#edubuntu 2006-02-06
<npmccallum_> Anyone know the status of edubuntu dapper?  Does the install from daily work as a server install?
<digitalnova> how do i give ME the default user full rights to do whatever I want on the ubuntu? i.e. drag and drop files into folders without getting (permissions) error
<Lord_Athur> hi all, is there a traslator english-spanish and& vice-versa to install via apt?
<mhz> OT: dont kill me but this guy actually made his Falcom Millenium toy from Bruger King the case of his pen-drive http://www.noticias.com/articulo/31-01-2006/eduardo-mendez/bricomania-usb-52db.html
<mhz> jsgotangco: hi
<mhz> do we have meeting 2morrow?
<jsgotangco> mhz, hey! long time no chat
<mhz> indeed
<jsgotangco> edubuntu?
<jsgotangco> no idea
<jsgotangco> they are in london at the moment
<mhz> oh
<mhz> on their knees?
<jsgotangco> distro sprint
<mhz> oh, right
<mhz> jsgotangco: can i ask you a M$ question?
<jsgotangco> sure
<mhz> jsgotangco: thx. My wife has this light laptop (Compaq M300, no Cd drive to boot from and only a USB floppy) with a 700 MHz Intel, 10 GB and 192 MB of ram
<mhz> She wants to use Linux instead (I can boot it and installit via NetBoot) BUT she definately needs AutoCad and Vector programs
<mhz> jsgotangco: so any ideas how she can actually run M$ only for those 2 Programs and live in Linux 90% of the time ?
<mhz> Obviously, when I install Linux I'll format and partition her HD
<jsgotangco> i think autocad can run on wine
<jsgotangco> not sure about that vector thing
<jsgotangco> a lot of people really need autocad on linux
<mhz> unfortuantely AutoCAD is a standard
* irvin is away: I'm busy
<mhz> jsgotangco: but usine wine would mean to ge more HW?
<mhz> +t
<jsgotangco> more memory rather
<mhz> hmmm
<jsgotangco> i get to run some pretty games on winecvs and they eat more ram compared to running it natively in windows
<mhz> and in order to run Wine, will she need to "install" windows anyways? or it is a matter of downloading a ROM?
<mhz> install = boot from CD which she just can't
<jsgotangco> no
<jsgotangco> wine uses a fakewindows root thing
<jsgotangco> its not really windows
<jsgotangco> you still need the installer of the apps you want to run wine with though
<mhz> oh
<mhz> so the potenial good news is just a matter of getting more ram
<mhz> as she will need no M$ CD
<mhz> only AutoCAD installer
<mhz> ?
<jsgotangco> yeah
<mhz> okis, thx jsgotangco 
<jsgotangco> unless AUTOCAD asks for the windows CD :/
<mhz> you 're kidding me?
<mhz> is that even possible?
<jsgotangco> i dunno
<jsgotangco> some win apps do that
<jsgotangco> but its been rare
<jsgotangco> before, any networking config requried a reload of the origianl libraries
<jsgotangco> not so much now its been better (strangely)
<mhz> geee!
<jsgotangco> not sure if autocad does directx too
<jsgotangco> gotta eat lunch brb
<edgaroot> nobody talks?
<JaneW> http://linclips.com/index.php?page=clip&id=16
<JaneW> Edubuntu screencast ^
<spacey> meeting this afternoon?
<juliux> i think now we have 12:03 UTC
<spacey> ok
<tecs> hi, im planning to isntall edubuntu for my lil sister. but i see kde as a easier desktop imo. if i use the ubuntu cd, and download the edubuntu packages and kubuntu packages will that have the same result as to installing edubuntu and downloading kubuntu-desktop?
<spacey> you install any of them and just install edubuntu-desktop or kubuntu-desktop. but edubuntu-desktop its not really useful ify ou use kde
<spacey> only thing is a few programs
<ogra> kdeedu, the tux4kids suite and gcompris mainly 
<spacey> you might as well install the software manually and change the background to something in edubuntu-artwork :P
<tecs> so its more usable if the environment is gnome?
<ogra> its all developed and integrated with gnome ... usability is your chioce ;)
<ogra> if you find KDE more usable and dont want to use gnome, go for a kde based install ;)
<tecs> ok, well im jsut more comfortable with kde, but what do i care its for my little sister hehehe thanks
<tecs> thanks guys:) see you later
<tecs> still downloading edubuntu hehe thanks again
<ogra> :)
<lucasvo> ogra: how did you do your hackergotchi?
<lucasvo> is there an easy way, how to make shadow around a square box?
<ogra> yes, the drop shadow function from gimp
<lucasvo> ogra: hm, where is it/
<lucasvo> ?
<ogra> somewhere in the menu
<JaneW> heard of this? http://www.gnomefiles.org/app.php?soft_id=1010
<JaneW> we have a community memeber offering to package it....
<jsgotangco> its only in spanish :/
<jsgotangco> but it sure is on-tangent with edubuntu's goals
<spacey> made with gambas:p
<ogra> *yawn*
<jsgotangco> heh
<mhz> ogra: hi there!
<mhz> ogra: did the meeting take place today?
<mhz> ogra: did you notice I was very lost to finish last meeting's agenda in the tech part?
<dcadmin> anyone alive?
<juliux> dcadmin, yes
<dcadmin> I need some help as rapidly as possible... I'm setting up edubuntu for a daycare that a student group and myself are providing free computer help and support to
<dcadmin> all the hardware is detected and seemingly working fine, but gcompris won't play audio
<dcadmin> it will do so if I launch it from a termnal after ensuring it's set to play music and fx
<dcadmin> but not if I launch it from the gnome menus
<dcadmin> any ideas?
<juliux> hm sorry no idea
<dcadmin> \sh, any idea for my problem?
<\sh> what? I wasn't online until now..and don't have a backlog
<dcadmin> gcompris won't play audio unless it's launched from a terminal
<dcadmin> it makes the reading games sort of useless
<\sh> hmm..did you file a bug? so ogra or I can test it somehow....dapper or breezy? 
* mode/#edubuntu [-o \sh]  by ChanServ
<khermans_> can someone tel me how to edit the kernel boot params for the client machines?
<khermans_> where is that data storeD?
<khermans_> hello?
<khermans_> Seveas, ?
<Seveas> patience, my friend...
<Seveas> in the pxe config
<khermans_> :-0
<khermans_> i have doe it before, but need to know the location
<khermans_> i forget where it is stored :-(
<Seveas> slocate pxe :)
<khermans_> thx Seveas 
<khermans_> thanks dude!!!!
<khermans_> kudos kudos!!
<khermans_> i made donation to Ubuntu recently
<khermans_> and also we made funof Ballmer when he came to our school
<khermans_> Seveas, http://video.google.com/videosearch?q=linux+microsoft
<khermans_> Seveas, http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-5336561617389993359&q=linux+microsoft
#edubuntu 2006-02-07
<Lord_Athur> hi all
<DeMoNSeEd> hello
<DeMoNSeEd> anyone around
<Infinity-1> Hello?
<jsgotangco> hi there :)
<mhz> JaneW: hi there
<mhz> JaneW: got a minute?
<JaneW> mhz: hello ... yes
<mhz> JaneW: As you already noticed, I had problems to do the meeting's minute and when I wanted to do it, I really had no clue what to add regarding technical part :(
<mhz> JaneW: on a different matter, I sent an email to Mark on tuesday, regarding the event and tour we are planning here, is it ok if I send it to you too, so you can 'maybe' have him read it soon and give us answer?
<JaneW> mhz: yes sure
<JaneW> mhz: we were discussing using moin for the edubuntu web site yesterday btw...
<JaneW> thought you may be happy to hear that
<mhz> heheheheh
<jsgotangco> JaneW, i got to meet Hande at last
<JaneW> jsgotangco: cool, I haven't!
<JaneW> jsgotangco: got pics?
<jsgotangco> she's stunning
<mhz> JaneW: moin makes me happy, yes, but I feel happier knowing we all are using something we can really work on and fits all our needs
<JaneW> jsgotangco: how's it going? / gone?
<JaneW> jsgotangco: really? PICS!
<jsgotangco> i'll upload them later
<JaneW> jsgotangco: I'd expect no less from Mark ;)
<jsgotangco> its in my phone
<jsgotangco> heh
<jsgotangco> but mark wore a suit :/
<jsgotangco> and a golden tie...
<mhz> JaneW: and I thought we were gonna try Drupal instead
* mhz has not even had time to read the logs :(
<mhz> jsgotangco: so there was a meeting! :)
<jsgotangco> well it was a canonical trip :/
<mhz> yeah, I should have figured JaneW whould have told us it was cancelled, otherwise we were sticking to the plan.
* mhz slaps himself
<jsgotangco> well
<jsgotangco> i just stumbled on it
<jsgotangco> i thought them being in london, we won't hvae a meeting
<JaneW> I forgot and only popped on when I was pinged
<JaneW> so it was pretty disjointed and impromtu
<JaneW> sorry
<jsgotangco> ahhh
<jsgotangco> still good results though
* mhz printing logs to read on the bus
<JaneW> heh
* mhz hates to print info from web
<jsgotangco> mhz, are you still pursuing open content/curriculum?
<JaneW> the plague is still ravaging here
<mhz> jsgotangco: ?
<mhz> JaneW: plague? M$? disease?
<JaneW> out of 18 only 6 of us haven't been sick... and I am very tired and lethargic.
<jsgotangco> mhz, you said before you wanted to add some curricula stuff in edubuntu
<mhz> JaneW: oh, vitamin C is always welcome and some herbal teas
<jsgotangco> are you sure it wasn't sladen?? :)
<jsgotangco> heh
<JaneW> lol
<mhz> jsgotangco: oh, yes! The tour is intended to show to teachers many of the ideas and the potential still hidden behind edubuntu community
<JaneW> he is ot here, but normally he is the carrier of dreaded disease...
<mhz> so they get motivated to once and for all start collaborating
<jsgotangco> JaneW, mark told me the may conf will be in germany :/
<JaneW> jsgotangco: this is what I have heard...
<jsgotangco> and that he wanted to do asia for the next probably in bagalore
<mhz> JaneW: if in germany or any other place... when should the may conf be?
<jsgotangco> a few weeks after release
<mhz> hmmm, first 10 days in May?
<JaneW> mhz: yes prolly
<JaneW> realease is set for 20 april
* mhz turns 31 on may 9th!
<JaneW> cvd will be planning exactly where and when
* JaneW turns 32 on 30 April
<mhz> wow!
* jsgotangco turns 32 on August 28
<mhz> THAT'S why you are so lovely!
<JaneW> heh
<JaneW> jsgotangco: we are all pretty much the same age as Mark ;)
<jsgotangco> except he has a billion+ and we don't
<mhz> nah! except he has a jet
<mhz> ;0
<JaneW> jsgotangco: but we have children! :)))
<jsgotangco> lol
<mhz> $ doesn't matter, as long as we are happy and our families are healthy
<JaneW> agreed
* mhz feels he's a liar!
<JaneW> heh
<jsgotangco> money money money
<mhz> YES!!!!
<mhz> :D
<JaneW> amended to $ not THE most important thing...
<jsgotangco> mark was pretty happy here from the looks of it
<mhz> money AND healthy family :D
<mhz> pics?
<jsgotangco> i'll transfer it from my phone later
<jsgotangco> (bluetooth)
<mhz> okis
<JaneW> jsgotangco: I am pleased he finally gave SE Asia a try
<jsgotangco> but still...jeez he cut his hair and wore a suit...
<JaneW> I suspect he will be bitten by the bug and want to keep going back...
* jsgotangco was forced to wear something formal too...
* JaneW needs to see the haircut
<JaneW> he is doing Bangkok too... 
* JaneW suspects he will discuover the joys and naughtiness of Thailand too ;)
<jsgotangco> even if he flies in his own jet, its still tiring to do trans pacific flights
<jsgotangco> yeah, he asked about the nightlife scene..hehehe
<mhz> JaneW: email happily knocking on your inbox
<JaneW> sounds like him...
<jsgotangco> yeah
* \sh just turned 35...and you are still so young ;)
<jsgotangco> don't fret
<jsgotangco> we'll all past the calendar
<jsgotangco> :/
<jsgotangco> 30s should be the prime of our lives :)
<\sh> looks like I have to have a drink with ogra..he is still beating me in age :)
<\sh> jsgotangco: yes...if you like "Hey, you are too old for this job"
* mhz still looks like a 20 year old baby when he shaves :D
<jsgotangco> \sh, :( don't feel so bad about it
<mhz> actually, I get "How can I help you young man"
<jsgotangco> heh
<jsgotangco> that doesn't happen to me
<jsgotangco> now they call me sir
<jsgotangco> :(
<mhz> \sh: but you'll never be told you are too young if your run for president, that's the good part
<jsgotangco> lol
<mhz> lol
<\sh> mhz: president of what? 
<mhz> any
<mhz> presidents are always over 35
<mhz> afaik
<\sh> "The > 35ish group of jobless people in germany"?
<mhz> LOL!!
<mhz> \sh:  35ish group of jobless people in germany and Chile
* mhz would vote for you
<\sh> this president thing reminds me of "Escape from New York": "Yes, I'm the President, I knew when I took this thing, that I'm the President"
<\sh> mhz: oh then I wish that this "\sh for president" thing will never happen :)
<mhz> hehehe
<mhz> \sh: but if you give a couple of good speeches to young newbies, i bet they'll follow you :D
<\sh> mhz: well, we have a lot of jobless young people here in germany...but I don't think they will follow me, because they wouldn't understand me :)
<mhz> oh, well, then you have big issues :p
* mhz has been jobless for the last 3 months and everytime I get to give speeches, many young newbies want to talk to me... at least if they were girl-groupies!
<mhz> :D
<jsgotangco> due
<jsgotangco> dude
<jsgotangco> i hope you're doing those talks for a good cause :/
<mhz> lol
<\sh> mhz: well..best thing would be, you will get some money for the talks :
<\sh> )
<mhz> jsgotangco: it's good...for whom? well, that depends :D
<jsgotangco> talks are good money especially if you do it outside your home country
<mhz> \sh: oh, no...my wife always tells me the same thing.. "clap, clap, clap,...now make sure the claps become money"
<mhz> well, not here, unless you are PhD on some very important subject
<jsgotangco> mhz, "outside"
<mhz> here = latinamerica
<\sh> mhz: I know what you mean. right now I'm waiting for the company I did some work last week..that they pay my money...so I can pay my rent and my car and my ex+son
<jsgotangco> ok outside Latin america
<mhz> jsgotangco: lol
* jsgotangco can say it based on experience
<jsgotangco> but you really have to work hard and maitain a good reputation :/
<mhz> \sh: well, i am not saying I feel ok with this but.. if you ever happen not to have money to pay the rent for 3 months... the 4th month you start feeling more "ok" with it :D
<mhz> jsgotangco: good reputation? hmm, not good future ;0
<jsgotangco> mhz, it comes later
<\sh> mhz: well, my landlord would chase me out when I don't pay my rent this month :)
<mhz> \sh: any chances you can exchange/trade knowledge or services instead of moeny ?
<mhz> money
<\sh> mhz: no...
<mhz> well, I had to ask ;p
<\sh> money makes it all..and only money....
<\sh> knowledge is not valuable in germany somehow :)
<\sh> anyways...need to do some knowledge transfer from /dev/web to /dev/brain about java and servlets and jsp stuff...cu later :)
<mhz> :D
<Infinity-1> can someone tell me howto configure loadlin to start edubuntu install from dos prompt
<Infinity-1> Thinkpad570
<Infinity-1> does not recognize usb cdrom
<Infinity-1> no floppy
<mhz> Infinity-1: you mean, you have M$ and want to install Edubuntu on that box but it can't boot form CD drive nor Floppy drive?
<Infinity-1> right
<Infinity-1> I can boot slax live cd from dos using loadlin included in boot folder from slax cd
<Infinity-1> linux recognizes usb cdrom
<mhz> Infinity-1: then, basically, you have to place a couple of files on to your C:\
<Infinity-1> I have loadlin.exe
<Infinity-1> and lilo.conf
<mhz> oooohh, okis
<Infinity-1> I need to know which device to use for my boot device
<Infinity-1> I tried /dev/hd1
<Infinity-1> /dev/hd0
<Infinity-1> not sure what it is on thinkpad
<mhz> Infinity-1: I installed Edubuntu on this laptop, with no CD drive nor floppy drive
<Infinity-1> I get error message "not able to mount fs"
<Infinity-1> can you email me the lilo.conf file?
<Infinity-1> I think that is all I need
<Infinity-1> and to copy the correct files from the edubuntu cd to the c: drive
<Infinity-1> just.cruisin@yahoo.com
<Infinity-1> I would greatly appreciate it
<Infinity-1> been banging my head for 3 days now
<mhz> Infinity-1: welll..... I dont have them any more
<Infinity-1> hmmm ok
<mhz> but I got them from the wiki
<mhz> let me get the urls for you
<mhz> please gimme a minute
<Infinity-1> thanks!
<Infinity-1> no worries
<Infinity-1> take ur time
<Infinity-1> I am working graveyard shift and want to get edubuntu working when I get home.
<Infinity-1> how is everybody else doing?
<Infinity-1> I received my 15 cd's in the mail for ubuntu 2 days ago
<Infinity-1> and I have already distributed them!
<Infinity-1> I am in BC, Canada
<mhz> Infinity-1: good to hear that
<Infinity-1> I just ordered some edubuntu cd's - I have 3 kids myself and think we should start with the kids to increase the linux population
<mhz> Infinity-1: edubuntu cd'?
<mhz> local provider?
<Infinity-1> I ordered it through the ubuntu site
<Infinity-1> haven't heard back if they will do it or not
<jsgotangco> there's no edubuntu cd yet
<Infinity-1> I may just have to burn everyone a copy
<jsgotangco> just download for now :)
<Infinity-1> you can download the install cd from their wesite
<Infinity-1> then burn it
<jsgotangco> :)
<Infinity-1> mhz: any luck with the urls
<mhz> Infinity-1: https://wiki.edubuntu.org/Installation/Netboot
<ogra> EEEK 
<ogra> who wrote that ? 
<ogra> xinetd is evil 
<mhz> Infinity-1: https://wiki.edubuntu.org/Installation/FromWindows
<mhz> ogra: not me ;D
<ogra> just install tftpd-hpa and dont configure anything, thats all preconfigured ...
<Infinity-1> thanks mhz
<Infinity-1> I will try that in 2 hours
<Infinity-1> when I'm off work
<spacey> ogra, did you ever managed to get willow+transparant proxy?
<ogra> spacey, had no time to try ... i will put more effort into content filtering for dapper+1
<ogra> (read that as: i want to have it as a high prio distro target for edubuntu dapper+1)
<spacey> yeah sure
<spacey> just wondering
<ogra> but iirc i had it running with transparent proxying when i tested it
<Infinity-1> mhz: if ur there thanks! gotta run. be back l8r
<mhz_BBS> ogra: you may like this http://vybiral.info/mockup/tango-windowsXP.PNG
<jsgotangco> lol
<jsgotangco> nice fonts though
<mhz_BBS> jsgotangco: http://www.openworkshop.org/
<mhz_BBS> moin freak site
<jsgotangco> oh my god
<jsgotangco> freaky moin hakcs
<mhz_BBS> yup
<mhz_BBS> well, except the Calendar
<mhz_BBS> that's MoinCalendar in action
<jsgotangco> yeah
<jsgotangco> that's pretty cool
* jsgotangco wonders if there is wikipedia calendar
<jsgotangco> err
<jsgotangco> mediawiki calendar
<mhz_BBS> hehehe
<mhz_BBS> well, I can show you a Moin looking just like mediawiki
<mhz_BBS> http://beta.el-directorio.org:8080/Instalando_MozEx_en_Firefox_1
<mhz_BBS> well, that was 1.5
<mhz_BBS> and this is 1.4 http://wiki.slec.net/wiki/Ayuda_de_uso_Zope_de_emacs
<jsgotangco> i need mediawiki :/
<thefamousnomo> hello people!
<thefamousnomo> i am having install issues with edubuntu 5.10 on hp e-vectra...
<thefamousnomo> among other errors i am generally getting to 50% ltdp client...
<thefamousnomo> anyone able to help?
<thefamousnomo> anyone even here?
<thefamousnomo> thanx
<mhz> re
<DeMoNSeEd> hello
<DeMoNSeEd> anyone aboot?
<DeMoNSeEd> i seem to need some help with GCompris
<DeMoNSeEd> anyone here?
<lucasvo> DeMoNSeEd: please ask a more specific question
<DeMoNSeEd> first i wanted to establish if indeed there was a live body in here.......okay, i'm running Breezy on box boxes here, i installed gcompris on my wife's machine for my daughter to play, it seems to install fine, comes up okay, but when she chooses the memory games in gcompris, it comes up, what happens is, when she makes a match, gcompris kicks out totally
<DeMoNSeEd> *both boxes
<DeMoNSeEd> i at first thought it might have been because i also had install Childsplay in there too, so i tried installing gcompris on my box, so it's alone, i get the same thing, it kicks
<DeMoNSeEd> she's very yoing so memory is anongst the few she can play
<DeMoNSeEd> *young
<lucasvo> DeMoNSeEd: sorry, I can't help you about that
<DeMoNSeEd> k, thanks....it's kinds of a p.o
<DeMoNSeEd> hopefully this will be fixed by the time Dapper comes out
<DeMoNSeEd> but again, thanks for listenin
<mhz> DeMoNSeEd: could it be due to lack of memory?
<DeMoNSeEd> i doubt it
<DeMoNSeEd> i've got 512 on mine
<mhz> oh
<mhz> DeMoNSeEd: but are you running Edubuntu (LTSP -> client boxes ?)
<DeMoNSeEd> it's frustrating as i knw that on other distros it works fine, but her machine runs like a dream on everything else, i had to blow off a perfectly good system due to 1 thing
<DeMoNSeEd> nope, i'm running breezy (ubuntu) 
<DeMoNSeEd> i apt -get gcompris
<mhz> hmmm
<mhz> DeMoNSeEd: apt-get install childsplay
<DeMoNSeEd> i had asked in bunty room, but in the tradition of deb derivs, i was totally ignored till i was told, like we care about gcompris, just take it out man......that was huge help
<mhz> and in the meantime, please run gcompris from a terminal so when it kicks out we can know WHY it does it
<DeMoNSeEd> k, if i boot it in term it does show something about gnomecanvas
<mhz> DeMoNSeEd: they ignored you and were not polite to you in a #ubuntu room?
<DeMoNSeEd> and yup, i do have childsplay in there, it works like a dream, prob being it doesn't have as much to offer as gcompris
<DeMoNSeEd> yup
<DeMoNSeEd> i'm not new, so i am very familar with Deb folk
<DeMoNSeEd> i deal in migrations.....57 from windass to ubuntu to date, so i'm very sensitive to such, as i advise all my converts to seek help in irc, but i digress, that another matter
<DeMoNSeEd> gimme 5, i'll apt gcompris back into her machime, i had indeed removed it last night, i'll boot it in term and show you what it gives
<DeMoNSeEd> k?
<mhz> DeMoNSeEd: I would please encorage you to save that logfile, and present it to ogra or someone else. AFAIK, every channel has admins, and each admin has signed Code of Conduct 
<DeMoNSeEd> ogra?
<mhz> yup
<mhz> Mr. Edubuntu
<DeMoNSeEd> k, but it didn't happen in here, to be fair, you're being huge help, this took place in the ubuntu room proper and it's far some an isolated incident, you've brought back my faith in ubuntu a little, just by your helping here...the main room should be such
<DeMoNSeEd> k, brb
<DeMoNSeEd> this is what i get in term if i boot it from term
<DeMoNSeEd> ** (gcompris:24366): WARNING **: config_file /home/jacqui/.gcompris/gcompris.conf
<DeMoNSeEd> ** Message: gcompris_set_locale 'ca'
<DeMoNSeEd> init_plugins 0.379278 sec.
<DeMoNSeEd> gcompris_load_menus 0.415322 sec.
<DeMoNSeEd> gcompris_load_mime_types 0.430239 sec.
<DeMoNSeEd> __main__:1: DeprecationWarning: Module gnome.canvas is deprecated; please import gnomecanvas instead
<DeMoNSeEd> Not using psyco (psyco.sf.net), AI not a maximum speed!
<DeMoNSeEd> (gcompris:24366): GnomeCanvas-CRITICAL **: gnome_canvas_item_set_valist: assertion `GNOME_IS_CANVAS_ITEM (item)' failed
<DeMoNSeEd> (gcompris:24366): GnomeCanvas-CRITICAL **: gnome_canvas_item_set_valist: assertion `GNOME_IS_CANVAS_ITEM (item)' failed
<DeMoNSeEd> Segmentation fault
<DeMoNSeEd> it comes up great, but there's a rubiks cube looking game section, in which has memory type card...match pics game, they come up all right, but once you match 2 pics, the whole thing kicks out totally
<mhz> DeMoNSeEd: I have no clue what GNOME_canvas is
<mhz> I use Wmaker and XFCE :(
<DeMoNSeEd> as me
<DeMoNSeEd> k
<DeMoNSeEd> i'm grateful for you trying, very much so
<DeMoNSeEd> hopefully Dapper will be okay
<mhz> thx, at least we now have that output
<mhz> did you google for gnome.canvas
<DeMoNSeEd> like i saids before, i know i can run gcompris on other distros, as i already have, but i don't want to take off a perfectly running system for 1 build
<mhz> sure
<DeMoNSeEd> nope, but the time i gave up trying to get an answer i was a lil frustrated and had just stepped away for a bit
<DeMoNSeEd> i do the goog and see
<DeMoNSeEd> thanks again, you're doing a great job
<DeMoNSeEd> i'll pop back after
<DeMoNSeEd> thanks again.....take care
<mhz> DeMoNSeEd: or
<DeMoNSeEd> or?
<mhz> maybe it is indeed a bug
<mhz> and reporting it could be good idea
<mhz> DeMoNSeEd: hold on, let me ask a friend about canvas
<DeMoNSeEd> k, i'll look at gcompris site
<DeMoNSeEd> for bug reports...k..i'll hang in
<DeMoNSeEd> i'll be back in bout 15 mins
#edubuntu 2006-02-08
<Lord_Athur> hi all
<Lord_Athur> i need help
<Lord_Athur> is there a program made with c++ on edubuntu?
<Lord_Athur> can anybody tell me one easy to modify and used under the terminal environment?
<Rondom> Lord_Athur: waht do you want to do
<Rondom> learn c++?
<Lord_Athur> no
<Lord_Athur> try to see "real" examples 
<Lord_Athur> do you know about an easy program made with c++?
<Lord_Athur> mhz, 
<Lord_Athur> what do you say?
<Lord_Athur> do you know?
<signifer123> hey
<Lord_Athur> hi signifer123 
<Kamping_Kaiser> is the edubuntu-devel list realy quiet, or have i not joined properly?
<jsgotangco> its been quiet lately :/
<Kamping_Kaiser> ok thanks :)
<Gent> anyone alive?
* Kamping_Kaiser rises from his grave
<Gent> yay!
<Gent> Ok, I still need help
<Gent> and no one seems to know what's up
<Kamping_Kaiser> well i have been here for 4 hours, but try anyway ;)
<crimsun> help may be a bit slow, since the developers are at the distro sprint
<Gent> Ok.... I have this organization... and we donate computers, we donated one yesterday to a daycare and it was running edubuntu
<Gent> gcompris is essential to what they're doing
<Gent> when I try to launch gcompris from the gnome menus, I get no sound
<Gent> if I open a terminal, start it, ensure fx and music are checked, then restart it from the terminal I get sound
<Gent> I can restart it 20 times from the terminal, and will always get sound after that point
<Gent> but never from the menu
<Gent> any ideas?
<Kamping_Kaiser> um. fraid not. never use the software :/ could it be a working dir issue?
<Gent> could be, if it uses some sort of relative path to look for the config
<Gent> but I can't imagine it would
<Gent> I'd imagine it would look in ~/.gcompris/gcompris.conf
<Gent> which is where the file is
<Kamping_Kaiser> what happens to the file? does it get changed when gcompris starts from the menu but not a terminal? what I'm asking is could it be changing to a default each start?
<Gent> no
<Gent> it doesn't seem to change at all
<Gent> I can manually set fx and music to 1
<Gent> and it will never change
<Gent> yet the first time I start from a terminal even, no sound
<Gent> even if I do   gcompris --sound
<Gent> It could be an underlying OSS compatibility issue or something...
<Gent> cause it looks like it's using OSS
<Gent> at least I think /dev/sequencer is old OSS shit
<Kamping_Kaiser> not sure. ihave an amazingly narrow experiance with linux :)
<Kamping_Kaiser> and not having an edubuntu box (yet) i cant even look at it :(
<jsgotangco> yeah i also experience that with gcompris :/
<jsgotangco> its annoying it seems to have a mind of its own
<Gent> I would have thought as one of the essential portions of the system that it would be something taken care of
<Gent> it's inclusion is sorta what separates edubuntu apart
<Gent> also is schoolbell on edubuntu, or just schooltool
<Gent> it seems like schoolbell has all the real management stuff
<jsgotangco> Gent, oh it works its probably more on hardware though but thats a long shot
<jsgotangco> brb
<Gent> well it seems like a mix between hardware and software, I could see if you didn't have a multichannel card... but I'd imagine it would use ESD (as the logical thing to do on ubuntu)
<crimsun> you could wrap it using esddsp, I presume
<Gent> never used that
<Gent> do you just do esddsp <command> ?
<crimsun> esddsp app
<Gent> I'll have to give that a shot
<Gent> I REALLY need to build up my linux on this system again
<Gent> I've been using WinXP way too long
<shaqiel> hi yall
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
<Infinity-1> If I already have Ubuntu installed, what is the easiest way to upgrade or switch to EdUbuntu please?
<Kamping_Kaiser> apt-get install edubuntu-desktop IIRC.
<Infinity-1> Kamping_Kaiser: thanks!
<Kamping_Kaiser> np
<Infinity-1> I am actually still completing network install of Ubuntu on thinkpad 570 4GB 128MB
<Infinity-1> it's taken me a week to get this far!!!! :O
<Infinity-1> been out of the loop for a few years -- getting back into the game again
<Kamping_Kaiser> a week o:O
<Infinity-1> I know
<Infinity-1> was running 98  uggh~!
<Infinity-1> usb cdrom
<Infinity-1> no floppy
<Kamping_Kaiser> oh, evil
<Infinity-1> I might still have one more hurdle to get over
<Kamping_Kaiser> whtas that?
<Infinity-1> seem to get to starting X and then message about not able to load initial something
<Infinity-1> initial desktop / space / something
<Infinity-1> I always forget to write it down thinking I can remember it
<Infinity-1> I am just installing all the additional packages now
<Kamping_Kaiser> but the desktop loads?
<Infinity-1> I'm sure it will come up again in a few minutes
<Infinity-1> nope kernel panic
<Kamping_Kaiser> o_0
<Kamping_Kaiser> ouch
<Infinity-1> so I restarted laptop this time and it skipped that part and continued loading packages
<Infinity-1> currently unpacking samba
<Infinity-1> getting close
<Infinity-1> xutils
<Infinity-1> oh know! ttf loading now
<Infinity-1> If I remember correctly there are hundreds of these
<Infinity-1> wrong again!
<Infinity-1> ubunti-docs
<Infinity-1> xserver...
<Infinity-1> xfonts
<Infinity-1> unpacking is complete
<Infinity-1> now setting up packages
<Kamping_Kaiser> lol. i take your word for it, i don't need comentry ;)
<Infinity-1> I know sorry - 
<Infinity-1> lol
<Kamping_Kaiser> lol
<Infinity-1> network install takes awhile ha!
<Kamping_Kaiser> over the net yeh. :)
<Kamping_Kaiser> not over 100mb networks though :)
<Infinity-1> well, I am on Cable modem connection
<Infinity-1> I don't think they would like me doing install from work! ;)
<Kamping_Kaiser> lol.
<Kamping_Kaiser> i made an ubuntu mirror at work and use that ;)
<Infinity-1> one of our guys just got fired - I heard he was running sniffer on his workstation! 
<Infinity-1> talk about stupid!
<Kamping_Kaiser> lol. no kidding
<Infinity-1> and we have a sysadmin in the same office everyday.
<Kamping_Kaiser> I'm supprised he bothered, a switch should stop that being usefull
<Infinity-1> I think our internal is pretty slack - based on honesty system still
<Infinity-1> I think it is changing now! LOL
<Kamping_Kaiser> lol
<Infinity-1> hung up at 99% of course!
<Infinity-1> trying different server addresses
<Kamping_Kaiser> lol.
<Infinity-1> I should have selected the US server at the beginning instead of being stubborn and sticking with Canada!
<Kamping_Kaiser> lol. the us server is actualy prone to errors. for the record
<Infinity-1> :)
<Kamping_Kaiser> :)
<Infinity-1> if i restart, do you think it will continue install, or will I have to start from the beginning?
<Infinity-1> still hanging
<Kamping_Kaiser> not sure. what's it stopped on?
<Infinity-1> Connecting to ca.archive.ubuntu.com (206.75.218.53)
<Infinity-1> then it tries the other server at .52
<Infinity-1> it just keeps going between the two servers - not connecting
<Infinity-1> 99% complete
<Kamping_Kaiser> hm. so do you have a abase system installed?
<Infinity-1> who knows,,,
<Kamping_Kaiser> oh, i see :/
<Infinity-1> here I go..... going to restart.....
<Kamping_Kaiser> ok *crosses fingers*
<Infinity-1> yep!
<Infinity-1> it would be nice if it said connection timed out - please enter alernate server location
<Infinity-1> maybe I'll get this error message I can tell youabbout
<Kamping_Kaiser> lol.  
<Infinity-1> its trying to load Gnome
<Infinity-1> looking good....
<Infinity-1> hmmm
<Kamping_Kaiser> :S
<Infinity-1> well, I got the little spinning circle icon
<Kamping_Kaiser> goood...
<Infinity-1> now I have a square screen about one third of my screen that I cannot read
<Kamping_Kaiser> hm. can you get a getty open?
<Infinity-1> restarting
<Infinity-1> I'll pay for awhile
<Infinity-1> see where I get to
<Kamping_Kaiser> ok
<Infinity-1> starting in recovery mode
<Infinity-1> I think I just have to configure xconf
<Kamping_Kaiser> try sudo apt-get -f install first
<Infinity-1> ok, did that , it says Done 0 upgrade, 0 newly installed, 0 to remove and 0 not upgraded
<Kamping_Kaiser> ok. then try `sudo apt-get install edubuntu-desktop` to make sure it's all there
<Infinity-1> startx doesn't work
<Infinity-1> ok
<Infinity-1> E: Couldn't find package edubuntu-desktop
<Infinity-1> checked spelling
<Kamping_Kaiser> do you have main and universe?
<Infinity-1> not sure, I just did network install of Ubuntu
<Kamping_Kaiser> checkyour sources list
<Infinity-1> find sources
<Infinity-1> mount cdrom works
<lucasvo> Infinity-1: no, it's sudo vi /etc/apt/sources.list
<Infinity-1> hoary universe
<Kamping_Kaiser> hoary? o_0
<Infinity-1> who knows??
<Infinity-1> now what is exit command
<Infinity-1> :quit
<Kamping_Kaiser> yep
<Infinity-1> yep
<Infinity-1> ok I can access edubuntu cd
<Kamping_Kaiser> oh, you have it on cd?
<Kamping_Kaiser> was there an edubuntu in hoary... i think it was first in with Breezy wasnt it?
<Infinity-1> yeah Breezy is the version
<Infinity-1> I burned EdUbuntu on CD before starting this
<Infinity-1> and then installed grub onto MBR
<Infinity-1> then it just started network install of Ubuntu
<Infinity-1> ls
<Kamping_Kaiser> interesting. (i havent installed edubuntu)
<Infinity-1> neither have I - LOL
<Infinity-1> cd..
<lucasvo> Infinity-1: update to breezy
<Infinity-1> right now I am in command line mode
<lucasvo> Infinity-1: on the install cd?
<Infinity-1> what command can I run to start xconfigurator?
<lucasvo> Infinity-1: you didn't install your system correct 
<Infinity-1> well, it timed out on the network install at 99%
<lucasvo> huh
<lucasvo> Infinity-1: easiest would be to install it from cd 
<Infinity-1> well, easier said than done
<Infinity-1> Thinkpad 570 - USB CDRom
<Infinity-1> does not recognize cdrom in bios
<Infinity-1> no floppy
<lucasvo> Infinity-1: so how did you do it?
<Infinity-1> I installed grub onto MBR
<Infinity-1> then started Ubuntu Install
<Infinity-1> it just automatically started the network install
<lucasvo> Infinity-1: I would redo the install
<Infinity-1> yeah, which means putting my hard drive back into my pc and installing win98 and then grub, and then running network install again
<Infinity-1> but hey, it's only time!
<lucasvo> Infinity-1: hm, with this basic questions, I would go to#ubuntu
<Infinity-1> I tried running the install for Ubuntu directly with the laptop HD mounted on PC but that doesn;t work either
<Infinity-1> I am in there too, but they are pretty busy right now
<Infinity-1> I will play for a bit to see what I can hack
<Infinity-1> just looking for something I can add to menu.lst in grub even
<mhz> JaneW: hi, got a minute again?
<JaneW> mhz: I am back now
<JaneW> mhz: your pdf talks about other attachments, but there aren't any....
<JaneW> mhz: so did mark respond to you?
<mhz> JaneW: ohh, gee! I'll send the attachements
<mhz> JaneW: yes, today. BUT
<Lord_Athur> hi all
<JaneW> mhz: yes...?
<mhz> JaneW: he said he had no other email from me (only the one I sent yeasterday night to push a little) probably because he filters deleted it or he decided not to respond
<JaneW> mhz: he gets a LOT of mail (you can imagine)
<mhz> JaneW: ehehehe, yes
<JaneW> I thin claire helps to filter it
<mhz> JaneW: so I just resend it CC'ing you
<JaneW> thin=think
<JaneW> mhz: great thanks
* mhz hopes Mark did not go for the last option "he decided not to respond" 
<mhz> JaneW: thx to you for the patience
<JaneW> mhz: there were a few typos / grammar errors in the pdf, want me to help you ocrrect it?
<mhz> sure
* JaneW has a HUGE headache :(
<mhz> JaneW: need to get 'source' file?
<mhz> JaneW: then, that can wait, please get better 1st!
<JaneW> no now's fine I'll PM you
<mhz> ohterwise, I'll be causing you more headaches
<mhz> :D
<mhz> Lord_Athur: hi there
<Lord_Athur> hi mhz 
<Lord_Athur> will there you be a meeting tomorrow in (on at ;O) the cultural center
<Lord_Athur> hahhaa
<Lord_Athur> i wrote it of a wrong way
<mhz> Lord_Athur: don't worry, prepositions in English kill me all the time!
<Lord_Athur> hehehe
<Lord_Athur> then will you be there?
<mhz> nope, impossible :(
<Lord_Athur> ok
<mhz> ooohhh, this looks VERY interesting
<mhz> http://ipcf.freedesktop.org/wiki/
<jsgotangco> mhz, http://www.flickr.com/photos/headgeekette
* mhz obediently opening
<Infinity-1> can someone tell me the command for the apt-get edubuntu-desktop
<Infinity-1> I think I am only missing one word
<Infinity-1> apt-get edubuntu-desktop
<jouni__m> Infinity-1 apt-get install edubuntu-desktop I think
<Infinity-1> ahh install  thanks I'll try it
<Infinity-1> with sudo at the beginning!
<Infinity-1> sudo apt-get install edubuntu-desktop
<Lord_Athur> Infinity-1, can't I install the edubuntu-desktop meta-package from debian?
<Infinity-1> hmmm lots of broken dependencies
<Infinity-1> dunno, I am just installing ubuntu on my laptop myself
<Infinity-1> got it working finally 10 minutes ago after a week of head banging
<Infinity-1> I am on it right now here
<Lord_Athur> mhz,  can't I install the edubuntu-desktop meta-package from debian?
<Infinity-1> I also have 414 updates available to be installed. So I guess I sould complete those first
<Infinity-1> I'll be back!
<mhz> Lord_Athur: if your 'edubuntu'desktop' is not in the results of "apt- cache search edubuntu-desktop", then it is not there.
<Lord_Athur> mhz, it isn't
<Lord_Athur> :P
<MrSuper34> hello
<mhz> Lord_Athur: and I doubt it will be part of debian repos
<mhz> because Edubuntu is a customization of many things for Ubuntu systems
<mhz> and ubuntu is not = debian
<jsgotangco> :P
<MrSuper34> where i find a list of educational softwares included in edubuntu 5.10?
<Lord_Athur> :O
<mhz> MrSuper34: gimme a sec to get you an url
<mhz> MrSuper34: wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuSoftwareList
<mhz> ;p
<mhz> MrSuper34: but please consider this list corresponds to the apps. shipped in the cd, not the huge repository of edu apps.
<MrSuper34> tks
<MrSuper34> ok
<MrSuper34> Do you have a solution for installing KDE as a default environment on Edubuntu?
<mhz> yup
<mhz> KDE is just a desktop
<mhz> so, apt-get install kubuntu-desktop will give you a full KDE 'ubuntised'
<MrSuper34> ok but I like to make KDE a DEFAULT desktop of Edubuntu...can anyone help me to do this?
<MrSuper34> ok but... if I install KUbuntu over EdUbuntu, did I loose any Edubuntu's educational applications?
<jouni__m> MrSuper34 then choose session KDE from gdm menu (or kdm) .Log in and it asks if you want KDE for default session.
<mhz> you mean, everytime you boot X you want KDE to be default environement?
<mhz> MrSuper34: no, you don't loose a thing
<mhz> MrSuper34: edubuntu is mainly a LTSP implementation + edu apps + GUI's
<MrSuper34> but... don't have any educational applications in EdUbuntu wich run only on Gnome desktop?
<mhz> even if we did, you dont lose a thing because you already have gnome installed or not? And besides, APT is so clever that will install dependencies needed
<MrSuper34> ok...thank you very much... i'm going to download right now!
<mhz> and we'll be here is your system crashes :D
<MrSuper34> :)))
<mhz> MrSuper34: sorry, i had to be mean for a moment :D
<mhz> don't worry, it will be ok
<mhz> ogra: ping
<mhz> ogra: maybe you could take a look at this http://ltsp-thinadmin.sourceforge.net/english/index.html#about
<mhz> That guy is Mr. Edulinux
<qwizzz> Hello?
<mhz> hi
<qwizzz> lol  I've been a network/PC tech/admin/consultant since 1997 and this is the first time I've used IRC.
<qwizzz> I have a question about terminal server clients logging in.
<qwizzz> Can anyone help?
<qwizzz> mhz?  Know anything about ltsp in edubuntu?
<mhz> qwizzz: the idea of IRC is that after you say hi, you usually shoot your questions and anyone reads it and responds if available or know
<mhz> qwizzz: yes, a little
<qwizzz> Oh... okay.
<mhz> qwizzz: oh, welcome to IRC, BTW :)
<qwizzz> Well I have a server machine up and running with two NIC's... (thanks for the welcome :) ) ...and the client sees the server, pulls down an IP and boots...
<qwizzz> but then I cannot login on the client.
<mhz> qwizzz: which version of edubuntu?
<qwizzz> mhz: breezy 5.10
<mhz> qwizzz: so clients get IP?
<mhz> but can't login?
<qwizzz> yep, I can even ping them from the server.
<qwizzz> I only have two users on the server.
<mhz> okis
<mhz> qwizzz: in the server, try this $ ltsp-update-sshkeys
<mhz> then try to login from clients
<qwizzz> should I restart any services or reboot the client?
* mhz knows ogra doesn't approve this but it does work in most of the cases, no matter how ilogical it can be
<mhz> qwizzz: no need
<mhz> let's see what happens fisrt
<Infinity-1> is there a command I can run to repair an installation or restart an installation from cdrom?
<qwizzz> mhz I lOVE YOU!
<mhz> qwizzz: good!!!
<qwizzz> lol needless to say it worked.
<Infinity-1> is there any install file I can run from the cd
<mhz> Infinity-1: hmm, can you provide more details?
<Infinity-1> I installed Ubuntu network install
<Infinity-1> but it is not able to run Gnome desktop anymore
<Infinity-1> it worked once
<Infinity-1> I am on thinkpad 570
<Infinity-1> I finally figured out that nemagic / 60Hz / 800x600 seems to work
<Infinity-1> but it took a long time to load
<Infinity-1> now I can't even run startx
<Infinity-1> so I was wondering if i could restart the install from command line in linux using the install cd
<Infinity-1> mount cdrom
<Infinity-1> oops wrong pc sorry! lol
<mhz> Infinity-1: aahhhh, now i see
<mhz> Infinity-1: you want to re-configure X ?
<qwizzz> one more question though..  the original user account created during the OS install, the semi-root one, can log on to the terminals
<mhz> yup
<mhz> qwizzz: the beauty of LTSP
<Infinity-1> I tried   sudo dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xorg
<qwizzz> but the second account I created cannot.
<mhz> is that everyuser that exists on Server side
<mhz> will login in terminals
<Infinity-1> that worked originally but now it doesn't
<mhz> ohhh
<Infinity-1> I would like to even re-install Gnome Desktop but can't find the package name
<mhz> qwizzz: IF a user is already logged in, you cant use it from terminal
<mhz> i guess, dapper is solving that
<mhz> Infinity-1: then apt-cache search gnome
<mhz> Infinity-1: you'll see many results
<mhz> Infinity-1: you find the package name for the desktop
<Infinity-1> ok I'll try that
<mhz> Infinity-1: and then, apt-get remove gnome-desktop (if that's the name)
<Infinity-1> can't even mount cdrom anymore - says not in /etc/fstab or /etc/mtab
<Infinity-1> it's getting  worse!
<mhz> and apt-get install gnome-desktop
<mhz> Infinity-1: how do you mount cdrom?
<mhz> and what installation did you perform?
<Infinity-1> last time I booted I just typed "mount cdrom" and it worked fine
<mhz> mount /cdrom
<Infinity-1> thanks that worked!
<mhz> Infinity-1: mount command will read the file /etc/fstab
<Infinity-1> I now have access to the install cd
<mhz> hehehe
<Infinity-1> looking for gnome desktop pkg now
<Infinity-1> seem to be missing all kinds of dependent pkgs
<qwizzz> mhz seriously, thank you... I am very young and very new to linux.  I've been reading a LOT but there is just so much... 
<mhz> qwizzz: i appreciate your feelings. You're welcome
<mhz> qwizzz: and yes, there are lots to learn
<mhz> thats the beauty of this
<mhz> there are many ways to do same things
<Infinity-1> lol - I only want one that works!
<mhz> and there's always new needs to solve
<qwizzz> Yeah,  I am literally in love with edubuntu and Open Source overall
<mhz> hehehe
<mhz> me too
<mhz> Infinity-1: but maybe you are doing something wrong or have something missing
<mhz> and from here it is kind of difficult to tell
<qwizzz> I am THE PC guy for my old high school... its charter and I am basically the only Techie there
<Infinity-1> Well, I'll keep trying. Just don't want to have to take my hard drive out again mount it onto PC, install windows98, then install grub, then do network install just to get back to where I already am!
<Infinity-1> Why can't i just install EdUbuntu or Ubuntu from linux command line using Ubuntu CD
<mhz> Infinity-1: you can if you use Dapper instead of Breezy
<Infinity-1> I can install windows from windows, but I can't install linux from Linux! Go figure
<Infinity-1> Dapper?
<Infinity-1> is that another version of Ubuntu?
<mhz> qwizzz: we always try to be here to help or cheer up people but manytimes people are doing something else or sleeping
<mhz> Infinity-1: is the latest version
<mhz> Infinity-1: I have installed Linux from Linux many times
<Infinity-1> Can I install it from Linux command line?
<mhz> and even the 1st ubuntu
<mhz> yes, you can even install it via rsync
<mhz> :D
<Infinity-1> ok, thanks - I'll go burn it! 
<mhz> hehehe
<qwizzz> You have any advice on some type of groupware for  school?  I like schooltool but I don't know if it's enough.
<mhz> qwizzz: what you need?
<qwizzz> I'll let you know in 20.. :D
<mhz_BackIn20> heheh
<mhz_BackIn20> thx
#edubuntu 2006-02-09
<signifer123> good day
<qwizzztest> mhz: when you get back, the original semi-root user can log into the terminal even when it (the semi root usr) is logged into the server, and none of the users I create 
<qwizzztest> can login through the terminal machine at all.
<qwizzztest> hi
<qwizzztest> does read error: 110 mean you guys can't see me any more?
<qwizzztest> Anybody here?
<Lord_Athur> yes
<Lord_Athur> me
<Lord_Athur> :p
<qwizzztest> :D
<qwizzztest> I'm having some trouble with ltsp
<qwizzztest> I can only log onto the terminal clients with the original user created during OS install.
<Lord_Athur> :O
<Lord_Athur> that wrong
<Lord_Athur> can't you see gdm?
<qwizzztest> ??
<Lord_Athur> cannot you see any graphical applications? (the first to see is gdm(where you enter graphically))
<Lord_Athur> i've to go
<qwizzztest> hello?
<juliux> ogra, what do you think about this? http://www.juliux.de/ubuntu/edubuntudvdcover.png
<ogra> nice, but sadly doesnt gain us anything for dapper :)
<jsgotangco> oohhh cd coverr
<juliux> jsgotangco, no a cover for a dvd box
<juliux> ogra, we also will make a dapper version
<juliux> ogra, we will make edubuntu dvd boxes for the cebit
<ogra> juliux, re: dapper version for DVD box, thats nice ! 
<ogra> we'll pretty sure get the pressed install CD this time btw ...
<juliux> cool
<juliux> for the cebit we will burn dvds so we can give something about edubuntu away
<ogra> yup
<jsgotangco> grrr
<ogra> nobody answers my call for serial mice testing :'-(
<ogra> *sniff*
* juliux has no time
<ogra> its one command to issue ... not really time consuming ...
<ogra> but anyway if nobody answers with some data we wont have serial mouse support and i'll have less work to do ... fine even :)
<jsgotangco> serial
<jsgotangco> this laptop has no serial
<jsgotangco> i wish it had
<ogra> i think thats the point ... and thats why we have this longstanding bug since warty ...
<jsgotangco> ogra, do you plan to go to linuxtag?
<ogra> nobody has the equipment to even do tests
<ogra> jsgotangco, it overlaps with some other stuff iirc (have forgotten what )
<ogra> i'll surely be at FOSDEM 
<jsgotangco> err FOSDEM is too soon
* jsgotangco is planning to go to linuxtag
<ogra> but FOSDEM doesnt clash with my dates
<jsgotangco> i still have a serial mouse somewhere downstairs but i doubt if it still works
<spacey> i don't have any serial stuff either
<spacey> why do people insist using such stuff
<ogra> many users of thin clients in poorer countries do ...
<ogra> but its solved for LTSP already ...
<ogra> mdz just asked if i could solve it for the whole distro and add automatic detection
<jsgotangco> are you still in london?
<ogra> yup
<ogra> until tomorrow
<jsgotangco> ahh goodie
<dungodung> I've just installed Edubuntu
<dungodung> but my mp3s and videos won't play
<dungodung> are there codecs I should install?
<ogra> dungodung, see the RestrictedFormats page on wiki.edubuntu.org
<dungodung> will do
<dungodung> how do I go about installing a .rpm?
<mhz_dinner> dungodung: sorry, it's been 4 years since I used rpm
<mhz_dinner> but i guess you could do $sudo apt-cache search rpm
<dungodung> then why do they exist?
<mhz_dinner> rpm = are for redhat based packages
<dungodung> oh
<mhz_dinner> while deb = debian based packages
<mhz_dinner> they are already packaged for each distro
<dungodung> so ubuntu is based on debian, right
<dungodung> ?
<dungodung> which means that I shouldn't use rpms?
<mhz_dinner> however, you can always download the 'source' package (usually tar.gz) and compile it for your own needs
<mhz_dinner> dungodung: it means unless you know what you are doing, you don't need to use rpms
<mhz_dinner> dungodung: there is a Package Manager called Synaptics
<dungodung> I know that
<mhz_dinner> use it to search for applications you need
<mhz_dinner> and it will install it for you taking care of dependencies and updating your system
<dungodung> but synaptic doesn't have what I want
<dungodung> e.g. amarok, mplayer, pptpconfig, some codecs
<mhz_dinner> ohhh, it does
<mhz_dinner> you need to enable it to look for those packages in the other repositories
<dungodung> not edubuntu
<dungodung> and I can't connect to internet yet over edubuntu
<dungodung> so I have to download some packages from WinXP for now
<mhz_dinner> ohhh
<mhz_dinner> i see
<dungodung> I hope pptpconfig enables my wireless connection
<mhz_dinner> :D then it is not a problem of your APT manager but you connecting to web ?
<dungodung> and how do I install anything
<dungodung> ?
<dungodung> make install?
<mhz_dinner> depends...
<mhz_dinner> if you get your .deb packages
<mhz_dinner> you run $ dpkg -i the_package.deb
<mhz_dinner> I guess synaptics can do that for you too
* mhz_dinner not sure
<mhz_dinner> dungodung: however, the easiest and fastest way (and more safe) is to get your edubuntu box connected to web
<dungodung> well that
<dungodung> well that's what I'm trying
<mhz_dinner> but I have never used wi-fi yet
<mhz_dinner> dungodung: any chances you can try with cables?
<dungodung> mhz_dinner: I found pptpconfig.rpm...
<dungodung> mhz_dinner: cables?
<dungodung> my ISP suggested that I should buy a router (50E)
<dungodung> and I don't feel like spending that much money
<dungodung> the other option is pptpconfig and I can't seem to find the appropriate one
<mhz_dinner> hehehe
* mhz_dinner NEVER trusts ISP's
<mhz_dinner> they hardly know more than any enduser
<dungodung> well, with my ISP, it should be NEVER^n (n->inf.)
<mhz_dinner> dungodung: can you tell us your network environment layout?
<dungodung> network environment layout? what would that be?
<dungodung> :}
<mhz_dinner> example:   ISP -> cable Modem -> home-server -> swithc -> boxes
<dungodung> oh
<dungodung> ISP -> antenna on my roof -> some cables -> my computer (ethernet - wifi)
<mhz_dinner> dungodung: and your edubuntu box 'must' use wi-fi? can't it be ethernet cable while we get all you need?
<mhz_dinner> dungodung: ooh, you have only one computer?
<dungodung> yes
<dungodung> I found http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=31516
<mhz_dinner> and those "some cables" what are for?
<dungodung> for connecting wifi with the antenna
<mhz_dinner> dungodung: simple..  add the following to your repository.
<mhz_dinner> deb http://quozl.netrek.org/pptp/ pptpconfig/
<mhz_dinner> deb http://quozl.netrek.org/pptp/ php-gtk/
<dungodung> and the one for electricity
<dungodung> how do I add to repository?
<mhz_dinner> can we use a terminal?
<dungodung> well I'm in windows
<mhz_dinner> ohh
<mhz_dinner> so that box is dualboot?
<dungodung> and I don't, obviously, have internet in linus
<dungodung> *x
<dungodung> yes, I'm having grub manage linux/win
<mhz_dinner> dungodung: donwload http://quozl.netrek.org/pptp/pptp-linux-1.5.0.tar.gz
<mhz_dinner> to your guindouz box
<dungodung> ok...
<dungodung> done
<mhz_dinner> get that tar.gz to your linux HD /home partition
<mhz_dinner> (usb stick, floppy, cd, somewhow ) :D
<mhz_dinner> oooppp, sorry,
<dungodung> I can access the files from linux
<mhz_dinner> family forcing me to have lunch
<dungodung> it's ntfs, but I found a way
<dungodung> ok, you go on
<dungodung> I'll manage
<mhz_dinner> dungodung: you'll have to compile it
<dungodung> bon apetit
<dungodung> how?
<mhz_dinner> https://wiki.edubuntu.org/?action=fullsearch&context=180&value=wifi&titlesearch=Titles
<mhz_dinner> in that wiki, you'll find tons of useful info
<mhz_dinner> to compile
<mhz_dinner> or maybe even pptpconfig
<dungodung> allright
<dungodung> thank you VERY much
<dungodung> now, go eat ;))
<mhz_dinner> dungodung: you also have
<mhz_dinner> https://wiki.edubuntu.org/?action=fullsearch&context=180&value=wifi&titlesearch=Titles
<mhz_dinner> sorry
<mhz_dinner> dungodung: you also have pptp-linux
<mhz_dinner> i guess that is included in the CD
<mhz_dinner> so maybe even you already have it
<mhz_dinner> https://wiki.edubuntu.org/mppeVPNhowto?highlight=%28pptpconfig%29
<mhz_dinner> dungodung: thx
<dungodung> :D
<signifer123> hello
<Lord_Athur> hi signifer123 
#edubuntu 2006-02-10
<ove> hello anyone?
