#ubports 2017-11-27
<tgBot> Mel was added by: Mel
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @malditobastardo, thank you, i really appreciate and super happy to know others share some ideas with me!
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Flohack, haha, but honestly, the firat thing that comes to my mind is redhat :D all linux but as soon as I end up using CentOS I feel like I'm lost. GNU/Linux is an achievable goal but my ways of doing things are all debian/ubuntu specific and i dont spend extra time testing if it is GNU Linux proof, sobyeah, that is why ;)
<tgBot> nirajnikant was added by: nirajnikant
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> @nirajnikant, Hello Niraj and welcome! I'm part of the UBports welcoming team.  â¦ To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
<tgBot> <supri yono> Hi all.. are three any Ubuntu touch/phone for my Xiaomi mi5s?
<tgBot> <supri yono> Are there any Ubuntu touch/phone for Xiaomi mi5s
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> Hello ,the Turkish group seems to be asking about this device
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> I can't remember the result but I don't think it's supported now.
<tgBot> <vanyasem> @wayneoutthere hey
<tgBot> <vanyasem> Russian group is asking more questions about N4
<tgBot> <vanyasem> will N4 support snaps in the future or is the kernel too old?
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> @vanyasem, Did Marius discuss this on the Community Update yesterday?
<tgBot> <vanyasem> @Crash_Burn, yep, I remember that
<tgBot> <vanyasem> I am not sure about supported kernels though that's why I'm asking. a person in our Russian chat is concerned about it
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> Ok..   Watching the UT update now and he was saying they will stick with clicks.
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> But I'm not an expert ;P
<tgBot> <vanyasem> @Crash_Burn, the question does not involve clicks at all...
<tgBot> <vanyasem> I am asking about potential support in the future
<tgBot> <vanyasem> ð
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> FOR NOWclicks (sorry for caps) yes.  But one day....
<tgBot> <vanyasem> please read the question
<tgBot> <vanyasem> I already regret talking to you
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> @vanyasem, I was just trying to be helpful ð
<tgBot> <vanyasem> @Crash_Burn, no offense, thanks anyways
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> Happy to be of service
<tgBot> <vanyasem> i am a developer and needed some info for an another developer
<tgBot> <vanyasem> so I wanted a rough technical explanation of what devices will support snaps
<tgBot> <vanyasem> and if n4 is included in the list
<tgBot> <vanyasem> clicks are not involved at all
<tgBot> <vanyasem> thank you anyways, have a good day
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> I just ordered Nexus5, and as soon as it's arrived, I'm flashing what onto it....
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> KDE  Plasma Mobile :D
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> "It is build to be potentially running many Qt/GTK/X11-based applications" I need to know if UT limitations are or are not present there
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> and need to get hands-on experience with Wayland
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> on their website they say it straight: Packages can be installed by âapt-get install packagenameâ  â¦ that makes me think that I'm on the same page with them. I will continue to invest my time into UT, but I'm skeptical at the same time, because I see focus and effort being made into smartphone scenario use-cases rather than into Ubuntu Linux experience. And I don't believe that UT can catch up in the smartphone aspects to close the gap to
<tgBot> I don't see UT reaching a stage at which it pleases regular smartphone users. â¦ KDE Plasma seems to be more oriented on pleasing Ubuntu Linux users, and in providing Ubuntu Linux use cases and scenarios, whereas the mobile phone aspect is just a side-dish, and add-on, not to say a gimmick. Nice to have but not what the value preposition is about. â¦ But we will see how things evolve.
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> but I'll continue my work on both UT and KDE Plasma Mobile
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> Sweet.. Also, well you can get Plasma Mobile related help in @plasmamobile group :)
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @bhushanshah, thanks!
<tgBot> Albin was added by: Albin
<tgBot> <peternerlich> @Albin, Hello Albin and welcome! I'm part of the UBports welcoming team. â¦ To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
<tgBot> <Flohack> @vanyasem, The best assumption if you get generic answers like this is: We donÂ´t know. And we really donÂ´t know what will happen. Snaps are not on our worklist ATM, and whn tehy come, there are still a ton of questions to be answered before we get device specific
<tgBot> <Flohack> But dont start getting rude towards non-developers that want to help plz
<tgBot> Usinitafute was added by: Usinitafute
<tgBot> <peternerlich> @Usinitafute, Hello @Usinitafute and welcome! I'm part of the UBports welcoming team. â¦ To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> (Photo, 724x229) https://irc.ubports.com/ot30Q4F0/file_2442.jpg Holly crap!!! notify-send works on UT!!! I actually installed it thinking it owuld pop notifications on my desktop when using x forwarding, but it pops them on the phone!!!
<tgBot> <Stereofont> @Mel, Hello Mel and welcome!  I'm part of the UBports welcoming team.    â¦ To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> (Photo, 768x1280) https://irc.ubports.com/v6S0GEcv/file_2444.jpg $ notify-send "notify-send on UT" "$(uname -a)"
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> (Photo, 768x1280) https://irc.ubports.com/p0j1xbz4/file_2446.jpg $ notify-send "notify-send on UT" "How about that now!"
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> You guiys HAVE TO include it in the image by default, it is absolutely useful!!!
<tgBot> <peternerlich> @KrisJacewicz, totally!! ððððð
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> (Photo, 768x1280) https://irc.ubports.com/1ntBLHSW/file_2448.jpg notify-send -i ~/.local/OpenSoftwareHub/fpc3/lazarus/images/icons/lazarus.ico "notify-send on UT" "Even icons work, whoah"
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> so guys, just: â¦ $ sudo apt-get install libnotify-bin
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> default image needs this!!! you can write a headless service/daemon that can send these out!
<tgBot> <samitormanen> Nice find Kris !!!
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> ðð»
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> guys, support my request on this to include it in the default image
<tgBot> <Stereofont> Can someone put the advantages and use cases of this in simple terms please?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Stereofont, Advantage: you can send on-screen native notifications to users â¦ Use cases: â¦ 1. your apps can send notifications â¦ 2. system services can send notifications â¦ 3. you can use it as a chat over the network, when you send hearts to your gf's phone over ssh
<tgBot> <Stereofont> So ping with UT telegram?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> 4. Telegram can send notifications :D
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> 5. you can make cron jobs that check the situation af if one occurs, they pop you up about it
<tgBot> <Matteo> @KrisJacewicz, +1
<tgBot> <vanyasem> @KrisJacewicz, +
<tgBot> <Stereofont> @KrisJacewicz, So 'battery is 10%'
<tgBot> <Stereofont> @KrisJacewicz, Can it include custom alert sounds?
<tgBot> <Flohack> @KrisJacewicz, Dekko2 can do this without this package :P
<tgBot> <Flohack> It it also runs a headless daemon, ask @DanChapman what he did ;)
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Stereofont, $ notify-send "Battery Level" "$(upower -i $(upower -e | grep 'battery') | grep -E "state|to\ full|percentage")"
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> (Photo, 768x1280) https://irc.ubports.com/HmN38mY2/file_2450.jpg $ notify-send "Battery Level" "$(upower -i $(upower -e | grep 'battery') | grep -E "state|to\ full|percentage")"
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Flohack, sure, let's UT do most typical tasks totally different from the default and obvious ways it is done on Ubuntu Desktop. Sounds better ;)
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> forgive my sarcasm, I'm just that kind of person ;)
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Stereofont, in bash scripts you can run command playing sound right before the send-notify
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> you can even make vibration
<tgBot> <Flohack> @KrisJacewicz, I can filter that out. I agree that a script needs a binary to send messages like this. But please do not put it in such a way that this is the only way to send messages. There are system calls already existing for that, so the binary is a complementary tool, not a mandatory one
<tgBot> <samitormanen> It is good if we could have different ways of handling notifications. Feel free to experiment more Kris! ð
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Flohack, you know Florian, while your remarks are all valid, but at the same time the more I continue the more I feel that UT is not really being a community that listens to users passionate about it.  â¦ I am just about to start working on KDE Plasma Mobile platform, and I already see from some amazing conversaations with one of itsmaintainers that it basically allows you to do anything you do on desktop the way you would do it on desktop. A
<tgBot> while I am trying UT to raise its value preposition, I can't push it trhu the people responsible for it. I will eventually give up. Other platforms start seeming more open and allowing. â¦ Not directing this directly at you, nothing personal. Just expressing that feeling of fighting against the windstrucks.
<tgBot> <Flohack> @KrisJacewicz, And this you tell me in a group of over 1000 participants? I like people being excited about this project, but if you are willing to contribute more than just occasional PRs, if you are willing to shape the future of UT then please join our organization (Application form on the homepage). But if you speak like this on our main channel where 90% of people are non-developers, you might make them feel unassured about what they should thi
<tgBot> about UT. They might even think we are lazy people not listening to them, since we also dont listen to you. And you make an impression that while we are silent, and you speak a lot, we are also not working efficiently on the project. So this is an invitation, become part of the team. But then, you also need to accept our vision, and yes, our vision is a primary mobile phone approach, with a convergence option included. Not the other way round.
<tgBot> <Stereofont> @KrisJacewicz, This perhaps makes the case for 'flavours' rather than a single distro?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> mgreat thing for me is that I do in fact have a choice. not so great for UT, because so far it struggles to define its value preposition. â¦ If UT is after users seeking smartphone experience, than I'm skeptcal about it. Already abandonned once, can now become isolated and then obsolete, deprecated. Canonical now just focuses on going back to gnome, and reapproaching wayland. But later on, it will be back with unbuntu phone. Only this time wit
<tgBot> but with wayland.  â¦ UT may add "wayland support" but so what. What selling poitn will it have at all? Where the value preposition? Smartphone value? Will NEVER be able to compete against android/ios. Freedom and privacy? I think that spot will be taken by Librem 5 very soon. So what value preposition will UT have??? I am trying to create that value preposition, and at times it feels like I'm facing a wall.  â¦ Yet abnother app on Ubuntu Open Store. Great.
<tgBot> are all great and nice to have. But this is now what UT can compete for attention with!  â¦ On the other hand, if it becomes a Linux experience that only additionally can also be used as a smartphone as an add-on, an extras, a gimmick. Then the value preposition becomes real. There is a real deal on the table suddenly, a value that others don't already offer a better alternative to.
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Flohack, I want you to know that despite all this critique all of sudden, I respect you like only few people here. I'm not attacking, I'm trying to lay out my thought hoping it can push some different ideas. I actually do want UT to grow. Being skeptical is one thing, and wishing well is another.
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> @KrisJacewicz : What you do is super interesting and appears to add a lot of value to the UT platform, even for us not being developers. Please stay around, because I think UT and its community has so much in store going forward and we really appreciate and need all your work! â¦ UBPorts team: I think we can all recognize that there are different value propositions and that things can be done in several different ways. I understand that there i
<tgBot> for UT and that all the goodness brought forward by Kris and others canât be included in the standard images without consideration. But please, let us all work to keep dedicated people on board to make UT as great as it can be. Maybe including some of the stuff Kris suggests wonât hurt normal users and if so, I see no reason why not to.
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> to join a your team would be actually an honour, but I would first need to be on the same page with your vision. I am open to discussing that vision, I'm not fixed in whow I see things now.
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @TomasOqvist, FYI, I'm not saying I'll leave or anyting like that. I'm a big fan of everything that happens here, just I was suppressing sume general frustrations, but ultimately it's all me worrying for the future of UT, not bad wishing. I will stay around, for sure.
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> but I have a problem accepting current vision for UT. That's why I'm kind of a lone wolf. I'll listen to any arguments, of any side, but I do not see value preposition here.
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> @KrisJacewicz, Thanks Kris, I really appreciate it! By the way, I tried Plasma Mobile on a Nexus 5 a few months ago and back then it wasn't usable at all on that form factor. None of the UI scaling worked, but they have probably come further along since then.
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> Florian, I feel like you are the right person in the right place, that is why I flood you with my criticism here and now. Not necessarily to convince you, if you could convince me, it'd be good too. But as of currently, I'm not yet convinced.
<tgBot> <Matteo> @TomasOqvist, Tomas I totally share your thoughts. Me too, I'm not a developer but being this a community, it is good to have people like Kris so committed to improve UT. Maybe one day I'll be so inspired by community efforts that I'll try to contribute in a more effectively manner (not only by mean of money like already I do, but trying to develop some code bu myself, who knows...).
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Matteo, +1
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> however, Plasma Mobile i also Ubuntu (16.04), so basically I will go on with my ATU concept, and UT will be included in it as long as there is no wall that cannot be moved past.
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> @KrisJacewicz, Sounds great!
<tgBot> <malditobastardo> I can understand both positions here. From Kris and Flo. I thing this need to be discussed privately not here in front of 1000 non-devs as Flo said. Everything else I am with all of you guys.
<tgBot> <JBBgameich> Plasma Mobile is quite independent of the base system, so it could switch to arch for example (they already have images based on arch)
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @JBBgameich, yes I'm aware, but for now I enjoy knowing that it is currently running on Ubuntu 16.04
<tgBot> <JBBgameich> @JBBgameich, (but there are no plans to do so afaik)
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> the reason I worry about UT is because I think it eventually has to do one of 3 things: â¦ 1. Provide value that others don't provide â¦ 2. Provide value better than others do â¦ 3. Provide exactly same (equal) value but cheaper than others do â¦ And I do not know how/if UT is doing or going to make any of these 2 things. Not hating, just feeling it is important to know this. Because the only one thing I know about why UBports is continuing
<tgBot> to let it end. And this is noble, but has nothing to do with adressing these 3 points above. All the great work on it is noble, but is is sufficient to grant UT chance for success.
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> some more context: when Canonical first spoke of its vision, it was fresh, original and innovative. It got awarded even! â¦ But now there are others who came up with comparable concepts already. Going back to my list of 3 key things, one of which UT would need to be able to deliver on.
<tgBot> <Stereofont> @malditobastardo, I think discussion of central ideas belongs absolutely in this public forum. My view is that we need a good balance of 'sensible' and 'adventurous'. Too much of either will sink the boat. If there are frustrations, I think we should understand that they stem from UBports being small and limited in resources. That demands a certain discipline and within that, in the real world, there will be a certain rigidity. You can't always g
<tgBot> what you wannaâ¦
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Stereofont, yes, I get it
<tgBot> <samitormanen> I agree with Lionelb..
<tgBot> <malditobastardo> I understand and I agree with you too Lionel. The good thing about the community is that its very mature. Kris, I dont know much tbh about this. But i think right now they are working hard to get to 16.04, after that I am sure everything will be more easy. About your ideas for repositories etc, you have your blog amazingly well explained why X repos should be included etc, I think now is time to try to make a consensus with the other devs. A
<tgBot> mentioned to you, they really want to have you on board. you should think about it
<tgBot> <malditobastardo> Sorry about my english, I am also in the phone
<tgBot> <malditobastardo> I think most of us here already know your hard work, and we support all of your effort.
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @malditobastardo, actually it is not about me trying to push my personal ideas on which packages should also be included, or about me needing UT core team to pay close attention to how I exploit the system on my own. â¦ I also absolutely love the way @Stereofont summed it up. â¦ My most essential, most directly aimed at this community concerns are about the value preposition in UT.
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @KrisJacewicz, all boild down to this
<tgBot> <malditobastardo> Yeah, I mean. Your blog is pretty self explanatory. Of course its not only about packages, its the big picture. Everything is there.
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> and other than that I feel more support than I need and I am not trying to steel more attention. I also feel appreciated for my work and all that. That is not any of my concerns.
<tgBot> <malditobastardo> @KrisJacewicz, Thats Is why I think now is a good oportunity to sit and discuss properly about this directly with the devs.
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> you know, I want to see UT succeed so badly, that I can't but see real problems that it must face sooner or later. I'm not lashing out on it. And I am certainly not complaining about people putting immense effort in keeping UT alive. It's pretty spectacular how well it has worked so far. But what then? If Canonical abandonned its own vision, and even admitted it was wrong, then do we learn from it? Or do we try to prove Canonical was wrong abou
<tgBot> wrong?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> which one is it - that's my question
<tgBot> <malditobastardo> I agree
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> my impression is that UT is now trying to prove Canonical was wrong about being wrong. â¦ My own opinion is that perhaps Canonical wasn't wrong, and we shoudl learn from it, and make UT differently than how Canonical tried to do it. I am questionning the original vision. But at the end of the day, I will follow up anyways. And will stick around.
<tgBot> <Flohack> @TomasOqvist, Its a difference of just including a few packages for apt preinstallation on the image, which is no big deal, and on the other hand, changing the complete vision that we inherited from Canonical. What a change of vision means: We would have to stop working on OTAs and 16.04 upgrade, and instead start rewriting lot of intermediate APIs for Wayland etc. Probably also exchange core Apps, click concept etc. I dont see this coming all of a
<tgBot> sudden.
<tgBot> <Flohack> Im out for lunch guys...
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Flohack, I guess you are convinced that UT will do just fine as it is. I wish it does.'
<tgBot> <alan_griffiths> The fact that we can even debate the future of Ubuntu Touch shows that UBports is doing an amazing job with the resources it has. But I don't feel the project has yet left the "consolidate" stage. â¦ There are fundamental "time bomb" issues at the core to defusing: moving to a supported Ubuntu version and replacing the legacy notification server. There's also work needed to incorporate newer versions of libraries the project uses such as Qt.
<tgBot> initiatives such as Halium. â¦ All of that us urgent in the sense that it needs doing to support any possible future. Otherwise the burden of supporting the resulting legacy will increasingly fall onto the UBports team and the project will fail. â¦ Discussing future direction is healthy and important, but don't be impatient for that future. Current efforts are, and should, be focussed on these "time bombs". Once they are defused the project will be in a bet
<tgBot> to move forward. That's the time when plans will be needed.
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> +1
<tgBot> <JBBgameich> I think the upcomping 16.04 release has the Qt and "switch to Halium" time bomb fixed. The latest community update also sounded like there is some replacement for the notification server now.
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @alan_griffiths, yes, UBports is doing an amazing job with the resources it has!
<tgBot> <milkor73> @KrisJacewicz, Kris, you are also very inspiring with your solution , pls join Florian , Ubports wish to join together current Ubuntu Touch phone concept.
<tgBot> <Skorpion96> Where are downloaded images from browser?
<tgBot> <delijati> @alan_griffiths, +1
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @milkor73, the only reason I am not "officially" on board is because the things I am interested in exploring on the platform are not what their team is focused on. They carry out the main core work for UT to actually be, and I am focusng in exploring alternative use cases, and doing a bit of hacking. I am not that much interested in the standard use scenarios for UT. Yes, I am skeptical about these standard uses, but I wish to be proven wrong
<tgBot> further into the future. â¦ At some point the core team might find it interesting to expand some of my alternative/unconventional use case ideas into becoming part of the standard/default concepts. IF that happens, I'll be ready to join on board anytime! â¦ But for now it is all good. UT is progressing, and I can exploit it. The fact that I have some differences in opinions is not by any means a problem to me, I support UT very much, and I even go out of my
<tgBot> â¦ I reckon the concept of "time bombs" and respect the order that has been established on the mainstream work.  â¦ But it is absolutely up to UT mainteiners if they want to invest their mind into any of my alternative concepts. It is not required that they do, however, in order for me to continue what I'm doing. Just that, naturally, since I care, I will want to vocalize my criticism when an opportunity arises. I'd like to challenge you with some thoughts,
<tgBot> to challenge me back. â¦ But for as long as I stay without knowing answers to some most basic, most essential questions about the value preposition of UT, there will be some skepticism in me. Still, hope to prove it wrong in the long run, for the best of Ubuntu Touch.
<tgBot> <Flohack> @alan_griffiths, Thanks Alan for that. This is exactly what we are sturggling with: While we are in the middle of analyzing and understanding what acutally needs to be done, and how we can do it without breaking the user experience for the existing devices (which seemed to have worked pretty well so far) everybody expects that we talk about the future. Will there be snaps, will there be convegence, are you going to sell devices etc... These are all
<tgBot> questions for the time "after"... "now" is the time to gracefully move services, understand build processes and try to get a CI train moving so that we can actually deliver smth. And yes, I am on the notifications server, thats one of the main concerns now.
<tgBot> <JBBgameich> Are you currently still using the libhybris version from vivid?
<tgBot> <Flohack> yes sure, there might be a different one in 16.04 and/or halium
<tgBot> <JBBgameich> I rebased the mir version on upstream again yesterday, but I was unsure if you have done this yourself now
<tgBot> <Flohack> There are patches from Canonical inside do you mean this?
<tgBot> <JBBgameich> Yes
<tgBot> <JBBgameich> https://github.com/libhybris/libhybris/compare/master...JBBgameich:ubports
<tgBot> <JBBgameich> This are the patches you currently have on top of libhybris from 2015 afaik, but which also compile on top of the latest upstream libhybris.
<tgBot> <Flohack> @JBBgameich, That would fit in the Halium channel too, are you there as well?
<tgBot> <JBBgameich> Yes, sure :)
<tgBot> <JBBgameich> It's just a UBports specific thing
<tgBot> <JBBgameich> Is this channel more for developers, users or random questions btw?
<tgBot> <Flohack> its the general noise channel
<tgBot> <Flohack> :P
<tgBot> <Flohack> Ask smth but dont cry if there is no answer one one day, and on the other day there are 100
<tgBot> <Flohack> it is very indeterministic
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Flohack, i found out that application form is currently not available on the website, fyi
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> (Photo, 1119x340) https://irc.ubports.com/0f5pfAlz/file_2452.jpg
<tgBot> <Flohack> Ah yes there was smth sorry... I will send you a manual copy ;)
<tgBot> <ahayzen> l
<tgBot> <ahayzen> whoops wrong window
<tgBot> <AndyBleaden> @Flohack, Agree with all of this
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Flohack, thank you
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> @Flohack, Yes, I fully understand that a change of vision can't and shouldn't be done overnight if at all. My point was that maybe we could implement some stuff that doesn't cause the normal user any problems or create more work for developers. The final direction of this project, I believe, is still written in the stars until we find the best value proposition for UT. I have been using UT as a daily driver for a good 2-3 years now (if not more)
<tgBot> there are some things missing that I don't see coming anytime soon. But the prospects of convergence has always been appealing to me, and the
<tgBot> <TronFortyTwo> Hi! There is a way I can update OTAs just using the shell? Because I have an E5 with broken unusable screen, but I am still using it as a developing machine.
<dobey> @tronfortytwo you can use system-image-cli to update, yes
<tgBot> <TronFortyTwo> oh I see thanks
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> @KrisJacewicz, traitor!  ban him!
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> @KrisJacewicz, this is neat.  this seems like news.  don't forget, people, to send us news :)
<tgBot> <DanChapman> @wayneoutthere, Note that `notify-send` will only show an ephemeral popup so you "have" to be looking at the screen to actually see it. It won't persist in the message tray and you can'nt manage the launcher count. libnotify is fine for desktop usecases where you spend alot of the time looking at an active screen. But it popping up in your pocket you would have to be pretty handy to get it out quick enough to see where it came from
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> No one wants my opinion, but my opinion shall, of course, be provided for free: â¦ 1. Kris is amazing, intelligent, and excited.  He's also adventurous and has clear goals and sees that there is potential with UT, otherwise he wouldn't be wasting his time here (he is busy â¦ 2. Florian is busy (this is a theme here, btw) and is facing more of the admin/organizational stuff plus he has been around forever.  He also understands many areas of t
<tgBot> community and knows what many, if not most people think and understand.   Ã¢â¬Â¦ Both of you are awesome and all of us are part of this.  HOwever, Florian is partially correct that simply distracting and confusing the current work could be problematic to the faith and excitement around current work. Ã¢â¬Â¦ However, Kris is only being loud about this stuff because he is either a) unable to see a clear vision from the group or b) is not in line with that vision.   Ã¢â¬
<tgBot> should exist.   â¦ Alan also raised a very important point which is that we have a few urgent milestones that require the entire focus of everyone to immediately address.   â¦ I believe we need to: â¦ 1. get the urgent milestones out of the way ASAP while â¦ 2. discussing as a group, in the right way, the clear vision of the project  â¦ This is a big topic and I appreciate everyone here remaining understanding and excited about the future.  As Alan wisel
<tgBot> are having this discussion should be very exciting.   â¦ Have a nice day.   â¦ Opinion concluded.
<tgBot> <Flohack> @DanChapman, @KrisJacewicz
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @wayneoutthere, hahah
<tgBot> <Matteo> @wayneoutthere, +1 this is a very nice opinion indeed! I'm with you Wayne and with all the amazing developers we got on this platform. Just work together for the best!
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @DanChapman, but the program that uses notify-send can be smart enough to pop notifications when you are loomi g at the screen ;)
<tgBot> <Big ET> @KrisJacewicz, If you want "persistent" notifications. look at: â¦ https://github.com/BigET/NotificationPost
<tgBot> <Big ET> this is also a clik package that is in openstore. I have done this a year ago I think.
<tgBot> <DanChapman> @KrisJacewicz, How would it know you are looking at the screen? It's rather pointless if the notification comes from the app you are looking at and all other apps are suspended. so? The current notification api uses libnotify anyway so it's not like something new has been used. The UT notification api allows you to control more than a popup with a simple dbus call.
<tgBot> <Big ET> https://open.uappexplorer.com/app/com.edi.npost
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @wayneoutthere, thank you Wayne for this opinion, i appreciate it! â¦ I am not really going to sabotage all the great work being done here with some ideas belonging to a differwnt vision of what a linux phone should be. I have plenty of respect for the work being done here but i also say what i think. I hope I state my criticism clearly for those who care to read it. But that's that and after i said what I had to say i will continue to reapect
<tgBot> you guys will do. I am not bitching about things i wish were bit different, i clearly raise my case and break my point of view down to precise arguments. Overall i deeply care for UT to be doing best it can, and that's the bottom line. Lots of respect for people and work, but i still have my own opinions. there is no conflict of interest here though. my own vision can be worked on independently from the work on UT, and suggestions i make arw not so much to ea
<tgBot> to ease others to explore ways i explore. You guys be the judges of whether or not its worthwile to consider them. â¦ But yes, i will be also workin with plasma mobile soon and i will be making a lot of comparison. But all that for the better of both platforms, I hope.
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @DanChapman, every single thing you do on app is a message event so you can know if user is interacting with the app and also with the phone bu checking if screen lock has kicked in yet. But that is about "how", whereas "why" is subjective. Some people will find use for this type of notifications, some won't.  â¦ Ypu all guys have your consideratipn for keeping the image light. But perhaps you could design a quota, and a small one, maybe 5 MB,
<tgBot> 10MB, a quota for vaguely defined "packages increasing usability" within which quota we could vote for those really tiny packages that could really be appreciated evwn if not absolutely crucial. After all why would UT have to be a frugal OS?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Big ET, very nice, thanks! this can be used from command line as well? i am thinking of script scenarios also, like bash scripts maybe cron jobs or deamons too, not only apps.
<tgBot> <Big ET> yes. this is exactly the script that send the message. â¦ https://github.com/BigET/NotificationPost/blob/master/output/notify.sh
<tgBot> <Big ET> practically is a dbus call.
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Big ET, highly appreciated!
<tgBot> <Big ET> but also if you want to send the dbus call, you have to register the notification sending application.
<tgBot> <Big ET> from the terminal you can impersonate some that are already registered, like telegram or npost or whatever.
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> btw i also think some packages are only nice to have, while with some other ones it is really weird that they are missing (lile xauth and maliit plugins for gtk). But if a small elastic quota would exist that can be voted for by people from outside of the image maintainers circle, wouldn't that be interesting and pro-consumer attitude? You guys weight pros and cons and decide if such a approach could be afforded or not.
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Big ET, 1. how to impersonate another app? â¦ 2. howto programatically check/list which ones are registered and thus can be impersonated?
<tgBot> <peternerlich> (Photo, 199x1280) https://irc.ubports.com/KZ7l1bMx/file_2454.jpg Big text blobs today. I'm positive that's a good thing!
<tgBot> <Big ET> @KrisJacewicz, 2. you have to enumerate the dbus objects. I don't know exactly. â¦ 1. look at the notify.sh I've sent you. you give to the method you call over dbus the object in my case it was com.ubuntu.Postal.Post and com.edi.npost_npost
<tgBot> <peternerlich> (Photo, 1280x199) https://irc.ubports.com/k57kRacI/file_2456.jpg Big text blobs today. I'm positive that's a good thing. (rotated to not create a huge gap here)
<tgBot> <Big ET> @KrisJacewicz, This is the question that i have answer before making npost. â¦ https://askubuntu.com/questions/755556/persistent-notification-on-ubuntu-touch
<tgBot> <Big ET> it is a thing that on the ubuntu touch (hope this is still true in the ubports image) the twitter-app can be used to send a notification.
<tgBot> <Big ET> hey even the wiki still works, tkx ubuntu. â¦ https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Process/Merges/TestPlan/indicator-messages
<tgBot> <DanChapman> @Big ET, I think this is only possible if if the twitter app (or any app) has a push helper. and the notification card is compatible with that helper
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> @peternerlich, ððð
<tgBot> <Big ET> @DanChapman, I have not try to impersonate twitter-app on the latest ubports image, but nport click pakage works on the latest ubports (atleast on my meizu pro5 is)
<tgBot> <Big ET> @KrisJacewicz, If you look at the npost as an example it is quite easy to create your own click package that is registering a push helper so you can put your own icon to the notification and etc. â¦ It is so easy that you should impersonate someone else just for a small one time hack to see it works.
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Big ET, this is great news for you guus, but i am not working with click so i will want to learn genwric ways of using this. but all this info you provided is awesome thanks again!
<tgBot> <Big ET> well, you can look at the scripts that the click installer is running to do the registration. I don't know it from the top of my head, but is strait forward, you have to do some apparmor profiles and call some registration on dbus in the ubuntu.postal stuff. npost can help you with hacking also because it shows how to export a qtquick control that will allow to run scripts from qml. this is what npost does is a qml that runs a bash that sends a notif
<tgBot> <Big ET> so the icon that is shown in the notification is registered when the click installs.
<tgBot> <Big ET> maybe is (or not) common knowlage, but in UT (at least) apparmor is governing also the dbus.
