#edubuntu 2006-04-24
<cbx33> right nn lucasvo ogra 
<cbx33> hope to catch you all tomorrow in the meeting
<lucasvo> cbx33: g8
<lucasvo> oh, sorry that's swiss german
<lucasvo> gnite
<cbx33> hehe
<JaneW> night all
<highvoltage> night JaneW 
<lucasvo> goodnight JaneW 
<lucasvo> ogra: that's a hot one for me: What's the policy for adding people to kubuntu-members and edubuntu-members launchpad teams ? jriddell, ogra
<Bluekuja> i go
<Bluekuja> cya to all channel
<lucasvo> Bluekuja: cya
<highvoltage> geez, it's getting late.
<lns> Late?? It's only 4:00pm here ;)
<highvoltage> 0:56 here :)
<lns> hehe
<highvoltage> goodnight, #edubuntu!
<highvoltage> ubotu: goodnight
<ubotu> highvoltage: No idea, try searching at http://ubuntu.cc.com.au/
<highvoltage> dumb bot.
<AMDXP> hi there
<Burgundavia> salut AMDXP
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
<cbx33> can the ltsp client be run from the livecd of edubuntu?
<cbx33> my mistake
<cbx33> Is there a howto for getting graphical login for ltsp in edubuntu breezy? or is that not possible.
<highvoltage> cbx33: you should get a graphical login by default
<highvoltage> guys, i'm going to miss (at least most) of the meeting this afternoon, i will be available on irc tonight though
<cbx33> highvoltage: not on breezy
<cbx33> I had to do a lot to get it to work, and not it's broken
<cbx33> :p
<cbx33> I'm going to submit a report to you guys in a while
<cbx33> if that's ok....one of them might be a bug report, if so I'll bug report it on an ok from you guys
<cbx33> highvoltage: were you talking about breezy or dapper edubuntu?
<highvoltage> cbx33: both
<highvoltage> cbx33: although dapper has a nicer, themed login
<cbx33> I'll write up my report and send it along to the ML tonight
<cbx33> is there an agenda for the meeting today?
<mwright1night> Hi anyone about
<ogra> sure
<cbx33> yup
<mwright1night> are you interested in usability in gnome?
<ogra> sure :)
<mwright1night> ogra: cool 
<cbx33> yup
<mwright1night> ok I am keen to get a change made to gnome, it can be done a couple of ways
<mwright1night> Default action is to move like a mac, when you drag and drop a file
<mwright1night> on a PC the default option is to copy
<cbx33> depends whree you're copying it from and to
<mwright1night> problem is, a move is the same as a unix mv and if a directory is set g+s then move does not inherit the permissions
<mwright1night> say home directory to a shared directory set g+s
<ogra> thats rather something for ubuntu, we wont change ubuntu defaults in our packages if possible
<mwright1night> ogra: maybe you could pass on, cause it's particularly a problem in a LTSP environment
<ogra> since we dont want to differ in behavior
<mwright1night> cause what is different about a windows office or windows situation is that they always keep the files on a file server
<mwright1night> I am not having much luck talking to any ubuntu people except for when I ran into Jeff at Linuxworld AU
<mwright1night> and he agreed to get the change into the dot release of gnome
<ogra> try to ask in the ubuntu-desktop mailing list or in #ubuntu-desktop, these are the guys caring for the gnome packages
<mwright1night> but I didn't have any luck with the responsible developer -- which was probably partly my fault
<ogra> i'm pretty sure they want a proper whishlist bug for it ;)
<mwright1night> ok
<mwright1night> it's pretty high on wishlist
<mwright1night> it's the only feature that nautilus is lacking in my user environment
<ogra> it wont happen for dapper, we're working on the beta release which will be out on 20th
<mwright1night> I have this really ugly kludge script that runs every minute from cron fixing permissions
<mwright1night> The excuse I got from gnome people when I tried to get it in gnome, was that windows works the same way
<ogra> did you ask jdub for help ? 
<ogra> (with ubuntu, not gnome upstream i mean)
<mwright1night> but I argue that it does not, cause no one shares the same folder on the same box in win32 land .. they always throw a dozen servers acting as file servers
<mwright1night> yer it was jeff I ran into at linuxworld.. I didn't know his nick on irc though
<ogra> if he agreed with you, he'll be the best person to help 
<mwright1night> Ok but this particularly effects your project
<mwright1night> cause it's terminal server environments that have lots of ordinary end users
<mwright1night> and to save $$$ and have better IO, the shared folder is often on the same server
<mwright1night> It certainly is in the 5 LTSPs I look after
<mwright1night> if it is via a samba share, you can set samba to behave differently
<ogra> might be, but its still a nautilus default that needs fixage in the nautilus package 
<mwright1night> but cause it's the same server, nautilus is in control
<mwright1night> yep
<mwright1night> ok I'll work with them, I thought I could interest you and you'd have move sway with them
<mwright1night> I've been trying to get some action on this for a while
<ogra> i'll support you if i have some time to look into the issue, currently i'm very busy with the beta preparation and testing CDs
<mwright1night> ok fair enough
<mwright1night> I am interested in your teacher tool for ubuntu
<mwright1night> is it out yet?
<ogra> we have the beginnings in dapper universe
<ogra> its called student-control-panel
<ogra> but still needs a lot of love
<mwright1night> I can't come to edubuntu ltsp yet until the october release, cause I need local devices
<mwright1night> I'm trying to set them up now, but I am very excited about ubuntu (as a long time Redhat user)
<ogra> we'll have all you need in universe in dapper
<ogra> you just have to set it up yourself
<cbx33> mwright1night: i recently moved from fedora to ubuntu myself :p
<JaneW> At the meeting today we will be discussing: The Dev Status, Bug Status, Testing Status, Artwork, Web Site progress, Documentation, Cookbook, Edubuntu Memeber status and anything else required to be discussed.
<cbx33> excellent
* cbx33 will be there
<ogra> JaneW, please dont count on me too much... 
<ogra> beta is keeping me very busy
<mwright1night> I haven't moved yet, but we are doing a new LTSP for Friends of the Earth Melbourne www.mel.foe.org.au and radio 3cr www.3cr.org.au
<mwright1night> we will do both of them with dapper drake and see how it goes
<cbx33> cool
<cbx33> 1 hour till meeting yeh?
<mwright1night> then if that goes well, my other 5 LTSPs I will convert to Ubuntu over christmas, Redhat just doesn't care about desktop that much
<cbx33> redhat have generally gone downhill
<JaneW> ogra: can you give us 5-10 mins?
<ogra> sure
<JaneW> mwright1night: that's ironic
<JaneW> friends of the earth = foe ;)
<mwright1night> yer foe
<mwright1night> it's a bit of a bummer 
<mwright1night> maybe fote would be better
<cbx33> :p
<bluekuja> lol i have missed two times
<bluekuja> the shedule
<bluekuja> in ubuntu-meeting
<bluekuja> -.-
<bluekuja> wats the correct command?
<cbx33> @schedule GMT
<cbx33> ok, my LTSP won;t boot at all
<cbx33> http://www.ubuntuforums.org/archive/index.php/t-152005.html
<cbx33> same issue as here?
<ogra> thats a nfs timeout
<cbx33> hmmm
<cbx33> why would it be doing that
<cbx33> oooh
* cbx33 has idea
<JaneW> **Reminder** 7 minutes to the Edubuntu meeting in #ubuntu-meeting
<AndreaVeri> okie 
<cbx33> note taken
<cbx33> ogra: so the approval path is the same as at the CC meetings for ubuntu?
<ogra> yep
<ogra> i'll have to clearify how the status of ubuntumembers is 
<cbx33> I'd better get my tail i ngear then
<cbx33> thank you for all the help today ogra 
<ogra> i.e. are they automatically in edubuntu-members as well
<cbx33> I'll get on with doccing those scripts
<cbx33> so all ubuntu memebrs are edubuntu members?
<ogra> i dont know
<ogra> thats what i need to know
<cbx33> i thought it was a one way thing
<bimberi> vica-versa according to the launchpad setup
<cbx33> that's what i understood, but clarification is a good thing
<cbx33> brb
<ogra> i dont think its really vice versa ...
<ogra> i think edubuntu members are automatically ubuntu members, but not the other way around
<cbx33> yes
<cbx33> that's what i understood
<bimberi> that's what i meant
<ogra> but i'll clearify that before writing the mail
* cbx33 awaits the mail :p
* ogra takes a break while waiting for edubuntu-meta-0.65 to build
<cbx33> good work ogra 
* cbx33 offers ogra a cold beer
<kjcole> TIme for me to do office work...
<kjcole> I wish I could spend more time in IRC than I do.
<kjcole> Later all.
<bobulator> hey everyone, how ya doin?
<bobulator> i got a quick question - im trying to do a network install of regular xubuntu, how can i temporarily disable the thin client stuff?
<ogra> you'll need to use netboot images
<ogra> but i doubt xubuntu has any 
<ogra> the ubuntu ones are here: http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/dapper/main/installer-i386/current/images/netboot/
<bobulator> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Installation/LocalNet
<bobulator> i was trying that?
<bobulator> no dice?
<cbx33> ogra: I'm gonna doc in sgml then convert that work for you?
<ogra> cbx33, sure
<cbx33> I got all I need now I think, once they are ready and approved, shall I submit the bug for debian to get the mincluded upstream?
<ogra> we are upstream
<cbx33> sorry downstream
<ogra> debian occasionally merges from us and we from them
<cbx33> my brain isn't functioning today
<ogra> dont care about debian, i'll do that
<cbx33> is it a good idea to doc when my brain isn't functioning...I'll let you decide :p
<cbx33> np ogra 
<ogra> would be nice if you could do it in bzr
<ogra> its easier to merge that way
<ogra> http://people.ubuntu.com/~ogra/bzr-archive/ltsp/dapper/ is the current upstream branch 
<cbx33> ow would i do that?
<ogra> mkdir ltsp
<ogra> cd ltsp
<cbx33> I've never had exposure to bzr 
<ogra> bzr get http://people.ubuntu.com/~ogra/bzr-archive/ltsp/dapper/
<ogra> make your changes 
<cbx33> hi highvoltage 
<ogra> bzr commit -m'i made some changes'
<ogra> then upload the tree to a webserver and notify me
<highvoltage> hi cbx33 
<ogra> i can just run bzr merge <url> then
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
<cbx33> ok
<bobulator> ogra, you think the localnet boot is no go and i need to use the netboot image?
<ogra> bobulator, you need an image that installs xubuntu 
<ogra> we dont have such an image i fear
<bobulator> on that page though, you just use the normal disk iso
<ogra> ah, then follow these instructions
<bobulator> i mean im not really that fussed between them, it just looked like the simplest way
<bobulator> but its trying to thin client boot, how i i stop it? :)
<ogra> i only have done normal net installs of ubuntu so far
<bobulator> ah cool
<ogra> no idea and i'm currently working to get the beta CD images ready... its not really the time for me to give support
<bobulator> haha ok thats cool :)
<bobulator> do i need to alter the netboot instructions much?
<bobulator> for booting off an edubuntu server
<ogra> no idea
<bobulator> ah you only ever done it off standalones?
<cbx33> ogra: that bzr command fails
<bimberi> cbx33: what do you get?
<cbx33> an integer is required
<ogra> dpkg -l bzr ? 
<cbx33> up it's installed ok
<cbx33> do i have to run this from a dapper root, or can it be fro ma breezy root?
<ogra> which version
<cbx33>  0.1.1-0ubuntu1 bazaar-ng, the next-generation distributed v
<cbx33> is that one too old?
<ogra> 0.8~2006040710 is recent
<cbx33> I'll try it from within my dapper chroot
<cbx33> ok works now
<cbx33> bzr: ERROR: An error has been detected in the repository http://people.ubuntu.com/~ogra/bzr-archive/ltsp/dapper/.Please run bzr reconcile on this repository.
<munzir> Hi, most apps I launch from a terminal shows: X Error: BadDevice, invalid or uninitialized input device 169   Major opcode:  147  Minor opcode:  3 Failed to open device
<ogra> gah, crap, that a11y stuff ate all the free space on the isos 
<ogra> cbx33, did you wipe the tree before using the newer version ? might be old cruft from the try with 0.1.1 
<jsgotangco> ogra, yeah i would have expected that
<jsgotangco> did we just explode?
<ogra> i didnt
<ogra> since nobody notified me that there were seed changes at all
<jsgotangco> i was surprised when my desktop started downloading dasher
<ogra> dholbach neither merges with edubuntu (as all the others do) nor does he notify me if he changes the ubuntu seed
<jsgotangco> i guess he doesn't like little children? heh
<ogra> so it was a bit surprising, since i had planned to use the 20MB free space i had managed over the last weeks for languages
<ogra> nah, he's just not used to seed management
<ogra> its an oversight
<jsgotangco> i guess we're shipping a11y by default then
<jsgotangco> can you remove those?
<ogra> i *could* 
<ogra> i'm just not sure if i *should* :)
<ogra> gnome-a11y-themes are ~2MB alone 
<jsgotangco> ahh the high contrast stuff
<jsgotangco> however the installer has a11y stuff too
<ogra> that as well
<ogra> and i dont know on which parts it relies
<ogra> its not documented yet
<jsgotangco> it seems to have all components
<jsgotangco> even festival
<jsgotangco> hrmm
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
<Bluekuja> Mr highvoltage 
<Bluekuja> welcome
<highvoltage> hi mr Bluekuja 
<lucasvo> hi highvoltage 
<lucasvo> hi Bluekuja 
<lucasvo> sorry, I couldn't make it to the meeting
<highvoltage> Bluekuja: when's the next cc meeting?
<highvoltage> hi lucasvo 
<highvoltage> lucasvo: how are things?
<Bluekuja> hi lucasvo :)
<lucasvo> well, I sold a website to a customer, so I think they aren't that bad. :)
<Bluekuja> i dont know when it will be, im trying to talk with elmo
* lucasvo has to reed the logs
<highvoltage> lucasvo: great
<lucasvo> highvoltage: what about the edubuntu website?
<highvoltage> lucasvo: i'm going to make the font a bit bigger, and get the edubuntu pages so that it will work fine, and then we go live.
<highvoltage> then i'll send the edubuntu theme to both you and pips1
<Bluekuja> jon translations?
<highvoltage> or i'll find a place where we can play a bit
<highvoltage> then we can build forward on what we have.
<highvoltage> Bluekuja: let me just check launchpad...
<spacey> argh
* spacey gets NFS server not responding with LTSP setup suddenly
<Bluekuja> ok
<lucasvo> highvoltage: I think the news are more important than the related projects
<ogra> spacey, so did someone start a dhcp server in your net
<lucasvo> maybe one could move them up?
<highvoltage> lucasvo: yeah
<spacey> ogra: probably not but actually i would not be enterily suprised
<spacey> we did an upgrade this weekend, but that shouldn't have caused the problem
<ogra> you should see where the IP comes from if usplash drops you to console mode
<spacey> we placed a second server and upgraded the "backbone" switch to gbit
<spacey> hmmm
<spacey> bring me on an idea
<spacey> s/bring/brings
<lucasvo> highvoltage: I like the new searchbox
<highvoltage> lucasvo: thanks
<lucasvo> fits the design better
<highvoltage> Bluekuja: jordi is helping me now
<highvoltage> lucasvo: Burgwork freaked out a bit at the blue, so i changed it :)
<lucasvo> highvoltage: well, he did a good job
<lucasvo> ;)
<highvoltage> :)
<lucasvo> !seen LaserJock
<ubotu> laserjock <n=mantha@ubuntu/member/laserjock> was last seen on IRC in channel #kubuntu, 11d 10h 39m 51s ago, saying: 'I know Seveas has a little repo for it, but I haven't seen any work on it for Dapper'.
<ogra> blue ?
<lucasvo> ogra: yeah, the search button was blue
<ogra> oh, yes, i remember
* highvoltage liked the blue
<drbreen> how do i build the /opt/ltsp/i386 directory again (on ubuntu) ? my clients seem to need it for network boot...
<ogra> sudo ltsp-build-client you mean ?
<drbreen> ltsp-build-client takes ages just to verify the packages ?
<ogra> yes, it checks the md5 sums etc ...
<Burgwork> highvoltage, I did not freak out. I expressed concern about colour consistency
<drbreen> ok
<drbreen> thx
<highvoltage> Burgwork: yes, so you did.
<drbreen> so i should not download tgz packages ?
* HedgeMage peeks in
<highvoltage> Burgwork: didn't mean to offend :)
<drbreen> cause it downloads packages
<drbreen> with ltspadmin
<ogra> never ever use ltspadmin with ubuntu ltsp installed
<ogra> that breaks completely
<ogra> sudo apt-get remove --purge ltsp-utils ... there is a reason it is in universe ;)
<highvoltage> ogra: ltspadmin installs in /usr/sbin/ltspadmin
<highvoltage> ogra: do you think we should put a script higher in the path, that prints a message that ltspadmin shouldn't be used with ubuntu ltsp?
<ogra> highvoltage, its neither shipped, nor supported nor in main
<Burgwork> highvoltage, nope :)
<highvoltage> ogra: ok, but many people seem to use it, we often hear about this more than once a week.
<ogra> so i dont really care ... if users install the stuff from universe thats their own fault
<ogra> yes, it was on the CD in breezy
<ogra> thats a problem with breezy, but it was fixed in breezy updates as well as in dapper
<highvoltage> ok, then i suppose it will be less of a problem in the future.
<ogra> yep
<drbreen> ARGL
<drbreen> i used ltsp-admin
<drbreen> now do i have to rebuild everything and stuff ?
<ogra> would make sense, yes, is that breezy or dapper ? 
<drbreen> breezy
<drbreen> and it just worked - shit
<ogra> you have to decide for either ltsp implementation
<drbreen> ok yeah i know
<drbreen> and the ubuntu one was the one liked
<ogra> ok
<drbreen> so what can i do now
<ogra> so use the command i gave above
<drbreen> i have
<drbreen> and how can i rebuild
<drbreen> when everything is installed
<ogra> ok, now do the same with ltsp-server and ltsp-server-standalone
<drbreen> ok
<ogra> then rm -rf /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp
<ogra> then rm -rf /opt/ltsp/i386
<ogra> then install ltsp-server-standalone again and run ltsp-build-client
<ogra> after that adjust /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf, start the dhcp server and boot a client :)
<drbreen> thanks
* spacey will go to location shortly and test some stuff
* spacey fears the worst
<ogra> spacey, either your nfs server is really broken, or the client tries to mount from the wrong machine ... 
<ogra> no rocket science ...
<spacey> well
<spacey> at least the nfs server works for other mounts
<ogra> do you have portmap restricted on the server in any way 
<ogra> (hosts.allow/deny come to mind)
<spacey> nop
<spacey> the wierd thing is that it worked (yesterday as well).
<spacey> and today it doesn't
<spacey> and i can't see any relation with the upgrade we had this weekend
<spacey> although the ltsp wiki said something about that ip fragmentation problems etc.
<spacey> but that doesn't make sense
<spacey> for this error
<spacey> anyway
* ..[topic/#edubuntu:ogra] :  Edubuntu - the education version of Ubuntu, download: http://releases.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/5.10/ | Mailing List http://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/edubuntu-devel | Wiki: http://wiki.edubuntu.org | Website http://www.edubuntu.org | MEETING: every wednesday at 12:00 UTC | Read before installing: http://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuInstallNotes | Please test our beta candidate http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/daily/20060419.1/ (and the daily-li
<spacey> i'm go there in 15 min and poke around a bit :)
* ..[topic/#edubuntu:ogra] :  Edubuntu - the education version of Ubuntu, download: http://releases.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/5.10/ | Mailing List http://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/edubuntu-devel | Wiki: http://wiki.edubuntu.org | Website http://www.edubuntu.org | MEETING: every wednesday at 12:00 UTC | Read before installing: http://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuInstallNotes | Please test our beta candidate http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/daily/20060419.1/ (liveCD as well)
<spacey> edgy eft
<spacey> heh
<highvoltage> pggt.
<highvoltage> drupal's translation just covers the drupal words (menu's, etc), not the content. that is quite depressing.
<HedgeMage> highvoltage: IIRC there is a way to extend that... I'll look when TT naps
<highvoltage> HedgeMage: nice, that would be very much appreciated
<highvoltage> HedgeMage: #drupal is convinced that you can't :(
<HedgeMage> highvoltage: well, a friend of mine was in the process of hacking together a drupal module to add that functionality, the question is whether it's done or not
<HedgeMage> (or if it's close enough we could finish it off for the edubuntu site)
<highvoltage> ok
<HedgeMage> if not, I bet we could come up with one
<HedgeMage> I've been playing with drupal for a while and am pretty familiar with it
<highvoltage> cook
<highvoltage> i mean... cool.
<HedgeMage> :)
<AMDXP> anyone using the dapper version of Edubuntu?
<highvoltage> AMDXP: yes, lots of people :)
<highvoltage> AMDXP: i'm running dapper on my system, i have all of the edubuntu packages installed. something i can assist with?
<spacey> dammit
<HedgeMage> spacey: nice to see you, too :P
<spacey> hi
<spacey> this nfs server not responding error is not good for my mood
<spacey> the client seems to get the right ip address if i look at the dhcpd logs
<spacey> i can mount /opt/ltsp on my laptop
<ogra> what kind of ltsp ? 
<spacey> the classic one, so nothing to worry for you ogra;)
<ogra> i expected that, but still, 4.1 or 4.2 ?
<spacey> 4.1
<ogra> hmm, thats an 2.4 kernel, right ? 
<spacey> nope
<spacey> 2.6.9
<ogra> oh
<spacey> it has both
<ogra> sad, i know there is some discrepancy in nfs handling and framesize between 2.4 and .26
<ogra> *2.6 too
<ogra> but if you use 2.6 all over that cant be it
<spacey> wierd thing is just that everything worked fine till today
<spacey> that cracks my nuts
* spacey recalls the phrase "everything worked just fine till today" from his past part time helpdesk job
<ogra> a cleaning woman that unplugged the network cable ? 
<spacey> ogra: well in that case it wouldn't tftp either :)
<ogra> if the plug isnt plugged in completely ? 
<spacey> hmm
<spacey> well at least the rest of the network traffic is no problem
<ogra> or the NIC doesnt work in full duplex, did you check with miitool ?
<spacey> thats wierd
<spacey> the edubuntu server says it has 100mbit full duplex
<spacey> but the switch says it the edubuntu server has 1000mbit
<ogra> hmm, so its a switch configuration bug i'd guess
<ogra> or a bug in the NIC driver
<HedgeMage> highvoltage: still about?
<ogra> is the server supposed to have gigE ?
<spacey> yup
<spacey> we made it gbitE this weekend
<spacey> so it could be related
<highvoltage> HedgeMage: yep
<ogra> yup, you said so
<spacey> dmesg says it 1000mbit
<spacey> but mii-tool says 100mbit-FD
<ogra> probably miitool is just silly
<HedgeMage> highvoltage: talked to the person I mentioned... he abondoned the project shortly after starting it, so no go there... I still think we should be able to hack something together though
<ogra> what happens if you patch the client to another port  ?
<spacey> i think i should drag a client from the classroom to the switch then
<highvoltage> HedgeMage: ok, thanks for checking up on that
<spacey> since the wires here are mad
<highvoltage> goodnight HedgeMage, ogra and spacey 
<spacey> gn highvoltage
<HedgeMage> np
<HedgeMage> night night highvoltage 
<HedgeMage> BTW, who schedules the edubuntu meetings?
<ogra> we didnt really schedule more than once and decided it fits everyone participating ...
* HedgeMage wants to whine about the bad timing, and not rotating times like main ubuntu at least
<ogra> if that changed we need to rotate the schedule
<ogra> or reschedule
<HedgeMage> ogra: well, I can say that I'd show up if it weren't in the 4 or 6 hour window where I really really have to sleep
<ogra> we had only east coast people here so far
<ogra> for them its 8:00 am or something
<ogra> we'll move the date then
<HedgeMage> it's 4am for me :(
<HedgeMage> yay!
* HedgeMage hugs ogra 
<spacey> well that didn't have any effect
<spacey> i wonder if setting nfs to tcp would help
<ogra> try it ? 
<spacey> yeah
<spacey> should be able to set it in /linuxrc
<Burgwork> ogra, I would love it we could rotate the schedule
<Burgwork> I am the same tz as HedgeMage (in fact, so is robitaille)
<ogra> JaneW, will hate me for that :)
<ogra> but since we can approve members now, we'll have to offer more TZ compatibility
<HedgeMage> approve members?
<ogra> yep
* HedgeMage wonders what ogra means
<ogra> if you want an ubuntu.com mailadress or want to be a developer, the first step is to become a ubuntu member
<ogra> we can now also make edubuntu members
<AMDXP> well i hope to download and try out edubuntu i think this will be great for my niece
<ogra> HedgeMage, http://www.ubuntu.com/community/processes/newmember
<spacey> is edubuntu and ubuntu membership seperated?
<HedgeMage> ahh
<ogra> spacey, nope
<spacey> so whats the difference?:)
<ogra> if you are a edubuntu member, you automatically become a ubuntu member
<ogra> that the CC doesnt approve edubuntu applicants anymore
<spacey> not through community council?
<ogra> same for kubuntu
<spacey> aha
<ogra> nope, through the edubuntu "council"
<spacey> hehe
<ogra> (which we dont have yet)
<HedgeMage> ogra: ahh spiffy
<spacey> what do you have in mind for edubuntu council
<ogra> the advantage is that you get both mail adresses as edubuntu member
<ogra> ;)
<ogra> ubuntu.com and edubuntu.org :)
<spacey> yay :P
<ogra> spacey, at least 3 people 
<ogra> i think we'll start with jane and me and an elected community member 
<ogra> i'd like to step back from that responsibility at some point though
<ogra> i'll send a mail to the list so we can discuss it after the beta dust has settled around me :)
* HedgeMage nods
<Bluekuja> ogra: news about the next cc meeting?
<Bluekuja> agenda is still not updated
<ogra> Bluekuja, why do you ask me ? 
<ogra> i have no clue
<Bluekuja> ogra: coz you know everything 
<ogra> i'm not a CC member
<Bluekuja> ahha im joking :)
<ogra> :)
<Bluekuja> i think that oliver can answer to an infinity of questions
<Bluekuja> giving a great answer
<Bluekuja> ;)
<spacey> too bad i missed the meeting today
<spacey> anyway i'm off home
<spacey> time to call it a day regarding ltsp
<spacey> bbl
<LaserJock> ogra: so I could have 2 email addresses, how cool ;-)
<ogra> yep
<LaserJock> if it weren't for the time I'd be making the edubuntu meetings
<ogra> ok, thats already two vioces 
<mzuverink> Is there a location that has a bunch of kvtml files for the various kde apps that make up edubuntu?
<Bluekuja> goodnight #edubuntu :)
<HedgeMage> night night Bluekuja 
<lucasvo> LaserJock: hi
<lucasvo> LaserJock: ogra said you were working on making edubuntu suit a highschool/university use?
<lucasvo> damn!
<lucasvo> gimp crashed again
<lns> lucasvo, I would think Edubuntu in a university would be straying a bit from Edubuntu's goals..just MHO though
<lns> I would think straight Ubuntu/LTSP would be much better suited
<Burgwork> the needs of a university are different but similar to those of a school
<ogra> lns, how would you define edubuntus goals ? 
<lns> uh oh, i pissed off the leader ;) j/k
<lns> well
<ogra> nope
<lns> it says right on the site, "Linux for YOUNG human beings"
<ogra> you didnt its an important question
<lns> and the graphical content, themes and a bunch of applications already in Edubuntu are geared toward ages 3-9
<ogra> that changes in dapper
<lns> what changes?
#edubuntu 2006-04-25
<ogra> the themeing
<lns> I'm using Dapper flight 6, will it change from that?
<ogra> yep
<lns> right on =)
<lns> can you describe the changes? I'm really curious
<ogra> at least the wallpaper of the default theme will be rather neutral
<lns> oh cool
<lucasvo> lns: exactly, but why not make another theme?
<lucasvo> install more advanced apps
<ogra> the "young" theme will get another wallpaper
<ogra> and the "plain" theme wont change 
<lns> that's good - some feedback i got from my customer was "a lot of kids older than 9 won't like the little girl, especially the boys"
<lns> hehe
<ogra> btw, try sudo dpkg-reconfigure edubuntu-artwork if youre on dapper 
<lns> lucasvo, i don't see anything wrong with making another theme
<ogra> (only works if you use the default theme with the user you log in with)
<lns> but in a university, most people won't want apps like "tux type" and "potato guy" ;) (even though i love them both and i'm 25)
<lucasvo> lns: hm, yes, I would like to calculate with complex numbers
<lucasvo> :)
<lns> ogra, thanks i'll do that when i'm there next =)
<lucasvo> is there a very very very advanced calculator licensed under gpl?
<lucasvo> or is a Texas Instruments the only whay to go ?
<lns> i'm sure there are tons
<lns> lucasvo, apt-cache search calculator
<ogra> heh, you've beaten me
<lns> ogra, will the reconf of artwork change anybody's already modified backgrounds?
<ogra> nope
<ogra> only the system defaults
<lns> cool
<lns> oh here's another thing i got today
<ogra> if that is overriden by a user config already it wont change
<lns> the staff was confused as to where the pics from "Tuxpaint" went because the kids wanted to make their background what they did in that pgm
<lns> maybe, by default we could consider changing the $savedir var into a non-hidden directory in their home dirs?
<ogra> hmm, good question
<lns> just a thought
<ogra> yep, sounds sane
<lns> right now it's saved in ~/.tuxpaint/saved/
<lns> awesome! =)
<ogra> but i'm not sure how that affects upgrades indeed :/
<ogra> i.e. former users wont find their pics anymore
<lucasvo> ogra: maybe make a script that copies the files
<lns> well if we modify /etc/tuxpaint/tuxpaint.conf it won't overwrite it upon upgrade by default, right?
<lns> oh yeah
<lns> i was gonna do it by hand...
<lns> <--- needs to learn scripting really really badly
<ogra> lucasvo, that'd need to *always* be wrapped around the prog then 
<ogra> thats not a good idea ...
<ogra> and you cant do it in the package either, because it affects userdata ...
<lns> what about making a script and just making it available on edubuntu website for those who want to use it?
<ogra> that will still require them to read that page ...
<lucasvo> maybe ask if the user wants to have the data saved in .tuxpaint or in another folder. and also write that changing will affect userdata
<ogra> dont forget, we have many users that have no internet access ...
<ogra> lucasvo, ask when/where ?
<lucasvo> ogra: during installation
<lucasvo> like dhcp asks for an IP
<lucasvo> ogra: can't one determine if it is a fresh install or if it is an update?
* lucasvo is an absolute .deb noob
<ogra> installer questions are a big nono 
<lns> i think asking that question would confuse a LOT of users especially if they're teachers with no linux experience
<ogra> we already have some more than ubuntu/kubuntu
<ogra> which is not appreciated but unavoidable if you install a dhcp server distro ...
<lucasvo> or maybe just make a script that runs instead of tuxpaint. which copies all the files to a more reasonable place and than runs tuxpaint
<ogra> thats what i meant above, you'll carry this around for eternity
<lns> hehe
<lucasvo> ogra: ah yes
<lns> what about creating a symlink that's not hidden?
<ogra> you dont know from which version a user updates 
<ogra> lns, thats an option
* lns loves symlinks
<lns> that way there's no actual config changes either
<ogra> but you need to patch the program ... to create the symlink if its not there
<ogra> (which should be configurable, so you even add a new config option)
<lns> ahh true
* lucasvo loves a 10lines long ./configure :)
<lns> is there any way in gnome to detect the first time an app is launched for each user?
<lns> like the absense of gconf settings, etc?
<lucasvo> anyway,  I go now
<lucasvo> good night
<lns> later lucasvo!
<lns> could we communicate this feature request upstream to tuxpaint?
<lns> maybe if they make the change in the package it would be better? then we don't have to worry about patching, etc.?
<LaserJock> lucasvo: are you still here?
<lucasvo> LaserJock: well, I just brushed my teeth :)
<LaserJock> lucasvo: sorry, I was setting up a laser flurescence lab
<lucasvo> cool
<LaserJock> lucasvo: yes, I'm interested in university (especially scientific) use of Ubuntu in general and Edubuntu
<lucasvo> I am interested in using ubuntu for myself, so advanced math in highschool and chemistry and other things
<lucasvo> LaserJock: what are you using it for at the moment?
<LaserJock> lucasvo: well, I use Ubuntu for as much as I can, writing papers, presentations, data collection, data analysis
<lucasvo> gnuplot?
<LaserJock> heck yeah
<LaserJock> actually I'm moving stuff over to python
<LaserJock> so I'm trying to get matplotlib set up instead of gnuplot
<LaserJock> although there is a gnuplot wrapper for python
<LaserJock> I use scipy quite a bit
<LaserJock> I'd like to put together some metapackages for science fields
<LaserJock> for edgy
<lucasvo> yeah, that would be cool
<LaserJock> lucasvo: so you want to do some complex number calculations?
<lucasvo> yeah, but atm, I prefer to sleep
<lucasvo> :)
<lucasvo> cu tomorrow
<eDRUcated> hello
* HedgeMage peeks in
<HedgeMage> hi eDRUcated 
<Sergi0> hi
<eDRUcated> hello
<eDRUcated> so you all use edubuntu
<HedgeMage> and/or work on it :)
<eDRUcated> cool
<eDRUcated> i was considering it for my next OS
<eDRUcated> i am a 19 yo science major
* HedgeMage nods
<HedgeMage> well, if you have questions, we're here to help
<eDRUcated> i am planning on starting up my own private home schooling type facility
<eDRUcated> ok
<eDRUcated> thank you
<eDRUcated> so what is your background Mage
<HedgeMage> I've been using Linux for about 10 years, give or take, and working with various educational FOSS projects for about that long... my mom's a teacher, I have taken on a lot of (informal) teaching roles over the years, and my son uses edubuntu :)
<HedgeMage> what kind of "facility" are you talking about (and what country are you in?)
* HedgeMage is curious
<eDRUcated> i am in the US but i am moving to Canada really soon to countinue my education. 
<eDRUcated> i am planning on a private home school for grade 7 and up
<eDRUcated> i would like some info on how to start up a server network so that the student in my school can learn from home and in the building
<eDRUcated> and how to setup a irc server for the students and teachers to use as well
<HedgeMage> :)
<eDRUcated> hedge are you there
<HedgeMage> yep 
<HedgeMage> sorry, I tend to pop in and out
<eDRUcated> oo
<eDRUcated> ok
<eDRUcated> sorry
<HedgeMage> I am watching my 3yo son, and i'm a freenode staffer so I occassionally get caught up chasing spambots and doing user service and stuff
<eDRUcated> i feel rude now
<eDRUcated> oo
<eDRUcated> ok
<HedgeMage> that's okay, I just multitask more than most people
<eDRUcated> i do a lot too
<eDRUcated> lol
<eDRUcated> i understand
<eDRUcated> i am head of my county as alternative student lifestyle and a political advocate for the same. i practice a bit of street and loop hole law and have 16 credits at my college. i also tutor and am a student aid/teacher in 3 classes
<eDRUcated> it is hell
<HedgeMage> where are you starting from? totally new to linux? linux user? linux admin experience?  if you do have experience, what distro(s) are you most familiar with?
<eDRUcated> i love it
<HedgeMage> lol
<eDRUcated> i have SEEN Knoppix
<eDRUcated> lol
<eDRUcated> and i have studied what different things do
<HedgeMage> hehe okay :)
<eDRUcated> ok
<eDRUcated> so what do you go to tell me 
<eDRUcated> oo
<eDRUcated> in case you are wondering i am using Mac OS X
<eDRUcated> shoot
<eDRUcated> i will brb
<eDRUcated> need to run to the store
<eDRUcated> i will BRB
<HedgeMage> if I were you, I'd start by putting edubuntu or ubuntu on the computer you use the most, and getting used to using/admin'ing that box... then start running a server here and one there just for practice playing with them
<HedgeMage> I tend to learn best by experimentation... if you're the (much more patient) type who reads docs *before* they break something... you might want to start differently ;)
<HedgeMage> hi jinty 
<jinty> heya HedgeMage
<jinty> what's up?
<HedgeMage> not much... mommytasking ( a step or three above multitasking ) as usual ;)
<eDRUcated> hello again
<LaserJock> eDRUcated: oh, heah. I was just reading the backlog
<eDRUcated> oo
<eDRUcated> ok
<LaserJock> I'm a PhD chemistry student and was homeschooled for a while
<LaserJock> and I'm typing from OSX at the moment ;-)
<eDRUcated> me too
<eDRUcated> i am looking into using it as a teaching tool
<LaserJock> eDRUcated: what age range?
<eDRUcated> grades 7 - 12
<eDRUcated> i am 19 myself but i almost have my associates and am moving right to my Bachelor's
<eDRUcated> why do you ask
<LaserJock> just interested, it seem like Edubuntu is a little more suited for younger kids
<LaserJock> I haven't really used it much so far. My ubuntu box is down at the moment so I'm using chroots for all my dev work
<eDRUcated> i see
<eDRUcated> i am very new to all this
<LaserJock> but I think Edubuntu (and Ubuntu in general) have lots of potential in educational/academic settings
<eDRUcated> yes
<eDRUcated> i totally agree
<eDRUcated> so how old are you
<LaserJock> lets see, I'm 24 now, almost done with my PhD
<eDRUcated> and what type of Apple Computer do you have
<eDRUcated> wow
<eDRUcated> i am impresseed
<LaserJock> intel Imac
<eDRUcated> impressed**
<eDRUcated> i see
<eDRUcated> nice
<eDRUcated> i am still on my iBook G4
<LaserJock> well, my advisor bought it for me so it isn't exactly mine
<LaserJock> but I use it like 12 hrs a day
<eDRUcated> i am getting a MacBook Pro in 4 weeks
<eDRUcated> lol
<eDRUcated> i see
<eDRUcated> where are you if you dont mind me asking
<eDRUcated> and what is your PhD in
<LaserJock> Reno, NV and Physical Chemistry
<eDRUcated> wow
<eDRUcated> i am majoring in Biology
<eDRUcated> so we are both Science Majors
<eDRUcated> nice
<LaserJock> yeah
<eDRUcated> what kinda of computer you got at home
<LaserJock> I've got  Windows and Ubuntu desktops (1.8GHz AMD) that I'm going to merge this week and a Windows laptop that I do a lot of work from
<eDRUcated> i am just on my 14 inch Apple iBook G4 1.4 GHz
<eDRUcated> i got 1 GB of RAM
<LaserJock> btw,  somewhat off-topic but I lead a team of devs (and interested people) that look after science apps in the Universe repo
<eDRUcated> ok, what are you proposing
<LaserJock> so if you are ever interested in sciece related apps you can hang out over in #ubuntu-motu ;-)
<eDRUcated> ok
<eDRUcated> i will remember that
<LaserJock> eDRUcated: if you find bugs and stuff or what to get a favorit science app in the repos, there are people who work on those things ;-)
<LaserJock> *want
<eDRUcated> how do you do the private thing on here
<eDRUcated> lol
<LaserJock> use /query I think
<eDRUcated> like so i can talk to you and just you
<HedgeMage> /query nickname   or   /msg nickname
<eDRUcated> ok
* HedgeMage peeks back in
<eDRUcated> ?msg NickServ IDENTIFY 5534
<bimberi> eDRUcated: you had better change that password
<eDRUcated> lol
<eDRUcated> i know
<bimberi> :)
<eDRUcated> how do i do that
<eDRUcated> lol
<eDRUcated> help
<eDRUcated> someone
<eDRUcated> anyone
<bimberi> eDRUcated: not sure,  i think it will be '/msg nickserv register <newpassword>' (once you have already identified)
<eDRUcated> ok
<eDRUcated> thanks
<bimberi> eDRUcated: that worked?
<eDRUcated> no
<eDRUcated> ahhhh
<eDRUcated> it is not working
<eDRUcated> oh well
<eDRUcated> it is fine i guess
<eDRUcated> i will have someone else help me out later 
<eDRUcated> lol
<bimberi> eDRUcated: you're not identified, do that first
<bimberi> got it ...
<bimberi> /msg nickserv set password <newpassword>
<bimberi> (once you've identified)
<eDRUcated> ok
<eDRUcated> thanks
<bimberi> yw :)
<eDRUcated> thank you
<eDRUcated> hehehe
<bimberi> have you heard of schooltool?
<bimberi> eDRUcated: ^^^^
<eDRUcated> yes
<eDRUcated> it is built in
<eDRUcated> that is what i am using to schedule and all that good stuff
<bimberi> great :)
<eDRUcated> all classwork will be done on the edubuntu system
<eDRUcated> attendance will be tracked through IRC chat rooms
<eDRUcated> when not in the building
<eDRUcated> it is a great plan
<eDRUcated> just needs to be built
<eDRUcated> i have all the ideas in my head
<eDRUcated> i just need to learn the system
<bimberi> it sounds great
<eDRUcated> so do you think you could offer any sort of help
<bimberi> eDRUcated: if you have problems ask here and if i'm about and can help i will :)
<HedgeMage> so will I :)
<bimberi> when not 'mommytasking' :P
<HedgeMage> yep :)
<HedgeMage> and sometimes while mommytasking :)
* bimberi does some of that too
<HedgeMage> hehe
<HedgeMage> a fellow mommy geek? cool. :D
* Yagisan waves hello
<HedgeMage> hi Yagisan 
<Yagisan> G'day HedgeMage. How are you today ?
<HedgeMage> Yagisan: pretty good... about to put TT (my son) to bed.  I'll be right back
<Yagisan> HedgeMage: no worries. My son is busy trying to hit the keyboard
<HedgeMage> lol
<HedgeMage> how old?
<Yagisan> he's 5 months
<HedgeMage> awww
<Yagisan> he, like his big sister, has a strong interest in the pc
<HedgeMage> :)
* HedgeMage looks for a place to insert a random plug for ##parenting
<HedgeMage> ;)
<HedgeMage> TT loves it too
<Yagisan> my wife thinks I'll turn them into geeks.
<HedgeMage> you say that as if it's a bad thing :P
<Yagisan> according to mum it is. I do have to consider the fact that I don't have a basement for them to live in too.
<HedgeMage> rofl
<HedgeMage> hey, I was a geek and I moved out at 17
<HedgeMage> I did move back for a few months, but that was extreme circumstances (hubby was deployed and I'd just gotten TT back after a kidnapping)
<Yagisan> oh shit
* Yagisan left home @ 16. but that wasn't really by choice
* HedgeMage nods
<HedgeMage> He's in one piece, he probably won't even remember it, and I got him back... that's what's important :)
<Yagisan> happen while shopping ?
<HedgeMage> No, a friend of the family was babysitting him and she cracked.
<HedgeMage> She and her husband couldn't have kids, and she found out the day or so before that they lost the little girl they were adopting... he was deployed, she freaked out and went loopy
<Yagisan> I suppose my not having any baby sitters around for 6000km is a blessing then.
<Yagisan> I'm glad your son is safe
<HedgeMage> thanks
<LaserJock> yeah, that is really horrible
* bimberi has come back in the middle of something - doesn't read well but glad to see things are ok
* Yagisan would have had an excessively violent reaction to that
<Yagisan> HedgeMage: you work for freenode ?
<HedgeMage> Yagisan: I wanted to beat her to a bloody pulp... but she was genuinely nuts, not malicious... she didn't hurt him just decided he was her kid... really cracked... I hope she got help
<HedgeMage> mostly I didn't because he was watching me
<HedgeMage> Yagisan: I'm a volunteer network staffer :)
<Yagisan> I'm sad to say, both my children have watched me beat the shit out of someone twice my size that wanted to harm them
<Yagisan> HedgeMage: Is their a procedure to re-assign control of a channel, when the person that set it up hasn't been seen in over a year ?
<Yagisan> HedgeMage: I ask, because for a project I'm involved in, we don't have anyone the can devoice rude uses, and kick the ones that are promoting warez
<Yagisan> s/uses/users
<HedgeMage> Yagisan: is it a #primary channel or an ##about channel?
<Yagisan> HedgeMage: the channel is #doomsday
<HedgeMage> it's a #primary channel so you need to fill out a GCF and explain the situation in the notes section, I'll grab you a link to the form
<Yagisan> HedgeMage: thank you.
<HedgeMage> np
<HedgeMage> Yagisan: http://freenode.net/group_contact_form.shtml
<HedgeMage> make sure to add in there some way for us to confirm you're actually involved with the project (part of the standard procedure)
<HedgeMage> Yagisan: GCF confirms are very slow right now as we have a HUGE backlog, but if you remind me over the weekend, I will try to bump you up the list :)
<Yagisan> HedgeMage: thanks. It's easy to confirm of part of the project :) I'm the Ubuntu maintainer, I post on the developers blog, and soon, I'll have svn access, once project lead gets his adsl reconnected.
<HedgeMage> Yagisan: cool :)
<Yagisan> HedgeMage: It's deng, a doom port. :) I ah, taught my 2 year old daughter to play it
<Yagisan> she can do map 1 of doom2
<Yagisan> mum wasn't happy :()
<HedgeMage> I bet. 
<HedgeMage> I'd kick hubby's but if he let TT do doom
<Yagisan> oddly enough, it's less violent then what's on tv.
<Yagisan> but she would rather play with her brother, rather then dad
<HedgeMage> we don't let him watch mainstream TV either :P
<Yagisan> I watch all the childrens shows before I let my kids watch them
<Yagisan> and the vast majority of them
<Yagisan> seem to promote stupidity
<HedgeMage> yep, but not all
<Yagisan> "lets stick our feet into the bucket, not pick it up or walk around it"
<Yagisan> there is only a few shows I let them watch now
<Yagisan> "Play School" is the main one
<Yagisan> actually, I feel old watching that
<Yagisan> it's been on air longer then I've been on the planet
<Yagisan> HedgeMage: what is your interest in edubuntu ?
<bimberi> Yagisan: we use a TiVo to filter TV for our boys.  It just records shows they (and we) like which are on at any time and they can just browse through its interface and pick what they want
<bimberi> (this is in .au by the way :) )
<HedgeMage> Yagisan: Well, I have been passionate about FOSS in education for a long time.  My first sysadmin gig was for my local school district, and my mom is a teacher... I was part of another edu project a while back but left due to politics :/
<HedgeMage> bbiab phone
<Yagisan> bimberi: my reception is crap. but I used my pc + tvtuner in my last place to do a similar thing
<bimberi> Yagisan: ah - yes you mentioned something about 6000km earlier :)
<Yagisan> HedgeMage: I have an interest in the ltsp component (it sparks my inner geek), and I'd like my kids to be computer literate when they grow up, so I think this can help
<Yagisan> bimberi: yeah. I'm in .au, and grandma + grandpa are in .jp
<HedgeMage> back
<HedgeMage> :)
<HedgeMage> Yagisan: my son loves edubuntu
<bimberi> HedgeMage: i checked the logs for the bit i missed.  Just to clarify that i'm a (yet another?) daddy geek.  Sorry to disappoint :)
<Yagisan> right. GCF sent. HedgeMage does it give a confirmation ?
<bimberi> my eldest loves edubuntu too - and calls himself an edubunut!
<Yagisan> bimberi: there seem to be equal mums and dads in here
<Yagisan> mine just loves dads pc.
<HedgeMage> bimberi: daddy geeks are very cool too :)
<bimberi> Yagisan: yes, it's good to see :)
<HedgeMage> Yagisan: nope... we call to confirm people manually, that is why it is so slow
<Yagisan> of course, who would have thought that daddy geeks would actually reproduce.
* Yagisan ducks for cover
<bimberi> hehe
<HedgeMage> lol
* HedgeMage loves geek men
* HedgeMage married one, as a matter of fact
<HedgeMage> Hey, folks, I just had a couple of people ask me if Edubuntu CDs will be available via shipit or something similar when Dapper comes out
<bimberi> I don't think so (but am not sure).  I recall some discussion about it but I don't think it was considered feasible - the leading lights (highvoltage, ogra, JaneW ...) will know better.
* HedgeMage nods
<HedgeMage> thanks bimberi 
<bimberi> HedgeMage: yw :)
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
<HedgeMage> hi highvoltage 
* HedgeMage contemplates sleep
<highvoltage> hi HedgeMage 
<highvoltage> been awake since last we spoke?
<HedgeMage> yep
<HedgeMage> and since quite a bit before that
<HedgeMage> Once I get my cookbook chapters done I think I'm going to take a look at that drupal problem and see if I can come up with a module to add the translation functionality
<HedgeMage> it shouldn't be too hard.
* Yagisan needs to head off now
* Yagisan is in deep shit
<Yagisan> bye all
<HedgeMage> hi juliux 
<juliux> hi HedgeMage 
<highvoltage> ogra: does squeak use python?
<cbx33> ogra: you around?
<highvoltage> bbl
<cbx33> ogra: you around
<cbx33> http://www.progbox.co.uk/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2006/04/test.html
<cbx33> first draft
<pygi> JaneW, spacey, ogra: hi hi
<lucasvo> hi pygi 
<JaneW> hi pygi 
<spacey> hi
<cbx33> hi pygi 
<pygi> hi lucasvo, and cbx33 
<pygi> JaneW: see, we have wrote something :)
<pygi> more then it's on wiki tho, considering I am unable to upload my writings right now:-/
<pygi> entire part I is written
<JaneW> pygi: YAY
<JaneW> \o?
<JaneW> oops
<JaneW> \o/
<cbx33> heheh
<JaneW> my arm broke
<cbx33> \o? - i can't hear you :p
<pygi> JaneW: huh, what happened? :/
<JaneW> pygi: no, joking, about the messed up cheering person
<pygi> aha, oki :)
<cbx33> I finished the ltsp-build-client man page
<cbx33> well the first draft
<cbx33> http://www.progbox.co.uk/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2006/04/test.html :D
<pygi> JaneW: what are you upto right now? working something again? :)
* pygi is at linux conference
<cbx33> oooooh nice on pygi 
* JaneW is setting up our Google SoC stuff
<pygi> JaneW: ah, what are the projects this time?
<JaneW> TBD
<JaneW> and we don;t have much time to sort it all out
<cbx33> JaneW: anything i can do?
<pygi> dang, network :-/
<cbx33> which is the build ogra wanted us to test?
<cbx33> is it the daily current?
<pygi> JaneW: I have suggestion as well :)
<JaneW> pygi: mail me please
<pygi> JaneW: will do this sec :)
<pygi> JaneW: sent
<jsgotangco> is that  a man page i see?
<pygi> JaneW: I think that would rock for Dapper
<pygi> Dapper+1
<cbx33> jsgotangco: yes
<cbx33> does it look ok?
<pygi> JaneW: are you alive? :)
<cbx33> does anyone know which version of the cd was the latest one ogra uploaded yesterday...
<ogra> cbx33, its always the latest build that needs testing
<cbx33> is it the current one?
<cbx33> if so I have a fault :p
* ..[topic/#edubuntu:ogra] :  Edubuntu - the education version of Ubuntu, download: http://releases.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/5.10/ | Mailing List http://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/edubuntu-devel | Wiki: http://wiki.edubuntu.org | Website http://www.edubuntu.org | MEETING: every wednesday at 12:00 UTC | Read before installing: http://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuInstallNotes | Please test our beta candidate http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/daily/current/ (liveCD as well)
<cbx33> klibc-utils was corrupt
<ogra> but wait for 30min, i think there is another one in the works
<cbx33> gonna download again to check that this isn't an issue
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> does tha man page look ok?
<ogra> it wasnt here, make sure not to burn faster than 8x
<cbx33> I'm using the .iso file in a vmware
<ogra> apart from the config file stuff (which we dont have) it does, yes
<cbx33> but they can create a config file no?
<ogra> i tested the complete  20060419.1 set for all arches live/install yesterday, there was no issue with klibc ... thats strange
<cbx33> want me to download again or wait for you next version
<ogra> nope, we neither create nor use the config file
<cbx33> I'll remove that section then
<ogra> thats a debian invention, i'm still pondering if we want it or not
<cbx33> I don;t think it's particularly useful
<cbx33> well, lemme know, I'll remove it if you want......how does it look apart from that, up to standard ?? fleshy enough?
<ogra> it is in one case, we use usplash on the clients, to get the edubuntu graphics in there, we must install them in the chroot ... thats where this file might help
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> it would be good if there was an option to define a config file somewhere?
<cbx33> possibly an addition we could make?  then you could hold config files for various chroots?
<ogra> its enough to have a standard configfile ... the only thing you need to make sure in such a case is, that the package doesnt handle it as one :)
<cbx33> yes
<cbx33> I'll remove the config section for now yes?
<ogra> then other packages can divert it or change contents, which is not possible in conffiles from packages
<ogra> yep
<cbx33> does it look fleshy enough apart from that, or are there things you'd like me to change....guess I'm really asking...is it god enough?
<ogra> why did you choose a debian mirror string ?
<ogra> s/string/url/
<cbx33> sorry
<cbx33> force of habit
<ogra> heh
<ogra> argh
<cbx33> that'll go anyway
<ogra> please remove the ltsp 4.X tools from "see also"
<cbx33> ok
<ogra> and ltsp-build-client isnt available at ltsp.org
<cbx33> so no see also?
<ogra> see also ltsp-update-sshkeys
<ogra> see also ltsp-update-kernels
<cbx33> ok and the kernel one
<cbx33> excellent
<cbx33> where shall i say it's available from?
<ogra> https://launchpad.net/products/ltsp
<cbx33> ok excellent
<cbx33> I'll make those changes and re up load - do you want me continue to do the other utils?
<ogra> https://launchpad.net/people/ogra/+branch/ltsp/dapper would be more correct but is not version independent
<cbx33> ok
<ogra> sure :)
<ogra> thanks for doing that
<cbx33> np - is it fleshy enough?
<pygi> JaneW: will talk to you by mail :)
<ogra> the mirror part could have a note that you can also use file:// urls like file:///cdrom
<cbx33> ahh excellent plan
<ogra> (thats how the installer uses it in edubuntu)
<cbx33> indeed i thought it must
<cbx33> http://www.progbox.co.uk/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2006/04/test.html
<ogra> yep, looks great :)
<cbx33> excellent
<cbx33> do we normally put an authr of manpages ?
<cbx33> author
<ogra> yep
* cbx33 will add one
<cbx33> then I'll ship you the link
<cbx33> want the .sgml or the .8 file>
<ogra> .8 prevents a dependency on conversion tools
<ogra> but makes it less good translatable
<ogra> lets start with .8 for now
<ogra> but dont throw the .sgml away
<ogra> (i dont think we'll get a translation before dapper release for it, so i'll take the easier way, but in eft we'll translate it)
<ogra> hard to get used to that new name
<JaneW> ogra: ping
<ogra> JaneW, pong
<cbx33> ogra: all my changes are in the sgml that'll be going nowhere
<cbx33> http://www.progbox.co.uk/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2006/04/test.html
<cbx33> http://www.progbox.co.uk/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2006/04/ltsp-build-client.txt - here's the .8 file
<cbx33> just rename it, it wouldn't let me upload a .8 to that server
<ogra> yep, will do
<ogra> thanks a lot :)
<cbx33> np
<cbx33> hopefully I'll get the other ones done later today, but I got the dentist later on :S - then I got to do some paid work
<ogra> take your time, its not a race ;)
<cbx33> In my working life I have built a reputation on getting things done quickly - I always try to do things I've said I'll do as quick as I can
<cbx33> ogra: that whole CD image was b0rked
<ogra> which one was it ?
<cbx33> which ever was current about 3 hours ago
<cbx33> but it could havebeen just my download
<ogra> oh
<cbx33> I'm looking at the latest one but it's not up yet
<ogra> there are new ones building
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> gimme a shout when they are complete, I'll download and install
<cbx33> if it' within the next hour I'll get a chance to test it out a little before I go home
<cbx33> if not I'll just leave it installing
<ogra> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/daily/20060420/ will have the full set within 10mins or so
<cbx33> thanks ogra 
<cbx33> got it ogra downloading now
<cbx33> ogra: I'm still getting the klibc-utils error
<cbx33> hang on going to check a few things
<ogra> cbx33, when exactly do you get it ? 
<ogra> during boot, during package copying, during install ?  
<cbx33> the md5sums are out
<cbx33> but this is odd that it's happened twice in a row
<cbx33> oh dear, I think there must have been an issue with the download
<cbx33> it keeps b0rking halfway through the install - I got 300Mb of it the first time, only 158 of the sceond....
<cbx33> I'm keeping a close eye this time
<ogra> use rsync ;)
<ogra> http://people.ubuntu.com/~ogra/rsyncer.sh
<cbx33> I bookmarked that yesterday :p
<ogra> run it with ./rsycner.sh --help to see the options
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
<cbx33> k
<ogra> ah, yes, use it then :)
<ogra> (rsyncing between two isos currently takes between 2 and 5 mins for me)
<cbx33> can it run with no initial iso?
<ogra> sure, but then its like wget
<cbx33> yes
<cbx33> just making sure :o
<ogra> just create a edubuntu dir in your current dir, copy the old iso there and run the rsync script
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> that's what I thought
<cbx33> ogra: installing now, it crashed twice during hardware detection in two difference places, but seems to be ok now
<ogra> i'm already past ltsp install on i386
<cbx33> grrrr
<cbx33> I'm installing base system
<cbx33> I'm glad the proxy bit is in there now
<ogra> ??
<ogra> the installer didnt change since weeks, it was always there
<cbx33> for choosing an apt-proxy - it wasn't in breezy
<ogra> ah
<ogra> vs breezy... ok :)
<cbx33> sorry ogra didn;t mean to scare ya
* ogra goes for ppc install bbl
<highvoltage> win 21
<C-O-L-T> Seveas: Ubuntu/Kubuntu/Edubuntu BETA is released today right?
<jsgotangco> it'll be announced
<C-O-L-T> jsgotangco: But as far as I know it will be released today right? At morning I saw the Ubuntu Beta page, there was up for an hour and then dissapeared
<jsgotangco> yeah the system is probably still building images as we speak
<C-O-L-T> jsgotangco: I see ok I am waiting :))
* jsgotangco checks server
<jsgotangco> there is actually a 20-April build on the server
<jsgotangco> after 19.1
<cbx33> the latest build is out as the 20-april one
<cbx33> hi ogra 
<ogra> hey
<cbx33> I've noticed one issue, a hang that does resolve itselft
<ogra> ppc live/install are good :)
<cbx33> but there's no indication about what it's doing
<cbx33> excellent
<ogra> a "hang" ?
<ogra> where, when ?
<cbx333> debootstrap: Setting up sysvinit (2.86.ds1-6ubuntu26) ...
<cbx333> debootstrap: sysvinit: creating /dev/initctldebootstrap: init:debootstrap: timeout opening/writing control channel /dev/initct
<ogra> you can check what its doing on console 4
<cbx333> then it sits there for a good 4-5 minutes at 48%
<cbx333> that is console 4
<ogra> ah, k
<cbx333> it's just sitting there not showing me a lot
<cbx333> I don't know the reason
<cbx333> just thought I'd mention it
<cbx333> want me to ML it later?
<ogra> what is shown on console 1 ?
<cbx333> I can't remember off hand it is what ever is at 48% on installing the base system
<cbx333> :p
<cbx333> I'll check it out again later, my full install is just finishing
<cbx333> ltsp is done
<ogra> no, thats enough, just wanted to know which stage it was
<cbx33> it's during the debootstrap phase
<ogra> there are two bootstrap phases ;)
<ogra> thats why i asked
<cbx33> ah, sorry ogra, havnt delved into the install that much
<ogra> no, its fine, jaust wanted to telly you ;)
<cbx33> thank you...it's all good knowledge :p
<pygi> JaneW, ogra: around?
<ogra> pygi, very busy, whats up ?
<JaneW> pygi: ditto, and got your mail
<JaneW> byt the way anyone over 18 registered as a student can sign up for Google SoC 2006
<JaneW> http://code.google.com/soc/studentfaq.html
<pygi> ogra: nothing, just wanted to ask you do you like the idea :)
<pygi> JaneW: ye, ye, I know
<pygi> when does a spec needs to be` done JaneW, except right now? :)
<ogra> sorry, i cant get mail currently, will read it if i have a working evo again
<pygi> ogra: kk
<JaneW> pretty soon the timeline is here
<JaneW> http://code.google.com/soc/studentfaq.html#42
<pygi> 1 May I think the applications start
<pygi> hm, will monday do?
<pygi> JaneW: perhaps it would be better for me to mentor that project 
<pygi> unless ogra wants/have time for it
<pygi> ah, nvm, your busy
<pygi> I'll just try to write the spec
<cbx33> ogra: still installing  :)
<ogra> great :)
<pygi> JaneW: enjoy :-)
<pygi> you too ogra
<jsgotangco> mentoring
<ogra> would have been helpful if he had said *what* he wannts to mentor :)
<jsgotangco> heh
<cbx33> i didn;t like to ask
<cbx33> :p
<cbx33> when do the other ltsp scripts get run ogra?
<ogra> if you see "Building LTSP Chroot" on console 1
<ogra> with a very lame progressbar ;)
<cbx33> ahhhhhh
<cbx33> that's the bugger
<cbx33> presumably it's the kernel one that takes the time
<ogra> i have a fix pending for that progress thing, but wasnt allowed to get it in anymore
<ogra> (as well as i have a dhcpd.conf autogenerator pending)
<cbx33> nice
<cbx33> i've not ever had to initiate those scripts, can u give me a brief what they do
<cbx33> just so i can flesh out in the man page
<ogra> the installer ? 
<ogra> it just calls "chroot /target ltsp-build-client --mirror file:///cdrom"
<cbx33> i meant the update keys and kernel scripts
<ogra> ltsp-build-client in turn calls -update-kernels and then -update-sshkeys
<cbx33> ok
<ogra> if you do a kernel update in the chroot, you need to run -update-kernels amnually
<cbx33> i see
<ogra> if you change IP settings of the machine, you need to run -update-sshkeys afterwards to make the ssh client in the chroot aware of it
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> thank you ogra as I said I've never needed them so far
<ogra> -update kernels copies the kernel and initramfs from the chroot to the tftp dir, so the chroot kernel will be provided by the tftpserver
<cbx33> yes i see that by the script
<ogra> (additionally it sets up PXE or yaboot for booting)
<cbx33> and etherboot too
<ogra> not by default
<ogra> etherboot needs manual love
<cbx33> heheh
<ogra> https://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuDocumentation/LTSPEtherbootSetup
<cbx33> yes
<ogra> i'll enhance the script to care for it automatically in eft
<cbx33> i read that one earolier
<cbx33> nice 
<cbx33> grrr....this is taking ages....that'll teach me for using VM
<Yagisan> w00t. my documentation gets another plug
* cbx33 w00ts for Yagisan too
* Yagisan is happy tonight
* cbx33 is glad.....
<cbx33> is a grouchy Yagisan a baaaad thing?
<Yagisan> I got my membership application for an upstream project accepted because I fixed documentation, and linux build scripts
<cbx33> nice one, 
<cbx33> I'm thinking of applying for edubuntu membership status soon....hope i get accepted
<ogra> sure you will :)
<highvoltage> :)
<Yagisan> cbx33: yeah. ever seen an angry goat ? now imagine a larger smarter one.
<cbx33> yikes
<cbx33> WOW - you guys think so?
* cbx33 is a very happy edubuntuian
<ogra> :))
<Yagisan> cbx33: I don't see why not
<highvoltage> shouldn't that be edubuntero?
<cbx33> indeed it should
<cbx33> when's the next edubuntu CC meeting?
<ogra> next ?
<ogra> you mean the firts ;)
<cbx33> first
<highvoltage> ogra: have you seen anagramarama? looks like nice software for edubuntu
<ogra> *first
<cbx33> haha beat ya :p
<ogra> not yet
<ogra> i was to busy with the beta the last days
<Yagisan> ogra: so what do I need to say for my membership ?
<ogra> havent even seen the sun :)
* cbx33 reaggranges the letts in ogra's name
<cbx33> and replaces one
<cbx33> ogre
<cbx33> that's what came to mind when yo usaid you'd seen no sunlight
<cbx33> i imagined a large grissly edubuntero
<cbx33> i must update my wiki
<cbx33> been so busy i havn't had time
<ogra> dont forget to mention the manpage work and the testing support ;)
<cbx33> indeed i won't
<cbx33> ooh ooh ooh it's finished instlling
<cbx33> I'm impressed blender 2.41 :D
<cbx33> ogra: is ltsp-utils going to be in dapper?
<ogra> in universe
<cbx33> not in the default install
<cbx33> ?
* Yagisan feels like headbutting the screen
<ogra> since it trashes your ltsp setup, its not, no :)
<Yagisan> cbx33: don't use ltsp-utils
* cbx33 apologises
<cbx33> I'm used to breezy
<Bluekuja> hi #edubuntu
<Bluekuja> :)
<cbx33> hi andrea
<Bluekuja> hi pete
<Bluekuja> ;)
<cbx33> ;)
<Bluekuja> hi mr ogra and mr highvoltage
<Yagisan> G'day Bluekuja
* cbx33 forgot to go into official mode
<Bluekuja> hi Yagisan :)
<cbx33> Good Afternoon Mr Bluekuja 
<Bluekuja> hehe
<Bluekuja> highvoltage: how is going with the website?
* Yagisan was in official mode
<cbx33> :p
* cbx33 is british remember :p
<Bluekuja> ^^
* cbx33 tries to put o nhis best british accent 
* cbx33 fails
<Bluekuja> i need to wait highvoltage for news about italian language on drupal
<Yagisan> cbx33: you're a pom. you poor thing ;)
<Bluekuja> still waiting it on launchpad
<cbx33> Yagisan: indeed I am....
<highvoltage> hi Bluekuja 
<cbx33> I'm poor too, it;'s true
<Bluekuja> hi jon
<Bluekuja> :)
<highvoltage> Bluekuja: just a few secs...
<Yagisan> cbx33: so, you'll move down here after you retire then
<Bluekuja> okie 
<cbx33> ooooh dunno...I may run into the angry smart goat then :p
<Bluekuja> Yagisan, cbx33 
<Bluekuja> are you good with irc-servers?
<Bluekuja> services to connect to them etc
<cbx33> what do you need ?
<Bluekuja> i need to create a irc server
<Bluekuja> with services
<cbx33> bahamut is good with services if i recall
<Yagisan> Bluekuja: sorry mate. I haven't set one up.
<Bluekuja> i was trying to connect services but it seems that nothing work
<Bluekuja> server works good
<highvoltage> Bluekuja: i was very dissapointed, drupal's .po and .pot files only contained drupal translations, not the actual content
<Bluekuja> oh
<Bluekuja> so i have to translate all
<highvoltage> Bluekuja: so I asked on #drupal and they said that Drupal doesn't have content translations :(
<Bluekuja> eheh 
<cbx33> right I'm off guys
<Bluekuja> aww
<cbx33> catch you all later....
* Yagisan is annoyed.
<highvoltage> cheers cbx33 
<Bluekuja> okie cya
<cbx33> I'll bbl or tomorrow
<Yagisan> ../../Src/Unix/sys_dylib.c:30:23: error: sys_dylib.h: No such file or directory
<highvoltage> Yagisan: how so?
<Bluekuja> thats not a good news
<Yagisan> yet it is clearly there
<cbx33> bye highvoltage  Bluekuja  Yagisan  ogra 
<ogra> ciao
<Yagisan> bye cbx33
<Bluekuja> ciauz
<ogra> thanks for all the help 
<cbx33> np
<cbx33> ogra: it looks good btw...all works :p
<cbx33> i'll test more tomorrow
<cbx33> prolly get the docs for using a different dhcp server started
<ogra> yep, it worked here as well... on all 3 arches
<Bluekuja> ogra: i gonna translate this page http://proto.edubuntu.org/gettingstarted
<Bluekuja> it would be usefull?
<ogra> Bluekuja, great, but let us finish it first
<Bluekuja> ok
<Bluekuja> ping me when done
<ogra> its not completely in shape yet
<Bluekuja> okie perfect
<ogra> yup, will jump on it next week
<Bluekuja> it will be operative and translated in italian
<Bluekuja> just ping me
<Bluekuja> i'll put that on edubuntu space in italian loco
<Bluekuja> ;)
<ogra> and into the -docs package indeed ;)
<Bluekuja> yes of course
<Bluekuja> :)
* B4zzA is away: I'm busy
* highvoltage will attempt to finish that doc tonight afap
<highvoltage> ogra: i'm going to ask you some things about that doc later tonight, ie: what stuff it needs to be finished.
