat, i might swing by, if I am in the area
<rickspencer3-afk> kewl
<seb128> Keybuk, still there?
<Keybuk> seb128: if you're quick
<seb128> Keybuk, it's "invoke-rc.d dbus force-reload" which creates the issue
<seb128> Keybuk, it seems to restart dbus
<Keybuk> oh, weird
<Keybuk> didn't it before?
<seb128> running "sudo invoke-rc.d dbus force-reload" do the same
<seb128> no
<seb128> I tried using startx
<seb128> and running nautilus
<lool> seb128: Hey, sorry it's late, LP #420238 is marked fix released but I cant find a corresponding upload, it it really the case?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 420238 in indicator-applet "indicator-applet-session crashed with signal 5 in g_main_context_dispatch()" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/420238
<seb128> nautilus exit because dbus restart
<seb128> gdm exit as well if you use it
<Keybuk> ahh
<Keybuk> thanks
<Keybuk> I'll dig into that
<seb128> lool, hey, if I'm on IRC no reason to be sorry to ping me ;-)
<Keybuk> should be a simple fix
<seb128> Keybuk, you're welcome, thanks
<seb128> lool, no idea it has been closed by tedg, ask him rather
<lool> seb128: Ok I saw you acted on the bug and thought you have sponsored it
<lool> tedg: Around?
<seb128> lool, let me look
<lool> tedg: LP #420238 is marked fix released but I just got it with up-to-date UNR image from today
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 420238 in indicator-applet "indicator-applet-session crashed with signal 5 in g_main_context_dispatch()" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/420238
 * tedg looking
<lool> I have version 0.1.3-0ubuntu1 in the live image and I got this error on startup
<lool> perhaps it's a subtly different crash and I can file a new bug if you like
<seb128> lool, yes it should be fixed, the commit is from 2 weeks ago and we did update that some days ago
<lool> seb128: Ok got a crash from virtualbox booting a fresh daily iso with latest versions so I think it's another bug in the same function
<lool> tedg, seb128: Just filed #430264 about that; thanks!
<seb128> lool, thanks
<lool> tedg: Also I got a popup saying FastUserSwitchApplet couldn't be loaded on startup (just before the indicator-session crash); I see some relevant errors in .xsession-errors
<lool> tedg: Would you mind having a look and telling me whether it's the same bug or another one?
<tedg> lool: Sure.
 * lool installs something to push .xsession-errors
<tedg> There was also the error with starting up Evo that was a dbusmenu issue.  I don't think that one's been packaged.
<seb128> no it has no but that one is an assert not a sigsegv
<tedg> Ah, yes.
<lool> tedg: http://paste.ubuntu.com/271680/
<seb128> bug #427819
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 427819 in dbusmenu "indicator-applet assert failure: ERROR:dbus-gproxy.c:2274:dbus_g_proxy_end_call_internal: assertion failed: (reply != NULL)" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/427819
<lool> tedg: So you can see ** (gnome-panel:3444): WARNING **: panel-applet-frame.c:1344: failed to load applet OAFIID:GNOME_IndicatorApplet (cannot get property bag):
<lool> tedg: and ** (gnome-panel:3444): WARNING **: panel-applet-frame.c:1344: failed to load applet OAFIID:GNOME_FastUserSwitchApplet (cannot get property bag):
<lool> and later apport starting
<tedg> lool: Yeah, honestly I have no idea how that stuff works, it's all libapplet magic...
<seb128> asac, any idea how I could get greasemonkey to work again? it's blocking bug triage for me
 * tedg doesn't even know where to buy a property bag
<lool> tedg: Ok so who would be the right person to work on this issue?
<tedg> lool: Uhm, I don't know really.  It seems to be something with starting up the applets... do you have other applets in your panel?
<lool> tedg: Yes
<lool> tedg: It's a regular gnome-panel
<lool> tedg: The default config in UNR
<lool> tedg: Do you guys do alphas testing?  Perhaps you can checkout the current UNR ISO up for testing in virtualbox?
<lool> tedg: On a second boot it didn't happen, got no error
<lool> So it looks like a race
<tedg> Second boot or second login?
<lool> tedg: Fresh boot of an UNR iso
<lool> no persistence
<lool> Just the same thing
<tedg> Oh, okay.  Hmm... which means depending on machine configuration it may or may not happen.
<lool> tedg: Yes, well I'd rather depending on timing
<tedg> I wonder if it's something starting up CORBA and the panel.  Is there some way to know whether they're the first applets to load or not?
<lool> tedg: I guess you can add debug to the panel or strace?
<lool> tedg: I can hand you the default gconf config which has the default applets
<lool> http://paste.ubuntu.com/271686/
<lool> /apps/panel/applets/applet_0/bonobo_iid OAFIID:GNOME_GoHome etc.
<tedg> They probably go in order... I would guess.
<tedg> lool: I don't see anything descriptive in gnome-panel.  Unsurprisingly, property_bag is NULL :)
<lool> seb128: Hey do you know why there are three evolution .desktop files?
<lool> evolution: /usr/share/applications/evolution-2.2.desktop
<lool> evolution: /usr/share/applications/evolution-mail.desktop
<lool> evolution-common: /usr/share/applications/evolution.desktop
<lool> tedg: Eh  :)
<seb128> one is a compatibility one for gnome-panel profiles using 2.2
<seb128> one is to start the previously used component
<seb128> and one always starts the mailer component
<lool> Ok
<seb128> there was some discussion about having several for the different components
<seb128> having one specific for the mailer or not, etc
<lool> seb128: I think it would be ok if the icons looked different
<seb128> but no really strong argument so we never changed it
<lool> Or were named more differently
<lool> For instance Evolution Suite versus Evolution Mail
<lool> seb128: The issue I just faced with UNR is the following: it comes with a default list of Favorites
<lool> I browsed to Internet and saw Evo, added it to Favorites and now it looks as if I'd have too of them
<lool> But one is actually Evolution Mail and Calendar and the other Evolution Mail
<tedg> seb128: Looks like we need all three of them: http://www.gnu.org/software/gettext/manual/gettext.html#Triggering
<lool> I think it's not trivial to discover for an end user
<lool> seb128: Or perhaps having one Calendar and one Mail entry in Office and one Mail entry in Internet?
<pitti> good night everyone
<lool> night
<seb128> re
<seb128> hey huats
<huats> hello seb
<huats> ...
<mpt> lool, the most thorough solution to that would be to split Evolution into separate programs :-)
<mpt> (but also the most difficult)
<mpt> The next most thorough and difficult would be to abolish the "Internet" category
<lool> Eh
<lool> mpt: I filed a bug on this; perhaps you share some short term insights?
<lool> Hmm why dont I see them
<mpt> Someone subscribed me to a bug report about the "Ibus Preferences" and now I'm depressed
<lool> haha
<lool> mpt: 430287 but seb128 duped it
<lool> which is why I couldn't find i
<mpt> so as long as your bug report doesn't have the same effect
<lool> it
<lool> mpt: Did you see karmic UNR already?
<mpt> Would be cool if Launchpad could say "But there are 2 duplicates that match your search, how about these:"
<lool> mpt: I filed a couple of bugs where I felt I needed a designer to tell what the right thing to do would be
<mpt> lool, I have not, I browsed the office last week for a computer running UNR and could not find one
<lool> mpt: e.g. 430270, 430289, and 430290
<lool> mpt: that's sad
<mpt> But our venturesome project manager has installed it, so I shall see it on Friday I expect
 * mpt mails himself about those bug reports
<lool> mpt: Thanks
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-09-16
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, robert_ancell - good morning
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, hey
<TheMuso> Hey guys.
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: Hope you haven't updated yet today.
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, not yet, problem?
<rickspencer3> you can tell we haven't because we are online
<robert_ancell> :/
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: see /topic in #ubuntu-devel.
<TheMuso> rickspencer3: I saw pitti ask you to ask me about gnome-speech replacement. Whats the deal there?
<rickspencer3> right
<rickspencer3> shall we go over the team meeting, Eastern edition?
<rickspencer3> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-09-15
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, robert_ancell , ready?
<robert_ancell> yes
<rickspencer3> ok
<TheMuso> sure
<rickspencer3> so first, reiterate the deciscion regarding Empathy vs. Pidgin
<rickspencer3> note that I consider this discussion closed
<rickspencer3> RESULT: we are sticking with the POR:
<rickspencer3>     * Empathy will be installed in new installs, pidgin won't be
<rickspencer3>     * Empathy will be installed on upgrade installs, pidgin won't be removed
<rickspencer3>     * Empathy will offer to import pidgin settings on first run
<rickspencer3> I am just stating this here for the record (again)
<rickspencer3> questions are fine, but we are committed to this course
<rickspencer3> questions?
<robert_ancell> how many important bugs remain before Karmic?
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, for Empathy and Pidgin?
<robert_ancell> Empathy
<rickspencer3> I can't answer that
<TheMuso> none for me, I just have to prepare myself for the backlash from blind users that think they have to have everything the way they want them or else... :)
<rickspencer3> there are none that are release target atm
<robert_ancell> ok
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, can they still use pidgin?
<rickspencer3> note my second point
<TheMuso> rickspencer3: Oh sure, but its not on the CDs by default, which is what they will get annoyed about/
<rickspencer3> also, we should capture their concerns as legitimate bugs and fix them as soon as is feasible
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, right
<TheMuso> Thats if they file them. The blind community are hopeless at bug filing.
<TheMuso> overall
<rickspencer3> I suppose this represents a significant regression, and they are probably entitled to be annoyed
<TheMuso> A few who do help out in that regard.
<rickspencer3> ok
<rickspencer3> I take these concerns very seriously ...
<TheMuso> Ok I appreciate that.
<rickspencer3> but I understand that Empathy is usable by blind users
<rickspencer3> just not convenient
<TheMuso> Right.
<TheMuso> Its usable, but not the point that pidgin is.
<TheMuso> to the point
<rickspencer3> in general, I think that blind users have the right to expect to use the same tools as other users
<TheMuso> As for gnome-speech replacement, I see the two work items I need to address, one which I can, and one which is ongoing.
<rickspencer3> so we should fix these issues asap
<TheMuso> Right.
<rickspencer3> ok, that's the next section
<rickspencer3> first, kenvandine gave the partner update
<rickspencer3> a big bug fix for couchdb came this week
<rickspencer3> and there are some complaints about the usability of the u1 client preference dialog
<rickspencer3> those will need a ui freeze exception to get fixed
<rickspencer3> not too much to report on Kubuntu front
<TheMuso> yeah read that
<rickspencer3> they seem pleased by their progress with the netbook
<rickspencer3> we talked a lot about bugs
<rickspencer3> neither of you have targeted bugs atm, so you are off the hook
<rickspencer3> then we talked about work items
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, this is where pitti mentioned you
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, you have two open work items regarding gnome-speech-replacement
<TheMuso> rickspencer3: Right.
<TheMuso> Make that one.
<rickspencer3> seems one is just writing the test plan and release notes
<rickspencer3> oops, wrong project, sorry
<TheMuso> np
<rickspencer3> go ahead, TheMuso , what's the status of these work items?
<TheMuso> in any case, the other is ongoing, and is not that easy. :)
<TheMuso> rickspencer3: Ok debugging pulseaudio output is still ongoing, and the promotion of packages to main is done.
<TheMuso> The whiteboard now reflects that.
<rickspencer3> ah
<rickspencer3> k
<rickspencer3> we were looking at these:
<rickspencer3>     * Promote speech-dispatcher and libdotconf to main: TODO
<rickspencer3>     * Debug speech-dispatcher's pulseaudio output support: TODO
<rickspencer3> so, the first is done
<TheMuso> yeah
<TheMuso> yes
<TheMuso> I just marked it as such.
<rickspencer3> and the second you just work on up to the bitter end?
<TheMuso> Indeed.
<rickspencer3> get as much done as you can?
<rickspencer3> okay
<rickspencer3> thanks
<TheMuso> np
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, any red flags? concerns? regarding pulsesaudio output support?
<TheMuso> Only that the upstrea author of the code has not been very helpful.
 * rickspencer3 nods
<rickspencer3> ok ..
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell,
<TheMuso> As he simply adapted, somewhat badly, the code from another project for speech-dispatcher.
<robert_ancell> pulse has been playing better for me the last few days
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: Great.
<rickspencer3> Update Compiz triaging instructions https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebuggingCompiz:
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, are you still going to do that for Karmic, or shall we postpone?
<robert_ancell> I will do that today
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, I didn't mean that to crack the whip
<rickspencer3> if it's not important, or can be done after the release
<rickspencer3> feel free to set it to postpone
<robert_ancell> :) No, it should be done and it wont take too long
<rickspencer3> ok
<rickspencer3> the great bulk of remaining items are related to firefox, and asac feels he has those under control
<rickspencer3> last topic was regarding this page:
<rickspencer3> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/FindRightPackage
<rickspencer3> the qa team is working to change the mix of bugs so that most of them come from ubuntu-bugs rather than the web interface
<rickspencer3> so we should have good instructions on this page to help with that goal
<rickspencer3> (which will benefit us dramatically)
<robert_ancell> cool
<rickspencer3> could both please look at that page and make sure:
<rickspencer3> 1. all the areas that have packages are covered
<TheMuso> right
<rickspencer3> 2. that coverage is accurate
<rickspencer3> in other words, make the instructions correct and complete
<TheMuso> right
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, I can't image this:
<rickspencer3> ubuntu-bug alsa-base
<rickspencer3> is terribly good advice these days ;)
<rickspencer3> though I could be wrong
<TheMuso> Audio is a difficult one, as there are many bits that are part of the stack. I need to think that over and see if I can come up with something better.
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, symptom based reporting script?
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, please discuss this possibility with pitti
<TheMuso> rickspencer3: I believe pitti and seb128 added support for audio, but I don't know how to call it.
<TheMuso> for symptom based reporting.
<rickspencer3> ACTION: TheMuso to check on how to call the audio symptom script and update the wiki accordingly
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, ok? ^
<TheMuso> fine by me
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, I wonder if "graphic environment" might be too broad
<rickspencer3> I think there is a symptom script for this ... but also, I wonder if we should try to tease out compiz issues?
<rickspencer3> ACTION: robert_ancell to check on Graphic Environment section
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, have time for this? ^
<robert_ancell> I'll have to ask Bryce but running everything through one point may actually be a good idea
<robert_ancell> yes
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, bryce is on leave ... but you can ask tselliot
<rickspencer3> his real name is Alberto, and he is virtual bryce for September
<robert_ancell> :)
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, robert_ancell any other business?
<TheMuso> No.
<robert_ancell> no
<rickspencer3> ok then
<rickspencer3> thanks for your time, as usual :)
<TheMuso> np
 * rickspencer3 taps gavel
<TheMuso> c/
<Keybuk> hmm
<Keybuk> xsplash is hanging around like an ex on facebook
 * ccheney notices thinkpad x200 are pretty cheap currently on the lenovo cpp site
 * ccheney thinks the new x210 will be coming out soon
<mac_v> Amaranth: hei , you up ? is Bug #391479 due to compiz ?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 391479 in update-manager "Child Windows [of Synaptic/update manager] should remain in the same desktop as the parent window" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/391479
<Amaranth> mac_v: I suppose it probably is since one person says it doesn't happen with metacity
 * Amaranth stabs gnome-power-manager
<mac_v> hm... testing it out
<mac_v> what's up with gpm?
<hyperair> many issues
<Amaranth> trying to see if jaunty's compiz has issues with suspend to see if a bug is in compiz or the intel driver but gpm won't recognize I unplugged
<hyperair> heh
<Amaranth> and it just took 15 seconds before it started doing a suspend manually
<mac_v> heh , gpm started giving my screen burn-ins!
<hyperair> burn ins?
<Amaranth> wtf
<Amaranth> it just woke up then suspended again :/
<hyperair> when i press my suspend key, my screen turns off instead of suspending
<mac_v> yeah! the screensaver didnt activate , so it was all nite with the same view!
<Amaranth> mac_v: you have a CRT?
<mac_v> LCD
<mac_v> hehe , when i suspend and resume everything freezes ;)
<Amaranth> "Your system encountered a serious kernel problem."
<Amaranth> oh, it's just a warning
<Amaranth> a little dramatic there
<mac_v> i like ubunut+1's new topic :)
<mac_v> " Topic for #ubuntu+1 is: Neither karmic nor the buildds are in a working state right now. "
<Amaranth> yep, buildds got hosed so packages were published that weren't actually finished building or something
<Amaranth> I'm afraid to reboot :P
<Amaranth> wait, I just did reboot...
<mac_v> \o/ me too
<Amaranth> I think that problem may already be fixed. Someone on the planet posted instructions for chroot'ing in and upgrading packages to get their system working again
<mac_v> i had to fight to get it to reboot , anyways i rarely shutdown ;p
<Amaranth> 3 suspends so far and no sign of this bug, this is bad news for me
<Amaranth> hehe, another "Your system encountered a serious kernel problem."
<mac_v> hm.. the fan warns me the BIOS is not recognized o.0 ! , is there a list or something for which is recognized?
<Amaranth> your fan talks to you?
<mac_v> ;) during boot
<Amaranth> I'm kind of excited, I finally get to use git bisect
<mac_v> acerhdf: unknown (unsupported) BIOS version Acer, inc./Aspire 5670     /v1.3219, please report, aborting!
<Amaranth> oh, yeah, that'll be a list of some kind
<superm1> Amaranth, the excitement wears off quickly after you realize how many times you have to compile to find the right commit :)
<mac_v> it sounds like "Danger Will Robinson"
<mac_v> ;p
<Amaranth> superm1: Yeah, I'm thinking of just rolling back suspicious commits manually
<Amaranth> it gets worse: the problem may be in a compiz-fusion plugin so I'll have to git bisect at least 3 git branches
<Amaranth> although I guess I can rule that out easily enough by disabling those plugins and trying to reproduce
<Amaranth> gpm is not seeing plug/unplug events at all
<mac_v> Amaranth: i think the synaptic/update manager bug i showed earlier is infact due to compiz , i switched the window manager to metacity and not probs 0.0
<Amaranth> why do we always have a "everything died, you can't boot and we can't build fixed packages" event near the end of development cycles?
<Amaranth> last one was libc6 finally getting updated and discovering the updated build flags we were using made it die
<Amaranth> that one nicely trashed the buildds too
<Amaranth> ah, this one was just an upstart problem
<mac_v> argh ! xsplash overrides the !"quiet" kernel option :(
<mac_v> hyperair: do you know the bug# for the Alt+f2 problem?
<mac_v> has it started working for you?
<Amaranth> 6 suspends with jaunty compiz without problems, 6 suspends with karmic compiz without problems
<Amaranth> This bug is either already fixed or just got a lot more annoying
<Amaranth> I so hope this bug is already fixed because I _really_ do not want to do more than 6 suspends on each bisect run :/
<Amaranth> ok, it's an intel bug
<Amaranth> kwin users have the same problem
<Amaranth> phew
<mac_v> hehe ;)
<Amaranth> mac_v: can you assign me to that update-manager bug instead of mvo?
<mac_v> sure
<Amaranth> I'm too frustrated with launchpad slowness to deal with it right now
<mac_v> Amaranth: also are you still having problems with the logout plugin?
<Amaranth> haven't gotten a chance to mess with it
<Amaranth> it's on the bottom of my compiz todo list tbh since it's just a little shine instead of a bug
<mac_v> yeah
<Amaranth> I'll try to take a look tomorrow though since a little more shine might help people ignore the 500 or so bugs open in compiz right now :P
<mac_v> hehe ;p .. also an FYI , i updated the latest karmic compiz , and no problems for me
<Amaranth> mac_v: the panel bug seems to only be easy to trigger on the guest session
<Amaranth> otherwise it is very intermittent
<Amaranth> unless you just meant fine in general :)
<mac_v> hrm... didnt try with guest session , let me try
<hyperair> mac_v: what alt+f2 problem?
<hyperair> mac_v: also, doesn't xsplash only start when X starts?
<hyperair> mac_v: my xsplash doesn't start until after usplash shows me all my messages
<mac_v> hyperair: the alt-f2 not working when panel has transparency
<hyperair> mac_v: sorry i didn't look into that any more, since i removed my panel's transparency (it's pseudo, not composited)
<mac_v> hehe ;)
<hyperair> :)
<hyperair> i've instead used compiz to match gnome-panel windows for transparency
<mac_v> hmm , my xsplash after the latest updates doesnt show the usplash messages , or maybe its due to the boot ppa !
 * mac_v should stop testing every ppa at the same time! :(
<hyperair> hahah
<hyperair> i remember sarvatt wrote a script for cleanly removing a PPA
<hyperair> you know, reset every package to the non-PPA package and so on
<mac_v> yeah thats for the xorg edgers , should look into that one :)
<mac_v> for now , i'v just pinned my boot ppa to a lower priority , so i wont get prompted for an update unless i choose \o/
<Amaranth> mac_v: xsplash isn't supposed to show those messages
<mac_v> :(
 * mac_v wants messages ... grr...
<Amaranth> iirc the idea is to start X as soon as possible and show a progress bar but if you need a password or something for encryption it flips back to usplash to ask then flips back to xsplash
<Amaranth> but xsplash doesn't show any messages
<mac_v> yeah
<Amaranth> since I don't have KMS that flip back and forth bit is rather annoying
<mac_v> ATI?
<Amaranth> intel but with KMS on I have no brightness control
<mac_v> crap the screen just blanke on me!
<mac_v> blanked*
<Amaranth> they need to port the various methods of changing the screen brightness from the xorg driver to the kernel
<Amaranth> right now you only get brightness control if your panel supports some ACPI standard or something
<mac_v> grr... more gpm testing!
<pitti> Good morning
<pitti> TheMuso: there's no symptom script for audio right now; would be great to get one, of course
<mac_v> pitti: morning  ... any idea where i could check for a recognized BIOS version? i get this error in my kernel log > acerhdf: unknown (unsupported) BIOS version Acer, inc./Aspire 5670     /v1.3219, please report, aborting!
<pitti> TheMuso: there's the beginnings of it in the totem package hook; I guess some of it can become part of the sound hook; even though it's just very coarse, it's already better than nothing
<mac_v> maybe it could solve the gspca module problem
<pitti> mac_v: hm, shouldn't that be displayed on boot, or in the bios setup?
<mac_v> no problem is displayed in the bios setup
<TheMuso> pitti: hrm ok.
<mac_v> but the fan does work without any problems
<robert_ancell> pitti, morning!  btw I made a BZR branch for gnumeric when I was working on that bug to cherrypick.  The gnumeric packing style is _very_ old
<pitti> robert_ancell: oh, sorry; I just did it yesterday
<pitti> robert_ancell: yeah, it's ancient
<robert_ancell> pitti, ok, I will merge it into the branch
<robert_ancell> pitti, oh, is there a reason why we don't update gnumeric to the latest version?
<Amaranth> people still use gnumeric?
<pitti> robert_ancell: it's not part of gnome, thus was just bound by the debian import freeze
<pitti> robert_ancell: (i. e. nobody cared to update it until FF)
<pitti> Amaranth: "still"? gnumeric is awesome
<pitti> I like it so much better than OO calc
<pitti> anyway, need to reboot, brb
<robert_ancell> Amaranth, hey
<Amaranth> robert_ancell: howdy
<pitti> ArneGoetje: hm, do you know why language-support-writing-fi stopped depending on openoffice.org-voikko and mozvoikko?
<ArneGoetje> pitti: yep
<pitti> ArneGoetje: I cleaned up http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/component-mismatches.txt now by explicitly seeding the ones which were previously pulled in through l-s-translations-*
<ArneGoetje> pitti: that dependency is now handled by language-selector and only if mozilla products or oo.o is installed for Finnish users
<pitti> and I'll remove the obosolete -zh sources
<pitti> ArneGoetje: ah, good to know; then I'll seed them
<seb128> good morning there
<ArneGoetje> pitti: but not the zh transitional package, right?
<seb128> Keybuk, thanks for fixing this upstart dbus restart issue ;-)
<pitti> ArneGoetje: I seeded the transitional binaries (we need them until after karmic+1)
<pitti> hey seb128
<ArneGoetje> pitti: yep
<pitti> ArneGoetje: but the old source packages for language-pack-gnome-zh etc. can go
<ArneGoetje> pitti: right
<Amaranth> seb128: you mean you like having your desktop working?
<seb128> Amaranth, my desktop was never broken, upgrades just started to close my sessions which is not the best hing
<seb128> thing
<Amaranth> ah
<Amaranth> only problem with upgrades I had was network manager dying and not coming back but it seems to start itself again now
<seb128> Keybuk, btw do you want to get bugs about your changes assigned to you?
<seb128> Keybuk, ie bug #430494
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 430494 in gdm "gdm upstart script fails to start gdm" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/430494
<ArneGoetje> pitti: is aplha6 through now?
<pitti> ArneGoetje: no, tomorrow
<Amaranth> pitti: would this be a bad time to upload something then? :)
<pitti> Amaranth: major bug fixes are okay
<pitti> but alpha-6 CDs are currently being built
<pitti> Amaranth: n-m> had that, too, seems fixed now
<Amaranth> I dunno how major it is but the fix for compiz making your panels invisible got reverted in the time between me telling mvo about it and him pulling a new git snapshot
<pitti> Amaranth: except after suspend, then I have to tick the "enable network" box manually
<ArneGoetje> pitti: could you do a code review for language-selector for me and push it into alpha6? Currently there are nasty bugs which can cause crashes and make l-s unusable. I have fixed them in my branch, but mvo didn't have time to review them yet.
<Amaranth> pitti: other way around for me, I tried to disable networking while doing suspend testing and it kept turning back on after resume
<pitti> ArneGoetje: no, I can't push it into alpha-6; CDs are being built now
<ArneGoetje> pitti: :(
<pitti> ArneGoetje: can you please mail me about the code review?
<ArneGoetje> pitti: sure
<pitti> we can upload it, but it's not guaranteed to go in
<Amaranth> I guess the compiz fix doesn't matter so much then if it can't make alpha 6 anyway
<seb128> Amaranth, lot of people don't use CD images but daily karmic updates
<ArneGoetje> pitti: I guess it would be enough if it's in the archive available as an update
<seb128> or rather most users install updates and will not be limited to CD testing
<pitti> ArneGoetje: *nod*
<Amaranth> I guess it's a good thing my patch for panel shadows is there since you can at least see the shadow of the panel and know it is running
<Laney> I'm finding that gnoe-terminal i dopping some ofmy kepresses
<Laney> is tis a known bug?
<Amaranth> seb128: Right, unless it was the beta
<Amaranth> Who is handling xorg bugs right now?
<seb128> Amaranth, tseliot
<Amaranth> ah, good timing then :)
<tseliot> Amaranth: what's up?
<Amaranth> tseliot: bug 422669 should probably have it's importance set to high
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 422669 in xserver-xorg-video-intel "[karmic] suspend to ram broken in kubuntu" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/422669
<Amaranth> I'd like to help with getting it fixed but I don't even know where to start on such things
<Amaranth> step 1: change the title :)
<Amaranth> it affects compiz too
<seb128> Amaranth, do you know about compiz decoration going away after suspend, resume?
<seb128> is that this issue?
<Amaranth> seb128: That's that bug
<Amaranth> All windows with RGBA visuals go invisible
<seb128> +1 to get it fixed for karmic ;-)
<tseliot> Amaranth: the latest mesa + apw's kernel should fix that
<Amaranth> I did about 20 suspends trying to reproduce it with various compiz package versions
<chrisccoulson> good morning everybody!
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson!
<tseliot> that bug is duplicate
<chrisccoulson> hey seb128
<Amaranth> Amusingly I couldn't reproduce it at all when I was trying but then did so right after I stopped trying
<Amaranth> mvo: good morning
<Amaranth> mvo: some bad news: between the time I told you about the invisible panel fix and you making a new snapshot my fix was reverted and an alternative was tried that doesn't work :/
<Amaranth> tseliot: Do you have a bug number for the original bug?
<tseliot> Amaranth: bug 429241
<pitti> tseliot: good morning
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 429241 in xserver-xorg-video-intel "[GM45E] i915 graphics corruption and hang" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/429241
<tseliot> pitti: good morning to you
<mvo> hey Amaranth - hrm, thats bad
<pitti> tseliot: I'm running latest mesa with andy's kernel now, suspended in the morning, and will now watch out for corruptions and freezes
<tseliot> pitti: thanks a lot. Let me know if something goes wrong
<Amaranth> tseliot: Are you sure that's the same issue? People in the other bug were talking about crashes and such but that was not the original issue the bug was about
<tseliot> Amaranth: yes, the two problems (which could show up separately) were part of the same problem
<Amaranth> tseliot: alright, will mark these as dupes of that one
<Amaranth> I have never had the GPU hang and cannot reliably reproduce even the missing windows so I'll take your word for it
<chrisccoulson> everybody managed to boot ok this morning then after the updates last night?
<tseliot> Amaranth: thanks
<Amaranth> It was nice to see that my system survived 20 rapid suspend/resume cycles though :)
<tseliot> :-)
<Amaranth> hrm, using two computers at the same desk at the same time is confusing
<Laney> the quick brown fox jumps over telzy dg
<Laney> I wonderhowIwould dbug this
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - would devhelp fall under the standing freeze-exception that exists for other gnome packages?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: bit of a borderline case, I think; how intrusive are the changes?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - not sure. i just noticed that its quite out of date
<chrisccoulson> i was just looking for stuff to update:)
<pitti> oh, we synced that from Debian
<pitti> they just have 0.23.1-1
<pitti> so that shuold probably be safe to sync
<seb128> that being?
<pitti> seb128: devhelp
<seb128> oh, right
<Amaranth> chrisccoulson: it's not really that far out of date, 0.23.1 is the latest stable release and 0.27 is a development release, I guess
<Amaranth> err, 2.27
<Amaranth> so definitely development
<chrisccoulson> ah, ok. 0.23 isn't that old then. it's just the version numbers that are misleading now upstream have a 2.27.92 release
<Amaranth> maybe if they stick to the GNOME release schedule we can get development versions in karmic+1 :)
<seb128> james_w, pitti: is bug #425792 a duplicate of bug #403192?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 425792 in devicekit-disks "update-notifier crashed with SIGSEGV in gdu_device_get_object_path()" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/425792
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 403192 in devicekit-disks "update-notifier crashed with SIGSEGV in gdu_pool_get_devices()" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/403192
<seb128> see bug #422392 from keescook too
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 422392 in devicekit-disks "devicekit-disks (and devicekit-power) need to be stopped when new package is installed" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/422392
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson: why have you regenerated aclocal.m4 for transmission?
<asac> hmm ... took me 20 resumes to get my computer up
<chrisccoulson> kklimonda - it's regenerated automatically by autoreconf
<chrisccoulson> because there is a patch that touches the build system
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson: maybe we could just inject launchpad-integration into Makefile.in instead?
<kklimonda> ya, I've made it myself and that's why I'm asking ;)
<chrisccoulson> kklimonda - we prefer not to manually edit Makefile.in, because it can get difficult to maintain doing that
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson: what happens if we don't apply 99_autoreconf.patch? spare me a free rebuilt :)
<chrisccoulson> it's much easier to patch Makefile.am and then regenerate Makefile.in
<kklimonda> ya, that was my understanding
<chrisccoulson> kklimonda - if you don't apply that patch, the launchpad-integration won't work
<chrisccoulson> it only worked before because there was a debian/rules hook to run autoreconf in the build system. but with desktop packages, we tend to regenerate it before uploading
<chrisccoulson> some people have different opinions on how to do it though ;)
<kklimonda> I see, i see
<kklimonda> so instead of using autoreconf I should regenerate it myself?
<kklimonda> it seems to be more work but maybe that's just me
<asac> Keybuk: any ideas how i can best upstream the upstart init script? can we detect during build time
<asac> if upstart version is high enough?
<asac> anyone already rebooted after upstart upgrade?
<asac> ;)
 * asac scared about turning off this system
<seb128> I did yesterday
<asac> seb128: greasemonkey is still dead?
<chrisccoulson> kklimonda - you still use autoreconf, but the changes go in to a patch (99_autoreconf) in this case
<asac> seb128: thought it worked after you installed it in profile ;)
<seb128> asac, the one installed via firefox says that it doesn't work with the current version
<seb128> asac, well the error I got before restart came back a bit after restart and disabled it
<seb128> the version not supported one
<seb128> which is weird because it was working for a bit
<asac> seb128: did you uninstall the package?
<seb128> yes
<seb128> I tried to reinstall it yesterday after uninstalling the web one
<seb128> but it's not listed
<asac> hmm
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson: ~1mb 99_autoreconf is considered normal?
<seb128> which is weird because the bug has been closed saying the new version should be working
<asac> seb128: so after uninstalling package and uninstalling from firefox you were in a state where greasemonkey was completely gone?
<seb128> kklimonda, diffstat it to be sure there is no cache there
<seb128> asac, yes
<kklimonda> :*
<chrisccoulson> kklimonda - did you delete all the cruft from it? (autom4te.cache)
<seb128> asac, then I did sudo apt-get install greasemonkey but that didn't make it listed again
<asac> seb128: so you have the package installed again?
<asac> hmm
<asac> poor seb128
<seb128> asac, I'm back to epiphany meanwhile
<seb128> I need stock replies to triage bugs
<asac> yeah
<seb128> dunno how you handle those without stock replies ;-)
<seb128> it's so quicker to click on a "need info" button
<seb128> or "need stacktrace"
<asac> you know my approach to bugs ;)
<seb128> hehe
<asac> i had script ones ... those were even better than stock replies
<seb128> anyway I would appreciate if you bumped this greasemonkey fixing if that's not only me having the issue
<asac> seb128: but actually. since we debugged it i always have your stockreplies ;)
<seb128> I expect that will impact on the team efficiency
<seb128> I know pedro use those a lot too
<asac> seb128: i havent heard of anyone else having issues to be honest
<seb128> ok, weird
<asac> anyway. at least the package should get a regular maxversion bump
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson: yes.. I get lots of changes in configure scripts..
<asac> will prioritize this now that main is frozen
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson: 20 files changed, 6387 insertions(+), 14382 deletions(-) vs 19 files changed, 1241 insertions(+), 2324 deletions(-) in your patch
<chrisccoulson> that seems quite a lot :-/
<seb128> happens easily when using different versions than upstream to do the update
<seb128> that's not an issue
<seb128> you can try running the same version of automake etc for the update to lower that
<Amaranth> You guys have stock replies in a greasemonkey script?
 * Amaranth dies
<Amaranth> gimme!
<kklimonda> btw, is it just me or is xplash similar to fedora's previous bootsplash that used X? I mean - won't we have similar problems with that (for example long start) ?
<Amaranth> I went through 200 bugs once copy/pasting stock replies from the wiki before giving up on the idea
<kklimonda> :0
<kklimonda> :)
<asac> Amaranth: http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/bugtriage.user.js ;)
<Amaranth> kklimonda: No, rhgb started an X server just for the boot splash then killed it and started another one for you to login
<pitti> Amaranth: they are awesome
<Amaranth> kklimonda: xsplash runs as a part of gdm so when it finishes you'll looking at a gdm login window
<pitti> Amaranth: https://launchpad.net/launchpad-gm-scripts
<pitti> there's also a PPA of a packaged version, etc.
<kklimonda> Amaranth: ach, that's why I haven't seen so much flickering :)
<seb128> tseliot, where should crashes in nvidia libGL in karmic be reassigned?
 * Amaranth has been pushing them to nvidia-glx-180
<Amaranth> although I probably should have remembered which ones I did so I could mark dupes, I'm sure there were a few
<seb128> Amaranth, https://edge.launchpad.net/launchpad-gm-scripts has a better version
<seb128> mine is a old custom one
<seb128> their one has button to add stock replies, etc on the webpage
<seb128> so you can edit those easily
<seb128> but it didn't work in epiphany so I kept using my old one ;-)
<Amaranth> is software-sources supposed to add the PPA gpg key when you add a PPA?
<seb128> mvo_, ^
<seb128> Amaranth, http://bazaar.launchpad.net/%7Egm-dev-launchpad/launchpad-gm-scripts/master/files
<Amaranth> yeah, I'm going to have to grab the file since my greasemonkey is from amo
<kklimonda> cccCCCCC
<kklimonda> oops, sorry
<Amaranth> oh, it doesn't depend on the greasemonkey package
<mvo_> Amaranth: yes, add-apt-repository ppa:compiz should add the key as well
<Amaranth> mvo_: alright, was about to start looking up how to add it manually again :)
<Amaranth> and this greasemonkey launchpad stuff is _so awesome_
<Amaranth> I suddenly feel like doing a bunch of bug triage
<Amaranth> wow, it even has one for valgrind
<mac_v> pitti: hi... how do i request a UI freeze exception? i just subscribe the ~ubuntu-release team to the bug and add a comment about why this needs an exception, right?
<pitti> mac_v: right, and also tell the doc team, to update screenshots etc.
<mac_v> hmm.. , ok
<pitti> (if they have some)
<pitti> mac_v: usually it should be enough to subscribe them to the bug and get their ack there
<mac_v> pitti: i dont think this  , Bug #409828 , needs the doc team..
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 409828 in empathy "Empathy shows wrong icon for notifications" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/409828
<mac_v> well anycase , i'll just subscribe them :)
<mvo_> Amaranth: have you talked to maniac yet about the revert?
<pitti> mac_v: should be fine, yes; but still better to sub them
<Amaranth> mvo_: just via email, no reply yet
<mvo_> Amaranth: cool, thanks
<Amaranth> mvo_: since it won't get into alpha 6 anyway I figure we can afford to wait a bit and see if he can figure out what he would consider a proper fix
 * mvo_ nods
<seb128> does anybody get nothing on screen when booting with the newer linux version in karmic?
<tseliot> seb128, Amaranth: nvidia-graphics-drivers-180
<seb128> tseliot, thanks
<seb128> I've reassigned to the glx package for now
<seb128> will do that for the next one
<tseliot> seb128: ok, thanks
<Amaranth> seb128: if it's following what the ubuntu-boot packages were doing you're not supposed to see anything until xsplash
<seb128> I tried -190 and -185 but launchpad said those were not published in ubuntu
<Amaranth> usplash will only show up if you need to put in a password or a fsck is running
<seb128> Amaranth, not doing something for over 30 seconds = very confusing
<Amaranth> seb128: well X is supposed to start faster than that :)
<seb128> I wonder how people can think that's a good idea
<Amaranth> it's more like 10 seconds or so for me
<seb128> well it's not
<seb128> I've a slow laptop drive
<Amaranth> I think Keybuk probably wants to make sure it is working like planned but will probably turn usplash back on for karmic if it doesn't get fast enough
<Amaranth> seb128: I have a 5400rpm drive too
<seb128> it's weird that it happens only with the new linux image
<seb128> ie if I pick the previous one usplash is used
<Amaranth> seb128: update-initramfs only updates the current kernel
<seb128> shouldn't the initramfs be the same or updated for all images on upgrade?
<Amaranth> seb128: if you force it to update all of them usplash will go away there too
<seb128> hum ok
<Amaranth> I think an update to initramfs updates all of them but updates to things in the initramfs only update the current one
<seb128> I'm wondering how many people will think their machine crash and do ctrl-alt-del before getting xsplash
<Amaranth> but maybe they all just update the current one which would make sense if you want to use the old one if something goes wrong
 * tseliot can't even see the gnome-panel if he enters GNOME with nvidia. The xterm session works well though
<Amaranth> tseliot: do you see the shadow for the panel?
<tseliot> Amaranth: no, sometimes I see an empty panel at the top
<Amaranth> ah
<tseliot> but that's it
<Amaranth> I tend to get an empty panel when gpm is acting up
<Amaranth> Until gnome-panel either gives up on gpm or gpm starts working
<seb128> xsplash starts around 32.8 seconds on this bootchart there
<tseliot> I don't get anything else though
<Amaranth> seb128: ouch
<seb128> and that's a 7200rpm drive
<seb128> ie not the slowest disk you can get
<Amaranth> seb128: that sounds like a bug
<seb128> hum compiz decorator crashed again right now
<Amaranth> seb128: it's more like 15 seconds for me with a 5400rpm drive and sreadahead not actually working
 * Amaranth wonders if anyone ever figured out what "exe" was in bootchart
<Amaranth> stalls my boot about 4 seconds doing a crap load of IO before sreadahead can even start
<Amaranth> seb128: is this something you can reproduce or get a lot?
<seb128> Amaranth, what? the compiz issue? or the boot one?
<Amaranth> compiz
<seb128> looking at bootchart I've seen only it's as slow for other people
<seb128> ie on pitti's one xorg starts after 35 seconds
<seb128> xsplash is around 45s in boot
<Amaranth> pitti seems to have an overall terrible boot time as well
<Amaranth> heck with a clean install of jaunty my boot time was floating between 14 and 17 seconds so I thought my karmic times were terrible
<Amaranth> then I see yours :P
<Amaranth> jcastro is booting in 4 seconds though
<pitti> yeah, grub->gdm is 65 seconds
<pitti> before the upstartification it was 50
<Amaranth> If you want better boot times steal his laptop at UDS :P
<seb128> one minute of no screen = computer crashed for most users
<seb128> http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/seb128-laptop-karmic-20090916.png
<seb128> is my current bootchart
<Amaranth> seb128: Like I said, I'm sure Keybuk won't leave usplash disabled for karmic, it's just a part of testing
<pitti> seb128: I think it's now missing to load the fbcon module
<pitti> so that you don't have text consoles with KMS
<seb128> going through the udev calls and disk mounts takes almost 15 seconds
<Amaranth> Yeah, it should at least show the couple of errors messages from the kernel everyone seems to get
<seb128> pitti, ah ok
<pitti> seb128: I asked Scott about it
<seb128> alsactl = 5 seconds
<pitti> for me the screen goes to standby during boot
<seb128> xorg = 7 seconds
<Amaranth> wow, you must have some crazy hardware
<seb128> pitti, seems to do the same there
<pitti> with everything starting in parallel, stuff just trashes
<seb128> Amaranth, dell d630
<Amaranth> that's a lot of calls to blkid and modprobe at the start
<pitti> hard disks just aren't fit to load things in parallel
<Amaranth> and you don't seem to have sreadahead
<seb128> with a 7200rpm drive and some gigas of ram
<pitti> Amaranth: I do
<seb128> ii  sreadahead                                 1.0-3~boot3                                      Read required files in advance during boot
<Amaranth> seb128: Oh, I see it now
<Amaranth> seb128: but it must not have any profile data because it only runs for about half a second
<Amaranth> probably less than that
<seb128> Amaranth, it's installed for ages so that's weird
<seb128> and I did reboots without changing packages today
<Amaranth> pitti: ideally with sreadahead and careful ordering of startup tasks you could minimize the disk abuse
<Amaranth> seb128: yeah, sreadahead seems broken in general so it's not surprising
<Amaranth> for me sreadahead runs for the entire boot but never shows any IO or CPU usage
<seb128> still I'm surprised you manage to get so fast loading
<Amaranth> seb128: http://img193.imageshack.us/img193/9544/travislaptopkarmic20090.png
<Amaranth> in that boot "exe" stalls things even longer than my latest chart actually
<Amaranth> oh, that was before the "make it faster" bits landed
<seb128> Amaranth, it takes you around 25 seconds to have xorg running though
<seb128> not 15
<Amaranth> right, that's out of date
<Amaranth> that was before usplash went away
<Amaranth> seb128: http://img34.imageshack.us/img34/9544/travislaptopkarmic20090.png
<Amaranth> hmm, you know what, xsplash didn't even load
<seb128> you have a fast disk
<seb128> it tops to 37meg/s on the chart
<seb128> mine is a 7200rpm and top at 15meg/s
<Amaranth> guess I assumed it was just broken when I saw my mouse cursor
<Amaranth> seb128: 7200rpm should be more like 50MB/s in a benchmark
<Amaranth> my disk is only 5400rpm
<seb128> well it's not
<seb128> see my chart
<seb128> 15mb/s
<Amaranth> right, that's a problem with the boot, not your disk
<Amaranth> seb128: sudo hdparm -t /dev/sda
<Amaranth> actually mine is saying 50MB/s...
<Amaranth> \
<seb128>  Timing buffered disk reads:  160 MB in  3.03 seconds =  52.88 MB/sec
<Amaranth> so it should be about as good assuming your disk has a good cache and decent seek times
<Amaranth> but it is a dell so it probably has the worst you can get for both of those... :P
<seb128> lol
<seb128> in any case let's see where it goes
<pitti> mine is 22 MB/s :-(
<seb128> pitti, do you know if there is a bug about the screen being cut on current karmic?
<pitti> seb128: "cut"?
<seb128> <pitti> for me the screen goes to standby during boot
<seb128> ^ that
<pitti> ah
<seb128> it does the same there, I did boot an old image
<pitti> seb128: I asked Scott about it, waiting for his response
<seb128> ok
<seb128> at least he fixed the upstart restarting dbus which restarted all sessions this night ;-)
<Amaranth> seb128: it looks like if you delete /var/lib/sreadahead/pack and reboot it should generate a new profile
<Amaranth> that's what the monthly cron job does anyway
<seb128> the pack there has been updated yesterday
<Amaranth> weird
<Amaranth> heh, it also looks like all 6 bugs open against sreadahead are the same bug
 * tseliot 's gnome-session is busted. Xfce works great...
<seb128> tseliot, how busted?
<pitti> tseliot: ATI?
<tseliot> pitti: nvidia
 * pitti just stumbled over bug 423415 when testing the live system on wife's computer
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 423415 in xserver-xorg-video-ati "Ati driver issues when logging into desktop" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/423415
<Ng> sweet, suspend works again \o/
<Ng> didn't lock my screen though, hmm
<tseliot> seb128: I log in and I can see Ubuntu's default background after the splash screen
<tseliot> seb128: nothing else
<pitti> Ng: the mesa fix?
<seb128> tseliot, gconftool-2 -R /desktop/gnome/session
<Ng> pitti: I think it may have been, yeah. on resume I'd mostly just have a locked display
<seb128> tseliot, could you run that and copy on pastebin?
<Ng> but I couldn't always even persuade it to actually suspend, which was odd, sometimes it would just do... nothing
<tseliot> seb128: sure
<Ng> err, s/locked/hung/
<tseliot> seb128: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/271994/
<seb128> tseliot, that looks correct, not this issue then
<tseliot> pitti: the mesa fix simply corrects a calculation where the size of the delta of the buffer object was bigger than the whole object
<seb128> tseliot, if you run gnome-session by hand is an anon GNOME login does it work?
<Ng> did upstream remove the ability to disable bluetooth adapters from the applet?
<tseliot> seb128: I can try
<Amaranth> Ng: iirc it now requires something else
<Amaranth> in the kernel or a dbus service or something, don't remember
<Ng> Amaranth: oh, could be, bluetooth-properties says "Could not open RFKILL control device, please verify your installation"
<Amaranth> ah, yep
<tseliot> pitti: oh and the fix affected only intel (/src/mesa/drivers/dri/i965/brw_wm_surface_state.c)
<Amaranth> Ng: http://mail.gnome.org/archives/desktop-devel-list/2009-July/msg00212.html
<Ng> Amaranth: aha, so this is a permissions issue. I have /dev/rfkill, it's just root:root 644
<Amaranth> Ng: udev to the rescue!
<Ng> hehe
<Amaranth> (please file a bug :)
 * Ng looks fo... :)
<Amaranth> Ng: thanks for reminding me about that, should save me some battery life
<Ng> heh. I'd slightly forgotten about it because I'm using bluetooth a lot for internet access atm, but when I have a real connection again I'll want the battery life too ;)
 * Ng can't find a bug, so files one.... against udev?
<Amaranth> yay 55 wakeups a second
<Amaranth> and most of that is wireless
<Ng> nice
<Ng> ok, filed as bug #430622
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 430622 in udev "Relax permissions on /dev/rfkill?" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/430622
<tseliot> seb128: I think you can ignore xfce warnings. I launched gnome-session from the xterm session: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/272000/
<seb128> tseliot, it seems a "compiz is crashing xorg" issue
<seb128> it does the same on my ati card
<Amaranth> down to 18 wakeups a second if I turn off wifi and unplug my mouse :)
<seb128> does your session crash? ie back to gdm?
<Amaranth> tseliot: nvidia bug
<tseliot> seb128: is there a gconf key that I can use to make sure that compiz is disabled?
<Amaranth> we used to have a failsafe GNOME session for just that reason but...
<pitti> seb128: do you know a better bug for the ati crash than 423415?
<seb128> tseliot, change /desktop/gnome/session/required_components/windowmanager
<tseliot> seb128: no, it doesn't. It doesn't allow me to do anything else and I have to restart X
<tseliot> Amaranth: it used to work with the same driver
<Ng> Amaranth: huh, I didn't realise that gnome power manager can display wakup info now too
<Amaranth> I don't even see compiz giving any errors
<Amaranth> tseliot: If X crashes it's X or the driver
<seb128> tseliot, could be bug #419126
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 419126 in mesa "X fails to start up after mesa+git update - gdm loops after logging in" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/419126
<tseliot> Amaranth: it doesn't crash X
<tseliot> seb128: and it also happened before the upgrade to the latest mesa
<davmor2> pitti: all the logs in the bug are the ones that bryce asked for
<Amaranth> tseliot: the only other reason I can think of everything would suddenly fail to connect is if something used up all the available X connections
<seb128> tseliot, right, I'm looking for a bug, it was already there a week ago
<Amaranth> but that something would have to spawn like 500 windows
<tseliot> Amaranth: heh, there's no reason why that should happen when the session starts
<Amaranth> compiz opens one as a child of the root window so apps can get the WM name and one for each window you have open so...
<davmor2> seb128: the ati bug start the day the ati driver was update.  Just before the release of alpha 5 for me
<Amaranth> yeah
 * tseliot tries to log in with metacity instead of compiz
<Amaranth> Ng: ha, gnome-power-manager causes most of the wakeups when I have it showing wakeups :P
<seb128> tseliot, bug #426159
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 426159 in xorg-server "Xserver crashes when logging in" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/426159
<Ng> Amaranth: haha
<Amaranth> due to updating the screen so much
<tseliot> seb128, Amaranth: using metacity seems to solve the problem. So it has to be compiz
<seb128> tseliot, that was the same issue
<Amaranth> tseliot: X crash can't be a compiz issue
<seb128> tseliot, well, compiz crashes the x server, but that's a driver or xorg issue
<seb128> whatever compiz is doing xorg should not crash
<tseliot> Amaranth: well, X didn't crash. I could still move the mouse pointer and even see the xsplash animation. No trace of it in the log
<seb128> tseliot, use #419126
<Amaranth> as far as what compiz is doing there was only one core change I can think of that would even affect rendering (and thus the drivers) and that was to fix a memory leak with DRI2
<Amaranth> tseliot: but the log you posted shows X crashing...
<seb128> tseliot, are you sure? can you put your /var/log/Xorg.0.log.old online?
<Amaranth> or getting stuck in an infinite loop
<tseliot> unless X is trapping useful information
<Amaranth> but if that was the cause I don't think the mouse would move
<Amaranth> no, that's a lie, there are times X gets wedged like that and the mouse still moves
<cassidy> seb128, hi. I'm aware that's probably a hot topic, but is there discussion to revert to the old behaviour regardind icons in menu and buttons in Ubuntu ?
<cassidy> Empathy looks completely shit without icons
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - do you want to subscribe desktop-bugs to libgdata bugs? one of the issues raised in the MIR was that it doesn't have anybody looking at that package yet?
<Amaranth> cassidy: empathy should be fixed to show icons where they are appropriate
<seb128> cassidy, that's a GNOME decision I'm not aware of any move to revert since mpt was in favor of that
<seb128> chrisccoulson, sure
<cassidy> Amaranth, it doesn't display them. But that's fugly
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - thanks
<cassidy> for example in context menu there is still the space of the icon
<cassidy> but nothing in it
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I doubt anybody read all the desktop bugs though so that makes virtually no difference but if some people feel better
<Amaranth> I'd really like to see some icons in the System menu though...
<seb128> cassidy, bug #407621
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 407621 in libgnome "(design decision) Icons missing from context menu , dialogue buttons , firefox bookmark favicons" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/407621
<Zdra> seb128, the problem is nobody made fuzz about it, I was warned about Empathy being shit yesterday...
<seb128> cassidy, feel free to comment there or to talk to mpt
<cassidy> seb128, I know, was just wondering about the Ubuntu position regarding this decision
<Zdra> seb128, really, ubuntu should revert to default
<Amaranth> cassidy: yeah, there are plans to change GTK+ to not leave that gap when it is configured to hide most icons
<seb128> cassidy, mpt was one of the drivers for the change
<tseliot> seb128: http://paste.ubuntu.com/272005/ (the ddxSigGiveUp took place when I restarted X)
<Amaranth> Zdra: The default is no icons
<Zdra> seb128, that something that needs at least one cycle with all maintainers warned
<seb128> ie the canonical design team seels to agree
<Zdra> Amaranth, I meant old default
<seb128> Zdra, right I agree they didn't communicate properly about that and I told it to vuntz and some other rt people by then too
<Zdra> seb128, IMO it's not a question of good or bad, it is just that they made that without telling anyone and that result to crap applications because we didn't had time to fix them
<seb128> Zdra, we might change back before karmic to fix it for next cycle
<Amaranth> the only missing icon that annoys me all the time is totem not showing the icon for the show button
<Zdra> seb128, that would be wize
<cassidy> yeah if the change is good or not it's not the problem (for now). But it has been done in a shitty way in GNOME
<Amaranth> Zdra: It was talked about a lot on d-d-l
<cassidy> I discovered the result when switching to Karmic this we
<seb128> I told so to andre and vuntz
<cassidy> Empathy was looking related
<seb128> Amaranth, there was no announce describing what to do though
<cassidy> retarded :p
<Zdra> Amaranth, Some maintainers have a live outside GNOME and don't read all of ddl
<Amaranth> seb128: there was, about 20 replies into the thread about it on d-d-l :P
<seb128> I asked mccann to write an email about that to d-d-l, he said he would be never did
<seb128> Amaranth, the discussion was a flame about the change
<Amaranth> I know, I was joking with that one
<seb128> Amaranth, not a "applications should set the always show property for object, objects being ..."
<Amaranth> although there was a discussion about the change too
<Amaranth> I believe the metacity maintainer started the whole thing
<seb128> well, nobody announced maintainers they have to review their icon use
<seb128> that was just discussed as a setting change
<Zdra> seb128, see http://mail.gnome.org/archives/desktop-devel-list/2009-September/msg00086.html
<seb128> Zdra, thanks
<seb128> tseliot, oh, you are using an nvidia card?
<seb128> tseliot, so it's not the same as the ati bug ;-)
<seb128> tseliot, do you get the issue using nv?
<Amaranth> r600 reports it isn't using the software renderer?
<Amaranth> didn't think r600 3d support was that far along
<tseliot> seb128: no, it works well with nv (which doesn't work with compiz)
<Amaranth> at beta time someone should open a bug for each pciid that compiz makes X crash for so we can fill up the blacklist
<Amaranth> crappy fix but we've had to do it before
<tseliot> Amaranth: weird, maybe it's because of the latest mesa
<tseliot> mesa/drm
<Amaranth> tseliot: yeah, seems we have enough new mesa/drm to get 3d support that instantly crashes X
<Amaranth> going to be a PITA blacklisting every single Radeon HD card
<Amaranth> probably easy to make mesa/drm claim to not support any acceleration on those
<Amaranth> easier*
<tseliot> Amaranth, pitti, Ng: I think the -ati driver is still using xaa. Maybe I should have a look at some X logs
<Amaranth> oh man, I hope not
<Amaranth> I think the X patch to disable XaaNoOffscreenPixmaps was dropped when intel stopped using XAA
<Amaranth> I was about to drop the corresponding patch to trigger that from compiz
<tseliot> weird, apw's card was using xaa. The one in the bug report is using exa though
<Amaranth> he probably did that manually
<tseliot> it could be
<Amaranth> yeah, the patch to make compiz and XAA work well together was dropped from X so if you use XAA you either get weird rendering glitches with some (mostly Qt) apps or you enable XaaNoOffscreenPixmaps which basically disables XAA and does pure software 2D rendering
<pitti> tseliot: I just started kubuntu-netbook-remix, and it works there; I guess compiz triggers something which makes it crash?
<Amaranth> pitti: is that a Radeon HD?
<pitti> Amaranth: yes, 6xx
<seb128> same here
<pitti> i. e. not "fully" supported by -ati yet
<Amaranth> yes, compiz tries to use the completely broken 3D acceleration for r600 we seem to have picked up
<Amaranth> I thought the r600 3D stuff was a part of the radeon KMS stuff
<Amaranth> oh, we have that, don't we
<seb128> Ng, bug #430240 btw
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 430240 in gnome-bluetooth "karmic - regression? - bluetooth applet no longer has an option to turn bluetooth on/off" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/430240
 * tseliot wonders if 3D can be disabled (in the driver) for such cards
<soren> I'm seeing the same symptoms as bug #412619. Does anyone want me to try something?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 412619 in rhythmbox "error ripping audio CD with rhythmbox" [Low,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/412619
<Amaranth> tseliot: whatever glxinfo checks to get the OpenGL renderer string needs to return "Software Renderer" for those cards
<Amaranth> tseliot: I guess that'd be mesa
<seb128> soren, no
<tseliot> pitti, seb128: do 3D apps work?
<soren> seb128: Alright.
<Amaranth> the bug they linked to says glxgears crashes X too
<tseliot> Amaranth: I think it should be there. I need to check
<Amaranth> I didn't think the r600 stuff was much past making glxgears work in any branch of the code
<pitti> tseliot: no hw acceleration, I think; but I just tested video
<Amaranth> pitti: try glxgears
<pitti> tseliot: if nothing else helps we can blacklist the chips in compiz
<Ng> seb128: oh bah, sorry. Can I dupe that to mine?
<seb128> Ng, sure
<Amaranth> pitti: There are a _lot_ of Radeon HD chips...
<pitti> Amaranth: will do next time I boot a test system on that one (my wife currently needs her computer, sorry)
<pitti> Amaranth: I guess r5xx and below will work
<Amaranth> pitti: we'd have to blacklist every pciid fglrx claims to support
<seb128> will try too later, I'm on my laptop right now and I've to go for lunch
<Amaranth> but we'd have to implement per-driver blacklists first
<pitti> Amaranth: oh, that's not fglrx, it's the free one
<seb128> why fglrx?
<pitti> (live system)
<seb128> I'm using ati
<Amaranth> pitti: fglrx only supports Radeon HD
<Amaranth> it's an easy source of the pciids we need to blacklist
<seb128> oh ok
<seb128> lunch, bbl
<Amaranth> but if we blacklist them you won't get compiz when you install fglrx either
<Amaranth> since the blacklist is currently global, not per-driver
<tseliot> it looks like r600 was enabled in mesa 7.6.0~git20090817.7c422387-0ubuntu1
<Amaranth> like I said, probably easier to disable 3D acceleration in mesa
<pitti> Amaranth: eww
<Amaranth> pitti: we've only had one other time we needed blacklists per-driver
<pitti> Amaranth: ok, I'll boot it again to confirm; I was pretty sure that in alpha-3 and jaunty it just used software 3D
<Amaranth> back when -ati had problems with laptops and installing fglrx made it work right
<tseliot> Amaranth: yes, that should be easier
<Amaranth> iirc we ended up just blocking all laptops using the -ati driver instead
<pitti_kne> Amaranth: ok, I'm in Kubuntu Netbook, on ATI
<Amaranth> pitti_kne: alright, try glxinfo | grep renderer
<pitti_kne> it's an RV630
<pitti_kne> meh, no glxinfo
<Amaranth> hehe
<Amaranth> you'll need glxgears too while you're installing things
 * pitti_kne installs mesa-utils
<Amaranth> ah, right, all in one package
<pitti_kne> OpenGL renderer string: Mesa DRI R600 (RV630 9587) 20090101 AGP 8x x86/MMX+/3DNow!+/SSE2 TCL
<pitti_kne> right, so it's 3D now
<Amaranth> pitti_kne: ok, that's our problem right there
<Amaranth> pitti_kne: try glxgears
<pitti_kne>  glxgears
<pitti_kne> IRQ's not enabled, falling back to busy waits: 2 16
<pitti_kne> no rrb
<pitti_kne> drmRadeonCmdBuffer: -22
<pitti_kne> and immediately quits
<Amaranth> alright, so it didn't crash X but it also failed somewhat spectacularly
<Amaranth> that's not surprising, glxgears uses almost no 3D stuff compared to compiz
<pitti_kne> Amaranth: it might crash compiz, though
<Amaranth> I don't think we've found an OpenGL extension we don't like yet ;)
<pitti_kne> if only I had VTs on the Ubuntu live system..
<pitti_kne> then I could switch to metacity and get some logging
<pitti_kne> but it's completely busted
<pitti_kne> X keeps restarting itself, and VTs are broken
<Amaranth> wouldn't help anyway, if gdb stops compiz your X is completely frozen
<Amaranth> you have to ssh in and run gdb remotely
<pitti_kne> Amaranth: well, I could at least check .xsession-errors and the like
<pitti_kne> Amaranth: no ssh on the live system
<pitti_kne> hm, I could try to boot it with "text"
<Amaranth> you could install openssh-server
 * pitti_kne checks if the upstart job still respects that
<pitti_kne> Amaranth: if I could type that command, I wouldn't need it in the first place :-)
<Amaranth> you don't get a terminal in the netbook remix?
<pitti_kne> Amaranth: I do; I mean in UBuntu with compiz
<pitti_kne> I cuold try installing compiz onKubuntu, of course
<Amaranth> oh, just install compiz and ssh on the netbook remix
<Amaranth> if it's an actual netbook RAM could get a bit tight
<kwwii> pitti_kne: hey, I wanted to install karmic so I can show my team-mates the xsplash and such...is the artwork already included?
<Laney> is zenity in bzr?
<pitti_kne> kwwii: just the old one that we carry for some weeks
<pitti_kne> Amaranth: nah, it's 3 GB RAM, Athon 3000, pretty beefy machine :)
<davmor2> pitti_kne: if you want vt on ubuntu live try removing the quiet and usplash from the grub line and then as soon as the desktop appears hit your vt of choice that's how I got the info for bryce
<pitti> meh, and of course switching to text VTs broke X
<davmor2> not desktop xsplash sorry
<pitti> davmor2: ok, will try that; easier than installing everything all over again in the next KNE boot
<pitti> meh, /etc/init/gdm.conf doesn't check for "text" any more
<kwwii> pitti_kne: hrm, is there any way for me to show the team the current status of karmic, only with the new artwork?
<pitti> kwwii: sorry, pitti_kne is dead
<pitti> kwwii: I don't have the new artwork
<pitti> kwwii: for xsplash you mean? I just have some new icons for usplash
<pitti> Amaranth: ok, I reproduced the compiz failure in a controlled fashion
<kwwii> pitti: yes
<pitti> Amaranth: using metacity, compiz --replace, got X crash
<Amaranth> pitti: alright, to see what compiz is doing right before X crashes you'll need to ssh in
<Amaranth> wait, compiz isn't crashing so gdb won't help...
<pitti> Amaranth: I redirected out and err to a file
 * pitti walks over and pastes it into the bug
<Amaranth> I don't think it spits out any useful messages either
<pitti> Amaranth: sent to the bug
<pitti> Amaranth: right, it doesn't, but for teh record
<pitti> Amaranth: want me to try anything else?
<pitti> the "gconftool" is an issue
<Amaranth> pitti: does your Xorg log have any useful info?
<pitti> seb128: was that compat name dropped deliberately? (only gconftool-2 now), or was that an accident?
<pitti> Amaranth: no, nothing; no new entries when it's crashing
<Amaranth> hrm
<pitti> Amaranth: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xserver-xorg-video-ati/+bug/423415/comments/16
<seb128> pitti, looking
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 423415 in xserver-xorg-video-ati "Ati driver issues when logging into desktop" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<Amaranth> dbgsym packages for X would probably be too much even if you do have 3GB RAM
<pitti> seb128: it's easy to fix compiz to use gconftool-2, but I already fixed it somewhere else, too
<pitti> Amaranth: what would that help?
<pitti> it's not a crash in the SEGV sense
<pitti> otherwise it should be in the X log, and apport should catch it, too
<Amaranth> what else could it be?
<seb128> pitti, the postinst still has code to install the alternative
<pitti> Amaranth: I don't know..
<Amaranth> I can't think of why it'd decide to X normally
<seb128> seems to be a bug if it doesn't work
<Amaranth> err, exit
<pitti> seb128: do you have it?
<Amaranth> and if it did there would be something in the log about that
<seb128> pitti, yes
<Amaranth> I don't have gconftool anymore
<pitti> Amaranth: so I thought; unfortunately the old ~/xsession-errors gets killed with the respawn
<Amaranth> I didn't even know it existed, I've always used gconftool-2
<seb128> /usr/bin/gconftool -> /etc/alternatives/gconftool
<seb128> /usr/bin/gconftool-2
<pitti> Amaranth: let me try without gdm and startx, that should retain .xsession-errors
<seb128> in gconf2 binary
<pitti> I don't have /usr/bin/gconftool
<pitti> brb
<seb128> pitti, the gconf2 postinst has
<seb128> "if [ "$1" = install ]; then
<seb128>     install_alternative
<seb128> fi
<seb128> if [ "$1" = configure ] && dpkg --compare-versions "$2" lt-nl 2.19.1-2; then
<seb128>     install_alternative
<seb128> fi
<seb128> "
<pitti> Amaranth: ah, https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xserver-xorg-video-ati/+bug/423415/comments/17
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 423415 in xserver-xorg-video-ati "Ati driver issues when logging into desktop" [Undecided,Confirmed]
 * davmor2 hugs pitti
<davmor2> bugs been doing my head in for a fortnight :)
<pitti> seb128: that looks weird
<pitti> seb128: "install" isn't even a legal postinst argument, is it?
<pitti> seb128: and why woudl it install the alternative only for these old packages? (except if it really was deliberate)
<seb128> pitti, that comes from debian and I'm not sure
<Amaranth> pitti: that appears to die as soon as it calls glxinfo
<Amaranth> first error is on `/usr/bin/glxinfo | grep -c GLX_EXT_texture_from_pixmap`
<pitti> Amaranth: I'll start it again and try that manually; it's still running
 * pitti walks over
<Amaranth> but then on the second round with LIBGL_ALWAYS_INDIRECT set it correctly says there is no support
<pitti> ah, sorry, not running any more; froze again after vt switch
<Amaranth> pitti: don't bother
<pitti> Amaranth: ok, then I'll bother about lunch :)
<Amaranth> no matter what information we get the answer is to disable this acceleration code in mesa so compiz doesn't even try to run
<seb128> hey MacSlow
<seb128> MacSlow, any luck on those notify-osd crashers?
<MacSlow> seb128, still on the mem-leaks
<MacSlow> seb128, but the crasher are on my plate for this week too
<seb128> MacSlow, don't you think crashes should be fixed first?
<Amaranth> mvo_: the invisible panel bug seems to go away if I do a local rebuild of compiz
<Amaranth> What exactly was the problem with the buildds?
 * tseliot is building mesa without r600
<mvo_> Amaranth: uh, that is strange
<Amaranth> very
<Amaranth> me and maniac just went over the code and couldn't figure out why it was not working right
<Amaranth> everything I suggested was shot down except for "stack corruption"
<Amaranth> because building with a printf made the bug go away
<Amaranth> so I tried again with a fresh apt-get source compiz and built it without making any changes
<mvo_> hmmm
<mvo_> and now its gone everytime you try?
<Amaranth> mvo_: well all 5 times I tried so far anyway
<Amaranth> with the package from the repo it happens every single time
<mvo_> how odd
<Amaranth> yeah
<Amaranth> I don't know if it was just something weird with the buildd and rebuilding will help or if it's an environment issue
<Amaranth> guess I can setup pbuilder
<seb128> try a ppa it's faster ;-)
<Amaranth> not if someone is doing OOo uploads
<cassidy> seb128, would be cool to fix https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/farsight2/+bug/429927  bigon did the merge
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 429927 in farsight2 "Please merge farsight2 0.0.15 from debian unstable" [Wishlist,New]
<seb128> cassidy, it's planned but we are frozen for alpha6 today
<seb128> I will upload tomorrow
<cassidy> thanks
<pitti> tseliot: mesa without r600> in a PPA?
<tseliot> pitti, seb128: mesa without r600 should be here (as soon as it's built): https://launchpad.net/~albertomilone/+archive/x-testing
<pitti> tseliot: ok, I'll try that on the live system then
 * pitti hugs tseliot
 * tseliot hugs pitti (thanks for testing)
<pitti> Amaranth, tseliot: do you know of anything which we could grab as debug information to fix that properly before disabling and forgetting it?
<Amaranth> I suppose it should be saying no, there is no tfp instead of crashing X...
<pitti> Amaranth: you said that it crashed on calling glxinfo? that worked on KNE, but perhaps the ubuntu build has a different set of package versions; I'll try it again
<Amaranth> but since the r600 code isn't even supposed to run glxgears yet I don't think we should care
<tseliot> pitti: maybe updating drm, mesa (and kernel for KMS) should fix it (but might cause regressions to any other driver)
<Amaranth> not worth it since the 3d support for r600 is worthless right now
 * tseliot would rather not run the risk
<Amaranth> mvo_: it works fine if I build with pbuilder too
<Amaranth> perhaps it is related to the buildd problems
<Amaranth> I guess after the alpha 6 freeze a no change rebuild should fix it
<pitti> tseliot: I think I'll mark bug 423415 as a dupe of bug 419126
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 423415 in xserver-xorg-video-ati "Ati driver issues when logging into desktop" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/423415
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 419126 in mesa "X fails to start up after mesa+git update - gdm loops after logging in" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/419126
<tseliot> Amaranth: yes, I meant updating drm, mesa, etc. to experimental code. In other words, I was saying no ;)
<Amaranth> tseliot: experimental code that is most likely out of date compared to the git snapshot of mesa we have now :P
<tseliot> heh
<Amaranth> so either merge the branch before making a snapshot or lose all fixes we've gotten
<Amaranth> yeah, not a good idea
<tseliot> pitti: yes, it's the same bug
 * tseliot nods
 * pitti -> AFK for some more CD testing
<tseliot> pitti, seb128: the mesa packages were built and are now ready for testing
<tseliot> Ng: ^^
<pitti> tseliot: ah, will do; great!
<rickspencer3> seb128, pitti, tseliot, kenvandine,  what's the word on the street?
<pitti> rickspencer3: b0rkage
<rickspencer3> how's A6 looking?
<seb128> rickspencer3, desktop or ubuntu?
<rickspencer3> pitti, I was afraid of that
<kenvandine> yo  yo
<seb128> rickspencer3, the boot changes broke a lot of things
<seb128> rickspencer3, desktop looks alright...
<rickspencer3> seb128, does it boot?
 * rickspencer3 is downloading Kubuntu Netbook ISO right now
<seb128> it does for me yes
<tseliot> rickspencer3: 419126 doesn't help but hopefully my change in mesa will prevent it from happening
<seb128> not sure of other people
<rickspencer3> bug #419126
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 419126 in mesa "[ATI R6xx] X fails to start up after mesa+git update - gdm loops after logging in" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/419126
<rickspencer3> nice
<rickspencer3> I have been worried that Ubuntu would fall over after all the A6 updates :)
<tseliot> hehe
<seb128> brb
<pitti> rickspencer3: bug 430611 is currently the biggest bug, I think
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 430611 in dbus "dbus fails to start on clean boot using upstart job" [Critical,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/430611
<rickspencer3> pitti, my, that is problematic indeed
<rickspencer3> I suppose Keybuk is working feverishly at bug whack-a-mole
<pitti> right
<Keybuk> nobody mentioned that bug to me ;)
<kenvandine> bratsche, that is the bug you hit
<Keybuk> oh
<Keybuk> maybe they did, just not by number
<Keybuk> is that the /var on separate partition one?
<bratsche> kenvandine: Thanks.
 * kenvandine avoids updating this morning
<dobey> pitti: care to sponsor a couple packages for me? :)
<pitti> dobey: please just sub ubuntu-main-sponsors, I'll upload them after a6
<bratsche> Yeah, I did an update yesterday and then the startup failed after it did a battery check or something.  So later last night I updated again and it got further, but then dbus wasn't starting.  That's where it's still at today.
<davmor2> rickspencer3: doesn't ubuntu need to get up before a6 before it can fall over :D
<dobey> pitti: after tomorrow? :(
<pitti> tseliot: damn, doesn't seem to help :(
<kenvandine> dobey, yes... frozen for a6 now
<pitti> tseliot: I updated from the PPA, and still get the same loop
<dobey> :(
<pitti> tseliot: and froze again (tried to switch VT); anything I should check with those?
<tseliot> pitti: make sure you don't have r600_dri.so
<pitti> tseliot: where is that?
<tseliot> pitti: /usr/lib/dri/r600_dri.so
<pitti> tseliot: can I just rm that on the live system? or does your mesa package do other changes?
<tseliot> pitti: try to remove it
<pitti> tseliot: now compiz falls back to metacity
<tseliot> pitti: which is exactly what we want. Now let me check why that file was still there
<pitti> tseliot: followed up
<pitti> tseliot: well, jaunty did have compiz on r6xx, I think?
<dobey> these milestones make no sense to me then
<pitti> dobey: why not?
<tseliot> pitti: support for r600 and r700 is still experimental. Are you sure about that?
<dobey> because the milestone's date doesn't match the freeze, which means there's a significant portion of the milestone that doesn't make sense because it's targetted at the release time, and not the freeze time
<pitti> tseliot: not entirely; I can boot jaunty later to be sure, but I thought it had composite
<pitti> dobey: well, you can't do a release in a snap of a finger; if the release is on Thursday, you need to freeze on Tuesday to be able to fix the breakage, build CDs, test them, etc.
<tseliot> pitti: ok, please test it with jaunty and let me know. thanks
<kwwii> seb128: on the latest karmic update the xdg places icons in the "places" menu shows some funky icons...all of them exist at 24x24 but it seems to pick two of them from svg....any idea why?
<seb128> no
<seb128> the icons seem fine there
<seb128> do you have a screenshot?
<dobey> pitti: yes. but the launchpad milestones should have their dates set to match the freeze times. it's confusing (and disconcerting) to me (as a new contributor), that i can't get major fixes in, because i missed the freeze which isn't set as a milestone in launchpad. i have to go look somewhere completely different for the freeze information.
<kwwii> seb128: no worries, I just figured it out...hard to see but there is a naming problem with two of them, sorry to bother
<dobey> pitti: and it makes it very difficult to target milestones correctly for other projects on launchpad, that we want to be in ubuntu
<seb128> ok
<seb128> dobey, btw about your sponsoring request from this week
<seb128> dobey, when you ask for testing on the bug should sponsoring be blocked on testing results?
<seb128> it was not clear to me so I didn't upload
<dobey> seb128: yes. though that's probably not the best way to do things. not exactly sure at the moment what a better way to do it is though.
<seb128> dobey, could you subscribe sponsors after getting testing feedback then?
<dobey> seb128: sure. sorry for confusion. very stressed/in a hurry lately :-/
<seb128> no problem don't worry it will just make things clearer next time
<tseliot> pitti: ah, I've just found this in the debian/rules: 	DRI_DRIVERS += mach64 mga r128 r200 r300 r600 radeon s3v savage tdfx trident
<tseliot> pitti: shall I bump the revision to 0ubuntu6 in the ppa or shall I use some ~xtesting?
<pitti> tseliot: ok, I misremembered; no compiz love in jaunty
<Zdra> I installed epiphany-webkit, but I can't find plugins
<tseliot> :-/
<Zdra> is there a package for them?
<Zdra> epiphany-extensions seems to be for the mozilla based epiphany
<pitti> tseliot: doesn't matter much; but 0ubuntu5+ppa1 would be better
<pitti> tseliot: since the next regular ubuntu upload will be ubuntu5, the PPA should be smaller
<tseliot> pitti: yes, I meant "+" instead of "~"
<pitti> tseliot: I recommend using ubuntu5~ppa1, ~ppa2, etc.
<pitti> but of course that's too late now for this ppa :)
<tseliot> oh
<tseliot> ok
<seb128> Zdra, not yet I think, asac was going to look at it iirc but I'm not sure
<Zdra> seb128, mozilla based is going to be the default?
<seb128> Zdra, no, firefox is the default
<Zdra> seb128, I mean for epiphany-browser
<seb128> Zdra, I think asac wants to migrate epiphany users to epiphany-webkit for karmic but didn't yet
<Zdra> IMO epiphany-browser should be wekbit, and add a epiphany-mozilla
<asac> seb128: it breaks my heart
<asac> seb128: i know we already said: yes. but here is another chance to say no :)
<asac> no would come with universe demotion though
<seb128> Zdra, do we need an epiphany-mozilla?
<seb128> asac, I'm not sure why we have epiphany in main to be honest
<Zdra> seb128, probably not
<seb128> out of "it's GNOME"
<asac> seb128: me neither ;)
<seb128> but that add extra work for no benefit
<seb128> and makes harder for motus to work on it
<asac> seb128: can you demote it?
<asac> Zdra: the transition is just adding the transitional packages to the webkit source and removing webkit
<asac> from archive.
<dobey> pitti, seb128: who's responsible for setting up the Ubuntu milestones/dates in LP for the development cycle? i'd like to involve whomever it is in discussion about improving them a bit, once i collect my thoughts and write something reasonable :)
<Zdra> asac, makes sense
<Zdra> asac, I hope it will be done for karmic :)
<asac> Zdra: you really hope?
<seb128> asac, I prefer not doing anything right now in case it's on DVD images or something, need to be checked with pitti or slangasek first I would say
<asac> Zdra: are you a user speaking for webkit or epiphany?
<asac> seb128: sure
<seb128> dobey, the ubuntu drivers probably, pitti or slangasek should know
<Zdra> asac, I like both :)
<asac> Zdra: are you running the webkitversion?
<dobey> seb128: thanks
<asac> isnt it a major problem that there is no password management?
<Zdra> asac, I tried, but with no plugin package, it is not usable
<asac> (for your personal use?)
<pitti> dobey: so far cjwatson did it, but claiming that alpha 6 was due yesterday would be wrong, too
<Zdra> asac, adblock is mendatory
<seb128> never used that
<pitti> dobey: we announce freezes on planet, ubuntu-devel-announce, #ubuntu-devel, and fridge (I think)
<seb128> but I use greasemonkey ;-)
<dobey> pitti: development on alpha6 was due yesterday, no?
<Zdra> seb128, epiphany's adblock is wonderful
<asac> Zdra: how does debian maintain extensions for the gecko/webkit split?
<pitti> dobey: by and large, yes; we are still landing changes to fix release critical bugs
<Zdra> I never had to change rules, it just work out of the box
<pitti> dobey: where did you look for the dates?
<Zdra> asac, I have no idea
<seb128> asac, the way we do I think
<dobey> pitti: i'm looking at the milestone dates in launchpad
<seb128> they didn't package the webkit ones yet
<asac> allright
<asac> thats what i thought ... just wanted to be sure
<pitti> dobey: ah, "Expected: in 9 hours"?
<pitti> heh
<dobey> pitti: yes
<asac> Zdra: so unless upstream fixed this very recently epiphany-webkit has no password management. how bad would that feel for an epiphany user like you?
<pitti> dobey: well, IMHO it's not that critical that the updates don't land on the CDs; you hardly will do large and complex U1 operations in the live system, and people will upgrade after installation anyway
<asac> e.g. if we decided to drop gecko and move everyone to webkit
<dobey> and i'm not sure what qualifies as 'release critical' but current ubuntuone-client in the archive doesn't work.
<dobey> i guess
<Zdra> asac, I heard pwd is fixed now upstream, but I'm not sure
<pitti> dobey: bug 426804?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 426804 in ubuntuone-client "ubuntuone-client doesn't connect (because domain name changed?)" [Critical,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/426804
 * asac  checks
<Zdra> asac, youtube and facebook works
<Zdra> asac, so I'm happy
<dobey> pitti: that's one of the issues, yes
<Zdra> guess those are good test, if they work, everything works
<pitti> dobey: so well, I can upload it, but can't guarantee that it will land on the CDs
<dobey> pitti: well i've already come to terms with it not getting on there
<asac> Zdra: not sure why you think that youtube and facebook cover all corner cases. probably a too simple pov ;)
<dobey> pitti: but regardless, i'd like to discuss improving the milestone situation with whoever it is best to discuss it with :)
<asac> Zdra: or are you saying that passwords work there?
<dobey> hell
<dobey> 'everyhthing' doesn't even work in firefox
<pitti> dobey: hm, I'm not sure; adding a "freeze" date to the +milestone page, or just a string saying "freeze is usually two days before this" or so?
<Zdra> asac, I didn't test, but fredp said that xan said that it is done
<dobey> pitti: i think it's better to set the milestone date as the freeze date in LP. LP already has a separate 'releases' feature, so one should add releases for alphas/betas with the appropriate dates set there
<fredp> Zdra, asac: http://git.gnome.org/cgit/epiphany/commit/?id=eea4e5155ed3102ee21c57958a29603ed0f5166f & http://blogs.gnome.org/xan/2009/09/08/the-show-so-far/
<Zdra> Hm, it also changed my home page to debian.org... but that's not big issue
<fredp> perhaps the package is missing a nss dependency?
<pitti> dobey: that sounds weird, though; we shouldn't set the release date for the final to "two weeks earlier" either
<dobey> pitti: no no. the release date is not the milsetone date
<dobey> pitti: these are already separate concepts in launchpad :)
<seb128> asac,
<seb128> "epiphany-webkit (2.27.92-2) experimental; urgency=low
<seb128>   * debian/control.in:
<seb128>   - Added missing build-dep on libnss3-dev (used in the password importer)"
<asac> semi-nice
<asac> ;)
<asac> let me check what they did for real
<seb128> asac, it's not built since it dep-wait on a newer webkit that the one we have though
<seb128> I've seen that you were discussing webkit with dholbach and other people the other day
<seb128> so I stayed away from this one
<dobey> pitti: but as i said, i still need to collect my thoughts fully. just wondering who i should ping to discuss further once i do
<asac> seb128: that was about the ABI/API changes introduced by us
<pitti> dobey: I'm not actually sure who sets the milestones in LP, but I suspect it's either slangasek or cjwatson
<seb128> asac, right it was sort of looking like we could drop it and sync
<seb128> asac, so I waited for somebody to open a sync request ;-)
<asac> seb128: but since ephy-webkit password management is fixed (somehow) and they even migrate profile data
<asac> we should go for that i think
<seb128> +1
<asac> i was just in doubt because of that
<asac> oki
<seb128> epiphany-gecko is not maintained anyway and if you want a gecko browser use firefox
<asac> lets hope webkit doesnt bust gwibber or so
<seb128> asac, can you look at the webkit update?
<dobey> pitti: ok. i'll ping them and you as well when i collect thoughts and forumlate a mail to express them :)
<pitti> thanks
<asac> seb128: right. but i would hav ehated to force current ephy users to use firefox for one cycle (like you ;))
<asac> seb128: yes. i do the webkit update. in worst case we just break anjal and see if they complain.
<seb128> asac, I'm using firefox now and I somewhat like it ;-)
<asac> imo they should put that into ppa anyway
<seb128> asac, it doesn't crash every second closing which is a good win :-p
<asac> seb128: yes. but thats not how its supposed to be ... also you have a bad experience ;) with greasmonkey breaking etc.
<asac> never seen before issues :)
<seb128> asac, I did reinstall the internet addon greasemonkey and it's working again, weird
<seb128> asac, let see if it decided after a while that it's not compatible with firefox 3.5.3 again now
<seb128> decides
<tseliot> pitti: does 0ubuntu5+ppa1 solve the problem (I see no trace of the r600 module in the package)?
 * asac off some NM testing
<pitti> tseliot: I suppose, but I didn't test it
<tseliot> pitti: also it's likely that editing the debian/rules is enough (as opposed to patching the source). I'm building the packages locally and I'll attach a debdiff to the bug report in any case
<pitti> tseliot: right, if it can be done with a configure switch, that's better
<tseliot> pitti: yes, I think the debian/rules overrides the list of modules in the configure.ac of the source
<hyperair> hmmm i wonder if gdu will allow me to hot-unplug my hard disks
<hyperair> IDE hard disks i mean. =D
<Laney> good luck with that
<hyperair> hahaha
<hyperair> well at least my SATA disks can be hot unplugged
 * Laney needs to go home and fix the karmic mess
<Laney> someone come round and do it for me please :(
<Laney> I offer cake!
<pitti> Laney: good luck
<pitti> Laney: dist-upgrade should do it
<pitti> seb128: btw, with most recent karmic I don't get the "powers off screen on boot" issue any more
<Laney> pitti: Gotta get into the system though, which is a pain
<Laney> chroot from a live cd?
<seb128> pitti, what did you upgrade?
<pitti> seb128: I don't know, everything
<pitti> I didn't see it on today's CD live systems either
<pitti> this morning I still had yesterday evening's packages
<seb128> same here
<seb128> I will upgrade later
<seb128> I want a working machine for now
<chrisccoulson> i upgraded my desktop last night and then spent until 3am trying to get it to boot again ;)
<Laney> chrisccoulson: how did it fail/
 * Laney is in busybox land
<chrisccoulson> it got just past the initramfs and hung at mountall
<chrisccoulson> it turns out that some bindfs mounts in my fstab screw it up, so i just disabled them for now
<Laney> I hope a dist-upgrade fixes it... I did actually plan on doing some sponsoring yesterday
<Laney> after my PC was down for a week
<chrisccoulson> but it took me a long time to figure that out. my keyboard doesn't work that early on sometimes
<Laney> gnome-terminal was losing keypresses too even when it was working
 * Laney is a bit frustrated
<chrisccoulson> is it your only machine?
<Laney> nah, got a laptop
<Laney> it's my only Ubuntu machine though
<chrisccoulson> heh, i only have 1 machine here
<chrisccoulson> i think it's probably time i invested in a laptop now
<chrisccoulson> i used to have a company laptop, but my current employer is too tight to give me one
<Laney> I bought my own... and then a few months later work said that if I hadn't they'd have bought me one then
<chrisccoulson> i don't think there is any chance of my employer doing that. i'd be lucky to get a pen off them ;)
 * chrisccoulson thinks he should probably not be using the company network for IRC now
<Laney> heh heh
<chrisccoulson> i should probably do some sponsoring tonight really. i havent done any for a little while now
<pitti> ubuntu-bug...
<pitti> Gdk-ERROR **: The program 'firefox' received an X Window System error.
<pitti> This probably reflects a bug in the program.
<pitti> The error was 'BadWindow (invalid Window parameter)'.
<pitti>   (Details: serial 523 error_code 3 request_code 20 minor_code 0)
<pitti> meh
<pitti> asac: any idea about that? This seems to happen randomly
<asac> yes
<asac> one second
<asac> bug 401055
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 401055 in xorg-server "[MASTER] Gdk-ERROR **: The program 'firefox-3.5' received an X Window System error (BadWindow)" [Unknown,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/401055
<asac> i have a bandaid for this. and upstream supposely landed a right fix on trunk
<asac> pitti: do you still see this?
<asac> could you verify that its fixed in firefox-3.7 from the daily ppa?
<asac> https://edge.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-mozilla-daily/+archive/ppa
<asac> i need a confirm before requesting approval for the 3.6 and 3.5 branche
<pitti> asac: seems I can currently reproduce it with ubuntu-bug with every other try
<asac> with 3.7?
<pitti> asac: no, with current karmic (3.5)
<pitti> asac: can I install 3.7 in parallel? or should I backup my .mozilla?
<asac> pitti: parallel should work. it copies your profile if all goes well ;)
<asac> (backup is always good)
<asac> just have to teach ubuntu-bug to use the firefox-3.7 command
<mac_v> asac: hm... why isnt the bandaid applied for that? ;p
<mac_v> i lost several bugs to that error , even if i have FF open :(
<seb128> mac_v, to limit bug flood on launchpad? ;-)
<asac> tough question. you can argue for both ways. but it was alpha stage so i thought better not hide it
<mac_v> seb128: hehe ,  i want to flood with all known bugs ;)
<mac_v> *unknown
<superm1> kenvandine, how do you set third party backgrounds/logo's for xsplash?
<superm1> it looks like it supports command line arguments, but it's not obvious where to use them
<pitti> superm1: he's just working on a package split
<pitti> superm1: there will be an ubuntu-xsplash-artwork package
<pitti> superm1: which derivatives can just replace (same files)
<superm1> pitti, ah okay
<pitti> kenvandine: please add a Conflicts:/Replaces: xsplash-artwork to it
<pitti> let's not go through the alternatives mess again like in usplash
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i'm glad i'm not the only one who can't confirm bug 427464 ;)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 427464 in gnome-session "Can't add to startup applications" [Low,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/427464
<seb128> chrisccoulson, hehe
<kenvandine> pitti, pushed, how does that look?
<pitti> kenvandine: pushed where?
<pitti> (and what?)
<kenvandine> oh... i thought you looked at the branch :)
<kenvandine> ubuntu-xsplash-artwork
<kenvandine> i had a Provides and Conflicts
<kenvandine> i thought you wanted me to add a Replaces too :)
<kenvandine> ~ubuntu-desktop/xsplash/ubuntu
<kenvandine> pitti, i read your comment earlier and thought it was feedback :)
<pitti> kenvandine: ah, xsplash
<pitti> sorry, too many things going on today
<kenvandine> understand
<kenvandine> i thought you went out and checked up on my work :)
<kenvandine> pitti, when you can, please do go look at it
<kenvandine> it isn't ready for upload yet though
<kenvandine> we are doing a 0.8 tomorrow
<pitti> kenvandine: please depend on ubuntu-xsplash-artwork | xsplash-artwork
<pitti> kenvandine: there always must be a real preferred alternative
<kenvandine> ok
<pitti> kenvandine: and -artwork needs to conflicts/replaces: xsplash (<< 0.7.1-0ubuntu2) for the moved files
<kenvandine> so you can use a | for or?
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> actually 0.8
<pitti> kenvandine: FYI, having "etc/" in debian/xsplash.install will probably suffice
<pitti> kenvandine: | is "or", yes
<kenvandine> i'll go ahead and bump version too
<pitti> kenvandine: 0.7.1-0ubuntu2 will do even if you do a 0.8 later (that's also bigger than 0.7.1-0ubuntu2 :) )
<pitti> kenvandine: likewise, just for future laziness you probably just want /usr/bin/ into xsplash.install (just in case there'll be more in the future
<kenvandine> ok
<pitti> kenvandine: dh_install gets along with directories just fine
<pitti> kenvandine: so, with the fixed C/R and alternative dep it looks fine, thanks
<kenvandine> actually... the version conflicts/replaces isn't useful... that package has never existed
 * kenvandine puts it in for good measure though
<pitti> kenvandine: sure it is; xsplash exists
<pitti> kenvandine: the *new* package c/r's to the *old* (existing one)
<kenvandine> humm... oh...
<pitti> kenvandine: since u-x-artwork now ships files which are already shipped in xsplash
<kenvandine> duh...
<pitti> so you have to upgrade xsplash first before you can unpack u-x-artwork
<pitti> and the C/R ensures that
<kenvandine> yeah
<kenvandine> good point
<kenvandine> thx!
<kenvandine> fixed
<pitti> need to leave for TKD, cu tomorrow!
<kenvandine> have fun!
<kenvandine> good night
<mvo_> hey rugby471 - many thanks for your branch
<rugby471> mvo_: no problem
<chrisccoulson> mvo_ - just looking at the changelog for compiz. was "unredirect fullscreen windows" disabled in jaunty too?
<chrisccoulson> unfortunately, disabling it breaks user switching for nvidia users :(
<mac_v> chrisccoulson: no , actually it is being done to prevent flicker from notify-osd ;)
<chrisccoulson> ah, ok. that is one side effect of it. but i have to re-enable it again anyway ;)
<chrisccoulson> maybe compiz could do a run-time check for people like me who have crappy drivers ;)
<mac_v> dont we all have crappy drivers ;p
<bratsche> pitti: ping
<chrisccoulson> mac_v - i don't know. i'm not sure what other drivers are like. but this white-screen bug has existed for eternity in the nvidia driver, and will probably never be fixed in my lifetime ;)
<bratsche> pitti: Nevermind
<mvo_> chrisccoulson: oh? hm, that is bad. I guess we need to re-enable it then again, that is a pretty big use-case
<mac_v> chrisccoulson: hehe , as an ATI user i thought nvidia guys had the best time of their life , \o/ good to know
<chrisccoulson> mvo_ - i'm not sure really. i suppose it depends on how many nvidia users want user switching or not
<chrisccoulson> the issue with it disabled is that you end up with a completely white screen on user switching
<mvo_> chrisccoulson: many thanks - is there a bug open about this yet?
<mac_v> chrisccoulson: could you comment that on Bug 346187
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 346187 in compiz "Screen blinks to desktop when OSD message appears over fullscreen window or even when you move the mouse" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/346187
<chrisccoulson> mvo_ - i think so. i'd have to try and find it though.
<mac_v> that was the bug which "fixed" this issue
<chrisccoulson> it would be a shame to break notify-osd appearance though if only a small percentage of the user base experience the nvidia bug on a regular basis
<chrisccoulson> so i'm quite fine with just re-enabling it again ;)
<chrisccoulson> (i mean, manually re-enabling it locally on my machine)
<chrisccoulson> mvo_ - bug 160264 is the nvidia driver issue
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 160264 in nvidia-graphics-drivers-180 "[nvidia] compiz displays white screen when locked" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/160264
<mvo_> chrisccoulson: thanks
<chrisccoulson> enabling unredirect fullscreen windows is only a workaround for the issue though - it doesn't fix it, and nvidia don't seem particularly interested in it
<chrisccoulson> you still end up with windows appearing as white boxes if they are created on an inactive X session
<mac_v> anyone notice , after the recent compiz update, that the window jumps up when closing?
<seb128> no
<mac_v> hmm... only certain windows consistently do that
<mac_v> seb128: you are also using ATI ,right?
<mac_v> do you have azureus installed?
<mac_v> or vuze rather
<seb128> no, intel on this box
<mac_v> :(
<seb128> the ati config crashes on compiz start
<seb128> on what applications do you get the issue? where do they jump if they are closing?
<mac_v> i think its related to an animation [burn], and it happens to the vuze window when i use close button on the top right to minimize to the notification area
<mac_v> i noticed this on another app also but i'm just not able to recall :(
<chrisccoulson> i've just tried gnome-shell for the first time on real hardware. i'm amazed at how painfully slow and jerky the animations are
 * mac_v couldnt get gnome-shell to start :(
<chrisccoulson> it starts ok here, but it's not very nice to use
<mac_v> could some one confirm that Bug #423355 , is fixed? lp is lying as commited
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 423355 in hundredpapercuts "Main window should center on screen" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/423355
<chrisccoulson> thats fixed for me
<mac_v> yup me too , thanks
<hyperair> huh what happened to compiz O-o
<hyperair> compiz.real: ../../src/display.c:793: updatePlugins: Assertion `j == pListCount' failed.
<mac_v> compiz is doing all sorts of weird stuff! , the modal window for the root prompt started using animation after the recent updates
<hyperair> â§..what?
<hyperair> modal window for the root prompt?
<hyperair> what modal window?
<mac_v> hyperair: the window you get for root password prompts
<mac_v> damn the window are jumping!
<mac_v> hyperair: could you test this , open up the history from synaptic
<mac_v> now when closing[from the button on the top right] the window do you see a short jump in the window?
<hyperair> mac_v: you want me to test with compiz?
<mac_v> when closing the history window*
<hyperair> mac_v: i can't even START it!
<hyperair> said assertion happens, then metacity kicks in
<mac_v> oh ,
<mac_v> thats bad!
<hyperair> yes, that IS bad
<hyperair> VERY bad
<mac_v> lol
<mac_v> chrisccoulson: could you test that^ with compiz ?
<hyperair> there seems to be a bug on it
<hyperair> but it's private so i can't see it =.=
<hyperair> 429858
<hyperair> #429858
<hyperair> bug #429858
<ubottu> Bug 429858 on http://launchpad.net/bugs/429858 is private
<hyperair> see
 * mac_v kicks the bot
<chrisccoulson> mac_v - i can't recreate that. but then, i havent restarted my session since i upgraded
<chrisccoulson> actually, i must have restarted compiz when i ran gnome-shell
<chrisccoulson> so, i can't recreate it then
<mac_v> hm.. it happens only for certain windows! and for those windows its consistent :(
<mac_v> argh , it happens to all the synaptic child windows!
<mac_v> and to gedit about window!
<chrisccoulson> hyperair - you should be able to see bug 429858 now
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 429858 in compiz "compiz.real assert failure: compiz.real: ../../src/display.c:793: updatePlugins: Assertion `j == pListCount' failed." [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/429858
<chrisccoulson> mac_v - actually, i can get the window to jump
<mac_v> \o/ i'm not see things
<mac_v> seeing*
<mac_v> chrisccoulson: which app? , i'v now found the terminal's about window jumps too
<chrisccoulson> for synaptic, the modal dialogs get the wrong animation (as if it were a normal window)
<chrisccoulson> i wonder if it has the wrong type hint?
<chrisccoulson> xprop to the rescue
<chrisccoulson> "_NET_WM_WINDOW_TYPE(ATOM) = _NET_WM_WINDOW_TYPE_NORMAL"
<chrisccoulson> ^^^that is wrong, I think
<mac_v> hmm...
<chrisccoulson> it would be "_NET_WM_WINDOW_TYPE_DIALOG"
<chrisccoulson> s/would/should
<mac_v> which update did that change o.0
<chrisccoulson> so, compiz gives it the wrong animation
<chrisccoulson> mac_v - not sure. i don't open the synaptic preferences too often, so i don't know
<chrisccoulson> what other windows do you see it with?
<mac_v> the jump? > vuze main window , all synaptics child windows , gedit/terminal about windows
<mac_v> and compiz's child windows
<mac_v> Amaranth: is this a known issue ^ ?
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i can trigger it with the about windows, but they get the correct animation, so the 2 issues are unrelated. i just noticed that the synaptic preferences gets the wrong animation by chance
<mac_v> yeah the modal getting animations and the jumps are different issue
<chrisccoulson> mac_v - bug 430955
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 430955 in synaptic "Preferences dialog has incorrect type hint" [Low,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/430955
<Amaranth> jump?
<mac_v> chrisccoulson: when you say > "modal Preferences dialog in Synaptic" , you mean the modal windows for all the gksudo apps right?
<chrisccoulson> mac_v - no, i just mean the preferences window in this case
<chrisccoulson> the authentication window is generally not modal, and is spawned in another process
 * Amaranth gets lost, goes have have morning caffeine injection before trying to follow
<chrisccoulson> mac_v - in the case of policykit prompts, they're displayed by polkit-gnome-authentication-agent-1 now
<mac_v> chrisccoulson: the authentication window also gets an animation here
<mac_v> policy kit prompts are not modal windows for me.
<chrisccoulson> mac_v - compiz can animate all windows, but by default, only normal windows get the glide animation
<chrisccoulson> other window types should be faded
<chrisccoulson> although, you can set them all to glide;)
<Amaranth> wait, is the problem windows getting the wrong animation?
<mac_v> chrisccoulson: hm.. those modal prompts dont cause a problem for me , the modal where the screen greys out and displays the authentication window for gksudo apps is now animating for me
<mac_v> the grey background animates!
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i get that too
<mac_v> Amaranth: the jump is noticed with these windows >  all synaptics child windows , gedit/terminal about windows ,  compiz's child windows
<mac_v> could you test it ?
<Amaranth> "the jump"? I hope that isn't a bad as "the clap"
<chrisccoulson> it's worse;)
<hyperair> seb128: gnome-shell needs libclutter-1.0-dev to run.
<mac_v> Amaranth: when you close the windows using the top right close button , the window jump up and animate
<seb128> hyperair, yes, I know
<hyperair> seb128: basically the symlink for libclutter-glx.so
<hyperair> ah
<seb128> I think that's a gnome-shell bug
<seb128> but I didn't track it yet
<seb128> I don't want to add a depends that would be wrong
<seb128> it should use the .so.soname
<seb128> not the .so
<Amaranth> wow, I thought my compiz was really broken
<Amaranth> turns out I was running metacity
<mac_v> lol
<Amaranth> mac_v: yeah, I see that little jump
<Amaranth> mac_v: ccsm's windows do it too?
<mac_v> yeah
<mac_v> ccsm's child windows
 * Amaranth puts this just above making the logout plugin work on his todo list
<Amaranth> :P
<mac_v> ;)
<seb128> what is the logout thing doing?
<Amaranth> seb128: basically the same thing we used to do, it fades out the rest of the screen
<seb128> is anybody using that?
<Amaranth> no, mac_v wants us to
<mac_v> ;p
<mac_v> seb128: Bug #429132
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 429132 in compiz "Compiz logout/shutdown effect" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/429132
<mac_v> it works , but Amaranth is noticing some problems
 * hyperair continues grumbling about compiz not starting
<seb128> we should stop shipping useless options
<Amaranth> yeah, like your match rule not working at all :P
<Amaranth> mac_v: because I don't use FUSA
<Amaranth> I figured it out :)
<mac_v> i dont use FUSA too ;p
<seb128> we get tons of bugs about those and we don't have time to work on basic options already so who cares about those
<Amaranth> well dang
<Amaranth> seb128: it's more of a feature request
<mac_v> Amaranth: or did you mean indicator session?
<Amaranth> mac_v: I use System->Log Out
<Amaranth> mac_v: and System->Shutdown
<mac_v> ah! those are not available in the default setup ;p
<Amaranth> not unless you remove the FUSA applet
<hyperair> i used to use gnome-do for everything, but then hibernate and suspend are not working due to devicekit changes
<Amaranth> mac_v: If you aren't using those dialogs that effect is worthless
<seb128> I tried gnome-do once and I don't understand the point of it
<Amaranth> mac_v: I'm going to mark it Won't Fix now that I know what you want
<seb128> I find it unefficient and ugly and not obvious to trigger
<mac_v> Amaranth: huh?
<Amaranth> seb128: it's so you take your hands off the keyboard less often
<mac_v> Amaranth: yeah , indicator session removes those options  ;)
<Amaranth> mac_v: Every single dialog FUSA pops up you want to use with this is just a confirm/deny dialog
<hyperair> seb128: that's just you. many others love gnome-do
<hyperair> seb128: use your keyboard a little more
<Amaranth> I only thought the logout effect would be cool with the window where you choose what you want to do
<seb128> Amaranth, alt-f2 - command doesn't make me move my hands
<hyperair> mm yeah, and you're going to alt+f2 suspend?
<seb128> hyperair, I probably didn't spent enough time to get the grasp of it
<mac_v> Amaranth: for every single fusa prompts
<Amaranth> seb128: no but you move them awkwardly and that only helps for running apps
<seb128> it just seems alt-f2 with ugly icons to me
<Amaranth> seb128: alt-f2 won't let you skip to the next song
<Amaranth> seb128: or post to twitter :)
<Amaranth> mac_v: right, that's kind of silly
<walters> yeah, there's two parts; application launching/switching, and application-specific plugins
<Amaranth> mac_v: those dialogs are just yes/no
<mac_v> Amaranth: ;p
<seb128> Amaranth, that's the sort of things I didn't figure and don't do anyway
<hyperair> i use it to load my files
<seb128> and for skipping songs most keyboards have keys
<mac_v> Amaranth: so why shouldnt they have the effect?
<Amaranth> mac_v: It just looks...wrong
<seb128> there were some people suggesting installing gnome-do by default
<mac_v> seb128: oh pls dont
<seb128> but I think the whole thing is just not obvious to any non-tech user
<Amaranth> mac_v: that effect is currently being used right now for gksu to tell you you can't do anything else until you decide what to do here (put in password or cancel)
<seb128> and even for tech users it's not really...
<Amaranth> seb128: it took me a year to figure out the point of quicksilver on OS X, now I can't do without
<Amaranth> hmm, that's not exactly an endorsement
<Amaranth> (gnome-do is very similar to quicksilver)
<mac_v> gnome-do is a quicksilver rip-off ;p
 * chrisccoulson starts installing gnome-do
<Amaranth> it's really meant for power users who are also keyboard junkies
<seb128> I'm using the keyboard a lot
 * mac_v tries to jedi unplug chrisccoulson's connection ;p
<seb128> but I use alt-tab, command lines and alt-f2 usually
<Amaranth> people who would use ratpoison if it was just a little more practical :P
<seb128> and gnome-do didn't bring any value for what I do
<seb128> it's just slow and ugly
<mac_v> i hate it because i cant customize the dock ;p
<hyperair> mac_v: then don't use the dock.
<mac_v> cairo-dock is awesome
<Amaranth> seb128: the people suggesting it be installed by default all seemed to actually want docky
<hyperair> mac_v: anyway docky's pretty cool all the same, though it's going to be splitting off from Do
<Amaranth> seb128: the dock part of gnome-do
<hyperair> cairo dock is awesome, but rather crashy
<hyperair> it lacks polish
<seb128> dunno what docky is
<Amaranth> hyperair: is it? DBO was talking about that some time ago but nothing ever seemed to happen
<seb128> I install gnome-do
<mac_v> the latest 2.0 is great
<mac_v> hyperair: ^
<seb128> and sort of never figured how to run it
<Amaranth> seb128: yet another OS X style dock
<hyperair> Amaranth: the code's split off already.
<Amaranth> seb128: it's a mode in gnome-do
<hyperair> mac_v: maybe i should try it sometime.
<seb128> I managed to make it displays ugly scares with pixelized icons to launch things
<seb128> and that's about it
<Amaranth> it's a theme actually, which is so absurd it's scary
<hyperair> mac_v: the reason i ditched cairo dock was mainly because docky was pretty much do. it allowed me to cut down some resources by using docky instead of cairo dock
 * mac_v waits for a gnome-do plugin for cairo-dock ;)
<Amaranth> well, they call it in "interface" but it's basically this dock with gnome-do latched onto the side
<Amaranth> seb128: so our users want an OS X clone
<mac_v> grr...^
<seb128> not only them, the design team too apparently ;-)
<mac_v> seb128: booo David ;p
<Amaranth> hahahaha
<seb128> half joking there
<hyperair> seb128: if your icons are pixelly you blame your icon theme, not do.
<Amaranth> yeah, kind of biased there
<seb128> every time they try to sell a thing their justification is that macos do it too
<mac_v> eew
<Amaranth> seb128: well OS X is a good model to base your work on if you're worried about usability
<seb128> hyperair, I do blame it but same result, gnome-do looks ugly
<Amaranth> except in the rather huge cases where it isn't
<hyperair> seb128: i've never had a problem with pixelly icons.
<Amaranth> like, well, the dock!
<hyperair> seb128: like i said, your icon theme is screwed. go toss it and get a new oen
<seb128> hyperair, lucky you, the search one displayed by default is ugly there and I use the default theme
<Amaranth> gnome-do developers are recommend you use gnome-colors so as to not make gnome-do look bad
<hyperair> seb128: then file a bug and get the icon fixed.
<Amaranth> s/are//
<mac_v> seb128: sometimes they just say ,its done by OSX rather than why doing it so is good! , thats want is crazy o.0
<mac_v> what*
<seb128> hyperair, oh, there are bugs, the issue is to find icons drawers
<seb128> seems less obvious that you think
<hyperair> seb128: icons drawers?
<Amaranth> gnome-colors has a human-style version ;)
<seb128> hyperair, whoever is drawing icons
<seb128> designers
<mac_v> hehe ;p
<hyperair> ah
<seb128> dunno how you call those guys
<hyperair> the word is artist
<Amaranth> artists
<mac_v> artists
<seb128> but we don't have lot of them around
<hyperair> *not* drawer
 * hyperair facepalms
<Amaranth> hehe
<seb128> well, artists do not only do icons
<seb128> I was speaking about people interested in doing icons
<hyperair> then you call them icon artists
<seb128> not backgrounds
<seb128> ok ;-)
<mac_v> hyperair: seb128 is french so anything he says will sound good ;p
<seb128> lol
<hyperair> haha
<Amaranth> only if he says it in french and in person
<seb128> you don't have a word made from drawing?
<hyperair> also, compiz's code leaves me wondering wtf it's doing
<mac_v> nope
<seb128> ie people who draw?
<mac_v> artists
<seb128> english is weird sometime ;-)
<Amaranth> seb128: we only stole part of french
<seb128> artists are people doing art in french
<seb128> could be music as well as drawing
<Amaranth> hyperair: the code to comment ratio is something like 10000:1
<Amaranth> hyperair: what part are you looking at or looking for?
<hyperair> Amaranth: updatePlugins. there's a bloody assertion that's failing
<hyperair> Amaranth: it's left me without compiz. and no compiz leaves me very annoyed
<hyperair> Amaranth: bug #429858
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 429858 in compiz "compiz.real assert failure: compiz.real: ../../src/display.c:793: updatePlugins: Assertion `j == pListCount' failed." [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/429858
<hyperair> well i could just take the shortcut and comment out the assertion
<hyperair> but what the hell is j supposed to be?!
<hyperair> my goodness they've reused their iterators so many times there's no telling what each iterator is for any more =.=
<Amaranth> oh, that code is rather tame actually
<hyperair> then please fix it. it's not tame enough for me to handle
<Amaranth> j is the number of plugins we added, it should be the size of the pList array
<seb128> Amaranth, btw did you figure why your local compiz rebuilds don't have the transparency issue?
<Amaranth> seb128: no, I'm guessing buildd weirdness and hoping a rebuild will help
<hyperair> Amaranth: so what does j != pListCount imply?
<seb128> seems not likely
<Amaranth> hyperair: pListCount is the number of plugins we should have determined by the number in the original plugin list plus the number in the new plugin list minus the one in the new plugin list that were already in the old plugin list
<Amaranth> so somehow we didn't add enough plugins
 * hyperair groans
<Amaranth> what triggers his?
<Amaranth> this*
<hyperair> starting compiz!
<hyperair> i can't start compiz damnit!
<mac_v> lol
 * hyperair headdesks repeatedly
<hyperair> if this isn't the worst regression i've ever seen, i don't know what is
<Amaranth> hyperair: a bit dramatic
<mac_v> hyperair: add tag regression to the bug ;)
<hyperair> well of course. but you do realize that compiz is a core part of the majority of ubuntu users' desktop usage.
<Amaranth> hyperair: gconftool-2 -g /apps/compiz/general/allscreens/options/active_plugins
<Amaranth> hyperair: and you are the first person I've heard of having this bug :P
<hyperair> [core,ccp,dbus,place,mousepoll,gnomecompat,move,resize,decoration,png,svg,imgjpeg,text,neg,video,wall,snap,animation,scale,scaleaddon,expo,staticswitcher,regex,resizeinfo,workarounds,ezoom,vpswitch,extrawm,fade,session
<hyperair> Amaranth: i didn't report it. there are three duplicates.
<Amaranth> hrm, the sort is different
<hyperair> i remember recursive-unsetting it
<Amaranth> hyperair: bug number?
<hyperair> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/compiz/+bug/429858
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 429858 in compiz "compiz.real assert failure: compiz.real: ../../src/display.c:793: updatePlugins: Assertion `j == pListCount' failed." [Medium,New]
<Amaranth> ah, you said that earlier
 * Amaranth gets more caffeine
<hyperair> indeed
 * hyperair whacks gnome-shell for not having anywhere near compiz functionality
<hyperair> i don't know what i'm going to do when gnome-panel finally gets deprecated in favour of shell
<Amaranth> hyperair: feel like installing every dev package for the entire GNOME and KDE desktops and trying to build compiz with some debug printfs?
<hyperair> Amaranth: hell no.
<hyperair> Amaranth: i've got pbuilder though
<Amaranth> ok, amd64 then?
<hyperair> mmhmm
<hyperair> amd64.
<Amaranth> hyperair: it takes like 20 minutes to download all the dependencies in pbuilder if you've got a decent connection
<Amaranth> not something we want to do over and over
<hyperair> there's /var/cache/pbuilder/aptcache
<Amaranth> just installing them takes 5 minutes
<hyperair> heh maybe for you
<hyperair> i can fall asleep waiting for my pbuilder to finish installing dependencies sometimes
 * Amaranth tries to find wiki page for people.ubuntu.com usage
<seb128> hyperair, don't worry gnome-panel will not be deprecated any time soon
<hyperair> seb128: hmm that's nice to hear, but it will eventually, when shell takes over, right?
<seb128> well, gnome-shell requires 3d to be working
<seb128> so GNOME needs a fallback solution for all users who don't have that
<seb128> so gnome-panel will still be around for a while
<Amaranth> seb128: I heard it'll be around until GNOME 3.2
<Amaranth> The GNOME experience is going to be so different between people with tfp and people without
<Amaranth> tfp = GLX_EXT_texture_from_pixmap
<Amaranth> hmm, sure does take a while to upload to people.ubuntu.com
<seb128> the thing let to know is which ones will get the best experience ;-)
<Amaranth> seb128: people without, from what I've seen
<seb128> ;-)
<hyperair> Amaranth: agree.
<Amaranth> hyperair: http://www.realistanew.com/random/compiz-core_0.8.3+git20090915-0ubuntu1_amd64.deb
<hyperair> is that all that needs to be reinstalled?
<Amaranth> install that and run `compiz &`
<Amaranth> pastebin the output
<hyperair> alright
<Amaranth> I gave up on people.ubuntu.com, it is still supposedly doing something
<Amaranth> took about 2 seconds to upload to my website instead
<hyperair> dupPluginCount=2, pListCount=3, initial plugins=2, final plugin count=2
<hyperair> Amaranth: ^
<Amaranth> hyperair: have you modified compiz-wrapper at all?
<hyperair> lemme stare at it
<Amaranth> it should be shoving 6 plugins in there from the start
<Amaranth> it's only doing 2
<hyperair> hmm
<hyperair> ah i have a dpkg-divert i forgot to remove
<Amaranth> hyperair: CM_DRY=yes compiz
<Amaranth> don't remove the divert yet
<Amaranth> from the dry run paste the Execute line
<hyperair> ..shit i removed it already
<hyperair> /usr/bin/compiz.real --ignore-desktop-hints --replace  core ccp
<hyperair> that's what it says
<Amaranth> ah, core
<hyperair> ?
<Amaranth> yeah, you can't have core in there anymore
<hyperair> i see
<Amaranth> we did in older compiz-wrapper packages but the changes in git to make plugins added on the command line stay loaded no matter what made things blow up if you added core on the command line
<Amaranth> although that was supposed to be fixed too, guess it failed
<Amaranth> sure enough, if I run that line I get the same error
<hyperair> i see
<Amaranth> apparently you and 4 other people are doing things to compiz-wrapper they shouldn't be :P
<hyperair> so why weren't you seeing it in the first place?
<Amaranth> because once I got that crash I fixed compiz-wrapper to not add core before I pushed the changes to bzr
<Amaranth> i just forgot about it
<Amaranth> actually I think before they tried to "fix" it you got an infinite loop of loading/unloading core
<hyperair> hmm
<hyperair> well what i was doing to compiz-wrapper was unblacklisting my gpu
<hyperair> because someone had the great idea to blacklist my pci id
<Amaranth> http://git.compiz.org/compiz/core/commit/?h=compiz-0.8&id=20cdf69d096616104cd26fc30c8efd7e4e4e164d
<Amaranth> hyperair: what chip is that?
<Amaranth> and there are better ways to work around the blacklist
<hyperair> Amaranth: i965
<Amaranth> hyperair: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=582112
<Amaranth> I wrote that post when we blacklisted i965 :P
<hyperair> wait, lemme fix my gconf then log back in
<hyperair> ...this is fun. xsplash won't stop
<hyperair> now i'm staring at an xsplash screen + panel
<hyperair> ah it's finally back to normal
<seb128> xsplash should have a  25 seconds timeout
<seb128> weird that it doesn't go away for you
<hyperair> i see
<hyperair> er it did timeout in the end
<hyperair> it's just that i managed to finish logging in before 25 seconds was up
<seb128> ok, the issue about the timeout being reached when it should not should be fixed after the alpha freeze I think
<hyperair> i see
<hyperair> now then.. is there a way i can tell gdu to go away, and that my 6 bad sectors are here to stay and i'm lazy to do anything (more) with it?
<seb128> the git versions allows that I think
<seb128> chrisccoulson was going to look at backporting the change for karmic
<hyperair> hmm that's nice
<hyperair> it drove me nuts enough to attempt to get those 6 sectors reallocated
<hyperair> i ended up forgetting to include count=1 in my dd invocation and lost 4G of data after a good fsck
 * hyperair has now developed a phobia of dd
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i'm going to look at that gdu change. but it currently blocks on a devicekit-disks update, which will need a FF exception
<seb128> you can also uninstall gnome-disk-utility
<hyperair> hmm true..
<hyperair> or i could prevent it from starting up
<hyperair> i'm interested to know about any *more* issue with my hard disk
<hyperair> like i know about my 6 bad sectors, but if it deteriorates any further, i'd like to know
<mac_v> hyperair: just turn off disk notifications from startup list
<seb128> right, makes sense
<chrisccoulson> here's a screenshot of the new smart status window:
<chrisccoulson> http://people.freedesktop.org/~david/nsui-2.png
<hyperair> mac_v: please read what i said again, more carefully this time ;)
<mac_v> heh , i type slow ;p
<hyperair> chrisccoulson: ooh nice
<chrisccoulson> the notifier is used for more than failure notification too, so turning it off is not a solution;)
<Amaranth> hyperair: If you have 6 bad sectors that means it is going to (probably somewhat quickly) deteriorate further
<hyperair> Amaranth: i know :(
<chrisccoulson> Amaranth - i have 24 bad sectors;)
<chrisccoulson> it's been like that for ages
<hyperair> chrisccoulson: fun. =p how old is it?
<Amaranth> chrisccoulson: just under the threshold for "disk has failed"
<mac_v> i'v had 3 for nearly 1 yr!
<chrisccoulson> it's about 4 years old now
<hyperair> Amaranth: but 24 out of millions of sectors is nothing, right?
<Amaranth> I suppose you could get it like that from the factory due to a manufacturing defect
<hyperair> i wonder how many bad sectors my desktop has..
<hyperair> either way my "bad" sectors aren't bad, but more of half-bad half-ok
<hyperair> sometimes they read
<hyperair> sometimes they don't
<Amaranth> Although if I got a disk with any bad sectors right after buying it I'd be taking it back
<hyperair> same goes for writing
<chrisccoulson> it might be a good thing if my disk fails
<hyperair> my disk failing is a bad thing. /me has backups but they're all over the place
<chrisccoulson> i can then justify buying a new computer to my girlfriend
<seb128> lol
<hyperair> heheh
<chrisccoulson> "i have to buy a new computer because it has a terminal fault and you won't be able to view our photos again"
<chrisccoulson> that should do it ;)
<mac_v> lmao
<chrisccoulson> then i'd just hide this one in another room and use one of the spare disks
 * hyperair prints out the irc logs and files them up for future blackmailing purposes
<Amaranth> chrisccoulson: Too bad you didn't get caught in the recent "karmic is completely broken" stuff
<Amaranth> You could have used that as an excuse, blamed it on the hardware :P
<seb128> oh he did
<chrisccoulson> Amaranth - i got caught up in that;)_
<seb128> he just decided to spend his night to fix it rather than use it as en excuse apparently ;-)
<chrisccoulson> i spent 5 hours last night trying to get my machine to boot ;)
<chrisccoulson> heh
<Amaranth> No one is ever sneaky when their computer is broken
<hyperair> what was the whole karmic is completely broken issue about?
<hyperair> was it the repeated fscks?
<hyperair> due to a bad timestamp or something
<Amaranth> hyperair: something to do with upstart, I guess
<hyperair> huh O_o
<seb128> some people have dbus not starting apparently
<hyperair> i feel lucky i didn't get to see that one
<Amaranth> at least with no dbus you can still plug in an ethernet cable and upgrade to fixed packages
<hyperair> i still have to find some way to hijack my friend's notebook for debugging. 9.10 won't boot for him
<Amaranth> the libc fun a release or two back was real painful
<chrisccoulson> i had no issues with dbus or anything like that, but couldn't boot because i use bindfs for sharing files
<hyperair> Amaranth: oh yeah i got caught up in that. i think it was hardy.
<hyperair> or before that
<Amaranth> hardy sounds right
<hyperair> yeah hardy.
<seb128> chrisccoulson, did you let Keybuk about that issue?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, or opened a bug about it?
<Amaranth> About a month before I had decided to start checking ubuntu forums if any package that would make the system unbootable got updated
<seb128> I'm not addict enough to dist-upgrade to fall into all those issues usually
<Amaranth> that's what saved me
 * hyperair groans
<hyperair> now stackswitch isn't working..
<seb128> by the time I join IRC and want to upgrade there is already enough noise about breakages to let me stay away from those
<Amaranth> seb128: I run a dist-upgrade when I wake up, a dist-upgrade when I go to lunch, and a dist-upgrade before I get off the computer
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah - bug 430880
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 430880 in mountall "bindfs: blocking boot" [Medium,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/430880
<seb128> chrisccoulson, ok, cool
 * hyperair wonders if stackswitch will ever enter ubuntu's archives
 * Keybuk points at the status ;)
<chrisccoulson> right, i'm just going to do that now:)
<Amaranth> Keybuk must have upstart in his highlights :P
<Amaranth> hyperair: stackswitch has never made it into compiz
<Amaranth> hyperair: we don't diverge that far from upstream
<hyperair> oh it hasn't?
<hyperair> can't it be packaged separately though?
<mac_v> Keybuk: are those issues fixed? so its safe to restart? ;)
<Amaranth> no because it isn't really maintained
<hyperair> ah damn
<Amaranth> onestone wrote it when someone told me about the idea in prague and it has sit since
<Amaranth> s/sit/sat/
<Amaranth> actually I think it was Ng but that doesn't seem right
<Keybuk> mac_v: some issues are fixed
<Keybuk> some issues are not fixed
<Amaranth> mac_v: if you don't do any funky networking stuff you should be fine
<mac_v> aw... i'm using the boot ppa ,
<Ng> what did I do? ;)
<Amaranth> Ng: proposed the idea for stackswitch in compiz
<Amaranth> I remember someone sitting with my downstairs and telling me about it but the idea was so exciting I forgot who
<Amaranth> s/my/me/
<Amaranth> too many typos today
<Ng> Amaranth: I haven't suggested random compiz things to you since the UDS in Boston, and I wasn't in Prague ;)
<Amaranth> ok then, wrong person
<Ng> innocent \o/
<chrisccoulson> Keybuk - i'm just trying to get the info for bug 430880 - should mountall actually return eventually?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 430880 in mountall "bindfs: blocking boot" [Medium,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/430880
<Amaranth> oh, I know, it must have been mpt
<Keybuk> no, it doesn't
<Keybuk> well
<Keybuk> it should
<Keybuk> but clearly it doesn't return in your case ;)
<Keybuk> so it's ok to ^C it
<Keybuk> the log up to that point should be reasonably revealing
<chrisccoulson> cool, thanks
<chrisccoulson> Keybuk - http://launchpadlibrarian.net/31922472/mountall.log
<seb128> chrisccoulson, you probably want to change the bug back the new too
<seb128> to new
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i should do really
<chrisccoulson> done!
<Amaranth> hyperair: did dropping the revert fix the problem?
 * Amaranth cries at his inbox
<Keybuk> chrisccoulson: that's weird, your log is missing the important bit
<hyperair> Amaranth: yeah, thanks
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, what's the important bit?
<Keybuk> chrisccoulson: did you ^C it?
<chrisccoulson> i did, there was no extra info when i did that
<Keybuk> chrisccoulson: the dump of what mountall thinks each filesystem is
<chrisccoulson> Keybuk - isn't the last statement there incomplete too? ("dropping unknown")
<Keybuk> yeah
 * Keybuk hates UNIX
<chrisccoulson> Keybuk - i'll attach gdb too it. i wonder if nih_debug chokes on any wierd characters in that entry?
<Keybuk> nah
<Keybuk> it's just silly stdout buffering because you're piping it
<Amaranth> I hate when that happens
<mac_v> Amaranth: i didnt understand the reason for the FUSA not having the logout effect? , its a shutdown or a logout process why should it be treated the same way as the upstream dialogue?
<hyperair> is anyone familiar with gnome-power-manager not locking the screen when suspending/hibernating?
<mac_v> when a user is getting out of the system , the screen darkens
<Amaranth> mac_v: the upstream dialog has choices you need to make before it'll do anything
<Amaranth> well, it'll shutdown if you don't make any choice but that isn't always what you want so you want to make sure they are paying attention to pick the right task
<Amaranth> mac_v: upstream dialog is like windows, fusa dialog is like OS X ;)
<mac_v> Amaranth: yes  ,i understand that , but lack of choices doesnt make the dialogue less important , the present fusa confirmation dialogue is miniscule and doesn grab enough attention
<Amaranth> mac_v: it doesn't have to
<mac_v> it gets lost in the back ground
<Amaranth> if you chose to shutdown and they ignore the window that comes up the system will still shutdown
<Amaranth> pronoun problems...
<Amaranth> mac_v: meanwhile with the upstream dialog if you chose to shutdown but you actually want to suspend if you don't see the dialog it'll shutdown instead
<mac_v> Amaranth: that is the same behavior in the upstream dialogue too
<mac_v> hmm...
<Amaranth> but since we don't use the upstream dialog and you can't make a match rule for the upstream dialog there is nothing that can be done for it
<chrisccoulson> Keybuk - http://launchpadlibrarian.net/31922802/mountall-gdb.log
<chrisccoulson> i interrupted it twice in GDB and got the same trace
<mac_v> Amaranth: why do we have to worry about the upstream dialogue?
<Amaranth> any match rule for the upstream dialog also includes gnome-session running in general
<mac_v> its something like gnome-strati... or what ever the name is ;)
<Amaranth> mac_v: we don't, that's why I closed it instead of adding a gnome-session task to make the upstream dialog distinct
<Amaranth> mac_v: I'm going to pull a Design Team and say "that's how OS X does it"
<Keybuk> chrisccoulson: trace is uninteresting - it's the debug log I want to see
<Keybuk> chrisccoulson: in gdb "run --debug" then capture that
<Keybuk> that *would* be useful
<mac_v> Amaranth: ;p , instead of that we could just use it for FUSA alone, ;) the present dialogue is miniscule ... let me ge tback to  you on that ;)
<mac_v> OSX is not always right
<Amaranth> no but in this case there is no reason to give more attention to the dialog
<Amaranth> it is going to do what you want even if you ignore it
<chrisccoulson> Keybuk - i get the same debug output as before though
<mac_v> Amaranth: indeed there is , since its a countdown , if the user misses it he would be booted out :(
<Amaranth> mac_v: he did ask the system to shut down
<mac_v> hrm...
<Keybuk> chrisccoulson: then try "p fflush (stdout)"
<mac_v> Amaranth: i disagree , but lets get an option from the design team ;)
<mac_v> Amaranth: why is find that its necessary is , since its a process thats closing the session , so the greying out signifies that .... But maybe its just me ;p
<chrisccoulson> Keybuk - http://paste.ubuntu.com/272367/
<Keybuk> that's better
<Keybuk> chrisccoulson: ok, it thinks they're virtual filesystems
<Keybuk> that's ok
 * Keybuk has a fix pending for this
<chrisccoulson> Keybuk - thanks:)
<mac_v> Amaranth: BTW , which plugin does gksu use?
<Amaranth> mac_v: none, I added code to it to do a composited fade
<Amaranth> way before that compiz plugin even existed
<mac_v> the grey background ok the password prompt , started using "Close" animations after the recent compiz update
<mac_v> s/ok/of
<Amaranth> yeah, I see that
<mac_v> \o/
<Amaranth> it avoids that on open by making a window 2x2 or so then resizing it to the size of the screen before starting the fade
<Amaranth> any settings change we make in compiz for this will not take effect if users have changed their animation settings on their own
<mac_v> huh? you mean if we fix the gksu to not having the close animation ... it will break for customized settings?
<mac_v> rather > it will not be fixed for customized settings
<Amaranth> right because the fix would have to be in compiz settings
<Amaranth> hmm, I suppose we could screw with the window type for gksu's fade window
<mac_v> aw!
<Amaranth> but that may cause other problems
<mac_v> what is the window match of that grey background? couldnt we add it to the exclusions...? ;p i guess its not so simple
<Amaranth> mac_v: you can't find it normally since gksu prevents all input while it is running
<Amaranth> and again, if you make such a rule change in compiz only people running stock will see it
<mac_v> aw :(
<Amaranth> since it's a GDK window and not a GTK one it is harder to change the window type
<Amaranth> gdk_window_set_opacity only works on TOPLEVEL windows
<Amaranth> nevermind, figured it out
<Amaranth> mac_v: fixed :)
<mac_v> \o/
<mac_v> Amaranth: how?
<Amaranth> mac_v: gdk_window_set_type_hint (fadeout->window, GDK_WINDOW_TYPE_HINT_DIALOG)
<Amaranth> dialogs get the fade animation
<mac_v> nice :)
<Amaranth> wow, OS X fail
<Amaranth> that's rate
<Amaranth> err, rare
<chrisccoulson> wow, users are really having a rant about tap-to-click being disabled by default
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-09-17
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, ping
<rickspencer3> hi robert_ancell
<rickspencer3> how are you this morning?
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, hi rick
<robert_ancell> good, my video system seems unhappy though, text/panels not always refreshing.  Is it safe to dist-upgrade today?
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, uh
<rickspencer3> I would not recommend a dist-upgrade
<rickspencer3> I think Friday would be a good day (Saturday for you)
<TheMuso> SOmething tells me the alpha will be somewhat delayed.
<kenvandine> robert_ancell, pong
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, hey, do you know much about this empathy patch?
<kenvandine> yeah
<kenvandine> have't looked at it since july though
<robert_ancell> so I've got it to compile and it puts an entry in the menu.
<robert_ancell> Have icons been deprecated though?
<kenvandine> humm
<kenvandine> in the messenging menu?
<robert_ancell> yes, there used to be a set_property_icon
<kenvandine> i think that is a bug... but we need to check with ted
<kenvandine> i was just looking at that in gwibber a few minutes ago
<kenvandine> dbusmenu bug
<kenvandine> so yes... leave set_property_icon there for now
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, ok, so I guess I'm not sure when the patch is "finished".  I've fixed all the requests of upstream and it works but I don't know the requirements for the messaging menu and it doesn't have a lot of documentation
<kenvandine> can you attach a patch to the bug and i can test?
<kenvandine> i can run it by ted too
<kenvandine> or add a patch to the packaging branh and push it somewhere
<kenvandine> s/branh/branch
<robert_ancell> There is a patch in the GNOME bug but I'll build a PPA for it
<kenvandine> if it uses packaging branches
<kenvandine> cool
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, thanks for helping with that!
<robert_ancell> np
<kenvandine> cool, thx robert_ancell!
 * kenvandine goes to get the kids to bed
<ccheney> anyone know if the cpu freq applet is going to be rewritten anytime soon to be useful for newer cpus?
<ccheney> a single cpu now can have 8 'cores' (between real and ht) and will have up to 12 by around december
<ccheney> setting throttling for that many cores using the current applet is painful
<rugby471> pitti or Riddell: could you please have a look at this merge? - https://code.launchpad.net/~rugby471/jockey/fix-386375/+merge/11247
<rugby471> pitti or Riddell: it fixes bug 386375 and get's rid of some unnecessary text in the progress bar (ie. 0% )
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 386375 in jockey ""Hardware Drivers" displays empty error dialog when not connected to the network" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/386375
<rugby471> thanks
<pitti> Good morning
<kklimonda> good morning pitti, I have two questions
<kklimonda> pitti: bug 429483 - it requires UI Freeze exception for a new dialog window (http://trac.transmissionbt.com/ticket/2387) and a Donate link in Help menu.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 429483 in transmission "Transmission 1.75, a bugfix release, is available" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/429483
<kklimonda> pitti: if it's a big no no we can just patch out both of them
<pitti> bratsche: pong
<pitti> bratsche: ah, unpong then :)
<kklimonda> pitti: the second question is about but 42293 - what is the right way of fixing it? or rather when should those symlinks be deleted? I'm trying to get piuparts to work without additional settings and it's one of more irritating bugs. :)
<pitti> Riddell: I have the jockey merge in a tab now, will look at it after the alpha rush
<kklimonda> bug 42293
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 42293 in coreutils "coreutils.mo are dangling symlinks" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/42293
<pitti> hi kklimonda
<pitti> kklimonda: transmission sounds fine, replying in bug
<pitti> kklimonda: followed up in 429483
<pitti> kklimonda: right, I take this on my list now
<asac> hi
<seb128> hello there
<asac> ;)
<asac> is keybuk spree over ;)?
 * asac needs to check what was done to poor networkmanager ;)
<pitti> kklimonda: I assigned the coreutils bug to me, should be relatively easy to fix
<kklimonda> pitti: won't there still be dangling symlinks after you point them to locale-langpack? Or are you going to distribute LC_TIME/coreutils.mo in langpacks too?
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<kklimonda> good morning :)
<pitti> kklimonda: they are the same files
<pitti> kklimonda: of course they will be dangling for the langpacks you don't have installed
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hey pitti
<kklimonda> pitti: so ignore pattern should be added to piuparts for those files anyway? fine by me
<pitti> kklimonda: ah, perhaps; we could also change the package to not get stripped and not have the translations in the langpacks at all
<pitti> not sure how important it is to be able to translate coreutils in LP
<asac> so how can i best figure if a system has upstart or not (upstream fashion)?
<asac> hmm. guess need to wait for keybuk
<robert_ancell> hey pitti
<robert_ancell> can you look at sponsoring the empathy changes in bug 340180 and bug 409828?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 340180 in indicator-messages "Please provide indicator-applet support in empathy" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/340180
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 409828 in empathy "Empathy shows wrong icon for notifications" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/409828
<pitti> hey robert_ancell
<pitti> robert_ancell: not right now, we are in a6 freeze
<robert_ancell> ah, ok
<pitti> robert_ancell: can you please just sub sponsors? I'll do a major sponsoring round tomorrow
<robert_ancell> sub?
<pitti> subscribe
<robert_ancell> np, I was just asking as kenvandine was going to try the changes and this would save doing the PPA
<chrisccoulson> hey pitti - we need a FF exception for the DK-disks update after a6 don't we?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: borderline, I think; it's code cleanup mainly, or is there really a new feature?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i haven't looked at it in much detail, but it seems the smart code got reworked a fair bit to make it more useful
<chrisccoulson> and the API is more simple too
<chrisccoulson> i was going to say it might be best to do dk-disks and g-d-u under the same freez exception request, as both updates depend on each other
<pitti> *nod*
<seb128> hey robert_ancell
<seb128> robert_ancell, how are you?
<robert_ancell> seb128, hey, good
<seb128> pitti, hey
<seb128> pitti, I'm wondering if your devicekit-disks change doesn't break things
<pitti> hi seb128, good morning
<seb128> pitti, we started receiving bugs since yesterday from users saying that gvfs doesn't list their cds and dvds disks anymore
<seb128> I'm wondering if gvfs picks the new devicekit-disks dynamically
<pitti> hm, it should be d-bus activated
<pitti> seb128: can you dupe them and assign to me?
<pitti> it wouldn't be right to never permit a daemon restart
<pitti> phone, bbl
<seb128> pitti, ok
<asac_> whats the best way to restart dbus services?
<asac_> i use killall but that can't be the right approach ;)
<pitti> asac_: I do the same, for d-bus activated services
<pitti> I'm not aware of a more official method
<asac_> hmm
<asac_> ok
<pitti> seb128: gvfs-mount -l; sudo killall devkit-disks-daemon; gvfs-mount -l works here, hmm
<pitti> seb128: didn't try with a CD yet, though
<seb128> pitti, sorry for the email spam I had some timeout issues on launchpad and did the changes several times
<pitti> seb128: but it also kills the polling subprocess, so I guess it's related to that
<asac_> kwwii: is there any further input you need on the NM icons?
<pitti> seb128: np
<seb128> pitti, could be yes
<asac_> kwwii: hi ;)
<kwwii> asac_: hey, just sent you the png and svg files
<asac_> rock!
<kwwii> including an orange one
<rodrigo_> nautilus seems to be broken with last update, is it just me or known?
<asac_> fantastic. now i have to integrate all this ;)
<kwwii> asac_: just let me know if there are any problems or you need anything else
<kwwii> asac_: note that I will be on a plane back home this afternoon
 * rodrigo_ upgrades some more packages
<seb128> rodrigo_, how broken? what update? there was no recent change
<rodrigo_> seb128: it doesn't start, gives some dbus errors, and ends
<asac_> kwwii: hmm ... i have problems accessing my mail server ... can you bounce the mail to asacasa@gmail.com too?
<rodrigo_> seb128: will file a bug if you don't know about it
<asac_> kwwii: (in case it doesnt come back up until i get to this)
<mac_v> asac_: nice palindrome for a mail id ;)
<asac_> its googles fault ... they said that 4 letters are not long enough :/
<asac_> yeah. but i somehow like it ;) ... if it wasn't that long ;)
<rodrigo_> seb128: http://pastebin.ca/1569421
<seb128> rodrigo_, is dbus running?
<seb128> urg
<rodrigo_> seb128: yes, seems so
<seb128> rodrigo_, dpkg -l | grep gvfs-backends
<rodrigo_> seb128: oh, no gvfs-backends package
<seb128> pitti, some of the guest session changes made notification-daemon be used there
<rodrigo_> I guess that's it
 * rodrigo_ installs
<seb128> rodrigo_, that's it yes
<seb128> how did you manage to remove it?
<seb128> pitti, oh, it's because the .service checks for GDMSESSION being gnome or default
<rodrigo_> I didn't do it myself, so either it was not installed, or was removed with the dist-upgrade
<seb128> not guest-restricted
<pitti> seb128: ah, that would be it
<pitti> good catch
<seb128> rodrigo_, grep gvfs-backends /var/log/dpkg.log
<rodrigo_> seb128: nothing there
<seb128> pitti, should I just add guest-restricted to the notify-osd .service?
<pitti> seb128: either that, or just invert the test and check for stracciatella perhaps?
<seb128> rodrigo_, grep gvfs-backends /var/log/dpkg.log*
<pitti> seb128: I'm not sure what Xubuntu etc. want
<rodrigo_> seb128: is this a new package, or has it been around for long?
<seb128> pitti, ok
<rodrigo_> seb128: right, nothing in /var/log/dpkg.log*
<seb128> rodrigo_, it's there since gvfs is in ubuntu, ie hardy
<rodrigo_> hmm
<seb128> rodrigo_, dpkg -l | grep gvfs?
<rodrigo_> seb128: I just installed it, so now it's there:
<rodrigo_> ii  gvfs                                        1.3.6-0ubuntu1                             userspace virtual filesystem - server
<rodrigo_> ii  gvfs-backends                               1.3.6-0ubuntu1                             userspace virtual filesystem - backends
<rodrigo_> ii  gvfs-bin                                    1.3.6-0ubuntu1                             userspace virtual filesystem - binaries
<rodrigo_> ii  gvfs-fuse                                   1.3.6-0ubuntu1                             userspace virtual filesystem - fuse server
<rodrigo_> ii  libgvfscommon0                              1.3.6-0ubuntu1                             userspace virtual filesystem - library
<seb128> ok
<seb128> weird
<rodrigo_> ok, now it starts
<seb128> if nautilus worked before it was installed
<seb128> it's weird that you don't have it in the dpkg.log though
<rodrigo_> yeah
<Amaranth> hrm, wish we could block people from filing bug reports if they're using SKIP_CHECKS to override the compiz blacklist
<Amaranth> s/bug reports/apport crash reports/
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - do you think we should split services-admin from g-s-t and remove it from the CD now? it's pretty useless in the upstart world now isn't it?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: +1
<pitti> chrisccoulson: it's useless and error prone enough with the old init scripts
<chrisccoulson> pitti - cool, i'll do that then (and possibly the g-s-t update too)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - do you have any opinion about polkit-gnome-authorizations too? that doesn't manage the new polkit-1 policies, so that could probably go as well couldn't it?
 * chrisccoulson puts on cruft-busting gloves
<james_w> bin it!
<chrisccoulson> cool:)
<chrisccoulson> i'll try and work on that as well then!
<james_w> only thing it manages now is packagekit, hal, screenresolution-extra and checkbox
<james_w> so there's no need for it to be in the default install I don't think
<james_w> (on my system that is)
<chrisccoulson> james_w - yeah, i agree. i don't think many users will find a need for editing those policies
<james_w> though it seems like we should be able to get people to port the last two
<chrisccoulson> james_w - possibly. i don't think screenresolution-extra would be difficult to port
<tseliot> chrisccoulson: what should screenresolution-extra do? What changes are you suggesting?
<james_w> hi tseliot
<chrisccoulson> tseliot - it is still using the old policykit isn't it?
<tseliot> james_w: hi James
<tseliot> chrisccoulson: I guess so. I wasn't aware of the changes in policykit
 * tseliot hasn't touched policykit code for a few months now
<chrisccoulson> tseliot - yeah, a lot of stuff moved to the new polkit-1 API. it's not a big issue, because both versions are on the CD
<chrisccoulson> and there are some things (like HAL) which will never be ported
<tseliot> chrisccoulson: are there any examples of the new API in python I can look at?
<chrisccoulson> tseliot - not sure about python examples.
<chrisccoulson> actually, apport would be a good example
<tseliot> ok, I'll have a look at apport then. Thanks
<seb128> re
<chrisccoulson> tseliot - it's not particularly important this cycle, as the old polkit has to stay around for HAL anyway
<chrisccoulson> hi seb128
<seb128> another half an hour wasted waiting for my computer to boot, karmic is no fun this week
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson
<tseliot> chrisccoulson: ah, ok, so would it be something I can port to, say, Karmic+1?
<chrisccoulson> tseliot - it would probably be best to do in karmic+1 now, given the stage we are at in karmic now
<tseliot> chrisccoulson: this is good news as I'm very busy with X stuff right now :-)
<chrisccoulson> tseliot - FYI, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/PolicyKitOneMigration gives a summary of work still outstanding for the migration
<tseliot> chrisccoulson: excellent, thanks
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - are you having issues booting too?
<seb128> it's rather than I get nothing on screen and fsck running every second boot now
<seb128> so I just have to sit there and wait 15 minutes for it to be done when it happens
<seb128> and I can't see why it runs fsck since there is nothing display on screen
<asac> seb128: have you tried to switch your clock to UTC?
<seb128> asac, no
<seb128> I don't like to workaround bugs because otherwise we forget about those and they don't get fixed for our users
 * Laney seems to be tickling lots of boot bugs
<asac> actually i think the problem is not unclean shutdown
<asac> it happened for me after two days off
<Laney> found an unrelated util-linux/udev one yesterday
<asac> but the superblock timestamp was still exactly 2h ahead
<Laney> reinstalled and found a mountall one too :)
<seb128> asac, the fsck due to timezone offset?
<asac> yes
<asac> is that fixed?
 * asac doesnt reboot anymore
<seb128> asac, right, Keybuk tracked that to a fs issue
<seb128> no
<asac> seb128: bug id?
<seb128> ask scott when he's around
<asac> k
<asac> i hope its on release team radar ;)
<seb128> he said that e2fsck and dumpe2fs disagree on the timestamp set
<asac> ok sounds like there is an idea at least
<tseliot> seb128, Amaranth: I think I've just found out why compiz didn't work any more with my nvidia card. Something messed up my settings for the opacity plugin: http://albertomilone.com/ubuntu/karmic/screenshots/compiz-problem.png
<Ng> are there any issues with devicekit-power wedging? I was poking at a failure to suspend last night and I realised that g-p-m was unresponsive and I think it was blocked talking to devkit-power, which also seemed to be blocked on something
<seb128> pitti, interesting change in gdm git: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=565151
<ubottu> Gnome bug 565151 in general "Thrashing autofs home directory mounts" [Normal,Resolved: fixed]
<seb128> pitti, they store configs in /var/cache/gdm now
<seb128> pitti, that fixes the "user dir is not accessible to read config"
<pitti> seb128: oh, nice!
<pitti> rad
<pitti> sorry for being absent for so long, it took me half an hour to get my machine booting again
<pitti> it's completely wedged
<seb128> pitti, join the club
<pitti> I'll just reisntall my laptop now
<seb128> <seb128> another half an hour wasted waiting for my computer to boot, karmic is no fun this week
<pitti> for me it hangs forever on "starting sad crypto disks..."
<seb128> it seems to run fsck every second boot there
<seb128> but I've nothing on screen so I just wait 15 minutes and get my desktop eventually
<pitti> right, now it disables my screen again as well
<pitti> seb128: argh, indeed, no CD-ROMs any more
<pitti> but that's not due to yesterday's devkit change
<pitti> it just changes the postinst
<pitti> and this is a clean boot
<seb128> hum ok
<seb128> linux bug?
<pitti> need to investigate later
<pitti> first I need a working machine again
<seb128> gvfs didn't change recently
<pitti> I see the CD in devkit-disks --dump
<pitti> but not in gvfs-mount -li
<seb128> gvfs didn't change for over a week now
<seb128> so it's weird
<seb128> restart, brb
<pitti> I'm off for reinstalling, bbl
<pitti_reinstalli> hm, seems seb128's reboot didn't go so well
<seb128> re
<seb128> ok, laptop seems to boot and work ok again now
<kklimonda> why isn't it possible to disable touchpad from mouse settings anymore?
<seb128> why do you need to do that?
<chrisccoulson> kklimonda - it isn't possible because that's how upstream implemented it ;)
<chrisccoulson> wb seb128
<kklimonda> seb128: I have both touchpad and trackpoint and I never use touchpad but from time to time I accidentally touch it and move my mouse. Not too often or I would dig deeper but often enough to notice that I can't disable it anymore ;)
<pitti_reinstalli> seb128: welcome back
<pitti_reinstalli> seb128: what did you change?
<pitti_reinstalli> seb128: I just commented on the gvfs cd bug, I think I know what's going on
<seb128> pitti: nothing, new set of updates and clean boot seemed to be enough there
<pitti_reinstalli> (don't have it at hand, I'm on my wife's computer while mine is reinstalling)
<pitti_reinstalli> seb128: most likely it's due to the gvfs-gdu-volume-monitor crash
<seb128> I just read your comment
<pitti_reinstalli> the monitor that's for the CD drive
<seb128> "the crash"
<seb128> like there was only one ;-)
<pitti_reinstalli> well, that one has a gazillion dupes :)
<seb128> urg, that many duplicates? why the heck didn't I get email about those
<pitti_reinstalli> and most importantly, of course, it's the one that I get, too :-P
<seb128> pitti_reinstalli, any clue of what is going on or should I ping davidz or alex about it?
<pitti_reinstalli> seb128: haven't looked at it at all yet, TBH
<pitti_reinstalli> after this alpha6 mess, I need to close IRC for a day to do a catch-up/debugging session or so
<pitti_reinstalli> not tomorrow, since there's release team meeting and some other catch-up/sponsoring to do, but perhaps next Monday and Tuesday half day each
<seb128> pitti_reinstalli, ok, I will try pinging upstream guys, GNOME 2.28 is on monday
<seb128> pitti_reinstalli, I will handle sponsoring, I'm not that busy today and tomorrow
<seb128> I just wait for the freeze to be over
<seb128> do you know if the freeze is likely to end today?
<chrisccoulson> i did some nice easy updates last night for you to sponsor:)
<seb128> yeah I noticed, thanks!
<chrisccoulson> so, no-one has looked at the GDU crasher yet? (the one with gazillion dupes). I don't mind taking a look - I could do with something to take my mind off work!
<chrisccoulson> brb, lunch#
<pitti_reinstalli> seb128: I hope we can get a6 out today
<seb128> pitti_reinstalli, ok good
<seb128> didrocks, hello
<didrocks> hey seb128 :)
<seb128> didrocks, how are you?
<seb128> didrocks, do you want to do the mutter update when you have a slot for an update?
<didrocks> seb128: fine, still busy all this week, but fine :)
<didrocks> seb128: it's already on my week-end schedule
<seb128> excellent, thanks!
<seb128> good luck for your busy week ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: thanks a lot :-)
<didrocks> seb128: also, if somebody can work review the MIR when alpha is out: bug #428793 it would be great.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 428793 in goocanvas "MIR for goocanvas" [Wishlist,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/428793
<didrocks> one thing less to think about :)
<didrocks> oh promoted :)
<seb128> it's fix released?
<didrocks> yes, this night
<didrocks> next time, I'll check :-)
<seb128> ;-)
<james_w> pitti_reinstalli: do you have a ~/.xsession-errors from the gvfs crash?
<didrocks> (thanks pitti_reinstalli)
<pitti_reinstalli> james_w: not right now, just reinstalling; I'll let you know once the box comes back up
<james_w> pitti_reinstalli: great, thanks
<james_w> it seems like adding an apport hook to get ~/.xsession-errors would sometimes get the wrong one wouldn't it?
<didrocks> seb128: so, you should be able to sponsor bug #425339 now when you have some time
<davmor2> pitti_reinstalli: we got pretty good coverage going on :)
<james_w> they run at submission time, so it would only help if the submission was made in the same session as the problem
<ubottu> Error: Could not parse data returned by Launchpad: timed out (https://launchpad.net/bugs/425339/+text)
<pitti_reinstalli> oh noes.. I just reinstalled this, and it's still broken
<pitti_reinstalli> eternal hard disk activity, disabled screen
<seb128> didrocks, yes, will do after the freeze
<didrocks> perfect, thanks :)
<pitti_reinstalli> *nnng*
 * didrocks returns to fight back on work :-)
<seb128> james_w, pitti_reinstalli: having apport adding .xsession-errors lines from before the crash would make sense
<seb128> bug-buddy does it for GNOME bugs too
<james_w> I'm pretty sure in this case there's going to be a line about some DBus issue talking to devkit-disks, so it would be invaluable
<pitti_reinstalli> hm, I'm a bit hesitant to always attach it, though; could it potentially have sensitive stuff?
<seb128> well as said bug-buddy does it
<pitti_reinstalli> or can we have a regexp which would filter out interesting stuff?
<pitti_reinstalli> ok
<seb128> and programs printing sensitive informations should be fixed
<seb128> well we can add a regexp too if required
<TheMuso> /c/c
<pitti_reinstalli> a lot of users even complained about disclosing the user name or paths
<seb128> or add this only to apport-crash bugs by default
<seb128> they are private by default anyway
<pitti_reinstalli> we'd reintroduce that
<pitti_reinstalli> seb128: perhaps we can start with filtering somethign like Glib-CRITICAL.* ?
<seb128> I was going to suggest that
<seb128> warnings and errors
<pitti_reinstalli> (gnome-panel:3485): libglade-WARNING **: Unexpected element <requires-version> inside <glade-interface>.
<pitti_reinstalli> that's also interesting
<pitti_reinstalli> (gnome-settings-daemon:3475): GLib-CRITICAL **: g_propagate_error: assertion `src != NULL' failed
<pitti_reinstalli> and that perhaps
<pitti_reinstalli> that sounds easy enough for a regexp
<seb128> hum
<seb128> what ubuntu version do you run?
<pitti_reinstalli> that's jaunty here
<seb128> gnome-panel should be using gtkbuilder
<seb128> ah ok ;-)
<pitti_reinstalli> can't throw Karmic at my wife just yet
<pitti_reinstalli> I have enough to do helping her with computer stuff even with stable releases :)
<seb128> anyway getting those is the useful part usually
<mat_t> mvo: playing with software store - looking great!
<james_w> it would be useful if they could be stashed somewhere, so that they could be requested if needed
<pitti_reinstalli> so, ^(.*:\d+): \w+\(WARNING|CRITICAL|ERROR):.*
<pitti_reinstalli> seb128: ^
<seb128> +1
<mat_t> mvo: great work :)
<pitti_reinstalli> james_w: right, they are gone after restarting session
<james_w> rather than "please restart your session (as it is truncated), reproduce the problem, then attach the file here"
<james_w> perhaps over the top, but useful
<pitti_reinstalli> seb128: would you mind throwing that into an apport bug and assign it to me? (sorry, bad working env here)
<james_w> missing a backslash :-)
<james_w> ERROR\):.*
<seb128> hey mvo, Amaranth, did you read anything about compiz breaking keybindings changes recently?
<seb128> bah, they did the reportbug change on launchpad now
<seb128> pitti_reinstalli, will do
 * pitti_reinstalli hugs seb128
 * seb128 hugs pitti_reinstalli back
<pitti_reinstalli> seb128: +filebug?no-redirect or ubuntu-bug
<seb128> ok, no-redirect, thanks
<seb128> pitti_reinstalli, bug #431807
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 431807 in apport "would be nice to send xsessions-errors warnings and errors" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/431807
<pitti_reinstalli> seb128: thanks
<kenvandine> seb128, can you also sponsor bug 430881 when you do the gdm upload too?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 430881 in xsplash "xsplash 0.8" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/430881
<kenvandine> seb128, gdm will require that
<seb128> kenvandine, I do plan to clean the sponsoring queue after the freeze
<mvo> glatzor: hi, I wonder if https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/software-store/+bug/423718/comments/3 means that we can try again to get conffile and debconf support
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 423718 in software-store "Use Packagekit instead of gnome-app-install." [Undecided,Incomplete]
<mvo> glatzor: I will work on the conffile handling in aptdaemon (if you don't mind) now
 * pitti_reinst hugs glatzor
<pitti_reinst> seb128: I still see bug 431812 and added some analysis; you got this as well?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 431812 in sysvinit "screen powers off during fsck" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/431812
<pitti_reinst> if so, please confirm
<seb128> pitti_reinst, yes
<pitti_reinst> seb128: it only really matters with fsck, but I think you got that a lot
<seb128> I've that every second reboot
<pitti_reinst> ok, so it's not just me
<seb128> pitti_reinst, I've added a comment to the bug
<huats> hello everyone !
<seb128> lut huats
<seb128> huats, ca va?
<huats> hello seb128
<huats> back in Toulouse
<huats> :)
<seb128> ok
<seb128> too far to annoy didrocks now then? ;-)
<seb128> bbl, doing iso testing and playing with some updates too
<Keybuk> so, compiz doesn't remember my key bindings between reboots anymore
<Keybuk> how would I debug that?
 * pitti back
<pitti> mvo: btw, had a look at software-store while reinstalling - this looks nice!
<mvo> pitti: thanks
<chrisccoulson> Amaranth - do you know about compiz keybinding issues? I've seen a few people now say that it's forgetting custom keybindings
<Laney> I lost my switch workspace keybindings a couple of times
<pitti> I have some custom keybindings here, but I never lost them, hmm
<Laney> set in gnome-keybinding-properties
<seb128> chrisccoulson, bug #430981
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 430981 in compiz "keybindings not remembered on reboot" [Low,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/430981
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - thanks
<Keybuk> seb128: I wouldn't say Low, I'd say Medium
<seb128> Keybuk, I set to low because that's one user and not confirmed
<seb128> Keybuk, I planned to move to high if that's happening to everybody though
<Keybuk> it's certainly happening to me
<Keybuk> I'm not everybody though ;)
<seb128> well that makes several users
<seb128> can be bumped ;-)
 * seb128 does that now
<seb128> bug settings bumped, assigned to canonical desktop team and karmic task added
<seb128> chrisccoulson, can you dup bugs you see from this one?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, can do. i've not looked for other bugs yet, but some people mentioned it on IRC
<seb128> can you point them there?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, no problem
<seb128> thanks
<dobey> hola
<dobey> seb128: can i get those uploads now? :)
<seb128> hey
<seb128> dobey, no, alpha6 freeze still in effect
<dobey> oh ok
<dobey> seb128: is there generally a specific time when it's unfrozen, or is it 'when the CD is generated and released'?
<seb128> dobey, when the cd are online and announced
<dobey> seb128: ok, thanks
<seb128> you're welcome
<mac_v> mvo: hi.. you around?
<mvo> mac_v: yes
<mac_v> mvo: mat wants a patch for Bug 402633 , will this work > http://paste.ubuntu.com/272865/
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 402633 in compiz-fusion-plugins-main "Change the animation on window close to fade" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/402633
<kwwii> pitti: do you know when the xplash artwork will be in place?
<pitti> bratsche: ^ do you?
<mac_v> mvo: was confused since the bug reports the present animation for close as glide 2 but the animation.xml has it listed as zoom!
<bratsche> kwwii: kenvandine has made the package and uploaded it I think.. but I'm not sure when it goes in exactly.
<pitti> ah, so I guess it'll be uploaded after the alpha freeze
<bratsche> Is that later today?
<mvo> mac_v: hm, IIRC its glide2, I can have a look later when I'm done with working on software-store (for today)
<kwwii> bratsche: hrm, not having it before the beta would be bad if we still need to change things
<mac_v> mvo: ok , thanks ,:)
<kwwii> bratsche: anyway, thanks for the info
<kenvandine> pitti, yeah it is waiting to be sponsored (after a6)
<bratsche> kenvandine: dbarth wanted to see if there's any chance we could do another xsplash release before then to get in one more bugfix that I made last night.
<kenvandine> bratsche, sure
<kenvandine> merge it all to trunk and tag it please
<kenvandine> 0.8.1 :)
<bratsche> Okay, all merged up and version is incremented to 0.8.1
<kenvandine> ok
 * kenvandine turns the crank
<bratsche> heh
<kenvandine> bratsche, what was the bug number you fixed with the panel-above branch?
<kenvandine> bratsche, it would be handy if you included bug numbers in the commit logs :)
<bratsche> Oh yeah, sorry.
<bratsche> https://bugs.launchpad.net/xsplash/+bug/427511
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 427511 in xsplash "bottom gnome-panel bar sometime on top of xsplash" [Medium,Confirmed]
<kenvandine> thx :)
<james_w> --fixes!
<mac_v> mvo: hm... i got the source for compiz from > https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/karmic/+source/compiz-fusion-plugins-main/0.8.3+git20090914-0ubuntu1 , was that the wrong source :(
<pitti> mvo: btw, I can't uninstall gnome-app-install, apturl still holds it in
<pitti> mvo: will apturl be ported to software-store?
<pitti> if not, we need to hide it somehow, we hardly want two Add/Remove apps
<pitti> seb128: tossed you bug 431882, please let me know if you are overloaded
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 431882 in gnome-panel "Software Store shows up under System Menu instead of Applications menu" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/431882
<seb128> pitti, not overloaded but I fixed that bug already?
<pitti> oh, then it's a dupe?
<seb128> pitti, the current position is what the spec describe
<seb128> talk to mpt?
<pitti> ah, I see
<seb128> bug #426209
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 426209 in software-store ""Ubuntu Software Store" is in the wrong place in the panel menus" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/426209
<seb128> "<https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SoftwareStore#Launching%20graphically>: 'âUbuntu Software Storeâ should be a top-level item in the âSystemâ menu, immediately after âAdministrationâ but before the following separator. It should not be present anywhere in the âApplicationsâ menu.'"
<seb128> rickspencer3, ^
<pitti> seb128: bug updated
<seb128> pitti, thanks
<seb128> I don't mind either way but somebody decide and let me know
<seb128> I can change it back if required
<rickspencer3> seb128, I think that's wrong
<rickspencer3> seb128, I'll let you know how it pans out
<seb128> rickspencer3, please talk to mpt and let me know what to do then ;-)
<pitti> It feels wrong to me as well, but at least the current situation is deliberate
<seb128> thanks
<rickspencer3> seb128, right
<pitti> but at least we need to uninstall gnome-app-install
<pitti> i. e. fix apturl (or drop it)
<seb128> right
<mvo> pitti: yeah, I will port the required functionatlity
<james_w> interesting: https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/353278
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 353278 in policykit-kde "[jaunty] kpackagekit doesn't prompt for user password" [Medium,Confirmed]
<mat_t> seb128: hey
<mat_t> seb128: could you have a peek at the patch here https://bugs.launchpad.net/hundredpapercuts/+bug/402633
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 402633 in hundredpapercuts "Change the animation on window close to fade" [Low,Fix committed]
<mat_t> seb128: see if it's good to go
<seb128> mvo, ^
<seb128> mat_t, why did you change the ubuntu task to fix commited?
<mvo> seb128: let me check
<seb128> mvo, thanks!
<mat_t> seb128: oh, sorry, I thought this was appropriate
<mat_t> seb128: still a newbie when it comes to these things ;)
<seb128> mat_t, well it's wrong if the fix is not in bzr and it probably means people will not open the bug
<seb128> ie they will think the change is done and waiting for upload when it's not
<mat_t> I see
<pitti> seb128: meh, seems I can't reproduce bug 376145 now :-(
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 376145 in gvfs "gvfs-gdu-volume-monitor crashed with SIGSEGV in gdu_pool_get_presentables()" [Unknown,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/376145
<seb128> ok, me neither
<pitti> I got it several times before my reinstall, and now when I want to look at it, it's gone
<seb128> but alex said he would ping davidz about it
<seb128> so let's see how it goes
<pitti> and CDs work fine
<pitti> so at least I now know that it's a dup
<pitti> I'll stare at the backtrace and code for a bit
<rugby471> mvo & mac_v: hello
<rugby471> pitti: did you manage to look at that jockey merge proposal today?
<mvo> hey rugby471
<pitti> hey rugby471
<pitti> rugby471: yes, see bug report, I updated it
<mvo> rugby471: I merged your branch this morning, I left in the spinner gif in the image loading dialog (hope that was ok) - out of curisotry, what was the reason to remove it?
<rugby471> pitti: ah just saw it in my inbox :-)
<rugby471> mvo: yeah I wanted to talk toy you about that
<rugby471> toy > to
<rugby471> basically we already have a progress bar in the dialog to show something is happening
<rugby471> I didn't feel there was need for two things to be shown
<rugby471> the other reason is that I think it will bring more toruble with it
<mvo> rugby471: ok, that makes sense. I left it in because when I tested it screenshots.d.o was down and no progress bar at all
<mvo> rugby471: trouble in what way?
<pitti> seb128: hah! as soon as I enter a CD, I get
<pitti> Drive changed:      'CD/DVD Drive'
<rugby471> to fit in with all gtk themes, (to be transparent)  we have to ship the png frames
<pitti> Drive disconnected: 'CD/DVD Drive'
<rugby471> mvo: which is more trouble :-)
<pitti> seb128: it doesn't actually crash, though
<rugby471> mvo: screenshot.d.n is back up now, I email christoph
<rugby471> emal > emailed
<mvo> rugby471: heh, ok. yeah, the white on gray is not that great
<mvo> rugby471: oh, nice
<rugby471> mvo: hehe
 * mvo scratches his head
<mvo> maybe we can make it pulse until the first progress is recived?
<mvo> (it == the progressbar?)
<rugby471> mvo: I though the progress bar started as soon as the dialog is loaded?
<mvo> rugby471: yes, but initially its empty until the first block (8k) is transfered
<rugby471> mvo: oh
<mvo> so if the thing stalls from the start it looks like nothing is happening
<rugby471> mvo: I suppose that is a good idea then :-)
<mvo> cool :)
<mac_v> rugby471:  hi ;)
<mvo> mac_v: I commited the patch for plugins-main
<rugby471> mvo, pitti: just going to do some testing so I have to trun my internet connection off :-)
<rugby471> turn
<mac_v> mvo: thanks ;) ... did i do the patch against the right version?
<mvo> mac_v: I modified it a bit to be part of the 01-animations-default patch
<mvo> testing now, if its good, I will upload
<mac_v> ah ok ... :)
<rugby471> I am back :-)
<tgpraveen> bigon: will empathy have msn audio/video chat in karmic?
<rugby471> pitti: The reason I was using [-3] is because there were two empty values in the list that I received
<seb128> tgpraveen, the upgrade is still being discussed
<pitti> rugby471: do you have a trivial way to reproduce such an error?
<rugby471> pitti: anyway I have now added some code to remove any such balnk items of the list
<rugby471> *blank
<pitti> rugby471: the code is meant to grab a standard exceptoin output and give the last line
<seb128> pitti, still debugging this cdrom issue?
<pitti> seb128: got side-tracked, but will get back to it
<rugby471> pitti: sorry :-)
<seb128> pitti, any idea if somebody will track me down if I start uploading now? ;-)
 * mac_v points seb128 to logs ;p
<pitti> we need a DELAYED queue :)
<rugby471> pitti: using this http://pastebin.com/d9b57071 makes it all better
<seb128> we need people to lift freezes ;-)
<rugby471> pitti: is this okay to put in ?
<pitti> seb128: I really don't want to lift the freeze without consulting Steve, I didn't follow all the breakage in detail
<pitti> ah, seems he just woke up
<rugby471> pitti: or not compliant with your writing style (if jockey has one)
<seb128> pitti, ok, cool
<pitti> rugby471: it's really really weird that an exception would have empty trailing lines
<rugby471> yeah but I get it everytime on jaunty
<pitti> rugby471: as I said, first I'd like to see the actual output which causes that empty dialog
<rugby471> pitti: and that was what the bug was originally about
<pitti> e. g. reproducing it in a mechanical manner (for the test suite)
<rugby471> pitti: do you want me to pastebin the list I get
<rugby471> ?
<pitti> rugby471: then, this should be much easier with
<pitti> rugby471: str(e).strip().splitlines()[-1]
<pitti> rugby471: please do
<rugby471> ah, forgot about strip() :-)
<rugby471> that is much cleaner
<rugby471> pitti: see you in a sec
<pitti> seb128: asking
<rugby471> pitti: here we go
<rugby471> pitti: http://pastebin.com/d2afa5f13
<rugby471> pitti: is that okay ?
<pitti> rugby471: oh, fun
<rugby471> pitti: hehe
<pitti> rugby471: right, then I believe adding strip() is the correct solution
<rugby471> cool
<rugby471> pitti: should I update my branch with that then?
<rugby471> pitti: or do you just want to commit to trunk?
<pitti> rugby471: please go ahead and update the branch and merge request
<rugby471> pitti: okay
<rugby471> pitti: just going to dinnner, will update when I am back
<pitti> no time to look at it right now, sorry, and tomorrow I'll have forgotten about it without getting a new mail :)
<rugby471> hehe
<mat_t> mvo: thx!
<pitti> seb128: go wild!
<seb128> pitti, yes sir!
<pitti> @all: freeze is lifted, go ahead and upload
<chrisccoulson> yay!
<chrisccoulson> :)
<Zdra> seb128, did you had time to think about that stupid default to not show icons in menus?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - did you say you have issues with your CD drive too?
<seb128> Zdra, I'm not thinking about that one
<Zdra> seb128, to add an argument: Try to make something with inkscape: GOOD LUCK !
<pitti> chrisccoulson: yes, seems the gdu monitor dies when I insert a CD
<seb128> Zdra, I'm waiting for the feedback after beta, we have time to switch the gconf key
<pitti> seb128: I'll upload gdm
<Zdra> seb128, ok
<seb128> pitti, can you sponsor kenvandine's change too
<seb128> pitti, and the accessibility one?
<pitti> seb128: sure, that's included
<seb128> they are both trivial
<chrisccoulson> oh, ok. i don't see that. i thought that the "devkit-disks --dump" output in the bug report was a bit strange
<pitti> seb128: oh, that's not committed; looking
<chrisccoulson> "mount paths:             /tmp/cdrom"
<pitti> chrisccoulson: looks like wedged fstab?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - thats what i was wondering. perhaps you could try removing the CD entry from your fstab?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: anyway, I originally suspected it would be due to bug 376145
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 376145 in gvfs "gvfs-gdu-volume-monitor crashed with SIGSEGV in gdu_pool_get_presentables()" [Unknown,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/376145
<pitti> chrisccoulson: i. e. that the monitor for the CD-ROM crahes
<seb128> pitti, bug #423831
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 423831 in gdm "gdm > 2.26: a11y should use onboard and not gok that is missing" [Low,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/423831
<pitti> chrisccoulson: oh, we stopped adding cdrom entries to fstab a while ago, I don't have one
<pitti> seb128: thx
<chrisccoulson> pitti - possibly. but would you not lose other volumes in computer:/// too?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i still have a CD entry on a fresh install
<seb128> pitti, that can wait if you want to upload now
<pitti> chrisccoulson: hm, I did a fresh install today
<chrisccoulson> (although i installed from the alternate CD)
<pitti> seb128: no, that's fine, I'll review it
<pitti> chrisccoulson: ah, it's only ubiquity
<seb128> pitti, thanks!
<pitti> chrisccoulson: d-i still does it for server love
 * chrisccoulson goes to remove CD entries from fstab
<seb128> pitti, did you review the xsplash changes for license etc?
<pitti> seb128: yes, there was a merge proposal which I ack'ed
<seb128> ok thanks
<seb128> sponsoring now
<pitti> \o/
 * seb128 goes wild on uploads
<pitti> -changes@ gets full :)
<pitti> seb128: ok, new gdm conflicts to xsplash < 0.8, so if you sponsor that now, I can go ahead with gdm
<seb128> pitti, how does it conflict?
<seb128> pitti, I think we should not have a conflict there
<pitti> seb128: it calls a new option, --daemon
<seb128> what happens if the option is not available?
<pitti> xsplash wouldn't start, I guess
<seb128> if that's only xsplash will not be used it's better than having people uninstalling xsplash no?
<pitti> probably yes
<seb128> anyway I've already uploaded xsplash
<pitti> kenvandine: ^ ?
<seb128> it will go through binary new though
<pitti> seb128: it'll be in NEW, though
<pitti> I'll test the gok->onboard change now, and then remove the conflicts
<seb128> pitti, thanks
<seb128> pitti, hum, let it
<seb128> less risky if the other alternative is to block on xsplash
<seb128> well I guess xsplash --unknown-option will not block
<rugby471> pitti: I have pushed the changes and redone the merge proposal, do you need me to remind you in the morning or anything?
<pitti> rugby471: I should get mail about it, thanks
<rugby471> pitti: thankyou ! :-)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - do you see any warnings in ~/.xsession-errors before the volume monitor crashes?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: if only I knew -- since my reinstall today I don't get the crash any more
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I probably need to restart a couple of times
<pitti> I don't think that a mere reinstall could cure that
<chrisccoulson> i'm just trying to look at why it might crash (i cant recreate it here either). there are some g_warnings in gdu that might give an idea why gdu_pool_new could return NULL
<chrisccoulson> there is no NULL pointer check in gvfs anyway
<pitti> chrisccoulson: oh, I don't mean the pool_new() thing
<pitti> I thought that was finally fixed for good with yesterday's dk-disks upload
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I mean the gdu_pool_get_presentables() crash
 * pitti -> gdm testing, brb
<chrisccoulson> oh, are we thinking about different bugs?
<chrisccoulson> ah, yeah, i was looking at the gdu_pool_get_presentables() crash, but that will crash if passed a NULL GduPool
<chrisccoulson> "SegvReason: reading NULL VMA"
<james_w> I think it's the same reason for the crash
<james_w> pool_new returning NULL again
<james_w> just for different reasons this time I expect
<james_w> though if that was only fixed "for good" yesterday could it be the same reason?
<chrisccoulson> james_w - i've noticed sometimes that when i open users-admin for the first time, it fails with an error (failed to read configuration, or something like that) but it opens ok the second time. i wonder if this is something strange about being dbus activated?
<chrisccoulson> the 2 things could be related
<james_w> that would be my guess
<chrisccoulson> so, devkit-disks-daemon gets activated by dbus, but the connection fails the first time
<chrisccoulson> i'll ask someone if they can attach their ~/.xession-errors, as that will likely have the reason for crashing in there
<kenvandine> pitti, it wouldn't background xsplash
<kenvandine> pitti, so not sure what that would do to gdm
<kenvandine> i figured better safe than sorry :)
<mac_v> hrmm... anyone knows whats blocking alpha 6?
<seb128> mac_v, the freeze has been lifted so I guess writing notes?
<mac_v> yeah probably ;) the known issues maybe a long list
<chrisccoulson> known issues? it's working absolutely perfectly here....
<chrisccoulson> ;)
<pitti> kenvandine, seb128: eww, we should keep the conflicts; apparently xsplash doesn't crash on the unknown --daemon and just sits there, and this blocks gdm entirely
<pitti> onboard works fine
<pitti> kenvandine: can we get the desktopcouch dependency fix today?
<pitti> to just pull in couchdb-bin?
<kenvandine> pitti, it is waiting for review now
<kenvandine> statik, ^^
<kenvandine> think you can review/merge that branch?
<pitti> kenvandine: does it require the OLS team's review for a packaging fix?
 * pitti isn't sure about your peer review procedures
<kenvandine> the packaging branch is their's
<pitti> oh
<kenvandine> so they use tarmac to merge
<kenvandine> but that queue can be long
<kenvandine> https://code.launchpad.net/~ken-vandine/desktopcouch/lp-427036/+merge/11986
<kenvandine> statik, ^^
<kenvandine> hey jono
<kenvandine> jono, feeling better?
<jono> kenvandine, feeling a little better now :)
<statik> hi kenvandine, and pitti. i wonder if you noticed the 3 debdiffs for desktopcouch, bindwood, and python-couchdb that change the dependency to couchdb-bin that were attached to bug https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/desktopcouch/+bug/427036 yesterday?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 427036 in desktopcouch "Launching xulrunner affects boot time" [High,Confirmed]
<kenvandine> oh
<kenvandine> i guess we didn't notice those
<statik> reviewing the rdepends for couchdb, those looked like the right packages to change. i believe chef* should continue to depend directly on couchdb
<pitti> so couchdb itself was already uploaded
<statik> i saw that, many thanks
<pitti> shuold I just sponsor the debdiffs, or should they land in a branch first, and be bzr bd'ed from there?
<statik> pitti: from what james_w has told me, it's ok to just sponsor the debdiffs and they will automatically go into the right official branch
<kenvandine> i say sponsor the debdiffs for now
<pitti> *nod*
<statik> pitti: i did them as debdiffs rather than bzr because of the nature of the change, it seemed much easier to review and sponsor as debdiffs
<pitti> well, not automatically
<kenvandine> statik, but you will need to make the changes in your branches
<kenvandine> but they should match
<pitti> statik: that's fine; I just don't want to make bzr vs. archive inconsistent
<pitti> uploading
<statik> thanks! by "official branch" i mean lp:ubuntu/desktopcouch. we'll still need to merge into lp:~ubuntuone-control-tower/ubuntu/karmic/desktopcouch/spb
<kenvandine> oh that is what the spb is
<pitti> both uploaded, thanks!
<pitti> yay faster boot
<james_w> statik: why not fold the change in with the desktopcouch upgrade?
<statik> james_w, because the bug was targeted to alpha6, and the desktopcouch upgrade had been rejected for alpha6? that was my logic anyway :) i think i need to understand a bit better what the cutoff is for uploads of bugfixes targeted to a milestone
<james_w> statik: ah, good reason :-)
<james_w> if you grab someone on a Monday of milestone week and ask for an upload then you will have no problem
<james_w> Tuesday might be ok
<james_w> any later and there is a risk of disrupting the milestone
<statik> yeah, we had every intention of having desktopcouch upgrade ready to go on monday morning :/ sorry about that
<pitti> kenvandine, seb128: ubuntu-xsplash-artwork NEWed, so it shouldn't block gdm for too long
<james_w> while there is often a respin on Wednesday it's not a good idea ro rely on it, sometime we get it right first time :-)
<statik> pitti, what does NEWed mean? (i suppose i could look at the soyuz code but i'm lazy)
<james_w> statik: no worries, with practice we'll get it right
<james_w> statik: thanks for all the cool new stuff :-)
<al-maisan> statik: NEW means the source package was seen by soyuz for the firs time
<al-maisan> *first
<rugby471> mvo: just pushed some small changes, when are we going to see the pathbar in software-store?
<seb128> pitti, thanks
<james_w> statik: as al-maisan says. It requires a check that we actually want it in Ubuntu, that it is correctly licensed and not going to do hideous things to those that install it, and then set the overrides that put it in main or something.
<kenvandine> pitti, thx
 * james_w starts cooking otherwise there will be complaints
<statik> al-maisan, james_w: ah, that makes sense. so a package being in new means that an archive admin needs to approve it?
<james_w> statik: exactly
<al-maisan> statik: yes
<james_w> statik: either the whole package is NEW, or it builds a new binary package that it didn't before. Both require checks, with the latter case being much quicker usually
<statik> this whole thing kind of makes sense
<statik> i have a vision in my head of packages flowing through the system now
<statik> since i'm nagging you guys with questions, here is another one: will ubuntu or launchpad support any of the new source package formats? I read about both quilt and git 3.0 source package formats, but i couldn't tell whether debian officially supports them
<james_w> they plan to switch to the quilt 3.0 as default
<james_w> they don't support it yet though
<james_w> and I fear soyuz doesn't
<al-maisan> statik: I guess we're busy supporting the source package format we have :P and then there's work on source package branches..
 * al-maisan has not heard about either quilt 3.0 or git formats but that's not to be construed as an authoritative answer by any means ;)
<al-maisan> anyway, dinner time!
<statik> kenvandine, hey some unrelated good news about couchdb btw, i think we'll have a 0.10 final release next week.
<kenvandine> statik, awesome news
<rugby471> mvo: just tested the pathbar integration (it is awesome :-] )
<mvo> rugby471: yeah, its a bit buggy still (the integration code)
<mvo> but it looks great
<rugby471> mvo: yeah, it is known that clicking currently does nothing?
<statik> kenvandine, also thank you for following up on the dependency change for desktopcouch, and sorry about the duplicated work
<rugby471> mvo: it is pretty, but pretty useless in it's current state :-)
<kenvandine> statik, no worries
<mvo> rugby471: yeah, the integration is not fully working, the pathbar code itself supports click signals :)
<statik> it is so nice working with the ubuntu team, you folks teach me something new every day
<davmor2> statik: you missed the s off the end of something
<pitti> kenvandine, bratsche: ah, thanks for fixing the xsplash throbber! xsplash still flickers a lot, though, is that known?
<bratsche> Flickers how?
<bratsche> The animation stutters a lot and isn't very smooth.  I'm not sure what to do about that yet though. :/
<bratsche> pitti: Do you happen to know how gdm does its "fade in" effect when it first appears?  Do you know where in the code that is?
<bratsche> I feel like I should try to do the opposite effect in xsplash in the gdm session.  Right now it just abruptly disappears, because there is no compositing enabled.
<bratsche> I wish we could enable metacity compositing in the gdm session.  That would fix it.
<pitti> bratsche: well, I see the bg image, then a black bg again, then it comes back
<pitti> it takes some seconds, then it stabilizes
<bratsche> :/
<bratsche> Hmm.
<pitti> bratsche: no idea about gdm's fading, I'm afraid
<bratsche> pitti: I'm not experiencing that flicker.. I'm not quite sure what to do about it.
<bratsche> pitti: I managed to get rid of all the flicker on my system by doing some kind of crazy XComposite tricks to get the compositing overlay window initialized before compiz starts.  I'm not sure what else to do yet.
<pitti> ok, just wanted to know whether it's already known
<pitti> but it didn't do that in 0.7
<bratsche> Oh really?
<bratsche> Uhh.
<bratsche> Hmm.
<pitti> except for the jumping throbber, it was smooth
<bratsche> Oh oh...
<bratsche> I'm sure it was doing it in 0.7 but the background was set to the warty-final.png or whatever, so you didn't see it.
<bratsche> So probably the logo and throbber flickered then.
<bratsche> :/
<bratsche> Or maybe I'm wrong.  Feel free to file a bug and mention that you didn't see it in 0.7.
<pitti> ok, will do
<bratsche> What kind of hardware is this btw?
<pitti> bratsche: intel gm945, Dell Latitude D430, external 1280x1024 TFT
<bratsche> Okay thanks.  I'll try to look into it.
<bratsche> Yikes, I thought I was done with flickering stuff. :)
<bratsche> pitti: Are you using compiz?
<pitti> bratsche: yes; but it's also doing this for gdm, where metacity is used
<bratsche> Hmm.
<bratsche> Okay, thanks.
<Amaranth> Why does compiz always wait until I'm not around to explode for everyone? :P
<seb128> the breaking  being this time? the shortcut one?
<Amaranth> seb128: yeah, the loss of shortcuts
<seb128> Xorg takes 15 seconds to start on my bootchart, *shrug*
<davmor2> seb128: who needs X ;)
<Amaranth> I think using the ubuntu-boot PPA must have shielded me from the problems people were having
<hyperair> what's in the ubuntu-boot ppa?
<Amaranth> nothing anymore
<Amaranth> it's all been moved to main
<hyperair> ah
<Amaranth> but it had all the packages that needed to be updated to get a booting system
<hyperair> has usplash been ditched for good?
<hyperair> also, i still find xsplash a strange thing
<Amaranth> hyperair: iirc it's supposed to show up for passwords and fsck
<Amaranth> but only passwords work right now
<hyperair> it looks like some kind of pixel-thick spaceship jumping up and down
<hyperair> Amaranth: no, passwords don't work
<hyperair> Amaranth: at least not from initrd
<Amaranth> hmm
<davmor2> seb128: quick query is there or will there be a gnome 3 meta package?  Or should just installing gnomeshell magically install everything else needed?
<seb128> weird question
<seb128> what do you expect GNOME3 to be?
<seb128> it's basically what we have now + gnome-shell
<Amaranth> it's gnome-shell :P
<davmor2> seb128: ah cool I wasn't sure if that was the only difference or if there were a bunch of other apps that would need installing too
<chrisccoulson> hyperair - the xsplash theme just changed with the last upload btw
<chrisccoulson> no more "pixel-thick spaceship jumping up and down";)
<seb128> the issue right now is linux io scheduling sucking
<hyperair> chrisccoulson: woo. what's it now?
<hyperair> seb128: hear hear!
<seb128> the animation stops for seconds on ioload
<hyperair> bfs ftw
<hyperair> i haven't gotten round to trying it yet
<Amaranth> bfs is not an io scheduler
<chrisccoulson> linux io scheduling is quite sucky actually.
<hyperair> hmm it isn't?
<Amaranth> nope, CPU
<hyperair> whoops =p
<Amaranth> and mainline can get the same results with a couple of tweaks
<Amaranth> there are 4 tweaks needed, 3 of them you can do without patching your kernel :)
<hyperair> it would be nice to not completely hang during periods of high disk i/o
<hyperair> what are the tweaks?
<chrisccoulson> hyperair - thats what my desktop does. everything hangs when there is lots of disk IO - even applications that aren't doing anything with the disks
<Amaranth> hyperair: http://www.realistanew.com/random/sched_hacks
<chrisccoulson> i get pretty much 100% iowait when my disks are being used
<Amaranth> don't worry about it causing problems, those are the defaults in the current sched tip
<hyperair> chrisccoulson: yeah that's pretty much it.
<Amaranth> so 2.6.32 will use those settings plus one other change related to kthread scheduling we can't change like this
<hyperair> chrisccoulson: it's also why i couldn't stop dd when i forgot count=1 and had it zero out 4G of my hard disk =.=
<chrisccoulson> ouch ;)
<chrisccoulson> brb
 * Amaranth needs to get this script running as soon as possible in his boot
<Amaranth> see how if affects boot time
<Amaranth> probably messes it up
<hyperair> Amaranth: don't bother adding asa script. put it in /etc/sysctl.conf
<Amaranth> yeah, I guess
<hyperair> rather /etc/sysctl.d/
<Amaranth> I also have no_sched_hacks to put it back, I was using the scripts to toggle back and forth
<Amaranth> hyperair: I have no idea what the option names should be in sysctl.conf :P
<hyperair> kernel.sched_min_granularity_ns = 100000
<hyperair> kernel.sched_wakeup_granularity_ns = 100000
<Amaranth> and I don't think the NO_NEW_SLEEPERS one can be done this way
<Amaranth> and that's the most important one
<diverse_izzue> question concerning network-manager: is integration with bluetooth supposed to be working? when i pair my phone (nokia e51) with my laptop, i'm not offered to configure it for web access
<hyperair> yeah that's elsewhere
<hyperair> just stick it in /etc/rc.conf
<hyperair> or something
<Amaranth> hyperair: might as well do them all elsewhere
<hyperair> haha true
<hyperair> you could stick it in upstart
<hyperair> /etc/init
<Amaranth> those other two are just the cherry on top, NO_NEW_FAIR_SLEEPERS is a tremendous gain
<mac_v> Amaranth: the design team stuck with you ;p and pulled a its too late for karmic
<mac_v> the logout plugin
<Amaranth> all kernels from 2.6.23 on have had a 10% drop in throughput, NO_NEW_FAIR_SLEEPERS drops that to 3%
<Amaranth> well, on this one benchmark
<Amaranth> hey, it might actually help boot
<hyperair> hmm i wonder.
<hyperair> it might help me log in faster!
 * Amaranth reboots, hopes it actually makes it
<hyperair> Amaranth: http://pastebin.com/f1775f53
<hyperair> Amaranth: drop that in /etc/init/something.conf
<Amaranth> haha, I have a similar thing
<hyperair> =)
<Amaranth> same start line but I just make it exec my script
<hyperair> i see
<hyperair> haha
<Amaranth> and my description is "echo its a fscking desktop > kernel"
<hyperair> hahaha
<hyperair> nice =p
<Amaranth> it's a desktop that can't load agpgart and doesn't get any hardware acceleration...
 * hyperair is re git-cloning the kernel (amazing how many things 4G of zeroes can destroy)
<hyperair> what's the fourth tweak?
<Amaranth> I'm amazed you would do such a thing
<Amaranth> hyperair: it removes the code from the scheduler to give kthreads an automatic nice 5 boost
<hyperair> Amaranth: bad sectors.
<Amaranth> I know but on a system you don't have backed up?
<hyperair> http://smartmontools.sourceforge.net/badblockhowto.html <-- this is good if you don't get smart and run dd on your own forgetting count=1
<hyperair> it's backed up
<hyperair> well
<hyperair> partially
<hyperair> the most important parts are backed up nicely
<hyperair> dropbox ftw
<hyperair> after screwing it over, dropbox nicely downloaded all the files i bombed back
<hyperair> =D
<hyperair> well not all, but the most important ones
<hyperair> i thrashed a few git repositories
<hyperair> and my local kernel tree couldn't build because Makefile was filled with zeroes
 * hyperair sighs
<Amaranth> /me gets lots of udev errors and boot along with the agpgart thing
<Amaranth> wtf
<hyperair> udev errors i'm also getting
<Amaranth> Cannot initialize the agpgart module
<hyperair> okay, that i'm not getting
<cdE|Woozy> Amaranth, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/430694
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 430694 in linux "agpgart-intel not loaded before drm sometimes, causes KMS to fail" [Medium,Triaged]
<Amaranth> right, I need to turn KMS off anyway
<chrisccoulson> urgh, that was wierd. nautilus wouldn't show any contents of my home folder!
<Amaranth> that sched_hack cut 5 seconds off my boot time but now X starts even later
<hyperair> hm
<Amaranth> I wish sreadahead actually worked :/
<hyperair> hmm it doesn't?
<hyperair> i thought it was because i was compiling mainline kernels
<hyperair> i took the patch from sreadahead and hacked it into working
<Amaranth> it does no IO
<Amaranth> except when I wipe out the pack file then it does IO while it profiles
<hyperair> meh
<hyperair> what a strange thing it is
<hyperair> what's the point of reading data in sequential order?
<Amaranth> eh?
<hyperair> i thought it was decided that sreadahead wouldn't be used as default because rotary hard disks fail with it
<hyperair> whereas solid state disks benefited
<Amaranth> I thought the whole point of sreadahead was to read the data in sequential order instead of the order it is used because that is better on HDD
<hyperair> no, that's readahead.
<hyperair> not sreadahead
<hyperair> check the manpage
<hyperair> sreadahead  is a daemon that reads data sequential by use from disk
<hyperair> bah.
<hyperair> why was readahead removed from archives?
<hyperair> hmm preload looks like an interesting one
<chrisccoulson> hyperair - i ran preload for ages in Jaunty - and it never did anything at all for me
<chrisccoulson> when i removed it, it made absolutely no difference to my machine
<hyperair> chrisccoulson: hmm that sucks.
<hyperair> chrisccoulson: the description makes it sound very promising
<chrisccoulson> hyperair - give it a go if you like, but my experience with it was overwhelmingly neutral ;)
<hyperair> =(
<Amaranth> hrm, still getting a broken sreadahead
<Amaranth> hyperair: btw, disabling quiet wouldn't help you anyway, upstart scripts don't output anything
<Amaranth> heh, I've got readahead working but since it was using sysvinit scripts it profiled my gdm/desktop startup instead of boot and once I got it switched to upstart it won't profile anymore
<Amaranth> so it just slows my boot down my preloading my desktop :P
<Amaranth> s/my/by/
<Amaranth> err, bad sed :P
<Amaranth> hyperair: btw, readahead reads files in the order they are used, sreadahead sorts them by where they are on the disk
<Amaranth> huh, readahead doesn't help my boot time at all
<Amaranth> what a waste of time
<Amaranth> still massive amounts of IO wait
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-09-18
<rickspencer3> hi robert_ancell
 * rickspencer3 pounces
<robert_ancell> arrgh!
<robert_ancell> :)
<TheMuso> Hey rickspencer3, robert_ancell.
<rickspencer3> hi TheMuso
<robert_ancell> hey TheMuso
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, there's 5 minutes you'll never get back
<rickspencer3> waiting for me to find an irrelevant email
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, :)
<bratsche> Hey robert_ancell!
<robert_ancell> bratsche, hey cody
<robert_ancell> bratsche, how is xsplash going?
<bratsche> It's going okay.  David thinks it's loading too slowly on his machine, but we're having no luck so far finding ways to speed it up.
<robert_ancell> ah, overheads
<robert_ancell> bratsche, hey, could you take a quick look at an old GTK+ bug I filed and see if it is correctly marked invalid? https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=578095
<ubottu> Gnome bug 578095 in uimanager/actions "gtk_widget_show() overrides visible property of GtkAction" [Normal,Resolved: notabug]
<bratsche> Sure.
<bratsche> robert_ancell: Christian seems right.. but I also don't think I've ever used GtkAction::visible so maybe I'm not thinking about it right.
<robert_ancell> bratsche, it seems odd because then the action visible state doesn't match the n widgets state.  Anyway that change probably broke a lot of peoples code...
<bratsche> Did it not always work this way?
<robert_ancell> no, I guess gtk_widget_show() used to ignore widgets that were connected to actions
<bratsche> Does it still?
<robert_ancell> no, you can show() and hide() widgets that are connected to an action.
<bratsche> We could try to set "no-show-all" on related widgets I guess.  But if not perhaps we should at least make a note of this in the documentation.
<kwwii> just got the xsplash artwork...cool stuff, whoever was responsible, I thank you personally
<bratsche> mt
<kwwii> lol
<bratsche> kwwii: Hey, how's it going?  I got your email this morning.  Let me read it again and remember what I was supposed to respond to, because I forgot to come back to it. :)
<kwwii> I bet he didn't include the package in the distro
<TheMuso> Yeah I am glad that the artwork package has now been separated. Time to do somethign about Studio's xsplash. :)
<kwwii> TheMuso: exactly :)
<bratsche> Yeah, I can't wait to see what Studio has!
<kwwii> well, I will look forward to seeing how this workson different resolutions
<kwwii> I think we have a lot of work ahead ofus
<bratsche> kwwii: Oh yeah, I need to find out where the metacity themes should be installed right?
<kwwii> sed/ofus/of us
<kwwii> bratsche: I cannot figure out how the theme is set
<kwwii> it is not a gconf key
<kwwii> that I can find at least
<kwwii> and it is not in /usr/share/gdm/themes
<bratsche> metacity is probably just pulling in whatever gtk theme is set.
<kwwii> that still has the old themes in it
<kwwii> from the old package I guess
<kwwii> I need to update that package to install it into the same dir
<kwwii> and then point gdm to that gtk and metacity theme
<kwwii> but I don't understand how to do that :p
<kwwii> I don<
<kwwii> erm
<bratsche> What did Jaunty do?  There was custom gdm theming in Jaunty right?
<kwwii> Jaunty had the old gdm
<bratsche> Oh, we have a different gdm.
<kwwii> which had an xml file
<kwwii> no doubt ;)
<kwwii> there is a panel at the bottom, with lots of applets which we also need to kill
<kwwii> honestly, we are way behind the game on gdm
<kwwii> anyway
<kwwii> the thing is, I cannot find any info on this and everyone I ask tells me that when I figure it out I should tell them
<kwwii> anyway...almost 2am...bonne nuit
<bratsche> Good night!
<chrisccoulson> the theming for GDM now is just the same as a normal user session isn't it? (metacity theme is set in /apps/metacity/general/theme), and all the themes just go in /usr/share/themes
<TheMuso> If you mean gdm theme, it now uses parts of the theming from gnome-session, i.e background, etc.
<TheMuso> kwwii: I'll jump on later tonight when you are up and I can work through this with you.
<TheMuso> bratsche: Basically now that gdm uses parts of gnome-session, the gconf keys that gnome-session/gnome-settings-daemon use to set the theme is what is needed to set the theme for gdm, but only for the gdm user.
<chrisccoulson> and you can't change the panel position/layout in the greeter either
<chrisccoulson> thats hard coded
<chrisccoulson> so if you want no panel, then you need to patch GDM to not draw one
<TheMuso> chrisccoulson: Right. That could be changed by adding gconf keys to take care of that.
<chrisccoulson> TheMuso - there's no gconf keys for the GDM greeter panel AFAICT
<chrisccoulson> it's all hard-coded
<TheMuso> chrisccoulson: But my point is that it surely wouldn't be hard to remove the hard coding, and use gconf keys.
<Amaranth> heh
<Amaranth> Famous last words?
<kenvandine> hey robert_ancell
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, hey
<kenvandine> see my mail about empathy?
<kenvandine> it's almost ready :)
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, yes, fixed all things except the event problem. I can't see what is wrong with that code...
<kenvandine> me either
<kenvandine> that code worked before
<kenvandine> so either event stuff chanded in empathy
<kenvandine> or
<kenvandine> libindicate chages
<kenvandine> changs
<kenvandine> damn
<kenvandine> sorry... typing with a baby in my arms
<kenvandine> :)
<robert_ancell> :)
<robert_ancell> say hi to baby from me
<kenvandine> :)
<bratsche> Hey ken!
<kenvandine> i'll try to do the accent
<kenvandine> yo bratsche
 * kenvandine goes to get the kids to bed
<kenvandine> robert_ancell, i hope you have more success than me :)
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, heh.  GObject code really is tiresome to work with...
<kenvandine> i lost more hair with it today
<bratsche> What are you working on?
<kenvandine> but it was nice to have someone to hand off to
<kenvandine> robert_ancell, i bet bratsche can fix it :)
<bratsche> Uh, suddenly I have to go.
<bratsche> :)
<kenvandine> easily :D
 * kenvandine runs for real now
<Amaranth> the release notes says software store is going to replace add/remove under applications
<Amaranth> I thought mpt said having it under system was the right spot for it to be?
<TheMuso> C
<Amaranth> bratsche: what should I do to figure out why xsplash isn't working? I just get a black screen until gdm login window
<bratsche> Uhh.
<bratsche> Check /usr/share/images/xsplash
<bratsche> Do you have all the images/
<bratsche> ugh, I can't type.
<bratsche> I've been drinking way too much tonight.
<Amaranth> bratsche: yep
<bratsche> Hmm.
<bratsche> open a terminal
<bratsche> sudo -u gdm xsplash
<Amaranth> I get a warning about logging being disabled and it exits
<bratsche> Oh weird.. do you have /etc/dbus/system.d/xsplash.conf?
<Amaranth> dbus-1 but yes
<bratsche> Oh yeah, right.
<bratsche> Check the user in that file.. is it gdm?
<Amaranth> root
<bratsche> wtf
<bratsche> It should be gdm.
<Amaranth> sudo xsplash does the same thing, btw
<bratsche> Try changing that file to say user is gdm.
<Amaranth> there we go, fixed
<bratsche> Weird.
<Amaranth> bratsche: apt-get source xsplash shows the original file says root too
<bratsche> Something got b0rked in the packaging then.
<Amaranth> or in autogen
<bratsche> Yeah, there should be a --with-user=gdm parameter
<Amaranth> you don't seem to have any code in data/Makefile.am to generate the xsplash.conf from xsplash.conf.in
<bratsche> kenvandine: ^
<bratsche> Amaranth: I think it's in configure.ac
<bratsche> Amaranth: xsplash-0.8.1/debian/rules sets DEB_CONFIGURE_EXTRA_FLAGS += --with-user=gdm
<Amaranth> in that case perhaps the bug is that xsplash.conf is shipped in the tarball
<bratsche> Maybe.
<bratsche> I'll ping kenvandine in the morning about it.
<Amaranth> hrm, local build worked
<bratsche> Hi ara!
<ara> hey bratsche1
<bratsche> So I just lost a portion of my life arguing with someone  whether "has been disproven" can be considered correct grammar for present perfect tense.
<bratsche> I think it's time to go to bed.
<pitti> Good morning
<pitti> bratsche: this morning, xsplash wasn't flickering
<pitti> bratsche: I just noticed that the throbber sometimes stutters, and after some 10 seconds just gets stuck
<didrocks> hey pitti
<pitti> hey didrocks
<seb128> good morning there
 * pitti hugs seb128
<didrocks> lut seb128 :)
 * seb128 hugs pitti
<seb128> salut didrocks
<seb128> the world didn't break with all the dx updates yesterday? ;-)
<davmor2> asac: You probably already know but FF on first start up on (live cd and new system install) is opening Add-ons and there are 2 different versions of Xulrunner (de)/(en) listed in in languages 19.1.2 and crossed beneath each is 1.9.0.8
<seb128> what the?
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hey seb128
<chrisccoulson> looking forward to the weekend?
<seb128> so my laptop just suspended 3 times in a row without me asking anything
<seb128> chrisccoulson, yes!
<seb128> but still one work day before
<seb128> at least we are unfrozen ;-)
<chrisccoulson> heh, yeah, i'm looking forward to it too. but i only have half a work day left:)
<seb128> hehe
<seb128> I will not say lucky you since I'm not annoyed by doing ubuntu work on friday afternoon ;-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, doing ubuntu work on a friday afternoon probably isn't too bad ;)
<chrisccoulson> hey pitti - i was going to work on a MIR for libgda4 this afternoon, but i need to update the package first. i put the upstream changelog in bug 432169 - would you mind taking a quick glance and saying if you think the update would be ok without doing a FF exception?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 432169 in libgda4 "Please update to 4.0.4" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/432169
<chrisccoulson> i was actually going to rebase it on debian first, but debian renamed the package names
<chrisccoulson> actually, brb, breakfast just arrived at work!
<kwwii> TheMuso: hey, any idea what to do with gdm? I assume we just need to make it look for a gconf key for the right theme
<Amaranth> kwwii: Actually it uses all the regular desktop theming stuff
<Amaranth> so it probably won't just be one key
<kwwii> Amaranth: right, but we want to set a different gtk and metacity theme
<kwwii> from what I understand it is all hard coded just to use the gnome session settings
<mvo> no chriscoulsen today?
<mvo> hmmm
<seb128> mvo, he's having breakfeast
<seb128> breakfast
<seb128> he will probably be back soon
<mvo> aha, hey chrisccoulson
<seb128> see ;-)
<chrisccoulson> hey pitti, sorry, i had to disappear for breakfast right after asking you a question ;)
<mvo> chrisccoulson: did you get my question about compiz and nvidia?
<chrisccoulson> thanks for commenting on the bug by the way
<chrisccoulson> hi mvo - i did. i will respond when i get home from work if that is ok:)
<TheMuso> kwwii: I am about to have dinner. I'll jump on and chat about it with you afterwards if thats ok.
<kwwii> TheMuso: cool, thanks
<mvo> chrisccoulson: can you give me a quick overview, i.e. on what hardware/driver you see the failure and how to reproduce maybe?
<chrisccoulson> mvo - i will do
<Amaranth> asac: Ever hear anything about firefox keyboard shortcuts not working if you use xmodmap to swap control and super?
<chrisccoulson> mvo - i'm running the latest 185 version of the driver and i have a 8800GT card. if i switch user using the indicator-session applet (which will lock the screen as it switches VT), i always get a white screen when i switch back to my session again (assuming "unredirect fullscreen windows" is disabled)
<seb128> Amaranth, hey
<Amaranth> seb128: howdy
<seb128> did you look at this keybinding compiz issue?
<Amaranth> haven't yet, no
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - can you play CD's in rhythmbox ok? I just get a "No URI handler for cdda" warning in the console when i try to play a CD
<chrisccoulson> i'm wondering if i'm missing something :-/
<seb128> chrisccoulson, there is a bug opened recently on gst-plugins-base0.10
<seb128> apparently the cdda handling changed
<seb128> and rhythmbox gives uris not working with it
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - ok, thanks. i'll have a look for that one
<seb128> I've just read the comment
<seb128> I didn't look at the issue yet
<seb128> if you want to open an upstream bug you are welcome ;-)
<mvo> chrisccoulson: thanks, I will try to reproduce, i got the same driver
<seb128> the bug might have been reassigned to rhythmbox
<chrisccoulson> mvo - thanks
<chrisccoulson> mvo - i'm wondering if the issue could be worked around by locking the screen before doing the VT switch?
<chrisccoulson> then everyone could have "unredirect fullscreen windows" disabled
<Amaranth> oh crap they haven't fixed that yet?
<chrisccoulson> admittedly, it still doesn't solve the underlying driver issue, and other windows that appear on the inactive VT will still appear as white boxes
 * Amaranth stabs nvidia repeatedly
<Amaranth> I believe we reported that one 3 or 4 years ago...
<chrisccoulson> Amaranth - no, it's still not fixed
<chrisccoulson> it's so annoying to have white boxes appear everywhere wheni switch users
<Amaranth> *sigh*
<Amaranth> So...when are we switching to nouveau? :)
<chrisccoulson> i hate nvidia
<kklimonda> heh
<mvo> yeah, I have a vague memeory from the old report that it was supposed to be fixed
<mvo> oh well
<chrisccoulson> mvo - by "fixed", i think it was actually just "worked around" for the screensaver case
<Amaranth> mvo: the workaround was unredirect fullscreen windows
<Amaranth> I think that's actually why we enabled it
<Amaranth> mvo: btw, I've only seen one user with performance problems on nvidia with that disabled
<Amaranth> if we can do something about the screensaver I'd rather leave it disabled considering everything else if affects
<chrisccoulson> i'd rather have it disabled too, as it creates a lot of flicker with fullscreen windows and notify-osd
<chrisccoulson> perhaps i will try some hacking today to make sure gnome-screensaver-dialog is up and running before switching to another X screen
<asac> Amaranth: sounds familiar (modmap thing)
<Amaranth> driving me nuts, about to look into another browser :P
<Laney> seb128: Did you discover what that superblock timestamp bug was about?
 * Laney is seeing it
<Laney> might be the wrong utc setting
<seb128> Laney, ask Keybuk
<Amaranth> Wasn't that the same problem as your time being set in the future every boot?
<Laney> i'll tell you in a second ;)
<Laney> time is right
<Laney> where does it store the utc setting?
<Amaranth> hrm, too late for webkit-gtk 1.1.14, I guess?
<seb128> Amaranth, no, we will get it
<seb128> epiphany-webkit depwait on it
<asac> Amaranth: if its needed for latest aepyh then not
<Amaranth> yay
<Amaranth> I need it for a side project
<asac> Amaranth: want to test that gwibber still works with it?
<asac> ;)
<Amaranth> don't want to carry too many local packages
<asac> i wanted to check yesterday, but for me gwibber doesnt work at all atm.
<Amaranth> I suppose I could, I have a twitter account
<Amaranth> isn't there some automagic way using a watch file to update a package?
<Amaranth> I always forget how that works
<seb128> get the debian package and build it?
<Amaranth> eh?
<TheMuso> kwwii: Ok. I'll come into #ubuntu-artwork and we can chat there.
<Amaranth> seb128: That'll just build the local version
<asac> Amaranth: http://ftp.de.debian.org/debian/pool/main/w/webkit/webkit_1.1.14-1.dsc
<Amaranth> kwwii: Does that mean we're getting the awesome gdm theme seen on the wiki? :)
<seb128> Amaranth, I didn't understand the question I think
<Amaranth> seb128: well the watch file is supposed to be used to get the latest upstream tarball
<Amaranth> seb128: but how do you make it do that?
<seb128> use uupdate?
<mac_v> mpt_: hi... regarding the software store... there seems to be no quick way to launch the installed app... is there any plan for implementing it/adding to the specs ?
<mpt_> mac_v, bug 420517 has discussion of that.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 420517 in software-store "Installed apps: "where-to" and open button" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/420517
<mac_v> ah... great ;)
<mac_v> hmm... the "Where is it?"button seems an over complication !
<mpt> mac_v, overcomplication?
<mac_v> yeah... the magical second pointer ;p  commenting on bug ;)
<Amaranth> asac: building merged package now, how long does this usually take? :)
<asac> a bit ;)
<asac> get a coffee in the meantime
 * Amaranth has visions of building it on OS X
<Amaranth> The only good thing I can say about it is at least it doesn't take as long as firefox
<mpt> mac_v, you think that's more complicated than repeating the names of the menus and submenus and making you find them elsewhere?
<Amaranth> asac: kind of sucks we have to change the ABI though to add in stuff upstream dropped (for anjal or whatever)
<asac> Amaranth: lets just ignore that imo
<asac> and rebuild all our packages
<Amaranth> too late
<asac> to be sure
<asac> too late?
<mvo> mpt: have you send a ticket to IS yet about the screenshots.ubuntu.com proxy? it would be nice if you could CC me
<asac> Amaranth: we want to sync
<Amaranth> at least things that expect to work with upstream won't be using that stuff so it won't hurt to drop it
<Amaranth> asac: hrm, I'm several minutes into this build too
<mpt> mvo, not yet, doing that today
<asac> Amaranth: not sure what its too late for then ;)
<asac> all i said was: just build debian package ;)
 * Amaranth kills build, starts over
<mac_v> mpt: i think the presence of a launch option in a dialogue, only available after the install [similar to the Add/remove].. is much simpler. I dont think users are going to confuse SS as an app launcher ;)
<asac> but yeah. i think its ok to just dro pthe anjal patch
<mvo> thanks mpt
<Amaranth> I suspect anjal upstream no longer uses that API
<mac_v> mpt: but thats not how you have SS designed , so thinking of a better option :)
<mpt> mac_v, the problem with the Add/Remove dialog is that it doesn't actually show you how to launch it later. You can't reopen that post-install dialog.
 * asac gets a snack from baker next door
<mac_v> mpt: yeah , i realize that problem :) ... had a notion thats why you have thought of this ;)
<mac_v> mpt: but something about a second pointer showing up in the main screen doesnt sound right... and if its needed , its better doing it within a modal window of the software store
<Amaranth> oh, I see what the deal with anjal is, they made up some API but it hasn't been accepted
<mpt> mac_v, better in what way?
<mpt> mac_v, I'm not overly attached to using a separate pointer. Another way would be to draw a ring around the menu and wait for you to open it yourself, then draw a ring around the appropriate submenu, etc.
<mpt> Windows Vista was going to have a similar help mechanism (but Microsoft pulled it before release).
<mac_v> mpt: having 2 pointers show up on the screen , something totally creeps me out... it sounds like something overridding the system...  but if its done within the SS itself its better , ie: users clicks "where is it" , the screen changes to a desktop and shows the menu and the location... but i think we are over thinking the capacity if users to understand and trying to over spoon feed them. ;p  .... i like the idea of the rings , only problem is
<mac_v>  its similar to XP [highlighting the installed menu,submenu]
<mpt> Why is that a problem?
<mac_v> hehe ,yeah... not a problem ;)
<pitti> seb128: do you happen to know the current state of bug 421318? Seems quite dead upstream
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 421318 in totem "totem crashed with SIGABRT in __kernel_vsyscall()" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/421318
<seb128> no
<seb128> I'm not even sure where the bug is
<seb128> when we started gettings bugs about it totem didn't change for a while
<seb128> could be python, pygobject, pygtk
<seb128> it would require somebody with a clue about python to debug it
<seb128> I don't understand python valgrind logs
<pitti> ok; I put it down as "not investigated yet" on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/ReleaseStatus
<seb128> and I didn't stop anything in git commits that should make a difference there
<seb128> stop -> spot
<kwwii> Amaranth: yes, that is the idea :)
<pitti> we got a large chunk of new bugs this week apparenlty
<pitti> "new" on the release radar, that is
<pitti> OTOH our bug fix turnaround was awesome this week
<seb128> pitti, I've started adding some from my list as discussed yesterday
<pitti> seb128: right, that's good, thanks
<seb128> np
<seb128> I've mislestoned a lot of gdm bugs too
<seb128> expect that to continue this afternoon too
<pitti> seb128: btw, we should also milestone the broken timed login
<pitti> after autologin
<pitti> not for beta, but for final IMHO
<seb128> I'm not convinced that's a bug
<seb128> or rather an issue
<seb128> upstream argue that's a feature
<pitti> hm
<seb128> you can switch user from the fusa
<pitti> you couldn't ever get out of an autologin, though
<pitti> (if only I could...)
<pitti> fglrx crashes on two X screens..
<pitti> but anyway, if that was discussed already, ok
<seb128> deserve you for using binary drivers ;-)
<pitti> I just don't see the sense of this TBH
<pitti> autologin only really makes sense the very first time when gdm starts
<seb128> read the upstream bug to see their point
<seb128> they say it's mainly for kiosks
<seb128> http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=587606
<ubottu> Gnome bug 587606 in general "should use timed login after closing an autologed session" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<seb128> but I agree we might want to prefer timed login for desktop use
<pitti> except that most people who use autologin probably don't use it for a kiosk..
<seb128> right
<seb128> pitti, set a milestone to it now too
<seb128> 9 gdm bugs milestoned for karmic ...
<pitti> I followed up upstream
<seb128> thanks
<pitti> seb128: since it already identified the patch that changed it, fixing this would be to revert that; not too hard, I hope
<Amaranth> yay webcore finally built
 * Amaranth is seeing the light at the end of the tunnel
<asac> nice
<asac> Amaranth: so liferea, gwibber, midori maybe to get a first idea ;)
<asac> devhelp
<pitti> is webcore the new webkit?
<pitti> I'm off for two hours for some errands and lunch
<Amaranth> pitti: webcore, javascriptcore, and I think a couple other *cores all get linked together to make webkit
<pitti> ah, thanks
<Amaranth> woo it's on make install
<asac> jcastro: i assume you forgot to drop the xulrunner-1.9 depends in listen?
<asac> jcastro: i will drop that now - seems like everything is webkit
<asac> hmm
<asac> so now filebug redirects me to wiki page
<asac> wahts the trick to file bugs without ubuntu-bug ;)
<asac> oh got it
<asac> was hidden on wiki
<Amaranth> gah, I swear dpkg got even slower at reading its database
<Amaranth> what the hell, some guy managed to change the status of an upstream bug on bug 429241
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 429241 in xserver-xorg-video-intel "[GM45E] i915 graphics corruption and hang" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/429241
<Amaranth> but it's still linked to fd.o bugzilla
<asac> heh. hopefully gets reset on next upstream status sync run
<seb128> there was a bug in the ajax thing allow to change settings
<seb128> but I think that was fixed
<seb128> bug #400222
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 400222 in malone "new status ajax menu let you change bugzilla watch status" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/400222
<Amaranth> I can't figure out how to change it back but I'm pretty sure the guy is upset because he is still seeing the bug (because the packages with the fix are not available yet)
<Amaranth> hrm, gwibber not showing anything
<Amaranth> oh, wrong username/password
<Amaranth> gwibber doesn't tell you that, I had to try to login on twitter.com
<Amaranth> I can see why this thing didn't get into the default install...
<asac> Amaranth: for me gwibber doesnt work at all (even without new webkit) ... does not show any dents/tweets
<Amaranth> the preferences window is broken
<Amaranth> is this a git snapshot of pre-0.1 software or something?
<asac> regression due to webkit?
<asac> a bzr snapshot
<asac> you can try a more recent snapshot ;)
<Amaranth> preferences window doesn't use webkit
<asac> one second
<Amaranth> the close button is not connected to anything
<asac> yes. gwibber is pretty above the edge atm
<asac> Amaranth: bzr branch lp:gwibber
<asac> then killall gwibber gwibber-daemon
<asac> and run inside that dir: ./bin/gwibber-daemon
<asac> and ./bin/gwibber
<Amaranth> asac: epiphany seems to work with acid 3, slashdot, and youtube
<Amaranth> same with midori
<asac> Amaranth: try ssl sites
<asac> Amaranth: please check liferea
<asac> and devhelp
<Amaranth> ok, gmail works with midori and epiphany
<Amaranth> and my bank works with epiphany
<Amaranth> liferea seems to work, I'm reading planet ubuntu
<Amaranth> deleted gnome files and added my blog, all working
<Amaranth> wow the last 10 updates in my blog go back 2 years
<asac> Amaranth: any python-webkit app would be great
<asac> assuming we dont get gwibber to work ;)
<Amaranth> reading webkit docs in devhelp
<Amaranth> yay my personal project works
 * Amaranth tests software-store
<Amaranth> not sure what parts of that use python-webkit but it seems to be displaying things alright
<Amaranth> asac: I can tweet from the bzr checkout of gwibber but can't see anything
<Amaranth> opposite of the one in the repo :P
<asac> hmm
<Amaranth> I'm going to say that's all gwibber fail
<asac> Amaranth: what errors are you seeing on console?
<Amaranth> zero
<asac> kenvandine: wake?
<asac> kenvandine: can you confirm that gwibber is in broken in general in bzr? e.g. not diplaying any dents
<Amaranth> i've got identi.ca and twitter setup on there now, getting nothing
<Amaranth> but considering how many other bugs I found in about 5 minutes of poking I'm not sure what to think
<Amaranth> going back to 1.1.13
<Amaranth> gwibber fails the same way with 1.1.13
<asac> ok
<Amaranth> asac: I think we're fine with getting 1.1.14 in
<asac> so i would think all is fine
<asac> seb128: ^ .. can you sync please or do you need some exception bug?
<soren> Are we likely to sync gstreamer again the cycle? If not, I have a few cherry picks I'd like to do.
<Amaranth> huzzah, I got gwibber (package) working with 1.1.14 even
<Amaranth> just had to tell it to refresh a couple times
 * soren is not sure if gstreamer micro releases fall under the GNOME umbrella of stuff we keep syncing after FF.
<asac> soren: i think unless gnome pulls it in, we dont do that automatically
<asac> what bugs need to be fixed?
<soren> bug #431027
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 431027 in rhythmbox "No longer able to rip CD's from rhythmbox" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/431027
<soren> to fix it, I need http://git.gnome.org/cgit/rhythmbox/commit/?id=c4931555a29b102d4cba6dcb02123fd50ced9a8d applied to rhythmbox...
<seb128> asac, I can sync
<soren> and http://cgit.freedesktop.org/gstreamer/gst-plugins-base/commit/?id=6781c4c9c599561a3ca2f964ef9a60b653ee710d and http://cgit.freedesktop.org/gstreamer/gst-plugins-base/commit/?id=901dbc6ab4579398cc1b5f7a80a52a101cfaef54 applied to gstreamer-plugins-base.
<soren> these are not in any releases yet (they were only just done yesterday), so a sync won't do it right now.
<asac> seb128: thx
<seb128> soren, not sure if they do but I do syncs, ie I synced yesterday evening
<seb128> soren, the current versions are pre-version for the next stable
<seb128> we will get the stable one
<soren> seb128: I see.
<asac> gst releases in sync with gnome?
<seb128> not really
<asac> or just this time?
<asac> ok
<seb128> but they try to align
<seb128> and we do try to get the new versions when they align
<Amaranth> btw, http://arstechnica.com/open-source/guides/2009/07/how-to-build-a-desktop-wysiwyg-editor-with-webkit-and-html-5.ars/2 works with 1.1.14 too :)
 * Amaranth will stop testing stuff now
<seb128> Amaranth, yeah, fix compiz rather than playing with webkit ;-)
<Amaranth> ok so keybindings set via keyboard shortcuts don't get reset apparently
<Amaranth> because my maximize vertically keybinding has never gone away
<Amaranth> keybindings in there that metacity uses too, I mean
<Amaranth> that would imply it's not a problem with the ccp gconf backend
<soren> asac, seb128: The rhythmbox patch is in the new rhythmbox release (from half an hour ago).
<soren> so we'll get that one for free next time we sync.
<seb128> soren, ok, already on my update list
<soren> seb128: Ta very much.
<seb128> np, thanks for tracking the issue ;-)
 * soren was in the middle of ripping about a million CD's when this upgrade came along :)
<soren> ..so it's something I rather care about :)
<seb128> hehe
<lool> seb128: Hey
<lool> seb128: Can I chat with you about telepathy-mission-control-5?
<seb128> yes sure
<lool> seb128: We have a serious issue with the Ubuntu Moblin Remix
<lool> seb128: We build this image from karmic + moblin PPA
<lool> One of the software is called anerley and only knows about the C API
<lool> But TMC 5 dropped the C API in favour of the DBus one
<lool> The effort to port it is significant and while we raised this as a priority item upstream it looks like they wont provide a ported anerley soon
<lool> seb128: I was told enabling libmcclient in t-m-c-5 would help us in the mean time
<lool> seb128: Do you think we could enable that?  It's a highly unstable C API
<seb128> cassidy, pitti: ^ opinions?
<seb128> lool, you don't think you will manage to fix your software or replace it before karmic?
<seb128> I'm not especially looking forward enabling unstable apis there
<cassidy> seb128, lool: you should ask to jonnylamb on #telepathy, he's working on porting Moblin to MC5
<lool> seb128: It seems unlikely
<lool> seb128: but could happen
<lool> we dont really know
<lool> cassidy: Oh he is
<lool> cassidy: That's really good to know
<seb128> investigate what cassidy said first maybe?
<cassidy> lool, don't know the details, you should really ask him
<lool> seb128: Yeah definitely
<lool> seb128, cassidy: THanks
<seb128> thank you for raising the issue ;-)
<seb128> let we know what you can figure after talking to upstream still
<lool> ok
<cassidy> seb128, btw, would be good to sync https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/telepathy-gabble/+bug/429378
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 429378 in telepathy-gabble "Sync telepathy-gabble 0.8.3-1 (main) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,Confirmed]
<seb128> cassidy, ok will do
<asac> seb128: extensions feel still pretty broken with ephy-webkit :/
<seb128> how so?
<asac> seb128: not. sure. greasemonkey 2.27.92 doesnt work ... adblock has issues too
<asac> seb128: anyway. is ephy-webkit now unblocked for .92
<asac> ?
<seb128> unblocked?
<asac> i am currently working against .91 i think
<seb128> webkit will be synced too
<seb128> I'm looking to other syncs pending before flushing those
<asac> ok let me know when its in
<seb128> ok
<seb128> expect at least 2 hours
<seb128> one one for build and one for publishing
<asac> sure
<pitti> re
<seb128> pitti, wb
<pitti> seb128: hm, I'm afraid I don't know about libmcclient
<pitti> if the mobile guys need it and will care for it, I don't particularly mind
<seb128> pitti, I don't either
<seb128> ok, same here
<rickspencer3-afk> hi all
<rickspencer3_> seb128, asac pitti kenvandine - what's the work on street regarding alpha 6?
<pitti> rickspencer3_: it's out, with a few documented warts
<seb128> hey rickspencer3_, what pitti said
<rickspencer3_> right
<pitti> and as soon as the freeze was lifted, a looot of goodness landed \o/
<rickspencer3_> but any feedback from users?