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Big ET, i dont use apparmor either, i am not interested in those scenarios, i live them to you guys
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> i ise my ut phone like its just ubuntu computer and im not into all that confined aspect for smartphone apps scenarios
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> too limiting for me
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> when i want this much limits i go to android
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> on ut phone i do real stuff not mobile apps
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> things android cant do
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> although android becomes more and more open
<tgBot> <Big ET> You are like me I also use my pro5 like a laptop replacement, but I found that is much easier to write a line in the click manifest and the rest just works than to do a lot of small things to interface with the rest of the ecosystem. â¦ you can create a click package that just register the push notification, you can put there an icon and stuff. And the rest you are doing it like notify.sh just send a dbus message
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Big ET, i totally agree that there are ways you can use click as a piece of a bigger thing, but i am just not interested in it. i dont mind it, and dont reject it, its all good and has its purpose and audience. but i do things mainly in object pascal and hv very cross platform mindset. most of my code can run on any linux as well as on windows and osx. sometimes i write for linux specifically and even then i dont want to make it to spcific to
<tgBot> things like click. but in a system when you diy things sure i totally see it fit :D
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> basically i am interested in knowing techniques that use click but i am even more interested in knosing how to achieve same resulta without it, without all thw confinement limitation
<tgBot> <DanChapman> @KrisJacewicz, So to do this without click you cannot use the current notification api. instead you will have to use libnotify for popups and libmessaging-menu for persisting notifications in the message tray. which IIRC both take your desktop file to "register" the app with the service. For the launcher count you will have to use the unity launcher dbus api
<tgBot> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~unity-team/unity8/trunk/view/head:/plugins/Unity/Launcher/dbusinterface.cpp which takes an appId. Not sure if non click apps have an appId?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @DanChapman, thank you! also that last mention about appid, i suddenly remembered aomething that might be related...
<tgBot> <Big ET> @KrisJacewicz, I had looked at this before I've made the npost app. There are some click hooks scripts on your device that are doing the registration. But the thing is that you need to create a lot of resources if you want to integrate proper. look at: â¦ https://github.com/BigET/NotificationPost/tree/master/output
<tgBot> <DanChapman> but do note that doing it this way bypasses a user preferences for notifications. The user may have turned them off but going this route will not respect that
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> i notices that when you open non click app and then go back to thw apps scope and click on that non click app's launcher again, you dont end up getting back into it. you need to manually swap from the right edge to go back to it. but click apps will just get back to front if u click on theor launcher again while they are in the background. I was suspecting it had to do with appid, that perhaps non click apps didnt have it and that s why
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> but i am npt sure about it
<tgBot> <DanChapman> Yeah id assume that would be why
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @DanChapman, absolutely, point taken.
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> you know with regards to users i totally get the confinement aspect, i really do. but when i am my own user i dont want it, you lnow what i mean? so i understand the click and apparmor design and where it fits. still, for me this is ubuntu linux inside a mobile phone form factor and i want to do have a grewn light like i it's my ubuntu
<tgBot> <Big ET> besides the apparmour, you need a json to for the notification helper, a service xml (NPost.service) that will register the sender in the postal service of UT and some other things that I forgot.
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> if i had a clear logic with all the steps i could make a command line tool that handles all that and hides it, so it can be used in scripts and in non click programs too
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> just lile there is notify-send i could make a vesrion designed to do that
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> make the complicated problem seem simple from the outside :)
<tgBot> <Big ET> @KrisJacewicz, if you don't care about the icons that are present in the notification and etc. just the message just do (copied from the askubuntu question that I quoted earlier): â¦ gdbus call âsession âdest com.ubuntu.Postal \ â¦ âobject-path /com/ubuntu/Postal/com_2eubuntu_2edeveloper_2ewebapps_2ewebapp_2dtwitter \ â¦ âmethod com.ubuntu.Postal.Post \ â¦ com.ubuntu.developer.webapps.webapp-twitter_webapp-twitter \ â¦ "\"{\\\"message\\\
<tgBot> \\\"notification\\\":{\\\"card\\\": {\\\"summary\\\": \\\"Some Title\\\", \\\"body\\\": \\\"Some text\\\", \\\"popup\\\": true, \\\"persist\\\": true}}}\""
<tgBot> <Big ET> this *should* work on latest ubports.
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Big ET, wow, beautiful! hahah
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> need to sleep, 1am here, will trybit tomorrow
<tgBot> <Big ET> @KrisJacewicz, oh well, you will probably come later to ask about how to register the icon, and you will arrive to the point that you will create that simple click. ;)
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Big ET, haha, possible!
<tgBot> <Eranuzan> btw any one knows how to launch external applications from within another application? i`m trying to launch the gallery app from the camera app
<tgBot> <Eranuzan> ?
<tgBot> <DanChapman> @Eranuzan, Take a look at the Base URLS parts of the url dispatcher docs. https://docs.ubuntu.com/phone/en/platform/guides/url-dispatcher-guide
<tgBot> <balcy> for example, I open the terminal app from within my app via:  Qt.openUrlExternally("appid://com.ubuntu.terminal/terminal/current-user-version");
<tgBot> <Eranuzan> Thanks @DanChapman i tried  that but either is missunderstood whats appid is orit doesn't seems to work
<tgBot> <Eranuzan> i guess the answer is that i miss understood how to do it :) Thanks @balcy
<tgBot> <balcy> you're welcome
<tgBot> <Eranuzan> Yay new Dekko 2 version!!! Thanks @DanChapman ðð
<tgBot> <DanChapman> There will be another shortly. Forgot to bump the service versions to get them to restart. ð¤£
<tgBot> <Eranuzan> Great more updates!! ðð
<tgBot> <balcy> does anyone know, what could be the reason if an app does no longer appear in the LogViewer app ? Or alternatively, how to start a click app, e.g. webbrowser-app on the phone in order to see why it fails ?
<tgBot> <DanChapman> Thanks everyone for all the translations. you guys rock!
<tgBot> <balcy> in the terminal I get "UbuntuClientIntegration: connection to Mir server failed..."
<tgBot> <DanChapman> `webbrowser-app --desktop_file_hint=webbrowser-app.desktop`
<tgBot> <balcy> ah thanks I will try that...
<tgBot> <balcy> great, now it shows the startup error... just playing around with oxide ...
<tgBot> <DanChapman> ð
<tgBot> h4888 was added by: h4888
<tgBot> <h4888> Hello. Are there any Experienced JS developers in this group?
<tgBot> <peternerlich> Hello @h4888 and welcome! I'm part of the UBports welcoming team. â¦ To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
<tgBot> <h4888> Thank you @peternerlich but I am not new here :)
<tgBot> <peternerlich> You are not? Great! â¦ Anyway, if this is is going to be a longer and rather off-topic conersation (as it seems to be), could we talk in the offtopic or welcome room? I would consider myself a rather experienced JS developer, though that probably is dependent on your level of experience.
<tgBot> <h4888> @peternerlich links to the off-topic room?
<tgBot> <peternerlich> @h4888, You got me there. I have still to receive notice on how to join the off-topic room, but I am in the welcome room. https://t.me/joinchat/Baj4lhJ4XRotoeGk1QxuRQ
<tgBot> <DanChapman> @peternerlich, @ubports_ot
<tgBot> <peternerlich> @DanChapman, Thank you very much! Gotta include that in the UBFR quick links...
<tgBot> <DanChapman> ð
<tgBot> <Matteo> @DanChapman hi Dan, thank you for the update, it's good to see the app is improving always better and better. But unfortunately, I noticed I still can't answer to an e-mail by the simple reply button: the app crashes every time I try to reply or the app crashes by itself....Maybe it's just me: I'm on BQ E5 rc. Thank you.
<tgBot> dohbee was added by: dohbee
<tgBot> <peternerlich> Hello @dohbee and welcome! I'm part of the UBports welcoming team. â¦ To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
<tgBot> Gianluca Ottavi was added by: Gianluca Ottavi
<tgBot> <Ernst Vaarties> I have the BQ 4.5 and was just wondering. Could it benefit from an upgrade to Ubuntu 16.04 an later to 18.04?
<tgBot> <peternerlich> Hello Ernst and welcome! I'm part of the UBports welcoming team. â¦ To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
<tgBot> <Cesar_Herrera> Will it be possible to pay with the telephone?
<tgBot> <peternerlich> @Ernst Vaarties, I have the E4.5, too. I am not sure about the plan with 16.04, 18.04 and the corresponding milestones, but in the long term, the device will still be supported (as long as it still gets used), but at some point it won't receive new features.
<tgBot> <JBBgameich> I have built Halium for it, but someone said he isn't sure if  the Android device tree I used was even working correctly... So as long as nobody works further on that, it won't get 16.04 afaik
<tgBot> <peternerlich> This is because of the resources which are just below the target of what UT wants to achieve. It is designed for high-end devices, which is pretty obvious when you consider the original plans for full convergence.
<tgBot> <peternerlich> Still, the E4.5 is and will remain (at least for my purposes, which are mainly those of a normal reliable mobile phone for work) a perfectly usable device.
<tgBot> <Ernst Vaarties> Yes, it is suffice for my needs (calling, texting and Telegram). For the nerd in me, it would be fun to have it upgraded. Will follow UBPorts to see if it will happen.
<tgBot> <peternerlich> @Ernst Vaarties, There's a brand new News Channel to stay up to day without having to scrape this busy group: @ubports_news
<tgBot> <Stereofont> @Gianluca Ottavi, Hello Gianluca and welcome!  I'm part of the UBports welcoming team.    â¦ To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
<tgBot> <Stereofont> @Cesar_Herrera, Never say never but the truth is 'not soon'. It would have to be accredited by a bank and the payment system. A big obstacle. There are stick on Visa tabs in use in some countries though, so you could stick one on you phone
<tgBot> <Stereofont> @Jaume81, This
<tgBot> <dohbee> Well, you can pay with bitcoins today, for any place that lets you pay with bitcoins i guess, since you just scan the QR in the wallet app, and enter the amount to send.
<tgBot> <dohbee> NFC payments is another story, but there's no reason someone with the time and inclination to do so, couldn't get it working on devices where NFC is available, i guess
<tgBot> <YougoChats> @Stereofont, I can tape my debit card to my phone and have this
<tgBot> <YougoChats> And then have them nicked both at the same time ð
<tgBot> m_71_x7 was added by: m_71_x7
<tgBot> <Cesar_Herrera> @Stereofont, Thanks.
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> Hello @m_71_x7 and welcome!  I'm part of the UBports welcoming team.    â¦ To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
<tgBot> <demokrit atomos> @JBBgameich, Is there an image available for testing this? (I dont have a working bq right now but maybe i can convince a friend and then report back ;-p)
<tgBot> Rocco was added by: Rocco
<tgBot> <Rocco> His all.
<tgBot> <Rocco> Hi
<tgBot> <milkor73> @Rocco, Hello Rocco and welcome!  I'm part of the UBports welcoming team.    â¦ To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
<tgBot> <Rocco> Thanks. A big demand. How can I install Ubuntu touch sdk on Ubuntu 17.10
<tgBot> <Rocco> ?
<tgBot> <Michele> You cannot, I think. I have 17.10 too, I suggest you to use clickable to develop
<tgBot> <Michele> https://github.com/bhdouglass/clickable
<tgBot> <delijati> Rocco use a virtualbox and 16.04 ... there is a image in the ubports forum
<tgBot> <delijati> https://forums.ubports.com/topic/184/ubuntu-touch-programming-course
<tgBot> <Wildnislehrer> Hi guys, i saw this and my question is: can this dual sim adapter work with ut? â¦ http://www.simore.com/en/dual-sim-card-adapter-3g-4g-wx-twin-micro-sim.html?___store=simore_en
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Switching SIMs would require a reboot, but it might work otherwise.
<tgBot> <Wildnislehrer> Thank you
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> No guarantees. Check phone compatibility first.
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> You'd be doing an experience at best.
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Experiment
<tgBot> <Wildnislehrer> My question was just out of interest. A friend would by a phone for UT. He needed DualSim, but E5 isn't available
<tgBot> <Stereofont> @YougoChats, ð that's technology for you â¦
<tgBot> <Stereofont> @Wildnislehrer, Fairphone is dual
<tgBot> <Wildnislehrer> @Stereofont, Fairphone is high priced for him.
<tgBot> <Stereofont> Used price is not so bad
<tgBot> <Wildnislehrer> I'm talk with him ð
<tgBot> <Stereofont> I got mine used at a very good price because they didn't really know what it is ð
<tgBot> <Wildnislehrer> Lucky you ð
<tgBot> <Seumas> Has anyone ever had luck installing Audacity to any UT devic? Last time I tried it on my M10, it crashed on startup (the app I mean).
<tgBot> <Seumas> *device
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> @Seumas, No but sounds cool and update me if this ever works. We do audiocast with it...
<tgBot> <Seumas> I wonder if more PPAs granted with 16.04 will give better compatibility for it.
#ubports 2017-11-28
<tgBot> <FreeInside_fr> tg://join?invite=Baj4lhJ4XRotoeGk1QxuRQ
<tgBot> <Jaume81> @Wildnislehrer, He can try Meizu Pro 5 and install UT
<tgBot> <ajyotirmay> wondering if Google Treble will be a good thing for projects like UBports
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> I noticed no Korean keyboard? Any idea how to make Korean language work on UT? Works on Ubuntu desktop...
<tgBot> <BlueKenny> Hey, is it possible to use python-tk in UT? (With clickable)
<tgBot> deepu11 was added by: deepu11
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @BlueKenny, if tkinder uses qt5 bindings then ues
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> or if it uses gtk2 bindings then also yes, but via xmir
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> and xmir scenario os not clickable
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> afaik there is no way to make click app use xmir
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> on ut
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> if it was possible i would love to ise it
<tgBot> <BlueKenny> @KrisJacewicz, Thank you :) â¦ i'm going to learn QML ð
<tgBot> <DanChapman> @KrisJacewicz, Can't you just add the xmir parts to a launch script which your desktop file calls? something like â¦ ```Xmir -rootless :2 â¦ export DISPLAY=:2 â¦ exec @``` â¦ And then in your desktop file add â¦ ```X-Ubuntu-Touch=true â¦ X-Ubuntu-XMir-Enable=true â¦ Exec=/launchscript myapp``` â¦ I would have thought this should work
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @DanChapman, brilliant workaround, love it!
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> will test
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> how about :2 part, is it like a constant or every time xmir runs it uses out one display from the pool?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @DanChapman, ah I just remembered what was th problem from the past (I actually tired that, except the parts in the script, which i really thank you for):
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> the problem was that click upon installation generates .desktop fle at ~/.local/share/applications/ and your X-Ubuntu-* flags WON'T be preserved in that generated launcher
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> that was the problem I faced
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> i don't even think it is a bug, rather a lack of feature in click logic
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> not sure
<tgBot> <milkor73> @deepu11, Hello deepu and welcome!  I'm part of the UBports welcoming team.    â¦ To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
<tgBot> <bastos777> @DanChapman thank you for the Dekko 2update ð
<tgBot> <nfsprodriver> What's new?
<tgBot> <bastos777> And thanks to the core debs for clock and camera paps for improving!
<tgBot> <bastos777> *developers *apps ð
<tgBot> <DanChapman> @KrisJacewicz ah i see there is some troubles there. Some possible good new though. There was a patch in xenial which enables ubuntu-app-launch to start apps with xmir https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/tickets?search=2531 so once we have some xenial based devices, things should get a bit easier for you. Although looking at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dfAlgJtqSLM i see there are some gtk apps there running on mir. So maybe you won't even need xmir o
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @DanChapman, wow, great news in deed!!!
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> I mean, that would be HUGE news for everything that I do if gtk could run directly on mir, man I would start making apps like crazy! hehe
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> and would start talking to Lazarus community to get involved as well, I'm sure they'd have good number of people interested in it
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @KrisJacewicz, Lazarus can bind QT5 as well, but I was not successful with it, because apparently Lazarus bindings require min qt5.6, but even when that requirement gets fulfilled, I still don't know if qt on UT is fully binary compatible with equivalent on xorg, if yes, than that would be good news for Lazarus as well.  â¦ Some of my apps do graphic rendering, and in such case xmir is too slow for me. That will also be a bottleneck for others
<tgBot> use whatever language/ide to make their gtk apps. That is why I am interested in trying out xwayland, because AFAIK it really is NOT like xmir, except purpose-wise, but not under the hood. xwayland has no hw acceleration for rendering either, but at least it supports glamor (https://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/Software/Glamor/)
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> however, if gtk were to be supported natively in mir, then whoah, the possibilities are endless!
<tgBot> <anpok> hmm the gtk mir integration isnt that much code
<tgBot> <anpok> but it is in a bad state..
<tgBot> <anpok> I spent some time working on it.. but that was at a time when we also reworked the buffer ownership in mir.
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> This is all I know in the subject: â¦ https://developer.gnome.org/gtk3/stable/gtk-mir.html
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> but apparently UT does not have this port included (I'm talking 15.04), not on my end
<tgBot> <anpok> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~attente/gtk/gtk-mir/files/head:/debian/patches/ and http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~attente/gtk/mir-copy-paste/files/head:/debian/patches/ is probably the most recent status
<tgBot> <anpok> there should be proper git repo somewher
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> (Photo, 768x1280) https://irc.ubports.com/PQgkOM0u/file_2458.jpg so my UT does not have this
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @anpok, can you install this with apt-get?
<tgBot> <anpok> I am not sure about dependencies..
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @anpok, I wonder if installing mir's gtk backend would or would not conflick with also existing on ut backend for x, do you know if that'd be an issue?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> could both backends co-exist?
<tgBot> <anpok> yes they would
<tgBot> <anpok> in the end you control that via the environment
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> I'm willing and ready to test drive it, could you suggest initial steps?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> I mean, to install that backend on my ut?
<tgBot> <anpok> figure out which gtk version is in the ppa/15.04 .. and whether there are matching gdk-mir patches for that gtk version
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @anpok, I only need to install the patches, no need to install some initial libraries fisrt?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> these patches will add mir support onto the original gtk libraries?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> also is gtk+ a synonym for gtk3?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> or only gtk2?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> or both?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> found this: â¦ "GTK/GTK+ and GTK2 are different versions of the same API. GTK is an old, deprecated version, GTK2 is the previous one, GTK+ 3/GTK3 is the current version. â¦ GTK+ is the correct name of the old API, but most people just call it GTK. â¦ The C++ bindings for GTK+ are part of the project GTKmm." â¦ source: https://stackoverflow.com/questions/5830731/what-is-the-relation-between-gtk-gtk-and-gtk2
<tgBot> <anpok> no the patches are the differences between the specific upstream mir integration of gdk and the current state of development at that time
<tgBot> <anpok> so those patches will not work with the 15.04 version of gtk
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @anpok, seems like it's gtk+3.0 3.14.12-0ubuntu2 â¦ source: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/vivid/+source/gtk+3.0
<tgBot> <anpok> ahh now I remember why we did not enable the mir backend..
<tgBot> <anpok> cairo has (or hopefully had) some annoying limitation wrt to byte ordering
<tgBot> <anpok> and the android gles drivers could not match the color channel order
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> so that remains unresolved?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @anpok, you mean little endian vs big endian?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> or color format?
<tgBot> <anpok> GL_RGBA GL_ABGR GL_BGRA .. or GL_ARGB .. insanity..
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> I see
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> but wondering, since cairo works on arm linux under x, so that problem is only regarding translating these to gles calls?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> *gles calls on android?
<tgBot> <anpok> yes
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> but would a static mapping table solve that?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> or was figuring the mapping the problem?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> some inconsistencies?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> if I had some guidance I would even be willing to try to figure such mapping experimentally
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> if that would bring gtk to mir, I would love to help
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> perhaps even I could figure out a routine to run during initialization, that runs tests to figure out the mapping automatically
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> test based, call gles apis with different mappings until the results are valid for used input, and then remember that mapping for use aftr the initialization
<tgBot> <Stereofont> @wayneoutthere, At the pull down menu it allows you to select any language but in keyboard settings only a few are implemented. In principle it shouldn't be complicated to add more but I have no idea how to do that. Adding all would bloat the system
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> with just a little guidance I could take the work off someone else's shoulders, but I need help in setting up the environment for testing, and some list of APIs to translate between gtk and gles
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> @KrisJacewicz, Hey Kris, I am trying to run KeePass2 off my phone with X forwarding. I am getting  â¦ X11 forwarding request failed on channel 0 â¦ Unhandled Exception: â¦ followed by a bunch of errors. â¦ What am I missing?
<tgBot> <Rocco> @delijati, Ok. Thanks. I'll try.
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @TomasOqvist, idk, but I can try to troubleshoot you, how did you install KeyPass2, with apt-get or sth else?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> I will get it on my ut as well and see if I can run it
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> @KrisJacewicz, apt-get and then edited the desktop file
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> the package name?
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> keepass2
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> $ apt-get install keypass â¦ or sth else?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> ok, bare with me
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> apt-get install keypass2
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> sorry keepass2
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> (Photo, 724x463) https://irc.ubports.com/msnddaqA/file_2460.jpg mono runtime part
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> (Video, 143s)https://irc.ubports.com/T0rH34f6/file_2461.mp4 I think it's related to mono
<tgBot> <vanyasem> Install the native version
<tgBot> <vanyasem> I believe it was keepassx2
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @vanyasem, +1
<tgBot> <vanyasem> screw Mono
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> yes it works!
<tgBot> <vanyasem> âºï¸
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> (Photo, 1280x720) https://irc.ubports.com/3fXCVlNg/file_2463.jpg $ sudo apt-get install keepassx
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> Ok, so install keepassx instead and edit the desktop file?
<tgBot> <LarreaMikel> you can also try keepassxc (I think it has a better gui)
<tgBot> <LarreaMikel> nah.. quite similar, sorry
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> (Photo, 768x1280) https://irc.ubports.com/An1b0AMu/file_2465.jpg i installed natve version
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> (Photo, 768x1280) https://irc.ubports.com/oy0sjBHB/file_2467.jpg this is without wm
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> (Photo, 768x1280) https://irc.ubports.com/QwB69p9r/file_2469.jpg and this is with wm
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> if you still hv a problem let me know I'll get you thru ;)
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> Yes, keepassx works, but I need to export my kdbx database to one compatible with keepassx. Also, starting it locally only shows half of the app in the top right corner of the phone.
<PureTryOut[m]> @KrisJacewicz: may I ask, why do you have 2 Telegram launchers on your phone?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @TomasOqvist, because you do not run it with a wm, if you do then you get it fullscreen, see my 2 case scenarios above with screenshots
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @PureTryOut[m], one is on th ephone, another is just a launcher that starts Telegram from my Ubuntu desktop over WiFi onto my phone
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> keepass2 is better as it uses later and more secure file format I think. Seems I have to export to KeePass 1.x format, which isn't supported in Ubuntu version of KeePass2.
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> the one that has (x86_64) added in the name
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> @KrisJacewicz, How do I run it with wm?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @TomasOqvist, one step at a time, perhaps keepassx2 is available just not in the official repos, try asking goole ;)
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> @KrisJacewicz, He he, I turn out to be just as impatient as you are...
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @TomasOqvist, I call bash wrapper from my .desktop launcher, so I have wrapper at /usr/bin/start-keepassx, and the actual launcher at /usr/share/applications/keepass2.desktop, let me show you...
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> (Photo, 768x1280) https://irc.ubports.com/7HHjx7zU/file_2471.jpg this is my wrapper script
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> (Photo, 768x1280) https://irc.ubports.com/ctippMgB/file_2473.jpg and this is my launcher
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> BUT, you need to have wm installed first, I am using matchbox
<PureTryOut[m]> @KrisJacewicz ooh that is pretty cool actually. I assume that's with all your `(x86_64)` launchers then?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> $ sudo apt-get install matchbox â¦ *approx 30* MB
<PureTryOut[m]> also, I recommend KeepassXC over KeepassX
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @PureTryOut[m], correct, I wrote about it and demoed: http://kriscode.blogspot.tw/2017/11/desktop-apps-on-ubuntu-phone.html
<PureTryOut[m]> cool!
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @TomasOqvist, also in this article you actually will find all these things explained, even though it talks about Lazarus IDE, but the xmir setup is explained in great detail: http://kriscode.blogspot.tw/2017/11/lazarus-on-arm-ubuntu.html
<tgBot> <SergioSRM> @KrisJacewicz, MISS Mir Scopes Suck... lolð
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> @KrisJacewicz, Ok, I think I already installed matchbox. I'll try that.
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> @PureTryOut[m], Can it read .kdbx files?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @SergioSRM, off course scopes don't suck, just that I'm aversed to them, it's putely subjective ;)
<tgBot> <malditobastardo> Keepassxc is the one i reommend too
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> (Photo, 768x1280) https://irc.ubports.com/frUtu6rG/file_2475.jpg that's what I use instead, it actually uses my ~/Desktop for content, and will soon add folder support
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> uploading a video showing it in action
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> unfortunately because of xmir slow renderring it is less spectacular than it could be, I had to give up on fancy animation effects
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> so I want a normal desktop experience, not an app scope
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> and I want to see my wallpaper, otherwise it doesn't matter that I can have one set !
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> so right now I'm uploading a video showcasing how my UT looks like from login to actually seeing and using this replacement for scopes
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> so the way it works is that I now only show icons from my actual Desktop folder (which btw is missing in UT by default), and not all the apps. You can decide yourself what to have on your desktop and what not to have
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> also, I will add a dash-like experience
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> so you can start apps that are not on your desktop
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> like on Ubuntu Desktop
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> currently dash doesn't happen on UT, just brings scopes to the front
<PureTryOut[m]> @TomasOqvist yeah it can, like KeepassX. KeepassXC is basically KeepassX, but actually supported by more than 1 developer
<tgBot> <vanyasem> @KrisJacewicz, please compress your videos
<tgBot> <vanyasem> I don't feel like downloading 90 mb files :)
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @vanyasem, when I send them from mobile it doesn't show me that option
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> only on desktop, sorry
<tgBot> <vanyasem> use ffmpeg
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> I'll download onto my desktop and resend compressed
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> Ok, this doesn't look good: â¦ Error http://repo.ubports.com vivid/main armhf Packages â¦   Could not get status - stat (2: No such file or directory)
<tgBot> <anpok> @KrisJacewicz, I cannot remember if that was a problem of cairo then trying to render in software.. or having artefacts because a differen byte order is expected..
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @vanyasem, well that is not viable fo rme, because Isent that vid from my android phone telegram
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> While sudo apt update on the phone
<tgBot> <vanyasem> @KrisJacewicz, oh, then it should have that option. it was there for abes
<tgBot> <vanyasem> (Photo, 622x1280) https://irc.ubports.com/0EyrnmfQ/file_2477.jpg
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @anpok, well, I'm interested in helping, but I'm not capable of starting this effort without some initial help
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @vanyasem, I'll look into it
<tgBot> <anpok> hm get the code .. enable the mir backend.
<tgBot> <anpok> hmm
<tgBot> <anpok> first find the right code :)
<tgBot> <anpok> then see what happens
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> @TomasOqvist, It worked after 'sudo mount -o remount,rw /'
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @TomasOqvist, off course :P
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> But it fails to update the repo 'ppa:phoerious/keepassxc', although it installs fine.
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> So I can't install keepassxc.
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @TomasOqvist, by "installs fine" you mean it enlists that repo, off course it doesn, you can enlist anything, even verses from your favorite song
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> probably that repo does not provide packages for arm, or not for vivid
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> but if it has sources you can buildd it yourself
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> @KrisJacewicz, Ok, so I will have to stick with keepassx then I guess...
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @TomasOqvist, unless you build it from sources
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> here: https://github.com/keepassxreboot/keepassxc
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> @KrisJacewicz, Yeah, I might give it a go.
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> @TomasOqvist, I have to build on the phone or can I do it from my Ubuntu 16.04 desktop?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> $ sudo apt-get install git â¦ $ git clone https://github.com/keepassxreboot/keepassxc.git keepassxc-src â¦ $ cd keepassxc-src â¦ $ mkdir build â¦ $ cd build â¦ $ cmake -DWITH_XC_AUTOTYPE=ON -DWITH_XC_HTTP=ON -DWITH_XC_YUBIKEY=ON -DCMAKE_BUILD_TYPE=Release .. â¦ $ make -j4 â¦ $ DESTDIR=~/.local install
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> and since it uses qt5, it should run natively in mir (in theory
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @TomasOqvist, you can do either, or even on raspberry pi. â¦ - On the desktop you need to build it in architectural chroot â¦ - on the phone you may be missing qt5 dev packages needed for building â¦ - on raspi you can do all the compiling easy, then move compiled app to your ut
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> if you build it on desktop but not with architectural chroot you will end up building desktop version, unusable on the phone
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> ie cmake is missing on ut
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> $ sudo apt-get install cmake â¦ some extra ~20MB
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> and there might be more, so architectural chroot or raspi could be your best choice, unless you want to challenge yourself :D
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> (Photo, 724x463) https://irc.ubports.com/lusSo9qT/file_2479.jpg yup, not straightforward to build it on the phone, unless you hv newer cmake than in the repos (or you're on 16.04)
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> CMake Error: CMake was unable to find a build program corresponding to "Unix Makefiles".  CMAKE_MAKE_PROGRAM is not set.  You probably need to select a different build tool.