<ogra> highvoltage, there is some stuff we'll need to change
<highvoltage> ogra: we might have different ideas of what it still needs :)
<Bluekuja> highvoltage: how its going with the website?
<ogra> the lts.conf needs a lot of correction ...
<highvoltage> ogra: ok, will you be available to point them out to me?
<Bluekuja> final release on?
<highvoltage> Bluekuja: 1 June
<ogra> i.e. it will break if you use IMPS/" there which is autodetected
<Bluekuja> ok perfect
<ogra> i didnt wnat to make much changes to the text
<highvoltage> ogra: ok, can you give me those details when i'm home a bit later?
<ogra> highvoltage, not today, i slept ~4h in the last 3 days ... 
<ogra> need some relaxing now that beta is released
<highvoltage> shees
<Bluekuja> how much coffee ogra?
<highvoltage> ogra: sure. i will add to it, and then get feedback from a more refreshed ogra later :)
<ogra> not as much as usual ...
<Bluekuja> hehe
<jsgotangco> ogra: planet misses you
<jsgotangco> heh
<ogra> i'm getting old, my belly doent like too much coffee anymore :)
<Bluekuja> ehheeh
<ogra> jsgotangco, i'll start blogging agian soon
<highvoltage> ogra: please make some edubuntu food when you're all refreshed and dapper is released, so that we can teas dholbach about it
<jsgotangco> the last time i saw you blog was the time you were in sydney
<ogra> dholbach already poked me to blog about my new car which i found a bit ... well non ubuntu :)
<highvoltage> ogra: does it run windows!?
<ogra> it *has* windows ...
<highvoltage> ogra: please don't tell me you bought a BMW
<highvoltage> ogra: I mean, MS windows :)
<ogra> it also runs them from A to B :)
<ogra> highvoltage, i already have 2 BMWs
<jsgotangco> lol
<jsgotangco> wow
<ogra> i just got rid of one
<highvoltage> BMW's are so non-ubuntu.
* jsgotangco has a shitty korean car
<highvoltage> ogra: so what car did you buy then? i can't think of another car that's really non-ubuntu.
<ogra> http://people.ubuntu.com/~ogra/2CAF65BCd01.jpg
* jsgotangco doesn't think he'll be able to afford a bmw in his lifetime
* highvoltage likes
<ogra> but not for driving, only for restauration ... its ~25 years old 
<highvoltage> what's so non-ubuntu about it?
<highvoltage> it's red!
<ogra> its a car
<highvoltage> it fits nice with the edubuntu theme.
<Yagisan> needs a big edubuntu logo on the hood
<ogra> it will get a big edubuntu logo on the front later :)
<jsgotangco> would you like to have naked women inside to make it more ubuntu?
<highvoltage> hehehehhe!
<ogra> jsgotangco, i could ask my GF :)
<highvoltage> dholbach won't be able to compete with that!
<Yagisan> yes. you can censor the pics with edubuntu logos ;)
<ogra> heh
<Yagisan> unfortunately the target audience won't be able to see the pics, but thats life
<ogra> no, really its just to get me out of that chair where i spend more than 14h/day and get fat ...
<ogra> fixing old cars is a hobby i have since i was 16
<highvoltage> wow. i never knew that.
<jsgotangco> so you prefer caburetor than fuel injection?
* highvoltage must nominates ogra for behindubuntu so that we get to know these things
<highvoltage> s/nominates/nominate
<ogra> jsgotangco, really depends ...
* Yagisan will get out of his chair for a pretty lady, otherwise, I'd rather sit in it
<jsgotangco> i guess you're a DTM fan?
<Bluekuja> soon ,i have to reboot to install again flight 6 so brb
<ogra> jsgotangco, i wouldnt like an injection in my old sidecar motorbike :)
<ogra> but i wouldnt like to miss the mechanical injection in that porsche
<jsgotangco> heh
<jsgotangco> you'll probably laugh at my car
<ogra> jsgotangco, i *hate* everything that has to do with sports :)
<ogra> even DTM
<highvoltage> jsgotangco: what car do you have?
<jsgotangco> even motorsports?
<ogra> yep
<jsgotangco> highvoltage: it's called a Picanto from KIA
<ogra> i occasionally watch snooker on tv
<jsgotangco> like a poor man's MINI
<highvoltage> jsgotangco: but that's a newish car, isn't it?
<jsgotangco> yes and cheap
<ogra> and paris-dakar every year, but thats about it
<highvoltage> jsgotangco: my car is even cheaper :)
<jsgotangco> really i can actually bear to watch le mans
* Yagisan doesn't have a car
<ogra> jsgotangco, i live about 20Km away from the nrburgring here, but i never watched a race ...
<jsgotangco> ogra: jeezz
* jsgotangco would give everything for that
<highvoltage> i have a bike, it's a Gomoto Freedom 125 - http://www.gomoto.co.za/
<jsgotangco> i once drove at the fun park at twin ring motegi in japan
<jsgotangco> it was fun
<highvoltage> and car is a VW CITI Golf
<Yagisan> I have a pair of legs that actually work
* Yagisan waits for sympathy
<highvoltage> citi golfs look like this: http://www.mccarthyvw.co.za/Showroom/Citi/Colours/generic.gif
<ogra> highvoltage, hey that reminds me on my yamaha rd80 mx i drove to turkey with when i was 17
<highvoltage> http://cybercapetown.com/carhire/images/citi-golf.jpg
<highvoltage> ogra: wow, that sounds like fun!
<ogra> (the bike)
<ogra> yup, it was
<highvoltage> how far is turkey from germany?
<ogra> took me 6 weeks to get to istanbul
<ogra> ~3000km
<jsgotangco> whoa
<highvoltage> amazing.
<ogra> yeah that was fun 
<ogra> my mother died from fear
<jsgotangco> the nice thing i dig about eu is that its possible to roam around the place on whatever method you want
<ogra> yep
<lucasvo> jsgotangco: well, that was possible without the EU as well
<ogra> we're not iran :)
<lucasvo> I didn't have any problem to go to germany, italy, austria, france without Personenfreizuegigkeitsabkommen
<jsgotangco> lucasvo: ah i eman europe in general...
<lucasvo> yeah, I was in Poland as well which doesn't belong to eu, without a visum
<ogra> it does now
<ogra> (since quite some time already)
<lucasvo> the americans are the only ones playing big brother with their visa
<lucasvo> I was there 3 years ago
<jsgotangco> i dont like it there at all
<ogra> wow
<jsgotangco> even though my parents and my siblins already live there
* ogra just opened his mobile phone bill
<highvoltage> ogra: did you use any Yoda quotes on your mother?
<ogra> highvoltage, to calm her ? 
<ogra> nope
<highvoltage> ogra: for other reasons!?
<ogra> thats something she needed to learn anyway ;)
<highvoltage> if you want to feel better about your mobile bill, i can send you mine :)
<ogra> and she got me back in one piece, so all was fine :)
<ogra> highvoltage, my bill this month are 1.44 
<ogra> i doubt you need to send me yours ;)
<jsgotangco> lol
<highvoltage> hehe
* jsgotangco uses prepay
* ogra did that too until canonical
<highvoltage> i'll go back to pre-paid when i don't need to use my mobile for internet anymore
<lucasvo> how much do you pay per min to call from mobile to mobile?
<ogra> but now i need good roaming 
<Yagisan> night all
<ogra> night Yagisan 
<jsgotangco> canoncical can afford to pay your bills
<highvoltage> night Yagisan 
<ogra> jsgotangco, nah, i can claim parts of it back from tax
<lucasvo> jsgotangco: well, if it is less than a beer, I hope so :)
<highvoltage> lucasvo: i get 300 free minutes a month for off-peak times (which i have never used up)
<ogra> if i travel, my bill is usually above 100 
* lucasvo pays 0.5 EUr per hour
<highvoltage> lucasvo: peak charges are about R2.70 per minute
<lucasvo> R?
<ogra> rand
* jsgotangco uses his mobile mostly for data
<highvoltage> lucasvo: thats US$0.41
* ogra uses his mobile only from foreign countries
* lucasvo uses his mobile because it is cheaper
* highvoltage has another sim card for foreign countries
<jsgotangco> whoa long email on sounder
<ogra> lucasvo, i usually dont use phones at all ... :) 
* highvoltage reads sounder
<lucasvo> anybody has a blackberry?
* ogra wants evo to work again so he could read *any* mail
<lucasvo> evo sucks :)
<highvoltage> evo is nice.
<lucasvo> their imap interpretation is crappy
<highvoltage> i switched to thunderbird because evo was unstable in breezy
<ogra> evo is fine 
<ogra> (if it works)
<highvoltage> but when evo got more stable i switched back
<ogra> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/evolution/+bug/40236
<ogra> its not stable for me currently
<lucasvo> well, I had to repair my .evolution directory 4 times
<highvoltage> ok, bbl...
<lucasvo> ogra: do you use imap?
<ogra> yep
<Bluekuja> cya guys have a nice day , be back later
<lucasvo> cya Bluekuja 
<lucasvo> ogra: is your sent folder on the server?
<ogra> noipe
<jsgotangco> lucasvo: i used to, till i swtiched to Sony Ericsson
<lucasvo> see, that sucks, it is technically not possible if you have Inbox as /
<lucasvo> it doesn't accept INBOX/Sent as Sent
<lucasvo> so if I connect to my IMAP server I see Inbox with subfolders: Sent, Drafts,Spam
<lucasvo> if I open it in thunderbird I have the Folders Inbox, Sent, Drafts, Spam
<lucasvo> they refused to implement this function
<lucasvo> ogra: so, what do you do if you are on your ibook and want so see, what mails you sent on your workstation?
<ogra> lucasvo, nothing, i usually read my mails only from one machine
<lucasvo> I have a notebook, an account in my school, a blackberry, a workstation
<lucasvo> I check my mail on all of them
<jsgotangco> it seems a lot of specs are being registered in LP but most of them are wishlists
* ..[topic/#edubuntu:ogra] :  Edubuntu - the education version of Ubuntu, download: http://releases.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/5.10/ | Mailing List http://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/edubuntu-devel | Wiki: http://wiki.edubuntu.org | Website http://www.edubuntu.org | MEETING: every wednesday at 12:00 UTC | Read before installing: http://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuInstallNotes | Dapper beta is out http://releases.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/dapper/
<lns> Hi all
<LaserJock> hi lns
<lns> Hey LaserJock 
<lns> You know I'm so happy the LTSP is around - I've always been a huge fan of thin client networks
<lns> Putting power at each desk seems illogical to me
<LaserJock> I've never done anything with LTSP, I'll have to try it some time. I don't know on what, but it sounds cool
<lucasvo> !seen Yagisan
<ubotu> yagisan <n=jamie@60-240-19-190-nsw-pppoe.tpgi.com.au> was last seen on IRC in channel #edubuntu, 1h 44m 27s ago, saying: 'night all'.
<Petaris> Is there a specific iso for the edubuntu ltsp?
<LaserJock> I think just the edubuntu iso
<Petaris> ok
<Petaris> thanks
<lucasvo> Petaris: the edubuntu-server packages installs the complete ltsp 
<Petaris> right
<Petaris> how stable is the dapper beta?
<lucasvo> so if you have ubuntu installed you can just 'sudo apt-get install edubuntu-server'
<Petaris> this is going to be a clean install
<lucasvo> Petaris: it is already Beta. It's stable enough for me
<lucasvo> Petaris: then, if you use the edubuntu cd, type "server" 
<lucasvo> when it asks you to enter bootparams or press enter
<lucasvo> Petaris: I didn't have problem with any of the apps I am using
<Petaris> right
<Petaris> I just need basics mostly
<Petaris> firefox+flash+openoffice+gtypist+vmplayer (don't ask)
<lns> sorry
<lns> didn't mean to start a conversation and leave =p
<lucasvo> Petaris: I use vmplayer as well :)
<LaserJock> doesn't everybody ;-)
<lucasvo> yes, with a windows full of commercial software :)
<Petaris> the curent k12ltsp server tanks with some softwares
<Petaris> *softwares running in a win98 vm image
<Petaris> one software called Music Ace 2 tanked it today with only 5 users
<Petaris> :/
<lns> how difficult would it be for an interface to select apps that you would want to run locally on a thin client instead of over the network? I'm curious, this would be invaluable for not only Edubuntu thin client setups but any LTSP/x11 setup
<lucasvo> lns: well, probably it would take quite a time :)
<Petaris> lns: I have been searching for that exact thing
<Petaris> including running alsa locally
<lucasvo> Petaris, lns: set up a bounty 
<lucasvo> maybe somebody implements it
<lns> that would be really cool
<lns> lucasvo, where do you set up stuff like that?
<Petaris> I don't need it to be selectable
<Petaris> just set it in a config file or something
<lucasvo> lns: a bounty? on launchpad.net
<lns> oh ok
<Petaris> I was thinking of pushing some of those apps local using a ram disk
<Petaris> the ram disk would have a slimmed down /dev and would grab the other goodies from the server
<lucasvo> Petaris: well, you can do that
<Petaris> audio really needs improvement
<lucasvo> people are using it for VoIP for e.g.
<Petaris> hrm
<lucasvo> I have read an article about this in some magazine
<Petaris> cool
<Petaris> I think if we have nice enough clients we could push out some of the more intensive apps and processing to them locally
<Petaris> a 1 GHz proc with 512 MB RAM for example 
<Petaris> these days RAM is usually pretty cheap
<lucasvo> yeah, ogra is doing a mythtv-image in his leisuretime :)
<Petaris> He was talking about working on audio too
<Petaris> switching from nasd and esd to something else
<lns> alsa?
<lns> alsa doesn't do network transport does it?
<Petaris> no
<Petaris> I wan't to see if we could run also locally on the clients
<Petaris> it would solve lots of audio issues
<Petaris> thats why the local /dev on the clients
<Petaris> to hold dsp and mixer
<lns> well true you need whatever libraries a program uses locally if you want to run it locally in LTSP
<Petaris> not to mention local usb thumb drives etc
<Petaris> right
<Petaris> or at least make it think that they are local
<Petaris> :)
<lns> http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/LocalAppFirefox
<lns> that might help you Petaris 
<lns> one could use that as a template
<Petaris> right, I've looked at that before
<Petaris> but it seems to me that firefox runs pretty nice from the server
<lns> yes, but things like plugins (flash, streaming video) probably would be sluggish
<lns> I would say any app that is video/sound intensive (video player/editor/plugin, graphically intensive games) need to be run locally
<Burgwork> ogra, you will be happy to note that polypaudio just made another release
<Burgwork> http://0pointer.de/blog/projects/polypaudio-0.8
<ogra> Burgwork, nice, but i doubt we'll use it anyway
<Burgwork> ogra, true
<ogra> gstreamer is the way to go, until then i ddint plan to redo the sound stuf
<ogra> f
<Petaris> Hello ogra
<ogra> hi
<cbx33> evenin
<LaserJock> hi cbx33 
<cbx33> hi LaserJock 
<cbx33> howz it all going
<LaserJock> ok, I guess
<cbx33> ogra, I've gotten one of those man pages done, there's a spelling mistake on the one I shipped to you - is now corrected, I'll try to bzr it now I'm home....did you get my message about the bzr repo needing reconciling??
<cbx33> I couldn't complete the export
<ogra> did you get my message about wiping the contents you pulled with the old version ? :)
<cbx33> heheh obviously not :p
<ogra> ;)
<ogra> try that
<cbx33> thanx bud, will try that
<ogra> there are many people working with that branch, so it should work
<ogra> else i'd have gotten complaints already 
<cbx33> yeh yeh, my stupidity
<cbx33> :p
<cbx33> any other docs you need me to work on after that....those two are really short
<ogra> not right now
<cbx33> anything else apart from docs you need doing?
<ogra> i'm about to crash, the last three days with beta preparation were a bit exhausting
<cbx33> I'll be doing more testing tomorrow
<ogra> cool :)
<cbx33> can i just ask, what do we use now to administer the ltsp server?
<ogra> apt :)
<ogra> and an editor for an optional lts.conf 
<cbx33> righteeee-ho
<cbx33> really disliking those ltsp-utils :p
<ogra> eft will get http://people.ubuntu.com/~ogra/LTSPManager/
<ogra> (i hope)
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
<cbx33> nice
<cbx33> hi highvoltage 
<cbx33> well go crash ogra you desserve it
<cbx33> have a nice rest
<ogra> i'll have to write the announcement later but now i'll take a rest first :)
<highvoltage> hi cbx33 
<cbx33> which announcement?
<cbx33> howz it going highvoltage?  need any help with anything?
<highvoltage> goodnight, ogra.
<ogra> highvoltage, nah, i'll come back :)
<highvoltage> ogra: ok :)
<highvoltage> cbx33: i think i'm going to take an early night :)
<highvoltage> 20:13 -!- Irssi: Join to #edubuntu was synced in 284 secs
<highvoltage> hehe. talk about a fast connection...
<cbx33> heh, np
<cbx33> you've all got my mail if you need any odd jobs done
<cbx33> blimey quiet in here tonight
<lucasvo> yeah
<Bluekuja> ogra: are you there?
<Bluekuja> goodnight #edubuntu
#edubuntu 2006-04-26
<eDRUcated> msg nickserv identify iheartmatt
<eDRUcated> fuck
<eDRUcated> lol
<eDRUcated> opps
<eDRUcated> grr
<eDRUcated> lol
<lucasvo> eDRUcated: :)
<lucasvo> should I register?
<eDRUcated> yes
<eDRUcated> lol
<eDRUcated> it is worth it
<eDRUcated> i keep forgetings though
<eDRUcated> lol
<eDRUcated> grr
<lucasvo> I hope you ONLY use this p/w for nickserv
<eDRUcated> i do
<eDRUcated> why do you ask
<lucasvo> yeah, because otherwise I could read your mail now
<eDRUcated> what mail
<lucasvo> 00:22 < eDRUcated> msg nickserv identify iheartmatt
<eDRUcated> so
<eDRUcated> that is not my email pass
<lucasvo> if you used the same pw for your mail, I could read your mail
<eDRUcated> silly
<eDRUcated> lol
<eDRUcated> what is my email then silly
<lucasvo> I mean, I could login to your webmail for e.g. with that password
<eDRUcated> e.g. ???
<eDRUcated> she makes me angry
<eDRUcated> opps
<eDRUcated> wrong box
<eDRUcated> bad day
<eDRUcated> wow
<eDRUcated> lol
<eDRUcated> help
<lucasvo> eDRUcated: what help do you need?
<eDRUcated> i need to change that pass
<eDRUcated> i feel odd now
<eDRUcated> lol
<lucasvo>  /msg NickServ help
<eDRUcated> that does nto helo
<eDRUcated> help
<eDRUcated> grr
<eDRUcated> i need an admin here
<eDRUcated> HELP
<lucasvo>  why?
<lucasvo> just du /msg NickServ Drop
<lucasvo> and then register again with the new password
<eDRUcated> ok
<lucasvo> eDRUcated: worked?
<eDRUcated> i need to register now
<eDRUcated> i dont remember
<eDRUcated> lol
<Rondom> /ns HELP SET PASSWORD
<Rondom> ^^ you can also type this
<Rondom> so nobody can register your nick while it's unregistered
<Rondom> eDRUcated: if you already dropped your nick
<Rondom> type //ns REGISTER password email@addre.ss
<LaserJock> eDRUcated: you need to type those kinds of things in a server console or something
<eDRUcated> ok
<eDRUcated> lol
<eDRUcated> i forgot
<eDRUcated> lol
<eDRUcated> i am in a manic mode today
<eDRUcated> wow
<eDRUcated> lol
<Rondom> /ns REGISTER password email@email.com
<eDRUcated> i am goingto go lay down
<noch> hey is someone awake?
<bimberi> noch: barely :)
<HedgeMage> Hey, folks... just got back from the first meeting of the new FOSS user group in town, and it seems our first activity will be an Edubuntu install/orientation day :)  (Only two people, but still, it'll be fun.)
<HedgeMage> hey, highvoltage you just missed:
<HedgeMage> Hey, folks... just got back from the first meeting of the new FOSS user group in town, and it seems our first activity will be an Edubuntu install/orientation day :)  (Only two people, but still, it'll be fun.)
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
<highvoltage> heh. kewl.
<HedgeMage> I have a little too much energy tonight, so beware.
<HedgeMage> :)
<highvoltage> great!
<highvoltage> it's a good change from the mopey half-asleep-half-alive people i have to deal with daily!
<HedgeMage> lol
<HedgeMage> I'm usually one of those
<HedgeMage> but I *finally* caught up on sleep today, and I'm really glad that meeting was a success.
<HedgeMage> That, and someone gave me blueberry bread and triple-chocolate ice cream.
<HedgeMage> be afraid, be very afraid. :P
<highvoltage> :)
* highvoltage hides
<HedgeMage> xhehe
<HedgeMage> hi superseth 
<JaneW> ogra: ping
<spacey> good morning
<HedgeMage> hi JaneW, spacey 
<spacey> tonight OS Cafe! yay :)
<HedgeMage> OS cafe?
<spacey> open source cafe :p
<spacey> drinks & talks
<spacey> http://users.lichtsnel.nl/~spacey/
<spacey> http://users.lichtsnel.nl/~spacey/?p=198
<spacey> must be nice:)
* HedgeMage looks
<cbx33> should searching on the proto edubuntu  site cause an access denied message?
<spacey> cbx33: probably not :p
<cbx33> heh
<cbx33> anyone know where the docs are for ltsp on dapper in edubuntu?
<spacey> cbx33: https://launchpad.net/products/edubuntu-website/+bugs
<spacey> file a bug :)
<cbx33> will do
<HedgeMage> spacey: ahh, neat... sorry to hear about your school's haphazard approach to Linux stuff... I hope the place I applied for a job at is better :)
<spacey> they did get some SUN machinary now
<spacey> so at least its unix
<spacey> they also use some linux
<spacey> but its only like 1 or 2 months
<spacey> of the four years you study there
<cbx33> spacey: that sux
<spacey> and then you don't even get to know it properly, just apt-get install apache en put online a php website
* HedgeMage nods to spacey 
<spacey> cbx33: they call the study software engineering
<cbx33> I'm teaching linux to some kids at my secondary school in the UK
<HedgeMage> cbx33: cool
<cbx33> I'm the IT manager there
<spacey> great :)
<cbx33> just starting to try to roll out ltsp, the members of youth LUG all had xen machines before :D
<HedgeMage> :)
<cbx33> ogra: around yet?
<cbx33> Hi Yagisan 
<cbx33> was hoping you'd turn up
<cbx33> ltsp in dapper
<Yagisan> G'day cbx33
<cbx33> how do we set it up
<cbx33> where' the the howto
<cbx33> :p
<Yagisan> ah. Not yet written. Straight (k)ubuntu or edubuntu ?
<cbx33> edubuntu
<cbx33> are you writing it?
<Yagisan> IIRC edubuntu sets it up on install
<cbx33> but it's not running
<Yagisan> cbx33: I write documentation occasionally
<cbx33> cos there's no tftp service running at the moment
<cbx33> I may give it a bash
<cbx33> once i figure out what to do
<cbx33> :p
<HedgeMage> cbx33: here's a draft (only a draft) one of the Edubuntu Cookbook people just finished http://proto.edubuntu.org/gettingstarted
<HedgeMage> JonathanCarter did that one ^^^^^^
<HedgeMage> it's just a draft, though, according to the page.
<Yagisan> cbx33: for edubuntu did you do a "workstation" or server install (I should let you know, I last installed edubuntu @ the breezy release, so the name may have changed)
<Yagisan> G'day HedgeMage
<HedgeMage> hi Yagisan :)
<HedgeMage> how's life?
<Yagisan> HedgeMage: not going to plan :(
<HedgeMage> awwww :(
<cbx33> i did a "normal" install
* Yagisan had a big unexpected expense pop up, that means, either more customers, or second job is needed fast
<HedgeMage> awww
* HedgeMage hugs Yagisan 
<HedgeMage> I hate when that happens
<cbx33> Yagisan: I nko the feeling
<cbx33> we went through our finances last night
<cbx33> and created an expense category called splurge
<cbx33> the splurge category was far toooo high
<HedgeMage> :(
<HedgeMage> I'm pretty careful with our money, but I have to be.
<cbx33> We want to buy a house but at the mo there's no chance
<cbx33> we're renting at the mo
<Yagisan> HedgeMage: I need to ship 4 people O/S for 4 weeks, ASAP
<Yagisan> cbx33: yeah, but I blew my savings paying medical and living costs for my wife after her injury giving birth
<Yagisan> cbx33: me too. it sucks big time.
<HedgeMage> Yagisan: ouch
<cbx33> it does indeed
<cbx33> my wife and i were both made redundant a month before we got married
<cbx33> bang went the savings
<Yagisan> cbx33: that was me two years ago. Built it back up, then, all gone again.
<Yagisan> cbx33: you get any notice ?
<cbx33> i got a month
<cbx33> but my wife only got a week
<cbx33> cos they never gave her a proper contract...which we'd been bugging for for bloody ages
<cbx33> we think they planned it all along
<HedgeMage> :(
<cbx33> to drop us just before the 12 months came up when they would have had to give us redundancy pay
<HedgeMage> hubby's in the army... it's harder to get out than to stay in :P
<cbx33> HedgeMage: true
<Yagisan> cbx33: do you clients boot ? I'm looking at my server and tftp isn't a daemon service here
<cbx33> o it;s under inetd
<cbx33> back in a mo
<Yagisan> hmm, that's annoying when that happens
<Yagisan> cbx33: the clients should just boot fine. If you have more then about 40 clients on the box, I'd consider daemonising tftp, otherwise, inetd is fine
* Yagisan has just submitted a new uni application
<Yagisan> I hope it turns out better then the last one did.
<HedgeMage> good luck!
<Yagisan> HedgeMage: last one was odd. I was punished with failure because I asked questions, like, explain this
<Yagisan> HedgeMage: yet, students that were blatantly cheating passed (their assignments can be found via google groups)
* Yagisan doesn't feel value for money
<HedgeMage> Yagisan: no big surprise there... many so-called educational institutions are more about preserving the status quo than anything else
<Yagisan> HedgeMage: I only need a degree for 1 reason. It secures my right to work in Japan.
<Yagisan> HedgeMage: I try to pick something that interests me, but teachers aren't interested in teaching external students :(
<Yagisan> cbx33: how did you go ?
<HedgeMage> Yagisan: I know how you feel
<Yagisan> thanks HedgeMage. How did you come by your nick ?
<cbx33> Yagisan: how did I go? - with ltsp?
<HedgeMage> In old legends and lore, a "hedge mage" is a magic user who lacks the formal training of a "proper" wizard.  Hedge mages learn primarily through experience, trial and error, and so on.  It seemed to fit how I've learned most things, especially WRT computers, programming, etc.
<Yagisan> cbx33: yes, ltsp.
<Yagisan> HedgeMage: mine was simple. My wife called me Yagisan, then her family started calling me Yagisan.
<HedgeMage> hehe :)
<Yagisan> It was because I sometimes look like, and act like, a certain large, stubborn animal
<cbx33> heheh
<cbx33> Yagisan: you.....never...
<cbx33> mine stems from a sounterstrike alias
<cbx33> cutterbomb
<cbx33> Yagisan: in an ltsp setup, what needs to be present to allow the nfs access
<cbx33> it just needs reverse dns doesn;t it
<Yagisan> cbx33: /etc/exports
<Yagisan> cbx33: no dns needed
<cbx33> yes that's setup fine to allow all hosts
<cbx33> I'm getting an access denied when my client tries to access the nfs root
<cbx33> does nfs log to anywhere in edubuntu?
<Yagisan> thats odd
<cbx33> well I'm not using the built in DHCP
<cbx33> I'm using an alternative
<Yagisan> cbx33: /var/log/messages
<cbx33> nope nothing in there
<cbx33> you sure?
<Yagisan> cbx33: why not use the built in dhcp ? that is the only supported configuration IIRC
<cbx33> no, you can do it with another dhcp
<cbx33> I already have a dhcp running on the system
<cbx33> that has quite a detailied setup
<Yagisan> cbx33: jamie@doomguy:~/deng-svn/deng$ cat /var/log/messages |grep nfs
<Yagisan> Apr 21 14:45:04 doomguy kernel: [232373.226366]  nfsd: last server has exited
<cbx33> hmmm just tried manually mounting the nfs root and there's no issue
<Yagisan> cbx33: of course you can use other dhcp, you do lose the tight integration though. Your dhcp set up ok for nfs ?
<Yagisan> no typos ?
<cbx33> Yagisan: what needs to be changed?
<cbx33> in the dhcp
<cbx33> Yagisan: I'm not seeing any logs in nfs
<cbx33> */in/for
<Yagisan> sorry mate, I'm sorta not here. My son is sick
<cbx33> sorry Yagisan, you go take care of your son
<cbx33> I'm ok here :p
<HedgeMage> Okay, I'm *really* going to bed this time
<HedgeMage> ttyal
<cbx33> nn HedgeMage 
<lucasvo> cbx33: I once did it with custom dhcp but I don't have the config anymore
<cbx33> well the only problem Im having is with mounting the nfs root
<lucasvo> cbx33: just look into /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf and copy&paste the values you don't have
<cbx33> i can mount it manually from the busybox shell
<cbx33> it just won't do it during booting
<lucasvo> has the dhcpserver the same ip as the nfs?
<lucasvo> cbx33: you are on dapper?
<cbx33> yes
<cbx33> I'm on dapper
<cbx33> but the dchp is not the same as the nfs
<cbx33> is that the issue?
<cbx33> is it trying to load the nfs root from my already established dhcp server?
<lucasvo> hm, I think you need to set a next-server ___IPofNFS___;
<lucasvo> cbx33: yes
<cbx33> please tell me I can do that on a windows dhcp server
<cbx33> :p
<lucasvo> lol
* cbx33 bangs his head against a wall
<lucasvo> why don't you use a windows dhcp server?
<lucasvo> ehm I mean linux :)
* lucasvo get's confuses when he hears windows :)
<lucasvo>   next-server 192.168.27.1;
<lucasvo> ^^ on linus
<cbx33> I'll check it out on the windows machine
<cbx33> it's set correctly already
<cbx33> ok looks like I need to set the 017 option
<cbx33> rootpath
<cbx33>  /ltsproot in this howto
<cbx33> frack - I don;t think it can actually do it
<lucasvo> option root-path "/opt/ltsp/i386";
<cbx33> hmm...that's not gonna work is it
<lucasvo>   filename "/ltsp/pxelinux.0";
<cbx33> cos it won;t know how to setup the nfs
<lucasvo> why?
<cbx33> where is it specified that the rootpath is an nfs mount?
<lucasvo> what do you mean?
<cbx33> well how does it know that you should use nfs for the root path
<cbx33> is that just a giv..e...n.......w00t...hold on.....it could be working
<cbx33> woooooooooooooooooooooooowheeeeeeeeeeeeeee
<lucasvo> yeah, well, if you move /opt/ltsp to /ltsp you would have to change it ;)
<cbx33> no no
<cbx33> i didn;t move anything....it was another option i had to set
<cbx33> right brb
<cbx33> w000t...i have a working client :D
<lucasvo> cbx33: what did you have to set?
<cbx33> that root path option I'm going to document it now....
<cbx33> where abouts shall I document it on the wiki
<lucasvo> cbx33: please write it into the wiki
<lucasvo> cbx33: here: https://wiki.edubuntu.org/LTSPServerSetup
<cbx33> t's locked I can't edit it 
<lucasvo> ok, then make a new document and ask ogra to link it
<cbx33> kk
<lucasvo> LTSPdifferentDHCP
<lucasvo> or I don't know
<lucasvo> ogra: ping
<cbx33> I am not allowed to edit this page
<cbx33> don;t think he's around yet :p
<lucasvo> cbx33: you need to login
<lucasvo> with your launchpad account
<cbx33> ahh..where?
<cbx33> no nevermind
<cbx33> I'm being stupid
<cbx33> ok I'm going to make a new page, and get ogra to link it in
<lucasvo> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UserPreferences
<lucasvo> am I blind or is there a Login link missing in the edubuntu teme?
<ogra> sorry i'm just trying to debug evolution, that has prio (need my mail)
<lucasvo> lol, see, evolution sucks :)
<cbx33> ooooh don;t tick Mr ogra  off :p
<lucasvo> I've never had that problems with thunderbird
<lucasvo> I am only ticking his programms off :)
<lucasvo> ogra: what's the problem with evolution?
<ogra> it segfaults silently
<lucasvo> lol
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
<cbx33> hi highvoltage 
<highvoltage> hi cbx33 
<lucasvo> hi highvoltage 
<highvoltage> hi lucasvo 
<cbx33> https://wiki.edubuntu.org/LTSPWindowsDHCP
<cbx33> how does that look ?
<ogra> put an: "sudo apt-get remove dhcp3-server" at the top ;) to make sure the user cannot just run them both (which will cause a lot of support)
<ogra> else thats very good :)
<cbx33> ok, i could go the whole hog with screen shots etc, but I don;t think that's necessary
<ogra> well, its windows ... :)
<ogra> oh, btw, put that below EdubuntuDocumentation ... we share one wiki database with ubuntu,xubuntu,ubuntu
<ogra> so putting it there will make sure its edubuntu documentation :)
<cbx33> ogra: I'm not sure I follow?
<cbx33> sorry....having a blonde moment,. - I did just get blonde highlights....could explain it
<ogra> https://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuDocumentation
<cbx33> I'm going to work on the etherboot setup too, because that's what we'll use here
<ogra> have a look there 
<ogra> i'll move the other docs there as well before release
<cbx33> ok done
<cbx33> nope, not done.....do you just want a link to my doc at the bottom?
<cbx33> or move the page to there?
<cbx33> sorry ogra I know you're busy
<ogra> move the page if possible 
<cbx33> ok...I'll delete the old one
<cbx33> ok, all sorted
<cbx33> I put it as a draft
<cbx33> right....
* cbx33 turns his attention to etherboot
<ogra> dont put to much effort in it 
<ogra> it will be automated in eft
<cbx33> yes, I know, but I need to use etherboot here
<cbx33> :Dp
<cbx33> our machines are going to be dual boot
<cbx33> windows/ubuntu
<cbx33> i was gonna setup grub with the boot without PXE system so they could choose windows or ubuntu
<cbx33> unless you can think of another way?
<ogra> there is a "network grub" version 
<ogra> i never tried it
<cbx33> oh?
<cbx33> i was gonna install the floppy disk stuff onto a small hdd partition and do it that way :p
<cbx33> but that could be a much easier way to do it
<ogra> it operates on PXE level and gives you a bootmenu
<cbx33> oooh
<cbx33> could be good
<cbx33> got a link?
<lucasvo> very neat :)
<ogra> (server sides, though)
<cbx33> yeh..that's the only disadvantage
<ogra> its somewhere on the syslinux page and there is also documentation in the grub docs afaik
<cbx33> kk thank ogra 
<lucasvo> cbx33: https://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuDocumentation/LTSPEtherbootSetup
<cbx33> es reading that now
<lucasvo> there is a zlilo file you can generate
<cbx33> that's my other option
<lucasvo> I mean this: https://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuDocumentation/BootingClientsWithoutPxe
<ogra> we should probably crosslink these two :)
<cbx33> ndeed
<ogra> they both need each other ;)
<cbx33> are you going to link my DHCP page into one of the ltsp server setup docs?
<cbx33> would it be an idea to put a link into the cookbook?
<ogra> under LTSPServerSetup ?
<cbx33> up to you?
<cbx33> wherever you feel it's appropriate
<lucasvo> I would put it into LTSPServerSetup
* lucasvo will test dapper beta now
<lucasvo> what is ports?
<bimberi_> lucasvo: ubuntu ported to other architectures
<lucasvo> ah, ok
<bimberi_> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-announce/2006-April/000068.html
<lucasvo> thanks
<bimberi_> yw :)
<cbx33> ogra: you there?
<ogra> yep
<cbx33> um pxelinux config file
<cbx33> can i have several options in there?
<lucasvo> anybody could help me with gdb?
<ogra> not sure
<cbx33> like so they can choose thich to boot from
<ogra> look into the docs 
<lucasvo> I need to debug gimp 
<cbx33> it has a label option
<lucasvo> it crashes all the time
<cbx33> which makes me think so
<cbx33> I'll try it
<ogra> lucasvo, https://wiki.edubuntu.org/Debugging
<ogra> and #ubuntu-bugs ;)
<lucasvo> ogra: thanks
<cbx33> ogra: I'll look into it, could be a nice doc to put up there
<ogra> yep
<ogra> or even a suggestion to add it to the ltsp defaults ;)
<lucasvo> 40548
<lucasvo> bug 40548
<lucasvo> #40548
<lucasvo> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/gimp/+bug/40548
<lucasvo> !bug 40548
<ubotu> Did you get hit by a windmill? Try searching at http://ubuntu.cc.com.au/, lucasvo
<lucasvo> we don't have ubugtu?
<ogra> we dont really need it
<cbx33> indeed
<ogra> (there are less than 10 edubuntu related bugs in LP)
<cbx33> :D
<cbx33> wayyy to go :p
<ogra> i'm willing to consider it if we hit the 50 bugs mark ;)
<lucasvo> cbx33: that's why edubuntu is perfect :)
<ogra> haha
<ogra> that only means that people dont file enough bugs :)
<cbx33> ogra: do we use NBP on the PXElinux
<ogra> NBP ?
<cbx33> network boot prompt
<cbx33> ooh ooh hang on
<ogra> nope
<cbx33> I've DONE IT 
<cbx33> Ok I gotta doc this :D
<ogra> :)
<ogra> cool
<cbx33> can multiboot from linux or localdisk
<cbx33> :D
<lucasvo> maybe one should begin to combine all the docs about the thinclients
<cbx33> hmmm
<ogra> lucasvo, thats why i want them under EdubuntuDocumentation
<lucasvo> now you have about 5 docs on how to boot your thin clients
<lucasvo> ogra: yeah
<ogra> we can later create subsections
<cbx33> grr just can't get display.msg to work
<ogra> if you get it working, try to switch it to gfxboot ;)
<ogra> (joking...)
<cbx33> I'd love too
<cbx33> infact i may just do that....
<cbx33> later on of course
<cbx33> is there docs on how to administrate the ltsp server yet?
<cbx33> ogra: how much work is it to get gfxboot working
<lucasvo> waa
<ogra> cbx33, thats rather a question for Kamion who implemented it in the CD boot ...
<lucasvo> 100ms ping time to google
<ogra> i've never seen the gfxboot code, but it comes from suse which might make it not better :)
<cbx33> hheheh
<cbx33> I know what you mean
<cbx33> I'll maybe try that out on monday
<cbx33> for now I have a system that works YAY !!!!
<cbx33> just need to do the m$ integration into edubuntu now
<ogra> ask Kamion, he has a bzr repo of his gfxboot stuff and can point you to the right documentation
<cbx33> nice
<cbx33> I'll mail him later
<lucasvo> cbx33: you are very productive, cool work!
<ogra> does anybody mind if i use https://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuCommunity as the "getting involved" part of the beta announcement ? JaneW, highvoltage ?
<lucasvo> ogra: I would add a sentence that says, one can also come to irc channel and ask what to do
<ogra> thats what that page says
<lucasvo> you mean the whole page?
<ogra> its just that we dont have a GettingInvolved wikipage like ubuntu and kubuntu have
<lucasvo> I thought, you only mean paragraph 2.
<lucasvo> How can I get involved?
<ogra> i want to put the link to that page in the announcement 
<ogra> yes
<lucasvo> ogra: it was a missunderstanding, on the wikipage, there is a paragraph called "How can I get involved?" and I thought you only want to put this one into the mail
<ogra> nope
<ogra> JaneW, highvoltage... piiing
* ogra wants to get that thing out of the door)
<cbx33> ogra: is this the CC mailiout?
<ogra> thats the ubuntu-announce mail
<ogra> https://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuDapperBetaAnnouncement
<cbx33> ah ok
<jsgotangco> you haven't sent an annouce email?
* jsgotangco sorry has been busy all day
<ogra> jsgotangco, i have a working evolution since 4h again (after 2 days of not being able to use it through a looping segfault)
<jsgotangco> heh
* jsgotangco aims to send a release annoucement email someday
<cbx33> ogra: how can I include screenshots in my wiki page
<ogra> sure, why not ? :)
<cbx33> I menat how?
<cbx33> :p
<highvoltage> ogra: hi
<highvoltage> i'm on my way out
<cbx33> do i have to host them?
<highvoltage> ogra: JaneW is painting eggs :)
<highvoltage> (small office party thing)
<cbx33> https://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuDocumentation/LTSPMultiboot
<jsgotangco> highvoltage: that's too late for easter though, and highly ambiguous for earth day
<jsgotangco> heh
<highvoltage> jsgotangco: :)
<highvoltage> ogra: pooong?
<ogra> highvoltage, see my question
<ogra> cbx33, doesnt that system offer a "default" setting as well ? so you can get rid of the prompt and have a timeout ? 
<cbx33> the default system is documented
<cbx33> in the doc
* highvoltage reads EdubuntuCommunity
<cbx33> oh
<cbx33> yes
<cbx33> yes...it documents about the time out
<cbx33> but it didn;t like defaulting to the LOCALBOOT 0 line
<cbx33> so i had to creat two stanza
<highvoltage> ogra: yep
<ogra> highvoltage, thanks 
<ogra> will wrap some text around it and then the announcement is ready for correction ...
<highvoltage> nice
<highvoltage> ok, bye! have a good weekend, edubuntu land!
<ogra> ciao 
<cbx33> how do i include images on the wiki?
<jsgotangco> that's no good he's out to have fun on a friday night
<cbx33> I've uploaded it as an attachement
<cbx33> or is that the wrong way to go about it?
<ogra> just look at some other page that uses screenshots ;)
<cbx33> kk
<cbx33> was just looking for one
<cbx33> DONE !
<cbx33> woohoo :D
<cbx33> ogra: I have finished those man pages too
<cbx33> I'll upload those tonight 
<ogra> thanks
<cbx33> you now have the 3 pages
<cbx33> I'll try using bzr :p
<ogra> thanks a lot :)
<cbx33> np
<cbx33> my next doc will be about integrating m$ authentication so things ike kerberos
<cbx33> so that people can implement those into their AD domains
<JaneW> ogra: I have photos of ubuntu eggs and an ubuntu hot cross bun now
<cbx33> hehehehe
<JaneW> ogra: still need help?
* ogra fights his anger about the artwork ...
<cbx33> what's up ogra 
<ogra> JaneW, a prrofreading would be nice, give me 30 min i'll finish the doc ...
<ogra> cbx33, our marketing wants us to use a dark greenish theme (chalkboard colors)
<JaneW> gah I am tired of this artwork argument
<JaneW> what's the difference to her anyway?
<ogra> JaneW, ready: https://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuDapperBetaAnnouncement
<JaneW> ogra: fast 30 mins :)
<ogra> she paied money to cliff for the chalkboard already i guess and missed to ask for feedback on the idea 
<ogra> which i find very odd
<ogra> i heard about chalkboard less than two weeks ago the first time 
<jsgotangco> JaneW: can i make a spec about a line of food products with teh Ubuntu trademark
<jsgotangco> ogra: artwork?
<ogra> yes
<jsgotangco> im not following this at all sorry :)
<ogra> we'll get a dark depressive chalkboard colored one it seems, no matter what i say, silbs goes on and on with it
<jsgotangco> schools still use a chalkboard?
<jsgotangco> that's being too sterotype :)
<ogra> i even referred to you telling her that we gained so much market *because* of our colorscheme, but she seems not to listen and tells me that she advised some changes to the chalkboard
<spacey> "the chalkboard?
<ogra> s/market/market in asia/
<jsgotangco> edubuntu is pretty big here
<ogra> i'm just concerned to give up the identity we have now
<jsgotangco> i would understand that
<jsgotangco> i guess it doesn't bode well with gartoon
<jsgotangco> or tangerine
<spacey> the school we deployed it is very happy with the current one
<spacey> s/it/edubuntu
<spacey> including edubuntu girl
<ogra> i thought so
<ogra> jsgotangco, that as well
<jsgotangco> ogra: pressure from community might help?
<ogra> yeah !
<spacey> it should be a bit happy
<spacey> its for kids
<ogra> yep, but dont forget we want to look a bit more grown up this time :)
* lucasvo likes the chalkboard, but he is more an adult than a kid 
<ogra> at least for the default
<lucasvo> ogra: I wouldn't say that
* jsgotangco remembered soething about a proposal before for a chalkboard-like theme but havent heard from it since until today
<JaneW> ogra: looks great, I just made some v.minor edits...
<lucasvo> I think one should make more than one theme
<ogra> JaneW, cool, will send it then :)
<JaneW> ogra: Do It
<JaneW> :)
<spacey> ogra: if you want to address a bit older group of kids
<jsgotangco> go go go
<ogra> lucasvo, we can have only *one* default theme 
<ogra> no matter how many we produce
<lucasvo> well, the default yes
<spacey> :>
<JaneW> jsgotangco: yes - re spec :)
<jsgotangco> or else i'll invite you to join blatant errors and awkward grammar LP team
<lucasvo> but one could have more than one official theme
<spacey> any idea how this chalkboard theme will look l?
<lucasvo> maybe an install option to chose the theme? *g*
<ogra> jsgotangco, is there such a team ? i'D happily join 
* lucasvo should probably join it as well
<lucasvo> :)
<jsgotangco> ogra: blatant-and-awkward
<ogra> spacey, like a chalkboard ... all dark and green
<jsgotangco> its headed by mvo :)
<ogra> haha
<spacey> our chalkboard where black
<spacey> were
<ogra> oh, here they are very dark greenish
<spacey> when i was young
<JaneW> ogra: let's show them the themes and get a quick poll?
<spacey> actually i depended on the classroom
<spacey> also had them in blue and light green
<spacey> :P
<lucasvo> in our old school they were green, in the school I am atm, they are black
<JaneW> ogra: can we?
<jsgotangco> JaneW: yeah like last year
<ogra> JaneW, no idea
* lucasvo hates the whiteboards :)
<ogra> but i guess we'll have to to get some opinions here
<spacey> i'm off btw, opensource cafe in half hour :)
<spacey> byebye:)
<ogra> https://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuDapperTheme/JonathanCarter/chalk?highlight=%28edubuntu%29%7C%28chalkboard%29
<ogra> thats a bit more blue than the one we got offered, but you get the idea
<jsgotangco> yeah ive seen this before
<jsgotangco> i kind of liked it before
<jsgotangco> but not as default
<spacey> reminds me of win98
<lucasvo> I wouldn't make the edubuntu so silverish it looks more like a harley davidson than a chalkboard
<jsgotangco> lol
<spacey> only thing i like is the edubuntu written in chalk
<lucasvo> yeah, that one is good
<jsgotangco> i kind of like the chalk logo though
<lucasvo> it is too abstract for kids
<cbx33> i prefer the orange
<cbx33> bbl
<jsgotangco> EWWWWw
<jsgotangco> is that the berlin wall???
<jsgotangco> oopss
<JaneW> heh
<JaneW> ok I am going home
<JaneW> to eat my hot ubuntu bun
<LaserJock> ok, so here is a question. I haven't installed edubuntu yet but from the screenshots it does look like it is targeted toward younger kids. Is there a plan to make it also University friendly?
<ogra> LaserJock, the new default theme should look a bit more mature in dapper
<LaserJock> ogra: got a url for that? is it the one above?
<ogra> the one above looks similar to what we got proposed 
<ogra> i'm *very* unhappy with it
<ogra> especially since we discarded the idea in breezy already with a majority of the community
<LaserJock> it look kind of Win95ish
<ogra> yeah
<ogra> the new one is a bit more professional and a bit more green
<LaserJock> k
<ogra> but still has depressive dark green colors
<LaserJock> hmm, anybody done any studies of what schools prefer?
<ogra> i think we have a color identity we should stay with ... just have a neutral wallpaper
<LaserJock> what would be cool is for universities to each have a theme in their school colors
<ogra> we already ship three themes :)
<ogra> and see my pranding package RFC on -devel ;)
<jsgotangco> ogra: i just saw it
<ogra> *branding
<jsgotangco> it reminded me of graffitti
<jsgotangco> hehe
<LaserJock> ogra: reading your mail right now
<ogra> the berlin wall ? 
<ogra> heh
<ogra> thats a good title for it 
<jsgotangco> if we're going to make it realistic, we'll need something like jane <3 tom thing
<jsgotangco> no classes!
<ogra> :)
<jsgotangco> ogra: i read about the branding RFC, but would rather not reply to list, are you just looking into creating an app or doing a while branding spec?
<ogra> the plain theme is thought for universities btw ... 
* jsgotangco got to do white box branding for MS before, it had a whole CD toolkit with docs
<ogra> i want an app that creates an artwork metapackage that you can just add to a customized CD iso
<ogra> so branding on click ...
<jsgotangco> no guidelines whatsoever
<ogra> nope
* jsgotangco is pretty much insterested in OEM ever since we featured it last release
<ogra> only a tool that picks up the current setup
<jsgotangco> but i hardly see any movement on it
<ogra> it could be an addition to the oem stuff, yes
<jsgotangco> who's in charge of oem anyway?
<jsgotangco> (business-wise)
<ogra> but the idea is that you install ubuntu, make your changes to themes, artwork, logos etc and then just have one click to get a package that brands every ubuntu you install that on
<LaserJock> is it possible to change themes?  if I have ubuntu, kubuntu, and edubuntu installed (actually *-desktop) can I choose which theme I want?
<jsgotangco> it can be extended to other stuff 
<ogra> jsgotangco, sure thats eft+3 or so :)
<jsgotangco> :P
<ogra> LaserJock, in edubuntu just run dpkg-reconfigure edubuntu-artwork 
<LaserJock> ah
<jsgotangco> count me in i can focus on it for next cycle at least i;ll have focus
<ogra> but it doesnt work well together with ubuntu-artwork
<ogra> since edubuntu-desktop changes the default desktop to edubuntu 
<LaserJock> so there isn't some kind of theme chooser for users?
<ogra> sure the theme tool 
<ogra> but thats only for the user
<LaserJock> does that do the bootsplash too, or is it just for gnome/gdm?
<ogra> everything 
<Bluekuja> hi guys :)
<LaserJock> cool
<Bluekuja> ogra take a look here https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+bug/40576
<Bluekuja> just filled out 
<ogra> Bluekuja, that didnt happen since breezy ...
<ogra> did you notify #ubuntu-bugs about it ? 
<Bluekuja> im going to do it now :)
<Bluekuja> i noticed this problem with labtop
<LaserJock> ogra: so Edubuntu beta is out, right?
<Bluekuja> 5 minutes waiting
<Bluekuja> -.-
<ogra> LaserJock, despite missing the announcement, yes :)
<LaserJock> ogra: ok, I think I'll give it a whirl
<ogra> :)
<LaserJock> I got my 2 boxes at home merged together last night so I'm going to wipe my 120G drive and start over with Beta
<LaserJock> hmm, where are the edubuntu isos located?
<ogra> erm ...
<ogra>  /topic ?
<jsgotangco> lol
<LaserJock> doh
<ogra> seems we really need that announcement with the url :)
<jsgotangco> graduate school sure comes in handy eh?
<jsgotangco> :)
<LaserJock> jsgotangco: you bet, I can spel and evrything
<LaserJock> actually, in my irssi term it is hard to see the topics
<jsgotangco> you should join blatant-and-awkward in LP then
<jsgotangco> ah right
<LaserJock> jsgotangco: I've seen that team :-)
<jsgotangco> anyways goodnight
<LaserJock> arggh, no seeds for the torrent :(
<ogra> really ? 
<LaserJock> nope
<LaserJock> I'm just downloading the i386 livecd directly
<ogra> why the liveCD ?
<LaserJock> cause I want to test it out
<ogra> ah, k+
<LaserJock> I haven't seen espresso yet
<ogra> its pretty cool and a lot faster ...
<ogra> but not helpful for edubuntu sadly ...
<LaserJock> no?
<ogra> since you can get only the workstation install with it
<LaserJock> oh, that would be what I want if I'm not using it as a ltsp server, right?
<ogra> yep
<LaserJock> k
<LaserJock> I'm not really interested in ltsp at this point since I only have a couple computers
<LaserJock> hmm, but my department does have a undergraduate computer lab
<ogra> the sudo dpkg-reconfigure edubuntu-artwork works also on the liveCD btw ... run it in a terminal and log out ... on autoligin you'll have the new theme
<LaserJock> cool
<LaserJock> hmm, this ltsp stuff would be perfect for our computer lab :/
<ogra> sure :)
<LaserJock> I just wonder how hard it would be to get people to try it
<LaserJock> right now we have ~10-15 Windows computers that each have some sort of read-only partition that is booted up
<LaserJock> but it is a pain that they are all still  seperate computers
<LaserJock> ok, this might be a stupid question, but  how do you tell if a NIC has PXE?
<cbx33> afternoon all
<LaserJock> hi cbx33 
<cbx33> hi LaserJock 
<lns> LaserJock, is the NIC onboard or an add-on card?
<lns> hi all btw =)
<LaserJock> lns: actually, I have no idea. I was just trying to think about our computer lab and how I could tell
<lns> well
<lns> if it's onboard, when you boot the computer go into the BIOS and see if it has any settings for the NIC
<lns> and you'll be able to tell from there
<lns> if not
<lns> during boot and after POST it should give you a seperate message like "Press CTRL+S to enter setup" or something simmilar to that for the NIC
<lns> you'll have to watch the messages as you boot up
<LaserJock> lns: k, thanks
<lns> no prob
<LaserJock> man, it would be really sweet if I could get the department to use Edubuntu
<LaserJock> I just think it would be a tough sell
<lns> LaserJock, what department?
<lns> oh nm
<lns> hehe
<LaserJock> lns: I'm a PhD chemistry student at a US university ;-)
<lns> nice
<lns> =)
<LaserJock> the problem is, hardly anybody uses linux here :/
<LaserJock> it's all OSX and Windows
<cbx33> Grrr....
<lns> burn some liveCDs
<cbx33> damn those propreitory inferior OS's
<lns> for ppc and i386...pop them randomly in some drives and reboot ;)
<cbx33> or setup and LTSP server and PXE boot
<LaserJock> one of the main problems is that it is used by all students on campus
<LaserJock> so the use MS Office a lot
<LaserJock> I'm not sure if they would go for OO.org
<cbx33> they'd cut back on spending if they moved to openoffice :p
<LaserJock> for sure, it could be much cheaper
<LaserJock> they were looking at upgrading the computers, but I'm pretty sure they wouldn't have to with LTSP
<LaserJock> plus I could whip up a chemistry meta package so that we have all the goodies installed ;-)
<cbx33> LaserJock, I was just thinking that way they could still have windows installed
<LaserJock> ewwww
<cbx33> and no modification to the HDD at all
<cbx33> that's the best part :p
<LaserJock> hmm, yeah. maybe if I could set up an Edubuntu server and without messing up the current setup
<cbx33> well that's what I was suggesting :p
<cbx33> if they didn;t like all they would have to do is turn off the edubuntu server
<cbx33> ogra, you there?
<lns> you know LaserJock it might be smarter to use Ubuntu+LTSP instead of edubuntu for a uni
<lns> just my opinion
<lns> i know we talked about this yesterday
<cbx33> well yeh :p
<ogra> lns, did you take a look at edubuntu with the plain theme ? 
<lns> any ss available?
<lns> i have't
<ogra> thats intended for science and unis
<lns> oh...well i mean i was just thinkng along the lines of what default apps are installed
<lns> not necessarily just the theme
<ogra> yep, thats on the list for eft ... to have better menu management that would switch certain parts off for certain usecases
<cbx33> ogra, excellent
<lns> wow ogra nice
<ogra> dunno if its manageable in time in the short release cycle
<ogra> but it will be definately there in eft+1
<lns> hehe
<cbx33> ogra, any news on the artwork
<ogra> we only have 4 months for eft
<lns> i read their plans for efty, it seems like it'd be pretty easy to include stuff in it since they're cleaning the slate so to speak
<cbx33> I love the idea about the theme management btw :P
<ogra> and two of these will be bugfixing and stabilization
<ogra> cbx33, the future idea is to have it selectable from the CD bootmenu
<LaserJock> ogra: 4 months? I thought we had 5 1/2
<cbx33> that'd be awsome
<ogra> i just have to dig deep into the gfxboot guts ...
<ogra> which i didnt have time for yet
<cbx33> well...I'll be digging into those guts soon too :p
<ogra> thats great, so we can discuss changes and know what we're talking about even
<cbx33> indeed 
<cbx33> I hope
<cbx33> :p
<cbx33> I'll get the bzr version at somepoint
<ogra> LaserJock, oct 10th as usual :)
<cbx33> probably monday
<ogra> probably a week or two later ...
<LaserJock> ogra: are you sure? I thought the TB decided to do +2 weeks for Dapper+1, +2, and +3
<ogra> cbx33, its in dapper ...
<ogra> 4 months +2 weeks are still no 5 1/2 :)
<cbx33> i thought you said that version came from SuSE
<LaserJock> ogra: no, I mean -2 I guess
<LaserJock> so it would be 5 1/2 months for the next 3 releases
<ogra> ah
<LaserJock> I could be wrong though
<cbx33> ogra, do the options in gfxboot then get passed to the kernel I presume?
<ogra> yep
<ogra> thats the easy part 
<cbx33> hehe
<cbx33> what's the hard part then ?
<ogra> hacking the GUI up is the hard one
<cbx33> what's the hard part then :p
<cbx33> aahhhhh
<cbx33> I'll bbl
<lns> is the new ubuntu gfx boot too?
<lns> or just edubuntu
<ogra> all of them are
<ogra> even xubuntu i think (didnt check)
<lns> awesome
<lns> i really like it
<lns> is there a way to put that in the actual bootloader post install, i.e. grub/lilo replacement?
<lns> is it based on either?
<ogra> we tried it (grub bootimage) and it failed on a huge amount of machines
<lns> understandable
<lns> tricky to get all that into a bootloader
<bobulator> can anyone point me in the right direction of stuff to look at to add a thick client to the thin client network? not even sure what protocols i'm looking at messing with... NFS?
<lns> bobulator, what are you trying to accomplish with the thick client?
<bobulator> well
<bobulator> we have 1 room with all the computers in it
<bobulator> and we want another at the other end of the house that can be used for sound and the like
<bobulator> and just as a workstation, we ahve another decent processor so it seems daft not to use it to it's full and the like
<bobulator> basically we want to keep the same user data and logins, but have everything else running locally
<bobulator> lns: any ideas where i should be looking?
<lns> hmm
<lns> possibly nis/samba domain
<lns> i'm sure edubuntu just uses passwd pam auth
<bobulator> lns: i thoguht samba was just for windows to talk to linux?
<lns> not necessarily
<bobulator> ok
<lns> you can use it for all linux too, it's a good filesharing system
<bobulator> cool :)
<lns> it just is compatible with windows/cifs
<bobulator> so either that, or pam?
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
<bobulator> and not nfs?
<lns> nfs isn't an authentication mechanism, just filesharing
<lns> nis would work
<lns> but i don't have much exp with that
<bobulator> ah ok
<bobulator> it would be good to have something in the edubuntu docs about it :) it cant be that rare a request...
<bobulator> if i sort it out ill try and write it up
<ogra> we'll have a ldap/kreberos based solution at some point 
<bobulator> cool
<bobulator> worth looking those up too?
<ogra> until then you'll have to set it up yourself, that would be nice to have documented
<bobulator> is it pretty straightforward in a linux kinda way?
<ogra> there are at least plenty of documents how to set it up on the web i think
<ogra> i'd not introduce samba just for network auth 
<bobulator> cool
<ogra> but nis is insecure (which would be an alternative)
<bobulator> so is one of those for auth and one for filesharing?
<ogra> and all ldap/kerberos solutions require some more knowledge
<bobulator> ok
<ogra> you have nfs running on the edubuntu server anyway
<ogra> so there is nothing you need to care ...
<ogra> +about 
<cbx33> I'm gonna be documenting samba ubuntu authentication soon
<bobulator> :)
<cbx33> authenticating against an AD domain
<bobulator> ok, ill look up that for now then and then try the other one later
<cbx33> bye all
<ogra> its just teaching the clients to authenticate via the server and then teaching the server to allow that
<cbx33> I'll have to upload those bits tomorrow ogra, I'm off out to see Silent Hill now :p
<ogra> cbx33, enjoy :)
<cbx33> heeh
<bobulator> right, so look up nfs and nis you reckon? i need things to type into google :)
<ogra> yes
<bobulator> cool, ta!
<ogra> but be aware that nis is the least secure system here
<bobulator> ok. but presumably as long as i make it local network only, itll be ok?
<ogra> so if you are paranoid about security stuff, its nothing for you
<bobulator> reet
<bobulator> but if its runnign already?
<ogra> nis ? 
<bobulator> ah ok
<ogra> nis isnt installed
<bobulator> so nfs is running
<bobulator> and nis is
<bobulator> ok
<ogra> nfs exports the / readonly for the thin clients in ltsp 
<bobulator> right
<ogra> there is nothing insecure about that :)
<bobulator> cool :) but i guess having it let other directorys be writable is insecure?
<ogra> nah
<highvoltage> yay, it's weekend!
<bobulator> so its just nis i need to worry about, right
<ogra> just make sure to use the options right 
<ogra> yep
<highvoltage> ogra: nice announce
<ogra> thanks :)
<bobulator> how insecure is it? does it transmit passwords unencrypted or something?
<highvoltage> ogra: if i have lots of space on my installation medium, and lets say i have a customised Edubuntu installation DVD, would it legal (from a debian/apt/dpkg perspective) to tar up the ltsp chroot on a working machine, and then extract it from the installation medium, instead of building it?
<highvoltage> ogra: i know it's a waste of space, but it would make the installation a bit faster for us at a big bunch of schools
<highvoltage> (note that i'm not suggesting this for any official edubuntu dvd)
<ogra> just make sure to use the same packages you also ship on the CD
<highvoltage> ok, will do.
<ogra> the chroot is unpacked ~300MB
<highvoltage> and i'll have ltsp-standalone-server and everything installed as i should just before i would run ltsp-build-client, would that be ok?
<ogra> no idea how small you can squeeze it
<ogra> yup
* highvoltage bzips it quickly just to test
<ogra> you also need to make sure that the installer doesnt call ltsp-client-builder 
<ogra> else you'll have it twice
<highvoltage> yes, i want to do a custom seed for our tuxlabs.
<ogra> (the first one will get overwritten, but you wont gain speed)
<highvoltage> i don't really know how to do it yet, but the ubuntu wiki seems full of advise, and i suppose there's just one way to learn, and that's to just do it :)
<highvoltage> i strongly considered using ltsp.org again for the next upgrade, simply because it has USB support (something our teachers want desperately)
<highvoltage> but since the next edubuntu ltsp will have it too, i figured they can just wait a little more.
<highvoltage> something else i've considered, is that if we extracted Ubuntu LTSP, we could possibly give the option to choose between ubuntu ltsp and ltsp.org, but then i thought that it would just add too much support overhead, so we're just sticking with ubuntu ltsp.
<cbx33> highvoltage, from what i can see ubuntu ltsp works better anyway
<highvoltage> cbx33: what's the specs on the thin client you're using?
<cbx33> um...well I tested it on a VM machine...and it b0rked
<cbx33> but then i tested it on a nice toshiba laptop and it was fine
<cbx33> I've not done much testing on other machines yet
<cbx33> want to get it all up and running
<highvoltage> i'd like to do some experiments on some low-end hardware, i have mixed theories that suggests that either one could work better on say, a PII 233 with 64MB RAM
<cbx33> gonna have AD authentication....
<cbx33> cos the kids still need to access their work
<cbx33> whether they re on linux or windows
<cbx33> i think we need some docs about how the ltsp can be administrated
<cbx33> like adding pacakges etc....
<ogra> yep
<ogra> but thats a one liner :)
<cbx33> apt-get :p
<cbx33> inside the chrrot I presume?
<ogra> yep
<cbx33> how do logins work
<ogra> you need to copy the servers sources.list before, because the chroot only jhas the cdrom
<cbx33> is the pam authentication exactly the same as on a normal system
<cbx33> i see
<ogra> pam ? 
<ogra> we use a ssh tunnel
<ogra> dunno if that uses any pam modules ...
<cbx33> ah i see
<cbx33> just thinking about how I'm going to get AD authentication working
<ogra> you'll need to tell the servers sshd to use the AD, dont ask me how
<cbx33> or even if it;s possible
<cbx33> i don't even think that's possible
<cbx33> hmmmm this is gonna be tricky
<ogra> ssh is able to use pam, i just dont know if we do it by default
<cbx33> that'd be cool, I'm sure we can do it one way or th other
<cbx33> although ad authentication is a PITA
<cbx33> kerberos for one thing
<cbx33> is a nuicense
<highvoltage> ogra: you will also notice way less mails and admin stuff from the list :)
<cbx33> ogra, did i ask if ther ewas any news on the artwork?
<ogra> nope, there werent any yet
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> I'm not too sure about the green
<cbx33> right...I gotta dash
<highvoltage> ogra: what's the wallpapers currently included on the beta CD?
<ogra> only edubuntu girl
<ogra> plain doesnt use a wallpaper and i'm waiting fro something for the young theme
<bobulator> hmm
<bobulator> does anyone know if nfs-utils has been superceded? its not on the package list
<highvoltage> is there any way i can limit a user's memory usage in edubuntu?
<Burgundavia> highvoltage: afaik, that is not possible at all
<crimsun> highvoltage: $EDITOR /etc/security/limits.conf
<Burgundavia> hmm, I proved wrong
<crimsun> highvoltage: set hard limits for the items, namely memlock, rss, stack, and as
<highvoltage> crimsun: wow, that's very handy. does it use ulimit?
<crimsun> this is in pam, so it's effective regardless of what shell is used
<crimsun> if you wish, you can set ulimits, too
<Sergi0> hi, could freenx be used in a edubuntu enviorment?
<highvoltage> crimsun: what's the difference really between soft and hard limits?
<highvoltage> crimsun: i tried to look at ulimits, but i'm having trouble finding documentation on it :/
<ogra> Sergi0, sure, why shouldnt that be possible
* HedgeMage peeks in 
<Sergi0> ogra: freenx is alot faster, so a client ltsp could use it and connects with freenx with the server, right?
<ogra> that would require some work on the ltsp setup
<crimsun> highvoltage: ulimits tend to be associated per-shell. Instead you want to think about rlimits for process quotas. Neither the soft nor the hard limits can be exceeded, but the soft is often called the "current" because it can be raised through calls to the hard limit.
<Sergi0> ah okay, but not impossible ogra
<ogra> i.e. you would have to make the freenx client start instaed of ldm
<ogra> (after X is up)
<highvoltage> crimsun: aaah
<ogra> apart from that there shouldnt be a probelm
<Sergi0> ogra: ah okay, great
<highvoltage> crimsun: could i set, in limits.conf, that a user may have up to 120MB real ram, and after that they can still have as much swap as they want?
<crimsun> highvoltage: no, because swap is part of the vm affected by real ram usage
<highvoltage> crimsun: or does memlock lock total in swap and ram?
<highvoltage> ok.
#edubuntu 2006-04-27
<kamiro87> hello. is edubuntu have a polish version?
<kamiro87> sorry, ttpo *&does
<colin_> heelo
<colin_> hello*
<colin_> im trying to set up edubutu for my school lab
<colin_> if i want centrilized users, should u connet edubuntu clients to a ubuntu server or wut?
<colin_> how does that work?
<Arc> you using ltsp or just want centralized authentication?
<colin_> sorry, what is ltsp again?
<colin_> i forgot
<colin_> oh
<colin_> got it
<colin_> just centralized auth
<colin_> i want sw to be local
<lucasvo> colin_: you need to set up an ldap server
<colin_> it minimize load on the wireless
<lucasvo> and then install pam_ldap
<lucasvo> and some sort of file server to mount the /home/_User/
<lucasvo> colin_: but that's not easy
<colin_> ok
<colin_> ill be back in like 10 mins
<colin_> hold on
<colin_> ok
<colin_> back
<colin_> so...
<colin_> what is the pad addition to ldap?