<rickspencer3_> I can see that my inbox has quite a few karmic changes!
<pitti> yes, from Madkiss^W^W^Wnothing particluar
<rickspencer3_> I see Till was busy today!
<kenvandine> pitti, i am following the indicator-session/polkit-1 thing, it is milestoned for beta in ayatana
 * kenvandine will keep cracking the whip on ted :)
<kenvandine> rickspencer3_, i am SO happy to see the new artwork in xsplash :)
<kenvandine> that throbber was killing me
<rickspencer3_> kenvandine, agreed
<rickspencer3_> it looks nice
<rickspencer3_> now it's time for Foundations to finish the job
<rickspencer3_> :)
<pitti> kenvandine: good morning; thanks
<pitti> absolutely!
<pitti> now it's just stuttering, but at least it looks much nicer!
<pitti> kwwii: btw, do you happen to have a few spare cycles to put in mat_t's new usplash-theme-ubuntu artwork?
<pitti> I already disabled the progress bar in the branch
<pitti> but we still need to integrate the new pics
<chrisccoulson> fantastic! i finish work for the week and the weather is nice outside :)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, hey
<seb128> chrisccoulson, want to do the vala update?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, can do
<seb128> there is 0.7.6 in unstabl
<seb128> unstable
<chrisccoulson> cool, i'll take a look at that
<seb128> it's only changing the rules to make the testsuite fail on errors
<seb128> we should convince slomo to apply that to debian too
<chrisccoulson> yeah, should be an easy update
<chrisccoulson> i mentioned it to slomo before when i did the change in ubuntu
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i'm not sure whether i should just update libgda4 to the new upstream version, or also rebase it on debian. if i rebase on debian now, then the package is less maintenance in the future, but they renamed the binary packages
<chrisccoulson> which would mean rebuilding it's rdepends (which is only anjuta and libgdamm anyway)
<seb128> better to rename the binaries earlier
<seb128> less delta to carry for the next lts
<pitti> chrisccoulson: hm, just two rdepends sounds bearable
 * Laney votes for yay
<pitti> so I concur with seb128, too
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i'll do that then. would you be able to apporve the packages in NEW when i do it?
<chrisccoulson> /apporve/approve
<pitti> kenvandine: anything worthwhile mentioning for dx integration at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/ReleaseStatus ?
<pitti> Riddell: would you mind updating https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/ReleaseStatus for kubuntu?
<kenvandine> not really
 * kenvandine reads
<kenvandine> pitti, i removed the art work comment about xsplash
<pitti> ah, indeed
<Riddelll> pitti: yes indeed
<kenvandine> pitti, question... that couchdb/couchdb-bin split
<kenvandine> shouldn't couchdb-bin conflict with older versions of couchdb?
<kenvandine> not replace?
<kenvandine> or perhaps do both
<pitti> in fact both
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> that is broken then :/
<pitti> replaces: is the more critical part then
<kenvandine> Replaces is there now
<kenvandine> but not conflicts
<pitti> kenvandine: nah, it's okay; with conflicts: it's a little cleaner and avoids trouble when moving conffiles
<kenvandine> someone complained about a failed update
<pitti> kenvandine: but yes, the package is still broken in the sense that too much was moved to -bin
<pitti> all the /var and /etc/ stuff should stay in couchdb
<kenvandine> oh
<kenvandine> and that is still noted in the bug
<kenvandine> ok
<kwwii> pitti: working on gdm atm...what exacty do you need?
<pitti> kwwii: mat_t sent new usplash logos the other day for usplash-theme-ubuntu, with some instructions which to use for which resolutio and at which position
<kwwii> pitti: while I do know how to do it, I won't have time until the middle of next week or so...he had told me that you were taking care of it all :)
<pitti> kwwii: ok; was worth a try :)
<kwwii> pitti: if it is not done by the time I get done with what I am currently working on, I can take care of it
<bratsche> pitti: Yeah, I know about the throbber doing that.  I don't know what to do about it.  Seems like scheduling problems maybe, but I don't know.
<tgpraveen> what is the name for the default theme in ubuntuz/
<tgpraveen> has it been updated for karmic aas compared to jaunty?
<tgpraveen> *ubuntu
<kenvandine> pitti, can you upload bug 424491
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 424491 in pidgin-libnotify "Pidgin should add messages to the messaging menu" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/424491
<kenvandine> please :)
<jcastro> asac: at the time I don't think I knew about dropping those.
<Amaranth> jcastro: fix gwibber please
 * seb128 is away for some errands
<seb128> bbl
<kenvandine> Amaranth, specific bugs?
<kenvandine> Amaranth, i am hoping to get some of my indicator stuff merged into trunk today
<kenvandine> my branch seems to be behaving better than trunk is ;)
 * Amaranth clicks on report problem
<Amaranth> wtf, obsolete packages?
<kenvandine> Amaranth, i suspect flood gates opened after alpha6 :)
<jcastro> Amaranth: everythhing is kenvandine's fault. (just kidding) what's the problem?
<kenvandine> :)
<Amaranth> it tends to not show anything
<Amaranth> sometimes clicking reload a couple times helps
<kenvandine> Amaranth, that is fixed
<Amaranth> apport throws up an error when I click on preferences
<kenvandine> just not released yet
<Amaranth> kenvandine: actually no, bzr is worse
<kenvandine> Amaranth, not in my branch :))
<kenvandine> just make sure you use the account tree view for now
<jcastro> yeah that dropbox at the top is definately broken/flaky
<kenvandine> jcastro, ryan said sandy might have a fix
<kenvandine> he at least knows why it is broken
<kenvandine> ryan has too much magic in that stuff :)
<kenvandine> something about the account tree and the combobox always exist, but depending on your view it shows and hides them
<kenvandine> and making changes to one changes the others behind you... etc
<Amaranth> why does tweeting not show my tweet right away? :)
<jcastro> it's supposed to
<kenvandine> mine does
<Amaranth> I had to refresh again
<pitti>     - don't list software-store (lp: #431882)
<pitti> seb128: ^ oh?
<kenvandine> pitti, did you see my sponsoring request?
<pitti> re
<pitti> sorry, I just need to finish that psql security update
<mpt> mvo, for bug 430200, why would it require gksu to do the repairs?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 430200 in software-store "does not support detecting if apt cache is broken" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/430200
<pitti> kenvandine: looking
<kenvandine> pitti, bug 424491
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 424491 in pidgin-libnotify "Pidgin should add messages to the messaging menu" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/424491
<kenvandine> it's on my ayatana hit list for the week :)
<pitti> yup, saw it in scrollback now, doing
<kenvandine> thx!
<mvo> mpt: we have two options, one is to throw up the hands and say "its broken, see how you can fix it", the other one is to run "update-manager" in repair mode. now update-manager in repair mode is a modified version of the release upgrader
<mvo> mpt: and it needs root to run (no fancy aptdaemon backend unfortunately)
<mvo> alternatively we could try to repair ourselfs, but I would rather have one central app that can do it (and that would be u-m)
<pitti> kenvandine: ah, I just see tedg's PPA branch there; I won't use that then, and just upload your debdiff? or do you also have an ubuntu-desktop branch for ubuntu now?
<kenvandine> yes
<kenvandine> just debdiff
<kenvandine> i followed your advice :)
<asac> jcastro: ok thanks. i dropped it now
<pitti> kenvandine: uh, what a patch :)
<mpt> mvo, ok. Next question: In what situations can the Store discover that the cache is broken? Could it happen at any time while the Store is open? Or would it always be immediately after launch?
<kenvandine> pitti, hopefully it will be the only change for karmic :)
<mvo> mpt: it could in theory happen anytime (because the user installs something out-of-band). but usually it would appear on startup
<mvo> mpt: also not quite on startup, because the cache is opened in the background, so it maybe ~10-30s later
<Amaranth> libindicate-qt0 ships a libindicate-qt.so.1 file when it used to ship a libindicate-qt.so.0 file
<Amaranth> Shouldn't the package name have changed?
<mpt> mvo, ok, so I guess it needs to be an error alert of some sort, rather than (for example) a replacement for the lobby screen. Next question: What do you mean by "broken" specifically? Can you give an example of how this happens?
<mvo> mpt: if someone uses dpkg directly and does not honor dependencies, if someone shuts down the machine (via pulling the powercord) during a running upgrade etc
<mvo> mpt: this is the usual situation
<chrisccoulson> Amaranth - yes it should have changed if the SO version changed
<lool> seb128: Hey; so I chatted about telepathy/moblin with the #telepathy folks and they shared the ported moblin bits (yeah!)
<lool> seb128: The only issue is that this needs new ABI
<lool> So they will release a new telepathy-glib which has it in the next two weeks
<lool> seb128: Would be good to have it in karmic
<lool> In the mean time, we'll either add the new ABI as ubuntu or karmic specific abi/api as a new binary package or namespaced headers (or even new source) - OR- add the headers straight to the moblin apps
<lool> seb128: Will come with reviewable stuff when that's clearer
<lool> seb128: Shouldn't be disruptive for you; the main things we want is the new telepathy-glib in karmic if possible but not strictly required
<mpt> mvo, ok. Final question for this bug (I think): Does it make any sense to let someone continue using the Store with the cache in its broken state? How likely is it that they'll experience missing applications, uninstallable applications, etc, until it's fixed?
<Amaranth> chrisccoulson: what importance do you think a bug like that should have in launchpad?
<Amaranth> I wanna say High since it's a pretty big issue since it's essentially hiding problems from them
<mvo> mpt: browsing is fine, the results of installing/removing something is pretty undefinied at this point though
<mvo> mpt: its likely that it will just throw a error in this case
<pitti> kenvandine: hm, seems someone beat me to uploading pidgin-libnotify?
<kenvandine> ?
<pitti> kenvandine: argh, no
<kenvandine> i didn't see it in the changes
<pitti> ubuntu9 was used as a jaunty-proposed SRU
<kenvandine> oh
<pitti> will reupload as ubuntu10
<mpt> mvo, ok, so maybe the error alert should appear at the point you click "Install" or "Remove" for any application if the cache is broken. Would that make sense?
<mvo> mpt: yes, that would work. I'm not sure if its not something we should tell the user right from the start though. but I don't have a strong opinion aobut this
<mvo> mpt: I'm pretty concerened  about the deboconf fialures btw (bug #430569)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 430569 in software-store "software-store crashed with IOError in _accept_connection()" [Critical,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/430569
<kenvandine> pitti, thx
<mpt> mvo, ok. Sorry I thought I had finished asking questions, but: How difficult is it to add an icon to the right edge of a row in the navigation pane (no matter how wide the pane is), in addition to the existing icon on the left? (I'm asking because we could stick a /!\ icon next to "Installed Software" as a warning that stuff is broken even before you try to install.)
<mvo> mpt: probably not terrible difficult
<mpt> mvo, ok, I'll do a spec for this now.
<mvo> mpt: could you give me a quick feedback on "The database is rebuilding, please hold on a minute" ?
<mvo> mpt: a better string
<mpt> mvo, where is this appearing? In a progress window, or in the main pane?
<mvo> mpt: main paine, but as a big overlay (for now)
<mvo> mpt: the string is important, the actual appearance can be tweaked
<mpt> mvo, I suggest "Rebuilding application catalogâ¦", then underneath have a determinate progress bar if determinate progress is available, otherwise a spinner
<mvo> mpt: a spinner like the loading icon? or a progressbar in pulse mode?
<mpt> mvo, in what situation does that appear? I thought this whole previous conversation was because the Store *couldn't* rebuild the database itself? :-)
<mpt> mvo, like the one used when loading screenshots
<mvo> mpt: if update-manager is used for example, or if someone updates the software-store package from within the store
<mvo> mpt: thanks for the string, I updated it now. I hope we will not have to use it, but for now I will go with that solution
<mvo> mpt: its better than crashing :)
<mpt> definitely
<mpt> mvo, hm, I understand this less than I thought I did. If update-manager is being used to do the rebuilding, how is the Store able to show the rebuilding at all?
<mvo> mpt: so software-store does not have a package managment lock. if another apps is doing a package managment operation while software-store is running it needs to react.
<mvo> mpt: and one operation that crashes it is a update to e.g. app-install-data or software-store itself
<mvo> does that make more sense now?
<mpt> mvo, so is this an accurate example? (1) I'm looking at the Games department. (2) In a terminal, I do apt-get install hedgewars. (3) When apt-get finishes, the Store notices this and puts up its rebuilding message.
<mvo> mpt: only if the apt-get install touches a file in /usr/share/app-install or software-store itself. then a database rebuild is performed
<mvo> mpt: a more realisitic example is that someone get a update for app-install-data-partner because we ship some shinny new application
<mvo> mpt: while browsing the store
<mvo> (he may have auto-updates enabled for example)
<mvo> now if the apt cache changes, it needs to react too, but that is not implemented yet
<mpt> mvo, ah, so by "if someone updates the software-store package" you meant if they update it elsewhere (e.g. from Update Manager) while the Store is running.
<mvo> mpt: exactly
<mpt> ok
<mvo> mpt: I have uploaded a new version with the changes, there is no spinner currently, I think its easy (trivial even) to add one, its also relatively easy to add progress information. its a simple-matter-of-programming
<mpt> ha, I'm too slow
<mvo> too slow?
<mpt> Given what you've just told me, I was just about to suggest something like: "Another program has changed the application catalog. One moment, pleaseâ¦"
<mvo> oh, sorry
<mpt> Doesn't particularly matter, though
<mpt> hey rugby471
<rugby471> mpt: hi, blimey you are quick on seeing me sign in :-)
<mvo> hey rugby471
<rugby471> mvo: hello
<mpt> rugby471, if you have time I was going to ask if you might be interested in having a swing at bug 426257, but if I understand mvo correctly, it's quite difficult
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 426257 in software-store "Sole installation/removal doesn't switch to "In Progress" section" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/426257
<mvo> mpt: oh, did I say that? I don't think its very difficult, just work (or maybe it is and I forgot already why ;)
<mpt> oh good
<rugby471> mpt & mvo: sure I can take a stab at that
<mpt> thanks rugby471!
<rugby471> unless mvo is already working on it
<mpt> I think that's the biggest UX-related bug at the moment (besides, y'know, the crashers and stuff)
<rugby471> hehe
<mvo> rugby471: no, I'm done with s-s for today
<rugby471> mvo: cool
<mpt> mvo, btw, I saw on the project Code page that you were working on the path button stuff. How's that going? (Launchpad annoyingly wouldn't let me try the branch without an SSH key)
<mvo> rugby471: you can make the "rebuilding cataglog" window pretty if you want :)
<rugby471> mpt: it looks awesome
<rugby471> mvo: okay I shall have a look :-)
<mvo> mpt: good, it looks very nice, but its not functional yet (the integration, the widget itself is ok AFAICT)
<rugby471> mpt: I shall need to watch mock the week first though :-)
<mvo> mpt: its risky to add though, it will be funny for people doing right-to-left languages for example
<pitti> kwwii, mat_t: do you know whom to complain at about the horrible ethernet icon in network-manager? that got into karmic a few weeks ago
<pitti> and didn't fix itself yet
<mpt> rugby471, you're a Brit? I thought you were in SA or somewhere
<rugby471> mpt: nope :-) why did you think that?
<mpt> jolly good show, what
<rugby471> hehe
<rugby471> mpt: do you watch mock the week?
<mpt> rugby471, because of the pin pointing at South Africa on your Launchpad page.
<rugby471> mpt: really, well that is wrong :-)
 * rugby471 realises that mpt has been scouring his launchpad user for details...
<rugby471> :-)
<mpt> pitti, ivanka and kwwii are going to sort it.
<pitti> mpt: many thanks
<mat_t> pitti: yeah, I only just saw it
<mat_t> pitti: don't know where it came from
<pitti> mat_t: isn't that obvious? it's a stray pacman ghost!
<mat_t> kwwii: ^ any ideas?
<mat_t> pitti: aaaargh!!!
<mac_v> mat_t: pitti: there is already a bug about it ;)
<pitti> mat_t: quick, quick, eat the pill!
<mat_t> aaaagggghhh&^*&?
 * pitti sees mat_t attempt that Ubuntu level again
<Amaranth> wakka wakka wakka
<pitti> WTF? seb128, I just found out why the retracers are unhappy..
 * mac_v thought rugby471 was aussie ;)
<pitti> Package: gdb
<pitti> Status: purge ok not-installed
<rugby471> mac_v: hehe
<pitti> Package gdb is not available, but is referred to by another package.
<pitti> what happened to gdb??
<chrisccoulson> my cat ate it ;)
<pitti> ooh, we pinned it to jaunty, now I remember
<mat_t> pitti: usplash fade-out looks great :)
<pitti> mat_t: :-)
<pitti> mat_t: I committed the progress bar disabling to bzr
<pitti> now I just need to find some time to put in the new artwork
<kwwii> hehe, everyone is having a fit about the ethernet icon
<chrisccoulson> i haven't seen the new icon actually, i wonder what everyone is having a fit about
<mat_t> pitti: cool\
<kwwii> I guess that nm upstream changed the icons that they use and/or naming which caused this icon to be shown
<chrisccoulson> urgh, now i see
<pitti> curious how few people are on ethernet these days
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i'm on ethernet, but i don't have the default icon theme
<mvo> chrisccoulson: hm, I seem to be unable to reporduce the whie window bug, how odd
<chrisccoulson> mvo - yeah, that's a bit strange. i wonder what we have different
<mvo> chrisccoulson: well, I upload a new version with the revert for now
<c_korn> mpt: hello. I was told to ask you whether the icons in the system menu are added (regarding bug 407621). the system menu is as editable as any other of the main menus in alacarte. in my opinion in therefore also requires icons because it is a dynamic object. also with the current identation it really looks as there are icons missing.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 407621 in libgnome "(design decision) Icons missing from context menu , dialogue buttons , firefox bookmark favicons" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/407621
<chrisccoulson> mvo - thanks. i'll have a play around on my machine later and see if there are any other settings which affect it
<Amaranth> hehe, was looking for an old project of mine and discovered a blog post from kenvandine about him using :)
<mpt> c_korn, by that standard, all the items in all OpenOffice.org menus should have icons, because you can add/remove them in "Tools" > "Customize". So that's not the standard of dynamic-ness (dynamicity?) we're using.
<Amaranth> I do think the System menu should have icons again
<Amaranth> I can't really think of a good reason why, it just seems right
<mac_v> lool: hi... i didnt understand why the FFE was needed for UNR ,and the Humanity theme
<c_korn> then what is special about the system menu so it does not get icons ? it is as editable as Applications and Places ?
<chrisccoulson> i'm not bothered either way about the system menu having icons or not, but the places menu looks horribly broken. i'd actually prefer no icons at all in the places menu rather than the current half-implementation
<chrisccoulson> even my non-tech-savvy girlfriend asked me why the menu was broken
<c_korn> exactly. the places menu is another problem. and if no icons are present can the identation then be removed, too? it does not make sense like in normal application menus where there can be check boxes and so on
<chrisccoulson> i quite like the whitespace in the system menu actually
<chrisccoulson> i wish the indicator-session-applet was consistent and had the same whitespace though
<c_korn> well then, be it as it may.
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i just locally built gnome-python-extras here with the gda bindings built in to a separate package (python-gda), but the extra package ends up with a dependency on python and python2.5. that's not supposed to happen is it? (none of the other bindings do)
<pitti> weird
<pitti> does it b-dep on python2.5?
<pitti> or perhaps the new package doesn't have a correct XB-Python-Version: field in debian/control or so?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - it doesn't b-dep on that version, and XB-Python-Version is the same for all of the packages
<chrisccoulson> "${python:Versions}"
<kwwii> pitti: btw, after looking into it, it seems that nm is pointing to the wrong icon. I'll bug asac about it
<chrisccoulson> debian/pyversions has "2.5-" in it
<pitti> hm, no idea offhand, sorry
<pitti> but I need to run out now
<pitti> have a nice weekend everyone!
<rickspencer3_> bye bye pitti
<chrisccoulson> have a good weekend too pitti
<asac> kwwii: hi. what icon?
<rugby471> mvo: are you still here?
<rugby471> mvo: actually don't worry
<rugby471> mpt: I am trying to work on the bug 426257 but there is a bug that is blocking me from working on it (I think)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 426257 in software-store "Sole installation/removal doesn't switch to "In Progress" section" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/426257
<rugby471> mpt: are you running karmic?
<mpt> rugby471, not this minute, it's on my other partition
<rugby471> ah, I needed someone to test something
<rugby471> anyway can test something for me?
<rugby471> *anyone
<rugby471> mpt: basically I don't think you can actually run two installs/removes at the same time
<rugby471> mpt: this makes it impossible to test the bug
<kenvandine> Amaranth, what project was that?
<mpt> rugby471, you need to slow your Internet connection riiiiiight down? I'm sure there's some command line for that
<rugby471> mpt: no it won't actually let me run two things at the same time
<rugby471> it gives me an error (no two connections at the same time)
<mpt> oh, that's not good
<rugby471> hehe
<rugby471> mvo is gone for dinner I think
<mpt> report a boog
<rugby471> yup
<rugby471> I shall have to work on something else atm :-)
<rugby471> mot: any requests
<rugby471> mpt: any requests ^ ?
<mpt> rugby471, the opposite case might be a bit easier, bug 431907
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 431907 in software-store "Software store does not switch view after install/remove" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/431907
<mpt> rugby471, and bug 426266 involves removing a string, so it shouldn't cause UI Freeze problems
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 426266 in software-store "Store refers to Chess as a "core component" of Ubuntu" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/426266
<mpt> (fixing it shouldn't, I mean)
<rugby471> mpt: cool I shall have another go :-)
<mpt> thanks rugby471 :-)
<rugby471> mpt: just realised another bug, you cannot remove an app if it has an upgrade :-)
<mpt> rugby471, what do you mean by "it has an upgrade"?
<rugby471> mpt: ie. you can update the package
<seb128> re
<seb128> pitti, yeah, we want to list it where g-a-i was
<seb128> and it's a gnome-menus change
<seb128> did you figure for the retracers?
<seb128> lool, ok cool
<mpt> rugby471, that's a weird problem. Easily fixable?
<rugby471> mpt: probably
<rugby471> mpt: but I can't do it this evening (probably)
<rugby471> mpt: about the chess dialog bug
<rugby471> mpt: it will be easy to fix this bug and correct the text for the generic depends dialog at the same time, however does ui freeze mean that I cannot?
<mpt> rugby471, ok, report that upgrade bug just in case you forget about it (or in case someone else wants to fix it)
<rugby471> mpt: done :P
<mpt> rugby471, as I said, I think that merely removing a string doesn't break the UI freeze. I'm not an expert on that, though.
<rugby471> mpt: however changing one definitely breaks it?
<rugby471> the current dependency dialog is this:
<rugby471>         primary=_("%s depends on other software on the system. ") % self.appname
<rugby471>         secondary = _("Uninstalling it means that the following "
<rugby471>                       "additional software needs to be removed.")
<mpt> Changing a string is a different matter, but I think mvo is going to apply for a freeze exception for new text for bug 430200 anyway.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 430200 in software-store "does not support detecting if apt cache is broken" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/430200
<rugby471> ah
<rugby471> the current dependecy dialog doesn't conform to the spec
<mpt> rugby471, that's a different alert, I think.
<rugby471> no. 4 here https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SoftwareStore#removing
<mpt> All the images have disappeared from that page, halp
<rugby471> oops
<rugby471> mpt: are you sure?
<mpt> Hm, no, I guess it's just a Chromium problem
<mpt> anyway
<rugby471> hehe
<mpt> rugby471, as I understand it, the Chess bug is with the alert in step 2, not the alert in step 4.
<rugby471> mpt:correct
<rugby471> however the dialog in 4) is also incorrect
<mpt> The code you just pasted is from (the non-spec-matching) step 4.
<rugby471> mpt: correct
<rugby471> mpt: it will be easier to fix them both at the same time
<mpt> That's bug 426261, not bug 426266
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 426261 in software-store "Dependency removal alert doesn't match the specification" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/426261
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 426266 in software-store "Store refers to Chess as a "core component" of Ubuntu" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/426266
<mpt> As far as I'm concerned, you're welcome to do that. :-) But as I say, I'm not an expert on User Interface Freeze exceptions.
<rugby471> mpt: you know what, I shall fix both things and ask mvo :-)
<rugby471> mpt: he can merge what he likes :-)
<mpt> Good plan.
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - you there?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, sort of yes
<seb128> about to go for dinner though
<chrisccoulson> i've just built gnome-python-extras locally here with a depends on libgda4, to re-enable the pygda binding
<seb128> ah nice
<chrisccoulson> (and building it in to a new package - python-gda)
<chrisccoulson> but it ends up with dependencies on python and python2.5
<chrisccoulson> i'm not sure why :-/
<chrisccoulson> all of the other bindings just depend on python
<seb128> is there a .so which build with libpython2.5?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - possibly. it has a dependency on libpython2.5 too
<seb128> I'm not sure what is going on without looking into details
<chrisccoulson> the so does link against libpython2.5
<rugby471> mpt: quick q before I go
<rugby471> mpt: in the dependencies dialog, do we always want the vertical scrollbar showing like in the image?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - thanks, i'll take a look at this a bit more later
<rugby471> showing > showing,
<mpt> rugby471, I think so, yes. ("Unless otherwise specified, a package list view should always have a vertical scrollbar.")
<rugby471> mpt: cool
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-09-19
<c_korn> I wonder if there is a way to configure indicator-applet only to show pidgin only if empathy and evolution are still installed.
<rugby471> mpt: hello
<mpt> hi rugby471
<rugby471> mpt: I have just finished of some work on the dependency dialogs
<rugby471> mpt: and just started a little bit on the history view :-)
<rugby471> mpt: I wonder whether that could be the next thing you spec
<rugby471> mpt: I was thinking about it and envisioning a list with buttons so you can undo each history item, and a calender below to filter by data...
<rugby471> *date
<mpt> rugby471, I won't be able to spec that during work time, because I'm fully booked working on other stuff until UDS
<rugby471> mpt:sure
<mpt> but I might be able to do it in spare time
<rugby471> mpt: well it is not nearly working at all at the moment so don't worry :-)
<rugby471> just the preliminary code for the xml file that keeps track fo the history is there atm
<rugby471> *of
<mpt> rugby471, can you draw a sketch or something of the layout you were thinking of?
<rugby471> mpt: sure
<mpt> I was thinking more of a reverse-chronological list, but I hadn't really thought about how to filter it by date
<rugby471> mpt: for some reason I have some of my best ideas in the shower ? :-)
<rugby471> mpt: yeah, but then the option to use the calender to filter
<rugby471> anyway I shall do that :-)
<mpt> thanks
<mpt> Make a sub-page on the wiki for the mockups, linked to from the History section, if that's convenient
<rugby471> ok
<mpt> thanks for working on the dependency dialogs
<rugby471> no problem
<mpt> How are they looking?
<rugby471> mpt: the only thing 'wrong' with them at the moment are the alignment of the package view with the text, and the icons are not yet the icons of the actual dependencies, just the generic package icon
<rugby471> mpt: you can check them out form my branch https://code.launchpad.net/~rugby471/software-store/software-store-andrew
<mpt> rugby471, maybe you could discuss this with mvo, but I think the package list view should be some kind of reusable widget, so that you can say "show this set of packages in a package list view here", and they get all their appropriate text, icons etc automatically
<rugby471> mpt: yeah I was thinking about that as well
<rugby471> mpt: there is a lot of duplicated code
<mpt> That way you wouldn't need to reimplement the icons in the dialog, for example
<mpt> And Update Manager could use the same view as well.
<rugby471> mpt: I think I shall let mvo do some of it though :-) there is still much I ahve to learn...
<rugby471> *have
<rugby471> currently I am chasing the zoom icon in dmz-cursor-theme
<rugby471> mpt: there isn't one and webkit gives it an ugly one when used in software-store
<mpt> rugby471, zoom icon? what for?
<rugby471> mpt: when you click on the screenshot, it now enlarges
<mpt> oh, right. I should spec that precisely for v2.
<mpt> Probably the screenshot should have a zoom-in emblem in the corner, rather than using a cursor.
<rugby471> mpt: in that case I won't :-)
<mpt> won't what?
<rugby471> mpt: chase the zoom icon thing
<rugby471> mpt: anyway I need to do some work now
<rugby471> mpt: see ya
<mpt> ok, have fun
<rugby471> mpt: btw this is the type of xml doc. that I am using for the history, is there any other data that needs to be here?
<rugby471> http://pastebin.com/d3fcd92ec
<rugby471> mpt: the event would be something like install PKG
<rugby471> and action would be the actuall things that happen (ie. install of pkg1, pkg2 & pkg3)
<mpt> rugby471, are you aware that Synaptic already has a history, including things that were done in Update Manager etc? So I think all this info is already being stored elsewhere.
<rugby471> mpt: no
<rugby471> mpt: hehe I should probably check this
<mpt> From how it's displayed in Synaptic, I fear that it's recorded in an unstructured text format
<mpt> I'm not sure what the best way of structuring it would be, but maybe we can get away with not requiring an XML parser :-)
<rugby471> mpt: just looking at it, it seems to just be a log file
<rugby471> not very useful for parsing
<rugby471> mpt: the xml parser is not that difficult etc.
<rugby471> it makes it very easy
<mpt> hmmmm
<rugby471> mpt: yep I think it is a commit log, as when I changed languages to french (randomly) it shows the log in a different language
<mpt> That's unfortunate (for the Store, I mean, not for French speakers)
<mpt> This gets into the issue of how closely Update Manager should combine with the Store
<rugby471> mpt: it would not be that hard to port the history thing into update-manager
<mpt> because it would be nice to see a History of previous updates from Update Manager, too
<mpt> which would be a subset of the history the Store showed
<rugby471> mpt: ie. before software-store takes over from update-manager, port the code
<rugby471> mpt: I shall discuss with mvo definitely
<rugby471> mpt: however xml is the way forward :-)
<rugby471> mpt: the possibility to 'undo' actions seems to be very useful though :-)
<mpt> yes, definitely
<mac_v> rugby471: we are trying to eventually replace synaptic also , so undo \o/ ... i'v made so many undos in synaptic ;)
<rugby471> mac_v: hehe
<rugby471> mac_v: it would also be really useful in the case of - something broke today, so what changes have happened since then...
<mac_v> rugby471: the major problem with synaptic history ... is the history doesnt record any installs/removals from terminal :(
<rugby471> mac_v: yup
<rugby471> mac_v: I don't think that apt-get stores history
<mac_v> yeah , i think it needs to be figured out
<c_korn> mpt: hello. thanks for the explanation regarding the "missing" icons in the places menu in the bug report. you mentioned that software store has been moved to a different place. but now I cannot find it in the menu at all.
<mac_v> hehe ^
<rugby471> >:-(
<rugby471> thats is mvo's territory :-)
<mpt> c_korn, that's not good. Actually it's seb128's territory, I think.
<mpt> c_korn, report the bug, and link to it from a comment in the bug report I linked to about moving it.
 * mpt wonders if that made any sense
<c_korn> mpt: what package should the bug be reported to ?
<mpt> c_korn, gnome-panel
<mac_v> mpt: regarding zoom of screenshots are you planning on having a constant emblem , or a one semi transparent one which shows only when user hovers over the screenshot?
<mac_v>  or a semi transparent one*
<mpt> mac_v, I hadn't really thought about it. What do you suggest?
<mac_v> a semi-transparent one on pointer hover  , is better
<mac_v> having a constant emblem would spoil the screenshot and it would cover the screenshot:)
<mpt> hm, good point
<c_korn> (opened bug 433035)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 433035 in gnome-panel "Ubuntu Software Store has disappeared from the gnome menu" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/433035
<mac_v> c_korn: nice quote "As said by Matthew Paul Thomas " :)
<mac_v> just an FYI , its also in the latest specs ;)
<mpt> c_korn, ah, I hadn't seen the latest in bug 431882: "The software store desktop should be changed to drop its nodisplay=true now"
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 431882 in software-store "Software Store shows up under System Menu instead of Applications menu" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/431882
<mpt> That'll be why it's not appearing
<mac_v> rugby471: this sounds like the windows system restore "I was thinking about it and envisioning a list with buttons so you can undo each history item, and a calender below to filter by date..." ;) ...
<mac_v> mpt: rugby471: how about something more graphical? user clicks , history > view is first calender  , user selects date > view changes to the list [if possible list with the screenshots of app] , back goes back to the calendar?
<mac_v> for version 2? ;) or is that similar to OSX , time machine ;p
<rugby471> mac_v: I though it might sound similiar:-)
<rugby471> mac_v: that sounds pretty complex :-)
<mac_v> yup , didnt say it was easy ;)
<mpt> mac_v, there are a few different cases we want to cater for
<mpt> Probably the most common is "What's that program I installed last night, I don't remember what it's called"
<mpt> Another is "Something bad started happening on my system around September 12th. What package changes happened just before then?"
<mac_v> yup , so having the screenshot with the time installed will do it right?
<mac_v> app name + screenshot + time installed > once the user selects the specific date
<mpt> So, your suggestion would work for those two
<mpt> But it wouldn't work so well if you can't remember, or don't know, the date you installed something
<mac_v> and the sort order is always only according to time
<mac_v> mpt: ah...
 * mac_v thinks
<mpt> "I installed some astronomy thing a few months ago, I don't remember exactly when"
<mac_v> yay \o/... more categories nice :)
<mpt> more categories?
<mac_v> mpt: hmm... we could have it similar to the main window , "All" "Departments" on the top of the calendar ,
<mac_v> so the user can switch the department and only the dates when he has installed those apps will be highlighted
<mac_v> then he can toggle the months to any month he wants
 * mac_v thinks about narrowing it more down for the "when"
<mpt> How about a time slider that has marks to show when stuff actually happened?
<mpt> Like F-Spot's, but pretty
<mac_v> mpt: yeah , the slider for days should work :) , so the departments on first row , the time slider in the second row? and pretty app screenshots+info in the display below ?
<mpt> mac_v, I don't know. This is like playing chess: you need to consider lots of possible moves. Draw up a bunch of possible layouts and see which ones would work well. :-)
<mac_v> hehe ;)
<mpt> One thing to consider: The history should be searchable. So it would make sense for a search field in the History screen to be in a location bar at the top, like the search field in all the other screens that has one. But a path button (as found in the location bars in other sections) might not make sense in the History section. So is there anything else that would make sense at the left end of that location bar, instead of the path button?
<mac_v> mpt: "All Sources" button , + the "Filter by Source" Combo button reveals a list of the ppa/sources and on the selection the custom source is displayed next to the main button "Sources"...
<mac_v> could that use the path bar?
<mpt> mac_v, maybe, but why would that make sense for the History section and not for (for example) the "Installed Software" section?
<mac_v> mpt: we display that *only* for history view
<mpt> why?
<mac_v> hrmm ... ;)
<mpt> I think a realistic user story is "I want to see a list of installed software I have that's not from official Ubuntu repositories"
<mac_v> mpt: why should the history view be similar to the regular store view?
<mpt> so I should be able to filter the "Installed Software" section by source as well
<mpt> And if I can filter both that section and the History section by the same attribute, the interface for doing that should be the same in each section
<mpt> for the same reason that the search field should be in the same place in each section
<mac_v> the constant search is good... but heh , I gave an idea for filling the path bar ;p  ... we could keep it empty in history ;)
<mac_v> but that would not look nice :(
<mpt> Well, it wouldn't be awful
<mpt> The Cancel bar <https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SoftwareStore#cancel-bar> will usually contain only one button, for example
<mpt> but if there's something *specific* to filtering history that could fit in there, it would make sense to put it there.
<mpt> I was wondering whether possibly the time slider would fit in there, but I guess there wouldn't be enough room.
<mac_v> mpt: we could use the time slider there
<mac_v> hehe ;)
<mpt> snap
<mac_v> mpt: meh , just text saying "Filter the installed apps by install section and date" or something worded shorter to fit the bar ;)
<mpt> Well, consider the case I mentioned earlier: "Something bad started happening on my system around September 12th. What package changes happened just before then?"
<mpt> In that case, you want to see installations, removals, and updates
<mac_v> yeah , the text to be more appropriate then ;p
<mpt> but in other cases, you'll just want to see installations ("what was that new program I installed last week? don't show me any update stuff, just the installations")
<mac_v> oooh nice
<mac_v> so installed , removed , updates? sections?
<mpt> And in other cases, you might even want to see just removals only ("I uninstalled that thingamebob, and now I want it back, what was it called")
<mpt> maybe :-)
<mac_v> yeah , more categories... more difficulty for hackers \o/
<mpt> Show: [ All changes      :^]
<mpt> or
<mac_v> yeah that sounds sane , "All" "Installed" "Removed" "Updated"
<mpt> Show: (*) Everything  ( ) Installations  ( ) Removals  ( ) Updates
<mpt> though maybe that would take up too much width
<mac_v> hehe ;) , all is shorter ;)
<mpt> yeah, but if it was labelled "All" it would be better as the last radio button rather than the first, so someone reading them in order has a better understanding of "all what"
<mac_v> yeah last is better
<mac_v> "Sort by"
<mac_v> ?
<mpt> maybe
<mpt> or maybe that would be done with column headers
<mpt> It depends on whether the items actually use columns
<mac_v> huh? columns?
<mac_v> oh please no columns in history too
<mpt> why?
<mpt> Consider the data we have to present:
<mpt> - what package was changed
<mpt> - when it was changed
<mpt> - the kind of change (installed, removed, reinstalled, updated)
<mpt>   - if was updaed, from which version to which version
<mpt> That last one is the tricky one, visually
<mpt> because we wouldn't want to spend (quite wide) columns just on that, if installations and removals aren't going to use them at all.
<mpt> (Though I suppose installations would still have a resulting version.)
<mac_v> mpt: columns are a bit tedious, its always trying to stuff more info , when cant present it better or allow the sort better
<mac_v> when we have the buttons on top it simplifies the view than having columns
<mpt> And then actions for each of the items: some combination of "Undo", "Reinstall", "Remove", "Downgrade"
<mpt> though those might be in a menu opened from a single menubutton for each item
<mac_v> the view can be simple  , 3 columns , 1: screenshot 2:App info in rows [a:Name , b:was installed/removed/upgraded on___  ] 3: actions buttons  a:Install/Remove[depending on last action] b:Re-install c:Downgrade
<mac_v> mpt: also  , SS must keep the screenshots archived , that would speed up the view
<tgpraveen> will the empathy that ships with karmic have msn audio/video?
<tgpraveen> bigon: kenvandine ^^?
<kenvandine> tgpraveen, depends on what we need to add :)
<kenvandine> tgpraveen, please file a bug and go ahead and assign it to me
<tgpraveen> kenvandine: ok
<kenvandine> thx
<mpt> mac_v, cached, you mean? I agree
<mac_v> oh yeah , cached
<tgpraveen> kenvandine: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/empathy/+bug/333675
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 333675 in telepathy-butterfly "Add video chat for MSN" [Wishlist,Fix committed]
<tgpraveen> there was a bug already
<kenvandine> thx
<tgpraveen> and it seems bigon is tracking so am not doing anything
<bigon> tgpraveen: we need lastversion of telepathy-butterfly and python-msn
<kenvandine> woot
<mac_v> mpt: but more permanently , the nautilus thumbnails cache gets cleared every 180 days by default , the screenshot can be updated only on updates
<tgpraveen> bigon: and is it planned to include those versions or not?
<bigon> dunno, I think that it's still under discussion
<mac_v> tgpraveen:  is chat audio/video possible for yahoo accounts?
<tgpraveen> mac_v: no sadly not right now :-( currently
<tgpraveen> only gyachi on linux does that I think
 * mac_v searches magic gyachi ;)
<tgpraveen> mac_v: I think its not there in repos
<mac_v> argh!
<tgpraveen> search forum there is a nice thread with howto
<tgpraveen> and all
<mac_v> tgpraveen: oh ok thanks :)
<mac_v> mpt: you still here? your thoughts on Bug #204567 , shall we Increase the limit to make downloads available on the bookmarks? since now even UbuntuOne is in the default install , so now the user has no room for custom bookmarks
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 204567 in gnome-panel "Downloads should go to ~/Downloads" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/204567
<mpt> mac_v, that falls under the "I don't really care" category at the moment
<mac_v> ;p
<mpt> It makes miled sense to me to have a Downloads folder, and for that to show by default in Places
<mpt> mild sense, rather
<tgpraveen> maybe remove desktop item from places menu
<tgpraveen> and instead addd downloads seems
<tgpraveen> to be more in keeping with the whole point of places menu
<mac_v> tgpraveen: desktop doesnt fall under the submenu
<mac_v> its a separate item
<tgpraveen> though with gnome shell all this will be gone
<mac_v> hehe ;)
<chrisccoulson> james_w - if you have a few spare minutes, would you mind approving the libgda4 packages in NEW?
<mac_v> mpt: BTW ,that bug has a patch and is being held up only for a comment from you ;)
<mpt> really?
<mac_v> yup, Sebastien wanted your decision
<mpt> "I've discussed that with alex on IRC let's do the change"
<mac_v> mpt: thats for the name Download > Download"s"
<mpt> oh
<james_w> chrisccoulson: sure
<chrisccoulson> james_w - thank you:)
<james_w> I'm pretty confused by this gdu-notification bug
<chrisccoulson> james_w - which one?
<chrisccoulson> the crasher?
<james_w> yeah
<james_w> I got it after a reboot today
<chrisccoulson> me too. if i could actually recreate it, then it would be much easier to debug
<james_w> with nothing in ~/.xsession-errors
<james_w> no crash on re-running
<james_w> and I think I was wrong about the send_interface being needed
<james_w> re-reading the dbus docs it seems send_destination should have covered that
<chrisccoulson> nothing in ~/.xession-errors is wierd, as there should be some warnings in there before it crashes
<james_w> it seems to be some sort of race
<chrisccoulson> do you think it is an issue with dbus activation?
<james_w> but yeah, I can't see how it return NULL without a g_warning
<james_w> ah yeah, I'd forgotten you mentioned that
<james_w> something to look at I think
<james_w> so, kill the daemon and re-run the notification?
<chrisccoulson> james_w - i've seen a similar issue before where a call would always fail on the first go (even though the service was activated on the first call)
<chrisccoulson> i had to work around it by calling org.freedesktop.DBus.StartServiceByName before making the first call
<james_w> no crash doing that
<james_w> did you get "unexpected return code 0" or something else?
<chrisccoulson> james_w - not sure, it was quite a long time ago. i can try the code i was using again later and see if it still happens
<chrisccoulson> anyway, i've got to dash to the supermarket. bbl!
<james_w> if the thing is daemonising then it could be a race between the process exiting and the bus name being claimed
<james_w> but that's just a stab in the dark
<james_w> enjoy
<tgpraveen> does messaging indicator support thunderbird or will it support by final release?
<c_korn> where are the options to remove empathy and evolution from the indicator-applet
<chrisccoulson> c_korn - not sure they exist yet
<chrisccoulson> but you can remove them in /etc/indicators/messages/applications
<c_korn> I read the mailing list. and Mark was against the idea of a settings dialog to enable/disable the appearence of the apps in the indicator-applet.
<chrisccoulson> hmmmmm
<c_korn> however now I have to create an account in evolution (which I do not want to use) to disable evolution in the applet
 * chrisccoulson wouldn't mind some icons for the launchers in the menu
<chrisccoulson> there is not enough visually different between "Empathy" and "Evolution"
<chrisccoulson> its really awkward to launch the correct application
<c_korn> and the configuration of evolution does not fit on a 800x600 resolution. so I have to guess where the buttons to the next dialog are (but this is another problem)
<c_korn> tgpraveen: bug 367175 and bug 409849 are about that. thunderbird has to be patched to make use of the indicator-applet
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 367175 in thunderbird "thunderbird not using indicator applet" [Unknown,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/367175
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 409849 in thunderbird "[Feature Request] Support for Messaging Menu" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/409849
<tgpraveen1> http://ostatic.com/blog/ubuntu-version-9-10-code-named-lucid-lynx
<tgpraveen1> ubuntu 10.04 name
<chrisccoulson> hi kklimonda, are you working on bug 426335?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 426335 in hamster-applet "Update to 2.27.92" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/426335
<mauren> hi
<mauren> Looking for an app/command/shortcut that will auto resize all open windows within gnome to fit screen so they are all visible.  Any suggestions?
<chrisccoulson> mauren - not sure, maybe a compiz plugin or something
<chrisccoulson> you want #ubuntu for support though ;)
<mauren> ok
<mauren> chrisccoulson I thought of that also .. but no luck.
<mauren> using a compiz plugin
<johanbr> mauren, this is really an #ubuntu question, but I think you want the "maximumize" compiz plugin
<mauren> i tried the scale windows
<mauren> it didnit work
<mauren> i'll try that, thanks
<mauren> wow
<mauren> thanks
<mauren> !
<Amaranth> johanbr: And now I know what that plugin does too :)
<johanbr> :)
<Amaranth> kristian tried explaining once, he did it much worse
<c_korn> eh, indicator-applet does not have an icon atm ?
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-09-20
<Ken47150> :)
<kklimonda|G1> morning
<rugby471> mpt_: hello
<mpt_> hello rugby471
<rugby471> mpt: did you see my mockup?
<mpt> rugby471, I did not. Mockup of what, and where?
<rugby471> mpt: no worries, here it is https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SoftwareStore/Mockups
<mpt> ah
<mpt> hm
<rugby471> mpt: that is my idea anyway
<rugby471> mac_v: you should put a mockup of your idea here ^
<mpt> I wonder if it would make a little more sense for the calendar to be above the list rather than below
<mdc_laptop> rugby471, making the dates where changes was made bold would be great..
<mpt> so that the two filter-y things, the calendar and the search field, are close to each other
<rugby471> mpt: good point
<rugby471> mdc_laptop: absolutely, this is just a first mockup though :-)
<mdc_laptop> :-)
<mpt> rugby471, I like the general "undo" approach
<rugby471> mpt: if it isn't clear, the bit about the details bit is as follows
<mpt> rugby471, though there might be other things you want to do to a package, e.g. reinstall/reconfigure it
<rugby471> basically there would be a details menu item in the view menu, when you click it, a pop-up window appears giving you the details
<mpt> I also wonder what happens to the calendar in a maximized window on a wide screen. :-)
<mpt> rugby471, you mean details of the transaction that took place?
<rugby471> mpt: maybe have the arrow icon in the normal app view so the user can look at the details page?
<rugby471> mpt: yes
<mpt> oh, right, now I actually read what you wrote in the mockup <:-)
<rugby471> mpt: basically the history section would only list the events that happened
<rugby471> mpt: ie. applicationx was installed
<rugby471> the view details would give the user the oppourtunity the see what actually happened
<rugby471> mpt: ie. packagex and it's dependencies were installed
<rugby471> etc.
<rugby471> mpt: yeah sorry about that, it isn't terribly visible :-)
<rugby471> mpt: oh an application icon in the view wouldn't have the overlay icons btw
<rugby471> an > and
<rugby471> mpt: RE:widescreen it would just scale to the width of the window, however I could make it so that the calender doesn't expand
<mpt> rugby471, by "the overlay icons" do you mean the installed checkmark?
<rugby471> popey: hi, how is your boxee box going :-)
<rugby471> mpt: yup
<rugby471> mpt: I just used a screenshot from the installed items view, they shouldn't be there
<rugby471> mpt: thinking about it the history section would also include things like dist-upgrades as well
<mpt> rugby471, why not keep the emblem? It would be a useful extra hint as to the current state (e.g. I uninstalled this application then, but I've since reinstalled it)
<mac_v> mpt: is the left pane essential for a history section?
<mac_v> couldnt we use the full window
<rugby471> mpt: sure, I see your point
<mpt> mac_v, it's useful when you want to navigate away from it :-)
<mac_v> mpt: we could just add a close button for that , the left pane IMO , seems not necessary for the history
 * mpt wonders if mac_v is thinking of iTunes LP
<mac_v> hehe ;p
<rugby471> mpt: off-topic have you seen the new mockups for gimp 2.8 They look awesome :-) http://www.mmiworks.net/eng/publications/2009/09/gimp-single-mode.html
<mpt> mac_v, I don't see that it's any less necessary for History than for any other section. Nor need it be particularly more complicated.
<mac_v> the reason i felt not needed > was to use the space , to have a more spacious timeslider and display :)
<rugby471> mac_v: I am sure there would be enough space PS: we really want your mockups of this idea :-)
 * mac_v having a mild headache right now :( .... but soon ;)
<mpt> rugby471, meh. They're trying to solve an OS-level problem at the application level, which makes sense for them, since Gimp is a cross-platform application, but it can't possibly be as good as solving it at the OS level.
<tgpraveen> will software store eventually replace synpatic also?
<hyperair> i don't think it would
<mpt> tgpraveen, yes, in version 2.
<mac_v> its is supposed to replace synaptic in 10.10
<hyperair> =O
<mpt> tgpraveen, though Synaptic will still be available in the repositories if you're a fan.
<hyperair> hmmm
<tgpraveen> hmm
<hyperair> this means that nautilus-share will have to use software store to auto-install samba.
<mac_v> yeah , mvo intends to maintain it
<hyperair> which means i can no longer keep it syncable from debian.
<mpt> hyperair, can't you just use the apt: protocol?
<tgpraveen> softwrare store will have to progress a lot. how will we install libraries and stuff as I doubt software store should
<hyperair> mpt: does debian have apt: installed by default?
<tgpraveen> have libraries and all shown?
<hyperair> mpt: apturl i mean
<mpt> hyperair, I don't know, it's been about a decade since I ran Debian.
<hyperair> mpt: i think it isn't.
 * rugby471 thought the GIMP redeisgn was a great thing until mpt open his mouth
<rugby471> opened
<rugby471> :-)
<rugby471> only joking :-)
<rugby471> hyperair: software-store will display all libs etc.
<mpt> tgpraveen, ok, please describe it specifically in the "Unresolved issues" section of the SoftwareStore spec. (E.g. "When you click on _____, nautilus-share uses ______ to request that synaptic install samba. The Store needs to provide an equivalent mechanism.")
<rugby471> hyperair: however we might use an advanced view etc.
<rugby471> hyperair: don't worry I am sure mpt has an ace up his sleeve :-)
<hyperair> ...is it me or have both of you suddenly confused me with tgpraveen?
<rugby471> tgpraveen, mpt: I think using apt-url would be a lot easier
<rugby471> hyperair: probably :-)
<hyperair> i'm the one concerned about nautilus-share autoinstalling samba, and tgpraveen is the one concerned about installing libs..
<mpt> hyperair, sorry, yes. :-)
 * hyperair sighs
<rugby471> I read over the conversation in 5 secs, maybe I should have taken more time :-)
<rugby471> hyperair: now I am confused :-)
 * mpt investigates how to color-code people in XChat to avoid this problem
<hyperair> mpt: anyway, nautilus-share just execs gksudo synaptic something somethin
<hyperair> g
<rugby471> hyperair: apt-url samba
<rugby471> hyperair: that would be a lot eaier
<hyperair> hmm should i make nautilus-share depend on apturl then?
 * tgpraveen decides to wait until hyperair 's issue is cleared
<rugby471> hyperair: it would be a lot better implementation
<hyperair> hmm
<hyperair> indeed.
<mpt> hyperair, the PackageKit protocol might be the right answer to that too, though again that might have Debian-syncing problems.
 * hyperair groans
 * rugby471 laughs
<mpt> hyperair, we can discuss it at UDS Lucid. :-)
<rugby471> mpt: is it actually lucid?
<rugby471> mpt: I heard rumours it was a rumour :-)
<hyperair> mpt: UDS is so far away. in distance i mean.
<mpt> Yes, Lucid Lynx, announced yesterday
<rugby471> see you for 30 mins
<tgpraveen> mpt:  so how will installing libraries be dealt?
<mpt> ha!
<mpt> When I Web search for "Lucid Lynx" I get a bunch of audio shop sites, apparently because "Lucid" and "Lynx" are two audio brands adjacent to each other in alphabetical listings
<mpt> e.g. http://performanceaudio.com/
<mpt> hyperair, we'll have teleconferencing as usual, and Gobby, and mailing lists and wikis. We do try.
<hyperair> teleconferencing eh
<hyperair> that's interesting
<hyperair> i never knew there was such a thing
<hyperair> i thought it was just live recordings
<mpt> I forget exactly what it's called -- Icecast? something like that
<hyperair> i think it was that
<mpt> with people listening, and posting responses on IRC
<hyperair> but it's not two way is it?
<hyperair> ah
<hyperair> posting responses
<hyperair> yes, that makes sense
<mpt> and sometimes we've dialled in people who are particularly expert in the topic being discussed.
<rugby471> mpt: the remote participation is not that good though
<rugby471> we need something like icecast but for videos
<rugby471> mpt: like on ustream
<rugby471> mpt: per this page https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopExperienceTeam/KarmicNotifyOSD
<rugby471> mpt: why is AppCenter there?
<mpt> rugby471, I have no idea.
<rugby471> mpt: Oh I thought you were the drafter :-)
<mpt> nup
<mpt> I maintain the main NotifyOSD page
<rugby471> oh
 * mac_v wonders what Anjali is about
<tgpraveen> mac_v: it's a modification of evolution
<tgpraveen> for netbooks
<mac_v> huh!
<tgpraveen> oh wait is that wrong
<tgpraveen> I think I am mixing something up
<mac_v> tgpraveen: i was wondering about > https://launchpad.net/anjali
 * mac_v mpt is hiding stuff from us ;p
 * mac_v thinks^
<tgpraveen> This projectâs license is proprietary.
<tgpraveen> so duh!
 * tgpraveen guesses surprises awaits for us with Lucid
<mac_v> tgpraveen: half the world would not know what "Anjali" actually is ;p
<mac_v> s/is/means
<rugby471> tgpraveen & mac_v : more surprises await us here as well https://launchpad.net/~flash-ubuntu-team :-)
<rugby471> or https://launchpad.net/flash-ubuntu
<tgpraveen> mac_v: I am from India so I guess I am supposed to what what it mean
<tgpraveen> s
<mac_v> yup , thats why i mentioned it to you ;)
<tgpraveen> ;-)
<rugby471> mpt: the progress of the history view http://videobin.org/v/i/ik.ogg
<rugby471> mpt: atm it is parsing the history xml file and highlighting (in bold) the days that events have occured on
<rugby471> mac_v: for your interest ^
<mac_v> rugby471: i'll be adding a mockup in a few mins :)
<rugby471> mac_v: awesome!
<rugby471> see ya guys
<c_korn> jcastro: hello
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-09-20
<kmckinney> Hi everyone, does anyone know how to contact davidz (David Zeuthen). I am working on the gnome-device-manager package and I wanted to ask him a few questions.
<mclasen> kmckinney: you'll find him on GimpNet during work hours on weekdays
<kmckinney> mclasen: thanks!!
<TheMuso> c
<didrocks> good morning
<slomo> pitti: hi :) do you have a second or two for two quite trivial freeze exceptions?
<htorque> good morning, everybody! i have a question about the rdepends of libevolution: shouldn't they all depend on evolution too?
<htorque> eg., i purged evolution and evolution-indicator stayed behind because it only depends on libevolution.
<htorque> rdepends already depending on both: evolution-couchdb, evolution-exchange, evolution-plugins-experimental, evolution-mapi
<glatzor> morning mvo
<htorque> rdepends depending on libevolution only: libevolution-dbgsym, tracker-miner-evolution, mail-notification-evolution, evoluion-plugins, evolution-indicator
<bryceh> glatzor, hi
<glatzor> hello bryceh! how are you?
<glatzor> mvo, https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/software-center/+bug/642936
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 642936 in python-apt (Debian) (and 2 other projects) "Doesn't monitor remove transactions (affects: 1) (heat: 8)" [Unknown,Unknown]
<didrocks> htorque: evolution doesn't use libevolution, hence evo doesn't dep on libevolution
<pitti> Good morning
<glatzor> mvo, could you please take a look at this python-apt bug? I attachted a patch.
<glatzor> morning pitti
<didrocks> hey pitti
<pitti> slomo: I can have a look, yes
<pitti> guten Morgen glatzor, wie gehts?
<htorque> didrocks, hm, 'apt-cache depends evolution' shows 'Depends: libevolution'?
<pitti> bonjour didrocks
<slomo> pitti: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gst-plugins-good0.10/+bug/641218  and   https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/totem-plugin-arte/+bug/639760   (second one is in universe)
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 641218 in gst-plugins-good0.10 (Ubuntu) "Freeze Exception: Backport 0.10.24-3 and 0.10.24-4 changes from Debian (affects: 1) (heat: 8)" [Undecided,New]
<didrocks> htorque: sorry, I apt-cache show the other way around :)
<mvo> glatzor: good morning! sure, I have a look now
<bryceh> glatzor, doing fine, you?
<glatzor> bryceh, pitti, thanks. I am well, but I am in a hurry - have to get my bus! So see you!
<micahg> htorque: not necessarily, that would usually be handled if the the package is marked automatically for install and if nothing else uses it, aptitude/apt should offer to remove
<didrocks> htorque: so, it seems normal that they only depends on libevolution, evolution is just the gui
<didrocks> htorque: libevolution the way to access to e-d-s
<micahg> htorque: you can see why it was left by running: aptitude why libevolution
<pitti> slomo: done, looks fine
<slomo> pitti: thanks :)
<htorque> micahg, didrocks: thanks. i'm still a bit confused, why eg. evolution-plugins depends only on libevolution, while evolution-plugins-experimental depends on both. or: can evolution-indicator be used without the package evolution?
<didrocks> htorque: this one should be an issue. But they are plugins that can be used with anjal for instance, IIRC, I set that for those depending on evolution (the gui) itself or not. I'll have a look again for Natty. evolution-indicator should work with anjal
<htorque> didrocks, ah, makes sense then. thanks! :)
<didrocks> htorque: you're welcome :)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: hey ;)
<chrisccoulson> hi didrocks, how are you?
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson, good morning
<pitti> chrisccoulson: had a nice weekend?
<chrisccoulson> hi pitti
<chrisccoulson> yeah, it wasn't too bad, although i spent quite a bit of time yesterday trying to get firefox to build with the test-suite enabled
<chrisccoulson> other than that, it was a fairly quiet weekend
<chrisccoulson> how about you?
<chrisccoulson> grrrr @ bug 641294
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 641294 in firefox (Ubuntu) "Error loading the runtime (/usr/lib/firefox-3.6.10/libnssutil3.so: undefined symbol: PL_ClearArenaPool) (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Low,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/641294
<pitti> chrisccoulson: was rather quiet, too (my wife is away visiting a friend); so I went for some bicycling, house cleaning, and watching too many "Doctor House" episodes :)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I went to a "Star Trek - Facts and Fiction" presentation on Sat evening, which was really interesting, though
<pitti> I was surprised to learn that the Warp drive is quite a lot more realistic than I thought
<directhex> even the "reach warp 10 and you'll devolve into some kind of lizard" bit from Voyager?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - nice. is this the sort of thing you can only do when your wife is away, or is she also a star trek fan too?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: she isn't; however, I'd have gone there anwyay, she just wouldn't have joined me :)
<pitti> directhex: well, there's quite a bit of impact waay before you fold the universe into an infinitesimally small point :)
<didrocks> hey chrisccoulson
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: how was your week-end?
<pitti> before that I knew that some physicist had come up with some theories about how this could work, but back then it still needed 20 billion universe energies to do that
<pitti> but apparently in 1999 some clever guy reduced that by a factor of 10**32 (!)
<pitti> so it's "only" the energy of 20 suns now
<directhex> there's more power in dilithium than i thought!
<pitti> directhex: oh, this was all just from a purely theoretical standpoint, of course; no engineering at all
<chrisccoulson> hey didrocks, it was good thanks. how was yours?
<pitti> they just looked at how to warp space (in the GRT sense) to create such a "warp bubble"
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: well, I was force to test maverick reinstallation. / has been corrupted and no way to fsck, even on live cd
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: so, not a very good experience
<chrisccoulson> ouch, that's not good
<pitti> and of course the little problem that building such a warp bubble needs something that produces negative energy; while that's physically allowed, nobody found such a thing yet
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: yeah, but at least /home was safe :)
<pitti> (except in ridiculously small quantities using the Casimir effect)
 * pitti realizes he's waaay OT here, sorry
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: btw, do you have some free time for some GNOME bug?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks - yeah, sure
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: bug #633303 would be interesting to fix
<directhex> my indicator-application merge is on-topic. but it needs a tedg or bratsche, both of whom are hiding
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 633303 in gnome-terminal (Ubuntu Maverick) (and 1 other project) "gnome-terminal crashed with signal 5 in _XError() when Mutter is restarted (affects: 70) (dups: 23) (heat: 244)" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/633303
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: people get it on unity and gnome shell, so maybe vte related
<chrisccoulson> didrocks - yeah, i can look at that one
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: but terminator doesn't crash (xterm does from a report)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: thanks ;)
<htorque> xterm doesn't for me
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: also bug #629452 if you are interested :)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 629452 in gnome-bluetooth (Ubuntu Maverick) (and 1 other project) "can not disable bluetooth in applet menu (affects: 14) (dups: 2) (heat: 72)" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/629452
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: I think that's enough for now. I'll try to continue on GNOME updates today
<chrisccoulson> didrocks - sure, i'll take a look at that one after gnome-terminal
<didrocks> thanks chrisccoulson :)
<rodrigo_> hmm, is seb128 out?
<didrocks> rodrigo_: yeah, he's on vacation this week
<didrocks> rodrigo_: hey btw
<rodrigo_> hi didrocks
<didrocks> how are you?
<rodrigo_> ok, well deserved vacation I guess :)
<didrocks> right :)
<rodrigo_> didrocks, feeling a bit Mondayish, but fine, thanks, you?
<didrocks> rodrigo_: I'm fine thanks ;) sunny, but cold
<didrocks> rodrigo_: did you merge evolution localized welcome email in the patch, btw? (I think we should have it before Thursday to get it into maverick or dpm will cry ;))
<rodrigo_> didrocks, working on it, dpm sent me the translations, but I need to format them in the mbox, etc
<rodrigo_> didrocks, but yes, before Thursday they will be in
<rodrigo_> probably today evedning or tomorrow, I'll have it done
<didrocks> rodrigo_: great! thanks :)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: I'll assign the indicator bug to karl
<baptistemm> hi
<baptistemm> pitti: there are some interesting fixes for git packages (at least for me) from debian which could interesting to have for maverick, although the fixes are in experimental. Would it possible to have them or it is safer to pick the fixes one by one ? http://packages.debian.org/changelogs/pool/main/g/git/git_1.7.2.3-1/changelog
<didrocks> rodrigo_: interested in doing the tomboy update?
<rodrigo_> didrocks, yes, I can do it, if you want
<didrocks> rodrigo_: sweet! thanks :)
<rodrigo_> didrocks, hmm, is the ~ubuntu-desktop up-to-date? I thought 1.3.3 had already been uploaded
<rodrigo_> no, only 1.3.2 in the archive
<didrocks> rodrigo_: yeah, only 1.3.2-1ubuntu4
<didrocks> rodrigo_: but .3 just lived one day :)
<rodrigo_> ah
<rodrigo_> ok, building the package, will submit as soon as everyting is ok
<directhex> didrocks, tomboy is broken
<didrocks> directhex: even .4?
<didrocks> rodrigo_: ^^
<directhex> didrocks, Bug #636132
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 636132 in indicator-application (Ubuntu) "Tomboy does not start, indicator-application version skew (affects: 2) (heat: 14)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/636132
<rodrigo_> didrocks, hmm, is it?
<rodrigo_> testing now
<directhex> only works on upgrade systems with leftover libindicator0
<rodrigo_> didrocks, seems to work ok for me
<didrocks> trying there using not the applet
<rodrigo_> oh, but no text for the notes titles in the menu :(
<directhex> rodrigo_, do you have libindicator0 installed?
<rodrigo_> the panel applet works great
<rodrigo_> directhex, hmm, let me check
<rodrigo_> ii  libappindicator0                          0.2.3-0ubuntu2
<directhex> rodrigo_, that's why it works. leftover package
<rodrigo_> so, if I remove that, it doesn'0t work?
<rodrigo_> ok
<rodrigo_> ugh, I've uploaded the package already :(
<directhex> fixed (well, hacked around) in https://code.launchpad.net/~directhex/indicator-application/gapi_is_a_pile_of_shit/+merge/35963
<didrocks> directhex: it works there, I've reinstalled from scratch maverick yesterday. But I have to check why I have it
<rodrigo_> directhex, ah, dll mapping
<rodrigo_> directhex, I had a similar problem in the u1 patch in tomboy
<directhex> rodrigo_, dll mapping plus a major problem with the way gapi handles signals, which took the other 11 hours of yesterday's hacking
<rodrigo_> ok, so the fix is outside tomboy, so it's ok for the tomboy ackage to be uploaded, right?
<rodrigo_> directhex, :(
<didrocks> directhex: ok, I get libindicator0 because of unity
<rodrigo_> directhex, gapi is a bit unmaintained, hasn't seen a release for months, afaics
<directhex> rodrigo_, yes, tomboy should be okay, it's the binding that needs updating
<rodrigo_> ok
<directhex> rodrigo_, indeed... trunk version doesn't cope with this scenario (multiple signals w/ the same signal handler) either
<didrocks> directhex: just ping tedg about that one when he's there
<directhex> didrocks, he hasn't been here since i proposed the merge! i reckon he's hiding
<rodrigo_> didrocks, merge this then please -> https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~rodrigo-moya/ubuntu/maverick/tomboy/1_3_4_release/+merge/36002
<didrocks> directhex: hehe, right. Just remember me to launch the hunt then :p
<didrocks> rodrigo_: sure, thanks!
<pitti> baptistemm: does git have a test suite with nice coverage? or anyone else who tested the new version? For a package like git, syncing could be adequate
<rodrigo_> didrocks, sorry, proposed it for the wrong branch, re-proposing
<didrocks> pitti: I'm just uploading GNOME 2.31.92 without opening or subscribing ubuntu-release to each bug, it's ok I guess?
<pitti> didrocks: yes, we'll review it from the queue
<didrocks> pitti: thanks :)
<didrocks> rodrigo_: pushed, thanks!
<rodrigo_> didrocks, https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~rodrigo-moya/ubuntu/maverick/tomboy/1_3_4_release/+merge/36003
<rodrigo_> didrocks, oh, already pushed?
<didrocks> rodrigo_: yes. I think LP will linked to the branch once scanned :)
<rodrigo_> didrocks, ah, ok
<Laney> rodrigo_: you are using the wrong version number for new upstreams you upload
<Laney> they should be -0ubuntu1
<baptistemm> pitti: I don't really know, I've just look at the package because I discovered some bugs while setting up a git repository with web interface
<didrocks> right, rodrigo_ can you fix that and upload again? pitti, can you reject -1ubuntu1, please?
<pitti> didrocks: which package?
<pitti> tomboy?
<pitti> right, it's the only 1ubuntu1, rejecting
<didrocks> pitti: thanks :)
<didrocks> rodrigo_: open for a new upload :)
<didrocks> pitti: do you prefer than I update gdu or do you want to do it in experimental + sync? (or do you want me to propose a package for exp)
<rodrigo_> Laney, hmm, what is wrong then?
<didrocks> rodrigo_: you should use -0ubuntu1 instead of -1ubuntu1
<rodrigo_> didrocks, oh
<didrocks> as you don't base on a debian version, apart if you merged :)
<rodrigo_> didrocks, the previous uploads all have 1ubuntu*
<didrocks> rodrigo_: it's never too late to make it right ;)
<rodrigo_> didrocks, ah, ok :)
<didrocks> rodrigo_: more seriously, if we want to merge from debian, we have to upload with -1 or -1ubuntu1
<didrocks> which won't be possible if you use that version
<rodrigo_> ok
<didrocks> am I the only one with one row despite of the setting of 2 rows of ws in metacity? (which wasn't updated for a while)
<Laney> rodrigo_: Yeah, you have to upload with higher version than what's in the archive already. If you use -1ubuntu1 then it's impossible to upload -1 as this is considered "lower" by dpkg
<rodrigo_> Laney, ah, ok
<pitti> didrocks: ah, I can do that
<didrocks> pitti: thanks :)
<pitti> didrocks: ah, in fact I already looked at that a while ago
<pitti> didrocks: we don't upload to unstable since it drops all the GTK docs
<rodrigo_> didrocks, https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~rodrigo-moya/ubuntu/maverick/tomboy/1_3_4_release/+merge/36003 <- change is there, so please merge
<pitti> didrocks: and there's nothing urgent in that; is it important to get this new versino into maverick?
<didrocks> pitti: from what I see, yes, we need --enable-gtk-doc and build it. But nothing important from what I see in it. The import change (can be launched on small screen) is already backported
<didrocks> pitti: thanks :)
<didrocks> rodrigo_: doing, thanks!
<pitti> didrocks: no, it was completely ripped out
<pitti> didrocks: the small screen patch was reverted in 2.32 as well
<directhex> pitti, my pending indicator-application merge is urgent for maverick, or certainly a similar merge is
<didrocks> pitti: oh really? did I misread the NEWS file?
<pitti> didrocks: yes, it was reverted after tagging the release and NEWS file
<pitti> didrocks: I suppose David noticed the broken gtk-doc stuff when he tried to make dist
<didrocks> pitti: oh ok, hence the fact I didn't saw that
<didrocks> well, no hurry in any case
<didrocks> rodrigo_: done, thanks :)
<rodrigo_> didrocks, ok!
<directhex> it's tedg!
<didrocks> tedg: be careful, some people are hunting for you :)
 * tedg runs and hides
<didrocks> directhex: he's there! quick! ;)
<directhex> tedg, mono binding for indicator-application is "buggered" to use the technical term
<tedg> directhex, I think that's a generic term for all mono bindings :)
<tedg> I saw the merge request.
<tedg> Does that make it happy-happy?
<directhex> tedg, it makes it not ftbfs, and have correct deps, and stuff... it could do with some quick testing from someone with a maverick system
<directhex> tedg, i uploaded a test package to my ppa, but haven't had time to set up a VM
<tedg> directhex, Hmm, okay.  Tomboy has worked correctly on my Maverick system...
<directhex> tedg, purge libappindicator0
<tedg> directhex, No, that might break things ;)
<directhex> tedg, it'd certainly break tomboy
<chrisccoulson> right, gnome-terminal crasher is fixed \o/
<chrisccoulson> will upload in a second, and then send the patch upstream
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: awesome \o/
 * didrocks hugs chrisccoulson
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: what was it?
 * chrisccoulson hugs didrocks
<chrisccoulson> didrocks - it was just passing the XID of the destroyed window to XChangeProperty
<chrisccoulson> it's a 1 line fix :)
<didrocks> hehe, I bet gnome-terminal didn't like it! :)
<didrocks> pitti: can you reject g-c-c please? I didn't see there is a 2.31.92.1 release too
<pitti> didrocks: what? no bribe or tip?
<pitti> j/k
<pitti> killed
<didrocks> pitti: :p thanks! ;)
<didrocks> pitti: will tip you with some beer at UDS :)
<pitti> good deal!
 * pitti hugs didrocks
 * didrocks hugs pitti back
<directhex> i thought dholbach was the one people hugged
 * nessita notices that every time she reads this channel people is huging eachother
<chrisccoulson> directhex, yeah, but he's not in here :)
<chrisccoulson> nessita, this channel is full of love
<chrisccoulson> :)
<directhex> nessita, FOSS developers are very loving
<nessita> chrisccoulson: hey, the channel of love is #pyar! do not steal that from us
<nessita> directhex: better love than hate :-)
<chrisccoulson> nessita, #pyar doesn't speak my language though ;)
<nessita> chrisccoulson: september is the bets tiome of the year to start speaking spanish!
<nessita> s/tiome/time/
<bratsche> Anyone here know anything about the transition effects that are built into evince?  Is there some way to enable them?
<pitti> bratsche: I thought they'd be specified in a PDF itself?
<pitti> bratsche: ISTR playing with them in latex-beamer
<bratsche> Maybe you're right.. it kind of looked like it's used for page-changing animations, which is what I wanted.
<bratsche> Oh I think you're right.
<chrisccoulson> didrocks - any other issues you want me to take a look at?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: sure, looking at the bug list (I think nobody new from this morning, but in any case)
<ogra> didrocks, btw, did you implement the error message if people try to run unity on non-gl HW ?
<didrocks> ogra: just did it this week-end
<didrocks> ogra: I'll just change .dmrc as well, it will be better for cases like live-cd where there is no passwd
<didrocks> and you can't choose your session
<ogra> dmrc ? to what ?
<didrocks> ogra: to tell "gnome" is the default session then
<ogra> hrm
<ogra> cant you just use the default system session
<ogra> oh, indeed, thats a prob on x86 without GL
<didrocks> ogra: well, the default will be une on the une live
 * ogra thinks to ARMish
<didrocks> yeah
<didrocks> :)
<ogra> on our images its une-efl
<didrocks> like, you have a nvidia card
<didrocks> you start ubuntu-netbook
<didrocks> (on the live cd)
<ogra> right
<didrocks> you get into the session, error message
<didrocks> logout
<ogra> understood
<didrocks> but then, you have ubuntu with no password and you can't change the session :)
<didrocks> hence the fix I should do to .dmrc
<ogra> i'm just not so happy about the fact that we trash the users default session in our images in case he wanted to just try unity
<didrocks> ogra: better than nothingâ¦ if you want to do better :)
<ogra> since he will now get back to gnome instead of the efl stuff
<ogra> we should look for a proper solution for this at UDS
<didrocks> ogra: if you want to implement it, you can check if there is efl in the image
<didrocks> right
<ogra> it should be set by the -default-settings packages but in a proper way
<didrocks> I'm already in a hurry, looking for important bug for the team and updating GNOME + unity team bug triage and uploads
<ogra> worst case with an alternative or so
<didrocks> + some unity fixes I'm writing too
<ogra> yeah, lets keep the discussion for UDS, i dont want to hold you up
<ogra> for maverick its fine
<didrocks> yeah :)
 * ogra has to fight with automatic PPA enablement in his images ... also time consuming
<ogra> ande we dont have the final HW yet ... which means new bootloader and kernel right before release day
<didrocks> bratsche: did you have some time to look at bug #551809 ?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 551809 in gtk+2.0 (Ubuntu) (and 1 other project) "gnome-settings-daemon crashed with SIGSEGV (affects: 276) (dups: 62) (heat: 1079)" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/551809
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: interested in looking at it? ^ (I think bratsche didn't have the time to get a look there)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: there is also bug #187823 if is on againâ¦ not sure if you want to have a look at cairo :)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 187823 in libcairo-perl (Ubuntu Hardy) (and 2 other projects) "ftbfs (1 failed test) with current cairo version (heat: 6)" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/187823
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, yeah, i can take a look at the g-s-d crasher
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: thanks :)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: seems to be gtk from the bug report
<bratsche> didrocks: I didn't get anywhere useful with it, and today I have to start on an MT demo for next week.
<didrocks> bratsche: sure, can you just ensure chrisccoulson have all the element you investigate?
<didrocks> elements*
<rodrigo_> kenvandine, hey did you tweet that led zeppelin link from rhythmbox?
<kenvandine> rodrigo_, yup :)
<kenvandine> rodrigo_, i just fixed that...
<rodrigo_> kenvandine, cool! :D
<kenvandine> someone had renamed the vbox in the glade file
 * kenvandine will propose a branch in a few
<rodrigo_> kenvandine, fixed in the rb plugin?
<kenvandine> rodrigo_, yes
<kenvandine> it was working a couple weeks ago...
<rodrigo_> kenvandine, ah, ok
<rodrigo_> kenvandine, yes
<kenvandine> rodrigo_, https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~ken-vandine/rhythmbox-ubuntuone-music-store/u1msurl-gwibber/+merge/36027
<kenvandine> if you want to review it
<kenvandine> :)
<rodrigo_> kenvandine, yesm reviewing it
<bcurtiswx_> kenvandine, i can still reproduce the notification bug, i've emailed you SS and steps to reproduce.  No rush by any means. :)
<kenvandine> bcurtiswx_, ok, thx!
<kenvandine> i'll look at it in a bit
<bcurtiswx_> kenvandine, np
<mpt> mvo, bug 643566 doesn't happen for me in my main installation, just in the fresh installation
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 643566 in software-center (Ubuntu) ""Reinstall Previous Purchases" does nothing after signing in (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/643566
<mpt> mvo, anything you want me to do to help debug it?
<mvo> mpt: hmm, hmm, let me look at the code, but that looks like a issue with ubuntu-sso-client, could you try the buildin one?
<mvo> mpt: is there more output, or just those lines?
<mvo> mpt: could you run with "--debug" and paste the output?
<mpt> mvo, really a sign-in problem even though it says it's signed in successfully?
<mpt> mvo, there was no more output
<mvo> mpt: well, that is a guess at this point, but the only error is dbus related
<mvo> mpt: maybe --debug will help?
<mvo> mpt: it might be that ubuntu-sso-client does not return the token to s-c after the login for some reason, so while u-sso-l is in, s-c is not
<mvo> mpt: but again, just a guess at this point
<mpt> ok, I'll try both, bbiab
<mvo> mpt: thanks!
<mpt> wahaha
<mpt> mvo, it's not a sign-in problem, it's a navigation problem
<mvo> meh?
<mvo> really?
<mpt> The menu item works only if the "Get Software" branch is already expanded
<mvo> hahahaha
<mpt> When it's collapsed, it just blinks
<mvo> and is not added?
<mvo> crazy!
<mpt> It is added, if you expand it
<mvo> many thanks for finding this one
<mvo> so if expanded its fine and added
<mvo> if unexpanded its not added, even if you expand later?
<mpt> It is added
<mvo> aha, but not selected?
<mpt> exactly
<mvo> great, please put that into the bug
<mvo> I target it
<mpt> bug 643566 updated
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 643566 in software-center (Ubuntu) ""Reinstall Previous Purchases" apparently does nothing if "Get Software" is collapsed (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/643566
<mvo> thanks mpt
<tremolux> mvo: I have a fix for bug 643566, I'll upload a branch
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 643566 in software-center (Ubuntu) ""Reinstall Previous Purchases" apparently does nothing if "Get Software" is collapsed (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/643566
<mvo> tremolux: sweet, thanks!
<tremolux> mvo: sure thing!
<vish> tremolux: wasnt there a bug/plan to redirect the "get more themes online" in the appearance window to direct to SC ?
<tremolux> vish: hmm, if there was I was not aware of it  :-/
<vish> hehe!
<vish> np..
<tremolux> vish: ok, if you find the bug or run across info plz send to me if you don't mind
<tremolux> vish: meanwhile I'll poke around  ;)
<vish> tremolux: sure.. will do :)
<tremolux> vish: thx
<vish> np..
<devildante> hey guys :)
<tremolux> devildante: hey!
<devildante> hi tremolux
<devildante> mpt is not here? on a monday? I call laziness :p
<tremolux> devildante: haha, nah, he was actually here until just a few minutes ago
<devildante> ah
<tremolux> devildante: he may be back, not sure where he went
<devildante> okay :)
<tremolux> and with that, I have to run to an appt myself, see everyone a little later
 * tremolux waves
<sense> aquarius: Is Guake really the full width of the screen on Unity for you? I don't have any troubles with it.
<aquarius> sense, see http://ubuntuone.com/p/Gqa/ -- xchat is maximised on the first screen, and twitter is maximised on the second
<aquarius> as you can see, guake is sticking out into the second screen
<sense> aquarius: Ah, I see. That seems to be related to dual-monitor setups, but it's still annoying, especially since drop-down terminals and dual-monitor setups are both things often used by power users. I'll triage the bug report.
<sense> Although this is actually two bugs in one report.
<aquarius> yeah, it is, but I figured that if there was some magic way that an app is supposed to know about the unity launcher, then someone would change the bug to be "guake ignores settings for left-hand docks"
<aquarius> would be interesting to see what happens if you have a panel docked to the left side of your screen on a dual monitor setup and then run guake
<sense> yeah
<sense> I have to say though that the development of Guake does seem quite inactive. The TERM env variable bug has been lingering around for way too long already.
<aquarius> man, the TERM bug is really, really annoying
<sense> yes
<aquarius> not sure there are any alternative more-developed dropdown terminals
<aquarius> and I'm aware that they're purely a poweruser tool :)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: btw, from your gnome-terminal fix, why didn't it crash before when switching from metacity to compiz or restarting the WM?
<sense> It is such a great thing! I'm more addicted to F12 these days than to F5. ;)
<sense> aquarius: Bug report upstream already: <http://guake.org/ticket/194>. Nine months old though. The latest commit that wasn't from Transifex was 7 weeks old. :S
<aquarius> sense, so it's basically orphaned upstream :(
<sense> I'm afraid it is slowly dying. :(
<chrisccoulson> didrocks - if there is a WM already running, then a different code path is taken
<chrisccoulson> so, if you switch WM or restart, it takes a code path which doesn't crash
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: oh ok, so if I crashed compiz, and respawn it, it would have crashed as well?
<chrisccoulson> (although, theoretically it could still crash, if the new WM hasn't really started)
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, yeah, i'd expect it to crash then too
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: thanks for the info ;)
<didrocks> yeah, understood
<chrisccoulson> cool. i've committed it upstream now as well
<didrocks> great ;)
<devildante> mvo: ping
<and471> devildante, I think he is at dinner
<devildante> argh
<didrocks> pitti: it seems that cheese and gees are leftover from the acceptance queue. I'll push libgnomekbd and vala as well in a bit
<didrocks> session restart
<didrocks> ok, pushed. GNOME updates mostly done \o/
<didrocks> phew*
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-09-21
<kmckinney> Hello mclasen: I have been trying to find Davidz on GimpNet but I am not sure what channel he is on.. Would you know the channel he resides?
<mclasen> he's usually in #gtk+ or #fedora-desktop
<kmckinney> thanks again
<kyanardag__>  i remember reading about a software two connect two computers via wireless (without connecting to router), do you any of you guys know a software like that?
<OwaisL> kyanardag__: What do you intent to do with the connection?
<OwaisL> kyanardag__: Network Manager can do that. Try creating a new wireless connection by clicking the NM applet.
<didrocks> good morning
<nisshh> hey didrocks :)
<didrocks> hey nisshh!
<nisshh> didrocks: i thought you ran an irssi proxy? but you keep hopping on and off irc
<didrocks> nisshh: I moved from Paris and consequently, my server is down right now
<didrocks> nisshh: I used bip btw, not irssi proxy :)
<nisshh> didrocks: ah, right, i forgot you just moved :)
<dpm> good morning didrocks. I've got a question: one of the recent unity updates wiped out all my launchers from the panel in the left (or whatever it is called). Is there an easy way to get them back? Or at least to get the default ones back?
<didrocks> dpm: was it something like 2 weeks before?
<didrocks> good morning :)
<dpm> didrocks, I cannot tell, I hadn't been updating the notebook for a while. I would have thought it might have been rather a week, but it could have been two as well :)
<didrocks> dpm: ok, I think that's because I reorganized the defaults to be more sane
<didrocks> dpm: so, the easiest is to: gconftool-2 -u /desktop/unity
<didrocks> logout
<didrocks> and login again
<dpm> didrocks, ok, cool, let me try that now
<didrocks> dpm: keep me in touch :)
<dpm> didrocks, that did not seem to do anything. I've still got: a terminal launcher (that I had added some time ago), a launcher to bazaar notification (which I've never added there but somehow it's now stuck in there) and then workspaces, files, applications and trash
<didrocks> dpm: oupss, sorry, it was gconftool-2 --recursive-unset /desktop/unity
<dpm> didrocks, no worries, trying that now :)
<didrocks> sorry again :)
<dpm> didrocks, that did it, thanks! I've got another question, though. How can I get rid of the bzr notification launcher? I cannot untick the "Keep in launcher" option, as it is not checked anyway, but that launcher comes back every time
<didrocks> dpm: no, you can't I think you should open a bug against unity (for tracking) and bamf (for the component) and harrass Jason about it :)
<dpm> didrocks, ok, that will do, thanks! :)
<didrocks> you're welcome :)
<didrocks> dpm: about OOo translation, can we do that for natty? maybe it doesn't worth crowding builders so close to release?
<pitti> Good morning
<dpm> didrocks, sure. It would be cool if the fix could be committed, so that the next upload (be it in maverick or in natty) already includes it and does not import translations, as every OO.o upload puts thousands of PO files in the imports queue that take several days to process and block the ones from other applications. It would be ok if we were using those translations, but until there is a dedicated OO.o maintainer who can take care of them, we've di
<dpm> sabled them, so OO.o is not translatable in LP and generally it is not useful to import them (unless they are needed for statistics).
<didrocks> hey pitti
<didrocks> dpm: sure, will have a look this week
<dpm> didrocks, thanks a lot. It doesn't need a new upload, I just want to make sure that the next upload, if there is any, does not put all the translations in the imports queue.
<didrocks> dpm: ok, will do :)
<dpm> cool :)
<njm> Hey Guys, since I updated my Ubuntu 10.04 Remix on my netbook, my 3G USB Dongle doesn't work anymore...  It says: waiting for usb device to settle in dmesg.  Any ideas
<milanbv> njm: this is a development channel, try in #ubuntu
<njm> Will do thanx
<fta> slomo, uh?? https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libvpx/0.9.2-1
<fta> thought you did it, but it's not your name
<fta> hm, he filed bug 636894
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 636894 in libvpx (Ubuntu) "please sync libvpx 0.9.2-1 from debian experimental (main) (affects: 1) (heat: 10)" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/636894
<slomo> fta: yes, the person filing the sync bug is listed as uploader
<fta> hm
<didrocks> hum, seems I was disconnected
<didrocks> dpm: did you receive my messages?
<dpm> didrocks, no, unfortunately not
<dpm> (the last ones I got were when we were talking about oo.o)
<didrocks> dpm: ok, so: I've made a patch for unity as I told you last week, with a new string
<didrocks> it will probably land tomorrow
<didrocks> it's an error message on people not having acceleration when starting unity
<didrocks> unity was crashing before
<didrocks> so, even if it's not translated in time, it's still a win :
<chrisccoulson> milanbv - you there?
<dpm> didrocks, no worries. Can you point me to the patch, so I know which string it will be and I send an e-mail to translators?
<dpm> or if there is a bug
<didrocks> dpm: sure, one sec
<milanbv> chrisccoulson: looks like ;-)
<chrisccoulson> milanbv - can you easily trigger this g-s-d crasher?
<chrisccoulson> well, that should probably be "anything with an indicator" crasher? :)
<milanbv> chrisccoulson: no :(
<milanbv> I think it happens when icons are changed, and gtk-update-icon-cache is run
<chrisccoulson> milanbv, do you use the indicator-applet, or just the old notification area?
<milanbv> which occurs often in development releases, but...
<milanbv> just the notification area (GNOME Shell acutally)
<milanbv> the crash is in GtkStatusIcon
<chrisccoulson> ah, ok. i'll try with that too
<milanbv> yesterday I got the crash hours after installing upgrades
<milanbv> chrisccoulson: have you read the upstream report?
<chrisccoulson> milanbv, yeah, i had a look at that
<milanbv> random thoughts, but that could be useful
<didrocks> dpm: bug #614088
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 614088 in unity (Ubuntu) (and 2 other projects) "unity should give an error to the user when not supported by the driver/graphic card (affects: 20) (dups: 5) (heat: 114)" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/614088
<didrocks> just linked the branch to it
<didrocks> dpm: if you have a better idea for the wording, do not hesitate
<milanbv> chrisccoulson: actually, I suspect OpenOffice might trigger the crash
<milanbv> I've updated it yesterday, and I remember having seen the crash after updating it before
<rodrigo_> didrocks, I was about to submit the translations for the u1 email in evolution, but have just seen an update to the evo package, but the ubuntu-desktop branch is not up-to-date it seems, so my submission will overwrite that one
<rodrigo_> didrocks, can you have a look, please?
<didrocks> rodrigo_: oh, did I forgot to push? let me see
<rodrigo_> ah, it was you? :)
<rodrigo_> didn't see who the did the change :)
<didrocks> rodrigo_: no revision to push
<rodrigo_> hmm
<didrocks> rodrigo_: let me see :)
<didrocks> 2.30.3-1ubuntu4 ?
<didrocks> that's my change from this morning
<rodrigo_> ah, ok
<rodrigo_> my fault, sorry
<didrocks> no worry :)
<didrocks> rodrigo_: ~ubuntu-desktop/evolution/ubuntu, right?
<rodrigo_> didrocks, yes
<didrocks> rodrigo_: all should be good then ;)
<rodrigo_> my update is indeed 1ubuntu5
<didrocks> great, maybe waiting for tomorrow for the update? seeing if new things are queuing?
<didrocks> (normally not, but we never know)
<didrocks> but still, I'll pull from your branch
<rodrigo_> didrocks, https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~rodrigo-moya/ubuntu/maverick/evolution/add_u1_email_translations/+merge/36123 <- so if you can upload and merge, we should be good
<rodrigo_> (no permissions for evolution package)
<rodrigo_> didrocks, I'm going to talk with upstream to have the email thing translatable via gettext (with a intltool patch from danilo), because it's going to be a PITA to maintain this patch
<didrocks> rodrigo_: I totally agree :)
<didrocks> rodrigo_: no formatting for languages? like the enligsh one?
<rodrigo_> didrocks, no, sorry :(
<didrocks> rodrigo_: I don't really care, but that will be nice to have for Natty :)
<didrocks> rodrigo_: you tested it and it's working?
<rodrigo_> didrocks, but I wrote a script to integrate the translations, so working on trying to make it generate the HTML also
<didrocks> rodrigo_: ok, I pull and merge that then
<didrocks> rodrigo_: will wait before uploading
<didrocks> thanks :)
<rodrigo_> didrocks, yes, tested a few languages, both ones with no previous translation for the evolution mail, and ones with that mail already translated
<rodrigo_> didrocks, dpm wants to be notified when the package is ready, so that translators for each language can check it
<rodrigo_> didrocks, the problem is that the translations don't include the HTML formatting (<a href...) the English version has, so I need to parse it and guess where the formatting goes
<didrocks> rodrigo_: yeah, that's a PITA :/
<rodrigo_> didrocks, so, I prefer to submit a plain text one, and hopefully if I make it work, submit a 2nd version of the patch with the HTML
<rodrigo_> yeah, a royal PITA indeed :)
<didrocks> rodrigo_: well, I'll upload tomorrow, maybe some changes will pile up for unity until then
<rodrigo_> ok
<didrocks> thanks ;)
<rodrigo_> np :)
<didrocks> pitti: not sure who is in archive admin task, but it seems that cheese is ignored, do you know why? it's not in the same rule than any other GNOME components?
<pitti> didrocks: it'll be reviewed; several people review the queue several times a day, but it might not be entirely FIFO
<didrocks> pitti: ok, just wondered about it. Thanks! ;)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: hey, how are you?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks - good thanks, how are you?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: busy, but good :)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: do you strike still on the gtk/gsd bug?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: if you think it's too hard to get, do not hesitate to drop it
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, yeah, i'm trying to figure that one out atm
<didrocks> great, thanks ;) good luck!
<chrisccoulson> thanks :)
<didrocks> session restart, brb
<chrisccoulson> jcastro - did you ask in here a few days ago about an issue with tomboy not displaying labels in the indicator menu?
<jcastro> I did
<chrisccoulson> jcastro, did you ever reproduce it?
<bilalakhtar> I know this is a somewhat offtopic question, but can anyone over here hilight the process of joining the recently made app review board?
<bilalakhtar> *highlight
<bilalakhtar> brb
<jcastro> isn't it on the wiki?
<chrisccoulson> milanbv, so, libappindicator does actually handle the changed signal from GtkIconTheme, and updates GtkStatusIcon. isn't that unnecessary? (doesn't GtkImage already handle this same signal?)
<jcastro> chrisccoulson: neither me, vandine, or karl were able to reproduce it
<chrisccoulson> jcastro, i can reproduce it :)
<jcastro> chrisccoulson: so far only the people on the bug seem to have reproduced it
<jcastro> alright!
<chrisccoulson> jcastro - it happens when you're not using the indicator (ie, with the fallback)
<chrisccoulson> i've just got a menu full of blank entries
<jcastro> Oh.
<chrisccoulson> i just stumbled across it when looking at another issue
<jcastro> ok, I'll let karl know
<chrisccoulson> thanks
<mvo> mpt: could you please have a look at this http://people.canonical.com/~mvo/tmp/Screenshot-Ubuntu%20Software%20Centre.png - its a fix for the missing support to show further information about a channel, it used to be a feature of gnome-app-install that was not used much, but it would be good to get it back because otherwise the "enable channel" screen is a bit terse
<mvo> mpt: please let me know if that makes sense or if you think it should be done differently
<mpt> mvo, is that for a whitelisted repository?
<mvo> mpt: yes
<mpt> mvo, that looks fine to me, apart from the "Share" link
<mvo> mpt: currently its only maverick-partner, but the TI folks want to ship some more
<mvo> mpt: ok, I make the button go away
<mpt> mvo, is 100% of that description provided by the repository maintainer?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - /dev/rfkill is only meant to be used by the root user isn't it?
<mvo> mpt: yes
<mpt> ok
<cyphermox> chrisccoulson, right, through the rfkill command
<klattimer> any chance of a repaste of the last few lines
<bilalakhtar> jcastro: It isn't on the wiki
<chrisccoulson> cyphermox, oh, i wasn't aware of that. the bluetooth-applet is trying to open /dev/rfkill directly, it seems
<chrisccoulson> klattimer:
<chrisccoulson> <chrisccoulson> pitti - /dev/rfkill is only meant to be used by the root user isn't it?
<chrisccoulson> <cyphermox> chrisccoulson, right, through the rfkill command
<cyphermox> chrisccoulson, oh
<klattimer> :/
<klattimer> ok, this isn't a brilliant state of affairs
<chrisccoulson> how did this used to work?
<jcastro> bilalakhtar: oh sorry, it was on the mailing list: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2010-August/031084.html
<bilalakhtar> Thanks jcastro !
<klattimer> chrisccoulson: the code is pretty specific
<bilalakhtar> jcastro: as I mentioned, the biggest mistake in my life was not joining ubuntu-devel but joining ubuntu-devel-*. the aftermath of not joining resulted in me missing 2 deadlines, one for this and the other for the UDs sponsorship
<didrocks> session restart, brb
<bilalakhtar> *UDS
<klattimer> chrisccoulson: http://paste.ubuntu.com/497680/
<klattimer> and later to set the state it writes directly to the device
<chrisccoulson> klattimer, so, this hasn't really changed between 2.30 and 2.31.x
<chrisccoulson> so, we must have previously set ACL's on /dev/rfkill
<klattimer> must have
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, /lib/udev/rules.d/61-gnome-bluetooth-rfkill.rules
<chrisccoulson> ok, i think the udev rule for gnome-bluetooth is not doing the right thing anymore, but i need pitti's help here :)
<chrisccoulson> everything else is doing TAG+="udev-acl", but gnome-bluetooth is doing ENV{ACL_MANAGE}="1"
<chrisccoulson> looks suspicious to me :)
<chrisccoulson> ok, that fixes it
<chrisccoulson> klattimer, i'll upload a fix for that in a minute
<klattimer> chrisccoulson: brilliant
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I think the bluetooth applet might use it as well -- there was at least one thing which talked to it from userspace
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I remember an udev rule which allowed access to regular users
<chrisccoulson> pitti - it's ok, i've got a fix already
<pitti> chrisccoulson: ah, right
<chrisccoulson> the current udev rule is wrong
<chrisccoulson> i'm just going to upload the fix now
<pitti> chrisccoulson: ENV{ACL_MANAGE} is supposed to be an internal implementation detail of udev-acl
<pitti> chrisccoulson: if you use TAG, it'll work
<pitti> chrisccoulson: ok, good
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, i just changed it to use TAG, and it works now
<pitti> chrisccoulson: sorry for delay, was out for lunch
<chrisccoulson> that's ok :)
<didrocks> kenvandine: good morning :)
<kenvandine> didrocks, good morning
<didrocks> kenvandine: do you think you'll have some time today for updating the telepathy stack (folks, mission-control, gabble) to the version that upstream advised?
<kenvandine> sure
<kenvandine> i'll make time for that :)
<kenvandine> upstream advised?
<kenvandine> specific version?
<kenvandine> or latest?
<didrocks> kenvandine: specific version, one sec
<didrocks> kenvandine: http://mail.gnome.org/archives/desktop-devel-list/2010-September/msg00037.html
<didrocks> kenvandine: don't look at the bullets, it's the requirement. The advise is in the next paragraph :)
<kenvandine> ok
<didrocks> thanks kenvandine :)
<didrocks> session restart, crossing fingers!
<milanbv> chrisccoulson: you found a place where libappindicator is watching the 'changed' signal?
<milanbv> I didn't notice this
<chrisccoulson> milanbv - yeah, it's doing that
<milanbv> of course it's wrong, since GIcon is meant to update automatically
<chrisccoulson> yeah, it does seem wrong
<chrisccoulson> i'm not sure if it has anything to do with the crash, but i'll start looking at it again in a bit
<chrisccoulson> i had to get a break and look at something else ;)
<milanbv> could be - if the signal handler is called before the default handler from GtkImage
<chrisccoulson> before my head exploded
<milanbv> the GIcon could be destroyed right after the custom handler uses it
<milanbv> :-)
<milanbv> nasty bug...
<chrisccoulson> yeah, this bug is a bit of a pain
<milanbv> chrisccoulson: I confirm theme_changed_cb() should not exist
<milanbv> that may fix the bug, but it's hard to explain exactly why it crashes
<milanbv> since anyway it doesn't crash everytime you change theme...
<milanbv> tedg: if you're looking for a nice bug to work on... :-p
<milanbv> Chris has found out that the gnome-settings-daemon crash could be linked with libappindicator updating the GtkStatusIcon when theme changes, which isn't needed
<tedg> milanbv, No, I'm in holding pattern.  It seems that OMG Ubuntu is down -- my life is in a holding pattern.
<milanbv> :-)
<kenvandine> rodrigo_, i pushed more u1ms fixes to lp:~ken-vandine/ubuntu/maverick/rhythmbox-ubuntuone-music-store/gconf
<tedg> milanbv, It does need to handle theme changes as the icon could change when the theme changes.
<milanbv> tedg: yeah, that's the point
<milanbv> I guess this redundant signal causes weird things
<milanbv> even if I can't tell why it doesn't at least work
<kenvandine> rodrigo_, i proposed a merge https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~ken-vandine/ubuntu/maverick/rhythmbox-ubuntuone-music-store/gconf/+merge/36147
<rodrigo_> kenvandine, looking
<rodrigo_> kenvandine, oh, it's u1ms, sorry :(
<kenvandine> no worries
<kenvandine> that is what aquarius gave you :)
<rodrigo_> kenvandine, that's what aquarius had, yes
<kenvandine> rodrigo_, but this actually works
 * rodrigo_ blames aquarius
<kenvandine> :)
<rodrigo_> ok
<rodrigo_> looking at the source branch now
 * fagan wonders if there is going to be any update to the u1ms in terms of functionality next release
<rodrigo_> kenvandine, ah, it's the same branch :)
<rodrigo_> kenvandine, ok, so approved
<kenvandine> :)
<kenvandine> rodrigo_, only question i have is why it doesn't open the music store and go straight to the song
<kenvandine> aquarius, ^^
<kenvandine> rodrigo_, so don't upload yet... lets find out about that
<rodrigo_> yes
 * aquarius is blamed
 * aquarius is on a phone call, though
<aquarius> it *should* go straight to the song
<aquarius> (sorry about the x- thing)
<kenvandine> aquarius, no worries
<kenvandine> aquarius, it doesn't :)
<aquarius> kenvandine, what does it do? open rhythmbox?
<kenvandine> yes
<kenvandine> but not to the store
<aquarius> if you start rhythmbox as "rhythmbox -D U1" from the terminal, and then click a link, what output do you get?
<kenvandine> aquarius, one sec
<rodrigo_> maybe it got broken with the last rb plugin API changes
<kenvandine> Traceback (most recent call last):
<kenvandine>   File "umusicstore/__init__.py", line 49, in activate
<kenvandine>     shell.props.sourcelist.select(self.source)
<kenvandine> AttributeError: 'U1MusicStorePlugin' object has no attribute 'source'
<kenvandine> i see that when it loads the plugin
<kenvandine> but no output at all when i click on the link
<kenvandine> i think that %s is getting eaten
<kenvandine> looks at the man page, it only takes options
<kenvandine> aquarius, it probably needs to be rhythmbox-client --select-source=%s
 * kenvandine tests
<rodrigo_> kenvandine, hmm, maybe it needs to be "rhythmbox %s" ?
<aquarius> kenvandine, it worked for me first.
<rodrigo_> kenvandine, in the gconf-defaults file?
<aquarius> kenvandine, if you're getting that error above then the problem is that the plugin isn't loading correctly
<aquarius> and so becuse the plugin isn't loaded, it isn't catching the URL.
<rodrigo_> kenvandine, that object has no attribute 'source' thing was fixed some weeks ago, I guess you're running latest packages of everything?
<aquarius> ah, crapsticks
<aquarius> rodrigo_, i thought this source thing was fixed?
<kenvandine> rodrigo_, i am
<rodrigo_> yes, it was
 * rodrigo_ checks
<aquarius> rodrigo_, hasn't been in http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntuone-control-tower/rhythmbox-ubuntuone-music-store/trunk/annotate/head:/umusicstore/__init__.py -- was any fix merged?
<rodrigo_> hmm, I don't get that warning at all, with latest rb and the plugin
<rodrigo_> self.source is supposed to be from rb.Plugin, isn't it?
<aquarius> I have 0.1.5 installed, and 0.1.6 is in the archive, so I may need to upgrade. kenvandine, which version do you have?
<aquarius> I get the same self.source error
<kenvandine> i have 0.1.6
<rodrigo_> 0.1.6 just has the fix from kenvandine from yesterday about the tweet button not showing up
<aquarius> rodrigo_, uh? so you run rhythmbox -D U1 and don't get that error?
<rodrigo_> let me try with -D U1
<rodrigo_> I don't get that error, but the store is not selected
<aquarius> the store won't be selected because you have the "it's run before" key
<aquarius> that's why you're not getting the error :)
<aquarius> delete the gconf key /apps/rhythmbox/plugins/umusicstore/first_time_flag
<aquarius> and I think the line that refers to self.source should actually refer to self.music_store_widget.source
<rodrigo_> I have rhythmbox                                 0.13.1-0ubuntu4
<aquarius> and I didn't catch this bug because I already had the flag so that bit of code didn't get run :(
<rodrigo_> is that what you both have?
<aquarius> rodrigo_, yes
<aquarius> rodrigo_, if you delete the key, I think you'll see the error
<rodrigo_> hmm, let me try
<rodrigo_> right
<rodrigo_> I'll propose a branch
<aquarius> test it first ;-)
<rodrigo_> yeah :)
<rodrigo_> yeah, that line needs to be self.music_store_widget.source
<rodrigo_> seems to work
<rodrigo_> let me try now with -D U1
<rodrigo_> hmm, that doesn't seem to work
<aquarius> does it throw an error?
<aquarius> or does it just try to select the source but fail?
<aquarius> (you may need to delete the key again)
<rodrigo_> no error/warning on the terminal, no
<rodrigo_> when I delete the key and activate it, it goes correctly to the music store
<rodrigo_> but then quit, and run -D U1, and it just goes to the main library
<rodrigo_> ah, but we have that in __init__.py#activate:
<rodrigo_> # Select the source if it's the first time
<rodrigo_>         conf_client = gconf.client_get_default ()
<rodrigo_>         if not conf_client.get_bool(U1_FIRST_TIME_FLAG_ENTRY):
<rodrigo_>             shell.props.sourcelist.select(self.music_store_widget.source)
<rodrigo_>             conf_client.set_bool(U1_FIRST_TIME_FLAG_ENTRY, True)
<rodrigo_> so it only does it when the key is False or doesn't exist, right?
<rodrigo_> so, that is, -D U1 calls the activate in __init.py, right?
<rodrigo_> right, if I unset the key, -D U1 works ok
<rodrigo_> aquarius, so, why do we only do that on first run, do you remember?
<aquarius> because it draws attention to the music store the first time you start rhythmbox, but doesn't ram it down your throat every time
<rodrigo_> so if we don't check for the key there, it activates it always, right?
 * rodrigo_ checks
<rodrigo_> yeah, but this makes -D U1 not work
<rodrigo_> and there is no way for the plugin to check the command line
<rodrigo_> and I guess rb u1ms://... calls activate in _init_.py, right?
<rodrigo_> aquarius, ^
<rodrigo_> aquarius, in fact, how does the url get registered in rb? how does rb know which source to show? U1MSLinks doesn't seem to do anything related to that
 * aquarius looks for the code
<rodrigo_> __init__.py only has code to activate / deactivate it
<aquarius> it's in musicstorewidget
<aquarius> do_impl_want_uri and do_impl_add_uri
<rodrigo_> ah
<aquarius> u1mslinks is the thing that *provides* u1mslinks, not the thing that handles them
<aquarius> the musicstorewidget handles them, because it knows how to open the store
<rodrigo_> right
<rodrigo_> so, I guess we miss a call to .activate there, in do_impl_add_uri
<aquarius> the plugin doesn't need to check the command line: when RB gets started with a url, it says to all the plugins "hey, I have a u1ms:// URL, do you want it?"
<aquarius> rodrigo_, so the problem is that the store isn't appearing on first load?
<rodrigo_> aquarius, on first load, with the fix I just did, yes
<rodrigo_> but then -D U1 doesn't work
<aquarius> or is the store not appearing in the RB user interface *at all* if it's started from a u1ms link?
<rodrigo_> kenvandine, ^^
 * rodrigo_ tests
<aquarius> not sure what you mean about -D U1 not working?
<kenvandine> it is for me
<kenvandine> i have the store
<kenvandine> but the store doesn't get displayed
<kenvandine> i have to select it
<rodrigo_> aquarius, rhythmbox -D U1
<rodrigo_> aquarius, because of the first_time_flag we have
<aquarius> rodrigo_, why does having the first_time_flag stop -D U1 working? confused!
<rodrigo_> aquarius, because of the code I pasted above
<rodrigo_> we only call shell.props.sourcelist.select(self.music_store_widget.source) if the first_time_flag is not set
<rodrigo_> or is False
<aquarius> yep
<aquarius> so delete the key and then run rhythmbox, no?
<aquarius> I'd stick a "print self.music_store_widget.source" just above the line where we select it, I think, to see if that code's actually being run and whether the source is correctly set
<aquarius> I feel like I am missing your point :)
<rodrigo_> aquarius, it works if I delete the key, but then after that, running rb -D U1 doesn't select the music store
<aquarius> when you say "it works if I delete the key", does that mean "it correctly selects the music store the first time I run Rhythmbox after deleting the key"?
<rodrigo_> aquarius, yes
<aquarius> that's what's supposed to happen!
<aquarius> hooray, you have fixed the bug.
<aquarius> You don't seem as happy about this as I would imagine you would be :)
<rodrigo_> aquarius, yes, was looking at the other thing from kenvandine
<rodrigo_> do_impl_add_uri is never called for me
<aquarius> oh.
<aquarius> er.
<aquarius> don't know why that doesn't happen
<rodrigo_> aquarius, is the return 100 in do_impl_want_uri what rb expects for knowing our plugin supports that?
<aquarius> yes
<aquarius> you return a score, 0-100, saying how much you want this URL
<aquarius> so you could say 80, and then if someone else says 100 then they win
<desrt> tedg: yes/no :)
<rodrigo_> aquarius, do_impl_want_uri is never called neither
 * aquarius grumbles
<tedg> desrt, Actually have a TODO to write you a mail, looks like no :(
<aquarius> it used to be, I promise
<aquarius> rodrigo_, are you sure it's running the version of the plugni that you're editing?
<rodrigo_> aquarius, yes
<aquarius> then...don't know.
<desrt> tedg: that's a shame :(
<rodrigo_> aquarius, there were some API changes in one of the rb updates, so this might have broke then
<desrt> cody is still in, i guess?
<aquarius> rodrigo_, how are you starting rhyhtmbox?
<rodrigo_> aquarius, rhythmbox u1ms://stores.7digital.com/corporate_1/artists/govt-mule/the-deepest-end-live-in-concert-1/
<aquarius> how do you know whether do_impl_want_uri is being called or not?
<rodrigo_> aquarius, added print's
<aquarius> yeah, but if you don't have -D U1 you won't see the prints
<rodrigo_> hmm
<rodrigo_> aquarius, with -D U1, same thing
<aquarius> now, impl_want_uri is weird
<aquarius> I remember those functions being weird when I was writing this
<aquarius> instead of having it print something, try something a bit more permanent like writing to a temp file
<rodrigo_> aquarius, kenvandine: for he time being, I've proposed this branch -> https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~rodrigo-moya/rhythmbox-ubuntuone-music-store/fix-first-time-activation/+merge/36157
<rodrigo_> aquarius, ok
<aquarius> rodrigo_, branch approved
<kenvandine> rodrigo_, that does fix the url problem though right?
<rodrigo_> kenvandine, it doesn't, looking at that now, it doesn't work for me neither
<aquarius> kenvandine, no. that just fixes the source error we were getting.
<aquarius> now, if a link doesn't take you to the right page in the store, it's actually a problem with the plugin
<kenvandine> ok
<aquarius> which I will help debug just as soon as I've finished helping with desktopcouch ;)
<tedg> desrt, I agree.
<rodrigo_> aquarius, I'll keep debugging on my side
<desrt> well
<rodrigo_> hey desrt!
<desrt> hopefully we can spend some time at UDS
<desrt> rodrigo_: hey :)
<rodrigo_> desrt, going to uds then?
<desrt> pfft.  as if i'd miss that party!
<rodrigo_> desrt, heh
<desrt> we're gonna go get drunk with mickey mouse, right?
<rodrigo_> yes, and pluto is coming also
<desrt> NICE
<desrt> the dog drinks me under the table every time
<desrt> ...it could be that i'm remembering things wrong, though
<rodrigo_> :)
<desrt> someone really needs to package an updated modemmanager for ubuntu
<robbiew> hey RAOF...so is nouveau currently busted for us in 10.10?
<didrocks> hey desrt, how are you?
<didrocks> hum, meeting time
 * kenvandine waves
<didrocks> chrisccoulson, tremolux, Riddell, kenvandine, cyphermox: hey
<chrisccoulson> hey!
<didrocks> am I forgetting someone? :)
<tkamppeter> hi
<didrocks> hey tkamppeter ;)
<tremolux> hey!
<didrocks> short list this week :-)
<didrocks> let's keep it short then
<didrocks> (and chrisccoulson, did you bought a car? :p)
<chrisccoulson> ;)
<chrisccoulson> i might have
<didrocks> hehe, but you prefered the meeting to buy one, great! ;)
<didrocks> so, action from previous meeting
<Riddell> hi
<didrocks> I had a call for testing the migration tools with custom launcher on unity
<didrocks> did someone tried it?
<didrocks> try*
 * didrocks ears desperatly only the wind :)
<kenvandine> hehe
<didrocks> well, I've retried it (forced due to a / FS corruption)
<didrocks> and it worked :)
<didrocks> it seems that I got some bug report with special caracter in the desktop name
<didrocks> so, people may have try it
<chrisccoulson> i've not had a chance to try it, but i can try it if there's still some value in that
<didrocks> there is a pending fix :)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: yeah, it would be great!
<didrocks> instruction are from last week meeting
<didrocks> ok, let's move on so
<didrocks> kenvandine, parteners update?
<kenvandine> sure
<kenvandine> U1 guys are testing a fix for couchdb that CouchOne thinks will fix replication
<kenvandine> bug 422178
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 422178 in couchdb (Ubuntu Maverick) (and 2 other projects) "CouchDB needs to properly enable SSL support (affects: 2) (heat: 18)" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/422178
<kenvandine> a bunch of fixes for u1ms plugin in rb, gwibber integration and url handler stuff
<kenvandine> but not completely fixed yet, it isn't opening rb to the store page as it should
<kenvandine> ubuntuone-client  - bug 640392
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 640392 in ubuntuone-client (Ubuntu) (and 1 other project) "syncdaemon_metadata_get_is_synced always returns FALSE for post-generations folders (affects: 1) (heat: 10)" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/640392
<kenvandine> Fixed to show proper emblems on folders in nautilus (rather than showing "updating" emblem across synced folders) -
<kenvandine> and bug 617656  Causes nautilus to hang when u1 is asking for a lot of folders. Still trying to track down the root cause after many hours of debugging and troubleshooting.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 617656 in ubuntuone-client (Ubuntu Maverick) (and 2 other projects) "nautilus hangs while asking for folders (affects: 3) (heat: 18)" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/617656
<kenvandine> will go in this week
<didrocks> before thursday then?
<kenvandine> by tomorrow, if they aren't in already, i think i saw a changelog for that
<didrocks> great :)
<kenvandine> that's it for U1
<didrocks> so, desktopcouch should now replicate everything? We shouldn't have any known issue during it?
<aquarius> didrocks, not yet.
<kenvandine> aquarius, there are other bugs?
<didrocks> ok, that's a separate issue?
<kenvandine> i thought this fixed it for maverick...
<aquarius> didrocks, we're working with the couchio and erlang teams right now for an SSL fix.
 * aquarius does the long-suffering look.
<kenvandine> sigh...
 * didrocks hugs aquarius
<kenvandine> so this only fixes part of it... dang
<kenvandine> poor aquarius
<chrisccoulson> kenvandine, so, nautilus is hanging rather than crashing, right?
<kenvandine> i'll buy you another beer in orlando :)
<aquarius> kenvandine, heh
<kenvandine> chrisccoulson, yes
<didrocks> nice, way better :)
<chrisccoulson> kenvandine, well, bug 635614 might be a good place to start
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 635614 in ubuntuone-client (Ubuntu) "Should use async dbus calls when talking to syncdaemon, and stop blocking nautilus UI (affects: 1) (heat: 426)" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/635614
<aquarius> kenvandine, do you know how far rodrigo got with investigating why the music store isn't opening to the correct page with a link? I'm available to help now but he's gone :(
<kenvandine> ok, i'll make sure they are looking at that
<chrisccoulson> doing long synchronous dbus calls from the main thread is baaaaaadddd....
<kenvandine> aquarius, nope
<chrisccoulson> those calls hang the whole UI
<kenvandine> ugh
<aquarius> kenvandine, ok, I'll chase him later
<kenvandine> ok, i'll point them at it
<didrocks> kenvandine: can you show them this bug and suggest moving to that?
<kenvandine> yes
<kenvandine> anything else on U1?
<didrocks> thanks :)
<didrocks> not for me, you can go on
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> DX
<kenvandine> for DX, the biggest thing is ABI change in libindicator
<kenvandine> bug 637692 (shotwell import dialog won't close)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 637692 in unity (and 5 other projects) "Action for top-level dropdown menu item not activated (affects: 3) (heat: 155)" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/637692
<didrocks> (API change in fact)
<kenvandine> didrocks, oh it is?
<kenvandine> ugh!
<kenvandine> grrrr
<didrocks> kenvandine: yeah, we discussed again this morning
<kenvandine> missed that...
<didrocks> kenvandine: but it's the ABI issue which is annoying
<didrocks> (well, my morning :))
<kenvandine> hehe
<kenvandine> ok
<didrocks> it's basically changing a structure and adding an optional call
<kenvandine> so this will require a bunch of rebuilds
<kenvandine> anything more than rebuilds?
<didrocks> just on indicator-appmenu, adding the call
<didrocks> but rebuild for others
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> whew
<didrocks> so, that's the scary part
<kenvandine> i am testing those builds now
<kenvandine> well trying too... had to free some space on this SSD :)
<didrocks> great, I'll coordinate with the release team for getting that approved
<kenvandine> also got one more thing for design
<kenvandine> hit me after i updated the wiki
<kenvandine> they are requesting a couple UIF exceptions
<kenvandine> for usability reasons
<kenvandine> very minor... and shouldn't affect screenshots or anything
<didrocks> on what component?
<kenvandine> light-themes and compiz
<didrocks> shouldn't affect screenshots?
<kenvandine> compiz is tweaking shadows in the default settings
<kenvandine> moving them down 4 pixels
<kenvandine> not noticable
<didrocks> yeah
<didrocks> and the other one? on light-theme N
<didrocks> ?
<kenvandine> one more change for compiz
<kenvandine> the inactive window decorations are no longer transparent
<kenvandine> for the theme
<didrocks> hum, this is some kind of visible :/
<didrocks> design should learn the freezeâ¦
<didrocks> something to work on at UDS
<Riddell> speaking of which, any word on the font?
<kenvandine> yeah...
<chrisccoulson> i was just thinking the same ;)
<kenvandine> didrocks, let me grab the link for the theme email , easier
<didrocks> kenvandine: can you follow that and ask them to do the UI freeze paperwork?
<kenvandine> Riddell, nothing confirmed yet
<kenvandine> didrocks, already doing that now... :)
<didrocks> kenvandine: great, thanks :) (and yeah, if I can have the email, that will be good, thanks)
<kenvandine> last week they said they wouldn't push for the exception, but changed their mind... seems they are worried from a usability stand point
<didrocks> ok
<didrocks> any other question for kenvandine?
<kenvandine> i'll update the wiki with the details
<didrocks> ok, moving on
<didrocks> thanks kenvandine
<didrocks> Riddell: kubuntu update? (not sure as you were on vacation IIRC last week)
<Riddell> I was but since I'm never far away from Kubuntu I can do an update anyway
<Riddell>  * Qt 4.7.0 just got released, we'll probably upload it although it's just a version number bump compared to what we currently have
<Riddell>  * shiny new KPackagekit with applications view in the archive
<Riddell>  * component mismatches is tidied up for Kubuntu bits
<Riddell>  * possible samba sharing patches to be added yet, since this is broken anyway it can't get much worse
<Riddell>  * 18 tagged beasties http://tinyurl.com/33p7vu3 mostly I expect them to be fixable or ignorable so I'm generally happy with where we are
<Riddell> oh and thanks to persia for fixing koffice on ARM
<didrocks> welcome back Riddell, btw :)
<didrocks> great!
<didrocks> so even "High" priority bugs aren't so high? the list is reasonable?
<Riddell> they're high but I'm comfortable we have time to fix them
<Riddell> I'll start panicing in about a week's time :)
<didrocks> heh, right, let's postpone panic :)
<didrocks> any question for Riddell?
<Neko> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/55758568/screenshot.png
<Neko> anyone know where the size of the Applications button up top is defined?
<didrocks> Neko: we are in a meeting now
<didrocks> ok, seems not, let's move on next topic
<Neko> I'm patient :D
<didrocks> thanks Riddell
<didrocks> so, here is the most important piece of ubuntu: UNE :-)
<didrocks> (sorry, kidding, that was my only chance to do that joke!)
<tremolux> haha
<didrocks> Lot of bugs fixed (more than 40!) in one week. A lot of goodness thanks to the crazy unity team. Still a lot of fixes in the pipeline. Hurring for a wednesday's evening upload for final fixes.
<didrocks> the dx team is really rocking
<didrocks> unity is in a way better state regarding crashes
<didrocks> and a lot of goodness will come soon
<didrocks> kudos to them :)
<didrocks> We also got an issue this week due to a mesa upload breaking all clutter-based app (and so unity).
<devildante> yeah, from what I've heard, unity is exciting :)
<didrocks> fortunately, the fix made his way fast enough
<didrocks> that's it for unity, any question?
<devildante> btw, hi all :)
<tremolux> hey devildante!
<didrocks> hey devildante ;)
<devildante> hi :)
<didrocks> ok, next topic, tremolux, USC update?
<tremolux> hi didrocks, yep
<tremolux> Buy Something: new $1 test package uploaded, continued testing, target to open up for general testing this week
<tremolux> New Apps: extras.ubuntu.com key added to default sources.list and to keyring, all pieces now in place for new-apps
<tremolux> Misc:  of course, lots of testing, targeted bugfixing
<devildante> great!
<tremolux> so, things a moving along  :)
<didrocks> about extras.ubuntu.com
<tremolux> yes?
<didrocks> I got an issue with it yesterday
<didrocks> I tried to apt-get source <whatever<
<tremolux> keyring issue?
<didrocks> as the repo wasn't there, it didn't want to source it
<didrocks> well, I have to get a deeper look, but not sure it was only a keyring issue
<didrocks> (fresh forced install from Sunday)
<tremolux> ok, you may not yet have the package that sets it up yet
<tremolux> not sure
<tremolux> maybe we can talk after
<didrocks> ok, something to try then :)
<didrocks> sure
<didrocks> (yes, no key from what I see)
<tremolux> so you don't have the extras.ubuntu.com repo at all?
<tremolux> or, you have it but not the key>?
<didrocks> do you need testing on the buy something?
<didrocks> let's talk about extras after the meeting
<tremolux> sure!  would appreciate that
<tremolux> but, it will cost you $1 to test  ;)
<didrocks> for rick's wallpaper, I can live with that :)
<tremolux> maybe give it a few hours as I *think* we are working out issues still with the new $1 package
<didrocks> ok ;)
<tremolux> thanks didrocks
<didrocks> nice to see it finally coming! awesome work ;)
<didrocks> any question on USC?
<tremolux> thanks (on behalf of the team)!  :)
 * devildante wonders when it will be part of the USC team
<didrocks> ok, moving on, thanks tremolux
<devildante> not that it is a demand :p
<didrocks> devildante: discuss that with them after the meeting :)
<didrocks> so, no pedro this week
<devildante> okay :)
<didrocks> which means, no new bugs \o/
<tremolux> devildante: heh, well, you are part of the team for sure, on LP is just a formality
<didrocks> more seriously, I'm tracking bugs assigned to our team
<didrocks> I assigned some already, nothing to be concerned about
<devildante> tremolux, thanks :)
<didrocks> so, no wasting time on that now
<didrocks> ok, so release status: http://people.canonical.com/~pitti/workitems/maverick/canonical-desktop-team-ubuntu-10.10.html
<didrocks> wellâ¦ no activity which is normal as we should really focus on bugs
<devildante> I still don't understand these graphs :p
<didrocks> please please, update your WI, postpone them, close them
<didrocks> seems to be the case, apart from RAOF (I will speak to him)
<didrocks> and pitti!
<pitti> oops :)
<fagan> win 7
<fagan> whoops sorry
 * pitti defers his
<didrocks> pitti: no worry, we are still under the trendline :)
<didrocks> ok, that's it for that part, any question?
<didrocks> hum, there is no mozilla update in the template, chrisccoulson, something to share?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks - i've not filled in my bit yet
<chrisccoulson> but maverick is looking pretty good for mozilla
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: yeah, I'm switching back to using firefox nowdays :)
<didrocks> seems like you triaged a lot of bugs
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, you're the second person who's said that to me ;)
<devildante> a silly question, is firefox 4.0 in 10.10?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: good work!
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i spent some time looking at a bug report on friday, which looked like it might be a regression in lucid
<didrocks> devildante: will be updated when out as the new mozilla update policy
<devildante> didrocks, great, thanks :)
<chrisccoulson> and i spent nearly my entire day to then discover it wasn't, and the reporter flamed me when i closed the report :(
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: urgh, that happensâ¦ :/
<didrocks> any other question on firefox?
<chrisccoulson> i've spent some time this week preparing things for natty
<chrisccoulson> one of those is to get the mozilla test-suite running on our builds in firerox 4.0
<chrisccoulson> which i've done now :)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: nice!
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: is there a ppa? :)
<chrisccoulson> didrocks - yeah, there's the ubuntu-mozilla-daily PPA atm
<chrisccoulson> but there will be another one soon for the FF4.0 beta's, which won't be daily builds
<didrocks> ok, natty will be cool, but maverick is our first top priority! Fixing bugs and update/install test should be our current focus :)
<devildante> yes!
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i'm doing that too ;)
<didrocks> so, back on bug fixing/updating/crazy ABI migration handling! Let's keep maverick rocking and good work everyone! :)
<vish> mvo / tremolux: someone just pointed out > http://fonts.debian.net/  !! ;)
<vish> where did this guy go!!!!!  > http://twitter.com/mpt/statuses/6691562107
<didrocks> thanks all :)
<pitti> thanks didrocks
<vish> oops.. meeting! :s
<didrocks> vish: just finished, it's ok!
<devildante> vish, I missed the discussion, what's that for?
<tremolux> thanks everybody
<vish> didrocks: phew! :)
<fagan> vish: thats awesome
 * kenvandine back to rebuilding
<vish> devildante: its for the font screenshots..
<devildante> ah
<devildante> great :)
<vish> several of the fonts have no screenshots..
<tremolux> vish: wow!
<vish> we should probably try to link to that.. :)
<fagan> and we should have one for the ubuntu font
<fagan> but later
<fagan> :)
<fagan> vish: the best thing is that we can build from that
<vish> yup
<fagan> there is loads done
<tremolux> vish: that is seriously cool
<vish>  yea! seriously!
<chrisccoulson> didrocks - https://edge.launchpad.net/~mozillateam/+archive/firefox-next
<chrisccoulson> courtesy of micahg :)
<chrisccoulson> for people who aren't brave enough for daily builds ;)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: thanks, I'll take a look :)
<chrisccoulson> although, a fair bit has changed already between b6 and the current dailies
<chrisccoulson> (ie, the statusbar has gone now)
<didrocks> oh right, I read that
<chrisccoulson> also, there's still a fair bit of discussion about what to do with the linux UI
<chrisccoulson> eg, https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=585370
<ubot2> Mozilla bug 585370 in General "Implement the Firefox button on Linux" [Normal,Assigned]
<didrocks> hum, seeing that
<didrocks> wellâ¦ let's track that and see. given the ressource, we don't have a lot of options :)
<Neko> meeting over yet?
<and471> Neko, yup
<Neko> okay
<Neko> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/55758568/screenshot.png
<Neko> anyone know where the size of the Applications button up top is defined?
<Neko> the button is called "Xfce Menu" but the .desktop that defines that is not seemingly used as the translation for it is Xfce Menu.. not Applications. I can't tell where that string comes from therefore I worry about where this menu and it's size and position are actually defined
<Neko> if I knew that I could just fix it :]
<Neko> so any ideas?
<Neko> I'm also curious what settings defines the default backdrop etc. for the desktop, and the gdm backdrop.. older gdms I'd edit the theme but now it's seemingly some magical gconf somewhere..
<didrocks> Neko: I think you'll find xfce guys on #ubuntu rather
<Neko> .... it does the same for GNOME FYI
<Neko> there is some special magic being done to this button somewhere :]
<didrocks> Neko: not the same applet and panel
<Neko> so where would it be for gnome just as an FYI
<didrocks> Neko: for gdm, you should log in as the gdm user
<didrocks> Neko: well, I think I know GNOME a little and no, it's not the same technology
<didrocks> FYI
<Neko> to change the backdrop for gdm?
<didrocks> background, not sure what a backdrop is
<Neko> same thing
<Neko> you use painting terms I use theater terms :D
<Neko> I need to log in as gdm? I just want to know where it keeps the string that says "this is the png I load behind the greeter window"
<didrocks> Neko: the gconf key is /desktop/gnome/background/picture_filename as the gdm user
<Neko> so it's kept in /var/lib/gdm/.gconf/desktop/und/so/weiter then by that reckoning?
<didrocks> Neko: exactly
<Neko> okay consider that this does not exist here where is the default kept
<didrocks> Neko: it's the default system one then, generated by update-gconf-defaults from /usr/share/gconf/defaults/16_ubuntu-wallpapers
<Neko> here that's "/usr/share/backgrounds/warty-final-ubuntu.png"
<Neko> I have my doubts this has been valid for about 4 years
<didrocks> right
<didrocks> because when you upgrade,  you still want people having their wallpapers
<didrocks> so, we keep the same filename
<didrocks> ok, dinner time there!
<Neko> so warty-final-ubuntu.png is provided by some update-alternatives stuff then?
<dobey> hrmm. wonder when i can upload to narwhal
<bcurtiswx_> dobey, gotta wait until after 10.10.10 at least
<mvo> vish: cool, fonts.debian.net - we should use this to generate font screenshots inside software-center
<vish> mvo: yup! i'v added it to the unresolved issues too.. probably for the fonts category, we can make SC grab screenshots from there..
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-09-22
<pitti> Good morning
<didrocks> Guten Morgen pitti
<didrocks> -hum, I didn't say hi there? weird, should be tired today ;))
<kenvandine> pitti, good morning
<kenvandine> pitti, can you push a couple packages through unapproved for me?  compiz and light-themes, both UIF exceptions that robbiew approved
<didrocks> kenvandine: the queue will be reviewed, I'll have a look at it
<kenvandine> pitti, and if you could also do telepathy-butterfly and telepathy-mission-control-5
<kenvandine> didrocks, thx
<kenvandine> i am going to bed :)
<pitti> kenvandine: oh, another compiz?
<pitti> kenvandine: I'll have a look, yes
<kenvandine> pitti, yeah... a few design tweaks
<kenvandine> robbiew approved the exception
<kenvandine> just some defaults
<kenvandine> and the theme update too
<kenvandine> the telepathy ones are just getting us to the versions upstream recommends
<didrocks> kenvandine: enjoy your evening :)
<didrocks> kenvandine: you didn't beat me, that's a fail :p
<kenvandine> hehe... i will enjoy the pillow
<kenvandine> hehe
 * didrocks hugs kenvandine
<kenvandine> didrocks, i see it the other way... i win!
<didrocks> yeah, for you health, i guess :-)
<didrocks> your*
<kenvandine> :)
<kenvandine> good night everyone!
<didrocks> good night kenvandine!
<didrocks> pitti: can I grab you for a minute about a libindicator change?
<pitti> didrocks: what's up?
<didrocks> pitti: so, we have this bug for quite a long time (bug #637692)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 637692 in unity (and 6 other projects) "Action for top-level dropdown menu item not activated (affects: 3) (heat: 16)" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/637692
<didrocks> which prevent some applications to use the accelerators in appmenu
<didrocks> and so menu item not activated
<didrocks> ted fixed it yesterday, but this require an ABI break
<didrocks> (not enough free slots in a structure, has to be changed)
<didrocks> so, we have 8 source package depending on that one
<didrocks> and bumping libindicator0 -> libindicator1
<didrocks> dbarth explains it in comment #4
<didrocks> I can handle the transition today if the release team ack it
<pitti> didrocks: adding a new field at the end of a struct is an abi break?
<pitti> oh, do library clients have to fill it out, and the library expects it to be correct? then yes
<didrocks> pitti: I guess so, isn't it? as the structure doesn't have the same size?
<didrocks> right
<didrocks> so, do I need to do some paperwork in addition to the comments on the bug? (we wrote that yesterday with dbarth)
<didrocks> I think it's better to speak with you first :)
<pitti> didrocks: this doesn't sound too bad, so please go ahead
<didrocks> also, another note, the issue is that people will only see one part of the indicators during the transition
 * didrocks pastebin the summary he made yesterday
<didrocks> some discussion with tedg because he wanted a conflicts
<didrocks> (on the new bin package)
<pitti> but updated
<pitti> didrocks: hang on, new binary package?
<pitti> I thought we just need a new library soname?
<didrocks> pitti: libindicator1 instead of libindicator0
<pitti> ah
<didrocks> yeah
<pitti> didrocks: why would you want a conflicts?
<pitti> libindicator0 will be NBS, and all rdepends transitioned
<didrocks> one second, pastebin one click away :)
<pitti> libindicator1 can't conflicts: libindicator0
<didrocks> http://paste.ubuntu.com/498267/
<didrocks> that's why I told to ted
<didrocks> I just summarize it there ^
<didrocks> ted is annoyed because some indicators won't show during the transition
<didrocks> the indicator protocol isn't versionned
<didrocks> so, if the render uses the new library (with the soname bump), only those indicators will be shown
<pitti> without understanding the details of his rationale, but Breaks/Conflicts of different library ABIs is a no, no, no, no
<didrocks> ok, you agree then :)
<pitti> what you _can_ do is to add breaks to the rebuilt packages against libindicate0
 * didrocks feels better now that pitti tells it :)
<pitti> but of course that wouldn't help you for the partial upgrade case
<didrocks> right, that's why I explained yesterday
<pitti> but *shrug*, if you do partial upgrades and don't upgrade one indicator, you'll break that indicator and get to keep both parts, yes
<didrocks> I agree, and at least, they won't be uninstalled but people in a partial upgrade :)
<didrocks> pitti: ok, so thanks, I'm handling the transition today
<pitti> kenvandine: I followed up to the bugs, still some open questions
<pitti> didrocks: ok, let me know when you need unapproved/NEW poking
<pitti> didrocks: would be nice if you could add versioned b-deps to the rebuilds, so that we can accept them all at once and have the depwaits sort it out
<didrocks> pitti: thanks, I will (just rebuilding everything first)
<didrocks> pitti: will do :)
<didrocks> pitti: we have in addition 4 packages: xfce4-indicator-plugin, lxpanel, cairo-dock-plug-ins, ubiquity. So the total number is 12
<didrocks> lxpanel is FTBFS, I've already mentionned it to lubuntu guys and they will fix that later today, so I won't upload it
<pitti> okay
<pitti> dobey: do you still remember ./DistUtilsExtra/command/check.py? would you mind to change the license to GPL-2 or later, so that it matches the rest of the code?
<pitti> dobey: if you agree, can you please say so by mailing 597548@bugs.debian.org?
<RAOF> Morning/evening all.
<pitti> hey RAOF, how are you?
<RAOF> Pretty good.
<RAOF> Being able to sleep in until 11 was a good call. :)
<didrocks> hey RAOF!
<RAOF> didrocks: Good... morning?
<pitti> RAOF: hah, wearning off the jetlag?
<RAOF> pitti: Yup.  I got back late yesterday afternoon.
<RAOF> I no longer am so tired I feel physically sick.  Yay!
<didrocks> RAOF: heh, how it is to be to the right side of the world? ;)
<RAOF> Now that I'm back to the future, it's much better :)
<didrocks> RAOF: hehe :)
<RAOF> Were there any other firedrills due to my miscommunication while I was out of contact? :(
<didrocks> RAOF: not a lot, no, there was something IIRC, let me look at my logs
<didrocks> RAOF: false alarm, it will be for natty :)
<didrocks> RAOF: just think to close your WI on http://people.canonical.com/~pitti/workitems/maverick/canonical-desktop-team-ubuntu-10.10.html
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hey pitti, how are you?
<pitti> doing well, thanks! how about you?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i'm good thanks, although a little bit tired
<chrisccoulson> 6am start for 2 mornings in a row ;)
<pitti> uh, how's that?
<pitti> kids?
<didrocks> hey chrisccoulson!
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, i get up with my daughter on tuesday and wednseday mornings, as my gf works a night shift on tuesday night
<chrisccoulson> hey didrocks
<chrisccoulson> ooh, 2 bugs fixed for me already this morning. thanks to whoever approved my uploads :)
<pitti> you're welcome
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: do you still work on the gtk bug? (again, if you think you don't have the time, or don't have any clue, I can point you to other small bugs :)
<chrisccoulson> didrocks - yeah, i'm still spending some time on that
<chrisccoulson> i'm determined not to have to give up on it ;)
<chrisccoulson> but i can look at some other bugs too
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: hehe, good luck then! :)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: if you want to change a little your mind, maybe bug #644447 is small and easy, do you want that I assign it to you?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 644447 in indicator-application (Ubuntu) "When burning a disc with Brasero and with Ambiance theme can't read the text in the indicator applet (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/644447
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, yeah, that ones fine
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: jujst to look if it's because of the indicator or brasero :)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: if it's the indicator, I'll give it to tedg, ok?
<chrisccoulson> sure, no problem
<fta2> grrrr  /usr/include/cairo/cairo.h:1976: error: comma at end of enumerator list
<fta2> fix is trivial, and already upstreamed. any chance we get an update?
<cyphermox> could someone please take a look at bug 625696, I have a branch ready for merge, or alternatively I could make a debdiff for sponsoring :)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 625696 in nautilus (Ubuntu Maverick) (and 4 other projects) "Nautilus crash when IM preedit (affects: 18) (dups: 7) (heat: 109)" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/625696
<chrisccoulson> cyphermox, i can't sponsor nautilus, but didrocks might be able to take a look :)
<didrocks> can do it, but not just know
<cyphermox> didrocks, all good
<cyphermox> didrocks, is a branch fine or do you prefer debdiffs?
<didrocks> cyphermox: can you subscribe me to the merge request?
<didrocks> cyphermox: just do a merge request :)
<didrocks> cyphermox: your source is ~ubuntu-desktop/nautilus/maverick, right?
<cyphermox> sure, I'll do that.. there isn't even a merge rq yet
<cyphermox> yup
<didrocks> oupss
<didrocks> ~ubuntu-desktop/nautilus/ubuntu :)
<cyphermox> oh wait no
<didrocks> it's a debian/ branch only
<cyphermox> d'oh
<cyphermox> well, i'll subscribe you ;)
<kenvandine> i am doing murrine, btw
<fta2> didrocks, anything you can do for cairo? (problem described above)
<didrocks> fta2: not like if I'm already postponing important changes for hours :)
<didrocks> is it making something failing?
<fta2> didrocks, can't build anything that has quite aggressive flags and werror
<fta2> it's a trivial 1 line fix
<fta2> 1 char fix even
<didrocks> fta2: sure, can you send me a patch? I'll handle it when it's quieter there
<fta2> didrocks, debdiff? (it's been fixed ~12d ago upstream: http://cgit.freedesktop.org/cairo/log/)
<didrocks> fta2: what is better for you :)
<chrisccoulson> didrocks - any other bugs? :)
<chrisccoulson> bug 644447 is a theme issue btw
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 644447 in light-themes (Ubuntu) "When burning a disc with Brasero and with Ambiance theme can't read the text in the indicator applet (dup-of: 617192)" [Undecided,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/644447
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 617192 in light-themes (Ubuntu) "[maverick-beta] Disabled menu items unreadable (affects: 20) (dups: 5) (heat: 200)" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/617192
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: can you ping Cimi on #ayatana?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks - yeah, sure
<didrocks> thanks :)
<nessita> pitti: ping
<pitti> didrocks: no new libindicate in maverick yet?
<pitti> hey nessita
<nessita> pitti: hello! I was wondering if could help me with lp-project-upload
<nessita> if you*
<pitti> nessita: sure; doesn't it work for you?
<nessita> pitti: it does, as long as my project doesn't have more than one series... is there any way of using it with more than one serie? like having trunk and stable-1-0
<pitti> sorry, not with the current version
<nessita> oh!
 * nessita cries
<pitti>     if len(proj.series) != 1:
<pitti>         print >> sys.stderr, 'Does not support creating releases if more than one series exists.'
 * nessita cries some more
<pitti> nessita: so, it wouldn't be too hard to add support for that, you were just the first one who asked :)
<didrocks> pitti: all is ready and we are testing and rdepends, but there is still an issue with dbusmenu not building
<nessita> pitti: I *love* lp-project-upload
<didrocks> pitti: ted is looking at it
<nessita> pitti: how much for that feature? /me bargains
<nessita> :-D
<didrocks> nessita: I have my local patched version to add to latest series :)
<pitti> nessita: how about a beer at UDS? :-)
<pitti> didrocks: shhh :)
<didrocks> ;)
<nessita> pitti: cheater! you have that ready already ;-)
<pitti> nessita: I'm in a meeting right now, and then I have a job interview, but I can probably get to it later this evening
<nessita> pitti: ok, thanks. No rush though
<pitti> nessita: no, I haven't..
<nessita> pitti: I'll borrow's didrocks patch if he allows me to
<pitti> nessita: if "latest series" is enough for your immediate need, that sounds fine
<nessita> pitti: I may tweaked it to the oldest series or latests as I see it fit :-)
<nessita> didrocks: can I borrow that patch?
<didrocks> nessita: sure, one second :)
 * nessita only has 2 series, so oldest-latest is enough :-D
<pitti> there goes my beer .. *sod*
<pitti> j/k, /me hugs nessita and didrocks
<nessita> and the hug show starts!
 * didrocks hugs pitti back :)
<didrocks> nessita: http://paste.ubuntu.com/498521/
 * nessita hugs back as well 
 * bcurtiswx_ watches the "show-the-love-ometer" peak
<didrocks> I didn't propose it to pitti as "last serie" isn't best for everyone I guess
<didrocks> (be careful series = proj.series[-1] doesn't work with launchpad objects)
<pitti> didrocks: oh, just -1? does it have a guaranteed ordering?
<nessita> didrocks: it does not??? I was *about* mentioning it. Thanks!
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, I've tested a lot on different project and it seems to be historically ordered
<pitti> nice
<didrocks> pitti: I tried in staging with crazy cases :)
<didrocks> pitti: not sure launchpadlib ensure it will stay like that
<nessita> pitti: can I propose a branch? if so, where to?
<didrocks> nessita: yeah, it doesn'tâ¦ got trapped at the beginning :)
<pitti> nessita: it's in ubuntu-dev-tools
<pitti> nessita: so, http://codebrowse.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-dev/ubuntu-dev-tools/trunk/changes
<nessita> pitti: ack
<pitti> didrocks: I was just wondering because there's an xfce4-indicator-plugin in the queue
<pitti> didrocks: I'll keep it until the new libindicator actually hits
<didrocks> pitti: oh? is it mine?
 * didrocks checks
<pitti> didrocks: the changelog says so
<pitti> didrocks: oh, just -1? does it have a guaranteed ordering?
<pitti> oops
<didrocks> :)
<pitti> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/56248381/xfce4-indicator-plugin_0.0.1-2build1_source.changes
<didrocks> too many things in // ;)
<didrocks> I pushed also cairo-dock
<didrocks> pitti: the build-dep should be fine normally
<nessita> pitti: are there any tests for ubuntu-dev-tools?
<pitti> nessita: not sure, it's been a while since I touched it
<nessita> pitti: ack
<pitti> nessita: but I wouldn't propose a simple "use the last one" for merging, I'd rather add a --series option
<pitti> otherwise it's way too easy to accidentally hit the wrong series
<nessita> pitti: I agree
<bcurtiswx_> didrocks, empathy 2.32.0 will be released monday FYI
<didrocks> bcurtiswx_: I know, the all GNOME 2.32 is due to next Monday :)
<didrocks> thanks ;)
<bcurtiswx_> OK, i now know all gnome 2.32 is due Monday..
 * bcurtiswx_ adds this to the learn something new everyday ;)
<didrocks> :)
 * bcurtiswx_ is also a chat killer apparently :P
<Tm_T> no, you're not capable of killing others by that kind of chat
<didrocks> cyphermox: can I trigger the nautilus crash easily?
<cyphermox> didrocks, yup. right click in the typeahread popup in icon view, then select any "special" input method, it doesn't have to be IBus
<cyphermox> e.g. Cyrillic, Vietnamese, tend to work quite well
<didrocks> cyphermox: oh right
<didrocks> ok, getting your merge now
<devildante> hi guys :)
<bratsche> didrocks, kenvandine: Have you guys by any chance noticed any bugs reported against gtk+ or gnome-panel that might be related to submenus remaining on the screen but not responding to updates?  Then if you drag another window over that area you see parts of the other window left behind?  Screenshot: http://imgur.com/OzDXz
<didrocks> bratsche: urgh, not reallyâ¦ apart when apps are not responding, but otherwise, noâ¦
<kenvandine> bratsche, not that i have noticed
<didrocks> rodrigo_: hey
<rodrigo_> hey didrocks
<didrocks> rodrigo_: is it a known bug that I can show/hide the ubuntu one in right-click->ubuntu oneâ¦ but I see no effect in nautilus?
<rodrigo_> didrocks, yes, there is no way to tell nautilus to stop displaying the ribbon
<bratsche> Hey rodrigo_ how's it going?
<rodrigo_> didrocks, we can easily fix though, listening to the gconf changes and hide/show the ribbon
<rodrigo_> didrocks, it just didn't happen in time, but I can do it
<didrocks> rodrigo_: oh, right, I remember about that API
<rodrigo_> hey bratsche
<didrocks> rodrigo_: well, just do what you think it's better for the user. I think the current behavior is just weird from a user point of view :)
<rodrigo_> didrocks, yes
<rodrigo_> didrocks, if you file a bug, I'll fix it for maverick
<rodrigo_> didrocks, if I file the bug and provide the fix, it doesn't look like a good way to convince the release team :)
<didrocks> rodrigo_: right, will do then, ubuntuone-client, right?
<rodrigo_> didrocks, assign it to me, yes, u1-client
<didrocks> rodrigo_: will do, thanks!
<fta> didrocks, http://people.ubuntu.com/~fta/cairo/
<kenvandine> james_w, ping
<james_w> hi kenvandine
<kenvandine> james_w, you've had a look at python multiprocessing... mind taking a quick look at a patch?
<kenvandine> https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~roignac/gwibber/Bug628686-unblocking-UI/+merge/35893
<kenvandine> that definitely makes startup of the client snappy... but seems like a hack to me
<kenvandine> and i suspect it would prevent those dbus call_blocking errors
<kenvandine> i would love to fix that before i do a release in a few minutes...
<james_w> kenvandine: I don't know, it feels wrong to me
<kenvandine> yeah, that was my thought too...
<kenvandine> so right now, if you start gwibber when gwibber-service isn't running, the client doesn't show until the first set of jobs complete
<kenvandine> and sometimes it times out
<kenvandine> so this bypasses that
<kenvandine> but definately seems like it could cause other problems
<kenvandine> however, this does help knowing where that is happening
<james_w> does it need to call get() at all?
<kenvandine> then we don't get the failures
<james_w> that would be cleaner than what is there
<kenvandine> indeed
<kenvandine> actually that might not be bad.... we don't do anything with the timeout exception yet anyway
<kenvandine> which i am sure is why he did this
<james_w> well it's just ignoring it there
<kenvandine> yeah... we basically ignore it anyway
<james_w> what he has done is just ensure that call takes 0 time
<kenvandine> the idea was someday we might have some retry...
<kenvandine> yeah
<james_w> you can do that in cleaner ways
<james_w> seeing as it's in a thread anyway, can't you not call get() with a timeout, and implement a polling loop with your own timeout?
<kenvandine> yeah... but we might not need to do that anyway
<james_w> seeing as the result of that call isn't used, and you have a callback, I don't think you need to call get()
<kenvandine> i think the idea was we wanted to be able to get the Timeout exception
<kenvandine> but timeouts are generally transient
<kenvandine> and curl operation will timeout if it has to anyway
<kenvandine> james_w, good compromise :)
<kenvandine> james_w, thx
<james_w> np
<nessita> question: what's the recommended way of sending a signal to a process when installing a package upgrade?
<devildante> nessita, you mean via dbus?
<nessita> devildante: nopes, in a preinst script for example. I'd use killall, but lintian will not approve :-)
<nessita> killall -signame
<devildante> hmm, don't know... not enough experienced, I guess :p
<nessita> devildante: thanks anyways. I think I'll trying with pkill
<chrisccoulson> nessita, usually something like "kill -s HUP", but the process needs a handler for that signal
<chrisccoulson> i'm sure someone asked the same question a few days ago for U1 ;)
<nessita> chrisccoulson: but you need the pid for the process in order to use kill. I was hoping to use the name of the process
<nessita> chrisccoulson: I think I got it, I was using pkill without the -f option, that's why my process wasn't killed
<chrisccoulson> nessita, "kill -s HUP `pidof <name>`"
<nessita> that's awful! :-)
<nessita> chrisccoulson: and the pidof doesn't work for process like "/usr/bin/python /usr/lib/ubuntu-sso-client/ubuntu-sso-login"
<nessita> chrisccoulson: pkill -f -HUP works :-)
<chrisccoulson> :-)
<nessita> thanks!
<nessita> ok, sponsor hunter time! is anyone available to sponsor/upload https://code.launchpad.net/~nataliabidart/ubuntu/maverick/ubuntu-sso-client/ubuntu-sso-client-1.0.2/+merge/36352 ?
<chrisccoulson> i don't think i can sponsor that :(
<chrisccoulson> i'm not special enough ;)
<robbiew> didrocks: around?
<didrocks> robbiew: yeah
<nessita> chrisccoulson: thanks anyways
<robbiew> didrocks: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/utouch-grail/+bug/644385 needs some assistance in sponsorship....oubiwann and MT would thank you greatly ;)
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 644385 in utouch-grail (Ubuntu) "[FFe] Update version of utouch-grail to 1.0.14 (affects: 1) (heat: 8)" [High,Confirmed]
<robbiew> didrocks: it's been ack'd by pitti already
<didrocks> robbiew: if I can sponsor without testing I can do it now. if it needs testing, I'm still on the libindicator transition and unity new release, so I can queue it :)
<robbiew> oubiwann: ^^^?
<nessita> hey kenvandine, would you be available to sponsor a new ubuntu-sso-client release? merge proposal located at https://code.launchpad.net/~nataliabidart/ubuntu/maverick/ubuntu-sso-client/ubuntu-sso-client-1.0.2/+merge/36352
<oubiwann> robbiew: thanks... didrocks: gimme a sec, and I'll let you know how thoroughly it's been tested
<didrocks> oubiwann: sure :)
<kenvandine> nessita, /me looks
<ari-tczew> nessita: I suggest ask on #ubuntu-motu for sponsorship.
<rydberg> just joined, oubiwann
<oubiwann> rydberg: cool
<nessita> ari-tczew: really? I was told this was the proper place to do it...
<didrocks> ari-tczew: not for things in mainâ¦
<kenvandine> nessita, i am on it :)
<nessita> kenvandine: thanks!
<ari-tczew> didrocks: I heard that also for main.
<rydberg> didrocks, oubiwann: the grail changes have been tested in desktop and unity settings since sunday, on five or six different machines, build tested, runtime tested, corner-case tested.
<ari-tczew> it's a new
<nessita> ari-tczew: where did you hear that? /me wants to hear as well
<didrocks> ari-tczew: can be, but we are used to work that way with people we know and we keep doing that
<didrocks> rydberg: great, just signing then :)
<fta> didrocks, the fix for cairo i talked about earlier: http://people.ubuntu.com/~fta/cairo/
<didrocks> oubiwann: ^^
<didrocks> fta: yeah, queuing it too :)
<kenvandine> nessita, looks quick, i have another call in 10m... crazy day :/
 * didrocks will soon be at 30 uploads today
<oubiwann> didrocks: thanks!
<kenvandine> didrocks, wow
<rydberg> didrocks, thanks man :-)
<kenvandine> damn libindicator change!
<kenvandine> didrocks, i rebuilt all of those 4 times yesterday :)
<didrocks> kenvandine: I hate hate hate now! :-)
<ari-tczew> nessita: from developers on #ubuntu-motu
<kenvandine> i plan to sleep tonight :)
<didrocks> kenvandine: seems to start badly for me :)
<didrocks> 14h-16h maybe I'll reach 18h today :)
<didrocks> oubiwann: rydberg: uploaded
<kenvandine> nessita, did you publish the tarball?
<oubiwann> didrocks: phenomenal, thanks!
<rydberg> *bows* much obliged
<didrocks> oubiwann: rydberg: yw, for just a gpg signature, it's not a lot compared to building and testing :)
<rydberg> but its important :-)
<nessita> kenvandine: I did, in the stable-1-0 release, which is the one binded to maverick
<nessita> kenvandine: shall I change the watch file in a way that uscan detect that tarball? I was wondering about that...
<nessita> kenvandine: tarball was uploaded to http://launchpad.net/ubuntu-sso-client/stable-1-0/1.0.2/+download/ubuntu-sso-client-1.0.2.tar.gz
<nessita> pitti: https://code.launchpad.net/~nataliabidart/ubuntu-dev-tools/multiple-series-for-project-upload/+merge/36354
<didrocks> kenvandine: did you update telepathy-gabble, btw?
<kenvandine> didrocks, no... i couldn't
<slomo> fta: cairo fixes? which?
<kenvandine> it requires telepathy-glib update
<didrocks> kenvandine: ok, it was the gir issue :)
<kenvandine> yes
<slomo> fta: the trailing comma one? that should only be a problem if someone is misinformed enough to compile stuff with -pedantic :)
<fta> slomo, hit me already a few times since it landed. and it doesn't hurt to have the fix. it's also fixed upstream
<didrocks> kenvandine: thanks for the info, I can close one tab :)
<kenvandine> hehe
<fta> slomo, and i don't consider -pedantic bad, it often help spot weird situations
<fta> +s
<slomo> fta: sure, having that fix is fine i only didn't want to upload a new version just for that :) -pedantic is often really pedantic and using it doesn't guarantee that you only use language parts of the currently selected standard anyway
<fta> slomo, it enforces good practices, such as forcing you to check return values from almost everything, good to create resilient code
<fta> also avoid bad casts
<slomo> fta: it does? well, for all these things there are -W flags too and they don't enable the nitpick mode in gcc that doesn't show any real problems ;)
<kenvandine> ok... what is the right way of referencing a download file in a watch file for a series?
<kenvandine> http://launchpad.net/ubuntu-sso-client/+download?start=10  .*/ubuntu-sso-client-([0-9.]+)\.tar\.gz
<kenvandine> i am not thrilled with that
<kenvandine> i tried putting the series in the url... and even the version but it doesn't like that
<nessita> kenvandine: yeah, I tried that myself. I was hoping that http://launchpad.net/ubuntu-sso-client/stable-1-0/+download would work
<kenvandine> i uploaded with this change to the watch file... but there must be a better way
<kenvandine> i guess http://launchpad.net/ubuntu-sso-client/+download has some magic in it
<nessita> kenvandine: any idea who can we ask?
<kenvandine> people i don't want to bother atm
<kenvandine> didrocks probably knows... but he is busy and i want him to get some rest at some point :)
<nessita> kenvandine: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu-sso-client/+download?start=10 is not listing the stable-1-0 release for me, is it for you?
<nessita> heh
<kenvandine> yes it is...
<kenvandine> weird
<didrocks> for uscan?
<kenvandine> well, actually it finds the tarball
<kenvandine> yeah
<didrocks> uscan --verbose first for debugging :)
<kenvandine> wasn't useful
<didrocks> it finds the tarball? what's the issue then?
<kenvandine> it seems hacky
<kenvandine> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu-sso-client/+download?start=10
<didrocks> hum, not good
<didrocks> I have example in unity
<didrocks> one second
<kenvandine> i wonder if i used --verbose when i hate the typo in the series...
<nessita> didrocks: we need uscan to download released from a given series
<didrocks> nessita: oh for a serie
<didrocks> I've already done that somewhereâ¦
<nessita> yeah
<didrocks> nessita: if it can wait tomorrow, I can dive into my archives :)
<didrocks> just that I need to finish unity stuff
<nessita> didrocks: sure, go ahead
<kenvandine> didrocks, not important
<kenvandine> we worked around it for today :)
<kenvandine> just in the future it would be nice to fix
<avi_> Hey guys, anyone out there have experience deving with Quickly (or know where I should go for help with it)? Thanks!
<kenvandine> avi_, #quickly is the best place
<avi_> Ooh i didn't know it had a channel.
<avi_> Thanks!
<kenvandine> :)
<kenvandine> np
 * didrocks hides
<devildante> nessita evolved into nessita1! :p
<nessita1> devildante: yeah, silly net connection
<devildante> nessita1 devolved into nessita!
 * devildante needs to stop being silly
 * nessita killed the other one
<chrisccoulson> ok, this g-s-d crasher in really making my head hurt now
<devildante> what is g-s-d?
<rickspencer3> devildante, gnome settings daemon
<devildante> ah
<devildante> thanks :)
<htorque> devildante, when your ubuntu looks like windows 95, then that's a crashed g-s-d :P
<devildante> ah yes I remember :p
 * devildante has bad memories
<devildante> I'll have nightmares tonight :p
<GrueMaster> I have a couple of bugs that I don't think are armel specific, but more netbook image related.  Problem is I don't know what to file them against.
<devildante> GrueMaster: you should head to #ubuntu-bugs
<GrueMaster> One is when I insert a USB drive, I get two file managers and a dbus error window.  Second is gnome-codec-install will fail if universe is not available in /etc/apt/sources.list.
<GrueMaster> Ok
<coafcv> hey. how can I make totem show the current title played when listening to an internet radio station? It did this with 9.04, but 10.04 doesn't show it.
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-09-23
<pitti> Good morning
<didrocks> good morning
 * pitti hugs didrocks
 * didrocks hugs pitti back (even if I have no idea why the initial hug ;))
<pitti> just because you rock, and it's a nice morning
<didrocks> pitti: hehe, thanks :-)
<didrocks> how are you?
<pitti> didrocks: I'm great, thanks!
<didrocks> session restart, brb
<pitti> didrocks: just followed up in bug 645561 ; did I misunderstand this?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 645561 in gnome-keyring (Ubuntu) "gnome-keyring prompts lack way to set default timeout (affects: 2) (heat: 12)" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/645561
<didrocks> pitti: no you didn't, I was pondering between 10 minutes or 15 minutes. Wasn't gksudo 15 minutes previously? The thing is that we don't have any way now to configure for ssh key the time to unlock it
<didrocks> maybe 10 is a little bit harsh, as you saidâ¦
<pitti> didrocks: sudo is 15 minutes, yes
<pitti> but not ssh/gpg
<pitti> if it keeps forgetting the keys after 15 minutes, then we don't need it at all
<didrocks> gpg is still 100 by default IIRC
 * didrocks checks
<pitti> I don't do an upload every 15 minutes
<pitti> perhaps we can just reapply the configurability in gconf?
<didrocks> pitti: I can have a look, not sure how many hack it needs
<didrocks> pitti: having a look, please reject and reopen the bug
<pitti> done
<didrocks> thanks
<didrocks> slomo: hey
<didrocks> slomo: do you think the new cairo is causing the libcairo-perl testsuite failing? (it needs refresh? http://launchpadlibrarian.net/55429556/buildlog_ubuntu-maverick-i386.libcairo-perl_1.070-1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz)
<slomo> didrocks: hm, maybe... no idea :) but this doesn't look good
<didrocks> slomo: right, I'm pondering deactivating the testsuite but if the errors are reals :)
<slomo> didrocks: might be a bug in the testsuite too
<didrocks> slomo: yeah, but in that case, it should have failed in debian too :)
<slomo> debian still has the old cairo
<slomo> the new cairo is a bit more restrictive in corner cases
<didrocks> hum, that's maybe the cause then
<slomo> yes, it caused problems in some applications too
<didrocks> so, you should we should try deactivating the testsuite?
<didrocks> think*
<slomo> probably... nothing is using libcairo-perl anyway
<didrocks> (that was my rough guess looking at rdepends :))
<didrocks> ok, will do that then, thanks slomo!
<pitti> dobey: hello, how are you?
<didrocks> dpm: FYI, I tried to add all needed info to bug #614088
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 614088 in unity (Ubuntu) (and 3 other projects) "unity should give an error to the user when not supported by the driver/graphic card (affects: 20) (dups: 5) (heat: 116)" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/614088
<dpm> thanks didrocks!
<dpm> and good morning :)
<didrocks> hey dpm ;) you're welcome!
<didrocks> flappy connexion here
<didrocks> pitti: do you think you will have some time to review indicator transition + unity stack today from the unapproved queue?
<pitti> didrocks: ah, I'll look at this now, I want to start with the library
<didrocks> pitti: thanks :)
<pitti> didrocks: hm, this lib doesn't have a symbols file or shlibs?
<didrocks> pitti: there is a shlibs in debian/rules, isn't it?
 * didrocks checks
<pitti> ah, i might have missed it
<pitti> but symbols files FTW..
<didrocks> I agree
<didrocks> tedg doesn't wantâ¦
<didrocks> because of daily build failure
<pitti> you don't need to set it to FTBFS on mismatch
<pitti> the default is just to print a diff
<didrocks> even on buildd? we get FTBFS when symbols mismatched
<pitti> hm, I had those for ages, and it didn't barf
<didrocks> well, locally, I'm using DPKG_GENSYMBOLS_CHECK_LEVEL=4, but it's only local
<pitti> right
<didrocks> hum, I should check again, but I explicitely remember having bamf or clutk failing because of new symbols
<didrocks> maybe daily build are different? they shouldn't
<didrocks> I'll have a deeper look at that and try to fix that for next release
<didrocks> for indicator-* it's tedg/ken call's, but I will point symbol file again! :)
<didrocks> (trying a silly test now for bamf in my ppa)
<pitti> didrocks: wow @ unity mega fix release
<pitti> I begin to understand how you got so many bugs fixed :)
 * pitti hugs didrocks
<didrocks> pitti: hehe, that's the trick :)
 * didrocks hugs pitti back
<didrocks> some of them are from me nevertheless, I don't steal everything ;)
<pitti> didrocks: gnome-bluetooth upload refers to bug    4. 558841
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 4 in ubuntu (and 1 other project) "Importing finished po doesn't change progressbar (affects: 1) (dups: 1) (heat: 9)" [Undecided,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/4
<pitti> oops, bug 558841
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 558841 in indicator-application (Ubuntu Lucid) (and 7 other projects) "bluetooth "devices" menu item not working in bluetooth indicator (affects: 21) (dups: 4) (heat: 129)" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/558841
<pitti> didrocks: but this bug applies to the indicator-application
<pitti> typo somewhere, or is the bug task wrong?
<didrocks> pitti: urgh, the bug tasks is great, retargetting
<didrocks> pitti: sorry about it :)
<pitti> "great"?
<didrocks> wrong*
 * didrocks is tired :)
 * pitti binNEWs libindicator
<pitti> unfortunately 6 mins too late for current publisher
<didrocks> pitti: already built? \o/
 * pitti pats his build score fudging skillz :)
 * didrocks hugs pitti for the NEWing and review :)
<didrocks> ahah!
<didrocks> so, I fixed the bug to match right component
<pitti> cheers!
<rodrigo_> hi didrocks
<pitti> kenvandine: new murrine looks a bit UI invasive and has no bug report associated..
<rodrigo_> didrocks, 2 questions: did you upload the evolution package? and did you file the bug we talked about yesterday?
<didrocks> rodrigo_: didn't have the time to file the bug, but the evolution package is in UNAPPROVED queue, yes :)
<rodrigo_> didrocks, ah, ok, thanks!
<didrocks> rodrigo_: yw )
<didrocks> seb128 comes back! my IRC is like a christmas tree! :)
<pitti> didrocks: no, it's not in unapproved
<didrocks> hum? I checked yesterday the queueâ¦ let me look
<didrocks> well, approved 10 minutes ago :p
<didrocks> pitti: is it you? :)
<pitti> *chuckle*
 * didrocks hugs pitti
 * pitti just loves it to make people look "WTH?" from time to time, sorry
<didrocks> pitti: that's fine ;) just thought "what I done?" for a second :)
<didrocks> hopefully, evolution is just one ws away ;)
<pitti> ws?
<pitti> workspace?
<didrocks> yeah, sorry :)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: hey, how are you?
<chrisccoulson> hi didrocks - good thanks, but a little tired
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: I saw you work late yesterday?
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i went to bed at 4am ;)
<didrocks> urgh ;)
<didrocks> do you still have the mind to work on some bugs?
<didrocks> :)
<rodrigo_> didrocks, ah, evolution package accepted!
<didrocks> or busy with firefox stuffed!
<rodrigo_> dpm, ping ^^
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i'm currently working on bug 641056
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 641056 in ia32-libs (Ubuntu Maverick) (and 3 other projects) "Loader chooses 64-bit instead of 32-bit library (affects: 6) (heat: 36)" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/641056
<rodrigo_> dpm, the translations for the u1 email
<dpm> rodrigo_, I've just seen that, they've been uploaded, thanks for the heads up
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: great, if you need any bug, just let me (for instance, the ftbfs on syncevolution)
<chrisccoulson> didrocks - yeah, i took a quick look at that yesterday. but it fails to build when you add any patches
<chrisccoulson> it seems to run "intltool-update -m" at the end of the build, which exits with an error because of the new files in .pc/
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: oh really? that's weird
<chrisccoulson> but i didn't spend any time to figure out what was running that.
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: if you have some time, will be great. Not high priority IMHO
<rodrigo_> didrocks, https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntuone-client/+bug/645932
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 645932 in ubuntuone-client "Hiding/showing the ribbon from the menu doesn't do anything until you visit another folder in Nautilus (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Undecided,New]
<didrocks> rodrigo_: thanks for opening it, sorry but I'm running on different topics :)
<rodrigo_> didrocks, working on a fix right now
<rodrigo_> didrocks, np
<didrocks> rodrigo_: what will be the workaround as it's due to nautilus ?
<rodrigo_> didrocks, well, it's due to us not listening to GConf entry changes
<rodrigo_> so it should be easy
<didrocks> oh ok :)
<rodrigo_> hmm, although it looks nautilus keeps a bar, so hiding our ribbon is not enough :(
<didrocks> yeah, that was what I saw when playing with nautilus API
<didrocks> hence my "it's due to nautilus"
<rodrigo_> yeah
<rodrigo_> I thought it was an easier thing to fix
<rodrigo_> well,  maybe I can hide the parent, but that won't work the first time
<didrocks> yeah, I really hope nautilus will soon migrate to libpeasâ¦ should be easier to get more control on nautilus
<didrocks> pitti: FYI, we get a crasher in unity when clicking on some indicators, getting a fix and distro patch
<chrisccoulson> wow, this ia32-libs stuff is just such a mess
<pitti> chrisccoulson: amen
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: doesn't sound attracting when reading the bug report, isn't it? :)
<pitti> didrocks: ack
<pitti> ia32-libs should just die
<chrisccoulson> yes :-)
<didrocks> yeah, quite hackish
<pitti> or be replaced with a clever script which does a i386 chroot and some bind mounts
<pitti> or dpkg/apt multiarch
<pitti> chrisccoulson: btw, no need to squeeze that through DSL; I've been doing these updates in a dchroot on ronne
<pitti> and remote debsign
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, that's what i'm doing currently :)
<pitti> upload bandwidth from the DC is quite nice :)
<chrisccoulson> there's no way i'm uploading a 700MB tarball on my connection ;)
<pitti> by the time you can say "gosh, what a hideous package, I hate it" it's finished
<nessita> hello everyone!
<chrisccoulson> lol
<chrisccoulson> hi nessita
<nessita> pitti: not sure if you got the message yesterday, bu I proposed https://code.launchpad.net/~nataliabidart/ubuntu-dev-tools/multiple-series-for-project-upload/+merge/36354
<pitti> Senora, hello!
<pitti> nessita: I saw it, thanks! looks nice
<nessita> hola chrisccoulson, pitti!
<nessita> pitti: awesome
<didrocks> hey nessita
<nessita> hello didrocks, how are you?
<didrocks> nessita: I'm fine, thanks :) and you?
<nessita> pretty good, preparing some mate and enjoying the weather (today is sunny, yesterday was rainy)
<didrocks> oh nice :)
<bcurtiswx> matte?
<bcurtiswx> ah, mate.  i have colleagues who drink it.. maybe it's worth trying
<didrocks> pitti: unity fix uploaded
<cyphermox> pitti: I wanted to get a second opinion from you for a fix to bug 484429
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 484429 in udisks (Fedora) (and 11 other projects) "Plugging in a LUKS device causes the following error: Error unlocking device: cryptsetup exited with exit code 239: Command failed: Device already exists (affects: 20) (heat: 113)" [Unknown,Unknown] https://launchpad.net/bugs/484429
<kenvandine> pitti, it shouldn't be much of a change from the last snapshot we included
<kenvandine> and there is a bug that it fixes, but it wasn't reported until after i uploaded, in light-themes
<kenvandine> one sec
<kenvandine> pitti, it actually fixes bug 622284
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 622284 in gtk2-engines-murrine (Ubuntu Maverick) (and 1 other project) "Font blur on some buttons in Ambiance/Radiance theme (affects: 5) (heat: 26)" [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/622284
<kenvandine> and is related to bug 634422
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 634422 in light-themes (Ubuntu) (and 2 other projects) "[UIFE] tweaks to light-themes for maverick (affects: 2) (heat: 16)" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/634422
<didrocks> kenvandine: go on holiday!
<kenvandine> which is a UIF exception, but we didn't list that package there... since it was a gnome package and we had been waiting for a stable release
<kenvandine> hey didrocks
<kenvandine> i am :)
<didrocks> hey kenvandine :)
<didrocks> I see that!
<kenvandine> just checking in :)
<kenvandine> several things i am tracking are still in the unapproved queue :(
<nessita> mvo: ping
<kenvandine> compiz, murrine, and mission-control
<kenvandine> oh and udev...
<didrocks> kenvandine: murrine corresponds to the new version in GNOME ftp?
<kenvandine> yes
<kenvandine> so that should be ok
<mvo> hey nessita
<nessita> mvo: hey there, how are you?
<mvo> nessita: good, thanks! how are you?
<nessita> mvo: pretty good! I just wanted to let you know that I'm (still) getting this https://pastebin.canonical.com/37583/ when updating software-center
<didrocks> kenvandine: great :)
<mvo> nessita: uh, that is with a current maverick? what does  apt-cache policy apt-xapian-index
<mvo>  output?
<nessita> mvo: ah!         500 http://mirrors.kernel.org/ubuntu/ maverick/main amd64 Packages
<nessita> full output https://pastebin.canonical.com/37585/
<mvo> nessita: could you pastebin the file /var/lib/apt-xapian-index/values please ?
<nessita> mvo: https://pastebin.canonical.com/37586/
<mvo> nessita: thanks, that is a bit odd, catalogedtime is missing from there, I look at the package
<mvo> nessita: could you also pastebin "sudo update-apt-xapian-index -v  -f -u
<mvo> " please?
<nessita> sure
<nessita> mvo: https://pastebin.canonical.com/37587/
<mvo> nessita: thanks, and after that finished, you still have no "catalogedtime" in /var/lib/apt-xapian-index/values ?
<mvo> nessita: is this a upgrade or a fresh install?
<nessita> mvo: still no catalogtime, this is an upgrade
<mvo> thanks nessita, I dig into it now and see what I can find
<nessita> mvo: sure!
<mvo> nessita: spanish locale I assume?
<nessita> nopes
<nessita> en_US
<mvo> thanks
<pitti> didrocks: done
<didrocks> pitti: thanks :)
<mvo> nessita: is it there if you run sudo update-apt-xapian-index -v  -f ?
<mvo> nessita: "it" == "the cataloguedtime"
 * nessita checks
<pitti> kenvandine: ah, thanks
<nessita> mvo: I have this line: Reading plugin /usr/share/apt-xapian-index/plugins/cataloged_time.py.
<pitti> cyphermox: reading..
<mvo> nessita: I think I can reproduce it now, many thanks for the report
<nessita> mvo: you're welcome!
<pitti> cyphermox: so it seems the cryptsetup part is fixed in maverick, by way of debian?
<pitti> cyphermox: I'll digest the udisks patch later on, thanks for this
<kenvandine> pitti, how would you feel about me patching gwibber so it adds the keys to the desktop files so appmenu doesn't try to display the File/Edit menus for gwibber-accounts and gwibber-preferences?
<kenvandine> they do nothing...
<pitti> kenvandine: hm, why does appmenu display them in the first place?
<pitti> does it invent menus out of thin air?
<kenvandine> it sticks stubs in so you can have a menu for copy/paste
<kenvandine> something that was never fully implemented
<kenvandine> it does that if the app doesn't have any menus
 * kenvandine thinks it is silly the way it is
<pitti> ah, that explains why I keep getting those menus on random applications
<kenvandine> they are completely useless and ugly
<kenvandine> yeah
<pitti> couldn't we rather disable that completely?
<pitti> instead of playing catch-up in every app?
<pitti> I even get those two on a completely empty desktop right now
<kenvandine> you'd have to convince other people :)
<kenvandine> it is annoying
<pitti> well, s/right now/last time I looked at it/
<kenvandine> it is better now... the common stuff is blacklisted
<kenvandine> open office, firefix, chromium, etc
<kenvandine> firefox even
<pitti> this seems like a the wrong way..
<kenvandine> but there are random apps that do it
<kenvandine> indeed
<pitti> perhaps we could whitelist the two or three apps that actually need it?
<kenvandine> i think there might be some underlying architectural reasons why they are there now...
 * pitti follows up to the bug and waits for sabdfl's response
<cyphermox> pitti, I'm curious if there really was much for cryptsetup to do in the first place, since it's really udisks listening to udev events and saying "ooh, unplugged device"
<sabdfl> pitti: i believe mpt had a clever plan which i approved and it fell short of full implementation
<sabdfl> however, i don't recall the exact plan
<sabdfl> i think the stubs were to handle a case like: an app pops up a dialog with selectable text. the rest of the apps menus are not appropriate, but edt/cut/copy/paste might be
<sabdfl> i agree, having the stubs when they are not useful isn't right
<pitti> sabdfl: but even then we wouldn't need a File menu?
<sabdfl> happy to see a fix of any form
<mpt> kenvandine, that's a bug in the window type detection. You shouldn't be hacking around it by making more and more additions to the blacklist.
<sabdfl> the File stub is, iirc, to keep Edit in the right place
<mpt> kenvandine, the opposite case is where the menus disappear when Gimp's Toolbox window is focused, and they should not.
<kenvandine> mpt, is there a bug filed on that already?
<kenvandine> i haven't seen that
<kenvandine> mpt, there seems to be quite a few windows like that
 * mpt tries it out
<mpt> ah, actually, the Gwibber case is fine
<mpt> The only bug there is that the Edit items aren't implemented yet
<kenvandine> mpt, yes... but at this point they won't be for maverick
<mpt> sure
<mpt> So, an alternative would be to remove the Edit menu from the fallback menus for Maverick
<mpt> but it's probably way too late even for that
<kenvandine> that would definitely be better
<kenvandine> there are lots of windows that get this
<pitti> mpt: well, it sounds easier than tring to add a hundred more blacklist entries?
<pitti> (or, rather, finding them in the first place)
<mpt> pitti, yes, there should be only three entries in the blacklist
<mpt> well, four I guess, counting Seamonkey
<kenvandine> and it just seems ugly, in fact the thing that really made this get my attention was my wife's new netbook... first thing she did when she opened gwibber-accounts was click on the edit menu and say "well that is ugly"
<kenvandine> she had no reason to click it... besides it being there :)
<sabdfl> if it's on the screen and has no purpose, and has no style, it's clutter
<mpt> There should be an API for windows to say "If the global menu bar is active, please inherit the parent window's menus, but enable only these items {}"
<kenvandine> sabdfl, yup
<kenvandine> sabdfl, and first impression is key
<sabdfl> indeed
<mpt> So that the menu bar contents don't flash around so much
<kenvandine> sabdfl, she was totally wow'd by unity btw :)
<kenvandine> this was the first thing she complained about
<sabdfl> glad to hear it
<didrocks> mpt: I already have on patch for appmenu nearly going to sponsor, if we decide on that, I should maybe hold on
<kenvandine> ok, well i gotta go... my wife is reminding me i am on vacation :)
<didrocks> kenvandine: enjoy! ;)
<kenvandine> didrocks, can you keep an eye on my stuff in the unapproved queue for me? :)
<mpt> ugh
<didrocks> kenvandine: sure, harassing people is one of my favorite activity :)
<kenvandine> hehe... thx didrocks
<didrocks> yw ;)
<kenvandine> before i disconnect.. gotta make sure unity doesn't crash any more :)
<didrocks> hehe, right! or just wait for the next publisher which should be there soon
<mpt> The menus don't even pass the first test case I wrote in June
<mpt> Who's in charge of QA for them?
<kenvandine> didrocks, ugh... i built that -ubuntu2 and it still crashes
<kenvandine> mpt, :(
<kenvandine> didrocks, anything else i might need?
<didrocks> kenvandine: hum, really?
<kenvandine> yeah... still crashing for me
<didrocks> kenvandine: on clicking on system indicator?
<kenvandine> any of them
<davidbarth> mpt: it's a bit late, what do we do now?
<kenvandine> happens on the MeMenu and messaging menu too
<kenvandine> didrocks, perhaps i don't have all of the indicator related updates
<didrocks> kenvandine: yeah, sounds like that
<davidbarth> kenvandine: is that with neil's fix?
<didrocks> kenvandine: retrying
<didrocks> davidbarth: he took from the trunk, he didn't update everything
<didrocks> but with neil's fix
<didrocks> kenvandine: retrying, one sec
<mpt> davidbarth, reported bug 646029
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 646029 in indicator-appmenu "UTILITY wrongly treated as an active window (fails test case) (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/646029
<mvo> nessita: just fyi bug #646018 - the s-c part is fixed, but there is a apt-xapian-index issue left
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 646018 in software-center (Ubuntu) (and 1 other project) "indexing fails after a upgrade if the apt-xapian-index is not yet regenerated (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/646018
<mpt> davidbarth, I suggest, get whoever's doing QA for the menus to go through the rest of those test cases (sorry I don't have time to do that myself)
<nessita> mvo: very nice!
 * kenvandine shouldn't update right before traveling... hope we have wifi at the beach house :)
<didrocks> kenvandine: well, you still have the GNOME session as a fallback
<didrocks> session restart, brb
<didrocks> kenvandine: I confirm the fix "fixes" it :)
<kenvandine> didrocks, ok... :)
<chrisccoulson> didrocks - i might need you to sponsor a gdk-pixbuf upload in a minute :)
<kenvandine> didrocks, guess i need to wait for stuff to get published
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: that's some kind of "advertisement" before the actual push? :)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: it's for the lib32-on-64-mess? :)
<chrisccoulson> didrocks - yeah, i'm just testing it atm :)
<didrocks> kenvandine: I guess so, yeah, sorry :)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: awesome!
<chrisccoulson> hopefully i'll be able to run upstream firefox builds on my laptop again then ;)
<didrocks> not sure this sounds like a good or bad news :)
<chrisccoulson> didrocks - are you running i386?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: yes
<chrisccoulson> didrocks - do you have a /usr/lib32 symlink to /usr/lib?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: no, it's not a symlink
<didrocks> $ ls -ld /usr/lib32/
<didrocks> drwxr-xr-x 4 root root 4096 2010-09-19 14:07 /usr/lib32/
<chrisccoulson> oh, but it actually exists?
<didrocks> yeah, and contains nvidia-current and vdpau here
<mvo> is it just me or is mutt showing a not-quite-black background for anyone else with the latest vte/gnome-terminal?
<mvo> and no home/end keys in mutt
<chrisccoulson> w00t, it works \o/
<pitti> mvo: which vte?
<pitti> mvo: it's the same white background color as in any other terminal
<pitti> but I suppose I have custom colors
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, ok, i've pushed the gdk-pixbuf changes to lp:~ubuntu-desktop/gdk-pixbuf/ubuntu
<chrisccoulson> i'd appreciate it if you could test it when you get a few spare minutes
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: will review in a few. Thanks :)
<chrisccoulson> (i've tested x86_64 and i386 on x86_64, but i've not tested your combination yet)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: ok, anything particular that needed attention?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks - i'd be interested to see the strace output of gdk-pixbuf-query-loaders
<mvo> pitti: aha, that was it! for some reason my the color palette was set to "custom"
<mvo> pitti: now its all good again
<chrisccoulson> didrocks - i just noticed too that we have an out-of-date gdk-pixbuf version
<chrisccoulson> should we update that?
<chrisccoulson> (to 2.22.0)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: it depends on latest glib, we should wait on seb for it :)
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, oh, i didn't notice that ;)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: can you ping me later or send me an email about gdk-pixbuf?
<didrocks> still on unity and indicators right now
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, yeah, sure
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: thanks :)
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, is there anything else high priority for maverick you want working on in the meantime?
<chrisccoulson> i suppose i should carry on looking at this g-s-d crasher ;)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: yeah, if you feel strong enough as it's quite a headache apparently :)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: or the syncevo ftbfs for a change
<chrisccoulson> yeah, this crash is a pain. i've resorted to running bluetooth-applet and g-s-d in gdb now, with a watchpoint on the memory locations i'm interested in
<chrisccoulson> so i can catch anything that writes to them ;)
<jcastro> hey didrocks, do desktop team branches always point to the dev release? like this?  lp:~ubuntu-desktop/shotwell/ubuntu
<jcastro> what if I wanted say, the lucid packaging?
<didrocks> jcastro: most of the time, I personnaly try to do lp:~ubuntu-desktop/shotwell/lucid on first SRU
<didrocks> jcastro: if not, that mean we don't have that and the history contains only dev release version (which is lucid at some point)
<didrocks> jcastro: we don't have any policy for that, so everyone does what is the best for him
<desrt> good morning everyone
<jcastro> ok so that branch may or may not exist?
<didrocks> hey desrt!
<didrocks> right
<desrt> how's freaking fourtytwo coming along?
<desrt> er.  maverick, i mean
<cyphermox> jcastro, wouldn't lp:ubuntu/lucid/shotwell be just as good, except for the extra files alongside debian/?
<jcastro> didrocks: can I propose making that a policy? It will make it much easier for upstreams to make daily builds on older distros
<cyphermox> jcastro, forget I asked -- daily builds
<didrocks> jcastro: can be a good idea, not sure what will be our process for natty, using full source branchc or not
<jcastro> didrocks: ok, think of me if the discussion comes up
<didrocks> desrt: things announce nicely, on the final sprint!
<didrocks> jcastro: I'll sure!
<jcastro> making it easy for any upstream shipped by ~desktop to be able to reuse your packaging for dailies would be really nice
<didrocks> sounds a good idea, right  :)
<desrt> didrocks: either there's a bug in my parser or one in your printer :)
<jcastro> everyone I've tried so far has Just Worked
<jcastro> didrocks: I'll have dailies for shotwell for real today. :D
<desrt> didrocks: 'announce'?
<didrocks> desrt: not announce then ;) but "looks" :)
<didrocks> jcastro: great!
<desrt> :)
<desrt> is seb around today?
<jcastro> desrt: I haven't seen him all week, holiday I think
<jcastro> didrocks: is that branch discussion something you guys would do at UDS?
<didrocks> jcastro: yeah, something like "ubuntu desktop process"
<jcastro> ok
<didrocks> desrt: he's on vacation this week
<desrt> heh
<desrt> i hope he relaxes very well
<desrt> he's going to need some energy
<desrt> you guys have any issues (other than the rollback patch that robert made -- already on the list)?
<didrocks> desrt: not a lot, some with new g-i as we won't take it, so rollback some commits
<didrocks> but overall, it's good
<desrt> g-i has been really fun lately
<desrt> i've been meaning to send those guys a thank you note
<desrt> makes my breaking-stuff look not so bad =)
<didrocks> hehe :)
<fagan> kenvandine: Gwibber isnt working right with the messaging menu
<fagan> its after falling back to the notification area
<fagan> is that a known issue?
<chrisccoulson> b'ah, i just got bluetooth-applet to crash again for the second time in 3 days, and just realised i'm looking at totally the wrong thing :@
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: urgh :/
<chrisccoulson> so, back to trying again now ;)
<chrisccoulson> i'm going to nail this sucker :-)
<kinygos> hi...can anyone recommend a graphics package for ubuntu for producing website graphics, buttons, layout cuts, etc....inkscape is what i'm about to download and use, but just wondering if there's anything else for comparison
<fagan> kinygos: you should ask that on #ubuntu
<fagan> this channel isnt for support
<kinygos> apologies
<fagan> np
<kinygos> (is this for ubuntu desktop os development then?)
<fagan> yep
<kinygos> cool...thanks for the great OS :)
<didrocks> pitti: sorry for abusing, but you should have 2 indicators remaining in the queue (they were on dput away) and one new unity too really solving the crash now
 * didrocks still wonders why the .c got rebuild locally but not on buildd
<didrocks> timestamp randomness
<fta> do we really need a display to upgrade now???
<fta> Setting up software-center (3.0) ...
<fta> /usr/lib/pymodules/python2.6/gtk-2.0/gtk/__init__.py:57: GtkWarning: could not open display
<fta>   warnings.warn(str(e), _gtk.Warning)
<fta> (when upgrading remotely over ssh)
<Keybuk> stupid crappy silly nouveau driver
<Keybuk> every time I minimize or close chromium windows, it crashes
<didrocks> I'm still using nvidia because of that
<chrisccoulson> didrocks - did you try ff-4.0 yet?
<chrisccoulson> i tried the beta 6 version yesterday, and it feels so dated already ;)
<chrisccoulson> dailies ftw :-)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: not yet, why? ;)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: oh, so good!
<chrisccoulson> i was just wondering ;)
<Chipaca> rickspencer3: ping
<rickspencer3> hey Chipaca
<Chipaca> rickspencer3: hi!
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson: ping, any idea why would sun java plugin stop working after firefox update? anthing I could ask guy to check before I decide to go for a walk? ;)
<rickspencer3> kklimonda, hey, do you still have that repro for bug #638513 handy?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 638513 in glib2.0 (Ubuntu) "PyGtk App Core dumps (affects: 1) (heat: 489)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/638513
<kklimonda> rickspencer3: bah, I should have attached it. fortunately it's really small
<rickspencer3> kklimonda, it was in pastebin somewhere, but I can't find it :(
<kklimonda> rickspencer3: I'll attach it to bug report now
<rickspencer3> thanks man
<kklimonda> rickspencer3: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/glib2.0/+bug/638513/+attachment/1629399/+files/spin.py
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 638513 in glib2.0 (Ubuntu) "PyGtk App Core dumps (affects: 1) (heat: 8)" [Undecided,New]
<kklimonda> rickspencer3: you should raise the importance and make your min^H coworkers take a look at it ;)
<kklimonda> this is a really nasty crash :/
<kklimonda> rickspencer3: oh, I see why does it crash
<kklimonda> rickspencer3: the callback for input has to return either True or False
<kklimonda> rickspencer3: it's still shouldn't crash but at least I can see now why does it happen
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-09-24
<rickspencer3> kklimonda, can I fix that in my Python code?
<kklimonda> rickspencer3: yes
<rickspencer3> so if test() returns True, all is good?
<rickspencer3> in your sample?
<rickspencer3> sweet
<kklimonda> rickspencer3: well, either True or False (see http://pygtk.org/docs/pygtk/class-gtkspinbutton.html#signal-gtkspinbutton--input for what should be returned in your case)
<rickspencer3> let me try it
<rickspencer3> hmm
<rickspencer3> still crashing for me
<kklimonda> hmm..
<rickspencer3> before my signal handler is even called
<rickspencer3> yeah, even without the handler connected it crashes
<kklimonda> rickspencer3: that's weird - it didn't crash when callback wasn't connected before
<kklimonda> rickspencer3: and adding return True to __changed in grid_filter.py fixed it for me.
<rickspencer3> hmmm
<rickspencer3> weird, not for me, I must be missing something really simple
<kklimonda> rickspencer3: http://pastebin.com/1WyryErp - that's for grid_filter.py from the tarball you have uploaded to the bugreport
<kklimonda> argh, not this - http://pastebin.com/bedubE7c
<kklimonda> I was supposed to paste a patch, not whole script :)
<rickspencer3> kklimonda, so, it's not working for me, but I'm suspecting I am doing something really silly
<kklimonda> rickspencer3: hmm.. if you tested the patch and not script I've pasted before (which was unpatched) then I'm not sure..
<kklimonda> rickspencer3: does spin.py work for you?
<rickspencer3> kklimonda, it was me being stupid
<kklimonda> well, it happens to all of us from time to time.
<rickspencer3> it happens to me every day, so I'm used to it :/
<rickspencer3> (hadn't set the PYTHONPATH properly when running the test script)
<rickspencer3> kklimonda, sweet, so not the widget is working properly!
<rickspencer3> thanks a million
<kklimonda> no problem, glad to be of help
<rickspencer3> kklimonda, so ...
<rickspencer3> more to the point, you're not supposed to use the "input" signal handler in Python at all
<rickspencer3> :(
<rickspencer3> you're supposed to use "value-changed"
<rickspencer3> if ever there was a face-palm moment, this is it
<kklimonda> rickspencer3: :)
<kklimonda> rickspencer3: good to know
<rickspencer3> mortifie
<RAOF> Morning all
<RAOF> Argh!  I just spent 30 seconds wondering why my mouse pointer wouldn't go to this screenâ¦ which is driven by a different computer.  Bah!
<rickspencer3> hey RAOF
<RAOF> rickspencer3: Good evening!
<rickspencer3> RAOF, back in Sydney?
<RAOF> Hobart, yeah.
<rickspencer3> Sid-knee
<rickspencer3> Oh, right, Hobart
<RAOF> Not Syd-en-ee :)
<rickspencer3> how was the conference?
<RAOF> Great!
<RAOF> Toulouse is a pretty nice town and there were all sorts of interesting conversations.
<rickspencer3> nice
<RAOF> We cornered krh at one point and made him explain wayland in detail :)
<rickspencer3> heh
<rickspencer3> and?
<RAOF> It's pretty interesting architecturally.
<RAOF> And has its own special IPC mechanism, and object-based notification system.
<RAOF> And is not an X server in any way :)
<rickspencer3> heh
<rickspencer3> RAOF, how is xorg-xserver looking for Maverick?
<RAOF> Although he gave a neat demonstration of a couple of X servers + some flowers running under wayland with funky animation.
<RAOF> xorg-server is looking pretty good.
<RAOF> There are some edge-cases in mesa on strange hardware I need to look at, and to get kde to log out without crashing the server.
<RAOF> That's on intel.
<rickspencer3> right
<rickspencer3> well, Kubuntu is in much better shape with the new mesa, right?
<RAOF> I've got the kde thing half done; now it just needs to log _in_ succesfully the second time ;)
<rickspencer3> heh
<Amaranth> RAOF: Although Wayland is basically X the way modern applications really use X
<Amaranth> RAOF: It gives you a pixmap to draw to and tell it when you're done
<RAOF> Kubuntu is *much* better with the new mesa.  And the new mesa helped Chase's multi-touch in unity demonstration, too, because it made unity actually work on his ati laptop :)
<Amaranth> And that's pretty much it on the client side of drawing, the toolkit or app has to handle subwindows and such by itself
<Amaranth> Which they all do anyway
<RAOF> Amaranth: Right.  It's not terribly difficult to port things to it.
<Amaranth> Although it still needs libxkb and some major work in the input area in general
<RAOF> That might need to wait until we actually figure out how to do input properly :)
<Amaranth> And apparently it's still possible to write an application that hooks in to the wayland compositor to provide effects
<rickspencer3> well, so long as you can draw flowers, I guess that's all that matters
<RAOF> But libxkbcommon is getting split out and depended on by X, so Wayland will be able to have xkb working more easily.
<Amaranth> It just gives you flicker free screen updates and transparency, compositing 101 stuff
<RAOF> Yeah.  Actually, the goal appears to be to make your compositor link to libwayland and be a display server itself.
<RAOF> So unity-wayland would be the display server and compositor and shell.
<Amaranth> But the major problem with wayland is it lacks all the standard we have for how windows should work, EWMH and such
<RAOF> By design!
<Amaranth> Sure but you need to provide some of that, somewhere
<RAOF> In the desktop shell, or so says krh.
<Amaranth> So each compositor/display server should implement their own version of docks and always on top windows and such?
<RAOF> Yes.
<Amaranth> Oh boy, that's going to be a mess for a few years
<RAOF> Or, alternatively, should provide a separate interface to make those writable.
<Amaranth> Until someone reinvents half the X11 standards
<RAOF> Over dbus!
<RAOF> ;:)
<Amaranth> Yeah, I imagine it'd all be over dbus
<Amaranth> Setting properties on the root window is such a hack
<Amaranth> I've been tempted to get wayland running on my computer, now that you don't have to build the entire stack to do it
<RAOF> Yeah.  And something you can't do in Wayland, because clients can't communicate.
<RAOF> (Over wayland, at least)
<RAOF> You can expect a wayland PPA pretty soon.
<Amaranth> We'll probably end up with a new org.freedesktop.WindowManager interface every shell/display server implements
<RAOF> Yup.
<Amaranth> Or even better, a library everyone uses
<kklimonda> RAOF: if wayland a real [1] project that is aimed at replacing X at some point [1] as opposed to a tech demo of sort :)
<RAOF> Oooh, I don't know about that!
<RAOF> kklimonda: krh was talking about Meego(?) switching to wayland in the near future; it's not actually a tech demo.
<kklimonda> RAOF: sweet
<Amaranth> Although the nice thing about the xserver is if you don't have a driver you can still use it
<kklimonda> RAOF: so when do we follow? :)
<Amaranth> Yeah, apparently Nokia is looking in to using it for Meego
<Sarvatt> kklimonda: meego as in the phone UI for meego :)
<kklimonda> Sarvatt: I know, j/k ;)
<RAOF> kklimonda: Right now!  Just as long as you don't want anything to run! :)
<Amaranth> But if you had a seamless way of starting a rootless X server for legacy apps...
<RAOF> But, more seriously, we might want to use wayland in the next couple of cycles as an intermediate compositor for switching between X servers.
<kklimonda> RAOF: meh, as long as it runs terminal I'm all set ;)
<kklimonda> RAOF: hmm, sounds interesting - what's the usecase?
<Amaranth> The nice thing is you could implement that org.freedesktop.WindowManager interface for X11 too that would just set the appropriate properties and such so apps wouldn't have to care
<Amaranth> RAOF: That sounds like the exact idea I was pushing at UDS Seville using Xgl :)
<RAOF> kklimonda: Keith gets his way and X is entirely out of the trusted path so each user runs one (or more) X server(s) and you want to be able to log in smoothly.
<RAOF> Amaranth: :)
<Amaranth> Yeah, if wayland is running at root and managing input you could run xservers on top of it as the user running the session and expose much less code to root access
<Amaranth> And have a spinning cube to switch user sessions or something :)
<RAOF> Amaranth: That's what krh was suggesting.  Keith was going further; *no* display server manages input, and you push input arbitration into the kernel.
<kklimonda> now that's something users would actually care about :)
<RAOF> In what seemed like a very reasonable (and small) change to the input code.
<Amaranth> RAOF: ha
<Amaranth> That'd be a nice way to work around not having a revoke() syscall
<RAOF> Right.
<RAOF> The idea being, you don't need revoke if the input devices don't broadcast but instead go to only one fd (as serial devices do now?) + some way for consolekit to tell the kernel which fd should get it.
<RAOF> It seemed very reasonable in a room full of 40-odd X hackers :)
<RAOF> Woot!  A new fglrx which actually works on Maverick!
<ajmitch> isn't that sort of an important thing to have before release? :)
<RAOF> Yes.  And we've now got it.
<Sarvatt> we do?!
 * Sarvatt jumps for joy
<RAOF> According to my bug mail, yes.  Looks like Alberto just uploaded it.
<Sarvatt> oh ATI you never cease to confuse the heck out of me
<Sarvatt> beta driver that works with xserver 1.9 doesn't have newer kernel support added in the public releases for the past 4 months :)
<RAOF> Launchpad wishlist: The ability to add a regex to a bug, so when anyone enters a comment matching that you can pop up some text saying âWe've repeatedly said that this applies to the E6410 and *not* to the E6510.  Do you *really* want to add a comment about how this fix doesn't work for the E6510?â
<TheMuso> It will be nice once all ATI cards have open source support out of the box... If that is indeed the eventual aim...
<RAOF> That's getting pretty close.
<RAOF> I *think* we're even be supporting Radeon 5xxx series 3D out of the box on Maverick, although I don't have any hardware to determine how useful this is :)
<Sarvatt> yup, no 2D acceleration though funny enough
<Sarvatt> don't worry, 6xxx series will be out really soon and drivers will lag 6 months again :)
 * ajmitch just wants fast, stable & complete 3D support :)
<Sarvatt> RAOF: our friend eDP?
<Amaranth> Hey, once all the gallium dreams happen having 3D support will get you 2D support for free
<Amaranth> Neat, i just got root on my laptop. Without putting in my password
<Sarvatt> the xorg state tracker seems to be on life support, I think only vmware cares about it
<RAOF> Sarvatt: Indeed.  We talked of eDP in hushed tones at XDS, so as to not traumatise Jesse any further :)
<Sarvatt> hah!
<Amaranth> Sarvatt: That's why I said dreams :)
<Amaranth> I suppose I'll get it the same time I get native Direct3D support
<Amaranth> Oh, wait...
<Sarvatt> yeah speaking of that, adding wine-dev to the mesa build-deps sure is fun! it's bad enough mesa depends on x which depends on mesa in xorg-edgers for vmwgfx
<GrueMaster> crimsun: Need your help again with Marvell Dove audio in Maverick.  Seems the new board changed codecs.
<TheMuso> GrueMaster: What has changed exactly? Mixer elemt names?
<pitti> Good morning
<RAOF> Heya pitti
<GrueMaster> TheMuso: Hey.  No, the entire codec chip.
<GrueMaster> It used to use an AD1980, now it uses an ALC655.
<TheMuso> GrueMaster: oh ok
<bratsche> Hey pitti, how's it going?
<pitti> hey bratsche; pretty well, thanks!
<GrueMaster> TheMuso: I have found in my research that there are several x86 motherboards that use the same codec.  I am trying to decipher the pci/ac97 code for similarities, but coming up short.  Alsa speaker-test works, but nothing through pulseaudio.
<GrueMaster> TheMuso: If you get a chance, scan http://paste.ubuntu.com/499485.  The ASoC machine driver is exporting AC97 HiFi, AC97 LFE, and AC97 Surround.  Not sure what pulseaudio needs.
<GrueMaster> If you have any insights, leave me a note, thanks.  I'm off to bed for now.
<mvo> pitti: hey, good morning. do you think its ok to get http://paste.ubuntu.com/499517/ in? its both bugfix and feature (in order to fix the bug) - the problem is that brasero calls the packagekit session interface to find what provides the cdrdao binary and this is a nice and elegant way to fix the problem (and any other app that searches for binaries)
<mvo> its currently broken (throws exception, so its going to be hard for the change to make it worse ;)
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> good morning mvo, hey didrocks
<didrocks> Guten Morgen pitti :)
<pitti> mvo: oh, haven't seen try:/except:/else yet; so else is run when there's no exception?
<pitti> mvo: it looks like an elegant solution indeed
<pitti> fine for me
 * didrocks like also try:/except:/finally: ;)
<mvo> pitti: thanks! I think its a win too, I tested it with brasero and its really nice, you insert a audio cd and it will prompt to install cdrdao and continue just fine afterwards
<pitti> mvo: I just thought that having wodim and growisofs would be enough
<pitti> I don't remember that I installed cdrdao to burn an audio CD
<pitti> this sounds like something which ought to "just work" in a default install?
<pitti> mvo: so brasero doesn't use wodim any more?
<mvo> pitti: not sure, I haven't looked into brasero myself. but I agree, it should just work
<mvo> pitti: oddly with the current brasero it crashes :/ I worked on that branch a couple of days ago so I think its a regression
<mvo> didrocks: do you know about this? what brasero is using for audio cd burning?
<didrocks> mvo: hum, I haven't tracked brasero recently. Let me have a look
<didrocks> in 2.31.3: Fix wrong report of speed with both cdrecord and wodim
<didrocks> so, sounds like it's still works with wodim, let me look the changelog from that
<didrocks> burn-wodim.c as a plugin
<mvo> odd
<didrocks> I don't see it in the plugin list, weirdâ¦ will try to have a look when having some time
<pitti> alternatively we could drop wodim and just install cdrdao?
<pitti> well, I guess wodim is still needed for data CDs
<mvo> eh, so I have a fresh install here
<mvo> but no wodim
<mvo> I guess that is the problem then :) ?
<mvo> no installed wodim
<mvo> I have a look
<mvo> wodim seems to be prefered over cdrdao when I read the plugin order correctly
<pitti> shouldn't brasero depend on either of those?
<mvo> yeah
<mvo> for some reason it got dropped
<mvo> I check the bzr history
<pitti> in wodim it did
<pitti> Depends: [...] wodim, genisoimage, dvd+rw-tools,
<pitti> all of those are gone
<pitti> can we please put them back?
<mvo> yeah, in lucid it was all there
<mvo> sure, I can do that now
<mvo> I just want to see who/why so that I can send my wrath ;)
<pitti> *phear*
 * pitti hugs mvo, cheers
 * mvo makes his best grim face and hugs pitti back
<pitti> your best grim face still isn't very scary, sorry :)
<mvo> lol
<pitti> but I'm sure whoever committed it won't ever have a successful dist-upgrade again
<mvo> I need to practise more
 * pitti thinks mvo's revenges are a little more subtle than mere grim faces
<mvo> if uid=="name": raise ResolverGeneratedBreaks("The resolver generated breaks, %s" % random.choice(apt.Cache())
<mvo> there is a new brasero-cdrkit
<mvo> maybe its enough to seed that
<pitti> aah
<mvo> it seems to have all the dependencies
<pitti> but that doesn't have dvd+rwtools?
<pitti> mvo: I'd actually prefer this to be a recommends: of brasero
<pitti> it sounds more correct to me
<mvo> the dvd+rwtools? or wodim-cdrkit (or both)?
<pitti> They are only needed for the
<pitti>  following operations in Brasero:
<pitti>   * Audio CD burning with CD-Text information
<pitti>   * Video DVD creation
<pitti> hmm
<pitti> mvo: I meant that brasero-cdrkit doesn't depend on dvd+rwtools
<pitti> but lucid's brasero did
<mvo> odd that this was unoticed for so long, it seems like its missing since Jul (the first merge)
<pitti> well, what's a CD?
<pitti> USB sticks FTW :)
<mvo> haha, true
<mvo> shows how the world has changed
<pitti> mvo: brasero-cdrkit promoted to main
<mvo> pitti: nice, thanks
 * pitti leaves this in mvo's capable hands and goes back to fixing OEM stuff
<mvo> I add dvd+rwtools as a recommend sand upload
<mvo> thanks for your help/time pitti
<pitti> if dvd+rwtools is still being used, that sounds good
<pitti> mvo: and you'll add brasero recommends: -cdrkit?
<mvo> yeah
<mvo> either that or seeding, I don't have a preference
<mvo> recommends is fine
<pitti> I think recommends: is better, for derivatives or people without the metapackage
<pitti> or chroots, and whatnot
<mvo> ok
<mvo> makes sense
 * mvo prepares the upload
<pitti> and we need a brasero upload anyway
<mvo> oh, what for?
<pitti> mvo: I thought you wanted to add the dvd+rwtools dependency?
<mvo> I just checked, it gets in via the libbrasero-media1 dependency
<mvo> but stil, the derivates argument makes sense
<pitti> ah
<mvo> hey glatzor! thanks for your sessioninstaller merge \o/
<glatzor> thanks for your patchm mvo!
<didrocks> pitti: I'm interested in your opinion on bug #645561
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 645561 in gnome-keyring (Ubuntu) "gnome-keyring prompts lack way to set default timeout (affects: 2) (heat: 14)" [Undecided,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/645561
<didrocks> maybe reverting to seahorse-plugins for this release for GPG key is the solution
<didrocks> (as mdeslaur suggested)
<chrisccoulson> hi didrocks
<didrocks> hey chrisccoulson, how are you?
<chrisccoulson> did you have a chance to look at the gdk-pixbuf change yet?
<chrisccoulson> i'm good btw thanks :)
<chrisccoulson> how are you?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: not yet, just jumping on it in a few :)
<didrocks> tired ;)
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i feel a bit tired too ;)
<chrisccoulson> urgh, the new hamster-applet is really broken
<chrisccoulson> ok, it's pretty much not usable
<didrocks> what? ;)
<chrisccoulson> the new hamster-applet
<didrocks> ahâ¦ (sorry, as just reconnected, no context) :)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: so, what should I do? at least I have a graphical GNOME interface, which means gdx-pixbuf should work :)
<chrisccoulson> when i fill in the "Description" field for a particular task (or even leave it empty), it shows the wrong description in todays list of tasks, and the description seems to change depending on where i put my mouse
<chrisccoulson> so i can't trust that any of the information it's displaying is actually correct ;)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: ahah, some kind of $random in it, sweet!
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, oh, that's good gdk-pixbuf works :-)
<chrisccoulson> could you run gdk-pixbuf-query-loaders through strace, and put the output somewhere for me to look at? :)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: here we go: http://paste.ubuntu.com/499564/
<pitti> didrocks: yes, sounds good to me
<pitti> didrocks: and filing a bug upstream about making the timeout configurable?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks - oh, this commit looks suspicious - http://git.gnome.org/browse/hamster-applet/commit/?h=gnome-2-32&id=4b40e64c536a79329adbd0cae3d17c615f3904e0
<chrisccoulson> i think i might test that and then backport it if it works
<chrisccoulson> i really on the hamster applet ;)
<didrocks> pitti: ok, so removing the conffile for gnome-keyring-gpg.desktop and filing the upstream bug :)
<chrisccoulson> didrocks - ok, that output looks fine
<chrisccoulson> i think it's good to go :)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: ok, great t;)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: needs sponsoring for that one?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, yes please
<chrisccoulson> i can't upload that yet ;)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: ok, doing then :)
<chrisccoulson> thanks. i'll get ia32-libs done then, once that's been approved
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: great, setting it as fix commited
<chrisccoulson> thanks
<didrocks> thank to you :)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: so, there is nothing do to on ia32-libs?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks - i need to refresh ia32-libs with the new gdk-pixbuf version, and also add a postinst hook to create the loaders.cache on install
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: ok, keep me in touch ;)
<chrisccoulson> ok, hamster-applet is fixed
<chrisccoulson> will upload that too
<didrocks> great ;)
<didrocks> do you want to work on other bugs too?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks - yeah, sure :)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: I think that one can be interesting to fix (bug #630753)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 630753 in gnome-screensaver (Ubuntu) "gnome-screensaver activates while watching a movie in totem (affects: 2) (heat: 206)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/630753
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i can take that one
<chrisccoulson> i saw that too
<didrocks> thanks :)
<didrocks> maybe totem issue as vlc isn't impacted
<chrisccoulson> VLC uses a different mechanism to do this
<didrocks> oh ok :)
<chrisccoulson> right, i've got to pop out for a little bit to pick up my car :)
<didrocks> see you!
<didrocks> RAOF: can you have a look at your WI list and state on them, please?
<dpm> didrocks, I'm not sure who I should best ask, but you and Robert seemed to do the latest changes for yelp, so here goes the question :)
<dpm> could someone have a look at bug 605577 and remove the en.po translation?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 605577 in yelp (Ubuntu) (and 4 other projects) "Help contents title bar shows cubes with numbers instead of a proper title (affects: 127) (dups: 65) (heat: 830)" [Undecided,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/605577
<dpm> I've explained in my last comment. This will still not fix the bug (we'll need a new full language pack for that), but at least will I think prevent the wrong en.po getting into LP with the next upload
<didrocks> dpm: don't we refresh the full yelp on 2.32.0 upload normally?
<dpm> didrocks, if that's planned, that's fine, that would take care of it
<didrocks> dpm: I mean, take from launchpad, as create this patch
<didrocks> dpm: yeah, next week, we will have 2.32.0
<dpm> ok, cool
<didrocks> I should just add a task to remind me about it :)
<dpm> :)
<didrocks> oh no
<didrocks> sorry, we have 2.30.1
<didrocks> I think it's the webkit transition
<didrocks> so, we wont update
<didrocks> dpm: the best fix it to take from launchpad and refresh the patch?
<didrocks> rather than deleting en.po
<dpm> didrocks, yeah, as it will fetch new translations in other languages people might have done
<didrocks> dpm: think it worthes it, adding a task for me :)
<didrocks> dpm: btw, bug #619816
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 619816 in gnome-power-manager (Ubuntu) (and 1 other project) "Battery status line too long (affects: 2) (dups: 1) (heat: 20)" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/619816
<dpm> awesone, thanks didrocks
<dpm> ok, let me have a look
<didrocks> dpm: not sure it will be accepted or not, still didn't ask, but maybe it worthes it
<dpm> didrocks, ok, commented on it, thanks for the pointer
<didrocks> thanks dpm :)
<doko> who can tell me something about the libindicator uploads?
<doko> is it correct to demote libindicator-tools  ?
<didrocks> doko: I think you should ask tedg about it when he's around
<doko> didrocks: could you remind me/ask him?
<didrocks> doko: yeah, I will
<doko> thanks
<didrocks> yw
<didrocks> dpm: can you join #ayatana?
<dpm> yep!
<didrocks> thanks :)
<didrocks> tedg: hey
<didrocks> 14:51:24          doko | is it correct to demote libindicator-tools  ?
<didrocks> tedg: ^^
<tedg> didrocks, What does "demote" mean in this context?
<tedg> Oh, to universe?
<tedg> I don't think there's any reason those need to be in main.  They're just debugging tools.
<tedg> doko, ^
<doko> tedg: ok, thanks!
<didrocks> yeah, it's my feeling as well :)
<kamstrup> dpm, we have a problem with https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu-translations/+bug/646653
<didrocks> thanks tedg
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 646653 in unity (Ubuntu) (and 2 other projects) "The number of items message in the Unity trash does not load translations (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Critical,Triaged]
<kamstrup> dpm, it's getting late and I can not for the life of me figure out why ngettext() isn't working
<kamstrup> dpm, So my last resort is to change the string into something without nggettext()
<dpm> hey kamstrup, does gettext() work there?
<kamstrup> dpm, So either (if n_items == 1) _("1 Item in trash") else _("%d items in Trash") - and pretend plural forms don't exist
<kamstrup> dpm, yes
<kamstrup> dpm, or simply "Items in trash: %d" - which seems a bit awkward
<kamstrup> dpm, what's your take on this?
<dpm> kamstrup, I think it might be awkward, but at this point it might be the best solution as the if/else option would only work for some languages
<kamstrup> dpm, ok will do that then - should I notify the mailing list?
<dpm> kamstrup, yes, please, that would be great
<dpm> kamstrup, and thanks a lot for the work on this
<dpm> didrocks, the conversation on the g-p-m time string has reminded me about bug 579134 - I know it's too late, but it might be worth reassessing the importance, as per pitti's comment there, so that it stays on the radar for natty perhaps
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 579134 in indicator-datetime (Ubuntu) (and 2 other projects) "The date and time indicator should respect the locale setting for time format (affects: 23) (dups: 2) (heat: 126)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/579134
<pitti> dpm: ugh, does that thing still display 12 hours only? :-(
<dpm> pitti, I think there was a workaround to use a translatable string to specify the format, but I haven't tried it yet, as we haven't finished translating it in our team
<dpm> I might try with another locale
<pitti> dpm: but that's rather broken -- that's already specified in the locale
<dpm> pitti, I know, I know, I'm just mentioning it
<geser> pitti: what do you expect from "A very, very simple clock"?
<pitti> I understand that we don't want to use strftime(%c), but we can certainly ask the locale for whether it's 24 or 12 hours, and the AM/PM strings
<didrocks> dpm: can you remind me that later? It's one of the blocker I set to not put indicator-datetime to the desktop this cycle
<pitti> geser: to at least show the correct time? :-)
<dpm> didrocks, sure
<pitti> tedg: ^ WDYT about just asking the locale for the format?
<geser> pitti: 50% of a day it's correct :)
<tedg> pitti, I couldn't find a way to ask it that simple of a question.  But, what we do is make the default string translatable.
<pitti> geser: only if you work from 6 to 18, which is not quite the most preferred part of the day for geeks..
<tedg> pitti, There's also a gsettings key for those who don't like their locale's setting.
<rickspencer3> good morning all
<pitti> tedg: so from a shell this would be "locale -k am_pmÃ
<pitti> hey rickspencer3
<pitti> tedg: of course you'd use the libc function for that, but if it has a value, it shows the localized strings for AM and PM; if it's not set, it's 24 hours
<pitti> tedg: with that we can use the info from the locales, instead of having to re-translate them all over agani (which is also quite error prone)
<didrocks> hey rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> hi didrocks
<mterry> tedg, pitti, dpm: I remember looking at that bug.  I think one problem I had was that en_GB doesn't translate the string to say 24 hour time.  Also, stfrtime can give you the time in locale format, but it has seconds attached, and there's no clean way to strip that
<pitti> mterry: right, that's why I suggested asking the locale instead of strftime()
<pitti> mterry: but en_GB uses 12 hours?
<mterry> pitti, no?  I thought not.  I've used it in the past to show 24h
<mterry> pitti, this is complicated.  language-support says en_GB is 24h.  with LC_TIME="en_GB.UTF-8", date --date="8PM" gives 20:00:00.  But locale -k am_pm shows am_pm="AM;PM"
<pitti> mterry: oh, indeed; seems I misremembered
<mterry> pitti, I think locale -k is lying?
<pitti> apparently so
<pitti> mterry: I just checked the locale source, and it sets it to empty
<mterry> pitti, so currently indicator-datetime is 12h for en_GB but should be 24h if someone would add that translation
<mterry> pitti, sets am_pm to empty?
<pitti> right, which means "24 hours"
<pitti> so date can interpret it correctly, just locale -k shows it wrong
<mterry> pitti, odd.  Is there another way of asking?
 * pitti checks
<mterry> pitti, is there a library that 'locale' and 'date' are using?  What's the lowest level way besides scraping the locale files?
<pitti> glibc
<pitti> <locale/langinfo.h>
<mterry> pitti, so nl_langinfo ?
<pitti> right; I used that in the past for something different
 * mterry waits for giant glibc manual to load
 * pitti writes a quick test program
<mterry> pitti, actually, strftime %p seems like it gives the info we need.  Empty string means 24-hour, else it gives AM or PM
<pitti> mterry: hm, nl_langinfo() gives me the same as locale -k
<pitti> mterry: ah, good
<mterry> pitti, hrm, it doesn't work for en_GB when I do date +%p
<mterry> pitti, gives me AM
<pitti> same nl_langinfo() presumably
 * pitti RTFS in glibc
<mterry> pitti, which argument to langinfo did you use?  I see three relevant ones: T_FMT_AMPM, AM_STR, and PM_STR
<pitti>     printf ("T_FMT: '%s', T_FMT_AMPM: '%s', AM_STR: '%s', PM_STR: '%s'\n",
<pitti>             nl_langinfo (T_FMT), nl_langinfo (T_FMT_AMPM),
<pitti>             nl_langinfo (AM_STR), nl_langinfo (PM_STR));
<pitti> mterry: it seems AM_STR and PM_STR aren't a good indicator
<pitti> mterry: they are present in the locale so that you can alternatively use 12 hour format (GB probably had used it in the past)
<mterry> pitti, but T_FMT_AMPM is?  that would work en?
<pitti> mterry: but I think T_FMT_AMPM is better
<pitti> $ LANG=en_GB.utf8 /tmp/timefmt
<pitti> T_FMT: '%T', T_FMT_AMPM: '%l:%M:%S %P %Z', AM_STR: 'AM', PM_STR: 'PM'
<pitti> $ LANG=en_US.utf8 /tmp/timefmt
<pitti> T_FMT: '%r', T_FMT_AMPM: '%I:%M:%S %p', AM_STR: 'AM', PM_STR: 'PM'
<mterry> pitti, (why is this so hard?  :))
<mterry> pitti, oh, but T_FMT_AMPM forces seconds
<pitti> %I is hour (1..12)
<mterry> pitti, one could grep the returned string for %I
<pitti> mterry: I think we should grep for %p or %P
<mterry> pitti, to determine if it's 24h.  /me shudders
<pitti> for de_DE.utf8:
<pitti> T_FMT: '%T', T_FMT_AMPM: '', AM_STR: '', PM_STR: ''
<pitti> (we don't use 12 hour format, ever)
<pitti> i. e. it'll just be empty
<pitti> so it seems T_FMT_AMPM =~ '%[pP]' is a good indicator
<mterry> pitti, but en_GB has %p and should be 24h
<mterry> pitti, wouldn't %I be better?
<pitti> mterry: en_GB has %l there, which confusingly is described as "The  hour  (12-hour clock) as a decimal number (range 1 to 12)"
<mterry> pitti, I think T_FMT_AMPM is also broken for en_GB...?
<pitti> well, no; it looks correct for a time which you request in 12 hour form
<pitti> phone, brb
<mterry> pitti, oh right.  T_FMT_AMPM is inherently non-24h.  I don't get why you care about %p though.  The goal I thought was to find a way to detect that en_GB is 24h.  %p gives a false-negative for that
<pitti> right
<pitti> (phone, brb)
<mterry> pitti, sure, no rush :)
 * pitti chuckles about some h4cks in glibc
<pitti> #  define ampm (L_("AMPM") + 2 * (tp->tm_hour > 11))
<pitti> mterry: so it seems that date +%X gets it correct
<pitti> ooh, of course
<pitti> mterry: T_FMT == '%T' -> 24 hour; T_FMT == '%r' -> AM/PM
<pitti> mterry: the alternative is to just use strftime('%X') and removing seconds
<pitti> the format is predictable, after all
<pitti> (i. e. HH:MM:SS (AM|PM)?
<pitti> but I think using T_FMT is what we actually want
<pitti> and that's what strftime uses for %X
<pitti> #  define ampm (L_("AMPM") + 2 * (tp->tm_hour > 11))
<pitti> oops
<pitti> http://sourceware.org/git/?p=glibc.git;a=blob;f=time/strftime_l.c;h=08c2aeb32be6421cb8075dfae3579da4ee02644a;hb=HEAD#l1177
<pitti> tedg: so, seems we have two alternatives
<mterry> pitti, http://stackoverflow.com/questions/2507726/how-to-display-locale-sensitive-time-format-without-seconds-in-python tells how to remove seconds
<rickspencer3> pitti, hey
<rickspencer3> bug #605577
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 605577 in yelp (Ubuntu Maverick) (and 6 other projects) "Help contents title bar shows cubes with numbers instead of a proper title (affects: 127) (dups: 65) (heat: 830)" [Undecided,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/605577
<rickspencer3> seems lang pack related, and is really ugly
<rickspencer3> pitti, do have a chance to check in and see how we can fix this asap?
<pitti> rickspencer3: I'll have a look ASAP
<rickspencer3> thanks pitti
<chrisccoulson> yeah, it's a broken langpack. i came across the same issue when we updated the language packs in all the other releases for the firefox update
<chrisccoulson> and it got fixed in those
<rickspencer3> chrisccoulson, well, it's really really ugly
<rickspencer3> and very salient
<chrisccoulson> rickspencer3, yeah, it's fairly noticeable
<pitti> mterry: that would bring it to the next level (locale dependent hour/minute separators), but it looks a bit ugly
<chrisccoulson> remote debsign ftw :-)
<chrisccoulson> thanks for the suggestion yesterday pitti ;)
<didrocks> rickspencer3: pitti: will do it on Monday as dicussed on this channel :)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: heh
<chrisccoulson> i can do this whole update whilst only using a few bytes of my own bandwidth :-)
<didrocks> it's just about taking the new LP translations which removes the en.mo
<tedg> pitti, I looked at that, but my concern was whether the format was predictable... I hate the idea of parsing format strings :-/
<pitti> tedg: right; I think checking T_FMT is more robust
<rickspencer3> didrocks, the status on the bug is making robbiew worry
<didrocks> rickspencer3: oh, I can change that
<rickspencer3> perhaps you could update it there when you get a chance?
<didrocks> sure
<pitti> tedg: if it's %T or %r, we know what to do
<didrocks> done
 * robbiew has corrected the settings...so it shows up on our radar ;)
<didrocks> good, should be fixed on Monday, just hadn't the time still :)
<robbiew> no worries
<pitti> dpm: do you already know whether bug 605577 is fixed in the translations?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 605577 in yelp (Ubuntu Maverick) (and 6 other projects) "Help contents title bar shows cubes with numbers instead of a proper title (affects: 128) (dups: 65) (heat: 842)" [Undecided,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/605577
<mterry> didrocks, I swear the top pixel isn't working!
<didrocks> mterry: go hunt and hit njpatel then ;)
<didrocks> mterry: are you in the UNE session?