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> you probably also missing basic tools
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> $ sudo apt-get install build-essential
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> I have compilers on my ut already so I have these basic things, but you probably don't
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> cmake from sources: https://cmake.org/install/
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> I may try this on raspi when time permits
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> Uhm, this is getting complicated... Got past cmake command, but not make -j4
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> Or, I mean I got the same as you above
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @TomasOqvist, well, I got even less forward than you so cant help, cuz I don't know what problems are behind
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> but I guess missing dev packages, including for qt5
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> ah ok, so not yet actually in make
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> What about space on the phone? I now have: â¦ Filesystem                      Size  Used Avail Use% Mounted on â¦ udev                            1,3G  4,0K  1,3G   1% /dev â¦ tmpfs                           287M  1,1M  286M   1% /run â¦ /dev/mmcblk0p28                  55G  4,1G   49G   8% /userdata â¦ /dev/loop0                      2,0G  1,9G     0 100% / â¦ /dev/loop1                      118M  113M  4,1M  97% /android/system â¦ none
<tgBot>   4,0K     0  4,0K   0% /android â¦ tmpfs                           1,4G  4,0K  1,4G   1% /etc/fstab â¦ tmpfs                           1,4G  1,1M  1,4G   1% /var/lib/lxc/android/rootfs â¦ /dev/disk/by-partlabel/cache    504M  9,6M  495M   2% /android/cache â¦ /dev/disk/by-partlabel/modem     64M   57M  7,9M  88% /android/firmware â¦ /dev/disk/by-partlabel/persist  4,9M  4,2M  760K  85% /android/persist â¦ none                            4,0K     0  4,0
<tgBot> tmpfs                           1,4G   84K  1,4G   1% /tmp â¦ none                            5,0M     0  5,0M   0% /run/lock â¦ cgmfs                           100K     0  100K   0% /run/cgmanager/fs â¦ none                            1,4G  112K  1,4G   1% /run/shm â¦ none                            100M     0  100M   0% /run/user â¦ tmpfs                           1,4G     0  1,4G   0% /media â¦ tmpfs                           1,4G  4,0K  1,4G   1% /v
<tgBot>                  287M     0  287M   0% /run/user/0 â¦ tmpfs                           287M   40K  287M   1% /run/user/32011
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> btw, if you insist to make this on dsktop (ie you don't have raspi), then remember, don't use qemu-system-arm, it is limited in that it can supply maximum of 256MB RAM into the chroot. Use architectural chroot instead. â¦ 1. the qemu-system-arm (limited memory) tutorials here: http://kriscode.blogspot.tw/2016/12/easy-containers-on-ubuntu-touch.html â¦ 2. architectural chroot covered here:
<tgBot> http://kriscode.blogspot.tw/2017/11/telegram-on-arm-raspi-and-ubuntu-touch-1.html
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> *Ad 1. I showed debootstrap on ut, but you do it on esktop exactly same way, and end up having arm chroot on your intel host
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @TomasOqvist, yes you need to take care of that
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> there are multiple ways
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> I move some stuff into the userspace and symlink it back to the original place
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> at least stuff I apt-get install, but you can also use this to move some of the staff that came with the image by default
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> I moved my entire /usr/share content into my userspace
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> So that would be â¦ sudo mv /usr/share /userdata/usr/share â¦ ln -s /usr/share /userdata/usr/share  â¦ ?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> I did like so: â¦ $ mkdir ~/.hdd â¦ $ sudo cp -a /usr/share ~/.hdd/ â¦ $ sudo rm -r /usr/share â¦ $ sudo ln -s /home/phablet/.hdd/share /usr/share â¦ BUT be AWARE: it gets risky, you can skip the rm -r /usr/bin part, you will not regain any space, but you will not add anything into that either, but then you cannot ln -s to /usr/share unless: â¦ a) you rename it to sth else, or â¦ b) you mount new location over the old instead on using sy
<tgBot> because I don't hv to deal with /etc/fstab or other scripts
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> cp -a - t prevail all the original priviledges etc
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> regular mv/cp will screw you up with these ;)
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> it's a tricky terrain to walk on, but can be rewarded with plenty of space to apt-get install stuff :D
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> Hm, will it mess up coming OTA updates?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @TomasOqvist, no, the OTA will just overwrite it, and your /usr/share in the userspace will be of no use any longer, you can delete it completely
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> then you can redo the steps all over again
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> You mean it needs to be repeated after each OTA update?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @TomasOqvist, precisely, it is a non-persistent technique
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> Ok, and the other options to regain space that you were thinking of? (Sorry for bothering you about this)
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> if you want persistent technique, I'd suggest another approach, just move into your userspace apps only, not the stuff that your OTA image has shipped with
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> and in your user autostart or user cronjob or anything in the userspace, add script that checks if the symlinking is in effect or not, and i not, re-does it
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> That is /usr/share/applications and those that I installed myself?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @TomasOqvist, not any fixed path, just whatever is added when you apt-get install, case by case I'm affraid, no generic way to rule them all
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> @KrisJacewicz, Thanks, where do the click installs reside?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> what I do, I repackage my apps completely for userspace, let's say Geany, i downloaded deb: â¦ $ apt-get download geany â¦ and I extracted it in my home, then I created single .sh script that symlinks the content onto my system image, so I can put this Geany folder ANY place I so desire (obviously I do it under my home directory somewhere), and then enetr that location and: â¦ $ sudo install.sh â¦ (I also have uninstall.sh script just for t
<tgBot> symlinks hings on the fly. So after OTA I just need to re-enter that folder and re-run install.sh â¦ HOWEVER, I can install user's cron job that runs the script, and after OTA update it will still be in effect (the cronjob). Or some other user's autostart, bash rc or whatever
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> @KrisJacewicz, And those can also be moved to /userdata?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @TomasOqvist, hahah, these already ARE in the userspace
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> that's why they persist between OTA updates
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> @KrisJacewicz, Bear with me, I am a novice ð
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> cd into that location and you'll notice it is already writable
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @TomasOqvist, no sweat
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> plus, you're already hacking ut, so I'm all happy to bear with you :D
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> But my problem with lack of space remains, and I don't have that many apt-get installs in /usr/share
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @TomasOqvist, off course, because ut image by default has very little space left, it's not what UT makers anticipate that users will apt-get things
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> that's why as long as you remount / to writable, you're already hacking ut, using it differently than intended
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> but that's where ut actually becomes of value :D
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> But wait, my mc install has persisted through OTA updates??
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> otherwise it can only do less of what other mobile OSes can do
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @TomasOqvist, very hard to believe
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> @KrisJacewicz, I have only installed once, and update devel every day and it is still there.
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @TomasOqvist, sudo apt-get upgrade is not same as OTA update
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> OTA update rewrites/overrides your entire system partition
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> otherwise I myself am missing something here
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> (Photo, 717x239) https://irc.ubports.com/liMccnHi/file_2481.jpg No, I do it from System Settings app
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> so always oublecheck what I or others say
<tgBot> <DanChapman> From what I understand of it an OTA will only bork apt installs if it touches/replaces files that the deb package either installed or depended on. I have some modifications to the dash that never get overwritten as those qml files never change
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> could it be that new OTA includes it? that would be a shocker since UT team is reluctant to add packages to default image and mc I think would not be regarded by them as crucial, esp that even terminal app is not included by default
<tgBot> <samitormanen> yay, I can print documents straight from my Ubuntu phone ð
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> @samitormanen, How?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @DanChapman, well than OTA is much more intelligent than I thought, and I am sincerely impressed
<tgBot> <samitormanen> @TomasOqvist, from command line
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @samitormanen, :D
<tgBot> <unknown> Hey â¦ It is possible to install desktop version of Google Chrome on UT (like keepass) â¦ If one had chrome one could install ARC Welder Extension and run Android Apps (including WhatsApp...) on UT
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> @KrisJacewicz, Well, if space is as limited as it seems on my phone...
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> @samitormanen, Sample command pls?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @unknown, if by "desktop version" you mean intel version then not. â¦ If you mean non-mir version, then yes.
<tgBot> <milkor73> @samitormanen, This sound Great Sami
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> ACTUALLY - i don't know about Chrome, but CHromium most certainly yes, I have
<tgBot> <samitormanen> it wont work without installing and configuring things. but now I can print a document just by typing "lp document.txt"
<tgBot> <samitormanen> and it is network printer
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @samitormanen, share conf flow, and I'll make UI for it
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> @samitormanen, Naturally...
<tgBot> <unknown> @KrisJacewicz, Since chromium is very similar to chrome it might work - somebody should test it ð¤
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @unknown, what I mean is that IDK whether or not Chrome is released for ARM linux
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> but Chromium is
<tgBot> <samitormanen> @KrisJacewicz, i write some howto if someone wants to try it ð
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> @samitormanen, ð
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> Chrome similarity is because Chrome is based off of Chromium, not even sure if it is available as source code, or only binary version, Chrome = Chromium+Google's proprietary stuff on top of it
<tgBot> <peternerlich> Quick question, does someone know how to easily ssh into UT from my laptop via USB?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @samitormanen, thenshare it with me in pm so it doesn't get lost in the history by the time I hv free hours to sit down to it
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @peternerlich, use screen maybe, haven't tried but in theory should work
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> your usb supports serial connection
<tgBot> <samitormanen> @KrisJacewicz, ok.
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> lots of embedded systems work that way
<tgBot> <unknown> @KrisJacewicz, Raspberry Pi = UT?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> i do it with single board computers, you need to use data capable usb cable naturally
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @unknown, nope, raspberry pi is hardware, UT is software, but also raspi supports multiple OS distributions, including Ubuntu Core and Ubuntu with Mate Desktop, but not Ubuntu Touch
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> YT could be ported to raspi, but currently UT apparently is investing in things like hallium which means it will depend on android kernel, that is adirection away from raspi, unless there is modern android for it, which perhaps there is but I don't know
<tgBot> <unknown> @KrisJacewicz, Yes but if a software runs on RasPi (raspbian) would it also run on UT
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> and it would be interesting, becaus ethen you'd hv UT on a regular monitor, wonder how it would look like, should be exactly same as Mir desktop on intel based laptop/pc
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @unknown, depends, if it is a software compiled for ARM linux then yes, given that UT provides all dependencies
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> raspi is hardware, it can run ARM native machine code, but executable files are also compiled against OS, not only against CPU
<tgBot> <unknown> Okay I see
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> so ARM Linux is the common ground on which both UT as well ass Linux based distros available for raspi grow
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> raspbian is not same as raspi, one is OS another is HW
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> raspbian is debian based
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> generally compatible with UT, so it's all about dependencies then
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> but more or less yes, same
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> if you use Ubuntu on raspi then you get even more compatibility
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> your executables will be valid, but the dependencies (libraries that are linked dynamically at runtime) might not be available on UT, you can always distribute them with your app in one bundle, then yes, you achieve full compatibility
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> but even then there is GUI related problem, if the app is GUI, whgat widgetset it uses is another limitation
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> currently ut supports qt5 and gkt+/gtk2 via xmir
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> but gtk3 doesn't start on the phone via xmir (does start over ssh with x forwarding though)
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> and qt4 i hv no idea
<tgBot> <unknown> So does this tutorial on how to install Chrome on Raspbian also work on UT? â¦ https://www.linux.com/blog/run-google-chrome-raspberry-pi
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> so things like that
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @unknown, yes but not sufficient, UT will require additional steps
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> for example UT has read-only filesystem, which raspi does not have so you won't see that addressed on that tutorial
<tgBot> <unknown> Ever heard of ExaGear?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> also, at the end, if you also wish to use chrome on the phone's screen, you will need to modify the .desktop launcher, but ssh scenario does not depend on it
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @unknown, yes, I even mentionned them on my blog and contacted about supporting UT, let me find their reply
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> deleted, but basically they responded asking why would they support a dead platform
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> I replied, but no hearing from them since
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> that was very recently
<tgBot> <unknown> @unknown, In this tutorial they use ExaGear to run x86 Chrome version on a RasPi â¦ If this worked or could be implemented on UT we could also run Android Apps
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @unknown, well yes, but exagear does not support UT atm, and also...
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> ExaGear itself introduces performance penalty, it is advertised to reach up to 80% of native performance, but that's just a maximum used in marketing, although they have super confident claim that it's much faster than qemu. â¦ Now, xmir, on top of that, is yet another level of performance penalty. I'm talking about speed of rendering out the GUI
<tgBot> <unknown> Okay and ARC Welder will slow down again
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> I may try exagear on plasma mobile, as xwayland it does not have limitations that xmir has (from what I was told/explained) so that might be viable environment for exagear, we'll see
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> if your far goal is to run android app s on UT, then you'd want as little layer in between with performance penalty as possible, study into the case ob BB supporting android apps, their approach was sth you could look into
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> but as inneficient as it may prove with xmir, you could in theory do android with qemu: http://www.upubuntu.com/2012/03/how-to-install-android-x86-40-using.html
<tgBot> <unknown> It was just an idea when I read about ARC Welder...
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> the only culprit: this tutorial uses x86 android, you'd want arm android
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> your kernel versions would need to be matching, then you shoudl be able to install full android OS into qemu-kvm based vm
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> on UT
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> I even have a terribly great idea (but I can't make it happen) that perhaps a qt5 ative vnc client could perform better than xmir for such use scenarios
<tgBot> <unknown> A full Android OS (including launcher and everything else) might not be the best solution â¦ ARC Welder doesn't do this
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> instead of xmir rendering apps into itself with its limitations, a native qt5 vlc client running directly in Mir could do it
<tgBot> <unknown> I have to go now - see you later
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> take care
<tgBot> <unknown> Thank you for your effort
<tgBot> <SwizzlaKalongie> â is anbox still active?
<tgBot> <Flohack> @SwizzlaKalongie, TBH We dont know :)
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @SwizzlaKalongie, it is online still, not sure if that means active or not, but more important question is this: does anbox use ARM android, or intel
<tgBot> <SwizzlaKalongie> @KrisJacewicz, arm.. they say " ... it is specifically built in a device independent way. Anbox will ship with a single Android image per architecture (amd64, armhf, arm64) and no device specifc modifications are required"
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @SwizzlaKalongie, well then, a promising idea!
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> however need to find out how will it render out its gui
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> xmir? qt5?
<tgBot> <SwizzlaKalongie> hmm... technical questions... oh well... i'm good at waiting haha
<tgBot> <SwizzlaKalongie> we'll either get there one day or just won't need android anything by that point
<tgBot> <delijati> @KrisJacewicz have you tried to compile anbox for ut or at some arm device ?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @delijati, no but im interested in it so maybe on thw weekend
<tgBot> <samitormanen> damn, .pdf and .txt files works but .doc files wont print..
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @samitormanen, off course
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> pdf is a printing format and txt is raw text
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> pdf is like ps, made for print
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> so that's why
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> doc is interpreted format
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> doc viewer interprets it and renders out as it "thinks" it should
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> pdf is different, no room for interpretation
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> http://resources.printhandbook.com/pages/file-types.php
<tgBot> <samitormanen> ah, ok. that explains it. thanks!
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> however some printers have built-in support for doc(x)
<tgBot> <samitormanen> i can print .doc with "catdoc file.doc |lp" but then it is plain text.
<tgBot> <samitormanen> but it's good thing to get something to printed out. ð better than nothing.
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @samitormanen, because catdoc only extracts plain text from the internal doc file structure, no formatting
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> so printing catdoc is exacrly identical as printing txt
<tgBot> <samitormanen> yep.
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> @KrisJacewicz, woah...........  it's hard not to get drawn in by keepassx... !
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> @wayneoutthere, Yes, it is a nifty thought to always have your up to date passwords on the phone! But migrating from the database on KeePass2 on my desktop turned out to be more difficult than I thought. Have yet to find an export format that I can oper in KeePassX without getting 'signature error'.
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> well, most of what Kris is doing is not possible for guys like me, however, I think Kris is all about the bigger picture and he is motivating people to think and act and get excited and so... neat.
<tgBot> <milkor73> @wayneoutthere, Very well Wayne I agree with you but for all the non developers!!! Pls be aware this is just hacking to find out what can UT do, what can we expect,,,, There is no intention you and me as non developers with UT daily devices to try it, as you will break very possibly upcoming new OS OTA updates and maybe something else. Be inspired, watch the difference among UT and the market mainstream OSes. And be patient, all this will come incl
<tgBot> in the UT OS convergence concept. ð
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> Right.  I hate creating new groups though.  we don't want more than we actually need ha
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @milkor73, good point. i in deed am focused on users who will want to do what i do. And i admit that i am not focused on regular smartphone users who will just want to ise UT as a smartphone imstead of android/ios. Because i dont believe that ut can match android/ios in that aspect. because of my skepticism i focus on exploring ut value that appeals to other group of users. but at the end of the day, i think, it is all good. because there is a
<tgBot> solid team supporting regular users already so I am effectively addressing something in a complementary fashion.
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> you are yes
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> and the excitment around it is motivating
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> tahnk you, i appreciate it
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> but I'm speaking to the manager in you (we have one).  how can we motivate, mobilize, and organize the troops?
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> obviously we need to have a big picture discussion ... i have a weird part of my brain that loves systems and organizing. i try to run from it but it won't run from me.  here I see something complimentary and I also see a lot of people who could possibly help.. but the problem is 'what are we helping' and 'where are we going'?
<tgBot> <milkor73> @KrisJacewicz, Thanks for your feedback and happy that you are in deeper contact with core team already.
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> oh
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> that's good
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> anyway, i feel like... we need some big in-your-face forum meeting
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> kind of like Q&A on steroids
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> *hides*
<tgBot> <LarreaMikel> @TomasOqvist, Do you know Keepweb? It's in the openstore.
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> no. here is what I know â--Â»Â»     __ Â«Â«------------
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> (sounds exciting to search)(we're going to start reviewing apps soon... i think we have one already reviewed. ha
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @milkor73, well, only what u see happens here in this chat
<tgBot> <dohbee> @wayneoutthere, I don't know how ubports is handling building the image tarballs now, but previously the images would only have translations included which had i think >60% (or maybe it was even higher) completion rate
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> @LarreaMikel, Yes, I have it installed. But it is a bit of a hassle, because I have to copy my password file from dropbox all the time, or I am out of sync with my most recent passwords. It would be easier if possible to MTP into the OPO, but there's some bug preventing that.
<tgBot> <PhoenixLandPirate> @KrisJacewicz, Folder support in the app draw would be awesome.
<tgBot> <PhoenixLandPirate> But it's have to be designed right which is something I think would be difficult to do.
<tgBot> <PhoenixLandPirate> Personally if I install desktop on my apps, for convergence reasons, I don't want to see them when I'm on phone.
<tgBot> <PhoenixLandPirate> I liked the separation which the libertine scope added, but it isn't great. â¦ Also the idea if going to the openstore, downloading like Firefox thinking it's the mobile version, then having the desktop version, would be pretty upsetting. â¦ And then having 2 Firefox's next to each other one being desktop, other being phone, would also be a bad time.
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @PhoenixLandPirate, i get this, to each its own, no doubt about that
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> also valuable feedback fpr me to allow some customization per user's prefference
<tgBot> <LarreaMikel> @TomasOqvist, but you will have that same problem with keepassxc, don't you?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> also the desktop on ut via my scopes replaceme t would not matter in converged desktop
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> hou would still see regular converged desktop
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> or no desktip at all in ssh scenario
<tgBot> <PhoenixLandPirate> I never use the desktop anyways, but it should be available for convergence mode for those who do use the desktop
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @PhoenixLandPirate, i agree
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> the way i think i will adress that is so that u can choose if you want a particular location to be shown on your phone (could be Desktop or anything else) or just apps
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> i think that will be flexible enough
<tgBot> <Vijaypraj> (Photo, 720x1280) https://irc.ubports.com/q71BYyQY/file_2485.jpg
<tgBot> <Vijaypraj> How to fix it
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> ctrl+c
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> 2nd from the left
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> or 'n'
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> @LarreaMikel, Not if I run keepass through x-forwarding, then I will always work with the same database.
<tgBot> <LarreaMikel> ahh, ok. understood.
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @TomasOqvist, use rsync if u hv a server OR script rsync to work on your LAN
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @TomasOqvist, precisely that is one of killer aspects of x forwarding!
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> that's one of biggies i was trying to bring to everyone's attention!
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> your apps, data, configs, all travels with you. in your pocket.
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> +1
<tgBot> <dohbee> @Vijaypraj, Don't use apt on the phone, unless it's in a chroot.
<tgBot> <Vijaypraj> So what should i have to do
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @dohbee, dont limit ppl. he is free to use apt it is his phone, his choice.
<tgBot> <dohbee> Yes, one is free to break their own things.
<tgBot> <Vijaypraj> I want to install libretine
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @dohbee, yes. also u dont k ow if they will or will not break things. tell ppl that they should understand what they are doing but if they do, let them. â¦ vijay might not be very familiar with apt, i deduce, so i would generally not suggest him to use it, but it should be because of his lack of understanding of apt not as an umbrekable rule.
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> so vijay learn more about apt before using it
<tgBot> <Vijaypraj> I am familiar with apt
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> your sources dont fownload maybe network problem maybe your / is not writable
<tgBot> <Vijaypraj> I am new to in ut but not new in Linux
<tgBot> <Vijaypraj> I tried to unlock
<tgBot> <Vijaypraj> Dpkg directory
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Vijaypraj, well thwn i think usong apt is fine for u
<tgBot> <Vijaypraj> But still not working
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> and u can disregard the comment about chroot
<tgBot> <Vijaypraj> I have no more experience in ut
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> isnyour image writable?
<tgBot> <Vijaypraj> I am using stable version
<tgBot> <Vijaypraj> And i also try with sudo
<tgBot> <Vijaypraj> But not working
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> ok can ypu mkdir /blablah ?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> with sudo?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> if u cant means u are readonly
<tgBot> <Vijaypraj> Yes
<tgBot> <Vijaypraj> I make mkdir
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> ok so can u verify u have no internet problem?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> u using telegram on the phone?
<tgBot> <Vijaypraj> Yes I will check
<tgBot> <dohbee> @Vijaypraj, libertine is installed by default
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @dohbee, is it? why on earth would it be default is beyond me...
<tgBot> <Vijaypraj> Not a problem with internet
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Vijaypraj, no dependency problems?
<tgBot> <Vijaypraj> No
<tgBot> <dohbee> @KrisJacewicz, i do know if they will break things. the root partition is read-only for a reason. changing it to rw and using apt to update/install things is a generally bad idea, and a quick way to fill the partition to 100%
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> so only problem with fetching repos yes?
<tgBot> <Vijaypraj> Yes
<tgBot> <dohbee> @KrisJacewicz, it was in april. i don't think ubports changed anything. it would be installed by default so people can create containers and use legacy apps
<tgBot> <dohbee> what wasn't installed by default was the legacy apps scope, which was in the app store as a click instead
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @dohbee, should bebup to user not to you, but explaining rationale is good. explain but dont forbid.  â¦ also since the system is designed to work in read only it doesnt matter if root is 100% full anyways ;)
<tgBot> <dohbee> don't tell me what to do
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Vijaypraj, maybe change to main server? are you using a local server?
<tgBot> <dohbee> well fill your root partition to 100% and let me know how well your phone boots then
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> in software sources?
<tgBot> <dohbee> vivid is dead
<tgBot> <dohbee> it is no more
<tgBot> <dohbee> it is an ex-distro
<tgBot> <Vijaypraj> So how to change
<tgBot> <Vijaypraj> In ut
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> It looks like the repository is still up, though. We're probably the only ones using it
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Vijaypraj, maybe just change sources?
<tgBot> <Vijaypraj> I will try
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> But that's why we're trying to get to 16.04 as quickly as possible rather than beating on 15.04
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> i cant help u now but someone here can tell ypu what they hv in thwir /etc/apt/sources*
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> including the commented ones
<tgBot> <Vijaypraj> Ok
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> u can tey to ise that and retry
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Vijaypraj, also for the limited space alternative to chrooting is moving some data (for example from under usr share) into userspace and symlinking it back to otiginal location
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> u can keep ypu disk usage low that way
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> i run my gui apps like that, cuz i dont want the overhead pf libertine
<tgBot> <dohbee> why do you have deb-src enabled? and why is it trying to download the uncompressed versions of the files?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @dohbee, that is a good remark right there
<tgBot> <dohbee> but really you don't need to use apt to use libertine
<tgBot> <dohbee> or a regular chroot if what you want is CLI tools
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @dohbee, that is another great point, despite i argued with u earlier i totally agree that simple clean chroot is agreat tool, and no overhead related to libertine
<tgBot> <dohbee> libertine is literally just a plain chroot with a few default packages and X installed
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> however i suspect you would agree that sometimes chroot is just not an option, ie if you want to install wireshark
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> because sometimes u want direct access to real resources and not be in a chroot jail
<tgBot> <dohbee> and libertine handles managing bind mounts for you
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @dohbee, i thought lxc, but also libertine is full vivid, whereas u can run chroot on a MUCH more compact chroot image
<tgBot> <dohbee> libertine has nothing to do with vivid
<tgBot> <JBBgameich> But lxc should run on the device already because of the Android container, so you could Setup a second lxc with debian Sid  maybe ...
<tgBot> <JBBgameich> Has anybody tried that already?
<tgBot> <dohbee> it is lxc, but lxc is also just a specially managed chroot
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @dohbee, into chroot in libertine downloads vivid afaik
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> if it is not, then it was last time i used it
<tgBot> <dohbee> you can create 16.04 or 17.10 or whatever version you want, in a libertine container
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> i am veru sure of what i am saying because i used debootstrap container manually after that to have xenial chroot fpr a project
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> and libertine had vivid to match host image
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @dohbee, which arw all large sistros that is my meaning all the time
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> chroot can go much lighter than amy of ubuntus
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> tjat is the overhead i meant
<tgBot> <dohbee> it grabs basic pre-installed image
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> and vijay i saw your screen amd u arw on read only fs, your error messages are saying this to you explicitely
<tgBot> <dohbee> but there's nothing stopping you from apt-get removing extra stuff inside the container if you want
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> u nedd to read the errors
<tgBot> Rocco 3 was added by: Rocco 3
<tgBot> <dohbee> generally most people want to have translations and working systems too
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> and brush up on some info, but this group will help u fond answers
<tgBot> <dohbee> telling people to do things the exceptionally hard way because of your personal ideals of what "overhead" is, is not helpful
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Guys
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> alright gius time to sleep take care and later
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Let's get Ubuntu Touch 16.04 first and worry about what we can do on top of it after that
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @dohbee, sorry but that not what i am doing. i dont encourage ppl using apt on ut. i dont tell them they cant either. especially if they want to and ask how. sth for u to think about. anyways, rwally uv to sleep now.
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @UniversalSuperBox, +1
<tgBot> <dohbee> i didn't say anyone can't. i said they shouldn't
<tgBot> <VIJAYHIREMATH1> @UniversalSuperBox, Irony : On 15.04 Nexus 5 was really getting in good shape.
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> The goal of 16.04 is to change the base operating system only. Its behavior should stay the same.
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> We can change the behavior after we're on a supported base.
<tgBot> <VIJAYHIREMATH1> @UniversalSuperBox, +1
<tgBot> <alan_griffiths> @UniversalSuperBox, +1
<tgBot> <mariogrip> woo! i just got mir 0.28 to run on nexus 5 :D
<tgBot> <samzn> fantastic!
<tgBot> <mariogrip> here is the android part of https://github.com/ubports/mir-android-platform
<tgBot> <mariogrip> moved it to github so it's easier to contribute and read
<tgBot> <samzn> I should be on vacations by next week
<tgBot> <samzn> Going to double down on the apps I've promised for the platform :)
<tgBot> <alan_griffiths> @mariogrip, That's very interesting! Tell us more.
<tgBot> <mariogrip> @samzn, YAY :D
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> The Nexus 5 didn't explode, so I guess that's step 1
<tgBot> <mariogrip> @alan_griffiths, I just have the demos working no qtmir/unity8 or anything like that
<tgBot> <samzn> https://boards.4chan.org/g/thread/63598651/is-there-any-reason-to-still-use-android-phones found this on /g/
<tgBot> <mariogrip> @alan_griffiths, will try some different things, but the demos seems to `just` work
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> @samzn, Wow...
<tgBot> <mariogrip> @UniversalSuperBox, it's not made by samsung :P
<tgBot> <alan_griffiths> @mariogrip, Sure, but you've got the first out-of-tree "graphics platform" working. That's a big step.
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> @UniversalSuperBox, That's a lot of testosterone in one thread
<tgBot> <mariogrip> @alan_griffiths, Have to thank @anpok for that, i just made it compile with 0.28 :)
<tgBot> <samzn> .28 is the build with wayland support, correct?
<tgBot> <mariogrip> @samzn, Jep, basic wayland support
<tgBot> <samzn> Fantastic work Marius
<tgBot> <alan_griffiths> @UniversalSuperBox, As it should be. The patten language is "Stable Intermediate Forms - A Foundation Pattern for Derisking the Process of Change" https://accu.org/index.php/journals/261
<tgBot> <samitormanen> Good work Marius! ð¤
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> Congratulations! we have a new language group.  Be sure to find out what that is by subscribing to the UBports News Channel here:  https://t.me/ubports_news
<tgBot> <dohbee> @UniversalSuperBox, It's 4chan. What can you expect but a bunch of dudes wishing they could all be the alpha?
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> I suppose
<tgBot> <Radu> @dohbee, Worse, it's /g/. That place is more cancerous than most boards.
<tgBot> <samzn> except for some cucks
<tgBot> <samzn> There's plenty of interesting discussions once in a while
<tgBot> gonfebo was added by: gonfebo
<tgBot> <peternerlich> Hello @gonfebo and welcome! I'm part of the UBports welcoming team. â¦ To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
<tgBot> <Radu> From time to time. But everything invoving OS's and phones turns to shit
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> Hmm.  I might have to boldly believe you are incorrect.
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> there is always time for an exception.
<tgBot> <DanChapman> @alan_griffiths, That was a really interesting read! Thanks for sharing the link ð
<tgBot> <Radu> Yeah, but in between apple fanboys, wannabes that think gentoo and arch are the end-point of OS development(Ubuntu is for kids, and has the amazon botnet, etc), people that screech about bloat and hate DE's, people that think parroting Stallman's ego-jerk about GNU+Linux makes them smart, windows users copy-pasting old arguments, and folks that think every advance leap in computing(phones, mice, visual interfaces) since the 80's is heresy, because they
<tgBot> shit some stuck-up ancient neckbeards from that age still think, it's not exactly Silicon Valley
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> I think you just summed up the Internet.
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Let's be different than that here.
<tgBot> <Radu> oh no, this community is awesome. but other places don't exactly see eye-to-eye about our vision
<tgBot> <peternerlich> quick question: in the webapp creator app, what do the suburls do? I find that a bit confusing
<tgBot> <neothethird> @peternerlich, iirc they need a regular expression describing all urls that are supposed to be opened in the app, everything else will be opened in the browser
<tgBot> <neothethird> if in doubt just use `*.url.com/*` i guess
<tgBot> <peternerlich> @neothethird, ah ok, but the url space I already entered above is included?
<tgBot> <neothethird> ok, maybe i'm wrong
<tgBot> <neothethird> been a while since i messed with the webapp creator
<tgBot> <peternerlich> (it says `Add any URL under the main URL that should be opened in the app` â `Access to SubURL 1` ...)
<tgBot> <neothethird> ok, maybe they want to have seperate patterns for the subdomain, domain and path
<tgBot> <neothethird> @cibersheep care to elaborate? ^
<tgBot> <dohbee> @Radu, which vision exactly? there are so many to choose from.
<tgBot> <peternerlich> btw, is `htop` available as a click package?
<tgBot> <Flohack> @peternerlich, No but if you push me nicely I could add it to the rootfs ;)
<tgBot> <JBBgameich> I would like to build a Ubuntu Touch click package of  https://github.com/kaidanim/kaidan. Currently Kaidan depends on Qt 5.9 and Kirigami 2. Do you think it will work on the new xenial release if we put Kirigami inside the click package?