<signifer123> hello
<ove> I have som trouble with my old IBM and dapper
<ove> the screen resolution is not appropriate
<signifer123> is it stuck on 640x480?
<ove> yes
<ove> can I fix it via the terminal?
<ove> I can get that to work but doesn't know the commands
<ove> sorry my misspellings
<signifer123> yes you can...
<signifer123> two ways
<signifer123> edit the /etx/X11/org.conf
<signifer123> or run sudo dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xorg
<ove> thank you, I'll try those
<signifer123> you have a web browser?
<signifer123> http://ubuntuforums.org/showpost.php?p=129379&postcount=21
<signifer123> or http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?p=454217
<signifer123> both solve the problem
<signifer123> and this may work:
<signifer123> sudo cp /etc/X11/xorg.conf /etc/X11/xorg.conf.custom
<signifer123> sudo sh -c 'md5sum /etc/X11/xorg.conf > /var/lib/xfree86/xorg.conf.md5sum'
<signifer123> sudo dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xorg
<twan> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/8015
<ove> I just tried the dapper install on my old pc. I firing it up now to try to adjust the resolution
<signifer123> so?
<signifer123> it work?
<signifer123> twan what is that for?
<ove> the problem is seeing what I'm typing
<signifer123> what app are you compiling
<signifer123> ohhh
<ove> I have not figured it out yet
<ove> The first one seemed to work okay
<ove> I okayed through a lot of questions...
<signifer123> which one you do
<ove> but the resolution stayed the same
<signifer123> reconfigure?
<ove> sudo dpkg-reconfigure xserver-xor
<ove> g
<signifer123> yeah...
<ove> and  sudo cp /etc/X11/xorg.conf /etc/X11/xorg.conf.custom
<signifer123> that jsut backs it up
<ove> I do not have internet connection with it
<signifer123> ok
<signifer123> what does it have when you do:
<signifer123> sudo edit /etc/X11/xorg.conf
<ove> just a minute...
<signifer123> that iwll open the file in term
<signifer123> when you scroll down where will be SubSection "Display":
<twan> signfier, it's for svgalib
<signifer123> that holds the different resolutions for x11
<signifer123> k
<twan> do u know what that is
<signifer123> dispaly libraries
<twan> why would i get that error
<ove> perl:  warning: settings failed ... and a lot more
<signifer123> ohhh
<ove> ...unknown file type
<signifer123> what was it doing?
<ove> sorry ... unknown mime-tye
<ove> mime-type
<signifer123> was that on boot or what?
<ove> no "edit" mailcap rules found
<ove> after the sudo edit /etc/X11/xorg.conf
<signifer123> that jsut means you have nothign assigned to the eidt command
<signifer123> dit*
<signifer123> edit*
<signifer123> you have vi,vim,or any other text edtor
<signifer123> for console...
<signifer123> i don't feel ubuntu is very good at console
<signifer123> you cannot boot into 640 by 480 adn use gedit?
<signifer123> and*
<ove> I have started vi now, but I have not used it before
<signifer123> alright
<signifer123> type
<signifer123> :q
<signifer123> then press enter
<signifer123> and use it to load the xorg.conf
<signifer123> sudo vi /etc/X11/xorg.conf
<signifer123> use arrow keys to move, o to write ot the file
<signifer123> and esc key to exit write mode
<signifer123> :q then press enter to exit, and :w then enter to save
<signifer123> :-p
<ove> I can see the config.file, where do i write?
<signifer123> scroll down
<signifer123> to a part with SubSection "Display"
<signifer123> or a bunch of SubSection "Display"
<signifer123> it will have depth
<signifer123> and modes
<signifer123> the modes are resolutions
<ove> I can see section screen
<signifer123> yeah thats it
<signifer123> look at the DefaultDepth
<ove> depth 4
<signifer123> and move to the SubSection "Display" with that depth
<signifer123> and is the only mode 640x480?
<lucasvo> ove: hm, depth 4 will mean that you only have 16 colors
<ove> modes but it says 1400x1050?
<lucasvo> is that correct?
<signifer123> hmmm...
<signifer123> i guess so...
<lucasvo>         SubSection "Display"
<lucasvo>                 Depth           4
<lucasvo>                 Modes           "1280x1024" "1280x960" "1152x864" "1024x768" "832x624" "800x600" "720x400" "640x480"
<lucasvo>         EndSubSection
<lucasvo> this is the way I have it
<ove> no, only 1400x1050
<ove> maybe I have to turn it off first
<ove> can I switch it to 1280x960?
<ove> or 800x600 perhaps?
<signifer123> yeah...
<signifer123> or jsut add more
<signifer123> mine funks out if i delete the originals
<signifer123> what video card you have?
<ove> I am not sure, but I'll have to stop now
<ove> thank you for all your help
<ove> I'll save it and try again to morrow
<ove> bye
<signifer123> cya
<thefamousnomo> hello people
<thefamousnomo> anyone else have any difficulties getting sound on some of the gcompris suite?
<thefamousnomo> anyone????
<lucasvo> are there any cd covers for (ed)ubuntu 6.04 flight 3?
<squareyes> Evening all, just installed Edubuntu on hda3 Ubuntu on hda1, is there anyway I can access between the 2 please?
<squareyes> Boot flag on hda3
<Kamping_Kaiser> access betweent the 2?
<squareyes> Wish to read and write to both from both
<squareyes> df on both only show a single system e.g.squareyes@ubuntuhere:~$ df
<squareyes> Filesystem           1K-blocks      Used Available Use% Mounted on
<squareyes> /dev/hda1             19226476   3174616  15075112  18% /
<squareyes> tmpfs                   128400         0    128400   0% /dev/shm
<squareyes> tmpfs                   128400     12588    115812  10% /lib/modules/2.6.12-9-386/volatile 
<Kamping_Kaiser> so you need a new line in fstab in each system, and a new directory in /mnt
<Kamping_Kaiser> so say `mkdir /mnt/Edubuntu` then add the line `/dev/hda1       /mnt/Edubuntu           ext3    defaults        0       0` to your fstab
<Kamping_Kaiser> and chnage Edubuntu for plain Ubuntu and hda1 with hda3 where required
<squareyes> have put the line in /etc/fstab,  /dev/hda3       /media/hda3     ext3    defaults,errors=remount-ro 0       1 all show in /media
<squareyes> will give that a try thanks
<Kamping_Kaiser> ok. gl
<Kamping_Kaiser> (why media i don't know, but oh well)
<squareyes> my appologies, meant /dev/
<Kamping_Kaiser> no, you had them the right way round, i just find putting partitions in /media/ a bit rediculous
<flint> good morning....
<zakame> heya flint 
<flint> jelkner was supposed to show up on this channel...
<flint> zakame, how are you all?
<zakame> there was some talk between Kamping_Kaiser and squareyes a while ago
<flint> My current bluse revolve around this damn Mach Speed PM800 Mother board and celeron I picked up from tiger direct...
<flint> The silly thing (and I got 2) will not POST.
<Kamping_Kaiser> hm zakame?
<zakame> gaah :(
<zakame> Kamping_Kaiser: re: squareyes on hd access
<zakame> (er don
<zakame> 't mind me)
<Kamping_Kaiser> ah right
<flint> ...and how this relates to edubuntu is that this fine 3.2 GHz 2 Gig humer was going to be my new edubuntu test server..
<flint> kevin?  
<C-O-L-T> Seveas: does exist an edubuntu Live CD?
<C-O-L-T> there is an edubuntu live cd?
<C-O-L-T> anybody here?
<C-O-L-T> there is an edubuntu live cd?
<juliux> C-O-L-T, http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/daily-live/current/ there ist the live cd
<C-O-L-T> juliux: why is not written at www.edubuntu.org that there is a live cd
<juliux> C-O-L-T, because it is a alpha version
<C-O-L-T> juliux: this is dapper, is it stable, can I use it
<juliux> dapper is a developer version
<juliux> you can use it but no garantie that it will work 100%
<C-O-L-T> juliux: what does it means this
<juliux> that it isnt tested very well
<juliux> there are many bugs 
<C-O-L-T> juliux: if you use it, you can tell me that if it  is stable or not
<juliux> i use breezy 
<juliux> dapper only for testing new things
<C-O-L-T> ok I would like just to look at edubuntu, I have ubuntu
<C-O-L-T> I am just interested
<C-O-L-T> it will help me dapper live?
<juliux> yes 
<juliux> but i think there is not server services on it
<C-O-L-T> ok
<C-O-L-T> I don't need any services, I just want to look at it
<juliux> ok 
<C-O-L-T> and there is no breezy live of edubuntu
<juliux> no
<juliux> the livecd is new for dapper
<C-O-L-T> I see
<C-O-L-T> And after the final - official release there will be an Edubuntu live cd?
<C-O-L-T> what do you know?
<C-O-L-T> juliux: ?
<juliux> i think so 
<C-O-L-T> ok
<C-O-L-T> thanks for the information
<C-O-L-T> juliux: bye
<juliux> cu
<C-O-L-T> need to go
<simon__> hi i have ubuntu already installed can i migrate easily to Edubuntu.
<simon__> anyone at home?
<signifer123> not certain if you cna do it without install
<mhz> signifer123: yes, from ubuntu, just $ apt-get install edubuntu-server edubuntu-desktop
<signifer123> ooh :-p
<signifer123> anyone won slune?
#edubuntu 2006-02-11
<flint> hi there I am in need o f some help setting up edubuntu breezy....
<flint> lucasvo, you there?
<flint> sksk think I have hardware problems bye for now.
<jsgotangco> dont we all
<mhz> jsgotangco: thx for those pictures
<mhz> were those from your cell phone?
<jsgotangco> some not all
<jsgotangco> well that's not my album
<mhz> oh
<jsgotangco> that's from a friend
<mhz> jsgotangco: i have made a background for edubuntu 6.04, but again it's darkish :(
<jsgotangco> i've seen them
<jsgotangco> looks good for xfce though
<mhz> oh, this one I did today?
<mhz> oh, yes! you are subscribed to * :D
<mhz> anyways, I astill can't get to understand how AUC works
<jsgotangco> its terribly cumbersome at the moment
<mhz> ohh
<jsgotangco> an approver uploads and creates thumbnails then ftps those to a server
<mhz> eeeeek!
<jsgotangco> so if you are broadband-challenged, download a 1280x1040 wallpaper won't cut it
<jsgotangco> then create a thumbnail then upload
<jsgotangco> even in broadband the process is cumbersome
<mhz> but, there are web tools to do that
<jsgotangco> yes but you see we made our own tool from scratch
<mhz> hehehe
<jsgotangco> henrik was discussing to moving it completely to moin
<jsgotangco> and have contributors uplod themselves
<jsgotangco> like what we have been doing to theopencd.org
<mhz> yup
* mhz still complains he cant find time for OpenCD :(  !!!
<jsgotangco> if you can suggest a high-quality winfoss app, that'll do
<jsgotangco> i can just evaluate it
<mhz> jsgotangco: what id we had a #ubuntu-moin so we can direct users to help them thruogh the wikiing process
<mhz> autocad!!!
<mhz> :D
<jsgotangco> ubuntu-moin?
<mhz> yup
<mhz> helping users on-real-time
<mhz> showing them wiking is not hard 
<jsgotangco> ok i have no time to support such though
<mhz> i know
<mhz> it's just that I have read (you too) many wiki complains, suggestions, ideas, etc
<jsgotangco> yeah
<mhz> and maybe it is easier to help these people with troubles, to solve them together, by hand
<mhz> step by step
<mhz> having an IRC support
<jsgotangco> i think you're the most qualified for this
<mhz> hahahah
* mhz is just a fan
* mhz commits harakiri every end-of-day becasue he still knows nothing about python
<mhz> but surely I'd be glad to help
<mhz> well, henrik has learnt a lot too
<jsgotangco> but you're initiated it already,you're already qualified
<mhz> yup, i guess
<mhz> "but if I die on the field today, who will take my place and this flag and lead the victory?"
<mhz> :D
<jsgotangco> we run back to the barracks
<mhz> LOL
<mhz> jsgotangco: can i make one last question before i either go to bed or back to Inkscape?
<jsgotangco> sure
<jsgotangco> its almost lunch here anyways
<mhz> oohh, okis
<mhz> here it's 00:55 AM of monday
<jsgotangco> what's your question?
<mhz> jsgotangco: as you know I need to use darkish themes and wallpapers (usually), BUT
<mhz> many web pages i visit they usually render in white background and "almost-impossible-to-read" words because they look like white too
<mhz> but when I use normal "whitey" themes, I see all web pages ok
* ulinskie is away: kain po muna
<jsgotangco> hmm
<jsgotangco> white itself has many palettes
<mhz> ?
<mhz> I mean, if i use a black based theme, I have this issue. But even if I use a grey one, that doesn't happen
<Hal> Is there, or is there planned to be, a bootable cd release of EduBuntu? I love the live CD version of Ubuntu and would love to be able to pop in the cd to my wifes computer for my son to be able to use it.
* ulinskie is away: up up and away...
<alejandro_> someone with experience using LTSP with edubuntu/ubuntu ?
<spacey> alejandro_, yes
<spacey> it works
<spacey> finely
<alejandro_> spacey, here i have problems with tftpd, forbidden directory and it doesnt load the kernel image.
<spacey> forbidden directory?
<alejandro_> yes and i have the right permissions in the /tftpboot
<spacey> did you set the right path?
<spacey> grep tftp /etc/inetd.conf
<spacey> tftp           dgram   udp     wait    root  /usr/sbin/in.tftpd /usr/sbin/in.tftpd -s /tftpboot
<spacey> because default ubuntu path is different
<spacey> alejandro_, :)
<spacey> # tftp           dgram   udp     wait    root  /usr/sbin/in.tftpd /usr/sbin/in.tftpd -s /var/lib/tftpboot
<spacey> last one is default edubuntu
<lucasvo>  /w 16
<flint> mhz, my life is a living hell...
<flint> jsgotangco, anyone seen ogra this morning>
<mhz> flint: why? what happens?
<mhz> flint: probably they are on a plane right now
<flint> mhz, gotcha.  how was the human virus business in london?
<jsgotangco> nope
<jsgotangco> he's probably still in london or about to go leave
<jsgotangco> or already at home i dunno
<flint> I have got the lab set up here in Vermont, and I have a copy of edubuntu bb running
<mhz> cool
<flint> I hook up a crossover cable to a laptop and pxe boot perfectly and get to the famous lotr login screen (think eye of sauron)
<flint> I try to log on with a known good name and I get nowhere...any ideas?
<mhz> :D
<mhz> yes
<mhz> flint: 1st step... in the server, run $ ltsp-update-sshkeys
<mhz> and then try to login from the laptop using a known user in the server.. BUT make sure that user is not already logged in
<flint> no, not to my knowledge... lemme check... it is just a plain vanilla bb
<flint> gotcha...
<flint> hold on... this looks promising... :^)
* mhz is not english native speaker
<flint> I wish I spoke spanish like mhs speaks english!
<mhz> flint: i dont know why, it is even illogical to ogra, but the ltsp-update-sshkeys does work 99% when you can't login
<mhz> ;)
<mhz> flint: gotcha is like "it works" ?
<lucasvo> flint: what was yesterday?
<lucasvo> flint: you pinged me
<flint> mhz, the damn think took off like a scalded cat!!! EXCELLENT!
<mhz> flint: ooh, cool
<flint> now I gotta go back to my intermittend hardware problem...
<mhz> flint: just remember that breezy only accepts logins from users that are not already logged in
<mhz> in other words, you can login with a user only once
<flint> I need to write this stuff up.  you will be my STAR!
<mhz> thx, :D
<flint> lucasvo, it was this very same (and greviously annoying) problemmo.  thanks to all.
<flint> why not put this in the chrontab?
<alejandro_> spacey, yes, i changed it, but i restarted inetd and is still not working.
<spacey> alejandro_, errorlog:)
<spacey> you sure tftpd is the problem?
<alejandro_> yes, I think so.
<ogra> whats the error ? 
<zakame> heya ogra ! :D
<ogra> hey zakame 
<alejandro> spacey, now it works. :-)
<spacey> alejandro, great
<alejandro> spacey, just it doesnt find the pivot_root, so it doesnt mount the nfs
<alejandro> spacey, :(
<spacey> alejandro, check your exports then
<alejandro> /opt/ltsp                 192.168.0.0/255.255.255.0(ro,no_root_squash,sync)
<alejandro> /var/opt/ltsp/swapfiles   192.168.0.0/255.255.255.0(rw,no_root_squash,async)
<alejandro> and /opt/ltsp       *(ro,no_root_squash,async)
<alejandro> what is wrong here? 
<ogra> wipe one of the concurring /opt/ltsp entries 
<ogra>  /opt/ltsp       *(ro,no_root_squash,async) is the default
<alejandro> the default one?
<ogra> of ubuntu ltsp, yes
<spacey> should work with either
<ogra> yup#
<ogra> (in case the network stuff it right in the other one indeed)
<alejandro> ok, thanks
<alejandro> heh, the tftp working in the fedora, i dont know why it's not working with ubuntu with the same dhcp configuration
<alejandro> it's extrange..
<spacey> look at the errors
<spacey> you said earlier that it worked right
<spacey> tftp
<ogra> alejandro, did you follow the ThinClientHowto ? 
<ogra> there normally is nothing to configure, it should work out of the box
<alejandro> ogra, the clients work without problems, there were tested before with Fedora 
<alejandro> ogra, here we bought thin clients ready to use with LTSP
<alejandro> the problem happens with the ubuntu server :(
<ogra> alejandro, thats not what i asked ... fedora uses the old ltsp implementation, ubuntu has muecow
<alejandro> spacey, worked right because I was running the fedora in the vmware
<alejandro> spacey, ogra, can you send me your dhcpd.conf ?
<spacey> i can't
<spacey> to specific
<spacey> but examples are in the documentation
<spacey> you can post yours on pastebin
<spacey> en i can check it for you
<ogra> alejandro, the default dhcpd.conf is what i use (since i wrote it for the package)
<ogra> see the ThinClientHowto, its on that page ...
<spacey> alejando, your running normal ltsp on ubuntu right?
<alejandro> yes
<ogra> spacey, define "normal"
<spacey> it should work, if it doesn't i think its better to ask for support in #ltsp. since you don't use the ubuntu implemention
<spacey> ogra, ltsp.org
<spacey> version
<ogra> the normal ltsp on ubuntu is ltsp-server :)
<ogra> spacey, :)
<spacey> hmm
<spacey> ok
<spacey> anyway
<spacey> i got the normal one working now
<spacey> so it works
<spacey> the ubuntu implementation was not stable enough
<spacey> in our situatio
<spacey> n
<ogra> note that we'll drop support for the old ltsp with dapper
<spacey> ogra, well you can still install it on top i guess?
<ogra> i guess so ... 
<ogra> if someone takes care of the packages in universe (i wont)
<spacey> it would hurt your eyes if you see it maybe ;p
<alejandro> well, anyway i dont understand why in the ThinClient Howto, they use in the dhcpd.conf "ltsp" directory, when it creates a "lts" in tftp
<alejandro> it's a bug?
<ogra> nope
<ogra> the ThinClientHowto was written for the fully automatic muecow installation ... its perfectly right as its written there
<ogra> if you use the classic ltsp from ltsp.org, use their documentation ...
<alejandro> well, i'm using the ubuntu packages
<alejandro> (in breezy)
<ogra> the ltsp-server and/or ltsp-server-standalone package ? 
<alejandro> ltsp-server-standalone
<alejandro> but currently I'm using my own dhcp server
<ogra> then you shouldnt use -standalone ...
<ogra> (see the package descriptios of ltsp-server and ltsp-server-standalone)
<alejandro> ok, then ltsp-server and dhcpd no?
<ogra> nope
<ogra> no need for dhcpd if you already have one in your network
<ogra> just make sure the dhcpd you have is set up correctly to point the clients to your ltsp server 
<alejandro> ah ok, but here in testing in an alone network, i need one
<ogra> yes
<ogra> then you need to follow the ThinClientHowto ...
<mhz> ogra: hi, ping
<ogra> mhz, pong
<mhz> ogra: any version control system you know of that lets you use some kind of ACL or control based on user privileges?
<ogra> nope, i only use and know bzr ...
<mhz> oh, okis
<mhz> is there any bzr GUI?
<ogra> but svn or cvs might do such stuff ... 
<ogra> yes
<ogra> bzrk 
<mhz> duh!
<mhz> sorry
* mhz forgot about that
<mhz> ogra: thx
<paolob> hi guys!
<paolob> hi ogra 
<mhz> paolob: hi
<paolob> I was experimenting with my 40 clients, and I saw that the bottleneck in the clients' booting is the moment in witch the client says: "calculating modules dependencies": every client need almost 10 MB/s!
<paolob> hi mhz 
<paolob> in order to speed up the clients' boot, that moment is the most important, I think
<paolob> mhz, is ogra away
<paolob> ?
<paolob> ogra, how are you?
<paolob> mhz, referring to the "no free leases" bug, ogra had told me to reduce the lease-time in /etc/dhcp3/dhcpd.conf . That change doesn't resolve the bug, a lesses lease time is to be put in /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf
<mhz> paolob: sorry i was on the phone
<paolob> mhz, could you tell him?
<mhz> yup, I could
<paolob> you could or you can?
<paolob> :-)
<signifer123> hey
#edubuntu 2006-02-12
<RazaMetaL> hi
<RazaMetaL> can you help me with some ltsp on ubuntu?
<mhz> RazaMetaL: hi
<mhz> RazaMetaL: shoot
<RazaMetaL> mhz, thnkz ... :)
<RazaMetaL> mhz, i need to enable localmedia support
<mhz> RazaMetaL: ooooohhh
<mhz> by local, you mean clients?
<RazaMetaL> yes
<RazaMetaL> localmedia in the clients
<mhz> Are you suing Breezy or Dapper?
<mhz> using
<RazaMetaL> breezy
<RazaMetaL> http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/LocalMedia#Scripts
<RazaMetaL> if you use GDM:
<mhz> RazaMetaL: then it doesn't work, afaik
<RazaMetaL> /usr/local/bin/LDA-setup.sh goes into line 3 of /etc/X11/gdm/PostLogin/Default
<RazaMetaL> /usr/local/bin/LDA-shutdown.sh goes into line 3 of /etc/X11/gdm/PostSession/Default
* mhz checking again, but he remembers localmedia is one of the issues for breezy
<RazaMetaL> I need to upgrade to Dapper ?
<mhz> RazaMetaL: localmedia is under development for dapper
<mhz> current status is unknown to me
<RazaMetaL> :S
<mhz> RazaMetaL: gimme a sec
<mhz> jsgotangco: alive?
<jsgotangco> yeah but quite busy
<jsgotangco> whats up
<jsgotangco> ?
<mhz> is localmedia issue solved for dapper?
<mhz> was there a workaround for breezy?
<jsgotangco> pmount?
<mhz> localmedia = on clients side 
<jsgotangco> not sure
<mhz> jsgotangco: okis, then you confimr my thoughts, thx
<RazaMetaL> :(
<mhz> RazaMetaL: nope, not solved yet but under development
<mhz> for dapper
<mhz> RazaMetaL: yes, I know how you feel
<mhz> but look at from this perspective...
<mhz> Breezy is verion 1 of Edubuntu, Dapper #2
<mhz> and in only 2 versions (releasing every 6 month period) issues are taking good care of :D
<RazaMetaL> i'm happy now with breezy and ltsp :)
<mhz> hehehe
<mhz> ogra is doing a terrific job
<mhz> trying to make everyone happy
<RazaMetaL> coul be better if the clients can support the localmedia
<mhz> of course
<mhz> and they will
<mhz> Dapper is scheduled for April
<RazaMetaL> whats happens if i start the LDA-setup.sh ?
<mhz> i have not tested it yet
<RazaMetaL> the script will be running in the client side of server side ?
* mhz had more boxes for an LTSP environment but now he only has 2 boxes
<mhz> RazaMetaL: afaik, LTSP is about running all the stuff in server side, forwarding x via ssh
<RazaMetaL> ahh.... is clear now
<mhz> All clients need is processor, little ram and a NIC
<cliebow> mhz: yes it is..ubuntu forwards xover ssh..traditional does a simle x connection
<mhz> cliebow: thx for confirming that at this late hours for my head
<cliebow> mon plaisir,mon ami!
<RazaMetaL> mhz, i'm reading https://wiki.edubuntu.org/ThinClientLocalDevices
<RazaMetaL> :)
* mhz is reading too
<mhz> cliebow: je ne se parle francais, at all :D
<mhz> RazaMetaL: oooh, yes, I thought you knew... Edubuntu uses a LTSP modification, not standard ltsp
<mhz> LTSP 4.2 (i guess) will use Edubuntu innovations
<RazaMetaL> :S
* ulinskie is away: visit wahoy.com, zamboanga's free online classified ads
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
* ulinskie is away: visit wahoy.com, zamboanga's free online classified ads
<alejandro> alejandro@voyager:~/Desktop$ sudo ltsp-build-client
<alejandro> I: Retrieving Release
<alejandro> E: Failed getting release file http://us.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/breezy/Release
<alejandro> hmm, why ltsp-build-client is not working here?
<ogra> try with another mirror 
<ogra>  sudo ltsp-build-client --mirror http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu
<ogra> or 
<ogra> mount cdrom &&  sudo ltsp-build-client --mirror file:///cdrom
<ogra> the us mirror is known to have issues from time to time
<ogra> (its changed to archive.ubuntu.com in dapper)
<alejandro> yes, i tested with another mirrors, but the same problem.
<alejandro> it's odd, because I can see the release file in the web browser.
<ogra> works fine here ...
<ogra> at least with the first command i gave you above ...
<alejandro> alejandro@voyager:/$  sudo ltsp-build-client --mirror http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu
<alejandro> I: Retrieving Release
<alejandro> E: Failed getting release file http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/breezy/Release
<alejandro> hm.
<ogra> your network setup is fine on this machine ? 
<ogra> can you do:
<ogra> wget http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/breezy/Release
<alejandro> yes, I downloaded with wget.
<ogra> thats pretty strange ...
<jsgotangco> brb
<ogra> if you run a normal apt-get update on the system that works as well ? (note that ltsp-build-client does exactly this)
<alejandro> sudo debootstrap breezy /opt/ltsp/i386/ archive.ubuntu.com
<alejandro> the same trying to make a debootstrap
<alejandro> yes, apt-get update works fine.
<alejandro> magic! :)
<ogra> that cant work 
<ogra> sudo debootstrap breezy /opt/ltsp/i386/ archive.ubuntu.com
<ogra> it clearly wont get any file 
<ogra> you need archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu
<alejandro> yes, i tried both
<alejandro> ;(
<ogra> any cdrom handy to try with a cd as mirror ? 
<alejandro> no, i will try to download it again.
<dsaa[away] > ogra: may i know if there's a solution to the serial keyboard and serial mouse non-detection in edubuntu breezy?
<ogra> dsaa[away] , not for thin clients, no, you could try a little sed magic in the ltsp-client-setup initscript though ...
<dsaa[away] > ogra: for default desktops only, i'm not using ltsp yet.
<ogra> hmm, well, now that i think about it ... you could install the "joystick" package in the client chroot and write an initscript that runs inputattach with the right parameters, that might be easier
<ogra> ah, k
<ogra> just install joystick and make sure inputattach gets started before gdm ...
<ogra> i.e. you could add it to the bootmisc.sh script ...
<dsaa[away] > ogra: thanks for the clue.
<ogra> youre welcome :)
<eds0n> Hey, just wondering.. I've just set up an edubuntu server, and I'm wondering how to add users so you can login through the clients? I can't login :/
<ogra> eds0n, every user that can log in locally on the server is also able to log in through a client ...
<eds0n> ogra: so you mean I just add users the regular way, and that's it?
<ogra> that should be it, yes ...
<eds0n> ogra: cause I tried but it didn't work :/ Must be something else then
<eds0n> ogra: ok, I'll check it out more thoroughly then
<ogra> did you try with your admin user ? 
<eds0n> yep
<eds0n> doesn't login
<ogra> note that if you changed the ip of the interface the thin clients are connected to after installation you must run sudo ltsp-update-sshkeys to make the ssh server aware of the change ...
<ogra> try that and try to log in again
<eds0n> ogra: SSH?
<eds0n> ogra: I'm just talking about logging in through the thin-clients. Didn't know that was through SSH
<eds0n> ahh. it worked! Thanks :D
<ogra> the edubuntu ltsp uses ssh tunnels
<eds0n> ogra: cool, thanks man
<ogra> (no unsafe X forwarding ;) )
<ogra> :)
<ogra> glad to help :)
<eds0n> ogra: thanks again, now I can start the experiment :)
<ogra> :)
<ogra> come back if you got more questions ;)
<eds0n> well, we're basically doing a performance experiment, so we have to find out what tools to use to measure performance. Any ideas?
<ogra> hmm ...
<dsaa[away] > ogra: may i know what channel the community council meeting is conducted in the IRC?
<spacey> #ubuntu-meeting
<ogra> #ubuntu-meeting, as all meetings we have :)
<spacey> all meetings
<dsaa[away] > ogra: thanks again
<cliebow> ogra: with last weeks dapper iso.can not find suitable kernel..on Dell laptop,,any hunts?
<ogra> a dily build ? 
<ogra> *daily
<ogra> (note that the last tested one was flight 3, which should be fine) 
<cliebow> wel just an iso so not too sure.ill look up fklight three see if it is what i have
<ogra> we were all in london for the distro hacking sprint, so nobody had time to check the dailies
<cliebow> ill just give another try..
<mhz> ogra: hi. paolob was here last night and sent this message to you "the lease reduction has to be done in /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.con and not in /etc/dhcp/"
<ogra> mhz, yup, i know, my mistake ...
<mhz> oh, no mistake, just a little trip :)
<cliebow> mhz: i type far better in french than in English 8~)
* mhz remembers very clearly he had also mentioned that to paolob 3 weeks ago or so
<cliebow> im just a downeaster from Maine
<mhz> cliebow: ok, mon amie
<cliebow> 8~)
<mhz> cliebow: no matter what lang. I type in, I always make typos :D
<cliebow> me too..bad keyboard it m ust be
<cliebow> like yoda i also talk sometimes
<mhz> nah... bad naughty fingers ;p
<cliebow> 8~)..booking it for school..later..
* mode/#edubuntu [+o highvoltage]  by ChanServ
<spacey> i miss k8 kernel on ubuntu 32bit
<spacey> ;(
<ogra> err... k8 on 32bit ??
<spacey> yeah
<spacey> why not
<ogra> because k8 is compiled to make full use of the 64bit registers of the CPU ...
<ogra> it cant work reliable in 32bit
<spacey> hmm
<spacey> will k7 work?
<Yagisan> ??
<Yagisan> a k8 kernel works fine on 32bit
<Yagisan> spaceyk7 is ok
<spacey> many valid reasons to run i386 on an amd64 cpu
<spacey> at least
<spacey> just wondering which kernel is most ideal in this case
<spacey> i'll give k7 a try
<Yagisan> spacey k7 works. k8 (32bit kernel) IIRC is similar to the pentium 4 optimised kernels
<ogra> Yagisan, there is no k8 32bit kernel in ubuntu 
<spacey> Yagisan: so which kernel would fit best? :P
<Yagisan> ogra: pity. the 0.0000000005% speedup ;)
<Yagisan> spacey Ideally a rool-your-own, but out of the box - k7
<ogra> heh
<spacey> Yagisan: xD
<ogra> it'd rather be intresting to have the fan and cputmp modules working ... they dont work at all in 32bit kernels on amd64
<Yagisan> for ease of admin though, most of my boxes use i686
<spacey> Yagisan: whats the advantage for admin with that?
* Yagisan has 2 i586 class, 3 i686 class, and 1 amd64 class system
<spacey> 586? thats ancient
<Yagisan> spacey i586 is not ancient
<Yagisan> spacey: it works PERFECTLY fine, is quiet, and relatively cool
<Yagisan> I wish I could say the same about several i686 systems I've had
* Yagisan dreams about having a quad, dual core amd64 box
<spacey> Yagisan: thats pre pentium2 right?
<spacey> that is ancient
<spacey> :D
<ogra> 586 is pentium I
<ogra> and pentium pro
<ogra> and most of the new geode via and other embedded CPUs
<spacey> i would not have any use for a pentium1 at least
<ogra> all my thin clients here are 586 ... even the brand new ones 
<ogra> additionally most of the mini ITX embedded boards you find in settop and multimedia boxes are 
<Yagisan> ogra: pentium pro is the original i686
<Yagisan> spacey I have many uses for them
<Yagisan> firewalls, vpns, thin clients, www server
<ogra> Yagisan, ah, right
<Yagisan> testing boxes
<ogra> i just wanted to poit out that its a wrong assumption that 586 is old :)
<Yagisan> i586 include k6, k6/2, most cyrix/via chips
<spacey> for vpn they might be a bit slow
<Yagisan> spacey: nope. that saturate the link with blowfish
<spacey> www server could be a bit faster as well, if its public
<Yagisan> they] 
<spacey> also depends on your bandwidth i guess;p
<spacey> even my p2 400 has some work if i utilize my 10mbit line over IPSEC
<Yagisan> spacey. A Pentium 60 can saturate a Fast Ethernet Connection. With blowfish it does about 70% capacity
<Yagisan> AES or 3DES ?
<spacey> we don't use blowfish
<Yagisan> blowfish is nice. just as strong as AES, but much faster. not so good for embeded systems though
<spacey>         pfs_group modp768;
<spacey>         encryption_algorithm 3des;
<spacey>         authentication_algorithm hmac_md5;
<spacey>         compression_algorithm deflate;
<Yagisan> woo hoo. My Japanese translations are being done :)
<spacey> from raccoon.conf
<spacey> racoon even
<Yagisan> spacey: 3des is very slow. even on amd64
<spacey> no performance problems here
<spacey> but i don't use p1
<Yagisan> spacey: switching to aes will give you both better security, and higher throughput
<spacey> :)
<spacey> ah, i'll consider that
<mcksean> 
<mcksean> anyone out there right now?
<Yagisan> damm, spacey left
<Yagisan> mcksean: there is always people here
<Yagisan> sometimes, we are just to busy to answer
<mcksean> excellent
<mcksean> thanks yagisan
<Yagisan> what's on your mind ?
<mcksean> i've been looking for an opportunity to deploy a k12ltsp for years and have stumbled across edubuntu when downloading a copy of breezy...
<mcksean> my kids have had fun with it so far and i'd like some input on the ltsp portion of edubuntu -- is good to go at this point...at beta status?
<mcksean> oops -- that was supposed to be "would like some input on"
<Yagisan> I think the ltsp stuff works so well, I use it in a commercial (non-educational) setting
<Yagisan> :)
<Yagisan> but I've heard that the next release will be even better
<mcksean> the k12ltsp project uses the server as the router for the classroom lan and workstations--does edubuntu's ltsp function that way?
<ogra> its stable and reliable, but lacks some of the features the classic ltsp has ... (i.e. we dont support all options in lts.conf yet)
<Yagisan> basically
<Yagisan> but it has some advantages too
<Yagisan> much quicker and easier install
<mcksean> heard that
<mcksean> one cd as opposed to a dvd for fc4
<Yagisan> regular updates for sec issues
<mcksean> very nice :)
<Yagisan> uses ubuntu native applications
<Yagisan> :)
<ogra> and we guarantee upgradeability on new releases ;)
<ogra> no reinstalls necessary 
<mcksean> one of the biggest obstacles that I have is overcoming MS mindshare -- i've got a very lowtech instructor who will be the one with his hands on the computers most of the time -- i need some info for him on how easy it really is to manage
<mcksean> also, what are you running on your server for the ltsp?
<mcksean> can i get by with a p4 2.4GHz box with IDE to get things started?...or do I at least need to upgrade to a SCSI drive?
<Yagisan> mcksean: ram is important. My box is a 2Ghz amd64, 1.5GB RAM, sevral IDE/SATA drives in a software RAID5
<ogra> that really depends on the amount of clients you plan
<Yagisan> that is currently overkill
<mcksean> yagisan: nice -- how many clients are you running?
<mcksean> brb
<Yagisan> mcksean: there are 4 client systems, but never more then 3 at a time
<Yagisan> I'm not a big business (yet)
<Yagisan> spacey: back ?
<mcksean> yagisan: thanks for the input -- take care!
<Yagisan> mcksean: no worries :)
<Yagisan> spacey: just FYI. des, aes and blowfish compared on a high-end, mid-end and low-end system. http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/8176
<Mez> hmm -
<Mez> I'm about to go set up an edubuntu server for someone (mainly for moodle)
<Mez> is there anything you think we should have web facing atm?
<Yagisan> spacey: more up to date. high-end now benched in both 64bit and 32bit mode http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/8181 : the results are interesting.
<Mez> well, anything you'd recommend
<Yagisan> Mez: I'm not sure I understand your question
<Mez> Yagisan: I've been asked to set up a moodle server for a school.
<Mez> I'm going to be basing it around edubuntu
<spacey> Yagisan: how do you perform that test
<Yagisan> Mez: ok. I have no experience with moodle, but I can help you with securing the server once moodle is installed
<ogra> Mez, just apt-get install moodle and answer the debconf questions ...
<Yagisan> spacey: openssl bench des aes blowfish
<spacey> Yagisan: bench is an invalid command here
<Yagisan> spacey oops. speed
<Yagisan> spacey: "openssl speed" will bench the lot. "openssl speed x y z" will bench x y and z only
<spacey> Yagisan: is your benchmark 32bit or 64bit? (the amd64 one)
<Mez> ogra: I've set them up a moodle server before ... but they wiped it and used the windows version
<Yagisan> spacey: top is 64bit, second is 32bit. http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/8181
<ogra> Mez, and why did they ask you to do it again ? 
<spacey> yeah but second is different cpu
<Mez> Yagisan: should have no problems securing the server - access is going to be by ssh cert only for anything other than web services (and we're going to hook in a module I made for moodle to allow them to access their network files at home)
<Yagisan> spacey: please check the second pastebin link ;)
<Mez> ogra: because they wiped it for something else - it was a test machine - now they want to go production with it :D but - well... they dont want to use windows and they dont relly know mych about linux
<ogra> ah, cool
<Yagisan> spacey: isn't it cool that the P2 can almost saturate a fast ethernet link :)
<spacey> Yagisan:  http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/8183
<spacey> results of my laptop
<spacey> which is 32 bit
<Yagisan> spacey: your aes is faster because you have twice the cache. I only have 512kb
<spacey> aha
<Yagisan> spacey: but blowfish seems unaffected, and des is slower
<spacey> blowfish faster @ 32bit it seems
<Yagisan> spacey: yeah, it's not optimised for 64bit
* Yagisan should go to bed. I have an exam in about 5 hours
<Yagisan> night all
<juliux> hi mhz 
<mhz> juliux: hey!!
<juliux> mhz, your text was great
<juliux> we have translate it into german
<mhz> juliux: really? Good!!
<mhz> is it on a wiki?
<juliux> not yet
* mhz has not uploaded it in spanish! :)
<juliux> but i can add it to the wiki
<mhz> juliux: i am glad i could help
<juliux> and we have made a dvdcover for breezy and will make one for dapper see here http://www.juliux.de/ubuntu/edubuntudvdcover.png
* mhz tabbing
<mhz> juliux: i like it
<mhz> it wont be expensive to print it
<juliux> i have a epson r200 and i think it cost about 20cent 
<juliux> by 1440 dpi
<mhz> nice
<mhz> ogra: have you seen hno73 somewhere (channel) ?
<mhz> whois responds he is logged but in no channel
<scribe63> anyone successfully upgraded schoolbell and scholtool
<hno73> mhz: hello?
<ogra> scribe63, to what ? there is no update 
<scribe63> schoolbell from 1.2.2-1 to 1.2.3 and schooltool from 0.11.2 to 0.1.3
<ogra> scribe63, they are not yet packaged 
<ogra> schooltool at least isnt yet 
<ogra> its waiting for a zope3 upgrade in debian ...
<scribe63> i know cuz they do not display in synaptic. so i'm trying to see whats the proceedure or what may break if i ugrade fron tarballs or using alien on the rpm packages
<mhz> hno73: pong
<mhz> hno73: good to see ya
<mhz> whois didnt tell me where you were
<mhz> :)
<mhz> hno73: there are at least 3 things I'd like to discuss with you if possible
<ogra> scribe63, simple rule of thumb if you dont want to break your system, dont use aline or rpms
<ogra> we'll get an update before release i think
<hno73> mhz: ok, one thing at a time :)
<scribe63> thanks for that pointer, will try the tarballs. if you know, should  i remove the previous packages first to avoid any confilcts
<ogra> scribe63, if you care, wait until jinty comes around, he cares for the packages in debian 
<hno73> hm, gaim on dapper is not 100% stable ...
<ogra> scribe63, no idea, i only do the packaging of edubuntu and wouldnt recommend to use tarballs at all ..
<mhz> hno73: no worries
<mhz> so, hno73, shall i shoot or you go 1st?
<ogra> its very unlikely they install in the right locations ... and there is a reson why its not packaged for us yet ... you'll pretty sure also need zope3 from tarballs etc
<hno73> mhz: go ahead
<scribe63> that makes sense, i'll lookout for jinty, the current schooltool duplicate calendar entries i noticed since in november 2005,its been fixed. thats why i want to update
<mhz> hno73: /me phone
<hno73> ok
<scribe63> ogra: new to using chat, now sort of realizing how its done. thanks for the pointers i'll wait till the packager packages.
<ogra> scribe63, yes, thats the safest method to not break your installation :)
<mhz> re
<Mez|Work> am just here incase something cocks up with the moodle install :D
<Mez|Work> so I can poke you guys and get you to help :D
<mhz> moodle?
<flint> ogra, ollie on the flight 3 disk, how do I get around the chroot issue?
<flint> I guess I will go look on the web site...eh?  it is just that you mentioned something about a chroot bug.
<ogra> it should work with flight3 i386 ...
<ogra> not with ppc ... and i'm not sure about amd64 
<aralia> hi. I'm new here!
<gand> I wish to do some videotutorial, Is there a video stream codec for linux x86 that can be viewed inside browser?
#edubuntu 2007-02-05
<neoplasticity> hello
<neoplasticity> anyone home?
<elmo40> nope
<RichEd> hey elmo40 ...
<elmo40> RichEd: hi
<nixternal> someones got mail!  I have just sent the link to the new edubuntu-docs package for Feisty that I created. enjoy!
<cbx33> mornin willvdl
<RichEd> g'morning cbx33 & willvdl again
<cbx33> hey RichEd
<cbx33> ogra_ been about yet?
<RichEd> !seen ogra
<ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about seen ogra - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
<willvdl> hey all
<RichEd> !seen ogra_
<ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about seen ogra_ - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
<cbx33> howz it going willvdl
<RichEd> wasup with the bot and !seen ... have i got my syntax wrong ?
<cbx33> no no that's right
<cbx33> !seen RichEd
<ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about seen riched - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
<RichEd> so is ubotu battling to get out of bed today ? was there a bot drinking convention this weekend causing short term memory loss ?
<cbx33> what's edubuntugirl been up to
<cbx33> she's a naughty girl isn't she
<RichEd> but cbx33 to answer your question: nope not from my side ... last chatted to ogra in friday
<cbx33> ok
<RichEd> he'll be busy busy with tests and feature freeze
* RichEd is concerned about cbx33 and edubuntu girl ... and the naughty flirting angle
<cbx33> RichEd, I know that, that's why I need to speak to him
<RichEd> edubuntgirl: tell ogra and ogra_ that cbx33 would like a word with him when he has a moment
<RichEd> edubuntugirl: tell ogra that cbx33 would like a word with him when he has a moment
<edubuntugirl> Righto, RichEd!
<RichEd> edubuntugirl: tell ogra_ that cbx33 would like a word with him when he has a moment
<edubuntugirl> Righto, RichEd!
<RichEd> thanks
<cbx33> hah
<cbx33> he's gonna get plastered with message
<cbx33> s
<cbx33> hehehe
<highvoltage> cbx33: if you do a !seen it asks ubotu
<highvoltage> edubuntugirl: seen ogra
<edubuntugirl> ogra was last seen on #edubuntu 2 days, 18 hours, 49 minutes and 0 seconds ago, saying: accroding to firefox --help there is ... [Fri Feb  2 16:16:30 2007] 
<cbx33> cool highvoltage
<cbx33> thanks dude
<willvdl> nobody knows edubuntugirl like highvoltage ..
<highvoltage> edubuntugirl for the revolution!
<edubuntugirl> highvoltage: sorry...
<highvoltage> pgg
<cbx33> anyone else tested herd3?
<RichEd> edubuntugirl: seen ogra_
<edubuntugirl> ogra_ was last seen on #edubuntu 5 days, 20 hours, 42 minutes and 37 seconds ago, saying: ?? [Tue Jan 30 14:31:39 2007] 
<smile> edubuntu...girl?
<RichEd> hey highvoltage
<RichEd> smile ... yep ... we've got a chic bot ... but we're not sexist ... just geeks ;)
<highvoltage> hey RichEd
<highvoltage> RichEd: ogra and ogra_ are two different nicks, that's why they have different seen times
<RichEd> which is why i tested the second option to chek if oliver had been around under his alter ego
<RichEd> so thanks ... but was aware of that :)
<highvoltage> edubuntu-girl is a symbol of independence and uprising against old people who want to enforce their outdated ways onto the world! :)
<highvoltage> (well, since the edubuntugirl posts on the mailing lists, anyway)
<willvdl> that old-people-ist!
<cbx33> highvoltage, can irssi show several windows at once?
<ogra_> hey cbx33
<edubuntugirl> ogra_: by the way, RichEd told me to tell you 'cbx33 would like a word with him when he has a moment' 1 hours, 26 minutes and 48 seconds ago (on Mon Feb  5 11:00:49 2007)
<cbx33> hi ogra_
<cbx33> pm please
<ogra_> cbx33, do you read me ?
<ogra_> oh ...
<ogra_> hmm
<cbx33> no
<cbx33> not registered?
<cbx33> I'm writing a message
<smile> How much Disk Space does Edubuntu require???
<RichEd> smile: 2GB for a workable install
<smile> ok, thanks
<smile> if i install Edubuntu, will i still be able to boot into XP
<jsgotangco> RichEd: hey dude
<SiCk--> smile, it depends how you partition your drive i'd say
<RichEd> smile: yes ... you can choose dual boot option on install ... it will leave your XP untouched ... and will help you make a new partition for edubuntu
<RichEd> jsgotangco: 'lo there
<smile> xp is on C Drive. i'll install Edubuntu on a section of D Drive patition
<smile> oh oki
<smile> will it do dual boot by default
<RichEd> smile ... not sure if it will boot that way ... rather give it 2GC on C for booting ... and then you can create a shared data section for both operating systems ... FAT32
<RichEd> (on D: I mean)
<RichEd> re dual bot, it gives you a GRUB menu when you power up, and then you choose which boot you want.
<smile> both are NTFS
<smile> so i should install on C:?
<smile> is it possible to d
<RichEd> it's a text menu which loads as soon as the PC firmware loads
<RichEd> I'm not sure if it will boot from D: anyone else can you confirm this ?
<smile> is it possible to share disk space between Linux and Windows?!
<RichEd> smile: note that if you set up a shared data partition as FAT32, both Linux and Windows can read and write to it.
<RichEd> If you leave it as NTFS, linux will *read* it by default, but it will not mount the drive as writeable.
<RichEd> let me get you a wiki page on dual boot install .... give me a min
<smile> do i have to reformat my entire drive into FAT before installing Edubuntu?
<jsgotangco> no cookie
<RichEd> nope: see here: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/WindowsDualBoot
<RichEd> where it says ubuntu, just read edubuntu ... same principles apply
<RichEd> back in a few mins
<RichEd> ping ogra, willvdl, rodarvus
<RichEd> we're all quite busy today ... so please just update the UES page and Education page if you have changes / updates
<ogra> oh, ok
<edubuntugirl> ogra: by the way, pygi told me to tell you 'poke me once he's around pls, thanks' 15 hours, 9 minutes and 48 seconds ago (on Sun Feb  4 22:53:02 2007)
<edubuntugirl> ogra: by the way, RichEd told me to tell you 'cbx33 would like a word with him when he has a moment' 3 hours, 2 minutes and 8 seconds ago (on Mon Feb  5 11:00:42 2007)
<willvdl> RichEd, pong
<willvdl> ah, ok
<RichEd> :)
<cbx33> ogra, re earlier discussions Edubuntu 7.04 "Feisty Fawn" - Alpha i386 (20070201.1)
<ogra> cbx33,
<ogra> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/releases/feisty/herd-3/feisty-server-i386.list says herd3 has ltsp 0.132
<ogra>  ltsp (0.133) feisty; urgency=low
<ogra>  .
<ogra>    * final switch for pulseaudio support
<ogra> ^^^ that was the change that added the pulse-esound-compat plugin
<ogra> there was no such dependency on herd3
<ogra> so i dont understand what you tested there to get that breakage
<cbx33> hmm
<cbx33> how odd
<ogra> did you doenload updates during install ?
<cbx33> do you hve the md5sum there for your iso?
<ogra> *download
<cbx33> hmmm
<cbx33> don't think so but possibly
<cbx33> so i will try a reinstall without the net connected
<cbx33> sound like a plan?
<cbx33> is esound-compat in main yeT?
<ogra> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/releases/feisty/herd-3/MD5SUMS
<ogra> no, thats why i waited with the dep until herd3 was done
<cbx33> right
<cbx33> well then i must have downloaded updates
<cbx33> I'll do it again but disconnect the net
<cbx33> seeing as as you saif there is no way it could have been included in herd 3
<cbx33> hmm....
* jsgotangco waves
<cbx33> it says I'm using ltsp-client 0.132
<cbx33> ok but 0.133 is installed
<cbx33> so yes that's why
<ogra> sudo chroot /opt/ltsp/i386/ dpkg -s ltsp-client|grep Version
<ogra> ??
<cbx33> the installed version is 0.133
<cbx33> in the main system
<cbx33> can i revert my change to get a working chroot?
<cbx33> or shall I just apt-get remove and dpkg -i the other pacakges?
<ogra> you could wipe your chroot and use universe in an --extra-mirror option
<ogra> see man ltsp-build-client :)
<cbx33> yeh..... man ltsp-build-client....which I wrote :p
<ogra> which is outdated
<cbx33> i know
<ogra> i need to write a geneartor for it
<ogra> so it gets updated according to distro we build on and according to the used plugins
<cbx33> indeed
<cbx33> i didn't realise it was so huge
<cbx33> with the whole plugin system etc
<cbx33> only looked at it yesterday
<cbx33> sorry sat
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> think I have a working deb now
<cbx33> just gonna try installing and running
<cbx33> is the Xb-Python-Version field ok in my packge?
<cbx33> dpkg keeps complaining about it saying it's unknown
<ogra> you mean because pbuilder moans ?
<ogra> yes, its fine
<cbx33> yeh
<cbx33> ok
<ogra> the warning during build as well
<cbx33> pbuilder and debuild
<cbx33> hehe
<cbx33> yup
<ogra> yep
<cbx33> ok installing the chroot
<ogra> someone should fix that ... but seems nobody is intrested
<cbx33> heh
<cbx33> it should only be a small fix surely
<cbx33> it's bad in a way cos it makes the newer packagers think they are doing something wrong
<ogra> right
<ogra> not only the new ones :)
<cbx33> hah
<cbx33> :p
<cbx33> ouch
<cbx33> ltsp-build-client just failed....
<ogra> ok, three MIRs to go ...
<cbx33> nice one
<ogra> oh, how ?
<cbx33> ahhh
<cbx33> bzip
<cbx33> compressed file ended prematurely
<ogra> bzip ?
<ogra> weird
<cbx33> bzip2
<cbx33> yeh
<cbx33> I'll re run it
<cbx33> it was whilst getting pacakges from universe
<cbx33> we don;t need another MIR for tc m do we?
<bddebian> Heya
<ogra> nope
<ogra> just a short notification for the archive admins and new seeding
<cbx33> yup
* cbx33 should really learn about apt-cache
<elmo40> ubotu: date
<ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about date - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
<elmo40> what is this bot for?
<cbx33> ogra, this ltsp build isn't having much luck i wonder if a reinstall would be quicker :p
<juliux> elmo40, it is a wiki bot
<juliux> @ssh
<juliux> ubotu, ssh
<ubotu> SSH is the Secure SHell protocol. See https://help.ubuntu.com/community/SSHHowto for usage. Putty is a nice SSH client for Windows; it can be found at http://www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/~sgtatham/putty/
<elmo40> ahh, i see
<elmo40> so who can tell me what the date is? ;)
<elmo40> ubotu: avi
<ubotu> For multimedia issues, this page has useful information: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/RestrictedFormats - See also http://help.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/desktopguide/C/common-tasks-chap.html - But please use free formats if you can: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/FreeFormats
<juliux> elmo40, i have no idea ask in #ubuntu-ops
<ogra_> its 14:52 UTC
<elmo40> in the #elive room, they have apt. apt will tell you all :-P
<ogra_> :)
<elmo40> how many bots in here?
<elmo40> wasnt ubuntugirl a bot?
<ogra_> three at least
<ogra_> four even
<cbx33> yeh, ogra_ is a bot :p
<ogra_> :P
<cbx33> hehe
<cbx33> grrr
<cbx33> USB stopped working my VM for some reasson
<ogra> wasnt me
<cbx33> bet it was :p
<cbx33> hehe
<cbx33> right ftp it is then
<cbx33> ogra, be prepared for an email in a mo
<juliux> ogra, did you think you find time to come one day to essen?
<ogra> when ?
<ogra> i'm in italy the last feb weekend
<juliux> ogra, 17 and 18 february
<ogra> no
<ogra> 16th is my bday ... i wont work on that weekend
<juliux> ahhhh
<juliux> so we should come to you and sing a song for you;)
<ogra> hehe, yes
<ogra> but essen->kassel is quite some distance :)
<juliux> if you drive dresden->essen essen->kassel is nothing
<ogra> heh, right
<ogra> get a car man ....
<cbx33> i read that breifley and translated....ogra do you think one day you'll find the time to eat
<ogra> you are in germany and supposed to help with the traffic jams
<ogra> cbx33, heh
<juliux> ogra, lol
<ogra> good suggestion btw
* ogra goes to find some late breakfast
<cbx33> is this right ogra
<cbx33> removing student-c-p wans to remove edubuntu-desktop too
<ogra> yep
<ogra> seedchange
<cbx33> ahh
<ogra> i cant change it before the package is in the archive
<ogra> just dont forget to reinstall edubuntu-desktop later
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> but won;t it try to install student-control-panel?
<cbx33> ogra, hmm....it's complaining about importing the module now
<cbx33> oh
<cbx33> nevermind
<nixternal> oi!
<cbx33> something has changed in dbus ogra :p
<ogra> ogra@edubuntu:~/packages$ sudo ltsp-build-client --extra-mirror http://de.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu universe --chroot test
<ogra> ....
<ogra> /opt/ltsp/blepp/boot/./vmlinuz -> /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/blepp/./vmlinuz
<ogra> info: LTSP client installation completed successfully
<ogra> works fine with 0.133
<ogra> at least for me
<cbx33> :p
<cbx33> just getting help on my dbus issue
<elmo40> are things changing? should i hold on till edubuntu is upgraded to grab the newest version?
<cbx33> elmo40, you'll have to wait till april
<elmo40> ouch :/
<elmo40> why so far? that when ubuntu is changing?
<elmo40> 6.10 is latest?
<cbx33> yes
<elmo40> hey, what is 7.04? Feisty Fawn?
<cbx33> that's the release we;'re working on right no
<cbx33> w
<elmo40> ahh, ok. And that will be due in April, right?
<elmo40> now, why is it called DVD version, when it is under 700mb?
<cbx33> ogra, at the moment, the plugins were statically linked to the python2.4 folder
<cbx33> so /usr/lib/python2.4/site-pacakges/studentdcontropanel/plugins
<cbx33> but now of course we use python 2.5 so that doesn't work
<cbx33> shouldI statically change the link.....or where else should I point it
<cbx33> it reads the plugins by doing an ls of the folder the plugins are in
<cbx33> what should I do ogra ?
<willvdl> can anyone suggest a decent wireless AP that can do ethernet bridging?
<ogra> cbx33, ??
<juliux> willvdl, most of the linksys aps
<ogra> you shouldnt have to do *anything* with that path
<willvdl> juliux, just looking at them now
<ogra> just depend on the right python version
<juliux> willvdl, linksys is ciscohardware
<cbx33> ogra, so how can i traverse the path where the plugins folder is located
<cbx33> to find which plugins are there
<willvdl> juliux, what about netgear?
<juliux> willvdl, bah netgear
<juliux> willvdl, the webinterface is bullshit
<ogra> cbx33, you dont
<ogra> you only import the module
<ogra> dont use the path anywhere
<cbx33> yeh yeh i know that
<willvdl> juliux, don't need one, only need to bridge an ethernet network to an accesspoint providing internet
<juliux> willvdl, you can flash most of the linksys aps
<cbx33> but....how does it know what modules are available in that dir?