<mterry> didrocks, yeah
<didrocks> or trying to run it from desktop
<mterry> didrocks, running unity from desktop?
<didrocks> humâ¦ really, I can't reproduce it, I was thinking first your were talking about the other bug :/
<didrocks> mterry: with mutter --replace blablabla :)
<njpatel> mterry, one sec, you need to hit jason
<mterry> didrocks, ah.  I'll bug njpatel to see if that's the best debugging method
<mterry> njpatel, or jason
<DBO> wassup homies
<njpatel> DBO, meet your picking patches biggest fan, mterry
<njpatel> mterry, let him have it
<njpatel> :)
<mterry> DBO, you're jason?  :)
<gord> Its a trap!
<DBO> ITS A TRAP
<DBO> we cannot repel bugs of this magnitude
<DBO> mterry, no
<mterry> DBO, OK, so my top pixel in UNE maverick still doesn't work.  (it works for GtkStatusIcon indicators like NM, but not indicators, window controls, or the logo button)
<mterry> DBO, ok
<DBO> yeah I got that bug report this morning
<DBO> I am looking it over (again) now
<mterry> DBO, any way I can provide debugging stuff?
<DBO> not sure whats wrong since the math all makes sense in my head
 * didrocks updates DBO for getting the missing case
<didrocks> and update the symbol file as well
<DBO> wat?
 * DBO wonders if mterry really thinks he is not Jason
<mterry> DBO, you lied to me?!  Man, I'm too trusting
<DBO> /whois DBO wasn't a clue?
<mterry> DBO, didn't need to, I had your gentleman's word
<DBO> mterry, but you met me in real life
<DBO> you *know* I am not a gentleman
<mterry> DBO, :)
<DBO> little more than a man-child truly
<mterry> DBO, didrocks suggested trying to run mutter from desktop session (not netbook session).  Would that be a useful test?
<didrocks> mterry: no, this was in case you've done that
<DBO> mterry, if you can manage to click the "top pixel" of a window...
<DBO> accurately
<mterry> DBO, nope!
<DBO> I actually wrote a utility for that
<didrocks> sometime, mutter doesn't align very well, when started over compiz (the mouse was aready moved by some offset)
<DBO> yay mouse warp
<bratsche> dpkg-source: error: none of the filenames in ---/+++ are relative in diff `evince-2.31.92/debian/patches/03_gesture.patch' (line 3)
<bratsche> Oops.
<mterry> DBO, but I find it odd that the GtkStatusIcons get it right.  Or should I not be surprised since those are xembeds?
<chrisccoulson> right, i am done with ia32-libs \o/
<DBO> mterry, no surprise
<dpm> pitti, sorry, I was on the phone. re: the yelp bug, I fixed it in LP, it's only that the delta export did not pick up the change (the corrected en.po file), but the full export should. I talked about it with didrocks earlier on, and we should also make sure that the patch with translations from LP in yelp does not contain en.po, otherwise we'd be reimporting it into LP I think
<pitti> dpm: ah, thanks; so the problem is that yelp has some patch with LP-imported translations, and it messes up the encoding along the way?
<dpm> pitti, not exactly. Somehow an en.po file with en@shaw translations was imported into LP. That en.po file was exported in langpacks wreaking havoc in yelp. In addition to that, when adding translations to yelp from LP we also put that en.po translation in the patch. So we should fix this in two places: language packs and yelp
<pitti> dpm: I just don't understand why we manually patch in LP translations to yelp?
<pitti> dpm: but thanks for the heads-up!
<dpm> pitti, because we include some additional Ubuntu-specific strings to the documentation. I understand that that's the only way to use those translations. I think it's "Assistive Technologies" and something else perhaps (in the main index page shown when starting yelp)
<pitti> dpm: ok; I'll probably talk to you on Monday about this
<dpm> pitti, sure, but I'm away on Monday and back on Tuesday, but in the meantime seb128 should also be aware of the yelp-patching part (most probably better than me)
<dpm> and didrocks too
<didrocks> pitti: I've already done that for 2 or 3 release, not sure why yelp need manual translation, right
<didrocks> pitti: new gnome-keyring to fix the gpg issue uploaded btw
<chrisccoulson> thanks to whoever approved ia32-libs already :-)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: oh? it's done?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks - yeah, it was approved a couple of minutes after uploading it
<chrisccoulson> right, totem next
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: thanks! ;)
<cyphermox> didrocks, I'm able to fix 575160 by using the in-tree cairo, about to push a package to my PPA for testing, but I already have a merge request.
<didrocks> cyphermox: oh nice!
<didrocks> cyphermox: One more bug dead ;)
<cyphermox> hopefully
<cyphermox> didrocks, I'm not sure if it fixes things for lucid though, I'll look in a minute
<didrocks> cyphermox: just keep us updated.
<cyphermox> yep
<didrocks> cyphermox: well, focus on maverick, no hurry for lucid I think
<chrisccoulson> cyphermox, did any other distro's switch to in-tree cairo too?
<cyphermox> rickspencer3, did you make that wallpaper? if so, nice work on the saturation
<cyphermox> chrisccoulson, looks to me like it's exactly what opensuse did
<didrocks> cyphermox: you bought it? :)
<rickspencer3> cyphermox, no
<rickspencer3> I had a wallpaper, it was a picture of my dog
<cyphermox> didrocks, yeah I did
<rickspencer3> but someone replaced it :/
<cyphermox> aw
<didrocks> urgh :/
<cyphermox> rickspencer3, we have snails, why couldn't we have dogs?
<rickspencer3> well
<rickspencer3> there are dogs, and there is my dog
<rickspencer3> I guess there was concern that the wallpaper would have been considered some kind of act of aggression
<rickspencer3> international incidents ensue
<rickspencer3> etc...
<doko> chrisccoulson: looking at the firefox package, is there a reason that binary packages are still in the control file (the ones which are not built anymore)?
<chrisccoulson> doko - which packages are those?
<chrisccoulson> we cleaned all the transitional packages in maverick, so they should all be gone now
<doko> chrisccoulson: sorry, was looking on the wrong machine
<chrisccoulson> didrocks - a quick look at the error messages from bug 632594 suggests that dbus is not running
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 632594 in xorg-server (Ubuntu) (and 1 other project) "xvfb 1.9 and/or metacity not working on the buildds (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/632594
<chrisccoulson> which makes sense in the buildd ;)
<chrisccoulson> i have similar issues with firefox unit tests too
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: right, I really didn't give a look at it
<chrisccoulson> yeah, me neither. that's just a guess from the error message
<chrisccoulson> but you need dbus to talk to gconf
<didrocks> isn't there this --direct option?
<didrocks> ignore me
<didrocks> I was thinking a testsuite using gconftool
<didrocks> so, if it's only the testsuite which fails, deactivating this part will fix the issue
<chrisccoulson> really, the test-suite needs to start metacity with dbus-launch
<chrisccoulson> but that's pretty hacky
<chrisccoulson> i'd just ignore those warnings tbh ;)
<didrocks> yeah, sounds the safe option :)
<didrocks> dbus + buildd aren't good mate :)
 * cyphermox -> lunch
<pitti> didrocks: upower fix uploaded FYI
<pitti> (I think..)
<didrocks> pitti: are we already Monday?
 * didrocks should have get some rest :)
<pitti> heh
<pitti> didrocks: I'll deal with yelp on Monday
 * didrocks hugs pitti thanks!
<didrocks> pitti: oh, you want to work on it? thanks!
 * pitti does some more queue review and then waves good bye
<didrocks> oO(gnome-keyring, gnome-keyringâ¦)
<didrocks> thanks pitti, enjoy your week-end!
<pitti> didrocks: right, those
<didrocks> :)
<pitti> didrocks: you tested the gnome-keyring update, I figure? i. e. seahorse still works well for gpg?
<didrocks> pitti: running seahorse from yesterday
<pitti> ooh, dpkg-maintscript-helper; nice, it's the first time I see that in production
<didrocks> yeah, it's working well it seems
<didrocks> I tried without changing the content
<didrocks> -> removed
<didrocks> with changing the content
<didrocks> -> renamed :)
<pitti> didrocks: nice, so 2.31.92 does make it configurable already?
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, with gsettings, not sure there is an UI (didn't check yet)
<pitti> ah, gsettings;
<pitti> ok, let's keep seahorse for now
<didrocks> it's desrt's fault :)
<pitti> good night, have a nice weekend everyone!
<didrocks> enjoy pitti
<DBO> mterry, you here?
<mterry> DBO, yup
<DBO> I seriously have my doubts about you being on the right mutter
<DBO> I just cant reproduce the bug
<DBO> top pixel works
<mterry> DBO, 2.31.5-0ubuntu7
<mterry> DBO, did you see that sabdfl reproduced it too?
<DBO> erm sorry latest clutter
<mterry> DBO, libclutter-1.0-0 1.2.12-0ubuntu13
<DBO> I can video it working on my system though I suspect you will take my word it works here
<mterry> DBO, yeah, obvi otherwise there would be a million people complaining.  I'm suspecting it's not a 100% reproducable thing.  (though I can 100% reproduce it)
<mterry> DBO, want video card info?
<mterry> DBO, I'm on some sort of Intel
<DBO> need more than that
<mterry> DBO, :)
<mterry> DBO, Intel Corporation Mobile GM965/GL960 Integrated Graphics Controller
<DBO> GM965 then
 * mterry shrugs
<DBO> wtf then
<DBO> hey do me a favor
<DBO> you are running unity now?
<DBO> send me a screenshot of your desktop
<mterry> DBO, ok
<mterry> DBO, I think I can see the pixel sabdfl was talking about at the top
<DBO> thats what I am worried about
<DBO> I am going to use gimp to find out for sure
<mterry> DBO, in the bug
<DBO> well fuck me sideways
<DBO> the whole thing is offset by a pixel
<DBO> no wonder the top pixel isn't working
<mterry> DBO, :)
<DBO> join me in the dx chat room please
<didrocks> enjoy your week-end :)
<doko> chrisccoulson: ia32-libs: why are the packages not refreshed?
<chrisccoulson> doko - they are refreshed aren't they?
<chrisccoulson> it's picked up the new gdk-pixbuf anyway :/
<doko> chrisccoulson: all?
<chrisccoulson> doko - yeah, everything that was out-of-date has a new version now
<doko> chrisccoulson: sorry, my mistake
<Laney> just seen bug 619003
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 619003 in gdk-pixbuf (Ubuntu) "multiple warnings during installation (affects: 4) (heat: 20)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/619003
<Laney> might be worth a poke
 * chrisccoulson wipes brow
<chrisccoulson> i thought that was because of my upload today ;)
<chrisccoulson> but that bug is quite old
<chrisccoulson> i nearly died there ;)
<Laney> haha
<chrisccoulson> i wouldn't be popular if i broke gdk-pixbuf in time for the weekend
<devildante> mvo: ping
<mvo> hey devildante!
<mvo> devildante: how is it going?
<devildante> hi mvo :) all is fine :)
<devildante> mvo: I just wondered if there are any bugs targeted for fixing in 10.10 in USC or update-manager
<mvo> devildante: there is a nasty race 507836 in s-c
<devildante> bug 507836?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 507836 in software-center (Ubuntu) "[master] software-center crashed with DatabaseModifiedError in _database_gen_postlist_iter() (affects: 89) (dups: 58) (heat: 527)" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/507836
<mvo> devildante: but a bit of triage would be cool, all the stuff with apport traceback is probably worth a look
<devildante> pff, you just said in the comments you fixed it :p
<mvo> no really :)
<devildante> silly me, it's only the UI :p
<mvo> just made the effects go away, the root is still there
<mvo> the "fix" just recovery nicely
<devildante> 'kay :)
<mvo> well, "just" is already good, but fixing the root cause would rock
<mvo> I have no good idea currently :/ but maybe a fresh brain is needed :)
<devildante> so we need some triaging before determining the root?
<mvo> for this bug I think the root is a race condition between the apt-cache-reopen and the xapian-db-rebuilding (or finish rebuilding). if both overlap, the problem appears
<mvo> but a general triage of the bugs in NEW state would be great, I'm sure there are some low hanging ones
<devildante> hmm...
<mvo> (i.e. easy to fix ones, if we get good backtraces from apport)
<devildante> Don't have time, I have to prepare a hugday :p
<mvo> haha
<mvo> excellent
<mvo> on what package is it?
<devildante> Not a specific package, it will be jaunty bugs
<devildante> we "need" to treat these bugs before jaunty goes EOL
<devildante> not really need, but it would be great :)
<mvo> woah
<mvo> cool :)
<devildante> is it that great? :p
<mvo> its cool to do this kind of gardening
<devildante> heh :)
<robbiew> mvo: up late?
<mvo> robbiew: yes
<mvo> robbiew: merging a python-apt fix that looked super-simple and turned out to be not quite-as-simple as anticipated
<robbiew> ah...a common trap in coding ;)
<mvo> lol
<mvo> indeed
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-09-25
<bilalakhtar> Has anyone seen seb here lately?
<vish> bilalakhtar: he is on vacation
<bilalakhtar> vish: why is everyone on vacations right now? The season is over, I suppose
<vish> bilalakhtar: not sure.. ;)
<bilalakhtar> dholbach should come back soon, he is being awaited a LOT
<bilalakhtar> The sponsoring overview is down for almost 2 weeks now
<ari-tczew> bilalakhtar: http://people.ubuntu.com/~bdrung/sponsoring/
<ari-tczew> temporary sponsoring overview by bdrung_
<bilalakhtar> bdrung_: Thanks for that, and ari-tczew, same to you !
<bdrung_> bilalakhtar: np, it took me only a half hour to find the right fix for the sponsoring overview
<bilalakhtar> bdrung_: What was it?
<bdrung_> bilalakhtar: a merge proposal that targets debian. the sponsor overview tried to get the series from the ubuntu distro instead of debian distro.
<bilalakhtar> oh, so it resulted in errors, I suppose
<bdrung_> bilalakhtar: it crashed and that's the reason why the official page is not updated
<bilalakhtar> hmm
<bilalakhtar> and dholbach deserted it in that condition :(
<kklimonda> well, people are entitled to vacations from time to time.
 * devildante likes the transparent borders of not focused windows
<devildante> whoever did that, I thank him :)
<vish> devildante: screenshot?
 * vish doesnt use defaults and often not easy to notice changes ;p
<devildante> vish: http://imgur.com/CF5Eu.png
<devildante> makes you want to use the default now :p
<vish> devildante: huh! thats such an old trick ;p
<vish> devildante: you could always change the metacity opacity for a very long time.. its been used since dust themes came ;)
<devildante> ah
<devildante> but it's by default now, so it's even more awesome :)
<vish> :)
<vish> devildante: is that cairo-dock there? ;)
<devildante> vish: docky :)
<vish> pff ;p
<devildante> IMO, cairo-dock is too much configurable, and you get lost easily
<vish> yea, its easy to get lost..
<vish> devildante: but you can never find two identical cairo-docks.. atleast i havent yet seen two similar docks ;)  and most of the new docks just take features from it..
<devildante> It's not the first one to implement a new feature which is better ; you must implement it well
<bcurtiswx> i <3 docky
<vish> haha! its done well, but people dont notice it much ;p
<devildante> yay bcurtiswx
<vish> simpletons ! ;p
<devildante> IMO (again), docky is THE competitor to apple's dock, this because of its simplicity, and because it's just better [/troll]
<bcurtiswx> http://imgur.com/rY5ne.jpg :D
<OwaisL> Yes, it's better than mac dock
<bcurtiswx> noone likes my epically awesome wallpaper? :(
<OwaisL> haha
<devildante> bcurtiswx: very great
<OwaisL> check mine: http://i.imgur.com/D1Gd2.png
 * bcurtiswx puts on sunglasses for that bright thing :P
<vish> bcurtiswx: hehe! ranting on the default wallpaper eh? ;p
<devildante> bcurtiswx: you shouldn't do that, the default wallpaper is GREAT :)
<bcurtiswx> haha, nah, i'm glad it was "updated"
<devildante> oh come on, mpt just went and he's gone?
 * devildante cries :p
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-09-26
<devildante> mpt: still here? how are you? :)
<mpt> hi devildante
<mpt> I'm awake thinking about fonts
<devildante> haha
<devildante> when will it get available for general testing?
<devildante> I mean the Ubuntu font :)
<mpt> oh, no, not that
<devildante> ah
<mpt> More how we can get the previews from http://fonts.debian.net/ into Ubuntu Software Center's "Fonts" department
<mpt> What are you up to?
<bcurtiswx_> apparently devildante is up to nothing online anymore.. lol
<intellectronica> hya, i have a question pertaining to the netbook ui. is this the best channel to ask or is there one more specific to the netbook editiion (couldn't find one on the wiki)?
<intellectronica> the question, b.t.w, is how can i customize the location of the launcher bar? i like the launcher but hate having it to the left of text windows
<bcurtiswx_> #ayatana if you're talking about the unity interface
<intellectronica> cheers bcurtiswx_
<bcurtiswx_> intellectronica, yw
<hyperair> Amaranth: is there some bugzilla somewhere i can send compiz++ patches to?
<vish> hyperair: using compiz 0.9.x?
<vish> is there a ppa somewhere with that?
<devildante> is there already a schedule for UDS-N?
<hyperair> vish: no, i just compiled it
<vish> hyperair: where is your MOTU-fu? pff ;p
<hyperair> vish: needs time =)
<gambs> ANyone here with expertise in Empathy?
<gambs> Nevermind.
<evildante> mpt: around?
<mpt> yep
<evildante> mpt: I don't see myself in the software-center AUTHORS file :p Can I have an entry there?
<evildante> (if this is not impolite :p)
<mpt> evildante, I don't know. Are you any relation to devildante? ;-)
<devildante> happy now? :p
<mpt> ok, now talk to mvo or e-mail him
<mpt> because I will forget
<devildante> haha
<devildante> thanks :)
<mpt> I'm sorry, I don't think I've seen that file, it's not really my ambit
<devildante> the AUTHORS file in the root of trunk, how dare you not see it? :p
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-09-19
<RAOF> It'd be neat :)
<jbicha> charlie-tca: have you looked to see what edubuntu is doing? I think they only replace the wallpaper but it's at least something
<charlie-tca> jbicha: why does everyone except Unity have to make these things happen by little bits? There really should be a way for any of us to have a custom greeter, instead of just Ubuntu.
<RAOF> Wasn't that what robert_ancell was saying?  You'd make xubuntu-greeter, and the xubuntu-desktop package would install that, and the postinst would frob lightdm-set-defaults?
<charlie-tca> That's what I asked for. Hopefully we can make that happen now
<robert_ancell> can a debian pacakge conflict with something that it provides?  I want to make lightdm-gtk-greeter-config-ubuntu provide lightdm-gtk-greeter-config but not allow any other configuration variant to be installed at the same time
<micahg> robert_ancell: yes
<micahg> robert_ancell: http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-relationships.html#s-conflicts
<robert_ancell> charlie-tca, RAOF, micahg: does this look like it might solve the problem? http://paste.ubuntu.com/692688/
<charlie-tca> micahg: ??
<RAOF> robert_ancell: It wants a Replaces: too, right?
<micahg> robert_ancell: you need a replaces as well, that only lets one at a time be installed (like a mail daemon) as opposed to like the display managers
<robert_ancell> The replaces always confuses me, shouldn't the conflicts be sufficient?
<charlie-tca> robert_ancell: thank you for your efforts
<robert_ancell> I guess it replaces the existing one?
<micahg> robert_ancell: replaces allows one package to replace a file in another package
<robert_ancell> charlie-tca, np, I hate dpkg :)
<RAOF> No; Conflicts tells apt to balk at installing it, Conflics+Replaces has special semantics.
<RAOF> (As does Replaces+Breaks)
<RAOF> Should this fundamentally be a debconf option?
<RAOF> Like the x-display-manager doodad?
<robert_ancell> RAOF, no, because the GTK greeter can't know how many configurations are out there
<robert_ancell> it's like installing gnome-settings-daemon and it asking you "Are you using this with Unity or GNOME or both?"
<micahg> robert_ancell: I'd suggest a file like default.conf in a .d which says which one is in use
<RAOF> Well, the gtk greeter could grow a capability, like what micahg suggested.
<micahg> then a debconf option can write to that file
<RAOF> conflicts/replaces on a configuration file might get weird; I'm not sure.
<RAOF> But you might start to fight dpkg's conffile handling.
<robert_ancell> micahg, do you mean the greeter loads /etc/lightdm/lightdm-gtk-greeter.conf.d?
<RAOF> It would be that the postinst scans /etc/lightdm/lightdm-gtk-greeter.conf.d and presents each of the included files as a possible default, then sets that one.
<micahg> robert_ancell: it could load whatever greeter that /etc/lightdm/lightdm-gtk-greeter.conf.d/default.conf says to
<micahg> or do whatever gdm/lightdm does for its alternatives
<robert_ancell> micahg, that's adding layers on layers.  Why doesn't it just load it's one configuration, and a higher level decides what that should be?
<micahg> robert_ancell: how does lightdm register as the default dm?
<RAOF> You could do that with alternatives; the GL packages do it that way, to provide their appropriate ld.so.conf (among other things).
<RAOF> That's also how plymouth themes work, IIRC.
<RAOF> (Although with plymouth I don't think you're alternitivesing a conffile)
<robert_ancell> micahg, there's a difference between the daemon (lightdm) and the greeters (lightdm-gtk-greeter).  The daemon needs to register with the system to ensure it's the only one on startup, but the greeters are just like applications
<micahg> robert_ancell: I understand, but we can reuse the same principle
<micahg> only allow one at a time to be primary
<micahg> and give users an easy way to switch between them
<micahg> that would absolve the need for extra layers
<robert_ancell> ok, I can confirm having the two packages works with dpkg conffiles behaviour
<robert_ancell> charlie-tca, does bug 845549 make sense?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 845549 in lightdm "Do not ship /etc/lightdm/lightdm-gtk-greeter.conf" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/845549
<smspillaz> RAOF: question, were we planning to merge in my xserver patch this week ?
<RAOF> smspillaz: It's in the xserver git tree.  Does it want to be in before or after beta 2?
<smspillaz> preferably before since it fixes a fairly important bug
<RAOF> (ie: The next upload will have it.  When would you like it ?)
<RAOF> Got a LP handle on that?
<smspillaz> sure, hang on
<RAOF> Hm:  Qt says ?ConfigureWindow window=0x02400010 values={width=65535 height=65535}?.  This is unlikely to end well.
<smspillaz> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/847967
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 847967 in unity "A minimized window 'remains' behind on the desktop if /apps/compiz-1/plugins/unityshell/screen0/options/show_minimized_windows is set to true" [High,In progress]
<smspillaz> RAOF: sounds like a stupid application
<smspillaz> RAOF: interestingly enough, we should be able to handle that case in compiz now (if the server doesn't BadAlloc)
<RAOF> smspillaz: That's bug It's bug #805303
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 805303 in xorg-server "Gtk-CRITICAL **: IA__gtk_widget_style_get: assertion `GTK_IS_WIDGET (widget)' failed with the default qt4 gui" [Critical,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/805303
<smspillaz> except that I haven't had any luck convincing distro to turn support for windows > max texture size on
<RAOF> The server, would you believe it, doesn't particularly like RENDER requests against that window :)
<smspillaz> wow
<smspillaz> yeah I did notice problems with vlc the other day
<RAOF> smspillaz: Doesn't unity break compiz's max texture size support anyway?
<smspillaz> RAOF: sort of
<smspillaz> RAOF: you can still have windows > mts, but not a screen size > mts
<smspillaz> because we didn't get time to implement multiple textures for the framebuffer object
<smspillaz> maybe we can do it as part of this week's bugs
<RAOF> By "Screen size" you mean "Size of a single RandR display", right?
<charlie-tca> robert_ancell: yes, it makes sense to me. Thank you very much.
<smspillaz> RAOF: no, DefaultScreen (dpy)->width/height :)
<RAOF> smspillaz: So, when you say ?sort of?, what you *actually* mean is ?yes, absolutely? :P
<RAOF> Although I guess there may sometimes be a use for a window bigger than the total area of your displays.
<smspillaz> RAOF: nope, I meant sort of
<smspillaz> RAOF: you can have *windows* larger than your maximum texture size
<smspillaz> the total output on your screen will be limited to your max texture size
<smspillaz> however, the plugin which provides support for this is off by default
<RAOF> Correct me if I'm wrong, but the current ?Unity sort of breaks this? means that having multiple displays, where one axis is > max_texture_size, will still catastrophically fail.  Right?
<smspillaz> yes, correct
<RAOF> Turning on that plugin before that's fixed doesn't really seem like a huge win :)
<smspillaz> next cycle we'll make it so that nux's framebuffer objects support binding over multiple textures
<smspillaz> RAOF: well, if some stupid client decides to create a huge window that doesn't hit a BadAlloc then it will work
<RAOF> What will currently happen?
<RAOF> They'll get a blank app window?
<smspillaz> compiz fails to bind the texture and you get a white window
<RAOF> I guess that's something that'd be good to be avoided.
<smspillaz> oh and the decorator will crash since it pixmap type decorations which exceed your maximum texture size are not supported so it will try to switch to the legacy reparenting mode
<smspillaz> except that the legacy mode is ... essentially unmainted
<smspillaz> *unmaintained
<smspillaz> RAOF: also, I found out that xorg-devel is suprisingly higher traffic than I thought
<RAOF> Hah!  Yes.e
<smspillaz> RAOF: I get the impression that you are still somewhere where typing is an inconvenience
<RAOF> No; I'm just bouncing IRC around the world.
<smspillaz> RAOF: oh, still in the states ?
<RAOF> No, just using a different IRC bouncer.
<smspillaz> ah ok
<smspillaz> RAOF: anyways, just came in to poke you about that xserver patch
<smspillaz> :)
<RAOF> Wow.  Is a 65535x65535x32bpp pixmap *really* 16 GB?
<smspillaz> RAOF: 16 GiB more likely
<RAOF> Well, yeah.
<RAOF> smspillaz: Ok.  I'll finish testing the xserver upload, add that bug reference, and upload.
<smspillaz> scwheeeeeeeet
 * smspillaz watches the number of bug reports about "OMG INVISIBLE WINDOWS" skyrocket down
<smspillaz> RAOF: oh for testing purposes
<smspillaz> RAOF: if you have unity compiled from source
<smspillaz> if you run unity/tests/test-input-remover/test-input-remover
<smspillaz> if it complains about a BadValue
<smspillaz> then its not working
<RAOF> Thanks for that!
 * RAOF goes to compile unity from source, and run that against the old xserver.
<smspillaz> well, a BadValue
<smspillaz> then it will hang
<smspillaz> RAOF: err
<smspillaz> RAOF: so you may want to just run the test independently
<smspillaz> compiling unity takes a very long time
<smspillaz> longer than the X server
<smspillaz> so just go into tests/test-input-remover/
<RAOF> Fortunately, dual-core sandybridge i5 + a reasonably fresh ccache ;)
<smspillaz> and then mkdir build ; cd build ; cmake .. ; make ./test-input-remover
<RAOF> Although that sounds easier :)
<smspillaz> RAOF: I'm going to fix that at the sprint
<smspillaz> err UDS
<smspillaz> RAOF: ... you don't want to know the crazy thing I am doing to fix that bug btw :/
<smspillaz> in order to avoid abi breaks in compiz ... I'm fixing the server
<smspillaz> yeah
<smspillaz> we're awesome like that
<RAOF> It *sounds* like your XShaping the window away, and then lying to the clients about it?
<smspillaz> RAOF: sort of
<smspillaz> RAOF: we XShape the input away but disable event generation while we're doing it, since we listen for XShape events ourselves
<smspillaz> but then core needs to know when the XShaping actually happened so that it will update the parent window shape correctly if the client resizes itself while hidden
<smspillaz> so we tell core about the XShaping and ignore any events that come from send_event on our side
<RAOF> Oh, right.  And that's when the client can find out about the XShape change if it wants to.
<smspillaz> well
<smspillaz> it gets the notification twice'
<smspillaz> but its the same notification, so meh
<smspillaz> xsendevent is really dangerous though
<smspillaz> its only ever safe to send events with values that come directly from the x server itself
<smspillaz> I wrote about it on my big braindump on window stacking (http://smspillaz.wordpress.com/2011/09/18/braindump-how-to-get-window-stacking-right/)
<RAOF> This is one of many pieces of the X server I'm blissfully unaware of.
<smspillaz> RAOF: like many other things, XSendEvent is a hack
<smspillaz> the server does no checks whatsoever except on the event type and client message format
<smspillaz> you can send *whatever you like* to a client
<smspillaz> for example, you can send a DestroyNotify to a client saying one of its windows was destroyed
<smspillaz> and the client will probably not know any better
<smspillaz> RAOF: even if a client specifically requested not to receive certain events, you can send them anyways
<RAOF> Fun!
<smspillaz> and the client will still get them
<RAOF> What could possibly go wrong!
<smspillaz> anyways, I need to study for this class
<smspillaz> RAOF: so much possible breakage :/
<smspillaz> apparantly java is being stupid again: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/compiz/+bug/843530
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 843530 in compiz "java6 popup window buttons are obscured in compiz" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<RAOF> Yay!
<jasoncwarner_> hey robert_ancell ... any luck deciphering what is going on with the lag in Unity-greeter?
 * jasoncwarner_ so curious what it could be! :)
<robert_ancell> jasoncwarner_, one of the bug reporters seems to have some indication it might be xrandr related
<robert_ancell> jasoncwarner_, I'll make you a package with gnome-settings-daemon disabled and let's see if that makes a difference
<jasoncwarner_> robert_ancell: ah...ok...send it and I'll give it a shot
<RAOF> Huh.  Does this only happen on Intel systems?  Keith was saying that there's a known-regression in the VGA probing which makes it hugely pessimistic (and where the 1sec stop in X server startup comes from).
<robert_ancell> jasoncwarner_, ok, sent
<robert_ancell> RAOF, people are mentioning intel
<robert_ancell> RAOF, have you ever seen the problem?
<RAOF> Yes.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, can you run your X magic on it to see what the greeter is doing to X?
<RAOF> Also, it seems to correlate with the high Xserver CPU usage during the bootchart.
<RAOF> robert_ancell:  Where can I insert my shim?
<robert_ancell> RAOF, set display-setup-script in SeatDefaults
<robert_ancell> I'm not 100% sure it's working in the current version, but it's worth trying.  It definitely works on the next version
<RAOF> Actually, I could probably just replate /usr/sbin/unity-greeter with a nice little script?
<robert_ancell> RAOF, yes, that would do it
<robert_ancell> RAOF, or edit /usr/share/xgreeters/unity-greeter.deskto
<robert_ancell> RAOF, or edit /usr/share/xgreeters/unity-greeter.desktop
<jasoncwarner_> robert_ancell: got it...be back in a few after testing...
<Sarvatt> RAOF: what system did you see it on?
<RAOF> Sarvatt: Everyone's favourite GM45!
<RAOF> I'm not sure about the sandybridge.
<Sarvatt> oh ok, was going to be confused if you said the e6420 because thats fine here
<Sarvatt> so yet another lenovo to the mix
<jasoncwarner_> hey robert_ancell
<jasoncwarner_> http://paste.ubuntu.com/692730/
<jasoncwarner_> this was noticeably better, actually...there were still moments where input locked for a split second, but overall experience was quite a bit smoother
<robert_ancell> jasoncwarner_, yeah, that looks like it.  So it's something that gnome-settings-daemon is doing, possibly the xrandr interaction with X?
<robert_ancell> this is a *lot* better: [+0.74s] DEBUG: user-list.vala:1248: Rendered first frame
<RAOF> gnome-settings-daemon *does* have a tendency to probe xrandr multiple times; if it's blocking waiting for that, and VGA probe is taking ~1sec, then that could be our candidate.
<jasoncwarner_> robert_ancell: do we lose anything by not having g-s-d starting up there? or did you make it start threaded or something?
<robert_ancell> jasoncwarner_, it's already started in the background (it's another process).  we need it for all the power management, X settings etc
<robert_ancell> RAOF, the unity-greeter logs just seem to show really slow response times from the X server - could g-s-d be blocking the X server with these requests?
<pitti> Good morning
<pitti> tremolux: thanks, will sponsor them
<tremolux> pitti: hey! thanks :)
<pitti> cyphermox: I have no idea what DUID is, I was hoping that cjwatson could review this (as he dealt with IPv6 a bit)
<tremolux> pitti: it's tzdata season ;)
<pitti> tremolux: indeed, and we skipped a few, too
<TheMuso> Morning pitti.
<jbicha> good morning
<jasoncwarner_> morning pitti
<pitti> hey TheMuso, hey jasoncwarner_
<jasoncwarner_> how was the weekend?
<pitti> jasoncwarner_: pretty nice, but a bit trying as well - lots of sightseeing, museums, etc. with my in-laws :)
<pitti> RAOF: do you plan to update gnome-color-manager from 3.1.2 to 3.1.91?
<pitti> jbicha: do you want to update gnome-shell, or shall I look into this?
 * pitti grabs anjuta for now
<pitti> RAOF: ah right, I noted on the pad: it needs colord 0.1.12, do we want that in oneiric?
<jbicha> pitti: gshell needs caribou
<pitti> ah
<jbicha> it doesn't require caribout to actually work, just that it's installed :-)
<RAOF> pitti: If something needs colord 0.1.12 I can do that; it's pretty bugfixy.
<RAOF> It's pretty much ready to go for Debian already.
<pitti> RAOF: the new g-color-mgr does, yes
<RAOF> robert_ancell: Oh, hey!  Unity-greeter does some fallback detection now?
<robert_ancell> RAOF, no?
<RAOF> robert_ancell: Then why is it (a) authenticating as a DRI2 client, and (b) grabbing the list of GL extensions supported?
<robert_ancell> RAOF, oh, it runs the nux tester in the background to save time when logging in
<RAOF> Ah, ok.
<pitti> TheMuso: for bug 836798, would it be possible to somehow make at-spi and at-spi2 coexist?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 836798 in at-spi2-atk "natty to oneiric upgrade failed: Could not perform immediate configuration on 'python-pyatspi2'" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/836798
<pitti> TheMuso: I guess porting the remaining at-spi apps to 2 is not viable for oneiric, or is it?
<TheMuso> pitti: Not viable no. Most of the at-spi v1 and v2 stacks are co-installable, we just need a way to remove at-spi v1 off eople's systems unless they use apps that are not part of the default install.
<pitti> TheMuso: the cleanup can't be enforced with a Breaks:/Conflicts: while we still have rdepends
<pitti> but cleaning up doesn't matter so much, update-manager will deal with that once they go to universe
<pitti> TheMuso: but I thought the two packages shared a file?
<TheMuso> pitti: Right, I see that now, so we're going to have to remove all breaks/confclits from at-spi2-core and libatk-adaptor, and remove at-spi v1 another way
<TheMuso> pitti: pyatspi is the only package that shares a file.
<pitti> TheMuso: right, so we need to solve that one
<TheMuso> And pyatspi's API has not changed.
<TheMuso> so orca for example can use pyatspi for v1 or v2.
<pitti> TheMuso: can you work on that today/tomorrow, so that we can get working upgrades to b2?
<pitti> oh, nice
<TheMuso> pitti: Yes I can upload fixes today for those.
<TheMuso> But the issue of old at-spi on user's systems still remains.
<pitti> TheMuso: see above: once they go to universe, u-m will clean them up
<TheMuso> oh ok
<pitti> but as they are (or will be) co-installable anyway, having them on the system sohuldn't break anything?
<TheMuso> So its only at-spi2-atk that needs to be fixed, will do that now.
<pitti> TheMuso: do libatk-adaptor and at-spi share any files, like /usr/lib/gtk-[23].0/modules/libatk-bridge.so ?
<pitti> but if they are compatible, then I guess libatk-adaptor can just replaces: at-spi, and then the new one will be used
<TheMuso> pitti: Oh yes of course. libatk-adaptor and at-spi share /usr/lib/gtk-2.0/modules/libatk-bridge.so
<pitti> TheMuso: that was my question -- if libatk-adaptor takes over that one, will at-spi still work?
<TheMuso> pitti: no
<pitti> TheMuso: does the file name need to be exactly that? or could it be called libatk-bridge-2.so?
<TheMuso> pitti: It could be called something else, but then we would need to add extra code to unity to support 2 different modules./
<TheMuso> And gnome-shell/clutter as well.
 * pitti checks rdepends of at-spi: gok, dasher, python-pyatspi, and python-strongwind
<pitti> TheMuso: i. e. mainly gok and dasher; do either of these have GNOME 3 versions or replacements?
<TheMuso> pitti: gok is no longer maintained and is replaced by Caribou, however I don't think thats packaged yet.,
<TheMuso> As for dasher, its still maintained, but I am not sure if it has any code upstrea to support at-spi v2 yet.
<pitti> it's being packaged, but not yet in oneiric
<TheMuso> ok
<pitti> TheMuso: could we change gok and dasher to look for /usr/lib/gtk-2.0/modules/libatk-bridge-atspi.so instead?
<pitti> TheMuso: and rename the module in the old at-spi package?
<pitti> TheMuso: then the breaks:/replaces can become versioned
<TheMuso> pitti: Its not up to those apps to load the atk module. The atk module is usually dealt with by gtk itself
<TheMuso> either via GTK_MODULES env variable or gnome-settings-daemon taking care of it these days
<pitti> TheMuso: oh, I thought you said you needed to change unity/shell etc. to look for a changed name
<TheMuso> pitti: Yes, because unity and gnome-shell do not use GTK for some of their bits, i.e unity uses nux/compiz, and shell uses clutter.
<TheMuso> So they have to load the module manually.
<pitti> TheMuso: so if we rename the old module instead, would that be any simpler?
<TheMuso> I don't think so, because we would still need code in shell/unity to support the different module name, because if a user still wants to use gok/dasher, they need to use the entire older stack.
<broder> RAOF, robert_ancell: i've seen symptoms in the past where an xrandr doing an actual probe will cause the entire UI to hang
<broder> primarily on intel systems, though occasionally on other drivers
<pitti> TheMuso: hm; so it seems to me we need to push for caribou to get into oneiric, and we need to drop dasher?
<TheMuso> pitti: I don't know about dahser, I believe people still use it...
<pitti> as the stacks seem to be fundamentally not co-installable then
<TheMuso> dasher
<TheMuso> Or, we could disable dasher's at-spi support, because afaik its an optional extra.
<pitti> right, but unless we can find a way to make them co-installable, there's not much point having rdepends to the old one
<pitti> ah, if it's still useful with that, sure
 * TheMuso checks that to be sure
<RAOF> robert_ancell: http://paste.ubuntu.com/692763 is available for your ponderance, if you wish.  It's a unity-greeter with xtrace running with CLOCK_MONOTONIC timestamps.  http://paste.ubuntu.com/692764 is the accompanying Xorg.0.log; it looks a lot like the ~500ms stutters in X protocol timestamps correspond to the EDID probing in the Xorg.0.log, but unity-greeter (or anything it spawns) does not seem to be doing a lot of XRandR calls.
<TheMuso> pitti: Ok got a build of dasher here with at-spi disabled.
<TheMuso> So dasher can still be used sans at-spi.
<DBO> ping RAOF
<RAOF> DBO: Pong
<DBO> this week
<DBO> the nvidia bug
<DBO> must die
<DBO> do you have *any* theories on how we might accomplish this task?
<RAOF> Didn't you have an incantation like ?recreate all the FBOs? to make it work?
<RAOF> Failing anything else, you *could* check for the existence of the NV-GLX extension and just /restart Unity/ when recieving the "resumed" signal!
<RAOF> That's totally ugly, but better than the alternative.
<RAOF> And has the advantage of not messing things up for !nvidia.
<pitti> TheMuso: nice! so do we have a plan now? drop the breaks: to fix upgrades for b2, and finish the caribou packaging to get a gok replacement?
<pitti> jbicha: ^ does that seem realistic?
<didrocks> good morning
<RAOF> DBO: Would I be correct in assuming that it'd be a huge pain in the arse to tear down your GL context on resume and rebuild it? :)
<pitti> bonjour didrocks, ca va? had a nice weekend?
<DBO> RAOF, yes
<DBO> I did rejigger the FBO's on resume
<DBO> no help
<didrocks> guten morgen pitti. I'm fine thanks. Was the week-end with all monuments opened to the public, so some nice walk in the city (and too much great Lyon's food ;)). And you?
<RAOF> DBO: Oh, that's right.  That _used_ to work, but now doesn't?
<DBO> actually we're not sure what happened
<DBO> didrocks, how did you weekend go?
<jbicha> do people depend on gok instead of onboard? because caribou standalone tries to place the keyboard next to text input
<TheMuso> pitti: SOunds good to me, and I'll upload dasher sans at-spi support.
<didrocks> DBO: was nice, thanks, how was yours? (you shouldn't be working, still on week-end for you BTW :p)
<jbicha> which doesn't work for Firefox or full-screen terminals so caribou may be a bit rough
<TheMuso> jbicha: Well we already use onboard as the primary OSK.
<DBO> didrocks, I want to know how the compiz testing went for you :)
<TheMuso> So I tink only people who really need it will use it.
<pitti> didrocks: heh, similar; we had our parents as guests since Thursday, so we did long city/sightseeing/museum tours
<RAOF> DBO: I was sure you had done some experimentation on how to make things work :/
<didrocks> DBO: I didn't get any weird stacking issue (but I didn't get a lot of issues before). I didn't take latest c-p-m though
<pitti> brb, breakfast
<jbicha> TheMuso: right, I was just wondering if gok was popular or if people were more or less content with onboard
<DBO> RAOF, I did
<TheMuso> jbicha: TO be honest, I haven't heard either way, but I know onboard is used.
<DBO> RAOF, I was sure recreating them worked last cycle
<DBO> it doesn't this time
<TheMuso> Haven't heard anyone using gok recently
<DBO> thats all I know
<DBO> didrocks, so PPA today?
<didrocks> DBO: yeah, I saw some new branches proposed for merging though by smspillaz, is there a new tarball needed?
<DBO> you should ask him I guess
<jbicha> pitti: yes, gok has been abandoned upstream so we could drop it & hope that caribou starts working again
<smspillaz> didrocks: DBO no new tarball needed
<smspillaz> that's just other stuff I was hacking around with
<DBO> smspillaz, excellent
<DBO> didrocks, roll that shit up :)
<didrocks> smspillaz: I heard about the new c-p-m is needed for a change in the animation plugin, is that true?
<DBO> yes
<didrocks> smspillaz: FYI, we rollbacked the ABI number change you did as it wasn't needed and we don't want free ABI bump at this stage
<smspillaz> didrocks: no problem
<didrocks> smspillaz: I guess robert carr checked that, but can I have your +1 as well that the window ws switcher change is in the new c-p-m as well?
<didrocks> smspillaz: (and finally, cherry on the top, can I get the latest rev commit id from where you make dist? I didn't get them and I prefer that than a date for versionning the package)
<DBO> didrocks, thank you sir for your efforts today
<DBO> goodnight :)
<smspillaz> didrocks: from cpm or core ?
<didrocks> DBO: yw! have a good night :)
<didrocks> smspillaz: both :-)
<smspillaz> ok
<RAOF> smspillaz: Is your unity fix for 847967 in the archive?
<didrocks> smspillaz: (and +1 on cpm containing the ws switcher change?)
<smspillaz> RAOF: yes
<didrocks> smspillaz: if so, please change the bug status to fix released for every components
<RAOF> smspillaz: Why is the bug not set to ?Fix Released? then, and why does it not appear to work?
<smspillaz> RAOF: it doesn't work ?
<smspillaz> that's nice
<smspillaz> RAOF: does the test result in a BadValue ?
<RAOF> smspillaz: test-input-remover works fine; unity still really hates minimising.
<smspillaz> :/
<smspillaz> RAOF: is this with the version you've compiled ?
<smspillaz> since it works fine here
<RAOF> smspillaz: This is with the version of unity that's in the archive.
<smspillaz> *shrug* ok, maybe it isn't in the archive
<RAOF> Which is why I first asked "is the fix for unity in the archive" :)
<smspillaz> didrocks: when was unity last updated ?
<didrocks> smspillaz: as usually, Thursday evening
<RAOF> Because there's not much point fixing the X server for beta2 if unity isn't fixed.
<smspillaz> RAOF: can you try compiling unity from source and see if you still get the problem ?
<didrocks> smspillaz: can I get the revisions please and the confirmation I'm asking?
<smspillaz> didrocks: yes yes, just give me a minute
<didrocks> (if the bug status was changed when the fix has been in, we would know for sure if it's in the archive or notâ¦)
<RAOF> :)
<smspillaz> right, it's more a matter of, I can't remember when I actually merged in the fix for that
<smspillaz> RAOF: can you compile from source and check? I need to know whether it's broken or not in the archive
<didrocks> smspillaz: hence why I remind everyone for the past 10 month to set the bug as "fix committed" once merging it
<smspillaz> if it's broken, well then painful times ahead for me
<RAOF> smspillaz: Yup.  Building now.
<smspillaz> thanks
<smspillaz> didrocks: I need to resync the cpm branch, once that's done I'll get you the revids
<didrocks> smspillaz: ok thanks, and please check that the tarball have the ws switcher change
<smspillaz> didrocks: did they not have it last time ?
<didrocks> smspillaz: not sure what is "last time", just a question if the latest tarball you rolled on Thursday evening contains the ws switcher changed we distro-patch in ubuntu
<smspillaz> didrocks: yes, it contains it
<didrocks> RAOF: smspillaz: easier than recompiling unity, looking at the trunk:  http://paste.ubuntu.com/692796/
<didrocks> this is since last release
<didrocks> smspillaz: thanks for the info!
<didrocks> seems the smspillaz's branch is indeed released
<smspillaz> great
<smspillaz> RAOF: which windows does it not work with ?
<RAOF> smspillaz: gedit
<smspillaz> ok
<smspillaz> I'll recompile my x server and see what's happening then
<smspillaz> since it got clobbered by the last dist-upgrade I did
<RAOF> Or, rather more specifically, *maximised* windows.
<pitti> TheMuso: sorry, rejecting at-spi2-atk; the Replaces: is still necessary, otherwise dpkg will break on the file conflict
<pitti> TheMuso: can you please reupload?
<TheMuso> pitti: whoops of course, thanks.
<RAOF> smspillaz: Hm, there also sometimes seems to be some visual corruption left behind; fragments of the minimize animation.
<pitti> smspillaz, RAOF: is the unity task in bug 847967 still relevant?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 847967 in unity "A minimized window 'remains' behind on the desktop if /apps/compiz-1/plugins/unityshell/screen0/options/show_minimized_windows is set to true" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/847967
<pitti> or is it exclusively an X.org workaround?
<RAOF> pitti: This is exactly what we're talking about now :)
<pitti> ah, sorry
<RAOF> There's a mandatory xorg workaround, but Unity also needs a fix.
<pitti> I wonder if we should get this into b2 and accept now
<pitti> i. e. more testing vs. regression potential
<RAOF> Yeah.
<smspillaz> RAOF: it really seems like this branch wasn't merged :/
<pitti> the change looks like a workaround, and it's not obvious to me that it wouldn't break other software?
<smspillaz> RAOF: are you compiling from source ?
<smspillaz> pitti: no, it wont
<RAOF> It's a pretty simple patch, been reviewed upstream, and shouldn't result in changing client-visible protocol.
<RAOF> smspillaz: Yup, I've just built from source.
<pitti> i. e. it essentially disables the 8th bit of the event type; this is kind of a protocol change?
<RAOF> That bit is set by XSendEvent.
<RAOF> Well, I it *does* change the client-visible protocol.  I guess some software *might* rely on the fact that using XSendEvent for some event types will cause an XError, but I can't imagine why :)
<RAOF> So it's a protocol change in that requests which should succeed and previously generated an XError now succeed.
<smspillaz> RAOF: great, it broke again, gosh this thing is fragile
<RAOF> That's just what we want to hear at beta-2!
<smspillaz> who said that minimized window thumbnailing was easy
<RAOF> Ah.  Would I be correct in assuming that having minimised windows when starting unity is still a bad idea?
<smspillaz> ok, so it s broken for me because dpkg epic failed at configuring my server :/
 * smspillaz grabs the source again and recompiles
<RAOF> Or, rather, would I be correct in assuming that you are fully cognisant of the fact that starting unity while there are minimised windows results in those windows being entirely inaccessible?
<smspillaz> RAOF: that should work fine
<RAOF> Ah.  Well, it doesn't.
<smspillaz> RAOF: maybe it's fixed on my local verison
<smspillaz> *shrug* I don't know, we have like a million branches we're working on in parallel
<RAOF> Compiz is *highly* confused; the alt-tab switcher knows that there's a window, but it can't get it, so it presents a big blank window (with the correct title).
<RAOF> Selecting it doesn't raise it, cliciking on the launcher icon does nothing, etc.
<smspillaz> ok, stop complaining and let me look into this please
<RAOF> Wilco.  Give a holler if you'd like some testing.
<ricotz> pitti, good morning
<ricotz> pitti, while using the pre-generated docs for glib, shouldnt the libglib2.0-doc.install use them directly? http://paste.debian.net/plain/130929
 * smspillaz debuilds his xserver again
<smspillaz> RAOF: to double check, you don't have a locally installed old version of unity which doesn't have this fix applied ?
<RAOF> Well, I do have a locally installed unity, but it should be the unity I just built and installed.
<smspillaz> ok
<RAOF> Is there an easy way to check?
<smspillaz> ls ~/.compiz-1/plugins
<RAOF> Yeah, they're all current.
<smspillaz> ok, let me have a look into this
<smspillaz> this is very strange though, since it was working *fine* like 4 days ago
<pitti> ricotz: sorry, I don't understand the question -- it does use dh_install to install them from the source?
<RAOF> smspillaz: Sorry to rain on your parade :/
<RAOF> Bah!  Unity!  Stack the switcher *above* everything else :(
<ricotz> pitti, i mean the libglib2.0-doc.install looks for "installed" docs, not sure why they are got installed after a reconfigure without --enable-gtk-docs
<smspillaz> RAOF: .... we should have merged my stacking fixes branch in last week
<ricotz> pitti, libgtk-3-doc.install is doing it this way like i pastebined
<smspillaz> of course, given the recent trend of events, it will probably fix it for me and nobody else
<rickspencer3> RAOF, hey ...
<RAOF> rickspencer3: Yo yo!
<pitti> ricotz: --enable-gtk-docs was only temporary; it has always been the default, it just temporarily got broken
<rickspencer3> RAOF, I think I'm going to buy a new laptop today
<pitti> ricotz: upstream makefiles actually install the pre-generated docs into /usr/share/ etc. properly
<pitti> hey rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> I was planning to get one with a proprietary graphics chip ... to ahve the "real" user experience
<RAOF> smspillaz: GAHK!  I seem to be pulling from the Ubuntu branch rather than upstream.  Sorry.
<smspillaz> hahahahaahhahahaahahahahahahaaha
<didrocks> RAOF: the stacking issue is not a unity issue, it's a compiz one, waiting for the revids to push that in a ppa
<didrocks> (some fixes)
<RAOF> smspillaz: Building upstream now.
<smspillaz> RAOF: by "upstream" what do you mean ?
<didrocks> RAOF: unity? did you see my comment above?
<smspillaz> unity or compiz ?
<RAOF> smspillaz: Unity, lp:unity.  For the minimise issue.
<didrocks> :/
<didrocks> 08:08:58      didrocks | RAOF: smspillaz: easier than recompiling unity, looking at the trunk:  http://paste.ubuntu.com/692796/
<didrocks> 08:09:09      didrocks | this is since last release
<didrocks> 08:09:11      didrocks | smspillaz: thanks for the info!
<didrocks> 08:09:27      didrocks | seems the smspillaz's branch is indeed released
<didrocks> so, as you can see, there is anything more on top of the latest release from smspillaz's
<ricotz> pitti, i see, so rules should include --enable-gtk-docs again?
<RAOF> Ok.
<rickspencer3> RAOF, sorry, I didn't realize that you guys were talking :/
 * rickspencer3 backs away slowly
<RAOF> rickspencer3: No problem :)
<RAOF> rickspencer3: You were after a recommendation?
<fredp> robert_ancell: you're coming to montreal, great!
<rickspencer3> RAOF, yeah, I wanted to know if I would experience sufficient pain if I bought a new ASUS with radeon graphics
<rickspencer3> I could get a different brand with nvidia
<pitti> ricotz: no, that would cause regeneration of the docs during build, which we don't need
<rickspencer3> oooh, the website advertises that this notebook comes with ...
<rickspencer3> USD ports, I'm getting that one
<RAOF> HAH!
<RAOF> rickspencer3: If you're after maximum pain, make sure you get a muxless system.  Of course, it's easy to determine ahead of time whether it's muxless or not.
<ricotz> pitti, ok, thanks :)
<RAOF> (And by ?maximum pain? I mean that *at best* you'll only be able to drive the external displays with the discrete card, and the laptop panel with the intel chip)
<smspillaz> RAOF: minimization works perfectly here
<RAOF> Ok.  I'll perform a unity --reset and see.
<smspillaz> ok
<smspillaz> I stand corrected
<smspillaz> it works perfecltly except for maximized windows
<rickspencer3> pitti, how does the current desktop image look for doing a fresh install?
<smspillaz> RAOF: ok, so I need to fix the maximized window case
<pitti> rickspencer3: I haven't done a test install with yesterday's daily yet, but I did with one of last week's; should be alright, no uninstallables right now
<smspillaz> RAOF: other than that, I'd say apply this patch
<RAOF> Aaaaaah!  It's probably time to restart the X server; input is now going to invisible windows :)
<RAOF> smspillaz: Is ?I'd say apply this patch? going to be followed with a patch to test? :)
<smspillaz> RAOF: oh as in
<smspillaz> RAOF: you should upload the server with this fix applied
<smspillaz> since there's a small corner case which is causing it to not work for maximized windows
<RAOF> smspillaz: Already done so.
<smspillaz> but my testing shows that it works everywhere else
<smspillaz> RAOF: oh, ok, good :)
<RAOF> pitti: Do you want anymore paperwork before accepting the xserver upload?
<pitti> RAOF: no, I was just asking how you assess the regression potential, and whether the unity task is also valid
<smspillaz> pitti: is there a bug status "mostly fixed" ?
<smspillaz> that would be kinda useful right now
<RAOF> Ok.  I assess the regression potential as minimal; it's a protocol change, but only from "this should work, but doesn't" to "this now works", and the unity task is hella valid :)
<didrocks> the unity task is valid but where it the code it needs?
<smspillaz> oh I see what's going on
<smspillaz> hmm
<didrocks> as no branch link to it
<didrocks> linked*
<pitti> RAOF: ok, tahnks
<didrocks> and in trunk right now, nothing new on that since latest release
<didrocks> pitti: ^
<smspillaz> didrocks: can we take a 1 line distro patch on compiz ?
<didrocks> ah, so there is indeed something missing
<didrocks> smspillaz: in that case, will be better to get today with stacking bugs fixes?
<smspillaz> didrocks: uhhh, weren't people testing them ?
<didrocks> I would tell that stacking bugs seems more important for beta2 than this, isn't it?
<smspillaz> didrocks: sure, although not being able to interact with anything once you minimize a window is also of ... importance
<didrocks> smspillaz: DBO tested locally, I tested locally, I'm still waiting for your rev ids to push to a ppa
<smspillaz> right
<smspillaz> that
<didrocks> but it's only the 5th time I ask for the last hour :)
<smspillaz> I'm kinda hoping I didn't interrupt my cpm resync while I was testing this
<didrocks> smspillaz: just telling that if we want a new compiz, maybe packing both fixes
<didrocks> smspillaz: you can still giving me the compiz core first
<didrocks> give*
 * smspillaz runs the script again just to be sure
<smspillaz> didrocks: so do you want the compiz rev *with* the stacking fix merged in or *without* it ?
<didrocks> smspillaz: with, what corresponds to the latest tarballs you gave me
<didrocks> better than a "ubu1" you tagged which has no meaning
<smspillaz> didrocks: 2805
<didrocks> smspillaz: building
<didrocks> will poke dbarth to get the bug #
<smspillaz> gosh unity panel service is chatty
<smspillaz> makes debugging painful
<robert_ancell> fredp, sure am
<smspillaz> didrocks: cpm is rev 27
<didrocks> smspillaz: ok, thanks, and from what I heard there is an API addition in core needed by cpm, right?
<and471> hey mpt
<smspillaz> didrocks: nope
<didrocks> smspillaz: ah, rrcarr was wrong, was nice to ask them :)
<didrocks> then*
<smspillaz> the api change is needed by the composite plugin but that's in core itself
<jasoncwarner_> didrocks , this music lens feels like it does non-obvious things. Took me a minute to figure out what it was doing when I was clicking on a track after searching
<jasoncwarner_> didrocks: and when I click on 'available for purchase', nothing seems ot happen at all...
<didrocks> jasoncwarner_: indeed, only searches "work" for now
<didrocks> smspillaz: ok, great!
<jasoncwarner_> didrocks: oh!
<didrocks> jasoncwarner_: and seems they merged new icons asset in trunk for it, I'll track them to file an UIFe again (grrr at merging in trunk before the UIFe is acked, even *asked*)
<jasoncwarner_> didrocks: who is "they" in the above?
<didrocks> jasoncwarner_: seems to be lamalex
<jasoncwarner_> didrocks: ok...thanks...
<didrocks> smspillaz: dh_install: compiz-plugins-main-default missing files (debian/tmp/usr/*/compiz/*animation.*), aborting
<didrocks> smspillaz: no more animation plugin in cpm?
<rodrigo_> morning
<seb128> hi desktopers
<chrisccoulson> hi seb128, how are you?
<rodrigo_> hey seb128, had good vacation?
<didrocks> salut seb128, bonnes vacances?
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson rodrigo_
<seb128> lut didrocks
<didrocks> hey rodrigo_, chrisccoulson
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: nice work on the metacity patch btw :)
<seb128> yeah, I had a nice week off
<seb128> how did the week go for you guys?
<rodrigo_> hi didrocks, chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hey didrocks
<seb128> where do we stand for beta2 and with the freeze?
<chrisccoulson> looks like my gtk patch is good too - (gnome bug 659241)
<ubot2> Gnome bug 659241 in gtk "GtkPaned initially allocates space for separator, even if there is only one child" [Normal,Unconfirmed] http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=659241
<seb128> I see that pitti worked yesterday to do some updates
<pitti> hey seb128, bonjour
<pitti> seb128: enjoyed your holidays?
<seb128> hey pitti, how are you?
<seb128> pitti, yes, very much, thanks
<pitti> seb128: yeah, I updated everything to .92 which got released already (not much yet)
<seb128> I enjoy less the email backlog after a week though :p
<pitti> seb128: pretty well, thanks! just had a long weekend with my in-laws; we did a lot of sightseeing and museums
<seb128> is there any work we should land earlier? I will probably delay emails to after updates
<pitti> and we watched the European Championship qualification game between Germany and Switzerland on Sunday, in the stadium here
<pitti> was my first time in a soccer stadium, quite exciting!
<seb128> nice ;-)
<seb128> there was quite some sport this w.e
<pitti> seb128: nothing that I can see; vala is uploaded, gtkmm3.0 needs fixing upstream for the gtk font selector API change (i. e. current release FTBFS), pygobject packaged in Debian, but not appropriate for beta (breaks some stuff)
<seb128> rugby world cup, tennis davis cup, football, basket ball european championship game
<smspillaz> didrocks: ???
<smspillaz> didrocks: err, that's ... weird
<seb128> pitti, ok
<didrocks> smspillaz: this is with the cpm tarball
<pitti> seb128: and I updated gtk+ to the latest git head on Thursday; I hope there won't be too many changes in today's release compared to that
<rodrigo_> seb128, yes, sorry about the French loss in the basketball final :)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: great on you gtk patch :)
<pitti> seb128: I'm currently working on the two retracer crashes
<seb128> rodrigo_, we lost in tennis as well, damn you spanishes
<pitti> seb128: the dup checker has quite a serious bug
<smspillaz> didrocks: the one that I gave you last week ?
<seb128> pitti, ok
<rodrigo_> seb128, oh, didn't know that
<pitti> seb128: btw, I got rid of the consolidation step entirely, it's now done on each visited bug individually
<didrocks> seb128: well, I didn't hear about any else :-)
<pitti> seb128: so it now does the right thing wrt. marking regressions again
<pitti> (or will again, once I fix that bug)
<didrocks> smspillaz: no "animation" in the plugins/ folder in cpm
<smspillaz> didrocks: which tarball are you looking it. There's one here
<smspillaz> https://chinstrap.canonical.com/~smspillaz/releases/0.9.5.94ub1/
<smspillaz> compiz-plugins-main_0.9.5.94ub1.orig.tar.gz
<smspillaz> I just checked now, that's got the animation plugin in it
<didrocks> smspillaz: hum, this one wasn't the one, it was the one in tarballs-oneiric-0.9.5.94ub1.tar.bz2 which was the only one available
<smspillaz> *shrug* I'm not sure why its not in there then. At least the ones I tested have that one
<didrocks> smspillaz: ok, taking this one then
<smspillaz> :)
<didrocks> smspillaz: when you approve the branch from external contributor (https://code.launchpad.net/~om26er/unity/unity-fix-852984/+merge/75890), please remember that you need to merge it as well (and change the bug status, target to the milestone), please!
<didrocks> smspillaz: can you fix that one?
<smspillaz> sure
<smspillaz> didrocks: I'm waiting on njpatel actually
<smspillaz> forthat
<didrocks> smspillaz: ah ok :)
<didrocks> as you approved it, I was thinking it was ready to be merged
<smspillaz> yeah it looks good and then I realized it would be best to double check
<didrocks> (maybe you should not set it in that state :))
<smspillaz> I changed it back to needs review
<seb128> hey mvo ;-)
<didrocks> smspillaz: thanks!
<rodrigo_> brb
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: good news for you! compiz (compiz and c-p-m) fixes for stacking bugs should be in ubuntu-desktop/ppa. Once it's built you are more welcome to rush to it! (take care that there is an experimental music lens as well which can result in some crash in unity)
<didrocks> pitti: I'm testing this version since Friday (just compiz, not c-p-m though), some dx members (3) are testing it for a few extra days, if we can get some positive results from the ppa today do you think there is a windows for upload? (as the stacking bugs are still really ackwards)
<pitti> didrocks: yes, today is still ok for selected changes
<pitti> didrocks: stacking fixes heavily appreciated indeed; how much change is the new version?
<didrocks> pitti: quite a lot of changes though, smspillaz is working exclusively on it for the past few weeks
<didrocks> pitti: there is no ABI break, so we can revert easily if needed
<pitti> didrocks: I mean, the last compiz upload was last Thursday, did we get so many changes since then?
<didrocks> pitti: the last compiz was only a settings upgrade
<didrocks> and those branches have been put aside from any other work
<didrocks> pitti: some diffstat: http://paste.ubuntu.com/692855/
<didrocks> (487 from stackdebugger)
<pitti> didrocks: that looks a tad big at this point, can the stacking fixes sensibly be cherry-picked?
<didrocks> pitti: as there is an API change inside the same package, I don't think so, smspillaz ? ^
<didrocks> pitti: this is
<didrocks> pitti: this is *only* stacking fixes
<smspillaz> pitti: no, it is either all or nothing
<smspillaz> if you try to cherry pick from that branch you'll cause problems :)
<pitti> didrocks: ok, if you think it's safe enough and doesn't cause other regressions; but it really needs to happen today
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, I'll wait for our chrisccoulson to test the ppa as well for a couple of hours first :)
<didrocks> as he's our stacking issue rockstar!
<pitti> didrocks: is it in the u-desktop PPA? I'm happy to test that as well
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, it's currently building, I can ping you once done
<pitti> nice
<didrocks> pitti: you will need to logout/login again to restart compiz and xorg in sync for the stacking state
<didrocks> smspillaz: is the additional commit needed for RAOF's issue on minimize is in this tarball as well? ^
<smspillaz> no, not yet
<smspillaz> its complicated
<didrocks> smspillaz: how had it worked for you then?
<smspillaz> didrocks: it worked but broke other stuff
<smspillaz> its a fine balance unfortunately
<htorque> didrocks: hi, i got some time to click around. do I need c-p-m as well or is the compiz package from the PPA enough?
<didrocks> hum, ok
<smspillaz> another one of these "core can stomp on what the server is telling us and then the server stabs us for it" bugs
<didrocks> htorque: hum? neither compiz nor c-p-m are built yet in the ppa. I will tell you once both are built, but you need both
<didrocks> htorque: and then, logout/login
<htorque> didrocks: k, thanks
<didrocks> RAOF: do you know about having black squares on the screen with nvidia blob driver?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, thanks, will test that in a bit
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, does that mean i have to look at the blurry icons in the dash? ;)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: heh, indeed, feel drunk! :-)
<chrisccoulson> lol
<chrisccoulson> i wish there was a way i could disable that and have nice, sharp icons like unity 2d :)
<didrocks> RAOF: and then, some applications (particularly chromium) is having a hard time: http://people.canonical.com/~didrocks/nvidia_glitches.png
<mvo> glatzor: \o/
<mvo> hey seb128
 * glatzor waves mvo
 * glatzor busselt den mvo
<chrisccoulson_> is launchpad dead?
<chrisccoulson_> https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop gives an OOPS
<htorque> yeah
<chrisccoulson_> oh
<chrisccoulson_> <wgrant> In a few minutes we'll be down for a couple of minutes of database upgrades
<mvo> glatzor: thanks so much for finding and fixing the dbus hangs, awsome
<mvo> glatzor: you made my day :)
<chrisccoulson_> didrocks, do i also need compiz-plugins-main from the PPA?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson_: yeah, you need both :)
<didrocks> (still waiting for publishing)
<chrisccoulson_> didrocks, that seems to be an older version compared to what is already in the archive
<didrocks> chrisccoulson_: interesting 1:0.9.5.94+bzr20110915-0ubuntu1 > 1:0.9.5.94+bzr27-0ubuntu1~ppa1 ?
<chrisccoulson_> didrocks, yeah, seems so
<didrocks> (tried to get back to a revid versionning now that I have them)
<seb128> didrocks, dpkg --compare-versions is your friend
<didrocks> chrisccoulson_: it's too smart :-)
<chrisccoulson_> heh
<smspillaz> RAOF: hm, ok, almost fixed it
<didrocks> seb128: sure, in that one, i was only thinking about trivial char by char
<didrocks> ok, reuploading with the date then
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: you can still manually downgrade (you need at least -default package)
<chrisccoulson> thanks
<glatzor> mvo, you pointed me to the direction
<didrocks> smspillaz: dbarth found out that the compiz tarball doesn't correspond to rev 2805, can you clarify that out with him please?
<glatzor> mvo, but those encodings errors are really nasty ones lp#846044
<mvo> glatzor: I initially thought that the blocking was the debfile resolving or somehting like this, but its pretty obvious now what the real cause is :)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, do you see bug 852406 on your laptop btw?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 852406 in linux "Phantom battery appears after resume from suspend" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/852406
<mvo> glatzor: yeah, we have a bunch of them in s-c as well, rather anyoing, did comment #3 help in this bug ? setting the default encoding?
<smspillaz> didrocks: ok, hang on
<smspillaz> didrocks: i need to finish fixing this first
<glatzor> mvo, about the encoding issue. It seems to make sense to workaround the DBusException.get_dbus_message() method by accessing the error string from Exception.message
<didrocks> smspillaz: just talk to dbarth about it when you have the time
<glatzor> mvo, I cannot reproduce this error here
<mvo> glatzor: :/
<mvo> glatzor: yeah, dyoing it when calling get_dbus_message() makes most sense I guess
<seb128> chrisccoulson, not that I noticed but I'm not uptodate, I didn't upgrade since before my holidays
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I will try later once I've upgraded and restarted
<htorque> meh, i got a stuck click-through window in gimp
<didrocks> htorque: after logging out/logging in?
<htorque> yes
<didrocks> smspillaz: ^^
<htorque> it's gimp with the maximized main window and the toolbox opened. after creating a new image from the "File" menu, that dialog stays opened even after quitting gimp.
<smspillaz> known issue
<glatzor> mvo, so I will merge the non-blocking-lintian branch
<didrocks> is there a bug tracking that?
<smspillaz> didrocks: don't know
<didrocks> would be nice that "known issues" are filed and tracked
<htorque> more stuck stuff: synaptic -> reload package information. the dialog gets stuck the same way just not fully transparent. also, the menu stuck when quitting the application (File -> Quit).
<htorque> http://img.xrmb2.net/images/779754.png
<smspillaz> htorque: hang on
<smspillaz> htorque: you're running the newest c-p-m ?
<htorque> yeah
<smspillaz> hmm
<smspillaz> didrocks: can we make another package of that for testing ?
<smspillaz> I'll get you another tarball
<glatzor> mvo, i also 'fixed' the encoding error
<didrocks> smspillaz: do you have a fix for it? later than rev27?
<smspillaz> didrocks: not necessarily, I've just made some changes to the animation plugin
<smspillaz> didrocks: is htorque testing the stacking fixes ppa ?
<didrocks> smspillaz: yeah
<didrocks> smspillaz: would be nice that some changes are tracked and under a bug ref
<smspillaz> htorque: I think you'll need an updated animation plugin, hang on
<mvo> htorque: oh? hmmm, that part of the code has no changed in a while
<smspillaz> didrocks: kind of juggling 4 different branches atm, excuse the errors
 * didrocks sees that as a juggle, indeded
<didrocks> indeed*
<smspillaz> the good news is that I've fixed RAOF's bug
<smspillaz> coolio, all fixed
<didrocks> smspillaz: ok, so you have two folders with the same packages name
<didrocks> smspillaz: https://chinstrap.canonical.com/~smspillaz/releases/0.9.5.94stacking and https://chinstrap.canonical.com/~smspillaz/releases/0.9.5.94ub1/
<didrocks> both containing "ubu1"
<didrocks> dbarth had a look there
<didrocks> seems the second one, which is the one you pointed me about is indeed rev 1805, but doesn't contain stacking fixes
<dpm> morning pitti, did you disable the oneiric language packs? I just want to check it wasn't me who did it inadvertently when changing the crontab to adapt to the new LP export times. After language pack exports being broken in LP for a while, I was expecting new langpacks on Friday
<pitti> dpm: yes, for beta-2 freeze
<didrocks> can you please look at all this mess and get me *one* tarball with *a list of fixed bugs* ensuring we have *what we need and what we need only*?
<didrocks> bringing some sanity and rigor thereâ¦
<smspillaz> didrocks: oh great.
<smspillaz> didrocks: this is why I shouldn't upload tarballs at 4am
 * didrocks won't comment
<smspillaz> I think I was actually delerious by that point
<smspillaz> had been working on the stacking bug for .... about 29 hours straight
<smspillaz> the moral of the story is don't maintain window managers
<dbarth> the stacking directory should contain the right one, i'm checking that now
 * didrocks wonders how other people on the dx team +1 the stacking fix over the past few days telling it's fixing everything from the 2nd link then
<dpm> pitti, could we have a new delta export before the full one at the end of the week? Due to broken exports in LP translators haven't been able to see any updates for a while
<rodrigo_> pitti, the versions page is updated continously now, right?
<pitti> seb128: erk, seems my sqlite3 operation under oneiric somehow broke the .db under lucid :/
<pitti> rodrigo_: yes
<rodrigo_> pitti, as soon as the packages are accepted, or when they are in the queue?
<pitti> dpm: too late for beta-2, but we can reenable it on Friday, yes
<dpm> pitti, ok
<dbarth> didrocks: they're testing by using the source branch
<smspillaz> wow, the oneiric and main branches are really diverging
<smspillaz> the conflicts are out of control
<pitti> rodrigo_: "accepted" I think
<pitti> rodrigo_: there is some code to check the unapproved queue, I think, but it doesn't seem to work
<pitti> rodrigo_: I updated the pad with stuff that I updated, and of course everyone can check the queue
<pitti> rodrigo_: or bzr :)
<RAOF> didrocks: Hm, no I don't know anything about those nvidia glitches.
<rodrigo_> pitti, ok, it wasn't being updated while my last upload was waiting for approval, that's why I asked
<didrocks> RAOF: I guess it's maybe linked to bug #813343
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 813343 in unity "nvidia drivers, second monitor covered by black" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/813343
<didrocks> RAOF: but I get it even when I have one monitor
<rodrigo_> I'll leave it in the pad until it is accepted, so that nobody starts working on it
<didrocks> pitti: ok, seems we maybe shouldn't get the compiz fixes then for today (as conflicts are out of control)
<smspillaz> didrocks: no, we'll be fine
<smspillaz> didrocks: I was speaking as in
<smspillaz> when I was merging in the fix for raof's branch
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, i grabbed the version from the desktop PPA
<smspillaz> I got a large number of conflicts but most of them are trivial
<chrisccoulson> i got an invisible window after minimizing a window for the first time
<smspillaz> chrisccoulson: update your xserver
<chrisccoulson> brb, switching back to 2d first
<RAOF> didrocks: I wouldn't expect it to be the same as the second-monitor bug, but maybe it is.
<chrisccoulson> that's better
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: it shouldn't fix the stacking issue, don't spend time trying it, see the discussion above ^
<chrisccoulson> smspillaz, update my xserver from where? it's already up-to-date....
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: not the right tarball
<chrisccoulson> g'ah ;)_
<smspillaz> RAOF: new xserver uploaded ?
<RAOF> smspillaz: Yes, and accepted.
<smspillaz> chrisccoulson: basically you should only ever get that if you minimized a maximized window with the newest xserver
<smspillaz> which is something I'm trying to fix now
<RAOF> chrisccoulson: You're looking for xserver-xorg-core 1.10.4-1ubuntu2
<didrocks> RAOF: however I have those issues: http://people.canonical.com/~didrocks/nvidia_glitches2.png
<didrocks> RAOF: who should I ping to track that?
<rodrigo_> bbiab
<RAOF> didrocks: Hm.  That looks kinda like bad Damage handling.  tselliot is probably who you want to ping.
<didrocks> RAOF: ok, will bother him then :)
<smspillaz> RAOF: didrocks: ok, I am going to merge the stacking branch upstream now
<smspillaz> try and get our branches under control here
<didrocks> smspillaz: need as well all bug # attached
<didrocks> smspillaz: especially those coming from the current rev 1804, 1805
<didrocks> as it's not a stacking fix it seems
<smspillaz> didrocks: keep in mind that while I can get bug # for everything, over-cherry-picking is not really a feasible option
<didrocks> smspillaz: as usual with compizâ¦ But better to get everything tracked, with fix committed bugs and suchâ¦
<smspillaz> didrocks: those revisions have been signed off already
<smspillaz> I just did a merge, that's all
<didrocks> smspillaz: yeah, but can I get the bug numbers as it's the only thing I'm asking for?
<smspillaz> didrocks: sure, hang on
<didrocks> thanks!
<smspillaz> loggerhead needs to be able to show you the full revision tree
<smspillaz> didrocks: 2805 is bug 731685 and 2804 is bug 724093
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 731685 in compiz "Panel shadow conflicts with Window shadow in Ubuntu Classic Desktop Session" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/731685
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 2804 in launchpad "Stop indenting and wrapping bug descriptions in e-mail notifications" [Medium,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/2804
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 724093 in compiz "unity-window-decorator: When switching between windows, Orca does not speak the title of the focused window." [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/724093
<dbarth> smspillaz: i have verified the stacking tarball
<dbarth> smspillaz: it corresponds to the lp:~compiz-team/compiz-core/compiz-core.stack_sync_fix branch, modulo those 2 fixes you've just mentionned
<didrocks> smspillaz: ok, and then the stacking bug fixes
<chrisccoulson> pitti - did you approve the firefox/thunderbird uploads yesterday?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: yes; don't tell me they are utterly broken :)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - no, i just wanted to say thanks ;)
<dbarth> smspillaz: would you have other stacking patches to add on top, or can we just rebuild from this tarball instead
<chrisccoulson> pitti - those are the RC's for the 7.0 release too :)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: *phew* :) you're welcome; I thought better to start building them early, wrt. arm images and such
<smspillaz> dbarth: I'd rather make a new one
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i was a bit concerned about that. i was hoping to get them slightly before the freeze ;)
<smspillaz> i need to have dinner
<chrisccoulson> but mozilla had an all-hands event last week, so things were a bit quiet
<didrocks> smspillaz: and c-p-m btw? no new tarball? can I get the bugs # as well?
<smspillaz|d> didrocks: yes, that's coming
<dbarth> didrocks: i'll give you the rest
<didrocks> dbarth: thanks
<chrisccoulson> can we not propose blueprints for UDS-P yet? ;)
<soren> When a browser (in this instance Google Chrome) complains it's not the default browser... How can it tell? Where does it look this up?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, what do you want to work on? ;-)
<bryceh> chrisccoulson, perpetual peacock is not open yet for blueprints
<pitti> bryceh: you had a spelling error in "perky penguin"
<geser> is the codename for P already announced?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, nice work on bug #804435
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 804435 in unity-2d "Wallpaper is loaded twice with different alignment by gnome-session and nautilus (Oneiric)" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/804435
<seb128> chrisccoulson, did you see that upstream "accept commit"-ed it?
<seb128> didrocks, ^ btw
<didrocks> seb128: I know about it, I asked him to continue the debugging I just had the time to start :)
<seb128> didrocks, right, I pointed that the patch got accepted
<seb128> chrisccoulson, if you don't have commit access you should say it on the bug so somebody commit it ;-)
<didrocks> yeah, I looked at it, chrisccoulson really rocks! :-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, i've got commit access. i will test in a minute if it still works ;)
<chrisccoulson> heh, i did a build of thunderbird on my laptop at the weekend - it took around 35 minutes :)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: that sounds fast -- how long did the old one take?
<chrisccoulson> or thereabouts. i didn't actually time it, but it wasn't very long
<chrisccoulson> pitti - it took around 3.5 hours before ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, so you are happy about the laptop you picked?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: can I have a dist-cc on your laptop for compiz/nux/unity? :)
 * didrocks tries
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, it's really fast :)
<seb128> ssd?
<chrisccoulson> the 8GB or RAM + SSD really helps ;)
<seb128> ssd for the win!
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i can't believe how much of a difference it makes :)
<popey> chrisccoulson: what laptop do you have?
<chrisccoulson> popey, it's a dell e6410
<popey> zoiks
 * popey looks at his laptop and sees Latitude | E6410
<chrisccoulson> popey - i actually wanted to buy a thinkpad, but i didn't want to pay for a new docking station ;)
<popey> (work supplied laptop)
<chrisccoulson> heh :)
<popey> they are quite nice, I agree.
<smspillaz> RAOF: are you able to kompile kompiz ?
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i quite like the new machine :)
<smspillaz> dbarth: are you free to test something ?
<didrocks> smspillaz: think about the core.h ABI downgrade btw
<smspillaz> didrocks: yep, sure
<Sweetshark> omg: http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/incubator-ooo-dev/201109.mbox/%3C4E7712C9.9060306@gmx.ch%3E
<RAOF> smspillaz: Which compiz?
<smspillaz> RAOF: lp:~compiz-team/compiz-core/oneiric.stack_sync_fix
<smspillaz> if you compile from there you should be able to test if maximized windows are still a problem
<smspillaz> RAOF: you may want to change the ABI back (in fact, I might do that now)
<RAOF> smspillaz: Actually, is tomorrow early enough?  I need to wander bedwards.
<smspillaz> hmm
<smspillaz> well, I need someone to test it today, but if you need to go to bed that's fine
<smspillaz> dbarth: !! ?
<smspillaz> RAOF: will the new xserver appear if you did apt-get update && apt-get install xserver-xorg-core ?
<smspillaz> didrocks: actually, are you free to test something ?
<didrocks> smspillaz: I already lost 5 hours with compiz this morning, need to catch up on something else. Do you have the tarballs?
<smspillaz> nope, I'm waiting on someone to test my branch so that I can make tarballs for you
<RAOF> smspillaz: Yes.  The new xserver is published and ready to roll.
<smspillaz> RAOF: thanks
<smspillaz> didrocks: unless you don't want the fix for https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/compiz/+bug/853734 (broken maximize)
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 853734 in unity "maximized windows fail to update their input extents when undecorated" [High,Fix committed]
<didrocks> smspillaz: all will be in a ppa at this point I guess
<smspillaz> ok
<didrocks> smspillaz: so you can still roll with it as it's only in a ppa
<smspillaz> sure
<smspillaz> although I need someone to approve my merge first
<didrocks> smspillaz: and get all bug # for stacking (and the c-p-m change)
<smspillaz> otherwise rolling tarballs is ... painful
<chrisccoulson> w00t, my git access still works - http://git.gnome.org/browse/gtk+/commit/?id=22cd009ef7ae24011aa3c8414c44361133c93d2c :)
<smspillaz> didrocks: https://chinstrap.canonical.com/~smspillaz/releases/0.9.5.94ub1/compiz-plugins-main_0.95rev27.orig.tar.gz . The only thing that's changed is that I fixed bug https://bugs.launchpad.net/compiz-plugins-main/+bug/853807
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 853807 in unity "crash when looping paint list in preparePaint (on closing windows)" [High,Fix committed]
<didrocks> smspillaz: ok, thanks for this one, redoing the tarballs
<didrocks> hum, I will have to cheat with the ppa as the version rev27 was already there
<smspillaz> ah
<didrocks> smspillaz: 0.95 ?
<didrocks> not 0.9.94 ?
<smspillaz> or 0.9.5.94
<smspillaz> typo
<didrocks> ok
 * rodrigo_ lunch
<smspillaz> didrocks: ok, we got kamstrup|afk to test my branch and he says it works fine
<didrocks> smspillaz: ok, so merging and tarball?
<didrocks> smspillaz: and bug # for all the stacking fixes
<smspillaz> there's only one meta-bug I'm using to track it
<smspillaz> didrocks: yeah, he just needs to hit the approve button
<didrocks> smspillaz: only one? there is more on the unity target page assigned to you IIRC
<ogra_> hmm, is it expected that my shutdown icon does not turn red if need to reboot after an upgrade ?
<smspillaz> didrocks: well, I can try to collect them all :/
<didrocks> smspillaz: see the latest target
<smspillaz> didrocks: ok, I have one request. could you have a look over the code for https://code.launchpad.net/~compiz-team/compiz-core/compiz-core.fix_853734/+merge/75992 and approve it if it looks good ?
<didrocks> smspillaz: that's what kamstrup|afk tested, isn't it?
<smspillaz> kamstrup|afk didn't approve it since he didn't have time to look at the code
<smspillaz> didrocks: yes
<smspillaz> but I kinda need this in before I merge stuff
<seb128> ogra_, not sure, check with ted when he's online
<didrocks> smspillaz: I don't see any insanity in the code, approved
<smspillaz> :)
<didrocks> smspillaz: bug #805087 is another stacking issue
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 805087 in unity "Dash and launcher appear underneath windows" [Critical,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/805087
<didrocks> smspillaz: bug #847967 is fixed by this branch as well?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 847967 in unity "A minimized window 'remains' behind on the desktop if /apps/compiz-1/plugins/unityshell/screen0/options/show_minimized_windows is set to true" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/847967
<smspillaz> didrocks: sort of. this branch implements a fix for something that wasn't quite working in the original fix
<pitti> seb128: hmm, still no new .92 tarballs..
<smspillaz> SunFl0wer: rabid nick swapping much ?
<seb128> pitti, gnome-screensaver earlier and they just uploaded the evolution stack
<didrocks> smspillaz: so, please set it to fix committed
<SunFl0wer> smspillaz, we are playing a game
<pitti> seb128: oh, versions.html is behind?
<pitti> seb128: anything else that I could help with?
<seb128> pitti, seems so
<seb128> versions being behind
<smspillaz> SunFl0wer: I figured :)
<seb128> gnome-screensaver was uploaded over an hour ago
<smspillaz> didrocks: yep
<seb128> pitti, nothing that I know about, I'm about to be done catching up with emails, bugs, updates, etc
<pitti> seb128: is anyone working on it? pad doesn't say
<seb128> i.e with what happened while I was not there
<seb128> pitti, no
<seb128> pitti, i.e feel free to claim any of those updates
<seb128> rodrigo_ was debugging the proxy bug and is at lunch
<seb128> nobody else is set on GNOME updates today I think
<pitti> I'm working on apport today, but that's not overly critical
<rodrigo_> seb128, I'm cooking, and yes, almost have a fix
<pitti> I'm mostly standing by for .92 packaging
<seb128> I will start on updates soon as they come
 * pitti grabs the screen saver then
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> let the evolution stack for cyphermox I guess
<seb128> out of e-d-s they are not on the CD anyway
<seb128> so we don't need to get them in early
<pitti> getting e-d-s ASAP would be good, though (unless there's another ABI break, but let's hope not)
<seb128> reading the changelog there isn't
 * smspillaz merges in the stacking fix
<seb128> pitti, gtkmm got an update as well btw
<pitti> seb128: yeah, looked in git, but apparently still not udpated to new gtk_font_selector API
<seb128> weird
<seb128> pitti, it might be worth pinging murrayc on #gnome-hackers about it
<seb128> I've not followed the details but it seems weird he rolled a tarball that doesn't work with the current gtk
<pitti> ok
<pitti> can do, just starting g-s build
<seb128> Laney, hey, will you update tomboy? (no hurry, it's only translations updates)
<Laney> yeah soon
<Laney> didn't think it'd be wanted for b2
<Laney> I want to give chipaca and aquarius time to fix U1 if possible
<GunnarHj> pitti: Hi Martin, hope you had a nice weekend. Wondering if https://code.launchpad.net/~gunnarhj/language-selector/fontconfig/+merge/75045 possibly qualifies for a b-freeze exception. It includes a couple of dbus related fixes, and since I have been struggling with those for a while, I'm anxious to get it into the archive asap, so there is enough time for further tweaking if we'd get more crash reports.
<seb128> Laney, ok, I just write you down on the etherpad for it so nobody duplicate work
<smspillaz> didrocks: ok, got that merged upstream \o/
<didrocks> smspillaz: great, ping me with a tarball please :)
<mterry> didrocks, seb128, smspillaz: morning (for me)!
<didrocks> good morning mterry!
<seb128> mterry, hey mterry, how are you?
<mterry> didrocks, were you talking stacking fix shop with smspillaz?  /me is eager to test out new packages, has all sorts of stacking gremlins in his machine
<mterry> seb128, good!
<didrocks> mterry: indeed!
<pitti> seb128: grabbing gtkmm3.0; seems last time I tried to build .18, my bad
<didrocks> mterry: seems you will be a nice guinea pig then ;)
<mterry> didrocks, let me know what I can do to help  :)
<seb128> pitti, great, thanks
<smspillaz> DISCLAIMER: not guarunteed to have fixed it
<mterry> pitti, also morning pitti!
<didrocks> mterry: sure, will ping you once landed in the ubuntu-dektop ppa
<pitti> hey mterry, how are you?
<pitti> hey GunnarHj
<mterry> good
<pitti> GunnarHj: hm, need to review that in-depth, it's quite a large p atch
<pitti> rodrigo_: do we need the new folks for anything in b2? it's quite a large update, and doesn't strictly fall under the gnome standing FFE
<GunnarHj> pitti: I see. Seeked a sponsor last thursday, but noone had the time before b2. Were probably busy with their own last minute uploads...
<smspillaz> didrocks: so bad news
<smspillaz> didrocks: libreoffice causes stacking bugs
<didrocks> smspillaz: very bad ones?
<pitti> ok, all 3.1.92 on http://people.gnome.org/~vuntz/tmp/versions/versions-unstable are in now
<smspillaz> didrocks: well it gets above panels somehow
<smspillaz> I can't reproduce it now though
<smspillaz> something to keep on the radar though
<seb128> pitti, I've been putting things to update on the etherpad as they were showing on the ftp list, but good to have versions updated as well ;-)
<smspillaz> gosh, I wish we didn't live in a world where there were all these broken applications
<smspillaz> #firstworldproblem
<pitti> seb128: ah, thanks
<pitti> GunnarHj: ok, responded (I used a separate response for separate issues, sorry for multiple mails)
<pitti> seb128: accidental double-dput of d-schemas, or does the second one fix something?
<seb128> pitti, accidentally called back the wrong command
<pitti> seb128: ok
<seb128> i.e feel free to drop one of the 2
<seb128> sorry about that
<cyphermox> ohh, new evo
<dobey> grrrrr
<pitti> seb128: np, done
<pitti> cyphermox: good morning
<cyphermox> pitti: hey
<dobey> why does gnome-session Depends: unity | unity-2d?
<pitti> cyphermox: do you want to package these? if so, starting with e-d-s would be appreciated, as that's on the images
<didrocks> dobey: because it contains the session files
<cyphermox> pitti: yup yup, getting started nao
<seb128> dobey, because that's the sessions it ships, it has also | gnome-shell in oneiric
<cyphermox> pitti: not sure if you saw my ping before, but if  you could review/ack https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/network-manager/+bug/849994 it would be much appreciated
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 849994 in network-manager "FFE: add NetworkManager DUID support" [Undecided,New]
<dobey> that is broken
<pitti> cyphermox: I answered to that actually
<cyphermox> you did?
<dobey> why are those not Recommends?
<seb128> dobey, right, it should | x-session and have all session providers provide it
<seb128> Recommends would work as well I guess
<pitti> cyphermox: in short, I have next to no idea about ipv6 and what DUID is, I was hoping someone with ipv6 knowledge coudl review this; I think Colin did some ipv6 stuff
<cyphermox> yeah
<dobey> it shouldn't depend on any of them really. the dependency is backward; unity should require gnome-session, i think
<rodrigo_> pitti, the new folks is needed for the upcomping gnome-contacts update
<pitti> rodrigo_: how much did you test the new versino with empathy?
<cyphermox> most of the issue comes from the fact that having sufficient knowledge of NM, DHCPv6 and what DUIDs are is not very distributed.. we all have little bits of the puzzle :)
<dobey> and how do i configure my panels the way i had them in natty, in oneiric?
<rodrigo_> pitti, installed it and running empathy with it now
<rodrigo_> pitti, will keep testing
<pitti> rodrigo_: ah, good; so shouldn't totally break b2 then?
<rodrigo_> pitti, AFAICS so far, no
<pitti> rodrigo_: ok, can accept if you feel good about it
<rodrigo_> pitti, if you want, let's wait for another tester :)
 * kenvandine waves
<pitti> hey kenvandine, welcome back! how are you?
<kenvandine> a bit tired :)
<kenvandine> long day of travel yesterday, but vacation was great!
<seb128> oh, a kenvandine
<seb128> kenvandine, hey!
<kenvandine> hey seb128
<didrocks> welcome back kenvandine!
<kenvandine> thx didrocks
<dobey> whee, bug #853886
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 853886 in gnome-terminal "Menu bar shown even when it shouldn't be, without Unity" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/853886
<seb128> pitti, hum, you dropped indicator-applet? did you check with ted,dx?
<pitti> seb128: if it ever gets fixed, we can trivially reintroduce it
<seb128> ok
<pitti> and it was holding a lot of cruft in NBS, etc.
<pitti> http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/nbs.html will be empty again as soon as ltsp built (that was just a temporary glitch in debian/control)
<seb128> ok
<seb128> I still not like much that we drop support for our techs like that
<seb128> let's see if dx fixes it before oneiric or not
<pitti> well, actually I think it's the right thing to do
<pitti> gnome-shell doesn't support it, and the classic gnome session should now be a bit more "vanilla" upstream, too
<dobey> oneiric has been a nightmare for me on my laptop with poulsbo :(
<rodrigo_> hey kenvandine, had a good vacation?
<kenvandine> rodrigo_, yes i did!
<dobey> how can i get my config back?
 * kenvandine applies 2 weeks of updates... 
<rodrigo_> kenvandine, you've been in Croation, right?
<seb128> pitti, right, I don't argue we should have the applet on by default, still would be nice to have it for those who like indicators ;-)
<rodrigo_> Croatia
<kenvandine> yeah
<seb128> pitti, but not worth spending our time on
<kenvandine> croatia was pretty incredible
<kenvandine> dubrovnik and split
<rodrigo_> kenvandine, yeah, I've heard it's a nice place indeed
<kenvandine> i wasn't expecting it to be quite that nice
<rodrigo_> kenvandine, ok, we expect photos now :)
<kenvandine> i'll share what my wife uploads, she is the photographer :)
<seb128> kenvandine, oh, and you can bring us our souvenirs at UDS ;-)
<seb128> no hurry
<kenvandine> hehe :)
<kenvandine> brb, reboot
<rodrigo_> oh yeah, souvenirs
<kenvandine> woot, smooth upgrade :)
<seb128> lucky you!
<kenvandine> ugh.. maybe not... no dash or quick menus
<kenvandine> quick lists.... whatever... i forgot the unity lingo :)
<seb128> oh, likely a stacking issue
<kenvandine> ah stacking bugs...
<seb128> ;-)
<kenvandine> works on an empty desktop
<seb128> dx should have a fixed compiz out today
<seb128> let's see
<kenvandine> woot
<kenvandine> finally really fixed the stacking bugs?
<seb128> that's what they claim at least
<didrocks> fixed minus libreoffice though
<didrocks> kenvandine: minus libreoffice and gimp
<didrocks> (and more to come, I'm afraid)
<didrocks> we'll see in the ppa, once I get after 3 trial the right tarball :)
<glatzor> pitti, hello, I have got a question about sub classes of gtk widgets. in aptdaemon we use GObject.GObject.__init__(self), but is it correct that this is done implicitely nowadays?
<glatzor> pitti, see http://python-gtk-3-tutorial.readthedocs.org/en/latest/introduction.html#extended-example
<pitti> glatzor: I don't know off-hand, I'm afraid; better ask in #python on GIMP IRC?
<pitti> but I haven't seen that explicit call anywhwere, so it's likely
<smspillaz> mterry: did you have the bug number for windows that start iconified not working with compiz ?
<mterry> smspillaz, bug 732997
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 732997 in unity "Cannot open a window that starts iconified" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/732997
<smspillaz> coolio, thanks
<mterry> smspillaz, I'm honored, but I think you meant mterry, not coolio  ;)
<mterry> We need more rap programmers
<smspillaz> mterry: ahahah
<seb128> pitti, hum, wasn't libgucharmap7 a gtk2 lib?
<pitti> didrocks: ah, pulling new compiz from PPA, testing now..
<seb128> pitti, with libgucharmap-2-90-7 the gtk3 one?
<didrocks> pitti: no, that's the one from this morning
<didrocks> pitti: it's one of the three wrong tarball rolled last Thursday, it doesn't contain stacking fix
<pitti> didrocks: I see
<pitti> seb128: oh, oops
<didrocks> pitti: smspillaz will hopefully roll some again soon (at least, supposed to)
<pitti> seb128: I guess we need to roll back to 3.0.1 then?
<pitti> it still has two rdepends
<seb128> pitti, I would just drop the gtk2 build
<seb128> pitti, we can probably drop the plugins from the 2 rdepends
<pitti> yes, presumably
<seb128> or the 2 rdepends
<pitti> seb128: noted in pad
<seb128> pitti, thanks
<didrocks> pitti: didn't notice anything done in that regards, but I get flicker free boot on nvidia today! (thanks for Qt to have killed my laptop to be abled to see that) :)
<pitti> didrocks: on the binary driver!?
<didrocks> pitti: indeed
<didrocks> back to a state similar than lucid one
<didrocks> with a not that much ugly plymouth
<pitti> eww, tons of shadow windows with new compiz
<didrocks> pitti: indeed, but let's wait on the new fixed one to see if it's still there
<didrocks> pitti: you mean, black shadow until you click on the application, isn't it?
<pitti> so, compiz from PPA seems heavily broken :(
<didrocks> (when switching ws)
<pitti> didrocks: apport-gtk windows staying around even after the process is gone
<pitti> and in the foreground, bah
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, this one is from it, with latest c-p-m
<pitti> and on all desktops
<pitti> didrocks: any workaround known?
<didrocks> pitti: restarting unity (no need to logout/login)
<didrocks> and stare at smspillaz to get the correct tarball
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, i wonder if i should have a go at fixing bug 852406? i can't imagine it would be that hard :/
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 852406 in linux "Phantom battery appears after resume from suspend" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/852406
<seb128> chrisccoulson, have a got at figuring why g-s-d is blocking the session for some seconds rather ;-)
<chrisccoulson> heh
<didrocks> pitti: sorry, maybe I was unclear: by "flicker free", I meant, there is still a black window between plymouth and lightdm for screen resolution change, but I get no anymore completely ugly logo and text on top of it
<ricotz> hi, are there known issues with gnome-keyring, like having multiple instances?
<rodrigo_> hmm, in which branch is libcolord-dev? lp:ubuntu/colord doesn't seem to exist
<seb128> ricotz, no
<seb128> rodrigo_, could be a udd bug, maybe james_w has an idea about it
<seb128> rodrigo_, otherwise you can just update the "old" way, i.e without a vcs
<rodrigo_> james_w, any idea? ^^
<seb128> apt-get source etc
<rodrigo_> yeah
<ricotz> seb128, ok :), then there is something wrong here :\
<mdeslaur> seb128: have you seen issues like I'm getting in bug 848198 ?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 848198 in gconf "Sporadic gconf error messages" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/848198
<seb128> mdeslaur, yes, seems to happen just after I install debs
<mdeslaur> seb128: I sporadically get it with a bunch of different apps
<mdeslaur> seb128: chrisccoulson had mentioned a problem with dbus getting slammed from one of the indicators, I wonder if that's what's causing it
<seb128> mdeslaur, I doubt it, I get often the message from the bug but not often the indicator dbus slamming
<mdeslaur> ok
<james_w> rodrigo_, http://package-import.ubuntu.com/status/colord.html#2011-08-06%2003:21:19.112776
<rodrigo_> james_w, oh :(
<pitti> rodrigo_: I thought RAOF wanted to update colord in/through debian
 * pitti back in 30
<rodrigo_> pitti, yes, I'll wait for him, we need 0.1.12 for the new g-s-d release
<rodrigo_> so yes, will wait for him
<seb128> rodrigo_, no please don't wait for him
<seb128> we need those GNOME updates in now if we want them for beta2
<rodrigo_> seb128, why?
<rodrigo_> ah ok
<seb128> because we already are over beta2 freeze
<seb128> it was before the w.e
<seb128> we really want the new g-s-d in, there are quite some fixes in this version, would be a shame to beta2 test the old one
 * mterry looks into a gvfs crash
<seb128> mterry, which one?
<mterry> seb128, bug 811761
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 811761 in gvfs "gvfsd-dav crashed with SIGSEGV in g_vfs_backend_get_daemon()" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/811761
<seb128> ok ;-)
<mterry> seb128, one of the few crash reports I've seen recently that I can actually reproduce, so I'm not letting it go  :)
<seb128> hehe
<seb128> bug #839828 seems popular as well
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 839828 in gvfs "gvfsd-http crashed with SIGSEGV in g_settings_get_child()" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/839828
<mterry> hadn't seen it yet
<mterry> seb128, hrm that looks like a bad use of g_settings api at a quick glance.  I'll look more after gvfs
<mterry> I mean, after the first bug
<seb128> thanks
<pitti> seb128: uh, ABI break in dconf?
<seb128> pitti, yes, but libdconf is not used out of dconf itself
<seb128> pitti, everything uses gsettings
<pitti> ah, ok
<pitti> seb128: that's still a rather central library, do you think we should squeeze it into b2?
<seb128> desrt, ^
<pitti> mterry: ah, assigning the bug to you then, thanks for looking into it
<desrt> uhoh.
<seb128> hey desrt ;-)
<seb128> pitti, it seems fine to me but let's see what desrt says
 * pitti grabs empathy
<seb128> desrt, how confident are you that the new dconf and its abi break will create no issue? ;-)
<desrt> seb128: not so confident.
<desrt> seb128: you mean the 3 functions that got removed, right?
<seb128> desrt, yes
<desrt> nobody is using those
<seb128> desrt, what are you not confident in for the update?
<desrt> i guess i am confident
<seb128> lol
<seb128> you just said you were not ;-)
<desrt> i'm not confident that it's not an ABI change, becasue it is
<didrocks> seb128: the world changes in one minute you knowâ¦ :-)
<desrt> it will probably cause issues with your symbols file, for example
<desrt> but in terms of real breaks
<seb128> desrt, oh sorry that was not the question, I did the update including .symbols and uploaded
<desrt> i think you're fine then
<seb128> desrt, we are frozen for beta2 though so pitti is reviewing uploads and was pondering ack-ing it or not
<seb128> desrt, reviewers don't like much api breaks around freeze times ;-)
<desrt> nobody uses libdconf except to call _reset()
<seb128> pitti, ^
<seb128> pitti, I would say "go for it", it works fine for me at least
<didrocks> desrt: even Qtdconf is fine?
<desrt> yes
<desrt> qtdconf is particular fine since it doesn't use that library at all
<desrt> *particularly
<didrocks> ah, indeed, that helps :-)
<pitti> seb128: okay :)
<mterry> didrocks, which PPA did you put the compiz update in?
<desrt> mterry: odd crashes in gvfs
<didrocks> mterry: still not the right compiz, hoping to get the new one put in ~ubuntu-desktop/ppa any time soon
<mterry> didrocks, k
<didrocks> mterry: but don't upgrade from it please! the current compiz in it is bad, I'll ping you
<mterry> didrocks, ok!
<chrisccoulson> heh, i upgraded from that ;)
<chrisccoulson> i didn't notice it to be any worse though
<didrocks> mterry: it's just good enough for chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> lol
 * didrocks hugs chrisccoulson :-)
<mterry> desrt, those two bugs?  the first is not very surprising after looking at code.  I'll post a patch upstream soon
<chrisccoulson> well, i switched to 2d anyway ;)
<desrt> mterry: the second one looks like a typical case of incorrectly written/installed schemas
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: happy you test it a lot! :-)
<chrisccoulson> heh
<chrisccoulson> did i mention that the icons in the dash in 2d look really nice? :)
<desrt> mterry: these sorts of bugs used to be much more obvious when we aborted straight away...
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: you mean, like you can have beers? :-)
<chrisccoulson> :)
<mterry> desrt, what?  gsettings doesn't abort all the time anymore?
<mterry> can barely call it gsettings
<desrt> mterry: no.  owen talked me out of it.
<desrt> mterry: i think i might turn it on again next cycle.  it's causing more trouble than it's worth
<desrt> same story as always -- nobody ever reads g_critical()
<rodrigo_> hey desrt, seems glib 2.29.92 fixed the issue
<desrt> the other option i'm pondering is to make g_critical() fatal by default :)
<desrt> rodrigo_: the gsettings threading crash?
<rodrigo_> desrt, fatal, like in logging you out, for instance? :D
<rodrigo_> desrt, yes
<chrisccoulson> yes, please turn it back on. you don't know the pain i had to go through to protect against aborts in firefox so that upstream would accept adding gsettings support in to the tree ;)
<desrt> rodrigo_: excellent.
<cyphermox> seb128: e-d-s ready, should I just upload it?
<mterry> desrt, you might want to get some patsy to push that into git for you though
<chrisccoulson> and now you turn it off, so my work is wasted :P
<desrt> rodrigo_: individual apps (and language bindings perhaps) would have the option to turn criticals back down to merely warnings
<desrt> i expect that python would turn them into exceptions, actually
<rodrigo_> yeah
<seb128> cyphermox, yes
<mterry> rodrigo_, which gsettings crash bug are you talking about?
<pitti> rodrigo_: oh, I see g-s-d landed, I thought that would require new colord?
<rodrigo_> pitti, I added colord to the sponshor list -> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/colord/+bug/853956
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 853956 in colord "Update to 0.1.12" [Undecided,New]
<pitti> rodrigo_: ah
<rodrigo_> mterry, crash in threads, there are several bugs for it
<desrt> mterry: btw: noticed you were into ido
<rodrigo_> mterry, I jsut closed several of them, so you'll get mail for those if you want details
<mterry> desrt, yeah, I've not done much with it in a couple years though
<pitti> rodrigo_: you don't happen to have a ready .dsc somewhere? (or bzr branch, etc.)
<mterry> rodrigo_, cool
<htorque> chrisccoulson: sorry to interrupt, but you had a bug reported about the cut off dash icons in unity - i can't seem to find that?
<desrt> mterry: my girlfriend is an aspiring esperantist and she's dragging me into it too
<mterry> desrt, still the official GNOME translator for it, I think  :)
<rodrigo_> pitti, yes, I do
<desrt> mterry: ya.  that's how i found out :)
<rodrigo_> pitti, do you want me to send them to you?
<pitti> rodrigo_: can you put it on people or u1, or anywher?
<rodrigo_> pitti, yes, sure, just the .dsc?
<didrocks> smspillaz: trying to fetch myself all the bug # for the compiz upload as I didn't get anything yet. is bug #853734 in the tarball you gave me?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 853734 in compiz "maximized windows fail to update their input extents when undecorated" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/853734
<pitti> rodrigo_: or just attach to the bug (diff.gz and dsc)
<rodrigo_> ok
<pitti> rodrigo_: debian.tar.gz as wel, of course
<chrisccoulson> htorque, i didn't report a bug about cut-off icons. i reported one about blurry icons and ghosting, which i think was closed as "Opinion", and i was told that the blurry icons is by design
<rodrigo_> pitti, hmm, no diff.gz
<pitti> rodrigo_: .debian.tar.gz, presumably
<seb128> rodrigo_, debian.tar.gz is source v3
<htorque> chrisccoulson: yeah i left that comment, but you could also see the cut off "ghost icons" in your screenshot (the once at the bottom from "available for download"), not sure *that* is by design.
<rodrigo_> pitti, but I have debian.tart.gz and .dsc
<rodrigo_> ok
<chrisccoulson> htorque, well, cut-off or no cut-off, i still think it looks completely broken
<chrisccoulson> and i find it nauseating to look at ;)
<rodrigo_> pitti, ok, both attached to https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/colord/+bug/853956
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 853956 in colord "Update to 0.1.12" [Undecided,New]
<desrt> didrocks: hey
<didrocks> hey again desrt :)
<desrt> didrocks: how reliable is this unity-panel-service crash?
<cyphermox> seb128: uploaded.
<didrocks> desrt: I never got it myself (fortunaly or unfortunaly), seems to be quite popular though
<seb128> thanks
<didrocks> desrt: I guess the stacktrace about the race is quite accurate
<desrt> didrocks: we're musing about introducing some locks for g_setenv() vs. gettext
<rodrigo_> out for a bit, bbl
<desrt> didrocks: but i wonder: are those setenv calls at program init time, or is stuff already running?
<htorque> chrisccoulson: which *is* an opinion (i agree with :P). however, there being cut-off icons seems like a valid bug why i wanted to subscribe to it, but if that's closed i'll probably open a new one. :)
<didrocks> desrt: yeah, I saw the upstream discussion, I'm so surprised it's not thread-safe
<didrocks> desrt: let me recheck
<chrisccoulson> htorque, yeah, probably best to open a new one
<chrisccoulson> good luck!
<chrisccoulson> :)
<htorque> heh
<desrt> didrocks: it's one of those things that's so bloody obvious that you have to wonder how we got into this mess in the first place
<mterry> My touchpad settings are not visible in g-c-c anymore?  And my tap-to-click setting got reset?
<desrt> didrocks: at the same time, though, you can perfectly understand the process
<seb128> mterry, they should be in the mouse capplet
<didrocks> desrt: exactly, it's surprising it wasn't triggered before. Confirming, everything is at init time
<mterry> seb128, I don't have the 'touchpad' tab in that capplet anymore
<seb128> mterry, what config do you have?
<seb128> mterry, are you sure it was there before?
<didrocks> desrt: some before gtk_init, so I guess it's not triggered, but the a11y part, after it
<seb128> mterry, can you pastebin an xinput list log?
<desrt> didrocks: the ally part could be the problem
<desrt> didrocks: unfortunately, by the time the damage is done in getenv() the thread that called setenv() is probably quite far away from the scene of the crime
<seb128> is somebody here using nouveau?
<mterry> seb128, I don't remember the last time I checked whether it was there.  It used to be in natty at least...
<pitti> rodrigo_: thanks, sponsored
<mterry> seb128, xinput list: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/693160/
<seb128> mterry, ok, yours should be there, that's a bug I guess
<desrt> didrocks: so what do you want to do?
<didrocks> desrt: I like how this sounds. Seems like the perfect crime :-)
<seb128> mterry, I just wanted to check that you don't have an alps pad, those are not supported correctly
 * mterry reports a bug
<seb128> that's what I got on my dell
<seb128> ok
<seb128> nobody is on nouveau there?!
<didrocks> re
<seb128> didrocks, is nouveau working for you? ;-)
<didrocks> 18:29:16         desrt | didrocks: unfortunately, by the time the damage is done in getenv() the thread that called setenv() is probably quite far away from the scene of the crime
<didrocks> 18:29:44      didrocks | desrt: I like how this sounds. Seems like the perfect crime :-)
<didrocks> desrt: didn't get anything else
<desrt> didrocks: ah.  i said "so what do you want to do?"
<didrocks> seb128: hum, didn't try it TBH, seems people are telling its better than last cycle on the french forum
<desrt> you can try to go around killing off setenv() calls, or i can try to give seb a hacky vendorpatch for glib to try to workaround the issue
<desrt> either by disabling gettext or by trying to lock (and hope that all your setenv calls are via g_setenv() and not straight setenv())
<didrocks> desrt: the setend seems quite necessary for the AT binding from what API commented
<desrt> we could also try to get someone who knows about these things to patch the libc to be threadsafe for setenv()
<seb128> didrocks, they can maybe try bug #849954 for slangasek so we can get ffb in beta2? ;-)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 849954 in plymouth "FFe: enable flicker-free boot with lightdm" [Medium,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/849954
<didrocks> desrt: they are done by gsetenv
<seb128> didrocks, it's a one liner change to an upstart job
<desrt> didrocks: you have no idea what random libraries you might be calling that are doing setenv() for themselves
<slangasek> seb128, didrocks: if it would help us get testers I'm happy to push to a ppa
<didrocks> seb128: as it to be done today? I still need to find myself all compiz bugs as it wasn't done by upstream
<didrocks> going to nouveau is the time consumer part I guess
<seb128> didrocks, can you ask the forum guys to test if some run nouveau?
<slangasek> yes, today is pretty much the last window for getting the plymouth change in for beta2, I think
<didrocks> desrt: indeed, I hope it's really our calls doing that, we can maybe try first by killing those call and ask our users to test it from a ppa
<mdeslaur> slangasek: give me a moment, and I'll test it with nouveau
<didrocks> give me a minute
<didrocks> trying to finish compiz
<didrocks> and then, on the nouveau part
<desrt> okay.  poke me when we can talk about this properly.
<didrocks> desrt: yeah, I think it will be tomorrow if you don't mind
<desrt> didrocks: that's totally fine
<desrt> rodrigo_: you have this locale monitor branch in glib...
<slangasek> mdeslaur: yay, thanks
<didrocks> ah, if mdeslaur is on it, that's nice :)
<seb128> pitti, urg, bug #853973
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 853973 in gucharmap "package libgucharmap7 1:3.0.1-0ubuntu1 failed to install/upgrade: trying to overwrite '/usr/lib/libgucharmap_2_90.so.7.0.0', which is also in package libgucharmap-2-90-7 1:3.1.92-0ubuntu1" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/853973
<pitti> seb128: yeah, I guess I'll fix that right now then
<seb128> thanks
<pitti> just testing empathy update, then sending it queuewards
<didrocks> ok, pushed the compiz, ,hoping the bug # are correct, if not, upstream will fix those or notâ¦
<smspillaz> didrocks: nope its not
<smspillaz> oh
<smspillaz> did someone say that nouveau needs testing wtih something ?
 * smspillaz runs nouveau
<smspillaz> seb128: ^ ?
<didrocks> smspillaz: can you get the bug list as you promissed then?
<smspillaz> didrocks: yeah, sure
<seb128> smspillaz, bug #849954
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 849954 in plymouth "FFe: enable flicker-free boot with lightdm" [Medium,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/849954
<seb128> smspillaz, but get didrocks's bugslist first I guess ;-)
<smspillaz> allright
<didrocks> smspillaz: list I had right now: http://paste.ubuntu.com/693168/
<smspillaz> thanks
<didrocks> mdeslaur: can try nouveau now if you are not on it
<mdeslaur> didrocks: I'm doing it now
<didrocks> mdeslaur: ok, great :)
<Sarvatt> isn't the nouveau drm backend for plymouth disabled via a distro patch?
<Sarvatt> you have to boot with plymouth:force-drm to enable it I believe
<Sarvatt> #ifdef GDM_HANGING_IS_FINE_WITH_ME ha
<seb128> slangasek, ^
<slangasek> yes, I believe it falls back to the framebuffer interface
<slangasek> which we still want to test
<slangasek> I'm not asking for testing any weird non-standard scenarios, just to make sure we don't regress on the default path
<slangasek> by, for instance, causing lightdm to hang :P
<Sarvatt> thought only the drm renderer worked with flicker free
<mhr3> cyphermox, ping, hey my NetworkManager doesn't want to start after latest updates
<mhr3> it says it can't find libnss3.so
<kenvandine> mhr3, i just had that problem too
<kenvandine> /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libnss3.so was missing
<kenvandine> i just re-installed the deb from the cache and it was fine
<mhr3> i ended up symlinking it
<kenvandine> i thought it was because my laptop died during an upgrade
<kenvandine> weird that you hit it too
<kenvandine> must not have been related
<cyphermox> doesn' t sound good, but it's not NM, but libnss
<kenvandine> but the deb seemed fine
<cyphermox> let me test with this machine, I should be able to trigger that issue
<kenvandine> cyphermox, reinstall of libnss3 fixed it though...
<kenvandine> cyphermox, the package was still installed, but the lib was missing
<cyphermox> kenvandine: yeah, but what might have triggered libnss to break?
<kenvandine> for me, my laptop died during the upgrade so i thought it corrupted it... but that must not be what happened
<GunnarHj> pitti: Posted some clarifications at https://code.launchpad.net/~gunnarhj/language-selector/fontconfig/+merge/75045 Awaiting your further comments before I change anything.
<kenvandine> the deb i had in my apt cache was fine though
<mhr3> i had fresh beta1, i was upgrading ~500 packages, but it went fine
<cyphermox> mhr3: check what this outputs:  grep libnss3 /var/lib/dpkg/info/*
<didrocks> pitti: chrisccoulson: mterry: seb128: new compiz built and published in the ubuntu-desktop ppa. Don't look at the bug list, it's inaccurate apparently but as I couldn't get an updated one despite the many requests through the dayâ¦
<seb128> didrocks, ok
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, thanks
<chrisccoulson> does that fix the stacking issues?
<mdeslaur> slangasek: tested with nouveau, bug updated
<pitti> seb128: hm, I did the gucharmap update in bzr, but seeing that it affects four packages, like abiword, I think we should better revert to 3.0.1; WDYT?
<pitti> hm, abiword doesn't actually seem to require it
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: it should
<seb128> pitti, revert http://git.gnome.org/browse/gucharmap/commit/?id=1f3b859eb4b59af148a890fa1ee3c4d92e05b709
<seb128> pitti, ?
<htorque> slangasek: if you still need nouveau feedback - works fine here, still no logo, but the text screen before lightdm is gone.
<pitti> seb128: ah, yes, even better :)
<chrisccoulson> cool :)
<htorque> slangasek: (no cryptsetup)
<mdeslaur> htorque: is plymouth corrupted for you?
<slangasek> mdeslaur, htorque: you rock, thanks!
<htorque> mdeslaur: right before lightdm starts i get a purple/garbled screen, yes, but that was the case before too.
<mdeslaur> htorque: ok, same here
<mdeslaur> htorque: that's plymouth having a fit :P
<mhr3> cyphermox, http://paste.ubuntu.com/693187/
<mhr3> maybe you see something weird :)
<slangasek> mdeslaur: take it up with the framebuffer implementation, it's not plymouth's fault it doesn't map coherently to your output :)
<dobey> pitti: should i bug you for a couple (string/ui) freeze exceptions? :)
<pitti> dobey: better discuss with the doc team (mdke/jbicha), release team defers to them anyway
<pitti> and for string changes, dpm
<mdeslaur> slangasek: hehe
<cyphermox> mhr3: nothing jumps out, no.
<smspillaz> didrocks: http://paste.ubuntu.com/693192/
<dobey> pitti: so on one of them there's a +1 from dpm and jbicha; do i need to wait for release team to say it's good?
<didrocks> smspillaz: thanks
<pitti> dobey: fine then
<mhr3> cyphermox, afaict the libnss3:amd64.list:/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libnss3.so just wasn't there
<dobey> pitti: also u1 isn't in the ubuntu docs really i think, so not so much an issue for that; the other bug i'm curious about for freeze approval is bug #849494 :)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 849494 in ubuntuone-control-panel "String freeze exception: still offers Evolution plug-in for contact sync in Oneiric" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/849494
<dobey> hrmm, and no dpm around :-/
<pitti> dobey: already approved, see comment 16
<dobey> 16?
<dobey> there are only 9 comments
<cyphermox> mhr3: kenvandine: weird thing is, I just crashed with a kernel oops in ksoftirq
<pitti> sorry, 6
<pitti> dobey: ^
<dobey> oh right; ok. thanks
<dobey> chrisccoulson: ping
<jbicha> dobey: if it's a string freeze exception you need to let the translators list know
<kenvandine> mhr3, right... the file wasn't there but i checked with dpkg -S and dpkg  knew about the file and the package that owned it
<dobey> jbicha: was already done :)
<jbicha> oh ok, carry on :)
<mhr3> kenvandine, then something deleted it
<dobey> i wonder how i am going to fix my laptop after upgrading to oneiric on it
<cyphermox> mhr3: however my system still appears fine, and I still have libnss3, although not all configurations are done
<mhr3> cyphermox, i really can't say what caused it, i just know it was gone
 * didrocks waves good evening, need to run outside to think :)
<pitti> didrocks: good night, sleep well!
<didrocks> pitti: thanks! keep me posted on how it goes with the ppa :)
<dobey> where is thunderbird-couchdb?! :(
<seb128> ok, I'm out for dinner, I will be back a bit later to check on GNOME updates
<seb128> will do the ones available then
<seb128> bbl
<mterry> smspillaz, (testing the new compiz from the PPA): stacking issues seem fine, but I got an half-visible window when I closed a dialog that isn't going away (http://ubuntuone.com/7GfdLX3zLT1VoVFIJqZYHj)
<pitti> TTFN for me as well, see you tomorrow!
<smspillaz> mterry: did you update your plugins-main ?
<mterry> smspillaz, yes
<smspillaz> hm
<smspillaz> ok I'll look into it tomorrow
<htorque> mterry: same thing i got, also (context) menus like to get stuck
<dobey> gnome-panel is very crashy in oneiric
<dobey> and i can't see how to make it have the configuration i had before i upgraded :(
<chrisccoulson> hi dobey
<chrisccoulson> woah, so, color + power account for 1 second of g-s-d startup here!!
<chrisccoulson> i wonder wth is it doing?
<chrisccoulson> brb
<dobey> chrisccoulson: hey. so thunderbird-couchdb? :)
<dobey> doh
<ejat> can someone look at bug 854008
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 854008 in gucharmap "package libgucharmap7 1:3.0.1-0ubuntu1 failed to install/upgrade: trying to overwrite '/usr/lib/libgucharmap_2_90.so.7.0.0', which is also in package libgucharmap-2-90-7 1:3.1.92-0ubuntu1" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/854008
<chrisccoulson> wow, just wow. xrandr plugin - 2.1 seconds!
<chrisccoulson> now i see why gsd holds my session up for 5 seconds
<dobey> chrisccoulson: hey. so thunderbird-couchdb? :)
<chrisccoulson> ah :)
<chrisccoulson> yes, will upload that in a moment
<chrisccoulson> just trying to figure out why my session takes so long to load ;)
<dobey> unity ;)
<ejat> :)
<jbicha> gnome-shell should depend on gnome fallback? bug 852950
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 852950 in gnome-shell "Depend gnome-session-fallback" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/852950
<chrisccoulson> dobey, well, unity is slow
<chrisccoulson> but gnome-settings-daemon is terrible
<chrisccoulson> bug 854101
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 854101 in gnome-settings-daemon "gnome-settings-daemon takes waaaaaaaay too long to start" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/854101
<chrisccoulson> power/color/xrandr plugins account for ~3.1 seconds of session loading
<dobey> chrisccoulson: eh, from my pov, oneiric has totally destroyed my configuration on my laptop :(
<mterry> smspillaz, when you look at that ghost window tomorrow, note that dpkg apparently wasn't done with "setting up" all my packages, including compiz-plugins-main, so my issue may be junk (though htorque did report similar behavior)
<zyga> is mvo still on holiday?
<chrisccoulson> zyga, no, but he's likely to have finished for the day already
<zyga> chrisccoulson, ok, good news
 * kenvandine heads out in search of food, bbiab
<pitti> rodrigo_: are you still working on a new control-center upload today, or should we do that post-b2?
<rodrigo_> pitti, post-b2 better I think, as it depends on an unreleased network-manager
<rodrigo_> desrt, so, what's up with the locale monitor branch in glib?
<pitti> rodrigo_: ack
<desrt> rodrigo_: you wrote it, right?
<htorque> chrisccoulson: maybe connected to output probing? see later comments and charts in bug 828112.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 828112 in unity-greeter "Password field feedback slow at times" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/828112
<rodrigo_> desrt, I think it can be removed, until there's really a way to actually change the lang of apps on the fly
<pitti> chrisccoulson, rodrigo_: can you think of any other new gnome upstream release which ought to get into b2? we need to start building images
<desrt> rodrigo_: right.  that's what i wanted your opinion on
<desrt> how exactly do you envision that working?
<rodrigo_> desrt, yes, I did, based on some discussions with mclasen
<rodrigo_> desrt, right now, I don't, apart from loging out and back in :)
<pitti> I don't see anything else pending on http://people.canonical.com/~platform/desktop/versions.html
<pitti> a new gnome-color-manager might be nice, but that's less critical
<desrt> rodrigo_: we're having some concurrency issues with gettext at the moment, so i'm sort of curious
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i can't think of anything that needs to go in
<seb128> re
<pitti> new nautilus and gvfs might be nice, but nothing released yet
<pitti> wb seb128, just in time
<seb128> time for what?
<pitti> seb128: can you think of any other new gnome upstream release which ought to get into b2? we need to start building images
<chrisccoulson> htorque, yes, it is related to output probing, i'd discovered that already (see my comment on bug 854101)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 854101 in gnome-settings-daemon "gnome-settings-daemon takes waaaaaaaay too long to start" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/854101
<pitti> seb128: control-center is blocked, and versions.html doesn't have other stuff which seems urgent
<dobey> rodrigo_: btw, did you figure what was up with e-d-s/couchdb?
<seb128> pitti, did you guys package the stack that got released while I was at dinner?
<seb128> pitti, g-c-c would be nice
<pitti> seb128: I was saying that a new gvfs and nautilus would be nice, but they need releases first?
<seb128> pitti, nautilus had one
<seb128> I'm on it
<pitti> oh
<seb128> they got
<htorque> chrisccoulson: ah, missed that link. :-)
<seb128> - gnome-menus
<seb128> - pygobject
<seb128> - libwnck
<seb128> - nautilus
<rodrigo_> dobey, no, I'm about to test the new version and do some debug if it still doesn't work
<seb128> - gconf
<pitti> seb128: I did pygobject in Debian, breaks stuff; -> post b2
<seb128> - gtksourceview3
<seb128> - cogl (not on the CD)
<dobey> rodrigo_: ah ok
<rodrigo_> seb128, I'll do gnome-menus
<pitti> seb128: I'll do gnome-menus
<chrisccoulson> seb128, i'm going to wish i never started looking at g-s-d soon ;)
<seb128> pitti, I'm doing nautilus, gconf, gtksourceview3
<seb128> chrisccoulson, ;-)
<pitti> rodrigo_: ok, you were first :)
<seb128> what is blocking g-c-c?
<rodrigo_> pitti, :)
<rodrigo_> seb128, new network-manager-applet
<seb128> we should really get that one in, it's one of those that have a stack of commits
<rodrigo_> libnm-gtk, which is there now
<seb128> can't you just revert that commit?
<rodrigo_> yes, I can
<seb128> can you do this and let gnome-menus to pitti?
<seb128> pitti, libwnck3 as well if you want to do it
<rodrigo_> yes, sure, pitti gets gnome-menus
<pitti> rodrigo_: after all! :-)
<pitti> yes, on it
<rodrigo_> :)
<rodrigo_> well, reverting that patch in g-c-c might need some more reverts
<rodrigo_> I'll have dinner and continue later
<pitti> meh, lp:ubuntu/libwnck3 is completely f**ed up
<jbicha> seb128: the gnome-help links in nautilus should point to ubuntu-help instead
<seb128> jbicha, do you have a patch?
<jbicha> not yet, I can make one
<seb128> jbicha, that would be welcome ;-)
<pitti> seb128: did you already start with sourceview3, or want me to take it? my two from above are trivial
<seb128> pitti, feel free to take it
<pitti> taking then
<seb128> still dealing with nautilus which needs some patches updates
<pitti> please forgive the dumb question, how do I get the classic 2d gnome-panel session these days?
<pitti> (in lightdm, I mean)
<seb128> pitti, install gnome-session-fallback
<pitti> ah, -fallback, thanks
<pitti> was looking for -classic or somethign such
<pitti> I know no better way for testing gnome-menus
<seb128> pitti, yeah, out of trying a menu editor or the application lens in unity
<pitti> oh heck, a classic gnome session with metacity feels OMGFAST!
<bryceh> :-)
<seb128> to start?
<pitti> to anything
<pitti> start, menus, clicking, shutdown, etc.
<jbicha> seb128: http://paste.ubuntu.com/693258/
<seb128> jbicha, can you just commit it to the vcs?
<pitti> ooh, pygobject 3.0.0; I was packaging 2.29.4
<pitti> will do that in Debian, and fix the breakage over the freeze
<jbicha> seb128: done
<seb128> jbicha, thanks
<pitti> seb128: all done; more to go?
<pitti> bah, we outperform versions.html
<seb128> jbicha, do you think you can finish the nautilus update? I'm having build issues because my system is not uptodate
<seb128> I'm updating but it's going to take some 15 minutes...
<jbicha> seb128: I could, do you want to push what you have?
<seb128> jbicha, I just did
<seb128> rodrigo_, pitti did the vala update
<pitti> rodrigo_: yes, it's in unapproved and in bzr
 * pitti thinks it's awesome to see our packaging army at work
<pitti> jbicha: can you please have a quick look at bug 844049?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 844049 in ayatana-design "UIFe: Indicators - Device indicator icon looks like it has an emblem" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/844049
<pitti> jbicha: the fix is in unapproved, so if this is ok, I'd accept it now, so that we have it for beta; if not, I'll hold it back
<seb128> jbicha, did you upload your vino update?
<jbicha> pitti: ok, I gave my approval
<pitti> jbicha: ah, great
<jbicha> seb128: no, but I have now, multi-tasking :-)
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> pitti, once nautilus and gedit (which I'm just building) are uploaded I think we are mostly done with interesting ones
<seb128> g-c-c would be nice but rodrigo_ had depends issue on it so we should wait on that
<geser> which package creates /etc/timezone? For some reason I didn't have that file which resulted in my datetime indicator not working (only displaying the text "Time")
<flacoste> hi! i'd like to report a bug against the 'Time & Date' indicator, but I don't know which package is involved
<jcastro> flacoste: indicator-datetime
<flacoste> thx jcastro!
<pitti> seb128: ok, thanks
<flacoste> of course, it was already reported
<flacoste> and even better, a fix was commited upstream
<seb128> pitti,
<seb128> http://download.gnome.org/sources/gnome-desktop/3.1/gnome-desktop-3.1.92.tar.bz2
<pitti> seb128: on it
<seb128> http://download.gnome.org/sources/gnome-power-manager/3.1/gnome-power-manager-3.1.92.tar.bz2
<seb128> if somebody wants to grab those
<seb128> pitti, we are in low priority ones now I guess so if you guys want to stay stop and start rolling images just say so
<pitti> seb128: we are waiting for g-c-c mostly at this point; everything we can do in parallel is still ok
<pitti> once g-c-c is in, we'll build
<pitti> oh, and naughtylus
<seb128> pitti, let's not wait on g-c-c imho
<pitti> I thought that was the "interesting" one?
<seb128> not sure but I've the feeling it will take a while
<pitti> ok, apport, jockey, software-center, software-properties-gtk all work great with pygobject 3.0.0
<pitti> just gtimelog breaks
<seb128> pitti, right but rodrigo_ said it depends on a new nm-applet version and that he would look at reverting the commit that added the new version but that it could lead to other reverts
<seb128> rodrigo_ left for dinner as well
<pitti> but I'd like to test 3.0.0 with ubiquity, so still post b2
<seb128> so I wouldn't could on it for today
<pitti> seb128: ok
<seb128> could->count
<pitti> seb128: ok, so nautilus and then done?
<seb128> yes
<seb128> gnome-desktop3 would still be nice if you are on it
<pitti> yep, doing now
 * jbicha waiting for nautilus to build again
<seb128> jbicha, do you know if there are lot of sources to patch for the gnome->ubuntu documentation?
<jbicha> seb128: I believe it's just vino & nautilus, most apps provide their own help
<seb128> ok, great ;-)
<jbicha> I need to update jockey's help button though
<seb128> we got bug #853137 today
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 853137 in seahorse "The page 'gkr-keyring' was not found in the document 'ghelpseahorse'." [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/853137
<seb128> but I guess it's a seahorse bug
<seb128> nothing to do with the ubuntu documentation
<jbicha> seb128: also gnome-control-center but that's already been done
<jbicha> *updated for ubuntu-help
<seb128> ok
<pitti> seb128: gpm and g-desktop3 done, both easy and work fine
<seb128> pitti, great
<pitti> jbicha: is nautilus making any trouble? i. e. any risk for b2?
<jbicha> pitti: looks like my dput got stuck, will try again
<pitti> oh, awesome
<jbicha> wow, compact view has some major issues though
<pitti> jbicha: BTW, if dput is causing you trouble, I'm happy to upload it for you from bzr
<jbicha> pitti: please, it keeps timing out at 5547/5548k
<pitti> of course; why would it break at 1/5548..
<pitti> jbicha: thanks for the update!
<pitti> seb128: with nautilus being in now as well, that's it for b2?
<pitti> jbicha: upped
<seb128> pitti, they will roll random side tarballs until tomorrow but I don't see anything worth delaying images
<pitti> agreed
<seb128> g-c-c would be nice to get but I don't see that happen today
<pitti> gvfs would have been nice, but not the end of the world
<pitti> (it fixes a crasher with some dupes)
<seb128> gvfs has 2 commits and translations
<seb128> oh, which one?
<pitti> seb128: bug 447695
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 447695 in gvfs "Nautilus cannot write to shared Vista/Win7 folders with desktop.ini file" [Low,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/447695
<pitti> but nothing that spoils the beta
<seb128> right
<pitti> so, good night everyone! (again)
<rodrigo_> seb128, it's happening, if it builds
<rodrigo_> working on it now
<chrisccoulson> b'ah, still getting weird issues even with the latest compiz
<DBO> define latest compiz
<chrisccoulson> this is totally and utterly broken
<DBO> and define issues
<chrisccoulson> DBO - from the ubuntu-desktop PPA
<DBO> are the issues
<DBO> windows get stuck on my screen when I close/minimize them?
<chrisccoulson> DBO - yes, you beat me to it ;)
<DBO> fucking hell
<DBO> I need to get a patch in there
<DBO> but I dont know
<DBO> how
<chrisccoulson> DBO, oh, you have a fix already?
<DBO> sure
<DBO> it was never broken
<DBO> the wrong animation plugin got mixed in...
<mterry> DBO, what's the patch?  I can put it in the package
<mterry> in the PPA
<DBO> mterry, there is an animation plugin
<DBO> in compiz-plugins-main
<DBO> it was supposed to be updated with the new core
<DBO> but no new package appears to have been pushed
<DBO> https://code.launchpad.net/~compiz-team/compiz-animation-plugin/0.9.5
<DBO> that code
<DBO> needs to be used with latest core
<DBO> or you get ghost windows
<DBO> like mad
<DBO> so yeah... thats all I got
<DBO> mterry, do you want me to tarball it up or you just want to hack it in yourself?
<DBO> (seeing as I have no clue what I would be doing really)
<mterry> DBO, looking to see if I understand situation (/me looks at what we have in PPA)
<mterry> DBO, the package in the PPA says it uses today's bzr snapshot...
<DBO> mterry, checking
<DBO> mterry, src/animation.cpp is not correct
<DBO> they are different in the different versions
<DBO> so are the corresponding xml files
<mterry> DBO, can you tell if that is all that's missing or did we screw up when making the snapshot in other ways?
<DBO> mterry, looks like we grabbed the oneric trunk rather than trunk trunk
<DBO> I cant promise about upgrade paths
<DBO> since I just dont know what they are
<DBO> also I dont know if the diffs in the xml files are from your guys or us
<kenvandine> i would imagine we want to stick with the oneiric trunk
<DBO> kenvandine, no
<DBO> we cant
<DBO> the point of this test
<DBO> is so we can merge into the oneiric trunk
<kenvandine> i see
<kenvandine> so the snapshot should have been taken from the other branch
<DBO> right
<mterry> DBO, https://code.launchpad.net/~compiz-team/compiz-animation-plugin/0.9.5 is trunk-trunk?
<kenvandine> DBO, i think smspillaz was creating the tarballs
<kenvandine> was my impression, based on the chat i saw between him and didrocks
<kenvandine> DBO, so you are sure what was uploaded was wrong?
<DBO> yes
<kenvandine> ok
<DBO> mterry, yes
<mterry> DBO, do you know if this is true for all the plugins or just the animation one?
<seb128> DBO, sept. 19 13:42:30 <smspillaz>	didrocks: https://chinstrap.canonical.com/~smspillaz/releases/0.9.5.94ub1/compiz-plugins-main_0.95rev27.orig.tar.gz . The only thing that's changed is that I fixed bug https://bugs.launchpad.net/compiz-plugins-main/+bug/853807
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 853807 in unity "crash when looping paint list in preparePaint (on closing windows)" [High,Fix committed]
<seb128> mterry, ^
<DBO> mterry, just the animation one
<seb128> that's what is in the ppa I think
<DBO> mterry, the animation plugin is the only plugin with a "critical" change
<rodrigo_> ok, g-c-c built
<DBO> chrisccoulson, btw
<DBO> if you want to fix your system for a bit
<kenvandine> rodrigo_, i see that gnome-contacts is more useful now... woot!
<DBO> disable the animation plugin
<DBO> when the new plugins go up
<DBO> turn it back on
<rodrigo_> kenvandine, yes, much more :)
<mterry> FYI, I'm working on updating the animation plugin in the PPA
<mterry> (in case that wasn't clear)
<rodrigo_> seb128, g-c-c uploaded, is it in time?
<seb128> pitti, ^
<rodrigo_> I thought he'd gone :)
<seb128> rodrigo_, let's see if they ack it before starting rolling images
<rodrigo_> ok
<seb128> rodrigo_, yeah, well he will read backlog tomorrow, I doubt any other r-t members will ack it while he's not there
<seb128> so let's see tomorrow
<seb128> we can probably get it in, it will be on updates and on respins if there is any
<seb128> which is likely
<rodrigo_> ok
<rodrigo_> I'll go watch a film or something, so good night!
<kenvandine> good night rodrigo_!
<seb128> 'night rodrigo_
<seb128> rodrigo_, ok, I pinged them, g-c-c got reviewed and is in
<popey> cjwatson: as I recall you did some work on ubiquity in relation to EFI installs. I have done a clean install on an Apple Mac laptop, and I suspect that the install has been done in "EFI mode" rather than "BIOS mode". As a result the nvidia binary driver doesn't work. Which sucks a bit.
<popey> cjwatson: citation:-
<popey> bah, http://mjg59.dreamwidth.org/2929.html?thread=54129#cmt54129
<popey> cjwatson: so my question is, how do I install in "BIOS mode"?
<mterry> DBO, (just fyi, I updated the plugins in the PPA)
<DBO> mterry, now is the part where I start praying everything is okay...
<mterry> DBO, heh, I hope you're in good with $DEITY
<DBO> I had a dream last night that I met a flying computer mouse that could talk
<DBO> that is my new god
<mterry> DBO, damn.  That is reasonable
<DBO> mterry, I am known for my rational mind and sound manner of dealing with all rangers of issues
<DBO> rangers...
<DBO> im way too tired these days
<DBO> someone needs to invent a longer day so I can sleep
<mterry> DBO, :)
<micahg> DBO: xkcd.com/320/
<mterry> good night all!
<dupondje> sweet :) the Gnome updates
<DBO> night mterry
<RAOF> Morning DBO :)
<DBO> morning RAOF
<DBO> micahg, I prefer slowing down the earths rotation personally
<DBO> however due to the devastating impacts of the moons gravity
<DBO> the days are already getting longer
<DBO> so all I really need is a time machine, that goes forward in time, faster than 1x
<micahg> DBO: good luck with that :), http://xkcd.com/162/
<DBO> micahg, so you're saying that my true object is to build the worlds largest flywheel
<DBO> and get it really going
<DBO> (and anchor it somewhere witch some decent rooting)
<micahg> DBO: sounds like an interesting project for winter vacation
<DBO> do we have to take winter vacation?
<RAOF> Well, you're welcome to work, but it'll still be taken out of your vacation time :)
<DBO> excellent
<popey> cjwatson: ignore me, found the issue and how to fix it
<jbicha> oh, nautilus isn't even in the desktop set
<DBO> chrisccoulson, the issue should be resolved now
<cjwatson> popey: hey, do you have that system still available for testing?  I have a test script that needs to be run
<popey> cjwatson: I'm currently reinstalling 11.10 on it in 'bios mode', but am happy to do whatever you need
<cjwatson> popey: I can forward you a mail; what address?
<popey> alan@popey.com
<cjwatson> sent
<popey> cjwatson: ok, so that mail doesn't say I need to do an install of any kind, just fiddle in a live environment?
<popey> the 'fix' I got from mjg59 was 'insert ubuntu cd, hold down alt, boot, at menu choose 'windows' instead of 'efi'.
<cjwatson> popey: yes, this is purely live fiddling
<cjwatson> popey: that's a fix too, but I'm trying to make things more robust
<popey> ok
<cjwatson> I mean, that's certainly the best fix for the moment, or you could use the amd64+mac CD
<popey> will do the fiddling and let you know
<cjwatson> but since I've had reports of bricking systems, I want to take the opportunity for debugging
<cjwatson> ta
<popey> sure
<popey> cjwatson: the cd I have is from beta 1, which is dated 1/9/11, your mail is dated 31/8 and asked for the daily live cd to be used. does it matter?
<cjwatson> it doesn't matter
<popey> ok
<popey> cjwatson: sadly it still says amd64/efi
<popey> cjwatson: I am happy to install an ssh server on this box if you want remote access to it.
<cjwatson> popey: that would be good, thanks
<popey> cjwatson: ok, a live environment sufficient or prefer an install?
<cjwatson> preferably live with that build tree available
<popey> ok
<popey> cjwatson: ok to use your ssh key from launchpad?
<cjwatson> yep
<cjwatson> I can do IPv6 if that's easier
<popey> hehe, i haven't quite got to ipv6 yet :D
<cjwatson> I always advertise it just in case; sometimes it saves somebody the effort of poking a hole in NAT
<popey> gotcha
<chrisccoulson> RAOF, there?
<RAOF> Yo yo, ho!
<chrisccoulson> hi RAOF
<chrisccoulson> did you see bug 854101?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 854101 in ubuntu-boot-speed "gnome-settings-daemon takes waaaaaaaay too long to start" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/854101
<RAOF> I did indeed.
<RAOF> What system are you running on?
<chrisccoulson> RAOF, it seems that it's doing XRRGetScreenResources 3 times at startup ;)
<chrisccoulson> RAOF, this is an intel system
<RAOF> Hah!
<RAOF> I suspect that it'd take much less time on a different GPU; there's a VGA probing problem on intel at the moment.
<chrisccoulson> ah, ok
<chrisccoulson> i think i can reduce it down to one call
 * RAOF needs to chase down the mailing list to see if Keith's fixed that yet.
<chrisccoulson> i don't see any reason why we couldn't share the same GnomeRRScreen across plugins in g-s-d....
<RAOF> Is it actually making 3 X protocol calls?
<chrisccoulson> RAOF, yeah. it creates a GnomeRRScreen in 3 different plugins, and that does XRRGetScreenResources each time it initializes
<RAOF> Because unity-greeter starts gnome-settings-daemon, doesn't it?  And when I xtraced that I only got 1 (set of) RANDR protocol request(s).
<chrisccoulson> RAOF, it doesn't start all of the plugins
<broder> chrisccoulson: what plugins other than xrandr?
<chrisccoulson> broder, xrandr, power, color
<broder> eww, power needs randr? oh right - the brightness interface. blech
<RAOF> Yeah; sharing the GnomeRRScreen sounds like a reasonable idea.
<chrisccoulson> RAOF, yeah, i'll do that first thing in the morning
<chrisccoulson> i don't see a reason why that wouldn't work
<chrisccoulson> and that will save a full second on my nice, fast laptop
<chrisccoulson> so it should be quite a win
<RAOF> Alternatively, could the plugins be loaded in parallel?
<broder> alternatively, could you add a boolean to GnomeRRScreen for whether or not to probe, and not probe for color and power?
<broder> seems like they wouldn't care that much about up-to-date info
<chrisccoulson> broder - well, that's an API change regardless of what we do. but adding that flag means the caller needs to make a decision on whether it thinks the information is up-to-date or not
<RAOF> You'd need to add some global caching to gnome-desktop for that to work, right?
<chrisccoulson> i think i'd rather do something like ubuntu_gnome_rr_screen_get_default() for now
<chrisccoulson> or something like that ;)
<broder> RAOF: the backend that gnome_rr_screen_new calls into already takes a boolean for whether or not to trigger a probe (i.e. RRGetScreenResources vs. RRGetScreenResourcesCurrent), it's just always true when coming from gnome_rr_screen_new
<RAOF> Ah, funcy.
<broder> (gnome_rr_screen_new -> gnome_rr_screen_initable_init -> screen_info_new, which takes a needs_reprobe boolean for which _initable_init always passes TRUE)
<chrisccoulson> right, that makes sense though :)
<chrisccoulson> in general, that's what you want when you initialize a new context
<broder> chrisccoulson: i might care about getting the current state without triggering a probe, which might cause the state to change
<broder> e.g. it's annoying sometimes that i can't run "xrandr -q" without it potentially changing what my current configuration is, due to g-s-d picking up the RRChange event
<broder> and probing, at least on intel, has been expensive for a while now - at least going back to natty
<broder> anyway, i think i've just convinced myself that this boolean flag makes sense, so i'll probably go and send a patch off to gnome-desktop upstream regardless of what you guys decide to do :)
<chrisccoulson> broder - how does it make sense? which of the 3 plugins should set the flag true to do a reprobe?
<broder> randr
<chrisccoulson> and what happens if you disable that plugin?
<chrisccoulson> will the other 2 trigger a reprobe?
<chrisccoulson> or change the loading order?
<broder> why should they? that's not their responsibility
<broder> power and color should be reacting to whatever configuration is active, not actively going and seeking out new ones
<chrisccoulson> well, then they initialize with information that is not up-to-date?
<broder> no, the information is up to date according to the X server's view of the world
<broder> it accurately reflects whatever the X server is doing at the point they're initialized
<broder> and they listen for randr change events so their view stays up to date
<chrisccoulson> so what is the point in the reprobe at all then?
<broder> because the randr plugin's responsibility is trying to make sure that the outputs you've connected are active
<broder> though when you put it that way, i'm not entirely sure
<chrisccoulson> well, it can do that without a reprobe if what you say is true ;)
<broder> right
<broder> i mean, there's my idealized world, and then there's the real world where you don't always get notified for hotplug events
<broder> but even in that case, if we assume that g-s-d is only really started at bootup, the X server's info should be up to date
<RAOF> Well, the time between starting X and starting a user session is unbounded.
<broder> chrisccoulson: it might make sense for none of the g-s-d plugins to do a probe, but for e.g. the monitors capplet to do one when it starts up
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-09-20
<pitti> Good morning
<kenvandine> good morning pitti!
<RAOF> Hey pitti!
<pitti> the meeting point of US, AU, and EU!
<pitti> kenvandine: still busy catching up on email? :-)
<kenvandine> yup :)
<pitti> hey RAOF, how are you? did you see that rodrigo updated colord in ubuntu? we needed to get the stuff in for b2, so we couldn't wait for a sync from Debian; but of course we should sync again once 0.1.12 is in debian
<kenvandine> i am actually in california for a couple days
<RAOF> pitti: Yeah, I did.
<kenvandine> so a few hours further back in time :)
<RAOF> pitti: I didn't realise that it was wanted for b2, otherwise I would have uploaded it myself.
<micahg> pitti: can't sync, bad version
<pitti> argh
 * micahg thinks lintian should barf on that, but hasn't gotten around to fixing it
<kenvandine> i wish it would
 * kenvandine makes that mistake too often :/
<micahg> bug 782308 if anyone is feeling adventerous
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 782308 in lintian "Lintian should warn about if there is a -XubuntuY without a corresponding Debian entry" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/782308
<jbicha> pitti: good morning
<pitti> hey jbicha, how are you?
<jbicha> pitti: good, I had to set my dput to sftp so that big uploads work
<jbicha> could you add nautilus to the desktop set?
<pitti> jbicha: I can't (at least not permanently), I'm afraid; I'm afraid you need to email cjwatson to ask for this
<pitti> jbicha: I'll sponsor it; however, I don't think it'll land in b2
<pitti> jbicha: uploaded
<jbicha> ok, thanks!
 * micahg wonders why nautilus wouldn't be in the desktop set
<RAOF> pitti: Do you have any insight into PolicyKit development?  I've got http://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/polkit-devel/2011-September/000353.html which will enable us to switch polkit support back on in colord.
<pitti> RAOF: probably best to directly discuss that with davidz (he's Boston time)
<pitti> RAOF: he probably will prefer a bz.fd.o bug for it
<robert_ancell> smspillaz, if I get a XConfigureRequest, should it always be responded to with a XConfigureWindow?
<RAOF> pitti: And davidz would be in what IRC channels? :).  I'll also go file a bug.
<pitti> RAOF: I usually catch him in #udev on freenode
<pitti> but he's usually pretty good in seeing bz mail
<pitti> RAOF: when you package colord for Debian, can you please add the missing liblcms2-dev dependency to libcolord-dev?
<RAOF> Oooh, certainly.
<pitti> we got a control-center build failure due to that
<pitti> RAOF: actually, seems the -dev package is missing a whole lot more
<RAOF> In fact, I'll add all the requires there.
<pitti> heh, snap :)
<pitti> dbus, gobject, etc.
<RAOF> Yeah.
<pitti>   * debian/control: Add missing liblcms2-dev, libdbus-1-dev, libglib2.0-dev
<pitti>     dependencies to libcolord-dev, to fix FTBFS of reverse dependencies.
<pitti> something like that
<RAOF> Yup.
<RAOF> Done
<robert_ancell> RAOF, any idea why onboard would send three configure requests? http://paste.ubuntu.com/693515/
<RAOF> Animation?
<RAOF> Not really, no.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, it wants to be normal sized, then requests two tiny windows
<RAOF> Does it do that all at once?
<robert_ancell> RAOF, yes, before the map request
<RAOF> No idea.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, what's the correct response as a window manager - do XConfigureWindow each time?
<RAOF> I don't know sorry.
<RAOF> Sam would know, obviously, as might DBO :)
<robert_ancell> RAOF, perhaps you know this one.  How does focus work in X?  Do the windows request focus and the window manager gives it to them?  It appears the default behaviour is the window under the cursor has focus
<RAOF> That's my understanding of the default focus mode, yes.  Well, ish.
<broder> robert_ancell: http://standards.freedesktop.org/wm-spec/wm-spec-latest.html#id2550738
<robert_ancell> aha
<robert_ancell> cheers broder
<broder> robert_ancell: when in doubt, guess "ClientMessage to the root window with what you want as the message type" :-P
<RAOF> Although clients can just XSetInputFocus if they so desire.
<robert_ancell> Now I think I understand why wm developers mutter about focus stealing so much...
<broder> RAOF: on a totally unrelated note, do you know if anybody's modified xtrace or written something like it that can filter on certain extensions or do any filtering at all?
<RAOF> broder: What do you mean by filtering?  xtrace itself can filter out extensions to the client running under it.
<broder> RAOF: no, i want it to pass everything through, but i only want it to print out, say, RandR messages
<RAOF> Oh.  I just pass everything through grep :)
<broder> ugh :)
<broder> i guess the messages are all confined to one line so it's not that bad
<smspillaz> robert_ancell: it depends
<smspillaz> robert_ancell: if you choose to do nothing, you must send a synethetic ConfigureNotify to the client window with the same position it alrady had
<smspillaz> otherwise you're allowed to do whatever you want with it
<robert_ancell> smspillaz, right, that's what I figured.  Any idea why onboard would send these bogus 1x1 requests?
<smspillaz> robert_ancell: it may be for a toplevel unmapped window / inputonly window and not actually for the keyboard window itself
<didrocks> good morning
<robert_ancell> smspillaz, the requests are all for the same window, but it does seem to produce a panel style window if you kill the main window.  So perhaps it's testing if the window manager will let it hide?
<pitti> bonjour didrocks, ca va?
<didrocks> pitti: guten morgen pitti. I'm ok, thanks! you?
<pitti> didrocks: bit tired still, was a rather short night, but ok
<pitti> didrocks: pondering what to do with bug 779382
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 779382 in unity-2d "update-notifier not visible under unity" [Critical,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/779382
<pitti> didrocks: I think we should just whitelist u-notifier, but that doesn't seem to work with u-2d
<pitti> didrocks: what's the process for raising DX' awareness to fix the whitelist handling for -2d?
 * pitti can't remember whether it's subscription, assignment, upstream task, milestone, etc.
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, the whitelist is different in unity-2d and unity-3dâ¦
<didrocks> let me look at the bug first
<pitti> didrocks: ah, so it's just a matter of setting the whitelist in two different places? that'd be easy then
<didrocks> pitti: isn't what design wants to kill (update-notifier icon) and just let update-manager appearing?
<pitti> didrocks: yes, that's the default now, but people may have configured it to show the icon instead
<didrocks> hum, weird, the schema changed, it should be the same
<didrocks> the code is different, but it's looking at the same key now
<didrocks> pitti: do we really want to support that? Last time I wanted to add something to the systray, it was a long discussion with mpt who didn't want to and let people edit the whitelist
<didrocks> otherwise, the whitelist would be "All" (like all posts on OMGUbuntu are doing)
 * didrocks still thinks that this whitelist is useless
<pitti> didrocks: well, update-notifier is a bit special here, as it regressed only recently (after beta-1) for unity-2d
<pitti> before that it apparently appeared in 2d's systra
<pitti> y
<didrocks> pitti: indeed, because there was no whitelist for unity-2d
<didrocks> but it was already blacklisted in unity-3d for a cycle
<pitti> so this was a feature/ui change
<pitti> right, for -3d
<pitti> slangasek's concern is primarily for 2d, AFAIUI
<smspillaz> robert_ancell: perhaps
<didrocks> it's just making -2d the same as 3d
<didrocks> why the concern is only on 2d and not 3d?
<smspillaz> robert_ancell: I mean, the default behaviour compiz adopts is to just do what the client asks for as long as the window is managed really
<pitti> and as it changed behaviour after FF/UIF, and thus stops people who got used to the icon from upgrading from beta to final, we should at least whiltelist that one
<robert_ancell> smspillaz, it's weird then, I wonder what it does with onboard to avoid being 1x1
<slangasek> I'm concerned about both - but for beta-2 I'm concerned about unity-2d in particular because up to now, unity-2d users have been getting their notifications of updates without interruption
<slangasek> if we break that, some users may not notice they're running insecure systems
<pitti> it's also in the session indicator now, but of course you need to know about this
<smspillaz> robert_ancell: it probably resizes itself back
<slangasek> session indicator> heh, yes, I would never have thought to look there
<didrocks> anyway, I think we should be coherent between both
<didrocks> that is, enabling in 3d and 2d if we are going to enable it
<pitti> so let's whitelist it in both then?
<pitti> sounds good to me
<didrocks> normally, it's the wmclass which is used
<didrocks> so, we should have a try
<pitti> didrocks: can we JFDI this without a huge process? I'll take the bullets, you can blame me :)
<didrocks> pitti: will do that, and I was hoping today would be quiet :)
 * pitti never really believed in deliberatly breaking our own software even
<pitti> didrocks: well, I don't think it's a beta-2 blocker, we can't wait for that anyway
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, I spent a faire amount of time with design to discuss that the whitelist is useless and dangerous
<didrocks> and now, softwares in ppa editing the whitelist in their postinst
<didrocks> sedding in the gsetting schemasâ¦
 * didrocks tries to get the wmclass of the window
<slangasek> pitti: I have targeted the bug to beta-2, because of the issue of unity-2d users upgrading to beta-2 and then having no idea why they're not getting updates...
<RAOF> Oh, my.
<didrocks> slangasek: TBH, we have the same issue with people who upgraded to natty then
<slangasek> not a blocker for images, but I do think it should be a blocker for beta-2
<didrocks> slangasek: they set the value to on, but never saw any update with unithy
<didrocks> unity
<pitti> slangasek: for upgrades from natty? ok
<didrocks> hence my suprise it's a blocker on a beta, but not on a previous stable release
<slangasek> didrocks: yes, and I think it's a major issue there as well, and one I would like to SRU for
<pitti> if we can get an upload right now, it'd still be possible to squeeze in
<slangasek> didrocks: it's a blocker on beta because I didn't know about it for the previous stable release ;)
<pitti> as I want to shuffle image builds to wait for the FTBFSed control-center
<pitti> didrocks: is that hard to change? I didn't see an existing gsettings override file in unity
<pitti> didrocks: but for the "rush" one, I guess -2d is enough
<didrocks> pitti: there is none, I edit upstream
<pitti> (unless it's  using the very same blacklist)
<didrocks> pitti: it's the same
<didrocks> so it needs an unity upload
<didrocks> and maybe a -2d if it doesn't work there
 * didrocks is looking for the wmclass
<pitti> didrocks: ah; but as this is a distro specific change until we port update-notifier to indicator, a dh_installgsettings override file might be easier?
<didrocks> pitti: all unity settings change are done upstream, we don't override our software until someone else ship unity
<pitti> ok
<didrocks> pitti: so better to keep the upstream in sync as they are using jhbuild for them
<didrocks> is there a way to force update-notifier showing its icon?
<didrocks> (apart from the gconf key, but just as a test)
<pitti> you mean if you have up to date software?
<slangasek> downgrade $randompkg?
<didrocks> yeah, ok, will downgrade
<didrocks> ah, found the gsettings corresponding key
<didrocks> great, I have notifications, but didn't see the reject for showing the icon
 * didrocks sigh at the debugging message removed to find the wmclass of the icon (as clicking on unity gives compiz if you whitelist it)
<didrocks> ok, the WMCLASS is Update-notifier
<didrocks> works on 2d as well, phew
<didrocks> uploading unity
<kenvandine> didrocks, FYI bug 854448
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 854448 in unity "Skype is not in whitelist for Systray" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/854448
<kenvandine> jasoncwarner_ just filed that
<didrocks> kenvandine: ?
<didrocks> jasoncwarner_ is aware about sni-qt isn't it?
<didrocks> we discussed that a lot
<kenvandine> oh yeah... we did talk about that before my vacation
<kenvandine> it isn't working for some reason
<kenvandine> jasoncwarner_, ^^^
<kenvandine> jasoncwarner_, hadn't you filed a bug about that before?
<didrocks> I also filed the weekly report with status on itâ¦
<kenvandine> hehe
<jasoncwarner_> I thought I did
<kenvandine> i know you did... now i remember that
<didrocks> and there is the rationale in the changelog when I removed it from the systray
<jasoncwarner_> didrocks: so, skype should work without the whitelist? because it was not on a fresh install today
<jasoncwarner_> which is why I thought I needed to file the bug....even with the fix to sni-qt
<didrocks> jasoncwarner_: it should, you should have sni-qt
<didrocks> jasoncwarner_: is sni-qt installed?
<didrocks> jasoncwarner_: just tried skype here, and I have the icon with sni-qt showing it
<jasoncwarner_> didrocks: yes, it is installed...
<jasoncwarner_> didrocks: trying something
<didrocks> It should be shown as an indicator
<didrocks> with an additional "Activate" menu that we had manually to some applications as you can't just right click on them
<jasoncwarner_> didrocks: just removed it from my whitelist....going to check...one sec
<kenvandine> you need 32bit version of sni-qt
<kenvandine> looking at bug 838470
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 838470 in sni-qt "Skype not showing in indicator" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/838470
<didrocks> jasoncwarner_: you need to restart unity to get it worked
<kenvandine> do you have that?
<didrocks> yeah, we discussed about the issue where it didn't work because of multi-arch
<didrocks> and we fixed it for you and ping you jasoncwarner_ with agateau :)
 * slangasek hugs didrocks - thanks for the unity upload!
 * didrocks hugs slangasek back, you're welcome
 * slangasek installs sni-qt:i386 here for good measure
<pitti> didrocks: yay you, thanks
<didrocks> slangasek: should be correctly transitionned, I didn't test it here but agateau did
<kenvandine> pitti, if you are waiting on something for images... it would be nice to get my ido upload in
<didrocks> (to multiarch)
<kenvandine> it fixes the unclickable calendar in indicator-datetime
<kenvandine> pitti, and is very low risk imo
<pitti> kenvandine: *nod*
<kenvandine> thx
<slangasek> didrocks: yeah, I now have both sni-qt and sni-qt:i386 installed, looks good :)
<jasoncwarner_> didrocks: seems sni-qt isn't working...restarted and it isn't there.  I must have had it in my whitelist in my other install...this is a fresh install today so testing a whole bunch of stuff ;)
<didrocks> jasoncwarner_: amd64?
<jasoncwarner_> didrocks: yeah
<jasoncwarner_> didrocks:  I did install skype:i386 this time ;)
<didrocks> slangasek: is there anything particular to do in the seed? to install the i386 version? ^
<slangasek> didrocks: you can't seed packages from a different architecture; shouldn't we ask for the skype:i386 package to recommend/depend on it?
<didrocks> slangasek: it would be the case for a lot of Qt application (sni-qt is for all Qt applications showing something in the systray)
<didrocks> like mumble and such
<slangasek> right, but there are fairly few i386 binary-only qt apps that I know of
<slangasek> but regardless, there really is no way to seed it
<slangasek> (and certainly no space for it...)
<didrocks> slangasek: sni-qt is already seeded by default
<didrocks> it seems the issue is only for amd64 application with 32 bits only
<slangasek> I mean there's no way to seed the foreign-arch one
<didrocks> ok, so right now, the skype recommends seems better
<slangasek> ... which would require pulling a second copy of qt onto the CDs, which is definitely not possible
<didrocks> ah, indeed, even it's a plugin, it will pull the 32 bits version of Qt
<didrocks> slangasek: however, that won't fix the situation when people install skype from the skype website
<didrocks> jasoncwarner_: you downloaded skype from the partner repo?
<slangasek> didrocks: well, except skype is a partner package... provided by skype... so whatever they put in one place, they'll put in the other :)
<jasoncwarner_> didrocks: I enabled the source in S-C and then I apt-get installed skype:i386
<jasoncwarner_> installing via S-C didn't get me the correct version (which is something else I have to track down)
<jasoncwarner_> tremolux and MVO ^^ I was going to talk to you guys about that...
<didrocks> slangasek: ah ok, do you know about who is in charge of asking them/us doing, this tweak?
<slangasek> didrocks: it also means we don't have access to directly modify the skype:i386 package anyway.  Could you talk to Brian Thomason about this?  He's the contact
<didrocks> jasoncwarner_: each issue after another? :)
<didrocks> slangasek: excellent, will do, thanks!
<didrocks> jasoncwarner_: so, at least, we have the explanation with sni-qt, did reinstalling the 32 bits version of it fixed it for you?
<jasoncwarner_> didrocks: I'm like the perfect user tester ;) I keep breaking my machine...mostly id10t style ;)
<didrocks> jasoncwarner_: stop breaking things! it's 8:40 and I still didn't get any coffee :)
<kenvandine> jasoncwarner_, libido got accepted, so that fix will be coming soon
<kenvandine> my body still feels like it is in europe... but i think i need to force myself to sleep soon
<ricotz> good morning
<ricotz> i have add some comment on the cogl/clutter update on the pad
<ricotz> didrocks, pitti ^ is this worth the trouble to get it into beta2?
<Sweetshark> Morning, all!
<kenvandine> good morning Sweetshark
<pitti> hey Sweetshark
<pitti> ricotz: ABI break should certainly be done after b2 at this point
<didrocks> hey ricotz, Sweetshark
<ricotz> pitti, yeah, i am thinking the same
<ricotz> didrocks, hi
<Sweetshark> pitti: 3.4.3-2 is blocked at debian because of debian bug 642176 (caused by dokos gcc update there). But I would fix ubuntu bugs #835153 and ubuntu bug #799535, so should we still release that merged as 3.4.3-1ubuntu2 for beta2?
<ubot2> Debian bug 642176 in g++-4.6 "g++-4.6: libreoffice/mozilla build fails with gcc >= 4.6.1-10 due to gcc PR 50442" [Important,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/642176
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 835153 in libreoffice "oosplash.bin crashed with SIGSEGV in XSetForeground()" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/835153
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 799535 in libreoffice "package libreoffice-common (not installed) failed to install/upgrade: tentata sovrascrittura di "/usr/share/mime/packages/openoffice.org.xml" presente anche nel pacchetto openoffice.org-debian-menus 3.3-9556" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/799535
<pitti> Sweetshark: too late for b2
<Sweetshark> pitti: ah, ok.
<pitti> but we can upload it afterwards of course
<robert_ancell> didrocks, hey, do you know much about indicators?  I'm wondering if it's safe to load them in a separate thread, because it's behaving really badly in unity-greeter
<didrocks> robert_ancell: hey, how badly? FYI, in unity, we have it in a service (unity-panel-service) which communicates to unity through dbus
<pitti> rodrigo_: good morning
<pitti> rodrigo_: FYI, the gnome-control-center FTBFS, I retried it after I fixed libcolord-dev depenendies; armel failed again, need another publisher; but it's being handled, so you can ignore it
<didrocks> ah, at least, oneconf syncing is working on staging now :-)
<didrocks> pitti: btw, reminder about the team meeting report
<pitti> argh, that, too
 * pitti doing 5 things at the same time
<pitti> didrocks: cheers
<robert_ancell> didrocks, getting weird crashes
<robert_ancell> didrocks, using new Indicator.Object.from_file (filename) and loading them all in parallel
<robert_ancell> but they're not put into the menubar in the UI thread from then on
<robert_ancell> rather they are  put into the menubar in the UI thread from then on
<didrocks> robert_ancell: I guess definitively threading it will be nicer, but see with tedg
<didrocks> robert_ancell: the only way we got some stability in natty is to put them in a separate process (it was in the same process in maverick and was the culpurit of most UNE crashers)
<robert_ancell> didrocks, is each one in it's own process?
<didrocks> robert_ancell: no, there are all in the same process (unity-panel-service),
<robert_ancell> didrocks, so they are loaded sequentially in one process?
<robert_ancell> that's my next plan of attach, to load them like that
<robert_ancell> attack
<robert_ancell> late :)
<didrocks> robert_ancell: no, they are all loaded one after another. First indicator_object_new_from_file() and then cycling on the libraries resulting from that call
<robert_ancell> didrocks, cycling on the libraries?
<didrocks> basically something like that (from memory):
<didrocks> while (((name = g_dir_read_name (dir)) != NULL) && g_str_has_suffix (name, ".so"))
<didrocks>     path = g_build_filename (INDICATORDIR, name, NULL);
<didrocks>     â¦
<didrocks>      and using indicator_object_new_from_file on that
<robert_ancell> oh, ok
<robert_ancell> they take *ages* to load.  They really should be loaded in parallel
<didrocks> robert_ancell: indeed, you can see that when unity is starting (all indicators appearing one after another)
<didrocks> robert_ancell: I guess we can try that as we are protected in a separate process
<didrocks> robert_ancell: but in unity-greeter, if you are in the same process, try to protect from crashâ¦ :/
<robert_ancell> didrocks, I'll get back to you, I think it may be broken
<robert_ancell> didrocks, so, how do you pass the objects over d-bus?
<robert_ancell> then I'll fork it in unity-greeter which will be much safer
<didrocks> robert_ancell: that's more than possible, we discovered a lot of issues with indicators, even if normally the backends are in separate processes (all the indicator*services) and so should be easily multithreadable
<didrocks> robert_ancell: dbusmenu
<BigWhale> apt-get update just informed me that one signature was invalid. How do I check which repository it belongs to?
<mvo> BigWhale: it seems like there is a server issue currently
<BigWhale> never mind
<BigWhale> with the recent crack into kernel.org and such, I got sort of paranoid :>
<Sweetshark> pitti: do you know if we ever had a openoffice.org-debian-menus package? I suspect it has always been from a third party. bug #799535
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 799535 in libreoffice "package libreoffice-common (not installed) failed to install/upgrade: tentata sovrascrittura di "/usr/share/mime/packages/openoffice.org.xml" presente anche nel pacchetto openoffice.org-debian-menus 3.3-9556" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/799535
<mvo> BigWhale: what was the error message you got?
<BigWhale> mvo: W: GPG error: http://archive.ubuntu.com oneiric Release: The following signatures were invalid: BADSIG 40976EAF437D05B5 Ubuntu Archive Automatic Signing Key <ftpmaster@ubuntu.com>
<mvo> BigWhale: thanks! I start some investigation on this now
<BigWhale> mvo: you're welcome. and thank you. :)
<mvo> I wonder if more people are affected, I get this too on two machines
<pitti> Sweetshark: to check: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/openoffice.org-debian-menus/+changelog
<pitti> Sweetshark: I can't reach LP or the DC right now
<geser> mvo: I've seen someone in #ubuntu-de having it too
<mvo> geser: thanks, its under investigation, server is out of sync, admins working on it
<rodrigo_> morning
<robert_ancell> didrocks, seems much more stable now
<rodrigo_> hey robert_ancell
<RAOF> Bah!  *That's* why avahi backtraces don't get retraced properly?  All their symbols are in avahi-dbg!
<robert_ancell> rodrigo_, hey
<pitti> can anyone else reach launchpad or chinstrap?
 * pitti toddles off for breakfast, perhaps it'll come back by then
<Sweetshark> pitti: that link doesnt exist, so it is third party right?
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<Sweetshark> pitti: LP is fine here
<seb128> hey
<didrocks> salut seb128
<seb128> lut didrocks, ca va bien ?
<didrocks> seb128: on fait aller, et toi?
<seb128> ca va bien je pense, je te dirais aprÃ¨s un cafÃ© ;-)
<seb128> didrocks, oh, slangasek talked you about whitelisting update-notifier it seems ;-)
<pitti> Sweetshark: right
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<seb128> hey pitti, how are you?
<pitti> seb128: bit hectic, but fine, thanks! how about yourself?
<seb128> I'm fine thanks
<pitti> colord/armel published now, giving back gnome-control-center again
<seb128> pitti, is there anything I can help on?
<chrisccoulson> hi seb128, pitti
<pitti> seb128: currently fighting with DC/mirroring problems for image builds, not much there, I'm afraid
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson, how are you?
<chrisccoulson> i'm good thanks, how are you?
<didrocks> seb128: indeed :)
<seb128> pitti, ok, just say the word if you need me for something
<pitti> seb128: but if you could have a look at the ~ 4 c-desktop-team assigned bugs on http://status.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/ubuntu-desktop/index.html, and see if they should be assigned/upstreamed/etc, that'd be nice
<seb128> pitti, ok
<didrocks> seb128: pitti: chrisccoulson: jasoncwarner_: seems the 3rd tarball of c-p-m was still wrong. Adding a distro-patch which explained why we got those artefacts to the ppa.
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, yeah, DBO explained it last night
<pitti> seb128: in particular, bug 827921 should be fixed now
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 827921 in nautilus "Pressing Ctrl-V puts path to a copied file into search box instead of actually running paste action" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/827921
<chrisccoulson> the version in the PPA made it pretty much unusable ;)
<seb128> pitti, that one should be fixed in the nautilus update from yesterday
<seb128> pitti, I will check and close it
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: he explained it to you? that would be nice that I got an email at least
<pitti> seb128: I couldn't reproduce the bug with the old nautilus either, but yes, should be fixed
<seb128> didrocks, yeah, DBO said the wrong trunk was used, he said the trunk trunk is the one we want, not the oneiric trunk
<didrocks> seb128: seems compiz process is totally broken, we got 6 bad tarballs in 4 days
<seb128> didrocks, read the channel log from the evening,night
<didrocks> and lost numerous hours
<seb128> didrocks, yeah, DBO said he would fix that
<didrocks> and I would have liked to not spent some time this morning to discover that again :/
<seb128> pitti, it was trivial to reproduce ctrl-C on a file, ctrl-V
<didrocks> well, anyway, let's build and push a fix
<pitti> seb128: I tried in normal and list view, both worked
<pitti> *shrug*, who knows
<seb128> pitti, ok, weird, it opens a text entry on the bottom right with the filename there
<seb128> rather than copying the file
<pitti> a search box?
<seb128> yes
<pitti> yes, that's what the bug was about
<pitti> but I wasn't able to reproduce
<seb128> it does it every time there
<seb128> well anyway, I will update now and test
<chrisccoulson> i get that too
<chrisccoulson> although, i have seen it work correctly on occasion, but i get the text entry most of the time
<seb128> it seems a race in the events
 * didrocks fixes the patch which, of course, doesn't apply
<chrisccoulson> wow, i''ve only got this week left, then i'm on vacation for 2 weeks :)
<chrisccoulson> that's probably the worst time for me to take vacation isn't it? ;)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - do you happen to have any bootcharts from when startup time was quick (lucid?). i want to see where pulseaudio starts
<seb128> chrisccoulson, http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/bootchart/
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I've some there
<chrisccoulson> thanks
<seb128> chrisccoulson, http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/bootchart/seb-dellmini-lucid-20100125-3.png
<seb128> should be about right
<chrisccoulson> ok, it seems to start when everything else starts
<chrisccoulson> i think i can probably make it do that again then
<chrisccoulson> i wonder what changed there :/
<seb128> does that matter?
<chrisccoulson> we block the whole session to load that at the moment
<seb128> why do we block on it?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, holiday> great, do you have everything in shape you needed done for oneiric?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, the media-keys plugin connects to pulseaudio before the main loop runs
<chrisccoulson> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-settings-daemon/+bug/854101/comments/4
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 854101 in ubuntu-boot-speed "gnome-settings-daemon takes waaaaaaaay too long to start" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<seb128> chrisccoulson, do we need to cover for anything while you are not there?
<seb128> urg
<pitti> chrisccoulson: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/11.10/BootSpeedAnalysis has links to my three boot charts (lucid/maverick/oneiric) on the mini 10v
<pitti> chrisccoulson: wrt. xrandr, didn't we fix that by not calling it at all unless the user has a ~/.config/monitors.xml?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: nice finding wrt. pulseaudio! indeed the session doesn't need to block for that
<chrisccoulson> seb128, i think most things should be ok. the firefox/thunderbird dailies are pretty much automatic. the only thing that really needs to keep up-to-date are the firefox-next/thunderbird-next PPA's, with the 8.0 beta releases
<chrisccoulson> and we advertise those as pretty much officially supported :)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: will there be firefox/tbird releases in the next two weeks which we need to package?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - the 7.0 release is on 27th, but we'll actually get the final builds this week
<chrisccoulson> there might not actually be a beta release until i get back, as the first ones tend to be 10-14 days after the last update
<chrisccoulson> so that might work out ok
<rodrigo_> pitti, ok, so I should ignore the build failure of g-c-c, right?
<pitti> rodrigo_:
<pitti> rodrigo_: right
<chrisccoulson> urgh, metacity just hung
<rodrigo_> pitti, what was the colord problem? it needed a newer version?
<chrisccoulson> on a lock in ca_context_play
<chrisccoulson> i've seen the same hang in both firefox and thunderbird in the last few days too :/
<pitti> rodrigo_: libcolord-dev was missing dependencies on liblcms2-dev, libglib2.0-dev, and a third one
<rodrigo_> oh ok
<pitti> rodrigo: see Requires in /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/pkgconfig/colord.pc
<pitti> ah, libdbus-1-dev
<pitti> rodrigo_: RAOF committed that to debian, too
<pitti> rodrigo_: btw, next time can you please use -0ubuntu1? you used -1ubuntu1, so we can't sync
<rodrigo_> oh, missed that, sorry
<seb128> chrisccoulson, do you have tb contacts syncing working?
<rodrigo_> so, whenever we use a different version than debian, it's 0ubuntu?, right?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, desktopcouch is still broken, so it doesn't even work in evolution yet
<seb128> chrisccoulson, did you look at the tb messaging issue on pop? my friend still get spams added to the counter :-(
<pitti> rodrigo_: right
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, i'm not sure what's going on there, and i don't have a POP account to test. with imap, we don't get new message notifications until the message filters have run
<seb128> chrisccoulson, http://mail.google.com/support/bin/answer.py?answer=13273
<seb128> chrisccoulson, gmail does pop
<seb128> chrisccoulson, get a gmail account!
<chrisccoulson> oh, i didn't realize that
<chrisccoulson> i've got a gmail account, but i use imap ;)
<rodrigo_> is anyone going to work on network-manager updates?
<pitti> I suppose cyphermox will
<seb128> rodrigo_, check with cyphermox when he's online
<chrisccoulson> urgh, what on earth is going on? firefox, thunderbird, metacity, gnome-settings-daemon all spinning my CPU in the same call (ca_context_play)?
<rodrigo_> ok
<chrisccoulson> my laptop feels like it's going to melt
<seb128> rodrigo_, but it's getting late in the cycle
<seb128> chrisccoulson, is that a canberra pulseaudio thing?
<rodrigo_> seb128, late for updating NM?
<seb128> rodrigo_, yeah
<rodrigo_> ok, I'll check with cyphermox
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah. i just noticed pulseaudio isn't even running here
<seb128> chrisccoulson, could be the issue ;-)
<chrisccoulson> everything is greyed out in the sound panel
<chrisccoulson> if i start pulseaudio manually, then everything starts working
<chrisccoulson> this has happened several times in the last few days :/
<seb128> open a bug against pulseaudio
<seb128> let it run in debug somewhere maybe so you see if it goes down or something
<seb128> David Henningsson might look at your bug if you open one ;-)
<pitti> rodrigo_: there: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-control-center/1:3.1.92-0ubuntu1, all built
<rodrigo_> pitti, ok thanks!
<seb128> pitti, "  * Drop 05_correct_gpg_agent_error_code.patch, upstream now." in gnome-keyring
<seb128> did you check?
<pitti> seb128: I think so, did I look wrong?
<seb128> some users said on bug #828756 that the bug is back with yesterday update
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 828756 in gnome-keyring "getting "connection is untrusted" warnings" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/828756
<seb128> "The bug was solved by the gnome-keyring 3.1.91-0ubuntu4 upgrade about a
<seb128> week ago, but now it's back with 3.1.92-0ubuntu1 :("
<seb128> pitti, but maybe it's a different issue
<seb128> checking git
<pitti> seb128: I have gotten untrusted certificate errors in empathy for weeks now
<seb128> pitti, it was fixed with 3.1.91-0ubuntu4 for most users
 * pitti checks, perhaps the patch didn't apply, and it only looked like it was fixed
<seb128> pitti, btw confirmed that nautilus ctrl-V is fixed so I'm closing that one
<pitti> https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=659080 says "fixed", too
<ubot2> Gnome bug 659080 in gpg-agent "gpg-agent: Bad error code in response to GETINFO" [Normal,Resolved: fixed]
<seb128> pitti, ok, yeah, the user comments were misleading then
<seb128> sorry about the noise
<pitti> seb128: yes, confirmed, it's upstream
<seb128> seems like "upstream issue"
<pitti> this seems to be a telepathy-something bug
<seb128> right
<pitti> (and I get it, too)
<seb128> I will check with kenvandine when he's online
 * pitti goes to unbreak our Pango GIR
<seb128> pitti, what is broken?
<pitti> enums don't have type information, and TabAlign.LEFT is mis-spelled TabAlign.TAB_LEFT
<pitti> it works fine in jhbuild
<pitti> type information sounds like a similar issue to the out-of-tree GTK 3 breakage that we had
<seb128> ok, git got some fixes for builddir != srcdir builds
<pitti> ah, it's multibuild, too
<seb128> but not sure if those fix your issues
<rodrigo_> pitti, vala 0.14.0 is still in the queue, right?
<pitti> hm, do they ever do a new release?
<pitti> rodrigo_: yes
<rodrigo_> ok
<pitti> http://git.gnome.org/browse/pango/commit/?id=2c3683a35bb6212b4ba2e1f30bdbed38f076ef42
<pitti> aah
<pitti> that's most probably the fix which causes gtimelog to not segfault any more
<seb128> pitti, they = pango? I can ping behdad about that later if you want
<pitti> seb128: that'd be helpful; they don't seem to align to GNOME milestones?
<pitti> seb128: otherwise I'll just package a git snapshot, there's quite a lot of fixes that we want
<seb128> pitti, pango is not "actively maintained" nowadays
<seb128> well let's say it's mostly doing the job so it's in maintainance mode and behdad is working on harfbuzz
<pitti> seb128: do you mind if I just do a make dist from git?
<chrisccoulson_> i guess i should probably take bug 854101 ;)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 854101 in ubuntu-boot-speed "gnome-settings-daemon takes waaaaaaaay too long to start" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/854101
<chrisccoulson_> oh, i'm already assigned
<chrisccoulson_> hah :)
<seb128> pitti, you can do a snapshot, no issue from me, I will ping behdad about a tarball anyway, that would still be nice to have
<pitti> right
<seb128> chrisccoulson_: yeah, I'm reviewing http://reports.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/ubuntu-desktop/oneiric.html and just assigned it to you 2 minutes ago ;-)
<seb128> rodrigo_, could you review the patch from tkamppeter on bug #842768, the bug is beta2 milestoned there
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 842768 in system-config-printer "Cups notifies "printer ' xxx ' may be not connected " although printer is OK and printing is OK too" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/842768
<rodrigo_> seb128, ok, looking
<seb128> rodrigo_, it's probably not a beta2 blocker but seems like something to "fix" for Oneiric
<rodrigo_> ok
<seb128> rodrigo_, if you have no opinion on it maybe get pedro to upstream the bug and see what upstream (marek?) says ;-)
<rodrigo_> I think it makes sense to use 'connecting...' instead of 'maybe connected' for sure
<rodrigo_> but yes, that would be for 3.4, so yes, will talk to marek
<seb128> thanks
<rodrigo_> ugh, again gnome-online-accounts rejected, I always forget I have no permissions
<seb128> rodrigo_, I can sponsor it for you, did you email cjwatson about it?
<rodrigo_> seb128, yes, iirc
<rodrigo_> let me check my mails
<seb128> ok
<seb128> rodrigo_, you pushed to the vcs? I can sponsor from it?
<rodrigo_> oh yes, he said it should be added to the desktop set automatically
<rodrigo_> seb128, yes, in the vcs, ready to sponsor
<rodrigo_> need to reboot, brb
<seb128> ok
<seb128> how "added automatically"?
<seb128> it's a recommends from gnome-control-center?
<tseliot> seb128: is this a known bug in the latest nautilus? http://people.canonical.com/~amilone/nautilus_bug.png
<seb128> tseliot, dpkg -l | grep nautilus?
<cjwatson> rodrigo_,seb128: added gnome-online-accounts to the ubuntu-desktop package set now
<seb128> cjwatson, thanks
<seb128> rodrigo_, i've sponsored the update already so no need to reupload ;-)
<tseliot> seb128: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/693665/
<seb128> tseliot, upgrade to 0ubuntu2
<tseliot> seb128: ok, thanks
<seb128> yw
<didrocks> pitti: chrisccoulson: seb128: finally, the correct c-p-m should be in the ppa now and published (hopefully)
<seb128> didrocks, \o/
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, thanks
<pitti> didrocks: you rock! that must have been "fun" to untangle *hug*
<chrisccoulson> will switch back to 3d in a bit and give it a try
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, for some definition of fun :-)
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, i'm getting half a dozen emails every day from chromium users
<tseliot> seb128: also, do you have any news on bug #820103 ?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 820103 in pidgin "Disconnecting connection 0x" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/820103
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: see, you should start using it! :)
<chrisccoulson> lol
<chrisccoulson> i'm happy with my current browser ;)
<htorque> didrocks: the c-p-m added to the ppa yesterday by mterry contained different animation settings - is that fixed now or even intended?
<chrisccoulson> htorque, see tha backscroll
<didrocks> htorque: no, it was wrong, I fixed it
<htorque> good, thanks (no backscroll :()!
<rodrigo_> seb128, cjwatson: ok, thanks
<seb128> dobey, pitti: will we get ubuntuone-client-gnome back on the CD? or make sure that upgrades get it? njpatel didn't have it installed on his Oneiric system and I didn't either, it seems like natty->oneiric upgraders might loose the nautilus integration if that one doesn't get pulled in
<seb128> jibel, mvo: ^ do you know if that's a know issue? if you do natty to oneiric updates could you check if that one is correctly installed on the upgraded systems?
<pitti> seb128: looks like it, but only after b2
<pitti> shouldn't be an issue for upgrades, though?
<seb128> pitti, well I'm wondering by it was not installed for me or njpatel
<seb128> but maybe it got removed during the cycle and nothing pulled back in
<njpatel> I installed O fresh on this system ~ a2
<chrisccoulson> seb128, it wasn't installed for me on a fresh install last week
<seb128> njpatel, chrisccoulson: ok, so that might be normal with their "installer", will be fixed after b2 apparently
<chrisccoulson> ah, ok
<seb128> we will go back to pre-install u1 things
<jasoncwarner_> hey kamstrup ...hate to say this, but I just did a fresh install of oneiric on a new disk and I got the same (i think) zg error at boot :(
<seb128> hey jasoncwarner_
<jasoncwarner_> hey seb128
<kamstrup> jasoncwarner_: that's just really really odd
<jasoncwarner_> kamstrup: you want the crash file?
<kamstrup> jasoncwarner_: seems there's a subset of people with some really odd persisting problems with the fts extension
<kamstrup> jasoncwarner_: why not :-)
<jasoncwarner_> kamstrup: the weird thing, like I said, is that I did a brand new, fresh install...
<kamstrup> jasoncwarner_: yeah, it's the same computer still, right?
<jasoncwarner_> yeah, ubt a diff disk (ssd vs 7200rpm)
<jasoncwarner_> kamstrup: http://paste.ubuntu.com/693677/
<kamstrup> jasoncwarner_: yeah, that shouldn't matter... what I am thinking is that it's some odd platform specific error in the SWIG bindings for libxapian...
<kamstrup> jasoncwarner_: ah, that trace, is another bug :-)
<jasoncwarner_> kamstrup: I have ZERO idea if this is related, but I feel like I got the moment I started Skype...then again...the moment I started skype caused all sorts of problems. ;)
<kamstrup> jasoncwarner_: it's the old zeitgeist-daemon --restart bug
<jasoncwarner_> kamstrup: another bug? sheesh...this machine and zg )
<jasoncwarner_> kamstrup: I have it back?
<kamstrup> jasoncwarner_: nah, that bug is known
<kamstrup> jasoncwarner_: I thought we had it distropatched or something, but mayb enot
<jasoncwarner_> kamstrup: well, I feel better that it is already known ;) perhaps a fix will be waiting for me when I wake up in the morning! :) I'm about to get to bed....
<kamstrup> jasoncwarner_: looking into this, sleep tight dude :-)
<jasoncwarner_> kamstrup: as always, mucho appreciated!
<rodrigo_> chrisccoulson, I found (and fixed) the evo-couchdb issue
<chrisccoulson> rodrigo_, excellent, thanks :)
<rodrigo_> chrisccoulson, so, could you please build lp:~ubuntu-desktop/couchdb-glib/ubuntu and test with thunderbird?
<chrisccoulson> rodrigo_, hmm, i still get "Cannot open book: Could not create DesktopcouchSession object"
<rodrigo_> chrisccoulson, hmm, you maybe need to recreate the desktopcouch config
<rodrigo_> let me find the instructions
<rodrigo_> that error is when it can't find the tokens in the keyring
<rodrigo_> chrisccoulson, http://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/Specifications/desktopcouch/Documentation/Troubleshooting
<rodrigo_> see the killing and restarting... section
<chrisccoulson> rodrigo_, \o/
 * rodrigo_ dances
<chrisccoulson> i added a contact in thunderbird, and checked it exists with futon
<chrisccoulson> seems to work fine :)
<rodrigo_> cool
<chrisccoulson> ok, i'll upload my little extension to handle the initial addressbook creation
<chrisccoulson> then it will all work :)
<rodrigo_> yes, and we can go out for beer celebration :)
<chrisccoulson> can we do the beer bit first?
<rodrigo_> let's not touch anything couchdb-related in the next few weeks though, just in case something else breaks :)
<rodrigo_> chrisccoulson, yes, sure :)
<chrisccoulson> heh
<seb128> \o/ running retracers
<chrisccoulson> what plays the login sound when the session loads?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, /usr/share/gnome/autostart/libcanberra-login-sound.desktop
<chrisccoulson> seb128, ah, thanks
<seb128> chrisccoulson, btw I still have a pending him to "disable login sound in oneiric"
<seb128> chrisccoulson, if you want to do it you"re welcome
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i don't mind. that's the first thing i turn off on a fresh install anyway
<chrisccoulson> perhaps we should make the login sound conditional on having accessibility enabled?
<seb128> I wonder if that .desktop works
<chrisccoulson> i can see how it might be useful there
<seb128> /usr/bin/canberra-gtk-play --id="desktop-login" --description="GNOME Login"
<seb128> Failed to play sound: File or data not found
<seb128> chrisccoulson, is it useful with a11y? the login screen ready sound is, but is the session sound useful?
<chrisccoulson> yeah, good point
<AlanBell> orca starts talking when you get to the desktop
<AlanBell> drums at the start of ubiquity on the live CD is a big deal though
<kamstrup> pitti: The category icons for Songs and Albums are missing in unity-lens-music. Does this need a UI freeze exception, or can I just fix it?
<seb128> kamstrup, just fix it
<pitti> kamstrup: JFDI
<kamstrup> like
<seb128> pitti, is there any chance to let in the applications updates from the queue once we have a first set of isos?
<pitti> seb128: we can do that, yes; but still building ISOs right now, I better not risk uninstallability right now
<seb128> pitti, no hurry ;-)
<pedro_> morning folks!
<rodrigo_> hey pedro_
<rodrigo_> pedro_, how were your holidays? :)
<pitti> seb128: did you ever look at and understand bug 797000 by chance?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 797000 in desktop-file-utils "/etc/gnome/defaults.list uses non-existent inode/directory=nautilus-folder-handler.desktop" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/797000
<pitti> hey pedro_, welcome back!
<seb128> pitti, looked at, yes, understood no
<pedro_> rodrigo_, hola! , very relaxing , almost the only 'noise' i've heard were birds singing ;-) so pretty good
<pedro_> pitti, hello! thanks :-)
<pedro_> salut seb128!
<seb128> hey pedro_, how are you?
 * pedro_ swimming in the mail flood
<seb128> pitti, but doesn't seem worth tracking for the team or for Oneiric
<pedro_> seb128, pretty good and you?
<seb128> pedro_, I'm good thanks
<seb128> pedro_, catching up after holidays
<rodrigo_> pedro_, ah cool, so you didn't see all the bugs we assigned to you?
<pedro_> rodrigo_, i'm going trough those now, later i'll run my 'assigns-all-the-bugs-to-the-spanish-guy' script  :-P
<rodrigo_> ugh :)
<seb128> is that a spanish war happening there? ;-)
<rodrigo_> yeah, I have a spam-pedro-with-bug-mail script, so he'd better not run his script
<pedro_> lol
<seb128> desrt, what are the chances that https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=654563 gets fixed this cycle? ;-)
<ubot2> Gnome bug 654563 in gio "info capplet: Failed to calculate disk space" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<jjardon> Hello, any idea about when gnome-documents and sushi will be packaged?
<seb128> jjardon, hello! whenever somebody interested steps up to package those for debian or ubuntu
<seb128> jjardon, or said differently "no idea, lack of resources and packaging those is not the priority for Oneiric"
<seb128> but maybe ricotz or somebody else will want to pick it up ;-)
<jjardon> seb128: yeah maybe we have to convince some packager ;)
<seb128> jjardon, we will look at it after the Oneiric freeze if nobody else does it before
<ricotz> seb128, jjardon, currently not ;), sorry
<jjardon> seb128: only said that because the two packages are part of GNOME 3.2, and will appear in the release notes, so users will expect them avaliable
<seb128> jjardon, yeah, and I would like to test shushi as well ;-)
<seb128> let's when it's a bit less crazy
 * rodrigo_ lunch
<jjardon> seb128: FYI we are in  hard code freeze in GNOME, so do not expect lot of changes ;)
<jjardon> seb128: thanks anyway!
<seb128> jjardon, right, yw, thank you for pointing that those are needed ;-)
<seb128> bah
<mpt> Well, that was interesting
<mpt> Upgraded to Oneiric, restarted, and all my windows were invisible
<seb128> we have mimetype issues
<chrisccoulson> brb, testing another g-s-d speedup fix
<chrisccoulson> seb128, pitti - https://launchpadlibrarian.net/80414933/farnsworth-oneiric-20110920-2.png :)
<chrisccoulson> the time taken for gsd to start is shorter now
<chrisccoulson> compared with http://ubuntuone.com/0xKppDPyZiHP9aDzmzzPoR
<seb128> chrisccoulson, 11s to 5s, not bad
<seb128> ;-)
<chrisccoulson> heh :)
<chrisccoulson> there is some variation with the xrandr plugin. it seems to take much longer with my laptop docked
<chrisccoulson> but the changes i'm testing here seem to save ~2.5s consistently
<chrisccoulson> so, i can't really see any other obvious wins in g-s-d, other than making the xrandr plugin not take so long. i wonder if that's just because i have a local monitor config
<chrisccoulson> brb
 * didrocks got his OneConf syncing working \o/
<chrisccoulson> ok, xrandr plugin still sucks without any monitors.xml
<chrisccoulson> it looks like it's not meant to do anything in that case
<chrisccoulson> i'll see if i can figure out what's going on
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: btw, is your stacking bug vanished?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, not sure, i'm on 2d atm
<didrocks> ok :)
<chrisccoulson> i'll try 3d in a bit
<chrisccoulson> but i'm quite happy with 2d now :)
<zyga> mvo, hi
<zyga> mvo, could you please look at https://code.launchpad.net/~zkrynicki/command-not-found/fix-839609/+merge/75440
<zyga> mvo, I believe it fixes the annoying c-n-f crashes-on-localized-input bug
<chrisccoulson> would be nice to have a better alt+tab switcher in 2d :)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: that's the pet project I want to trigger when I can get some spare time :)
<didrocks> would be a nice first QML app
<hallyn> can someone please explain alt-tab in unity now?  Is there any other way I'm supposed to just switch between applications on the same desktop?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, that would be awesome :)
<mvo> zyga: sure, will do
<pitti> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily-live/20110920/ is finally there for testing
<mterry> didrocks, what was wrong with my ghost windows patch?
<didrocks> mterry: it was taken from compiz-plugins-main trunk, which reverted some of ours distro-patch (smspillaz has embeeded our distro patches in another branch and roll as part of the tarball). It contained additional commits we don't want as well
<mterry> didrocks, mine did?  It was a two liner
 * didrocks looks at the diff again
<mterry> didrocks, whoa, I think you're right
<didrocks> mterry: https://launchpadlibrarian.net/80368147/compiz-plugins-main_1%3A0.9.5.94%2Bbzr20110919-0ubuntu1~ppa1_1%3A0.9.5.94%2Bbzr20110919-0ubuntu1~ppa2.diff.gz
<mterry> didrocks, I had a two-liner version that I intended to upload
<mterry> didrocks, I must have forgotten to re-debuild...
<didrocks> mterry: no worry, just scary :-)
<didrocks> mterry: it's all fine now, I pushed the correct version (hopefully)
 * mterry is really confused, remembers looking at a debdiff twice to be sure
<didrocks> mterry: ah, that was the issue! only twice. Three is mandatory with compiz :-)
<mterry> didrocks, oh!
 * didrocks hugs mterry, no worry ;)
<mterry> didrocks, god, I'm all sorts of confused.  the two liner patch was for qtwebkit for a completely different thing.  The compiz-plugins-main thing went down just like you described.
 * mterry drinks a large coffee
<didrocks> mterry: seems you had processes memory separation issues :)-
<didrocks> :-)
<mterry> heh
<didrocks> and corrupted memory!
<mterry> didrocks, anyway, this new compiz seems great
<mterry> fixes all the stacking issues I've had
<mterry> smspillaz, ^
<didrocks> mterry: good news! hoping that we will be able to push it after beta2 :)
<didrocks> (still some known issues with the gimp and libro though)
<mterry> ah, don't happen to use em
<didrocks> neither do I, but it seems some are :-)
<didrocks> crazy when you have LaTeX for everything :)
<seb128> pitti, did we get to turn off hibernate by default in Oneiric?
<smspillaz> didrocks: those issues aren't really manifesting themselves that much
<pitti> seb128: not so far, I think
<seb128> well I guess "no, because we didn't get the ui to turn it back on"?
<pitti> seb128: also, we forgot to disable the startup sound :/
<smspillaz> didrocks: I think by that point we'll fix it in an SRU once I've got some time to really dig into it
<pitti> seb128: that, too
<didrocks> smspillaz: let's see how it goes and what the feedback "in real use" will be
<seb128> pitti, yeah, I was mentioning to chrisccoulson before lunch, the startup sound
<chrisccoulson> wow, so g-s-d takes 0.5 seconds each time it tries to restore the backup, intended and default configurations, even if they don't exist
<chrisccoulson> that's definitely dixable
<seb128> pitti, does it still play for you?
<chrisccoulson> **fixable
<seb128> chrisccoulson, "backup"?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, monitors.xml.backup
<seb128> ah
<chrisccoulson> then it tries monitors.xml
<chrisccoulson> and then the system default
<chrisccoulson> none of these exist in my case, yet it still spends 0.5s trying each one
<chrisccoulson> that seems broken ;)
<seb128> pitti, /usr/share/gnome/autostart/libcanberra-login-sound.desktop has "/usr/bin/canberra-gtk-play --id="desktop-login" --description="GNOME Login"" and that command doesn't work for me
<seb128> $ /usr/bin/canberra-gtk-play --id="desktop-login" --description="GNOME Login"
<seb128> Failed to play sound: File or data not found
<desrt> seb128: this is a silly bug.  why didn't it get fixed already?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, indeed
<seb128> desrt, not enough people to look at bugs, everybody is busy...?
<pitti> seb128: yes, I still hear the sound in a guest  session
<desrt> seb128: glib developers are so lazy
<seb128> pitti, ok, it's on my beta2 list of things to check on
<pitti> Failed to play sound: Sound disabled
<seb128> desrt, GNOME bug #658188  seems a lot as well
<pitti> seb128: ^ here
<ubot2> Gnome bug 658188 in gio "g_app_info_set_as_last_used_for_type generates a broken mimeapps.list" [Normal,Unconfirmed] http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=658188
<pitti> but that's my personal account, where I indeed disabled it
<seb128> desrt, it means every time you open the g-c-c info panel, default application without doing any chance, it screws all your preferred applications
<desrt> seb128: do you always wait until the day after hard code freeze to tell me all of the things you want fixed? :)
<seb128> desrt, broken since GNOME3, still broken in 3.2
<seb128> desrt, lol, yes, wouldn't be fun otherwise ;-)
<seb128> desrt, sorry, I think they are not stopper for .0, maybe to fix for .1
<pitti> seb128: I'm just booting the current i386 live CD, login sound works there, too
<desrt> the first one is probably easy enough
<seb128> pitti, ok, I will look at turning it off then
<desrt> i'm taking a look now
<seb128> desrt, thanks
<pitti> seb128: that command works fine in a default user account
<seb128> desrt, the second one is "fun", opening the g-c-c info panel leads to gwibber being the default image viewer for me ;-)
<seb128> pitti, it's probably my user config then
<desrt> seb128: it's gnome's new approach to social media
<seb128> ;-)
<desrt> seb128: you "view" images by posting them to your twitter page and asking your friends to describe to you what they saw
<chrisccoulson> wow
<chrisccoulson> so, gnome_rr_config_apply_from_filename_with_time does a gnome_rr_screen_refresh before even checking if the configuration exists
<desrt> i think it's a great way to spend more time talking to your friends!
<seb128> pitti, I need to think what would be the best way, we could disable the autostart by default but that's probably wrong for those who will want to set a login sound back
<chrisccoulson> i think we're going to have g-s-d startup down to < 1s in a bit ;)
<pitti> seb128: I'd just disable the default in gsettings
<pitti> chrisccoulson: yay
<seb128> desrt, it should just connect you to random community users
<seb128> "easy community building" ;-)
<desrt> GNOME: "helping you meet new people!"
<seb128> chrisccoulson, hurry, it seems ubiquity is broken, we can get respins :p
<seb128> now I hide before pitti start chasing me with a big stick
<didrocks> seb128: btw, I remember we discussed about sound-theme-freedesktop brought by libcanberra0, seems it's still the case, so we have system sounds installed as well?
<seb128> didrocks, yes, but it seems it made some users happy and it's small enough
<seb128> since nobody pushed to revert and we have the CD space for it now I didn't bother
<didrocks> I hate those sounds, time to disable them :)
<seb128> didrocks, they should be off by default
<seb128> but there for users who want to set a sound theme
<didrocks> hum, it's not there, maybe my old old configuration set them back
<didrocks> if it's off by default, I'm happy, I let my configuration this way to not forget about it
<didrocks> ok, the obvious question is how to disable them
<chrisccoulson> heh
<didrocks> juste mute then I guess
<didrocks> just*
<didrocks> ahhhhhhhh way better :)
<didrocks> when I think I let those on to remember to continue the discussion about the depends with the kubuntu guysâ¦
<didrocks> so much pain for nothing ;)
<Laney> how /do/ you change the sound theme?
<didrocks> seems you can't change it in the ui, just mute the current one and change the default alert sound
<cyphermox> rodrigo_: I'm checking whether it would be worth updating NM so late. there are some bugs fixed and I think it also fixes the agents crash I've been fighting, but it also bumps soname for libnm-util
<seb128> Laney, didrocks: yeah, I was wondering the same, seems quite broken :-(
<Laney> :(
<seb128> pedro_, can you upstream bug #854401?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 854401 in nautilus "the text on desktop icons doesn't adapt to the background color" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/854401
<pedro_> seb128, sure, its going there in a bit
<dobey> seb128: when did you/njpatel upgrade?
<seb128> pedro_, thanks
<seb128> dobey, unping, njpatel did an oneiric install so he got the installer and not things preinstalled
<dobey> ok
<seb128> dobey, I upgraded earlier and probably got it dropped when it became a new source or when we upgraded nautilus to gtk3 before you ported u1
<dobey> seb128: on upgrade though, if you've already got stuff installed, it should still be installed after, unles spackages are broken right?
<seb128> right
<dobey> ah ok; yeah, that's why i asked. if you upgraded when the package went away for a short time, you would have been missing it :)
<rodrigo_> cyphermox, ok, keep me posted, there is libnm-gtk in n-m-applet, which g-c-c depends on
<cyphermox> the what?
<cyphermox> brr
<seb128> hey cyphermox
<cyphermox> hey seb128!
<seb128> cyphermox, gnome-control-center, they use widgets from libnm-gtk
<cyphermox> yeah
<zyga> mvo, thanks
<seb128> cyphermox, they used nm-applet before but gnome-shell conflicts with it so they moved code around it seems
<cyphermox> yeah, see that now
<cyphermox> it's going to be a little painful but it should be fine
<cyphermox> nm-applet is just bugfix, nm looks like it is too (checking)
<seb128> well, we reverted the g-c-c commit for now
<seb128> if it's late in the cycle to update nm we can probably adapt g-c-c
<seb128> or let the commit reverted since we still use nm-applet
<cyphermox> well, the biggest issue really is NM, not nm-applet
<cyphermox> nm changing the soname for libnm-util just means updating g-c-c (which would be done anyway), and the vpn plugins, afaict
<seb128> well, that's what g-c-c needs I think, nm
<seb128> if they moved the code there
<cyphermox> no
<cyphermox> it's a new lib in the network-manager-applet source pkg :)
<seb128> oh ok
<seb128> right, easier than I though then
<seb128> we just need to update nm-applet then from a g-c-c perspective
<cyphermox> seb128: no, because that new nm-applet also requires the new NM, I think
<seb128> ok
<cyphermox> but I think this could be reverted
<seb128> your call
<seb128> cyphermox, otherwise, do you plan to work on the evolution, evolution-exchange, gtkhtml updates as well? I put your name for those in the etherpad ;-)
<seb128> they are not on the CD so no hurry
<cyphermox> yeah, I plan to
<seb128> great
<cyphermox> I was going to try and fix this NM crasher first, upload after beta
<cyphermox> but I'm also kind of stuck, it
<cyphermox> it's hard to reproduce so very hard to confirm it's fixed :)
<seb128> desrt, bug #839876 (https://launchpadlibrarian.net/78809203/Stacktrace.txt)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 839876 in evince "evince crashed with SIGSEGV in g_settings_delay()" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/839876
<seb128> desrt, do you know if that's an application bug or a gsettings one?
<didrocks> seb128: I think we should retitle bug #854503 with "Take real launcher size to get icons area next to the launcher", wdyt?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 854503 in nautilus "Using Unity setting "Hide Launcher - never", files on desktop can not be placed close to the launcher" [Low,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/854503
<desrt> seb128: offhand it looks like a missing schema
<didrocks> seb128: not for oneiric anyway, as -2d and -3 doesn't have the same values, and with gsettings maybe segfaulting back next release if the value isn't there, it makes a dep between nautilus and unity-common :)
<seb128> didrocks, works for me
<seb128> desrt, that's when you tell me that it was clear at least when you were aborting on missing schemas? ;-)
<desrt> seb128: i think next cycle i'll be bringing back insta-fatal for missing schemas again
<desrt> seb128: in a modified form that lets you explicitly turn it off
<mvo> thank you zyga!
<desrt> this is totally insane
<seb128> desrt, this?
<desrt> seb128: what's your take on critical being fatal by default?
<zyga> mvo, thanks, sorry for not proposing this during your absence :/
<seb128> desrt, things like https://launchpadlibrarian.net/78230385/Stacktrace.txt are missing schemas as well I guess?
<desrt> seb128: but able to be disabled in language bindings (like python) where it gets converted to an exception
<seb128> desrt, ok during unstable cycle, not on stable versions
<desrt> seb128: yes.  things like that are also missing schemas
<seb128> desrt, you really want to minimize things closing on stable version, often applications can keep running enough for you to not have work lost
<seb128> desrt, ok thanks, I wish I know how users land with missing schemas
<seb128> they are in the deb, that doesn't make much sense
<desrt> seb128: this is actually an interesting problem
<seb128> or corruptions happen often...
<mvo> zyga: no worries, still time until final freeze
<desrt> we don't want to explode on missing schemas
<desrt> but when looking through traces we do want to be able to know about them
<desrt> (ie: that they were missing)
<desrt> seb128: i guess it comes down to being able to get the xsession-errors
<desrt> fedora does a cool trick where it greps for the name of the process that crashed and sends only lines that match that
<seb128> desrt, we have .xsession-errors
<seb128> desrt, https://launchpadlibrarian.net/78809028/XsessionErrors.txt that's for the evince one
<desrt> makes it nicer not to have to download and dig through 14 meg :)
<seb128> well apport does filter
<seb128> but I think the filters need improvement
<desrt> odd.  no gsettings errors from evince.
<seb128> it grabs only on some keywords like Gtk-Warnings
<zyga> mvo, good :)
<desrt> seb128: this gnome-control-center bug is pretty obvious
<seb128> desrt, the disk or the mimetype one?
<desrt> seb128: you have "none" in your fstab instead of "swap", which is what we expect
<desrt> for the mountpoint of the swap partition
<seb128> # swap was on /dev/sda5 during installation
<seb128> UUID=d077cd26-da2d-4c0f-ad00-276c510fd4ae none            swap    sw              0       0
<desrt> ya.  the 'none' is the trouble
<desrt> change it to 'swap' and the trouble disappears
<desrt> we have a few possible fixes here
<seb128> desrt, it's the "mount point" field
<seb128> which should it be "swap"?
<seb128> why
<desrt> seb128: i'm just explaining what works
<seb128> desrt, swap has no mount point
<seb128> right
<seb128> I knew about that workaround ;-)
<desrt> we have this code if (strcmp (fstab->fs_vfstype, "swap") == 0) continue;
<desrt> so there :p
<desrt> that's why :)
<seb128> ok
<desrt> anyway... so there are 3 fixes we could do
<desrt> first is that you change your fstab
<seb128> next? ;-)
<desrt> next is that i modify this part of glib to use our own big internal list of stuff to ignore
<seb128> but
<seb128> # <file system> <mount point>   <type>  <options>       <dump>  <pass>
<desrt> next is that we patch control-center not to call query_filesystem_info() on files that don't exist
<desrt> i like the last option best.  it's easiest and least likely to explode.
<seb128> shouldn't "fstab->fs_vfstype" be the third field?
<seb128> fs   mount   type
<seb128> which is fstab for me
<seb128> UUID=d077cd26-da2d-4c0f-ad00-276c510fd4ae none            swap    sw              0       0
<desrt> yes.  fedora has "UUID=blahblah swap swap .."
<seb128> well the line you show me check fs_vfstype
<seb128> which should be swap in Ubuntu as well
<desrt> sorry
<desrt> i'll show another
<zyga> mvo, one more thing, could you please make sure to upgrade the version number stored internally in the application? this is the only thing that users report most of the time and differentiating between versions helps. I changed the version this time but it has to be maintained continuously (before it was stuck on some older release)
<desrt> if ((strcmp (mntent->mnt_dir, "ignore") == 0) || (strcmp (mntent->mnt_dir, "swap") == 0)) continue;
<desrt> and
<desrt> if ((strcmp (mntent.mnt_mountp, "ignore") == 0) || (strcmp (mntent.mnt_mountp, "swap") == 0)) continue;
<desrt> so i think we should try to fix gio, but that can wait until after the release
<seb128> desrt, what about adding "none" to those?
<desrt> meanwhile, this is a heuristic and gio will never be 100% perfect in all cases
<seb128> right
<desrt> so probably gnome-control-center should be more robust
<seb128> agree on fixing g-c-c
<seb128> feel free to bounce the bug back there ;-)
<desrt> we can probably fix it by just treating the NULL case as 0 bytes
<seb128> or to clone it
<desrt> meh
<desrt> i'll do the quick patch for GIO now
<desrt> plus the g-c-c patch
<desrt> and we'll look at fixing it properly after the release
<desrt> can keep it all on the same bug.  will make release-team decisions easier
<seb128> desrt, thanks
<desrt> seb128: does this bug impact debian, in your opinion?
 * desrt needs to know where to assign the blame :)
<seb128> desrt, don't you have a debian server? ;-)
<desrt> actually, no
<seb128> I would tend to say that yes but easy to verify by somebody who has a debian box
<seb128> i.e pitti
<desrt> best i have is a laptop
<desrt> seb128: don't YOU have a debian server? :p
<seb128> I've no server :p
<desrt> more shame for you than me, i say :)
<hallyn> eh.  compiz just crashed because I re-enabled the task switcher.
<seb128> I'm a desktop guy
<seb128> ;-)
<hallyn> now unity is gone, but at least I have alt-tab working :)
<didrocks> hallyn: the task switcher have some keys conflicting like unity, (alt + tab), so you probably acked the fact to remove unity
<hallyn> didrocks: why would it not just obsolete the other keybinding?
<hallyn> (shift-alt-tab would have been the one)
<desrt> seb128: ya.  it's a debianism.
<didrocks> hallyn: because compiz-config-settings-manager doesn't know how to do that? patches welcomed :)
<hallyn> fair enough :)
<hallyn> (I thought it used to do that years ago though!)
<hallyn> (guess i was wrong)
<seb128> desrt, yeah, I just looking on alioth, it's none there as well
<didrocks> hallyn: I don't think so, it just remove the plugin unfortunatly
<didrocks> or you can ignore the conflict
<seb128> desrt, on a debian 6.0.2
<didrocks> and then, weird things can happen :)
<hallyn> didrocks: ok, i can just manually disable the other - but, can i ask,
<hallyn> is there some place where the motivation for the new alt-tab behavior is documented?
<didrocks> hallyn: right, disable the other, then reenable unity
<didrocks> hallyn: I guess it's a question for the ayatana mailing list
<didrocks> to talk with the designers
<hallyn> didrocks: ok, thanks
<didrocks> yw
<desrt> seb128: the patch in that bug is tested and works now if you want to vendor-patch it
<desrt> https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=654563#c5
<ubot2> Gnome bug 654563 in gio "info capplet: Failed to calculate disk space" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<seb128> desrt, thanks
<desrt> doing g-c-c now
<rodrigo_> dobey, ping
<dobey> rodrigo_: hey
<rodrigo_> dobey, fixed the evo-couchdb issue
<dobey> rodrigo_: awesome
<rodrigo_> dobey, seems recent changes to e-d-s made it not happy with SoupSessionAsync being used on threads
<dobey> ah
<rodrigo_> so, just changed that to use SoupSessionSync, since we do sync operations anyway
<dobey> makes sense
<rodrigo_> now, replication doesn't work for me though :(
<rodrigo_> does it for you?
<dobey> rodrigo_: that's mostly a server issue
<rodrigo_> yes, BAD_REQUEST
<dobey> it's known and being worked on; but we have some SRUs to do of desktopcouch for old versions
<rodrigo_> ah ok
<dobey> hrmm, you shouldn't get a 400
<dobey> should be getting a 503
<dobey> i seem to get 503s in replication log
<rodrigo_> I consistently get 400's
<dobey> weird
<dobey> rodrigo_: can you make a new user and set up ubuntuone with same account in that user, and see if it gets the same errors?
<rodrigo_> yes
<dobey> rodrigo_: cool; thanks again
 * dobey goes to get some lunch and run some errands
<chrisccoulson> seb128, pitti - https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/oneiric/+source/gnome-desktop3/+bug/854101/comments/7 :)
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 854101 in ubuntu-boot-speed "gnome-settings-daemon takes waaaaaaaay too long to start" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<chrisccoulson> i can't believe how fast the unity-2d session starts here now
<chrisccoulson> i can barely blink after typing my password before the panel has loaded
<pitti> chrisccoulson: wow, that looks awesome!
<pitti> chrisccoulson: X.org still takes an awful amount of time on your machine
<chrisccoulson> i shall push the changes to the desktop PPA in a bit, and would appreciate some testers
<chrisccoulson> to make sure i've not broken anything ;)
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i'm not sure why Xorg takes so long here
<seb128> chrisccoulson, count me in for testing from the ppa when you put it there ;-)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: great work! did you already got a response from upstream for your previous patch?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, oh, and stop using 2d :p
<chrisccoulson> pitti - which patch was that?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, i prefer 2d ;)
<chrisccoulson> no blurry icons in the dash :)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, bah, your g-s-d work should work for me on 3d as well ;-)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I thought you had one for the media plugin (pulse), and before one for xrandr?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i don't think so. i only started on this yesterday evening
<chrisccoulson> i intend to send them upstream, or at least start a discussion on the issues i've found :)
<chrisccoulson> (like, doing 3 reprobes, which is insane)
<pitti> probably won't help on http://people.canonical.com/~pitti/bootcharts/daniel-oneiric-20110914-disable-indicator-session.png as both CPUs are full anyway
<pitti> but on faster CPUs this should be quite noticeable
<pitti> could buy 3.5 s on http://people.canonical.com/~pitti/bootcharts/donald-oneiric-20110914.png (that's my X201 workstation)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: sorry, I didn't follow earlier, but what those gsd configuration are for?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, which ones?
<chrisccoulson> pitti:
 * didrocks wonders why with nvidia he always get on gsd now a "can't find suitable size" and enormous fonts now at each startup
<chrisccoulson> [    14.607] (II) intel(0): Initializing HW Cursor
<chrisccoulson> [    17.020] (II) intel(0): RandR 1.2 enabled, ignore the following RandR disabled message.
<chrisccoulson> are those timestamps in my Xorg log?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: the backup, intended, default
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, oh, those are for the display configuration
<chrisccoulson> by default, there aren't any configurations to load, but gsd still spends 0.5s iterating each one
<didrocks> seems what is maybe broken there then :)
<chrisccoulson> but i've fixed that locally now :)
<didrocks> yeah, I'll tell if you that makes vanish the dialog there
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, hmm, it probably won't fix your problem
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: where are they saved? maybe I can rm them
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, ~/.config/monitors.xml is probably the one
<chrisccoulson> (that's the intended configuration)
<didrocks> ok, I have one
<didrocks> let me remove it
<htorque> sorry to interrupt (again), but this doesn't influence bug 828112, right?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 828112 in unity-greeter "Password field feedback slow at times" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/828112
<jcastro> it's the thing that keeps popping up a window on login
<didrocks> ah seems that was it :)
<jcastro> that happened to me too
<didrocks> thanks chrisccoulson, not sure how a bad one was saved though
<chrisccoulson> htorque, i don't think that anything i'm doing will affect that bug
<didrocks> jcastro: ah!
<chrisccoulson> i'm focused on the session start only atm
<jcastro> didrocks: it's something else that happened, I get it on 2 machines
<didrocks> jcastro: I just rm the file and it "fixed" it
<didrocks> but still not sure why it's saved
<jcastro> the display thingey saves there
<jbicha> cjwatson: could yelp-xsl and yelp-tools be added to the desktop set also?
<didrocks> jcastro: nvidia?
<jcastro> yep
<chrisccoulson> pitti - so, that "17.020" timestamp in my xorg log lines up nicely with the the greeter starting
<jcastro> oh, no, I don't think the nvidia tool saves there, I think the GNOME one does
<chrisccoulson> i guess that's something i should bug RAOF about
<didrocks> ok, maybe we really should blacklist the display dialog with nvidia
<jcastro> but I am not certain
<chrisccoulson> perhaps he can figure out what Xorg is doing for 3 seconds there
<didrocks> jcastro: yeah, I guess so, we should hide the display with nvidia blob driver anyway
<jcastro> hide the gnome display right?
<didrocks> indeed
<jcastro> because you need the nvidia one
<jcastro> oh ok
<didrocks> just a thought
<jcastro> I agree
<jcastro> are we allowed to put things in g-c-c yet or does that incur hatred from upstream still?
<didrocks> jcastro: you mean, without distro-patching?
<jcastro> yeah
<didrocks> it's a distro-patch right now, all the thing we put it there
<pitti> jasoncwarner, Sweetshark, bryceh, chrisccoulson, didrocks, tremolux, Riddell, kenvandine, cyphermox, mterry, rodrigo_, seb128, tkamppeter, pedro_: meeting reminder in 15 mins
<mterry> w00t
<cyphermox> yup yup
<pitti> jcastro: put things into gcc> that's a long lost cause
 * pedro_ waves
<pitti> we are so bad, we even put ubuntuone there TWICE!
<seb128> chrisccoulson, didrocks: the backup monitors.xml config thing is in case you apply a broken config I think, so it can go revert to the working one after the delay
<seb128> iirc
<jbicha> by the way, will the extra ubuntuone be gone before beta2?
<seb128> the third file seems weird
<didrocks> pitti: depends hadess told me at desktop summit that he wasn't against putting unity settings there if unity runs!
<seb128> jbicha, what extra ubuntuone?
<pitti> seb128: there are two ubuntuone settings in c-c
<seb128> not here
<didrocks> seb128: it's not a backup one, it's read when gsd starts apparentlyâ¦
<jcastro> hey before your meeting, I have a question. I want to tell users about the new DVD image and all it's goodness, is this the canonical list of extra packages or are there more somewhere? http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/seeds/ubuntu.oneiric/dvd
<pitti> both open the control panel
<seb128> I've seen a bug about it
<seb128> but it doesn't happen for me
<pitti> seb128: maybe one is u1-installer, the other u1-control-panel?
<seb128> oh right
<seb128> I don't have the installer installed
<didrocks> install the installer :-)
<Laney> yeah, that's what they are
<Laney> is jcastro's link right?
<Laney> if so, what's that mono stuff doing therE?
<seb128> didrocks, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/693835/ that's the gsd code
<seb128> didrocks, it's a bit weird, but it seems they try to be smart about backup configs on start as well, in case you have a non working configuration
<seb128> like you tried to apply something that didn't work, screwed your xorg and forced you to reboot
<seb128> jbicha, you probably better drop an email to cjwatson for those, easier to track than irc pings usually
<didrocks> seb128: indeed, but does those backup configuration file works with nvidia? it seems not
<didrocks> (the one which was generated)
<didrocks> and maybe it detects nvidia as a non working one
<seb128> yeah, not sure about nvidia ;-)
<didrocks> let me just try to open the display properties again
<didrocks> and restart g-s-d then
<cjwatson> jbicha: yes, please mail me this kind of request, I don't process them without an e-mail traili
<cjwatson> *trail
<jbicha> cjwatson: seb128: thanks
<didrocks> seb128: jcastro: so confirming, the gnome display thing is creating that file
<didrocks> as when you change the resolution it works
<didrocks> (with a lot of noise)
<didrocks> and let that invalid file then
<didrocks> maybe we should just blacklist the GNOME thing with nvidia blob driver?
<jcastro> I think so, the tool is useless with nvidia and it will just confuse people into thinking it works.
<pitti> jasoncwarner, Sweetshark, bryceh, chrisccoulson, didrocks, tremolux, Riddell, kenvandine, cyphermox, mterry, rodrigo_, seb128, tkamppeter, pedro_: meeting time
<Sweetshark> o/
<rodrigo_> o/
<seb128> didrocks, we used to do something like that, tseliot made patches by then to run the nvidia control dialog iirc
<pitti> hello everyone
<didrocks> hey
<seb128> hey
<mterry> heyo
<pitti> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2011-09-20
 * kenvandine waves
<pedro_> hello!
<pitti> FYI, quick release status: the first smoketests of the current b2 candidates are coming in
<pitti> we found a rather serious ubiquity bug and will need a respin
<pitti> but as long as you are online, they actually install pretty well
<chrisccoulson> hi :)
<pitti> otherwise it's nothing earthshattering on our side
<pitti> kenvandine: do you need to discuss anything partner-wise?
<kenvandine> i gave the u1 guys the list of release bugs skaet is tracking for their packages
<kenvandine> they are going to follow up on them all
<tkamppeter> hi
<kenvandine> that is all i have
<pitti> we also had a quick discussion with U1 team yesterday
<seb128> kenvandine, pitti: will we get the whole u1 stack back on the CD after beta2?
<pitti> looks like we'll put u1-client control-panel, and music store back on the default install
<kenvandine> good
<didrocks> makes sense :-)
<pitti> not the couchy bits, of course
<kenvandine> that is a much better choice
<jbicha> cool!