<tgBot> <JBBgameich> Currently I'm still waiting for lxd being packaged for debian so I can use clickable properly
<tgBot> <dohbee> i guess if 5.9 is there, it will sort of work, but not be very friendly
<tgBot> <peternerlich> @Flohack, I'm not sure that is the right way to do it, since there is literally no normal user that would ever use it. But it would have been nice could it be added with more ease for those who do use it
<tgBot> <dohbee> it says only 5.7 is required in the readme
<tgBot> <dohbee> yeah, CMakeLists.txt also only depends on 5.7.0
<tgBot> <Flohack> @peternerlich, I am missing htop every time ^^
<tgBot> <peternerlich> true
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> If only overlay-style filesystems were included and stable in Android kerneld
<tgBot> <balcy> @balcy, ... I have found a way to build it and get it running, will write about this in the forum some time later
<tgBot> <Flohack> https://github.com/ubports/ubuntu-touch-meta/commit/ff9ec414ae5e62a6c71db3c90ac1ce72755a82ff @KrisJacewicz @peternerlich
<tgBot> GiovanniStaiano was added by: GiovanniStaiano
<tgBot> <anpok> hm repowerd complains about a missing library and dbus service files.. Loading module: 'libubuntu_application_api_touch_mirclient.so.3.0.0' â¦ Error org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.ServiceUnknown: The name com.canonical.powerd was not provided by any .service files â¦ Error org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.ServiceUnknown: The name com.canonical.powerd was not provided by any .service files â¦ library "libubuntu_application_api.so" not found
<tgBot> <peternerlich> Hello @GiovanniStaiano and welcome! I'm part of the UBports welcoming team. â¦ To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
<tgBot> <GiovanniStaiano> Hello - Ciao :)
<tgBot> <peternerlich> If you have any "beginner" questions or need guidance, feel free to ask over in the welcome room (invite at request). â¦ Also, you might be repelled by the amount of messages going through our groups at times, but still interested to stay updated about our project. In this case, lucky you, there's a brand new News Channel! @ubports_news
<tgBot> <peternerlich> @GiovanniStaiano, If you have any "beginner" questions or need guidance, feel free to ask over in the welcome room (invite at request). â¦ Also, you might be repelled by the amount of messages going through our groups at times, but still interested to stay updated about our project. In this case, lucky you, there's a brand new News Channel! @ubports_news
<tgBot> <GiovanniStaiano> ð
<tgBot> <GiovanniStaiano> Hello, Does the GPS work well (Especially with the Nexus 5)? I have to turn on the smartphone several times until you start the GPS.
<tgBot> <nfsprodriver> For me even in Northern Germany it works fine.
<tgBot> <dohbee> @anpok, The problem is the missing library then. The complaint about the service files is from dbus as it failed to start repowerd, which provides that bus name.
<tgBot> <dohbee> @GiovanniStaiano, It worked OK for me when I last used it, and after letting the signal get linked up while outside. If I tried straight from indoors, it wouldn't find the satellites
<tgBot> <GiovanniStaiano> @nfsprodriver @nfsprodriver Does it quickly find the signal?
<tgBot> <anpok> ok
<tgBot> <GiovanniStaiano> @dohbee Does it quickly find the signal?
<tgBot> <sverzegnassi> @Flohack, poppler-data plz ð
<tgBot> <dohbee> @GiovanniStaiano, It was satellite only, no AGPS, so it wasn't exactly quick, but it wasn't too slow either. It did take a few seconds.
<tgBot> <Flohack> https://github.com/ubports/ubuntu-touch-meta/commit/a897bfd36b628df02533a22af8e146ee8c6e5442 @KrisJacewicz
<tgBot> <dohbee> probably about the same as when using satellite only in Android
<tgBot> <GiovanniStaiano> OK
<tgBot> <cibersheep> @neothethird, M? Reading...
<tgBot> <cibersheep> @peternerlich, This is because with some websites / services if the main URL is: `whoeva,com` sometimes `www.whoeva,com` doesn't work. Or `app.whoeva,com` â¦ So, you have the fields in case you need them. â¦ Also, say you are interested in open some other URL in the app: `whoeva,com` needs acces to `imthere,fr`, then you might use the additional URL for that purpose
<tgBot> <peternerlich> @cibersheep, aah ok
<tgBot> <cibersheep> @peternerlich, Does that make sense?
<tgBot> <c_smith> Question: is Halogen to a point where I can test Ubuntu Touch on it?
<tgBot> <c_smith> (not afraid of building it, I'm just not fluent enough with programming to be able to attempt major changes to the tree)
<tgBot> <dohbee> halogen?
<tgBot> <cibersheep> @dohbee, I guess is Hallium, right?
<tgBot> <cibersheep> @c_smith, You have a dedicated Telegram group if you want to check
<tgBot> <dohbee> i was guessing that, but maybe one meant a specific device port
<tgBot> <cibersheep> @dohbee, Oh, right
<tgBot> <lduboeuf> hi, no more notifications from Jenkins builds ?
<tgBot> <lduboeuf> (sorry if i'm out off topic)
<tgBot> <kristijantkalec> @DanChapman I have one question about dekko 2
<tgBot> <kristijantkalec> I've set up a imap account, but it doesn't show me the mails in onbox
<tgBot> <kristijantkalec> Inbox*
<tgBot> <kristijantkalec> I can send them, but I cannot read them. Is it a known issue?
<tgBot> <kristijantkalec> Thanks
<tgBot> <Dio Cristo> Yessah
<tgBot> <Dio Cristo> Vicinoo
<tgBot> <c_smith> @cibersheep, Already there, rarely do I get anything like a reply there, guess I'll try again there
<tgBot> <cibersheep> @c_smith, Oh. Anyway, think that Halium might be in early stage
<tgBot> <Michele> @Dio Cristo, are you italian? wanna join @ubportsitaliano?
<tgBot> <cibersheep> @c_smith, Or might want to take a look at the forum? â¦ https://forums.ubports.com/topic/431/porting-halium-to-nexus-7-deb
<tgBot> <cibersheep> Sorry if I'm not being too helpful :(
<tgBot> <Dio Cristo> @Michele, Ammazzati
<tgBot> <Vijaypraj> vijay prajapati: â¦ sudo ubuntu-device-flash --server=http://system-image.ubports.com touch --device=hammerhead \ --channel=15.04/stable --bootstrap
<tgBot> <Vijaypraj> Change device name
<tgBot> <Vijaypraj> It is easy to install
<tgBot> <malditobastardo> I need redshift on UT so much
<tgBot> <peternerlich> @malditobastardo, me too~~~
<tgBot> <malditobastardo> https://github.com/ubports/ubuntu-touch/issues/348
<tgBot> <malditobastardo> Amazing move! Kris will be happy after this ð¹
<tgBot> <malditobastardo> @peternerlich, https://community.ubuntu.com/t/mirs-next-steps-we-need-your-input/2140/34
<tgBot> <malditobastardo> Read the last answer ðº
<tgBot> <malditobastardo> well, last 2 answers from the devs
<tgBot> <peternerlich> @malditobastardo, I'm also an advocate for making more apps SuruDark theme compatible, but there is way more important stuff atm
<tgBot> <peternerlich> @malditobastardo, ð
<tgBot> <profetik777> hey as many of you know in the states, today is GIVING TUESDAY!
<tgBot> <profetik777> how about we give ubports a special holiday cheer with a $16.04 donation :D
<tgBot> <profetik777> just a thought :D
<tgBot> <profetik777> si puedes, if you can.
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> I'll have to find something to give to!
<tgBot> <profetik777> @UniversalSuperBox, halium lol
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> I don't think they'll take my money
<tgBot> <profetik777> plasma mobile ;P
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Yeah, they'd take my money
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Give time to Halium and you help all three!
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> yaaaay
<tgBot> <profetik777> there is prism....lol but hopefully those who are not on patreon can give a one time donation, that would be cool too...and those projects we mentioned - its all love in these parts....most of the time at least lol
#ubports 2017-11-29
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Flohack, thank you, so much!
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Flohack, you are awesome
<tgBot> <neothethird> @KrisJacewicz, am i awesome as well? https://github.com/ubports/ubuntu-touch-meta/commit/a897bfd36b628df02533a22af8e146ee8c6e5442
<tgBot> <neothethird> even though it took forever
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @profetik777, +1
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @profetik777, +1
<tgBot> <Ern_st> @neothethird where can I find the fix for this bug : https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubports-android/+bug/1542964 ? I got the same error on my port.
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1542964 in ubports-android "Mir/hwc: invalid source image img wh=1152x1920 rect=0,0,0,0" [Critical,Fix released]
<tgBot> <neothethird> uhh
<tgBot> <neothethird> Sorry, no idea
<tgBot> <neothethird> @Ern_st, @mariogrip do you remember what this was about?
<tgBot> <mariogrip> @Ern_st, kernel missmatch, are you using a caf kernel?
<tgBot> <Ern_st> I think...
<tgBot> <Ern_st> How can i be sure ?
<tgBot> <mariogrip> @Ern_st, what device?
<tgBot> <Ern_st> I'm porting a moto g 2013, based on the work of Walid.
<tgBot> <mariogrip> you an try my super hack https://github.com/ubports/android_kernel_oneplus_msm8974/commit/317db5f3fcf0582991aaf593d0475023e4ca089d
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> https://docs.ubports.com/en/latest/porting/installing-16-04.html#choose-a-rootfs â¦ indicates device tree, should it be the same for kernel @mariogrip ?
<tgBot> <mariogrip> I belive this is 5.1
<tgBot> <mariogrip> right @Ern_st
<tgBot> <Ern_st> Yes 5.1
<tgBot> <Ern_st> But my device is caf according to the boarconfig so i took the sudoku
<tgBot> <mariogrip> Yeah, we dont have a pure caf 5.1 rootfs yet, but that `hack` works
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> `hack`
<tgBot> <Ern_st> Thanks i'll keep you update
<tgBot> <mariogrip> did you choose the caf rootfs?
<tgBot> <Ern_st> Yes
<tgBot> <mariogrip> if so, that wont work, since that is built for 7.1
<tgBot> <mariogrip> give the non caf a try
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> oh.
<tgBot> <Ern_st> Ok, what i remember the problem was also there. But with the non caf the hack might works ?
<tgBot> <Ern_st> So i try non caf and then non caf + hack ?
<tgBot> <mariogrip> yes
<tgBot> <mariogrip> bacon uses that hack + non caf
<tgBot> <Ern_st> Ok
<tgBot> <Ern_st> Thanks
<tgBot> <Ern_st> @mariogrip @UniversalSuperBox the non caf xenial +  â¦ + https://github.com/ubports/device-files/tree/ubp-5.1/common/system/usr/lib/arm-linux-gnueabihf â¦ + https://github.com/ubports/device-files/tree/ubp-5.1/common/system/usr/include/hybris â¦ seems to clear all my graphic issues â¦ thanks
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> dear all, I want to share with you my 1st impression of using plasma desktop vs using UT. â¦ UT is MUCH more end user ready than plasma mobile, but at the same time plasma is much more hackable. â¦ I think that working on both projects will be plenty of fun, and I'm sure I will be able to contrubute both, although from my skill sets, I think I will be able to contribute to plasma more, because there is more stuff missing in it that I actually
<tgBot> want to tell you that I gained a whole lot more appreciation for both UT and plasma now!
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> @KrisJacewicz, ð¤Thanks for your awesome contributions Kris.
<tgBot> <Konrad_Fichtner> Fwd from msnzmmk: hi guys. sorry for asking. i live in iran and i cant join the ubport super grupe. â¦ in the music app, when i save some music in memory, it's not add to music app automatically, and i should add manually. is it for you same? â¦ (in nexus 5)
<tgBot> <Konrad_Fichtner> ...from the fairphone/ubuntu group. Can someone help him?
<tgBot> <Vijaypraj> No
<tgBot> <Vijaypraj> In my Nexus 5
<tgBot> <Vijaypraj> Aong add automatically
<tgBot> <Vijaypraj> You should have to update app
<tgBot> <Vijaypraj> Either apt-get dist-upgrade
<tgBot> <Vijaypraj> Use command
<tgBot> <Konrad_Fichtner> @msnzmmk
<tgBot> <Konrad_Fichtner> Thnx
<tgBot> <Ern_st> @Vijaypraj, You cannot do it on an Ubuntu touch system.
<tgBot> <Vijaypraj> I done
<tgBot> <Vijaypraj> Would you like to watch
<tgBot> <Vijaypraj> ?
<tgBot> <Ern_st> @Konrad_Fichtner, Can he use Matrix or IRC to join us ? Anyway, music file are scanned automatically by media-scanner something. Does it files contain the correct extension ?
<tgBot> <Xorpad> You can do it, you just have to remount / as rw
<tgBot> <Xorpad> but it can break things when updates come
<tgBot> <Vijaypraj> Yes i know
<tgBot> <Ern_st> Correct @Xorpad not for common users
<tgBot> <Vijaypraj> When ota is updated than it will re lock
<tgBot> <Vijaypraj> Any one can do
<tgBot> <Xorpad> Yes
<tgBot> <Xorpad> you can
<tgBot> <Vijaypraj> But he/she has to properly Knowledge about it
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Vijaypraj, upone EVERY reboot it returns to ro
<tgBot> <Xorpad> yeppers
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> and off course, upon your wish. I consider it a good practice to remount it to ro once you finished needing it rw, not let it just stay rw for no reason
<tgBot> <Xorpad> It's better if you use a chroot in your home folder if you want to apt-get command-line tools
<tgBot> <Xorpad> or just a binary folder to PATH in your home dir
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Xorpad, case by case, there are instances when chroot is not a viable option
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Xorpad, +1
<tgBot> <Xorpad> edit .bashrc to add that path and you can pump in stuff you compile on pc with the right prefix
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> PATH + LD_LIBRARY_PATH
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I have a ~/bin folder with stuff I cross-compiled
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Xorpad, +1
<tgBot> <Xorpad> htop and ccrypt
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I just installed them to see how
<tgBot> <Xorpad> and I have a shell script that replaces the PATH addition in .bashrc after update
<tgBot> <Xorpad> just copies it from another file in the home folder
<tgBot> <Xorpad> with a . prefix so it's hidden
<tgBot> <Xorpad> anyone got distcc type compiling for android build system?
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I want to spread out the load
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> you know, I hv to elaborate, it seems to me (it's not recent observation, I have had this observatons for years) all boild down to a peculiar programming practices on Linux. It is not enforced by th OS, it is just a practice that spread like a virus and now is the source of these type of problems. What am I talking about? That linux software makers keep shitting files of their software all ofer the filesystem, instead of just containing them ne
<tgBot> one portable folder, that can also be completely installed into userspace with laucnehrs, and PATH and LD_LIBRARY_PATH etc. â¦ I make all of my apps in that way. It is not commanded by god that you put some stuf under usr share, some under usr bin, some in usr bin some in opt and so on. It is just a practice. And it has been at the very source of things liek containers and snpaps/clicks/flatpacks. â¦ Isn't that interesting? Just people insisting on a practi
<tgBot> will, all these soulutions emerged to address a virtual problem, a problem of habits...
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I dislike most of what goes on in computer science these days
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I long for my 386
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> I remeber once I accidentally installed firefox (nod deb, I think it was tarball or sth) without sudo and guess what... â¦ It installed! completely into the userspace. Can be done! Just do it as a programmer, you get to chose. Also, deb packaging is handicapped, it cannot install shit into your home folder.  â¦ Click can, but you have to explicitely pass the user name to it, so it knows which userspace to intall to. deb is handicapped as a pa
<tgBot> in regards to that, it is not able to install stuff but into the main filesystem
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I install everything I compile from source with checkinstall on ubuntu
<tgBot> <Xorpad> "sudo checkinstall -D make install"
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Xorpad, I like you ;)
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> @Xorpad, My first pc... remember it like yesterday.  A Dell.  Stayed up all night hacking away on it and playing Twin Towers mud.
<tgBot> <Xorpad> My first PC too, I was like 3 and it was 1988
<tgBot> <Xorpad> had it until I was like 7 when we upgraded to a pentium with MMX
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I learned to code on that thing
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> but seriosuly, if you are developer, it's completely up to you how you make your software install iteself. All that legacy habits, your call, but don't just follow old habbits on autodrive mode, pass concepts through your own internal filter and make your on educated decissions - encouraging, not forcing ;)
<tgBot> <Xorpad> We need conventions though
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> @Xorpad, Hehehe... me too... was blown away but its what... 16 MB of ram?
<tgBot> <Xorpad> as much as we also need to move forward wed need software design conventions
<tgBot> <Xorpad> you know?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Xorpad, my first PC was Amiga CDTV, without hd, OS was loaded from 1.44 floppies, I still program for AmigaOS, great OS btw, but these days I run in in a vm
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Xorpad, +1 !! â¤ï¸ Preach!!
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I remember having OS load from 5'1/4 floppy
<tgBot> <Xorpad> then we got a 30MB hard drive
<tgBot> <Xorpad> thing was state of the art
<tgBot> <vanyasem> that's going a bit off topic guys
<tgBot> <Xorpad> sorry @vanyasem you right
<tgBot> <vanyasem> consider moving to @ubports_ot
<tgBot> <Xorpad> aye aye!
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @vanyasem, not the part about programming conventions
<tgBot> <vanyasem> agreed
<tgBot> <Xorpad> Well, like, the whole reason we have computers as complex as we do and huge monolithic software platforms is because we stick to standards that allow stuff to be reused and built up to crazy extents
<tgBot> <Xorpad> Like, if it wasn't for IBM neglecting to get exclusivity on the i386 pc hardware they used, we would not be talking right now
<tgBot> <Xorpad> There literally wouldn't be an internet
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> so yes, the talk about who had what as 1st PC and when, was a bit of who's dick is bigger kind of game, but as for the programming conventions, ESPECIALLY on UT with rw filesystem and limited space, we could POPULARIZE (if you're with me on this one, IDK if you are tho) the new convention of making portable software that is easy to install into suerspace. Because: â¦ 1. it increases security by removing requirement for sudo/root priviledges fo
<tgBot> â¦ 2. it saves the ro filesystem on UT â¦ 3. it saves the overhead of workarounds around the legacy distribution model (cntainers, clicks, flatpacks, snaps, etc) â¦ I am not against click, it's good and I don't challenge it, but we can distribute alternatively packaged legacy software.  â¦ In fact I began a project dubbed "OpenSoftwareHub" that does just that, and it proposes new packaging/distribution convention, as well as helps in repackaging things. F
<tgBot> Geany, Inkscape, and few other apps from .deb format into new generic style: wget/scp/cp a tar, extract, enter, run install.sh, and BAM, Geany in your userspace (still requires sudo for symlinks, but this could be avoided if Geany sourceode received patches, or if env variables could be figured out)
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Xorpad, evolution is one thing I like to remember about. Space was expensive back in the days, Disk and memory. Now space is cheap. Reusing is fine, you don't need to spread software all over though.  â¦ The entire concept of ~/home in Linux is designed around accomodating userspace installations, but software makers are not taking advantage of it. DE knows to look for launchers in ~/.local/share/applications/ and things like that.
<tgBot> Programmers/publishers just need to take advantage of it. And it cannot be taken advantage of with .deb
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> click btw is great, but wish it didn't use sudo either
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> and yes I do recognize that you may wish to install into the main filesystem, absolutely. Just that now everything install there, not just what needs to.
<tgBot> <nikhilubuntu> I have ubuntu phone running ubports.
<tgBot> <nikhilubuntu> however I can not see ubports supergroups from telegram app on phone
<tgBot> <nikhilubuntu> I can acces that from telegram desktop app only
<tgBot> <nikhilubuntu> any idea why its happenning?
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> @KrisJacewicz, Well laid out and interesting read. (trying to understand everything) I would just like to ask about item 1, in that I have two kids and I like the fact that I have control on what software gets installed... granted a simple user auth could be created, I think that is the only thing that jumps out at me. (not that it is the most important thing regarding your post)
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> @nikhilubuntu, You need to get the new beta Telegram app
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> https://github.com/ubports/telegram-app/releases/download/v2.5.0/com.ubuntu.telegram_2.5.0.0_armhf.click
<tgBot> <nikhilubuntu> ok. thanks. I will do that today itself.
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> @nikhilubuntu, ð
<tgBot> <nikhilubuntu> do i need to remove the current telegram app or the new version will automatically replace it?
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> It will replace it.. (however, don't try to upgrade it from the OpenStrore)
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> as it will downgrade it ;P
<tgBot> <nikhilubuntu> ok
<tgBot> <Matteo> @neothethird, @KrisJacewicz did you see that Kris? I guess all the additional packages you needed for x-forwarding are included thank to @neothethird, isn't it?
<tgBot> <peternerlich> @Crash_Burn, Can we suggest to the OpenStore team to visually separate upgrading to and downgrading from a newer version?
<tgBot> <peternerlich> and use "downgrade"
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> @peternerlich, This might be a special situation, but perhaps a good idea as I almost clicked the upgrade button ;P
<tgBot> <peternerlich> @Crash_Burn, I don't really think this is a special situation, since the OpenStore itself allows you to install any click package from your storage, so I would categorize this as a rather usual system state that should be handled elegantly, especially if it's as easy as comparing version numbers
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> @peternerlich, https://github.com/UbuntuOpenStore/openstore-meta/issues Going to sleep now.. look into it more tomorrow.  Thanks and good night.
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Crash_Burn, very valid scenario. i cant think of any specific solution that is "one fits all". I think that your scenario (subjectively from my perspective)is a special case, thus requires some initial change of default settings, before it is in effect. Like a security/privacy policy that you add atop the default setting
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @peternerlich, i understod him differrntly. that he wants to limit kids' ability to i stall apps locally without sudo
<tgBot> Holger BÃ¶cker was added by: Holger BÃ¶cker
<tgBot> <Stereofont> @Konrad_Fichtner, @Konrad_fichtner is this because he doesn't have the Telegram beta installed?
<tgBot> <peternerlich> @Holger BÃ¶cker, Hello Holger and welcome! I'm part of the UBports welcoming team. â¦ To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
<tgBot> <peternerlich> Du scheinst mir auch, deutscher Natur zu sein (no offense) â Vielleicht hast du Interesse an unserer neuen deutschen Language Group? http://t.me/UBports_Deutsch
<tgBot> <Javacookies> I just got a 2nd hand Nexus 5 32GB for around $70 ð
<tgBot> <Javacookies> now, is it possible to triple boot Plasma Mobile, Sailfish OS and Ubuntu? LOL
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> (Photo, 800x627) https://irc.ubports.com/Csy2r7D6/file_2487.jpg today I used UBports GUI installer and it's absolutely beautiful!
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Javacookies, +1 â¤ï¸
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> I want tomake similar one for Plasma Desktop and I could totally also make it work with UT, so one for both plasma and UT, but would some of you consider that some sort of breaking of unspoken code?
<tgBot> Syah Wawa was added by: Syah Wawa
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> (Photo, 720x1280) https://irc.ubports.com/0z0sXYCp/file_2489.jpg
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> also on the phone that installation splash, super beautiful, I'm absolutely sold n it!
<tgBot> <Stereofont> @Syah Wawa, Hello Syah Wawa and welcome!  I'm part of the UBports welcoming team.    â¦ To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> you know guys, this is where I can get involved, in making GUI apps supporting UT on the LinuxDesktop/Windows/OSX end
<tgBot> <VIJAYHIREMATH1> @KrisJacewicz  can't we refactor ut now to make all the apps in user space?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @VIJAYHIREMATH1, not sure what you are asking. ut default click already installs app into userspace.
<tgBot> <VIJAYHIREMATH1> @KrisJacewicz, You were telling there are some apps which installs some files in root we can identify them and correct it.
<tgBot> <VIJAYHIREMATH1> At least all the core apps(not sure whether they have already in user space?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @VIJAYHIREMATH1, well, what I was talking about are legacy software packages distributed as .deb, and "correcting" is not a word to use, because correction is used for fixing something broken, and that's not the case
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @VIJAYHIREMATH1, it is possible that you have a slight misunderstanding of what I said earlier
<tgBot> <VIJAYHIREMATH1> @KrisJacewicz, Modify if that suits
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @VIJAYHIREMATH1, yes, but really there was a context to it, and I am not sure if you are also within that context, since you mentionned core apps now
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> (Photo, 720x1280) https://irc.ubports.com/oZuD0FgK/file_2491.jpg
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> Terminal app present by default on clean install - VERY satisfying!
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> the progress on this including addressing some feedback is IMPRESSIVE
<tgBot> <peternerlich> at this point also a very belated but HUGE shoutout to whoever did such a great job on shaping the terminal app. I didn't believe it would be that easy to use without a proper keyboard â¤ï¸â¤ï¸â¤ï¸â¤ï¸â¤ï¸
<tgBot> <Javacookies> I'm still waiting for the new redesigned terminal ð â¦ I installed it before on my laptop via snap and it looks great!
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @peternerlich, +1
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> some state of the art mobile terminall app, RESPECT â¤ï¸
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Javacookies, looking forward to that
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> seriously, that Terminal app right there is THE Ubuntu spirit emanating form this phone â¤ï¸
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Florian, I have a queston, it's not a formal request, because I do not insist that it is needed, but perhaps would be helpful, and I'm biased as I've a stake in it. â¦ Since UT default configuration makes it impossible to use ssh-copy-id from your machine into UT device, so I made a tool specifically addressing this, called ssh-pull-id, which is same, but opposit direction: your ut device pulls ssh identity from your pc, intsead of your machi
<tgBot> it to ut device. That circumvents  the config which prevents the pc from connecting to ut device for key exchange. â¦ The tool is very simple, and I hosted it open source here: https://sourceforge.net/projects/ssh-pull-id/ â¦ specifically made it for pairing ut with other machines. If you'd be interested in including it, I can relicense it to whatever suits you, and maintain.
<tgBot> <DanChapman> @KrisJacewicz, Doesn't phablet-tools already solve this with phablet-shell? It handles the copying of keys etc for you
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @DanChapman, well, here's the thing: i didn't know about phablet-shell, so I need to learn about it now
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> you need to install it on pc side?
<tgBot> <DanChapman> Yes `apt install phablet-tools`
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> because if so, then ssh-pull-id could be a lighter option, only requires your machine to hv ssh server service
<tgBot> <DanChapman> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~phablet-team/phablet-tools/trunk/view/head:/phablet-shell
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @DanChapman, thank you!
<tgBot> <DanChapman> you can also take screen shots make image writable and lots of other stuff with phablet-tools
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> you see, there are lots of pieces of inforamtion around, and I miss lots of this pieces, still
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @DanChapman, +1
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @DanChapman, I will to 2 things, now that I know: â¦ 1. get myself familiar with it â¦ 2. find a way to make others familiar as well, get phablet-tools some exposure
<tgBot> <Flohack> @KrisJacewicz, Plz open an issue for that on GH, otherwise I loose it again ;)
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> I think, since I was not aware of it, there might be more people who also aren't, but what you say it is used for, I think, should be highlighted, everyone who flashes UT on a phone, should really know about it, it should even be mentionned in the GUIO installer
<tgBot> <Flohack> Yeah we are behind with documenting, I can imagine a "UserÂ´s Manual" one day which will have a section for how to hack & optimize the device, and what tools are there.
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Flohack, understood. As you perhaps see now, I've new info from Dan, very relevant, but still ssh-pull-id can be considered, for it does not depend on phablet-tools being installed on device, alnd also, â¦ @DanChapman , I don't know how phablet-tools works, but I deduce, that it uses adb for exchanging keys. SImply because I am only aware of adb service AND ssh service being readily available on UT. And that is even more overhead on the pc si
<tgBot> (although I totally praise phablet-tools), just pointing out how ssh-pull-id still has its own advantage. â¦ Also, by default ssh is not enabled, you need to enable it via adb: android-gadget-service enable ssh â¦ (i just flashed nexus5 with UT and did this, but didnt check if it was indeed disabled, it was in the past). â¦ If you don't have adb stack on the pc end, you can do that on-device from Terminal app. And then you can use ssh-pull-id to finish the
<tgBot> adb required on pc end at all. â¦ @DanChapman does my logic make sense, what do you think?
<tgBot> <Flohack> Its in fact not obvious in many places how to do things. Starts with that you can pin stuff to the dash, and how.
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Flohack, I want to contribute to that
<tgBot> <Flohack> Or that you can navigate between indicators with your finger
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Flohack the ways I can readily contribute: â¦ 1. Growing documentation â¦ 2. Creating gtk apps, so either for pc end (Linux/Win/OSX) or for xmir scenario on the phone â¦ 3. Creating headless (terminal) apps/tools/services â¦ *I don't hv experience in coding low level Linux stuff: kernel, kernel modules/drivers, etc.
<tgBot> <Flohack> @KrisJacewicz, Can you Go? ð
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Flohack, no, I am mostly coding in Object Pascal, but I also know C/C++, and website end things like js,css,html. â¦ However, my C/C++ coding is without GUI experience, I have always been doing GUI apps with Object Pascal only
<tgBot> <Flohack> I am looking for a Go dev at the moment
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> so, I can assist in Go written code maintenance, esp if I don't need to design GUI in it
<tgBot> <Flohack> Yeah its only backend/server code
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Flohack, no able to help as an independent maintainer, but I can assist, yes
<tgBot> <Flohack> Oki. I am a totally Go noob so I canÂ´t even assist ;)
<tgBot> <Dohxis> Whats up with Go? I have seen some other projects written in Go for Ubuntu Touch.
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Flohack, I saw Go code, nbever wrote a line in it, but basically I understand Go code as if I was looking at C++
<tgBot> <Flohack> The notification backend we must take over from Canonical is written in Go
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> sure, there are differences, but roughly C++/Java/Go all the same to me, in terms of fixing bugs etc
<tgBot> <Flohack> I need to get it up running with some modifications for testing
<tgBot> <Dohxis> I setup it once, played around and didn't really like the language.
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Flohack, ok, I'm not Go programmer, but I can help to the extent of my abilities, IF there is noone else readily available for the task
<tgBot> <Flohack> Ok thx. Seems Go is not so popular, despite I am reading articles why its much mbetter than C++ lol
<tgBot> <DanChapman> I'm free for all of December outside of Dekko commitments to work on the notifications server. @Flohack @KrisJacewicz would you like to catchup at the weekend to come up with requirements and planning
<tgBot> <Flohack> @DanChapman, Cool that would be awesome, we are running a bit out of time ;)
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Flohack, it's religious topic, really, but the rule of the thumb is, new languages emmerge daily. And there is no one language that is better than others for every job/scenario. Go addresses some problems better than something else, but some other problems are better addressed in other languages.
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @DanChapman, I am very willing to get my hands dirty
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> also I am able and willing to help in architectural design, that's what I do for living
<tgBot> <Flohack> Ok invited you to the topic group
<tgBot> <Dohxis> I would love to help too, but my understanding is quite limited on low level stuff.