<colin_> pam*
<colin_> so... if i just disk image a setup edubuntu drive and dup it to 10 laptops, can i run a server so all the student can have their own login/documents/settings and just run the programs localy
<lucasvo> no
<lucasvo> thats not that easy
<lucasvo> first you have to set up ldap
<lucasvo> www.openldap.org
<colin_> i thought that was for mail
<lucasvo> no, not only
<lucasvo> I am not an expert in this area, I can't really help you
<colin_> do u no what functinality it would have for my setup?
<lucasvo> yes, people would be able to login with the same pass and files on every machine
<colin_> and then just run programs off the server?
<lucasvo> no, not with ldap
<lucasvo> if you use some sort of ldap+fileserver, everything is local 
<lucasvo> except authentication on login 
<colin_> so i could run the programs locally on the clients, like i wanted to
<lucasvo> yes
<colin_> that sounds great
<colin_> thanks
<lucasvo> np
<colin_> but wait, is the users' home dir local or server based?
<lucasvo> serverbased
<lucasvo> colin_: the fileserver
<colin_> (sorry for all the questions, im a tech, not an admin, and i only have mac background)
<colin_> ok cool
<colin_> so i would run logins and documents/settings(home directory) on the server w/ ldap and programs and the OS on the local drive
<colin_> is that a good summery?
<lucasvo> yes
<lucasvo> LDAP is used for authentaction
<colin_> sounds good
<lucasvo> but don't ask me what fileserver to use
<lucasvo> probably nfs
<lucasvo> but that's not very secure
<colin_> dont rele need security
<lucasvo> well if it's over WLAN :)
<colin_> its just school work and all the kids are computer iliterate
<colin_> its low power wlan, u cant get in from out side the classroom
<lucasvo> and that could be a problem, because kids all opening a file generates some traffic
<lucasvo> colin_: try to use cable from the server to the workstations
<colin_> yeah...i no
<colin_> hmmmm
<colin_> the problem is its going to be a protible laptop cart
<lucasvo> aha
<colin_> but the good thing is that the wlan move w/ it
<colin_> moves*
<colin_> so wait, what is the diff between pam_ldap and open ldap?
<lucasvo> two different programs
<lucasvo> pam_ldap is a module which is installed on the client 
<lucasvo> it enables user to login over a remote ldap server
<lucasvo> openldap is the server with the user database
<colin_> ah
<colin_> got its
<colin_> and pam_ldap is fluid w/ edubuntu?
<lucasvo> lucasvo@supernova:~$ apt-cache search libpam-ldap
<lucasvo> libpam-ccreds - Pam module to cache authentication credentials
<lucasvo> libpam-ldap - Pluggable Authentication Module allowing LDAP interfaces
<lucasvo> nss-updatedb - Cache name service directories in DB format
<lucasvo> lucasvo@supernova:~$
<colin_> which means?
<lucasvo> yes
<colin_> what?
<lucasvo> there is a package to install
<lucasvo> it is fluid with ubuntu
<colin_> ok
<colin_> cool
<colin_> sounds good
<colin_> thanks
<colin_> now, will there be a gui for the login?
<lucasvo> yes, it's a normal login
<colin_> ok
<lucasvo> with gdm or kdm or whatever you want
<colin_> are those both login programs built into edubuntu?
<lucasvo> gmd is
<colin_> (im very new to linux)
<lucasvo> *gdm
<colin_> ok
<lucasvo> gotta go now
<lucasvo> cu colin_ 
<colin_> thanks for the help!
<colin_> see yeah
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
<highvoltage> Bluekuja: morning
<highvoltage> Bluekuja: is there an edubuntu-it team on launchpad yet?
<highvoltage> Bluekuja: perhaps you'd like to do something similar to https://launchpad.net/people/edubuntu-br ?
<Bluekuja> hi highvoltage :)
<Bluekuja> good morning and good day :)
<Bluekuja> i gonna create the team on launchpad
<Bluekuja> it could be a very nice idea
<Bluekuja> im making the html page for ubuntu-it
<Bluekuja> there will be a link for edubuntu-it and all documentations/wiki that we will translate
<Bluekuja> also news ,forum and much more
<Bluekuja> highvoltage: tell me when you're back :)
<Bluekuja> ok :)
<Bluekuja> soon ill give you the link
<Bluekuja> i have to go now
<Bluekuja> see you later jon
<Bluekuja> and good day
<Bluekuja> ;)
<cbx33> mornin all
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
<HedgeMage> highvoltage: Are you about?
<highvoltage> HedgeMage: yep
<HedgeMage> highvoltage: I've done some research on internationalization/translation in drupal... there are some options available, but I wanted to find out before I dig deeper whether you're planning on sticking with 4.6.x for the time being, or if you're hot on the tails of 4.7.x of Drupal
* HedgeMage doesn't know what proto.edubuntu.org is running right now
<highvoltage> it's running 4.6.x now, but we're planning to move to the 4.7 series as soon as it hits stable
* HedgeMage nods
<HedgeMage> okay... I have both a 4.6 install and a 4.7 running that I can play with... the good news is that there *is* an internationalization module...
<HedgeMage> it's not going to be ready for 4.7 for a while, but maybe I can jump in on that a bit.
<HedgeMage> (Drupal's beta freezes tend to be less than absolute)
<HedgeMage> so, updating modules tends to be hurry up and do, then hurry up and do over... and least for something like internationalization which touches everything
<HedgeMage> I'll do more contemplating, reading, and tinkering and get back to ya with a reccommendation of some sort (or options, or whatever I come up with.
<HedgeMage> highvoltage: the other thing I wanted to know is whether you have a target date for the new site to go live, and if so when ?
* HedgeMage notes that giving a HedgeMage ideas is sometimes like rolling a pebble down a snowy hill.
<HedgeMage> :P
<highvoltage> sorry, just talked to my father.
<HedgeMage> np :)
<highvoltage> yes, the launch date is last wednesday :)
<highvoltage> (targeted)
<HedgeMage> lol :)
<highvoltage> so we're 2 days over, although it wasn't a hard target.
* HedgeMage nods
<highvoltage> the idea was that we launch the same time as the beta
<highvoltage> i've sent the request to canonical RT that they change proto to www
<highvoltage> it will probably happen Monday/Tuesday
<highvoltage> the website doesn't have to have everything we want in it to go live, it's already a bit better than the older site
* HedgeMage nods
<highvoltage> after it's launched we can have a new proto that runs 4.7 :)
<HedgeMage> is there any chance you wouldn't mind grabbing me a snapshot of the current install... I'd like to test some things, and I'd hate to come up with the perfect solution only to have it break the theme and conflict with another module you're using
<highvoltage> sure, i'll do that monday, when i'm at work with nice bandwidth again :)
<HedgeMage> hehe cool
<highvoltage> atm i'm on a 1kb/s cellphone connection
<HedgeMage> ouch!
<highvoltage> brb
<HedgeMage> understood.
* HedgeMage nods
<HedgeMage> highvoltage: it's after 4am here... I'm off to bed.  Please drop me an email at HedgeMage@binaryredneck.net when you have a chance, so I have your address.  That way if I don't manage to catch you on line I can still let you know if I come up with anything of interest.
* ..[topic/#edubuntu:juliux] : Edubuntu - the education version of Ubuntu, download: http://releases.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/5.10/ | Mailing List http://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/edubuntu-devel | Wiki: http://wiki.edubuntu.org | Website http://www.edubuntu.org | MEETING: every wednesday at 12:00 UTC | Read before installing: http://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuInstallNotes | Dapper beta is out http://releases.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/dapper/ | Visit Edubuntu at the LinuxTag in Wie
* ..[topic/#edubuntu:juliux] : Edubuntu - the education version of Ubuntu, download: http://releases.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/5.10/ | Mailing List http://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/edubuntu-devel | Wiki: http://wiki.edubuntu.org | Website http://www.edubuntu.org | MEETING: every wednesday at 12:00 UTC | Read before installing: http://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuInstallNotes | Dapper beta is out http://releases.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/dapper/
<pygi> highvoltage: here?
<highvoltage> pygi: yep
<pygi> wrote anything perhaps?
<highvoltage> my top priority right now is the edubuntu and xubuntu websites
<pygi> bah, ah, rah
<highvoltage> i plan to do some cookbook-cooking next weekend, though :)
<pygi> by May, 10 I want entire book written :)
<highvoltage> great!
<emmakelley> hi
<pygi> highvoltage: still too red and too orage
<pygi> orange*
<pygi> also, the team edubuntu-cooks doesn't seem ok right now :P
<highvoltage> pygi: colours we're stuck on :/
<pygi> highvoltage: a little lighter? 
<highvoltage> i can ask jane/ogra if we can go lighter
<highvoltage> keep in mind that ogra used those colours in the gtk themes as well
<highvoltage> if we deviate, we have all kinds of colours that don't fit
<pygi> highvoltage: kk...and what about that team? :P
<highvoltage> the edubuntu-cooks team?
<pygi> that :P
<highvoltage> you mean i shouln't add it to the community page yet, or the team itself is not ok yet?
<pygi> well, that team isn't ok :-P
<pygi> none of this people work on the cookbook =P
<highvoltage> i'll have a big part of my content by the end of next weekend :)
<pygi> not you....the *other* people
<pygi> I don't know any of them :P
<highvoltage> ah, ok.
<highvoltage> well, perhaps they just need a bit of pressure.
<highvoltage> i think hedgemadge will deliver, though.
<pygi> except herman
<pygi> you don't get it :P
<highvoltage> no, not really :)
<highvoltage> sorry, long day
<pygi> I trust you, hedgemage, ogra, spacey and whoever works on this right now but...look this..
<pygi> https://launchpad.net/people/edubuntu-cooks
<highvoltage> hmmm... i suggest you put a deadline in for submission of *any* content at all
<pygi> what is that team all about? :-P
<highvoltage> and anyone who don't submit anything within, let's say, two weeks, gets taken off the list
<pygi> I think it's the *old team*
<highvoltage> yes, it is.
<pygi> ah, I guess it doesn't matter actually...we don't need launchpad team to do something :)
<pygi> ur thoughts? 
<pygi> in two weeks? the book should be done in 2 and a half weeks :)
<highvoltage> yep, but if we have some inactive members in teams they should be removed, i think. with enough warning though.
<pygi> true :-)
* pygi removes himself :)
<highvoltage> hehe
<pygi> highvoltage: :)
<Bluekuja> highvoltage: ping
<highvoltage> ping
<highvoltage> Bluekuja: pong
<Bluekuja> hi jon
<Bluekuja> i have a question
<Bluekuja> im making the presentation to put in edubuntu-it
<Bluekuja> website
<highvoltage> nice
<Bluekuja> my idea was to translate the edubuntu.org one
<Bluekuja> and put it as presentation
<Bluekuja> what do you think ?
<highvoltage> i think it's good.
<highvoltage> it will need an update when dapper is released.
<highvoltage> and you can always build on that and make it better afterwards.
<Bluekuja> of course
<Bluekuja> license?
<Bluekuja> i have only to put all trademarks are owned by canonical
<Bluekuja> at the bottom
<highvoltage> licens is creative commons sharalike by attribution
<highvoltage> ok, good.
<Bluekuja> ok i have translated it
<Bluekuja> before^^
<Bluekuja> im talking with other members
<Bluekuja> and then ill give you the link
<Bluekuja> for community
<Bluekuja> ;)
<highvoltage> ok, thanks!
<Bluekuja> we wil change also the banner
<Bluekuja> to make it similar to edubuntu.org site
<Bluekuja> it will be something nice
<Bluekuja> hehe
<eDRUcated> #nosgoth
<eDRUcated> opps
<pygi> spacey: alive? :)
#edubuntu 2006-04-28
<Bluekuja> Seveas :ping
<Seveas> Bluekuja, ?
<Bluekuja> hi dennis can i ask you a fast question about irc bots?
<Seveas> sure
<Bluekuja> i have a irc server and i need a logger bot ,do you know a good software for it?
<pygi> Bluekuja: mostly any will do, eggdrop seems like a reasonable choice, too bloated tho :P
<Seveas> if you operate the server, then just let the server log
<Seveas> otherwise, use a supybot or an eggdrop
<Bluekuja> oh perfect
<Bluekuja> tnx seveas and pygi
<Bluekuja> ;)
* pygi considers eggdrop too bloated for such simple tasks :)
<Seveas> yeah
<Bluekuja> heeh
<Seveas> eggdrop sucks anyway 
<Bluekuja> lol
* pygi heartly agrees with Seveas...
<Bluekuja> goodnight #edubuntu
<emmakelley> Hi
<alexcamilo> Hello
<alexcamilo> I have some questions about edubuntu. Are there polish versions of the various applications/games? and what are the recommended specs for running edubuntu?
<alexcamilo> Would a 650mhz intel celeron cpu and 160mb of ram suffice? 
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
<pourriture> hello .... was just looking for a distro to install on a testbed and I stumbled across edubuntu ... am VERY interested in hearing success stories
<pourriture> I love the idea of an os for kids/education ... when I was 10 I started with apple basic and it was a bit daunting ... what age group does edubuntu have the most "stuff" for?
<highvoltage> hi pourriture 
<highvoltage> i work on the tuxlabs project: http://www.tuxlabs.org.za
<highvoltage> we user a highly customised, and a bit more primitive setup, but similar to edubuntu
<highvoltage> we run it in 200 schools across south africa at the moment, and it's been great.
<pourriture> cool ... am  looking  at that now ... don't have kids myself (yet) but friends and co-workers are always asking me about good computer stuff for their kids
<pourriture> more home use ... not terminal server type classroom things
<highvoltage> ok. the default edubuntu installation doesn't have massive amount of software for kids.
<highvoltage> but if you download software from the ubuntu universe, there's lots of cool stuff.
<pourriture> I have installed the debian jr package before ... but it was kind of hit and miss as far as being current
<pourriture> and I don't usually use gnome or kde ... so I might have missed some of the finer points .... for my boxen I use a slim fluxbox or svgalib config
<pourriture> so the full blown desktop environment is a bit out of my arena
<highvoltage> XFCE is really nice.
<highvoltage> hi jsgotangco 
<highvoltage> how are things going?
<jsgotangco> hey
<jsgotangco> i had a bad sprain this morning
<highvoltage> ouch. recovered from the fall yet?
<jsgotangco> oh i did already
<jsgotangco> i just woke up, and i felt a sharp pain
<janimo> ogra_ibook: ping
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
<marc_> exit
<josh__> hello
<mhz> highvoltage, ping
<mhz> highvoltage, I could finally boot into ISO in hda8
<highvoltage> mhz: pong
<highvoltage> yay :)
* mhz is gonna wiki it
<mhz> highvoltage, do you think this should be wikied in w.u.o or my personal wiki?
<highvoltage> mhz: it's just a copy and paste from both :)
<mhz> ?
<mhz> what you mean?
<highvoltage> i mean, you could do it in both.
<mhz> oooh
<mhz> i c
<highvoltage> once you've done it in either, you could just copy and paste it, since it's all moin :)
<josh__> hey, i wonder if you could help, can i edit the GRUB from edubuntu?
<highvoltage> yep
<josh__> because when i rebooted after installing edubuntu the GRUB bootloader didnt give me XP as a option...just ubuntu
<highvoltage> press alt+f2, then type sudo "gedit /boot/grub/menu.lst"
<mhz> highvoltage, yeah, the diff is I write spanish in my personal one
<mhz> ;)
<highvoltage> mhz: aaah
<highvoltage> mhz: perhaps the ubuntu one then :)
<josh__> thanks for that highvoltage
<mhz> highvoltage, as I have dapper install iso, I tried it with elive.iso first
<mhz> highvoltage, elive ROCKS!!!!!
<mhz> highvoltage, its Elive Panel is out of this world!
<spacey> whats elive?
<highvoltage> hmm... yeah. i don't know what it is either.
<mhz> elive is a live/installable distro based on enligthenment
<mhz> e16 and e17
<spacey> aha
* mhz is testing e17
<mhz> and i must admit I am entering nirvana here
<mhz> it is so spectacular 
<mhz> very, very stylish and cool
<highvoltage> try e17 + gxl :)
<mhz> hehehe
<bobulator> some of you might like this:
<bobulator> http://news.com.com/Ad+watchdog+warns+Microsoft+to+%27Get+the+Facts%27/2100-1016_3-5323672.html?tag=nefd.hed
<highvoltage> goodnight, #edubuntu
<juliux> goodnight highvoltage 
<highvoltage> night juliux!
<cbx33> hey everyone :D
<cbx33> ogra_ibook, you around?
<cbx33> hey Bluekuja 
<Bluekuja> hey cbx33 :)
<Bluekuja> this server is lagging
<Bluekuja> im trying to identify
<cbx33> hehe
<Bluekuja> ok done
<cbx33> excellent
<Bluekuja> eheh
<cbx33> how've you been
<cbx33> Bluekuja, you used bzr?
<Bluekuja> i was initially in launchpad
<Bluekuja> then im putting up an irc server
<Bluekuja> ^^
<cbx33> ah....yeh you said the other day
<Bluekuja> yep^^
<cbx33> I'm trying to checkout one of ogra's bzr archives
<cbx33> but it still doesnt work
<Bluekuja> nope i didnt use before bzre
<Bluekuja> *bzr
<cbx33> ah ok
<cbx33> Bluekuja, you used REVU before?
<Bluekuja> nope
<cbx33> heheh
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> :p
<Bluekuja> thats motu software
<Bluekuja> ^^
<cbx33> i know
<Bluekuja> oliver is an expert
<Bluekuja> so just wait me
<Bluekuja> *him
<Bluekuja> but its away
<Bluekuja> tomorrow he will be here for sure
<cbx33> ahhh
<cbx33> I have many questions for him :p
#edubuntu 2006-04-29
<axl000> anyone can help me to install alsa
<Burgundavia> axl000: it should already be installed
<axl000> i want to install the last version
<axl000> but no one help me
<alexcamilo> Does anyone know where i can get a DVD iso? its not listed on the website.
<alexcamilo> * download site
<alexcamilo> is it still "under construction"
<bimberi> alexcamilo: i'm fairly sure there's no edubuntu DVD iso
<alexcamilo> oh
<alexcamilo> oh whell
<cbx33> ogra_ibook: when you are around, I still can't get bzr to download
<cbx33> hi highvoltage 
<cbx33> ogra_ibook: problem with latest CD image - ltsp-client-builder failes
<linuxboy> hi
<linuxboy> I'm playing with LTSP
<linuxboy> I heard I can get a sort of "fat" client in ltsp
<linuxboy> is that correct?
<cbx33> linuxboy: I'm not sure, I've only used the thin ones 
<cbx33> ogra_ibook: would know for sure
<cbx33> but he's not here right now
<linuxboy> cbx33: I want it so I can spacify programs that will run on the client
<cbx33> in wahat way
<cbx33> you could uninstall programs from the chroot
<spacey> linuxboy: LTSP supports local programs
<spacey> the Ubuntu LTSP version doesn't afaik
<spacey> anyway see www.ltsp.org
<linuxboy> spacey: what is it caled ?
<spacey> http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/LTSP-42
<spacey> oh its not in there
<spacey> i thought i read it somewhere
<spacey>  Local Applications
<spacey> Applications typically run on the server, and display their output on the thin client display. With LTSP, it is possible to run an application on the thin client, thereby utilizing more of the local resources and putting less of a load on the server. We call this Local Apps.
<spacey> http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/LocalApps
<cbx33> spacey: did you say this is or isn't supported in edubuntu?
<spacey> isn't i think, at least not that i know of
<spacey> but you would have to check with ogra
<cbx33> ah I have many questions for that man
<spacey> if i look at the LocalApps page at ltsp it doesn't look really pretty
<spacey> i would _never_ use that
<cbx33> no
<cbx33> you're right
<cbx33> it's just that I have quite powerful thin client machines, would be nice to utilise that power
<cbx33> maybe eft+1
<spacey> well in the end it will probably cost more effort then you gain
<spacey> at least the way the ltsp guys do it
<spacey> and you lose any form of security
<spacey> :P
<spacey> really has to implemented differently if you want local apps
<cbx33> yeh
<cbx33> Damn it I need to get this AD integration sorted
<spacey> at least that possible in a sane way
<cbx33> hehehe
<cbx33> may need a bit of guidence :D - hopeing to make a configuration tool for it
<cbx33> like sadms
<highvoltage> cbx33: hi there! sorry in meeting, taking break now.
<linuxboy> cbx33: I think localapps is great for things like OOo and firefox
<linuxboy> Burgundavia: (memory hogs)
<juliux> i think at frist we need local device support
<linuxboy> thats true
<cbx33> indeed
<cbx33> local device support is a must
<juliux> if we have local device support i only will use thinclients at home
<cbx33> but then equally i think ms integration is a mus also
<cbx33> so many schools need to be coaxed into using linux
<cbx33> if they can use LTSP and still get it to authenticate against their existing MS domain
<cbx33> we stand a better chance
* cbx33 is just testing the latest iso release :D
* cbx33 is curious as to how some of the karma is calculated....mines gone up by like 3,000 in the last 3 days....yet I've done nothing on launchpad :p
<highvoltage> linuxboy: you might also want to take a look at lessdisks
<highvoltage> (apt-cache show lessdisks)
<cbx33> how does it differ highvoltage 
<cbx33> highvoltage: do you do any motu work?
<cbx33> there is an error in the latest cd install with regards to LTSP, can anyone else confirm this?
<highvoltage> cbx33: it also builds a chroot, but it configures the client that boots as a fat client, and also sets up things like tmpfs, etc for you
<highvoltage> cbx33: i got started with motu late last year, but it's gone very slow since my internet connection at home died
<linuxboy> highvoltage: can you specify a single app to execute on teh client ?
<highvoltage> linuxboy: for that you'll need to use LTSP.org atm
<linuxboy> highvoltage: http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/LocalApps
<linuxboy> highvoltage: ^^^ that?
<highvoltage> linuxboy: or you can do some hacking to the ubuntu ltsp, which is a lot of work, and currently undocumented.
<highvoltage> linuxboy: yep, that11:07 < cbx33> but then equally i think ms integration is a mus also
<highvoltage> oops, mouse mistake
<highvoltage> linuxboy: yes, that link, if you're using LTSP.org
<linuxboy> that I am
<linuxboy> I didn't know there were other thin clitne type projects
<cbx33> anyone know if the earlier builds work ok with installing LTSP
<cbx33> the current build bombs out for me
<highvoltage> cbx33: afaik all the dapper ones more or less worked, are you installing your chroot over the internet?
<cbx33> the dapper one did work on the 20th
<cbx33> it doesn't work now on the 24th :p
* cbx33 tries 22nd
<highvoltage> ah, daily builds? they're not extremely reliable (or even tested)
<highvoltage> best is to try a flight CD
<highvoltage> sorry, the beta cd.
<cbx33> no I tend to try them out for ogra_ibook 
<linuxboy> the problem with the beta cd is you can't get from the repos
<cbx33> hi Bluekuja 
<linuxboy> because they have moved on already
<highvoltage> linuxboy: yep, although that's true for the daily builds too :)
<linuxboy> the beta is just a snapshot cd
<spacey> whats moved?
<linuxboy> spacey: packages upgraded
<cbx33> ooooooooggggggggggggggrrrrrrrrrraaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa :p
<juliux> cbx33, i think you get an highlight only with ogra_ibook 
<cbx33> juliux: thanks for the tip
<cbx33> :p
<cbx33> ogra: w00t 
<cbx33> how are ya ?
<Bluekuja> hi cbx33 :)
<Bluekuja> mr highvoltage good morning
<cbx33> h Bluekuja 
<highvoltage> morning Bluekuja 
<highvoltage> Bluekuja: afternoon now :)
<Bluekuja> i have created all channels
<Bluekuja> pete
<Bluekuja> later you can join 
<Bluekuja> to take a look
<ogra> highvoltage, ping
<highvoltage> ogra: pong
<ogra> who broke the mailing list headers ?
<ogra> there is a reply to list header set ... thats evil evil evil, please revert that asap
<ogra> (since when is that btw ?)
<juliux> ogra, since last week i think, if i look to the mail header
<ogra> yep, i just talked to jane
<juliux> ah
<juliux> i only check my local mails ,)
<cbx33> ogra: Hi
<ogra> hey
<cbx33> there seems to be a problem with LTSP on the beta
<cbx33> it's bombing out during installation
<cbx33> oh btw
<cbx33> I've finished and tested those man pages
<cbx33> I can't get bzr to work
<cbx33> It keeps coming up with the reconcile message, even though I've deleted the dir.
<cbx33> http://www.progbox.co.uk/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2006/04/ltsp-update-sshkeys.txthttp://www.progbox.co.uk/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2006/04/ltsp-update-kernels.txthttp://www.progbox.co.uk/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2006/04/ltsp-build-client.txt
<cbx33> grrr
<cbx33> http://www.progbox.co.uk/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2006/04/ltsp-update-sshkeys.txt
<cbx33> http://www.progbox.co.uk/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2006/04/ltsp-update-kernels.txt
<cbx33> http://www.progbox.co.uk/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2006/04/ltsp-build-client.txt
<highvoltage> ogra: i changed some settings wrt the sender filters, but nothing wrt the headers. what is wrong?
<ogra> highvoltage, its reverted already, dont worry ... Jane switched on header mangling 
<highvoltage> ok, cool.
<ogra> (and reverted it already)
<JaneW> sorry, made sense to me at the time...
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
<highvoltage> well, there's only one way of finding out if something works in mailman, and that's to try it :)
<ogra> sure, but breaking list headers is evil, please discuss such steps before :)
<highvoltage> of course :)
<highvoltage> i'm sure all feature breakage will be planned way in advance :)
<ogra> (it resulted for me in getting all mails multiple times)
<cbx33> even LTSP? :p
<ogra> highvoltage, its aboput time to start thinking about our goals for edgy 
<cbx33> ogra: was the beta build the one that I tested a few days ago?
<ogra> i think so
<cbx33> hmmm
<highvoltage> ogra: you know I have lots of ideas, I'll compile a list, although I'm in no position to decide, of course, since you do all the work :)
<cbx33> well LTSP won;t install on this machine
<ogra> highvoltage, i'd like to get more help, really :)
<highvoltage> ogra: although, the builders are coming tomorrow to fix the pipe at my home, so I might have internet at home real soon then i can get very incolved there again :)
<ogra> cbx33, ?
<ogra> details ?
<ogra> highvoltage, yeah
<cbx33> I'll help you out ogra if I can be of any help
<highvoltage> ogra: where are the places where i can get involved with that would be the biggest help?
<cbx33> in the Build LTSP chroot step on the installation it bombs out
<ogra> so tell me when/where adnb why doesnt LTSP install ?
<ogra> ah
<ogra> switch to console #3 and see whats breaking
<cbx33> is that known?
<cbx33> there are problems and -y was used without --force-yes
<ogra> you can also file a bug and attach /var/log/installer/messages, that holds the build log for the ltsp chroot
<cbx33> is it a universe problem you think?
<juliux> ogra, why is an ubuntu bootsplash on the thinclients? 
<ogra> because i suck
<cbx33> never ogra 
<cbx33> don't blaspheme:p
<ogra> cbx33, in that case i do :)
<cbx33> possibly a local diversion of the start-stop-daemon
<ogra> its an issue i still need to fix
<ogra> and there is no easy way to do that
<ogra> mdz will slay me :)
<cbx33> anything I can help with?
<highvoltage> mdz is a strange phenonemon in that way.
<ogra> cbx33, yes, file the bug :)
* cbx33 hasn't met mdz
<highvoltage> he's super super strict, and it's a pain in so many ways it seems,
* juliux was only surprised 
<highvoltage> but it does result in much better quality, and things do get done the right way in the end.
<ogra> it requires a change to ltsp thats not really non intrusive and that i missed before feature freeze ...
<highvoltage> ouch.
<ogra> my job is to convince him that its no new feature before i can get it in
<highvoltage> but it isn't, is it?
<juliux> hm we can write a howto you how you can change it ;)
<ogra> nah
<ogra> i need to fix it
* cbx33 I will file the bug
<ogra> the ldm login is also not switched to the shipped edubuntu theme
<ogra> cbx33, thanks
<highvoltage> well, technically... the chroot is running more of an Ubuntu than an Edubuntu, so it's not completely wrong :)
<cbx33> hmmm
<highvoltage> ogra: please think about my question earlier, I'm glad to help out wherever I can, I just need to know which areas you need help with, so that I can do some reading, etc.
<cbx33> ogra: me too
<ogra> grab the ltsp bzr tree from http://people.ubuntu.com/~ogra/bzr-archive/ltsp/devel/ and make your changes ;)
<cbx33> I can't get the tree
<cbx33> it doesn't work
<ogra> i'll happily merge all sane patches :)
<cbx33> it keeps talking about reconciling
<ogra> did you ask in #bzr ?
<cbx33> no...
<cbx33> I'll try again on this machine....I just need the upto date version of bzr
<juliux> ogra, can you give me a contact to the press officer from canonical?
<ogra> hmm, not really, i guess silbs is the right person
<juliux> ogra, thxs
<cbx33> ogra: how can i transfer data from the b0rked installation
<cbx33> sftp isn't installed, nor ftp
<ogra> sure, sftp clientside is installed
<ogra> use scp :)
<cbx33> did you mean just switch to console 2
<ogra> console 3
<cbx33> no i mean to be able to transfer
<ogra> but if you finished the install, just the above logfile will do it
<cbx33> will it?
<ogra> that doesnt matter 
<cbx33> i didn't finish the install
<ogra> you can also do it under X
<ogra> ah
<ogra> k, then use console 2 and use scp
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> scp command not found - am I stupid here?
<ogra> the log is /var/log/messages in the installer if the install didnt finish
<cbx33> yes I've cat'd that and verified it
<cbx33> just need to transfer it
<cbx33> which is where my brain fails
<ogra> ah, wait, there is a installer step in the menu ... "install installer components" or something like that
<cbx33> ok
<ogra> look if you can install the openssh client there
<ogra> its not in the installer by default
<cbx33> excellent
<cbx33> ok, gonna bug it now
<ogra> thanks, assign it directly to me
<cbx33> ogra: what package is it?
<cbx33> ltsp-client-builder?
<ogra> just ltsp
<ogra> (sourcepackage name)
<cbx33> ltsp-client-builder is a package name apparently :p
<cbx33> but I've done ltsp
<ogra> ltsp-client-builder is a binary
<ogra> the binary packages will likely be dropped from malone
<cbx33> ahh
<cbx33> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/ltsp/+bug/41088
<cbx33> rying to get bzr again
<cbx33> ogra: would there be any harm in reconcileing the repo?
<cbx33> does it take a long time?
<ogra> dunno, never had to do it
<ogra> worst case i couldnt merge your changes
<cbx33> well, I can't get the repo
<cbx33> it's bombing out at phase 2/4
<cbx33> in the fetch phase
<cbx33> taking ages too :p
<ogra> ogra@edubuntu:/mnt/devel/bastel$ bzr get http://people.ubuntu.com/~ogra/bzr-archive/ltsp/devel/
<ogra> Inventory ok.
<ogra> Branched 303 revision(s).
<ogra> ogra@edubuntu:/mnt/devel/bastel$
<ogra> hmm, works 
<cbx33> very nice
<cbx33> not a shred of luck here
<cbx33> \ [==============================                             ]  fetch phase 2/4
<cbx33> been hanging on that for the last 5 minutes
<ogra> you wiped the folder completely ?
<cbx33> i did indeed
<ogra> good
<ogra> just let it sit there
* cbx33 trusts ogra 
<ogra> it will move on ;)
* cbx33 trusts ogra 
<cbx33> :p
<ogra> (either with error or succsessfull, but it will move on ;) )
<cbx33> so seriously like highvoltage said, I'm up for helping with anything else I can too
<ogra> so about your bug, thats definately a beta iso ?
<cbx33> yes
<cbx33> and I media checked it and md5sum'd it too
<ogra> and its the default run of ltsp-client-builder ? not a manual second one ?
<cbx33> nope the inital default run
<cbx33> I was installing just as I did before
<cbx33> with that daily build
<ogra> hmm, i have no explanation for that error then
* cbx33 did well to trust ogra it works fine :D
<cbx33> ogra: anything you want me to try....a different machine?
<cbx33> I have the ltsp bzr tree
<ogra> it can only occur if packages are either missin (whic is the case in all dailies after beta atm) or if they already have a config and cant prompt (second manual run of the builder for example)
<cbx33> i see
<cbx33> would running it without the ability to contact the net help do you think?
<ogra> i'll try myself again... but all betas worked here
<cbx33> so it get's everything off the cd
<ogra> hmm, try it
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> now wrt ltsp
<ogra> it shoulndt get anything from the nte though
<cbx33> do you have a few seconds spare to help me out.....
<cbx33> i now have you bzr tree
<cbx33> do copy my files into the server dir 
<ogra> put the manpages in the debian dir and add the appropriate dh_installman directives in the rules file
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> do i use debuild to build the source package?
<cbx33> ogra: there are some un merged changes I think in the changelog?
<ogra> bzr status will tell you
<cbx33> hmmm
<ogra> oh, no, there was a conflict
<cbx33> thought so :p
<cbx33> sorry I'm used to svn
<pygi> JaneW, spacey,highvoltage, ogra: Hi hi
<ogra> jiji
<ogra> oh
<ogra> hihi too
<JaneW> hi pygi 
<ogra> cbx33, pushing the fix now
<cbx33> thank you ogra 
<spacey> pong
<spacey> hi
<cbx33> sorry to cause you so much hastle
<ogra> you can just run bzr pull if its finished to get it
<pygi> spacey: how's the book? :)
<spacey> on schedule for that chapters assigned to me
<ogra> cbx33, you discovered a bug, thats no hassle :) i wonder why nobody noticed it before 
<ogra> (including me)
<cbx33> heh
<cbx33> well,,,I do try
<cbx33> not to make more work for you ogra :p
<ogra> but that might be because i mostly work on the dapper, not on the devel branch :)
<pygi> spacey: oki doki :)
<ogra> should chaneg that habit now :)
<ogra> *change
<spacey> pygi: what about you
<pygi> Done with entire Part I
<spacey> nice
<ogra> (devel is/will be the edgy eft branch btw)
<spacey> is it in the wiki yet?
<pygi> spacey: nop, will be sometimes later
<pygi> still checking it, etc
<spacey> ok
<pygi> JaneW: wanna write the artwork thingy? we have no one to write it :)
<spacey> if you put it in the wiki we can check it as well ;)
<cbx33> yeh i thought so
<pygi> spacey: will do this week :)
* pygi wants the book finished by May, 10 :-D
<pygi> spacey: that seems reasonable for me :)
<pygi> thoughts?
<cbx33> ogra: is the confilct fixed, or should I just ignore it?
<cbx33> I'm not pullingany new revisions
<ogra> bzr push still runs
<ogra> guve iut a second )or 30)
<ogra> that should have been: give it a second (or 30)
<ogra> my typing really sucks today
<cbx33> i got that :p
* ogra twiddles thumbs ... waiting for bzr
<pygi> spacey: alive? :)
* cbx33 copies ogra 
<ogra> pushing is really slow ...
<ogra> pulling is reasonable fast ...
<cbx33> bzr seems really slow
<cbx33> first time I ever used it
<ogra> sftp is
<ogra> the rsync transport is fast ...
<spacey> pygi: alive but working
<pygi> spacey: okie dokie...enjoy :)
<spacey> pygi: I was planning to have it finished at 10th
<pygi> spacey: great
<cbx33> got it ogra 
<ogra> cbx33, now run: bzr pull
<ogra> should finish within seconds
<cbx33> yes done
<ogra> :)
<ogra> great
<cbx33> ok transfereed the files
<JaneW> pygi: I can look at it...
<pygi> JaneW: Look & Feel (Maintain artwork package,Fit your needs)
<pygi> ok, great :-D
<pygi> that is the only chapter we don't have people for =P
<ogra> make a testbuild in pbuilder and check if the manpages end up in the right package (dpkg --contents)
<ogra> (or dpkg -c)
<cbx33> would debuild -S work?
<ogra> might ... but you dont ahve the special chroot pbuilder uses 
<ogra> (so you might miss dependencys for example)
<cbx33> ok
<ogra> pbuilder is the preferred variant we use, but debuild indeed works too
<cbx33> ok
<pygi> talk to you later
<ogra> cbx33, do you have a webserver where you can push your tree with sftp (one that has a sshd running)
<cbx33> I do, but not here
<cbx33> I'm limited to port 80 whilst I'm at work
<ogra> ok, create a bazaar directory there if you are home, so you can push it to a public place where i can pull it from to merge it
<cbx33> ok, may need a little assistance
<cbx33> but I'll do my best
<ogra> if thats done, you'll only use bzr push/pull/commit 
<cbx33> ogra: editing the rules file, 
<ogra> s/use/have to use/
<cbx33> me being a packaging n00b
<cbx33> dh_installman -A ?
<cbx33> should that work?
<cbx33> to install all man pages
<ogra>  man dh_installman ;)
<cbx33> have done that :;)
<ogra> good :)
<cbx33> okk
<ogra> you might need a .manpages file to define where they end up
<Bluekuja> cbx33 :ping
<cbx33> hi
<Bluekuja> hey pete
<Bluekuja> i have registered all channels
<Bluekuja> that you requested
<cbx33> hi, sorry I'll try those IRC channels when I get home
<Bluekuja> perfect ;)
<cbx33> I can;t have access to those here
<Bluekuja> just ping me
<Bluekuja> later
<Bluekuja> ;)
<cbx33> ogra: I'm gonna need some help with this......
<ogra> just ask
<cbx33> but I'll sort it out later when you have a spare sec....whooooops...does ogra have spare secs :p
<cbx33> the dh_installman lines
<ogra> i usually sleep during the spare secs :)
* cbx33 breaks down and cries........
<cbx33> I'm all confused.....
<cbx33> by following another example
<cbx33> I created the .manpages file
<ogra> fine 
<cbx33> but I'm getting
<cbx33> doc/ltsp-update-kernels.8: No such file or directory at /usr/bin/dh_installman line 116.
<ogra> (a ltsp-server.manpages file i hope =
<cbx33> in the man pages file it says
<cbx33> doc/ltsp-update-kernels.8 is in the .manpages file
<ogra> where is doc ?
<cbx33> I seee the problem
<cbx33> hang on
<cbx33> some times just taling hekpls
<ogra> did you add such a dir below the debian dir ?
<cbx33> no
<cbx33> we shall see if this works now
<cbx33> should it be /source/doc
<cbx33> or /source/debian/doc
<ogra> what do you define in the .manpages file ? 
<cbx33> doc/file.8
<ogra> just wipe the doc/
<cbx33> and keep the files in the /debian/ root?
<ogra> yep
<cbx33> still fails
<cbx33> i have the .8 files in /source/debian/
<cbx33> the doc dir is in /source/debian/doc
<cbx33> the .manpages says doc/file.8
<cbx33> what am i missing here
<ogra> try debian/doc/manpage.8 in the manpages file
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> gtg to meeting
<cbx33> back later
<cbx33> right...I managed to get VNC in my meeting :D
<ogra> haha
<cbx33> but it's still not working
<cbx33> ahhhh
<cbx33> i think my dh line is wrong
<cbx33> ogra: just one final question...
<cbx33> what should my dh_installman line be
<ogra> i cant tell you from the top of my head
<cbx33> np...i think I'm closer now
<ogra> i'd pick a package that uses it and check that
<cbx33> :D:D:D:D
<cbx33> wooooooooooooooohhhhhhhhhooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo- ogra it worked :D
<ogra> :)
<cbx33> ok...now ive built it and it works.....what do you want from me
<cbx33> a debdiff?
<cbx33> or did you want me to commit directly?
<ogra> nope, i want you to push your repo on a piublic place where i can merge it from
<cbx33> ok, i'll do that later on :D
<cbx33> i may need a bit of guidence
<ogra> JaneW, ok, Amaranth just changed my mind ... i'll happily mentor his content filtering work ;)
<ogra> (for SoC that is)
<spacey> what will he be working on?
<ogra> finishing willow and integrating it right
<ogra> he has enough python and pygtk skills to do so :))
<spacey> thats great
<spacey> i look forward to the results :)
<ogra> me too
<JaneW> ogra: cool
<ogra> there is aanother guy that probably likes to write some kdeedu replacements :)
<jsgotangco> would that be you? heh
<ogra> mentoring myself ?
<ogra> nah, thanks, i wouldnt bear me
<juliux> ogra, i hope you didnt mean me
<ogra> juliux, you plan to apply for SoC ?
<juliux> ogra, no
<juliux> ogra, but i the future i will write something for ubunut
<juliux> ubuntu
<ogra> cool :)
<juliux> ogra, i hope that i get my intership in england for the sommer so i can learn english
<ogra> https://launchpad.net/people/edubuntu-bugs
<ogra> everybody feel free to join
* JaneW always thinks of magical trevor when I see the name 'Travis Watkins' :)
<ogra> he wrote the mmenu editor (alacarte) for us in ubuntu already
<ogra> i trust his skills and that he does it *right* 
<ogra> and he's a member of the community, so he'll be around after the SoC as well
<ogra> (which was my main concern with the SoC stuff, unfinished things just stay like that)
<highvoltage> ogra, JaneW: new edubuntu website might even be up today
<highvoltage> Znarl is on it
<spacey> will there also be edubuntu bug days? :P
<JaneW> highvoltage: :))
<highvoltage> (same goes for Xubuntu.org)
<spacey> highvoltage: new website is finished?
<highvoltage> spacey: not 100% 100%
<spacey> i see :p
<spacey> download link gives permission denied
<ogra> spacey, not really planned, but i can ask the bugsquad
<highvoltage> spacey: but Znarl will bring it up to 99%, and then we'll do the last few bits in the next few days
<spacey> as well as the search box
<ogra> i dont really see many edubuntu bugs though
<spacey> ogra: is edubuntu seperate in launchpad anyway?
<highvoltage> spacey: after that, pips1 and I have a big list of things we'd still like to implement :)
<ogra> nope
<spacey> so its not much use :)
<ogra> but the QA guy we have now wants a default asignee for edubuntu bugs
<spacey> ah
<spacey> so now i get mail if someone assigns to edubuntu-bugs
<spacey> thats nice
<ogra> (he'll define edubuntu bugs as bugs in all packages that are in edubuntu beyond ubuntu)
<spacey> highvoltage: kk:)
<ogra> while i defined edubuntu bugs as bugs in edubuntu packages (edubuntu-artwork -meta) until now
<ogra> (a bug in kdeedu is a kde bug imho)
<ogra> spacey, not true
<ogra> spacey, *now* you'll get these bugmails :)
<spacey> :>
<spacey> great
<spacey> thats a nice thing
<ogra> yep
<ogra> it usually gets pretty noisy, but i dont fear that for edubuntu ...
<ogra> (such a default subscriber address)
<pygi> JaneW: still around?
<pygi> ogra: any idea why we suggested creating config gui's for two proxy's?
<ogra> we didnt
<pygi> for SoC
<ogra> (at least i didnt)
<pygi> Willow and Squid
<pygi> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/GoogleSoC2006
<pygi> look
<ogra> dunno whose idea the squid crap was, i wont support it
<ogra> ask the person who submitted it
<pygi> that was me :-/
<ogra> why ? 
<pygi> I'll just erase it
<ogra> lets switch it then or merge them
<pygi> ok
<pygi> we can safely remove squid if you feel it's not good
<ogra> willow is already python, has a gui and is far advanced beyond squid wrt filtering
<pygi> agreed
<ogra> and willow is my declared goal for edubuntu since breezy
* pygi didn't knew....
<spacey> that ifolder spec looks interesting
<ogra> i think there are some discussions in the ML archive 
<spacey> quite usefull since its multiplatform if they actually use ifolder
<spacey> willow works great in any case:)
<ogra> isnt ifolder even packaged already ? 
<spacey> dunno
<ogra> yes, willow is just a time consuming job to fix up
<spacey> well not *really* time consuming, but compared to apt-get install it is i guess :)
<spacey> only bad thing i noticed is that it produces zombie processes on regular basis
<spacey> but not on every configuration
<ogra> it is time consuming to rip out the profiler stuff and to get the init script for transparent proxying right
<spacey> bit nasty
<spacey> ogra: yes!
<spacey> thats true :)
<ogra> thats why i didnt touch it yet :)
<pygi> ogra: ok, I removed it
<ogra> so i'm really happy about the offer 
<spacey> and it needs some extra features
<ogra> i'm fine as is for an initial package
<spacey> the page which is displayed when you visit a blocked page is hardcode in the code on different locations
<ogra> (if everything included also works ... i.e. pam)
<ogra> ah, ok, that should be trivial 
<spacey> yeh
<JaneW> http://shots.osdir.com/slideshows/slideshow.php?release=621&slide=1
* pygi goes back to Mono hacking
<ogra> uh, mono ? 
<ogra> why that ? 
* highvoltage seriously has to try edubuntu live + espresso
<pygi> ogra: Because I am working on Diva video editor
<pygi> Mono + C
<ogra> worked nice here on the one test i did
<pygi> highvoltage: tried...works :)
* pygi just remembered something that he also has to do today ... joy :-/
<highvoltage> pygi: so i here :)
<highvoltage> (hear)
<ogra> JaneW, yay, cool
<pygi> ogra: do you have a list of goals for edgy?
<ogra> not yet
* pygi will help coding for edgy, at least he'll try :)
<pygi> ogra: ok
<ogra> i have a mental list for ltsp enhancements 
<jsgotangco> ogra: where are edubuntu bugs assigned? -meta?
<ogra> jsgotangco, either meta if its a meta bug or the specific app but assigned to edubuntu-bugs
<JaneW> ogra: although it further entrenches edubuntu girl and our colour scheme :)
<ogra> JaneW, tell that to silbs
* jsgotangco admits not testing edubuntu lately
<JaneW> ogra: :/
<ogra> i've given up after her comment that she'll approach cliff to make changes to the chalkboard, which i found a pretty awkward reaction on 2 no's from two persons she showed it
<jsgotangco> hrmmm
<ogra> i'm totally oppsed to the chalkboard and will publically dissociate 
<jsgotangco> http://shots.osdir.com/slideshows/slideshow.php?release=621&slide=3
<jsgotangco> final?
<ogra> if she insists to use it, she'll have to explain it to the people, not me
<ogra> jsgotangco, indeed, written in stone !
* jsgotangco faints
<ogra> jsgotangco, whats wrong with it 
<ogra> ;) we surely can change it ;)
<jsgotangco> it won't complement chalkboard
<ogra> it was in correspondence with the first shiny wallpaper suggestions we had
<ogra> indeed, not even gartonn works nice with a chalkboard
<ogra> *gartoon
<ogra> dont ask about the rest of the colorscheme
* ogra is very disappointed about that artwork dictatorship
<jsgotangco> i thought hande is the one coordinating such for edubuntu
<ogra> (but "the berlin wall" fits very nicely in that shape indeed)
<ogra> (not that i  sound bitter ... noo)
<jsgotangco> lol
<Bluekuja> ogra: i asked permission to join edubuntu-bugs team, im really interested in  bug triaging
<ogra> fine
<jsgotangco> there's edubuntu-bugs?
<Bluekuja> im doing a lot of work also for the ubuntu one
<Bluekuja> ;)
<ogra> jsgotangco, yes as a default bug contact for the QA guy
<jsgotangco> ogra: you guys alreaedy have the QA Engineer?
<ogra> (its equivalent to a edubuntu-bugs mailing list in fact)
<ogra> i think so ... i must admit i didnt follow closely, but i think there was someone introduced who'll start working soon
<ogra> Bluekuja, approved :)
<Bluekuja> tnx ogra ;) 
<jsgotangco> what's the difference?
<Bluekuja> ill report bugs in lp
<jsgotangco> :P
<Bluekuja> or both lp and ml?
* pygi will be back soon
<ogra> Bluekuja, LP
<Bluekuja> perfect
<jsgotangco> ogra: so much for being mr. edubuntu if you don't have a say on the end product
<jsgotangco> ;)
<ogra> jsgotangco, i have ... but apparently not for artwork anymore
<jsgotangco> you'll get the blame if it backfires
<ogra> yep
<jsgotangco> brb new kernel
<jsgotangco> ogra: are you familiar with LAMS?
<jsgotangco> (its java though, sorry)
<ogra> jsgotangco, i took a glance when mark mentioned it forst to me (several months ago)
<ogra> *first
<ogra> they try to get it running with gcj afaik
<jsgotangco> they actually recommend ubuntu
<ogra> we'll have it in edubuntu as soon as its possible to integrate it
<ogra> i'll surely look at it for edgy
<ogra> hmm, would "packaging LAMS for multiverse" make sense as a SoC spec ?
<jsgotangco> i was thinking of multiverse too
<jsgotangco> but isn't packaing too easy for SoC
<jsgotangco> i will try to build it tomorrow
<ogra> i think there is plenty of work involved in packaging it
<HiddenWolf> afaik Google wants to see actual code produced. :)
<Draigh> hi all, new here, dragged by that wolf above ;)
<jsgotangco> oh no!
<jsgotangco> :)
<Draigh> according to the website they only accept actual code. No documentation or anything else.
<HiddenWolf> ogra: this is the guy I talked to you about. Be gentle. 
<ogra> Draigh, thats a goolgle desicion 
<ogra> there are guidleines anywhere whats accepted and what not
<Draigh> I noticed :) Anyway.. I would like to sign up for it and work on games 
<Draigh> Hidde told me you may have something there for me?
<jsgotangco> bug #1
<ogra> have a look at the kdeedu games we ship in edubuntu, we have constantly space problems with the CD due to the kde software we ship, it would be cool to have non kde replacements
<jsgotangco> yeah
<ogra> so we could drop kde and especially its huge translation packages 
<HiddenWolf> jsgotangco: fixing bug #1 is worth more than one SoC bounty. ;)
<jsgotangco> HiddenWolf: hehehe
<Draigh> ok, still new here though. (needs a speedcourse in ubuntu) Practical: by what do you want to have it replaced?
<ogra> what can you program in ? 
<ogra> everything not using QT or KDE libs is fine ;)
<Draigh> java, c, c++ are known
<Draigh> and I have had basics in general so I can learn new languages easy
<ogra> c and gtk or c++ and gtkmm would be nice
<ogra> java only if you can make it work with the free gcc java implementation, else its doomed to stay in the area of restricted packages and we cant ship it on the CD
<Draigh> I prefer the c++ version then. Java is easiest. Will check options though. If done right then it gets platform-independent, which is always a plus.
* Draigh gets steamcourse from hidde
<Draigh> ogra: would I be programming a new edu-game or redoing the current ones?
<ogra> as you like
<ogra> if you find it easier to modify existing stuff, why not 
<ogra> its all open source
<ogra>  :)
<Draigh> true, doesn't really matter except maybe in time needed
<ogra> (but to be honest i doubt its easier to port QT apps to GTK than to rewrite them)
<HiddenWolf> at least the idea's and concepts are there. :)
<HiddenWolf> if he can't think up any better. :)
* HiddenWolf hides
* Draigh grins
<Draigh> I doubt that will be a problem for me
<Draigh> See you later, going to get the basics right and look at the precise rules (again)
<highvoltage> hello!
<linuxboy> !olleh
<ubotu> linuxboy: Not a clue. Try searching at http://ubuntu.cc.com.au/
<highvoltage> linuxboy: ubotu isn't quite Spinach
<highvoltage> linuxboy: we had a knab in here, called edubuntugirl
<linuxboy> i was saying hello! in reverse
<linuxboy> lol
<linuxboy> did it get hit on?
<highvoltage> linuxboy: she'll be back here when my connection at home works :)
<highvoltage> linuxboy: not that i know of :)
<Schoolinux> is there any theacher here?
<highvoltage> theacher? what's that?
<cbx33> hi all
<cbx33> ogra, so, you there?
<ogra> sure
<cbx33> brief steps how do i make my public bzr repo?
<ogra> ssh to your webserver
<ogra> make a public dir i.e. bazaar 
<cbx33> uhuh
<ogra> bzr push sftp://serverurl//home/cbx33/public_html/bazaar (or whatever the path to it is)
<cbx33> ah right ok
<cbx33> cool
<cbx33> I'll try do that later on
<ogra> bzr keeps the url so in the future you can just run bzr push 
<cbx33> that's pretty simple
<ogra> and omit the url
<cbx33> i see
<cbx33> now what happens if the dir I have my source in is different from yours ?
<ogra> so bzr pull will always pull my recent changes from my repo, bzr push will push it up to yours ... 
<cbx33> i see
<cbx33> said the blind man to the deaf dog :p
<ogra> i'll make a branch of yours on my local disk and wwhenever you notify me i'll merge it 
<cbx33> excellent
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> I'll get that going hopefully tonight
<cbx33> I tested the deb with dpkg -c and they were all in there
<ogra> great
<ogra> also a lintian and a linda check would be nice
<ogra> to make sure all is policy conform
<cbx33> lintian was done as part of debuild
<cbx33> sorry, i used debuild in the end
<ogra> ah, k
<cbx33> I'm more used to that, 
<cbx33> maybe at some point when you are less busy I could ask you a few questions about packaging
<cbx33> Hi Hannes_ 
<cbx33> HedgeMage, 
<HedgeMage> hi cbx33 
<ogra> cbx33, sure 
<cbx33> thanx ogra you're a great help
<cbx33> really I owe you one
<cbx33> if ever you're in the UK I'll buy you a beer
<ogra> i'll be in london again at some point i guess
<cbx33> bbl
<cbx33> well I'm in southampton
<cbx33> if you ever feel like visiting :p
<ogra> we're having our developer sprints there from time to time
<cbx33> oooh
<cbx33> excellent let me know eh?
<ogra> will do
<ogra> in fact a good bunch of canonical people lives in south uk
<LaserJock> including the sabdfl, I think
<cbx33> oh?
<ogra> yep
<LaserJock> if he isn't running around the world
<cbx33> brb
<cbx33> like real soon
<ogra> which he nearly always is :)
<cbx33> I'm back :p
<LaserJock> that was fairly quick ;-)
<cbx33> ogra, sorry what was that command to push to the server again?
<cbx33> told ya
<ogra> bzr push sftp://serverurl//home/cbx33/public_html/bazaar 
<Bluekuja_debian> ogra: im installing the beta version
<Bluekuja_debian> im having problems
<cbx33> Bluekuja_debian, what with
<ogra> note the second doubleslash 
<cbx33> ah i see....just trying now
<Bluekuja_debian> installer
<ogra> Bluekuja_debian, tell me
<Bluekuja_debian> at disk partition step
<Bluekuja_debian> it freeze
<Bluekuja_debian> resizing the partition
<ogra> the liveCD installer or the text based normal one 
<cbx33> I had problems too Bluekuja_debian 
<Bluekuja_debian> livecd
<juliux> Bluekuja_debian, this is a know bug
<juliux> knowing
<ogra> (i never test resizing since i only have spare partitions on production systems)
<Bluekuja_debian> yes its a gparted problem
<Bluekuja_debian> i had the same problem also in breezy
<ogra> juliux, hmm Kamion did several uploads related to that bug pre beta
<ogra> the resizing bit shouldnt be gparted
<ogra> only the gui stuff is afaik
<Bluekuja_debian> yep
<cbx33> can debuild clean?
<ogra> but Kamion will know
<Bluekuja_debian> i try to install it in text mode
<juliux> ogra, the bug is fixed in the repos but not in the isos
<ogra> meh
<ogra> i thought it entered the beta 
<juliux> if i read heise it isnt in the beta
<ogra> i havent read heise recently
<juliux> i only read heise because some users asked me about that
<cbx33> ogra, uploading changes
<ogra> url ? 
<cbx33> let you know when it's done :p
<ogra> ok :)
<cbx33> ogra, takes bloody ages to upload
<ogra> yep
<cbx33> give me svn :p
<ogra> make a coffebreak :)
<cbx33> indeed
<cbx33> ogra, could you do me a favour just this once and give the changes I made a quick glance over :p - it's the first time I've done this type of thing, would appreciate comments
<ogra> its being worked on, but the python-paramiko (sftp) implementation is pretty crappy 
<ogra> i wont merge anything i didnt review ;)
<cbx33> excellent
<cbx33> http://www.progbox.co.uk/bazaar/ltsp - I think
<cbx33> but it's not finished yet
<ogra> so be sure you'll get comments for every change :)
<cbx33> W00T
<Bluekuja_debian> another problem resizing
* ogra gets some food ... bbl
<Bluekuja_debian> now it tells not enough space....
<cbx33> it's problably be done when you return
<cbx33> Bluekuja_debian, oh dear
<cbx33> does the installer check for diskpace now before installing ogra ?
<Bluekuja_debian> OMG
<Bluekuja_debian> all hard disk data gone -.-
<cbx33> oh dea Bluekuja_debian 
<cbx33> sounds like a bad bug
<ogra> ping Kamion in -devel about it 
<Bluekuja_debian> yeah -.-
<cbx33> ogra, still copying
<Bluekuja_debian> okie 
<cbx33> do they use bzr for anything big?
<ogra> cbx33, still eating :)
<cbx33> hahah
<cbx33> 313/570
<ogra> we use bzr for everything in ubuntu
<ogra> note that ltsp has a *huge* changes history ... 
<cbx33> can i ask what it's benefits are?
<cbx33> as opposed to svn
<cbx33> i had only just heard of it when started working on ubuntu
<ogra> it will be tightly integrated into launchpad soon
<ogra> you can do revision control, merges etc directly on LP then 
<cbx33> oooh nice
<cbx33> 0 revisions pushed
<cbx33> why is that?
<ogra> did you commit your change ? 
<cbx33> hmmm
<ogra> what does bzr status say
* cbx33 sits in the corner and looks sheepish
<cbx33> so commit doesn't try to commit to your repo?
<ogra> nope
<ogra> commit commits only in the current tree
<cbx33> ok commiting
<ogra> bzr commit -m'i made a change'
<cbx33> now pushing
<cbx33> ok it's collecting again...is that from your server?
<cbx33> collecting/fetching
<Bluekuja_debian> i have talked with kamion
<Bluekuja_debian> there is a wiki page about that bug
<Bluekuja_debian> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DapperBeta/PartitionTableCorruption
<cbx33> ogra, think the final release will check the hdd for disk space before installing?
<ogra> cbx33, no idea, really, i'm no installer guy
<cbx33> hehe
<cbx33> ok, just waiting for bzr to fetch now
<Bluekuja_debian> highvoltage: ping
<ogra> cbx33, hmm, i get a "server not found" message for www.progbox.co.uk
<highvoltage> Bluekuja_debian: pong
<Bluekuja_debian> hey jon
<Bluekuja_debian> do you still have the file i gave you?
<Bluekuja_debian> presentation
<cbx33> ogra, you sure
<cbx33> www.progbox.co.uk
<ogra> ogra@aleph:~$ host progbox.co.uk
<ogra> ;; connection timed out; no servers could be reached
<cbx33> hmmm
<highvoltage> Bluekuja_debian: yep
<ogra> ogra@aleph:~$ host www.progbox.co.uk
<ogra> ;; connection timed out; no servers could be reached
<Bluekuja_debian> great man
<highvoltage> Bluekuja_debian: the stuff i copied and pasted out of IRC?
<ogra> thats directly on my DNS server
<Bluekuja_debian> yep
<Bluekuja_debian> great jon
<Bluekuja_debian> pass me it later
<Bluekuja_debian> or tomorrow
<Bluekuja_debian> my hd is now formatted -.-
<Bluekuja_debian> ^^
<highvoltage> ok
<Bluekuja_debian> tnx
<Bluekuja_debian> brb
<cbx33> ogra, any luck
<cbx33> did you get my pm?
<ogra> nope
<ogra> are you registered ?
<cbx33> ah..
<cbx33> ogra, did u get my pm now?
<ogra> yes, sorry didnt text yet
<ogra> err 
<ogra> test indeed
<ogra> the dns seems to work again 
<cbx33> goodgood
<ogra> hmm
<ogra> http://www.progbox.co.uk/bazaar/ltsp/ is empty
<ogra> sure you pushed to the right location ? 
<cbx33> there is a .bzr in there
<cbx33> with tonnes of stuff
<cbx33> but nothing else
<cbx33> append .bzr and you'll see
<ogra> yep, i do
<cbx33> so what's gone wrong?
<cbx33> i did exactly as you said i think
<ogra> the push finished cleanly ? no errors ? 
<cbx33> unless......
<cbx33> damn i changed ht source dir
<ogra> heh
<cbx33> would that have affected it?
<cbx33> i renaqmed it
<ogra> before pushing you mean ? 
<ogra> might be, yes
<juliux> ogra, http://wiki.ubuntuusers.de/Edubuntu#head-f20b56b47278e8fae31b6e9160000e519254632c
<highvoltage> goodnight, #edubuntu
<ogra> juliux, cool, but be careful, the origial isnt final yet
<juliux> ogra, ok we will check that but it is a base
<ogra> yep
<cbx33> ogra, trying again...if this doesn't work Ill redownload the source tree and re upload
<alexcamilo> If i connect to the internet with edubuntu install disks and try to install one of the languages that is not on the CD will it download the stuff i need? or do i have to hunt it down after install?
<alexcamilo> or apt-get it or something
#edubuntu 2006-04-30
<alexcamilo> Hello. Is it possible to download the polish language content via apt-get for the edubuntu apps
<alexcamilo> i tried "apt-cache search polish" and "apt-cache search pl"
<alexcamilo> *sudo
<LaserJock> I'm pretty sure if you install the polish language packs then you will get what has been translated
<alexcamilo> what are they called?
<alexcamilo> nvm i'l hit up google and come back if search comes up dry
<LaserJock> alexcamilo: language-pack-pl
<alexcamilo> oh, thanx
<LaserJock> np
<LaserJock> alexcamilo: and you might want language-support-pl if you don't have it already
<alexcamilo> hmm. not popping up. do i need to add a repository?
<LaserJock> hmm, what release of ubuntu are you using?
<alexcamilo> edubuntu 5.10
<LaserJock> ahh, what I gave you might be for 6.06
<LaserJock> actually, they are in the Main repository in breezy
<alexcamilo> is there something like updating apt-cache
<alexcamilo> like the list
<LaserJock> apt-get update
<alexcamilo> doesnt seem to help
<alexcamilo> maybe i should spin the install disk while online. someone told me it will grab what it needs.
<LaserJock> hmm, odd, but unfortunately I have to go
<alexcamilo> thanx for the help
<LaserJock> it is there I'm sure
<LaserJock> somewhere
<alexcamilo> i'l keep messin around toll it works
<alexcamilo> i've noticed something odd about the splash screen in edubuntu. it's nice and shiny provided that nothing goes wrong but when something fails it goes back to white text mode. marks it as "failed" and continues.  is there any way to tell it to stay in that spash screen?  its annoying when something like contacting the ntp server when not online fails.
<DarkElf109> Hey there. I was wondering, is it possible to configure auto-login with LTSP clients? I've searched the 'net and forums high and low, and there have only been vague mentionings of it. If it is possible, how is it done?
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
<eniac_petrov> hi aLL
<HedgeMage> hi eniac_petrov 
<HedgeMage> I'm only somewhat here, but if you want my attention just hilight me (say my name)
<HedgeMage> :)
<eniac_petrov> ok
<eniac_petrov> np
<eniac_petrov> thanks
<cbx33> hi all
<eniac_petrov> hi
<cbx33> ogra's not around yet is he?
* HedgeMage always assumed ogra was a "she"... at least it would make sense if named for the character in Dark Crystal
<JaneW> HedgeMage: no ogra is a he
<Burgundavia> HedgeMage: oliver grawert, not a women
<JaneW> HedgeMage: and he is named after himself ;)
* Burgundavia suddnetly has a vision of ogra is drag...
<JaneW> ogra = Oliver Grawert
<HedgeMage> ahhh
<JaneW> although it's pretty cool if that's a character somewhere too
<HedgeMage> JaneW: I thought perhaps it was the interesting woman with the mechanical model of outer space and the removable eye from the movie Dark Crystal
<JaneW> lol
<HedgeMage> (Jim Hensen's first movie, yay muppets!)
<JaneW> Muppets are cool
<cbx33> prtty kewl that his namse makes up ogra :p
<cbx33> I'd get
<cbx33> psav
<cbx33> that sux
<HedgeMage> lol
<HedgeMage> I'd get SSTEW  which sounds like some horrible sea ration :P
<spacey> i get hbos, and i already use that :p
<spacey> on launchpad 
<cbx33> excellent
<cbx33> it is funny how people come up with their handles
<cbx33> I just can't get the hang of this karma business
<spacey> you don't want to know how i got up with "spacey"
<cbx33> hehehe
<spacey> cbx33: its really simple: its not important :P so don't worry about it :)
<cbx33> just makes me laugh that's all
<cbx33> I've been inactive the past few days and it keeps going up and up 
<cbx33> heheh
<cbx33> ogra: you around yet bud?
<cbx33> hi Bluekuja 
<Bluekuja> hey pete
<Bluekuja> :)
<cbx33> sorry I didn't get round to checking those channels yesterdya, I had to go out
<Bluekuja> np man
<Bluekuja> you can come when you want
<cbx33> didn't even get the changes done for ogra till this morning
* ogra waves
<cbx33> howz it all going.  I see you're a member of quite a few groups now :d
<cbx33> hi ogra 
<cbx33> wnat that URL
<Bluekuja> lol
<cbx33> http://www.progbox.co.uk/bazaar/ltsp/devel
<ogra> yup, i just reloaded :)
<ogra> cool
<cbx33> ok ogra got a bit of bad news.  I still can't install LTSP
<cbx33> i had tried on two machines now
<cbx33> both with and without network capability
<ogra> i'll do a i386 test ijnstall during the day
<cbx33> I don't know what's going wrong but it sure as hell ain't working
<cbx33> just tocheck..I'm installing it onto a laptop
<cbx33> that shouldn't make a difference should it?
<ogra> as i said, i could explain it if you have a more recent daily build than the beta is
<ogra> since there are packages missing on the CD
<cbx33> I have tried it with 24/04/06
<ogra> due to overzizedness
<cbx33> I went back to the older ones
<cbx33> none of them work. I was trying the beta seeing as I thought it shuld be the most stable of all the recent ones
<ogra> ok, a hint
<ogra> before you download have a look at this file
<ogra> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/daily/current/report.html
<ogra> if its empty, everything is ok
<cbx33> indeed
<cbx33> was it empty on the 20/04/06
<ogra> if you see some stuff like alien or lsb thats a very good indicator the iso is oversized
<cbx33> if so i want that iso back
<ogra> heh
<cbx33> i think that's the one i used
<ogra> then it also depends if you have a YYYYMMDD iso or a YYYMMDD.1 iso :)
<cbx33> ah...me thinks it was a .1
<ogra> i think the one we released as beta was at least a .1 if not a .2
<ogra> .1 should be fine 
<cbx33> do you have it anywhere still?
<cbx33> cos it's dissapoeared from the archive
<ogra> http://releases.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/dapper/
<ogra> only the recent 3 isos are kept by default
<ogra> (from the dailies)
<cbx33> are the others deleted?
<ogra> yep
<cbx33> dog nang it
* cbx33 wants an LTSP server again....was gonna work on getting winbind working
<cbx33> :(
<cbx33> ogra: did those LTSP changes come down ok?
<ogra> i have some other stuff to do currently, but will look at them during the next hour
<cbx33> sorry ogra not meaning to be nagging
<ogra> nah, its fine
<cbx33> sorry ogra not meaning to be nagging
<cbx33> sorry ogra not meaning to be a nag
<ogra> i'm just out of diskspace on this machine and need to free up some space 
<ogra> :)
<cbx33> phew - it's hot in this office today
<cbx33> well i say office...did i mention i work in an ex-toilet :p
<ogra> heh
<cbx33> the total opening window area is less than .5m square
* cbx33 gets headaches.....a lot !
<Sergi0> hi, what ltsp version does dapper/edubuntu comes with? how hard is it to upgrade to 4.2?
<ogra> Sergi0, ubuntu-ltsp
<ogra> its newer than 4.2
<Sergi0> ah, great :D damn u are good!
<ogra> but we lack local device support out of the box ...
<cbx33> ogra: will that be in eft?
<ogra> the rest is similar bt different :)
<cbx33> is there a howto on setting up that?
<ogra> i.e. we use the so called muecow implementation which only uses distro packaages
<ogra> cbx33, not yet
<cbx33> will there be?