<ogra> pycentral will care for all links for the right py versions
<ogra> it has a builtin searchpath
<cbx33> no no
<cbx33> how does tcm
<ogra> it==python
<juliux> willvdl, hm ok
<cbx33> it=tcm
<cbx33> tcm does an "ls" on the plugins dir
<ogra> have you looked at python-ltsp ?
<cbx33> to find the names of the modules to import
<ogra> EEK
<cbx33> i dissapoint you more and more each day right :p
<ogra> look at python-ltsp's __init__.py
<cbx33> ok
<ogra> just use something like that
<willvdl> juliux, just looking for a nice bridge or AP in bridge mode that can handle 20 or so clients
<ogra> let the python module handler do the rest for you
<ogra> necver use hardcoded paths *anywhere*
<cbx33> ogra, as i need to find out the names of the plugins to tie them to the context menu
<juliux> willvdl, i work a littlebit more on the edubuntu flyer desing see http://ubuntu.juliux.de/edubuntu_back.png http://ubuntu.juliux.de/edubuntu_front.png
<ogra> then they should go into /usr/share/tcm ... not into the module dir
<juliux> willvdl, then take the bridge you get by your local computer reseller
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> I'll move it
<cbx33> w00t i have it running
<cbx33> now to tart it up for you
<elmo40> ahh, nevermind... fiesty DVD is only 680Mb(unfinished?) while edgy DVD is 3.8Gb. How many wm's does the DVD come with?
<willvdl> juliux, the reseller is about 5000km away in west africa
<willvdl> :)
<juliux> willvdl, lol
<juliux> elmo40, on the dvd is everything from main, so gnome,kde and xfce i think
<elmo40> i see
<elmo40> just wondering why it was 3.7Gb ;) It is also an install disc?
<juliux> not on the cd
<elmo40> hrmm, no seeders for the torrent :(
<elmo40> what? the dvd is not installable?
<elmo40> only live?
<juliux> the dvd is booth
<juliux> live and install
<elmo40> ok
<elmo40> nice script? gui or text?
<juliux> you have the grafical install from the livecd and the debian installer
<elmo40> ok
<elmo40> hrmm, i get an error when trying to dl via torrent. "Failure: Requested download is not authorized for use with this tracker." How do i fix that?
<juliux> i think the feisty isos are not yet on the bittorrent tracker
<elmo40> this is the edgyDVD
<elmo40> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/dvd/current/  from this site
<juliux> that is feisty not edgy
<juliux> oh no it is booth
<elmo40> very odd... i still have an error, but it is downloading :\
<juliux> is it fast enough?
<elmo40> that edgyDVD, i take it it is not edubuntu?
<elmo40> 7kb/s
<juliux> there are edubuntu and ubuntu dvds
<elmo40> so that page, i guess it is under edubuntu, so it is the edubuntuDVD
<willvdl> juliux, the linksys APs have a management web interface right? Any idea why they come with a windows install cd-rom?
<juliux> willvdl, no idea
<willvdl> odd. they should presumably jsut point you to an IP
<willvdl> unless, the cd does that all automatically...
<juliux> i realy have no idea, all my wlan ethernet bridges are wrap boards
<willvdl> wrap boards?
<juliux> yes
<willvdl> what's that?
<juliux> it is a embedded computer
<willvdl> ah. gotcha
<juliux> with only 2-3 ethernet ports, a seriell port, a mini-pci slot and a flashcard as harddisk
<willvdl> seems most APs can do some kind of bridging mode. this is good news
<juliux> and i installed debian on the flashcard
<willvdl> right
<juliux> you can also flash the linksys aps with a sepcial linux;)
<willvdl> I'd rather not :) not yet
<willvdl> not naw rather
<willvdl> or now even
<juliux> it is nice if you can manage your accesspoint via ssh
<willvdl> true. will stick to the default. It's not for me
<cbx33> ogra, TCM builds and runs
<cbx33> ogra, bing bong you have TCM mail :p
<cbx33> ping ogra
<cbx33> any css styling gurus here?
<cbx33> esp with positioning
<cbx33> ping highvoltage
<cbx33> highvoltage, nevermind
<highvoltage> ok :-/
<highvoltage> man it's hot
* highvoltage gets into cooler clothes
<ircusr> hi all
<highvoltage> hi ircusr
<ircusr> wassup
<lordkeiden> hi all. where do i go to find out which linux educational apps are mature enough for a live school with fairly computer iliterate staff?
<cbx33> highvoltage, on your blog
<highvoltage> just very hot here
<cbx33> how did you get the date like that?
<highvoltage> I think I'll go swim in a few minutes
<cbx33> i think it's really cool
<ircusr> I'm planning to offer paid tech support for edubuntu for education institutions
<ircusr> is that ok?
<highvoltage> ircusr: yep
<ircusr> great!
<highvoltage> ircusr: you might consider becoming an ubuntu affiliate
<ircusr> how do i do that?
<highvoltage> ircusr: http://www.ubuntu.com/partners/become/affiliate
<lordkeiden> what DE does edubuntu use?
<ircusr> gnome
<ircusr> right'
<highvoltage> ircusr: when you start making some money, you can also become an ubuntu partner
<ircusr> ?
<ircusr> kool :)
<highvoltage> yes, Edubuntu uses GNOME by default
<highvoltage> you can install others if you want too as well
<highvoltage> cbx33: sorry, I'm not ignoring you :)
<lordkeiden> and i assume nothing breaks if you install kde also?
<cbx33> highvoltage, np
<highvoltage> cbx33: that came with the wordpress theme I'm using, I also think it's quite cool
<cbx33> yeh
<highvoltage> lordkeiden: nope, installing KDE is fine
<cbx33> i wanted to put it on mine
<ircusr> i think edubuntu is a great contribution to education
<cbx33> hehe
<cbx33> :p
<lordkeiden> ircusr: i'm doing that now for one christian school.
<highvoltage> cbx33: you could probably just steal it out of the css ;)
<ircusr> doin what
<ircusr> i mean public schools, here in Peru
<cbx33> prboably
<cbx33> :p
<highvoltage> edubuntugirl: google wikipedia peru
<lordkeiden> paid support , not for edubuntu, but for the transition to it...
<edubuntugirl> highvoltage: ERROR: No matches found
<lordkeiden> ircusr: cool.
* highvoltage brb
<ircusr> what about edubuntu for colleges?
<ircusr> are they planning to support a distro for colleges too?
<lordkeiden> i have ubuntu installed. is ther any benefit to installing edubuntu from the repos?
<ircusr> i dunno
<ircusr> maybe from the educational apps
<lordkeiden> afaik, i have every educational app know to linux installed now, at least those from all the ubuntu repos.
<ircusr> ah
<lordkeiden> anyone know about "Readmaster" by ACE Ministries?
<lordkeiden> is there a linux app like it?
<ircusr> nope
<ircusr> did you contact the school, or did they respond to an add, lordkeiden?
<highvoltage> lordkeiden: edubuntu makes it easy to install ubuntu with the educational applications in the repositories, but you can get to an edubuntu setup manually in ubuntu by just installing the packages that are used in edubuntu
<highvoltage> (they share the same repositories)
<lordkeiden> i should wait for an answer longer =) nope to the first or second ??
<ircusr> nope to both
<lordkeiden> the school contacted me. a friend is a teacher there, so when they needed a tech contact, she offered me up...
<ircusr> ah
<ircusr> connections
<ircusr> heh?
<lordkeiden> highvoltage: afaik, i have done that. so i have edubuntu on steroids then?
<lordkeiden> ircusr: imho, connections out perform marketing 100-to1
<ircusr> yea
<ircusr> they do
<ircusr> nobody looks up an add
<ircusr> ad
<lordkeiden> this 1 client has netted me 17 otheres...
<ircusr> really
<ircusr> wow
<cbx33> lordkeiden, i agree with you there
<cbx33> ping ogra
<ircusr> i agree too
<lordkeiden> churches are pretty loyal to their own....they know i have integrity and skillz, so they offer me up at every chance.
<ircusr> what about the public system?
<lordkeiden> and no adgenda but the education of the kids.
<ircusr> ah
<lordkeiden> in public, there is much more red tape...and many adgendas it seems.
<ircusr> yea
<ircusr> and its the sector that needs the most
<lordkeiden> and in my experience, the kids education isn;t always prominent in the mix...
<lordkeiden> ircusr: true...
<ircusr> damn
<lordkeiden> ircusr: ?
<ircusr> i wonder if there's a way to break with edubuntu into the public system without all the redtape
<lordkeiden> it will take a solid contact to help you find the champion in the school board...
<lordkeiden> i would start with a single school...like a pilot school. when there is success there, you have an entire school as your champion to the board...
<lordkeiden> u will still have the red tape, but with a school as a champion, you may find that the board *wants* you to get thru it so you can get to work savin them money and improving their test scores with technology.
<lordkeiden> are keduca and gcompris good tools? where should i look for truely useful apps? i am a tech guy, so my job in this is to evaluate the stability and features as best as i can, then turn over the apps i like to the educators and let them tell me what is and isn't good, but i don't wanna hand them a bunch of stuff thats still 2 years from being ready fot the classroom.
<lordkeiden> i gotta reboot, but please answer. I'll be back soon to see the activity. thanks
<lordkeiden> is there a feisty for edubuntu?
<Burgwork> yes
<lordkeiden> so the packages I get from the feisty repos are not renamed edgy ones?
<stgraber> the repos are the same for all edubuntu/ubuntu/kubuntu/xubuntu
<stgraber> so if you have set feisty in your sources, you get the feisty packages
<lordkeiden> well that's kewl. efficient
<ircusr> i want to spread edubuntu over the public system here in peru
<cbx33> hey LaserJock
<LaserJock> hi Pete
<juliux> i have a question, is there commercial support for edubuntu available?
<LaserJock> I think  so
<LaserJock> but I'm not positive about that
<cbx33> ping ogra
<highvoltage> LaserJock: hehe, have you seen this before? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6lSmI_zsTgA&mode=related&search=
<juliux> LaserJock, ok I will ask RichEd
<LaserJock> highvoltage: lol
<highvoltage> juliux: as far as I understand CAnonical does provide commercial support for edubuntu
<juliux> highvoltage, thxs
<cbx33> highvoltage, http://www.progbox.co.uk/wordpress/
<cbx33> consider it stolen :p
<Burgwork> hey LaserJock, cbx33
<cbx33> hi Burgwork
<cbx33> highvoltage, http://www.engadget.com/2007/01/29/apple-uk-im-a-mac-im-a-pc-smashing-isnt-it/
<LaserJock> hi Burgwork
<cbx33> LaserJock, did you still need some pygtk stuff done?
<LaserJock> cbx33: considering that FF is the 8th I'm considering deferring the menu spec to Feisty+1
<cbx33> ok
<LaserJock> I'd rather put time into some MIRs to get some more apps on the 2nd CD
<LaserJock> ogra: do you have an opinion on ^^ ?
<cbx33> well i was gonna say I'm probably gonna be pretty busy the next few days, with book and tcm
<LaserJock> mhm
<LaserJock> I'm swamped too
<willvdl> LaserJock, where is your MIR list again?
<LaserJock> willvdl: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/JordanMantha/EdubuntuMIRCandidates
<LaserJock> although I suspect I won't be able to get many of them this time
<LaserJock> the dependencies are a bugger
<willvdl> sweet. been thinking about it recently
<Burgwork> LaserJock: childsplay is not really that great and duplicates gcompris
<willvdl> LaserJock, familiar with http://matplotlib.sourceforge.net/?
<LaserJock> willvdl: a bit actually
<LaserJock> willvdl: I think scipy + matplotlib is an excellent scientific computing tool
<willvdl> been a few years since I played with MAtlab etc.
<LaserJock> I use scipy in my research
<willvdl> my engineer mates swear by it
<LaserJock> and if I did much plotting I'd use matplotlib
<LaserJock> yes
<LaserJock> they are teaching matlab as an intro to programming in a lot of engineering departments
<LaserJock> my younger brother is working on an engineering degree, CAD and Matlab are about the "killer apps"
<willvdl> MAtlab as intro to programming? ow
<LaserJock> yeah, there is a fair amount of effort in the Python community to get Python there first :-)
<willvdl> I jsut remember the matrix conventions being back to front from C :)
<willvdl> but never really played with Octave
<highvoltage> cbx33: :)
<willvdl> LaserJock, we should think about library management systems some time in the future too: http://www.koha.org/  http://www.emilda.org/
<LaserJock> cbx33: those are really funny. Somehow I always find British TV to be much funnier
<cbx33> hheheh
<LaserJock> willvdl: yeah, we need to work on staging these things. Getting packages into Universe, then once they seem stable, secure, and useful promote them to Main
<bdoin> hi, GCompris users complained that version 7.2 on dapper crashed in the algebra activity. they tested 7.4 in the next release and it doesn't crash. is there a way to fix the dapper package?
<willvdl> strangely library management is not something I've seen pop up on our lists before
<willvdl> but my mother is a librarian :)
<LaserJock> bdoin: you can request a backport for the dapper-backports repository
<bdoin> great, how to request that ?
<LaserJock> bdoin: or if the bug has a specific fix, we can backport that fix to 7.2
<LaserJock> bdoin: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BackportRequestProcess
<bdoin> i did not checked yet precisely but it's probably a one liner. it would be better anyway to have our 7.4 in dapper because the 7.2 is not maintained anymore.
<LaserJock> well, the only thing is that the dapper-backports repository isn't as widely used
<bdoin> ok so a fix is better
<LaserJock> it is, although it's a bit tougher to get it in
<LaserJock> you could always try both
<LaserJock> get 7.4 backported
<highvoltage> heh @ Paul Flint's bug reply
<LaserJock> and then try to get 7.2 fixed for people who don't use dapper-backports
<LaserJock> highvoltage: hehe, yeah
<juliux> cbx33, take a look at http://ubuntu.juliux.de/edubuntu_back.png and http://ubuntu.juliux.de/edubuntu_front.png
<cbx33> juliux, is this for feisty?
<cbx33> nice
<cbx33> typo on first word on  front
<cbx33> edbuntu
<juliux> cbx33, it is still under construction
<cbx33> ah ok
<cbx33> :p
<willvdl> cbx33, more a layout thing at the mo
<cbx33> yeh it looks awesome
<juliux> cbx33, i copied the text from your BETT flyer
<cbx33> better tha nthe one i did
<cbx33> ~Yikes
* cbx33 goes to check the flyer
<willvdl> cbx33, i copied the text from your BETT flyer:   lol
<cbx33> phew thankfuylly not that paragraph
<juliux> i only changed the positions and the format
<willvdl> cbx33 :) Don't worry, we checked your flyer as well.
<cbx33> hehe
<cbx33> good
<lordkeiden> anyone ever use "Readmaster" from ACE Ministries? anything like it in linux?
<cbx33> lordkeiden, what's it do?
<juliux> willvdl, what do you think?
<willvdl> I like it. I think we need it
<lordkeiden> it is a reading program (duh) It dispalys a story for the student to read, erasing the story as they read, forcing then to read at a increasing rate. as they improve their speed, the pace is increased. there is a comprehencion test after each story to gauge their speed vs comprehention.
<juliux> willvdl, that is a good answer
<willvdl> I practice my good answers :)
<juliux> i think about some more color on the back
<LaserJock> lordkeiden: I don't know of any, but I don't know every app in Linux either :-)
<willvdl> LaserJock, but we were counting on you :P
<LaserJock> yikes
<willvdl> don't let us down
* LaserJock feels the pressure
<lordkeiden> too late...i'm crushed...not i gotta go back to windows...all uz of LaserJock...
<lordkeiden> (i knew I shouldn't have used the winxp cd for kindleing)
<LaserJock> heh
<LaserJock> well, you can sometimes run Windows apps in Linux using a program called Wine
<lordkeiden> lol...yeah, i know. I can run the app in linux, with wine. the real problem is that the vendor stops renewing licenses for it in june, and it is their "holy grail" app...
<LaserJock> hmm, have you googled around?
<LaserJock> I've seen mentions of reading apps, but I don't know their feature sets to know if they'll do what you describe
<jbrefort> LaserJock, any patch for gchemutils?
<LaserJock> jbrefort: how much time do we have?
<LaserJock> unfortunately my time is really getting eaten up in RL
<jbrefort> 10 days if I'm optimistic
<LaserJock> I was made Head Teaching Assistant this semester
<LaserJock> and I wasn't planning on any teaching duties whatsoever
<jbrefort> but I found several issues today, so it might be a bit more
<LaserJock> are you wanting mostly the docs?
<jbrefort> and the electronegativity color scheme, may be
<LaserJock> k, I'll see what I can do
<LaserJock> sorry about not getting these earlier
<jbrefort> after next release, only bugs fixes will be accepted until 0.8.0 is out
<jbrefort> np, I'm late too, too much work
<jbrefort> currently testing a potential crasher...
<juliux> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/LTSPWiring are this pictures still up to date?
<cbx33> ping ogra
<cbx33> edubuntugirl, tell ogra I'm off for the night....please mail me...if you get the book chapter looked at...Ican then look at it tomrorow morning on the way to work
<edubuntugirl> Righto, cbx33!
#edubuntu 2007-02-06
<willvdl> gnight
<elmo40> well, that edgyDVD.torrent is dead :/
<elmo40> guess i will use d4x to grab the .iso
<LaserJock> yeah, I bet there aren't enough people to keep the Edubuntu torrents very fast at all
<elmo40> i am at 10%
<elmo40> been like that for 5hrs :\
<wist_> hi guys... i dont know if it's the right thing to do or the right place to ask but....... After installing Edubuntu to my HD it just crashes everytime the Updates notification pops up
<wist_> PIII 500 MhZ 456 MB RAM , 40 GB HD
<wist_> isntalled from the live cd.. i need to do something here... just dont know what..
<LaserJock> yikes, that's not good
<LaserJock> I'd actually ask #ubuntu as it's probably a generic problem (not Edubuntu specific) and they have a lot more people
<wist_> :) thats a start, thanks .
<matsavhalev> hi guys, once i have set up edubuntu for ltsp, is there a way to change/add the feature to boot an install cd? whatever i change still gives me ltsp :-)
<LaserJock> on a client?
<LaserJock> or on the server?
<cbx33> Thanks ogra
<cbx33> awesome work
<cbx33> got two secs to discuss one point?
<ogra> indeed
<edubuntugirl> ogra: by the way, cbx33 told me to tell you 'I'm off for the night....please mail me...if you get the book chapter looked at...Ican then look at it tomrorow morning on the way to work' 12 hours, 8 minutes and 33 seconds ago (on Tue Feb  6 00:09:26 2007)
<ogra> cbx33, ^^
<cbx33> yeh I got it
<ogra> she was faster :)
<cbx33> no no I've already started looking at it
<cbx33> I wondered if yo ucould spare me a few minuetes in a sec
<ogra> sure
<cbx33> just to go over one or two points
<cbx33> hang on lemme boot up the laptop
<cbx33> oh yeh...right 1) mounting proc in the chroot
<cbx33> i don't think I've ever done that....
<ogra> a bunch of packages require it ...
<cbx33> ahh right ok cool
<cbx33> that's fine
<cbx33> 2) my blabberings about the server configs
<ogra> one vs two NICs ?
<cbx33> yeh
<cbx33> see i used to use a one NIC + alternative DHCP server setup
<ogra> sure, thats fine
<cbx33> and the reason why i was saying about connecting to a private subnet
<cbx33> is so that people can't bypass the edubuntu server to gain access to the network
<ogra> what i complained about was the "edubuntu as a gateway"
<cbx33> using like a live cd for example
<cbx33> i thought this was more of an advantage
<ogra> it's a secuzrity feature that we dont route the client network
<cbx33> but....i'm probably wrong ;)
<ogra> the two NIC setup is our declared and desired default
<cbx33> but in a way the edbuntu server does act like a firewall/gateway
<ogra> in that setup you dont have any routing between client network and LAN
<cbx33> unless the clients are not booting from the edubuntu server
<ogra> if you use a single NIC setup
<ogra> you can indeed let the clients be on the internet directly
<cbx33> oh i see
<cbx33> i think
<cbx33> are you saying....
<ogra> why shouzld the clients not boot from the edubuntu server in the two NIC setup, there is nothing in the way
<cbx33> Internet -> NIC1 -> Edubuntu server -> NiC2 -> Switch -> Clients
<ogra> you have a dedicated network and a dedicated dhcpd
<ogra> right
<ogra> NIC2 is owned by the edubuntu server alone
<cbx33> so basically you do have a seperate private subnet
<cbx33> on NIC2
<ogra> right, thats the default setup since edgy
<cbx33> maybe it was just my wording
<cbx33> that's what I was saying in that first bit
<ogra> if yor setup differs from it you get  a warning from ltsp-client-builder during install
<cbx33> that the "other card is usually connected to a private subnet of the network"
<cbx33> NIC2 is connected to a switch connecte to just LTSP clients
<ogra> right
<cbx33> so where is my wording wrong?
<ogra> but in no scenario you use edubuntu as a gateway (at least by default)
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> if I remove the word gateway is that better?
<ogra> "Using Edubuntu as the primary gateway requires the server machine to have two network interface cards. "
<cbx33> I'll put using edubuntu in the recommend configuration requires/.....
<ogra> try to explain why we use two NICs etc
<cbx33> and take out primary gateway
<cbx33> I will
<cbx33> ok thanks
<ogra> and indeed, avoid the term gateway :)
<cbx33> hehe
<cbx33> sorry
<cbx33> i didn't mean gateway like that
<cbx33> but yes
<ogra> no, its fine
<cbx33> I sholdn't have used it
<ogra> there might come setups where we need to route the clients
<ogra> in the future
<cbx33> and the xres question was not in the build chroot
<ogra> but for now i'd like to sell it as an additional security feature
<cbx33> and the xres question was not in the build chroot
<cbx33> it was in the general setup
<ogra> ah, good
<ogra> else debconf would have been broken
<cbx33> hehe
<cbx33> sorry
<ogra> it's explicitly told to not ask
<cbx33> thanks for the chroot reinforcement
<cbx33> in the kernels section
<ogra> yeah, thats important
<cbx33> ;)
<ogra> its complicated enough to muddle it up
<juliux> cbx33, for alle the network are nice pictures in web https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/LTSPWiring perhap it help
<cbx33> yes
<cbx33> now
<ogra> juliux, these are not printable in a book ... the quality is rather web ...
<cbx33> did I get the localdevices section all wrong
<ogra> and i dont have bigger originals of them
<cbx33> ogra: I will be putting diagrams
<ogra> right
<juliux> ogra, i will create new ones in the next days, i need some for a poster for the expos
<cbx33> but they are likely to be redrawn by publishers
<cbx33> is my local devices section all wrong ogra ?
<ogra> no, the localdev section is fine, but missing information :)
<cbx33> oh ok
<cbx33> I'll read
<ogra> how do i switch it on on a normal ubuntu, what has to be done additionally in edubuntu
<cbx33> I'l probably leave that out
<cbx33> and point to a wiki
<cbx33> as this is meant to be generally about edubuntu
<ogra> well, the "add the user to the fuse group, the user manager has a special option for it" would be nice, else you wont have local devices at all
<cbx33> ahhh yes
<cbx33> so you need that for edubuntu too?
<ogra> (not adding the users to the fuse group by default is also a security feature you can point out)
<ogra> yes, thats all thats needed in edubuntu
<ogra> in ubuntu you have to enable it in the lts.conf additionally, which edubuntu has by default
<ogra> (just read the wiki ;) )
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> I will
<cbx33> sorry about the troubleshooting ltsp
<cbx33> :p
<cbx33> the dhcp-server status
<cbx33> heheh
<cbx33> i guessed....to be checked later on
<cbx33> thanks for the commands
<ogra> in the future we'll have little tools based on python-ltsp for that ;)
<cbx33> nice
<cbx33> for the window managers
<cbx33> obviously once they are installed...the dropdown stuff applies right?
<cbx33> kubuntu-desktop
<cbx33> ?
<ogra> it always applies
<ogra> you always have a "default" and a "gnome" session
<cbx33> ahh yes
<ogra> where default points to gnome in that case indeed
<ogra> if you install xfce, kubuntu or xubuntu desktop they will appear there ... whatever you installed last will be the default
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> does ldm askyou if you want to make the one you just changed to default?
<ogra> no
<ogra> it's not gdm :)
<ogra> (yet :P )
<cbx33> hehe
<cbx33> ok so ... arey ouhappy for what I have to be the first draft if I make the changes you requested?
<ogra> sure
<cbx33> is it ok?
<ogra> yep
<cbx33> how would you rate it?
<cbx33> think it'l be good for edubuntu?
<ogra> it's good user doumentation, and indeed i think it will be good :)
* ogra goes for some food
<cbx33> ogra: cool eat well....last thing....is there anything missing from the chapter...and that's it I'm done THANK YOU SO MUCH
<cbx33> you are a LEGEND
<ogra> cbx33, you didnt add ${python:depends} to thin-client-manager-gnome (pycentral dependency is still missing), the copyright file is still missing the dates, cheap_plugin still has an underscore in its name (python naming policy)
<ogra> cbx33, and i still have the wrong glade file ...
<ogra> nothing changed ....
<ogra> ogra@edubuntu:~/packages/thin-client-manager-0.5.0$ sudo student-control-panel
<ogra> Traceback (most recent call last):
<ogra>   File "/usr/bin/student-control-panel", line 740, in <module>
<ogra>     base = ControlPanel()
<ogra>   File "/usr/bin/student-control-panel", line 95, in __init__
<ogra>     self.share.connect("clicked", lambda w: self.make_share(treeselection))
<ogra> AttributeError: 'NoneType' object has no attribute 'connect'
<cbx33> WHAT?
<cbx33> I changed all that
<cbx33> do you have the right email?
<cbx33> that's not right
<ogra> i have your last email
<ogra> the one where i picked the book chapter out as well
<cbx33> no
<cbx33> i sent you one yesterday
<ogra> oh, right
<ogra> heh, sorry
* cbx33 wipes his memory
<ogra> what is thin-client-manager_0.5.0.tar.gz ?
<cbx33> you obviously havn't eaten enough
<cbx33> thought that was autogenerated by my debuild
<ogra> i rarely eat before 4pm :)
* cbx33 passes ogra a sandwich
<ogra> it shouldnt, else something with the package is wrong
<cbx33> ok....ignore it then
<ogra> i'll check ... dont worry
<cbx33> go for the orig...
<cbx33> that's always right
<cbx33> did I tell you....my school is seriously considered a switch to linux
<ogra> no, thats nice :)
<cbx33> yeh
<cbx33> Yikes......Dell are only shipping Vista now
<cbx33> it's only been out a few days
<cbx33> would have thought they would offer both options for a while
<cbx33> as Vista still has _a lot_ of problems
<RichEd> cbx33: tell your school that w2000 -> vista is a migration, and not an upgrade
<RichEd> so if they have to migrate, why not migrate to an open future, free of licence fees or licence admin and the whims & financial needs of a US monopoly
<ogra> cbx33, using ${python:depends} requires that you run dh_python in your rules file
<cliebow> cbx33:yeah saw the same thing at bestbuy and circuit city..bend over and embrace visigoth...errr vis ta
<cbx33> ogra: sorry
<cbx33> Je suis stupide
<ogra> hmm, wait, that doesnt help dh_python is deprecated ...
<ogra> should rather be dh_pysupport and a Build-Dep-Indep:
<cbx33> ah yes...think i saw that when i was creating...the debianpolicy
<cbx33> ah i seee
<ogra> bah, blind me ...
<ogra> pycentral does it ... if you spell right ...
<ogra> ${python:depends} needs to be ${python:Depends} indeed
<cbx33> ahhh sorry
<cbx33> did you wanna make any changes and send it back to me....or did you want me to make the changes?
<ogra> if i dotn discover bigger stufgf i'm fine with making small changes
<ogra> i'm not done yet :)
<cbx33> hehehaha
<cbx33> i know
<ogra> hrm
<ogra> what about the python2.4-dbus dep ?
<ogra> can we switch to 2.5 ?
<cbx33> i would think so
<cbx33> what do we do about previous versions?
<cbx33> is there a python-dbus?
<ogra> yep
<cbx33> maybe we could use that
<ogra> right
<ogra> does tcm-backend need to depend on pessulus ?
<ogra> heh, no it depends on python-tcm thats sufficient
<cbx33> umm....well....the backend should provide pessulus over ssh -X
<ogra> the backend runs wwhere ?
<ogra> ltsp server or client session ?
<cbx33> ltsp server
<ogra> well, thats totally pointless to discuss ... :)
<ogra> no matter where you install it, python-tcm is a dep ;)
<ogra> and python-tcm pulls in all we need (dbus, pessulus)
<cbx33> yes
<ogra> ok, looks better now
<ogra> look, a gui :)
<ogra> sadly its crashing over and over
<ogra> lots of ps errors
<cbx33> oh yeh it will do
<cbx33> john doesn;t exist as a user
<cbx33> neither does pete
<cbx33> I did say that to you
<cbx33> cos the userlist function is hacked
<ogra> well, there is some other wonky stuff going on as well
<ogra> did you test and develop on a feisty system ?
<ogra> there is a lot of buggy stuff going on, tcm interacts with apport all the time
<cbx33> yes i have tested an run on a feisty system
<ogra> the "end process" button still shows in all windows
<cbx33> yeh that's on my list
<cbx33> I'll look into the apport thing tonight
<ogra> did you think about how to create the ssh user and his keys ?
<cbx33> no.....seeing as it's not my strong point I thought I'd ask you about it
<ogra> might be triggered by a vnc backtrace i see all the time
<cbx33> ahhh
<cbx33> quite possibly
<ogra> tcm must work without vnc running on the client ...
<ogra> so please add error handling there
<cbx33> it should do
<cbx33> i will run over that again
<ogra> Traceback (most recent call last):
<ogra>   File "/usr/bin/student-control-panel", line 244, in new_vnc
<ogra>     self.vnc[(a)]  = VNC(self.wTree, users[a] [2] , port, passw)
<ogra>   File "/usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/studentcontrolpanel/vnc.py", line 610, in __init__
<ogra>     self.window = gtk.glade.XML("/home/pete/vnctest/vncview.glade")
<cbx33> YIKES
<cbx33> that path was fixed in my latest upload
<ogra> if it cant establish a connection, just make it quiet ... as a goodie you could present a default pic in the preview
<cbx33> no no, it's failing cos it's looking for the vncview.glade file in my home dir
<ogra> something like a cracked display or so ...
<ogra> ah
<cbx33> it was an early hack that I changed yesterday
<ogra> right
<cbx33> it's now in the /usr/share/student-control-panel
<cbx33> lemme check that
<ogra> the "connect to desktop" button needs to go from the process window as well
<ogra> (trivial glade hack)
<ogra> yeah, apport seems not to care for the ps errors, but for the vnc traceback ...
<cbx33> yes
<cbx33> if you want to modify to test it's at the bottom of the vnc.py file in the usr/lib
<cbx33> just after the VNC class edfinition
<cbx33> it slipped through
<cbx33> sorry
<ogra> whats that connect/disconnect button in the toolbar ?
<ogra> the most left one
<cbx33> that will be for the remote server
<ogra> (apart from being a redundant button)
<cbx33> will bring up a dialog
<ogra> ah, that will need another icon
<ogra> having two disconnect buttons with the same icon is a bit conbfusing
<cbx33> yes
<cbx33> i know
<cbx33> icons are my last point
<ogra> but thats a feisty+1 feature anyway, just hide it for now
<cbx33> oh is it...
<ogra> and make it switched on constantly
<cbx33> it's done
<ogra> did you test it extensively with say 10 ltsp servers ?
<cbx33> no....
<cbx33> i don;t have that kind of resources
<ogra> and where is the dialog you were talking about :)
<cbx33> for the remote server?
<ogra> lets do it right and keep it for feisty+1
<cbx33> not done yet... :p
<cbx33> it would just be an ip
<ogra> the parts that are done are awesome already, dont get aucght by featuritis
<cbx33> ok
<ogra> *caught
<cbx33> :(
<ogra> meh
<cbx33> I'll remove it...
<ogra> *c a u g h t
<ogra> just the guoi item ....
<ogra> dont remove the code
<cbx33> if you check out the ltcm.py file in /usr/lib you'll see that it's mostly in there
<cbx33> yeh i know what you mean
<cbx33> each call to the backend has a "remote" alternative
<cbx33> if an ip is passed
<ogra> yep, saw that
<ogra> lets concentrate on the features we actually can test ...
<cbx33> ok
<ogra> and that are likely to be perfect in the release
<cbx33> tested the user groups thingy?
<ogra> not yet
<ogra> i need to revert your static userlist first ...
<ogra> for now i'm fine ...
<cbx33> heh
<ogra> the package looks ok with my minor changes
<ogra> i'll send you the debdiff and upload ...
<ogra> oh, one thing ...
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> what's that
<cbx33> I gotta shoot off for a while
<ogra> lets agree that we use the ubuntu versioning scheme with the new version
<cbx33> sure
<ogra> makes it easier for debian to adopt it
<cbx33> if you can explain it to me
<cbx33> I'll use it
<ogra> 0.5.0 is your upstream version
<ogra> 0.5.0-1 would be the first debian package of it (if its non native liek ours)
<cbx33> gtg....will read when i get back
<ogra> 0.5.0-0ubuntu1 would be a first ubuntu package of an app
<ogra> because 0.5.0-1 is bigger than 0.5.0-0ubuntu1 a package from the same source built in debian would override ours
<ogra> makes syncing easy etc
<ogra> oh, and one last thing, please be more wordy in your changelog entries ...
<cbx33> thanks ogra
<cbx33> ok
<ogra> you did a lot of changes ....
<ogra> one line doesnt suffice for that :)
<cbx33> ok
<ogra> i'll add up stuff before the upload ...
<cbx33> ogra: I'l get that fixed tonight when i get home from work
<sbalneav> Morning all
<cbx33> hey sbalneav
<jsgotangco> yo!
<cbx33> yo yo jsgotangco
<juliux> hi sbalneav jsgotangco
<sbalneav> Hello hell
<sbalneav> hello
<jsgotangco> hey you guys how are you doing
<sbalneav> whoops, fingers aren't working yet.
<sbalneav> Need more coffee.
<willvdl> coffee, that's what's wrong with me today. I ran out of coffee
<willvdl> hey jsgotangco, quick question?
<jsgotangco> go ahead
<willvdl> on wiki there are 2 spots where handbook/cookbook were managed
<willvdl> https://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuDocumentation/EdubuntuCookbook
<willvdl> which redirects to help.u.com
<willvdl> and https://wiki.edubuntu.org/EdubuntuHandbook
<willvdl> presumably one must be deprecated?
<jsgotangco> willvdl: honestly, my brain is fried at the moment for all these issues i have at home and myself so I can't even remember that
<willvdl> okie, I'll read both, figure out which is most recent and delete the other
<jsgotangco> im sorry
<willvdl> no worries
<jsgotangco> its just that so many things are on my mind at the moment
<jsgotangco> and IRC is the best place to escape
<jsgotangco> :)
<willvdl> that's what oyu thought...mwuhahaha
<willvdl> you need to join #escapism, not #edubuntu
<jsgotangco> lol
<willvdl> or change your nick
<jsgotangco> or #marriage-counselling or something
<willvdl> perhaps #my-dog-died-recently
<willvdl> darn, it's too hot here for me to think straight either
<march> Hi@all
<accuser> anyone deployed edubuntu into a primary school?
<cliebow_> 3-5..
<cbx33> ping ogra_ how do you specify usb printers in lts.conf
<cbx33> or sbalneav for that matter :p
<sbalneav> Ummm,
<sbalneav> should be... (gimme a sec)
<cbx33> cos paraller is /dev/lp0
<cbx33> right
<sbalneav> I think it's /dev/usb/lp0
<cbx33> anywhere to make sure
<cbx33> it's for the edubuntu chapter in the officilal ubuntu boook
<sbalneav> I can check at home tonight.  It depends on where Ubuntu's udev puts usb printers.  I don't have one here, but at home I do.
<cbx33> ok cool
<cbx33> thanks sbalneav
<cbx33> sbalneav, ooh can I ask yo uanother question
<sbalneav> Sure.
<cbx33> in the lts.conf file
<cbx33> you do something like
<cbx33> [00:4C:69:73:61:00] 
<cbx33>     PRINTER_0_DEVICE = /dev/lp0
<ogra_> its /dev/usblp0
<cbx33> ogra_, you rock thanks dude
<sbalneav> ah
<ogra_> no additional slashes
<sbalneav> there we go.
<cbx33> the 9100
<cbx33> etc...
<cbx33> that's permachine right?
<ogra_> no
<sbalneav> Right.
<cbx33> so you can have 9100 on one ip
<cbx33> and 9100 on another ip?
<ogra_> right
<sbalneav> yes
<cbx33> thanks guys
<ogra_> but it counts up with every additional PRINTER_n_DEVICE
<cbx33> yes
<cbx33> on each machine
<cbx33> now sound edgy ogra_
<ogra_> right
<cbx33> SOUND=True for dapper
<cbx33> is that needed for edgy too?
<ogra_> sure
<ogra_> even though edgy will also understand Y
<cbx33> right
<cbx33> thanks I'll leave it as that then
<cbx33> but feisty it's default right?
<ogra_> but just keep it at True :)
<cbx33> of course
<cbx33> less confusing
<ogra_> not sure yet if i want to ship a default lts.conmf
<cbx33> ahh...
<cbx33> ok I'll keep it as you have to modify lts for now
<ogra_> its default in edubuntu
<ogra_> but not in ltsp
<cbx33> ahh
<cbx33> I only really care about edubuntu at the moment
<ogra_> ah, right
<ogra_> we have it in hthe default file since edgy
<cbx33> ahh
<ogra_> look yourself ;)
<cbx33> thought so
<cbx33> sorry ogra_
<cbx33> :# - embarrased
<cbx33> ogra_, where i use the lp_server name in the chapter....should I use lp_server/jetpipe ?
<cbx33> cos we don't use lp_server now do we
<ogra_> no, we dont
<cbx33> I explained the difference above
<ogra_> dont make it to public
<ogra_> (the old name i mean)
<cbx33> oh ok
<cbx33> I'll just use jetpipe
<ogra_> sbalneav, btw ...
<cbx33> do we yet have a print charging system for edubuntu LTSP?
<cbx33> that is something our school would be extremely interested in
<cbx33> maybe I'll have to write one
<ogra_> cups ?
<ogra_> it should write proper logs
<cbx33> cool
<cbx33> but does it limit printing based on how much they have used?
<ogra_> on the server you still run cups ... jetpipe is only piping jetdirect stuff to /dev/lpsomething
<cbx33> true...sorry I'm pretty fried it's been a long day
<cbx33> ogra_, is this valid
<cbx33> [00:4C:69:73:61:00] 
<cbx33>     PRINTER_0_DEVICE = /dev/lp0
<cbx33>     PRINTER_1_DEVICE = /dev/usblp0
<ogra_> yes
* cbx33 dares someone to translated the mac address to ascii :p 
<cbx33> hehehe
<cbx33> how do you suggest people get the mac address from the client?
<cliebow_> cbx33:you mean without watching syslog?
<cbx33> cliebow, heheh yeh
<cbx33> arrggghh
<cbx33> attack of the caravena
<willvdl> you were attacked by a Spanish caravan?
<cbx33> heh
<cbx33> IP=192.168.16.5 ; ping -c1 $IP | grep "NULL"; arp -a | grep $IP
<cbx33> that sufficient for getting the mac of a running ip ogra_ ?
<billy_idle> c you
<ogra_> i think so ...
<cbx33> seems to work ok here
<ogra_> cbx33, tcm is in ...
<cbx33> w00t
<cbx33> universe or main?
<cbx33> did you make all the changes?
<ogra_> i did make a bunch of them
<cbx33> thank you...I really do owe you
<ogra_> but now you can work directly on the package
<cbx33> fantastic
<cbx33> that makes it a lot easier
<cbx33> did you even update my changelog entry?
<ogra_> yes
<ogra_> meh, we were missing an empty SCP package ... for the transition
<cbx33> ?
<cbx33> oh for upgraders?
<ogra_> yep
<ogra_> ok, now SCP is gone ...
<cbx33> did you fix the vnc vncview file path error?
<ogra_> Accepted:
<ogra_> thin-client-manager 0.5.0-0ubuntu1 was ACCEPTED.
<ogra_>         Component: main Section: misc
<ogra_> nope ...
<cbx33> ok
<ogra_> i count that as general bugfixing
<cbx33> ah right ok
<cbx33> so assume you fixed just pacakging issues
<cbx33> I have a printout of our convo
<ogra_> the *feature* is there, we just need to fix the bugs in it :)
<cbx33> so i will fix any other issues you mentioned
<cbx33> :)
<cbx33> thank you again ogra_
<cbx33> I know it took valuable time to look at that today
<cbx33> and the book
<cbx33> you rock
<ogra_> and really, dont try to do everything, concentrate on the most important stuff, what we dont get this release, we'll get next one ...
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> I don't want to dissapoint
<cbx33> I'll get the most important stuff done
<ogra_> if you have time left to do extra stuff, fine ...
<cbx33> ok
<ogra_> but set priorities :)
<ogra_> for yourself i mean ...
<cbx33> meh 195.248.38.80 is down
* ogra_ takes a break
<cbx33> archive.ubuntu.com
<cbx33> you deserve it
<cbx33> making the changes to book now
<cbx33> tcm is for later on
<cbx33> so ogra_ we're good for FF now?
<ogra_> 195.248.90.35 is up :)
<cbx33> hehe
<ogra_> archive.ubuntu.com
<ogra_> not at all
<cbx33> I need to fix up and working for Thursday
<ogra_> edubuntu auth server/client are looking bad ...
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> no no i meant TCM
<ogra_> fat clients wont happen without it
<cbx33> anything I can do? - says the man who's already pushing it :)
<ogra_> so all i have to show this time might be sound, tcm and 2cds
<cbx33> get me a job there and I can finish everything up
<cbx33> haha
<ogra_> i'm trying to get ltsp-manager done though
<cbx33> ogra_, do we have an edubuntu specific roadmap?
<ogra_> willvdl wanted to make one once ...
<cbx33> i think it's good idea
<ogra_> but i think that didnt happen yet
<ogra_> soemthing for the educon :)
<cbx33> but not now obviously
<willvdl> well, the technical roadmap is handled well by the sprints, dev summits and launchpad
<cbx33> and we need to split up tasks....and make that more visible
<cbx33> willvdl, is it all documented in one place?
<cbx33> willvdl, got time for a little chat?
<willvdl> cbx33, if you know how to use LP then yes :)
<ogra_> willvdl, well, then we need a roadmap generator that makes us a roadmap from the html of the spec page ;)
<ogra_> something for UDS ;)
<cbx33> willvdl, what d'ya need
<willvdl> ogra_, is there a real need for that? I mean will be automatic but it will still need ot be built
<ogra_> well, you build it once
<ogra_> and paste it to a website
<cbx33> oh sorry willvdl
<ogra_> "desired features"
<cbx33> i didn't get what ya meant
<cbx33> is it possible to track those changes
<cbx33> and also....what can we break down for the community
<willvdl> hang on, two threads :)
<ogra_> "for status overviews please see the specific spec pages on LP"
<cbx33> thanks ogra_
<willvdl> ogra_, there is probably a good case for a nice formatted easy to read overview that is simply pulled from LP
<cbx33> i think if we can pull all relevant info together on a wiki page
<ogra_> willvdl, thats what i mean ... if i remember yxou and RichEd in the beginning, such a page would have been valuable
<willvdl> The hard part is pulling in the "informational" specs on docs/marketing etc.
<cbx33> of course
<willvdl> yeah, RichEd mentioned something like that
<ogra_> anyway, break ... bbl
<cbx33> but once it's done initially it means it _should_ just need updating
<cbx33> see ya ogra_
<willvdl> it will work for the technical specs
<willvdl> cbx33, have a look at https://wiki.edubuntu.org/Edubuntu/Wiki/SiteMap
<willvdl> it is a WIP for the wiki at least to use the wiki more than the www
<willvdl> and point to all the spin-off projects
<willvdl> like doc-team, marjeting-team, esa
<cbx33> cool
<willvdl> it's jsut a start as it's quite hard to do :)
<cbx33> do we generally have people in charge of speficic areas?
<willvdl> but our community page etc needed updating
<cbx33> it would be nice after the meeting on a wednesday, to have each...section leader, update what's needed to be updated etc
<cbx33> so people know what's going on and can help out
<willvdl> that's tricky too
<willvdl> considering that docs are handled by the doc-team
<willvdl> etc.
<willvdl> ah, wait I get you
<willvdl> hmmm. nice idea
<cbx33> do you see what i mean
<willvdl> yes
<cbx33> and then there is a one stop portal
<cbx33> for what's needed to be done
<cbx33> what has been done
<willvdl> have a look at that sitemap and tell me if the structure makes sense to you
<cbx33> yes it does
<cbx33> perhaps
<willvdl> I'm not convinced it will work properly
<cbx33> we could split it down into the sections of the meeting
<willvdl> It is geared around "how to contribute" and then ships you off somewhere else
<cbx33> i revolve around that myself
<cbx33> if we had a page with
<cbx33> Tech/Artwork/Docs/Community etc
<cbx33> as a small nav at the top
<willvdl> as opposed to "how to contribute" and "this is what we are doing"
<willvdl> like the original community page
<cbx33> people could click on that and see the curent status of what we're doing
<cbx33> hmmm
<cbx33> i see your point
* cbx33 goes back for a second look
<willvdl> I'm going to work on it again tonight.
<willvdl> I need to e.g. move doc stuff to doc-team and then link to there from our roadmap
<cbx33> hmm yes
<willvdl> I also need a quick break. very hot
<cbx33> hehe
<cbx33> it's cold here
<cbx33> like only a few degrees
<willvdl> 30 at least here and it's 19:00
<highvoltage> willvdl: according to the gnome applet, its' 24C atm :)
<highvoltage> (but it feels closer to 30C)
<cbx33> ltsp-build-client --extra-mirror=http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu feisty universe
<cbx33> is that the correct syntax for building a chroot with univer added?
<Laser_away> willvdl: pingy pingy
<cbx33> hey LaserJock
<LaserJock> hi Pete
<LaserJock> is oli around?
<willvdl> highvoltage, your gnome applet is not in SMW :)
<LaserJock> cbx33: I see lots of TCM activity in the backlog
<willvdl> LaserJock, pongy pongy
<cbx33> yup it's in
<LaserJock> willvdl: did you get an answer about Edubuntu Cookbook vs Edubuntu Handbook in the wiki?
<cbx33> oli is around he's just on a break right now
<willvdl> ah, no
<cbx33> LaserJock, ^^ is that the right syntax for the build client do you know?
<LaserJock> willvdl: Edubuntu Cookbook was started first, and then the Edubuntu Handbook was started seperately later
<LaserJock> I kept the old material around because there was a decent amount of material
<willvdl> yip, realise that but I'm not sure about the "relevance" of the stuff that is in help.u.c
<cbx33> pardon me but...does KEduca actually do anything when you select a test from the servers?
<LaserJock> cbx33: I don't know about syntax
<LaserJock> still morning for me
<LaserJock> ;-)
<LaserJock> willvdl: well, if the Handbook gets done I almost think we should wipe both from the wiki
<willvdl> LaserJock, we all spoke at some length not so long ago about doing stuff on wiki vs docbook
<willvdl> and I still don't know what is the best course of action...
<LaserJock> sure
<LaserJock> but I think starting from a clean slate at least would be good
<cbx33> ++
<willvdl> is there stuff on the wiki that is not in the docbook?
<cbx33> possibly
<LaserJock> I don't know
<cbx33> why not export and save all pages somewhere
<LaserJock> that's the problem
<cbx33> :p
<willvdl> OK, I'll check tonight and make a report on it
<cbx33> wow you're brave willvdl
<LaserJock> outdated and incomplete help is about as bad as no help at all
<willvdl> I just don't have the time to actually contribute to the docbook at the moment.
<willvdl> but I can make a few wiki pages pointing folks to how to contribute :)
<LaserJock> mhm
<willvdl> I just with that Help Wiki Wuality Assurance spec would get taken seriously
* willvdl has a lisp. make that quality
<LaserJock> well, it is taken seriously
<LaserJock> just not enough man power to get anywhere fast, IMO
<willvdl> meaning I can see some real problems coming in when we have dapper, edgy and feisty swirling about
<willvdl> and one handbook for instance
<cbx33> yes
<highvoltage> willvdl: heh
<cbx33> willvdl, I have already hit that
<cbx33> with the book chapter
<willvdl> how?
<willvdl> meaning you have already experienced that?
<cbx33> writing some different versions of methods to handle diffrent verions of edubuntu
<cbx33> right well....i think willvdl that this hits upon what we were talking about earlier
<cbx33> hi highvoltage
<LaserJock> we should have a wiki page that gives a table of LTSP features and what versions of Edubuntu have them
<willvdl> docbook has some "context" tag thingy that would work
<cbx33> LaserJock, mostly, how to enable/enabled by default too
<willvdl> then when you build it each release, you jsut specify what "contexts" to build in
<LaserJock> that sounds somewhat overly complicated
<LaserJock> why not branch for each version of Edubuntu
<willvdl> it's in the Qual Assur spec
<LaserJock> for docbook?
<willvdl> yip.
* LaserJock goes to read the spec again
<LaserJock> HelpWikiQualityAssurance does say anything about docbook
<LaserJock> *doesn't
<LaserJock> just Moin
<willvdl> hmmm, where did I read it then...
<LaserJock> maybe in one of Matthew East's other brain bender specs ;-)
<willvdl> Sean Wheller is quite a fan of the idea as well
<LaserJock> I bet
<LaserJock> not that I'm particularly against it
<LaserJock> I just think we've got a lot of other things that need fixing
<willvdl> but I guess you're right, branches would suffice
<willvdl> it depends on how the Handbook is going to be distributed
* cbx33 agrees on the fixing thing
<cbx33> bbl
<LaserJock> right now we can't even make pdfs right so I'm a little less concerned about branching vs context building
<willvdl> pdfs are a lesser concern IMO
<LaserJock> well, it depends
<LaserJock> branching works quite well
<LaserJock> though it is would probably be a little bit more managment
<willvdl> only problem with branching is that there is then less tendency to update older docs
<LaserJock> having a PDF that people can print that looks profession is important for me
<willvdl> and onyl work on current ones
<LaserJock> hmm, I'm not sure about that
<willvdl> true. seperate issues though butI'm with you on the manpower thing
<LaserJock> branching allows you to fix things in older docs without messing with the current ones
<LaserJock> I could see the context thing as getting pretty complicated
<willvdl> yeah but you'll be less likely to do so since it's branched
<LaserJock> which is a good thing
<willvdl> agreed. would need full-time management
<LaserJock> you don't want "stable" documentation to be constantly changing
<willvdl> yeah. point
<LaserJock> there are pros and cons
<willvdl> hmmm.
<LaserJock> if the context thing worked well and there weren't a lot of differences it'd probably be nice
<willvdl> I need to have a solid look at the handbook tonight
<LaserJock> but if you are rewriting large chuncks each release ...
<willvdl> I don't even know if it currently builds
<LaserJock> I think nixternal's keeping track of it ok, he built an edubuntu-docs package
<willvdl> awesome
<willvdl> must remember to pat him on the back
<willvdl> LaserJock, the other thing that is at the back of my mind is what the scope/aim of the handbook is suposed to be
<willvdl> I can't help thinking that most relevant info should be in an install-guide and in upstream help
<LaserJock> yes, well that's the nature of a Handbook
<LaserJock> I think I'd rather see something more along the lines of TBH that integrates into the Ubuntu documentation
<willvdl> exactly. it aims to reinvent certian wheels but at the same time I can see the definite need for it
<willvdl> or that
<LaserJock> on the other hand, it *is* useful as a PDF or HTML guide
<LaserJock> where people can get all the info from one source
<LaserJock> print it out
<LaserJock> whatever
<willvdl> especially since it is likely to be most useful as an install-guide and first-time-configuration-guide
<willvdl> but if it's TBH then you can build it to look how you want
<LaserJock> well, kinda
<LaserJock> I don't think the doc team will be creating PDF or HTML versions of the docs anymore
<LaserJock> we are basically sacraficing online versions to get TBH on the user's computer
<LaserJock> in the end the goal is to reintroduce the contents of the help into the help wiki
<LaserJock> so help.u.c will be all wiki
<willvdl> yeah, I know.
<willvdl> I'm not sure I like it though
<willvdl> it means that the info is in yelp, fine, but also on the wiki
<willvdl> which means people will want to edit it
<willvdl> the reverse process doesn't work
<LaserJock> well
<LaserJock> at first the pages from yelp will be immutable I imagine
<LaserJock> and then once Moin->docbook is finished then docs will be written/maintained in the wiki
<LaserJock> and then shipped as docbook
<willvdl> it just seems ... odd. are there not other collaborative tools (like gobby) for editing rather
<willvdl> hmm feeding time. bbl
<cbx33> ogra I still can't get my client to build
<cbx33> is my line ^^^ ok?
<willvdl> eek. too many handbooks :)
<cbx33> hehehahah
* cbx33 laughs at willvdl 
<cbx33> sorry willvdl
<cbx33> :p
<LaserJock> willvdl: at some point you just have to take the best one and archive the rest ;-)
<nixternal> who said my name? :)
<LaserJock> me
<LaserJock> willvdl was wondering how edubuntu docs were doing
<LaserJock> nixternal: did you just put the handbook into your new edubuntu-docs package?
<nixternal> no
<nixternal> handbook, about edubuntu, release notes, and the school advocacy guide
<LaserJock> no Ubuntu material though
<nixternal> I may have forgot to add that in the changelog
<LaserJock> ?
<nixternal> no Ubuntu material
<nixternal> Ubuntu-docs are installed by default it seems with Edubuntu
<LaserJock> I think we need to replace that
<nixternal> well, I think the Ubuntu-docs should stay seeing as it will be GNOME specific, especially with the topic based help
<LaserJock> yes, but it blows away all our docs in doing so
<nixternal> if we remove Ubuntu-docs then we can just add the topic based stuff to the Edubuntu package
<LaserJock> exactly
<LaserJock> for now, I think it might be easier to tweak Ubuntu's yelp frontpage to add in the Edubuntu material
<nixternal> already done
<LaserJock> and include the TBH stuff in edubuntu-docs (replace ubuntu-docs)
<nixternal> at least the Edubuntu shows up on the Yelp frontpage
<LaserJock> does the Ubuntu material?
<nixternal> yes
<nixternal> both do
<nixternal> it is rather sloppy, but nothing much that a little bit of hacking can't fix
<LaserJock> hmm, have you got your package somewhere, I'd like to test that out
<nixternal> ya, one sec
<LaserJock> sloppy works for me as long as it works even a little bit ;-)
<cbx33> are we getting the latest version of scribus in ubuntu?
<cbx33> 1.3|
<nixternal> http://www.nixternal.com/docs/edubuntu/feisty-package/
<cbx33> we're lagging behind with 1.2.5
<LaserJock> isn't that scribus-ng
<nixternal> heh, I downloaded it from the Scribus page
<LaserJock> ?
<nixternal> yes
<crimsun> LaserJock: Pete can't read, that's all.
<nixternal> they have the Police Academy here at the university today
<nixternal> so there are a bunch of wannabe cops roaming around
<crimsun> cbx33: you're an MOTU; you _know_ how to use apt-cache search
<cbx33> true
<nixternal> haha
<nixternal> sorry, didn't mean to laugh at you :)
<nixternal> I have been in school for 2 hours now, and we have gotten 3 inches of snow in the mean time
<nixternal> my drive home is going to be horrible
<LaserJock> nixternal: blame it on all that global warming :-)
<nixternal> shush, no such thing!
<cbx33> nixternal, cool
<LaserJock> nixternal: the other thing is if we want to ship the docs we need to get it into Main
<cbx33> I only asked cos the default installed scribus in edubuntu is clearly 1.2.5
<cbx33> That's all
<nixternal> LaserJock: I will leave that up to you, I am not worthy
<cbx33> i thought there was a newer one.  Sorry for my lack of reading abliities :(
<LaserJock> I think there was something about replacing scribus with scribus-ng because 1.2 isn't going to be getting bug fixes, etc.
<LaserJock> nixternal: *I* am not worthy
<LaserJock> this stinkin' Feature Freeze deadline is killing me
<nixternal> hah, you and crimsun are the closes to be legal entities of GODDOM
<nixternal> was that a Bushism?
<LaserJock> bah
<crimsun> I ain't no stinking thing
<cbx33> LaserJock, anything I can do?
<crimsun> LaserJock's the MOTU rep to #launchpad _and_ a member of the MOTU trinity
<nixternal> I can blame my poor typing on the lag I am experiencing on the school wifi > home server
<cbx33> the MOTU trinity?
<LaserJock> but crimsun's the one that does all the work so ...