<tgBot> <Flohack> Its not so low-levelactually
<tgBot> <neothethird> @Matteo, yep
<tgBot> <Dohxis> @Flohack, Where is the source code for it? Want to check if I can understand anything there
<tgBot> <Flohack> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-push-hackers/ubuntu-push/trunk/files/head:/server/
<tgBot> <Flohack> I will import the project to Github shall we
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> on nexus5 where there is no home button (hw) the only way to get back to the scopes is by swiping fro the right edge?
<tgBot> <neothethird> Or longswipe from the left
<tgBot> <neothethird> Or shortswipe from the left and tap the Ubuntu logo
<tgBot> <Konrad_Fichtner> @Stereofont, I don't know, I just read his question in the Fairphone/ubuntu group and tried to help by asking the ubports Supergroup which in probably restricted in Iran
<tgBot> msnzmmk was added by: Konrad_Fichtner
<tgBot> <lduboeuf> @KrisJacewicz, finaly i get it to work via phablet-tools, `adb push ~/.ssh/id_rsa.pub /home/phablet`  then `adb shell` and `cat id_rsa.pub >> ~.ssh/authorized_keys`. ssh to my phablet is fine now
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @lduboeuf, there is a better way, you should not need to copy the key over, use echoing instead
<tgBot> <lduboeuf> yes for sure
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> $ export KEY=$(cat ~/.ssh/id_rsa.pub) â¦ $ adb shell "echo '$KEY' Â» /home/phablet/.ssh/authorized_keys"
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> I just tested, works with these parenthesis I used above
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @lduboeuf, @TomasOqvist had just used ssh-pull-id and said it also worked for him for importing keys. It does not require adb btw
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> @KrisJacewicz, Yes, very nice tool indeed!
<tgBot> <lduboeuf> yes but need to have an ssh server
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @lduboeuf, yes , but no adb, depending on your case you might fnd it more suitable, or less
<tgBot> <lduboeuf> yes :)
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> I alway hv ssh server on my machines because I want to access them remotely too, so for ppl like me this is easier
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> but if you don't want to, it may actually not be a good tool for you
<tgBot> <lduboeuf> any advice for installing a gtk file manager via apt without breaking everything ?
<tgBot> <lduboeuf> i feel so afraid of doing apt install on phone
<tgBot> <SergioSRM> Is it possible to make WhatsApp Web responsive? to dont have a desktop view in UT :(
<tgBot> <Xorpad> what is WhatsApp?
<tgBot> <Xorpad> is it thr new myspace?
<tgBot> <ProsperoDaniele> @Xorpad, Lol
<tgBot> <Xorpad> i know that sounded like a joke but the real joke is i actually dont know
<tgBot> <neothethird> Wow, srsly ?
<tgBot> <neothethird> Something like telegram
<tgBot> <mariogrip> *closed source telegram owned by facebook*
<tgBot> <Xorpad> yeah im out of touch. ive heard of whatsapp but had no idea what it is
<tgBot> <devsigma_bot> @mariogrip, years behind telegram in resources
<tgBot> <SergioSRM> @Xorpad, Will O is back!ðð»
<tgBot> <devsigma_bot> And will download lot of sh*t to your device, doesn't have cloud based file saving like telegram
<tgBot> <SergioSRM> to much hate to WhatsApp over hereð®
<tgBot> <devsigma_bot> @SergioSRM, I'm not whatsapp hater
<tgBot> <devsigma_bot> But that is the truth
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> guys, for who wishes to try, I open early access to OpenSoftwareHub, which I will gradually release more and more non-click apps on, for UT, that install into userspace. â¦ Currently I have first put snake game in it (wrote especially for UT's xmir), but will be adding more, including Geany, Lazarus IDE, Inkscape, etc. â¦ The website is not launched yet, but early access is here: â¦ http://opensoftwarehub.org/download/
<tgBot> <Xorpad> @SergioSRM, yeah. first i took a week break from coding/irc then my laptops all got hit by a power surge or something. lost a gaming laptop anf 2 netbooks. and i have sweet stationy rigs but i cant sit at a desk because spine issues so i was gone for almost 2 weeks
<tgBot> <Xorpad> i bought a used netboom today for $25 off crsightslist
<tgBot> <Xorpad> and i ordered a rockbook chromebook
<tgBot> <Xorpad> *rockcore
<tgBot> <SergioSRM> @Xorpad, Rockchip?
<tgBot> <Xorpad> It's a mid-to-high end arm SoC maker
<tgBot> <Xorpad> it's a 2.2ghz quad core arm64 system with 4gb ram and a semi-decent GPU which I forget the specs of
<tgBot> <Xorpad> and it has 32gb SSD, 720p 11.6 inch screen
<tgBot> <Xorpad> 12-16 hours battery life
<tgBot> <Xorpad> sorry this is very OT
<tgBot> <Xorpad> well, i guess it's not... it's an arm SoC
<tgBot> <Xorpad> lol
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> (Photo, 720x1280) https://irc.ubports.com/p48nrjHS/file_2493.jpg the OSH temporary icon (some dubbed it Flying Spaghetti Monster already)
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> (Photo, 720x1280) https://irc.ubports.com/U0LLPjQl/file_2495.jpg main page (undergoing UX redesign)
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> (Photo, 720x1280) https://irc.ubports.com/M0q8CD6q/file_2497.jpg app db
<tgBot> <Xorpad> Flying spaghette monster?
<tgBot> * Xorpad puts on his pasta strainer
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> (Photo, 720x1280) https://irc.ubports.com/aWV5eODX/file_2499.jpg app installed
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> (Photo, 720x1280) https://irc.ubports.com/3KIspYjO/file_2501.jpg app running
<tgBot> <Xorpad> Now your game needs content
<tgBot> <SergioSRM> @Xorpad, You are a new kind of superhero, Offtopicman!  â¦ Offtopicman, our favourite superhero who brings random conversations!
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> (Photo, 720x1280) https://irc.ubports.com/4gPUNijx/file_2503.jpg
<tgBot> <Xorpad> haha
<tgBot> <SergioSRM> @KrisJacewicz, it's not better to use touch controls? For example, touching the edges to move to that direction instead of using arrows? ð
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I do tend to rant about random things at length
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I'm Captian OT... Say anything about anything... I'll drive the topic somewhere else
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @SergioSRM, have not thought of that yet, this is POC
<tgBot> <SergioSRM> @KrisJacewicz, And what is the difference between OpenStore and OpenSoftwareHub?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> I was asked a question by @Dohxis  that I think I own you all an answer to, which is (his question): â¦ "Could you explain why it exist versus just having open store?" â¦ And the answer: â¦ 1. It is not UT-specific, not even Linux-specific â¦ 2. It doesn't use debs, and thus installs apps into userspace, which especially on UT is cricial â¦ 3. on UT it automates deployment of non-click, Xmir apps
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @SergioSRM, see 1 answer above
<tgBot> <SergioSRM> ðð»ðð»ðð»ðð»ðð»
<tgBot> <SergioSRM> Great!
<tgBot> <SergioSRM> Thank you for your work!
<tgBot> <Xorpad> everyone hold your hands and pray
<tgBot> <Xorpad> the bullhead may be about to come to life
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I'm hoping and praying that it works
<tgBot> <Xorpad> and nope.. bootlooping
<tgBot> <Xorpad> that was anti-climactic
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> the version you have access to is already being improved for a release candidate, and then will open up full documentation of how anyone can host any software with it, end even host own repo of apps. Will also release non-linux versions (windows/OSX) as soon as some app management is ready that knows which apps not to list on which platforms. My own apps will be available for every supported target, but everyone will be able to publish for any 
<tgBot> they wish.
<tgBot> <Xorpad> What kind of apps you making @KrisJacewicz ?
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I suck at GUIs so I'm not going to try making apps
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I'll just stick to messing with the guts of the beast
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Xorpad, I do any type of apps but for UT I will first focus on GUI wrappers for what currently only has command line support, and on tools for making ecosystem of devices, ie your ut phone and your desktop conveniently coexisting in one system, aware of each other and with cool tricks possible
<tgBot> <Xorpad> oo
<tgBot> <Xorpad> let me know when you get to the filesystem stuff
<tgBot> <Xorpad> :D
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Xorpad, what do you mean?
<tgBot> <Xorpad> Well, filesystems are handled in the kernel, so I could make a kernel module to blend the filesystems together from 2 seperate ones
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @KrisJacewicz, 4. people who make native qt5 apps can also distribute it via OSH to have them absolutely unconfined
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Xorpad, ok, well I do not do this kind of software though. I had in the past made file-embedded custom filesystems, but not OS-wide suppirted, only for app internal use.
<tgBot> <Xorpad> Yeah I would make that part, and then you could make the interface and app with it after I make it
<tgBot> <Xorpad> that's what i'm good for, implementing things the coders will use
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Xorpad, when you hv specific project in mind, pm me, and I'll lok into it and tell you if I'm suitable and if I can assign time to it
<tgBot> <Xorpad> Well, I have to do what the developers want
<tgBot> <Xorpad> because as that crazy guy from MS says... DEVELOPERS DEVELOPERS DEVELOPERS DEVELOPERS DEVELOPERS... DEVELOPERS!
<tgBot> <DanChapman> @KrisJacewicz, you can do this with click
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @DanChapman, you mean unconfined apparmor profile in the json manifest right?
<tgBot> <DanChapman> yeah
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> via OSH you can deploy it without manifest at all, and without click, just binary files
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> I am not saying everyone needs it, but if someone does, well, OSH can do that
<tgBot> <Xorpad> all the apps are belong to us
<tgBot> <DanChapman> Ok that's fair enough but you need to make people aware they won't be able to use some of the ubuntu api's like online-accounts (unless you use the libaccounts-glib/libaccounts-qt c++ libraries) or register for the notification service. There are probably other qt/qml apis that also rely on click appId's
<tgBot> <DanChapman> click takes away alot of pain with using some of these apis by adding a few lines to a json file.
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> @KrisJacewicz, It installs the apps into userspace, right?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @DanChapman, valid point, and yes it's possible for OSH to use .so library calls, not done that yet though.
<tgBot> <DanChapman> there's pro's and con's to both sides. We should just make people aware of what they ð
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @DanChapman, I totally agree and I support click, except for that it currently does not work with Xmir, because of what we earlier discussed
<tgBot> <DanChapman> ð
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @DanChapman, that's my thinking as well
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> and FYI, I would myself start using click if the Xmir issue got resolved
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> not for all projects, but I would start using it
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> I do recognize where it simplifies things
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @TomasOqvist, yes, however with legacy apps, when you repackage them, sme are persisting on filesystem hardcoded paths, in which case symlinks would be made. It would make the app happy, yet save space on your system image.
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> @KrisJacewicz, ð
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> Geany for example insists on having things in /usr/share/geany and it's a hardcoded path. I don't want to invest time in changing it in the source code and recompiling, so after i install it locally, I just symlink it to where it wants to have it.
<tgBot> <lduboeuf> @KrisJacewicz , awesome work. osh & snake installed on my BQ :)
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @lduboeuf, I am super interested to know how it performs on BQ, never tested n that device
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> because Xmir is slower in rendering than comparing to native mir execution, and device specs probably have important influence on this as well
<tgBot> <lduboeuf> seems to be smooth on BQ
<tgBot> <TronFortyTwo> @KrisJacewicz, Just for the sake of correctness and for your interest, is possible to package XMir app in a .click
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> phone or tablet?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @TronFortyTwo, package - yes, deploy - no, not currently
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> after u imstall the click the .desktop launcher will have xmir flags removed
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> that is the sole reason
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> @KrisJacewicz, This is a 'known bug' .... any volunteers for documentation, please PM me on the side! ;)
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> @KrisJacewicz, like crypto-currencies ;)
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> @Flohack, hey! where is my invitation!!???  ;)  I'm collecting UBports groups on my telegram list and I'm hoping to hit 100 by 2018
<tgBot> <Flohack> @wayneoutthere, really ð
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> @Xorpad, you're now the best friend of 1015 people instantly...
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> @Flohack, no.
<tgBot> <mariogrip> @wayneoutthere, im getting close to 250 now... no wonder i never answer anyone
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> @Xorpad, surprisingly, I know this youtube reference...
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> @mariogrip, the race is on!  It might be smart to .... start listing these, but more important I want to poll the community to find out who does what and where everyone can best contribute...
<tgBot> <Flohack> hey @mariogrip we got the canonical push server to life :) - unfortunately it is not the same version as the clients are expecting ;) - but we started to hack it. At least they already talk with each other
<tgBot> <alan_griffiths> A first step, but an important one: â¦ https://community.ubuntu.com/t/mir-0-28-android-out-of-tree-platform-module/2371
<tgBot> <mariogrip> @Flohack, YAY :D
<tgBot> <mariogrip> @alan_griffiths, :D I now got WaylandAllocator up there https://github.com/ubports/mir-android-platform/commit/7806af725993cb8666bd23531924cda58685a998
<tgBot> <Stereofont> @Konrad_Fichtner, Hello msnzmmk and welcome!  I'm part of the UBports welcoming team.    â¦ To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
<tgBot> <Ern_st> @Flohack, Great job !
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> @Flohack, @Flohack has super powers ;)
<tgBot> <Flohack> @Flohack, And now we got first message through ;) So push service is no mystery any more ^^
<tgBot> <Flohack> since I changed to your client config it does not work anymore on the device ð
<tgBot> <delijati> @Flohack can you point me to the code ?
<tgBot> <Flohack> Sure
<tgBot> <Flohack> @delijati, https://code.launchpad.net/~ci-train-bot/ubuntu-push/ubuntu-push-ubuntu-yakkety-2021
<tgBot> <DanChapman> @Flohack, Shall we get this branch imported to github?
<tgBot> <Flohack> I think so, yes
<tgBot> <DanChapman> ð
<tgBot> <Flohack> let me send myself a message ð
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> @Flohack, test
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> @Flohack, this seems like news...?
<tgBot> <Flohack> @wayneoutthere, We will have a few things to do but I try to make a marketingish example screenie ^^
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> sure... napkin... pen... easy engrish
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> because when i hear 'push server' i think of waitress abuse
<tgBot> <delijati> ahh i se someone was bored and tried "golang"  :D
<tgBot> <Flohack> @delijati, All the indicators are also Go
<tgBot> <delijati> lol
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> @delijati, Canonical
<tgBot> <Flohack> Its used widely on the core OS ^^
<tgBot> <delijati> hmm why not better than C ;)
<tgBot> <dohbee> @Flohack, No they are not.
<tgBot> <Flohack> @dohbee, Ok some of them ^^
<tgBot> <dohbee> none of the indicators are go
<tgBot> <Flohack> you sure?
<tgBot> <dohbee> they are Vala, C, or C++
<tgBot> <Flohack> hmm strange
<tgBot> <Flohack> what was I thinking then
<tgBot> <Flohack> disregard ^^
<tgBot> <dohbee> accounts-polld is go
<tgBot> <dohbee> and some of the lower level phone integration stuff is go (nuntium, ciborium, etc)
<tgBot> <dohbee> there's not a whole lot of go on the phone
<tgBot> <dohbee> and except for indicator-network, and a few others that only worked under unity7, they were all shared between unity7 and unity8
<tgBot> <dohbee> which is going to make for some interesting problems if another group wants to keep unity7 alive, while some other groups want unity8
<tgBot> <dohbee> honestly, i would suggest just getting rid of ubuntu-push on ubports at this point. it's not worth the trouble of maintaining it, for practically nothing to be using it
<tgBot> <Flohack> @dohbee, yeah but we cannot just switch off telegram notifications. thats not going to happen
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @dohbee, i kind of could live with that
<tgBot> <Flohack> We can talk about improvements but after we secured the status quo. Canonical will turn off their service soon and we dont like this
<tgBot> <dohbee> @Flohack, if you don't log in to u1, they've been "switched off" already for a long time. and are you working with telegram to keep things updated to your server. and is it really worth all the trouble, for just telegram, even if they do do support your alternate server?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Flohack, question though, that push server worked on now is not a real gsm push right?
<tgBot> <Xorpad> someone help, i'm lost in git
<tgBot> <Flohack> @dohbee, There is no trouble, just set up a machine and install it. And on the client, update the config to point to a new IP
<tgBot> <dohbee> @KrisJacewicz, what do you mean by "gsm push" exactly?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> one that happens when base stations do paging an one that has no bandwidth cost?
<tgBot> <Xorpad> how do i push forcefully a branch that's not up to date with the repo?
<tgBot> <dohbee> @Flohack, it's not that simple
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I need to push my code to the fork i made of bullhead kernel
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> @Xorpad, Well, you can do `--force` but you should instead pull hte changes
<tgBot> <dohbee> @KrisJacewicz, that's not how push notifications work on any phone OS
<tgBot> <Xorpad> @UniversalSuperBox there's like a ton of commits
<tgBot> <Xorpad> @UniversalSuperBox but they all break things and are not good
<tgBot> <Xorpad> so many comparisons of signed and unsigned ints
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @dohbee, telwcom operators do push lile that and some open the service for outer networks
<tgBot> <Xorpad> i tried using âforce, it rejects it still
<tgBot> <Flohack> @dohbee, He means data SMS as used by Google and iOS partially
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> depending on area you are apple or google might even hv subscription to it
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> @KrisJacewicz, Unfortunately ours does not
<tgBot> <Flohack> And no, we cant have that
<tgBot> <Flohack> It costs a lot of money
<tgBot> <dohbee> @KrisJacewicz, that's fine, but that's not how Android/iOS work
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> afaik they do
<tgBot> <Xorpad> should I just make a new git repository that's not a fork?
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> to some extent
<tgBot> <Flohack> @dohbee, How do you think firebase works than
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> but yeah this got cleared
<tgBot> <dohbee> there's a client service running on the phone that maintains an open TCP connection
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I need to get my code somewhere i can browse from my android box until I can get my new pc
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> @Xorpad, What's the actual error you're getting?
<tgBot> <Xorpad> ! [remote rejected] ubp-7.1 -> ubp-7.1 (shallow update not allowed)
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I don't know git
<tgBot> <Flohack> @dohbee, Yep. But believe me, they are also using data SMS ^^
<tgBot> <Xorpad> lulz
<tgBot> <dohbee> ie, the exact same way it works in Chrome
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I know how to clone stuff and that's about it
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> @Xorpad, `git fetch --unshallow`
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Then you should be able to push
<tgBot> <Xorpad> okay thanks @UniversalSuperBox
<tgBot> <dohbee> @Flohack, Sorry, none of the documentation on either GCM or iOS notifications, mentions anything about "data SMS"
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> also perhaps we could do pull/poll notifications instead of push
<tgBot> <Flohack> @dohbee, Its true, because you do not need to know that part
<tgBot> <Flohack> They simply dont document this
<tgBot> <dohbee> because it's not true
<tgBot> <dohbee> otherwise push notifications wouldn't work without a SIM
<tgBot> <Flohack> They use it additionally
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Anyway, this is irrelevant
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I got DRM runtime tests going on bullhead earlier in the night
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> We were talking about the push server
<tgBot> <Flohack> @KrisJacewicz, The devices pull already
<tgBot> <Xorpad> but I still can't render it to the screen, haven't got there yet
<tgBot> <Flohack> Telegram will not agree to us pulling from their server
<tgBot> <Xorpad> what kind of server is needed? I'm lost
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I have a VPS with 5tb monthly data
<tgBot> <dohbee> @KrisJacewicz, preferably not, because pull is very expensive (eats battery/data)
<tgBot> <Xorpad> and I don't even think they enforce monthly data limits
<tgBot> <Xorpad> they never used to but said they would in the future
<tgBot> <Xorpad> but it would be trivial cost in data, unless it started pushing multiple tb per day
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I think it's like $1 per TB to go over
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> @Xorpad, DRM won't work on bullhead
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I know... that's why I'm trying to get it going
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> It just won't.. tada
<tgBot> <Xorpad> it has to render to the FB but you can pipe it
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> Well not sure... But umm good luck
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I'm having fun anyways lol
<tgBot> <Xorpad> :D
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> I'm not sure how to explain you how this works
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I know how linux works for the most part
<tgBot> <Xorpad> and I know what can and can't be done... almost everything can be done unless it violates the laws of physics
<tgBot> <Xorpad> the question is, will it be done
<tgBot> <Xorpad> can I do it?
<tgBot> <Xorpad> it's challenging
<tgBot> <Xorpad> Anyways, I'm working my way though stuff, making some good progress, at least I did all last night
<tgBot> <Xorpad> Even if all the work I've done ends up getting throw out, I have learned more about the system I will be working with
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I'm constantly learning while I do... I haven't done so much linux kernel stuff, I made my own hobby kernels for pc but only started getting into linux kernel maybe a year ago
<tgBot> <Xorpad> so every day that I dig into the code, the closer I get to having all the knowledge I need to pump out lots of ports
<tgBot> <Flohack> (Photo, 1080x1920) https://irc.ubports.com/0X4cRn04/file_2505.jpg
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> i guess drm you mention is not digital rights management but sometging else...
<tgBot> <alan_griffiths> @Flohack, Ship it!
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I actually forget what it stands for, I think digital media rendering or something... It's related to hardware accelerated gpu
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> @KrisJacewicz, The graphics thing
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> ok because i wasnt sure thwre are so many abreviations these days and they are ambiguous
<tgBot> * Xorpad has no idea what he's doing but he's confident that it's leading to a good place and things are on track with learning /adapting to new project new environment, working with git and managing all sorts of commits and updates and fixes
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I mean, I have a background is OS/Compiler development so it's not crazy for me to do this stuff, but it's a new project and I have a lot to learn before I'm really in the groove
<tgBot> <Flohack> @alan_griffiths, Wilco. Just need to find one of our vBoxes that is capable
<tgBot> <Xorpad> My jounry to ubports began with me wanting to put together a simple android ROM that was debloated and had everything I wanted... Wasn't even gonna code anything
<tgBot> <Xorpad> a year later here I am
<tgBot> <Ern_st> Good progress flo !
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Xorpad, i did compilers/interpreters for few years
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I have a gcc fork
<tgBot> <Xorpad> but I don't share it
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I'm going to start a business where i compile sources with my compiler for them
<tgBot> <Xorpad> arm = 13% faster benchmarks with my fork, aarch64 11% faster benchmarks
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> i was more into interpreters though because i was more turned on by memory and object management than by lexical and grammar analyzers
<tgBot> <Xorpad> ryzen cpu optimizations, I got over 3% improvement over gcc -7.2
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Xorpad, i am sirw pascal compiler faster than any c++ by a lot
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> *sure
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I just hack stuff together
<tgBot> <Xorpad> one thing I've learned... I'm not good at making algorithms, another thing I've learned is I can still come up with any one I need, it just isn't as good as the publicly documented methods from mathematicians
<tgBot> <Xorpad> So like my algorithm might be 20% slower than the insdustry standard, but I make it myself using logic and it works
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I like re-inventing the wheel with coding
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> imho the big bloat woth c++ are templates, there are ppl who preach them, but when use thwm alot the make process devours memory and time
<tgBot> <Xorpad> so I invent algorithms that already have amazing versions just to challenge myself
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I dislike and can't really use C++... When I use C++, it's like C with C++ mixed in for higher level functions
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I really like C though
<tgBot> <Flohack> @Xorpad, C++ is itself just a macro for C
<tgBot> <Flohack> and it has leaky abstraction of certain things ð
<tgBot> <Xorpad> @Flohack how so? I wasn't aware, I thought c++ just have a std c namespace
<tgBot> <Flohack> @Xorpad, Its sarcastical ^^
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I am not too up on things really... if they don't talk about it at blackhat or defconf or 33c3 I don't know it
<tgBot> <Xorpad> lol
<tgBot> <Xorpad> 33c3 was awesome
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I love conferences with other technies
<tgBot> <Xorpad> We need to flock together lol
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> i also mainly like c and when doing c++ i feel grateful for pascal. pascal became objective before c bacame c++ and the version of compiler then only changer minor number to 5.5 :D  â¦ and novadays everything that is considered C#'s improvemwnt over c++ actually is taken from delphi (object pascal) because creator of c# was the crearor of turbo pascal and dwlphi
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I hate pascal syntax
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> also lua was based off dwlphi
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Xorpad, i love it, absolutely human friendly unlike c languages that look like someone spilled non alphabet characters
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> maintaining someone else's cose is a pleasure and abreeze
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> @ubports_ot
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I like Python, C, and assembly... Which works out god because I can make C libraries for my python framework to use, then I can make assembly optimizations to the c based python libraries, and I can even use my GIL defeating kernel samepage hack that lets you run multi-core with python... Like those 3 languages are all I need for what I do
<tgBot> <Xorpad> sorry @UniversalSuperBox
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> in c you cant figure out your own code after not dealing with it daily for a while
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> c is awesomly portable
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Xorpad, precisely speaking the poi t of libraries is that u can make them in anynlanguage and reuse in any other because they are compiled binary machine code
<tgBot> <Xorpad> @daltson is right we should move to OT
<tgBot> <Xorpad> we can chat in there, we seem to have similar mindsets with coding
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I know I'm the one who goes off topic all the time but I don't mean to
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> bed time here
<tgBot> <Xorpad> okay man
<tgBot> <Xorpad> have a good sleep
<tgBot> <Xorpad> we will talk another day:D
<tgBot> <Xorpad> We should collaborate on an UT API
<tgBot> <Xorpad> for UT specific apps
<tgBot> <Xorpad> Like how android as the SDK
<tgBot> <Xorpad> Would anyone be down for that?
<tgBot> <Xorpad> we could just implement features as devs request them, but at a certain point we would need to stablize the API
<tgBot> <Eranuzan> @Flohack, WoooHooo!!
<tgBot> <JBBgameich> Isn't all the Qt stuff already the API for Ubuntu Touch? My aim wouldn't be making Ubuntu Touch specific apps, but Qt QML Apps that run everywhere (Plasma Mobile, Ubuntu Touch, LuneOS etc.)
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Yep, and if we get QtQuick2 support...
<tgBot> <JBBgameich> Mariogrip said QtQuick2 support in the latest community update, but I think you have Qt Quick 2 already. Do you mean QtQuick Controls 2 (Sounds similar, but it's a real huge difference)
<tgBot> <JBBgameich> Because QtQuick2 is just for creating coloured rectangles and some other basic stuff
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> is this a conspiracy to blog me out of reading and understanding super group content???  CONSPIRACY!
<tgBot> <sverzegnassi> @JBBgameich, Yep, it's QtQuick Controls 2
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> @JBBgameich, Erm, a control style. Suru style
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> @sverzegnassi, Sorry I misrepresent
<tgBot> <dohbee> @JBBgameich, The ubuntu ui toolkit isn't pure QML, and depends on some other ubuntu-specific-ish things. but you can shove whatever qml modules you want into your package already, and it should work for the most part. it just gets weird when you need to ship c++ that ends up breaking on minor Qt updates when they change internal api versioning somewhere
<tgBot> <dohbee> @JBBgameich, Well, QtQuick2 is just the name for the whole feature set that runs QML. It's always been in the ubuntu phone, as it's a core part of Qt5. The controls package has been there for a while too I think. But some of the other sub-modules haven't been.
<tgBot> * theMitu
<tgBot> <VIJAYHIREMATH1> @dohbee, It's just amazing.. how are you so sure about all Ubuntu stuff?
<tgBot> mvaisakh was added by: mvaisakh
<tgBot> <milkor73> @mvaisakh, Hello Visakh and welcome!  I'm part of the UBports welcoming team.    â¦ To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
<tgBot> <mvaisakh> Thank you for this warm welcome!
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> Welcome indeed!
<tgBot> <dohbee> @VIJAYHIREMATH1, Because I was a developer of it.
<tgBot> <profetik777> Boom
<tgBot> NOT_A_NORMAL_XDA_GUY was added by: NOT_A_NORMAL_XDA_GUY
<tgBot> Sumit Cheriyan was added by: Sumit Cheriyan
<tgBot> <NOT_A_NORMAL_XDA_GUY> Hello devs
<tgBot> <NOT_A_NORMAL_XDA_GUY> newbie here...
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> Hello @NOT_A_NORMAL_XDA_GUY and welcome!  I'm part of the UBports welcoming team.    â¦ To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
<tgBot> <Flohack> hiho nice username
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> Hello Sumit and welcome!  I'm part of the UBports welcoming team.    â¦ To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
<tgBot> <NOT_A_NORMAL_XDA_GUY> I was going to build ubuntu touch for my 64 bit device via this https://docs.ubuntu.com/phone/en/devices/porting-new-device â¦ .....is it gnna work!!
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> Two new members at the same time :)  cool
<tgBot> <NOT_A_NORMAL_XDA_GUY> @NOT_A_NORMAL_XDA_GUY, ??
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> @NOT_A_NORMAL_XDA_GUY, You've come to the right place
<tgBot> <NOT_A_NORMAL_XDA_GUY> @Crash_Burn, Thank god
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> LOL
<tgBot> <NOT_A_NORMAL_XDA_GUY> Tmrw we gnna install ubuntu 17.10 and start installation of dependencies and tools required as newbie
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> Have you taken a look at the Halium project as well?
<tgBot> <NOT_A_NORMAL_XDA_GUY> @Crash_Burn, no wat is it?
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> https://halium.org/
<tgBot> <NOT_A_NORMAL_XDA_GUY> @Crash_Burn, Looks cool! :)
<tgBot> <NOT_A_NORMAL_XDA_GUY> @Crash_Burn, Will try to build if ill became a pro like u ppl
<tgBot> <NOT_A_NORMAL_XDA_GUY> ð
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> There is a lot of work that goes into porting to a new device.. .but there are people here that can help.
<tgBot> <NOT_A_NORMAL_XDA_GUY> Conplete newbie here
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> Keep us posted with your progress :)
<tgBot> <NOT_A_NORMAL_XDA_GUY> @Crash_Burn, Yea...i would love to see ubuntu touch running on My device ð
<tgBot> <Flohack> @NOT_A_NORMAL_XDA_GUY, Please join the Halium group - currently there is no working port for arm64 AFAIK - but they are making progress
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> Maybe try a device that already has a port?
<tgBot> <NOT_A_NORMAL_XDA_GUY> @Crash_Burn, I hope ill build it soon with the instructions posted on their page
<tgBot> <NOT_A_NORMAL_XDA_GUY> @Crash_Burn, My device is completely.new
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> @Crash_Burn, high five on that username and welcome! ha
<tgBot> <NOT_A_NORMAL_XDA_GUY> Its leeco le2
<tgBot> <NOT_A_NORMAL_XDA_GUY> X526
<tgBot> <NOT_A_NORMAL_XDA_GUY> @wayneoutthere, Tysm!ð
<tgBot> <NOT_A_NORMAL_XDA_GUY> @Crash_Burn, Will it support/
<tgBot> <NOT_A_NORMAL_XDA_GUY> ?)