<cbx33> :p
<ogra> i still have to update the packages for it
<cbx33> I'd write it....if I had a working LTSP server :(
<ogra> probably after release, i'm not sure i have the time before
<cbx33> yeh sure np
<ogra> cbx33, i'm working on 41088, relasx 
<Sergi0> oh, i looked at the new features in 4.2 and the local support is improved
<ogra> :)
<ogra> Sergi0, yep
<cbx33> ooooh.....sorry ogra not bugging...just extremely keen
* Sergi0 needs 25h in a day
<ogra> but i dont agree with the implementation at all, our local device support will be integrated differently
* cbx33 would love to have about 40 hours a day
<Sergi0> brb
<ogra> (i.e. jim and scott reinvented the wheel with lbus for notifications, while we already have dbus running in every ubuntu, the clen implementation is to use the existing parts and enhance them)
<ogra> but that takes a bit longer
<cbx33> nice
<cbx33> I'm impressed ogra 
<ogra> its on my list for edgy eft :)
<cbx33> w00t
<Sergi0> :)
<ogra> the ltspfs and ltspfsd are nivce programs we'll already have in universe for dapper, just integrating them is up to the user 
<ogra> (thats where we'll need documentation)
<cbx33> I'll help out there if I can
<ogra> that would be very good, since thats the area i cant put much time in 
<cbx33> ogra: well, I definitely will work on that area then
<spacey> ogra: did you look at ltsp localapps? *brrr* :)
<ogra> spacey, not yet
<spacey> ogra: please don't implement that in their way :P
<spacey> it makes you feel secure with windows
<ogra> you mean with an ssh server on every client ? 
<ogra> cbx33, seems our apt maintainer thinks you dont have gpg on your iso ...
<ogra> (41088)
<cbx33> oh?
<cbx33> is there a new comment?
<spacey> http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/LTSP-42?topic=LocalApps :)
<ogra> cbx33, nope i'm discussing it with him
<spacey> In your /etc/exports file, make sure you have an entry that looks like this:
<cbx33> ah
<spacey>  /home    192.168.0.0/255.255.255.0(rw,root_squash,async)
<cbx33> ok, sounds good
<spacey> :o
<cbx33> would that affect from the CD too
<cbx33> ie with no network connectivity?
<spacey> *BRRR*
<ogra> spacey, hah
<cbx33> thanks btw ogra
<spacey> ogra: thats simply horrible
<ogra> cbx33, the ltsp-client-builder *exclusively* uses the CD, no matter if networked or not
<ogra> spacey, yep
<cbx33> ah right ok
<ogra> but you are the only person which sees it until now
<ogra> thats whats bugging me
<cbx33> I hope I'm not doing anyting stupid
<ogra> i doubt that :)
<cbx33> do you think it's the start-stop-daemon package that's causing it?
<ogra> nope
<ogra> thats no package
<cbx33> oh....
<ogra> make_dummy_start_stop_daemon() {
<ogra>     cat > $ROOT/sbin/start-stop-daemon.dummy <<EOF
<ogra> #!/bin/sh
<ogra> echo 1>&2
<ogra> echo 'Warning: Fake start-stop-daemon called, doing nothing.' 1>&2
<cbx33> well the pacakge that contains it?
<ogra> exit 0
<ogra> EOF
<cbx33> ahh
<ogra> there is no package :)
<ogra> only that code snippet 
<cbx33> i see
<ogra> and this
<ogra> remove_dummy_start_stop_daemon() {
<ogra>     rm $ROOT/sbin/start-stop-daemon
<ogra>     chroot $ROOT dpkg-divert --remove --local --rename /sbin/start-stop-daemon
<ogra> }
<ogra> (and some copying of the .dummy file)
<ogra> its definately an apt error 
<cbx33> right
<cbx33> I'm going to try installing it on my virtual machine now
<ogra> cbx33, can you try on console #2 in the installer if gpgv is installed an executable ?
<ogra> i think thats our prob
<ogra> s/an/and/
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> just trying now
<cbx33> ogra: does it install the ltsp chroot before the rest of the system?
<cbx33> console 3 is for ltsp install no?
<cbx33> w00t - just finished recording the first section for youth lug radio
<cbx33> ogra: we got to interview you edubuntu guys soon :p
<ogra> heh :)
<ogra> console 3 is the ltsp install, right 
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> well then this install is working fine on the vm machine
<cbx33> it's b0rked on 2 laptops
<cbx33> ones a dell latitude d600
<ogra> same iso ?#
<cbx33> the other is a toshiba
<cbx33> yes
<cbx33> both from the CD that I burnt
<cbx33> and I'm using that CD with the vmware machine
<ogra> and you always had the gpgv error with apt ? 
<cbx33> not an ISO the actual cd
<cbx33> yes on the two laptops
<ogra> thats horribly strange
<cbx33> yes...
<ogra> can you tell me whats in .disk/info ? 
<cbx33> on which machine?
<cbx33> the one that's installing?
<ogra> from the iso/CD 
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> hang on
<ogra> its in the root dir of each CD/iso
<cbx33> Beta i386 (20060420)
<ogra> hm, k
<cbx33> that ok?
<cbx33> what you were expectng?
<ogra> Beta i386 (20060420)
<ogra> :)
<cbx33> heh
<cbx33> what would be loaded differently?
<cbx33> pcmcia?
<cbx33> could that be b0rking something?
<ogra> nope
<cbx33> swat I thought
<cbx33> but it seems to be laptop related
<cbx33> unless you have installed in on a laptop
<ogra> i test on a laptop over here 
<ogra> (all arches)
<cbx33> hmmm
<cbx33> these aren't particularly old
<ogra> (or rather on two laptops)
<cbx33> d600 - isn't that old
<ogra> meine either
<ogra> *mine
<cbx33> slip of the tongue eh?
<cbx33> :p
<cbx33> hmmm this is very strange
<lucasvo> it's german
<cbx33> lucasvo: I know
<cbx33> I did study german at secondary school
<lucasvo> ah
<cbx33> but have forgotten most of it unfortunately
<lucasvo> cbx33: where are you from?
<cbx33> Was machst du nach der schule?
<cbx33> UK
<cbx33> u?
<juliux> lucasvo, hi
<lucasvo> Ich werde sehr wahrscheinlich studieren
<lucasvo> CH
<lucasvo> juliux: hi
<cbx33> heh
<cbx33> Ich mache meine Hausafgaben
<juliux> cbx33, lucasvo there is a extra channel for german ;)
<cbx33> juliux: I don;t think I'm up for that yet
<ogra> juliux, and ? 
<cbx33> or...well...ever really
<ogra> juliux, we even have french days in #ubuntu-motu from time to time :)
* juliux only want so push the german channel
<lucasvo> juk
<lucasvo> french
<cbx33> ogra: it's gone through fine here on the VM - just configured xorg
<ogra> great
* lucasvo has to learn french, italian, german, english in school
* juliux has learned, latin, russian and englisch at school
<cbx33> ogra: but not on those two laptops
<ogra> can you run through an install on one of them and let it finish, so we have the complete logs ? 
<cbx33> ogra: do you mean skip the ltsp step when it bombs out?
<ogra> yep
<ogra> it will drop you to the installer menu, just pick the next step after "build ltsp environment"
<cbx33> any particular settings for the remainder of the steps
<ogra> nope
<ogra> just jump over the failing step 
<cbx33> ok, you'll have to let this VM ware machine finish
<ogra> i want the installer logs of the base install that happens before
<cbx33> hmmm....I could suspend the VM take out the CD, then resume it later :p
* cbx33 hugs VMWare
<ogra> i suspect the lappies cant read a package or something, that silently fails ... and makes gpgv bomb out
<cbx33> yes
<cbx33> me thinking that too
<ogra> also my comment onn rthe bug was silly
<ogra> indeed you need to do: chroot /target gpgv
<ogra> to check if its working
<xwind__> hi people.
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> running the install now
<ogra> and i suspect the installers gpg is installed, but the one in /target is missing (by whatever install error that happens before)
<ogra> hi xwind__ 
<cbx33> ok
<xwind__> hello ogra. A bit smoother this time with Dapper 6.06.
<ogra> :)
<xwind__> although, i am puzzled why the user/group administration menu disappeared after adding another user.
<xwind__> was that expected?
<cbx33> xwind__: filed a bug?
<ogra> for that user oor for the user you added the other one with ? 
<ogra> new users are not in the admin group by default 
<xwind__> my first acct i used to have access to it.
<ogra> menu items that require this group are hidden from users that dont belong to it in dapper
<xwind__> my first acct is a sudoer so maybe i can fiddle something to have it appear again?
<ogra> yes, a bug against gnome-system-tools would be a good start
<xwind__> so is this thing a bug?
<ogra> might be
<ogra> let the g-s-t maintainer check ;)
<xwind__> ok. 
<xwind__> but, which group has access rights to the user admin menu? am thinking of just adding my username to it.
<lucasvo> ogra: is s-c-p going to be in eft?
<ogra> its already in dapper
<ogra> if its in the default install in eft is a question of being finished ...
<ogra> if someone works on it and its stable i'll happily include it ...
<ogra> i doubt i'll have the time to work on it
<pygi> lucasvo: please remind me what s-c-p is?
<lucasvo> student-control-panel
<pygi> o, nice
<pygi> python?
<lucasvo> yes
<lucasvo> sudo apt-get install student-control-panel
<ogra> here is the bazaar archive:
<ogra> http://people.ubuntu.com/~ogra/bzr-archive/student-control-panel-0.1/
<ogra> in case someone wants to work on it
* ogra will concentrate on http://people.ubuntu.com/~ogra/LTSPManager/ for eft
<cbx33> ogra: did ya get a chance to look at those changes yet?
<ogra> ah, sorry, not yet
<cbx33> ogra: ok it's skipped the step and is now installing
<cbx33> np
<cbx33> does it normally do the select and install procedure....????
<cbx33> it's taking ages :p
<ogra> yep
<cbx33> do you get your people.ubuntu.com address when you become an ubuntu developer? just outta interest?
<ogra> yep
<cbx33> oh..and is the ubuntu CC meeting organised yet?
<ogra> (yep for paied developers fwiw)
<cbx33> so ogra how did you get your "paid" job :p
<ogra> luck ? 
<cbx33> heheh
<cbx33> very so.....
<ogra> or because i'm so nice looking ...
<cbx33> I wish I could do something a little more worth while
<cbx33> oh..yes....you're so handsome ogra :p
<JaneW> lol
* JaneW waits for the hot-tub session to start ;)
* cbx33 runs a mile
<ogra> no, honestly, i just helped as much as i could, got sponsoring for creating the hwdb-client and was hired at the conference
<cbx33> "i'm toooo younggg foooor that kind of thiiiiinng
<JaneW> ogra: which conf?
<ogra> udud
<ogra> udu
<JaneW> oic, I never knew that
<JaneW> thought you were around before then
<ogra> for mataro i paied myself and learned to know everybody
<cbx33> ogra: was foged at a conf
<cbx33> forged
<ogra> between mataro and udu i developed hwdb-client and the lockscreen patch 
<ogra> that was what got me involved ...
<ogra> after that i started leading the MOTU until dholbach took over
<ogra> its all about involvement ... and patiency 
<cbx33> oh yeh...i wasn't looking for getting paid
<xwind__> sorry to insert, i just did adduser and i got "Only one or two names allowed." I already have 2 users. BUT, is this normal? Can somebody point me to an explanation why only 2 users are allowed?
<ogra> huh ? 
<ogra> thats rather an error from the command ... 
<ogra> are you sure you used it right ? 
<xwind__> sudo adduser
<ogra> and what user do you ant to add ? 
<xwind__> ops!
<ogra> :)
<xwind__> :)
<xwind__> i just tested adduser ogra
<xwind__> and it worked!
<xwind__> ha ha ha
<ogra> also i'm not sure it creates the home dir, chack that 
<xwind__> it's afraid of u.
<ogra> *check
<bimberi> it should
<xwind__> it did create the home dir
<ogra> bimberi, one of them doesnt by default, i'm just not sure if its useradd or adduser (i rarely use either)
<bimberi> ogra: yes i use the gui tools these days :)
<bimberi> paid ubuntu developer == mdz's slave doesn't it?
<bimberi> :P
<bimberi> (no need to answer that)
* cbx33 needs to get into the developing side a bit more
<cbx33> but it's too difficult in my current job
<bimberi> !motu
<ubotu> I guess motu is the Masters of the Universe ( https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU )
<cbx33> don't get the opportunity
<ogra> bimberi, mdz is one of the best bosses i ever had 
<cbx33> and i don't have a lot of time outside of work.....though I do get some
<ogra> if not *the* best
<cbx33> my boss at the moment is fantastic
<bimberi> ogra: glad to hear it
<cbx33> but everyone keeps telling me I'm wasted here
<ogra> bimberi, glad i can say that :) 
<ogra> i even had bosses that have beaten me up in my life :)
<cbx33> i need to get a new job at some point
* cbx33 isn't feeling challenged in my job at the moment
<bimberi> ogra: well they mustn't have known what they had then
<cbx33> and how handsome you are :p
<ogra> he was just irascible and i had missed to manually enter 3 mail adresses from the 5000 i had to add manually that day
<cbx33> :S
<ogra> sadly one of them was important enought for the customer to call my boss ... 
<cbx33> oh dear
<cbx33> ogra: this install seems to be taking forever :p
<ogra> he got in a rage ... smashed me ... i deleted the 5000 mailadresses, packed my bag and went home 
<cbx33> ogra: you're kidding?
<ogra> nope
<cbx33> that's horrific
<xwind__> gud on u.
<ogra> thats how it goes sometimes
<bimberi> yes, 'horiffic' is just the word...
<xwind__> but perhaps, u could just have encrypted it.
<bimberi> *horrific*
<cbx33> ogra: no one should have to put up with that
<ogra> i had worse stuff happening ... thats not the worst :)
<xwind__> and hold them up for ransom.
<cbx33> well at least you are happy in your work now
<bimberi> we hope :)
<cbx33> it doesn't make up for what happened
<ogra> i am :)
<xwind__> oh boy, i feel so glad that i don't have a boss.
* cbx33 feels like ogra is his boss here :p
<ogra> haha
<cbx33> and a very good one too
<ogra> not at all :)
<cbx33> a mentor as well :p
<ogra> thats true 
<xwind__> we all have our own specialties.
<cbx33> nah serious thanx ogra for all your help....I'm learning so much
<cbx33> I really appreciate it
<xwind__> me too
<xwind__> just a parting question before i deploy my app 2moro. Is 64MB still the minimum RAM requirement for LTSP - Edubuntu?
<ogra> everybody i teach something gains knowledge he gives back to edubuntu ;) its totally selfish :)
<cbx33> eheheh
<ogra> xwind__, yes
<ogra> you can set up an nbd server (untested) to get it down to less with network swapping
<cbx33> well, I'm hoping to get more knowldge in the whole packaging area soon
<bimberi> especially when it's done in here - others observe - as I have with ogra <-> cbx33 in recent times 
<cbx33> ah the silent leaner :p
<cbx33> learner :p
<ogra> :)
<cbx33> it' still installing ogra 
<cbx33> i would have thought it would have been done by now
<bimberi> oh no - nothing sinks in :P
<xwind__> Got to leave u now, have to put my kids to bed. Thanks again.
<cbx33> bye xwind__ 
* bimberi 's two are safely tucked up
<xwind__> bye all. bye ogra.
<ogra> ciao xwind__ 
<ogra> cbx33, a normal install on my slowest CD rom here takes 1.5h
<cbx33> ah
<ogra> on my fastest its done in 45min up to 1h
<cbx33> heheh
<cbx33> kk
<jono> hi all
<jono> can someone do me a favour? I need a screenshot of the default desktop for the official ubuntu book
<bimberi> hi jono
<jono> hi bimberi
<jono> could you mail me a screenshot?
<ogra> jono, we dont have the final wallpaper yet
<cbx33> indeed we don't
<cbx33> a source of great debate
<bimberi> i could
<jono> thats fine, I just need a screenshot of the desktop that is installed at the moment
<ogra> you can only get a shot from breezy ... but dapper might look totally different
<ogra> ok
<ogra> jono, http://people.ubuntu.com/~ogra/edubuntu/dapper_art/
<ogra> i keep them during development there, if we have new stuff i'll update them
<jono> which one do you recommend I use?
<bimberi> the one with "ogra - File Browser" minimised at the bottom :P
<ogra> jono, Screenshot3.png  
<ogra> it shows the website as well (even its also the old one)
<cbx33> ogra: is that on a widescreen?
<ogra> oh, yes, damned
<ogra> jono, does that work for you ? 
<cbx33> didn't know if that was a problem
<ogra> (widescreen i mean)
<ogra> cbx33, me neither, but jono will ;)
<cbx33> heheh
<jono> thanks ogra :)
<ogra> but as i said, it might change fundamentally
<ogra> i have a heavy discusiion with silbs currently
<ogra> (she wants it all chalkboary which looks like win95 in the end, i want to stick to our colors)
<jono> thanks :)
<ogra> so we might get a green one for final ;)
<cbx33> I hope not
<cbx33> I love our colours/theme
<ogra> me too
<cbx33> that would make it look......more...primary schooly
<cbx33> I think it's great the way it is
<cbx33> who gets the final word?
<cbx33> there shuld be a petition
<cbx33> :p
<ogra> i guess mark and silbs :)
<ogra> JaneW, and i can only veto ... 
<cbx33> well....veto from me too :p
<bimberi> i like the chalkboard but haven't actually used it
<ogra> i try to carry the community opinion over to her ...
<ogra> bimberi, use it for one day in the current edubuntu artwork ...
<ogra> it doesnt match our icons, it doesnt match the widget or windowframe colors
<bimberi> ok
<JaneW> yes there's not much we can do alone, but can convey the community climate 
<ogra> oh, and in fact its not public yet
<ogra> https://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuDapperTheme/JonathanCarter/chalk
<bimberi> yes i do like the Gartoon icons
<ogra> but its similar to that oine
<ogra> ( a bit brighter)
<bimberi> i found is something like http://www.gnome-look.org/content/show.php?content=29050
<cbx33> the only one that confuses me iwth firefox icon
<ogra> yep thats derived from jonathans
<cbx33> looks too much like the gimp icon
<cbx33> ok ogra what info did you want from that laptop
<cbx33> it's gone through and installed
<ogra> all thats in /var/log/installer after the install
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> ogra: shall I upload it to launchpad?
<ogra> either attach it to the bug or mail it to me (ogra@ubuntu.com)
<cbx33> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/ltsp/+bug/41088
<cbx33> done
<ogra> thanks
<cbx33> np
<ogra> will take some time to inspect
<cbx33> of course I'm only bringing it to you guyses attention
<cbx33> it's up to you how you deal with it :p
<cbx33> ok ogra this is just an observation
<cbx33> but the installation on the laptop took way too long
<cbx33> I'm watching it install now....and it's speeding by......seriously speeding on the vm......when it was doing it on the laptop...completely dedicated machien it took bloody ages
<ogra> yep, might be that it has acpi issues and DMA isnt enabled or something
<cbx33> could be possibly....thought I'd just make you aware
<cbx33> sorry
<ogra> cbx33, WOAH
<ogra> did you ever have a look in your syslog in the zipped file ? 
<ogra> cbx33, would you mind doing another install, but adjust your BIOS clock before ?
<ogra> i'm pretty sure that will solve it ;)
<ogra> your laptop thinks its Jul 10th :)
* lucasvo has problems with the clock as well
<jono> ogra: can you do me another favour?
<ogra> sure
<jono> ogra: I need a few more screenshots for the chapter
<ogra> ok
<jono> I need a shot of the desktop with a bunch of games open
<jono> the educational cames and applications
<jono> oh no
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
<jono> hang on
<jono> sorry, got it wrong
<ogra> i guess that wont suffice http://shots.osdir.com/slideshows/slideshow.php?release=621&slide=1
<jono> could you take a screenshot of gcompris and another screenshot of kstars
<pygi> highvoltage: hi hi
<highvoltage> hi pygi 
<highvoltage> hi ogra and jono 
<Bluekuja> good afternoon highvoltage ;)
<highvoltage> and Bluekuja :)
<Bluekuja> how are you ?
<Bluekuja> all ok?
<highvoltage> kind of :)
<ogra> jono, i think highvoltage already has a set of shots ...
<ogra> highvoltage, ?
<highvoltage> ogra: gcompris shots?
<highvoltage> oh, and kstars
<highvoltage> i could take some.
<highvoltage> jono: there are some gcompris shots on http://www.edubuntu.org/tour.html
<highvoltage> jono: any specific kstars shots you'd like?
<lucasvo> jono: what screenshots do you need?
<lucasvo> I could do theme
<jono> lucasvo: cool
<jono> I just needs some screenshots of the gcompris and kstars applications (just the apps, not the entire desktop)
<ogra> (just make sure to use the current theme for it ;) )
<jono> ogra: was the screenshot you gave me first, the current theme?
<ogra> yep
<ogra> the current dapper theme  
<highvoltage> jono: here's one: http://www.jonathancarter.co.za/files/kstars.png
<lucasvo> highvoltage: oh, you are doing them
<lucasvo> I'll upload mine as well
<jono> thanks
<highvoltage> how many do you need? i don't know kstars very well, i could give you more similar ones though
<ogra> lucasvo, highvoltage usually has them on disk :)
<highvoltage> lucasvo: yeah, do that. it will give him more choice
* highvoltage should update the on-disk screenshot collection :)
<lucasvo> http://wservices.ch/~lucas/ablage/screenshots/
<jono> can someone do a gcompris one?
<lucasvo> jono: I just uploaded 3 of them
<lucasvo> jono: same url
<jono> thanks :)
<lucasvo> jono: I uploaded 2 more
<jono> thats fine :)
<lucasvo> jono: do you need any other screenshots?
<lucasvo> jono: can you tell me, when I can delete them again?
<jono> lucasvo: nope, good thanks :)
<jono> thanks folks :)
<cbx33> ogra: I'm so sorry,,,,,,I shuld have checked that first
* cbx33 major apologises
<ogra> cbx33, noo
<ogra> you showed us an evil buig 
<ogra> *bug
<ogra> the installer should cope with that, even if we cant avoid the slowness
<cbx33> heheh
<cbx33> I'll try that later on tonight if that's ok
<cbx33> just about to go home :p
<ogra> yep, sure
<cbx33> actually would tomorrow be ok? - I'm not going to be able to carry another laptop home tonight
<cbx33> I'll start it installing first thing
<cbx33> it'll be ready for when you arrive
<cbx33> were those ltsp changes ok?
<cbx33> gtg...see you all later
<cbx33> ogra: it works :P
<cbx33> :p
<pygi> cbx33: congrats
<cbx33> it was the time issue
<cbx33> I'm on the new edubuntu LTSP server as we speak
<cbx33> bbl
<ogra> cool
<ogra> i'd like to ask you to try another install later with the wrong clock again 
<ogra> (if i uploaded the fix)
<lucasvo> ogra: install with an old clock is horrible
<ogra> yep
<ogra> but shouldnt break
* lucasvo has a ibook g3 without a working clock
<ogra> in fact we had a future clock, not one in the past
<ogra> (but that doesnt matter)
<lucasvo> where?
<ogra> inb the bug
<lucasvo> ah
<cbx33> hi ogra yeh I can try that tomorrow
<cbx33> oh the other thing I wanted to ask you
<cbx33> well anyone relaly
<cbx33> on ubuntu when it boots up
<cbx33> if it can't detect a network connection it waits for one
<cbx33> now you can hit ctrl+c to quit ethat script 
<cbx33> is this anydifferent in dapper?
<cbx33> evenin LaserJock
<cbx33> ogra: does that bug affect upstream?
<ogra> which one, which upstream ? 
<cbx33> the clock bug - ubuntu
<ogra> we are upstream 
<cbx33> argh again
<ogra> at least for ltsp :)
<cbx33> i always get that wrong
<cbx33> hehe
<cbx33> ah i see
<cbx33> ok np
<cbx33> ogra: is what I described with the network the desired action?
<ogra> nope, it shouldnt happen in dapper anymore 
<cbx33> excellent
<cbx33> got another bug
<ogra> and in breezy it timed out after some time
<cbx33> well not a real one
<cbx33> when i load firefox the default page is missing
<cbx33> using the GB locale
<cbx33> Firefox can't find the file at /usr/share/ubuntu-artwork/home/locales/index-en_GB.html.
<cbx33> don;t know if that's supposed to be missing or not
<ogra> its broken currently ...
<ogra> #my bug
<cbx33> np
<cbx33> just checking in boss
<cbx33> is this a bug, I just registered a team, but was unnable to use my email address as the contact email address, saying that it was already taken
<ogra> which it probably is :)
<cbx33> well i didn't understand what they meant by that
<cbx33> i want all team mails to go to me
<cbx33> at the moment
<cbx33> but I couldn;t do that
<ogra> they will anyway, sicne you are the owner of the team
<cbx33> ok
<ogra> the address is the address *i* use if i want to mail the whole team
<ogra> so just be creative and invent a new address for it ;)
<cbx33> oh I see
<cbx33> I think I can handle that ogra thank you very much :p
<ogra> :)
<cbx33> my mind isn't that dull just yet :p
<cbx33> is launchpad and ubuntu.com down?
<cbx33> I can;t get to either
<ogra> i can reach https://launchpad.net/products/ltsp flawless
<cbx33> i can now
<cbx33> how were those changes ogra?
<ogra> i only took a first glance, but they seem fine 
<cbx33> :D
* cbx33 pats himself on the back :D
<ogra> will inspect them a bit deeper later today ...
<cbx33> ogra: anything else you need help with at the mo?
<ogra> in any case your bzr branch works fine now :)
<ogra> if you like you can register it on https://launchpad.net/products/ltsp
<cbx33> yeh....the push doesn't work
<cbx33> I had to tar and copy the entire thing up there to get it to work
<ogra> oh ? 
<cbx33> push doesn't update the working copy
<cbx33> it even warned me
<cbx33> plus it was a darn sight quicker
<ogra> thats ok
<ogra> it still does update the source
<ogra> (its only a warning not an error)
<cbx33> well let's put it this way...it didn;t create the source
<cbx33> thought it may update it once it's there
<cbx33> what's the status of my branch :p
<cbx33> experimental :p
<cbx33> think I found another bug in launchpad
<cbx33> cbx33 branch - is apparently not a valid branch name
<ogra> no spaces 
<cbx33> Invalid name 'cbx33 branch'. Names must start with a letter or number and be lowercase. The characters +, - and . are also allowed after the first character.
<cbx33> really?
<ogra> use a -
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> it should say that in the error message :p
<cbx33> i suppose it does in a way
<ogra> letters, numbers, +, - and .
<ogra> thats what it says :)
<cbx33> yeh yeh 
<cbx33> I'll be able to test the new install tomorrow if you want
<lucasvo> cbx33: what changes did you do to ltsp
<lucasvo> `?
<cbx33> added man pages
<lucasvo> ah
<cbx33> nothing exciting
<cbx33> ogra: got a sec to talk about packaging?
<cbx33> eeeek
<cbx33> gotta dash for a while
<cbx33> back later
<lucasvo> which daily-live of edubuntu is good?
<lucasvo> from the last 4 days?
<ogra> the beta
<ogra> no guarantees for any daily since that 
<ogra> (in fact i'm sure the install CD is completely broken...
<ogra> )
<ogra> so the live is likely broken as well
<lucasvo> in http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/releases/dapper/ there is only flight 6
<ogra> topic ...
<eniac_petrov> In thursday - 4 may in 1.02 and 3 seconds AM, the date will appears thus: 01:02:03:04:05:06
<eniac_petrov> This phenomenom across only between 100 years
<spacey> its not really a normal way to indicate time like that
<eniac_petrov> why?
<eniac_petrov> sorry
<eniac_petrov> error
<eniac_petrov> no, it's for here. sorry, I have opened many channels
<eniac_petrov> why?
<lucasvo> why what?
<spacey> i don't think you combine hh:mm:ss and dd-mm-yy like that it are two different sequences :P you can make many combinations if you just try to fit everything together
<spacey> we'll i wouldn't be suprised if it would pop up on slashdot :P
<lucasvo> eniac_petrov: go on and submit it :)
<eniac_petrov> you are right...
<highvoltage> goodnight, edubuntero's :)
<cbx33> nn highvoltage 
<cbx33> ooh wait
<cbx33> you still there?
* highvoltage holds on a bit
<cbx33> pm
<highvoltage> k
<highvoltage> cbx33: are you identified, haven't received a pm yet.
<cbx33> Bluekuja, you there?
<eniac_petrov> Bye all, in my country now is night...
<lucasvo> is ltsp with ndiswrapper working?
<ogra> server sided should be possible 
<ogra> but ahy use ndiswrapper ? 
<ogra> *why
<cbx33> ogra, what docs did i say i was gonna work on?
<cbx33> :p
<cbx33> is there an agenda for the meeting tomorrow?
<ogra> we have a static agenda
<lucasvo> a friend has an old notebook with usb wlan stick
<cbx33> ah ok
<cbx33> Ihave something to add:p
<cbx33> I'll bring it up in AOB
<ogra> lucasvo, and the broadcom driver in dapper doesnt work ? 
<lucasvo> ogra: it's a different notebook
<lucasvo> this one is NEW
<lucasvo> the other one old
<lucasvo> so no NIC
* HedgeMage peeks in
<lucasvo> can I put packages from unniverse onto an install cd with jigdo?
<ogra> nope
<ogra> but onto a jigdo CD :)
<ogra> (read that as add-on CD iirc there are no installer bits on jigdo CDs)
<lucasvo> I can't follow
<cbx33> qwhat's jigdo
<lucasvo> is there a possibility to burn a ubuntu install cd with additional packages:ndiswrapper and wpasupplicant +dependencies?
<ogra> lucasvo, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/InstallCDCustomizationHowTo
<lucasvo> ogra: thanks
<cbx33> right I'm of to bed
<cbx33> nn guys
<lucasvo> goodnight cbx33 
<ogra> night cbx33 and thanks for the manpages, i really appreciate that
<lucasvo> cbx33: btw, are you a edubuntu member? on LP
<cbx33> yes
<cbx33> I am
<cbx33> no ogra 
<cbx33> sorry
<cbx33> no problem ogra 
<cbx33> sorry no lucasvo I'm not an edubuntu member
<cbx33> yet
<cbx33> :p
<cbx33> hopefully soon
<ogra> but you have my advocacy ;)
<cbx33> I'm an edubuntu member hopeful
<cbx33> wow....that menas a lot...thank you ogra 
<cbx33> well when the next opportunity arrises I'll be applying :p
<ogra> dont forget to document your edubuntu work on the wiki ;)
<cbx33> wiki.edubuntu.com/PeteSavage
<ogra> put a link to your bzr archive there as well :)
<cbx33> ah yes
<cbx33> will do
<ogra> sabdfl is very happy if he sees that :) 
<ogra> you will win his heart that way ;)
<cbx33> excellent
* cbx33 will do that tomorrow
<lucasvo> ogra: can companies also get ubuntu members?
<ogra> lucasvo, hmm, dunno, but if they follow the process ...
<cbx33> any other tips for the iwki
<ogra> nope, looks great as is
<cbx33> :p
<lucasvo> cbx33: I would like to see  a picture :)
<ogra> that should rarther be a hackergochi on LP ;)
<ogra> *rather
<lucasvo> yeah
<cbx33> heheh
* cbx33 will consider it
<cbx33> :Lp
<lucasvo> cbx33: what's your name on LP?
<cbx33> debug-silentkeystroke
<cbx33> well silentkeystroke really
<cbx33> search for that
<ogra> just click the link on the wikipage ? 
<lucasvo> ah, I didn't see the link
<lucasvo> I have to add my domainhoster lots of karma points, he registered and answered my mails after buisness hours :)
<lucasvo> I was quite amazed that he did that
<lucasvo> that's VERY unusual for CH people
<HedgeMage> Anyone knowledgeable: is there an "official word" on requirements for standalone edubuntu, or should I just borrow the reccommendations from ubuntu ?
<ogra> nope, you shouldnt 
<ogra> wait a sec
* HedgeMage nods
<ogra> The default classroom server installation requires at least 2.5GB of disk space, a CPU of at least 1 GHz
<ogra> 256 MB of RAM 
<ogra> an additional 128 MB of RAM per thin client (e.g., a server driving two clients should have at least 512 MB RAM)
<ogra> A standalone Edubuntu workstation requires a CPU of at least 500 MHz, at least 128 MB of RAM, and at least 2.1 GB of disk space.
<ogra> thats from the CD cover text ...
<lucasvo> https://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuDocumentation/EdubuntuCookbook/HardwareRequirements?highlight=%28requirements%29%7C%28edubuntu%29
<HedgeMage> thanks ogra 
<ogra> lucasvo, i chose them a bit more conservative than in that wikipage
<lucasvo> yeah
<ogra> i'll also not recommend 40MB clients
<ogra> err
<ogra> 48MB
<ogra> 64MB should be minimum to avoid surprises
* HedgeMage nods
<lucasvo> asking for RAID, hm, I don't know, let's say not very good advertisement
* ogra thinks we should user the "least usable" minimum, not like mictosoft the least potentially not crashing minimum
* HedgeMage nods
<HedgeMage> ogra: another question, when do we need to be wrapped up by?  I have a total newbie teacher handy and next weekend I was going to run through an install with her to test my instructions... that'll work, right?
<ogra> sure
<HedgeMage> cool
<HedgeMage> :)
<ogra> i personally dont feel bound to the doc freezes on the release schedule
<ogra> since we dont directly work with the docteam but have our own :)
* HedgeMage nods
<HedgeMage> also, I've had a couple of folks ask me if/when edubuntu will be available via shipit
<ogra> from june 1st on 
<ogra> dunno if we accept pre orders 
<HedgeMage> spiffy
<HedgeMage> I just didn't know if it was this release or next :)
<ogra> shipit.edubuntu.org already works though :)
<HedgeMage> cool
<ogra> since some days
* HedgeMage makes a note to order ubuntu and edubuntu CDs this time around
<ogra> :)
* lucasvo feels guilty ordering CD's since he doesn't needs at all
<HedgeMage> lucasvo: I felt like that the first time I ordered... but I only have one CD left... I gave out quite a few to interested people.
<ogra> lucasvo, as long as you give them away occasionally thats fine :)
<ogra> (thats the purpose of shipit)
<HedgeMage> brb my guys want food
<cbx33> nn guys
<cbx33> again :p
<ogra> night cbx33 
#edubuntu 2007-04-23
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
<Demon012> hi everyone I am a new programmer (new in every sense) and looking for a program I can help develop
<Demon012> anyone need help developing any educational software?
<pygi> cbx33: :)
<Demon012> hi cbx33
<Demon012> have you got anything I can help out with?
<pygi> everyone needs help :)
<Demon012> with any particular project?
<pygi> hm, what languages are you familiar with?
<Demon012> just english really (I know an extremally limited amount of french)
<pygi> I meant programming :P
<Demon012> lol
<Demon012> C++, Java, PHP are my main ones also can use assembly but try to avoid it at all costs as it gives me headaches
<Demon012> also willing to learn any other languages though
<Demon012> oh yes also started teaching myself python but haven't got too far with that yet
<pygi> ok, well, you may jump on launchpad and see if there are any bugs in edu software you could fix :)
<pygi> kde-edu, gcompris, and stuff :)
<Demon012> ok that's cool
<Demon012> mmm I have already registered on there as Alan Jenkins (my real name; should I re register as Demon012 to avoid confusion ?)
<pygi> no need :)
<Demon012> kk
<pygi> morning bluekuja
<bluekuja> hello pygi!
<bluekuja> how are you man?
<pygi> tired
<bluekuja> :D
<bluekuja> same for me
<faf> Hi.... I'm planning an edubuntu 7.04 install, and wonder if any squid/proxy setup is installed per default, so that I may block those nasty sites for the kids?
<faf> brb
<faf> Hi.... I'm planning an edubuntu 7.04 install, and wonder if any squid/proxy setup is installed per default, so that I may block those nasty sites for the kids?
<faf> anyway... think I found something on the web.... laters
<maccam94> RichEd, you around?
<RichEd> hi maccam94 ... yes ... battling with a machine problem at the moment ...no room for mail folders & it is crashing
<RichEd> need to fix urgently
<maccam94> ah
<maccam94> k
<gonzaloaf_work> hi is it necessary to have two NICs to configure lstp server and my clients could connect to internet?
<ogra> its what the devlopment was focused on, so the two NIC setup works out of the box ...
<ogra> with one NIC you will need to do manual configuration
<ogra> its not *necessary* to have two NICs to get internet access ... its just more comfortable
<gonzaloaf_work> ogra, what do I have to do?
<ogra> make sure to not have any other dhcp server in the network and set up the config for the edubuntu dhcpd manually or make sure the dhcp server you already have in your net is set up to make the clients boot
<bluekuja> ogra: hi oliver!
<gonzaloaf_work> ogra, ok I understand.... is there any how to to configure ltsp 5? I'm a user of ltsp4.2 but I know that ltsp5 works in a totally different way
<ogra> you can still use lts.conf
<ogra> /opt/ltsp/i386/usr/share/doc/ltsp-client/examples/lts-parameters.txt.gz has the list of all supported parameters
<ogra> and an example lts.conf in the same dir
<gonzaloaf_work> ogra, are autologin and local devices working in ltsp5?
<ogra> no autologin, no
<ogra> local devices work since edgy
<ogra> there is a way to use sdm instead of ldm to use autologin ... but i havent heard any success stories yet, google might help
<gonzaloaf_work> ogra, ok let me configure my server...
<gonzaloaf_work> and see what happens
<gonzaloaf_work> is there a ltsp manager for ltsp 5? like ltspadmin for 4.2
<ogra> nope
<ogra> wroking on it though :)
<gonzaloaf_work> ogra, everything manually?
<ogra> http://people.ubuntu.com/~ogra/LTSPManager/
<ogra> everything automatically
<ogra> you shouldnt need to do any manual configuration unless you want anythng special
<cbx33> ping ogra URGENT
<ogra> pong ?
<ogra> did the sky fall ?
* ogra looks up
<ogra> not here at least :)
<cbx33> haha
<cbx33> wow you are like...actually here?
<cbx33> got a sec in pm to discuss book chapter
<ogra> no, im in my garden ... :)
<cbx33> just had editor on the phon
<ogra> sure
<gonzaloaf_work> ogra, I have an error when I try to run ltsp-manager: ImportError: no module named ltsp
<ogra> its not ready yet
<ogra> for now you need to resort to lts.conf if you urgently want to override the autodetection
<ogra> (but to be honest i dont see much reason for doing that :) )
<gonzaloaf_work> in the case of having 2 NICs how do I tell ltsp5 to use eth1 ?
<ogra> edubuntu does that fr you ...
<ogra> the installer asks you which NIC is the one for the outside world
<gonzaloaf_work> ogra, I have put the 2nd NIC after the install :$
<ogra> ah
<ogra> set it up with a static IP
<ogra> make sure the IP network data matches it in /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf
<gonzaloaf_work> ogra, ooooh I was editing /etc/dhcp3/dhcpd.conf
<ogra> ltsap uses its own file ... makes it easier for us to prevent breaking existing setups :)
<ogra> *ltsp
<gonzaloaf_work> I'm trying to configure the PXE boot but it doesnt work, this is my /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf file http://www.pastebin.ca/454469 , any clue?
<cbx33> pingity pongity ogra
<cliebow_> gonzaloaf_work, your dhcpd.conf seems ok..is this an old intel card??
<cliebow_> might just verify that /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/pxelinux.0 exists..
<willvdl> > feeding frenzy
<cbx33> hey willvdl
<willvdl> ola compadre
<gonzaloaf_work> cliebow, my mistake :$ the switch was unplugged
<willvdl> just grabbing some nosh
<cliebow_> gonzaloaf_work, COol..too bad i Never Make those mistakes 8~)
<gonzaloaf_work> how to install x11vnc or in general applications on the client?
<cliebow_> gonzaloaf_work, there is a wikipage
<cbx33> ping ogra
<cbx33> I'm popping out in a little while
<cbx33> but I'll be back
<lns> what's up all
<gladk2> it is interesting, how many people are really using LTSP? I would like to do it, but no experience!
<lns> gladk2, tons, all over the world!
<gladk2> Reallly?
<lns> LTSP has been around for a while now
<lns> I've got 2 installations myself in NorCal
<gladk2> What is NorCal?
<lns> sorry, Northern California (USA)
<gladk2> I see
<gladk2> Was it difficult?
<lns> depends on what kind of linux/system administration experience you have
<lns> edubuntu is very easy to get going
<gladk2> It seems that Edubuntu gives everything out of box
<cbx33> evenin all
<gladk2> ok
<lns> yep
<lns> if you're comfortable with installing linux, then you'll be comfortable installing edubuntu
<ogra> cbx33, sorry, took me a while until i could get to it ...
<lns> clients are easy to get going if you're familliar with the BIOS and have PXE bootable network cards in them
<cbx33> ogra, that's cool
<cbx33> is it looking ok
<ogra> cbx33, unmounting proc if you are in the chroot should just be: umount /proc
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> lemme open up the doc
<ogra> (you are saying that you leave the chroot with ctrl-d afterwards, so the above should be in)
<ogra> the command you gave is the one you need to use if you are outside the chroot ...
<cbx33> is ahhh
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> for umounting that is
<cbx33> yeh
<cbx33> i see
<gladk2> lns, thank you!
<ogra> so make your pick, either put ctrl-d above or change it to umount /proc :)
<ogra> apart from that i didnt see any wrong stuff ...
<cbx33> dude you are amazing
<cbx33> can i just ask
<lns> np gladk2 =)
<cbx33> Installing the LTSP Environment in Ubuntu or on a Desktop Installation
<cbx33> is that sectyion ok?
<ogra> wait
<cbx33> waiting....
<cbx33> incorrect parameter.... wait requires at least 1 argument....you gave none
<ogra> looks ok
<cbx33> awesome
<cbx33> so it gets the approval from the mighty ogra?
<ogra> yep
<ogra> all fine i think
<cbx33> dude
<cbx33> no...#
<cbx33> you put a conditional on it
<cbx33> "i think"
<cbx33> hehe
<ogra> heh, well i'm tired, i might have overseen something
<cbx33> NFS Server Is Not Responding
<cbx33> is that bit at the end ok?
<ogra> but i trust that enough eyes have seen it :)
<cbx33> the NFSOPTS
<cbx33> I'm sure I saw in one doc it was called MOPTS
<ogra> NFSOPTS is the right term
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> and I added that section about Intel Boot Agents
<cbx33> as it took me AGES to find that issue
<ogra> actually nfsopts, but our initramfs is buggy and picks that one ...
<cbx33> ok....if you say it's good
<cbx33> then it's good
<ogra> you might add that the package size limit is cuased by the media ...
<ogra> *caused
<cbx33> caused by the media?
<cbx33> how?
<ogra> on gigabit you can surely go with 32k frames ...
<ogra> a normal value for 100mbit is 8192 ...
<cbx33> ahh i see
<cbx33> I'll leave it as is....otherwise it may get too technical
<ogra> 2048 is really a safety value that should even make it half way work on 10M
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> ;)
<cbx33> well....I'm just about to do that last final change about going to the wiki
<cbx33> and then we're done my friend
<cbx33> thanks gain
<ajmitch> hi ogra, cbx33
<cbx33> hey ajmitch
<Burgwork> hey ogra, ajmitch, cbx33
<cbx33> Hi Burgwork
<ajmitch> hello Burgwork
<Burgwork> I learnt a nice lesson today
<Burgwork> if you mistype your dc when setting up ldap, the usernames will come down but you cannot auth
<ajmitch> makes sense
<cbx33> heh
<cbx33> nn all
<gonzaloaf_work> HI, I can see my clients screens with student-control-panel, but I just see as small thumbnails, is it possible to see them in full screen mode?
<gonzaloaf_work> where are all the educational apps dor edubuntu? why the didnt come installed by default?
<maccam94> gonzaloaf_work: from what I recall, there is a limited set installed by default. to add more, go to applications -> add/remove, and then browse the Education section
<Burgwork> gonzaloaf_work: you need the apps cd now
<gonzaloaf_work> I have a internet connection
#edubuntu 2007-04-24
<Dimicus> Hi guys. anyone can spare a min ?
<maccam94> Dimicus: what's up?
<Dimicus> HI.. i have a prob with my soundcard. unusal as i understand :P
<Dimicus> i cant use 2 sounddevice at same time
<Dimicus> when im on teamspeak i cant play mp3 and viceversa
<Dimicus> and as i understand i need full duplex soundcard
<Dimicus> and my fiend has the same card and it work for him so i suppose it full duplex
<Dimicus> i use fiesty fawn edubuntu
<Dimicus> and my fiend use a older release
<Dimicus> its a alc880
<stgraber> If you want to make two softwares using OSS (not alsa) you'll need a soundcard with hardware-mixing
<stgraber> otherwise alsa mixing will do it for most of the other softwares
<maccam94> sounds like you are having an issue with one or both of the apps not using esd (the esound daemon). check system -> preferences -> sound and make sure you're using esd and not alsa or oss. if esd is set, check out #ubuntu, they should be able to help with basic ubuntu issues like that ;-)
<stgraber> Dimicus: cat /proc/asound/pcm
<Laser_away> gonzaloaf_work: we moved the educational apps to the Server Add-on CD for 7.04
<Laser_away> gonzaloaf_work: it alows us to put more of them on and gives room for more server/low-level stuff on the 1st CD
<stgraber> if you have : playback 2 or more it should works fine with TS and any other OSS software
<stgraber> if you have : playback 1, then you'll only be able to use one software using OSS at a time
<stgraber> (or will have to use artsd, esd, pulseaudio, or any other sound daemon)
<stgraber> (but TS doesn't work with most of them)
<Dimicus> thanx will check. tried #ubuntu but the problem is that that channel is so crowded noways so impposible to get help
<maccam94> Dimicus: ah, makes sense
<stgraber> the full-duplex itself is being able to record+play sound at the same time, not being able to have multiple access to the sound card
<maccam94> stgraber: well that's kind of teamspeak/mp3 playback
<maccam94> although teamspeak is recording and playback
<stgraber> teamspeak+mp3+Quake3 works just fine with my Audigy 2 ZS :)
<stgraber> but it has a 8 channels hardware-mixing
<stgraber> otherwise you'll have sound problem for sure as soon as those softwares don't use alsa
<gonzaloaf_work> does anybody know if my clients can play sounds?
<maccam94> i think that may be new in feisty, or else it's still in the works. i remember seeing it on the list of things to do on the ubuntu development site....
<Dimicus> Ok i have made sure that i use esd on everything. teamspeak still not working. hoever i checked ct /proc/asound/pcm and it says i have playback 1
<Dimicus> so thats mean i needa new soundcard ?
<stgraber> there are some workarounds using artsd, but you may feel a delay while speaking on TS
<Dimicus> well i have another soundcard i can install so no worry tehre
<stgraber> check out the wiki, I'm pretty sure to have seen that in it
<maccam94> gonzaloaf_work: this might answer your question: Edubuntu LTSP Thin Client... The thin client boot-speed is improved in the new release, and LTSP sound support now enables volume control while providing sound to many more applications.
<Dimicus> thanx for the answer guys realy appreciate it. hope you can help me with other things later on :) gonna fix lstp for a little home project ;)
<lns> Can anyone vouch for the stability/usability of Sabayon?
<lns> I.E., is it something that would be better off in the testing lab, or in a production environment?
<Burgwork> yes and mostly
<Burgwork> I know of people that use it in production
<lns> Burgwork, it looks really really nice... it seems to be the answer to what my customer is asking for right now with Ubuntu/LTSP/Edubuntu for creating user profiles
<lns> Thank you..I wanted to know from experienced users if it would be good to recommend using this, as long as it's not buggy
<lns> so many little apps are, it's hard to be sure sometimes when there's a lot riding on it
<Burgwork> it does require a little bit of setup
<lns> Burgwork, does that mean a default profile? do you have any URLs i can study?
<Burgwork> http://www.gnome.org/projects/sabayon/ldap.html
<Burgwork> for ldap
<lns> ty!
<lns> man, i really need to get up to speed on ldap
<lns> that seems like the true cornerstone of SO many awesome network setups and configurations
<gonzaloaf_work> I dont know what happened, I put the correct user and password but my clients doesnt login, why?
<lns> gonzaloaf_work, can you elaborate at all on "clients doesnt login'?
<gonzaloaf_work> lns, I enter the user then the password... it tries to log but it returns to the login window
<lns> gonzaloaf_work, have you examined the logs at all?
<cliebow>   gonzaloaf_work have  you tried ltsp-update-sshkeys?
<gonzaloaf_work> lns, yep
<gonzaloaf_work> cliebow, noup
<gonzaloaf_work> cliebow, why should I do that?
<cliebow> that helps sometimes..
<cliebow> cause ldm is just a front  for ssh
<cliebow> so the keys could  be mixed
<Laser_away> dabaR: they are both approved
<LaserJock> and I think they'll be done primarily by the GSoC student
<dabaR> I am trying to figure out whether the GSoC program is aiming to produce open-source projects, or to develop free software:)
<LaserJock> dabaR: how do you mean?
<LaserJock> dabaR: they are paying for students to work on a project for a summer
<dabaR> See, if I was the student, part of my work would be on motivating and building a community of people to work on my project with me.
<dabaR> Making people interested in my project, and wanting to contribute.
<dabaR> Maybe that is cause I am into project management more than coding.
<dabaR> I feel like open source is the process, free software is the product...
<dabaR> I mean, that is how they talk about them in theory, in one reading.
<dabaR> Dunno. I am gonna get involved in the PyStart project(if plausible), so I can benefit from my involvement. I am hoping to learn python, pygtk, get involved with *buntu, learn about conducting open source...
<LaserJock> well
<dabaR> And I think others may have interest in doing so. And any help to my GSoC project means I am more likely to get the money at the end.
<LaserJock> GSoC is about starting a project
<LaserJock> so they pay somebody to do some code
<LaserJock> the hope would be that a community would form around it
<ajmitch> GSoC also requires that it be your own work that you submit
<LaserJock> but since there's payment for service involved it's not easy to allow a bunch of people to contribute while one person is getting paid
<dabaR> ajmitch: so, no community work allowed?
<LaserJock> I don't know that it's not allowed exactly
<ajmitch> it would make community work difficult
<dabaR> I guess I should have read about how GSoC works to learn the answers to my questions. THat is what I will do next. I got my clue:)
<LaserJock> but I think it needs to be clear that the student did the work
<LaserJock> but I think the community is welcome to give tips, discuss the project, etc.
<dabaR> And not contribute code. Weird. Google does not get open source in the end! ;)
<dabaR> Just kidding, to make that clear...
<LaserJock> the students are required to provide the source in the end
<dabaR> I meant get open source as in understand it.
<bimberi> i wonder who owns the copyright?
<LaserJock> I think the student
<bimberi> good
<dabaR> I will research, and come back with some conclusions.
<dabaR> Each student (or her/his mentoring organization) must license all student GSoC code under a license palatable to the mentoring organization. Some organizations will require students to assign copyright to them, but many will allow them to retain copyright. If Google is a student's sponsoring organization, then the student keeps copyright to her/his code.
<dabaR> PyStart will use GPL v2.
<dabaR> I am pretty sure that it does not make sense that all code has to be produced by the student
<dabaR> Thanks a lot.
<bimberi> I'd say if a student can have others do the work for them they deserve a reward for their ... entrepreneurship :)
<LaserJock> well, I'd say it would be against the spirit of GSoC to have other people do the work
<dabaR> bimberi: same thoughts here.
<dabaR> Noone is a fool...
<dabaR> Noone will work if the guy that is getting paid is not.
<bimberi> LaserJock: absolutely
<LaserJock> dabaR: no, but if somebody offered to split the money if the other person did the work ...
<dabaR> Anyhow, I have high hopes for my involvement the PyStart project.
<LaserJock> sure
<LaserJock> it just might take until the summer is over before the communit an really dig in
<dabaR> LaserJock: I can see where you are going with it.
<dabaR> With your argument.
<dabaR> LaserJock: And that is true too.
<LaserJock> well, the point is that student is being paid to learn and provide something for the community
<LaserJock> having lots of people doing the work for them kinda defeats the point
<LaserJock> then it just becomes a "who get's the money" thing
<dabaR> I am not suggesting I will do work for them. With them.
* ajmitch even got patches for some of his code after soc
<dabaR> Cause, I can maybe write the unit tests while he is doing the code.
<dabaR> And proofread the docs...
<dabaR> Stuff like that. Get some experience with a GSoC project. Maybe do one myself next year.
<dabaR> And both of those projects were suggested by the same guy, encompass.
<dabaR> Both were his ideas, afaik.
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
* mode/#edubuntu [-o highvoltage]  by highvoltage
<ajmitch> hi highvoltage :)
<highvoltage> hi ajmitch :)
<highvoltage> ajmitch: that was supposed to be a "/join #edubuntu" ;)
<ajmitch> I know ;)
<cbx33> bbl guys
<cbx33> ;)
<cbx33> guys
<cbx33> I need an A3 printer for LTSP environment
<cbx33> can anyone recommend anything?
<dabaR> cbx33: You are the mentor for PyStart, right? Are you also the mentor for the other project?
<cbx33> dabaR: just pystart
<cbx33> which other one were you talking about?
<dabaR> Cool. There was an idea by encompass that was? accepted for a grading program.
<cbx33> yes
<dabaR> You are not the mentor for that one, though?
<cbx33> no
<dabaR> K. Well, I am Dan, and I am interested in participating in the PyStart project, by helping with quality assurance, and perhaps contributing some code. Is that acceptable under the GSoC program?
<cbx33> tbph I'm not sure, though......
<cbx33> on the coding part
<cbx33> once GSoC is over......we'd love to have help on it
<ajmitch> hey cbx33 :)
<dabaR> I read the faq and terms on the GSoC page, and it seems that is perfectly fine. No need to answer now, if you are not sure, just thought I would let you know.
<cbx33> dabaR: I will talk to the GSoC admins now
<dabaR> Tue Apr 24 03:20:24 CDT 2007
<cbx33> not here it's not
<cbx33> ajmitch: Hey dude
<cbx33> howz it going?
<dabaR> Just so you know why if I do not reply right away.
<dabaR> cbx33: Have you noticed this post? http://groups.drupal.org/node/3621 It could be a useful read for encompass. It is linked on the GSoC blog, as an example of what could be done by May 28. I am aware that encompass is planning/doing most of it.
<dabaR> cbx33: also, I am curious about the post by the person that replied to encompass' post to the -devel list, about using gettext to allow for I18N, and L10N. Is gettext something that is commonly used within Edubuntu?
<cbx33> hmmm
<cbx33> well tbph
<cbx33> there havn't been many educational apps developed by the edubutnu community
<dabaR> but there are members that are familiar with some of the code. I bet someone knows the answer. I can find out, thanks.
<dabaR> I can just read the source, even ;)
<cbx33> translation should be an issue at all
<cbx33> get text isn't hard from what I've heard ;)
<cbx33> but tbh I've never used it
<dabaR> K. Good night. I will leave this open, so let me know when you find out what kind of help is acceptable.
<cbx33> dabaR: well
<cbx33> I've just finished speaking to the admin
<cbx33> if you have a few minutes?
<dabaR> Yup
<cbx33> right
<cbx33> so....
<cbx33> I will have to talk to encompass about this, but
<cbx33> if we are able to create pystart as a seperate entity,
<cbx33> then it is possible for him to write the bits that are covered by GSoC
<cbx33> and you to write....extensions to that
<cbx33> but
<cbx33> we will also require testing
<cbx33> beta testing and feedback will be very important
<cbx33> and it's probaable that translation won't feature within Jasons spec
<cbx33> so...it could be an area that needs help
<cbx33> I will chat to Jason when I get a sec
<cbx33> we are supposed to be having our weekly meeting soon
<cbx33> ;)
<dabaR> I don't get something here. I find it strange that an open source project would not be open to everyone to develop. But, rules are rules. We will see as it goes along what is acceptable. And I can still read all the code, and that.
<cbx33> no no
<cbx33> it's not like that at all
<cbx33> Google have to see what the students have done
<cbx33> it has to be clearly defined
<cbx33> so...
<cbx33> like...X wrote a divX plugin for mplayer etc
<cbx33> it can't be...here are some diffs
<ajmitch> nor is the mentor going to be coding half of it ;)
<cbx33> indeed
<dabaR> Right. What I am envisioning is X led the development of a divX plugin for mplayer
<cbx33> no
<cbx33> it's Google Summer of Code.....the student does all the coding
<dabaR> A-ha.
<dabaR> OK. Well, nice to meet you ^_^
<cbx33> mentors are there for direction quality control and assistance if the student gets stuck
<cbx33> but
<ajmitch> & helping them integrate into the community
<cbx33> indeed
<cbx33> thanks ajmitch
<cbx33> but there is no reason why you can't help out on it, if you wish to
<cbx33> it just may not be hard and fast coding
<dabaR> Right. I understand.
<cbx33> not till the GSoC portion is over any who
<cbx33> make sense?
<dabaR> Completely.
<cbx33> good
<ajmitch> once that part is over, it's wide open for everyone
<cbx33> ;)
<cbx33> I'm hoping once it's open more people will jump in
<ajmitch> reminds me that I should get back to people on the patches for authtool, if I see them on irc
<dabaR> What about a suite of unit tests for the code? Sorry to keep you.
<cbx33> well
<cbx33> infact
<cbx33> writing some of the content for the release would be great
<cbx33> I don't see that as infringing at all
<cbx33> there will be some lessons needed
<cbx33> etc ;)
<cbx33> so that pystart has some files to use to show
<cbx33> once the framework is in place, that'll be something that can start
<cbx33> dabaR: can you drop me a mail....
<cbx33> so i can mail you when things are at that stage
<dabaR> What framework?
<cbx33> wel...
<cbx33> the lesson files will be in some kind of xml format
<cbx33> but Jason is still designing that
<dabaR> is googlemail(in your contact page on the blog site) a spam trap for gmail?
<dabaR> Do I translate googlemail to gmail in other words.
<dabaR> I have been talking with encompass through gmail. I instructed him on how to set up a dynamic DNS host name for his computer. I am not sure I will be interested in creating the lessons, but you can email me. I am definitely interested in what contributions are welcomed. I am a CS student, though, so there is a limited number of things I am interested in within the project.
<dabaR> cbx33:
<cbx33> ping ogra
<cbx33> one last quick question
<cbx33> for the book
<cbx33> the bootfile name
<cbx33> ltsp/i386/pxelinux.0
<ogra> you are missing a slash
<ogra> filename "/ltsp/i386/pxelinux.0"
<ogra> err
<ogra> filename "/ltsp/i386/pxelinux.0";
<cbx33> yeh
<cbx33> but in the chapter it was written as
<cbx33>  ltsp/pxelinux.0
<cbx33> hmmm
<cbx33> for a windows machine that works
<cbx33> i mean without the slahs
<cbx33> but i need the i386
<cbx33> ;)
<Toyito> Hi there
<Toyito> this is my first time here anibody there?????
<ogra> only 39 people :)
<Toyito> oopss
<Toyito> ha ha ha
<Toyito> hey can u help me pls...
<Toyito> i have a little problem whit Edubuntu Feisty...
<ogra> shoot
<Toyito> ok i have a fresh install...alll works fine but i dont have sound on Flash in the thin clients....(H)
<Toyito> i have system sound but not in flash.....
<Toyito> ??????
<ogra> hmm
<ogra> flash should just use alsa ...
<Toyito> yes....in Feisty my thin clients are using Alsa
<ogra> yup, i know i implemented it :)
<ogra> i wonder why flash doesnt do that
<ogra> looks like a bug in flash to me ...
<ogra> it should pick that up
<Toyito> yup and i am in a big problem....my boos want to make a presentation of the new lab...:-S
<Toyito> any tip?
<Toyito> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=420299&highlight=Feisty+flash
<Toyito> other like me...
<Toyito> hey Ogra what do you know a way to fix flash sound in Edgy?
<ogra> well, thats running an 32bit firefox an amd64 ... completely different prob
<ogra> flash sound in edgy worked fine afaik
<ogra> at least i never had problems here
<ogra> and there are no bugs about it
<Toyito> i think this is my problem....i have an AMD 64bits machine as server....im installing now on a P IV....
<ogra> oh
<Toyito> he...a little mistake......
<ogra> how did you get flash on there at all ?
<Toyito> just installing from Synaptic
<Toyito> im using i386 arch...hey but in the AMD flash sound is ok on the server
<ogra> ah, ok
<Toyito> just tcs have problems
<ogra> thats not related to the amd64 then
<ogra> if you run the i386 distro
<Toyito> ok
<Toyito> im running the i386 distro on an AMD 64 machine, do u think this is a problem?
<ogra> no
<Toyito> so?
<ogra> that actually the best you can do unless you have more than 4G of RAM in the amd65
<ogra> *64
<Toyito> ok...i only have 2Gb.
<ogra> well, its definately a bug in flash, i fear there is not much i can do about it right away ...
<ogra> i'll look into it if i can find a workaround or so ...
<ogra> at least since you say all other sounds work as expected ...
<Toyito> ok thanks a lot
<Toyito> ill be waiting for any help
<bddebian> Heya
<Toyito> hey
<bddebian> Hello Toyito
<Toyito> Hello
<Toyito> any help on Feisty flash soun on thin clients???
<sbalneav> Morning all
<Toyito> morning
<Toyito> did you get sound on thin clients using fiesty????
<sbalneav> Yep, they work for me
<th1a> Hi RichEd.
<RichEd> hi tom ...
<RichEd> looking forward to meeting you in the flesh
<th1a> I have a couple questions about the summit.
<ogra> hey tom
<th1a> Indeed.  You too.
<RichEd> sure ... fire away
<th1a> Hi ogra.
* ogra saw jinty on the list as well :)
<th1a> How long is my SchoolTool talk?
<th1a> ogra: Yes, the two of you have a lot to talk about.
<ogra> great :)
<ogra> lookig forward to that ...
<th1a> I didn't want to be stuck trying to explain the issues in Zope 3 component packaging.
<ogra> i was very sad we couldnt ship shooltool this release .... that shouldnt happen again in the future
<th1a> ogra: Yes, that's the goal.
<ogra> well, feisty is out ... lets not moan about spiled milk ;)
<ogra> *spilled
<th1a> We just had our head down writing code while the packaging issues steadily piled up.
<RichEd> th1a: you can do a 30 min presentation to a general audience, 10 mins q&a
<ogra> we'll do better in gutsy
<th1a> ogra: This summit should help.  Plus we've got a lot more working code now!
<ogra> yay
<RichEd> and then you can also have a BOF discussion session with the technical track ... either in UES or in UDS
<LaserJock> RichEd: is there a schedule up for UES yet?
<th1a> RichEd: OK, so the 30 minute talk is more to educators, administrators, etc.
<RichEd> i.e. 30 mins sales pitch ... to get the demand up
<th1a> RichEd: OK.
<RichEd> and then a roll up sleeves, what needs to be done by who, when to deliver
<RichEd> LaserJock: need to have it done by 3:00 pm tomorrow my time
<RichEd> that will be my morning
<RichEd> (time spoken for)
<ogra> whats that in utc ?
<th1a> RichEd: You had also initially mentioned doing a talk on "open source in ed in the US," which I have been planning in my head, but I guess it isn't on the agenda now.
<ogra> i have a talk on the openweek tomorrow
<LaserJock> any of you guys getting to seville on the evening of the 2nd?
<RichEd> LaserJock: yep most should be ... I will
<LaserJock> I was hoping somebody would be taking that same Madrid->Seville filght
<LaserJock> *flight
<RichEd> LaserJock: I'll be in seville from the monday evening via paris ... no help
<th1a> RichEd: If you'd like me to give a short talk on that topic, I can, but I haven't spent serious time on it, so I won't be offended if it doesn't fit the schedule now.
<RichEd> th1a: we'll have lightning talks as the last session on each day ... 5-10 mins ... to stimulate debate and chats around the dinner table / bar
<RichEd> no prep needed, just a forum to raise ideas / concerns / onservations
<RichEd> so that would fit well there
<LaserJock> "Edubuntu rocks! kthxbye" ;-)
<th1a> OK, I'll do that.  Do I need to sign up on the wiki?
<RichEd> I'll be updating the wiki tomorrow:
<RichEd> attendees
<RichEd> agenda
<RichEd> BOFs
<RichEd> etc.
<RichEd> Will add you there
<th1a> RichEd: Thanks.
<th1a> ogra: Another thing we'll need to talk about is SIF -- I'm working on a "Zone Integration Server" that only uses stuff in Ubuntu core (mod_python, sqlite, simpletal, etc.) so it should be easy to package.
<ogra> th1a, i dont mid iling main inclusion reports if you need other stuff :)
<ogra> *filing
<th1a> ogra: Actually, these are turning out to be excellent choices anyhow.  Also, everything is in Fedora and probably will be on the OLPC server, so it makes sense all around.
<ogra> cool
* jinty waves to ogra
<ogra> :)
<dabaR> Hi,.
<LaserJock> hi dabaR
<dabaR> hi
<LaserJock> ogra: you might find this interesting: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=420063
<ogra> LaserJock, i have mail from upstream aready
<ogra> *already
<LaserJock> cool
<LaserJock> I didn't quite get the license, but it seems like it might be suitable for at least Multiverse
<ogra> yep
<ogra> impara (the company behind it is from germany)
<ogra> they complain about broken GL support in our package btw
<LaserJock> in what package?
<ogra> Wir benutzen
<ogra> zur Zeit unsere eigene und nicht die Ubuntu-Squeak-Version, weil diese
<ogra> Probleme mit OpenGL hat.
<ogra> we are currently using our own squeak version because upstream has problems with OpenGL
<ogra> s/upstream/the Ubuntu-Squeak-Version/
<ogra> sorry
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
<LaserJock> ah
<LaserJock> well, our Squeak needs redone
<ogra> yeah
<bluekuja> cbx33: ping
<lns> I know this is ubuntu-specific, but has anyone here upgraded 6.06 to 7.04 on a 64-bit architecture with 32-bit thin clients?
<cliebow> lns: i believe you  will have  to  build the client on a 32 b it  machine if  clients are 32 bit..so  update feisty  on server then download perhaps the chroot tarball and dump it in /opt/ltsp
<lns> cliebow, when I installed Edgy I used a commandline parm. for building the chroot, something like --arch-i386 - would that work, you think?
<lns> Can't remember the command to build it, i think it was build-client-chroot or similar
<lns> ahh, ltsp-build-client
#edubuntu 2007-04-25
<Toyito> Hi there
<Toyito> hey could you help me pls
<Kamping_Kaiser> you hare to ask a question before people knwo that
<Toyito> ok i have installed Edubuntu Feisty, a fresh install, i have system sound in the server and clients....but when i visit a flash site i don have sound in terminals
<Toyito> can u help me to fix it?
<Kamping_Kaiser> /i/ cant, havent used ltsp on feisty
<Toyito> ok thanks
<RichEd> Burgundavia: you confirmed for UDS ?
<Burgundavia> RichEd: yep
<RichEd> great ... will be good to meet you in the flesh
<ajmitch> excellent...
<LaserJock> RichEd: schedule up?
<irc> LaserJock: busy with it now ... will have draft on the wiki in approx 2-3 hours
<LaserJock> cool
<ajmitch> hey LaserJock
<ajmitch> why are you still awake? :)
<LaserJock> ajmitch: well, I've got too much to do to go to bed
<LaserJock> gotta write up open week stuff for tomorrow
<LaserJock> do some data analysis for some rockin' cool data I got this evening
<LaserJock> etc.
<ajmitch> ah fun
<LaserJock> unfortunately it's 1:00am before I can get to anything :/
<RichEd> Burgwork: you there ?
<RichEd> ping ogra
<ogra> pong
<RichEd> ogra: are you up to answering a quick moodle question in #edulinux for <mpytasz>
<RichEd> and also, we have confirmation of a top moodle developer for UES ... Petr Skoda
<ogra> yay
<cbx33> ok
<RichEd> ogra, willvdl : 43 people confirmed for UES
<ogra> woah
<ogra> thats not bad
<willvdl> sweet
<ogra> the edubuntu kickoff meeting we had in london were 15 ppl or so
<RichEd> i'll update the attendee list when I have finished the first draft of the schedule ...