<crimsun> grunts do all the work while deities bask
<LaserJock> cbx33: perhaps, I'm just trying to get MIRs in
<nixternal> hah
<nixternal> crimsun: well get to basking
<crimsun> sorry, too busy being a grunt
<LaserJock> lol
<nixternal> heh
<nixternal> crimsun: I think I found a new audio bug though
<LaserJock> nixternal: ewww, the yelp frontpage is a tad nasty
<nixternal> LaserJock: yes, I said that up ^^
<cbx33> i read that as a tad tasty then
<nixternal> crimsun: remember I told you about the mute button lighting up properly (which I never knew I had)?
<LaserJock> nixternal: do you think you can work with mdke to get that worked out?
<nixternal> well if I mute it, shutdown/reboot, when I come back in the system is still muted, but the led isn't lit
<nixternal> LaserJock: if I have to :)
<nixternal> sure I can
<nixternal> I need to learn more than the KDE side truthfully
<nixternal> I mean GNOME needs so much help, I figured I would learn it a little bit more :)
<nixternal> OH, btw, The main KDE Educational leader, is an avid lover of Edubuntu I found out recently while talking to her
<LaserJock> yep
<LaserJock> Marie I think is her name?
<nixternal> Yes
<nixternal> I am helping her with the KDE 4 Educational documentation and hopefully working in strigi and some new help center
<LaserJock> nixternal: I think you might want to change the versioning of your edubuntu-docs package
<crimsun> nixternal: hardware boog.
<crimsun> nixternal: we're obviously saving state correctly; bios isn't.
<cbx33> stoopid bios
<nixternal> heh
<nixternal> I bet it works correctly in Windows :)
* nixternal runs and hides
<willvdl> LaserJock, nixternal: just catching up on a page or two back. Is the idea to have Edubuntu contain edubuntu-docs.deb but not ubuntu-docs.deb?
<nixternal> LaserJock: I will be back at about 23:00 UTC. I gotta get my butt to class
<nixternal> willvdl: yes
<LaserJock> willvdl: we have to figure that out
<willvdl> and then build edubuntu-docs.deb to include the TBH stuff
<nixternal> merge some of the stuff from Ubuntu docs into Edubuntu docs
<willvdl> makefile issue, nothing more?
<LaserJock> well ...
<nixternal> we need major, and I mean major help with content for the Handbook as well
<LaserJock> mostly
<willvdl> excluding content
<LaserJock> we need to rework the yelp frontpage to work for Edubuntu
<nixternal> alrighty, Im heading off to class, I will be back at home 17:00 Chicago Standard Time :)  23:00 for you UTC'ers
<willvdl> lemme rephrase, to drop ubuntu-docs for Edubuntu would jsut require a tweaked makefile right?
<nixternal> of course my server will be logging you talking bad about me
<willvdl> we don't use your name when we do that
<willvdl> we have hand-signals
<nixternal> haha
<LaserJock> willvdl: we also need to tweak the yelp frontpage to make it Edubuntu specific, but yeah
<willvdl> OK. I'm working now on merging the 3 cookbooks
<willvdl> and can hopefully make a patch before edubuntu-meeting
<cbx33> nice
<LaserJock> nixternal: make sure to use versioning that's consistent with the current edubuntu-docs package. In fact, you should have the changelog, etc. from that
<nixternal> alrighty, back in class
<nixternal> LaserJock: I will redo it when I get home
<nixternal> this class is warm
<willvdl> crap my docbook skills are seriously rusty. can't even remeber how to include from other docs
<bddebian> Heya
<swimmerino88> hello...can somebody help me?I have a little problem
<LaserJock> please give us your problem and we'll see if we can help
<cberl1> Hi folks.  Got a bit of a problem that I need help figuring out:  I ran into Kernel Panic today, and I'm not sure how to get data about what happened.  Can anyone point me in the right direction?  I'm on Edgy, and all up to date.
<stgraber> you should be able to get the log of the kernel panic in your /var/log/syslog file
<swimmerino88> ok in mi computer I have ubuntu...now i have installed all the desktop ubuntu-kubuntu-edubuntu-xubuntu...I have two problem...the first one is that ubuntu doesn't work!after the login appear a window which tell me that there is a bug.I saved the file and the other problem is that edubuntu isn't in my sessions in the login!
<cberl1> stgraber: Okay, so I should check the syslog.x file that matches the time of the panic?
<stgraber> yes
<cberl1> Okay, then what do I do with it?  :)
<stgraber> check what's written just above it
<stgraber> if you are lucky you'll easily see what module is involved
<cberl1> Okay, I'll start there.  Thanks!
<stgraber> Once the module name found, you'll be able to find if the bug is already reported on https://launchpad.net
<stgraber> if not, you'll be able to file a new bug
<cberl1> stgraber: What if I don't find anything in the syslog about the kernel panic?
<stgraber> can you paste this part of the syslog to a pastebin ?
<swimmerino88> LaserJock: this is the text that I saved http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/4461/
<cberl1> Sure -- I'll send you the appropriate timeframe and post the link here.
<swimmerino88> please...nobody have my problem???
<LaserJock> swimmerino88: Edubuntu essentiall replace Ubuntu
<LaserJock> they both use Gnome
<swimmerino88> LaserJock:so i have to install or ubuntu or edubuntu?
<LaserJock> swimmerino88: well, it's all there
<LaserJock> it's just a matter of artwork mostly
<LaserJock> what is it that you want to change?
<swimmerino88> LaserJock:No I don't wanto to change..I'd like only tu use all the ubuntus
<LaserJock> you are
<swimmerino88> LaserJock:what?
<LaserJock> it's just that Ubuntu and Edubuntu are a little mixed together, they aren't completely independent in a sense
<cberl1> stgraber: Okay, I've posted a filtered version to http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/4464/ (without the client kernel messages mixed in)
<cberl1> stgraber: if you want the full thing, with what's going on with the clients as well, I'll repost
<cberl1> stgraber: Basically, I got a call at about 9:15am telling me the server was down.  I arrived at 10am and tried to diagnose -- server was non-responsive so I rebooted it.
<swimmerino88> LaserJock:ok but I have the same problem too.Now I will remove edubuntu-desktop...so I will have ubuntu-kubuntu an xubuntu,like before...but when I enter in ubuntu,after the login appear a window!an I can't work!it says that I have to save this file...I saved it but i can't work,becauste this windows appear,and appear and appear lots of times...this is the message-> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/4461/ can you help me?
<cberl1> stgraber: One thing I think I filtered out was nbdswap activating -- which is something odd, because I have that disabled in my lts.conf (I'll post to same link)
<stgraber> cberl1: It's weird, you don't really have any useful information in your syslog ...
<LaserJock> swimmerino88: ok, try moving aside your Gnome config. mv ~/.gnome2 ~/.gnome2_bak and relogin
<stgraber> it's like if your server just had a power cut and was rebooted one hour after ...
<stgraber> no module error of any kind before the reboot ...
<swimmerino88> LaserJock:can you send to me the termila's command please?
<cberl1> stgraber: I'll post the whole thing for that timeframe -- my feeling is it may be linked to the nbdswap...
<cberl1> Try this:  http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/4465/
<LaserJock> swimmerino88: mv ~/.gnome2 ~/.gnome2_bak
<swimmerino88> LaserJock: ok i did it...now i will relogin
<stgraber> cberl1: It's possible but the boot of this .0.240 station isn't different from any other
<stgraber> and we don't have any error message ...
<cberl1> stgraber: True, but according to my lts.conf, no client should even be using nbdswap...
<cberl1> Unless I have the syntax for that wrong?
<swimmerino88> LaserJock:nothing it doesn't work
<LaserJock> swimmerino88: what happens if you reinstall edubuntu-desktop?
<swimmerino88> LaserJock: at the moment I remove edubuntu
<stgraber> cberl1: I can't find an up to date list of lts.conf parameters ...
<LaserJock> why? I mean it might have taken some things with it that caused the problem
<LaserJock> or did the problem already exist before you removed edubuntu-desktop?
<stgraber> I know that I had some problem with parameters that exists in LTSP and not in Edubuntu
<cberl1> stgraber: Okay, I'll do some digging here.
<stgraber> but the latest list I can find is breezy's one :)
<swimmerino88> LaserJock:what do you want?that i reinstall it?
<LaserJock> swimmerino88: can you try reinstalling edubuntu-desktop
<cberl1> stgraber: Somehow I think that one may be a bit dated...
<swimmerino88>  LaserJock:and what do i have to do with ubuntu-desktop?
<swimmerino88>  LaserJock:ok this is installed and now?with ubuntu desktop???
<LaserJock> don't do anything to ubuntu-desktop
<LaserJock> just see if you can log in
<swimmerino88> ok i will relogin now
<cberl1> stgraber: What would this do:  if [ -n "$NBD_SWAP" ] ;then  (found in /etc/init.d/ltsp-client-setup)
<stgraber> if $NBD_SWAP is defined do ...
<swimmerino88> LaserJock:It works but without panels only the desktop
<cberl1> Yay!  I think I found a bug!  :)
<cberl1> if NBD_SWAP is defined (true or false) it enables it!
<swimmerino88> LaserJock:it says tu me that there is a pannel working already
<LaserJock> swimmerino88: weird, what version of Ubuntu is this?
<swimmerino88> swimmerino88:edgy
<stgraber> cberl1: can you paste the content of that script ?
<stgraber> cberl1: I don't have edubuntu installed at home for the moment
<cberl1> stgraber: Sure.  Just one moment...
<LaserJock> swimmerino88: ah, ok, in a termianl type killall gnome-panel
<swimmerino88> LaserJock:ok now you think that it will work?
<LaserJock> it *should*
<swimmerino88> LaserJock:and if we do a thing?the file that i saved is called gnome-pannel bug...is there a file in the system called with this name?if is yes...can you copy to me it?and then I will copy it?
<cberl1> stgraber: Sorry for the delay.  http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/4470/
<LaserJock> swimmerino88: that was a bug repot
<LaserJock> report
<swimmerino88> ok
<swimmerino88> i will relogin
<stgraber> cberl1: it will only be loaded if $NBD_SWAP is defined, I don't see the problem (except some formating mistakes)
<swimmerino88> LaserJock:nothing it doesn't work!:(
<LaserJock> you can't log in?
<LaserJock> or still no panels?
<cberl1> stgraber: That is the problem.  :)  I've got it defined as "False", so it gets set as "on"; defining it makes it true.
<cberl1> stgraber: Which is fine, I'll edit my lts.conf to take it out.  If I still get panic, then I've narrowed a problem source, at least.
<stgraber> in the worst case you can still do : NBD_SWAP="" just before the if
<swimmerino88> LaserJock:i can login,but when te desktop appears there is the windows for the bug reports
<stgraber> but that's not a good way to do :)
<cberl1> stgraber: True, but I think undefining it for now is fine.  I'm going to test for a while and see if that's it.  I'll post a new syslog if I keep getting kernel panic errors.  Strange that it doesn't put any info in the log, though.
<LaserJock> swimmerino88: have you tried rebooting?
<swimmerino88> LaserJock:yes!!!
<LaserJock> swimmerino88: weird, you can try making another user and logging in as them to see if it's a config problem
<swimmerino88> LaserJock:I'm thinking to remove ubuntu-dektop
<LaserJock> that won't fix it I don't think
<LaserJock> ubuntu-desktop and edubuntu-desktop are almost the same
<swimmerino88> LaserJock:yes!for it i want to remove one
<cberl1> Well, thanks.  I'll check back in if problems recur.
#edubuntu 2007-02-07
<nixternal> edubuntugirl: gimme a hug!
<edubuntugirl> hug!
<nixternal> thank you
<LaserJock> geeze, you need to get a woman
<ajmitch> heh
<Kamping_Kaiser> lol
<Burgwork> heh
<nixternal> I have one, anyone want her?
<LaserJock> no thanks, I like mine just fine
<nixternal> oh well, I tried
<thisisnotreal> why is there a dvd? it contains nothing!!!
<thisisnotreal> very disappointed.
<thisisnotreal> a dozen 'educational' apps, gnome, OOo, and firefox.
<thisisnotreal> why 3+ Gb ?
<thisisnotreal> only one window manager
<thisisnotreal> can anyone explain all the bloat?
<thisisnotreal> i know gnome is large, but not this large!!
<Kamping_Kaiser> probably lots of stuff not installed by default
<thisisnotreal> not installed? they all compressed on the disc?
<thisisnotreal> when i run apt-get, it calls a remote server, not the compressed files.
<thisisnotreal> nor the CD
<thisisnotreal> now i ask, how am i supposed to access all this 'hidden data' that fills this DVD ?
<thisisnotreal> wow, /usr/lib is 650+ Mb. How many libraries does one distro require?
<thisisnotreal> and i thought winVISTA was heavy...
<thisisnotreal> yes, i am complaining. I would like to know why it is so large... what is all this? If I installed it, will it expand to 7Gb?
<thisisnotreal> besides, i only see a handful of actual 'educational' software on here. There are hundreds of GNU apps floating around (sf.net is a good start) why not add them?
<Kamping_Kaiser> why not add the kitchen sink?
<thisisnotreal> well shit, it IS almost 4Gb.
<thisisnotreal> why not give people what the name implies ?
<thisisnotreal> EDU-buntu
<thisisnotreal> something for educational
<thisisnotreal> why 600+ Mb in libs? What applications require all those libs?
<RichEd> thisisnotreal: there's a full LTSP server setup on the CD so it is an education server as well as a workstatin edition.
<RichEd> it also runs KDE apps as well as gnome
<thisisnotreal> ltsp has a small footprint.
<thisisnotreal> 8mb of KDE libs.
<thisisnotreal> perl is larger then the kde library
<RichEd> you can check more details with ogra when he is around later
<thisisnotreal> i see some of the 'issues' here... the language pack is over 200Mb
<thisisnotreal> just to make it clear... i am not angry, only disappointed.
<thisisnotreal> i expected MUCH more from 4Gb in the way of 'educational' software.
<RichEd> thisisnotreal: as I said, check with ogra ... the DVD was a way of getting around the space limitation of the CD, not really an attempt to fill a full DVD. the next release will be on 2 CDs, which is a closer fit to the actual reailty size
<RichEd> *reality
<thisisnotreal> well, i guess the main question i have is... what differentiates edu from ubuntu? only edubuntu-desktop? or are there other things?
<RichEd> language pack for example is significant for "foreign" countries with poor internet connectivity
<thisisnotreal> RichEd: ya, i guess language is important (though a EN version would be dl'd more often then a multi-lang one)
<thisisnotreal> btw, what is the screenshot app?
<thisisnotreal> i am not familiar with gnome
<RichEd> lemme check ... give me a min
<thisisnotreal> gnome-screenshot ;)
<RichEd> was about to paste that :)
<RichEd> thisisnotreal: suggestions and comments are welcome ... phrase them in terms of how you'd like to see us improve :)
<RichEd> the edubuntu-devel mailing list is best
<thisisnotreal> one last question before i turn in for the night... why are all the 'educational' apps KDE based while Gnome is the window manager of choice? Did someone not think this through? http://img370.imageshack.us/img370/2854/edupackagespe7.png  13 'educational' apps, all KDE based... just seems odd to me.
<RichEd> thisisnotreal: the more educational apps you can make us aware of or recommend, the better
<RichEd> we've been building a stable server (LTSP) and desktop ... and aimed originally at pre-primary
<RichEd> now we are trying to expand the application set ... especially at senior school level and university
<RichEd> we'll be starting a process of listing applications people make us aware of, and getting users to review them for usefulness, age group, and running smoothly under edubuntu
<RichEd> when we see good reviews, we'll check out licencing issues, full testing, and then start the process of moving them into main if it all fits together
<LaserJock> hi RichEd
<RichEd> hi LaserJock
<LaserJock> RichEd: how's it going?
<RichEd> okay ... busy planning trips again ... looks like 2.5 weeks away from home at the end of the month
<RichEd> and your side ? all well ?
<RichEd> how's the laser work going ?
<LaserJock> RichEd: well, it's going
<LaserJock> I'm really really busy
<LaserJock> trying to git various things done
<LaserJock> *get
<RichEd> yup ... life seems to speed up as it goes along ... more threads ... less closure ... memory leaks :)
<LaserJock> too many deadlines
<LaserJock> I keep running into deadlines
<LaserJock> or rather running right past them :/
<RichEd> that's funny ... i thought they ran past me
<LaserJock> heh, relativity
<LaserJock> just depends on your frame reference
<willvdl> I think I figured out the 3 Handbook thingy
<willvdl> hey cbx33
<willvdl> think I've figured out the Handbook versions thingy :)
<willvdl> https://wiki.edubuntu.org/HowToCookEdubuntu/Chapters is what was used just before DocBook
<willvdl> and the one on help.u.c is older.
<willvdl> seems there where two independant CookBook efforts in the past
<cbx33> yes
<cbx33> there were
<cbx33> hi willvdl by the way :p
<cbx33> I seem to have a ton of lag here
<cbx33> could be due to how much I'm downloading
<cbx33> do i see that the set time option has been removed from ubiquity?
<juliux> morning
<juliux> morning cbx33
<cbx33> mornin juliux
<RichEd> hi cbx33 & juliux
<cbx33> hey RichEd
<juliux> hey RichEd
<juliux> RichEd, any idea how much developers edubuntu has in germany, europe, worldwide?
<RichEd> juliux ... not really easy to qualtify seeing as we have only 2 canonical developers and the rest are volunteers
<RichEd> I always just say "a strong community of devlopers in many countries"
<juliux> RichEd, the linuxtag wants numbers:(
<RichEd> well I'd say the only way to find out is to send a mail to edubuntu-devel asking people to identify themselves if they are in germany
<juliux> hmpf
<juliux> i will write nothing in there, it is a stupid question
<Kamping_Kaiser> lol
<juliux> who is a developer? somebody who commit one patch a week? a month?
<Kamping_Kaiser> juliux, someone who writes doco, tests work? :)
<RichEd> answer them: Lots, but not enough. Volunteers please to visit #edubuntu on freenode
<juliux> RichEd, that is good;9
<juliux> we can make a big poster, we need you, join today edubuntu dev community ;)
<RichEd> :)
<pips1> hi everyone
<RichEd> ==== edubuntu meeting in #ubuntu-meeting in 13 mins ======
<jsgotangco> hi
<jsgotangco> ohhh i get to catch a meeting
<RichEd> hi there mr philippine's
<jsgotangco> its nice to catch up
<highvoltage> RichEd: I have another meeting at 14:00, so I'll have to miss it unfortunately
<highvoltage> RichEd: Could you please pass my apologies?
* RichEd will certainly pass highvoltage's apologies ...
<RichEd> ==== edubuntu meeting in #ubuntu-meeting in 2 mins ======
<cbx33> hi all
<juliux> hi cbx33
<cbx33> I have an lvm partiton which I'm mounting in the fstab, but it's mounting read - only
<juliux> cbx33, we have weekly edubuntu meeting at the moment;)
<cbx33> any reason why?
<cbx33> oh yeh
<cbx33> shute
<thisisnotreal> RichEd: electrical/cad apps (gschem, oregano, ksinus, geda, ktechlab, freecad, gcad3d) chemistry apps (gOpenmol, jchempaint, jMol) math/sci apps (oregano, scilab, labplot) and maybe some development apps(eclipse, kdevelop, bluefish)
<thisisnotreal> RichEd: sorry for the late reply, i fell asleep ;)
<RichEd> thanks ... can you whack me an email ? i'm in a meeting and multi-multi tasking ... I'll send you a reply as well.
<thisisnotreal> as far as i know, all those apps are GNU licensed
<RichEd> richard@ubuntu.com
<thisisnotreal> k
<RichEd> we'll check them out
<pips1> thisisnotreal: the apps you mention, do they exist in debian as packages?
<thisisnotreal> most, yes
<thisisnotreal> ktechlab is there
<thisisnotreal> oregano
<thisisnotreal> scilab, i think
<thisisnotreal> bluefish for sure
<thisisnotreal> kdevelop, possibly
<thisisnotreal> but for being 4Gb in size, i expected them to already be there!
<Kamping_Kaiser> i sugest you get over the 4 gig thing - it doesnt contain 4 gig of what you think it should, but probably 4 gig of what someone else does
<thisisnotreal> umm, no it doesnt
<thisisnotreal> but still
<thisisnotreal> i guess they wanted to have the repo in it
<thisisnotreal> that is why it is that large.
<thisisnotreal> besides, 13 apps does not make this an Educational distro.
<thisisnotreal> It NEEDS to be full of school apps.
<RichEd> thisisnotreal: "	future applications to include in Edubuntu " thank you kindly
<thisisnotreal> no problem
<RichEd> thisisnotreal: b.t.w if you feel like joining us at some stage, we meet every wednesday, time alternates between 12:00-14:00 UTC and 20:00-22:00 UTC in #ubuntu-meeting
<RichEd> see: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/event
<tom47> does edubuntu require the use of XFS file system?
<tom47> why?  because that file is corrupted on the iso i have
<ogra> edubuntu uses ext3 by default like ubuntu and kubuntu do
<tom47> ogra ok so i should be able to happily use that cd huh
<ogra> not if its corrupted ... did you do a selftest of it ?
<ogra> it has a menu item for that
<tom47> yes thats where the error is in the XFS file
<tom47> dXFS deb file
<ogra> then you either have a corrupted download, corrupted media or you burned it to fast
<tom47> so it should not even want to use it
<ogra> no
<ogra> it will load it though
<ogra> the instaler loads all available modules ... in case you would want xfs you could have it
<ogra> but it wont be used by default
<tom47> funny it isn't installed in ubuntu
<tom47> ok think i will try it
<tom47> thank you
<ogra> burn a new disk ... not faster than 8x as the wiki suggests
<thisisnotreal> RichEd: thank you for the invitation
<thisisnotreal> i must head off to work now, have a good day!
<Kamping_Kaiser> RichEd, can i pm you a few links? sorry about not typing the lams stuff up yet, but its on the todo list.
<RichEd> no problem ... can you dump them in /msg and then dump those into a mail ?
<RichEd> too many threads today
* RichEd rolls eyes
<Kamping_Kaiser> heh. np.
<guigz> hello
* RichEd -> collection 20 mins
<guigz> I have a tiny problem: progress bars don't look well.I have edubuntu edgy installed.
<Kamping_Kaiser> RichEd, sent you the email. hope its sojjme help.
<Kamping_Kaiser> *some
<pips1> cu
<tom47> i only have one network card in the server .... what do i have to do, to enable the clients and the internet to be attached to the same router please
<tom47> i only have one network card in the server .... what do i have to do, to enable the clients and the internet to be attached to the same router please
<bddebian> Heya
<tom47> bddebian it may be that you and i are the only ones here
<bddebian> tom47: Nah, there's 47 of them, they're just hiding from us :)
<tom47> i had a question but got no response ....
<tom47> i only have one network card in the server .... what do i have to do, to enable the clients and the internet to be attached to the same router please
<bddebian> Is the server the router?
<tom47> no
<tom47> the router is an adsl router with wireless and 4 ethernet ports
<hj> hey RichardD, are you around ?
<tom47> hope i did not mis an aswer because xchat aborted on me :(
<tom47> question - can i use a single ethernet on my edubuntu server for both client and internet access (they would be thrugh my adsl router)
<ogra> yes, but you should disable a dhcp server thats possibly running on the router
<tom47> ogra ah thank ou very much yes there is one there
<tom47> ogra is there anything special i need to do / be aware of in installing edubuntu in respect of this?
<tom47> ..... oh and is there a dhcp that runs under edubuntu then?
<ogra> you should pick an ip from 192.168.0.X for your interface and configure it as a static one during install
<ogra> then you dont need to touch anything
<tom47> my router is presently 10.1.1.1
<ogra> fi you want a different net, you need to adjust /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf accordingly
<ogra> and restart the dhcp server
<tom47> ogra ok think i have worked through that ...... dhcp off in router, dhcp will be served from the server .... and if i use 10.1.1.1 as my gateway to internet that should do it?
<ogra> right ... best is to switch off the dhcp on the router before you install ...
<tom47> yes i will do that ty v much
<tom47> ogra ru there?
<tom47> i editted /etc/ltsp/dhcp.conf ..... now seem to have errors in it when i try to restart it
<tom47> .... no specific error message though ... its blank
<tom47> dhcpd.conf to be more accurate
<LaserJock> bah, I'm always mising RichEd
<cbx33> hey LaserJock
<LaserJock> hi Pete
<cberl1> Is there any reason a kernel panic wouldn't leave some kind of log on the system when it appears?  Something strange going on with one of my servers.
<cberl1> Put a different way:  how can I figure out why a server would be "randomly" crashing (giving kernel panics)?
<LaserJock> can you try a different kernel?
<LaserJock> I don't know about your original log question
<cberl1> LaserJock: Sure, which would you suggest?  I'm running Edgy, with SMP, using the LTSP to server 30 clients.
<cberl1> currently using:  2.6.17-10-generic
<LaserJock> hmmm
<LaserJock> actually maybe you should as #ubuntu-kernel real quick about the log issue. Edgy shouldn't be radomly giving kernel panics
<LaserJock> but I'm certainly no kernel expert
<cberl1> Okay, I'll give it a go.
<hj> btw, como les gusta codename ukibuntu
<hj> ups wrong room, sorry guys
<rippawallet> educational ubuntu :D
<LaserJock> wahoo!
<rippawallet> my school uses windoez
<rippawallet> lol
<LaserJock> bummer
<rippawallet> indeed.
<rippawallet> not only that
<rippawallet> but like
<rippawallet> windoes 98
<rippawallet> >_<
<LaserJock> yikes
<hj> hey at my school, we didnt had computers jajajajaja !
<rippawallet> :O
<hj> but well fix that pretty soon
<hj> :D
<hj> thanks to free software   yeeeei
<hj> jajajaja
<rippawallet> hai2uthxbai
<hj> So anyone here has played around with persistent LiveUSB ?
<tom47> i seem to have borked my dhcp
<tom47> i get an error when i restart dhcp "error in dhcpd.conf" but no further diagnostic
<tom47> is ogra there?
<hj> i havent heard of ogra for a while now
<tom47> ah i was talking with him/her last night
<tom47> about 4 hours ago
<hj> well he was online a few hours ago
<tom47> ah i see what you mean sorry
<hj> 10.16 am  (its now 4.19 for me  gtm -6:00)
<tom47> he gave me some suggestions on how to set up edubuntu with only one ethernet connection on the edubuntu server
<hj> mhhh , we've done it with mandriva...
<hj> if its really urgent let me know and i'll ask one of our guys to come and explain...   (im not that hardcore)
<tom47> i made the changes to lstp.conf but i may have gotten it wrong
<hj> mhhh, surely out of my league jajaja,
<hj> gimme a sec, let me see if our guy is free
<tom47> ty
<hj> you can take a look at the /var/log/messages log file to see more detailed error messages coming from dhcp server
<tom47> ok
<hj> just tail -f /var/log/messages and watch it as you bring you server up
<hj> it will tell you exactly what is wrong with the configuration
<tom47> ok will try it
<ogra> tom47, hey
<tom47> ogra hi
<ogra> tom47, so what did you break ? and how ? :)
<tom47> oh ... i editted lstp as i had in mind to do from our discussion and it says there are errors in it when i restart dhcp
<ogra> thats a stadard edubuntu install from the server CD, right ?
<tom47> yes it was but i am trying to set up with the adsl router being used to attach the clients
<ogra> did you disable the dhcpd on the router before install as i suggested ?
<tom47> i just retated dhcp3 and it fails in self test and displays no messages
<tom47> yes its disabled on the router yep
<LaserJock> hi ogra
<ogra> so the installer asked you for static IP settings, right ?
<tom47> dhcpd self-test failed. Please fix the config file.
<tom47> The error was:
<ogra> hey LaserJock
<LaserJock> ogra: at home? seems like you are endlessly traveling
<ogra> LaserJock, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MainInclusionReportCryptsetup have fun with your MIRs ...
<tom47> ummmm could not be completely certain about that ogra
<ogra> iwj is doing main approval now
<LaserJock> ogra: hmmm
<ogra> tom47, well, if you disabled the dhcp on the router, the edubuntu installer shouldnt have gotten an IP address and asked you for one
<ogra> did it ask you ?
<tom47> ogra my memor of what it asked is a bit hazey sorry
<ogra> ok
<LaserJock> ogra: it's hard. people want software, but getting into Main seems awefully difficult
<ogra> LaserJock, it was never difficult with pitti
<hj> tom47: is there any other box running services that could have dhcp enabled ?
<LaserJock> ogra: I was wondering if a edubuntu-universe tasks package would be helpful
<LaserJock> like the DebianEdu stuff
<tom47> hj i have two other boxes running but they were formerly using dhcp on the router
<ogra> tom47, can you paste your /etc/network/interfaces file and the /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf file to http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/ please
<tom47> ok wilco
<ogra> LaserJock, indeed it would
<ogra> LaserJock, but dont expect that you can file scripted MIRs with iwj as reviewer ... see his comments ...
<ogra> obviously CVE and secunia entries are not enough for him as well ...
<LaserJock> ogra: yep, well I'll see what I can do
<LaserJock> yeah, that seems odd
<ogra> thats iwj
<LaserJock> ogra: did you get the email I sent you yesterday?
<ogra> nope
* ogra digs
<tom47> ogra http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/4639/
<ogra> i only got a linkedin update from you ... thats the last mail containing your name here
<LaserJock> hmm
<LaserJock> I sent it to ogra at ubuntu.com
<ogra> tom47, ok, and the /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf file as well
<LaserJock> ogra: is ^^ the right address?
<ogra> Subject: 	2nd CD MIRs
<ogra> aha
<ogra> landed i my spamfilter
<LaserJock> yeah, that's it
<LaserJock> opps
<ogra> this bogofilter setup isnt really working with evo
<tom47> ogra http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/4640/
<ogra> my spamassasin on the server is far more reliable
<ogra> LaserJock, i agree about the menu spec ... lets keep it for feisty+1 ... then we'll have plenty of space as well :)
<LaserJock> mhm
<LaserJock> I want to get the GUI right
<LaserJock> and I think things might change with the 2nd CD stuff
<ogra> tom47, change: range 10.1.1.1 10.1.1.250; to range 10.1.1.20 10.1.1.250;
<tom47> k
<ogra> so the dhcpd doesnt try to hand out the routers ip or your own one
<ogra> but that shouldnt stop dhcpd from starting
<tom47> just in ltspd.conf i guess?
<ogra> ltspd.conf ?
<ogra> what should that be ?
<nixternal> LaserJock: did we figure out if we are keeping Ubuntu docs, or are we going to incorporate them into the new Edubuntu package?
<ogra> you mean dhcpd.conf :)
<tom47> sorry
<tom47> dhcpd.conf
<ogra> right :)
<LaserJock> nixternal: we need to test what we *can* do. I remembered mdke saying something about the yelp frontpage being partly determined in the yelp package itself
<LaserJock> nixternal: we need to have a system fast, we need to get edubuntu-docs promoted if we want to ship it on the CD
<tom47> ogra still the same message after i enter the restart command
<ogra> right, check /var/log/syslog and /var/log/daemon.log for messages
<LaserJock> Feature Freeze is killing me :/
<ogra> as i said, the change wont fix the issue, but the fixed config will prevent errors
<ogra> LaserJock, dont tell *me*
<ogra> feisty is the worst release i had ...
<ogra> 3 out of 8 specs only
<LaserJock> :(
<LaserJock> it has been really rough this time
<LaserJock> Edgy was chaotic, but that's because we had so little time
<LaserJock> and we still got a fair amount done
<tom47> ogra complains about bad subnet mask
<nixternal> LaserJock: if you need some help, i have an hour and a half to help out with something
<tom47> on line 3
<ogra> tom47, so change line 3 :)
<LaserJock> Feisty seems like growing pains, a lot more bureaucracy, too much to do with too few people, or something like that
<ogra> tom47, netmask 255.0.0.0 should be: netmask 255.255.255.0
<tom47> ogra ty
<LaserJock> nixternal: -> -doc
<ogra> tom47, same for line 9 option subnet-mask 255.0.0.0; should be option subnet-mask 255.255.255.0;
<tom47> as simple as the ... places index finger to forehead
<nixternal> LaserJock: package?
<nixternal> content?
<tom47> ogra hj ty
<tom47> ogra retarted just fine
<ogra> great :)
<hj> sweet
<hj> so ogra, do you remember that distribution i talked to you about months ago ?  booting from a live usb for students
<ogra> only very rough
<hj> okz... well so it comes that i got our ministry of science and technology and our council of social development to support the idea
<hj> along with the worldbank that now is evaluating the budget (in order to approve some funds)
<hj> the main idea is to fight the digital divide in mexico, using among other tools a persistent liveusb
<hj> pretty much a similar philosophy as that to OLPC
<hj> but we take care not only for hardware but for schooling systems and social development...
<hj> i will be needing gather up some volunteers in order to create this specific ubuntu distribution... do you guys have any idea on where should i start from ?
<hj> i talked with some guys from the mexican community and they adviced to start a google group to gather volunteers ... is there any other proccess that i should undertake ?
<tom47> ogra works just fine ty
<ogra> :)
* tomedu is really tom47 in my first client session
<ogra> yay
<tomedu> yay indeed heheheheheh
<Burgwork> hj: so you want to build a specific build of edubuntu for a USB key?
<hj> yup yup but with certiain requeriements
<hj> it has to be persistent...
<hj> this is, children must be able to preserve their files and configurations
<hj> and must be able to update from distributed sources (not a priority)
<hj> The thing is, my company will take care of the learning management system and social networks for free, give it as opensource to every school and ngo... but we can't handle the linux distribution we only have one real linux developer, hence i'm turning to the ubuntu community for help
<Burgwork> well, the ubuntu live stuff does persistence
<hj> no way
<Burgwork> just take the edubuntu-workstation live iso and tweak it
<Burgwork> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/LiveCDPersistence
<hj> great, it will be much more simpler that i thought
<Burgwork> just not a trivial thing to setup
<Burgwork> be nice if somebody could write a nice utility turn it on
<Burgwork> or maybe hack the installer to make a liveusb drive
<nixternal> Burgwork: we did one for our LUG with DSL, you can run it from a USB Key and then you can also save to a seperate location on the USB and access it later rather easy
<Burgwork> yep
<hj> Great, and how should i ask for help ? do i have to setup a formal request ?
<Burgwork> no
<Burgwork> I would lay out exactly what you want and start asking around
<hj> i started a google group, as some users in mexican community advised,  im right now writing the requierements and start asking for volunteers,
<hj> so it seems the solution is not that complex as i thought
<Burgwork> likely it will be pretty easy
<hj> nixternal: do you have any documentation available ?
<nixternal> hj: we used documentation availabe from the Damn Small Linux site
<nixternal> there is one about setting up a r/w USB distro iirc
<hj> thanks
#edubuntu 2007-02-08
<cbx33> ping anyone alive
<LaserJock> Pete!
<cbx33> hey LaserJock
<LaserJock> cbx33: what's up?
<cbx33> um
<cbx33> mounting a chroot
<cbx33> well going into a chroot
<cbx33> i need to mount proc
<cbx33> what is the command to do that?
<LaserJock> yeah
<cbx33> how is everything going with you?
<LaserJock> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebootstrapChroot has good info
<LaserJock> I'm not sure how to do it CLI exactly
<cbx33> hmm
<cbx33> oh cos that's what I need
<cbx33> think ubuntu-moet will know?
<nixternal> LaserJock: http://www.nixternal.com/docs/edubuntu/feisty-package
<nixternal> updated
<nixternal> I will be in class, I will be home in 4 hours
<nixternal> later
<cbx33> hey ogra
<cbx33> hey guys
<cbx33> on an edubuntu ltsp ldm screen
<cbx33> is the ip address in the bottom left or right?
<kgoetz> RichEd-1: ping?
<tom47> would edubuntu run ok with wifi?
<tom47> !wifi
<ubotu> Wireless documentation can be found at https://help.ubuntu.com/community/WifiDocs
<LaserJock> tom47: an Edubuntu LTSP server?
<tom47> yes
<tom47> attached to w wireless router by cable and the clients on wifi
<LaserJock> I don't think it's recommended
<LaserJock> the network connection is basically the biggest bottleneck for an LTSP setup
<LaserJock> how many clients?
<tom47> 3/5
<tom47> with prob only 2 in use at any one time
<LaserJock> it might work sorta
<LaserJock> what kinda wifi?
<tom47> probasbly thinkpads
<tom47> with either a belkin or similar wireless adsl roiuter
<tom47> router
<tom47> pretty sure the comms volume would be low
<RichEd> tom47: hi ... #ltsp is a good place to ask those sorts of questions
<RichEd> hi LaserJock
<tom47> riched ahh yes prob is too yep i will try there
<RichEd> tom47: they are edubuntu aware across there :)
<tom47> Riched ok ty tc guys
<LaserJock> RichEd: get my email?
<RichEd> LaserJock: lemme check
<RichEd> yessir mr LaserJock mail received in good working condition
<LaserJock> :-)
<RichEd> the education summit will help with application suggestions, as well as the community site where we are calling for applications in the field, and will be getting users to review
<LaserJock> I've asked a bit on the Education and Science subforum of ubuntuforums.org
<RichEd> at LCA the educators were all very excited about having a place where the kids and teachers could review applications and comment on:
<RichEd> * grade level
<RichEd> * age level
<RichEd> * usability etc.
<LaserJock> but the feedback is pretty sparse and weighted towards scientists I think
<LaserJock> is the education summit still planned for the week before Feisty+1 UDS?
<RichEd> we even floated the idea of getting teachers to set projects for the kids to spend a lesson searching for FOSS applications, downloading and installing 1 between say 3 kids, and then doing a review as a project task
<kgoetz> it sounds very similar to what lorien were doing, and i have to say i think its a good one
<RichEd> the idea is to extend the concept of collaborative development in the Open Source community into other areas of education ... like applications and content etc.
<RichEd> i.e. all help to create a list / repository whereby if you bring one new app to the list, you get 10 more to take away
<RichEd> ^^ yep UES thu 3, fri 4 May ... UDS sun 6, fri 11 May
<RichEd> kgoetz: lorien ?
<RichEd> we'd welcome any existing lists to start with
<LaserJock> RichEd: and same place as UDS?
<kgoetz> RichEd: the school stuart someone was from (see my notes from the miniconf). he was plainning to set something similar runningwith GIS software to help another school
<RichEd> yes indeed ... spain it is ... can't anounce exact location untill the official balloons go up - this week i hope
<RichEd> kgoetz: okay ... i remember now ... there are quite a few lists of applications floating around, the main thing we want to do, apart from bringing them all together, is to get the classroom level review as opposed to the developer perspective
<RichEd> i.e. tuXpain is good for kids from 6-10 grades 1-4 but then you'll want to move them onto GIMP etc.
<RichEd> that sort of advice
* RichEd doffs his hat to jsgotangco
<kgoetz> RichEd: i've been trying to keep in touch with stuart, perhaps we could aproach him about this. i suspect some other schools would be interested if it goes ok with him
<RichEd> kgoetz: i'll be planning the community space with pips1 this wek and next, and the review concept will be the first key area of the new site
<RichEd> so we will aim for getting a framework up by the end of feb, and kick it into action early march
<RichEd> i'll make a note to include stuart in the annoucement / call to action
<kgoetz> RichEd: my going overseas has bene put back a month, so i'm going to spend a little time here instead of none. i'm happy to try and work on that with you and pips as is neeed
<RichEd> great ... thanks indeed. i've got to finish UES stuff this week, and planning for 2 overseas trips, and then will give it some energy next wek
<RichEd> will keep you in the loop
<kgoetz> no worries. ping me whenever :)
<LaserJock> RichEd: still here?
<RichEd> i think so
<LaserJock> how many people are going to be at UES?
<RichEd> we're aiming at 30-40
<LaserJock> mostly teachers?
<RichEd> target is mostly educators and decision makers - we're hoping for some UNESCO and DFID etc.
<RichEd> people using Edubuntu or people considering taking the leap away from Veeeesta to FOSS
* highvoltage just turned 25
<RichEd> so the idea is for some presentations on success stories that will give people confidence that the time is rigjt and edubuntu is mature
<RichEd> *right
<LaserJock> highvoltage: \o/
<RichEd> mature like highvoltage
<RichEd> happy
<RichEd> happy
<RichEd> BOIFDAY !!!!!!
<highvoltage> :-D
<LaserJock> I've been 25 for like 3 months now
<LaserJock> :p
* RichEd lights the candles
<RichEd> I've been like 25 for nearly 18 years now :P
<highvoltage> LaserJock: and I for about 8 minutes (more or less exactly) :)
* RichEd watches as the birthday cake slowly bursts into flames .... blow out the candles dammnit
* highvoltage blows hard
<highvoltage> erm...
<highvoltage> blows out the candle and cake, at least
<RichEd> yayay !
<RichEd> LaserJock: we'll also be inviting distros built on ubuntu (guadelinex) as well as skolelinux and debian-edu etc for community collaboration against the dark side
<LaserJock> are there going to be sponsorships? any need for a loser like me to go?
* LaserJock notes the silence ;-)
<LaserJock> highvoltage: so what are you up to these days?
<LaserJock> your company going good?
<kgoetz> highvoltage: happy bday
<highvoltage> thanks kgoetz
* kgoetz wasnt be 25 for 3.5 years ;)
<highvoltage> LaserJock: the company is doing good, I'd like to get myself replaced in this company
<highvoltage> LaserJock: because I want to start an additional 2 companies before the end of the year
<highvoltage> LaserJock: some big risks are involved, but I might as well try before I'm completely over the hill ;)
<LaserJock> just a little ambitous? :-)
<highvoltage> I don't know. I never thought of myself as ambitious
<LaserJock> I just want to graduate before I'm 30 :/
<highvoltage> I'd like to graduate at some point at my life!
<highvoltage> but I'll have to start studying first for anything like that to be possible
<highvoltage> maybe when I retire one day ;)
<highvoltage> LaserJock: I think it's more a case of being stubborn and wanting to see things happen the way I think it should than ambition
<LaserJock> mhm, makes sense
<highvoltage> LaserJock: there's so many opportunities that go by that no one takes advantage of, I guess I just want to prove what's possible
<highvoltage> people here constantly complain that there's no work for young people here, and that's SO incredibly untrue
<juliux> willvdl, ping
<willvdl> juliux, pong
<juliux> willvdl, did you have time to look at the edubuntu flyer?
<willvdl> I looked at the last snapshot you sent, yesterday was it?
<juliux> yes
<juliux> i need some feedback on the text
<willvdl> ah. send me thie link again and I'll put something together for the end of the day?
<willvdl> need to swap offices and arrange some visas urgently this afternoon
<cbx33> hey all
* cbx33 is tired
<cbx33> had less than 4 hours sleep last night finishing up the book chapter
<juliux> willvdl, ok
<juliux> willvdl, http://ubuntu.juliux.de/edubuntu_back.png http://ubuntu.juliux.de/edubuntu_front.png after the weekend is also o
<juliux> k
<cbx33> hey all in an fstab line, can i do things like
<cbx33>  /dev/hda/home/user /home/user blah blah
<Kamping_Kaiser> no
<cbx33> that sux
<Kamping_Kaiser> unless dev/hda/user is a symlink
<Kamping_Kaiser> why do you want to?
<Kamping_Kaiser> you can bind (eg /proc to /chroot/proc)
<cbx33> i have an lvm partition
<cbx33> and it was my old system
<cbx33> I have installed a new system
<cbx33> but wanted to use the home dir on there as my new dir
* Kamping_Kaiser doesnt get lvm, so some of these questions might be stupid
<Kamping_Kaiser> whats the structure of your old system? is /home/ on its own partition
<Kamping_Kaiser> ?
<willvdl> juliux, thanks. will give it a go
<cbx33> no
<cbx33> it is /home/pete
<Kamping_Kaiser> cbx33, that is the seperate partiiton?
<cbx33> no
<willvdl> bbl
<cbx33> basicalyl this lvm parition had all the entire system
<cbx33> file system
<cbx33> but i only want to mount /home/pete to my current /home/pete
<Kamping_Kaiser> you can mount the old system anyware (ie /mnt/oldsys), and either bind or symlink the old home to the new one
<cbx33> ah yes i suppose I coiuld symlink my home dir
<cbx33> never thought of that
<cbx33> oh well.....here goes
<cbx33> I'll log out whilst i do that ;)
<Kamping_Kaiser> gl!
<cbx33> hehe
* Kamping_Kaiser is sitting on a host with a symlinked home atm
<cbx33> i have a backup user
<cbx33> cool
<cbx33> ln -s <target> <source>
<cbx33> or the other way round?
<Kamping_Kaiser> iirce soruce first
* cbx33 ALWAYS forgets this
<Kamping_Kaiser> *sp
<cbx33> see ya soon
* Kamping_Kaiser wonders if bind would be better
<Kamping_Kaiser> catch you then :)
<symlinkedhome> Kamping_Kaiser: works ;)
<symlinkedhome> w00t
<Kamping_Kaiser> symlinkedhome, :D
<symlinkedhome> now to reclaim my nick
<cbx33> that was awesome Kamping_Kaiser
<cbx33> it's working like a charm
<Kamping_Kaiser> cbx33, np. see if you notice any weirdness :)
<cbx33> none so far
<Kamping_Kaiser> i seem to recall there was some cute ones when changingn levels in a shell, i just cant reproduce them on demand
<cbx33> heheh
* cbx33 is reading about pixbufloader at the mo
<cbx33> thinking it'll solve all my problems
<Kamping_Kaiser> cbx33, http://pastebin.ca/345278
<Kamping_Kaiser> that one
<Kamping_Kaiser> not sure if moving stuff around has any issues yet :)
<Kamping_Kaiser> cbx33, in that example, my home is a symlink from /mnt/Storage/kgoetz-home to /home/kgoetz
<cbx33> ahh i see
<cbx33> eek
<Kamping_Kaiser> eek? :S
<cbx33> ahh yes
<cbx33> have just recreated that bug
<cbx33> :p
<Kamping_Kaiser> lol :P
<Kamping_Kaiser> took me a while to sus that one *grin*
<cbx33> heheh
<cbx33> hey willvdl
<willvdl> hey. how's the book?
<cbx33> well i sent the email with the first draft off
<cbx33> so...
<cbx33> who knows
<willvdl> groovu. look forward to it
<willvdl> gotto run quick
<cbx33> np
<tom47> i have a flashdrive mounted on the client but cannot find the equivalenr"eject" option that exists in ubuntu .... do you simply remove it?
<Kamping_Kaiser> tom47, what do you mean its in ubuntu but not edubuntu?
<tom47> when i plug in a flash drive in ubuntu i right click and "eject" it before removing it so thatr the buffers are flushed .... in edubuntu it mounts on the client desktop in the same way but there is no "eject" showing on right click
<Kamping_Kaiser> you mean a stand alone ubuntu pc, not ltsp ubuntu then? not sure about the problem, btw
<cliebow> tom47:processes should just die when you pull the stcik in a client
<tom47> yes a standalone ubuntu installation compared to an edubuntu client
<Kamping_Kaiser> cliebow, so they are mounted sync?
<tom47> cliebow yes it does that it seems but are the buffers flushed every time ... ie the reason you have to "eject" in an ubuntu installation does not apply here?
<cliebow> well doesnt ltspfs make the connection
<cliebow> seems they are flushed every couple seconds...there is sbalneavs page on wiki.ltsp.org
<tom47> ah thats terrific .... wonder why ubuntu itself doesn't do this ;-)
<cliebow> hhmm.cant find the spec
<cliebow> This is one of the coolest features of the local device support in LTSP-4.2.
<cliebow> Once the local device has been idle for 2 seconds, it is internally un-mounted, so that there's no data lingering around in buffers, and the filesystem is sync'd properly. Even though the device isn't mounted, the icon stays on the screen. If the user accesses anything on the device, it will automatically re-mount it and read/write it.
<cliebow> A user certainly shouldn't be pulling the usb stick out in the middle of saving a document, but once the save operation is finished, only 2 seconds is needed before you can pull the device.
<cliebow> not what i was loking for.but
<tom47> aha!!! cliebow thats excellent news thanks for revealing the answer
<Kamping_Kaiser> damn it, why cant they put eject anyway?
<cliebow> cant find the spec..durnit
<Kamping_Kaiser> have you any idea how confusing thats going to be at work? :|
<cliebow> i dont know if there is a technical reason..
<cliebow> http://wiki.ltsp.org/twiki/bin/view/Ltsp/LtspFS
<Kamping_Kaiser> how what?
<ogra> Kamping_Kaiser, adding an eject would require two way communication ... which is very hard to do and raises the minimal requirements for the clients
<ogra> the auto unmount is additionally way more secure for people that just ignore the eject ...
<ogra> (which are many)
<Kamping_Kaiser> ogra, i see. *shrug*. hopefully by the next LTS (when the server will upgrade) ubuntu standalone will do someth8ing similar, or explaing to people when and when not to pull devices out will get silly and impractical
<tom47> ogra yes makes for a good reason to move that capability into ubuntu itself to my mind ... but look guys thanks for the help .... i have a test setup here and am running through it reasonably closely and its great to be able to get answers  to such obscure stuff thanks again
<tom47> snap
<ogra> well, ubuntu edgy should pop up a warning if you just pull your usb stick out ...
<tom47> too late she cried ... i am pregnant !!
<ogra> yeah
<ogra> but she will be more careful before the second child at least :)
<tom47> hehehehhe
<cliebow> be aware that lbussd will go crazy sometimes and consuume all cpu if clients are not logged off right..unless ogra has fixed that
<ogra> cliebow, ubuntu doesnt use lbus
<cliebow> solves that
<cliebow> 8~)
<ogra> :)
<ogra> we have a one way ssh socket we communicate through ... that makes lbus obsolete :)
<tom47> i have been pondering the question of a wifi installation and have had some conversations in #ltsp ..... seems its quite immature just yet
<tom47> there is a local small vet clinic where such an installation would be ideal ... quite a few workstations but not as many operators
<tom47> quite a few = up to 6 and simultaneous in use workstations prob no more than 2 and even that quite rarely
<Kamping_Kaiser> wifi?
<tom47> wireless lan
<Kamping_Kaiser> rather, 'whats with wifi and ltsp'? do you want to netboot over wireless?
<tom47> ideally ..... but to run a live session would be the crucual feature .... local cd boot may be a way to go i gues conceptually
<juliux> RichEd, sorry i sent you an e-mail but this e-mail should go to somebody else
<tom47> some work has been done but it does not look recent
<Kamping_Kaiser> do wireless cards support pxe booting? thats really the key bit ;)
<tom47> and it revolves around a floppy boot which is not attractive as laptops are likely to be the chosen clients
<tom47> no apparently not ... wouldn't it be a bios issue as much as wifi?
<Kamping_Kaiser> you could boot cd, i know people who diy dban cds (why i dont know)
<tom47> you can use a eth to wifi bridge to achieve it but tahts not a very attractive choice
<tom47> ah well maybe thats why ...
<Kamping_Kaiser>  not sure what re bios. it would have to allow you to boot that interface, but the rest should be the pxe loader
<willvdl> juliux, what's your email address?
<juliux> willvdl, juliux@ubuntu-de.org or jbloch@edubuntu.org or mail@juliux.de ;)
<juliux> willvdl, it is all the some mailbox
<willvdl> cool. I just want to introduce you to some guys that are going to go to Linux Tag.
<willvdl> you will be running a booth right?
<willvdl> http://www.cs.umd.edu/~lorin/ffs.html <-- I love this :)
<juliux> willvdl, if you mean the LinuxTag in berlin in may, yes
<willvdl> juliux, thanks
<willvdl> erm, how many linuxtags are there?
<juliux> willvdl, we have many in germany
<juliux> willvdl, but they are not all called LinuxTag
<willvdl> oh. cool. I'll check :) Jono will be at the Berlin one as well?
<juliux> willvdl, at the begining of march we have the chemnitzer Linux Tage
<juliux> willvdl, i hope so
<willvdl> cool
<juliux> willvdl, we wants to committ a talk
<juliux> willvdl, if you want to know on which expos in germany we are check http://wiki.ubuntuusers.de/LocoTeam/Messen or https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ConferenceAppearances
<SiCk> ello all
<SiCk> i'm stuck with a problem again
<SiCk> :(
<SiCk> haha
<juliux> SiCk, ask;)
<Kamping_Kaiser> poor SiCk :(
<SiCk> i didnt have a problem when i first logged in here, then it reared its head. grr
<SiCk> but yes
<SiCk> i boot my client and get Can't open file /usr/share/gdm/themes/Human/Human.xml , this is after a gdm reinstall
<SiCk> ogra mentioned something about permissions the last time this happened?
<Kamping_Kaiser> SiCk, does the file exist?
<SiCk> ooh
<SiCk> no.
<SiCk> haha
<SiCk> but even a find doesnt bring up human.xml
<Kamping_Kaiser> SiCk, try `ls -lh /usr/share/gdm/themes/Human/Human.xml`
<SiCk> no such file/directory
<Kamping_Kaiser> head over to p.u.c and use the 'packages with this file' search and find the one you need
<SiCk> puc?
<Kamping_Kaiser> packages.ubuntu.com
<SiCk> right well now i dont get any errors, but it doesnt log into the session
<SiCk> it tries to and just jumps straight back to the login
<SiCk> you know, i've a feeling i might need to re-build my client
<ogra> to end up with the same problems again ?
<ogra> you already rebuilt your client
<SiCk> it was working before though
<ogra> just fix it ;)
<Kamping_Kaiser> hehe
<SiCk> then i uninstalled gnome and installed icewm
<SiCk> then i uninstalled icewm and installed gnome
<ogra> in your kiosk setup ?
<SiCk> and then this happened. :P
<SiCk> yeah
<ogra> ugh
<SiCk> haha
<ogra> why did you install gnome ?
<ogra> i thought you only wanted a web kiosk
<Kamping_Kaiser> SiCk, move your not-working chroot aside, and build a new one
<SiCk> i do, it isnt even just a web kiosk for someones use , its just a computer showing a webpage in fullscreen
<SiCk> at the moment the xsession is only calling firefox
<SiCk> but its moaning to have gdm for the whole system to start
<Kamping_Kaiser> night
<ogra> right, so use gdm then :)
<willvdl> RichEd,ping
<SiCk> well gdm is installed
<SiCk> edgy-gdm-themes is installed
<ogra> and runs ?
<SiCk> no, thats the problem
<SiCk> its going to boot in i think and just jumps back to login
<SiCk> maybe its my xsession...
<SiCk> 1 sec.
<ogra> so gdm doesnt start up at all ?
<SiCk> would a blank line mess things up?
<SiCk> in an xsession
<ogra> no, but a & at the end of the line
<SiCk> all i have in the kiosk autologin user's xsession is
<SiCk> #!/bin/sh
<SiCk> , /usr/bin/firefox
<SiCk> without the ,
<ogra> that should be right
<SiCk> ill try it without that empty line i didnt notice
<SiCk> same thing :(
<SiCk> lunctime anywayh
<SiCk> back late
<ogra> i suspect something fishy with your account or the homedir
<SiCk> yeah, possibly... i might try re-creating the user later just
<ogra> no, just check the homedir
<SiCk> if all else fails, a rebuild yarr
<SiCk> what sould i be looking for in the homedir?
<SiCk> i checked the perms on it earlier and it seemed fine
<ogra> add a delay to the gdm autologin ...
<ogra> wait until it failed
<ogra> log in on console and check .xsession-errors in the sers home
<ogra> *users
<SiCk> the gdm autologin is set to 10
<SiCk> or 5 i think i changed it to
<ogra> ok, so you have time to switch to console
<SiCk> ah right, okay ill do that when i get back
<RichEd> pong willvdl
<jgedeon> y
<bddebian> Heya
<lpf> hello
<mathesis> jai speak spanish?
<hj> I speak spanish...
<hj> although im not a saavy user  :  (
<plagerism> Hello, I was hoping to start a new project that would allow multiple students root access to their very own linux distrobution. I originally started looking at this about 6 months ago, and now I am taking another look because of something that I heard puppylinux does with a save file
<plagerism> Puppylinux allows changes to the filesystem to be saved on a separate partition
<plagerism> So my idea was to have a local disk with the base system, and then allow changes to be stored over the network, probably via a chroot via a minimal base system
<plagerism> Currently my school uses removable disks(one per each student) which you can imagine is a tedious task to administrate.
<ogra> well, you could use ltsp and usbsticks
<ogra> but that would bind you to a single distro
<ogra> you could also set up a netboot server that serves liveCD isos ...
<ogra> depending on the distro the students could mount a local disk or use usbsticks
<ogra> but that will need some scripting ...
<plagerism> ogra: currently on the localdisk they have some archaic setup using evms to autorevert
<plagerism> ogra, I think for these purposes a single distrobution would be okay
<mathesis> hi all
<mathesis> speak spanish?
<ogra> plagerism, well, then set up a test lab with ltsp ;)
<mathesis> ltsp edubuntu i = ltsp4.2?