<pitti> yeah
 * kenvandine never thought that was a good idea
<pitti> we dropped them without need
<kenvandine> :)
<mterry> pitti, not ubuntuone-couch?  (I don't think it pulls in anything couchy)
<pitti> it was really quite pointless
<pitti> mterry: I thought that's just a command line tool?
<pitti> mterry: but I don't mind
<mterry> pitti, no, it provides some python bindings that duplicity/deja-dup uses
<pitti> "whatever we had in natty"
<mterry> pitti, can't upload to u1 without it
<kenvandine> does that pull in desktopcouch?
<pitti> mterry: but then deja-dup should certainly have a dependency or at least a recommends to it?
<pitti> kenvandine: no
<kenvandine> good
<mterry> pitti, it did before, but when we went down the installer route, i dropped it and added support to deja-dup to run the installer (which I made sure installs ubuntuone-couch)
<pitti> mterry: it moved to universe yesterday, so better add a recommends
<mterry> pitti, I can go back to before
 * mterry wishes people would make up their minds
<pitti> mterry: please add it back then
<mterry> k
<pitti> didrocks: thanks for the unity update on the wiki
<didrocks> yw
<pitti> didrocks: anything to discuss? should the team test some newer compiz packages? (sorry, I lost track of them)
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, the ppa should contained all what is needed (as I claimed on the wiki ;))
<didrocks> so go ahead, download, test, and ping me if anything is wrong
 * didrocks looks at the stacking breaker, chrisccoulson!
<pitti> chrisccoulson: ^
<didrocks> :)
<chrisccoulson> i've not tested it yet
<pitti> chrisccoulson: and while you are at it, please make it fast, will you?
 * pitti hugs chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> that means switching back to 3d for a bit ;)
 * chrisccoulson hugs pitti
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: come on, between two awesome fixes! :-)
<chrisccoulson> :)
 * pitti updates in the meantime
<chrisccoulson> i'll try it in a bit. i want to get the gsd/gnome-desktop changes in to the PPA first
<mterry> the PPA works great for me
<didrocks> I'll probably pushed the fixed Qt in the ppa as well waiting for the freeze
<pitti> tremolux: anything to discuss for s-c? seems to be going well
<pitti> oh, no new packages/
<pitti> ?
<tremolux> pitti: hey! nothing really to discuss, we are just fixing stuff
<pitti> argh, seems add-apt-repository messed up retrieving the key or so
<pitti> tremolux: that's good news, at this point :)
<didrocks> (if some people wants to test the oneconf staging server for syncing, please ping me, feedback would be welcomed ;))
<tremolux> pitti: yes, I feel really good about it, it's getting into nicer shape every day
<pitti> BTW, if you need to roll back, use "sudo ppa-purge ppa:ubuntu-desktop/ppa"
<pitti> works really nicely
 * kenvandine hugs ppa-purge
<pitti> ok, nothing else from my side; AOB?
<tremolux> didrocks: I'll definitely test with the server, I've been using the local test data so far
<mterry> Anyone have any MIRs that I don't know about?
<didrocks> tremolux: great, thanks!
<tremolux> didrocks: oneconf ftw!
<mterry> hopefully not, pretty late for MIRs
<Sweetshark> mterry: I just got asked again about lo-menubar bing included in main ;)
<pitti> veto
<Sweetshark> pitti: thanks
<didrocks> tremolux: thanks to believe in it! :)
<mterry> Sweetshark, I thought we were holding off, for stability reasons?
<tremolux> didrocks: :)
<Sweetshark> mterry: right.
<mterry> phew
<mterry> :)
<pitti> oh, the i386 and amd64 retracers have caught up again
<pitti> they are running again now
<seb128> \o/
<pitti> sorry for the 2 days downtime, needed to fix a couple of bugs
<kenvandine> just so everyone is aware, i will be out again tomorrow, but returning again on thursday
<pitti> so, then without further ado, let's fix this oneiric thingy!
<mterry> oh, and I'm on vacation next week, FYI
<pitti> thanks everyone
<pitti> mterry, chrisccoulson: enjoy your holidays!
<kenvandine> :)
<chrisccoulson> heh, thanks :)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: do you already have someone briefed for mozilla babysitting while you are away?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - not yet. i can sort that out though
<chrisccoulson> i guess i need a victim ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, mterry: enjoy!
<chrisccoulson> ok, g-s-d is in the ubuntu-desktop PPA
<chrisccoulson> just doing gnome-desktop now
<seb128> chrisccoulson, give it to the security team, they love firefox ;-)
<chrisccoulson> lol
<rodrigo_> chrisccoulson, what changes does have that g-s-d on the ppa?
<pitti> well, I actually had micahg in mind when I pondered people who know about firefox
<chrisccoulson> rodrigo_, make it start up faster :)
<rodrigo_> ah
<chrisccoulson> rodrigo_, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/oneiric/+source/gnome-desktop3/+bug/854101/comments/7
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 854101 in ubuntu-boot-speed "gnome-settings-daemon takes waaaaaaaay too long to start" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<rodrigo_> chrisccoulson, cool!
<chrisccoulson> ok, gnome-desktop uploaded too
<chrisccoulson> rodrigo_, you probably want to review the changes and test it too, to make sure i'm not doing anything crazy ;)
<rodrigo_> chrisccoulson, do you have a link to the patch in g-s-d?
<rodrigo_> chrisccoulson, yeah, right :)
<chrisccoulson> rodrigo_, there's 3 patches - you can grab them from the package in the PPA now
<rodrigo_> ok
<chrisccoulson> i've not pushed them anywhere else yet
<chrisccoulson> ignore the profiling patch ;)
<chrisccoulson> that was just so i could get profiling information to stdout
<seb128> pitti, can you score up the i386 builds for https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/+archive/ppa/+sourcepub/1948415/+listing-archive-extra and https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/+archive/ppa/+sourcepub/1948422/+listing-archive-extra ?
<pitti> seb128: done
<seb128> pitti, danke
<chrisccoulson> thanks :)
<chrisccoulson> does zeitgeist really need to start as soon as the session loads?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: it's dbus activated, but zeitgeist-datahub triggers it
<pitti> chrisccoulson: but that's being fixed
<pitti> chrisccoulson: seif told me that they rewrote this entire thing in C
<chrisccoulson> pitti - ah, ok. that's good. it currently seems to take up 0.5s CPU here before the rest of the unity-2d components
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I mentioned that on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/11.10/BootSpeedAnalysis
<Sweetshark> ah, great. Im on omgubuntu.
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i guess i could add my gsd findings to that too
<didrocks> seb128: bug #854448 is not really a duplicate, it's a multi-arch issue
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 854448 in unity "AMD64 Skype should depend on i386 sni-qt (multiarch)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/854448
<didrocks> seb128: skype amd64 should pull i386 sni-qt
<pitti> Sweetshark: doesn't actually read badly, though?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: sure, please do
<Sweetshark> pitti: yeah, could have been much worse. I did not read the news there -- I first noticed my blog getting a lot more attention than usual ...
<mterry> kirkland, hello!  Did you ever make any progress on bug 845738?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 845738 in ecryptfs-utils "Add ecryptfs-verify-private script" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/845738
<seb128> didrocks, ok, it's not me who duplicated it, I just commented ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: ok, just pointing that we discussed lenghty about it this morning :-)
<didrocks> seb128: and as it will bring the i386 Qt stack on amd64, we can't install both by default on amd64
<didrocks> apart from skype, not sure which other Qt apps is in this situation
<seb128> didrocks, ok, thanks for letting me know ;-)
<seb128> I'm glad I neither use amd64 nor skype :p
<didrocks> seb128: you want 2 Qt stack on your machine, I know it! :-)
<htorque> chrisccoulson: tested your packages: http://img.xrmb2.net/images/696959.png â \o/
<chrisccoulson> wow, that's a massive win
<chrisccoulson> i wasn't expecting that
<chrisccoulson> and everything still works ok?
<htorque> looks like it :)
<chrisccoulson> those 6 blocks of Xorg CPU are g-s-d doing 6 probes
<chrisccoulson> i've cut those right down
<chrisccoulson> i added all my findings to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/11.10/BootSpeedAnalysis anyway
<chrisccoulson> oh, rodrigo has gone?
<chrisccoulson> ah
<chrisccoulson> brb, dinner time
<micahg> chrisccoulson: pitti: seb128: I was planning on babysitting firefox while chrisccoulson was gone (with the assumption that little will need to be done before release)
<kirkland> mterry: hrm, I haven't :-/  been pretty overloaded lately
<kirkland> mterry: tab's open in my browser, will try to get to Inbox-0 and Tab-0 by EoD today :-)
<mterry> kirkland, heh, no worries
<seb128> micahg, that's great thanks, and yeah chrisccoulson said there should be not a lot to do, maybe an updated tarball with no changes to upload
<seb128> brb
<pitti> good night everyone!
<cyphermox> night pitti
<chrisccoulson> pitti, did you see htorque's bootchart?
<htorque> chrisccoulson: ignoring display ports 1-3 and non-existing hdmi ports 1-3 via xorg.conf shaved off another 14 seconds: http://img.xrmb2.net/images/141990.png - but that's likely a kernel regression as that works fine with natty's kernel.
<chrisccoulson> 15s -> 3s for g-s-d
<chrisccoulson> yeah, that looks better
<kenvandine> chrisccoulson, that's awesome!
<chrisccoulson> kenvandine, unity-2d session starts in less than 3s here now ;)
<kenvandine> nice
<chrisccoulson> i wonder how hard it would be to get compiz to start as fast as metacity :/
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: dlopening, dlopeningâ¦
<chrisccoulson> heh
<chrisccoulson> we need one big fat binary
<chrisccoulson> that's why chrome is one big binary
<chrisccoulson> and why firefox probably will be at some point too
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, what actually does take all the time when compiz starts?
<chrisccoulson> it's not something i've looked at yet
<chrisccoulson> perhaps i will do later though ;)
<chrisccoulson> it's pretty sad compared to metacity
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: basically, initialising gl (composite) and dlopening all the plugins enabled
<didrocks> loading the configuration backend is slow
<didrocks> and the configuration backend backend (gconf) slower
<chrisccoulson> heh, and i bet compiz takes the 0.5s hit of starting gconf as well now, seeing as nothing else is using it
<chrisccoulson> oh, isn't metacity using it though?
<chrisccoulson> yeah, metacity starts it
<Sweetshark> chrisccoulson: Libreoffice master has code for making everyting one big binary too on master.
<didrocks> metacity still using gconf
<didrocks> yeah
<didrocks> so it's a fair game there :)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: but compiz reads all keys for all plugins
<Sweetshark> chrisccoulson: well, an experimental switch
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, there's an easy fix for that. we could have gconf up and running whilst g-s-d is loading
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: 900 keys was the natty default profile
<chrisccoulson> gnome-session used to start it really early anyway
<didrocks> indeed
<chrisccoulson> i'm going to try that again, seeing as it won't block anything initially
<chrisccoulson> it might help compiz a bit ;)
<didrocks> 0.5s is still someting :)
<chrisccoulson> Sweetshark, yeah, big binaries seem to load quicker :)
<chrisccoulson> jjardon, can we make the battery icon for indicator-power not turn red when i still have over 2 hours of battery life left? :)
<micahg> it gets even faster when you optimize the binaries so everything needed is in order
<smspillaz> oh, can I put some feelers out for how the testing of the stacking branch is going ?
<smspillaz> chrisccoulson: are you volunteering to make compiz startup time faster ?
<smspillaz> I've wanted to do this for a while but haven't had time to
<chrisccoulson> smspillaz, possibly ;)
<chrisccoulson> it would certainly be nice to make it start faster for P
<smspillaz> chrisccoulson: of course
<smspillaz> chrisccoulson: I don't plan to change compiz much for P though
<chrisccoulson> yeah, probably a good idea :)
<didrocks> have a good evening everyone!
<smspillaz> night didrocks
<smspillaz> err
<didrocks> smspillaz: thanks, you too!
<smspillaz> evening, rather
<smspillaz> heh
<smspillaz> "morning!" :)
<didrocks> yeah, time for doing some exercice :)
<didrocks> heh, indeed, morning
<mterry> smspillaz, you asked about the testing of the stacking branch?  I'm loving it
<smspillaz> sweet
<mterry> smspillaz, no regressions so far, fixes every wart I saw
<smspillaz> I noticed one problem with libreoffice the other day
<mterry> smspillaz, yeah, someone was saying that
<chrisccoulson> i'm just upgrading now, then i will switch back to 3d and test :)
<smspillaz> and the regression detection code I put in still notices some errors with more complex cases
<mterry> smspillaz, but I haven't happened to use it
<smspillaz> but it should be 99% fixed now
<smspillaz> and considering I've been in lo for a bit now working on this uni assignment
<smspillaz> and haven't seen it, guess we're good
<mterry> smspillaz, I saw you had some branch for the minimized window case?
<smspillaz> yes, that's been merged in
<smspillaz> I forgot to tell you that
<smspillaz> you can tell stbe there's no need to hack around that now
<mterry> smspillaz, is it in a PPA for easy testing?  I'd like to confirm that deja-dup will work like I expect now
<smspillaz> mterry: no ppa yet
<mterry> (it does some minimized craziness)
<mterry> QQ
<smspillaz> mterry: we're probably going to do another compiz upload later in the week with the stacking branch merged in. I'll cherry pick that fix in at the same time
<smspillaz> err
<smspillaz> next week
<kenvandine> bigon, any idea why bug 828756 came back with empathy 3.1.92?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 828756 in empathy "getting "connection is untrusted" warnings" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/828756
<mterry> smspillaz, yeah, but I'll be on vacation then, and I want to know whether I can revert my workaround in code before then.  I'll test the patch
<kenvandine> since it had been confirmed fixed in gnome-keyring
<smspillaz> mterry: if you know how to build the compiz package I can give you a patch
<smspillaz> mterry: the problem is in both unity and compiz though
<smspillaz> mterry: or you can give me a testcase and I'll see if it does anything crazy here
<mterry> smspillaz, guh
<mterry> smspillaz, there's a testcase in the bug
<smspillaz> mterry: # ?
<bigon> kenvandine: dunno
<mterry> smspillaz, bug 732997
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 732997 in unity "Cannot open a window that starts iconified" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/732997
<smspillaz> mterry: oh, you mean the vala one ?
<mterry> smspillaz, but there are some minor corner cases I wanted to test (like a minimized window starting in an existing window group) and such
<mterry> smspillaz, yeah, that was my testcase
<smspillaz> mterry: ok, so the vala one works as you expect
<mterry> smspillaz, sweet
<smspillaz> it just appears in the launcher then when you click it it unminimizes
<mterry> yay
<smspillaz> as for deja-dup
<mterry> smspillaz, deja-dup in 11.10 right now is patched to avoid that code path, so it's not a good test case right now
<smspillaz> can I test things with what's currently in ubuntu ?
<smspillaz> mterry: I can edit the code
<seb128> re
<mterry> smspillaz, you'd have to recompile.  What you could do is grab 19.91 instead of 19.92
<mterry> smspillaz, the old package that is
<smspillaz> mterry: I can recompile, it sfine
<seb128> chrisccoulson, your g-s-d g-d updates seems to work fine
<seb128> won almost 1 second login time there
<chrisccoulson> nice :)
<mterry> smspillaz, OK.  Then the code is in widgets/WidgetUtils.vala, search for iconify.  There are two code blocks commented out which should go back to like it was
<smspillaz> mterry: I used gentoo and arch linux for a few years before I started working for canonical, I'm not afraid of compilers :)
<mterry> smspillaz, :)
<smspillaz> ok
<mterry> smspillaz, but...  are you going to edit bzr or the Ubuntu package?
<smspillaz> package
<mterry> if the Ubuntu package, you'll have to edit the C code, as it doesn't recompile the vala
<smspillaz> *shrug* whatever
<mterry> smspillaz, so edit widgets/WidgetUtils.c and do the same search  :)
<smspillaz> :)
<mterry> vala is goofy sometimes
<mterry> smspillaz, thanks!
<smspillaz> vala is a nice concept
<smspillaz> but it's just ... a pain sometimes
<chrisccoulson> right, switching back to 3d now
<smspillaz> at least in my experience
<smspillaz> mterry: so what's the thing I should do to make it exhibit the behaviour you want
<mterry> smspillaz, I think in the past year, it has at least become a stable platform/compiler.  Before, not so much
<mterry> smspillaz, hmm
<smspillaz> I'll do it with and without your patch
<smspillaz> mterry: valac-0.14 broke a bunch of unity code
<smspillaz> it's not stable :)
<mterry> smspillaz, oh really?  I didn't have too much changes to make for 0.14
<seb128> smspillaz, unity is still unity vala?
<seb128> still "using"
<Sweetshark> vala is cfront/glockenspiel 2.0.
<mterry> smspillaz, so the simplest case is running "deja-dup --backup --auto"
 * Sweetshark hides
<smspillaz> seb128: I think there was some old stuff tha twas
<seb128> chrisccoulson, http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/seb-e6410-oneiric-20110920-8.png
<seb128> chrisccoulson, http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/seb-e6410-oneiric-20110920-9.png
<seb128> chrisccoulson, that's before and after your updates on my laptop config
<mterry> smspillaz, but the other thing to try is first running "deja-dup-preferences" and then separately running "deja-dup --backup --auto" and seeing how well that works (it should be two windows in the same launcher then)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, btw do you also see plymouth staying there for almist 5 seconds?
<smspillaz> mterry: just to double check
<mterry> smspillaz, and I think also...  "deja-dup --prompt"
<chrisccoulson> seb128, oh, that looks better
<smspillaz> deja-dup --backup --auto won't start thrashing my disk will it ?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, no, i don't see plymouth at all on my laptop
<seb128> slangasek, ^ what info would be useful about "plymouth sitting there for 5 seconds" on my bootcharts?
<mterry> smspillaz, if you haven't set anything up, it should ask for your password, setting the urgency bit on the window
<seb128> slangasek, it's like half the boot time ;-)
<mterry> smspillaz, but not showing itself until you click on the launcher
<smspillaz> ok
<slangasek> seb128: 'ubuntu-bug plymouth' should gather up the important details
<slangasek> (dmesg, /proc/fb, lspci)
<seb128> slangasek, ok, is there any log that could point if it's really plymouth "blocking" the boot during that time?
<seb128> slangasek, or any boot option I could try, like nosplash?
<smspillaz> seb128: ... if only compiz was using gsettings in oneiric :(
<slangasek> seb128: "nosplash" is not a boot option, you just leave "splash" off :)  What does the boot chart look like?
<seb128> smspillaz, well, I will be happy if it uses it next cycle ;-)
<seb128> slangasek, http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/seb-e6410-oneiric-20110920-9.png
<slangasek> seb128: /var/log/boot.log should show what upstart jobs are happening at the time
<slangasek> (but without timestamps)
<smspillaz> seb128: +1
<smspillaz> seb128: I don't know why it wasn't put in this cycle actually
<smspillaz> must have been some confusiopn
<seb128> smspillaz, don't start on that when didrocks is around ;-)
<seb128> smspillaz, basically you guys didn't manage to give us a tarball before feature freeze
<smspillaz> ah yeah
<seb128> smspillaz, that and we freaked out of other issues like the stacking and the unity dialog and speed
<seb128> smspillaz, and we wanted to focus on getting those sorted before adding features
<smspillaz> *shrug*
<seb128> well, next cycle ;-)
<smspillaz> prepare for a codedump next cycle then
<seb128> with some luck it will be ready early in the cycle
<smspillaz> the list is getting pretty long
<smspillaz> oh literally
<smspillaz> september 22
<seb128> what list?
<smspillaz> I am merging like 6 different branches
<smspillaz> seb128: the list of stuff that's done but wasn't merged into this cycle for whatever reason :)
<seb128> smspillaz, you better not merge all those in once
<smspillaz> seb128: don't really have a choice
<seb128> we should rather prioritize and see what we want to land next cycle to avoid a disaster again and have to revert everything
<smspillaz> give me time to fix bugs
<smspillaz> its never perfect on the first run
<smspillaz> that's all I ask :)
<smspillaz> anyways, lets not discuss this now, it's a touchy subject
<smspillaz> mterry: one small caveat with minimized windows
<mterry> smspillaz,
<mterry> k
<smspillaz> mterry: windows that a start minimized are not accessible in the "per window" mode of the alt-tab
<smspillaz> because they have not been mapped
<smspillaz> and as such we are not able to access their pixmap data
<smspillaz> so I've filed a design bug about this
<smspillaz> because right now the launcher will unminimize the last used minimized window
<smspillaz> if the window is part of a group
<smspillaz> (ditto alt-tab)
<mterry> smspillaz, if I manually call map on the window, does that workaround that?
<smspillaz> mterry: err, it depends on how gtk works really
<mterry> smspillaz, I forget how it handles that
<smspillaz> mterry: how this works on an X level is .. interesting
<smspillaz> basically in order to make a window initially minimized
<mterry> smspillaz, well, I can live with it not being in alt-tab
<smspillaz> you set the initial_state member to IconicState and then map the window
<smspillaz> the window manager will intercept that and then transition the window from withdrawn to minimized
<smspillaz> but not actually map the window
<smspillaz> if you map the window again
<smspillaz> it unminimizes
<mterry> smspillaz, hrm
<smspillaz> mterry: basically, the only way to access such windows right now is by using the spread which will temp unminimize windows
<smspillaz> (that's only in the case of window groups though)
<smspillaz> but lets see what design says about this
<smspillaz> because I think that for initially unmapped / minimized windows
<mterry> smspillaz, that's fine.  The chances a user will have the preferences open when an automatic backup starts is small
<smspillaz> activating the launcher icon should unminimize all windows
<smspillaz> err
<smspillaz> unminimize all initailly minimized windows and show any withdrawn windows
<smspillaz> mterry: ok so valac doesn't include comments in the code, hurr
<smspillaz> mterry: can you point me to the bzr version :)
<mterry> smspillaz, :)
<mterry> smspillaz, https://live.gnome.org/DejaDup/GettingInvolved/Coding
<mterry> smspillaz, you can skip the bit about adding the ppa:deja-dup-team/dev repository
<seb128> we should not let things skip alt-tab ever
<smspillaz> this reminds me that we should also stack focus denied windows at the bottom of the tree
<smspillaz> seb128: it's impossible to implement it unfortunately
<smspillaz> seb128: without brekaing applications
<smspillaz> seb128: the application will still be alt-tabbable
<seb128> smspillaz, we shouldn't make applications skip alt-tab there
<seb128> then
<smspillaz> but you just won't see the initially minimized or withdrawn window
<smspillaz> because to xcomposite, its pixmap doesn't exist
<seb128> smspillaz, oh, my comment was a side one, I hate how apport dialog are "lost" if you alt-tab to something which is over them
<seb128> like not listed in the launcher
<seb128> not listed in alt-tab
<smspillaz> yeah that sucks
<seb128> the only way to go back to those is to reduce or close whatever is in front
<seb128> I don't get why we just don't list them as normal dialogs
<seb128> well that's rather an application design thing than a wm one
<smspillaz> though I'm suprised that apport is not matched to an application by bamf
<slangasek> seb128: what's the video chipset on this, OOI?
<seb128> slangasek, i5
<seb128> the intel chip integrated to the i5
<rickspencer3> hi seb128
<rickspencer3> I just set up a 'puter with i7
<rickspencer3> I installed the nvidia driver
<seb128> hey rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> I guess there is some way I can choose between integrated graphics and the nvidia chip
<rickspencer3> ?
 * rickspencer3 noticed seb128 had i5
<seb128> my i5 doesn't have dual videos
<rickspencer3> nice, so I restarted and got Unity 2e
<rickspencer3> 2d, even
<seb128> I'm sure there is a way, but it would be a question before suited for Sarvatt or tjaalton or RAOF or bryceh ;-)
<slangasek> seb128: so I'm not quite sure what this points to, but plymouthd is stuck waiting for something... it coincides with the lifetime of the 'plymouth' command above it, which is *probably* 'plymouth show-splash'... so udev has signalled that the video is up, plymouth tries to display to it, and then it has to wait for some reason
 * rickspencer3 removes binary blob
<slangasek> seb128: booting with plymouth:debug and attaching /var/log/plymouth-debug.log would be the next step
<seb128> slangasek, ok thanks, I will do that next time I restart
<slangasek> seb128: I definitely want to see the dmesg for this.  Have you filed a bug?
<bryceh> rickspencer3, no hybrid graphics switching is not supported yet
<seb128> slangasek, not yet, I was trying to figure if I'm right to blame it on plymouth before
<bryceh> rickspencer3, there's sometimes manual ways to switch via bios or other hw-specific mechanisms
<rickspencer3> bryceh, so ... I was running Unity 3d, np, I presume from the integrated intel chip
<slangasek> seb128: plymouth is just the messenger ;)  but ubuntu-bug plymouth gives *me* the information needed to further triage
<rickspencer3> I run jockey, it says I need the nvidia driver for Unity 3d, I install it, no unity 3d
<rickspencer3> bryceh, I suppose there is a bug here somewhere?
<bryceh> rickspencer3, yep
<bryceh> rickspencer3, well, wishlist feature actually
<rickspencer3> also, not it offers "nvidia_current"
<slangasek> oh, also, I think the first dotted line suggests that this is all being ascribed to the kernel budget, not the plumbing budget
<slangasek> which corroborates the idea that it's a kernel driver delay
<seb128> slangasek, ok, I will open the bug and add the log and ping you with the bug number ;-)
<slangasek> sounds fine :)
<seb128> dinner time for now, bbl
<rickspencer3> bryceh,  so, I'm confused, why does jockey tell me to install the binary driver to get 3d, and then 3d doesn't work?
<bryceh> rickspencer3, I'd have to check logs to say for certain, but typically is something like this:  jockey looks at all your video cards and notices that you have an nvidia card supported by the binary driver, so it helpfully suggests installing it
<bryceh> however when you reboot, the kernel starts loading up kernel drivers for graphics, notes you have an intel card so loads up that kernel driver
<smspillaz> mterry: hm so
<rickspencer3> bryceh, uh
<smspillaz> mterry: do you actually request for the window to start iconic and then show it later ?
<bryceh> now X comes along and sees that you have parts from one driver loaded in the kernel (intel), and parts from another (nvidia), and so can't do its job
<rickspencer3> so, basically, I can't use my brand new nvidia chip with 11.10?
<mterry> smspillaz, yeah, iconify()/show()/iconify().  Then I rely on the launcher to show it when the user clicks the icon
<bryceh> rickspencer3, well, there's sometimes manual ways to switch via bios or something, but no hybrid graphics switching through software is not available yet
<rickspencer3> dang
<smspillaz> mterry: that seems like wrong behaviour to me
 * rickspencer3 disables driver
<mterry> smspillaz, OK, why?
<smspillaz> oh hang on
<rickspencer3> bryceh, what if I don't want to switch?
<rickspencer3> I just want to use the nvidia card?
<smspillaz> mterry: ok, I misunderstood the way gtk works
<smspillaz> the example does iconify () show ()
<bryceh> rickspencer3, you could try blacklisting the i915 kernel driver, some people find that does the trick
<smspillaz> I had show () iconify ()
<smspillaz> that wouldn't work until the window was realized
<mterry> smspillaz, right, I think if you did that, you might flash on screen for a sec
<mterry> smspillaz, which is a way to work around previous compiz behavior
<smspillaz> no, it just mapped unfocused
<smspillaz> huh wtf
<mterry> smspillaz, oh, that might be because WidgetUtils.c sets focus_on_map = false
<smspillaz> right
<smspillaz> but I just changed it to do iconify () show () like the example and it still died
<smspillaz> well
<smspillaz> by died I mean
<smspillaz> mapped
<smspillaz> but not minimized
<mterry> smspillaz, can you pastebin the vala code?
<smspillaz> sure, hang on
<mterry> just to verify you've turned the copier on
<smspillaz> mterry: http://paste.ubuntu.com/693929/
 * smspillaz greps gdk for XWMH.initial_state
<mterry> smspillaz, in hide_background_window_for_shell, don't set focus_on_map = true.  That was part of the workaround
<mterry> er, false
<mterry> I mean, don't set focus_on_map = false
<mterry> Not sure if that will affect anything, but...
<smspillaz> it shouldn't
<smspillaz> mterry: maybe the unity shell detection code isn't working here
<mterry> smspillaz, add a: warning("hello!"); to the code block then
<mterry> This is step 1 of my evil plan to make smspillaz a deja-dup developer
<mterry> Then deja-dup maintainer, as I slowly fade away
<smspillaz> hey hang on, I was planning to do that window compiz!
<smspillaz> *with
<smspillaz> ahhhh *what*
<smspillaz> ok
<smspillaz> so for some reason it is in my $PATH
<smspillaz> but not running the right one
<smspillaz> mterry: anyways, I ran it locally and it works as expected now
<mterry> smspillaz, yay!
<smspillaz> :)
<mterry> smspillaz, for all three cases (alone, window group, prompt)?
<smspillaz> mterry: ok test results
<smspillaz> for deja-dup-preference
<smspillaz> it shows a separte launcher icon
<smspillaz> (dunno if that's intentional, seems to be a different desktop file)
<smspillaz> when you have both deja-dup --promp and deja-dup --backup --auto open
<mterry> smspillaz, it is, but I thought in such cases it got bundled in.  If it doesn't, that's fine too
<smspillaz> clicking on the launcher icon deiconifies the first one, then once you've dealt with it clicking it again will deiconify the other one
<mterry> smspillaz, if that is what you expect, I'm fine with it
<smspillaz> +1
<mterry> smspillaz, thank you so much for testing
<smspillaz> np
<mterry> smspillaz, I'll back out my workaround then before 20.0 release
<smspillaz> +1
<jcastro> smspillaz: wooo, my stacking issues are fixed with the desktop ppa
<jcastro> great job!
<smspillaz> no guaruntees, but thanks for the compliment
<kenvandine> smspillaz, it does seem good here too
<kenvandine> looks promising :)
<smspillaz> jcastro: kenvandine: if you run with --debug and open tricky applications like gimp and libreoffice you'll see that its not perfect
<smspillaz> but its fixed about 99% of the problems
<smspillaz> so that's good
<kenvandine> i am very happy that the dash and switcher appear on top again
<kenvandine> makes it much easier to use unity :)
<jcastro> yeah but something else changed, my dash performance took a hit last week on nvidia
<smspillaz> jcastro: it is because the dash is constantly repainting itself
<smspillaz> we are looking into it
<jcastro> oh, I thought it was my driver, because that got updated
<smspillaz> could be that too
<smspillaz> jcastro: bolt a few fans to your laptop and use nouveau
<smspillaz> :3
 * smspillaz does that
<smspillaz> no literally, I bolted fans to my laptop
<jcastro> my fan is already always maxed out
<chrisccoulson> yeah, the stacking issues seem to be fixed here too
<chrisccoulson> but it's time to switch back to 2d now, where the icons in the dash aren't blurry :)
<chrisccoulson> RAOF, bug 854986 is for you ;)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 854986 in xorg-server "5 second delay between Xorg starting and the greeter starting (Dell Latitude E6410)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/854986
<chrisccoulson> sorry :/
<seb128> chrisccoulson, it's weird how different your chart is compared to the one I did earlier
<seb128> chrisccoulson, is that on your new dell?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, i'm not sure why it's so different
<chrisccoulson> yeah, this is the new machine
<seb128> chrisccoulson, so quite similar to my dell
<seb128> you have a 5s before the boot start, modprobe is quite hitting the disk for you, xorg is very slow as well
<chrisccoulson> yeah, you don't seem to see any of that :/
<chrisccoulson> slangasek, is it normal for modprobe to take this long - https://launchpadlibrarian.net/80443468/farnsworth-oneiric-20110920-9.png?
<chrisccoulson> actually, i'm not sure who i should ping about that ;)
<chrisccoulson> buy seb128 doesn't see that, and we have fairly similar hardware
<chrisccoulson> **but
<seb128> your disk is a ssd as well right?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah
<seb128> chrisccoulson, well maybe try the kernel team
<seb128> we miss Keybuk to bring up such issues ;-)
<chrisccoulson> heh
<slangasek> chrisccoulson: it's certainly not *normal*, it's a bug
<slangasek> it's not the first such bug I've seen this cycle however
<chrisccoulson> slangasek, any idea how i could debug it?
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i've been looking at the desktop budget today, and killed a few bugs there already
<chrisccoulson> it seems my bootchart shows a couple of really long delays :(
<achiang> anyone here knowledgeable about gnome-power-manager? seeing something strange/annoying... turn the brightness down on laptop monitor, reboot, and then brightness is back to the max
<slangasek> chrisccoulson: file a bug on the kernel; that should pull in dmesg and udev logs I think
<chrisccoulson> slangasek, ok, will do that
<chrisccoulson> thanks
<slangasek> chrisccoulson: and somewhere buried in those logs, you should be able to see some odd gaps in the timings that will tell you who's to blame
<chrisccoulson> achiang, i'm sure there's a bug about that somewhere. i don't think it's ever saved the brightness across reboots unless you adjust it in the control center panel
<chrisccoulson> in any case, that's controlled by gnome-settings-daemon now
<chrisccoulson> brb
<achiang> chrisccoulson: yeah, i've found LP: #771561
<seb128> chrisccoulson, hum, I wonder if your g-s-d update is buggy
<chrisccoulson> seb128, oh, what's not working?
<seb128> when I log in docked with the laptop lid close the screen is set to mirror
<chrisccoulson> seb128, what did it do before?
<seb128> where usually it's my external monitor 1920 resolution which is set and the laptop screen off
<seb128> which is the configuration I defined with the screen capplet
<seb128> so it's like g-s-d was not loading my config on login
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, i'll take a look. perhaps that's the gnome-desktop change
<seb128> do you want me to downgrade gnome-desktop to see?
<seb128> mterry, nice catch on the gedit bug, just curious but how did you figure that?
<seb128> I tried to look at it earlier in the cycle but neither gdb nor strace were really useful
<chrisccoulson> seb128, ah, it doesn't load my config here too
<seb128> chrisccoulson, do you want me to try with gnome-desktop downgraded?
<mterry> seb128, GEDIT_DEBUG=1 and looking at different output
<seb128> chrisccoulson, you should create a test user so you wouldn't have to log out and in ;-)
<seb128> mterry, oh, GEDIT_DEBUG, learning every day...
<seb128> thanks ;-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, can do (try with gnome-desktop downgraded)
<seb128> brb
<seb128> re
<seb128> chrisccoulson, yeah, downgrading libgnome-desktop-3-2 fixes it
<chrisccoulson> seb128, thanks. i'll take a look at that then
<chrisccoulson> seb128, ok, found the issue
<seb128> chrisccoulson, great!
<chrisccoulson> g-s-d expects me to set the GError appropriately when the backup file isn't found, which i forgot to do ;)
<chrisccoulson> so it just skips over the whole lot
<chrisccoulson> easy fix :)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, ok, fix uploaded now
<seb128> chrisccoulson, thanks
<chrisccoulson> it does mean that you'll suffer the cost of XRRGetScreenResourcesCurrent, as that is called if you have a configuration file
<chrisccoulson> i wonder if i can avoid that :/
<chrisccoulson> it seems pointless to fetch the screen information, and then refresh it again immediately afterwards
<chrisccoulson> i guess it's better than suffering from 3 of them though ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, well, I personally don't care much, if you saw my charts the xrandr call have very low impact on xorg on my config
<seb128> weird that it takes over 1s for some other intel users
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i'm fairly sure the additional refresh is completely unnecessary there
<chrisccoulson> it would make sense when applying a config manually later in the session
<chrisccoulson> but it's triggering 2 reprobes in a row still
<mterry> tremolux, I just got bug 848676 on up-to-date software-center when I was removing packages
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 848676 in software-center "[MASTER] software-center crashed with DBusException in _convert_dbus_exception(): org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.UnknownMethod: Method "GetAll" with signature "s" on interface "org.freedesktop.DBus.Properties" doesn't exist" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/848676
<tremolux> mterry: hmm, well that's just sad
<tremolux> mterry: what's your version?
<tremolux> mterry: .3?
<mterry> tremolux, yeah
<tremolux> mterry: did you apport it?
<mterry> tremolux, I did, but it said "this has already been reported" and pointed me at that bug
<tremolux> mterry: yeah, I think that one's bugpatterned
<mterry> tremolux, easy for me to trigger.  I seem to get it by just removing packages
<mterry> tremolux, hmm,  no, but queuing up packages to remove
<tremolux> mterry: I guess we need to reopen, would you mind adding a comment to the bug?
<mterry> tremolux, OK
<tremolux> mterry: thanks
<tremolux> mterry: so, for you it's quite reproducible then?
<mterry> tremolux, I got it 3 times anyway
<tremolux> mterry: the key might be the multiple removes, this is one of those bugs that we haven't been able to repro ourselves
<chrisccoulson> time to find out where Xorg is burning 5 seconds on startup here
<soren> Every time I do anything involving xrandr, everything stalls for a while. I think it's more than 5 seconds though, so possibly completely unrelated.
<chrisccoulson> soren, no, i don't think that's unrelated ;)
<htorque> chrisccoulson: have you tried the latest natty kernel by any chance? my probing related cpu spiking (probably what soren sees) starts between ubuntu's 2.6.38 and 2.6.39 kernel.
<htorque> not sure though if i wouldn't be chasing a red herring if i'd bisect the kernel.
<seb128> Sarvatt, bryceh: ^
<seb128> on the topic
<bryceh> chrisccoulson, soren vga probing?
<chrisccoulson> bryceh, yeah, see bug 854101
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 854101 in ubuntu-boot-speed "gnome-settings-daemon takes waaaaaaaay too long to start" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/854101
<bryceh> I'd be interested to hear if the delay = ${NUM_VIDEO_OUTPUTS} * 1 sec
<seb128> 'night
<Sarvatt> soren: 5 seconds! thats crazy! randomly curious, is that on a thinkpad?
<bryceh> chrisccoulson, tail -f /var/log/Xorg.0.log and then reproduce, and see if you see it printing RANDR stuff during that period
<bryceh> chrisccoulson, x220?
<chrisccoulson> bryceh, no, i'm on a dell here. the probing isn't too bad for me (~0.5s). the main problem is the amount of times we do it :)
<Sarvatt> bryceh: nope he's on a dell, his numbers dont seem that crazy
<chrisccoulson> i'm more concerned about bug 854986 on my laptop though ;)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 854986 in xorg-server "5 second delay between Xorg starting and the greeter starting (Dell Latitude E6410)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/854986
<soren> Sarvatt: Yes, it is.
<chrisccoulson> Xorg seems to take forever to start on my machine
<htorque_> bryceh: here it's a thinkpad t510. i see probes for lcd (internal), vga (nothing connected), hdmi1-3 (don't have those), dp1-3 (i have one - disconnected).
<soren> bryceh: ${NUM_VIDEO_OUTPUTS} as in possible outputs or active outputs?
<bryceh> chrisccoulson, yeah, I noticed that as well; crazy amount of repetitive repetition
<bryceh> soren, possible
<soren> I'll attempt to time it. Hang on.
<soren> Hm.. No.
<bryceh> soren, upstream (Intel) says they know of an issue where the VGA probing is unnecessarily slow, at least on certain hardware types, but it's uncertain if that's the case here
<soren> Just running xrandr takes slightly less than 4 seconds.
<soren> With 2 connected and 5 disconnected outputs.
<soren> Actually changing anything, though, is way slower.
<bryceh> I think there's a way to make it completely ignore specific outputs.  dunno what the config syntax is though.  but that would pinpoint if it really is the output probing
<htorque_> bryceh: http://paste.ubuntu.com/694052/
<soren> bryceh: WEll, "xrandr --current" is nearly instantaneous.
<htorque_> soren: confirming.
<bryceh>        --current
<bryceh>               Return the current screen configuration, without polling for hardware changes.
<bryceh> ok, so that seems to support the hypothesis that it's the polling that's bugged
<soren> bryceh: This is kernel stuff these days, right?
<bryceh> htorque_, thanks.  however I'm wondering if the configuration needs to happen kernel-side; do you find that xorg.conf change results in faster boot / randr ?
<bryceh> soren, correct
<htorque_> bryce: yes, a lot faster.
<bryceh> htorque_, ok thanks
<htorque_> bryce: it's basically the same picture as here if i put all my disconnected outputs on "ignore": https://launchpadlibrarian.net/80234431/oneiric-2.6.38-vs-3.0.0_crop.png
<bryceh> soren, would be interesting if you could add that same snippet and see if it also eliminates the lag (or a portion of it) for you
<soren> Sorry, which snippet was this?
<soren> bryceh: ^
<bryceh> soren, <htorque_> bryceh: http://paste.ubuntu.com/694052/
<htorque_> i haven't tested only VGA1 though - i did this for all disconnected ones.
<bryceh> htorque_, do you put that in /etc/X11/xorg.conf.d/vga.conf or similar?  Or just in xorg.conf directly?
<htorque_> xorg.conf in /etc/X11
<soren> bryceh: I'll give it a shot.
<bryceh> soren, thanks
<soren> bryceh: I'll repeat for all the disconnected ones, right?
<bryceh> htorque_, in those two images, is the ONLY difference the kernel version?  (Same Xorg versions?)
<chrisccoulson> fantastic, i've got some air crash investigation to watch
<htorque_> bryce: yes. i actually narrowed that down to 2.6.38-8.42 â good, 2.6.39-0.5 â bad.
<bryceh> soren, that would be quite interesting; I'm curious if it's just hte VGA that causes the slowdown, or the sum of all disconnected outputs
<bryceh> htorque_, sweet, excellent work.  Has this been escalated for the kernel team yet?
<htorque_> bryce: no, i just finished all the rebooting fun. it's also happening with a daily upstream kernel from a couple days ago (from the ubuntu mainline ppa).
<RAOF> Oh, the mainline kernel builds are back in business?
<bryceh> htorque_, ok, no prob, would you mind filing a bug (ubuntu-bug linux) and I can handle getting it escalated to the kernel team
<bryceh> or actually
<htorque_> RAOF: oh, it was 201108310919 - so probably not :-(
<bryceh> htorque_, do `ubuntu-bug xorg`, which will get X logs that might be of use
<bryceh> I'll reassign to kernel after that
<htorque_> bryce: what about chrisccoulson's bug 854986? is this not the same?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 854986 in xorg-server "5 second delay between Xorg starting and the greeter starting (Dell Latitude E6410)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/854986
<chrisccoulson> i don't think that's the same
<chrisccoulson> if it is, then it's not any clients triggering the probing
<bryceh> well, just to be safe let's assume they're not.  I can escalate both, and let upstream decide
<soren> bryceh: This is interesting.
<soren> bryceh: I tried disabling everything but LVDS1. xrandr was instantaneous.
<bryceh> chrisccoulson, lp #854101 is focusing totally on just gnome lag stuff?  nothing I need to worry over?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 854101 in ubuntu-boot-speed "gnome-settings-daemon takes waaaaaaaay too long to start" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/854101
<soren> Then I re-enabled VGA1 (I use an external monitor). Still instantaneous.
<soren> Then I re-enabled HDMI1. Now it's back to ~4 seconds to just run xrandr.
<RAOF> chrisccoulson: X does a probe during startup; if proping is taking ages, X startup will take ages.
<chrisccoulson> bryceh, yeah, that's completely focused on what gnome-settings-daemon does before anything else starts
<RAOF> s/proping/probing/
<bryceh> alrighty
<chrisccoulson> RAOF, yeah, i'm not sure what it's doing. did you see my last comment on the bug?
<soren> lightdm also felt waaaay snappier when all the disconnected outputs were disabled.
<bryceh> morning RAOF
<chrisccoulson> i found where it spends 2.5 seconds of its time
<soren> I'll see if HDMI1 is the culprit of it it's any disconnected output that makes it slow.
<htorque_> bryceh: should i undo the fix in that report? i'm also using this fixed g-s-d version (but found the kernel differences before that on a 'clean' system).
<htorque_> (i mean before reporting anything)
<RAOF> chrisccoulson: Does it actually do a modeset on X startup?
<bryceh> htorque_, hmm, might not matter, but to be completely scientific it would not be a bad idea
<soren> Wow.
<soren> For me, it's HDMI1.
<soren> I re-enabled everything but that, and now it's as fast as it was in NAtty.
<chrisccoulson> RAOF, bug 854986 - i'm not sure if that has enough information to tell you that :)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 854986 in xorg-server "5 second delay between Xorg starting and the greeter starting (Dell Latitude E6410)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/854986
<soren> I don't have an HDMI port at all, though. It's an X200s. I think I'd have one if I had a docking station, but I don't.
<htorque_> soren: do you actually have a HDMI port? i don't...
<htorque_> ok :)
<soren> So it's no loss for me, but for someone with a dock, it'd suck to have it be disabled.
<RAOF> soren: No, you wouldn't have an HDMI port, even on the docking station.
 * RAOF *has* a docking station; it's got exactly one video output: DP.
<soren> RAOF: No?
<soren> Oh.
<RAOF> The vbios is just being super-conservative.
<bryceh> soren, check your xrandr output; there are cases where you'll have "phantom outputs" that dont' actually have a physical connector hooked up
<soren> bryceh: Oh, the vast majority are fake.
<RAOF> Maybe lenovo will at some point create a docking station that has 3 DP outputs, a couple of HDMI... :)
<soren> bryceh: I only have two. One is the built-in display, and then I have a VGA port.
<soren> bryceh: but xrandr brags about DP1 DP2 DP3 HDMI1 HDMI2
<bryceh> chrisccoulson, I'd also like to see you repeat the xorg.conf settings to narrow down if disabling HDMI or another output restores your speed
<bryceh> yeah
<bryceh> soren, there are ways to 'quirk' off these phantom outputs, but it requires kernel patching
<bryceh> soren, can you also file a bug report (ubuntu-bug xorg), so we can handle your case as well
<soren> bryceh: Sure thing.
<bryceh> I'm hoping that upstream can give us a general purpose patch, but it's possible they'll do quirking, which will be very hw-specific
<chrisccoulson> bryceh, which settings are those? sorry, i haven't followed all of the discussion :)
<bryceh> chrisccoulson, <bryceh> soren, <htorque_> bryceh: http://paste.ubuntu.com/694052/
<bryceh> chrisccoulson, stick that in your /etc/X11/xorg.conf (maybe expand to include other outputs), then restart X
<chrisccoulson> ok, brb
<soren> bryceh: Bug #855124
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 855124 in xorg "XRANDR operations very slow" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/855124
<bryceh> thanks
<chrisccoulson> bryceh, probing seems quicker
<chrisccoulson> i added all the disconnected outputs reported by xrandr -q to my xorg.conf
<chrisccoulson> but it doesn't affect bug 854986
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 854986 in xorg-server "5 second delay between Xorg starting and the greeter starting (Dell Latitude E6410)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/854986
<bryceh> chrisccoulson, hmm
<chrisccoulson> 1 second, brb
<chrisccoulson> yeah, so probing went from ~0.5s to ~0.13s
<bryceh> chrisccoulson, interesting, but Xorg startup is exactly the same?
<chrisccoulson> bryceh, yeah, it looks like it
<chrisccoulson> bryceh, yeah, still ~5s
<RAOF> It seems like you've only got one monitor plugged in, right?
<RAOF> X shouldn't be setting a mode at all in that case.
<chrisccoulson> RAOF, i've just got the laptop screen atm
<bryceh> ohhh
<bryceh> eDP1
<RAOF> Which is why I'm surprised that setdesiredmodes is taking so long.
<RAOF> Yeah, eDP modesetting is not necessarily the fastest thing you could stick in your startup path :)
<bryceh> chrisccoulson, try connecting a monitor, and disabling everything but that (i.e. disable the eDP1 output)
<bryceh> RAOF, was just 1 week ago keithp was telling us the woe that is eDP
<chrisccoulson> ok, i'll try that
<RAOF> And both nouveau and intel performed major surgery on their eDP stacks to make modesetting on the new MBAs work :)
<chrisccoulson> need to go back upstairs for that though
<htorque> bryceh: bug 855133 - i will see if it's only HDMI1 for me like for soren.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 855133 in xorg "Xrandr probing slow" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/855133
<bryceh> htorque, ok thanks
<bryceh> soren, ok now on to your bug
<chrisccoulson> ok, brb
 * RAOF thinks chrisccoulson needs a second, dedicated IRC machine :)
<chrisccoulson> bryceh, it was ~3.6s on that boot with eDP1 disabled
<bryceh> ok that sounds better
<bryceh> ideally I'd want to see ~1 sec
<bryceh> or 2 sec max
<chrisccoulson> and it looks like all of that saving came from xf86SetDesiredModes
<chrisccoulson> i patched my system here to log extra points :)
<RAOF> Yeah.
<RAOF> That would be because you're no longer modesetting the eDP.
<htorque> bryceh: fwiw, it's also HDMI1 here.
<chrisccoulson> the other big delay seems to be here:
<chrisccoulson> [    11.508] drmOpenDevice: open result is 12, (OK)
<chrisccoulson> [    13.231] drmOpenByBusid: Searching for BusID pci:0000:00:02.0
<RAOF> ???
<RAOF> Your machine is weird.
<chrisccoulson> heh
<bryceh> chrisccoulson, final question - is this a regression?  Did the boot speed work properly in natty or in oneiric with an earlier kernel version?
<RAOF> On my x200s the whole DRM open stuff takes less time than the resolution of the timer.
<chrisccoulson> bryceh, good question. it's a new laptop
<bryceh> chrisccoulson, ok
<chrisccoulson> i gave up on my old one because boot time was in the order of minutes ;)
<bryceh> ok that chalks up.  I think eDP just sucks this way
<bryceh> can you return it?  (kidding!!!)
<chrisccoulson> heh
<bryceh> chrisccoulson, I've forwarded your bug upstream.  Don't get hopes up this'll be fixed by release; from what keithp said, they're having serious troubles getting eDP to work right... the hardware design itself seems to be to blame
<chrisccoulson> ah, ok. thanks
<RAOF> Yeah.  There's lots of "set this thing and wait x hundreds of ms, then do this other thing, and wait again".
<Sarvatt> did I hear eDP? chrisccoulson, mind trying this kernel? http://kernel.ubuntu.com/~sarvatt/macbook-air/
<Sarvatt> lots of huge delays peppered into the eDP modesetting code trying to make it work right because they didnt know what was going wrong, they're reworking it for 3.2
<chrisccoulson> ah, ok. i'll give that a try
<RAOF> I wonder what's happening in your 2 seconds of drm probing?
<chrisccoulson> 1 second, brb
<RAOF> NOOOOOO! Unity's alt-tab switcher has regressed to being more annoying again.
<RAOF> GARGH!  *Raise* the window you give focus to, please!
<bryceh> soren, ok, forwarded your bug report as well.  Sounds like HDMI1 just needs quirked off and then it's good.  Maybe they have an idea for a  more general fix
<bryceh> I've added the ubuntu kernel team as well
<chrisccoulson> Sarvatt, wow, that brings it down to around ~2s (with the eDP output enabled), and also fixes my ~5s modprobe issue too
<Sarvatt> chrisccoulson: argh
<chrisccoulson> 15 seconds to a usable session now, including entering my password
<chrisccoulson> that's impressive!
<RAOF> chrisccoulson: Does it also fix your crazy 2 second pause during drm loading in Xorg.0.log?
<chrisccoulson> hang on a minute, i've got to reboot again, just to see it more than once
<Sarvatt> chrisccoulson: its about 100K worth of patches on top of oneiric's kernel, hearing that makes me think its really needed but way too much to SRU at this point so I dont know wth to do
<chrisccoulson> RAOF, i still get a pause during drm loading (~1.2s)
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i'm not too sure either
<RAOF> Working modesetting is worth an extra 10sec boot time.
<chrisccoulson> it certainly would be nice to claw back some of the startup performance that we've lost over the last couple of cycles
<chrisccoulson> http://ubuntuone.com/2zvoxdrCCAdn2K42yBHHdI
<chrisccoulson> not sure if that works yet ;)
<RAOF> Working modesetting *without* the extra 10sec boot time could wait until P, I guess.
<bryceh> Sarvatt, is that a backport of upstream git or something?
<chrisccoulson> so, that link i shared is my *new* bootchart :)
<chrisccoulson> i'm really happy with that ;)
<chrisccoulson> that's taken around ~7s off it
<bryceh> chrisccoulson, well in your case seems we've narrowed it to eDP, which is new HW that's just plain badly supported, so not the source of the lossages ;-)
<Sarvatt> bryceh: keithp got a macbook air which is one of the few eDP machines and is trying to make it work, and in the process rewrote eDP modesetting quite a lot but its still not 100% yet
<RAOF> And nouveau's rewritten their eDP support likewise.
<bryceh> chrisccoulson, upstream has a question on it-
<bryceh> Can we get an strace of X starting along with a perf report? Something like
<bryceh> strace -t -o x.strace X -ac
<bryceh> perf record -f -g -a X -ac && perf report | cat > x.perf
<jasoncwarner_> hey robert_ancell TheMuso RAOF and bryceh meeting time.
<jasoncwarner_> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2011-09-20
<bryceh> jasoncwarner_, heya
<jasoncwarner_> hey bryceh , how are things?
<chrisccoulson> bryceh, it doesn't need to be a cold start does it?
<RAOF> We interrupt your regularly scheduled bootperformance hackfest to bring you the Desktop meeting :)
<bryceh> heh
<chrisccoulson> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/80459240/farnsworth-oneiric-20110920-16.png will make jasoncwarner_ happy ;)
<bryceh> jasoncwarner_, going good.  raof and I had a good time at the X conference last week, lots of good convo's
<kenvandine> chrisccoulson, nice!
<TheMuso> Hey folks.
<chrisccoulson> kenvandine, that's thanks to RAOF, bryceh and Sarvatt ;)
<jasoncwarner_> chrisccoulson: ~15s? i do like that !
<chrisccoulson> jasoncwarner_, yeah, it was >25s yesterday
<kenvandine> now get that with unity-3d :)
<jasoncwarner_> chrisccoulson: that is exactly the trend we need ;)
<bryceh> just getting back into the swing of things today.  Fixed (I think) one of the release bugs pitti posted about today, and trying to tackle some X boot speed issues (slow output probing), which seems HW-specific so far
<jasoncwarner_> bryceh: nice...
<jasoncwarner_> let's get the meeting cranking
<robert_ancell> chrisccoulson, very impressive
<jasoncwarner_> [TOPIC] X update
<bryceh> oh...  as above.
<bryceh> RAOF, anything to add?
<Sarvatt> chrisccoulson: dont get too happy at that, the code was literally rewritten in the kernel yesterday and still isnt working properly so is some time off and is only fixing up your eDP machine (there are like 10 eDP i915 laptops total in the wild)
<RAOF> Did some triage of Xserver bugs; it looks like a bunch of them were accidentally fixed by the 1.10.4 upload.
<chrisccoulson> Sarvatt, that's ok, that works for me ;)
<jasoncwarner_> bryceh: ok...thanks...
<RAOF> I'm pretty sure I've got bug #831867 nailed down, and just need to test.
<Sarvatt> my i915 LVDS machines with SSDs have <10 second boot times here  the whole cycle
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 831867 in sane-backends "colord assert failure: colord: browser.c:701: avahi_service_browser_free: Assertion `*_head == _item' failed." [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/831867
<bryceh> http://www.bryceharrington.org/Arsenal/Reports/ubuntu-x-swat/totals-oneiric-workqueue.svg looks nasty, but I thinkj that's mainly a slew of False GPU lockup bugs we can ignore
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF: oh, nice!
<Sarvatt> (sorry for interrupting the meeting)
<jasoncwarner_> colord was causing some weird startup slowness, correct?
<bryceh> oh, I got a solid lead on the false gpu lockups chatting with Intel.  but will probably need to wait until next cycle to experiment with
<jasoncwarner_> let's move to LightDM/Unity-Greeter... robert_ancell ?
<RAOF> No; the gnome-settings-daemon color plugin was doing xrandr probes on startup, and that's expensive.
<robert_ancell> jasoncwarner_, I'll try and get one more release in before beta2 to fix some minor issues.  The important issue seems to be crashing in the greeter due to the indicators being threaded.  I've changed them to load sequentially in a thread and it seems more stable now
<jasoncwarner_> robert_ancell: cool...ok...
<jasoncwarner_> robert_ancell: the greeter you had me test that seems to help with my laginess, is that released generally yet?
<robert_ancell> jasoncwarner_, yes, that should be the latest one.  The most recent logs seemed to indicate it was round trip time to X that was the problem, and the stuff people have been finding in gnome-settings-daemon seems to confirm that
<robert_ancell> The very last one I sent you had g-s-d disabled, which indicated that is probably the cause
<robert_ancell> unfortunately we can't do that in general ;)
<jasoncwarner_> robert_ancell: yeah...I was just getting lag again so was wondering what was up...now i know! :)
<jasoncwarner_> robert_ancell, bryceh and RAOF you guys have clues on what is going on in U-G with X for a possible fix?
<robert_ancell> the logs showed a big initial delay, which is probably xrandr blocking the X server.
<RAOF> g-s-d causes boot slowdowns?  What a surprise!
<bryceh> U-G?
<jasoncwarner_> bryceh: unity-greeter...I've taken to the custom of shortening everything ;)
<robert_ancell> The ongoing lagginess was shown in the mouse right, which indicates the X server not keeping up
<bryceh> well, we have been suspecting output-probing related issues, perhaps a regression with vga probing, but so far haven't pinpointed it to that
<robert_ancell> RAOF, you could reproduce it right?
<jasoncwarner_> Ok...sounds like we have some clues, but nothing too exact yet...thanks.
<bryceh> chrisccoulson has isolated some X-related delays to be due to g-s-d over-querying randr, thus exacerbating the probing issue
<RAOF> robert_ancell: Yeah.  I sent you the traces.
<jasoncwarner_> TheMuso: care to update on a11y, sound and all that good stuff?
<bryceh> i.e., it's slow to probe to begin with, and then GNOME requests re-probing multiple times
<RAOF> Something was probing xrandr, causing the delays.
<RAOF> But I'm not sure what, because the xtrace of unity-greeter didn't show RANDR requests.
<TheMuso> Ok, we should finally be over all the a11y related upgrade issues, pitti and myself spent some time on Monday afternoon sorting that out, so that should be good now.
<chrisccoulson> bryceh, 6 times on the default install :)
<chrisccoulson> and that's before anything else in the session begins to load
<TheMuso> I've had reports from users saying that the stuff I recently added to make using a11y on the live CD is not working, but I suspect they are either not doing something right, or are not using a recent daily, or are using beta 1. Need to run through things myself once again to be sure, hope to do that today/tomorrow, so I can get any fixes in post beta 2 if they are needed.
<chrisccoulson> i added my findings to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/11.10/BootSpeedAnalysis for anyone who is interested
<TheMuso> Still need to fix accessibility for notifications, as they are broken. May file a bug against notify-osd to make sure its known by DX, in case someone like Alehandro has time to look at it...
<TheMuso> But I am going to try and fix it myself if I can.
<TheMuso> Audio wise, a few more bug fixes post beta 2, but nothing major.
<TheMuso> So things are starting to wrap up on my end.
<jasoncwarner_> TheMuso: how is accessibility in ubuiquity? I believe you said you needed to do some more testing there last week ?
<TheMuso> jasoncwarner_: Yeah its usable, needs more work cleaning up widget names, but thats one goal for 12.04. A user can still get through and work out what is what and get the system installed.
<jasoncwarner_> TheMuso: ok...cool...would you say that, using Unity-2d, we have a fully accessible desktop?
<TheMuso> Not yet, still waiting on more bugfixes from the 2d guys
<TheMuso> But the only critical thing that is missing is the quicklists and no access to the panel.
<TheMuso> The dash is mostly usable, and hopefully will be more so after next week's upload.
<jasoncwarner_> TheMuso: ok...sounds florian is making 'em a priority. let me know if it looks like something si going to fall short so we can get it reprioritized.
<jasoncwarner_> thanks!
<jasoncwarner_> ok...
<TheMuso> ok
<jasoncwarner_> [TOPIC] Any other Business?
<jasoncwarner_> anyone want to add anything ?
<TheMuso> nope
<jasoncwarner_> alright...thank everyone
<RAOF> Nor here.
<jasoncwarner_> [END MEETING]
<bryceh> thanks
<robert_ancell> bryceh, hey, does failsafe X work now?  LightDM now exits if it can't start an X server / greeter but I'm not sure if the code is there to trigger failsafe X from upstart
<bryceh> robert_ancell, the code should be there, but I haven't had a chance to test it again since before XDC
<robert_ancell> bryceh, ok
<bryceh> robert_ancell, at least the udev rule ought to be firing
<bryceh> robert_ancell, I plan to play with it some more this week once I'm though some of these release bugs
<robert_ancell> ok, let me know if lightdm behaves badly
<bryceh> robert_ancell, right will do
<bryceh> htorque, ok tackled your bug report too - I've sent it upstream with your comments
<htorque> bryceh: thanks! :)
<bryceh> htorque, yours and soren's look very similar, possibly dupes.  but will let upstream decide.
<htorque> bryceh: yeah, thought so. also, we are both using thinkpads (though not the same models).
<cyphermox> robert_ancell: planning to go for a beer on some evening during hackfest? :)
<htorque> robert_ancell: hi! fyi, with bug 855133 worked around, bug 828112 is fixed for me. no lagging whatsoever.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 855133 in linux "Xrandr probing slow" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/855133
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 828112 in unity-greeter "Password field feedback slow at times" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/828112
<robert_ancell> cyphermox, which hackfest (though the answer is almost certainly yes)
<robert_ancell> htorque, yes!  Can we get jasoncwarner_ to test that too?
<cyphermox> robert_ancell: beginning of October in Montreal
<jasoncwarner_> robert_ancell: update and test? I rebooted yesterday and still had it (will reboot again here shortly)
<robert_ancell> cyphermox, you'll be there?  then of course!
<cyphermox> robert_ancell: I live a few minutes away, and work a few days a week from the Montreal office :)
<robert_ancell> sweet
<htorque> jasoncwarner_: are you using a thinkpad by any chance?
<jasoncwarner_> htorque: I am...x220
<jasoncwarner_> htorque: and I've heard of others using the 220 that see the same thing...
<jasoncwarner_> htorque: are you using thinkpad?
<htorque> jasoncwarner_: great! can you follow the description in bug 855124 and create or add that to your /etc/X11/xorg.conf? - yes, i'm using a thinkpad too (T510).
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 855124 in linux "XRANDR operations very slow unless (phantom) HDMI1 disabled" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/855124
<htorque> after that you hopefully shouldn't get any more lagging at the unity-greeter.
<jasoncwarner_> htorque: where is the xorg.conf? I don't have one in /etc/X11
<htorque> in that case create one
<htorque> (at /etc/X11/xorg.conf, yes)
<jasoncwarner_> ok
<jasoncwarner_> that is kind of what i was wondering :) thanks
<jasoncwarner_> htorque robert_ancell be back in a few...testing it...
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-09-21
<jasoncwarner_> robert_ancell and htorque that seemed to make a huge diff
<jasoncwarner_> http://paste.ubuntu.com/694113/ u-g log
<jasoncwarner_> I still had no mouse movement at the beginning...but that was for a second or two (which I think was X catching up)
<mdeslaur> This is weird: bug 855171
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 855171 in ca-certificates "libnss3.so went missing after upgrade" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/855171
<mdeslaur> whoops, wrong channel
<bryceh> jasoncwarner_, excellent, thanks for confirming that
<cyphermox> hmm
<cyphermox> would adding GNOME to NotShowIn cover just the Gnome Shell cases, or also break fallback and others? :)
<jbicha> GNOME is Shell & Fallback
<cyphermox> jbicha: yeah, that's the problem probably ;)
<cyphermox> going to test this now
<jbicha> like gnome-datetime-panel.desktop shows in Fallback g-c-c but it's OnlyShowIn=Gnome;
<jbicha> echo $XDG_CURRENT_DESKTOP
<cyphermox> oh, I know about all of this, just "saying out loud" that I'm pretty much screwed either way
<cyphermox> jbicha: see https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/network-manager-applet/+bug/852961 :)
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 852961 in network-manager-applet "nm-applet is wrongly started with Gnome Shell" [Undecided,New]
<cyphermox> I can't add it to NotShowIn without breaking something, and if I don't add it, something's still going to be broken
<cyphermox> but I think Shell > fallback; so I'll add it.
<jbicha> but I don't have nm-applet in my Shell session, just Fallback or Unity
<stgraber> cyphermox: shell isn't shipped by default by a derivative...
<cyphermox> really?
<cyphermox> also, really?
<cyphermox> gah
<cyphermox> stgraber: so edubuntu ships fallback?
<stgraber> cyphermox: fallback is an option at install time in edubuntu
<cyphermox> mkay
<jbicha> my notifications area is blank on new start & I have the normal Shell network menu
<cyphermox> jbicha: that's weird
<cyphermox> why would this bug be open then?
<jbicha> perhaps he's using an old shell version
<cyphermox> maybe
<cyphermox> alright, thanks for clearing that up
<jbicha> oh wait, he sees notifications in both shell style & an uglier style when the network disconnects for instance
<jbicha> I can duplicate that
<cyphermox> oh
<cyphermox> well then yeah, this is because nm-applet is getting started
<cyphermox> fixing this is going to be painful, because we're obviously limited by what's being run
<cyphermox> and shell / fallback sharing the same desktop value doesn't help
<jbicha> I think gnome-shell uses nm-applet, just with a different frontend
<cyphermox> jbicha: no
<cyphermox> it uses its own frontend in js
<jbicha> also the latest gnome-shell (not in the archives yet) doesn't show network notifications for connections/disconnections
<cyphermox> mkay
<jbicha> so it's at least visually fixed with that
<cyphermox> urgh
<cyphermox> is that going to be shipped?
<jbicha> just waiting for GNOME to get around to releasing the new gjs which gnome-shell silently depends on
 * cyphermox cries
<cyphermox> I just won't touch this and sleep on the issue
<jbicha> they just assume that you're going to be using the latest gjs & mutter & don't bother updating the configure.ac to reflect that
<broder> cyphermox: i thought i remembered dcbw saying that nm-applet didn't actually provide ui with shell these days
<cyphermox> broder that's what I remember too
<cyphermox> nm-applet shouldn't be running in shell, that's most likely the problem because it currently gets started in /etc/xdg/autostart
<broder> cyphermox: no, no - i thought he said it runs but only does...something minor and invisible
<cyphermox> broder: maybe
<cyphermox> AIUI it's just used for the wireless/mobile dialogs
<cyphermox> something that might be fixed by the new n-m-applet package with libnm-gtk split out
<broder> cyphermox: http://paste.ubuntu.com/694185/ - from about a week ago
<cyphermox> right
<cyphermox> I'll need to setup something with gnome-shell and mess around with it to see
<broder> oh, it sounds like maybe the only problem is notifications?
<jbicha> broder: yes I believe so
<cyphermox> sounds like it now
<cyphermox> jbicha: I just updated the bug, could you try figuring out what sends the notifcation that looks wrong?
<cyphermox> or if they have a different text, just a screenshot of each may be enough :)
<broder> we don't patch how nm-applet does its notifications - how would this not be broken anywhere that's using gnome-shell?
<jbicha> I expect that Fedora would have the same problem
<broder> err...wait, i was looking at n-m, not nm-applet :)
<cyphermox> broder: actually, I think it was lightly patched, but I don't think it would affect this
<cyphermox> it might be caused by differences in the notification themes, I've seen something getting broken in notifications if I install xubuntu-desktop on top of ubuntu-desktop, notifications start looking different, getting buttons, etc.
<broder> is gnome-shell a notification daemon? i guess...if notify-osd grabbed the dbus name, but gnome-shell short-circuited notifications internally to keep them from hitting dbus...
<jbicha> when I try to connect to a random encrypted wifi network, I get 2 popups to enter the password, one from gs, one from nm-applet
<cyphermox> yuck
<jbicha> not sure if the second one is just because I canceled the first one though
<broder> dcbw said that should happen around gnome 3.2 or so - is that what we're at at this point?
<cyphermox> pretty much
<cyphermox> "should" happen?
<jbicha> we're on 3.1.90 and current is 3.1.92 though
<broder> well...gnome-shell definitely looks like it ships a secret agent
<broder> (look at src/shell-network-agent.{h,c} and js/ui/networkAgent.js)
<jbicha> cyphermox: getting screenshots is a bit tricky since this is my web connection :)
<jbicha> I'm going to reboot into Fedora
<cyphermox> ok
<cyphermox> broder: jbicha: I really should be going to bed
<jbicha> ok, it's not a big issue anyway
<broder> jbicha: does gnome-shell set any useful environment variables so we could patch nm-applet to check those and exit immediately if they're set?
<cyphermox> you want to ping me if you find something ? :)
<cyphermox> you guys seem to be getting more progress than I do
<broder> cyphermox: it looks to me like nm-applet just shouldn't be running under gnome-shell anymore
<jbicha> I think you could sniff dbus to check if you're in gshell or not
<cyphermox> broder: I kind of got that feeling but I think you still need it for some dialogs at least
<broder> cyphermox: does nm-applet (not nm-connection-editor) do anything besides secret prompts?
<cyphermox> broder: that no, I don't think so
<broder> cyphermox: then just have nm-applet exit(0) if it's running under gnome-shell...however you determine that
<cyphermox> not sure how the more complex wifi connections are done
<broder> well, i've got an oneiric machine, and infrastructure for 802.1x and wpa enterprise , so i can try to do some experimentation at some point
<broder> but from my quick skim of the gnome-shell code, i see code for 802.1x, PPPoE, and modem connections
<broder> only thing i don't see offhand is vpn
<cyphermox> I'll look again in the morning
<jbicha> Fedora 16 doesn't show notifications for nm-applet so they only have the enter wifi password double dialog part of the bug
<cyphermox> ok
<cyphermox> maybe it's caused by one of those old patches we carry and I keep having to fix
<jbicha> well I think we want connection notifications in Unity though
<cyphermox> yeah
<cyphermox> jbicha: which still means there is no easy fix, I'll setup gnome-shell tomorrow on my system and try to make sense of what sends what
<kamstrup> mvo: morning - I need you help on some popcon related stuff
<kamstrup> mvo: how is the #stars computed from the popcon rating?
<kamstrup> digging through the S-C code only confused me more :-)
<kamstrup> my guess is that we normalize the score with the "max_popcon_desktop" metadata from the xapian index and multiply by 5... but I can't find that calculation anywhere
<kamstrup> also, I am not sure whether that makes sense at all :-)
<seb128> hey
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<seb128> hey pitti, how are you?
<pitti> seb128: furiously debugging ubiquity problems :)
<pitti> quite well, thanks
<pitti> just really concerned about the release time now
<seb128> pitti, "fun" ;-)
<seb128> is it worth testing the installer?
<seb128> or is it "known buggy"?
<pitti> it crashes if you are offline
<pitti> should work fine, just look a bit ugly if you are online and don't use the live session
<pitti> so, still worth testing if you want to
<mvo> kamstrup: *pfff* ;) we don't use the popcon for the stars, we use the ratings data
<mvo> kamstrup: what is the use-case, do you want to show it in unity?
<kamstrup> mvo: lol, that explains my inability to find it :-D
<seb128> pitti, let's see, I usually use the 10v as a test box and the wifi doesn't work out of the box
<kamstrup> mvo: the dash allows you to filter by the S-C rating
<kamstrup> mvo: so it's not in the xapian index?
<pitti> seb128: right, it'd fail there, unless you have an ethernet cable plugged in
<pitti> I did a test install on that one yesterday, with success
<kamstrup> mvo: hit super-a and unfold the "Filter results" expander, and you'll see what I mean
<mvo> kamstrup: no, because its so dynamic. we store it currently in a extra file
<mvo> kamstrup: but that sounds like that needs some re-thinking
<kamstrup> mvo: a fudge...
<kamstrup> mvo: yeah, probably means we need to pull that feature from the dash...
<rodrigo_> oh, everyone back :)
<mvo> kamstrup: aha, I was totally unaware of this feature in the dash
<rodrigo_> there were only 20 people or so when I woke up, I guess freenode had problems?
<kamstrup> mvo: yeah, it's not exactly a prominent place, hidden away inside the expander
<pitti> rodrigo_: yes, it did; should be fixed now, though
<mvo> kamstrup: so we currently use a xapian.KeyMaker and throw that as the sorter to the db
<seb128> robert_ancell, hey
<seb128> robert_ancell, what are you still doing online? ;-)
<robert_ancell> seb128, hey, just logged on to bug you...
<kamstrup> mvo: ah, so a KeyMaker that pulls the ratings from the file in order to generate the collation key?
<seb128> robert_ancell, oh great, it has been a while I didn't catch you (part due to the fact I was on holidays ;-)
<mvo> kamstrup: and the review stats (star rating plus wilson-score based "score" of the ratings) are stored in a pythin pickle
<mvo> kamstrup: yeah
<seb128> robert_ancell, what's up?
<robert_ancell> seb128, can you try / find victims to try lightdm + unity-greeter master today and check they're good?  I've been using them today, and I think everything's ok, but being this close to release a second opinion would be good
<kamstrup> mvo: hehe, a pickle, that puts me in a pickle (wow, worst pun ever)
<mvo> kamstrup: now of course we can make this a c++ friendlier format for you, thats easy
<mvo> kamstrup: lol, indeed
<seb128> robert_ancell, I'm happy to test those
<seb128> robert_ancell, did you see the translation bug I commented on?
<mvo> kamstrup: if this software stuff does not work out, just do standup commedy ;)
<robert_ancell> seb128, there's one remaining bug 845549 which I had a solution for but a commenter says it should be done better with the alternatives.  So could you follow up on those changes then undo mine if they're better
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 845549 in lightdm "Do not ship /etc/lightdm/lightdm-gtk-greeter.conf" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/845549
<kamstrup> mvo: out only option is prettymuch json I guess... but I don'tknow if that kills performance... I gues it'll be a very large file
<seb128> robert_ancell, ok
<mvo> kamstrup: would a libdb format work for you too?
<robert_ancell> seb128, yes, I fixed that.  it was gettext not being initialized correctly
<seb128> robert_ancell, great
<kamstrup> mvo: libdb? you mean bdb, or?
<seb128> robert_ancell, ok, I will test both trunks, review open bugs and drop you an email at the end of my day
<robert_ancell> seb128, there will still be bugs with PAM messages not being localized, but they're more unlikely to occur
<mvo> kamstrup: yeah
<robert_ancell> seb128, thanks!
<seb128> robert_ancell, yw, great job btw, lightdm really works great for me ;-)
<kamstrup> mvo: do we ship a bdb lib on the cd?
<seb128> well the current version does, let's see trunk :p
<robert_ancell> seb128, :)
<robert_ancell> seb128, There's still more bugs cropping up, but I think we're on top of the most important ones.
<mvo> kamstrup: need to check, I can also play a bit with json. alternatively I could provide you a dbus service
<mvo> kamstrup: but that does not is speedy enough I guess
<kamstrup> mvo: hmm, we can't depend on a running s-c
<seb128> robert_ancell, yeah, I've not seen a lot of "important to fix for oneiric" ones, out of the ones assigned to you
<seb128> robert_ancell, I will review the bugs today though just to be sure
<kamstrup> mvo: json is easy, but scares me because I've seen how slow it is in gwibber
<mvo> kamstrup: it would be something extra, not part of main s-c, but its probably a bad idea even then
<mvo> kamstrup: yeah, exactly
<kamstrup> mvo: it takes >1s 100% CPU churn to parse ~1k messages in gwibber
<mvo> kamstrup: s-c is already pretty slow to startup, I don't want to make it worse :/
<kamstrup> granted, that's some complex json, but still
<kamstrup> mvo: lol, right :-)
<robert_ancell> seb128, thanks.  there will be some things that will be annoying, but I guess we can put in the release notes "use gdm if this particular feature is important" (assuming it works in GDM)
<kamstrup> mvo: a mmap()able db format should make it faster than a pickle for S-C as well I guess
<mvo> kamstrup: let me check the CD to see if dbm might work, we just need to be careful with the layout so that there are no interoperatable issue. but I think that should be ok as the data is really just a mapping of str -> (int, int, int)
<kamstrup> mvo: yeah, sounds fit for a keystore
<seb128> robert_ancell, right
<mvo> kamstrup: I think for next cycle we need to talk some more and we need to provide you proper APIs
<kamstrup> mvo: I have libdb5.1 providing /usr/lib/i386-linux-gnu/libdb-5.1.so here... i don't know if that's on the cd...
<kamstrup> but i guess so
<robert_ancell> jasoncwarner_, so bug 828112 is fixed?  Using packages from the standard repos?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 828112 in unity-greeter "Password field feedback slow at times" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/828112
<mvo> kamstrup: both 4.8 and 5.1 are installed for me on the live-cd so we should be fine
<seb128> robert_ancell, the updates I mentioned there are not in the standard repo but in the ubuntu-desktop ppa
<robert_ancell> seb128, is there a bug I can merge this with?
<jasoncwarner_> robert_ancell: I had to manually create an /etc/X11/xorg.conf file to stop the HDMI probe
<pitti> robert_ancell: right, we need a wrapper around gnome-session for the lightdm guest account that we can hook the AA profile to
<robert_ancell> pitti, yeah, annoying!
<pitti> robert_ancell: but that can be a simple two-liner (she-bang and exec gnome-session "$@"), as in gdm
<pitti> jjardon: good morning
<pitti> jjardon: out of interest, what's the advantage of i-power talking to gnome-settings-daemon instead of upower directly?
<robert_ancell> pitti, right, but there's no concept of sticking one in in lightdm, so we need to work out the right place to do it
<kamstrup> mvo: ok, cool. I've no idea, but I assume we should use 5.1...
<seb128> jasoncwarner_, bug #855350 is the bug dholbach opened about the output probbing issue
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 855350 in xorg "long reprobes slow down boot/login" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/855350
<seb128> jasoncwarner_, if you want to comment on it
<jjardon> pitti: gnome-settings-daemon parse all the devices info for me, so I get a list of available devices with all their info only with a dbus call
<pitti> jjardon: that makes it slightly dependent on GNOME, though?
<pitti> jjardon: I just noticed because I'm currently debugging bug 854717, and it's indicator-power which dbus-launches g-s-d
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 854717 in ubiquity "Broken panel icons and dialog style during ubiquity-dm and OEM install/final user configuration" [Critical,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/854717
<pitti> (a broken g-s-d)
<pitti> jjardon: that's not directly i-power's fault, of course, but it made me wonder why it uses g-s-d
<chrisccoulson_> RAOF, Sarvatt - is the eDP slowness likely to affect changing the screen brightness via xrandr?
<chrisccoulson_> i noticed this morning that the new kernel fixes a huge lag i was also seeing when adjusting the brightnes
<chrisccoulson_> s
<chrisccoulson_> unless that's just my imagination ;)
<pitti> chrisccoulson_: if xrandr --verbose contains a "BACKLIGHT", then we are using xrandr calls for the brightness keys, yes
<pitti> the old gnome-power-manager had a fallback to poke the values into the ACPI files in /proc/, but I guess that's gone these days
<pitti> we now rely on the XBACKLIGHT extension, which I believe goes through XRandR
<pitti> (I have no idea where this ends up at the kernel level, though)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - oh, no BACKLIGHT on my machine here :/
<jjardon> pitti: well, gsd is a core part of GNOME, I really do not think that you can run a Unity session without it. Also, I'd have to duplicate a lot of code that Its already in gsd, so I chooosed to use gsd directly
<pitti> jjardon: I mean for XFCE and the like
<pitti> jjardon: I was just wondering if g-s-d's power module provides any functionality which upower doesn't, or whether it just offers a more convenient API
<jjardon> pitti: XFCE has is own power indicator
<pitti> because if g-s-d is adding functionality, I'd rather move that down to upower
<jasoncwarner_> seb128 and didrocks, can I reschedule our talks tonight? have a conflicting music lens discussion at the same time...
<didrocks> jasoncwarner_: sure
<seb128> jasoncwarner_, "no" ;-)
<jjardon> pitti: gsd uses upower to get all the info about power devices. It parses it and you get all the info with a dbus call. So, yes, It's a much more convenience api and you save a lot of code
<pitti> jjardon: fun, I thought it would be a lot more convenient to use e. g. up_client_get_devices() and teh libupower-glib API than fiddling with dbus calls yourself
<pitti> jjardon: so if libupower-glib sohuld have an API that you would like to have and is missing, I'm still interested in hearing about it; we can just add it
<jasoncwarner_> hmmm...is mumble not working for anyone else right now? setting up on my recent reinstall and it hangs configuring it...have to force quit it...
<pitti> jasoncwarner_: WFM
<seb128> jasoncwarner_, works here
<mvo> kamstrup: proof of concept lp:~mvo/software-center/review-stats-as-dbm-for-unity-with-best-regards
<pitti> jjardon: we just noticed that we can't use indicator-power in ubiquity-dm for that reason (see my last comment on bug 854717)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 854717 in ubiquity "Broken panel icons and dialog style during ubiquity-dm and OEM install/final user configuration" [Critical,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/854717
<jjardon> pitti: sure. have to go now, I'll follow the discussion later ;)
<mvo> kamstrup: exports (iii) ratings_average, ratings_total, dampended_rating, the last one is what you want to use as the key, its calculated using a wilson score on the ratings spread
<mvo> kamstrup: well, I guess not necssarily, depends on your UI needs, but that is what we use
<mvo> kamstrup: I guess it would be nice to export it to a tool for you too so that you can trigger updates on the stats yourself instead of relying on s-c doing it
<kamstrup> mvo: I don't think generally the dash should cause changes to local data
<kamstrup> mvo: it's for lookups and access
<mvo> 'k
<kamstrup> mvo: usage logging hapens indirectly via zeitgeist then
<mvo> kamstrup: if you need the review spread (10 x 1 star, 4 x 2 stars) etc, just let me know, that can be added as well
<kamstrup> mvo: ok - not for O definitely
<mvo> kamstrup: and we might need a bugreport if that should make it into the archive for reference for the release team, uploads are hand-approved currently
<kamstrup> mvo: ok...
<kamstrup> mvo: what format do you want to use for the payload?
<kamstrup> mvo: A GVariant "(iii)" would be extraordinarily handy for me :-)
<kamstrup> dunno how easy they are to serialize in Python though... lemme see
<mvo> kamstrup: I already use python struct
<mvo> kamstrup: so you should be able to just use something like struct { int , int, int } in your c(++) code
<kamstrup> mvo: oh? you sure?
<mvo> kamstrup: well, that is what the python struct module is all about, I haven't written a test C client for this yet, but it should just work(tm)
<mvo> kamstrup: let me quickly verify this
<davidcalle> pitti, or someone else, when is the new pygobject supposed to enter the archives?
<pitti> davidcalle: 3.0.0? after b2
<davidcalle> pitti, thanks, I'm worried about it. Looks like it makes python lenses segfault.
<seb128> seems like a bug for kamstrup ;-)
<pitti> davidcalle: that's why I didn't push it into b2 yet; I tested it with apport, jockey, software-center etc., but not with everything yet; I did notice a regression in gtimelog, but I got that fixed now
<pitti> davidcalle: you can test it from the PPA, maybe you can get a stack trace and file a bug?
<davidcalle> pitti, I'm on the PPA. I will file a bug, thanks.
<kamstrup> davidcalle: you have the ppa url, I can debug the crasher
<pitti> kamstrup: add-apt-repository ppa:ubuntu-desktop/ppa
<kamstrup> pitti: thanks
<pitti> kamstrup: you'll also get a faster startup from that, for bonus :)
<pitti> jasoncwarner_: want to skip our 1-on-1, too?
<davidcalle> kamstrup, thanks :) Was learning how to get stack traces.
 * didrocks reboots
<jasoncwarner_> pitti: I'm good for a bit if you have a couple of minutes...want to catch up on a couple quick things...
<jasoncwarner_> i got mumble working as well (took a reboot)
<didrocks> waow, that wasâ¦ weird
<didrocks> libnss3 package installed, but no /usr/lib/i386-linux-gnu/libnss3.so
<didrocks> network-manager and nm-applet didn't appreciate :)
<geser> didrocks: see topic in #ubuntu-devel
<didrocks> geser: argh, okâ¦ thanks for the pointer
<mpt> pitti, hi. If an application wants to discourage you from logging out or shutting down while it finishes a task (e.g. burning a CD, defragmenting a disk, installing a package), what's the appropriate way to do that? Is it a ConsoleKit API? (I tried reading the CK docs but didn't understand them)
<chrisccoulson> mpt - gnome-session
<chrisccoulson> that has an inhibit API
<chrisccoulson> (for logging out, anyway)
<mpt> chrisccoulson, ah, <http://live.gnome.org/SessionManagement/GnomeSession#A8._QueryEndSession>?
<seb128> didrocks, mhr
<chrisccoulson> for shutting down, i'm not sure if there is an inhibit API
<seb128> didrocks, mhr3 and cyphermox got that bug as well this week
<seb128> didrocks, cyphermox tried to figure why the file had been cleaned, not sure they figured it though
<didrocks> yeah, seems ca-certificates being a little bit more too drastic in his pick :)
<kamstrup> davidcalle: don't stop then :-)
<didrocks> seb128: what geser told, topic of #ubuntu-devel
<seb128> ok
<kamstrup> davidcalle: did you have a bug report?
<didrocks> ca-certificates eats system libraries, DO NOT UPDATE (bug #855171)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 855171 in nss "libnss3.so went missing after upgrade" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/855171
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> I got lucky it didn't eat mine
<didrocks> indeed, well, I just lost 3 minutesâ¦
<didrocks> fortunatly, I had it still in cache and --reinstall worked
<davidcalle> kamstrup, I'm filing one in a few minutes.
<didrocks> otherwise, I would have to hunt for an usb key, and that would have took more time :)
<mpt> thanks chrisccoulson
<seb128> stupid tb, stop marking the selected message as read when entering a mailbox! ;-)
<davidcalle> kamstrup, https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/855402
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 855402 in unity "Python lenses segfault with pygobject3" [Undecided,New]
<kamstrup> davidcalle: tanks
<kamstrup> thanks
<didrocks> seb128: +1
<rodrigo_> chrisccoulson, your g-s-d package is indeed much quicker
<rodrigo_> chrisccoulson, I was looking though at making those patches upstreamable, and I think it would be better, for the share-the-gnome-rr-screen one, to have some code in gnome-settings-daemon/gnome-settings-daemon/gnome-settings-screen.[ch] or something
<chrisccoulson> rodrigo_, yeah, i planned to do it that way at some point
<rodrigo_> that just returns a shared instance of GnomeRRScreen, instead of using the property on the GdkScreen
<rodrigo_> chrisccoulson, ok, cool
<chrisccoulson> yeah, that would probably be better actually
<rodrigo_> chrisccoulson, I can do it if you want
<chrisccoulson> rodrigo_, sure, feel free :)
<chrisccoulson> i'll push the current branch to bzr in a moment
<rodrigo_> about the media keys one, not 100% sure, so better to file a bug for hadess to review it
<chrisccoulson> rodrigo_, did you see my notes on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/11.10/BootSpeedAnalysis ?
<rodrigo_> chrisccoulson, no, looking
<rodrigo_> chrisccoulson, yes, we can have the patches as they are for oneiric, I'll prepare the patch for git master
<chrisccoulson> thanks :)
<tjaalton> chrisccoulson: firefox sometimes opens tabs on a wrong window here, as if the focus is not on the window where I want it to be. known issue or not?
<chrisccoulson> tjaalton, no, i've not seen that before. is this using compiz?
<chrisccoulson> actually, i'm not sure if that would matter
<tjaalton> chrisccoulson: yes, and happens only with fullscreen windows, it seems
<chrisccoulson> how are you opening the new tab?
<tjaalton> ctrl-t
<chrisccoulson> that should open in the window that gets the event :/
<tjaalton> well, all the kbd shortcuts end up in the wrong window, so ctrl-w might close tabs behind my back :)
<chrisccoulson> i've seen focus issues with compiz like this ;)
<chrisccoulson> eg, bug 838625
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: speaking of which, did you upgrade using the ppa?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 838625 in compiz "Unpredictable focusing after switching viewports with the keyboard" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/838625
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, yeah. i didn't see any issues afterwards
<didrocks> great :-)
<tjaalton> chrisccoulson: oh, if it's related to the stacking bug then I'll just wait for the updates
<didrocks> tjaalton: you can try the ubuntu-desktop ppa
<tjaalton> happens with fullscreen windows that are on separate viewports, one on top of the other
<tjaalton> didrocks: ppa:ubuntu-desktop?
<didrocks> tjaalton: ppa:ubuntu-desktop/ppa indeed :)
<tjaalton> didrocks: thanks, adding
<didrocks> tjaalton: keep us in touch :)
<chrisccoulson> i should try the 3d session again to see if the stacking fixes fix the focus issues i was seeing too
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: oh, you didn't try it? wasn't the purpose of installing the ppa :-)
<tjaalton> it's possible to fix the focus by going to another viewport with a non-fullscreen ffox window
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, yeah, i didn't notice any stacking issues (like, mouse clicks going to the wrong windows and the dash appearing underneath everything else)
<chrisccoulson> but i didn't use it for long enough to see if there were other focus issues. i wasn't sure if that was all related to the stacking bugs
<chrisccoulson> rodrigo_, i've pushed the gsd changes to bzr btw
<chrisccoulson> remember also that there is a gnome-desktop change
<rodrigo_> chrisccoulson, ok
<rodrigo_> chrisccoulson, for the gnome-desktop change, I'll let you do the upstreaming :)
<chrisccoulson> rodrigo_, sure, no problem
<seb128> didrocks, can we drop your gwibber upload to the desktop ppa? it's the same version than oneiric and 2 weeks old
<seb128> bah, tb
<seb128> "Thunderbird is already running, but is not responding. To open a new window, you must first close the existing Thunderbird process, or restart your system."
<didrocks> seb128: yes
<seb128> didrocks, thanks
<didrocks> yw
<chrisccoulson> rodrigo_, gnome bug 659689
<ubot2> Gnome bug 659689 in libgnome-desktop "gnome_rr_config_apply_from_filename_with_time does an unnecessary XRR roundtrip if the config file doesn't exist" [Normal,Unconfirmed] http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=659689
<rodrigo_> chrisccoulson, ok thanks
<jjardon> pitti: after some research, I think the best solution here is wait until the gsd dbus service is ready and then use it from indicator-power, so we do not have conflicts. Working on a patch
<pitti> jjardon: i. e. not activate it yourself?
<pitti> jjardon: we have an alternative proposal for ubiquity to start g-s-d earlier, wait for it to appear on the bus, and then start its panel
<pitti> but of course the two don't exclude each other :)
<jjardon> pitti: yeah. Use g_bus_watch_name() to start to use the service when It appears
<chrisccoulson> gutted - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-somerset-14998964
<chrisccoulson> just think of all that wasted cheese
<seb128> hum, cheese! ;-)
<seb128> well, uk cheese, it's probably not real cheese ;-)
<didrocks> indeed, it's not cheese
<didrocks> I tried that in Ireland, "white sheddar" looks like "gruyÃ¨re"
<didrocks> not at all the same on pasta :p
<chrisccoulson> heh
<seb128> chrisccoulson, will we get a stable tb before oneiric?
<seb128> it's weird to be greeted by a "welcome to thunderbird beta" ;-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yes ;)
<seb128> great ;-)
<jjardon> pitti: just committed this patch. Maybe you can verify that It solves the problem for you? http://paste.ubuntu.com/694409/
<pitti> jjardon: you can link that to bug 854717, BTW
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 854717 in ubiquity "Broken panel icons and dialog style during ubiquity-dm and OEM install/final user configuration" [Critical,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/854717
<pitti> jjardon: nice!
<pitti> jjardon: once it's built, I can try that with an older ubiquity version, that'll double-check
<jjardon> pitti: great :). Just added a comment to the bug pointing to the commit
<rodrigo_> lunch, bbl
<pitti> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily-live/20110921.1/ up for testing
<seb128> pitti, great
<pitti> seb128, didrocks: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/OneiricOcelot/TechnicalOverview#Ubuntu_Desktop seems current to me; can you think of anything which we introduced after b1 which ought to be described?
<pitti> didrocks: oh, oneconf perhaps?
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, as syncing is now on, I can put a sentence about it
<seb128> pitti, nothing I can think offhand but I will tell you if I figure one
<didrocks> nothing for unity
 * pitti will review our meeting pages
<pitti> didrocks: I'll add CJK support for the dash search
<pitti> hm, we really need to fix versions.py to take the unapproved queue into account
<seb128> pitti, i've updated the etherpad for the todo list, but yes
<seb128> looking into it
<pitti> seb128: ooh, new g-i? /me grabs
<seb128> it should check the queue but maybe it's only the new one, not "unapproved"
<didrocks> pitti: indeed, adding
<seb128> for upload in distro_series.getPackageUploads(status='Unapproved'):
<seb128> no, it checks for Unapproved, weird
<pitti> doing glib-network as well
<seb128> pitti, danke
 * didrocks doesn't like people getting a traceback, and then uploading it only after dist-upgradingâ¦
<seb128> didrocks, you hate users, just say it! ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: you teached me so! :p
 * didrocks looks if apt has the info of when the package was installed
<didrocks> maybe apport can check the timestamp in /var/crash and when the package was installed
<seb128> didrocks, what do you try to prevent? apport should not let you report bugs where the versions listed are outdated
<pitti> didrocks: yes, that's been on my TODO list for quite long, I  hope I can do that in perky penguin
<didrocks> seb128: basically, someone got a crash, then apt-get upgrade, then run apport to report the bug
<seb128> retracing will fail for those usually, but yeah it creates noise
<didrocks> seb128: apport will tell "I have the latest and greatest" and upload :)
<didrocks> seb128: not on python!
<didrocks> pitti: that would be excellent ;)
<seb128> the ones I would really like to block is those happening at session closing and showing at next login ;-)
<pitti> didrocks: this can be done cheaply with comparing the time stamp of the executable file at crash and at GUI time
<didrocks> seb128: indeed
<pitti> seb128: bug 460932, but need to sit down for a while to see how we can prevent it
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 460932 in apport "Do not catch crashes which happen at logout" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/460932
<didrocks> pitti: hum? yeah, that's a cheap and nice idea :)
<pitti> didrocks: faster than md5sum'ing etc.
<didrocks> pitti: let me put that on my TODO
<pitti> didrocks: bug 132904
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 132904 in apport "Ignore crashes for running programs whose package got updated underneath" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/132904
<pitti> didrocks: I'll assign it to me and tag it pet-bug
<pitti> didrocks: one of my goals for next cycle is to fix pet-bugs again :)
<didrocks> pitti: oh, a really recent bug :)
<didrocks> pitti: great! :-)
<seb128> pitti, one way would be to not spawn dialogs for things not from the current boot
<seb128> i.e anything older than dmesg stamps
<pitti> hah, it is already
<mdeslaur> bug 853951 is _really_ beginning to irk me
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 853951 in unity "Workspace switcher makes windows lose decorations" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/853951
<seb128> smspillaz, ^
<seb128> mdeslaur, never got this one
<pitti> seb128: hmm, that's worth thinking through indeed
<didrocks> mdeslaur: urgh? doesn't happen here.
<smspillaz> mdeslaur: didrocks it's a known issue, I'm going to work on it when I get a chance
<mdeslaur> didrocks, smspillaz, seb128: thanks
<seb128> I wonder what the "test drive" button in usb-creator does
<didrocks> mdeslaur: smspillaz: targetting it then
<seb128> it's on the dialog after the iso recording
<pitti> didrocks: thanks for the wiki update; I did some cleanups, and signing off now
<didrocks> pitti: great, thanks :)
<chrisccoulson> i've just been trying to debug another issue with the volume notifications, and this time i don't think it is the fault of g-s-d
<chrisccoulson> according to pulseaudio indicator-sound-service responds to each volume change by setting the volume again
<chrisccoulson> and it ends up cancelling the mute when g-s-d initially sets it
<mdeslaur> chrisccoulson: lol
<chrisccoulson> ie, g-s-d sets muted and displays it on screen, but indicator-sound-service immediately unmutes it again
<chrisccoulson> so the next time you press the volume down media-key, you get the same "muted" icon without the throbbing effect
<chrisccoulson> time to report an indicator-sound bug ;)
<chrisccoulson> that's been bugging me for weeks now
<seb128> vuntz, can you review a gnome-desktop patch from chrisccoulson?
 * pitti grabs gtk+3.0
<chrisccoulson> nice, i'm glad i narrowed down bug 855557, that's been annoying me for ages :)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 855557 in indicator-sound "indicator-sound-service interferes with gnome-settings-daemon" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/855557
<seb128> chrisccoulson, bounce it to dx, or ted, ronoc is on leave
<seb128> hum, ok who understand launchpadlib?
<seb128> ubuntu_series = launchpad.distributions['ubuntu'].getSeries(name_or_version='oneiric')
<seb128> print ubuntu_series.getPackageUploads()
<seb128> that gives me
<seb128> <lazr.restfulclient.resource.Collection object at 0x929fb4c>
<seb128> what I can do from it?
<seb128> version tries to iterate through it with a "for upload in ubuntu_series.getPackageUploads():"
<seb128> but that seems to not work
<pitti> iteration usually works
<pitti> what doesn't here?
<seb128> ubuntu_series = launchpad.distributions['ubuntu'].getSeries(name_or_version='oneiric')
<seb128> for upload in ubuntu_series.getPackageUploads():
<seb128>     print "unapproved:", upload
<seb128>  
<seb128> -> empty output
<seb128> pitti, ^
<seb128> it seems to hang
<pitti> seb128: erm, just getPackageUploads()?
<pitti> isn't that going to give you a bazillion results?
<seb128> getPackageUploads(status='Unapproved')
<seb128> pitti, ubuntu_series.getPackageUploads(status='Unapproved'):
<seb128> rather
<seb128> when I dropped the status to see if that was the issue
<pitti> >>> up.total_size
<pitti> 30
<pitti> that seems fine
<pitti> and iteration works here
<seb128> ok
<seb128> ubuntu_series = launchpad.distributions['ubuntu'].getSeries(name_or_version='oneiric')
<seb128> for upload in ubuntu_series.getPackageUploads(status='Unapproved'):
<seb128>     print "unapproved:", upload
<seb128> -> empty
<seb128> for me
<seb128> like it returns without printing anything
<pitti> >>> for u in up:
<pitti> ...     print u.display_name
<pitti> ...
<pitti> pygobject
<pitti> gobject-introspection
<pitti> eucalyptus
<pitti> [...]
<pitti> and just printing u gives me "https://api.launchpad.net/1.0/ubuntu/oneiric/+upload/3198332" [...]
<seb128> mueuh
<pitti> ooh
<seb128> pitti, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/694454/
<seb128> is what I'm trying to run
<pitti> seb128: it seems it doesn't work with login_anonymously()
<pitti> WTH
<pitti> darn, seems we need to login authenticated again
<seb128> why?!
<pitti> i. e. login_with(), and supply a cookie the first time
<pitti> I don't know
<seb128> I don't want to start having to maintain a cookie for version
<seb128> I guess I should ask on #launchpad, seems a bug
<seb128> pitti, well in any case that's why the versions queue use is broken
<pitti> ah, ok
<seb128> since that's what it does to list items in the queue
<pitti> seb128: we could just leave the cookie on ~/.launchpadlib/ on people, and give it a readonly priv?
<seb128> pitti, wfm
<seb128> but we need an account to use?
<seb128> or do you want to use the retracer one?
<pitti> I'm happy for it to use my creds, as long as it's readonly and public
<seb128> pitti, want to set it up?
<pitti> seb128: sure
<seb128> thanks!
<pitti> seb128: done, next cron job should get it
<pitti> in 15 ins
<seb128> pitti, danke! ;-)
<cyphermox> seb128: would I need an FFE for the libnm-gtk split (what is needed for g-c-c) ?
<seb128> pitti, ^
<cyphermox> I'm about to write one for NM 0.9.1.90 too.
<pitti> cyphermox: they split a source pakcage?
<cyphermox> yeah
<pitti> seems fine
<pitti> cyphermox: any difference in the binary packages?
<cyphermox> wait no
<cyphermox> they split the binary package
<pitti> i. e. source only split, or does it create new library packages?
<cyphermox> new library
<seb128> is there an easier way to specify configure option to dh rules than using "override_dh_auto_configure:"?
<pitti> that'll mean a transition with potentially many rebuilds, so we should have an FFE
<seb128> i.e should I
<pitti> seb128: I don't think there is
<seb128> override_dh_auto_configure:
<seb128> 	dh_auto_configure --disable-icon-update
<cyphermox> pitti: nothing was using any of it before :)
<seb128> 	dh_auto_configure --  --disable...
<seb128> rather
<seb128> pitti, ok, thanks
<cyphermox> pitti: it's been split to make wifi/mobile dialogs available to other apps instead of relying on nm-applet
<pitti> cyphermox: seems fine
<cyphermox> pitti: my ffe for NM is https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/network-manager/+bug/855592
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 855592 in network-manager "FFE: NetworkManager 0.9.1.90" [Undecided,New]
<pitti> cyphermox: updated
<cyphermox> thanks
<pitti> seb128: http://people.canonical.com/~platform/desktop/versions.html> darn, no difference
<seb128> pitti, "Last updated: Wednesday September 21 2011 13:50:06 +0000"
<seb128> pitti, it was before your change
<pitti> oh, versions.py stopped running, weird
 * pitti runs in foreground, perhaps it crashed
<seb128> maybe it's waiting for lplib authentification?
<seb128> or something went wrong with the cookie
<pitti> no, I did that already, and checked
<seb128> there is a reason I prefer anonymous ;-)
<seb128> ok
<pitti> temporarily disabling cronjob (in case I forget)
<dobey> pitti: can we go back to the old, non-broken, python-gojbect? :)
<pitti> dobey: what is broken?
<pitti> seb128: running in foreground now; lp login etc. went fine
<dobey> pitti: requiring people to use introspection, when all the APIs they need to use are not introspected, and some of the APIs they need, don't have static bindings
<pitti> dobey: how was the latter any different?
<pitti> e. g. Soup didn't have static bindings, so you couldn't use it before either
<dobey> pitti: back when we could mix static bindings and gi bindings, we could actually have software that works reliably
<pitti> that actually never worked reliably
<dobey> pitti: right, but we could mix static/gi with old gobject
<pitti> it was a source of weird crsahes
<dobey> i'd rather have a million bugs depending on upstream getting their act together, than having them tell me i'm not allowed to write applications using APIs I need to use, because they haven't been bound in GI :-/
<dobey> and my particular points of pain right now are Unity and twisted
<dobey> not Soup
<pitti> dobey: you can still do it by importing all GI bits first, and then the static ones
<pitti> but you get to keep both halves when it breaks
<pitti> $ python -c 'import gobject; from gi.repository import Gtk'
<pitti> -> ImportError('When using gi.repository blabla')
<pitti> $ python -c 'from gi.repository import Gtk; import gobject'
<dobey> unfortunately not possible
<pitti> -> no complaint
<pitti> but even this simple one already breaks in glib
<pitti> (Warning: g_boxed_type_register_static:..)
<pitti> $ python -c 'from gi.repository import Soup; import twisted'
<pitti> dobey: ^ that particular combination might work?
<pitti> ah, twisted itself doesn't use gobject, that was just a particular submodule
<seb128> chrisccoulson, is ureadahead working for you? is it supposed to do something on a ssd? on my chart it doesn't stop any other loading and the bar has no io color, seems weird
<pitti> dobey: is there a particular library you need? building a gir is not exactly rocket science, so we can help upstream to build one
<dobey> pitti: from twisted.internet.glib2reactor import install
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, it seems to work ok here
<dobey> pitti: the problem isn't that the .gir/typelib is missing; the problem is that glib/gio/gobject stuff isn't totally bound yet
<seb128> chrisccoulson, hum ok, I'm testing on the 10v with an install I just did an hour ago
<chrisccoulson> seb128, actually, maybe not - https://launchpadlibrarian.net/80459240/farnsworth-oneiric-20110920-16.png
<chrisccoulson> that doesn't make a lot of sense ;)
<seb128> your changes in the ppa won 1s on the boot there
<chrisccoulson> nice :)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, is that a fresh install?
<dobey> pitti: or well, i'm trying to port the glib2/gtk2 reactor to gi/gtk3 APIs with gir, but alas, lack of upstream bindings
<seb128> chrisccoulson, well "fresh", rebooted 10 times with some minutes in session
<seb128> chrisccoulson, i.e it should have done the ureadahead caching
<chrisccoulson> there's still the case where it regresses if you've ever changed your monitor settings, which sucks
<chrisccoulson> (ie, it adds back another reprobe)
<chrisccoulson> which there isn't really any need for :)
<seb128> it's "down" to 26.8s on the 10v
<chrisccoulson> seb128, what was it in lucid?
<seb128> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/11.10/BootSpeedAnalysis
<seb128> 12s...
<chrisccoulson> still a way to go then ;)
<seb128> but it was 37s 1 week ago on oneiric
<seb128> so 10.2s in a week is already something ;-)
<chrisccoulson> :)
<seb128> it's not only us
<seb128> gnome-session used to start 6s into the boot, it starts at 9s now
<chrisccoulson> ah, so it's not all our fault then ;)
<seb128> I need to debug nautilus
<seb128> it was taking 3 seconds of cpu, it's taking like 10s now
<seb128> and I've moved all the .so out, so it's not the u1 integration or something else being stupid
<chrisccoulson> ouch, that's quite a bit
<seb128> the other offender is compiz,unity
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i think those are a lost cause for oneiric ;)
<seb128> also we use to run the wm directly
<seb128> not delay it to after g-s-d
<seb128> i.e on http://people.canonical.com/~pitti/bootcharts/daniel-lucid-20100305-1.png
<seb128> lot of small things taking 1s as well
<seb128> the helper to detect if we should run 3d or not
<pitti> seb128: hm, who knows -- http://people.canonical.com/~platform/desktop/versions.html worked now
<pitti> heisenbug
<seb128> zg taking over a second cpu
<seb128> pitti, looks better ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: the helper souldn't take any time now, (at least, you should pay the price before gnome-session is there)
<seb128> didrocks, it's autologin
<didrocks> seb128: even with autologin
<pitti> seb128: indeed, much more useful again \o/
<didrocks> seb128: it's run *before* gnome-session
<seb128> didrocks, so it's buggy, it takes 2s of blue bar
<chrisccoulson> so, we'll all be discussing boot speed at UDS then ? :)
<seb128> didrocks, not on my charts
<pitti> seb128: ah, it marks the unapproved ones with a little "Q"
<seb128> pitti, right
<didrocks> seb128: can you upload your chart?
<seb128> didrocks, yeah, I'm copying them over
<didrocks> if you are on autologin
<didrocks> you should see it running twice
<didrocks> one before gnome-session, paying the price
<didrocks> and a short time after gnome-session (just checking a file)
<didrocks> seb128: ls /tmp/unity_support_test*
<pitti> didrocks: oh, I was going to ask you about this -- what creates /tmp/unity_support_test.0 ?
<pitti> didrocks: it's a predictable file name, so whatever creates it must be *very* careful to not make this a symlink attack vector
<didrocks> pitti: unity_support_test creates it :)
<didrocks> (/usr/lib/nux/unity_support_test)
<didrocks> pitti: hum, it runs under the user or lightdm name, indeed
<pitti> didrocks: does it need to be in /tmp/ ?
<didrocks> pitti: it needs to be somewhere where it's removed at startup
<seb128> didrocks, doh, ok, my fault
<didrocks> pitti: basically, that's the speed improvment I made last week i discussed on the team report
<seb128> didrocks, there is a gnome-fallback... on the chart, I though it was the fallback 3d session upstream thing
<didrocks> pitti: when unity-greeter is running, the support tool test is ran and drop that file depending on the result
<seb128> but it seems it's gnome-fallback-mount-helper from g-s-d
<didrocks> seb128: ahah! :-)
<seb128> didrocks, pitti, chrisccoulson: http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/oneiric-Inspiron-1011-oneiric-20110921-6.png
<didrocks> pitti: then the scripts in /etc/X11/Xsession.d/ before logging try to pick it
<seb128> 10v beta2 chart with the desktop team ppa
<pitti> seb128: oh, wow, on mine it was 2 s faster even without the PPA: http://people.canonical.com/~pitti/bootcharts/daniel-oneiric-20110914-disable-indicator-session.png
<pitti> seb128: however, the desktop PPA should make little difference
<seb128> why does it call modprobre and blkid in serie?
<pitti> as both CPUs are fully used all the time, the extra wait time doesn't matter
<seb128> pitti, it makes a ~1s difference there
<pitti> nice
<didrocks> pitti: I'm happy with any better solution, basically, the test tool should be able to cache its result and we need to have a fast check even if we restart it upon reboot
<pitti> didrocks: so it can't go into ~, and it needs to be predictable
<didrocks> pitti: knowing that it can be run from multiple users on the machcine (and even lightdm)
<pitti> didrocks: and needs cleaning up on boot?
<didrocks> pitti: indeed, if you install a new driver or whatever
<pitti> didrocks: then the only locations are /tmp/ and /run/lock/, both of which are world-writeable
<didrocks> I picked /tmp for that reason
<pitti> didrocks: so we indeed need to be careful; I'll have a look at the code, I guess it's in lp:unity?
<didrocks> pitti: no, it's lp:nux
<didrocks> pitti: my code is pretty silly, but yeah, I will leave a second look :)
<pitti> didrocks: I can just run that tool without harm, right?
<pitti> didrocks: what's .0, the $DISPLAY?
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, it won't hurt you, I promess!
<didrocks> pitti: no, it's the result (0 for ok, 1 for ko)
<pitti> ah
<pitti> right, it's not user specific
<chrisccoulson> nice - http://chevrel.org/temp/Capture-trailer_400p.png :)
<didrocks> pitti: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~unity-team/nux/trunk/view/head:/tools/unity_support_test.c
<pitti> didrocks: dang, it's vulnerable
<pitti> $ ln -s pwned /tmp/unity_support_test.0
<pitti> $ /usr/lib/nux/unity_support_test
<pitti> $ ls /tmp/pwned
<pitti> /tmp/pwned
<pitti> didrocks: I'll create a branch
<didrocks> pitti: thanks, can push it in next nux release
<didrocks> pitti: I just fopen(resultfilename, "w+") and then fclose it
<pitti> didrocks: right, you need to use the Unix open() with O_CREAT|O_EXCL
<pitti> the latter is the important bit here, to atomically guard against symlink attacks
<didrocks> pitti: ok, not really good at security on this, will look at some documentation with your branch :)
<didrocks> ok, basically, the idea is to fail is the file is already there?
<pitti> didrocks: yes
<pitti> didrocks: the attach scenario is that you can overwrite/kill any file which is owned by the user who calls support_test
<seb128> didrocks, how busy are you? feel free to grab some GNOME updates this week when you have a slot ;-) (hint, gnome-session for example) ;-)
<pitti> i. e. lightdm or you
<pitti> didrocks: you can e. g. point it to your keyring, or the lightdm configuration, etc.
<pitti> didrocks: I'll create a branch/MP
<didrocks> pitti: oh ok, so some kind of "nullify" attack
<didrocks> pitti: but to detect if the file exists, I just test resultfile = fopen("/tmp/unity_support_test.0", "r"); (and fclose it if it's there, nothing to read and such). This has no security implication, isn't it?
<didrocks> seb128: will do
<seb128> didrocks, thanks
<didrocks> seb128: still some compiz churn, but will be ok afterwards, I hope
<seb128> didrocks, no hurry, I doubt we will unfreeze before friday morning
<seb128> didrocks, but feel free to claim on the pad for later ;-)
<didrocks> yeah, I'm afraid of that too, I'll try have some iso testing as well tomorrow morning
<mdeslaur> didrocks, pitti: is there a possibility of someone malicious creating the file and breaking the GUI on a multiuser system?
<didrocks> mdeslaur: well, define "breaking"
<mdeslaur> didrocks: ie: saying the hardware supports 3d, when in fact it doesn't, so desktop sessions don't come up?
<didrocks> mdeslaur: the support test tool will say "go ahead", then unity needs to fallback if it can't load, which is a whishlist bug opened
<didrocks> seb128: I'm maybe blind but I don't see the unity_support_tool being run on your bootchart?
<seb128> <seb128> didrocks, doh, ok, my fault
<seb128> <seb128> didrocks, there is a gnome-fallback... on the chart, I though it was the fallback 3d session upstream thing
<seb128> <seb128> but it seems it's gnome-fallback-mount-helper from g-s-d
<seb128> didrocks, ^
<didrocks> seb128: yeah saw that, but still, we should it running
<mdeslaur> the file should be in a non-user writable location, and maybe the timestamp could be checked to see if it's stale or something
<seb128> oh
<seb128> didrocks, well in the session it's normal, if it just checks a file it's too short to register on the chart
<didrocks> mdeslaur: the file is created by the tool runned by the user though
<didrocks> seb128: but that means that the initial check is fast as well?
<mdeslaur> didrocks: I thought you said the tool is run by unity-greeter?
<didrocks> mdeslaur: ok, so the tool *can* be run by the unity-greeter
<didrocks> mdeslaur: there are two cases:
<didrocks> - no autologin and unity-greeter -> the tool is run there, while the user is typing his password, the detection is done and cache the info in /tmp
<seb128> didrocks, I don't really know, need to check, it seems weird indeed
<didrocks> then, Xsession.d (under the new user) check if the file is there, and run the session
<seb128> didrocks, it shows on my laptop manual login chart: http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/seb-e6410-oneiric-20110920-9.png
<didrocks> mdeslaur: if the user is using something else or autologin, the Xsession.d won't find the file and will run the tool then
<didrocks> seb128: hum, interesting
<seb128> didrocks, it's running, the proc_ps.log has it
<seb128> didrocks, it's like it was exiting immediatly
<seb128> didrocks, maybe lightdm close and destroy the process directly in autologin
<seb128> didrocks, I think lightdm does clean behind him
<mdeslaur> didrocks: ok...hrm...
<seb128> didrocks, lightdm is too light, the helper doesn't have time to run ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: hum, try logging in slower please :)
<didrocks> seb128: oh, what you can do
<seb128> didrocks, it's *auto*login :p
<didrocks> seb128: reboot, start unity-greeter
<didrocks> ah, you mean, in the autologin case, not the bootchart :)
<seb128> right
<didrocks> so, in the autologin case, lightdm doesn't start it
<seb128> didrocks, it does
<seb128> it shows with one tick in the bootchart log
<didrocks> seb128: unity-greeter is run?
<seb128> no
<seb128> it's autologin
<didrocks> so, it's not lightdm
<seb128> no greeter
<didrocks> well, it's lighdm in same way
<didrocks> but not *the* lightdm :)
<didrocks> it's run by /etc/X11/Xsession.d/50_check_unity_support
<didrocks> so, it should do the full check and drop the file
<seb128> well it drops the file
<seb128> didrocks, it seems fast, it takes 0.1s (user time) (0.04s system time) to run on a session after flush caches
<seb128> ie echo 3 >  /proc/sys/vm/drop_caches
<seb128> didrocks, so maybe it's fast enough to not be picked by the bootchart, the graphic filter out "noise"
<pitti> open("/tmp/unity_support_test.0", O_WRONLY|O_CREAT|O_EXCL, 0666) = -1 EEXIST (File exists)
<pitti> yep
<didrocks> seb128: weird that it's slower when the greeter is there though
<seb128> didrocks, it's not the same box, the greeter login is my laptop not the 10v
<seb128> could be that the intel probing is faster on the 10v
<seb128> quite some people have slow probing issue on modern intel hardware it seems
<didrocks> seb128: ok, so it seems that the cache (for your laptop) is still useful as winning 0.5s maybe?
<seb128> didrocks, right
<rodrigo_> desrt, when binding a GSettings key to a GtkAdjustment value that changes quick, is gsettings clever enough to just not write for every change?
<pitti> didrocks, mdeslaur: https://code.launchpad.net/~pitti/nux/symlink-attack-fix/+merge/76434
<mdeslaur> pitti: looks ok, thanks
<pitti> so, good night everyone!
<didrocks> +1 as well then :)
<rodrigo_> bye pitti
<mdeslaur> pitti: good night!
<didrocks> pitti: merging, thanks a lot! good night
<seb128> Laney, rodrigo_: do you hand with tomboy upstream on IRC or something? could you ask if they have any plan to fix https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=657180 for 1.8?
<ubot2> Gnome bug 657180 in General "tomboy blocks shutdown" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<desrt> rodrigo_: no.  it's not.
<rodrigo_> seb128, I am on #tomboy all day yes, but don't participate much
<desrt> rodrigo_: it's a difficult problem to solve
<rodrigo_> but yes, sure, asking now
<seb128> rodrigo_, thanks
<rodrigo_> desrt, right, I'm seeing evolution has a gconf-bridge object that does the binding thing that gsettings does
<rodrigo_> desrt, they use a timeout, which not sure it's the best way
<desrt> rodrigo_: a good approach may be to introduce a flag at the binding API layer
<desrt> RATE_LIMIT or so
<rodrigo_> yeah, like _DELAYED?
<rodrigo_> right
<desrt> or maybe apply the rate limiting by default
<desrt> and have a flag to turn it off
<desrt> it seems like a problem that's unique to property bindings
<desrt> and solving the problem at lower layers is substantially more complicated
<desrt> rodrigo_: i welcome a bug
<rodrigo_> desrt, I'll file one, yes
<rodrigo_> desrt, https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=659738
<ubot2> Gnome bug 659738 in gsettings "Need a way to tell GSettings to delay writes for rapidly changing properties" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<rodrigo_> desrt, to be honest, I haven't seen any bug coming from that, so maybe it's not an issue as it was with GConf?
<desrt> rodrigo_: it's a performance hit
<rodrigo_> ok
<desrt> particularly on ext4 with spinning disks
<desrt> fsync() take a decade there
<desrt> and dconf does fsync() on each write
<desrt> (because it has to)
<desrt> so 100 changes -> 100 fsync() round trips.  each takes like 40ms
<desrt> even though it's async, your disk ends up active for a few seconds after you stop
<desrt> that's bad
<rodrigo_> yeah
<seb128> tedg, hey
<seb128> tedg, can you make sure bug #854292 and bug #855557 are assigned and tracked for Oneiric?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 854292 in indicator-session "indicator-session disappear after running update-manager" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/854292
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 855557 in indicator-sound "indicator-sound-service interferes with gnome-settings-daemon" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/855557
<desrt> seb128: so the mime database stuff in glib...
<desrt> seb128: the latest version of the control center no longer uses this API, so it shouldn't be a problem (as i understand it)
<seb128> desrt, well as commented on the bug the user bug is still the same
<seb128> desrt, open the info capplet and see .local/share/applications/mimeinfo.list being created with random values
<seb128> desrt, halfline and alex confirmed it's behaving weird also for them on their fedora with 3.1.92 yesterday so it's not Debian,Ubuntu specific
<seb128> desrt, but the bug might be somewhere else...
<desrt> seb128: odd.
<desrt> seb128: i'll look again, in any case
<seb128> thanks
<desrt> since lxde and xfce are impacted as well
<seb128> well, even for GNOME is seems a not-so-nice bug
<seb128> open the control center and get gwibber to open photos, gedit to open calendars and another web browser than the one you used ;-)
<mvo> hm, is it just me or does anyone lese find it confusing that "Guest session" is written in the same text / color as ubuntu 11.10 and yet you can click on it but you can't click on ubuntu 11.10
<desrt> seb128: so i do as you say, and i get a file
<desrt> but the contents of the file are pretty reasonable
<desrt> jpegs open with eog, videos with totem, oggs with rhythmbox, etc.
<seb128> desrt, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/693740/
<seb128> that's the file I get
<seb128> desrt, well, it pick handlers for the said type, so if you have i.e only one email client, one web browser, etc you are likely to be ok
 * desrt sort of wonders why merely opening the panel and doing nothing at all is enough to cause a file to be generated
<seb128> yeah, that's a bug as well in my opinion, bastien seemed to disagree it's one though
<desrt> reminds me that i have a patch to commit to g-c-c
<seb128> same, I don't see why it creates "added associations"
<rodrigo_> out for a bit, bbl
<didrocks> have a good night everyone
<skaet> rodrigo_,  seb128 - what is the outlook on bug 832603?   Am stumbling into it on a fresh update.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 832603 in gnome-settings-daemon "gnome-settings-daemon crashed with SIGSEGV in g_simple_async_result_complete()" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/832603
 * skaet does fresh update from natty, and booting oneiric, this is first thing seen. 
<seb128> skaet, rodrigo seems to not be online, I don't personally know but I will check with him when he's there
<skaet> seb128, thank you.   Anything you think he might want gathered from the machine before I reboot?
<seb128> skaet, is g-s-d down, like no theme, etc or do you just get the apport prompt but things work normally?
<seb128> skaet, add your .xsession-errors to the bug if you can please
<seb128> skaet, oh and could you check the timestamp of the .crash and see if it correspond to the login?
<seb128> just to make sure it's not a segfault from the old version on logout before you restarted
<skaet> g-s-d down,  no theme.   Its fresh install update from clean installed and updated natty.   First boot triggered.
<seb128> ok, so please add the .xsession-errors that should be enough
<skaet> seb128,  will do.   Thanks
<seb128> re
<seb128> ok, that was "interesting"
<seb128> g-s-d was not applied any icon theme, theme, etc
<seb128> turn out that "don"t run unity-greeter --test-mode" with your user :p it will desactivate all the g-s-d plugins which are not actived on the greeter
<micahg> seb128: can you please have someone look at bug 845374
<seb128> micahg, will ping kenvandine tomorrow
<seb128> but it got only 3 duplicates in 2 weeks
<seb128> seems like a low priority bug, we get lot of bugs that get that in a day
<dobey> hrmm
<micahg> seb128: really?  maybe people aren't using gwibber then, feel free to lower priority
<dobey> when did GtkBox switch to not having children expanded by default with _add()?
<seb128> micahg, that bug says you don't need to use gwibber
<seb128> micahg, gwibber works fine there
<seb128> micahg, but anyway, I will get kenvandine to look at it
 * micahg must be subscribe to weird people with long links then...
<seb128> micahg, do you use ecryptfs?
<micahg> seb128: yes
<seb128> micahg, well maybe it's due ecryptfs filenames limitation
<seb128> users tend to not run ecryptfs ;-)
<micahg> seb128: orly, maybe I should have our ecryptfs guy take a look (tyhicks)
<seb128> well it's still a bug, but it wouldn't be the first thing to be hit by it
<seb128> evolution has issues due to it as well
<seb128> the limitation is due to some patents iirc, so not something ecryptfs will fix
<kirkland> seb128: that's not quite true
<kirkland> seb128: actually for 12.04, tyhicks and jjohansen are support to fix this
<seb128> ok, I should better not speak about what I don't know :p
<mdeslaur> the filename in the bug isn't long enough to be a ecryptfs issue
<kirkland> seb128: jjohansen had a functional, though non-perfect solution
<seb128> kirkland, sorry, I though somebody told me that a year ago
<kirkland> seb128: there was a slight concern about that, but we cleared it
<seb128> great to read ;-)
<seb128> mdeslaur, oh ok
<kirkland> seb128: :-)
<seb128> well as said, I will ask kenvandine to have a look when he's back tomorrow
<micahg> seb128: thanks
<seb128> it might just be a good old standard gwibber bug ;-)
<cyphermox> brb
<desrt> tedg: hey
<tedg> desrt, Howdy
<desrt> tedg: did you want to come to montreal?
<tedg> desrt, I have passed a request up the chain, but I haven't gotten a response.  Need to ping.
<desrt> tedg: i think olli mentioned that it might be useful for you to be there
<tedg> desrt, Yeah, and I had sent him justification.  But, I never got back a yes/no from him.  He's not online now.
<desrt> tedg: he asked me if i thought it would be worthwhile.  i said yes.... so here's hoping =)
<cyphermox> desrt: btw, thanks for the invite (got it from jason), I'll definitely be there
<jbicha> cyphermox: what do you think of the proposed fix for bug 852961 ?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 852961 in network-manager-applet "nm-applet is wrongly started with Gnome Shell" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/852961
<cyphermox> jbicha: what should it be set to?
<cyphermox> jbicha: hmm.. maybe that's not such a bad idea, I can start to fix one of mpt's bug reports with this
<cyphermox> bbl, dinner
<desrt> cyphermox: nice :)
<desrt> cyphermox: be sure to add yourself to the wiki!
<desrt> cyphermox: (and ask the others) https://live.gnome.org/Montreal2011/Participants
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-09-22
<cyphermox> desrt: I had
<cyphermox> jbicha: there?
<jbicha> cyphermox: howdy
<cyphermox> hey :)
<cyphermox> jbicha: so you tried the Autostart condition? what did you use for a condition?
<jbicha> I just used AutostartCondition=GNOME3 unless-session gnome in /etc/xdg/autostart/nm-applet.desktop
<cyphermox> ok... I'll need to look that up
<cyphermox> ah, I see mterry mentioned it in an email before to u-d
<cyphermox> amazing :D
 * cyphermox logs out to test
<cyphermox> jbicha: yup, seems to be covering all cases
<ben_> I've got a heck of a question.
<ben_> Is there currently a way to install gnome 3 on Lucid?
<RAOF> That's unlikely to be a particularly fruitful endevour.  Why do you want to?
<ben_> I just wanted to try it out.  Something different I guess.
<ben_> I tried gnome-shell and thought it was pretty cool so I wanted to see if I could install the whole environment
<RAOF> I'd try a livecd, I think.
<ben_> What distro is on the live cd?
<RAOF> Or, rather, a liveUSB, with persistence.
<jbicha> ben_: Ubuntu 11.10 is the first release to officially support GNOME 3 and it's a very easy install to get GNOME Shell there
<jbicha> there's a PPA for 11.04 that might work, but trying on Lucid is probably not worth the effort
<jbicha> it'll more or less break your Classic desktop since indicators don't work with gnome-panel 3 yet
<ben_> Which DE have you guys been working with on your setup?
<ben_> Oh I see.  It's opensuse
<pitti> Good morning
<TheMuso> Morning pitti.
<pitti> jbicha: oh, caribou got rejected, did you get an email why?
<jbicha> pitti: we rejected it because Debian made changes yesterday that they wanted included
<pitti> ah, ok
<jbicha> I updated my branch, but bigon has another bug he plans to look at today before we upload again
<pitti> jbicha: and then we'll just sync instead?
<pitti> jbicha: I made a small fix to the copyright file
<jbicha> pitti: no because it looks like caribou won't build with GNOME 3.0 so I don't think it'll be pushed to experimental soon
<jbicha> we fixed the copyright file too
<Kaleo> pitti: hi
<Kaleo> pitti: I am waiting for a freeze exception to be cleared before merging a patch in Unity 2D
<pitti> hey Kaleo, how are you?
<Kaleo> pitti: https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity-2d/+bug/654988
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 654988 in unity-2d "Unity doesn't mirror its interface for RTL locales." [Medium,In progress]
<Kaleo> pitti: very good, thanks
<Kaleo> pitti: I am afraid I might have missed a step in the process of the freeze exception
<Kaleo> pitti: basically I don't know where to look for an answer about it (acceptance or not)
<Kaleo> pitti: it's also really early in the morning so my brain is slow too :)
<pitti> Kaleo: hm, given how old this issue already is, it seems a bit risky to introduce that past beta-2? we are in rather deep freeze now
<pitti> Kaleo: there hasn't been any recent comment to this bug which would trigger RT attention
<Kaleo> pitti: I understand, I am confident that the patch won't introduce regressions for LTR languages
<pitti> it was opened in January or so
<Kaleo> pitti: yeah, I see
<pitti> Kaleo: right, I mean for RTL - it's quite a disruption there?
<Kaleo> pitti: yes, though I think a very welcome one
<Kaleo> pitti: code wise it's fairly minimal since we are using Qt/QML's infrastructure for it
<jbicha> Kaleo: if I understand right, this will mirror RTL on Unity 2d but not for Unity 3D, that might be enough reason to wait...
<Kaleo> jbicha: that's correct
<pitti> that', too
<Kaleo> jbicha: on the other hand we have other deltas such as a big a11y delta between 2D and 3D already
<Kaleo> jbicha: meaning that if we always have to wait for the other version before fixing one version it can get tricky
<Kaleo> jbicha: though in this case it is a fairly big difference visually for RTL
<Kaleo> do you think it's possible to merge it tentatively? that is, to merge it and give it a week in the distro and revert it if there are significant issues?
<Kaleo> (it has been tested over a couple of weeks by mardy and myself)
<pitti> Kaleo: I'd be more comfortable if this could be put into a PPA with a big call for testing, and some responses from RTL users
<jbicha> so I guess the question is whether it's enough of a bug for RTL users that they won't mind that Unity 3D works so differently
<pitti> and the consistency issue is a rather bad blocker for this as well
<Kaleo> pitti: can totally do a ppa
<pitti> Kaleo: perhaps you can add the feature, and turn it off by default, and document a way to enable it?
<Kaleo> pitti: hmmm that's a good idea
<pitti> Kaleo: then this could even land in the distro, and the call for testing would be easier
<Kaleo> pitti: that's the best idea!
<Kaleo> pitti: so it is off by default the way it's done
<pitti> and for people who want it they would at least have a way to use it
<pitti> and for P we then turn it on for both 2d and 3d?
<Kaleo> pitti: it is activated when a certain string is set in the translation
<pitti> oh, a single, e. g. Hebrew, string is enough to enable it?
<Kaleo> pitti: yes
<pitti> shouldn't it look at your locale rather?
<pitti> but well, maybe that's the right thing, I'm not sure
<Kaleo> pitti: I am no expert in the domain, maybe
<Kaleo> pitti: mardy may know better
<Kaleo> pitti: but in our case it's a good thing :)
<Kaleo> jbicha: do you think the idea is good?
<jbicha> Kaleo: shipping it disabled by default won't cause any problems and it's definitely something that should be fixed for P
<jbicha> is that RTL translation string thing standard for Qt?
<Kaleo> jbicha: i would need to check with mardy
<jbicha> Kaleo: ah, found the documentation, looks like you need to add a line for the translators to have something to translate
<jbicha> http://doc.qt.nokia.com/4.7-snapshot/qml-righttoleft.html#default-layout-direction
<Kaleo> jbicha: right thats what we do
<Kaleo> thanks a lot guys
<Kaleo> pitti: thank you
<pitti> nice
<jbicha> it looked like you just checked whether the value was set but didn't provide the string for translators to use
<jbicha> it's cool that RTL is built in to QML like that :)
<Kaleo> jbicha: thats correct; lets merge it and do a call for testing with instructions how to do that
<didrocks> good morning
<robert_ancell> RAOF, what sets the default X keyboard layout?
<RAOF> udev attributes
<robert_ancell> is it ubiquity?
<robert_ancell> RAOF, but udev can't possibly know the layout right
<pitti> console-setup and X.org set it from /etc/default/keybaord
<pitti> ubiquity/d-i write that file, yes
<RAOF> Ah, right.  You're after policy, not mechanism :)
<robert_ancell> RAOF, thanks
<rickspencer3> good morning didrocks, robert_ancell, pitti, RAOF
<robert_ancell> pitti, thanks too
<pitti> hey rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> beta2 today? What's the word on the street?
<RAOF> Morning rickspencer3!  How's your laptop going?
<rickspencer3> hi RAOF except for my zompbie nvidia chip, it works perfectly
<didrocks> hey rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> taking me a bit to adapt to the next keyboard, which is not helped that it's a French keyboard and I'm using a US mapping
<didrocks> rickspencer3: you really brought an azerty layout laptop? :-)
<rickspencer3> didrocks, yes I did
<didrocks> :-)
<didrocks> nice, you are on the right way ;)
<rickspencer3> hah
<rickspencer3> I wish
<RAOF> And you look at the keys? :)  This is a German keyboard, and it's fine for me :)
<didrocks> time to break the keyboard layout switcher ;)
<rickspencer3> pitti, how does Beta 2 look?
<pitti> rickspencer3: after many respins it's now behaving
<rickspencer3> didrocks, nah, I don't much look at the keys, but it's still a different size and all
<rickspencer3> pitti, were the respins mostly those ubiquity bugs, or were there other things going on?
<rickspencer3> like the ca-certs thing
<pitti> rickspencer3: mostly ubiquity, but the ca-certificates one was nasty, too
<rickspencer3> pitti, do you still have to be connected to the network to run Ubiquity?
<pitti> rickspencer3: no, that was fixed (reason for two respins)
<rickspencer3> ah good
<rickspencer3> that was quite annoying
<rickspencer3> pitti, I guess the gsd thing was fixed while ev was in there?
 * rickspencer3 did 2 installs 2 nights ago
<pitti> rickspencer3: yeah, I debugged it last morning, and then we got it in quickly
<rickspencer3> sweet
<rickspencer3> I am *loving* LightDM
<rickspencer3> the new greeter looks so good
<rickspencer3> and it's so snappy
<jbicha> GDM 3.2 feels like GNOME Shell so it probably would have been a huge headache to try to Ubuntu-ify it
<pitti> bah, package updates become hard to do now; we need to unfreeze
<pitti> but versions.html considering UNAPPROVED greatly helps
<didrocks> hey jbicha!
<micahg> pitti: hmm, I thought we're staying frozen until the end
<pitti> micahg: until it's 100% sure that we aren't going to respin
<pitti> I think that's some point during the day
<micahg> pitti: no, I thought until final release
<pitti> uh, for three weeks?
<micahg> yep
<pitti> I thougth we only did that between RC and final
 * micahg too, until I was reminded of last cycle...
<micahg> pitti: http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/09/16/%23ubuntu-meeting.html#t15:55
<pitti> micahg: ah, thanks
<pitti> micahg: I wasn't in last week's release meeting, so that escaped me
<micahg> yeah, the idea was kicked around in -release earlier last week
<pitti> that'll require a lot of handholding from the release team
<RAOF> Hm.  That's what I assumed would be happening anyway.
<micahg> pitti: we actually don't have an RC this cycle, so kinda makes sense
<pitti> jbicha: oh, you can't upload g-shell?
<pitti> ah, universe, I guess
 * pitti will sponsor your branches
<jbicha> pitti: gnome-shell won't build though until we add caribou
<pitti> jbicha: did you test the shell build?
<pitti> jbicha: the new configure.ac has
<pitti> +PKG_CHECK_MODULES(BROWSER_PLUGIN, gio-2.0 >= $GIO_MIN_VERSION json-glib-1.0 >= 0.13.2)
<pitti> jbicha: but there is no json-glib-dev build dep
<jbicha> I wasn't sure how to pbuilder it since I needed new versions of packages
<pitti> jbicha: I usually check a configure.ac diff between the old and new versions to see bumps and new build deps
<rickspencer3> I think I finally have a reliable reproducer for that annoying z-order stacking bug in Unity
<rickspencer3> 2 days after it's been fixed, I think :/
<rickspencer3> anyway, the recovery dialog from LO seems to trigger it
<pitti> jbicha: so, I'll just add libjson-glib-dev after the merge, ok? or do you want to do it in your branch?
<didrocks> jbicha: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Packaging/Training/Logs/2009-04-16
<didrocks> rickspencer3: questions I was asking you before you quit, you have the compiz ppa version isn't it?
<rickspencer3> didrocks, no
<rickspencer3> this is an fresh install from 2 nights ago
<didrocks> rickspencer3: there is a compiz uploaded on the ppa which should fix stacking issues
<jbicha> pitti: it looks like mutter pulls in clutter which pulls in libjson-glib-dev
<rickspencer3> didrocks, do you want me to try it?
<didrocks> rickspencer3: compiz and c-p-m, seems to fix major issues
<didrocks> rickspencer3: yes please
<pitti> jbicha: ah, ok; but I'll add it anyway, safer
<jbicha> pitti: ok, no problem
<rickspencer3> didrocks, what's the url for the ppa?
<didrocks> rickspencer3: as those are very intrusive changes, we pend the tests between multiples people while we were frozen
<didrocks> rickspencer3: https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/+archive/ppa
<RAOF> rickspencer3: What z-order bug are you thinking of?  The one where the focused window isn't raised to the top of the stacking order?
<rickspencer3> RAOF, it's where the alt-tab strip and the dash and the launcher appear under windows on the desktop
<RAOF> Oh, _that_ one.
<rickspencer3> I just found that it starts after the LO recovery dialog first appears
<RAOF> I think the fix for that might have broken my alt-tab, but no one else seems to be able to reproduce.
<rickspencer3> didrocks, after I add the PPA do I have to reinstall unity, or will a dist-upgrade just do it?
<didrocks> rickspencer3: even just an upgrade should work
<didrocks> rickspencer3: this will bring you others packages though
<didrocks> like a speedy g-s-d
<didrocks> and fixed Qt 4.7.4 for vlc and some other apps
<rickspencer3> didrocks, urk, I'm getting a 404 from the ppa :/
<didrocks> on apt-get update?
<rickspencer3> yes
<didrocks> I can reach it from there
<rickspencer3> I just ran update and got a 404 from main too!
<jbicha> pitti: can you sync anjuta-extras from sid? the version in oneiric conflicts with our anjuta
<pitti> jbicha: doesn't seem to be on any image, sure
<didrocks> rickspencer3: seems you are more in trouble then, do you have Internet on that box? (is it the one you have IRC?)
<rickspencer3> didrocks, yes :)
<rickspencer3> it's only main and the desktop PPA that are giving me a 404
<RAOF> GRAGHoughheuu splutter splutter.  Having focus not return to the previously focused window in a group drives me crazy.
<didrocks> rickspencer3: for main, french or main archives?
<rickspencer3> didrocks, I'm sure there are some temporary server side issues, I'll try again in a bit
<didrocks> rickspencer3: fr.archive or archive
<didrocks> rickspencer3: yeah, let's pend that to a later try
<rickspencer3> didrocks, no, I switched to archive because the fr were often not working for me
<didrocks> what, fr always works ;-)
<pitti> on strike too often
<didrocks> on archives strike were scheduled :p
<didrocks> pitti: that's soooooooo easy!
<rickspencer3> maybe I was always trying between noon and 2pm?
<didrocks> roh, come on! :-)
<didrocks> rickspencer3: if you go to descent cities like Lyon, most of shops aren't closed between noon and 2pm :-)
<rickspencer3> didrocks,  I like it here, that they take things easy
<rickspencer3> and the grocery store and bakery near us stay opened
<rickspencer3> so, not really complaining
<didrocks> rickspencer3: indeed, that the big advantage of where you live, life is cooler I guess :)
<didrocks> (same in the very south of France)
<rickspencer3> indeed
<rickspencer3> most people are relaxed and friendly here
<rickspencer3> more so then in Seattle, for sure
<didrocks> you won't find that in Paris :-) (I would tell Lyon is average, between Paris and Toulouse, but less relaxed than Toulouse)
<rickspencer3> except on Sunday morning when there is a line at the bakery and you don't understand what they are asking you when they won't to know what specific type of criossant you want
<rickspencer3> in these cases, they are less relaxed
<didrocks> ahah, you should just point with your finger like "euhâ¦ euhâ¦ I want that"
<didrocks> rickspencer3: you should know that a "baguette" has as well different naming depending on which city you live
<pitti> jbicha: done
<rickspencer3> didrocks, hmmm, fortunately they understand me when I say "baguette" here
<rickspencer3> then I don't understand them when they try to clarify which of the 5 types I want
<rickspencer3> but then they understand me when I point and say "set baguette"
<didrocks> rickspencer3: just ask for the regular one, it's the best :) "baguette tradition" is just a trap to pay it at a higher cost for no real additional value ;)
<rickspencer3> didrocks, I like the ones covered in salt sometimes :)
<rickspencer3> and they are the same .80 euro price
<AfC> Bring your own salt?
<didrocks> with salt? not flour?
<RAOF> I imagine Rick can tell the difference between salt and flour :)
<jbicha> pitti: I wonder if we should just upload caribou, it might cause problems if people update to mutter without also upgrading to the corresponding gshell
<rickspencer3> RAOF, indeed, as I told seb128, the first thing I sorted out was how to get food
<didrocks> salt on top of a baguette, never saw that :) sounds healthy :)
<RAOF> Most correct!
<bryceh> didrocks, and then it's deep fried.
<didrocks> bryceh: of course! mostly needed :-)
<RAOF> Urgh.  Could indicator-datetime-service kindly not spam DBus, causing compiz to be terribly unresponsive?
<didrocks> RAOF: at least, now, you can click on the calendar and change the month!
<RAOF> OH WOW!
<RAOF> I hadn't noticed that it now works.  Awesome!
<didrocks> RAOF: yeah, after 5 months! you can have calendar again :-)
<didrocks> RAOF: more seriously, on the spammy datetime, tedg discussed about it, but he has no solution right now
<robert_ancell> didrocks, oh yay!  That's been bugging me for ages
<didrocks> robert_ancell: yeah, I totally rejoice when I saw that being released :)
<RAOF> didrocks: Does he know what's going wrong?  It really really degrades any interaction with unity.
<mvo> didrocks: nice! finally I can stop using cal(1)
<didrocks> mvo: ahah, you were using it as well? was my only way when I needed a calendar ;)
<AfC> Who is looking after the network-manager-applet package these days? I have a packaging bug to file, but I need to talk about it with a human first.
<didrocks> RAOF: yeah, he knows about it, I don't have the detail in memory, but I'll try to reping him later today
<kamstrup> mvo: hey, you're fast! awesome :-D
<mvo> didrocks: same here. I have the new oneconf now and everythng is working perfectly. I get diffs and the new machine shows up almost instantly, really really nice
<kamstrup> mvo: so which one of the structs members should I use?
<mvo> kamstrup: you did all the hard work, so that was easy :)
<didrocks> mvo: \o/ what a change compared to the desktopcouch version! :-)
<mvo> kamstrup: depends on what you need, ratings average (the first) if you need to do the filtering. but sort the sorting I would recommend the last one
<didrocks> mvo: I'm really eager to integrate ubiquity next cycle and all what we can do with that, crossing fingers ;)
<kamstrup> mvo: ok, i'll try with the first one and then experiment a little, thanks!
<mvo> kamstrup: we basicly use http://www.evanmiller.org/how-not-to-sort-by-average-rating.html for the sorting to avoid that the 1x5 star app floats on top
<mvo> kamstrup: that is the last member of the struct
<mvo> didrocks: yeah, that is going to be awsome, especially with the "keep-home" feature
<didrocks> indeed, you just keep home and you can reinstall all your apps in a breeze :)
<mvo> yes
 * mvo hugs didrocks
<didrocks> mvo: btw, thinking about it, do you think it will be hard to add a new renderer for the gtktree (AppStore2) to add in the categories "install all"/"remove all"
 * didrocks hugs mvo
<mvo> kamstrup: please tell me if everything works as expected, if so I will merge and upload after the freeze
<didrocks> mvo: not sure it can still enters oneiricâ¦ but at least for p
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<mvo> didrocks: I don't think it will be very hard, but everything is a bit hard with the gtk.TreeView
<mvo> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hi mvo, how are you?
<mvo> sleepy, but otherwise good. and you?
<didrocks> mvo: yeah, I'll try to have a look for that for P. Apart from that and an easy way to remove a computer from the list on don't have anymore, I don't see anything else for usc itself right now
 * mvo nods
<kamstrup> mvo epic quote "I don't think it will be very hard, but everything is a bit hard with the gtk.TreeView"
<robert_ancell> pitti, hey, do you know if seb128 is in today?
<didrocks> kamstrup: well, that's not that untrue with treeview :)
<mvo> heh :)
<pitti> robert_ancell: he should be
<kamstrup> didrocks: not only "not untrue", but painstakingly true!
<ricotz> pitti, good morning
<pitti> hey ricotz
<kamstrup> mvo: how do I trink it to dump a db?
<didrocks> kamstrup: I think we should make pain and stacking synonyms now :-)
<kamstrup> lol
<ricotz> pitti, i noticed some uploads to the queue which might be uploaded after an clutter/cogl upload
<mvo> kamstrup: just get the branch and run s-c from it once (via ./software-center) and it should appear a couple of seconds later
<ricotz> pitti, http://people.ubuntu.com/~ricotz/clutter/
<robert_ancell> pitti, ok, good.  I have a unity-greeter which is in the upload queue, can you have a look at that.  There's a lightdm release pushed to bzr, but I'd like seb128 to take a look over it today before uploading and we need to resolved bug 845549 before release.  Can you also look at it and see if it's ok to upload pending that fix?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 845549 in lightdm "Do not ship /etc/lightdm/lightdm-gtk-greeter.conf" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/845549
<kamstrup> mvo: thanks, i see it now :-) I was just running ./run_local.sh thinking I was a l337 haxor
<seb128> hey
<didrocks> salut seb128
<pitti> robert_ancell: summoning powers!
<seb128> lut didrocks
<seb128> hey pitti robert_ancell
<pitti> ricotz: you need these sponsored?
<seb128> pitti, how are you?
<pitti> seb128: quite fine, thanks!
<mvo> kamstrup: heh :)
<seb128> what's the beta2 status?
<seb128> hey mvo
<pitti> arrived late, but seems ok now
<ricotz> pitti, yes, but they should be built and published before gnome-games, g-s, mutter
<pitti> ricotz: why, did these forget to bump their build dependencies?
<mvo> hey seb128!
<ricotz> and cheese
<pitti> ricotz: or does the new clutter change ABI?
<ricotz> pitti, no, cogl bump its soname
<kamstrup> mvo: can you add the libdb version to the db path name?
<ricotz> pitti, clutter is stable, but cogl is also in their rdepends
<mvo> kamstrup: sure, I will do that, I have a call now, I will do it right after that
<kamstrup> mvo: you have db.DB_VERSION_{MAJOR,MINOR}
<kamstrup> mvo: sure
<seb128> pitti, was the summoning powers for me joining? robert_ancell looking for me?
<pitti> seb128: yes, robert_ancell asked for you
<seb128> robert_ancell, hello!
<robert_ancell> seb128, hey.  I think I've got all the issues you had fixed, it's just bug 845549 blocking the release to B2 now
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 845549 in lightdm "Do not ship /etc/lightdm/lightdm-gtk-greeter.conf" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/845549
<seb128> robert_ancell, well it's too late by a week for beta2, we are frozen since friday
<robert_ancell> seb128, I was hoping to ask the release team nicely :)
<seb128> robert_ancell, that's a packaging change though, I would just undo your additional binary and not block 0.9.8 on it
<seb128> we can fix that bug in -0ubuntu2
<robert_ancell> seb128, ok, I'll do that
<seb128> robert_ancell, well, you can but beta2 is supposed to be today and I doubt they will respin isos for lightdm and restart the testing from 0
<robert_ancell> oh, is that already started?  I thought that started tonight
<seb128> robert_ancell, btw did you get an ecryptfs login issue as well?
<robert_ancell> ok, np, it can all be post b2
<robert_ancell> yes
<seb128> robert_ancell, no, beta2 is supposed to be out tonight :p
<seb128> robert_ancell, i.e validated and published, isos started being rolled on monday
<seb128> robert_ancell, you really need an ecryptfs testcase ;-)
<seb128> or to convert your main user to it :p
<robert_ancell> seb128, yes, but I can't test it in the regression tests
<robert_ancell> stupid PAM is a pita
<seb128> ok
<seb128> robert_ancell, well in any case imho you should roll back the fix for bug #845549 and wait for the patch to use alternatives
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 845549 in lightdm "Do not ship /etc/lightdm/lightdm-gtk-greeter.conf" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/845549
<seb128> then you can upload 0.9.8
<pitti> ricotz: mutter is already accepted, BTW
<pitti> ricotz: so we might need another upload for that and bump build deps?
<seb128> I will grab it from the queue if you upload today still, otherwise will do a trunk build for testing
<seb128> robert_ancell, what bugs are still on your list for oneiric? getting close now ;-)
<robert_ancell> I have 8 I'm tracking now
<ricotz> pitti, a simple rebuild will do, the required versions hasnt change, just to pick up the new lib
<seb128> robert_ancell, do you tag those or milestone them or something which makes easy to see the list for me?
<robert_ancell> seb128, should I just use the ubuntu 11.10 milestone?
<seb128> robert_ancell, works for me
<seb128> robert_ancell, btw you probably need a ffe bug for 0.9.8
<seb128> since you added the language selector
<seb128> it will probably be easy to get an ack since it's optional on a greeter we don't use by default (but that some derivatives use)
<rodrigo_> morning
<robert_ancell> seb128, ok, all tagged and assigned to me
<seb128> robert_ancell, thanks
<robert_ancell> later all
<seb128> robert_ancell, 'night
<seb128> oh, jbicha doing updates in Debian now ;-)
<seb128> jbicha, hey, I noticed that you have a pitivi ffe bug waiting for a comment from you
<seb128> jbicha, i.e pitti asked some question a week ago and you didn't reply
<seb128> hey rodrigo_, how are you?
<rodrigo_> hi seb128
<pitti> hey rodrigo_
<rodrigo_> hi pitti
<pitti> ricotz: oh, cogl ABI bump -- that requires an FFE
<rodrigo_> hmm, did someone do libgnomekbd update?
<pitti> rodrigo_: yes, in unapproved
<rodrigo_> ah ok
<pitti> I marked it on the pad, didn't I?
<pitti> and it's green on versions.html
<rodrigo_> yeah
<seb128> pitti, not sure cogl broke ABI, they just decide to keep going for the unstable cycle and bump the soname for the stable
<pitti> seb128: well, it's a library transition, with some rdepends, so we shoudl have a bug for trackign the transition now
<seb128> well, soname bump is an abi break I guess
<seb128> pitti, right
<pitti> quadrapassel, mutter, cheese, champlain, gnome-shell, AFAICS
<seb128> pitti, I just wanted to say that the transition should be easy, they didn't break api
<seb128> but agreed, that seem some tracking
<ricotz> seb128, pitti, they moved some stuff to there experimental api, so nothing was actually removed, but yeah it is an break
<seb128> pitti, btw davidz did an api change in gdbus-codegen, we should track it as well
<ricotz> pitti, seb128, but it doesnt break/ftbfs any of its depends
<pitti> ricotz: right
<pitti> ricotz: it's fine, but please file an FFE bug anyway, so that we can add the tasks needed for rebuild, etc.
<ricotz> ok
<pitti> ricotz: both uploaded, thanks!
<ricotz> pitti, thanks
<bigon> hey
<bigon> pitti, ricotz I've some trouble with how in caribou the gtk module is loaded
<jbicha> rodrigo_: re: the System Info Checking for Updates bug, line 1880ish doesn't look right to me
<jbicha> http://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-control-center/tree/panels/info/cc-info-panel.c#n1856
<rodrigo_> jbicha, looking
<bigon> I think the Xsession script is not needed as there is a .desktop file that is installed in gnome-setting-daemon that seems to load it already
<jbicha> rodrigo_: just a guess, I'm not much of a C coder nor do I understand what parts of PK Ubuntu has by default
<chrisccoulson> hey seb128, how are you?
<rodrigo_> jbicha, it has that interface, yes
<ricotz> pitti, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/cogl/+bug/856179
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 856179 in cogl "[FFe] cogl 1.8.0 with soname bump" [Undecided,New]
<rodrigo_> checking anyway
<seb128> chrisccoulson, hey, I'm great thanks, how are you?
<chrisccoulson> rodrigo_, it seems federico agrees with me about removing the refresh in gnome-desktop when applying a display configuration :)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, i'm good thanks
<rodrigo_> chrisccoulson, cool!
<ricotz> bigon, in what way?
<chrisccoulson> so, i'll remove that. that wins us back some time for people who configured display settings :)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, \o/
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I need to double check if you update broke something there
<rodrigo_> jbicha, hmm, indeed we don't, I guess that was changed, because it was using an interface session-installer implements
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I've a "weird","buggy" case
<chrisccoulson> seb128, oh?
<ricotz> pitti, please add libchamplain-0.8 too
<bigon> mmh? what about champlain-0.8?
<rodrigo_> hmm, weird, has session-installer been changed?
<rodrigo_> it used to implement the GetUpdates method, iirc
<rodrigo_> but d-feet doesn't show it
<ricotz> bigon, it needs an rebuild for the cogl soname bump
<bigon> oh ok :)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, so for some reason I can't boot my laptop docked since I updated this week, I see the purple color but lightdm never displays and I can't switch to vts
<seb128> chrisccoulson, the screen is on but nothing display
<seb128> well anyway that's another issue
<seb128> boot works fine undocked though
<didrocks> hey chrisccoulson
<seb128> so I boot, log in, then dock my laptop
<seb128> doing that give me a 1440 mirrored resolution
<seb128> but when I open the xrandr capplet it switches back to the correct config
<seb128> i.e 1920
<seb128> (which is my external monitor resolution, I work with lid closed)
<chrisccoulson> hmmm :/
<seb128> so I'm wondering if it applies the stored config when I open the capplet and if it should do it when I dock the laptop rather
<seb128> but I'm not sure that worked before
<chrisccoulson> that seems to happen to me too, but it's not a new problem for me
<seb128> ok, so maybe it's not yours
<seb128> I got the "hang" issue on the same day I installed your updates
<seb128> I never booted undocked and docked it this way before
<seb128> so I don't know if that ever worked
<chrisccoulson> ie, docking my laptop always seems to get me a clone config, which either corrects when i open the display settings, or requires me to manually configure the display
<seb128> ok
<seb128> good, so not a new bug
<chrisccoulson> i'll have a look, just to make sure. but i don't think it's a new bug
<seb128> still seems weird that opening the display settings do the right thing
<seb128> it should do whatever it does there when the laptop is docked ;-)
<RAOF> Sounds like hotplug isn't being triggered properly.
<RAOF> Because opening display settings triggers a full xrandr probe, it should always pick up anything that you've got plugged in at that moment.
<chrisccoulson> i guess it would be easy to check if gnome-settings-daemon ever gets a notification about the display config changing
<bigon> 10:03 < ricotz> bigon, in what way? << well I think that the one of the desktop file in the caribou bin pkg make gnome-setting-daemon load the gtk module
<RAOF> That's not what to look for; it's the udev events that you should look for.
<bigon> so the hack to add it to the evironoment variable in Xsession.d is not needed
<bigon> but that will require to change where that file is installed
<RAOF> Hm, actually, I'm not exactly sure what X events should trigger on hotplug.  Certainly X shouldn't actually *configure* the newly discovered displays, just notify that they've appeared.  It's g-s-d's job to actually set a mode on them.
<bigon> (also I'm not sure if the caribou gtk modules shouldn't depends against caribou and not the opposite as it's done now)
<chrisccoulson> RAOF, RRScreenChangeNotify
<RAOF> Ah, ok.
<chrisccoulson> that's the event that gnome-settings-daemon is expecting to see
<bigon> ricotz: /usr/lib/gnome-settings-daemon-3.0/gtk-modules/caribou-gtk-module.desktop
<chrisccoulson> seb128, what's in your ~/.config/monitors.xml?
<chrisccoulson> does it actually have a mirrored configuration in there?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/695000/
<chrisccoulson> seb128, hmm, so, it doesn't look like it
<seb128> no
<seb128> well maybe it's not in mirror when I dock it
<seb128> it's hard to say since my lid is closed and opening the gui switches it to 1920 before I can see what were the settings
<seb128> it might just be that the external monitor stays in 1440
<chrisccoulson> interesting
<chrisccoulson> i'll have a look at this today, and see if there is anything obvious going wrong
<chrisccoulson> but this hasn't really ever worked reliably for me
<chrisccoulson> although i would be very happy if it did work reliably :)
<seb128> doesn't seem a priority but would be nice to fix
<chrisccoulson> indeed
<chrisccoulson> pitti, will lots of people get spam if i make ubuntu-core-dev a member of https://launchpad.net/~mozillateam ? (and can i actually do that)
<chrisccoulson> i just noticed that nobody (basically except for me, micahg and jdstrand) can actually commit to our branches
<pitti> chrisccoulson: you need to set a contact email for mozillateam first
<pitti> otherwise everyone will get spammed, yes
<pitti> chrisccoulson: yes, you can invite, and the owner of core-dev can then accept
<chrisccoulson> i guess ubuntu-mozillateam@lists.ubuntu.com would be an appropriate contact?
<pitti> that sounds fine
<chrisccoulson> pitti - oh, that address is already used for https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-mozillateam
<chrisccoulson> which doesn't really exist ;)
<rodrigo_> mvo, ping
<pitti> chrisccoulson: hm, case for #launchpad?
<pitti> to clean it up
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, just asked there now
<pitti> rodrigo_: FYI, I reopened bug 853751, as it's not fixed in ubuntu yet; can you close it with the changelog?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 853751 in gnome-control-center "http proxy setting blanked when user goes back to proxy settings" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/853751
<rodrigo_> pitti, hmm, it's in 3.1.92
<pitti> rodrigo_: ah, ok; the last comment sounded otherwise
<pitti> rodrigo_: closed again, thanks!
<Laney> sounds like the bug I filed upstream
<Laney> https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=658447 - want to close?
<rodrigo_> pitti, yeah, I should have mentioned 3-2 branch, not master
<ubot2> Gnome bug 658447 in Network "Clears proxy host when opened" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<mvo> kamstrup: added that now too, I will add some cleanup, tests and it should be ready later today (we are in freeze anyway)
<mvo> rodrigo_: poing
<mvo> rodrigo_: pong even
<rodrigo_> mvo, :)
<rodrigo_> mvo, you've worked on sessioninstaller, right?
<mvo> yes
<rodrigo_> mvo, I thought it implemented the GetTid/GetUpdates interface of packagekit, but looking at the code I don't see it
<rodrigo_> mvo, so, I guess I have dreamed it?
<rodrigo_> and it worked for me because I have packagekit installed?
<mvo> rodrigo_: this sounds like its the system api, not the session api? or am I missing something?
<mvo> rodrigo_: that sounds likely
<rodrigo_> mvo, I thought it was the session API
<rodrigo_> ok, we need to patch g-c-c then
<rodrigo_> since packagekit is not on the CD
<mvo> what is it doing with that info?
<mvo> could you double check if its really part of the session api? if so, we could add it to s-i
<rodrigo_> mvo, on the system info panel in g-c-c, checks for updates, and enables a button to install those
<rodrigo_> mvo, yes, sure
<mvo> it would actually be quite nice to have this on the session api
<glatzor> rodrigo_, mvo The glib client library of PackageKit uses the system bus directly
<rodrigo_> mvo, glatzor: yes, they're from the system api
<glatzor> mvo, rodrigo_  once I find some time to continue the work on the glib library for aptdaemon we could just port the plugin
<rodrigo_> glatzor, which plugin you mean?
<glatzor> the packagekit plugin of gnome-session-daemon
<rodrigo_> right
<rodrigo_> is there any plan to implement the PK system API?
<rodrigo_> in aptdaemon?
<glatzor> rodrigo_, but why port the plugin if we still have the universal ubuntu sessio  daemon, formerly called update-notifier arround :) are there any plans to port functionallity from update-notifier to g-s-d?
<rodrigo_> glatzor, well, we already have a way to check and install updates in the system info
<rodrigo_> I'll port that to aptdaemon, if it's got a dbus interface, does it?
<rodrigo_> it does, yes
<glatzor> rodrigo_, currently we don't have got any aquivalent method to GetUpdates. The idea of aptdaemon was only to move the operation which require root privilliges to a separate daemon
<rodrigo_> right, I see
<seb128> chrisccoulson, what's happening with bug #743096
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 743096 in evolution-couchdb "contacts only sync with evolution not with thunderbird" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/743096
<seb128> chrisccoulson, did you ship your u1 addressbook creating code with tb?
<rodrigo_> need to reboot, brb
<glatzor> rodrigo_, but we could think about providing a small subset of PackageKit API that we want to support by aptdaemon. for update checking it doesn't make sense to keep an apt cache in every active user session
<mvo> glatzor: I see requests for this from various parties now, the indicator logout applet wants to know info about pending updates too, now g-c-c, it seems like it does make sense to provide info for some common operations
<mvo> glatzor: especially since the libapt c++ api is pretty tricky to use from pure c apps
<mvo> glatzor: I got approval for the add-license-key call, are you fine with me merging that code into trunk now ?
<glatzor> mvo, sorry. not yet. We currently don't have got a way to verify the key. see the latest comments on the bug
<glatzor> mvo, would it be possible to download the key by aptdaemon?
<glatzor> mvo, so we could rely on ssl and url validation
<pitti> chrisccoulson: bug 805136, do you think that has an actual chance for oneiric?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 805136 in thunderbird "accounts window doesn't fit on screen and no scrollbar to show hidden fields" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/805136
<mvo> glatzor: indeed, its a oauth protected url
<mvo> glatzor: let me think about this a little bit
<pitti> didrocks: desktop-o-oneconf, "Wait for ISD to publish the webcatalog part" -> is that done now?
<didrocks> pitti: right, it's done, let me update it
<pitti> didrocks: I can update it, just wanted to confirm
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, the spec is done
<pitti> (done)
<didrocks> thanks pitti :)
<kamstrup> mvo: all the pkgname keys in the db are prefixed with a ","... any reason?
<mvo> kamstrup: no, I can fix that
<mvo> kamstrup: its a relict of the past, it used to be that we stored the application name as well, but that is just too errorprone
<kamstrup> mvo: ah, I see
<kamstrup> mvo: but other than that, it works beautifully here :-) And very fast!
<mvo> kamstrup: awsome!
<kamstrup> mvo: looks like you're dumping the db from the main thread, before the UI is shown..?
<kamstrup> or am I missing something?
<mvo> kamstrup: yeah, its just proof of concept currently, I will optimize this before the final merge
<kamstrup> mvo: oki
<seb128> pitti, is apport collecting the .xsession-errors warning etc when the issue happen or when you run ubuntu-bug?
<pitti> seb128: not for all bugs; hookutils has an xsession_errors() function
<mvo> kamstrup: the code surrounding it is also a bit clumsy, I will take the opportunity to clean that up too
<pitti> seb128: oh, which is called in generic hook, so it should be ther
<seb128> pitti, right, but at what time is that called?
<seb128> pitti, on the issue time (when the .crash is written) or when ubuntu-bug is run?
<pitti> seb128: but it only shows lines which match (\(.*:\d+\): \w+-(WARNING|CRITICAL|ERROR))|(Error: .*No Symbols named)
<pitti> to avoid catching passwords and the like
<pitti> seb128: when ubuntu-bug is run
<seb128> pitti, yeah, I've looked at the apport source and seen that
<seb128> pitti, ok, that might explain why it's often useless
<seb128> pitti, it collects the infos at the wrong time
<seb128> pitti, well, something for next cycle, we have other things to do that improving apport before Oneiric now
<seb128> I will keep it on my list
<seb128> pitti, thanks ;-)
<pitti> nice to test Kubuntu CDs from time to time and see how it looks like these days
<seb128> pitti, we should get GNObuntu CDs to test how GNOME looks like these days ;-)
<pitti> heh, right; I never built enough in jhbuild to get that far
<pitti> only the basic libs (pygobject, gtk, etc.)
<seb128> well, installing gnome-shell to Oneiric should be close enough from upstream GNOME
<pitti> *nod*
<pitti> I think stracciatella-session is pretty much obsolete, I think we should just remove it
<seb128> oh, yes
<pitti> g-shell isn't using indicators, or unity, or our panel layout, or what not
<seb128> indeed
<didrocks> there is still notify-osd on the panel session, isn't it?
<didrocks> not sure if it's blackisted in gnome-shell
<pitti> I thought shell had a builtin notification service?
<seb128> they do
<didrocks> yeah, not sure if it's using dbus and so our service is spawn first
<seb128> debian is dropped service activation from the notification daemons
<seb128> letting those being started by autostart in their corresponding session
<seb128> GNOME did the same for notification-daemon
<didrocks> ok, so it's their shell service which is started in the gnome-shell session?
<seb128> didrocks, well, our service has a list of sessions where notify-osd should be running and gnome-shell is not in there
<pitti> $ lp-remove-package.py -u pitti -m 'gnome-session-fallback and gnome-shell now do not have ubuntu modifications, and stracciatella-session does not work any more' stracciatella-session
 * pitti sheds a tear
<didrocks> seb128: ineed, it's been updated, as I didn't touch, I wasn't sure there was still "gnome" listed in it
<didrocks> there is some cleaning still needed
<didrocks> and use DESTKOP_SESSION has well
<didrocks> but that can wait
<seb128> didrocks, we should just drop the .service as others are doing and add an autostart with OnlyShowIn=Unity
<kamstrup> mvo: w00t.Everything works very well now :-) It's great fun toying around with the ratings in the apps lens :-D
<didrocks> can work as well
<mvo> kamstrup: :)
<mvo> kamstrup: the ",pkgname" issue should be fixed now too
<glatzor> see you mvo I am leaving for work! have a nice day
<mvo> thanks glatzor
<mvo> glatzor: you too!
<seb128> chrisccoulson, how did you profile g-s-d? did you have any clever way or basically markers in the code?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, there's a disabled patch in the package in the PPA, and you also need to do --enable-profiling
<chrisccoulson> (as a build option)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, ok, well I want to profile nautilus so I was wondering if you used a tool I can re-use, seems not
<seb128> guess I'm back to the markers in the code and strace ;-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, g-s-d already has code for profiling, which you can inspect with strace
<chrisccoulson> i just modified it to print stuff out, with timestamps
<chrisccoulson> brb. need to restart
<didrocks> need to change the plugs for my internet router, waiting for new delivery, continuing some oneconf offline work.
<didrocks> bbl
<seb128> bah
<seb128> I really wonder how much u1 test their stuff
<seb128> the g-s-d integration is broken in oneiric, i.e the .so doesn't load, and nobody noticed
<chrisccoulson> seb128, oh, this is a bit suspicous. when i dock my laptop, g-s-d doesn't just get a randr event, but it also gets a hotkey event from the display key :/
<chrisccoulson> i wonder where that comes from
<chrisccoulson> yeah, that happens fairly consistently
<tseliot> chrisccoulson: do you have a log that shows the hotkey event?
<chrisccoulson> tseliot, i've got the debug output from gsd
<tseliot> yep, that's what I meant
<chrisccoulson> 1 second, jsut going to switch off the media-keys plugin, just to see if that keypress actually makes a difference
<chrisccoulson> bingo!
<chrisccoulson> stopping that keypress from happening causes gsd to correctly apply my stored config
<chrisccoulson> seb128 ^^
<chrisccoulson> tseliot, http://paste.ubuntu.com/695039/
<chrisccoulson> not sure that tells you much though ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, nice catch
<chrisccoulson> that's the first time i've ever docked my laptop and it hasn't defaulted to a clone config, but actually applied my working config :)
<tseliot> chrisccoulson: I'm wondering if this is just because code that handles the hotkey event is also the same whithc handles RandR events
<chrisccoulson> so, now to track down where this keypress comes from
<chrisccoulson> tseliot, inside X?
<tseliot> chrisccoulson: no, in libgnome-desktop
<chrisccoulson> tseliot, the keypress isn't handled by libgnome-desktop
<chrisccoulson> it's handled in a separate plugin, and is a real X key event
<tseliot> chrisccoulson: gnome-settings-daemon then?
<chrisccoulson> tseliot, yeah
<chrisccoulson> i wonder if my dock does that?
<chrisccoulson> perhaps i should just try pulling out the monitor cable
<chrisccoulson> 1 second
<chrisccoulson> there we go
<chrisccoulson> so my dock is stupid
<chrisccoulson> it's triggering that key event when i dock/undock
<chrisccoulson> it doesn't if i just pull the monitor cable out
<chrisccoulson> let me just verify that one more time
<pitti> seb128: btw, I'll have another holiday tomorrow
<pitti> seb128: I updated https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/ReleaseStatus already, but I'm not sure whether we are going to have a meeting tomorrow
<pitti> seb128: if we have one, would you be able to lurk, in case questions come up?
<pitti> (I'll tell skaet and point her to the report)
<chrisccoulson> tseliot, ok, totally confirmed - my docking station is a complete idiot :)
<tseliot> chrisccoulson: :)
<chrisccoulson> i consistently get the display key event every time i dock
<chrisccoulson> at the same time as the randr event
<chrisccoulson> which breaks gsd :(
<chrisccoulson> i wonder if that's the same for seb128 too
<chrisccoulson> that's really annoying
<chrisccoulson> tseliot, is there anything we can do about that? :)
<chrisccoulson> it would be really awesome to not have to reconfigure my display every time i dock my laptop :)
<seb128> pitti, can do
<Sweetshark> pitti: libreoffice_3.4.3-1ubuntu3 is on chinstrap
<tseliot> chrisccoulson: so, just to understand things better (as I've never used a dock), when you use the dock your external screen is used and the laptop's switches off or otherwise how does it work?
<chrisccoulson> tseliot, i use both screens when i dock, with them both side-by-side
<chrisccoulson> i have my settings in a stored configuration, because gsd defaults to cloning them
<chrisccoulson> so, when i dock, i expect it to just see a randr event, and for gsd to happily apply my stored config (with the displays side-by-side)
<chrisccoulson> but the extra hotkey event from my dock causes it to apply one of the default configs, with the first one being "clone"
<tseliot> chrisccoulson: right, that's what should happen but if you get a hotkey event, that makes it switch to a different configuration
<chrisccoulson> tseliot, yeah :)
<tseliot> chrisccoulson: according to the log (if I'm reading it correctly), gsd is handling the hotkey event first and then it tries to apply your stored settings, so this should work, at least in theory
<tseliot> or maybe those events are triggered by the hotkey event?
<Sweetshark> pitti: hold on, there is one commit missing
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i'm not too sure what happens there
<tseliot> chrisccoulson: you should probably check that before we can think of a workaround
 * tseliot -> lunch
 * didrocks grrr at UPS telling they arrive in 10 minutes for making the swap and finally arrived 50 minutes later
<chrisccoulson> i think i might be better off dusting off xtrace here
<Sweetshark> pitti: fixed
<pitti> Sweetshark: libreoffice_3.4.3-1ubuntu3_source.changes, right?
<rodrigo_> hmm so, what needs to be done to apply for MOTU?
<Sweetshark> pitti: right
<pitti> Sweetshark: uploaded
<didrocks> rodrigo_: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DeveloperMembershipBoard/ApplicationProcess
<rodrigo_> didrocks, thanks
<didrocks> rodrigo_: yw!
<Sweetshark> pitti: thanks
 * Sweetshark lunches
<pitti> mmm, lunch, me 2
 * chrisccoulson gets hungry too
<seb128> hum, it's lunch time indeed!
<rodrigo_> can I get some endorsements at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/RodrigoMoya/MOTUApplication please?
<rodrigo_> (I'll pay it back with beer :)
<rodrigo_> btw, for MOTU you get per package permissions, or just permissions for all packages?
<seb128> rodrigo_, will comment on it, you get access to "universe"
<rodrigo_> ok, so every package there?
<seb128> yes
<rodrigo_> ok cool
 * rodrigo_ prepares to break lots of stuff
<seb128> they will like you there :p
<rodrigo_> :)
<rodrigo_> lunch, bbl
 * pitti reviews unapproved
<pitti> chrisccoulson: did you upload the g-s-d and g-desktop fixes yet? *yearn*
<chrisccoulson> pitti - not yet, i was waiting on comments from upstream
<pitti> ah, ok
<chrisccoulson> and upstream recommended that i do to gnome-desktop what i wanted to do in the first place :)
<chrisccoulson> (ie, get rid of the useless reprobe when applying a saved config)
<chrisccoulson> which is nice :)
<pitti> seb128: if you double-click a jpg file, does it open with eog or with shotwell?
<pitti> I get shotwell here, which seems a bit odd
<seb128> pitti, should be eog
<seb128> pitti, you might be hitting https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=658188
<ubot2> Gnome bug 658188 in gio "g_app_info_set_as_last_used_for_type generates a broken mimeapps.list" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<pitti> ah, that again
<seb128> pitti, do you have that file in .local/share/applications?
<chrisccoulson> rodrigo_, did you want to update the gsd branch with your tidied up patch?
<seb128> pitti, if yes what does it contain?
<pitti> seb128: right, indeed
<pitti> http://paste.ubuntu.com/695083/
<seb128> pitti, there you go
 * pitti nukes both files
<seb128> pitti, I've been discussing it with desrt and some other GNOME guys
<seb128> let's see if it gets fixed for this cycle
<pitti> happy again now
<seb128> great
<pitti> thanks!
<seb128> yw ;-)
<seb128> waouh
<seb128> early unfreeze \o/
<pitti> seb128: no, not thawed
<pitti> seb128: apparently last week's release meeting said that oneiric will not thaw any more
<pitti> seb128: but the b2 images are as good as they are going to be, so I pushed a bit for reviewing/flusing unapproved
<seb128> pitti, sorry, wrong word, "early queue relax" \o/
 * didrocks will pushes compiz then
<didrocks> push*
<seb128> didrocks, \o/
<seb128> wth
<pitti> for now I'm still only accepting packages which I'd trust not to break the images, though
<pitti> also, I need pkgbinarymangler and vala-0.14 to publish to accept some more
<seb128> nautilus open and read like 10 times the default wallpaper on start
<seb128> no wonder it's so slow
<pitti> ugh
<seb128> investigating...
<pitti> that might explain why it balooned from 0.5 to 5 seconds
<pitti> (see my wiki page)
<pitti> seb128: nice catch!
<seb128> yeah, that's where I come from ;-)
<seb128> well wiki and charts I did
<didrocks> hopefully, it reads 10 times from my cache :p
<seb128> didrocks,
<seb128> 1316692376.273702 access("file:///usr/share/backgrounds/warty-final-ubuntu.png", F_OK) = -1 ENOENT (No such file or directory)
<seb128> 1316692376.273765 getcwd("/builddir/nautilus", 4096) = 37
<seb128> 1316692376.273816 open("/builddir/nautilus/file:///usr/share/backgrounds/warty-final-ubuntu.png", O_RDONLY|O_LARGEFILE) = -1 ENOENT (No such file or directory)
<seb128> 1316692376.273898 open("/usr/share/backgrounds/warty-final-ubuntu.png", O_RDONLY|O_LARGEFILE) = 24
<seb128> 1316692376.273948 fstat64(24, {st_mode=S_IFREG|0644, st_size=295416, ...}) = 0
<seb128> 1316692376.274009 read(24, "\377\330\377\340\0\20JFIF\0\1\2\0\0d\0d\0\0\377\354\0\21Ducky\0\1\0"..., 8192) = 8192
<seb128> seems not
<seb128> it does that every time
<didrocks> seb128: does it still use gnomedesktop?
<didrocks> seb128: I tried to tweak my cached background and it's the one which is used
<seb128> didrocks, yeah, but that's not even my background
<seb128> my user has another image
<seb128> it reads the default one...
<didrocks> ah nice! :-)
<seb128> so I think it's just bog
<seb128> didrocks, you are still good I think
<seb128> well your code rather ;-) you as well of course ... ;-)
<kenvandine> good morning all
<seb128> "1316692376.868893 lstat64("/usr/share/backgrounds/Bird_by_Magnus.jpg", {st_mode=S_IFREG|0644, st_size=84958, ...}) = 0
<seb128> 1316692376.869103 lstat64("/home/seb128/.cache/wallpaper/0_5_1920_1080_708d778bd7093a84d30ab7d51ad92436", {st_mode=S_IFREG|0664, st_size=694268, ...}) = 0
<seb128> 1316692376.869323 open("/home/seb128/.cache/wallpaper/0_5_1920_1080_708d778bd7093a84d30ab7d51ad92436", O_RDONLY|O_LARGEFILE) = 23"
<seb128> didrocks, ^
<didrocks> seb128: waow, double goodness! :-)
<seb128> didrocks, that's my background image
<seb128> hey kenvandine, how are you?
<kenvandine> good
<didrocks> so ok, it just stat it
<kenvandine> glad to be home finally :)
<didrocks> to ensure the cache is up to date
<seb128> didrocks, yeah, seems to do what it should
<didrocks> so, now, just have to ensure why it reads the default which is even not set
<seb128> kenvandine, how is your jetlag?
<kenvandine> none... amazingly
<seb128> didrocks, right, that's what I'm looking at
<pitti> hey kenvandine, goo dmorning
<kenvandine> i was on monday after traveling from europe on sunday
<seb128> bah, I really hate the "reveal on the edge"
<kenvandine> but heading back to the east coast had no affect :)
<kenvandine> i really don't like any sort of hiding...
<seb128> keep showing the unity launcher when I want to do "back" in firefox and browse dconf-editor left pane
<kamstrup> pitti: that segv with pygobject3.0 and python lenses, is related to gvariant handling I believe... Can you check https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/855402
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 855402 in unity "Python lenses segfault with pygobject3" [Critical,In progress]
<cyphermox> good morning!
<seb128> DOH
<seb128> didrocks, pitti, chrisccoulson: stupid dx!
<seb128> user-desktop.svg:  <image id="image3127" xlink:href="file:///usr/share/backgrounds/warty-final-ubuntu.png" height="13" width="20" y="46" x="1"/>
<didrocks> what have they done?
<seb128> it's for the desktop icon
<didrocks> urgh?
<seb128> they load and compute the background in each svg
<didrocks> "nice"
<seb128> 22 48 64 128
<didrocks> ok, that explains everything
<seb128> nautilus takes half the cpu with the gnome icon theme...
<seb128> njpatel, ^ you guys have to be kinding us
<didrocks> so, I have some python code to do that for oneconf, which just do it when you change your wallpaper :)
<njpatel> seb128, sorry?
<njpatel> seb128, I don't think that's a DX thing dude
<seb128> njpatel, ignore me, it's a an issue with icon people, don't you ;-)
<seb128> njpatel, but I don't know who "icon people" is nowadays ;-)
<njpatel> seb128, sladen
<njpatel> is the point of contact
<njpatel> lord knows who actually creates them :)
<seb128> njpatel, yeah, thanks, moving channel
<rodrigo_> chrisccoulson, well, doesn't mind really, the result is the same, so I guess there's no need to update the patch
<rodrigo_> chrisccoulson, just reworked your patch to make it upstreamable
<chrisccoulson> tseliot, i'm not sure why the gsd-randr log showed the keypress before the randr event
<chrisccoulson> but when i debug it in gdb, i get the randr event before the keypress
<chrisccoulson> so it does apply the correct config, then immediately changes it again
<seb128> why a keypress would trigger an xrandr change?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, it's the fn+f7 keypress
<seb128> oh
<chrisccoulson> the one that cycles through display configs :)
<chrisccoulson> it seems the dock triggers that :(
<chrisccoulson> perhaps to work around a windows bug ;)
<seb128> do they try to be smart assuming the software will be dumb?
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i guess so
<seb128> I wonder if that's dell specific...
<chrisccoulson> just like the remapping of Fn+F7 to Super + P in the BIOS ;)
<tseliot> chrisccoulson: it makes sense. Maybe we can make the app ignore hotkey events for a small amount of time after randr events? We should consider any potential regression though
<chrisccoulson> tseliot, i guess that's possible. it sounds a bit hacky though ;)
<tseliot> chrisccoulson: only because it is ;)
<chrisccoulson> i'm not sure what to set the time to though. my laptop is fairly fast, so i could pick a time that works for me, but it still breaks for everyone else
<chrisccoulson> rodrigo_, who normally works on the randr stuff in gsd?
<rodrigo_> chrisccoulson, federico
<tseliot> chrisccoulson: you can also ask RAOF
<chrisccoulson> rodrigo_, is that his IRC name too? i don't see him online atm
<rodrigo_> chrisccoulson, he's doing some house moving, he told me by mail, but his mail is federico@gnome.org
<rodrigo_> he's usually 'federico' on irc
<chrisccoulson> rodrigo_, thanks. i'll drop him an e-mail and see if he has an opinion on this too
<rodrigo_> ok
<kenvandine> i have to run out for a bit... my wife's van won't start so I need to go provide some road-side assistance
<chrisccoulson> kenvandine, will that assistance involve her driving back in your motor, leaving you stranded with her van? ;)
<chrisccoulson> that's what i would expect to happen if jo was stranded somewhere :)
<kirkland> seb128: i see a couple of ecryptfs highlights above ... ecryptfs broken?
<seb128> kirkland, no, just the lightdm candidate version which had login issues with ecryptfs users again
<seb128> kirkland, but we did catch it up before release
<seb128> kirkland, robert_ancell said it's difficult to write tests for ecryptfs login in lightdm because pam sucks basically
<seb128> dobey, bug #856331 btw
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 856331 in ubuntuone-client-gnome "the gsd integration doesn't work in Oneiric" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/856331
<dobey> seb128: yeah, i saw that e-mail earlier. so we have to install real schemas somewhere now?
<seb128> dobey, yes
<dobey> boo :(
<seb128> dobey, well it's just a .xml to add to your source
<seb128> with a few makefile lines
<dobey> yeah, and new strings to be translated
<Laney> dobey: do you know if there's any progress on fixing the tomboy U1 stuff?
<Laney> there are sadly a few bugs affecting tomboy sync atm :(
<dobey> Laney: no news :-/
<seb128> dobey, who cares about gsettings key description to be translated
<Laney> what do you think?
<Laney> if it's not fixed very soon it might be best to use the standard sync auth thing?
<rodrigo_> Laney, does it work via the tomboyweb type?
<Laney> 848250 affects me too, I raised it with upstream
<Laney> rodrigo_: it at least lets you connect
<Laney> ^ that bug means I can't sync
<Laney> don't know if it affects everyone though
<seb128> Laney, can you raise https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=657180 with them as well?
<ubot2> Gnome bug 657180 in General "tomboy blocks shutdown" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<rodrigo_> Laney, syncing doesn't work for me neither, not only setting up the syncing service
<Laney> there's a problem with the sensitivity of the save button too
<seb128> that bug is ridiculous
<Laney> rodrigo already raised that one
<seb128> ok
<seb128> we should have let tomboy out of the CD for this cycle, seems like it will be really buggy for Oneiric :-(
<dobey> bug 848250
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 848250 in tomboy "Tomboy sync fails on Oneiric, New Note Template already exists" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/848250
<Laney> i suspect some small fixes will make syncing work again
<Laney> the biggest problems are in an ubuntu patch
<dobey> ah
<pitti> chrisccoulson: FYI, tkamppeter's g-s-d fix overrode your PPA version
<rodrigo_> bug 848250
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 848250 in tomboy "Tomboy sync fails on Oneiric, New Note Template already exists" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/848250
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, going to upload shortly
<chrisccoulson> just investigating another (but unrelated) display config problem
<seb128> pitti, 10v login down to 25s ;-)
<seb128> well rather closer from 23s
<seb128> the chart line is a bit weird, nautilus and compiz are done at 23s
<chrisccoulson> are we still frozen?
<didrocks> seb128: but you still have CPU activity?
<chrisccoulson> i guess we are :)
<didrocks> after that for 2s?
<Laney> we aren't unfreezing
<seb128> didrocks, I've a gap of 1.5 seconds and then zg-datahub that I had delay by 10s
<seb128> didrocks, if we delay by 15s or 20s it will be 23s I think
<mvo> hey! could one of the gtk guys quickly double check what I do wrong in http://paste.ubuntu.com/695136/  ? when I click the button it always returns a assert error and "None" for  combo.get_active_text()
<mvo> I'm pretty sure this used to work
<seb128> didrocks, it just at the wrong timing and gets picked
<didrocks> seb128: see, 20 is fine :)
<seb128> ;-)
<rodrigo_> Laney, hmm, tomboy syncing just worked for me, after restarting it
<Laney> I got some conflict message about the new note template when I first synced
<rodrigo_> Laney, yes, saw the bug, not sure why it fails there
<Laney> but I have no idea why it wants to sync that
<rodrigo_> it syncs everything afair
<Laney> nor does it show up on U1 so shouldn't be a conflict in any case
<mvo> mvo: following up with myself, Gtk.ComboBoxText() - does not work ; Gtk.ComboBoxText.new() - works fine. now I want to weep a bit
<jbicha> pitti: could you upload yelp-tools for me (it's not part of the desktop set yet)?
<pitti> jbicha: sure, where is it?
<seb128> mvo, good catch
<seb128> mvo, loving gir don't you? ;-)
<dobey> mvo: oh i have been weeping all week from gir :)
<didrocks> mvo: indeed, I took a lot of time with stupid things like that in the OneConf view, so if you see .new() sometimes, it's because the other one doesn't workâ¦
<dobey> mvo, didrocks: you guys have it easy :)
<didrocks> dobey: well, I just loved autocompletion on ipython so much while doing that! :-)
<mvo> dobey, seb128: like honestly, this is not even remotely funny, I want to switch to qt^Whtml5^Wvisual basic
<jbicha> pitti: https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/yelp-tools/ubuntu
<mvo> *ANYTHING ELSE*
<dobey> mvo: try polling an fd in a glib main lop with gir, AND having your code be backward compatible to run all the way back to lucid
<mvo> dobey: woah, WOAH!
<didrocks> mvo: visual basic, sounds interesting, the future? (or even better, vba) :-)
<dobey> mvo: hint: none of the fd polling APIs in glib/gobject/gio are actually bound in gir :)
<mvo> dobey: I had some compat code in s-c to support both old and new glib, that was already a big pita
<mvo> didrocks: I believe its more consistent â¦
 * mvo stops ranting now
<dobey> mvo: you aren't using twisted. pita doesn't even begin to describe it ;)
<pitti> mvo: does gtk_comboboxtext_new() do anything except init'ing the object and setting properties? that's what the default gobject constructor does
<didrocks> seems that the metro window 8 apps are using html5 + js
<mvo> pitti: I don't know, but that makes it pretty likely
<mvo> pitti: I mean, it appears that its doing more
<mvo> pitti: what is crazy is that I think that this worked at some point in the past, but I may be wrong
<pitti> if you just call Class(), that'll just call the GObject constructor and set any property which you pass
<pitti> which should usually work, unless the _new() C method does something on top of that
<pitti> mvo: and reading the code it just calls g_object_new() with properties
<pitti> mvo: so I'd expect that ComboboxText.new() sets id-column=1 and entry-text-column=0, while ComboboxText() just leaves these properties at their default
<pitti> mvo: ah, default of these is -1
<DBO> popey, you're such a meanie
<pitti> mvo: or is it breaking with something else? then we need to have a closer look
<popey> :D
<popey> DBO: get fired, then I'll let you in
<mvo> pitti: that sounds pretty likely that this is the crux
<seb128> pitti, do you think bug #840089 is worth oneiric notes
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 840089 in gnome-settings-daemon "doesn't convert the power options from gconf to gsettings" [Medium,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/840089
<seb128> pitti, basically upgrades to natty will have their behaviour of lid close, etc resetted
<pitti> seb128: ah, yes I think we should have that
<pitti> .. documented
<pitti> at least there's a way to configure it now
<seb128> pitti,  btw, opened bug #856475 about the nautilus issue
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 856475 in ubuntu-mono "user-desktop and desktop icons slow the desktop a lot" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/856475
<didrocks> is it me or the pad is down?
<pitti> seb128: thanks, nice catch! Updated the wiki page and linked to boot speed project
<didrocks> ah back now
<tjaalton> didrocks: unity stacking issues have been gone since using the ppa, btw
<seb128> didrocks, it tends to have issues for some time
<didrocks> tjaalton: excellent new \o/
<didrocks> news*
<seb128> pitti, thanks ;-)
<didrocks> tjaalton: should be in oneiric soon I guess, still frozen
<rodrigo_> seb128, cjwatson: wasn't gnome-contacts added to the desktop set? or was it gnome-online-accounts?
<tjaalton> didrocks: seems like the archive was unfrozen already
<rodrigo_> desrt, btw, forgot to tell you yesterday -> https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=659738
<ubot2> Gnome bug 659738 in gsettings "Need a way to tell GSettings to delay writes for rapidly changing properties" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<desrt> rodrigo_: showed up on my radar, thanks :)
<rodrigo_> desrt, ok
<didrocks> tjaalton: updates are cherry-picked rather
<didrocks> tjaalton: but not the compiz/c-p-m ones yet
<tjaalton> didrocks: ah, ok
<didrocks> tjaalton: see https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/oneiric/+queue?queue_state=1&queue_text=
<seb128> rodrigo_, it was g-o-a, g-c is in universe iirc
<rodrigo_> seb128, oh, ok
<rodrigo_> so lp:~ubuntu-desktop/gnome-contacts/ubuntu up for sponsoring
<pitti> didrocks: compiz upload refers to bug 845765; is that a bug # typo, or is it really a compiz bug? I think the former, as the changelog talks about stackign order and that bug is a crash
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 845765 in indicator-weather "indicator-weather crashed with SIGSEGV in g_array_append_vals()" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/845765
<didrocks> pitti: urgh, this is the end of the changelog that smspillaz completed, I didn't double checked, sorry about this
 * didrocks knows now that he couldn't really trust anything from compizâ¦
<chrisccoulson> pitti - after linking the ubuntu-boot-speed project to several bugs this week, i noticed that the bug supervisor is the foundations team
<chrisccoulson> they don't mind do they? ;)
<pitti> I just subscribed to all bugs in that project, too
<didrocks> pitti: can't get a similar one, it wasn't on my initial list
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I think that was Robbie; I guess they mainly read it out of interest
<chrisccoulson> pitti - ah, ok
<chrisccoulson> i'll subscribe to those too
<pitti> didrocks: ok, so just leave it like it is; the bug won't be closed then, which looks right
<didrocks> pitti: ok, let's leave it like that, thanks!
<pitti> didrocks: no problem; I just wanted to ask whether I should fix the task or so
<dobey> pitti: did you not add ubuntuone-couch also?
<pitti> dobey: uh, no; isn't that the kind of package which should rather be a dependency?
<pitti> dobey: I mainly reverted to the beta-1 situation before teh installer
<dobey> pitti: it was a recommends from deja-dup before it was changed to suggests for bug #833824
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 833824 in ubuntu-meta "Remove Ubuntu One packages from Oneiric CD" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/833824
<pitti> dobey: we didn't ship it in natty either; but if it's useful for anything, I don't mind having it, it's tiny
<didrocks> mterry mentionned it's needed IIRC
<pitti> ah
<dobey> pitti: so it is need for deja-dup integration with u1
<didrocks> maybe deja-dup should recommend it rather?
<pitti> dobey, mterry: would you mind if we'd restore that recommends instead? it sounds more correct to me, as it's also supposed to work when you install it on e. g. xubuntu
<mterry> pitti, I intend to restore the recommends as soon as beta is over.  I dropped it because of the whole installer plan
<dobey> sounds fine i guess.
<pitti> mterry: ah, nice (you can upload, btw)
<mterry> pitti, which is no longer the direction, right?
<dobey> beta is over :)
<mterry> pitti, oh!  heh, I hadn't noticed
<pitti> mterry: yes, was quite an about-face :)
<pitti> mterry: you could have upload all the time
<pitti> mterry: oneiric is frozen (and will never thaw again), so all uploads are held in unapproved anyway
<mterry> pitti, oh, OK
<pitti> mterry: we are now flushing the queue as the b2 images are final now
<dobey> pitti: care to sponsor https://code.launchpad.net/~dobey/ubuntu/oneiric/ubuntuone-file-storage-api/fix-packages/+merge/76279 ? i can't upload it anyway, regardless of the freeze. :)
<pitti> dobey: sure, doing
<dobey> thanks
<mterry> dobey, you need to get U1 package upload rights
<dobey> mterry: i need to tet a u1 package set made
<pitti> chrisccoulson: is the "stable distribution.ini" issue still on your radar? we need this by the release if we don't want to break defaults packages with each and every firefox release
<tkamppeter> pitti, I have found what makes CUPS crashing, and a workaround, not a fix.
<tkamppeter> pitti, When creating or removing a queue, the printer is (un)registered for DNS-SD broadcasting this queue and CUPS keeps in an array which queues are broadcasting. It adds the DNS-SD service name to the printer's record and then adds the record to the array, with the service name as sorting/searching criteria.
<tkamppeter> pitti, when it removes a queue, it searches the record in the array to remove it and afterwards sets the service name in the record to NULL. When creating a queue it searches the array to find the correct place for the new record, so that they keep sorted.
<tkamppeter> pitti on this array search (it does a binary search) it chokes on a record in the array where the pointer to the service name is not the start adrres of a string nor 0 (NULL), but 1 (!). I did not find out how this happened, but I can work around it by defining the array without comparison function (set it to NULL), getting an unsorted array which is searched linearly. Array size is the number of locally defined queues. Most users hav
<tkamppeter> e less than 100. Would the linear search a problem for a user with ~10000 queues?
<tkamppeter> pitti, 10000 queues would be comparing 10000 pointers would this take too long?
<seb128> pedro_, ola, thanks for sending that gconf bug upstream btw ;-)
<pitti> tkamppeter: hm, maybe report it upstream first with that analysis, perhaps Mike has a better patch quickly?
<pitti> tkamppeter: it depends on how much time it takes for each operation; if it's just a second or two in total, we could certainly do that workaround, but if it would actually need to contact the printer, it seems way too expensive
<tkamppeter> pitti, it is nothing more than a comparison of pointers, this simple loop:
<tkamppeter>     for (current = 0; current < a->num_elements; current ++)
<tkamppeter>       if (a->elements[current] == e)
<tkamppeter>       {
<tkamppeter>         diff = 0;
<tkamppeter>         break;
<tkamppeter>       }
<tkamppeter>  
<tkamppeter> where a->elements[] is the haystack and e is the needle.
<tkamppeter> pitti ^^
<pitti> tkamppeter: ah, that's simple
<pitti> tkamppeter: linear search should be fine there
<tkamppeter> binary search seems to be over-sophisticated here.
<JonOomph> While testing Ubuntu 11.10 w/ Unity2D, I noticed that when clicking on a global menu option in OpenShot (such as "New Title", or "Preferences"), a new non-modal dialog would open (as expected), but it is hidden behind the existing window.  Any thoughts or suggestions?  Thanks!
<kirkland> okay, running Unity2D ... why sometimes when I alt-tab, the icon just wiggles in the left panel?  I can't get it to actually come to the foreground with alt-tab ....
<kenvandine> kirkland, that would have something to do with focus stealing prevention in metacity
<kenvandine> not sure if we have a bug filed about it, but i know people have very different opinions on focus stealing
<kenvandine> i do think alt-tab should really raise, so it should get fixed
<kirkland> kenvandine: yeah, totally
<kenvandine> best to file a bug against unity-2d to make it try to deal with it in metacity, worse case the unity-2d guys will move it to metacity
<didrocks> yeah, maybe there is a raise on alt + tab
<rodrigo_> out for a bit, bbl
<pitti> ah, no, we still have TB meeting today
<didrocks> pitti: if you want to ack Qt just before leaving after the meetingâ¦
<tkamppeter> pitti, updated bug 855445 and tested workaround, no perceivable delays
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 855445 in cups "cupsd crashed with SIGSEGV in _cups_strcasecmp()" [Undecided,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/855445
<didrocks> ok, time for some exercice, have a good evening everyone!
<achiang> kenvandine: when you update ubuntu-wallpapers, do you update ubuntu-wallpapers-xml.in manually? or is there some trick to it that i'm missing?
<kenvandine> i did it manually
<tkamppeter> pitti, tested adding and removing 10000 queues no perceivable delays.
<pedro_> seb128, ah no problem ;-) (re gconf bug)
<seb128> does somebody want to work on bug #839407
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 839407 in gnome-utils "gnome-font-viewer missing in oneiric" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/839407
<seb128> ?
<seb128> it would basically add a binary for it (or copy what debian did)
<seb128> it's built we just don't ship in any binary
<seb128> jbicha, kenvandine, somebody else?
<kenvandine> seb128, i can take a look
<kenvandine> FYI, i just uploaded notify-osd
<seb128> kenvandine, thanks
<seb128> kenvandine, thanks ;-)
<kenvandine> had to fix a ftbfs too :)
<tkamppeter> pitti, workaround for bug 855445 committed to BZR, can you upload a new CUPS package? Thanks.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 855445 in cups "cupsd crashed with SIGSEGV in _cups_strcasecmp()" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/855445
<tkamppeter> pitti, and thanks for fixing cups-dbg.
<pitti> tkamppeter: ah, thanks; will do
<lamalex> rickspencer3, how do i get photobomb?
<lamalex> i thought it was in repos for O
<rickspencer3> lamalex, it's in my PPA
<lamalex> why isn't it just in the archive?
<jbicha> lamalex: buy it from Software Center :)
<lamalex> i'm trying!
<lamalex> the search doesn't find it
<jbicha> I think it's only for sale in Natty
<lamalex> ah
<lamalex> that's silly
 * Laney wonders how you get source for Free apps distributed in that way
<Laney> also, s-c doesn't display prices on the index?
<pitti> good night everyone!
<cyphermox> pitti: night
<chrisccoulson> seb128, thunderbird-couchdb is in source new btw ;)
<dobey> chrisccoulson: YAY!
<dobey> hrmm
<chrisccoulson> heh :)
<dobey> i wonder if i /have/ to use org.foo.bar.bz.really.long.thing.gschma.xml as filename for gsettings schemas
<dobey> makes no sense, that
<tkamppeter> pitti, thank you for uploading CUPS.
<mterry> tedg, ping about dbusmenu memory
<tedg> mterry, Yes?
<mterry> tedg, oh, hmm
<mterry> tedg, just re-acquainting myself with dbusmenuitem/gtkmenuitem interactions.  Was going to ask a question about who owns the dbusmenuitem used for dbusmenu_gtkclient_newitem_base, but I think it's eventually owned by the root member of the gtkclient?
<tedg> mterry, Yes
<dobey> seb128: good news. fixing that schema bug, i also am fixing the other bug to use gsettings instead of gconf in oneiric. do i need to do anything special to get the values migrated from gconf to gsettings, for existing users, or are they already there?
<seb128> dobey, http://developer.gnome.org/gio/stable/ch28s07.html
<seb128> dobey, basically you need to ship a .convert which has the gconf to gsettings keys mapping and it will work
<seb128> dobey, you can get lot of example in GNOME softwares that switched to gsettings
<dobey> ok, great; thanks
<dobey> ugh, gsettings doesn't have set/get_list :-/
<seb128> kenvandine, do you use gnome-contacts? there is an update rodrigo_ did that needs sponsoring if you fancy trying it and sponsoring
<seb128> cyphermox, hey
<seb128> cyphermox, there is a new evolution-data-server tarball fixing some bugs worth rolling a new tarball apparently if you want to do it
<achiang> mterry: do you know how xdg-autostart works? does it just run everything in /etc/xdg/... in alphanumeric order?
<mterry> achiang, gnome-session drives it.  It runs them in "phase" order.  desktop files can set a phase they are in
<seb128> what is xdg-autostart?
<seb128> ok, mterry is around, I will let him handle it ;-)
<mterry> :)
<chrisccoulson> yes, and you should put everything in the application phase
<mterry> achiang, there is also another directory, /usr/share/gnome/autostart
<dobey> it also checks that they are allowed to run under the environment in question
<chrisccoulson> don't put anything in the initialization phase, else we will hunt you down :)
<mterry> achiang, it also doesn't run things that have Hidden=true, things that say NotShowIn=GNOME, etc.
<seb128> chrisccoulson, should we get g-s-d out of there? ;-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, that needs to be there
<seb128> why?
<chrisccoulson> just don't add anything else to it ;)
<cyphermox> seb128: sure
<chrisccoulson> it's already slow enough
<seb128> cyphermox, thanks
<cyphermox> this is good too since I just uploaded a new gtkhtml (not that it changes much though)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, in lucid we didn't wait for gsd to be done to run the wm at least iirc
<achiang> mterry: ok, thanks. as usual, i'm doing something odd and custom
<chrisccoulson> seb128, it needs to have the theme and font stuff set up before anything else appears on screen
<achiang> chrisccoulson: ^^ so don't worry, i won't mess with upstream. :)
<seb128> cyphermox, yeah, you own us an evolution update as well ;-)
<cyphermox> yup yup, getting there
<chrisccoulson> seb128, i actually tried flattening it out this week, just to see what happened, and i ended up with unity with the wong icon theme
 * cyphermox is stabbing the fugly NM 3G mobile connection wizard bug
<chrisccoulson> and nautilus with the wrong theme too
<mterry> achiang, (if you aren't doing something time sensitive, you can also set X-GNOME-Autostart-Delay=60 or so to delay it from slowing boot
<seb128> chrisccoulson, oh I need to try that, gtk3 is supposed to pick themes correctly, like nautilus shouldn't stay grey when g-s-d get sdown and respawn during the session
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, it still happens
<seb128> chrisccoulson, did you actually check with gtk3? upstream told me during the natty cycle that it was working with it
<achiang> mterry: trying to solve a different problem; i want to know when the desktop is fully up and usable, so i'm looking for a likely process name to snoop for in a bash busy-wait loop
<seb128> bah
<achiang> mterry: unless you have a better idea. ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, (never trust what upstream says ;-)
<chrisccoulson> in any case, changing theme / fonts settings and monitor settings once there is already stuff on screen is really slow
<chrisccoulson> heh ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, btw in case we didn't mention it, no holidays for you until all the g-s-d issues are fixed in Oneiric ;-)
<chrisccoulson> lol
<chrisccoulson> my last day is tomorrow ;)
<chrisccoulson> seriously though, i'll be around at the start of next week
<chrisccoulson> we don't go on holiday until friday
<chrisccoulson> then it'll be no interweb for a week
<mterry> achiang, you mean, when all the autostart files have been processed?  looking into gnome-session is your best bet.  I don't *think* it sends out a useful dbus event or anything by that time.
<mterry> achiang, or just set an autostart delay of 0 or 1?
<achiang> mterry: hm. ok
<chrisccoulson> mterry, we've had this discussion before, when xsplash was conceived
<chrisccoulson> and there isn't really a reliable way to do that atm
<chrisccoulson> ie, i think gnome-session will tell you once it has started everything in the Application phase
<chrisccoulson> but that doesn't really tell you whether the desktop is loaded
<kenvandine> seb128, i can sponsor gnome-contacts
<achiang> chrisccoulson: what i'm doing now is this:
<achiang> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/695273/
<seb128> chrisccoulson, heh, joke aside don't work even next week!
<seb128> chrisccoulson, you really deserve some time off work ;-)
<achiang> we launch gdm in the background, and then look for indicator-datetime startup... once it's up, then we exit the script
<seb128> chrisccoulson, enjoy your holidays and be back for UDS ;-)
<chrisccoulson> heh, thanks :)
<achiang> we have gdm set to auto-login
<achiang> mterry: ^^
<chrisccoulson> achiang, i guess that would work. i wish we had a better way of doing it though :)
<chrisccoulson> i'm not sure there is really a good way to tell when the desktop is really loaded and ready to use though :(
<seb128> you could maybe try to monitor cpu and stop after 3 seconds under 50% or something
<achiang> seb128: not a good heuristic, because we're actually inside a chroot
<achiang> :)
<jbicha> kenvandine: are you able to sponsor yelp-tools for me also?
<seb128> jbicha, did you email cjwatson about having it added to the desktop set?
<seb128> achiang, ok, well the way usplash was working or bootchart is doing its line is to check what is usually the slowest process and to wait for it to be done
<seb128> achiang, we patched nautilus by then to send a dbus signal to say it was done with loading
<achiang> seb128: hm, but the nautilus patch has been dropped?
<mterry> achiang, there are probably also dbus names you could wait for?  com.canonical.Unity, com.canonical.Unity.Panel...  but not sure that's any better than watching for datetime
<seb128> yes because we stopped using xsplash
<achiang> seb128: do you know what era that was, so i know about when to go looking?
<chrisccoulson> jaunty/karmic wasn't it?
<chrisccoulson> IIRC ;)
<seb128> achiang, karmic
<seb128> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/30103945/nautilus_1%3A2.27.4-0ubuntu5_1%3A2.27.4-0ubuntu6.diff.gz
<achiang> ok, i'll play around with my hacky technique, and if need be, i'll go do some code archaeology. :)
<achiang> seb128: awesome, thanks!
<seb128> yw
<achiang> except... won't nautilus finish loading before the indicators?
<jbicha> seb128: yes but perhaps he's been busy or it get lost in his inbox
<seb128> there were some iteration over the patch so maybe take the karmic stable version to get the "current" version of it
<seb128> jbicha, yeah, no worry about the "no reply yet" I just wanted to make sure it's tracked
<kenvandine> jbicha, sure... where is the branch?
<seb128> achiang, what will be loaded first...do a bootchart on your config
<achiang> seb128: right, sounds good. thanks
<seb128> when we did that gnome-panel and nautilus were the slowest
 * achiang gets it now
<seb128> we got both to emit a signal and xsplash to wait on those or timeout
<jbicha> kenvandine: https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/yelp-tools/ubuntu
<kenvandine> jbicha, great, i'll do it in a bit
<seb128> jbicha, btw I need to discuss with ricotz and you and maybe others
<seb128> jbicha, it would be nice to see an desktop-extras set for things in universe, i.e gnome-shell
<seb128> jbicha, but somebody needs to build the list of what would be in that set ;-)
<seb128> jbicha, I figured you and ricotz might be interested
<jbicha> seb128: yes, it's a bit tricky figuring out what its scope should be
<seb128> jbicha, well there is an easy "starting" set
<jbicha> anything in GNOME not in main?
<seb128> i.e gnome-shell, anjuta, epiphany-browser,...
<seb128> cheese, gda, gdl
<seb128> etc
<seb128> but yeah, everything GNOMish not in the desktop set
<seb128> then we can discuss random "side softwares"
<jbicha> ok, I'll work on a proposed list
<seb128> jbicha, thanks!
<seb128> jbicha, no hurry, it will be for next cycle most likely, but still would be nice to get that rolling ;-)
<seb128> jbicha, ricotz seemed interested as well
<seb128> the idea is to have a team who can maintain at least the gnome-shell by their own
<kenvandine> jbicha, sponsored
<seb128> kenvandine, btw did you see the gwibber bug I assigned you yesterday?
<seb128> kenvandine, micahg seemed to thing it was a frequent issue for users
<seb128> kenvandine, oh, welcome back btw ;-)
<kenvandine> seb128, no... it isn't in my assigned mailbox... bug number?
<seb128> kenvandine, it has to be! checking
<kenvandine> it probably matched some gwibber rule before the assigned run in my procmailrc
<kenvandine> i should make sure i get that ordered right... :)
 * kenvandine hates email :-p
<seb128> kenvandine, no, it's private so it's not emailed
<seb128> kenvandine, bug #845374
<kenvandine> ah
<kenvandine> i don't think that will affect upgraders, but clearly I need to handle that better
<seb128> kenvandine, ok, I don't understand the issue but the dup count seemed low enough that I didn't consider a frequent issue
<kenvandine> i suspect it is failing to create the path to store the avatar in
<kenvandine> it should handle the exception gracefully
<kenvandine> i'll take care of it, thx!
 * dupondje is really missing an option to delete wireless accounts in Gnome
<seb128> kenvandine, thank you
<dobey> hrmm, will have to finish this branch up in the morning; doesn't build on oneiric :-/
<jasoncwarner_> what up everyone...how are things?
<cyphermox> not bad, not bad
<cyphermox> I managed to fix up the retardedness in the mobile broadband wizard, after a few hours prodding at it :)
<jasoncwarner_> cyphermox: nice...
<jasoncwarner_> how about that bug that rick was having with atheros? the one where his wifi dropped every 30 minutes or so?
<bryceh> hi jasoncwarner_
<jasoncwarner_> hey bryceh
<jasoncwarner_> bryceh: you see my email on multi-monitor bugs? want to unblock dx soon so we can get those sorted ... when you've taken a look, let me know what you think
<seb128> hey jasoncwarner_
<bryceh> jasoncwarner_, yep, read the email
<cyphermox> d'oh, fail. I apparently busted my transfer limit here.
<jasoncwarner_> I'm pretty sure seb128  should be sleeping...I hope didrocks is sleeping
<bryceh> jasoncwarner_, do you remember a couple sprints ago when we first evaluated Unity?
<bryceh> jasoncwarner_, RAOF and I put it on our laptops and connected up to the projector
<cyphermox> bryceh: jasoncwarner_: multi-monitor; anything I can help testing?
<jasoncwarner_> cyphermox: I'll foward email
<cyphermox> ok
<bryceh> jasoncwarner_, at that time we noticed some fairly bad breakages with multimonitor under unity which weren't present with gnome
<mterry> smspillaz, heyo.  with the new compiz in the archive, I just got the "dash behind other windows" issue
<bryceh> jasoncwarner_, Sam was in the desktop room and RAOF and I (and I think you?) chatted with him about the multimonitor troubles we'd seen
<bryceh> at that time we learned that compiz (I think) had it's own multimonitor handling code
<bryceh> jasoncwarner_, raof and I suggested they look at the gnome-desktop multimonitor logic, because the GNOME guys had already gone through painstakingly debugging MM support over the past couple years
<bryceh> jasoncwarner_, you took us into the DX room and we went through all these problems with them; pretty sure we even wrote them on flip charts :-)
<jasoncwarner_> :)
<jasoncwarner_> bryceh: so, what you are telling me is that dx should already know all this?
<bryceh> jasoncwarner_, well, trying to say we're not (intentionally) blocking Dx.  It's our impression these are not xorg bugs, but rather issues in compiz' multimonitor logic.
<jasoncwarner_> ok...I'm going to reply to the thread and include you guys. sounds like we all need to get in a room really quickly and figure out what game plan to finish 'em is going to be...
<jasoncwarner_> thanks
<RAOF> Yeah.  I'd looked at those bugs, and while it's possible the nvidia one is an driver bug, I'm pretty certain the intel one is not.
<bryceh> jasoncwarner_, sure.  Fwiw, the bug reports you forwarded look like were already looked at from the X side and determined not to be X bugs
<bryceh> RAOF, ^ am I remembering things properly?  You may have had additional contact with the compiz folks about dual head configuration?
<jasoncwarner_> bryceh RAOF ok....
<RAOF> bryceh: Other than bitching to them occasionally, not really.
<bryceh> jasoncwarner_, I can explain what's going on with bug #830949 in more detail
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 830949 in xserver-xorg-video-intel "[Intel N10 Graphics] Plugging in external monitor to VGA port makes both displays corrupted with thick slanted lines " [Critical,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/830949
<jasoncwarner_> that woudl be great...I think more explanation on those would help this along...
<bryceh> sure
<RAOF> I no longer use two monitors day-to-day, but before I switched to the standing desk I was, and Unity was playing nicely on my hardware.
<chrisccoulson> multimonitor support is working pretty nice in 2d :)
<bryceh> jasoncwarner_, the hardware is capable of running multiple monitors at some large total resolution.  the hardware is also able to render 3D to a certain size buffer
<bryceh> on some hardware, the 3D buffer size is less than the total resolution size it can map.
<RAOF> That's true of most hardware, in fact, although users will rarely hit it.
<cyphermox> bryceh: if it helps I can test a bunch of laptops in the Montreal lab tomorrow for multi-monitor
<jasoncwarner_> FYI...for those interested, these are the bugs we are discussing
<jasoncwarner_> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/compiz/+bug/830949
<jasoncwarner_> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/813343
<jasoncwarner_> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/compiz/+bug/830949
<jasoncwarner_> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/813343
<jasoncwarner_> https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/815613
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 830949 in xserver-xorg-video-intel "[Intel N10 Graphics] Plugging in external monitor to VGA port makes both displays corrupted with thick slanted lines " [Critical,Invalid]
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 813343 in unity "nvidia drivers, second monitor covered by black" [High,Confirmed]
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 815613 in unity "[intel] When I plug in a second monitor, I get a black bar across the top of my screen and the second monitor is black except for the bar at the top." [High,Confirmed]
<cyphermox> not sure how much this will be useful and fixable so late though :)
<bryceh> jasoncwarner_, btw those are just 3 bugs (you have two that are the same bugs)
<jasoncwarner_> bryceh: awesome, you guys already "fixed" two bugs ;)
<bryceh> cyphermox, yeah, of course more testing can't hurt but I think the issues are understood it's more of an analysis/debugging problem now; needs someone conversant in compiz internals I  think
<cyphermox> alright
<RAOF> I think that bug 815613 is unity failing to set the output viewport correctly.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 815613 in unity "[intel] When I plug in a second monitor, I get a black bar across the top of my screen and the second monitor is black except for the bar at the top." [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/815613
<cyphermox> in general I recall it working pretty well on my system in the office, but it's always intell graphics
<RAOF> That looks like what unity used to consistently do for me, but I fixed some of it and the rest got fixed.
<cyphermox> and like RAOF my hardware tends to be magical
<RAOF> cyphermox: Some of my hardware seems to have lost it's shine; compiz just crashed when I enabled the second monitor :)
<cyphermox> RAOF: plus don't you have one system that crashes on wifi or somethign?
<bryceh> jasoncwarner_, I do like that dbarth is estimating that 80% of Dx's troubles are because of xorg.  We get the blame for a lot of non-Xorg problems, but we've never been thrown under the bus quite that forcefully before.  ;-)
<RAOF> cyphermox: Yeah, that's this system ;)
<cyphermox> fun. if you tell me what it is I might have the same card somewhere or the same laptop model
<cyphermox> seems like I'm traveling to the office tomorrow :)
<RAOF> Dell e6420
<RAOF> Network controller: Broadcom Corporation BCM4313 802.11b/g/n
<cyphermox> like the one that was broken forever in Maverick and maybe natty too?
<RAOF> It worked in natty for a while.
<jasoncwarner_> hey cyphermox I didn't see if you responded about rick's wifi bug..the atheros one?
<cyphermox> ie with bad KMS issues?
<cyphermox> jasoncwarner_: I did
<cyphermox> really weird issue, it dies because of "inactivity"
<RAOF> It would lock up at the drop of a hat in the early oneiric cycle; it's stable now.
<bryceh> cyphermox, btw for testing multimonitor a couple things that tend to surface bugs - rotate one or both displays 90 degrees, disable/reenable one display, boot with monitor A and hotplug monitor B where B's resolution is much greater than A's.
<cyphermox> bryceh: that's fun, common cases too
<cyphermox> maybe not rotationing displays, but higher resolutions on external
<cyphermox> does the type of output change much?
<bryceh> cyphermox, if you're doing automated testing or just want some shortcuts, I've put some scripts into xdiagnose/data/workloads that do some of these things
<cyphermox> we can test VGA, DVI, DP, and with some advance notice, HDMI
<cyphermox> ok
<bryceh> yes DP and HDMI often tend to have unique bugs
<RAOF> cyphermox: Got some HDMI with audio sinks?
<cyphermox> RAOF: I do
<bryceh> DVI seems to be pretty well debugged by now
<cyphermox> I bought two screens when I was in QA -- one Dell with HDMI vga and dvi, with speakers, and one pro model also from dell with vga, dvi and dp
<bryceh> cyphermox, one issue we've been seeing recently is a ~1-sec lag when probing outputs (such as when running xrandr)
<RAOF> HDMI ? audio should shake out some bugs.
<cyphermox> the pro model rotates and is a really nice screen :)
<cyphermox> bryceh: as in xrandr blocking for a second?
 * RAOF loves his ultrasharp 24"
<bryceh> cyphermox, right
<RAOF> Oooh, which rotates!
<cyphermox> I can look up the price. both monitors went for under 500 :)
<cyphermox> (together)
 * RAOF would need to seriously rearrange his desk to fit another monitor on.
<RAOF> And I don't think any of my decent hardware can reasonably drive two external displays :(
<cyphermox> I had a nice two monitor setup until my gf decided I had to reconnect her tower :)
<cyphermox> bbl
 * RAOF reboots to finish update before reporting more compiz bugs.
<broder> did smspillaz ever pick up the patch to catch RRChangeNotify events?
<bryceh> broder, good question
<bryceh> smspillaz?
<DBO> broder, what patch?
<Sweetshark> Hi all. I have a question about bug status handling: Could somebody have a look at https://bugs.launchpad.net/df-libreoffice/+bug/745836/comments/51 and give me an opinion/judgement before that escalates into a bug-state-war? (asking here because ubuntu-bugs is silent)
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 745836 in libreoffice "soffice.bin crashed with SIGSEGV in cppu::throwException()" [High,Confirmed]
<broder> DBO: http://lists.compiz.org/pipermail/dev/2011-March/001443.html
<broder> sam had some comments about not responding to both randr events and configurenotify events, but that's a pretty straightforward change
<broder> (swallow the configurenotify on the root window if priv->randrExtension)
<DBO> broder, the patch is not merged
<DBO> I'll ask sam about it
<DBO> and if he has no good objections
<DBO> we'll merge it
<jasoncwarner_> hey bryceh RAOF and cyphermox , I am going to close my stuff for a bit to get through some TODOs. I'll be back online a bit later to catch up on what you think of those bugs...thanks!
<RAOF> Catch you later!~
<jbicha> I've been annoyed by bug 856884 for a long time but I didn't know what was breaking it
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 856884 in unity "Running unity --reset breaks metacity keyboard shortcut defaults" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/856884
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-09-23
<DBO> sooo I need another release of bamf
<DBO> yay
<RAOF> DBO:  Do you test external monitor support on netbooks?  How much of a performance penalty is going over the max gl texture size expected to exact?
<RAOF> Because today's empyrical testing suggests the answer is "at least one order of magnitude" :)
<DBO> RAOF, going over the max gl texture size should just break it
<DBO> period
<DBO> it shouldn't run
<RAOF> Well, then!  Rejoice!  It runs.
<DBO> how?
<RAOF> At roughly 30seconds per frame, but it runs.
<DBO> seriously how?
<RAOF> Dunno.  Any way for me to get unity to tell me?
<DBO> Im baffled
<DBO> you sure glxinfo says you exceeded it?
<RAOF> It complains a bunch about windows unmappable to textures, but displays everything correctly.
<RAOF> GL_MAX_TEXTURE_SIZE= 2048, a 1920x1200 monitor + a 1024x600 monitor.  Stacked one above the other it works fast, stacked one next to the other it's interestingly slow.
<DBO> RAOF, it must be falling back to copy mode
<DBO> which is SLOW
<DBO> so yes
<DBO> exceeding max texture size is bad
<DBO> very bad
<RAOF> Yes.
<DBO> is your desktop rendering?
<RAOF> I'm not sure, let me check...
<RAOF> (I'm obviously not IRCing on the netbook, or you'd see a 1 minute latency on anything I typed :))
<DBO> RAOF, you have dual monitors set up?
<DBO> lp:~unity-team/unity/unity.alt-tab-follow-monitor
<DBO> can you confirm that branch makes alt-tab follow monitors for you
<DBO> I am concerned it wont work right on xrandr systems
<Sarvatt> RAOF: whys that a surprise? 1900 pixels < 2048, 2944 > 2048. meanwhile 8 year old netbook gpu's suck but they are supposed to be certified with ubuntu
<DBO> having australians in the company is incredibly helpful
<DBO> I can force them to test my work when my coworkers are off hours
<RAOF> Sarvatt: I'm surprised that it *works*
<RAOF> Or, rather, works at all.
<RAOF> "Works" might be overselling it somewhat.
<DBO> RAOF, seriously though, can you confirm the fix on xrandr systems?
<Sarvatt> yeah i915 started falling back to unaccelerated mid maverick
<DBO> (I only got nvidia)
<RAOF> Yeah, I will.
<DBO> Sarvatt, is that it?
<DBO> its using software rendering
<Sarvatt> you can get 4096x4096 but anything over 2048x2048 is completely unaccelerated
<Sarvatt> too slow to be usable :(
<DBO> Sarvatt, does that apply to ATI as well?
<RAOF> Especially on the poor little atom netbook.
