#ubuntu-uds-room-203 2012-05-08
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* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-uds-room-203 to: Track: Community | App Developer external outreach | Url: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-q/meeting/20546/community-p-appdevelopers-external-outreach/ | Audio: http://icecast.ubuntu.com:8000/room-203.ogg.m3u
<dmj726> hello
<dmj726> are we ready to begin :)
<highvoltage> anyone on IRC?
<dmj726> yep, I can hear you!
<dscassel> highvoltage: Yup. :)
<dpm> notes at http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-q/meeting/20546/community-p-appdevelopers-external-outreach
<dmj726> I have published one thing through the app portal.
<dmj726> What about finding ways to spotlight successful apps that are already in the app store?
<dmj726> Showing apps doing well on Ubuntu would likely attract developers developing elsewhere
<mhall119> dmj726: we have another session about ways to promote the success of apps
<dscassel> We need success stories.
<dmj726> mhall119: which session is that?
<dmj726> I just figured that that would help get people to jump on the bandwagon
<mhall119> dmj726: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-q/meeting/20417/community-q-app-promotion/ and http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-q/meeting/20415/community-q-upstream-evangelism/
<dmj726> mhall119: cool, will be interested in those from this: https://apps.ubuntu.com/cat/applications/zhackers-volume1-usc/
<dmj726> Getting onto Ubuntu isn't that hard
<dmj726> either from linux or windows
<dmj726> we need new apps
<dmj726> it's not a big problem having an app available from a ppa or third party repo
<dmj726> the big problem is apps that aren't available at all
<dscassel> Convincing Unity3D (the game platform) to port to Ubuntu would help tonnes.
<dscassel> (although that might confuse people. :)
<dscassel> In my exprience, there are plenty of developers (mostly web devs) who are running Ubuntu.
<dscassel> They're not writing apps, though.
<dmj726> dscassel: really?
<dscassel> dmj726: Yeah. Locally, in dev groups, it's the second platform after mac. Windows is 3rd.
<dmj726> dscassel: Given recent trends in Ubuntu app development, it sounds like they could be an easy sell on native apps using webkit-gtk and userwebkit
<dmj726> Novacut is a good example for how to do this
<dscassel> dmj726: Yeah! That's what I want to hear. I want to know enough to know how to pitch that to them.
<dmj726> dscassel: Talk to jderose (Jason DeRose) and especially JamesMR (James Raymond)
<dscassel> I have a side project I don't have enough time for where I want to put send a little game on developer.ubuntu.com so I can show people how it's done.
<dscassel> dmj726: Will do. Thanks. :)
<dmj726> We need a good success stories businesswise
<dmj726> need good advertising story
<dmj726> Humble indie bundle (generally 25% of their money)
<dmj726> adam savage likes linux
<dmj726> ^^ mythbuster
<dmj726> Making it easy to get new releases of software into released versions of ubuntu is a big issue
<dmj726> so you shouldn't need an alpha version of ubuntu for GIMP 2.8
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* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-uds-room-203 to: Track: Desktop | Synchronizing settings among multiple computers using Ubuntu One | Url: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-q/meeting/20796/synchronizing-settings-among-multiple-computers-using-ubuntu-one/ | Audio: http://icecast.ubuntu.com:8000/room-203.ogg.m3u
#ubuntu-uds-room-203 2012-05-09
<patrickdickey> I don't have the audio feed working yet, but I was wondering if this is intended to be a step past the current status with synching between computers?  By that I mean, instead of just showing what applications are installed, do you want to give something like a "one-click" option to install and configure all computers the same way?
<patrickdickey> I finally got it working. Had to install vlc to hear.
<ChipaPhone> that's something that should be done by system management
<ChipaPhone> (so, not this session)
<patrickdickey> So this would be more about synching your config files (from your /home directory) then? I'm just trying to get a better understanding.
<ChipaPhone> yup
<ChipaPhone> per app, that is
<ChipaPhone> not sure if you're following the audio
<alexmoldovan> what about having some config files directly on U1 and then symlink them locally...