<plagerism> will ltsp allow each user to have root access to their own virtual system??
<ogra> mathesis, edubuntu ships ltsp5
<mathesis> edubuntu install ltsp5
<cbx33> hi all
<bddebian> Heya cbx33
<cbx33> hey bddebian
<Burgwork> hey cbx33
<willvdl> cbx33, your BETT leaflet is getting new life in juliux's flyer :)
<cberl1> Hey folks!  Good news!  Edgy wasn't giving me "kernel panic" for no reason (not that I didn't think there would be a logical reason).  I had a bad 2nd cpu.  Replacing it seems to have done the trick in fixing my server.  I'll monitor for a bit and make sure this is it, but looks good so far!
<cberl1> stgraber: Thanks for your assistance on this one!  By knowing it was a hard crash, I narrowed it down to a few key elements and just replaced them one by one.
<stgraber> oh, a CPU, you are really unlucky ...
<stgraber> and your system worked with a defect 2nd CPU ? :)
<cberl1> stgraber: Well, I guess when you're recycling servers that have been in service for a few years, ya take a few chances....  On the bright side, we're servicing a classroom of 30 for under $2000.
<cberl1> ...and yes, system worked.  Until it got busy, apparently...!
<cberl1> stgraber: Still testing to verify the cause, but the system has been up all day now, unlike yesterday.
<stgraber> Oh 30 clients on a single server, you must have a huge amount of ram for that
<stgraber> well, I'm happy that you have found the problem, there's nothing worse than having a problem that can happen again at any time and you don't know what it's
<cberl1> 3GB, although it rarely tips over 1.5 GB, so far.  With the big apps running -- Firefox (with java going) and OpenOffice.
<cberl1> The dual CPUs definitely have an impact in this configuration -- only 1GHz CPUs, but when working together you wouldn't know it.
<stgraber> the recommended memory for edubuntu is actually of 150MB minimum per client, maybe this number will have to be reviewed (or the 150MB where for desktop+openoffice :))
<stgraber> s/where/were
<stgraber> Actually the best for the big networks is I think the Xeon dual core, I had once to manage one of them, it's really impressive
<stgraber> (it was a server with two Xeon Dual-Core 3.2Ghz) :)
<stgraber> but I wouldn't like to have to buy one of them :)
<cberl1> I used the estimates from the LTSP project for number of clients (which I suppose is irrelevant since max. memory on the servers I have access to is 4GB), which suggest only 64MB/client.  From what I see, this actually seems apropos.
<LaserJock> I think it really depends on the apps the clients are running
<cberl1> Oh, and a side note:  it never touches swap (unless I'm running something to really stress out the server.
<LaserJock> how many clients are active at a given time?
<cberl1> LaserJock: True.  But one girl in the class had over 32 instances of Firefox open and was still clicking when memory finally hit about 3GB.
<cberl1> LaserJock: That's the thing:  "active" is a relative term.  All 30, but they use the web a lot, so really there's a lot of "waiting" time.
<cberl1> (for the cpus, not the users)
<LaserJock> interesting
<LaserJock> what grade level is this?
<cberl1> 11-12 (dropouts, actually), leading to college level.
<cberl1> It's part of a student recovery program.
<LaserJock> do you have an idea of what apps they use?
<cberl1> I'll be trying to track that next (now that the server is up consistently).  Primarily, web, word processing, spreadsheets and math programs.  Found a nice online graphing calculator the teacher is interested in.  Also, one or two students need accessibility options -- screen magnifier, etc.
<LaserJock> do you know what kind of math programs by chance?
<cberl1> Not off hand
<cberl1> They'd *like* to use WordPerfect, too, if they could -- any suggestions?  :)
<LaserJock> yikes
<LaserJock> convince them to use OpenOffice? ;-)
<cberl1> Rest of our school board uses it, so compatibility is a bit of an issue.  So far, they are using OO, though.
<stgraber> I know that WordPerfect 8 was ported to Linux (but non-free of course)
<cberl1> stgraber: Did you ever see that beast?
<cberl1> stgraber: There is a freely downloadable version, but....<shiver>...I won't go there!
<stgraber> the only way to have it working on Linux is to use wine to emulate the Windows version but I wouldn't recommend it in an LTSP environment (I had some problem with Wine and some Math softwares)
<stgraber> cberl1: What version are you using on Windows ?
<lemurfan> I've been told that my source list could be out of date i'm wandering if anyone couls send me there list if you know it the up to date one please
<cberl1> stgraber: Funny you mention:  on another server I have, I'm using wine, and I hate the security aspects of that...  But it works well!
<cberl1> stgraber: WP12
<lemurfan> I've been told that my source list could be out of date i'm wandering if anyone couls send me there list if you know it the up to date one please
<cberl1> lemurfan: Only need to ask once.  Did you check the website?
<lemurfan> Which website
<cberl1> Ubuntu's, I presume that's what you're using?
<lemurfan> Theres nothing on there
<cberl1> lemurfan: when did you install?
<lemurfan> I installed edubuntu 6.06 last weekend
<cberl1> Then your sources list is probably up to date.
<lemurfan> oh right
<cberl1> You can fire up the Update Manager and force it to check for updates, if you are curious.
<lemurfan> Could you tell me how to get frozen bubble
<cberl1> !frozenbubble
<ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about frozenbubble - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
<LaserJock> !info frozenbubble
<ubotu> Package frozenbubble does not exist in edgy, edgy-seveas
<stgraber> !info frozen-bubble
<ubotu> frozen-bubble: Pop out the bubbles !. In component universe, is extra. Version 1.0.0-6ubuntu1 (edgy), package size 72 kB, installed size 356 kB
<LaserJock> lol
<cberl1> LaserJock: Okay, so it's in the universe, right?
<LaserJock> lemurfan: you need to enable the Universe repository first
<lemurfan> <ubotu> how do i get it
<cberl1> lemurfan: enable the universe and use your Add/Remove to instal it.
<lemurfan> is it on the list
<stgraber> cberl1: http://www.tldp.org/FAQ/WordPerfect-Linux-FAQ/downloadwp8.html It's about WP8 on Linux, for WP12 you would have to use wine (and add some RAM :))
<LaserJock> lemurfan: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Repositories/Ubuntu
<stgraber> cberl1: but I doubt WP8 is able to read correctly WP12 file format (if they didn't change it they at least introduced some new things)
<cberl1> stgraber: Yeah, think I've done that one once or twice.  Very old stuff, so you have to mess with libraries and such.  Not what I want my users to go through.
<cberl1> stgraber: Actually, WP is good that way, not much changes.  But all the same, I'll stick with OO as long as I can get away with it!
<cberl1> lemurfan: do you know how to enable the "universe" repository?
<lemurfan> no
<stgraber> cberl1: Can they correctly open a WP12 document with OOo ? Last time I had to open a WP document it was from a WP8 computer
<cberl1> stgraber: It does an okay job.  Graphics generally get lost, though.
<cberl1> So I tell them to save as doc to get their stuff onto the terminal server
<cberl1> That works pretty well.
<stgraber> lemurfan: Go to the System menu, then Administration, then you should have something like "Software sources" (that's for Edgy, I can't remember the name for Dapper)
<lemurfan> ok
<cbx33> hey Burgwork
<cbx33> awesome willvdl
<cberl1> lemurfan: this may help:  http://ubuntuguide.org/wiki/Dapper
<cberl1> Hey, that's the first time I've popped into that utility -- that's a nice improvement!  Looks very simple!
* cberl1 tends to "vi /etc/apt/sources.list"...
* mode/#edubuntu [+o Seveas]  by ChanServ
* mode/#edubuntu [+b *!*@cpc1-cosh6-0-0-cust948.cos2.cable.ntl.com]  by Seveas
<cberl1> Well, no more lemurfan....
<stgraber> :)
<cberl1> Well, suppose I should get back to work.  Thanks again for the help!
<rippawalle1> is edubuntu educational
<rippawalle1> and does it pwn
<LaserJock> yes, and yes
<rippawalle1> zh0mfg
<rippawalle1> more than xubuntu
<rippawalle1> D:
<LaserJock> they are different
<rippawalle1> yar
<rippawalle1> let me ask something
<rippawalle1> what makes edubuntu educational
<rippawalle1> i havent used it
<rippawalle1> so am curious
<LaserJock> it's got some educational programs
<rippawalle1> cool
<rippawalle1> i wish my school use it
<rippawalle1> we have wind0ez 98
<rippawalle1> :D
<LaserJock> and it has an LTSP server setup
<LaserJock> so you can make a thin client computer lab
<rippawalle1> =0
<rippawalle1> :
<rippawalle1> :(
<rippawalle1> my skool sux0rs
<rippawalle1> lol
* rippawalle1 backflips
<rippawalle1> wtf
<rippawalle1> rippawalletl
<rippawalle1> rippawallet1
<rippawalle1> hmm
<rippawalle1> stange
<rippawalle1> lol
<rippawalle1> D:
<willvdl> ritalin
<willvdl> less sugar
* mode/#edubuntu [-o Seveas]  by ChanServ
<ajmitch> heh
<cbx33> heheh
<hj> rippawalle1: check this link maybe we can help http://hj.nmty.org/ukini/
<willvdl> night all
#edubuntu 2007-02-09
<RichEd> greetz edubuntoo's
<RichEd> highvoltage: ping
<highvoltage> RichEd: pong
<highvoltage> greetingz
<LaserJock> morning South Africaners
<LaserJock> hmm, don't think that's right
<highvoltage> heh, probably "South Africans"
<highvoltage> hi Americano
<highvoltage> :p
<LaserJock> :-)
<jsgotangco> hey you western people
<LaserJock> hmm, I think I'm more eastern for you ;-)
<jsgotangco> really now
<jsgotangco> not like the "far east"
<jsgotangco> hehe
<jsgotangco> or the oriental east
<RichEd> LaserJock: right (almost in 2 languages) South Africans = correct for the english folk
<RichEd> Suid Afrikaners for the Afrikaans folk
<LaserJock> ahh, I was just mixing up my Afrikaans ;-)
<jsgotangco> suid eh?
<jsgotangco> like sticky bits in a directory
<RichEd> suid = bastardised zuid = south in german
<LaserJock> all these languages
<LaserJock> poor Americans just can't keep up
<LaserJock> ;-)
<RichEd> LaserJock: most of them still can't speak english ... sox. eeze donout
* RichEd rolls his eyes
<RichEd> *donut doh
<LaserJock> some do better than others for sure
<LaserJock> I have a goal of learning 1 other language before I die
<highvoltage> LaserJock: what else do they speak close to you? I would guess Spanish?
<LaserJock> yes
<LaserJock> lots and lots of spanish
<cafuego_> RichEd: Dutch, not german.
<RichEd> cafuego_: afrikaans originated as a "kitchen language" a mix of english, dutch, german and local "native" languages ... i mix up the exact root language some times :)
<cafuego_> RichEd: <heh>
<cafuego_> I can't let you give my pretty dutch words to those bastard germans.
<LaserJock> lol
<RichEd> cafuego_: now let's not be nasty
<cafuego_> I have to, we get taught in school <heh>
<RichEd> show a little love for your EU neighbours ... you can do it ... imagine if *they* were allowed to blame their actions on what they were taught.
* LaserJock gives EU a hug
<highvoltage> LaserJock: you are so not what we are taught to expect from a typical american stereotype :)
* highvoltage gives LaserJock a hug
<LaserJock> heh
<highvoltage> /clear !!!
<highvoltage> :)
<LaserJock> I feel better about IRC hugs from people I haven't slept in the same room with ;-)
<highvoltage> I think as long as both of us agree that the hugs should stay in IRC, it's fine
<LaserJock> agreed
<highvoltage> deal!
* RichEd suspects some latency here ... and I'm not talking about lag ;)
<RichEd> (joke)
<cafuego_> RichEd: Oh, we love the belgians and french and english...
<RichEd> careful now ... my family name is Weideman ;)
<ajmitch> cafuego_: you're not biased towards the dutch, are you?
<anestis> hi there from Greece
<cafuego_> RichEd: Aha!
<cafuego_> RichEd: yes, I saw you wandering around at LCA.
<cafuego_> RichEd: Don't worry though, some of my best friends are german ;-)
<RichEd> Hello Anestis
<RichEd> anestis: did you get my email ? is the meeting confirmed for today ?
<anestis> i had a problem in email and didn't receive it
<anestis> but at least we can chat
<RichEd> good ... if we are talking about edulinux, then we can use the #edulinux channel
<anestis> did you see the message I send personaly to you ?
<LaserJock> is there a website for it?
<RichEd> antoniiou and adiba are in there now
<anestis> who is adiba?
<RichEd> LaserJock: just a web page for the moment
<RichEd> adiba = Adrian Banu
<anestis> ok
<anestis> i send a message to you, did you get it?
<RichEd> anestis: you can use this comman /join #edulinux or you can right click on the underlined #edulinux to join
<LaserJock> I keep finding some old project
<RichEd> anestis: no ...
<RichEd> check your FreeNode message window ... it may tell you that you are not registered
<anestis> then i'll check what is wrong
<anestis> till then i'll use this
<RichEd> if you want to send people private messages, you need to reguster your nickname
<anestis> ok
<RichEd> can you type /join #edulinux as the first letters on a new line and i will see you in there with the others
<anestis> RichEd did you received my pm
<RichEd> yes i see the window now ... going there
<RichEd> hi anestis
<RichEd> are you having problems ?
<RichEd> anestis: I lost my connection for a minute or two
<RichEd> see new messages in private window
<adamix> a question for ltsp guru: with last edubuntu updates did anyone know something about problems with usb pen on edubuntu client?
<RichEd> adamix: try on #lstp ... there is high edubuntu awareness there
<RichEd> also please ping ogra if you have a serious issue ... he'll want to know about it
<adamix> ok, thank you RichEd
<RichEd> :)
* RichEd - install & reboot ... back in 30
<highvoltage> anyone happen to know whether booting an nbi enabled kernel on a pxe machine is a bad idea?
<highvoltage> it seems that the dhcp trick in the default edubuntu makes the clients boot to an nbi kernel on some machines
<highvoltage> I couldn't see any strange results though
<ogra> highvoltage, i was pondering to switch to a single image, its like that since quite some time already ...
<ogra> since there seem to be no bad side effects we could save some space
<highvoltage> ogra: that's what I thought too. If the NBI image works well on both, then there's not much need for the pxe-only version
<highvoltage> ogra: I've only noticed it recently though :)
<ogra> it's like that in edgy
<highvoltage> aah, then it sounds about right
<ogra> should be a minor change to ltsp-update-kernels ... i'll put it on my todo
<highvoltage> kewl
<jsgotangco> highvoltage: you there?
<maccam94> anybody here, or just idlers?
<jsgotangco> no
<jsgotangco> im alive
<maccam94> i'm trying to plan an (ed)ubuntu deployment
<jsgotangco> ;)
<maccam94> sweet
<maccam94> ok, i'm working on a proposal at the moment for replacing 700 high school computers' xp installations with (ed)ubuntu
<maccam94> the computers are all networked, have 2ghz pentium 4's, 256mb of ram, and 40gb hd's
<maccam94> the configurations are essentially identical
<maccam94> what I want to accomplish with the new setup is network-wide logins, a networked /home directory, and have the computers only show nearby printers
<jsgotangco> hrmmmm
<jsgotangco> the guru isn't here
<maccam94> i want something kind of like ltsp i think, but i want the computers to be kind of "thick" clients
<maccam94> jsgotangco, who would the "guru" be, and when is he usually around?
<jsgotangco> you can ask ogra but he's probably busy at the momnet
<highvoltage> edubuntugirl: tell jsgotangco ping
<edubuntugirl> Righto, highvoltage!
<willvdl> highvoltage and edubuntugirl have a "special" relationship
<jsgotangco> yes!
<edubuntugirl> jsgotangco: by the way, highvoltage told me to tell you 'ping' 52 minutes and 50 seconds ago (on Fri Feb  9 15:47:37 2007)
<bddebian> Howdy
<icheyne> does edubuntu work fine on 384 MB of RAM?
<icheyne> 800MHz PIII
<wist_____> icheyne im using that much ram w/ PIII 500
<icheyne> cool
<icheyne> maybe I'll try it then
<wist_____> its not the fastest ...... but.. its not bad at all
<icheyne> the kids might prefer it
<icheyne> that's their machine
<icheyne> :)
<wist_____> well
<wist_____> i guess it will work just fine
<icheyne> wist_____, are you on edubuntu now?
<wist_____> yes
<wist_____> oops
<wist_____> wait
<icheyne> what does free -m say?
<wist_____> this machine here  is not edubunto
<wist_____> edubuntu is on my right , 2nd pc
<icheyne> oh right
<wist_____> :x
<icheyne> ah
<icheyne> thanks anyway
<icheyne> :)
<wist_____> im kindda new to it..
<wist_____> thats why i dont use it as main machine
<wist_____> yet ... :)
<icheyne> Linux or Edubuntu or both?
<icheyne> aha
<wist_____> new to edubuntu
<icheyne> oh ok
<icheyne> thx
<willvdl> icheyne, I have edgy at home on almost exactly your spec
<icheyne> I'd be interested to see what free -m says with a Firefox window open
<wist_____> lemme check then
<icheyne> wist_____, would be cool to see
<wist_____> hang on
<wist_____> http://rafb.net/p/3B1Qq565.html
<wist_____> icheyne .. for u
<icheyne> oh cool
<icheyne> wist_____, what did you have open? just Firefox?
<wist_____> just firefox yes
<wist_____> and a console window
<icheyne> awesome
<icheyne> that's plenty for me
<icheyne> :)
<icheyne> not too different to Xubuntu really
<icheyne> thanks mate
<wist_____> np
<icheyne> :D
<willvdl> folks, have a great weekend
<mathesis> edubuntu==ltsp?
<bdoin> mathesis: edubuntu includes ltsp
<juliux> mathesis, edubuntu is based on ubuntu and ltsp5 is included
<mathesis> bdoin: time left estimated install edubuntu?
<bdoin> I don't know, never installed it.
<juliux> around 25min on athlon xp 2400+ with 1gb ram
<mathesis> in celeron 2.8+1gb ram
<juliux> i think around 20min
<juliux> depends how fast you klick on the install dialog;)
<mathesis> where can i download image edubuntu finally?
<mathesis> what is the link edubuntu for download?
<juliux> http://releases.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/edgy/
<mathesis> edubuntu.org
<juliux> use the the live iso for a normal live system or a single system installtion the server on for a edubuntu server incl ltsp
<Kingskid> Hi everybody! Could I ask a favor? can somebody send me the text from the Edubuntu CD cover? I want to have it translated.
<mathesis> i need linl fast to download edubunto for server ltsp in the cyber
<mathesis> i need link fast to download edubunto for server ltsp in the cyber
<juliux> mathesis, use bittorrent
<mathesis> is fast bittoreent
<ogra> juliux, you surely dont click on any install dialog if you want ltsp :P
<juliux> ogra, i can also klick with my keyboard;)
<ogra> heh
<juliux> ogra, but you are right, it is not a typical klick;)
<juliux> ogra, did you creat https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/LTSPWiring ?
<ogra> the pics ?
<ogra> yes
<ogra> bu i dont have the xcf files anymore
<juliux> hmpf
<juliux> that was my next question;9
<ogra> i can search for them ... might e there is one left, but its in a resolution you can use for web only ...
<ogra> *might be
<ogra> it will have the size of a stamp if you want to print it or look horribly scaled
<juliux> ogra, can you pls mail me your post address
<ogra> sure
<juliux> thxs
<juliux> ogra, i/we want to make a nice din a 0 poster about edubuntu for expos
<bdoin> are some of you going to the fosdem?
<juliux> bdoin, i have no time:( my girlfriend booked a holiday in vienna
<ogra> bdoin, i'd love to, but i'm at a EU education conference :(( ...
<bdoin> ogra: very good what kind of conference?
<ogra> an internal project from the EU we lead, called edulinux ...
<mathesis> ogra: edubuntu have support local device acces?
<ogra> i think riched created a wikipage about it
<ogra> mathesis, yep
<bdoin> ogra: don't hesitate to contact us if there are talks about software for children
<mathesis> i have ltsp 4.2 with its problem http://pastebin.ca/346064
<bdoin> well, 'us' is GCompris.
<juliux> mathesis, ltsp 4.2 is not supportet in ubuntu
<ogra> bdoin, i would, but thats rather a work conference of the participating countries ... not a public one ...
<mathesis> I have 5 terminals with this error
<ogra> https://wiki.edubuntu.org/Edulinux
<ogra> mathesis, there are only two reasons that can cause this error, both are listed in the message
<mathesis>   implemented in they debian I now I will migrate to edubuntu
<mathesis> ogra: ubuntu have good suppor
<ogra> yup
<mathesis> where are you from ogra?
<ogra> germany
<cbx33> yo yo yo yo yo all
<LaserJock> hi Pete
<cbx33> hey LaserJock
#edubuntu 2007-02-10
* skirk Go to Sleep
* skirk Go to Sleep
<wist> hey guys, i just installed edubuntu recently, but there's no traceroute command do i need to install a specific package for that ?
<Laser_away> wist: yeah, traceroute
<wist> Laser_away i said that there is no traceroute command ...
<Laser_away> so install the traceroute package
<wist> is that the name ?
<Laser_away> yes
<wist> apt-get install traceroute
<wist> hmm
<wist> :\
<wist> working
<wist> :x   sorry and thanks.
<Laser_away> np
<wist> where can i see a list of available packages
<wist> apt-get <something> ?
<wist> can't find an option for that ..
<wist> (available for download, that is)
<hj> Hi guys, ... have any of you are using a learning management system ?
<m300107> Hello, anyone there? I'm trying to install a thin client with a minimal OS on its 3.2 GB disk so that I can boot over the network without needing a cdrom etc. Any ideas? Thanks
<highvoltage> m300107: you can use etherboot
<highvoltage> m300107: http://www.rom-o-matic.net
<m300107> Thanks I've got an etherboot cdrom but it doesnt seem to pick up my NIC. I'm trying to boot with helix to see the lspci card output for the NIC, but since I've got a small hard drive it might be simpler and quicker to boot up on that
<cliebow>  m300107:can you boot to ubuntu live cd/install cd and get a pci id?
<cliebow> or knoppix or mandrake move?
<m300107> <cliebow>:I'm trying to boot with my Helix CD right now, but am having problems with the boot parms because it's got almost NO memory
<cliebow> can you see the chip:get any info from it?
<cliebow> you/ll need prob 128 for ubuntu..i get by with 32 in ltsp-4.2
<cliebow> as far as a thin client is concerned
<m300107> I'm still trying to read the lspci output for the card by boot the machine up. But this is proving a big headache with 32M. Can you get this info straight off the card?
<cliebow> prob not..unless it is obvious..like rtl8139 or 3com
<m300107> Er netgear, not much information from their website either
<m300107> ahh at last, lspci output. The ethernet controller for the netgear card:
<cliebow> that is tough without the pci id..since some are via-rhine and some are other
<m300107> 0000:00:08.0 Ethernet controller: Realtek Semiconductor Co.,Ltd RTL-8139/8139C/8139C+ (rev 10)
<m300107> So I guess that's the code I need for the rom-o-matic thing
<cliebow> ok that is the slot
<cliebow> now lspci -n for the id
<cliebow> in thaT SLOT
<cliebow> prob ends with 8139
<cliebow> 10ec:8139?
<m300107> Ah, OK, looks like 10ec:8139
<m300107> good guess!
<cliebow> i use a lot of them..they tend to be very easy
<cliebow> you cana use whatever version you like but 5.0.11 has been rock solid for years
<cliebow> in etherboot
<m300107> Now off to Rom-o-matic again for the etherboot cd, because this disk is just too slow. my fingers were itching for a tuxracer thing for ages
<cliebow> heh..id be surprised if the cd doesnt have it..can you just boot from floppy?
<cliebow> for starters?
<m300107> none of my other machines have floppy, so it'd be a bit hard to transfer the image. this machine is wonderfullly built inside but just too old
<cliebow> ive neverused the cd...not a prom slot anywhere?
<cliebow> they do have a floppy controller ?
<cliebow> bbiab
<m300107> Hi got it to boot. Problem now is that my DHCP server is a OpenWRT Linksys with no space on it. The TS will have to be my Ubuntu 6.10 file server on 192.168.1.2. So I guess I'll have to tweak the rom-o-matic setting "DEFAULT_BOOTFILE" to point to 192.168.1.2. Where are the boot files kept? Which ports do I have to open in the firewall?
<m300107> I've installed the edubuntu-server package
<m300107> ... but I can't find any files under /opt/ - anyone know how to install them under Ubuntu 6.10
<bddebian> Heya
<cliebow>  m300107:you'd be better off to shut off dhcp in the router and run dhcp on the ts
<cliebow> m300107:apt-get install ltsp-server-standalone
<cliebow> that Will turn on dhcp in your ts.
<cliebow> best to hard code an address for your server nic
<m300107> [headache factor increasing by 10]  but the router is the only thing here that stays on all the time, and it gives DHCP address to other clients too.
<m300107> I guess I could use the TS to give out a different range within the same subnet mask. The router would still let them in, wouldn't it?
<m300107> hard-coding the server nic: those are the static_server_ip options in the ROM-O-Matic options, I guess.
<cliebow> you will not get a root-path from your router on second dhcp if you dont do something] ..i habvnt messed with those options..best not ot
<cliebow> you could put a second nic in..one for your clients on a seperate switch..one for your reg network
<cliebow> andf hard code the "internal" nic
<m300107> I've got the schooltool listening on 7080 on my TS
<m300107> second nic might be the thing, though
<cliebow> OR..[headache factor increasing]  you could use alternate port for your dhcp
<m300107> this is only  a home network, i can use a a range within the dhcp addresses from my router for the 1 or 2 thin clients.
<m300107> then the rom-o-matic settings include a STATIC_BOOTFILE setting which I could perhaps set to the TS. [hoping not to have to reset my dhcp / router settings] 
<cbx33> hey all
<cliebow> m300107:dang your nick is long.you cant use that dhcp to provide filename or root-path can you?
<cliebow> cbx33:howdy
<cbx33> hi cliebow
<m300107> cliebow you been whois me? this is my laptop. not the old piece of junk i want to give to my daughter on mon
<m300107> :-)
<cliebow> no i havnt but m3 etc etc is a little vgerbose 8~)
<cliebow> by the way ..i do givge typing lessons
<m300107> OK, I'm going to give up on my router settings and setup DHCP on the TS as you suggest
<cliebow> the big thing is what you are going to boot with...a floppy is easy..never tried alternate dhcp from a cd..
<cbx33> hmmm
<cliebow> m300107:ive always d/l ed etherboot source and changed dhcp call myself..never used the port 1067 provided by etherboot
<m300107> <cliebow>: which extra ports should I open on my server for the dhcp and terminal server?
<cliebow> you'll need 67/8 for dhcp 69 for tftp 2049 for nfs 6000 for x ssh on 22 if using edubuntu-ltsp
<m300107> cliebow: how do you change the dhcp call? I guess it is easier to alter a floppy, but which settings
<m300107> thx
<cliebow> ltsp-server-standalone does most for you...to change dhcp listening port in /etc/init.d/dhcp3-server add -p 1067 to the startup call..looki nwiki./.ltsp.org for dhcp alternate port
<cliebow> il be back in a bit
<m300107> have reconfigured the server for dhcp and installed the ltsp-server-standalone, found ltsp-build-client because there were no client images pre-installed. the
<m300107> will the  ltsp-build-client give me the images for the etherboot?
<cbx33> oooh mumma, phimage is looking nice now ;)
<m300107> what is phimage?
<cliebow>  no you will need your own etherboot..did you switch to port 1067?
<m300107> haven't got back to the client for all that excitement with LTSP installations and reconfig of DHCP
<m300107> bbia minute...
<cliebow> --exec /usr/sbin/dhcpd3 -- -q -p 1001 $INTERFACES -pf $D
<cliebow> line from dhcp3-server to use 1001
<m300108> thanks
<m300108> cliebow, can you repeat those lines again re dhcpd3, had to switch computer because the monsters wanted to watch a dvd.
<cbx33> <cliebow> --exec /usr/sbin/dhcpd3 -- -q -p 1001 $INTERFACES -pf $D
<cbx33> <cliebow> line from dhcp3-server to use 1001
<m300108> what was the line before --exec /usr/sbin/dhcpd3? Sorry, lost the context
<cbx33> <cliebow>  no you will need your own etherboot..did you switch to port 1067?
<m300108> no, haven't switched yet. Do I need an extra DHCP listener on that port?
<m300108> sorry for butting in cbx33 - lost the context
<cbx33> m300108, I'm pasting in all that cliebow sent to you
<m300108> Oh thanks cbx33
<cliebow> --exec /usr/sbin/dhcpd3 -- -q -p 1001 $INTERFACES -pf $D
<cliebow> just add -p 1067   or whatever..that is fgrom a working server
<m300108> I've got DHCP up and the client is looking for /ltsp/i386/nbi.img (am still booting from cdrom). the client-build prog installed a whole distro under /opt/ltsp/i386/
<m300108>  but no image file. I've got no floppy drive outside this ancient box w/ exception an old sun box here. How do I get the boot image?
<m300108> The /etc/ltsp/dhcp.conf points to an image file:
<m300108>  if substring( option vendor-class-identifier, 0, 9 ) = "PXEClient" {
<m300108>     filename "/ltsp/i386/pxelinux.0";
<m300108>   }
<m300108>   else{
<m300108>     filename "/ltsp/i386/nbi.img";
<m300108>   }
<m300108>   option root-path "/opt/ltsp/i386";
<m300108> }
<m300108> AH, the files seem to be in /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/ - let's see if I can link them in..
<m300108> Right, I never thought I'd get excited about seeing dots march across the screen, but this ancient box looks like it might be booting. It is _very_ slow though. Shouldn't it be fast on a server?
<m300108> the thing it is running on is amd64
<cliebow> takes my dots about 3/4 of a second
<m300108> hmm, may be a firewall issue then.
<cliebow> no your etherboot is still looking at port 67? and trying to get a filename from your router..
<cliebow> leem get the pice for you that gives the initramfs correct port to do second dhcp
<m300108> didn't alter the etherboot settings on either client or server
<m300108> my router doesn't have much space on it for image files.
<cliebow> it is not smart enough to give the filename statement anyway
<cliebow> option option-128 e4:45:74:68:00:00;
<cliebow> option option-129 "DPORT=1001";
<cliebow> that tells the initramfs that at second dhcp..looking for option root-path..to use port 1001
<m300108> are those lines in /etc/ltsp/dhcp.conf?
<cliebow> yes
<m300108> option option-128 e4:45:74:68:00:00; -is that MAC-address-specific?
<cliebow> No No
<cliebow> NOT a Mac address
<m300108> I put those lines in but a restart of /etc/init.d/dhcp3-server restart caused errors: dhcpd self-test failed. Please fix the config file.
<cliebow> it looks like only later versions than 5.0.11 will let yo change alternate dhcp port (from the website).it can be done manually using source code
<cliebow> prob left out a semicolon
<cliebow> those lines taken from a working server...
<m300108> Lines:  option option-128 e4:45:74:68:00:00;
<m300108>   option option-129 "DPORT=1001";
<m300108> sorry bbiab
<cliebow> i gotta run too..bbl
<m300108> OK, my installation hadn't booted TFTPd, now I've kickstarted that on port 69 UDP and it started to boot up fine. :-).
<m300108> But then, there was a boot message: "Target filesystem doesn't have /sbin/init" on the client, and it drops me into some busybox shell. (The client-build command installed a Debian / Ubuntu system. "/bin/sh: can't access tty; job control turned off"
<cliebow>  you didnt mix ltsp4.2 and 5?
<cliebow> i have to run.bbl
<m300108> Hi folks
<m300108> it seems to work now. I copied my /etc/passwd group and shadow over to the /opt/ltsp/i386/etc/ but can't log in
<m300108> But I guess I'll get by with a bit of tweaking now. The screen resolution is rather poor. Is this due to the local graphics card? I was hoping this'd be at least partly handled by the TS
<m300108> have to go, thanks cliebow
<LaserJock> hi cbx33
<pete_> evenin all
<cbx33> evenin LaserJock
<tsmithe> !info linux-lowlatency feisty | cbx33
<ubotu> cbx33: linux-lowlatency: Complete low latency Linux kernel. In component multiverse, is optional. Version 2.6.20.6.1 (feisty), package size 23 kB, installed size 52 kB
<cbx33> thanks tsmithe
<cbx33> didn't know you hung out in here too
<cbx33> how much work would it be to install it on edgy?
<tsmithe> dunno
<tsmithe> prevu?
<tsmithe> and i don't hang here. just saw you were, and knew that it was a channel with ubotu and thought i'd point it out
<cbx33> heh
<cbx33> thanks tsmithe
<tsmithe> :)
#edubuntu 2007-02-11
<tsmithe> !prevu | cbx33
<ubotu> cbx33: prevu is an automated, personal backporting utility. Check out https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Prevu for more details
<mathesis> i need a repository for java
<LaserJock> the JVM?
<LaserJock> from Sun?
<mathesis> sun
<mathesis> java to install limewire
<LaserJock> it's in Multiverse
<mathesis> the gtk-gnutella and limewire is on the equal network
<mzuverink> anyone have a en to es kvoctrain filelaying around?  All the kde stuff is european in nature
<mathesis>  hi
<mathesis> edubuntu include support for local device,memory usb,cd rom,disket?
<LaserJock> yes
<mathesis> LaserJock, how can config local device
<LaserJock> I'm not sure
<LaserJock> I doesn't just work?
<mathesis> se ogra i have include option to sound and LDA in terminal1 ... terminal N?
<ut4r82> ut4r82 join this group
<juliux> !ask
<ubotu> Don't ask to ask a question. Just ask your question :)
<ut4r82> ut4r82 join this group
<ut4r82> please help me I found many error in my edubuntu 6.10 eddgy
<ut4r82> who can help me right now
<ut4r82> I need your help as soon as possible
<juliux> !ask | ut4r82
<ubotu> ut4r82: Don't ask to ask a question. Just ask your question :)
<ut4r82> this my problem : starting up...[17179570. 788000]  PCI :cannot allocate resource region 3 of device 0000:00.0
<ut4r82> like that my computer error can be GUI please help me now
<ut4r82> I need your help
<salotti> hi... I have a problem with a repositories.. that won let me do nothing on my system.... Err http://br.archive.ubuntu.com edgy Release.gpg    .. there is another mirorr ?
<highvoltage> salotti: you can just take away the br.
<highvoltage> salotti: otherwise you can ask in #ubuntu-mirror
<salotti> highvoltage: hehe.. makes sense... stupid I
<salotti> gonna find where to change it .....
<barktpolar> Hello, I'm trying to configure sound, can alsaconf be downloaded and installed without any other files needed or do I need to download some others
<bddebian> Heya
<juliux> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Hello juliux
<mathesis> hi ogra
<mathesis>  /j #ubuntu-es
<mathesis> hi
#edubuntu 2008-02-04
<markvandenborre> this might be interesting for people who have problem keeping the load on an ltsp server down
<markvandenborre> I put it into root's crontab at a school, seems to help a _lot_
 * dtrask is a little nervous about Super Bowl right now....lives in New England
<pygi> shouldnt you be sleeping :p
<dtrask> at 9:55?
<dtrask> little early  ;-)
<pygi> dtrask, ehm!
<pygi> sorry, missed timezones :P
<pygi> it's 3:55AM :P
<pygi> hello PriceChild
<PriceChild> Hey there pygi.
<Tux_help> Hello, is there where I might ask for some Ubuntu installation help?
<TelnetManta> Is this chan still alive?
<johnny> obviously.. look at all the people :)
#edubuntu 2008-02-05
<texastwister> I'm having problems getting LTSP clients to start a gnome session.  Gnome runs fine at the server.  The LTSP client boots properly and presents a login screen. When I login, I see "verifying password" and the screen flashes as it attempts to launch Xwindows, then it puts me back at the login screen.  This is edubuntu 7.10 i686.
<texastwister> Using "Failsafe xterm" works fine.
<texastwister> And from the xterm, I can even execute "gnome-session" and get to the gnome desktop.  I just can't log directly in that way.
<texastwister> Any ideas?
<texastwister> I'm not sure where to look for relevant log messages.
<texastwister> Well I've made some headway... but have some lingering problems.  I removed Sabayon and  updated the LTSP image and now I can logn to gnome from  the LTSP clients.  But apparently some profile settings are broken.  I get some error messages on first login of every new user. and on one account the default background  is replaces with black and there are no desktop icons.  On another account the default background  is chan
<slee> Hi is anyone here using edubuntu in a UK school?
<nblracer2> netsplit over
<nblracer> hey im lloking for a guide/turtoral/help on setting up a small network with 5 or so computers, with something simmilar to roming profiles, So any one can login into any of the computers and it would sync up with other computers and/or a server with all there personal data and settings.
<nblracer> not to spam it over two channels
<nblracer> but they said you might be better in this area
<nblracer> any one?
<TelnetManta> Is this channel even alive anymore?
<TelnetManta> It used to be very busy in here, I hope that the project hasnt lost support
<nblracer> i agree
<stgraber> RichEd: Is tomorrow meeting an early or a late meeting ? (looks like the fridge is once again out of sync :))
<TelnetManta> does Ogra still frequent this chan?
<johnny> TelnetManta, yes he does
<johnny> he prolly can't hang out and idle as often cuz everybody always mentions his name and makes his client bug him all the time :)
<johnny> i've had to leave some channels because of that
<TelnetManta> thanks
<TelnetManta> I knew I havent seen him in a while
<stgraber> ogra: Do you know of someone who could give me a hand with a QT bug ? (the italc demo stuff, upstream telling me that this bug is kind of ubuntu specific ...)
#edubuntu 2008-02-06
<humbolto> somebody still awake?
<humbolto> I have some weird problem with my ltsp server
<humbolto> I just upgraded from edgy to gutsy and now, when my clients boot, they get stuck after tftp has transfered the kernel image.
<humbolto> the thing stops for 5 minutes or so and the everything goes on normally.
<nixternal> RichEd: I need to have some IRC time privately with you and ogra when you both get some time to sit down..concerning Edubuntu chapter of the book..just have a few questions on some things before I rock it out this week
<humbolto> Hey, I got a little problem here with LTSP gutsy/hardy.
<humbolto> On some clients the boot process freezes for about 5 minutes right after tftp kernel download is finished.
<humbolto> I had this working once tonight, but I don't know what killed it again.
<humbolto> Does anybody have any idea?
<humbolto> Some hint?
<kgoetz> is it a server or client side issue?
<humbolto> well, I have no idea!
<humbolto> It might be a config issue.
<humbolto> I am wondering if I might have put something wrong in dhcpd.conf.
<humbolto> I tried so many things, but could not figure out what triggers this.
<humbolto> Seems like the machines with the boot ROMs have problems, while the one with the bootdisk seems fine.
<RichEd> nixternal: sure ... we have the late edubuntu meeting tonight 20h00 UTC so ogra & i should be around when you wake up
<stgraber> ogra: ping
<ogra> stgraber, pong
<stgraber> ogra: Who can I ping about a QT issue ? (italc of course)
<stgraber> our remaining bug which causes the demo mode to fail seems to be a QImage bug and not an iTalc one (at least it's upstream's opinion)
<ogra> ask riddell
<stgraber> "[unknown] ASSERT: "i >= 0 && i < height()" in file image/qimage.cpp, line 1712" is the thing
<stgraber> with an interesting backtrace ... http://paste.stgraber.org/141
<stgraber> ogra: that looks like an evil bug, even Riddell doesn't know how to fix it (or workaround a QT bug)
<stgraber> ogra: I'll ask #kde-devel
<ogra> and file it upstream probably ?
<ogra> not all QT devs might be on IRC ;)
<stgraber> yes, well I need a quick fix for it (or at least a workaround), FF is next week ...
<ogra> right
<ogra> how important would you consider the demo mode ?
<ogra> i mean, could we just drop the UI stuff for it for this release without loosing to much functionallity ?
<stgraber> I think in order of importance here it's : Overview, Control, Demo, Lock
<ogra> demo is share teadchers desktop with the students, right ?
<stgraber> everything else works fine so I certainly just can disable the demo mode but it's a regression from what we had in tcm
<stgraber> yes
<ogra> hmm and te demo mode was actually the only vnc related thing that worked without probs :/
<ogra> (in TCM)
<stgraber> asking in QT devel chan at the moment (as it's not really related to KDE)
<ogra> indeed
<stgraber> They don't seem to have an idea of what is this bug (they are thinking of an application bug ...), I'm downloading QT's source code to check what there are at that 1712th line in qimage.cpp
<nblracer> hello
<RichEd> nblracer: was it you asking about guidance on a roaming network setup yesterday ?
<nblracer> yes
<RichEd> well ask again now ... there are people around who could give you some pointers
<nblracer> im looking though the cook book now
<RichEd> ah ... i'll also send you a mail extract from a teacher in the US who has a mac/edubuntu/win mix & match environment
<RichEd> with roaming students
<nblracer> but a little heads up im not planning to use edubuntu, on any of the clients or the server
<RichEd> np ... just the ideas he uses for profile and office setup
<nblracer> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/EdubuntuDocumentation/EdubuntuCookbook/Networking
<nblracer> "In the thin-client configuration...."
<nblracer> that not what i want
<nblracer> ekks that is almosty scary, how slow that will be
<nblracer> I'm looking for a more sync system
<nblracer> i wish i had what i said yesterday, i worded well
<RichEd> ogra & stgraber : where are the channel logs located ? nblracer wants to peek back into yesterday
<stgraber> !logs
<ubotu> Channel logs can be found at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/ - Logs for LoCo channels are at http://logs.ubuntu-eu.org/freenode/ - See also Â« /msg ubotu ircstats Â»
<nblracer> http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2008/02/05/
<nblracer> bah beet me to it
<nblracer> google knows all
<nblracer> hey im looking for a guide/turtoral/help on setting up a small network with 5 or so computers, with something simmilar to roming profiles, So any one can login into any of the computers and it would sync up with other computers and/or a server with all there personal data and settings.
<nblracer> :P
<markvandenborre> anyone with an idea of the performance of rdp from a bunch of pxe edubuntu clients?
<markvandenborre> the thin client server is not too powerful, but if I'm not mistaken this one wouldn't be doing a lot of work, right?
<markvandenborre> please ask if my question is not clear
<yotux> I am coming from ubuntu and I have old user accounts that I still want to use
<yotux> I can not log into x it says there an issue with xinit or something anyone offer advice
<stgraber> markvandenborre: by rdp you mean the remote desktop protocol ? (rdp5 and rdesktop as client) ?
<markvandenborre> yes
<stgraber> you can install rdesktop in the chroot and then have it running on the thin client
<stgraber> or do you also need a gnome session for normal use ?
<markvandenborre> stgraber: might be the case, yes
<stgraber> ok, so rdesktop itself doesn't eat much CPU
<markvandenborre> is there some prepackaged rdp client setup?
<markvandenborre> it's more the network that I'm scared of
<stgraber> aptitude install rdesktop and then just write a small shell script
<stgraber> RDP works fine on 56k with the right settings
<markvandenborre> oh
<stgraber> so you won't kill your network with it
<markvandenborre> right... that would be a good solution
<markvandenborre> btw: this is not for me, haven't touched windows in years
<markvandenborre> I'm just selling an old server I had laying around on ebay
<markvandenborre> together with some recycled clients
<stgraber> even with -x LAN (32bit + background + all the effects) it works fine with ~20 clients on a 100Mb/s link
<markvandenborre> in the hope that someone might pick it up
<markvandenborre> and start experimenting
<markvandenborre> now someone's interested, and he asks if he can also do rdp
<markvandenborre> so you've been a great help
<yotux> can anyone offer advise on how to import users from  install into edubuntu
<markvandenborre> yotux: you had users on an old machine?
<markvandenborre> and now you want to migrate them to a new one?
<yotux> I was running ubuntu 7.10 this morning
<yotux> I am now running edubutnu 7.10
<markvandenborre> ok
<yotux> I get xsession errors
<markvandenborre> on a single desktop?
<yotux> I have setup my house with ltsp this morning
<yotux> I can't log-in on the server and I can not login on a thin client
<yotux> here is the error message http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/54987/
<yotux> I'm not new to linux but I am not at the level of debugging :(
<yotux> I have emails and other docs that I do not want to loose
<yotux> I thought that I could just use my old home partition without any problems I see that I am wrong :(
<markvandenborre> yotux: sorry, have to go
<yotux> ok
<juliux> ogra, ping
<juliux> ogra, did you heared something from openthinclient.org?
<humbolto> does anybody know what could cause my terminals to stop booting for about 5 minutes right after tftp has finished downloading the boot image? after all the .......
<RichEd> ogra: ^ from above
<RichEd> <humbolto> does anybody know what could cause my terminals to stop booting for about 5 minutes right after tftp has finished downloading the boot image? after all the .......
<RichEd> humbolto: also ask in #ltsp ...
<humbolto> RichEd: Well, they used to boot with no problems in Ubuntu LTSP Edgy. But now I have this problem. Therefore, this is a regression caused by Ubuntu, so I have to ask here.
<humbolto> RichEd: My guess is, that maybe the boot ROM I was using with Edgy LTSP might not be 100% compatible with the boot image format in Gutsy. What do you guys think?
<RichEd> humbolto: sure ... happy with that logic ... s'just that our LTSP is the latest version from the core ltsp team who hang out in #ltsp
<RichEd> ogra could help you here, but he is probably taking a break before our late night meeting
<RichEd> but jammcq or sbalneaves or vagrant may be in #ltsp on US time and more alert there
<ogra_cmpc> humbolto: thats an upgraded system ? or a fresh install ?
 * RichEd realises he used ogra's usual nick and not his current one ... 
<humbolto> ogra_cmpc: Upgrade, while the ltsp-client environment was built from scratch.
<ogra_cmpc> so you went edgy->feisty->gutsy as noted in the upgrade notes ?
<humbolto> ogra_cmpc: Everything else seems quite fine. And the systems that boot from a floppy do not show this delay.
<humbolto> ogra_cmpc: edgy -> feisty -> gutsy yes.
<ogra_cmpc> what kind of image is that ? rom-o-matic or something special ?
<humbolto> ogra_cmpc: tried a gutsy and a hardy client environment, both showed the same result
<humbolto> rom-o-matic
<ogra_cmpc> if you use rom-o-matic ones i'd suggest using the pxe emulation mode they include
<humbolto> ogra_cmpc: Which means the boot from the ROM a PXE loader?
<ogra_cmpc> right, the etherboot rom behaves like a pxe client
<humbolto> so that would be the .zpxe image then?
<ogra_cmpc> there is a checkbox for pxe emu in the rom-o-matic settings no idea if that has a special extension in the end
<humbolto> ok. I got this on #ltsp: i think it switched from using mkelf-linux to mkelfimage for the network bootable images
<humbolto> and that: well, ltsp5 hasn't ever used mknbi, so i don't think that's your problem. but the switch from mkelf-linux to mkelfimage *might* be your problem. i don't know when that happened in ubuntu
<humbolto> any comments?
<humbolto> I regularly search the web for documents on the current LTSP design in Ubuntu. I never found anything explaining the latest architectural decisions.
<humbolto> Is there a wiki page somewhere?
<humbolto> There must be some document, some place you use to coordinate yourself.
<ogra_cmpc> the best doc source on ltsp5 is teh edubuntu handbook atm installed on everz edubuntu system
<humbolto> ogra_cmpc: Saw the online version. Addresses Users but does not help much when troubleshooting a layer deeper. Things like nbd-server are not even mentioned there.
<ogra_cmpc> hmm i thought there is a whole section ...
<ogra_cmpc> the online version was onlz recentlz brought up to date
<humbolto> ogra_cmpc: OK, I'll check the offline version.
<laga> ogra_cmpc: saw the mythbuntu plugin? ;)
<ogra_cmpc> laga: yes, there were some changes i wanted to suggest but i have no working browser around atm
<ogra_cmpc> (very limited env here atm)
<laga> ogra_cmpc: any suggestions are appreciated, thanks
<ogra_cmpc> laga: i'll make some comments on the bug tomorrow
<laga> ogra_cmpc: take your time. i won't have time to make any changes till the end of the month unfortunately
<ogra_cmpc> ok, but note that feature freeze is on valentine ... and ltsp is in main
<laga> ogra_cmpc: hum. i've already got my mythbuntu-diskless package again so i could just slip my files in via an update. i'll try to make those changes you suggested before valentine's, though
<RichEd> === edubuntu meeting in #ubuntu-meeting = 8 mins
<humbolto> RichEd: Will the chat protocol of this meeting be available somewhere?
<RichEd> humbolto: "chat protocol" ... you mean like rules about how we discuss things ?
<humbolto> RichEd: no, log.
<ogra_cmpc> humbolto: all ubuntu channels are logged on irclogs.ubuntu.com but feel free to attend its an open meeting :)
<humbolto> ogra_cmpc: Great.
<ogra_cmpc> juliux: nobody contacted me from there afair
<juliux> ogra_cmpc, i read that they use ubuntu so i think there was some communication
<ogra_cmpc> nope
<ogra_cmpc> great they use ubuntu though :)
<Pascal_1> hello,
<Pascal_1> i've got already a samba server and a ldap server, then my windows client can connect on the pdc with an ldap autentication.
<Pascal_1> My question is : is it possible to make it works same way for thin client with edubuntu ?
<Pascal_1> i mean when thin client connect on edubuntu server, is it possible that the authentication based on samba ??
<RichEd> Pascal_1: we're mostly in the meeting now
<RichEd> wait for ogra / ogra_cmpc later ... around 2 hours
<Pascal_1> what do you mean ? my english is not really good      :-'
<Pascal_1> ok
<RichEd> Pascal_1: = edubuntu meeting in #ubuntu-meeting <- we are all in there
<stgraber> Pascal_1: you can use LDAP login on your edubuntu server
<Pascal_1> but this is not the place for that kind of question no ??
<stgraber> Pascal_1: you can read abut it in Ubuntu's wiki (I can give you an URL after the meeting) or maybe even in ubuntu-fr's wiki
<Pascal_1> stgraber: i would like to make it works as  with my windows client
<Pascal_1> yes if you can url interst me
<stgraber> Pascal_1: http://doc.ubuntu-fr.org/ldap_client
<Pascal_1> thanks a lot stgraber
<stgraber> np
<Pascal_1> RichEd:  as i dont want disturb meeting on the other channel what do you mean with : f.y.i. meeting format is 1st session : tech (mostly related to development)
<RichEd> we discuss issues related to development and the next release
<johnny> he's saying answers are going to be slower in here during the meeting i think
<RichEd> so programming work / progress / issues & artwork & CD structure etc.
<RichEd> so as johnny comments, the tech people will be busy focussing on that discussion more than on questions here
<RichEd> ( for a while - like 1- 2 hours )
<RichEd> hey pygi ... we're in da meetin
<pygi> hello RichEd
<Pascal_1> RichEd: i understood that it's for that reason i didnt say anything on this chan ;-)
<Pascal_1> stgraber: i found that also : http://www.gesnel.fr/ubuntu/2007/05/30/integration-de-clients-ubuntu-dans-un-reseau-avec-ldap/
<stgraber> Pascal_1: ok, this one is a bit more complete as it also describes the way you can have network drives auto-mounted using libpam-mount
<Pascal_1> yes !!!   great !!!
<Pascal_1> thanks again all for your help bye
<johnny> nixternal, where are you?
<nixternal> Chicago, but I am probably moving back to MD in the next few months
<nixternal> I have a house in southern MD
<johnny> where in southern md?
<nixternal> Lexington Park area
<nixternal> down by the base
<nixternal> I was stationed at Patuxent River for a couple of years...my x-wife and daughter live there still
<johnny> lexington park is a city?
<nixternal> heh, barely, but ya
<nixternal> Lexington Park, Ridge, California, Hollywood, Leonardtown...all in St. Mary's County
<johnny> too far :(
<nixternal> you up by bmore?
<johnny> in bmore
<johnny> as of june
<nixternal> cool...my cousin just moved back there as well...I am probably going to actually move somewhere around DC unless I take a job on the base down by my x and daughter
<highvoltage> ogra_cmpc: which challenge?
<ogra_cmpc> two meetings in one room at the same time :)
<juliux> i have something from the marketing front;) 300 edubuntu coffee mugs are ordered
<juliux> and i am still waiting to get edubuntu flyers from RichEd
<highvoltage> juliux: \o/
<RichEd> juliux: let's just make sure that nixternal covered what he needed ... rich ?
<highvoltage> RichEd: btw, been meaning to ask you, are you part of our loco-tem yet?
<johnny> ogra so what's the current status of ltsp in hardy?
<johnny> vagrantc fixed autologin and added an optional guest login option to go along with it
<ogra_cmpc> didnt change much ... apart from my local install
<johnny> which is pretty cool..
<ogra_cmpc> right
<RichEd> highvoltage: i been avoiding getting sucked in locally :) so not yet no
<ogra_cmpc> i'll pull the most recent upstream code next week, that has vagrants fixes
<ogra_cmpc> well, actually francis' fixes
<highvoltage> RichEd: ok, prepared to be sucked it soon :)
<highvoltage> *prepare
<highvoltage> man I need sleep
<RichEd> *in
<highvoltage> yes, that too :)
<RichEd> === sorry quick comment regarding the naming discussion ===
<ogra_cmpc> johnny: as i said in the tech section before i'm mainly focused to get consolekit working, else we can dump ltsp
<RichEd> there is no intention for unilateral action about dropping the name edubuntu ...
<johnny> i wasn't in there at that point
<ogra_cmpc> ah
<RichEd> we'll keep chatting about it, and will schedule a session for UDS to discuss the new add-on structure and any implications
<johnny> guess i'l have to go read logs at some point
<RichEd> part of the reason for adding "ubuntu education edition" into the name is that there are hundreds of computer manufacturers or system builders who are all wanting to pre-install unbuntu
<highvoltage> ubuntu- that sounds like a cool name actually.
<highvoltage> (unbuntu, even)
<RichEd> not all of them - especially the foreign language companies - make it all the way in their "research" to get to edubujtu and understand it
<RichEd> *edubuntu
<RichEd> i.e. what it offers them and their clients
<RichEd> but if we introduce the concept of "do you want an education edition of Ubuntu" then it is very simple and clear to them
<RichEd> and some will chose to pre-install the whole edubuntu bundle
<RichEd> and some will select some components from the bundle, and go with that
<RichEd> --
<highvoltage> ok
<johnny> there's only two mentions of consolekit in the log
<highvoltage> goodnight guys
<RichEd> highvoltage: that post is pure coincidence and absolute synergy .. he gives the same motivation and benefits
<ogra_cmpc> johnny: there is nothing uploaded
<RichEd> highvoltage: before you go ...
<highvoltage> RichEd: heh, I wondered what you would say about that. have you read the comments?
<ogra_cmpc> johnny: oh, you mean the irc log
<RichEd> * Community Council Applicants * anyone
<highvoltage> oh yes
<juliux> and something real cool, linux4afrika is an offical decade projekt from the UN, more informations on www.dekaden.org i will try to get something in english
<RichEd> highvoltage: not yet
<ogra_cmpc> Edubuntu Council rather
<RichEd> ogra_cmpc: apologies ... brain running down
<ogra_cmpc> juliux: oh, did they recieve that status recently?
<juliux> ogra_cmpc, yes i get an e-mail from hans-peter-merkel
<ogra_cmpc> yay
<juliux> ogra_cmpc, i can forward that to you
<juliux> he is atm in tansania
<ogra_cmpc> yes, please
<juliux> ogra_cmpc, done
<ogra_cmpc> thanks
<ogra_cmpc> so is there nobody for council stuff here ?
<juliux> ubuntu-de will also support linux4afrika at chemnitz linux-tage, cebit and linuxtag in berlin;)
<ogra_cmpc> i'll likely be in berlin again
<highvoltage> ogra_cmpc: doesn't seem so. I meant to invite two people who had pending member requests to this meeting
<ogra_cmpc> not sure i'll make cebit (could couple that with a visit of my parents though)
<highvoltage> ogra_cmpc: but time caught me, we'll have to give them a chance at the next ecm
<juliux> ogra_cmpc, more then one day?
<ogra_cmpc> berlin ?
<juliux> yes
<ogra_cmpc> not sure yet
<juliux> RichEd, what we have to do that ogra_cmpc gets the order to attend more then one day on linux tag in berlin?
<ogra_cmpc> i have a friend who has a spare flat for me, i'll probably stay longer, but i'll decide that spontaneous
<ogra_cmpc> juliux: ask my line manager :)
<juliux> ogra_cmpc, mail address?
<juliux> ;)
<ogra_cmpc> (colin)
 * juliux will send an ubuntu coffee mug and everything will be fine;)
<RichEd> juliux: send me an email request, giving details about "how oliver's presence will have a huge impact and benefits" ... and i'll pass it along
<juliux> RichEd, ok
<ogra_cmpc> i applied for official attendance internally, but there were no final decisions yet
<RichEd> juliux: an ubuntu coffee mug or an edubuntu coffee mug ? ;)
<ogra_cmpc> an external request might raise my chances
<juliux> RichEd, depends who makes the decision;)
<highvoltage> last call for any EC issues?