<Sarvatt> nope depending on how far back you're going
<Sarvatt> the atom gpu's are 8 years old
<Sarvatt> i mean like r500+ can do 4096x4096 fine
<DBO> no I mean
<Sarvatt> anything in the past 5-6 years is fine
<DBO> do they have a "fallback" size
<Sarvatt> not that i know of
<DBO> okay
<DBO> ATI HD2600 is getting similar crap performance reports
<DBO> with dual monitor
<DBO> fglrx is fast with it
<Sarvatt> thats really odd outside of ati being slow with web browser scrolling in general because of EXA, they dont have anything like intels gen3 unaccelerated once you go past 2048x2048 that i know of
<DBO> I am going to get more feedback on it today from the reporter
<DBO> but we shall see
<RAOF> DBO: Does that branch require a newer nux?
<DBO> RAOF, yes
<Sarvatt> the alternative on intel was not working at all >2048x2048 like lucid and before, 4096x4096 works on the netbooks with a 2D session at least acceptably.. we have a crapload of machines that cant be certified with ubuntu because compiz works like crap with an external monitor plugged in with gnome defaulting to rightof even though its a hardware limitation and would work ok above or below
<DBO> I am thinking of methods of rendering it top/bottom
<DBO> but having the layout be left/right
<DBO> Im not sure its possible sadly
<RAOF> DBO: I just need to pull nux trunk?
<DBO> RAOF, yes
<DBO> once desktop team told us so long as old unity works on newer nux, and it doesn't matter if newer unity doesn't work on older nux
<DBO> a whole new world of fucking around opened up
<RAOF> Sweet.  A whole new world of C++ compiling opens up.
<DBO> YEP!
<RAOF> Man, I hope that core is retracable.  32 frames of ?? leading into HandleEvent.
<DBO> wewt
<Sarvatt> RAOF: incoming http://sarvatt.com/downloads/gdb.txt
<DBO> Sarvatt, how did you do that?
<DBO> Sarvatt, that is REALLY old?
<Sarvatt> yeah REALLY old
 * smspillaz only sees capital letters
<smspillaz> Sarvatt: we have a plugin to get around the max texture size limitations
<smspillaz> Sarvatt: it's called 'Copy To Texture'
<DBO> mesa kinda does that for you now smspillaz
<smspillaz> DBO: realy ?
<DBO> on intel yeah
<RAOF> For sufficiently loose values of ?kinda?.
<DBO> yes
<smspillaz> DBO: it creates multiple textures with correclty offset tex-coord matrices and vertex lists ?
<smspillaz> errrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr
 * smspillaz thinks that functionality is on the wrong layer
<DBO> it boosts the max texture size from 2048 to 4096
<desrt> smspillaz: weird.  your comment reminded me of a random half-dream thought i had while waking up this morning
<DBO> at the cost of performance
<smspillaz> DBO: ok, that's not a real solution
<Sarvatt> sorry that was just an example of me going, how much bigger could this possibly get once i get debug symbols installed? and having it be 2.8mb of repeating info a long time ago :)
<desrt> smspillaz: which is that the UN classified capslock as a crime against humanity
<RAOF> No.  It falls back to software rendering, providing an astounding 30 sec/frame performance.
<smspillaz> desrt: +1
<DBO> desrt, +1
<smspillaz> DBO: ok, I don't call that 'mesa doing it for you'
<RAOF> Bah!
<DBO> smspillaz, I only mean to say, it doesn't crash
<smspillaz> DBO: I call that 'don't ever let mesa do that'
<smspillaz> DBO: it didn't crash before
<smspillaz> DBO: you just get a white texture
<smspillaz> or rather
<smspillaz> you don't get a texture at all
<RAOF> DBO: I think that ?works? on my xrandr system.  Is it really meant to pop up the alt-tab switcher on the display with currently focused window?
<DBO> well now you do
<smspillaz> it only crashed because we had a distro patch which would assert and fall back to metacity whenever a texture failed to bind
<DBO> RAOF, or where you mouse is kind of yes
<smspillaz> DBO: it doesn't crash, I tried it just now
<DBO> RAOF, its supposed to follow your workflow in general yeah...
<smspillaz> DBO: make a test app that creates a 10,000x10,0000 window
<smspillaz> it won't crash
<DBO> smspillaz, cheeze it
<smspillaz> DBO: ???
<smspillaz> RAOF: DBO: Sarvatt: in any case, we should enable copytex by default. There's not reason not to have it and it only kicks in whenever tfp fails
<Sarvatt> slow > white texture, but its still not usable and quite a lot of netbooks aren't getting shipped with ubuntu because of it. almost wish falling back to metacity was still an option because that would have passed certification :)
<smspillaz> why not just enable copytex ?
<smspillaz> it's much faster than software mode and you don't get white textures
<RAOF> DBO: In that case, it doesn't seem to work.  It seems to pop up on the display with the currently focused window, and I find that pretty awkward.
<smspillaz> the only thing is that if you create huge windows they will get nontransparent decorations
<RAOF> DBO: Is there any way that you could just pop it up on *all* connected displays?
<smspillaz> and support for window-based decorations is a little flaky at the moment
<DBO> RAOF, how would you prefer it to work other than what you just said
<Sarvatt> is that done automatically? as it is now if you plug in an external monitor in unity its "unusably" slow according to the people doing the certification
<smspillaz> but with P it should be better
<smspillaz> Sarvatt: no, at the moment it probably just falls back to software mode
<RAOF> DBO: I'd prefer it to appear on the display the mouse is on; that's generally where my focus is.
<DBO> smspillaz, how do I get the display where the mouse is in compiz?
<smspillaz> DBO: screen->outputForPoint (CompPoint (pointerX, pointerY));
<smspillaz> or something like that
<smspillaz> RAOF: the old alt-tab did it based on what window currently has focus
<DBO> so I have to first query the mouse position
<smspillaz> DBO: no, you don't
<RAOF> smspillaz: And I hated that, too :)
<smspillaz> it will be updated enough to guaruntee that its in the right spot
<smspillaz> DBO: it updates every time you enter a window
<smspillaz> RAOF: IMO, having it where the cursor is doesn't make much sense. maybe it should be based on timestamps
<smspillaz> eg, when you move the cursor, its timestamp is the most up to date the cursor takes priority
<RAOF> Frankly, I think it should be on *all* connected displays.
<RAOF> It's a desktop-wide action.
<smspillaz> otherwise the thing with the last updated  _NET_USER_TIME takes priority
<RAOF> That would also work, yes.
<RAOF> Probably.
<RAOF> :)
<DBO> RAOF, hold on a moment
<smspillaz> RAOF: the context switch is already massive enough when you hit alt-tab since the thing is huge
<DBO> RAOF, okay pull
<RAOF> :(.  A retraced backtrace nets us exactly 3/68 frames that aren't ??
 * smspillaz goes back to his uni assignment
<smspillaz> due in ..... 6 hours
<DBO> RAOF, once you test and confirm it works for you
<DBO> please leave a comment here https://code.launchpad.net/~unity-team/unity/unity.alt-tab-follow-monitor/+merge/76667
<RAOF> Just an "it works"?
<DBO> yes
<DBO> provided
<DBO> it works
<RAOF> Ah!  *That's* what the assert is.compiz: /usr/include/boost/smart_ptr/shared_ptr.hpp:418: T* boost::shared_ptr<T>::operator->() const [with T = UnityFBO]: Assertion `px != 0' failed.
<smspillaz> RAOF: backtrace ?
<RAOF> smspillaz: I'll try to get you one that's not 63 frames of ??
<RAOF> DBO: Comment left.
<DBO> RAOF, sexellent
<DBO> brb
<DBO> smspillaz, wanna +1 the review (its free karma)
<smspillaz> done
<smspillaz> gosh
<smspillaz> it seems like subscribing to the wayland mailing list you get the same flamewars again and again and again
<smspillaz> Client Side * sucks!
<smspillaz> No it doesn't!
<smspillaz> Yes it does!@
<smspillaz> X sucks!
<smspillaz> Yeah X sucks!
<DBO> join a different side each time
<smspillaz> So lets Client Side *!
<smspillaz> No!
<smspillaz> DBO: its gotten to the point of
<smspillaz> every single time someone makes a wild assertion
<smspillaz> I have to put "disclaimer, I don't claim that this is better, but this is *actually* the way * works"
<RAOF> The thing that I don't get in the CSD flamewars is that X *in no way* mandates server-side decorations.
<bryceh> boo flamers
<bryceh> need a procmail rule that only passes through emails from people whose address actually appears in the wayland git tree
<smspillaz> RAOF: indeed, except that people in the 90s very quickly realized that doing them server side was the only way to Stop The Madness [tm]
<smspillaz> of course, doing them server side created more madness
<smspillaz> arguable server side decorations is the whole reason why we have the entire ICCCM Section 4 today
<smspillaz> RAOF: bryceh oh, I was going to ask you
<smspillaz> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/compiz/+bug/856043
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 856043 in compiz "compiz crashed with SIGSEGV in _XFreeEventCookies() (dup-of: 851472)" [Undecided,New]
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 851472 in compiz "compiz crashed with SIGSEGV in _XFreeEventCookies()" [Critical,Confirmed]
<smspillaz> we seem to be getting a lot of those
<smspillaz> and the crash happens when we call XNextEvent
<jbicha> free cookies! :)
<DBO> I hope they are thin mints
<smspillaz> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/compiz/+bug/851472
<bryceh> hmm
<smspillaz>  _XFreeEventCookies (dpy=0x855810) at ../../src/XlibInt.c:780
<smspillaz>  XNextEvent (dpy=0x855810, event=0x7fffa408d510) at ../../src/NextEvent.c:47
<smspillaz>  PrivateScreen::processEvents (this=0x8404a0) at /build/buildd/compiz-0.9.5.94+bzr2803/src/screen.cpp:636
<smspillaz> I haven't been able to reproduce this particular one myself yet
<smspillaz> but if someone's been able to reproduce that I can single-step through Xlib
<DBO> smspillaz, do we know when this first started happening?
<smspillaz> September 18
<bryceh> xtrace might tell what's going on with X
<bryceh> bbl
<broder> RAOF: does it make sense for there to be a "does anybody have a problem if i set the resolution to this?" "yes, i have a problem if you set the resolution to this!" protocol?
<broder> to avoid some of these texture size issues?
<RAOF> I don't know.  It sounds moderately complicated.
<RAOF> And it's fundamentally still a work-around; compositors *can* handle those resolutions, but don't.
<broder> but they can't handle them well
<broder> i'd rather not have gnome-desktop extend the external display i plug into my dinky, 8-year-old netbook if it's going to cause my performance to suck
<broder> i would be similar to QueryEndSession/EndSession in gnome-session
<broder> *it
<RAOF> Well, there's no reason for your performance to suck; it's possible for the compositor to break the textures up into <= max texture size chunks.  We just don't have that enabled or tested.
<smspillaz> RAOF: you only have to enable one plugin ...
<smspillaz> and I've tested it
<smspillaz> it works fine
<smspillaz> RAOF: the only case it won't work right now is because we redirect paint into an fbo for unity
<smspillaz> and this is not broken up
<RAOF> Yeah, but "you testing it" is not the same as "tested on all the many and varied crazy hardware that Ubuntu runs on".
<smspillaz> it should work the same everywhere
<smspillaz> next cycle then
<RAOF> We should totally enable that out of the gate in P.
<RAOF> Well, and make sure that Unity works with it, too ?
<smspillaz> RAOF: we need a framebuffer object implementation that supports buffers > max texture size
<smspillaz> really, the only way I see this working is if I re-wrote the paint system
<smspillaz> and made it so that buffers were inserted at points
<smspillaz> so that they can control if, eg, a window must be painted multiple times
<smspillaz> I plan to do that anyways, but probably not for P
<smspillaz> what will likely end up happening is that some applications is going to misbehave once again and screw up stacking
<smspillaz> and then there is going to be a huge emergency where everyone blame me for their problems again
<smspillaz> and I end up being a social outcast etc etc etc
<smspillaz> and then don't get to work on making the paint system awesome
<smspillaz> "c'est la vie"
<RAOF> The life of a window manager author.
<RAOF> Alright.  Now that I've got debugging symbols for everything under the sun, let's see if I can't get a useful backtrace out of that xrandr crash.
<lifeless> heh
<lifeless> gl
<lifeless> RAOF: btw
<lifeless> RAOF: someone commented on my adding of xrandr to xvfb, that it has regressed in oneiric; did someone drop all the patches perhaps ?
<jasoncwarner_> hey...anyone having sound problems lately? my seems to "go away" and I have to reboot to get it back.
<TheMuso> jasoncwarner_: What do you mean by go away?
<jbicha> is file-roller broken for y'all also? when I enter a subfolder and return to the previous folder, the folders start multiplying
<TheMuso> Bearing in mind that I use audio all day, and haven't had a problem.
<jasoncwarner_> TheMuso: one minute sound is working and then, not there hte next
<jasoncwarner_> haven't noticed exactly when it goes away
<TheMuso> jasoncwarner_: Is it reliably reproduceable?
<jasoncwarner_> but all indications are that it is working except there is no sound
<jasoncwarner_> TheMuso: don't know how to do it exactly, still looking
<TheMuso> Ok, I'd check dmesg and syslog when it happens.
<jbicha> http://img29.imageshack.us/img29/2576/sharedcolortargets0010p.png
<TheMuso> And if you can come up with a reliable way of reproducing, please file a bug, and follow the steps at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PulseAudio/Log.
<RAOF> lifeless: Looks like that did indeed get dropped.
<lifeless> RAOF: what should I do ?
<RAOF> I think we might want to evaluate whether xvfb is the best tool for what we're after; it's basically just a headless environment to run tests in, yes?
<lifeless> yes, used by various dx projects and lp
<lifeless> I know upstream are insane and not taking patches
<RAOF> One of the things in a talk at XDC was a desire to remove everything but the xfree86 DDX, on the basis that it actually does everything all the others do too.
<RAOF> Can we run a regular xfree86 server, loading the dummy video and dummy input drivers?
<lifeless> if you wrap it in xvfb-run, we can do anything you want
<lifeless> at this point, *AFAIK*, the screen-capture aspect of xvfb-run is not used by 'us'
<lifeless> *xvfb-run-or-similar*
<RAOF> Ok.  So, I think the answer there is that I should work out how to make that happen.
<lifeless> ok
<lifeless> with bated breath I wait
<RAOF> DBO: Are you in the market for a compiz backtrace?
<RAOF> Mmm, overloaded operator ->
<smspillaz> RAOF: DBO is asleep. send it this way
<RAOF> smspillaz: http://paste.ubuntu.com/695462/
<RAOF> It seems that it's possible for paintOutput to be called after Refresh () and before Relayout() has had a chance to actually set up the fbos for the output.
<RAOF> With hilarious consequences!
<didrocks> good morning
<smspillaz> RAOF: that's a fun race condition
<RAOF> Indeed.
<RAOF> Good morning didrocks
<smspillaz> we should probably only trash the fbos on Relayout then
<RAOF> Ah, but what about hotplug?
<didrocks> hey RAOF, how are you?
<smspillaz> hi didrocks
<RAOF> It's not so much that you've trashed the fbo.  The fbo hasn't yet been set up! :)
<smspillaz> RAOF: relayout will get called
<smspillaz> oh
<smspillaz> right
<smspillaz> yeah, because we're waiting on gtk to give us the new monitor geometry rather than compiz
<smspillaz> (why does it even work like that)
<smspillaz> RAOF: I think I'm going to start implementing an iron fist approach on unityshell
<smspillaz> if you're a plugin start acting like one etc etc
<didrocks> hey smspillaz
<smspillaz> RAOF: ok, we'll find out in the 20 minutes this takes to build if this actually works
<RAOF> smspillaz: Got a branch you'd like me to test?
<smspillaz> kompiling
<jasoncwarner_> smspillaz is awake! yay...
<jasoncwarner_> smspillaz, I want to get a call about multi-monitor stuff with dbarth, RAOF and anyone else interested in fixing these bugs.
<jasoncwarner_> smspillaz RAOF https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/compiz/+bug/830949
<jasoncwarner_> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/813343
<jasoncwarner_> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/compiz/+bug/830949
<jasoncwarner_> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/813343
<jasoncwarner_> https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/815613
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 830949 in xserver-xorg-video-intel "[Intel N10 Graphics] Plugging in external monitor to VGA port makes both displays corrupted with thick slanted lines " [Critical,Invalid]
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 813343 in unity "nvidia drivers, second monitor covered by black" [High,Confirmed]
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 815613 in unity "[intel] When I plug in a second monitor, I get a black bar across the top of my screen and the second monitor is black except for the bar at the top." [High,Confirmed]
<RAOF> At least for intel I've half-confirmed that bug.  It doesn't crash for me in the way described, but it does become unusably slow.
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF: any idea on fix, by chance? I know I only gave this to you guys like 8 hours ago....
<RAOF> "Don't do that"
<RAOF> Well, don't do that for now.  For P try and ensure that compiz can shatter its textures/fbos.
<RAOF> As smspillaz will undoubtedly chime in to say, compiz itself will handle that situation nicely, it just requires enabling a plugin.  Unity however has slightly higher demands.
<RAOF> We *used* to crash out and start metacity instead, but that's not exactly a winner when running Unity. :)
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF & smspillaz options for O, though? what can we do to make compiz/unity not, you know, completely barf in the multi-mon situation
<RAOF> Well, it's only really an issue for netbooks.
<RAOF> Now, if only netbooks weren't a focus area... :)
<RAOF> By and large multi-monitor works just fine.  Modulo some bugs - smspillaz, how's that build going?
<RAOF> jasoncwarner_: Probably the best thing to do for O would be to patch gnome-settings-daemon to not set up the displays in such a way that it breaks.
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF: what kind of patch? like, what we g-s-d do? now allow certain resolution monitor configs?
<RAOF> Exactly.=
<RAOF> Refuse to automatically configure a desktop with a dimension > max texture size, and throw up a big warning for manual setting of that.
<didrocks> jasoncwarner_: RAOF: I would tend to thing, we should to that in the display monitor capplet
<didrocks> jasoncwarner_: RAOF: and same, if you use the nvidia blob driver, prevent it's usage
<didrocks> the results if you do so are quiteâ¦ interesting :)
<RAOF> What happens with the blob?
<RAOF> Does unity not notice the hotplug or something?
<RAOF> didrocks: Anyway, it has to be done in g-s-d rather than the capplet because g-s-d's xrandr plugin will automatically set up a new display on hotplug.
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF: can we get that information (dimension > max texture size ) and basically say 'this computer can handle these resolutions" and , ash didier say, only show them what they have that unity can handle (for now)
<RAOF> That information is very easy to get, yes.
<didrocks> really? nux people were telling it wasn't available?
<didrocks> since natty
<RAOF> Max texture size?
<bryceh> glxinfo reports max texture size for  instance
<bryceh> xrandr tells you all about available resolutions
<bryceh> fwiw, the issue that this needs handled in g-s-d has been known for  years; I can probably dig up the bug report about it
<jasoncwarner_> So, RAOF bryceh didrocks and smspillaz , what I'm hearing is that we can create a workaround in g-s-d (and maybe display capplet) for Unity not doing what it should...and that might get us through O?
<jasoncwarner_> but
<jasoncwarner_> (assuming the above is correct)
<RAOF> Pretty much, yes.  I'm not sure what's happening with the nvidia blob, though.
<jasoncwarner_> it still doesn't fix compiz/unity...
<jasoncwarner_> which we would need to do
<jasoncwarner_> Ok...do we have a bug for the g-s-d work around yet? want to add that to release-manager checklist
<jasoncwarner_> and, didrocks...might want to add the above to your didier tag list
<RAOF> The compiz stuff is already done - the Copy to Texture plugin handles the compiz end.
<didrocks> jasoncwarner_: yeah, IIRC, the black screen with nvidia is already on, let me checkc and ensure
<RAOF> The problem is that Unity uses fbos, which don't have an equivalent plugin.
<jbicha> didrocks: good morning, bug 856884 is annoying for users who use Unity & other desktops
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 856884 in unity "Running unity --reset breaks metacity keyboard shortcut defaults" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/856884
<didrocks> jbicha: is it still the case since beta 2?
<didrocks> jbicha: i guess I fixed it
<bryceh> jasoncwarner_, not spotting the g-s-d bug on this; I'm sure there was one tho
<jbicha> didrocks: no, it's still the case as of right now
<bryceh> maybe it got expired
<didrocks> jbicha: so, if you unity --reset, can you confirm ctrl + alt + T still works in compiz now?
<jasoncwarner_> bryceh or RAOF could you file a new bug for g-s-d so I can get it on kates checklist?
<RAOF> I'll file one.
<jbicha> didrocks: yes, but the bug is about the other 3 keyboard shortcuts that unity --reset breaks :)
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF: awesome, thank you!
<bryceh> bug 555641 maybe?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 555641 in compiz "MASTER: max texture size prevents compiz from running (dup-of: 824099)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/555641
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 824099 in compiz "[~30 systems] Plugging in external monitor to VGA port makes both displays corrupted with thick slanted lines" [Critical,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/824099
<RAOF> bryceh: Yeah, I'll resurrect that into a g-s-d bug.
<didrocks> jasoncwarner_: it's not unity --reset, it's compiz not being nice
<jbicha> didrocks: I've been frustrated by the bug for several weeks, your patch finally helped me realize what was creating the ~/.gconf/metacity stuff
<bryceh> RAOF, yep sounds good
<jbicha> I didn't expect unity --reset to _add_ stuff
<didrocks> jbicha: it's not that simple
<didrocks> jbicha: basically, unity --reset reset all compiz gconf value, isn't it?
<didrocks> jbicha: and those keys are magically bound to metacity one by the gnome-compat plugin
<didrocks> so it then updates the metacity ones
<didrocks> not something I can fix easily then, as the default aren't the same between session (as unity provides those keys)
<bryceh> RAOF, there's a compiz patch in comment #8; dunno if it's relevant
<didrocks> jbicha: I guess I can change the setting for Meta + D
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF: when you have new bug #, let me know so I can get that kate...thanks!
<jbicha> it's doing it wrong, it should read what the defaults really are (maybe the gsettings thing will fix it)
<bryceh> Travis said, "Ideally Xorg would sort this out though which I believe is the point of the 'shatter' work."
<didrocks> jbicha: want to make a compiz patch? :)
<didrocks> jbicha: I'm afraid it won't, hence the fact that smspillaz should be aware about it now ;)
<bryceh> jasoncwarner_, maybe that shatter stuff is what dbarth's thinking about
<jbicha> didrocks: I can try copying what you did
<RAOF> Yup.  Either Xorg, or compiz, or both.
<didrocks> jbicha: won't work for other keys, they will conflict with unity keys
<didrocks> and prevent unity to start
<bryceh> jasoncwarner_, unfortunately X.org Shatter is so heavily delayed I doubt it'll ever exist
<didrocks> are you using unity --reset that often?
<jasoncwarner_> bryceh RAOF not up on my 'shatter' these days...
<jasoncwarner_> ah, so not exactly a solution?
<didrocks> I shouldn't have added this option I guess :)
<jbicha> didrocks: I always run the dev releases, so yes it happens, quite a few users mess with ccsm too & I've been recommending unity --reset
<didrocks> jbicha: it's really hackish FYI :-)
<RAOF> bryceh: IIUC you get it for "free" with airlied's hybrid graphics support work.
<didrocks> jbicha: so, I have an idea
<jbicha> I don't understand why patching the keys will break unity, I delete my ~/.gconf/metacity and things work fine
<bryceh> RAOF, hmm, mayhbe
<didrocks> jbicha: again, we don't set those keys directlly
<didrocks> jbicha: basically, when a key under ~/.gconf/compiz changes
<RAOF> jasoncwarner_: I'm resurrecting bug 824099 to track this.
<didrocks> there is gnomecompat which updates the corresponding metacity key
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 824099 in gnome-settings-daemon "[~30 systems] Plugging in external monitor to VGA port makes both displays corrupted with thick slanted lines" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/824099
<didrocks> jbicha: ok until there?
<jbicha> those keys are the metacity defaults, either from upstream or as packaged in the metacity ubuntu package
<didrocks> wait for my explanation
<didrocks> jbicha: are you ok about the compiz -> metacity change?
<jbicha> the gnomecompat plugin does some crossover thing with metacity, I don't understand it much deeper than that
<didrocks> basically, when a gconf compiz key changes, it updates the metacity one
<didrocks> in the default for compiz, with the unity profile, the Alt + F1, Alt + F2 are dealt by unity, not by the shortcuts general settings
<bryceh> jasoncwarner_, the original X.org shatter was proposed several years ago; there was some work done on it by redhat, but I haven't heard anything more about that in a long time.
<didrocks> to the gconf compiz key  bound to those metacity shortcuts are set to "null" to avoid conflicts between compiz and unity
<didrocks> so*
<jbicha> so it's hacks on top of hacks?
<bryceh> jasoncwarner_, the effort RAOF refers to is also by redhat, but is also similarly highly experimental and doesn't have an ETA afaik
<didrocks> jbicha: it's just compiz not enabling two plugins having the same key
<RAOF> XRandR 1.4 was going to support it, too.  Again, delayed.
<didrocks> jbicha: so when you --reset (which isn't a core experience case normally), you reset all keys to default
<jbicha> do we even need gnomecompat?
<didrocks> and those 2 keys to defaults
<bryceh> jasoncwarner_, it might be something we'd want to look at for 12.04 for hybrid graphics support, but even there it's probably >6 month effort
<didrocks> jbicha: yeah, it's the only way to get the same number of worspaces, and the gnome session integration
<didrocks> jbicha: it's also the only way to set the compiz key in g-c-c
<bryceh> RAOF, hmm, can you find a reference to that about randr 1.4?  I hadn't heard that.
<didrocks> so, what we can do is working this issue
<didrocks> like, patching unity --reset to then set the metacity gconf key back
<bryceh> randr 1.4 sounds a lot more feasible for possibly backporting than the stuff airlied's doing
<didrocks> (which won't be picked by compiz, and so no compiz plugin conflict)
<bryceh> we might even be able to persuade keithp to help
<RAOF> bryceh: It was part of the per-crtc pixmap thing - that's basically shattering the framebuffer into monitor-sized chunks.
<RAOF> The compositor would then only need to deal with textures as big as the biggest monitor, rather than as big as the combined framebuffer.
<RAOF> Of course, I don't think xrandr 1.4 has gone anywhere since it got backed out from 1.11.
<didrocks> jbicha: want to fix that?
<bryceh> RAOF, yeah but it was pretty close at that point.  I can follow up with keith about it
<jbicha> didrocks: would it be bad to just have unity --reset rm -rf ~/.gconf/apps/metacity/global_keybindings
<didrocks> jbicha: urgh, don't do that!
<RAOF> bryceh: And also check that my understanding is correct :)
<didrocks> jbicha: this is bad for gconf, he never really supported touching those files manually
<bryceh> RAOF, right :-)
<didrocks> jbicha: better to reset using gconftool-2
<didrocks> if those are null
<RAOF> bryceh: That said, it'll require compiz changes to get working.  And if we're allowing compiz changes, it *might* just be easier to make those compiz changes anyway; compiz can work around xserver limitations.
<jbicha> didrocks: ok same thing: gconftool-2 --recursive-unset /apps/metacity/global_keybindings
<didrocks> jbicha: yeah, I think just run than in unity --reset
<didrocks> jbicha: want to make a patch? I'll review it
<bryceh> RAOF, true
<bryceh> RAOF, I'm just trying to make sure we got all bases covered from the X perspective
<jbicha> didrocks: you said that's in compiz?
<RAOF> Sure.  If it'd make compiz's job easier, and is feasible, it'd be a good idea.
<didrocks> jbicha: no, the unity "binary" is in unity itself
<didrocks> jbicha: look at tools/unity.cmake
<didrocks> jbicha: it's a small python script
<bryceh> RAOF, jasoncwarner_ so is there an assignee for bug #824099?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 824099 in compiz "[~30 systems] Plugging in external monitor to VGA port makes both displays corrupted with thick slanted lines" [Critical,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/824099
<RAOF> bryceh: Do you think the wording of 824099 sufficiently describes the problem, and our proposed solution?
<bryceh> RAOF, yes that looks very good.  Might elaborate a bit on the second paragraph - why is unity particularly limited in this case?
<bryceh> RAOF, there's (I think) 3 use cases we need to address:
<RAOF> Might need to get smspillaz to elaborate on that bit; I'm not totally sure what the specific details are.
<bryceh> 1.  Boot.   So compiz/unity needs to avoid starting up if the system's configured in this fashion
<bryceh> 2.  Hotplugging another monitor (which I think the bug's description covers)
<bryceh> mm, maybe just those two cases
<bryceh> was going to say setting up the external monitor and restarting compiz, but that's basically a subcase of #1
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF and bryceh so we'll track it via bug #824099 ? I'm cool with that...
<bryceh> RAOF, for #1, does compiz already cover that well enough, or do you think we need another bug about that?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 824099 in gnome-settings-daemon "Max GL texture size can break multi-head" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/824099
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF, are you able to handle the g-s-d portion of the fix?
<didrocks> jbicha: looks good, did you try it to ensure we don't have unseen side effects?
<rickspencer3> is anyone else seeing that notify-osd no longer shows the volume in the notification when changing volume via keyboard?
<RAOF> bryceh: I think compiz already covers #1.
<didrocks> jbicha: as compiz is ran after, I'm afraid that the key will still be overwritten, so maybe, that should be done afterwards
<RAOF> jasoncwarner_: I think I can take the g-s-d portion, yes.
<jasoncwarner_> rickspencer3: yeah, chrisccoulson was looking at that
<didrocks> rickspencer3: yeah, it's known and under work
<rickspencer3> chrisccoulson? not Dx?
<jbicha> didrocks: no, do I have to build nux too?
<rickspencer3> thanks didrocks
<jasoncwarner_> rickspencer3: I thought it was fixed, though (though I'm on desktop ppa at the moment)
<chrisccoulson> i uploaded a fix for that yesterday
<rickspencer3> thanks chrisccoulson
<didrocks> jbicha: no, just run make install for the tool/ directory
<rickspencer3> I'll get it later today, I guess
<rickspencer3> meh
 * rickspencer3 dist-upgrades
<chrisccoulson> yeah, it seems it was accepted yesterday - https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/oneiric-changes/2011-September/010183.html
<rickspencer3> didrocks, should I remove the desktop PPA before I upgrade?
<didrocks> rickspencer3: no, the upgrade should be smooth from there
<rickspencer3> thanks didrocks
<didrocks> yw
<jbicha> didrocks: I'm having trouble building just a directory, I'll try again after I sleep :)
<jbicha> thanks for all the help
<didrocks> jbicha: no hurry! do not hesitate to ping me if you need any help with cmake ;)
<didrocks> jbicha: thanks you for looking at it :)
<bryceh> RAOF, short of shatter, is there anything more that can be done on the compiz/unity side to improve the situation?  Or is the workaround the best we're going to do for the time being?
<bryceh> like, any potentials on improving the performance of the compiz "shatter" workaround?
<jasoncwarner_> hey RAOF bryceh and didrocks you all mentioned that g-s-d for the multi-mon stuff was the correct way, but as didrocks mentioned, should we patch monitor capplet to not allow to high monitor sizes as well? stop it on two fronts?
<didrocks> I would say so, but I'm just not aware enough of all this resolution stuff :-) (but still, at least, we should blacklist the capplet for nvidia blog driver use)
<rickspencer3> uh, how do I tell nautilus to open a file with mplayer?
<RAOF> bryceh: I *think* the workaround is the minimum-risk path for the time being.  I don't know what the performance of compiz's shattering workaround is; it'd have to be better than the software fallbacks we currently get.
<bryceh> RAOF, oh I thought the compiz shatter *was* the software fallback; no?
<RAOF> I believe the current fallback is in mesa, to software rendering.
<rodrigo_> morning
<RAOF> We don't have copy-to-texture enabled by default; maybe I should fire up the netbook and check what influence that has.
<didrocks> rickspencer3: right-click -> open with another application? (if it's not on the list of supported mimetypes for this extension)
<rickspencer3> didrocks, right, so you used to be able to enter a command in that dialog
<rickspencer3> I guess I'll have to make or change the mplayer desktop file for something :/
<didrocks> rickspencer3: yeah, seems it's not listed (just installed it) indeed
<didrocks> weird
<rickspencer3> respin beta2!!!
<rickspencer3> I'll start the incident report
<rickspencer3> ;)
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF bryceh smspillaz didrocks (anyone else listening about multimonitor). how does this sound for workaround
<jasoncwarner_> 1. patch g-s-d to not allow unity to start with higher than max 3d resolution
<didrocks> rickspencer3: heh!
<jasoncwarner_> 2. patch monitor capplet to not allow someone to actively choose a resolution higher than max 3d reoslution when running unity
<jasoncwarner_> ?
<bryceh> RAOF, are you taking the action for doing both of those?  (I gather they both will require some hacking on gnome-desktop)  Or should someone else take #2?
<RAOF> I think 1. would actually be a patch to unity_support_test; g-s-d doesn't actually determine whether Unity runs or not, right?
<didrocks> jasoncwarner_: agreed on that :)
<didrocks> RAOF: hum, but if resolution changes?
<didrocks> RAOF: unity isn't restarted
<bryceh> 1. patch g-s-d to not allow increasing resolution beyond max texture buffer size if unity is running
<RAOF> What I expect to do for 1. is to ensure that g-s-d won't set a resolution that unity won't work at, rather than trying to stop unity from starting if the resolution is too high.
<bryceh> 2. patch monitor capplet to not allow someone to actively choose a resolution higher than max 3d reoslution when running unity
<RAOF> Right, that.
<jasoncwarner_> right
<jasoncwarner_> sorry..
<jasoncwarner_> great
<jasoncwarner_> tadpole
<didrocks> yeah, with misreading the 1. agreed with bryceh and RAOF :)
<jasoncwarner_> (was going a bad place...just skipped like 10 steps...moving on)
<seb128> hey
<jasoncwarner_> morning seb
<RAOF> Hey seb!
<didrocks> salut seb128
<bryceh> hi seb128
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF: could you update the bug with the plan?
<seb128> hey didrocks bryceh jasoncwarner_
<RAOF> I think that's already on there?  Clearly not sufficiently obvious ;)
<seb128> what bug is that?
<RAOF> bug 3824099
<RAOF> Or, rather, bug #824099
<seb128> that's an old one!
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 824099 in gnome-settings-daemon "Max GL texture size can break multi-head" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/824099
<seb128> or not ;-)
<smspillaz> submitted a demotivational for my assignment
<seb128> hum
<smspillaz> feel like a bucket of win
<bryceh> RAOF, yeah you got it right; maybe jason's wording is less jargonny :-)
<seb128> is that bug old like the world?
<RAOF> That bug is old like the world, yes.
<seb128> like tseliot patched the capplets years ago for that
<bryceh> seb128, right
<seb128> but we dropped the patch since because the drivers were supposed to be good nowadays
<seb128> *shrug*
<chrisccoulson> hi seb128
<rodrigo_> oh, cyphermox uploaded the new NM and NM-applet!
<rodrigo_> hey seb128
<RAOF> Well, the drivers work, but terribly slowly, since you're exceeding a hardware limit and falling back to software.
<RAOF> This used to work well because compiz would crash, and spawn Metacity :)
<micahg> hi seb128, thanks for sorting out seed yesterday
<bryceh> RAOF, and Copy to Texture was considered a "real" solution, but doesn't work (yet) under unity?
<RAOF> bryceh: That is my understanding, yes.
<seb128> right, ok
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson, rodrigo_, how are you?
<seb128> micahg, you're welcome
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, good thanks
<chrisccoulson> winding down day for me :P
<seb128> hehe
<seb128> do you still have anything to get done for Oneiric?
<seb128> or anything we should watch for while you are away?
<rodrigo_> chrisccoulson, :)
<didrocks> seb128: no, wait 6PM to tell "oh chrisccoulson, there is a bug issue in firefoxâ¦"
<rodrigo_> yeah
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah. i've just remembered that i need to make firefox look in gsettings for the accessibility settings
<seb128> didrocks, ;-)
 * rodrigo_ prepares a ton of bug reports for 5:30
<seb128> chrisccoulson, is tb contact syncing working?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, thunderbird-couchdb is in source new :)
<seb128> once we get thunderbird-couchdb out of NEW
<chrisccoulson> if you feel like reviewing it :)
<didrocks> rodrigo_: weak, 6 is better! :-)
<seb128> should that be installed by default?
<didrocks> hey rodrigo_
<rodrigo_> didrocks, yeah, right
<seb128> bah, I missed robert_ancell
<seb128> why didn't we get new unity-greeter and lightdm
<micahg> is anyone aware the new pitivi claims to want python-gst0.10 0.10.28?
<rodrigo_> is the ca-certificates package fixed? is it safe to upgrade it?
<micahg> rodrigo_: should be, yes
<seb128> micahg, no, I will check with jbicha when he's there
<rodrigo_> micahg, ok
<micahg> seb128: ok, thanks, seems to be my only broke package ATM
<rickspencer3> jasoncwarner_, so if someone who is having multi-mon issues simply chooses a lower resolution, their problems will go away?
<jasoncwarner_> rickspencer3: I believe so, yes...as long as that resolution is supported in 3d configuration (which RAOF will only allow after he patches from above)
<RAOF> Where their problems are caused by exceeding the max texture size, yes.
<RAOF> There may be other problems (there's a race in Unity where monitor hotplug can crash compiz), but they're not caused by X :)
<seb128> imho it would be a better experience to tell them to use unity-2d that to tell them they can't use their monitor
<seb128> unity-2d is close enough from unity and you usually want to use your monitor resolution
<RAOF> Yes.  That requires a logout though, doesn't it?
<seb128> yes
<seb128> but well rather than blocking those choices I would display a warning saying to relog in 2d
<RAOF> So we can't really do that automatically when they plug in a monitor.
<mvo> seb128, pitti: it appears that bug #854622 (and friends) are caused by the changelog sharing feature. see comment #8 in this bug. this is all a bit mysterious though
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 854622 in update-manager "Could not install libglib2.0" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/854622
<seb128> mvo, hey, I've no real clue about the changelog sharing and pitti is off today
<RAOF> seb128: You mean - block those choices *and* display a warning saying to relog in 2d, yes?  That's a fine plan.
<seb128> RAOF, no, don't block those choices
<seb128> RAOF, but if somebody picks one display a warning saying that it will slow down their session and that if they want to use the resolution then should use 2d rather
<seb128> RAOF, ie the choices are just not available people will think Ubuntu is broken and that they can't use their monitor
<seb128> we need in some way to explain why the choices are not available and what are the solution for people who want to use their native resolution
<RAOF> I think we're on the same page.
<seb128> ok, great ;-)
<RAOF> I don't mean "not display those options at all", I mean "display those options, but when the user sets them tell them "whoops, you need to go to unity 2d to set this"".
<seb128> +1
<seb128> ;-)
<mvo> seb128: ok, thanks. I mark it as high and target for oneiric to keep it on the radar
<mvo> seb128: I don't have a clue about this feature either, but something really fishy is going on
<RAOF> mvo: Oh - were I to guess, I'd suggest that pkgbinarymangler is selecting libglib2.0-data as the primary changelog package on i386 (where it's built) but not on amd64 (because it's not built there).  But I thought that there were checks for that.
<seb128> mvo, well, it seems wrong that the lib binary got -data in its changelog
<mvo> RAOF: ohhh, that is a interessting thought!
<mvo> seb128: yeah, indeed
<rodrigo_> do we have a "keyboard-layouts" icon?
<rodrigo_> we are using the same icon for the region and language selector in g-c-c
<rodrigo_> couldn't really find one that matches
<seb128> rodrigo_, key_bindings.png would work I guess
<rodrigo_> ok, looking
<seb128> rodrigo_, or better, preferences-desktop-keyboard
<rodrigo_> seb128, hmm, not sure it's good
<rodrigo_> oh, looking that one
<seb128> rodrigo_, eog /usr/share/icons/Humanity/apps/24/preferences-desktop-keyboard-shortcuts.svg
<seb128> ups
<rodrigo_> yes, that one's better
<seb128> eog /usr/share/icons/Humanity/apps/24/preferences-desktop-keyboard.svg
<seb128> rather
<rodrigo_> yeah
<rodrigo_> well, that's the same one as the keyboard panel
<rodrigo_> so we need another one
<seb128> rodrigo_, the keybinding one then?
<seb128> it's not ideal but it's better than what we have...
<rodrigo_> yes, I guess it's too late to create a new icon, so yes
<rodrigo_> can't find a better one
<seb128> especially that a new icon would only be in our theme
<mvo> hrm, focus-follow mouse seems to act oddly with the latest unity -:/
<seb128> so break if you change to the gnome icon theme
<rodrigo_> seb128, yes
<Sweetshark> hi all.
<seb128> hey Sweetshark
<seb128> didrocks, you probably noticed but there is a new sni-qt listed on version, is that something for Oneiric still?
<didrocks> seb128: yes, it is, it's on my list for today
<didrocks> seb128: minor fixes, but still good to know
<seb128> didrocks, ok great, thanks
<didrocks> I tried to convince agateau to do the packaging himself, but he's shy :)
<seb128> didrocks, I put you for it on the etherpad
<seb128> hehe
<didrocks> seb128: sure, thanks!
<seb128> thanks ;-)
<didrocks> yw
 * didrocks hopes a release team member will still be around, seems I made a booboo in the oneconf package if people have no .mo file
<seb128> rodrigo_, is there a way to load a local g-c-c .so
<seb128> like for debugging, I want to use the one from the build tree without having to install it
<didrocks> seb128: oh, he didn't push 0.2.4
<didrocks> 0.2.3 is basically the version we have today
<seb128> didrocks, ok
<didrocks> will wait on monday so that he release 0.2.4, he told me you would do it yesterday
<seb128> those french people...
<didrocks> yeah, not reliable :-)
 * didrocks tries to use pitti's tool to build the French CD
<seb128> where is the spanish?
<seb128> rodrigo_, ola senior?
 * didrocks is eager to try cross-building (building the amd64 flavor on my i386 as it's possible)
<didrocks> but let's see if I get a fine i386 first :)
<asac> hi guys! running stock oneiric ... wonder if there is any app included nowadays to take photos from my webcam or if i need to install cheese?
<didrocks> there is none AFAIK
<asac> ok. my best hope was shotwell ... seems it doesnt support taking photo from next to the import action
<asac> didrocks: is cheese the best option?
<seb128> asac, yes
<seb128> asac, hey btw ;-)
<seb128> asac, cheese is the best option
<didrocks> pitivi can't do that, isn't it?
<rodrigo_> seb128, sorry, was preparing a snack :)
<seb128> didrocks, I don't think it does handle inputs
<rodrigo_> seb128, g-c-c just looks at its own prefix, for lib/control-center-2-0/
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, didn't try for a while but that's my bet
<rodrigo_> seb128, so no, not possible
<seb128> rodrigo_, so every time I want to debug a panel I need to install the .so over the system one?
<seb128> it's ridiculous...
<asac> seb128: cool
<rodrigo_> seb128, yes, or use jhbuild/a local prefix
<glatzor> mvo, rodrigo_ , a limited packagekit compaitibilty layer shouldn't be doable. It is just more or less about moving some bits from session-installer and the former apt backend of packagekit to aptdaemon. But will a dependency on python-packagekit :)
<rodrigo_> seb128, install to /tmp or whatever
<glatzor> should be doable
<glatzor> :)
<seb128> rodrigo_, we should add a command line option to let specify a .so :p
<rodrigo_> :)
<rodrigo_> glatzor, why would it have to depend on p-pk?
<rodrigo_> ah, for the apt backend
<rodrigo_> glatzor, but can't we just provide the PK bus API on top of aptdaemon? why would it need to depend on python-pk in that case?
<rodrigo_> I think for P we'll have to implement compatibility dbus layers, for PK and systemd, which are being used more and more in GNOME
<rodrigo_> instead of having to patch every app that uses them
<glatzor> rodrigo_, because we would need the enums
<rodrigo_> glatzor, what enums? the ones in the C API?
<glatzor> rodrigo_, we could also hardcode them. e.g. we would have to emit Package signals which contain the security level of an upgrade - the level is a string which is defined in p-pk
<rodrigo_> glatzor, right, so not a real need to depend, just we need a way to "share" those strings/enums, to avoid copy/paste errors
<rodrigo_> glatzor, of course, this is P material, so maybe we should have a session at UDS?
<glatzor> rodrigo_, mvo, indeed. I won't be at UDS. But perhaps I can join on IRC
<rodrigo_> glatzor, oh ok, then we'll assign all tasks to you :)
<rodrigo_> glatzor, on the other hand, is anything in PK missing for it to replace aptdaemon?
<Sweetshark> seb128: any idea on https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libreoffice/+bug/745836 ? To put it bluntly it seems that at least 75% of all reported Libreoffice crashes come from this single root cause, which is: encrypted swap is broken.
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 745836 in libreoffice "soffice.bin crashed with SIGSEGV in cppu::throwException()" [High,Confirmed]
<glatzor> rodrigo_, right, the whole s-c integration.
<rodrigo_> glatzor, hmm, s-c uses aptdaemon, right? so it could, if PK offered all it needs, use it instead, right?
<rodrigo_> or what do you mean?
<seb128> Sweetshark, not really...
<seb128> Sweetshark, try asking on #ubuntu-devel maybe
<seb128> Sweetshark, you might have somebody with an idea there
<Sweetshark> chrisccoulson: bug 745836 might also be interesting to you. (Or anyone else who has reports of weird crash when the app was swapped out)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 745836 in libreoffice "soffice.bin crashed with SIGSEGV in cppu::throwException()" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/745836
<glatzor> rodrigo_, That is the way free software works. But you would need to push a lot of features to PackageKit, chaining transactions, mupltiple authentication, licensekey handling, handling of failed installation, method to repair the system ...
<rodrigo_> glatzor, ok, that's the answer to my 'what's missing' question :)
<glatzor> rodrigo_, the whole purchase process is deeply integrated in aptdaemon
<glatzor> rodrigo_, The InstallPackages method is not the main purpose of aptdaemon. But indeed PackageKit is catching up in some areas e.g. debconf handling, the next release will support config file conflicts questions.
<Sweetshark> seb128: given that bug, I really want to have "encrypted swap/home" reported by apport too.
<glatzor> rodrigo_, but there isn't yet a InstallPackageFile method
<seb128> Sweetshark, should be an info easy to collect
<rodrigo_> glatzor, ok, then we'd be fine with the compatibility layer for now, I guess
<glatzor> rodrigo_, mvo It also seems that richard is moving away from the session bus interface to the native glib client - introducing PkTask which handles the transaction dance
<rodrigo_> oh cool
<mvo> hm, I always like the session bus interface
<glatzor> rodrigo_, mvo me too.
<glatzor> mvo, rodrigo_ oh guys, I have to leave for work. See you!
<rodrigo_> well, PkTask would be a layer on top of it, or is the session interface going away?
<rodrigo_> bye glatzor
<mvo> see you glatzor
<didrocks> X crashed on too many writing on disk :/
<glatzor> rodrigo_, the session interface doesn't seem to go away but most new applications just use the glib client
<glatzor> rodrigo_, at the time the session bus was introduced glib introspection wasn't available too
<rodrigo_> glatzor, right
<seb128> rodrigo_, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/695561/
<seb128> rodrigo_, could you tell me if that seems ok to you?
<seb128> didrocks, ^
<rodrigo_> seb128, looking
<seb128> didrocks, the ubuntu session are "ubuntu" and "ubuntu-2d" right? and the XDG... name is Unity for both?
<seb128> just checking, the patch seems to work fine there
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i seem to have Unity for the XDG name here (in 2d)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, thanks
<didrocks> seb128: looks good for the sessions name, (pinging dbus to ensure we are in the session doesn't make sense I guess?)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, $ gsettings get org.gnome.desktop.session session-name
<didrocks> seb128: not sure for the XDG_CURRENT_DESKTOP, is it set by lightdm?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, can you tell me what it gives?
<rodrigo_> seb128, looks good to me, yes. I would use g_str_equal instead of g_strcmp0 though, but don't worry abnout that :-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, it says "ubuntu" here
<seb128> rodrigo_, you are wrong :p
<seb128> chrisccoulson, in 2d?
<rodrigo_> :)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah
<seb128> crap :-(
<chrisccoulson> that doesn't sound right, does it?
<seb128> rodrigo_, http://developer.gnome.org/glib/stable/glib-Hash-Tables.html#g-str-equal
<seb128> "Note that this function is primarily meant as a hash table comparison function. For a general-purpose, NULL-safe string comparison function, see g_strcmp0(). "
<rodrigo_> seb128, yeah, g_strcmp0 checks for NULL indeed
<seb128> rodrigo_, I've been checking because I saw you used g_str_equal in your region panel patch
<seb128> crap, that doesn't work
<seb128> settings org.gnome.desktop.session session-name has no effect
<seb128> vuntz, !!!
<didrocks> seb128: what set XDG_CURRENT_DESKTOP ? instead of relying in nautilus on the dbus settings (but more exact to know if unity runs or not), I should probably rely on it
<seb128> didrocks, no, session "org.gnome.desktop.session session-name" in gsettings doesn't change the session as it should
<seb128> crap
<seb128> ok, I will do it the debian way, hide that switch, it's just broken
<didrocks> seb128: that doesn't answer on XDG_CURRENT_DESKTOP, is it linked to that? ::)
<seb128> didrocks, lightdm does set it, I just copied what others did in gnome-control-center and gnome-screensaver
<seb128> that seems to work fine
<seb128> didrocks, chrisccoulson, vuntz: ok, the issue is that "org.gnome.desktop.session session-name" is only respected when there is no --session given to gnome-session
<seb128> so it works for a "startx" login
<didrocks> hum, /me grep -r in lightdm and didn't find it, looking
<didrocks> seb128: meaning that all of those integration will be broken on gdm, better to still rely on dbus thenâ¦
<seb128> didrocks, well I'm not sure what set XDG_CURRENT_DESKTOP, I though it was lightdm
<seb128> we really a "is_unity_running()" api distro patched in glib or something :p
<seb128> or gtk
<didrocks> agreed
<didrocks> or set that in the /usr/share/xsessions/*desktop file
<seb128> I need to talk to desrt about it
<seb128> if I distro patch that in glib he will track me down :p
<didrocks> and he has good chance to find you! :-)
<seb128> but we need to figure a proper way to get that info
<seb128> ;-)
 * didrocks still grep -r around :)
<didrocks> ah, gnome-session
<seb128> didrocks, https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=654041
<ubot2> Gnome bug 654041 in general "Respect XDG_CURRENT_DESKTOP" [Normal,Resolved: fixed]
<seb128> didrocks, seems gnome-session read it?
<didrocks> hum, we have a distro-patch though
<didrocks> debian/patches/52_xdg_current_desktop.patch
<didrocks> quite lame to distro-patch our distro-patches .session files
<didrocks> I guess I already have to refresh it because of that, but well :)
<seb128> oh ok, distro patch in gnome-session
<seb128> didrocks, so yeah, that should work with any login manager
<seb128> so we can probably use that for GNOME and Unity, they both use gnome-session for all their sessions
<didrocks> indeed
<didrocks> seb128: I'll probably add the complex dbus call for nautilus on P then
<didrocks> remove*
<seb128> ok
<seb128> vuntz, hello, how is "org.gnome.desktop.session session-name" supposed to interact with --session? ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: it's the default session if no --session is set
<didrocks> which I override to "ubuntu" for LTSP
<seb128> didrocks, ok, so I fail to see how it can work even for gnome-shell
<seb128> since all the gnome session we ship have a --session
<seb128> i.e gnome-shell.desktop has "gnome-session --session=gnome"
<didrocks> yeah, but is org.gnome.desktop.session session-name different?
<seb128> it means the only case where the option can work is when you pick no session but startx
<seb128> didrocks, different from what?
<didrocks> is shouldn't gconf/gsettings shouldn't store states, isn't it?
<didrocks> seb128: should still be ubuntu
<seb128> didrocks, the "force fallback" switch in the info panel change the value of this key
<seb128> that's how it "forces fallback"
<didrocks> ah, interested :)
<seb128> i.e it set the key to gnome-fallback
<didrocks> yeah, I guess it doesn't work then
<didrocks> (in ubuntu)
<didrocks> because for the gnome-shell session
<seb128> so my patch I just did was doing ubuntu,ubuntu-2d rather than gnome,gnome-fallback
<didrocks> by defaut, the desktop key is Exec=gnome-session
<didrocks> without --session
<seb128> right
<seb128> well I will just do what debian did
<didrocks> seb128: the better way would be that to set the session in .dmrc
<didrocks> wdyt?
<seb128> "   * 90_force_fallback.patch: new patch. Disable the âforced fallback
<seb128>      modeâ switch, since we already provide a xsession file for it in
<seb128>      gnome-session-fallback."
<seb128> that's what Debian did
<didrocks> (sorry, slowly catching up on that, didn't follow at all this discussion :))
<seb128> didrocks, well, I'm leaning toward "just use the login screen selector to select your session"
<didrocks> yeah, either that, or set the .dmrc
<didrocks> but one place seems better IMHO
<seb128> I don't fancy adding code to deal with dmrc :p
<seb128> let's be consistent and use the login screen
<didrocks> agreed
<seb128> thanks ;-)
<seb128> lunch time
<seb128> bbl
<didrocks> yw :-) thanks to you! Sorry for the time for catching up on the subject :)
<seb128> rodrigo_, there?
<seb128> or something else not under compiz
<seb128> chrisccoulson, ? ;-)
<rodrigo_> seb128, yes
<chrisccoulson> hi seb128
<seb128> could you try to open the removable media panel in system settings
<chrisccoulson> yeah, done
<seb128> click on "other media", close the dialog, click on "other media" again
<seb128> does it work the second time or display a small empty dialog?
<chrisccoulson> it works ok the second time
<seb128> hum ok, thanks
<seb128> chrisccoulson, oh
<rodrigo_> seb128, yes, works ok both times
<seb128> can you close it by the wm button
<seb128> not by the close button
<rodrigo_> seb128, it doesn't under compiz?
<rodrigo_> ok
<chrisccoulson> seb128, ah
<rodrigo_> there's not, on gnome-shell
<chrisccoulson> now it's broken ;)
<seb128> rodrigo_, alt-f4?
<chrisccoulson> so is that a bug that we can't blame compiz for?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, seems so, thanks ;-)
<rodrigo_> ah, but using atl-f4 indeed shows it's broken
<chrisccoulson> dang
<chrisccoulson> ;)
<seb128> I will open a bug
<seb128> thanks guys
<seb128> well maybe I should check if that will still apply to trunk once they move that dialog in the info panel
<rodrigo_> seb128, checking it now
<seb128> rodrigo_, thanks
<rodrigo_> seb128, happens the same, so assign the bug to me if you want
<seb128> rodrigo_, ok, thanks
<rodrigo_> ok, lunch now, bbl
<seb128> well it's a very low priority issue
<seb128> still a bug ;-)
<seb128> rodrigo_, enjoy
<cyphermox> seb128: hey
<seb128> hey cyphermox, how are you?
<cyphermox> not bad, doing the evo stuff now
<seb128> great
<cyphermox> rodrigo_ needs libnm-gtk, can you ack the network-manager-applet upload?
<seb128> no, it's a release team call, try asking on #ubuntu-release
<cyphermox> oh, sorry, thought you were :)
<seb128> sorry, I'm archive admin but not release team ;-)
<cyphermox> ah, that's my mistake then :)
<Sweetshark> nice, bug 745836 just got kernelteamed.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 745836 in ecryptfs-utils "ecryptfs encrypted swap corrupts application stack/heap [was: soffice.bin SIGSEGV cppu::throwException()]" [Critical,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/745836
<kirkland> that bug title is painfully inaccurate :-(
<Sweetshark> kirkland: what would you like instead?
<kirkland> Sweetshark: the swap is not encrypted by ecryptfs;  it's encrypted by the kernel's dmcrypt
<kirkland> Sweetshark: it was configured by ecryptfs-setup-swap
<kirkland> Sweetshark: which is merely a shell script that sets up swap for device mapper encryption
<Sweetshark> kirkland: hmm, right. Ill remove "ecryptfs" from the title.
<tseliot> cyphermox: do you plan on uploading the workaround attached in bug #856631 ? I solves the problem here
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 856631 in pidgin "irc: periodic '/who' polling causes connection drops" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/856631
<cyphermox> tseliot: are you sure this is the right bug number or that I'm the one you want to ping? :)
<cyphermox> that said, I certainly can upload that fix once I test it :)
<tseliot> cyphermox: yes, that's bug. I use pidgin and I'm affected by that problem
<tseliot> cyphermox: and thanks for your help :)
<cyphermox> seb128: you mentioned a new e-d-s tarball yesterday; where would that be? it's not showing up on ftp.gnome.org (or at least I don't see it)
<seb128> cyphermox, sorry, my mistake, it was in the 3.0 serie not 3.1 :-(
<cyphermox> tseliot: sure, I'll get to it shortly (but it's after e-d-s/evo on my todo :)
<cyphermox> seb128: ah ok :)
<cyphermox> are we affected by that bug though?
<tseliot> cyphermox: excellent, thanks again
<rodrigo_> cyphermox, seb128: well, we are disabling the libnm-gtk stuff, so not really needed, just that if available, I'll remove the patch to disable it in g-c-c
<cyphermox> rodrigo_: well, it's in queue now, pending approval by the release team
<cyphermox> I had asked pitti about it before, he seemed okay with it once I explained the change
<seb128> rodrigo_, bug #856824 is yours
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 856824 in gnome-control-center "Gnome Control Center crashes if light-themes are not installed" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/856824
<seb128> cyphermox, try maybe pinging in #ubuntu-release
<cyphermox> seb128: I had
<rodrigo_> seb128, ok
<cyphermox> well, didn't ping anyone, but I mentioned it :)
<seb128> ok, let's wait for them then ;-)
<seb128> slangasek, hey
<seb128> slangasek, I've opened bug #857434 about the plymouth blocking the boot for 5 seconds issue, let me know if you need extra details
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 857434 in plymouth "creates a 5 seconds delay in the boot" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/857434
<jbicha> seb128: here's a proposed desktop-extra list: http://paste.ubuntu.com/695657/
<seb128> jbicha, hey
<seb128> jbicha, some people were looking for you ;-)
<jjardon> seb128: hi! Is it planned and update of the epiphany-browser package? (the new webapp feature is only available in 3.1.x versions)
<seb128> jjardon, no
<seb128> jjardon, hey ;-)
<seb128> jjardon, epiphany 3.1 depends on an unstable webkit serie (1.5) and our security team doesn't feel like shipping an unstable webkit
<seb128> jjardon, webkit-gtk really needs to get a schedule which is aligned with GNOME if GNOME depends on the current version :-(
<seb128> jjardon, we will probably need to get those in the GNOME3 ppa or something
<jbicha> seb128: I uploaded a new pitivi if that's what the problem was
<jjardon> seb128: mmm, good to know. I'll talk with webkitgtk devels
<seb128> jbicha, that work one of the two issue, the second one is that gnome-shell needs to be rebuilt for the clutter;cogl soname change but depwait on caribou
<seb128> jjardon, thanks
<seb128> jbicha, that work -> that was
<seb128> jbicha, so right know gnome-shell is being removed if you dist-upgrade
<seb128> jbicha, can we go back to patch the caribou requirement out to get it to build?
<jbicha> I was waiting on bigon for caribou for gnome-shell as he wanted to fix/rearrange without needing a conflicts/replaces
<seb128> jbicha, well, I doubt caribou will be in before monday, it would be nice to not let gnome-shell broken for the w.e
<jbicha> that's too invasive, the first time wasn't too bad but it was a headache when I tried to rebase that patch
<seb128> jbicha, it will first need to be uploaded, then to be reviewed
<seb128> then to get a ffe
<seb128> ok, so I guess we will live with a broken gnome-shell for some time
<jbicha> the ffe was already granted: bug 845300 pitti uploaded the first time & would have uploaded yesterday
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 845300 in Ubuntu Oneiric "[FFe] [needs-packaging] caribou" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/845300
<bigon> fred peters suggest me somethng for caribou yesterday, I'll ahve a look
<bigon> have
<seb128> jbicha, ok, so let's see how it goes, it's usually hard to find archive admin on the w.e
<bigon> this weeken
<bigon> weekend
<seb128> jbicha, thanks
<seb128> jbicha, your desktop-extra set seems a good start, we shouldn't list things that are in the desktop set though, i.e gnome-utils
<jbicha> bigon: thanks, the caribou thing happened at the same as the cogl transition which broke some things
<seb128> jbicha, synaptic also is probably rather a mvo,packaging team component than a desktop one
<davmor2> guys any idea why when I click on a date evolution tries to open?  I haven't installed evolution
<seb128> jbicha, otherwise the list looks good
<seb128> jbicha, we can discuss that next week during the team meeting
<jbicha> seb128: ok I'll make those changes and mail to the desktop list
<seb128> jbicha, yeah, mailing the list seems a good idea, thanks ;-)
<seb128> davmor2, bug
<davmor2> seb128: nm it looks like contacts sync pulled it in
<jjardon> seb128: so the plan is to have 1.6 for GNOME 3.2
<seb128> jjardon, ok, great, I doubt we will be able to change major series for webkit now though
<seb128> jjardon, it's a bit suboptimal, they failed to their plan in previous cycles (i.e we ship 1.3 because 1.4 was not there for 3.0 in natty)
<seb128> jjardon, and there was no 1.5 tarball for like 2 months this cycle so it didn't seem on track by then...
<seb128> jjardon, well anyway I will check with pitti what we can do next week, thanks for checking with upstream
<seb128> micahg, chrisccoulson, mdeslaur: ^ do you have any opinion on what webkitgtk serie would be best for Oneiric?
<jjardon> seb128: I'll point this in the next r-t meeting. Definitevely we should improve this for the next cycle
<seb128> well I doubt 1.4 to 1.6 will get a ffe now
<seb128> jjardon, thanks
<mdeslaur> seb128: honestly, I would like to stay with 1.4 so we don't ship a pre-release version again. That being said, we don't have a way of fixing the zillion security issues with webkitgtk as it is now, so I don't really know.
<seb128> mdeslaur, well as said I doubt we can switch now anyway
<seb128> the diff between those is probably far from trivial and webkit is used in quite some applications
<seb128> including several desktop ones from the default installation
<mdeslaur> it's kind of late to switch now, IMHO
<cyphermox> why bother with webkitgtk when we have gtkhtml? :D
<jjardon> seb128: those are using the pre-release version for some time now
 * mdeslaur cries at so many default desktop applications exposing users to security issues
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i'm glad i don't have to touch webkit ;)
<seb128> jjardon, well the issue is that it's a non trivial diff, we sort of decided on the version to use at ff, we didn't do any testing of our softwares with 1.5
<rodrigo_> hmm, I wonder if we don't add Adwaita to the list of themes in the Appearance panel
<rodrigo_> s/if/why
<rodrigo_> design decision, but still, I think it would make sense to offer it as a choice
<seb128> rodrigo_, they would probably be fine with it knowing that it's not there by default anyway
<chrisccoulson> rodrigo_, yeah, i'd like to be able to switch to adwaita when i use gnome-shell (without opening gnome-tweak-tool) :)
<rodrigo_> yes, I guess they wanted the 4 themes we offer as choice, just because those are the only GTK3 ones installed by default
<jjardon> seb128: the GNOME community already did some testing for you ;)
<rodrigo_> chrisccoulson, I personally prefer Ambiance, much darker, which is what I like
<rodrigo_> but yes, Adwaita should be in the list
<rodrigo_> seb128, do you think we can add it this late?
<jjardon> seb128: also Fedora
<jbicha> rodrigo_: well it would only show if users have it installed, right?
<rodrigo_> jbicha, yes, with my last change to the theme selector patch I just pushed to bzr
<seb128> jjardon, not on ubiquity for example
<seb128> or other ubuntu tools that use webkit
<jjardon> xan_: Is there any api changes between 1.4 and 1.6?
<xan_> no
<jjardon> seb128: ^
<jjardon> seb128: what are your concern? regression bugs?
<seb128> jjardon, my concern is that it's 1 week from oneiric
<seb128> we are hard frozen
<seb128> it's hard to take non trivial changes and regression test them accross ubuntu in a week
<seb128> even if in theory there is no change it could have bugs or we could have some application doing stupid stuff that used to work
<seb128> i.e it's a risky change
<seb128> I wish somebody would have raised that as an issue earlier than during hard freeze
<seb128> I think we will just have to deal with webkit being 1.4 for Oneiric and get the new one in a ppa
<seb128> and work better next cycle with webkitgtk guys to have a public schedule and regular tarballs
<jbicha> I looked for a release schedule but couldn't find one, I agree with seb128 that it was unclear whether it would be ready
<seb128> when we decided at feature freeze there was only one tarball in the 1.5 serie in months and it looked like it was going to not get there on time
<xan_> we have said a bunch of times we are in sync with gnome
<seb128> we did the reverse in natty, we went for 1.3 and got bitten by 1.4 not being on time
<seb128> xan_, and you failed to roll regular tarball, and you failed to roll 1.4 in time for GNOME 3.0
<rodrigo_> seb128, so, do you agree on adding Adwaita to the list of themes (only shown if it's installed)
<xan_> I guess the message is not getting across, so I accept suggestions to improve it
<seb128> rodrigo_, yes
<rodrigo_> seb128, ok
<xan_> seb128: 1.4.0 made it for GNOME 3.0 AFAIK
<xan_> everyone is using it at least
<slangasek> seb128: plymouth> is this a different machine than the one being put through daily testing by QA?
<seb128> xan_, we shipped natty with 1.3.13 which was current when we hard froze natty
<jjardon> kenvandine: some free time to roll a new package? https://launchpad.net/indicator-power/trunk/0.8
<jbicha> xan_: https://lists.webkit.org/pipermail/webkit-gtk/2011-June/000594.html we of course shipped in April
<xan_> jbicha: that's 1.4.2
<slangasek> seb128: seems so, looks like it's a machine you have local access to... ok, will chase that bug, thanks
<seb128> slangasek, sorry, was replying to xan
<seb128> slangasek, the machine is my work laptop
<seb128> slangasek, so I get do any testing you need
<slangasek> seb128: ok, cool :)
<seb128> slangasek, out of the "I don't want to reboot now because I don't want to stop what I'm doing" ;-)
<seb128> slangasek, thanks for looking into it
<xan_> jbicha: 1.4.0 was released on april 25th
<kenvandine> jjardon, sure
<jjardon> kenvandine: thanks!
<jbicha> xan_: but that was the first announcement as stable to the mailing list
<seb128> xan_, which was 3 weeks after GNOME3
<seb128> xan_, we usually need the stack a bit earlier than GNOME since we hard freeze close from the new GNOME dates
<seb128> xan_, so it means your schedule is one month late for us (or was for 1.4)
<xan_> seb128: true, 3.0 was a busy cycle, we just delivered for it to be in the distros. Lots of development happened for 3.0.1 in many modules.
<xan_> in any case, we try to be in sync with gnome, and we ourselves depend on webkitgtk+ so we'll ship it
<seb128> xan_, ok, noted for next cycle
<seb128> xan_, it would help if there was a public schedule somewhere we can refer to when we take our decision (even if it states that you will stick to GNOME) and to have regular tarballs during the cycle
<seb128> xan_, it tooks months to get a 1.5.2 this cycle it seems, when we looked at 1.5 at our feature freeze current was style .1
<slangasek> seb128: so are you referring to the 5 seconds between plymouthd startup and udev startup?
<xan_> seb128: we do as many as we can, we are all very busy :)
<seb128> slangasek, yes
<seb128> xan_, right, and we ship on fixed dates and need a stable version so we have our constrains as well
<seb128> xan_, 1.4 seemed to best choice when we looked at it for this cycle
<xan_> seb128: I'm not really complaining
<xan_> I was just asked to join and answer questions
<xan_> if there's misunderstandings about our intentions it's good to clarify them and we can try to do a better job
<seb128> xan_, ok, thanks for joining
<slangasek> seb128: why is plymouth in your initramfs?
<slangasek> (crypted swap?)
<xan_> but in the end we can fail to do as many releases as we could or release exactly on time, we are only human...
<xan_> (and releasing webkit is not trivial unfortunately)
<seb128> xan_, I will note for next cycle that you really try to stick to GNOME schedule and that we should be fine updating
<seb128> slangasek, euh, dunno, my user is an ecryptfs one
<slangasek> seb128: right, ecryptfs turns on crypted swap.  ok
<seb128> slangasek, but out of that I did nothing technical to my config
<xan_> seb128: that sounds fair. If we screw up massively you won't be the only one complaining anyway
<seb128> xan_, thanks
<seb128> xan_, sorry it didn't work well this cycle, we will do better next one ;-)
<xan_> seb128: we were particularly busy this cycle, hopefully the next one will go smoother
<jjardon> Maybe It would be a good idea to have a special rule for external dependencies, to avoid situations like this.
<seb128> xan_, and yeah, I understand people being busy, release being hard to get out etc, that's why we decided to be conservative since our shedule doesn't let lot of margin for slips
<seb128> things is that we can trust GNOME tarballs to be on time
<seb128> but it's harder for external depends, there is no promise there
<xan_> seb128: one thing you can do is see what epiphany does, which I maintain
<seb128> it's a best effort thing, and some bite us back in the past
<xan_> if it depends on unstable webkit you can be sure a stable release will happen ;)
<seb128> or not... see 1.4 ;-)
<xan_> well, we released a couple of weeks later
<xan_> but pushing 1.4 if you are already using 1.3.13 is a no-brainer IMHO
<seb128> which was after we pressed our CDs
<xan_> right, well
<seb128> we don't like to press CDs with an unstable version of an important lib
<xan_> I guess your schedule is extremely tight
<seb128> it is
<xan_> then I agree it's risky stuff
<seb128> which was my point, we tend to be conservative because we have little time margins for slips
<xan_> I guess I can try to be fanatic about releasing exactly on time
<xan_> but you could also have some more buffer time for GNOME stuff :P
<seb128> it would help to at least have a RC with GNOME RC ;-)
<seb128> yeah, I'm trying to work on that for next cycle
<xan_> well, we shipped 1.5.90 this time
<xan_> :)
<seb128> GNOME shifted a bit his cycle as well, we used to ship with .1
<xan_> and I think we delivered in all the past cycles
<xan_> 1.0.x and 1.2.x
<seb128> ok
<seb128> so seems we should try to follow you next cycle
<seb128> and I will come complaining if things slip too much and we are in a difficult position :-)
<xan_> please do
<seb128> or complaining^W nicely ask for a tarball
<seb128> thanks! ;-)
<xan_> if someone asks nicely about really needing a tarball it's more likely to happen :)
<jjardon> seb128: feel free to complain to the r-t also ;)
<seb128> jjardon, I will do, though it's not really in r-t realm to tell webkit what to do since it's part of GNOME ;-)
<seb128> it's always a bit difficult with external depends
<jjardon> seb128: sure, but we can try to search a solution if the things are not working well
<seb128> it's like cairo, should we follow 1.11. ;-)
<xan_> I have to say that for an external dependency we are massively aligned with gnome in any case
<xan_> so we are not the usual external dependency..
<seb128> right, I was a bit unsure about that, it's good to read
<jjardon> there are plans to divide external dependencies in several classes, Its not the same libxml2 than webkitgtk, for example
<seb128> it's part our fault for not having somebody assigned to maintain webkit in Ubuntu
<jjardon> we are going to discuss that for the next cycle
<kenvandine> jjardon, i see you have a couple of bug fixes in trunk since 0.8, want to roll a 0.9 and get those in too?
<seb128> so nobody with close contact with upstream or enough insight to have a good opinion on what to do
<jjardon> kenvandine: oh, you are rigth. let me roll a 0.9 release
<kenvandine> great
<kenvandine> let me know when it is ready
<slangasek> seb128: reassigned to the kernel ;)
<seb128> slangasek, thanks ;-)
<xan_> ok, see you
<jbicha> kenvandine: there's no particular reason why gwibber still uses python-support, is there?
<dobey> desrt: ping
<kenvandine> jbicha, i don't think so
<jjardon> kenvandine: https://launchpad.net/indicator-power/trunk/0.9 ;)
<kenvandine> jjardon, thx
<dobey> rodrigo_: feliz cumpleanos
<didrocks> dobey: who is working on the ubuntu-sso-client this cycle?
<jjardon> seb128: I'd like to have feedback about the external dependencies reorganization: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/release-team/2011-April/msg00232.html
<dobey> didrocks: in what sense? i'm guessing you don't mean in terms of windows porting :)
<didrocks> dobey: no, on the ubuntu version :)
<jjardon> rodrigo_: feliz cumpleaÃ±os!!
<rodrigo_> dobey, jjardon: gracias :)
<seb128> jjardon, I like it mostly, it would just be nice to have a public list of what you consider being in each category, is that list somewhere?
<rodrigo_> indeed, it's my birthday, so time to go out and get drunk :)
<jjardon> seb128: no, we are still discussing it
<dobey> didrocks: mostly nobody; is there a bug that needs fixed or something?
<seb128> jjardon, also for 2. I would prefer something which encourage not depending on unstable series for those components since having a stable GNOME depending on an unstable library is not a good thing for anyone
<didrocks> dobey: yeah, it seems to puzzle people, one sec, filing step to reproduce
<jjardon> seb128: agree
<rodrigo_> seb128, pitti, didrocks, chrisccoulson: if you feel like, please endorse me when you have time at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/RodrigoMoya/MOTUApplication
<seb128> rodrigo_, oh right, will do
<rodrigo_> as I said yesterday, I'll pay endorsements back with beer :)
<seb128> ;-)
<rodrigo_> oh jbicha already won 1 beer!
<chrisccoulson> i was just about to suggest that ;)
<jjardon> seb128: maybe we should depend on stable libraries in the end of the cycles
<rodrigo_> thanks jbicha
<chrisccoulson> -EPLEASEINSERTBEER :)
<rodrigo_> :D
<seb128> jjardon, what do you mean? you can't really go back, let's assume GNOME 3.1.1 started depending on cairo 1.11 or poppler 0.17
<desrt> dobey: pong
<rodrigo_> talking about beer, time for me to go pick one or 2, so have a good weekend all!
<seb128> jjardon, what would you do now since those are still not close from a stable version?
<jbicha> rodrigo_: lol, have a good weekend
<seb128> rodrigo_, thanks, enjoy your w.e!
<dobey> desrt: why does g_settings_set_strv() take a const gchar * const* if _get_strv() returns a gchar**?
<jjardon> seb128: so you suggest that 2 dependencies should be always stable versions?
<desrt> dobey: it's quite usual that functions return references to you but do not consume the ones that you pass to them
<didrocks> dobey: does it make sense to you: bug #857514
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 857514 in ubuntu-sso-client "/usr/lib/ubuntu-sso-client/ubuntu-sso-login shouldn't stop if a login dialog is shown" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/857514
<dobey> g_settings_set_strv(settings, key, g_settings_get_strv(settings, key)); -> compiler warning
<desrt> dobey: as well it should be.  you just leaked memory.
<desrt> dobey: g_settings_get_strv() is documented: Returns: a newly-allocated, NULL-terminated array of strings, the value that is stored at key in settings.
<dobey> the memory leak is obviousl wrong there, but passing in a gchar** doesn't leak memory
<dobey> and gcc doesn't warn about memory leaks (though would be awesome if it did)
<desrt> dobey: so you're dealing with my second most-hated thing about C
<desrt> dobey: use C++ :)
<seb128> jjardon, yes
<desrt> (seriously: if you compiled exactly that code with a C++ compiler, the warning would go away)
<desrt> C++ understands that it's always safe to promote char** to const char * const *
<desrt> but C does not
<desrt> so you must cast
<dobey> i want to use APIs that aren't designed to give me compiler warnings
<desrt> dobey: use a cast
<dobey> meh
<seb128> jjardon, or at least that we require having a public schedule from those project stating they will have their next stable out on time
<desrt> dobey: or construct an array of const char *
<desrt> that's not so difficult to do...
<desrt> dobey: or petition the ISO to fix this stupidity
<desrt> dobey: casting 'char **' to 'const char **' is actually unsafe
<dobey> didrocks: no, that doesn't make sense. it tracks pending requests afaik
<jjardon> seb128: I think that would work: If some GNOME dev needs some unstable version of a external library, He has to request info about the plans to the library authors, and make a propossal to the r-t with the info later
<desrt> dobey: but 'char **' to 'const char * const *' should really be automatic
<seb128> jjardon, right
<didrocks> dobey: can you test? I experienced it, and multiple people experienced it
<didrocks> desrt: I have an easy way to test if you are on oneiric up to date
<desrt> didrocks:  i am not :)
<didrocks> argh dobey ^
<didrocks> sorry desrt ;)
<didrocks> too many d* here :)
<seb128> cyphermox, did you upload evolution yet?
<dobey> didrocks: my laptop is up to date
<dobey> i need to get lunch though right now; add it to the bug :)
<didrocks> dobey: done, I guess that's the easiest way to get it, I'll add a different test case as well
<micahg> seb128: I think we should stick with 1.4.x for release, we can do rebuild testing and upgrade to 1.6.x post release if we have to
<seb128> micahg, right
<micahg> and I'll get natty fixed eventually...
<cyphermox> seb128: I did
<jbicha> kenvandine: gwibber wouldn't build for me http://paste.ubuntu.com/695718/
<seb128> cyphermox, ok, I've looked at the vcs, there is quite some git_* still there, should they we cleaned?
<seb128> cyphermox, you didn't push the update the to the vcs as well
<didrocks> dobey: so, reproducer on comment #2, should give you more insight :)
<cyphermox> no, not yet because it's still in the unapproved queue, thought it better to wait
<seb128> cyphermox, no, it's usually better to not wait ;-)
<kenvandine> jbicha, wrong valac version
<kenvandine> jbicha, it needs 0.12
<kenvandine> i should make the build smarter to detect valac-0.12 and use that
<jbicha> kenvandine: ah, thanks
<seb128> cyphermox, better to push whatever you do to avoid somebody else to commit other changes and have to rebase
<kenvandine> jbicha, so to build locally, you need to update-alternatives --set valac /usr/bin/valac-0.12
<kenvandine> something like that
<cyphermox> pushed now
<kenvandine> then if you want valac-0.14 to be the default, change it back after you are done building
<kenvandine> sucks, i know
<cyphermox> and yeah, we should drop those files. they're not listed in debian/patches/series though
<mterry> kenvandine, deja-dup uses a modified version of PROG_VALAC that specifies 'valac-0.12' as the executable to help with that: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~deja-dup-hackers/deja-dup/20/view/head:/acinclude.m4
<kenvandine> mterry, awesome, thx!
<seb128> cyphermox, thanks
<seb128> cyphermox, yeah, seems like you added them a while back and forgot to bzr del them once they were dropped from the series
<cyphermox> brb, lunch
<seb128> cyphermox, enjoy!
<didrocks> ok, time for week-end and some exercice, see you on Monday guys!
<kenvandine> jbicha, ok, gwibber trunk will build now without updating alternatives
<jbicha> kenvandine: I pushed the dh_python2 switch to the ubuntu-desktop branch
<kenvandine> jbicha, thx, i'll look at it
<seb128> jbicha, did you add the "ffe?" to the gthumb line in the etherpad?
<jbicha> seb128: yes
<seb128> jbicha, not sure but I assume we are on an unstable serie so we can as well get the current version from it
 * kenvandine needs to get around to a gwibber 3.1.92 release this weekend... so behind
<seb128> kenvandine, keep some capacity for next week, you have to maintain firefox, tb and deja-dup for a while
<seb128> ;-)
 * kenvandine hides under a big rock
<kenvandine> :-D
<seb128> oh, come on, mterry and chrisccoulson deserve some holidays and you stocked energy with yours ;-)
<chrisccoulson> heh
<mterry> :)
<jbicha> seb128: I guess you're right, the fact that we shipped 2.13.1 in natty confused me
<jbicha> seb128: what do you think about bug 839407? it's a regression from Natty, does it need a freeze exception to get back on the CD?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 839407 in gnome-utils "gnome-font-viewer missing in oneiric" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/839407
<seb128> jbicha, check with pitti on monday, I'm not sure how useful it is to install fonts in an OS where you can't select the font to use...
<seb128> "on an OS"
<seb128> but I'm fine having it on the CD as well
<seb128> i.e I don't really have a strong opinion either way, I don't think it's really that useful for most users but it's small and doesn't hurt to get
<mterry> tedg, how are dbusmenu_menuitem_proxy objects created?
<mterry> tedg, (I don't see the entry point to them from the rest of libdbusmenu)
<tedg> mterry, They're created by the sound menu and the messaging menu.
<tedg> mterry, They're the custom menuitems in those menus.
<tedg> mterry, The app exports, the service then proxies and exports an integrated menu.
<mterry> tedg, ok.  found a small leak there, but it's not the big one
<tedg> mterry, Ah, cool.
 * tedg is starting to realize that he doesn't have the bandwidth to have Qt installed on his machine... qt4-doc, 85M, seriously?
<jbicha> seb128: are you able to push caribou into the new queue or do I need an AA even for that?
<micahg> jbicha: seb128 is an AA :)
<jbicha> micahg: cool, thanks
<jbicha> seb128: I believe we're ready for caribou then
<jbicha> but can core-dev add new source packages?
<micahg> jbicha: MOTU and core-dev can upload a new source, an AA has to review it before it can hit the archive and build
<jbicha> thanks
<seb128> jbicha, do you need sponsoring?
<jbicha> seb128: yes please https://code.launchpad.net/~jbicha/+junk/caribou
<seb128> jbicha, sponsored, you can go on #ubuntu-release to point to the ffe bug and ask for it to get in ;-)
<ricotz> cyphermox, hello :), i noticed a small problem with network-manager-applet -- libnm-gtk0 is missing a versioned conflict with the old nm-gnome package
<cyphermox> ricotz:  good catch
<ricotz> currently the update is a bit bumpy ;)
<cyphermox> it has been released?
<ricotz> it isnt accepted yet, so you can still replace it
<cyphermox> ahah, yeah
<cyphermox> I'm not familiar with that procedure quire so much; seb128, I just upload a new revision on top?
<seb128> cyphermox: either that or reupload the same and ask for the previous one to be rejected
<cyphermox> ok
<cyphermox> can you reject it n-m-applet?
<seb128> cyphermox: seems infinity is doing active review, you can maybe get him to ack the upload for you ;-)
<seb128> cyphermox: rejected
<cyphermox> thanks
<seb128> yw
<cyphermox> I hate netlink so much.
<jbicha> seb128: does gnome-shell need to be manually pushed for depwait or will it rebuild automatically?
<seb128> jbicha, the later one
<slangasek> anyone here know when the new upstream version of lightdm is meant to be uploaded?  it's entangled a plymouth-shutdown-related fix that I had staged in bzr
<slangasek> I don't think I want to push that to the archive without robert_ancell's sign-off :)
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-09-24
<nardev> something like this http://lh4.ggpht.com/_B0CuCDv4i18/SckLBmN4HHI/AAAAAAAABAI/bBcx51pLCo8/desktop-list[11].png something like this: http://lh4.ggpht.com/_B0CuCDv4i18/SckLBmN4HHI/AAAAAAAABAI/bBcx51pLCo8/desktop-list[11].png
<charlie-tca> Maybe it's me, but I can't find any method to shutdown/log off Ubuntu after installing using beta2
<charlie-tca> I did change the text size to large, maybe that causes the menu to change?
<charlie-tca> It does cause it to change. When the text is made large, the gear thingy moved so far to the right it is gone until after a restart. The retart had to be done from terminal using 'sudo shutdown -r now', since there is no other way to do it without the gear.
<broder> charlie-tca: is that what happened? i figured that indicator-session just crashed
<charlie-tca> broder: for me, yes, enlarging the text pushes the last thing on the panel off to the right, since the text grew bigger in front of it
<charlie-tca> logging out or restarting allows the text to reposition on the panel, which lets that thing come back to the left
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-09-25
<gingerling> hey
<gingerling> anyone there?
<gingerling> just moved to unity and am a bit stressed out
<gingerling> in the controll centre, under the main menu button, you can click things to go/not go into your menu. Where is the place that this effects? It doesnt seem to change the side bar place, but I dont see any other form of main menu on the computer?
<gingerling> also, how do you move your indicators on the panel?
<gingerling> hi?
<gingerling> anyone there?
<gingerling> am kinda stuck
<broder> what package is responsible for the status icon that hte update information is outdated? because...it's slightly mis-sized on my machine - http://imgur.com/uIvdt
<cyphermox> broder: cute.
<cyphermox> I'd say this could be update-manager, but the icon doesn't look right (but it could just have been changed or something)
<micahg> broder: isn't that update-notifier?
<htorque> that's a known bug, let me find the bug-no.
<htorque> broder: bug 856125
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 856125 in unity "update-notifier systray icons showed and the wrong place and size" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/856125
<broder> htorque: ah, great. it seemed...obvious enough that someone else would have caught it, i just didn't know what i was looking for :)
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-09-17
<TheMuso> D/c
<veebers> Has any one else had issues with the latest IcedTea-web plugin on Quantal?
<TheMuso> Hrm. Unity 3D on Arm with OpenGLES with the pvr driver is... Interesting. A screen flicker for pretty much everything to do with window/launcher rendering. Yeah thats shippable.
<pitti> Good morning
<TheMuso> Morning pitti.
<didrocks> good morning
<TheMuso> Morning didrocks.
<didrocks> hey TheMuso
<TheMuso> didrocks: Is there any paperwork required for backporting unity upstream commits to the current packaging? I'd like to get the code for https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/1023542 into our unity package, so I can update at-spi2-atk from upstream to the latest upstream release. I don't want ot have to carry patches.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1023542 in unity "[a11y] Unity and unity-panel a11y initialization need to be ported to atk-bridge library" [Undecided,Fix committed]
<didrocks> TheMuso: there is going to be a release this week, so no need for backporting I guess as there will be all FFe and UIFe at the same time
<didrocks> TheMuso: I'll keep you in touch
<TheMuso> didrocks: Ok, I was just hoping to get it in before beta freeze. Do we know what version Unity will be at, as I could upload to proposed add a breaks.
<TheMuso> And do we know when the release is due?
<TheMuso> But am happy to wait assuming its not too close to the beta freeze.
<didrocks> TheMuso: I can just ensure you it will be before beta freeze :)
<didrocks> TheMuso: unity 6.6
<pitti> bonjour didrocks, ca va?
<TheMuso> didrocks: Ok thanks, please keep me posted.
<didrocks> pitti: Ã§a va bien, (toujours en train de tousser par contre) et toi?
<pitti> didrocks: nous sommes allÃ©s Ã  Dresden, c'Ã©tait bien!
<pitti> met our family and friends again
<pitti> it's always rather short, but we don't get to see them that often
<didrocks> sweet :)
<Mirv> TheMuso: tha paperworks includes getting FFe approved by the release time, preferably today. I added the bug report to be an FFe now as well
<Mirv> s/time/team/ :)
<dpm> good morning all
<dpm> could someone help me with unity-lens-photo? It seems not to be translatable on https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/quantal/+source/unity-lens-photo - and I can see no source package for it. Am I looking at the right place?
<didrocks> weird, the source is translatable apparently
<didrocks> and it's using distutils-extra
<didrocks> ah, maybe I know
 * trijntje is also translator, if there are any questions regarding the translation side of the photos-lens please ask
<dpm> didrocks, what puzzled me is the "there is no source package" message on https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/quantal/+source/unity-lens-photo
<dpm> thanks trijntje!
<dpm> bbiab
<didrocks> dpm: yeah, because it's unity-lens-photos
<didrocks> https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/quantal/+source/unity-lens-photos
<didrocks> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity-lens-photos/+publishinghistory
<didrocks> it's been published in universe and then promoted
<didrocks> there was no version directly uploaded to universe
<didrocks> that's why the template .pot wasn't extracted
<didrocks> I'm uploading a dummy version just for that
<didrocks> (done)
<om26er> who should i ping about bug 1045885
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1045885 in gnome-settings-daemon "Titlebar font is not 'Ubuntu Bold' in 12.10" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1045885
<trijntje> didrocks: when should this take effect?
<didrocks> trijntje: approx 2-3 hours I would say, time to import and so on
<didrocks> om26er: hum, can you check that they have ubuntu-settings package installed?
<trijntje> I see, thanks!
<didrocks> yw :)
<om26er> didrocks, it was not, just installed and relogin but the font is still not Ubuntu
<didrocks> om26er: it's ubuntu there
<didrocks> om26er: not running staging?
<om26er> i am running unity staging ppa, i have the issue on two different machines
<om26er> it works if i change it in dconf ;) so our setting is not changing the font i guess
<didrocks> om26er: what setting do you change in dconf?
<didrocks> and what do you have instead of "ubuntu"?
<didrocks> before changing it :)
<om26er> didrocks, org.gnome.desktop.wm.preferences have title bar font to 'Cantarell Bold 11'
<om26er> changing that to Ubuntu bold works
<didrocks> om26er: ok, confirming the value
<didrocks> om26er: can I get a screenshot? I still have the right title bar here
<didrocks> om26er: oh, maybe it's because compiz is fixed in staging to read the right gsettings value now
<didrocks> (just want to really understand what happened before making any change)
<om26er> didrocks, here http://imagebin.org/index.php?mode=image&id=228693
<didrocks> om26er: this is not the ubuntu font?
 * didrocks maybe is not awaken, but it seems to be the ubuntu one for him
<om26er> didrocks, no its not.
<om26er> its clearly not ubuntu font
<didrocks> om26er: the unity panel, right?
<didrocks> oh right, the n
<didrocks> om26er: but the gnome-terminal title bar is from what the reports says, which is not the case, right?
<om26er> didrocks, both panel and terminal are using the same (undesired) fonts
<didrocks> om26er: yeah, not the case here because this is fixed in compiz staging (using the gsettings key for compiz)
<didrocks> om26er: thanks! I'm fixing it in a few
<om26er> didrocks, super, thanks you.
<didrocks> yw ;)
<didrocks> om26er: do you have handy the value we had in the past?
<om26er> didrocks, Ubuntu Bold 11
<didrocks> om26er: yeah, confirming, was in the metacity space :)
<didrocks> excellent, changing it
<dpm> thanks didrocks (re: fixing the unity-lens-photos template)
<didrocks> yw :)
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<Laney> hey
<didrocks> hey chrisccoulson, Laney!
<didrocks> how are you guys?
<Laney> awesome
<Laney> went climbing in the peak district at the weekend
<Laney> want to get out to fontainebleau even more now ;-)
<chrisccoulson> hi didrocks, Laney
<didrocks> Laney: excellent :)
<chrisccoulson> climbing in the peak district sounds nice. i wouldn't mind doing something like that again soon once i've shed another 15kg or so :)
<Laney> heh
<didrocks> Sweetshark: hey, are you back from your holidays?
<Laney> chrisccoulson: what do you think about the webapps/firefox ffe? Is it advisable to land it given that it depends on something going for the chop?
<chrisccoulson> Laney, it also symlinks folders / files between profiles, thus bypassing the profile locking mechanism which exists for a good reason
<Laney> hmm
<chrisccoulson> that is definitely completely unacceptable to ship anywhere
<Laney> does upstream know about this?
<chrisccoulson> but honestly, i don't think we have a choice about the matter. i just won't let it go near any of my machines
<chrisccoulson> i'm not sure how much they know. they clearly haven't reviewed any of it
<Laney> I meant upstream as in PS(?)
<Laney> do they know what they should be fixing
<Laney> popey: ^?
<chrisccoulson> oh, ok
<chrisccoulson> i'm not sure
<chrisccoulson> the implementation makes me want to to cry though
<Laney> this feels like a rock/hard place situation
<chrisccoulson> especially when you consider that the upstream (mozilla) webapp mode works fine without any of these hacks or depending on a feature that's about to be removed
<popey> Laney, one for ken / racarr / alo i think.
<chrisccoulson> the symlinking of folders between profiles is asking for trouble though. that's a heisenbug (or at worst, profile corruption) waiting to happen
<popey> hmm, alo not here..
<popey> Laney, I'll poke racarr and ken when they wake
<Laney> thanks
<chrisccoulson> gah, damn you greasemonkey
<chrisccoulson> bug 1051152 is now the most frequent crash in the firefox beta (well, if you ignore flash)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1051152 in firefox "Firefox 16 beta crash in nsIContent::SetAttr with greasemonkey installed" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1051152
<Sweetshark> <- back!
<Sweetshark> (connectivity limited though)
<Sweetshark> didrocks: &&
<Sweetshark> didrocks: ^^
<didrocks> hey Sweetshark! How were your holidays?
<Sweetshark> didrocks: I still am on tenerife ;) -- but quite nice indeed.
<Sweetshark> oh oh, inbox 2200.
<Sweetshark> well, could be worse.
<didrocks> heh :)
<didrocks> good catchup!
<Sweetshark> didrocks: booking a flight to gran canaria for tommorrow to visit the aentos guys.
<didrocks> Sweetshark: oh, excellent!
<chrisccoulson> Sweetshark, i'll gladly swap my inbox for yours ;)
<chrisccoulson> i've got about 11000 unread
<Sweetshark> chrisccoulson: protip: get more involved in upstream and give them your phone number. they will force you to read your inbox during vacation ;)
<didrocks> tjaalton: hey!
<didrocks> tjaalton: you did upload mesa? so the regression has been fixed upstream?
<tjaalton> didrocks: it never was a regression in the 9.0 branch, but we had a version created before it got branched..
<tjaalton> and yes it's fixed in upstream master too
<didrocks> tjaalton: excellent, I'll close the bug then! Thanks :)
<tjaalton> should be closed now?
<tjaalton> yeah
<didrocks> just saw you did! exellent :)
<tjaalton> the upload closed it :)
<didrocks> pitti: any pick on bug #1049058, do you know what this file is for?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1049058 in apport "Obsolete config file -lts-q-backports-left after precise to quantal upgrades" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1049058
<tjaalton> didrocks: someone tested the backports ppa
<didrocks> tjaalton: ah ok, it was that bug #, as the text didn't really matched, thanks!
<didrocks> tjaalton: meaning?
<tjaalton> didrocks: oh it's apport.. nevermind, I have the same file here and not enabled the ppa
<didrocks> tjaalton: ok, let's wait for pitti to see if apport has some magic involved :)
<tjaalton> didrocks: it's the ppa where the X/kernel stack is being prepared for 12.04.2
<tjaalton> backport from quantal
<didrocks> ah, and so it's adding a tag to it
<didrocks> not sure what should clean the conffile then
<pitti> didrocks: sorry, got disconnected; looking
<pitti> didrocks: ah, we introduced that in a precise SRU for the kernel/X.org PPA testing
<pitti> didrocks: I'll handle it, thanks!
<didrocks> pitti: thanks :)
<doko> didrocks, pitti: for when is the next gnome update scheduled?
<doko> qauntal
<pitti> 3.5.92 tarballs are due today
<pitti> so today/tomorrow/Wednesday
<doko> grr
<Laney> you have Beta Freeze on Thursday anyway
<Laney> so the builders should be quieter thereafter
<doko> ahh, nice
<GunnarHj> pitti: Hi Martin, it has been a while since. I have suffered from multiple health issues, and spent about five months at hospitals and similar places.
<GunnarHj> When dealing with bug 1018621 I noticed that lp:ubuntu/accountsservice does not show the quantal revisions as I would have expected. Perhaps a Launchpad issue?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1018621 in accountsservice ""Language for menus and windows" is not saved if .profile is missing" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1018621
<GunnarHj> Instead of making an MP I attached a patch to the bug. Hope that's good enough.
<GunnarHj> Do you possibly have time to sponsor the proposal? It's about a spot in the code that you reviewed previously.
<pitti> hey GunnarHj, welcome back! ugh, that doesn't sound good, are you better now?
<pitti> GunnarHj: yeah, sometimes the automatic UDD imports lag behind, so a patch is fine
<pitti> GunnarHj: of course, I'll have a look
<GunnarHj> pitti: Yes, I keep getting better, and will move back home tomorrow. Thanks for checking it out.
<pitti> GunnarHj: ah, good to hear, good luck!
<davidcalle> pitti, salut, I've seen Robert Ancell uploading a gir enabled exiv lib and since you asked the other day, I wanted to let you know that I have a Photos lens branch now using it.
<pitti> davidcalle: sweet!
<pitti> davidcalle: so you can search for tags now?
<davidcalle> pitti, you can already search for tags without using it (Shotwell takes care of extracting them and it has them in db). It's mostly for other exif things (make, model, flash...).
<pitti> hm, the photo lens doesn't currently seem to work for me at all
<pitti> it shows no results whatsoever
<desrt> good morning, fellow buntuites
<davidcalle> pitti, yikes. Do you have anything imported in Shotwell? Or any online account enabled?
<pitti> yes, I have thousands of photos, in the XDG dir
<ogra_> probably it doesnt like their content ?
<pitti> I don't use picasa, but I have google enabled in online accounts
<pitti> probably the pr0n filter
<ogra_> anything scary one them ? :)
<ogra_> *on
<pitti> argh, back in ~ 10 min
<davidcalle> pitti, ok, currently the lens only supports what's in Shotwell. Folder support needed the new exif lib (to actually be useful), and it has only landed a few hours ago.
<didrocks> davidcalle: landed? there is a FFe for it?
<davidcalle> didrocks, the exif lib has landed, not the support for it in the lens
<didrocks> ah ok :)
<pitti> davidcalle: but I do use shotwell
<pitti> davidcalle: I did all the tagging etc. there
<pitti> .shotwell/data/photo.db is 2.6 MB, that should be enough fodder?
<davidcalle> pitti, oh right. Then It's because you need a newer version for it to support big Shotwell libraries. If you want to test it, there is a package in https://code.launchpad.net/~unity-lens-photos/+archive/staging , install and then just killall unity-lens-photos to restart it.
<davidcalle> pitti, it's the version that will land with the incoming Unity release.
<pitti> that seems to help; I don't see thumbnails, though
<pitti> wow, that's grinding the CPU
<pitti> so I do see thumbnails for some searches, but not for others
<davidcalle> pitti, just the first search, then it should be smooth.
<davidcalle> pitti, no thumbnails as "the image not found" icon, or just the Dash background instead of an icon?
<davidcalle> pitti, first case it's because Shotwell doesn't have a thumbnail for it, second case it's a Unity bug
<pitti> anyway, thanks! seems to work much better now
<pitti> davidcalle: just a grey default icon
<davidcalle> pitti, ok, then that's a bug for me :)
 * ogra_ wonders if you guys test that feature on arm 
<davidcalle> (it should fallback on Nautilus thumbs, then raw file, but apparently it doesn't)
<davidcalle> ogra_, not tested on arm, but if you have some hardware for me... :) More seriously, if you are able to test it and find arm specific bugs, please file them and I'll find a way to get my hands on some hw.
<ogra_> davidcalle, well, desktop as well as Dx have pandaboards for this
<chrisccoulson> does anyone run quantal on their pandaboard?
<Sweetshark> jasoncwarner_: ping?
<ogra_> yes
<chrisccoulson> ogra_, oh, i had precise on mine, but it seemed to stop working after i upgraded it to quantal (nothing on the screen), but i've not had a chance to figure out why
<ogra_> chrisccoulson, hmm i havent tested any upgrades yet, probably Qa did though
<ogra_> chrisccoulson, and i wouldnt suggest upgrading anyway, since that would leave you with rootfs on SD
<ogra_> which we dont engourage anymore for desktop installs, IO is way to slow
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I installed beta1, WFM
<pitti> well, unity is horribly slow of course, so I disabled lightdm and just use it with ssh
<chrisccoulson> ok, i'll try doing a fresh install now
<chrisccoulson> heh, unity is slow, even on my main machine ;)
<chrisccoulson> (well, it is if i leave it running for a day)
<ogra_> pitti, hmm, it shouldnt be slow, did you actually us the final beta image or any candidate ?
<ogra_> *use
<ogra_> well, slower than on x86 ... but pretty usable still
<pitti> well, it's already slow on my quad-core i7 :)
<ogra_> (we include the binary driver in the image since the last beta candisate)
<pitti> ogra_: ah, I didn't get that one then, I guess
<ogra_> well, then unity wouldnt even start ;)
<pitti> ogra_: but doesn't that violate pretty much every promise about free software, and licenses, etc. that we ever gave?
<ogra_> we dont have any fllback on arm
<pitti> that seems something which should at least have gotten a big announcement from sabdfl or a TB discussion
<ogra_> pitti, yeah, we might need to call it a panda remix or some such
<pitti> because the installer, ISO pages, web pages etc. all speak about FOSS
<ogra_> since its the only opportunity to run the desktop now
<pitti> self-selected tragedy..
<ogra_> (note that we dropped desktop for all other arches (or switched to derivatives))
<ogra_> but panda is our reference board atm, so it needs to work there
<pitti> hm, xubuntu or lubuntu images might indeed not be the worst choice there? that should be reasonably fast
<ogra_> right
<chrisccoulson> ah, it's great that i can download the image in around 90 seconds :)
<ogra_> pitti, execpt that we still need a reference image for ubuntu-desktop on arm
<pitti> with compiz and all those gazillion python processes the current unity packages don't seem to be something that a real product on an arm phone/tablet would use, or are they?
<ogra_> and the panda is the only platform that even has a shippable driver
<ogra_> what do you think all TVs have inside ;)
<pitti> yeah, I agree that under those conditions, putting it on canonical.com and flag it as "contains binary driver" sounds like the best approach
<ogra_> ubuntu-tv and ubuntu-tablet will be arm
<ogra_> ugh, i would really like to keep it on cdimage
<ogra_> pitti, i'll discuss it with steve once he's back from vac.
<ogra_> i dont mind calling it a remox and have an explaining wikipage for this, but i dont want to have to use any non standard location for it
<ogra_> (or any non tsandard build system that differs in any way from cdimage, else teh reference part is moot)
<xnox> pitti: don't we have a checkbox in ubiquity "install binary blobs" and it is offered on all images?!
<pitti> yes, we do
<ogra_> xnox, yes, that leaves the choice to the user
<xnox> pitti: don't you have to boot with "free software" option only in the boot screen?
<ogra_> not on arm
<ogra_> we dont have a bootloader menu there
<pitti> neither has the live session and default install without that option
<xnox> ogra_: shouldn't we have it ticked on panda boards, and well fail install if a person unticks it?
<pitti> the TB unanimously defeated the proposal to install nonfree drivers by default (i. e. that checkbox)
<xnox> pitti: true, I remember that now.
<xnox> hmmm =(
<xnox> looks like we don't have a releasable panda then.
<ogra_> well, thats why we have defined the remix stuff
<ogra_> we do, we just cant call it plain ubuntu
<xnox> Bambuntu
<ogra_> but as the netbook-remix i think that can live next to the other images as long as its tagged the right way
<Laney> which package are we talking about?
<Laney> I see this: "All of the application software installed by default is free software. In addition, we install some hardware drivers that are available only in binary format, but such packages are clearly marked in the restricted component."
<Laney> not sure that matches my expectations
<ogra_> ah, under that term pandas would be fine
<ogra_> Laney, where exactly is that from ?
<Laney> ogra_: http://www.ubuntu.com/project/about-ubuntu/licensing
<Laney> but I don't understand that text to be in line with the TB's decision
<ogra_> yeah, it surely isnt
<ogra_> if the decision was actually that strict
<Laney> hmm
<Laney> I misunderstand
<Laney> http://article.gmane.org/gmane.linux.ubuntu.devel.announce/817
<ogra_> yeah, thats only about the checkbox
<Laney> "the only concession is
<Laney> for hardware drivers"
<ogra_> right
<Laney> should be ok then
<ogra_> yeah
<ogra_> though we should note it somewhere ... release notes or so
<Laney> possibly in the installer?
<ogra_> so people arent surprised
<ogra_> hmm, i dont like the idea that we might have to maintain arch specific code for this in the installer
<ogra_> and iirc the first page of the final installer usually links to the release notes
<Laney> well, it's more of an ongoing thing
<Laney> so probably not ideally placed in the release notes, but maybe nothing is needed if we've always allowed this
<Riddell> anyone able to test taglib 1.8 for bug 1050463 ?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1050463 in taglib "FFe update to 1.8" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1050463
<didrocks> tjaalton: hey, are you working on bug #966744 btw? do you need more help?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 966744 in xserver-xorg-video-intel "[i965] Resume from suspend leaves me with black screen or a screen of the desktop before it suspended. Compiz hung in intel_update_renderbuffers() from intel_prepare_render() from brw_draw_prims()" [Critical,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/966744
<didrocks> tjaalton: same question on bug #927168
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 927168 in mesa "compiz crashed with SIGSEGV in memmove() from drisw_update_tex_buffer() from dri_set_tex_buffer2() from drisw_bind_tex_image() from __glXBindTexImageEXT() from TfpTexture::enable() from enableFragmentOperationsAndDrawGeometry()" [Critical,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/927168
<didrocks> hey kenvandine!
<didrocks> how are you?
<kenvandine> good
<kenvandine> didrocks, my unity branches got approved :)
<didrocks> saw that!
<didrocks> congrats :)
<kenvandine> libunity not quite
<didrocks> kenvandine: can you check on bug #1042343 with the U1 team?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1042343 in ubuntuone-client "[FFE] Ubuntu One integration with Q sync indicator" [High,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1042343
<kenvandine> sure
<didrocks> to know if it's going to land or not
<didrocks> and when :)
<didrocks> thanks!
<didrocks> kenvandine: I'm taking care of the empathy update for GNOME, no worry :)
<kenvandine> good, thanks :)
<didrocks> I think gfvs is on pitti's plate :)
<didrocks> so taking devhelp and empathy now
<kenvandine> didrocks, the word from U1 on bug 1042343 is "should be no later than tomorrow"
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1042343 in ubuntuone-client "[FFE] Ubuntu One integration with Q sync indicator" [High,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1042343
<didrocks> kenvandine: excellent, thanks!
<didrocks> skaet: ^
<skaet> thanks kenvandine,  didrocks.
<kenvandine> probably today actually
<charles> mterry: https://bugs.launchpad.net/indicator-sync/+bug/1051798
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1051798 in indicator-sync "Clicking SyncMenuApp's 'paused' button causes feedback loop if >1 indicator running" [Low,In progress]
<charles> (fyi)
<mterry> charles, awesome, thanks
<mterry> charles, does seem like low likelihood of being triggered
<mterry> I wonder why it ever stops...  race condition maybe?
<charles> yeah I agree wrt low likelihood, that's why I marked it as Low  urgency
<charles> I didn't track down why it stopped. It's likely a race condition
<charles> testing for timing issues on four separate processes is fun :)
<mterry> :)
<xnox> Magic Desktop people, please help with bug 1052040
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1052040 in ubiquity "[regression] ubiquity greeter does not have overlay scrollbars in quantal, but it did in precise" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1052040
<xnox> what changed w.r.t. overlay scrollbars between precise & quantal?
<ogra_> greeter ?
 * xnox fail at english
<ogra_> well, where are any scrollbars in the greeter ?
<ogra_> it only fires up a panel and ubiquity, no ?
<xnox> ogra_: the language selection has scrollbar, see screenshots
<ogra_> oh, i see what you mean
<xnox> ogra_: also this could be the reason for scrollbars during slideshow, as the overlay scrollbars would not be visible.
<ogra_> iirc there was a var to not have the scrollbars be replaced, probably casper or ubiquity set that somewhere ... though it would be surprising if that went unnoticed
<xnox> ogra_: as far as I know, nothing changed in ubiquity w.r.t. scrollbars....
<xnox> ogra_: but I did notice that scrollbars became 'gtk plugin' instead of 'gtk module' or something along those lines, or LD_PRELOAD -> proper gtk module
 * xnox or something like that.....
<didrocks> tedg: can you please give a hand to xnox? ^
<ogra_> oh, right, you might need to explicitly load it in csettings somewhere
<ogra_> *gsettings
<didrocks> ogra_: the default is true though
<didrocks> xnox: org.gnome.desktop.interface ubuntu-overlay-scrollbars
<ogra_> didrocks, and its fine if you run the live session
<xnox> also notice how quantal loads in much higher resolution =) *nice*
<didrocks> there is really an init env issue on the ubiquity-dm :)
<xnox> yes, yes there is. =)))
<didrocks> :)
<ogra_> i assume we dont start gnome-settings-daemon the right way
<didrocks> I think it's all linked unfortunately
<didrocks> ogra_: it's my bet as well
<didrocks> this, the font, and so onâ¦
<xnox> we actually do start g-s-d
<ogra_> or in the right order or whatever
<didrocks> I think ogra_ is right, there is a timing issue or something like that
<xnox> didrocks: look at the screenshot, the font is correct there (well at least when I managed to take the screenshot...)
<didrocks> or in the way it's launched
<didrocks> xnox: yeah, but you told me that a lot of time it wasn't, right?
<didrocks> xnox: you asked me for the gsettings key, telling gsettings didn't get the right result
<xnox> true.
<didrocks> so there is "something" weird
<xnox> but g-s-d used to crash under ubiquity-dm
<didrocks> maybe desrt would have an idea
<xnox> now that was fixed and it doesn't anymore
<didrocks> ah :)
<didrocks> ok
<didrocks> so that's fixed
<xnox> so _now_ I am expecting everything to look perfect =)
<didrocks> it was just crashing, then ubiquity loads at the wrong time
<didrocks> ok, so the overlay however isn't loaded
<xnox> hmmm...
<didrocks> xnox: can you just read the gsettings key and print the result?
<didrocks> xnox: to ensure it sees "true"
<xnox> ... from the same environment eh?!
<xnox> =)
<didrocks> xnox: from ubiquity itself
 * didrocks needs to run out today, see you tomorrow guys
<didrocks> xnox: if it's seeing true, we can dig into that together tomorrow
 * xnox 0/
<didrocks> just ping me :)
<tedg> xnox, There was a "don't scroll me bro" command that apps can use
<tedg> xnox, It seems that it's broken though tsdgeos has submitted a patch.
<davidcalle> Laney, hi, I'm not sure about what you are asking on the Unity UIFe for the photos lens. If the photos lens is already in Quantal? Or if the version with the new icon paths is already in Quantal?
<ogra_> tedg, the point is that we *do* want to have them :)
<xnox> tedg: ok, but g-s-d is running, there are fonts, yet the scrollbar is "fat" instead of "overlay"
<xnox> tedg: compare the two screenshots on the bug 1052040
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1052040 in ubiquity "[regression] ubiquity greeter does not have overlay scrollbars in quantal, but it did in precise" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1052040
<Laney> davidcalle: you said it depends on some change in Unity
<Laney> I want to know if that change is already in or if it's in a future Unity version
<tedg> Ah, I see.
<davidcalle> Laney, the changes are in the Unity branches linked to the report, so not yet in Quantal.
<Laney> ok
<tedg> xnox, I wonder if the env is getting setup.
<tedg> xnox, You should grab Cimi when he gets back, that should be tomorrow.
<xnox> tedg: Cimi being didrocks?
<tedg> xnox, No, Cimi being Cimi :-)
<xnox> ah =)
<xnox> Cimi
<xnox> gotcha
<Sweetsharks2> hi there. im getting desparate at gettin wifi to work eith network manager in this hotel an lf am running out of ideas. wifi works, i can see the notebook ip from my android phone. yet i cant even ping the gw.
<Sweetsharks2> any hints?
<chrisccoulson> you might have more luck directing that at cyphermox :)
<cyphermox> Sweetsharks2: that's not a whole lot of info to debug wifi ;)
<cyphermox> so,, you're reportedly connected but can't ping the gateway?
<cyphermox> can you ping 8.8.8.8 ?
<cyphermox> (maybe the gateway or a firewall is blocking icmp)
<cyphermox> Sweetsharks2: if you can tell me what driver is used that can help too
<Sweetsharks2> cyphermox: no, i can only ping myself.
<Sweetsharks2> iwlwifi
<Sweetsharks2> i get a good gateway though. the same i see from my android phone.
<Sweetsharks2> no, i cant ping google dns.
<semkox> will lava 7 be never in repos for ubuntu?
<semkox> *java
<Sweetsharks2> cyphermox: i font yhink there is anything wrong on the wpa level, but routing is very broken.
<cyphermox> but routing shouldn't ever be different
<cyphermox> I mean, you'll only have the default gateway
<cyphermox> if you can't ping; they're doing something funky
<cyphermox> perhaps you can't be connected to more than one device with the same account?
<chrisccoulson> ogra_, if i boot my pandaboard with the quantal b1 image, i still get a blank screen (but the monitor is on) :(
<chrisccoulson> but i can switch to a console, and see this error:
<chrisccoulson> omapdss HDMI error: failed to enable GPIO's
<cyphermox> chrisccoulson: I saw those briefly on mine the other day
<Sweetsharks2> cyphrmox: Iirc I got some shaky connection yesterday  when setting ipv6 to ignore. but i do get that now. i drove to another hotel yesterday an everything worked there :-(
<Sweetsharks2> s/do get/dont get/
<Sweetsharks2> cyphermox: I get a 192.168.10.69 ip with 1000 mtu in ifconfig
<cyphermox> Sweetsharks2: that seems like a pretty low mtu, but it shouldn't be a problem
<stgraber> if IPv6 is somehow involved, 1000 is an invalid MTU. Lowest MTU for IPv6 is 1280
<cyphermox> anything in syslog mentions anything from the kernel about "TX", or transmit issues, or something caught by the firewall?
<cyphermox> stgraber: I doubt any hotel in the world gives IPv6 ;)
<Sweetsharks2> cyphermox: route -n looks strange to me: 0.0.0.0 gw 192.168.10.1 mask 0 ug metric 0
<Sweetsharks2> ...
<Sweetsharks2> checking syslog
<cyphermox> nah, should be fine
<cyphermox> otherwise I'd say check if wpasupplicant says anything in syslog again if you enable debugging (sudo /usr/lib/NetworkManager/debug-helper.py --wpa debug) and if you receive any traffic with tcpdump -i wlan0
<Sweetsharks2> syslog has "tx aggregation enabled on ra =  hexfoo tid=0
<cyphermox> that's normally fine
<cyphermox> you could also try to disable 11n
<cyphermox> Sweetsharks2: http://adeadhamster.blogspot.ca/2010/10/linux-iwlagn-problems.html
<Sweetsharks2> oh and ip6addrconf timed out or failed by nw manager
<cyphermox> that's normal if the hotel doesn't hand out IPv6 addresses
<Sweetsharks2> iwlagn module isnt even loaded it seems
<Sweetsharks2> cyphrmox: that first line of the route table looks  good  to me too, but the is another for 192.254.0.0 mask 255.255.0
<Sweetsharks2> .0 with metric 1000 that looks odd
<Sweetsharks2> eh
<Sweetsharks2> 169.254.0.0 mask 255.255.0.0
<Sweetsharks2> cyphermox: https://plus.google.com/app/plus/mp/205/#~loop:aid=z12wc11y5o2owvq0h22gv5kw5tmvgx1sm&view=activity
<cyphermox> Sweetsharks2: there's nothing abnormal in this
<cyphermox> the driver might be iwlwifi rather than iwlagn
<Sweetsharks2> arrrrgh. if thrre is nothing wrong with it why doesnt it work?
<Sweetsharks2> my phone even sees the ip of ghe notebook even with the correct mac address
<Sweetsharks2> cyphermox: this is on precise, is there alternative to debug-helper.py?
<Sweetsharks2> ok. giving up fot now :-\
<jbicha> robert_ancell: hey, have you had a chance to try cheese again recently?
<robert_ancell> jbicha, no
<jbicha> did you see my comment on bug 1045539
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1045539 in cheese "Update to 3.5.91" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1045539
<robert_ancell> jbicha, building now
<jbicha> robert_ancell: you might as well build 3.5.92, translation update :)
<robert_ancell> jbicha, I'm getting this /usr/lib/gcc/x86_64-linux-gnu/4.7/../../../x86_64-linux-gnu/libclutter-gst-2.0.so: undefined reference to `gst_message_parse_duration'
<robert_ancell> was also getting it with gnome-contacts
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-09-18
<thomi> When I ssh in to a laptop and do: "export DISPLAY=:0 && gedit" the editor doesn't have an integrated menu in the panbel
<thomi> *panel
<thomi> does anyone know what I'm missing (I guess an environment variable) in order to get that working correctly?
<thomi> bah - nvm. Seems it's UBUNTU_MENUPROXY - should have seen that one.
<TheMuso> D/c
<jbicha> robert_ancell: oh, I missed your message but I read the backlog
<jbicha> I'm guessing clutter-gst-2.0 needs to be adjusted for the lastest gstreamer
<jbicha> it hit gnome-sushi too
<jbicha> or...maybe clutter-gst-2.0 just needs a rebuild; that worked for a totem 3.5 problem in the gnome3 ppa
<robert_ancell> k
<jbicha> ok, I just sent a rebuild
<jbicha> robert_ancell: I believe rebuilding clutter-gst-2.0 worked :)
<robert_ancell> jbicha, cool, updating now
<robert_ancell> jbicha, cheese now works for me
<jbicha> robert_ancell: cool, I'm converting the bug to a FFe
<pitti> Good morning
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> bonjour didrocks!
<didrocks> bonjour pitti! comment Ã§a va?
<pitti> Ã§a va bien, merci!
<pitti> although I do feel a bit meat-grinded :)
<pitti> in yesterday's training we didn't do Taekwondo, but we got a lesson in Brazilian Jutsu
<didrocks> oh, interesting :)
<didrocks> how was it?
<pitti> which was fun, but my body isn't used to that :)
<pitti> it's more like wrestling and locking your partner into an "inescapable" grip and choke
<didrocks> ah ok, so yeah, I can imagine you are using other muscles for that :)
<jibel> good morning
<jibel> little error with updates this morning bug 1052331
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1052331 in pyatspi "package python3-pyatspi2 2.5.92+dfsg-0ubuntu1 failed to install/upgrade: subprocess installed post-installation script returned error exit status 1" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1052331
<didrocks> hey jibel!
<didrocks> TheMuso: can you look at that one? it's part of your update
<didrocks> ah dholbach was quicker :)
<didrocks> tjaalton: hey, did you see my questions yesterday?
<didrocks> jibel: dholbach uploaded a fix, thanks!
<jibel> didrocks, cool, thanks!
<tjaalton> didrocks: I did yes. it looks undecided if the llvmpipe compiz crasher is a compiz bug or something in mesa
<tjaalton> didrocks: the other one I should send upstream..
<didrocks> tjaalton: the other is bug #966744, right?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 966744 in xserver-xorg-video-intel "[i965] Resume from suspend leaves me with black screen or a screen of the desktop before it suspended. Compiz hung in intel_update_renderbuffers() from intel_prepare_render() from brw_draw_prims()" [Critical,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/966744
<tjaalton> didrocks: btw, there is libwacom 0.6 released early july that I've forgot to upload. no other big changes other than a soname bump, but do you think it would be possible to upload via -proposed and rebuild g-s-d/g-c-c against it?
<tjaalton> didrocks: yup
<didrocks> tjaalton: can you state that in the bug report and taking care of the bug #966744? (so I think there is no resolution of the issue before quantal, right?)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 966744 in xserver-xorg-video-intel "[i965] Resume from suspend leaves me with black screen or a screen of the desktop before it suspended. Compiz hung in intel_update_renderbuffers() from intel_prepare_render() from brw_draw_prims()" [Critical,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/966744
<didrocks> tjaalton: when you speak about upstream, you mean, xorg upstream, right?
<didrocks> or the intel driver one?
<didrocks> not compiz?
<tjaalton> didrocks: right, mesa/intel upstream, bugs.fd.o
<didrocks> tjaalton: would you mind tracking it? (and add a comment stating that)
<tjaalton> sure
<didrocks> thanks!
<didrocks> on bug #927168, what should be done?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 927168 in compiz "compiz crashed with SIGSEGV in memmove() from drisw_update_tex_buffer() from dri_set_tex_buffer2() from drisw_bind_tex_image() from __glXBindTexImageEXT() from TfpTexture::enable() from enableFragmentOperationsAndDrawGeometry()" [Critical,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/927168
<didrocks> as we don't really know where the crash is
<tjaalton> sounds like it could at least be worked around in compiz
<tjaalton> is vanvugt on irc?
<tjaalton> oh duflu
<didrocks> tjaalton: yeah!
<didrocks> tjaalton: if it can worked around, please ping him :)
<didrocks> that would be one less critical bug on our list!
<didrocks> on libwacom6 -> if it's just an ABI break and not an API break, no worry with me for the rebuild, I think it will need a FFe, no?
<dpm> good morning desktop folk
<dpm> Does anyone know where the strings to integrate with applications in the online accounts dialog come from?.E.g. "Publish your pictures to Facebook" "Integrate your feed data" - I'm trying to find out if they're translatable at all
<tjaalton> didrocks: the soname should've been bumped for 0.5
<tjaalton> this one mostly just adds some tests and tablet definitions
<tjaalton> would probably need an FFe being so late in the cycle..
<didrocks> hey dpm
<dpm> morning didrocks!
<didrocks> tjaalton: yeah, if you get one acked, I can help you with the transition
<Sweetshark> moin everyone from somewhere in the atlantic ....
<pitti> Sweetshark: *in*?
<pitti> you IRC while swimming?!
<Sweetshark> pitti: im ircing while on a ferry from tenerife to gran canaria
<pitti> ah, that does sound enjoyable :)
<didrocks> hey Sweetshark!
<Sweetshark> didrocks: bonjour a toi!
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<didrocks> hey chrisccoulson! how are you?
<pitti> bonjour chrisccoulson!
<chrisccoulson> hi didrocks. yeah, i'm good thanks. how are you?
<chrisccoulson> hi pitti, how are you?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: still coughing, but overall great! thanks :)
<pitti> Sweetshark: holidays, or did you manage to declare this a business trip? :-)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: quite fine, thanks! how about yourself?
<Laney> hey
<pitti> c'est un Laney! bonjour
<didrocks> pitti: you don't see him working next to the swimming pool?
<didrocks> hey Laney :)
<pitti> didrocks: furiously!
<pitti> "Hey Baby! Can I get you a drink and show you how to build LibO"?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, not too bad thanks. looking forward to doing some actual hacking today
<didrocks> ahah, and he has some argumentsâ¦ :-)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: hacking == fixing bugs? ;)
<chrisccoulson> heh, kind of
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: http://reports.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-q-tracking-bug-tasks.html you have 2 high bugs :)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: would be cool if you can get a status on them :)
<Sweetshark> pitti: I will try to make this a business trip after the fact. Im visiting aentos and aruiz on gran canaria ;)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: so didrocks is cracking the whip now?
<Sweetshark> pitti: also, AFAIK the ultimate nerd picup line is "did you see the wikipedia entry about me btw?"
<chrisccoulson> yeah, it seems like it ;)
<pitti> oh, c'est l'anniversaire de sabdfl
<didrocks> pitti: I find seb128 to be too sloppy. Time to get serious!
<pitti> Fifty Shades of Didier!
<didrocks> :)
<Laney> my word
<Sweetshark> pitti: oh does that mean we all get a day off and wave to a boat driving down the river thames?
<pitti> Sweetshark: ... boat? I had expected something more fancy like a Soyuz, or at least the Canonical 1!
<Sweetshark> pitti: "please now raise your head to observe the reentry of sabdfl in Canonical 1 for touchdown at the olympic stadium"?
<pitti> Sweetshark: now we're talking!
<dpm> ok, I've found out where the strings from online accounts come from. They are in .application files such as http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~unity-lens-photos/unity-lens-photos/trunk/view/head:/unity-lens-photos.application and http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~gwibber-committers/gwibber/trunk/view/head:/data/gwibber.application - it seems that they are unfortunately untranslatable, so I'd like to file a bug. Does anyone know what the best source package to do
<dpm>  it against would be?
<pitti> speaking of rockets, isn't it time soon for the new big bang theory season?
<didrocks> dpm: I can fix the unity-lens-photos one
<didrocks> dpm: just ping ken for gwibber
<dpm> didrocks, is it fixable, though? I've never heard of .application files before, I'm not even sure they support translation
<didrocks> dpm: I'm looking if we have .application.in files somewhere
<didrocks> as it's pure xml, it should be, but one sec
<didrocks> dpm: hum, we don't have any examples, let's ping upstream
<davidcalle> didrocks, in /usr/share/accounts/applications
<didrocks> davidcalle: right, but they are all not translatable
<dpm> didrocks, are .application files a fd.o standard? I had never heard of them
<didrocks> dpm: no, but it's a traditional xml ones though
<didrocks> dpm: we do have some tools to translates xml files I guess, right? (like the .ui)
<didrocks> I see         <translations>unity-lens-photos</translations>
<Sweetshark> oh wow, I have three talks accepted for the LibreOffice conference. I guess I have to create more than abstracts for them now :-/
<didrocks> dpm: xml2po and so on for instance
<dpm> didrocks, I don't think we do have tools to handle translations for generic xml other than intltool (and yes, xml2po, but we don't have any existing infrastructure or hooks into build systems for that afaik). Intltool might extract the strings, but they will have to be put manually in the source packages, they won't be shippable in language packs, unless we add support for them as we currently do with e.g. .policy and .desktop files
<didrocks> dpm: we are using xml2po for compiz g-c-c integration files
<didrocks> we just need to extract them in the .pot file
<didrocks> then, I guess the application loading the xml
<didrocks> should gettext(package, string)
<didrocks> I asked mardy about it, waiting for an answer
<dpm> excellent, thanks didrocks
<didrocks> dpm: empathy upstream is in the same case and asking mardy as well :)
<didrocks> dpm: will keep you posted
<dpm> great, thanks
<dpm> I'm still wondering where .applications files comes from (what's the upstream?) and why they were designed without having localization in mind
<dpm> *come from
<didrocks> dpm: ask PS for that :p
<larsu> didrocks, good morning!
<didrocks> hey larsu :)
<larsu> didrocks, do you know when the gtk release from yesterday will be uploaded?
 * larsu has a indicator-messages release in the pipeline that depends on it
<didrocks> larsu: when I will get time for it, apart if pitti is handling it?
<didrocks> larsu: today for sure anyway :)
<didrocks> larsu: I'll ping you once in distro
<larsu> didrocks, awesome, thanks!
<didrocks> yw :)
<Laney> which gtk? http://ftp.gnome.org/pub/GNOME/sources/gtk+/3.5/ doesn't show a new release?
<Laney> larsu: ^
<didrocks> pitti: do you know about https://bugs.launchpad.net/sessioninstaller/+bug/1042231?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1042231 in sessioninstaller "InstallPackageNames should not return until the package has been installed" [Undecided,New]
<larsu> Laney, you're right, it's not out yet. It was supposed to be released yesterday...
<didrocks> pitti: seems the empathy guys are telling that it's blocking the TP -> UOA correct account migration
<pitti> didrocks: I know about it, but didn't get to it yet; I wasn't aware that it's a blocker
<pitti> didrocks: I haven't touched sessioninstaller before, but I think I can have a look this week then
<didrocks> pitti: excellent, thanks!
 * didrocks is now on yet-another-ps-additional-unexpected-work
<pitti> didrocks: seems you don't get to do a lot of stable+1 due to all that
<didrocks> pitti: unfortunately notâ¦
<didrocks> pitti: I've dealt with the whole evolution NBS which is already quite a lot
<didrocks> but I clearly can't do more
<ogra_> pitti, so wrt yesterday .... looking at http://article.gmane.org/gmane.linux.ubuntu.devel.announce/817 it looks to me like including a hardware driver even if its binary is fine, as long as it is redistributable and lives in restricted
<ogra_> ..."the only concession is for hardware drivers as detailed at http://www.ubuntu.com/project/about-ubuntu/licensing"...
<ogra_> (licensing talks about it at the very bottom)
<ogra_> (not sure you folloed the conversation that went on yesterady)
<pitti> no, I didn't follow it any more; ok, thanks
<didrocks> Laney: do you have some time for some i18n playground?
<Laney> didrocks: I don't know so much about it, but I can take a look, sure
<didrocks> Laney: ls /usr/share/accounts/applications/
<didrocks> you can see some apps in there
<didrocks> I think what's need to be done would be:
<didrocks> -> ensuring that upstream have an application.in files with translatable tags (using _)
<didrocks> we standardise that they should have a <translations> tag with the package name
<dholbach> hiya
<dholbach> do we have some docs for how to "integrate a program into the HUD"?
<didrocks> then running intltool-extract files.applications.in
<dholbach> http://daniel.holba.ch/blog/2012/09/ubuntu-dev-hangouts/#comment-653338925
<didrocks> so that it's get merged into a files.applications.in.h
<didrocks> Laney: then, add that to the POTFILES.in for python and into the Makefiles so that it extracts into the .pot file
<Laney> what loads these strings now?
<didrocks> Laney: and running intltool-merge --no-translations -x -u foo.applications.in foo.application
<didrocks> to create the xml upstream file which is shipped
<didrocks> Laney: then, online-account (the g-c-c plugin) will load them
<didrocks> looking at the <translations> tag
<didrocks> and gettext (package, string)
<didrocks> Laney: does it make sense to you?
<Laney> didrocks: yeah I think so, I'll look into it
<didrocks> Laney: thanks, I'll open a bug
<didrocks> Laney: no need to do empathy, upstream is doing it
<Laney> I see shotwell gwibber unity-lens-photos unity-scope-gdocs in there
<didrocks> Laney: trying to get gnome-control-center-signon supporting it for beta2 for the poor translators :)
<didrocks> Laney: sounds like the right list
<didrocks> as most of them are python, it should be similar once you get one
<didrocks> Laney: the .in.h is just there to get then extracted to the .pot file, we don't use it for real
<didrocks> Laney: but it was the only way to have something clean when I had to deal with a similar case in compiz
<didrocks> (even if it sounds bad for "python" apps :))
<didrocks> dholbach: your question should go to #ubuntu-unity
<dholbach> ok
<didrocks> dholbach: but basically, using gtk and a traditional menu should do it
<didrocks> dholbach: same for Qt apps
<Laney> I see an xml example in /usr/share/doc/intltool/README.gz
<Laney> doesn't look too hard
<dholbach> thanks didrocks
<didrocks> Laney: https://bugs.launchpad.net/shotwell/+bug/1052375
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1052375 in unity-scope-gdocs "The online account g-c-c interface doesn't support i18n" [Undecided,New]
<Laney> ty
<didrocks> thanks to you :)
<chrisccoulson> ogra_, not sure if you saw my comment yesterday evening, after trying to boot my pandaboard with the quantal b1 image
<chrisccoulson> no success yet ;)
<ogra_> chrisccoulson, there seem to be issues with the graphics, try to switch to console and back
<ogra_> that usually helps
<chrisccoulson> ogra_, yeah, i've tried that too. did you see the error message i see on the console?
<chrisccoulson> "omapdss HDMI error: failed to enable GPIO's"
 * ogra_ is waiting for working builds with teh new kernel from yesterday to actually test 
<ogra_> thats normal, ignore it
<chrisccoulson> ah, ok
<chrisccoulson> it seems that X is running, i just get a blank screen though :(
<chrisccoulson> although, the monitor is powered
<chrisccoulson> in fact, i've just switched back from the console after leaving it on all night, and it works ;)
<ogra_> chrisccoulson, yeah, ubiquity-dm is really really slow on startup ... so you can easily get the impression it just crashed ... while staring at a black screen
<chrisccoulson> perhaps the screensaver kicks in before it appears then?
<ogra_> yeah, could be, i still have that on my list as a low prio item to look at
<ogra_> wprst case i'll release note it ... the slow SD card IO doesnt really help either ....
<xnox> ubiquity-dm should inhibit screensaver.... unless it was too slow to do that....
<ogra_> xnox, right, and it could well be that we see a race here ...
<ogra_> overlayfs isnt actually fast ... and combined with SD card I/O i could imagine we hit many corner cases you wont see anywhere else
<ogra_> like races that wouldnt show up on x86 with USB for the rootfs
<Laney> ogra_: we got the anti-flickering kernel?
<ogra_> not sure it is promnoted yet, might sit in NEw i didnt check
<ogra_> it was uploaded yesterday
<Laney> i don't remember seeing the bug get closed
<Laney> think i'm subscribed
<ogra_> hmm, i dont see the bug number in the changelog i think
<Laney> nothing's in NEW
<ogra_> then it might be in the archive already
<tjaalton> didrocks: libwacom 0.6 doesn't break the abi, it just added some so no rebuilds needed
<didrocks> tjaalton: but they bumped the soname, still?
<tjaalton> didrocks: minor bump, libwacom.so.2 is still there
<didrocks> tjaalton: ok, please upload wacom in -proposed
<didrocks> I'll handle the g-s-d and g-c-c rebuilds
<tjaalton> shouldn't need rebuilds :)
<didrocks> and excellent even, if there is still the older package :)
<tjaalton> heh
<tjaalton> there has been no updates upstream since early july, so it should be quite safe :)
<didrocks> yep :)
<tjaalton> didrocks: confirmed, works with the current versions without rebuilds
<didrocks> tjaalton: sweet, thanks!
<tjaalton> didrocks: so, should I just upload or do you think a FFe is needed?
<didrocks> tjaalton: I don't think it does need if it's just bug fixes as you are telling and there is no transition needed (meaning, the old packages are still there)
<tjaalton> right, it's just a data lib for tablet definitions
<tjaalton> so I'll just upload then, thanks
<didrocks> updating gcr
<didrocks> updating gnome-keyring, libcryptui
<didrocks> taking libsecret, searhorse and seahorse-nautilus, seahorse-sharing
<doko> didrocks, pitti: I didn't see any gnome library updates yet. will these come as well?
<pitti> not sure, I haven't followed those
<didrocks> doko: wdym?
<didrocks> doko: look at -changes, I'm updating to latest GNOME
<pitti> if someone asks me to do an update I can look into it
<doko> didrocks, I am asking because I don't want to see instabilities for the test rebuild. I thought that a gnome version update would start with some library packages first
<didrocks> doko: just counted, we had 47 updates done since yesterday
<didrocks> doko: it's already a lotâ¦ I don't know what you expect though
<didrocks> doko: and we can't update packages before GNOME releases them
<didrocks> which they have until wednesday to do
<doko> didrocks, so there are no library updates this time?
<didrocks> wdym by libraries?
<didrocks> I updated libsecret, libcrypui just 20 minutes ago
<didrocks> I see libwacom and a lot of libs updated in the mentionned 47 updates
<didrocks> still not glib or gtk ready, no
<doko> yeah, I would think that these would come first. but anyway, I think I should wait for these before the test rebuild
<didrocks> right, they are not released upstream as of now though
<pitti> glib 2.33.14 is tagged in git
<jbicha> doko: there shouldn't be any GNOME library transitions by this point as it's been API freeze for a few weeks
<didrocks> larsu: did you get any chance to look at evolution-indicator?
<larsu> didrocks, not yet, sorry
<jbicha> there's cogl but I don't see anything that *needs* the latest version
<didrocks> larsu: do you think this will be possible before beta2 freeze?
<larsu> didrocks, is that on fri?
<didrocks> larsu: thu
<larsu> didrocks, evening?
<didrocks> larsu: approx, yeah
<larsu> didrocks, if it's a simple port I'll make it until then
<larsu> (and it probably is)
<didrocks> larsu: not that straightforward though
<larsu> I guess the hard part will be figuring out how to build evo? or is it a plugin?
<didrocks> larsu: oh, it's a plugin
<desrt> pitti: hey
<desrt> pitti: if i make GThread introspectable and add a boxed type, would it be fully usable from python/js/etc?
<pitti> hey desrt
<desrt> g_thread_new(), i mean
<desrt> ie: add the annotations that you suggested
<pitti> desrt: there might be some API which isn't, but I haven't looked very far ahead
<pitti> e. g. GThreadPool looks like a lost cause
<desrt> is it because of the lack of destroynotify on the user_data?
<pitti> it might cover the basic GThread functionality, though
<desrt> in the threadpool case i can see an argument for adding a _full variant....
<pitti> that, and two callbacks and two user_data; g-i isn't prepared for that (and neither is pygobject)
<pitti> but in Python you'd just use threading
<pitti> (i. e. the builtin module)
<desrt> do we have similar features in JS, though?
 * desrt mumbles something about how you ought to be in #gtk+
<desrt> pitti: i don't see any g_thread_pool_* API that takes two function pointers
<pitti> did I mix that up? I looked at several similar bug reports recently
<pitti> https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=683941
<ubot2> Gnome bug 683941 in gthread "g_thread_pool_new() is not introspectable" [Normal,New]
<desrt> there are two data pointers passed to the worker function
<desrt> one is the usual user_data arrangement, from g_thread_pool_new()
<pitti> ah, one is user_data from _new(), the other data from push, right
<desrt> the other one is the data from push()
<desrt> so we're close....
<pitti> so yes, it's the missing GDestroyNotify for user_data presumably; I really haven't looked into detals
<desrt> i'd be happy to add that
<pitti> this seemed like a "wontfix"/"skip" case to me, but if you want to make it introspectable I can have a deeper look
<desrt> the bigger trouble, imho, is the data parameter
<desrt> i guess you can always assume that is a PyObject going in and coming out
<desrt> but that gets funky if you try to pass the threadpool to someone else :)
<desrt> (which i guess is a vaguely insane thing to do anyway)
<desrt> hm.  _set_sort_func() is sort of weird as well
<desrt> it would need a GDestroyNotify
<desrt> anyway.. imho, GThreadPool is actually the one worth fighting for
<desrt> since that sort of functionality is less likely to be available in a language library
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: I again had the quick filter collapsed, did you notice anything?
<didrocks> Laney: did you start to do the transition for the online account xml and so on?
<didrocks> Laney: I saw people assigning some to themselves
<desrt> pitti: according to #gtk+ GThread(Pool) might be useful to javascript hackers
<didrocks> kenvandine: don't do empathy, I dealt it with cassidy
<pitti> desrt: I see; so perhaps let's start with GThread and write some tests around it, and then investigate the bigger challenge of GThreadPool if GThread is sensible?
<desrt> sure
<kenvandine> didrocks, ok
<didrocks> kenvandine: thanks for assigning gwibber to you, you think it's possible to get it for beta2?
<desrt> pitti: (more relaying from #gtk+) it may not be that useful if we want to have a 'higher/nicer/more-JS-like' interface...
<didrocks> davidcalle: same question for unity-lens-photos
<kenvandine> didrocks, yup
<didrocks> thanks :)
<kenvandine> there will be a gwibber release right after the next unity release :)
<didrocks> kenvandine: I hope that the unity release won't be too late thenâ¦
<kenvandine> hehehe :)
<kenvandine> either way this will land in time :)
<kenvandine> assuming the g-c-c panel can load them
<didrocks> yeah
<didrocks> I checked with the uoa guys for that
<davidcalle> didrocks, the .application translation?
<didrocks> yep
<davidcalle> didrocks, ok
<didrocks> thanks davidcalle
<bcurtiswx> wow, i've never seen soo many crashes at one point on my desktop...
<bcurtiswx> apport won't work to report anything right now.
<bcurtiswx> Cannot connect to crash database, please check your Internet connection.'int' object has no attribute 'isspace'
<didrocks> Sweetshark, chrisccoulson, Laney, kenvandine, mterry, robru, tkamppeter, jasoncwarner_: ok, meeting time, do anyone has anything to tell about? (No agenda items on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2012-09-18)
<mterry> No...
<mterry> Though congrats kenvandine on finishing the preview lens  :)
<didrocks> I'm a little bit disappointed about the lack of content on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2012-09-18
<didrocks> last week and this week
<didrocks> only mterry and I right now completed it
 * kenvandine holds breath waiting for a unity release
<didrocks> I hope people did some stuff that worth nothing :)
<didrocks> noting*
<kenvandine> didrocks, i did too
<kenvandine> about 3 minutes ago
<kenvandine> :)
<didrocks> kenvandine: ahah, ok, and kenvandine then! :)
<robru> didrocks: I did lots of good stuff! We are slashing crufty code out of Gwibber every day ;-)
<didrocks> robru: please note them!
<didrocks> the wiki page is for that :)
<robru> didrocks: sorry I'm new ;-)
<kenvandine> and robu just got a Dee.SharedModel working :)
<didrocks> robru: you do receive the reminder email right?
<mterry> didrocks, I tend to only note things that landed in the last week, so sometimes there isn't much to note ("worked on bug fixes")
<didrocks> (I think I added you directly)
<didrocks> mterry: no worry, and you normally complete it and update blueprints, so that's fine :)
<robru> I don't see it in my inbox, didrocks... when did you send it?
<didrocks> but no report for xorg stack for quite a while
<didrocks> robru: your canonical email normally
<mterry> didrocks, I'm just saying as an explanation for why some might not have anything -- maybe nothing happened to land in quantal or they were tiny bug fixes
<didrocks> "Weekly meeting and reports remember"
<robru> didrocks: yes but *when*, silly ;-)
<didrocks> robru: 5h30 ago
<mterry> robru, this morning, 6:00AM EST
<didrocks> mterry: sure, but we have criticals bugs on the list, noting them when they are fixed is good as well (help to communicate to the release team)
<mterry> fair
<robru> didrocks: oh hm, there it is in my archive. I must have accidentally archived it while skimming other mails
<didrocks> anyway, seems there is nothing else to discuss, please look at the bug list I sent into the email (the release team one)
<didrocks> thanks everyone :)
<robru> thanks didrocks !
<didrocks> robru: no worry, stop archiving me! :)
<kenvandine> didrocks, how is the unity release looking?
<didrocks> kenvandine: nothing ready
<didrocks> at all
<kenvandine> :(
<kenvandine> my branches all landed :)
<didrocks> yeah, I saw that! congrats :)
<Laney> didrocks: sorry, not yet, was planning on doing it tomorrow
<didrocks> Laney: ok, so no need :)
<Laney> looking at glib btw
<didrocks> thanks Laney :)
<ricotz> Laney, hi
<Laney> hey
<ricotz> Laney, is there a reason that emacs depends on emacs23 rather then emacs24?
<Laney> we didn't decide to change the default
<Laney> partially following debian, partially because emacs24 is new
<ricotz> ok, nevermind then
<Laney> I definitely saw some bugs with the global menu and emacs24
<ricotz> alright, better to keep that way then
<Laney> we can change it early in R
<Laney> I think there's a new emacs-defaults package or so in Debian now
<bcurtiswx> anyone else that uses google talk have connection issues with Emapthy
<bcurtiswx> Empathy*
<bcurtiswx> I read somewhere they changed to OAuth.. or like the newest version of it.. not sure which
<kenvandine> bcurtiswx, mhall119 was having issues
<bcurtiswx> kenvandine, Google upgraded to use OAuth 2.0 i found the article i read.. not sure if thats causing issues there, but i mentioned it in #telepathy so <shrugs>
<kenvandine> shouldn't be
<mhall119> I assume this isn't a problem that everybody using Quantal is having
<kenvandine> you would think we'd have a crap load of bug reports on it
<kenvandine> i am not having that issue
<kenvandine> but it really worries me...
<kenvandine> once 12.10 is out the door, the number of users multiples
<mhall119> kenvandine: anything else I can do to help debug it?
<Laney> didrocks: did you forget to upload seahorse or something else?
 * Laney can do it if you want
<didrocks> Laney: I didn't get it done, too many pings at the same, please, be my guest :)
<Laney> ack
<Laney> do we have -sharing? I can't see it
<didrocks> Laney: no, I didn't find it in the repo
<didrocks> so no upload, no bounty :)
<didrocks> Laney: I didn't try to build it but there is a change in configure.ac in seahorse
<Laney> yeah I got it to build
<didrocks> Laney: about libsecret-1 on libsecret-private
<didrocks> but it's shipped
<Laney> oh>
<didrocks> so no worry :)
<Laney> I don't see that
<didrocks> ah? maybe -PKG_CHECK_MODULES([LIBSECRET], libsecret-1 >= $LIBSECRET_REQUIRED,
<didrocks> +PKG_CHECK_MODULES([LIBSECRET], libsecret-unstable >= $LIBSECRET_REQUIRED,
<didrocks> -unstable
<Laney> it's not in my diff from .91 to .92
<Laney> if you're looking at bzr it's out of date
<didrocks> ah, probably then :)
<didrocks> we have a lot of out of date bzr
<didrocks> and no more vcs-bzr branch
<didrocks> ah, not for that one
<didrocks> wasn't looking at bzr
<didrocks> diff -Nup ../seahorse-3.5.91/configure.ac .
<didrocks> being in the seahorse-3.5.92 directory
<didrocks> and
<didrocks> -AC_INIT([seahorse], [3.5.91],
<didrocks> +AC_INIT([seahorse], [3.5.92],
<didrocks> so sounds fine?
<Laney> apply the patches ;-)
<Laney> debian/patches/use-stable-libsecret.patch
<didrocks> Laney: ok, I'm used to bzr bd-do doing that for me :)
<Laney> hehe
<didrocks> so it was already reverted :)
<didrocks> I was surprised by Stef, he just wrote "new translations and doc system"
<didrocks> and normally, you can trust what he writes
<didrocks> thanks Laney for clearing that up :)
<Laney> that patch could do with a header TBH
<didrocks> agreed
<jbicha> oh, they dropped the LowContrast & HighContrastInverse themes but we're still using them in gnome-control-center 3.4 :( http://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-themes-standard/tree/NEWS
<bizhanMona> HI I would like to get some info on UEFI boot, could someone point me to the right direction please?
<jbicha> I opened a bug complaining about dropping those themes so late in the cycle but I'm skeptical that the devs will care
<fginther> hello, how does one sync up a lp packaging branch to a the latest package in the repository?  i.e. nux is at 3.4.0 in quantal/main, but lp:ubuntu/nux is at 3.2.0
<mterry> fginther, I usually poke james_w
<Sweetshark> desrt: ping?
<desrt> hi
<jbicha> yeah, they didn't care https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=684311
<ubot2> Gnome bug 684311 in HighContrast and LowContrast "Please restore HighContrastInverse & LowContrast themes for 3.6" [Major,Resolved: wontfix]
<tedg> jdstrand, I hear you know a magic incantation that will make my packaging load an apparmor profile.  Would you share such mysterious secrets?
<xnox> jbicha: does this mean there are no a11y themes at all in 3.6?
<xnox> jbicha: what will lubuntu, xubuntu do about a11y then?
<xnox> or anybody else that does not use clutter....
<kenvandine> ugh... no ally themes!
<kenvandine> a11y
<jbicha> xnox: HighContrast is still there, they just forcefully deprecated the other 2 less important ally themes
<xnox> jbicha: Inverse is just as important as HighContrast.
<jbicha> GNOME Shell 3.6/System Settings 3.6 has cool support for more powerful a11y theming
<xnox> due to specific a11y conditions
<xnox> jbicha: I am very happy for Gnome Shell (well clutter) but what about XFCE, LXDE, Unity (Compiz) - those don't have those. What about gtk apps running in KDE?
<jbicha> you can grab gnome-control-center & gnome-settings-daemon from ricotz staging if you're curious to have a look
<jbicha> we'll eventually copy those to the GNOME3 PPA I believe
<xnox> does it work in not-shell?
<jbicha> xnox: no, lots of the new magic doesn't work in Fallback because no developer wants to do the work
<jbicha> it would be awesome if the Compiz/Unity devs would try to plug into it for 13.04
<xnox> jbicha: added my comment to that bug
<skaet> smspillaz, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/compiz/+bug/1042323 -  will the next release of compiz to land for beta 2 contain this?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1042323 in compiz "[FFE] Port GTK Window Decorator to GSettings" [High,Fix released]
<jasoncwarner_> bryceh robert_ancell TheMuso RAOF meeting reminder. Any agenda items? Don't forget to update your status https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2012-09-18
<RAOF> No agenda items here.
 * bryceh waves
<bryceh> RAOF, did you see they're splitting glu out from mesa9?
<RAOF> bryceh: Yup. I reviewed the glu package for tjaalton.
<bryceh> great
<RAOF> Also, hurray!
<RAOF> The fewer non-{E,}GL{,ES} non-DRI things that the mesa source package builds the better :)
<dupondje> hmz, my headphone seems broken on quantal. Not listed in output, but listed in hardware ...
<bryceh> can we make libtxc-dxtn-s2tc0 a dependency for ia32-libs-multiarch:i386?
<dupondje> :s
<bryceh> er, try again.  can we make libtxc-dxtn-s2tc0:i386 a dependency for ia32-libs-multiarch:i386?
<RAOF> It isn't already a Recommends: of mesa?
<RAOF> That's probably the better path, right?
<RAOF> Yeah, we should make that a Recommends of libgl1-mesa-glx or somesuch.
 * bryceh nods
<RAOF> ...after promoting it to main, I guess.
<bryceh> yeah the i386 package is required for certain (binary-only) games, but there's no way to install it via the GUI.  would be nice if we could just pull it in via a dependency so it's transparent for users
<Sarvatt> should be libtxc-dxtn0, so people can actually use the patent encumbered one if they want? :P libtxc-dxtn-s2tc0 provides libtxc-dxtn0
<bryceh> not a bad idea
<Sarvatt> except the humble games require libtxc-dxtn-s2tc0 so cant install it at the same time as those anyway :(
<bryceh> hrm
<RAOF> The humble bundle explicitly depend on libtxc-dxtn-s2tc0?
<Sarvatt> bastion does at least
<RAOF> I can't exactly blame them; we've dropped the ball on dependency there ;)
<bryceh> and I suppose having them switch to depend on libtxc-dxtn0 wouldn't solve the already existing releases out there
<RAOF> Sarvatt: Is there any particular reason why someone would want the patent-encumbered one?
<TheMuso> dupondje: Have you filed a bug? If so, please file it against pulseaudio and include a log form Pulse as per https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PulseAudio/Log.
<Sarvatt> haven't heard of any complaints about s2tc, but the description of how it gets around the patent makes it sound like the patented one might be preferred
<Sarvatt> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/S2TC
<Sarvatt> better to stick with what we have i guess after thinking about it, not like libtxc-dxtn0 will be going into debian/ubuntu and the provides might end up getting dropped one day
<bryceh> ok
<RAOF> Oh, man. errors.ubuntu.com now links to pretty colourised backtraces.
<bryceh> RAOF, Sarvatt thanks.  So libtxc-dxtn-s2tc0:i386 is to be made a Recommends for libgl1-mesa-glx then?  Worth ML discussion or shall I JFDI?
<RAOF> JFDI. And that would obviously be libtxc-dxtn-s2tc0 as the Recommends, right? You can't do cross-arch dependencies, and we'd want the 64bit version too :)
<Sarvatt> bryceh: minus the :i386 yep, been doing that in edgers for a long time but s2tc is fairly recent in ubuntu (last month of precise)
<bryceh> RAOF, well what I understand the problem for this case is that the game in question is a i386 binary, so needs the :i386 package present
<RAOF> bryceh: Which means that it'll have libgl1-mesa-glx:i386 installed, which will Recommend the appropriate arch'd libtxc-dxtn-s2tc0
<bryceh> ahhh
<RAOF> Unless they're bundling libgl, which would be totally bonkers.
<bryceh> righto, ok yes I concur
<bryceh> thanks for the cluebat :-)
<smspillaz> skaet: yes
<smspillaz> skaet: or at least, I think so. Mirv said they were doing a snapshot or at least cherry picking those fixes
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, gnome-themes-standard just dropped the High Conrast Inverse theme - is that a problem?
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-09-19
<sarnold> robert_ancell: apparently some details are in https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=684311
<ubot2> Gnome bug 684311 in HighContrast and LowContrast "Please restore HighContrastInverse & LowContrast themes for 3.6" [Major,Resolved: wontfix]
<robert_ancell> sarnold, thanks
<jbicha> alex-abreu: so what would the Amazon launcher even do? load amazon.com?
<jbicha> I have to admit I haven't tested the webapps stuff yet as I was waiting for it to show up in the normal repositories
<alex-abreu> jbicha: open amazon and give a direct access to the amazon webapp
<jbicha> why does the Design Team think we need a direct link to amazon.com on the default Ubuntu desktop?
<jbicha> no offense, but it sounds ridiculous to me
<alex-abreu> no offense taken, there was some discussions over it and that's what was decided as part of the default apps exposed to the user
<Mirv> smspillaz: I eventually went for brz3377 snapshot...
<Mirv> after duflu seemed to be ready to tag it 0.9.8.4 anyway :)
<pitti> Good morning
<robert_ancell> seiflotfy, hey
<robert_ancell> seiflotfy, had a question about gnome-clocks crashing creating a TimeZone object, does it need a particular version of glib/g-i?
<jbicha> robert_ancell: yeah, it needs the new glib, I think this commit http://git.gnome.org/browse/glib/commit/?id=02f143c2d9fa
<robert_ancell> jbicha, ah, that's what I'm looking for
<robert_ancell> jbicha, did you intentionally not update?
<robert_ancell> I figure we should just upload since that glib will be coming anyway
<jbicha> robert_ancell: no, we shouldn't intentionally upload something that would be broken
<jbicha> I mean it probably has all of 6 users so far, but still
<robert_ancell> jbicha, well, it might risk missing a freeze otherwise
<robert_ancell> better to get it in earlier than later
<jbicha> I consider it a bugfix release
<jbicha> I would have just uploaded if the new version actually ran :)
<robert_ancell> jbicha, can you open bugs if you investigate an update bug it is blocked? I've opened bug 1052759
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1052759 in gnome-clocks "Update to 0.1.2" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1052759
<robert_ancell> but is blocked that should say
<jbicha> ok, nautilus 3.5.92 in the ppa is waiting on the new glib too
<robert_ancell> jbicha, good, because I was about to look at that one
<jbicha> pitti: did you want to upload glib2.0 or are you swamped with Beta2Freeze?
<pitti> hey jbicha
<pitti> nobody asked me about it yet; I'm not exactly twiddling thumbs, but if nobody else can do it, I can have a look
<robert_ancell> pitti, also, is there a reason why we're pushing all the glib changes through debian? It's slowing everything down
<pitti> robert_ancell: mostly to avoid building up a delta and having to merge again, and a courtesy to Debian
<pitti> but we did have several Ubuntu specific uploads
<robert_ancell> I'm happy to upload straight to Ubuntu but I haven't been because of this sync. But it's slowed me down a number of times when it would just be updated in an hour after release
<pitti> I just regularly merge them back
<pitti> it's not "forbidden" to upload to Ubuntu
<robert_ancell> ok, will do that in the future
<pitti> but it's causing more work in sum
<pitti> (not terribly much, though)
<pitti> robert_ancell: so if you can update glib, I'm happy to commit the diff to Debian after the upload; sounds ok?
<robert_ancell> pitti, yeah, but this is not a zero sum game so the bigger issue is the additional time lost to us compared to us updating it faster with everything else
<robert_ancell> pitti, sure
<didrocks> good morning
<smspillaz>  Mirv kk
<pitti> bonjour didrocks
<didrocks> guten morgen pitti
<larsu> didrocks, good morning!
<didrocks> hey larsu
<larsu> didrocks, you'll do the gtk update? If so, the menu item patch doesn't apply anymore. I have attached a new one on bug #1039476
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1039476 in gtk+3.0 "gtk_menu_new_from_model doesn't support custom menu items" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1039476
<didrocks> larsu: ah, excellent, thanks a lot :)
<didrocks> you subscribed me to the bug, so should be fine! :-)
<larsu> just wanted to make sure you're not doing the update before reading email ;)
<larsu> didrocks, more importantly: I looked into porting indicator-evolution, but there's two problems:
<larsu> (1) it's installing into the 3.4 plugin directory instead of the 3.6 one
<larsu> (2) it's showing notification bubbles in addition to the messaging menu stuff, why? (there's a separate libnotify plugin already)
<didrocks> larsu: no, I'm digging on a big stack of emails to answers first TBH :)
<didrocks> larsu: I think (2) is not a regression
<didrocks> larsu: and it's like thunderbird
<didrocks> I agree it's not logicial
<didrocks> logical*
<didrocks> but it's the way design wanted it
<larsu> design? Because they wanted different notifications from the ones in the other plugin?
<larsu> (3) it doesn't build :(
<didrocks> larsu: (3) is because of the API change, right?
<larsu> didrocks, no, "unknown type name 'GConfClient'"
<didrocks> ah, still using gconf :/
<larsu> should still build though, right?
<RAOF> Yeah, and then crash (unless it calls dbus_threads_init_default()) </bitter>
<didrocks> larsu: I guess e-d-s was including gconf and configuring it for you, no?
<didrocks> larsu: if that's too much work, we can declare evolution-indicator dead and remove it
<larsu> didrocks, yeah, I'd be fine porting it to libmessaging-menu, but I don't have time for porting it to 3.6 and gsettings (especially since I know nothing about evolution internals)
<larsu> hm, including gconf-client.h directly works
<RAOF> I'm not joking about calling dbus_threads_init_default; if you use gconf and don't call that, you're going to get awkward memory corruption crashes in libdbus.
<didrocks> larsu: ok, let's remove it then
<larsu> didrocks, alright, sorry :-/
<didrocks> no worry larsu :)
<didrocks> cyphermox: FYI ^ So apart if you feel you have the time to port, we will drop evolution-indicator
<didrocks> larsu: catching up on email, seems robert_ancell did already the update
<larsu> didrocks, interesting. Let me check how he resolved the issue with the patch
<didrocks> larsu: weird, he didn't, he just removed a patch
<didrocks> but it doesn't seem to be yours, right?
<larsu> didrocks, no it's not, that one had to be removed
<didrocks> larsu: he didn't touch your patch at all
<didrocks> larsu: I have no diff
<larsu> didrocks, do your tools error out when a patch can't be applied?
<didrocks> yep
<didrocks> larsu: look at your diff: http://paste.ubuntu.com/1214242/
<didrocks> with the version in the package
<larsu> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/gtk/ubuntugtk3/revision/225#debian/patches/ubuntu_gtk_custom_menu_items.patch
<larsu> that shows it, he updated it
<didrocks> grrrr, and yeah for listing things in the changelog :/
 * larsu feels for didrocks
<didrocks> larsu: thanks nevertheless and sorry you worked for nothing :)
<didrocks> let's close the bug
<larsu> didrocks, I did it anyway in my jhbuild, I just wanted to save you guys some trouble
<larsu> so no harm
<didrocks> larsu: thanks for noticing and pinging us :)
<larsu> didrocks, just trying to get PS a better reputation around here :)
 * larsu has a feeling it's a lost cause, though
<didrocks> larsu: you are on of the few! :-)
<larsu> hehe
<didrocks> one*
<larsu> didrocks, indicator-messages 12.10.3 is out. Wow, 1.5 days before a freeze, that's a new record! ;)
<didrocks> larsu: let's turn that this way: 1.5days in advance to the rest of PS team! Well done :)
<didrocks> larsu: updating now :)
<larsu> thanks!
<didrocks> larsu: "oh, an updated NEWS file"
 * didrocks gives a bonus point to larsu
<larsu> awesome! I collect bonus points ;)
<larsu> didrocks, shouldn't all bugs that are mentioned in the milestone be marked as fix released? Do I have to do that manually?
<larsu> https://launchpad.net/indicator-messages/12.10/12.10.3
<didrocks> larsu: for upstream ones, yes, for the package one, they will get closed automatically when I upload the package
<larsu> :'(
<didrocks> larsu: yeah, closing the milestone should close them, I agree
<didrocks> larsu: basically, I have a script doing that for unity, maybe we should make it less unity-related and share it
<didrocks> larsu: all fix committed are -> fix released
<didrocks> the others are set to the next milestone
<larsu> didrocks, that sounds exactly like what I need
<didrocks> larsu: let's figure that out for next release and after the beta freeze crazyness :)
<larsu> didrocks, yeah no hurry
<larsu> I'm half done anyway ;)
<Laney> hey ho
<Laney> TheMuso: hey, did you consider dropping the g-c-c recommends from mousetweak instead of dropping mousetweak from onboard?
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<didrocks> larsu: hey
<larsu> didrocks, ya?
<didrocks> larsu: I have a different icon on the messaging menu and power indicator
<didrocks> larsu: isn't because of the gtk patch drop?
<didrocks> hey chrisccoulson :)
<chrisccoulson> hi didrocks, how are you?
<larsu> didrocks, power indicator is because of the dropped patch. What's the new icon on the messaging indicator?
<didrocks> larsu: screenshoting
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: busy busy, yourself?
<larsu> didrocks, I fixed the battery icons in ubuntu-mono, but charles didn't like my patch and I must have overlooked his reply. Fixing it now
<didrocks> larsu: http://people.canonical.com/~didrocks/indicator-icons.png
<didrocks> larsu: sweet :)
<larsu> didrocks, yeah, messaging menu now shows online status in the panel
<larsu> the X means offline
<didrocks> larsu: ok, the icon looks weird, but well :)
<didrocks> larsu: you had an UIFe accepeted, right?
<larsu> didrocks, I totally agree. Take it up with mpt ;)
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, yeah, pretty busy
<larsu> didrocks, yes
<larsu> (uife)
<didrocks> larsu: excellent! uploading then :)
<larsu> \o/
<didrocks> larsu: tell me for ubuntu-mono once ready
<larsu> didrocks, yep
<xnox> didrocks: I turn off icons on my desktop to prevent accidental leaks ;-)
<didrocks> xnox: :)
<larsu> didrocks, who maintains ubuntu-mono?
<larsu> I wonder if I can just delete the battery icons that we're not using
<larsu> also, we have the 000,020,040,060,080,100 charge statuses in ubuntu-mono, but we only need empty,low,good,full
<larsu> I wonder which ones should be mapped to which
<larsu> low == 020 or 040? good == 060 or 080?
<didrocks> larsu: I'm deep in unity issues TBH, so if we can keep the delta of changes low :)
<didrocks> larsu: it was design before who maintained it
<didrocks> but nobody anymore
<didrocks> larsu: maybe ask mpt for icon mapping?
<larsu> didrocks, great :-/ I'll figure something out
<mpt> larsu, ideally I'd prefer the fill to be to the nearest pixel :-)
<larsu> mpt, we have icons that support 20% steps (which is probably close enough to nearest pixel for the panel), but they aren't used
<mpt> larsu, can you fix g-p-m so that they are?
<larsu> mpt, yeah, of course
<mpt> larsu, what would be other ways of fixing it?
<larsu> mpt, change the icon names so that we only use the 4 levels
<larsu> mpt, but you already convinced me
<larsu> mpt, the only problem will be upstream, which probably won't like our approach because they are using the empty,low,good,full scale
<larsu> and we need a quick fix for beta2 to make the panel pull at least the icons from ubuntu-mono, but that's not a big deal
<doko> pitti, would it be possible to have a look at the libsocialweb build failure? looks like an gobject incompatibility
<Laney> Mirv: hey, just looking at bug #1052068
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1052068 in unity-scope-video-remote "[UIFe/FFe] Addition of Amazon details to the video preview" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1052068
<Laney> do we have Amazon video results currently?
<Laney> I can't seem to get the video lens to give me them if so
<davidcalle> Laney, only for US users
<davidcalle> Laney, the search backend does geo IP
<Laney> oh, right
<xnox> do british get Daily Mail reviews of the top YouTube video? =)
<davidcalle> xnox, cool idea :)
<Laney> davidcalle: is this new in Q?
<Laney> I assume it sends search strings to an Ubuntu server?
<davidcalle> Laney, results are not new, but details for the video are. Yes, it's videosearch.ubuntu.com
<Laney> interesting
<Laney> do you consider that users might want to disable that?
<davidcalle> Laney, that's whay it's in a separate package and not in unity-lens-video, assuming, that users caring about *.ubuntu.com calls are able to remove a package.
<davidcalle> Laney, you can also select the sources of the Lens in the filter and only have local files.
<Laney> davidcalle: alright, that makes sense
<davidcalle> Laney, by the way, do you want a screenshot or something of this specific previews? I can tweak the requests to get US results .
<Laney> I wonder why I don't see video results on the home lens (is that the right terminology?)
<Laney> davidcalle: it would be nice in future, but not required now
<davidcalle> Laney, it is, and you will only see local results in the home, as you don't want anything you type in the home dash to be sent to servers.
<Laney> davidcalle: Good. That's what I was hoping for
<Laney> OK, thank you, I'm going to approve it
<Laney> done
<davidcalle> Laney, thank you
<Laney> np
<Laney> it has sharpened my thoughts around another FFe ;-)
<larsu> didrocks, I have a merge request for ubuntu-mono up, but please wait for charles to confirm that these are indeed correct ;)
 * larsu hates bulk renaming icons
<larsu> mpt, the icon for "battery is empty" is the same as for "battery is missing". That's surely not the way it was intended, is it?
<mpt> larsu, nope
<larsu> mpt, who do I need to assign in lp to get an icon drawn?
<Laney> larsu: does this fix the full battery while on mains power icon?
<mpt> "There should also be (1) a generic battery icon, for use when a battery has been removed or when its charge level has not yet been determined."
<mpt> larsu, ~jnick-tait
<larsu> Laney, that's a indicator-power bug, the icon for battery-full and battery-full-charging are correct
<larsu> mpt, thanks
<Laney> k
<larsu> Laney, is there a bug number already? Otherwise I'll file one, it's an easy fix
<Laney> larsu: probably https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/indicator-power/+bug/1048041
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1048041 in indicator-power "Power icon doesn't show it is charging when it's plugged in" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<Laney> but I thought there was a better one with some discussion
<rodrigo_> hi
<larsu> Laney, oh I misunderstood you then. This has been working for me for a while now...
<larsu> I'll ping charles about it
<rodrigo_> there's a 1-click feature to setup PPAs, right?
<rodrigo_> if so, where can I find information?
<Laney> I see a "full battery" icon, but no lightning bolt thingy
<larsu> Laney, in quantal?
<Laney> yeah
<Laney> if you think it might have been fixed recently, I haven't restarted my session in a while
<larsu> no it has been working for a couple of months for me
<larsu> I'll assign charles, he wrote that code
<Laney> ack
<pitti> doko: can do, yes
<pitti> glatzor, mvo: hey, how are you/
<pitti> glatzor, mvo: it seems bug 1042231 is an incompatibility with the PK API -- while PK's is said to be synchronous, sessioninstaller's is async
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1042231 in sessioninstaller "InstallPackageNames should not return until the package has been installed" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1042231
<pitti> glatzor, mvo: would it be okay to make InstallPackageNames() and similar methods wait until completion, or would that break something else?
<rodrigo_> pitti, mvo: so, I seem to recall there was a 1-click way of setting up PPAs, but googling just shows opensuse stuff, so I might be mixing distros
<pitti> rodrigo_: sounds like apturl
<rodrigo_> oh
 * rodrigo_ googles
<pitti> "apturl-gtk apt://pmount"
<pitti> but that obviously needs some support in Firefox, not sure how that part works
<Laney> to add a PPA though?
<pitti> I think they can also be more complex to add PPAs
<pitti> see manpage
<rodrigo_> well, firefox would just laucnh the app registered for that url, right?
<Laney> ah yes
<pitti> apturl apt+http://launchpad.net/~mvo/ppa?package=2vcard
<Laney> look in apturl(8)
<rodrigo_> pitti, cool
<Laney> oh, but
<Laney> Warning: This is currently disabled because of security concerns.
<pitti> ah, right
<pitti> a simple apt://packagename does work in firefox, though
<TheMuso> Laney: No, because afaik onboard has a UI for GTK and QT, so its cross-desktop.
<Laney> i see
<Laney> should we pull mousetweaks in somehow?
<TheMuso> Laney: We do already in the seeds.
<TheMuso> And afaik g-c-c depends on mousetweaks as well.
<Laney> TheMuso: Ah, that's great then. Thanks!
<Laney> It recommends it, so it still seems curious to have the symmetric one too
<glatzor> hello pitti and mvo!
<glatzor> pitti, actually sessioninstaller should already wait until the action is done
<glatzor> before returning
<pitti> I haven't tested it yet, but the bug says it doesn't
<glatzor> pitti, that is a nasty bug
<glatzor> pitti, the Api of the gtk3 progress dialog changed slightly and I missed to adpot sessioninstaller
<doko> pitti, the rygel ftbfs looks like a problem with new vala/gtk too
<pitti> glatzor: so that means it's not meant to be async, and indeed was sync before, so fixing this is not likely to break anything else?
<ricotz> doko, did you try to build it with vala-0.18 instead of vala-0.16? or remove the vala stamps to force a c-code regeneration.
<pitti> doko: sounds like a job for the desktop team
<doko> ricotz, no. could you check this?
<didrocks> robru: would you mind looking at it when you get some free time? ^
<ricotz> doko, since 0.14 is the gnome 3.4 version it is probably some incompatibility with a newer "3.6" library, 0.15.x is the current branch
<ricotz> doko, i am trying to build it with vala 0.18
<doko> ok
<doko> pitti, sorry forget about you aren't in -desktop anymore
<ricotz> doko, no luck
<glatzor> pitti, sessioninstaller hasn't changed. it is just the aptdaemon.gtk3widgets.AptProgressDialog.run() method
<cyphermox> didrocks: evolution-indicator is a huge mess, don't think I will have time to port to 3.6, switch to gsettings, fix up any other things that need porting
<glatzor> pitti, basically this should do the trick http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/1214681/
<glatzor> pitti, but I will have a deeper look at it
<cyphermox> sucks though, because now we don't have an indicator mechanism for those who use evolution
<didrocks> cyphermox: so, pulling the trigger?
<pitti> glatzor: great, thanks! I'm afraid I don't know enough about these internals yet
<cyphermox> yeah :( I'll look at the upstream code on free time and try to massage it back into shape, but it's not likely to be ready in two weeks ;)
 * didrocks flushes
<cyphermox> huge step backwards... taken.
<cyphermox> sorry, I'm bitchy, didn't have water at home this morning :(
<didrocks> cyphermox: I'm making the evolution-indicator bugs invalid right now
<cyphermox> ok
<didrocks> cyphermox: the good news is that you have more time to work on bug #1037669
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1037669 in evolution "gst-plugin-scanner and browser plugins are used when opening certain emails" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1037669
<cyphermox> ahah yeah ;)
<cyphermox> I got a semi-helpful response on the upstream bug
<didrocks> larsu: do you know who is working on bug #1040259?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1040259 in unity-mail "FFE: libmessaging-menu transitions for quantal" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1040259
<larsu> didrocks, the respective maintainers. Everybody added their project there. I'll do liferea, seb said he'll do pidgin
<cyphermox> pitti: do you still do SRU approvals?
<pitti> cyphermox: no, I left the team some months ago
<cyphermox> ok
<didrocks> larsu: ok, assigning to him then :)
<larsu> didrocks, do you know when he's coming back?
<larsu> otherwise I might just do it
<didrocks> larsu: next week
<larsu> ah okay
<didrocks> tkamppeter: hey, are you working on bug #998156?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 998156 in gtk+3.0 "GTK Print dialog sends broken custom page size attribute: "PageSize=Custom.Custom.<width>x<length>"" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/998156
<larsu> didrocks, I asked mkasik's opinion about the attached patch, but he hasn't answered yet
<larsu> (he's the one doing printing in gtk)
<didrocks> larsu: ah, should we try it in quantal? or can you try to ping him again?
<larsu> didrocks, I think the patch is not good enough for upstream, but it will do the job for a cycle if we don't get a real fix soon
<larsu> the patch almost certainly works, it's just not doing the right thing
<didrocks> larsu: maybe not beta2 though? should we just fiddle it in after it? (so that easier to revert)
<larsu> yeah let's do that
<didrocks> ok, gotcha :)
<glatzor> pitti, this bug must be around for ages
<didrocks> doko: btw, you should be fine most GNOME components landed now
<doko> didrocks, ok, thanks
 * mlankhorst makes a note going 170 km/h is not good for fuel economy
 * didrocks hugs kenvandine
<didrocks> thanks :)
 * kenvandine hugs didrocks
<tsdgeos> kenvandine: hi, ted said you might be one to review https://code.launchpad.net/~aacid/gtk/ubuntugtk3_nmenomic_patch/+merge/125169
<kenvandine> didrocks, what do you think about that ^^
<kenvandine> didrocks, are you doing a gtk upload today?
<didrocks> kenvandine: robert already did it
<kenvandine> i think it looks safe, but i don't have time to test it today
<didrocks> kenvandine: agreed
 * didrocks tries to find a victimâ¦
<didrocks> Laney: got some gtk-quality time? :)
<Laney> didrocks: yeah, will look soon
<Laney> wrangling totem right now
<didrocks> Laney: thanks a lot! :)
<didrocks> Laney: ah, on the totem bug? excellent :)
<Laney> yeah
<Laney> shame we didn't take the new upstreams, would have made taking that patch easier
<didrocks> Laney: yeah, I know, but gstreamer 1.0â¦ :/
<Laney> indeed
<tsdgeos> Laney: great :-) ping me if you have any question about the mnemonic patch thingie
<Laney> sure, thanks tsdgeos!
<larsu> tsdgeos, why does this bug only happen in nautilus?
<larsu> your description implies it should happen on every context menu
<tsdgeos> larsu: good question
<tsdgeos> i don't have an answer though
<didrocks> larsu: ping me when there is some movement on ubuntu-mono btw :)
<tsdgeos> larsu: which maybe means i need some more research
<tsdgeos> but otoh i could not find any other mnemonic broken and the nautilus got fixed
<larsu> didrocks, yeah, I'll ping charles to speed up the merge request
<larsu> well, I guess I hust did :)
<larsu> tsdgeos, yeah, it just feels a bit weird topatch gtk when only one application has the problem
<larsu> and we already have more than enough patches in gtk ;)
<Laney> it's not a new patch, but a change to the existing one
<didrocks> Laney: heh :)
<larsu> oh, you're right
<Laney> but yeah I agree that it is curious and we should understand the bug ...
 * tsdgeos digs a bit more into it
<didrocks> xnox: can you look at bug #1051222?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1051222 in apport "hook /usr/share/apport/package-hooks/source_ubiquity.py crashed: during ubuntu-bug ubiquity execution " [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1051222
 * xnox looks
<didrocks> psivaa: please don't add rls-q-incoming task for things we are not supporting
<didrocks> psivaa: like indicator-weather
<tsdgeos> wow, is it me or glade scrollbar is totally broken?
<psivaa> didrocks, ok, was doing some batch processing to include the tag, sorry i dint know that it was not supported,
<didrocks> psivaa: well, cleaning the list of the desktop team with down to 3 incoming task
<robru> hi didrocks, I just woke up. what did you want me to look at? I was reading the scrollback and it looks like you decided that was invalid shortly after pinging me... ?
<didrocks> psivaa: in addition to be swamped by the PS team and other tasks, I try to make the release team an skaet's list happy
<didrocks> psivaa: so please, double check before adding additional work :)
<didrocks> robru: hum, not invalid IIRC, let me check
<robru> didrocks: maybe the invalid thing was something else, wasn't really clear to me what you wanted me to do ;-)
<psivaa> didrocks, sure will do, from now on
<tsdgeos> larsu: are we positive it only happens in nautilus?
<doko> the cairo-5c ftbfs is desktopish too. works in debian, so maybe needs an update for the new cairo version in quantal
<didrocks> psivaa: thanks :)
<larsu> tsdgeos, it doesn't happen in totem, empathy, gnome-terminal
<didrocks> robru: rygel is FTBFS, can you look why and how to fix it?
<didrocks> robru: that was the request
<didrocks> (and it's not invalid :))
<tsdgeos> larsu: do they have duplicate entries with the same accelerator in the popup menu
 * tsdgeos tries to create a dummy menu from nothing with duplicate entries with same accelerator 
<robru> didrocks: ok, I just woke up, give me a minute to have breakfast and then I will look ;-)
<larsu> tsdgeos, I don't know, is that important?
<didrocks> robru: thanks :)
<tsdgeos> larsu: it is
<gema> didrocks: regarding the rls-q-incoming , kate asked us to tag anything that should be fixed this cycle from our list with it
<gema> didrocks: now, after our chat this morning, we have a better idea of the things that are interesting
<didrocks> gema: please don't include universe package in the desktop team list
<didrocks> gema: if we could fix all the ones in main and have nothing to do, yeah, the universe one will make sense
<didrocks> gema: but we are clearly away from that target
<gema> didrocks: ack
<gema> didrocks: if some slips, please feel free to remove, we have a lot of people ramping up at the moment and we may make this kind of mistake
<gema> didrocks: I rather err on the side of caution and over tag, than forget something important
<gema> didrocks: but we'll try our best
<micahg> well, we need a way to make sure something gets reviewed to be RC even if it's not in main
<didrocks> gema: that's why I prefered to warn them :)
<didrocks> gema: so that they don't reproduce it
<gema> didrocks: ack
<gema> micahg: how do you propose we do that?
 * micahg is just speaking out loud here, not a desktop specific issue
<micahg> gema: maybe let's go to -release
<gema> micahg: ack
<Laney> tsdgeos: I don't see two entries with 'r' as mnemonic in nautilus though
<tsdgeos> Laney: that's because nautilus seem to be a bit weird and creates all entries and then hides the one it doesn't need
<tsdgeos> for example i was using "P" that in my locale has "_Properties" and if you select a folder also has "Obre en nova _pestanya"
<tsdgeos> and even if you open the menu on a file that is not a folder, the "Obre nova _pestanya" one goes through that function
<tsdgeos> i'm trying to build an example
<tsdgeos> pleasea bear with me
<tsdgeos> Laney: see this example http://paste.ubuntu.com/1214935/
<tsdgeos> it has two _S items
<tsdgeos> but only one of them is being added to the menu
<tsdgeos> with the old code
<tsdgeos> it doesn't trigger the Save one when pressing s
<tsdgeos> with my new one it does
<tsdgeos> because if you have a look at https://code.launchpad.net/~aacid/gtk/ubuntugtk3_nmenomic_patch/+merge/125169 what the first if does (an if that is not present in gtk) is bypass the check for visibility, sensitive, etc (the second part of the if) when it is an item that is handled by the global menu, but since it's not an item handled by the global menu we can't bypass those checks
<tsdgeos> Laney: did i make any sense there?
<Laney> tsdgeos: yeah, I get it, thanks
<tsdgeos> :-)
<Laney> didrocks: ah, so bug #1041032 blocks on bug #1041287
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1041032 in totem "An error occurred "Location not found" after automatically installing the missing gstreamer plugins." [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1041032
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1041287 in sessioninstaller "gst-install is finished when it is not finished actually." [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1041287
<didrocks> Laney: ah, interesting, is it the one I pinged pitti about?
<Laney> dunno :-)
<Laney> it has no distro task or release tags so if you found it that way then probably not
<pitti> sounds very similar to bug 1042231 anyway
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1042231 in sessioninstaller "InstallPackageNames should not return until the package has been installed" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1042231
<didrocks> right
<Laney> ah, good information
<didrocks> Laney: looking for something else to do then? :)
<Laney> oh no, got that gtk patch to do
<Laney> i'll test that sessioninstaller one tomorrow
<didrocks> Laney: oh right!
<didrocks> Laney: good luck :)
<lamont> I wonder what codec I'm missing that sound-juicer/quantal is claiming "The currently selected audio profile is not available on your system" when I tell it that I want mp3 output
<chrisccoulson> ah, f**k, bug 1051152 has pretty much exploded in 15.0.1 now as well
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1051152 in firefox "Firefox 16 beta crash in nsIContent::SetAttr with greasemonkey installed" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1051152
<chrisccoulson> https://crash-stats.mozilla.com/report/list?product=Firefox&version=Firefox%3A15.0.1&platform=linux&query_search=signature&query_type=contains&reason_type=contains&date=09%2F19%2F2012%2015%3A49%3A36&range_value=1&range_unit=weeks&hang_type=any&process_type=any&do_query=1&signature=nsIContent%3A%3ASetAttr
<xclaesse> kenvandine, I would totally love if you could build -doc packages for libfolks ;)
<kenvandine> xclaesse, ugh... we should :)
<kenvandine> but no time right now :/
<micahg> chrisccoulson: is that a regression in 15.0.1 over 15?
<xclaesse> kenvandine, last time I asked (was before quantal) that was not possible because of vala version, something like that
<chrisccoulson> no, it's a change in greasemonkey
<chrisccoulson> which means people are left with a broken browser again, and i can't be bothered trying to get a fix through our SRU process this time
<micahg> can we get upstream to blocklist the broken greasemonkey or is it our addon?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: seems PS is waiting for another comment on yourself on bug #1040313, can you please have look again?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1040313 in unity-firefox-extension "[FFE] Update WebApps to support Firefox" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1040313
<chrisccoulson> it's our addon
<Laney> uploading gtk, looks fine to me
 * Laney waves
<didrocks> Laney: great!
<alci> Hi all.
<alci> hope I'm not being rude, but I wanted to attract your attention to bu https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mozilla-thunderbird/+bug/105088
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 105088 in mozilla-thunderbird "Thunderbird does not honor gnome-vfs paths" [Medium,Confirmed]
<alci> This seems like a big problem for the default email client in Precise LTS and Quantal as well.
<tkamppeter> larsu, hi
<tedg> jdstrand, ping
<jdstrand> tedg: hey-- dh-apparmor help?
<tedg> jdstrand, yes please!
<jdstrand> tedg: so it should be quite easy. you can look at tcpdump as an example
<jdstrand> tedg: in essence, you build depends on dh-apparmor
<jdstrand> tedg: you can options Suggests apparmor in the package
<jdstrand> you create your profile in debian. eg debian/usr.bin.foo
<jdstrand> then call dh_apparmor in debian/rules:
<jdstrand> dh_apparmor --profile-name=usr.bin.foo [-pfoo]
<tedg> jdstrand, Okay, so I need to just override the installdeb, right?
<dobey> cyphermox: ping
<tedg> jdstrand, I think I understand, let me give it a go.
<jdstrand> you'll want to create the etc/apparmor.d/force-complain directory too (usually in a .dirs file)
<tedg> jdstrand, What's that?
<jdstrand> tedg: the force-complain directory is a directory we use to force a profile that is shipped in enforcing mode in complain mode (so we don't have to fiddle with a conffile)
<jdstrand> tedg: you don't need to put anything in there. just create it
<larsu> tkamppeter, hi
<jdstrand> tedg: it is possible for the user to create a symlink/file in there. the postrm will clean it up on purge
<tedg> jdstrand, Okay, so if I don't have a dirs file can I just do a mkdir -p ?
<jdstrand> sure
<jdstrand> tedg: actually, I am looking at the generated maintainer script for tcpdump. I don't think you need to create it. dh_apparmor handles it ok. just ignore force-complain for now
<jdstrand> grep apparmor /var/lib/dpkg/info/tcpdump.*
<tedg> jdstrand, Cool, it all seems to be working!
<jdstrand> \o/
<tedg> jdstrand, Thanks!
<jdstrand> np
<tedg> mterry, Merges proposed, now with apparmor.  I know you were loosing sleep over your machine getting hacked with xfreerdp buffer exploits :-)
 * tedg hugs the security team
<mterry> tedg, ah thanks!
<mdeslaur> tedg: well, having anyone step up to my machine and access my files from the login screen was kind of less than ideal :)
 * mdeslaur hugs tedg
<tedg> mdeslaur, Store your pr0n collection on an external drive ;-)
<mdeslaur> hehe :P
<mdeslaur> tedg: I though that was what ubuntuone was for?
<tedg> mdeslaur, You are a marketing genius!
<mdeslaur> hehe
<kenvandine> anyone know what to do with this error?
<kenvandine> dpkg-source: error: add __pycache__/build_i18n_ext.cpython-32.pyc in debian/source/include-binaries if you want to store the modified binary in the debian tarball
<mterry> tedg, what is the wrapper for?
<kenvandine> that file isn't in the source branch or the tarball
<kenvandine> but quilt thinks it is a changed file
<mterry> kenvandine, pycache is a generated folder, I know that much
<kenvandine> yeah... quilt is angry with me...
<kenvandine> not quilt
<kenvandine> i guess :/
<kenvandine> just dpkg
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, my connection is maxing out at only 58Mbps. i wish my neighbours would stop using the internet in the evenings!
<chrisccoulson> so inconsiderate....
<micahg> 58Mbps, I wish I had that
 * micahg is stuck on a measly 25Mbps
<jbicha> micahg: I've got 3Mbps at home, faster at work though
<cyphermox> dobey: pong
<cyphermox> sorry, irc window was closed
<dobey> cyphermox: hey, i saw you did the uploads for indicator-sync. i was wondering why libsync-menu1 doesn't Depends: indicator-sync, as it does need it to be useful
<cyphermox> meh, oversight
<dobey> cyphermox: can you do an upload adding that real quick?
<cyphermox> it doesn't make it not work at all, just useless
<cyphermox> sure
<cyphermox> is there a bug for this?
<dobey> no, i wanted to ping you first in case there was some reason that made sense :)
<dobey> should i file one?
<cyphermox> not for this
<dobey> there is an FFe for ubuntuone to add integration with it though. so when we get that in and add the Recommnds: for the gir, it will be nice to have the deps work right :)
<cyphermox> anything else?
<micahg> that might be a reason not to add the depends actually (depending on which piece of U1 is depending on it)
<micahg> if U1 is being used in an env w/out indicators, there's no reason to pull in the indicator itself
<cyphermox> is there a MIR for indicator-sync?
<Laney> bug #1046055
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1046055 in indicator-sync "[MIR] indicator-sync" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1046055
<cyphermox> yeah, just found out via rmadison
 * Laney googled :-)
<Laney> the premier way to find Launchpad bugs
<cyphermox> hehe
<cyphermox> micahg: in this case a Recommends might be the better way to go
<cyphermox> at least you can remove it
<cyphermox> it's true that libsync-menu1 is pretty useless without indicator-sync installed
<cyphermox> huh, maybe there's another issue too
<Laney> ah, that greasemonkey bug is why my firefox crapped out earlier
<Laney> the firefox crash reporter wouldn't let me submit either :-)
<cyphermox> ah, it's just really really new
<micahg> cyphermox: useless, yes, but libraries shouldn't pull other stuff unless it's needed to make the library function, indicator-sync will allow consumers of the library to have their contents displayed in it
<jbicha> maybe ubuntu-one shouldn't be doing the depending or recommending at all, let ubuntu-desktop or ubuntu-settings do that
<chrisccoulson_> Laney, yeah, that crash sucks :/
<bkerensa> does anyone know how and where Online Accounts stores account credentials?
<jbicha> bkerensa: I think in the gnome-keyring, you can open seahorse if you want to poke at them
<bkerensa> jbicha: I just wanted to make sure they were stored securely
<bkerensa> thanks :D
<cyphermox> micahg: dobey: libindicator-messages-status-provider1 doesn't depend on indicator-messages; libsync-menu1 probably should not depends on indicator-sync
<micahg> suggests seems fine
<cyphermox> so it's more like jbicha mentioned, fix this in seed
<cyphermox> that could work too
<dobey> that seems wrong
<cyphermox> but it doesn't address what dobey wants addressed ;)
<micahg> well, which binary was supposed to get the recommends?
<cyphermox> micahg: what do you mean?
<micahg> which U1 binary
<cyphermox> none. U1 depends on libsync-menu1 since it makes use of the library
<Laney> unity depends directly on the other indicators
<dobey> micahg: ubuntuone-client
<Laney> well, recommends
<micahg> well, that again seems wrong as it's only useful in some environments
<dobey> eh?
<cyphermox> micahg: well the library itself isn't going to do much unless you have indicator-sync installed
<dobey> it's the same as libnotify4 having a Recommends: for notification-daemon | notify-osd
<dobey> or the other various notification daemon implementations
<dobey> ralsina: https://code.launchpad.net/~dobey/ubuntuone-client/fix-icon-install/+merge/125337 please
<dobey> err
<dobey> wrong channel for that
<cyphermox> dobey:  I'm not feeling strongly enough for indicator-sync to address things any differently than other indicators, so taking the example on indicator-messages, this should probably be best addressed as a recommends/depends from unity like the others
<micahg> notification is supported almost universally, just with different implementations, I'm not sure indicators are there yet
<Laney> yeah, that's a recommends on a (not pure) virtual package
<Laney> I think going from unity is the right approach
<cyphermox> I think this can wait until didrocks is back to include this in the next unity upload?
<Laney> MP might be best to make sure it's not lost
<cyphermox> aye
<Laney> oh Breaking Bad, where have you been all my life?
<cyphermox> Laney: just found that?
<cyphermox> it's amazing
<Laney> just got netflix, so yeah
<cyphermox> ah, yeah :)
<dobey> micahg: which is probably why libsync-menu1 should depends on indicator-sync; it's not like anything actually happens with it outside unity when it's installed, either
<micahg> dobey: sure, Xfce and KDE have indicator implementations which might make it useful
<micahg> although Xfce ATM is stuck with GTK2 indicators, not sure about KDE
<lickalott> anyone have a suggestion for a good bandwidth usage monitor
<lickalott> command line
<cyphermox> dobey: MP done for unity
<cyphermox> bbl
<Saviq> is anyone elses Unity is all-kinds-of-broken today on Q?
<Saviq> I've no alt+tab switcher, the launcher doesn't notice open windows etc... unusable, really :/
<ogra_> Saviq, the alt-tab switcher is usable for you when it works ?
<Saviq> ogra_, ;P
<ogra_> :)
<robert_ancell> RAOF, did you forget to upstream bug 831867?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 831867 in sane-backends "colord assert failure: colord: browser.c:701: avahi_service_browser_free: Assertion `*_head == _item' failed." [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/831867
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-09-20
<RAOF> robert_ancell: Heh. Launchpad timeout. If that's the bug I'm thinking of, no, I didn't forget to upstream it.
<RAOF> robert_ancell: colord upstream has totally removed sane support due to crashes; if it looks like my fix clears most of those crashes up sane support will be re-added.
<thumper> hi all
<thumper> seems my GM45 intel chip still isn't very loved by quantal
<bkerensa> that is most unfortunate
<bkerensa> what are you encountering?
<thumper> after logging in from lightdm, unity starts, then after 10s it crashes and restarts, then crashes again after 10s and doesn't restart
<thumper> 10s delay is the time when the dash view gets realized
<thumper> I filed a bug a while back
<thumper> and it is a known issue with the older intel chips
<bkerensa> thumper: what is the bug #?
<bkerensa> oh
<thumper> some race condition in the driver
 * thumper looks
<thumper> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xserver-xorg-video-intel/+bug/1043562
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1043562 in xserver-xorg-video-intel "[gm45] GPU lockup EIR: 0x00000010 PGTBL_ER: 0x00000001 IPEHR: 0x60020100" [High,Triaged]
<Darxus> I should be updating my gtk ppa to this version, right https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/quantal/+source/gtk+3.0/3.5.18-0ubuntu2 ?  Not 3.5.18-0ubuntu1 which I can currently download from the archives?
<pitti> Good morning
<TheMuso> Morning pitti.
<pitti> hey TheMuso, how are you?
<TheMuso> pitti: Not too bad thanks, yourself?
<pitti> quite fine, thanks!
<pitti> hey robert_ancell
<robert_ancell> pitti, hello
<pitti> robert_ancell: how's glib doing?
<robert_ancell> pitti, i'm building it in a PPA right now, doesn't like to build locally
 * TheMuso wonders whether GTK 3.5.16 needs the new glib... I am experiencing some segfaults related to a11y and GTK here, downgrading to 3.5.16 makes the problem go away...
<pitti> robert_ancell: you can build locally with DEB_BUILD_OPTIONS=nocheck if you want local .debs for testing (and quick)
<TheMuso> Just building a downgaded package of the first ubuntu revision of 3.5.18 prior to the patch update...
<TheMuso> to see if the problem still persists.
<robert_ancell> pitti, oh, that's handy
<pitti> robert_ancell: this dbus keyring thingy is really unnerving; I don't know why it does that when building under a running gnome session
<pitti> robert_ancell: I looked for something which would create that key (then we coudl add it to debian/rules), or to avoid it (unsetting DBUS_*, etc.), but no luck
<jbicha> robert_ancell: you saw that glib 2.33.14 was uploaded to experimental today?
<pitti> oh, we might just sync that then?
<pitti> seems Laney committed it there
<pitti> https://buildd.debian.org/status/package.php?p=glib2.0&suite=experimental
<pitti> wow
<robert_ancell> just sync then
<pitti> oh, this also disables the glib schema compiler warnings again, good
<pitti> d'oh, forgot to specify -proposed
<pitti> ah well, I'll watch it
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> bonjour didrocks
<didrocks> hey pitti, how are you?
<pitti> je vais bien, merci! et toi?
<kenvandine> didrocks, good morning
<kenvandine> didrocks, is the libunity release going to be 6.5.2?
<pitti> kenvandine: oh, burning the midnight oil?
<kenvandine> yes... sigh
<kenvandine> i am taking today off... so gotta get some stuff finished :)
<kenvandine> so i can go out of town in a few hours
<didrocks> kenvandine: 6.6 rather
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> cool
<didrocks> pitti: je continue de tousser encore :/
<kenvandine> didrocks, i released gwibber
<kenvandine> and preparing the packaging branch
<kenvandine> going to add a build dep for that
<pitti> didrocks: argh -- no time to rest and cure it properly, I guess :(
<didrocks> kenvandine: excellent! pushing to -proposed?
<kenvandine> no...
<kenvandine> oh
<kenvandine> i guess i can
<kenvandine> it'll just dep wait :)
<didrocks> kenvandine: I think it will make sense :)
<kenvandine> i was going to ask you to upload it later
<kenvandine> but this works :)
<didrocks> can do as well :)
<didrocks> kenvandine: indicators -> all is ok?
<kenvandine> can you get chromium-browser out of -proposed for me?
<kenvandine> yeah
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, the rush will continue today
<didrocks> kenvandine: will do as well! :)
<kenvandine> didrocks, dbusmenu is still coming
<kenvandine> thx
<didrocks> kenvandine: ok, excellent, thanks!
<kenvandine> it is ready to go from -proposed to quantal now
 * didrocks continues to do changes in unity now that the latest UIFe/FFe are acked
<kenvandine> bamf and libunity-webapps got promoted
<kenvandine> i am going to make gwibber build dep on libunity-dev >= 6.5.1 (which is what i have in the pkgconfig check)
<RAOF> kenvandine: Is https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gwibber/+bug/1051801 on your plate?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1051801 in gwibber "gwibber-service crashed with SIGSEGV" [Medium,Confirmed]
<didrocks> kenvandine: looking good to me
<kenvandine> RAOF, yes... that is a dupe though
<kenvandine> i am currently stumped on that crash
<kenvandine> i had barry look at it too, no joy :/
<RAOF> kenvandine: You're probably corrupting memory in libdbus by not calling dbus_threads_init_default
<kenvandine> RAOF, do you think that could be in libaccounts-glib and triggered by gwibber calling it with GI?
<didrocks> RAOF is the libdbus expert now I guess :)
<kenvandine> we need one :)
<didrocks> RAOF: more colord stuff on the release team list for you man :)
<RAOF> Hurray! :(
<kenvandine> didrocks, don't distract him from thinking about that crash :)
<didrocks> heh :)
<didrocks> ok rls-q-incoming clean for this morning now
<didrocks> kenvandine: hum, you did upload unity-lens-photos?
<didrocks> kenvandine: it was part of the testing stack for unity, as it delivers new features
<didrocks> did you get all manual tests done?
<kenvandine> there was no new features
<didrocks> oh -photos
<didrocks> not -videos
<kenvandine> :)
 * didrocks will grab coffee
<didrocks> kenvandine: go back to do some awesomeness, sorry for the interruption ;)
<kenvandine> no worries
<RAOF> kenvandine: In the stacktrace on that bug, there's something that's accessing dbus from python; that's going to break, because gdbus accesses dbus on its own thread.
<kenvandine> gwibber-service isn't doing any gdbus yet
<RAOF> glib *always* does gdbus.
<kenvandine> but... it is using libaccounts-glib
<kenvandine> well.. sure :)
<RAOF> It's frustrating. It means that glib has broken previously-working code.
<kenvandine> i am reasonable sure it is something to do with logging in with libaccounts-glib
<kenvandine> we stubbed that out so it didn't actually call libaccounts-glib and couldn't get the crash
<kenvandine> but finding a fix...  has me stumped
<kenvandine> RAOF, a fix for that would earn you a few beers at UDS :)
<RAOF> Seriously, I'd try throwing a dbus_threads_init_default() early in gwibber's main.
<RAOF> That does seem to have fixed a bunch of colord problems. (Possibly exposing more âº)
<RAOF> It also fixed everything using gconf.
<kenvandine> dbus.mainloop.glib.threads_init
<kenvandine> RAOF, ^^
<RAOF> kenvandine: Ah, it already does?
<kenvandine> no
 * RAOF isn't familiar with what that's hooked up to.
<kenvandine> i don't think it does
<RAOF> Yeah, looks like that's what you want to call.
<kenvandine> i wish the crash was more predictable...
<RAOF> Hurray for thread madness!
<kenvandine> i am trying it
<kenvandine> didrocks, hummm... when i unplug i am getting the fallback icon for indicator-power
<kenvandine> perhaps something in that ubuntu-mono upload?
<didrocks> kenvandine: right, I noticed that yesterday as well, waiting for larsu to connect :)
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> cool
<kenvandine> brb
<kenvandine> RAOF, that really might have fixed it!
<RAOF> GDBus is a hateful blight upon the world :(
<kenvandine> RAOF, you are my hero
<RAOF> Which is annoying, because if you use *only* gdbus it's quite nice.
<RAOF> It's just that it'll silently break your code if you happen to interact with dbus in any other way :(
<kenvandine> ok, i am going to get some sleep
<kenvandine> see you guys on monday!
<RAOF> desrt: Can I bitch at you about gdbus having a critical design bug causing glib to break everything that uses dbus?
<didrocks> desrt: then, it would be my turn with a dconf-writer race issue
<didrocks> poor desrt :)
<dpm> good morning all
<didrocks> hey dpm
<dpm> bonjour didrocks
<dpm> hey, does anyone know where the strings from the power indicator come from? I see "Battery (0:39 to charge)" shown untranslated on my system, even though the strings (if they come from indicator-power) have been translated for a few cycles. It seems that indicator-power has stopped loading those translations?
<didrocks> dpm: I confirm that the only place where this string is exposed for translation is indicator-power on my system
<didrocks> dpm: and that it's translated in the .mo file in french as well
<didrocks> but the english part is loaded
<didrocks> larsu: hey do you know if you init the gettext support? ^
<dpm> thanks didrocks
<dpm> seems like a regression
<larsu> didrocks, in indicator-power? Let me checl
<didrocks> yep
<larsu> check
<didrocks> larsu: "Battery (charged)" is in indicator-power.mo
<didrocks> msgid "%s (charged)"
<didrocks> msgstr "%s (chargÃ©e)"
<didrocks> for instance
<didrocks> but showing in english
<didrocks> and there is no other strings in other projects exposing it
<didrocks> larsu: I have a second request then, the icon isn't right if I unplug the cable (like battery discharging)
<didrocks> larsu: still on the unity side, not sure if you can give it a look, should be a mismatching symlink
<larsu> didrocks, indicator-power doesn't have a separate service, only the plugin that gets loaded in the panel
<larsu> that probably messes with translations, right?
<larsu> didrocks, unity-panel-service doesn't intialize gettext, but I guess it would be the wrong domain anyway
<didrocks> larsu: yeah, I think the gettext domain is different
<didrocks> how does this work for the others? indicator-power is the only to be in that case?
<didrocks> (no external service)
<larsu> didrocks, I think so, yes
<didrocks> is it possible for the plugin to change the gettext domain before loading each strings?
<didrocks> and restore afterwards
<larsu> tbh, I don't know
<tsdgeos> didrocks: larsu: so you guys merged https://code.launchpad.net/~aacid/gtk/ubuntugtk3_nmenomic_patch/+merge/125169 that fixes https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nautilus/+bug/896740 How shall i update the bug?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 896740 in appmenu-gtk "With appmenus context-menu shortcut options in nautilus do not work properly. E.g. I need to press R twice to select Rename and then hit Return to select it." [High,In progress]
<didrocks> larsu: 37 strings
<tsdgeos> mark all those as Invalid and add the "gtk" project and set as fix released there?
<larsu> didrocks, where? In i-power?
<didrocks> tsdgeos: exactly, thanks!
<didrocks> larsu: yep
<tsdgeos> didrocks: oki
<didrocks> tsdgeos: you can tell it's fixed in 3.5.18-0ubuntu2
<larsu> didrocks, I wonder why this wasn't a problem before...
<didrocks> larsu: TBH, I think it was, it's not the first time I'm noticing that
<didrocks> larsu: let me start my netbook on precise
<didrocks> if I can find my cable power
<larsu> didrocks, the real solution here is to move the logic into a separate service, which we are planning on doing anyway next cycle
<tsdgeos> didrocks: any hint of the exact name i shall use? gtk? gtk3? can't really find it :_/
<larsu> didrocks, but that would be too much change this late in the cycle. I think nothing else in the panel is using gettext, so we might get away with setting the domain of indicator-power onto the whole panel
<larsu> slightly hackish, but....
<didrocks> larsu: sweet, I can't get anymore unity3d running on my precise netbook
<didrocks> larsu: however, unity-2d has it translated
<didrocks> larsu: as it's using the service, it seems that something changed, right?
<didrocks> tsdgeos: gtk+3.0
<larsu> didrocks, charles changed the implementation quite a bit, but I think it was always without a separate process
<larsu> didrocks, do you have a indicator-power process running?
<larsu> (on precise)
<didrocks> larsu: let me look after unf**** my session :)
<larsu> haha
<tsdgeos> didrocks: and now more questions (i'm on newbiew mode) i got the "precise" subthingie in gtk+3.0, how do i add the Quantal one
<tsdgeos> ?
<didrocks> larsu: yep, no service
<didrocks> tsdgeos: no need to add the Quantal one as it's fixed
<didrocks> tsdgeos: the main task is Quantal
<larsu> tsdgeos, but for the record: "nominate for series"
<tsdgeos> ok i see
<didrocks> it's only used to track bugs we want to track
<didrocks> and we don't track them once fixed :)
<didrocks> larsu: not everyone can do that, you need special launchpad powers :)
<didrocks> even for nominating now
<didrocks> and you need to be on the downstream task
<larsu> oh yeah right, I forgot that I got moved into that special group recently ;)
<didrocks> :)
<tsdgeos> well, I left https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gtk+3.0/+bug/896740 as tidy as i could, appreciate if you could make sure i did it correctly
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 896740 in gtk+3.0 "With appmenus context-menu shortcut options in nautilus do not work properly. E.g. I need to press R twice to select Rename and then hit Return to select it." [Undecided,New]
<didrocks> larsu: you are special!
<larsu> \o
<didrocks> tsdgeos: put the main gtk+3.0 task as fix released
<didrocks> otherwise, looks good
<didrocks> larsu: so something changed, maybe in the unity panel service?
<tsdgeos> didrocks: ok, done
<didrocks> tsdgeos: looking good, thanks!
<larsu> didrocks, I don't think so, that hasn't been touched a lot recently. I'm digging in the precise sources of i-power right now, let's see what I can find
<larsu> didrocks, otherwise, charles will probably be able to help us (when he's awake ;) )
<didrocks> larsu: yep :)
<didrocks> larsu: so that + the icon (the second one is probably more trivial)
<larsu> didrocks, maybe I messed up the icon renaming, I'll have a look right after this
<larsu> didrocks, got it!
<larsu> didrocks, the old implementation called g_dgettext, which you can pass the domain directly
<larsu> the new implementation uses _(), which uses the default domain
<larsu> we need more developers using different languages
 * larsu should switch to german....
<larsu> didrocks, you'll get a fix today
<didrocks> larsu: excellent, thanks!
<didrocks> dpm: ^
<didrocks> larsu: yeah, please use your desktop in your language! don't hate it :)
<didrocks> dpm: did you get a bug for it?
<dpm> didrocks, I haven't filed one, as I first wanted to confirm it. Shall I just file a bug?
<dpm> larsu, didrocks, our ever amazing translations community to the rescue: <kelemengabor> it was split out into a new file: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/quantal/indicator-power/quantal/view/head:/src/device.c
<dpm>  and it includes glib/gi18n.h, instead of glib/gi18n-lib.h
<didrocks> using dgettext(), that's what larsu changed
<didrocks> larsu: maybe a comment on the first use so that the change doesn't regress?
<didrocks> telling it's loaded in process of the unity-panel-service
<larsu> didrocks, yup
<larsu> didrocks, actually, dpm's fix is the same as mine with much less work: gi18n-lib redefines _() to call g_dgettext
<Laney> pitti: thanks! mbiebl finished it up last night, was going to sync this morning
<didrocks> Laney: excellent then :)
<didrocks> I think we did that in another package
<didrocks> a couple of cycles ago
<didrocks> I don't remember which one TBH
<larsu> didrocks, do you want a new release for that or can you pull the one revision in the package?
<didrocks> larsu: I'll gladely steal the commit :)
<larsu> didrocks, cool, I'll test and upload in a bit, no need to wait for charles to review for this tiny thing
<didrocks> larsu: right, and I'll confirm it as well
<larsu> yep
<larsu> didrocks, argh, what do I need to install to make `LANG=de_DE ./program` work?
<larsu> I installed german from the "Language Support" thing in g-c-c
<didrocks> larsu: yeah, the language support through g-c-c should set it to you
<larsu> Locale not supported by C library.	Using the fallback 'C' locale.
<larsu> didrocks, https://code.launchpad.net/~larsu/indicator-power/i18n-lib
<larsu> didrocks, I'll push it to trunk when you tell me it works ;)
<didrocks> larsu: ok, testing :)
<larsu> didrocks, icon fix: https://code.launchpad.net/~larsu/ubuntu-mono/lp1001229/+merge/125430
<larsu> didrocks, you were right, the link target for the battery-full-symbolic were wrong: they were missing the .svg extension
<didrocks> larsu: ah! excellent, thanks!
<didrocks> larsu: sorry, got other discussions
<didrocks> larsu: translation fix confirmed
<didrocks> larsu: you can merge it to trunk
<larsu> didrocks, will do
<larsu> dpm, thanks for pointing me to that other header!
<dpm> larsu, np, thanks for the quick fix!
<larsu> didrocks, it's in trunk
<didrocks> larsu: and it's uploaded :)
<didrocks> still waiting on ubuntu-mono to build now
<didrocks> larsu: and correct icons (at least, for almost fully charged battery) loaded!
<larsu> didrocks, great thanks
<didrocks> larsu: thanks to you :)
<ronoc> <rant>The "extra stereo" plugin for audious should be deleted, it clearly introduces artifacts into the mix</rant>
<doko> pitti, while you are at cairo, there is the cairao-c5 ftbfs (test cases), however the 1.8 package is a mess
<doko> see the debian report
<pitti> doko: I don't see a package cairo-c5, caiaro-c5, or anything similar?
<pitti> (also, I won't get to that today -- beta freeze rush)
<doko> pitti, cairo-5c
<tsdgeos> guys what's your opinion on https://bugs.launchpad.net/ayatana-scrollbar/+bug/1005677 and the two branches i made to fix it https://code.launchpad.net/~aacid/ayatana-scrollbar/qt_no_overlay_scrollbar/+merge/124697 and https://code.launchpad.net/~aacid/ayatana-scrollbar/blacklisted_libs/+merge/124873 ? I'm getting from Cimi that he is busy and can't review it
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1005677 in ayatana-scrollbar "Re-emergence of "Gtk-CRITICAL **: IA__gtk_widget_style_get: assertion `GTK_IS_WIDGET (widget)'" Makes vlc and other Qt apps crashing crashing" [High,In progress]
<tsdgeos> Sincerely i prefer the first one but Cimi says he doesn't like distro patching (and i can agree to that)
<pitti> didrocks: oh, nobody packaged gvfs 1.13.8 and .9? I guess I should do that today then
<didrocks> pitti: oh? I asked you on Monday, but didn't get any answer, I didn't dare touching it, sorry
<pitti> np; we have pretty good test coverage for it now :)
<didrocks> pitti: heh, you can upload with your eyes closed :)
 * didrocks goes back to the PS/unity """party"""
<pitti> if I upload to -proposed, yes :)
<Mirv> yeah that's where the real party is
<Laney> larsu: magically, the indicator-power icons are fixed ;-)
<larsu> Laney, ;)
<xnox> Laney: larsu: thank you. I was scared that it will be default =)
<Sweetshark> hmmm, installing the quantal daily CD (amd64) in VirtualBox fails to install the bootloader. known issue?
<didrocks> xnox: any idea? ^
<didrocks> Sweetshark: hey!
<didrocks> Sweetshark: you have one bug on http://reports.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-q-tracking-bug-tasks.html, do you think you will have the time to work on it? :)
<didrocks> it was targetted for beta2
<xnox> Sweetshark: no idea. Was fine yesterday... but there is reported jenkins failure  today (?!) bug bug 1053317
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1053317 in ubiquity "Failed to symbolic-link /boot/initrd.img-3.5.0-15-generic to initrd.img:File exists at /var/lib/dpkg/info/linux-image-3.5.0-15-generic.postinst line 614. on amd64 installation" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1053317
<dpm> does anyone know what the indicator-sync is? I've just noticed that new translations template in the queue and approved it
<dpm> it seems the template was uploaded yesterday the first time
<Sweetshark> didrocks: hmm, like this: http://paste.ubuntu.com/1216635/ ?
<didrocks> Sweetshark: the metapackage is in universe?
<davidcalle> dpm, it's the indicator that should handle and display things such as Ubuntu One sync progress. U1 should be updated to work with it, which is, I believe, in progress or done.
<dpm> davidcalle, ok, thanks.
<davidcalle> didrocks, hey
<Sweetshark> didrocks: eh, no. how does micahg get that? the libreoffice source package is in main.
<didrocks> hey davidcalle!
<didrocks> Sweetshark: can you please check with him?
<davidcalle> didrocks, there has been a new photo lens upload yesterday, but the packaging has lost a depends (was here in the previous distro version). Neither mterry or kenvandine are around, would you have the time to fix it? (or point me to the good person) https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity-lens-photos/+bug/1053257
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1053257 in unity-lens-photos "unity-lens-photos crashed with ImportError in /usr/lib/unity-lens-photos/flickr_scope.py: No module named oauthlib.oauth1" [Medium,In progress]
<didrocks> davidcalle: ok, will do it
<davidcalle> didrocks, thanks :)
<didrocks> yw :)
<Sweetshark> didrocks: i am asking back on the bug what that is about.
<didrocks> ok
<didrocks> davidcalle: do you know where the packaging branch is?
<didrocks> seems ubuntu/unity-lens-photos
<davidcalle> didrocks, don't know, looking for it
<didrocks> davidcalle: I guess it's that one
<davidcalle> didrocks, yes it is
<didrocks> davidcalle: ok, a lot of uploads are missing in this
<didrocks> davidcalle: I'm just adding the dep
<davidcalle> didrocks, and it misses a depends on python3-oauthlib
<davidcalle> didrocks, yes, mterry took over it for some time.
<didrocks> without pushing the branch and following the merge-upstream workflow :/
<didrocks> davidcalle: gir1.2-gdata-0.0 dep is needed as well, right?
<davidcalle> didrocks, it is, yes. Missing too?
<didrocks> yep
<davidcalle> :/
<didrocks> davidcalle: uploaded
<davidcalle> didrocks, merci!
<didrocks> de rien :)
<desrt> RAOF: sure.  what's up?
<cyphermox> didrocks: saw my merge proposal?
<didrocks> cyphermox: hum, not really, did you subscribe me to it?
<cyphermox> yeah, you're reviewer
<cyphermox> it's for unity
<didrocks> cyphermox: link?
<cyphermox> https://code.launchpad.net/~mathieu-tl/ubuntu/quantal/unity/indicator-sync-recommends/+merge/125342
<didrocks> cyphermox: it's already installed by default?
<cyphermox> didrocks: it's not
<cyphermox> U1 will need it
<didrocks> cyphermox: do we have a FFe?
<didrocks> acked by the release team
<didrocks> and an UIFe?
<cyphermox> it's packaged and there as been a MIR
<didrocks> and about the FFe/UIFe?
<cyphermox> there is no UIFe/FFe for having it included by Unity; oops
<didrocks> I mean, for having it installed by default?
<cyphermox> no
<didrocks> ok, I won't include it then until that is done
<cyphermox> dobey: ^^
<didrocks> cyphermox: it's not that one? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntuone-client/+bug/1042343
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1042343 in ubuntuone-client/trunk "[FFE] Ubuntu One integration with Q sync indicator" [High,Fix committed]
<cyphermox> that sounds more like for U1
<didrocks> 15:34:37     cyphermox | U1 will need it
<didrocks> isn't what yo utold?
<didrocks> your told*
<didrocks> you*
<cyphermox> yes
<Laney> it's not that
<Laney> that is for U1 using the new API
<didrocks> Laney: ok :)
<Laney> but it is rather pointless to use that if there's nowhere to render it
<didrocks> cyphermox: tell me when they will have followed the process, they need an acked FFe and UIFe
<dobey> hrmm
<Laney> I suppose it will impact screenshots of the desktop
<cyphermox> yeah
<didrocks> hence the ask for UIFe :)
<Laney> indeed
<cyphermox> I wonder what happens when there is nothing syncing, hopefully it's passive then
<jbicha> and will adding indicator-sync integration mean we can finally kill the U1 shortcut by default in the launcher?
<dobey> jbicha: why would we kill the shortcut? i suppose we could at some point, but it doesn't seem really necessary
<cyphermox> jbicha: why kill the shortcut?
<cyphermox> you need to configure it somehow at first
<dobey> and yeah, the sync indicator integration will only work when it's actually configured and running
<jbicha> we have way too much stuff in the launcher by default; once configured, I pretty much never use the control panel
<dobey> remove the libreoffice shortcuts by default
<cyphermox> I don't know how indicator-sync shows things while they aren't syncing, I'm hoping it's PASSIVE, so not showing at all if there is no operation in progress
<jbicha> the U1 shortcut is really just an advertisement & not used much so it seemed an easier target for my frustration
<cyphermox> hehe
<dobey> cyphermox: well if ubuntuone-syncdaemon isn't running (which it isn't by default, as it only runs after you set up u1), and the indicator integration comes from thereâ¦
<charles> cyphermox: it's in the spec, it shows if there's any client registered on it, whether there's activity or not
<jbicha> but sure, we would get rid of Calc & Impress by default
<cyphermox> jbicha: OTOH, the control panel is reachable from the... control panel
<cyphermox> ykwim ;)
<jbicha> which is more logical
<dobey> anyway, have to run real quick. brb
<cyphermox> bah, it's similar to Software Center. do you use it much?
<larsu> charles, which, imo, is the weakest part of the spec. It shouldn't show when it's not syncing
<cyphermox> some people might; jsut like some people might use the U1 control center regularly to see how well their transfers are going or if the right directories get synced
<jbicha> I have a very difficult time trying to get people to use apt-get, so yes, Software Center is very useful & used more than once
<charles> larsu: yeah I was kind of surprised at that ... a lot of the indicator design choices lately have been hide-it-until-you-need-it
<cyphermox> charles: oh, so it always does show?
<cyphermox> :)
<larsu> charles, exactly
<charles> cyphermox: it shows if there's any client registered on it, whether there's activity or not
<cyphermox> ah, well that's probably not too bad
<cyphermox> definitely needs a UIFe/FFe anyway
<jbicha> in that case, it sounds like the spec was designed so that we could kill the launcher icon by default
<larsu> jbicha, yes!
<cyphermox> charles: do you want to file a bug for that if dobey hasn't? Then I'll shepherd it to get the FFe approved
<charles> *nod*
<charles> jbicha: *nod*
<charles> cyphermox: file a bug for not showing until needed? run that by mpt first
<cyphermox> no
<cyphermox> I mean file a bug for having it installed by default
<charles> cyphermox: hm, I thought that already was ticketed. one moment
 * mpt tries to remember
<cyphermox> ok
<mpt> Possibly the idea was for it to be an advertisement, removing itself once you were registered?
<mpt> (or if you said you weren't interested)
<mpt> That's not mentioned in the sync menu spec...
<charles> cyphermox: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/indicator-sync/+bug/1046055
<larsu> mpt, automatically removing launcher items doesn't sound like a good idea
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1046055 in indicator-sync "[MIR] indicator-sync" [Undecided,Fix released]
<cyphermox> charles: that's just to get it in Main
<charles> cyphermox: definitely then FFe
<cyphermox> hmm.. perhaps my leak fix for nm-applet was overengineered :)
<mpt> aha, here we go: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MenuBar#system-status
<mpt> "(Present until you've signed up)"
<mpt> That was just a suggestion, though, I'm not an Ubuntu One designer
<cyphermox> desrt: glib question for you; how bad is it to use g_slist_append? punishable by death since it needs to iterate through the list? my alternative involves some changes I'm a little worried about
<larsu> cyphermox, a common convention is to use g_slist_prepend to add all items, and then call g_slist_reverse
<cyphermox> larsu: I want to touch it as little as possible, it's a list I get from an association on a menu item
<larsu> cyphermox, I don't understand your question then. Do you want to add a single item to the list?
<cyphermox> basically, http://paste.ubuntu.com/1216725/ ; starts at line 238; then 315.
<cyphermox> larsu there could be any number of items added to the list
<cyphermox> it's a list of duplicate BSS for a given SSID
<larsu> cyphermox, it's already using g_slist_prepend, though
<cyphermox> (clear_dupes_list frees the whole thing)
<cyphermox> larsu: yes
<desrt> cyphermox: there's nothing wrong with it perse
<charles> cyphermox: I don't see what you're asking about?
<cyphermox> larsu: the original (the minuses at 315, appears to leak, according to valgrind
<charles> cyphermox: I don't see much list overhead in the patch here
<cyphermox> ie. just prepending doesn't change the pointer in the object to the new start of the list
<larsu> cyphermox, yeah calling g_object_set_data_full is correct, but why are you copying the list?
<larsu> cyphermox, ah! there's a destroynotify set
<cyphermox> larsu: because yes
<cyphermox> the new
<charles> lol
<cyphermox> argh
<desrt> steal it!
<cyphermox> the new g_object_data_full will call the destroynotify
<desrt> g_object_steal_data
<cyphermox> desrt: won't the above still apply?
<charles> g_object_steal_data
<desrt> it gets the original pointer and doesn't call the destroynotify
<larsu> cyphermox, what charles said
<desrt> then you can modify and reset it
<larsu> oh, and desrt
<desrt> hi larsu :)
<larsu> desrt, hi!
<cyphermox> desrt: I thought the notify was being called when the set_data was being done
<desrt> it is
<desrt> but it's called on the _last_ value
<cyphermox> oh
<desrt> ie: if i call set_full (obj, "x", y, z);
<cyphermox> which no longer exists
<desrt> then z(y) is called on the *next* call to set()
<desrt> if i steal() it first, then 'y' is no longer owned by obj, and z is never called
<cyphermox> ah, not just called with something that doesn't exists, not called at all?
<cyphermox> this will make things simpler, yeah
<micahg> Sweetshark: the libreoffice binary (metapackage) package is in universe, that's what's being prompted about on upgrade
<cyphermox> desrt: larsu: charles: thanks.
<Ursinha> bug 1052754, that was fast!
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1052754 in apport "apport-gtk crashed with AttributeError in _filter_tag_names(): 'int' object has no attribute 'isspace'" [Critical,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1052754
<Ursinha> thanks pitti :)
<pitti> well, it was me breaking it in the first place :)
<Sweetshark> micahg: we are splitting one source package in multiple reporsitories?
<micahg> Sweetshark: yes, it's common
<micahg> well
<micahg> not exactly
<micahg> the binary is in universe, the source in main
<micahg> sometimes this is done where binary dependencies are needed for something that can't/shouldn't go through the MIR process
<micahg> Sweetshark: the problem is it's confusing for the user, so the short description just needs to be tweaked so it's clear that it's only the metapackage being demoted, not libreoffice itself (or promote the metapackage back to main if there's no reason for it to be in universe)
<Sweetshark> micahg: well, libreoffice source is obviously MIRed (otherwise it couldnt produce main binaries), so it doesnt make sense at all to have it put stuff in universe.