<ChipaPhone> what about it?
<patrickdickey> So, functionality would need to be put into the Ubuntu-one daemon (or ubuntu itself) to force a restart of the apps, when the settings change? Or the apps would have to designed to listen/look for the changed settings.
<patrickdickey> One thing that would make this easier (if I'm understanding everything correctly) is if apps would stop using global settings, and start using per user settings. Since synching my settings shouldn't affect how you are using the app -even on the same system.
<patrickdickey> Nothing right off-hand. It brings me to my next question though. Since the apps user settings,then wouldn't it be realistic that if I change the settings on one computer, I'm going to either shut down the app on other computers, or restart them myself?
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<cmagina> autotest has performance tests and profilers (sar, sysstat, etc.)
<med_> a lot of talk about IPMI early in this session.  Will the existing WOL support be retained as well
<med_> thanks Daviey.
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<SpamapS> You guys got it all figured out right?
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* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-uds-room-203 to: Track: Desktop | System Compositor | Url: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-q/meeting/20429/desktop-q-system-compositor/ | Audio: http://icecast.ubuntu.com:8000/room-203.ogg.m3u
<Darxus> Who's talking?
<lallenlowe> it's about time
<lallenlowe> sounds liek robert
<lallenlowe> ancell
<lallenlowe> Darxus: hey, sup
 * thiago is here too
<thiago> across the bay, in SF
<AlanBell> lallenlowe: yes it is Robert Ancell
<lallenlowe> are we going to use weston or write a custom wayland compositor?
<lallenlowe> doesn't nouveau work with wayland?
<Darxus> lallenlowe: Yes, nouveau works with wayland.
<lallenlowe> and in the mean time people with nvidia cards can use nouveau
<thiago> but people with nvidia cards will eventually want to use the nvidia driver, and it needs to work with whatever solution is adopted
<lallenlowe> agreed, but as they said, that isn't gonna happen until nvidia sees that they are missing out on useful functionality
<thiago> the OSS drivers should work, provided you have a recent Mesa
<thiago> another thing you can say is "best experience with these drivers, if you don't have it, you get a text boot sequence"
<Darxus> And a sufficiently recent version of mesa for use with wayland 0.85 is included with precise, as well as wayland and weston packages.
<thiago> right, but we'll have wayland 0.90 or 0.95 and they might need an updated Mesa
<Darxus> Yep.
<thiago> why is that (the breakage)?
<thiago> libGL.so.1?
<Darxus> thiago: You mean why does using the nvidia proprietary driver break simultaneously using another card?  (I don't know)
<thiago> Darxus: yes
<Darxus> Weston's current desktop shell is a plugin, might make sense to implement switchers that way.
<alf_> How will the VTs work with this scheme without KMS (eg with nvidia) ?
<Darxus> alf_: With the nvidia proprietary driver, you'll fall back to what you get now.  No change.
<Darxus> Although the other question - how will VTs be done with a system compositor?
<Darxus> What about the... drmcon?
<Darxus> Okay, so switching to a VT should remain the same, with a system compositor?
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<thiago> I don't see why it would be different. There's one VT where it's running.
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<Darxus> You guys know about kmscon, right?  Console output via kms...
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<thiago> signing off
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<Darxus> I'll test, I have a radeon.
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<Darxus> krh and somebody else has done some work on a system compositor.
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<Darxus> sadmac was the other person working on a system compositor.
<AlanBell> mhall119: hi are you popping into here?
<AlanBell> no, not here :)
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#ubuntu-uds-room-203 2012-05-10
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<mpt> Bye Luke :-)
<mpt> Is Ted Gould, Lars Uebernickel, Charles Kerr, or Conor Curran there?
<mpt> oh, there's charles on IRC
<mpt> \o/
<mpt> I think I heard Ana as well
<mpt> hello!
<mpt> Only your first UDS and already you get to sit in the front row
<mpt> I am online
<mpt> Is that better?