<RichEd> some nice attendees across quite a spread of interest and background
<willvdl> good news indeed
<cbx33> hey guys
<cbx33> I'm being thick here
<cbx33> I have a usb hdd
<cbx33>  /dev/sda
<cbx33> I just created a partition on it with gnome patirion manager
<cbx33> so i have /dev/sda1
<cbx33> i unplug and plug in and it automounts it
<cbx33> but I can't write to it
<cbx33> even though it's mounted as rw
<cbx33> how can i mount this partition so a "normal" user can write to it
<cliebow> and it has a dos filesystem?
<Kamping_Kaiser> RichEd, good numbers.
<cbx33> no
<cbx33> ext3
<cbx33> i just created i
<RichEd> Kamping_Kaiser: and a nice spread ... I am glad now that I did not promote it harder than we did ... 40-45 is manageable for this event, and then we can aim for a kick-ass event in 6 months time.
<cbx33> cool
* ajmitch would have loved to get to UES
* cbx33 too
<Kamping_Kaiser> ajmitch, mm. <aol />
<RichEd> ajmitch & cbx33 : now that I have been through the process, we'll sort out arrangements a lot earlier with more warning for the next event.
<Kamping_Kaiser> RichEd, heh. well done on the promotions front too then ;)
<ajmitch> I suspect that UDS will be more worthwhile for me at this point
<ajmitch> since I'm pretty much just focused on development
<cbx33> cliebow: what can i do about it
<ajmitch> cbx33: it's using the normal permissions
<ajmitch> so making it writable for anyone to create directories in would be a good help
<cbx33> who would i do that?
<cbx33> how?
<ajmitch> chmod ?
<cbx33> hmm
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> I'll try
<cbx33> the dir that I mounted to was created by a standard user
<cbx33> what do i chmod?
<cliebow> i am not so bright..but  if i mount with sudo only  root can write
<ajmitch> but the root inode on the device probably isn't writable
* ajmitch did have a usb stick with ext2 on it around here somewhere
<cbx33> ajmitch: i see
<cbx33> how do i make it so?
<ajmitch> where is it mounted?
* cliebow cliebow listens
<cbx33> a folder a user created
<ajmitch> not helpful
<cbx33>  /home/pete/win2000
<ajmitch> ls -lad /home/pete/win2000
<cbx33> whilst mounted?
<ajmitch> yes
<cbx33> ok hang on
<cbx33> oh no sorry...the auto mount mounted it to media/disk-1
<cbx33> but yes ther erms are wrong
<cbx33> I'll chmod
<ajmitch> right
<ajmitch> then it should magically work
<cbx33> thanks
<cbx33> YAY
<cliebow> yAY
<cbx33> if i wanted to mauanlly mount and get the same effect
<cbx33> how would I do it?
<ajmitch> it should work now when you manually mount
<ajmitch> try it
<RichEd> Kamping_Kaiser: any predictions for the krikkit today ?
<ajmitch> RichEd: don't talk about such things
<Kamping_Kaiser> RichEd, not an unbiased one :)
* Kamping_Kaiser returns to hacking on recomendations for school IT upgrade stuff
* cliebow cliebow looks to see what  else can be cut from school
* cliebow without  totally  destroying it
* ogra imagines cliebow running through corridors with a big knife
* Kamping_Kaiser hides under a desk
<cliebow> heh
<ogra> oh, he said without totally destroying it ...
<ogra> s/knife/scalpel/
<Kamping_Kaiser> lol
<cliebow> we're  in a place where the town valuation has quadrupled..so the state says we dont need any money..so just to keep status quo we have to ask for another 800000  from thic city of retirees
<cliebow> which is why pos cpus with 64  meg  of ram are my terminals
<ajmitch> morning ogra :)
<ogra> hey
<cliebow> btw:Good  Morning Edubuntu!
<ogra> :)
<ogra> afternoon
<cliebow> heh
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
* mode/#edubuntu [-o highvoltage]  by highvoltage
<highvoltage> hmm.. should get that fixed
<RichEd> hi highvoltage
<highvoltage> hi RichEd
<Kamping_Kaiser> btw RichEd , can we have a topic oin -education ?  perty please :)
<RichEd> Kamping_Kaiser: try to get there ...
<juliux> hi
<bimberi> RichEd: My prediction - a tie :)
* RichEd sings " tie me kangeroo down sport ... tie me kangeroo down"
<bimberi> ha!
<Kamping_Kaiser> lol
<bimberi> ajmitch: :(
* bimberi is a big Stephen Fleming fan
<RichEd> quick wiki table help question ... how do I force a line in a table row ?
<RichEd> *a line break
<ogra> [[BR] ]  ?
<RichEd> okay ... will try that ... was using <br> and did not work
<RichEd> thanks :) works
<ogra> was guessed :)
<RichEd> it's quote fussy, needs BR in caps, but does the job
<RichEd> *quite
<ogra> do we have any rdektop edgy users around ?
<ogra> *rdesktop
<Kamping_Kaiser> RichEd, dont know if your following the cricket... good luck for your team :)
<testingltsp> anybody tested LTSP5 in edubuntu?
<RichEd> thanks Kamping_Kaiser sane to you :)
<Kamping_Kaiser> ta :)
<RichEd> *same ... oops freudian slip
<Kamping_Kaiser> lol
<testingltsp> anybody tested LTSP5 in edubuntu?
<kgoetz> testingltsp: no need to ask every minute
<kgoetz> wait a while, if someone has they might respond
<testingltsp> hahaha
<testingltsp> pl
<testingltsp> ok
<testingltsp> played too much maple story, learnt how to spamming message
<testingltsp> I've installed ltsp5 with edubuntu, all my terminals boot up perfectly, but none of them allow me to login!
<Kamping_Kaiser> testingltsp, do you have sabayon installed?
<testingltsp> kamping_kaiser, i tested sabayon before, I think that is the first version when it is supporting berly 3D desktop
<Kamping_Kaiser> testingltsp, if you have sabayon installed but users arnt in groups (whatever sabayon calls them) they cant log in
<testingltsp> I don't mind using any distro to test out the latest LTSP 5, but seems that Ubuntu is most promising
<testingltsp> kamping_kaiser, I'm using edubuntu 7.04 + LTSP 5
<Kamping_Kaiser> yes, but do you have sabayon installed?
<Kamping_Kaiser> check.
<Kamping_Kaiser> now
<testingltsp> i don't have sabayon now
<Kamping_Kaiser> ok
<Kamping_Kaiser> do you have any errors in ~/.xsession-errors from the user you were trying to log in as?
<testingltsp> how to find that log?
<testingltsp> at terminal side?
<Kamping_Kaiser> log in at the server console or ssh into the server
<Kamping_Kaiser> then look in /home/username/.xsession-errors (where username is the user you tried to log in using the terminal)
<testingltsp> I've tried to use screen 2 by login using prompt
<testingltsp> but still not manage to login
<testingltsp> checking now
<Kamping_Kaiser> you wont be able to log into the thin clients unless you manually create a user the the chroot
<testingltsp> ohh
<testingltsp> how to create user using chroot?
<Kamping_Kaiser> it would be funky if somehow anyone in %admin could be added into the chroot as 'allow logins', but afaik it cant be done (yet)
<bddebian> Heay
<bddebian> Err Heya even :-)
<Kamping_Kaiser> you dont need a user in the chroot to login usign the gui
<Kamping_Kaiser> hey bddebian :)
<bddebian> Hello Kamping_Kaiser
<Kamping_Kaiser> :)
<testingltsp> a little bit confuse....
<testingltsp> i didn't encounter this problem with the previous version
<Kamping_Kaiser> welcome to software ;)
<testingltsp> hahah xD
<Kamping_Kaiser> hehe :\
<willvdl> highvoltage, sjoe, just got visa
<RichEd> willvdl: good :)
<ogra> testingltsp, did you chaneg any IP data for any of your network cards after installation ? if so, run sudo ltsp-update-sshkeys and try logging in again
<ogra> *change
<highvoltage> willvdl: cool!
<testingltsp> ogra, I've not changing anything & I did run that ltsp-update-sshkeys, still not working
<highvoltage> willvdl: btw, I see we're sharing a room :)
<testingltsp> ogra, is there will be something inside the file "ssh_known_hosts" after execution of ltsp-update-sshkeys? mine is blank
<willvdl> we are?
<willvdl> aha, the list on Claire's email
<willvdl> should read it I guess :)
<ogra> testingltsp, under /opt/ltsp/i386/ ... yes
<testingltsp> sob, my ssh_known_hosts is empty inside, I don't know what to do.
<willvdl> highvoltage, trust your visa is all under control...us getting them in at the same time and all :)
<ogra> testingltsp, is your ssh server running ?
<testingltsp> how to verify that?
<ogra> ps ax|grep ssh
<ogra> should return something .... else its not
<testingltsp>  5138 ?        Ss     0:00 /usr/bin/ssh-agent /usr/bin/dbus-launch --exit-with-s
<testingltsp> is it running?
<highvoltage> willvdl: I'm getting mine on Monday
<ogra> ogra@edubuntu:~/devel/feisty-ltsp$ ps ax|grep ssh
<ogra>  5155 ?        Ss     0:00 /usr/sbin/sshd
<ogra> thats what you are looking for
<ogra> sudo /etc/init.d/ssh start
<testingltsp> hmm mine looks weird
<testingltsp> ok
<ogra> try that ^^^
<testingltsp> ogra, u r my time saver!
<ogra> :)
<testingltsp> i don't have SSH server installed! lmao, tot is auto installed if LTSP is selected!
<ogra> oh, so thats no standard edubuntu install ...
<testingltsp> yeah
<ogra> you *could* run ltsp without ssh ... so its not a hard dependency ...
<testingltsp> is a bit shock that they miss out this link in synaptic, lol
<ogra> apt-cache show ltsp-server :)
<ogra> it has Recommends: ....
<testingltsp> I've tried ubuntu & edubuntu 7.04, same thing
<testingltsp> cool!!!! first time log in through client, ogra, i love u
<ogra> :)
<mcsd> !beryl
<ubotu> Beryl is a window manager that takes advantage of an OpenGL accelerated X environment. See http://forum.beryl-project.org/ - Help in #ubuntu-effects
<willvdl> http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/04/04/AR2007040402715.html
<ogra> hmm, high profile bribery ?
* ogra would take high profile bribes gratefully ...
<willvdl> what would you like to be bribed to do?
<ogra> no idea ... for my existence ?
<ogra> i dont have specific targets for stuff to work on for bribes .... :)
<ogra> not yet ... but now that you say it .... :)
<Riverman> hi room
<Riverman> LTSP: can not boot an old client without a PXE NIC, it uses a RTL 8139 chip (clone)
<Riverman> ideas?
<cliebow_> Ri:how far do you get..
<willvdl> ogra, perhaps LP needs a Bribery button. "Get this spec completed Xtra Fast!" (TM)
<Riverman> well, I went on rom o matic
<ogra> haha
<Riverman> booted with dos, executed a com file, but got no dhcp, this i tried with a windows server though, because my linus server is not reaady yet
<Riverman> just to test the fake pxe boot
<ogra> why do you boot with DOS ?
<ogra> the rom-o-matic disks should be able to boot right away
<Riverman> well, i downloaded a tgz file to put on a floppy with rawwrite, but i got error
<cliebow_> use rawrite to put a .zdsk onto a floppy
<cliebow_> or.lzdsk..whatever
<ogra> we had a very good howto once for creating rom o matic images... i wonder where its gone :/
<Riverman> hmm i tried to find a howto.. but didnt get one
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
* mode/#edubuntu [-o highvoltage]  by highvoltage
<Riverman> does Edubuntu ltsp server create bootdisks?
<ogra> seems someone deleted it from the wiki
<ogra> no
<ogra> but its ready to boot eterboot right away
<Riverman> since the chipset is really well know (the rtl 8139)
<ogra> so if you have your floppy working it should work out o the box
<ogra> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/LTSPBootingClientsWithoutPxe
<ogra> there we go
<ogra> well hidden
<willvdl> seems the whole wiki front was rewritten
<ogra> i added it to the help.ubuntu-com ltsp docs
<Riverman> hmmm
<willvdl> ok. I'm an idiot
<willvdl> later
<ajmitch> ogra: a good session there
<ogra> thanks
<ogra> well, i need to go to do some tuxtype training i guess
<ogra> sadly you can only scratch the surface with this 1h limitation and so many questions
<joebaker> ogra:  nice presentation.  I have some experience using an http proxy filter solution using dansguardian and squid and clamav.  Ubuntu packages exist which can provide this solution.  A dns method makes auto configuration of the client doable using java script on a web server at http://wpad.localdomain/wpad.dat
<ogra> we ship smoothwall on the addon CD atm
<ajmitch> ogra: yeah, I didn't get to even ask any questions :)
<ogra> i'll look into adding dansguariand or squidguard ... the prob with these is that they need updated balcklists every now and then
<ogra> and dansguardian isnt freely distributable iirc
<joebaker> ogra.  There is the license issue with Dan's guardian -- yes, although it is gpl to schools --- but that doesn't really work does it.  -- Importantly though Dan's guardian does not _require_ updated blacklists to be effective.
<ogra> well, its not GPL to distributors ...
<ogra> thats the main prob for me :)
<ogra> we have willowng, but development of that stalled somehow
<joebaker> ogra:  Maybe you are familiar with dan's guardian's approach of monitoring the content of the pages for matching regular expressions which have values associated with them.  A calculation is done, compared to acceptable value.
<ogra> it was the most promising approach ...
<ogra> joebaker, well, willowng simply uses a spam filter mechanism to match content ...
<ogra> a bayesian one ... so it learns :)
<joebaker> Maybe dansguardian can become truely gpl in the future.  I'll look into willowng.   I've been studying Python, maybe I can help if it's written in Python.
<ogra> it is
<cliebow_> joebaker:you working with python-gtk
<joebaker> http://dansguardian.org/?page=copyright2     Since Edubuntu caters to mostly a non-commercial audience, there could be some benefit to using DansGuardian.  Where I work, we own a commercial license to DansGuardian.
<joebaker> cliebow_ :  I hope to.  I'm reading "Python How to Program by Deitel"  it's a 1300 page book.  I'm on about page 300.
<ogra> joebaker, we want to be able to provide edubuntu to everyone, even commecial people who want t use it as a base
<joebaker> ogra:  I certianly agree.
<LaserJock> hi ogra, sorry I missed your session
<ogra> so such licensing wont work for shipment ...
<ogra> LaserJock, well i missed yours too :P
<joebaker> ogra:  I think that Ubuntu can buy a distributable license from DansGuardian that isn't too expensive... less than $5,000 if I recall.  I used to build firewalls and support them so I considered buying it.  Of course this might be problematic for derivative distributions.  I should contact "Dan" and see if he would enjoy increased exposure by releasing the product fully under GPL.
<Burgwork> joebaker: we have a content filter
<Burgwork> plus, that license is not really legal
<cliebow_> having trouble installing feisty on a "fakeraid" intel matrix in raid 0..feisty sees the two drives as ndependent drives..anyone have any thoughts?
<Burgwork> gpl2 allows commericial use
<ogra> joebaker, we would have paied for mp3 support if that were our philosophy
<cbx33> ogra, ++
<cbx33> hey all
<Burgwork> joebaker: Amaranth is the primary author of willowng
<Burgwork> hey cbx33
<cbx33> Hey Burgwork
<cbx33> think the chapter is done
<ogra> hi cbx33
<cbx33> hey ogra
<Burgwork> cool
<cbx33> howz it going everyone
<Burgwork> how do I change my keymap in bash?
<cliebow_> cbx33:owdy!
<cbx33> ogra, you did a new ldm in C right?
<cbx33> hey cliebow
<ogra> yes
<joebaker> Burgwork: Thanks, I'll note Amaranth authorship of willowng.
<cbx33> GTK baseD?
<ogra> https://launchpad.net/people/ogra/+branch/ltsp/ldm-greeter
<ogra> yes
<cbx33> cool
<cbx33> can i run it as a standard thingy
<ogra> i use it since two weeks :)
<cbx33> without it being a login manager
<ogra> no
<cbx33> so it will be in gutsy?
<cbx33> I wanted to have a look at generating that clock plugin we talked about
<ogra> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/ldm-improvements
<Burgwork> joebaker: willowng works for basic content filtering
<ogra> but it wont get any new gui stuff
<ogra> its slow enough with the existing stuff
<cbx33> i thought you said it was faster in C
<MrGreen> got a fresh install got a couple of questions?
<cbx33> woudl a cairo clock slow it down?
<MrGreen> cairo clock is sweet
<Burgwork> yes
<ogra> cbx33, its faster and smaller because it doesnt use *any* deps than plain GTK
<cbx33> ahh ok
<MrGreen> my keyboard is whack .. atm " is where @ should be ;-(
<ogra> no cairo or anything to play with
<cbx33> i see
<cbx33> if i could do it in plain gtk?
<ogra> only what gtk widgets pffer
<MrGreen> mono
<ogra> *offer
<cbx33> hmm
<joebaker> ogra your typing is fun to watch :)
<ogra> heh
<ogra> i would type three times faster if i wouldnt have to do corrections all the time :)
<cbx33> hehe
<cbx33> sometimes I wonder why we do corrections
<ogra> but i'm german so this broken stuff bothers me :)
<cbx33> I'm not going to btoher in future
<ogra> tads greht
<cbx33> unless someone asks ;~
<cbx33> ah
<ogra> or so :)
<cbx33> Das ist Gut Ja?
<MrGreen> nien
<cbx33> ogra, we're getting two new pigs on Friday
<cbx33> ;)
<ogra> cool
<Burgwork> ok non-english folks
<Burgwork> the keyboard detection on my latest install of Ubuntu server failed
<ogra> pur new one grows and grows
<Burgwork> if I change the locale, will that fix it?
<ogra> unlikely
<Burgwork> ie: I got the wrong keymap
<cbx33> hehe
<cbx33> we're hoping to breed these two
<cbx33> ;)
<cbx33> have a little guinea pig farm
<ogra> Burgwork, changing the keyboard settings will likely gain you more here :)
<cbx33> guinea pig babies are sooo cool
<Burgwork> ogra: where is that stored?
<ogra> console-tools or so
<ogra> or console-setup
<ogra> dpkg-reconfigure is your friend :)
<Monika|K> you can change the keyboard in your xorg.conf
<Monika|K> 	Option	    "XkbModel" "pc105"
<Monika|K> 	Option	    "XkbLayout" "de"
<Monika|K> that would be for a German keyboard
<ogra> it puts the settings into /etc/default ... xorg reads from that on reofgure ...
<ogra> *reconfigure
<ogra> Monika|K, apart from the fact that you shouldnt edit xorg.conf manually :)
<ogra> dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xorg is the magic comand ;)
<Burgwork> but there is no X on the box
<Monika|K> one shouldn't? I have been advised to do it a lot and have changed mine
<ogra> well, the tools we write usually operate as frontend to tools like dpkg-reconfigure ... i.e the new restricted manager
<cliebow_> having trouble installing feisty on a "fakeraid" intel matrix in raid 0..feisty sees the two drives as ndependent drives..anyone have any thoughts?
<ogra> if you change it manyually the debconf db wont match the content of the file anymore
<ogra> cliebow, i think there was something in the ubuntu release notes about raid stuff
<cliebow_> ok take another look
<ogra> lie being extremely slow during partition creation
<ogra> *like
<LaserJock> ogra: are we going to talk about UES and UDS at the meeting today?
<ogra> i think so
<ogra> RichEd made some effort to get a schedule together
<ogra> so i guess he wants to talk about it
<ogra> i'm still not dont registering all my specs ...
<ogra> actually i had a new idea today i need to wirte down as well
<cbx33> ogra, http://www.gnome.org/~davyd/gnome-journal-cairo-article/clock-ex3.c
<cbx33> doesn't that use the same libs
<cbx33> gtk.h that you did?
<ogra> yes
<cbx33> but it does cairo?
<ogra> but mine dosest make ldd load cairo into ram :P
<cbx33> i see
<cbx33> ok i get it now
<ogra> if you dont call cairo it wont be loaded
<cbx33> yeh
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> I see
<LaserJock> I'm working on learning some gtk/cairo
<ogra> cbx33, apart from that you have another prob ...
<cbx33> ;)
<ogra> the clock on thin clients is usually wrong
<cbx33> *bah*
<cbx33> :p
<cbx33> bbl
<ogra> and i'm not after shipping and setting up an ntp server in edubuntu
<ogra> apart from that you will slow down booting of the clients through that again
<ogra> focus for gutsy ltsp is *speed* and stability not features ;)
<LaserJock> awwww, but bling is fun ;-)
<LaserJock> we aren't doing beryl-on-ltsp ?
<ogra> ask Amaranth :P
<ogra> i'm waiting for the beryl plugin ;)
<LaserJock> ok, well something I've been thinking about
<ogra> it cant work ...
<LaserJock> is better user managment
<ogra> ah
<ogra> ok
<LaserJock> I'm not great with all this fancy LDAP/AD stuff
<ogra> well, that should go along with a proper edubuntu-auth-server implementation
<ogra> what we need is a good ldap admin gui
<LaserJock> but I keep seeing around the edu community "we need better user management, especially in bulk"
<LaserJock> so will that be all that's needed?
<ogra> the one i picked in the spec was pretty disappointing and far from being ready
<LaserJock> well, not "all" as in trivial
<ogra> well, find a good ldap admin thats as easy as users-admin
<Burgwork> ogra: which one did you pick??
<ogra> Burgwork, edsadmin
<LaserJock> but is saying "if you want to do decent amounts users, you'll be using ldap" a safe assumption
<Burgwork> ahh
<Burgwork> lat is a better bet
<ogra> Burgwork, it had the most userfriendly gui but lots of probs underneath
<LaserJock> this is were my ignorance of "real life" deployments fails
<ogra> lat is the worst crap i've seen so far
<Burgwork> heh
<Burgwork> it has the most features
<ogra> i wouldnt put a teacher in front of it
<Burgwork> I have only run into one crasher
<ogra> yes, exactly its totally non-gnome
<LaserJock> I just imagined something like the the gnome user tool, but with bulk features
<ogra> it has way to many features
<LaserJock> like import/export from file
<ogra> yeh as simple as it can get
<ogra> *yeah even
<ogra> the best would be to have an ldap backend for users-admin
<ogra> that just hooks in to ldap and to the existing gui
<LaserJock> ok, well I wondered if I could tie the dynamic menu stuff into a bulk user management tool, but it sounds like that's not really a good idea
<ogra> well, why not ....
<ogra> if you dont bloat the ui
<ogra> i.e. i dont want users to get a server selection dialog ...
<LaserJock> well, I just thought it'd require messing around with the existing tools
<ogra> or see a directory structure
<ogra> if there is a new tool written thats as good or better than the existing tools thats fine ...
<LaserJock> I was hoping for a GSoC project for that
<ogra> the existing ldap admin tools are simply what they say they are ...
<ogra> ldap admin tools ...
<ogra> what we want is a user management tool ... :)
<LaserJock> I want a user managment tool that works with ldap as well
<Burgwork> an ldap backend for users-admin would rock
<ogra> right
<LaserJock> is it worth a spec?
<Burgwork> it really shoujld be done upstream
<ogra> sure
<Burgwork> if we provide patches, I imagine they will take them
<Burgwork> it has been talked about before
<ogra> Burgwork, it can be done in ubuntu and flow up the stream ;)
<cliebow_> ldap is so configurable with respect to users..how to deal with all the nuances people have added?
<Burgwork> you assume defaults
<ogra> cliebow_, i'm lookinf for something in the default install ...
<Burgwork> if people have screwed up defaults, that is their issue, not ours
<ogra> if you have special cases such a tool should point you to other tools that are better suited ...
<ogra> i.e. if t detects a non standard setup
* ogra changes locations ... it get dark on the balcony
<joebaker> There are many LDAP gui tools.   GQ,  Directory Administrator, etc...   I'll try to dig up my notes... There was one Mandriva Corporate server that is GPL that looked promising....
<joebaker> http://luma.sourceforge.net/about.html
<Burgwork> we don't need an ldap gui tool
<Burgwork> we need a user control tool that happens to control ldap users
<joebaker> But I still have to say it just doesn't look simple enough.   This user admin stuff needs to be simple enough for an end user to do.
<joebaker> Burgwork:  right.
<joebaker> Burgwork:  But then there's a config file in the ldap.secret which would need to contain the LDAP admin/root password (or) the tool would ask for that password to pass during updates.
<Burgwork> it would make sense that the tool would need to ask for that information
<cliebow_> pam_ldap.secret would be readable wouldnt it?
<joebaker> Burgwork:  Actually most ldap client machines rarely are given admin power to the LDAP server.  Most entities are given permission to update "self" in some fashion.  So it's like the root password on a server (which is a client of an LDAP server) may not be the admin password of the LDAP service.
<Burgwork> we are arguing past each other
<joebaker> cliebow_  No, pam_ldap.secret can have restrictive permissions as I recall.  So it's security is addressed via standard Unix style permissions, yet some are still leary of storing a password unencrypted in a file.
<cliebow_> cant blam em 8~)
<Burgwork> we are talking about changing the users-admin tool to admin ldap users
<cliebow_> joebaker: yeah of course..i had it in my head to build the server..
<cliebow_> on same machine
<joebaker> I just find it very convenient that I can have an older machine acting as the LDAP server, and when I bring up a new LTSP server, it becomes a client of that LDAP server.  So all accounts, an NFS home directory and the like are ready and waiting for users to run with.  I recognize that a large percentage of your schools might just start with one Edubuntu system and won't have seperate NFS & LDAP services.  But for the business I wor
<cliebow_> joebaker: yes..
<RichEd> hello
<RichEd> ==== edubuntu meeting === in #ubuntu-meeting == in 9 mins
<LaserJock> wahoo
<ogra> hey hey
<RichEd> LaserJock, Ogra: provisional schedule is here ... just have most of the presentations in so far:
<RichEd> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UES-Sevilla/Schedule
<RichEd> Once we discuss the tech meeting ideas / topics, I'll arrange those in tomorrow
<ogra> i've seen it and advertised UES in my edubuntu talk ....
<RichEd> edubuntu talk ?
<ogra> its openweek ...
<ogra> i told yu about it yesterday
<RichEd> okay ... when it that ?
<RichEd> *is
<ogra> it was 17:00 UTC
<ogra> and is on sat 17:00 UTC again
<RichEd> okay :) great
<ogra> right before sabdfl ....
<RichEd> note also that Mark wants us to plan Boton dates (October UDS/UES) and announce to the mail list next week, and start broadcasting for discussion at Secilla
<ogra> i had a bunch of questions that would have better been adressed to will or you though
<ogra> cool
<ogra> nice to know that we're "official" :)
<RichEd> I think we'll gear a lot of that one will be aimed at University level ... it is becoming clear from emails and submissions to Ubuntu Live and UES that the university adoption is way higher than we realise
<LaserJock> RichEd: looks fun and educational :-)
<RichEd> And maturity
<LaserJock> cool
<RichEd> LaserJock: I also reaslised today that I must take notes of issues people faced when they present on their case studies, and bring those up during the open floor discussion at the end of each day
<RichEd> See if others have or had the same problems, and can offer suggested approaches or solutions
<RichEd> especially to the soft issues
<Monika|K> at my university we use Kubuntu rather than Edubuntu
<LaserJock> Monika|K: becuase you all use KDE over there ;-)
<RichEd> Monika|K: the summits are aimed at *buntu and Education
<RichEd> where organisations add their own applications to the base release
<Monika|K> LaserJock also in Germany there are more Ubuntu than Kubuntu users
<LaserJock> really?
<Monika|K> as far as I know, yes
<LaserJock> from the people I talk to it sounds like there are a lot more Kubuntu folks
<RichEd> So we hope to learn from them which applications we need to add to Edubuntu to make it improve as a simple education bundle.
<Monika|K> at least ubuntuusers.de has about 10 times as many registered users as kubuntu-de.org
<RichEd> ==== edubuntu meeting === in #ubuntu-meeting == now ===
<Monika|K> but then, uu has been around for longer and also covers Kubuntu
<Monika|K> so I guess one can't really definitely tell
<ogra> yeah
<ogra> its hard to tell ...
<Burgwork> https://blueprints.beta.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/edubuntu-mass-deployment-management hm
<Burgwork> interesting
<RichEd> hi Burgwork ... what dates are you around at UDs ? I need to update the wiki list for Claire
<Burgwork> RichEd: the full UDS
<RichEd> Arrive Sun, leave Sat ?
<Burgwork> YES
<Burgwork> sorry, yes
<LaserJock> no need to yell, shesh ;-)
<Burgwork> was filling out a form with a postal code
<Burgwork> thus the caps
<RichEd> Burgwork: thanks :)
* RichEd acknowledges a fine defeat to bimberi ...
<LaserJock> ok wait, are we saying we'll vote on EC on the 16th?
<RichEd> LaserJock: yep ... gotta problem with that buddy ?
* RichEd stares at LaserJock 
<LaserJock> no
<LaserJock> I just didn't know for sure
* RichEd backs off a few inchres
<RichEd> I'm too tired for this ... will cause a ruckus soon
<LaserJock> uh oh
* RichEd is off to bed
<LaserJock> good night Richard
* ogra too
<bluekuja> goodnight oliver
<ogra> that day was way to long for not having a freeze ahead
<bluekuja> ogra: I'll kep you updated about that rdesktop problem!
<bluekuja> *keep
<LaserJock> ogra: I bet
<bluekuja> LaserJock:  do you have a minute for that review?
<LaserJock> bluekuja: getting there
<bluekuja> LaserJock:  you rock man!
<bluekuja> :D
<bluekuja> i need to restart my internet connection
<bluekuja> brb
<pygi> LaserJock, :)
#edubuntu 2007-04-26
<nixternal> how come I always miss the Edubuntu meetings? I want to toss my hat in for membership (for about 6 months now), but can never make it to a meeting
<Burgwork> nixternal: you already have Edubuntu, via your Kubuntu memberhsip
<nixternal> also, LaserJock, any plans for 7.10?
<nixternal> via Kubuntu and Ubuntu and Burgwork memberships ;)
<Burgwork> wait a sec, you have membership in me?
<nixternal> LaserJock: that is for doc work? Kubuntu is solid and won't take to much from me this go round
<nixternal> not in you...OK, I am going to stop
<nixternal> trying to say it right still sounded wrong
* bimberi thinks nixternal just likes to collect memberships :)
<nixternal> yes
<nixternal> muhehehe
<nixternal> it started out as a joke, but Burgwork made me want it (membership) even more. I want to be like him when I grow up
<Burgwork> nixternal: you are twisted :)
<nixternal> you think? ;)
<Burgwork> ya, you use KDE?
<pygi> :P
<ajmitch> aw, nixternal left
<ajmitch> yay, he returns
<ajmitch> Burgwork: it's not fair, I'm not an edubuntu or kubuntu member
<nixternal> oh man, I press the wrong button and everyone starts talking bad about me ;)
<ajmitch> nixternal: of course
<ajmitch> how else would we talk?
* pygi burns ajmitch 
<ajmitch> hello pygi :)
<Burgwork> ajmitch: how familiar are you with mysql?
<nixternal> haha
<nixternal> OK, class time
<nixternal> back in a bit
<pygi> ajmitch, hi ^_^
<ajmitch> Burgwork: mysql & php are the bane of my life
<Burgwork> I am having a headache installing joomla
<ajmitch> ok
<pygi> Burgwork, what's the problem?
<Burgwork> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Joomla <-- following this
<Burgwork> I have created a mysql db
<Burgwork> and yet is says "mysql unavailable" on the first page
<Burgwork> on the joomla config wizard
<pygi> restarted mysql, gave all rights to the user that joomla is using to access db, and such?
<Burgwork> yep and yep
<ajmitch> joomla is php?
<Burgwork> ya
<ajmitch> got the appropriate php-mysql installed?
<Burgwork> now I feel stupid
* Burgwork goes and hides
<Burgwork> ok, that worked
<ajmitch> excellent
* ajmitch likes simple fixes
<pygi> congrats Burgwork :)
<LaserJock> nixternal: you sitll around?
<LaserJock> Burgwork: you still around?
<sacater> highvolt1ge: ive fixed gizmo
<sacater> highvolt1ge: well sort of, i now use ekig
<sacater> ekiga*
<skwashd> hi all
<skwashd> i have been trying to install edubuntu and i am not having much luck
<skwashd> nm
<skwashd> had my partioning wrong
<skwashd> 100M / not 100G :)
<juliux> hi RichEd
* RichEd -> Sevilla trip arrangements ... leaving tomorrow ... out for an hour or so
<tsurc> Ive just installed edu7.04 on a test server, and I'm having problems with the Screen Viewer.
<tsurc> I'm having problems setting up Screen Viewer on edubunut7.04. I have followed the instructions here https://wiki.edubuntu.org/InstallX11VncOnLtspClients BUT NO JOY
<tsurc> sorry "but no joy"
<cliebow_> tsurc:this is usng thin-client-manager?
<tsurc> yes, but weirdly and I don't know what I did...... but it works now
<cliebow_> must live right 8~)
<cliebow_> soccer playoffs on now?
<tsurc> get a small thumbnail from thin-client-manager.... note ip address of client. close thin-client manager. Fire up vncviewer ip:6 and your away.
<tsurc> all I need to do now I thing is sort out sound with websites using flash. Set the clients NOT to detect the on board flash, and workout how to turn all the clients of with a cron job.
<tsurc> *think
<tsurc> cliebow_: I haven't tried that script out yet you sent me. I have had a little read through and it look ok so far.
<cliebow_>  i cant remember..ohhh ldap..
<tsurc> cliebow_: prefer rugby union (bit like american football minus the body armour, helmets and stuff) ;)
<cliebow_> tsurc:death-wish football..my brother used to play
<sbalneav> Morning all
<tsurc> My sister used to play for Lancaster University Womens squad.
<tsurc> Morning (Afternoon ?)
<cliebow_> my old Teach gave a list of user@ws..id click on it..hit run and it would open up
<bddebian> Heya
<cliebow_> sort of like mrs doubtfire..8~)
<tsurc> Well I know we have a love hate relationship, but she's not quite that bad. For a rugby player she's surprisingly feminine
<cliebow_> cool..
<tsurc> anyway, I havn't seen her for a bit, I'm more bothered about getting a cron job for shuting down the clients.
<cliebow_> like an ssh -e to the client?
<tsurc> I've got waking them up ok. using wakeonlan on the server
<cliebow_> cool
<tsurc> but shutting them all down is a puzzler
<tsurc> Idea is at 8pm server shuts down all the clients....8am Server starts all the clients. thus 12h of power saved every day... *week*month*year = allot of power saved
<sbalneav> tsurc: Remembering that even if you shut them down, they're still using power
<tsurc> wakeonlan was the easy part. (except its in universe) wakeonlan MACoClient MACoClient MACoClient etc =  job done
<sbalneav> Better solution would be to simply put a block-heater timer on the pwer for the lab table, and actually kill power to the table.
<tsurc> yeh but no where near the level they would if they were on fully
<sbalneav> As well, you can actually buy power-strips that are tcp/ip aware.
<ogra> with running sshd ? *g*
<sbalneav> The one I used to have had a telnet interface
<tsurc> and it scores high for internal politics, that we don't have to change anything, just implement code
<ogra> cool
<tsurc> thats just bells and whistles ATM, my real problem lies with the onboard flash on these t5725's. When a user logsin they get them proudly displayed on their desktop.
<ogra> hmm, thats tricky, we dont have a blacklist meachanism for loca devices ...
<ogra> i asume you want functionality for usbsticks etc ...
<tsurc> hey, really jut stuff that is plugged in "after" the user has logged in
<tsurc> another thing I just noticed, is that the testuser I created can navigate into the Administrators home directory.
<tsurc> changing the permissions on the folder solves this...... but should this happen out the box?
<ogra> yup, we use the default umask value ubuntu uses ... you can change that in /etc/profile
<ogra> man umask gves you info
<ogra> *gives
<tsurc> right... any particular reason why?
<ogra> just to stay conform with ubuntu defaults and ubuntu documentation
<tsurc> just seems a bit odd on an edubuntu server install thats all
<ogra> for the flashdisks you could try to edit /opt/ltsp/i386/etc/init.d/ltsp-client
<ogra> find a line "/usr/sbin/delayed_mounter"
<ogra> comment it
<ogra> and reboot a client
<ogra> if that works i'll make it a config option "EXCLUDE_STATIC_LOCALDEV" or so ...
<ogra> (for gutsy)
<tsurc> changed... rebooting now
<tsurc> ;) works a treat
<ogra> great
<ogra> thanks for testing ... i add a patch to my local branch
<tsurc> although I have the edubuntu-server-addon cd in the server right now, and the user can see it too.
<ogra> yes, all users will see server sided devices
<ogra> they are not handled by ltsp but by the default desktop
<ogra> devices handled by ltspfs are only seen and accessible by the user who owns them ...
<tsurc> yes.... but when "I" try to eject it it fails because apparently only testuser can do that.
<ogra> sounds like a gnome bug
<ogra> nautilus rather
<tsurc> on the testusers desktop there is no left_click eject option
<ogra> indeed
<ogra> hmm
<ogra> all you can do is eject it from the terminal ...
<ogra> nautilus is patched to not show any eject items on thin clients ...since ltspfs doesnt use unmounting or ejecting
<ogra> indeed that case wasnt planned :)
<tsurc> anyway of finding out what packages are invloved to I can file a bug in the right place?
<tsurc> .. and ejecting from the terminal works ;) thanks
<ogra> file it against nautilus and add info that its caused by an ltsp patch and only happens on thin clients
<ogra> it wouldnt happen if you were the only user on the server though ...
<ogra> (the ture bug is that testuser got the device assigned)
<ogra> you could disable device mounting in the gnome settings of testuser, that would prevent this bug i guess
<ogra> (it wnt affect the thin client devices)
<tsurc> how would i do that?
<ogra> System->Settings->Removable devices ...
<ogra> uncheck the options to automount devices and CDroms ...
<ogra> if you now plug in the CD it should be owned by the admin user
<tsurc> ;) that works
<tsurc> still having problems with the screen viewer though. I get "Not Connected" ip, user, Unavailable (in red) install x11vnc on the client. Even though x11vnc is installed.
<tsurc> *
<tsurc> Is there any way of telling if a user has "OK"d a message sent through the thin-client-manager
<bonbonthejon> Any contribs around who have the current handbook? I think I found an error.
<ogra> fle a bug against the edubuntu-docs package :)
<ogra> *file
<bonbonthejon> ok
<bonbonthejon> I dont know where it is, I found the screenshot in the handbook
<ogra> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/edubuntu-docs/+filebug just describe it roughly ... if someone of the doc team has a question bout it they wil ask on the bug
<ogra> ahm, bug 110352 :)
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 110352 in edubuntu-docs "Grammatical error in handbook" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/110352
<ogra> oh, thats gnome-app-install, nice catch
<bonbonthejon> I just did another one too
<bonbonthejon> bug 110357
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 110357 in edubuntu-docs "Add link in handbook" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/110357
<bonbonthejon> ogra: I have a little experience setting up a software RAID under Ubuntu server, would there be a place for a small tutorial?
<ogra> look what on the wiki already ...
<ogra> *what's
<bonbonthejon> ogra: the general ubuntu wiki? or does edubuntu have a wiki
<ogra> they use the same database but different frontends and webservers
<bonbonthejon> ok
<LaserJock> ogra: have you merged all the edu stuff for gutsy?
<ogra> haha
<LaserJock> that's what I thought
<ogra> June 21st is merge end ...
<LaserJock> ok
<LaserJock> hopefully merges.ubuntu.com will be back up shortly
<ogra> tomorrowit should be back
<ogra> HD failure
<LaserJock> mhm, I saw some emails to Debian about it
#edubuntu 2007-04-27
<maccam94> um, www.edubuntu.org is down for me >_<
* maccam94 wants to grab the x86 7.04 torrents
<maccam94> can anyone else confirm that the site is down?
<Burgwork> yep, down
<Burgwork> up again
<bhaskar> i have install edubuntu 7.04 festy , LTSP 5 is built in , very nice, i want to know how to setup printer?? on client and server
<achandra> hey there!
<achandra> wireless issues!
<achandra> Intel Pro/Wireless 2200 BG
<achandra> has anyone experienced similar issues?
<achandra> can anyone help me to get this wireless up and running.. I am using a Intel Pro/Wireless 2200BG connection..
<ukubuntu> You guys may wish to help redress the balance  http://fridge.ubuntu.com/node/910 pass it on all day ;)
<ukubuntu> Edubuntu
<ukubuntu> 1% (2 votes)
<ukubuntu> Kubuntu
<ukubuntu> 49% (167 votes)
<ukubuntu> Ubuntu
<ukubuntu> 48% (161 votes)
<ukubuntu> Xubuntu
<ukubuntu> 2% (8 votes)
<ukubuntu> None of the above
<ukubuntu> 0% (0 votes)
<ukubuntu> Total votes: 338
<pipedream> eek
* pipedream votes
<cliebow> ukubuntu, done
<cliebow> now i vote for the other schools
<ukubuntu> kewl
<bhaskar> hello, can u give me the links of Edubuntu server add-on CD
<bhaskar> i have Server 7.04 Feisty
<bhaskar> so i need 7.04 server add-on CD link
<bddebian> Heay
<bddebian> Err Heya
<ogra> tsk ...
<ogra> breaking traditions ...
<bddebian> Yeah :'-(
<cliebow_> palindromes..almost
<bettsp> ogra: ping
<knix_> Is it possible to authenticate students with edubuntu in active directory?
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
* mode/#edubuntu [-o highvoltage]  by highvoltage
* meduxa is away: Away at the moment
<ogra> bettsp, pong
<cbx333> ogra, we just got two little rexs
<ogra> nicde
<cbx333> Asuka and Tifa
<cbx333> about 9 weeks old ;)
<ogra> two girls  ?
<cbx333> yup
<cbx333> you knew the names?
<ogra> nope
<ogra> susie also considers  new one ...
<cbx333> Asuka is a character name from Neon Genesis Evangelion
<ogra> somehow the old one we had left slightly suffers from the agile young one
<cbx333> and Tifa is from Final Fantasy 7
<cbx333> ;)
<ogra> ah
* LaserJock thinks cbx333 need to get a life ;-)
* LaserJock then runs out of the room
* cbx333 kicks LaserJock 
<cbx333> damn he was too fast
<cbx333> they had to have japanese names ;)
<cbx333> or
<cbx333> at least from japanese created series
<cbx333> ;)
<LaserJock> cbx333: I'm fast as a laser
<ogra> after seville i'm planning a 10-20 sqm outdoor cage for mine
<LaserJock> so 3x10^8 m/s
<cbx333> we're hoping to breed a few
<ogra> ah, nice ...
<cbx333> we had babies before
<cbx333> they are very cute
<ogra> we're still unsure we want that trouble .... but thinking about it since quite ome time
<cbx333> maximum you can get is 4 ;)
<cbx333> or 5
<LaserJock> ogra: did I already ask you if you were going to Sevilla via Madrid?
<ogra> via palma de mallorca
<LaserJock> I'd really like to catch a taxi with somebody
<ogra> 1h break between the flights
<ogra> i was planning via malaga ... but somehow the plane was overbooked when i looked...
<ogra> seems i was to late ... so now i fly through palma
<ogra> LaserJock, but you dont want to go from madrid to sevilla by taxi
<ogra> do you ?
<LaserJock> no
<LaserJock> I was just wondering if people were going to take the same flight
<LaserJock> so it'd be easy
<cbx333> ogra, what breed are your pigs?
<LaserJock> ogra: what time to you arrive at sevilla?
<LaserJock> I arrive 15:00 on the 2nd
<LaserJock> gotta run for meetings, bbl
<LaserJock> if anybody is reaching sevilla at ^^ let me know
<ogra> cbx33, one US or CH Teddy and i dont know the english name for the other race, but a pretty common one
<ogra> Laser_away, i think i arrive around 16:30
<ogra> ah, apprently they are aclled abyssinian
<ogra> *called
<bettsp> Damn it, I got distracted by schoolin'
<bettsp> ogra: I got a LTSP Fat Client up and running per the spec
<bettsp> There's a few problems though; I tried to add it as notes to the LTSPFatClient page but it's locked cause it's a spec
<ogra> hmm, you should be able to edit the wikipage ...
<bettsp> Well anyways I'll just tell you
<bettsp> There's a few problems with D-Bus getting loaded, mainly because some paths in var it tries to write to are read-only
<bettsp> As a result hald doesn't get loaded either; not a big deal but it's something to fix to make the spec work seamlessly
<bettsp> It seems to be really slow to boot too, even though the server isn't working that hard
<bettsp> I've been tweaking NFS settings but I haven't got anything worth anything
<ogra> just add these paths to /etc/default/ltsp-client-setup :)
<ogra> in the client chroot
<ogra> so they get RW
<ogra> s/get/become/
<bettsp> ogra: Yeah, that's what I did (after picking out how ltsp works)
<ogra> yeah we need ore developer docs ...
<ogra> the opensuse people just start implementing our ltsp ... i'm trying to take notes abut their questions ...
<cbx333> ogra, our third is a boy shelty ;)
<bettsp> The other thing you might think about adding to Edubuntu in general is a GUI way to tweak what packages are installed on the client image
<cbx333> ogra, nice idea
<bettsp> (Maybe it already exists, I'm new to Edubuntu)
<ogra> no, it doesnt yet, but we're working on a spec for gutsy for full update-manager integration
<cbx333> ;)
<cbx333> that's gonna be cool
<ogra> so you will automatically get popups for security updates and will be able to upgrade the chroot via the dist-upgrade tool
<cbx333> two icons?
<ogra> nope
<highvoltage> hello cbx333 and ogra
<ogra> integrated in u-m
<cbx333> hey highvoltage
* cbx333 is working on a new project ;)
<ogra> funnily that requires synaptic in the chroot
<cbx333> hehehe
<ogra> so theoretically you *can* manage your packages in the chroot via that :)
<cbx333> hah
<cbx333> that's cool
<highvoltage> cbx333: weren't you going to announce them real soon? (you  said breviously you have a few real cool projects)
<cbx333> hehe
<cbx333> this ia a new one
<cbx333> I started it last night
<cbx333> almost v1 already
<highvoltage> another one!
<highvoltage> #!/bin/sh
<highvoltage> echo "cbx33 rulzzz!!!!1cos(0)!!"
<cbx333> ok I'll let you in ;)
<cbx333> it's called vcsfrenzy
<cbx333> a libnotify bind for bzr and svn
<highvoltage> aah
<cbx333> so that you get informed of updates to repos that are important to you
<bettsp> cbx333: That's cool
* ogra has split out the ltsp-build-client gui part from ltsp manager the last days
<highvoltage> libnotify, that's the gnome-bubble thing right?
<cbx333> yup
<cbx333> like update manager
<cbx333> very cool ;)
<cbx333> i needed it for work
<cbx333> svn is ready and done
<ogra> cbx33, does it integrate with LP ?
<cbx333> just need to do bzr
<ogra> so i can monitor the lp branches ....
<cbx333> yes
<cbx333> it will do
<cbx333> just copy the address into the config file
<cbx333> v2 will have an applet icon
<cbx333> so you can add the measily
<cbx333> and assign custom icons
<ogra> LP has an api for that  ... with rss ...
<cbx333> ahhh cool
<cbx333> i could make a distinction between LPbzr and bzr
<cbx333> will make LPbzr faster
<ogra> yu could show the short from of the recent revisions in a tooltip ...
<cbx333> yup
<cbx333> that's what it does
<ogra> nice
<cbx333> it already has a button in the tooltip to open up the full log message
<cbx333> "View Log"
<ogra> now just integrate with bzr-gtk and launch nautilus with the right branch  :)
<cbx333> heh
<cbx333> give me a chance ;)
<cbx333> i on;y started it yesterday
<ogra> ver.2.x  :)
<ogra> or 5.x :)
<cbx333> nah
<cbx333> 2.x
<cbx333> it's my next week project
<cbx333> which means it should be fairly complete by next week
<cbx333> v1 at least ;)
<cbx333> bzr will be able to do LP branchs
<cbx333> but the bzrLP (thanks to you ogra) will be faster;)
<cbx333> you can set poll time for each repo
<cbx333> and give each repo a custom name for the bubbles
<cbx333> was gonna add a view diff too
<ogra> you should be able to pull that in from bzr-gtk it has such functions
<cbx333> so does bzr in general
<ogra> no i mean bzr-gtk has a complete view diff function including syntax highlighting and gtk window :)
<cbx333> ahhh
<cbx333> awesome
<cbx333> maybe I'll look at that for v2
<ogra> you just need to call it, no need t code it :)
<cbx333> cool
<cbx333> does bzr-gtk come with libs then?
<ogra> no idea i have only tested it once ...
<cbx333> ok
<ogra> somehow i find using bzr in a gui strange ...
<cbx333> hehe
<ogra> notifications would be cool though
* cbx333 often finds using a gui strange
<cbx333> awesome
<cbx333> well keep it under ya haet ;)
<cbx333> will be blogging soon
<cbx333> I have the bzr code almost read
<cbx333> y
<cbx333> thanks for the encouragement guys
<cbx333> I'll be looking for beta testers ;)
<cbx333> funnily enough ogra is already down on the list.....HAHAH
<highvoltage> 1/win 11
<ogra> 2/loose 22 ?
<highvoltage> ogra: heh :)
<highvoltage> ogra: are you still envolved with debian in any way?
<ogra> still ?
<ogra> i never was
<ogra> i was using it excessive over years, but never developed any debian stuff
<highvoltage> ah ok. somehoe I got the idea that you were involved with debian just before joining ubuntu. probably because you were a debian user :)
<ogra> i earned my bread with it :)
<ogra> but actually the conference in mataro was my second OSS conference ever ...
<ogra> without going to conferences you dont get your key signed ...
<ogra> without key you are rather non existent in the debian world if it comes to developemnt
<ogra> (indeed you can send patches or so)
<ogra> but i'm considering becoming DD
<highvoltage> ah yes, that reminds me, I'll have to print some ID copies with gpg fingerprints
<ogra> we have so much ltp stuff that i'd like to get my hands n in debian as well
<ogra> *on
<highvoltage> long-term, I'd like to become a DD. even if it means I'll only become one when I'm 50.
<ogra> *ltsp
<highvoltage> cool :)
<highvoltage> I see debian's LTSP uses quite a bit less ram than in Ubuntu. how is that so? I thought they were pretty much the same?
<ogra> vagrant cascadian (the guy who maintains the debian ltsp branch, you will meet him in spain) maintains ltsp and all its friends, but is no DD
<ogra> well
<ogra> debian uses a debian kernel, we use an ubuntu kernel
<highvoltage> ah ok :)
<ogra> X is pretty much the same ...
<ogra> ldm as well
<highvoltage> ubuntu kernels are quite big.
<ogra> oh, and indeed you can only compare debian with a pre edgy version of ubuntus ltsp
<highvoltage> I think my K&R C book has arrived. went to the post office today but it was closed because of the public holiday today.
<ogra> debian was frozen for nearly 6 months
<highvoltage> heh, that's an entire release cycle on the ubuntu side :)
<ogra> it had package version 0.99 ... edgy already had 0.127
<ogra> indeed there was some stuff backported ...
<ogra> but debian has no localdev suport out of the box ... still uses esd etc
<ogra> oh, and comes with no printing support at all
<Laser_away> ogra: hmm, so if I wait 1.5 hrs I can meet you at the Sevilla airport
<highvoltage> ah now that I see bluekuja I remember I had a question
<Cnl_Delta> hmm big room, hi there
<highvoltage> ogra: bluekuja is accepted in edubuntu-members because he's already an ubuntu-membet, right?
<bluekuja> highvoltage: yes
<highvoltage> bluekuja: how have you been?
<ogra> Laser_away, yep
<bluekuja> we talked about it in the previsious meeting
<ogra> hi Cnl_Delta
<ogra> highvoltage, yep
<bluekuja> on 25 of april
<bluekuja> with RichEd
<bluekuja> and oliver
<highvoltage> aah, I just realised I missed a meeting :(
<Laser_away> tsk tsk
<ogra> highvoltage, we agreed (EC) in the meeting that it needs approval from one EC member to become edubuntu-member if youre already ubuntu member
<Cnl_Delta> hey there ogra, was curious to know if edubuntu can run on  a P@ with 128 MB of RAM (8 GB HDD)
<Cnl_Delta> *P2
<ogra> no
<highvoltage> we've had lots of public holidays this month, it messes with my weeks. I don't know when Wednesdays are anymore :/
<highvoltage> ogra: that sounds good
<ogra> well, it could probably *run* but it will be far from usable
<ogra> Cnl_Delta, get 128M more :)
<Cnl_Delta> hehe
<Cnl_Delta> i got old folk and really young kids using a pc like that
<highvoltage> Cnl_Delta: you could try Xubuntu and install the educational applications on top of that.
<ogra> memory is essential in linux ... CPU speed is less important
<Cnl_Delta> thought edubuntu would be more useful than win 98 (its not used right now)
<highvoltage> Cnl_Delta: 128MB is also a bit little for Xubuntu, but it will certainly run better than a full gnome desktop
<bluekuja> highvoltage: everything ok now?
<ogra> yeah, what highvoltage says ... xubuntu is probably the better choice for that HW
<highvoltage> bluekuja: more or less :)
<Cnl_Delta> i got the alternate installer of Xubuntu and have done a test install on my system (1 GB RAM)
<ogra> or run it as thin client :)
<bluekuja> highvoltage: i forgot you lost that meeting
<Cnl_Delta> hmm
<bluekuja> highvoltage: anyway you can check logs to check the new "policy"
<Cnl_Delta> i just thought of Xubuntu and haven't read about thin client stuff
<Cnl_Delta> *thought of Edubuntu i mean
<Cnl_Delta> I was looking for an OS that just to run a web browser and E-Mail that was easy enough for a 60 year old to learn how to use
<highvoltage> Cnl_Delta: is the P2 on the same network as your 1GB RAM system?
<highvoltage> Cnl_Delta: the Xubuntu CD gives you an LTSP install option too, if you install from the alternate cd
* ogra wonders if anyone tested that before release on xubuntu 
<Cnl_Delta> hmm
<Cnl_Delta> once i get my BIOS fixed
<Cnl_Delta> i have 3.0 AMD64 with 1 GB of RAM to spare
<Cnl_Delta> ang 80 GB HDD
<ogra> that would make a perfect edubuntu ltsp server
<Cnl_Delta> so yes it I could have it on the same network
<cbx33> w00t
<mario> cbx33, :)
<cliebow> yippee
#edubuntu 2007-04-28
<Dimicu1> Hi guys, mind to help me a sec.. where can i find information about my usb ? think i have messed up mine when i specified a wrong mount point
<cliebow> maybe umount /dev/sd*
<Dimicu1> well the thing is that i had a usb hdd inserted. and i took properties on it and changed mount point on it. after that its mezzed up prolly because the mount point i choosed was mezzed up. and now everytime i insert it i get a strange error message about the mount point
<Dimicu1> i can mount it and i cant unmount it
<Dimicu1> cant
<Dimicu1> so is there maybee so that that USb module has a code string in it that when i use it it gonna moount it on the place i specified
<mario> where did cbx33 ran now
<mario> ergh
<mario> evil him
<nickzxcv> is it possible to install edubuntu from pxe?
<nickzxcv> supposedly I need the alternate cd but there doesn't seem to be one for edubuntu
<nickzxcv> I would think pxe install would be a very common situation in schools, maybe even more common than pxe-booting thin clients
<nickzxcv> where I went to school at least, they used norton ghost for everything to install on all the workstation hard drives
<LaserJock> nickzxcv: I'm not sure how a pe install would work
<LaserJock> nickzxcv: btw, in Edubuntu the Server CD is like an alternate CD in Ubuntu
<nickzxcv> LaserJock: cool, so can I get a edubuntu desktop install from pxe booting with the files on the server cd?
<Laser_away> nickzxcv: I have no idea really, but I suspect not
<Burgundavia> Laser_away: go to bed :)_
<Laser_away> Burgundavia: you first
<Laser_away> ;-)
<Burgundavia> heh
* Laser_away is leaving now
<mpytasz> ping ogra
<jelkner> i just dist-upgraded from edgy to feisty
<jelkner> everything seemed to go well, and the server works fine
<jelkner> but clients won't boot
<jelkner> i get:
<jelkner> Your /etc/fstab does not contain the fsck passno field.
<jelkner> and a bunch of syslod: /var/log/<log files> : Permission denied
<jelkner> anyone familiar with this?
<nixternal> ogra: the classroom awaits your talk :)
<juliux_hsv> !seen ogra
<ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about seen ogra - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
<sacater> highvoltage: hey
<sacater> highvoltage: any news i should know on that 2nd May gathering
<jelkner> never mind
<jelkner> rebuilding the client environment did the trick
<highvoltage> hey sacater
<highvoltage> sacater: I'm not sure. but I could pass on any information as soon as I have it.
<sacater> highvoltage: btw, im now using gizmo, add sacater@ekiga.net if you wish to call me
#edubuntu 2007-04-29
<Bhaskar1> i have USB Printer of Canon LBP 2900, how can i configure in Edubuntu 7.04 LTSP5.0
<Burgundavia> Bhaskar1: have you verified that it works in Linux via linuxprinting.org?
<Bhaskar1> ya
<Bhaskar1> Burgundavia, i have to configure in lts.conf or not , and how?
* Starting logfile irclogs/edubuntu.log
<juliux> morning
<mario> hi
<cliebow>   ho
<gmanic> hi. just upgraded to feisty according to wiki, but now my desktop on the client ist _very_ slow. proper xorg-server (ati) is running. hints?
<cmonkey> im an edubuntu noob, but it looks like nobody else is around.  did you update the NFS root?
<juliux> what was the question?
<cmonkey> [11:45]  <gmanic> hi. just upgraded to feisty according to wiki, but now my desktop on the client ist _very_ slow. proper xorg-server (ati) is running. hints?
<gmanic> update the nfs root? you mean build a new client? sure did that.
<juliux> cmonkey, thxs
<cmonkey> gmanic, i was just thinking of the instructions at the bottom of this: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/HowToCookEdubuntu/Chapters/LTSPManagement
<gmanic> cmonkey: yes, i did that. it's part of the update-instructions as refered to in https://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuLTSPUpgradeNotes (although that notes are for edgy :-)
<gmanic> cmonkey: thx anyway.
<mario> hi folks
<highvoltage> hello cbx33
<cbx33> hey highvoltage
<juliux> hey cbx33
<cbx33> hey juliux
<cbx33> anyone done any applets for gnome?
<juliux> not yet
<cbx33> hheh
<highvoltage> I've done it once before from example but can't remember how or from which example anymore
<highvoltage> ah, I think it was from a tutorial from the learningpython blog
<cbx33> ahhh
<highvoltage> http://www.learningpython.com/ <- was somewhere on there, fwiw :)
<cbx33> heh
<mario> cbx33, poke
<highvoltage> pygi brothers
<pygi> highvoltage, :)
<pygi> highvoltage, how are you?
<highvoltage> pygi: doing very well, for a change :)
<pygi> highvoltage, yay, glad to hear =)
<highvoltage> I can't remember when I was last so organised. It feels good.
<pygi> ^_^
<highvoltage> my K&R C book /still/ hasn't arrived. I hope it's here when I come back from Spain. well, it has to be, otherwise it exceeded the delivery span.
<pygi> hehe :) I have that one for a long time =)
<mjg> Is there a way in Edubuntu to force the logout of a student/user after a specified time period?
<Burgundavia> mjg: timeoutd
<mjg> Do you know if it resets after every login?
<mjg> Or after 24 hours (for example)
<Burgundavia> http://packages.ubuntu.com/feisty/admin/timeoutd
<mjg> I'll research. Thanks for your help.
<LaserJock> highvoltage: ping?
#edubuntu 2008-04-21
<matgate> hi there
<matgate> I am a new migrated to ubunto, and have some problems, can someone guide me?
<matgate> can someone have to time to help me out, i will be really thankful
<matgate> * anyone here interested to help me?
<juliux> try #ubuntu for general ubuntu support
<matgate> ok thanks
<primary> hiya our terminals do not recognise usb devices all users have usb privilages etc
<Muhammad_Saad> Hello, How do I recover damaged Thunderbird profile? Is there any channel on this server where I can get an answer?
<nixternal_> anyone feel like providing an Edubuntu talk at OpenWeek next week?
<nixternal_> https://wiki.kubuntu.org/UbuntuOpenWeek
<nixternal_> we are trying to fill the TBDs on that page
<nixternal_> it would be a great time to let people know of the changes with Edubuntu -> Ubuntu Education Edition
<nixternal_> ogra and RichEd ^^ :)
<ogra> nixternal_, i already told jorge i'm only available f it really is urgent ...
<ogra> i mean really really urgent
 * nixternal_ will make it urgent :)
<ogra> like life saving for anyone ...
<nixternal> hahaha
<ogra> i'm totaly exhauseted, working through the nights since two weeks
<nixternal> ogra: voluntell someone to do a talk :)
<nixternal> ya, I hear you there
<ogra> well RichEd would surely be the best person to talk about the name changes but not sure thats enough for openweek
<ogra> theer s usually a lot of tech related questions
<nixternal> true
<nixternal> RichEd could talk about the new direction though :)
<sandrossv> edubuntu use GNOME, KDE ... ?
<stgraber> gnome
<sandrossv> hmm
<sandrossv> ty
#edubuntu 2008-04-22
<moritz> Hi
<moritz> I'm running Edubuntu 7.10 with LTSP.  It occured that for a certain user several processes survived
<moritz> although the user isn't logged in anymore.
<moritz> looks like a "zombie session".
<moritz> is that a known problem?  is there a known fix?
<moritz> ah, this seems related: https://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuResetDesktopSession
<johnny> moritz, i just pkill -u <user>
<johnny> you might want to look into an app called gnome watchdog tho
<Muhammad_Saad> !info tofrodos
<ubotu> tofrodos (source: tofrodos): Converts DOS <-> Unix text files, alias tofromdos. In component main, is optional. Version 1.7.6-2 (gutsy), package size 16 kB, installed size 68 kB
<georgy_28> Hello, I have thin-client server up and running. Every thing runs well. The only think it's the greeter. Is it possible to have this greeter in french ?
<msaul> I have upgraded to Edubuntu 8.04 beta, just wondering when official release will be available for download...
<msaul> I noticed that Hardy Heron is nice...
<msaul> Only thing I really notice that doesn't work is multimedia center app called elisa..
<stgraber> msaul: thursday
<msaul> awesome - thanks :)
<Aprendiz_escola> BOm dia
<Aprendiz_escola> AlguÃ© poderia me ajudar com Edubuntu
<Kamping_Kaiser> please dont ask things in multiple channels at the same time.
<Kamping_Kaiser> especially for different distributions
<dx9s_work> anybody around?
<wwwojcieh> yep
<dx9s_work> next question... anybody (including wwwojcieh) have experience w/ LTSP (v5) and in particular ltspfs and the correct way for a person to "unmount" a (let us say) usb thumb drive from the client?
<wwwojcieh> no
<dx9s_work> for anybody reading (regardless of gnome or command line) 'umount /media/{username}/usbdisk-sdX1' yeilds "/media/{username}/usbdisk-sdX1 is not in the fstab (and you are not root)"
<dx9s_work> I think the recent changes from moving the plugdev stuff out so it doesn't touch fstab **might** be an issue... but I am not knowledgable on plugdev stuff
#edubuntu 2008-04-23
<pips1> hi there
<pips1> is there a meeting coming up?
<stgraber> good question
<pips1> hi stgraber
<pips1> RichEd-1: ping ?
<pips1> we need to update the website for the release
<RichEd-1> hi pips1 & stgraber
<pips1> hi
<RichEd> pips1: well remembered ...
<pips1> i very hard pressed for time
<RichEd> i presume there is a meeting ... mr ogra dear sir ... you round and about ?
<RichEd> pips1: me too ... and energy
<stgraber> probably busy with ISO testing :)
<pips1> I can't spend the usual 4-5 hours doing the update on the site.. :-/
<RichEd> stgraber: the fun never stops
<RichEd> speak of the devil / ogre :)
<RichEd> we meeting now ollie ?
<pips1> what I really need is a finished text for the download page that I can then format nicely and done.
<RichEd> pips1: if we can list what needs to be done ... i can work with people like highvoltage
<stgraber> RichEd: the good point is that we have less edubuntu images so less testing needed here (but we now have Ubuntu-Studio ...)
<RichEd> he is always a good person to volunteer in his absence
<RichEd> ogra: meeting ? or are you dead busy ?
<ogra> RichEd, what would you want to discuss ?
 * pips1 notices stgraber mentions ubuntu-studio
<RichEd> website updates, press release ... party balloons and candles ... release stuff
<pips1> party balloons :-)
 * RichEd just *knows* that pips1 will "steal" one of our balloons to take home for his kid
<ogra> i'm pretty busy with cmpc installer bugs (apparently intel found out that you can *test* th eimage yesterday) i'm drowning in feedback since the conf call
<pips1> o_o
 * ogra sighs ... 
<stgraber> ogra: uhm, aren't test images available for months ? :)
<ogra> would have been nice if they started that a month or two ago, not at dawn of the release where i'm busy with other stuff ...
<ogra> stgraber, right
<ogra> stgraber, i wouldnt complain if they wouldnt actualy find serious bugs :P
<RichEd> ogra: same as usual :) :(
<stgraber> yes, and archive being frozen + everyone busy ISO testing doesn't really help I guess
<ogra> RichEd, not really
 * pips1 starts to think about the list of things that need done for the website
<ogra> RichEd, i have 24h left for changes
<stgraber> pips1: the css would need a good bugfix update
<pips1> erm... we might as well move to #ubuntu-meeting ?
<RichEd> pips1: if you can mail me, and cc highvoltage ... then we can call off the meeting in the interest of higher priorities
<stgraber> content/screenshot too
<pips1> ah
<RichEd> pips1: no need to move to the channel i think ... i'll be around and about here ... so ping for comments, or mail me a list of what needs to be done
<RichEd> i'll rope in some help ... and let you know what we can or can't take care of
<pips1> stgraber: well, I suppose I'll make a list of 1.) crucial short-time update needs and 2.) notes about things that ideally need updating... I'm really pressed for time
<RichEd> pips1: thanks ... highvoltage will also have some ideas / comments i am sure
<ogra> btw, https://wiki.edubuntu.org/HardyClassroomServer and https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/LTSPQuickInstall are ready so far
<pips1> *click* *click*
<pips1> ogra: excellent, thanks
<pips1> quick question: I can't find oo.org Database in my edubuntu 8.04 installation?
<pips1> ?
<ogra> pips1, ask calc in -devel
<ogra> some oo.o bits had to be dropped for space reasons, nit sure which
<ogra> *not
<RichEd> ogra: did you see the price jump for cmpc gen 2 ?
<RichEd> 	First Classmates available for pre-order in US (for $500!)			
<pips1> right. Open office database was dropped from ubuntu cd, AFAIK
<RichEd> that from chris dawson ... zdnet
<RichEd> a week after he reviewed the HP education offerring ... which he commented on as great, but at around $400, he'd take 2 classmates
<ogra> RichEd, my dual CPU laptop with 2G ram and 120G HDD costs 599â¬
<ogra> i doubt that really cuts it ... tsk
<pips1> looks like blender was dropped from edu add-on cd ?
<ogra> pips1, three releases ago, yes
<pips1> oops
<pips1> :-)
<ogra> :)
<RichEd> yep ... he also said about the HP that $400 was close to a real notebook at around $ 600
<pips1> that web page on e.org really needs an update :-)
<RichEd> so $ 500 for classmate makes it an expensive toy with a small screen ...
<ogra> and bad resolution
<RichEd> pips1: it needs a full overhaul, not a face-lift :)
<ogra> i have the actual gen 2.0 here with HDD and big screen
<RichEd> by big do you mean 9"
<ogra> using still 800x480 and looking totally clunky
<ogra> yeah
<ogra> but it doesnt have a higher resolution
<RichEd> well 9" aint very big in many people's minds ...
<RichEd> (ask madonna ;)
<pips1> pfft
<ogra> that really depends on the angle you look at it ...
<RichEd> mr 12" pips1 scoffs at a mere 9"
<pips1> Ubuntu Education Edition 8.04 - Linux for Young Human Beings - new slogan? anyone?
<RichEd> ogra ... not many girls believe that old line any more  ;)
<pips1> keep slogan?