<micahg> Sweetshark: not necessarily true, we have many packages in main with binaries in universe
<Sweetshark> 14:28 < Sweetshark> didrocks: hmm, like this: http://paste.ubuntu.com/1216635/ ?
<Sweetshark> ^^ micahg
<micahg> something like that
<didrocks> I think most of people are installing "libroffice"
<didrocks> so libroffice in main makes more sense
<micahg> yes, if it's not pulling a heap of other stuff in main (unless that stuff is supportable)
<didrocks> Sweetshark: can you check that? if so, I'll do the promotion
<micahg> didrocks: you'll need to add it to the supported seed as well or it'll fall right back out of main
<Sweetshark> micahg: k, will do that (its trivial). OTOH this unclean separation still boggles my mind. see didrocks comments, mind that we have packagekit integration in libreoffice now that might have interesting implications and he fact that an source build of a main package geenerates nonmain binaries is really icky too me.
<dobey> mpt: i don't think we'd remove the u1 launcher automatically after sign-up. that would be quite odd to have happen. and we also do integrate with the unity launcher APIs already as well
<micahg> Sweetshark: main/universe distinction will hopefully go away by the next LTS, but the idea is that not everything is Canonical supported
<didrocks> micahg: thanks, I'm an archive admin, I know about this :)
<micahg> so, if a binary is not needed by the other stuff in main and pulls in a bunch of other things also not needed, it's demoted (if possible)
<didrocks> and a core dev for years
<micahg> didrocks: figured as much, just wanted to be sure :)
<Sweetshark> micahg: I understand that. but since the source already needs the build-deps that only applies to stuff with nasty binary-only closed source deps. right?
<micahg> well, sometimes there's a run time dependency not needed at build time
<micahg> Sweetshark: didrocks: the libreoffice binary as is doesn't have its dependencies in main (libreoffice-filter-mobiledev, ttf-sil-gentium-basic)
<didrocks> micahg: ah, so makes sense it's been demoted
<didrocks> Sweetshark: are those mandatory, can we put them as suggest? ^
<Sweetshark> didrocks: can be demoted to suggest easily.
<didrocks> Sweetshark: can you please do so rather than the description?
<mpt> dobey, that something has APIs doesn't necessarily mean that it's a good idea to be part of it. :-)
<micahg> Sweetshark: didrocks: well, the description should be updated as well (metapackages should be labeled as such)
<mpt> dobey, I agree going away after sign-up would be unusual, but maybe it's a choice between doing that, and not being in the Launcher at all.
<micahg> but the severity is lower if it's in main
<didrocks> micahg: is it mandatory but the debian policy? never seen this paragraph
<micahg> didrocks: well, not exactly, this quote from 3.4.1 seems most relevant: "Remember that in many situations the user may only see the synopsis line - make it as informative as you can. "
<didrocks> micahg: I have nothing against adding it if it doesn't diverge from debian and/or we don't have translations for it
<micahg> didrocks: agreed, it could certainly wait until next cycle at this point and should go through Debian if the binary is promoted
<didrocks> yep
<Laney> pitti: hey, is it OK for me to upload for #1042231?
<pitti> Laney: I guess so, but I guess mvo or glatzor would be better to ping
<pitti> Laney: but I guess with the beta freeze, it's better to fix it now
<Laney> ah, sorry, thought you were the distro guy for that
<tedg> mterry, tsdgeos implemented saving the last server, but it uses a new lib as it encrypts the cache.  Does that need an FFe?
<tedg> mterry, For RLS
<mterry> tedg, guh, yeah.  My understanding is all new packages need FFe
<tedg> mterry, Not a new package, a new build dep.
<tedg> mterry, The dep is already in main.
 * tedg forgot to verify that before asking, but did now.
<mterry> tedg, ah, few.  no, shouldn't need an FFe
<mterry> I mean phew
<tedg> Hooked on phonics strikes again!
<tedg> :-)
<tedg> mterry, Ah, okay.  I'll pull it in.
<tedg> mterry, dbarth helped add some testing to libpam-freerdp as well.  So I'll be releasing that.
<mvo> Laney: go for it
<Laney> cheers
<dobey> charles, cyphermox, didrocks: is there an FFe bug filed for indicator-sync to be installed by default?
<didrocks> dobey: I think the question was addressed to your team about that
<didrocks> dobey: I never saw that
<didrocks> and as told, there is the need to an UIFe and a FFe
<dobey> right; i saw some backlog with charles and cyphermox discussing that, but don't see a bug for it.
<dobey> the MIR bug was linked, but that's fixed and separate
<Laney> mvo: could you merge lp:~laney/sessioninstaller/fix-1042231 into the packaging branch please?
<mterry> jdstrand, you seemed semi-involved in the various webapps FFe bugs.  Have you done any security auditing of those packages?  I'm starting a pre-review MIR for them
<mvo> Laney: sure, hm, it says bzr: ERROR: Not a branch: "bzr+ssh://bazaar.launchpad.net/~laney/sessioninstaller/".
<Laney> er
<Laney> oh, sorry
<Laney> lp:~laney/sessioninstaller/distro-fix-1042231
<dobey> cyphermox, charles: so does that uife/ffe bug still need to get filed?
<Laney> mvo: ^
<mvo> Laney: done, thanks!
<Laney> cheers
<didrocks> dobey: they need to. Not sure they can be reviewed today TBH
<didrocks> dobey: it's really late, we are preparing the same thing with PS, but started 2 weeks ago to discuss the exceptions
<didrocks> and still in flux :)
 * didrocks needs to reboot, brb
<robru> hey didrocks
<didrocks> hey robru
<robru> that rygel ftbfs has me quite stumped. I tried a git bisect on it and was unable to find a version that actually does build successfully, which leads me to believe that perhaps something changed in some package that rygel depends on, which broke it, rather than a change in rygel itself.
<robru> but I don't know enough vala to really say what. The test that fails is related to Soup though.
<didrocks> robru: ok no worry, do you want something else to work on?
<didrocks> or do you have enough on your plate?
<robru> didrocks: I have quite a lot of gwibber work left ;-)
<robru> but maybe if you want to throw me something easy ;-)
<didrocks> robru: ok, go for it then :)
<robru> thanks
<jdstrand> mterry: I have not. mdeslaur looked at 1043461. chriscoulson looked at the extension code and I trust his judgement. the bit we need to make sure of is that there is a process in place regarding testing before our security updates for the browser go out. we can't wait on them for updates, but we recognize breaking webapps is bad
<didrocks> robru: quite busy, will try to find an easy one for you tomorrow :)
<robru> didrocks: ok thanks
<didrocks> yw :)
<mterry> jdstrand, webapps-applications depends on gjs (which depends on mozjs).  Are those giant red flags?
<jdstrand> probably, but it isn't like we can block it. chris looked at this stuff, and I know mdeslaur has also
<mterry> jdstrand, fyi, MIR bug I started is bug 1053463
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1053463 in ubuntu "[MIR] webapps packages" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1053463
<mterry> jdstrand, ok
<jdstrand> (well, mdeslaur has looked at this stuff at a high level-- I don't know if he specifically looked at webapps-applications)
 * jdstrand guesses not
<mdeslaur> no, I just looked at how it was installing packages
<mdeslaur> I didn't take a close look at the code
 * jdstrand nods
<mterry> jdstrand, mdeslaur: which of you should I ask to review things as they come up?  (I can do MIR side, but for auditing purposes)
<mterry> Or shall I just assign to team
<jdstrand> mterry: the team is fine
 * mterry suspects most of this stuff will need a security pass
<jdstrand> mterry: how much are we talking about? this is extremely late for any sort of timely review
<jdstrand> (for beta2)
<dobey> cyphermox, charles, didrocks: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/indicator-sync/+bug/1053482
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1053482 in indicator-sync "[FFe] [UIFe] Install indicator-sync by default" [Undecided,New]
<mterry> jdstrand, tell me about it  :)  Um, well, chris can probably verify the quality of the FF extensions.  So I guess just gjs and mozjs?  Unless Chris can vouch for mozjs too?
<dobey> does that need to be on unity? or affects both?
<didrocks> dobey: affects unity and indicator-sync
<didrocks> dobey: then, you need to get the release team and the doc team to ack it
<didrocks> dobey: TBH, I'm not available today, still continuing the PS and unity work
<jbicha> olli: I'm curious about the UI for bug 1053470 You said it's a lens, but it only shows an additional category after searching
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1053470 in unity "[FFE][UIFe] Dash - land the "more suggestions..." lens" [Critical,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1053470
<jbicha> does that mean it doesn't show up in the white lens bar at the bottom of the dash?
<olli> jbicha, it is an additional category
<jbicha> so it's more of a scope than a lens?
<davidcalle> jbicha, it's a property of lenses that can be set : appear in Dash bar/don't
<jbicha> oh, we don't have any other lenses like that yet, right?
<mterry> chrisccoulson, how do you feel about mozjs and gjs finding their way into main?
<davidcalle> jbicha, not by default, but the 3rd party lens that brings a calculator and weather in the Home dash, does the same thing.
<njpatel> jbicha: hey
<njpatel> you had a question about the shopping lens not showing up at the bottom?
<njpatel> You're right in that it just shows up once you've done a search in the home screen (and if something matches)
<njpatel> There isn't anything else that does that right now but it's been a feature since 10.10 of the lenses API
<jbicha> njpatel: ok, I'm just trying to get a better understanding of these terms, scopes & lenses are tricky to try to explain, & I guess this is one more facet to understand
<njpatel> jbicha: yeah, main thing is only lenses are allowed to show up in the home screen
<njpatel> so if you want to be there, but not be a full-on lens with an icon etc
<njpatel> then you can
<njpatel> but as a scope,your only method of having results on the homescreen is if you are adding results to a lens
<jbicha> it sounds like it's a super-scope to me :)
<didrocks> jdstrand: unity-lens-shopping in NEW (quantal-proposed)
<njpatel> jbicha: hehe
 * njpatel needs better naming
<jbicha> I mean it's like a scope but it can plug into lots of lenses
<njpatel> jbicha: actually, something like that is proposed for 13.04
<njpatel> :)
<mdeslaur> mterry: seeing as how mozjs is ripe with known security vulnerabilities because the standalone version is unmaintained, I'd say it has a pretty slim chance of making it in main
<jbicha> well that's how it feels to a user at least
<mterry> mdeslaur, ah OK.  That's what I feared
<Laney> hm, there's no Filter Results on the home screen
<njpatel> which should simplify all these daemons etc
<njpatel> Laney: nope
<mdeslaur> mterry: probably worth opening a separate MIR for it
<njpatel> Laney: that's meant to be like that
<Laney> I'm sure that's the case
<mterry> mdeslaur, is seed any better from a security point of view?
<Laney> I was just assuming you'd be able to turn shopping on and off there
<njpatel> Laney: right, the way we say is through software center
<njpatel> it would have been nice to have a disable and not remove
<njpatel> you're right
<g0twig> please checkout the bug here: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-control-center/+bug/871985/comments/17 and this comment
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 871985 in gnome-control-center "The printing panel shouldn't display errors about firewalld not running" [Medium,Confirmed]
<mdeslaur> mterry: well, seed is based on webkit, which is problematic also
<mterry> but at least in main already.  :)
<mdeslaur> mterry: not for long
<mterry> fair enough
<mdeslaur> mterry: we have a strategy for webkit, jdstrand can tell you more about it
<mterry> interestingly, mozjs is only used for building
<mterry> so that's somewhat good.  but it would still involve having it in main
<mdeslaur> for the build? why does it need a js interpreter for building?
<mdeslaur> ah, for the test suite
<mterry> chrisccoulson, ping about webapps plugins
<jbicha> bkerensa: your system-config-printer fix should be an actual patch so that we can easily apply it to new versions, do you have time to fix?
<bkerensa> jbicha: surely
<jbicha> bkerensa: do you have that patch? apparently we just froze now but I should be able to still upload it
<cyphermox> jbicha: that being for the firewalld check in control-center/
<cyphermox> ?
<jbicha> cyphermox: no, bug 1053189
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1053189 in system-config-printer "UIFE: Rename "Print Settings" to "Printers"" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1053189
<cyphermox> ah
<jbicha> the package doesn't use quilt :(
<jbicha> cyphermox: hey, it looks like s-c-p isn't in the desktop set, do you want to sponsor for me?
<cyphermox> jbicha: you're funny
<jbicha> I try
<cyphermox> hmm.. sorry; I'd rather not upload things at this point past the freeze deadline
<jbicha> or I could ping robert_ancell if you're done for the day
<cyphermox> I mean, system-config-printer probably builds fast, but it's in the default install, the rule is you're supposed to avoid it if possible and this doesn't fix a critical issue ;)
<jbicha> it affects translations so if we're going to change it, we need to do it now
<Laney> you can upload it into the queue, it's fine
<jbicha> Laney: LP killed that since it's main, but not the desktop set
<jbicha> http://people.ubuntu.com/~jbicha/system-config-printer/
<Laney> not you, people in general
<Laney> I'm going to bed, but I'll do it tomorrow if needed
<Laney> rather not though, because then I can't do the queue review
<stgraber> cyphermox: can you please upload that so we can review and let it in?
<jbicha> I somehow had it in my head that the freeze was at midnight UTC so I wasn't watching the clock close enough
<stgraber> freezes are pretty much always at 21:00 UTC
<jbicha> yeah I should know better by now
<Laney> jbicha: how is that different from the branch on the bug?
<cyphermox> stgraber: yeah sure
<cyphermox> Laney: I'll upload it
<jbicha> Laney: it wasn't formatted as a patch, it just modified the source directly
<Laney> I see
<Laney> well, personally I'd have preferred a debdiff (or branch) on the bug rather than uploading to a web server
<Laney> but /me steps away :P
<Laney> night
<cyphermox> night
<cyphermox> ah, indeed looks a little more consistent with the other items
<cyphermox> stgraber: done
<cyphermox> jbicha: ^
 * cyphermox runs to a LUG meeting
<bkerensa> ;d
<bkerensa> jbicha: why did you need a patch specifically?
<bkerensa> the branch should have worked
<cyphermox> bkerensa: was it your first patch?
<bkerensa> LOL
 * bkerensa facepalms
<bkerensa> no not by far
<bkerensa> it was jbicha's patch
<cyphermox> oh ok ;)
<bkerensa> I submitted a MP
<bkerensa> he wanted a patch for some reason
<cyphermox> but I mean, first upload?
<bkerensa> no
<cyphermox> k
<cyphermox> brb
<jbicha> it needs to be a patch so that we can separate the source from the packaging, which is important for when we want to include a new upstream version
<bkerensa> jbicha: ahh its a debian package?
<jbicha> everything is a debian package :)
<bkerensa> jbicha: debian maintained
<jbicha> for most packages, we only touch the debian/ directory and use patches to manipulate the source when needed
<jbicha> for debian source format 3.0 packages, you can't touch the source directly so you need to use quilt patches
<thumper> hi folks
<micahg> well, 3.0 (quilt)
<robert_ancell> RAOF, I did some colord package updating (bug 1053701, bug 1053696)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1053701 in ubuntu "[needs-packaging] colord-gtk" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1053701
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1053696 in colord "Update to 0.1.23" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1053696
<RAOF> robert_ancell: Oooh, ta.
<RAOF> robert_ancell: I wasn't considering it a priority because there's not much in the new versions, other than splitting out colord-gtk into a new source package. Was there a trigger for your welcome updating spree? :)
<robert_ancell> RAOF, just cause it was out of date and I like things to be up to date :)
<robert_ancell> I guess it won't get into quantal but it should be good to go for Debian and then it's ready to pick up for R
<bkerensa> I wish Management Service could have been renamed for 12.10
<bschaefer> hello, so who would I bug to get bamf and libunity-webapps rebuilt in unity-team/staging?
<bschaefer> https://bugs.launchpad.net/libunity-webapps/+bug/1053688
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1053688 in libunity-webapps "bamfdaemon links to libunity_webapps.so but the library is named libunity-webapps.so" [Undecided,New]
<bschaefer> because of that bug ^
<bschaefer> causes bamfdaemon to die, which causes a bunch of problems in unity :(
<cyphermox> bschaefer: I'd recommend asking in #ubuntu-unity too, in case someone is up/looking there
<bschaefer> cyphermox, alright thanks!
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-09-21
<jbicha> tkamppeter: could you take a look at bug 1050602 when you're around?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1050602 in ghostscript "gs 9.06 segfaults when converting to png, bmp, tiff, etc." [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1050602
<bkerensa> does anyone know why even after removing transmission it still somehow spawns up?
<bkerensa> like if you click a magnet url?
<sarnold> bkerensa: how did you remove it?
<bkerensa> sarnold: apt-get remove transmission
<sarnold> bkerensa: somewhere along the way the package was renamed to transmission-gtk, iirc. Try dpkg -l 'transmission*' to see which transmission packages are still installed, if any
<pitti> Good morning
<desrt> pitti: good morn
<pitti> hey desrt
<RAOF> Morning pitti
<RAOF> Hey desrt!
<desrt> hi
<desrt> you had a question for me the other day...
<RAOF> desrt: The gdbus bitch I wanted to get off my chest was how it breaks software that uses libdbus.
<desrt> oh?
<desrt> how so?
<desrt> (and why should i care?) ;)
<RAOF> Because it always spawns a thread, and does libdbus calls on it, without ever initialising libdbus' threadsafety, or suggesting that the caller might want to do that.
<desrt> no....
<desrt> gdbus never calls libdbus
<RAOF> ...hm.
<RAOF> Ah. So there's something else in our stack which is.
<desrt> glad i could help :)
<RAOF> desrt: So gdbus has its own dbus implementation?
<desrt> from scratch
<desrt> glib has a libdbus depend in ./configure but only so the testcases can compare serialisation for compatibility
<desrt> it's never used at runtime
<desrt> bedtime here
<desrt> laters :)
<RAOF> Catch you :)
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> bonjour didrocks
<didrocks> guten morgen pitti (sorry, already in useless paperwork), how are you?
<pitti> je vais bien! having "fun" with sandboxing a gnome-session with a mock upower for testing
<didrocks> pitti: lucky you to be able to work on technical things :)
 * pitti hugs didrocks
 * didrocks hugs pitti back
<bizhanMona> HI I have installed some packages on my Ubuntu/Precise 12.04. I have forgot the list of the packages that I have installed, is there any command could provide me the history of the packages installed? Tx
<didrocks> bizhanMona: you can see some good history in /var/log/apt/history.log
<bizhanMona> didrocks: thx
<didrocks> yw
<pitti> didrocks: nice unity bug fix list!
<didrocks> pitti: isn't it? :)
<didrocks> pitti: a lot of FFe in them though :/
<mvo> hrm, is it a known issue that after login the screen stays blank and does not load to the full desktop? or should I start debugging?
<didrocks> mvo: ah, not known, some people even installed -proposed yesterday without any issue
<mvo> didrocks: compiz[11350] trap int3 ip:xxxx sp:xxxx error:0
<mvo> didrocks: from dmesg, let me try if I can get apport to trigger
<didrocks> mvo: do you mind reporting the crash if any?
<didrocks> yep :)
<mvo> heh :) "TypeError: 'in <string>' requires string as left operand, not byte"  from the source_xorg.py plugin
<didrocks> hum, I thought bryceh fixed that one? ^
<mvo> all updates from this morning are installed
<mvo> maybe its not build yet
<didrocks> mvo: juts tell that your issue is not graphical to bypass the xorg hook :)
<didrocks> in reporting your bug
<mvo> yeah, tried reporting via cli/linux-console, but that did not went too well, LP does not really like the ascii browser anymore it seems
 * mvo will login failsafe
<didrocks> mvo: better?
<didrocks> mvo: you can do a local retracing otherwise you have the -dbgsym handy
<mvo> didrocks: bug #1053848
<didrocks> mvo: can you add me to subscriber? :)
 * didrocks wants access :p
<mvo> didrocks: *cough* I thought you can see *everything* ;)
<didrocks> mvo: sure sure, I'm just pretending to not bein able :)
<didrocks> being*
<didrocks> mvo: looking with the unity guys on it now
<mvo> didrocks: added you now, should I leave it as is or try something like unity --reset to see if that fixes it, i.e. if its a local setting or something
<mvo> didrocks: cool, any channel I should join?
<didrocks> mvo: can you try a guest session and run "unity" there?
<didrocks> mvo: asking duflu to come here
<mvo> didrocks: guest session appears fine
<didrocks> mvo: with unity?
<mvo> didrocks: yes
<didrocks> ah, interesting
<didrocks> so, what do you have in your config making thatâ¦
<didrocks> duflu: hey, just a summary, seems that mvo can run unity successfully with a guest account
<mvo> didrocks: not much really, I think :) my ccsm days are over, I just customized some stuff via the normal control center like focus follow mouse, custom keybindings etc
<didrocks> duflu: so, seems to be a settings, let's see once retraced, but I bet gsettings-related
<didrocks> mvo: we migrated some custom keybindings (but there is a bug in glib making that not all key are transitionned successfully)
<duflu> didrocks: OK, will wait. In the mean time I will be in and out (crashing X)
<didrocks> duflu: enjoy :)
<didrocks> pitti: anything I can buy you to get bug #1053848 retraced soon? :)
<mvo> didrocks: ok, I will keep the system as it is and log into openbox or something in the meantime
<didrocks> mvo: heh, that will remind you old times :)
<didrocks> (I personnaly likes fluxbox)
<mvo> didrocks: ahah, indeed
<didrocks> mvo: retrace failed :/
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<didrocks> hey chrisccoulson!
<didrocks> how are you?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, quite tired. had quite a late night last night. how are you?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: quite relieved to have unity/compiz stack landed and an iso spinning soon with it :)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: paperwork prepared for the release team, we are on track!
<didrocks> I had a question from the release team though, about the firefox webapp support
<didrocks> I know you discussed with the webapps guys
<didrocks> can you update myself please where we are at?
<didrocks> (sorry to bother you with that, but I prefer to have things prepared for the meeting with PS later today)
<chrisccoulson> i need to check up on the bug, but i think they want me to look at a merge after i highlighted some issues with their "chromeless" support
<chrisccoulson> not sure if all of those have been addressed yet
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: do you think you will be able to do it today and keep me up to date then? (the meeting is at 4PM UTC)
<chrisccoulson> yeah, sure
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: thanks a lot :)
<chrisccoulson> still trying to clear up some mess i found from bug 1051152 too, which resulted in http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~extension-hackers/globalmenu-extension/trunk/revision/451 last night ;)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1051152 in globalmenu-extension "Firefox 16 beta crash in nsIContent::SetAttr with greasemonkey installed" [Critical,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1051152
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: so, you definitively hates greasemonkey now? :)
<chrisccoulson> yes
<chrisccoulson> i hated it before, anyway
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: for their upstream code, how does mozilla handles it?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: I guess they have quite some issues with such popular extensions
<chrisccoulson> especially when firefox has a supported mechanism for injecting script in to content that doesn't rely on greasemonkey, and is future proof (so it will continue to work with multiple content processes, whereas greasemonkey will stop working)
<chrisccoulson> oh, mozilla have a blocklist mechanism for problematic addons ;)
<didrocks> ok, they just badlist it if something is really wrong with the extension?
<chrisccoulson> although, that's normally used for malware, addons which introduce a security problem or as a last resort for addons which cause other problems (such as ours, causing crashes)
<gotwig> I want a feature freeze exception for this commit for gnome control center: http://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-control-center/commit/?id=45ba8e89e86397df912e07df14d76373f1c7e7af  this fixes the error message from firewallid for finding network printers in Printers panel under GNOME Shell
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: ok, got it :)
<didrocks> gotwig: please follow https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess
<didrocks> gotwig: you will need an UIFe as well (same page)
<Laney> hey
<didrocks> hey Laney, how are you?
<Laney> glad we got to the freeze :P
<Laney> but yeah, good. you?
<didrocks> Laney: approximately the same feeling :)
<Laney> :-)
<tjaalton> is it a known bug that the date on the indicator has some weird characters on fresh quantal?
<didrocks> tjaalton: no, don't get that one, please file a bug and ping me
<Laney> screenshot would be useful
<czajkowski> Laney: found another bug! my machine won't power off! found this out the hard way and woke up to no battery :/
<didrocks> larsu: hey, did you hear about anything like that? ^
<tjaalton> didrocks: ok, at least with finnish locale
<Laney> czajkowski: won't power off?
<didrocks> tjaalton: for once, french one is fine :)
<czajkowski> Laney: nope hit shut down from menu, brings me back to thelogin screen
<czajkowski> Laney: have to hold the power button to shut it off
<larsu> tjaalton, didrocks, haven't heard of that one yet, no
<tjaalton> ok let me get a screenshot first
<czajkowski> Laney: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/lightdm/+bug/1053852
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1053852 in lightdm "machine wont shut down without being forced to" [Undecided,New]
<Laney> hm, is there no apport hook for lightdm?
<tjaalton> hmm, and auto-raise got turned on
<tjaalton> (i have just focus-follows-mouse)
<tjaalton> *had
<Laney> czajkowski: can you attach the files from /var/log/lightdm please
<tjaalton> larsu, didrocks: http://koti.kapsi.fi/~tjaalton/tmp/date.png
<didrocks> indeed, quite annoying :/ larsu: can you track it, with charles if needed? ^
<didrocks> tjaalton: a bug would be appreciated
<tjaalton> sure
<tjaalton> against..?
<larsu> tjaalton, indicator-datetime
<tjaalton> thanks
<larsu> didrocks, I won't be able to fix it today, have to finish a gtk patch, I'll let charles know as soon as he's online
<didrocks> larsu: sure, there is time, but would be nice to fix it before my EOD so that we can have it for beta2
<larsu> didrocks, agreed.
<didrocks> larsu: keep me posted (or tell charles to keep me posted ;))
<didrocks> thanks! :)
<tjaalton> filed bug 1053875
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1053875 in indicator-datetime "space between date and time replaced with extra characters" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1053875
<didrocks> mvo: tell me when you have some time so that we play with your dconf config
<larsu> tjaalton, thanks!
<mvo> didrocks: now
 * Laney sidles up to chrisccoulson 
<Laney> oh, Chriiiis?
<didrocks> mvo: ok, so, just for testing, but can you try renaming you .config/dconf/user?
<didrocks> mvo: so that we ensure it's a gsettings key to be at fault here
<Laney> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/quantal/+queue?queue_state=1&queue_text= â webapps there. Is it sane?
<mvo> didrocks: hm, same deal
<didrocks> mvo: ah, what can it be then? hum :/
<didrocks> mvo: I guess you never ever installed unity by handâ¦
<mvo> didrocks: uhhhhhhh, let me double check, a long time ago I did a patch for unity
<didrocks> mvo: oh? so having some special .compiz, .compiz-1 content maybe?
<didrocks> and .config/compiz-1
<mvo> didrocks: let me double check
<mvo> didrocks: .compiz-1 -> .compiz-1.xxx was it
<mvo> didrocks: now it works
<didrocks> mvo: yeah, you have an old compiz/unity installation
<didrocks> mvo: didn't really like the ABI break I guess :p
<mvo> didrocks: so that would only be quantal->quantal?
<didrocks> mvo: that's only people compiling by hand and installing a local version
<mvo> oh, I have local plugins?!?
<didrocks> not using packages
<mvo> how is that
<didrocks> yep
<didrocks> when you worked on it I guess
<didrocks> it's installing them in .compiz-1/
<mvo> didrocks: yeah, I cleaned /usr/local but I did not think about this
<didrocks> mvo: yeah, it's puzzling, I know :)
<didrocks> mvo: btw #1 issue when PS reports a crash and ping me about their code, telling that quantal is broken :p
<mvo> didrocks: hm, I killed the .so files now but still no luck, so even session and .xml
<mvo> kills it
<didrocks> mvo: didn't you tell me that renaming the .compiz-1 worked?
<didrocks> mvo: oh, not related, but think to rename (out of the session) your ~/.config/dconf/user file to not loose your dconf config :)
<mvo> didrocks: yeah, renaming worked
<didrocks> mvo: can you run tree on your content in it?
<mvo> didrocks: a bunch of xml and a bunch of session files
<didrocks> mvo: so, removing all xml files didn't work?
<mvo> didrocks: removing the xml helped, so that is what it crashed it
<mvo> didrocks: interessted in debugging further?
<mvo> didrocks: or should I just remove them?
<didrocks> mvo: no, you had those xml because of the local install
<didrocks> mvo: and some keys changed
<mvo> didrocks: ok
<didrocks> so compiz was trying to load an unexisting keys for you I guess
<didrocks> hence the crash
<didrocks> but really related to your local install :)
<didrocks> phew! Thanks mvo :)
<mvo> didrocks: :)
<mvo> didrocks: thank you, sorry for wasting your time
<didrocks> mvo: no worry at all ;)
<mvo> didrocks: one further question, how do I get back my focus-follow-mouse? can't see it in the control center
<mvo> or am I just blind?
<didrocks> mvo: it wasn't in control-center IIRC, not sure how you set it
<didrocks> mvo: did you do this:
<mvo> didrocks: ccsm seem to have no effect too
<didrocks> 10:32:38      didrocks | mvo: oh, not related, but think to rename (out of the session) your ~/.config/dconf/user file to not loose
<didrocks>                        | your dconf config :)
<mvo> didrocks: I did!
<didrocks> hum, so maybe the data is not read anymore
<didrocks> oh, gtk-window-decorator moved to gsettings
<didrocks> I bet the config was in gconf
<didrocks> mvo: do you remember the name of the key?
<mvo> didrocks: no :(
<didrocks> can try to find it in gsettings
<didrocks> hum, let me try to look at it
<didrocks> mvo: where was it in g-c-c?
<mvo> didrocks: I can search for it too, no worries
<didrocks> mvo: don't find it easily, but the migration code was only gconf -> gsettings, so it should still work, if you didn't find it anymore, just poke me and I'll look
<mvo> didrocks: hm, let me dig around a bit, its my own pet specal configuration (focus-follow-mouse, autoraise) and most people will not care
<mvo> didrocks: thanks again for your help
<didrocks> mvo: you're really welcomed :)
<mvo> didrocks: yipieee, org.gnome.desktop.wm.preferences made me a happy man again
<didrocks> mvo: excellent! Thanks for the update :)
<gotwig> is gnome with the new languages and regions going to come to quantal?
<gotwig> *languages and regions panel for gnome control center
<didrocks> gotwig: no, we stay on the earlier gnome-control-center version
<didrocks> for quantal
<gotwig> didrocks: so no new languages and regions for 12.10?
<gotwig> *packaged for 12.10
<didrocks> no
<gotwig> I would be interessted in a PPA :X
<didrocks> will be in R
<gotwig> 13.04?
<didrocks> yep
<gotwig> alright
<gotwig> didrocks: do you know how to make a PPA?
<didrocks> gotwig: you should go to #ubuntu-motu to get some help on that I guess and read the launchpad help on ppas
<didrocks> gotwig: I warn you, doing this update is not trivial
<didrocks> gotwig: it will break a lot of functionality
<didrocks> that's why we don't take it into distro
<didrocks> gotwig: also talk to ricotz when he's aroud, he's making a latest gnome ppa
<gotwig> well I know ricotz :D
<didrocks> so, you should coordinate with him :)
<Laney> he has something in https://launchpad.net/~ricotz/+archive/staging
<gotwig> n1te
<doko> didrocks, pitti, could you have a look at the glib2.0 ftbfs on arm*?
<tkamppeter> Laney, I have put upa a bug fix for GTK, bug 1053891. The bug prevents users from printing in many cases.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1053891 in gtk+3.0 "GTK print dialog does not allow printing and does not show options of a remote DNS-SD/Bonjour printer" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1053891
<Laney> tkamppeter: ok
<Laney> is it upstream?
<didrocks> seems a test failure, pitti is the expert :)
<Laney> he's been working the test failures already
<tkamppeter> Laney, I have reported it also upstream, now.
<Laney> tkamppeter: cheer
<Laney> s
<Laney> if you get somebody else to upload then I will be able to accept
<didrocks> tkamppeter: hey! are you working on bug #932882?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 932882 in gutenprint "Update of a printer driver package does not update the PPD files of the existing queues for this driver" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/932882
<tkamppeter> didrocks, I have looked into it but I am not able to reproduce it, I have tried to stop CUPS and the update process restarts CUPS then, I have tried to update both CUPS and Gutenprint from the same command line, for me the PPDs get always updated.
<Sweetsharks2> morning everyone!
<tkamppeter> Laney, you do not have upload rights on GTK?
<tkamppeter> pitti, can you upload GTK for me, bug 1053891? Thanks.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1053891 in gtk+3.0 "GTK print dialog does not allow printing and does not show options of a remote DNS-SD/Bonjour printer" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1053891
<Laney> tkamppeter: I do. I mean that if I am the one to upload it then I cannot then accept it through the freeze
<didrocks> tkamppeter: can you put it as incomplete then and downgrade to medium the priority of it?
<didrocks> tkamppeter: let's get a real list of things we can fix that way! Thanks :)
 * Sweetsharks2  is on limited connectivity today. Can join this wifi with my android phone only, so I cant see my Canonical email. I will try to check those at the airport ~1400 UTC
<tkamppeter> didrocks, done.
<didrocks> tkamppeter: thanks :)
<didrocks> hey Sweetsharks2!
<tkamppeter> pitti, can you accept uploads through the freeze, or upload GTK so that Laney can accept it? Thanks.
<Laney> he's not on the release team any more ;(
<Laney> I could upload it and get someone else to review
 * Sweetsharks2  waves back at didrocks.
<Laney> tkamppeter: I'll do that
<Laney> DEP3 patch headers would be nice in future btw
<pitti> tkamppeter, Laney: I can accept it from the -proposed queue; and uploading GTK to -proposed is a good idea anyway
<pitti> (sorry, DSL reconnect)
<Laney> it's ok, I'm doing it now
<Laney> release team reviews should be the same for proposed
<Laney> as there's not really any further check guaranteed when someone copies it to release
<Laney> tkamppeter: Shouldn't the preceding httpSeparateURI be put in an else block of that if you added?
<tkamppeter> Laney, no, the first httpSeparateURI determines the method. If the method is dnssd, the second is done, if it is not dnssd, the result of the first is OK.
<Laney> oh, that's an out parameter
<Laney> ta
<pitti> early start/end today, have a nice weekend everyone!
<ogra_> pitti, enjoy
<didrocks> see you pitti :)
<Laney> hum
<Laney> the retracers tell you to upgrade to packages in -proposed if there are newer ones there
 * Sweetsharks2  hopes 4000mAh are enough to finish this LibreOffice release build.
<Laney> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nautilus/+bug/1053670
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1053670 in nautilus "nautilus crashed with SIGSEGV in g_type_check_instance_cast()" [Medium,Confirmed]
<Laney> the trace mentions dbusmenu, and they started coming in very soon after that upload
<Laney> charles: ^ ;-)
<tkamppeter> Laney, I have tested the GTK package from quantal-proposed and it works (bug 1053891).
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1053891 in gtk+3.0 "GTK print dialog does not allow printing and does not show options of a remote DNS-SD/Bonjour printer" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1053891
<Laney> tkamppeter: good, should be copied over when all arches build
 * Laney goes to lunch
<doko> didrocks, anybody working on the glib2.0 ftbfs?
<didrocks> doko: as Laney stated above: 11:24:55         Laney | he's been working the test failures already
<didrocks> it's in -proposed anyway, so won't get copied to quantal
<didrocks> so pitti is on it
<doko> ahh, ok
<doko> didrocks, hmm, no, the failure is in quantal too :-/
<didrocks> oh?
<doko> 2.33.14-1 is in quantal, the svn version in -proposed
<desrt> bonan matenon, Äiuj
<didrocks> hey desrt
<didrocks> doko: one sec
<didrocks> doko: right, but 3.5.18-0ubuntu2 didn't FTBFS from what I see
<didrocks> so the version which FTBFS is only in proposde
<didrocks> proposed
<doko> didrocks, no, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/glib2.0/2.33.14-1 shows the same ftbfs
<didrocks> ah glib
<didrocks> sorry, was one gtk
<doko> gtk is ok
<didrocks> doko: seems pitti already did try different fixes for it
<didrocks> and he's the one knowing the best the testsuite
<doko> ok
 * Sweetsharks2  is leaveing on a jetplane.
<didrocks> Sweetsharks2: have a safe flight!
<desrt> Sweetsharks2: ciao
<doko> didrocks, is the evolution demotion correct?
<czajkowski> Laney: so who can I poke re the powering off not working?
<czajkowski> forogt about it and came back to a nearly dead laptop :/
<didrocks> doko: no, I'll look at it why
<didrocks> cyphermox: do you why what happened around evolution btw? ^
<jbicha> czajkowski: it's probably at least related to bug 861171
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 861171 in policykit "Shutdown from greeter does nothing when multiple accounts open" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/861171
<czajkowski> jbicha: hmm interesting it doesnt seem to matter if it's one account or many
<jbicha> maybe it got worse then
<jbicha> I wonder if it could be confused by system services running in the background as different users
<jbicha> I think the primary problem could just be solved if we wrote a policykit policy to give admin users the chance to shutdown anyway even if other users are logged in
<cyphermox> didrocks: no idea
<cyphermox> have you found out why it was demoted?
<didrocks> cyphermox: no, wanted to know if anything changed
<Laney> there's no reason for it to be in main that I can see
<Laney> no rdepends and it's not seeded
<didrocks> cyphermox: evolution was supposed to be in the supported seed?
<didrocks> Laney: I think we kept it in the supported seed, it's still officially supported
<cyphermox> I think it probably was just still partly depended on (e-d-s was anyway) because of thunderbird's eds integration, so maybe it never got in the supported seed
<didrocks> ah ok :)
<didrocks> adding it there then
<cyphermox> I have no idea otherwise, I think you'll find we already added some other things from evo in supported, evolution-exchange maybe ;)
<didrocks> nop, only  * /^evolution-documentation-/
<cyphermox> ah, weird
<cyphermox> I really thought there was one of them
<cyphermox> evolution-documentation-*, does that even exist?
<cyphermox> I can't think of a source package that creates it ;)
<didrocks> cyphermox: doesn't seem so
<didrocks> anyway, evo fixed, in supported now
<didrocks> larsu: hum, my machine is almost charged (and the label confirms) but the icon shows 20% charged, is that a symlinking issue?
<charles> Laney, thanks!
<charles> Laney: I'll take a look
<Laney> rocking, thank you
<czajkowski> jbicha: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/lightdm/+bug/1053852  my issue.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1053852 in lightdm "machine wont shut down without being forced to" [Undecided,New]
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: hey, did you get some time to do the review?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, i've not commented yet, but i guess it's ok
<chrisccoulson> but then, i don't really have any say in the matter tbh
<chrisccoulson> it's a strange idea of chromeless, anyway
<chrisccoulson> just hiding the navigation bar (which doesn't even hide the addressbar if you move it to another toolbar), and keeping all other chrome visible (menu, bookmarks, history, addon manager, addon bar, tabstrip, basically everything except for the navigation bar)
<chrisccoulson> odd
<chrisccoulson> this is what i imagine chromeless to look like: https://twitter.com/chrisccoulson/status/245656603737595905/photo/1/large
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: oh really?
<chrisccoulson> (also firefox)
 * didrocks looks
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: hum, looking weird indeed
<charles> tjaalton: ping
<chrisccoulson> our implementation is weird, and there are theme artefacts with the tabstrip when the navigation bar isn't present
<chrisccoulson> it just looks bad
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: "nice" :/
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: but firefox doesn't have any chromeless mode?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, yeah, it does. see my screenshot :)
<chrisccoulson> that's the mozilla chromeless
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: this is ours?
<didrocks> ah :)
<didrocks> ok
<tjaalton> didrocks: pong
<didrocks> misunderstood
<didrocks> tjaalton: hum, did I ping you? :)
<tjaalton> oh sorry
<tjaalton> I was lazy :)
<tjaalton> charles: ^
<mterry> chrisccoulson, heyo.  You got a chance to review the webapps firefox plugins, right?  The unity-firefox-extension and webapps-greasemonkey?
<didrocks> tjaalton: stop being lazy! :-)
<tjaalton> lazy reader :)
<didrocks> heh ;)
<tjaalton> I just assumed it was you :)
<chrisccoulson> mterry, it's pointless me reviewing them, because we're going to ship them regardless of what i find
<mterry> chrisccoulson, is there a problem with chromeless support?  (reading backlog)
<didrocks> tjaalton: I can fix that and I have bugs for you :p
<mterry> chrisccoulson, :-/
<chrisccoulson> mterry, yeah, it's hideous
<tjaalton> <tumbleweed>
<mterry> chrisccoulson, I think we're enabling it?  Is that a bad decision?
<charles> tjaalton: just checking, in the screenshot you put on https://bugs.launchpad.net/indicator-datetime/+bug/1053875, that's with language settings set to Finnish, yes?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1053875 in indicator-datetime "space between date and time replaced with extra characters" [High,Confirmed]
<chrisccoulson> the tab strip (why is a tabstrip displayed in "chromeless" anyway) looks bad without the navigation bar with our implementation
<tjaalton> charles: yep
<charles> tjaalton: I'm not seeing it here and am going to test it out in that setting
<didrocks> charles: doesn't happen with French for instance
<charles> ok, thanks
<chrisccoulson> also, we display the entire firefox menu still, including "View -> Toolbars -> Navigation Bar", which doesn't even work
<charles> yeah it should show up as an en space, not sure why it isn't in Finnish
<mterry> chrisccoulson, hmm.  :-/
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: this is because of the appmenu support?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: like, the real upstream chromeless hides it?
<mterry> chrisccoulson, well, back to the other thing.  have you found anything any problems with greasemonkey or unity plugins yet?  Or did you not bother looking?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, the real upstream chromeless hides everything (well, it doesn't just hide it, the browser chrome isn't loaded at all. ie, no tabstrip, addon bar, navbar, menubar, sidebars, addon manager etc)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: ah, this is the upstream one, do you have an image of ours?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: and I guess the question is why we don't use the upstream one :)
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, that's a question for them
<didrocks> I know ;)
<chrisccoulson> mterry, you really don't want my opinion on greasemonkey :)
<charles> hmm, no WFM even with my language set to suomi
<didrocks> charles: do you have latest unity (6.6) (not likely to be the cause, but we never knowâ¦)
<didrocks> ?
<charles> didrocks: no, I'm still on 6.4.0-0ubuntu6, I'll do an update
<charles> didrocks: thanks for the suggestion
<didrocks> charles: no worry, but I'm not really hopeful that will trigger it TBH :/
<didrocks> few changes in the panel area
<charles> tjaalton: any insights on how to trigger it?
<charles> tjaalton: does the behavior change if you change your locale?
<charles> tjaalton: and as per dobey's suggestion a few lines up, what version of unity are you on?
<tjaalton> charles: I seem to have another machine with 6.4.0+bzr2680 which has it
<dobey> oops, i think i broke charles :)
<tjaalton> charles: the other one has 6.6
<charles> dobey: lol :)
<charles> tjaalton: and, what happens if you change language settings?
<doko> didrocks, cyphermox: is bogofilter used by evolution too? wants to demote too ...
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, that's ours by the way: http://ubuntuone.com/79PlBEH8uxo8dpMcXZ3OdQ
<chrisccoulson> (see the line under the active tab, which isn't there when the navigation bar is present)
<cyphermox> doko: it's a Recommends, yes. didrocks put evolution in the supported seed earlier
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: yeah, seeing, weird to see the tab, but I think there are design consideration about "external site"
<didrocks> cyphermox: we should upload removing that recommends, doesn't seems necessary to me, wdyt?
<cyphermox> didrocks: it's used by the often unused spam detection thingy in evo
<tjaalton> charles: everything else changed the setting, but indicator-datetime :) (still in finnish..)
<didrocks> cyphermox: do we turn it by default if installed?
<cyphermox> nah, IIRC it needs to be enabled in evo
<chrisccoulson> right, exercise time
<cyphermox> and I think evo will tell you if neither it nor spamassassin are installed
<didrocks> cyphermox: hum, maybe it's still good to let it anyway
<doko> cyphermox, no, Recommends: evolution-plugins, yelp, bogofilter | spamassassin
<cyphermox> so in that case, yeah, Iguess we could remove it
<didrocks> if it pings you about it
 * cyphermox tests
<doko> if it demotes, then it only should be the second alternative
<didrocks> yeah, 2 spam filters is a little bit ETOOMUCH anyway in main
<didrocks> cyphermox: can we confirm us what's the best between the 2?
<didrocks> you*
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: good luck!
<cyphermox> oh boy
<jbicha> chrisccoulson: that web apps feature keeps the new tab button?
<chrisccoulson> jbicha, it keeps everything, except for the navigation bar
<chrisccoulson> including everything that's normally accessible via the menus
<jbicha> doesn't sound very useful...
<chrisccoulson> which is different to the upstream one, which hides absolutely everything
<larsu> didrocks, checking right now
<doko> didrocks, cyphermox: there are some more binaries for demotion: glade, indicator-sync, powerwake.. intended?
<didrocks> doko: indicator-sync is a U1 think
<didrocks> dobey: ^
<didrocks> doko: glade was in main? waow
<didrocks> doko: glade is fine to demote
<didrocks> powerwakeâ¦
<cyphermox> indicator-sync I don't think is intentional, especially since it's just gone through MIR
<larsu> didrocks, battery-full-symbolic and battery-good-symbolic have the right icons... can you check those two on your system?
<didrocks> cyphermox: I don't think as well, but not sure if they got the FFe/UIFe for inclusion by default
<didrocks> larsu: doing
<didrocks> larsu: the full is fine
<doko> didrocks, apparently other glade binaries are still in main
<didrocks> larsu: it's just the one before
<didrocks> doko: right, the glade binaries are needed in main
<didrocks> doko: glade itselfâ¦ not really
<cyphermox> didrocks: not yet, there's a bug but skaet NAK'd it, it was missing rationale
<Laney> no, it was denied
<dobey> uh yeah, indicator-sync should not be demoted
<Laney> perhaps we want to put it in supported
<larsu> didrocks, the one right before is -good, right charles?
<didrocks> cyphermox: shouldn't be promoted or added to a seed meanwhile then
<doko> dobey, could you seed it?
<doko> cyphermox, what do you refer to?
<didrocks> doko: sorry, I meant "glade libraries"
<cyphermox> doko: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/indicator-sync/+bug/1053482
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1053482 in unity "[FFe] [UIFe] Install indicator-sync by default" [Undecided,New]
<dobey> doko: not if skaet won't let me, no :)
<dobey> but i would like to yes :)
<didrocks> dobey: you can put in the supported seed
<doko> dobey, demote it?
<didrocks> dobey: that won't install it by default
<didrocks> larsu: the symlinks looks good
<Laney> doesn't seem to particularly matter if it falls out of main though
<Laney> the source package will still be there, no?
<mterry> didrocks, feel like some NEW reviews?
<dobey> doko: why demote it? i don't understand why demoting it is even a question. it just went into main
<didrocks> larsu: however, just before I see battery-full-charged-symbolic, I get battery-low-charging-symbolic
<Laney> dobey: things only stay in main if there is a reason for them to do so
<didrocks> mterry: if it's short, fine for me
<cyphermox> doko: you meant indicator-sync the binary package, right? libsync-menu1 is still going to be in main
<Laney> there is no reason ATM for indicator-sync to stay there.
<larsu> didrocks, a bug in indicator-power maybe?
<doko> cyphermox, yes, the binary
<didrocks> larsu: yeah, that would be my bet
<didrocks> larsu: minor, keeping it in mind, if you use your laptop on battery, try to watch this
<cyphermox> in this case it doesn't really matter if it's in main or universe until it gets installed by default, AFAIK
<larsu> didrocks, will do
<larsu> didrocks, thanks for the pointer
<didrocks> larsu: no worry, I'll keep you posted
<charles> didrocks, larsu: here's a cheatsheet of what icons i-power is looking for, and in what order
<charles> didrocks, larsu: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~indicator-applet-developers/indicator-power/trunk.12.10/view/head:/tests/test-device.cc#L222
<didrocks> charles: ah, so it's the same icon from 5% charging to 95%?
<didrocks> I confirm it's what I saw
<didrocks> larsu: ^
<charles> didrocks: yes, that's the way the spec wants it
<didrocks> ok, it's puzzling, but mistery solved
<didrocks> mpt: hey, it's weird ^
<didrocks> :)
<charles> didrocks:
<dobey> woah, nautilus just went insane on my laptop with latest updates in q
<charles>   This function's logic differs from GSD's power plugin in some ways:
<charles>   1. All charging batteries use the same icon regardless of progress.
<charles>   <https://bugs.launchpad.net/indicator-power/+bug/824629/comments/7>
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 824629 in ayatana-design "Time to charge may be hard to distinguish from time to discharge" [Low,Fix released]
<didrocks> charles: oh I trust that you followed the spec :)
<didrocks> just that it's weird
<charles> mpt, didrocks: given the new icons, it might be time to revisit / eliminate 824629
<didrocks> I was thinking that after a 10 minutes without AC and plugin again, I saw something like 20% of charged
<didrocks> charles: yeah, would be good I think, to approximately see where the loading is about
<charles> didrocks: iirc the issue was that the 'fill' level in the battery icon made it difficult to see the charging lightning icon
<cyphermox> didrocks: I wouldn't be able to say that bogofilter or spamassassin is better, but what's for sure is bogofilter appears to have fewer dependencies than spamassassin
<didrocks> charles: yeah, I can understand, but it's not consistent with what you can expect and other dekstop/mobile OS are doing
<charles> didrocks: *nod*
<didrocks> cyphermox: I think we'll need to pick one :)
<cyphermox> I know ;)
<cyphermox> how's a 600k + difference in "CD size", still any relevant?
<cyphermox> IIRC we still have a top limit at some point ;)
<didrocks> cyphermox: well, not in any CD
<cyphermox> oh, true
<didrocks> cyphermox: so really your pick, on the one which seems to be the most active upstream
<didrocks> cyphermox: I think you can delay the check on Monday
<doko> spamassassin has more rdeps
<didrocks> yeah, I checked that
<didrocks> however, I don't konw the rdeps
<didrocks> know*
<didrocks> apart from kmail
<cyphermox> where did you see kmail?
<cyphermox> neither look very active, TBH, but I'm leaning more towards spamassassin
<dobey> how active does a spam filter really need to be upstream? bogofilter itself doesn't really do much, user has to do all the training, and spamassassin is basically just rules updates
<didrocks> cyphermox: once you have reach a decision, if it's spamassassin, can you revert the recommends between them?
<cyphermox> yeah
<Sweetshark> didrocks: which one was the libreoffice metapackage bug again?
<didrocks> Sweetshark: bug #1045165 (see http://reports.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-q-tracking-bug-tasks.html)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1045165 in libreoffice "libreoffice is shown as no longer supported on upgrade to quantal" [Medium,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1045165
<Sweetshark> didrocks: thx
<didrocks> yw :)
<doko> Sweetshark, could you followup or close bug #1034560 ?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1034560 in libserializer "[MIR] libloader-java, libformula-java, librepository-java, libfonts-java, libserializer-java " [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1034560
<doko> and 1034558
<didrocks> tjaalton: did you try a guest session btw?
<tjaalton> didrocks: now I did, same thing
<doko> didrocks, ahh, powerwake is server stuff
<didrocks> ok, worthed a try in case there was a local factor :)
<didrocks> doko: ah, that explains why I never saw it :)
<Sweetshark> doko: done
<Sweetshark> doko: postponed to next cycle
<doko> ok
<davidcalle> didrocks, hi, what's the recommended way to land small bugfixes at this stage? New upstream release, distro patch?
<didrocks> davidcalle: depends, if one or two commits, distro patch
<didrocks> if more -> I would prefer a release
<davidcalle> didrocks, two commits.
<Sweetshark> didrocks, micahg: could you review http://anonscm.debian.org/gitweb/?p=pkg-openoffice/libreoffice.git;a=commitdiff;h=7f60525baa5d8f0b0c195cf3dfc4b12d6c6aa1e1 and http://anonscm.debian.org/gitweb/?p=pkg-openoffice/libreoffice.git;a=commitdiff;h=8fd97c90d9fef961b4143337f7aad2f1617273a2 ?
<didrocks> davidcalle: should be fine, can't deal with that before monday (in meetings)
<didrocks> Sweetshark: same answer ^
<didrocks> if anyone else in the team want to have a look
<davidcalle> mterry, hi, would you have time for a small distro patch to the photos lens?
<davidcalle> didrocks, thanks
<mterry> davidcalle, it won't land for B2, but OK
<mterry> can go into -proposed
<davidcalle> mterry, oh, I've just noticed you are on the webapps stuff, nevermind, it will wait ;)
<mterry> davidcalle, that is quiet right this second, I can help
<didrocks> davidcalle: please add tests
<didrocks> for the regressions
<didrocks> and the manual tests (I didn't look yet for them ;))
<davidcalle> didrocks, I hope you didn't. I still need to look at how they are done now, looks like they have changed since last cycle.
<didrocks> davidcalle: just do manual one before the next upload please
<davidcalle> didrocks, ok
<didrocks> merci! :)
<davidcalle> mterry, I'll ping you about it later then, thanks :)
<tjaalton> charles, didrocks: further updates seem to have fixed the datetime issue
<didrocks> urgh?
 * didrocks is puzzled
<tjaalton> me too..
<tjaalton> I'll check the other machine too
<tjaalton> yup, fixed
<didrocks> tjaalton: weird, would be interested in the list of packages you updated :)
<tjaalton> probably the libgtk-3 update
<micahg> Sweetshark: looks fine to me, you might want to also see if you need to change that font to its new name as it was renamed in precise
<tjaalton> not that many that were updated
<didrocks> ok :)
<tkamppeter> didrocks, is there still anything to do on bug 1053891? Or is it now only waiting for someone with appropriate rights to put it into Quantal?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1053891 in gtk+3.0 "GTK print dialog does not allow printing and does not show options of a remote DNS-SD/Bonjour printer" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1053891
<didrocks> tkamppeter: nothing needed, I just targeted it so that we don't loose track of it. Thanks!
<charles> tjaalton, huh. okay
<charles> tjaalton: thanks for the update :)
<tjaalton> charles: there were also some language-pack updates, more likely that it was a bug there
<didrocks> yeah, most likely
<micahg> Sweetshark: BTW, I wouldn't bother with an upload for this to beta 2 IMHO, it should go in for final though
<chrisccoulson> phew, knackered
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: hey! Can you please comment on bug #1040313 and bug #1053578? The release/PS team is asking to have some comments from you to take their decision
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1040313 in libunity-webapps "[FFE] Update WebApps to support Firefox" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1040313
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1053578 in firefox "[FFE] [UIFE] add chromeless mode to Firefox" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1053578
<didrocks> skaet: ^
<davidcalle> mterry, hi again, i've added manual tests for each photo provider. Do you still have time for an upload?
<skaet> didrocks,  ack.
 * didrocks waves good evening and good week-end now!
<didrocks> see you on Monday everyone :)
<Laney> bye!
<Laney> (too slow)
<xnox> what is the package of the desktop keyboard indicator?
<xnox> aka general keyboard layout settings
<xnox> g-s-c ?
<mterry> davidcalle, nope, not right this second, sorry
<davidcalle> mterry, ok :)
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, firefox + valgrind = PAIN
<xnox> chrisccoulson: i think the pain starts at the first argument.
<chrisccoulson> not really ;)
<chrisccoulson> bugger, so one of the recent commits to http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~extension-hackers/globalmenu-extension/trunk/changes has introduced quite a sizeable leak :(
<chrisccoulson> ah, found my memory leak :)
<dupondje> Anyone else with issues browsing to smb mounts in nautilus?
<Sweetshark> micahg: I wouldnt bother any release or timing for this issue alone. It will be piggybacked whatever unitymenus changes there are.
<Sweetshark> (those are the critical stuff, both from a regression risk and a timing/feature view ...
<micahg> Sweetshark: well, we should get an upload before final freeze, but I assume you'll have other changes before then
<Sweetshark> micahg: sure
<micahg> Sweetshark: have a good weekend
<Sweetshark> micahg: thanks, you too.
 * Sweetshark just arrived back home after a long flight.
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-09-22
<dupondje> someone around ? :)
<dupondje> gdm seems to be marked as autoremovable
<dupondje> even if gnome-shell is installed
<dupondje> which shouldn't be the case :)
<naushad567> hi
<naushad567> anyone here for help
<naushad567> ?
<asac> everything in good shape for a precise/quantal upgrade?
<asac> hmm. update-manager -d doesnt offer me upgrade
<asac> anyone knows?
<mitya57> works for me
<asac> mitya57: precise?
<mitya57> asac: yes, right now I'm on precise :)
<mitya57> did you do an apt-get update?
<asac> yeah
<asac> did that
<asac> i am all up to date on precise
<asac> but update-manager -d doesnt offer me the button that i used to know
<asac> intersting
<mitya57> does "sudo do-release-upgrade -d" work?
<asac> i found it
<asac> so in settings there are options "inform me of all new releases", "inform me of LTS releases" "never inform me"
<asac> i had LTS selected as i installed this machine with precise in first place
<asac> (i changed nothing)
<asac> changing it to "inform me of all releases" made the -d flag work :_)
<mitya57> ah, that's in "inform me of LTS releases" by default for those who install LTS :)
<asac> pitti: ^^ ... not sure who is the update-manager gurut nowadays... maybe show him the above 10 lines
<asac> right. but i wouldn't expect it to disable the -d
<asac> anyway
<asac> found and will give it a try :)
<asac> wish me luck
<asac> byebye
<mitya57> good luck :)
<jbicha> asac: that's mentioned at the top of the quantal release notes
<jbicha> -d will still work to get you the next LTS before LTS.1 when the next LTS is advertised to everyone running the previous LTS
<cyphermox> howdy
<dupondje> somebody could check the missing depend on gdm in gnome-shell ? :)
<jbicha> dupondje: I uploaded a fix within about an hour of the bug getting filed yesterday, but we're in beta freeze so it needs to be manually accepted
<dupondje> allright :)
<asac> jbicha: gotcha
<asac> so now i have a problem with compiz looping on CPU
<MohamedAlaa98> Hello Guys :)
<MohamedAlaa98> I want to join GNOME3 Team in launchpad
<MohamedAlaa98> anyone?
<jbicha> MohamedAlaa98: which team in particular do you want to join and why?
<MohamedAlaa98> Gnome3 team
<MohamedAlaa98> who packages gnome3 extra apps for ubuntu
<MohamedAlaa98> jibcha: https://launchpad.net/~gnome3-team
<MohamedAlaa98> jbicha: https://launchpad.net/~gnome3-team
<jbicha> ok, that team is basically for the GNOME3 PPA but you don't have to be a member of that team to contribute
<jbicha> just submit merge proposals to the gnome3 or ubuntu-desktop branches
<jbicha> do good work like that for a while and then you can apply to join that team
<MohamedAlaa98> I want to contribute in packaging
<MohamedAlaa98> I don't want to contibute in that way
<jbicha> I don't understand what you mean; we need to see good work from you (merge proposals or patches) before we can give you commit access
<MohamedAlaa98> ok, got it
<MohamedAlaa98> jbicha: thank you :)
<mterry> jbicha, yo, just saw your webapps bug
<mterry> jbicha, I'm updating my PPA right now with the latest things I pushed to -proposed
<mterry> jbicha, I forgot to sync the PPA yesterday
<jbicha> mterry: ah, thanks
<mterry> jbicha, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libunity-webapps/+bug/1054658/comments/2
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1054658 in libunity-webapps "Failed to open webapp application path dir /usr/share/ubuntu/unity-webapps/userscripts:" [Undecided,New]
<jbicha> I rebuilt libunity-webapps from proposed & was about to post an update about the disappearing amazon launcher
<mterry> jbicha, any bugs that I didn't mention I think are unknown
<jbicha> it looks like the disappearaing amazon launcher is intentional if you run
<jbicha> gsettings get com.canonical.Unity.Launcher favorites
<mterry> you mean it gets dropped from gsettings?
<jbicha> it still seems crazy, http://paste.ubuntu.com/1220930/
<jbicha> oh maybe that's not intentional, but a side effect
<mterry> looks normal?
<mterry> I have to jet, but will check back this evening
<jbicha> is UbuntuOneMusiconeubuntucom.desktop supposed to be different than ubuntu-amazon-default.desktop
<jbicha> it uses xdg-open instead of unity-webapps-runner
<mterry> jbicha, you mean different naming scheme?
<mterry> oh yeah
<mterry> I asked about that too
<mterry> yes
<mterry> Because amazon looks up local url to us
<mterry> e
<mterry> so it needs special logic
<mterry> whereas the store is just a url
<jbicha> this entire feature seems crazy to me
<mterry> jbicha, agreed
<mterry> jbicha, half part crack, half part magic
<Laney> probably ought to do its searches over https at least
<mterry> got to go
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-09-23
<BigWhale> I updated, rebooted and now minimize, maximize and close buttons are on the right side ...
<BigWhale> of title bars ...
<Laney> BigWhale: what does "gsettings get org.gnome.desktop.wm.preferences button-layout" say?
<BigWhale> hmm ctrl-alt-T is dead too ... :/
<Laney> different bug
<BigWhale> yeah ... :)
<BigWhale> bigwhale@thefish:~$ gsettings get org.gnome.desktop.wm.preferences button-layout':minimize,maximize,close'
<Laney> there you go then
<Laney> you reset it at some point, and that's just started working again
<Laney> gsettings reset org.gnome.desktop.wm.preferences button-layout should sort you out
<BigWhale> I am sure I never did that. Not on purpose. I installed 12.10 from one of the daily builds
<charles> BigWhale, Laney: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/1053981
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1053981 in unity "window decorations on right-hand-side of title bar" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<jbicha> charles: do you have ubuntu-settings installed?
<charles> jbicha: nope, it's not installed. I didn't take any steps to manually uninstall it though
<jbicha> more importantly, do you have ubuntu-desktop installed?
<charles> jbicha: same answer. no, though I didn't manually uninstall it
<jbicha> please install ubuntu-desktop to fix your problem :)
<charles> jbicha: lol, that part I already understood :)
<charles> jbicha: the more interesting question is what caused the change...
<jbicha> if you didn't intentionally remove ubuntu-desktop, then you must have done a dist-upgrade without paying attention
<jbicha> ubuntu-settings is a new package to keep the Ubuntu overrides of GNOME settings separate so that Ubuntu derivatives can have an easier time picking and choosing which of those they want
<jbicha> instead of having to patch (or unpatch) a dozen separate packages
<charles> ah, cool
<charles> thanks jbicha :)
<charles> jbicha: confirmed, it was a blind dist-upgrade. thanks again :)
<Laney> heh
<davidcalle> Laney, I've spent some time tonight fiddling with Vala, only to discover your mp on the lens. You beat me to it by an hour. :)
<Laney> davidcalle: doing a similar thing?
<davidcalle> Laney, yes, and your code is much cleaner.
<Laney> hehe
<Laney> it's my first vala experience
<Laney> I do know C# though
<Laney> did you have any thoughts about UI?
<davidcalle> Laney, maybe a "Dash" tab in privacy with a "Disable Shopping" checkbox.
<Laney> Yeah something like that
<Laney> It's all so late though, for translating and stuff :(
<Laney> oh well, night
<davidcalle> Laney, indeed. But we have the "More suggestions" string already used. So, it could be a on/off toggle for "More Suggestions". Even if it wouldn't convey it's only turned off in the Home Dash.
<davidcalle> Laney, bye :)
<jbicha> Laney: I don't think you should use schema path="/desktop/unity/lenses/shopping/" shouldn't you use a similar schema path to the schema id?
<Laney> yeah, but the other lenses use this path already
<jbicha> yeah and they're wrong
<jbicha> we finally got most of them using the same schema id pattern
<Laney> they should all be fixed at the same time imho
<Laney> alas, I'm going to bed
<Laney> nn
<jbicha> it's one less schema we're going to have to migrate for 13.04
<jasoncwarner_> man...I did a reinstall yesterday (12.04.1 upgraded to 12.10) and my computer is RIDICULOUSLY hot today. :/
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-09-16
 * didrocks just back from Boston
<didrocks> sil2100: Mirv: hey, how is it going?
<sil2100> didrocks: morning!
<sil2100> didrocks: rather fine... but I'm not sure what's the status of daily-release right now
<didrocks> Mirv: sil2100: can we sync up in a hangout in a few?
<didrocks> so that I can give you the status, story and so onâ¦
<didrocks> just expect to see a really tired didrocks ;)
<sil2100> didrocks: ok, fine with me in ~20-30 min, let's wait for Mirv ;)
<didrocks> sure, good plan ;)
<sil2100> didrocks: how was the flight? When did you return back home?
<jibel> Good morning didrocks! you arrived home safely ?
<jibel> Hi sil2100
<didrocks> sil2100: I returned back home 10 minutes ago
<didrocks> jibel: yeah, uneventful! how was yours?
<didrocks> sil2100: so, it's technically still Sunday for me :p
<sil2100> :O
<sil2100> 10 minutes ago?!
<jibel> didrocks, good flight, arrived 20min earlier than schedule, so exceptional. but then we had to wait for a free parking stand :)
<didrocks> sil2100: yeah, I left Sunday evening
<didrocks> jibel: ahah, really worthed arriving in advance :p
<sil2100> jibel: morning!
<jibel> didrocks, how was your WE in Boston?
<sil2100> didrocks: damn! You should have a day off now and sleep!
<sil2100> Mirv: piiing! ^
<didrocks> sil2100: well, I have to sync up with you first ;)
<didrocks> jibel: excellent! Boston is a really beautiful city, I wasn't expecting that
<didrocks> also, I saw mterry on Sunday
<didrocks> hum, I'll need to sync up with dbarth as well
<sil2100> :<
<didrocks> dbarth: around for a hangout?
<didrocks> need to talk about webapps
<jibel> didrocks, Good you enjoyed Boston. Now GO TO BED!
<didrocks> well, I need people around first ;)
<didrocks> and going to bed at that time is ensuring it will be a fail tonight
<didrocks> jibel: btw, we had fun with a lxc failure on Friday evening
<didrocks> (what a week)
<didrocks> but stgraber got a fix
<sil2100> Again?
<dbarth> didrocks: yup
<didrocks> sil2100: yeah, because of a wrong upgrade
<didrocks> (well, latest lxc broke)
<didrocks> but latest latest fixes it now ;)
<jibel> didrocks, yep I saw that last week on my machine, something with mountall IIRC
<didrocks> right
<didrocks> all fixed normally now
<jibel> It is fixed, I verified this morning
<Mirv> sil2100: pong pong :)
<Mirv> didrocks: just fine, eager to get daily releases back online :)
<sil2100> didrocks: we have contact with Mirv ! Hangout guys?
<Mirv> fine by me, at least as soon as I find a headset
<didrocks> sil2100: Mirv: I'm talking with dbarth right now, will ping you later
<sil2100> ah, ACK
<Mirv> ok. kind a Sunday you have.
<sil2100> ;)
<sil2100> didrocks: then in the meantime I go grab late breakfast
<didrocks> sil2100: sure sure
 * Mirv -> lunch
<ricotz> didrocks, hi :)
<didrocks> hey ricotz
<ricotz> didrocks, the gnome-session update in saucy might have been a bit rushed
<ricotz> it seems better to keep using 3.8.x if there are no problems resolved by 3.9.90
<sil2100> ;)
<sil2100> didrocks: when can we connect btw.? I want you resting already ;p!
<didrocks> ricotz: who uploaded it? Sorry, I'm just back from Boston and totally jetlag/out of the loop
<ricotz> didrocks, while gnome-session 3.9.91 requires a new gnome-desktop3 which kind of requires a running mutter/gdm
<ricotz> didrocks, ah i see, i think jbicha did
<didrocks> ricotz: can you sync up with him to revert it?
<ricotz> didrocks, i decided to ping you while seb isnt here ;)
<ricotz> will do, see it as note for now then
<didrocks> ricotz: yeah, I'm in a middle of 100 things right now, so I think jbicha will be available before me ;)
<ricotz> didrocks, don't worry then, thx
<didrocks> ricotz: just reping me tomorrow when I'm fresh and not in a crazy timezone mindset ;)
<ricotz> heh ;)
<tkamppeter> I have applied a bug fix to Cairo, can someone upload it for me? Bug 968785.
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 968785 in ghostscript (Ubuntu) "ghostscript runs for indefinitely long period of time when called by foomatic-rip" [High,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/968785
<sil2100> didrocks: ping! Hangout
<sil2100> asac: ^
<asac> sil2100: ok
<asac> one sec
<didrocks> coming
<didrocks> sil2100: I rerun the sdk stack
<sil2100> didrocks: ACK, I'm looking on unity8 now
<sil2100> didrocks: you SLEEP!
<didrocks> sil2100: was I looking that bad? :p
<sil2100> No ;) But when I think about it that you got back from Boston just today in the morning, I feel tired myself!
<didrocks> ahah, sorry to make you feel tired ;)
<didrocks> ok, maybe the fact that I'm working laying on carpet is not a good sign
<didrocks> but I feel good that way
<lool> qengho: heyo, asac has other issues than the chrome disappearing with latest chromium-browser; notably with google docs; is this something reported / that you know of already?
<sil2100> Wohoo, daily-build is so CLEAN
<didrocks> cleanly empty! ;)
<sil2100> didrocks: spinning off unity8!
<didrocks> \o/
<pitti> Good morning
<didrocks> hey pitti!
<didrocks> enjoying your trip apparently? ;)
<pitti> didrocks: bonjour Didier, Ã§a va ? survived the flight?
<didrocks> pitti: apparently yeah. Still surviving the jetlag though (arrived at home 4 hours ago now and still awake \o/)
<pitti> erk
<didrocks> didn't succeed to sleep during the flight, so still Sunday for me :p
<didrocks> pitti: how was yours? uneventful?
<pitti> didrocks: both of the planes were an hour late, so in the end the tight connection worked out
<pitti> broken panel in the first, broken battery in the second
<pitti> like, even Friday 13 itself was delayed by a day :)
<didrocks> ahah, happy that you got there in a piece then!
<didrocks> no broken pitti :p
<pitti> yeah, indeed; I'm just beginning to get the usual cold, though
<pitti> there is NO escape!
<didrocks> ah, finally, an ubuflu! I was afraid nobody would get one :)
 * didrocks hugs pitti
<didrocks> (with care to not grab the cold)
<pitti> hah
<didrocks> pitti: you should have stayed a little bit more to Boston
<didrocks> I was alone, but it was lovely
 * desrt yawns
<didrocks> thanks Mirv!
<tkamppeter> xnox, hi
<xnox> tkamppeter: heya!
<tkamppeter> xnox, I Have a problem with PackageKit when adding package sources, it does not install the GPG key, see
<tkamppeter> http://paste.ubuntu.com/6101343/
<tkamppeter> xnox, it seems to be caused by some change in PackageKit, as system-config-printer did not change and current Saucy package works perfectly on Raring.
<xnox> tkamppeter: it cloud be a dbus/glib change wince it is expecting a UINT64 or UINT32 bit value but that's not what it is getting. Maybe the signature should be prefixed with 0x ?
<xnox> tkamppeter: I don't think it's my domain =/ try debugging it with pdb to see what values it's receiving and why install-printerdriver.py:35 is reporting warnings.
<tkamppeter> xnox, I have done the same thing with pure Python now, without system-config-printer, once with the unchanged key and once with the key with 0x preceded. See http://paste.ubuntu.com/6115179/
<tkamppeter> xnox, do you know whom I can ask? Who has made this package? r should I replace the small Python script by C or shell, to avoid the Python bindings?
<jbicha> didrocks: I don't think there's any need to revert gnome-session, 3.9.90 works fine and there are unlikely to be more 3.8 releases; we just can't upgrade to 3.10
<didrocks> jbicha: can you discuss with ricotz? I have no personal opinion about it and he brings that on
<xnox> tkamppeter: right, so on command line I did: $ sudo /usr/sbin/aptd
<xnox> tkamppeter: then I opened D-feet and org.freeddesktop.PackageKit appeared on the system bus.
<xnox> tkamppeter: and indeed there is no CreateTransaction method.
<ricotz> jbicha, i am fine with that, but carefully looking at the recent changes for cherry-picking fixes is needed then
<xnox> tkamppeter: there is however org.debian.apt dbus-interface with "AddVendorKeyFromKeyserver / from File" etc. but at that point one can already use something like python-apt.
<tkamppeter> xnox, this means that pk.install_signature() is not compatible with aptd any more due to API changes?
<xnox> tkamppeter: well, either packagekit api changed, or aptd changed or both.
<tkamppeter> xnox, who is resposible for that?
<xnox> tkamppeter: currently in saucy there is https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/aptdaemon/1.1.1-0ubuntu1 done by glatzor which FTBFS and thus still not available. It seems to have plenty of bugfixes.
<xnox> tkamppeter: not sure who is responsible.
<ricotz> jbicha, e.g. https://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-session/commit/?id=2040b88847ed1ee11182caac96b0f09c553c646e, or even https://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-session/commit/?id=ac9fd0dc97a17674cb082f80df0b1fcc45bc92bf
<xnox> tkamppeter: try pulling that newer package, rebuild locally (ignoring the test-failure, or better fix them) and check if it fixes the issues with system-config-printer for you?!
<tkamppeter> xnox, good idea, thanks.
<jbicha> ricotz: the first commit needs rebasing of some Ubuntu patches, the second commit should be fine though
<jbicha> and we wouldn't have gotten either of those by sticking with 3.8 either
<ricotz> jbicha, i guess it might be easier to take 3.9.91+ and revert things
<ricotz> jbicha, the argument for going with 3.8.4 would be to avoid clashes with gnome3 ppa where we don't want to revert things
<jbicha> I think we'd need a ffe to upgrade gnome-session any further for saucy but you can upgrade further with the gnome3 ppas
<ricotz> ok
<tkamppeter> xnox, that's it, aptdaemon 1.1.1 solves the problem. Thank you very much.
<xnox> tkamppeter: right, then please help to fix it's test-suite failures, such that we release saucy with aptdaemon 1.1.1 =)
<didrocks> sil2100: falling asleep, leaving now, please do feel free to publish (and continue on the rest) once you are confident. See you!
<tedg> Does someone know why we'd be getting this cli-common error?
<tedg> https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/job/libappindicator-saucy-armhf-autolanding/3/console
<tedg> What do the cli dh rules do?
<cyphermox> sil2100: what pieces are we publishing atm?
<Laney> tedg: you asked that exact question before
<sil2100> cyphermox: for now none, we're more or less ready to publish unity8, sdk and apps, but we have some AP failures going on
<Laney> The job broke and didn't install the build deps
<alberts> Hi! Can someone look at this fix for nautilus - https://code.launchpad.net/~albertsmuktupavels/nautilus/white-screen-fix/+merge/180231
<tedg> Laney, Oh, so this is the same thing with dh rules needing to be on the base image.
<tedg> Like the dh_click stuff
<tedg> But, wait, why only on ARM then?
<Laney> no
<Laney> dpkg-checkbuilddeps: Unmet build dependencies: python-all-dev cli-common-dev (>= 0.5.7) libnunit-cil-dev dbus-test-runner xvfb valac mono-devel (>= 2.4.3) python-gtk2-dev gtk-sharp2-gapi libgtk2.0-cil-dev libdbus-glib-1-dev (>= 0.82) libindicator-dev (>= 0.3.90) libindicator3-dev (>= 0.3.90) libdbusmenu-glib-dev (>= 0.5.90) libdbusmenu-gtk-dev (>= 0.5.90) libdbusmenu-gtk3-dev (>= 0.5.90) libgirepository1.0-dev
<Laney> it should have installed those
<Laney> in particular missing cli-common-dev makes that error happen
<tedg> Okay, so fginther it seems that the ARM images don't have cli-common-dev installed on them.  Can we fix that please?
<fginther> tedg, yes, should be able to
<tedg> Laney, It seems that the images do a "dh clean" before installing the build-deps, so if the needed dh scripts aren't there, they fail.
<Laney> that would happen
<Laney> the build deps should have been installed; error with the job
<tedg> Really I think it should install the build deps before doing dh clean.  Not sure why it doesn't.
<tedg> fginther, Thanks!
<fginther> tedg, ugh, cli-common-dev requires 154 packages
<Laney> why don't you do the source package build with -nc?
<Laney> it's freshly checked out so won't be dirty
<cyphermox> sil2100: you planning on releasing everything? what about services?
<tedg> fginther, That's a bunch!
<sil2100> cyphermox: we're not planning on releasing that
<sil2100> cyphermox: we have a schedule for releases:
<cyphermox> hrm
<sil2100> cyphermox: https://docs.google.com/a/canonical.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Au6idq7TkpUUdGNWb0tTVmJLVzFZd0doV3dVOGpWemc#gid=0
<cyphermox> MTP ;)
<cyphermox> mtp is in services, that's the one I'm interested in
<cyphermox> it's already been preNEWed, btw. slangasek looked at it
<cyphermox> sil2100: can I run the stack anyway with just mtp? we'll just wait before publishing?
<sil2100> cyphermox: I think there was a talk about MTP today, so I guess it's ok to spin the stack
<sil2100> cyphermox: just asac would have to make sure all is green
<cyphermox> aye
<cyphermox> asac: ^^ I'd like to land MTP, ok to spin the stack with just it?
<fginther> tedg, cli-common-dev is installed on all the arm boxes, is there an MP I need to rerun?
<asac> cyphermox: aftrer we pushed unity8/sdk
<cyphermox> asac: ack
<asac> whats the status on that? did we get confirm that eerything is good and pushed it?
<tedg> fginther, Yes please, https://code.launchpad.net/~jbicha/libappindicator/misc-debian-control-fixes/+merge/180032
<ogra_> asac, see -touch
<ogra_> asac, sil2100 is on it
<asac> ogra_: whats the summary
<asac> lots of stuff was talkeda bout
<asac> -> touch
<ogra_> still testing
<sil2100> kenvandine: https://code.launchpad.net/~sil2100/cupstream2distro-config/mir_switch_to_next_PPA/+merge/185871 <- can you take a look? The Mir guys asked for this
<sil2100> cyphermox, kenvandine: later this day, check this branch and redeploy for the US guys on the Mir sprint ;) -> https://code.launchpad.net/~sil2100/cupstream2distro-config/mir_switch_to_next_PPA/+merge/185871
<asac> sil2100: how long befrore you drop off?
<sil2100> I should be gone already so not super long, I have a strange headache now as well!
<kenvandine> sil2100, sure
<sil2100> kenvandine: do you have a moment for this? https://code.launchpad.net/~sil2100/cupstream2distro-config/extra_pkgs_for_services/+merge/185905 ?
<sil2100> kenvandine: I'll redeploy anyway ;)
<kenvandine> hey sil2100, sorry, let me look
<cyphermox> I do
<cyphermox> don't redeply now please
<kenvandine> cyphermox, thx :)
<cyphermox> if the mir team just wants to write code for post-saucy, this is the wrong way to "fix" it
<sil2100> cyphermox: I think they want to write fixes for saucy
<sil2100> Not post-saucy
<sil2100> cyphermox: since they want to have those changes released to saucy later
<cyphermox> well, the result is the same really
<sil2100> cyphermox: at least that's how I understood kgunn
<cyphermox> they should do saucy bugfix in a saucy branch
<cyphermox> and upstream development in turnk
<cyphermox> *trunk
<sil2100> There is no trunk, and I think they only want to do bugfixes for saucy for now
<sil2100> I mean, trunk is for saucy still
<sil2100> cyphermox: but best if you discuss that with kgunn
<cyphermox> from there we can just change the target branch for saucy to whatever they name their change, and trunk for further devel
<kgunn> sil2100: cyphermox ....our trunk is for saucy
<sil2100> cyphermox: ^
<kgunn> our trunk is sacred, so anything landing there...we want in saucy
<cyphermox> kgunn: you don't expect to be doing any development not expected to land in saucy?
<cyphermox> alright
<sil2100> cyphermox: as I said, trunk is for saucy, there is no 'upstream development', they work for saucy only
<cyphermox> sil2100: but then the PPA change is still incorrect, daily-build-next is explicitly not saucy
<kgunn> cyphermox: correct...for the moment...and totally understand, if/when we get to doing dev that's not going into saucy
<kgunn> we would branch ourselves
<cyphermox> kgunn: ack
<cyphermox> well for now anything in trunk does end up in saucy, that's all good
<sil2100> cyphermox: well, true, but Didier uses it temporarily for saucy stuff as well
<cyphermox> sil2100: the ppa change would make mir build in a ppa that could have random other stuff for future releases.
<sil2100> cyphermox: I remember last week he used it as well
<cyphermox> yes, for a very specific reason, to avoid building against Mir :)
<cyphermox> since we purged the daily-build ppa completely
<alberts> Hi! Does anyone knows what version of gtk will be used in ubuntu 14.04?
<cyphermox> kenvandine: what's your opinion? feels to me like this should all be a no-op
<cyphermox> alberts: whatever stable version of Gtk will be available, I'd say
<cyphermox> alberts: depends on roadmap, let me check
<cyphermox> alberts: I'm not sure. 4.0 by then maybe? I have no idea
<cyphermox> there's a 3.9.14 tagged in git so there is a possibility I guess
<alberts> cyphermox: thanks!
<kenvandine> cyphermox, sil2100: not sure, so sending it to daily-build-next means not saucy, so yeah... a no-op
<cyphermox> well, the ppa itself doesn't change where we land stuff
<kenvandine> well, not totally a no-op... it still gets sent there
<kenvandine> oh... that's where it builds it
<kenvandine> not the dest
<cyphermox> but I'm not sure we should possibly break what builds in next with an old mir
<kenvandine> that is scary then
<alberts> can someone look at this fix? https://code.launchpad.net/~albertsmuktupavels/nautilus/white-screen-fix/+merge/180231
<kenvandine> should it maybe stay in experimental for now?  so it doesn't taint anything?
<alberts> ubuntu 13.10 probably will be last ubuntu supporting multiple screens as with gtk 3.10 multi screen support has removed. it would be nice if this bug is fixed at least in this ubuntu version.
<cyphermox> well if it's meant to be bugfix I'm fine with it building in the daily-build ppa... that's what it's for anyway
<cyphermox> as long as there truly are no non-bugfix commits, but even then we can see it since it's manual publishing
<kenvandine> true... so then just not making the change makes sense
<sil2100> cyphermox: I didn't want to build it in daily-build PPA since I only want things in daily-build which we are considering to release in the nearest time
<cyphermox> alberts: my concern wasn't with the fact that it's run only once per screen or not, but with whether there is an upstream-acceptable alternative to using the constructor to handle this
<sil2100> cyphermox: while not slowing down the development of the Mir guys
<sil2100> So maybe a different PPA?
<cyphermox> sil2100: you wouldn't be slowing things down for Mir people
<cyphermox> bugfix is just that -- bugfix
<cyphermox> so if it's bugfix that lands in Mir trunk as kgunn mentions, you really don't need to change anything
<sil2100> cyphermox: well, I'm tired now, so I don't care much now - so if you think it's ok to have it in daily-build, then ACK
<cyphermox> I think it's perfectly safe and fine
<cyphermox> doh, why did kgunn leave, we still need him :D
<alberts> cyphermox: upstream has removed background drawing. so i guess there is no alternative. or I don't understand something?
<cyphermox> alberts: that said, I don't feel strongly about it, just mildly prefer to see a patch that has received the blessing from the gnome people
<ricotz> cyphermox, hi :), just wanted to ask if you are going to take a look at network-manager 0.9.8.4?
<cyphermox> ricotz: I will, soonish
<cyphermox> ricotz: got to land one patch first, then I'll be updating the packaging for 0.9.8.4
<ricotz> cyphermox, great!
<cyphermox> we should be able to land that this week
<cyphermox> ricotz: do you need anything in particular?
<alberts> cyphermox: so what should I do to get that fix accepted?
<ricotz> cyphermox, nothing particular, i was about to take a look to get it into gnome3 ppa (which currently has 0.9.8.2), i will leave it to you then ;)
<cyphermox> kenvandine: want to give your opinion on alberts' patch too? I don't feel strongly against the patch, though I think there is a better way to do this... but I'm not sure any of us have time to spend working on it
<cyphermox> ricotz: ack
<cyphermox> ricotz: there is a bunch of memory fixes and stuff like that, so a good idea to land anyway
<alberts> cyphermox: it is not my patch. Its old patch which was rejected with "seems a bit simple to me, we don't want to construct a new object each time, rather we want one per screen". But it is already [with patch] constructed once per screen.
<kenvandine> cyphermox, not really, i'm pretty distracted right now by content-hub
<cyphermox> kenvandine: ack
<cyphermox> alberts: I still think the fix is slightly incorrect, but let's just get it out of the way
<cyphermox> alberts: it's for saucy right?
<alberts> cyphermox: yes, but I have created merge proposal for precise too. what would be correct way to fix it? Maybe I could try to fix it myself...
<cyphermox> alberts: let's done one thing at a time :)
<cyphermox> alberts:  if you want to see your name in changelog, could you also update changelog to bump the version and apply the patch? do you know how to do that
<alberts> cyphermox: I don't care about seeing my name in changelog. I just want it to be fixed. so do i need to do something now?
<cyphermox> nah, I can handle it from here
<tedg> fginther, Thanks, it looks like that patch landed!
<fginther> tedg, \o/
<jasoncwarner> hey Laney , still around? was wondering if we are still missing anything for datetime settings in system settings?
<thumper> o/ jasoncwarner
<Laney> jasoncwarner: hi, here for two minutes
<Laney> jasoncwarner: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/TimeAndDate#Phone
<Laney> We don't have the "Setting the time & date automatically ..." bit
<jasoncwarner> Laney: is that needing the location service? (which is landing this week, I think)
<Laney> mmm, I don't know exactly what that provides
<Laney> I didn't know which API to use to ask if there's internet access
<Laney> I think I started a thread about it on ubuntu-phone a few weeks ago but didn't get a clear answer
<jasoncwarner> Laney ok. since you are heading off, mind following up on that tomorrow and driving to an answer? if need be, grab lool or chickencutlass and get a definitive answer.
<Laney> I think this http://doc.qt.digia.com/qtmobility-1.2/qml-networkinfo.html is the thing
<Laney> but it didn't work, maybe due to missing backend
<Laney> I'll try it again
<Laney> oh yes, wait, I'm remembering more
<Laney> it has some complicated notion of 'informative' carriers and stuff
<Laney> jasoncwarner: More remembering; the 'automatic' timezone selection doesn't do anything either
<Laney> I think ofono provides this
<Laney> Ken has been doing settings for things that need ofono as he has a device whereas Seb and I don't
<ochosi> Laney: sorry to bother you again with this, but you mentioned before that ubuntu also has a logout issue (i pinged you about xubuntu and our session taking forever to end when logging out, because you submitted that logind patch)
<Laney> ochosi: nothing more to report
<ochosi> so this still hasn't been debugged yet in ubuntu?
<Laney> not by me anyway
<ochosi> ok, any idea whom i could ask about this?
<Laney> I don't think anyone is doing so
<ochosi> ppl just too busy with mir and the phone-stuff?
<Laney> pitti might know best how to start looking but I doubt he has began to debug this one either
<Laney> basically phone things for 13.10
<Laney> Ideally I'll get more time for desktop bugs soon
<Laney> anyway, in the absence of that it'd be great for someone else to prod at it
<ochosi> yup
<ochosi> we'll see whether we get anywhere, but i guess i'll ask pitti first for some pointers
<Laney> maybe the ubuntu GNOME guys have the same problem
<Laney> try asking them too
<ochosi> they use gdm though, no?
<Laney> logind though
<ochosi> true
<ochosi> any names in the u-gnome team you can recommend?
<Laney> I recommend that you go ask in #ubuntu-gnome and hang around for a reply
<Laney> got to go now, see you tomorrow
 * Laney waves
<ochosi> sure, thanks Laney !
<cyphermox> alberts: I haven't forgotten you, just busy and I ran into issues merging your branch
<cyphermox> I'll get back to it soon
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-09-17
<alberts> cyphermox:  in what issues you ran?
<tkamppeter> larsu_, hi
<larsu_> tkamppeter: hi
<tkamppeter> larsu, can you have a look at bug 1196986, seems to be a problem with bannertopdf.
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1196986 in cups-filters (Ubuntu) "bannertopdf can't handle Japanese characters" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1196986
<larsu> tkamppeter: yes I saw that one. I'll have a look as soon as I have time.
<didrocks> good morning
<Laney> hi
<jibel> Good morning
<Mirv> didrocks: I've the new autopilot compiled in daily-build, and I've the first comparison now - at least during first run, 3 failed ui-toolkit autopilot tests with the new autopilot, all successful with the old. I'll test now again with the new one.
<didrocks> Mirv: thanks! keep us up to date :)
 * didrocks has to answer tones of emails on people not being happy with the manual landing. Not sure why they don't contact asac :/
<asac> didrocks: dont explain
<asac> direct them to me
<asac> :)
<didrocks> especially has some wants to workaround this with manual uploads now that "everything is blocked because of daily release"
<didrocks> asac: this is clearly hurting the CI view, everyone things now that dailies are broken as well ^
<didrocks> and that's why we have this process
<asac> didrocks: lets talk in 6 minutes :)
<Laney> muhahaha, libgdata succeeded on a rebuild
<didrocks> cyphermox: sil2100: robru: Mirv: can you join #ubuntu-ci-eng please? we can coordinate landing there
<didrocks> jibel: hey, who should I contact to create an experimental view? (experimental/mir and experimental/mirslave)
<jibel> didrocks, on jenkins?
<didrocks> yeah
<jibel> didrocks, I explained cyphermox how to do it last week
<didrocks> jibel: ok, I'll ping him, thanks
<didrocks> we still have http://10.97.0.1:8080/view/cu2d/view/Experimental/view/All/ until then
<jibel> didrocks, he should know but I can help if he encounters any problem
<didrocks> jibel: perfect, thanks a lot ;)
 * didrocks out for an hour, trying to run to keep awaken ;)
<Sweetsha1k> jibel: any chance you get the libreoffice bibisect repo updated again?
<Laney> dpm: hey, translations q: I just set up https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu-wallpapers/trunk/+pots/ubuntu-wallpapers - is it going to synchronise with https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/saucy/+source/ubuntu-wallpapers/+pots/ubuntu-wallpapers ?
 * dpm looks
<Laney> it says they are shared
<Laney> just wondering if there's a delay to be expected there
<Sweetshark> Hey desktopers, I need someone to sponsor a LibreOffice saucy update! volunteers?
<dpm> Laney, it looks good. I've just changed a couple of things: set the permissions to Restricted in the upstream project (they were set to Open). I've also set the imports to import only templates: there is no need to import PO files in the upstream project if translations are going to be done in LP. Notice that the "Automatic synchronization of translations is not enabled" message in https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/saucy/+source/ubuntu-wallpap
<dpm> ers/+sharing-details is a bug in LP. It happens when you set the imports to templates only, but it does the sharing nevertheless.
<Sweetshark> (well, s/I need someone to sponsor/Tommorrow I need someone to sponsor/)
<Laney> dpm: OK, there were no translations in the source branch only
<Laney> not sure why you'd choose restricted but if that's the standard choice then fine
<Laney> if there's people who do the necessary reviewing
<dpm> Laney, and sharing is instant (i.e. once set in LP, translators can already translate on either side, and the translations will propagate the minute they submit them)
<Laney> dpm: what about the pre-existing ones?
<dpm> Laney, leaving a project's translation permission to open is a recipe for disaster. It's the same as if bzr branches were open for commits: you'd get lots of activity, but that wouldn't reflect on good quality
<dpm> Laney, ah, let me have a look. Perhaps we need to set upstream to import PO files and when LP is done then switch it back to templates only
<dpm> there don't seem to be any translations in the branch: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-art-pkg/ubuntu-wallpapers/ubuntu/files/head:/po/
<dpm> so I think we can set the imports to templates only
<Laney> yeah I want to get the ones that LP knows about in there
<Sweetshark> no volunteers? Then I suggest to assign didrocks as a sponsor -- LibreOffice wouldnt work without a french guy sponsoring it ...
<Laney> from the saucy package
<dpm> Laney, automatic exports should take care of that for you
<Laney> ok, will see if it happens in a few hours then
<Laney> otherwise can always manually import it
<Laney> thanks
<dpm> Laney, I think it happens some time very early in the morning, once a day, so I think we've missed the window for the exports
<Laney> nod
<pitti> Good morning
<tkamppeter> I have installed "gallery-app" on a normal Ubuntu desktop (Unity) how do I get my photos (in ~/Pictures/) visible in it?
<czajkowski> chrisccoulson: you mock me! meanie! :)
<chrisccoulson> hi :)
<sil2100> Mirv: still around :D ?
<sil2100> kenvandine: ping!
<desrt_> Laney: did you do the new glib upload yet?
<Laney> desrt: which new?
<desrt> Laney: released yesterday
<Laney> no
<desrt> k
<Laney> was off yesterday & sponsoring this morning
<Laney> a problem?
<desrt> if you're gonna do it, please include this little guy: https://bug707787.bugzilla-attachments.gnome.org/attachment.cgi?id=255107
<kenvandine> sil2100, pong
<Laney> ok
<desrt> Laney: thanks
<Laney> not worth doing a .1 release?
<sil2100> Laney: hi! I'm running the latest content-hub right now on my phone, and I'm trying to change the background in u-s-s - when I click on the Welcome screen image it opens up the gallery-app, but do you know what I should do to select the image to be the wallpaper ;p?
<desrt> Laney: hmm
<sil2100> kenvandine: ^
<desrt> Laney: we do have a new chinese translation as well :)
<Laney> I heard people like those
<desrt> okay sure.  i can do a new release.
<sil2100> kenvandine, Laney: since right now it opens up the gallery-app like a normal app and I just can browse images, not select any of them to be my wallpaper
<kenvandine> sil2100, humm... do you get the picker toolbar at the bottom?
<Laney> desrt: up to you, cherry picking is just as easy for me
<sil2100> kenvandine: nope...
<kenvandine> it should go in picker mode
<kenvandine> do you have multiple instances of gallery-app?
<kenvandine> oh... wait
<kenvandine> sil2100, latest content-hub == what version?
<kenvandine> last i checked, the latest published was too old for what gallery-app needed
<sil2100> kenvandine: the one that got built today, i.e. 0.0+13.10.20130917-0ubuntu1
<kenvandine> sil2100, that's why i was bugging you guys about publishing last week
<kenvandine> ok... humm
<sil2100> kenvandine: since before it didn't even start the gallery-app when clicking on the background
<kenvandine> and what about gallery-app?
<sil2100> kenvandine: gallery-app I have an old one - do we need a new gallery-app for that? I have 0.0.67+13.10.20130905-0ubuntu1
<kenvandine> sil2100, that version of gallery-app worked for me last week... with content-hub trunk
<kenvandine> oh, wait not quite
<kenvandine> there is one more branch...  https://code.launchpad.net/~schwann/gallery-app/gallery-single-select/+merge/185230
<kenvandine> i'm using that branch, which has failures still
<sil2100> Ouch ;/
<sil2100> kenvandine: did you add that to the list of 'Landing Asks' in the Landing Pipeline?
<sil2100> Since I guess it's essential to land along with content-hub, otherwise we have no test-cases to check if it works
<kenvandine> humm... the failure is because it is building against the old content-hub
<kenvandine> he should bump the build depends there
<kenvandine> so content-hub got published today?
<kenvandine> sil2100, the content-hub items on the landing asks sheet lists this use case to test, so that's good :)
<tkamppeter> Has anyone tested gallery-app on a normal Ubuntu desktop? I cannot see my photos then/
<kenvandine> tkamppeter, it works for me... it only shows photos in ~/Pictures
<sil2100> kenvandine: no it didn't get published, I want to publish it but I must make sure it passes the manual tests
<sil2100> kenvandine: which I tried, but don't work ;p
<tkamppeter> For convergence (using same data on Ubuntu Touch and normal desktop) this shouls work.
<kenvandine> hehe
<sil2100> kenvandine: so it means we need to rebuild and release gallery-app along with content-hub...
<kenvandine> yeah, the CI is failing on this branch
<tkamppeter> kenvandine, my photos are in subdirectories of ~/Pictures.
<kenvandine> building against the older content-hub
<kenvandine> tkamppeter, should work then...
<kenvandine> tkamppeter, works for me... any errors if you run it from a console?
<kenvandine> sil2100, now that we have read-only images, do we just need to remount rw to install debs?
<sil2100> kenvandine: well, I still use the old images since it's a pain otherwise ;)
<tkamppeter> kenvandine, I get only photos shown which are directly in ~/Pictures/ not the ones in subdirectories.
<kenvandine> tkamppeter, oh... i guess you're right
<kenvandine> humm
<kenvandine> tkamppeter, ask about that in #ubuntu-touch
<kenvandine> or look for bug reports, surely someone has filed that :)
<didrocks> kenvandine: btw please join #ubuntu-ci-eng
<tkamppeter> kenvandine, no answer yet on #ubuntu-touch, have reported bug 1226613 now.
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1226613 in gallery-app (Ubuntu) "gallery-app on normal Unity desktop: Photos in subdirectories of ~/Pictures are not displayed" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1226613
<kenvandine> tkamppeter, thx
 * Laney hopes someone is in a u-s-s reviewing frame of mind
 * sil2100 can be if needed
<Laney> doing a few MPs to hide stuff
<sil2100> Laney: any merge of high priority?
<Laney> not really
<Laney> they just stack up
<Laney> so good to spend a bit of time each day doing them
<sil2100> Laney: I'll do some in a moment, looking at what's available already
<jbicha> Laney: I guess we'll have to drop gnome-documents/armhf from saucy because libgdata/armhf is build without goa support
<Laney> does it do anyting without goa?
<jbicha> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-documents/3.8.4-1/+build/4932336
<jbicha> without goa, I guess gnome-documents would still be a decent but very simple document viewer
<Laney> it's a hard requirement in configure.ac
<jbicha> yeah, perhaps it could be conditionalized but not by me right now
<jbicha> someone should also test-build e-d-s and evolution to make sure they'll rebuild on armhf
<jbicha> I was able to rebuild grilo-plugins fine here
<jasoncwarner> hey Laney, around?
<Laney> jasoncwarner: sure am
<jasoncwarner> hey Laney !
<Laney> how's it going?
<jasoncwarner> alright. just following up on the date & time.
<Laney> okies
<desrt> Laney: there is a .93 now, thanks for the suggestion
<Laney> desrt: cool, tomorrow is the day
<desrt> great.  thanks.
<Laney> jasoncwarner: I think you found a system-settings bug
<Laney> kudos :P
<jasoncwarner> Laney: which one is that specifically?
<jasoncwarner> ;)
<Laney> clicking on the disabled component
<jasoncwarner> ah, ok :)
<Laney> I mean bug as in something we didn't know about
<Laney> yeah, I see how to fix that
<Laney> it even was fixed in one case but not the other
<Laney> ya, seems happy enough
<jasoncwarner> thanks Laney
<desrt> pitti: hey.  pygobject currently fails to build: configure: error: You must have one of the following versions of lcov: 1.6 1.7 1.8 1.9 (found: 1.10).
<desrt> pitti: uninstalling lcov makes it work properly.....
<pitti> desrt: oh, Fedora has 10?
<desrt> seems to
<pitti> desrt: so I guess we need a newer gnome-common in saucy for building the tarball?
<desrt> pitti: i built out of git....
<desrt> maybe gnome-common was indeed the problem
<pitti> autogen.sh doesn't verify the lcov version by itself, that must have been through autoconf via gnome-common
<desrt> okay.  so this is probably a jhbuild bug then
<desrt> ie: not requiring a new-enough gnome-common in the sysdeps
<pitti> hm, but gnome-common itself should be jhbuildable?
<desrt> yes... but jhbuild skips building things that have a 'new enough' version already installed on the system
<desrt> in fact, it looks like pygobject has no gnome-common depend at all.... did you add this lcov stuff recently?
<pitti> desrt: maybe half a year ago or so
<desrt> huh
 * desrt appears confused
<pitti> Thu Nov 8 14:54:30 2012 +0100
<pitti> that's when I landed it in pygobject
<desrt> installing gnome-common out of git fixes the issue
<desrt> so this is a definite jhbuild moduleset bug
<desrt> ignore me =)
<pitti> desrt: oh, I might not have added a g-common dep to jhbuild
<desrt> pitti: if you want to do that, that could be nice
<pitti> desrt: are the modulesets subject to the hard freeze?
<desrt> no.  i imagine not.
<desrt> i know we have a blanet exception for buildsystem fixes.  i'd include this under that.
<pitti> desrt: http://paste.ubuntu.com/6120793/ ?
<desrt> looks fine to me
<desrt> let me know if you push it -- i can test right away
<pitti> desrt: pushed
 * pitti listens to LinuxCon keynote, bbl
<desrt> pitti: seems to work properly.  thanks.
<desrt> pitti: you correctly note for tarball builds that you should have a newer gnome-common, though
<desrt> maybe do tarballs from inside of jhbuild?
<pitti> desrt: yes, that indeed seems better; I actually thought I had done so
<pitti> like, I usually run jhbuild run make distcheck
<desrt> well -- as stated, i was building out of git
<desrt> so i have no idea what the state of the tarballs is
<ochosi> robert_ancell: hi there
<ochosi> sorry to ping you a bit out of context, but there are a few lightdm issues i wanted to quickly ask you about (if there's time)
<ochosi> first of all, the test-mode seems rather borked now (https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/lightdm/+bug/1226544)
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1226544 in lightdm (Ubuntu) "lightdm --test-mode fails immediately" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<ochosi> and secondly, the greeter returns false on querying whether restarting is possible (https://bugs.launchpad.net/lightdm/+bug/1226509)
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1226509 in Light Display Manager "lightdm_get_can_restart returns false in Ubuntu Saucy" [Undecided,New]
<ochosi> these two weren't present in Raring
<robert_ancell> ochosi, hi. I haven't had time to look at them but for the second one try calling the D-Bus interface yourself and see if that is returning false. If it is, then that's an issue in logind
<ochosi> robert_ancell: ah, nice! thanks for the hint!
<robert_ancell> ochosi, I haven't tried test-mode in a while
<ochosi> yeah, it was useful for us when developing the greeter
<ochosi> and it still is
<ochosi> so it'd be nice if it was kept alive
<robert_ancell> I'll try and have a look, but very busy so any help much appreciated
<ochosi> logind seems to cause some issues in across desktops
<ochosi> yeah, i thought so
<ochosi> mobile and mir are eating up all the time, innit?
<robert_ancell> ochosi, sure are :)
<ochosi> hm, logind seems to cause odd logout-delays in pretty much all desktops btw
<ochosi> i've talked to lubuntu folk, heard the same from kubuntu and ubuntu-gnome plus ubuntu itself too
<ochosi> seems no-one has debugged it yet, and i'm afraid logind is a bit over my head..
<ochosi> just in case you know anyone to forward this to
<robert_ancell> I'm no logind expert, you want to talk to people like slangasek and others on the Ubuntu foundations team
<ochosi> hm, ok
<ochosi> i'll try to get a hold of them then
<ochosi> thanks a lot for your help, it's really much appreciated
<ochosi> especially as i know how much the team is focussed on !=desktop atm
<robert_ancell> ochosi, np!
<robert_ancell> gtg, later all
<ochosi> sure, seeya!
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-09-18
<jbicha> unity-webapps-service shouldn't depend on webbrowser-app, right?
<jibel> Good morning
<Laney> hey
<Laney> sil2100: sil2100 sil2100 sil2100
<sil2100> Laney: wazzup?
<sil2100> Morning!
<Laney> hallo
<Laney> so like, the webbrowser-app dep from unity-webapps-service seems a bit premature
<Laney> that MIR isn't granted
<Laney> and now the images fail to build
<sil2100> Ooook, now that is quite a problem indeed, this is something we missed
<sil2100> I already had a talk with upstream about it and they said that it's necessary to have the dep in
<sil2100> Laney: what if we would have a recommends on that?
<Laney> no, I guess you want it installed
<sil2100> Laney: right, but I can request a rewrite so that it would work without webbrowser-app installed, since I guess getting webbrowser-app into Main is not an option
<Laney> why not?
<Laney> anyway: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity-webapps-qml/+bug/1206268
<sil2100> Laney: I thought that we won't be including touch apps into main for now...
<Laney> I think this is a deliberate new way to launch the webapps?
<Laney> anyway, dunno, the problem currently is that we got the dependency without the mir
<Laney> = bad
<sil2100> Right, do you think trying to get a MIR for webbrowser-app would be the right way to go?
<Laney> that's the bug I linked
<Laney> but it is blocked
<sil2100> Ah, right, I see the webbrowser-app now
<Laney> maybe you want to back out the change for now or something
<Laney> chat to the upstream guys about it
<JamesTait> Good morning all!
<JamesTait> Is anyone else having trouble getting past the lightdm greeter this morning? I enter my password, it seems to accept it and attempt to start my session, then dumps me back at the greeter.
<Laney> JamesTait: Anything in your logs? /var/log/lightdm/ ~/.cache/upstart/
<JamesTait> Laney, sorry, only just seen your message.  I hadn't looked in ~/.cache/upstart but /var/log/auth.log was showing authentication failures in lightdm:auth, which is odd.
<JamesTait> Laney, anyway, I did an apt-get upgrade and restarted lightdm from a vt and now it's let me in.
<Laney> O_O
<JamesTait> Laney, I switched to vt1 to try and get help and diagnose, but when I came to switch back to vt7 it tried to start a failsafe-x session.
<Laney> did anything relevant get updated?
<JamesTait> Laney, that apparently failed (no gdm, I think), and when I switched back to vt1 there was no lightdm process running at all.
<JamesTait> Laney, just checking history.log, hang on.
<Laney> anyway, let us know if it happens again I guess
<JamesTait> Yeah.  I think I recall seeing that someone else had the same situation the other day, but I can't remember who it was.
<JamesTait> Laney, http://paste.ubuntu.com/6123127/ is the log - I don't think I see anything obvious. Some Unity webapps stuff, some Java, Thunderbird latest ESR...
<JamesTait> Terrible wrapping. :-/
<Sweetshark> Moin!
<Sweetshark> Who will be the victi^Whero sponsoring LibreOffice 1:4.1.2~rc2-0ubuntu1? volunteers?
<Sweetshark> 30 minutes without a reply ...
 * Sweetshark considers wrestling down didrocks and make him do the sponsoring ...
<didrocks> Sweetshark: no no no ;) please try to get a patch pilot :p (or Laney who didn't want to vote in favor for you ;))
<didrocks> Sweetshark: TBH, I'm handling quite a lot of stuff, can't focus on sponsoring right now
<Sweetshark> didrocks: k
<Laney> Sweetshark: maybe at the end of the day, but I recommend catching a patch pilot if you can
<Laney> https://www.google.com/calendar/embed?src=6k1e5rq45m1bdqq0n1ge3oqaok@group.calendar.google.com&gsessionid=OK
<Laney> I think the Monday people skipped their shifts ;-)
<Sweetshark> Laney: hah, I wrote you a mail with the details and cc'ed pitti -- who according to that is todays pp ;)
<Laney> saw
<Laney> pitti's at a conference though
<czajkowski> aloha
<bcurtiswx> updated last night and when logging in it just goes right back to lightdm
<bcurtiswx> im guessing it may potentially be a unity-system-compositor issue too
<sil2100> didrocks: is that ok? http://10.97.0.1:8080/job/cu2d-webapp-saucy-3.0publish/5/artifact/packaging_changes_libunity-webapps_2.5.0~+13.10.20130918-0ubuntu1.diff
<bcurtiswx> I get a message of: "Failed to use bus name org.freedesktop.DisplayManager, do you have appropriate perissions?" but i'm not sure thats why it goes back to lightdm when i try logging in.
<didrocks> sil2100: good!
<bcurtiswx> weird, i can login to another persons account on my desktop
<bcurtiswx> but mine just comes back to the lightdm screen
<bcurtiswx> how do you even debug that, lol
<pitti> Good morning
<pitti> Sweetshark: yes, need to postpone/move my PP, I'm at plumbers
<sil2100> didrocks: can I ask for 2 preNEW's? Are you busy busy?
<sil2100> :)
<didrocks> sil2100: I can handle that today, but not now now
<sil2100> didrocks: good good goood goooood
<sil2100> didrocks: lp:clickmanager-plugin and lp:click-update-manager <- those need preNEWing, they're missing bootstrapping but I'll add them now after they're ACKed
<didrocks> ok
<bcurtiswx> is it possible that one account on a computer could use unity-system-compositor and another would not ?
<Sweetshark> pitti: alrighty, should I just wait, or do you have a standin? seb128 is on vacation, and I dont want to explain the details to ~everyone who possibly might upload as with LO there are a few more details than with other pkgs ...
<pitti> Sweetshark: well, TBH I only do very cursory checks on it anyway, so I guess any core dev could help out
<jbicha> hi, could libappindicator be pushed to saucy?
<sil2100> jbicha: hi! You mean the new version?
<sil2100> jbicha: did you put it on the Landing Asks tab ;) /
<jbicha> sil2100: can you paste the link as I don't have the spreadsheet bookmarked?
<Laney> can we get a release of ubuntu-system-settings?
<jbicha> it would be nice to have vala-0.16 out of main (libappindicator was the last rdepends)
<mlankhorst|lpc> m00
<Laney> hello mlankhorst
<mlankhorst|lpc> heya
<Laney> how's new orleans?
<mlankhorst|lpc> I realized I missed the meeting yWarm!
<mlankhorst|lpc> :P
<mlankhorst|lpc> very warm actually
<Laney> there was no meeting
<sil2100> jbicha: one moment
<sil2100> Laney: that's in the works
<Laney> ok
<sil2100> Laney: will release u-s-s in a moment
<mlankhorst|lpc> oh well
<mlankhorst|lpc> nothing to miss then :P
<Laney> this manual business is annoying
<bcurtiswx> hey all, my desktop session crashes and reverts back to lightdm, is there a way i can reset unity (i see the --reset option was deprecated)
<Laney> try #ubuntu-unity
<sil2100> jbicha: https://docs.google.com/a/canonical.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Au6idq7TkpUUdGNWb0tTVmJLVzFZd0doV3dVOGpWemc#gid=1
<Laney> bcurtiswx: logs show anything good?
<bcurtiswx> Laney: logs are, well.. useless
<Laney> did you check ~/.cache/upstart/?
<bcurtiswx> .xsession-errors shows nothing useful
<bcurtiswx> hmm lemme check now
<mlankhorst|lpc> osx terminal emulator is awful, need to get ubuntu running again
<jbicha> sil2100: ok I have read-only access
<sil2100> jbicha: hm, then probably the best way is to poke asac
<sil2100> jbicha: he's the guy responsible, so I guess he won't mind being poked about things liek that
<bcurtiswx> Laney: unity-panel-service: Fatal IO error 11 (Resource temporarily unavailable) on X server :0.
<Laney> erm
<Laney> yeah, let me redirect you to #ubuntu-unity :-)
<bcurtiswx> Laney: i'm there thanks :)
<Laney> cool
<asac> jbicha: if you want something on the landing spreadsheet, go through our lead/manager please
<jbicha> asac: who do you recommend I talk to? I'm not sure I know who the leads are
<bcurtiswx> Laney: idk why but lightdm was getting permission denied from my .Xauthority file
<bcurtiswx> removed that and it lets me log in
<Laney> what were the permissions?
<Laney> could that be apparmor?
<Laney> check dmesg/syslog for denials
<jbicha> the team work spreadsheet says talk to asac or didrocks for permission to release
<bcurtiswx> i didn't check the file perms
<bcurtiswx> it would be there if i coudl scroll up on my VT
<jbicha> tedg: maybe I need to ping you for publishing libappindicator?
<bcurtiswx> but it stops too early
<tedg> jbicha, Honestly, not sure anymore.  It seems like magic right now.
<tedg> I think that didrocks might be able to release things...
<didrocks> jbicha: I think you need to ask tedg to add to the spreadsheet
<tedg> didrocks, For things that aren't on the touch image?
<didrocks> tedg: for everything that we land
<asac> jbicha: get what you want to land on the landing spreadsheet
<asac> jbicha: then ask me, didrocks or someone else if its good
<asac> jbicha: we will most likely come to you with a set of autopilot tests that we want you to run on your phone first
<asac> to give us assurance
<Laney> libappindicator isn't even on the phone
<jbicha> lol, I don't run Ubuntu phone :)
<jbicha> except for building with the default vala, there's nothing at all risky here
<jbicha> https://bazaar.launchpad.net/~indicator-applet-developers/libappindicator/trunk.13.10/revision/266
<jbicha> and the current version of libappindicator ftbfs (because it doesn't build-depend on at-spi2-core)
<Laney> desrt: how come the new du API isn't documented in https://developer.gnome.org/gio/unstable/GFile.html properly?
<desrt> aw crap.  probably forgot to add it to the symbols file.
<desrt> fill fix before the final release
<desrt> *will
<Laney> k
<happyaron> is there a schedule of updating language packs?
<Sweetshark> ^^ while having a bazillion other things to my upstream stats do not look _that_ bad: 1062 commits (1.6%), 613KLOC changed (4.1%), 170KLOC removed (1.4%), 13 sign-offs (1.5%), 44 reviews (1.8%), 39 test creds (1.6%) ...
<sil2100> didrocks: !
<didrocks> sil2100: hey hey!
<sil2100> didrocks: I have 3 packaging changes... all of them just remove qtdeclarative5-hud1.0 as the dependency, as it's not used, for apps: notes-app, gallery-app and webbrowser-app
<didrocks> sil2100: excellent! Loves cleaning, if this is the only thing, I trust you, so +1 ;)
<happyaron> didrocks: mind review/upload LP #1226492?
<didrocks> happyaron: hum, I would rather ping the patch pilot, don't really have time for those until I'm piloting TBH
<happyaron> didrocks: no pilot...
<didrocks> happyaron: maybe try later or tomorrow? If nothing in on Monday (I'll be back then), I can sponsor it
<happyaron> didrocks: ok, thanks
<didrocks> yw, do not hesitate to remind it to me on Monday
<didrocks> I'll probably forget about it
<happyaron> :)
<didrocks> ;)
<jbicha> xnox: do you think you'll get a chance to finish https://code.launchpad.net/~jbicha/ubuntu-themes/drop-input-keyboard-icon/+merge/181793 by tomorrow?
<jbicha> it fixes this bug: http://imgbin.org/images/15107.png
<xnox> jbicha: yak. is tommorow the UI freeze?
<jbicha> xnox: yeah :|
<xnox> jbicha: while this does change the UI, it's a bug fix to be honest and not /major UI revamp/ cause I have a few branches to merge check in the ubuntu-themes.
<xnox> jbicha: I'm at linux plumbers conference till the end of the week. I'll poke that and other bugs this evening.
<jbicha> xnox: if it doesn't make it, it should be an easy uife, thanks
<jbicha> enjoy the conference
<xnox> jbicha: cheers.
<Sweetshark> Laney: since all other venues fell flat, I would still appreciate a LO upload.
<Laney> Sweetshark: soon then, if I get this code working
<Laney> bdrung: when are you back? ^_^
<Sweetshark> fwiw, I am building on armhf too locally, but obviously that wont be finished before tommorrow ...
<Sweetshark> Laney: no worries, Im not in a hurry as long as it goes in.
<Laney> xnox: got any LPC gossip?
<xnox> Laney: oh yeah =) splendid already
<xnox> Laney: they play Avicii as pre-talk music it's so cool ;-)
<Laney> haha
<mlankhorst|lpc> haha
 * Laney imagines mlankhorst getting on down to that
<mlankhorst|lpc> nope.avi
<kgunn> kenvandine: ping
<kgunn> kenvandine: unping
<kenvandine> kgunn that was easy :)
<kgunn> kenvandine: any time!
<bdrung> Laney: 12 days left till my deadline
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-09-19
<Laney> good morning el desktoppers
<asac> gnome-screenshot doesnt work here
<asac> :)
<asac> seems to not capture what is on screen, but black
<czajkowski> asac: restart machine and it works or restart something which I never remember and seb tells me
<czajkowski> it's the same for print screen
<czajkowski> known bug
<czajkowski> Laney: gooooood morning
<asac> yeah
<asac> thanks
<czajkowski> np
<czajkowski> would be a really nice bug to get fixed :) have had that issue since I started saucy testing months ago
<mlankhorst|lpc> morning!
<Laney> mlankhorst|lpc: up early?
<mlankhorst|lpc> Laney: yeah I couldn't sleep after that point :P
<mlankhorst|lpc> I think my best approach is not adjust to this timezone much
<slomo> Laney: gstreamer 1.1.90 for you in experimental, 1.2.0 early next week
<Laney> slomo: yeah, saw, thanks
<sil2100> Laney: hi! ACK on the Background settings assignment ;)
<Laney> cool
<Laney> I'm getting stressed out at C++ currently
<sil2100> Laney: I have one merge ready for the background setting anyway, just still waiting for actual 'assets' from design
<Laney> cool
<sil2100> Since I'm using temporary placeholders for now
<sil2100> uh? Something wrong with C++?
<sil2100> )
<Laney> no, it's something wrong with me
<Laney> how to use glib async callbacks
<Laney> Might just do it sync in a QThread
<Laney> :|
 * Laney lunches
<pitti> Good morning
<highvoltage> pitteah
<desrt> good morning, hackers
<robert_ancell> desrt, good morning to you
<desrt> robert_ancell: will you be joining us in SF this time around?
<robert_ancell> desrt, what's happening in SF?
<desrt> a sprint with some teams
<desrt> desktop, plus some others, plus a managers event, as i understand it
<robert_ancell> desrt, I'm in Oakland for the managers event
<desrt> that's what i meant, then :)
<desrt> will be good to see you
<desrt> i bought a bottle of bitters after last time :)
<robert_ancell> desrt, yeah, haven't seen you guys in persons for ages!
<robert_ancell> nice
<desrt> that stuff goes with practically anything that fizzes
<RAOF> But best with lemonade and lime juice!
<desrt> RAOF: this is how robert_ancell introduced it to me :)
<sil2100> kenvandine: https://code.launchpad.net/~sil2100/cupstream2distro-config/extra_pkgs_for_unity8/+merge/186531
<kenvandine> sil2100, looking
<sil2100> kenvandine: btw. can you do a quick ACK of a packaging change for me? :)
<sil2100> kenvandine: http://10.97.0.1:8080/job/cu2d-unity8-saucy-3.0publish/lastSuccessfulBuild/artifact/packaging_changes_unity8_7.81.3+13.10.20130919.2-0ubuntu1.diff
<kenvandine> sil2100, sure
<sil2100> kenvandine: (hi btw.!)
<kenvandine> :)
<sil2100> Today I'm not feeling too well and it seems I'm doing things the other way around ;p
<kenvandine> sil2100, looks good
<kenvandine> sil2100, and hello :)
<sil2100> kenvandine: thanks!
<Laney> sil2100: come to the settings hangout https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/1886ac1548f08150beb365de16d3d1a9c2086185
<Laney> you went away?
<sil2100> Me? ;)
<happyaron> Laney: why LP #1226492 needs an archive administrator's approval? for it's NEW?
<jbicha> Laney: could you remove gnome-documents/armhf?
<Laney> no
<Laney> ask an archive admin :P
<Laney> happyaron: yes
<ochosi> robert_ancell: thanks a bunch for taking a look at the test-mode!
<robert_ancell> ochosi, np, turned out to be a simple regression
<jbicha> oops I thought you were one
<happyaron> Laney: seems jr has approved it
<ochosi> robert_ancell: we pinned the logout bug on upstart now btw ;) (https://bugs.launchpad.net/upstart/+bug/1227212)
<Laney> k
<Laney> jbicha: if only!
<happyaron> robert_ancell: I think it's okay to sponsor fcitx-qimpanel, jr approved it.
<xnox> jbicha: ubuntu-themes are all merged up, but pending daily release to happen. filed relevant requests everywhere.
<xnox> if it doesn't make it today, i'll then will be requesting UIFe and still pushing that upload for saucy
<Laney> oooooooooor
<Laney> probably ought to release ubuntu-wallpapers too
<jbicha> xnox: great! that bug's been annoying me for a long time...
<Laney> bah, finally it works
<Laney> xnox: did you manually upload ubuntu-wallpapers last time?
<Laney> xnox: don't suppose you have time to do it again?
<Laney> bored during a talk or something ...
<Laney> we got chinese translations that it'd be good to have before UIF
<xnox> Laney: which wallpapers - the ubuntu ones or the kylin ones or both? (they are two packages as far as I remember)
<Laney> ubuntu-wallpapers
<xnox> ack.
<xnox> Laney: will do in the moment.
<Laney> thanks
<Laney> I didn't check that the xml is set up to be translated, fyi
<Laney> hopefully someone did
<Laney> It at least is .xml.in with _name
<Laney> conidence is medium to high ;-)
<Laney> confidence
<happyaron> just FYI the kylin ones have translations in first upload..
 * Laney installs them to see if they are nice
<Laney> hmm, some of them are
<happyaron> Laney: some of them may have resolution problem, but acked by design team afaik
<Laney> the photographs are good
 * Laney has some rams on a hill now
<happyaron> :)
<Laney> slomo: did you really mean early next week for 1.2.0?
<Laney> seems quite a short gap
<Laney> oh, you said that in the email too so I guess so
<slomo> Laney: yes, needs to be in time for gnome
<Laney> fair enough
<Laney> works well for us, so thanks
<slomo> Laney: and since 1.1.4 the changes are rather limited, it was already stabilizing a lot... also thanks to ubuntu having upgraded and people reporting broken things to us :)
<Laney> :-)
<Laney> still see feature changes though, which means paperwork for me :P
<mlankhorst|lpc> :p
<mlankhorst|lpc> or keeping eyes closed
 * Laney refers mlankhorst to the DMB!
<slomo> Laney: which do you mean? :)
<slomo> Laney: there are some API changes though, we fixed some newly added API to make more sense
<Laney> new plugins surely count
<slomo> which new plugins since 1.1.4?
<Laney> I doubt anyone is going to seriously review it though
<Laney> on our side
<Laney> oh wait, wtf
<Laney> your mail is "Changes since 1.0"
<Laney> bah
<slomo> there were no new plugins, some minor new features in some unimportant plugins and the API changes i mentioned above
<slomo> it's mostly bugfixes and cleanup
 * Laney nods
<mlankhorst|lpc> as usual, there are no bugs. ;)
<xnox> Laney: kenvandine says he'll kick off ubuntu-wallpapers build once the new default wallpaper lands.
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-09-20
<Laney> xnox: "once"? what about UIF?
<Laney> p.s. hi
<darkxst> Hey Laney
<asac> anyone can look at ==== unity ==== stack changes here ... http://people.canonical.com/~platform/cu2d/results
<asac> and tell me if that changes anything in the ui?
<asac> those are staged and just wanted to punt them in the archive... just double checking because of the freezes
<Laney> hi darkxst
<Laney> asac: I guess #ubuntu-unity would know more
<asac> ok thought you were the integration experts :)
<Laney> well, certainly not /me/, at least for that stuff :P
<Laney> but the CI guys should be in unity anyway
<darkxst> Laney, so T will move to 3.10?
<Laney> darkxst: I'd expect so
<Laney> might have similar time problems as we had this cycle though
<darkxst> ok, right now there is big problem with the xrandr stuff being moved into mutter
<darkxst> probably it will need to be copied into Unity
<darkxst> the changes to gnome-desktop will be incredibly messy to revert for unity only
<Laney> oh, what did they do?
<darkxst> all the display config stuff is now a dbus api in mutter
<Laney> ah, guess this is some abstraction over X/Wayland
<darkxst> yeh mutter abstracts all that away, so gnome-desktop neednt have any idea whether running X or wayland
<Laney> I suppose unity (or something) wants to implement this interface too then
<darkxst> yup
<Laney> fun
<darkxst> it would be cleanest in Unity I guess
<Laney> I suppose file a bug at least
<Laney> seems like it'll lead to a lot of duplication
<darkxst> Laney, I'm guessing Mir doesnt use xrandr etc?
<darkxst> although Xmir might?
<Laney> xmir will need to, sure
<davmor2> Daft Question time.  Empathy, with google moving to it's own system, microsoft moving to sykpe, and facebook only working some of the time, isn't it just a poor irc client now?
<jpds_> davmor2: Have some empathy.
<davmor2> jpds_: :)
<Mirv> ogra: can you check/ack content-hub packaging changes? http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/6132295/
<Mirv> comes down to adding glib/gsetings/libnih dependenies
<ogra> Mirv, shipit
<Mirv> ogra: ok
<pitti> Good morning
<desrt> pitti: hello!
<pitti> it's a desrt! hey mate, how are you?
<RAOF> desrt, pitti: Good morning.
<desrt> still down in the delta?
<pitti> hey desrt
<pitti> desrt: yes, last conf day; will fly back tomorrow
<desrt> pop quiz: pitti and RAOF both wish you good morning.  which one uses the word 'mate' in his greeting?
<desrt> RAOF: hi :)
<desrt> pitti: what kind of swanky events did they have this year?
 * desrt sort of regrets not coming
<pitti> desrt: we had a "Mardi Gras" parade on Wednesday evening, right through the city (with police escort)
<pitti> desrt: right into the "House of Blues" where they had an awesome band (and buffet and bar, of course)
<desrt> figures :p
<desrt> linuxcon events are getting ridiculous :p
<desrt> was it fun? :)
<pitti> desrt: yes, much
<desrt> last year's campfire-on-the-beach thing was pretty sweet too
<pitti> desrt: I've hung out in bars with life music three times this week now, it's just an amazing place for that
<desrt> ya... we have some pretty good jazz clubs in toronto with live music every night... but i just can't imagine what it's like down there
<desrt> probably completely off the charts
<xnox> Laney: i think it all landed on time.
<attente> mterry, hi
<mterry> attente, hello
<attente> mterry, do you have time to do a review of https://code.launchpad.net/~attente/unity-greeter/indicator-keyboard/+merge/179057 ?
<Laney> xnox: I don't think so, because it's now UIF and there is no upload
<xnox> Laney: right, sorry. ubuntu-themes upload happened in time for UIF, but not wallpapers.
<Laney> ho hum!
<Laney> kenvandine: do you have default wallpaper news? ;-)
<kenvandine> Laney, no... i was just looking to see if he emailed me again
 * kenvandine pings 
<Laney> roxor
<kenvandine> not on irc... jounih emailed me yesterday saying it was ready and what format i needed it in
<kenvandine> i told him and asked him to email it to me asap... and nothing
<mterry> attente, does that need an FFe?
<attente> mterry, too be honest, i'm not sure
<attente> should i file one anyways?
<mterry> attente, and maybe we should convert any values of "ug-keyboard" we see into "keyboard" and drop our custom ug-keyboard code, if it's not useful anymore
<mterry> attente, probably?
<attente> mterry, sure
<kenvandine> Laney, i got the wallpaper and updated it
<kenvandine> Laney, but... the package fails to build with --fail-missing, which was already there
<kenvandine> missing the translations
<Laney> those are new
<Laney> it's conceivable there could be problems there :-)
<kenvandine> oh... the translations are new?
<Laney> ya
<Laney> well, I just turned it on in LP
<kenvandine> i see
<Laney> so they'll be newly exported to the branch now
<kenvandine> https://code.launchpad.net/~ken-vandine/ubuntu-wallpapers/13_10/+merge/186813
<kenvandine> Laney, ^^
<kenvandine> mind giving that a review?
<Laney> hah
<Laney> I was getting ready to blame glib for a bug
<Laney> but it turned out to be me :)
<kenvandine> haha
<kenvandine> there are no bugs in glib
<kenvandine> :)
<Laney> jbicha: who is ubuntu-docs now?
<Laney> woo, proper space listing in u-s-s
<Laney> desrt: what a GREAT API!
<desrt> Laney: can i see the patch?
<Laney> not yet
<desrt> ah.  you're working on it?
<Laney> yeah, need to report when it's in progress
 * desrt is happy to see the fruits of his labours appreciated so rapidly
<Laney> I don't think the way I used the async api from c++ is very nice
<desrt> ah.  nice.  you're gonna do the progress?
<Laney> just in progress/not
<desrt> ah.  fair enough.
 * desrt likes to see the counters go up as a form of progress reporting
<Laney> could do that I suppose
<Laney> but it'd be annoying to make that work with the bar thing
<desrt> ya... seb said he didn't want progress reporting this way
<jbicha> Laney: https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-core-doc/ubuntu-docs/saucy
<desrt> i only added it because they want to use this API in nautilus and sushi now
<Laney> fair enough
<Laney> so I made a struct to pass as user_data to the callback function which contains the 'this' pointer, and a counter so we know when all of the operations are finished to emit the signal which updates the UI
<Laney> seems janky
<desrt> you're doing it for all of the user's documents/downloads/photos/videos/etc. folders?
<Laney> videos/audio/pictures
<desrt> if you want to report those as a single consolidated size, that's pretty much what you have to do, i figure
<Laney> nah, individually
<Laney> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/AboutThisDevice#phone-storage
<desrt> interesting.
<desrt> so do you show progress for the whole thing until you know all the answers?
<desrt> or do you fill in each category as you find it?
<Laney> I'm doing it all at once
<desrt> i assume you also dispatch the async ops at the same time
<Laney> ya
<desrt> (which is a great idea from a performance standpoint btw)
<desrt> you're pretty much doing it the correct way, then
<Laney> I just keep a counter and when they're all in then fire off the event
<Laney> which makes QML fetch the values again
<Laney> ok, thanks
<Laney> you can see the reality in a little while
<desrt> i'll be happy to take a look.  gimme a ping.
<tedg> desrt, Do you know of an easy way to go from PID to DBus bus name?
<desrt> tedg: no.
<tedg> I mean, clearly I can get the list and go through getting PIDs, but I was looking for something more elegant.
<desrt> mostly because a given PID could have multiple bus names
<tedg> Hmm, okay.
<tedg> True, I'd take an array :-)
<desrt> (and not just multiple well-known names.... but there could be multiple DBus libraries involved)
<desrt> tedg: i think you'd pretty much need to iterate over all the names on the bus, asking for PIDs and do the reverse mapping
<desrt> tedg: the good news is that it's only two roundtrips to do that...
<tedg> desrt, ?  GetConnectionUnixProcessID only takes a string?
<desrt> tedg: dispatch all of them at the same time
<tedg> desrt, Seems I'd have to call it for each.
<tedg> Oh, yes.
<desrt> the art of dbus: look for ways to decrease roundtrips
<tedg> I was thinking reducing messages.
<desrt> ya.  you're stuck on that point, unfortunately
<tedg> Still n messages.
<desrt> messages don't matter as much as context switches
<desrt> and in this case you're in luck, because you'll end up with fewer context switches than messages _and_ because you're talking to the bus daemon, so the number of switches is already halved
<tedg> Multi-core FTW!  ;-)
<desrt> ie: it's not that bad...
<tedg> Naw, it's not.  But it's a little brute force.  Was hoping there was a lookup I didn't know about.
<desrt> you could maybe propose a new API
<desrt> what are you trying to do with it?
<tedg> Unfortunately this is a "done by Tuesday" type of thing.
<desrt> lol
<tedg> Not time for that in v1.0
<desrt> looking up bus names for PIDs seems slightly suspect...
<tedg> It's okay, according the apparmor I'm "trusted" ;-)
 * desrt needs to have a chat with apparmor
<desrt>  (( "psst... don't you know this guy works for the NSA?" ))
<tedg> It's clear Ubuntu needs to switch to SELinux so I'll be trusted again!
<desrt> tedg: i mean it seems suspect from a code-smell standpoint
<tedg> desrt, I agree, and I think we should add API for it.
<tedg> desrt, But that'll obviously take longer than I have right now.
<desrt> tedg: no... i mean the desire to map PIDs to busnames is suspect
<tedg> desrt, But it can be hidden from users.
<desrt> what are you trying to do?
<tedg> desrt, Basically implement the org.freedeskop.Application calling on secondary activation for confined apps.
<tedg> desrt, But I only know PIDs
<desrt> why not just send a message to the well-known name?
<tedg> Confined apps can't have well known names.
<desrt> O_o
<ochosi> robert_ancell: we tried to debug the restart-menuitem-missing bug in lightdm a bit more, it seems to return "challange" instead of "yes"
<desrt> okay.  i don't want to know :)
<ochosi> robert_ancell: when querying "gdbus call --system --dest org.freedesktop.login1 --object-path  /org/freedesktop/login1 --method org.freedesktop.login1.Manager.CanReboot"
<robert_ancell> ochosi, huh, mine returns yes
<robert_ancell> ochosi, it might be a PolicyKit issue
<ochosi> robert_ancell: that call was run when logged out
<ochosi> robert_ancell: when logged in, it also returns "yes" for me
<desrt> tedg: how are you going to deal with processes that have multiple DBus connections?  introspection?
<tedg> desrt, Haven't decided.  Trying to decide how evil it would be to just send the message to all and have them reject.
<desrt> tedg: this is what i was talking about when i mentioned code smell :)
<tedg> desrt, I think that this is probably something we could also add to the dbus daemon, a way to query the filters of a another process.  Then we'd get "introspection" at least enough to avoid many of these cases.  Though, definitely need to think about it more.
<desrt> tedg: i think you should allow each confined app to own exactly one well-known bus name
<desrt> ie: its ID
<desrt> way easier to avoid these types of hacks this way
<tedg> desrt, We can't because we don't want confined apps to see other confined apps on the system.  Also, which connection gets to be "the" connection?
<desrt> tedg: whichever one claims the name first
<desrt> same as normal dbus rules
<desrt> except that you'd reject name ownership requests for anything but the one name that is allowed
<tedg> But then for instance my HUD might not work because it's gdbus because my qtdbus connection was faster.
<desrt> tedg: dbus doesn't work like that....
<desrt> the connection that wants to have the well-known name has to request it
<tedg> Sure, but if both of them need to be "the" connection.  Then they'll both request it.
<desrt> no...
<desrt> in the gapplication case if you have qtdbus coming up as well, only the gdbus connection will try to grab the app's well-known name
<desrt> the qtdbus connection won't -- it will remain as having only the unique name
<desrt> it doesn't matter which one comes up first
<desrt> this is already happening in (probably) dozens of apps running on your system today
<tedg> Sure, but let's say you're using GApplication and libubuntufoobar,which happens to want to be on "the connection" too.
<tedg> The problem is identity.
<tedg> They all want to be on "the" connection then.
<desrt> tedg: well-known names are added to the connection _after_ it is opened (and maybe after it has been used for a while, by other parts of the process)
<desrt> so it doesn't matter who brings up which connections, or by which library
<desrt> the name won't be acquired until GApplication tries to grab it
<tedg> I understand the dbus part here.  The issue is that both libubuntufoo and libubuntubar want to be on the connection with the well known name.
<desrt> tedg: why?
<tedg> If libubuntufoo uses a different dbus implementation than libubuntubar they can't both be there.
<desrt> tedg: that's already a problem in existing dbus
<tedg> Correct.  It is.
<desrt> and it's not a problem that we've ever really .... had a problem with
<tedg> So that's why having a wellknown name per-app doesn't help.
<desrt> tedg: unless you're doing _exceptionally_ strange things with well-known names, this just isn't a problem
<tedg> Well, there are work arounds in thing like libdee to deal with it...
<desrt> tedg: not afaik?
<desrt> libdee does fall into what i would consider an exceptionally strange use of well-known names, but it is pretty elegant, actually
<tedg> Look at how libdee registers well known names... crazy.
<desrt> libdee shares a wellknown name between multiple processes as a token
<tedg> Yes.  I know.  And it gets a lot of robustness there as well.
<desrt> indeed.  very elegant
<desrt> but certainly not the sort of thing that GApplication is doing
<desrt> and if you're forbidding well-known names entirely, you're going to break the dee case anyway
<desrt> (which may be appropriate.  i'm not commenting on that)
<tedg> Yup.  So anyway.  We're blocking well known names.  And I have to work around that in this case. :-)
<tedg> Trying to make that not suck as much as possible.
<desrt> it's going to suck lots :)
<desrt> it's also going to be super-racy
<desrt> but i guess that's the design choice you made....
<tedg> We should a NoSQL-like thing where we upload javascript snipets to the dbus-daemon to execute to make things less racy.
 * tedg solves all the problems
<tedg> ;-)
<desrt> we already have name activation.  it's pretty much the perfect tool to take care of what you're trying to take care of.
 * desrt doesn't really feel like discussing this further
<desrt> Laney: your use of a uint pointer is very strange here
<desrt> also: it's evil how the list of 4 directories is coded in one place and the number (4) is elsewhere
<desrt> rather you should have 'uint outstanding;' and do outstanding++ each time you issue a new async
<desrt> then outstanding-- when each comes in
<attente> mterry, i filed the FFe, do we basically just wait for someone from the release team to look at it?
<mterry> attente, yeah.  I suppose I can review your branch in the mean time
<attente> mterry, ok, thanks for your help
<mterry> attente, you need to handle upgrade path in case someone set gsettings and ug-keyboard is still there
<mterry> attente, and we no longer grab layouts from LightDM.  How does indicator-keyboard grab its list of available layouts?
<attente> mterry, indicator-keyboard goes to accountsservice for the user's input sources
<attente> for the upgrade path, i-keyboard is also taking the user's old keyboard layout settings and moving them to the correct gsettings key
<attente> it shouldn't be possible for the user to have both ug-keyboard and i-keyboard together at the same time, if that's what you mean?
<mterry> attente, sorry, when I said upgrade I meant with the unity-greeter patch  (i.e. please make "ug-keyboard" -> "keyboard"
<mterry> attente, someone might end up with ug-keyboard in their indicator list still
<attente> mterry, oh, ok, i misunderstood you, sorry
<attente> i'll fix it
<mterry> attente, menubar.vala:237.5-237.33: warning: method `MenuBar.cmp_layout' never used
<mterry> attente, and add it to Recommends
<attente> mterry, ok
<Laney> desrt: that is a good idea
<Laney> I knew it was evil but somehow didn't think of that
<desrt> Laney: also not sure why you used a pointer there at all
<Laney> instead of a class variable?
<desrt> Laney: no... it should ... i'm confused :)
<desrt> Laney: why didn't you just use 'uint' instead of 'uint*'?
<Laney> desrt: it goes out of scope, or do you mean why not use uint in the struct? because I want to only emit the signal once so I'm sharing the counter
 * Laney is off for now, maybe back later :-)
<Laney> have good weekends
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-09-22
<alberts> attente: are you here?
<alberts> attente: I commented on merge proposal (already merged) created by you - https://code.launchpad.net/~attente/ubuntu-themes/gtkmodelmenuitem-icon-spacing/+merge/163053
<attente> alberts, what version of light-themes do you have installed?
<attente> alberts, also what version of unity-services do you have?
<alberts> attente: light-themes version - 13.04+13.10.20130919.3-0ubuntu1
<alberts> attente: unity-services - 7.1.0+13.10.20130920-0ubuntu1
<alberts> attente: but I am not using unity, I use gnome-flashback session
<bjf> bug or feature? in saucy i'm no longer able to set my 'caps lock' to 'ctrl' with: dconf write /org/gnome/libgnomekbd/keyboard/options "['ctrl\tctrl:nocaps']"
<bjf> is there a new way to do this?
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-09-15
<pitti> Good morning
<larsu> good morning pitti!
<pitti> hey larsu! urgh, early for you!
<larsu> indeed! *yawn*
<didrocks> morning
<larsu> hi didrocks!
<didrocks> hey larsu ;)
<Sweetshark> moin all!
<didrocks> hey Sweetshark!
<willcooke> morning all
<willcooke> happy birthday seb128 & didrocks (for last week)
<didrocks> thanks a lot willcooke ;)
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<seb128> hey willcooke, thanks
 * larsu was unaware of didrocks' birthday
<larsu> didrocks: hay birthday (belated)!
<didrocks> larsu: heh, thanks :)
<Laney> grarg
<Laney> hello!
<didrocks> morning GuestLaney! :)
<willcooke> o/
<Laney> silly freenode compromise
<Laney> sup
<seb128> hey Laney, wb! had good holidays?
<Laney> yeah, very nice thanks seb128
<Laney> those guys like strong beer
<seb128> hehe
<Laney> and staying in the 'eco village' was a fun experience
<Laney> much home grown food
<Sweetshark> oh last week was french birthday week?
<willcooke> :D
<Sweetshark> congrats seb128 and didrocks, hope you had good fun partying ;)
<seb128> Sweetshark, thanks!
<didrocks> seb128: not that much partying, but thanks :)
<Sweetshark> seb128: I tried to enable lto on libreoffice on the weekend, because -36% in codesize did sound somewhat tempting ...
 * seb128 hands didrocks an IRC client
<seb128> Sweetshark, how did that go?
<didrocks> seb128: :p
<seb128> ;-)
<didrocks> too many s on this channel :)
<Sweetshark> seb128: ... sadly we broke gcc again with recent changes.
<seb128> :-/
<Sweetshark> seb128: "... now hits limit on number of sections in ELF library used by GCC ..." http://nabble.documentfoundation.org/Re-Performance-samples-for-LibreOffice-td4119856.html#a4122177
<Sweetshark> 640k sections in a ELF lib should be enough for everyone
<seb128> challenging the toolchain ;-)
<seb128> or is that trolling it?
<Sweetshark> seb128: we? trolling? never! https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-kzGk3zwiI4o/U-izLdW6PfI/AAAAAAAAEtA/H7ENAJipMNc/s0/
<Sweetshark> seb128: so lto doesnt fly for utopic (would be quite late anyway), but I just got mergedlibs back and autopkgtests seem to run now too.
<seb128> Sweetshark, k
<seb128> do you need sponsoring for something?
<Sweetshark> seb128: Hmmm, since we are at LTS+1 I should probably drop old transitionals too.
<Sweetshark> seb128: sooo, tomorrow is ETA for tagging of 4.3.2~rc2, I will be on vacation from Wednesday until the weekend. I will try to throw a release to the PPA still, if that works, we should update to utopic ~soonish then.
 * Sweetshark takes a look at utopic schedule.
<Sweetshark> (soonish: early next week)
<seb128> Laney, what's the status of that evince ffe?
<Laney> status?
<Laney> i approved it
<seb128> Laney, you were still discussing upstreaming patches and theming issues, I was unsure if you considered those as "need to be resolved prior to upload"
<Laney> just asking to look for and help to make sure theme things are fixed if there are any
<seb128> k
<seb128> so I'm going to upload
<seb128> thanks ;-)
<Laney> blarg
<Laney> seb128: can you share your source package for usd/ucc?
<Laney> I'm failing at finding or merging the branches right
<seb128> Laney, I'm using the version robert_ancell pushed in the ubuntu-desktop ppa
<Laney> oh
<Laney> didn't know it was there
<Laney> how handy
<GunnarHj> pitti: ping?
<Laney> seb128: do you have media keys?
<seb128> Laney, yes
<Laney> could you try 'mute' with the new usd please?
<Laney> that doesn't work for me now
<Laney> but down/up do
<seb128> they all 3 work for me
<Laney> hmm
<seb128> do you have any error in the upstart log?
<seb128> it's weird that those changes would have an impact on one of the keybindings only
<Laney> http://paste.ubuntu.com/8350367/ is what I see
<seb128> hum
<seb128> brb, need to restart to make sure I'm running the right version
<seb128> I've been mixing testing with the fcitx ppa version
<Laney> k, no rush, got to patch pilot now anyways
<GunnarHj> Laney: Can you please start with bug #1351092 then? ;)
<ubot5> bug 1351092 in language-selector (Ubuntu) "Configuration of the Droid Sans Fallback font" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1351092
 * Laney screams
<GunnarHj> Laney: Didn't mean to scare you...
<Laney> i never managed to understand that bug
<GunnarHj> Laney: Basically there is a config file in fonts-droid which messes up things. I want to drop it.
<Laney> GunnarHj: I get what you want to do, but I don't understand the 'sometimes' quality of the problems
<Laney> like Qt apps were wrong but gtk was alright
<Laney> seems like there's other bugs here
<seb128> Laney, works fine after a reboot
<Laney> seb128: weird
<Laney> GunnarHj: Let's upload your thing anyway since it's the way out we have now :-)
<GunnarHj> Laney: All the tests indicate that we get rid of the problems if we drop that config file. Actually the root cause might be in that file, but I'm not 100% sure.
<seb128> Laney, does it work for you if you downgrade?
<Laney> I used it earlier today
<GunnarHj> Laney: Upload, yeah! :)
 * Laney tries again
<Laney> GunnarHj: I'm mainly nervous because we don't understand exactly what is wrong and the symptoms feel like bugs elsewhere
<Laney> oh well
<seb128> Laney, the error you copied doesn't look like something that would be due to gnome-desktop code though
<seb128> it's a keysym issue
<GunnarHj> Laney: I'm not so nervous. That file is weird, and not designed for general use.
<Laney> didn't you write it?
<GunnarHj> Laney: No, I wrote another config file which we keep. I want to drop the one which is shipped from upstream.
<Laney> oh okay
<Laney> in that case you know what I want you to do :P
<GunnarHj> Laney: Indeed. Already started that.
<Laney> seb128: seems buggy with the old one too
<GunnarHj> Laney: Btw, I can do the l-s parts of the uploads if you like. If you just fix fonts-android in utopic and trusty.
<Laney> k
<seb128> Laney, that makes more sense ;-)
<seb128> Laney, new xorg issue maybe?
<Laney> actually it got more buggy now after restarting
<Laney> it uses the default actions for one of the keys instead of volume down
<Laney> one is ignored and the third one works
<seb128> you run the update again, or the utopic version?
<Laney> both are the same in this respect
<seb128> k
<Laney> it's to do with remapping
<Laney> now I remapped them none of them work any more
<Laney> :(!
<Laney> and it's even specific to these three keys - using something else works
 * Laney makes a note to look later
<ogra_> Laney, how is the gst dropping of the build-deps going ?
<ogra_> we really need that fixed before final rtm
<ogra_> (and it will take you a week to land it at least i guess)
<Laney> http://people.canonical.com/~ogra/touch-image-stats/20140913.changes
<ogra_> Laney, thats not rtm
<Laney> k
<ogra_> landing in rtm means you need an rtm silo, lots of tests and final QA signoff
<seb128> kenvandine, hey, how are you?
<kenvandine> hey seb128, have a nice long weekend?
<seb128> kenvandine, I did, thanks! Having tuesday to thursday off as well, so just around today and friday this week ;-)
<kenvandine> nice!
<seb128> Laney, larsu, didrocks, ^ btw
<kenvandine> seb128, my uitk api bump seems to work well, autopilot tests work and CI passes :)
<kenvandine> seb128, if you want to kick the tires a little on silo 19
<pitti> hello GunnarHj
<didrocks> seb128: enjoy!
<seb128> kenvandine, I just opened it, reviewing that
<Laney> seb128: more .nl?
<seb128> didrocks, thanks ;-)
<kenvandine> seb128, that's the massive sed bumping the api versions
<Laney> ogra_: I don't know how to do it
<seb128> Laney, no, .fr only this month
<kenvandine> seb128, not ready for approval yet :)
<kenvandine> i should bump the package depends, etc
<Laney> burning days then? ;-)
<seb128> kenvandine, k
<kenvandine> even though the 1.1 api has been around for a while
<kenvandine> seb128, but please do install it and do a little manual testing, see if anything's broken
<kenvandine> only thing i noticed was no line on the battery graph...
<ogra_> Laney, add a spreadsheet entry, select rtm in the "target distro" row ... and then ask for a silo
<kenvandine> but my device i'm testing it on was actually turned off for 24 hours :)
<Laney> does it get copied from utopic?
<larsu> seb128: wow, enjoy!
<kenvandine> so only only for 30m or so... might not be enough data
<seb128> Laney, yeah, I still have some 20 days to take and weather is supposed to be good and family is taking a few days off to the north sea, doing that as well
<Laney> 20!
<seb128> yeah...
<ogra_> Laney, you can either have someone from the landing team sync it in to dput yourself (target distro in changelog needs to be 14.09, not utopic)
<Laney> 6 week christmas holiday
<seb128> Laney, yeah, I took 2 in Malta and one on friday
<seb128> lol
<ogra_> seb128, how wasteful !
<seb128> hehe
 * ogra_ still has all his vacation days for this year 
<Laney> you guys...
 * Laney will take the remainder when moving house in a few weeks
<seb128> kenvandine, should https://code.launchpad.net/~chipaca/ubuntu-system-settings/push-helper-to-spec/+merge/234311 be set back to approved? seems like Ted comment was not accurate/shouldn't be a blocker
 * ogra_ will take his when he doesnt think about phones all day anymore 
<kenvandine> seb128, sure, i'll be glad to land that :)
<kenvandine> seb128, i was about to land it when tedg commented
<seb128> kenvandine, you said the uitk api bump is not ready for review?
<GunnarHj> Hi pitti! Time for a couple of lanpack-locales things?
<kenvandine> so i put the brakes on... i even had tested it in the silo
<kenvandine> seb128, not quite, i want a few people to do a bit of manual testing
<seb128> kenvandine, I'm going to do manual testing now
<kenvandine> thanks
<seb128> kenvandine, it's a silo you said?
<kenvandine> 19
<kenvandine> yes
<kenvandine> i marked it experimental :)
<kenvandine> although, i'm pretty pleased that it seems to work
<kenvandine> i was really fearful bumping those imports :)
<pitti> GunnarHj: just ask away; I'm not feeling too well today, so only checking IRC sporadically
<GunnarHj> pitti: Ok, it's this to be more precise:
<GunnarHj> pitti: I'm about to propose the addition of a new (ce_RU) locale, so it would be good if you first could upload the patch at bug #214730.
<ubot5> bug 214730 in langpack-locales (Ubuntu) "Incorrect date format in en_CA.utf8 locale" [Low,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/214730
<GunnarHj> pitti: Also, when talking about langpack-locales, could you please read the latest comment at bug #1090288.
<ubot5> bug 1090288 in langpack-locales (Ubuntu) "The locale file for en_ZA appears to have an error" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1090288
<GunnarHj> pitti: Hope you get better soon!
<seb128> kenvandine, hum
<seb128> kenvandine, https://launchpad.net/~ci-train-ppa-service/+archive/ubuntu/landing-019 is empty?
<kenvandine> whoops
<kenvandine> 20 :)
<kenvandine> i had 19 and 20... got them confused :)
<seb128> kenvandine, that's better ;-)
<seb128> kenvandine, seems to work fine! I'm going to keep playing a bit with it though
<seb128> but first going away for some exercice, bbiab
<kenvandine> seb128, thx!
<Laney> GunnarHj: where's the trusty diff/branch?
<GunnarHj> Laney: I didn't make a separate for trusty since it's identical. Thought you could just change the version number.
<Laney> k
<Trevinho> seb128: hey, can you care of https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/ubuntu/utopic/ubuntu-meta/add-emoji-support/+merge/234140 ?
<GunnarHj> Laney: i.e. it's fonts-android which are identical in utopic and trusty, not language-selector. But I can take care of the latter.
<Laney> GunnarHj: I got it
<Laney> GunnarHj: I added a maintscript to remove the obsolete conffile
<Laney> uploading now
<GunnarHj> Laney: Ok. I concluded that it wasn't necessary, but it can't hurt of course. Thanks!
<happyaron> Laney: can you do an upload for ubuntukylin-meta? just removed an odd package from it.
<Laney> ok, sec
 * happyaron sent packageset inclusion request to devel-permission just now
<happyaron> great
<Laney> let me just add that
<Laney> and you can do it
<happyaron> ok
<happyaron> for changing the seeds, is commiting the change to bzr enough? or there's something else to do
<Laney> here
<Laney> there*
<Laney> download the source package and run the ./update script in there
<willcooke> happyaron, are you an Ubuntu member BTW?  FJKong is just starting the process now
<Laney> then build it, check the diff  & upload
<happyaron> willcooke: yes I do, I think I'm a member since 2009
<willcooke> happyaron, :) cool!
<Laney> old skool
<willcooke> happyaron, in which case I think FJKong might be asking for you to write him a recommendation
<willcooke> :)
<happyaron> Laney: ok, so can you add the seeds to packageset as well?
<happyaron> willcooke: sure
<Laney> that doesn't make sense
<Laney> the seeds themselves are just a bzr branch
<Laney> which you get access to via team membership
<happyaron> Laney: so I pushed the changes for ubuntukylin seeds, is that sufficient?
<Laney> do the ./update thing I just said and then upload the package you get out of that
<happyaron> ok
<happyaron> let me see
<Laney> Guest11861: done
<Laney> erm, not you Guest11861
<Laney> GunnarHj: ^^^
<happyaron> Laney: well you mean ubuntukylin-meta, what about ubuntukylin.utopic, I think they are different?
<Laney> that's the seed branch which you already pushed to
<happyaron> ok
<GunnarHj> Laney: Thanks! Then I'll complete it with the l-s part.
<Laney> cool stuff
<Laney> hope it fixes everything ...
<GunnarHj> Laney: Me to. ;)
<pitti> GunnarHj: I uploaded the patch for bug 214730
<ubot5> bug 214730 in langpack-locales (Ubuntu) "Incorrect date format in en_CA.utf8 locale" [Low,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/214730
<GunnarHj> pitti: Thanks!
<pitti> GunnarHj: as for the en_CA decimal comma, I'm afraid I don't have a qualified or strong opinion there; TBH I lost track when to use the comma and when the dot, but whatever the govt and majority of people use is what locales should have, independent of Qt bugs
<GunnarHj> pitti: I agree, and that speaks for dropping our Ubuntu patch. I'll get back with a patch about it.
<Laney> hey LocutusOfBorg1, I'm curious about the cairo merge - what change is it bringing us?
<LocutusOfBorg1> Laney, unfortunately nothing anymore
<Laney> looked that way
<LocutusOfBorg1> the latest debian changes elided the previous ones :)
<LocutusOfBorg1> so when I opened it there were a difference
<LocutusOfBorg1> (preventing even wxpython to be built)
 * Laney nods
<Laney> shall I de-sponsorify it?
<LocutusOfBorg1> after that we fixed the wx stuff
<Laney> I did sponsor webkit though, so not a waste of time completely
<Laney> thanks for that ;- )
<Laney> longface
<LocutusOfBorg1> mmm
<LocutusOfBorg1> yes, it is fine
<LocutusOfBorg1> :)
<LocutusOfBorg1> (I was wondering about a conflict between versions)
<Laney> those Breaks wouldn't have been necessary anyway
<Laney> but still, free webkit bump, can't say no to that
<LocutusOfBorg1> :)
<seb128> Trevinho, hey, that might need a ffe, check with Laney
<Laney> mysterious message!
<seb128> Laney, see his ping around 13:53utc
<LocutusOfBorg1> Laney, I didn't get the debdiff change
<LocutusOfBorg1> build for ppc64el
<LocutusOfBorg1> is not a change in ubuntu... (the debian package already builds for ppc64el AFAICS)
<seb128> Laney, new font adding to the seed
<Laney> LocutusOfBorg1: oops, didn't delete it
<Laney> never mind
<LocutusOfBorg1> if it is just a changelog problem is fine for me ;)
<Laney> I actually copied it from the old merge changelog
<Laney> because I put the changes into my git repo
<Laney> so yeah
<LocutusOfBorg1> lol :)
<LocutusOfBorg1> np
<Laney> seb128: yeah feel free
<seb128> kenvandine, the new abi changes seem to work fine to me, +1
<seb128> kenvandine, btw, what do you plan to work on next for settings?
<kenvandine> seb128, great
<kenvandine> finishing up the update stuff
<kenvandine> well "finishing" is loosely defined :)
<seb128> yeah
<kenvandine> my singleton branch is working really well
<seb128> gatox is back also no?
<seb128> you should make sure you don't duplicate work ;-)
<gatox> seb128, yes.... i'm working in the display errors bugs
<seb128> gatox, k, great, kenvandine is working on the update count not refreshed issues
<kenvandine> seb128, for the updates in the main view, how do you feel about maybe not checking for updates right away, but check after some period of time if the check was done in the updates page?
<kenvandine> gatox, hey... you're back!
<gatox> kenvandine, yes, i saw you fixed A LOT of stuff..... great!
<kenvandine> seb128, that way it doesn't show up there right away
<kenvandine> and if you go into the upates page which triggers a check
<kenvandine> the main view doesn't ever need to check
<seb128> kenvandine, you mean if you go to update, then back on the main view, then wait there?
<seb128> kenvandine, I guess that's ok, but not very useful either
<kenvandine> i mean add a timer, like 60 seconds for the updates available entry
<kenvandine> and if you happen to do anything that triggers a check
<kenvandine> it'll not need to check itself
<kenvandine> otherwise it will ?
<seb128> kenvandine, not sure it makes sense to check after a bit
<kenvandine> seb128, an easy way to improve the experience for right now
<seb128> who is going to open settings to sit on the main grid for a minute?
<kenvandine> well if you go into settings for some other reason
<kenvandine> maybe tweak sounds
<kenvandine> then back out to the main view
<kenvandine> they'll be showing
<seb128> check with mpt I guess
<seb128> he might find the inconsistency worth than doing nothing
<seb128> like "why was there no update, and I visited something and came back and now they are, couldn't it check the first time"
<kenvandine> mpt, ^^
<didrocks> enough for today, see you tomorrow guys
<seb128> I would just disable the auto check
<kenvandine> good night didrocks
<seb128> didrocks, have a good evening!
<kenvandine> that's what i had done
<kenvandine> then if you go into updates
<didrocks> see you kenvandine, enjoy your almost-week-off seb128 :)
<kenvandine> and back out
<kenvandine> you see the count
<seb128> didrocks, thanks :-)
<seb128> kenvandine, that works for me
<kenvandine> ideally we'd have the emblem or whatever
<seb128> right
<kenvandine> but that isn't as quick of a fix :)
<seb128> kenvandine, I can have a look to bug #1368920 if you want
<ubot5> bug 1368920 in ubuntu-system-settings (Ubuntu) "Icons for scopes are not displayed in the storage list" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1368920
<kenvandine> seb128, that would be great
<seb128> kenvandine, k, take over this one then (and I'm going to look at well at making about use libclick rather than the click command line)
<seb128> kenvandine, ups, I just noticed it was assigned by Pat to Jonas, checking with him as well
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-09-16
<pitti> Good morning
<willcooke> tkamppeter, I've just emailed the printer guys from last week
<didrocks> morning willcooke
<willcooke> hey didrocks
 * willcooke grumble grumble 
<willcooke> early start again
<willcooke> I need more sleep :)
 * didrocks does the first real pull requests review on a non small feature addition by a contributor on udtc!
<willcooke> \o/
<larsu> morning guys!
<willcooke> hey larsu
<didrocks> hey larsu
<Guest45203> Guest45203 has arrived!
<Laney> phew
<larsu> hi Laney  :)
<willcooke> hi Laney
<didrocks> morning Laney
<Laney> morning chaps
<Laney> how goes?
<willcooke> is good
<larsu> good good
<GunnarHj> Sweetshark: Hi BjÃ¶rn, any chance that you can upload bug #1308771? You assigned yourself to it 3 months ago, so the sponsors seem to be disinclined to interfere.
<ubot5> bug 1308771 in libreoffice-dictionaries (Ubuntu) "Update Swedish spellcheck and hyphenation dictionaries" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1308771
<willcooke> didrocks, what do you think > >>  We have a meeting on Friday with the Community team re: developer desktop, should we cancel the meeting today with Jorge?
<didrocks> willcooke: yeah, no need to ETOOMANYMEETINGS, and we have our catchup tomorrow anyway
<willcooke> :D
<willcooke> FJKong, happyaron, can you let me have an email with your updates for the meeting in before your EOD (unless you are coming to the meeting)
<Sweetshark> GunnarHj: Sorry, getting LibreOffice itself to 4.3 in utopic had priority. Will look into it today, note however I dont have any upload rights whatsoever anyway.
<mitya57> sil2100: ping about lp:~mitya57/appmenu-qt5/lp1362104
<sil2100> mitya57: hey! On my radar, just being overwhelmed by landing team stuff - will look into it today I hope
<sil2100> mitya57: sorry about that
<Sweetshark> willcooke: you recently told me you updated my name in hr tools. Possibly as a sideeffect this broke my login on some hr-tools. The syncs there seem to be very fragile and cant seem to be able to decide if my first name only has a 'o' or an 'oe'.
<Laney> "Some German Guy"
 * ogra_ doesnt see an oe in Sweetshark 
<Sweetshark> willcooke: and no Im not seeing ghosts, this is with creds from a pw-manager -- and it used to work yesterday morning, but not yesterday evening. still doesnt work with the stored combo today, but I accidentally found it working with the other account name.
<Sweetshark> ogra_: I really dont want to try to convince hr about that account name. ;)
<ogra_> hehe
<willcooke> hrm
<GunnarHj> Sweetshark: Well, upload help is what I'm asking for. pitti uploaded to Utopic in June, and jdstrand reviewed it 1+ month ago and was about to upload to Trusty, but raised a question which I addressed.
<Laney> GunnarHj: sounds like you need a patch pilot :-)
<Sweetshark> willcooke: fwiw, hr says this is likely not coming from your change. Which may very well be, I have seen that before, but not yet in such a clean cut "works in the morning, failed later" with the same stored pw.
<GunnarHj> Laney: Right. Are you still in duty?
<Laney> nope
<GunnarHj> :(
<Laney> but give me the link again and I'll look in a bit
<Laney> Good Guy Laneyâ¢
<GunnarHj> Laney: bug #1308771
<ubot5> bug 1308771 in libreoffice-dictionaries (Ubuntu) "Update Swedish spellcheck and hyphenation dictionaries" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1308771
<GunnarHj> Laney: TIA
<Laney> --build-dep-resolver=aptitude â¥
<marga> Trevinho, lots of confirmations that the packages fix the issues, no much news regarding other issues I mentioned.  When do you expect these to get SRUed?
<tkamppeter> willcooke, great, thanks.
<mitya57> sil2100: no problem, we still have some time before the release
<Trevinho> marga: we've a SRU waiting for some tests, so I think we need to plan that for the next one...
<Trevinho> marga: so, some weeks probably
<Trevinho> marga: but I can see if we can speed up things
<marga> Trevinho, "some" = ?
<marga> Trevinho, three? six? ten?
<Trevinho> well, considering that there are a lot of fixes to land, I guess it might be something like 5
<marga> Trevinho, does your first comment mean that there will be a release between now and then that is higher than the current and doesn't include the fix?
<Trevinho> marga: however I'm seeing if we can move that fix and others to the upcoming SRU instead
<Trevinho> marga: yes, the SRU is mostly "ready", but waiting in a silo for being released...
<marga> Trevinho, I see.
<marga> ETA for that?
<didrocks> darkxst: commented on libmediaart MIR
<didrocks> darkxst: globally, +1 for me, but it would be nice to enable unit tests (they are disabled in debian/rules and no information in debian/changelog about why they are disabled)
<Trevinho> marga: I can't say much about that, just guess... bregma knows more
<marga> Trevinho, do you have an isolated patch for the missing-prompt bug?
<marga> If the SRU comes without the fix, I could re-apply and re-build with the patch.
<Trevinho> marga: yep, the fix itself is in https://code.launchpad.net/~andyrock/unity/fix-1308540
<Trevinho> marga: this branch https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/unity/single-lock-input instead has both the SRU and the fix
<marga> ok.
<willcooke> hrm.
<willcooke> I have a potentially v. important meeting @ the same time as our weekly
<willcooke> didrocks, would you mind being chair today?
<larsu> Saviq: hey, why bug #1365408 ?
<ubot5> bug 1365408 in webbrowser-app (Ubuntu) "Should ship a PNG icon instead of using the theme" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1365408
<larsu> it doesn't give a rationale
 * desrt notes that the icon theme is cached
<larsu> it does give problems with looking up symbolic icons
<desrt> which is a good way to avoid calling stat() a whole lot
<desrt> ...which is nice, since things that try to open one app icon for display have a tendency to follow that by opening _all_ app icons for display
<renatu> larsu, hi
<larsu> renatu: nice nick
<renatu> :D
<desrt> larsu: he's in the imperative today
<larsu> desrt: lol
<larsu> renatu: waiting for Saviq to join
<renatu> somebody took my "renato"
<ogra_> larsu, isnt he on vacation ?
<larsu> ogra_: is he? He's online...
<ogra_> there was a mail ...
<larsu> indeed. thanks ogra_
<larsu> desrt, renatu: not sure who we should talk to now. He didn't specify an "icons" contact :P
<renatu> :D
<desrt> the desktop file spec (at least in so far as glib implements it) already allows specifying an absolute path for icons, so there's no problem there
<desrt> the only question is if this is actually a good idea or not, and i think the answer is 'no'
<desrt> at least not if you plan for this to be the normal case in any way
<larsu> desrt: even if you use that, there's no fallback
<larsu> which we would need for the -symbolic case
<larsu> or we could introduce X-SymbolicIcon
<larsu> which is a bit ugly and would require i-messages to open the desktop file again (it uses appinfo right now)
<desrt> i think rather you should have some mechanism for these sort of things to get automatically bailed out of apps (click packages or otherwise) to a common cache directory where an index can be built
<desrt> desktop files, icons, whatever else
<desrt> larsu: appinfo has an arbitrary-key query api now
<desrt> g_desktop_app_info_get_string()
<larsu> desrt: cool thanks
<larsu> renatu: ^^
<larsu> desrt: this cache directory would be the theme?
<desrt> one would certainly imagine wanting to structure it in precisely this way
<renatu> larsu, remember that click package can not write outside his own dir
<desrt> in order to reuse all of the existing logic
<larsu> renatu: the click package wouldn't write, rather the installer would extract it
<larsu> we're already doing that for desktop files, no?
<desrt> gsettings schemas also come to mind
<larsu> and gsettings schemas
<larsu> ha, lag makes me look slow ;)
<desrt> larsu: beer, etc.
<larsu> yep
<larsu> I hope the etc. involves more beer
<desrt> the 'etc.' involves me not actually caring, but not wanting to be called on it myself :)
<renatu> larsu, I do not know, how the installers works
<larsu> desrt: I have the feeling this will be one of those fights not worth fighting...^^
<desrt> fine by me... just wanted to give my opinion: absolute icon paths may be bad for performance, and have trouble with dealing with symbolic icons
<larsu> right, this is what they're stumbling across right now
<desrt> it also doesn't allow overriding icons, which may be desireable in some cases
<larsu> unlikely for apps
<larsu> but yeah, maybe for the built-in ones?!
<renatu> larsu, desrt, we should not have any .deb file in the future they want to move all apps to click packages
<renatu> even the dialer, messaging and contacts
<desrt> renatu: sounds like a bad idea to me....
<renatu> yeah I know
<desrt> you want as much of the core OS as possible to be in the readonly system image
<renatu> but this is the plan
<desrt> not installed in the same way as add-on apps
<larsu> and update the whole thing when an app changes?
<desrt> larsu: yes
<larsu> yeah I can see that
<desrt> the only really sane thing to do is some sort of android-type hybrid scheme where the app lives in the core image but can get updates installed
<desrt> which you hope won't happen too often
<desrt> ie: maybe my android tablet now has 4 or 5 google apps with updates installed -- that doesn't include the dialer
<larsu> right
<larsu> renatu: I guess this is very urgent?
<larsu> I can make indicator-messages read X-Ubuntu-SymbolicIcon, which would help for now
<renatu> larsu, this will be nice
<larsu> I think appending -symbolic is the wrong thing to do, because it doesn't have a fallback
<larsu> adding an additional key which only indicator-messages knows about is a bit gross though
<renatu> larsu, but we will keep the current behavior for themed icons?
<larsu> I'll make a note on the bug
<larsu> renatu: yes. This is only for file icons
<renatu> ok nice
<larsu> man, now you made me hate this again
<renatu> kkk
<renatu> larsu, btw I think this key should have priorities over everything
<larsu> desrt: thanks for your input
<larsu> renatu: it will
<renatu> for example if you are using a themed icon but you specified a X-Ubuntu-SymbolicIcon it should use it
<renatu> ok nice
<renatu> thanks
<didrocks> willcooke: oh, sure!
<willcooke> thx didrocks - I'll forward you the notes from the others
<didrocks> yw
<mitya57> charles: hi, you approved my indicator-session MP, do you know why the CI/merge wasn't triggered?
<GunnarHj> Laney: Where did that Good Guy go? ;)
<larsu> good guy? Seb?
<GunnarHj> larsu: Nah, it was Laney who claimed to be the one. :)
<larsu> ah, I thought you were asking him for the good guy (excluding him)
<Laney> right here, babes
<Laney> I said "a bit", be patient a little longer please
<GunnarHj> Laney: Ok.
<didrocks> Ok, seems it's this time of the week already! Meeting time!
<willcooke> thx didrocks
<didrocks> attente_, desrt, FJKong, Laney, larsu, quengho, Sweetshark, tkamppeter: meeting! I hope I didn't forget anybody.
<willcooke> bbiab
<willcooke> well, I'll be here, but PTP
<willcooke> OTP
<didrocks> no worry willcooke ;)
<FJKong> ha
<didrocks> everybody's all right? Will has a typical manager excuse to not chair this meeting (like another conflicting meeting and he likes the others more than us ;)) and seb128 is slac^W^W^W^Won vacations.
 * desrt thinks didrocks doesn't know what ^W does
 * larsu thinks didrocks meant ^H
<Laney> (H)
<desrt> didrocks: you're in charge, then?
<willcooke> trololololol
<didrocks> desrt: yep :)
<desrt> didrocks: you're doing a bad job.
<desrt> didrocks: get moving!
<didrocks> ahah, let's start then, attente_?
<larsu> I should point out the obvious bias towards French people who are running this meeting
<desrt> larsu: ya... will isn't fooling anyone with that british-sounding name of his...
<desrt> that extra 'e' on the end is instantly suspect.... like the concorde
<attente_> hey
<larsu> desrt: 2/3 is already a bias....
<attente_> failed to fix sync issues between fcitx and u-s-d
<attente_> so instead switched i-keyboard and u-s-d to use fcitx' current IME instead, and disabling per-window behaviour in i-keyboard, it's in the transition PPA
<attente_> modifying the u-c-c region panel UI to use fcitx' per-window behaviour instead
<attente_> (eof)
<Laney> whip these rebels into line
<larsu> *** willcooke is now known as willconcorde
<didrocks> thanks attente_
<didrocks> desrt: instead of trolling, anything to share with us? ;)
<desrt> didrocks: ya... i ended up fixing that inotify poll-every-4-seconds issue with desktop files
<desrt> i also did a systemd-shim release, but found out that although the problem with cgroups is solved logind is not properly GCing the session
<didrocks> excellent! ready for utopic?
<desrt> ya.. it's in the glib release that went out yesterday, in fact
<didrocks> great :)
<desrt> am still working on the systemd-shim issues unfortunately... i figured out the root cause, but it's one of those things that every step i take to make us more correctly implement the systemd interface causes some other part of logind to increase its expectations
<desrt> that's all, more or less
<desrt> larsu, Laney: would appreciate some confirmation on the desktop polling fix
<desrt> once it lands
<Laney> i didn't follow the issue
<larsu> sure
<Laney> but okay, given a pointer
<desrt> Laney: basically, if you have an app that accesses a desktop file, it will thereafter poll every 4 seconds
<desrt> due to the fact that we expect /usr/local/share/applications to exist, and it doesn't
<desrt> so it checks every 4 seconds to see if it was created (thanks inotify)
<desrt> so now we have a workaround that monitors parent directories instead
<larsu> desrt: I can't reproduce this on my system btw
<desrt> larsu: got /usr/local/share/applications?
<larsu> desrt: ya...
<desrt> is your XDG_DATA_DIRS set to something else?
<didrocks> mystery solved then :)
<desrt> oh wait.  ya.
<desrt> it won't happen if you have this, clearly :p
<larsu> desrt: I read this wrong of course. I have dirs that are not in XDG_DATA_DIRS
<larsu> whatevs, can deal with later
<desrt> larsu: let's chat in detail after :)
<didrocks> ok, let's get larsu/Laney reproduce it with some unexisting folders and confirming the fix :)
<desrt> (done)
<didrocks> let's move on
<didrocks> thanks desrt, great work :)
<didrocks> FJKong: your turn!
<FJKong> do some research on Nautilus about Searching and find gnome-search-tool is good tool for advance searching
<FJKong> reading source code of Nautilus
<FJKong> learn about type-ahead find and recursive search
<FJKong> analyze core dump of fcitx 100% problem
<FJKong> that'all I think
<desrt> FJKong: what is your goal here?
<didrocks> FJKong: do you think you start to get a grip on the nautilus code?
<FJKong> I need to look the search of nautilus
<FJKong> because NUDT want to add some feature on it
<FJKong> if anyone have more experience, give me some help
<didrocks> desrt: basically, we try to check if we can bind nautilus for the Kylin version needs instead of them switching to another file manager and diverging from bare ubuntu
<didrocks> (as we stick with nautilus in ubuntu itself for the context)
<FJKong> they want to use nemo
<desrt> more people upset with search functionality in nautilus?  i can scarcely believe it...
<desrt> FJKong: good luck :)
<didrocks> FJKong: if you need any help, you can ask on the channel generally
<desrt> FJKong: and let me know if you need any help
<didrocks> we are quite some people having touched the nautilus code
<desrt> <--
<FJKong> that's very nice
 * didrocks as well (even if it's only ubuntu patches) ;)
<didrocks> so yeah, do not hesitate!
<desrt> who wrote our own search patch?
<desrt> the one about restoring typeahead?
<desrt> seems to be quite relevent...
<didrocks> desrt: I didn't touch the search, but other parts
<didrocks> desrt: and Kylin has other needs that only search
<FJKong> desrt: actually they want to add filter by date
<didrocks> we can talk about it offline anyway
<desrt> FJKong: ugh.
<FJKong> now nautilus only support search by name
<FJKong> I am not sure why upstream doesn't support this
<didrocks> FJKong: let's talk about it after the meeting about the needs, seems like desrt is interested in the topic and that can takes time :)
<didrocks> thanks FJKong
<FJKong> k
<FJKong> thaks
<didrocks> Laney: anything to share even if you are back from holidays?
<Laney> oh yeah some things
<Laney> â¢ v short week
<Laney> â¢ Upload gstreamer-bad merge, try to figure out how to upload to rtm
<Laney> â¢ Poke at dmb packageset script, make some updates for xubuntu
<Laney> â¢ Test and sync glib
<Laney> â¢ Review robert_ancell's PPA & hint to file FFe
<Laney> â¢ Package new wallpapers and upload (in NEW, hint hint)
<Laney> â¢ Review mvo's change to dh_girepository & upload it, run test rebuild in experimental, https://people.debian.org/~laney/gi-ma/
<Laney> â¢ Review some FFes
<Laney> â¢ Patch pilot
<Laney> â¯
<didrocks> Laney: oh, planning to break gstreamer again on the phone? (j/k) ;)
<Laney> there was never a first time :-)
 * didrocks notes the NEW hint hint
 * didrocks will exchange against a FFe later on :p
<didrocks> thanks Laney and welcome back!
<Laney> ty
<didrocks> qengho: around?
<qengho> Hey!
<qengho> * im-progress: Releasing 37.0.2062.120. Tried switching to uptream-prefered compiler clang, but #security talked me into reverting to gcc.
<qengho> * new flash pepper-plugin version. In stage ppa.
<qengho> * todo: cr/mir testing. didn't do any last week.
<qengho> EOF
<qengho> "in-"
<didrocks> qengho: is it a lot more work to not compile with clang?
<JackYu> Laney, so busy:)
<qengho> didrocks: not more work, just ripping out some gcc-4.9 dodges, but it requires a lot of testing.
<qengho> didrocks: oh, I misunderstood your question. No additional work to keep gcc for now.
<didrocks> qengho: ok. If that begins to be an issue, I think we should have some vUDS session around it. I can see more and more project switching to clang
<didrocks> thanks qengho
<didrocks> next on the list is Sweetshark!
<qengho> So sad that I didn't even have to say what package.  :(
<larsu> hah :D
<didrocks> hum, seems no Sweetsharkâ¦
<didrocks> Sweetshark: reminder about https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libreoffice-dictionaries/+bug/1308771 btw, for SRU :)
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1308771 in libreoffice-dictionaries (Ubuntu) "Update Swedish spellcheck and hyphenation dictionaries" [Medium,In progress]
<didrocks> tkamppeter: around or do you want me to paste your report in case you were not there?
<didrocks> let's paste tkamppeter's summary
<didrocks>  - system-config-printer: Investigations on why the auto-download of
<didrocks> drivers stopped working.
<didrocks> - system-config-printer: Uploaded new GIT snapshot with many Python3
<didrocks> transition fixes.
<didrocks> - OpenPrinting web site: Phone meeting with Jeff Licquia on updating the
<didrocks> server and fixing some problems.
<didrocks> - Bugs.
<didrocks> I have some from TheMuso as well:
<didrocks> * More research on Section 508, and found a couple of sites that give deacent summaries of what it is all about. http://www.accessibletech.com/dw/508explained.html - Focuses on web content and http://www.access-board.gov/guidelines-and-standards/communications-and-it/about-the-section-508-standards/guide-to-the-section-508-standards
<didrocks> * Research CVAA, and don't think it is relevant to us. Summary at http://www.coataccess.org/node/9776 and more info at https://www.ssbbartgroup.com/blog/2013/05/14/cvaa-series-cvaa-overview/
<didrocks> * Finished iteration 1 of the a11y community wiki docs rewrite, only covered unity so far, still need to rewrite GNOME docs, so have removed them for now. https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Accessibility
<tkamppeter> I am here, but you were faster.
<didrocks> :)
<didrocks> Some from Robert now:
<didrocks> Worked on:
<didrocks> - Released lightdm 1.11.9
<didrocks> - Backported multi-seat, Mir container sessions to LightDM 1.10
<didrocks> - Released simple-scan 3.13.92
<didrocks> - Fixed FTBFS for empathy
<didrocks> - Bug triage, fixing
<didrocks> - Booked flights to the sprint
<didrocks>  Currently working on:
<didrocks> - Preparing LightDM 1.10.2 release and SRU
<didrocks> - FFE for u-s-d/u-c-c changes
<didrocks> - Bug fixing for utopic release
<didrocks>  Not blocked on anything.
 * larsu feels left out
<didrocks> oh larsu! please share :)
<didrocks> larsu: no worry, still 2 to go then ;)
<larsu> - themes: new evince uses a headerbar for its toolbar (thanks to seb). Theme that correctly and review sebs patches
<larsu> - reviewed desrts gdesktopappinfo-polls-too-much patch
<larsu> - discuss symbolic icons for click packages and make a preliminary patch for indicator-messages
<larsu> - my uitk icon theme branch finally landed, so I could update and merge unity8 and ubuntu-system-settings patches that use the Icon instead of StatusIcon component
<larsu> - that icon theme patch from last week was missing tests, started working on those
<larsu> didrocks: right, I thought you were going by the initial ping order
<larsu> eof
<didrocks> larsu: I was, but Laney posted work for 2 persons, so I skipped over you (reasonable excuse? :p)
<larsu> haha, definitely
<larsu> Laney: stop making us look bad!
<Laney> dude
<Laney> just use bullet points in tomboy
<Laney> it makes anyone look good
 * larsu install tomboy
<desrt> larsu: enjoy your VM
<didrocks> nice work on the themes larsu :)
<didrocks> but -1 for installing tomboy :p
<Laney> â¢ breathed in
<Laney> â¢ breathed out
<Laney> â¢ slept a few times
<Laney> â¢ went to the pub
<desrt> Laney: productive week!
<Laney> SEE!
<didrocks> heh
<desrt> the points are very professional!
 * larsu is blown away
<didrocks> ok, on the list to paste, I have happyaron's one:
<desrt> Laney: i'm concerned that you appear not to have showered or brushed your teeth...
<didrocks>  1. Reviewed and uploaded:
<didrocks> 1) indicator-china-weather
<didrocks> 2) UKSC
<didrocks> 3) unity-china-music-scope
<didrocks> 4) fcitx-qimapnel
<didrocks> 2. in progress:
<Laney> didn't want to make you all look bad by overachieving
<didrocks>  1) fcitx-qimpanel: need to send removal request of fcitx-qimpanel-configtool
<didrocks> 2) Fcitx MIR: still waiting for new upstream release of fcitx, which
<didrocks> has included most of necessary changes for unity integration
<didrocks> 3) got upload permission of ubuntukylin-meta package, upload pending
<didrocks> 4) ubuntukylin-default-settings changes
<didrocks>  3. TBD:
<didrocks> 1) ubuntukylin-wallpapers: wait NUDT for the contest to finish
<didrocks> 2) youker-assistant: wait NUDT for new release
<didrocks> 3) wait for the mentioned release of chinese-calendar from NUDT
<didrocks> (this guy should use bullet points!)
<didrocks> k, finally mine (with last minute bullet points):
<didrocks> â¢ Blog post on how to contribute to ubuntu developer tools center. Got quite a lot of great feedback, a bunch of bug reports/suggestions on github. Spending some time to handle and triage those.
<didrocks> â¢ We got already one external contribution (readme fix!) and a bigger one (eclipse support) is coming from another awesome contributor! Spent some time tutoring/reviewing/giving examples.
<didrocks> â¢ Implemented framework removal support (in trunk for now)
<didrocks> â¢ Imlemented eclipse android (ADT) support to serve as an example (in a branch for now)
<didrocks> â¢ Switch to certified docker images now that their server-side bug is fixed
<didrocks> â¢ Some refactoring, cleanup and numerous additional tests (running daily)
<didrocks> â¢ Minor bug fixes on reinstalling
<didrocks> â¢ libmediaart MIR review.
<didrocks> â¢ working with IS to be able to run medium tests on the CI DC.
<didrocks> â¢ Next: file a FFe (one eclipse support and ADT are merged in) for next release in utopic and give that to kind Laney ;)
<didrocks> EOF
<larsu> didrocks: your bullet points are, like, so amazing
<desrt> larsu: i disagree
<desrt> bullet points and periods at the ends of sentences don't mix.  noob error.
<didrocks> larsu: yeah, I so copied them fromâ¦ Laney ;)
<didrocks> anything else to share?
<didrocks> reminder: book your flights from next sprint if you didn't already
<larsu> desrt: I ws talking about the bullet points only, not general typography. You probably also wouldn't say "no, because the shoes don't match" after I compliment someone's hair
<Laney> this meeting has had a higher than average proportion devoted to trolling
<Laney> i like it
<larsu> no seb128...
<didrocks> ok, it seems nothing more than trolls in the air, time to wrap up, thanks everyone!
<desrt> Laney: welcome back
<didrocks> willcooke: end of meeting (if you copy and paste to the NZ/Australia guys)
<willcooke> thx didrocks, all
<Laney> thanks!
<desrt> would it be a huge disaster for us if kylin just used nemo?
<desrt> would it be more maintainership work or something?
<FJKong> desrt: ok we turn to file manager topic
<desrt> because as it is i think a lot of these requirements (requests?) are going to generate huge deltas vs. upstream and result in more work anyway
<Laney> not sure if it's better given that they want to patch the shit out of either of them
<desrt> although some of them could be helpful -- the relabel filesystems, for example
<FJKong> we won't turn to nemo in short time, is that true?
<desrt> ubuntu desktop generally?  no.
<desrt> won't happen any time soon
<desrt> maybe never...
<desrt> probably we'd stick with nautilus until we have something redone for unity8 in qml, for example...
<didrocks> Laney: NEWed (in main of course). Remember about it when I'll file this FFe, just saying :p
<Laney> thanks ;-)
<didrocks> yw
<didrocks> desrt: sounds like the plausible plan, yeah
<FJKong> NUDT will use nautilus in community verion and nemo for pre-install
<didrocks> desrt: maybe we should still patch at least the features that makes sense to us (and propose them upstream for sure)?
<desrt> didrocks: like bringing back the tree directory view?  good luck with that proposal...
<FJKong> so maybe they want me add some feature on nautilus and they will do on namo and maintain by themself
<didrocks> desrt: not that one, but the relabel filesystem
<didrocks> desrt: I'm not sure we want the tree directory in ubuntu for instance
<desrt> ya... relabel is totally cool, of course, if someone wants to do the work
<FJKong> didrocks: relabel filesystem means you can rename label of filesystem?
<desrt> i'll even volunteer to review the patch and help get it upstream
<desrt> FJKong: yes.  it's possible to do this using a dbus API via udisks, with polkit integration
<desrt> i think upstream would take such a patch
<desrt> org.freedesktop.UDisks2.Filesystem.SetLabel on the block_device object, fwiw
<FJKong> desrt: could you tell me some more detail on searching in nautilus?
<desrt> FJKong: i don't know much on this area other than to have an opinion that search-by-date is probably not a completely awesome feature
<desrt> particularly "by last accessed time" is completely unreliable
<desrt> which is why this feature was removed in the first place
<FJKong> desrt: to be honest, I never use search by date
<FJKong> I think in nautilus searching by name is enough for me
<FJKong> If I need to find, maybe I will use find in terminal.
<didrocks> willcooke: FYI, seems google is going the docker path (http://www.dartosphere.org/2014/09/16/docker-images-for-dart-now-available.html)
<didrocks> willcooke: they start to have quite a lot of images: https://registry.hub.docker.com/repos/google/
<didrocks> (but they didn't fix the "hit and refresh" issue)
<Laney> GunnarHj: this is fixed for utopic, yes?
<willcooke> didrocks, cool
<GunnarHj> Laney: Not quite. The MP is an addition to what's already in utopic.
<GunnarHj> Laney: I did it after jdstrands review.
<willcooke> larsu, Laney desrt FJKong - please could you populate your travel details in the spreadsheet as soon as you have flights confirmed etc
<willcooke> Sweetshark, ^^
<Laney> still waiting to book
<willcooke> chop chop :)
<larsu> willcooke: ah thanks for reminding me
<Laney> not my delay!
<Laney> well, not right now
<Laney> I can be partially blamed
<willcooke> :D
<desrt> willcooke: already did, no?
<willcooke> doh, sorry desrt
<didrocks> fatest holidays approval ever!
 * desrt tries one too
<Laney> slackers
<didrocks> desrt: let's DDOS this guy! :)
 * willcooke . . o O ( So manager.  Such approval.  wow)
<willcooke> desrt, you want tomorrow off?
<desrt> yes please :)
<willcooke> not trolling?
<desrt> you think i'd put a vacation day on the line for a troll?
<didrocks> Laney: mine were the end of years holidays :)
<willcooke> 'cos if you cancel it in 10 mins..... ;)
<didrocks> thanks willcooke :) paperworkstacktodo--
<desrt> willcooke: long story is that my mom is coming to town for her birthday tomorrow and we're going to proper british-style afternoon tea.  i forgot to book it off before just now.
<willcooke> well, I'm convinced
<Laney> (please be a troll)
<desrt> Laney: you're getting the shakes from seb not being around :p
<desrt> willcooke: thanks :)
 * willcooke -> dinner
<Laney> that'll be it - I knew there was something
<didrocks> EOD here! see you tomorrow guys
<Laney> GunnarHj: done, enjoy
<GunnarHj> Laney: Many thanks on behalf of the Swedish LoCo. :)
<Laney> you're welcome
<Laney> climbing time, see you!
<willcooke> EOD - tata
<desrt> so anyone taking wagers on the big announcement today?
<desrt> 2 hours to go...
<cyphermox> kenvandine: I got another quick fix for bluetooth in u-s-s :) https://code.launchpad.net/~mathieu-tl/ubuntu-system-settings/fix-lp1355904/+merge/234879
<kenvandine> cyphermox, thx
<kenvandine> cyphermox, can you review https://code.launchpad.net/~ken-vandine/ubuntu-system-settings/lp1365408/+merge/234764
<kenvandine> the CI failures aren't related, otto i think
<cyphermox> sure
<kenvandine> thx, i can get them both in the same landing
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-09-17
<pitti> Good morning
<duflu> pitti: Morning! And it still is in Australia too. You must be excessively early
<pitti> hey duflu, how are you?
<pitti> duflu: yeah, I started an hour earlier than usual (5:30 today)
<duflu> pitti: Good, I think. You?
<pitti> quite fine, thanks!
<didrocks> morning
<darkxst> hey didrocks
<didrocks> hey darkxst
<darkxst> didrocks, https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/view/Utopic/view/AutoPkgTest/job/utopic-adt-libmediaart
<didrocks> darkxst: perfect! +1ing then
<didrocks> darkxst: you maybe need a FFe though to have tracker dep on it
<darkxst> didrocks, I can file one if needed, however it was previously building with it, just temporalily disabled for a few weeks
<didrocks> darkxst: maybe ask Laney once he's around?
<darkxst> didrocks, ok, will do
<didrocks> meanwhile, approved!
<darkxst> didrocks, thanks
<didrocks> thanks to you:)
<larsu> good morning!
<didrocks> hey larsu! how are you?
<larsu> didrocks: great thanks! Awesomly sore muscles from exersise yesterdy (started doing crossfit)
<didrocks> oh nice! and no squash in the end?
<larsu> squash tomorrow
<didrocks> waow, combo!
<larsu> ya, trying to mix it up
<larsu> how are you?
<didrocks> I'm great, thanks! continuing community reviews for udtc ;)
<larsu> \o/
<happyaron> is there any possibility to do changes to wubi.exe?
<didrocks> happyaron: it's not really maintained, but yeah, I think if you talk with the foundation team, you can implement changes
<happyaron> I see
<willcooke> morning all
<larsu> hi willcooke
<happyaron> willcooke hey, :)
<didrocks> hey willcooke
 * willcooke is having a bad day already
<willcooke> I bought *a lot* of shoes online.  Three different styles, three sizes in each style
<willcooke> they arrived, I chose the ones that fitted, and I sent the rest back
<happyaron> ...
<willcooke> only the returns have got lost in the mail
<willcooke> which means, right now, I'm about 500 GBP out of pocket
<larsu> uh oh - sorry man :-/
 * willcooke goes to the post office
<Laney> ahoy
<darkxst> hey Laney
<larsu> morning Laney
<didrocks> urgh :/ good luck willcooke!
<didrocks> morning Laney
<darkxst> Laney, do I need to file a FFe to re-enable libmediaart build dep? it was only disabled for a few weeks while waiting on libmediaart MIR?
<darkxst> Laney, ^ for tracker
<Laney> I'd say so, you are now adding a new feature
<Laney> what does it do?
<darkxst> Laney, extracts metadata and images from media files
<darkxst> Laney, and the "feature" was there all cycle, it was only temporarily disabled so tracker MIR could go through, while waiting on libmediaart MIR
<darkxst> but if FFe is needed, no worries, will file one
<Laney> but the MIR was needed to add it to nautilus, meaning that since then you haven't had this feature
<Laney> if you see what I'm getting at
<Laney> anyway, have you tested it?
<darkxst> Laney, yes, and this is not really relevant to  nautilus
<darkxst> (as in I don't think the nautilus search provider even accesses the other metadata)
<Laney> darkxst: if you quickly file it saying that it's been tested I can approve that
<willcooke> didrocks, Laney - could you write a recommendation for FJKong in support of his Ubuntu membership application?
<didrocks> willcooke: sure, any wiki page link?
<willcooke> FJKong, ^^^  can you point didrocks at your wiki page when it's ready?
<FJKong> didrocks: I am preparing for this, I will let you know asap
<didrocks> ok, just ping me once ready :)
<FJKong> didrocks: ok thanks
 * willcooke wonders if he should be an Ubuntu member as well
<willcooke> seems appropriate
<Laney> six months significant and sustained contributions is the normal test
<willcooke> Laney, does that mean "code"?
<Laney> nope
<Laney> it could be many things, like running stalls or giving support on IRC
<darkxst> Laney, ok will do
<Laney> hrm
<Laney> rtm archive doesn't have all the build-deps for gst 1.4
 * Laney cherry-picks the fix they want instead
<Laney> wait
<Laney> well that was a waste of time
<willcooke> :)
<Laney> :|!
<didrocks> Laney: to make your time worthwhile, mind having a quick look? (shouldn't be long ;)): bug #1370441
<ubot5> bug 1370441 in Ubuntu "[FFe] package nose-json plugin" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1370441
<Laney> didrocks: I'm going to burn through the list later if that's ok
<didrocks> Laney: no worry :)
 * didrocks goes for some exercise, bbl
<GunnarHj> pitti: I proposed the addition of a ce_RU locale (bug #1369742), but there is a need for a new set of langpacks too. Suppose you have a script or something for creating the latter...
<ubot5> bug 1369742 in langpack-locales (Ubuntu) "Please add the new ce_RU locale" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1369742
<pitti> GunnarHj: yes, the langpack build is more or less automatic, once it gets added to /usr/share/i18n/SUPPORTED
<GunnarHj> pitti: I see. Any chance that you can upload?
<pitti> GunnarHj: yeah, can do
<GunnarHj> pitti: Thanks!
<pitti> GunnarHj: thanks to you!
<willcooke> didrocks, the UE live meeting clashes with our 1:1 - do you mind if we have it 30 mins later?
<didrocks> willcooke: sure, that's fine, maybe we should move it permanently for other weeks then?
<willcooke> yeah, I think that's a good plan
<didrocks> 30 minutes later sounds good to me
<willcooke> done
<didrocks> great
<willcooke> mhall119, greets - is the UE live thing happening ?
<didrocks> fginther: hey, do you have a proxy setup in the CI lab? Seems it will be the only way to access to dockerhub
<fginther> didrocks, I think the answer is 'no', but please ping the vanguard in ubuntu-ci-eng. I'm at a conference and can't dig into it at the moment
<didrocks> fginther: ok, doing! thanks
<stgraber> didrocks: there's one
<stgraber> if echo "" | nc -w 2 squid.internal 3128 >/dev/null 2>&1; then
<stgraber>     echo "Running in the Canonical CI environment"
<stgraber>     export http_proxy="http://squid.internal:3128"
<stgraber>     export https_proxy="http://squid.internal:3128"
<stgraber> we've got that in the LXC testsuite and it's been working pretty well so far :)
<didrocks> stgraber: oh, excellent! will try that as soon as I have my vms available again (finishing the current tests run). Thanks a lot for the hint :)
<didrocks> stgraber: yeah, I'm downloading templates as you are with LXC I guess :)
<willcooke> chrisccoulson, qengho - do you think that the open source PDF plugin for Chromium would work in Oxide?   Question from the UE live hangout.
<qengho> I don't know.
<qengho> willcooke: If Oxide talks all of PPAPI, it should.
<chrisccoulson> It depends. A lot of the PPAPI surface is implemented in chrome
<chrisccoulson> so Pepper plugins don't work out of the box
<willcooke> thx chrisccoulson qengho
<Laney> pitti: any idea why evolution-ews-dbgsym isn't in Packages on ddebs.u.c?
<pitti> Laney: no, I don't
<pitti> Laney: can you file a bug please? (pkg-create-dbgsym will do, although it's really in ddeb-retriever)
<Laney> pitti: okay
<Laney> ah, in fact the amd64 ddeb isn't tehre
<pitti> Laney: ah riht, I misread the arm64 one as amd64
<Laney> me too
<pitti> so apparently that fell victim to one of the many ways ddeb retrieval can fail :/
<Laney> ah well
<Laney> I'm uploading a new one in a minute anyway
<pitti> it should be much more robust since the rewrite in August, but the last build of that was before that
<pitti> ah good
<Laney> laters potaters
<tedg> cyphermox, I got a wifi router that now has 5Ghz support. When I list accesspoints, the rate for the 5GHz channel is listed as 54Mbps, but it's a lot higher than that, why is that?
<cyphermox> tedg: how do you list accesspoints?
<tedg> cyphermox, nmcli device wifi list iface wlan0
<cyphermox> tedg: it's probably the best NM can tell you without associating to the access point?
<cyphermox> for 802.11n/802.11ac it would get higher than 54, but via agregating multiple channels
<tedg> Ah, yeah. I guess I expected to get the aggregation benefits listed there.
<tedg> cyphermox, Does NM store that data? "Hey last time I connected here I got 100Mbps, perhaps that's closer to reality"
<cyphermox> no, it doesn't
<cyphermox> there'd be no point in saving it because it changes if you're at a different distance from the AP, if you sneeze, or if there are bees nearby
<tedg> BEES!
<tedg> I guess I figured for type of AP it'd be useful.
<tedg> i.e. it could if the signal was X high
<tedg> So for choosing which is the best, knowing capability has value.
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-09-18
<pitti> Good morning
<didrocks> morning
<mvo> hey didrocks, good morning
<didrocks> good morning mvo, how are you?
<mvo> didrocks: good, thanks!
<mvo> and you?
<didrocks> I'm great! thanks ;)
<larsu> good morning!
<didrocks> hey larsu
<TheMuso> Hey willcooke, seems like things are all well with your connection. :)
<willcooke> yeah, seems to be back on again
<didrocks> morning willcooke
<willcooke> morning :)
<Laney> hey hey
<willcooke> seÃ±or Laney - flights for the sprint.  How goes?  All in hand?
<Laney> I'm preparing a pointy stick
<willcooke> need me to chase them?
<willcooke> s/need/want
<Laney> let's see if my pointy stick is long enough
<didrocks> waow
<didrocks> reconciling a merge conflict
<didrocks> git push to github
<didrocks> even before the push command finished, https://github.com/didrocks/ubuntu-developer-tools-center/pull/25/files changed to say "you can merge automatically now"
<michael-vb> Good morning (or whatever your time-zone says).  I wanted to ping people about LP 1353675.  Specifically about how long it is likely to take before the fix hits release versions of Ubuntu, and which versions it is likely to get into.  My reason for asking is to know whether it is worth our working around the problem in the next VirtualBox release or not.
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1353675 in compiz (Ubuntu) "_NET_WM_FULLSCREEN_MONITORS not handled correctly" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1353675
<Laney> michael-vb: Trevinho should know
<michael-vb> From his nick I would guess he is located in Brazil, if he is it will probably be a while before he responds.
<Laney> no, in Europe (normally)
<michael-vb> Ah right.  Thanks.
<Laney> willcooke: cooking on gas now
<willcooke> woot, thx Laney
 * Laney goes on a ftbfs fixing adventure
<Laney> after lunch
<Laney> to the crocus cafe!
<Trevinho> michael-vb: hi (located in EU, but with some western timezone :D), I've proposed the fix fo the next compiz image that will land in utopic soon.
<Trevinho> michael-vb: however for getting that in trusty, you should propose a branch against the compiz stable branch and we'll manage to get it released as SRU asap
<Trevinho> michael-vb: for the SRU the time could be longer, consider some weeks (less than a month hopefully)
<didrocks> hey Trevinho, any news on the launcher gsettings issue?
<michael-vb> Trevinho: ah, good timing, I am just back.
<michael-vb> Thanks.
<michael-vb> Portugal?
<Trevinho> michael-vb: no, italy... :)
<Trevinho> didrocks: no, I've something higher prio to work on now, sorry
<michael-vb> Is that a Western time-zone?  I am in Germany.
<didrocks> Trevinho: that's been 4 months that we started discussing about it though :/
<didrocks> Trevinho: it's hurting the ubuntu developer story core experience
<michael-vb> So I have to check out the stable branch and back-port the change to that, then push that?
<Trevinho> michael-vb: no, I was jocking... like that "my own timezone" does not follow sun :D
<michael-vb> Ah right.  I am a bit slow today.
<Trevinho> michael-vb: yeah, a branch is enough with that patch applied... THen we'll manage an SRU
<Trevinho> didrocks: I know, but it's not the only, unfortunately :(
<didrocks> willcooke: can you help getting bug #1364070 on the Unity7's bug list? ^
<ubot5> bug 1364070 in unity (Ubuntu) "utopic unity (7.3.1+14.10.20140811-0ubuntu1) launcher addition through gsettings isn't picked up" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1364070
<michael-vb> Right, got to learn a bit more bzr then... after cvs, svn and git.
<didrocks> willcooke: basically, some people experiment no launcher icon addition at the end of the ubuntu developer tools center addition
<Trevinho> michael-vb: nothing harder than a bzr commit and bzr push :)
<didrocks> willcooke: last June I was told to not open a bug, but seeing nothing moving after 4 months, I preferred then to log it in (that's why I opened it recently)
<michael-vb> Do I need to do a fresh check-out, or does bzr have something like git to switch to a branch?
<Trevinho> michael-vb: it has, but you only need to branch the repo, then push it with another name such as lp:~machael-vb/compiz/name-of-the-branch
<michael-vb> Actually I meant that I have already checked out trunk (or whatever bzr calls it), whether I can switch to the stable branch on that check-out or whether I need to check-out the stable branch separately.
<michael-vb> Whatever, you probably have some on-line documentation about the work-flow.
<michael-vb> Finding that is probably more sensible than a personal tutorial on IRC.
<Trevinho> michael-vb: ah, no the repo is different... you need to branch a different branch... Well you also could switch to it, but you don't need it
<Trevinho> michael-vb: just bzr branch lp:compiz/0.9.11
<michael-vb> Thanks.
<michael-vb> And is there a preferred way to pull the change-set over from 0.9.12?
<GunnarHj> pitti: Re bug #1090288: It would be logical if you withdrew https://sourceware.org/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=13414 or made some kind of comment.
<ubot5> sourceware.org bug 13414 in localedata "wrong en_ZA locale decimal point" [Normal,Waiting]
<ubot5> bug 1090288 in langpack-locales (Ubuntu) "The locale file for en_ZA appears to have an error" [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1090288
<willcooke> didrocks, sure I'll speak to Bregma and see what he says
<didrocks> willcooke: thanks! :)
<Trevinho> michael-vb: well, you can just apply your old patch (it should do it cleanly) or use bzr merge -r rev-pre..rev-actual
<pitti> GunnarHj: good idea, done
<GunnarHj> pitti: Great!
<attente_> happyaron: hey, you said the fcitx MIR is just waiting on a new upstream release? do you know when that is?
<JackYu> hi, developers, would you please help to upload a new package for Ubuntu Kylin? please see bug #1371165
<ubot5> bug 1371165 in Ubuntu Kylin "Upload ubuntu-kylin-sso-client to Archive for UKSC" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1371165
<michael-vb> Trevinho: https://code.launchpad.net/~michael-thayer/compiz/lp-1353675-compiz-0.9.11
<michael-vb> Think I did the back-port right...
<Trevinho> michael-vb: cool, I'll propose to the branch, thanks
<michael-vb> Great, thanks.
<Trevinho> michael-vb: here it is https://code.launchpad.net/~michael-thayer/compiz/lp-1353675-compiz-0.9.11/+merge/235158
<michael-vb> Already seen!  Thanks.
<michael-vb> Is it expected that it still says "Unmerged revisions 3867"?
<cbaker_> anyone have any ideas as to why when trying to boot Ubuntu from USB it asks me what to do (Try without installing, install, advanced, etc) and after clicking anything, it just goes to a blank white box in the upper left hand corner?
 * willcooke_ -> EOD
<didrocks> see you willcooke_
<willcooke_> l8r
<nickoba> hello. I hope that I am in the right IRC for my question. I have setup an extended desktop successfully using xrander --right-of command
<nickoba> I would like to setup chrome in fullscreen. When I setup fullscreen in does not expand across all monitors. Just one.
<nickoba> Can someone help me with making chrome to expand across all screens?
<sarnold> nickoba: does chrome respect the -geometry 1000x1000+0+0 command line argument to set the size?
<nickoba> sarnold: I am looking into it. So are you suggesting this not settable in desktop or OS level?
<sarnold> nickoba: some window managers make those sorts of configurations easier than others, see e.g. http://i3wm.org/docs/userguide.html#_arbitrary_commands_for_specific_windows_for_window
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-09-19
<pitti> Good morning
<didrocks> good morning
<happyaron> 4444ff44454
<happyaron> ah sorry
<pitti`> happyaron: cat jumped on keyboard? :-)
<happyaron> pitti`: nope, terminal freezes and it's me... :)
<willcooke> morning
<didrocks> hey willcooke
 * FJKong say good morning to others
<willcooke> Good afternoon FJKong :)  Nearly EOW for you! \o/
<FJKong> willcooke: less than 3 hrs, lol
<willcooke> :)
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<didrocks> morning FJKong
<didrocks> welcome back seb128
<seb128> didrocks, hey, thanks ;-)
<willcooke> hi seb128
<seb128> hey willcooke
<FJKong> hey seb128
<seb128> hey FJKong
<FJKong> seb128: welcome back, I think I should talk with you about add pinyin searching to unity @ willcooke
<seb128> FJKong, hey, sure, I read an email about that, I need to finish catching up with what happened while I was on vac this week and to go for some small errands, I'm back in less than 1 hour if you want to discuss that
<FJKong> seb128: no problem, I will ping you next week, it is weekend for me already
<willcooke> what do we think about encrypting the home directory by default?
<seb128> FJKong, k, have a good w.e!
<Laney> hello!
<didrocks> morning Laney
<Laney> what's up didrocks?
<Laney> oh, it's friday, almost forgot!
<didrocks> Laney: all good, and yourself?
<Laney> doing alright
<willcooke> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel-discuss/2014-September/015048.html
<Laney> what's 14.02?
<willcooke> heh - yes, I thought that too
<willcooke> I've looped qengho in to that conversation with mdeslaur and I think I'm going to email that guy directly too.
<Laney> not sure it'll be very feasible to update trusty
<willcooke> hopefully we can get 14.10 upgraded though, and then maybe we can make some kind of joint announcement
<Laney> 14.10 already has the version he asks for
<willcooke> oh - sweet
<Laney> laney@iota> rmadison -s utopic libnss3                                                                                                     ~ libnss3 | 2:3.17-1ubuntu1 | utopic | amd64, arm64, armhf, i386, powerpc, ppc64el
<willcooke> nice one, thanks Laney
<Laney> I guessed that it works because pitti` was posting about netflix on G+ the other day ;-)
 * willcooke adds pitti` to his circles
<didrocks> eclipse behaves so weirdly on sigterm compared to intellij
<Estilanda> hi!
<Estilanda> Olga or Jouni?
<willcooke> seb128, when you've got 10 mins can we chat re: my email where I said I couldn't be bothered to explain via email :)
<seb128> willcooke, k,  I needed to go for some errands, I'm back but need to catchup a bit, let me 10 minutes
<willcooke> seb128, no hurry at all, it can wait to Monday morning and our normal slot
<didrocks> interesting, android.developer.com servers are starting to send some 500 errors this morning
<Laney> hmm, no ffe yet for the gnome-desktop stuff
<seb128> Laney, what is missing there?
<Laney> file, approve, upload
<Laney> accept, test, fix, be happy
<Laney> I thought that robert_ancell was going to put that in this week
<sil2100> Hello desktop team!
<seb128> robert_ancell doesn't do much paperwork style of work usually ;-)
<sil2100> I was in the middle of filling in the FFe for touch-specific packages when I noticed that mir is now partially part of the desktop images
<sil2100> i.e. libmirclient8 is in the desktop images, pulled in by libgtk-3-0
<sil2100> What should I do in this case? Is mir still feasible for a standing FFe?
<Laney> what are they planning?
<Laney> if stuff which breaks the gtk backend, probably not so cool
<didrocks> Laney: I would ask for at least ABI stability
<didrocks> willcooke: we lost you!
<Laney> sil2100: I think you should go ask them what they're planning for the rest of this cycle
<Laney> sil2100: In the meantime I'd ask for the easy stuff first
<Laney> using that command I gave you
<willcooke> didrocks, sorry, having technical issues all of a sudden
<Laney> your call is important to us
<seb128> ok, time for some exercice, bbl
<mitya57> Hi, can anybody check why the CI/merge wasn't triggered for https://code.launchpad.net/~mitya57/indicator-session/lp1363630/+merge/232813 ?
<mitya57> (which was approved > a week ago)
<Laney> mitya57: these things are manual nowadays
<mitya57> Laney: can you do it? :)
<Laney> afraid so
<Laney> you have to use the ci train
 * mitya57 rarely contributes to branches of this style, so missed the change
<Laney> mitya57: https://ci-train.ubuntu.com/job/ubuntu-landing-008-1-build/64/console watch the magic
<mitya57> Thanks a lot!
<Laney> and then you get https://launchpad.net/~ci-train-ppa-service/+archive/ubuntu/landing-008
<mitya57> Laney: who has the permissions to do such magic?
<Laney> add it, confirm it works, and then there's a pres butan to upload
<Laney> I think core-dev
<mitya57> So I just need to become a core-dev :)
<Laney> AIUI the new system "CI airline" is smarter and actually looks at the per-package ACL
<Laney> also has the benefit of not being jenkins
<ricotz> Laney, hi, would be nice to get glib2.0 2.40.0-3 into trusty
<Laney> ricotz: I'd quite like a stable release
<Laney> want to poke mclasen to do one?
<ricotz> Laney, huh, i mean the debian package ;)
<Laney> I know
<Laney> I want more than that :p
<ricotz> ah, i see
<Laney> I tried a poke a couple of weeks ago but it didn't work
<Laney> so would appreciate a second person ...
<ricotz> Laney, isnt poking desrt enough ;)
<Laney> he redirected me
<ricotz> oh
<ricotz> hmm, quite some time since the last commit for 2.40
<ricotz> i guess there are already more things/fixes worth to backport which would be more work than just tagging
<didrocks> popey: thanks man!
<desrt> i could do a release if you like
<desrt> i guess there have been a fair amount of fixes
<Laney> I would enter a state of pleasedness
<desrt> k.  i'll throw it on my today list
<Laney> not sure if there's anything else in master worth cherry picking over
<ricotz> desrt, great
<mitya57> Laney: tested, works, can you press the button?
<pitti> Laney: yeah, but I only got it to work with chrome; does it work with firefox now?
<Laney> pitti: don't know, the q. was about chrome anyhow
<popey> didrocks: np
<Laney> mitya57: got to wait for that page to wake up
<pitti> Laney: yeah, that works well, with an additional user-agent change plugin
<Laney> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel-discuss/2014-September/015048.html says there is something Netflix can do to make that unnecessary ...
<Laney> aha https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel-discuss/2014-September/015050.html
<Laney> mitya57: done, please could you ping me when it migrates to utopic release?
<Laney> one more pres butan to do then
<mitya57> Ok, will ping
<brainwash> can we restore the old update-notifier tray icon functionality? there is a patch attached to bug 1246364, but it might need some additional rework (check for desktop environment)
<ubot5> bug 1246364 in update-notifier (Ubuntu) "update-notifier does not show a tray icon in xubuntu" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1246364
<brainwash> the tray icon would be optional and enabled by default in non-unity sessions like xubuntu
<mitya57> Laney: migrated
<Laney> blarg
<ogra_> was that a jekyll/hyde thing ?
<mitya57> Now that you're really here: <mitya57> Laney: migrated
<Laney> mitya57: I think I did that
<Laney> should have merged your branch
<Laney> or maybe it's still running https://ci-train.ubuntu.com/job/ubuntu-landing-008-3-merge-clean/21/console
<mitya57> Laney: thanks, it was merged.
<Laney> great
<willcooke> merry weekend y'al
<Laney> RIGHT
<Laney> ha
<Laney> what timing
<Laney> bye too!
<willcooke> see ya
<Laney> seb128: I forgot to ask you how your trip to the seaside was!
<seb128> Laney, quite nice, thanks! Weather was splendid, almost to warm (like 28Â°C without wind in the top of the afternoon)
<Laney> what kind of september is this
<seb128> yeah, go figure
<seb128> it's another of those year where there is a nice/warm june, no decent summer in most of july/august and things are back to nice on septembre
<Laney> I think it's been pretty scorchio most of the time here
<Laney> but today I have had my lamp on the whole time
<Laney> suuuuuuuuper grey
<Laney> okay, pub time
<Laney> bye!
<seb128> Laney, have fun&a good w.e
<desrt> seb128: !
<desrt> you're back
<seb128> desrt, hey!
<desrt> seb128: how was your break?
<seb128> desrt, good, spending days with family on the north coast of France, relaxing and we had great weather
<seb128> spending->spent
<desrt> cool!
 * desrt is going up to his parents cottage again soonish
<desrt> no boston summit for me this year -- first time in a long one
<seb128> yeah, I saw that a few days ago
<seb128> going to spend thanksgiving in family as well
<seb128> ;-)
<desrt> >:|
<desrt> user panel in ubuntu is annoying wrt. passwords
<desrt> it tells me "not good enough", as if i should care
<desrt> and it won't let me set the password
<mdeslaur> desrt: adjust /etc/security/pwquality.conf
<desrt> mdeslaur: why do we get a different standard applied when an admin is changing another user's password via 'passwd'?
<mdeslaur> desrt: because the admin knows best
<desrt> exactly
<desrt> i'm complaining about the admin using the GUI tool to change another user's password
<desrt> it won't let me do it, so i have to use the commandline
<desrt> there's no extra security here -- only inconvenience
<mdeslaur> ah, I see, yes
#ubuntu-desktop 2015-09-14
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> Good morning
<didrocks> hey pitti, how are you?
<pitti> didrocks: okay, didn't sleep well (haven't in the whole last week, not sure why)
<pitti> didrocks: how are you? still did some celebrations after Julie returned?
<didrocks> pitti: nothing fancy: just eating some macarons with a coffee and relaxing :)
<didrocks> I hope your sleep depradation issue will get fixed soon!
<hikiko> hello :)
<didrocks> hey hikiko, how are you?
<hikiko>  hi didrocks :) happy birthday!
<hikiko> I am good, you?
<hikiko> back from holidays.. :)
<didrocks> hikiko: excellent! Thanks again ;) How were your holidays?
<hikiko> great! :D
<hikiko> I was in Paris (@my brother) but I forgot you live there to say a hello :)
<didrocks> hikiko: oh, I moved quite some years ago (end of 2010) to Lyon, so no worry ;)
<hikiko> haha :) my brother was at Lyon before Paris... I love Lyon too
 * hikiko loves France in general 
<didrocks> hope you had a nice time there!
<didrocks> Paris is great for tourism (a little bit less great for living IMHO)
<hikiko> +1
<larsu> good morning!
<didrocks> hey larsu, how are things?
<larsu> didrocks: great thanks! And for you? Did you have a nice birthday weekend?
<didrocks> larsu: nothing fancy, mostly alone and hacking, which is fine :p
<seb128> good morning desktopers!
<larsu> didrocks: however you prefer it!
<larsu> seb128: who are you? Can't remember seeing you in this channel
<didrocks> re seb128 :)
<larsu> seb128: :P Welcome back! Are you relaxed from the vacation?
<seb128> hey larsu! I'm good thanks, how are you?
<seb128> very much relaxed
<seb128> being 2 weeks outside walking for the most part is a good change ;-)
<seb128> slightly tired today though, I watched a bit of the US open match this night
<seb128> it was rain delayed and started at 1am
<seb128> went to bed at 3am...
<pitti> Ã§a va seb128, bienvenue retour !
<pitti> seb128: ah, vous Ãªtes allÃ© randonÃ©e ?
<seb128> pitti, bien rentrÃ© merci ;-)
<pitti> "randonnÃ©e"
<seb128> pitti, oui, en Ecosse, on a fait le west highland way (7j, 150km) et l'Ã®le de Skye
 * pitti s'entraÃ®ne les nouveaux mots du leÃ§on franÃ§ais dernier
<larsu> seb128: sounds good :) I'm great as well thanks. I have internet now, can you believe it?
<larsu> morning pitti!
<seb128> larsu, that sounds like an useful thing to have ;-)
<larsu> indeed
<seb128> brb, going to get something to eat, back from holidays and empty fridge
<pitti> hey larsu, guten Morgen! yay web
<larsu> oh yeah
 * didrocks is going to catch his flight. Working offline meanwhile (maybe will popup onlinefrom the airport). ttyl guys!
<willcooke> hey ho
<willcooke> hey seb128, nice holiday?
<didrocks> hey and see you willcooke :)
<willcooke> see ya didrocks - have fun
<didrocks> thx!
<larsu> morning willcooke!
<Laney> HEY TEAM
<willcooke> hi larsu Laney
<larsu> hi Laney!
<Laney> yo
<Laney> what's up?
<larsu> not much :)
<larsu> you?
<seb128> hey willcooke Laney
<seb128> willcooke, excellent ones, thanks ;-)
<Laney> seb128: !!!
<seb128> but almost spent an extra night in Glasgow, learnt about the "no show" rule, stupid airlines
<Laney> were the scots kind to you?
<seb128> they cancelled my return ticket because I didn't take the plane there
<willcooke> ouch
<seb128> (since I was in London and took the train instead)
<seb128> and they don't tell you about it
<seb128> online/machine checkin doesn't work and at the counter they say "oh, you didn't show on the flight some weeks ago, we cancelled the ticket you paid for, need to pay again, let me see what's the price today"
<larsu> seb128: ya ... they do this because you could end up with cheaper flights this way
<larsu> as soon as you don't show to one flight of your booking, they cancel the rest
<seb128> larsu, well not my problem if they are stupid enough to sell A+B for less than B
<seb128> I knew about legs on one flight
<seb128> I didn't know that impacted return as well
<seb128> well, googling shows that apparently the EU was to ban them from doing that
<larsu> really? wow
<larsu> it makes sense: imagine a big conference in city A, and lots of people from city B want to go there
<larsu> naturally return trips from B -> A will be expensive
<larsu> but not trips from A -> B
<larsu> so people could just buy the reverse and no-show for the flights to B
<seb128> http://www.europarl.europa.eu/news/en/news-room/content/20140203IPR34618/html/Parliament-pushes-for-enforceable-air-passenger-rights
<larsu> interesting
<seb128> https://www.lonelyplanet.com/thorntree/forums/europe-western-europe/topics/eu-changes-to-airlines-no-show-policies?page=1#post_21226843
<seb128> larsu, I fail to understand the logic in what you describe
<seb128> if there is more demand prices are higher, that's ok
<seb128> A->B could be 10â¬
<seb128> and B->A 100â¬
<seb128> and whole trip 110â¬
<seb128> if I pay 110â¬ and decide to use only the return the airline wins 10â¬ over if I had taken only the return costing 100â¬
<larsu> no. The problem is that all people want to go to A on the same date (B->A expensive) and leave on the same date a week later or so (A->B)
<larsu> the reverse will be very cheap on those days
<seb128> why?
<seb128> if there is lot of demand price will increase
<seb128> prices are not constant
<larsu> ah, you mean price the return differently from the way there?
<seb128> yes
<seb128> what I just say
<seb128> make the way there 10â¬ and the return 100â¬
<larsu> right, just making sure I understood you right
<seb128> if that's what the demand is
<larsu> that's a good point. I guess they offer rebates if you take a return trip?
<larsu> not sure
<seb128> well, that's their issue
<larsu> indeed
<seb128> they shouldn't be allowed to sell something to cancel it just because you had an issue and already missed to take advantage of half of it
<seb128> like what difference if I was in the plane or not?
<larsu> none
<seb128> they used less food and a bit less fuel by me not being there
<seb128> so it's a win for them
<larsu> but their argument still holds for multi-stop flights in one direction
<seb128> and they punish me over it
<seb128> no it doesn't?
<seb128> you pay for a seat, what difference does it make if you actually sit on it?