<charles> http://design.canonical.com/2012/04/status-menus/
<NMinker> how long is the lag?
<NMinker> bless you
<shirgall> An ical feed would work for those who use Google Calendar
<jbicha> are those on/off switches already supported for indicators?
<kenvandine> jbicha, not yet
<jbicha> some airlines allow wifi now
<shirgall> Can we reduce the number of lines consumed for items/catories that are disabled, and for enabling them?
<shirgall> For example: on my laptop, I have Mobile Broadband, and a line that says "not enabled" and another line that says "Enable mobile broadband".
<jbicha> shirgall: having the on/off switch should help with that
<shirgall> jbicha: yeah, on some devices you end up with a lot of networking devices and the window gets huge
<shirgall> On Bluetooth, why do we have "send files to device" and "Browse files on device" instead of just exposing it as another filesystem in Nautilus?
<shirgall> It would be nice to switch power save profiles with the battery indicator instead of addons like cpufreq or jupiter
<mpt> shirgall, I don't know for sure, but I think it is because there might be dozens of applicable devices nearby which would full Nautilus's side pane
<shirgall> mpt: fair enough, but the bluetooth menu doesn't list applicable devices either... if there was a filestore that could be explored, wouldn't it be better to show it and open nautilus on it and show nothing if there are no applicable devices?
<shirgall> messaging menu should be able to start those applications
<shirgall> Not happy that my messaging menu is currently showing "Set up Mail..." and "Thunderbird Mail" simultaneously.
<mpt> shirgall, that would be a bug
<shirgall> dmy default application for mail is set up as "Gnome Gmail"
<shirgall> So far that cough was the loudest thing to come through the stream. :)
<mpt> It's weird to hear someone typing something after it's already shown up in Etherpad
<NMinker> indeed
<NMinker> It's kind of like seeing into the future
<mpt> The indicator has/had the "it disappears just as you're about to click" problem too
<shirgall> It stays as long as there's a local job, right?
<mpt> This is an open question, though -- we could let it stay open afterwards
<mpt> shirgall, yes
<shirgall> if the job gets an error, it stays, I have tested this by stopping the queue on the other machine
<shirgall> For example, I had overaggressive ufw settings, jobs stalled
<shirgall> Super p r i n click the first icon :)
<mpt> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NotificationDesignGuidelines
<shirgall> Session dropped, but no IRC notification
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<shirgall> QoS does exist
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<mpt> Add a work item for me to check that accessible titles are in all the specs too
<mpt> There is for the sound menu and messaging menu, at least (just checked those now
<mpt> )
<shirgall> (and do they need to be translated?)
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<shirgall> Do my questions above count?
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 * jledbetter waves
<jledbetter> Howdy :)
<jledbetter> Audio is dropping for me
<jtatum> yikes
<jtatum> nobody's touching it
<jledbetter> Maybe the  network. I dunno.
<jledbetter> People must be using up all the wifi playing their games ;) Ok. I can hear stuff.
<jtatum> still egetting setup
<jledbetter> np. *keeps eating* have to run from this to another meeting next door
<jledbetter> jtatum: get me a magnet please :)
<jledbetter> Will try :)
<jledbetter> Cool
<akk> How does pleia2 tweet while talking? :)
 * philipballew wonders himself
<jledbetter> She's uber multitasker
<grantbow> uber
 * jledbetter wants cloning technology!
<akk> Or a time-turner.
<jledbetter> Oh. Yes.
<jledbetter> And can be approached with questions after too. (re: role model)
<pleia2> yeah :)
 * jledbetter can help with WP
<akk> Everybody's seeing the same "fatal error" I am, I assume?
<jtatum> yes, akk
<akk> It also had a problem where it wasn't picking up feeds from a lot of participants.