<ogra> "Educating Human Beings" ?
<RichEd> pips1: we'd need to get some go ahead to change i think ... but well spotted ... let's give it some thought and come up with some suggestions
<RichEd> ogra: sounds a bit klunky ...
<pips1> What is the ubuntu slogan?
<ogra> yeah
<ogra> Linux for Human Beings
<pips1> so that hasn't changed, then
<ogra> Education for Human Beings
<RichEd> so we need to stick to that with adding one word or so
<pips1> hmm
<ogra> Linux for Educated Human Beings
<pips1> I like the second suggestion better
<RichEd> Linux for Growing Human Being
<pips1> nah
<RichEd> +s
<RichEd> Linux for Learning Human Beings
<highvoltage> hi
<stgraber> hi highvoltage
<pips1> I prefere the "Educated" over "Learning"
<pips1> hi highvoltage
<pips1> *prefer
<highvoltage> aplologies, deadlines looming and I thought the meeting was at 10
<pips1> me also got deadlines looming :-/
<RichEd> Linux for Educated Human Beings <- sounds like they are already educated ... i.e. like "It's Linux for our intelligent elitist folk ... not the great umwashed commonners"
<pips1> unwashed hehe
<RichEd> said in a WW II British accent
 * RichEd has to collect a kid from a cancelled soccer practise
<RichEd> back in 15
<pips1> cu
<highvoltage> ogra: how are you feeling about tomorrow?
<RichEd> pips1: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Great_Unwashed <- see here ... an established english expression
<ogra> highvoltage, from an edubuntu and ltsp POV i'm fine cmpc keeps me busy though
<pips1> RichEd: stop throwing funny things at me!
<pips1> Hoi polloi
<pips1> When I was a film critic, I actually met a british director who had made a short form title Hoi Polloi
<pips1> ah wikipedia even has the link right there! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hoi_Polloi_%281935_film%29
<pips1> looks like another film tho
<pips1> anyway, back to work
<highvoltage> ogra: ok. when the new build with suspend is ready, let me know and I'll test.
<ogra> highvoltage, thats ready since ages
<ogra> 7th i think
<ogra> err
<ogra> 17th
<ogra> should be 17.1
<highvoltage> I think the one I had was 17
<highvoltage> had/have
<pips1> qcad is new on the cd, right?
<pips1> what else is new? rasmol? denemo? iTalc?
<pips1> highvoltage: I'm going through the list of edubuntu apps on http://www.edubuntu.org/UsingEdubuntu
<pips1> ... trying to figure what what has changed
<highvoltage> pips1: good. tirion is also going through screenshots and generating new ones. it's a pity he doesn't do IRC
<highvoltage> (well not much, anyway)
<stgraber> pips1: iTalc is new
<stgraber> IIRC we already had rasmol in Gutsy
<pips1> ic
<pips1> i thought that was only recently packaged by laserjock
<pips1> dunno
<pips1> what about kwordquiz?
<pips1> I guess I can use packages.ubuntu.org to find out...
<stgraber> pips1: you probably can diff the depends of the -addon packages from Gutsy to Hardy
<pips1> stgraber: erm, how exactly would i be able to do that?
<stgraber> pips1: the package list in edubuntu-addon is exactly the same !!!
<pips1> ?
<stgraber> stgraber@castiana:~/diff$ diff old-pkg new-pkg
<stgraber> stgraber@castiana:~/diff$
<pips1> strange, that doesn't sound right
<stgraber> according to changelog for the -addon only some icon/category and packaging stuff no package change
<pips1> we *know* that italc is new... no? you packaged it, no?
<stgraber> italc is not in -addon but in edubuntu-desktop
<ogra> -master is in -addon though
<ogra> users wont see anything of the client
<stgraber> pips1: http://changelogs.ubuntu.com/changelogs/pool/main/e/edubuntu-meta/edubuntu-meta_1.59/changelog
<pips1> *click*
<stgraber> ogra: it's not in one of the edubuntu-addon-* package though right ?
<stgraber> ogra: it's just in the addon CD seed ?
<ogra> yep
<ogra> which is sufficient
<stgraber> ok, so my diff is right. the -addon-* meta packages haven't changed
<ogra> right
<ogra> only the seeds have
<ogra> well, i dropped two empty categories from the addon package
 * pips1 never understood this whole seeds proces
<ogra> so they did change :) minimally
<pips1> *process
<pips1> so what are you saying? nothing has changed from gutsy to hardy?
<pips1> ;-P
<stgraber> hang on, I'm trying to find an easy way of getting what has changed
<pips1> ogra: since this is a new LTS, what will happen to dapper?
<stgraber> still supported
<pips1> will all the dapper iso's be pulled from the servers?
<pips1> ah
<pips1> right
<pips1> there needs to be some overlap
<stgraber> Dapper came out with 3 years desktop support and 5 years server support
<stgraber> you can't change that two years after
<pips1> right
<pips1> but as i undertood, edubuntu 6.06. LTS "standalone distro" only qualified for 3 years support...
<pips1> not 5 years
<pips1> right, ogra?
<ogra> right
<ogra> single pieces of it are 5 years
<stgraber> edubuntu is desktop so only 3 years
<ogra> but the distro as a whole isnt
<pips1> well, there are those "single pieces" :-)
<ogra> i.e. you can still run the kernel and dhcpd :)
<pips1> wow :-)
<ogra> they would be supported longer, but the desktop and ltsp bits wouldnt
<pips1> how cool is that?
<pips1> !
<pips1> ;-)
<ogra> the support is defined on a per package set base ....
<ogra> -server has 5 years of support
<ogra> packages in -server inherit that
<stgraber> pips1: https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-core-dev/ubuntu-seeds/edubuntu.hardy
<pips1> so basically, all edubuntu 6.06 LTS deployments now have 1 year to update to 8.04 LTS
<stgraber> yes
<ogra> right
<pips1> we need to mention that on the website
<pips1> stgraber: thanks for the above link, but it's all rather cryptic to me :-)
<stgraber> pips1: so basically : Hardy is now an addon, italc instead of tcm, version upgrade for the other packages
<stgraber> ogra: any major change/add ?
<pips1> we should have two sets of information: 1.) what changed from last release, for release notes, 2.) a complete list of all the cool apps currently shipped as "ubuntu education edition"
<ogra> stgraber, new artwork indeed, but thats about it i think
<stgraber> pips1: I can give you 2) as I have the addon CD here
<ogra> we need to point out the ltsp change very prominent
<pips1> yep, both in release notes and on website
<ogra> edubuntu is mostly known for its ltsp implementation people need to grasp that they dont lose anything
<pips1> right
<pips1> ltsp is in "core" ubuntu now, no harm in that
<pips1> ltsp will continue to mature, but the plan is to focus on education apps more ..
<stgraber> pips1: atomix, dia, edubuntu artwork, gcompris, epiphany, denemo, gnupain, gobby, gvim, inkscape, italc, kalzium, keduca, kino, kstars, kverbos, kvoctrain, liferea, gnome lockdown, qcad, rasmol, screem, scribus, tuxmath, tuxpaint, tuxtype, xaos
<pips1> gnupain sounds fun
<pips1> for aspiring doctors
<stgraber> pips1: that's what the user can install from gnome-app-install when he inserts the CD
<pips1> thanks
<ogra> pips1, you plan a complete release announcement atm ?
<ogra> slangasek asked if he could link that from the official announcement
<ogra> do we have an url ?
<ogra> (or future url)
<pips1> future url could be http://www.edubuntu.org/news/8.04-release, but we should coordinate with ubuntu.com, i.e. what their url will look like
<pips1> have a look at http://www.edubuntu.org/news/7.10-release
<pips1> the above future URL was for the *tour* the future release notes URL could be: http://www.edubuntu.org/ReleaseNotes/8.04
<pips1> ogra: do you know where i can reach newz2000 ?
<ogra> <slangasek> ogra: ok, thanks, will use that url as a placeholder for now
<pips1> he used to have his own irc channel around release time
<ogra> ( http://www.edubuntu.org/news/8.04-release)
<pips1> ok, that url is for the feature tour, though
<pips1> release notes should be :
<pips1> http://www.edubuntu.org/ReleaseNotes/8.04
<ogra> pips1, meet slangasek ;)
 * slangasek waves :)
<slangasek> pips1: hi, so the question is, what page on edubuntu.org should I be linking to from the release announcement mail, as the top-level Edubuntu release announcement
<pips1> http://www.edubuntu.org/ReleaseNotes/8.04
<ogra> pips1, thats the anouncement ? or ony the release notes ?
<ogra> *only
<ogra> RichEd, meep, meep ^^^^
<pips1> ogra: now you got me...
 * pips1 re-reads the question of slangasek and feels daft
<pips1> sorry for the confusion
<pips1> I think the release announcement should be:
<pips1>  http://www.edubuntu.org/news/8.04-release
<ogra> you said thats the tour before
<pips1> analog to the 7.10 release:
<pips1> http://www.edubuntu.org/news/7.10-release
<pips1> oh.
<pips1> so what is the difference between the tour and the release announcement, then?
<pips1> and how does ubuntu.com do it?
<pips1> basically, we can set the URL to whatever we want (with a path alias in drupal)
<pips1> we just have to make our mind up :-)
<pips1> hold on, sorry guys, I need to look after my son for a moment :-/
 * highvoltage is back
<slangasek> pips1: we've just had a nomenclature change on the Ubuntu side per marketing, so rather than "tour" we're now calling it an "overview", which refers to this document: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/HardyHeron/RC
<slangasek> pips1: and the release notes are this: http://www.ubuntu.com/getubuntu/releasenotes/804
<slangasek> pips1: but optimally, what I'd be linking to from the release announcement is some sort of Edubuntu 8.04 announcement text, since the per-flavor detail in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/HardyHeron/ReleaseAnnouncement is deliberately sparse
<slangasek> http://www.edubuntu.org/news/7.10-release looks like a pretty good example of what I'm thinking of, yes
 * pips1 looks at the urls
<pips1> slangasek: ok, so you'll use http://www.edubuntu.org/news/8.04-release for the url in the release announcement mail for the Ubuntu Education Edition 8.04 "overview"
<slangasek> that sounds reasonable, yes
<ogra> <newz2000> ogra: have pips join #ubuntu-matt
<ogra> theer you fgot him
<ogra> but that looks like you guys have sorted it already
<RichEd> pips1: confirmed that you should use:   http://www.edubuntu.org/news/8.04-release
<RichEd> i'll send you the text in an our or two
<RichEd> i''ll CC ogra for an accuracy comment review ... i want to make sure i have the install options flexibilty clear and realisic :)
<ogra> well, the instal options are: install *any* ubunu desktop, pop in addon
<ogra> *ubuntu :)
<ogra> there are not many other variations :)
<RichEd> ogra: what options does the user get then ... not just install edubuntu ? they are also able to chose components / application ?
<RichEd> or is that only planned for the 8.10
<ogra> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/HardyClassroomServer#head-7d164dd6ce5d6e99bc8403e65eb2286fbd87f749
<ogra> it operates on any ubuntu desktop that way
 * RichEd loads the link and makes coffee ... a sensible multi-task
<ogra> with net connection that enables the desktop to upll packages from the net additionally it might work with xubuntu/kubuntu as well
<ogra> but the officially supported setup that definately needs no net connection bases on having an ubuntu desktop
<ogra> all others will need network access because they will miss the deskop base needed by some packages we ship
<RichEd> ogra: thanks ... the add-remove apps from CD was what i was referring to ...
<RichEd> for 8.10 we should also consider a few recommended bundle options
<ogra> indeed
<ogra> make a spec, i'll add it to the team wiki
<RichEd> i.e. apps for young kids ... apps for teens etc.
<RichEd> so that a newbie dad installing on his home PC can just click a category and not have to consider what his offspring is ready for or grown past
<ogra> coding wise thats trivial, but it will need icons etc
<ogra> so a spec should be feasable
<RichEd> the best kind of feature ... trivial code, big user impact
<RichEd> good leverage of resource time
<highvoltage> RichEd: sies!
<highvoltage> RichEd: (unless you refer to time/money, and not people)
<RichEd> wtf ... you mean "appeals to oversized users" ?
<RichEd> or "large collision with users"
<ogra> large collision with oversized users ?
<RichEd> i guess "appeals to fat people" would not work as a sales bullet point
<RichEd> nor would "gives you a good smack"
<ogra> edubuntu - "teaches even fat people"
<highvoltage> RichEd: heh, no. calling people resources :)
<RichEd> highvoltage: i was referring to oliver's time ... like gold and diamonds, it is valuable, and limited
<RichEd> what should i call him ? smokey sweat labour ?
<highvoltage> RichEd: :)
<RichEd> "will work for tobacco and internet connection"
<RichEd> "odd hours not a problem"
<highvoltage> perfect!
<highvoltage> pips1: are you around?
<pips1> sort of
<pips1> I'm babysitting my son
<highvoltage> ok. you know that css bug in the fridge theme where short pages don't look good?
<mcksean> hey all -- are you planning for some edubuntu sessions @ ubuntu live this summer?
<highvoltage> RichEd should be able to answer that!
 * RichEd is out to smoke ... back in a fag's time
<pips1> highvoltage: regarding the css bug: yes, I noticed short pages looking bad... do you have a fix for it?
<highvoltage> pips1: I was going to ask you if you have any ideas :)
<pips1> um, no
<highvoltage> ogra: is it reasonable to say that the edubuntu add-on cd will be released withing the next 24hrs?
<ogra> pretty sure, yes
<highvoltage> J to the S to the G to the O
 * ogra curses his touchscreen
 * pips1 rubs his eyes
<ogra> everytime i want to wipe something off my screen i move windows or click something
<pips1> hey jsgotangco
<pips1> ogra: don't eat and work at the same time?
<jsgotangco> hi pips1
<jsgotangco> highvoltage: are we there yet? hehe
<ogra> pips1, i smoke ....
<pips1> ahh
<highvoltage> jsgotangco: yep!
<RichEd> ogra ? you back ?
<ogra> back ? from what ?
<ogra> i wont go away ...
<RichEd> i smoke
<RichEd> or was that a reference to your hot programming ?
<ogra> no to the dirt on my screen i wanted to wipe off
<ogra> vs pips1's assuption of sesame seeds from munching wth open mouth :)
 * pips1 chuckles as he is munching on japanese rice crackers
<RichEd> is this okay by you ?>
<RichEd> 8.04 bring the first release of the restructured Edubuntu - now known
<RichEd> as the Ubuntu Eucation Edition. The education desktop and application
<RichEd> suite now installs as an add-on to a standard Ubuntu desktop, or
<RichEd> individual Education applications can be selected for easy install
<RichEd> from the CD.
<ogra> sounds a bit lonish, like you couldnt take breath during saying it, but technically its correct
<RichEd> that's intended for a bridge sentence in the ubuntu announcement
<RichEd> okay then ... steve and i can play with grammar, but that gets the main point across ?
<pips1> "application suite" sounds a bit nebulous? but otherwise it think it's clear
<ogra> yup, its fine
<pips1> it think therefore it is!
<RichEd> i think
<RichEd> pips1: i need to make it clear that it is the edubuntu bundle on the CD ... not the whole education repository
<RichEd> hence the suite is what we have selected as a good base set
<RichEd> make sense ?
<pips1> it makes sense
<pips1> why not use bundle?
<pips1> instead of "suite"?
<RichEd> so that covers ... if you go hit me with edubuntu, you get the suite
<pips1> dunno
<RichEd> i you want to select, you can chose from the suite
<RichEd> using bundle i think does not make the selection point clear
<RichEd> comments welcome
<RichEd> how's this ?
<RichEd> 8.04 bring the first release of the restructured Edubuntu - now known
<RichEd> as the Ubuntu Education Edition. The education desktop and application
<RichEd> bundle now installs as an add-on to a standard Ubuntu desktop, or
<RichEd> individual Education applications may be selected from the bundle for
<RichEd> easy install from the CD.
<RichEd> s/installs/install/ grandma change
<pips1> hmm
 * pips1 looks up bundle in the thesaurus
<RichEd> suite i guess does kind of imply "from one company" ... or not
<pips1> well, I only ever read the word suite in the combination "office suite"
<RichEd> lounge suite
<RichEd> hotel suite
<pips1> so in that respect, yes, it sounds a bit like "from one producer"
<RichEd> he wore a badly spelt suite
<pips1> what about "collection" ?
<RichEd> we often talk about the bundle ... so i'd need some convincing that that is not the right word
<pips1> ach, we're nitpicking... suite or bundle is probably just fine..
 * RichEd takes a break
<RichEd> famil
<RichEd> family
<pips1> "suite" just sounds a bit snobbish? marketing speak?
<pips1> and "bundle", conversely, sounds a bit like "super savers deal" from your local low cost ... get 2 for 1
<ogra> enerprise bundle :)
<pips1> (suite means "a series of things", BTW)
<pips1> compilation? --> as in "the best of"?
<pips1> nah
<pips1> shipit will provide the add-on cd only, right? so really, we need to tell them to order both an ubuntu cd and a edubuntu cd, seperately?
<pips1> ohhhhhh
<pips1> Edubuntu Alternate CD isn't available through shipit at all?!?
<pips1> s/Edubuntu Alternate CD/Ubuntu Alternate CD/
<pips1> ogra: ^^^^
<pips1> ?
<ogra> no idea
<ogra> oh, ubuntu alternate ? no
<ogra> i dont think so
<pips1> so people wont be able to get a alternate & add-on shipped to them...
<ogra> hmm, might be, i dont really know i mst admit
 * ogra points to rich for business stuff
<pips1> ogra: so what is the story with the "content-server" and edubuntu? What about Moodle?
<ogra> apt-e install edubuntu-server
<ogra> i didnt manage to split/rname te package yet, in intrepid there will be a separate content-server package that edubuntu-server will depend on
<ogra> currently edubuntu-server == edubuntu-content-server
<pips1> and what services does it provide?
<pips1> moodle? something else?
<ogra> nope
<ogra> a siple moodle setup atm
<pips1> what do you mean by simple?
<ogra> apt-et install edubuntu-server , amswer somequestions, have moodle running
<pips1> if you install edubuntu-server, will that moodle server be available publicly? or is it firewalled off and only available on the LAN?
<ogra> depends on your answers :)
 * pips1 goes ahead and does apt-get instal edubuntu-server on his test box
<ogra> its just depending on  set of packages, nothing more
<ogra> *a set
<RichEd> ogra / pips : new improved shorter sweeter ...
<RichEd> 8.04 brings a restructure of Edubuntu into the Ubuntu Education Edition.
<RichEd> The education desktop and application bundle now install as an add-on
<RichEd> to a standard Ubuntu desktop. Individual applications from the Edubuntu
<RichEd> bundle may be selected for easy install from the CD.
 * RichEd leaves it at that and will check back later for comments
<RichEd> out for an hour or two
<ogra> RichEd, pips1 had a shipit question
<ogra> sounds god btw
<ogra> *good as well :)
<RichEd> pips1: chris was suggesting that if you order education education edition ... you get ubuntu CD & add-on
<RichEd> alternate prolly will not be shipped ... if you've got the IT muscle to install a server, the assumption is that you are able to download and burn a CD
<pips1> but that will only provide a "workstation install", i.e. not a classroom/ltsp installation
<RichEd> or have access to some techie who can do so for you
<pips1> right
<RichEd> i need to confirm that ... but apart from darkest africa ... internet access and burn iso is pretty much a commoddity
<RichEd> so in africa, you can get someone to deliver a hand burnt one via cleft stick
<pips1> ic
<pips1> my edubuntu-server installation ended with an error message :-/
<pips1_hardy-edu> Setting up postgresql (8.3.1-1) ...
<pips1_hardy-edu> dpkg: dependency problems prevent configuration of edubuntu-server:
<pips1_hardy-edu>  edubuntu-server depends on moodle; however:
<pips1_hardy-edu>   Package moodle is not configured yet.
<pips1_hardy-edu> dpkg: error processing edubuntu-server (--configure):
<pips1_hardy-edu>  dependency problems - leaving unconfigured
<pips1_hardy-edu> Processing triggers for libc6 ...
<pips1_hardy-edu> ldconfig deferred processing now taking place
<pips1_hardy-edu> Errors were encountered while processing:
<pips1_hardy-edu>  moodle
<pips1_hardy-edu>  edubuntu-server
<HedgeMage> RichEd:  umm, I'm in the US and there are TONS of places you can't download something the size of an ISO
<pips1_hardy-edu> E: Sub-process /usr/bin/dpkg returned an error code (1)
<HedgeMage> RichEd:  we have awful broadband penetration here.
<pips1> ...
<pips1> sorry for the paste flood
<HedgeMage> (not that you can't mail-order well enough, just making the point that broadband is NOT a given, even in developed countries)
<HedgeMage> np pips1
<ogra> pips1, thats from commandline ? it should have asked you abou at least ten questions
<ogra> (moodle)
<pips1> ogra: yes, that is from the command line
<pips1> It did ask questions and I provided answers, but it ended with the messages pasted above
<pips1> however, moodle seems to run under localhost... lemme continue...
<ogra> well, nothing we can change anyway
<ogra> archive is locked down
<pips1> (at the Moodle main admin accout config screen now)
<ogra> pips1, i was just told 8.04 wont be LTS for edubuntu
<ogra> can you take care LTS doesnt show up in the new docs  ?
<ogra> sorry that info got not communicated earlier
<HedgeMage> nixternal:  hey there
<HedgeMage> nixternal:  don't know whether you are coming or going?
<nixternal> heh, I have no clue myself...I was testing an oper script
<HedgeMage> ahh :)
<HedgeMage> how have you been?
<nixternal> busy busy busy, you?
<HedgeMage> Same
<HedgeMage> And fighting with my awful 'net connection.
<pips1> ogra: just so you know, moodle seems to run just fine
<pips1> :-)
<ogra> but had that error ?
<ogra> weird
<pips1> indeed
<ogra> i'll look into that for 8.04.1
<ogra> did you note the LTS part above ?
<highvoltage> ogra: heh, archive is frozen, to late to take the LTS away from /etc/issue :p
<ogra> ogra@osiris:~$ cat /etc/issue
<ogra> Ubuntu 8.04 \n \l
<highvoltage> awh
<pips1> the error said "Package moodle is not configured yet."
<pips1> so I suppose the error message was just related to the fact that I hadn't configured moodle at localhost/moodle yet...?
<highvoltage> educators always want the latest and greatest software anyway. at first I didn't like the idea of edubuntu being non-lts. but realistically, most people deploying edubuntu are probably always pushed to upgrade to the latest, so the non-lts thing is probably a bit of a non-issue.
<ogra> pips1, no idea, i'll take a deeper look after release
<highvoltage> ogra: does that mean you will allow universe inclusions for the next release?
<ogra> i'm not really fond of that, no, but if someone decides it /overrules me i will follow
<highvoltage> I think people should respect your decision and not override it even if they are technically above you.
<highvoltage> but that's just me :)
<ogra> well, its only that main garantees that more people are forced to look at apps while if we allow universe all maintanance will be forced on the person who cares for the disk (me)
<highvoltage> hmm, yes. that's true.
<pips1> highvoltage: could you provide me with a nice banner image for the 8.04 release, to place at the top of the page...? you're always good with these things. :-)
<highvoltage> pips1: you mean like http://www.edubuntu.org/files/banner-right-release.jpg ?
<highvoltage> (you could replace the 7.10 one with that one)
<highvoltage> (and replace the text in the yellow box in the drupal block upon release)
<highvoltage> RichEd, ogra: you guys should also help and push us a bit more to update that banner a bit more in the future
<highvoltage> I've wanted to replace it a few times, but I can't always think of things to replace it with.
<pips1> heh
<pips1> highvoltage: you still around?
<pips1> RichEd: ping
<lns> Has anyone had this issue, I'm getting randomly in some users' ~/.xsession-errors?  "Window manager warning: Buggy client sent a _NET_ACTIVE_WINDOW message with a timestamp of 0 for 0x1e00065 (OpenOffice)
<lns> Window manager warning: meta_window_activate called by a pager with a 0 timestamp; the pager needs to be fixed."
<lns> This causes the user to be kicked back to LDM after trying to open OOo
#edubuntu 2008-04-24
<pips1_> RichEd: morning
<RichEd> hi pips1_ ...
<RichEd> going through the mail now ...
<pips1_> besides writing that todo list, i haven't done anything yesterday..
<pips1_> I'm now making notes for the download page.
<pips1_> In the initial part of the page, we need to explain why there is now only one add-on CD and that they need to combine it with ubuntu and ubuntu server..
<stgraber> pips1_: they will never need ubuntu server (AFAIK), they need alternate for LTSP server
<stgraber> indeed that's something that needs to be clear in the anouncement :)
<pips1_> stgraber: you are right
<RichEd> pips1_ / stgraber : oliver has some clarifying text on his .ipso pages ...
<RichEd> *iso
<RichEd> i'm taking that, and rolling it into the press release / announcement page
<pips1_> RichEd: judging from last release webpage update bonanza, we are rapidly running out of time...
<pips1_> we need at least four documents
<pips1_> 1) mail announcement
<RichEd> then i'll send pips1_ the text for the release, and also the excerpts for the download page
<pips1_> 2) Download page text
<RichEd> pips1_: they will all follow from one document ... here is my approach
<pips1_> 3) edubuntu 8.04 overview page
<pips1_> 4) edubuntu 8.04 release notes
<RichEd> write the announcement in too much detail ... and then separate the detail into the 4 docs ... and trim the announcement
<RichEd> the announcement will be a high level summary, with links to the rest of the docs
<pips1_> ok
<RichEd> TIMING: pips1_ they are talking about 12pm midday BST
<RichEd> enough time ... this is my task this morning ...
<RichEd> you can hold off and do other stuff until in ping you
<pips1_> how are you planning on getting feedback from ogra and me and stgraber (?) ... send the document around by mail? wiki?
<RichEd> * until I ping
<RichEd> i'll pop up chunks of text here for immediate comment as i write
<pips1_> I see
<RichEd> then mail completed text to ogra pips1_ stgraber and ping here to let you know when & what to check
<RichEd> i'll write it all and manage ... get on with your real life until you hear from me
<RichEd> (at regular intervals)
<stgraber> do we have an expected time for release ?
<stgraber> last I heard, it was morning slangasek's time
<stgraber> so late afternoon here
<RichEd> stgraber: scroll back to the word TIMING
<stgraber> oh, missed this line :)
<RichEd> 3h4min and counting ...
<pips1_> RichEd: What will we use in terms of headings: Edubuntu 8.04 or always Ubuntu Education Edition 8.04 ??
<RichEd> pips ...
<RichEd> [1] for page titles use: Ubuntu Education Edition 8.04 : Edubuntu
<RichEd> [2] for CD general : Ubuntu Education Edition 8.04 CD
<RichEd> [3] for a user complete install: Edubuntu Desktop / Edubuntu Server
<pips1_> ok
<RichEd> the rebranding of the environment is a huge shirt ... has consequences on IRC channel names ... Docs .. wiki ... web site ... help ... desktop etc.
<RichEd> so now, the CD is called Ubuntu Education Edition 8.04
<RichEd> that is an add-on pack to Ubuntu
<RichEd> a full install of education add-on gives you edubuntu
<RichEd> ^ does that make sense for you to judge which name to use where ?
<pips1_> yes
<pips1_> urgh, the new brand name is so much longer...
<pips1_> 'edubuntu' vs. 'ubuntu education edition'
<pips1_> 8 vs. 24
<pips1_> ogra: RichEd Will there be such a thing as a DVD release of Edubuntu/UEE ?
<RichEd> pips1_: not as a physical item ... ogra may build an .iso of the collection for download
<pips1_> i ment the download
<pips1_> meant
<RichEd> not right now under deadline, but hpoefully buy the time the phsycial CDs ship ...
<pips1_> understood
<pips1_> oh dear, wiki.u.c is dead slow
<stgraber> erk, bad timing
<pips1_> RichEd: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Edubuntu/Website/ReleaseTodo/DraftDownload
<pips1_> RichEd: ^^^ outline for the download page structure
<RichEd> checking ...
<stgraber> pips1_: What about using gobby for release-notes/announcement/... ? it's probably a lot faster than wiki
<pips1_> no go for me
<pips1_> I'm still on 6.06 LTS :-)
<pips1_> my gobby version won't work with the newer versions....
<pips1_> I desperately need to update to 8.04 :-)
<RichEd> pips1_: snap
<RichEd> stgraber: i'm taking the last release announcement and updating that ... the ubuntu one is short & brief ... ours will be as well
<RichEd> we'll have a fuller page as an additional
<RichEd> here is the ubuntu one we are modelling: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/HardyHeron/ReleaseAnnouncement
<RichEd> pips1_: http://www.ubuntu.com/products/whatisubuntu/804features/ <-f.y.i. we'll include that as the tour link on the sidebar menu
<stgraber> that whatisubuntu page rocks !!!
<pips1_> yes
<pips1_> matt asked me not to publish it though!!
<pips1_> the url
<pips1_> stgraber: please hold off a minute before dragging everybody's attention to it ;-)
<stgraber> don't worry
<pips1_> RichEd: should I start writing copy for my Download page draft? Or will you do it? I'm just a bit worried we wont make it in time.. :-)
<RichEd> the wiki is already timing out ! don't make the masses whack the website into a stupor while we are trying to update
<pips1_> huh?
<pips1_> I wont use the wiki anymore
<pips1_> I will start writing text offline and start formatting it as html to insert into drupal / edubuntu.org
<RichEd> pips1_: for your comfort, do the structure and wording you see fit ... i'll then overlay mine over yours ... that way we can simply update a working acceptable page under less stress thata non-existing one
<stgraber> pips1_: if you are using Drupal's nodes, you can also turn the "published" flag off and directly work on the page in Drupal
<pips1_> stgraber: sure
<pips1_> RichEd: ok
<RichEd> pips1_: re huh i'm talking about stgraber making a lound reference to the www web page and using the rock war cry with multiple bangs which normally provokes a reaction like the sound of a tin opener operating on a can of fish at the local SPCA or animal shelter
<pips1_> hehe
<stgraber> :)
<RichEd> can any of you load a wiki page ... i'm timing out :P
<ogra> wiki.u.c has probs
<pips1_> I gave up
<ogra> IS is pinged
<highvoltage> it's probably not going to get any better soon
<pips1_> I don't think so either, I'm glad I opened all the pages I need for reference earlier
<pips1_> :-)
<highvoltage> some hosting providers offer slashdot insurance. I wonder if there would be hosting providers that offer ubuntu-release insurance soon :)
<pips1_> hehe
<RichEd> hi ogra ... feeling strong about the release(s) ...
<ogra> busy with desaster recovery .... https://launchpad.net/~cmpc-developers/+archive/+build/568554
<ogra> (witing for a fixed cmpc kernel that actually builds
<ogra> )
<RichEd> it is easier this time for edubuntu release now that it is part of the distro "engine" ?
<ogra> i didnt have to care so much
<ogra> and it will be even less next release
<ogra> this time we had all the infrastructural changes fr the addon, next time i only maintain a list and three packages for edubuntu itself
 * RichEd smiles at ogra's use of care ... in english it means to be interested, to pay attention to ...
<ogra> so from next time on i should really have time for actual development if tools :)
<RichEd> so "don't have to care" is along the road to "i don't give a sh*t" ...
<ogra> right :) the latter :)
<highvoltage> RichEd: ogra's use of care is more like the hacker language care
<RichEd> ahhh ... methought it was a german /english thing
<ogra> most of the infrastructural changes were made by colin, i actualy only had to pay attention my stuff follows up on his changes :)
<RichEd> ogra: great ... so the reorg is making sense ...
<RichEd> back after ciggie
<ogra> i already added two specs to the team canonical page :)
<ogra> (edubuntu-menus GUI and scheduling integration)
<ogra> (willowng and parental control integration)
<RichEd> i must add the easy education install categories
<RichEd> as well as the name change and carry through across web / irc / doc / help / wiki etc.
<RichEd> keeping edubuntu as the name for the full education default install
<RichEd> but the ubuntu education as the whole set of options available for ubuntu
<ogra> on the non edu side i have: mesh networking, easy usb key installer images, lightweight kernel flavour and boot profiling,
<pips1_> RichEd: if you need my attention, use my nick to ping... I'm too busy to follow conversation here. :-)
<RichEd> you mean on the non-generic h/w side ? i presume you refer to cmpc ?
<RichEd> and have you seen the OLPC keyboard problem making waves ?
<ogra> no to my job in the platfom tem
<ogra> *team
<RichEd> ahhh ... but all useful to us in edu :)_
<highvoltage> RichEd: which keyboard problem?
<highvoltage> oh, OLPC. right.
<ogra> mesh networking is a cmpc spec though but falls into general networking
<ogra> lightweight kernel is rather an ltsp thing but also useful for subnotebooks ;)
<ogra> same for boot profiling :)
<RichEd> highvoltage: not your keyboard problem ... a wipe with a strong disinfectant will sort that out
<highvoltage> RichEd: thanks for the tip.
<stgraber> ogra: is that compressed swap thing also planned for the cmpc in Intrepid ?
<RichEd> made by ogra(tm) ... available to broader the effort
<ogra> stgraber, someone else put it on the list already
<ogra> (compcache you mean i think)
<ogra> stgraber, i'd love to look into that especially i'd love to hear the reason why you need the go through a blockdevice instead of directly compressing all ram actions :)
<pips1_> RichEd: ogra: question: should we advertise the availability of Moodle in 8.04 at all?
<ogra> we did so before, if we dont advertise its removal thats fine :)
<RichEd> ogra: removal ?
<pips1_> we did so before? where? in the announcement mail? on the website? huh?
<ogra> i'd like to look into the bug you had there yesterday for 8.04.1 ... so its probaby better to not advertise it to much in the current state
<pips1_> for 7.10 ?
<RichEd> pips1_: on the download page, please make sure that there is a section for each of these:
<ogra> 7.10
<RichEd> * to install edubuntu desktop, you need ...
<RichEd> * to install edubuntu server, you need ...
<RichEd> * to install edubuntu LTSP server, you need ...
<pips1_> oh
<RichEd> and list the links needed ...
<ogra> s/LTSP/ClassroomServer/g
<pips1_> what is the difference between 'edubuntu server' and 'edubuntu LTSP server' ?
<ogra> and really drop the server part
<ogra> edubuntu-server is a metapackage, classroom server is an install variant
<pips1_> classroom server install variant gives you LTSP setup
<pips1_> correct?
<ogra> if you dont like classroom, call it thin client server, but please drop the ltsp
<ogra> right
<pips1_> why do you explicitely want to drop the LTSP?
<RichEd> we will add some text to flesh out a recipe level install instruction ... but for now, point people to the components they will need to d/l to get to the usual (expected) end desktops
<RichEd> ogra ... what is the difference now between ubuntu server ... and edubuntu server without ltsp ?
<pips1_> ah, LTSP is its own thing
<ogra> https://wiki.edubuntu.org/HardyClassroomServer isnt enough ?
<RichEd> any or none
<ogra> RichEd, a (currently broken apparently) moodle install
<ogra> edubuntu-server depends on postgresqul, apache and moodle to give you the content server
<RichEd> :( what's broke ?? is the install not completing, or installing but not running properly ?
<ogra> but pips1_ had some bad bug yesterday i'd like to look at as soon as hardy-updates is open so we shouldnt advertise it separately
<RichEd> and how would someone recover a bad install
<ogra> i have no idea what broke, i dont have the time to look now, i'm heavily behind on cmpc and cant upload any fix anyway
<pips1_> well, I got a nasty sound error on the command line, but moodle *seems* to run fine, on a first impression, anyway
<pips1_> *nasty sounding error
<ogra> it threw an install errorr that needs deeper researc, even though it seemed to work after install
<pips1_> right
<pips1_> so... on the download I simply write
<ogra> i can look next week (given the classmate kernel is done, i have ot roll the final images *today* for that)
<pips1_> 1.) to install edubuntu desktop
<pips1_> 2.) to installe edubunt thin client server
<pips1_>  ?
<ogra> yes
<ogra> we can add an 8.04.1 section there later and add edubuntu-server
<pips1_> RichEd: you ok with that?
<pips1_> RichEd: and what about the terminology? 'edubuntu classroom server' or 'edubuntu thin client server' ? (I think the latter is more accurate, since edubuntu server in the future will include a content server, etc?)
<pips1_> for hardy+1: edubuntu-server = ltsp + moodle ?
<ogra> in "biz speak" we call it ubuntu terminal services btw http://www.ubuntu.com/products/whatisubuntu/serveredition/technologies/ltsp
<ogra> pips1_, no
<ogra> more metapackages
<pips1_> right
<ogra> and edubuntu-server will never depend on ltsp
<pips1_> ltsp will always remain as an install variant, but people will add metapackages to suit their needs on top of that...
<ogra> (since i want edubuntu-server selectable in g-a-i later it would pull ltsp onto the addon CD)
<pips1_> understood
<ogra> ltsp is an ubuntu thing now
<pips1_> you want ltsp on ubuntu (alternate) cd
<pips1_> right
<pips1_> RichEd: any word from you about the wording for the "edubuntu server"? 'edubuntu terminal services', 'edubuntu thin client server', 'edubuntu server', ...? which to use?
<RichEd> edubuntu classroom server ... as oliver has used ...
<pips1_> ok
<RichEd> where it makes sense, use "edubuntu classroom server (thin client)"
<pips1_> "Install Edubuntu Classroom Server"
<pips1_> ok
<RichEd> like headings, but don't bog down body text with the long term
<pips1_> orga: "edubuntu classroom server (terminal services)" or "edubuntu classroom server (thin client)" ?
<ogra> feel free to choose :)
<pips1_> well, i guess it depends on what term is more likely to be googled for...
 * pips1_ checks
<pips1_> terminal services: 10'700'000 hits in google
<pips1_> thin client: 6'410'000 hits
<pips1_> terminal services: first link = Terminal Services is a component of Microsoft Windows...
<pips1_> thin client: first link = wikipedia
<pips1_> wow, really sounds like microsoft owns the term "terminal services"
<pips1_> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terminal_Services
<pips1_> 'thin client' seems to be more associated with open source...
<pips1_> interesting
 * pips1_ carries on
<pips1_> "Ubuntu Education Edition 8.04 is codenamed Hardy Heron and is supported for 18 months on both desktops and servers."
<pips1_> ogra: ^^^ is that correct?
<ogra> right
<ogra> btw, could you file a bug about moodle, "moodle tries to configure DB before postgres is up" seems to be the proper description
<ogra> against edubuntu-meta
<RichEd> pips1_: i wouldn't use "code named" sounds too james bond ... just use:
<RichEd> "Ubuntu Education Edition 8.04 (the Hardy Heron release) is supported for 18 months on both desktops and servers.
<RichEd> ogra: ?? happy with that ^
<ogra> sure
<pips1_> ok
<RichEd> pips1_: terminal services is synonymous with a MS service ... has been for 10+ years
<RichEd> thin client is generic ...
<pips1_> so what do we use?
<ogra> thats why we call it "ubuntu terminal services" on the marketing pages all over ubuntu.com :)
<pips1_> we might as well use terminal services ... :-)
 * RichEd would disagree :)
<RichEd> thin client <- a person looking normally to save money or management time / overhead in a large install has "thin client is a slimmer cheaper solution" in mind
<RichEd> imho ...
<ogra> http://www.ubuntu.com/products/whatisubuntu/serveredition/technologies/ltsp
<ogra> tell that to marketing :)
 * RichEd cannot believe that ogra is taking his lead from marketing ... follow the people in sharkskin suits ? 
<RichEd> ;)
<ogra> RichEd, well, i wrote that text :)
<pips1_> haha
<ogra> sympathising with the devil ;)
<pips1_> ogra the marketer
<pips1_> in lederhosen
<ogra> haha
<stgraber> "To use Ubuntu Terminal Services during Ubuntu install use the Ubuntu Alternate CD for installation, hit F4 at the bootscreen and select "Install a LTSP server" from the pop up "Modes" menu." :)
<ogra> well, call it as you like just dont call it LTSP in the ehadins
<ogra> *headings
<stgraber> to install "Ubuntu Terminal Services" install "LTSP" :)
<ogra> yeah
<ogra> the app is LTSP
<ogra> the product is ubuntu terminal server :)
<pips1_> "Ubuntu Education Edition 8.04 DVD's will be made available only a while after the initial CD release (feel free to check for availability at the following link) ..."
<pips1_> ogra: ^^^ ?
<stgraber> won't people expect something similar to Microsoft's terminal server (RDP stuff) with such a name ?
<ogra> (to be honest i was just to late to request a change for the menu entry wrt translations)
<ogra> (should have been "terminal server")
<pips1_> "The DVD image contains the Desktop and Server ISO's, as well as all the packages officially supported by Ubuntu"
<ogra> pips1_, DVD ?
<pips1_> ogra: ^^^ correct?
<pips1_> yes, should I write about the DVD, or drop that altogether?
<stgraber> pips1_: we don't have DVD
<pips1_> RichEd: mentioned that there might be one later?
<pips1_> misunderstanding?
<ogra> let me have a look, i'm not sure we have built DVDs at all since they are actually identical to ubuntu DVDs
<ogra> oh, we built them apparently
<pips1_> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/releases/8.04/release/
<stgraber> I don't have Edubuntu DVD in the list of images to test
<RichEd> pips1_ / stgraber : ogra and i chatted a while ago about building a DVD with the whole set of edu cd requirements on it
<ogra> stgraber, it doesnt differ from ubuntu
<stgraber> ogra: we don't seem to have the i386 one though
<pips1_> so what should i write on the download page?
<ogra> RichEd, the ubuntu DVD contains all of main (incuding the edu stuff)
<RichEd> so e.g. if someone wants to burn & post to a disconnected user ... they can do a DVD
<RichEd> ogra: will that get them edubuntu desktop / edubuntu server / edubuntu LTSP ?
<ogra> what would you expect from a "edubuntu DVD" thats not covered by the ubuntu DVD
<RichEd> if yes ... pips1_ you can make a DVD heading and point people to the ubuntu one
<ogra> RichEd, no, since we dont have any installer ntegration anywhere we dont have such modes
<pips1_> ubuntu DVD contains what? ubuntu + u. server + kubuntu + ?
<ogra> the edubuntu DVD wll offer exactly the same the ubuntu DVD offers
<pips1_> what is the ubuntu DVD url?
<ogra> all edu apps are included there
<ogra> pips1_, all of main that fits plus all langpacks
<pips1_> ic
<pips1_> so what is the URL?
<stgraber> IIRC DVD images are on cdimage, 2s
<ogra> i think its somewher on cdimage
<stgraber> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/releases/hardy/release/
<ogra> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/dvd/20080423/ there is a daily build though
<pips1_> "The DVD image contains the Desktop and Server ISO's, as well as all the packages officially supported by Ubuntu"
<pips1_> ogra: ^^^ correct?
<ogra> right
<pips1_> (i never used the dvd)
<pips1_> ok
<ogra> me neither
<ogra> juliux does thogh :)
<stgraber> ogra: AFAIK it doesn't contain Kubuntu, so not exactly "all packages officially supported by Ubuntu" maybe "all packages for the Ubuntu environement" would be better
<ogra> yeah
<ogra> sounds better in that light
<pips1_> ogra: I have a heading "Older Releases" which lists Edubuntu 6.06.1 Dapper....
<pips1_> I leave that in, right?
<pips1_> Dapper will still be available, right?
<ogra> yeah
<pips1_> ok
<ogra> and supported for another year
<pips1_> "supported until 2009" ?
<ogra> i think so
<juliux> ?
<pips1_> oh oh, me things we have a slight problem
<pips1_> hmm
<stgraber> pips1_: ?
<pips1_> on our download page, we use this nice script from matt nuzum that will give us an up to date list of all download mirrors...
<pips1_> but *only* for the Ubuntu 8.04 educational add-on CD
<pips1_> I can simply reference the ubuntu.com website for the Ubuntu 8.04 Desktop CD
<pips1_> ... download
<pips1_> but what about the links for the Ubuntu 8.04 Alternate CD
<pips1_> ?
 * pips1_ checks
<ogra> there is a checkbox on the ubuntu DL page
<ogra> it was at the bottom in 7.10
<ogra> Check here if you need the alternate desktop CD. This CD does not include the Live CD, instead it uses a text-based installer.
<pips1_> right... so i need to write that the *need* to tick that tiny checkbox on that page....
<ogra> just link to the HardyClassroomServer wikipage ?
<pips1_> well, you see, our download page will only provide a list of mirrors for the add-on CD!
<ogra> right
<pips1_> for the "other CDs", i.e. ubuntu Desktop and Ubuntu Alternate, I will just direct the people to the ubuntu.com website...
<ogra> so for general just link to the ubuntu DL page
<ogra> for classroom server link to the classroom server wikipage
<ogra> edubuntu addon works fine with ubuntu desktop
<ogra> no need for the checkbox, and classroom server users should in any case follow the instructions of the classrom server wikipage
<pips1_> well, that's what i'll do... but I guess people will still get a bit confused that they need to navigate to two download pages to get a complete "ubuntu education edition"...
<ogra> thats the drawback we have to live with in the new design
<pips1_> right
<ogra> you will always need the ubuntu base
<ogra> but for the default a link to the desktop iso is fine
<ogra> just make classroom server prominent enough
<pips1_> perhaps next time round, matt can adjust the script so it'll be nice and configurable....
<ogra> so people wanting that actually see it
<ogra> perhaps next time roud we can provide shipit with the alternate CD :)
<ogra> as classroom server edition
<RichEd> ogra: expanding this" is supported for 18 months on both desktops and servers"
<ogra> good idea
<pips1_> RichEd: do you have a paragraph that explains what the add-on CD contains?
<RichEd> pips1_: not yet
<pips1_> :-/
 * pips1_ has sweat breaking loose
<RichEd> pips1_: my buttefiles are wobbling me
<RichEd> ogra: ??
<RichEd> Edubuntu 8.04 is a Long Term Support release (LTR) and will be supported for 18 months on both desktops and servers through our managed software repositories. The desktop package manager notifier checks automatically for security and maintenance updates / patches and prompts from the tool bar for simple selection and installation.
<ogra> pips1_, the same it contained before there were no content changes
<stgraber> RichEd: s/LTR/LTS/ ?
<ogra> s/before/before, /
<ogra> RichEd, edubuntu is no LTS
<RichEd> stgraber: thanks ... i'll blame those on my contact lenses which are fogged up from lack of sleep
<RichEd> ogra: ?? wasn't 6.10 an LTS
<ogra> 6.10 was
<ogra> 8.04 isnt
<RichEd> but the underlying ubuntu is no ?
<ogra> thats what i was told very explicitly yesterday by mdz and cjwatson
<ogra> *EDU*buntu isnt a long term support release ...
<RichEd> can we say that it is based on the Ubuntu which is LTS
<ogra> ubuntu is
<RichEd> so is the concern about edu package support ?
<RichEd> because all of those are in the repositories and supported for ubuntu ?
<ogra> "the edubuntu CD operates as an addon to the long term supported ubuntu 8.04 edition" would surely be possible i think
<ogra> but we're not allowed to call the addon LTS
<ogra> or an edubuntu install
<RichEd> okay ... so do we support for 18 months ?
<stgraber> 18 yes, not 3 years though
<RichEd> and the base desktop is LTS supported for 36 months ?
<ogra> yeah, thats the general hort tem support cycle for all releases
<ogra> *short term
<RichEd> okay ... let me word that positively ... brb
<ogra> RichEd, afaik only content of the -desktop (and alternate indeed) and -server CDs is actually supported
<ogra> for LTS
<ogra> no kubuntu, xubuntu or edubuntu
<RichEd> ogra ... any release notes of our own anticipated ?
<ogra> RichEd, beyond the changes i wouldnt know what to note :)
<RichEd> ogra: fine by me ... the more we point people back to ubuntu, the better
<RichEd> so i have referenced theirs
<RichEd> ogra / stgraber / pips1_ : please check your mail for the web announcement text
<RichEd> comment here please ... no muti-email doc spawning :)
<pips1_> ok
 * RichEd is now checking to see if it needs modification for the mail shots
<RichEd> note that there is now no Edubuntu announcement going out in ubuntu announce
<RichEd> we are referenced as an add-on feature of ubuntu
<RichEd> we will do our own mail shot to our lists
 * RichEd heads for a ciggie and will come back for comments in 5
<ogra> Find out what is new in this release with a graphical tour:
<ogra>   http://www.ubuntu.com/getubuntu/releasenotes/710tour
<ogra>   http://www.ubuntu.com/getubuntu/releasenotes/710
<ogra> ...
<ogra> 7.10 ?
<ogra> beyond that looks good to me ...
<stgraber> RichEd: checking now
<stgraber> are these <link stuff standard in mail ? thunderbird just show them without linking
<ogra> its a txt attachment, probably TB doesnt interpret links in there
<ogra> i see it fine in evo
<stgraber> hmm, right
<RichEd> stgraber: that's for pips1_ to do on the web site announcement
<RichEd> the mail shot is a revised version for text only
<stgraber> shouldn't the mail link to the releasesnotes for Edubuntu ?
<RichEd> stgraber: scroll back dude ... none from ollie this time
<ogra> well, what should i note beyond the changes :)
<stgraber> hmm, ok :) sorry I was away for half an hour moving from school to some open wireless in town :)
<RichEd> ogra: is the LTS & support paragraph okay by you and non-offending for mdz and cjwatson ?
<stgraber> ogra: italc by default for all desktop install ? don't see any other change though
<ogra> oh, right
<ogra> italc !
<ogra> RichEd, looks good to me
<RichEd> ogra: sweet ... tx
<ogra> "edubuntu now comes with the fully integrated italc classroom management software" ?
<ogra> probably as bulletpoint somewhere :)
<RichEd> stgraber: once we have the page up ... i'll get pips1_ to add the italc line
<RichEd> will wax it into "managed education environment" as a leader and not just a bullet
<stgraber> pips1_: it's not actually an Edubuntu DVD but the Ubuntu DVD containing the education packages
<ogra> pips1_, i'm not registered, looks fine to me ...
<ogra> i like the new theme :)
<pips1_> ogra: it's been there since months :-)
<ogra> i should look there more often :)
<pips1_> stgraber: ok, will change
 * ogra wonders if #ubuntu-release-party will pass the 700 user mark before release
<RichEd> ogra: what's it at now ? and is there mayhem as usual ?
<ogra> 682 atm
<ogra> but stalled somewhat
 * stgraber is moving again, next wifi probably in ~30min
<ogra> hey slangasek
<slangasek> hi
<slangasek> pips1_: when do you plan to publish http://www.edubuntu.org/news/8.04-release ?
<ogra> we're in the last touch up's
<ogra> http://www.edubuntu.org/node/47
<slangasek> ok
<RichEd> ogra: nope that is the download page ...
<ogra> oh
<RichEd> pips1_: what's the node for the release ?
<RichEd> slangasek: text & content is ready ... just getting it live
<ogra> release was done then, right, we should be able t publisch now
<ogra> *publish
<RichEd> will ping when published
<slangasek> sounds good
<RichEd> a matter of minutes
<pips1_> ah ogra, don't publish that node publicly!!
<ogra> pips1_, 29 ppl here
<pips1_> ok ok
<ogra> 20 of them sleeping
<slangasek> ogra: images are propagating, I'm currently doing the final link check for the announcement mail but this still blocks on the ubuntu.com website too
<ogra> ah, good, so within the next hour i guess then
<slangasek> I hope so, I need to pass out soon
<RichEd> slangasek: i'm ready with my homer voice: "ahhhhhhhh sleeeeeeeeeeep"
<RichEd> ogra: with the add-on cd ... when you stick it in, does a prompt auto load ?
<RichEd> or do you need to launch something manually ?
<ogra> see the screenshots :)
 * RichEd shoots ogra ... gimmee da short answa dude
<ogra> yes
<RichEd> trying to write an accurate sentence ... not overload my firefox at the moment
<RichEd> why thank you dear;)
 * ogra wonders if RichEd noticed that he answered yes on an or question 
<ogra> :P
<ogra> it pops up a prompt
<ogra> giving you three choices
<RichEd> well review this then:
<RichEd> In versions prior to 8.04 Edubuntu was released as a distinct variant with its own separate Installer CDs. With the restructure you now start with the installation of an Ubuntu desktop as a base. Once you insert the Ubuntu Education CD, you will be prompted to add the Edubuntu add-on environment or opt to install education application enhancements.
<ogra> Once you insert the Ubuntu Education CD at a running desktop
<ogra> ...
<ogra> else its fine
<ogra> users should be aware you cant boot of it or pop it in at the text installer or so
<ogra> hmm
<ogra> "to add the Edubuntu add-on environment" .... "to start the Edubuntu add-on installer"
<ogra> (the button says "start add-on installer")
 * stgraber is back on some public wifi
<ogra> https://wiki.edubuntu.org/HardyClassroomServer?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=addon-popup.png
<ogra> in case the wiki works for you :)
<RichEd> just deleted a comment i was about to send that add the add on is crap sentence structure
<RichEd> check for errors while i polish the grandma
 * pips1_ waits for the paragraph... :-)
<ogra> #u-r-p -> 684
<ogra> 690 :)
<pips1_> huh?
 * ogra waits for 700
<pips1_> what is u r p ?
<stgraber> 5.2MB/s upload on bittorrent here ...
<RichEd> ogra: just checking ... stick in Cd and then a dialogue window comes up with the start button
<ogra> pips1_, #ubuntu-release-party
<stgraber> pips1_: #ubuntu-release-party
<pips1_> hehe
<ogra> RichEd, with a dialog with three buttons: cancel, start package manager, start add-on installer
<RichEd> tz
<RichEd> ogra: what does the boot option do ?
<ogra> boot option ?
<ogra> there is none
<ogra> the cd is not bootable
<pips1_> ogra: question: I want to understand what the two options do... Does "start package manager" give you synaptic?
<ogra> yep
<ogra> with the CD as repo
<pips1_> And "start add-on installer" gives you the gnome add/remove thingy (forgot the name)?
<stgraber> gnome-app-install
<ogra> right
<pips1_> thanks
<RichEd> pips1_: ogra ... here we go:
<RichEd> In versions prior to 8.04 Edubuntu was released as a distinct variant with its own separate Installer CDs. With the restructure you now start with the installation of an Ubuntu desktop base onto your machine, and once complete you then insert the Ubuntu Education CD. A dialogue box will load automatically offering you a choice of "start package manager" or "start add-on installer".
<RichEd> Select the "package manager" option to select individual Education applications from the Edubuntu default bundle for installation onto your Ubuntu desktop environment.
<RichEd> Select the "add-on installer" option to install the full education environment, including the Edubuntu default application packages and Edubuntu desktop as a single process.
<pips1_> RichEd: I think you misunderstood the options
<pips1_> RichEd: disregard my last sentence
<ogra> RichEd, dont document the package manager"
<RichEd> ??
<RichEd> wot he sed ??
<ogra> ad-on installer is all you need, it shows an entry for every whipped app
<ogra> "Select the "package manager" option to select individual Education applications from the Edubuntu default bundle for installation onto your Ubuntu desktop environment."
<ogra> drop that
<ogra> synaptic is nothing i want to expose to normal users like that, its complicated
<RichEd> me is confused ... what option do they select to get easy edubuntu ?
<pips1_> RichEd: I *do* think you misunderstood what happens / what the options are for the add-on cd...
<ogra> lets just push for the add-on installer case
 * RichEd waits for learning from a higher source
<ogra> RichEd, just drop the one sentence
<pips1_> RichEd: there is *no* option where you simply click a button and it installs every app on the add-on cd...
<ogra>  http://paste.ubuntu.com/7933/
<RichEd> what option then replaces the ubuntu desktop with the edubuntu one ?
<pips1_> you have the option to either install apps with the simple interface of gnome-app-installer, or the more advanced, but perhaps confusing synaptic package manager
<ogra> .oO(it would have been helpful to have a look at the installation howto before writing teh text)
<ogra> RichEd, http://paste.ubuntu.com/7933/ write it like that
<RichEd> loading
 * pips1_ same
<ogra> and drop "single process"
<ogra> its several clicks
<RichEd> pips ... take the wording from the link pasted
<ogra> if you want link https://wiki.edubuntu.org/HardyClassroomServer
<ogra> that describes the process exactly with screenshots
<RichEd> i wasn't impying single click ... but one train of action
<RichEd> as opposed to install dektop, then install apps
<ogra> ah,k
<RichEd> pips1_: slangasek i going ahead ... get the -page up so it is not a dummy link and we can refine
<RichEd> it's not wrong at the moment ... we're basically clariifying
<pips1_> hold on hold on
<pips1_> we still need the release notes page
<stgraber> slangasek changed the topic of #ubuntu-devel to: Ubuntu 8.04 LTS released!
<pips1_> ahhhh
<RichEd> ogra: so if they just want to select apps, and not change the desktop look & feel ... same button ? later choice
<ogra> right
<RichEd> pips1_: we have no release notes ... we reference ubuntu's
<pips1_> RichEd: they need to choose / install the "edubuntu-desktop" package from the gnome-app-installer menu..
<pips1_> no release notes?
<RichEd> is the desktop selection obvious for a newbie ?
 * stgraber is off again for a while
<pips1_> but anyhow... we can't publish our download page until i have the go ahead from matt... he needs to change the script for the list mirrors...!
<RichEd> pips1_: reference the ubuntu one only for now ... we can add any we need later
<ogra> so seems we have released
<ogra> \o/
<RichEd> pips1_: can you prod matt or do i need to
<pips1_> matt did it
<pips1_> it works
<pips1_> hang on
<RichEd> go with your page anyway ... better to have our news up than a please wait linked from the ubuntu mass announce
<RichEd> users can read up while they wait for mirrors
<pips1_> ok I just put up the new download page
<pips1_> but now i need to create two placeholders for the release notes and the "tour" that is linked to from the download page
<pips1_> RichEd: what are the URLs you used for the "release notes" and "tour" ?
<ogra> http://www.edubuntu.org/news/8.04-release
<ogra> thats in the ubuntu announcement in my mail from 10 mins ago
<pips1_> aaaha
<RichEd> ogra: not his question
<RichEd> pips1_: 1 sec
<RichEd>   http://www.ubuntu.com/getubuntu/releasenotes/804
<ogra> RichEd, well, thats the one we need up *right now*
<pips1_> well, anyway, we are only ready and online with the *download* page, but nothing else
<RichEd>   http://www.ubuntu.com/getubuntu/releasenotes/804overview
<ogra> thousands of users click already
<pips1_> absolutly, the get a 404 right now!!
<ogra> right
<RichEd> ogra: pips1_ is asking about links to embed on that page ... not the url it should be at
<ogra> ah
<RichEd> pips1_: those are sidebars ... get the landing page up as priority #1
<RichEd> pliss
<pips1_> phew... wo what link has been published via mail?
<pips1_> the landing page?
<pips1_> or has the mail not gone out yet? (i hope=
<ogra> announcement is out since 14:17
<RichEd> our announcement page referreced in the ubuntu-announce
<ogra> 20 mins
<RichEd> pips1_: make this one live "http://www.edubuntu.org/news/8.04-release"
<ogra> the ubuntu announce mail refers to http://www.edubuntu.org/news/8.04-release
<pips1_> what text should I publish there?!
<RichEd> the release mail i sent you an hour and a bit back ...
<RichEd> sorry i thought you were on top of that
<RichEd> we discussed the content here with ogra
<ogra> Find out what is new in this release with a graphical tour:
<ogra>   http://www.ubuntu.com/getubuntu/releasenotes/710tour
<ogra>   http://www.ubuntu.com/getubuntu/releasenotes/710
<ogra> needs fixing though
<ogra> s/710/804/
<RichEd> ogra: pips1_ the tour link is:  http://www.ubuntu.com/getubuntu/releasenotes/804overview
<ogra> ah
<RichEd> have you seen that graphical overview ogra ... very sexy
<ogra> well, iÃm using all these apps since months :)
<ogra> that takes away a bit of the excitement :)
<RichEd> pips1_: you winning there ?
 * pips1_ is frantically preparing the page
 * ogra hugs pips1_ 
<ogra> thanks for that
<highvoltage> pips1 ftw.
<ogra> the banner at the top still says "Almost there!"
<pips1_> ogra: I know that one is next
<pips1_> http://www.edubuntu.org/news/8.04-release
<pips1_> ^^ ^ that is the correct URL right?
<ogra> yup
<RichEd> tx pips1_
<highvoltage> is the release out?
<ogra> since 30min or so, yes
<pips1_> highvoltage: what was the file name of that updated banner logo you did?
<pips1_> ogra: RichEd can you please come up with a better banner text?!
<pips1_> http://www.edubuntu.org
<RichEd> pips1_: on the release page:
<RichEd> Ubuntu 8.04 and the new Edubuntu add-on CD is on its way! Nearly everything is complete, release is within 24 hours!
<ogra> "8.04 is here" "Ubuntu 8.04 and the new Edubuntu add-on CD were released on Apr 24 2008, get it at <url>"
<RichEd> change to:
<RichEd> Ubuntu 8.04 and the Ubuntu Education Edition (Edubuntu 8.04) were released on April 24 2008. Read all about it at <url for release announcement>
<RichEd> pips1_: and for the home page:
<RichEd> pips1_: sorry ... leave it as "get it at" with download link <- for the announce page
<RichEd> pips1_: and for the home page:
 * pips1_ listens
<RichEd> Hardy Heron Released !
<RichEd> Ubuntu 8.04 and Ubuntu Education Edition add-on CD are now available. Get the latest Edubuntu desktop and applications.
<RichEd> add for an optimal education enironment.
 * RichEd corrects the spelling
<RichEd> Hardy Heron Released !
 * pips1_ waits
<RichEd> Ubuntu 8.04 and Ubuntu Education Edition add-on CD are now available. Get the latest Edubuntu desktop and applications and Classroom server for an optimal education environment..
<Kamping_Kaiser> :)
<ogra> we shouldnt use the developmnet release namews in public announcements
<Kamping_Kaiser> congrats to those who worked on it
<ogra> (or put them in brackets at least)
<ogra> the official release name is 8.04
<ogra> not hardy heron
 * RichEd points to ogra and stgraber as the rocks of 8.04
<pips1_> everyone, reload the page...
<RichEd> pips1_: announce or home ?
 * pips1_ will change banner logo next
<pips1_> home
<pips1_> all pages, in fact
 * RichEd reloads the internet
<pips1_> highvoltage: aaargh, i can't change the logo, because only you have write permissions on that server directory..
<RichEd> pips1_: edubuntu add-on is another term we are adding to the confusion :(
<pips1_> RichEd: what? where? what do you want me to do?
<pips1_> ah, you mean the text in the logo
<pips1_> yeah
<pips1_> highvoltage: ping ping
<RichEd> Ubuntu 8.04 and the Ubuntu Education Edition CD have been released! Grab the latest versions of Edubuntu while they are hot!
 * pips1_ looks for a work around
<RichEd> Ubuntu 8.04 and the Ubuntu Education Edition CD 8,04 have been released! Grab the latest versions of Edubuntu desktop and Classroom server while they are hot!
<pips1_> oh man
* ogra changed the topic of #edubuntu to: Order: http://shipit.edubuntu.org || Edubuntu - the education version of Ubuntu || http://www.edubuntu.org | Wiki: http://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuWiki | MEETING: every Wednesday see http://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuMeetingAgenda | 8.04 (hardy heron) is released, see http://www.edubuntu.org/Download grab it while its hot !!!
<pips1_> I already changed it.. which one now?
 * RichEd reloads
<Kamping_Kaiser> night all. hope you get some good vibes :)
<ogra> Kamping_Kaiser, thanks, sleep tight
<RichEd> the release notes banner text is still "amost there"
<Kamping_Kaiser> catch you later all.
<RichEd> bye karl
<pips1_> RichEd: reload
<ogra> pips1_, didnt update for .org
<RichEd> pips1_: and when you have a moment to breathe ... please replace "You will never go back" with "The latest from Ubuntu Education "
<RichEd> something like that
<RichEd> you'll never go back sounds bit like a "forget sugar ... our sweetner is almost as good as the real thing"
<RichEd> back to what ... that implies that something else exists for education
<ogra> RichEd, its what we use on www.ubuntu.com as slogan
<RichEd> ogra: okay but ughhh
<pips1_> i think the slogan suck too
<RichEd> i stick by my "you'll never go back" why admit there is a competition
<pips1_> but I don't quite understand... i have changed it...
 * RichEd reloads
<ogra> RichEd, i dont like it either ... especially coupled with the promise of an uninstall feature
<pips1_> yeah
<ogra> (which surely users will look for and not uderstand the joke)
<pips1_> ridiculous
<RichEd> it says "we're almost as good, and hoping that you'll think we're as good or better"
<pips1_> so guys, is the banner ok now?
<ogra> it didnt chane on edubuntu.org
<ogra> almost there ...
<RichEd> http://www.edubuntu.org/news/8.04-release
<RichEd> this is still old
<pips1_> the banner logo stil needs changed to "ubuntu education edition 8.04", but I can't do anything, because highvoltage has changed the write permissions on the server
<RichEd> so who can do something pips1_ ?
<ogra> RichEd, highvoltage apparentl
<ogra> y
 * RichEd phones jonathan
<pips1_> RichEd: what is old about the 8.04-release page? what do I need to do?
 * ogra still gets the old bannertext on edubuntu.org
<RichEd> http://www.edubuntu.org/news/8.04-release
<ogra> pips1_, the banner
<RichEd> banner text says almost there
<pips1_> force reload?
<ogra> it didnt change at all on edubuntu.org
<ogra> only on edubuntu.com
<RichEd> yep
<pips1_> Huh?! it changed for me?
<pips1_> hold on
<pips1_> oh. perhaps drupal cache
<ogra> .com is fine here "your'll never go back" ....
<ogra> .org still shows "almost there"
<pips1_> i think it is an issue with drupal caching the pages...
<highvoltage> has the release happened?
 * pips1_ tries to remember how to flush the chache in drupal
<pips1_> highvoltage: !
<pips1_> highvoltage: yes
<ogra> highvoltage, we try to tell the world atm
<RichEd> highvoltage: help pips1_ please
<ogra> its just not as easy
<highvoltage> ah, do I need to flush the drupal cache?
<ogra> :)
<pips1_> yep
<highvoltage> ok
<RichEd> change the logo ... 7.10 is no longer hot or cool
<pips1_> and I need you to change the logo
<highvoltage> sorry I was on the phone with a client who wanted me to explain *everything* in the most minute detail
<pips1_> well, we need "Ubuntu Education Edition 8.04" in the logo text, not "Edubunut 8.04"
<jsgotangco> flush the drupal cache and force the cron too
<highvoltage> refresh.
<highvoltage> :)
<jsgotangco> heh
<ogra> yay
<RichEd> highvoltage: all groovy ... 'cept for a silly
<RichEd> logo text on http://www.edubuntu.org/news/8.04-release links to http://www.edubuntu.org/news/8.04-release
<pips1_> highvoltage: did you just hit cron.php ?
<RichEd> can you make a variant for that one page ?
<pips1_> RichEd: I don't understand
<pips1_> what is the prob
<pips1_> ?
<highvoltage> pips1_: nope, it's cronned
<pips1_> hihi me is totally confused
<ogra> oh, could we make the logo on the top left link to edubuntu.org instead of edubuntu-com
<RichEd> pips1_: the logo on the edubuntu 8.04 page announcement page announces edubuntu 8.04 with a link to itself
<ogra> *edubuntu.com
<highvoltage> RichEd: where should it link to?
<RichEd> if that page can be varied ... make the logo text: ubuntu 8.04
<ogra> RichEd, that banner is shown on all sites on edubuntu.*
<pips1_> RichEd: it can't
<highvoltage> it can, actually :)
<pips1_> the banner is there for *all* pages of the whole site...
<RichEd> okay ... it's not a biggie
<highvoltage> you can add an exception to the block
<ogra> there is only one where it appears to link to itself :)
<pips1_> well, yes, if we define a rule for the block
<highvoltage> RichEd just needs to say what should be there instead of the log
<highvoltage> *logo
<highvoltage> but I don't think users will mind that, to be honest
<RichEd> i 'spose it will only confuse the already challenged
<pips1_> i also think it isn't a problem
<pips1_> I prefer to get the release notes text up... instead.