<larsu> Munich -> Brussels -> New York is a cheaper ticket than Munich -> New York (because it's less convenient)
<larsu> so if I'm in Brussels, I could just get the cheaper ticket from Munich on no-show on the first flight
<seb128> I could book 2 seats for myself just because I don't like having people sitting next to me
<seb128> well, it's their issue if they sell A+B to less than B
<seb128> nobody force them to do that
<larsu> no, pricing is not based on cost
<larsu> but on value for the buyer
<seb128> it's a stupid system their create themself
<larsu> they could base it on cost
<seb128> like they create more annoying trips to be able to sell the less annoying ones for less
<larsu> but then all prices would go up a lot
<larsu> and planes wouldn't be used as efficiently
<seb128> why?
<seb128> cost for them is the same
<larsu> can you afford a direct flight to San Francisco from Europe?
<seb128> if everything was going up then they would just increase their margins
<seb128> that's not a change of distribution
<seb128> a change of distribution would mean lowering some options to increase some others
<larsu> you'd basically only have the cost of direct flights
<seb128> it doesn't make sense to me
<larsu> and you couldn't leverage the fact that many people want to cross the atlantic (big, filled planes) but have different desitinations in the US (smaller, filled planes)
<seb128> you have the direct flight + a small leg
<seb128> how is that less expensive that the direct flight alone
<larsu> you can shove more people into the transatlantic
<seb128> well, maybe there would be less small flights and more people would take the train to go to the big airport
<seb128> not really
<larsu> this is hard to explain here. Let's do it over some beer at the sprint ;)
<seb128> if 1000 persons want to go from Germany to N-Y on a day and if there was 1 plane in frankfurt only, people would take train to frankfort
<seb128> and the 1 plane would still be full
<seb128> but yeah, I can understand your logic with legs
<seb128> I don't understand the logic of how that impacts return
<larsu> people want to fly all the way though :)
<larsu> yeah, you might be right about returns
<seb128> I could have booked a return on any day
<larsu> indeed
<seb128> in fact I didn't do it on the same day
<larsu> did you pay a lot more now?
<seb128> we had ticket going on friday and return on sunday
<seb128> no, I think it was about the same price
<seb128> they made me pay Â£50
<seb128> well, anyway, I learnt something
<larsu> :)
<seb128> and I hope EU ban them from those abuse ;-)
<seb128> one thing they have no excuse on is that they send you the "do your online checkin" email and don't tell you the ticket is not valid anymore
<seb128> then the online checkin tells "need to do checkin at the airport"
<seb128> still not stating why
<larsu> haha srsly? That's really bad
<seb128> yes...
<seb128> even the self checkin machines at the airport
<larsu> in fact, they should send you a "you didn't show up, so your other tickets are invalid, too" email
<seb128> they recognize the passport and show you your flight, etc
<seb128> yes, they should have :-/
<larsu> ya this is bad
<larsu> sorry this happened to you :/
<seb128> no worry, it was not big inconvenience
<seb128> it took 10 minutes arguing at the desk
<seb128> and an extra Â£50
<seb128> which is ok
<larsu> and 50 pounds :)
<larsu> right
<seb128> I was wondering what to do if the only seats left would have been Â£300 ones
<seb128> anyway
<seb128> holidays were great otherwise
<seb128> walking for like 6 to 8 hours a day is a good change
<seb128> but I'm happy to be back after 15 days :-)
<larsu> good to have you back!
<seb128> (sorry everyone for spamming the channel with airline discussions ;-)
 * seb128 is catching up on emails
<seb128> how were things here recently? any exciting news?
<willcooke> seb128, once you're caught up, can we talk about:  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-touch-meta/+bug/1491753
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1491753 in ubuntu-touch-meta (Ubuntu) "Installing 'ubuntu-desktop-next' makes the system (kernel in fact) unbootable." [Critical,New]
<seb128> willcooke, I discussed that with dholbach some weeks before my holidays
<willcooke> oh cool
<seb128> unsure how to fix it/what to do
<seb128> that package is not meant to be installed on deb based systems :-/
<larsu> seb128: not really. scrollbars were acked, headerbars are being reviewed (next cycle probably). lots of small fixes from my side (notify-osd is not blurry on hidpi anymore!)
<seb128> larsu, nice :-)
<larsu> and theme fixes and stuff
<larsu> now working on the cities things
 * larsu is writing tests right now
<seb128> cities?
<willcooke> seb128, let's talk though the options later
<seb128> willcooke, k
<larsu> seb128: you know how selecting the city you're in in the time&date panel is really buggy?
<larsu> also, it depends on gtk, which we want to get rid of on the phone
<seb128> speaking about u-c-c or touch?
<larsu> so I'm splitting up libtimezonemap
<larsu> seb128: both actually
<seb128> cool
<larsu> also making that cities1500.txt file that we're installing and parsing every time much smaller
<larsu> and putting it as a resource into the library
<larsu> should be much ... (sorry) ... snappier
<Laney> smaller?
<larsu> Laney: ya. throwing out lots of information we don't need and gzipping it
<Laney> you should keep it easy to update that from geonames.org
<larsu> it is
<larsu> just copy the file over and the build system will compile it and link it into the library
<Laney> ok
 * larsu thought about that
 * Laney fluffles larsu's hair
<Laney> well done my child
 * larsu grins contently
<pitti> hey Laney, had a good weekend?
<Laney> hey pitti
<Laney> it was good thanks - played on the PS4 a bit, did some cooking, went to a chilli farm for pick your own (hot hot hot) & then for ice cream \o/
<Laney> how about you?
<pitti> Laney: quite nice too -- some household stuff and building present for my father in law's 60th bday next weekend, and yesterday we did a nice long hike
<pitti> and we baked onion cake and drank "Federweisser", old tradition :)
<Laney> oh nice, just googled this
<Laney> looks tasty
<pitti> it's a veeery young wine, almost no alcohol yet and very sweet
<pitti> and yummy :)
<Laney> do you just buy grape juice from the shop?
 * Laney is tempted to try ;)
<pitti> Laney: no, it comes ready-made in bottles
<Laney> ah, I thought you made it
<pitti> Laney: there's lots of yeast in it, so it's not just grape juice
<Laney> yeah
<pitti> it's just impossible to bring to a conference; the bottles aren't airtight (they'd explode otherwise), so they only have a very light lid
<Laney> so it is still fermenting when you buy it?
<pitti> yes; these days it's still very young, and after a few weeks it ferments to some more "mature" wine (less sweet, more sour/more alcohol)
 * Laney nods
 * didrocks luckily had no luggage, the AF line was crazy :p
<pitti> didrocks: oÃ» vas-tu ?
<pitti> "oÃ¹"
<didrocks> pitti: amsterdam
<didrocks> (back on wednesday, the conf is only tonight and tomorrow)
<Laney> go to the cat boat
<Laney> doooo it
<didrocks> cat boat? :p
<didrocks> Poezenboot
<didrocks> just next to the conference actually
<didrocks> well, rather, hotel
<Laney> :D
<didrocks> (the hotel is 2km away from the conference, I did cut the price in half compared to what the new BTS was proposing)
<didrocks> but the other hotel was 50m away :p
<didrocks> ah, boarding, see you later guys!
<Laney> Trevinho: looks like scrollbars are a bit messed up in webkit stuff
<Laney> e.g. devhelp
<darkxst> hey Laney pitti
<pitti> hey darkxst, how are you?
<darkxst> good, but it was a bit warm today! 23C
<darkxst> Laney, or pitti, can you take a look at bug 1479907 this week, i'd like to get it uploaded before final beta freeze if possible
<ubot5> bug 1479907 in Ubuntu GNOME "[Ffe] Support installing Language packs from gnome-control-center" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1479907
<Trevinho> Laney: Mh I'll check it
<Laney> darkxst: done
<Laney> Trevinho: thanks!
<darkxst> Laney, what is done? the ffe?
<Laney> darkxst: yes, the thing you asked for
<darkxst> Laney, ok, I see, took a while for the comment to show up
<darkxst> Laney, replied
<seb128> Laney, thanks for handling that whoopsie/system-image bug while I was away!
<Laney> seb128: np!
<Laney> took ages in the end
<Laney> renameeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee
<seb128> yeah :-/
<seb128> let's see if QA validates it
<ogra_> Laney, oh, yeah ... beer++ the next sprint we meet, thanks for doing my work :)
<Laney> ogra_: I'll give you the next hard bug I get :P
<ogra_> hah
<davmor2> seb128: I'm working on it,  all the off tests seem to of worked I'm now turning it back on to see if the crash gets uploaded or not
<davmor2> \o/
<seb128> davmor2, great
<Trevinho> Laney: so... Webkitgtk is quite buggy with ambiance as well, but I think that for them I can add a special case.
<Trevinho> Laney: do you know if there's any bug upstream related to OSB?
<Laney> Trevinho: I think so but I don't have one handy
<Trevinho> Laney: ok, is that still in bugzilla, right?
<Laney> yes
<Laney> maybe go ask #webkitgtk+
<Trevinho> ok, I'll check for that, so we can track if they fix
 * larsu learns that there's also a San Francisco in Cordoba, Argentinia
<larsu> probably we want to sort cities by size as well :)
<seb128> larsu, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/TimeAndDate#Phone has some details
<seb128> like " In addition, to avoid duplication, a suburb (PPLX) should not be included in search results whenever a larger settlement (PPL, PPLA, PPLC) that has the same time zone is present in the same search results"
<larsu> seb128: thanks, I've read that and have been meaning to talk to mpt about it
<larsu> there's not a lot of PPLX in the data set
<seb128> yw!
 * larsu is currently simply ignoring them
<seb128> I think it resolved some of the "too many Berlin" issue
<seb128> k
 * larsu checks
<seb128> larsu, it was https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-system-settings/+bug/1454195
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1454195 in ubuntu-system-settings (Ubuntu) "Time zone search for "Berlin" returns many suburbs of Berlin" [Low,Triaged]
<larsu> ah, that one
<larsu> yes, it solves that
<seb128> great
<Trevinho> Mh Laney I've like the impression that these webkit scrollbars can't have custom theming... https://trac.webkit.org/browser/trunk/Source/WebCore/platform/gtk/ScrollbarThemeGtk.cpp?rev=186680#L166 (I don't see how they can inherit the parent widget path, but... larsu, am I wrong?)
<larsu> Trevinho: I don't know to be honest...
<Trevinho> No worries... But they seem like custom widgets, and they didn't include any special class for these... So I've no clue how I can catch them
<Trevinho> nor a name...
<larsu> is adwaita doing it?
 * Trevinho has to patch it -_-
<Trevinho> larsu: well, adwaita is not using special theming, as it's always the same size...
<Trevinho> Although webkit is bugged even using adwaita
<larsu> :/
<Trevinho> so, I wanted to make scrollbars for webkit opaque and fat in any case
<larsu> Laney: I've pushed the first version of this code to github (larsu/geonames) and I'd like to keep debian/ out of the upstream - should I create a bzr packaging branch or how does this work?
<larsu> desrt: around? Would appreciate a review of what I've got so far
<desrt> larsu: not this week please :)
<larsu> sure
<Laney> Trevinho: suggest you check with upstream (try kov / berto as a first point)
<Laney> larsu: it should probably be on launchpad unless you want to be the only one who can do changes
<Laney> and both can be git now
<Laney> you can have debian/ as another branch in there (branched off the upstream tag)
<Trevinho> Laney: ok, thanks
<hikiko> willcooke, https://ufuntu.wordpress.com/category/compiz-introduction-and-demo/ done, but my english suck a little... if you have any corrections/advices they are welcome!
<willcooke> hikiko, awesome!  Thank you!  I will have a read now
<larsu> Laney: ah thanks. Is launchpad git Good Enough now?
<willcooke> hikiko, Embedded video doesn't work for me..  "Playback on other websites has been disabled by the video owner"
<Laney> larsu: you can put things in and get them out, and also it has merge proposals
<larsu> Laney: fair enough, let me try it
<hikiko> must be the youtube settings for the video, I ll fix it now
<Laney> I doubt any of the CI tooling is hooked up though
<Laney> (might be wrong)
<larsu> Laney: I do actually want changes to go through me right now
<larsu> but I can do that on lp as well, no?
<Laney> you'll presumably make a team to own it
<larsu> Laney: https://launchpad.net/geonames
<Laney> (H)
<larsu> I guess now I need to write a debian directory :(
<seb128> larsu, just copy one over from an similar project (recent if possible)
<seb128> larsu, I can do that debian/ dir part for you if you prefer
<larsu> seb128: yeah of course :)
<larsu> I'll appreciate a review once I'm done
<seb128> sure, just give me a ping
<willcooke> hikiko, confirmed fixed :)
<hikiko> cool :)
<willcooke> Trevinho, larsu - for OSBs can we control the width in both the active and inactive modes (where the SB has mouse over or not)
<Trevinho> willcooke: yeah
<Trevinho> willcooke: although, in order not to make the terminal to resize, we need to keep the actual scrollbar size the same... Then we can show them differently
<willcooke> Trevinho, oki good.  I'm just upgrading my 15.10 machine now, so I might be a bit behind, but right now I'm having all sorts of problems getting hold of the scroll bar with my trackpad
<Trevinho> willcooke: currently it's using 10px horizontally
<Trevinho> we can increase it, but then content space will be reduced as well
<Trevinho> it was maybe a mess to maintain, but the old design wasn't bad at all imho.
<willcooke> hrm, I think part of the problem is that they aren't expanding to the larger state on mouse over
<willcooke> might be something odd on my machine
<willcooke> ohh
<Trevinho> mh, weird
<willcooke> it's just terminal
<Trevinho> willcooke: is it on terminal
<willcooke> which I think you were fixing already
<willcooke> :D
<Trevinho> willcooke: eh, that's the thing
<Trevinho> willcooke: well, I could even change something else there...
<Trevinho> but the thing is that it's not using a properly scrolled window, so it only gets the "hovering" state when the mouse is actually over the 10px dedicated to the OSB
<Trevinho> we might change this by hacking the terminal though
<Trevinho> I didn't do it as I didn't want to include too many changes, but I guess it's doable
<Laney> dude
<Laney> when does it become sensible to do the proper GTK work?
<willcooke> Laney, what do you mean?
<Laney> to get terminal using the scrolled window
<willcooke> oh, so do the fixes in terminal, rather than trying to hack in support?  Yes, that sounds like a better solution.  How much work will it be?
<willcooke> cos right now it's unusable IMO
<Laney> as of the recent fixes it expands (for me) when I hover at the edge
<Laney> I wouldn't call it unusable
<willcooke> how can I try these fixes?
<Laney> in wily
<willcooke> oh, so just update?
<Laney> ya
<willcooke> sweet
<willcooke> thx Laney
<willcooke> 87% through a dist-upgrade
<Laney> Fixing it upstream is not for this cycle, but it should be more maintainable in the long term IMO
<larsu> rishi was working on this for terminal, no?
<willcooke> I've added it to the sprint agenda so we can talk about it and work out what's going on
<Laney> ya
<Laney> I guess it needs some more shoving to get over the line
<larsu> Laney: where do I push the packaging branch? Into the same repository?
<Laney> larsu: I guess a 'debian' branch of the same repo
<larsu> k
<larsu> Laney, seb128: https://git.launchpad.net/geonames?h=debian
<Laney> your copyright file is false
<Laney> misses the data/
<Laney> it's not usual to have a '-' in the library package name
<Laney> should have a long description
<willcooke> larsu, Trevinho, Laney - yeah, terminal usability much improved after the update, thanks
<Laney> and a .symbols file
<Laney> other than that, looks good! :)
<didrocks> crazyness, 2h to register!
<larsu> Laney: thanks! How do I specify CC-BY in the copyright file?
<Laney> here you are following https://www.debian.org/doc/packaging-manuals/copyright-format/1.0/
<seb128> didrocks, so the 17-21h is the registration slot? you got lucky, you did in half the allocated time :-)
<didrocks> seb128: it started before
<didrocks> but was already busy
<Laney> So something like CC-BY-2.0
<larsu> Laney: I can't find the copyright holder for geonames.org ... is this enough? http://paste.ubuntu.com/12409539/
<larsu> or should I include a link as well>
<larsu> ah, upstream-contact?
<didrocks> seb128: btw, I guess this country welcomed me showing its traditional weather condition :p
<seb128> haha
<seb128> it's back to blue sky here
<seb128> it rains often but never for long ;-)
<didrocks> yeah, but the shower can be quite strong :p
<didrocks> and if you are under it, no escape! :)
<didrocks> my pant testifiesâ¦
<seb128> utch
<Laney> been near any canals yet?
<Laney> watch out...
<didrocks> Laney: no need to dive into any canal, the clouds are here to help you not needing this:p
<Laney> larsu: hmm I actually don't know what to say for that
<larsu> Laney: ok thanks. Pushed a new version
<larsu> oh. should have built before
<Laney> heh
<larsu> should be fixed now
<larsu> forgot the dots
<hikiko> Trevinho, https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/1467695
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1467695 in Unity "Alt-Grave (`) switcher has flickering/pulsing shadow artifacts" [High,Triaged]
<hikiko> is this one for me?
<Trevinho> hikiko: yeah, it would be nice to get that fixed
<Trevinho> hikiko: to reproduce it you might need to open a lot of windows...
<hikiko> okie, I assign it to me and I look at it tomorrow
<Trevinho> hikiko: thanks
<hikiko> np1
<Trevinho> hikiko: we're using this board now for tracking https://trello.com/b/9YvUSYqq/unity-7 so bookmark and update it ;)
<hikiko> should I add cards?
<Trevinho> hikiko: yep
<Trevinho> hikiko: it's all ours... A way to keep ongoing things organized
<hikiko> cool
<willcooke> hikiko, we'll be looking for a way to auto-import from LP based on tag or similar
<willcooke> There's APIs and such, so it should be pretty easy
<hikiko> I could write a perl script
<hikiko> unless if there's a tool
<willcooke> Right, you volunteered!  Trevinho you saw that, she can't take it back.
<hikiko> hahaha
 * willcooke . . o O ( Sucker! )
<willcooke> hikiko, seriously, if you don't mind taking a look at some point, that would be excellent
<Trevinho> :=
<Trevinho> :)
<willcooke> I asked about but no one seems to have implemented it yet
<willcooke> There's a Trello API...
<Trevinho> hikiko: I guess python would be nicer (to maintain), and there are already APIs
<hikiko> np, I ll use this for the trello part: http://search.cpan.org/~rbwohlfar/WWW-Trello-Lite-1.00/lib/WWW/Trello/Lite.pm
<hikiko> the only tricky part is lp
<hikiko> but if there's an api
<hikiko> I can just use it
<Trevinho> hikiko: eh, that's why I said python...
<willcooke> yeah, all the LP APIs are Python
<Trevinho> hikiko: there's an api, but it's all python based
<willcooke> s/all/the one I have seen
<willcooke> https://pypi.python.org/pypi/trello
<Trevinho> err, the library is python based... the api can be rewritten
<Trevinho> but toooo annoygin
<willcooke> oh, right, yeah, that's what I meant
<Trevinho> annoying***
<hikiko> Trevinho, you mean the lp api not the trello right?
<willcooke> yeah
<willcooke> https://launchpad.net/launchpadlib
<Trevinho> yes.....
<hikiko> well I ll try first without api because what we need is a script that: logins, finds the assigned bugs at the webpage and adds them to trello using our credentials right?
<hikiko> or we need all bugs that have a specific tag? (that doesn't even needs login)
<Trevinho> specific tags
<Trevinho> or, assigned to the last milestone
<Trevinho> hikiko: for LP api, there are some (raw) tools I use sometimes, so you might inspire https://gist.github.com/3v1n0/aa6ad749ce29cac15f61
<willcooke> IMO we should not import all bugs assigned to a milestone
<hikiko> so something like ./script tag=foo milestone=bar trelloname=marco trellopass=foobar ?
<willcooke> I think we should keep the bulk of the bugs in LP, and then at the start of an agile sprint we decide which and how many bugs to take in to the "sprint" and then only import those in to Trello
<Trevinho> hikiko: well trelloname and trellopass shouldn't be like that as I guess it uses a different auth method... But well
<hikiko> well then we need something like:
<Trevinho> yeah... So, basically the ones tagged in a certain way
<hikiko> ./script <treloauth> tag=sprint
<willcooke> yeah, that would be good.
<Trevinho> yeah, also it would be nice to have that running in a cron...
<hikiko> that's easy :)
<willcooke> But let's be agile ;)  Let's try it and if it doesn't work, we will adapt
<hikiko> yep
<willcooke> I can set up a server on Canonistack to host it if you like
<Trevinho> ah, yeah nice
<willcooke> oki, I will get that done tomorrow
 * Trevinho is always wondering how to get that canonistack thing running... But he's lazy to check the wiki
<willcooke> I have a pretty good idea, plus I have all my credentials set up, so that makes it a lot easier
<Trevinho> yes, sure
<willcooke> Trevinho, still around?
<willcooke> Do you think we can remove unity from this bug:
<willcooke> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/857738
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 857738 in unity (Ubuntu) "compiz crashed with SIGABRT in raise()" [Undecided,New]
<willcooke> Looks like the compiz crasher is sorted and no comments for a couple of years
<Trevinho> Watching TV... I'll be back soon. I'll check that btw
<willcooke> Trevinho, no hurry.  If you think it can be removed, please do that.
<Trevinho> Ah checked... Yeah no unity involved
<willcooke> Trevinho, thanks, I've removed it
<willcooke> only 1792 to go...
<willcooke> .. 1791 ...
<Trevinho> :-D
<willcooke> urgh.  Me and the Chromium debugger do battle with Wordpress stylesheets again
<willcooke> morning robert_ancell - how goes?
<robert_ancell> willcooke, hey
<willcooke> g'night all
#ubuntu-desktop 2015-09-15
<pitti> Good morning
<larsu> what a wonderful morning!
<pitti> hey larsu, wie gehts?
<larsu> pitti: fantastisch - war gerade in der Sonne joggen :)
<pitti> larsu: wow, alles grau und regnerisch hier
<larsu> pitti: hier nicht :P https://www.dropbox.com/sc/tpuhymanh0255xv/AABAidOQ2jiSrTKFY2sAJc7ia
<pitti> niice!
<larsu> :)
<larsu> wie gehts dir?
<pitti> larsu: ganz okay, konnte nur wieder schlecht schlafen
<larsu> pitti: oh? Wasn los?
<pitti> weiss auch nicht, war die letzten Tage halt so
<larsu> hm, alles Gute!
<didrocks> good morning!
<larsu> hi didrocks
<larsu> Ã§a va?
<hikiko> hello
<larsu> morning hikiko
<pitti> bonjour didrocks, Ã§a va ?
<didrocks> hey larsu, hikiko, pitti
<didrocks> I'm fine, didn't sleep well at the hotel (until 3h30), but at the conference :p
<pitti> lol
<didrocks> opening in a hour, so just catching up on work ;)
<hikiko> hi didrocks larsu pitti :D
<didrocks> they really made the place quite cool
<larsu> where are you?
<didrocks> larsu: https://www.polymer-project.org/summit (there is a photo below)
<didrocks> larsu: it looks like this now: https://goo.gl/photos/H5hD2frXAyUfQB3m7
<larsu> didrocks: cool!
 * didrocks has beautiful donuts in front of meâ¦ sad that I ate too much this morning already :p
<larsu> :)
 * didrocks is in the room, exciting! :)
<didrocks> meanwhile, did a small html import for ubuntu font: https://github.com/ubuntu/font-ubuntu
<larsu> didrocks: *info :P
<didrocks> larsu: are you sure? I was certain informations was always plural
<pitti> "information" is like "water", no "informations" in English
<pitti> contre par franÃ§ais ou allemand :)
<didrocks> ah, so the contrary, I probably mixed up with "news"
<didrocks> thx, fixing!
<larsu> didrocks: yes, "information" is already plural. There's no need to add an extra s
<didrocks> larsu: crazy language :p
<pitti> en effet !
<larsu> didrocks: I guess in French it's like in German? (singular: Information; plural: Informationen)
<didrocks> ;)
<didrocks> right: information, informations
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<pitti> in English, "information" and "advice" are both not countable, so no plural
<larsu> ah even harder because it's spelled the same
<pitti> bonjour seb128 ! Ã§a va ?
<larsu> pitti: thanks for your advices!
<pitti> larsu: *OCD jumping up and down*
<seb128> hey pitti
 * larsu calms pitti down
<pitti> mais on a appris le calendrier et les dates hier soir au course franÃ§ais -- c'est un peu difficile aussi !
<seb128> pitti, tu prends des cours de franÃ§ais ?
<pitti> seb128: oui, depuis la derniÃ¨re semaine
<seb128> ah, c'est bien :-)
<seb128> 1 fois par semaine ?
<pitti> (la semaine derniÃ©re ? je ne peux pas me rappeler)
<didrocks> pitti: passe ton systÃ¨me en franÃ§ais, tu auras la date du jour comme Ã§a :)
<pitti> seb128: oui, et quelques exercises pour faire Ã  maison
<pitti> didrocks: dÃ©solÃ©, je ne l'ai pas compris Ã§a
<didrocks> pitti: easy, "system-settings -> languages -> french" ;) then you will have a french date!
<pitti> seb128: les courses (oÃ¹ je peux parler avec des vraies personnes :) ) et duolingo sont bien pour apprendre
<seb128> pitti, "les cours", "courses" c'est pour le shopping ou le sport ;-)
<pitti> didrocks: ah! le mot "passer" a trop de significations
<seb128> pitti, tu parleras bientÃ´t franÃ§ais comme Didier et moi !
<pitti> seb128: ah, merci
<didrocks> pitti: facile, tu utilises "faire" ou "passer" et tu les mets partout :p
<pitti> seb128: j'attends avec impatience le fÃªtes des lumiÃ¨res en decembre, Annett et moi vont visiter !
<pitti> didrocks: :)
<larsu> je ne comprends rien!
<larsu> il fait chaud?!
<seb128> pitti, vous allez bien vous amuser :-)
<seb128> lol
<seb128> larsu, sorry man ;-)
<larsu> marmelade?
<larsu> bibliotheque!
<pitti> err, "avons" visiter, Ã©videmment
<seb128> Laney, desrt, bug 1495781 seems a side effect of the fix for trash on overlayfs you did
<ubot5> bug 1495781 in glib2.0 (Ubuntu) "Can't move to trash in data partition" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1495781
<seb128> oh, I see that Laney already saw that/commented upstream
<pitti> larsu: oui, il fait chaud (et humide) ici !
<larsu> :)
<pitti> larsu: Â¿como estas?
<larsu> pitti: bien, pero no entiendo lo que diceÃ­s
 * seb128 reconfigure larsu, seems he got a wrong locale set
<larsu> Configuration file `larsu'
<larsu>  ==> Modified (by you or a script) since installation
<larsu>  ==> Package distributor has shipped and updated version.
<larsu>     What would you like to do?
<larsu>   Y: install the package maintainers version
<larsu>   N: keep your local version
<larsu> *** (Y/N/blah) [default=N]
<seb128> larsu, :-)
<seb128> larsu, did you need another review for the tz lib code/packaging?
<willcooke> heeyyyooooo
<seb128> hey willcooke
<larsu> seb128: Laney had a look yesterday, but I guess another set of eyes can't hurt :)
<larsu> morning willcooke!
<seb128> larsu, what's the url again?
<hikiko> willcooke, managed to post cards
<hikiko> with perl
<hikiko> now I only have to do the lp part :)
<hikiko> hello btw
<hikiko> :p
<hikiko> (in trello) :p
<seb128> hey hikiko
<seb128> larsu, does https://code.launchpad.net/~lukas-kde/indicator-sound/fixUnity8MuteNotification/+merge/266459 looks fine to you?
<larsu> seb128: https://git.launchpad.net/geonames/?h=debian
<seb128> larsu, danke
<larsu> seb128: wow this is STILL a problem?!
<seb128> larsu, that mp is not that old?
<larsu> I commented a month ago :)
<seb128> oh, that was august :p
<larsu> ;)
<seb128> well, no reason it goes away if nothing changes
<seb128> I'm doing a landing for indicator-sound and I was wondering if I should include that
<larsu> I don't consider myself maintaining this anymore after people overrode decisions of mine
<hikiko> hi seb128
<larsu> but I
<larsu> I'll comment again
<seb128> but if it's still discussed that's fine, it can go with the next landing
<seb128> larsu, thanks
<larsu> seb128: at least the whitespace fuckup should be fixed
<larsu> so yeah, let's wait for the next landing
<seb128> larsu, whitespace, you mean the alignment fix in the first chunck?
<larsu> yes
<seb128> it seems correct but has nothing to do with that changeset so should probably be split?
<larsu> oh wait, your're right
 * larsu misread the else
<larsu> thanks
<larsu> wait a second please
<seb128> yw
<seb128> sure
<seb128> I'm going to make coffee
<seb128> take your time
<larsu> enjoy
<seb128> thanks :-)
<willcooke> hey hikiko - nice one!  Thanks!
<larsu> seb128: done, but still has problems
<seb128> larsu, thanks for the review!
<Laney> yo
<larsu> hi Laney
<Laney> hey larsuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuUUUUUUUUUUuuuuUUUuuuuuuu
<larsu> oh wow
<larsu> how are you?
<Laney> gnarly thanks
<Laney> I went on a ride last night where we looked at how the rain makes pudddles in the road
<Laney> and the angle of kerbs
<Laney> and the positioning of trees
<Laney> the timing of traffic signals
<Laney> IT WAS GREAT!
<Laney> you?
<larsu> documenting how well cyclists can use the infrastructure?
<seb128> hey Laney
<larsu> pretty good thanks
<larsu> went running in the sun this morning
<Laney> sun
<Laney> what is this word
<larsu> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sun ?
<Laney> 404
<Laney> (HAHAHAHA)
<larsu> haha
<larsu> Britain.
<larsu> they block porn and references to good waether
<Laney> and they want to build a superhighway for bikes or something so we were looking at the route of that
<larsu> *weather
<larsu> oh cool!
<larsu> superhighway sounds ... galactic!
 * Laney speeds into the city centre
<Laney> hey seb128!
<Laney> how's home life?
<Laney> do you miss the trail?
<seb128> larsu, Trevinho, does one of you fancy reviewing https://code.launchpad.net/~nobuto/notify-osd/fix_dnd_is_screensaver_inhibited/+merge/255538 ?
<Laney> 15/09 09:17:35 -ChanServ(ChanServ@services.)- 7     infinity               +ARefiorstv (dmb-member) [modified 6w 1d 14h ago]
<Laney> oops!
<Laney> secret dmb leakage :-)
<larsu> seb128: is this ours now that MacSlow is gone?
<seb128> larsu, because it was not before? ;-)
<larsu> *officially :/
<seb128> but I guess "yes"
<Laney> he's still alive you know
<larsu> not in this channel
<Laney> might be willing to review things
<larsu> so ... not really
<Laney> dunno what kind of tab completion you have
<larsu> oh hi MacSlow :)
 * larsu must be confused
<Laney> but I guess yes officially
<hikiko> is it possible to resize the screen to a resolution that is > to your screen resolution?
<seb128> hikiko, should not no
<larsu> hopefully not
<hikiko> thanks seb128
<hikiko> I was wondering
<hikiko> if I could reproduce this bug:
<hikiko> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/1485727
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1485727 in unity (Ubuntu) "Corrupted unity desktop after resizing vbox/vmware window." [High,In progress]
<hikiko> without vbox
<hikiko> because development directly in the pc is faster
<MacSlow> larsu, well I'll certainly still be around... it's not that I drop of the face of the earth :)
<seb128> hikiko, you can configure a lower resolution, start compiz/unity and then change back the native one
<hikiko> let's see
<seb128> Laney, hey, life is good :-) I do miss the trail at time but my feet don't !
<seb128> I miss the good weather though
<seb128> we had sun mostly in Scotland where it's windy and rainy here
<larsu> MacSlow: hopefully!
<larsu> seb128: since when is inhibiting idle the same as not showing notifications?
<seb128> Laney, they apparently had their worst summer in a while, but weather turned to be good just when we arrived :-)
 * larsu guesses this is what we did before?
<Laney> oh wow
<seb128> I'm unsure, seems like we disabled it when lock screen is on
<hikiko> mm the bug doesn't appear at all :/ I ll use virtualbox
<Laney> larsu: I guess it's an approximation for full screen
<larsu> indeed
<Laney> I didn't notice this was broken
<Laney> yay for the death of IM clients!
<larsu> :(
<larsu> now we have custom notifications from firefox instead
<seb128> yeah, unsure what dnd_is_screensaver_inhibited is for exactly
<larsu> gnome shell doesn't seem to do this
<seb128> maybe MacSlow remembers
<larsu> tbh, I think we should probably throw this out completely
<seb128> that would work for me as well
<seb128> MacSlow, do you remember why we had the dnd_is_screensaver_inhibited logic (see https://code.launchpad.net/~nobuto/notify-osd/fix_dnd_is_screensaver_inhibited/+merge/255538)
<MacSlow> seb128, larsu: iirc that was because we wanted to avoid notifications showing up when e.g. the user is doing a fullscreen-presentation..
<larsu> MacSlow: we should probably have a special inhibit flag for that
<MacSlow> ... to avoid embarrasing moments when getting cozy IM-messages from your spouse/wife/husband/whatever...
<MacSlow> larsu, but several upstream apps would then have to be patched too, if we introduce a new inhibit-mechanism
<larsu> indeed...
<MacSlow> larsu, I see another "grep of hell" in the future ;) at least for the package in main
<MacSlow> packages
<Laney> seems annoying
<MacSlow> Laney, well... we have some experience in that
<Laney> doing annoying development? :)
 * larsu chuckles
<MacSlow> Laney, no... just the "grep of hell"-part :)
<Laney> larsu: what /does/ shell do?
<larsu> Laney: trying to find out right now.....
<Trevinho> hikiko: best checking with VMware, also you can build in host  and just copy the built libunityshell in guest
<seb128> Laney, larsu, I think they use to have a "dnd" switch in the equivalent of their indicator-session which inhibit notifications
<seb128> but that's a manual action
<hikiko> true, that's what I ll do Trevinho
<seb128> unsure if/what they do for the fullscreen presentation case
<larsu> seb128: they don't seem to anymore... calling Inhibit(8) still let's me send notifications
<larsu> Laney: ^
<didrocks> on, some Internetâ¦
<didrocks> oh*
<didrocks> (break time)
<seb128> hey didrocks, how is the conf?
<didrocks> seb128: the talks are a little bit basicâ¦ At least, it confirms my understanding where they want to go with it
<didrocks> and how they try to convince web developers to use an object/element model system
<didrocks> which is quite obvious for us to structure an app :)
<didrocks> however, quite not impressed by their network connection
<hikiko> https://i.imgur.com/ysUU76u.jpg wily blue screen of death  :p (I started unity in a broken vm)
<Trevinho> O_o
<larsu> seb128, Laney: I added a demo app at https://git.launchpad.net/geonames?h=master which is not built by default (because we don't want the package to depend on gtk)
<larsu> would appreciate if you could break it for me
<larsu> should be feature complete with the ubuntu-system-settings version (plus sorting by population, which I just added)
<larsu> next on my list is to allow localized names as well, but that's tricky (and wouldn't be a regression)
<larsu> Laney: shall I port system-settings, or do you want to?
<Laney> larsu: I'm not that keen so if you are then go wild
<GunnarHj> seb128: Hi Sebastien!
<GunnarHj> seb128: Would appreciate some advice on bug #1495097. Time to take a look?
<ubot5> bug 1495097 in hunspell (Ubuntu) "LibreOffice crashes when interacting with Danish and Swedish thesauri" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1495097
<larsu> there is no Swedish conspiracy
<Laney> GunnarHj: docs team ping
<Laney> GunnarHj: haven't had the default wallpaper yet, is that a problem for you?
<Laney> supposed to be coming soon
<Laney> also, hey, how's it going? :)
<GunnarHj> Hi Laney, I'm fine, thanks. How about you?
<Laney> feeling a bit octopus like
<ogra_> growing suckers ?
<Laney> predicting the outcome of sporting tournaments
 * Laney misses Paul
<GunnarHj> Laney: No problem with the wallpaper; we don't use it in language specific screenshots, so we can fix the English screenshots after doc string freeze.
<Laney> I'm guessing (but don't know) that it will be another tweak on the same concept
<Laney> so maybe not even that noticable
<GunnarHj> Ok.
<GunnarHj> Laney: Is there some conference going on?
<Laney> don't think so
<Laney> why?
<GunnarHj> Laney: Checked out the irc log for #ubuntu-desktop, and people started to talk at 04:56. Probably the time stamp is wrong then. ;)
<Laney> you should grep for pitti's "good morning" over the last few years :)
<GunnarHj> Yeah, but it wasn't just pitti...
<seb128> GunnarHj, hey
<seb128> GunnarHj, those timestamps are UTC ones, so it's almost 6am local time and the next line is one hour after that
<GunnarHj> seb128: Ok, I jumped at conclusion then. :)
<GunnarHj> larsu: Just noticed your remark "no Swedish conspiracy". Guess I have to believe you. ;)
<seb128> Trevinho, re your comment on the notify-osd change, cf channel backlog, it seems like it's a hack solution to not display notification when doing presentations and such (e.g assuming that presentation/view mode inhibit idle)
<willcooke> didrocks, the script you mentioned in your email - is that to import in to Trello or to process bugs?
<didrocks> willcooke: the one in my email is to import to Trello
<didrocks> (and there is some other snippets as well on processing/syncing bugs email)
<willcooke> cool, I will speak to Ted, thanks didrocks
<didrocks> yw
<didrocks> willcooke: mostly sure we had one for trello, (that was before the company mostly move to asana)
 * Laney hacked the sponsorship report to give per-team reports
<Laney> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/sponsoring/ubuntu-desktop.html
<seb128> Laney, great :-)
<larsu> \o/
<seb128> though a bit weird
<seb128> why are things like exim and bcmwl and livecd-rootfs on our list?
<seb128> we don't even have exim on the iso
<Laney> Archive Upload Rights for ubuntu-desktop: archive 'primary', package set 'ubuntu-desktop' in wily
<Laney> * Reverse Recommends: +- subversion-tools |  * Supported-Development-Desktop seed
<seb128> hum, k
<Laney> we might want to clean up these supported lists
<seb128> indeed
<Laney> but for sponsoring we can probably handle a few weird things being on there
<Laney> like that exim merge has already waited a while
<willcooke> thanks Laney
<seb128> yeah
<seb128> I tend to look at everything in the queue when I sponsor, often there are easy sync requests or typo fixes or small patches for things that don't belong to any important set
<seb128> but I guess some people would prefer keeping a closer eye on the desktop subset
<Laney> sort of hoping that I can get into a habit of checking this set more regularly
<Laney> and patch pilot everything in the queue once a month
<seb128> that would be good
 * Laney wonders about indicator-sponsoring ;-)
<larsu> uh oh
<larsu> is Laney tedg in disguise?
<Laney> heheh
<tedg> larsu: We often get confused.
<tedg> But please ping charles about indicator reviews.
<seb128> tedg, I though people confused you with Ken usually; not Charles? ;-)
<tedg> seb128: I tried to get business cards with "The better looking kenvandine" on them, but eh, they said it was too long.
<seb128> lol
<kenvandine> lol
 * larsu lokks puzzled
<larsu> *looks
<GunnarHj> seb128: Did you notice my request for advice on bug #1495097?
<ubot5> bug 1495097 in hunspell (Ubuntu) "LibreOffice crashes when interacting with Danish and Swedish thesauri" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1495097
<seb128> GunnarHj, yes, sorry, I was on my way to lunch and forgot to look at it once I was back
<GunnarHj> seb128: Ok. Time now?
<seb128> GunnarHj, yeah, looking
<seb128> GunnarHj, seems fine to update to 1.3.3 as a SRU, maybe not taking the vivid version though, we try to minimize the delta when doing SRUs for easier reviews
<seb128> GunnarHj, hum, 1.3.3 has features though
<seb128> "OpenDocument (ODF and Flat ODF) support"
<seb128> unsure if the SRU team would be happy with that
<seb128> it might be better to backport the bugfixes commits
<GunnarHj> seb128: The problem is that we have been trying that way for a few days, and haven't succeeded (at least not yet).
<seb128> why? you didn't figure out which commits fix the issue?
<seb128> is there a vcs for hunspell?
<GunnarHj> seb128: We found which commits claims to fix the issue, but backporting them only partially addresses the problem.
<GunnarHj> seb128: So it's complex.
<GunnarHj> seb128: The PPA was made for the purpose.
<seb128> GunnarHj, you can try to make a debdiff of the 1.3.2 -> 1.3.3 update and ping the SRU team for opinions to see if they consider that acceptable as a SRU
<seb128> if they don't then you need to do more work figuring out what to backport
<GunnarHj> seb128: Ok. That diff will contain a lot of other stuff, though...
<seb128> GunnarHj, right, which is why the SRU team might reject the idea to do that update
<willcooke> hikiko, I asked tedg and he pointed me to robru
<GunnarHj> seb128: I'll do as you suggest. Thanks!
<seb128> GunnarHj, yw!
<hikiko> willcooke, at least we know that someone has the script already :D less work for us!
<willcooke> hikiko, :)
<hallyn> 'unity-control-center network' in uptodate wily says 'The system network services are not compatible with this version" - known inprogress bug?
<hikiko> hallyn, I just installed wily today, wait a sec, I ll see if I can reproduce it
<hikiko> hallyn, I got the same message :)
<hikiko> (fresh installation, default settings)
<seb128> hallyn, not known until now and not in progress
<seb128> I guess a sideeffect of nm 1.0
<seb128> cyphermox, ^ do you know about it?
<hallyn> ok, thx. combined with not being able to run unity (for the net indicator) and wpa_supplicant+dhclient not updating resolvconf correctly, it's starting to feel like linux-from-scratch here :)
 * Sweet5hark lurks around in backlog.
<hallyn> thanks hikiko
<seb128> Sweet5hark, hey
<cyphermox> unity-control-center network?
<Sweet5hark> seb128: welcome back from vacation, btw! ;)
<cyphermox> use nm-connection-editor
<seb128> cyphermox, unity-control-center is our gnome-control-center fork
<cyphermox> yes, I knew that :)
<cyphermox> I'm just saying I hadn't heard of that issue
<seb128> k
<cyphermox> it's got to be checking versions
<seb128> do you have some cycle to have a lot?
<seb128> cyphermox, I guess something like https://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-control-center/commit/?id=f30e6df1d4665b06a45ad7bbe7a2ed2bfa9387f5
<seb128> let me try that
<cyphermox> https://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-control-center/commit/?id=f30e6df1d4665b06a45ad7bbe7a2ed2bfa9387f5
<cyphermox> hah
<cyphermox> yes, we get to the same thing
<seb128> hallyn, want to report a bug against https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity-control-center/+filebug ?
<seb128> cyphermox, thanks
<Laney> that's lucky
<Laney> looks like the panel got refactored since
<seb128> unsure it applies
<seb128> so wait for lucky comments :p
<qengho> Do any of you have a x86 32/64bit CPU that has no sse instruction set? Some kinds of AMD CPU or the like?
<qengho> $ grep " sse " /proc/cpuinfo
<qengho> ^ if that says anything, your CPU is too good for my purposes.
<willcooke> qengho,checking.  Maybe a virtual machine can help?
<qengho> willcooke: True, it could give me a positive result but I wouldn't trust a negative result.
<willcooke> qengho, I assume you need a desktop as well?
<willcooke> meh, even my VMs say they support sse
<qengho> willcooke: Yes, or fake x server. I need to know if Chromium is really avoiding SSE instructions if the CPU doesn't support it.
<willcooke> qengho, is ARM any use?
<willcooke> expect not
<qengho> willcooke: no.
 * willcooke feels a disturbance in the force
<seb128> hey
<hikiko> meeting time?
<desrt> bzzt
<willcooke> #startmeeting Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2015-09-15
<meetingology> Meeting started Tue Sep 15 15:30:33 2015 UTC.  The chair is willcooke. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Breaking your systems: GTK 3.16 - file bugs with tag "gtk316" | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2015-09-15 | Current topic:
<willcooke> Roll call: andyrock, attente, desrt,  dgadomski, didrocks (out), fjkong, happyaron, hikiko, laney, larsu, qengho, seb128, sweet5hark, themuso (out), tkamppeter, trevino, robert_ancell (out)
<desrt> o/
<larsu> o\
<Trevinho> o/
<hikiko> /o\
<dgadomski> hey
<qengho> o--
<hikiko> -O0
<desrt> -ggdb3 ?
<Sweet5hark> .
<willcooke> Let's go...
 * larsu stays
<hallyn> seb128: bug 1496028 , thx
<ubot5> bug 1496028 in unity-control-center (Ubuntu) "incompatible with network-manager version" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1496028
<willcooke> If you are not around when it's your go please shout and I will come back to you at the end
<willcooke> #topic andyrock
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Breaking your systems: GTK 3.16 - file bugs with tag "gtk316" | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2015-09-15 | Current topic: andyrock
<andyrock> hey
<andyrock> I spent this week still trying to fix the resize bug on vm
<andyrock> I'm kind of blocked
<andyrock> so I asked help to hikiko
<andyrock> she knows more about compiz
<andyrock> we have workaround to fix the problem
<andyrock> but would be nice to have a proper fix
<andyrock> eof
<willcooke> thanks andyrock
<willcooke> #topic attente
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Breaking your systems: GTK 3.16 - file bugs with tag "gtk316" | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2015-09-15 | Current topic: attente
<attente> not much, continuing work on gtk popup menu placement... fixing the code to make sure we can properly support combo boxes...
<attente> (eof)
<willcooke> thanks attente
<willcooke> #topic desrt
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Breaking your systems: GTK 3.16 - file bugs with tag "gtk316" | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2015-09-15 | Current topic: desrt
<desrt> got the inotify stuff into the glib tree as a patch against the backend... basic file monitoring is working, but i need to improve support for missing files, symlinks, etc.
<desrt> i also have nothing else at all to say about anything else
<desrt> eof.
<willcooke> thanks desrt.  Thank you for working over the weekend for the inotify stuff
<desrt> np.  still lots of work to do there unfortunately
<desrt> i found that my approach has a problem :(
<willcooke> #topic dgadomski
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Breaking your systems: GTK 3.16 - file bugs with tag "gtk316" | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2015-09-15 | Current topic: dgadomski
<willcooke> oops, sorry desrt
<desrt> no worries.  does not need to be discussed here.
<willcooke> kk
<willcooke> dgadomski, how goes?
<dgadomski> hey
<dgadomski> it's gonna be quick again - there were no new desktop issues reported, so nothing to share this time.
<dgadomski> thank you
<willcooke> \o/
<willcooke> thanks dgadomski
<willcooke> #topic FJKong
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Breaking your systems: GTK 3.16 - file bugs with tag "gtk316" | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2015-09-15 | Current topic: FJKong
<FJKong> continue fixing bugs on pinyin search
<FJKong> need to search how to display icon
<FJKong> new feature requirement for andvanced search
<FJKong> eof
<willcooke> thanks FJKong
<willcooke> #topic happyaron
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Breaking your systems: GTK 3.16 - file bugs with tag "gtk316" | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2015-09-15 | Current topic: happyaron
<willcooke> probably out
<willcooke> #topic hikiko
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Breaking your systems: GTK 3.16 - file bugs with tag "gtk316" | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2015-09-15 | Current topic: hikiko
<hikiko> just came back from holidays so that's what I did yesterday and today...: finished those tutorials, and I am looking at bug #1485727 I think the problem is that we have gl calls called by a signal handler so we don't know what the opengl context is when thes calls run (+we have different processes at that time)
<ubot5> bug 1485727 in unity (Ubuntu) "Corrupted unity desktop after resizing vbox/vmware window." [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1485727
<hikiko> a change of mine revealed this bug but it was necessary I can't revert it
<hikiko> (that's the bug andyrock mentioned)
<hikiko> eof
<willcooke> thanks hikiko
<willcooke> good work on the blog posts
<willcooke> and very cool video
<willcooke> #topic Laney
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Breaking your systems: GTK 3.16 - file bugs with tag "gtk316" | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2015-09-15 | Current topic: Laney
<Laney> â¢ Help upload indicator-datetime for timedated fixes
<Laney> â¢ Review/upload gnome-terminal from Trevinho to improve scrollbars
<Laney> â¢ Make it so you can disable whoopsie on Ubuntu phones (fix the "don't send crash reports" setting)
<Laney> â¢ Help with uploading a new gtk to the "overlay" for phone, move off old Mir
<Laney> â¢ Work on a private test for a new version of the Ubuntu font
<Laney> â¢ Update: gdk-pixbuf
<Laney> â¢ Work with gstreamer upstream on some patches to fix conflicting typedefs with gl (not gles) disabled, now fixed
<Laney> â¢ Small hacking on the sponsor queue to generate per-team reports
<Laney> â¢ Poke a bit at glib, there's a race/timing issue in GDateTime, file upstream
<Laney> â¢ Some release team reviews
<Laney> â
<willcooke> thanks Laney
<willcooke> #topic larsu
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Breaking your systems: GTK 3.16 - file bugs with tag "gtk316" | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2015-09-15 | Current topic: larsu
<larsu> - finished up datetime stuff (thanks again Laney)
<larsu> - made a library for looking up city names, becasue city selections on phone and desktop are really bad
<larsu> (looked through all bugs I could find to see what we need)
<larsu> project is up, testing appreciated
<larsu> - started integrating that into u-c-c, u-s-s is up next
<larsu> </larsu>
<seb128> larsu \o/
<willcooke> thanks larsu
<seb128> thanks for working on the city selection
<seb128> that was needed :-)
<Laney> really bad hurts my feelings :(
<larsu> :)
<willcooke> yes, huge usability improvement - thanks
 * Trevinho agrees
<larsu> Laney: "bad" was the backend you used - not your fault
<qengho> Is UTC an option? The geographic list bothers me elsewhere.
<larsu> qengho: elsewhere?
<larsu> qengho: no, you can only select cities
<qengho> That Other Phone OS.
<larsu> ah. take it up with mpt :)
 * larsu thinks we should only accept places in an entry labelled "location"
<willcooke> let's take this bit of the discussion up after the meeting
<willcooke> #topic qengho
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Breaking your systems: GTK 3.16 - file bugs with tag "gtk316" | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2015-09-15 | Current topic: qengho
<qengho> * chromium 45.0.2454.85 bugs. Not released yet.
<qengho> ** sse instruction-set detection and SIGILLs.
<qengho> ** l10n package might be broken. staging-ppa user complained. can't reproduce yet.
<qengho> * bug, Cr can't run in guest account. kernel patch dependencies should have landed everywhere in May.
<qengho> EOF
 * Laney feels better
<willcooke> Can people check their old machines to help test the SSE issue
<willcooke> thanks qengho
<qengho> Old AMDs?
<willcooke> #topic seb128
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Breaking your systems: GTK 3.16 - file bugs with tag "gtk316" | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2015-09-15 | Current topic: seb128
<seb128> was on holidays, only back since yesterday
<seb128> â¢ spent most of the day catching up with backlog
<seb128> â¢ landed indicator fixes made during the london week (to start the correct settings binary under unity8 desktop sessions)
<seb128> â¢ uploaded some other pending desktop fixes as well (notify-osd, indicator-session)
<seb128> â¢ tested a libusermetrics bugfix and found an issue, discussed extra changes required
<seb128> â¢ started looking at u-c-c needed some changes to be compatible with n-m 1
<seb128> </day.5>
<larsu> day 5?
<seb128> .5
<seb128> yesterday and today
<willcooke> thanks seb128
<willcooke> #topic Sweet5hark
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Breaking your systems: GTK 3.16 - file bugs with tag "gtk316" | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2015-09-15 | Current topic: Sweet5hark
<Sweet5hark> - accompanied/finished LibrOffice 5.0.1/wily upload (thanks cyphermox)
<Sweet5hark> - tested using system libetonyek, libwps, libcmis, cppunit: looking good
<Sweet5hark> - security topics
<Sweet5hark> - conference preparations: travel, slides, code
<Sweet5hark> - next up: 5.0.2.2 FFE, expected to be tagged upstream tomorrow
<Sweet5hark> EOF
<willcooke> thanks Sweet5hark
<willcooke> #topic TheMuso
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Breaking your systems: GTK 3.16 - file bugs with tag "gtk316" | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2015-09-15 | Current topic: TheMuso
<willcooke> * Finall found and fixed the accessibility bug to do with quicklist menu items not being spoken by Orca.
<willcooke> * Found and fixed a similar bug with the shutdown/restart/logout buttons.
<willcooke> * Discussions with upstrea about Orca gsettings implementation details.
<willcooke> * Started looking at into packaging PulseAudio 7 and putting it in a PPA for testing. It would be nice to land this early for 16.04
<willcooke> #topic tkamppeter
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Breaking your systems: GTK 3.16 - file bugs with tag "gtk316" | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2015-09-15 | Current topic: tkamppeter
<tkamppeter> - cups-filters: Several fixes done on the load balancing of cups-browsed, especially jobs are not waiting on the servers but on the client, avoiding loss on server failure or removal and better distribution of the work load. We chack also if the remote queues are actually accepting jobs, let AppArmor allow cups-browsed to create files for default printer management and load balancing. These and more fixes are released in cups-filters 1.0.76 now
<tkamppeter> and included in Wily.
<tkamppeter> - cups: Backported infinite loop fix for the USB backend.
<tkamppeter> - ippusbxd: More testing.
<tkamppeter> - Bugs.
<willcooke> tkamppeter, did you parcel arrive?
<tkamppeter> willcooke, not yet, tracking told on 09/09 that it is going to Curitiba, then nothin and today it said that it has arrived in Curitiba, from there it should somehow get to here.
<willcooke> tkamppeter, ack.  thanks
<willcooke> #topic Trevinho
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Breaking your systems: GTK 3.16 - file bugs with tag "gtk316" | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2015-09-15 | Current topic: Trevinho
<Trevinho> First Meeting with Nudt (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Ubuntu%20Kylin/Meeting/2015/20150910)
<Trevinho> Landed new scrollbar theming and fixes for gnome-terminal
<Trevinho> Fixed FTTB in libunity
<Trevinho> Even more autopilot-legacy fixes
<Trevinho> Done landing for new unity, ubuntu-themes, compiz, autopilot and libunity (took more than expected due to regressions)
<Trevinho> Some updates to the unity7 howto build post (https://unity.ubuntu.com/getinvolved/development/unity/)
<Trevinho> Nux window compositor event handling fixes (needed to get new dash scrollbars working)
<Trevinho> Prepared a backport branch for trusty SRU on a security but of unity-settings-daemon (needs seb128 ack)
<Trevinho> Usual reviews
<Trevinho> î¿
<willcooke> thanks Trevinho
<willcooke> #topic robert_ancell
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Breaking your systems: GTK 3.16 - file bugs with tag "gtk316" | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2015-09-15 | Current topic: robert_ancell
<willcooke> - Worked on XMir issues with duflu
<willcooke> - Released simple-scan 3.17.92
<willcooke> - Stable package updates
<seb128> Trevinho, sorry I was on vac, I can look at your security change this week if you remind me the url
<willcooke> #topic Any other business
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Breaking your systems: GTK 3.16 - file bugs with tag "gtk316" | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2015-09-15 | Current topic: Any other business
<Trevinho> seb128: https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/unity-settings-daemon/automount-monitor-lockscreen-trusty (it's just a backport, same code already in wily)
<seb128> Trevinho, thanks
<willcooke> Sprint - still no news.  Considering a move of location and/or date to see if we finalise everything.  More news as I get it.
<seb128> Sweet5hark, did you apply for DMB again? you said you would do after holidays
<mdeslaur> Trevinho, seb128: I am pushing out unity-settings-daemon security updates tomorrow
<mpt> qengho, I specced that âUTCâ should be an unlisted but typeable option for the PC settings, but I never did the same for the phone settings. Maybe I should. <https://wiki.ubuntu.com/TimeAndDate#PC>
<seb128> mdeslaur, oh, great, thanks
<mdeslaur> Trevinho, seb128: so please don't do anything with that merge request, I'm handling it in the usual security update way
<Trevinho> mdeslaur: ah, fair enough. I was considering a landing at this point (as it was there for long time ayway :))
<Sweet5hark> seb128: not yet. looked and found a sponsor/reviewer from the DMB for the LibreOffice package though. (cyphermox this time).
<mdeslaur> Trevinho: thanks for fixing that! :)
<seb128> mdeslaur, less work, +1 from me!
<Trevinho> np ;)
<mdeslaur> hehe
<willcooke> ok, I think we're there.
<Sweet5hark> seb128: he wondered how I am neither drunk nor in hospital after seeing the nitty-gritty details of the package.
<willcooke> #endmeeting
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Breaking your systems: GTK 3.16 - file bugs with tag "gtk316"
<meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Sep 15 16:00:28 2015 UTC.
<meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2015/ubuntu-desktop.2015-09-15-15.30.moin.txt
<mdeslaur> seb128: I'll trade you for finding someone to review this: https://code.launchpad.net/~mdeslaur/indicator-power/fix-priorities
<seb128> willcooke, if we move the sprint maybe ask everyone what weeks they are available or not (or check calendar if it has the info)
<willcooke> seb128, of course
<Laney> That would be annoying
<Laney> I've been turning down plans for that week
<willcooke> Laney, likewise
<willcooke> it's a last resort
<seb128> willcooke, imho better to keep the week, if locations don't work and we have to do it in London let's do that?
<willcooke> seb128, yeah I think that's the best option
<willcooke> clan is working on it right now
<seb128> k
<Trevinho> well, but Prague.... <3
<Trevinho> Anyway, it's fine everywhere for me
<larsu> willcooke: sorry to be so blunt, but wtf is going on? We have a sprint every October and yet time/date is still up in the air...
<larsu> it's very hard to make any plans this way
<Sweet5hark> oh, guys, I forgot the big news for today ....
<willcooke> larsu, I'll be happy to discuss off line
<larsu> *time/place, sorry
<Sweet5hark> Italian military switches 150.000 desktops to LibreOffice and ODF: https://joinup.ec.europa.eu/community/osor/news/italian-military-switch-libreoffice-and-odf
<Laney> time to commit a patch that changes all documents to "we stand for peace, the military is disbanded"
 * Trevinho proud of his army (for the first time ever)
 * Trevinho proud of his army (for the first time ever)
<Sweet5hark> Trevinho: heh
<Sweet5hark> Trevinho: yeah, thats all kinds of awesome.
<Sweet5hark> Trevinho: all kudos to the LibreItalia team. They are very awesome.
<Trevinho> Sweet5hark: yeah, I meet them from time to time, they're really cool guys!
<larsu> mpt: why UTC but not GMT or PDT?
<larsu> because otherwise one could't select a timezone without daylight savings time?
<seb128> Laney, unsure if you get u-c-c mps, you mentioned cases in the past where you didn't receive emails about those, so in case, https://code.launchpad.net/~seb128/unity-control-center/nm1/+merge/271157
<seb128> cyphermox, ^
<seb128> that fixes the buggy check and make the panel work without complaining
<Laney> seb128: will look tomorrow if nobody else does, thanks!
<Laney> and no I don't but at least they should come up on that sponsor page now
<seb128> Laney, thanks, enjoy your evening!
<seb128> climbing night for you?
 * seb128 has tennis tonight
<cyphermox> approved.
<seb128> quite wet and windy outside though
<seb128> cyphermox, thanks
<cyphermox> do I should do the merge too, or is that all you need?
<Laney> no climbing, did that the last two days
<cyphermox> oh, is this stuff that has to go through silos?
<Laney> MGS V â pub quiz
<Laney> it is a silofest
 * cyphermox fixes ubiquity instead
<Laney> you could practice your CI train skills
<cyphermox> well, technically I probably should be a trainguard this week or something, so it's possibly better if others do it
<seb128> cyphermox, I'm doing a landing, already in a silp
<seb128> silo
<cyphermox> ok
<seb128> Laney, good luck for the quiz ;-)
<didrocks> enjoy Laney ;)
<Laney> late night didrocks
<sethj> well
<sethj> I was going to help with the bug scrub, but the ubiquity crash bug prevents me from installing Wily so..
#ubuntu-desktop 2015-09-16
<xtalmath> s it possible to make my application generate a prompt dialog, that is system wide? so it can say block me from using the browser? is it a specific system call?
<pitti> Good morning
<didrocks> good morning!
<pitti> bonjour didrocks, Ã§a va ?
<pitti> didrocks: comment est le plastique ?
<didrocks> pitti: le plastique Ã©tait bien, mais fini hier soir :(
<didrocks> pitti: je travaille un peu avant d'aller Ã  l'aÃ©roport (mon vol est Ã  11h45)
<pitti> didrocks: ah, es-tu dÃ©jÃ  rentrÃ¨ ?
<didrocks> pitti: non, tout Ã  l'heure
<pitti> ah
<didrocks> pitti: et toi, comment Ã§a va ?
<pitti> didrocks: Ã§a va bien ! j'ai dormi trÃ¨s bien Ã  nouveau \o/
<didrocks> ah, super ! :-)
<larsu> good morning!
<didrocks> hey larsu!
<larsu> Laney, attente: congrats! https://www.bassi.io/articles/2015/09/15/who-wrote-gtk-3-18/
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<larsu> didrocks: bonjour! Ã§a va?
<larsu> oh aussi seb128! How are you?
<seb128> hey larsu, I'm good thanks, how are you?
<didrocks> larsu: Ã§a va bien :)
<didrocks> et toi ?
<larsu> seb128: great! Fixed gnome-logs boot menu for the 99.999% case late last night
<larsu> boot menu showed 0 entries when there's only one boot
<larsu> instead of ... you know ... 1
<larsu> didrocks: nickel! merci
<larsu> pitti: morning :) Do you know if we can get the journal to keep the most recent N logs?
<larsu> I see the point of not storing all of them, but having the last after a crash is probably useful
<pitti> hey larsu
<pitti> larsu: sure, just enable persistent journal, see /usr/share/doc/systemd/README.Debian
<larsu> I think I did this with `mkdir /var/log/journal`
<larsu> but according to its man page, it now stores everything, no?
<pitti> larsu: or just look at syslog, if you have that installed (I enabled persistant journal and uninstalled rsyslog)
<pitti> well, everything up to the size limits
<larsu> ah
<larsu> cool
<larsu> that makes sense
<larsu> thanks :)
<seb128> hey pitti
<pitti> Ã§a va seb128 !
<seb128> pitti, bien! et toi ?
 * larsu removes rsyslog as well - no need to keep *that* many logs
<pitti> seb128: je vais bien aussi, merci ! j'ai dormi bien Ã  nouveau
<seb128> ah, bonne nouvelle
<pitti> larsu: if you already have a persistant journal, then you should already see the previous boot -- try "journalctl -b -1"
<larsu> I do now, yes
 * larsu only noticed because gnome-logs is buggy in that case
<larsu> didrocks: so.... I'm actually eating a croissant with chocolate inside right now (sorry)
<larsu> (not claiming it's french, but it is very tasty)
 * didrocks cries
<didrocks> ok, going to checkout and then, train to the airport, I'll see if I can connect from there
<didrocks> later guys!
<larsu> later!
<willcooke> hi didrocks, bye didrocks
<willcooke> morning all
<larsu> hi willcooke. sup?
<willcooke> larsu, word
<Laney> hey!
<seb128> hey Laney!
<seb128> wie gehts?
<larsu> morning Laney!
<larsu> and congrats again :P
<larsu> Trevinho: new scrollbars break on web views :/
<Laney> told him that yesterday
<larsu> ah, thanks
<Laney> something messed up my keyboard then, it was like alt was held down all the time
 * Laney blames synergy
<Laney> oh i still can't use shift, wtf
<larsu> shift is OVERRATED
<darkxst> hey desktopers
<Laney> thanks for the congrats!
<davmor2> larsu: DOES THAT MAKE NO SHIFT underrated?
<Laney> oh It WoRkS aGaIn
<seb128> hey darkxst
<seb128> willcooke, so you posted the compiz/unity blog? now any plan to run the bot to close bugs before people waste effort on triaging those manually? ;-)
<willcooke> seb128, yeah, didrocks said he has some bots which can help
<seb128> willcooke, that was not prepared before sending the post? :-/
<willcooke> seb128, I want to allow time for people to find out that a robot is going to start closing their bugs so we don't get a sudden influx of "Hey, why did you close my bug" questions.
<larsu> willcooke: you'll get that either way, sadly
<willcooke> I dont think a gap of some days/a week is going to be a huge problem
<willcooke> larsu, yeah, probably true
<larsu> it helps if the closing comment contains "feel free to reopen if this is still an issue"
<willcooke> but if I can point to some public information that was published before we actioned it
<larsu> indeed
<willcooke> then we have a robust defence
<darkxst> you don't need a robot to close bugs, just 10 lines of python ;)
<larsu> I agree that this way around is better
<larsu> darkxst: that's what we call robots these days
<larsu> or ... you know .... "bots"
<willcooke> you kids, and your slang
<darkxst> larsu, its ok, I have a bot
<larsu> heh
<seb128> willcooke, right, it doesn't mean we couldn't have got the solution ready before posting :-)
<seb128> it just put us under pressure now because we started the process while we didn't figure out all the details yet
<seb128> but oh well, minor problem
<willcooke> yes, minor
<darkxst> I have a script somewhere to close of eol bugs, or are you want to close off more than that
<willcooke> darkxst, that will be useful, can you share?
<darkxst> willcooke, will dig it out after dinner
<willcooke> thanks
<seb128> willcooke, I'm going to help triaging a bit, let's see where we can get ;-)
<willcooke> seb128, I'm closing the apport ones now
<seb128> great
<seb128> manually?
<willcooke> maybe :)
<willcooke> depends on how many there are, vs how long it would take me to write a script
<seb128> some people probably have scripts for that
 * didrocks is now waiting for his plane (boarding in 40 minutes)
<seb128> hey didrocks
<mpt> larsu, because âUTCâ is something that (a) geeks may want to use and (b) has only one meaning. We couldnât cover all abbreviations because many of them are ambiguous: to cover just the ones starting with âAâ, ADT, AMST, AMT, and AST each refer to two different time zones.
<seb128> enjoying Schripold?
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, always liked this airport :)
<didrocks> enjoying the weather as well :p
<seb128> lol
<didrocks> so typical!
<didrocks> :)
<seb128> yesterday evening was fine!
<seb128> I went to play tennis from 8 to 10
<seb128> great weather
<didrocks> yeahâ¦ in 3 days, it was the only time which was fine :p
<seb128> when I wouldn't have bet on in the afternoon...
<didrocks> indeedâ¦
<didrocks> seems like there are high wind in Lyon (~110km/h)
<seb128> Trevinho, andyrock, bug #1496294 seems to be new in wily and high ranked on e.u.c
<didrocks> I hope the arrival won't be jumpy
<ubot5> bug 1496294 in unity (Ubuntu) "/usr/bin/compiz:11:g_bit_lock:g_variant_lock:g_variant_fill_gvs:gvs_variable_sized_array_needed_size:g_variant_serialiser_needed_size" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1496294
<seb128> didrocks, urg, good luck
<larsu> mpt: fair enough, but being able to type this in "Location" still feels wrong to me
<mpt> larsu, itâs a hidden treasure. I wouldnât want to add extra UI for it.
<mpt> (Or distract people by labelling it âLocation or UTC:â.)
<larsu> people that live in a city that starts with "utc" will see it ...
<larsu> *cough*
<larsu> well, at least people in cities starting with u and ut
<flexiondotorg> Morning.
<flexiondotorg> I was just smoke testing the daily isos.
<flexiondotorg> Ubiquity crashes on start up on both Ubuntu MATE and Xubuntu.
<flexiondotorg> Are you aware?
<Laney> Is it the network-manager thing?
<flexiondotorg> Yep.
<larsu> Laney is aware
<Laney> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubiquity/+bug/1495017/comments/16
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1495017 in ubiquity (Ubuntu Wily) "ubiquity crashed with permission error on NetworkManager GetDevices() call" [High,Fix released]
<flexiondotorg> Laney, Just saw nm has been updated :-)
<darkxst> I think that was fixed today
<seb128> it's still in proposed
<seb128> oh, just moved to release
<seb128> darkxst, bug #1496298 is due to new nautilus in the GNOME ppa, yet another case of GNOME dropping a key from a schemas...
<ubot5> bug 1496298 in nautilus (Ubuntu) "/usr/bin/gedit:5:g_settings_schema_get_value:g_settings_schema_key_init:g_settings_bind_with_mapping:g_settings_bind:install_nautilus_prefs" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1496298
<larsu> sigh
<larsu> when will people realize that these are public API
<seb128> larsu, Laney, do you have youtube showing as a source in totem?
<seb128> I don't, I wonder if that's a local issue
<larsu> nope
<larsu> rai.tv, blib.tv, and apple trailers
<seb128> same here
<Laney> yeah same
<Laney> is it meant to?
<seb128> I thought it was
<seb128> I expect youtube to be more popular than the other ones
 * larsu vaguely remembers some legal issue
<seb128> well, I guess it's supposed to work
<seb128> https://git.gnome.org/browse/totem/commit/?id=8121563b4fb276a984ed6fcd8d4d27f83b3aaa16
<seb128> recent key update
<seb128> ok, so I don't know how to test that, but everything else works, so let's upload the bugfix version
<seb128> mpt, your libusermetrics landed by error (validated the wrong line), I would rather keep it than revert and push through with the other part of the fix ... could you comment on the mp on what would be the right behaviour (having no text on first boot, or just the standard "no text sent today", etc)
<mpt> seb128, sure, do you have the link handy?
<willcooke> Trevinho, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/1197872
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1197872 in nux (Ubuntu) "unity crashed on session::view::Populate" [Medium,Triaged]
<popey> seb128: on that subject, blip.tv should be removed from totem, they were bought out and shut down recently
<willcooke> Trevinho, Do you think we should keep this open and work on it?
<seb128> mpt, https://code.launchpad.net/~mpt/libusermetrics/1286276-no-data-sources/+merge/268042 see mterry's comment
<seb128> popey, thanks
 * seb128 is away for some bt in car testing and some errands
<seb128> bbiab
<mpt> thanks
<darkxst> seb128, will take a look after dinner
<andyrock> willcooke: i think it's safe to close it
<willcooke> andyrock, thank you
<andyrock> willcooke: btw I finally managed to get a fix for the resize problem
<andyrock> \o/
<willcooke> andyrock, yay!
<andyrock> turned up to be a 1 line fix
<andyrock> 2 weeks for a lne
<andyrock> *line
<willcooke> andyrock, ha!  Well, good work!
<darkxst> willcooke, this seems to be the script I had, no idea where it came from though http://pastebin.com/f58wNZGd
<darkxst> though I do recall writing one also, can't find that though
<willcooke> thanks
<willcooke> I've got my own simple script pretty much ready to go
<willcooke> just working out how to add comments
<willcooke> and that script you showed has that functionality, so I'll steal that
<darkxst> comments are about the easiest bit of the LP api
<willcooke> I was somewhat surprised I had to slice a string to get the bug ID
<willcooke> then I found the bug object
<willcooke> :)
<darkxst> yup finding the data, is usually the harder bit
<darkxst> and in some cases, it just plain doesnt exist ;(
<willcooke> ok, so my script can now find and comment on the bugs I want and set the staus
<willcooke> status
<willcooke> But I need it to be able to set the status on both the upstream project and the Ubuntu package
<willcooke> back to dir(bug)
<darkxst> don't think I have ever tried to extract upstream project, from an ubuntu package, but surely it is there
<didrocks> phew, that wasâ¦ interesting
<didrocks> I didn't think I ordered any roller coaster topping in addition to the flight
<willcooke> :D
<didrocks> at least, home and safe ;)
<larsu> welcome home didrocks :)
<didrocks> thx larsu!
 * larsu curses at gtkentrycompletion
<larsu> srsly, I'm very close to reimplmenting it, but sanely
<larsu> it's like, oh, you have 50 matches? Let's show a VERY LARGE window
 * popey wonders where to file a bug where ALT+PRSCR _always_ messes up the menu/titlebar in screenshots http://imgur.com/2HWwQL1
<popey> I think it's because of our menus, but not sure where that goes? Unity?
<popey> willcooke: ^
<larsu> does turning of locally integrated menus help?
 * popey looks for that option
<popey> larsu: yes
<larsu> blame Trevinho, then ;)
<popey> \o/
<didrocks> larsu: it's a little bit more complicated than that
<didrocks> larsu: so, you press alt, you have the locally integrated menu appearing
<larsu> oh!
<larsu> haha
<Trevinho> larsu: yeah... that would be also without LIM in geneeral
<didrocks> then, you press Print Screen
<larsu> this is gold :D
<didrocks> you have the effect of fading to the menu again
<didrocks> and gnome-screenshot starts
<Trevinho> by pressing Alt in general unity shows the menus (also global ones)
<didrocks> yep
<didrocks> interesting, gnome-screenshot only execute when you release alt
<didrocks> so, if you press alt + print screen, keep alt pressed
<didrocks> gnome-screenshot is only executed when alt is released
<didrocks> so, can't easily avoid that, or the screenshotting need to be in unity to control the rendering
<larsu> didrocks: clearly that's where it belongs
<mdeslaur_> mpt: hi! do you have any opinion on https://code.launchpad.net/~mdeslaur/indicator-power/fix-priorities/+merge/260903
<seb128> Trevinho, could you review https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/1446081?
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1446081 in unity (Ubuntu) "Incorrect scaling of launcher icons" [Medium,Confirmed]
<seb128> Trevinho, there is a patch on there
<seb128> larsu, there is a small css patch to https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/rhythmbox/+bug/1448272 do you think you could have a look?
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1448272 in rhythmbox (Ubuntu) "White line between the interface and the application window title" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<larsu> seb128: err, I don't have this line
<seb128> larsu, yeah, me neither, but seems some user do, unsure why
<mpt> mdeslaur_, looking
<larsu> seb128: also, what's this patch for? rhythmbox itself?
<larsu> seb128: this already fixed it: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~jjardon/rhythmbox/trunk/revision/8892
<larsu> I'll make a note on the bug
<seb128> larsu, great, thanks
<seb128> larsu, sorry, I didn't look much, going through https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+patches and subscribing sponsors/pinging some people on the way to get some reviewing action ;-)
<larsu> seb128: no worries. No need for you to do all the work. happy to help out
<seb128> thanks!
<Newww> Developers! Please add the following item. On windows there is a convenient option to specify a file for download in the form http links. Example https://pp.vk.me/c629117/v629117790/eee0/LRcvOplaV8I.jpg I want to upload the file to the file sharing. This file is located on another server. On windows I can provide a link to a file that is dialog box itself will load the file into a temporary folder, and select it.
<Newww> On Unity, I have to first download the file to, and then specify the file.
<larsu> Newww: to upload, you can use nautilus' "Connect to server" feature. You can then select that server from the sidebar
<Newww> larsu: No, I just want to dialog supported http links, not just local files.
<larsu> not sure I understand. Do you want to open http links in an app or upload files to some http server while saving?
<Newww> I want to open http links in an app, Some apps such links, and some do not, like the chrome or firefox.
<larsu> all apps using gvfs should support this just fine
<larsu> gedit works, for example
 * larsu opens google.com in gedit and feels awesome
<Newww> More specifically, I want to choose the file to something from another server directly to the dialog box itself elected him, loaded into a temporary folder. So much faster than most.
<Newww> Yes, it works to open, but not selected. Chrome or firefox not support this, but windows I often use it, it is convenient and reduces time.
<Newww> Little such detail that really need :)
<larsu> ah, so you do want it the other way around. I don't think that works unless you add a server in nautilus
<didrocks> bye unity-panel-service, you didn't need to take 98% of my CPU IMHO
<larsu> didrocks: probably it's doing something important
<larsu> don't interrupt it!
<didrocks> larsu: ofc!
<qengho> Newww: is this only in web browsers that you can paste a location of a remote resource? Is it a place you normally type a local file name?
<larsu> it started displaying very small fonts for me recently
<Newww> Adding a server is not necessary, there are so many different servers, each adding it's inconvenient. It seems to me that you do not understand me a little bit.
<Newww> qengho: Exactly!
<qengho> I'm guessing that the file selector on Windows is less strict. A web page asks for a file to upload. You don't pick a file, but instead paste a URL. Windows' browser sends that text string to the remote end, which processes it magically. Ubuntu's file selector makes sure you are sending a file.
<mdeslaur_> mpt: excellent comment, I didn't properly handle that. I've proposed a new order, could you take another look? https://code.launchpad.net/~mdeslaur/indicator-power/fix-priorities/+merge/260903
<Newww> qengho: On windows dialog box downloads the file on this link -> saves it to a temporary folder -> select the downloaded file.
<qengho> Oh. Weird.
<Newww> But it is logical and very comfortable. Other programs like Krita allow you to select a file link, but do the same thing, first download, and then inserted into the program.
<larsu> hm? Now we're talking about downloading again?
<Newww> I mean, Krita itself downloading a file link.
<Newww> Although I'm not sure, maybe it makes the dialog box. Then why does not he do it for the web browser?
<andyrock> seb128: do you know where I can find the source code of the privacy panel in ucc?
<seb128> andyrock, https://code.launchpad.net/activity-log-manager
<andyrock> thanks :D
<seb128> iirc
<popey> willcooke: hey, please add bug 1496414 to your super important list of bugs which must be fixed for 16.04, kthx :)
<ubot5> bug 1496414 in unity (Ubuntu) "Window screenshots contain blurred titlebar with LIM" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1496414
<seb128> lol
<seb128> popey, unsure that's easy to solve/worth the effort
<seb128> you can use the gnome-screenshot UI instead of the keybinding to workaround it
<willcooke> popey, done.  Please leave the money in the usual place.
<popey> its a regression introduced with LIM
<willcooke> seb128, I've added the rls-w-incoming tag ;)
<popey> it _should_ have been fixed releases ago
<seb128> willcooke, fair enough, I'm just saying that I bet some money that it's not fixed for the LTS ;-)
<popey> working around a default keyboard shortcut because the default keyboard shortcut we ship is broken seems.. broken
<seb128> popey, not sure we can call that regression, it was always there with LIM, you disable LIM you are back to what we had
<seb128> note that LIM is not default
<popey> true, so not a regression, but LIM breaks screenshots, and LIM is on the CD by default
<popey> anyway, lets see if someone steps up to fix it
<seb128> I doubt it
<seb128> but let's see
<popey> :(
<seb128> out of changing the default keybinding to be e.g shift+printscreen
<seb128> but that's a workaround
<seb128> if you set to alt it's going to have the issue again
<popey> indeed, all workarounds
<popey> I suspect it can be fixed by changing the timing for how quickly the titlebar fades back
<popey> maybe a few ms difference could fix it
<mpt> mdeslaur_, this terminology predates your change, but I canât judge your proposal because I donât understand the distinction between â1. discharging itemsâ¦â â5. batteriesâ and â7. non-line powerâ
<mpt> Should âbatteriesâ be âfully-charged batteriesâ?
<mpt> And is ânon-line powerâ just a UPS, or does it cover batteries in some situations too?
<seb128> popey, changing the animation might mean compromising on what we think is the best visual experience just for a screenshoter bug easy to workaround, doesn't seem a good deal
<seb128> we could also delay the screenshot
<seb128> but at the price of making it less reactive, which would bug users would want to take a screenshot of a state of something changing
<charles> mpt, hello
 * charles reads the new comments in the MR
<popey> I have zero confidence in a fix to gnome screenshot after I filed gnome bug 684662 3 years ago. :)
<ubot5> Gnome bug 684662 in general "Default filename for screenshots is problematic" [Normal,Resolved: duplicate] http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=684662
<sethj> Is there a reason this bug is still set to "new" for the Unity package? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/940603 No comments since 2012, unity projected has it marked as fixed
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 940603 in unity (Ubuntu) "white box randomly shows up at top left corner blocking applications from using stuff under it" [Undecided,New]
<sethj> s/projected/project. Doesn't seem reproducible either.
<seb128> sethj, likely good to be closed
<larsu> this blog post worked...
<charles> mpt, 'non-line power' is a bad term that mdeslaur_ seems to have gotten from a comment I wrote, it's my fault :)
<charles> mpt, iirc, and from looking at the code, it's shorthand for upower 'kinds' that aren't battery or line power, e.g.
<seb128> larsu, what blog post?
<charles> mpt, keyboard, mouse
<larsu> seb128: willcooke's
<seb128> larsu, oh :-)
<larsu> seems like more bug activity today
<seb128> right
<charles> mpt, so it mean "everything else after batteries and line power", maybe mdeslaur_ will be kind enough to tweak my comment when he pushes the revision you suggested :-)
<mpt> sethj, itâs a side-effect of bug 76416. Basically Unity has some bug reports filed against the project, some against the package, some against both at once. That one was filed against both, and marked fixed for one, never marked fixed for the other.
<ubot5> bug 76416 in Launchpad itself "Poor handling of a distribution being its own upstream for a package" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/76416
<sethj> mpt, so if I can't reproduce it should I mark it invalid or fix released?
<mdeslaur_> charles, mpt: ok, so it looks like "batteries" means "fully charged batteries", and non-line power is "all other devices"
<mpt> sethj, so itâs good to look at both bug lists: <https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity> and <https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity>
<mpt> If itâs marked fixed for one, itâs almost certainly fixed for the other too, especially if it happened years ago. :-)
<mdeslaur_> charles, mpt: actually, "non-line power" would mean "fully charged other devices"
<mdeslaur_> I assume if something isn't charging or discharging it's fully-charged...but perhaps that assumption is wropng
<sethj> mpt, cool. Thanks for the lists tip, I hadn't thought of that xD
<willcooke> sethj, you good to mark that bug as Fix Released?
<mdeslaur_> right, it can be "unknown" too
<sethj> willcooke, yup, I can't reproduce it, and I have never experienced it either.
<willcooke> thanks sethj
<sethj> looks like this bug is in the same position: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/977984
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 977984 in unity (Ubuntu Precise) "Quicklists and tooltips sometimes lose their blur" [High,Confirmed]
<mdeslaur_> charles, mpt: "5- batteries that are neither charging nor discharging", "7- all other devices that are neither charging no discharging", "8- Line power"
<mpt> sethj, yep. Maybe willcooke can get those bug reports with conflicting states cleaned up as a batch.
<sethj> that seems like it would be a good idea.
<charles> mdeslaur_, mpt, in meeting, but ^ 5 7 8 sound good (but typo 's/no/not/' on 7)
<willcooke> mpt, sethj - good plan
<willcooke> I'll add it to my script
<willcooke> should be easy enough, once I've worked out why I keep getting " Resource is not bound to any representation, and no media media type was specified."
<larsu> that's because the resource is not bound to any representation! duh!!
<mpt> willcooke, at my suggestion unity8 switched to tracking bugs on just the package (bug 1364477). Maybe Unity 7 can do the same, unless thereâs some SRU-related reason to keep them separate.
<ubot5> bug 1364477 in Unity 8 "Unity 8 has two unsynced bug lists" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1364477
<willcooke> mpt, I'll look in to it, thanks
<mpt> charles, so should it be â7. fully-charged keyboard/mouseâ?
<mpt> charles, and â8. UPSâ?
<mdeslaur_> mpt: 7 is unknown, ups, monitor, mouse, keyboard, pda, phone, edia player, tablet and computer
<mpt> So what is âline powerâ then? :-)
<mdeslaur_> "line power" means a power supply
<mdeslaur_> AC
<mdeslaur_> Which I have no idea why we would want to display
<mdeslaur_> oh, we don't display it, it's special-case elsewhere
<desrt> cute: mount -o bind /home /mnt; mount -o bind /home/desrt /mnt
<desrt> what do you think this does?
<desrt> the correct answer, of course is "replace the contents of /home with /home/desrt"
<desrt> ie: /home/desrt stops existing and /home now contains my homedir, directly
<desrt> this is not how i thought bind mounts worked.....
<larsu> desrt: what did you expect?
<didrocks> I guess he expected to have /mnt containg /home/desrt and having the /home bindmount "shadowed"
<didrocks> interesting behavior btw :)
<desrt> i didn't expect that playing around with bindmounts instead of /mnt might impact the world outside /mnt ...
<desrt> *inside of
<pitti> desrt: welcome to the world of having mounts "shared" by default :/
<desrt> ya.  this is really strange.
<desrt> is this some recent change?
<pitti> desrt: with systemd; it was a huge debate back then
<desrt> how does systemd have any control over this?
<pitti> desrt: it's a kernel default (whether mounts are private or public by default)
<desrt> ah
<pitti> some sysctl thingy
<pitti> and systemd changes it
<desrt> this is ... weird
<pitti> it broke quite a lot of things back then
<pitti> I mean, those fixes were correct in the sense that anyone else could also have flipped that sysctl, but it was still weird
<pitti> I had preferred if nspawn or whatever would have configured its mounts public when needed
<pitti> but oh well, water under the bridge
 * pitti toddles off for making dinner
<desrt> pitti: do you know the name of the sysctl?
<desrt> not containing 'mount' nor 'bind' as one may expect
<pitti> http://cgit.freedesktop.org/systemd/systemd/commit/?id=b3ac5f8cb98757416d8660023d6564a7c411f0a0
<pitti> desrt: ^
<desrt> thanks
<desrt> ah
<desrt> mount flag
<pitti> one of the most debated changes ever
<desrt> ya
<desrt> this is a really bad change, imho
<desrt> _totally_ unexpected behaviour
<pitti> http://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/systemd-devel/2013-February/008558.html
<desrt> and specific to the root filesystem only, is _really_ weird
<pitti> no, I think it propagates
<pitti> to undo it you need --make-rprivate
<desrt> ugh
<mdeslaur_> mpt, charles: ok, I'm going to put this on hold for a while. Reading the upower source, it looks like the _only_ devices it calculates time remaining for is laptop batteries, and that is likely going away soon.
<mpt> mdeslaur_, really? Yay bizarre upstreams
<mdeslaur_> mpt: it's calculating the time remaining based on the "energy discharge rate", and since windows doesn't use that value, more and more hardware is coming out with bogus values there
<mpt> mdeslaur_, why is that a thing anyway? Thereâs probably something I donât understand, but Iâd just measure the percentage remaining at time T, and then at time T+n, and calculate the rate from that
<mpt> (âjustâ <http://c2.com/cgi/wiki?JustIsaDangerousWord>)
<mdeslaur_> mpt: that may work for a laptop battery, but my mouse for example only has something like three percentages: 92%, 48%, 5%
<mpt> haha
<mdeslaur_> yeah, yay for hardware
<mpt> Yay operating systems that try to work on hardware made by vendors who donât care
<mdeslaur_> hehe, yeah
<Laney> I seem to have lost my Firefox launcher icon
<Laney> did the .desktop file get renamed or something?
<larsu> I lost terminal one recently
<Laney> hm, it's happened on both machines
<willcooke> hey robert_ancell - how's the travel?
<robert_ancell> willcooke, made it to Toronto so must be all good!
<willcooke> :)
<robert_ancell> willcooke, how is the bug squashing response going?
<willcooke> robert_ancell, we had a response
<willcooke> :)
<willcooke> the first of many, I'm surre
<willcooke> *sure
<willcooke> robert_ancell, sethj wins the prize
<robert_ancell> Most bugs closed?
<willcooke> not quite
<willcooke> we'll have closed a couple of hundred by the end of the day
<willcooke> but mostly old apport crashes
<sethj> if I win the prize that's pretty sad as I've only processed 4/5 bugs so far :(
<willcooke> sethj, early days
<sethj> speaking of that however, I don't see how this is actually a Unity bug: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/971018
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 971018 in Unity "Auto-hide Unity Launcher will not reveal when mouse pushed to left side in VirtualBox or VMware" [High,Confirmed]
 * willcooke <- eternal optimist 
<sethj> Turning off mouse mouse pointer integration and it all works 100%
<sethj> willcooke, lol. Optimism is good :)
<willcooke> sethj, right so they're saying that once the mouse leaves the vbox screen then you can't open the launcher
<willcooke> I don't think we can do much about that
 * willcooke fires up vbox
<sethj> willcooke, yeah, basically. It's on Vbox to decide when the pointer is in the VM and when it's in the host, and it chooses host.
<sethj> I dunno if that makes it invalid or what though.
<willcooke> sethj, go with "Won't Fix"
<sethj> kk, thanks.
<willcooke> we wont ever get around to improving it, and there are a couple of work-arounds, don't hide the launcher, or use super key or alt-f1
<willcooke> sethj, fyi - there is some suggested text on the wiki page:  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BigDesktopBugScrub
<willcooke> I'll add one for "Won't Fix"
<didrocks> see you guys!
<willcooke> see ya didrocks
<Laney> hmm there's no relevant difference in files between the two firefoxen
<willcooke> actually sethj - I wonder if Opinion is a better choice.  That way its there to be picked up by anyone else if they want to work on it.
<sethj> willcooke, yup! Been using those when applicable. I don't have "won't fix" privs though. Do you want me to add a tag or do you want to do it.?
<willcooke> sethj, I'll do it now
<sethj> willcooke, oh that's a good idea. I'm sure there are a few things that can be done to optimize it, but it is such an edge case (no pun intended haha) I doubt anything will happen.
<willcooke> sethj, yeah
<sethj> willcooke, you might want to update the section on apport bugs on the wiki page too, as "won't fix" isn't a priv most users have. Potential ideas are use a tag for that too, or leave those for privileged folks.
<willcooke> sethj, all apport bugs should be gone very soon
<willcooke> sethj, just running my script against them now
<sethj> oh cool. nbd then
<willcooke> A.B.C.
<willcooke> Always. Be. Closing.
<willcooke> Bugs
<sethj> hmm, anyone else think this is more of a feature than a bug?
<sethj> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/1213834
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1213834 in unity (Ubuntu) "Dash query "2+2" should yield "4" by default" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<willcooke> hrm
<willcooke> Trevinho, what do you think about that one ^^
<willcooke> The calc scope isn't installed by default
<willcooke> oh, maybe it is
<willcooke> could be that searches starting "=" coudl do that
<sethj> the scope is installed by default
<sethj> = is a good idea
<willcooke> I'll mark it as opionon and use another tag to make sure it gets considered
<doko> fyi, gdk-pixbuf is broken, and things are uninstallable where it built. see https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gdk-pixbuf/2.31.7-1
<doko> e.g. no openjdk installable
<willcooke> thx for the heads up doko
<doko> willcooke, I pinged robert_ancell too. anybody looking at this?
<willcooke> doko, robert_ancell is at a conference.  I will hook up with seb128 in the morning
<robert_ancell> doko, this the gdk-pixbuf issue?
<doko> yes, then maybe better to remove the built binaries
<doko> willcooke, robert_ancell: now removed. please don't sync and run in the future ;)
<charles> mpt, another blow for making 'time remaining' meaningful in indicator-power then :P
<robert_ancell> tjaalton, were you thinking of having Xorg 1.19 in 16.04?
<Laney> doko: remove it
<Laney> and check debian buildds next time :P
<doko> Laney, I didn't sync ...
<Laney> ok, note to whoever did
<tjaalton> robert_ancell: depends on the release schedule, but yeah if doable
<robert_ancell> tjaalton, we were discussing it here and end of march is the release date. So that would work out pretty good for us.
<tjaalton> actually that's pretty late
<tjaalton> because of fglrx
<robert_ancell> ?
<tjaalton> it takes time for fglrx to catch up
<tjaalton> with the video abi
<robert_ancell> they release after the X release?
<tjaalton> they still don't support 1.18rc
<tjaalton> for instance
<robert_ancell> tjaalton, would they be motivated to hit 16.04 and be more ready for 1.19?
<tjaalton> we've always asked, but it still slips to the last week before release, every time :)
<tjaalton> ubuntu release
<robert_ancell> right
<robert_ancell> That's a bit tight for an LTS...
<robert_ancell> We'll have to lie to them and say it's 16.03
<tjaalton> of course, if the video abi doesn't change..
<tjaalton> then it's a non-issue. but I think it has changed every release
<robert_ancell> No-one talked about video changes (mostly glamor and input and general cleanups)
<robert_ancell> I guess we hope it doesn't change / ask fglrx nicely and see if that works out.
<tjaalton> as long as the abi is set early enough
<tjaalton> if it is changed. so first rc by mid-january or so, then put it in a ppa and ask them to fix their shit
<tjaalton> leaning towards not bumping mesa to 11.0.x in wily, since it can't use llvm-3.7 so no proper amdgpu support anyway
<robert_ancell> tjaalton, oh, it requires an newer llvm?
<tjaalton> amdgpu does
<robert_ancell> what else requires llvm in Ubuntu, i.e. what stops us bumping that?
<tjaalton> llvm-3.7 not building on i386
<robert_ancell> :(
<tjaalton> and that it's in universe, 3.5 3.6 already in main
<tjaalton> so would have to get rid of one
<robert_ancell> Problem for next cycle then...
<tjaalton> hm, though if mesa switched to 3.7 it would allow dropping 3.6 it seems
#ubuntu-desktop 2015-09-17
<pitti> Good morning
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> bonjour didrocks !
<didrocks> salut pitti, Ã§a va ?
<pitti> didrocks: Ã§a va bien ! j'ai jouÃ© au basket hier soir pour la premiÃ¨re fois aprÃ¨s les vacances d'Ã©tÃ©, je sense mes muscles :)
<pitti> c'Ã©tait grand
<didrocks> ahah, j'imagine :)
 * didrocks ne peut pas courir Ã  cause du tempsâ¦
<didrocks> beaucoup de vent et de pluie
<pitti> didrocks: ah, quelle domage .. aujourd'hui on a du soleil Ã  nouveau
<pitti> "dommage", non ?
<didrocks> "dommage", oui
<hikiko> hello
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<seb128> hey hikiko
<didrocks> re seb128, hey hikiko
<seb128> desrt, Laney, larsu, could you look if https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/1495173 is a glib bug? Trevinho seems to think so (though he didn't comment on the bug to say so)
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1495173 in glib2.0 (Ubuntu) "compiz crashed with SIGSEGV in g_bit_lock()" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<pitti> bonjour seb128, comment vas-tu ?
<seb128> pitti, salut, Ã§a va bien ! Et toi ?
<pitti> seb128: je vais bien aussi ! je sense mes muscles, jouer au basket hier soir (la premiÃ¨re fois aprÃ¨s les vacances de l'Ã©tÃ©)
<pitti> il a me manquÃ©
<pitti> ^ (is that right for "I missed it"?)
<seb128> hehe, moi c'est pareil avec le tennis ;-)
<pitti> seb128: ah, trÃ¨s bien ! â¥ sports
<seb128> "Ã§a m'a manquÃ©"
<seb128> il would be for somebody
<pitti> ah
 * TheMuso waves to deskoppers... some of whom are around early it seems. :)
<pitti> TheMuso: the early bird .. can bite me .. or so :)
<pitti> TheMuso: hey, how are you?
 * pitti retreats again to spend a nice hour or two with his favorite girl britney
<didrocks> hey TheMuso
<TheMuso> pitti: Well thanks. :)
<hikiko> hey didrocks seb128 pitti TheMuso etc sorry I was making coffee and missed the handshake :D how are you?
<TheMuso> hikiko: Fine thanks.
<pitti> hey hikiko! I'm great, thanks; how about yourself/
<hikiko> i am good :)
<seb128> hikiko, doing good thanks ;-)
<hikiko> :D
<larsu> good morning!
<larsu> seb128: I can have a look
<seb128> larsu, hey, thanks
<pitti> it's a larsu ! *hug*
 * larsu needs to make a tea first, though
<larsu> guten morgen pitti  :)
 * seb128 triages some of the unity bugs
<larsu> this bug is ... tricky
<seb128> larsu, do you see what's going on in there?
<larsu> I"m trying to reproduce right now
<larsu> it happens while writing the blacklist key
<larsu> I wonder if that's a bug in gvariant
<larsu> or if the variant that unity passes to dconf is corrupt
<larsu> oh wow I can reproduce after trying it 20 times or so
<larsu> ah, got it
<larsu> it's using gvariant wrong
<seb128> larsu, ah, Trevinho wrongly blaming glib then ;-)
<larsu> seems like it
<larsu> code looks good to me though
<larsu> finding out where all these gvariant warnings are coming from
<willcooke> hello you lot
<TheMuso> Hey willcooke.
<hikiko> hello willcooke
<willcooke> evening TheMuso
<willcooke> hey hikiko
<hikiko> what's the name of the ubuntu kylin desktop channel? I didn't save it in my laptop and my desktop is pretty dead to start xchat atm
<seb128> hey willcooke
<willcooke> hikiko, #nudt-canonical
<hikiko> thanks willcooke :)
<willcooke> soooooo, back splatter from the Grand Closing....
<willcooke> 1 bug
<willcooke> from Chipaca, which I've added to the rls-w-incoming list
<willcooke> pretty good so far I think
<willcooke> seb128, looks like you've run a script to close all the fix released ones too
<seb128> willcooke, no, just going through the New ones manually
<willcooke> ohhh
<seb128> started by the oldest ones
<seb128> and quite were fix released for unity but not unity (ubuntu)
<willcooke> thanks for doing that
<seb128> why oh why do we have the duplicates upstream/ubuntu component :-/
<seb128> yw!
<willcooke> seb128, I wonder what our options are for fixing that.  Trevinho has a script which can make sure bugs are synced between the two lists, and then we could just blanked close all of one list?
<willcooke> or remove from the affects list
<seb128> willcooke, I was pondering the close, but it would create quite some noise, not sure if that's worth it
<larsu> reassign?
<Laney> morning
<seb128> hey Laney, how are you?
<seb128> larsu, reassign what to what?
<larsu> seb128: one of the lists to the other
<larsu> I think mpt was arguing for always using package bugs
<seb128> right, that's what we do for other projects
<seb128> the unity/compiz list are just busy enough that it would create quite some spam
<seb128> unsure if that's worth it
<larsu> fair enough
<Laney> hey seb128 & larsu
<Laney> doing PRETTY GOOD!
<Laney> YOU?
<larsu> awesome :)
 * Laney has had two teas already
<Laney> so I feel like TALKING IN CAPS A BIT
 * larsu opens a window after building unity
<Laney> oh, cool, thx for looking at that one
<larsu> you're "welcome"
<pitti> hey Laney, good morning!
<seb128> Laney, doing good, thanks :-)
<Laney> I did a source-only upload to Debian yesterday and it worked
<Laney> we live in good times
<Laney> hi pitti!
<pitti> Laney: +1
<hikiko> Trevinho, I can't reproduce the bug with the shadow... how many windows do I need?  I opened like 10 firefox windows yesterday :s
<hikiko> do I need some plugin enabled?
<hikiko> eg application switcher?
<hikiko> (I tried with and without tbh)
 * TheMuso -> EOD, night folks.
<willcooke> cya TheMuso
<Laney> late night TheMuso
<Laney> actually it's not that late
<Laney> interesting
<larsu> hm, the crash I can reproduce has a vastly different stack trace
<seb128> corruption?
<seb128> oh, you mean compared to the one from the bug
<seb128> not between retries
<larsu> yes
<Chipaca> willcooke: i back splattered wha?
<willcooke> Chipaca, you complaining that bugs are still bugs and that we can't just ignore them.  sheesh.
<Chipaca> willcooke: if it's about the email i forwarded you, my comment was that you were pointing to "errors.ubutnu.com"
<willcooke> oh
<willcooke> crap
<Chipaca> willcooke: which is probably not where you were wanting to point them
<Chipaca> willcooke: i'm fine with killing some bugs with fire :)
<Chipaca> tried to point out a typo, is all
<willcooke> Oh, got you - in which case, I will kill it
<willcooke> and fix the typo
<Laney> hmmmmm
<seb128> ok, unity NEW 620 -> 507, not bad for an hour or so
<seb128> time to make some coffee
<willcooke> seb128, \o/
<hikiko> I think I ll fix the cube textures and lighting until marco is back... I can't make that bug appear maybe my gpu is very new
<larsu> hm, how do I run unity from inside the source tree?
 * larsu has changes that are not picked up
<seb128> larsu, dunno, maybe hikiko can help you?
<seb128> since Trevinho seems not to be around yet
<hikiko> larsu,
<larsu> I would have thought setting some env var to point compiz to libunity-shell.so would be enough
<hikiko> larsu, I usually build compiz and unity
<hikiko> and nux
<hikiko> larsu, here's what I do:
<hikiko> https://ufuntu.wordpress.com/2015/08/16/part4-build/
<hikiko> the 1st time
<hikiko> then if I need to check something for example in unityshell I only build this directory
<hikiko> or you can build it and replace the system's unityshell plugin with the build one
<hikiko> (libunityshell.so)
<hikiko> if you need to check something quickly
<larsu> do I need to copy it over?
<larsu> or can I tell compiz to use the one in my ~
<larsu> COMPIZ_PLUGIN_DIR doesn't seem to work :/
<larsu> oh it does ... but now everything crashes
<larsu> (the trick is to add $PWD/plugins/unityshell)
<hikiko> you can use: unity --replace ccp
<hikiko> and COMPIZ_CONFIG_VERSION=ubuntu
<larsu> hikiko: thanks!
<hikiko> larsu, I hope it works, I usually only build compiz...
<larsu> I was hoping to get around that (and it seems to work so far)
<hikiko> with unity I mean: <your_installation_path>/bin/unity
<hikiko> cool :)
<Laney> larsu: does this https://code.launchpad.net/~mterry/unity-settings-daemon/lid-power-event/+merge/271383 feel good to you?
<larsu> Laney: feels like they problably shouldn't connect to that signal again
<larsu> but also feels like it should work and doesn't matter that much
<Laney> ya, thanks
<willcooke> w
<willcooke> a
<willcooke> l
<willcooke> l
<willcooke> p
<willcooke> a
<willcooke> p
<willcooke> e
<willcooke> r
<larsu> someone messed with willcooke's xmodmap
<hikiko> lol
<willcooke> :D
<willcooke> It's my cunning plan to make sure Phonronix don't spot it :)
<willcooke> Let's take bets on how long it is before there is a news story after I open a bug with the wp in
<Laney> they usually subscribe to the pre-filed bug
<Laney> but if there was no one this time
<Laney> will see it on wily-changes :)
<willcooke> Laney, I've added it to my W machine and the dots on the lock screen dont line up with the lines on the wp
<willcooke> I'm not sure if that is fixable, if the wallpaper is scaled, will it be impossible to line up correctly I wonder
<Laney> hahaha
<Laney> don't the dots scale too?
<Laney> i.e. in the same relative position?
<willcooke> oh, yeah, good point
<Laney> (guessing)
<willcooke> it's not out by much
 * willcooke speaks to design
<Laney> I pointed this out so that it would be checked before handover...
<Laney> this doesn't tickle my OCD but it does some people evidently
<Laney> like x_no_x
<didrocks> mean Laney, doing experimentation on hilighting people ;)
<Laney> that's the opposite of mean
<Laney> deliberately *not* hilighting him
 * Laney is a nice guy
<didrocks> "but it does some people evidently"
<didrocks> so, there is still a chanceâ¦ :p
<willcooke> morning qengho
<larsu> seb128: one morning, one line of code :/
<larsu> at least I know how to build and test unity now :D
<larsu> funnily, nobody seems to ever use this feature, because it was totally broken
 * desrt yawns
<desrt> attente: hey.  running into some troubles here, but should still be on time
<seb128> larsu, well, at least you found the bug :-)
<desrt> larsu: thanks for making me not have to look at this :)
<larsu> desrt: you wouldn't have had fun
<desrt> i'd say "you handled it before i even woke up" but that wouldn't be true....
<larsu> wow
<desrt> you don't even want to know what i was doing all last night
<larsu> I'm glad I can choose "UTC" as per mpt's design in datetime panel
<larsu> it doesn't work though..
<larsu> what's the proper timezone name for that?
<larsu> desrt: what did you do?
<desrt> went to bed at 10... around 2:30, woke up, couldn't sleep further
<desrt> ...have you heard of this game called ingress?
<larsu> haha
<desrt> *cough*
 * desrt walked around east toronto from 3am to 7am
<seb128> crazy man
<desrt> ya well, i made level 5
<desrt> and you didn't
<desrt> who's crazy now, huh?!?
 * desrt twitches
<seb128> larsu, "Etc/UTC" I think
<larsu> seb128: thanks
<seb128> yw
<larsu> calling timedated with UTC directly works
<larsu> but not from datetime
<larsu> don't even get an answer
<Laney> Etc/Utc
<Laney> oh
 * Laney should read the full scrollback
<Laney> anarchy in the UK
<seb128> :-)
<seb128> what sort of anarchy?
<seb128> Laney is piloting, good man!
 * seb128 added items to the sponsoring queue yesterday while reviewing the +patches list...
<larsu> ah, it's going through timezonemap, which doesn't accept UTC
<larsu> "great"
<larsu> it's also writing the gsettings key twice
<seb128> and write it on start? ;-)
 * seb128 hides
<larsu> nope
<larsu> seb128: btw, check it out: https://code.launchpad.net/~larsu/unity-control-center/datetime-use-geonames
<larsu> (still needs Depends line)
<Laney> phwoar
<seb128> larsu, rock on, should I build the lib and that and play with it? or do you want to wait a bit before getting user feedback?
<larsu> seb128: play!!!
<seb128> k :-)
<larsu> seb128: if you build from source and --enable-demo, you'll get a small demo app
<larsu> otherwise the datetime branch should work as well
<seb128> k
<seb128> I'm going to try the demo and the panel
<larsu> the completion is a bit jumpy because of the long list of matches
<larsu> got a gtk patch for that
<larsu> going to lunch now though bbiab
<seb128> larsu, enjoy!
<Laney> chrisccoulson: what's the chance that I can build oxide in ram if I have 32 gigs? ...
 * Laney is obeying the instruction to test build it when updating ninja
<Laney> /usr/bin/ld.gold: --push-state: unknown option
<Laney> meh
<seb128> Laney, other people mentioned that error earlier today, see e.g #ubuntu-devel 7:12 uk time
<chrisccoulson> Laney, I've not tried it
<seb128> Laney, 8:51 is more useful
<Laney> so gold broke in some way
<seb128> no, qt did
<Laney> it didn't get changed
<seb128> cf the second chunck of discussion
<seb128> hum
<seb128> sounds like a doko issue
<seb128> dookkoooo
<Laney> who knows about broadcom firmware installation and stuff?
<Laney> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/b43-fwcutter/+bug/1490212 https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/bcmwl/+bug/1490713 https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/bcmwl/+bug/1491070
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1490212 in software-properties (Ubuntu) ""Modaliases" field missing from debian control file" [Undecided,New]
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1490713 in bcmwl (Ubuntu) "The Debian control file's "modaliases" is too generic" [Undecided,New]
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1491070 in bcmwl (Ubuntu) "On removal the package should warn a reboot is needed" [Undecided,New]
<seb128> Laney, I guess pitti does?
<pitti> so which out of b43-fwcutter, bcmwl, and brcmfmac is the driver du jour for these cards now?
<pitti> (probably a question for the kernel team, though)
<seb128> pitti, sorry I don't know, was trying to help Laney , who I think is patch piloting
<Laney> correct
<xclaesse> it's really annoying when evolution can't fetch my google emails because UOA's token isn't valid anymore but UOA settings UI won't let you renew it
<seb128> xclaesse, it doesn't? do you know if that's reported?
<xclaesse> seb128, not sure exactly what happens tbh, but evolution says: The reported error was "Le dÃ©lai d'attente est dÃ©passÃ©".
<xclaesse> (/me hates those who half-translate error msg)
<xclaesse> seb128, and if I delete and re-create my gmail account in UOA it works
<xclaesse> it happens often, like once a month...
<seb128> unsure if that's reported, it's worth asking to mardy if he knows about it
<seb128> he's on #ubuntu-devel
<willcooke> ruh roh
<willcooke> Can someone try this:
<willcooke> Log in 15.10
<willcooke> Lock the screen
<willcooke> from the lock screen click the power indicator
<willcooke> Choose Shut down
<willcooke> Click OK?
<sethj> what's the expected outcome?
<sethj> (besides shutting down)
<willcooke> well, I don't have the icons to actually shut down
<willcooke> I just have a box, with the text
<willcooke> and no buttons
<seb128> willcooke, lockscreen shouldn't allow you to shutdown
<seb128> that got recently changed
<seb128> weird that you get the menu option at all
<sethj> yeah, there is no shutdown button on my image.
<willcooke> erk
<willcooke> Trevinho, ^^^^^
<willcooke> Treeeevvviiinnnnnnnnnhhhooooooooooo!
<seb128> willcooke, dpkg -l | grep indicator-session?
<seb128> willcooke, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/indicator-session/12.10.5+15.10.20150915-0ubuntu1
<seb128> willcooke, when did you restart your session?
<willcooke> otp, one sec
 * desrt sits beside robert_ancell and attente
<willcooke> \o/
<robert_ancell> tripled the Canonical presence
<seb128> hey robert_ancell desrt
<seb128> enjoying the conference?
<robert_ancell> seb128, hi, yeah, it's good to meet everyone in person
<Trevinho> willcooke: we had to remove the option to shutdown from lockscreen, but normal one should be fine
<Trevinho> willcooke: maybe for some weird reason you miss the textures?
<Laney> Trevinho: did something change about desktop file handling for the launcher lately?
<Laney> I've noticed stuff disappearing
<Laney> like I just installed a new rhythmbox and the icon is gone now
<Laney> put it back, dpkg -i and it is gone again
<Trevinho> Laney: I noticed that. But nothing has changed
<Trevinho> Maybe has changed the way dpkg install desktop files?
<seb128> Laney, Trevinho, side effect of the glib inotify work?
<Trevinho> As we've a timed removal monitor
<seb128> launcher drops items when the .desktop are removed
<seb128> maybe it gets remove/added events?
<Trevinho> That has always been done
<Trevinho> Mh maybe... I'll check in a bit
<seb128> Trevinho, maybe what?
<Trevinho> We don't receive the added event
<seb128> Trevinho, bts, nice try trying to blame glib for https://code.launchpad.net/~larsu/unity/lp1495173/+merge/271446 ;-)
<Laney> if you can get a log of the events you see we can get it looked at if necessary
<Trevinho> seb128: I tried :-P
 * desrt shakes finger
<seb128> desrt, is there a glib-inotify test binary somewhere?
<desrt> gvfs-monitor-dir/file
<seb128> ah, I though there was
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> desrt, Laney, Trevinho, doing a "cp gedit.desktop gedit.desktop.old" and then mv .old gedit.desktop gives with old glib
<seb128> File = /usr/share/applications/gedit.desktop.old
<seb128> Other = /usr/share/applications/gedit.desktop
<seb128> Event = MOVED
<seb128> new glib
<seb128> File = /usr/share/applications/gedit.desktop
<seb128> Event = CREATED
<seb128> that's using gvfs-monitor-file
<seb128> not sure if that's expected
<seb128> but I guess that's what confuses unity
<seb128>  
<seb128> larsu, is the db of your new lib/test demo smaller than the one we had before? it lists less cities, unsure if that's a bug or by design
<Trevinho> Mh irrc they is a flag to get moved or deleted / created pair
<seb128> in any case it's a change of behaviour
<seb128> so unsure if that's wanted or not
<seb128> desrt/Laney probably know better
<willcooke> Trevinho, so this lock screen thing.  I've tried it on my test machine and my test VM - both the same
<willcooke> Trevinho, upgrading them both now to be sure (last update was a few days ago)
<seb128> willcooke, you didn't reply to my question earlier
<seb128> dpkg -l output and session restart
<willcooke> seb128, sorry, missed it - was otp
<seb128> willcooke, I landed that indicator-session fix on tuesday
<seb128> so you need to have update yesterday or today and restarted since
<willcooke> upgrading now...
<seb128> k
<willcooke> and now it's fixed.
 * willcooke shuts the hell up
<willcooke> sethj, looks like an update is needed ^^
<hikiko> willcooke, look at this: https://bugs.launchpad.net/compiz/+bug/91784
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 91784 in One Hundred Papercuts "The modal behavior of "Show Desktop" is confusing" [Low,Triaged]
<hikiko> 2007 and I can't understand if he refers to the unity desktop
<hikiko> show desktop just shows the desktop
<willcooke> 2007!!?!
<hikiko> yes
<hikiko> but the posts continue to 2012
<sethj> willcooke, ah, coolio. thanks for the heads up.
<hikiko> most people use metacity
<hikiko> should I mark it as opinion
<didrocks> hikiko: not in ubuntu, we used compiz at the time
<didrocks> (2007)
<seb128> hikiko, willcooke, the icon doesn't seem to reflect the state, but I think there are compiz bugs open about that as well
<hikiko> I marked it as invalid
<hikiko> for compiz(ubuntu)
<seb128> basically if you use "show desktop", then alt-tab to a window, it shows that window but doesn't unflag the "show desktop"
<hikiko> ?!
<hikiko> "unflag" means what?
<seb128> or it does nowadays, that might be fixed
<seb128> it used to that if you alt-tabbed to e.g xchat
<seb128> then picked "show desktop" again
<seb128> it would then display all the things the previous "show desktop" set back
<seb128> rather than show the desktop
<hikiko> oh
<hikiko> now it's fixed
<hikiko> so I mark it as fix commited
<hikiko> released*
<seb128> yeah, fix released seems righty
<willcooke> 1 down...
<hikiko> 2
<willcooke> :)
<hikiko> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/compiz/+bug/91786
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 91786 in compiz (Ubuntu) "Compiz's Panel shadows show on top of other windows" [Low,Fix released]
<hikiko> this one is old as well
<hikiko> those that have fix released
<willcooke> I found one earlier that duflu logged where he had two launchers, one of top of the other - I've never seen that
<hikiko> still appear as bugs
<larsu> seb128: no, it's exactly the same.... which city are you missing? Kuntzig?
<hikiko> I delete compiz (not compiz(ubuntu) from those that have status fix released in compiz
<hikiko> so that they dont appear on the list anymore
<larsu> andyrock: ci complains on my merge request, but the crash seems unrelated... is that known?
<seb128> larsu, no, but e.g typing "Berl" in the current panel gives a Berl in North Rhine-Westphalia, Germany
<seb128> where the demo doesn't
<larsu> seb128: the current code doesn't give Berlin for that....
<larsu> weird, wikipedia doesn't know that town
<larsu> google maps doesn't, either
<larsu> seb128: according to geomaps, it's "an area similar to a locality but with a small group of dwellings or other buildings"
<seb128> oh ok, so one case of the panel listing things that it shouldn't
<larsu> ya...
<larsu> seb128: we can always talk about including the larger dataset
<larsu> we're compressing it now, so that shouldn't be a problem
<seb128> well, we should only list cities
<larsu> but at some point, offering too many useless suggestions becomes less good of an experience
<larsu> right, that's what we're doing now (I hope)
<seb128> that was part of mpt's bug to exclude some of the ppld or whatever they are called
<seb128> larsu, the other issue is that it doesn't include translations, where the current version does
<seb128> like I can type "Londres "in the current panel
<seb128> but not in your demo
<seb128> for London
<larsu> yes, this is next on my list
<seb128> I didn't try your updated panel yet though
<seb128> so maybe it's a demo limitation
<seb128> k
<seb128> larsu, good work otherwise, works fine and doesn't feel slow ;-)
<larsu> thanks
<larsu> ya... that was kind of what I was going for ;)
<seb128> btw you might want to rebase your packaging branch on trunk, I first built that before nothing it was outdated
<larsu> oh?
<larsu> ah, I did but didn't push it
<larsu> sorry
<seb128> no worry
<larsu> I'll push overwrite it, so please do a new checkout of that branch
<seb128> k
 * larsu is not a big fan of the packaging branch model
<seb128> just include the debian dir in trunk?
<larsu> also not a fan :)
<Trevinho> are there other solutions? :)
<larsu> separate repository, like we do for gnome
<larsu> Trevinho: I already asked andyrock above - is the ci failure of my unity branch a known issue?
<larsu> it crashes some test, but that seems totally unrelated
<andyrock> larsu: sorry i missed the ping
<andyrock> yeah it's known
<Trevinho> larsu: it's a randome test failure
<Trevinho> larsu: it generally doesn't ever happen on ppa landings..
<Trevinho> so don't worry too much about that failure
<Trevinho> Not sure we should disable that est... As we already tried multiple times to get it stronger
<seb128> larsu, http://paste.ubuntu.com/12438586/ btw
<Trevinho> larsu: however, since IIRC it has to do with gio stuff, if you can check it.... :)
<Trevinho> larsu: as you know are an unity builder pro :)
<Trevinho> larsu: also I don't know how you ended up doing for building, but this (https://unity.ubuntu.com/getinvolved/development/unity/) is updated now
<Trevinho> so, basically just install it in your home and... that's it
<davmor2> cyphermox: start running I'll give you a 3 second head start.......wily ubiquity seems a bit hmmmmm completely broken
<Laney> larsu: when it's released the packager will just merge the upstream tags into that branch
<cyphermox> davmor2: does it?
<larsu> Trevinho: ah, thanks
<larsu> Laney: I understand, it's just a bit hard to get bootstrapped now that stuff is changing so quickly
<davmor2> cyphermox: wily 64bit uefi mode on dell xps 13, set it to install on the latest daily it just crashes
<larsu> seb128: thanks!
<Laney> sure
<cyphermox> davmor2: crash because NM?
<larsu> seb128: please don't upload yet, I want a review from desrt before committing on the api
<larsu> he PROMISED next week
<andyrock> https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/1260653
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1260653 in unity (Ubuntu) "Unity 4.3 Hangs When Upgrading Project" [Undecided,Invalid]
<andyrock> nic, we have bugs about unity3d
<andyrock> :D
<seb128> larsu, yeah, I was not going to, just playing with it for the moment
<seb128> larsu, if we want that in wily we need a ffe
<Laney> probably just wait until next release opens...
<davmor2> cyphermox: not sure couldn't get it to tell me anything useful was about to try it from desktop instead
<larsu> seb128: your decision
<seb128> larsu, what Laney just said
<cyphermox> davmor2: waiting for zsync then I'll try it too
<larsu> Laney: what seb128 said
<Trevinho> willcooke: as for the lockscreen bug, I see that it's fixed... But really not fully. I mean, in unity there's a code that ensures that the dialog is closed if no buttons have added (because it's pretty modular, depending on the situation)... And that didn't work in your case apparently
 * Laney waggles
<seb128> lol
<larsu> Laney: close the circle!
<Laney> seb128: just do what larsu says at all times, ok?
<larsu> uh oh
 * Laney strengthened it
 * larsu goes mute, just in case
<larsu> seb128: I think Laney would like some tea...
<Laney> omg
<larsu> haha
<Laney> can we go to the cat cafe in london?
<larsu> are there cats in there?
<Laney> YEP
<larsu> then no
<larsu> wait. A lot?
 * Trevinho wants to go there
<larsu> Trevinho: and fix your test suite?
<Laney> http://ladydinahs.com/our-cats/
<Trevinho> maybe :)
<Trevinho> I've already spent one night on nux tests... Not sure I want to see them for some hours
<Trevinho> although.... London's cats, well they're fu**ing aggressive!
<Trevinho> Londoncatteners...
<davmor2> cyphermox: tis the network manager issue bug it has taken me to is #bug 1495017
<ubot5> bug 1495017 in ubiquity (Ubuntu Wily) "ubiquity crashed with permission error on NetworkManager GetDevices() call" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1495017
<davmor2> cyphermox: might just not of made the morning's image
<cyphermox> no, it should have. it made it in yesterday's xubuntu
<davmor2> cyphermox: hmmm let me check the image then
<cyphermox> maybe it's that the fixed autopilot tests block promotion?
<cyphermox> nope
<cyphermox> today's image should have the right ubiquity version
<cyphermox> (I mean, *has* according to manifest)
<davmor2> cyphermox: meh looks like my cronjob beat the cdimage server I'm a day behind by the look of it updating and trying again will confirm shortly if it is fixed
<cyphermox> looks good here
<cyphermox> thanks for reminding me, I really need to cron all my image updates and such
<seb128> hikiko, Trevinho, does https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/1470097 ring a bell?
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1470097 in unity (Ubuntu) "Unity does not support cpus without sse4" [High,Incomplete]
<Trevinho> seb128: loook weird
<Trevinho> I don't think we go that low level in our code... :o
<Trevinho> seb128: is there a way to fake available CPU instructions?
<seb128> Trevinho, dunno, don't bother much, I was asking in case that was known
<larsu> err, shouldn't this be a ubuntu-wide thing?
<larsu> which cpus we support should reflect in compiler switches
<Trevinho> larsu: yeah, in fact that's the same thing I thought
<Trevinho> larsu: although, maybe there's some low level component that uses cpu calls
<Trevinho> but it would be weird if it used these kinds of calls
<larsu> ya
<larsu> hm, git doesn't like seb128's patch
<seb128> larsu, oh?
<seb128> patch -p1 it?
<larsu> also doens't like
<seb128> weiiird, what's the error?
<larsu> fatal: git apply: bad git-diff - expected /dev/null on line 33
<larsu> ah, line ending madnes
<larsu> *madness
<larsu> seb128: seb128@ubuntu.com?
<seb128> larsu, if you want, but don't bother with credit
<seb128> that's a trivial change
<larsu> pushed
<seb128> thanks
<Laney> hmm
<Laney> https://paste.debian.net/312215/
<Laney> that's a program which does basically what unity does
<Laney> is file = g_file_new_for_path(path); delete(path); create(path); g_file_query_exists(path) a sane thing to do?
<larsu> this program looks much simpler than unity to me
<larsu> Laney: yes. GFile is only a url
<Laney> indeed
<Laney> but it's getting false
<larsu> create() failed?
<Laney> woah
<larsu> ?
<Laney> I made it print the filename
<Laney> /usr/share/applications/rhythmbox.desktop.dpkg-new doesn't exist
<larsu> hm?
<Laney> well I had done       file = g_file_new_for_path("/usr/share/applications/rhythmbox.desktop");
<larsu> can you link the source as well please? I don't really know what this is about :)
<seb128> larsu, also http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2015/09/17/%23ubuntu-desktop.html#t13:57
<Laney> larsu: https://paste.debian.net/312217/ sorry!
<seb128> desrt didn't reply
<Laney> unity doesn't pass the flag to get MOVED
<seb128> new glib/old glib give different events
<Laney> I guess this tool does
<Laney> maybe it has a way to tell it not to
<seb128> -N
<seb128>   -N, --no-pair     Don't send single MOVED events
<seb128> ?
<Laney> ya, give that
<seb128> well
<larsu> this is straight in desrt's current territory, no?
<seb128> old glib
<seb128> File Monitor Event:
<seb128> File = /usr/share/applications/gedit.desktop.old
<seb128> Event = DELETED
<seb128> File Monitor Event:
<seb128> File = /usr/share/applications/gedit.desktop
<seb128> Event = CREATED
<seb128> new glib
<seb128> sorry that was new
<seb128> old
<seb128> File Monitor Event:
<seb128> File = /usr/share/applications/gedit.desktop
<seb128> Event = CREATED
<seb128> so glib behaviour changed in any case
<seb128> unsure if that's wanted
<Laney> I don't understand why the deleted event sees .dpkg-new
<seb128> same as in the gvfs-monitor log
<seb128> the moved is transformed on a delete on the old name (but that name is not monitored) + a created
<Laney> yeah
<davmor2> cyphermox: looks to be good dude both the latest image and the slide show
<Laney> holy crap it's 6pm
 * Laney feeds hamsters to the computer
<davmor2> Laney: no it isn't
<Laney> stop trying to psyops me into working longer
<davmor2> cyphermox: meh might of spoken too soon no bootable device :(  retrying
<Laney> there's CHEESE waiting to be eaten
<cyphermox> heh?
<Laney> I probably have a fix for that unity bug
<Laney> but no time to wait for it to build, for now it is cheesezeit
<Laney> bye!
<davmor2> cyphermox: meh I know what it is that stupid bios bug where it only looks for the one specific file
<cyphermox> I have no idea what you're talking about?
<chrisccoulson> Laney, did you manage to build oxide?
<willcooke> hikiko, script says 708 Compiz bugs > 2 years old, and of those only 64 have had any comments in the last year
<willcooke> g'night
<tkamppeter> hi, I have a problem with bug 1449875. I could fix it by adding a dependency to Ghostscript but the new dependency recommends tons of unneeded packages. Do all these get installed then, too?
<ubot5> bug 1449875 in ghostscript (Ubuntu) "ghostscript fails on some EPS files" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1449875
<davmor2> cyphermox: dells bios only see efi entries if /efi/boot/bootx64.efi exists otherwise it ignores the drive
<davmor2> cyphermox: and now after adding the entry it boots
<cyphermox> davmor2: ah, is that documented somewhere?
<davmor2> cyphermox: I think so fourdollars pointed me at it when I hit it the first time round it just threw me for a minute or two till I remembered it
#ubuntu-desktop 2015-09-18
<sethj> hmm, I just noticed two finger tap doesn't open the context menu on 15.10. Anyone else experiencing that?
<sethj> just to be clear, I mean two finger tap on the touchpad.
<pitti> Good morning
<duflu> pitti: Yes good morning (still is in Australia too)
<pitti> duflu: heh yes, couldn't sleep any more
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> bonjour didrocks !
<didrocks> salut pitti, Ã§a va ?
<pitti> didrocks: un peu fatiguÃ©, je m'ai levÃ© Ã  4h15 ..
<pitti> (avec Annett)
<pitti> mais bien, merci ! et toi ?
<didrocks> tu n'es pas restÃ© encore une heure au lit cette fois ?
<didrocks> Ã§a va, merci!  mais pas mal occupÃ© avec du snappyâ¦
<pitti> didrocks: on va Ã  Dresden cet aprÃ¨s-midi, alors je veux encore utiliser "bandwidth"
<didrocks> ah, d'accord :)
<pitti> didrocks: oui, je vais faire Ã§a (snappy demo) aussi aujourd'hui ou le prochaine semaine
<hikiko> hello
<didrocks> hey hikiko ! How are you?
<hikiko> bonjour didrocks :)
<hikiko> i am good, you?
<didrocks> I'm fine, thanks !
<larsu> bonjour!
<didrocks> bonjour larsu !
<larsu> hey how are you didrocks?
<pitti> hellas hikiko!
<pitti> guten Morgen larsu
 * larsu winkt pitti
<didrocks> larsu: I'm good, thanks!
<didrocks> yourself?
<larsu> great thanks!
<larsu> sun is shining so much I have problems seeing the screeen
<larsu> which is *awesome* in this season
<pitti> lol
<pitti> yeah, chilly but sunny autumn, nice!
<larsu> indeed
<hikiko> hey :) hi pitti and larsu
<larsu> good morning hikiko!
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<pitti> bonjour seb128 !
<seb128> hey pitti, wie gehts?
<pitti> seb128: gut, danke! je suis travaillÃ© depuis 4h20, on va Ã  Dresden aujourd'hui Ã  nouveau
<seb128> pitti, c'est dÃ©jÃ  l'aprÃ¨s-midi pour toi alors !
<pitti> seb128: en effet !
<seb128> oh, pitti is piloting
<pitti> *soooarrrrrrrr*
<seb128> that queue is going to be back in 0 today ;-)
<pitti> 57 â 42 so far
<pitti> I think I achieved that only once :/
<seb128> that's quite good, it was up to 80 earlier in the week
<pitti> and with FF it won't be today
<seb128> Laney did a good shift yesterday
<seb128> I was pondering having a look today, but after you guys I bet only the difficults one are going to be left ;-)
<seb128> I might still pick a few ones and at least nag server team or whoever should review them
<didrocks> cyphermox did quite some as well overnight, that was nice :)
<seb128> great
 * pitti -> train station, bbl
<willcooke> o/
<hikiko> hello willcooke
<willcooke> morning hikiko - did you see my message re: old bugs in Compiz...
<willcooke> script says 708 Compiz bugs > 2 years old, and of those only 64 have had any comments in the last year
<willcooke> Seems like we can auto-close a lot of them
<willcooke> or rather, auto-incomplete
<hikiko> no I didn't :s but I closed all the bugs before aug 2010
<seb128> hey willcooke hikiko Laney
<hikiko> it's not in my inbox :S
<hikiko> hi Laney seb128
<Laney> hey hey
<Laney> I just checked the calendar and it is indeed Friday
<Laney> chrisccoulson: oxide> no, I didn't look further than that push-state thing
<seb128> Laney, don't be sad, monday is not that far and then you can hack again on cool Ubuntu things ;-)
<hikiko> lol
<Laney> I know, I just hate the weekend and going to work at the climbing centre
<seb128> :-p
<Laney> all the time I'm there I am just looking forward to being back at launchpad.net
<seb128> going climing this w.e? ;-)
<Laney> ALWAYS!
<Laney> not outdoors though... maybe I should...
<Laney> how's it going? ;-)
<Laney> hey hikiko
<seb128> going good!
<hikiko> willcooke, I can't find your email :/
<seb128> I spent another hour triaging unity bugs, but start having enough of those so time to do something else
<willcooke> hikiko, was IRC
<seb128> I'm going to try to keep doing one hour in the morning for a bit
<willcooke> thanks seb128 !
<seb128> yw!
<willcooke> btw - please let me know (or fill in the spreadsheet) the days you expect to need a hotel room everyone
<willcooke> quite surprised how few people have done that
<Laney> people usually look at their travel options first
<hikiko> willcooke, I can't find it, but I closed some bugs before so we have even fewer
<willcooke> We need to get the hotel book asap, otherwise we're sleeping under desks in Blue Fin
<willcooke> *booked
<pitti> willcooke: I'm sure London has better places to spend the nights at :)
<Laney> sleepover at willcooke's house
<Laney> hey pitti
<pitti> hey Laney, how are you?
<willcooke> I think there is a direct correlation between hotels with rooms available at short notice and the murder rate for that area
<Laney> feeling strangely fine (/me puts that album on)
<Laney> went round a friend's for cheese and board games last night
<Laney> you?
<pitti> Laney: feeling quite okay too, although a bit tired; started early today as we go to Dresden over the weekend
<Laney> that means you're closer to being finished for the week :)
<pitti> Laney: exactly :)
 * Laney swears at mips* https://buildd.debian.org/status/package.php?p=gdk-pixbuf&suite=experimental
<willcooke> Trevinho, hey - any thoughts on when/if the dash overlay scroll bars will land?
<Sweet5hark> hmm, when did we cross the border to insanity: When we had a ./configure script with more then 10.000 lines? Or when we had a ./configure.ac with more than 10.000 lines?
<willcooke> hi Laney, seb128 - I've opened a bug with the new wallpaper.  I will speak to the doc team about exceptions
<willcooke> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-wallpapers/+bug/1497177
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1497177 in ubuntu-wallpapers (Ubuntu) "15.10 default desktop wallpaper" [Undecided,New]
<seb128> willcooke, popey, that screen corruption on monitor config changes (like plugin one or undocking), did you ever try changing workspaces? does that workaround it for you?
<willcooke> seb128, I tried it, made no difference.  I think it's a different bug.  Things like vt1 were effected as well
<Laney> willcooke: thx, will look later/monday
<willcooke> thanks Laney
<popey> seb128: i dont recall, but andyrock has made a patch which I am using now
<seb128> willcooke, k, I just saw it here with an external vga monitor but changing workspace fixed it
<popey> and have been able to change monitor config without it breaking
<seb128> popey, is that working?
<popey> so far, yes
<seb128> so it was a compiz/unity issue?
<popey> looks like it
<seb128> andyrock, ^ should https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xserver-xorg-video-intel/+bug/1421575 be marked invalid?
<willcooke> popey, so your wife-problems are fixed ;)
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1421575 in xserver-xorg-video-intel (Ubuntu) "Desktop corruption when changing monitor config" [High,Triaged]
<popey> lp:~azzar1/unity/lp-1485727/
<popey> IKR
<seb128> lp #1485727
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1485727 in unity (Ubuntu) "Corrupted unity desktop after resizing vbox/vmware window." [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1485727
<willcooke> but
<willcooke> I spoke to andyrock yesterday about this
<seb128> what I though, they seem similar problems
<willcooke> and he said there was no way I should be seeing it on 14.04
<seb128> but then changing workspaces should workaround it
<seb128> willcooke, your bug might be different from the one others are seeing then...
<popey> seb128: ok, let me revert back to stock unity and try that
<seb128> popey, thanks
<willcooke> seb128, yeah, I think so
<popey> seb128: reverted to stock wily unity, rebooted, logged in (had a separate issue I will mention in a moment) screen config changed, screen freaked out, switched desktops, desktop back to working!
<popey> So yes, switching workspaces _does_ work around the issue
<seb128> good
<seb128> popey, thanks for testing
<seb128> popey, I bet you wish you knew about that workaround before ;-)
<popey> Yes. I was thinking exactly that :)
<seb128> well at least it's good, we have a workaround and andyrock has a fix
<seb128> just suck to be willcooke who seems to have a different issue :-/
<popey> willcooke: does switching workspaces not "fix" it for you?
<willcooke> it didn't, but let me try again now...
 * willcooke saves everything first
<popey> Well, seb128 has made my day. So that's good. Thanks seb128 :)
<seb128> popey, yw!
<willcooke> that's a no then
<willcooke> although, actually vt1 is fine
<seb128> :-/
<willcooke> mine smells like drivers to me
<popey> mine smelled like drivers too
<popey> did you not test vanilla 14.04 from a stick?
<popey> pre-HWE stack?
<willcooke> well, seb128 and I tried a load of old kernels
<willcooke> I can't remember what we found out though.  I'll try again later
<seb128> the iso from usb didn't have the issue
<seb128> we didn't find what update started it by doing updates of xorg&co and restarting session
<seb128> we also tried to boot old kernel from the installed laptop
<seb128> but those didn't fix it
<willcooke> I should try andyrock's fix then, just out of interest
<andyrock> hey
<andyrock> well that patch applies to 15.10 (15.04 too?)
<willcooke> but not 14.04 right?
<andyrock> well you should try to merge hikiko's branches
<andyrock> then my fix
<andyrock> and see what happens
<andyrock> or just try to reproduce the problem on 15.10 + that fix
<willcooke> this sounds like something for the weekend
<andyrock> if you can't reproduce the problem anymore we can try to build a ppa with all the patches
<andyrock> to test on 14.04
<andyrock> and see what happens
<hikiko> yes you need the save_state() restore_state() otherwise the unity transformations will be applied in all running compiz plugins causing weird artifacts
<hikiko> and then andyrock's fix
<andyrock> makes sense
<andyrock> I'll try to build a ppa in the weekend
<willcooke> thanks
<popey> andyrock: dunno if it's related, but when I tried your patched unity, if I changed the desktop config (via pulling my laptop out of the docking station) the display froze
<popey> if I plug it back in again it recovers
<seb128> Laney, larsu, lol, I found how to use youtube in totem, usability fail imho
<popey> its not the whole system that freezes, because on the frozen laptop display if I "click" (blindly) things, then it catches up, or does them without showing me the result, so when I plug it back into the display, I suddenly see all the apps I launched
<seb128> Laney, larsu, it's not in the channels, you need to be on the "videos" tab, type something on the keyboard and then click on the "filesystem" label on the right of the text entry, which is a combo, and pick "youtube"
<seb128> I wonder if I'm just a dumb user
<seb128> or if that's really non obvious
<andyrock> popey so without the patch what's the problem?
<andyrock> it's the same right?
<popey> without the patch the screen goes crazy when I change monitor config
<popey> with the patch the screen freezes
<popey> will test some more though.
<larsu> seb128: that is really dumb
 * larsu is off for lunch though
<seb128> larsu, lunch is a good idea, I should do the same
<seb128> larsu, enjoy ;-)
<larsu> :)
<larsu> thanks
<andyrock> k thanks i'll try to test it too
<Trevinho> willcooke: OSB... I've fixed the bugs in nux, I'm almost done now... But there's one last bug in nux that I'd need to clear
<willcooke> Trevinho, coolio, thanks.  You're already on the case
 * Trevinho finally got a silo!
<didrocks> Trevinho: happy siloing :)
<popey> willcooke: did the new font land on the desktop?
<willcooke> popey, heh - which one?
<popey> ours :) Ubuntu Font.
 * Trevinho heard that they were testing it yet?
<willcooke> right, it's not quite that easy
<popey> oh okay.
<willcooke> v. 0.83 of the Ubuntu font is release which includes fixes for Mac
<popey> just noticed my desktop font looks horrid, and wondered if that was why
<popey> probably just my eyes :)
<willcooke> popey, humm, worth looking in to.  Can you do a screen grab?
<popey> willcooke: http://i.imgur.com/zxuuUJa.png
<willcooke> popey, humm, doesn't look quite as smooth as it should does it
<willcooke> popey, what about the dash?
<popey> same
<popey> i have logged in to other (non-unity) desktops on this laptop recently, wonder if that's messed my font settings up
<popey> nvm, will have a play
<willcooke> popey, let me check my vanilla 15.10 vm...
<tkamppeter> hi, I have a problem with bug 1449875. I could fix it by adding a dependency to Ghostscript but the new dependency recommends tons of unneeded packages. Do all these get installed then, too?
<ubot5> bug 1449875 in ghostscript (Ubuntu) "ghostscript fails on some EPS files" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1449875
<popey> willcooke: do you still have an iphone kicking around?
<popey> the #4 crash on errors.u.c is upower, on 14.04 (which you're running?) I have a theory that it only happens when an iphone is left plugged in and charging off the computer - i see it here on my 15.10 system.
<popey> I can tell upower has crashed because I get randomly sent to the lock screen while I'm working, and my machine slows as apport does its dance :)
 * davidcalle reports popey for not using the Ubuntu font
 * popey runs away to the French Foreign Legion 
<Sweet5hark> seb128: libreoffice 5.0.2 for wily building in ppa (and locally) fwiw ...
<seb128> Sweet5hark, great
<seb128> Sweet5hark, did you get the ffe approved?
<Sweet5hark> for 5.0.2? not yet
<Sweet5hark> seb128: building != finished building for libreoffice. and I need build logs for a FFE, dont I?
<seb128> Sweet5hark, ignore me, I was asking about 5.0 but it looks like that landed during my holidays
<Sweet5hark> seb128: yes, it did. kudos to cyphermox for that.
<seb128> Sweet5hark, now you have more sponsors for the DMB application, right? ;-)
<Sweet5hark> seb128: he wondered how it can be that Im not either drunk or in a asylum when seeing the packaging.
<seb128> lol
<Sweet5hark> seb128: hopefully insane packages need insane maintainers.
<Sweet5hark> (there is supposed to be a dot between hopefully and insane)
<willcooke> popey, I do have an iphone kicking around
<popey> willcooke: bet upower crashes if you leave it plugged into your ubuntu laptop :)
<willcooke> popey, will find cables and such and try it
<popey> ta
<willcooke> hi aquarius
<aquarius> willcooke, hey
<willcooke> seb128, do you happen to know off the top of your head if any ibus or fcitx changes landed in 14.04 recently?
<willcooke> aquarius, are these keyboard oddities limited to Unity and/or Gtk apps, Qt apps?
<aquarius> OK. Ctrl-arrows fail in Telegram (which is Qt), gnome-terminal, xchat-gnome (Gtk)
<aquarius> as does ctrl-f
<aquarius> ctrl-s works fine in xchat-gnome
<willcooke> and xev shows that ctrl is being seen?
<willcooke> Trevinho, is Unity doing any extra keyboard grabbing in 14.04 recently?
<willcooke> aquarius, you dont happen to have another keyboard kicking around?
<seb128> willcooke, not that I know, why?
<seb128> tkamppeter, don't add that depends/recommends if it pulls too much in
<seb128> willcooke, I guess for what aquarius is asking
<seb128> aquarius, do you get the issue in a guest session?
<aquarius> willcooke, yup; xev shows ctrl is being seen, and as noted some other ctrl combinations work, so the key's not broken
<willcooke> seb128, aquarius is suddenly having strange kbd issues, ctrl-arrows stopped working, ctrl-f stopped working
<willcooke> seb128, yeah
<aquarius> another keyboard -- you mean, another physical keyboard? Um. Somewhere :)
<seb128> willcooke, do you see the same?
<aquarius> guest session: good idea, I'll try that.
<willcooke> aquarius, yeah, I dunno, would be good to rule that out
<willcooke> seb128, nope, everything is fine here
<aquarius> confirmed: I see the same issue in a guest session
<willcooke> daflip
<seb128> well at least it's not user config
<willcooke> aquarius, do you happen to have a spare USB stick kicking around.  Would be interesting to see if a live 14.04 or 15.04 do that too
<aquarius> and the other ctrl key on the keyboard exhibits the same problem too, having just thought of tsting that
<aquarius> so it's not that someone hexed the ctrl key with "now you hate F and the arrows" :)
<desrt> seb128: this is not strictly a behaviour change
<desrt> seb128: the old glib would have done this too if it was "fast enough" (or if you moved the file slow enough)
<desrt> but the thing where events were always delayed 1s means that you never got the chance to see that before
<seb128> desrt, in practice it is though, enough to make working code behave differently
<desrt> so now that event reporting is faster, it makes sense of course that you have a chance to see more events
<seb128> hum, k
<desrt> i'd argue that the existing code wasn't _really_ working because there were cases where it could have still failed (like if the fs was super-heavy-loaded or something)
<desrt> although in practice, i have to agree with you :(
<seb128> same argument that the gsettings change some cycles ago
<desrt> but i'm really not sure what we should do to fix it....
<seb128> yeah, dunno either
<desrt> well, this one was weaker, and had an easy fix
<seb128> I guess we can fix unity, which is where we noticed it and too bad for other potential users
<desrt> (which i still didn't do, i admit... i still think people should just "fix" their code) :)
<desrt> but this case.... really, we fixed a bug that we had before, which is that events were being missed
<desrt> (due to the mandatory delay)
<seb128> yeah, same good old "apps relying on the runtime behaviour, not the theorical one"
<desrt> which is fair enough
<desrt> TDD is a thing, right?
<desrt> nobody writes code to be correct anyway -- only to pass tests
<desrt> because the first way is apparently impossible
<desrt> btw: good morning :)
<seb128> good morning, happy friday ;-)
<desrt> hells ya friday
<seb128> I hope you had some coffee already before jumping on IRCÂ§
<desrt> gotta go to the airport and rent a car tomorrow
<seb128> !
<desrt> actually, i didn't
<desrt> and there's a story about that, and i _should_
<seb128> you should ;-)
<desrt> basically, i owe money to the store downstairs
<desrt> went yesterday and tried to pay with my credit card, which was cancelled
<desrt> (new one was in the mail and they got too 'excited' about transfering the account too soon)
<desrt> so i couldn't pay... so i really do have to go down today to get a coffee.... and pay for two :)
<desrt> bbiab
<seb128> enjoy! :-)
<aquarius> OK, crisis over
<aquarius> It is the keyboard's fault
<aquarius> Using a different keyboard; works fine
<seb128> good
<aquarius> well, it's good from the point of view of the Ubuntu desktop team
<willcooke> phew
<aquarius> er!
<willcooke> sucks to be aquarius
<willcooke> ;p
<aquarius> it was good
<willcooke> aquarius, Logitech k720
<aquarius> but this one keeps failing
<aquarius> keys don't register sometimes
<aquarius> which I suppose might be *this* keyboard also failing
<aquarius> willcooke, the broken one is a Logitech K520 :)
<aquarius> I like logitech stuff
<aquarius> all the spacing is wrong on this one and everything :)
<aquarius> still, things work now at least.
<desrt> so lol.  got my new 20Ah usb battery yesterday, plugged it in overnight to charge
<desrt> ...it's still charging
<Laney> oh yeah, the unity fix
 * Laney buildz
<tkamppeter> seb128, and as I do not know whether it pulls to much in, I am asking.
<Laney> ummmm
<Laney> why do I have some kind of fcitx indicator in a wily live session?
<Laney> happyaron: any clue?
<seb128> Laney, "some kind"?
<seb128> Laney, what locale?
<Laney> it's a tux penguin
<Laney> en_US I guess, didn't change anything
<seb128> ps aux | grep fcitx?
<Laney> fcitx-qimpanel?
<Laney> it's in /etc/xdg/autostart
<Laney> if I kill that it gets replaced with a normal fcitx one
<Laney> then kill fcitx and both gone
<seb128> I lost track, I though we wouldn't install fcitx by default by pull them through langpack/language-selector?
<seb128> we probably need GunnarHj and/or happyaron for the details
<Laney> it's meant to be shipped as a .deb on the iso so that you can install it if you have internet
<Laney> but not actually installed
<Laney> not working right anyway
<seb128> if you have "no" internet?
<Laney> ye
<seb128> k
<seb128> so why is it installed? ;-)
<seb128> but yeah, seems buggy
<seb128> please open a bug?
<seb128> or
<seb128> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/fcitx/+bug/1489717
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1489717 in fcitx (Ubuntu) "wily: fcitx indicator shown when fcitx isn't in use" [Undecided,New]
<Laney> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/fcitx/+bug/1489717
<Laney> ha
 * seb128 assigns, High, tag rls-w-incoming
<seb128> Laney, thanks for pointing it out!
<Laney> quality triaging
<Laney> would report bug again
<Laney> maybe I'm wrong about how it was meant to be installed in the iso
<Laney> it might be that it should be installed there and removed after if you don't have chinese
<Laney> can't quite remember the discussion
<Laney> but if so then fixing that bug would be enough
<seb128> yeah
<Laney> I saw that it was me who merged the change into the seeds
<Laney> and thought hey that guy is usually right, it's probably *me* that is wrong
<Laney> :P
<seb128> desrt, larsu, Laney, can any of you remind me the environment variable that can be set to see the gdbus traffic?
<Laney> G_DBUS_DEBUG=all
<desrt> =message is better
<desrt> all is too verbose
<seb128> Laney, desrt, thanks
<seb128> brb, session restart
<larsu> desrt: it's all too verbose
<Laney> no YOU'RE too verbose
 * larsu shuts up
<Laney> :(
 * willcooke switches the light on
<willcooke> it's not even 6pm yet, and its too dark
<willcooke> :'(
<Trevinho> oh... so sad... :(
<Trevinho> willcooke: ah, you asked me about new grabs in 14.04 somewhere?  But well, I don't think anything changed recently
<willcooke> Trevinho, s'ok it was aquarius dodgy keyboard all along ;)
<aquarius> I am exceedingly sad about this, since now I've gotta buy a new keyboard
<aquarius> and I liked my logitech one
<Trevinho> oh, well mechanical ones are the new old stuff :)
<willcooke> buy a new one the same
<aquarius> trying to decide whether I should ask G+ and get a billion answers to make myself feel popular
<Trevinho> I'd just love to get a full keyboard with trackpad... but lenovo doesn't care about that :(
<willcooke> aquarius, screw that, go on eBuyer, wireless keyboards, sort my popularity, done
<aquarius> willcooke, but... this one's bust. This is not encouraging me to buy another. especially since I've only had it 18 months!
<willcooke> ah, I have a picture of your keyboard round here somewhere....
<willcooke> popey sent it to me...
<willcooke> http://i.imgur.com/ZaSx2eu.jpg
<aquarius> blimey, that's horrid
<Trevinho> Speaking of membrane keyboards, I'm experiencing lot of pleasure with this one http://www.logitech.com/en-us/product/wireless-illuminated-keyboard-k800?wt.mc_id=global_social-k800_redirect_FY11
<aquarius> my keyboard is not like that :)
<robert_ancell> desrt, decided not to come in to XDC today then?
<desrt> robert_ancell: no.  had too much work to do
 * desrt has been dealing with travel, emails, etc. for most of the morning
<willcooke> happy weekend all
<willcooke> safe travels robert_ancell
<Laney> happy weekend!
<desrt> Laney: take care!
<larsu> have fun!
<mterry> seb128, this bluetooth fix...
<seb128> mterry, yes?
<mterry> seb128, am I supposed to see a dialog when trying to pair?  I still don't see one  :(
<mterry> i mean, a pin prompt
<mterry> seb128, I install the package and then restart the control center
<seb128> mterry, yes, for me when I select the keyboard in settings and do next I get pincode to enter
<mterry> humph
<mterry> seb128, well the code change seems similar to the old one.  But I don't know if I should comment in the bug, since it doesn't seem to change things for me.  Maybe my keyboard has additional special problems
<mterry> comment in the MP I meant
<seb128> mterry, I Cced you mainly so you could try
<seb128> you might have more issues
<seb128> feel free to ignore the mp if that doesn't do it for you
<seb128> mterry, I get that with the patch here, http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/bluetooth.png
<seb128> where it was spinning/failing before
<mterry> seb128, you are living the dream
<seb128> lol
<mterry> seb128, now you're just bragging  :)
<seb128> :-(
<mterry> haha
<mterry> seb128, that's a nice dialog though
<seb128> mterry, you can try to  G_DBUS_DEBUG=all bluetooth-wizard
<seb128> and see if there is anything useful in the log
<mterry>  >>>> METHOD ERROR org.bluez.Error.Rejected
<mterry>       message 'Rejected bluetoothd generated PIN code'
<mterry>       in response to org.bluez.Agent1.DisplayPinCode()
<mterry>       on object /org/bluez/agent/gnome
<mterry> seb128, ^
<mterry> seems bad
<seb128> yeah
<seb128> unsure why, but it's a different method that the one used on my keyboard (DisplayPasskey)
<mterry> fascinating
<seb128> mterry, I'm about to call it a week, unsure what's going on but I can try having a look on monday if I see something in that code (a bit difficult to debug without device to test though)
<seb128> mterry, did you find something?
<mterry> seb128, my keyboard is a weird combo keyboard/touchpad
 * Trevinho probably got nux under control to get the new scrollbars not to be badly rendered...
<mterry> seb128, don't worry about it, go eod
<seb128> Trevinho, great
<mterry> seb128, no didn't find any thing, just slowly responding to your message  :)
<seb128> mterry, I'm still interested if you figure out something so please comment on the bug if you do ;-)
<mterry> seb128, yar
<seb128> have a nice w.e everyone!
<mterry> bye!
<Trevinho> yah... using nux is always like guessing random numbers
 * Trevinho leaves for WE
#ubuntu-desktop 2015-09-19
<sethj> anyone else think this is more of a feature than a bug? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/874734
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 874734 in unity (Ubuntu) "Alt-Backtick Keyboard Shortcut Can Not Be Disabled" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<frozenonline> hello
<frozenonline> hi
#ubuntu-desktop 2015-09-20
<happyaron> Laney: it's .desktop autostart, will upload fix to debian today
<IronDev> Hi Guys
<IronDev> I have a Mid 2011 MacBook Air
<IronDev> And it had 14.04 installed
<IronDev> So I upgraded it to 14.10
<IronDev> And when I did that the trackpad/wifi went bad
<IronDev> So I used bluetooth to connect to the internet and a mouse to control my computer
<IronDev> And I was messing with the system
<IronDev> When I tried to install Synaptiks from the Ubuntu Software Center
<IronDev> It froze and I forced restart and now the only thing I see is a blinking underscore after the ubuntu boot logo
<IronDev> Anyone on?
<IronDev> :) I got tty2 on
<IronDev> Yup
<IronDev> Its just a graphic prob
<ayan> IronDev: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/RecoveryMode
#ubuntu-desktop 2016-09-19
<hikiko> Hi!
<willcooke> morning all
<willcooke> TheMuso, still around?
<TheMuso> willcooke: Yup.
<TheMuso> Morning all.
<Laney> OHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
<Laney> I MISSED YOUUUUUUUUUUUUU
<Laney> Feeling Not Mutual
<pitti> Good morning willcooke and Laney!
<pitti> how are you doing?
 * pitti had a *really* quiet weekend, it has rained non-stop since Friday night (still is)
<Laney> hey pitti!
<Laney> the weather is unpleasant today here too - but the weekend was nice
<Laney> the parts where I wasn't in a flying metal tube anyway
<pitti> Laney: so are you a certified surfer now?
<Laney> 3 days of surfing are behind me, indeed
<Laney> don't feel *that* much better than when I started :)
<Laney> could stand up some (most?) of the time
<pitti> oh, I expected these courses to take much longer
<Laney> one day the waves were quite big for beginners
 * Laney has painful ribs from that one
<willcooke> Night TheMuso
<willcooke> hey Laney - welcome back!
<Laney> hi willcooke!
<willcooke> morning pitti
<Laney> what up?
<willcooke> Chillin'.  LIttle bit of illin'
<pitti> Laney: hmm; I hope you enjoyed the rest of your vacation more!
<davmor2> Laney: Shut up whinging already you had a blast, that's all we need to hear ;)
<Laney> davmor2: I can't sleep on one side :P
<Laney> BUT
<Laney> we were talking about going surfing again
<Laney> so must have had fun eh
<seb128> oh, some activity here, good morning desktopers
<willcooke> Hey seb128
<Laney> hi seb128!
<pitti> bonjour seb128 !
<seb128> sorry was head down in clearing backlog after 3 days w.e
<willcooke> Laney, seb128 - any chance of an SRU for this?  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nautilus-image-converter/+bug/1581094
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1581094 in One Hundred Papercuts "Rotate option fails to open dialog" [Low,Confirmed]
<davmor2> seb128: pfff come here and the first thing you do is work priorities man mornings first then work ;)
<seb128> willcooke, no reason we couldn't
<seb128> willcooke, I can add it to my list, going to have a look today
<willcooke> seb128, I was thinking this might be a good 1st day tasks for flexiondotorg next Monday?
<willcooke> 1st / 1st week
<willcooke> what do you think?
<seb128> as you wish
<seb128> it's an easy job, he's to packaging so shouldn't be taking more than 15 minutes
<seb128> but yeah, might be a nice/easy warm up one
<willcooke> oki, would rather you kept things clear to focus on the U8 MIRs etc
<seb128> makes sense
<seb128> especially that I'm on holidays at the end of the week until octobre 7 (noticed I forgot to put those in the system before so did that earlier today...)
<willcooke> Ohh
<willcooke> man
<willcooke> that's gonna be fun
<andyrock> morning
<seb128> hey andyrock!
<Laney> seb128: how's it going?
<Laney> did I m iss much? ;-)
<Laney> hi andyrock! how are you?
<andyrock> hey hey Laney
<seb128> Laney, going well, just had a 3 days w.e in France, that was nice
<seb128> Laney, I don't think you missing much no, Trevinho landed the unity7 systemd session thingy
<Laney> nothing better than some time in france!
<Laney> yeah I saw
<seb128> otherwise fun is going for next weeks
<Laney> winning
<seb128> the stack of MIRs for unity8 is still being worked on
<Laney> lemme know if you want any help
 * Laney tries to remember what was going on 10 days ago
<Laney> was jujuing
<seb128_> bah, internet disconnected
<seb128_> if somebody said something and I didn't reply please repeat
<Laney> 19/09 09:50:22 <Laney> lemme know if you want any help
<Laney> 19/09 09:50:37  * Laney tries to remember what was going on 10 days ago
<Laney> 19/09 09:50:39 <Laney> was jujuing
<Laney> be back in a minute
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> things are mostly being handled my Canonical upstreams and MIR team
<seb128> but we need to keep an eye on those/help getting reviews/fixes going to get it in shape for landing
<Laney> k
<seb128> going for lunch, bbiab
<davmor2> willcooke, seb128, Laney: so unity7 on it's own seems mostly stable I noticed an issue with routing which I believe maybe because of vpn and both connections enabling it by default maybe need to dig into that this morning
<davmor2> testing unity8 desktop session in vm to see if the issue with mesa is now resolved
<davmor2> unity8 still has issues which can potentially then affect unity7 still need to dig into those
<davmor2> unity8 music and video scopes are triggering scope crashes which take out the dash
<davmor2> digging into that too
<davmor2> installing chrome works a charm
<willcooke> thanks davmor2
<davmor2> willcooke: oh the mesa fix seems to of fixed the scopes crash however in My Music I see zfscrypt xzio xnu uuid test as music tracks hmmm me thinks it is not looking in the right folder if it's finding that stuff
<willcooke> davmor2, we can probably drop the music scope at this point
<davmor2> willcooke: but then how do you play music?
<willcooke> music app?
<willcooke> does that need the scope?
<ahayzen> nope :-) just mediascanner
<willcooke> :) thanks ahayzen - and welcome!
<ahayzen> willcooke, the music-app probably needs at media-hub and thumbnailer as well these days
<willcooke> I think that once we get the terminal in main then people could pull those in from universe
<willcooke> saves trying to MIR them now
<ahayzen> yeah :-) i know the media-hub team were working on getting that running on desktop, and thumbnailer already seems to work
<willcooke> plus I dont think media hub is fully "classic desktop" enabled yet
<willcooke> that :)
<willcooke> thumbnailer is getting an MIR
<willcooke> grr. Why does pad never reconnected properly
<desrt> hello, desktop!
<seb128> hey desrt, how are you?
<desrt> good.  a bit sleepy.  another busy weekend :)
<desrt> how was your weekend?
<seb128> good, we were in France, had some relaxing time and good food
<desrt> morning, hikiko
<desrt> visiting family, or..?
<seb128> yeah, visiting friends&familly for 3 days, that was nice ;-)
 * desrt waits for the next canadian long weekend to do the same
<desrt> willcooke: good morning
<willcooke> hi desrt
<hikiko> hi desrt
<hikiko> and all :)
<willcooke> hi hikiko!  Good break?
<willcooke> hey renatu
<willcooke> seb128, I was just talking to renatu about the packaging for buteo-syncfw - we've got it listed as not needed but it's being pulled in as a depends on something else right?
<willcooke> renatu, so do you think we can get away with not having buteo-syncfw on the 16.10 desktop?
<hikiko> yes willcooke :) it was nice! a bit tiring though!
<renatu> willcooke, yes, I will remove it from address-book-service dep
<willcooke> thanks renatu - in which case, I think that cascades down and means we can drop libiphb too right?
<willcooke> and then just MIR address-book-service
<renatu> willcooke, I am not sure which package is asking for libiphb
<seb128> willcooke, right, what renatu said
<renatu> probably this is a buteo-syncfw dep. If we drop buteo-syncfw it will not be necessary anymore
<willcooke> hmm, then I am confused as to why it's on the list :)
<willcooke> renatu, that sounds good!
<willcooke> thanks
<seb128> it's a buteo-syncfw depends yes
<willcooke> k
<willcooke> cool, so sounds like we're all set to change the packaging on a-b-service and drop libiphb and b-syncfw from the list
<willcooke> thanks a lot renatu
<willcooke> and seb128
<seb128> yw!
<willcooke> renatu, could you send me a link to the MIR once filed?
<renatu> willcooke, https://code.launchpad.net/~renatofilho/address-book-service/no-sync-dep/+merge/306090
<renatu> willcooke, I will create a silo with it. to test
<willcooke> renatu, ta.  Once you're happy please file an MIR bug to get a-b-s in too
<willcooke> and lemme have a link for that too
<seb128> renatu, willcooke, Recommends is not good enough, we are going to need to MIR/install recommends or downgrade them to suggests
<renatu> seb128, ok
<seb128> so we should directly go for a Suggests
<Laney> I just wrote something that does $(basename "${HOME}")
 * Laney sucks
<Sweet5hark> evil
<ogra_> yeah, you should grep /etc/passwd instead !
<ogra_> :)
<Laney> Another Quality Engineering Solution from Canonicalâ
<ogra_> grep "${HOME}" /etc/passwd|cut -d: -f1
<ogra_> for the beauty of it :)
 * ogra_ giggles
<Laney> that is actually more robust
<Laney> the basename might not always be the username
<ogra_> well, equally ugly
<Laney> oh it's shit
<Laney> but less buggy!
<Laney> :)
<ogra_> are there actual situations where you have $HOME but not $USER ?
<Laney> dunno
<Laney> I made it use id -un
<desrt> i appear not to have $USER
<desrt> (and i have $HOME)
<Laney> unlucky
 * Laney snuggles $USER
<Laney> hi desrt!
<desrt> hi laney :)
<Laney> what's new?
<desrt> not lots.  trying to get unpriv'd lxc working again.  it's not going too well.
<desrt> cgroups suck so bad :(
<desrt> the wild incompatibilities between cgroups v1 and v2 make the kernel developer's claims of taking backcompat seriously pretty laughable
<desrt> and it's fine.... v1 was unfixable.... the break is worth it
<desrt> i just wish that they'd stop pretending that they are better on this point than anyone else
 * desrt watches Laney self-snuggle
<Laney> first jeans day of the season today
<Laney> huddling is more appropriate
<desrt> i love colder!
 * desrt has had more than enough summer
 * desrt is targetted by an impressively advanced phishing scheme
<desrt> i think someone got hold of the customer list of my dentist....
<Laney> free scale and polish or you hit the news
<desrt> it's my old dentist... and i just had a scale and polish last week :p
#ubuntu-desktop 2016-09-20
<hikiko> hello
<pitti> Good morning
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<seb128> salut pitti, Ã§a va bien ?
<pitti> seb128: oui, mais trop de pluie (depuis vendredi..); et toi ?
<seb128> Ã§a va bien !
<seb128> c'est utile de la pluie, le sol Ã©tait trop sec
<pitti> yeah, but 4 days of uninterrupted rain is getting depressing
<pitti> actually it *just* stopped now! \o/
<pitti> je peux voir un peu bleu dans la ciel !
<willcooke> morning all
<hikiko> morning willcooke :)
<handsome_feng> Morning ! :)
<seb128> hey willcooke hikiko handsome_feng
<TheMuso> Hey folks.
<seb128> hey TheMuso
<hikiko> hi seb128 TheMuso seb128
<Laney> argh
<pitti> hey TheMuso
<pitti> morning Laney, how are you?
<pitti> are your ribs getting better?
<Laney> just been cleaning cat mess off the doorstep :@
<Laney> AND I pressed print screen by mistake and it's hung my laptop...
<Laney> ribs seem better though and I'm generally okay; thanks!
<Laney> how are you?
<seb128> hey Laney
<pitti> Laney: quite well, thanks; I can *finally* see some blue sky and a hint of sun after 4 days of uninterrupted rain \o/
<seb128> Laney, so you got a cat? or just one from the neighbour visiting?
<Laney> pitti: garden's going to look *great*
<Laney> hey seb128
<pitti> Laney: oh, what did you do?
<Laney> just some random cat
<Laney> pitti: I mean yours after that much watering :)
<pitti> we have about a dozen neighbor cats, and whichever is the alpha cat du jour tends to leave their markings in our garden
<Laney> seb128: how's it going?
<pitti> ugly step-on mines those!
<seb128> Laney, good! sunny but with 19Â°C, much better than 30Â°C ;-)
<pitti> Laney: oh, heh yes -- I didn't have to water myself indeed :)
<Laney> haha
<seb128> though having some difficulties to feel awake this morning, working on it with coffee
<Laney> this was like - open the door, luckily look down instead of just stepping straight out, "oh, a present, how nice"
 * Laney powers off laptop :(
<seb128> the screenshot froze it for good?
<seb128> did you sit on the key (and even that shouldn't DoS the system nowadays)
<Laney> killed dead nada
<Laney> couldn't ssh to it
<seb128> weird
<pitti> the key doesn't say "FreezeScr"?
<pitti> wow
<pitti> not even ssh? harsh
 * Laney tries again
<pitti> so not even just the "usual" graphic card messup
<pitti> Laney: it's gtk bug!
<pitti> OMG, I screwed that up
<Laney> meh, worked that time
<pitti> itz gtk bug!
<Laney> haha
<Laney> that's some gtk bug
<Laney> - crashthesystem();
<pitti> *clearly* from the changed theming engine
<Laney> screenshot { crash: true; }
<pitti> Laney: still anything in journalctl -b -1 (or syslog) by chance?
 * Laney looks
<pitti> I suppose not if it crashed that hard
<Laney> no persistent journal of course
 * Laney turns that on
<pitti> well, if it makes it that far, then rsyslog hopefully still survived a bit too -- nothing in syslog?
<pitti> Laney: oh, you physically powered off, not even SysRq worked any more?
<pitti> then there's no hope of logging indeed
<Laney> Sep 20 09:04:40 nightingale systemd[8967]: Reached target Timers.
<Laney> Sep 20 09:10:00 nightingale rsyslogd: [origin software="rsyslogd" swVersion="8.16.0" x-pid="1152" x-info="http://www.rsyslog.com"] start
<Laney> you know, I don't actually know how to sysrq on that machine
<Laney> is it fn + print screen?
<pitti> Alt+PrintScr here
<Laney> indeed!
<Laney> I thought that wouldn't work on the laptop keyboard for some reason
<willcooke> seb128, are you able to edit the subscribers on this:  https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntuone-credentials
<willcooke> I /think/ it needs unity api bugs removing
<willcooke> and then it's either approved or needs another MIR team go-around.  Cant really tell.
<seb128> willcooke, well, "edit", yes, but you can only subscribe teams you are administrator for, and I'm not for the unity api one
<willcooke> ah, kk
<seb128> one for alecu I guess, I can ping him if you want
<willcooke> yes please, thanks seb128
<willcooke> a couple more sec. acks came in over night
<willcooke> just tidying up now to try and get the list down even smaller
<seb128> willcooke, team has been subscribed from the comments on the bug
<willcooke> it has, but they said they wanted u-api-bugs removing
<willcooke> well, at least I think that's what it means
<willcooke> it's quite confusing
<seb128> well, the other one got added
<seb128> so that's how they deal with bugspam on their side
<willcooke> so probably good enough then
<seb128> the MIR side is fine
<willcooke> so you think we can move it to fixed?
<willcooke> or does an mir person have to do that?
<willcooke> Everything /looks/ ok to me
<willcooke> but whadda I know
<seb128> need to check with mterry
<willcooke> ack
<willcooke> I will assign it back
<seb128> he was argue with dobey
<seb128> the powerpc tests have been disabled
<seb128> which is not nice
<seb128> see comments #7-9
<seb128> 7-8
<willcooke> This is going to be a day for coffee instead of tea I think.
<willcooke> yes, it's *that* bad
 * willcooke . . o O (or maybe wine)
<TheMuso> lol
<happyaron> seb128: hey, mind to check my n-m changelog for patches again? it's 1 rename, 4 drops and 2 additions, all documented in changelog
<happyaron> if such form is okay, I'll go normal sponsorship process for coming updates
 * Laney stabs multithreading
<willcooke> LP down?
<willcooke> ignore
<Laney> :)
<alecu> seb128, willcooke: anything I can help with there?
<willcooke> hey alecu!
<willcooke> alecu, I think the most important things from my perspective are: u-scope-click && seeing if we can drop pay-service for 16.10
<alecu> willcooke: Sure, that's what I've got in my plate
<willcooke> alecu, super, thanks!
<willcooke> oh, right, the other thing alecu
<willcooke> can you remove unity-api-bugs as a subscriber from https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntuone-credentials
<alecu> Sure!
<willcooke> thanks!
<alecu> willcooke: seems I can't do it: https://launchpad.net/~unity-api-bugs/+members
<willcooke> ahh, kk - thanks alecu
<desrt> guten morgen
<Laney> ahoy desrt
<Laney> how's â?
<desrt> the left arrow appears lovely
<Laney> not here actually
<seb128> good morning desrt
<Laney> http://people.canonical.com/~laney/weird-things/argh.png
<desrt> morning seb
<desrt> nice left-arrow/questionmark ligature.  a very common and useful thing, to be sure.
<Laney> âºâºâºâºâºâºâº
<Laney> http://people.canonical.com/~laney/weird-things/argh2.png
<desrt> "we are the borg.  sadness is futile."
<ximion> Laney: are you using PackageKit for anything in Ubuntu at time?
<Laney> hi ximion
<Laney> you mean in the default desktop?
<Laney> not that I can think of right now
<Laney> other flavours might though
<Laney> don't break stuff
<ximion> Laney: on the contrary - I will upload a packagekit package today which fixes a lot of stuff ;-)
<Laney> ok
<ximion> and if you use it anywhere by default, you would definitely want that
<Laney> I know you love to break APIs :P
<Laney> we will merge it anyway
<ximion> if I wouldn't control myself I would end up in an endless cycle of rewrites ^^
<Laney> good job with PK you have hughsie to hold the line
<Laney> :)
<ximion> but at least the AppStream API is planned to stay stable for quite a long time now
<ximion> ha! you haven't experienced PKs past history of breaking stuff
 * Laney knows a bit
 * Laney knows click
 * Laney PRs it up
<Laney> ximion: thanks for merging, but reply to my question please - I'm curious :P
<ximion> Laney: did that a few msecs ago ^^
<ximion> looks like we might have missed an opportunity to optimize ^^
<Laney> synchronized (#ubuntu-desktop) {}
<ximion> :D
<Laney> meh
<Laney> asgen is getting OOM-killed on the cloud instance
<Laney> 8G is not enough?
<ximion> Laney: 4G is enough at Debian
<ximion> but barely
<ximion> are you running master?
<Laney> yeah
<ximion> I added a few patches to make it go easier on memory
<ximion> okay, so maybe just restart it when it got killed until it succeeds...
<Laney> haha
<ximion> but seriously, this is a bit ridiculous - I know that it will eat tons of ram, but it shouldn't really consume *that much*
<Laney> https://paste.ubuntu.com/23207393/
<ximion> I valgrinded all non-GC pieces, and there was no bigger memory leak (and the smaller ones are fixed)
<ximion> so either the GC is dumb, or we just have so many interconnected structures that there simply is nothing to free for quite a long time
<ximion> the latter might actually be true
<Laney> hope it's not something stupid like a leak in the downloading
<ximion> Laney: I always wanted to try out GC profiling: https://dlang.org/spec/garbage.html#gc_config
<ximion> everything that's @nogc is suspicious, and anything that mallocs as well
<ximion> Laney: are you cleaning up  stuff properly when a package is close()d?
<Laney> what stuff?
<Laney> it should all be in the tmpdir
<ximion> ok, so nothing in memory...
<ximion> maybe keeping a reference on everything via that allPackages thing you do adds additional memory usage
<ximion> btw, that's the profiling result for a dry run on one suite and one component (without processing packages): http://paste.debian.net/830522/
<ximion> kind of what I expect
<Laney> but the debian thing has the pkgCache too
<Laney> the references to an array shouldn't be significant
<ximion> no, but the references keep the actual object alive
<ximion> even if it isn't needed anymore
<Laney> the index is always alive no?
<Laney> ok so I could kill allPackages after extracting the langpacks
<Laney> not sure I believe this theory
<Laney> it would spike up almost immediately
<Laney> but this ran for some hours before being killed
<ximion> Laney: pruning stuff from the PkgIndex has lead to quite some decrease in RAM usage
<Laney> ok, I'll try to just keep the langpacks
<ximion> I now prune it after a section was processed
<ximion> but if the langpacks stuff still holds a reference to all of thise packages, they will of course not be collected
<Laney> it just overrides packagesFor and keeps the result
<ximion> I think one general problem with D is that it loves to copy by value and not by reference to achieve safety...
<ximion> by-reference is pretty much always an explicit action
<Laney> I remember that it was very annoying to achieve in this case
<ximion> sometimes asking on the forums is useful
<ximion> the people there are helpful, and I sometimes also just do it to highlight something I consider broken :P
<willcooke> weekly meeting aficionados - I'm in another meeting which is running a little late.  BRWY
<willcooke> unless someone else wants to get started
<willcooke> lulz
<Laney> ximion: do you want me to PR for that MAP thing or will you just do it?
<vigo> cyphermox, ping :)
<willcooke> oki, meeting time
<qengho> yay!
<willcooke> #startmeeting Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-09-20
<meetingology> Meeting started Tue Sep 20 15:32:46 2016 UTC.  The chair is willcooke. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-09-20 | Current topic:
 * Sweet5hark1 sneaks in
<willcooke> Roll call:  andyrock, attente, desrt,  dgadomski, fjkong, happyaron (out), hikiko (out), laney, qengho, seb128 (out), sweet5hark, themuso (out), tkamppeter, trevinho, robert_ancell (out)
<Laney> o/
<willcooke> Let's begin...
<willcooke> #topic andyrock
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-09-20 | Current topic: andyrock
<desrt> quiet day
<willcooke> let's come back to andyrock
<willcooke> #topic attente
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-09-20 | Current topic: attente
<attente> hey
 * desrt is on team attente
<attente> pretty sick recently
<attente> made a confined glade snap: http://attente.ca/glade_3.20.0.587b5514.1_amd64.snap
<attente> need to add tests for the jhbuild snapcraft plugin before it can be merged upstream
<attente> added glib bindings to content-hub, also just missing tests before it can be merged upstream
<attente> (eof)
<davmor2> seb128, Laney: could you have a quick look at something for me please, Open mouse settings double click is it orange to the right rather than the left on the slider?
<desrt> davmor2: meeting now.  after, maybe?
<willcooke> thanks attente, get well soon
<willcooke> #topic desrt
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-09-20 | Current topic: desrt
<davmor2> yeah no rush
<desrt> hihi.  forgot to prepare notes again, sorry :p
<desrt> usual week.  bugs, reviews, etc.  starting to write tests on the first round of dconf changes.  found a lot of issues, but i managed to get 100% through for the first time this morning.
<desrt> that's all, really
<willcooke> thanks desrt
<desrt> oh, also:
<desrt> played with containers a lot.  systemd-nspawn is pretty neat.
<ximion> Laney: whatever you like better
<ximion> I can do it ^^
<Laney> (less work)
<willcooke> #topic FJKong
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-09-20 | Current topic: FJKong
<FJKong> hi
<FJKong> 1 Hand over Sogou IM code to NUDT guys, do some guiding work.
<FJKong> 2 start packaging simple snap packages like: aldo, fldigi, snap register blocked
<FJKong> 3 report ong bug about snapcraft bug#1624854
<FJKong> 4 holiday of Mid autumn Festival
<FJKong> eof
<willcooke> thanks FJKong - happy hols!
<andyrock> o/
<willcooke> #topic andyrock
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-09-20 | Current topic: andyrock
<willcooke> :)
<andyrock> hey
<andyrock> sorry I had a troubled afternoon (I had to go to ER)
<willcooke> oh!!
<desrt> :(  are you okay?
<andyrock> basically another week working on unity8
<andyrock> yeah just a small problem with a finger
<qengho> Which keys?
<willcooke> sorry to hear that andyrock, hope you are on the mend
<andyrock> btw i've almosted completed the tooltips for unity8 launcher
<andyrock> i need to write some testes
 * desrt chuckles
<andyrock> yeah it's just a small problem  :D
<willcooke> thanks andyrock
<willcooke> #topic happyaron
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-09-20 | Current topic: happyaron
<willcooke> 1. short week due to visa interview on Wed, national holidays on Thu and Fri
<willcooke> 2. fcitx/1:4.2.9.1-3, LP: #1608469
<willcooke> 3. spl/zfs 0.6.5.8-1
<willcooke> 4. fix radcli (fork and replaces libfreeradius), add radius support in ocserv
<willcooke> 5. Reviews and summaries
<ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1608469 in fcitx (Ubuntu) "fcitx does not handle XmbReetIC() properly" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1608469
<qengho> zfs!
<willcooke> #topic hikiko
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-09-20 | Current topic: hikiko
<willcooke> * on holidays most of the days
<willcooke> * have some MPs awaiting review from last week
<willcooke> * looking at some U7 bugs in the meantime
<willcooke> EOF
 * Laney thought that was willcooke's summary at first
<Laney> "working on zfs now????"
<willcooke> :)
<willcooke> #topic Laney
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-09-20 | Current topic: Laney
<Laney> actually was more curious about the visa bit :P
<Laney> oh yeah
<Laney> this
<Laney> â¢ Short week - back from holidays
<Laney> â¢ Before I went away I uploaded the new default wallpaper, still waiting for a less banded version to replace the current one with.
<Laney> â¢ I also worked (also this week) on charming up the new asgen - the charm basically works now, but there are some bugs
<Laney> â a memory leak that makes it get OOM killed
<Laney> â some problems with thread safety (fixed upstream)
<Laney> â frontend is being hit by openstack being broken - I can't assign an IP to the instance (internal RT #95804 for interested nerds/jocks)
<Laney> â¢ Did the small appstream 0.10 transition quickly after the FFe got approved (todo: backport to xenial-backports)
<Laney> â¢ Oh I did (and reviewed) some theme bugfixes too (including https://code.launchpad.net/~willcooke/ubuntu-themes/hidpiicons/+merge/305219 which needs some small fixes)
<Laney> â¢ davmor2: it's the same on xenial - something weird there!
<Laney> ð
<willcooke> thanks Laney - I'll take a look at those fixes
<Laney> r0x0r
<willcooke> #topic qengho
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-09-20 | Current topic: qengho
<qengho> Happy Tuesday, y'all.
<qengho> * in-progress: new chromium upstream 53.0.2785.113. fine in yakkety, but crash in xenial amd64! memory allocator? Debugging.
<qengho> * in-progress: browser snap test, GPU issues, printing still not working.
<qengho> * to-do: armhf rasppi chromium crash. Old bug, but needs to be fixed.
<qengho> EOF
<willcooke> thanks qengho
<willcooke> Did the API changes get a final fix yet?
<davmor2> Laney: just looked odd so I just wanted a confirmation that it was meant to look like that
<qengho> No. I need to find out about Firefox. I ignored it yesterday.
<willcooke> qengho, ack
<willcooke> thx
<willcooke> #topic seb128
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-09-20 | Current topic: seb128
<willcooke> â¢ one vac day
<willcooke> â¢ some patch piloting (not a full shift but cleaned a bit and got some
<willcooke> things uploaded for yakkety)
<willcooke> â¢ several rounds of reviewing the unity8-mirs-stack and testing on the
<willcooke> daily iso
<willcooke> â¢ NEW reviews for the touch team
<willcooke> â¢ yakkety daily iso testing
<willcooke> â¢ bugs triaging and some fixing
<willcooke> â¢ joined some snappy discussions (mostly about xdg-open)
<willcooke> #topic Sweet5hark1
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-09-20 | Current topic: Sweet5hark1
<Sweet5hark1> - two days vacation
<Sweet5hark1> - updated libreoffice snap to 5.2.1
<Sweet5hark1> -- first attempt rejected: had no .desktop entries while using unity7 (neither had previous uploads, so moving goalposts a bit here)
<Sweet5hark1> -- added .desktop files after hunting for some docs where they are supposed to be
<Sweet5hark1> -- ran into bug 1623580, worked around it by providing .desktop files different from what is documented
<Sweet5hark1> -- filed bug 1625656, as static desktop files arent sustainable in the long run for LibreOffice and likely a lot of others who have non-trivial l10n in desktop files
<Sweet5hark1> -- also noted two new deprecation warnings from snapcraft since the last 5.2.0 build. IMHO that (combined with the rejection due to missing .desktop files which never where there) hints at the danger that we do a lintianification of snap (which will discourage volunteers)
<Sweet5hark1> - looked into bug 1619442
<Sweet5hark1> -- verified this is a gtk2 backend only issue
<Sweet5hark1> -- gtk2 is phased out and only provided as an emergency fallback from yakkety onwards, so dropped severity from High->Medium
<Sweet5hark1> -- might look into disabling gmenumodel/unity integration for gtk2 if this fixes the issue
<Sweet5hark1> EOF
<ubot5`> bug 1623580 in snapd (Ubuntu) "snapd strips Exec= lines from .desktop files which should be legitimate" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1623580
<ubot5`> bug 1625656 in Snapcraft "snapcraft should support dynamically generated .desktop files" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1625656
<ubot5`> bug 1619442 in libreoffice (Ubuntu) "An empty bar appeared above the toolbar after upgrade to version 5.2 (Unity7/gtk2)" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1619442
<willcooke> thanks Sweet5hark1
<willcooke> #topic TheMuso
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-09-20 | Current topic: TheMuso
<willcooke> * Worked on getting the terminal app in a deacent state for upload to yakkety. Afaik popey is handling the paperwork. Bug 1623845.
<willcooke> * Worked out that Orca is usable in oem-config mode under Xenial but not Yakkety. I suspect an a11y stack regression somewhere, not pursuing for yakkety at this point. However, to make things work properly in oem-config mode to allow a user to select a profile during first setup, an extra script will need to be added to ubiquity. No bug yet, plan to file that in coming days.
<willcooke> * Looked at getting a hold of some bluetooth hardware to track down the various bluetooth audio bugs we have, one being bug 1574324.
<ubot5`> bug 1623845 in Ubuntu "[needs-packaging] ubuntu-terminal-app" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1623845
<ubot5`> bug 1574324 in pulseaudio (Ubuntu) "pulseaudio crashes when connecting to bluetooth headphones (due to ubuntu changes?)" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1574324
<willcooke> #topic tkamppeter
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-09-20 | Current topic: tkamppeter
<tkamppeter> - cups-filters: Continued bug fixing on cups-browsed:
<tkamppeter>    o Many more fixes for problems like failure of CUPS on the server, handling of legacy-broadcasted remote printers, temporary failure of downloading remote PPD, saving PPD options of IPP network printers ...
<tkamppeter> - cups-filters: Released 1.11.3 with all the cups-browsed bug fixes of last week. Uploaded to Yakkety. A 1.11.4 will follow soon.
<tkamppeter> - CUPS: Synced 2.2.0 final from Debian into Yakkety, fixes an important infinite loop bug which could cause cups-browsed to hang on shutdown.
<tkamppeter> - Bugs.
<willcooke> thanks tkamppeter
<willcooke> #topic Trevinho
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-09-20 | Current topic: Trevinho
<Trevinho> Â· Working in new menu items for unity8... Done and in review.
<Trevinho> that's it
<willcooke> thanks Trevinho - well done!
<willcooke> #topic robert_ancell
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-09-20 | Current topic: robert_ancell
<willcooke> - Investigated snap missing metadata - license and title
<willcooke> - simple-scan 3.22 release
<willcooke> - Backport GsAuth support to gnome-software 3.20
<willcooke> - Fix gnome-software blocking on startup due to changelog downloading
<willcooke> - Misc gnome-software bugfixing
<willcooke> #topic AOB
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-09-20 | Current topic: AOB
<willcooke> Anyone got anything?
<willcooke> It's flexiondotorg's first day on Monday
<pitti> hug for everyone!
<Trevinho> cool
<willcooke> Everyone's travel looks booked (with one topic to follow up on)
<willcooke> U8 MIRs are very nearly done
<willcooke> Beta on Thursday
<willcooke> Oh, and one of the recs we had filled is now open again - so tell your friends!
<willcooke> any more for anyone?
<willcooke> 5... 4...
<willcooke> #endmeeting
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently
<meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Sep 20 15:52:17 2016 UTC.
<meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2016/ubuntu-desktop.2016-09-20-15.32.moin.txt
<willcooke> thanks everyone
<Laney> merci
<pitti> tedg: hey Ted, how are you?
<pitti> tedg: is there still something fundamental which holds back the indicator porting silo, or "just" missing merges and other technicallities?
<seb128> back, sorry took a bit longer than I though :-/
<willcooke> seb128, no problem
<willcooke> Right, I'm going afk for an hour or so, bbl
<seb128> willcooke, ttyl
<willcooke> seb128, another one ticked off :)  No many now
<willcooke> *Not
<seb128> :-)
<happyaron> [6~[6~[5~[5~[5~
<ximion> Laney: will you be running asgen in production soon?
 * ximion is kind of eager to see how many of the missing metadata issues get solved by that, and what remains to be fixed
<Laney> ximion: Not sure, it's tight for yakkety and I wanted to run it in staging first for a bit
<Laney> fixing these bugs is important for that of course
 * Laney hopes the sysadmins figure out the problem that makes the IP address not work
<ximion> I am quite happy that some people at Fedora envy Debian/Ubuntu for having much more complete and more useful AppStream data
<ximion> hughsie's tool seems to be highly selective in what it considers to be appropriate
<Laney> doesn't he require appdata?
<ximion> asgen just throws warnings at people :P
<ximion> jup - and screenshots too, apparently. And also anything that isn't relevent for GNOME Software gets ignored
<ximion> he also uses XML as cache and can't find icons which are split out into a -data/-common package
<ximion> which isn't such a big issue in Fedora, apparently
 * Laney knows not much about the ways of fedora packaging
<ximion> at least the way of the Arch packager is "stuff it all into one package"
<Laney> he's probably like "hahaha those debian guys can't find symlinks"
<ximion> Fedora seems to be the middle ground
<ximion> unless you are texlive - then you are insane
<ximion> Laney: symlinks.... who does that?
<ximion> (LibreOffice does, but aside from them?)
<Laney> firefox and thunderbird at least used to
<Laney> so nothing popular :P
<ximion> this is one of the cases that's easier to fix in the packages than in the generator
<ximion> jup - we all use Lyx and Lynx, no LO and FF
<davmor2> cyphermox, infinity: hmmmm our bi-annual issue of hardware not being detected seems to be in play on todays image? not detecting the wifi on the dell xps13
<Laney> ximion: I'll see if it survives overnight and do a PR for https://github.com/iainlane/appstream-generator/commit/2636be346654920c21eb9baf14cb9f0432fb3749 if it does
<ximion> C-style code comment ^^
 * ximion does that too ^^
<Laney> is there a D-style?!?!?!
<ximion> Laney: I remember that for the initial run at Debian I also had to launch asgen twice due to OOM - but I only had 4G
<Laney> it's holding at 5186 now ...
<Laney> see what happens when it gets onto the second arch
<ximion> D is "do whatever you want" :P
<ximion> . /* */ or // or /+ +/, anything goes
<Laney> heh
<ximion> https://dlang.org/spec/ddoc.html
<ximion> https://wiki.dlang.org/Commenting_out_code
<Laney> invalid syntax? must be a comment
<Laney> {- -} --  haskell
<ximion> looks like a sad face :P
<Laney> right, climbing time
<Laney> see if my surf battered body can take it
<willcooke> night all
#ubuntu-desktop 2016-09-21
<hikiko> Hi
<pitti> Good morning
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<pitti> bonjour seb128, Ã§a va ?
<willcooke> morning all
<willcooke> hey seb128, thanks for following up on those emails late last night.  Much appreciated.
<Laney> moin
<willcooke> hey Laney
<willcooke> Wow!  I got a report from HR about the amount of holiday that people have to use up.  It's accurate to 4 decimal places
<willcooke> TheMuso, you have 6.9992 days to use before the EOY :)
<willcooke> Please allocate in chunks of 0.0001
<pitti> so don't you *dare* slacking off those missing 69 seconds!
<willcooke> :DDD
<Laney> that's squirrel watching time
<seb128> hey pitti willcooke Laney
<seb128> willcooke, yw! sounds like it's a known issue with the new qt and Mirv is looking at it, unsure about timing of landing a fix though
<willcooke> seb128, yeah, reading about that now
<seb128> it looks like it's being discussed for a while which doesn't give confidence on a fix landing today
<willcooke> wondering if we are allowed to declare arm64 not supported
<willcooke> at least short term
<willcooke> seb128, did you get an "ok" from Steve about starting the seedings?
<seb128> yeah, recommends are fine if unhandled they shouldn't block the iso build
<willcooke> cool
<seb128> but it also mean the session isn't going to end up on the iso until all the depends are sorted out
<willcooke> We're not far away from having that all sorted I think
<seb128> right
<seb128> we are not far away from 16.10 either though...
<seb128> but yeah things are moving correctly
<Mirv> seb128: willcooke: actually we're now potentially finding out it's not a Qt issue, althouh some more recompilations to make sure. it seems to happen only on yakkety, not xenial(overlay) despite identical Qt versions -> GCC6, glibc 2.24 related potentially
<Mirv> or maybe a Qt issue but not with GCC5
<willcooke> O_o
<willcooke> it's a deep rabbit hole
<willcooke> thanks Mirv
<seb128> Mirv, which means we are not any closer from having it resolved?
<seb128> just moving the blame to the next component
<seb128> if it's a toolchain issue it's going to take a while...
<seb128> do we have a fallback option/workaround for 16.10?
<Mirv> seb128: no, just more information
<TheMuso> willcooke: Urm, is that with all accrued by the end of year, or is that based on current data?
<TheMuso> Hey folks bTW.
<seb128> hey TheMuso
<TheMuso> willcooke: Having said that, it sounds about right.
<willcooke> TheMuso, not really sure.  I think it's accrued until the EOY, but they've already taken off the Christmas close down.  Anyway, doesn't matter - was just a good example of the ridiculousness
<TheMuso> Oh sure.
<seb128> willcooke, speaking of vac, I'm in discussion with Hannah about french counts, they added some extra 10 days it seems unsure why
<willcooke> seb128, :) It did look kinda "WTF"!
<seb128> willcooke, by law we have ~10 days/year to get back because legal work time is 35h/week and we do 40h/week so we get some compensation days, but companies have the choice to give them as vac days or to pay them and until now Canonical always took the option to pay those
<seb128> so waiting for a reply on that
<willcooke> erk, yes, getting paid sounds better
<willcooke> let me know if I can help
<seb128> should be fine, Hannah is on it
<seb128> but thanks
<willcooke> np
<Laney> france is the best
<davmor2> seb128: just move to a decent Country that doesn't complicate things and you just get paid already ;)
<didrocks> well, in the past, we just got them paid
<didrocks> just afraid that this year, they changed without noticing the count
<chrisccoulson> seb128, surely you do about 70h/week? ;)
<didrocks> and meaning that if we don't take them, they aren't paid, the count will just go to 0
<didrocks> seb128: if you don't get an answer before your holidays, maybe willcooke should take it back on his pile of things to enjoy with HR? :)
<Laney> hi didrocks!
<didrocks> hey hey Laney ;)
<Laney> how's it going?
<Laney> saw a sexy picture of you giving a talk
<Laney> ...although it looked like it was in the office
<didrocks> it was in the office :)
<TheMuso> willcooke: Since I have you here, do you have bug numbers for those tasks you added to trello on my 16.10 board for your dock issue and that other bluetooth bug? I tried to search for an appropriate bug for the latter today but without any luck so far.
<didrocks> unsure where the picture was, didn't see it :p
<Laney> i forgot
<didrocks> but yeah, was in London last week
<pitti> bonjour didrocks, comment vas-tu ?
<Laney> sprint?
<willcooke> TheMuso, I haven't, sorry, but I will do
<didrocks> pitti: bien, et toi ?
<davmor2> didrocks: London last week
<TheMuso> willcooke: Ok thanks.
<pitti> didrocks: je vais bien aussi, merci !
<didrocks> Laney: no, ThingMonk (conference), then 2 days off :)
<didrocks> and some people in my team decided that I should do a meetup in the evening
<Laney> haha
<willcooke> TheMuso, what should I log them against for now?  Pulse?
<seb128> didrocks, I should have a reply this week but it's fine either way for me, it's only 10 days, worth case I take december off
<Laney> that sounds TERRIBLE!
<Laney> (jealous)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, hey, you are saying I should get way more days? ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: well, it's a big changeâ¦ I have 20 days now and it's quite some cut in the pay (without notice)
<didrocks> so they could at least have warned
<seb128> right
<TheMuso> willcooke: Pulse for bluetooth, alsa-driver for the dock one, because info from alsa-info is needed.
<TheMuso> willcooke: Well it maybe needed, given that it could very well be a kernel bug.
<willcooke> Just tried reproducing the BT one, and of course I cant
<willcooke> I'll focus on the dock one
<willcooke> thanks TheMuso
<TheMuso> Ok cool.
<TheMuso> np
<Laney> bah bah de bah
<Laney> can't valgrind the asgen
<seb128> why not?
<Laney> it's mmapping too much
<seb128> :-/
<Laney> http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/component-mismatches.svg
<Laney> looks fun now
<seb128> yeah, was about to mention it
<Laney> imagine the noises doko is making :D
<seb128> lol
<seb128> well it's mostly looking good
<seb128> there is little non yellow which isn't a R
<seb128> willcooke, ^ that looks good, I send another email but it looks like the ones that need fixing are
<seb128> * ubuntu-keyboard still depending on fonts-android
<seb128> * u-s-s depending on dbus-property-service (I think that was not on our list, we noted down that it should be made optional but then didn't work on i)
<seb128> * address-book-service depending on the buteo stack
<seb128> then the ones waiting on security team
<willcooke> ubuntu-keyboard - elleo was supposed to look at that.  Will chase.
<seb128> hum, seems like he landed a change in http://launchpadlibrarian.net/280894470/ubuntu-keyboard_0.100+16.10.20160808.1-0ubuntu1_0.100+16.10.20160818-0ubuntu1.diff.gz
<seb128> -Depends: fonts-droid-fallback | fonts-droid,
<seb128> +Depends: fonts-droid-fallback | fonts-droid | fonts-noto,
<seb128> but -noto is in universe as well...
<willcooke> if they can move to fonts-noto-cjk we win :)
<willcooke> (as in, no MIR needed)
<seb128> indeed!
<jbicha> hmm, I misunderstood the release schedule too
<desrt> survey day!
<desrt> good morning everyone
<Laney> hi!
<jbicha> seb128: Laney: what do you think of bug 1625897 ?
<ubot5`> bug 1625897 in webkit2gtk (Ubuntu) "Update webkitgtk to 2.14.0 in yakkety" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1625897
<desrt> "My organisation genuinely cares about the environment"
<desrt> some of these questions...
<Laney> laney@nightingale> env | wc -l                                                                                                                                                                      ~
<Laney> 89
<Laney> STRONGLY DISAGREE
<desrt> pollution
<desrt> desrt@humber:~$ env | wc -l
<desrt> 30
<desrt> try debian
<desrt> ......and a ream of "unset .." lines in your bash_profile
<Laney> probably most of these were set by me ...
<Laney> jbicha: I think it's a fine idea to do after beta 2
<seb128> jbicha, I'm not in the release team, I think we have quite some bugs/issues in yakkety and we should have focussed on fixing those rather than doing version updates recently but that's only my view
<seb128> jbicha, also all those packages migrating from cdbs to dh seems late for such changes...
<jbicha> ok
<andyrock> good afternoon
<desrt> andyrock: hihi
<seb128> hey andyrock, how are you?
<seb128> oh and hey desrt ;-)
<desrt> good morning seb
<jbicha> cdbs was kinda unstable recently which motivated the pkg-gnome team to finally switch to dh
<andyrock> my toe is getting better
<andyrock> :D
<desrt> i thought it was a finger?
 * desrt feels like she just learnt something about latin
<andyrock> and I thought that you could refer to a toe as a finger
<andyrock> :P
<desrt> er.  italian.
<andyrock> at least in Italian you can do it
<andyrock> :D
<desrt> it's same(ish) in esperanto
<desrt> a toe is a foot-finger
<seb128> jbicha, weird, didn't notice any issue with cdbs and it didn't change much ... anyway rewritting the packaging has potential for bugs and has 0 benefit to users, such changes should get done early in the cycle or at least before ff, not now
<jbicha> seb128: do you have a list of good candidate bugs for yakkety?
<seb128> jbicha, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.tag=rls-y-incoming
<willcooke> jhodapp, hey!  Do you know if mediaplayer-app "just works" on classic Ubuntu deskop under u8?
<jhodapp> willcooke, it does
<willcooke> jhodapp, sweet!
<jhodapp> willcooke, and also as a snap now too :)
<seb128> thanks for filing that MIR jhodapp!
 * seb128 hides
<willcooke> jhodapp, would you mind filing an MIR for it
<seb128> lol
<willcooke> :))
 * willcooke hugs jhodapp 
<jhodapp> lol
<jhodapp> seb128, for what change?
<willcooke> jhodapp, I'll send you an email with the details
<davmor2> willcooke, seb128: lightdm is still triggering a whole load of upstart jobs is that still expected?
<seb128> jhodapp, I was mostly joking, see what willcooke said, we are about to get the unity8 session as optional on the desktop iso and we would like to include the mediaplayer so we need it promoted to main
<seb128> davmor2, pitti knows better but yes
<seb128> I don't think we ever ported it to systemd
<seb128> that was blocked on indicators to land or something
<seb128> it's late now I guess
<jhodapp> seb128, ah, lol...I was so confused...
<davmor2> seb128: thanks
<pitti> seb128, davmor2: yes, I'm waiting for the indicator silo to land, then I can port the lightdm greeter
<jhodapp> willcooke, thanks, I'd be happy to fill that out
<seb128> jhodapp, sorry :-)
<davmor2> pitti: thanks
<seb128> pitti, that still didn't land?
<seb128> crazyness
<jhodapp> seb128, no worries :)
 * seb128 thinks we are about to beat edgy
<pitti> seb128: no -- I asked tedg a couple of times about the status, but no response yet; I don't know what's blocking it
<seb128> ted is busy on doing a snap from the unity8 session
<seb128> which is the new thing of the day
<seb128> I think
<willcooke> jhodapp, you got mail
<jhodapp> willcooke, hehe, thanks
<willcooke> jhodapp, could you send me a link when you've done it
<jhodapp> willcooke, sure
<willcooke> jhodapp, bear in mind it's not a final decision if we will push for it yet - depends on other work getting done, but would like to get things lined up ready
<jhodapp> willcooke, makes sense
<renatu> hi willcooke, I am talking with mterry about the same problem.
<renatu> I just want to understand is the "recommend" a problem for buteo packages?
<willcooke> hey renatu
<willcooke> seb128, could you speak to renatu, I'm in ameeting and would like this sorting quickly
<seb128> willcooke, sure
<willcooke> thank you
<renatu> seb128, hi
<seb128> renatu, hey
<seb128> wooot, Laney tackling yakkety bugs ;-)
<seb128> Trevinho, andyrock, is there any reason https://code.launchpad.net/~azzar1/unity/properly-handle-copy-dialog/+merge/299301 isn't getting reviewed?
<seb128> tedg, hey, did you see the ping about indicators/systemd landing?
<tedg> Yeah, I was looking at the silo now. There's a bunch of build errors that need to be chased down.
<tedg> Though, I should be able to do that some today.
<tedg> Planning to spending a fun day with bileto
<seb128> tedg, do you need help on those build issues?
<andyrock> seb128: nope
<tedg> seb128: I don't think so, I think it's JFDI type things.
<andyrock> it should still work
<seb128> tedg, k
<seb128> andyrock, so just need to wake up Trevinho? ;-)
 * seb128 sends some pizza to Trevinho
<andyrock> i'll schedule some time tomorrow to reviews  a couple of Trevinho's MP
<seb128> andyrock, thanks
<willcooke> Laney, looking at:  https://code.launchpad.net/~willcooke/ubuntu-themes/hidpiicons/+merge/305219
<willcooke> I've fixed gtk-widgets-assets-radiance.css in both places
<willcooke> But I don't get what's wrong with ln 2218 & 2231 in Ambiance/gtk-3.20/gtk-widgets.css
<seb128> oh, that didn't land?
<willcooke> not yet, need to fix some bugs
<seb128> it's getting late, maybe going to be for next time
<seb128> time->cycle
<willcooke> fine by me, but it's very very nearly ready
<willcooke> if that counts for anything
<willcooke> probably not
<seb128> Laney, bug #1571729 on what arch did you try? it seems 32 bits specific
<ubot5`> bug 1571729 in gnome-software (Ubuntu) "/usr/bin/gnome-software:11:look_at_pkg:load_apt_db:gs_plugin_refine:gs_plugin_loader_run_refine:gs_plugin_loader_run_results" [High,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1571729
<willcooke> I also don't get what needs doing for "I also found a find and replace error that I made on a previous commit - could you look for "assets/scale.vertical-vertical-fill.png" and "assets/scale.vertical-vertical-fill-disabled.png" and fix those too please?"
<Laney> seb128: definitely not 32 bit
<Laney> willcooke: look for button-toolbar.png
<Laney> willcooke: Look for those strings and fix the filenames
<seb128> Laney, k, dunno if it's 32 bits but reports are only from armhf and i386 and it does it every time on i386
<seb128> I should get a valgrind
<seb128> let me does that once my daily is downloaded, which is another 10 minutes
<willcooke> ah, line 2228
<Laney> maybe they moved if I merged it into trunk
<jhodapp> willcooke, https://bugs.launchpad.net/mediaplayer-app/+bug/1626164
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1626164 in mediaplayer-app "[MIR] mediaplayer-app" [Undecided,New]
<willcooke> thanks jhodapp
<jhodapp> willcooke, np...one change was needed so far that I completed and documented in that MIR
<seb128> willcooke, I would not ask them to hold on it, it just doesn't need to prioritized but if they have some extra review cycles...
<willcooke> undo
<willcooke> undo
<seb128> lol
<willcooke> guess I can't delete that can I?
<seb128> no
<Laney> you can sometimes hide comments ;-)
<Laney> ximion: I got a new machine with 32G of RAM ;-)
<ximion> Laney: ...and that is another way to solve this problem :D
<ximion> one I kind of like ^^
<Laney> did you ever try valgrinding the asgen?
<ximion> now you could probably even extract the localization into memory :P
<Laney> it dies for me
<willcooke> Laney,  https://code.launchpad.net/~willcooke/ubuntu-themes/hidpiicons/+merge/306356
<ximion> yes, I did - but the GC makes valgrinding harder
<Laney> lmdb cries
<Laney> as far as I could see it tries to mmap with a huge size and valgrind needs to put that in ram, but can't
<Laney> willcooke: merci
<Laney> willcooke: you could have just pushed (with or without --overwrite), no need to make a new proposal
<Laney> saves a bit of clicking anyway
<Laney> although you need to comment in order to generate mail for the reviewer
<Laney> urgh this locale synchronisation sucks
<Laney> come on Jussi, fix your build system!
<willcooke> Laney, ah, oki.  I just clicked the "resubmit proposal" button after I pushed the new stuff
<Laney> you need that to change settings (e.g. add a prerequisite branch), but not to just add more commits
<Laney> TYL :P
<willcooke> :))
<seb128> have a nice evening desktopers!
<willcooke> cya seb128
<willcooke> going EOD - night all
<ximion> Laney: I valgrinded that ages ago, but I think I simply went with a very small archive there and reduced the amount of stuff that gets mmapped
#ubuntu-desktop 2016-09-22
<pitti> Good morning
<hikiko> hi
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<TheMuso> Hey seb128.
<seb128> hey TheMuso
<flexiondotorg> Morning
<willcooke> morning all
<Laney> yo ho ho
<didrocks> good morning guys
<seb128> hey Laney flexiondotorg willcooke
<flexiondotorg> o/
<seb128> one again bitten by IRC not handling switching from wifi to cable, grrr
<seb128> took me a few minutes to think about it
<seb128> and of course got the timeout even after going back to wifi
<Laney> doh
<pitti> bonjuor didrocks et seb128, comment allez-vous ?
<pitti> morning Laney!
<seb128> salut pitti, Ã§a va bien ?
<didrocks> bonjour pitti, Ã§a va, et toi ?
<pitti> je vais bien, merci !
<Laney> guten morgen pitti!
<TheMuso> Later folks.
<willcooke> night TheMuso
 * willcooke rebooting in to Y - brb
<davmor2> willcooke: hey dude I'm hitting and interesting issue on Y if you enable  vpn to auto connect on wired and wireless connections it clashes horribly and you lose routing when you plugin in the wire I assume the wireless connect controlled by nm connects to it first
<willcooke> davmor2, speak to cyphermox and happyaron I think
<davmor2> willcooke: on Y do you see your indicator sound?
<willcooke> davmor2, in U8 or U7?
<davmor2> willcooke: u7
<willcooke> booting...
<willcooke> davmor2, on live session - yes
<davmor2> willcooke: this is full work desktop with rhythmbox and spotify in the indicator let me check it on the installed system and see if either of those apps take it out
<davmor2> hmmm http://paste.ubuntu.com/23214973/ that might be a problem
<davmor2> seb128, Laney: just got that from the .cache/indicator-sound.log any ideas?
<Laney> I don't think it matters
<Laney> have that here too
<willcooke> davmor2, is this is u8 installed as well?
<Laney> it's used for the unity 8 greeter I think
<davmor2> willcooke: nope
<davmor2> willcooke: this is my work machine so just unity7
<Laney> did the indicator die or was it never there?
<davmor2> Laney: let me check ps aux but from what I see I started the session this morning and it wasn't there
<davmor2> Laney: davmor2   3296  0.0  0.1 670716 11732 ?        Ssl  09:02   0:00 /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/indicator-sound/indicator-sound-service
<davmor2> hmmmm
<Laney> weird
<Laney> try killingi t
<seb128> davmor2, check the settings if the checkbox at the bottom is enabled
<seb128> the one about displaying the indicator
<davmor2> seb128: ha nice catch yeap it was unchecked but how the hell did that happen?
<seb128> you clicked it?
<seb128> or used something that changed it for you
<Laney> oh dear
<davmor2> seb128: not that I know too
<davmor2> seb128: I can't think what I might of used different to normal that might of changed it
<davmor2> seb128: I did a big batch of upgrades yesterday 135-ish if I recall then this morning it was missing but I didn't use the sound settings yesterday
<seb128> dunno, something changed the config
<seb128> did you open the sound panel? maybe it was focussed and you hit space or enter
<seb128> or did you try unity8? they maybe change the config?
<seb128> in any case dunno
<davmor2> seb128: ah that is a possibility
<seb128> it's a gsettings key so I doubt it changed by itself
<davmor2> might of hit space when it was focused
<seb128> either some action did it for you or some program
<seb128> but you are not the first one to hit that issue
<seb128> I wonder if that setting is more confusing that useful
<davmor2> seb128: thanks anyway mystery solved
<seb128> yw!
<willcooke> seb128, I spoke to TheMuso this morning about terminal app.  He said that we probably need an FFe to get Terminal in to Universe before the MIR can be processed - do we need to do that or is the MIR ok as is?  (cc popey)
<seb128> willcooke, need a FFe to get a new component in the archive now
<willcooke> Does that need a new bug, or can we reuse the MIR one?
<seb128> reusing the MIR should be alright be better to check with somebody from release team how much they dislike that, e.g Laney
<Laney> dunno what you're talking about
<seb128> Laney, reusing a MIR bug for a FFe
<seb128> cool or uncool
<Laney> might be messy
<Laney> plus they want different information
<seb128> like is recycling acceptable or preferred to open a new one
<Laney> not sure why you would want to
<seb128> well, once the MIR is acked
<seb128> Lazyness
<seb128> willcooke, sounds like better to open a new one
<Laney> but you have to write new stuff for the ffe anyway
<Laney> so it's this box or that box
<willcooke> oki, thanks seb128 Laney
<willcooke> popey, ^ can you do the honors?
<popey> ok
<Laney> merci!
<seb128> willcooke, you are going to ask next so replying to that now, if/when the ffe/mir are +1 you just need somebody to get unity8-desktop-session to recommends it so it gets installed
<willcooke> thanks seb128
<seb128> yw!
<Laney> merci!
<Laney> popey: Lemme know the number when you have it - happy to be easy with new stuff for this session at this point
<Laney> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-37437907
<Laney> it's over~~~~
<popey> will do, just reading docs to make sure I do it right
<willcooke> Laney, good on her!  And Mel & Sue
<davmor2> willcooke: here here
<Laney> \o/
<popey> Laney: filed bug 1626457, as per the wiki
<ubot5`> bug 1626457 in Ubuntu "[FFE] Ubuntu Terminal App request" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1626457
 * popey ninjas in a link to the source which he missed :)
<popey> Has Paul said whether he's staying on? Feels like he has more to lose.
<Laney> popey: I would also say that it is going to be added as a recommends to unity8-desktop-session, so installed for the new session only
<Laney> do these applications have Only/NotShowIn in their desktop files btw?
<popey> will do
<popey> Laney: no
<popey> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-terminal-dev/ubuntu-terminal-app/reboot/view/head:/com.ubuntu.terminal.desktop.in.in
<Laney> do you get two things called Terminal then?
<popey> In which session, unity 7 or unity 8?
<Laney> 7
<Laney> 8 uses that X-Ubuntu-Touch=true thing to whitelist apps doesn't it?
<popey> i do on my xenial laptop, yes
<Laney> so you don't get gnome-terminal there
<popey> cunning, not used that
<Laney> could be talking BS
<Laney> but... is it desired to have the new applications appearing in the unity 7 dash?
<popey> that's a question for willcooke (or other unity8 peeps I think)
<willcooke> At this point it would be nice, but not essential
<willcooke> If there is a neat packaging trick, like "only show in" that would be nice
<Laney> well, is it acceptable to have two things called Terminal in the unity 7 session?
<willcooke> at this point in time, yes
<willcooke> but of course, if it doesn't have to, and its easy to stop it, then that would be better
<Laney> mmm
<Laney> I think this is the only one with a collision
<popey> ooh, Paul signed with Channel 4 https://twitter.com/BBCNewsEnts/status/778896673217052672
<pitti> happyaron: NM 1.2.4 is in the packaging master, is that ready for upload? I need to adjust the tests to the changed isc-dhcp
<pitti> happyaron: I can also upload just that and rebase master, but in general it would be nice to put longer developments into branches; stuff in master should always be uploadable
<popey> willcooke: Laney https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-app-launch/+bug/1608546
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1608546 in ubuntu-app-launch (Ubuntu) "NotShowIn and OnlyShowIn in .desktop files are ignored" [High,In progress]
<willcooke> so until that lands we can either have it in U7 & U8 or nowhere
<willcooke> is that right?
<popey> I tested adding OnlyShowIn=Unity8 and it doesn't appear in either, right willcooke ?
<willcooke> ya
<willcooke> so I guess that answers our question about where it should appear :)
<Laney> popey: huh, I didn't expect ual to be involved in displaying the grid
<happyaron> pitti: yes ready
<popey> me either
<Laney> anyway
<pitti> happyaron: hmmm, you don't use UNRELEASED? or you do and forgot to push the tag?
<Laney> NotShowIn=Unity will be better than nowt
<willcooke> godo call
<willcooke> good
<pitti> happyaron: as d/changelog says (1.2.4-0ubuntu1) yakkety but I don't see it uploaded
<Laney> not nice for people on other desktops
<Laney> or get tedg's branch to go in
<seb128> Laney, popey, willcooke, the issue is that unity7 and unity8 are called "Unity" for their xdg session so we can't filter them using OnlyShowIn etc
<seb128> pitti, n-m was up for sponsoring, I guess he's just not using unreleased but it's as well because usually I do the sponsoring for him and I've no clue about the git workflow, does debcommit -r works there?
<Laney> Sounds like it should get "Unity8" in the list then
<popey> ah
<seb128> Unity8?
<seb128> like add a new session type?
<seb128> that would mean updating most of the existing .desktop which have OnlyShowIn=Unity to have Unity;Unity8 no?
<Laney> XDG_CURRENT_DESKTOP can be a list
<Laney> So something like Unity:Unity8
<seb128> right
<seb128> it's a bit tricky but I guess that would better than what we have now
<pitti> seb128: that's unrelated to git -- that's dch vs. dch -r; but yes, debcommit -ar works there
<seb128> the side effect is that if you install one of those by choice on unity7 it wouldn't get listed by the dash
<seb128> pitti, well in bzr that does the tagging no?
<pitti> seb128: yes, same with git
<Laney> of course, but that's better than everyone having confusing duplicates
<seb128> unsure if there similar concept of tagging uploads in git gbp
<pitti> seb128: so, let me fix the two test regressions before upload
<seb128> Laney, seems we are in agreement I meant that by "that would better than what we have now"
<pitti> one is for the changed isc-dhcp behaviour in -proposed, the other for kernel 4.8 (the fake module fails to build)
<Laney> good
<seb128> Laney, can you try to chase people to get that changed next week? everybody is still busy trying to land the session this week and t_ed also has indicators/systemd to solve so I guess better to not have too many conversations at the same time
<seb128> could be good to open a bug to start
<Laney> hang on, some guy has turned up to fix the boiler
<Laney> brb
<Laney> ok, he's beavering away
<Laney> seb128: do you know where it is set?
<seb128> Laney, I think it's lightdm but let me check
<seb128> right, it is
<Laney> I don't actually see XDG_CURRENT_DESKTOP set in unity8's environment
<Laney> you need to set DesktopNames in the .session file
<seb128> lightdm set it using the DesktopName from /usr/share/gnome-session/sessions/<name>.session I think?
<Laney> that wasn't set for unity8
<seb128> k
<Laney> so where's the fallback coming from?
<seb128> what fallback?
<Laney> using Unity as you said
<seb128> I though we had XDG_CURRENT_DESKTOP=Unity in unity8
<seb128> seems like I was wrong if you say it's unset
<Laney> indeed
<Laney> so if that behaviour exists it has to come from soemwhere else
<Laney> or maybe it just doesn't
<Laney> in which case we are lucky
<seb128> unsure how the unity8 dash decide what to show
<seb128> question for Saviq I guess
<seb128> or maybe dobey
<seb128> unity-scope-click-0.1.1+16.04.20160330/libclickscope/click/interface.cpp:static const std::string ONLYSHOWIN_UNITY("Unity");
<seb128> Laney, ^ could be that
<Saviq> yeah, click scope's responsible for that
<Saviq> and ubuntu-app-launch may need this, too
<Laney> meh, this is buggy
<Laney> it should look at XDG_CURRENT_DESKTOP
<Laney> Saviq: is the scope-click responsible for .deb applications too?
<Laney> ual does it right
<Laney> (ish)
<Saviq> Laney, yeah, anything that shows up in u8's Apps list goes through unity-scope-click
<Laney> ok
<Laney> well I think we can make it Unity;Unity8
<Laney> s/;/:/
<Laney> and then fix scope-click to consider it properly, and get that UAL merge proposal landed
<Laney> then things can have OnlyShowIn=Unity8
<Laney> seb128: is there a trello or other tracking place?
<seb128> Laney, https://trello.com/b/mab4G8UQ/unity-8-in-16-10
<seb128> that was mostly for the MIRs though
<seb128> but that's because it was most of the work, I guess it's fine to add another card
<Laney> like "Fixes outstanding" or something?
<seb128> yes
<seb128> we should probably add a column
<seb128> there are some recommends to drop and such as well
<seb128> willcooke, ^ wdyt?
<Laney> card or list?
<Laney> list probably
<seb128> list?
<seb128> I would add a column/stack whatever that's called
<Laney> that's called a list :P
<seb128> k
<seb128> so yeah, list
<seb128> then a card for the session thing
<seb128> and we can add some others for other issues we might hit once the session gets more testing
<seb128> or the recommends that need to be demoted to suggests still
<Laney> there
<seb128> thanks
<Laney> jbicha: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=771553 and https://bugs.webkit.org/show_bug.cgi?id=162317 fyi
<ubot5`> Gnome bug 771553 in Backend: Wayland "Shrinking window generates a black patch when gl is used" [Normal,New]
<ubot5`> bugs.webkit.org bug 162317 in WebKit Gtk "Regression 2.14.0: WebKitGtk+ based apps (like yelp, evolution) bahave strange on resizing" [Normal,Resolved: invalid]
<Laney> mentioned on #debian-gnome earlier
<jbicha> Laney: thanks, maybe that's just gtk 3.22? since I don't see a problem with resizing with wayland here
<Laney> dunno
<ximion> Laney: any asgen OOM issues on the 32G machine? ;-)
<Laney> it did actually :/
<Laney> ximion: we should do lazy extraction of translations
<Laney> this is relatively slow
<ximion> Laney: what!?
<ximion> okay, so something big must be leaking then
<Laney> haha
<ximion> if I would looks for something, the first place to look would be zarchive.d
<Laney> it just grows
<ximion> because that's the only place which handles a lot of unsafe code and also a lot of data
<Laney> so by the time of the last arch it's pushing 32 G
<ximion> Laney: I don't see this in Debian
<Laney> do a full run
<Laney> it's okay on incremental ones
<ximion> but I also don't process the whole archive anymore, it's just doing incremental updates
<ximion> exactly
<ximion> ok, so temporary solution is to just run the incremental updates
<ximion> in the long run, we need to find the leak
<Laney> ya
<ximion> when I am home, I will take a look at the zarchive.d code
<ximion> the weird thing is that almost all memory is GC-allocated, so we really shouldn't leak
<ximion> Laney: I will make an asgen release with the Ubuntu changes as soon as I implemented fonts support
<Laney> fonts, that'll be fun
<ximion> also, I might do the arch:all special-casing I talked about in the last bug report
<ximion> it might be relatively easy
<ximion> not fonts though ^^ - fonts support is 80% complete in asgen, but the last bit will be the hardest
<ximion> I will also need to depend on Pango, otherwise i18n doesn't work at all for fonts (I thought about getting around it, but then I would need to implement too much of functionality that Pango already has)
<dobey> Laney, seb128, Saviq: huh?
<ximion> Laney: fonts will require a metainfo file, so if we want them we should poke the font package maintainers to add those files
<ximion> because font upstreams usually don't do that ^^
<Laney> ximion: hmm, did hughsie already do that @ fedora?
<ximion> Laney: for some bits, yes - but we can do better ;-)
<ximion> hughsie pushed files into Fedora when he was just experimenting with fonts - since we can build on hughsie's experiences, we can do the metainfo files right the first time
<ximion> because once theyy're there, it's hard to motivate people to update them
<tedg> popey: willcooke: Laney: We can't support only show in until they fix trusted prompt overlays for the media player :-(
<tedg> They're using it to "hide" and application, so if we implement it correctly it'll break the media player.
<tedg> I'm really not a fan of it, but that's the reason that got pulled out.
<Laney> ximion: http://appstream.staging.ubuntu.com/
<Laney> tedg: ...
<ximion> Laney: it's beautiful!
<ximion> Laney: your AppStream copy isn't up-to-date :P
<ximion> (at 0.10.0 instead of 0.10.1)
<Laney> need to backport it
<Laney> some good bug fixes in there
<Laney> from Quality Contributors
<ximion> aka you ^^
<ximion> you can tell the AppStream release by the issues it emits ^^
<Laney> ximion: https://paste.debian.net/835005/
<vigo> Laney, I think I'm hitting a bug related to graphics in yy after fresh installation, do you know which logs should I take a look at?
<Laney> vigo: xorg logs / dmesg maybe
 * Laney is not very clued up on that, try #ubuntu-x for more experts
<vigo> basically, waking up after suspend leads to a black screen and "the system is running in low graphic mode" window appears
<vigo> with some errors
<vigo> Laney, thank you :)
<pitti> seb128: finally fixed the NM tests and pushed, so /me unlock
<seb128> pitti, thanks!
<pitti> argh, this is such a "everything breaks at once" day
 * pitti goes back to cloud fixing and kernel regression untangling, etc.
<pitti> seb128: I'll just force-badtest the current version for now, but would be great to have the fix in -proposed soon so that we don't risk further regressions and not noticing them
<pitti> seb128: (not sure what the status of 1.2.4 is, didn't just wnat to upload blindly)
<pitti> I can also just upload the two fixes and rebase git if that needs more time to mature
<seb128> 1.2.4 should be good/ready for yakkety
<seb128> happya_ron has been waiting for sponsoring for some days
<seb128> I just got too busy with other things this week to look at it
<pitti> seb128: right, just microversion, so hopefully "mostly harmless" </hitchhiker>
<vigo> https://pastebin.canonical.com/166279/
<vigo> Laney, line 938
<Laney> vigo: points you to a further file
<Laney> maybe its contents help you find a bug report
<vigo> Laney, yeap I'm pulling it to take a look :)
 * Laney lunches - suggest you take it to #ubuntu-x and/or the bugtracker mentioned
<seb128> jbicha, dunno if saw that but totem ftbfs in the test rebuild, seems something wrong with the nautilus extension, could be have to do with the nautilus multiarch changes (why did that land so late without a ffe?)
<seb128> hum, yakkety daily env doesn't have any configure keyboard layout in the indicator/settings, unsure what component to blame there :-/
<seb128> xorg?
<jbicha> seb128: nautilus was half-multiarchified so I finished the job, didn't think about a ffe for it...