<philipballew> yes akk
<grantbow> google cached blog.ubuntu-women.org page (wayback.archive.org didn't have it)
<grantbow> http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CCQQIDAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwebcache.googleusercontent.com%2Fsearch%3Fq%3Dcache%3Anop-Ta4VDv0J%3Ablog.ubuntu-women.org%2F%2B%26cd%3D1%26hl%3Den%26ct%3Dclnk%26gl%3Dus&ei=rBSsT8GsMuKi2wXf7fylAg&usg=AFQjCNFWoeNE8fwRlHYVfjaPIefqsgJv2g&sig2=pbN1_WoMS11E1M_8aLFkYA
<akk> huge header indeed
<jtatum> looks fixable, lot of whitespace in the image
<jledbetter> sorry, sound keeps dropping again.
<akk> Sound is working well here, though it doesn't reach to all the questioners.
<jledbetter> Ah. It's probably my network. I left my desk so I wouldn't be disturbed for this.
<akk> I'm getting tiny dropouts but not long enough to miss anything.
<jledbetter> Hm ok. My tiny dropouts are enough to miss something. It's ok. I'm back in and can follow along in the pad :)
<jledbetter> next UDS sounds like we should have a what is U-W and a separate session on U-W planning :)
<jledbetter> October 16 http://findingada.com/
<akk> Also, posting in a non-PDF format adds google-fu.
<jledbetter> +1 non-PDF
<jledbetter> We'd talked about using UBT by finding friendly mentors in that project to funnel folks into the Ubuntu projects.
<paulproteus> akk++
<paulproteus> jledbetter: UBT?
<jtatum> ubuntu beginner's team
<paulproteus> Thanks!
<jledbetter> paulproteus: For mo infos: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam
<jledbetter> sometimes just the mentoring is how to get started/where to go
<paulproteus> <backchannel>I would love to get more people in UBT and ubuntu-women to care about http://openhatch.org/missions/ and find out if that's something ubuntu-women can recommend to people, but don't want to be too self-promote-y</backchannel>
<jledbetter> paulproteus: You recruiter you ;)
<jledbetter> +1 to not everyone using irc
<paulproteus> http://adainitiative.org/2012/05/reminder-adacamp-dc-travel-applications-close-this-friday-may-11/
<paulproteus> re: my backchannel thing: I'll just bring that up on the mailing list.
 * jledbetter waves. See y'all later. Got a meeting at 1 :)
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<highvoltage> pleia2: I added a block for http://edubuntu.org that links to ubuntu-women, is the text ok? (suggestions welcome)
<pleia2> highvoltage: that's great! thank you :)
<highvoltage> :)
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<mpt> Is this the authentication session? It doesn't sound particularly ... authenticationistic
<mpt> Who proposed it?
<mpt> That would be laggy
<mpt> The streaming audio is about ten seconds behind real life
<mpt> Any new authentication scheme would need to be recognized in at least unity-greeter, policyKit-gnome, and gnome-control-center
<mpt> There is a separate session on fingerprint authentication: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-p-fingerprintauthentication
<mpt> And it's been discussed at *four* UDSes previously: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/fingerprint-authentication
<mpt> (actually, three, declined for one)
<mpt> So, I suggest first deciding, what specifically do you want people to be able to do and by when
<mpt> e.g. "By Ubuntu 12.10, someone should be able to log in with a combination of smartcard and password"
<mpt> or "By Ubuntu 13.04, someone should be able to use just their fingerprint and not need a password for anything"
<mpt> Otherwise it will end up like firewall GUI, or parental controls, or the common printing dialog: one of those things that usually gets discussed and never gets done :-)
<robert_ancell> mpt, agreed.  The main issue seems to be no resources to implement this (as per last time).
<mpt> yes
<mpt> I'd be happy to design that
<mpt> It would make sense to design them both at once, at least
<mpt> even if the implementation happens a bit at a time
<mpt> sure
<mpt> And someone supersede the fingerprint-specific blueprint so that its subscribers know what's happening
<mpt> cheers
<mpt> To log in, require:  [/] Password  [ ] Fingerprint  [ ] Smart card  [ ] Voiceprint ...
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#ubuntu-uds-room-203 2012-05-11
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