<RichEd> highvoltage: annonunce ubuntu instead of edubuntu ... and link to the ubuntu announce
<highvoltage> well, they should figure it out after reading the release announcement a few times that they're getting the same page ;)
<pips1_> LOL
<pips1_> ok
<pips1_> let's backtrack
<pips1_> highvoltage: can you sort out the logo text first, please?
<RichEd> highvoltage: let's hope none of the @nc cabinet members wear out their mouse button
<ogra> highvoltage, only in the evening, if they notice that the links they clicked the whole day led all to the same pages :P
<pips1_> "Edubuntu 8.04" should be "Ubuntu Education Edition 8.04" <--- right, RichEd ?
 * RichEd shuts up for a bit and goes to poison his lungs
<RichEd> pips1_: banner says ubuntu education edition
<pips1_> oh
<highvoltage> ogra: rofl
<pips1_> reloads
<RichEd> logo text can be edubuntu ... no problem with that
<pips1_> oh
<pips1_> ok
<pips1_> all sweet for the banner, then
<RichEd> it's an informal screamer / loudhailer add ... it can be familiar
<RichEd> banner is hundreds
<RichEd> does any other country use that slang term "hundreds"
<RichEd> in za it means "perfect" in a casual way ... 100%
<highvoltage> UGH
<highvoltage> I don't have ubuntu-title installed
<highvoltage> hmm, the exception doesn't seem to work for top-banner
<highvoltage> RichEd: I have to tend to someone now, but will look at it again in ~1hr
<pips1_> highvoltage: we will need to change the permissions on the server at some point... there is an edubuntu unix group already (i'm in that group), so we just need to give write permissions to the edubuntu group.
<highvoltage> pips1_: righto
<pips1_> that way, I can do the changes without having to pester you
<highvoltage> pips1_: it's strange, we were both in the edubuntu group last time, but I couldn't update drupal (and the drupal files were in the edubuntu group)
<highvoltage> either way, I agree it's something we need to sort out with the admins.
<pips1_> right
<highvoltage> will be back just a bit later...
<pips1_> ic
<pips1_> ok
<RichEd> pips1_: my error ... please correct
<RichEd> appplication
<RichEd> http://www.edubuntu.org/news/8.04-release
 * pips1_ looks
<pips1_> ah typo
<RichEd> also: Edubuntu contributors:
<RichEd> now says: contibutors:
<RichEd> and add to the mailing lists:
<RichEd> Ubuntu Education discussions:
<RichEd> http://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-education
<RichEd> last one ... add after "global mirrors"
<RichEd>  Edubuntu now comes with the fully integrated iTalc classroom management software allowing for teacher sharing, monitoring and control of networked workstations.
 * RichEd bows down in homage to stgraber 
<ogra> onitoring and control of networked workstations and thin clients
<ogra> :)
<pips1_> ok
<pips1_> reload
<RichEd> me has sent the mails to the 3 mail lists
 * RichEd changes magazines and aims ahain
<RichEd> *again
<RichEd> ... have to fetch my kids from school ... back in 15
<pips1_> question: what about the edubuntu release notes?
<RichEd> pips1_: there are no release notes ... we refer to ubuntu release notes
<pips1_> but we were asked to provide an url for them by mr. slang asek, no?
<RichEd> not as far as i am aware ... he wanted a url for the release *announcement*
<RichEd> which is the page you did for us that is not the download page
<RichEd> http://www.edubuntu.org/news/8.04-release
<RichEd> dat wun
<ogra> looks very good now
<RichEd> thanks pips1_ ... appreciated
<RichEd> :) +
<ogra> well done, thanks a lot
<pips1_> ogra: for people who are still running a LTSP lab with 6.06.1 LTSP, I would like to point to a page for LTSP configuration... The link at the bottom of the 6.06 "Getting Started" is broken...
<pips1_> Can I use: http://doc.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/edubuntu/handbook/C/customizing-thin-client.html
<ogra> no
<ogra> i dont think we have a dapper doc online anymore
<pips1_> oh, i see
<ogra> thats definately talking about stuff thats not available in dapper
<pips1_> so I just remove the link, or make a note.
<pips1_> ok
<ogra> it fuly applies to hardy though
<pips1_> strange how it is only available on doc.u.c rather than help.u.c
<pips1_> "Unfortunately, there is no documentation available online on how to configure settings for Edubuntu 6.06 LTS. Please refer to the documentation that comes with your system."
<pips1_> ogra: ^^^ is that ok?
<ogra> hmm
<pips1_> no, let's just write
 * ogra is digging if there is some old doc left
<ogra> sadly the wiki is a pain
<pips1_> "Documentation on how to configure settings for Edubuntu 6.06 LTS is available in the Edubuntu Handbook, which is available in the Edubuntu System Help menu."
<ogra> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ThinClientHowto was clearly a breezy/dapper page
<ogra> but i cnat get to it
<ogra> *cant
<pips1_> oh
<ogra> no, there was no handbook in dapper
<pips1_> ah, i see
<pips1_> ok, so I'll reference the ThinClientHowto wiki page
<ogra> i know highvoltage once did a wikipage for dapper options and there was something linked from the ThinClientHowto
<ogra> but with the wiki timeouts i cant get the url
<pips1_> right
<ogra> leave it out until the dust has settled
<ogra> ah, wait
<ogra> something loads
<ogra> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/EdubuntuLtsConfParams smells like a dapper page .... need to verify though
<ogra> ergh
<ogra> for ubuntu dapper look at http://www.edubuntu.org/ThinClientConfig
<ogra> which doesnt exist
<ogra> drop dapper
<ogra> (there is really no point in using dapper ltsp in a new install anyway, it didnthave any features)
<pips1_> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/EdubuntuLtsConfParams has loaded for me
<pips1_> it says that these are for breezy (!)
<ogra> its for breezy
<ogra> with a link for dapper at the bootom which links to the above page which doesnt exist
<ogra> really, drop dapper from the notes
<pips1_> for dapper, it references a page on edubuntu.org, which mentions the handbook.
<pips1_> my goodness
<ogra> yay for wiki cleanups
<ogra> well, really, i see no point for anyone to use dapper ltsp
<ogra> it has no sound or localdev support, an ugly login manager and isnt really fast
<pips1_> well, it's more for those few poor souls out there who are running dapper..
<ogra> i doubt there are many using dapper ltsp in production, really
<pips1_> ack, the link to the handbook on edubuntu.org is broken as well... what a mess!
<ogra> people wanted sound and localdev support which you could ony get from ltsp 4.2 at that time
<pips1_> ogra: where do you want me to add the link to https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/LTSPQuickInstall
<ogra> well, as long as we have linked HardyClassroomServer from somewhere
<ogra> it links to the ltsp page
<pips1_> ah, ok
<pips1_> in that case, I think I'm done for now
<pips1_> hey, big congrats on the new release! wooohooo! :-)
<pips1_> have a good evening
<pips1_> I'm off.
<pips1_> cheerio
<DrX> i just installed Linux and the GUI won't work and the error is "Data incomplete in file /etc/X11/xorg.conf.  At least on Device section is required."  what do u run to fix this?
<pips1> shipit.edubuntu.org still says "I want to pre-order CDs of Edubuntu 8.04" ... and "I want to download and test the beta version..."
<pips1> oh, and the link in the chat topic is wrong.. it should be https://wiki.edubuntu.org/Edubuntu
<wubrgamer> what is the edubuntu addon cd?
#edubuntu 2008-04-25
<Kamping_Kaiser> wubrgamer, its an extra cd for ubuntu which contains all the edubuntu packages
<wubrgamer> Kamping_Kaiser:  so there is no edubuntu cd?
<Kamping_Kaiser> wubrgamer, no stand alone cd
<wubrgamer> Kamping_Kaiser:  that's new
<wubrgamer> Kamping_Kaiser:  isn't it ?
<wubrgamer> Kamping_Kaiser:  I thought there used to be one
<Kamping_Kaiser> wubrgamer, until this release edubuntu has been a stand alone cd
<theunixgeek_> The loading bar in the usplash keeps bobbing back and forth instead of actually loading. how do I fix this?
<wubrgamer> how many gnome freaks are there?
<wubrgamer> gnomefreak:
<gnomefreak> wubrgamer: too damn many :(
<gnomefreak> my connections is being cranky
<wubrgamer> you need to cut that down, i'm pretty freenode is cranky about that sort of thing
<Kamping_Kaiser> gnomefre?k, hey mate
<Kamping_Kaiser> ;)
 * wubrgamer is away: I'm Away, Send me a PM
<Kamping_Kaiser> wubrgamer, could you not publicly announce aways please? :)
<wubrgamer> how do I do that?
<wubrgamer-away> is that better ?
<Kamping_Kaiser> not really, but its less obnoxious :)
<wubrgamer-away> does it announce my nick change?
<wubrgamer-away> honestly, what's the difference?
<Kamping_Kaiser> many clients dont show nick changes. as it happens many do, which is why its not really better
<roe_> I'm looking for a child oriented word processor, I've looked at some of the programs edubuntu offers, but didn't see one
<Kamping_Kaiser> what does 'child oriented' mean exactly?
<roe_> K thru 2
<Kamping_Kaiser> what would you want from it though? are you thinking like the wordprocessor in an XO?
<roe_> XO?
<roe_> something very simple that would allow them to compose a letter, or a story, with some light formating ability
<Kamping_Kaiser> so exactly like whats in the xo. wonder what its called. it may be packaged
<roe_> what is xo
<Kamping_Kaiser> the OLPC laptop
<roe_> ah
<roe_> the olpc website says it is packaged with abiword
<Kamping_Kaiser> a modified abiword yeah.
<Kamping_Kaiser> try abiword from the repositories. might be simple enough
 * Kamping_Kaiser hasnt used it for ages
<roe_> I have used it recently, it is more of a 3rd to 5 grade or adult light weight processor not very interactive
<Kamping_Kaiser> afk. catch you later
<roe_> so long
<lns> roe_, why not gedit? (Applications -> Accessories -> Text Editor)
<roe_> it isn't interactive (read fun for a kindergartner to use)
<roe_> it needs to help walk them through the various steps of writing
<lns> roe_, did you look at gcompris suite? I'm not sure if there's a word processor or not but that's probably in the ballpark
<roe_> I did and I didn't see one there
<lns> ya got me then
<lns> but there very well could be one out there
<lns> check this out
<lns> http://ingwa2.blogspot.com/2005/09/koffice-kids-office.html
<roe_> that looks perfect
<roe_> can't find if it has made any progress since 2005 though
<lns> maybe it's bug-free ? =)
<roe_> looks like it is bundled with koffice 2
<lns> some of KDEs apps are really top-notch...it'd be nice to see integration with gnome (such as the user mgr - very nice, well made comparatively)
<hbons> are there any docs available for customizing ubuntu like edubuntu does? and what tools do the edudevs use?
<johnny> searc for ubuntu cd remaster
<johnny> edubuntu is not a seperate distro as of 8.04
<johnny> it is an addon cd
<ogra> well
<ogra> ubuntu uses debian-cd to build the disks
<ogra> edubuntu is just treated like the second CD to ubuntu-desktop
<ogra> in a standard debian-cd build setup
<hbons> ï»¿johnny, ï»¿ogra: thanks! will check that out
<reg_> Have a question about 8.04 upgrade...
<reg_> Is it possible to upgrade edubuntu 7.10, keeping all users and without setting up thin clients again? Im a newbie at this...
<johnny> reg_, you should regenerate your client chroot
<johnny> but otherwise all the settings are fine
<reg_> Hmmm... Is it best to get a linux-nerde to help me? :-) Im running a system with 7 thin clients and about 50 users. Proxy etc. is run by seperate server.
<reg_> I have no idea how to regenerate client chroot or even what a client chroot is... ;-)
<johnny> you built that system dind't you?
<johnny> it's what the clients boot from /opt/ltsp/i386
<johnny> ltsp-build-client
<johnny> you should backup your old /opt/ltsp/i386
<johnny> and then run ltsp-build-client again
<reg_> Nope... Got some help from a "guru". I only service the system by upgrading and adding users...
<johnny> well if that person may have modified the chroot..
<johnny> then you should talk to them again
<johnny> and tell them that you were advised to rebuild the chroot from scratch
<reg_> think I have to call him... The kids in the youth club would kill me if they lost their internet connection today...
<reg_> I'll fix this later... Got to work some more now.. Thanks
<ogra> reg_, http://www.ubuntu.com/getubuntu/upgrading
<ogra> thats enough for the genral system upgrade
<ogra> for ltsp follow what johnny said (move /opt/ltsp/i386 away and run sudo ltsp-build-client)
<ogra> that should be all you need
<ogra> but better do it on a wekend in case you run into any probs ;)
<johnny> ogra, but the chroot could have been modified ina necessary way
<johnny> for their setup
<ogra> right
<johnny> so.. i think the original person should do it
<ogra> but you have the backup
<use> Hello
<use> ive a question - i need to use edubuntu @ school (i am sysadmin) - can i configure 1 pc and copy trhe settings to other pc`S?
<use> oder soll ich leiber auf deutsch fragen?
<MrBill> would a 550mhz K62 laptop with 512mb of RAM be a pretty painfully slow system to run Edubuntu on?
<LaserJock> what are you wanting to run?
<LaserJock> like what apps, etc.
<MrBill> A buddy is thinking to build a machine for his system (and 3 year old nephew) that will do basic browsing, email, etc. and I figure that having something like edubuntu would give some games/whatever that might be good for a kid
<MrBill> I'm brand new to Ubuntu myself (just converted from WinXP two weeks ago) so don't really know too much about what kinda system requirements Linux has in general
<MrBill> errrr, when i said "build for his system" i meant "build for his sister"
<LaserJock> I think it'd work ok
<LaserJock> the processor is a bit low, but the memory is nice, which is often more important
<MrBill> woudl it be adviseable to go with an older release? or is the newest release going to basically run just as quick as an older?
<LaserJock> yeah, should be fine
<LaserJock> you could perhaps look at Xubuntu
<LaserJock> and then add on edu apps from the addon cd
<MrBill> oh, I didn't realize I could do the addon apps to either xubuntu or kubuntu, i for some reason thought I had to be running a gnome version
<MrBill> I'm still sorta learning how this all works =)
<MrBill> that's probably the best solution, xubuntu runs a noticeable amount lighter than ubuntu ?
<LaserJock> MrBill: yeah
#edubuntu 2008-04-26
<Navegator> hello
<Navegator> ???
<c1b0rg> Hi, I have problems mounting hard disks on ltsp thin clients, anyone wants to help me
#edubuntu 2008-04-27
<gotamatw> Hi! I'm working with Edubuntu (gutsy). How can I make kde the default session on every thin client?
<johnny_> make it the default on your server?
 * johnny_ isn't sure.. just a guess
<johnny_> via update-alternatives perhaps
<johnny_> so... anybody upgrade to hardy here?
<johnny_> getting symlink issues with libGL.so.1
<johnny_> causing the upgrade to fail completely
<achandrashekar> hello...im curious about the new features that 8.04 has for ltsp setup..can someone let me know? does it include setup for load balancing?
<achandrashekar> errmm...that is graphical i mean..
<johnny_> don't think so
<johnny_> mostly it was stability fixes
<johnny_> and cleanups
<johnny_> not much new
<johnny_> at least my terminals boot..
<achandrashekar> johnny_: thanks.. so i had a disastrous junior admin cause a power outage..that i believe killed an ldap database..
<johnny_> bad news
<johnny_> :(
<achandrashekar> but i couldnt find how to fix it..so logins are slow..
<achandrashekar> and im pretty sure its hosed.
<achandrashekar> so i figured..wait and see what features were available.
<achandrashekar> and as a result...not have to go through the helacious pain of re-setup
<achandrashekar> :)
<achandrashekar> but we "may" just have to do that.
<johnny_> uhmm.. backup?
<achandrashekar> well.. im trying to determine whether the dbase is even screwed up. the hard part is figuring it whether it is.
<lns> achandrashekar, wouldn't it be fairly trivial to restore a known working db from backup then seeing if people can login? ;)
<johnny_> yay.. hardy upgrade broke my ltsp
<lns> how'd it do that?
<johnny_> some firefox issue
<johnny_> i'm workin on it
<lns> firefox broke ltsp?
<johnny_> nah.. ltsp came up fine
<johnny_> it's just firefox is the main use
<johnny_> my hardy upgrade actually failed
<johnny_> i'm not sure if it actually completed after fixing broken libgl1-mesa
<johnny_> update-manager seems to think it did
<johnny_> but it's hard to tell
<johnny_> i had to manually edit  diversions file
<lns> jeez
<johnny_> to remove fglrx crap that should have been removed when i uninstalled the driver
<johnny_> i tried fglrx cuz i thought it would be better
<johnny_> turns out it isn't
<johnny_> the open source driver was better
<johnny_> got the dual screen setup with my projector working nicely with it
<johnny_> now.. to fix firefox..
<johnny_> the icon is broken
<johnny_> i freakin knew it
<johnny_> it's too easy for ~/.gvfs entries to stick around
<johnny_> pkill -u user.. still leaves em
<johnny_> i mentioned this to people, but everybody said it wouldn't be the case
<johnny_> ok.. last problem to solve before i can go home
<indio_> hi all
<indio_> do someone can help me with edubuntu thin clients and cdrom mounting?
<indio_> after upgrading from gutsy to feisty thin client could not mount usb pen drive and cdrom
<indio_> applying some modifications, now usb pendrive works but cdrom still not for some dell optiplex 320
<johnny_> morning...
<johnny_> anybody here upgrade to hardy and have their firefox desktop icon go missing
<johnny_> i see a bug in launchpad, but it is solved
<paolob> Hi guys! I'm trying to use a thin client where the nic is a rtl 8139D, which should work, and actually the nic works if I put it in the server. However, when I boot from the floppy disk on the client, it finds correctly the dhcp server, obtains the IP, but when it's time to load the kernel from the ltsp server, it's loaded very very very slow. Any hint?
<paolob> I think I've followed correctly the instruction in https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/LTSPQuickInstall
<paolob> Hi ogra
<paolob> Hi guys! I'm using hardy edubuntu, I'm on a client, I enabled sound in  /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/lts.conf , but when I play a sound, it comes back on the server's sound card. What should I do in order to get the sound on the client's sound card? thank you
<lns> paolob, not sure about hardy, i'm still on Gutsy - but have you read the PulseAudio wiki?
<paolob> pulseaudio wiki? why?
<kingair_six> hello, I got some problems round here, first time linux and IRC user, patience appreciated
<kingair_six> hello
#edubuntu 2009-04-20
<LaserJock> anybody know if somebody is going to write a Jaunty release announcement or release notes?
#edubuntu 2009-04-21
<thismamacooks200> 3D was working great. But suddenly games run less that 1 fps. but, glxgears runs at 205+ fps. I have an Intel card.
<Ahmuck> thismamacooks200: it's SDL
<thismamacooks200> ok, so is there a way to diagnose and fix sdl?
<Ahmuck> it's a known problem
<Ahmuck> that hasn't been fixed
<Ahmuck> what game is it?
<thismamacooks200> assultcube, emilia pinball, extreme tux racer, savage 2
<Ahmuck> SDL sound it causing the problem iirc
<linux_any_1> #ltsp
<Frestechcoor> Does any one use a edubuntu terminal server?
<HedgeMage> I know that many people do, but I haven't personally, so I'm not much help in that area :/
<Nubae> Frestechcoor: your best off asking in #ltsp
<Frestechcoor> ok thanks
<Nubae> but many in here, including myself use it
<Frestechcoor> I have put edubuntu on a few computers at the elementary school I work at.  It seems to work pretty well.
<Nubae> yeah its nice
#edubuntu 2009-04-22
<LaserJock> nubae1, highvoltage: around?
<LaserJock> stgraber: you up yet?
<stgraber> LaserJock: yup
<LaserJock> stgraber: you watching -devel at all?
<stgraber> LaserJock: what's weird is that you're up yet :)
<stgraber> I try to, what did I miss ?
<LaserJock> stgraber: well, I got an email this morning
<LaserJock> stgraber: 1) we need a release announcement
<LaserJock> stgraber: 2) Edubuntu is being dropped from releases.ubuntu.com to cdimage.ubuntu.com
<LaserJock> so we have no mirroring
<LaserJock> and we'll need to update all download pages
<stgraber> hmm, ok ... so no more "official" support for edubuntu ?
<stgraber> for the website, I don't have any access on it, are we using something similar to ubuntu.com for the download page ?
<stgraber> if so we may need to update the code no ?
<LaserJock> stgraber: slangasek says that dropping to cdimages.u.c doesn't say anything about support directly
<nubae1> hi LaserJock
<nubae1> long ime no see
<nubae1> time
<LaserJock> stgraber: so my assumption is that Canonical is still supporting it, we just got replaced by Ubuntu Netbook Remix on releases.ubuntu.com
<LaserJock> nubae1: yeah, has been
<nubae1> I've get some of the edubuntu jaunty pages ready... I guess tomorrow is launch day?
<stgraber> well, yeah but you loose mirroring ... and we all know how fast cdimage usually is :)
<stgraber> nubae1: yeah
<LaserJock> stgraber: exactly, slangasek said we have to come up with our own mirroring
<LaserJock> i.e. I don't think that's exactly going to happen by tomorrow
<nubae1> own mirroring? what does that mean practically?
<LaserJock> so we need a release announcement ASAP and we need to change the download page on edubuntu.org
<LaserJock> nubae1: it means we're screwed for getting the .iso downloaded ;-)
<nubae1> ah lovely... what about using p2p?
<nubae1> could upload the iso to linuxtracker
<LaserJock> nubae1: well, if we have seeds
<nubae1> well wouldn't that kinda take care of itself if people start downloading?
<nubae1> I can put up an iso on my server (100mb connection)
<nubae1> if needs be
 * nubae1 wonders what kind of traffic there will actually be for the edubuntu cd
<LaserJock> I really don't know
<LaserJock> I've never seen any stats on it
<LaserJock> with the app bundles I think a lot of people are better off just installing over the internet
<Nubae> well, we could put up an rsync server for incremental updates and serve the image p2p too
<ogra> you should be able to get them on the torrent tracker, ask steve
<ogra> not irroring doesnt mean they cant be added to the ubuntu tracker
<ogra> *mirroring
<LaserJock> ogra: good thought
<Nubae> where will the image be served from though thats the question
<ogra> cdimage
<Nubae> ok
<LaserJock> anyway, primary focus for the moment needs to be getting a release announcement written
<Nubae> LaserJock: did u get my mail about the edubuntu-extras apps?
<LaserJock> Nubae: I did, I have it starred in gmail, just haven't had any time for Ubuntu for a while
<Nubae> I assumed as much :-)
<LaserJock> Nubae: thanks for them
<Nubae> yeah, I actually ran the apps too, to make sure they were all working and such
<LaserJock> slangasek says that http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/releases/jaunty/rc/edubuntu-9.04-rc-addon-amd64.iso.torrent works
<LaserJock> ok, so what needs to go into the release announcement?
<Nubae> cool well thats that then, we can put a torrent link up on torrenttracker too, if one needs a mirror
<LaserJock> 1) releases.u.c -> cdimage.u.c
<LaserJock> 2) app bundles
<LaserJock> 3) basic install instructions
<LaserJock> 4) perhaps the Firefox bug being fixed?
<LaserJock> 5) any LTSP stuff stgraber has?
<stgraber> LaserJock: probably, I've done a blog post recently about that, we can probably get some items out of it
<ogra> make a big point about compiz support ;)
<ogra> people like that
<LaserJock> ogra: you've got the most experience with this, does the outline above seem reasonable?
<ogra> yes, i think so
<LaserJock> tbh I never read these announcements so I'm not positive what all goes in them ;-)
<stgraber> ogra: yeah, dual-head and compiz are things people tend to like :)
<ogra> well, RichEd did everything for the last two/three releases ... i'm not that trained anymore for non mobile stuff :)
 * Nubae wonders if anyone reads them ;-)
<LaserJock> ogra: do we need separate "announcement" and "release notes"?
<stgraber> ogra: though we should maybe discuss turning LDM_DIRECTX on by default, it's not good from a security point of view but will give a lot better user experience (talking for karmic)
<ogra> phew, no idea
<stgraber> ogra: I still get some people complaining about video softwares and similar being slow or LTSP being a lot slower than desktop and that's really just SSH eating all their cpu
<ogra> stgraber, totally oppsed by me ... sorry security first ...
<ogra> video players should be localapps nowadays
<stgraber> ogra: well, I guess maybe we should make it easier for users to switch between secure and non-secure then. A ldm button would be cool :)
<stgraber> ogra: agreed for localapps but we'd need working gconf first or we'll have to use something else than totem
<ogra> a radiobutton in the options ... but not shown by default
<ogra> switchable by the admin through a lts.conf option
<ogra> but not as a choice for the user by default
<ogra> its 100% insecure transport vs 100% secure transport you are trading there ...
<ogra> we sadly dont have different levels here
<stgraber> well, it's more secure than XDMCP :)
<ogra> not really
<stgraber> with DIRECTX the login is still sent through ssh
<ogra> yes, but thats about it
<ogra> your online banking password you type into the https page is compromised
<stgraber> ok, added a few LTSP security items to my todolist for LTSP. Basically getting the switch from secure to insecure in ldm (through a lts.conf option) and allow an admin to force a warning message for users connected using DIRECTX
<LaserJock> OK, I created https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Edubuntu/9.04/ReleaseNotes and https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Edubuntu/9.04/ReleaseAnnouncement
<LaserJock> please please pretty please add to it
<LaserJock> I got up early so I could work on my dissertation before a meeting with my advisor
<LaserJock> so I need to kinda bail
<LaserJock> but I'll check in later
<stgraber> ok, I'll work on something for LTSP
<stgraber> (even if it's technically not edubuntu ... :))
<LaserJock> it's relevant to Edubuntu users
<LaserJock> but yeah, it's a bit tricky
<LaserJock> anybody work on the Release Announcement/Notes?
<LaserJock> good grief, what do we even call what we're releasing?
<LaserJock> is it Edubuntu 9.04 or is it Ubuntu Educational Addon 9.04 :/
<Lns> LaserJock: I like the latter, the former seems like an actual OS/version of ubuntu
<Lns> (like it used to be)
<Lns> There are still plenty of people asking about Edubuntu thin clients, thinking it's still built in
<LaserJock> how does this sound: "The Edubuntu team is proud to announce Edubuntu 9.04 Ubuntu Educational Addon."
<Lns> I think that's redundant imho
<Lns> the people are Edubuntu team, right? And we're releasing the Ubuntu Educational addon
<LaserJock> so "The Edubuntu team is proud to announce Ubuntu 9.04 Educational Addon.
<Lns> there ya go
<Lns> i like that
<Lns> That gives the feeling that the Edubuntu team can do much more than simply the "Ubuntu Educational Addon"
<Lns> such as advocation, etc
<Lns> other s/w projects
<Lns> which the sky is the limit, really
<LaserJock> ok, opening paragraph:
<LaserJock> The Edubuntu team is proud to announce Ubuntu 9.04 Educational Addon, continuing Edubuntu's tradition of integrating the latest and greatest open source educational software with the high-quality, easy-to-use Ubuntu distribution.
<LaserJock> Lns: ^^ seem OK?
<Lns> LaserJock: looks good to me =)
<LaserJock> Lns: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Edubuntu/9.04/ReleaseAnnouncement
<LaserJock> Lns: please read that and let me know if something needs changing
<Lns> LaserJock: just looking over, might be good to change "As an addon to Ubuntu, it offers regular releases,..." to "The Ubuntu Educational Addon offers regular releases,..."
<Lns> as not to confuse edubuntu w/uea
<LaserJock> Lns: ok, I wondered about that one
<Lns> LaserJock: also "Edubuntu comes with the fully integrated iTalc classroom management" ... should prolly be changed to uea
<LaserJock> should I mention edubuntu-desktop-kde
<Lns> and next par.. "The base Ubuntu 8.10 and Edubuntu add-on" s/Edubuntu/uea
<LaserJock> it's not on the CD, but I think Kubuntu users would be interested to know it exists
 * Lns shrugs
<Lns> sure, maybe as something like a "also, the edubuntu-desktop-kde"
<Lns> imho most of the "edubuntu" wordage should be changed to uea
<Lns> besides the reference to the project/people itself
<LaserJock> it's a bit difficult
<LaserJock> because, for instance, the edubuntu-desktop-kde is technically outside the Ubuntu Educational Addon
<LaserJock> but it's important for users to know about
<Lns> yeah
<Lns> well maybe for "most" cases we should do that then - there just seems to be a lot of confusion still, and it'd be good to clarify in the webpage etc.
<LaserJock> Lns: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Edubuntu/9.04/ReleaseAnnouncement
<LaserJock> Nubae: ^^?
<Ahmuck> 9.04 is out now ?
<LaserJock> Ahmuck: in a matter of hours I believe
<LaserJock> Ahmuck: you mind reading that announcement and letting me know if anything is confusing/wrong/missing?
<Ahmuck> i hate the bots
<Ahmuck> i ask a question, i'm a person, not a bot asking the question
<Ahmuck> LaserJock: ok, thx
<Ahmuck> sure, i'll read the announcement
<Ahmuck> LaserJock: looks good
<poseidon> Is there a FOSS (or even free) alternative to Rosetta Stone?
<LaserJock> Ahmuck: ok, good
<poseidon> For learning something like German
<Lns> poseidon: Some of my schools use RS too, that's an interesting question
<poseidon> Well I've looked and asked around.  I thought I would try one more time in here.
<poseidon> RS is like $200-500+ USD.  It's ridiculous
#edubuntu 2009-04-23
<stgraber> LaserJock: I added my items to the todo for the release notes not sure what should be part of the anounce though (maybe just a link or something)
<LaserJock> stgraber: do you have time to add maybe a sentence for each of those?
<stgraber> LaserJock: yeah, I'll get that from the blog post I did a few weeks ago
<LaserJock> stgraber: get anywhere?
<stgraber> LaserJock: doing a few other things, will work on it soon
<LaserJock> stgraber: ok, I'm gonna be gone for a few hours
<LaserJock> stgraber: I'll check it later tonight probably
<stgraber> k
<LaserJock> nubae1: I've got the release notes and release announcement all ready on edubuntu.org
<LaserJock> nubae1: I uploaded a new banner graphic
<LaserJock> nubae1: if Jaunty is released and if you get to it before I wake up feel free to s/8.10/9.04/ in the header block to make the announcement
<scythepod> hi.when will edubuntu 9.4 be released?
<anom1> good question.
<scythepod> ou, thought it will be released with  ubuntu
<nubae> it should be available... let me just update the page to refrlect that
<scythepod> Ah, ok
<anom1> if I'm a teacher or something, I'll create some simple quiz or syllabus materials for Edubuntu.  Then at least it can attract parents to give Edubuntu a try.
<nubae> ok, release notes and all should be up to date
<ogra> nubae, congrats to the release
<nubae> congrats? Laserjock deserves those, he wrote it all, I just released it by pressing some buttons ;-)
<ogra> right, that makes you the official edubuntu release manager :)
<ogra> (as opposed ot Laser being the edubuntu main developer and manager :) )
<nubae> heh
<nubae> congrats to u for netbook remix... that is looking absolutely awsome
<ogra> it is, not my work though
<ogra> my personal userbase gets smaller with every release it seems ;) i only adeed the new ARM architecture in jaunty
 * nubae hopes to see some cool arm based notebooks soon
<ogra> by end of the year i guess
<ogra> they say summer, but i doubt it
<nubae> do u get to see some cool pre-market ones?
<ogra> well, i only got a ton of boards surrounding me ... no cases
<ogra> and they are usually way bigger than what goes to market, but look like a space shuttle control
<ogra> (debug boards)
 * anom1 stumbles out the Jaunty Party room's door, completely drunk.
<nubae> ah can someone change the topic?
<nubae> ogra?
<Lns> nubae: haha..yeah looks like it needs updating!
<Lns> I *just* got done installing a new Jaunty on my new PC (core 2 duo 3.0ghz, 4gb ram)... mmmm...haven't had a new computer in so many years
<Lns> I can't believe Jaunty recognized all of my hardware. NVidia Geforce gfx, abit wifi, sound, dual NIC...it all just works. WAY easier than dealing with windows drivers!!
<Lns> the installer partitioning util is awesome too. Easiest to use yet, even with multiple partitions already on the drive
* LaserJock changed the topic of #edubuntu to: Edubuntu - the education version of Ubuntu | http://www.edubuntu.org | wiki: http://wiki.edubuntu.org/Edubuntu || 9.04 is released, see http://www.edubuntu.org/news/9.04-release || Help out with bugs: http://tinyurl.com/EduBugs || LTSP questions? try #ltsp
<nubae> greets LaserJock
<nubae> I updated the pages, and pointed the downloads page to the release notes
<nubae> and editted the main page to remove the upcoming 9.04 features
<nubae> let me know if there is anything else
<LaserJock> nubae: oh, excellent
<LaserJock> nubae: that's just perfect
<LaserJock> nubae: thanks for working on that
<nubae> no prob... there were some folks in here asking when edubuntu would be released so they pushed me to do it :-)
#edubuntu 2009-04-24
<Ahmuck-Sr> good evening.  are there any "gotcha's" i should be aware about doing a 81.0 to 9.04 upgrade on a ltsp server?
<Ahmuck-Sr> has anyone done a dist upgrade?
<Ahmuck-Sr> well, here goes nothing.  /me hopes nothing breaks
<Ahmuck-Sr> wow, upgrade is 900+ megabyte download
<Ahmuck-Sr> i'm suprised no one has come up with a upgrade tool that backs up configuration and then uses the release as the upgrade cd
<Ahmuck-Sr> upgrade broke some things
<Ahmuck-Sr> do i need to rebuild the ltsp client after upgrading to 9.04?
<jc2it> I have VIAChrome9 HC3 Integrated Graphics in an HP t5545 thin client. I am trying to get it to pxe boot from Ubuntu 8.04 LTS + LTSP, but I think I have a video driver problem. What driver do I use for the VIAChrome9 HC3 Integrated Graphics chipset?
<jc2it> This is the lts.conf that I have been playing with:
<jc2it>         [default]
<jc2it>                 XSERVER = openchrome
<jc2it>                 X_VIDEO_RAM = 16438
<jc2it>                 LDM_DIRECTX=True
<jc2it> #       HP t5545 TC
<jc2it>         [00:22:64:28:ad:68]
<jc2it> #               XSERVER = openchrome
<jc2it> #               X_VIDEO_RAM = 65752
<jc2it>                 SCREEN_07=ldm
<jc2it>                 SCREEN_02=shell
<jc2it> #               SCREEN_03=wy60
<jc2it> #               TELNET_HOST = 192.168.2.2
<jc2it> Results:
<jc2it>    Ubuntu boots, shows the progress bar and then starts BLINKING the screen on and off.
<jc2it> The default section works great for my Neoware C50 and 16mb of shared video RAM.
<HedgeMage> jc2it: Pastebins are your friend.
<HedgeMage> That said, I'm not much help with your config, I'm afraid I have little experience pxe-booting, and even less (meaning none) with that graphics chipset :/
<HedgeMage> sorry :(
<Ahmuck-Sr> after update last evening, my hp laserjet 1200 printer is spitting out garbage
<Ahmuck-Sr> fixed, deleted all printers and added back
<jc2it> http://pastebot.ltsp.org/311
#edubuntu 2009-04-26
<slonbg> hi, i just upgraded my edubuntu 8.04 to 8.10 in order to migrate to 9.04. as I read, since 8.10, edubuntu is actually an addon cd. is there an additional repository I need to add in order to get the edubuntu packages, or the normal ubuntu repo should work?
<dark4og> anyone place a snapscan fujitsu scanner on a thin client?
<stgraber> dark4og: it's not supported by default but if your scanner is supported by SANE, you could install saned on your thin client and access it from the server by network
<dark4og> I have attached it to the sever, Bang it was up... SANE command scanned in doc and all woked as advertised.
<dark4og> I need one at each desk, scanning in all incoming documents.
<dark4og> I have created a static IP in the client and went thru with some setting info that was used in Kiwi. this so far is at no visual  results.
<dark4og> Using PXE boot
<stgraber> so you have saned running on your thin clients, if so, adding the ip to /etc/sane.d/net.conf or something similar should do the trick
<stgraber> it's actually on my last of things to test for a customer next week but the only bit that's worrying me is how to filter the scanners to show only the user's and not all the others as well
<dark4og> In my case, I would be glad to just have it show up.. We are setting up another server with LTSP5, we have many hacks to the LTSP4 over the past year. I hope version 5 will pick it up.
<dark4og> We have only a small office and this is just another step in the edubuntu saga. They had a tough time adjusting to linux and Ooo, but noe we are up way more than down.
<dark4og> Good luck with your customer! Thanks for the chat.. :)
<mede> hello everyone
<mede> i have a question here
<mede> how to setup multiple server
<svenstaro> Uh, I'm going to deploy Edubuntu in my school. Anybody here who can help me out a bit?
<svenstaro> For example, do you run the terminals off the same users (anonymously, like kiosk), have a user per terminal or create a user per student?
<nubae> svenstaro: u can use any of those methods u like
<nubae> generally I'd imagine people create a user per student, and these students can then log in to any terminal with that username/password
<nubae> but if u want to create autologin terminals with one user per terminal u can do that too
<nubae> or even both, a button for autologin, and the possibility to enter a user on the system
<nubae> ltsp is very flexible
<highvoltage> I think it depends on the age of the students. for young students auto-login is nice
<highvoltage> for older ones you'll probably want to give them all their own users since they may want to store more of their own information without others interfering with it
<nubae> greets highvoltage
<highvoltage> hey nubae
<svenstaro> In my school we agreed on not letting any users store any files at all.
<svenstaro> How would you keep the user environment clean but provide a temporary way of saving data? Nightly jobs that default back all the users?
<svenstaro> I would really like to 'freeze' the user dirs and only allow them to safe temporary data
<svenstaro> save even
<highvoltage> I guess if the clients had enough RAM I'd store it in a ramdisk.
<svenstaro> How would you do that?
<highvoltage> I haven't done exactly that yet, but there's a plugin for PAM that creates home directories for users if they don't exist
<highvoltage> you could probably configure it to do so in /dev/shm/
<svenstaro> On second thought, I probably don't have enough space there because I need the users to run some apps locally, like firefox for flash videos else the server will explode.
<highvoltage> I guess you could also just have a bash script with a for loop that runs as a cron job and cleans the home directories out at midnight or something
<highvoltage> pygi: thanks for fixing my link, not sure how it got that way :)
<pygi> highvoltage, I see you finally decided to raise your voice :)
<highvoltage> pygi: it was overdue :-/
<pygi> highvoltage, yup, we talked about that some years ago xD
<svenstaro> Bare with me a little bit, I'm quite new to LTSP but otherwise I'm a good sysadmin. All changes that the users will see will be in the isolated chroot?
<highvoltage> svenstaro: well, their home directories are stored on your LTSP server
<highvoltage> svenstaro: and so are all of the non-local applications
<svenstaro> Okay, but if I want to install some educational software, I'll just chroot and apt-get and ltsp-image-update?
<highvoltage> svenstaro: so users actually don't directly "see" much of the chroot
<highvoltage> svenstaro: yes
<svenstaro> by LTSP server, you mean what *exactly*? The chroot is on my LTSP server, obviously.
<highvoltage> everything outside of the chroot.
<svenstaro> Uh, you mean I have to install apps outside of the chroot for people to be able to use them?
<highvoltage> for local apps, they need to be installed in the chroot, if you want to run them from the server, they must be installed there.
<svenstaro> I see. So if I want to run firefox locally, I need to install that bugger in the chroot and build the image?
<highvoltage> yes
<highvoltage> what version of Ubuntu are you running?
<svenstaro> 9.04, very freshly installed.
<highvoltage> ok, I know in older versions you also have to copy a script called ltsp-localapps from on of the LTSP documentation directories to somewhere in your path
<highvoltage> but I'm not sure if that's still required in 9.04
<svenstaro> There was a hint in the release notes about something with localapps gotten easier.
<svenstaro> localapps are MUST for me because the server is limitted to at most 2GBits
<svenstaro> I did a few local tests and quickly got to know that a single youtube video pulls 250Mbits raw.
<svenstaro> Also, 25% of my server, a full core.
<svenstaro> I can wire mac addresses to users and therefore autologins and therefore workstations, right?
<highvoltage> yes
<highvoltage> you can define that in the lts.conf file
<svenstaro> Nice. Which teacher administration tool would you use so that teachers get back some power?
<highvoltage> hmm, I'm not sure, I think ITIL works with Edubuntu, but I suggest you hang around here, you might get a better answer :)
<svenstaro> Right.
<svenstaro> Another thing, do properietary drivers work?
<svenstaro> Mainly for graphics so I can offload some media stuff onto the GPU.
<highvoltage> svenstaro: yep
<svenstaro> Is there any doc on this? I can't seem to find any.
<highvoltage> although I found the open source ATI drivers much better than the proprietary ones on jaunty.
<highvoltage> for nvidia the proprietary ones are still better i think
<svenstaro> Well I can choose between nv and nvidia and nvidia is a lot better.
<svenstaro> nv is without 3D acceleration, which is quite a must for some applications.
<highvoltage> svenstaro: docs are a problem at the moment, the LTSP wiki contains the best LTSP related documentation afaik
<svenstaro> In fact, I just shot a mail to the Edubuntu Docs guy and asked him to clean up the mess :/ Seriously, I'm finding so much old and new information about LTSP and I don't know which is which. Kind of frustrating.
<highvoltage> it is indeed, sorry about that. it's something that we'll be addressing soon after addressing some slightly more pressing community issues.
<svenstaro> Well, I can deal with it I guess, but I do have to wonder what those generic teachers will do.
<highvoltage> *nod*
<nubae> the ltsp docs are actually upstream now
<nubae> I'm pretty sure nobody is gonna be working on the edubuntu ltsp stuff
<nubae> for the ltsp upstream docs join #ltsp and check the topic
<svenstaro> http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/LtspDocumentationUpstream
<svenstaro> Right?
<nubae> yup
<svenstaro> So on Edubuntu, where should the lts.conf *really* reside? chroot or tftpd?
<nubae> tftpd
<nubae> but also in chroot, either or... though outside is preferable since u dont have to rebuild chroot for it to be active then
<svenstaro> Right, nice :)
<svenstaro> What is kiwi-ltsp and k12 from fedora and how do they relate and perform? There's genuinely mixed information about both.
<highvoltage> kiwi-ltsp is a fork for SuSE
<highvoltage> K12 uses LTSP on centos
<nubae> kiwi is actually great
<nubae> its not really a fork... it is still ltsp 5
<nubae> it just uses the kiwi back end to build images instead of nbd
<highvoltage> nubae: ok, ogra didn't seem to agree with that a while back
<nubae> I know :-)
<svenstaro> So what is k12 then? kiwi for fedora?
<nubae> the main reason being they do have their paths a little mixed up... ie, opt/ltsp is /srv/kiwi-ltsp
<nubae> and so on
<nubae> heh
<nubae> no, k12 is the educational version of fedora that includes ltsp
<nubae> I'd really recommend checking out opensuse-edu though, thats really quite impressive
<nubae> I hate to say it but its running circles around edubuntu
<svenstaro> Oh no, more circles yet!
<svenstaro> Actually, the original LTSP are pretty good. Some are pretty old but still it's comprehensive.
<svenstaro> The docs, that is.
<highvoltage> svenstaro: heh, the person you sent that e-mail to just pasted a part of it as a comment on my blog :)
<svenstaro> So, for nvidia I'd simply get ubuntu nvidia package from it's repos, make the clients X4_MODULE = nvidia, XSERVER = nvidia, MODULE = nvidia and bam, I've got native 3d acceleration?
<svenstaro> Oh my :P Can I get a link or does he say horrible stuff about me now.
<highvoltage> not at all, just a sec...
<highvoltage> svenstaro: http://jonathancarter.co.za/2009/04/26/what-should-become-of-edubuntu/#comment-228473
<nubae> yeah, edubuntu community needs to be motivated again
<nubae> I dont think I've seen a mail on the mailing list in a good month
<svenstaro> Oh dear :P
<svenstaro> What a horrible typo I did there.
<svenstaro> s/expect/except/g
<nubae> funny, there's the mention of sugar there, but that is just as dead as edubuntu...
<nubae> on the ubuntu platform that i
<nubae> is
<highvoltage> well, not quite, there's still one guy working on sugar
<highvoltage> *duck*
<highvoltage> (sorry bad joke)
<nubae> :-)
<svenstaro> I never tried sugar but from it looks like it isn't suited for my kind of environment.
<nubae> I moved to opensuse with that and started packaging along with some other folk, and we now have a really nice environment, including about 50 sugar activities running 0.84
<svenstaro> In my opinion, the disaccptance of Edubuntu is because there is 1) No comprehensive documentation 2) No mindset in the distro of what a real teacher would look forward to.
<svenstaro> You see, I'm still just a student myself 2 1/2 years away from finishing school, but I certainly know what kind of software I'd want to use as a teacher.
<nubae> well, it really happened because of the name change... it was suggested edubuntu become ubuntu-edu, and then everything got confused...
<svenstaro> Yeah, in my opinion, that was a big flaw. Edubuntu, LTSP and Ubuntu are different things with completely different goals each and they should be definitely separated.
<nubae> now we have the edubuntu web site and the edubuntu channel, but we don't even have canonical's blessing to distribute the edubuntu addon cd
<nubae> the only way to get it is via p2p
<svenstaro> Huh
<nubae> its all very sad...
<svenstaro> The main Ubuntu site has some references to Edubuntu even.
<nubae> yeah, thats outdated and all
<svenstaro> Meh :/
<svenstaro> Ironically that you made that blog post just yesterday.
<svenstaro> Woah, my English suffers badly from sleep deprivation.
<nubae> I haven't seen Riched in ages either, does he still work for canonical?
<nubae> anyway, highvoltage is right to sing praises to Laserjock (Jordan Mantha), he's been doing it all single handedly, I'm surprised he hasn't thrown in the towl...
<alkisg> "(04:10:50 Î¼Î¼) nubae: the only way to get it is via p2p" - what about this? http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/releases/9.04/release/edubuntu-9.04-addon-amd64.iso
<nubae> alkisg: hmmm, ok, u got me :-) At least it was discussed there would be no more support from canonical
<alkisg> It's not mirrored, but it is in the ubuntu site
<alkisg> (slow, but there :))
<nubae> ah no mirroring
<pygi> svenstaro, you know...
<nubae> that was it... well its similar in its destructio of edubuntu
<pygi> back in the time, I worked on the documentation ....
<pygi> and we actually created something
<pygi> but there was no real support from outside
<svenstaro> From my point of view, Edubuntu is kind of misdirected. Or rather, has always been rather misdirected. If it was meant for teachers, then teachers should be able to set it up and administrate it. The handbook does come close to that, but I imagine it provides too much for a quick look.
<pygi> right...
<nubae> the other problem is the installation medium, even though it makes sense to seperate the 2, from a user perspective, they want one cd to install the OS
<alkisg> Well, as a teacher, I think that edubuntu without LTSP is just a collection of applications. And because different countries have different educational systems, those collections are pretty much useless to most of the teachers :(
<nubae> alkisg: right
<svenstaro> Indeed. Why would you even want to perform to a 700mb iso? If you are gonna put it on a server, it might as well be a DVD.
<pygi> highvoltage, are you around?
<nubae> as fedora and opensuse have done
<pygi> I need to have a word with you
<svenstaro> alkisg: Exactly. There should be a quite advanced helper for the teachers to help them set them up an environment the way they want.
<alkisg> It would be much better if edubuntu was the ability to create custom packages lists per country..
<alkisg> E.g. edubuntu-el-primary
<svenstaro> alkisg: Not necessarily, for example in Germany, most schools randomly decide what tools to use for teaching. Because of lack of proper guidance and fear, we do not even use Google Earth, even though it's free for educational use. :/
<alkisg> svenstaro: so it wouldn't be possible for the german ministry of education to approve a list of applications for each level?
<alkisg> Because in Greece, I know such a thing would be possible.
<svenstaro> alkisg: Most probably not if the fate of the applications themselves is uncertain. Also that's called unfair market advantage around here.
<svenstaro> No application would ever be standardized. Every school has a get together once a year of all the teachers of one particular subject and they basically decide on what tools and books to use.
<alkisg> So what do your computer-related books have when they want to teach the students e.g. how to use a word processor?
<alkisg> Erm.... "what tools and books to use." => so the ministry doesn't publish books for all the students?
<svenstaro> No, private companies publish books on different subjects and the schools get to choose which company to follow for a few years.
<nubae> same with the British system
<pygi> same with Croatian system
<svenstaro> It's ultimately up to the head teacher of each subject to make the decision. In the end, the principal only gets to nod at the teachers' choices and has to somehow get the money from the school holder (next bigger city).
<svenstaro> Trying to enforce a standard on anything is fundamentally against our market system, so nothing is enforced, even though some media is banned.
<svenstaro> Anyway, what will become of Edubuntu?
<pygi> what we make out of it svenstaro I guess? :)
<pygi> I've left Edubuntu ages ago, for some of the reasons highvoltage mentions...
<svenstaro> So does Canocial approve Edubuntu or does it sanction it does it hate Edubuntu now?
<svenstaro> Give me some insight :P
<nubae> I think it just doesnt care
<pygi> probably something like that, yes
<svenstaro> Meh.
<svenstaro> And there isn't even any community member who really wants to work on it because... there isn't any community member who really wants to work on it... because (recursion) ?
<pygi> svenstaro, :p
<pygi> I think if anyone will really want to work on it, it'll be outside the project
<pygi> if you understand what I mean
<svenstaro> I'm actually quite short of building my own Edubuntu :P
<highvoltage> pygi: I'm around now
<pygi> highvoltage, are you going to UDS?
<highvoltage> pygi: yes.
<pygi> highvoltage, ohhh!
<pygi> cool, want us to raise some voices there?
<highvoltage> svenstaro: that's where I am at the moment, if we can't get Edubuntu on track again, I'll be resurecting some old work that I did as part of a distro we used to base on edubuntu
<highvoltage> pygi: yes, that's the plan
<pygi> highvoltage, pm then :)
<highvoltage> pygi: I think people should really get serious about Edubuntu again, that's first prize.
<pygi> svenstaro, do you have the resources to do that
<pygi> svenstaro, wake up :)
 * svenstaro wakes up
<svenstaro> I have resources as in time and machines. I'm a student, goddamnit :P
<svenstaro> Could Edubuntu become Schoolbuntu to address the intended audience further and to separate itself from the shattered remains that is Edubuntu?
<svenstaro> A fresh and genuinely clean start is dearly needed in my opinion.
<svenstaro> Every project start with a MEDIAwiki :P
<highvoltage> svenstaro: it depends on how things turn out
<svenstaro> When is UDS?
<pygi> svenstaro, end of May
<highvoltage> svenstaro: end of next month
<highvoltage> svenstaro: but we should have an answer on the lists way before then
<pygi> svenstaro, you have a pm btw
<svenstaro> Anyway, will you guys let me know how this turns out? I might not always be on IRC.
<highvoltage> svenstaro: yep, but please drop by again some time
<NCommander> good morning
<Ahmuck> i've an idea that could furhter edubuntu greatly
#edubuntu 2010-04-26
<dgroos> Good Morning!
<dgroos> I've been working to make a symlink for a good hour and have had un-success :(
<alkisg> a symlink?!
<dgroos> alkisg: hi :)
<dgroos> is this bad?
<alkisg> Hello
<alkisg> What exactly did you try?
<dgroos> I did this...
<dgroos> sudo ln -s /home/dgroos/Desktop/DogTraits /home/*/Desktop/Dogs
<dgroos> where DogTraits is an already existing folder I want to share to all...
<dgroos> And Dogs is the symlink I want to appear on everyone's Desktop
<alkisg> You'd need a loop for that
<dgroos> ?
<alkisg> for f in /home/*/Desktop; do ln -s /home/dgross/Desktop/DogTraits $f/Dogs; done
<alkisg> (and a sudo there...)
<dgroos> sorry--do I just type exactly as you wrote.. w a sudo?
<alkisg> for f in /home/*/Desktop; do echo sudo ln -s /home/dgross/Desktop/DogTraits $f/Dogs; done
<alkisg> type exactly that ^^
<alkisg> If it seems ok, then remove the "echo"
<dgroos> I don't know what you mean, 'If it seems ok, then remove the "echo"?
<alkisg> There's an echo in that line
<alkisg> That echo is used to show the instructions that are going to be executed, instead of executing them
<alkisg> Just run that command, you'll see what I mean
<dgroos> Right :)
<dgroos> it says, "sudo ln -s bash: /home/dgroos/Desktop/Dogtraits/: is a directory" is this good?
<alkisg> Nope. Did you copy/paste that line? Or did you type it?
<dgroos> type it... I'll try again
<dgroos> Or, I'll do irc on other computer, better...
<dgroos> for f in /home/*/Desktop; do echo sudo ln -s /home/dgross/Desktop/DogTraits $f/Dogs; done
 * alkisg reboots to check why statd isn't starting by default and is causing nfs to break...
<dgroos_> alkisg: And again, thanks :)
<alkisg> np :)
<alkisg> dgroos_: I usually do the same but for the teacher's "Public" directory
<dgroos_> Now I'll sprint to school and see if the permissions works correctly!
<alkisg> So everything he puts there, the students can see it from a symlink in their desktop dirs
<dgroos_> I know that over the summer I'm going to work on developing a sharing system--for next year
<dgroos_> So, I hope that I can put an image in that directory, DogTraits, and then any student can drag the images they need to their desktop as needed, but it won't delete the original in the DogTraits folder...
<alkisg> dgroos_, yeah, by default the teacher has read/write access there and the students read-only.
<dgroos_> Cool--I'm off!
<sbalneav> Morning all
<dinda> morning all:  is anyone familiar with setting up a local Moodle server?
<bencrisford> highvoltage: can I add UDS sessions to the meeting agenda?  because the way I see it, if we get them scheduled now, we can get the times that suit as many remote participants as poss.
#edubuntu 2010-04-27
<alkisg> Good morning
<mgariepy> good morning everyone
<stgraber> hey mgariepy
<mgariepy> how you doing stgraber ?
<stgraber> very good :) Testing some edubuntu and gently upgrading a bunch of services to Lucid where their hardy-equivalent were lacking important features ;)
<akgraner> highvolt1ge, stgraber   - http://www.ubuntu-user.com/Online/Blogs/Amber-Graner-You-in-Ubuntu/Edubuntu-Empowering-Enjoyable-Education-one-desktop-at-a-time!
<stgraber> akgraner: "Module not found"
<akgraner> dang it - They must still have the public link down - let me call them and find out...
<akgraner> stgraber, can you get to it this way - http://www.ubuntu-user.com/Online/Blogs/Amber-Graner-You-in-Ubuntu
<stgraber> ok, found the issue ;) that "!" isn't copy/pasted and so the URL doesn't work. Manually adding it at the end of the URL make it work
<akgraner> The site admins  were working on the site and have my permissions for adding images set wrong - so I am working on it
<akgraner> str
<akgraner> autotab fail :-(
<akgraner> stgraber, thanks as soon as they fix my permissions - I'll add the images
<stgraber> great, thanks
<akgraner> sorry it took so long
<akgraner> Also Issue 6 of Ubuntu User will have the CD with Edubuntu on it - Has any one talked to you all about anything for the Print Magazine?
<stgraber> nope, not me at least and I don't think Jonathan was contacted either
<mhall119> good interview
<akgraner> stgraber, okie dokie - let me send an email then - Issue 5 goes to print Thursday
<akgraner> Then we start working on Issue 6 - If you haven't heard back from by UDS will you ask me about it please
<akgraner> stgraber, and you all have permission to use a 2 x 4  above the neck and shoulders if you need too
<stgraber> akgraner: will you be physically at UDS this time too or remotely as you did for UDS-Karmic ?
<akgraner> stgraber, I'll be in Brussels
<akgraner> so one evening we can knock out the article with screen shots and all that good stuff if you all want
<stgraber> yep, sounds good. I'm still hoping for Jonathan to make it but he'd first need his passport back so he can apply for a european visa ... now that we are less than two weeks again, it becomes less and less likely to happen :(
<akgraner> :-(
<akgraner> I'll keep my fingers crossed
<mhall119> I hope the next UDS is in USA, so I don't need a passport
<stgraber> mhall119: currently it's a Europe-USA rotation, so if it stays that way you should be fine.
<dinda> akgraner:  did you manage to interview Chris Kenyon or anyone at Canonical about Edubuntu?
<mhall119> stgraber: I thought it was Europe-N. America
<stgraber> mhall119: well, last time it was outside the US in north america, it was in Montreal, not sure how long ago that was.
<mhall119> yeah, but I think new laws mean I need a passport even for Canada
<stgraber> mhall119: if I remember well (I live in Canada but I'm swiss so I need a passport to go to the US myself), you can sort-of upgrade your driving licence to act as some kind of passport to go to Canada
<stgraber> mhall119: it's supposed to be a lot easier and cheaper than getting an actual passport
<akgraner> dinda, not for this post - was hoping to do all that at UDS
<akgraner> I have Chris listed on my Interview spreadsheet though
<stgraber> dinda: that'd indeed be an interesting interview ;)
<mhall119> stgraber: I'll look into it, thanks
<mhall119> I just need to get a password anyway
<dinda> akgraner: ok, was hoping to get some 'official' word from them on status/future of h ow they see Edubuntu
<mhall119> so Canonical can give me free trips to Europe
<akgraner> I had him listed for another topic, but will put Edubuntu on there as well
<akgraner> dinda, gotcha
<dinda> stgraber:  yes, been trying to get official word as I hear from one camp the Edubuntu is officially supported and sometimes no response. . .
<akgraner> dinda, or anyone feel free to pm or email me questions and I'll see how to work them in
<dinda> stgraber: was trying to get a definitive answer if a school/person wanted to buy paid support for an Edubuntu install, could they?
<dinda> stgraber et al:  I'm working on a Using Edubuntu 9.10 course right now, CC licensed, so anyone acces teh course
<stgraber> dinda: my understanding so far (and that's what's know advertised as meta-information in the archive) is that components that are also part of ubuntu and kubuntu should have the same level of support as they have in ubuntu/kubuntu but the additional packages we include aren't supported (in the archive, it appears as a missing Supported: field).
<dinda> I hope to update it to the 10.04 release in time for summer and all those teachers with time on their hands :)
<stgraber> dinda: would be great to have an official statement and not just have to guess though
<dinda> stgraber: exactly, I think even Canonical is confused at the moment but it will get worked out
<stgraber> dinda: yeah, 10.04 should be a great release. The menu editor and fixed sabayon should make managing a classroom environment a lot easier and LTSP is just a click away now (instead of having to use the text installer for it as we had in the past).
<dinda> stgraber: I've been running 9.10 but look forward to upgrading soon and testing the ltsp stuff soon
<stgraber> dinda: will you be in Brussels ? It seems that we managed to miss each other at last UDS even though you told me which days you'd be there ;)
<dinda> stgraber: unfortunately wont' be in Brussels :(
<dinda> stgraber: but will try to listen in remotely
<akgraner> stgraber, dinda I noted the support question - if you all have more just drop me an email
<akgraner> catch you all laters and as soon as I can I'll add the images
<stgraber> akgraner: ok, thanks
<bencrisford> highvoltage: hows your internet?
<highvoltage> bencrisford: totally rubbish. sorry for all the parts/joins
<highvoltage> eek, I've been thrown in ##fix_your_connection
<highvoltage> (bye)
<bencrisford> isforinsects: hey
<isforinsects> bencrisford: hello
<bencrisford> isforinsects: I got your email :)
<isforinsects> So what's new in the edubuntu world?
<bencrisford> isforinsects: lots of exciting things going on :)
<bencrisford> theres a meeting tommorrow
<bencrisford> 19.00 UTC I think
<bencrisford> if you could attend that would be fantastic
<stgraber> yep, 19:00 UTC
<isforinsects> Hrrm, that is... 2200 est?
 * isforinsects checks
<stgraber> isforinsects: est as in EDT ?
<isforinsects> wrong direction, derp
<stgraber> bencrisford: did you see the interview ?
<isforinsects> yes. 1500
<stgraber> isforinsects: that's 3pm EDT
<isforinsects> this meeting: https://wiki.edubuntu.org/Edubuntu/Meetings/Agenda
<stgraber> yep
<bencrisford> stgraber: akgraner's one?
<stgraber> bencrisford: yup
<bencrisford> stgraber: yeah, was very nicely done :), hopefully it will help show people where we are and that we need them
#edubuntu 2010-04-28
<bencrisford> afternoon
<highvoltage> hi everyone
<bencrisford> highvoltage: evening
<bencrisford> highvoltage: at tonights meeting could we try and sort out UDS sessions
<stgraber> yep, sounds good
<bencrisford> because if we do it soon, it will mean we can make the sessions more accessible to remote participants
<highvoltage> yeah, I wish I could be around more today
<stgraber> anyway, got to go now, will be back for the meeting
<bencrisford> there should still be alot of sessions free
<highvoltage> I'm on my 'good' connection now...
<bencrisford> highvoltage: :)
<highvoltage> 19:23 -!- Irssi: Join to #edubuntu was synced in 53 secs
<highvoltage> and that's how bad it is :/
<stgraber> highvoltage: argh, that sucks.
<bencrisford> :/, and now you have no excuse to ignore my pings :P
<stgraber> we also need the website and release notes / technical overview and relesae announcement ready for tomorrow
<bencrisford> stgraber: that gonna be sorted via gobby doc?
<highvoltage> I think we'll have to stay with our current website for now and update to the new one post-release
<bencrisford> that sounds good, there is so much to do anyway
<highvoltage> bandwidth into canonical is going to suck for the next few days and sorting out problems isn't going to be fun
<bencrisford> creating marketing materials is gonna be tedious too...  gimp is fun for a couple of hours, but working with it for more can get tedious
 * bencrisford used tedious twice :/
<highvoltage> gimp doesn't sound like the right tool for it anyway. scribus and inksapce are probably better fits?
<bencrisford> depends what the materials are
<bencrisford> I use gimp alot for the image-y stuff, and fit it together with scribus
<bencrisford> inkscape I don't feel confident enough in, but hopefully some inkscape wizards will appear out of no-where and we can produce some awesome stuff
<bencrisford> scribus can be buggy as well, so we'll see how it goes
 * mhall119 liked the ironic over-use of "tedious"
<bencrisford> mhall119: I like that word, it sounds funny ^^
<bencrisford> teeeedious
<bencrisford> hehe
 * bencrisford is afraid he could be talking rubbish (caffeine has run out)
<mhall119> refill it
<highvoltage> hmm... caffeine... now there's an idea
<bencrisford> mhall119: nah, I haven't been sleeping properly for like a week, and i'm starting to fall apart physically...  i'm depriving myself of caffeine in the hope that it will cure my insomnia
<bencrisford> I even bought some camomile tea (i'm really desperate for sleep atm)
<mhall119> I stop drinking caffiene after noon so that I can sleep at night
<bencrisford> well its lie 4.39pm here
<mhall119> except a glass or two of iced tea
<bencrisford> like*
<mhall119> but there's not much caffiene in that
<bencrisford> no
<mhall119> I drink rootbeer instead of coke or pepsi because it's naturally caffiene free
 * bencrisford looks at the empty cook bottle on his desk...  woops
<bencrisford> coke*
<mhall119> say, is there a meeting today?
<bencrisford> think so
 * mhall119 needs to get these on his calendar
<bencrisford> 1h20s time if I am not mistaken
<mhall119> thanks
<mhall119> maybe I'll be able to attend some of this one
<bencrisford> I think evolution reminds me, but i'm pretty good at remembering things like that normally
<mhall119> yeah, I just need to put it on my calendar
<mhall119> I chat from my laptop at work, and work on my desktop, so I don't always pay attention
<bencrisford> phone calendar?
<bencrisford> I set one on there as well in case I fall asleep
 * bencrisford has an interesting looking book on his bed ( http://bit.ly/9eL3Oh ), which he might have a quick skim through before the meeting
<stgraber> meeting in two minutes
<alkisg> Lns, sbalneav, bencrisford > meeting
<Lns> thx alkisg
<bencrisford> alkisg: ty
<isforinsects> bencrisford: is the new edubuntu website up somewhere in test?  Or is there a git/bzr/etc repo I can clone?
<bencrisford> isforinsects: I think it was up somewhere as a test, but it might be in a repo somewhere as well, i'm not sure
<bencrisford> I can find you the url that I have for it
<bencrisford> not the repo, but the design
<bencrisford> http://edubuntu.frogandowl.org/
<isforinsects> why drupal?
<bencrisford> easily editable..?  not sure
<bencrisford> have an ask after the meeting when we retreat back here
<bencrisford> or during the meeting, but i'm not the guy to ask ;)
<highvoltage> stgraber: you got distracted? :)
<stgraber> slightly ;)
<vmlintu> Hi! I was asking earlier about the ldap/kerberos plans and I've been now checking what the server team is up-to. It looks like there'll be something happening on OpenLDAP schema/DIT setup level.
<stgraber> highvoltage:
<stgraber> highvoltage: sent some kind of meeting notes to the mailing-list. I hope I didn't miss something important ...
<bencrisford> stgraber: just the teams blueprint stuff, but that was only me and highvoltage :P, and I don't think we're gonna work on it until after UDS
<vmlintu> Also Debian Edu is currently wondering what to do with LDAP/Kerberos, so I'm trying to figure out what is the right place to work on this..
<highvoltage> vmlintu: that's a good question :)
<highvoltage> vmlintu: I guess the short answer is as widely as possible
<vmlintu> highvoltage: do you see that this is something that interests edubuntu devs?
<bencrisford> stgraber: did you see the discussion on the teams blueprint?  we were thinking a post-UDS IRC session to seperate the lp teams into 3 groups, deletion-leavingalone-fixing and then acting on them appropriately
<highvoltage> vmlintu: I can't speak for everyone but I personally see the value in it, unfortunately my LDAP knowledge is quite limited
<highvoltage> vmlintu: but I am interested and can at least review/sponsor any packaging if required
<bencrisford> stgraber: sound okay to you?  because I think most people had been distracted away from #ubuntu-meeting by the time we got on to that, so it didnt really get discussed by many people..
<vmlintu> highvoltage: what interests me most is whether there are others working on this for Edubuntu as I want to avoid doing double work
<highvoltage> vmlintu: yep, no risk of that!
<highvoltage> vmlintu: I've been following your blog and the discussion on debian-edu, and we'll pretty much use any contribution ldap wise that you make to ubuntu
<vmlintu> highvoltage: we have also others working on this now, but we'd probably need someone to help with packaging and such
<highvoltage> vmlintu: there are no other ldap plans currently here so there's not much risk of duplication
<vmlintu> highvoltage: ok, I'll then see what the server team is up-to and go forward with our current plans
<vmlintu> sometimes I wonder if our ltsp setups are just weird..
<bencrisford> night everyone
#edubuntu 2010-04-29
<highvoltage> hi everyone!
<stgraber> highvoltage: hi, do you have decent internet again ?
<highvoltage> stgraber: decent might be a bit of a stretch, but it seems *way* better that it was earlier this week, it's actually pretty much usable
<highvoltage> stgraber: we don't have a gobby/wiki page for release announcement yet do we?
<stgraber> highvoltage: can we try some skype (no video though ;)) ? there's a few things we should discuss
<highvoltage> ok
<stgraber> highvoltage: we have a gobby document but it's a simple copy/paste from 9.10
 * highvoltage starts up netbook
<stgraber> highvoltage: btw, if I believe gnome weather thingy, it's actually warmer here in Switzerland than in Cape Town ;)
<highvoltage> 24C here according to my gnome weather thingy :)
<highvoltage> (which is actually a bit warmer than usual for this time of the year)
<stgraber> 25C here this morning ;)
<Telenn> simple question... can anyone link me to a site where i can get a downloadable format of the ubuntu documention walkthrou's....
<sbalneav> Morning all
<sbalneav> highvoltage: Hey, here in Canada yet?
<highvoltage> sbalneav: heh, I've almost given up on that, I can't even get the canadian embassy to send me back my passport (with or without a visa)
<highvoltage> sbalneav: which is a real bummer because I can't even apply for my belgian visa without my passport, so at this rate no uds for me
<sbalneav> highvoltage: How come it's taking them so long?!
<sbalneav> Have you phoned them?