<tgBot> <Matteo> @neothethird, ð good job Jan, thanks!
<tgBot> <h4888> how much code do porters need to write to get their androids over to Halium?
<tgBot> <JBBgameich> Often, no real programming is involved.
<tgBot> <Flohack> @h4888, Rather how many changes in config files need to be done: between 5 and 700 ^^
<tgBot> <h4888> aah so it's hackery and not actual manual memory management C. methinks I might be able to do that
<tgBot> <Xorpad> some one said my name or was that in the on topic channel
<tgBot> <vanyasem> yep
<tgBot> <vanyasem> i wanted to talk to you
<tgBot> <vanyasem> about gentoo
<tgBot> <vanyasem> i can't manage to boot it's image with uefi
<tgBot> <PhoenixLandPirate> (Sticker, 512x269) https://irc.ubports.com/s2kSz323/file_2506
<tgBot> <Xorpad> are you booting the installer in uefi mode?
<tgBot> <vanyasem> yrd
<tgBot> <Xorpad> what's the symptoms?
<tgBot> <vanyasem> my UEFI doesn't see the flashdrive
<tgBot> <vanyasem> i tested 2 already
<tgBot> <vanyasem> i tried both dding the image and just copying it manually
<tgBot> <vanyasem> the boot flag is set, the filesystem is fat32
<tgBot> <dohbee> I thought this was about ubports, not gentoo
<tgBot> <Xorpad> you dont 23rd yet I bootable
<tgBot> <vanyasem> oh im in the wrong group lol
<tgBot> <Xorpad> you just put the contents of the I so on a fat32 partition
<tgBot> <Xorpad> the first and only partition specifically
<tgBot> <BlueKenny> (Photo, 1280x720) https://irc.ubports.com/KRpAVdjj/file_2508.jpg Hello, how to configure AppArmor, my script can't acces it own directory
<tgBot> <TronFortyTwo> @BlueKenny, You can't directly modify your /opt/click.ubuntu.com/... directory since there the app is installed. The directories you can access are the one inside ~/.cache ~/.local and ~/.config
<tgBot> <BlueKenny> @TronFortyTwo, Thank you, it works :)
<tgBot> kureta was added by: kureta
<tgBot> <Xorpad> welcome Sahin
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> Hello @Sahin and welcome!  I'm part of the UBports welcoming team.    â¦ To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
<tgBot> <Stereofont> Or welcome Èahin even ð
#ubports 2017-11-30
<tgBot> <Gabigol> Anyone else is suffering from reboots on fp2. I stopped using it as daily driver because of them. Heavy tasks, or just setting an alarm can make my fp2 reboot. Yeah, I've wiped it
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> ```The following packages will be REMOVED: â¦   ciborium qtdeclarative5-qtmir-plugin qtmir-android qtubuntu-android â¦   ubuntu-touch ubuntu-touch-session unity8 unity8-common```
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Figured out why my phone stopped working
<tgBot> <Xorpad> what?
<tgBot> <Xorpad> phone stopped working?
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I've never had a phone die on me
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> It uninstalled some important stuff
<tgBot> <Xorpad> only one I don't still own, 18 years of phones... I still have, with the exception of one that got taken during a mugging
<tgBot> <Xorpad> oh noes
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Also I don't think the stuff it installed works under the graphics stack. :P
<tgBot> <Xorpad> heh
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I got ubuntu running in a chroot, aarch64 rootfs
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I actually did that before I disappeared
<tgBot> <Xorpad> but I didn't say anything.... I was overloaded
<tgBot> <Xorpad> then the power surge
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I bought 2 UPS's so that doesn't happen again
<tgBot> <Xorpad> between the 2 there is enough for 700 watts for just over 1 hour
<tgBot> <dohbee> @UniversalSuperBox, s/it/you/
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Right, it's 16.04 testing
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Things go wrong
<tgBot> <dohbee> using apt on the phone to update will break things
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> It sure will
<tgBot> <dohbee> Doesn't matter if 15.04 or 16.04 or 18.04
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Yes, you're right
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> I'm trying to install packages to test qt 5.9
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> I'm sorry
<tgBot> <dohbee> You need a ppa with everything that depends on qt5 rebuilt against the new version for it to work
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Yes
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Such as, say, http://repo.ubports.com/pool/xenial_-_qt59/
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Which kinda works on 16.04 for the core devices, but it doesn't work on the device I'm porting
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @dohbee, it should be goal some way down the road to eventually make it not a problem
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Because it isn't built for CAF devices
<tgBot> <dohbee> That seems to still be missing a lot. I guess there is a tarball built with it for core devices?
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> I don't believe so
<tgBot> <dohbee> @KrisJacewicz, No it shouldn't. The goal should be to get rid of apt/debs
<tgBot> <dohbee> Debs are insecure.
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @dohbee, is it a common goal or is it just yours? cuz if it is overall common UT goal I'll get the fuck out of this platform
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> I think we know that this is a discussion that is currently unresolvable, and we've all heard everyone's points
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @dohbee, you belong to Apple man, seriously, cuz you know better and yusers should comply
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> Debs are not insecure
<tgBot> <dohbee> @KrisJacewicz, Because you want to grant root to everyone else?
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> I am sorry to break this to you
<tgBot> <dohbee> Lol
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @dohbee, allow option ofr it
<tgBot> <dohbee> Make a chroot if you want debs
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> there is a huge difference between not allowing vs not making a default configuration
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @dohbee, Rodney, you speak like you're Apple person
<tgBot> <dohbee> You are quite rude
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> because of this kind of closed mind iOS is the most restrictive OS
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> This discussion is not helping.
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @dohbee, just assertive
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> (Photo, 546x831) https://irc.ubports.com/m2xjOudu/file_2512.jpg
<tgBot> <dohbee> Like I said. You are rude
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> I'm not calling you vulgar names, just disagreeing with you while still rationalizing
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> I like your Harisson's Ford avatar, but I also have some contradictiong opinions with you, and I vocalize it, but I respect you man
<tgBot> <dohbee> No. You are feigning civility with veiled insults as a manner of asserting yourself to be correct
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> Just to summarize.. when Dalton did apt upgrade he knows what he was doing, and then Rodney jumped gun without context.. and it's not end of world yet.. can we please end this discussion right here?
<tgBot> <dohbee> i didn't jump the gun
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Drop it, please.
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> You did
<tgBot> <dohbee> he knew what he was doing, which is why i said he broke the system, the system didn't break itself
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> I'm sorry if that's how you take it, honsetly, because  I've no intentions of making you feel bad or look bad, just intention to disagreeing with you, not behind your back, face to face like men do
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Drop it.
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> I'm sorry I said anything.
<tgBot> <dohbee> Delete that stupid meme image you posted then. You don't respect others by posting stupid memes, or by condescension by saying "you're like an apple person, wanting to control the users"
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @dohbee, look Rodney, I even do more than that, I will now here appologise for that meme then, I take a second consideretion of how that meme could be in deed past the line, and I appologise for it, I hope you can accept this, because I'm genuine
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> I still disagree with some of your opinions (with other ones I'm on same page with you), but I've no interest in breaking good relations with you, alright man? I want to cope with all of you here, you as well
<tgBot> <dohbee> i don't need an apology. what i need is for you to realize why your comments were disrespectful, and to think about that before making similar comments in the future, not just to me, but everyone else as well.
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> https://www.ubuntu.com/about/about-ubuntu/conduct â¦ "Disagreement is no excuse for poor manners. [...] A community where people feel uncomfortable or threatened is not a productive one." â¦ You are agreeing to the code of conduct by participating in this community. Please, I understand that your opinions on software installations differ, but that doesn't mean that we need to make the room uncomfortable.
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @UniversalSuperBox, Dalton, I am an assertive and straightforward person, and I speak up what I think. I respect others, but at the end of the day everyone has its own standard for cutlural/emotional/etc sensitivity. â¦ And here is my constructive criticism to quoted part: â¦ "A community where people feel uncomfortable or threatened is not a productive one" - I can't control how people feel. Not always it is up to you whether or not a 3rd pe
<tgBot> feels uncomfortable or threatened. And also, "uncomfortable" is unavoidable in achieving progress. I've forgotten the times I was in college living stressless life under the adults babysitting me before I'm ready for real world that smacks you right in your face. I thought we need to be able to achieve amazing things as a team that works together well and where we respect each other. Not that we have to love each other and get in each others' asses. Liking so
<tgBot> same as respecting someone. I can achieve common goals thru cooperations even with someone I don't like, if I respect him/her. â¦ That is showing what kind of person I am, and what you can expect from me. I won't call any one of you "asshole" but I will say when I disagree with any one of you, without sweet talking.
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> *Licking someone's ass
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> call me oldschool, I'm '84 Polish, won't change.
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Shall I PM you so we can discuss?
<tgBot> <dohbee> (Sticker, 336x512) https://irc.ubports.com/j9HQ66aI/file_2513
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @UniversalSuperBox, you're welcome to
<tgBot> <Xorpad> ahhh
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> I want to offer something that could be interesting to this (heated for some reason) discussion in the future. The original Canonical spec for image based upgrades did not say that it was the only correct way to do things.
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> It said that "the use of apt/dpkg will remain supported with most devices having some kind of switch to opt out of image based updates and re-enable apt"
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ImageBasedUpgrades/
<tgBot> <dohbee> That is different from doing mount -o rw /, and then doing apt though. And it is not to support doing upgrades with apt, but to install specific packages for development/testing purposes. It was never meant to be a general purpose tool in the way it is on PC installs of Ubuntu
<tgBot> <dohbee> Also, my statements weren't about what one might arbitrarily want to claim is "correct" or not. I was simply stating what is more secure.
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> I think that clearer language could have been used on both sides.
<tgBot> <dohbee> But regardless of that, the tone of comments about it from Kris were unacceptable and rude
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> @dohbee, And what do you think Dalton was doing here? Former or Later one?
<tgBot> <dohbee> @bhushanshah, I don't know why you are misunderstanding what I typed, or what the intent of my statements were. You seem to think I was attacking Dalton (which I wasn't, and his comments there didn't indicate he thought I was either), and thus you are somehow trying to defend his choices to me.
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Honestly, there are a lot of compelling options for doing upgrades better than IBU works right now. Like OSTree or an OverlayFS of some type. We can't get far enough to evaluate or even consider them, though, if we sit here and bicker about the "Perfect" system, or what he or she said, we're never going to get anything done.
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> I think that everyone in this situation could have handled it better, and let's strive for that in the future.
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> Anyway.. I'll just go grab a cup of tea.. laters.. it's best if we stop this discussion right here .. right now
<tgBot> <dohbee> whatever.
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @UniversalSuperBox, you are a great mediator Dalton, every teams needs one, thank you!
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @UniversalSuperBox, +1
<tgBot> <Xorpad> hi
<tgBot> <developerfect> Hello
<tgBot> <Xorpad> how's it going guys?
<tgBot> <shinyhairsmylifeambition> Very glad that we can donate via *librapay*. A lot cheaper than patreon or paypal which I used until now.  â¦ I wish more people would use liberapay.
<tgBot> <shinyhairsmylifeambition> fee: Patreon takes 5%, Paypal 2%+something and liberapay between 0.8% and 0.59% (best case)
<tgBot> <Dohxis> Mmm LiberaPay, need to check it out
<tgBot> <NOT_A_NORMAL_XDA_GUY> What lunch target should i select for arm64 device while building ubuntu touch?
<tgBot> <NOT_A_NORMAL_XDA_GUY> Help here
<tgBot> <Xorpad> @NOT_A_NORMAL_XDA_GUY you have to have the specific version of the source with that phone haveing support
<tgBot> <Xorpad> Like, you can't just build an image for generic arm64
<tgBot> <NOT_A_NORMAL_XDA_GUY> @Xorpad, examople please
<tgBot> <Xorpad> Well, there is no arm64 chip exactly... arm is just a starrded set of instrucution sets for programming
<tgBot> <Xorpad> ARM Holdings maintains the ARM standards and licenses out the rights to use it
<tgBot> <NOT_A_NORMAL_XDA_GUY> @Xorpad, So shoukd i go for aosp_arm-eng
<tgBot> <Xorpad> No
<tgBot> <NOT_A_NORMAL_XDA_GUY> ð
<tgBot> <Xorpad> those images are for the emulators
<tgBot> <Xorpad> you can't use them on a real phone
<tgBot> <Xorpad> arm/aarch64/mips/x86_64 targets are emulator targets
<tgBot> <NOT_A_NORMAL_XDA_GUY> Then what should i go for?
<tgBot> <NOT_A_NORMAL_XDA_GUY> Cofused afð
<tgBot> <NOT_A_NORMAL_XDA_GUY> Or should i target the arch or device which has same specifications(portig?)
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> @NOT_A_NORMAL_XDA_GUY which device tou are porting to? And which docs you are following?
<tgBot> <NOT_A_NORMAL_XDA_GUY> @bhushanshah, I am porting to leeco le2 x526
<tgBot> <NOT_A_NORMAL_XDA_GUY> And the instructions i am following is https://docs.ubuntu.com/phone/en/devices/porting-new-device  â¦ @bhushanshah
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> That's ummm
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> Old docs
<tgBot> <NOT_A_NORMAL_XDA_GUY> @bhushanshah, New docs pleaseð
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> https://docs.ubports.com/en/latest/porting/introduction.html
<tgBot> <NOT_A_NORMAL_XDA_GUY> @bhushanshah, Its written halium?
<tgBot> <shenoy13> Just I noticed, is the halium project common for other is also like sailfish etc.,?
<tgBot> <shenoy13> I mean is it required to build different hybrid for UT and sailfish?
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> @NOT_A_NORMAL_XDA_GUY yes... Ubports will use the halium for new devices
<tgBot> <shenoy13> @shenoy13, Different hybris
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> @shenoy13, Halium project is common Android base, it can be used as a base for sailfishos but it's not being used right now
<tgBot> <NOT_A_NORMAL_XDA_GUY> @bhushanshah, Whats halium basically?
<tgBot> <NOT_A_NORMAL_XDA_GUY> ð
<tgBot> <shenoy13> @bhushanshah, Ok
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> @NOT_A_NORMAL_XDA_GUY, halium.org
<tgBot> Brian was added by: Brian
<tgBot> <peternerlich> Hello Brian and welcome! I'm part of the UBports welcoming team. â¦ To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
<tgBot> <Xorpad> Halium is a platform for running linux on on android devices
<tgBot> <Xorpad> you could think of it like a hypervisor, since it is containerized
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> It's otherway around actually
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> Android inside linux
<tgBot> <Xorpad> Well, android is linux
<tgBot> <Xorpad> but I was trying to simpllgy it
<tgBot> <Xorpad> Like officially the android kernel family is still called linux
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> Okay.. Android inside GNU/Linux
<tgBot> <Xorpad> It's linux inside linux inside linux
<tgBot> <Xorpad> ad infinitum,
<tgBot> <Xorpad> lulz
<tgBot> <Gleb Lee ð¸ð¨> It's not 'android inside linux', it's 'android blobs inside linux' :)
<tgBot> <Xorpad> yeah
<tgBot> <Xorpad> There is open-source drivers for some devices
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> I don't want to pour gasoline on any flame wars about the vision for UBPorts, but I would like to state the following: â¦ UBPorts is never going to be for everyone. The project has attracted FOSS embracing people like myself as well as a good number of very skilled developers. UT is a very, very long way from being an alternative mobile OS for more than a few, albeit steadily increasing, bunch of people.  â¦ Most of us have come here because w
<tgBot> the alternatives out there and many of us like to have a phone that can be tinkered with. However, the majority of UT users probably want a stable phone that can perform the basic tasks you expect from a modern smartphone today, and are content with the fact that many popular apps will never be available on our platform. UBPorts must, of course, cater to these users, but I wish this can be done without limiting the ability to customize the phone in terms of w
<tgBot> installing apps, use it for convergence purposes etc. For me, UT has become infinitely more interesting in the last couple of weeks with the knowledge about what can be done on the phone. I am aware of the risks though, and I have borked my UT devices more than once.  â¦ I see some heated discussions in this group, and I think that is OK as long as we act civilized and respect each others views on things. We all want this project to succeed, but for that to 
<tgBot> efforts from a good number of smart people - also developers that explore the boundaries of what UT is capable of. â¦ I understand moving UT to 16.04 is a daunting task, probably more so than I can imagine, but I am optimistic it can and will be done before too long. In the meantime, I think that many of us perceive progression as being rather slow, and therefore new and interesting stuff to try out makes the wait easier to bear. I think these "hacks" are al
<tgBot> long term development of the platform. Some things may even be useful for the average user looking to have a phone that "just works". â¦ Hopefully people in this community can continue to get along and work together to develop UT into the awesome platform it can be - catering to average as well as power users. â¦ My 2 cents...
<tgBot> <Xorpad> Ubuntu Touch serves a purpose
<tgBot> <Xorpad> once we get it running on more devices we could see a spike in the user base
<tgBot> <Xorpad> The fact is the market is dominated by 2 OS's that suck
<tgBot> <Xorpad> and people should have freedom to use something better
<tgBot> <Xorpad> iOS is totally locked down, android is totally bloated... UT is nice
<tgBot> <neothethird> @TomasOqvist, this is true
<tgBot> <neothethird> @Xorpad, so is this
<tgBot> <Stereofont> @TomasOqvist, As I never tire of saying, 'flavours' would be nice. Not practical now but in the futureâ¦
<tgBot> <Stereofont> Estate version, hatchback, four wheel drive â¦
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> @Stereofont, iOS flavor, Android flavor, "do whatever you want" flavor...
<tgBot> <Stereofont> @TomasOqvist, Emulating iOS or Android would be suicidal I think. They will always do that overkill better. But flavours according to need, for sure
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> @Stereofont, I wasn't thinking about emulating, merely the concept of "locked down" vs. "completely open". This could probably be accomplished with a "you have been warned + are you really sure" kind of switch ð.
<tgBot> <Flohack> @TomasOqvist, I totally agree on this and please @dohbee and @KrisJacewicz create your own channel for intense discussions of deb vs click, if you like. Nothing is gonna change in the next few weeks or months, UBports will not enter any discussion about packaging formats in that way. By the way you forgot snaps, what about them? Flatpack anyone? Choose your poison. And about security: Clicks are as insecure as debs as long as there is no review proc
<tgBot> for clicks. Currently everybody can upload anything to the store, and we cannot review each app as Apple is doing. That is something that would be ultimately necessary for "secure" Apps.
<tgBot> <Flohack> And please, accept each others opinion and dont get uncomfortable. We have so far no moderation in this group but it can be that we have to add it, if things continue in this way
<tgBot> <alan_griffiths> I don't think a chat channel is the right medium for this discussion right now. It doesn't maintain enough context. â¦ What I think is needed is first to clarify the requirements. Different "Personas"[1] will value these requirements differently, but without structure this discussion flounder. â¦  Clicks, snaps, flatpacks, debs etc all score differently against different requirements. A blogpost about the how they score against (for example
<tgBot> support, ability to customize, stability of device, different security models, etc. would go a long way towards structuring this (very necessary) discussion. â¦ 1. https://www.agilealliance.org/glossary/personas
<tgBot> <Flohack> @alan_griffiths, Because people think only from their standpoint, not even trying to see the needs of others here. Everyone is fine to make with UT what he wants, but please do not try to superimpose it on "the standard". Some things will contradict each other, and the OOB experience will not satisfy everyone. But yes, its more productive to deliver evidence-based data about proÂ´s and conÂ´s and not produce FUD about "security" in one sentence.
<tgBot> <Stereofont> @TomasOqvist, I would go a little further. A core common to all but with a custom 'toolbox' for each distribution, reflecting what is most useful to that user group. In part that can be achieved through app installation but probably can be eased by some architecture tweaks and removal of elements that will never be used
<tgBot> TheImpulson was added by: TheImpulson
<tgBot> * delijati to long discussion for a chat tool use email
<tgBot> <milkor73> @TheImpulson, Hello Aayush and welcome!  I'm part of the UBports welcoming team.    â¦ To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
<tgBot> <TheImpulson> @milkor73, Thanks Milan.
<tgBot> <Stereofont> Hi Aayush. Is our India group of interest to you?
<tgBot> <Stereofont> The link is in @ubports_news
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @TomasOqvist, +1
<tgBot> Enrique Torrubia was added by: Enrique Torrubia
<tgBot> <peternerlich> Hello Enrique and welcome! I'm part of the UBports welcoming team. â¦ To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Flohack, in case some of you didn't notice, i am not against any one packaging format, and I totally accept click as well. I have stated that before. When i said that i d like it to support xmir so i can start using it as well. So hopefully it eventually does start allowing xmir apps to work with it too.
<tgBot> <Enrique Torrubia> Hello  everybody.
<tgBot> <DiogoConstantino> Hi
<tgBot> * Federico
<tgBot> <Flohack> @KrisJacewicz, Its not a common goal, its the meaning of a single person. But your answer is really not helping the case here. This is what I want to point out. You say you are not against any packaging format, why you use the f-word here?
<tgBot> <peternerlich> @Enrique Torrubia, Oh, also, you might be repelled by the amount of messages going through our groups at times, but still interested to stay up to date about our project. In this case, lucky you, there's a brand new News Channel! @ubports_news
<tgBot> <Enrique Torrubia> Ok, thanks
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Flohack, then let me explain the "f- word",  i assumed we are all adults here and this is not a censored chat, ans it was within, say, fair use. I was not aware there was a rule forbidding using "f- word" but if there is i will obey.
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> it was not used as a vulgarism for the sake of being vulgar but as a instrument for maximum of emphasis
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> but i dont hold personal avers to any of existing packaging systems
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> and i did not state that i do, rather expressed avers to stripping users from access to tools they may prefer over whats default, because that was suggested by Rodnwy
<tgBot> <Flohack> @KrisJacewicz, You are speaking in front of over 1000 people. You cannot know how they receive your message. You know, in communications, the responsibility is always with the sender, not the receiver. You can speak like this with people you know better, and where you know how the receive it. Consider this as a chat where diplomacy is key to success. We take patience and politeness with every member, to explain slowly, through language barriers, for
<tgBot> sake of the project. Thats how to bring people together.
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> @Flohack, Being in the profession of communications, I second this!
<tgBot> <Flohack> @TomasOqvist, cool whats your job
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> @Flohack, I am running my own IR (Investor Relations) agency in Stockholm.
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> understood, and agreed
<tgBot> * gunawanpp820
<tgBot> <malditobastardo> @TomasOqvist, Agree with this
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> @TomasOqvist, Nice! I know a few projects that need cash injection!  One of them starts with UB and ends with S. ;)
<tgBot> <Mohannes> Looks like weâre moving to stockholm!
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> also, i fully agree.  I like a bit of joking and some ''adult references' are hard to avoid, however, in this forum I am totally against swear words, personal attacks and anything else that would make the dialogue look like drunk men in a bar discussing politics
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> Always remember we have a new persona arrive at our cocktail party every hour and a welcoming team dedicated to properly representing who we are.  What image are we showcasing?
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> On that note 'high five' to this 1K+ community for not needing moderation yet as @Flohack said somewhere above
<tgBot> <Xorpad> we are at 1024 member
<tgBot> <Xorpad> 1024!!
<tgBot> <Xorpad> 10^2 all hail
<tgBot> <Mohannes> AWWW YISSSS
<tgBot> <Eranuzan> (Sticker, 496x512) https://irc.ubports.com/kagcCYeE/file_2514
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> @Mohannes, ð
<tgBot> <TomasOqvist> @wayneoutthere, First we need to change the association from foundation to incorporated ð
<tgBot> <Mohannes> @peternerlich, This guy! Promoting the Sh*t out of UBports. Nice work!
<tgBot> <peternerlich> thank you, thank you ð
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> hey.... just a heads up to everyone.  We are doing some 'renovations' to the Welcome Room.  We booted out everyone except the Welcoming Team.  IF you need more welcoming or help or generally bored, you are always welcome to pop back any time.  Here is the join link to the Welcome Room if you need:  https://t.me/joinchat/Baj4lhJ4XRotoeGk1QxuRQ
<tgBot> <BrisPete> @Xorpad, We're better trhan 10^2, we're 2^10
<tgBot> <Xorpad> @BrisPete, Like a boss
<tgBot> <BrisPete> Can't type properly though. ð
<tgBot> <BrisPete> *than
<tgBot> <dohbee> :(
<tgBot> <Flohack> @KrisJacewicz your xauth package et.al. is now in the nightly devel
<tgBot> <Stereofont> Apple Support: âWith iOS 10, facial recognition is a built in feature and there is no option to disable itâ
<tgBot> <developerfect> @sopernam why did you leave the group
<tgBot> <sopernam> @developerfect, which group?
<tgBot> <developerfect> Turkish?
<tgBot> <sopernam> you're add false admin of your group
<tgBot> <developerfect> @sopernam, I will intervene immediately.
<tgBot> <sopernam> i dont know what happening. IMO he banned me
<tgBot> <sopernam> (Photo, 720x1280) https://irc.ubports.com/DpLgKWVm/file_2516.jpg
<tgBot> <developerfect> @sopernam, Try re-entering
<tgBot> <sopernam> can you send me group link?
<tgBot> <sopernam> or can you add me?
<tgBot> <developerfect> https://t.me/joinchat/Fum_4UxK27CD1dMMbLPCFQ
<tgBot> <sopernam> @developerfect, he banned me
<tgBot> <sopernam> no problem
<tgBot> <developerfect> Please re-enter
<tgBot> <sopernam> why you're deleted link.
<tgBot> <sopernam> @developerfect, pm me
<tgBot> <sopernam> im here if you want ask your question ask here. @developerfect
<tgBot> <archi_dagac> Hey
<tgBot> <archi_dagac> I am working on your problem Sopernam
<tgBot> <sopernam> thisnis not problem this is shitty politics
<tgBot> <archi_dagac> Please be kuayt
<tgBot> <archi_dagac> Ben bakÄ±yorum soruna sakin ol
<tgBot> <archi_dagac> Burda Åeyapma
<tgBot> <archi_dagac> I am solving the problem
<tgBot> <sopernam> meh...
<tgBot> <Matteo> @TomasOqvist, +1
<tgBot> <Stereofont> @archi_dagac, celti you have the authority to unban, in group settings
<tgBot> <archi_dagac> We solved
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> quickly! someone send some love to the Turks!
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> â¤ï¸â¤ï¸â¤ï¸â¤ï¸
<tgBot> <Georgecloon> Is Canonical okay with UBports using the Ubuntu name?
<tgBot> <Ruben> Installed ubports on my oneplus one phone (devel channel). It works great, thnx for that!
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @Flohack, super happy
<tgBot> <Stereofont> @Georgecloon, Yes and various other similar terms
<tgBot> <Georgecloon> Nice
<tgBot> <Flohack> @Georgecloon, We are still waiting for legal paperwork but yes basically they are fine with that
<tgBot> <Stereofont> @Georgecloon, Exactly. They could have chosen otherwise but it shows goodwill
<tgBot> <Georgecloon> Yeah, I didn't expect that from Canonical but it's great that the old name and logos and stuff can still be used
<tgBot> <Georgecloon> I also heard that supergroup support landed in UT's Telegram app but OpenStore isn't showing an update for it.
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> this is true.
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> push @Flohack. he likes being pushed.  eh, Flo??? eh??
<tgBot> <sverzegnassi> There is a beta version for the telegram application, but it has never been released as stable on OpenStore (not yet, maybe soon)
<tgBot> <Georgecloon> Oh, I didn't know it was beta
<tgBot> <Georgecloon> Never mind, I'll wait for stable to land then
<tgBot> <Georgecloon> WebTelegram also works fine for supergroups
<tgBot> <Michele> If you want to try the beta, here it is https://github.com/ubports/telegram-app/releases/tag/v2.5.0
<tgBot> <Georgecloon> @Michele, Thanks
<tgBot> <Michele> ðð»
<tgBot> <Flohack> @sverzegnassi, Today I merged to stable branch. Last tests & localization, then we are ready ;)
<tgBot> <Flohack> There is a new beta build from stable actually on GH
<tgBot> <Michele> @Flohack, this one https://github.com/ubports/telegram-app/releases/tag/v2.5.1
<tgBot> <Georgecloon> Where is the app's localization done? Transifex or something?
<tgBot> <sverzegnassi> @Flohack, Yeah, saw it a few hours ago :D
<tgBot> <Flohack> @Georgecloon, Https://translate.ubports.com
<tgBot> <Georgecloon> @Flohack, Thanks
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> @Georgecloon, We have some language groups now as well if you didn't catch the news. If you are interested in langauges feel free to message me on the side
<tgBot> Ashley Davies was added by: Ashley Davies
<tgBot> <peternerlich> Hello Ashley and welcome! I'm part of the UBports welcoming team. â¦ To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
<tgBot> <Ashley Davies> Hello! Thank you :')
<tgBot> <Ashley Davies> I'm looking for the old wiki on how to port UBTouch to a new device, I've grown tired of building Lineageos Android so wanted to try my hand at something new
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Well, you're in luck since that old wiki is old and didn't provide all of the info that you need! We've got a swath of new docs available at https://docs.ubports.com/en/latest/porting/introduction.html
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Just note that Ubuntu Touch 16.04, which you'll be porting, isn't quite ready for prime time yet.
<tgBot> <j2g2rp> @Michele, We should test something in last beta?
<tgBot> <peternerlich> Ashley Also, you might be repelled by the amount of messages going through our groups at times, but still interested to stay up to date about our project. In this case, lucky you, there's a brand new News Channel! @ubports_news
<tgBot> <Georgecloon> @wayneoutthere, I would be interested in a Dutch language group if there is one
<tgBot> <Flohack> @j2g2rp, Its very stable, no worries ^^
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> @Flohack, I think he's asking if there's anything specific to test
<tgBot> <Flohack> @UniversalSuperBox, Ha gotcha... Yes, well no, nothing special. Basically test for regressions, as this was a huge merge to stable branch, with some conflicts to be repaired
<tgBot> <Ashley Davies> Ha I don't mind reading a tonne of messages, gives me more to do. Thank you for the link I shall read it all  later tonight :)
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> @Ashley Davies, how badly I wish I had your time! haha
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> actually... i usually read all the messages here.
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> i'm trying to figure out if there is a cooler project out there... i can't really find one.
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> @wayneoutthere, ðð¤
<tgBot> Kefa Mabala was added by: Kefa Mabala
<tgBot> <peternerlich> Hello Kefa and welcome! I'm part of the UBports welcoming team. â¦ To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
<tgBot> <Kefa Mabala> Thanks
<tgBot> <malditobastardo> @Flohack, The latest beta we tried 2 weeks ago until today worked just flawlessly. :)
<tgBot> <Flohack> @malditobastardo, Thanks so I expect the same here also, but who knows
<tgBot> <malditobastardo> Yeah for sure!