<seb128> unsure if we should revert that or look at the extensions and fix those
<jbicha> I plan to check the nautilus extensions
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> k, time for dinner and somesport
<seb128> have a nice evening desktopers
<willcooke> cya seb128
<Laney> me too
<Laney> byeeeeeEEeeeeEEEeee
<willcooke> night Laney
<willcooke> calling it a day here too
<willcooke> night all
#ubuntu-desktop 2016-09-23
<robert_ancell> ximion, what's the ubuntu package / project that generates the dep11 data? Trying to assign bug 1626494 to the correct place
<ubot5`> bug 1626494 in gnome-software (Ubuntu) "Some app screenshots wrongly stretched in Ubuntu version of Gnome Software" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1626494
<ximion> robert_ancell: previously appstream-dep11, but soon it will be appstream-generator
<ximion> assign to appstream-generator, if the bug is fixed in asgen already, we can close it as soon as it is deployed at Ubuntu
<robert_ancell> ximion, ok
<ximion> robert_ancell: jap, that bug is indeed fixed
<ximion> or rather, has never been present in asgen :P
<ximion> so we just need Laney to flip the switch and make the new data available - I hope this will happen for Yakkety, still
<robert_ancell> ximion, will this happen in Xenial?
<robert_ancell> I've assigned to both, so we know which one has the issue
<ximion> robert_ancell: unfortunately we can't update the frozen metadata in Xenial properly :(
<robert_ancell> ximion, why not?
<ximion> since the image sizes are encoded in the AppStream metadata which is frozen, updating the image alone won't help
<ximion> robert_ancell: would require uploading new data into the Xenial suite and re-signing the InRelease file
<robert_ancell> ximion, why is the metadata frozen? Doesn't it need to be updated if you SRU something?
<ximion> robert_ancell: jup, then it will be updated for that particular SRU
<ximion> so we would need to make a dummy upload of that package to fix the issue
<ximion> which is pretty dumb
<robert_ancell> surely we can trigger an update of the whole file
<ximion> robert_ancell: doesn't help if the archive won't sign the file...
<ximion> would be awesome to get an exception for that
<ximion> all alternative solutions are basically hacks
<robert_ancell> I'll ask around
<ximion> one could make an override file for the -updates suites, but that would then mix data from the base suite with new data in a very unclean way
<ximion> one could also package the updated files in a .deb package as an update
<ximion> that would probably be not very invasive
<ximion> also a hack, but maybe the best one after updating the file directly
<pitti> Good morning
<willcooke> o/
<duflu> 'lo willcooke
<willcooke> evening duflu, how goes?
<duflu> willcooke: Afternoon. Goes OK. You?
<willcooke> oh, it's still afternoon for you?
<willcooke> Australia is a big place :)
<duflu> willcooke: Yes, sorry. This side is basically asia
<willcooke> :))
<Laney> hello
<willcooke> how do Laney
<Laney> hey willcooke
<Laney> <british>bit of a chill today</british>
<willcooke> Verily
<Laney> I thought about busting out the ol tog rated socks
<willcooke> String vest here
<davmor2> what, what? Whining about the weather, what a terribly British thing to do
<seb128> hey willcooke Laney duflu
<duflu> Morning seb128
<davmor2> tally-ho pip pip and all that
<Laney> OH and I got a new fiver last night for the first time
<Laney> which is exciting
<Laney> tried to destroy it of course
<Laney> hi davmor2 and seb128 and duflu :-)
<Laney> happy friday
 * duflu is reminded he hasn't seen a new AU fiver yet
<davmor2> Laney: use fire
<seb128> Laney, the plastic ones?
<seb128> happy friday indeed!
<davmor2> Laney: Morning and Happy Friday to you too
<Laney> seb128: https://www.thenewfiver.co.uk/
<Laney> what a website
<seb128> that's money well spent
<seb128> why would you need to advertize your currency?!
<seb128> it's not like people were ponding not using money
<Laney> well it did make me shed some patriotic tears
<seb128> haha
<Laney> I should check if any of them are in the first batch
<Laney> you can sell those ones for Â£200
<seb128> over 5k notes have been chewed or eaten in 2015, people are weird
<seb128> website is nice but I don't like much how the image don't slide with the content but get replaced
<seb128> can't pinpoint it but it feels weird
<willcooke> I like the side-on view especially
<pitti> hey seb128, Laney, and willcooke!
<willcooke> hey pitti
<seb128> hey pitti, happy friday!
<Laney> pitti in getting up late shocker
<willcooke> pitti, did cyphermox speak to you about https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubiquity/+bug/1626108
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1626108 in Ubuntu CD Images "Ubiquity session isn't setting up 3rd party hardware drivers" [Undecided,Fix released]
<pitti> seb128: bon vendredi !
<pitti> Laney: well, I said good morning at 6:45 :)
<pitti> I just didn't pay attention to IRC the last hour
<Laney> /at 06:45 /say hello
<Laney> :P
<Laney> how are you?
<pitti> slightly more relaxed now; yesterday was madness
<pitti> lots of fun with linux 4.8, scalingstack network/image failure etc.
<seb128> you meant you went to bed at 6:45?
<seb128> that was a short night
<seb128> ;-)
<pitti> I had a beer and a grappa yesterday evening at our favourite Italian, I needed that :)
<seb128> haha
<seb128> do you have any plan for the w.e already?
<pitti> seb128: yes, indeed -- I'm in a train to Berlin now
<pitti> 85th birthday of Annett's grandma tomorrow (near Berlin), then go to larsu and go to systemd.conf next week
<seb128> ah, you second office ;-)
<seb128> nice
<seb128> give a hug to Lars for me!
<pitti> le bureau roulant !
 * larsu waves
<Laney> ah, larsuland!
<Laney> it is a good land
 * larsu agrees
<Laney> go for some peanut sauce
<seb128> hey larsu ;-)
<larsu> hi seb128! Ã§a ca?
<larsu> *va
<larsu> 'sup Laney?
<seb128> Laney, if you like peanut sauce you should get kip sate in octobre in denhaag
<seb128> larsu, oui, et toi ?
<pitti> Laney: will remember, although not a peanut fan
<seb128> larsu, holidays tonight for me :-)
<larsu> seb128: nickel! Looking forward to having pitti around next week
<pitti> *beam*
<seb128> he's a good guest, I can recommend him ;-)
<pitti> seb128 made me run, wash the dishes, work from 4 am to 12 pm, and drink coffee!
 * pitti hugs seb128, it was great to visit you!
<Laney> pitti: ok, leave that out and just have the falafel then :P
<Laney> seb128: looking forward to you taking us to all the best places
<Laney> oooooooh you should choose the team dinner venue
<seb128> lol
 * seb128 hugs pitti back
<seb128> Laney, I can do that :-)
<Laney> larsu: not much, ribs still hurt a bit from surfing :-o
<Laney> got some couchsurfers coming tonight
<larsu> Laney: not sure if that's bad because your ribs hurt or good because you went surfing ;)
<larsu> oh, pitti does dishes? Awesome!
<Laney> respect the waves <o\
<seb128> lol
<seb128> larsu, you need to feed him icecream though otherwise he's not working as well
<larsu> seb128: that's really not going to be a problem...
<larsu> *really*
<seb128> :-)
<pitti> c'est toujours l'heure de la glace ! *yummy*
<pitti> mais maintenant c'est l'heure de systÃ¨me D
<larsu> *giggle*
<seb128> tjaalton, hey, do you know if anything changed with xorg keyboard layout handling in yakkety?
<seb128> livecd has no layout showing configured at all
<seb128> on xenial it has fr and us when picking french locale
<seb128> pitti, ^ or maybe you know, unsure how much is coming from lower stack/console setup/systemd
<seb128> qengho, chrisccoulson, willcooke, so we got chromium/firefox/libreoffice updates out, are we missing anything to desactivate the old google api key and switch to the new ones?
<willcooke> seb128, aiui, just waiting a little while to make sure "everyone" has switched
<seb128> willcooke, well, the key is over the quota and is not working, what difference does it make whether they switched or not?
<willcooke> good call
<seb128> :-)
<seb128> we are in a situation where it works for nobody
<seb128> if we switch it's going to work for those who upgraded
<seb128> which is an improvement whatever the number of upgraders is
<seb128>  
<seb128> pitti, good catch finding that it has to do with systemd user session
<seb128> now to know what bits it doesn't like...
<seb128> it's not the indicator since that's an optional part and just display the status it doesn't do the session config
<pitti> when I disable the systmed user session in Xsession.d/00upstart, then gsettings shows de and us again
<seb128> so maybe ibus or unity-settings-daemon
<seb128> thanks for figuring that out
<pitti> the "de" should come from /etc/default/keyboard
<seb128> I'm going to file a bug after lunch and try to poke a bit more to it
<pitti> not sure where the "us" comes from, that's always there apparently
<seb128> yes
<seb128> it's there because it's needed for e.g ctrl-C/X/V to work in any layout
<seb128> so u-s-d always add it
<seb128> I should make sure to log bugs and tag them this afternoon
<seb128> but lunch first, bbiab
<chrisccoulson> seb128, willcooke, switching it also breaks other APIs which currently aren't over the quota (eg, safebrowsing is the one that immediately springs to mind)
<chrisccoulson> Although it's probably ok to switch now
<tjaalton> seb128: yeah it's somewhere else
<chrisccoulson> I should probably upload firefox to yakket
<chrisccoulson> yakkety, even
<chrisccoulson> I see the current firefox 48 in yakkety that built everywhere except for s390 and ppc now fails to build everywhere except for x86 and x86-64 in doko's archive rebuild
<chrisccoulson> Awesome
<qengho> seb128: "well, the key is over the quota and is not working". There are like 30 parts to the API. 1 of them isn't working.
<seb128> qengho, can we limit the use of the key? like say it's not one to be used for geoloc? or is everything or nothing?
<seb128> qengho, also what are the users out of firefox/chromium/libreoffice which got updated to use the new one?
<qengho> seb128: that's a really good question about limits. I don't know if the capabilities apply to a single key or to the org. I'll find out.
<qengho> seb128: I don't understand your second question.
<seb128> qengho, we updated firefox/chromium/libreoffice to use the new key, is there anything else that needs updated? or what's the factor now to not transition over? with chromium/firefox security updates out with the new key I expect most of our users are transitionning to those ... do we have numbers/graphs about the number of requests from the new ones?
<qengho> seb128: Nothing else needs updating except the program of whoever is abusing our key. Ha ha.
<seb128> well at least we have different keys now...
<seb128> qengho, do you have stats on the use of the new ones?
<seb128> they are working right? but just have lower quota?
<qengho> seb128: We don't have stats per key, because that is disabled in the administration interface.
<qengho> I don't know why.^
<qengho> Or how.^
<seb128> do we have anyone we know at google that we can ask?
<qengho> seb128: I don't know anyone close to this subject. I'll ask the person I know, if he's back from vacation.
<seb128> k
<seb128> thanks
<ximion> Laney: not sure how you manage to get all these weird bugs ^^
<ximion> did you check if curl had any bugfixes in its DNS code recently?
<Laney> nope
<Laney> I saw your conversation with robert_ancell
<Laney> would be good if you didn't imply it was just a matter of me flicking a switch
<Laney> and there is no exception, the release won't be re-published
<Laney> imagine it - all xenial users will hit the archive to download the indices over again
<Laney> not going to happen
<ximion> Laney: jup - I think shipping updated files in a package would be okay though
<Laney> maybe
<Laney> how would that work?
<Laney> feels like publishing it via -updates could somehow be nice
<Laney> s/could somehow/somehow could/
 * Laney has europeanitis
<Laney> ximion: the trace goes down into glibc
<Laney> man it feel really unlikely that there are bugs here to me
<ximion> and of course it's not as easy as flipping a switch - I don't remember much of yesterday night's conversation, but I also think I mentioned that I hope it will be ready for Yakkety
<Laney> yeah
<ximion> which hopefully implies that it's not an easy task ^^
<Laney> don't want anyone to get their hopes up there :P
<Laney> want to run for a while to see how common these weird crashes are anyway
<ximion> having stuff in -updates will be really messy, because we would need to merge data there (old data into SRU data)
<Laney> ubuntu@juju-stg-ue-appstream-back-machine-1:/srv/appstream/logs/2016/09$ grep "Segmentation fault" *.log
<ximion> jup, the curl one goes deep
<Laney> 22_0900.log:Segmentation fault (core dumped)
<Laney> 22_1000.log:Segmentation fault (core dumped)
<Laney> 22_1600.log:2016-09-22 16:08:14 - INFO: Completed procSegmentation fault (core dumped)
<Laney> 23_0100.log:Segmentation fault (core dumped)
<Laney> 23_0900.log:2016-09-2Segmentation fault (core dumped)
<Laney> 23_1000.log:Segmentation fault (core dumped)
<ximion> oh sh*
<Laney> 23_1025.log:Segmentation fault (core dumped)
<ximion> looks like we need to fix this
<Laney> no results between 0100 and 0900 because it hung at 0200
<Laney> ;-)
<desrt> hello people, and happy friday!
<seb128> hey desrt, happy friday to you!
<Laney> hi desrt!
 * desrt is getting pumped for the weekend
<desrt> via lux!
<desrt> my first toronto anomaly
 * seb128 is trying to understand what desrt is saying
<Laney> thought you uninstalled that
<desrt> for 2 days
<desrt> just long enough to ensure that my streak was broken :)
<desrt> seb128: from time to time (a few times a year) in ingress is some event called 'anomaly' where the rules of the game are changed at a point that is focused in a particular place
<desrt> tomorrow, that place is downtown toronto, practically centred on my house
<seb128> oh ok
<seb128> they pulled that trick out to make you come back!
<seb128> which seems to have worked... ;-)
<desrt> i never intended to leave for good.  i just wanted to break my streak at an event 360 (the top badge tier) to make sure i didn't end up with a sick incentive to continue to 400, ... or 500, ... or ...
<desrt> *even 360
<seb128> lol
<desrt> "...on the 361st day, Desrt rested."
<desrt> uninstalling is a bit of a symbolic gesture and a guard against accidentally opening the app and hacking something... when you mindlessly do something every single day for a year, you get a bit auto-pilot about it
<desrt> it's a common tactic in this situation :)
<jhodapp> What would cause the temporary non-pinned icons that show on the launcher when you run a program to not show up towards the end but instead showing up as the 3rd icon from the top every time? It just started happening on one of my desktop machines very recently and this without changing anything being pinned on the launcher
<willcooke> Trevinho, ^
<willcooke> odd
<Trevinho> mhmh
<jhodapp> It's not full either, about 75%
<Trevinho> is that xenial?
<jhodapp> yes
<jhodapp> I don't seem to able to influence where those show up from this point either
<Trevinho> it happened in the past because of a race of bamf and unity calls, but this shouldn't happen now
<Trevinho> or.... well... it could be caused by the new "starting" flag
<Trevinho> which... andyrock did. Could be because of that... mhmh
<jhodapp> Trevinho, was that a recent SRU change or released with 16.04?
<andyrock> ?
<andyrock> jhodapp: can you open a bug with few steps to reproduce the issue?
<jhodapp> andyrock, well I don't know how to reproduce it, that's part of the problem
<jhodapp> it just started happening
<jhodapp> andyrock, and continues to happen any time I open an app not pinned on the launcher
<andyrock> which app? any app?
<jhodapp> yes
<jhodapp> any
<andyrock> did you try to restart unity?
<jhodapp> yup
<andyrock> 16.04?
<jhodapp> correct
<jhodapp> andyrock, I'd be happy to file a bug with this info if it's good enough
<andyrock> a screencast of the issue would help too
<jhodapp> andyrock, sure np
<andyrock> kk
<andyrock> send me the link when you're done
<jhodapp> andyrock, awesome thanks
<Trevinho> andyrock: one thing I thought it could happen is that... I'm not sure wether we're flagging the starting-icons as seen in unity... But it should be...
<andyrock> well what's weird is that it's the first time this problem is reported
<jhodapp> andyrock, yeah and I've been running 16.04 on this machine for quite some time but it just all of a sudden started happening
<ximion> Laney: well, this is terrible and we need to fix the bug - I have never seen it in Debian, and KDE Neon and elementary and Arch also never reported it
<ximion> (so, the hanging thread might be in the langpack code, and something is fishy about the curl downloads of packages)
<Laney> ximion: haha
<Laney> the hang is in seedContentsData
<ximion> Laney: so it is a write issue then
<ximion> I hope the NOTLS change didn't break it then...
<ximion> (if it did, the LMDB docs lie)
<ximion> the Debian extraction runs are crazy slow now... 40min (but for some weird reason it's *always* around 40min, no matter if there were 10 or 30 packages processed)
<Laney> did you profile it?
<ximion> Laney: I just looked at the log timestamps
<ximion> oh, yes I did, but at some time in May, a lot has change dsince then
<Laney> timestamps is ok
<ximion> package extraction was still the most time-consuming step, followed by any operation onvolving searching icons and then on the third place screenshot downloading
<Laney> where's most of the 40 minutes being spent?
<ximion> data export... takes 4min
<ximion> that isn't right
<ximion> https://appstream.debian.org/logs/2016/09/
<ximion> I need to look at this, that is taking too long
<Laney> turn on --verbose
<ximion> oh, actually, it's rendering HTML there too
<Laney> I have this suspicion that it might be doing Translation- stuff too often
<ximion> so likely that and parsing all the data is a culprit
<ximion> you can logInfo with some ID everytime it does that
<Laney> want to see how much it happens in your logs
<ximion> (another useless hint everyone else would have thought of got served, by me :P)
<Laney> there's already some logDebug there
<ximion> Laney: while turning on verbose mode, I noticed that today's run didn't produce a proper log
<ximion> the reason is that it crashed
<Laney> /o\
<Laney> WHAT HAVE WE DONE!
<ximion> I am running https://github.com/ximion/appstream-generator/commit/12ca9be289eb615a73b8372c0e4108609580a341 now
<ximion> now, if I just knew the working version that was running before I uploaded the broken one yesterday...
<Laney> can't tell what that does
<seb128> could somebody try to add a google account through u-c-c -> uoa on yakkety and let me know if the webview goes white for them as well when focussing the textentry?
<ximion> yeah, I think the last working version was https://github.com/ximion/appstream-generator/commit/dd87662d7f3dbdfe2dafaad0fcd2223be7a72bd9
<ximion> Laney: so, some commit in the range of be7a72bd9..9580a341 probably did something bad
<Laney> seb128: yup
<seb128> Laney, it does?
<Laney> yes
<seb128> Laney, thanks for confirming
<Laney> np
<Laney> ximion: that TLS thing is the most suspicious isn't it
<Laney> can you run under gdb?
<ximion> Laney: if I could be sure that it crashes then... The first run this morning at 8:10 succeeded
<ximion> the current one at 14:10 didn't
<Laney> indeed
<Laney> it sometimes works
 * Laney is gdbing
<Laney> this stuff is annoying to debug
<ximion> the TLS thing indeed is the thing I would place my bets on
<ximion> jup - it's highly parallel and also takes a while
<ximion> debugging anything threaded is always a pain
<ximion> but if we disable threads, it will probably work :P
<ximion> in the last log, there is no line telling about a segfault, btw
<ximion> the log just ends
<Laney> do you put stderr in there?
<ximion> exec >> "$LOGFILE" 2>&1
<Laney> mmm
<ximion> it ends prematurely though, and the only way that could have happened is by the command crashing
<ximion> it didn't execute the run for stretch at all
<ximion> so, this was either the OOM killer killing the script instead of asgen, or it crashed and the buffer wasn't written to disk
<Laney> OOM would say "Killed" or something and you would see it in dmesg
<ximion> unfortunately I have no access to any system logs
<ximion> otherwise I would know more already :P
<Laney> O_O
<ximion> DSA machines are highly restricted
<Laney> dmesg works
<Laney> [116865.646259] appstream-gener[14057]: segfault at 8 ip 00007fe4d30f5835 sp 00007fc4c63967c0 error 4 in libgio-2.0.so.0.4800.0[7fe4d3082000+181000]
<Laney> [138390.878702] appstream-gener[673]: segfault at 8 ip 00007faafe825835 sp 00007f8af1ac67c0 error 4 in libgio-2.0.so.0.4800.0[7faafe7b2000+181000]
<Laney> [159892.877074] appstream-gener[18486]: segfault at 8 ip 00007f431c97b835 sp 00007f230fc1c7c0 error 4 in libgio-2.0.so.0.4800.0[7f431c908000+181000]
<ximion> indeed!
<Laney> mekeel%
<Laney> gio...
<ximion> [  204.048422] [sched_delayed] sched: RT throttling activated
<ximion> [116865.646259] appstream-gener[14057]: segfault at 8 ip 00007fe4d30f5835 sp 00007fc4c63967c0 error 4 in libgio-2.0.so.0.4800.0[7fe4d3082000+181000]
<ximion> [138390.878702] appstream-gener[673]: segfault at 8 ip 00007faafe825835 sp 00007f8af1ac67c0 error 4 in libgio-2.0.so.0.4800.0[7faafe7b2000+181000]
<ximion> [159892.877074] appstream-gener[18486]: segfault at 8 ip 00007f431c97b835 sp 00007f230fc1c7c0 error 4 in libgio-2.0.so.0.4800.0[7f431c908000+181000]
<Laney> deja vu
<ximion> jup... why GIO?
<Laney> meh
<Laney> run it under gdb
<ximion> Laney: have you seen that bug already?
<Laney> no just the ones I filed
<Laney> although if you look at the latest log http://appstream.staging.ubuntu.com/logs/2016/09/23_1400.log
<ximion> oh great :(
<Laney> that happened later on in the run
<Laney> ah
<Laney> could have been at the start of the backports run
 * Laney adds some more info to the script
<ximion> Laney: I wonder if the script was still running when I added --verbose
<ximion> because the logfile now has a "cannot execute command "bose"" at the bottom :D
<ximion> super weird... can I tell dmesg to show timestamps?
<Laney> dmesg -T
<ximion> it also looks like all asgen commands ran through, at least they updated the timestamps information, which is the very last stepp
<ximion> Laney: hehe ^^
<ximion> [Mo Sep 19 20:14:35 2016] appstream-gener[14057]: segfault at 8 ip 00007fe4d30f5835 sp 00007fc4c63967c0 error 4 in libgio-2.0.so.0.4800.0[7fe4d3082000+181000]
<ximion> [Di Sep 20 02:13:20 2016] appstream-gener[673]: segfault at 8 ip 00007faafe825835 sp 00007f8af1ac67c0 error 4 in libgio-2.0.so.0.4800.0[7faafe7b2000+181000]
<ximion> [Di Sep 20 08:11:42 2016] appstream-gener[18486]: segfault at 8 ip 00007f431c97b835 sp 00007f230fc1c7c0 error 4 in libgio-2.0.so.0.4800.0[7f431c908000+181000]
<Laney> software sucks
<ximion> Laney: so maybe I broke it myself by editing a script that was still running
<Laney> let's go become farmers
<Laney> bah
<ximion> my lab is currently solving sofware issues with hardware workarounds
<Laney> it's working under gdb
<ximion> because we have an electrical engineer :P
 * Laney modifies the script
<Laney> run in foreground, run the asgen under gdb
<ximion> hah, like the one bug I had a few years back which just *never* appeared in valgrind and gdb :P
<Laney> it's probably just because I do one run at a time here
<Laney> but the real run is yakkety yakkety-proposed yakkety-updates yakkety-security yakkety-backports
<Laney> and cleanup
<Laney> higher chance that one of them breaks
<ximion> Laney: since cleanup is super-expensive, I only do it once a week
<ximion> I am currently running asgen manually with --verbose, so you can get information about how often it does what
<Laney> hm, didn't notice it being that slow
<ximion> because you have a way faster machine than mekeel is
<ximion> `asgen forget` is super fast
<Laney> ASGEN="gdb -ex 'handle SIGUSR1 SIGUSR2 pass nostop noprint' -ex run --args ${BASE_DIR}/appstream-generator/build/appstream-generator --verbose"
<Laney> winning
<ximion> ^^
<ximion> btw, you can put that "don't handle SIGUSR" stuff into some gdb config file
 * ximion did that at home
<Laney> sensible
<ximion> I pretty much never want to halt on a SIGUSR anyway
<ximion> anyway, I need to run (back home) - will be back soonish
<Laney> happy riding
<Laney> I got the crash, and it's SCARY
<ximion> Laney: any interesting events while I am gone?
<ximion> *was
<Laney> yes
<Laney> but not in a good way
<ximion> (or was the interesting event that you left for the weekend? ;-P)
<ximion> grr
<ximion> so -pthread didn't help
<Laney> it's a different crash
<Laney> one second
<Laney> the couchsurfers just turned up
<Laney> need to go say hi
<Laney> HAHA
<Laney> he showed me his phone
<Laney> ........................................which was running Ubuntu
<Laney> so I was like "come up and see my office" and he basically shat bricks
<Laney> :D
<davmor2> Laney: hahahaha
<Laney> ximion: https://paste.debian.net/836576
<Laney> :( :( :( ): ): ):
<seb128> Laney, why did he show you the phone? did you have an ubuntu tshirt? ;-)
<Laney> seb128: maybe he sensed something about me :P
<ximion> Laney: I see a lot of stuff waiting, and one GC thread apparently doing stuff
<Laney> ximion: the GC thread crashed
<ximion> dafuq
<Laney> told you
<ximion> Laney: check all your destructors, are you allocating memory with the GC in any of them?
<ximion> also, are you compiling with LDC or GDC?
<Laney> I never wrote any destructors :/
<Laney> gdc
<Laney> you should run under gdb too, see if you get this crash or a different one
<ximion> Laney: nothing is crashing for me: https://appstream.debian.org/logs/2016/09/23_1459.log
<ximion> I compile with LDC though
<Laney> it was earlier ...
<ximion> that GIO crash might have been temporarily, I want to see it happening again before I trust it
<ximion> temporarily as in: I was messing around with asgen at that time
<ximion> (since the crashes in the log were all from 3 days ago)
<ximion> Laney: I saw some errors when allocating with the GC in a destructor, but apart from that, I never saw this
<ximion> something is seriously broken there
<Laney> woe is us
<Laney> lemme try building with ldc :/
<ximion> I am preparing an ldc upload at time, which fixes most of its packaging issues
<ximion> it's still a Git version though :-/
<Laney> seems mostly broken in yakkety
<Laney> man
<Laney> this toolchain sucks
<ximion> indeed it does
<ximion> it's in part Debian people's fault, but also GDCs
<ximion> all the manpower is in DMD and LDC at time, GDC gets less
<ximion> oh, of course you could try a DMD compilation
<vigo> davmor2, any news about release?
<davmor2> vigo: not yet still testing i386 but it should be soon I guess
<ogra_> davmor2, how about now ?
<davmor2> ogra_: no and everytime you ask it is delayed by another hour or whatever the party bot says ;)
<ogra_> :D
<ximion> Laney: LDC upstream is working on fixing the bug which prevents me from uploading a better version to the archive
<Laney> win
<ximion> since someone synced a broken version into yakkety-proposed, we maybe see it updated soon
<ximion> so far the ldc people never disappointed me :)
<ximion> FTR: https://github.com/ldc-developers/ldc/issues/1774
<ximion> Laney: meanwhile, I'll make fonts work :P
<ximion> fonts suck
<Laney> the pub quiz last week had a font round
<Laney> https://scontent-lhr3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/14355541_1142627962450197_5893877451705311053_n.jpg?oh=6a4ac8f5d47bd363f084d09a16659b34&oe=5868860C
<Laney> ximion: I backported the new ldc and it at least builds asgen on my machine here
<Laney> will try it on the server on monday
 * Laney needs to get outta here
<ximion> :D nice idea!
<ximion> (the font quiz)
<Laney> CURLZ MT BABY
<Laney> ok, time to shoot
<Laney> bye kids!
<seb128> Laney, have a nice w.e!
<seb128> calling it a week as well, and holidays!
<seb128> see you in some weeks desktopers!
<willcooke> happy holiday seb128
<willcooke> right, enough for this week.
<willcooke> night all
#ubuntu-desktop 2017-09-18
<jibel> good morning
<tsimonq2> o/ jibel
<jibel> hi tsimonq2
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<duflu> Morning jibel, tsimonq2, oSoMoN
<tsimonq2> o/ oSoMoN and duflu
<oSoMoN> hey duflu, tsimonq2, jibel
<didrocks> good morning
<tsimonq2> o/ didrocks
<didrocks> hey tsimonq2
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<didrocks> re seb128
<tsimonq2> o/ seb128
<willcooke> morning all
<tsimonq2> o/ willcooke
<didrocks> hey willcooke
<Laney> morning
<didrocks> hey hey Laney
<Laney> hey didrocks
<Laney> good weekend?
<didrocks> quite uneventful, we wanted to see some museum for the European Heritage Days, but it started to rain when we went out
<didrocks> so we decided to head back
<didrocks> and you?
<tsimonq2> o/ Laney
<Laney> oooooooooh what did I do
<Laney> went to the theatre(!) on saturday, and yesterday it was the "green festival" which was fun
<Laney> then to the pub in the evening
<Laney> hi tsimonq2, how's it going?
<Laney> aren't you in the US?
<Laney> get to bed!
<tsimonq2> Laney: I procrastinated on $large-sum-of-homework :P
<tsimonq2> Otherwise I'm pretty good
<tsimonq2> How about you?
<Laney> yeah awesome
<Laney> it's a new dawn it's a new day it's a new life for me
<Laney> and i'm feeling gooooooooooooood
<tsimonq2> :D
<andyrock> willcooke: hey I might have an idea on how to workaround that issue with the lockscreen
<andyrock> the only problem is that I cannot reproduce it
<andyrock> do you know anyone that can easily reproduce it?
<andyrock> so I can ask him to test the fix (as soon as it's ready)
<willcooke> andyrock, nice one, but no, I don't know anyone who can reproduce it.  Seb said he could but only sometimes I think
<andyrock> ok I'll try to find a way to force it on my system
<amano> didrocks, is there a reason that the Ubuntu logo looks fuzzy/filtered in GDM, but crystal clear in Plymouth?
<amano> Ideally they should look the same and be on the same spot in both screens.
<didrocks> amano: yeah, I don't really know if it's a general rendering issue (which is making fonts blurry as well under wayland)
<didrocks> amano: it's exactly the same image
<didrocks> like, referencing the same path on disk
<amano> Ok. I was just wondering.
<amano> But you can consider lowering âUbuntuâ on the Plymouth screen if that can be done easily. To have it on the same spot like in GDM. To have it more seamless. Maybe for 18.04?
<duflu> Also, the GDM purple background is textured, unlike Plythouth
<didrocks> I think having it centered on plymouth makes sense
<didrocks> duflu: right, and I wonder if it's not the noise texture vs logo rendering like this
<didrocks> (which would be weird)
<duflu> didrocks, just the noise texture I guess
<didrocks> we should give it a look in NY, removing the noise texture and seeing how the logo renders
 * duflu *shrugs* and goes to dinner
<didrocks> enjoy your dinner duflu :)
<willcooke> add it to the list :D
<duflu> o/
<willcooke> I would be interested to see how it looks, my gut feeling is that it will look a bit odd.
<willcooke> But it would be cool when it goes in to GDM and looks almost seamless
<didrocks> yes, removing the texture for background doesn't give great results
<didrocks> I just think the logo shouldn't be impacted by the texture, that's just what we should look after (if this is what makes it blurry)
<amano> Maybe somebody can make a mockup with Ubuntu lowered. If it looks ok, then it doesn't matter that this placement doesn't make sense.
<didrocks> same kind of "things to fix" like blurry fonts on wayland IMHO (there is a bug about it)
<didrocks> amano: volounteering? :)
<amano> Sure ;)
<amano> Firing up Gimp in the evening.
<didrocks> sweet
<didrocks> (I guess not for 17.10 anyway)
<amano> Not that important anyway. A papercut bug ;)
<amano> Can Robert Ancell propose LightDM as an official successor to GDM to upstream GNOME?
<amano> The missing lockscreen bits for GNOME Shell would have to be added. And maybe that takes a year or so
<amano> But considering the security review in the MIR even GNOME would probably be happy to default to something saner.
<didrocks> he did that some years back (like 2011/2012?)
<amano> It is written by a GNOMER (Ancell), it is saner, it is sleaker, Ubuntu is getting closer to GNOME again. Maybe they would take it under the GNOME umbrella.
<amano> Maybe he should propose it again. My heart bleeds every time I click onto my GDM login name.
<amano> At the worst they say no again.
 * oSoMoN yells at computer that logs out randomly when he presses Ctrl+C in a terminal
<tsimonq2> O__o
<seb128> bug #1710637
<ubot5> bug 1710637 in mutter (Ubuntu) "Input falls through to gdm3 and terminates the session on Ctrl+C" [High,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1710637
<oSoMoN> yes, it started happening to me last week, and it's been plaguing my work days since then
<Laney> what do you do to trigger it?
<oSoMoN> not 100% reproducible, that's the gotcha, but usually Ctrl+C in a terminal to clear the prompt triggers it
<oSoMoN> and I *think* sometimes other key combinations do it too, but haven't managed to figure out which
<didrocks> jdstrand: that could be the issue we discussed about on Friday ^
<Laney> something else happened to make ctrl-c behave like that
<Laney> please try to figure out what it is, that's the key to fixing this
<jibel> oSoMoN, you're on wayland ? it never happened to me on X always wayland.
<tsimonq2> But why would Ctrl + C on GDM3 cancel the session anyways?
 * tsimonq2 is curious to see what comes out of that bug
<oSoMoN> jibel, yes, wayland
<Laney> you can configure the active console so that key presses go to it instead of the display server
<Laney> run sudo setupcon --force -k and you'll probably see the same bug happen
<oSoMoN> Laney, yes, Iâll pay close attention to what might trigger it
<Laney> I think I saw a comemnt somewhere where somebody said that they saw it after doing something with snap ...
 * Laney coughs
<jibel> it is not only ctrl+c for alt-arrow or alt-Fn. In my case alt-f4 to close a window switches to tty4 instead
<jibel> s/for/but/
<Laney> yes
<Laney> please try to find out what makes it happen
 * Laney hasn't seen it since fixing the previous instance (console-setup)
<jibel> Laney, thanks for the gdm fix, I just finished the upgrade tests and always get the right session
<Laney> nice
<Laney> that fixes the 'default' session case
<Laney> where you haven't used the cog menu to select anything before
<jibel> Laney, and also the right session is still selected after a logout and you don't have to switch between entries twice to select a session
<oSoMoN> logout just happened again. I had typed in a gnome-terminal window "ls /path/to/some/file" using tab completion to verify the exact name of that file, then pressed Ctrl+C to get a clean prompt, and voilÃ , back to session login screen
<oSoMoN> Laney, jibel:Â are there some logs IÂ can collect somewhere?
<jibel> oSoMoN, the journal, I think that's all
<Laney> the ctrl-c is a symptom of the bug, not the cause
<Laney> we need to know where the earlier mode switch happened
<jibel> yeah and journalctl will contain the entire session with maybe some clue
<Laney> might do
<Laney> I'm just saying, don't focus on what you were doing when you pressed ctrl-c
<Laney> that's not the smoking gun - something else is
 * oSoMoN inspects journal
<seb128> is there a way to query some vt config or something to know if the system is in that state?
<seb128> like to pull the status regularly and get a notification when things change
<seb128> to have a clue what action was done around that time
<Laney> don't know
<Laney> if it's setupcon you could add something to that file to log when it's run
<Laney> that one is a script
<Laney> I worked out how to query it, I think, and attached a program to bug #1710637
<ubot5> bug 1710637 in mutter (Ubuntu) "Input falls through to gdm3 and terminates the session on Ctrl+C" [High,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1710637
<seb128> oSoMoN, jibel ^
<seb128> Laney, good job!
<Laney> ty
<oSoMoN> Laney, awesome, Iâll use that
<Laney> make it notify you or something
<Laney> well, this is all assuming that we're barking up the right tree
<jdstrand> didrocks: oh, re bug #1710637. I commented in https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=772476 on that a long time ago, but I couldn't ever find a reproducer so didn't do as upstream asked
<oSoMoN> yes, of course
<ubot5> Gnome bug 772476 in wayland "[wayland] sometimes all keyboard input is displayed on vt1 when shutting down" [Major,New]
<ubot5> bug 1710637 in mutter (Ubuntu) "Input falls through to gdm3 and terminates the session on Ctrl+C" [High,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1710637
<jibel> thanks, i'll try it
<oSoMoN> K_OFF currently, presumably Iâm in a good state, let's see if I can trigger a state change
<jdstrand> didrocks: that is different than what I was seeing last week. this is different from what I saw last week-- I had mutter segfaults
<Laney> muhahah, they ran my trojan
<oSoMoN> Laney, should I have snapped it to run it fully confined? ;)
<oSoMoN> man, that was fast
<oSoMoN> "snap remove libreoffice" triggered state change to K_UNICODE
<oSoMoN> and sure enough, the next Ctrl+C logged me out
<Laney> SNAPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY
<Laney> at least you can try 'FIX' mode next time :P
<oSoMoN> yeah, I'll keep your trojan handy until the bug is fixed :)
<seb128> oSoMoN, write on the snapcraft forum about the issue
<ogra_> +1
<jdstrand> TODO: let didrocks know that after uninstalling gnome-shell-extension-dashtodock (I didn't use it), gnome-shell-extensions (don't think I used anything there), gnome-shell-extension-log-out-button (was using it) and gnome-shell-extension-suspend-button (was using it), the power button works as advertised
<jdstrand> s/TODO: //
 * jdstrand checkcs that off his list :)
<oSoMoN> seb128, doing that right now
<ogra_> jdstrand, how subtle :)
<jdstrand> indeed :)
<jdstrand> irc is my todo list backend now
 * Laney gets the libreoffice snap too
<seb128> suspend button is buggy with 3.26 it seems
<seb128> I had the issue as well
<zyga-ubuntu> ogra_: here?
<zyga-ubuntu> ogra_: anything we need to fix in snapd/
<ogra_> zyga-ubuntu, yeah ... seems the libreoffice snap somehow influences ctrl-c
<ogra_> no idea :)
<zyga-ubuntu> ogra_: I don't have that snap
<zyga-ubuntu> ogra_: but I have plenty of snaps
<ogra_> zyga-ubuntu, oSoMoN carries it to the forum this moment
<zyga-ubuntu> ogra_: and I am affected by that
<zyga-ubuntu> ogra_: I constantly kill gnome shell with ctrl-d or similar
<seb128> it's unlikely having to do with the snap
<zyga-ubuntu> (I started muscle-memory-learn to type exit instead)
<jibel> I can reproduce with just snap install gimp
<Laney> not me :-o
<jibel> then alt-f4 swtiches to vt4
<jibel> let me reboot and try again
<oSoMoN> https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/snap-remove-somesnap-triggers-keyboard-input-fallthrough-to-vt-ctrl-c-in-terminal-logs-out-of-current-gdm-session/2162
<ogra_> thats not a description, thats a novel :P
<zyga-ubuntu> jibel: note that when snaps are removed we reload udev profiles
<zyga-ubuntu> jibel: could that cause this?
<zyga-ubuntu> jibel: I can tell you about other things we do
<zyga-ubuntu> jibel: feel free to ask
<oSoMoN> ogra_, part II coming soon to your favourite book store
<ogra_> haha
<ogra_> zyga-ubuntu, perhaps you should do that reload a little more fine grained and exclude stuff like input devices (or harddisks you dont want these to change either underneath you)
<ogra_> udevadm trigger/settle has sepcific options for that
<ogra_> *specific
<zyga-ubuntu> oSoMoN: I replied to the forum
<oSoMoN> ack
<jibel> and again
<jibel> zyga-ubuntu, under wayland open a terminal and run: snap install gimp
<jibel> zyga-ubuntu, wait until it's install then press alt+f4
<Laney> doesn't happen for me on wayland
 * Laney has super powers
<zyga-ubuntu> checking
 * zyga-ubuntu loves his network :)
<jibel> if you cannot reproduce tell me what info you need
<zyga-ubuntu> jibel: I pressed it, moved me to Ta
<zyga-ubuntu> to VT
<zyga-ubuntu> so I suspect it is broken now
<jibel> Laney, don't you have a trojan of your own installed on your own system ;)
<zyga-ubuntu> darn
<zyga-ubuntu> I hit ctrl-c
<Laney> haha
<Laney> zyga-ubuntu: I put a program here https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gdm3/+bug/1710637/comments/11https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gdm3/+bug/1710637/comments/11 that you can use to fix it when it breaks
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1710637 in mutter (Ubuntu) "Input falls through to gdm3 and terminates the session on Ctrl+C" [High,Incomplete]
<zyga-ubuntu> mvo: hey, so to avoid risking any more shell terminations, can you please merge https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/3932
<zyga-ubuntu> Laney: I saw, I'm getting it now
<Laney> sooo strace snapd and see if it calls this ioctl?
<Laney> then look at the things that it calls
<zyga-ubuntu> Laney: which ioctl?
<zyga-ubuntu> Laney: I commented on the forum about what we do
<Laney> ok, but someone who can make it happen needs to look at those things
<zyga-ubuntu> https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/snap-remove-somesnap-triggers-keyboard-input-fallthrough-to-vt-ctrl-c-in-terminal-logs-out-of-current-gdm-session/2162/2?u=zyga
<Laney> KDSKBMODE
<zyga-ubuntu> Laney: after the crash I get K_OFF now
<zyga-ubuntu> Laney: snapd doesn't do that for sure
<jbicha> didrocks: the very first commit after 3.26.0 looks interesting to cherry-pick https://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-shell/log maybe it could close LP: #1713313
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1713313 in xdiagnose (Ubuntu) "Unable to launch pkexec'ed applications on Wayland session" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1713313
<zyga-ubuntu> Laney: but udev might
<jibel> zyga-ubuntu, it does not happen with every snaps, for example 'hello' doesn't break the system
<zyga-ubuntu> jibel: I suspec it is related to udev rules
<Laney> please could you debug it?
<zyga-ubuntu> jibel: libreoffice probably uses opengl
<zyga-ubuntu> jibel: so you get udev rules
<zyga-ubuntu> we generate the following udev config for gimp:
<zyga-ubuntu> SUBSYSTEM=="drm", KERNEL=="card[0-9]*", TAG+="snap_gimp_gimp"
<zyga-ubuntu> KERNEL=="nvidia*", TAG+="snap_gimp_gimp"
<zyga-ubuntu> KERNEL=="vchiq",   TAG+="snap_gimp_gimp"
<mvo> zyga-ubuntu: hm? how is 3932 related to shell terminations?
<zyga-ubuntu> mvo: it's not, I was just afraid I'll kit ctrl-c again and kill shell again
<zyga-ubuntu> *hit
<seb128> jbicha, why so much hate against system-config-printer? ;-
<seb128> ;-)
<jbicha> I'm just cleaning up :)
<jbicha> although I would have been unhappy to have it used instead of the upstream Printers panel at this point
<jbicha> it's an easy clean up since it's not even visible in GNOME
<seb128> jbicha, I'm not convinced it wouldn't be a good idea to keep it as a power tools
<seb128> the printer panel is quite buggy and has some limitations
<seb128> power tools -> solution for people who need things not working in the panel
<seb128> like sharing their printer
<seb128> or did they fix that in 3.26 ?
<jbicha> printer sharing is not in 3.26
<seb128> :-(
<seb128> well that would be a good reason for me to keep s-c-p installed (and remove the onlyshowin)
<jbicha> wouldn't it be a bit confusing to have 2 things named Printers?
<seb128> no Till around to ask him
<seb128> jbicha, you want to argue in favor or removing the buggy & incomplete integrated panel right? :p
<willcooke> seb128, just got an email from him, so he'll be here soon I think
<seb128> willcooke, thanks
<zyga-ubuntu> when I try to type in firefox certain keys don't work now... like "a" (it works elsewhere)... man, what a day
<seb128> weird
<seb128> probably a snapd bug :p
<jibel> zyga-ubuntu, it seems that all the snaps that trigger the bug use the opengl interface
<seb128> jibel, does "udevadm control --reload-rules" or "udevadm trigger" trigger the same issue?
<jibel> seb128, no they don't
<zyga-ubuntu> jibel: thank you, that's a good hint
<jibel> zyga-ubuntu, and it's only under wayland
<jbicha> seb128: could you try to restart the desktop versions tracker? I fixed a typo yesterday that broke it
<seb128> k
<jibel> seb128, udevadm trigger does actually trigger the bug under wayland. I added 2 test cases to the report.
<jibel> first test is a high level test of the second
<amano_> jbicha, RE cleaning up: vino and remmina do  not work with wayland. will those be removed from main?
<Laney> jibel: nice, probably a systemd bug then ;-)
<Laney> * desktop team's sloping shoulders
<jbicha> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-desktop/2017-June/004981.html
<jbicha> amano_: ^ I asked about that earlier but at this point it would also need a UIFe in my opinion
<amano_> can you still drop the xdiagnose dependence on ubuntu-desktop, so that can be removed manually (without removing the meta package)?
<amano_> s/dependence/dependency
<jbicha> amano_: I think we need more information from tjaalton about what the consequences are of dropping xdiagnose for the failsafex feature
<seb128> is anyone using artful and owning an internet stick to test bug #1707023?
<ubot5> bug 1707023 in gnome-control-center (Ubuntu) "mobile network connection cannot be added" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1707023
<tjaalton> jbicha: failsafe-x can go
<seb128> willcooke, ^you maybe?
<Laney> I think cyphermox has those
<jbicha> tjaalton: so there's no objection to dropping xdiagnose from default install? what about xterm?
<tjaalton> jbicha: what about xterm?
<tjaalton> I don't need that
<jbicha> tjaalton: my understanding is the only reason that we've had xterm in the default install for years is because of failsafex
<willcooke> seb128, Let me see if I've got a SIM card that will work
<tjaalton> jbicha: ok, so it can go as well then
<seb128> willcooke, thanks
<tjaalton> weird if xdiagnose didn't depend on it directly then
<amano_> i wish ImageMagick could at least be hidden in gnome-shell Activities and gnome-software
<amano_> the icon is off on so many levels
<didrocks> We have a list of things to put in "Utlities" section in g-s
<didrocks> Utilities*
<amano_> and removing it from gnome-software removes cups.
<seb128> why do we need imagemagick again?
<didrocks> I guess we can work on that in NY, just going over them one after another to minimize the number of default entries in the overview
<seb128> I guess that's it :p
<amano_> printing. part of it is used for printing. but that isn't obvious to the end user. It shouldn't show up in gnome-software
<jbicha> see the final comment at https://bugs.debian.org/675617
<ubot5> Debian bug 675617 in imagemagick "Please hide the menu entry" [Wishlist,Open]
<jbicha> too bad the Debian maintainer isn't that interested yet but we'll probably make that change for Ubuntu anyway
<seb128> right
<didrocks> jbicha: IIRC, willcooke was against hiding it as well, but moving it to the Utilities category rather
<didrocks> don't think splitting up helps? quite a divergence from debianâ¦
<jbicha> didrocks: my proposal doesn't hide it, it just doesn't install that piece by default but it's available to install for the few people who do want it
<didrocks> yeah, it's a large change and maintenance overhead, but I don't have strong opinion either way :)
<jbicha> we don't intentionally want the display app in the default install, it's a packaging mistake in my opinion
<didrocks> (this UI is horrible btw)
<jbicha> exactly
<jbicha> we can't support that app
<amano_> no app that removes big parts of the software stack should show up in software. imagemagick removes the printing support, removing xdiagnose removes the ubuntu-desktop meta package
<didrocks> I'm sure it's following the HIG, at least, the one from GNOME 1 ;)
<didrocks> jbicha: do you want to tackle the split?
<jbicha> yes, I'll file a bug with my proposed patch for review
<didrocks> nice!
<jbicha> I think that was already on my todo list but I blame Irma
<didrocks> there are others we want to keep installed by default, but they should just go to Utilities in that case
<didrocks> (you can find back the list on the fit and finish sprint trello card, it's one of the item when we reviewed the list)
<jbicha> amano_: the GNOME/Ubuntu Software app allows marking apps as required for a particular desktop. You can see those in the Installed tab as "System Applications"
<jbicha> they cannot be removed using the GNOME Software app
<jbicha> so we should use that feature to match the ubuntu-desktop depends. Not sure if that will happen this cycle though.
<amano_> I love how vim always shows up as installed on a fresh install in gnome-software ;) And apt is pretty sure that it isn't
<jbicha> amano_: see this patch: https://anonscm.debian.org/viewvc/pkg-gnome/desktop/unstable/epiphany-browser/debian/patches/dont-make-compulsory.patch?view=markup
<Laney> it'd probably be better to ship some appstream xml centrally to do that
<willcooke> seb128, having problems getting my 3G dongle to show up at all in Xenial on U7 where I /think/ it used to work.  Could be a bigger problem, could be just me
<seb128> willcooke, ok, don't worry/bother, maybe cyphermox or somebody else can help with that or maybe we can find somebody with a dongle next week
<willcooke> usb_modeswitch seems to be doing it's thing, so could be the SIM card
<willcooke> seb128, also - hub post ;)
<willcooke> seb128, I'll do that
<seb128> good idea!
<didrocks> willcooke: popey: idea for the hub, would be cool if there was a way to replace the comment system for some blog post by a hub discussion embeeded. That would centralize all discussions on things we post on (insight posts, a particular person blog post) on the hub
<cyphermox> sorry, I don't have the tools to test this anymore
<popey> didrocks: like this? https://meta.discourse.org/t/embedding-discourse-comments-via-javascript/31963
<didrocks> popey: sounds exactly it!
<didrocks> popey: I guess I'll need to find out how we can make that work with my static site generator, and somebody should do the same for insights :)
<popey> oooh! Good call.
<willcooke> seb128, I fixed it. *cough*  By unplugging ir and plugging it back in a few times.
<willcooke> *shrug*
 * didrocks urges himself to resist on pasting an IT Crowd reference
<seb128> willcooke, lol
<kenvandine> did you switch it off and on again?
<kenvandine> :-D
<seb128> jbicha, versions updated
<jbicha> thanks!
<seb128> yw!
<willcooke> seb128, updated that bug - have got it working, but the control center panel is a bit lacking.  Will review next week and then log upstream bugs
<seb128> willcooke, thanks
<Laney> cyphermox: just assigned that ctrl-c terminating the session bug to you, another instance of a similar thing in console-setup
<Laney> it's debugged, just not sure what the correct fix is, maybe you can take a look please?
<cyphermox> sure, but I thought this had already been fixed
<Laney> another instance
<cyphermox> ok, what bug # ?
<Laney> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gdm3/+bug/1710637
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1710637 in console-setup (Ubuntu) "Input falls through to gdm3 and terminates the session on Ctrl+C after udevadm trigger is executed under wayland" [High,Triaged]
<Laney> probably systemd does this properly these days anyway so that rule isn't that important?
<Laney> (commented on the bug, but I just tested and it seems like that is true)
<ThorHop[m]> Woop woop? Is there any improvement to IOMMU support in the latest iteration of Ubuntu desktop?
<sarnold> ThorHop[m]: you could try booting with intel_iommu=on or intel_iommu=strict and find out if your drivers are any good..
<ThorHop[m]> sarnold: according to qubes website my dell xps 9530 supports IOMMU... with an exception of booting from external harddrive. So I'll have to install on my SSD :P
<ThorHop[m]> and older kernel, without the latest nouveu drivers... hmm...
#ubuntu-desktop 2017-09-19
<Trevinho> c-lobrano: you might wat to give a look to https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/ubuntu-themes/vertical-linked-buttons-tuning/+merge/330958
<duflu> Trevinho, I found some of those buttons in gnome-maps too. But only after hacking the code (they are hidden behind the map :)
<Trevinho> hi duflu
<duflu> Hello too, Trevinho
<Trevinho> duflu: yeah, I saw them.. and c-lobrano already fixed that case, but there were some issues when we had more than 2 elements and some sizes were wrong
<Trevinho> duflu: also, I was thinking about not using rotated BGs for :active state, but probably it's just better to rotate all the gradients
<Trevinho> give it a check by the way
<Trevinho> duflu: maps has also a probelm with bg of that elemnt.., but it seems more complicated to pick
<duflu> Trevinho, ooops... seems the buttons behind the map is Wayland-specific
<didrocks> good morning
<duflu> Morning didrocks
<RAOF> Hey didrocks !
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers!
<didrocks> hey hey duflu, oSoMoN!
<duflu> Hi oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> hey duflu, didrocks, you guys good?
<duflu> oSoMoN, yeah going OK. You?
<oSoMoN> yeah, Iâm good, busy sorting out many things before leaving for next week
<oSoMoN> duflu, how's the travel looking wrt Jose and friends?
<duflu> oSoMoN, looking like it's improving slightly. Just going to find out the hard way
<oSoMoN> :/
<oSoMoN> hope you have a safe trip (and as easy as it gets)
<duflu> oSoMoN, Thanks. I am betting on the worst being over before I can round the globe
 * duflu moves from desktop to laptop
<jibel> good morning
<didrocks> hey jibel
<jibel> bonjour didrocks
<flexiondotorg> Morning desktopers
<didrocks> hey flexiondotorg
 * didrocks logout and log back in again
<oSoMoN> hey flexiondotorg
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<oSoMoN> salut seb128, Ã§a va?
<willcooke> morning all
<oSoMoN> morning willcooke
<seb128> lut oSoMoN, trÃ¨s bien, et toi ?
<seb128> hey willcooke
<oSoMoN> seb128, trÃ¨s bien, merci!
<willcooke> seb128, Laney - I've got a meeting today again, whose turn is it on the meeting chair? :)
<seb128> haha
<didrocks> hey hey willcooke, Laney
<seb128> I don't know whose turn it is but I can do it
<Laney> morning
<seb128> hey Laney
<Laney> hey seb128
<Laney> what's up
<Laney> hey didrocks too
<tseliot> jbicha: hey, gdm doesn't seem to call the hooks for prime any more, which means that switching between configurations on hybrid graphics doesn't work in 17.10. From what I can see, gdm doesn't call gpu-manager on log out.
<didrocks> Laney: when you get some time, mind looking at the FFe for ubuntu-dock dynamic transparency? bug #1717509 (I opened it on Friday, just attached the final diff)
<ubot5> bug 1717509 in gnome-shell-extension-ubuntu-dock (Ubuntu) "FFe/UIFe dock transparency and slight behavior changes" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1717509
<c-lobrano> hi all
<c-lobrano> Trevinho: I've seen for https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/ubuntu-themes/vertical-linked-buttons-tuning/+merge/330958, quite a change :D, thanks
<Laney> willcooke: jibel: seb128's not available atm, proposing to delay for 30 minutes or so
<didrocks> Laney: as you timed out, not sure if you saw this: when you get some time, mind looking at the FFe for ubuntu-dock dynamic transparency? bug #1717509 (I opened it on Friday, just attached the final diff)"
<ubot5> bug 1717509 in gnome-shell-extension-ubuntu-dock (Ubuntu) "FFe/UIFe dock transparency and slight behavior changes" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1717509
<Laney> I saw it
<Laney> i've been strategically leaving some requests to see if anybody else is picking them up
<jibel> Laney, wfm
<didrocks> that's what I thought when I didn't see that getting updated on Friday or Monday, that's why I didn't harass you :)
<didrocks> I would say can still wait for tomorrow, but I would like to have it updated and getting feedback before the week-end as there is quite some code changes
<GunnarHj> Hi Laney, saw the trello note about l-s. but for 17.10 I think that bug 1662031 should be given priority. It makes little sense to facilitate installing of additional languages if the users cannot switch between them.
<ubot5> bug 1662031 in gdm3 (Ubuntu) "Switching language and format broken" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1662031
<Laney> Didn't I say that the bugs were still valid?
<Laney> (that was rhetorical: yes)
<Laney> I agree that it should be looked at
<GunnarHj> Laney: You did. Is there a plan?
<Laney> not in particular
<Laney> feel free to tag it rls-aa-incoming
<GunnarHj> Laney: Just did.
<Laney> thx
<Trevinho> c-lobrano: good, feel free to review it
<GunnarHj> seb128, jbicha: Hi! Reminding of https://code.launchpad.net/~gunnarhj/ubuntu-seeds/ubuntu.artful_cjkv-fixes
<GunnarHj> If you think it's ok, I suppose it should be merged.
<GammaDraconis> Hello developper Team, why the iso dailybuild of Ubuntu Gnome (17.10) exist ? (I do not speak of Ubuntu but Ubuntu Gnome which was to disappear) ??
<seb128> hey GunnarHj
<seb128> GammaDraconis, because nobody stopped the build I guess, that's a question for darkxst or jbicha
<seb128> didrocks, you plan an ubuntu dock upload right? what do you think about including http://paste.ubuntu.com/25571905/ ?
<c-lobrano> Trevinho: lets say I'll use it to learn all the things I don't know yet :D
<seb128> didrocks, or should I just dput that and you can rebase your upload then?
<seb128> GunnarHj, if you believe that's a gdm bug then it might be useful to upstream it
<seb128> Laney, could you get libreoffice/autopkgtest/i386 ignored (I never remember if I can do that myself and how)? it's not a regression but still the same kernel/java issue, the previous version already got forced in
<seb128> Laney, (there was also a bug tagged to blog the migration which I just untagged)
<Laney> ok, but what's the status of that issue / who is making sure it is worked?
<seb128> Laney, kernel team had a fix uploaded which needed to be validated/migrated to updates/made available in the autopkgtest machine last time I checked, I should probably ping around about that again
<Laney> can you remind me of the bug number for my commit please?
<seb128> sure, let me look
<Laney> thx
<seb128> Laney, bug #1700692
<ubot5> bug 1699772 in linux (Ubuntu) "duplicate for #1700692 linux-image-4.10.0-24-generic, linux-image-4.8.0-56-generic, linux-image-4.4.0-81-generic, linux-image-3.13.0-121-generic Regression: many user-space apps crashing" [Critical,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1699772
<seb128> ah, that's a duplicate, correct number in ^
<Laney> nice one, done
<seb128> thanks!
<GunnarHj> seb128: I know that the bug is related somehow to GDM, since it's not present if I switch to LightDM, but I failed to spot the cause. It seems to happen at the start of the GNOME session,,,
<willcooke> jibel, when you get a mo, can you check a proposed Xenial?  When I commented in the meeting earlier about Chrome having a new theme, it seems my entire desktop has a new theme :)
<willcooke> jibel, I'm going to upgrade again and see if it goes away - so gimme an hour or so and I will reboot
<GunnarHj> seb128: Upstream don't use ~/.pam_environment for setting locale variables. Possibly it works with vanilla GNOME.
<seb128> GunnarHj, so changing language in gnome-control-center works? it's just in l-s which it doesn't?
<GunnarHj> seb128: No, that's not it. Changing it in the sense that ~/.pam_environment is set, works both if you use g-c-c and l-s. The problem is that something is overriding the PAM set variables, and in the end the variables in /etc/default/locale get set for the user session.
<seb128> GunnarHj, I've been changing language in g-c-c and it changes the strings in my session correctly
<seb128> but I think it gets that config out of gsettings or something
<jibel> willcooke, yeah, just let me know what you want me to check
<GunnarHj> seb128: It's been a while since I last tested. Please note that we have ubuntu specific patches in accountsservice and g-c-c, so gsettings shouldn't be involved.
<didrocks> seb128: sure, I can include that, do you want me to push and you commit there?
<seb128> didrocks, there is a vcs?
<seb128> didrocks, if you can push for me that would be nice
<didrocks> seb128: will do, even adding your little name to it then :p
<seb128> if that's upstream they don't know me
<seb128> haha
<seb128> thanks
<didrocks> yw
<didrocks> seb128: will write the blog post, so that everything is prepared for tomorrow's morning upload
<seb128> great
<didrocks> I gues that's fine if it's only available then?
<didrocks> ok
<seb128> yes
<seb128> we don't have a langpack export before next monday
<seb128> well unless I kick one manually but I think it can wait for monday
<didrocks> sounds good then :)
<oSoMoN> chrisccoulson, hey, have you had a chance to c
<oSoMoN> check the chromium update in the stage ppa?
<oSoMoN> (61.0.3163.79)
<didrocks> seb128: I think you didn't try your debdiff ;)
<seb128> didrocks, I did but not in a pbuilder
<seb128> I guess some extra build-depends are needed for the make pot?
<seb128> like gettext?
<didrocks> seb128: no, I'm surprised this passed for you even on your machine, the pot depends on prefs.js that we don't ship
<didrocks> (in ubuntu-dock)
<didrocks> just removed from the TO_LOCALIZE list
<seb128> $ f prefs.js
<seb128> ./gnome-shell-extension-ubuntu-dock-0.5/prefs.js
<didrocks> (in makefile)
<didrocks> yeah, but not installed
<didrocks> oh, forgot what I said
<didrocks> I removed it afterwards on the based merged
<seb128> ah
<didrocks> and you weren't testing the ubuntu-dock branch
<seb128> no, there is no vcs info in the control
<seb128> so I though it was not maintained in a vcs
<didrocks> yeah, the package moved, I think I can add it now that it's upstream
<seb128> thx
<didrocks> the link was in the best documented place: my blog though! :)
<seb128> :-)
 * didrocks doesn't remember, is it Vcs-Git: ?
<seb128> we should make debcheckout know about your blog :p
 * didrocks sends a patch to debian :p
<seb128> Vcs-Git is correct iirc yes
<didrocks> btw, it was the Homepage! :)
<didrocks> let's add this
<seb128> yeah, I saw that one, I assumed it was the code without the packaging
<seb128> right, I've been too lazy to open to check :p
<didrocks> heh ;)
<didrocks> no worry
<seb128> thanks for fixing!
<didrocks> thanks for the fix first!
<seb128> btw no build-depends missing I think
<seb128> dh-translations depends on intltool
<didrocks> no, worked on my sbuilds
<seb128> which depends on gettext
<jibel> tkamppeter, after a recent update of artful my printer stopped printing (canon mp210 usb) and there is this message in error_log "Can't detect file type / Job stopped due to filter errors; please consult the error_log file for details"
<jibel> tkamppeter, this is from error_log, how can I debug that?
<jibel> tkamppeter, the file is just a pdf but I tried with a libreoffice doc too and same error
<tkamppeter> First, make sure that your debug logging is in debug mode, see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebuggingPrintingProblems section "CUPS error_log".
<tkamppeter> jibel, ^^
<tkamppeter> jibel, then try to print the job again and mail me the error_log.
<jibel> tkamppeter, thanks, I enable it and report a bug
<jibel> I will*
<tkamppeter> jibel, another question: Do you have any other printer which works correctly?
<tkamppeter> jibel, and for your Canon, are you using proprietary drivers from Canon or do you simply use what comes with Ubuntu?
<jibel> tkamppeter, no I just have this one at the moment but it used to work pretty well. I use the drivers from Ubuntu
<jibel> tkamppeter, after enabling debug mode from system-config-printer, the server do not start
<tkamppeter> jibel, can you start it manually: "sudo systemctl start cups"?
<seb128> didrocks, did you see bug #1715869, any opinion about that?
<ubot5> bug 1715869 in gnome-control-center (Ubuntu) "It should say 'Position on screen' not 'Screen position' in Dock panel in 3.25.x" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1715869
<jibel> tkamppeter, that's what I did and it started. I'll gather some info and keep you updated
<didrocks> seb128: no opinion, I think it makes sense, but will need an UIFe
<seb128> right, I wonder if it's important enough to request one
<didrocks> native speakers, any thoughts? ^
<seb128> jbicha, Laney, ^ opinion on how
<seb128> s/how/^
<willcooke> jibel, re: the issue I had with themeing.  I think it's a Chrome issue.  Ignore for now
<jibel> willcooke, k
<jibel> tkamppeter, similar error messages to mine in bug 1718132 but with an hp printer
<ubot5> bug 1718132 in hplip (Ubuntu) "setup.py crashed with OSError in log(): [Errno 5] Eingabe-/Ausgabefehler" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1718132
<jibel> and made hplip crash as a side effect
<seb128> oh, dholbach still use ubuntu, good :)
<jibel> he uses the dev release even :)
<jbicha> didrocks: I think Unity used "Launcher placement". How about just "Placement"?
<jbicha> oh, Launcher Placement was asking which screen you wanted it on
<didrocks> jbicha: indeed
 * didrocks just had a flashback implementing that in 2010/2011 :p
<Laney> didrocks: seb128: position on screen is better to me
<seb128> jbicha, what would you think about removing euronews and guardian from the grilo plugin? they don't list any working content (https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=771213 and guardian seems to at least require totem-pl-parser built with libqvui which we don't do, and even with that it seems to not work on fedora)
<ubot5> Gnome bug 771213 in lua "Euronews plugin doesn't work" [Normal,New]
<seb128> Laney, thanks
<tkamppeter> jibel, problem is that your cups-filters and libqpdf are not corresponding.
<tkamppeter> jibel, which version of libqpdf and which version of the cups-filters packages do you have installed?
<didrocks> jbicha: seb128: tkamppeter: if you are working on the gnome-control-center change for printer, maybe roll the string change with it? (to not spam translation and documentation team too much with this)
<seb128> didrocks, k
<seb128> tkamppeter, current artful has cups-filter 1.17.5-1 and qpdf 7.0.0-1
<jibel> thanks seb128 :)
<seb128> jbicha synced the new qpdf
<seb128> jbicha, ^ did you screw up cups-filter by doing that? ;-)
<seb128> what was the rational for the update?
<tkamppeter> seb128, jibel, these should work together assuming that the soname did not increase from 7.0~b1 -> 7.0.0 of libqpdf.
<jibel> I can try to downgrade qpdf
<seb128> tkamppeter, seems it didn't
<seb128> oh, wait
<seb128> no, ignore that
<seb128> tkamppeter, how/where would an incompatibility show?
<seb128> tkamppeter, is your artful uptodate? does it work for you?
<tkamppeter> If not, cups-filters needs to get no-change-rebuilt, or I simply upload my yesterday-released 1.17.7 with some extra fixes.
<tkamppeter> seb128, ldd /usr/lib/cups/filter/pdftopdf
<tkamppeter> seb128, jibel, I will prepare the 1.17.7 upload now ...
<seb128> tkamppeter, the soname didn't change, are you sure a rebuild is going to fix it?
<jibel> tkamppeter, I downgraded qpdf to 7.0~b1-0ubuntu1, printed to a pdf and it's fine (read not a blank page)
<seb128> oh
<seb128> $ /usr/lib/cups/filter/pdftopdf
<seb128>  /usr/lib/cups/filter/pdftopdf: /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libqpdf.so.18: version `LIBQPDF_18' not found (required by /usr/lib/cups/filter/pdftopdf)
<seb128> so yeah, seems the issue
<seb128> jbicha worth knowing to test cups before updating qpdf next time!
<seb128> jibel, did you report a bug about the issue?
<seb128> tkamppeter, thanks for fixing it
<jibel> bug 1718215
<jibel> tkamppeter, ^
<ubot5> bug 1718215 in qpdf (Ubuntu) "Documents are sent to the printer do not print" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1718215
<seb128> thanks
<jibel> poor title :)
<tkamppeter> Jay Berkenbilt (QPDF upstream) reads LP bugs, but perhaps also good if you could also report on qpdf/qpdf on GitHub (upstream home).
<tkamppeter> jibel, seb128: ^^
<seb128> tkamppeter, well, you said that cups-filter just needs a rebuild so nothing to report against qpdf?
<tkamppeter> seb128, jibel, I will upload cups-filters 1.17.7 anyway, to "mark it in" for beta freeze (note that I will travel tomorrow, followed by two days of touristing).
<seb128> thanks tkamppeter
<jibel> tkamppeter, thanks
<tkamppeter> seb128, I am not sure, as pdftopdf passed ldd but fails when starting it. This looks like a QPDF bug for me, so please continue reporting it. No-change rebuilt usually is done on a soname change.
<seb128> ah
<seb128> $ nm -D /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libqpdf.so.18  | grep LIBQ
<seb128> 0000000000000000 A LIBQPDF_19
<seb128> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/337302409/qpdf_7.0~b1-3_7.0.0-1.diff.gz has
<seb128>  # LT = libtool
<seb128> -LT_CURRENT=18
<seb128> +LT_CURRENT=19
<seb128> +LT_AGE=1
<seb128> -LT_AGE=0
<seb128> so soname didn't change
<seb128> but the symbol changed
<seb128> $ ldd /usr/lib/cups/filter/pdftopdf
<seb128>  /usr/lib/cups/filter/pdftopdf: /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libqpdf.so.18: version `LIBQPDF_18' not found (required by /usr/lib/cups/filter/pdftopdf)
<seb128> libqpdf.map.in:LIBQPDF_@LT_CURRENT@ {
<seb128> so yeah, I don't know if qpdf is handling things weirdly, it feels like that symbol should match the soname
<seb128> not the ltcurrent
<tkamppeter> jibel, seb128, no downgrade of QPDF needed. I have rebuilt cups-filters now and this way it works with QPDF. Will upload cups-filters 1.17.7 in the next hour or so.
<seb128> tkamppeter, thanks, still the symbols you depends on shouldn't go away like that no?
<jibel> tkamppeter, thanks that's fine, it was just to confirm the version mismatch was to blame.
<didrocks> hum, ostree has been removed from s390 but not flatpak, and so, gnome software is FTBFS
<jbicha> Laney: do you know why you have gnome-software-plugin-flatpak installing the ostree plugin as of rev.86 this wasn't done in Debian?
<seb128> k, it's meeting time
<seb128> #startmeeting Desktop Team 2017-09-19
<meetingology> Meeting started Tue Sep 19 15:30:19 2017 UTC.  The chair is seb128. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/0T55ivzN/ubuntu-desktop-17-10-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team 2017-09-19 Meeting | Current topic:
<seb128> Roll call: andyrock, dgadomski, didrocks, duflu (out), jbicha, jamesh (out), jibel/heber (out), kenvandine (out), laney, oSoMoN, seb128, tkamppeter(out), trevinho, robert_ancell (out)
<didrocks> hey
<Trevinho> hello guys!
<heber> o/
<jbicha> o/
<Laney> jbicha: no, why does it matter?
<andyrock> o/
<oSoMoN> o/
<jbicha> it probably doesn't matter except we should probably do the same thing there on Debian and Ubuntu
<seb128> k, let's get started
<seb128> jbicha, Laney, topic for another channel or post meeting?
* seb128 changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: andyrock
<seb128> andyrock, hey
<Laney> ok
<andyrock> hey
<andyrock> # Implementing progress-bar in ubuntu-dock
<andyrock> # Ported the lockcreen-missing-entry from xenial to artful
<andyrock> # Writing a fix to workaround bug 1532508
<ubot5> bug 1532508 in GNOME Shell "Screen shown briefly after opening closed laptop lid, before even unlocking" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1532508
<andyrock> # eow
<seb128> andyrock, did you see they had patches up for review upstream for that lockscreen/gnome-shell issue?
<andyrock> yep, basically it's the same idea
<seb128> k, but better than what they did? ;-)
<andyrock> easier
<seb128> anyway, I just wanted to point it out in case you didn't see their version
<seb128> thanks andyrock!
<andyrock> yw!
* seb128 changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: dgadomski
<seb128> dgadomski, hey
<dgadomski> hey
<dgadomski> * prepared a set of benchmarks for bug #1638695 with various build-time options, will prepare some more
<dgadomski> * proposed a patch for #1699179 after testing (waiting for review)
<ubot5> bug 1638695 in python2.7 (Ubuntu Xenial) "Python 2.7.12 performance regression" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1638695
<tkamppeter> seb128, jibel: cups-filters 1.17.7 uploaded.
<dgadomski> eof
<seb128> tkamppeter, thanks
<seb128> dgadomski, thanks
<seb128> shrug
<seb128> I screwed up bot commands (somebody could have told me!)
* seb128 changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/0T55ivzN/ubuntu-desktop-17-10-cycle  | Desktop Team 2017-09-19 Meeting | Current topic:
<seb128> #topic didrocks
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/0T55ivzN/ubuntu-desktop-17-10-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team 2017-09-19 Meeting | Current topic: didrocks
<seb128> didrocks, hey
<didrocks> hey
<didrocks> * Final touch to GDM with adding ubuntu logo to login screen
<didrocks> * Change alt-tab behavior by advanced alt-tab in G-S + blog post (https://didrocks.fr/2017/09/14/ubuntu-gnome-shell-in-artful-day-12/). Continuing the discussion in the upstream bug report.
<didrocks> * glib2.0 merge
<didrocks> * Review whoopsie integration patch for g-c-c and sponsored.
<didrocks> * update mutter/G-S/G-S-E to 3.26
<didrocks> * Shuffle some keybindings in the dock to be more consitent both with keyboard shortcut or keyboard + mouse
<didrocks> * Work with Dash to Dock upstream in testing and advice them on dynamic transparency. FFe/UIFe for Ubuntu dock. Upload + blog post planned tomorrow morning.
<didrocks> .
<seb128> thanks didrocks
<seb128> nice work as usual, I like the ubuntu logo on the login screen ;-)
<didrocks> yeah, it's less empty ;) (and thanks!)
<seb128> k, next one
<seb128> #topic duflu
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/0T55ivzN/ubuntu-desktop-17-10-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team 2017-09-19 Meeting | Current topic: duflu
<seb128> * Performance:
<seb128>   - TLDR: Still jumping between CPU fixes and smoothness fixes which are interacting with each other...
<seb128>   - Prototyped and proposed the first fixes for GTK stuttering:
<seb128>     . https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=787665
<seb128>   - The stutter bugs are blocking the CPU-halving fix to clutter-gtk/totem, which exaggerates the issues.
<ubot5> Gnome bug 787665 in .General "gdk_frame_clock_get_frame_time is irregular and causing stuttering" [Normal,New]
<seb128>   - Unfortunately this has revealed a new problem with the design of clutter's GDK backend -- If you modify it to perform efficiently per the design of wl_subsurface then it no longer gets accurate monitor timing info. It works OK (guessing 60Hz instead of 59.95Hz) but is not ideal, and does constitute a new regression that would occur as a result of fixing the high CPU problem. This is actually a design bug in clutter
<seb128> (gdk<->clutter clock linking) more than anything else, so is difficult to fix and a difficult conversation with upstream for later.
<seb128>   - I will certainly still be working on this in New York next week.
<seb128> * Daily bug management across gnome-shell, mutter, gdm, ubuntu-themes, bluez, pulseaudio, dkms and mir.
<seb128> * Travel planning and preparation. My flight departs about the same time as this meeting. I am now traveling and on vacation briefly. Catch you next week...
<seb128> #topic jbicha
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/0T55ivzN/ubuntu-desktop-17-10-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team 2017-09-19 Meeting | Current topic: jbicha
<seb128> jbicha, hey
<jbicha> â¢ Packaged most of GNOME 3.26
<jbicha> â¢ Added gnome-language-selector button to gnome-control-center as workaround for LP: #1631750
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1631750 in gnome-control-center (Ubuntu) "Language installation doesn't work in Ubuntu GNOME 16.10 Settings app" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1631750
<jbicha> â¢ Filed LP: #1717946 and LP: #1717951
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1717946 in ubuntu-meta (Ubuntu) "UIFe: Drop xterm and xdiagnose from default install" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1717946
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1717951 in imagemagick (Ubuntu) "UIFe: Drop imagemagick-display from the default install" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1717951
<jbicha> â¢ Filed MIRs for 2 LibreOffice deps LP: #1717926 LP: #1717930
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1717926 in libzmf (Ubuntu) "[MIR] libzmf" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1717926
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1717930 in libstaroffice (Ubuntu) "[MIR] libstaroffice" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1717930
<jbicha> â¢ Working with tkamppeter on system-config-printer presence in 17.10 LP: #1718083
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1718083 in gnome-control-center (Ubuntu) "UIFe: Add Additional Printer Settings button" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1718083
<jbicha> eof
<didrocks> nice work jbicha on 3.26 + various patches :)
<seb128> thanks jbicha, lot of good work there
<seb128> jbicha, do you plan to handle the extra printing button to g-c-c? (just asking, if you don't I'm going to have a look)
<jbicha> seb128: feel free to work on that
<seb128> k
<seb128> thanks jbicha
<didrocks> seb128: if you want, I can handle that tomorrow
<didrocks> (the extra button)
<didrocks> + the string change on placement
<seb128> didrocks, if you want to do it feel free
<didrocks> will do thus
<seb128> thanks!
<seb128> ok, next
<seb128> #topic jibel/heber
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/0T55ivzN/ubuntu-desktop-17-10-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team 2017-09-19 Meeting | Current topic: jibel/heber
<seb128> jibel, heber, hey
<heber> Hey! QA updates:
<heber> * Triaged printing bug (qpdf / cups-filter version do not match)
<heber> *  Analyze testflinger provisioning failures for Artful
<heber> * Propose new KPIs for ubuntu desktop
<heber> * Analyze/Fix ust broken tests
<heber> * Define and test auto-upgrade jobs timeout
<heber> EOF
<seb128> heber, do you sync up with jibel for summaries?
<seb128> he sent one by email which overlap with yours but is slightly different
<seb128> I'm going to copy it anyway but would be nice if you had one version in the futur
<heber> seb128, we fill one doc, but it might be out of sync as well
<seb128> - KPI: errors.u.c: http://platform-qa-dashboard.canonical.com/dashboard/db/ubuntu-desktop-kpi
<seb128>   - New indicators:
<seb128>     - Delay to publish from proposed to the release pocket.
<seb128>     - Number of packages of the desktop package set published daily
<seb128>     - Percentage of packages with a distro patch published daily.
<seb128> - SRU verification of update-manager
<seb128> - Weekly verification of upgrade from Z to A
<seb128> - Tested new gdm (session selection bug)
<seb128> - Triaged console-setup bug (ctrl+c terminates the session)
<seb128> thanks heber
<seb128> #topic kenvandine
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/0T55ivzN/ubuntu-desktop-17-10-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team 2017-09-19 Meeting | Current topic: kenvandine
<seb128> * Created a gnome-3-26 PPA for 3.26 backports to xenial
<seb128> * Created new gnome-3-26-1604 platform snap (naming to match forum discussion for auto-connection)
<seb128> * Started building 3.26 versions of existing gnome snaps
<seb128> * Working on fixing an issue popey reported against snapcraft-desktop-helpers which causes apps that use various APIs like get_user_special_dir to get paths fail.
<seb128> #topic Laney
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/0T55ivzN/ubuntu-desktop-17-10-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team 2017-09-19 Meeting | Current topic: Laney
<seb128> Laney, hey
 * popey hugs seb128 
<Laney> hi
<Laney> feel like I forgot a lot of stuff in this but my notebook is downstairs
<Laney> /o\
<Laney> â¢ autopkgtest:
<Laney> â worked on bringing lgw01 back up after the re-deploy
<Laney> â learned some lessons from that when looking at bos02 (arm64/s390x cloud)
<Laney> â£ played with that to see what was working
<Laney> â£ filed a few tickets to get missing stuff fixed
<Laney> â holding the hand of armhf workers
<Laney> â¢ uploaded the new wallpapers
<Laney> â¢ tracked down another console-setup / tty keyboard mode bug
<Laney> â¢ Add DESKTOP_SESSION parameterised directory to XDG_DATA_DIRS under wayland too
<Laney> â¢ triaged trello cards & stuff for 18.04 prep
<Laney> â¢ reviewed quite a few freeze exceptions
<Laney> ð
<seb128> popey, that was the summary for ken if the hug has to do with the work listed :-)
<oSoMoN> kenvandine does the work, and seb128 gets the hugs
<popey> He's had far too many hugs recently. You deserve one too :)
<seb128> thanks :-)
<seb128> oSoMoN, that's what managers are for :p
<seb128> #topic oSoMoN
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/0T55ivzN/ubuntu-desktop-17-10-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team 2017-09-19 Meeting | Current topic: oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> hey
<oSoMoN> â¢ chromium 61.0.3163.79 ready for publication
<oSoMoN> â¢ chromium beta updated to 62.0.3202.18 and dev updated to 63.0.3213.3 for all series except trusty
<oSoMoN> â¢ libreoffice 5.4.1-0ubuntu1 now in artful, thanks Seb
<oSoMoN> â¢ working around bug #1714520 in libreoffice snap by disabling wayland support in desktop helper for now, will get to the bottom of this next week in NYC
<ubot5> bug 1714520 in libreoffice (Ubuntu) "[snap] libreoffice 5.4.x snap crashes at startup on wayland" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1714520
<oSoMoN> â¢ fixed bug #1703813 and bug #1713742 in libreoffice snap
<ubot5> bug 1703813 in libreoffice (Ubuntu) "[snap] missing removable-media plug" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1703813
<ubot5> bug 1713742 in libreoffice (Ubuntu) "[snap] libreoffice 5.4.0 snap has incorrect file permissions for some files installed by stage packages" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1713742
<oSoMoN> â¢ got affected by bug #1710637 and found out that snapd is causing the issue (thanks Laney!)
<ubot5> bug 1710637 in Snappy "Input falls through to gdm3 and terminates the session on Ctrl+C after udevadm trigger is executed under wayland" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1710637
<oSoMoN> â¢ filed bug #1718026 and got a good surprise, it's already fixed in the upcoming snapd 2.28
<ubot5> bug 1718026 in snapd (Ubuntu) "Applications from installed snaps don't appear in activities overview" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1718026
<oSoMoN> â¢ looking into issues with firefox snap
<oSoMoN> â¢ preparing topics for conversations next week
<oSoMoN> ð½
<seb128> oSoMoN, thanks!
<seb128> #topic seb128
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/0T55ivzN/ubuntu-desktop-17-10-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team 2017-09-19 Meeting | Current topic: seb128
<seb128> - not a lot of work done this week since I had 3 days off (some carry over item from previous week listed as well due to that)
<seb128> - created new g-c-c panel for the ubuntu session settings
<seb128> - update-notifier wayland fixes
<seb128> - updated unity universe composent to be translatables on launchpad (indicator-appmenu, indicator-messages, indicator-printers, indicator-bluetooth, indicator-sound)
<seb128> - trello board reviews
<seb128> - triaged recent launchpad bugs
<seb128> - reported some issues upstream, debugged some on the way
<seb128> </week>
<seb128> #topic tkamppeter
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/0T55ivzN/ubuntu-desktop-17-10-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team 2017-09-19 Meeting | Current topic: tkamppeter
<tkamppeter> - cups-filters: Got a lot of patches for Braille embossing
<tkamppeter> - avahi: Found a volunteer for working on the localhost support for IPP-over-USB! It is Rithvik Patibandla, one of the students who worked in this year's GSoC on the new Qt print dialog.
<tkamppeter> - LibreOffice: The improvements on the print dialog in LibreOffice to support common print dialog backends to always support the current print technologies, the GSoC-2017 project of Yash Srivastav, was accepted by LibreOffice upstream.
<tkamppeter> - cups: Packaged 2.2.4-7 with fixes for an every-second wake-up of the CUPS daemon and for the print quality option in print queues for driverless printers.
<tkamppeter> - Preparations for the trip to NYC.
<tkamppeter> - Bugs.
<tkamppeter> In addition: Uploaded cups-filters 1.17.7 to get more braille fixes in and to trigger a package build to fit QPDF 7.0.0.
<seb128> thanks tkamppeter, have a nice trip and enjoy NY during the few days you are spending there before the rally
<tkamppeter> seb128, thanks.
<tkamppeter> seb128, a question: How do I reserve a slot for a lightning talk on Wed or Thu?
<tkamppeter> seb128, About driverless printing.
<seb128> tkamppeter, I don't know but I'm going to ask and get you one
<seb128> but I expect people are going to be able to add themselve to the list next week
<seb128> thanks tkamppeter
<oSoMoN> tkamppeter, there's a tab on the rally spreadsheet where you can add yourself
<tkamppeter> seb128, thanks. Please not on Fri, as I want to present a demo and last year I was in the last slot and they have taken the network down.
<seb128> tkamppeter, noted
<seb128> oSoMoN, oh, good to know!
<tkamppeter> oSoMoN, thanks, I did not know that I can simply write there.
<seb128> ok, let's see if Marco is still with us of if you didn't resist to the pool attraction
<seb128> #topic Trevinho
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/0T55ivzN/ubuntu-desktop-17-10-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team 2017-09-19 Meeting | Current topic: Trevinho
<Trevinho> oh yes..
<seb128> Trevinho, hey
<seb128> :-)
<Trevinho> Â· Continued some mutter fixes
<Trevinho> Â· Redone the .destructive-action buttons style in themes
<Trevinho> Â· Done landing of theme fixes
<Trevinho> Â· Fixed .vertical .linked buttons style, rotating gradients and supporting middle-buttons
<Trevinho> Â· Refactored the cmake file for testing in unity7, splitting them all to avoid false-positive failures
<Trevinho> Â· Fixed a Float comparison not working in arm64, still checking ppc64 issues
<Trevinho> - EOF
<seb128> he's trolling me right?
<seb128> lol
<Trevinho> yes >/D
<seb128> :-p
<Trevinho> No, my keyboard layout changed....
<seb128> no worry
<seb128> thanks Trevinho!
<seb128> did you manage to get unblocked on the unity7 build issues?
<seb128> or still needing access to some porter box with a specific env?
<tkamppeter> seb128, oSoMoN: Thanks, I have entered myself now.
<Trevinho> seb128: the only issue I've now is witha ppc64 test issue
<Trevinho> which... I'm looking into, but testing isn't easy having no a porter
<Trevinho> I might just disable tests there
<seb128> yeah, feel free
<seb128> I don't think we care much about unity7 on ppc64
<Trevinho> Agree...
<Trevinho> I just don't like failures, as sometimes they are just pointing out that something is wrong
<Trevinho> just not happening in ther archs because of timing or other rasons
<Trevinho> reasons*
<seb128> right, would still be good to debug if we can
<seb128> but probably lower priority than other work/bugs atm
<seb128> anyway
<seb128> thanks Trevinho
<Trevinho> yep... just wanted to get rid of this
<seb128> #topic robert_ancell
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/0T55ivzN/ubuntu-desktop-17-10-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team 2017-09-19 Meeting | Current topic: robert_ancell
<seb128> - Released GNOME Software 3.26.0 to artful
<seb128> - Chasing up SRUs
<seb128> - Diagnosing GNOME Software stability / performance issues in artful
<seb128> - Backported auth dialog changes to GNOME Software 3.20 (Xenial)
<seb128> - Diagnosed why snaps take up more space in GNOME Software search results - turns out to be carriage returns coming from the Snap store.
<Trevinho> as andyrock has to land some big fixes to unity7, which will have to go to a, in order to be SRUed too
<seb128> - Updated versions page to track current package state
<seb128> #topic aob
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/0T55ivzN/ubuntu-desktop-17-10-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team 2017-09-19 Meeting | Current topic: aob
<seb128> Trevinho, right
<seb128> so, anything else to discuss?
<jbicha> not from me this week :)
<jbicha> oh, I'll probably start working on the Artful Release Notes this week since the Beta is coming up soon
<didrocks> that will be great! I think you might want to talk with kenvandine as well as GNOME is publishing some transitional documentation
<jbicha> ok
<didrocks> so we can reference/pick some work done there
<seb128> jbicha, we should probably give an hand there, thanks for pointing out
<seb128> I'm going to add it to the rally agenda
<seb128> thanks jbicha
<seb128> so I guess it's a wrap
<Laney> NO
<jbicha> yes, it's a team effort for the release notes :)
<seb128> Laney, no?
<Laney> we should look at
<Laney> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-aa-incoming-bug-tasks.html
<seb128> ah, yes
<seb128> we should probably tag things as well
<seb128> that list is short compared to the things we need to fix
<didrocks> can we freely tag what we put on the list? /me can do with the important bugs I have in mind tomorrow
<Laney> sure, but things already on there need to be triaged and assigned
<Laney> the idea is that you nominate them or tag rls-aa-notfixing
<seb128> right
<jbicha> so we should add that tag to bugs that look important to fix before release?
<Laney> then they go to http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-aa-tracking-bug-tasks.html and get fixed ...
<seb128> thanks for pointing that out Laney
<Laney> yes
<jbicha> or we can nominate a bug to artful directly if we have permissions, right?
<seb128> it should still be tagged to be listed?
<Laney> i think the nomination alone is enough
<seb128> ok
<seb128> that was a good reminder
<Laney> but jbicha shouldn't really be assigning work to the desktop team so the incoming procedure is appropriate
<seb128> thanks Laney!
<seb128> indeed
<Laney> um it wasn't meant to be a reminder
<Laney> or... if itis to be used as one
<jbicha> ok
<Laney> when do we go triage the list?
<seb128> Laney, sounds like a topic for next monday as we review trello boards/plans/etc?
<seb128> or would you prefer to do it before that?
<Laney> i don't think we have so many work days left this cycle
<seb128> right, which is a bit of a shame
<seb128> I'm going to have a first pass on the list/tag some bugs tomorrow
<seb128> Laney, do you think we should have a collective review, or maybe just go through, assign/close the ones that are obvious and bring on the channel for the others?
<Laney> I think everything should get assigned to someone and then we should look at incoming / tracking each meeting
<seb128> +1
<Laney> not sure
<Laney> some can probably be cleaned off straight away
<seb128> k
<Laney> like I don't know why bdmurray tagged http://launchpad.net/bugs/500175
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 500175 in software-center (Ubuntu) "Canceling an installation in Software Center crashes debconf with "Use of uninitialized value $reply in scalar chomp at /usr/share/perl5/Debconf/FrontEnd/Passthrough.pm line 66,"" [Medium,Confirmed]
<seb128> right
<Laney> so yeah if you like feel free to dish them out
<seb128> Laney, I need to wrap after the meeting but let's try to have an hangout with willcooke tomorrow morning?
<seb128> review the list/assign
<seb128> and then from now on we try to keep with it and do regular reviews
<seb128> if people want to assign themself to some of those bugs, please do
<Laney> can do, although I prefer it to be first thing so I can go to the library ;-)
<Laney> alright
<Laney> so people can expect to have some of these bugs assigned
<Laney> please try to work on them if that happens
<seb128> +1
<seb128> and yeah, first thing would be good for me as well
<seb128> ok, let's wrap on that note
<seb128> thanks everyone!
<Laney> and come to the team if you have issues rather than being stuck/blocked for days
<Laney> :-)
<Laney> thanks
<seb128> #endmeeting
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/0T55ivzN/ubuntu-desktop-17-10-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help
<meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Sep 19 16:10:37 2017 UTC.
<meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2017/ubuntu-desktop.2017-09-19-15.30.moin.txt
<seb128> on that note I'm away for a bit, going to deal with backlog before wrapping a bit later
<seb128> have a nice evening desktopers
<Laney> on a high brow note: this orange is (1) slimy (2) super citrussy
 * Laney gets sticky and then dies of facial inversion
<kenvandine> lol
<codygarver> can I expect artful to soon pick up the new release of `hicolor-icon-theme`? it only has 1 change, improved hidpi support
<codygarver> it landed in sid earlier this month
<jbicha> codygarver: that update is blocked because it appears to make this test fail: http://autopkgtest.ubuntu.com/packages/p/plasma-framework/artful/amd64
<codygarver> thanks! if I'm reading this right, this failure is some warning `cc1: warning: command line option â-std=c++11â is valid for C++/ObjC++ but not for C`
<codygarver> wonder why
<codygarver> oh wait no, it's `dialognativetest` in the log from the artifacts
<Laney> night fam
<tkamppeter> jbicha, did you see my last e-mails?
<jbicha> tkamppeter: the one recommending I install cups-pdf?
<xnox> Laney, please find an asignee to complete this - https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/artful/+source/unity-scopes-api/+bug/1718254
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1718254 in unity-scopes-api (Ubuntu Artful) "please drop url-dispatcher dependencies" [Critical,New]
<jbicha> GunnarHj: hi, these language seed changes (in general) are difficult for me to understand
<jbicha> https://code.launchpad.net/~gunnarhj/ubuntu-seeds/ubuntu.artful_cjkv-fixes/+merge/329857
<jbicha> are you planning to do a language-selector upload to match that? ^
<jbicha> I thought the general thinking is that for select languages including zh we would provide everything that l-s  would install for that language
<jbicha> but zh still has fcitx
<jbicha> *we would provide on the live iso
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Sorry, unreliable internet connection - back now
<willcooke> night all
<amano> Trevinho, is there a bug for the "close documents" "x" in libreoffice
<amano> that is not themed and looks buggy
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Hmm.. I see now that my reply didn't make it before I was disconnected. Trying again:
<GunnarHj> Important to keep in mind that pkg_depends in language-selector is used by the flavors too, and AFAIK they haven't switched from Fcitx to IBus for CJKV. So to not break things, language-selector needs to pull both Fcitx and IBus, which it currently does, so I see no need to change anything there. This is obviously a clumsy solution for CJKV users on Ubuntu (Fcitx packages are installed unnecessarily), but that's the way I think
<GunnarHj> we must go ATM.
<jbicha> GunnarHj: could you ask didrocks about that issue? maybe just email the ubuntu-desktop list
<Trevinho> Ampelbein: yes, also a proposed fix from c-lobrano, the problem is that LO doesn't allow to filter windows properly in order to have a css selector that is unique for it
<GunnarHj> jbicha: How about adding him as a reviewer on the MP and add the above comment.
<jbicha> that works too. I believe he was one of the drivers for shipping complete language support on the ISOs
<Trevinho> Ampelbein: sorry I wanted to reply to amano
<c-lobrano> amano, which LO version are you using?
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Right, but aren't you mixing up two different things now? AFAIK that was about language support for the biggest languages. The issue at hand is IM packages for all CJKV languages.
<GunnarHj> jbicha: In a sense they are related, since Simplified Chinese is included in both groups. But the MP suggests that the IBus packages are seeded in the desktop file.
<jbicha> it used to be that language-selector would show a popup asking you to install additional stuff for full language support and I think the idea is not show that prompt even when the user installs without internet access for the few langs we support
<jbicha> but there's probably a good argument to not have fonts-noto-cjk-extra on the iso because of its size and maybe fcitx now too
<jbicha> but I'm not the one that needs to be convinced here ;)
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Agreed. Ok, now I think I understand your point. To comply with that idea, we'd need to keep the Fcitx packages in desktop.
<jbicha> sorry, that you've found several complicated issues this cycle :| but I appreciate you working on it and pinging about it :)
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Aha, yes, I took for granted that we should tread fonts-noto-cjk-extra specially.
<GunnarHj> jbicha: It's the kind of stuff I'm usually involved in. ;)
<GunnarHj> jbicha: But I tend to think that, in order to prevent the "missing lang support" pop-up from showing up for Simplified Chinese installs, we should *not* move the Fcitx packages from desktop to supported, but keep them in desktop.
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Or rather "live"...
<seb128> it doesn't make sense to keep fcitx if it can't be used though
<jbicha> yes if that's what we want
<GunnarHj> seb128, jbicha: The problem is that pkg_depends is used by the flavors too, which keep Fcitx as default IM framework for CJKV.
<jbicha> GunnarHj: shouldn't you conditionalize fcitx in pkg/data_depends then to only be installed for those desktops?
<jbicha> like how the calligra translations are installed if the calligra library is already installed
<GunnarHj> jbicha: The mechanism implemented to conditionalize in pkg_depends is to state a package. Is there a common denominator for all flavors but vanilla Ubuntu?
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Maybe I could add a hack to the python program which parses it...
<jbicha> you can't repeat a line? using something like caja-common, kdelibs5-data, etc. for all the different flavors?
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Don't think so, but need to look at the code to be sure.
<jbicha> if that all works, there may not be any reason to keeping fcitx in supported either at this time
<GunnarHj> seb128, jbicha: Is it really true that Fcitx can't be used at all? I think we have reasons to assume that many CJKV users, who have started to use Fcitx, want to keep doing so, even if g-c-c doesn't support it.
<seb128> GunnarHj, afaik fcitx currently doesn't work under wayland which is our default session
<seb128> also there is no gnome-shell integration
<GunnarHj> seb128: I know that was the case. Still not fixed?
<jbicha> so I think universe is appropriate: we're not saying they can't install it if they want
<seb128> not that I know
<jbicha> our fcitx packages haven't been updated this cycle
<seb128> https://fcitx-im.org/wiki/Todo-List still has it as in progress
<GunnarHj> seb128, jbicha: Ok, I'll look at a way to make l-s not pull Fcitx in Ubuntu.
<GunnarHj> seb128, jbicha: Where is Aron nowadays?
<seb128> he's on this channel
<seb128> I think he's working on kylin but I'm not sure
<GunnarHj> happyaron: Any thoughts on ^ ?
<jbicha> he prepared UKUI packages for Debian recently
<tkamppeter> jbicha, still there?
<jbicha> yes
<tkamppeter> jbicha, I mean the e-mail where I have asked you for you to do the patch, as once I did never do any change on any GNOME program, and second, the extra button does not more than simply launch s-c-p in its own window, for testing this no printer is required.
<tkamppeter> jbicha, the hint with installing cups-pdf is mainly for taking a screenshot with a non-empty printer list.
<jbicha> tkamppeter: at today's Desktop meeting, didrocks volunteered to work on that patch tomorrow
<tkamppeter> jbicha, great, thanks for the info.
<jbicha> unless you got to it sooner ;)
<tkamppeter> No, I am not working on this, didrock is probably much, much faster with it as he is working on GNOME apps every day.
<jbicha> it sounds like it could be a good opportunity for you to expand your skills?
<tkamppeter> But now there is not much time for me as I am departing for NYC tomorrow afternoon and next week we have the Sprint.
<jbicha> the Printer panel in our default desktop sounds like something that is related to your field of expertise ;)
<jbicha> ok
<tkamppeter> jbicha, only that I have contributed to s-c-p which is in Python and there I also have only done the algorithms for printing-related decision making, not the GUI.
<tkamppeter> jbicha, such things as finding out whether printers discovered by different CUPS backends are actually the same physical device or which driver is the best for a given printer.
<tkamppeter> jbicha, these parts are even re-used g-c-c as it uses s-c-p's D-Bus service.
<jbicha> yes, part of s-c-p lives on, but the gui part isn't used by default in most of the big distros now
<tkamppeter> OK, so the GUI which needs to be maintained principally is the one of g-c-c and the one of s-c-p could be faded out sooner or later?
<tkamppeter> jbicha, perhaps I should run a GSoC project in 2018 which turns s-c-p's D-Bus service into a C library and another which adds all functionality missing in the g-c-c GUI but present in s-c-p? WDYT?
<tkamppeter> jbicha, the lib would be GUI-toolkit-independent and hosted at OpenPrinting and all desktops (GNOME/GTK, KDE/Qt, ...) would use this lib.
<jbicha> I think the hope is that the s-c-p button we're adding be a temporary workaround that we'd try to not need for 18.04 LTS
<jbicha> GSOC 2018 would be too late for that goal
<jbicha> the tricky part about "adding all functioinality missing" is that we need to work with the GNOME designers who maybe don't want all those settings there
<tkamppeter> OK.
<tkamppeter> jbicha, so my idea is more some long-term idea.
<jbicha> tkamppeter: cups-filter is blocked on cups autopkgtest http://autopkgtest.ubuntu.com/packages/c/cups/artful/amd64
#ubuntu-desktop 2017-09-20
<jibel> good morning
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<jibel> salut oSoMoN
<didrocks> good morning
<didrocks> salut jibel, oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> salut jibel
<oSoMoN> salut didrocks
<jibel> salut didrocks
<seb128> salut les frenchies, oSoMoN didrocks jibel
<ThorHop[m]> Something that bothers me is that there are very few screenshots in gnome-software...
<jamesh> oSoMoN: fyi: my branch adding host system font access for snaps got merged to master.  That probably means it'll be generally available in snapd-2.29
<oSoMoN> salut seb128
<oSoMoN> jamesh, yes, Iâve seen the branch land, thanks!
<oSoMoN> Iâll be eagerly waiting for it to be released
<jamesh> oSoMoN: it should only require you to plug the "desktop" interface, so apps should pick this up by default as they move to the new interface
<seb128> jamesh, did you land the complete work? like if you plug to the desktop interface all the host fonts are bindmounted for you?
<seb128> the pr I saw was just adding the mountdir but not doing any actual mounting
<seb128> jamesh, oh and hey btw :-)
<jamesh> seb128: yeah.  There were two parts: (1) adding the empty directories as mount points to the core snap, and (2) updating the desktop interface to actually do the bind mounts
<jamesh> seb128: (2) is what just landed
<seb128> ah nice
<seb128> good to know they are open to that as well
<seb128> do you plan to do similar changes for other things
<jamesh> this is just in master right now though, so you'd need to compile your own snapd until it is released
<seb128> like maybe mimetypes
<jamesh> seb128: I want to solve theming, but that is a little more complex
<seb128> k, that one would be good
<jamesh> I'm not sure whether exposing the host shared-mime-info makes sense
<jamesh> we should work out a way to avoid the rebuild that the desktop-helpers part does though
<seb128> right
<jamesh> the host system mime database is going to be a combination of the base shared-mime-info and stuff provided by installed applications
<jamesh> (a) it's not clear we want confined apps to know everything that's installed out of the sandbox, and (b) it's not clear that they could meaningfully use that info
<jamesh> (e.g. they can't launch those apps directly)
<seb128> right
<seb128> well, that's not an important part to resolve now in any case, theme is higher priority for sure
<seb128> oh other topic
<seb128> jamesh, did you see bug #1715662?
<ubot5> bug 1715662 in gnome-control-center (Ubuntu) "Network Connectivity Checking does not turn gray when toggle is set to Off" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1715662
<seb128> jamesh, and did you forget to send your weekly summary for the meeting yesterday or did that just got lost on the way?
<seb128> sorry for the dump of questions :-)
<jamesh> seb128: I had seen that bug.  The code is supposed to be doing delayed update, but obviously isn't quite working right.  I forgot to send through my update yesterday.
<seb128> jamesh, l_aney has a review comment pointing to a code error which he thinks explains the issue, can you have a look to that and comment back at least? even if you don't have slots to work on a fix atm
<jamesh> seb128: sure.
<seb128> thanks
<Laney> hooooooooooooooooooooooo
<didrocks> hey ho Laney
<seb128> hey Laney, how are you?
<Laney> hey didrocks seb128
<Laney> I'm gooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooood
<seb128> :-)
<Laney> you?
<seb128> I'm good as well, had a good night and was up feeling fresh and ready to work at 7am
<seb128> already got quite some work done
<seb128> and I'm playing tennis tonight :-)
<willcooke> morning all.  I'm on child care for a little bit this morning.  Should be back in about 15 mins
<Laney> 7am wtf
<seb128> lol
<seb128> hey willcooke
<seb128> good luck with the kids
<Laney> moin willcooke
<c-lobrano> morning all 0/
<seb128> hey c-lobrano
<jibel> I'm looking at bug 1718285 and trying to confirm it. It seems that it's caused by the uim module under wayland. I installed uim but would anyone know how to enable it? I found nothing to configure input methods in control center
<ubot5> bug 1718285 in nautilus (Ubuntu) "nautilus crashed with SIGSEGV in XGetModifierMapping()" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1718285
<willcooke> back
<seb128> jibel, GTK_IM_MODULE=uim <cmd>
<seb128> hey willcooke
<jibel> thanks
<seb128> jibel, I wanted to look at that but I'm currently under an x11 session and can't restart
<seb128> jibel, the bt is gtk2 so find something gtk2ish
<seb128> ignore that it's nautilus
<seb128> and gtk3
<seb128> I saw a similar on gtk2 earlier
<seb128> ah, no, it's the retrace
<seb128> im_module_init (type_module=0x55a287902100) at ../../gtk2/immodule/gtk-im-uim.c:1808
<seb128> I wonder if uim is wrongly built and install the gtk2 module in the gtk3 dir
<seb128> seems not
<willcooke> koza, seb128 let's skip again today.  duflu is out and nothing new to report on the current bluez stack I think
<seb128> willcooke, koza, +1
<willcooke> oh, except, I havent looked, but do you know if the fix for that bluetooth exploit is released to Xenial?
 * willcooke now looks
<seb128> willcooke, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/bluez/5.37-0ubuntu5.1
<jibel> seb128, the gtk2 module is installed in the gtk2 dir and GTK_IM_MODULE=uim nautiluse crashes nautilus immediately
<koza> willcooke, breaks my heart but yeah we can skip
 * willcooke sends koza some flowers
<koza> it is released, snap is following
<willcooke> thanks seb128
<seb128> willcooke, yw!
 * koza koza has lags, is uploading kernel at 34.00 KiB/s 
<willcooke> :(
<seb128> jibel, the uim bug is https://github.com/uim/uim/issues/71
<jibel> thanks, I'll update lp
<seb128> refresh first
<seb128> I did some changes to the bug
<jibel> ok
<oSoMoN> chrisccoulson, hey, have you had a chance to check the chromium update (61.0.3163.79) in the stage ppa?
<jamesh> seb128: this should fix up the gnome-control-center issue: https://code.launchpad.net/~jamesh/gnome-control-center/ubuntu-bug-1715662/+merge/331038
<seb128> jamesh, great, thanks
<didrocks> jbicha: FYI, tried the pkexec patch, but it only has effects on Xorg session, so I think we can wait for .1 :)
<seb128> bah, tb segfaults on start for me now
<chrisccoulson> oSoMoN, yeah, I'm working on it
<oSoMoN> thanks!
<seb128> restarting
<jbicha> seb128: hi, I guess we want NM 1.8.4 (released today) ? https://cgit.freedesktop.org/NetworkManager/NetworkManager/tree/NEWS/?h=nm-1-8
<jbicha> in case it helps with new gnome-control-center shell crashes?
<seb128> jbicha, hey, sure
<seb128> jbicha, I was going to ask you if you knew of a ppa with 1.10
<seb128> jbicha, the NEWS doesn't sound like it fixes the g-c-c issue though
<Laney> nah, master is still buggy, I tried with NM/g-c-c from git using jhbuild
<seb128> Laney, would be useful if you say so on #control-center :-)
<seb128> also good to mention
<seb128> I was about to spend time on that
<Laney> I just did mention it
<Laney> I literally just did that so this is not a case of me failing to tell you
<seb128> right, and I just thanked you for doing so :-)
<Laney> ok
<Laney> feel free to spend time on it
<Laney> I'm going to have lunch
<seb128> sorry, messages don't get through IRC easily sometime
<seb128> thanks for testing!
<seb128> I don't have a jhbuild handy around
<jbicha> it feels to me like the old g-c-c shell doesn't crash as much but I don't use the old shell as much either
<seb128> so I was going to start some manual building figuring out build options and such
<seb128> jbicha, do you have any idea what we do about that cups-filters/qpdf issue?
<jbicha> seb128: I thought tkamppeter fixed it (LP: #1718215) with cups-filters 1.17.7 but that's stuck in artful-proposed because of cups autopkgtest failures
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1718215 in cups-filters (Ubuntu) "versions of cups-filters and libqpdf do not match" [Critical,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1718215
<seb128> jbicha, right, the "blocked in proposed because of cups autopkg" is the issue
<jbicha> I FAIL stderr: /usr/bin/lp: Unsupported document-format "application/pdf"
<seb128> Till is away for travel/visiting of NY/w.e now
<seb128> right
<jbicha> I don't know
<seb128> I emailed Till about it
<seb128> but he said the cups-filters update should fix that
<seb128> jbicha, should we revert the qpdf update
<seb128> ?
<jbicha> the tests pass in Debian https://ci.debian.net/packages/c/cups/unstable/amd64/
<c-lobrano> does anybody knows why compiling mutter 3.24.4 I got this error http://paste.ubuntu.com/25578901/ ?
<seb128> jbicha, that's good to know but doesn't help us much?
<c-lobrano> *does anybody know
<jbicha> revert qpdf to what? qpdf 7b1 has been in artful for a few weeks
<seb128> that version works
<seb128> the issue is that they changed a symbol between 7b1 and 7
<seb128> c-lobrano, I don't
<c-lobrano> seb128: ok, thanks anyway
<seb128> jbicha, it's probably more productive to fix the issue but it's a bit annoying that it's when Till is travelling :-/
<c-lobrano> Trevinho, maybe :)
<seb128> c-lobrano, or the gnome channels
<c-lobrano> seb128: I've tried in gnome-shell already, but no luck
<jk^> hi all please, how to request a cancellation of a pastebin pasted for error? on paste.ubuntu.com?
<seb128> jk^, you can't easily, https://askubuntu.com/questions/406275/i-would-like-to-delete-an-accidental-post-i-did-on-paste-ubuntu-com-while-using suggest filing an ubuntu rt
<jbicha> didrocks: do you know why the Ubuntu session uses org.gnome.mutter gsettings instead of org.gnome.shell.overrides like the GNOME session does?
<jbicha> it makes configuring dynamic-workspaces or attach-modal-dialog etc. more complicated with Tweaks
<seb128> jbicha, I think it has to do with the use of a gnome-shell mode
<seb128> I don't remember the details though
<didrocks> jbicha: because this is the thing which was hackish in org.gnome.shell.overrides
<didrocks> jbicha: and upstream is ging to remove it now that we have per-session overrides
<didrocks> (per desktop rather)
<didrocks> jbicha: basically, in tweaks, you should just take the gsettings value, so it's actually easier
<jbicha> didrocks: I should do what?
<didrocks> jbicha: nothing, normally, the settings are just the base ones, org.gnome.mutter
<didrocks> and it will be the same for GNOME classic soon
<didrocks> (the patches are already ready by Florian)
<jbicha> didrocks: it sounds to me like you're saying that this will be easier for 3.28 but what should I do for 3.26?
<jbicha> a related bug is https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=786311
<ubot5> Gnome bug 786311 in general "Ineffective "static workspaces" setting" [Critical,New]
<didrocks> jbicha: you can test session and special case ubuntu if you want to support it
<didrocks> jbicha: knowing that in 3.28, you sohuld just have to listen on org.gnome.mutter
<didrocks> we are really getting a ton of positive comments on my blog post suite
<didrocks> the last one being:
<didrocks> "Wow, I have just tried it out, you know, Ubuntu 17.10 ... and it looks very nice! Works like a charm!
<didrocks> The animations in GNOME 3.26 when maximizing windows etc. also work great. Together with the modifications for Ubuntu, it all looks very posh!"
<kenvandine> :-D
 * didrocks was more expecting 50/50 feedbacks, but it's overall 80/20 of positive feedbacks
<cyphermox> willcooke: ping about the mascott for slideshow :)
<didrocks> jbicha: do you mind answer on a Tweak question on https://didrocks.fr/2017/09/20/ubuntu-gnome-shell-in-artful-day-13/#comment-3526266138? I can't think of anything blocking anyone installing an extension on Tweaksâ¦
<didrocks> apart from "can't disable extensions being part of a mode" ofc
<willcooke> cyphermox, HEY!
<willcooke> oops
<willcooke> sorry for caps
<cyphermox> ahaha
<willcooke> I added the mascot to the xcf file in the source
<willcooke> and also, lemme find the bug
<willcooke> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-themes/+bug/1717309
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1717309 in ubuntu-themes (Ubuntu) "17.10 Artful Aardvark Mascot" [Undecided,New]
<Trevinho> Laney, seb128: hey... I finally was able to fix all the compile issues, test failures and arch-related troubles (the only "bad thing" i had to accept was disabling -Werror in armhf and ppc64)... s390x doesn't go, but it never went and I guess we don't care. So if you agree, feel free to publish https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/2892
<Trevinho> So I can proceed back porting the important fixes on lockscreen to Xenial
<seb128> Trevinho, good, I do that
<willcooke> Trevinho, was anyone able to test and recreate?
<willcooke> on U7 that is
<Trevinho> willcooke: what you refer to?
<willcooke> Trevinho, the lock screen / desktop flashing up for a couple of seconds
<Trevinho> willcooke: ah andyrock had it iirc
<cyphermox> willcooke: cool!
<seb128> Trevinho, Laney,the publishing fails because of the missing s390x builds it seems
<Trevinho> In the past it was ignored... I don't know how to mark that
<Trevinho> There's a default that I can't reproduce and also valgrind doesn't complain... I can ignore tests there too... But, I guess we can just ignore the arch
<seb128> yeah, unsure how to ignore
<seb128> maybe manual pocket copy
<tjaalton> does super+up/down work for someone, to maximize/minimize windows? doesn't work for me
<tjaalton> left/right does
<Trevinho> seb128: probably...
<seb128> tjaalton, wfm under wayland
<tjaalton> seb128: ok, must be a hw issue on this beta laptop then..
<tjaalton> or something
<jibel> super+up/down doesn't work on X, but ctrl+super+up/down does
<seb128> what keybindings are listed in settings?
<tjaalton> jibel: yeah that works here too, and I'm on wayland
<jibel> ah, the settings was modified. After a reset super+up/down works
<jibel> I don't remember I modified it or looong time ago
<tjaalton> me neither
<didrocks> never opened ccsm in the unity times?
<jibel> it's keybindings inherited from unity7
<didrocks> ccsm had the nasty effect to "write" some default keys and so, became non defaults
<didrocks> (and so, new defaults aren't applied)
<jibel> default zesty installation ctrl+super+up/down maximizes/restores the windows but only super+up/down on artful/g-shell
<jibel> so on an upgraded system keybindings are different than a default artful installation
<tjaalton> ok, i'll blame ccsm
<tjaalton> looks like I got gnome set up pretty much the way I had unity7, but missing alt+f2 which had a history :)
<tjaalton> and some weirdness with a n*n workspace grid where some shortcuts think it's still a vertical array of workspaces
<tjaalton> but that's just a bug
<tjaalton> all in all, artful is looking good :)
<GunnarHj> seb128, jbicha: Hi guys, I think I made the adjustments of the ubuntu-seeds MP which we talked about yesterday, including an adjustment of l-s. Any remaining issues/questions, or is any of you ready to merge the thing?
<GunnarHj> https://code.launchpad.net/~gunnarhj/ubuntu-seeds/ubuntu.artful_cjkv-fixes/+merge/329857
<seb128> GunnarHj, I'm not familiar enough with that to merge it without spending some time trying to understand what it does exactly and I don't have slots for that atm
<Laney> Trevinho: looks like the last release does build on s390x q
<seb128> GunnarHj, while you are here, could you have a look to the UIFe on https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell-extension-ubuntu-dock/+bug/1713712 ?
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1713712 in gnome-shell-extension-ubuntu-dock (Ubuntu) "[UIFe, FFe] Provide Unity Launcher API" [Medium,New]
<jbicha> GunnarHj: the MP looks good to me. Speaking of UIFe's, I was going to email the lists soon for LP: #1718083
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1718083 in gnome-control-center (Ubuntu) "UIFe: Add Additional Printer Settings button" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1718083
<seb128> Laney, can you force skip over the cups-filters autopkgtest for cups failure? I emailed Till about it and he had a look and wrote "This is not a bug, this is a specialty PPD for Braille embossers which does not support PDF input. The autopkgtest of CUPS (debian/tests/cups in CUPS source package) needs some kind of override"
<seb128> jbicha, ^
<didrocks> GunnarHj: you should never have said "hi" :)
<seb128> :-)
<GunnarHj> didrocks, seb128: Wasn't aware of the implied code in that word. :)
<seb128> hehe
<didrocks> :p
<jbicha> seb128: so maybe Debian's autopkgtest didn't fail because they don't have cups-filter 1.17.7 with the extra braille stuff?
<Laney> seb128: if it's normal then the test shouldn't fail on it
<seb128> jbicha, right
<seb128> Laney, right, that's the "needs some kind of override" part
<seb128> Laney, but qpdf migrated to artful screwing cups-filters/cups on the way
<seb128> and Tiil is travelling to NY on having days off to visit
<seb128> so he's off until eow
<seb128> so either we keep cups broken in artful for the week
<seb128> or we skip over the test for that one
<seb128> and Till can do the test fix next week
<seb128> Laney, ^
<Laney> that thing you pasted doesn't sound like he's planning to fix cups
<seb128> the issue is not a real issue but an imperfect test so I would argue in favor of skipping and fixing the archive
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Added a comment on 1718083. Will you merge the ubuntu-seeds MP?
<Laney> yes, well, everyone always argues in favour of skipping over regressions rather than fixing things
<seb128> Laney, let me forward you the emails, I didn't want to spam IRC too much
<jbicha> seb128: did cups-filters just need a rebuild against qpdf? if so, maybe going back to 1.17.5 would be easier now
<seb128> jbicha, that would be a solution I guess
<seb128> Laney, I fowarded you the email, let me know what you want to do
<seb128> options are
<seb128> - keep artful buggy until somebody fixes the cups test (not likely this week)
<seb128> - delete the cups-filters and do a no change rebuild from the old version
<seb128> - skip over the test for now and fix properly next week
<seb128> afaik
<jibel> option 1 is not an option: buggy mean "no printing at all"
<GunnarHj> seb128: Added a comment on 1713712.
<jibel> so it's either revert or force the publication
<seb128> jibel, well it's an option, even if you don't like it
<seb128> I didn't say it was a good option
<jibel> you cannot reasonably keep printing broken for a week
<seb128> that's not the option I favorite
<seb128> agreed
<seb128> but I can't be bothered going backward
<seb128> and L_aney is not liking skips
<seb128> so we might just end up there
<seb128> jbicha, thanks for merging GunnarHj's changes
<seb128> I'm going to ask Till to set up an autopkgtest for qpdf as well
<seb128> so next time it doesn't migrate screwing up cups-filters/cups
<willcooke> It's probably worth pinging Till on email anyway, he might get a few mins here and there in the hotel before he goes out adventuring
<seb128> willcooke, I did, he debugged the issue
<seb128> well figured out what the problem is
<seb128> it's not a bug in the runtime, just a test that is being done over braille ppds which are special cases and shouldn't be tested in that conext
<seb128> context
<seb128> I don't think he's going to have the slots to do the packaging changes today though and he's off tomorrow/friday and I don't think it's important enough to ask him to take time on his days off to work
<willcooke> yeah, I mean he might fix the tests this week
<willcooke> worth asking is all I mean
<seb128> right, let me do that
<Laney> it would be easy for anyone to update /usr/share/cups/test-drivers to skip that brail [4~ even if that's temporaryledriver
<Laney> i'm having a really hard time IRCing atm, sorry
<Laney> don't even know if these messages are getting through
<seb128> Laney, they do
<seb128> thanks for the suggestion
<seb128> I emailed Till asking about that
<seb128> oSoMoN, you should probably change back the GNOME bug about the screen config being lost from needinfo to new since you provided the info
<oSoMoN> seb128, I was kind of expecting the person who asked for more info to do that, and it seems I can only change it to RESOLVED
<seb128> oh ok
<seb128> oSoMoN, ignore me then, sometime it acts as a small nudging but I didn't remember the status was locked
<Laney> managed to pass about 3 packets
<Laney> others in this room aren't having problems
<Laney> :/
<seb128> :-/
<seb128> Laney, time to use your 3g? ;-)
<Laney> can't tether on that
<Laney> ok, seems a bit better now
<seb128> wb!
<willcooke> cyphermox, lol @ aardvarkify
<oSoMoN> kenvandine, remember those /dev/shm/org.chromium.XXXXXX denials in the firefox snap? looks like firefox uses some chromium code for IPC, and they didn't bother modifying the namespaceâ¦ https://hg.mozilla.org/mozilla-central/file/tip/ipc/chromium/src/base/file_util_posix.cc
<seb128> Laney, you probably know that but just to give a confirmation, your n-m change fixes the g-c-c/unlock segfault for me
<seb128> Laney, do you plan to handle the n-m upload with the vpn patch and yours once they are accepted?
<Laney> seb128: can do if necessary
<seb128> Laney, that would be nice :-)
<kenvandine> oSoMoN, indeed
<kenvandine> oSoMoN, do you think that's related to the problem?
<oSoMoN> kenvandine, I think so, yes
<Trevinho> Laney: hey, you saw my ping of before?
<Trevinho> it's still valid, though I triggered a rebuild of the silo as I missed a commit
<Laney> Trevinho: yes, you said that s390x doesn't build, right?
<Laney> the last build in artful does have an s390x build so that's probably why it's complaining
<Trevinho> Laney: well, it's libnux that doesn't
<Trevinho> it builds
<Trevinho> but... it segfaults in a test
<Trevinho> and I can't really debug it
<Trevinho> valgrind is ok with it here
<Laney> doesn't matter why, just that's the reason I think
<Laney> so you probably need an archive admin to help you remove it or something
<Trevinho> Laney: so... you suggest me to disable the tests and get it done, or ask for the removal?
<Laney> I don't think there's much point building something that is totally/mostly broken
<Laney> so maybe remove it
<Laney> but you need to check for things which depend or build-depend on it too
<Trevinho> I guess only unity
<Trevinho> ype
<Trevinho> sil2100: can you help with that? ^
<Trevinho> or didrocks... but he's out now :(
<Trevinho> ah, seb128 too, no?
 * Trevinho goes through the list of admins :-D
<ricotz> oSoMoN, regarding firefox, this looks troublesome indeed
<oSoMoN> good night all
<qengho> yo
<jbicha> qengho: hi! I hope Irma wasn't too bad for you
<qengho> jbicha: Hi! Thanks! I barely felt it because I moved 3000 miles away.
<jbicha> oh, that works
<kenvandine> yay, auto-connection for gnome-3-26-1604 granted :)
<kenvandine> jdstrand, thx!
<kenvandine> seb128, ^^
<jdstrand> yw
<jdstrand> kenvandine: curious if you are doing one for gnome-3-24-1604?
<kenvandine> jdstrand, i could easily
<kenvandine> jdstrand, but not sure we need/want it now that we have 3.26
<kenvandine> less to maintain this way, we'll do one for 3.28 when it's out then we'll have multiple versions to maintain
<kenvandine> so lets not start with extra baggage :)
<jbicha> seb128: could you subscribe desktop-bugs to ibus-table-chinese and mozc? this is follow-up from GunnarHj's seed change
<jdstrand> kenvandine: wfm. perhaps you will want to have the snap removed if you are abandoning it (once you move your stuff off of it). just for your consideration
<kenvandine> jdstrand, yeah, that's a good idea
<jackpot51> So, there are serious HiDPI regressions on 3.26 with Xorg. These are visible in the Artful installer.
<jackpot51> Has anybody seen these?
<seb128> jackpot51, report bugs on launchpad?
<seb128> jbicha, I didn't follow, we need MIRs for new ibus things? is that for locales that were used fcitx?
<seb128> mozc is already in main, why do you need desktop-bugs subscribed?
<seb128> same for ibus-table-chinese
<jbicha> seb128: oh that makes sense since they were 'supported', but shouldn't there be a bug subsciber? I was looking at component-mismatches
<Trevinho> kenvandine: hey, can you give a look to https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/ubuntu-themes/vertical-linked-buttons-tuning/+merge/330958 ?
#ubuntu-desktop 2017-09-21
<didrocks> good morning
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<didrocks> hey seb128
<seb128> re didrocks
<jibel> good morning
<seb128> hey jibel
<jibel> salut seb128
<seb128> jibel, cups should be fixed in artful, let me know if you have the chance to try the update this morning
<jibel> seb128, I tried the version in proposed yesterday and it worked fine
<seb128> great
<seb128> well it migrated 3 hours ago
<seb128> so we should be good
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<didrocks> salut oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> salut jibel, seb128
<didrocks> hey jibel
<seb128> lut oSoMoN
<jibel> although I've a crash of evince when I print a specific document but I don't think it's related
<oSoMoN> salut didrocks
<seb128> jibel, can you share the document?
<seb128> at least privately?
<jibel> sure
<seb128> thanks
<jibel> seb128, in your inbox
<seb128> jibel, thanks, I can confirm the segfault
<seb128> let me look a bit at the stacktrace/get debug info
<seb128> jibel, that nautilus segfault is specific to videos?
<jibel> seb128, I couldn't reproduce with other types
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> indeed I can confirm
<jibel> seb128, there is a reference to vaapi in the trace
<seb128> well I just did it on a mp3
<jibel> didn't crash for me with an mp3
<seb128> so I think it's a bug in the totem extension
<seb128> ah
<seb128> well it does for me
<seb128> I'm going to assume it's the same bug in totem
<seb128> well at least start from that one and then test with videos
<jibel> there is a similar crash in shotwell
<seb128> jibel, when doing what?
<jibel> seb128, reported in LP
<jibel> I didn't try to reproduce it yet
<seb128> k
<jibel> in a call right now, i'll come back to it later
<jibel> seb128, actually I just opened shotwell under wayland and it crashed
<seb128> jibel, evince segfault reported upstream as https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=102922
<ubot5> Freedesktop bug 102922 in pdf backend "evince abrt on a double free in cairo_truetype_font_destroy" [Normal,New]
<jibel> thanks
<seb128> jibel, shotwell works fine under wayland here but I don't have lot of photos on that machine
<seb128> oh
<seb128> could be videos there as well
 * seb128 going to try that a bit later
<seb128> but I need to step out for some hours, shifting those to the evening today
<jibel> seb128, I uploaded the crash to bug 1718595 lets see if it 's the same trace
<ubot5> bug 1718595 in shotwell (Ubuntu) "shotwell crashed with SIGSEGV" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1718595
<seb128> thanks
<Laney> moin
<didrocks> hey Laney
<Laney> sup didrocks
<jibel> seb128, shotwell crashes in the video reader
<didrocks> Laney: nothing special, and you?
<Laney> mmm not much
<Laney> the sky is about 10cm off the ground today
<didrocks> waow, blue sky here and sun :)
<jibel> there used to be a setting to start a vpn automatically when a specific connection comes up. Where is it?
<jibel> I cannot find it in the network or vpn settings
<Trevinho> seb128: so, Laney suggested to remove the s390x nux/unity build from the archive...
<Trevinho> hey by the way :-)
<Trevinho> seb128: you can do that or who can?
 * didrocks needs to add multiple 'Add printers button' as the g-c-c panel is using a gtkstack
<didrocks> waow, system config printer is buggy in term of refresh with our theme
<didrocks> drawing artefacts and such
<didrocks> ah, the language support button isn't aligned right, let's ensure we align right all additional buttons as I suggested
 * didrocks cleans up the .ui patch as well for language support
<didrocks> (useless placeholders)
<Trevinho> didrocks: hey, you can also help with removal of nux/unity builds for s360x? :)
<didrocks> Trevinho: sure, did you check all rdepends?
<didrocks> just open a bug and list all binary packages that needs to be removed please :)
<Trevinho> didrocks: yeah, it only has unity
<Trevinho> well or... unity itself let me see
<didrocks> Trevinho: still, list all binaries package, there is libunity-core* and so on, please
<Trevinho> didrocks: on what project?
<didrocks> Trevinho: whatever, can against unity source package
<Trevinho> It was probably just easier to disable the tests :-D
<didrocks> and add all binary packages, ensuring there is no rdepends
<Trevinho> ehm, less time consusming
<didrocks> as you wish, but I need to list them all to remove them
<didrocks> so, be nice to the person who is going to remove them :p
<Trevinho> ok
<Trevinho> didrocks: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nux/+bug/1718615
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1718615 in nux (Ubuntu) "Nux doesn't build proprerly in s390x arch" [Undecided,New]
<didrocks> Trevinho: see, asking you was useful, there were the lenses :)
 * Trevinho hopes not to have included too much :-D
<Trevinho> or to less
<didrocks> Trevinho: done!
<didrocks> Trevinho: well, if you followed carefully the rdepends, it should be fine :)
<oSoMoN> when I upgrade my artful amd64 VM (vbox, was up-to-date yesterday), the VM boots but gdm fails to display the login screen
<didrocks> oSoMoN: the french forums report it's since the kernel upgrade to 4.13.0-11-12, maybe try downgrading it?
<oSoMoN> didrocks, thanks, trying that
<jibel> oSoMoN, try to disable wayland in gdm
<Trevinho> didrocks: yes I did but... Some are all
<Trevinho> Trevinho: thanks by the way
<Trevinho> Lol
<oSoMoN> jibel, how do I do that? IÂ don't have a login screen, can't select a session
<Trevinho> didrocks: thanks to you :-)
<jibel> oSoMoN, boot in recovery and uncomment #WaylandEnable=false in /etc/gdm3/custom.conf
<oSoMoN> jibel, ack, trying to downgrade (or rather not upgrade from my previous snapshot) the kernel first, then I'll try that
<oSoMoN> didrocks, not upgrading the kernel works
<didrocks> I guess you can drop a line on #ubuntu-kernele :p
<didrocks> kernel*
<Trevinho> sil2100: hey https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/2892 needs to be published but it doesn't go through because of missing build in s390x. We removed it from the archive, but still status gives errors
<jibel> didrocks, back to the keybindings topic from yesterday ccsm has little to do in the story. I did a fresh zesty install, applied all the updates, upgraded to artful and all the keybindings from unity7 are preserved and considered non-default under gnome-shell
<jibel> didrocks, eg ctrl+super+up/down to maximize/restore instead of super+up/down
<didrocks> jibel: interesting, can you look if the keys are considered as default before the upgrade (and then after the upgrade?)
<didrocks> jibel: there is nothing I know of (maybe Unity/Compiz does?) writing those keys
<didrocks> Trevinho: you may know? ^
<sil2100> Trevinho: hm, are those really removed from the archive?
<sil2100> Trevinho: I don't see any publishing history that would point that either nux or compiz got removed for s390x from artful
<didrocks> sil2100: they, were but indeed, no publishing history for the removal, see bug #1718615
<ubot5> bug 1718615 in nux (Ubuntu) "Nux doesn't build proprerly in s390x arch" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1718615
<didrocks> sil2100: archive skew? I can give a retry
<didrocks> nope
<didrocks> $ ./remove-package -a s390x -b libnux-4.0-0 libnux-4.0-dev libunity-core-6.0-9 libunity-core-6.0-dev unity unity-lens-video unity-lens-music unity-lens-files unity-lens-applications unity-china-music-scope -m "desktop isn't a target for s390x Bug #1718615"
<didrocks> Removing packages from artful:
<didrocks> Could not find binaries for 'libnux-4.0-0/None' in artful .  Exiting.
<didrocks> -> so done for the archive tool
<sil2100> hm, I think bileto is taking the info from LP so maybe it's still a bit too soon for Bileto
<sil2100> Maybe it'll notice once LP notices
<sil2100> Let's give it some more time
<sil2100> btw. last time I remember we wanted to remove unity etc. from s390x there was some opposition (can't remember what though)
<Gargoyle> Found a sneaky bug. Might be able to fill out a proper bug report later with some guidance, but thought I would see if anyone else can recreate.
<Gargoyle> In settings->devices->printers, click the settings icon for a printer and choose "details". The details "modal" opens with virtually no title bar. making it almost impossible to close.
<Gargoyle> I was just about able to right click on the 2 or 3 pixels of menu bar and choose close.
<Gargoyle> https://www.dropbox.com/s/88wh5vcpvq9e1z9/Screenshot%20from%202017-09-21%2012-26-23.png?dl=0
<andyrock> hey seb128 regarding the urgent notification
<andyrock> am I free regarding the design?
<Gargoyle> 17.10, updates last installed in Tuesday (I think)
<seb128> andyrock, hey, what urgent notifications?
<seb128> Trevinho, sorry I have shifted hours today, seems like others helped you with the archive bits though?
<jbicha> Gargoyle: that's LP: #1712011
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1712011 in gnome-control-center (Ubuntu) "Unable to close Printer properties" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1712011
<jbicha> Gargoyle: Esc key is a workaround to close the dialog
<andyrock> seb128: the one you get when an app requires attention
<andyrock> it's not so used
<andyrock> and I don't think it's high priority
<jbicha> Gargoyle: it's an unusual bug because it doesn't happen with GNOME's Adwaita theme
<andyrock> but I can deliver it by the end of today without problems
<jibel> Trevinho, keybindings bug 1718648
<ubot5> bug 1718648 in gsettings-desktop-schemas (Ubuntu) "unity7 keybindings are preserved after upgrade and considered as non-default keybindings" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1718648
<seb128> andyrock, sorry I changed location, yes for that just do whatever looks fine to you, we can change it later if we want
<Gargoyle> jbicha, Thanks for the info. I'll see if I can add anything useful to that bug.
<Gargoyle> Is there another bug to say that printing just doesn't work full stop?
<doko> is there a way to align the workspaces horizontally?
<jibel> Gargoyle, it should be working today. Make sure you have the latest version of cups-filters
<Gargoyle> jibel, Just spotted that in the pending updates, running apt now! :-)
<kenvandine> Trevinho, do you have that in a silo?
<oSoMoN> jibel, didrocks:Â to follow up on my kernel issue: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/1718679
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1718679 in linux (Ubuntu) "Upgrade to 4.13.0-11.12 in artful amd64 VM breaks display on wayland" [Undecided,New]
<seb128> oSoMoN, did you ask about it on #ubuntu-kernel?
<oSoMoN> seb128, I did, sforshee asked me to file a bug and said he would look into it
<seb128> good
<jbicha> seb128: LP: #1718643 is intentional behavior upstream. It can be disabled by turning off Tweaks>Windows>Attach Modal Dialogs
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1718643 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu) "Inability to move child dialogues separate from parent applicaitons" [Low,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1718643
<seb128> jbicha, I know
<seb128> jbicha, still, if users think it's a buggy behaviour they should tell upstream
<seb128> the feedback might lead upstream to think their design has a flaw if that's the case
<seb128> which can't happen without feedback
<jbicha> I don't think that's very useful hereâ¦ but ok
<seb128> yeah, bug trackers might not be the best place to give feedback on the experience
<seb128> but we don't have a better place for that?
<seb128> feel free to redirect them to a mailing list if you think it's more appropriate
<seb128> jbicha, anyway I don't care much either way, my rational was just to try to provide feedback to upstream when users think there is a problem with how things are designed
<jbicha> in this case, I think the behavior is so fundamental to GNOME that it's unlikely to be changed there
<seb128> they can't wontfix it, it's fine
<seb128> can*
<jibel> today my screen is not locked on resume from suspend, anyone else experienced this?
<seb128> I don't
<jibel> hmm, sept. 21 15:54:56 herm gnome-shell[2358]: Screen lock is locked down, not locking
<jibel> from the journal
<oSoMoN> seb128, jibel : I'm seeing the LO snap crash when exporting a presentation to pdf, and there's a cairo_surface_destroy assertion failed message in the console just before the crash, wondering if that could be related to the bug you filed earlier this morning?
<oSoMoN> I need to debug it further anyway
<seb128> oSoMoN, could be, difficult to say without at least a backtrace
<oSoMoN> yup, I'll try to get one
<jibel> disable-lock-screen is set to false, everything looks normal, weird
<seb128> jibel, well the message suggests that it thinks the screen is locked when it's not?
<seb128> GNOME 3.26 is a bit of a disaster :-/
<jibel> seb128, yes something along the line, or that it is disabled
<jibel> which is not the case
<seb128> next cycle we should perhaps avoid the new version
<jibel> and obviously not locked since I'm typing :)
<jbicha> seb128: the biggest problems are gnome-shell and gnome-control-center; unfortunately those are key parts of new GNOME versions :(
<seb128> seems like they didn't really ramp up their quality since we switched
<seb128> jbicha, right, gnome-shell especially those segfault, resolution changes being dismissed
<jbicha> other apps generally are fine
<jibel> gnome-shell and gnome-control-center top 2 on errors.u.c in terms of crashes
<seb128> it's even over me how they can release a "stable version" with those issues
<seb128> especially in a wayland world
<seb128> where a g-s segfault takes your session down
<seb128> they should really care more about fixing bugs or at least keep on top of what gets reported
<seb128> anyway
<seb128> </rant>
<jibel> yeah, now I switch to a vt first, start byobu, then log in gnome-shell and connect to the terminal, otherwise it brings everything down on crahs
<jibel> next cycle we should only focus on stability
<seb128> and stay away from gnome-shell updates
<seb128> I wonder what would be the right venue to tell them they have a quality problem and that they should get on it
<jbicha> GNOME devs hate it when we mix & match GNOME versions but there are good reasonsâ¦
<seb128> right
<jbicha> I wish GNOME did LTS releases
<mdeslaur> https://www.sudosatirical.com/articles/local-man-claims-gnome-is-root-cause-of-world-problems/
<jbicha> although that can backfire a bit for initial stability as devs rush to cram features in at the last moment
<seb128> jibel, did you confirm that "wayland doesn't work in vm with new kernel" issue?
<seb128> like is that impacting everyone?
<seb128> is that specific to vms?
<jbicha> at least GNOME 3.28 will still target mozjs52 so that's one less thing changing
<seb128> right
<Trevinho> kenvandine: no... I can do it or you can. As you wish
<jibel> seb128, no I didn't
<jibel> seb128, it works for me. The main problem is one I reported a while ago with qxl driver
<seb128> ah
<jibel> seb128, it's specific to virtual box
<jibel> it works in qemu
<jibel> yeah, last image with kernel 4.13 works in qemu
<jibel> oSoMoN, did you try to disable wayland in gdm?
<jibel> + latest kernel
<jibel> to narrow the problme down
<oSoMoN> jibel, IÂ did (see bug report), and that "fixed" the issue indeed
<jibel> oSoMoN, k, thanks
<jibel> another one in the wayland queue
<kenvandine> Trevinho, i can create it
<oSoMoN> https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/call-for-testing-libreoffice-5-4-1/2217
<oSoMoN> and https://plus.google.com/+OlivierTilloy/posts/aqMo6c9qrQE
<seb128> oSoMoN, well done on the libreoffice snap update!
<oSoMoN> thanks
<oSoMoN> let's see if the feedback is good enough to promote to stable sometime next week
<oSoMoN> chrisccoulson, chromium-browser fails to build in artful because of changes in glibc, IÂ have a patch for those, let me push that to a PPA near you
<oSoMoN> actually it's gonna have to be 61.0.3163.91, the latest stable
<oSoMoN> chrisccoulson, chromium-browser 61.0.3163.91-0ubuntu1.1374 currently building in https://launchpad.net/~osomon/+archive/ubuntu/chromium-stable/+packages , it should be safe to copy to artful-proposed as I've already tested that patch against the beta and dev branches, and the build is already past the point where it failed
<Laney> see you later
<Trevinho> sil2100: Laney tried to publish it actually (https://bileto.ubuntu.com/log/2892/publish/2/), but it failed... Should I clearout the silo or are there other tricks?
<seb128> Trevinho, we should probably just pocket copy
<oSoMoN> gânight all
#ubuntu-desktop 2017-09-22
<Trevinho> kenvandine: https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/2965 is fine now, if you want to test, feel free :)
<didrocks> good morning
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<didrocks> re seb128
<seb128> wtf, I'm building cairo from src and can't preload/ld_library_path load it
<seb128> $ LD_LIBRARY_PATH=./src/.libs /usr/bin/evince
<seb128>  /usr/bin/evince: error while loading shared libraries: libcairo.so.2: failed to map segment from shared object
<seb128> $ file src/.libs/libcairo.so.2.11509.0
<seb128> src/.libs/libcairo.so.2.11509.0: ELF 64-bit LSB shared object, x86-64, version 1 (SYSV), dynamically linked, BuildID[sha1]=32843f2d9e71e3d100c17563055418cae80c34c0, with debug_info, not stripped
<jibel> good morning
<seb128> lut jibel
<jibel> salut seb128
<seb128> shrug; fck
<seb128> of course it's apparmor
<seb128> quite confusing, why didn't I think about that yesterday evening
<seb128> I poked around for 15 minutes on google and decided to restart a new build fresh this morning
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<seb128> lut oSoMoN, joyeux vendredi !
<seb128> didrocks, jibel, Ã  vous aussi ;-)
<oSoMoN> salut seb128, didrocks, jibel
<didrocks> salut jibel & oSoMoN
<flexiondotorg> Bonjour desktopers
<seb128> hey flexiondotorg
<oSoMoN> bonjour flexiondotorg
<willcooke> morning!
<didrocks> good morning willcooke! Feeling better today?
<oSoMoN> morning willcooke!
<Laney> ahoy
<didrocks> hey hey Laney
<Laney> can't resolve DNS for my server this morning
<Laney> WEIRD
<Laney> hi didrocks, happy friday!
<didrocks> happy Friday and network debugging Laney :)
<willcooke> didrocks, yeah better.  Still coughing, so the people on the plane will be happy with me :)
<didrocks> that's the only reason I'm travelling via Paris and not London, to avoid you :)
<didrocks> (ok, maybe the fact that there is no reason for me to travel for 6h to go to London plays a little bit as wellâ¦) ;)
<willcooke> ha
<jamesh> About 14 hours until my first flight
<willcooke> safe travels jamesh
<willcooke> duflu and tkamppeter are probably there already
<jamesh> It'll be one long Saturday for me
<willcooke> I looked at the bus thing as advised by the hotel, it takes > 1hr to get from the airport to the hotel.  vs taxi @ 30 mins
<willcooke> Seems that the transfer time is inversely proportional to the number of timss they say "fast" on their web site
<didrocks> yeah, need to find people arriving at the same time though
<willcooke> yeah
<didrocks> ah, I thought andyrock is, but not the same airport apparently :p
<seb128> hey willcooke Laney, happy friday
<willcooke> hi seb128!
 * Laney nods seb128 
<Laney> what happen
<jamesh> I think I'll just take the Airporter: I can deal with paying now, and it's not like I'll be doing anything for the rest of the night
<sil2100> Someone set us up the bomb
<sil2100> All your base are belong to us
<Laney> should probably tell ubuntukylin their ISOs don't build
<seb128> Laney, it's rainy friday and I'm still dealing with a stack of GNOME segfaults :-/
<Laney> ah
<seb128> totem, evince, cairo, nautilus
<Laney> those are the fun ones to fix!
<seb128> fun
<seb128> indeed
<Laney> well
<Laney> at least you get a trace most of the time :P
<seb128> Laney, you should perhaps upload your n-m fixes even if they have not been reviewed? otherwise we might have g-c-c quite not usable for beta :-/
<seb128> right, I'm able to reproduce most of those issues
<seb128> which is good
<seb128> oh, I forgot gvfsd-mtp and gst-vaapi :p
<Laney> vaapi eh
<seb128> yeah...
<seb128> I've been good responses from upstream on most issues which is nice
<seb128> I wish that was the case for our current gnome-shell bugs as well :-/
<seb128> that starts getting me concerned for the release
<seb128> Laney, ah, you didn't reply to my question about n-m patches before beta earlier, but looks like you are getting a review so we might be able to cherrypick some commited changes :-)
<Laney> laney@artful (ubuntu|â¦)> git pull                                        ~/dev/canonical/packaging/desktop/gstreamer/gst-plugins-bad1.0
<Laney> Already up-to-date.
<Laney> laney@artful (ubuntu|â¦)> head -1 debian/changelog                        ~/dev/canonical/packaging/desktop/gstreamer/gst-plugins-bad1.0
<Laney> gst-plugins-bad1.0 (1.12.2-1ubuntu1) artful; urgency=medium
<Laney> laney@artful (ubuntu|â¦)> rmadison -sartful -asource gst-plugins-bad1.0   ~/dev/canonical/packaging/desktop/gstreamer/gst-plugins-bad1.0 gst-plugins-bad1.0 | 1.12.2-1ubuntu3 | artful/universe | source
<Laney> HMMMMMMMMMMMMMM!
<Laney> seb128: yeah I pinged upstream, sry for not replying to you
<seb128> no worry
<seb128> thx
<seb128> ah, people who don't commit to the packaging vcs..
<seb128> doh, one being me it seems :-/
<seb128> Laney, sorry about that, I sponsored for duflu but overlooked that there was a vcs
<Laney> nm
<seb128> I though we didn't have one for gst
<Laney> nobody else uses it either
<seb128> I should know better and check
<Laney> except a_beato when he was working on touch patches
<Laney> â¥
<seb128> :-)
<didrocks> we should fix our vcs workflow anyway while we are in NY
 * didrocks is a little bit tired of debian/ only branches when working on patches
<didrocks> I guess evaluating and taking the ubuntu one in the wiki
<Laney> I think there's some rbasak/nacc talks/sessions about git-ubuntu
 * Laney would be ok with using that
<didrocks> yep
<didrocks> at ubuntucon
<Laney> ...next week...
<didrocks> need to watch it anyway
<Laney> nod
 * willcooke adds didrocks to the meeting
<Laney> don't think that is a workshop on how to use it as a user if that's what you are expecting
<seb128> there is a meeting to discuss git usage
<seb128> what Laney said
<didrocks> willcooke: there is a meeting planned for that?
 * didrocks probably lost the tab of meetings :p
<didrocks> etoomanytabs
<seb128> didrocks, I got an invite this morning for one, I think that's what will was referring to when he said he was adding you
<didrocks> ah ok ;)
<willcooke> what he said
<didrocks> got it now, thanks!
<seb128> on that note lunch time, bbl
<Laney> oh aptly
<Laney> if only you didn't take eleventy squillion years to publish you'd be so great
<Laney> actually, you're still great, but that would make you better
<seb128> Laney, who were you asking for what they think (and about what?) on bug #1713712
<ubot5> bug 1713712 in gnome-shell-extension-ubuntu-dock (Ubuntu) "[UIFe, FFe] Provide Unity Launcher API" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1713712
<Laney> whoever wants to push for the change
<Laney> what is what to do about it not being reviewed and being beta soon and close to the release
<seb128> Laney, I would +1 to land the changes in artful now/on sunday|monday (before beta), I've been using them without issues for some days and the code got some first reviews
<Laney> write that on the bug please
<seb128> k
<seb128> done
<seb128> Laney, I don't understand how people can work with GNOME without any indication of "events"
<seb128> like incoming emails and such
<seb128> but that's my workflow and I guess others are differents
<seb128> so it might not be as important to get that I personally think :-)
<Laney> the feature is an okay ide
<Laney> a
<Laney> I'm more concerned from the release team side about increasing the potential bug surface
<seb128> right, tricky choice
<seb128> stability vs usability
<jbicha> didrocks: if you're talking about vcs for GNOME packages, Debian is "almost" ready to switch from svn to git, talk to Laney about that
<jbicha> and it's easy to have extra branches for Ubuntu series' and the git repos will include the source (it's not just debian/ only)
<seb128> jbicha, at the same time it seems some people are working on an equivalent to udd with git for ubuntu, like all sources with a standard workflow on launchpad
<seb128> which is compelling as well
<jbicha> for packages where we are in sync or nearly so, I think working in Debian git is better; for stuff like gnome-shell maybe the new Ubuntu git repo is better?
<seb128> yeah, let's see in practice what the workflows are etc
<andyrock> seb128: the fix  for this https://bugs.launchpad.net/gnome-shell/+bug/1696621  has been merged upstream
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1696621 in mutter (Ubuntu) "Desktop icons slip under the top bar and dock" [Medium,In progress]
<andyrock> we might need to use a debian patch for this
<andyrock> what do you think?
<seb128> andyrock, great, thanks
<andyrock> quilt right?
<seb128> andyrock, we should probably either backport it or snapshot git a bit latter
<seb128> depending of the number of changes we would like to backport
<seb128> we are probably going to get .1 before release but we want the fixes before beta for important/visible issues
<seb128> jbicha, ^ opinion?
<jbicha> seb128: either way is fine
<jbicha> since gnome-shell uses meson, making a new tarball goes something like: meson builddir; ninja -C builddir dist
<jbicha> and the tarball will be in builddir/meson-dist/
<didrocks> andyrock: as sugessted on the bug report, I feel that we should try another color for the emblem. It's in the css, great, but let's put a good color by default so that we don't need to have to tweak it back again
<andyrock> what color do you suggest?
<andyrock> didrocks: ^^^
<didrocks> andyrock: grey for the middle part? (maybe the same orange grey than the one we have in the theme)
<didrocks> andyrock: if you have the outline, it can be orange, to match alt-tab for instance or button selections
<didrocks> andyrock: look at the very bottom of /usr/share/gnome-shell/theme/ubuntu.css, I have a made a table of the main colors we use for our theme
<andyrock> kk
 * didrocks sees a typo in his css file btw "elemnents"
<didrocks> pushed in bzr
<seb128> didrocks, andyrock, is that about the launcher emblems?
<andyrock> yep
<didrocks> yes
<seb128> k
<seb128> the current look wfm but I'm not picky
<andyrock> didrocks: #dd4814 ?
<andyrock> I like the red
<didrocks> andyrock: try first #e95420 which is the official orange
<andyrock> in unity7 we don't use the orange but as you prefer
<didrocks> we do use a grey, correct?
<didrocks> this is why I suggested grey
<didrocks> we don't use red in unity7 IIRC ;)
<mdeslaur> jbicha: what's up with shotwell?
<andyrock> well red is used in all the other major OSes
<andyrock> (or OSs? :D )
<seb128> mdeslaur, you mean? bug? segfault? update stucked in proposed?
<andyrock> i'll update thr branch with  #e95420
<didrocks> it's not in anything we have in our theme
<jbicha> mdeslaur: failed autopkgtest triggered by a patch applied in Debian, someone with a camera can try to re-record the umockdev test https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=781802
<ubot5> Gnome bug 781802 in import "Ubuntu import autopkgtest fails with 0.26.1" [Major,New]
<didrocks> andyrock: well, try it first, not sure if #e95420 isn't too late
<andyrock> do you want a border as well?
<didrocks> or if you don't want, we can do it while uploading :)
<didrocks> andyrock: I guess it's just a question of try and see
<didrocks> there is a darker orange we picked for border, worth a try (in the css)
<didrocks> the color has been scientifically picked by popey and I :p
<didrocks> (don't ask)
<popey> uhoh
<didrocks> (no, there was no beer involved)
<didrocks> (yet)
<popey> [FACT]
<mdeslaur> seb128, jbicha: so can someone kill the failing test so it gets migrated? we need it for a security fix...
<seb128> mdeslaur, yes, I was thinking the same on my way back from lunch
<mdeslaur> ok, thanks
<seb128> or maybe somebody should ask pitti if he has a slot to update that record, he did the previous one iirc so he knows how to do that and has the hardware
<pitti> not today any more, sorry; meeting now and then an appointment; please assign a bug to me
<jbicha> mdeslaur: is the security issue already fixed in artful-proposed?
<mdeslaur> jbicha: it's fixed in the version in -proposed yes
<andyrock> didrocks: looks fine
<seb128> pitti, it's https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=781802 , do you want to maybe have a look next week? I don't want to annoy you too much
<ubot5> Gnome bug 781802 in import "Ubuntu import autopkgtest fails with 0.26.1" [Major,New]
<didrocks> andyrock: nice! :)
<andyrock> pushing
<pitti> seb128: oh, is that test upstream now
<andyrock> pushed
<pitti> ok, keeping the tab open
<jbicha> pitti: no but Ubuntu needs the autopkgtest to pass or the test ignored
<pitti> jbicha: right, I was asking why it's on gnome bz instead of lp
 * andyrock is trying to find a nice and easy animation for the urgent state
<seb128> pitti, thanks
<jbicha> pitti: I filed it on GNOME because it looked like a regression. Turns out the regression(?) was from a patch Debian grabbed from bugzilla that wasn't applied in git
<jbicha> one workaround is to just drop the ios8 patch but that didn't seem quite right eitherâ¦
<seb128> that patch didn't go upstream? do you know why?
<jbicha> https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=742295
<ubot5> Gnome bug 742295 in camera "cannot import photos from iOS 8.1.2" [Normal,Needinfo]
<jbicha> the patch author described it as a "TERRIBLE hack"
<seb128> jbicha, mdeslaur, removing the patch or commenting the test either workaround is fine with me
<jbicha> pitti: I can comment out the autopkgtest and if you update the umockdev we can re-enable it later?
<pitti> jbicha: sounds fine
<pitti> not worth blocking a security fix
<jbicha> ok, thanks
<seb128> pitti, how are you btw? any fun plans for this w.e while most of us here are going to be stucked in planes to the ubuntu rally from next week?
<jbicha> it'll be nice to finally have a shotwell that's not a really old git snapshot :)
<seb128> yeah
<seb128> I hope the new one isn't too buggy
<seb128> we didn't test it much
<pitti> seb128: we want to do a bike tour, after several weeks of grey and cold it's finally sunny again
<pitti> seb128: and of course, make a cross on a piece of paper on Sunday :)
<Laney> [ x ] Pedro
<pitti> Laney: whoever that is, I don't think he'll be on my ballot :)
<seb128> elections time?
<Laney> https://i.ytimg.com/vi/kHL5iQJLvNU/maxresdefault.jpg
<pitti> seb128: yep; I'm surprised it isn't a big thing in the French media - the French election for sure was here
<didrocks> pitti: oh it is in the French media, but people would have to live in France to realize :)
<pitti> well, it's actually fairly boring
<seb128> pitti, it might be, my weeks have just been crazy recently and I didn't have much time to keep up with what is happening
<didrocks> (that and the dismantlement of the Front Nationale are the 2 top news) ;)
<pitti> the polls have Merkel so far in the  lead that there will hardly be any surprises
<seb128> oh, friday troll time :p
<pitti> (le sigh -- times when the economy is running well-oiled is a really bad time for progressive politics, unfortunately)
<pitti> anyway, I'll add my 0.000001% to the Greens :)
<didrocks> well, even when it's not running well-oiled, like in France, it's a bad time for progressive politics
<pitti> but, but, as I said, appointment now, so have a good weekend and save travels!
<didrocks> thanks, enjoy your week-end pitti!
<pitti> where are you guys going?
<didrocks> New Yorkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkk
<pitti> somewhere US, I take it, for logn travel time
<pitti> oh, ncie!
<chrisccoulson> pitti, we'll take Merkel - you can have Theresa May ;)
<pitti> I had expected it to be too expensive for an Ubuntu sprint
<pitti> chrisccoulson: hmmmmmmmno :)
<chrisccoulson> heh
<didrocks> we would as well, especially Manhantan, but surprise surprise :)
<pitti> great, enjoy! make some photos
<didrocks> will do and +you on g+ ;)
<seb128> pitti, have fun! :-)
<pitti> didrocks: I read your blurbs anyway :)
 * pitti waves
<didrocks> bye bye ;)
<Trevinho> didrocks: hey can you take a look to https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/ubuntu-themes/vertical-linked-buttons-tuning/+merge/330958 ?
<didrocks> Trevinho: I think I can test it and bindly trust you :)
<Trevinho> didrocks: there's a bileto for it
<didrocks> Trevinho: we 2 other theme changes to do with seb128 next week, maybe we can try embeed that together?
<Trevinho> didrocks: https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/2965
<Trevinho> didrocks: yeah, but since it's ready, I would even publish it... as you wish
<Trevinho> releasing themes is less annoying that build stuff
<didrocks> Trevinho: let me have a quick test/look
<Laney> :not-fest!
<Trevinho> Laney: yeah, as you like :-P
<Trevinho> Laney: i might have avoidded the :nots, but it would hav ecaused many repeated definitions... Which... I don't like
<Trevinho> Laney: also three's no othre way to pick a child that is not first or last
<Trevinho> wel you can add definition for generic and then override, but still
<Laney> right
<seb128> nice, with the fctix->ibus changes qt4 dropped from the iso
 * Laney likes that way
<Trevinho> I had some issues I don't remember...
<Trevinho> ah, yeah... I had to put everywhere magic numbers, instead of few less times.. but maybe i had to..
<Trevinho> .Can't remember
<Laney> Trevinho: did you see that bug about the minimum titlebar height?
<Trevinho> Laney: nope... I had some work stashed in that regards though
<Trevinho> let me see
<seb128> and the iso is 70M lighter
<Laney> Trevinho: gnome-control-center -> printers -> click the cog on a printer -> printer details
<didrocks> nice!
<didrocks> well, speaking of g-c-c, the 2 separations headers aren't aligne in our theme
<didrocks> the headerbar one and the panel list one
<seb128> Laney, that's a theme bug?
<seb128> Laney, Trevinho, that's https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=784562 and the same is happening with upstream high contrast
<Laney> I think it's a missing minimum height on titlebars
<Trevinho> Laney: oh, cool feature :)
<ubot5> Gnome bug 784562 in Printers ""Printer Details" dialog has no title bar, no "OK", "Cancel", and "Close" button, requires ESC key to close" [Major,New]
<jbicha> I think qt5 is on the iso becuase of ibus-mozc R> mozc-utils-gui
<Trevinho> Laney: yeeah, that fixes it... let me quickly get a fix
<Trevinho> do we have a downstream bug
<Trevinho> ?
<seb128> jbicha, it was already on the iso before today so it's not that change pulling it in
<didrocks> Trevinho: hum, the theme fix is fine to me, but it seems you want to land other stuffs as well?
<jbicha> seb128: yes, it was fcitx-mozc R> mozc-utils-gui before
<seb128> k
<seb128> no change/nothing we can easily fix there right?
<Laney> Trevinho: https://bugs.launchpad.net/gnome-control-center/+bug/1712011
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1712011 in gnome-control-center (Ubuntu) "Unable to close Printer properties" [Low,Triaged]
<seb128> Laney, that's the same bug as the bugzilla I was sharing 10 min ago
<Laney> I know
<seb128> k
<Laney> he asked for a downstream bug
<Laney> so that's what I gave
<seb128> the downstream reference is in the bugzilla
<seb128> Trevinho, stop being lazy and read :p
<jbicha> find someone that uses mozc and ask them how important that app is and whether it can be handled in gnome-c-c instead?
<seb128> jbicha, I don't even know what mozc is and does
<jbicha> Japanese I believe
<seb128> Trevinho, so it's a theme issue? upstream high contrast has the same issue then should the bugzilla be reassigned?
<seb128> Laney, ^
<Trevinho> seb128: :-D I gave a vertical read, then I moved to fix the code instead, so committed locally now :)
<seb128> nice
<Trevinho> seb128: yeah, theme issue... our selectors were more restrictive than Adwaita ones
<seb128> so the upstream high contrast theme has the same issue?
<seb128> can you comment on the bz bug to say so?
<seb128> so upstream doesn't have to re-figure out the same thing as you did
<Trevinho> yep
<seb128> thanks
 * didrocks will let Trevinho reorganize his bilbeto then (as I didn't get an answer)
<Trevinho> didrocks: sorry, yeah... let me land this fix at this point
<Trevinho> sorry I missed the pings, I was in grep-focus mode :D
<didrocks> and I was grepped out
<didrocks> I see! :)
<Trevinho> lol
<didrocks> Trevinho: did you see my message about g-c-c and top settings bar?
<Trevinho> grep -v didrocks
<Trevinho> Oh, -v isn't for verbose... :-P
<didrocks> tsssss
<Trevinho> didrocks: g-c-c .. oh, let me see
<didrocks> Trevinho: it's quite easy to see -> headbar, line isn't aligned
<didrocks> doesn't happen on adwaita
 * Trevinho goes with GDK_SCALE=2
<didrocks> also, we have 2 lines
<didrocks> where adwaita has only one
<Trevinho> oh, wait I've still the buttons in the left..
<didrocks> :p
 * Trevinho really wanted to keep them there -_-
 * Trevinho goes back to the ugly side... and sees the issue
<Laney> you mac lover
<Trevinho> but later, let me first fix the other one
<Trevinho> NO!
<Trevinho> But, i got used to them now, and... after years, you know.. you get older with such setup...
<didrocks> Trevinho is indeed so old :p
<Trevinho> eh, after I turned 30 I feel not as flexible I used to be :-D
<Trevinho> Laney: https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/ubuntu-themes/fix-dialog-headerbar-min-height/+merge/331197
<seb128> Laney, you mentioned gst-plugin-b earlier, are you working on a bug there or updating it? (just asking before debugging that segfault with videos under wayland more)
<Laney> updating
<Laney> going to upload it in a few minutes
<Laney> or you can get it from deb https://swift.canonistack.canonical.com/v1/AUTH_e8074875467b46b7ab3c41ac60ccfbe7/ubuntu artful main now
<seb128> Laney, thanks
<Laney> amd64 only :-)
<seb128> I'm on amd64 on artful
<seb128> only my xenial install is still 32b
<seb128> that url is 401, but I can wait for the upload
 * Laney puts this in the newsletter
<Laney> no
<Laney> add that line to your sources.list
<jbicha> seb128: you're bleeding edge now! ;)
<seb128> Laney, too late to include an extra patch?
<Laney> to bad?
<Laney> is it upstream?
<Laney> no, I'll push and you can add it
<seb128> Laney, https://cgit.freedesktop.org/gstreamer/gst-plugins-bad/commit/?id=3f2a3d0d
<seb128> I think it's the segfault that takes shotwell down
<seb128> or crash nautilus when you open a video properties and close it
<seb128> it looks like they didn't backport to 1.12
<Laney> done
<Laney> you can probably ask for that in #gstreamer
<seb128> Laney, "done" mean you pushed to a git vcs somewhere?
<seb128> Laney, would you be angry if I just patch/dput today and figure out the vcs thing next week?
<seb128> I don't think I've the slot before my eow to figure out how to deal with that git vcs and git buildpackage or whatever is needed
<seb128> or I guess that can wait for monday
<seb128> jibel, ^ btw that's the shotwell/nautilus segfault on video issue you are having under wayland
<seb128> it's pulled in with vaapi
<seb128> so not on the default installation unless you click that installer box
<Laney> I guess I can include it for you
<Laney> might be a good learning opportunity but if you have no time that's fine
<seb128> thanks, as you want
<seb128> I guess it can wait monday as well
<seb128> I sort of know how to deal with git, I just always end up screwed something and taking half an hour to sort it out
<seb128> so probably not for today
<seb128> well git itself is fine now, I just don't know how to use gbp or cherry pick upstream commits to a debian style workflow
<jibel> seb128, okay, thanks. Let me know if I can help testing the fix
<seb128> should be good, I can confirm the issue, I think we just need to cherrypick the patch I was talking about
<Trevinho> seb128: sent fix also upstream...
<Trevinho> didrocks: you want to check that too? Not sure bileto completed :)
 * Trevinho takes 10-minutes pool-swim break at the pool
<Laney> haha
<didrocks> Trevinho: not completed and going off in 30 minutes for dentist appointment
<Trevinho> didrocks: ah, ok... no worries
<didrocks> enjoy swimming :)
<Trevinho> didrocks: well, you can still apply locally, beauuty of css
<Laney> Trevinho: bug should be reassigned to gtk, yes?
<Trevinho> Laney: yep
 * Trevinho does that
<Laney> hinting at you :P
<Laney> Trevinho: also not sure what happened on gnome bug #760651 but it doesn't look right
<ubot5> Gnome bug 760651 in general "Desktop icon under top panel" [Normal,Resolved: fixed] http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=760651
<Trevinho> Laney: git bz didn't undestand well
<Laney> is it actually pushed?
<Laney> https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/nautilus/ doesn't have it
<Laney> seems the URL changed
<Trevinho> Laney: yes, it's fixed in mutter
<Laney> aha
<Trevinho> https://git.gnome.org/browse/mutter/commit/?id=8532b102909e09e1e0fdbd7f2701a7c40de1af5f
<Trevinho> let me post this
<Laney> yeah I see it, thanks!
<Trevinho> I wanted before, it was an open tab.. forgot to finish
<jackpot51> Has anyone experienced HiDPI issues in X11, such as this? https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=788049
<ubot5> Gnome bug 788049 in general "HiDPI Regressions in X11" [Critical,New]
<didrocks> I guess Trevinho is the HiDPI expert here ^
<jackpot51> These issues are present in the installer as well, so even users with Wayland-capable computers will experience them
<didrocks> sure, as we forced the installer in an X session
<seb128> jbicha, btw did you see my suggestion about dropping euronews and guardian from grilo-plugins
<seb128> ?
<seb128> I don't think you replied (or I didn't read the reply)
<seb128> that was some days ago
<Trevinho> jackpot51: I think Jonas (who did those changes) is aware of them, we'll keep in touch next week for fixing them I guess
<Trevinho> Laney: if you can approve also https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/ubuntu-themes/vertical-linked-buttons-tuning/+merge/330958 I'll do the landing
<jackpot51> Trevinho: Where can I speak to Jonas?
<Trevinho> jackpot51: #gnome-shell on gimpnet
<Trevinho> jackpot51: jadahl the nickname, but he's in Taiwan, so consider that
<Laney> Trevinho: mmm, maybe c-lobrano wants to review?
 * Laney isn't very "in" the theme atm
<seb128> Trevinho, he's off for the week, maybe already travelling
<Trevinho> seb128: oh, right... He told me that he would arrive in NY tomorrow, so definetely he is
<Trevinho> Laney: i asked him but he said something like he would more learn from that :)
<Laney> heh
<Laney> ok, then can you include a before/after screenshot please? :-)
<c-lobrano> Laney, Trevinho: I confirm :D
<seb128> Laney, thanks for including that gst patch!
<Laney> np
<Laney> meh, why are vcs never up to date in ubuntu :(
<Laney> xnox: do you have commits for your NM uploads?
<Trevinho> ouch, I should probably refactor the headerbar code again (as per didier comment on separator)
<Trevinho> also HighContrast has other issues too, though
<mhall119> kenvandine[m][m]: willcooke: is the Unity->GNOME migration documentation somewhere public? I don't see anything other than the outline on the GNOME wiki
<kenvandine> mhall119, all i've gotten done is what's on the wiki
<kenvandine> planning to work on it while traveling though
<kenvandine> this weekend
<mhall119> kenvandine: ack, thanks. Let me know if the rest of us can help. I'm going to work on the banner for the gnome website for that
<kenvandine> mhall119, thx
<dobey> uhm
<dobey> hey all
<dobey> so, what would make "org.freedesktop.secrets" dbus service provided by gnome-keyring-daemon fail to work?
<dobey> apparently dbus-user-session got installed somehow, and it breaks everything
 * oSoMoN EOD
<oSoMoN> desktoppers, see you on Sunday on the other side of the pond
<kenvandine> oSoMoN, see ya' soon!
<Trevinho> see you soon
<oSoMoN> and safe travel to everyone
<jjjoooeee> hi there.  haven't seen any activity on https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell/+bug/1714542, but it seems pretty bad.  any further help i can give on tracking it down?
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1714542 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu) "gnome-shell crashed with SIGSEGV in st_theme_node_reduce_border_radius() from st_theme_node_paint_borders() from st_theme_node_paint()" [Medium,Confirmed]
<Laney> night, see some of you laters
<davidcalle> mhall119: kenvandine: I'm still happy to help, but I haven't received any meeting invite. Just let me know where you need help :)
<kenvandine> davidcalle, thx, i could definately use some help
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-09-17
<PaulePanter> Hi. How do I disable the *audio* notifications?
<PaulePanter> Ubuntu 18.04 with GNOME.
<PaulePanter> Under settings and then *notifications* I have them turned off, but they are still there. (I guess thatâs only for visual notifications.)
<jamesh> robert_ancell: is this likely to be a too old gnome-software? https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/i-can-not-install-many-snaps-from-snapstore-in-gnomesoftware/7402
<oSoMoN> doko, would you mind retrying https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+archive/test-rebuild-20180911/+build/15398106 ?  the build failure appears to be caused by FS corruption
<tjaalton> willcooke, seb128: hi, filed a FFE for mesa 18.2 just to be on the safe side :) https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mesa/+bug/1792873
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1792873 in mesa (Ubuntu) "FFE: 18.2.x for cosmic" [Medium,Triaged]
<seb128> tjaalton, hey, great, thx
<tjaalton> I've been running a rc for some weeks now without any issues on intel kbl
<doko> oSoMoN: yes, once the initial build is finished
<oSoMoN> thanks
<seb128> RAOF, hey, I fixed the colord build, took the liberty to move the change to a quilt patch but I'm happy to revert that if you prefer it otherwise, I just wanted to fix the error introduced by my sponsoring
<seb128> RAOF, also can you write content for https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/colord/+bug/1792356 ?
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1792356 in colord (Ubuntu) "[ffe] Update to 1.4.3" [Wishlist,Triaged]
<jamesh> kenvandine[m]: https://gitlab.gnome.org/Community/Ubuntu/gtk-common-themes/issues/1
<gitbot> Ubuntu issue 1 in gtk-common-themes "Suru icon theme symlink doesn't work" [Opened]
<tomreyn> can you remind me where whoopsie sends its data to and what the process is (if one still exists) for 3rd parties to gain access to the results?
<tomreyn> i think there used to be some process allowing OSS developers to gain access to their applications' crash reports free of charge?
<Wimpress> willcooke robert_ancell https://github.com/cprov/section_ops/pull/22
<gitbot> cprov issue (Pull request) 22 in section_ops "Create a section for the Ubuntu first run wizard" [Open]
<Wimpress> I've just spoken to Celso and he will merge the above later today.
<Wimpress> The new section id is `ubuntu-firstrun`
<jibel> willcooke, on vbox I get bug 1792932
<ubot5> bug 1792932 in xorg-server (Ubuntu) "Xorg assert failure: Xorg: ../../../../dix/privates.c:384: dixRegisterPrivateKey: Assertion `!global_keys[type].created' failed." [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1792932
<Wimpress> jibel: I can reproduce that. I've +1'd the bug.
<jibel> kenvandine[m], https://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/pending-sru.html
<jbicha> Laney: the pango/armhf failure with new Cantarell is odd https://autopkgtest.ubuntu.com/packages/p/pango1.0/cosmic/armhf
<jbicha> pango_layout_set_markup_with_accel: Error on line 2 char 27: ?\u000c<? is not a valid name
<jbicha> the broken utf thing differs in different runs
<andyrock> jbicha: hey! do you know if we can drop GTK_IM_MODULES=ibus in cosmic?
<andyrock> jbicha: it's creating several issues and unsetting it does not seems to affect ibus
<jbicha> andyrock: there was some discussion of problems on bug 1761554
<ubot5> bug 1761554 in im-config (Ubuntu Bionic) "[bionic] Extended characters in GNOME screen keyboard don't get entered" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1761554
<jbicha> I think it's early enough we could do that for cosmic this week. GunnarHj ^
<andyrock> jbicha: osk does not show up on wayland because of that variable
<jbicha> GunnarHj: there was a complaint about the fonts-noto-cjk fontconfig change in Debian bug 907999
<ubot5> Debian bug 907999 in fonts-noto-cjk "fonts-noto-cjk: Unable to use system fonts in Firefox after #907048" [Normal,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/907999
<andyrock> does not show on X neither but that's a "different" issue
<jbicha> andyrock: oh, reading 1761554 says that we *did* drop that but it was reverted because it did cause some other issues :(
<andyrock> jbicha: libreoffice crashing?
<jbicha> you should probably work with Gunnar on that issue; I'm not working on that one these days
<kenvandine> Trevinho, i created a docker image to use for CI builds of snaps
<kenvandine> ubuntudesktop/gnome-3-26-1604
<kenvandine> includes the PPA already, plus build-essentials and libgtk-3-dev
<kenvandine> based on snapcore/snapcraft:stable
<kenvandine> Trevinho, shaves about 20 minutes off CI builds
<jibel> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xorg-server/+bug/1792932
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1792932 in xorg-server (Ubuntu) "Xorg assert failure: Xorg: ../../../../dix/privates.c:384: dixRegisterPrivateKey: Assertion `!global_keys[type].created' failed." [Undecided,Confirmed]
<jibel> seb128, ^
<jibel> seb128, bug 1791090
<ubot5> bug 1791090 in linux (Ubuntu) "Xorg fails to start with radeon (kernel rejects radeon command stream from Xorg)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1791090
<seb128> tjaalton, ^  that seems an xorg issue, could you have a look?
<seb128> the second one as well
<kenvandine> didrocks, you might be interested in that docker image as well
<Laney> jbicha: did you try in lxd on your machine?
<jbicha> no
<Laney> I suggest that
<tjaalton> seb128: ok
<duflu> robert_ancell, https://trello.com/c/i3JvebJ9
<duflu> willcooke,  ^
<duflu> willcooke,  ^^
<tjaalton> seb128, jibel: the vbox thing is probably a mesa bug, should be fixed in 18.2.0
<seb128> tjaalton, thx
<seb128> tjaalton, can you comment on the bug saying that? (and maybe assigned/set status as appropriate)
<tjaalton> once I have that on a ppa to test
<seb128> thx
<GunnarHj> andyrock, jbicha: I already tried to drop "GTK_IM_MODULES=ibus" (for wayland) but had to revert it due to a regression. https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell/+bug/1761554/comments/18
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1761554 in im-config (Ubuntu Bionic) "[bionic] Extended characters in GNOME screen keyboard don't get entered" [High,Triaged]
<GunnarHj> andyrock, jbicha: So it would indeed be desirable for osk, but there is apparently more into it.
<andyrock> GunnarHj: what if we get libreoffice fixed?
<andyrock> GunnarHj: libreoffice works fine on fedora without that enviroment variable
<GunnarHj> andyrock: Sure, but there may be more than LO; see also comment #17. I was surprised by that regression, since GNOME does not set that variable upstream.
<andyrock> gnome-shell search bar should not be affected by that variable
<GunnarHj> jbicha: We are most likely not affected by that Debian fonts-noto-cjk bug. Our config is even more aggressive... But I will do some testing to confirm it.
<GunnarHj> andyrock: Ok.. I didn't test that myself. The LO issue was serious enough.
<GunnarHj> andyrock: Will we switch to wayland as default this cycle?
<andyrock> GunnarHj: nope but would be nice to have the osk fixed in wayland
<andyrock> GunnarHj: it's broken in X11 eleven too but I'm working on it
<GunnarHj> andyrock: Ok. Any idea how to fix it in LO? Setting the variable specifically for LO or something?
<GunnarHj> andyrock: When I reverted the first attempt, I had the thought to do it the other way around, i.e. unsetting the variable for GNOME Shell, but keeping it globally. Would that make sense to you?
<GunnarHj> Hey seb128, Do you know how to build the thing at https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/rancell/accountsservice/tree/ubuntu ? I downloaded the tarball, added the existing debian/ folder and changed the format to 1.0, but debuild() failed.
<seb128> GunnarHj, hey, no sorry I don't know. How did it fail?
<GunnarHj> seb128: Don't remember, to be honest. (Did it yesterday.) Guess I'd better ask Robert, then.
<seb128> yes, I can try asking him
<GunnarHj> seb128: Is he in Europe?
<seb128> yes, we are having a sprint in Brussels
<GunnarHj> ok
<seb128> oh, he's on IRC, I didn't notice :p
<GunnarHj> Hey robert_ancell, any hint on how to build your accountsservicer wip? ^
<jbicha> kenvandine[m]: did you make it there ok too?
<robert_ancell> GunnarHj, I'm trying to remember :)
<robert_ancell> GunnarHj, I'm pretty sure I was just building locally, I'll have to make an updated packaging branch that uses the new patches
<GunnarHj> robert_ancell: That would be great. Can you make a note on the bug report when you have done it?
<robert_ancell> sure
<andyrock> GunnarHj: that will not work, we need to make sure gtk applications do not start with that enviroment variable
<andyrock> GunnarHj: on wayland gtk-applications use Wayland Text Input Protocol
<andyrock> GunnarHj: that variable is forcing them to use ibus
<kenvandine> jbicha, yeah, how bad was it where you live?
<jbicha> I'm in FL now so we got nothing. I used to be in Columbia SC, they only got 2.5 inches of rain so not too bad
<jbicha> Irma last year was plenty
<andyrock> GunnarHj: because they use ibus, gnome-shell cannot communicate with them because it is expecting to communicate with them using the text input protocol
<GunnarHj> andyrock: I see. I can reinsert the im-config change anytime, but we'd better do the LO fix simultaneously.
<andyrock> GunnarHj: sure, we need to understand why LO is broken before
<andyrock> GunnarHj: I'll keep you updated
<GunnarHj> andyrock: Ok.
<kenvandine> jbicha, it was pretty nasty at the airport when i left
<kenvandine> visibility was terrible
<kenvandine> but we survived :)
<jbicha> seb128: I think your indicator-messages build failure is https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/glib/issues/1513 fixed in glib 2.58.1
<gitbot> GNOME issue 1513 in glib "GIcon regression?" [Gicon, Closed]
<jbicha> well I don't know if it fixes it, but it's related at least
<seb128> jbicha, you read Trevinho's comment on trello I see :)
<jbicha> no, but that issue is blocking glib from Debian Testing
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-09-18
<didrocks> Trevinho: the Yaru team is asking if we can drop debian/patches/scrollbar-background-theming.patch in gnome-terminal
<didrocks> Trevinho: it creates some artefacts with the default and Yaru team
<didrocks> https://community.ubuntu.com/t/call-for-participation-an-ubuntu-default-theme-lead-by-the-community/1545/1741
<didrocks> do you mind answering/looking at it?
<Trevinho> Laney: MERGE https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/ubuntu/+source/nautilus/+git/nautilus/+merge/355192
<Trevinho> didrocks: I was wondering that... Then i noticed it would break ambiance though
<didrocks> Trevinho: any workaround in the theme we can push to Yaru?
<didrocks> (please answer on the community hub thread)
<Nafallo> is there a meeting on IRC today? :-)
<seb128> Nafallo, you already asked that after the previous meeting, still no :)
<CarlenWhite> I guess my laptop really likes my printer because even after removing it, it adds it back.
<CarlenWhite> Ah it's a feature of CUPS
<Nafallo> seb128: you weren't sure ;-)
<seb128> kenvandine, willcooke, jamesh, looking at the calendar it doesn't seem like we have slots schedules for the snap topic from our agenda, is that something we should sort out now so we are sure to get the people who need (I guess the snapd team is busy and it's not easy to get them)? e.g "Multiple apps (snaps) with same name", "limited bandwidth", "Talk to snap team about updates notifications and turn off auto-updates from UI",
<seb128> debug symbols
<jamesh> seb128: there is a session for debug symbols on Friday
<seb128> jamesh, ah, good, I see it now
<seb128> what about the other topics? ;)
<jamesh> which of the others are most important?
<seb128> I don't know what the "multiple apps" is, but willcooke put it on the agenda so...
<jamesh> maybe it is multiple snaps with the same human readable name?
<seb128> we should talk to them about the low bandwith one, that was discussed on IRC recently
<jamesh> or similar names
<seb128> the feature is there, but they needed to get confidence on the feature working so we need to figure out what testing is needed/how to unblock
<seb128> or maybe we should just schedule a "desktop/snapd catchup" session and cover the different topics in one slot
<seb128> there might be other things worth discussing
<willcooke> robert_ancell, http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-bb-incoming-bug-tasks.html
<seb128> you can change bb to cc
<seb128> and incoming to tracking
<seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-cc-tracking-bug-tasks.html
<seb128> robert_ancell, http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-bb-tracking-bug-tasks.html is the main list atm
<jbicha> seb128: new glib 2.58.0-4 didn't fix indicator-messages https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/indicator-messages/13.10.1+17.04.20170120-0ubuntu3/+build/15461977
<jbicha> see https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/glib/issues/1513 which has some details about the change in 2.58
<gitbot> GNOME issue 1513 in glib "GIcon regression?" [Gicon, Closed]
<seb128> jbicha, thx
<seb128> Trevinho, ^
<seb128> jbicha, did you ask muktupavels about it?
<jbicha> no
<muktupavels> seb128, jbicha: well it is more or less same bug / caused by same change...
<muktupavels> There are not much options... Either change is reverted in glib or tests must be updated. In indicator-messages case symbolic icon names should be added.
<muktupavels> https://developer.gnome.org/gio/stable/GThemedIcon.html
<muktupavels> g_themed_icon_new_with_default_fallbacks documentation is no longer true...
<seb128> muktupavels, wasn't the recent commit supposed to revert the behaviour change?
<jbicha> the new commit didn't fully revert the behavior change
<muktupavels> seb128: no, it fixed only one thing to match documentation.
<seb128> Trevinho, can you unreject https://code.launchpad.net/~seb128/indicator-messages/symbolic-icons-tests/+merge/355144 ? :)
<seb128> muktupavels, uncompatible behaviour change in stable APIs are  not nice :/
<muktupavels> seb128: why are you telling that to me? I know and I agree with you. :)
<seb128> muktupavels, sorry, I read the who-is-telling-what on that gitlab issue report wrong :)
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-09-19
<jamesh> didrocks: here's a nice simple PR: https://github.com/ubuntu/yaru/pull/836
<gitbot> ubuntu issue (Pull request) 836 in yaru "build: require Meson >= 0.45 for strip_directory support, fixing #835" [Open]
<didrocks> jamesh: requesting a small additional change if you don't mind ;)
<jamesh> didrocks: done
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-09-20
<popey> kenvandine[m]: can you take a look at installing github-desktop snap, it uses desktop-gtk3 and I get a syntax error from the launcher when I run it
<popey> "/snap/github-desktop/33/bin/desktop-launch: line 428: ((: /home/alan/snap/github-desktop/33/.local/share/icons/*: syntax error: operand expected (error token is "/home/alan/snap/github-desktop/33/.local/share/icons/*")"
<tjaalton> should we install mesa-vulkan-drivers by default, and if so, which pkg should add the dependency?
<kenvandine> @popey ugh... I tested that, Trevinho  broke it!
<kenvandine> @Trevinho /snap/github-desktop/33/bin/desktop-launch: line 428: ((: /home/ken/snap/github-desktop/33/.local/share/icons/*: syntax error: operand expected (error token is "/home/ken/snap/github-desktop/33/.local/share/icons/*")
<popey> We need better QA on the desktop helpers. :)
<kenvandine> @Trevinho that is your array changes we just merged
<kenvandine> @popey yes... and we need to kill the helpers :)
<popey> I look forward to the QA for killing the desktop helpers :)
<Trevinho> kenvandine: can you paste me that file?
<popey> Trevinho: its in the github-desktop snap in edge
<Laney> TEAM
<Trevinho> popey: yeah, just lazy... adding it now :)
<kenvandine> @popey I'm using irccloud :)
<kenvandine> On the desktop it's kind of sucks compared to hexchat... but it might be nice to have it stay connected
<popey> â¤ï¸
<kenvandine> @popey i'll keep using it for a bit before I give up
<kenvandine> I hope it has desktop notifications :)
<popey> kenvandine: ping
<popey> kenvandine: ping
<kenvandine> yay
<kenvandine> it has half notifications :)
<kenvandine> just the popup
<kenvandine> no emblem in the dock :/
<popey> yeah, that would be nice
<popey> wonder if we need to bundle a libappindicator or something
<kenvandine> probably
<popey> i know Wimpress has bodged a couple of apps with that and setting an environment variable to force the app to think it's on unity
<RAOF> kenvandine: Joiiin the matrix.
<kenvandine> i bet @Trevinho knows... since telegram does work
<kenvandine> @RAOF I am on matrix :)
<popey> kenvandine: although i don't know if irccloud-desktop actually does badges
<RAOF> kenvandine: Then why are you using irccloud?
 * RAOF is confused
<kenvandine> because popey told me too
<popey> irccloud > *
<Trevinho> duflu: this might be interesting for you too https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/mutter/merge_requests/197
<gitbot> GNOME issue (Merge request) 197 in mutter "WIP: Sysprof integration" [1. Feature, 5. Performance, Opened]
<Trevinho> popey: no, irccloud has no badges. electron does not support them for ubuntu (at least, I wanted to patch it upstream, but I think it wasn't added yet). only mac is supported.
<popey> awww
<oSoMoN> seb128, bug #1793476
<ubot5> bug 1793476 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu) "Missing French translations for some strings" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1793476
<robert_ancell> jibel, can you add the SRU information to https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-software/+bug/1756379
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1756379 in gnome-software (Ubuntu Bionic) "Delay start of gnome-software service" [Medium,Fix committed]
<popey> kenvandine: can you let me know once the launcher is fixed. I had to build 33 snaps for security updates this morning and many of them now have this brokenness and will need re-building again.
<jamesh> kenvandine: https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/gnome-3-30-snaps-theming-issues/7290/14
<Trevinho> kenvandine: https://github.com/ubuntu/snapcraft-desktop-helpers/pull/155
<gitbot> ubuntu issue (Pull request) 155 in snapcraft-desktop-helpers "desktop-exports: don't break cycle overriding variables" [Open]
<Trevinho> popey: ^
<kenvandine> @popey can you rebuild one of them?
<kenvandine> ideally github-destkop :)
<willcooke> tjaalton, can we have a chat about that while we're in Brussels?
<tjaalton> willcooke: sure
<kenvandine> @popey i had to enable swap... not that i'm running irccloud
<kenvandine> s/not/now/
<tjaalton> willcooke: when/where?
<popey> kenvandine: https://launchpad.net/~build.snapcraft.io/+snap/56c2fcf81d3a14e2fc76ff29d6d68cea-xenial - building
<kenvandine> thx
<kenvandine> popey: wow, it builds for arm64 and armhf by default?
<popey> everything in build.snapcraft.io can build for i386,amd64,armhf,arm64, yes.
<popey> but we error out so it doesn't actually build a snap for all of them
<popey> soon we will be able to tell bsi to stop doing redundant builds
<kenvandine> popey Trevinho: I've confirmed the fix in a separate build
<popey> kenvandine: snap refresh github-desktop, revision 33 is latest
<popey> kenvandine: i lied, you may need the next build
<popey> yeah, wait for 34
<willcooke> tjaalton, that's the million dollar question :)  bear with me
<tjaalton> no problem :)
<popey> kenvandine: github-desktop revision 34 seems to work
<kenvandine> popey: ship it!
<popey> Thanks! I have re-triggered builds for the world and will check them after lunch
<kenvandine> popey: i guess github-desktop still needs some work?  I was just playing with it and it's missing libcurl
<popey> Pull requests welcome :)
<popey> Ah. It's vendored now, wimpy says
<popey> The one in edge is likely not to be released as we are working with upstream to get them building
<popey> So maybe use another one for tests
<kenvandine> jibel: did you see robert_ancell's ping about bug 1756379 ?
<ubot5> bug 1756379 in gnome-software (Ubuntu Bionic) "Delay start of gnome-software service" [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1756379
<robert_ancell> jamesh, lp:~ubuntu-desktop/snapd-glib/ubuntu-xenial has package updated to 1.43
<ricotz> oSoMoN, LO 6.1.2.1 tagged
<oSoMoN> ricotz, ack
<jamesh> robert_ancell: so this new test fails: https://github.com/snapcore/snapd-glib/commit/f893907aa86c1814ee8edf2286a320ff46057cf7
<jibel> kenvandine, nope I didn't
<jamesh> robert_ancell: https://github.com/snapcore/snapd-glib/pull/42
<gitbot> snapcore issue (Pull request) 42 in snapd-glib "Reconnect to snapd if disconnected while trying to send the request" [Open]
<robert_ancell> willcooke, https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-control-center/issues/198
<gitbot> GNOME issue 198 in gnome-control-center "Implement sound panel design" [6. Component: Sound, Opened]
<willcooke> robert_ancell, https://trello.com/b/RHiGQXZJ/ubuntu-desktop-1904-cycle
<popey> kenvandine: have you changed desktop-glib-only? We're suddenly seeing a build failure on desktop-launch https://travis-ci.com/snapcrafters/sdlpop/builds/85418705
<kenvandine> no... and that error has nothing to do with the helpers
<kenvandine> well
<popey> "Failed to generate snap metadata: The specified command 'desktop-launch' defined in the app 'sdlpop' does not exist or is not executable"
<kenvandine> it's your reference to it
<popey> that very much does imply it
<kenvandine> where's the yaml?
<popey> https://github.com/snapcrafters/sdlpop/blob/master/snap/snapcraft.yaml
<kenvandine> i think the desktop-launch script gets put under "bin/desktop-launch"
<kenvandine> which at runtime is in the path
<kenvandine> but snapcraft has started to complain if it doesn't think the script is in the snap
<kenvandine> that might be a recent snapcraft change
<kenvandine> so technically you don't need to specify bin in the path, it will work
<popey> it appears to be kyle's fault
<kenvandine> popey: everything is kyle's fault
<popey> he will be expressing sincere apologies via beer later
<popey> Sorry for suggesting it could have been you. :)
<didrocks> https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1anXF3-Gh7B8gG0Oiwcfqh0512NVC1YDM52jItbUveaA
<kenvandine> popey: nothing is my fault... you should know that :)
<oSoMoN> Laney, mind merging https://code.launchpad.net/~osomon/britney/hints-ubuntu-libreoffice/+merge/355442, when you have a moment?
<Laney> :(((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((
<Laney> can you maybe ask in #ubuntu-release please?
 * Laney is inside a rebase of britney now
<oSoMoN> Laney, ack
<Laney> every single commit has conflicted so far
 * Laney cries
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-09-21
<CarlenWhite> When Ubuntu Just Worksâ¢ with stuff is wonderful.
<CarlenWhite> Plug in a random flip phone, boom it's recognized as a modem and internet galore.
<CarlenWhite> Had myself a giddy time readding the time remaining to the battery, using someone's existing Gnome Shell implementation to add on a percent and crude directional animation of power.
<CarlenWhite> Well, uh, up until I managed to print an invoice and cause a printer to wastefully spit out papers upon papers of garbage characters and grew a greater disdain of printers
<CarlenWhite> Which I guess it's the norm considering I already consider printers, especially InkJets, demon spawn born only to cause unending suffering for mortals in oddly asinine situations in bursts of actually working.
<Laney> I assume it wouldn't be a problem if we lost mozjs60 and therefore gjs on s390x
<seb128> Laney, probably not
<seb128> x_nox can still fix it later if he cares enough :)
<seb128> andyrock, tiny wording point, "sync" usually is when we directly import, "merge" is when we have ubuntu changes (which is the case for gtk)
<popey> willcooke: you guys coming up to us?
<tjaalton> willcooke, seb128, duflu: where do we meet?
<duflu> tjaalton, Luxembourg room on 1
<willcooke> omw
<willcooke> seb128, oSoMoN https://errors.ubuntu.com/problem/b7bbe8793010d7f757f3de7861f6c9584a1fe623
<seb128> willcooke, oSoMoN, that looks like https://errors.ubuntu.com/problem/ac572b4fed36983c400b47046ea2445bd14d3884 with a slightly different signature (maybe because the code changed a bit) which Olivier reported upstream in april as https://bugs.chromium.org/p/chromium/issues/detail?id=831495 pointed out it was already the main chromium e.u.c issue
<seb128> said differently, old news
<willcooke> merci
<seb128> np
<kenvandine> jdstrand: can you please look at https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/auto-connecting-the-accounts-service-and-calendar-service-interfaces-for-the-gnome-calendar-snap/7377
<seb128> kenvandine, did you see warnings like that before?
<seb128> "main.go:189: cannot change mount namespace of snap "evince" according to change mount (/snap/gtk-common-themes/701/share/icons/Suru /snap/evince/42/data-dir/icons/Suru none bind,ro 0 0): cannot use "/snap/gtk-common-themes/701/share/icons/Suru" as bind-mount source: not a directory"
<oSoMoN> jbicha, would you mind reviewing https://salsa.debian.org/gnome-team/evince/merge_requests/1 ?
<gitbot> GNOME issue (Merge request) 1 in evince "Allow executing the gio-launch-desktop helper." [Opened]
<kenvandine> seb128: https://gitlab.gnome.org/Community/Ubuntu/gtk-common-themes/issues/1
<gitbot> Ubuntu issue 1 in gtk-common-themes "Suru icon theme symlink doesn't work" [Opened]
<seb128> kenvandine, thx
<popey> kenvandine: can you please test something for me locally? snap install mattermost-desktop --edge
<popey> kenvandine: i am seeing the snap directory for that application in my home to be 1GB full of themes
<popey> kenvandine: looks like icon-theme.cache. Is that expected?
<kenvandine> jdstrand: thanks
<kenvandine> popey: i'll look
<jdstrand> kenvandine: yw
<robert_ancell> jamesh, can you confirm snapd-glib master works for you? I'll make a new release
<tjaalton> seb128: mesa 18.2.1 was released, and I'd like to upload it to cosmic early next week if that FFE gets an ack, hint hint ;)
<kenvandine> popey: this looks much better
<kenvandine> https://www.irccloud.com/pastebin/kpJII6AM/
<k_alam> jbicha: Hi, Can you merge this and make a release ? https://code.launchpad.net/~khurshid-alam/unity-greeter/update-logo-for-cosmic/+merge/355273
<popey> kenvandine: much :)
<seb128> tjaalton, +1 from me but I'm not in the release team so I can't give you that +1 sadly...
<tjaalton> seb128: sure, but a +1 from the desktop team is still something :)
<kenvandine> popey: https://github.com/snapcrafters/mattermost-desktop/pull/14
<gitbot> snapcrafters issue (Pull request) 14 in mattermost-desktop "Fixed target mounts for themes and simplified providers" [Open]
<seb128> tjaalton, yeah +1 from us in that case :)
<seb128> give us the bug number when you have it filed so we can add a comment on it
<tjaalton> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mesa/+bug/1792873
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1792873 in mesa (Ubuntu) "FFE: 18.2.x for cosmic" [Medium,Triaged]
<seb128> ah, good
<jamesh> robert_ancell: cosmic pulseaudio + snapd-glib/master survives snapd restarts, so it looks good.
<willcooke> robert_ancell, kenvandine - this is the bug I think
<willcooke> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/snapd-glib/+bug/1789338
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1789338 in gnome-software (Ubuntu Xenial) "Support wide scope searches" [Medium,Triaged]
<willcooke> kenvandine, robert_ancell - all other bugs for the new versions in bionic proposed are now verification-done
<willcooke> I'll leave you guys to decide if you want to release with that issue or not
<robert_ancell> jbicha, I pushed a snapd-glib update to salsa
<willcooke> kenvandine, it's working here now :)_
<willcooke> the ordering is janky though
<kyrofa> kenvandine, oSoMoN, the glib extension spike is here: https://github.com/kyrofa/snapcraft/tree/spike/glib_extension . Once command-chain is in a stable snapd release (next week hopefully) we'll add proper command-chain support to snapcraft, which means that become unspiked
<kyrofa> kenvandine, oSoMoN also, perhaps less useful, in about an hour a snap of it will be available in edge/glib-extension
<kenvandine> kyrofa: thanks... You should come for a beer :-)
<oSoMoN> kyrofa, thanks
<oSoMoN> have a great week-end everyone!
<k_alam> Trevinho: Hi, Please merge and release unity-greeter https://code.launchpad.net/~khurshid-alam/unity-greeter/update-logo-for-cosmic/+merge/355273
#ubuntu-desktop 2019-09-16
<ricotz> good morning desktoppers :)
<ricotz> robert_ancell, hey :), could you take a look at https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/accountsservice/accountsservice/merge_requests/43
<ricotz> seb128, hi
<seb128> hey ricotz , how are you?
<ricotz> seb128, good, warm and sunny weekend ;), how are you?
<seb128> ricotz, I'm good, in Paris for the week with other Canonicalers
<ricotz> seb128, great
<seb128> jbicha, hey, nice to see you active on Debian/Ubuntu :-) Just as a reminder in case you didn't pay attention to the schedule, we are in feature freeze (you updates some things to a newer serie like gnome-boxes which probably technically should go through a ffe)
<willcooke> Logged a bug in Yaru re: battery icon colour:  https://github.com/ubuntu/yaru/issues/1531
<clobrano> morning all 0/
<willcooke> hey clobrano
<clobrano> wow, I must have made some mess configuring the bouncer, it was a pain to connect this morning :D
<clobrano> hi willcooke, how are you?
<willcooke> clobrano, doing good, here with the team in Paris!
<clobrano> willcooke: nice!
<clobrano> (no pun intended) :D
<tjaalton> hi, mesa 19.2.0-rc3 available for testing at ppa:canonical-x/x-staging. works fine on my intel laptop
<clobrano> willcooke and anyone could/want to test it :), I release a test branch for a third Yaru variant called Ambiance, to make the transition easier. There is still a problem though, Apps that prefer dark variant seem unable to take the Yaru-dark even if I make a copy of Yaru-dark called Yaru-ambiance-dark
<clobrano> s/anyone could.../anyone who could.../
<tjaalton> clobrano: you mean it'd keep the dark window top bar? I just noticed that latest eoan had it "white" with yaru, and changed to ambiance
<clobrano> tjaalton: exactly, this Yaru-ambiance would be Yaru 19.04 with some changes to make headerbar buttons more visible (see https://github.com/ubuntu/yaru/issues/1477)
<tjaalton> cool
<clobrano> :)
<GunnarHj> seb128: Where did that IBus update go? ;)
<seb128> GunnarHj, it got rejected because I forgot to use -sa to include the orig tarball, I will reupload in a bit
<GunnarHj> seb128: Ok.
<GunnarHj> seb128: Do you have an idea offhand how to deal with those test failures which happen if I add a couple of recent upstream commits? This is an example build log:
<GunnarHj> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/442793675/buildlog_ubuntu-eoan-amd64.ibus_1.5.21-1~exp2ubuntu1~test3_BUILDING.txt.gz
<GunnarHj> At the same time it builds fine on my not-so-clean hard disk, so I suspect that there is some missing build dep. The question, in that case, is which one(s).
<oSoMoN> Trevinho, I'm not seeing previews when clicking on an icon in the dock that has multiple windows open, is that a known regression?
<oSoMoN> Trevinho, also I can't dismiss a context menu invoked by right-clicking on an icon in the dock
<Trevinho> oSoMoN: yes, due to a last-second upload in mutter before release, so I've posted the patch fixing it if you want it already.
<oSoMoN> Trevinho, yeah, happy to test the patch, can you share the link?
<Trevinho> oSoMoN: sure
<Trevinho> oSoMoN: https://github.com/micheleg/dash-to-dock/commit/bb5b0c545292549525ab1ceda6bbce633f49cfbd.patch
<Trevinho> I wanted to do a release, but I was trying to get the fix for that crash in first... but since I still wasn't able to reproduce...
<Trevinho> I should probably patch that in first.
<Trevinho> oSoMoN: can you open a bug for it please :)
<oSoMoN> Trevinho, for the issue with the previews, or the one with the context menu? or two separate bugs for both?
<Trevinho> ah I think it's the same... https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell-extension-ubuntu-dock/+bug/1843520
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1843520 in gnome-shell-extension-ubuntu-dock (Ubuntu) "ubuntu-dock right-click menu appears at the top-left corner of the desktop (which in some cases is the wrong monitor) and is permanent" [High,In progress]
<Trevinho> already there
<oSoMoN> Trevinho, I confirm the patch fixes both issues, nice one
<Trevinho> oSoMoN: I'm about to board now, but in a while the package will be built in https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/3805 (might need to trigger "build" once it's actually done in ppa), so once it's done there, you are free to sponsor it :)
<oSoMoN> I'll let La_ney handle it
<GunnarHj> seb128: It's kind of funny... One of the IBus commits which I would like to have seen included has now been added to the stable releases as a security update. Maybe you should wait with that upload after all? (I wonder if security bypasses the tests....)
<seb128> GunnarHj, I doubt they do
<seb128> is that what creates the issue you mentioned before?
<seb128> I looked at the log but not idea offhand
<GunnarHj> seb128: Not sure. The patch I dropped contains two commits, so it may be the other one which affects the tests.
<seb128> we should include that security patch in eoan
<seb128> amurray, dunno if you planned to upload ibus/eoan but we have other changes ready to upload so maybe not do it to avoid conflicts
<GunnarHj> seb128: Yeah.. I can try with only that one in a PPA and see if it passes. Can do that tonight or tomorrow.
<amurray> seb128: I have a debdiff ready which I was going to get mdeslaur to sponsor but am happy to hold off and redo it once you folks are done
<GunnarHj> amurray: It would make things easier is you hold it back for now.
<amurray> GunnarHj: sure no worries
<amurray> GunnarHj: the security issue is not critical
<GunnarHj> amurray: Right.
<seb128> amurray, or email me the diff if you can so we can look at integrating that patch with the upload
<seb128> amurray, thx
<amurray> seb128: done
<Laney> Trevinho: +backgroud-opacity=0.7
<Laney> fail
<Trevinho> Laney: see https://github.com/ubuntu/yaru/pull/1518
<Trevinho> Laney: so we need to do it at dock level instead, otherwise we'd break the d2d settings
<Laney> Trevinho: read more closely
<Trevinho> Laney: what?
<Laney> +backgroud-opacity=0.7
<Trevinho> damned n...
<Laney> :D
<Trevinho> let me try to push again from the plaaane
<Trevinho> Laney: ok building again.... FLYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYing
<Laney> GOOOOOOOOOOOO
<Laney> don't forget to fix the PR too
<GunnarHj> seb128: The security thing built successfully in the PPA:
<GunnarHj> https://launchpad.net/~gunnarhj/+archive/ubuntu/ibus
<GunnarHj> You may want to upload that instead.
<GunnarHj> (So it looks like it was the other commit which caused the test failures.)
<seb128> GunnarHj, k
<dupondje> Didn't Gnome 3.34 had a fix for non-wayland apps to run as root? :)
<seb128> not that I know
<seb128> (bbiab, coffee time)
<dupondje> https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/mutter/commit/a8984a81c2e887623d69ec9989ae8a5025f7bd47
<dupondje> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/synaptic/+bug/1713313
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1713313 in xdiagnose (Ubuntu) "Unable to launch pkexec'ed applications on Wayland session" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<dupondje> And: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/synaptic/+bug/1771158
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1771158 in synaptic (Ubuntu) "Synaptic doesn't open with administrative privileges on wayland" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<dupondje> added comment on the latest bug, pkexec synaptic now works fine on wayland, but synaptic still gives a prompt that its not supported on wayland
<dupondje> might be nice to fix that before release? :)
<dupondje> seb128: https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/mutter/commit/a8984a81c2e887623d69ec9989ae8a5025f7bd47 fyi
<seb128> dupondje, thx
<seb128> GunnarHj, we have a ubuntu-dock upload with add a bit of transparency, do you think we need a formal UIFe bug or is that ok to upload?
<GunnarHj> seb128: No need to be formal. We don't have any screenshots which are affected anyway.
<seb128> GunnarHj, thx
<seb128> tkamppeter, Debian has a new cups-filters version, should we sync that?
<GunnarHj> amurray: Is this fine with you?
<GunnarHj> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ibus/1.5.21-1~exp2ubuntu1
#ubuntu-desktop 2019-09-17
<kenvandine> marcustomlinson: https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/DwkFBM7NVD/
<marcustomlinson> :)
<duflu> tseliot, jibel, can we say the new policy item is done? https://trello.com/c/6CeAcFWQ
<dupondje> Somebody else noticed this: When I click in thunderbird/terminal/whatever on a link, it doesn't open in firefox, but just gives me that firefox is already running (which is, but previous behavior was to just open an additional tab)
<dupondje> Since Eoan upgrade btw
<tseliot> duflu: I think RAOF said he would have point nr 3 of the task approved i.e. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NVidiaUpdates
<tseliot> not sure what the status is
<dupondje> On which package would that be a bug?
<duflu> dupondje, I would check the command line of the firefox process
<duflu> if the URL is in there then it's a Firefox bug
<duflu> else thunderbird?
<dupondje> duflu: well its not only in thunderbird that it happens :) so
<dupondje> jean-lo+ 21244  3.3  0.2 191972 41992 ?        Sl   10:30   0:00  \_ /usr/lib/firefox/firefox https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/DwkFBM7NVD/
<duflu> dupondje, great, thanks... then please run:  ubuntu-bug firefox
<duflu> ^ oSoMoN
<dupondje> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/firefox/+bug/1844281 there :)
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1844281 in firefox (Ubuntu) "Opening an URL in other software tries to start new firefox instance instead of new tab" [Undecided,New]
<oSoMoN> dupondje, does "xdg-open URL" open a new tab in firefox?
<dupondje> oSoMoN: nope :(
<dupondje> this just does /usr/lib/firefox/firefox https://google.com
<dupondje> so same issue
<oSoMoN> dupondje, can you run "apport-collect 1844281" ?
<dupondje> oSoMoN: done
<oSoMoN> thanks
<oSoMoN> dupondje, I can't reproduce the issue here, neither on my laptop nor in a clean eoan vm
<oSoMoN> tested both xorg and wayland sessions
<oSoMoN> dupondje, if you close firefox, make sure there are no leftover processes, then run it again, is the issue still reproducible?
<dupondje> oSoMoN: not anymore now ... strange strange
<dupondje> ok /ignore then, no idea how it got triggered, tried rebooting, but still works then
<oSoMoN> dupondje, if you don't mind I'll mark the bug incomplete so it will auto-expire in 2 months, if you see it happen again in the meantime just reset the status to new and comment, please
<dupondje> yea ofcourse, thans for checking!
<dupondje> thanks*
<seb128> robert_ancell, Laney, the 'new shared folders are not listed until changing panel' issue is fixed in git by https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-control-center/merge_requests/547
<Laney> cool
<jibel> Trevinho, https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/hfdHYQ4M4Y/
<seb128> jbicha, your libcairo-gobject-perl  sync depends on binaries in universe
<seb128> http://autopkgtest.ubuntu.com/packages/o/ostree/eoan/ppc64el is annoying :-(
<Laney> I'm looking into it
<seb128> thx
<seb128> Laney, you can unblock gnome-shell-extension-top-icons-plus  and gnome-shell-extension-bluetooth-quick-connect those got updated in eoan-proposed for the new shell version
<Laney> ok
<duflu> seb128, https://git.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-audio-dev/pulseaudio/log/ :)
#ubuntu-desktop 2019-09-18
<clobrano> good morning everyone 0/
<Laney> ahoy clobrano
<clobrano> hey Laney, in Paris you too?
<seb128> hey clobrano, how are you?
<Laney> oui
<clobrano> trÃ¨s bien :)
<dupondje> Is this known on Eoan: Gnome + Wayland, when I lock my desktop, login again, the dock is hidden, Clicking on activities brings it back (and its not set to auto-hide)
<clobrano> hey seb128, I'm doing fine, you?
<seb128> I'm good
<duflu> kenvandine, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell/+bug/1713021
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1713021 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu) "Minimize/unminimize animations do nothing for the first 100ms or so" [Medium,Confirmed]
<duflu> And probably similar bugs for other animations
<cyphermox> seb128: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/rygel/+bug/1786489
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1786489 in rygel (Ubuntu) "[MIR] rygel" [Undecided,Fix released]
<cyphermox> rygel seems to not be subscribed by the desktop team, is this an oversight?
<k_alam> seb128: Hi, good morning
<Trevinho> duflu: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=761565
<ubot5> Gnome bug 761565 in ClutterStage "actor.get_transformed_size/position work wrong after a change in stage size" [Normal,New]
<duflu> robert_ancell, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/accountsservice/+bug/1843982
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1843982 in accountsservice (Ubuntu) "Various programs crashed with SIGSEGV in g_str_hash() from g_hash_table_lookup() from update_user()" [Medium,Confirmed]
<duflu> robert_ancell, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/accountsservice/+bug/1843982
<duflu> willcooke, bug 1844101
<ubot5> bug 1844101 in linux (Ubuntu) "5.3.0-10 crashes immediately in init_tis -> ... -> tpm_init -> ... -> tpm_tis_core_init.cold -> ... (never boots)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1844101
<robert_ancell> willcooke, link to https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-online-accounts/issues/42 in the meeting
<dupondje> Trevinho: Is this known on Eoan: Gnome + Wayland, when I lock my desktop, login again, the dock is hidden, Clicking on activities brings it back (and its not set to auto-hide)
<dupondje> Or do I create a bugreport for it?
<Trevinho> dupondje: not known no, please do it
<Trevinho> dupondje: no issue on x11?
<dupondje> Didn't test really
<Trevinho> if you can would be nice
<dupondje> Trevinho: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell-extension-ubuntu-dock/+bug/1844523
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1844523 in gnome-shell-extension-ubuntu-dock (Ubuntu) "Dock hidden after lock/unlock" [Undecided,Incomplete]
#ubuntu-desktop 2019-09-19
<ricotz> seb128, hey :)
<seb128> hey ricotz , how are you?
<seb128> kenvandine, willcooke , https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-control-center/merge_requests/148
<seb128> the power strings got changed there
<ricotz> seb128, what is the best way to propose a package update which was synced but won't receive this version in debian?
<ricotz> seb128, a bit tired ;), I hope you aren't
<seb128> what do you mean, if it was synced Debian must have the version?
<seb128> or you mean a package in sync but we want an update and Debian won't do it?
<seb128> I'm ok, a bit tired as well, those team week are busy and often failing at going to bed early
<willcooke> thanks seb128 , looking at that commit
<ricotz> seb128, to be more specific, this is about getting a vala 0.44.8 update into eoan?
<ricotz> I could push it to salsa to be picked up from there
<ricotz> seb128, the weekend is coming ;)
<tseliot> xnox: hey, have you seen the bug report about S4? It looks like a very easy fix: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/initramfs-tools/+bug/1769297
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1769297 in initramfs-tools (Ubuntu) "resume from hibernation broken when resume image is autodetected" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<duflu> oSoMoN, ;) https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/Responses#Missing_a_crash_report_or_having_a_.crash_attachment
<clobrano> good morning everyone 0/
<duflu> Hi clobrano
<seb128> hey clobrano, how are you?
<clobrano> hey seb128, doing good :)
<seb128> ricotz, vala update sounds fine, salsa or ppa are fine
<ricotz> seb128, ok
<kenvandine> mpt: https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-control-center/issues/681
<willcooke> hi hellsworth!
<hellsworth> hello!
<willcooke> hellsworth is the newest member of the desktop team
<sarnold> "starting in the middle of the sprint"-new? :)
<willcooke> sarnold, started on Monday, logged on to Freenode on Wednesday-new
<hellsworth> well my first day was the first day of the sprint
<hellsworth> i consider myself still new since i'm only on day 4 :)
<sarnold> wow :) that's really quick even by canonical standards :D
<sarnold> welcome aboard hellsworth
<hellsworth> thanks. glad to be here!
<Wimpress> jibel: Are you aware of this bug?
<Wimpress> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-mate-meta/+bug/1841672
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1841672 in livecd-rootfs (Ubuntu Eoan) "CryptSetup packages should not be removed by `apt-get autoremove` on system installed with encryption and LVM" [Undecided,Triaged]
<jibel> Wimpress, no, I was not.
<seb128> jibel, ubiquity on daily-proposed in 'install only' mode works fine here (tested in kvm and virtualbox)
<seb128> did you do anything specific to get that error you reported?
<mpt> oSoMoN, you said that if there are two graphics cards from the same vendor they have to use the same driver. But is it possible that you can set one of them to not be used for graphics at all? (For example, one Nvidia card for graphics, the other Nvidia card for AI/ML)
<oSoMoN> mpt, I think so, yes
<GunnarHj> Hi sil2100, since you weren't around, I submitted bug #1844653 about the szl language.
<ubot5> bug 1844653 in langpack-o-matic "Questions about new szl language packs" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1844653
<jibel> seb128, indeed it's fixed on today's build. There's a new libatk, so it could be related to the ibus crashes on previous images
<seb128> jibel, k, good, thx for testing, hopefully it's fixed and not just something depending of the moon which comes back in another daily or on every second boot
<sil2100> GunnarHj: I was working on it yesterday and today and figured everything out!
<sil2100> GunnarHj: it should be actually appearing in the archive in a few minutes
<GunnarHj> sil2100: Excellent, thanks!
<sil2100> (I'm on a sprint now in Paris so I'm jumping around IRC a lot)
<k_alam> seb128: Hi, can you merge those usd related mr ?
<duflu> Testing robert_ancell_
<k_alam> seb128: I want them merged before beta release
<robert_ancell> willcooke, who would decide about control center options for light/dark theme? https://discourse.ubuntu.com/t/ubuntu-design-discussion/12508/7
<willcooke> robert_ancell, the team should decide if it's a good idea, if we do we take it to the next cycle, mpt should sign off/design it, whoever signs up for the work should deliver.  (I am missing someting?)
<seb128> k_alam, will do, sorry week is busy (as always)
<robert_ancell> willcooke, the question on the channel was who can we ask for approval, and I don't know who's managing this feature.
<willcooke> fwiw, I don;t like "design, dock & details"
<robert_ancell> I guess mpt would approve any design?
<k_alam> seb128: No prob, Thanks.
<willcooke> robert_ancell, in a meeting, bbiab and then we can talk.
<robert_ancell> ok
<seb128> what are the chances that upstream would be interested by that as well?
<robert_ancell> seb128, I think they'll have a similar case, so not sure if we land something first then switch to upstream or wait for upstream.
<cyphermox> didrocks: jibel: I thought you'd find this interesting; reviewing old rls-*-incoming bugs we came across https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/cryptsetup/+bug/1612906
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1612906 in cryptsetup (Ubuntu) "cryptsetup does not support ZFS" [Wishlist,Confirmed]
<cyphermox> (zfs on cryptsetup or the other way around)
<didrocks> cyphermox: ah, and coming from upstream ZFS community. Thanks for the pointer! I'll have a read
<didrocks> jibel: FYI as well ^
<cyphermox> yeah
<cyphermox> I thought you'd be in a better position to comment and reviw the patch
<cyphermox> there's a discussion on Debian bugs too
<didrocks> yeah, I'll have a look
<willcooke> GunnarHj, hullo.  I filed a UIFe for yaru theme changes... https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/yaru-theme/+bug/1844643
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1844643 in yaru-theme (Ubuntu) "[UIFe] Change default theme to Yaru Ambience variant " [Undecided,New]
 * clobrano saves the UIFe link
<GunnarHj> willcooke: Made a not on the bug report.
<GunnarHj> s/not/note/
<willcooke> thank you GunnarHj
<willcooke> clobrano, ^
<willcooke> still need to fix that video & boxes issue.  Still trying
<clobrano> willcooke, noted thanks
<didrocks> willcooke: ensure that the same of directories have exactly the same cast (not -Dark but -dark or whatever)
<willcooke> thx didrocks will look at that as soon as I get back
<clobrano_> willcooke, didrocks:
<clobrano_> carlo â ~ $ ll /usr/share/themes | grep Yaru                                                                                                                           ~
<clobrano_> drwxr-xr-x 5 root root 4096 set 19 15:40 Yaru
<clobrano_> drwxr-xr-x 5 root root 4096 set 19 15:40 Yaru-ambiance
<clobrano_> drwxr-xr-x 5 root root 4096 set 19 15:40 Yaru-ambiance-dark
<clobrano_> drwxr-xr-x 5 root root 4096 set 19 15:40 Yaru-dark
<clobrano_> carlo â ~ $ gresource list /usr/share/themes/Yaru/gtk-3.20/gtk.gresource | grep gtk                                                                                    ~
<clobrano_> /com/ubuntu/themes/Yaru/3.20/gtk-ambiance-dark.css
<clobrano_> /com/ubuntu/themes/Yaru/3.20/gtk-ambiance.css
<clobrano_> /com/ubuntu/themes/Yaru/3.20/gtk-dark.css
<clobrano_> /com/ubuntu/themes/Yaru/3.20/gtk.css
<clobrano_> same for gresource 3.0
<didrocks> yeah, should workâ¦ weird
<clobrano_> :(
<seb128> Laney, how do I tell autopkgtest to test the jsunit in proposed with the thunderbird in proposed? I though it was using &trigger= for each but that doesn't seem to work
<Laney> &trigger=package/version is correct
<seb128> Laney, thx, it was an escaping fail of the + in the version number
<Laney> ahhhhh
#ubuntu-desktop 2019-09-20
<tjaalton> has anyone noticed gnome upstream doing anything with their plan to support HDR? https://wiki.gnome.org/Initiatives/HDR
<tjaalton> that page is over 2y old
<ricotz> seb128, hi, I have prepared the vala 0.44.8-* package in salsa (debian-0.44 branch), feel free to adjust the version suffix as needed
 * ricotz back in couple hours
<seb128> ricotz, ack
<clobrano> hey all 0/
<clobrano> willcooke, didier, if you have time, I rebased latest Yaru work onto master here https://github.com/ubuntu/yaru/pull/1543, if you could confirm everything works, can be easily merged into master then
<clobrano> didrocks^
<willcooke> \m/ \m/ pulling and testing
<willcooke> clobrano, having the build instructions in the source is sooooooooooooooo nice
<willcooke> git pull && debuild = done
<willcooke> ð
<clobrano> does it work?
<willcooke> still building
<willcooke> ...installing...
<willcooke> ... restarting ...
<willcooke> ...    logging in    ...
<willcooke> clobrano, nope, something not right.  I've got light window headers
<willcooke> and light is missing
<clobrano> ah
<clobrano> let me check
<clobrano> willcooke, stupid question, isn't possible to release didrocks' branch instead that master?
<willcooke> yes, I think that is the easiest thing to do, it's been tested too
<clobrano> willcooke, since the problem is only the time to merge now...
<Laney> it's really weird if we tag a release that isn't in master, any reason that branch can't be merged?
<willcooke> oh, I missread
<willcooke> I assumed that what laney is saying is what you were proposing clobrano
<Laney> note that I'm not up to speed with what you are doing
<clobrano> Laney, rebasing onto master caused some weird effect
<willcooke> i.e. merge didrocks branch to master
<willcooke> hold hold
<willcooke> I checked out master
<willcooke> clobrano, should I have checked out your ambiance branch instead?
<clobrano> no, the PR, the branch is named light-dark-default-rebased
<willcooke> ah ha
<willcooke> my bad
<willcooke> stand by
<clobrano> uhuh, still hope!
<willcooke> clobrano, it wont build because the changelog is missing
<willcooke> clobrano, ignore
<willcooke> cd problem
<willcooke> clobrano, ð
<willcooke> ð
<willcooke> clobrano, works ð¥
<clobrano> willcooke, ð
<willcooke> light and dark work too
<clobrano> great
<willcooke> clobrano, ohhhhh noooooooez.  rhythmbox is broken
<clobrano> willcooke, :O in which way?
<willcooke> it's got a light header bar
<willcooke> restarting, just in case
<willcooke> yeah, I think perhaps the process was still runnning, reboot has fixed it
<clobrano> willcooke, okay I'll reboot as well, because I just installed it and it's broken in my machine
<clobrano> willcooke, I got it! Titlebars are SSD, it needed a shell restart :)
<clobrano> now it's good
<willcooke> clobrano, yeah, all looks good here, tested all the apps, and fine
<clobrano> it's like magic
<willcooke> c'est bon
<willcooke> clobrano, we're heading for lunch, bbiab.
<clobrano> ok :)
<willcooke> clobrano, back from lunch
<clobrano> :) how's french food?
<willcooke> clobrano, it's good!  But we didn't get cheese burgers for lunch like we did in Toronto :)
<clobrano> ahah
<kenvandine> jamesh how does this look?
<kenvandine>  https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/g4BrsMMqcM/
<jamesh> kenvandine: it should look similar to this: /usr/share/dbus-1/services/io.snapcraft.Launcher.service
<jamesh> "This allows confined snaps to activate fwupd via D-Bus"
<duflu> Wimpress, I think the answer for the X server's perspective is the highest of all versions xdpyinfo returns as a loaded extension
<duflu> Either DRI2 or DRI3
<Wimpress> duflu: Thanks
#ubuntu-desktop 2019-09-22
<LargePrime> hi ~$ dkms status rtl8812au
<LargePrime> rtl8812au, 4.3.8.12175.20140902+dfsg, 4.15.0-63-generic, x86_64: installed
<LargePrime> rtl8812au, 4.3.8.12175.20140902+dfsg, 4.15.0-65-generic, x86_64: installed
<LargePrime> ~$ sudo modprobe rtl8812au
<LargePrime> modprobe: FATAL: Module rtl8812au not found in directory /lib/modules/4.15.0-63-generic
<LargePrime> is this expected?
<LargePrime> when ever i do a software update and get a new kernel, i lose my wifi on reboot, and need a hardline to sudo apt install --reinstall rtl8812au-dkms
<LargePrime> please ping
<JanC> that sounds more like a kernel question
<JanC> LargePrime: ^
<LargePrime> so, a software update breaks a device on a desktop, and I should go ask kernel guys?
<LargePrime> kk JanC
<JanC> it's a kernel module that needs to be recompiled on every kernel upgrade
<LargePrime> by the desktop software update
<LargePrime> or do the kernel guys come update it for me?
<JanC> no, DKMS should do that automatically, but apparently something goes wrong there
<LargePrime> agreed
<JanC> and that's all kernel-related software
<LargePrime> infact it does do it. it just does it wrong ish
<JanC> so they would know it best  :)
<LargePrime> which chan would you recommend?
<JanC> #ubuntu-kernel