<highvoltage> sounds like a no. permission to go to bed? :)
 * ogra_cmpc wonders if jono planned another ubuntu grill session this year
<ogra_cmpc> ...
<juliux> ok i will write an request for ogra doko dholbach mvo pitti asac mcslow ;)
<ogra_cmpc> going once ...
<juliux> so i can make copy and paste;)
<ogra_cmpc> going twice ...
<highvoltage> *gong*
<ogra_cmpc> meeting adjourned
<juliux> ogra, that is not jono part
 * RichEd bangs the gong
<RichEd> thanks guys ... i'm done for the night
<ogra_cmpc> juliux: nowadays it is :)
<highvoltage> goodnight guys
<juliux> ogra_cmpc, i was asked to organise an ubuntu lovedy
<juliux> loveday
<ogra_cmpc> oh, cool
<juliux> tetet says he will talk with the london office about that
<ogra_cmpc> he has my full support :)
<juliux> because if i ask around for speakers nobody comes :(
<juliux> see last ubucon;)
<juliux> now everybody  we have silence
<nixternal> RichEd or ogra_cmpc: Is Edubuntu still going to be provided via ShipIt?
<RichEd> nixternal: my assumption is that canonical / shipit will provide the Edubuntu Add-On CD yes
<nixternal> groovy, thanks
<RichEd> i.e. we've got existing approval for 1CD which at the moment is Edubuntu
<RichEd> so it is reassigned to the Add-On
<nixternal> OK, I am looking at the CD images now
<stgraber> RichEd: would be good to have an easy way to order both Ubuntu+Edubuntu at the same time
<ogra_cmpc> we also talked about two sleeve cd covers
<nixternal> it lists "Classroom server CD" and "Classroom server add-on CD"
<ogra_cmpc> these are not relevant anymore
<nixternal> what is the difference if Edubuntu is now an add-on?
<nixternal> OK
<ogra_cmpc> thet wont be built anymore soon
<ogra_cmpc> only the addon will be there for alpha5
<nixternal> where can I get the add-on for Ubuntu so I can install it and play around with it?
<nixternal> get some screenshots and what not
<RichEd> stgraber: that is really a matter of adding a process saying order ubuntu here & edubuntu add on here
<RichEd> some people will need only the add-on if they picked up an ubuntu cd somewhere else, and then only if they have a bad internet connection
<ogra_cmpc> RichEd: well, there was no final word from silbs about teh two cd shipping yet
<stgraber> RichEd: yes and that's something we'll need because receive only an edubuntu CD will be useless
<ogra_cmpc> right
<stgraber> (in most case)
<RichEd> ogra: so as i said ... we add a process ... person X ordering an Ubuntu CD from ubuntu.shipitcom will get it for free
<ogra_cmpc> the idea was to have ubuntu shipped alongside in a two cd sleeve
<RichEd> the same person X ordering an Edbuntu CD from edubuntu.shipitcom will get it for free
<nixternal> ogra_cmpc: is "Classroom server add-on CD" the image I want to install on top of Ubuntu desktop?
<ogra_cmpc> but as i said i didnt hear any final word about that
<ogra_cmpc> nixternal: yes, but the seed changes are not done yet etc
<ogra_cmpc> i'm not sure what you get atm with it
<RichEd> ogra: that set will certainly be a need ... for handing out at education events / promotions .. OEM meetings etc.
<RichEd> government projects and the like
<nixternal> hrmm, any idea when the seed changes may occur?
<ogra_cmpc> nixternal: before FF
<ogra_cmpc> but then its still not tested etc
<RichEd> it's really down to a matter of making sure that people order and get what they need ... and not wanton shipping of extraneos CDs
<ogra_cmpc> the complete setup (seeds cd building etc) is undergoing a change atm
<nixternal> RichEd: how many people were asked about doing the chapter and said no before I gullably said "yes"? :p
<nixternal> Let me see if I have this right, to be included in the chapter, not in these words though:
<RichEd> nixternal: you were my first suggestion ... honest
<nixternal> "The Ubuntu Education Edition can be brought into your system in 3 different ways: 1) You can install the 'edubuntu-desktop' package, 2) You can download and burn an image to disk, or 3) You can order a set of CDs via ShipIt"
<RichEd> not sure of what came before i was asked though
<nixternal> I just want to make sure this chapter rocks and nothing is left undone or incorrect
<RichEd> nixternal: for the interim from now until 8.10 ... you can't refer to Ubuntu Education Edition in isolation
<RichEd> it is: Edubuntu - Ubuntu Education Edition
<nixternal> gotcha
<RichEd> don't oversell or overblow the componentisation ... some of that needs to be worked out and neatened
<RichEd> what you really need to get across is the move:
<RichEd> from: you get an eduntu CD and you install edubuntu
<RichEd> to: you start with an Ubuntu installation, and by using Edubuntu Add OnCD, you add the Ubuntu Education Bundle to get you to an Edubuntu desktop
<RichEd> the wallpaper will remain edubuntu
<RichEd> ditto the look & feel & menu & icons
<RichEd> ^ so that is the ground shift ^
<nixternal> rock on
<RichEd> the funky options will come with the 8.10 build up
<RichEd> we do not want to cause confusion
<RichEd> or oversell
<RichEd> we're making a leap now ...
<RichEd> and then we'll polish the whole environment in the next round
 * RichEd heads off to bed
<RichEd> nixternal: feel free to mail any copy to me to make sure it is "accurate" and clear
<RichEd> cc ogra
<nixternal> oh, I will be :)
 * RichEd modifies his spam filter
<RichEd> and turns off his monitor
<nixternal> haha
<nixternal> g'nite RichEd
<yotux> how can I import user from ubuntu to edubuntu
#edubuntu 2008-02-07
<w00w00> huhu =)
<nate_> how can I log into edubuntu from a user account that I had in ubuntu
<johnny> did you reinstall?
<johnny> or what?
<nate_> ok I had ubuntu this morning using a seperate /home partition
<nate_> I install ubuntu server this morning not formating /home partition
<nate_> now I get xession errors state I an not logged in for more than 10 secs
<johnny> did you readd the user to the accounts database?
<nate_> yes
<johnny> you might have to clear out some files in your ~/
<nate_> log fails from thin client giving no error message
<johnny> oh.. thin clients
<johnny> it could be many things..
<nate_> tried loging in on both server and thin client
<nate_> can't log in with X either place
<nate_> can login using cli
<johnny> bakcup all the . files
<johnny> or move them rather
<johnny> and then try
<nate_> so move all files dele the dir and then create a new skeleton
<johnny> they will be recreated automatically
<johnny> you could keep the .bash* files tho
<johnny> they won't cause a problem
<johnny> it's the gnome ones that you're prolly having trouble with
<nate_> brb
<highvoltage-cmpc> :D
<highvoltage-cmpc> ogra: :D
<highvoltage-cmpc> :D/
<highvoltage-cmpc> oops
<highvoltage-cmpc> ogra: ping?
<stgraber> ogra: You can give that to \sh : http://www.stgraber.org/download/ubuntu/italc/
<stgraber> ogra: it contains the binary and source packages + the backtrace and error in the "bug" file
<nblracer> hello again
<laga> ogra: please remember to comment on the mythbuntu plugin so i can fix it in time :) thanks
<RichEd> ogra_cmpc: ^ see request from laga | laga: ogra is working on 2 machines :)
 * pygi wonders what happened with iscsi magic that was supposed to be implemented *ages* ago
<pygi> ogra_cmpc, ogra : ? ^_^
<GregR> Hello.  I Have Edubuntu 6.06.2, fully updated.  When users log in from the thin clients, they do not show up in commands who or last, so I can't use sac to keep track of time.  Anyone know how to solve this problem?  Thanks.
<johnny> hmm.. mine do.. not sure
<GregR> Thank you, Johnny.  What version of Edubuntu are you using?
<johnny> not using edubuntu, i'm using regular ubuntu
<johnny> not that it should make much difference
<GregR> It's something about the way the thin clients log on using LTSP in Edubuntu.
<johnny> it shouldn't be any different
<johnny> in regards to ltsp
<GregR> Perhaps it shouldn't, but it definitely does.  When I log in directly to the Edubuntu server, the login shows up in who and last, but not from a thin client.
<johnny> i'm using the gutsy version
<GregR> Thank you for your help, Johnny.  Perhaps upgrading is the solution to my problem.
<johnny> which one are you using?
<johnny> feisty?
<johnny> if so are you using some DIRECTX parameter in lts.conf ?
<GregR> 6.06, Dapper Drake LTS.  I am using the default setup with minimal or no changing of configuration files.
<johnny> oh.. you're way out for me
<johnny> that's like really old i think :)
<johnny> i started with feisty on this one
<johnny> and upgraded to gutsy
<johnny> if the ltsp on there is ltsp4,that might explain it, but i'm not100% sure
<GregR> According to dpkg:
<GregR> ii  ltsp-server    0.87           Basic LTSP server environment
<GregR> ii  ltsp-server-st 0.87           Complete LTSP server environment
<johnny> i have no idea what versions those mean
<GregR> I know that 6.06 is old, but I am waiting for the next LTS release to upgrade.
<johnny> well.. guess you could continue waiting :)
<GregR> Thank you much, Johnny.  I joined the Edubuntu-users email list and asked my question there.  If I don't get an answer, I'll upgrade.  Good day.
<johnny> i know the gutsy and hardy stuff uses ssh by default
<johnny> and feisty for that matter
<iari> My laptop doesn't go into hibernation / Suspend mode. When I try switching to hibernate the screen goes black and there's a blinking '_' like DOS mode... I can't type or do anything except shutting down using the power button..
<johnny> so you'll always get stuff showing up in who
<johnny> i'm guessing yours is using xdmcp only
<johnny> maybe there's a way to get similiar output to who with that
<johnny> you could always try to parse ps if nothing else?
<johnny> GregR, i personally (and this is not representing ubuntu in any way) don't take much stock on lts yet
<johnny> the software is evolving too fast still
<johnny> still reaching feature parity with other systems
<johnny> so bugs fixes can often be hard to integrate a few years down the line
<johnny> as you can't rely on the original developers, but then have to rely on canonical developers who still have lots of work to do with the newer stuff as well
<johnny> as the original developers get flooded with bugs and get mad :)
<johnny> bugs they won't fix
<laga> ogra: i have finally posted the initramfs changes i've been talking about all the time
<laga> ogra: mostly for review, still lacking testing :/
#edubuntu 2008-02-08
<grezer34> good evening everyone, can anyone here tell me what this error means ??
<grezer34> dpkg: parse error, in file `/var/lib/dpkg/updates/0193' near line 1:
<grezer34>  newline in field name `#padding'
<kgoetz> that file has an erronous \n
<grezer34> ok ... how do you fix it
<grezer34> :)
<grezer34> I have tryed sudo dpkg --clear-avail && sudo apt-get update
<grezer34> but that did not do anything
<grezer34> and  sudo dpkg --configure -a
<grezer34> I tryed to load a GUI on my server, and that dident work ether
<kgoetz> open up the file and remove it :)
<grezer34> remove what
<grezer34> line 1 ??
<kgoetz> grezer34: paste your top 10 lines into pastebin
<grezer34> crap that means I have to use VI DAMM
<grezer34> sorry
<kgoetz> why? just use nano
<kgoetz> or 'head'
<grezer34> there is nothing in the file all it says is #padding over and over
<kgoetz> i dont have anything in that directory at all
<grezer34> ok, so I should remove all the ... Junk and
<kgoetz> try moving the file into your home, and see if that fixes it
<kgoetz> i dont know whats in the file still, so i dont know what will brewak
<grezer34> I am not good with vi, that is why I was trying to get a GUI
<grezer34> I think I will try the install again :)
<grezer34> I think it will be easyer :)
<kgoetz> 13:55 < kgoetz> why? just use nano
<kgoetz> 13:55 < kgoetz> or 'head'
<grezer34> thank goodness I just installed it
<grezer34> ??
<kgoetz> "you dont need to use vi. ever."
<grezer34> is nano like gedit ??
<kgoetz> try it.
<grezer34>  humm I just might
<grezer34> I am going to reinstall :)
<grezer34> thank goodness I just installed it yesterday :)
<grezer34> thanks kgoetz
<grezer34> have a good night
<kgoetz> night
<IsleVegan> greetings
<IsleVegan> where is the file the dictates the video mode that shows the login screen on clients?
<IsleVegan> maybe it's called gdm or ldm
<RichEd> hello mr pygi
<pygi> hi RichEd :)
<pygi> how are you doing?
<RichEd> pygi: okay & yourself ? looking forward to the weekend
<pygi> RichEd, a bit busy. Did two releases this week, looking at three more
<RichEd> pygi: releases of ?
<pygi> RichEd, oh, libburn and cdrskin
<pygi> soon releases of libisofs, libisoburn and xorriso
<pygi> interesting, dont you think :P
<RichEd> pygi: sarcasm so early in the morning ?
 * RichEd needs more coffee
<pygi> RichEd, why would that be a sarcasm? :)
<pygi> I was just trying to make you talk, since you're so silent :p
 * RichEd is multi-tasking, waking up, and thinking about breakfast
 * RichEd offers pygi a slice of fish-paste toast
<pygi> RichEd, nah, thanks, a bit too tired to eat now :P
<highvoltage> morning RichEd
<RichEd> hi
<zzaza> hi all
<markvandenborre> I have a strange problem here with a thin client server
<markvandenborre> window borders seem to be gone, so obviously something is wrong with the window manager
<markvandenborre> I'm running metacity
<markvandenborre> at least, that's what I _should_ be running
<markvandenborre> .xsession-erros is complaining about compiz not being found
<markvandenborre> which is strange, to say the least
<stgraber> ogra: did you find the time to ping \sh ?
<laga> ogra: ping
<stgraber> ogra: I updated : http://www.stgraber.org/download/ubuntu/italc/bug with my last testing results
<rolando-ve> RichEd: PING
#edubuntu 2008-02-09
<stgraber> ogra: We may have found the bug for iTalc :) (at least Tobias found a QRgb mistake in his code)
<laga> ogra: ping
<stgraber> RichEd-1: italc now works
<stgraber> RichEd-1: upstream tells me he'll release a new version later in the day and I hope to have it ready for inclusion by Monday
 * RichEd-1 cheers for stgraber and Tobias for identifying & fixing
<stgraber> RichEd-1: so oliver will have till Thursday to fill the MIR and have it moved to main (if he doesn't want to fill a FF exception too)
 * RichEd-1 cheers twice & jumps up & down at the news that it's on the inclusion path
<RichEd-1> w00t
<RichEd-1> stgraber: where can I get a featutre list for the version you are working on ?
<RichEd-1> and some high level info on how it works ...
<RichEd-1> i.e. teacher loads app on normal PC desktop
<stgraber> RichEd-1: http://italc.sourceforge.net/ seems to be a good start
<stgraber> RichEd-1: the client part will be starting by default on the clients and the server part will be available to the member of the admin group
<stgraber> RichEd-1: starting it will show the classroom UI with all the computers and the possible actions at the top of the window
<RichEd-1> and version # of the code you are working on so i can make sure i have the correct documentation feature set ?
<stgraber> 1.0.6 which will be released today, functions are identitical as 1.0.3, 1.0.4 and 1.0.5 as those were only bugfixes
<RichEd-1> (go on .. that level of detail is perfect ... it's for the suits in Intel who will never touch iTalc but want to tell people that "teacher admin" is available
<RichEd-1> also, w.r.t. the component that runs on the client:
<RichEd-1> #1 does it do any display on the local client
<RichEd-1> i.e. will the smaller screen be any problem ?
<stgraber> no, it's completely hidden so no problem client side
<stgraber> the only problem is if one wants to run the teacher part on a CMPC
<RichEd-1> #2 any other potential issues with runnning this on the classmate
<RichEd-1> i think ogra should test it asap on his notebook, taking over his cmpc
<RichEd-1> stgraber: nah ... the teacher needs a workstation end of story
<RichEd-1> the teacher is an adult
<stgraber> well, I haven't a CMPC or any of those small screen device around (still waiting for my EEE) but it shouldn't cause any problem as a client
<RichEd-1> make a note to remind ogra to test when you "release the code to him"
<RichEd-1> i'll mail him as well
<achandrashekar> Hello.I am setting up two edubuntu servers (Athlon X2 2.2GHz's,2GB of mem,450GB HDD) to power a 60 person lab type environment. Id like more information how to cluster the boxes to power up the lab. Is there any type of how to for this?
<johnny> anybody here testing out hardy?
<achandrashekar> anybody on the clustering?
<achandrashekar> rephrase of my original question anyone familiar with openmosix framework for clustering and how it works with edubuntu?
<johnny> i've never heard anybody in this channel mention openmosix
<johnny> is that software still in devel?
<Paladine> yodles
<achandrashekar> its a mechanism for clustering for ltsp and supposedly you need a recompilation of kernel to get it going. So I figured that "might" be what is being considered in terms of clustering
<Paladine> I have been assigned the task of setting up an Open Learning environment so I was looking for some advice
<achandrashekar> but
<achandrashekar> Id like to get a set up going such that I CAN cluster two boxes, and/or use the idling clients to work in a powerful cluster
<johnny> it might be too advanced for most of the folks in this channel
<johnny> try #ltsp
<johnny> as well
<achandrashekar> hmm..is there a development thread of edubuntu channel??
<johnny> and/or #ubuntu-server .. if there is one
<johnny> your question isn't development atm
<achandrashekar> ie..i have read something about a development group working on this.
<johnny> oh
<johnny> well, email those folks to see where they hang out i guess
<achandrashekar> okay..will have to join "yet another" list...lol
<achandrashekar> ;)
<Paladine> is there an edubuntu mailing list? it might be easier for me to write everything in an email than to try and do it over irc
<achandrashekar> i "might" just get busy with trying to set it up myself and see what happens.
<achandrashekar> and then seeing if there is any interest.
<stgraber> Paladine: http://lists.ubuntu.com => edubuntu-user or edubuntu-devel
<Paladine> thanks stgraber
<stgraber> achandrashekar: I never heard of someone doing clustering with LTSP, some have multiple LTSP servers and do load balacing (that's the official and supported way)
<achandrashekar> stgraber: http://openmosix.sourceforge.net/ltsp-omr4-1.html
<stgraber> achandrashekar: is MOSIX working with 2.6 ? last I heard of it it was only for 2.4
<achandrashekar> yep...that seemed to be the issue. That was going to be the next lead in question..to see "how far" it had come..but it appears...it has been a slow road.
<stgraber> I never saw openmosix running on 2.6, that will be your major issue with Ubuntu/Edubuntu as I doubt you can run a 2.4 kernel on Ubuntu (mainly due to udev)
<johnny> if openmosix hasn't advanced to a 2.6 kernel by now
<johnny> it sounds like a dead project
<stgraber> lastest release is from December 9, 2004
<johnny> yep.. dead
<johnny> achandrashekar, i wouldn't put much effort into that method then
<johnny> there must be a reason nobody has picked it up in so long
<stgraber> johnny: it simulates a big SMP computer, so if your software aren't threaded it's useless (it was the main problem with MOSIX and that kind of clustering)
<achandrashekar> I see..hmm..i guess the question what the best methodology is to use the "combined" horespower of two systems to power up an ltsp env, And if there is a how to for that for edubuntu.. I guess your previous post about where to look is best?
<achandrashekar> best question to ask about methodology i mean...
<achandrashekar> sorry poor grammar
<achandrashekar> i "could" power up 1/3 of the lab with one, and the other, and yet another..
<achandrashekar> but i figured id never have ALL nodes up at the same time..so why not come up with a solution to aggregrate the power..i suppose its a bit of wishful thinking.
<achandrashekar> nodes used that is..not "up" ...my bad.
<Paladine> k email sent to the list hopefully there will be hundreds of people all wanting to share their experiences with me :)
<pem725> I have a quick question about root logins to the F1 terminal
<pem725> I followed the directions detailed in the handbook but when I try to login - even after rebooting the server and my thin client - the root login and password are not accepted
<pem725> any ideas why this might be happening?
<stgraber> pem725: what exactly did you do ?
<pem725> I did sudo chroot /opt/ltsp/i386
<stgraber> pem725: I don't have the handbook in mind and it's not always up to date (depending on where you are reading it from)
<pem725> and then I issued a passwd command
<pem725> entered a password and confirmed it
<johnny> and then you rebuild the image?
<pem725> I am assuming I did this for the root user
<pem725> yes
<johnny> that's all i had to do
<pem725> hmmm
<johnny> was set it and rebuild the image
<pem725> I might need to step through the process slower
<pem725> when you login, do you login as root?
<johnny> login to the thinclient?
<johnny> yes
<pem725> yes
<pem725> great
<pem725> k
<johnny> but only from the terminal
<pem725> I will try it again
<pem725> yes, thanks.
<pem725> the reason I need to do this is to confirm that my via thin client is using the via xorg driver
<pem725> my video performance is so bad on my thin client
<pem725> horrible in fact
<stgraber> pem725: so there is an easier way to do that than setting a root pw
<pem725> excellent
<pem725> I'm all eyes
<stgraber> pem725: create a lts.conf file in /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/
<pem725> ok
<pem725> I have one for my via client already
<stgraber> ok, so you already have a general or default section at the top ?
<pem725> yes
<pem725> is there something I can add to the already existing default section?
<stgraber> just add : SCREEN_01=shell
<pem725> great
<pem725> will that allow me to login as my regular user and then sudo su?
<johnny> no
<stgraber> no, it'll open a root shell
<pem725> ok
<pem725> I guess I am confused here.
<pem725> so the shell will already have root logged in
<pem725> correct?
<stgraber> yes
<pem725> wonderful
<pem725> thank you very much.  Once I get this done, I will tackle sound and local devices
<pem725> thanks for your help.
<stgraber> np
<stgraber> pem725: here it doesn't seem to work with _01, I'm trying with _02 now
<stgraber> pem725: ok, it works fine with _02, it'll open a root shell on tty2 (F2)
<johnny> stgraber, do you have a hardy install?
<stgraber> johnny: yes running in Xen
<stgraber> and my lappy on Hardy (but Ubuntu, not edubuntu)
<johnny> can you test something for me? it should only take 2 minutes
<stgraber> sure
<johnny> that's fine..doesn't matter if it's edubuntu or whatever afaik
<johnny> what version of gnome-settings-daemon does it currenlty include?
<stgraber> stgraber@castiana:~$ dpkg -l | grep gnome-settings-daemon
<stgraber> ii  gnome-settings-daemon                     2.21.90.2-0ubuntu2
<johnny> aha.. perfect
<johnny> do you have xnest?
<stgraber> yes
<johnny> ok.. su to some user  and then run
<johnny> some other user not currently running
<johnny> and then
<johnny> Xnest -ac :1
<johnny> err
<johnny> Xnest -ac :1 &
<johnny> and then DISPLAY="0:1"/usr/libexec/gnome-settings-daemon
<johnny> that's all
<stgraber> Xnest doesn't work as my test user doesn't seem to have the right to access my X instance
<johnny> thus -ac ?
<johnny> that's what i had to do
<stgraber> test@castiana:~$ Xnest -ac :1
<stgraber> No protocol specified
<stgraber> Fatal server error:
<stgraber> Unable to open display ":0.0".
<johnny> that makes no sense..
<stgraber> it makes sense, a software (xnest), tries to access my X server without my tester user having the right to do so
<stgraber> -ac is valid for everything running in the Xnest, not on the main X server
<johnny> hmm.. i didn't do anything special on my server to make it work
<stgraber> if you do :
<stgraber> su yourtestuser
<stgraber> DISPLAY=:0 xeyes
<stgraber> does it work ?
<stgraber> (it shouldn't)
<johnny> su -
<johnny> is what i did
<johnny> sure.. but  that's why i do 0:1
<johnny> which i seem to have rights to do :)
<stgraber> hmm, in fact I was wrong, :1 is my current X server (or at least I have a :1 server running)
<stgraber> though trying with :2 doesn't work either
<stgraber> test@castiana:/home/stgraber$ Xnest -ac :2
<stgraber> Fatal server error:
<stgraber> Could not create server lock file: /tmp/.X2-lock
<stgraber> hmm, let me clean a bit my /tmp
<johnny> i know in the dbus xorg file i only have display0 and display1
<johnny> so i'm sticking with :0 and :1 atm
#edubuntu 2008-02-10
<Cheerio> hey
<Cheerio> can anybody help me please
<laga> not if you don't ask a question
<Cheerio> well i just used wubi to installe edubuntu on a virtual disk but it installed the server addition
<Cheerio> but i would like a desktop
<Cheerio> i tried sudo apt-get install edubuntu-desktop, but it said no updates or something
<Cheerio> any advice?
<Cheerio> i also have problems with the xorg config
<laga> Cheerio: someone will answer eventually, not everyone is at their computer all the time
<laga> good night :)
<Cheerio> lol k thanks
<firestorm> Hi all. Have a newborn and am doing some early investigation into educational GPL software...have installed tuxpaint, gcompris and childsplay. Any other suggestions?
<angelot> I'm running edubuntu-server 7.10 as an ltsp-server trying to play video with vlc on the clients.
<angelot> I have no problem playing mp3's with vlc from clients nor video with totem, but video with vlc I can't.
<angelot> VLC media player 0.8.6c Janus
<angelot> The program '.' received an X Window System error.
<angelot> This probably reflects a bug in the program.
<angelot> The error was 'BadAccess (attempt to access private resource denied)'.
<angelot>   (Details: serial 57 error_code 10 request_code 148 minor_code 1)
<angelot>   (Note to programmers: normally, X errors are reported asynchronously;
<angelot>    that is, you will receive the error a while after causing it.
<angelot>    To debug your program, run it with the --sync command line
<angelot>    option to change this behavior. You can then get a meaningful
<angelot>    backtrace from your debugger if you break on the gdk_x_error() function.)
<angelot> I belive this to be an ltsp-problem running X on thin clients
<angelot> I found a soulution on vlc-forums: The solution is to start X with MIT-SHM extension disable, and allowModXvidtune.
<angelot> How can I do this?
<angelot> This is my /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/lts.conf
<angelot> [default]
<angelot> XSERVER=auto
<angelot> SERVER=192.168.0.1
<angelot> SCREEN_02=shell
<angelot> SCREEN_07=ldm
<angelot> X_MODE_0="1024x768"
<angelot> X_COLOR_DEPTH=24
<angelot> X_HORZSYNC="31-60"
<angelot> X_VERTREFRESH="55-75"
<Kamping_Kaiser> angelot, dont paste
<angelot> Anyone?
<Kamping_Kaiser> !paste | angelot
<ubotu> angelot: pastebin is a service to post large texts so you don't flood the channel. The Ubuntu pastebin is at http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org (make sure you give us the URL for your paste - see also the #ubuntu channel topic)
<angelot> OK :-)
<Kamping_Kaiser> not sure about your query - you may ave to wait a while (most devs are in europe iirc)
<johnny> you do not want to disable MIT-SHM i bet
<johnny> sounds like a bad idea
<angelot> This is the paste-bin: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/55441/
<angelot> johnny, do you have any clues how I can make vlc working - disable MIT-SHM or not?
<johnny> never tried
<angelot> OK :-)
<johnny> but i think it may impact your performance
<johnny> i could be wrong about that
<johnny> but it sounds important
<johnny> try mplayer?
<angelot> I've just installed mplayer and I try that, but how can I write lts.conf to try to disable the MIT-SHM extension and allowModXvidtune?
<johnny> you can't
<johnny> iirc
<johnny> you have to edit the generated xorg
<johnny> or provide your own custom one
<angelot> Jonny: mplayer are running fine, except for some framedropping due to lack of resources on the thin client.
<angelot> I have no xorg.conf in my ltsp-setup, but the server have one. Do I have to edit the servers x-settings to get the clients to work well??
<johnny> no
<johnny> it doesn't use that one
<johnny> it generates one per client
<angelot> Where can I find this one?
<angelot> Where can I find the generated file for the thin clients?
<johnny> it's generated on the fly
<johnny> when the client loads
<johnny> you can provide a custom one per thin client
<johnny> i suppose
<angelot> I thought this was done using lts.conf
<johnny> that's very basic stuff
<angelot> In mine I have some default values, but you can specify one setting for each MAC-address...
<IsleVegan> the single terminal i have connecting to the server locks up after a period of inactivity
<IsleVegan> well, it doesn't come out of a black / blank display state
<angelot> IsleVegan: Seems to be an X-problem....
<IsleVegan> hmm
<IsleVegan> ok
<IsleVegan> what can i do about that?
<angelot> Does your terminal connect to the server using ltsp?
<IsleVegan> yes
<IsleVegan> i'm using the terminal now
<angelot> Then you can set some dafaults in /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/lts.conf
<IsleVegan> ok, i'll look at that
<IsleVegan> thanks for your help, i'm looking now
<angelot> See http://www.edubuntu.org/GettingStarted and scroll down to "Fine-tuning the thin client setup"
<IsleVegan> there doesn't appear to be an lts.conf file in that location
<angelot> By default, I don't think the lts.conf-file exist.
<angelot> I had to make one myself....
<IsleVegan> hmm
<IsleVegan> not sure what to put there, maybe i'll find that in the url you gave me
<angelot> Her you'll find mine: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/55442/
<IsleVegan> thanks
<IsleVegan> should i change this SERVER=192.168.0.1 to the ip address of my server?
<IsleVegan> ends in 183
<angelot> yep
<IsleVegan> :-)
<achandrashekar> hello. I have a question regarding a multiserver setup of edubuntu with ltsp
<achandrashekar> specifically it is regarding a /home mounted on nfs
<achandrashekar> and along the lines of that setup i plan to use it for the ENTIRE environment
<achandrashekar> with 3 servers
<achandrashekar> can someone give me a walk through or how to set it up?
<IsleVegan> thanks for earlier angelot
<IsleVegan> i appreciate your time
<IsleVegan> there may be other issues with this computer
<IsleVegan> the hard drive may be dead / dying or whatever, it's all a new setup except the hard drive
<angelot> IsleVegan: No problem. It was worth trying - I had the same problem with my 6.04 desktop...
<IsleVegan> well, i'm booted with puppy linux now on the terminal, was getting frustrated with problems from the server
<IsleVegan> blargh
<brizben> hello can some one tell me if there is any "math tutor" soft ware on edubuntu?
<theunixgeek> I followed http://ubuntu-tutorials.com/2007/07/18/removing-kde-icons-in-gnome-remove-gnome-icons-in-kde/ to remove KDE  apps from the GNOME menus and vice versa; how do I undo it.
<alien__> hi all
<nixternal> ogra: is there still going to be a DVD image/release of Edubuntu or just CD?
#edubuntu 2009-02-02
<Level_5> anyone here?
<nubae> yah
<Level_5> I'm lookin for help with a broadcom wireless card
<Level_5> using 8.04
<RichEd> away
<nubae> hi RichEd
<MoonStorm> what is the swf program?
<HedgeMage> swf is flash
<HedgeMage> (It stands for "ShockWave Flash")
<MoonStorm> yes, some type of program that puts screens togather for a flash presentation.  i forget the name
<HedgeMage> ahh, no clue, I don't do flash :)
 * Lns needs access to rename a wiki page on ubuntu wiki :(
<thismamacooks200> IRC problem, I keep getting the same error box every few seconds. It creates thousands of message boxes if I don't close them. "Unknown message somename@sbcglobal.net The IRC server received a message it did not understand "
<sbalneav> thismamacooks200: What IRC client are you using?
<thismamacooks200> sbalneav: pidgin
<sbalneav> and are you "somename@sbcglobal.net"?
<thismamacooks200> no I am not the 'someone'. that's not the actual address. I didn't want to print someone's email in case they have nothing to do with the problem
<sbalneav> hm, well, could be either a misconfiguration on their end, or perhaps they're trying to diddle with something improperly.  It's feenode that's giving you this?  Or a different IRC server?
<sbalneav> s/feenode/freenode/
<thismamacooks200> I'm not sure which IRC server it is, I'm running ubuntu.com (freenode?), ircnet.com, and efnet. I'll close the latter two and see if the messages stop
<thismamacooks200> nope, it must be comming from ubuntu.com
<sbalneav> I'd page the op in #ubuntu then, report it to him/her
<sbalneav> Either misconfig or maliciousness, they'll know what to do.
<re-G> i have written some scripts that you can use LTSP over wireless network. Please check: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/edubuntu-users/2009-January/005074.html
<MoonStorm> nub
<MoonStorm> nubae
#edubuntu 2009-02-03
<BattleStarJesus> I am trying to configure my computer so that I can log into it, using a GUI interface,  from a remote location.  I have come here for tutorial advice.  Suggestions?
<MoonStorm> vpn
<MoonStorm> tightvnc
<MoonStorm> ah, nm
<MoonStorm> he's left
<Meshezabeel> :)
<ScorpKing> hi guys. i've been trying all day to get a different usplash theme for the ltsp clients but no matter what i do the usplash theme does not change. any ideas?
<jojo_> someone from spain?
#edubuntu 2009-02-04
<ybit> so.. a school has essentially an unlimited budged to deploy a computer lab... how could
<ybit> ..well..how many educational apps are included with edubuntu?
<ybit> argh
<nubae> hey Lns
<nubae> how goes it on this fine evening/or day for you?
<Lns> nubae: hey! It's going pretty well, need to go grab some lunch
<Lns> hows bout you?
<nubae> yeah not bad... hey what did u make of that email asmo sent us?
<Lns> nubae: ? email?
<alkisg> nubae, sbalneav: "a new user management tool": http://www.redhat.com/archives/fedora-desktop-list/2008-May/msg00006.html
<Lns> bbl, lunch time
<nubae> no about ldap
<nubae> sent to rom	asmo.koskinen@arkki.info
<nubae> jerickson@logicalnetworking.net
<nubae> scott@hosef.org,
<nubae> cc	dvanassche@gmail.com,
<nubae> to	asmo.koskinen@arkki.info
<LaserJock> hmm, so I suppose we should have done a meeting today
<nubae> ufff maybe... could we do it another day?
<nubae> I've got a load of work to do and tomorrow a catch a flight to brussels
<LaserJock> yeah, I'm swamped
<nubae> figured as much :-)
<LaserJock> bah, I hate it when i forget the laptop power cord :(
<LaserJock> I try to get in to school for the first time this week and I'm gonna have to just go home when the battery gets low
<nubae> heh
<Lns> nubae: you mind forwarding that mail to me? I was having dns issues the past couple of days, it might not have reached me.
<nubae> which one sorry?
<Ahmuck> Baby, are you flooding channels?
<Baby> no, I'm trying to survive :P
<Baby> My connection is so crappy today
#edubuntu 2009-02-05
<ScorpKing> hi everyone. is there a way to change the usplash theme of ltsp clients?
<Lns> Anybody have a howto/link for getting msttcorefonts/defoma functional in edubuntu/ltsp?
<Lns> I've installed & followed the directions, and the docs say to add the following lines to your xorg.conf:  FontPath "/var/lib/defoma/x-ttcidfont-conf.d/dirs/TrueType"
<Lns>  FontPath "/var/lib/defoma/x-ttcidfont-conf.d/dirs/CID"
<Lns> Not sure if lts.conf has an option to add these lines in dynamically without having to create a custom xorg.conf for every client on the network
<LaserJock> Lns: have you tried it locally on the server?
<Lns> LaserJock: nope
<Lns> probably a good place to start, eh? :)
<alkisg> Lns, huh? There's a package for msttcorefonts, you just install it... Am I missing something?
<Lns> alkisg: yeah, they don't show up ;)
<alkisg> Ehm... where? E.g. I can see them in xfontsel...
<Lns> alkisg: can you give some msttcorefont names for me to check?
<LaserJock> Times New Roman
<alkisg> I'm not sure if all of them are part of msttcorefont, but these are the ms fonts I have: verdanda, webdings, arial, arial black, ...
<Lns> that's in msttcorefonts??
<LaserJock> Lns: yeah
<Lns> hmm, maybe you're right then. weird.
<Lns> lemme check a server i know i didn't install it on yet
<alkisg> Lns, the list is in `cat /var/lib/msttcorefonts/ms-fonts` (on a PC where you have installed it)
<Lns> ah, you're right. It sure doesn't seem like there are many new ones installed though! TNR is definitely not there w/o msttcorefonts. nice. Are there other font packages? I'm getting requests to install more, prettier fonts.
<Lns> alkisg: thanks :)
<Lns> cat /var/lib/msttcorefonts/ms-fonts|wc -l: 60 .. .nice, at least 60 more, it didn't look like that scrolling through them though. I'm just not awake enough yet.
<LaserJock> Lns: you should look into liberation fonts and Dejavu fonts, they're pretty nice
<Lns> LaserJock: awesome!
<Ahmuck> whose packaging for sugar?
<Ahmuck> i just noticed an e-mail come across the list
<Lns> Anyone using OOo 3.0.1 in Hardy via https://answers.launchpad.net/openoffice-pkgs ?
<Lns> erp...sorry, https://launchpad.net/~openoffice-pkgs/+archive/ppa
<Remaille> hi all
<Remaille> is there somewhere an edubuntu LTSP edition ?
<Remaille> a kind of ready to use
<Remaille> thanks
<Remaille> (it is not a LTSP question ;-))
<Lns> Remaille: Edubuntu is now an add-on that doesn't require LTSP.
<Lns> You can install LTSP via normal means in Ubuntu before/after installing Edubuntu
<Remaille> hum, ok so I ahve to install ltsp and edubuntu separatly ?
<Remaille> ok :)
<Lns> :)
<Remaille> I have juste tried LTSP alone to test : it worked baut i read that with edubuntu, it was ready to use "out of box"
<Remaille> maybe an old post
<Remaille> thanks
<Ahmuck> u need to install ubuntu alternate (f4) and choose ltsp
<Ahmuck> then install the edubuntu add-on
<Lns> Remaille: yeah, probably an old post (edubuntu used to install ltsp by default)
<Remaille> ok then :-) thanks
<Remaille> I am looking for something the easiest to use to show other people how nice and useful it could be
<Remaille> for their classrooms
<Ahmuck> edubuntu ltsp?
<Ahmuck> u'll need to setup a decent server first
<Remaille> we are testing with ubuntu+ltsp
<Ahmuck-Sr> there is a bit of a problem with pdf printing
<Ahmuck> pdf in firefox and pdf printing is crashing the thin client
#edubuntu 2009-02-06
<nothingman> hi, all
<fabio_> hi guys. I have just set up a ltsp network. The audio output of my thinclient is OK, but I cant record anything from the mic. How can I enable the mic on the thinclient?
<fabio_> i'm using Ubuntu 8.10
<fabio_> any idea, anyone?
<Ahmuck> fabio_:
<fabio_> Ahmuck any idea?
<Ahmuck> nope.  i'm sure someone knows however
<fabio_> nobody has tried... :(
<LaserJock> hi all
<Lns> hey LaserJock !
<Lns> fabio_: Mics I hear are easy to get set up with localapps.. i wouldn't imagine it's IMPOSSIBLE to get set up w/o it though
<Lns> I've personally never done it
<Lns> I could be wrong..
<fabio_> Lns somebody at #ltsp says that I need local apps enabled too
<fabio_> Lns just enabling local_apps should done the job?
<Lns> fabio_: i was just reading about it last night, and they gave a webcam example (cheese) of localapps and mentioned microphones.
<Lns> fabio_: not sure.. haven't used localapps, all my sites are on 8.04
<fabio_> Lns: but my application will run on the server, not on the client
<Lns> but i would assume so
<fabio_> its a softphone
<Lns> fabio_: does it run on a locally installed *buntu setup?
<Lns> with mic and all?
<fabio_> yes.
<fabio_> i just tested the audio rec of gnome
<Lns> ok, so i'd have to assume localapps would work. it's def. worth a try
<fabio_> I just enabled on lts.conf and rebooted the terminal. nothing new happened
<Lns> fabio_: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LTSPLocalAppSetup
<fabio_> Lns maybe it will work...
<fabio_> Lns but the problem is that the voip client i will run works under java
<Lns> fabio_: java browser applet, or standalone?
<fabio_> standalone
<Lns> fabio_: well i'm not sure, but i'd have to assume you could use that as a local app still
<fabio_> i will give a try
<fabio_> thanks anyway
<Lns> np
<Lns> good luck
<fabio_> thanks ;)
<Ahmuck> salsaga ?
<Ahmuck> is there a *deb for salasaga?
<LaserJock> I think there is
<riverfork> Hi, I'm new to IRC (sorry if I don't know standard protocol). I'm one of the main developers of TuxMath, part of Tux4Kids, which I believe is shipped as part of Edubuntu. I'm interested in a topic that may be more at the distribution/system level. I tried joining the mailing list several days ago, but never got sent the "Confirm your subscription" email (same thing happened with my attempt to join schooltool-dev). Anyone know what is up with that? Or is
<riverfork> this the best place for conversations anyway?
<loic-m> Should be
<LaserJock> riverfork: here is ok
<LaserJock> riverfork: but generally the mailing list will get you to a broader audience
<LaserJock> riverfork: do you need something in particular?
<riverfork> With regards to the mailing list: if it takes human intervention to "approve" my request to join, that would help.
<riverfork> However, I can mention the issue here briefly, you can tell me if you want more detail, or to save it for the list.
<LaserJock> riverfork: I don't think it should require human intervention to join
<LaserJock> riverfork: but go ahead and ask about the issue
<riverfork> I've checked my SPAM box (though there could be one I can't access) and I didn't find an intercepted message. Well, anyway...
<riverfork> Basically, it concerns infrastructure for free software in schools. Elementary schools in the US often run without "real" user accounts for each kid, instead assigning them a password-less login titled "Student" or something. TuxMath is needing to store per-student data. So we're thinking about how to set up the infrastructure for giving each student a fake user directory, and realizing this is something that might best be common across projects.
<LaserJock> right
<riverfork> A closely-related issue is expressing relationships between members of a school, say, that these 20 kids are in Mrs. Smith's class. Software should be able to go to Mrs. Smith's directory to read a common config file, and then look for special additional settings in their own home directory.
<loic-m> riverfork: like customized lessons, or a list of students?
<LaserJock> riverfork: yeah, that's fairly inline with some things we've been thinking about
<riverfork> Exactly. Or performance data (teachers want to know how kids are doing on the lessons), or a common high scores table. It's great if all the 2nd graders in Mrs. Smith's class compete against each other for high scores, but terrible if they also have to compete against 5th graders.
<LaserJock> what would really be useful is to set up a freedesktop.org taskforce on Education to look at things like configuration files in the classroom setting
<riverfork> Do you think there's any interest in a GSoC project to work on this stuff?
<LaserJock> well
<LaserJock> I think it would be longer term than GSoC
<LaserJock> for just Tuxmath perhaps
<LaserJock> but coming up with good standards for this seems like it'd be more involved and need to include a number of key players
<Ahmuck> thankfully, these issues are being discussed
<riverfork> Agreed with the "key players". I've already contacted GCompris (with some discussion there) and kdeedu (silence...). There seems to be at least some level of interest.
<riverfork> Another complication, of course, is that we support Mac & Win, and we'd want any solution to work for those platforms too (not that we don't want to encourage the spread of Edubuntu!)
<LaserJock> sure
<riverfork> Anyone have any particular suggestions about who I should contact?
<LaserJock> I wonder if we could come up with some sort of XDG path system
<riverfork> I should also give you a link to a post I made (TuxMath, TuxPaint, GCompris, and KDE-Edu) about the topic: http://sourceforge.net/mailarchive/forum.php?thread_name=200902011543.00580.holy%40wustl.edu&forum_name=tuxpaint-devel
<LaserJock> hmm
<LaserJock> I wonder if we could make a way to define "groups" that would then translate into paths
<LaserJock> so for desktop directories XDG has .config/user-dirs.dirs
<riverfork> The idea I outlined in that post is a hierarchical directory: school/grade/teacher/student.
<LaserJock> that defines several path vaiables
<LaserJock> *variables
<riverfork> I don't know about XDG yet, I'll read about it.
<riverfork> XDG might be a better way to go, but just to flesh out the approach we've been thinking about: the hierarchy lets you "read down" a config file (so you read config in the school directory, then descend and read any grade-specific overrides, etc.)
<LaserJock> riverfork: try http://standards.freedesktop.org/basedir-spec/latest/
<LaserJock> well, XDG would just let you have a standard, flexible way to do that
<riverfork> For a highscores file, the place you put it in the hierarchy defines the level at which competition occurs. So for example, if Mrs. Smith has a highscores file in her directory, the students in her class compete only with each other. If Mr. Jones and Mrs. Andrews are in the same grade as Mrs. Smith, but don't have a highscores file, then it defaults up to the grade level for them. Etc.
<riverfork> Thanks for the link, will check it out.
<riverfork> Oh rats, I just found out I have to sign off. What's the protocol for continuing this conversation? Should I just come back sometime over the weekend? If I leave the client open, will I get any intervening discussion (sorry to ask such stupid newbie questions).
<LaserJock> riverfork: yeah, you'd get it
<LaserJock> riverfork: but we should move this to a mailing list I think
<riverfork> Agreed. Is there anyone who can figure out what happened to my AWOL application to join? Email is holy AT wustl followed by edu.
<loic-m> riverfork: no need to leave your computer open, there's logs at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2009/02/ (but they only appear at the end of each day)
<Ahmuck> a user just shut down the server from a user account.  this was unexpected
<LaserJock> alright, back
#edubuntu 2009-02-07
<LaserJock> sbalneav: around?
<LaserJock> stgraber: ping?
<Mip5> Hey Gang - I've just followed the howto on updating the thin clients in ltsp, but I can't umount /proc - says the device is busy. Ubuntu 8.0.4 - any ideas?
<Ahmuck> nubae is ur man
<Ahmuck> er, nm
<Mip5> Ahmuck - thanks.
<Mip5> I wish I had a better handle on the process.
<Ahmuck> i thought u were talking about fat clients
<Ahmuck> sorry, wrong person
<Mip5> I've got thin clients
<Mip5> I just followed the howto https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/UpdatingChroot
<Mip5> on updating chroot - but obviously, I don't fully get what's happening....
<Mip5> okay - well, I'll check back later. Peace
<LaserJock> morning all
<Ahmuck> morning
 * Ahmuck has been way to busy lately
<Ahmuck> Changed the music format to .ogg, which SDL_mixer can play more reliably - is it SDL or perhaps the sound format?
<Ahmuck> http://www.huybers.net/poly/btc.html
#edubuntu 2009-02-08
<VSpike> Anyone got any suggestion for an ultra simple program launcher suitable for nursery/reception age children?  (3-6yrs)
<VSpike> I keep seeing these netbooks with really simple launchers, but none of them seem to have made it out into the wider world
<HedgeMage> VSpike: My son (about to turn 6) has been using plain old Xfce with a selection of programs linked on the desktop since he was about 3.
<HedgeMage> VSpike: So I haven't had cause to look for anything else.
<VSpike> HedgeMage: It's certainly one option, and not a bad one... was just looking for alternatives
<VSpike> I thought about wbar
<HedgeMage> If you have it narrowed down to 2-3 options I can use my kid as a guinea-pig for you. ;)
<VSpike> :)
<VSpike> Heh, I have 2 of my own as willing testers but thanks for the offer :D
<VSpike> TBH I'm more worried about the adults.  I want to recycle this PC a school discarded and give it back for use in the nursery school.
<VSpike> I just fear that if it's not instantly obvious, it won't get used or even turned on
 * HedgeMage nods
<VSpike> For the adults, the fact that it looks not like windows may make them not switch it on for the kids, or fear it
<HedgeMage> :(
<HedgeMage> I hate to see that happen.
<HedgeMage> Of course, my response is usually to turn it on and stick a kid or two in front, then make them watch what happens.
<VSpike> Maybe I just need to go and *show* them a bit .. a couple of top programs, like tuxpaint
<VSpike> Mine can show the others how to use tuxpaint :)
<VSpike> What other faves do your kids have?
<VSpike> KTuberling is usually popular
<HedgeMage> ri-li, tuxpaint, fillets-ng (though he only half understands it, the secret agent fish have him hooked), ktuberling, monsterz, secret maryo, frozen bubble, gcompris...
<VSpike> thanks, will check those out
<HedgeMage> circus linux, tux racer, and I Have No Tomatos
<HedgeMage> that's his whole list right now :)
<VSpike> The graphics on this machine *suck*, which rules out a lot of things
<VSpike> Trident Cyberblade
 * HedgeMage nods
<VSpike> Otherwise, it's OK. Athlon XP 1800+, 1GB of "found" RAM :)
<HedgeMage> brb
<VSpike> Sure
<VSpike> For some reason I can't get a working face browser for GDM, but maybe I just need to enable auto-login
<HedgeMage> back
<HedgeMage> I have face browser working -- note that you have to have chosen a theme that works with it
<HedgeMage> The only one of those apps I mentioned that might be a problem on old video is tux racer -- the rest are quite tolerant
<VSpike> hehe ri-li is fun, never seen it before
<VSpike> I will investigate the rest, because I've only seen a couple of them
<VSpike> Yeah, I selected a theme with face browser, just get an empty one
<VSpike> I've tried ticking the "include all users" option, and also turning it off an adding users manually
<HedgeMage> hang on, let me open the configurator here and I will walk you through it. :)
<VSpike> Oh, ta :)
<HedgeMage> Under the "Local" tab:
<HedgeMage> Style is "Themed with face browser"
<HedgeMage> Theme is "selected only"
<HedgeMage> From themes, choose "Happy Gnome with Browser" or "Human List"
<HedgeMage> Then under the "Users" tab:
<HedgeMage> Check "Include all users from /etc/passwd (not for NIS)"
<HedgeMage> make sure you have a default face selected, and a faces dir with faces for people to choose
<HedgeMage> Under the "Security" tab:
<VSpike> Ah, you got it, thanks!
<HedgeMage> Starting about halfway down
<HedgeMage> set "Minimal UID" to 1000
<VSpike> Didn't spot that I had to have "Themed with face browser" in style as well as selecting a theme with a face browser
<HedgeMage> Uncheck "Allow local system administrator login"
<HedgeMage> and check "Only allow login if user owns their home directory"
<HedgeMage> No problem!
<HedgeMage> do check those security settings even if everything else works, they can save you some headaches.
<VSpike> Thanks, I have those ones as you say
<HedgeMage> cool :)
<VSpike> Just wondering, is there any way to customise the menus in GDM? I think you kinda need the power ones, but I'd like to get rid of the language and session ones
<VSpike> It's a small thing but I can see people accidentally changing it and then getting confused
<VSpike> Probably have to hit the gdm config file
<HedgeMage> nah
<HedgeMage> under the "local" tab:
<HedgeMage> Uncheck "Show Actions Menu" -- it's just under the list of available themes.
<VSpike> Doesn't that get rid of the power control options too?
 * VSpike tries
<HedgeMage> I didn't think so, but check and find out
<HedgeMage> I have it all enabled here.  I'm the only one who uses my laptop, and the other box with a gui is only used by my son and I.
<HedgeMage> He's been well indoctrinated in the world of Linux, he can actually select the correct kernel from a list on bootup!  (Our shared box is my dev box, so it's a mix of normal and unstable stuff)
<VSpike> Heh it does the exact opposite of what I want :) remove the power stuff, keep the other stuff
<VSpike> I'll have a look in the gdm config file and google a bit - just wondered if you knew
<HedgeMage> hang on let me look at one other thing...
<VSpike> those menus (language, session) exhibit a behaviour that I see quite often in ubuntu - they start scrolled down so that the selected option is at the bottom and the only one visible
<VSpike> and the rest of the menu is empty space
<HedgeMage> nope...I have no clue
<VSpike> :) thanks for looking
<HedgeMage> np
<cdshan>  Hello! I have installed ubuntu 8.04 LTS server on my machine.  I have installed ltps and have configured dhcp.  The client boots into to the login screen but gives me an error message saying that .xsessions file is not present and window manager is not found.  What should I do?
<HedgeMage> cdshan: you might want to repeat your question for ogra -- he knows more about LTSP than me
<cdshan> this is the error I am getting after I enter the user name and password:
<cdshan> Xsession: X session started for shan at Fri Feb  6 19:16:34 IST 2009
<cdshan> Xsession: unable to start X session --- no "/home/shan/.xsession" file, no
<cdshan> "/home/shan/.Xsession" file, no session managers, no window managers, and no
<cdshan> terminal emulators found; aborting.
<Nubae-laptop> hey there folks
<Nubae-laptop> reporting from Fossdem
<Nubae-laptop> Where I had a great talk with the kde guys
<Nubae-laptop> who basically reiterated the fact the it is now an education project
<Nubae-laptop> I strongly agree now with Laserjock and others that we should move to kd
<Nubae-laptop> kde
 * ogra wasnt aware LaserJock wanted that
<Nubae-laptop> I was shown some example plasmoid apps that were education based that were extremely simply coded but amazingly useful. Basically kde 4 has become THE edu platform (apart from sugar) I think we should seriously discusss the move towards kde for edubuntu
<Nubae-laptop> laserjock was the one who inititated this
<ogra> as an optional thing as i understood
<Nubae-laptop> optional?
<ogra> whch exists since gutwsy but isnt maintained
<Nubae-laptop> look, the point here is kde-edu has a massive amount of devs compared to edubuntu
<Nubae-laptop> we need them
<Nubae-laptop> we need plasmoidsÃ§
<ogra> as i understood him he was looking for maintainers taking care of edubuntu-addon-kde
<ogra> which is dead since it exists
<Nubae-laptop> perhaps, because we are going about it the wrong way
<Nubae-laptop> we need to really involve the kde community
<ogra> well, edubuntu is an educational addon
<ogra> and needs to involve both communities of the big desktops
<ogra> or even the small ones
<ogra> in any cas its an addon and shouldnt care about the underlying desktops ... the addon and artwork packages need to integrate with both
<ogra> (or all three if you count in xfce)
<ogra> note that the edu apps were always used in a cross desktop manner in edubuntu
<ogra> the only thing that was focused directly on the dektop was always only the artwork related issues (usplash, wallpaper, icons)
<ogra> if you really want to re-fuel the old desktop wars, go for it ... but imho focusing on a single undelying desktop is the totally wrong approach
<ogra> it is an addon, leave it being an addon and make sure the respective communities help with DE artwork integration
<ogra> the only time wheer the desktop counted was when we still were building integrated installer CDs ... we siwtched away from that to exactly avoid the desktop specific issues ...
<alkisg> Well, we should probably start with asking for ltsp to support KDE :P :) :D
<ogra> send patches :P
<ogra> we made an attempt pre-gutsy to at least get their volume control working ... but the fixes never made it into productions
<ogra> -s
<ogra> local devices support needs hal integration to properly work with KDE since it doesnt monitor /media like gvfs and gio do
<alkisg> I'll give it a shot -probably at summer- but you know that greater forces would be needed :)
<ogra> and there is a lot more
<alkisg> Ouch... forget it, I don't know what you're talking about! :D :D :D
<ogra> i know tha stgraber was pretty desparate with all the issues KDE had
<ogra> though that was 3.x
<ogra> its likely the perfect time to avoid all the issues from the start in KDE 4
<alkisg> So if hal was used, then that would work in gnome also? Or are you talking about completely different implementations? (about localdevs)
<ogra> the prob is that you need a connection between the session dbus on teh server and the system dbus on the client for ltspfs via hal
<ogra> once you have that, you solve ltspfs for all desktops, shutdown/reboot/suspend ... and a lot more
<alkisg> Doesn't sshfs now support all the things ltsp needs to replace ltspfs? (I thought it was missing some stat* function that got implemented later on...)
<ogra> the only attempt i have seen yet that could work is a very hackish addition to dbus clled gabriael
<ogra> *gabriel
<ogra> that tried to establish an ssh tunnel between two machines to forward dbus
<alkisg> OK, I'm certain that this isn't for me. :) So I'll just join the fan club with nubae and LaserJock and ask scotty / stgraber and the rest to support KDE :P :D
<ogra> ltspfs is two parts ... the transport protocol (ltspfs and ltspfsd) and the mont scripts
<ogra> the mount scripts need to be replaced by proper hal and dbus implementation, ltspfs transport is fine
<ogra> hacking up sshfs for it would be an option indeed, but the prob lies elsewhere
<ogra> the ltspfs communication layer needs to be fixed to work with all desktops which means to use hal and dbus instead of scripts that talk though the ssh tunnel
<ogra> http://people.ubuntu.com/~ogra/ltspfs-hal-root.png
<ogra> that was the start of an attempt i made, but due to lacking time i never finished any actual implementation
<alkisg> Argh... lucky netmobile users...
<ogra> it created an ltspfs root device ... hal would then need to be hacked up to attach all client side devces to this rootdevice
<ogra> then you could add .fdi files that make it use the ltspfs transport layer
<nothingman> hi, all
<Meshezabeel> heya nothingman
<nothingman> what's new?