<tgBot> <cibersheep> @Michele, Weeeee testing
<tgBot> <Flohack> @cibersheep, test ok.
<tgBot> <cibersheep> @Flohack, Yes! It performs better than 2.5.0 :) â¦ Still Â«0 usersÂ» in supergroups except when tapping info (but no list of members)...
<tgBot> <Flohack> @cibersheep, Yeah I was totally bored by it constantly overwriting my user count with 0 ^^
<tgBot> <Flohack> I get the right value from the server but due do bad class design it will get constantly overwritten
<tgBot> <Field10pg> @cibersheep, Yess i testinggggg
<tgBot> <Stereofont> @Georgecloon, https://t.me/UBports_NL
<tgBot> <Rocco> Hi all.. how can I reboot in bootloader mode my one plus one... to flash ubuntu touch? Thanks
<tgBot> <malditobastardo> I don't receive notification for stickers ð¿
<tgBot> <malditobastardo> (if someone send me just a sticker)
<tgBot> <Michele> @malditobastardo, I don't receive notifications at allð­ð­
<tgBot> <malditobastardo> @Michele, ð¿ð¿ð¹
<tgBot> <Flohack> Just to note no one ever touched the notification code in Telegram. Its a simple register on the Telegram servers, plus on the Canonical push server. So here I cannot help ^^ - If you look in the log file right after start you might see it registering
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> @Rocco, Have you tried this method? â¦ http://ci.ubports.com/job/ubports/job/ubports-installer/job/mariogrip-dev/7/artifact/dist/ubports-nstaller-0.1.8-beta-x86_64.AppImage
<tgBot> <Rocco> @Crash_Burn, Say... not found
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> @Rocco, Something changed ð¤ Let me find the new link
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> @Rocco, https://t.me/joinchat/Baj4lhJ4XRotoeGk1QxuRQ I can help you further in the Welcome Room
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> If you like... I can provide more detailed help over there.
<tgBot> <Rocco> @Crash_Burn, Thanks..
#ubports 2017-12-01
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> I strongly recommend this boat loader and everything will be a lot easier
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> (Photo, 698x753) https://irc.ubports.com/OYMJOKXy/file_2518.jpg
<tgBot> <peternerlich> wow, from my tests this boat loader really drags the system down
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> Just keep trying, Peter.  You can't just quit.
<tgBot> <PhoenixLandPirate> If you accidentally cut it in half, you can simply use flex tape to put it back together
<tgBot> joeyshome was added by: joeyshome
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> Hello @joey and welcome!  I'm part of the UBports welcoming team.    â¦ To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
<tgBot> <vanyasem> @Crash_Burn, wrong handle
<tgBot> <vanyasem> Joey's handle is @joeyshome
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> What was up with that 3 hour silence above ? Ha. Question before I sleep: Is it possible to make a private web app with this web app creator app or is it always published to Openstore? Thanks
<tgBot> <YougoChats> You can save the click file, install the click file via open store or publish it.
<tgBot> <YougoChats> would be even better if you could open and edit previously stored click files too
<tgBot> <Gleb Lee ð¸ð¨> Hi. I want to try to create a webapp, but I'm not ready yet to flash my phone. Is there any environment to test webapps for UT? Maybe, just UT Browser in Unity8 is enough? â¦ I need to check how content-origin policy work etc.
<tgBot> <mixmoto> Hi i try to use tetering hotspot with my n5 but not working. It's a bug or doesn't work only for me?
<tgBot> <DanChapman> @Gleb Lee ð¸ð¨, Using the SDK on 16.04 will be enough to test webapps. Doesn't need to be unity8 just somewhere you can run oxide ð
<tgBot> <Gleb Lee ð¸ð¨> @DanChapman oh, thanks! I thought SDK no longer work...
<tgBot> <DanChapman> works for me on 16.04. It's just not available on the latest releases
<tgBot> <Gleb Lee ð¸ð¨> Ah, OK. Will try)
<tgBot> <Flohack> @Gleb Lee ð¸ð¨, Or you find fellow users who want to help testing ;) - but sorry we dont have a working emulator
<tgBot> <DanChapman> The simplest way to test a webapp is to do `webapp-container --app-id=webapp.test https://webapp.url`
<tgBot> <DanChapman> Once you've installed the sdk that is. THen you can fiddle about with the config files and what not
<tgBot> <Gleb Lee ð¸ð¨> Dan, thanks! Could I run local html bundle this way?
<tgBot> <DanChapman> yes you can pass it a local html file url
<tgBot> <Gleb Lee ð¸ð¨> OK, thanks. Brian Douglass shared this as example previously: https://github.com/bhdouglass/terrartisan/blob/master/terrartisan.desktop#L3
<tgBot> <Gleb Lee ð¸ð¨> And the last question. Is there any CSS library that recreates UT style guides (buttons, colours, etc)? If no, I'll try this.
<tgBot> <DanChapman> Errrm there is https://launchpad.net/ubuntu-html5-theme but its old and no longer matches the current suru style.
<tgBot> <DanChapman> So i wouldn't recommend using it. You would probably get better results rolling your own
<tgBot> <DanChapman> Or bringing that one up to date ð
<tgBot> <Gleb Lee ð¸ð¨> At least this is good place for start. Thanks, Dan!
<tgBot> <DanChapman> ð
<tgBot> <Andreas> Hi, yes or no question (if 'no' I'll dig deeper into the documentation): Can I "migrate" my phone from (Canonical's) UbuntuTouch to UBports simply by switching channels like so:  â¦ sudo system-image-cli âswitch 15.04/stable â¦ ?
<tgBot> <wagafo> @Andreas, Pretty sure you can't, since the Canonical image has now way of knowing about the UBports servers
<tgBot> <Andreas> Ok, thanks. I'll read some more in how-to-install-ubports on the web site. Thought there ws a shortcut ;)
<tgBot> thomorl was added by: thomorl
<tgBot> <thomorl> (Sticker, 507x512) https://irc.ubports.com/yrXDJeyx/file_2519
<tgBot> <cibersheep> @wayneoutthere, Yes
<tgBot> <cibersheep> @YougoChats, Oh. thanks
<tgBot> <cibersheep> @YougoChats, It's in the to do list ð¬
<tgBot> <Stereofont> @mixmoto, Not every provider allows it
<tgBot> <Stereofont> @Andreas, Sadly not. You do need to install fresh
<tgBot> <delijati> this is just so wrong http://blog.streamr.com/2017/11/streamr-jolla-zipper-blockchain-phone/
<tgBot> <delijati> even now jolla is broken ... there is really just ubports to the rescue
<tgBot> <Stereofont> @, Hello Deleted Person and welcome!  I'm part of the UBports welcoming team.    â¦ To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
<tgBot> <Greg> Does anyone know the status of the new camera and scree......n....   ...................................................??...............?..????.??....%?...?........... ...?....................................?..........................................................................%%..?...h?......?....?..
<tgBot> <Stereofont> @Greg, Guessing this is FP2?
<tgBot> <cibersheep> @Flohack with Telegram 2.5.1 I can't hear voice messages except the ones downloaded from previous versions
<tgBot> <cibersheep> (Voice, 0s)https://irc.ubports.com/0ApiX3hT/file_2520
<tgBot> <Flohack> Interesting
<tgBot> <Flohack> It worked in 2.5.0??
<tgBot> <garrogarri> @cibersheep, It works ð
<tgBot> <Christof> hi folks... in the latest community update you talk about images for OP3 and HTC10, though they are not (yet?) usable. Unfortunately my old phone (blackberry z30) is slowly dieing and I'm afraid it will be dead before a new device for ubports comes out. I'm not that much attracted to the current supported devices... Is there any information on if one of the two mentioned devices will become supported? The HTC 10 is quite nice I think
<tgBot> <Flohack> @Christof, I think both have good chances to get supported ;) - But dont ask me when...
<tgBot> <cibersheep> @Flohack, Yes. And I can hear audios downloaded in 2.5.0
<tgBot> <cibersheep> But not in 2.5.1
<tgBot> <cibersheep> @garrogarri, What version of Telegram are you using?
<tgBot> <garrogarri> I'm on desktop
<tgBot> <Flohack> @garrogarri, Thats not a test then ^^
<tgBot> <cibersheep> (Photo, 333x294) https://irc.ubports.com/adC5sOr1/file_2522.jpg
<tgBot> <Christof> @Flohack, Many thanks! Looking forward to new devices and hopefully my blackberry makes it to that dayð thanks to the whole team and keep up the good work!
<tgBot> <cibersheep> @cibersheep, When you press play, stays in blue a s no 'pause' icon and no sound
<tgBot> <cibersheep> @garrogarri, XD we are testing the ububtu phone client hehehe
<tgBot> <garrogarri> @cibersheep, I thought it was a transmission test ð
<tgBot> <cibersheep> @garrogarri, ðð
<tgBot> <Greg> Apologies for that odd message my phone hasn't been getting taps registered on part of the screen then started doing phantom taps just then, yes FP2
<tgBot> <malditobastardo> @cibersheep, Let me test
<tgBot> <malditobastardo> It doesn't work
<tgBot> <malditobastardo> (Sticker, 512x512) https://irc.ubports.com/6k6WkJc4/file_2523
<tgBot> <Stereofont> @Greg, New screen is supported in devel channel but sadly no support for the new camera. I am waiting too but 16.04 is more urgent ð
<tgBot> <Greg> But there are eventual plans to support the new cameras both front and back? Assume it would be easier to support them with the drivers from xenual anyway right
<tgBot> <YougoChats> @Greg, Yikes, sounds like a dying digtizerð
<tgBot> <Greg> That'll be fixed by a new screen module though right? Not that much of an issue
<tgBot> <YougoChats> fairphone support is very good. If it died on its own (no damage from dropping etc) within warranty, they will send you a new screen (no idea which hardware version) or have your phone picked up, repaired/replaced and sent back.
<tgBot> <YougoChats> do flash fairphone OS back on it to avoid funny questions
<tgBot> <Greg> Got it second hand sadly, seller gave me a partial refund to cover it though
<tgBot> <Greg> What do youean by hardware version, the screen or phone itself
<tgBot> <Cesar_Herrera> I run Telegram 2.5.1.0 and after 3 seconds the icons of all supergroups turn into violet and it is impossible to enter them.
<tgBot> <malditobastardo> @Cesar_Herrera, Could you please send an screenshot ?
<tgBot> <Cesar_Herrera> (Photo, 540x960) https://irc.ubports.com/panzw9xq/file_2525.jpg
<tgBot> <Flohack> @Cesar_Herrera, Also very interesting ^^
<tgBot> <Flohack> Plz send me logfile if possible
<tgBot> <Cesar_Herrera> @Flohack, Where send I it, please?
<tgBot> <Flohack> @Cesar_Herrera, PM it here
<tgBot> <Flohack> I mean in Telegram ^^
<tgBot> <YougoChats> @Greg, Mine was sexond handed too, but luckily I had the seller's number. I called him and he was fine with sending me his original purchase receipt. Its worth a try
<tgBot> <YougoChats> @Greg, Both really. They decided to replace my entire phone, but I got one with all old hardware. Not bad, but I secretly hoped they would send me a phone with the new camera module ð
<tgBot> <YougoChats> It depends on what they have on the shelf. I think if they decide to only replace one component, the chance of getting new hardware version is higher
<tgBot> <Cesar_Herrera> @Flohack, Sorry I don't remember where is it.
<tgBot> <Xorpad> what if i make a new boot system?
<tgBot> <Xorpad> is that bad?
<tgBot> <Xorpad> Like, it can be loaded from the android boot loader and put i
<tgBot> <Xorpad> can then make it replace it
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I just wondering... random thought
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I think a new boot system that can multi-boot and manage partitions..
<tgBot> <Xorpad> would be good
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I feel like doing something easy like that right now
<tgBot> <Cesar_Herrera> (Document) https://irc.ubports.com/SIFqlpaN/file_2526.log
<tgBot> <Flohack> Hmm maybe it fucked up the database upgrade
<tgBot> <Flohack> you hav 2.5.0 before?
<tgBot> <Cesar_Herrera> @Flohack, Yes
<tgBot> <Cesar_Herrera> @Flohack, Perhaps before I did the command pkon in a bad way
<tgBot> <Flohack> @Cesar_Herrera, It just looks as if your telegram cannot access the channels. are you familiar with sqlite?
<tgBot> <Cesar_Herrera> Not very much. But say
<tgBot> <Flohack> Hmm can you adb into the phone
<tgBot> <Cesar_Herrera> @Flohack, No.
<tgBot> <samitormanen> Is it possible to get newer web browser app to UT? Current browser is based in chromium 55 and I can't access to my web bank with it.. My Bank refuses to support current version. ð
<tgBot> <samitormanen> I have tried to change user agent strings but it doesn't help.
<tgBot> <Cesar_Herrera> And how did I it
<tgBot> <Flohack> @samitormanen, Is in the works. Unfortunately 57 broke all BQ devices...
<tgBot> <Cesar_Herrera> In the afternoon I may do tethering.
<tgBot> <samitormanen> Ok. Thanks @Flohack
<tgBot> <Flohack> @Cesar_Herrera, You need usb cable only ^^ and linux with adb installed
<tgBot> <Cesar_Herrera> Yes I have it installed as Apitz
<tgBot> <Cesar_Herrera> I use ssh not adb
<tgBot> <Flohack> @Cesar_Herrera, Ok then plz ssh ionto your device, change to .cache/com.ubuntu.telegram... dir, and then into your profile directory with your phone number
<tgBot> <Flohack> there you will find 2 .db files
<tgBot> <Flohack> SORRY .config!
<tgBot> <Cesar_Herrera> @Flohack, Weit until this afternool. Sorry
<tgBot> <Cesar_Herrera> @Flohack, I see 2 db
<tgBot> <Cesar_Herrera> @Flohack, I'm also there in terminal.
<tgBot> <Cesar_Herrera> (Document) https://irc.ubports.com/o6gfv4vA/file_2527
<tgBot> <Xorpad> no one have any opinions on another boot mechanism?
<tgBot> <Xorpad> like, something that android bootloader can load or that can be flashed directly, and that handles multi-boot and repartitioning of your drive... Like it would reside in recovery partition, be called from boot partition so that it loads and not the kernel, it would do everything TWRP does, everything the current ubuntu recovery does, handle multiboot, and we could use system partition as / and userdata parition as /home
<tgBot> <Xorpad> then we could install the rootfs to a native partition, which could be resized to house multiple rootfs's via the boot system which can also load images when resizing to set up dual-boot
<tgBot> <Xorpad> it wouldn't require flashing android bootloader
<tgBot> <Xorpad> but it would, if you want multi-boot, repartition the device
<tgBot> <Flohack> @Cesar_Herrera, Ok you need sqlite3 userdata.db
<tgBot> <Flohack> type it ^^
<tgBot> <Flohack> sry its database.db ^^ I am not rly well organized today
<tgBot> <dohbee> @Gleb Lee ð¸ð¨, Sounds like you want an html5 Cordova app, not a webapp.
<tgBot> <Flohack> @Cesar_Herrera, Ok just ping me when you are ready
<tgBot> <malditobastardo> I will rollback to the older telegram version because of the audio messages. I am receiving a few today lol
<tgBot> <Flohack> Lol ok
<tgBot> <Cesar_Herrera> @Flohack I'm in the directory, and?
<tgBot> <Flohack> sqlite3 database.db
<tgBot> <Flohack> then enter: select * from chats where accessHash > 0;
<tgBot> <Flohack> do you get any output?
<tgBot> <Cesar_Herrera> Sqlite3 and?
<tgBot> <Cesar_Herrera> @Flohack, Be patient please.
<tgBot> <Flohack> just type it with parameter database.db
<tgBot> <Flohack> then it opens the db immediately
<tgBot> <Cesar_Herrera> @Flohack, It lets a lot of things separated by |
<tgBot> <Cesar_Herrera> @Flohack, sqlite> select * from chats where accessHash > 0;                               â¦ 1190625957|0|0||UBports News Channel||15113497639|1|73394|-7761333253501751230|1|804725225201 â¦ 1059487747|0|0||UBports Supergroup [ENGLISH]|0|1737397639|1|28741|-1896395621444036648|429|4|430524416 â¦ sqlite>
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> @cibersheep, cool.  this is interesting.... i believe today I will do for private CRM access and see how that flows.  thanks!
<tgBot> <Flohack> @Cesar_Herrera, Ok so thats not the problem
<tgBot> <Flohack> You got only those 2 supergroups?
<tgBot> <Flohack> channels?
<tgBot> <Cesar_Herrera> @Flohack, If I close the app and delete de databases it is oK?
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> @Greg, How do I read this into a mic for a 'quotable moment' on the News Desk?  ;)
<tgBot> <Cesar_Herrera> I thint they are more
<tgBot> <Flohack> @Cesar_Herrera, yes better even is you go to the menu, select settings on the bottom and "Log Out", then close and restart app
<tgBot> <peternerlich> @wayneoutthere, google translate can help you figuring this out
<tgBot> <Cesar_Herrera> @Flohack, OK
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> @peternerlich, finally! a reason to use google!
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> @Xorpad i would totally answer your questions above about boot loaders but.. the only thing  I know about is boat loaders...
<tgBot> <Xorpad> lol
<tgBot> <peternerlich> @wayneoutthere, try japanese voice also
<tgBot> <peternerlich> that is weird. it speaks a majority of the dots out loud, but only if you translate it to german and let it voice it on the translated end insteead of from the input:
<tgBot> https://translate.google.com/#ja/de/Does%20anyone%20know%20the%20status%20of%20the%20new%20camera%20and%20scree......n....%20%20%20...................................................%3F%3F...............%3F..%3F%3F%3F%3F.%3F%3F....%25%3F...%3F...........%20...%3F....................................%3F..........................................................................%25%25..%3F...h%3F......%3F....%3F..
<tgBot> <peternerlich> anyway, this should really belong it ot...
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> time to bring on the Lab!
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Happy Patreon day, everyone!
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> @UniversalSuperBox, what's patreon day?  a call out to anyone who isn't already subscribed?
<tgBot> <Cesar_Herrera> @Flohack, Finally I did what you said, but as it waited a lot I unistall, erased everything and reinstalled. Finally OK.
<tgBot> <Flohack> Ok then its good. Maybe we need to advise that people can remove their .cache folder ;)
<tgBot> <dohbee> @Greg, Not sure what you mean here, but drivers come from Android, not Ubuntu. They tend to be binary blobs tied to the specific kernel versions shipped by the OEMs.
<tgBot> <dohbee> @Flohack, Limit that advice to the app-specific directory would be best. Removing entire .cache will delete all libertine containers that might be defined by users.
<tgBot> <cibersheep> @wayneoutthere, Once you finish with our app, it lets you open with OpenStore (and that install it in the device)
<tgBot> <Flohack> @dohbee, ð I would NEVER advise to delete the WHOLE cache. That said, .cache is a growing pile of smth... most apps do not clean up there properly. Eventually your space will be full (after years of usage)
<tgBot> <delijati> ahh @Flohack one question how to get the path to data , cache in qml
<tgBot> <dohbee> many years perhaps, or by creating multiple libertine containers. or maybe by installing some bad app which stores very large data in .cache
<tgBot> <Flohack> @delijati, Good question, no idea ^^
<tgBot> <dohbee> @delijati, https://doc-snapshots.qt.io/qtifw-master/scripting-qdesktopservices.html
<tgBot> <DanChapman> @delijati, there is no file api in qml. You have to use a c++ plugin or from python if your using pyotherside
<tgBot> <dohbee> storageLocation(DesktopServices.CacheLocation)
<tgBot> <dohbee> @DanChapman, You can use JS to read file:/// URLs
<tgBot> <DanChapman> I think you should use QStandardPaths over QDesktopService nowadays http://doc.qt.io/qt-5/qstandardpaths.html
<tgBot> <DanChapman> @dohbee, But that's just a hack as you have to use a XmlHttpRequest to get at the data. But you can't test that a file exists so you would be doing it blind
<tgBot> <dohbee> @DanChapman, In QML it is still part of Qt Labs Platform, not part of the main API
<tgBot> <dohbee> @DanChapman, You need to handle error conditions anyway, such as if it exists and is empty and your parsing then breaks
<tgBot> <sambuccid> @Flohack, work also closing and reopen app(more than one time)
<tgBot> <developerfect> (Sticker, 512x433) https://irc.ubports.com/RxuCUrIU/file_2528
<tgBot> <dohbee> main issue is there's no way to write to a local file
<tgBot> <DanChapman> @dohbee, Oh! nice. I didn't know that was in the labs modules ð
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> @cibersheep, quite cool. let me slowly go through this process and see what happens
<tgBot> <dohbee> but you can use localstorage or u1db or something instead, for structured storage. but that's of course not good for storing binary data like audio/video
<tgBot> <dohbee> @DanChapman, Since 5.8. Won't work on 5.7 or 5.5
<tgBot> <DanChapman> ack
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> @wayneoutthere, It's the day that Patreon takes/distributes money
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> oh cool. so my credit card gets hit for the team today! :)
<tgBot> <LarreaMikel> @UniversalSuperBox, As @shinyhairsmylifeambition stated, you receive a bigger portion of the donations with librepay... but is this the prefered way? Or you suggest to use patreon (or another)
<tgBot> <Flohack> @malditobastardo @cibersheep New telegram beta build, plz test audio...
<tgBot> <malditobastardo> @Flohack, Works!!
<tgBot> <malditobastardo> ð¸ð¸
<tgBot> <malditobastardo> Thanks boss!
<tgBot> <Flohack> @malditobastardo, you are welcome. Also now all pictures are being loaded again hopefully
<tgBot> <Flohack> whats still missing is profile pictures of supergroups and channels
<tgBot> <Flohack> I am stuck with this ^^
<tgBot> <Cesar_Herrera> @Flohack, And the number of people in supergroups.
<tgBot> <Flohack> @Cesar_Herrera, yeah but this is for me really an option ð
<tgBot> <kristijantkalec> Can someone please post on UBport News Channel about the last COmmunity update? Thanks :)
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> @cibersheep, so that is amazing!  i now have a full and app-like access to our company's CRM that i built a while back.  It works really well and i was shocked that it was able to create that app so quickly - and even with my skill level.  Amazing.  Great work!
<tgBot> <kristijantkalec> https://ubports.com/blog/community-updates-5/post/community-update-17-101
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> hmm.  I think we have to work on our internal news-feed systems.  I'll announce this shortly officially.  I didn't know it was published ha
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> FYI - anything like this I miss please PM me for now
<tgBot> <kristijantkalec> ok
<tgBot> <kristijantkalec> thanks
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> even stuff that 'might' be news
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> and thanks for letting me know! haha
<tgBot> <kristijantkalec> no problem :)
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> so... I'm going over to Off Topic https://t.me/ubports_ot group with this but I was doing some thinking about this bothersome 'net neutrality' conversation and how UBports and other tech could be a solution.  Feel free to join over there but don't bother commenting here since it's 'quite' off topic :)
<tgBot> <cibersheep> @wayneoutthere, Thanks! It's a team work: @Jujuyeh and @mateosalta ð
<tgBot> <malditobastardo> @Flohack, Profile = when you click someone's miniature or name right ?
<tgBot> <Flohack> @malditobastardo, not only that but also in the overview list
<tgBot> <Flohack> you will encounter missing pictures from time to time
<tgBot> <dohbee> @Flohack, Heck. I even get this in chromium for telegram, when my computer is under extreme load
<tgBot> <Flohack> @dohbee, lol I say no more
<tgBot> <TronFortyTwo> Hi! I have a problem with Ubuntu Touch. My E5 screen is broken, and to use the phone I adb into it. The problem is that I changed distro in my pc, and the phone doesn't accept the adb connection anymore. To make the connection work I should accept the new pc from the phone, but I can't with the broken screen. There's a way I can enter a shell in the phone somehow?
<tgBot> <TronFortyTwo> Thanks for the hel
<tgBot> <TronFortyTwo> *help
<tgBot> <dohbee> if it's connected to your wifi, you can maybe do ssh phablet@<your phone's ip> to connect
<tgBot> <LarreaMikel> What is the broken part? LCD, touch or both?
<tgBot> <Flohack> @TronFortyTwo, did you check the udev rules
<tgBot> <Flohack> cat /etc/udev/rules.d/51-android.rules
<tgBot> <Flohack> if you changed distro, adb might stop working because of this
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> @LarreaMikel, You're free to do whatever you want
<tgBot> <TronFortyTwo> @LarreaMikel, I think both, but not sure...
<tgBot> <TronFortyTwo> @dohbee, I'll try thanks
<tgBot> <LarreaMikel> well.. If the lcd is working, then you can see the screen... and you can try with a bluetooth mouse
<tgBot> <LarreaMikel> @UniversalSuperBox, I know, but it is just in case, in order to optimize the project income ..
<tgBot> <TronFortyTwo> @LarreaMikel, I mean, the lcd is surely broken, the digitizer probably
<tgBot> <TronFortyTwo> @Flohack, It's that in fact the problem
<tgBot> <Flohack> @TronFortyTwo, I am just guessing. Had a user in German chat some minutes ago who could not flash UT. Same story
<tgBot> <TronFortyTwo> The problem is within the phone :/, it refuse connection from my pc...
<tgBot> <Flohack> @TronFortyTwo, How can it do that, adb was enabled before, so it must wor know too
<tgBot> <LarreaMikel> and if you connect a keyboard...
<tgBot> <LarreaMikel> and hit enter?
<tgBot> <Flohack> Please follow these steps: https://github.com/ubports/ubports-installer/pull/51/files
<tgBot> <dohbee> @Flohack, It's the authorization side. The PC adb I'd changed, so needs reauth
<tgBot> <Flohack> @dohbee, uh damn!
<tgBot> <Flohack> adb devices says what?
<tgBot> <TronFortyTwo> @Flohack, I have followed that but still,: â¦ The outputs are â¦ tronfortytwo@debian:~$ adb shell â¦ * daemon not running. starting it now on port 5037 * â¦ * daemon started successfully * â¦ error: device unauthorized. â¦ This adb server's $ADB_VENDOR_KEYS is not set â¦ Try 'adb kill-server' if that seems wrong. â¦ Otherwise check for a confirmation dialog on your device. â¦ tronfourtytwo@debian:~$ adb devices â¦ List of devices atta
<tgBot> unauthorized
<tgBot> <Flohack> excasctly
<tgBot> <Flohack> now you need the adb key from the old PC is that possible?
<tgBot> <TronFortyTwo> @LarreaMikel, Does the authorization pop up react to 'enter' from the keyboard? Could be a good way
<tgBot> <TronFortyTwo> @Flohack, Where is it located the adb key? ð
<tgBot> <TronFortyTwo> Yay! Thanks @flohack! I found the key, replaced it and now it works like a charm!
<tgBot> <TronFortyTwo> I have my headless UT phone back :D
<tgBot> <Jujuyeh> @cibersheep, ð
<tgBot> <Flohack> @TronFortyTwo, good ^^
<tgBot> <jarlathreidy> Iâve noticed a few issues with the E4.5 lately and Iâm wondering if itâs worth reporting bugs or should I be looking into a newer device? Issues include; 1) WiFi drops off - need to turn on and off flight mode to get it back; 2) Characters delayed when typing; 3) Screensaver often doesnât turn on causing battery to drain fast.
<tgBot> <Cesar_Herrera> @Flohack I have the problem with Telegram another time. I have only 2.2Gb of free memory and I think this could be not enought amount.
<tgBot> <Flohack> @Cesar_Herrera, you mean locally?
<tgBot> <Flohack> on the file system?
<tgBot> <Cesar_Herrera> When I use the conf app.
<tgBot> <dohbee> @jarlathreidy, By "screensaver doesn't turn on" I presume you mean either the screen doesn't blank, or when it does, it doesn't go to deep sleep?
<tgBot> <Cesar_Herrera> (Photo, 540x960) https://irc.ubports.com/AkOj2GiX/file_2530.jpg
<tgBot> <jarlathreidy> Yeah, normally the display powers off but not in this case
<tgBot> <dohbee> so the screen just stays on with visible UI elements and everything?
<tgBot> Roy was added by: Roy
<tgBot> <peternerlich> Hello Roy and welcome! I'm part of the UBports welcoming team. â¦ To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
<tgBot> <peternerlich> Also, you might be repelled by the amount of messages going through our groups at times, but still interested to stay up to date about our project. In this case, lucky you, there's a brand new News Channel! @ubports_news
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> @peternerlich, Thanks @peternerlich .  Good news is that we have now hit about 15% of the group who have subscribed to the news channel.  I'm not sure why the remaining 85% haven't.  They must be crazy like us and read every single message!
<tgBot> <David_Gamiz_Jimenez> @Flohack te most important issue that I see is the videos cannot be downloaded... Or I pick in some list item this react to other place... Never happens something like that
<tgBot> <David_Gamiz_Jimenez> @David_Gamiz_Jimenez, From last version the telegram client I mean
<tgBot> <unknown> @wayneoutthere, Pin this message
<tgBot> <Flohack> @David_Gamiz_Jimenez, send me an example plz
<tgBot> <David_Gamiz_Jimenez> When I pick in you mensagge
<tgBot> <David_Gamiz_Jimenez> (Photo, 540x960) https://irc.ubports.com/zKZvNPIJ/file_2533.jpg
<tgBot> <David_Gamiz_Jimenez> (Photo, 540x960) https://irc.ubports.com/cDhd8X72/file_2534.jpg
<tgBot> <Flohack> Please try latest 2.5.1 again from GH, should be fixed already
<tgBot> <David_Gamiz_Jimenez> oky
<tgBot> <David_Gamiz_Jimenez> Yeah!! All work well again! nice download icon for videos! :)
<tgBot> <malditobastardo> @Flohack if I tap the photo miniature TG just freezes itself and crash
<tgBot> <malditobastardo> *several times
<tgBot> <Flohack> @malditobastardo, which foto? a thumbnail or a real foto
<tgBot> <Flohack> send me plz ^^
<tgBot> <malditobastardo> your TG profile pic for example
<tgBot> <malditobastardo> 2sec I am trying something
<tgBot> <malditobastardo> hmm now If I tap it opens the doc viewer
<tgBot> <Flohack> I tried another profile pic, was ok
<tgBot> <malditobastardo> I dont understand. If I tap any pic now it just doesnt do anything.