<sbalneav> Crumb.  I'm trying to build a package, and pbuilder-satisfydepends-dummy isn't being satisfied, but it gives no indication as to what's failing.
<highvoltage> sbalneav: they don't accept phone calls. only posts and faxes. not sure what that says about Canadians :)
<sbalneav> Friggin conservative government. :(
<sbalneav> *I* didn't vote for the scoundrels.
<sbalneav> Where did you send it to?  I work for a provincial government agency, so I know some feds.  Tell me where you sent it to, I'll try and make some phone calls, find out who you're supposed to contact.
<highvoltage> sbalneav: heh, thanks but it seems I'll just have to wait it out
<sbalneav> Are you sure?  I certainly don't mind running this down for you.
<bencrisford> afternoon all, and happy release day!
<bencrisford> highvoltage: hmm, are you an op?  because the channel still says "9.10 is released!"
<bencrisford> the topic needs updating :)
<bencrisford> or does it?  what time is it actually officially released?  lucid I mean
<bencrisford> ubuntu.com still says 9.10
<mhall119> bencrisford: it'll be released when it's released
<bencrisford> mhall119: that makes sense :), but when will that be ;)
<mhall119> sometime before the end of today
<ogra> bencrisford, go to #ubuntu-release-party and wait for it to come by :)
<bencrisford> ogra: Ok :D, I might just do that
<bencrisford> thats one busy channel :/
<ogra> many people are waiting :)
<ogra> (over 1200 this time, new record for that channel)
<alkisg> They had to respin the CDs due to some grub bug, so it's going to delay a little: http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=ODE5Ng
<bencrisford> wow :S
<bencrisford> are we [edubuntu] respinning?
<ogra> yes
<ogra> and stgraber is whirling to get them tested i think
<stgraber> edubuntu as already been completely tested, we are just waiting for the announcement
<stgraber> (though I'm doing some more tests)
<ogra> ah i thought amd64 was still behind
<stgraber> nope, fader did amd64, I'm just doing it as well to have more coverage
<ogra> ah
 * ogra is happy for no grub on ARM :)
<ogra> i had a relaxing day
<stgraber> ...
 * stgraber is installing his first 10.04 production server at the moment, a nice LTSP server based on a Core i5 and 4GB of RAM, should be enough for 6 clients ;)
<bencrisford> stgraber: cool
<bencrisford> you guys been busy today :D
<stgraber> yeah, last busy day, then vacation until UDS ;)
<stgraber> (well, technically I'm already on vacation, it's just that I'm probably even more busy this week than a regular work week ;))
<bencrisford> hehe
<highvoltage> bencrisford: 9.10 /is/ released :)
<bencrisford> highvoltage: yeah :D, but I was thinking lucid had been released, didn't occur to me that it might be later in the day :P
<highvoltage> hehe, yeah the version numbers go by so fast
<bencrisford> when I say to people who don't know about the version conventions, they assume its one up from 10.03
<bencrisford> so it doesnt sound as exciting as I try and make out to them
<bencrisford> hmm, that didnt sound right :P
<bencrisford> it doesnt sound as exciting as I try and make it sound
<bencrisford> until I explain, obviously
<highvoltage> bencrisford: :)
 * bencrisford should be preparing for his OW session next week :(
<bencrisford> I keep putting it off
<highvoltage> stgraber: do we have the ubuntu font anywhere?
<stgraber> highvoltage: I don't think so
<stgraber> highvoltage: I only received the letters as svg files
<highvoltage> ok, perhaps someone on -devel will have it
<bencrisford> highvoltage: thats another thing I was going to mention.  the banner on the edubuntu homepage - says 9.10, at some point we will need a 10.04 one
<bencrisford> I opened it up in gimp, and then realised that I didn't have the font :P
<highvoltage> bencrisford: I'm busy with that as we speak :)
<highvoltage> bencrisford: except that I'm dropping the banner entirely and replacing it with an image for the content page
<bencrisford> highvoltage: ok :)
<bencrisford> I was going to suggest that if we did have a banner, save the xcf somewhere dl'able to make it easily editable in future
<bencrisford> but if we're dropping it, no need :)
<highvoltage> bencrisford: the whole site will be dropped soon anyway :)
<highvoltage> (in favour of hedgemadge's fork)
<bencrisford> woo :D
 * bencrisford needs food :(
 * bencrisford searches for biscuits
<highvoltage> stgraber: eek, we don't have release notes yet do we?
<stgraber> highvoltage: we don't have any edubuntu-specific release notes so we should just link to ubuntu's
<highvoltage> stgraber: righto
<highvoltage> bencrisford: I ended up aborting my idea for a big picture since that theme can't do what I want it to do
<stgraber> highvoltage: you can flip the switch
<highvoltage> AYAYAYAY!!!
<stgraber> (that means Edubuntu 10.04 is now officialy release ;))
<highvoltage> switch flipped
<highvoltage> congratulations and thanks to everyone!!!
<stgraber> highvoltage: access denied
<stgraber> highvoltage: on /news/10.04-release
<highvoltage> eeeeek
<highvoltage> ah yes I see there was one switch that wasn't flipped :)
<stgraber> and another weekend without internet for the UK ;)
<highvoltage> hie hie :)
<highvoltage> stgraber: I'm just going to add a small section under "More Information" that explains that we're working on a new website that will be available soon with updated content
<stgraber> highvoltage: ok, sounds good
<alkisg> Congrats everyone, I think it's the best edubuntu release so far
<highvoltage> it's certainly been my most active one :)
 * alkisg will try to get more involved in the next lts, after his phd :)
<bencrisford> D= I missed the switch flipping!
<bencrisford> highvoltage: stgraber: hmm, I am getting a db error from edubuntu.org
<highvoltage> bencrisford: I guess mysql just crashed
<bencrisford> dont worry!  working now!
<highvoltage> heh ok
<bencrisford> highvoltage: yeah :D the mysql error was "Too many connections" according to drupal
<bencrisford> I guess our server isnt used to being so popular!
<mhall119> yay for popularity
<mhall119> need to start using memcache
<highvoltage> bencrisford: that's the same server that runs markshuttleworth.com, the ubuntu fridge, and a bunch of other sites. at least if it goes down it's important enough to get back up real soon :)
<stgraber> Mark's blog seems to be dead as well ;)
<bencrisford> stgraber: works for me, but no images
<bencrisford> anyway, were in Lucid!  congratz everyone :)
 * bencrisford cracks open champagne and shares celebratory ice cream
<sbalneav> Huzzah for us
<highvoltage> bencrisford: \o/
<bencrisford> wow, the kalzium molecular editor actually rocks :D
 * bencrisford whilst trying to explain ubuntu to friends has resorted to telling them there is a little penguin in your computer that is called the kernel
<highvoltage> bencrisford: heh when you get to the level where you have to explain what a kernel is, then you've gotten too far :)
<bencrisford> highvoltage: lol, well the penguin thing shut them up :P
<bencrisford> right now i'm trying to find a recipe for cookies or something so I can have some ubuntu or tux cookies to give people
<bencrisford> people might listen to my ramblings about linux a little more if I had food for them
<bencrisford> although I try not to ramble
<bencrisford> normally I just link people to the u.c release pages nowadays, and I seem to get a better response
<bencrisford> http://blog.josephhall.com/uploaded_images/DSC00379-tn.jpg - thats the sort of thing I was thinking :P, but it looks kind of hard...  I might just cut some shapes in a slice of toast or something
<highvoltage> bencrisford: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/node/300
<bencrisford> highvoltage: haha cool! that edubuntu one is awesome!
<highvoltage> :)
<bencrisford> hmm, circle of friends sandwich sounds realistic, but not sure what it would be :P
<bencrisford> realistic as in my culinary skills *might* just allow me to pull it off
<mhall119> highvoltage: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/mhall119#Baking%20Ubuntu
<bencrisford> wow, I didn't realise this stuff was so popular
<mhall119> my wife got the idea from someone else's posting
<mhall119> I think akgraner sent it to her
<highvoltage> heh
<bencrisford> hmm, I could get like a load of candy and melt it into shape with a blowtorch
#edubuntu 2010-04-30
<alkisg> Good morning
 * stgraber waves
<sbalneav> Morning all
<mhall119> morning
 * bencrisford has really messed up his 'buntu cakes
<mhall119> hope they still taste good
<bencrisford> I found a nice looking recipe, but it made way too many cakes, so I halved the ingredient amounts
<bencrisford> but it seems I forgot to halve the sugar and vanilla :(
<bencrisford> so I have really sweet, vanillery muffiny cup cake things
<bencrisford> and then I sort of gave up with putting an ubuntu design on
<bencrisford> because I didn't know how I would do it
<bencrisford> so I just melted some chocolate and marshmellows on the top
<bencrisford> basically, they are uber strong and sweet ubuntu cakes, that aren't actually ubuntu cakes :(
<bencrisford> mhall119: they dont actually taste that bad, but they can't be healthy :P
<mhall119> even better
<bencrisford> haha
<bencrisford> and there is flour everywhere :( because I ripped the bag by accident
<bencrisford> ill stick to oven chips and pizzas from now on
<mhall119> bencrisford: this is the article that inspired my wife: http://blog.josephhall.com/2006/11/sugar-cookies.html
<mhall119> his tux cookies are even more impressive: http://blog.josephhall.com/2006/11/tux-cookies.html
<bencrisford> mhall119: saw that yesterday when I was looking around online :D
<bencrisford> for recipes and that
<bencrisford> I liked the look of his circle of friends ones also :)
<isforinsects> 'ello all
<isforinsects> bencrisford: questions continue: what (if anything) is going on with the curriculum team?
<bencrisford> isforinsects: if that is the same as the ~edubuntu-study-content, then afaik - very little
<bencrisford> highvoltage: "9.10 is released" this time - the topic actually does need updating :)
<highvoltage> bencrisford: indeed :)
* highvoltage changed the topic of #edubuntu to: Edubuntu | http://www.edubuntu.org | wiki: http://wiki.edubuntu.org/Edubuntu | 10.04 is released!, see http://www.edubuntu.org/news/10.04-release | Help out with bugs: http://tinyurl.com/EduBugs | LTSP questions? also try #ltsp
<bencrisford> highvoltage: :),
<highvoltage> bencrisford: you've got something under your chin there
<bencrisford> highvoltage: do you mind if I edit the description of the teams blueprint so it includes what we discussed at the meeting wednesday
<bencrisford> and lol, so I have :P
<highvoltage> bencrisford: please go ahead
<bencrisford> highvoltage: btw, my ubuntu muffins kind of failed
<highvoltage> bencrisford: heh! what happened?
<bencrisford> I couldnt be bothered to make them look ubuntu-y...
<bencrisford> but before that I doubled the amount of sugar and vanilla by accident
<bencrisford> :/
<bencrisford> but, they still celebrated the lucid release in their own way :)
<bencrisford> and it was kind of fun getting everything covered in flour
<bencrisford> (clearing up on the other hand..  wasnt so fun)
<bencrisford> highvoltage: ok, I have changed the summary to include what we discussed on wednesday, making it clear what our "Action plan" roughly is at the moment
<bencrisford> I stuck to the same style and layout as it was, just updating some of the content
#edubuntu 2010-05-01
<HedgeMage> ping, highvoltage
<bencrisford> afternoon
<isforinsects> clear
<mhall119> highvoltage: do you know where Ubiquity get's its release name and number from?
<highvoltage> mhall119: I don't, at a guess I think it's one of the files outside of the acual casper image
<highvoltage> mhall119: #ubuntu-installer folk might be able to tell you... that is, if any of them are around today :)
<mhall119> thanks highvoltage
<mhall119> I'm wonding if it uses lsb-release
<highvoltage> it doesn't
#edubuntu 2010-05-02
<bencrisford> that was the best nights sleep I have had in a long time :)
<bencrisford> morning all
<mhall119> morning
<bencrisford> mhall119: afternoon :P
<mhall119> afternoon?  I'm not even done with my first cup of coffee
<stgraber> hello
<bencrisford> mhall119: lol, dont mention coffee :( im trying to give up
<bencrisford> stgraber: hi :)
 * bencrisford is teaching his lil' cousin bash
<bencrisford> not sure hes taking it all in...
 * etali wishes her niece would sit down in front of a computer long enough to even reach the "not taking it in" stage
<mhall119> bencrisford: don't give up, quitters never win
<bencrisford> anyway, its pouring with rain, and where I come from that normally means "lets go for a walk" :D
<mhall119> bencrisford: teach him python, it's easier
<bencrisford> etali: haha
<bencrisford> mhall119: truth is I just wanted to work on a script I started the other day, and he wont leave my side
<mhall119> lol
<mhall119> that's how my son got started with python, actually
<bencrisford> lol, nice :)
<mhall119> bencrisford: how old?
<etali> Maybe try Python if he shows an interest in doing something himself?  The results can look more exciting, which is a motivator
<bencrisford> mhall119: err, 10-ish?  I dunno, he seems young for his age
<bencrisford> etali: I used alot of zenity so it probably seemed exciting to him anyway
<bencrisford> I will suggest python to him though
<bencrisford> I think he could do well with it :)
<mhall119> bencrisford: my son is 6, he likes this game: http://img62.imageshack.us/i/quinnlaby.png/
<mhall119> there's also Jono's new PyJunior
<mhall119> and several others, like Rurple and Guido Von Robot
<bencrisford> I used to love games like that
<bencrisford> anyway, im going walkies :D
<bencrisford> back in a bit
<etali> Enjoy the rain :)
<mhall119> I'm kicking around the idea of making a myst-like game, only you solve the problems by writing Python snippets
<etali> mhall119: That sounds cool!  There's too many fake programming / hacker games these days, one where you do some real code would probably interest a lot of geeks.
<mhall119> I'm thinking that instead of saving their progress, i'll save their code, and then run through the game progress until they hit a stage without code
<mhall119> I'd call it "reboot", but I think I'd be sued
<etali> lol, how about POST, or Bootstrap?  (With POST you could make it stand for something different - Programmers Only Save Terra, or whatever the world in the game is called :-p)
 * etali wonders if ReBoot is still as cool as they remember it being.
<mhall119> no
<etali> no as in "reboot has aged really badly"?
<mhall119> yeah
<mhall119> CGI has come a long way since, what, 1994?
<etali> Wow, I forgot it had been that long!  I re-wo
<etali> ^^ I re-watched Battle of the Planets (was that the 80s?) recently, really regretted spoiling my memories of that *cringe*
<mhall119> lol
<mhall119> yeah, I stay away from childhood favorites for exactly that reason
<mhall119> but I think a game with an actual plot, isntead of just loco-style sprite control, would be a cool way to learn python
<mhall119> like, the entire world is make from code, and you have to modify parts to get the environment to behave differently
<mhall119> in order to solve the game
<mhall119> and it'll teach you different constructs as at each level
<mhall119> I'll have to play with pygame to figure out how to do this though
<mhall119> and lack of any kind of scene graph will make is more difficult to animate
<etali> It sounds like a pretty complex undertaking if you want to give the user the freedom to arrive at the right result any way they want to
<etali> Really cool idea, but I'm getting a headache just thinking about vague ways of doing it :)
<mhall119> well I wouldn't make everything about the environment hackable
<humbolto> how can I prevent certain partitions to show in nautilus/places?
<humbolto> I find some howtos that involve hal, which recently has been removed from ubuntu, so that does not help anymore.
<bencrisford> well that was a pleasant walk
<bencrisford> (hmm, sarcasm doesnt always work over IRC)
 * bencrisford really needs some caffeine
<bencrisford> Hmm, I can't seem to find a time-tabling software for linux
<bencrisford> I might start working on one
<bencrisford> education-wise it could help schools timetable lessons, and students timetable revision
<humbolto> Evince does not work in Lucid LTSP.
<humbolto> filed a bug already
<humbolto> but can somebody confirm that?
<bencrisford> isforinsects: it seems I have not accepted you in to the advocacy team yet :/, i'm sorry I thought i'd done that
#edubuntu 2011-04-25
<dyllan> hi all
<dyllan> I am having a problem with one of my thin clients, getting the ldm screen to show up, it PXE boots but then the screen stays blank. I am using this piece of hardware: http://www.devonit.com/_wp//wp-content/uploads/2010/10/TC5D-Dell.pdf
<dyllan> The only main difference between the thin client hardware that works and the one copied above that does not work is that non-working one had 2x DVI ports, do you think ltsp is getting confused about the dual DVI ports and therefore not able to bring up the ldm?
<dyllan> The thin client hardware that IS working: http://www.devonit.com/_wp//wp-content/uploads/2010/07/DIT_TC5Xc_SSheet-email.pdf
<dyllan> As you will see they both have the same Atom processor, memory and Graphics card.
<dyllan> hi all
<dyllan>  I am having a problem with one of my thin clients, getting the ldm screen to show up, it PXE boots but then the screen stays blank. I am using this piece of hardware: http://www.devonit.com/_wp//wp-content/uploads/2010/10/TC5D-Dell.pdf
<dyllan> The only main difference between the thin client hardware that works and the one copied above that does not work is that non-working one had 2x DVI ports, do you think ltsp is getting confused about the dual DVI ports and therefore not able to bring up the ldm?
<dyllan> The thin client hardware that IS working: http://www.devonit.com/_wp//wp-content/uploads/2010/07/DIT_TC5Xc_SSheet-email.pdf
<dyllan> As you will see they both have the same Atom processor, memory and Graphics card.
<dyllan> any ideas? - thanks!
<viks> ltsp is not workinng
<viks> fuse module is not showing
<viks> #ltsp
<viks> can we have ubuntu with only firefox applcation
<alkisg> viks: yes, it's very easy. You just create a "session" for firefox, and select it in GDM. Chromium-browser even puts a session automatically, so all you have to do is select it.
<alkisg> Google is your friend: http://www.instructables.com/id/Setting-Up-Ubuntu-as-a-Kiosk-Web-Appliance/
<alkisg> Also, your question isn't edubuntu-specific, so it's better to ask it in #ubuntu.
#edubuntu 2011-04-26
<vmlintu> good afternoon
<highvoltage> 10:14 < sladen> ron: FWIW, the author of Comic Sans is one of the designers who's worked on the ubuntu Font Family
<highvoltage> heh, that's interesting :)
<stgraber> is that a good thing ? :)
<highvoltage> I don't like Comic Sans, but I do like the Ubuntu Font
<highvoltage> otherwise it's just an interesting factoid :)
<stgraber> highvoltage: can you add "Do some translations testing with LTSP" to the big Oneiric todolist ?
<stgraber> highvoltage: installing from Alternate gives you LTSP in the right language but not everything is translated and the locale doesn't seem to always be set properly on login (missing .UTF-8 in some cases)
<stgraber> highvoltage: I won't open a bug because the existing one (Edubuntu) will cover most of that, just want to make sure we test it
<highvoltage> ok
<highvoltage> I'll make bugs for everything on that list and link it from the roadmap page within the next week or so
<stgraber> ok, I guess this one can just be an addon to that translation bug I opened before for Edubuntu, as in "once implemented, please really test it ;)"
<stgraber> ideally we should also have edubuntu-council or similar team subscribed to all of them + target them to oneiric so it's easy to get a todolist generate from LP without spending two hours doing bug searches (like I had to do a few times these past few weeks)
<highvoltage> stgraber: since when do we need 14.1GB to install edubuntu!?
<highvoltage> (I guess since the last daily build :) )
<highvoltage> stgraber: I'd rather suggest edubuntu-dev than edubuntu-council (and also that we fix the edubuntu-dev group some time)
<stgraber> highvoltage: not sure where that number comes from :) I'd think that if you install everything + LTSP you'd need 5-6GB, 14.1GB seems a bit excessive :)
<stgraber> the issue with subscribing edubuntu-dev is that it'll send the bugmail to any coredev + DMB + TB
<stgraber> though might be part of your "fix the edubuntu-dev group"
<stgraber> -council means it sends the e-mail to the EC which usually includes the ones who do the work anyway :)
<stgraber> or we could create a jonathan-and-stephane team and use that ;)
<highvoltage> stgraber: seems to be amd64 specific, amd64 won't let me progress in the installer because I don't have a 14.1GB disk installed, it worked before on the same VM though
<highvoltage> stgraber: hmm, I guess edubuntu-dev's contact should ideally be set to the edubuntu-devel mailing list
<highvoltage> (yes indeed re fixing edubuntu-dev group)
<highvoltage> what!?
<highvoltage> we don't have a jonathan-and-stephane team yet!?
<stgraber> wouldn't the bugmail spam edubuntu-dev ?
<stgraber> hmm, not that we really have much bugmail anyway and the ML is usually pretty quiet
<highvoltage> yeah we should keep the most edubuntu bug cloud go to edubuntu-bugs on lp
#edubuntu 2011-04-27
<ki> ltsp is not working in my case
<ki> its ot booting in kiosk mode
<highvoltage> http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v247/DrForester/SonyIsntGoodWithComputers.gif
<alkisg> Video in gif?!!! Wow...
<highvoltage> it was big in the 90's :)
<vmlintu> nice
<highvoltage> Edubuntu meeting anyone?
<highvoltage> (#ubuntu-meeting)
<stgraber> I'm around
<Ahmuck-Sr> is there a way to get edubuntu-meetings sent via e-mail?
<highvoltage> the logs? or reminders?
#edubuntu 2011-04-28
<Ahmuck-Sr> reminders
<highvoltage> I could do that again
<highvoltage> it's always last wednesday of the month and we did add a reminder on every single edubuntu web page about it
<highvoltage> but I guess it won't hurt poking the list about it
* highvoltage changed the topic of #edubuntu to: Edubuntu 11.04 is out! - http://www.edubuntu.org | Try Edubuntu WebLive!   http://edubuntu.org/weblive | wiki: http://wiki.edubuntu.org/Edubuntu | 10.10 is released!, see http://www.edubuntu.org/news/10.10-release | Help out with bugs: http://tinyurl.com/EduBugs | LTSP questions? also try #ltsp
<Kwpolska> I want to try ouf the WebLive of Ubuntu 11.04, but java support sucks on my system.  Can I just ssh -X to the machine?
<stgraber> Kwpolska: nope, it's not simply X over ssh. You can install nomachine's NX client though (http://www.nomachine.com/download.php)
<stgraber> Kwpolska: and then use "wget -O weblive.nxs http://www.edubuntu.org/weblive/nxs/weblive-appserv01.nx.stgraber.org/desktop/fullscreen" to grab the configuration file (replace weblive-appserv01 by the server you created an account on)
<Kwpolska> awesome, nxclient is in [extra]
<Kwpolska> stgraber: I can't do that.
<Kwpolska> stgraber: NX> 202 Authenticating user: nx
<Kwpolska> and then it says "authentication failed"
<stgraber> Kwpolska: what's the username you tried ?
<stgraber> the connection as user nx is usually fine, it then tries to su to your account, that may be the problem
<Kwpolska> stgraber: kwpolska
<Kwpolska> the file was downloaded through a shell server
<stgraber> ok, your account is on weblive-appserv03
<stgraber> so you need to: wget -O weblive.nxs http://www.edubuntu.org/weblive/nxs/weblive-appserv03.nx.stgraber.org/desktop/fullscreen
<Kwpolska> I did so.
<Kwpolska> I'll retry./
#edubuntu 2011-04-29
<dgroos> Just finished burning my iso of Natty Edubuntu and booting from it--looks shinny!
<dgroos> Thanks... again, to you creators of Edubuntu.
 * stgraber prepares his first Oneiric upload
<Ahmuck> is edubuntu like ubuntu 11.04 ?
<highvoltage> Ahmuck: That's like asking if Earth is like Mars :)
<highvoltage> (so yes and no)
<highvoltage> Ahmuck: edubuntu uses the classic gnome interface by default, my guess is that's what you are interested in knowing about :)
<Ahmuck> yes :)
<alkisg> highvoltage: it's still possible to select unity though, right?
<stgraber> alkisg: it's an option in the installer
<alkisg> Nice work :)
<stgraber> alkisg: if you choose it you'll get unity-3d when supported by your hardware and unity-2d as a fallback
<stgraber> AFAIK we are the only ones to ship both unity 3d and 2d
<alkisg> I tried natty on my daughter's netbook, I saw an "ubuntu" session, and something about "ubuntu safe mode" or something - that's unity 2d?
<alkisg> (and there was also ubuntu classic, which was the old UI)
<stgraber> "Ubuntu" is unity, there should be something for unity-3d and "Ubuntu classic" is the old UI
<alkisg> ty
<highvoltage> alkisg: yep
#edubuntu 2011-04-30
<hugelgupf> hi. somebody online?
<sumyunguy> howdy
<sumyunguy> can I update edubuntu from 10.10 to natty within edubuntu itself?
<Ahmuck> sumyunguy: in ubuntu you can, yes
<sumyunguy> lol how?
<sumyunguy> i have read all the release stuff and nothing says to upgrade do xyz
<sumyunguy> do I have to load from usb drive?
<sumyunguy> doesn't make sense
<ball> Is there some way to install Edubuntu over an existing Linux system?
<ball> (without using a CD or DVD)?
<pleia2> ball: that download link I gave you earlier has instructions "You can also install all Edubuntu packages, including artwork by installing the edubuntu-desktop package."
<pleia2> under " Installation on an existing Ubuntu system
<ball> pleia2: Do you think that'll fix her GUI?
<pleia2> what's the trouble with the GUI?
<ball> She had Xubuntu but I tried upgrading it to 11.4
<ball> ...it broke the panel.
<ball> (no menu top or bottom)
<pleia2> well, edubuntu uses gnome rather than xfce, so it wouldn't fix xfce's panels, it would load up a different gui
<pleia2> I don't know how to fix the xfce panels in 11.04 (haven't upgraded my own system yet)
<ball> I wouldn't try it.
<ball> brb
<ball> ...wondered if there was some way to mount and then chainload an iso image
<ball> ...or something like that.
<ball> Does 64-bit only make sense on a machine with more than 3 Gbytes RAM?
<doctormo> ball: YEs
<doctormo> pleia2: Hey p, how's plans?
<pleia2> doctormo: excellent! I'm excited about a million things and very busy :)
<doctormo> pleia2: Yeah, got my scanner working in the lab over the network, it runs from usb to cat5, back to usb, to server, server over saned to the rest of the clients.
<doctormo> Also basically completed my registration screen for the greeter, so people can register before they log in.
<doctormo> I think I'll do a video for it.
<doctormo> But man is it all a lot of work! :-)
<pleia2> nice!
<ball> I have to go.  I jus fell asleep again.
 * pleia2 heads out to dinner
* highvoltage changed the topic of #edubuntu to: Edubuntu 11.04 is out! - http://www.edubuntu.org | When asking questions, hang around for a bit, we're not always at our computers :) | Try  WebLive!   http://edubuntu.org/weblive | Help out with bugs: http://tinyurl.com/EduBugs | LTSP questions? also try #ltsp
#edubuntu 2011-05-01
<ball> hello alkisg
<alkisg> Good morning
<ball> Does the Edubuntu install generally produce a black screen and no evident disk activity?
<ball> Ah, I'm told that's a Natty thing.
 * ball gives up on Edubuntu, for now.
<alkisg> Is there an edubuntu 10.04.2 installation DVD available?
<revButtle> i do not wish to explore no less than the full capacity open source software can provide for the totality of my educational wishes & needs, please advise, respectfully, thank you for your time
<revButtle> this general question if answered intelligently is of no small positive recompense, so if something i say isn't clear don't hesitate to seek my aid in establishing an educated response to the education potential of education related open source software, respectfully, thank you for your time; i am not a bot
<revButtle> i do not know how to measure the potential of the open source software library in ensuring psychological/material security and harmlessness of any particular situation in general, please advise, respectfully i thank you for your time
<revButtle> if these questions already answered be kind enough to enlighten me :)
<revButtle> say i wish to recover a lack of informatic prowess and essential knowledge
<revButtle> so that my mind, body, lifestyle, world are not deprived of whatever aid i am capable of
<revButtle> or whatever enrichment i could offer
<revButtle> i do not know the measure or implementation of the maximal potential internet and society can do to enrich and aid the world
<revButtle_> the return ping was tardy so i reloaded this;
<revButtle> im not a philanthropist nor am i an activist i just don't want to have a computer for no more than entertainment but i don't see why i would need a computer or internet for the purposes i listed so maybe the only answer i need is something to shed light on my perspective; thank you for your time
<revButtle> this is not a joke. _ .
<doctormo> highvoltage: ping
<highvoltage> doctormo: pong
<doctormo> highvoltage: I've seen a handful of Edubuntu 11.04 reviews :-)
<doctormo> And I have an idea for 11.10 release.
<highvoltage> yep?
<doctormo> highvoltage: We could either make a new concept for the 11.10 release, or we could progress the current wallpaper and refine it further.
<doctormo> I'm also interested in your feelings now that it's out and you've gotten more responses.
<alkisg> highvoltage: we don't have an 10.04.2 DVD, do we?
<highvoltage> doctormo: at one point I was wondering if it's a good idea to perhaps start with a new wallpaper at LTS and then continue evolving the wallpaper until the next lts. but I havne't really thought it through completely. I like the idea of evolving the current one
<highvoltage> alkisg: nope, I know I'm contradicting myself against my last line but since Edubuntu isn't technicall LTS we don't have point releases for lts
<doctormo> alkisg: I guess without a support system, Edubuntu is really tailing ubuntu's support?
<highvoltage> doctormo: you're talking to him, alkisg *is* our support system!
<alkisg> Hehehe
<doctormo> alkisg: So, 3 years!?
<alkisg> Yup :)
<alkisg> Some teacher here wants to show off LTSP to other teachers, and he wants to give them a live DVD to try out in their labs, to see if they'll work OK with Ubuntu
<alkisg> I suggested edubuntu 10.04 to him, live ltsp works there, right?
<alkisg> (we prefer LTS releases because we don't have enough human resources to support non-lts ones...)
<vmlintu> highvoltage: do you know if there are going to be edubuntu sessions at UDS-O?
<highvoltage> vmlintu: yep, stgraber is scheduling it.
<highvoltage> alkisg: yep, live ltsp works on 10.04, but you just have to remember to let network manager settle down before starting it
<highvoltage> alkisg: if they're trying live ltsp it's probably best to boot edubuntu from a flash disk rather than a DVD for performance reasons
<vmlintu> highvoltage: are you going?
<alkisg> Nice - it's just for testing the hardware so performance won't matter much
<alkisg> Ty
<highvoltage> vmlintu: flight, hotel, etc is booked. I'm just waiting on my visa, and it's cutting a bit close at the moment, but I haven't had problem with a visa to europe before and I think it's probably that I'll be there
<vmlintu> ok, let's hope that it works out. I've been arranging to get there, but I have to admit that I don't know much of what is actually going on there.
<stgraber> alkisg: if you want an up to date 10.04 DVD (as we don't have 10.04.2), you can always unpack the squashfs on the DVD, upgrade it and repack. Same thing is true for the LTSP chroot squashfs. Then just rebuild the ISO.
<alkisg> Ah, cool, easy enough. Thanks stgraber :)
<stgraber> alkisg: the mkisofs command to repack the ISO is the tricky bit, but can easily be found on google when looking for live cd customization
<alkisg> I got that one, I had made a 9.10 live ltsp CD
<alkisg> (with proxydhcp, but now that edubuntu has live ltsp I didn't bother to make a newer one ;))
<doctormo> highvoltage: alkisg: thoughts on new art? http://doctormo.deviantart.com/#/d3fb519
 * alkisg likes the art but doesn't get the concept
<highvoltage> doctormo: I get "Deleted variation" when visiting that page
<doctormo> highvoltage: Sorry http://fav.me/d3fcs0z
<highvoltage> doctormo: I don't get it. I guess it's some alice in wonderland reference or something like that? :)
<highvoltage> (looks good at least)
<doctormo> highvoltage: Nope, some friends of mine bought their first house together, so I drew them a coat of arms. It's based on the art they make together.
<doctormo> So nothing you'd get unless you're into the Boston music scene.
<highvoltage> aah
<doctormo> highvoltage: But the imagary is similar to the style you were after i guess.
#edubuntu 2012-04-23
<stgraber> highvoltage: morning
<stgraber> highvoltage: can you check https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PrecisePangolin/ReleaseNotes/Edubuntu ?
<stgraber> highvoltage: I did a few updates, added some kind of generic description of Edubuntu at the top and fixed typos
<alkisg> extensive review of Ubuntu kernel configs  => wrong link, missing an "s" in /Specs/
<stgraber> alkisg: looking
<stgraber> alkisg: btw, I installed a small setup of 6 workstations at my father's school over the weekend, all running Edubuntu 12.04 in french and running epoptes. Works pretty nicely.
<alkisg> Cool :)
<alkisg> Some months ago I was a bit worried about its stability; now it appears to be quite stable, except for any rare x11vnc / xvnc4viewer crashes, of course :D
<stgraber> yeah, I had one case where xvnc4viewer wouldn't start on the teacher machine. Closing epoptes and re-opening fixed it
<stgraber> 11:51 < skaet> awesome.   Please thank the guy that spotted it from me.  :)
<stgraber> alkisg: ^ that's for you ;)
<alkisg> :D
<highvoltage> good morning stgraber, alkisg and jbicha
<alkisg> Good morning :)
<highvoltage> jbicha, stgraber: what bug were you talking about last night for gnome fallback session?
<stgraber> highvoltage: bug 986988
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 986988 in light-themes (Ubuntu) "UIFe: Re-enable the Ubuntu logo for the Applications menu in the GNOME Classic session" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/986988
<jbicha> highvoltage: good morning
<stgraber> highvoltage: rejected for 12.04 release though as it requires a rebuild of light-themes and gtk3 but might be worth getting in for .1
<stgraber> highvoltage: btw, will you have time to do all the screenshoting for the website today/tomorrow?
<jbicha> would the change affect your screenshots?
<stgraber> jbicha: probably but that'd just be one screenshot, so not worth worrying about
<highvoltage> ah yes, I was considering adding a few 12.04 tips and tricks somewhere that showed how to enable the distributor logo
<highvoltage> but having it on by default would've been great. it's no biggie updating screenshots though
<highvoltage> stgraber: I was planning on doing it on Wednesday, but I guess doing it sooner would probably be good since the server will still have some bandwidth :)
<jbicha> I didn't know until this weekend that it was possible to get the logo back
<stgraber> highvoltage: yeah, I'd prefer to have everything done by EOD tomorrow as we'll have to ask IS to setup the proxy, make a static snapshot, ...
<highvoltage> jbicha: ah, pity :)
<highvoltage> stgraber: righto
 * alkisg would also like to have the icon back
<alkisg> We'll probably use gnome-fallback session in schools here
<alkisg> *as the default
<jbicha> could you give your +1 to the bug report then, until we get Release Team approval
<alkisg> I did click in the affects me too, can I do something more? What?
<stgraber> jbicha: My -1 for release was with my release team hat on. Once I have the screenshots, I'll give the +1 for SRU.
#edubuntu 2012-04-24
<highvoltage> stgraber: http://edubuntu.org/sites/default/files/productivity_16.png and http://edubuntu.org/sites/default/files/ltsp-16.png seems to have gone missing (usually used on http://edubuntu.org/documentation), any idea what could have happened to them?
<stgraber> highvoltage: weird
<stgraber> highvoltage: http://edubuntu.org/sites/default/files/docimages/common/productivity.png and http://edubuntu.org/sites/default/files/docimages/common/ltsp.png
<highvoltage> great
<stgraber> highvoltage: page updated
<highvoltage> heh, I just clicked on "save" the same time I saw you saying that it's update
<highvoltage> *updated
<stgraber> :)
<stgraber> I guess I must have moved them to common 6 months ago because they were used by some other page I cleaned up
<highvoltage> I removed the installation guides/release notes/release announcements for all the releases older than 11.10 as well
<stgraber> common is the right place for all of them to be, so I'll probably just move the others there
<stgraber> k, sounds good
<highvoltage> stgraber: should I take the gnome-fallback session screenshots with the distributor logo or without it
<highvoltage> <question mark />
<stgraber> highvoltage: take it with the distributor logo, that's what we want it to look like anyway
<highvoltage> jbicha: is the sru for the distributor logo available?
<highvoltage> jbicha: I've gone ahead and included it in the screenshots so long: http://edubuntu.org/sites/default/files/docimages/apps-precise/gnome-fallback1_full.jpg
<jbicha> highvoltage: you can bug Cimi about https://code.launchpad.net/~jbicha/light-themes/fix-ambiance-in-gnome-panel/+merge/103001
<jbicha> the SRU was approved, it just needs to actually happen
<highvoltage> alkisg: howdy!
<alkisg> Hi highvoltage
<alkisg> The SRU will come to -proposed first, and then to normal updates?
<highvoltage> alkisg: could you perhaps provide 2 (or 4) screenshots for epoptes for http://edubuntu.org/screenshots ?
<alkisg> highvoltage: how about the ones in http://www.epoptes.org/screenshots ?
<highvoltage> alkisg: hmm, the first one looks broken, but I could use the others
<alkisg> It looks broken?!
<highvoltage> (ah it's back now, perhaps it was my connection)
<alkisg> Hehe someone also has one here: http://wioowszkole.org/media/images/albums/2012/03/03/epoptes6.png
<highvoltage> it was taken on 10.04 because it still uses the old light-themes, but I'll just gimp it out
<alkisg> And one showing drag 'n' drop here: http://www.epoptes.org/_/rsrc/1328100281757/documentation/groups/drag-n-drop.png
<highvoltage> hmm, we should actually include the kde help tool for the kde apps help
#edubuntu 2012-04-25
<highvoltage> stgraber, mgariepy: any comments on http://edubuntu.org/sites/default/files/banner-slideshow/precise-release.html for a release banner on edubuntu.org? http://edubuntu.org/sites/default/files/banner-slideshow/precise-release.html
<stgraber> highvoltage: looks good
<highvoltage> stgraber: I also think that we should have an "About Edubuntu" paragraph at the end of the announcement
 * highvoltage adds it so long
<stgraber> highvoltage: good idea, you can probably copy/paste some of what I put in the wiki announcement
<highvoltage> hmm, link?
<stgraber> highvoltage: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PrecisePangolin/ReleaseNotes/Edubuntu though looking at it again, there's only the first sentence you might re-use
<highvoltage> great
<highvoltage> stgraber: I'm going to change the spin slightly and assert Edubuntu more as a project than a product
<mgariepy> highvoltage, it looks good :)
<stgraber> highvoltage: I'll need to get the weblive VMs to run with libeatmydata ... it's so slow to build with all the fsyncs() and it's not like I care about the data
<highvoltage> heh, libeatmydata avoids the fsyncs? :)
<stgraber> yeah, it restores your system to pre-ext4 fiasco where you hope that the fs autosyncing is enough to get your data on disk
<stgraber> but prevents dpkg (well, everything) from calling fsync everytime they write to disk
<highvoltage> doesn't data=writeback do that already?
<stgraber> highvoltage: isn't that only for metadata syncing?
<highvoltage> from what I understand, data=writeback basically makes it work like reiserfs and if you have a power outage or something, you just travel back in time and lose all recent writes
<highvoltage> the quick usage instructions doesn't seem to disagree with either of us, but it does seem like data=writeback is the "ldm_directx" of ext4 :)
<highvoltage> http://kernel.org/doc/Documentation/filesystems/ext4.txt
<highvoltage> it's interesting how increasing the journal size could increase performance. I just go ahead and disable it completely on slow disks, like on my acer one.
<highvoltage> I've also had some success with commit=60 on slow disks where I wouldn't particular care losing a minutes worth of work (like also on the netbook)
<highvoltage> (but I'm sure you know about all of that already :p)
<stgraber> apparently I need to use cache=none on my VM disk
<stgraber> that should save quite a bit of cpu by avoiding use of the host cache
<stgraber> (I'm giving a partition directly to the VM)
<highvoltage> stgraber: mgariepy, alkisg, (and others): we have an edubuntu meeting at 19:00 UTC today, will you be able to make it?
<stgraber> should be
<alkisg> highvoltage: I don't think I can make it
<alkisg> highvoltage: one idea I'd like to discuss for 12.10 is that the edubuntu dvd could support ltsp fat clients with the existing squashfs image now
<alkisg> This would make the dvd smaller, the clients boot faster, and it would support fats along with thins
<highvoltage> alkisg: yeah knoppix does that and I always thought it was really cool
<highvoltage> ah you mean thin clients too, ok.
<alkisg> Now we have a chroot in the dvd
<alkisg> Instead of that, we could use the whole casper squashfs image as the chroot
<highvoltage> alkisg: and what happens when we want to install LTSP?
<alkisg> We'd need to have both ltsp-server and ltsp-client installed in the dvd for that to work
<alkisg> We just remove ltsp-client in that case
<highvoltage> I mean, when we install LTSP during the system installation?
<highvoltage> currently the installer uses the chroot that is shipped on the dvd for that
<alkisg> Two ideas:
<alkisg> 1) use the squashfs image of the cd,
<alkisg> or better yet,
<alkisg> 2) just clone the server disk
<alkisg> After ubiquity finishes, we can run ltsp-update-image --export-root
<alkisg> That uses the server disk, while cleaning it up a bit
<alkisg> (I've implemented it as part of ltsp-pnp, putting it upstream currently, will finish in a few weeks)
<alkisg> So people would have support for thin and fat clients out of the box and even with a smaller DVD
<highvoltage> server's disk? as in the server's /?
<alkisg> Yes
<alkisg> So it automatically takes the language settings and everything
<alkisg> The user accounts and other sensitive data are removed of course before being put in the chroot
<alkisg> Another thing I'd like in the 12.10 Ubuntu CDs (and edubuntu DVD) is ipxe
<alkisg> Would allow people that don't have bios netboot option to use the edubuntu dvd to netboot all clients
<alkisg> I think I've filed a bug report for that and it received positive comments...
<highvoltage> ok, interesting
<stgraber> highvoltage: can you help testing the amd64 image? weblive is taking me longer than expected
<highvoltage> stgraber: on it...
<highvoltage> (syncing now, I can't think that it would take long)
<stgraber> highvoltage: Ideally, do the following:
<stgraber>  - Boot to live session in a non-english language
<stgraber>  - Start LTSP-Live
<stgraber>  - Login from a thin client => check session language
<stgraber>  - Shutdown thin client
<stgraber>  - Install to disk in another language
<stgraber>  - Use manual partitioning
<stgraber>  - Use LTSP + gnome-fallback
<stgraber>  - Unselect tertiary
<stgraber>  - Select encrypted home
<stgraber> That's the easiest way of covering 95% of the code paths (just missing OEM)
<highvoltage> ok
<stgraber> if that all works, the image is good to ship
<highvoltage> stgraber, mgariepy: should we do a quick release roundup in #ubuntu-meeting since we have a meeting scheduled?
<stgraber> sure
<highvoltage> great.
<stgraber> highvoltage: install done
<stgraber> highvoltage: doing some post-install test of the codec fix
<mhall119> stgraber: highvoltage: I linkified some of the project names on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PrecisePangolin/ReleaseNotes/Edubuntu if you want to look over it
<highvoltage> I'm getting some weird graphics issues on ltsp-live, it looks like some weird compositing issues where any square is just drawn as a triangle
<stgraber> highvoltage: what video card are you using?
<stgraber> I'm using cirrus here and it looked good, using Precise's kvm
<highvoltage> stgraber: it's one of those good HP thin clients (with the intel mobile 4 iirc cards)
<stgraber> oh, ok, that's weird
<highvoltage> indeed, especially since I've never seen that so far on precise
<highvoltage> my checksums match. this is the right iso, right? http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/dvd/current/precise-dvd-amd64.iso
<stgraber> 20120425
<highvoltage> ok they're the same, at least
<highvoltage> well, ltsp-live itself works at least
<stgraber> yeah, just some weird ltsp issue to look into
<stgraber> apparently unity 3d is broken too, some people reported blank screens on LTSP unless you explicitly select ubuntu-2d
<stgraber> so much for 16bit just working I guess...
<stgraber> the dash overlay on the ubuntu wallpaper in 16bit is also extremely ugly, thankfully Edubuntu's wallpaper is quite a bit better
<highvoltage> ok I'm on to installing... the edubuntu slideshow looks cool in French :)
<stgraber> right, so I confirmed the codec fix, just checking that post-reboot oem still works and then waiting for your install result and will be consider as good to relesae
<stgraber> considering the few LTSP issues I've seen so far, I think we should prioritize these before any 12.10 feature work so we have them all fixed for 12.04.1
<stgraber> we won't be able to revert the 16bit change in an SRU but we should at least make sure the session always open fine and anything crashing because of 16bit gets fixed
<Ziron> Is the 12.04 release still on schedule for tomorrow?
<highvoltage> yep
<highvoltage> there's been some hickups but it shouldn't cause a delay
<stgraber> highvoltage: still installing?
<highvoltage> stgraber: yep, just checked
<highvoltage> stgraber: done, and I'm passing it despite the display problems I had in LTSP Live
<stgraber> k
<highvoltage> stgraber: I'll recheck that and file a bug if I can reproduce, if it's valid I guess we can SRU it for 12.04.1
<stgraber> yeah, if we can reproduce, we should fix and SRU
<stgraber> I don't have any LTSP hardware here so I'll need to wait to be back home before I can test any of that
<highvoltage> the installed system didn't have that error on LTSP
<stgraber> oh really? that's very odd then
<highvoltage> yep. perhaps something didn't reset properly on the thin client.
<stgraber> because we don't really change anything in lts.conf and the only thing we do to the image is run ltsp-update-image
<highvoltage> yep
<stgraber> yeah, sounds like graphical memory corruption or similar random weirdness
<highvoltage> but that's why I have to check again, perhaps it happens intermittently
<stgraber> anyway, can you post your results on the tracker before I move it?
<highvoltage> or perhaps it was just a fluke
<highvoltage> the tracker still says rebuilding though?
<stgraber> highvoltage: http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/milestones/214/builds/16053/testcases
<stgraber> the one in Precise Final is disabled until the new one in Precise Pre-release is tested
<highvoltage> ok
<stgraber> once you post your results I'll replace the current one in Precise Final by the one currently in Pre-release
<highvoltage> done
<stgraber> (yeah I know kind of complicated, skaet's idea ;) I think we'll discuss that at UDS and decide not to do it again)
#edubuntu 2012-04-26
<highvoltage> Congratulations to everyone who worked on the 12.04 release! It's now officially released!
* ChanServ changed the topic of #edubuntu to: Edubuntu 12.04 is out! - http://www.edubuntu.org | When asking questions, hang around for a bit, we're not always at our computers :) | Try   WebLive!   http://edubuntu.org/weblive | Help out with bugs: http://tinyurl.com/EduBugs | LTSP questions? also try #ltsp
<alkisg> Congrats!!! :)
<highvoltage> I took the orange home logo out of the secondary heading on the edubuntu.org page
<highvoltage> it was just looking ugly anyway :)
<highvoltage> alkisg: :)
<highvoltage> and I'll probably update the release banner too after things settle down a bit, it could be a bit nicer
<alkisg> highvoltage: I like the bright edubuntu ltsp background: http://edubuntu.org/sites/default/files/docimages/apps-precise/precise-ltsp-live-full.png
<highvoltage> alkisg: yes I agonised trying to find a nice background that has enough contrast so that you read the text and that looks simple and elegant
<highvoltage> alkisg: but the plymouth screen looked good so I recycled the light grey colours for the ldm theme :)
<mhall119> highvoltage: yoohoo
<mhall119> highvoltage: you joined our hangout
<highvoltage> mhall119: I'm typing in the chat box :)
<stgraber> highvoltage: almost 2000 edubuntu downloads from my server
<highvoltage> stgraber: nice!
<highvoltage> stgraber: I think we should add gnote in 12.10 (or tomboy, at least one good note taking app / desktop wiki)
<highvoltage> stgraber: around?
<alkisg> Â * A disk cloning/storage utility (ala Clonezilla, Fog, Ghost, etc)
<alkisg> ==> I was talking about that the other day, it's quite easy to do that with ltsp
<alkisg> And clonezilla has too many shortcomings to be useful :(
<highvoltage> alkisg: yeah that's what I thought too :D
<alkisg> Â * Authentication server (basically, something that provides LDAP/AD functionality) => just as a small starting point, we could again use the ltsp server for standalone machines authentication - all that is needed is ltsp-client over existing local installations
<alkisg> In the future I want to have all the accounts in linux servers, and VM/rdesktop/winbindd for windows clients
 * highvoltage likes the way that alkisg thinks
<alkisg> I think you write good roadmaps :D
<highvoltage> :)
 * alkisg is going to miss being at the UDS :-/
<ogra_> how about BTS then ?
<ogra_> (though i'm not yet sure i can come myself)
<alkisg> My leave of absense for phd comes to an end this summer, so it'll be difficult for me to leave in the middle of the school year
<alkisg> We should ask them to make it in europe once :)
<highvoltage> ogra_: oh no, even if they do it in europe?
<ogra_> highvoltage, BTS in europe isnt BTS
<alkisg> Greece has lots of seas :D
<ogra_> yeah, but that would be BTG :)
<ogra_> (by the greeks)
<alkisg> Well what if I arranged some greek univ students to do bikini shows? :P
<ogra_> or HLTSP
<ogra_> (Hellas LTSP)
<alkisg> Haha
<ogra_> (i wouldnt mind greece indeed :)  and would even less mind bikini shows )
<highvoltage> heh
<highvoltage> alkisg: I'm interested in your ideas for disk cloning using ltsp stuff.
<highvoltage> alkisg: what would you use for reading the disks? I know fog/clonezilla uses something else than dd (so that you don't read a whole disk just to get 4GB of data) but I haven't checked to see exactly what yet
<alkisg> highvoltage: for edubuntu, i.e. ext/btrfs, I was thinking of cloning the fat chroot
<alkisg> So, mount with nbd, and rsync to local disk, and run dpkg-reconfigure grub-pc
<alkisg> But it's also possible to have SCREEN_07="clone-master" as well
<highvoltage> alkisg: interesting
<alkisg> ...i.e. a script to select which partition to export with nbd, from a fat client itself
<alkisg> clonezilla unfortunately has bad requirements
<alkisg> First, it doesn't support cloning to smaller partition
<alkisg> So if my source partition is 50Gb, and only 5 are used, I can't clone it to a 40 Gb partition
<highvoltage> ah
#edubuntu 2012-04-27
<vmlintu_> alkisg: we've just been thinking of ways of cloning the nbd image to the local disk
<vmlintu_> alkisg: did you plan on installing the fat client chroot on the local disk and running from there?
<alkisg> vmlintu_: I want to support that as a possible scenario for slow local networks, yes
<alkisg> It involves 2 steps, as I thought it:
<alkisg> 1) Boot all the clients as ltsp clients. It'll be slow as the network is slow.
<alkisg> Run a "copy nbd image locally" script
<alkisg> Since that's a fat chroot, it can also contain gparted etc
<alkisg> I think here we'll do that part from epoptes, as it allows launching programs as root on the clients
<vmlintu_> have you done any tests on that yet?
<alkisg> 2) On boot, mount the nbd image and compare to the local version
<alkisg> If the remote image is newer, run rsync to sync it locally
<alkisg> So every time the sysadmin runs `ltsp-update-image`, the next boot will be a bit slower
<alkisg> Depending on the changes, it might need a couple of minutes to complete the boot process
<alkisg> That's all, it should allow for very slow networks to use LTSP
<vmlintu_> your plan sounds quite similar to what I had in mind
<alkisg> No, I haven't implemented anything about that part yet
<alkisg> I don't know when I'll have time for it
<vmlintu_> have you thought about the kernel updating part?
<vmlintu_> or would you always boot and load the kernel from the network?
<alkisg> That's on the (2) part as well
<alkisg> The newer kernel is available in the nbd image, one can copy it over its local /boot as well
<alkisg> (11:03:16 ÏÎ¼) vmlintu_: or would you always boot and load the kernel from the network? => that's a possible variation, yes, and it has an additional advantage:
<alkisg> one can just have a "sync-image-locally" kernel parameter,
<alkisg> and when that's in effect, it would copy the nbd image to the first hd partition, whatever that is,
<alkisg> so e.g. if it's a windows partition, it would sync the nbd image to C:\ltsp.nbd
<vmlintu_> that'd be interesting
<alkisg> The good side of it is that there's no step "1", so it can work even with student laptops
<alkisg> And e.g. in the summer vacations students can just delete that file to free up space
<alkisg> It'll be automatically synced on next boot
<vmlintu_> local kernel would enable some kind of wireless use, though
<vmlintu_> wireless updating would need to be done after wireless connection is up, though, so updating the image at boot time wouldn't work
<alkisg> True. One other thought is to use wubi or win32loader (the debian equivalent) to have the ltsp entry appear in the windows boot loader
<alkisg> It's a bit less intrusive for PCs that already have windows in their disks, no partitioning / other boot manager are needed
<alkisg> Finally, we also thought about the possibility to do the same thing with USB sticks, but currently they're a bit slow
<alkisg> I'm postponing the whole thing for later, for when btrfs snapshots are available out of the box
<vmlintu_> how would you use snapshots in this?
<alkisg> That way a client could boot with its older image and do a lazy rsync/update to the new one while students are working on it. When the update is done, it would take effect on the next boot.
<vmlintu_> I was thinking of storing two images on the disk: current and "next"
<alkisg> Currently storing images on NTFS volumes has problems; 100 % cpu usage for several seconds, making the system unresponsive and the students angry
<vmlintu_> ouch
<alkisg> So until that is solved, I'd go with the seperate partition solution, and I wouldn't want to have 2 of them, neither to have to duplicate the "old" into the "next" before rsync
<vmlintu_> yes, snapshots could solve that problem quite nicely
<alkisg> Also squashfs isn't rsync'able, so I'd use compressed btrfs, so I'd have to wait for it anyway
<vmlintu_> squashfs isn't rsync'able?
<alkisg> It's not writeable
<alkisg> It's read only
<alkisg> ...although it's possible to rsync from a squashfs network image to e.g. a local ext partition
<vmlintu_> I cannot twist my mind enough for that right now
<alkisg> But for slow USB sticks, a compressed btrfs would make a big difference
<alkisg> What I would also like to test, is 10 clients using x2go to connect to the LTSP server over 54mbps wifi
<alkisg> ...for older clients that are not good enough to be fat
<vmlintu_> do you mean rsync from mounted nbd image to local disk?
<alkisg> Yes
<alkisg> "nbd" can be whatever, squashfs, ext, btrfs, that's why I was specifically mentioning squashfs, as that one doesn't have write support, it's read-only by design
<alkisg> So you can't rsync it locally
<alkisg> You can copy it, but not rsync its contents to a local squashfs image, the local image needs to be something else, ext, btrfs...
<alkisg> $ sudo mount -o loop /opt/ltsp/images/i386.img /mnt
<alkisg> mount: warning: /mnt seems to be mounted read-only.
<vmlintu_> but you can rsync the whole image file from the server as a file to the local disk
<alkisg> ...I can't write anything in /mnt after mounting it, it's like mounting a cdrom
<alkisg> Yes, but since it's compressed, it's completely different
<alkisg> Even if you recompress the same data, the result might be completely different
<alkisg> So rsync makes no sense there, it's like doing "cp" from scratch
<vmlintu_> oh yes.. I just realised that we are using currently uncompressed squashfs images
<alkisg> Uncompressed squashfs would be rsyncable, but compressed btrfs would be rsyncable too and twice as fast
<alkisg> Uncompressed squashfs is too slow, I've never used it here
<vmlintu_> there were some stability issues with compressed images at some point
<vmlintu_> are the ubuntu images now compressed by default?
<alkisg> (11:31:20 ÏÎ¼) vmlintu_: there were some stability issues with compressed images at some point ==> no the stability problems were caused by nbd-proxy
<alkisg> (we never used nbd-proxy here)
<alkisg> (11:32:09 ÏÎ¼) vmlintu_: are the ubuntu images now compressed by default? => yes they're again compressed by default, and nbd-proxy is disabled by default as well
<vmlintu_> yes, I'm starting to remember those again.. I had forgotten the whole thing already
<alkisg> bbl
#edubuntu 2013-04-22
<highvoltage> stgraber: hey. remmina crashes on start :(
<highvoltage> stgraber: I guess it's too late to remove, so would it be something that would have to be fixed via -updates?
<stgraber> highvoltage: well, we couldn't really remove it ourselves, we inherit it from Ubuntu
<stgraber> highvoltage: so if it's broken in stock Ubuntu too, that probably should get fixed ASAP ;)
<stgraber> (doesn't seem to crash on start here)
<highvoltage> hmm, maybe it crashes on low screen resolutions or something (this was in a low resolution virtualbox), I'll go investigate further. it's comforting that it works somewhere, at least.
<stgraber> I didn't try to connect or anything but the main dialog at least showed up on my laptop (64bit clean raring install from yesterday)
<knas> test
#edubuntu 2013-04-23
<knas> hello good people
<knas> just installet edubuntu. trying it out
<knas> but cant seem to get any sound
<knas> whats the first step to find the problem? :P  complete linux newbie
<bcbc2> knas: you can look here as well https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebuggingSoundProblems
<dyllan> hi guys
<highvoltage> stgraber: why the new images? I tried the ones from earlier today and they looked good
<highvoltage> (afaict)
<stgraber> highvoltage: hang pre-partitioning on some systems
<highvoltage> ah.
<highvoltage> stgraber: I'm continuuing testing on these images so long anyway. remmina is good now, so it was fixed recently.
<dyllan> hi guys
<dyllan> I've tried locking down the wallpaper for Ubuntu 12.04 with gconf-editor and then dconf without luck, any ideas?
#edubuntu 2013-04-24
<dyllan> hi all.
<highvoltage> dyllan: hey
<highvoltage> stgraber: btw, I started putting together the release notes for the website, will finish up tonight
<highvoltage> stgraber: in terms of screenshots, I think we should keep the screenshots on the screenshot page LTS-only
<stgraber> highvoltage: agreed
<highvoltage> stgraber: and then have screenshots for new apps in the release announcement blog entry
<highvoltage> stgraber: can probably link from the screenshots page to the announcements too, explaining that these are programs that might make their way into future lts releases
<highvoltage> it also makes the release announcement a bit more exciting and interesting
<stgraber> that should fix the disabled+updates messages
<meerkat> Hello. Im compiling a list of what to seed once 13.04 goes live. Are there 2 versions of Edubuntu available? 32bit and 64 bit desktops?
<highvoltage> meerkat: that is correct
<highvoltage> in the future there will be an arm release too, but for 13.04 it's still just those two
<meerkat> all right. Thanks.
<stgraber> highvoltage: in case that wasn't clear, we've got another respin coming
<highvoltage> stgraber: ok :(
<stgraber> highvoltage: ^
<highvoltage> stgraber: ok, I'm at a guest house with a slowish connection but will start syncing
<highvoltage> stgraber: what changed?
<highvoltage> this wasn't the respin for calibre was it?
<stgraber> nope, that was the one of the illegal/nonfree skype icons
<highvoltage> heh, here I'm actually getting better speed than at the office for cdimage. heh.
<stgraber> hehe, here my grand-mother got upgraded to 75Mbps so I'll need to buy her a better access point, the current one can't cope ;)
<highvoltage> Telkom gave me a router/switch/AP that has "300mbps wireless N" written all over it in huge letters...
<highvoltage> but then the switch part only goes up to 100mbps :)
<stgraber> then next week internet should be even faster (company sprint) and then it'll be a shock going back to my "slow" 30Mbps at home
<stgraber> highvoltage: yeah, I alway found that quite stupid on those access points ;) at least my Linksys has a gigabit switch so you can actually use the bandwidth
<stgraber> otherwise you just get great speed between devices but that's not terribly useful :)
<highvoltage> yeah I need to go switch / AP hunting some time soon.
<stgraber> highvoltage: where are you at the moment anyway?
<highvoltage> stgraber: I'm in Johannesburg for the week for work. I need to do handover with someone who's leaving the company
<stgraber> k
<stgraber> then you'll be working remotely from Cape Town or is there an office over there?
<highvoltage> there's a smaller office there. I'll be working from there.
<highvoltage> most of the developers are in CT and most of the business/sales people are in Jo'burg
<highvoltage> I'm kind of the bridge between them so I'll probably travel a bit between the two cities again like in the old days
<highvoltage> the cape town office is actually just 2 big rooms, one is a conf room and the other is a big table where developers hang out and talk, code etc. it's only on Mondays that they come in to the office, the rest of the week everyone works from home
<stgraber> hehe, well at least it's not a huge waste of space like the Canonical Montreal office where most people also work remotely and we end up with a huge office mostly empty ;)
<highvoltage> the jo'burg offices we have is nice and big. it's a lot like a uds in the sense that there's a lot of rooms and people move around all day depending who they work with
<highvoltage> I really like that setup.
#edubuntu 2013-04-25
<stgraber> highvoltage: I'm doing update testing now btw
<highvoltage> stgraber: ok great, I think I'm going to skip this round of testing. I've done the last 3 images and there's been only a tiny change and I think if you run through this one then we should be good
<highvoltage> stgraber: I'm just filling in some of the smaller todo items for release, but overall I think we're looking good for release
<stgraber> ok
<stgraber> I built the latest iptables for raring and now I can do IPv6 NAT (yes it's evil), though the upside is that I've got IPv6 in my VMs and containers now
<stgraber> and with archive being on IPv6, I'm at 99.36% of IPv6 traffic today ;)
<stgraber> highvoltage: I'm checking if I've got enough bandwidth left at hetzner to mirror Edubuntu, depending on the result we may have to update the download/announcement pages
<stgraber> 4TB left, so I guess I'll be mirroring then (but not Kubuntu this time around, don't have enough bandwidth for that one)
<highvoltage> stgraber: ok great.
<stgraber> highvoltage: are we ready to press the button and release?
<stgraber> (waiting for the Supported: field to be sorted out but I guess we should be done in < 1 hour)
<highvoltage> stgraber: yep, then just need to add the links to the downloads page
<highvoltage> stgraber: edubuntu.org is still surprisingly snappy
<stgraber> highvoltage: I've already updated the downloads page for 13.04
<stgraber> highvoltage: and I did a couple of tweaks in the announcement (fixed URL to release notes, standardize the title, ...)
<highvoltage> stgraber: I see
<highvoltage> stgraber: ok just looked at it, looking good
<highvoltage> ah just need to add some attribution to the image I used...
<stgraber> highvoltage: documentation page updated too
<stgraber> highvoltage: do you already have an e-mail announcement ready or should I prepare my usual one?
<highvoltage> stgraber: I think you could go with your usual one. I know you like doing it ;)
<highvoltage> stgraber: everything else looks good
<stgraber> highvoltage: ok, I'll finish lunch and prepare the e-mail
<highvoltage> http://edubuntu.org/news/13.04-release
<meerkat> it is out?! :)
<meerkat> I'll start seeding. or downloading rather
* stgraber changed the topic of #edubuntu to: Edubuntu 13.04 is out! - http://www.edubuntu.org | When asking questions, hang around for a bit, we're not always at our computers :) | Help out with bugs: http://tinyurl.com/EduBugs | LTSP questions? also try #ltsp | Welcome to the playground, have lots of fun and behave yourself!
#edubuntu 2013-04-26
<DJRWolf> I did a direct download of Edubuntu 12.04.2 i386 and when I try to use it in VirtualBox it says it is not a bootable media, anyone ealts run into this problem?
#edubuntu 2013-04-27
<loof> Odd question... I'm trying to install 13.04 off a usb stick... I go to install and it's starting up X as if it's a live CD
<loof> Am I missing something obvious, or is there something wrong?
<highvoltage> hey everyone
<highvoltage> loof: that's normal if you choose the first option from the boot menu. inside the live session you'll find an install button on the main menu to the left
<highvoltage> loof: if you choose the second option on the usb boot menu then it will take you straight to the installer
#edubuntu 2014-04-22
<inpothet> hi
#edubuntu 2014-04-25
<Guest23406> hello
#edubuntu 2015-04-21
<newltsp> Hey guys i just created an edubuntu ltsp server
<newltsp> everything is working fine. I wanted to know how to make my server store users home dirs in a nfs server?
<newltsp> Guys please help
#edubuntu 2015-04-24
<otoman> hi, why there is not edubuntu 14.10 and 15.04 edubuntu release?
<highvoltage> hi ot<tab>
<ogra_> and he waited so patirently ....
<ogra_> a whopping 6 min !
<highvoltage> a new record? :)
#edubuntu 2016-04-26
<edubuntuuser2016> Hello, is anyone there for help?
#edubuntu 2017-04-25
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: golang-gopkg-flosch-pongo2.v3 (zesty-proposed/main) [3.0+git20141028.0.5e81b81-0ubuntu7 => 3.0+git20141028.0.5e81b81-0ubuntu8] (edubuntu, ubuntu-server)
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: golang-gopkg-lxc-go-lxc.v2 (zesty-proposed/main) [0.0~git20161126.1.82a07a6-0ubuntu3 => 0.0~git20161126.1.82a07a6-0ubuntu4] (edubuntu, ubuntu-server)
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: golang-goprotobuf (zesty-proposed/main) [0.0~git20161116.0.224aaba-3ubuntu1 => 0.0~git20161116.0.224aaba-3ubuntu2] (edubuntu, ubuntu-server)
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: golang-github-olekukonko-tablewriter (zesty-proposed/main) [0.0~git20151029.0.a5eefc2-1ubuntu6 => 0.0~git20151029.0.a5eefc2-1ubuntu7] (edubuntu, ubuntu-server)
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: golang-gocapability-dev (zesty-proposed/main) [0.0~git20150716.0.2c00dae-1ubuntu7 => 0.0~git20150716.0.2c00dae-1ubuntu8] (edubuntu, ubuntu-server)
#edubuntu 2017-04-26
<Indo> H
#edubuntu 2017-04-27
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: cloud-init (xenial-proposed/main) [0.7.9-90-g61eb03fe-0ubuntu1~16.04.1 => 0.7.9-113-g513e99e0-0ubuntu1~16.04.1] (edubuntu, ubuntu-cloud, ubuntu-server)
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: cloud-init (yakkety-proposed/main) [0.7.9-90-g61eb03fe-0ubuntu1~16.10.1 => 0.7.9-113-g513e99e0-0ubuntu1~16.10.1] (edubuntu, ubuntu-cloud, ubuntu-server)
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: cloud-init (zesty-proposed/main) [0.7.9-90-g61eb03fe-0ubuntu1 => 0.7.9-113-g513e99e0-0ubuntu1~17.04.1] (edubuntu, ubuntu-cloud, ubuntu-server)
#edubuntu 2017-04-29
<DrDog> 0987654321`
#edubuntu 2018-04-25
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: lxd (xenial-backports/main) [2.21-0ubuntu3~16.04.1 => 2.21-0ubuntu3~16.04.2] (edubuntu, ubuntu-server)
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: lxd (artful-backports/main) [2.21-0ubuntu3~17.10.1 => 2.21-0ubuntu3~17.10.2] (edubuntu, ubuntu-server)
#edubuntu 2018-04-27
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: cloud-init (bionic-proposed/main) [18.2-14-g6d48d265-0ubuntu1 => 18.2-27-g6ef92c98-0ubuntu1] (edubuntu, ubuntu-cloud, ubuntu-server)
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: cloud-init (bionic-proposed/main) [18.2-14-g6d48d265-0ubuntu1 => 18.2-27-g6ef92c98-0ubuntu1~18.04.1] (edubuntu, ubuntu-cloud, ubuntu-server)
#edubuntu 2020-04-20
<chattyMan1> hi
<chattyMan1> If on an ubuntu 18.04 sever, my UMASK is u=rwx g=rx o=rx; from another ubuntu computer should I be able to save files to that server?
#edubuntu 2020-04-21
<sacarde> hi
<sacarde> is possible to download edubuntu-14.04 iso ?
<sacarde> I find old iso.... http://old-releases.ubuntu.com/releases/edubuntu/
<sacarde> but dont find 14.04
<sacarde> ok
<sacarde> found
<sacarde> http://ftp.belnet.be/mirror/edubuntu.org/releases/14.04.2/release/
#edubuntu 2020-04-22
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: incremental (focal-proposed/main) [16.10.1-3.1 => 16.10.1-3.2] (edubuntu, ubuntu-server) (sync)
#edubuntu 2020-04-23
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: sphinx (focal-proposed/main) [1.8.5-7ubuntu2 => 1.8.5-7ubuntu3] (edubuntu, i386-whitelist, ubuntu-desktop, ubuntu-server)