<Meshezabeel> not much, you?
<nothingman> besides I have three servers going now
<Meshezabeel> wow :)
<nothingman> one's my laptop, and I had some students at my smaller school logged in on laptops as thin clients
<nothingman> after they left, I realized I had to add the fstab entry to mount the /home directory for the fat clients, so I played with that myself for a little bit
<nothingman> need more RAM before things will work right, though
<nothingman> :-P
<nothingman> my laptop crawls with 5 logged-in thin client users, or 3 fat clients at login screen
<Meshezabeel> lol, it's rare for a laptop to be a server ;)
<nothingman> heh
<nothingman> no desktops with decent enough specs at that school
<nothingman> in fact, when I walk in my laptop's the best suited for the purpose
<nothingman> but I'll probably still have to double my RAM to serve 9 clients
<Meshezabeel> lol, indeed
<Meshezabeel> I can just hear the fan running at full speed :p
<nothingman> actually, it does OK
<nothingman> I should probably kill gdm
<nothingman> gain back about half
<alkisg> My laptop (core 2 duo 2Ghz / 4 Gb RAM) works fine as an ltsp server with 8 clients, and I think it could handle twice as much... :)
<nothingman> yeah
<nothingman> mine's an Athlon 3200 with 1Gb
<nothingman> up to 2.0Ghz
<alkisg> ..and 100mpbs ethernet?
<nothingman> yup
<nothingman> that's what's gonna kill me, I think
<alkisg> Yeah, with 2 gb ram you could serve 10 clients, but with 100 mbps you won't be able to provide good screen refreshing
<nothingman> well, I'm hoping to use fat clients, but I still have to use a good amount of bandwidth for each client to access the NBD, right?
<alkisg> I don't think so, at least booting (I didn't test fat clients) wasn't so bad with 100mbps
<alkisg> I guess it's ok for fat clients
#edubuntu 2010-02-08
<mhall119> anyone know if OpenOffice 4 Kids is being packaged for Lucid?
<Ahmuck-Jr> openoffice 4 kids ?!
<mhall119> yeah, the're making a more kid friendly version
<mhall119> it's in 0.8 (beta) right now
<mhall119> someone was asking me if we were going to use it for Qimo 2.0
<Ahmuck-Jr> looks kewl
<Ahmuck-Jr> joerg_: new project?
<joerg_> Ahmuck-Jr, www.myserv-project.org
<joerg_> absolutely non commercial and open source
<sbalneav> mhall119: if it isn't in the repos at this point, I'd say no.
<sbalneav> joerg_: Let me know when you'd like me to look at an ldap module.
<joerg_> sbalneav, hey...thanks, that is nice :)
<joerg_> sbalneav, I have played with a lot of stuff recently and even set up a slapd :)
<joerg_> sbalneav, trying to implement the basic ideas to give fellow developers some starting point.
<joerg_> sbalneav, give me a shout if you know some web designer who'd like to give the whole thing a comm look and feel :)
<joerg_> sbalneav, do you want to have a look at it?
<sbalneav> No, I'm not much for web stuff :(  I'm more a plumbing guy.
<sbalneav> HedgeMage may be interested.
<joerg_> sbalneav, no, I mean at the status of the whole thing
<joerg_> sbalneav, then I'd give u a demo account
<sbalneav> Sure
<sbalneav> thanks
<joerg_> sbalneav, have u got ten minutes right now?
<sbalneav> Not at the moment, I'm madly trying to fix another bug :(
<sbalneav> Morning all
<highvoltage> sbalneav!
<highvoltage> morning!
<sbalneav> highvoltage: have a look at my ldap page?
<highvoltage> sbalneav: I did indeed.
<highvoltage> sbalneav: I don't know enough about ldap to give constructive feedback, but just reading through it it seems easy to follow and well layed out
<highvoltage> sbalneav: I'll try it out some time
<sbalneav> Hmmm, I need to figure out the magic needed for asking debconf questions.
<sbalneav> That way, we could get the edubuntu-ldap meta packages started.
<ogra> sbalneav, phew, have fun ...
<highvoltage> sbalneav: steal it from other packages :)
<sbalneav> Yeah, there's always that :)
<highvoltage> sbalneav: I think it's much easier than reading the actual debconf docs
<sbalneav> take a look at the source for the slapd package.
<sbalneav> With 1 question, all that stuff on the wiki page could be turned into a package.
<sbalneav> We just need to ask the password.
<alkisg> sbalneav: you need (1) a template with the question, (2) . /usr/share/debconf/confmodule, (3) db_get your_question, (4) db_stop
<sbalneav> alkisg: thanks!  I'll look into that.
<alkisg> sbalneav: I've recently used that for sch-scripts, so if you need any help, ping me :)
<sbalneav> That wiki page will end up becoming the core of Edubuntu's post-lucid "ldap everywhere" strategy.
<alkisg> (btw, what did you think of the project?)
<alkisg> (apart from it being immature :D)
<sbalneav> alkisg: I've set aside some time this week to take a look at it
<alkisg> sbalneav: thank you - be sure to `bzr pull` before you look at it, as much new code is added every day.
<sbalneav> shouldn't be too hard to externalize the code into generic objects.
 * alkisg is able to use sch-scripts currently to build a fat client chroot with no console involved at all... but that's only the begining
<ogra> wohoo
<alkisg> !info dnsmasq-base hardy
<ubottu> dnsmasq-base (source: dnsmasq): A small caching DNS proxy and DHCP/TFTP server. In component main, is optional. Version 2.41-2ubuntu2.2 (hardy), package size 197 kB, installed size 600 kB
<alkisg> ogra ^^
<ogra> alkisg, yeah, i see -base in main too
<ogra> alkisg, if you can safely convert people on upgrades without breaking their setups, why not move to it ...
<alkisg> ogra, schools here use dnsmasq in proxydhcp mode, because they use routers as dhcp server. And it's OK to tell them "wipe your disk and reinstall the new LTS version" every two years :)
<alkisg> So I'm not really concerned about compatibility or upgrades - I'm only concerned about bugs etc...
<ogra> alkisg, i thought you talked about the default in ubuntu
<alkisg> Nah... I'm too young to Ubuntu and too old in life to try that :D
<XuzhouJim> Can't seem to send to channel on ltsp.
<alkisg> You need to register your nickname first
<crimsun> alkisg: any updates on edubuntu/ltsp audio [lucid]?
<crimsun> alkisg: i.e., anything I should have on my radar
<alkisg> hey crimsun - I don't think so, everything seems fine so far
<crimsun> alkisg: good to read, thanks
<alkisg> I'll give it a look tomorrow, it's too late here, and I'll ping you if I see something, but really, I think everything's fine. Thanks! :)
<crimsun> ok
<XuzhouJim> I'm having an audio problem. Just got my server up and booting thin clients but getting bad feedback. Mic's being routed through speakers.
<alkisg> XuzhouJim: try MIC_VOLUME=10 and VOLUME=50 in lts.conf
<XuzhouJim> Tried setting MIC_VOLUME and FRONT_MIC_VOLUME to zero but no effect.
<XuzhouJim> Where can I register my nickname?
<alkisg> In your client settings.
<alkisg> Too late here, good night all.
#edubuntu 2010-02-09
<stgraber> alkisg: ping
<alkisg> Hi stgraber
<alkisg> That tftpd thing is a pain :)
<stgraber> well, currently I'm debugging some iTalc as it seems the launcher in Karmic is broken with ltsp ;)
<alkisg> Ouch. I think I'll move away from iTalc, as I couldn't make it work in my newest lab. It crashed every few seconds...
<alkisg> Also the developer isn't really responsive when one sends patches or questions... :-/
 * alkisg wishes there were more upstream italc developers
 * alkisg just noticed "Karmic" there. stgraber, in which case, exactly?
<stgraber> when iTalc runs locally on the thin client
<stgraber> I just found what was wrong and fixed it
<stgraber> the code to determine isd_host was inside the except determining isd_port
<alkisg> Ah. Yeah I think Gadi said something about that a week ago... I don't know, I've never used it this way
<stgraber> so basically, if isd_port is set as xprop, it would never look for isd_host
<stgraber> anyway, fixed and uploaded to lucid
<alkisg> Maybe we should set all the info in the xprop
<alkisg> Not just the port, but the ip as well.
<alkisg> Ah, ok
<alkisg> Were the shutdown/reboot patches included?
<stgraber> I don't think so, I'm a bit backlogged on iTalc work.
<stgraber> would you be able to propose a branch on LP with everything that you proposed to be included ?
<alkisg> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/italc/+bug/367960
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 367960 in italc ""power down" request fails on 9.04; logout instead" [Medium,Incomplete]
<alkisg> Hmmm does that have to be done before FF?
<alkisg> I could have a look at it later on this month, but not right now...
<stgraber> no, that's packaging work, I can still upload after FF
<alkisg> ok
<ogra> stgraber, i'd discuss the tftp issue on ubuntu-devel btw ... the path change was long ago already we just didnt sync it anymore in karmic
<alkisg> ogra, so is apache also going to use /srv?
<ogra> probably, not sure
<ogra> but i know the changes have been discussed in debian a lot back then
<ogra> so DDs will know about it and comment if you start a thread on u-devel
<alkisg> Ah. If this has been given a fair amount of thought, then maybe the best thing would be to change ltsp to use the new defaults.
<ogra> well, lets hear people that participated in the debian discussion :)
 * alkisg wonders if ltsp-preinst can preseed tftpd..
<ogra> not sure thats policy compliant
<ogra> since you cant be sure tftpd isnt already installed
 * alkisg asked in ubuntu-devel this morning, but didn't get any answers... so waits for stgraber to make the next move :)
<ogra> so you would change an existing setup
<alkisg> Why?
<ogra> i was talking about the ML :)
<alkisg> We could check all the debconf selections and conffiles...
<ogra> alkisg, imagine you ahve a server you run since several releases and picked to go with one or the other option ...
<ogra> now you install ltsp and the setup is silently changed
<alkisg> It'll be stored in debconf, then
<alkisg> No need to change his setup
<alkisg> I was talking about preseeding for new setups only...
<ogra> no need to preseed then
<alkisg> For the cd installer, preseeding is needed, we don't want to prompt the user about the path
<alkisg> And I wouldn't prompt for new ltsp installations either...
<alkisg> (if tftp is installed as part of ltsp-server, then we assume we know where we want tftpdir to be)
<stgraber> alkisg: so you sent an e-mail to ubuntu-devel ?
<alkisg> stgraber: no - just the irc channell :)
<alkisg> I'm not subscribed to the ML
<sbalneav> Morning all
<stgraber> ok, I'll send an e-mail to ubuntu-devel then
<sbalneav> Did I read a bug report email correctly today?
<sbalneav> That edubuntu's live dvd *only* and no alternative install dvd?
<sbalneav> i.e. the text based one?
<alkisg> According to cjwatson, we're now completely graphical :) No more text-based edubuntu...
<stgraber> ogra, alkisg: I'll pastebin it for both of you to read
<alkisg> Thanks
<sbalneav> I don't like that at all.
<alkisg> sbalneav, there's still the live dvd for text based installations...
<sbalneav> But the alternative dvd had all the actual packages on them, and could be easily used for ltsp chroot building.
<alkisg> I think Edubuntu is more targeted to teachers, who don't really like text... they get too much of it for their lessons already :P
<alkisg> (or students, etc etc)
<sbalneav> Was this discussed somewhere?
<ogra> you take away the tasksel option with that
<alkisg> In the last few meetings?
<ogra> which has no graphical equivalent
<alkisg> Can't one use the live dvd to install ubuntu, and then tasksel install edubuntu-desktop-gnome on top of that?
 * alkisg wasn't the one that put the "no text installer" idea, but supports it...
<ogra> yes, but you cant install a plain server that gives you a LAMP and mail machine for example
<ogra> so you exclude all advanced school admins
<ogra> the kind of people that dont want a gui on their server
<ogra> before you could do both from the same DVD
<alkisg> ? why would advanced school admins that want to install a LAMP / mail server use the edubuntu dvd and not the server one?
<ogra> because its already on there and they only need to do one download
<stgraber> sbalneav: LTSP will be moved in the Live environment. Classroom server wasn't used and had a lot of issues so we chose to drop it for this time and potentially add it back later.
<ogra> you simply force edubuntu into that GIU only side now
<alkisg> ogra: yes, and save 2 Gb downloads for all teachers/students...
<ogra> which excludes university adimns advanced shool admins etc
<ogra> ??
<alkisg> I mean, if a student wants to download edubuntu, why would he have to download 2 gb more just to support an admin who can use the server cd?
<alkisg> (and I believe there will be more students using edubuntu than admins...)
<ogra> well, all i'm saying is that you exclude a lot of people and opportunities that were covered before
<ogra> what you actually want is a liveCD apparently
<ogra> not an edubuntu DVD with all its benefits
<alkisg> A live edubuntu dvd, yes...
<ogra> but thats up to you guys
<alkisg> Not a CD - edu apps don't fit to a single cd
<ogra> i'm just pointing out ...
<ogra> i think its a big mistake, but your choice
<alkisg> Doesn't the ubuntu live cd cover all those cases?
<alkisg> (i.e. the admin that wants to install a lamp server etc?)
 * ogra somehow thinks he understood that "its own special edu distro again" wrongly 
<stgraber> ogra, sbalneav, alkisg: http://pastebin.com/m2a29411e
<ogra> and specifically all the fuss that went on recently in this channel about a perfect ldap setup, web driven user maintenance etc etc
<ogra> stgraber, wow, i wasnt aware of that version jump :)
<alkisg> stgraber: syntax error there? "especially has it's very likely to break"
<stgraber> alkisg: indeed, fixed.
<alkisg> I think I'd also ask about apache - I think those changes should be synchronized...
<ogra> stgraber, looks good (apart from the typo)
<alkisg> I.e. they should both move to /srv at the same time, or not at all...
<alkisg> (i.e. maybe we should leave tftp as it is for now, and change it later, when apache in ubuntu is ready for the change)
<ogra> alkisg, well, follow up on stephanes mail then with that concern
<ogra> sounds valid to me
<ogra> but should be seen by more eyes
<stgraber> ogra: well, experience showed that university and other cases where you want the server side of Edubuntu currently don't use our DVD as using netboot (mini.iso) is a lot faster. I'm clearly not against shipping a well designed and working Edubuntu server and we'll have that included as soon as we have someone working on it (but I'd avoid shipping the whole desktop twice though)
<alkisg> Mhmok, /me subscribes to the the ML...
<ogra> stgraber, well, but that means if you got it in L+1 you have to reverse all you do in L
<alkisg> This one? (it isn't in launchpad?) https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel
<ogra> seems a waste of work to me
<ogra> alkisg, the core lists are mostly in mailman :)
<alkisg> k, ty
<ogra> and yes, that one
<stgraber> ogra: for Lucid, the main focus is to have the desktop updated, good looking, having a possibility to get the netbook interface and LTSP in a more user friendly way. Then I'm fine with improving the server side in the upcoming releases assuming we have people commiting to work on that.
<ogra> well, the most discussions i have seen in the channel over the last weeks were by people intrested in contributing to a slick server solution
<stgraber> ogra: well, not really, I wouldn't revert the LTSP change or that repository change. We'd just add what's needed for a server install to the seed and for LTSP, use the chroot that's already included on the DVD
<stgraber> ogra: the LDAP stuff is sbalneav's plan for 12.04 IIRC
<ogra> i'm not talking LTSP here :)
<ogra> and i didnt mean sbalneav who is swamped in other work
<ogra> all persons that expressed interest in joining the team newly seemed to have some server based interests
<alkisg> Any names?
<ogra> joerg_ for example
<ogra> i saw at least three other guys in hot discussions here
<alkisg> I think joerg_ wanted a web-based frontend
<ogra> imho the change you plan simply excludes that part of the community
<alkisg> That can even be included in the live dvd... you don't need a text based installer for that..
<ogra> alkisg, how would he get that without the ability to install a webserver ?
<alkisg> Why wouldn't he be able to install a web server?
<ogra> well, as i said its beyond me to discuss that
<ogra> i'm totally swamped in other stuff and surely dont contribute much but my opinion to edubuntu anymore ...
<alkisg> Your opinion is always welcome
<ogra> i just expressed that opinion ... seems the decision happened anyway :)
<ogra> i just think its a failure
<alkisg> ...but personally I don't understand why those things can't be done from a graphical installer...
<ogra> and wanted to mention that with no offense to anyone or even that decision
<ogra> because it doesnt have that ability
<ogra> its a live image installer
 * alkisg didn't take part on that decision. He just thinks it was a good decision...
<ogra> and it wont grow that ability
<stgraber> ogra: I guess we'll see how it works. I don't think it's a bad choice for Lucid and everyone seemed happy with it (both at UDS and during meetings). I personaly always had in mind that the Content server or whatever we call it will come back in the near future.
<alkisg> ogra, can't a live cd install a web server if it uses the cd as a package source?
<ogra> alkisg, no, not as its designed atm, it has to be in the live image so everyomne (even desktop installs) gets it
<stgraber> alkisg: it could and we'll do something like that for the netbook interface and LTSP, though I guess in most case you don't want the whole UI for a web server.
<ogra> the live installer copies the live image 1:1 and then removes the unneeded bits
<ogra> you will need to redesign ubiquity for such additional features
<ogra> or have multiple live images
<alkisg> But afaik there *are* some packages in the live ubuntu cd... which doesn't have a text based installer... or did I get that wrong?
<ogra> all duplicating themselves
<sbalneav> So, basically, for people in countries with poor internet access, if they get someone to mail them an Edubuntu dvd, they can't use it to build the ltsp image.
<sbalneav> this is a huge loss.
<ogra> alkisg, you have a /pool directory on the live CD from which you can apt-get install packages manually for non networked systems
<joerg_> poor countries like germany :)
<joerg_> with 64kbit isdn internet connections :D
<ogra> joerg_, ++
<ogra> :)
<stgraber> ogra: that's true though we'll hack a bit around that (lacking the time to properly patch ubiquity) so the user gets prompted to install the netbook interface and/or LTSP.
<stgraber> after ubiquity is done
<ogra> you are aware that netboot and desktop dont work well together
<stgraber> sbalneav: that's not true, a generated ltsp.img will be on the DVD and will be unpacked if the user choses to install LTSP
<ogra> at least in a switchable way
<ogra> ?
<stgraber> ogra: yes, that's why it will only be installed if the user choses to after the install, the packages won't be installed otherwise
<ogra> not sure if the desktop team fixed that but we had to remove the ability to switch completely because it broke all sorts of things
<sbalneav> stgraber: and if the user then wants to install something like Firefox in the chroot for localapps?
<ogra> (in karmic that is)
<ogra> sbalneav, he would have to do that post install from an online archive ...
<stgraber> sbalneav: indeed, that's the case where we'll have a bit less functionality than we used to have. He'll have to download firefox and its dependencies in this csae.
<ogra> but definately not from the DVD
<alkisg> sbalneav: he can do all that with the live ubuntu dvd, can't he? Shouldn't edubuntu target different needs than the live ubuntu dvd?
<ogra> alkisg, he cant
<sbalneav> ogra: right, but with the alt dvd, s/he could just grab the package from there.
<ogra> alkisg, you dont have packages on a live image (unless you explicitly put them into /pool, which you guys just disabled)
<ogra> sbalneav, exactly my point :)
<alkisg> ogra, I said the *ubuntu* dvd, not the edubuntu one..
<stgraber> ogra: he said "ubuntu" not "edubuntu" :) and yes the Ubuntu DVD covers that
<alkisg> Doesn't that have all the packages?
<ogra> alkisg, sure, if he wants to download another 4G
<sbalneav> I personally, in my travels to Brazil, know of, and have worked with, people who are setting up LTSP labs in areas where there is NO internet access.  They have to truck everything in on a CD/DVD
<ogra> so you already excluded the parts of the world that had the most edubuntu users by switching to DVD ... now you exclude even more ...
<sbalneav> Right, I was about to say, the move to dvd was probably jarring enough for these people.
<ogra> yeah
<sbalneav> They may be able to borrow dvd players, but you just can't get internet in the Amazon interior
<ogra> or africa
<alkisg> So what did edubuntu offer to these countries that the live ubuntu dvd didn't ?
<sbalneav> A proper package archive with all the packages that they could add with apt-cd
<sbalneav> the live filesystem doesn't have those packages.
<alkisg> That's on the ubuntu dvd, and has more packages than edubuntu.
<alkisg> Anything else?
<sbalneav> Now they need two dvds
<alkisg> No, just one
<ogra> alkisg, back then they could get it from shipit ... it was a CD for which they rather easily could find something to isntall the media from
<alkisg> The ubuntu dvd...
<ogra> now you need internet for two DVDs, a DVD writer and player
<alkisg> Why two dvds? Why isn't the ubuntu dvd enough?
<sbalneav> So we're telling people they need two dvds?  One to install Edubuntu from, and then one Ubuntu dvd for the packages?
<ogra> heh
<ogra> anyway, i need to go back to work ... FF approaching quickly ... i expressed my concerns
<ogra> decision is yours :)
<sbalneav> I mean, before, we could just tell these people: you need the alternative install dvd.  You don't get the graphical installer, but you DO get everything you need to setup a full lab WITHOUT an internet connection.
<alkisg> And they can still do that with JUST the ubuntu live dvd.
<ogra> and how do they get their edubuntu desktop ?
<sbalneav> Then we're driving them away from Edubuntu
<alkisg> (btw, that's what teachers here are doing in places with 64kbps connections - they're using the ubuntu dvd)
<sbalneav> right, so if we generated the edubuntu alternate dvd, they wouldn't have to.
<alkisg> sbalneav: also, that was not true. There was no language support in the alternate cd. That was only true for english speaking countries..
<alkisg> They'd still need internet access or an additional media.
<ogra> on the dvd ??
<sbalneav> Right, which is why I've ALSO been arguing that we should be using the space on the dvd NOT FOR SILLY PRE-PACKAGED LTSP CHROOTS!!!!11one, but for mor langpacks
<sbalneav> since you can GENERATE the ltsp chroot from the dvd
<alkisg> I think stgraber has put all the langpacks now.
<sbalneav> Great.  As it should be.
<sbalneav> That was the greatest failing of the cd.
<stgraber> yeah, I spent a week fixing the langpacks
<ogra> has anyone tested the ltsp-live setup with more than one client ?
<stgraber> sbalneav: do you think people installing things in the chroot is really that much of an issue ? Do they have people powerful enough for localapps in country where they don't have fast internet ?
<stgraber> sbalneav: if it's really an issue, I don't have any problem putting a fat-client image on the DVD instead with the fat-client mode turned off, that way they'll have everything in it and can enable these localapps when they want
<sbalneav> They probably don't, but why should we limit that case.
<sbalneav> Here's my opinion, FWIW:
<stgraber> ogra: that's on highvoltage's todo list
<ogra> stgraber, i tried something like that back in the days and it was unusable ...
<ogra> but probably CD roms are more speedy nowadays
<alkisg> ogra: ltsp in a live dvd? I tried it 2 months ago, it worked fine.
<sbalneav> 1) I won't argue with a live boot.  Personally, I don't use it.  I'd rather install text mode.  However, text mode SHOULD be available as a last resort for people with broken video.
<stgraber> ogra: I'd also expect that the machine used for that has more RAM (at least 2GB), so caching will make it a lot faster. But that's still to be tested.
<sbalneav> 2) The DVD should have a proper APT archive, so that ALL packages that we ship can be installed from the DVD, regardless of internet connection status.
<ogra> alkisg, with more than one person using it
<sbalneav> 3) ALL langpacks should be there *by default*.
<alkisg> ogra, my squashfs was 1 Gb, it could easily be loaded in RAM, all of it..
<alkisg> (the casper one)
<alkisg> I can't imagine any ltsp servers with less than 2 gb
<ogra> the point is that it isnt by default, what did you add to casper to achieve that ?
<ogra> its mounted only from the CD
<sbalneav> If we have to sacrifice a live boot, or live ltsp chroot to obtain 2 and 3, then, In My Humble Opinion, thats what should happen, because 2 and 3 ensure that we can bring Edubuntu to *the widest possible audience*.  I don't care about bling and first impressions.  I care about making sure it's available to everyone.
<ogra> if you start FF or OOo it will just be darn slow
<XuzhouJim> Hi all, new here. Still wrestling with that audio feedback thing. "Solved" it by unplugging the mic, but I want students to be able to use the mic. I'm a little confused as to how to edit the lts.conf. I know there are two, one requiring an image remake. Found that one at: /opt/ltsp/i386/etc and it referred me to: var/lib/tfftp/ltsp/i386/lts.conf
<sbalneav> But that's just me.
<ogra> sbalneav, and me :)
<alkisg> ogra, nothing. I just told the teachers/testers not to take into account the speed on the first 15 minutes of using the dvd, but only after that...
<ogra> heh
<ogra> great if you have a 20min presentation
<ogra> which i thought was the only purpose of the live-ltsp
<alkisg> I don't :) I have teachers that want to test if their labs are suitable for ltsp.
<XuzhouJim> However, no lts.conf there but pxelinux.cfg/default
 * stgraber has to run to a meeting, was great hearing everyone's opinion and we'll have to consider some options to take that into account. Would have been better to know that at UDS time though ;)
<ogra> stgraber, i wasnt aware of that plan, sorry
<alkisg> Bye stgraber
<ogra> XuzhouJim, you can create the file if you need it
<alkisg> sbalneav: I think the plan is to have all of the 3 things you mentioned
<alkisg> (except for the last resort == text mode :D)
<XuzhouJim> do I need section headings or just MIC_VOLUME=10 and VOLUME=50?
<alkisg> You need a [Default] section heading
<XuzhouJim> indent section headings or just options?
<alkisg> [Default]
<alkisg> MIC_VOLUME=10
<alkisg> VOLUME=50
<alkisg> Put that in /var/lib/tftpboot/ltsp/i386/lts.conf.
<XuzhouJim> OK, BRB
<XuzhouJim> OK, that did something but now I can't get the mic to record. Can I get the mic to work WITHOUT the feedback squeel?
<sbalneav> XuzhouJijm: is it just a case that the volume's too low?
<sbalneav> If you're using a mic, you really should be using headphones.
<XuzhouJijm> I adjusted the input volume. Then I can hear background noise but no voice. Am using a headphone/mic combo
<ogra> great ... stgraber has support from the server team on the tftp issue ... good sign
<sbalneav> You're getting feedback.... with headphones?! Wow.
<XuzhouJijm> Sorry, didn't explain well.
<Ahmuck> ping
<XuzhouJijm> The mic is being routed through the speaker/headphone. With headphones no feedback but stiil get too much noise. When I set mic_volume=10, don't get the background noise but can't record either.
<XuzhouJijm> Is it just a matter of playing with the mic_volume and volume settings till  I get a good balance?
<sbalneav> I'd say, yes.
<sbalneav> Go up by 5's I'd say, so try 15, 20, etc.
<alkisg> XuzhouJijm: afaik there's a problem with sound initialization - it has to be low to get rid of the feedback, but after the initialization it should be high again, and it isn't.
<alkisg> XuzhouJijm: if you use the mixer while recording your voice, and raise the mic volume, doesn't it work ok?
<alkisg> Or do you get feedback then as well?
<XuzhouJijm> raising the mic volume in the mixer just records a background buzz, no voice.
<XuzhouJijm> Can you point me to the section I should read up on in the LTSPManual?
<lns_> stgraber: ping? you remember https://bugs.launchpad.net/ltsp-cluster/+bug/178895/comments/29 ?
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 178895 in audacity "Audacity does not mesh with PulseAudio" [Low,Fix released]
<lns_> sbalneav: ping?
<sbalneav> lns_: pong
<lns_> sbalneav: hey - did you get my msg last night re: session time limits in gnome?
<sbalneav> No, I didn't
<sbalneav> lns_: Can you repaste?
<lns_> sbalneav: well basically I was wondering if something such as a "user session time limit", whether it be per day/week/month/etc, is something that might want to go into Gnome itself, or a separate utility that could be developed
<alkisg> lns_, have you looked at gnome nanny?
<lns_> alkisg: yep, I haven't used it at all though - are you using it?
<alkisg> lns_, no, (I've installed it once but didn't get to use it), but it does have session time limit support...
<lns_> It seems to be kind of geared toward a very specific audience (small children who need access restrictions)
<alkisg> And even for specific hours per day, if one needs it
<lns_> It would seem strange to install something like that in a high school
<alkisg> So I guess code could be taken from there (under a different UI, of course...)
<alkisg> lns_: why? I don't think it's necessary for the UI to be shown to the students
<lns_> alkisg: not just students but staff perception...
<alkisg> Anyway, I didn't use it so I can't express any opinions - just thought I'd give the link :)
<lns_> alkisg: thx =) Yeah I looked a bit at it but it seems like something like user session time limits could be something real easy to implement (maybe?) outside of this big program
<sbalneav> yeah, I was going to say, nanny's already there.
<lns_> sbalneav: have you used it?
<lns_> looks like you can only install via source - no packaging/integration...this is something that i've had many requests for in the past
<lns_> with a dist. like edubuntu it would be really neat to have that kind of functionality ootb
<sbalneav> I beleive they have a ppa, if not, I'll look at packaging it.
<sbalneav> I haven't had time to play with it, but I know it does time restrictions.
<lns_> yeah i saw a screenie on their site, it looks neat
<lns_> nice little graph with green/red bars to show when someone can log in and when they can't
<lns_> i was thinking "hmm, pessulus integration"... ;)
<alkisg> It does have ubuntu packages, I installed it from their ppa
 * lns_ googles
<lns_> goes down to jaunty, not bad
 * lns_ is starting to mentally ditch the idea that anyone wants to do anything for hardy anymore ;)
<lns_> https://launchpad.net/~guadalinex-members/+archive/ppa/+packages
#edubuntu 2010-02-10
<sbalneav> Evening all
<Ahmuck> hear hear ... I may be able to demo edubuntu in some form to one of the local schools :)
<Ahmuck> at least there may be interest soon.
<sbalneav> Congrats
<Lns> Ahmuck, woohoo! If there's anything I can do to help, let me know - keep us in the loop!
<Lns> hi sbalneav
 * Lns orders pints for the chan
 * sbalneav quaffs pint
<Ahmuck> apache directory studio ?  LDAP ?
<Lns> wow, looks nice
<Lns> anyone have any exp. w/it?
<sbalneav> gq, this, etc are all nice, but I'm never sure who they're geared to.
<sbalneav> They're far to complicated for a non-professional admin (read: teacher) who just wants "to add a user"
<sbalneav> And for a full time admin like me, once you get onto ldap, you find yourself scripting everything, and wanting to just deal with the command line tools so you can diddle with 500 entries at a single swipe, as opposed to plinking around in a gui.
<sbalneav> I wish there was a good single GTK app for dealing with LDAP
<sbalneav> Something that's nice and simple.
<sbalneav> gq's there, but it's buggy as all get out.
<sbalneav> This looks nice, but it's a packaging nightmare
<sbalneav> eclipse + java + apache directory studio = a lot of work.
<sbalneav> http://sourceforge.net/projects/gqclient/files/
<sbalneav> last time it was touched was back in 2008
<sbalneav> Lns: You deal with LDAP?
<Lns> sbalneav, admittedly no.. I've tried at it a few times, I kinda get the structure (o= ou= etc.) but definitely haven't mastered it yet
<Sorell> I have a question
<Sorell> I have 2 nics on my ubuntu LTSP box
<Sorell> and am wondering why it needs 2 ports
<Sorell> does it split the network traffic up or is one of them just used for the network boot service
<aflorio_> hi guys.. i'm a teacher.. i'm searching for a software i can use to make tests... i want to test my students with custom question,,. you know.. as usual writing test, but made in front of a pc
<highvoltage> hey all
<sbalneav> Morning all
<stgraber> alkisg: I'm pushing an updated tftpd-hpa to my PPA for testing
<stgraber> the server team's position is to restore previous behavior
<stgraber> except for inetd where we'll switch to daemon
<sbalneav> so tftpd-hpa will run by itself, no inetd now?
<stgraber> right
<stgraber> it's a two line change to revert to the default behavior, except for the inetd thing, so we'll probably keep it as a daemon as long as it performs at least as well as inetd
<sbalneav> Yeah, I have no problem with that.
<highvoltage> stgraber: hmm, I think the ship seed may need some tweaking, dhcp3-server and ltsp-server-standalone are not available in the packages pool on the disc
<stgraber> highvoltage: fixed
<stgraber> highvoltage: I change ltsp-server by ltsp-server-standalone which recommends dhcp3-server, so we should have everything after that
<highvoltage> stgraber: thanks!
<highvoltage> stgraber: imho there's some good potential for future (or maybe even this) implementations of the ltsp-live cd. I think we could have a little gui that asks you:
<highvoltage> stgraber: 1. whether you want to export the whole livecd or a thin client session
<highvoltage> stgraber: 2. what interface you'd like to run dhcpd on (if at all)
<highvoltage> stgraber: 3. whether you'd like to load the ltsp.squashfs or the filesystem.squashfs into tmpfs
<highvoltage> I guess even further on it could have some support for selecting a preseed and perhaps some puppet integration so that you could use it to deploy some machines
<highvoltage> might be too much but it might be something worth while to discuss for a future implementation
<stgraber> yep, there's definitely potential there
<alkisg> Yeah too bad FF is so soon :)
<alkisg> stgraber: thanks! Would you also have a look at the "nbd-proxy under vbox" issue (makes testing easier :))? Or maybe I should add support for a "no-nbd-proxy" kernel parameter to ltsp_nbd?
<stgraber> alkisg: I'll try to have someone test it and debug it here. I don't use VBox ;)
<alkisg> lxc? Or real clients?
<stgraber> I use KVM and real clients
<alkisg> (or qemu / xen / kvm etc etc
<highvoltage> I use VirtualBox because I'm a sucker for nice user interfaces
<alkisg> highvoltage: did you also have an issue with nbd-proxy?
<highvoltage> (oh and some of my machines don't have VT extensions)
<highvoltage> alkisg: I haven't tried lucid ltsp on vbox yet, but it seems that I will soon :)
<stgraber> highvoltage: I don't know if Julien/David will be at the office this afternoon, if yes, they'll test with VBox. If not, then I'll probably poke you ;)
<highvoltage> stgraber: ok, I'm installing Edubuntu in virtualbox now, so it will be pratically no effort for me to test, I will do so anyway then :)
<cheesyking> hi all, got a problem with an ubuntu LTSP install, any experts around?
<cheesyking> just ran apt-get update on the client directory and I've got a pulseaudio problem
<highvoltage> cheesyking: in the ltsp chroot?
<cheesyking> yeah
<cheesyking> unmet dependancy
<highvoltage> cheesyking: in karmic?
<cheesyking> I think the dependancy didn't install because it was trying to start pulse and couldn't
<cheesyking> yeah karmic
<cheesyking> don't worry too much though, I've just wipped it and started rebuilding the client
<cheesyking> but I'd like to know what I did wrong... so I don't do it again!
<sbalneav> We'd need to see the exact error
<cheesyking> just copying and pasting...
<cheesyking> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/1630910/pulse.txt
<cheesyking> it looked a little large to post on IRC
<sbalneav> cheesyking: Did you remember to run: export LTSP_HANDLE_DAEMONS=false
<sbalneav> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/UpdatingChroot
<sbalneav> You need that in order to prevent the server from restarting it's own daemons when updateing the chroot.
<cheesyking> sorry, no,
<cheesyking> I thought I was forgetting something simple, thanks for being patient with me
<sbalneav> No problem
<sbalneav> 99% of the time, just doing an "apt-get update; apt-get upgrade" in the chroot works find.
<sbalneav> but if hal, dbus, pulse, etc, decide to upgrade, thats when it gets tricky.
<sbalneav> i.e. you need to mount proc in the chroot, set HANDLE_DAEMONS, etc.
<sbalneav> works fine, sorry
<joerg_> hi
<cheesyking> thanks
<joerg> cheesyking, welcome :o)
<stgraber> meeting in 10
<highvoltage>  meeting in one!
<highvoltage> (or now, actually)
<joerg> hello meeting ^^
<alkisg> Lns, sbalneav, nixternal, mgariepy ^^
<Lns> oop!
<joerg> it's a very productive meeting today, isn't it? :)
<stgraber> joerg: meeting is in ubuntu-meeting, not here
<joerg> lol
<joerg> okay :D
<sbalneav> So, just got finished with an Email convo with Dave Hopkins, apparently, it looks as if my LDAP tutorial got him going.
<sbalneav> You know what would be REALLY cool?
<sbalneav> is if there was a GTK app, similar to Gnome Help, that you could point at raw wiki pages, stored locally, and it would render them.
<sbalneav> So, exactly the same as gnome help, but with wiki markup as the backend, and not docbook
<sbalneav> that way, the handbook could just be: the wiki
<sbalneav> We'd work on the wiki, keeping it up to date, and just before launch, we'd get a static copy of all the wiki .txt files from the web server
<sbalneav> then just dump 'em in /usr/share somewhere.
<alkisg> There are some moinmoin to docbook exporters available... but not in really good shape, afaik
<alkisg> But I think it would be simple to fix those converters, than to create such an app from scratch
<sbalneav> Well, what I was wondering was is if Gnome Help has a plugin arch.
<sbalneav> But, moinmoin to docbook would be good too.
<Lns> sbalneav: alkisg: what about simply pointing to the wiki directly? I mean, I guess if they don't have net access..
<Lns> but dumping them right before release, it'd be like a solid snapshot for that release with no changes afterwards...that might be good (or bad too)
#edubuntu 2010-02-11
<mhall119|work> you could always just make a list of pages you want to include, and wget them from the wiki right before release
<mhall119|work> do a little URL re-writing so links to other offline pages point to them, while links to pages that weren't downloaded still point to the online wiki
<Ahmuck> i like wiki handbooks
<Ahmuck> where is this wiki?
<Ahmuck> a button to "update" wiki could be put there?
<Ahmuck> and using wget just as above?
<sbalneav> Evening all
<sbalneav> mhall119|work: Yeah, I suppose.  I'd like something that's:
<sbalneav> 1) Simple
<sbalneav> 2) Doesn't require running a web server on the box to view
<mhall119|work> if we wget the files, they can just be viewed in a browser
<mhall119|work> btw, I'm going to try and get my LoCo to do a documentation jam around edu-games for the upcoming global jam
<sbalneav> Another problem with the wiki idea is: translations.
<alkisg> Bah we need to disable the "your X isn't configured properly, do you want to reconfigure it" dialog for fat clients... I wonder how that's called
<sbalneav> Morning all
<sbalneav> Dear Scott Balneaves,
<sbalneav> We are pleased to inform you that you are now part of the GNOME
<sbalneav> Foundation Membership.
<sbalneav> \o/
<sbalneav> bbiab
<stgraber> sbalneav: Congrats !!!
<highvoltage> sbalneav: awesome!!! well done
<highvoltage> sbalneav, stgraber, alkisg, nixternal_:
<highvoltage> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Edubuntu/Documentation/Developers
<highvoltage> first draft based on Kubuntu policy as discussed. so far it's mostly s/kubuntu/edubuntu/g and s/kubuntu-dev/edubuntu-council/g
<highvoltage> (just made a change so might be good idea to refresh)
 * stgraber is looking
<alkisg> highvoltage: looks fine to me, except maybe that line needs a little explaining? "Able to upload Edubuntu packages" ==> where?
<highvoltage> alkisg: to main and universe, but yes I'll add that
<highvoltage> or I'll just say "ubuntu archives" instead
<stgraber> to Ubuntu archive
<stgraber> other than that small detail, looks good
<alkisg> Maybe sometime in the future we'll make another wiki page with the details on how to do that, and link to it?
<highvoltage> alkisg: you mean the technical details on how to do that?
<stgraber> that's identical to a regular ubuntu archive upload
<stgraber> and there's good documentation for that on the wiki already I believe
<highvoltage> alkisg: afaik dput will automatically know where to upload it to, so we could link to some of the MOTU docs if you're refering to the technical parts
<alkisg> OK, thanks, I'll search the wiki
<highvoltage> https://launchpad.net/~edubuntu-dev/+members
<highvoltage> are we going to start over with that group? or keep laserjock?
<highvoltage> I guess it's also enough just having Edubuntu Council as an administrator?
<stgraber> I believe the team owner and admins are fine
<stgraber> we may have to empty it though
<highvoltage> stgraber: I'm not an admin, could you do that please?
<stgraber> highvoltage: ? weird, the EC is the owner, you should have the right to
<stgraber> and the EC is also an admin
<highvoltage> stgraber: oh right, of course
<highvoltage> ok I'll empty it because strictly speaking, it should be empty
<highvoltage> (and we can just re-apply when everything is in place)
<nixternal> highvoltage: looks good...
<stgraber> highvoltage: yep
<highvoltage> I'm also going to add developer-membership-board as a co-administrator as per https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopers/TeamDelegation
<highvoltage> ok invited, anyway :)
<highvoltage> (and also ubuntu-core-dev)
<highvoltage> stgraber, nixternal, sbalneav, alkisg: I'll send our request to the TB, is that ok? anything else I should add?
<highvoltage> TB/Developer Board
<nixternal> highvoltage: that will work
 * alkisg agrees even though he doesn't completely understand all of it - but being able to upload to edubuntu packages will be a good thing :)
<highvoltage> alkisg: well, basically (and sorry if you allready know/understand this part) the old destinctions of motu's and core-devs are going to be replaced/supplemented (it's all still in progress) so that there is a more fine-grained control over who can upload packages where
<highvoltage> alkisg: so what we're applying for here is that everyone who are trusted edubuntu developers would be able to upload any Edubuntu package whether it's in universe or main
<highvoltage> alkisg: where previously you'd have to become a core-dev in order to be able to upload to main
<alkisg> Ah, got it. I've heard of some of these things, but I didn't get the big picture - thanks for clearing it up!
<highvoltage> you're welcome
<alkisg> Hmm fat client users can't authenticate as themselves, because no passwd entry is generated for them
<alkisg> So they can't even unlock gnome-screensaver
 * alkisg looks at the LTSP user handling code...
<alkisg> Of course we could disable the screen locking, but in general, I think the user should be able to authenticate as himself...
<sbalneav> highvoltage: Do I have to do something?  I just got unsubbed from edubuntu-dev
<highvoltage> sbalneav: read the scrollback of the last 40 lines or so, we're applying to make the edubuntu-dev a delegate of ubuntu-dev so we need to empty it first
<alkisg> sbalneav: we got rid of you because you were too good looking and made us look ugly :)
<highvoltage> alkisg: oh no! look what you did!
<alkisg> Heh, bad timing :)
<highvoltage> (probably just a co-incidence :p)
<highvoltage> alkisg, stgraber, nixternal, Lns: this is what I'm sending: http://paste.ubuntu.com/374126/
<highvoltage> sending in 5 mins or so if no one objects :)
<alkisg> Looks fine
<Lns> looks good to me =)
<nixternal> looks good to me
<highvoltage> sent
<alkisg> What exactly is allowed after feature freeze? E.g. would a fat client patch for disabling "lock screen" be allowed?
<highvoltage> alkisg: bug fixes are allowed, so that should be fine
<highvoltage> alkisg: it's clearly not a feature, at least
<alkisg> Got it
<alkisg> Thanks!
<Lns> Is it possible to take source from someone's PPA (which was packaged for Intrepid+) and build it for Hardy? I really need Audacity to run on my thin clients by Friday...this guy's PPA (https://launchpad.net/~diwic/+archive/ppa/+packages) has one with the pulseaudio fix, but he hasn't built it for hardy
<alkisg> Lns: doesn't stgraber have audacity on his ppa?
<alkisg> Ah no, Intrepid...
<Lns> :(
<Lns> I don't want my kids to miss out on their first podcasting class :(
<alkisg> Lns: I can try to copy it to my ppa, I don't know if it will compile
<alkisg> But if it does, you should be good to go
<Lns> alkisg: that would be *so* awesome, I would owe you big!!
<alkisg> Which one do you want me to try? stgraber's or the other guy's?
<Lns> Well I trust stgraber more than most...so ;)
<alkisg> k
<Lns> thank you alkisg !!
<highvoltage> Lns: if you can get all the build-depends satisfied with the right versions on hardy (or in a chroot or pbuidler) then it's quite easy
<Lns> highvoltage: yeah - it was depending on some fairly core sound libraries I didn't really want to touch
<alkisg> Lns: https://launchpad.net/~alkisg/+archive/ppa/+packages?field.name_filter=&field.status_filter=published&field.series_filter=hardy
<Lns> woah!! it's done?
<alkisg> Nope, it's in queue for compiling
<Lns> oh. ;)
<alkisg> If it compiles, you're ok, if not, it'll need some love...
<Lns> well thank you!! I'll refresh every so often today..
<Lns> I compiled the original audacity source on my server yesterday,j all it needed was wxwidgets.. but the sound preferences only gave me options for OSS..I figured i had to modify the makefile, and at that point I had to leave, so...
<alkisg> apt-get source gets you the source, apt-get build-dep gets you the dependencies, and debuild -b -tc -uc builds it ;)
<Lns> oh yeah? No modifying anything? No dependancy hell?
<alkisg> Well if the dependencies are not satisfiable, you'll have to change the sources...
<alkisg> But in a normal case, with those commands you're able to build a .deb package locally.
 * Lns needs a good lesson on the more intricate features of apt
<alkisg> Lns: failed to build, sorry...
<Lns> :(
<Lns> Thanks anyway!
<alkisg> make[3]: *** [src/hostapi/alsa/pa_linux_alsa.lo] Error 1
<alkisg> src/hostapi/alsa/pa_linux_alsa.c:1366: error: 'SND_PCM_TSTAMP_ENABLE' undeclared (first use in this function)
<Lns> hmm
<Lns> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/edubuntu/releases/10.04/alpha-2/ - latest ISO or no? Wasn't there a much newer version than from jan 14th?
<Lns> stgraber: any comments on the audacity conversation above?
<Lns> oh nm, found the latest build
<Lns> Also, we should look at "bambam" (posted to the list last night about it) and possibly including it in lucid+1
<Lns> pretty simple but neat keyboard mashing program for toddlers
<Lns> http://code.google.com/p/bambam/
<alkisg> stgraber: I want to add 2 gconf files (defaults and mandatory settings) for the fat client plugin, e.g. something like this: http://alkisg.pastebin.com/d2cbaea2f
<alkisg> Should they be packaged as part of e.g. ltsp-client-core, or should they be generated on the fly by the fat client script (which will then be much bigger?)
<alkisg> /me would prefer the former...
<alkisg> They'll end up in /opt/ltsp/i386/usr/share/gconf/defaults & mandatory, and I expect them to grow over time...
<sbalneav> Afternoon all
<stgraber> alkisg: you can use gconftool-2 to set these instead of writting the xml directly
<alkisg> stgraber: yes, but wouldn't it be more elegant to provide files instead?
<stgraber> alkisg: in your case, it'll be 4 gconftool-2 calls instead of writting the whole gconf
<stgraber> no, because if something else changes gconf, you'd override it. If you use gconftool-2, then it'll merge that with the existing schema
<stgraber> which is usually a lot better
<alkisg> By providing files, you can also have priorities (the number)
<alkisg> By gconftool-2 you just directly modify the database, you don't leave the admin any choice...
<alkisg> That's why most packages have gconf files instead of code, afaik..
<alkisg> I don't mind in either case - I just thought that was the way to go
<stgraber> hmm, right, I guess we'll have to carry these as part of the ubuntu packaging for now, lacking a better place to put it upstream
<alkisg> Should I mail them directly to you when I'm done?
<stgraber> yep
<alkisg> Thanks! :)
<stgraber> though the tricky part will be to install them only when running a fat client
<alkisg> Why?
<stgraber> or does that also work for regular thin client ?
<alkisg> Thin clients don't have gconf, so it shouldn't matter if the files are there
<alkisg> Thin clients with localapps also don't have gconf
<alkisg> Thin clients with many many localapps which have gconf by an admin's mistake, should also have those gconf files
<alkisg> So I think we're ok in shipping them in any case...
<stgraber> ok
<joerg> hey
#edubuntu 2010-02-12
<mhall119> hi
<joerg> mhall119, how are u?
<mhall119> good
<joerg> mhall119, I am good as well. thanks for asking :)
<mhall119> :P
<highvoltage> edubuntugirl: roshambo
<edubuntugirl> highvoltage: *blink*
<highvoltage> edubuntugirl: lsmod
<edubuntugirl> highvoltage: Plugins: admin, conversions, core, eval, factoid, feeds, film, fun, games, geography, google, help, icecast, identity, karma, languages, log, lotto, meetings, memo, network, oeis, quotes, rfc, seen, social, sources, strings, test, urlgrab and urlinfo
<mhall119> !karma
<mhall119> edubuntugirl: karma
<edubuntugirl> mhall119: Excuse me?
<mhall119> ah, nevermind
<highvoltage> edubuntugirl: mhall119++
<highvoltage> edubuntugirl: novel ftl
<highvoltage> edubuntugirl: karma mhall119
<edubuntugirl> highvoltage: mhall119 has karma of 1
<highvoltage> edubuntugirl: karma novel
<edubuntugirl> highvoltage: novel has karma of -1
<highvoltage> (I meant novell the first timme)
<mhall119> change it in the database
<highvoltage> this db is going to be dumped anyway, going to import the old edubuntugirl soon :)
<mhall119> you're dumping the new girl for the old girl?
<highvoltage> heh, I guess you could say that :)
<mhall119> we have a supybot in #ubuntu-us-fl
<mhall119> one of our members wrote a cool XKCD comic lookup plugin for it
<mhall119> but mostly we use it for doling out cookies and coffee
<mhall119> hey, you got a second?
<highvoltage> yep
<mhall119> so, there were several sessions about packaging last open/dev week
<highvoltage> not sure how useful I'll be, I'm just awake because I can't sleep :)
<mhall119> and each one used a different helper
<mhall119> debhelber, cdbs, something python specific
<mhall119> for most of my packages I just need to copy files into certain directories, no compiling or anything else
<mhall119> what's the easiest way?
<mhall119> last time I used debhelper and put my files in debian/install
<highvoltage> what do you use to build the package in the end, something like dpkg -B?
<highvoltage> using debhelper is quite important, it does a lot of tedius repetitive stuff for you
<mhall119> debuild
<mhall119> then dput to get it on launchpad
<highvoltage> oh sorry I totally misread you
<highvoltage> yes debhelper with your file list in debian/install is most probably the best way to do it
<mhall119> thanks highvoltage
<mhall119> sorry for the delay, my mom stopped by
<alkisg> ÎÎ±Î»Î·Î¼Î­ÏÎ±
<Tm_T> google buzzzrgh yhdistettynÃ¤ mapsiin ja latitudeen onkin jo ihan kiwa, sanoisin
<sbalneav> Morning all
<joerg> sbalneav, morning :)
#edubuntu 2010-02-13
<mhall119> highvoltage, got my first Qimo 2.0 packages built!
<mhall119> so Scratch doesn't look to be in the repos, anybody have suggestions on something I can use in place of eToys?
<mhall119> highvoltage, ping
<AlanBell> I am playing with wiimote whiteboard stuff at the moment
<AlanBell> it would be rather good to get it packaged for Ubuntu
<AlanBell> it is a python app, with a few dependencies, all in the repos
<AlanBell> http://github.com/pnegre/python-whiteboard
<AlanBell> there is also this one http://www.stepd.ca/gtkwhiteboard/
<AlanBell> I will have a go at packaging it at some point in the next few weeks
<AlanBell> but I am a bit of a newbie to the whole packaging thing. If anyone wants to help that would be great.
<AlanBell> I think it would be amazing if someone could install Ubuntu, install the whiteboard app and then with a wiimote and a projector and a Â£10 IR pen have an interactive whiteboard
<stgraber> As been a while I wanted to test that though haven't had the chance yet
<stgraber> at this point, it's extremely unlikely something new enters Lucid as we have our Feature Freeze on Thursday but it's clearly something we should look at, east least for Lucid+1
<alkisg> AlanBell: did those apps work for you?
<stgraber> alkisg: I just did a test with VBox, it booted just fine ...
<alkisg> stgraber: hmm... except for that vbox problem, I also have a problem with tftpd-hpa not starting at boot.
<alkisg> stgraber: what settings do you use in vbox?
<alkisg> networking / pae etc?
<stgraber> alkisg: I used the usual one, bridged using the VT extension of my CPU, PAE enabled + 3D graphic
<stgraber> alkisg: http://pastebin.com/f69a74c92
 * alkisg shrugs... I can reproduce the problem here 100% - removing nbd-proxy make it work, reinstalling it make it halt
<stgraber> alkisg: can you try: ltsp-update-image --arch i386 -n
<stgraber> I'm wondering if that's my use of -n that solves the issue ;)
<stgraber> (as it had fixed quite a lot of stability issue for me in the past)
<alkisg> trying...
<alkisg> (btw do you see any speed difference with -n? )
<stgraber> not really no, it's using slightly more bandwidth and less CPU but that's about it
<stgraber> though most squashfs issues I had sometime, completely vanished once I started using -n
<runout> hi, for the wii whiteboard i found some packages which did not work. they claim to have a problem with the bluetooth stack of bluez
<runout> following seems to work (last post with download) http://code.google.com/p/linux-whiteboard/issues/detail?id=22
<alkisg> stgraber: nah, the same
<alkisg> bs=1024, sz=537016, and then hangs
<stgraber> alkisg: can you boot without nbd-proxy, then do:
<stgraber> - nbd-proxy <server ip> 2000 2000
<stgraber> - nbd-client /dev/nbd1 127.0.0.1 2001
<stgraber> - mkdir -p /mnt/test
<stgraber> - mount /dev/nbd1 /mnt/test
<alkisg> With break=mount ?
<stgraber> something should fail at some point doing that
<stgraber> alkisg: nope, just boot the thin client as usual and do that from the shell
<alkisg> ok
<stgraber> it won't disconnect the existing nbd connection so it shouldn't be a problem
<alkisg> btw I also tried with your client (.xml), no difference
 * alkisg also notes that he's using the default generic-pae kernel... (i386)
<stgraber> I'm on Lucid amd64 on my laptop (where the VM was running), actual thin client is an Intel Atom one with 512MB of RAM and gigabit network to the server
<stgraber> I have 10 or so of them at the office running on Lucid, some as thin client, some as fat. All with the latest packages from my PPA
<alkisg> nbd-proxy 10.160.31.10 2000 2000
<alkisg> Hangup
<alkisg> From syslog: Feb 14 01:32:29 alkis nbd_server[11106]: Read failed: Inappropriate ioctl for device
<stgraber> alkisg: interesting, that's lucid 32bit right ?
<alkisg> Yup
<stgraber> I'll get you a debug version then, hang on a sec
<stgraber> alkisg: http://www.stgraber.org/download/nbd-proxy
<stgraber> alkisg: make it executable and run it with: ./nbd-proxy 10.160.31.10 2000 2000 2> debug.log
<stgraber> you should then have a full debug log in debug.log
<alkisg> stgraber: I tried again the same line (with the original nbd-proxy) and it worked!
<stgraber> hmm, something is really wrong then ...
<stgraber> so running the same thing two times failed the first time and worked the second ?
<alkisg> Yes
<alkisg> Let me reboot and test it again...
<alkisg> Yes, again the same thing
<alkisg> (so a quick fix would be to run it twice :P)
<alkisg> ok, putting the debug version...
<stgraber> does it die the first time ?
<stgraber> it's supposed to fork into background
<stgraber> so you would have to check with "ps aux"
<alkisg> It just says "Hangup" - I didn't look at ps
<alkisg> The second time, it doesn't fork to the background
<alkisg> It just waits - I thought it woulnd't fork..
<stgraber> hmm, ok, so it's actually behaving as it should ...
<stgraber> it's supposed to fork and say "hangup" (I don't remember why the "hangup")
<stgraber> and if it's already running, then it'll hang until the previous instance is killed
<stgraber> (as it can't listen twice on the same port)
<alkisg> Ah
<alkisg> Yeah, I see it on the processes list
<stgraber> what's happening if you do that nbd-client ?
<alkisg> Error: cannot open NBD: No such file or directory
<alkisg> Please ensure the 'nbd' module is loaded.
<alkisg> with: nbd-client /dev/nbd1 127.0.0.1 2001
<stgraber> my bad
<stgraber> nbd-client 127.0.0.1 2001 /dev/nbd1
<stgraber> that should work better
<alkisg> Error: Connect: Connection refused
<alkisg> should that be 2001 or 2000?
<stgraber> yeah ... seems like I'm half-asleep and it's not even late here ... :)
<alkisg> with 2000 it connects but I get a whole lot of errors
<stgraber> what kind of error ?
<alkisg> Buffer I/O error on device nbd1, logical block 1
<alkisg> nbd1: Attempted send on closed socket
<stgraber> oh, interesting
<stgraber> is nbd-proxy still running ?
<alkisg> Uh, ok, pressing ctrl+z / bg to check...
<alkisg> Yes, it is
<stgraber> ok, then I'm going to need some debug info I guess ;)
<alkisg> nbd-client died though. I rerun it and now it hanged on "Negotiation:"
<stgraber> restart the VM to get the kernel in a sane state
<alkisg> stgraber: I can also give you vnc access if you want...
<stgraber> alkisg: that'd be great
<alkisg> I usually do it with x11vnc -connect, but you'd need vncviewer -listen and a port forwarding for that, any other ideas?
<alkisg> Ah, silly me
<alkisg> Sorry, I'll just port forward 5900
#edubuntu 2010-02-14
<mhall119> stgraber, are you a MOTU?
<stgraber> mhall119: I'm a Coredev, so yes I'm a MOTU too ;)
<stgraber> why ?
<mhall119> There is a PPA for Scratch, but it's not in Universe
<mhall119> I had wanted to include it in Qimo, but I want to stick to the Ubuntu repos only if possible
<mhall119> their packages are only for Jaunty and Karmic right now
<mhall119> what would need to be done to get it into Universe for Lucid?
<stgraber> get it updated to Lucid, make sure the package follows the Debian policy (using lintian usually helps), then upload it to revu (revu.ubuntuwire.com)
<stgraber> once there, it'll get reviewd and if two MOTUs find it ok, it'll be uploaded to universe
<stgraber> though, for Lucid, you'd have to do that by Thursday, so it may be a bit short to get all that done
<mhall119> aw heck, I'll try for it
<mhall119> if not, I'll just use Laby
<mhall119> I'm still on the fence about which one I want to include anyway
<mhall119> I emailed the person who uploaded the others
<mhall119> see if s/he can make one for Lucid
<mhall119> otherwise I'll grab the source package and and re-build it for Lucid, I already testing the package on Lucid and it works fine
<mhall119> so no new packages will be included in Universe after Thursday?
<mhall119> because I'm just now getting my Qimo packages together, and there's no way they'll be ready by Thursday
<stgraber> yeah, no new package will be allowed in archive after thursday (unless they get some special exception) and no new upstream version of existing packages will be uploaded unless they are bugfix only or are granted an exception
<mhall119> stgraber, okay, so what are my options for Qimo?
<mhall119> shoot for multiverse this round and univserse in lucid+1?
<mhall119> also, it seems Scratch has a non-standard license: http://info.scratch.mit.edu/Source_Code
<mhall119> would that prevent it from being included in Lucid?
<stgraber> everything is frozen at the same time (main/restricted/universe/multiverse), so for Qimo, I'd suggest creating a PPA for Lucid with the packages that aren't in Lucid
<stgraber> I remember Debian refusing scratch for some licensing issue
<stgraber> that's probably why we don't have it in Ubuntu
<mhall119> ah, ok
<mhall119> could they get into multiverse if they have a package by thursday?
<mhall119> also, you said no new upstream versions are allowed, but what about things that aren't upstream, like the Edubuntu packages?
<stgraber> I doubt it, because it'd need to have the package in archive by thursday and in the past, it takes more than a week to have a package go through review + license review by the archive admins
<mhall119> ok
<stgraber> well, for example, if after thursday, we want a new sabayon, we'll need to file a feature freeze exception. That doesn't apply to meta packages that are already in archive though (like edubuntu-meta)
<mhall119> ok
<runout> i have a sabayon problem. if i login with a user i assigned a sabayon profile, the font is mirrored and upside down. can anybody help?
<Ahmuck-Jr> ubuntu dropped OO.o ?
<Tm_T> ?
<alkisg> http://digitizor.com/2010/02/12/open-office-is-back-in-ubuntu-netbook-edition-10-04/
<mhall119> Ahmuck-Jr, only in Netbook Edition
<mhall119> gimp it being dropped though
<mhall119> so they can include PiTiVi
<Ahmuck-Jr> is the alternate install bieng dropped as well?
<Ahmuck-Jr> i noticed that the netobook edition did not have a text install
<Ahmuck-Jr> what do they intend to use for an office suit in a netbook?
<mhall119> New Qimo artwork is arriving! http://www.qimo4kids.com/post/Illas-Ready-to-Play!!.aspx
<mhall119> Ahmuck-Jr, they're going to link to Google Docs
<Ahmuck-Jr> groan
<mhall119> forcing the "net" in "netbook"
<Ahmuck-Jr> they do know that google is riddled with privacy issues and that SAS is a step in the wrong direction as it releases control from the user into somebody else
<Ahmuck-Jr> it's like getting on a train knowing that the conductors decision is your only decision
<Ahmuck-Jr> i assume that removing google docs and replacing it with OO.o is still an option?
<Ahmuck-Jr> getting on the train voluntarily, when it wrecks, you want to blame the conductor, when in reality you made the choice.  being forced on the train akins to big brother
<Ahmuck-Jr> btw, i'm not against trains, i enjoy them
<mhall119> of course, you can install anything you want
<mhall119> you're also not forced to install UNE
<Ahmuck-Jr> but i enjoy my car just as well, as it takes me places the train can't
<Ahmuck-Jr> yes, UNE has a great interface for older people and even edubuntu people.  it's a simple interface
<Ahmuck-Jr> but i can't fathom why you would take the user's liberty from them and put it in the hands of a company that has serious privacy issues
<mhall119> because OO.o runs slow in lowend hardware and takes up a large amount of SSD space
<Ahmuck-Jr> same with OO.o for kids?
<mhall119> As far as I can tell, OO.o for kids is just a change in interface, everything else is the same
<mhall119> they could maybe include Abiword and Gnumeric as alternatives, but I think NTEU's would be happier with Google Docs
<Ahmuck-Jr> u know there is a move currently to do on the fly encryption of google docs so that it never get's sent to the server unencrypted?
<mhall119> I'm not sure you could, unless everthing about editing and viewing is done client-side
<Ahmuck-Jr> http://www.google-watch.org/bigbro.html - and i assume you've seen the diagram?
<Ahmuck-Jr> in google "word" it is done client side
<mhall119> no ajax sending and recieving blocks of content from the server?
<Ahmuck-Jr> in google "spreadsheet" the calculations are done server side, but it's bieng worked on atm
<mhall119> if anything on the server side needs to be content-aware while editing/viewing, then on the fly encryption won't work
<mhall119> if the backend is just dumb storage, then maybe
<Ahmuck-Jr> it sends junk back and forth to the server.  that junk is interpreted client side
<Ahmuck-Jr> so sending a line of text such as this would be sent from an client side application, jumbled up by encryption between the browser and the keyboard
<Ahmuck-Jr> i've seen the app
<mhall119> you could maybe individually encrypt each chunk of raw content, so that google only sees formatting and ciphertext, but I'm not sure how practical that would be
<Ahmuck-Jr> it's being done
<Ahmuck-Jr> responsibly, UNR would ship it with an encryption program
<Ahmuck-Jr> let me poke around and i'll locate the app
<alkisg> The link I pasted above says that they WON'T drop openoffice:   http://digitizor.com/2010/02/12/open-office-is-back-in-ubuntu-netbook-edition-10-04/
<mhall119> ah, ok, thanks alkisg
<mhall119> Ahmuck-Jr, it already ships with GnuPG
<Ahmuck-Jr> whew, thanks
<Ahmuck-Jr> mhall119 - no, this is specific to google docs
<Ahmuck-Jr> and a model for securing SAS documents against corporate spying
<Ahmuck-Jr> soooo ... that being said, will there be a Gimp for kids?
<Ahmuck-Jr> G4K
<Ahmuck-Jr> and other apps?
 * Ahmuck-Jr wonders if edubuntu should be looking at current apps and adapting them
<Ahmuck-Jr> one thing I deal with is older people 60 - 80
<Ahmuck-Jr> handling programs with to many options does not work well
 * Ahmuck-Jr scared alkisg away :(
<mhall119> tuxpaint is gimp 4 kids
<mhall119> Ahmuck-Jr, I think edubuntu has enough on their plate without trying to adapt existing apps too
<mhall119> but you make you own geri-buntu
<mhall119> senior-buntu
<mhall119> whatever you want to call it
<mhall119> and include apps and games for the enterly
<mhall119> elderly
<mhall119> I can type, honest
<Plinker__> 43] <Plinker__> If anyone can help I am looking for any information and a manual for the Asus P4P800 DX
<Plinker__> [13:45] <Plinker__> This is to put together another box running either Mepis or Mint as the OS.  Thanks...
<mhall119> have you checked Asus's website?
<mhall119> highvoltage, I didn't realize I had to have finished packages my Thursday to get into Lucid, so I won't make it this cycle
<mhall119> for some reason I was thinking Universe didn't get frozen
<highvoltage> mhall119: there's a process for getting in late packages, called feature freeze exception, we can still give it a shot
<highvoltage> mhall119: but then we'd also have to do it quite soon
<highvoltage> mhall119: where are your packages available?
<mhall119> highvoltage, I only just started on them, they're in my PPA
<mhall119> I only have 3 of the 5 or 6 I'm gonna need
<mhall119> and even those currently have a nasty bug that kills the login
<mhall119> when you log out
<mhall119> I can probably finish the 3 I have by the end of this week
<mhall119> but I still have to made a GDM theme, XSplash and possibly Plymouth theme packages
<highvoltage> mhall119: what's your LP username?
<mhall119> and those won't be ready for a while
<mhall119> mhall119
<mhall119> https://launchpad.net/~mhall119/+archive/ppa/+packages
<mhall119> I accidently stuck some of them in Karmic
<highvoltage> btw, where does the 119 come from?
<mhall119> my wife and I started dating Nov. 9th, many many years ago
<mhall119> I've used 119 to create a unique id ever since
<mhall119> it turns out there's a lot of mhall's around
<highvoltage> aaah
<mhall119> anyway, if I can get these 3 packages done, you can use them for Edubuntu at least
<mhall119> I really only need the GDM and splash themes for the LiveCD
#edubuntu 2011-02-07
<doctormo> highvoltage: You've always had the ability to ask me for art, you just never have ;-P
<highvoltage> doctormo: indeed :)
<highvoltage> doctormo: I guess I didn't realise how talented you were before
<highvoltage> (/me wonders how susceptable doctormo is to flattery)
<doctormo> lo, highvoltage, I'm rather dubious about my talent to draw, I'm more of a sculptor. BUT
<doctormo> I've really very good at manipulating media, using and reusing resources and componentising images.
<doctormo> Although I'm happy with the way TGM came out.
<doctormo> highvoltage: What do you need?
<highvoltage> doctormo: we need a wallpaper for edubuntu, preferably one that doesn't suck
<doctormo> what's the themes?
<doctormo> Want it more cartoony, more realism, bright, shaded, textured?
<highvoltage> doctormo: we have some basic requirements but their not that hard, we want to avoid text on the wallpapers, and it would be nice to be able to have a simplified verison for the LTSP login manager that can only display text in one colour
<highvoltage> doctormo: in terms of themes, you have lots of artistic license, but we want to avoid clichÃ©s like books and blackboards and world maps if possible
<doctormo> highvoltage: So, do you need a wallpaper or a KMS splash?
<highvoltage> wallpaper
<doctormo> So no moving parts or text version required.
<highvoltage> nope, but if the wallpaper is nice then it would indeed be nice having an animated plymouth theme available that maches
<highvoltage> ubuntu just boots up so fast anyway that I don't think we'll care too much about that anyway
<highvoltage> there's been some submissions on http://www.flickr.com/groups/uawt-6/ so far, I like some of the ideas behind some of them, but I think we should be a bit more ambitious for natty
<highvoltage> doctormo: not that I want to scare anyone away with too many requirements, having something just in concept is sometimes nice too :)
<doctormo> highvoltage: I have an idea I will execute on
<highvoltage> doctormo: great :)
<mgariepy> good morning everyone
<highvoltage> good morning mgariepy
<sakhi> good afternoon highvoltage ;)
 * sakhi ntpdate time.za.org gmt+2 ;)
<sakhi> later
<highvoltage> hey sakhi
<highvoltage> 9:40 in the morning here :)
<doctormo> highvoltage: ping
<highvoltage> doctormo: pong
<doctormo> highvoltage: This is my artistic vision for the wallpaper http://imagebin.org/136621 It's very early days. But I've very happy with the background.
<highvoltage> doctormo: yes, that certainly has potential. the fish looks a bit sick :)
<doctormo> highvoltage: The problem is, I agree with thorwil and I won't enter a competition.
<doctormo> For art
<doctormo> If you think I can do the piece, and you've seen my tentative suggestion.
<doctormo> I need you to give me more concrete direction and confirmation that you'll work with me on it and not waste my time if I do it.
<highvoltage> doctormo: ok, I understand completely
<highvoltage> (still gathering comments on that wallpaper in my head... give me a moment :) )
<highvoltage> doctormo: I can commit to you that we can work with you with a wallpaper, if you're willing to adapt and change your work as we need. obviously we can't commit to something if we haven't seen a final version of it yet (which I'm sure you'll understand)
<highvoltage> here are some notes on your current submision:
<highvoltage> * The shadeblocks that make the borders around the image are nice, but they will be partially hidden by pannels in the login screen and in the desktop session, which will make it look a bit out of place at times
<highvoltage> * The two narwhals don't look like they've been drawn in the same style. that said, I'm not really sure how great idea narwhals is for a default desktop background (maybe for an add-on since it is the code-name for the release, but probably not for a default)
<highvoltage> * The slipstream in the ocean is a bit too bright imho, some people don't like very bright images on wallpapers, it might not be a big problem though
<doctormo> highvoltage: The block/borders are actually part of the template. I should have removed those before uploading.
<highvoltage> doctormo: could you join us around this time on Wednesday for the Edubuntu meeting so that we can discuss it too with the others present? I like that you're taking this seriously, if you're willing to continue and work with feedback then we can probably commit to using a wallpaper that you provide. I definitely don't want your time to be wasted, and looking at that squeeze card you made I know you're capable
<doctormo> highvoltage: I should be available on Wednesday. Please make sure to email/message me too.
<highvoltage> doctormo: ok, will do
<doctormo> highvoltage: http://imagebin.org/136624
<highvoltage> doctormo: also, I sometimes sound a bit more picky than I am, so if anything sounds harsh it's most probably not meant that way
<doctormo> highvoltage: I don't actually wipe original art forms, this can go through 50 revisions and I'd keep all 50 ;-)
<doctormo> just incase I think you're wrong :-P
<highvoltage> doctormo: ok, great!
<highvoltage> doctormo: I just looked at your squeeze card again, there's something about the colours that you used that I like a lot too, but that might just be me. I wonder if we should get wider feedback sooner or later, do you have any recommendations?
<doctormo> highvoltage: The colours could have been chance, although the difference is that the card is more refined and finished
<doctormo> Since I could go through all interations with my own brain for what I was after
<doctormo> But I'm taking the same style from the card to try and impliment what you're looking for.
 * highvoltage takes a look at doctormo's deviantart channel (been meaning to but haven't gotten to it yet)
<highvoltage> what tools do you use to create your artwork?
<doctormo> highvoltage: Inkscape
<doctormo> It's all vector, that svg for the underwater scene is heavy duty. My 2GHz core2 due suffers rendering it ;-)
<highvoltage> heh, I'm not the only one who needs a new i7 then :)
<highvoltage> doctormo: nice concept! http://doctormo.deviantart.com/art/Ubuntu-Circuit-2-172263353?q=gallery:doctormo/701269&qo=22
 * alkisg likes the ubunchu covers :)
<doctormo> highvoltage: Consider that visual style too, maybe that's more what you're after.
<highvoltage> doctormo: could be, I guess I'm mezmorised by the all the smooth gradients and textures
<highvoltage> (and I think it would be a nice style for edubuntu)
<doctormo> highvoltage: Something to think about for your meeting.
<doctormo> I guess it's important to develop a visual style for edubuntu
<doctormo> Perhaps this is something the Canonical design team could be persuated to help with?
#edubuntu 2011-02-08
 * highvoltage crawls in bed and watches star trek
<sakhi> happy birthday highvoltage
<mgariepy> good morning everybody !
<highvoltage> enkosi kakhulu sakhi :)
<highvoltage> bon matin mgariepy
<mgariepy> bonne fÃªte highvoltage
<highvoltage> merci :)
<linuxson> Hi. Is there a channel I can join for iTalc users?
<highvoltage> good question
<highvoltage> linuxson: feel free to ask here, if you hang around there's a good chance someone could give an answer
<linuxson> highvoltage: Ok :)
<linuxson26> I am having some difficulty with iTalc, more specifically  with the powering back on and logging into of client  computers. I can switch them off, and wakeonlan has been  enabled...but I can't get them to power back on again. Got  MAC addresses and everything set up in iTalc
<linuxson26> And logging in with usernames and passwords is also not working
<highvoltage> linuxson26: sorry if I'm jumping to the first obvious question, but have you checked the bios yet to see if WoL is enabled?
<highvoltage> linuxson26 : you could also test with the wakeonlan script from the wakeonlan package to eliminate whether it's an italc problem or not
<linuxson26> highvoltage: I have alerady done all this, and I can power the machines back on using etherwake
<nigelb> stgraber: poke?
<linuxson26> But I am still trying to figure out how to let etherwake run a script, if at all possible, so that I don't have to run it for every single machine
<nigelb> stgraber: hey, would you be willing to talk at udw about app review board and extras.ubuntu.com?
<linuxson26> highvoltage: I tried wakeonlan, but it's giving me a "no such file/folder at line 138" error or something
<linuxson26> highvoltage: So I am currently stuck with etherwake and iTalc
<stgraber> nigelb: when is it ?
<nigelb> stgraber: last week of march
<nigelb> you can pick an empty slot from https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDeveloperWeek/Timetable
<stgraber> nigelb: ok, Thursday at 18:00 UTC would work
<nigelb> stgraber: \o/ Thank you
<stgraber> not sure what I'd say for an hour though, but I'll have time to think about it :)
<nigelb> stgraber: what do you want me to title it as 'Getting your app into Ubuntu' ?
<nigelb> stgraber: ouch, rickspencer picked up that slot a while back
<stgraber> ah, right ;) 19:00 UTC then
<nigelb> ok!
<linuxson26> I am having some difficulty with iTalc, more specifically  with the powering back on and logging into of client  computers. I can switch them off, and wakeonlan has been  enabled...but I can't get them to power back on again. Got  MAC addresses and everything set up in iTalc
<stgraber> nigelb: title should either mention extra or post-release
<nigelb> ok
#edubuntu 2011-02-09
<nothingman> hi, all
<linuxson> Good morning everyone
<linuxson> Still having problems with booting up and logging into user accounts via iTalc. Wakeonlan has been enabled in all networked pcs, and can boot them up using etherwake. Any help?
<linuxson> Anyone?
<linuxson> Having problems with booting up and logging into user  accounts via iTalc. Wakeonlan has been enabled in all  networked pcs, and can boot them up using etherwake. Any help?
<linuxson> Having problems with booting up and logging into user  accounts via iTalc. Wakeonlan has been enabled in all  networked pcs, and can boot them up using etherwake. Any help?
<linuxson> Hmmmmm....seems like the edubuntu channel is for parking ONLY...now where do I pass Go so I can collect $200?? Thanx so much for all your tons of help, don't know what I would do without it, except maybe commit a hanous crime against humanity!!!!
<x[x]> hey im currently working on a project about edubuntu for my class project and i was wondering is there an application list i can see that might be installed or what the safe guards are against bad websites and so on
<x[x]> i cant see it on the website
<x[x]> oh hey i think i found it
<mhall119> stgraber: http://justanothertriager.wordpress.com/2011/02/09/have-an-interesting-project-you-want-to-talk-about/ sandbox might be a good thing to talk about
<doctormo> highvoltage: Is there a meeting today? if so, what time?
<highvoltage> doctormo: 20:00 UTC, 2pm EDT
<doctormo> highvoltage: Have you had any further thoughts on what you want?
<highvoltage> doctormo: a little, I'd like to get wider input though. I could tell you exactly what I'd think would be great, but in the end it's what would be good for our users that matter
<doctormo> highvoltage: It's art, there are a few objective criteria, but what you're struggling with is all the subjectives.
<highvoltage> doctormo: will talk again a bit later, I need to head off the office (will be back in around 20m)
<doctormo> cure np
<doctormo> sure
<stgraber> mhall119: good idea indeed, adding myself to the list.
<callumacrae> How would I go about setting up edubuntu so that it accesses stuff over a network, and uses login info and files from the server?
<highvoltage> callumacrae: depends, are you planning on going diskless?
<callumacrae> I've already got 100 computers, a good server, and a fairly bad network setup, everything running windoze
<callumacrae> We're considering moving to edubuntu
<callumacrae> I guess we could use LTSP, but the network setup isn't great
<callumacrae> so it would need improvment
<highvoltage> indeed, ltsp is not great over a bad network
<highvoltage> I guess using samba for shares would be a good idea, especially since you have windows machines as well
<callumacrae> We're getting rid of them
<callumacrae> they're just too slow on these old computers
<highvoltage> backuppc is usually a good idea for backups, unless you want to store user's home directories on the server. nfs would be good for that
<highvoltage> pretty much everything is getting slow. web apps are getting huger by the day it seems
<callumacrae> we upgraded to W7 from XP, that's when it died
<highvoltage> ah :)
<highvoltage> callumacrae: the channel varies in traffic, if you hang around most of your answers can be answered
<callumacrae> thanks
<highvoltage> callumacrae: you could use NIS+ or LDAP for centralized auth, LDAP is more secure and integrates with a lot more, NIS+ pretty much only gives you logins and has security issues
<highvoltage> callumacrae: the ubuntu wiki has lots of information for all of this, and the edubuntu mailing lists is also a pretty good place to ask about this kind of stuff
<callumacrae> thanks, I'll take a look
<highvoltage> edubuntu meeting on #ubuntu-meeting in about half an hour
<highvoltage> doctormo: are you around?
<doctormo> highvoltage: I'm staying around for you my friend
<highvoltage> doctormo: the edubuntu meeting is in around 15 minutes in #ubuntu-meeting. stgraber just told me that he can't make it due to other commitments, but the others should be there at least
<highvoltage> time for edubuntu meeting in #ubuntu-meeting
<hajour> hai all i will ask my questions when you are finished with the meeting :)
<alkisg_web> hajour: you can ask now, and anyone that has time will see / answer them
<alkisg_web> No need to wait till the meeting is over
<hajour> yes but i don't want to disturb understand ?:)
<alkisg_web> hajour: sure, I'm telling you that you don't disturb anything if you write here
<callumacrae> The meeting is in another channel
<hajour> ok:)
<hajour> i have some health issues.so i am not so fast with writhing :)
<hajour> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/hajour  << then you understand
<alkisg_web> hajour: don't worry about your writing speed, take your time
<hajour> ok i was wondering or edubuntu also support electronic schoolbords
<hajour> and what it have for children with issues . reading and writing problems because they are on normal primary schools here in netherlands
<callumacrae> I was wondering about the electronic boards, too
<alkisg_web> I think there are some that support Ubuntu (and so Edubuntu as well), and the manufacturers provide drivers + software, but I don't remember the models
<hajour> well this school have already 3 of that kind of schoolbords you see
<hajour> and the director will go ask about that
<hajour> i want to be good prepared
<alkisg_web> You'll need their model then. Google for their model + ubuntu
<alkisg_web> Or, once you find their model, ask in #ubuntu or here to see if anyone has used them
<hajour> i don't no that yet.
<hajour> ok
<hajour> and my other question.
<alkisg_web> I don't know enough about accessibility, but here's a start: http://projects.gnome.org/accessibility/
<alkisg_web> Edubuntu uses gnome, so it also uses its accessibility infrastructure
<hajour> if that is the option then i know  we have to hurry up with speechcontrol
<hajour> because i am already in accessibility team
<hajour> yes but gnome use more processor power and memory
<hajour> many schools here in netherland have not new pc s
<hajour> they now use on the moment windows from 2001
<hajour> that says enough i think
<alkisg_web> Here in Greece we also have PCs from 1998 :)
<alkisg_web> We turned many of them to ubuntu / ltsp labs: http://goo.gl/maps/nOoQ
<hajour> also the government is going to give again 300 million less money on the schools
<highvoltage> doctormo: the competition-style also seems to attract a lot of "hey! let me hack something together in 60s and submit it!"
<hajour> here also more older then that alkisg_web
<alkisg_web> Well anything with 64MB RAM can be used as an LTSP client
<hajour> if i succeed to get this school use edubuntu then the next will be easier
<hajour> i will go ask all primary schools in this province and after that high schools but it has to be done good prepared and good
<highvoltage> hajour: wow just read your wiki page and I think it's great that you want to get involved!
<hajour> sorry for repeating myself
<hajour> thank you highvoltage
<hajour> also have read my sub page from accessibility?
<doctormo> highvoltage: it's good for making concepts, i admit that.
<doctormo> But we in the art team don't have a good site put together to allow people to contribute in that way
<doctormo> Ont he understanding that a concept is a start, not a finish.
<doctormo> And production isn't the same as picking something off a shelf. We need to collaborate, not just create a very large shelf of work to pick from.
<highvoltage> hajour: not yet...
<highvoltage> doctormo: yep, I pretty much 100% agree with you there
<hajour> well take your time :) you are also in a meeting
<hajour> if you are ready with the meeting i can tell some about a new project we are busy to begin with for deaf
<hajour> i am also busy with set up a project for accessibility in form of a irc bot on the moment so i am quiet busy :)
<highvoltage> hajour: have you talked to klaus knopper and his wife before? I'm not sure how involved they are in ubuntu at the moment, but klaus had a bunch of great ideas a few years back and even put together a distro for people who can't see (or see well)
<hajour> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SpeechControl/Talks/2011-03-04_UDW
<hajour> highvoltage,  ^
<hajour> this go be spoken in UDS
<hajour> i not yet met Klaus knopper
<hajour> anyway i don't no who they are
<callumacrae> How many schools actually use edubutu?
<hajour> i think not many in netherland
<hajour> but  that will go change
<hajour> they are streaking now the teachers
<hajour> because of to less money getting for to buy heat pc programs books enz
<callumacrae> :)
<hajour> so i had read it
<hajour> i have called right away the director
<hajour> that he could get ubuntu what is also linux
<hajour> then he is interested
<callumacrae> I'm trying to get my school to get Linux
<callumacrae> It takes ten minutes to log in with the current (windoze) system
<hajour> so i know  geither more info so i can get the school further over to lubuntu/edubuntu
<hajour> but the school wants a written piece where is standing the school is allowed to use ubuntu/edubuntu XD
<callumacrae> XD
<hajour> i think he not really can believe its free anyway
<mhall119> hajour: does it need to be pn physical paper, or is having it in writing online enough?
<hajour> but if he wants it he can get it i ask just to 1 off the counsel of jono
<callumacrae> IT techies will need training
<hajour> paper
<mhall119> hajour: shipit.ubuntu.com CDs will have it printed on them
<hajour> but i know mhall119  that other schools want have that to
<hajour> it need to be with signature
<mhall119> who's signature?
<hajour> i dont no lol
<hajour> you tell me
<hajour> its odd situation
<mhall119> FYI System->About Ubuntu will say the same thing, that it's free to use/copy/modify/share
<Nubae> cool possibility for accessability would be getting an autoreader to read ebooks to voice
<Nubae> scanner -> ocr -> voice
<highvoltage> hajour: written permission isn't hard to do :)
<mhall119> Nubae: http://projects.gnome.org/outreach/a11y/tasks/evince/
<callumacrae> hajour: Send them a copy of the license
<hajour> just have say it true Nubae
<callumacrae> What license does it use?
<hajour> to speechcontrol team
<highvoltage> callumacrae: edubuntu is made out of many different smaller projects that uses a bunch of different licenses
<hajour> GPL3
<hajour> but it cant be me who write it highvoltage
<highvoltage> yep, that's one of them. GPLv3, GPLv2, MIT, Apache and BSD licenses are very widely used
<Nubae> I remember I wrote a script that helped with autoreading a while back, ocropus and tesseract I believe
<hajour> i have said i have ask on my boss .else he would not listen .because i am a stupid housewive
<Nubae> wasn't really good enough at the time, perhaps things have changed?
<mhall119> hajour: don't let anybody tell you that you're stupid
<Nubae> only stupid answers, no stupid questions
<hajour> well mhall119  society is doing that in netherland
<mhall119> :(
<hajour> i am already fighting 18 years to have a simple job
<hajour> its alright i am used to it after all this time mhall119
<hajour> after 3 burn outs because of stress to have no change on jobs running against big walls from government i have learned to just have peace with it
<hajour> mhall119, ^
<callumacrae> How good would the server have to be for 100 computers and that thing where the 100 computers can be diskless?
<hajour> Nubae,  i need info in short simple lines with links.so i can read it better
<hajour> i can give my email to you mhall119
<Nubae> callumacrae ooph... I'd make it quad or dual core at least and 12 gigs+
<Nubae> ram
<callumacrae> Okay :)
<callumacrae> It'll cost less than 100 windoze licenses :D
<Nubae> for sure
<Nubae> I did the ROI for a local school recently, when they said... they really want win 7 + office +visio for 60 cpus
<Nubae> they quickly decided against it
<hajour> well Nubae  if the schools go use it then later the kids use it at home to.children are the grown ups from the future
<Nubae> mhall119 hmmm so that's 1 k per month then for that... sounds kinda neat, depending on the hours required
<hajour> the problem is that schools have a duty to have dyslectic programs
<Nubae> hajour sure, thats always a problem, as a teacher u have to teach not for the smartest kid in the class and not for the slowest
<hajour> i think i go to speechcontrol to give my daily pep talk again :P
<hajour> it has to be suite for all kids
<hajour> so if we have a good working speech program we win much more users for ubuntu/edubuntu enz
<Nubae> sure thing
<hajour> we from speechcontrol do our best to succeed and so fast as possible.we already trying to make open mary finisesd .if we succeed it will possible still come in natty
<hajour> we only coming a little short to reach that on a few programmers
<hajour> so i go busy now to search further
<hajour> mhall119,  can i pm you to give my email?
<mhall119> hajour: what for?
<hajour> for info links from edubuntu you said yes on it mhall119 time back
<hajour> or not?
<hajour> i have a short break on the moment i am on 21 channels 9 pm s
#edubuntu 2011-02-10
<alkisg> !info evolution lucid
<ubottu> evolution (source: evolution): groupware suite with mail client and organizer. In component main, is optional. Version 2.28.3-0ubuntu10.2 (lucid), package size 2370 kB, installed size 7020 kB
<masai47_> I am trying to install edubuntu as dual boot on an HP machine with windows XP and an HP recovery partition.  Installation seems to work fine.  On first reboot, getting into Ubuntu is easy.  But after booting into windows and then shutting down upon restart it says no modul found and wont boot up at all.  If I then boot into the recovery partition and then try again I can get into windows but Grubloader is gone.  Not sure what is 
<alkisg> masai47_: your message was too long and it got truncated:
<alkisg>  If I then boot into the recovery partition and then try again I can get into windows but Grubloader is gone.  Not sure what is
<masai47_> thanks
<alkisg> To recover grub, you can follow this: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Grub2#Recover Grub 2 via LiveCD
<masai47_> I am trying to install edubuntu on a schools computer.  It has XP and a HP recovery partion
<alkisg> Ah the URL has changed a bit, here is the correct one: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Grub2#Reinstalling%20from%20LiveCD
<masai47_> instalation seems to work, but after shutting down I get the error "no module found and the computer will not boot
<masai47_> I have reproduced this twice.  If I then boot into the recovery partiton (but do nothing) it then will boot normally into windows
<masai47_> I can see fixing it, (I just reinstalled) but is this going to happen every time (is windows doing something when I boot into it?)
<masai47_> I think I installed grub on the windows partion sda1, does it make sense for me to install it elsewhere?
<alkisg> masai47: you can install it to /dev/sda
<alkisg> Not in /dev/sda1
<alkisg> But XP wouldn't touch your boot record in sda1 on each boot
<alkisg> It's the recovery CD that's messing your boot up
<masai47> Sorry I am asking lots of questions but I cant get on internet at the school where I am triing to do this.  I think Edubuntu is a great solution for them (I have an unrelated question on things I might try on Pentium 3s with 128mb RAM and no networking equipment)
<masai47> its not a recovery CD but instead a partion
<alkisg> Same thing, it might be rewriting your MBR
<masai47> I will try again tomorrow to install grub to just sda
<masai47> I dont know what "no module found" means
<alkisg> That error is displayed from windows or from grub?
<masai47> neither
<alkisg> Pentium 3s with 128MB RAM would make good LTSP clients if you added gigabit network cards on them (<10 $)
<masai47> on starting up
<alkisg> On starting up windows or linux?
<masai47> right after the bios loads
<alkisg> BIOS => Boot manager => OS
<alkisg> Boot manager = windows boot manager or grub
<alkisg> OS = windows or linux
<alkisg> The message doesn't come from BIOS, so it's either a boot manager or an OS that is showing the message
<masai47> when I turn on the computer
<masai47> dos not go to grub where I choose
<masai47> that is the first error I get
<alkisg> That means that it's the boot manager
<alkisg> The boot manager can't load its modules so that it can show you a menu
<alkisg> It's *before* the grub menu, but it's still a boot manager problem
<alkisg> So try fixing grub by following the link above
#edubuntu 2011-02-11
<edubuntu> sup buntus?
<doctormo> highvoltage: How's the info for the background going?
<highvoltage> doctormo: I didn't get any feedback on the list, so I'm going to put together what I think will be great and people will have to be happy with what they get :)
<doctormo> highvoltage: We'll so a 5,1,3 pattern if that's ok with you? 5 concepts, 1 selection, 3 consultations and updates.
<highvoltage> doctormo: sounds good
<doctormo> highvoltage: Ah, yes, forgot what I said for a second
<highvoltage> doctormo: that's a long second :)
<highvoltage> (oops, I misread there for a bit)
<doctormo> highvoltage: Fun fun, I saw a wallpaper and da and thought of you today,
<doctormo> let me dig it up
<doctormo> highvoltage: http://fav.me/d398q54
<doctormo> But I also just saw this one, you have to check it out: http://fav.me/d398ufo
<highvoltage> heh
<highvoltage> you get narwhals with... tusks!?
<doctormo> highvoltage: You don't, that's creative license.
<highvoltage> heh, yes
<mgariepy> good morning everyone
<mhall119> morning
<Dunc_> having problems logging on w/ my ltsp clients...  anyone willing to listen?
<Dunc_> pam validates user, subsystem request sftp, receives disconnect from client
<Dunc_> ltsp standalone running on Ubuntu 10.10
<doctormo> highvoltage: Ello
<highvoltage> doctormo: heya
<highvoltage> doctormo: busy putting together email for you now...
<doctormo> thanks
<highvoltage> doctormo: I didn't get any feedback, seems like people don't care about wallpapers until release :)
<highvoltage> doctormo: sending you wants/don't-wants/mood stuff, don't have much in terms of definition and concept yet though
<doctormo> highvoltage: You'll get your 5 concepts, your team must pick one from there and then we'll work on it more from there. 3 times to get it right.
<doctormo> highvoltage: Although you've got a double negative in your requirements, I should clarify that line
<doctormo> You say "Do not want something not /too/ cartoonish", but this means you want something cartoonish.
<doctormo> highvoltage: See http://fav.me/d39apk5 for fun, please feedback me.
<highvoltage> doctormo: I guess that's not too much so, you can drop that requirement if you want
<doctormo> highvoltage: No, you misunderstand, I just need you to clarify what you said.
<highvoltage> doctormo: ok, you pasted me your debian squeeze wallpaper, which is really great and would be perfect... if it wasn't squeeze themed and had a debian logo :)
<doctormo> highvoltage: You still here?
<doctormo> Keep in mind that this is very raw concept stage, look at this http://imagebin.org/137416
<doctormo> It's based on the debian squeeze one, but with the edubuntu logo.
<doctormo> I'm still coming up with a way to do the person, and who/what the person should be.
<highvoltage> doctormo: ok, great. we'd like to avoid having logos on the wallpaper (sorry that's an obvious one I should've mentioned to you before), but yes, it can work. I know you like manga-style drawings but I think that might be what we'd consider "too cartoonish" if you know what I mean
<highvoltage> doctormo: do you think you could make a daytime version work?
<highvoltage> hmm, I guess that would mean losing the nice colours
<doctormo> highvoltage: OK I'm scrapping the concept.
<doctormo> Because everything about it is wrong ;-)
<doctormo> Although requirements are so important that you need to really list everything, even obvious things.
<doctormo> highvoltage: So I need to do a little bit of training with you so you know how to make requirements.
<highvoltage> sorry, I mentioned it so many times before to jbaer before, we had it on the previous spec, I should've copied and pasted more from there
<doctormo> I need to understand the mood of the piece you want. So far you've not really gone into the emotion much.
<doctormo> Your document has grouped my three things into one and then split into two bullets.
<doctormo> I really need an answer per question
<doctormo> I think I can decypher what info should go in what box, but it's important to be more direct.
<highvoltage> doctormo: The thing you need to understand is that we don't have all those answers. For the missing parts we need an artist, someone like you. If I could show you a picture of what we want, then we wouldn't need you in the first place now would we?
<doctormo> highvoltage: Obviously, but if you ask an artist to do the specification, you must be happy with whatever he comes up with.
<doctormo> Anyway, I'll continue to hack away at the remaining 4 concepts and present them to you at the end of next week.
<doctormo> Hopefully we can move from there.
<highvoltage> doctormo: indeed, although right at the beginning I did explicitely tell you that we have some basic requirements and the rest are basically left to artistic license
<highvoltage> doctormo: yes, I hope so too :)
<doctormo> yea, I admit I've been trying to push you towards nailing it down, because I fear rejection of hard work at the end.
<doctormo> But i'll trust you on this one.
<highvoltage> doctormo: yes, I understand that
<highvoltage> doctormo: in concept, I actually like the girl sitting on the hill, I didn't reject that, but I think that could be a good wallpaper if she was less manga-ey, and perhaps sitting under a tree or something. I'm not sure how much off a concept is allowed to change before you consider it rejected
<highvoltage> in the end we just need one good wallpaper, so one good concept that can be seen through to the end would even be enough imho. but then again I trust you to know best
#edubuntu 2011-02-13
<Firemouth> good morning
<Firemouth> good afternoon
<Firemouth> How would I go about configuring the DHCP server?
<Firemouth> I'm trying to get EDUbuntu 10.10 to work with my existing linksys router / firewall, which is on a 192.168.1.0/24
<Firemouth> the DHCP server wants to do 192.168.0.0/24
<alkisg> 1 nic setup?
<Firemouth> correct
<alkisg> You can't have 2 dhcp servers on the same subnet
<Firemouth> precisely, i'm going to disable DHCP on my linksys and use the DHCP built into EDUbuntu
<Firemouth> the problem is i need to configure my DHCP on EDUbuntu to assign addresses on the same subnet
<alkisg> Ah, ok then just edit /etc/ltsp/dhcpd.conf
<Firemouth> ahhhh
<Firemouth> rock on
<Firemouth> perfect!  Thank you!
<alkisg> You can also use this instead, if it suits you better: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuLTSP/ProxyDHCP
<alkisg> I.e. keep your router's dhcp server running
<Firemouth> even better
<Firemouth> i might do that
<Firemouth> sweet, thanks a bundle, going afk... just about to walk out the door
<Metalfend> hello again
<Metalfend> i'm having problems with PXE boot now
<Metalfend> my client worked before I started messing with the DHCP servera
<Metalfend> i put a packet sniffer on and i'm not seeing EDUbuntu respond to any DHCP requests
<Metalfend> so the scenario is my c lient computer won't boot past PXE, says Operating System not found
<Metalfend> anyone know how could i verify my DHCP server is running on the LTSP server?
<Metalfend> i found a log file, shows my DHCP requests that worked from earlier today, but the last 3 lines just say:  dhcpd: Internet Systems Consortium DHCP Server V3.1.3
<Metalfend> nm it was my fault
<Metalfend> i changed the network on the first address of the range but not the second
<Metalfend> and away we go
<Metalfend> 8-)
#edubuntu 2012-02-06
<dgroos> good morning
<dgroos> any help available for epoptes?
<dgroos> I'm not seeing client computers with the new version.
<highvoltage> could someone check if weblive works for them?
<highvoltage> I just get "The session can't be started" from the applet
<highvoltage> (perhaps I just have a bad java version or something)
<dgroos> highvoltage: address?
<highvoltage> dgroos: http://www.edubuntu.org/weblive
<alkisg> dgroos: hello
<highvoltage> I'm using the icedtea plugin and I think that used to work before
<dgroos> alkisg: Howdy!
<alkisg> dgroos: do you have epoptes-client installed in your chroot?
<dgroos> highvoltage: do I need to download the nomachine app as I already have itâ¦  How do I proceed in this case?
<dgroos> alkisg: Pretty sure I do--I'll check...
<alkisg> sudo chroot /opt/ltsp/i386 dpkg-query -W epoptes-client
<highvoltage> dgroos: nope, it should work without the installed app
<dgroos> epoptes-client	0.4.1~lucid1
<alkisg> dgroos: how are you launching epoptes? With remote apps from a fat client?
<dgroos> highvoltage: so I click on the 'download no machine link?
<dgroos> alkisg: no, vÃ­a nx to the server (so like sitting in front of the server screen, launching via menu)
<alkisg> highvoltage: works for me, lucid
<alkisg> dgroos: when epoptes is updated, the clients do not reconnect, they need to be restarted to connect again - is that the case?
<alkisg> Do you see the clients as little computer icons, or not at all?
<alkisg> dgroos: I'm going to leave in 10 minutes, if you want we can quickly solve it with a vnc... alkisg.dyndns.org from the epoptes help menu
<highvoltage> dgroos: nope, these instructions should work: http://edubuntu.org/documentation/weblive
<highvoltage> alkisg: ok thanks
<dgroos> Don't see the icons.  I'm almost positive a client has been restarted--wait, let me make a vbox client on the server and test.  I'll get backâ¦
<highvoltage> stgraber: which java plugin are you using?
<dgroos> alkisg: 'k
<stgraber> highvoltage: both icedtea and sun were working fine last I tried
<alkisg> dgroos: ok as in "no problem with epoptes" or ok as in "I should open my vncviewer and you try again to connect"? :D
<dgroos> alkisg: I tried to connect :)
<dgroos> the latter :)
<alkisg> dgroos: yeah I wasn't ready, try again :D
<alkisg> got it, moment...
<dgroos> alkisg: might there be anything to do with having the client MAC addresses in the lts.conf file defined?
<alkisg> dgroos: no, the certificates are wrong
<alkisg> They need to match for the clients to connect
<alkisg> The connection is very slow, so you do these:
<alkisg> sudo chroot /opt/ltsp/i386
<alkisg> epoptes-client -c
<alkisg> exit
<alkisg> sudo ltsp-update-image
<dgroos> 'k
<dgroos> THANKS!
<alkisg> Then client reboot :)
<alkisg> np
<alkisg> If it was up to me, the default would still be to not use certificates :D
<dgroos> I know what you mean, I've gone back from ssl mode on CmapTools/CmapServer and am not moving there for plone as well since students then get these scary notes about scam sites etc and it doesn't seem worth it.
<alkisg> time to go, bbl
<dgroos> highvoltage: fyi I just tried the download button for the nx client (that was the only option available) and it said: "You can't open the application nxclient because PowerPC applications are no longer supported."
<dgroos> I then clicked, "OK" then it gave me the dialog box saying that I could continue, that the session was ready to run.  My mac is using intel not PowerPC
<highvoltage> dgroos: ok
<highvoltage> stgraber: I get the same problem in an edubuntu VM as well
 * highvoltage tries oldstable on weblive
#edubuntu 2012-02-07
<alkisg> Good morning
<highvoltage> good morning alkisg
<highvoltage> stgraber: there's definitly something weird with weblive. It doesn't work in a default edubuntu 11.10 installation either
<highvoltage> (I also get the session can't be started message there)
<highvoltage> too bad, I wanted to demo it tonight :)
<stgraber> highvoltage: hmm, ok, weird, what server were you trying?
<highvoltage> stgraber: I didn't see it giving me an option, it just asks which release, I've tried both
<stgraber> ok, the server works fine though, I just connected to the 11.04 one using qtnx ...
<stgraber> I'll try from my 11.10 machine in a bit
<highvoltage> maybe it's something weird and specific I'm doing, but I used to be able to use it just fine. it worked for alkis on 10.04 yesterday as well.
<stgraber> highvoltage: confirmed both 11.04 and 11.10 work from a clean Ubuntu 11.10 install with icedtea
<highvoltage> stgraber: hmm, weird.
<brett__> hi everyone
<highvoltage> hey brett__
<brett__> I am trying to figure out a way to force my son to complete his kwordquiz before he can play browser games-  I have plans to add an autologoff script to limit his time playing, but I would like to push him into kwordquiz for 5 minutes for every 30 he is lgged on... hi highvoltage...
<highvoltage> hi brett__
<highvoltage> we used to have tool that could do things like that but it's no longer maintained. (it was called nanny)
<brett__> hi HV!  how's tuesday treating you?
<highvoltage> I'd help you with some ideas but I'm just about to go into a meeting, but if you can stick around I'll be back later or perhaps someone else could help you
<brett__> too bad its no long maintained-  thats fine-  i have some repairs to get done-
<brett__> ill be on all day
<brett__> i really appreciate the help (even the eidea of help is great)
<highvoltage> stgraber: could you pleade pass my excuses to the emra rmb meeting? Im running hopelessly late
<stgraber> highvoltage: k
#edubuntu 2012-02-08
<alkisg> Good morning
<mgariepy> good morning
<highvoltage> good morning
<jeepsterjc> Hello everyone.  I'm a teacher who had been using K12LTSP for many years on two 30 client labs and switched to Edubuntu and ltsp last year using only fat clients.  Things have been awesome, but today while trying to install Epoptes ran into a problem...  I have one wired connection but had two eth connections showing in the network applet.  I removed the one that was indicated "never used" and now the fat clients boot and have 
<jeepsterjc> internet
<jeepsterjc> How can I get the server to function properly??  The one wired connection listed in the applet is "ifupdown" and it is can't be edited...  Help
<jeepsterjc> !!
<highvoltage> hi jee
<highvoltage> jee<tab>
#edubuntu 2012-02-09
<Randall> /
<thunk> #ETEC697
<ha11srg00d> yo
<onadime> qwerty
<MookiePete> #ETEC697
<SeanM_> Hi
<Elvis_Y> hi
<cellodad> hello
<Bruce> hello all
<Elvis_Y> can anyone create a new channel?
<onadime> #/leave #etec697
<SeanM_> #etec697
<Bruce> #/leave #etec697
<ha11srg00d> test
<Elvis_Y> #etec697
<Elvis_Y> #/leave #etec697
<onadime> ==
<SharkByte> hello
<SharkByte> can anyone answer a printing question?
<SharkByte> hello
#edubuntu 2012-02-10
<alkisg> stgraber_: why do we need to delete plymouth-stop.conf ?
<alkisg> I just completed the change from RC_WHITELIST to RM_SYSTEM_SERVICES, if anyone knows his way around the ltsp trunk it'd be nice if he could check the disabled services list.
#edubuntu 2012-02-11
<alkisg> Good morning
#edubuntu 2013-02-05
<jbicha> highvoltage: congrats on taking over gnome-panel :)
<jbicha> what desktop do you normally use?
<highvoltage> jbicha: gnome fallback session
<Nadeem> Hi
<designbybeck__> Ok now on to some other questions! Edubuntu is to big to run on some of the older machines I've worked with for the public. I've used Qimo and/or just LinuxMint XCFE for light installs
<designbybeck__> any straight up Edubuntu package for Light / Old machines?
<stgraber> not really, the lightest we ship with is gnome-fallback and we don't have strong plans to ship another desktop environment just yet as we're trying to reduce our install media size
<Nadeem> I have only tried LTSP-Live on system that have one NICs, the dialog says ok. Then Inetwork  boot other system, the system boots up fine, then I enter a username, it lands on a screen with just the wallpaper
<stgraber> however it's easy to either install the Edubuntu packages on top of lubuntu/xubuntu or to install another desktop environment on top of Edubuntu
<Nadeem> designbybeck__: Yeah, just install xubuntu-desktop or lubuntu-desktop
<stgraber> Nadeem: what version of Edubuntu was that?
<Nadeem> 12.04 Sir
<stgraber> Nadeem: was that the 12.04 release media or 12.04.1?
<designbybeck__> i haven't been a fan of xubuntu, it seems lacking and very stock. I would have hoped for LinuxMint XCFE style
<stgraber> we had a bug that sounds like what you're describing but I believe it's been worked around in 12.04.1
<designbybeck__> even thought overall I'm not a fan of LinuxMint
<Nadeem> stgraber: I am using the 12.04.1 ISO only
<Nadeem> designbybeck__: Bro, it will give you a Xfce  desktop
<stgraber> Nadeem: hmm, ok. Next time you try, on the login screen, try to explicitly choose the Unity 2D session or the gnome fallback session. My guess is that LTSP is trying to open a 3D session on that machine and failing badly at it.
<Nadeem> stgraber: tried that
<designbybeck__> yes Nadeem just the LM XCFE is pretty polished I feel. Xubuntu just doesn't seem polished, just like they left it hangin'
<Nadeem> With gnome fallback
<designbybeck__> I haven't tired gnome fallback in awhile though so maybe I should give that a go
<stgraber> Nadeem: hmm, that's odd... so it's not that weird gnome-session bug then. Any chance you can try 12.10 to see if that somehow got resolved in there?
<Nadeem> stgraber: I will get the 13.04 alpha build then
<Nadeem> the dload are big and I am from India
<Nadeem> get 50 kbps here :D
<Nadeem> that way I can try the latest stuff in the arsenal
<Nadeem> stgraber: About that 2 nics stuff, is it possible to get LTSP(installed) working with 1 nic
<stgraber> Nadeem: it's if that network is completely isolated. If it's the same network you use to access internet, then no, ltsp live won't work with that.
<stgraber> Nadeem: we'll get support for single NIC LTSP server when in an Edubuntu server domain though but that's a pretty different use case and won't work from the live media
<Nadeem> stgraber: Thanks brother, then that is the reason why it isn't working.
<Nadeem> I will taking your leave now(late here). Thanks once again stgraber and highvoltage.
#edubuntu 2013-02-06
<daslinkard> Hello room!
<highvoltage> hello da<tab>
<highvoltage> stgraber: any chance you could look at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/edubuntu-live/+bug/1086498 for alpha 2 ?
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 1086498 in edubuntu-live (Ubuntu) "[r-alpha] Edubuntu default session is "10"" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<stgraber> highvoltage: I'll try to spend some time landing a new edubuntu-live in the archive this week but mostly for other reasons. I remember looking into that bug quickly and not finding any obvious source for it (as in, the session value in debconf was correct).
<highvoltage> yeah I just looked too and in 2 minutes I couldn't find the source of the problem
<highvoltage> well, there's a WEIGHT that's set to 10 but I couldn't see it referenced again anywhere in an obvious way
#edubuntu 2013-02-07
<stgraber> highvoltage: any thought on making the domain joining tool be a separate tool that you run post-install? that'd solve my keyboard problem and simplify the install process
<stgraber> highvoltage: basically I want to remove any input fields we have in there at the moment and just rely on radios and dropdowns
<highvoltage> stgraber: no objections. it's nice to have it in the installer too imho but it's certainly something that could/should evolve over time
<highvoltage> stgraber: at least it would make the installation process simpler, which is always good, I suppose
<stgraber> highvoltage: yeah. In theory we could have it show up after ubi-usersetup too but for now I think it's best to just have one well written robust tool that can be used post-install
<stgraber> highvoltage: I still have to think about the server case though as we'll clearly need some user input for that one
<skaet> highvoltage, stgraber - will you be following the same pattern for Alpha 2 as Alpha 1 in terms of release notes?
<stgraber> skaet: I think so, though I'm not the one who'll take care of a2
<highvoltage> skaet: Alpha 1 was so long ago that I can't even remember what it looked like
<highvoltage> skaet: but my guess would be "probably"?
<skaet> also a bit concerned about the testing load next week for testing 12.04.2 in parallel with 13.04 alpha 2.    Has anything been set up to line folks up to help?
<highvoltage> ah I haven't thought of doing that. so perhaps a call for testing might be a good idea?
<skaet> highvoltage,   I cloned what stgraber did for alpha 1,   which is basically a link to the edubuntu site.  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/RaringRingtail/Alpha2/Edubuntu
<skaet> alternately we can structure it similar to Kubuntu's page (more like the traditional).   Your preference.
<highvoltage> skaet: sounds good
<skaet> http://www.edubuntu.org/news/13.04-alpha1  <- looked good to me.
<stgraber> I think pointing to the website is easiest for those early milestones
<highvoltage> skaet: glad to see you back, btw :)
<highvoltage> (I'll be back in an hour or so, have to shower, eat, etc)
<skaet> highvoltage, :)  thanks.
<bond_> hi, can anybody tell me about 11th  field in /proc/diskstats? The documentation says that it is weighted # of milliseconds spent doing I/Os. Is it like # of milliseconds spent in a second?
#edubuntu 2013-02-09
<ajrye> hi there
<ajrye> is there a homeschool program using edubuntu, the biggest issue atm moment for my grandson is bulling and my wife and i are looking in to homeschooling him
<ajrye> would this distro be adequate for say grade 9 to 12 if I install the Tertiary Bundle
<ajrye> maybe ill come back later thank you
#edubuntu 2014-02-03
* pratchett.freenode.net changed the topic of #edubuntu to: Edubuntu 13.10 is out! - http://www.edubuntu.org | When asking questions, hang around for a bit, we're not always at our computers :) | Help out with bugs: http://tinyurl.com/EduBugs | LTSP questions? also try #ltsp | Welcome to the playground, have lots of fun and behave yourself!
<stgraber> highvoltage: FYI, Edubuntu 14.04.4 LTS this week
<ogra_> geez, .4 even before release ?
<ogra_> we're faster than ourselves nowadays
<stgraber> s/14.04/12.04/ :)
<ogra_> :)
<stgraber> too used to type 14.04 apparently ;)
<ogra_> hehe yeah, i have the same often enough
<highvoltage> stgraber: yeah just saw the email and eeked
<highvoltage> luckily my brain read that as 12.04.4 so it was a smaller eek than ogra_'s :)
#edubuntu 2014-02-04
<stgraber> highvoltage: those should be proper 12.04.4 candidates ^
<highvoltage> ah thanks
 * highvoltage syncs
#edubuntu 2014-02-06
<smallfoot->  Can gnome-session-flashback be updated?
<smallfoot-> its still 3.8
#edubuntu 2014-02-08
<mhall119> highvoltage: happy birthday
<highvoltage> thanks, mhall119!
#edubuntu 2015-02-07
<BobFromAccountin> hy
#edubuntu 2015-02-08
<tino> hello
#edubuntu 2016-02-11
<mhall119> stgraber: is edubuntu.org still the project's website?
<ogra_> why wouldnt it
<mhall119> because it's not loading
<mhall119> and we're linking to it from the new flavours download page on ubuntu.com
<ogra_> well, something to take up with the webopps team i guess
<ogra_> it is a canonical server
<mhall119> ack, will do, thanks
<ogra_> humboldt.canonical.com apparently
<mhall119> site's back up
<ogra_> mhall119, what was it ?
<mhall119> collatoral damage from other work, according to jacekn
<ogra_> ah
#edubuntu 2017-02-06
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: cloud-init (xenial-proposed/main) [0.7.9-0ubuntu1~16.04.1 => 0.7.9-0ubuntu1~16.04.2] (edubuntu, ubuntu-cloud, ubuntu-server)
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: cloud-init (yakkety-proposed/main) [0.7.8-68-gca3ae67-0ubuntu1~16.10.1 => 0.7.9-0ubuntu1~16.10.1] (edubuntu, ubuntu-cloud, ubuntu-server)
#edubuntu 2017-02-09
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: open-vm-tools (xenial-proposed/main) [2:10.0.7-3227872-2ubuntu1 => 2:10.0.7-3227872-5ubuntu1~16.04.1] (edubuntu, ubuntu-cloud, ubuntu-server)
#edubuntu 2017-02-12
<stathis> Good morning, is there a channel for edubuntu in Greek?
<stathis> I have 2 kids at home, 9 and 7 years old and i would like to install edubuntu on a old laptop for using it for their school works. Is this a good idea or someone have other suggestion?
#edubuntu 2018-02-06
-queuebot:#edubuntu- New binary: essays1743 [amd64] (bionic-proposed/universe) [2.100-1] (edubuntu)
#edubuntu 2018-02-08
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: lxd (xenial-backports/main) [2.21-0ubuntu2~16.04.1 => 2.21-0ubuntu3~16.04.1] (edubuntu, ubuntu-server)
-queuebot:#edubuntu- Unapproved: lxd (artful-backports/main) [2.21-0ubuntu2~17.10.1 => 2.21-0ubuntu3~17.10.1] (edubuntu, ubuntu-server)