<tgBot> <malditobastardo> I cannot open your profile window to add you or send you a private message for example
<tgBot> <malditobastardo> because nothing happens
<tgBot> <malditobastardo> Ok its not implemented yet. For some reason I thought you could get info from the participants by clicking the pic just with other TG apps/desktop
<tgBot> <Michele> @malditobastardo, it was some releases ago, now the idea is to re-implement that feature but in the swipe from right afaik
<tgBot> <malditobastardo> @Michele, hmmm maybe thats why I am getting so confused. It was before then. I remember
<tgBot> <malditobastardo> As you said, from swiping from the right there were an "I" information button maybe?
<tgBot> <malditobastardo> Maybe I am dreaming
<tgBot> <dohbee> @Michele, whomever is working on it, please don't implement features as only usable (and consequently, undiscoverable) with swipes and such.
<tgBot> <Flohack> @malditobastardo, I was on sticker packs only AFAIK
<tgBot> <Michele> @dohbee, swipe and gestures are frequently on Ubuntu Touch...
<tgBot> <malditobastardo> @Flohack, Ok sorry, I am just messing things around. Thank you for clarifyin Flo
<tgBot> <dohbee> @Michele, yes. but things that are only usable with swipes make it impossible to use the apps on PCs
<tgBot> <Flohack> you can drag with mouse ð
<tgBot> <DanChapman> @Flohack, ð
<tgBot> <dohbee> (Sticker, 336x512) https://irc.ubports.com/MRDFg10X/file_2535
<tgBot> <Flohack> @DanChapman, Believe me. Its how I debug Telegram
<tgBot> <Flohack> but to be serious, you can add various actions to QML stuff, so it can support mouse and desktop
<tgBot> <Flohack> think about right click
<tgBot> <DanChapman> In dekko I added the swipe actions to the right click context menu
<tgBot> <Flohack> @dohbee, Clicking on a avatar should bring up its details yes. But I cannot tell you when that died, I normally add new contacts on desktop only
<tgBot> <Flohack> Besides that, I remember that adding contacts on UT was only working for ppl from the address book. But I could be wrong
<tgBot> <Flohack> @malditobastardo, I think that never worked, and my fellow co-author thinks this, too ;)
<tgBot> <Flohack> Please open a ticket for that
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> it is interesting that punch code login only allows 4 digit pin. is the punch code a separate app or part of graphical session manager like lightdm is on desktop?
<tgBot> <DanChapman> afaik it's part of lightdm.
<tgBot> <malditobastardo> @Flohack, ð¸ð¸
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> i dont feel 4 gigits are safe considering that also ssh uses it. only 10000 possibilities by brute forcr. sure ssh is key only authentication, not allowing password login but i still feel it is exceptionally weak.
<tgBot> <DanChapman> then use password login ð
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> i would like it to allow 8 or 10 digits
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @DanChapman, i am
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> its just inconvenient to unlock phone with it
<tgBot> <DanChapman> but i agree it would be nice to allow a longer pin
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> feeling like 2 extremes
<tgBot> <dohbee> @DanChapman, It's a bunch of different parts. lightdm is a very minor part of it
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @dohbee, do you know if its modular? ie is it possible to only add custom loginmmechanism to it without rebuilding lightdm?
<tgBot> <dohbee> and it's not part of lightdm exactly. the "lightdm" part is actually part of unity8
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> kind of like pam modules?
<tgBot> <dohbee> the code for setting the PIN is in ubuntu-system-settings
<tgBot> <dohbee> i think it's just setting the password to the PIN, and not using a special pam module
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @dohbee, well thisnis awesome specific answere thank you, would you also know where the source for that is? i would look into it
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> hv a bit timw now
<tgBot> <dohbee> i forget which plug-in it is, but should be obvious when you look at the source tree for system-settings
<tgBot> <dohbee> i'm not sure if unity8 will need any change to lengthen the PIN on lock screen entry, but if so it might just be a simple QML change
<tgBot> <DanChapman> @dohbee, ah ok. Thanks for the clarification ð
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @dohbee, would be great if that was the case
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> if it was in deed you should be able to find qml plain text on the phone itself?
<tgBot> <dohbee> iirc, there's a signal handler in the qml that just tries to log in when the length == 4, when PIN is used
<tgBot> <stefanomelchior> @TronFortyTwo, Is IT possibile you have to Enable ssh connection from mobile? I mean using android-gadget-tools enable ssh
<tgBot> <dohbee> yes, the qml is under /usr/share/unity8/qml iirc
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @dohbee, thank you!
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> i see that straightforward change from ==4 to ==N would be still a bit stiff, ideally there should be a range, say 4-8 (maybe 10)
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> that would require additional button for user to confirm
<tgBot> <dohbee> there's a button already i think. or well, there's the "enter" key on the OSK.
<tgBot> <dohbee> so just getting rid of the autocomplete would probably be ok
<tgBot> <DanChapman> Would it not also require changes to the setup wizard and system-settings. IIRC it only accepts 4 digits
<tgBot> <dohbee> system-settings yes
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> @DanChapman, the iirc part what is it exactly?
<tgBot> <dohbee> i think setup wizard is just embedding the system-settings bit. but don't recall entirely
<tgBot> <dohbee> the dependency tree for unity8 is kind of weird. like an oroborus
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> and also if i wanted to makenmy own login plugin with a dot jointer code, does the design accomodate adding something extra without having to change other stuff around? ie if the join dotter was used to decrypt actuall passwors and feeding it to thw regular password input...
<tgBot> <dohbee> you mean a dot pattern like android?
<tgBot> <dohbee> no, that would not be simple to do at all really
<tgBot> <dohbee> i'm not sure there's any way to request what types of authentication are supported for a user, from pam, either. the way the PIN vs password stuff works now is a bit of a hack
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> yes exactly like that. i can implement the standalone module but would not know how to incorporate it.
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> preferably with some lower level api, a bit like pam does
<tgBot> <dohbee> well you would have to write a pam module for sure (assuming there isn't one already)
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> if the login screen could call up my module as a separate window full screen, and my window would return callback with password or token or whatever
<tgBot> <dohbee> but there's no sane way to know which UI to present to the user
<tgBot> <KrisJacewicz> ok, sad but i guess i will not bw taking that road then. so perhaps just a qml change to make ==4 into ==10 wouldnsuffice? i just assume that if user punches up the maximum it just uses it other wise he can proceed with a shorter one
<tgBot> <dohbee> well, no. you need to change system-settings at least too, and fix it to allow you to set the pin to that. (though i suppose you could probably cheat and just use passwd on cli to do it for yourself)
<tgBot> <dohbee> in which case, just changing the qml once you find it, should theoretically be enough
<tgBot> <dohbee> if you want something that can be shipped in ubports, it'll need a fair bit more work than that though
<tgBot> <jarlathreidy> @dohbee, Correct.
<tgBot> <dohbee> @jarlathreidy, It sounds like you installed something that can keep the screen on, and you have it running, then. Check the screen timeout setting in system settings too
<tgBot> <jarlathreidy> I have installed a few apps from the open store actually, Iâll try uninstalling them. The settings are correct and most (at least half) of the time the screen does what it should.
<tgBot> <jarlathreidy> But I thought everything was suspended when another app was in focus. This has happened with the dialler in the foreground.
<tgBot> <dohbee> dialer doesn't keep the screen on (unless someone changed that recently)
<tgBot> <dohbee> well, there's a hack allowed for some apps where they can keep the screen on
<tgBot> <jarlathreidy> Okay, Iâll try out your suggestions. Thanks Rodney.
<tgBot> <dohbee> so close all the apps and see if it'll power off the screen
<tgBot> <dohbee> if it still doesn't, open up a terminal or adb/ssh in, and see what's going on with top and ps perhaps
<tgBot> <dohbee> also, disabling twitter/gmail/etc notifications will also greatly improve battery life
<tgBot> <dohbee> if something is screwy with wifi, that can easily kill battery too
<tgBot> <jarlathreidy> Oh, nice - Iâll disable notifications too. I donât like them anyway (on any platform, not just UT).
<tgBot> <jarlathreidy> Screen powers off now. If it happens again Iâll look at running apps and maybe top/adb.
<tgBot> <dohbee> wouldn't be so bad if there was more reasonable push support, but accounts-polld (twitter/gmail notifications) definitely hurts battery life
<tgBot> <dohbee> ok cool. you probably installed something that keeps the screen on and had it running
<tgBot> <dohbee> ie, like unav
<tgBot> <jarlathreidy> Usually I have the same apps running; dekko, browser, podbird, dialler, music, twitter, G+, Calendar and Facebook Basic.
<tgBot> <jarlathreidy> Must be one of those
<tgBot> <jarlathreidy> Oh, and Telegram.
<tgBot> <jarlathreidy> The E4.5 was such a contradiction. It was the least powerful device and yet it was best supported (had fewest issues/bugs). Itâs not as reliable under UBP though.
<tgBot> <jarlathreidy> Maybe the âchampionâ device is different now.
<tgBot> <dohbee> well i don't know if dekko in open store does the "stay alive" thing, but it might. not sure about podbird either. the rest shouldn't do that though
<tgBot> <DanChapman> no dekko doesn't
<tgBot> <dohbee> @jarlathreidy, Well, i don't think it's the device that's the issue here, though i don't expect it is a primary concern for ubports.
<tgBot> <dohbee> ie, this sounds more like there just being no review of apps on open store, so they can all pretty much do whatever
<tgBot> <jarlathreidy> If it was apps, Iâd expect the problem on all devices. But my guess is most users arenât experiencing this.
<tgBot> <dohbee> or maybe they don't care, or don't keep the apps running when not in use, or just don't use the app that's causing the problem
<tgBot> <dohbee> :)
<tgBot> <dohbee> ie, i generally close apps on my phone that i'm not actively using, or pending usage while doing something else
<tgBot> <jarlathreidy> Even with just one app now since reboot (browser) typing URL is painful. Other apps seem okay though. I should check the bug tracker again actually.
<tgBot> <dohbee> i've always found typing a url to be painful on a phone, regardless of the pefromance
<tgBot> <jarlathreidy> Well, thatâs just expected. Waiting 2 - 3 seconds for each character to appear isnât.
<tgBot> <jarlathreidy> I donât see the browser here when I search https://github.com/ubports?utf8=%E2%9C%93&q=&type=&language=
<tgBot> <dohbee> right, that's a performance problem. i'd suggest checking top to see if anything is eating cpu or such. slow typing like that usually signals something else is wrong
<tgBot> <dohbee> https://github.com/ubports/webbrowser-app
<tgBot> <dohbee> but i doubt it's an issue in the browser
<tgBot> <jarlathreidy> The other apps donât have this issue though. And within the browser doesnât have it. Itâs just the URL bar. Seems like a bug.
<tgBot> <dohbee> ah, weird
<tgBot> <DanChapman> hmmm I wonder if the searching of the url suggestions is bogging down the event loop. That's the only thing i can think of that could be a cause for that
<tgBot> <dohbee> it's doing url suggestions?
<tgBot> <DanChapman> (Document) https://irc.ubports.com/CLzCMcEa/file_2537.png
<tgBot> <DanChapman> well search suggestions
<tgBot> <dohbee> oh, since when?
<tgBot> <jarlathreidy> That could fit. The issue mightânt be noticeable on the newer devices.
<tgBot> <dohbee> oh. hmm. can you disable that perhaps?
<tgBot> <dohbee> it looks like it is doing an XMLHttpRequest for that, on the QML side, rather than in C++ in another thread, which would indeed likely slow down the event loop
<tgBot> <jarlathreidy> No, but I can clear the history.
<tgBot> <jarlathreidy> Ah, itâs fast again!
<tgBot> <jarlathreidy> Clearing the history helped, so Danâs suggestion is more likely again.
<tgBot> <dohbee> oh, so it's just history of things you searched for already?
<tgBot> <jarlathreidy> I *thought* the suggestions included history and bookmarks but I havenât really been paying enough attention.
<tgBot> <DanChapman> yeah it must be doing a history search as well
<tgBot> <G1ott1> In order to use libertine is it still mandatory to install Desktop Apps Scope using the Canonical App Store or is it possible to install it via ssh, somehow?
<tgBot> <jarlathreidy> Yes, and bookmarks and google search suggestions.
<tgBot> <dohbee> @G1ott1, if you have the .click package you can side-load it via terminal, yes
<tgBot> <dohbee> is it not in the open store?
<tgBot> <G1ott1> @dohbee, Thanks. Do you possibly know where I can find it?
<tgBot> <dohbee> you can build a click from the code at https://launchpad.net/libertine-scope too
<tgBot> <jarlathreidy> This looks like my wifi issue. Heâs on âbaconâ. I think E4.5 is macko? https://github.com/ubports/ubuntu-touch/issues/219
<tgBot> <jarlathreidy> Should I add that to the report?
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> e4.5 is krillin
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Mako is the Nexus 4
<tgBot> <jarlathreidy> Thanks Dalton
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> I hate codenames
<tgBot> <jarlathreidy> Me too !
<tgBot> <dohbee> would be nice if some more official person could perhaps upload https://uappexplorer.com/app/libertine-scope.ubuntu to the open store too
<tgBot> <G1ott1> @dohbee, OK, thanks.
<tgBot> <G1ott1> @dohbee, Yes indeed :-)
<tgBot> <abdullahcok> Chuwi Hi10 pro (atom iÅlemcili) sadece linux yuklesem, arayÃ¼z iÃ§in gerekli Åeyleri kaldirir mÄ±? Kasma sorunu falan yaÅar mÄ±yÄ±m?
<tgBot> <abdullahcok> Sorry for that.
#ubports 2017-12-02
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> I wonder if someone knows someone who is able to move SRU to xenial-updates from xenial-proposed here
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> (a fix related to halium+utouch+pulseaudio is stuck in -proposed from quite a few days)
<tgBot> <dohbee> stuff doesn't get manually moved from proposed to updates
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> Oh?
<tgBot> <dohbee> once the fixes are validated, there's a 7 day waiting period before migrating
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> 7 days are already over well
<tgBot> <dohbee> bug link?
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pulseaudio/+bug/1728791
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1728791 in pulseaudio (Ubuntu) "[SRU] pulseaudio-droid module crashes on start" [Undecided,Fix committed]
<tgBot> <dohbee> the fix hasn't been verified
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> `verification-done-xenial` no?
<tgBot> <dohbee> the tag is still verification-needed
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> Ah crap
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> pebcak
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> I commented but didn't add tag back
<tgBot> <dohbee> you can maybe ping in #ubuntu-release to see if someone would be willing to manually prod it along
<tgBot> <dohbee> on freenode obviously
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> Okay will do later today
<tgBot> Rene was added by: Rene
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> @renedu Hello and welcome!  I'm part of the UBports welcoming team.    â¦ To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
<tgBot> <kuailexs> If you have time, please help me to see this ï¼https://forums.ubports.com/topic/764/need-help-for-porting-to-xiaomi-4-cancro
<tgBot> <renedu> @Crash_Burn, Thanks ð
<tgBot> <Xorpad> welcome @renedu
<tgBot> <renedu> @Xorpad, Thank you
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> @UniversalSuperBox, Same
<tgBot> <Xorpad> codenames?
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> @abdullahcok, Can I help you find a language focus group? Let me know :)
<tgBot> <kuailexs> please help me to see this ï¼https://forums.ubports.com/topic/764/need-help-for-porting-to-xiaomi-4-cancro
<tgBot> nflhmy was added by: nflhmy
<tgBot> <developerfect> Hello @nflhmy and welcome! I'm not part of the UBports welcoming team. â¦ To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
<tgBot> <Matteo> @Flohack since yesterday evening, when I installed the latest Telegram beta 2.5.1, I had already a couple of time a Telegram and all OS complete freezing, when I was on this supergroup, and I had to reboot....never happened before with the previous versions. I'm on BQ E5.
<tgBot> <Flohack> @Matteo, No idea. Telegram cannot freeze the OS IMO. Can you try to capture a log? Note to not restart telegram, the log history is very short
<tgBot> <Matteo> I mean, the telegram supergroup froze and I couldn't do a thing, neither swiping from the edges nor typing into Telegram window. I only had to long press the button to reboot
<tgBot> <Matteo> Unfortunately I already restarted Telegram
<tgBot> <Matteo> If it will happen again I'll take the log for you
<tgBot> <Matteo> @dohbee, +1
<tgBot> <Flohack> @Matteo, Sound like unity crash. Happens frequently to me since we suspect a memleak somewhere. Didnt you notice, after some days OOM killer is more active, and swap becomes full?
<tgBot> <Flohack> On 1GB devices its annoying. Better now since I use opo or fp2
<tgBot> <Matteo> Mmmh ok, but that's new to me...I know there is a bug causing the OS randomly reboot by itself when I open several windows at the same time, but this is new for me...maybe because I'm on rc channel?
<tgBot> <garrogarri> @Flohack, I also noticed the problem
<tgBot> <garrogarri> And I had the same suspect
<tgBot> <Matteo> @Flohack, How can I check the swap partition full?
<tgBot> <Matteo> Is there a way to flush periodically it?
<tgBot> <Flohack> @Matteo, No. Swap partition full means that there is not enough free RAM. But normally mobile devices have a very small swap partition, and instead Apps get evicted from RAM (OOM killer). Problem is, the UT OOM killer also targets critical OS parts sometimes ;)
<tgBot> <Flohack> So it can happen that for some reason you see a freezing screen, but if you are patient after some minutes you will see unity reloading. Ths is the usual behaviour for out of memory killed unity
<tgBot> <Flohack> Reboots might be connected to that, too. In fact if you look with top or other tools you will see unity taking up 800MB of RAM
<tgBot> <Flohack> which is really hefty on a 1GB device
<tgBot> <Flohack> But normally 3 or 4 apps can be kept open. Now comes the catch: After some days, you will not be able to keep even 2 Apps open in parallel, switch apps will mean you get the waiting time and a reload of the closed app. You can also notice it by getting a blurred "picture" of the last app state
<tgBot> <Flohack> That indicates the App has been forcefully closed due to RAM limitation
<tgBot> <Flohack> But why this changes over time? We dont know. Could be a memleak in QML engine for example
<tgBot> <Flohack> Could be a mistake in an App (like Telegram), causing a memleak
<tgBot> <Flohack> These errors are hard to find. Lets wait for 16.04 and Qt 5.9 to see if it gets better
<tgBot> <Flohack> maybe @alan_griffiths or @dohbee can elaborate on this, too. Its a fundamental problem we need to fix
<tgBot> <Matteo> Yes I understand much better the problem now, thanks for the explanation indeed. Unfortunately, no 16.04 will be available for BQ devices so I think this problem for me will persist. I'm wondering why devices with 1 GB of RAM are so penalized with Ubuntu Touch. Is that a problem of code optimization? I have a 2010 Android smartphone with only 700MB of RAM which still doesn't show any of the suffering BQ phone with 1GB of RAM has.
<tgBot> <Flohack> yes, unity weas not optimized so far. We have the chance to do that however, over time.
<tgBot> <Flohack> Android has much more effort behind to keep things small
<tgBot> <Gleb Lee ð¸ð¨> @wayneoutthere, I would really like if this channel posts even about minor improvements and interesting community hacks. â¦ I.e., about new betas of Telegram app or about our members experiments. I read here about successfull test of ecryptfs, Kris's experiments with desktops apps etc. All of these deserves attention. â¦ And ofc, short summary of UBPorts community updates, not only links. â¦ This could make News Channel more interesting
<tgBot> <Flohack> @Gleb Lee ð¸ð¨, Join the marketing team, then. We lack resources for that
<tgBot> Rawcode was added by: Rawcode
<tgBot> <Rawcode> hi there :)
<tgBot> <Stereofont> @Rawcode, Hello Federico and welcome!  I'm part of the UBports welcoming team.    â¦ To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
<tgBot> <Stereofont> There is also an Italian language group, Federico
<tgBot> <EKorneev> On this page â¦ https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome â¦ Wrong Link to Russian chanel  â¦ t.met  <---  ttt
<tgBot> <EKorneev> https://t.met/UBports_Ru
<tgBot> <Stereofont> @EKorneev, Thanks. We will correct
<tgBot> Christian_Koch_Pasing was added by: Christian_Koch_Pasing
<tgBot> <Xorpad> #welcome @Christian_Koch_Pasing
<tgBot> <Rawcode> guys, can you help me? i'm trying to install ubuntu touch, i'm in bootloader but seems that the program doesn't detect my nexus 5
<tgBot> <Stereofont> @Christian_Koch_Pasing, Hello Christian and welcome!  I'm part of the UBports welcoming team.    â¦ To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
<tgBot> <Stereofont> @Rawcode, Please join the Welcome Room
<tgBot> <Christian_Koch_Pasing> Thanks, I will do that. This group I only see in my Ubuntu-Notebook but not in my BQ-E5 ubports Ubuntu Touch?
<tgBot> <Stereofont> @Christian_Koch_Pasing, You have different telegram versions. OpenStore is not updated yet. Use the github version for your E5
<tgBot> <Christian_Koch_Pasing> OK I will do that.
<tgBot> <Flohack> @Rawcode, See new readme.md about udev rules
<tgBot> <Xorpad> @Flohack, you can download magic-device-tool, and it will most likely work, I've had this issue with a nexus 5 and another guy with a fairphone, and both of us used magic-device-tool successfully
<tgBot> <Xorpad> Oh, there's a fix now @Flohack ?
<tgBot> <Christian_Koch_Pasing> By, I will switch to the german supergroup
<tgBot> <Xorpad> later @Christian_Koch_Pasing
<tgBot> <Flohack> @Xorpad, Well not a fix but a precondition. We cant work around udev blocking access to some devices. Rules need to be set
<tgBot> <Flohack> See ubports-installer github repo, README.md
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I see. Well, as long as there's a solution that works. I know magic-device-tool will need replacing when everything is on halium-7.1
<tgBot> <Xorpad> but that actaully will make installation simpler i do think
<tgBot> <Xorpad> flute is crazyness I think
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I don't really enjoy listening to it so I don't care for playing it
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I have played similar instruments
<tgBot> <Xorpad> oops
<tgBot> <Xorpad> wrong channel
<tgBot> Canyouguesswhoireallyam was added by: Canyouguesswhoireallyam
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> Hello @Canyouguesswhoireallyam and welcome!  I'm part of the UBports welcoming team.    â¦ To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> Nice username ð
<tgBot> <Stereofont> @Crash_Burn, We don't need to guess. We know perfectly well that you are the Archbishop of Canterbury
<tgBot> <Canyouguesswhoireallyam> Thanks, just curious. Regarding ubports or Ubuntu touch as I haven't dived right into it yet and just want a few simple answers, does it offer device encryption and on what level?
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> @Canyouguesswhoireallyam, Yes Ubuntu Touch does now have encryption at the os level, Luks and encryptfs I believe.  The developers are continuing their work on it, but it is available if you have command line skills.  Let me see if I can find more (better) information...
<tgBot> <David_Gamiz_Jimenez> @Flohack guau! You are implemented the views counter in publications for diffusion channels! Thanks!
<tgBot> <Stereofont> Fwd from Dominik: Shortly, but I am busy atm. I will invest time into UT encryption in the near future.
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> I found something too :)
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> Fwd from Dominik: I now have encrypted Documents, Pictures, Download and Videos. With no noticeable performance degregation. 1080p video capture and replay worked as usual.
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> LOL... Lets give a big thanks to Dominik
<tgBot> <Stereofont> Not user friendly. It will also probably mess up updates
<tgBot> <David_Gamiz_Jimenez> One most asked question. If support is possible, what level of complexity or difficulty? Maybe we can make a little microfounding to push some number of big features to native client.
<tgBot> <Stereofont> @David_Gamiz_Jimenez, My understanding is that about 80% there and only modest difficulty. It is about time and resources
<tgBot> <Canyouguesswhoireallyam> Lol thanks Dom. â¦ Thanks for the info Will. â¦ That's good enough I'm guessing I could tweak around with it shortly over the Christmas holidays in my down time. I'll probably stuff up the device but in support of open source development it's well worth a shot and we'll eventually get there...eventually!!! â¦ Which device do you recommend?
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> @Canyouguesswhoireallyam, One of the core devices... like the Nexus 5, Fairphone 2 or Oneplus One.
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> https://devices.ubports.com/#/
<tgBot> <Canyouguesswhoireallyam> Yeah I saw it all, was just curious what you thought personally. But thank you still all points in the right direction.
<tgBot> <Stereofont> Other options are probably only months away and may be quite a lot better.  Right now, most go with Nexus 5
<tgBot> <Canyouguesswhoireallyam> Yeah I think I'll buy a nexus 5 for now and stuff around with it and then look into other devices. Thanks Lionelb
<tgBot> <Stereofont> If OnePlusThree comes on stream soon you will kick yourself for getting a OnePlusOne
<tgBot> <David_Gamiz_Jimenez> @Stereofont, OK, well the mini confound for more people at point time. To complete basic level for client.
<tgBot> <Xorpad> You can never have enough cool phones to mess with
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I have over 35
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> @Xorpad, ð³
<tgBot> <Xorpad> Lol
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I lost count
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I will never run out of stuff to hack
<tgBot> <Xorpad> lol
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> @Crash_Burn, My face actually did that !
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> Lol
<tgBot> <Xorpad> hahaha
<tgBot> <demokrit atomos> @Xorpad, U know under which conditions smartphones are produced right? (I mean you are free to do whatever you want but i cannot see anyone having time to play with that many and i wondered whether you ever considered that aspect of buying so many phones...)
<tgBot> <Xorpad> well, eventually I'll have them all running stuff other than what they were intended. I already made custom roms for most of them, in various states of completness/proper doings
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> @Gleb Lee ð¸ð¨, we agree.  problem is that marketing team doesn't know if something is news or not becuase we (like me) are not very technical.  I'm learning and starting to recognize but if something is news we need it explained to us as news.  You can all help the marketing team by sending messages to me with things you consider 'news' and that community should know.  the small details are always here and people who want small details us
<tgBot> read every post here I find.
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I get them to make stuff for them
<tgBot> <Xorpad> Like, it's what I do to keep busy and I've always got a reason why I need another one
<tgBot> <Stereofont> @Xorpad, It it ends up rescuing old phones rather than recycling that is morally justified I think. Plus your phones would mostly be trashed if you hadn't bought them
<tgBot> <Xorpad> yeah
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I don't waste them, it's my main hobby and I do some other stuff related to it that has in the past lead to nice income
<tgBot> <demokrit atomos> Ok, that's cool then xD
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> @Xorpad, your devices are to you, like what cups of coffee are to me.
<tgBot> <Xorpad> like, I got money for finding 2 vulns in aosp and asking for a bug bounty
<tgBot> <Xorpad> it was nice
<tgBot> <dohbee> @Flohack, there's certainly a lot of optimization that could be done, but basically someone needs to find the bugs, report them, and help get them fixed. if there are leaks in u8, no amount of upgrading the OS or qt5 will fix them.
<tgBot> <dohbee> but there were a lot of changes in the stack we made and landed into the 16.04 ppa too, however they are unfit for "status quo" of ubports
<tgBot> <Xorpad> Awe crap I might have deleted everything I had... I have backups that would be under 30 minutes old but I got to pull them
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I feel like going to sleep and dealing with this tomorrow
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> It already is tomorrow, Will.  :)
<tgBot> <dohbee> @wayneoutthere, It's always tomorrow, somewhere else.
<tgBot> <wayneoutthere> it's definitely tomorrow where will is it was 5am about when he postd it :)
<tgBot> <renedu> Where I can buying a Ubuntu phone?
<tgBot> <Gabigol> Probably on eBay
<tgBot> <renedu> What type best
<tgBot> <Wildnislehrer> My Nexus5 runs fine with UT.
<tgBot> <Wildnislehrer> D821
<tgBot> <renedu> Oh ~show me
<tgBot> <Wildnislehrer> @renedu, Video is coming...
<tgBot> <Wildnislehrer> You have pm
<tgBot> <renedu> What is that?
<tgBot> <Wildnislehrer> What do you mean?
<tgBot> <Wildnislehrer> pm - private message ?
<tgBot> <renedu> Thanks
<tgBot> <Sconio> Big problem after update (number 235) one plus one,
<tgBot> <Stereofont> @Sconio, rc?
<tgBot> <Sconio> Devel
<tgBot> <Flohack> Which problem(s) then?
<tgBot> <Rocco> Hi all... I installed ota2 on my one plus one... yesterday. All was ok. Now when screen is black and press the button to wake it up the phone is blocked... or must wait 20-30 sec or I must reload ubuntu entirely... some ideas? Thanks
<tgBot> <Crash_Burn> Battery>Adjust brightness automatically might be the culprit.  Try to disable that.
<tgBot> <Sconio> Fwd from Rocco: Hi all... I installed ota2 on my one plus one... yesterday. All was ok. Now when screen is black and press the button to wake it up the phone is blocked... or must wait 20-30 sec or I must reload ubuntu entirely... some ideas? Thanks
<tgBot> <Sconio> This
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> The answer is a message above
<tgBot> <Sconio> Black screen 30 sec
<tgBot> <Sconio> Block
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Does it work if you press the button three times?
<tgBot> <Sconio> Comes back when I press several times on power and volume +/-
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> But not the power button three times?
<tgBot> <Sconio> I have the impression that this is a bug due to multiboot, once out of two times there is this bug
<tgBot> <Sconio> Besides, what is the latest "no kexec" patch available for OPO (lineage 14.1)
<tgBot> <Sconio> ??
<tgBot> <malditobastardo> (Photo, 956x1280) https://irc.ubports.com/VoDhSsIu/file_2539.jpg
<tgBot> <malditobastardo> Love UT and N5
<tgBot> <Ern_st> @Sconio, Multirom ? You are good to reinstall the latest version. Updates doesn't work well with multirom
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> Any help got this error while building https://hastebin.com/quhidecowe.vbs
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> @Ern_st
<tgBot> <Ern_st> Halium 5 or 7 ?
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> 7
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> @Ern_st, Any fix ?
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> You aren't giving the whole error
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> That the whole error
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> From failed
<tgBot> <Ern_st> Correct, usually the error happen 15-20 line before.
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> OK wait
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> The error is related to bionic
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> https://hastebin.com/gecemizuya.swift @Ern_st @UniversalSuperBox
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Why are you building as root?
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> It failed without root
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Relocation overload... That's a compiler error
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> @UniversalSuperBox, How to fix
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> If I knew, I would have already said. :P
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> :/
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Something that neither Halium nor UBports have seen before, at least from my chat logs
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> bshah, ever heard of this?
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> `bionic/libc/arch-arm64/syscalls/__exit.S:11: error: relocation overflow in R_AARCH64_CONDBR19 â¦ `and similar errors
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> @UniversalSuperBox, Nope
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> Not before yesterday
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> Wait
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> arm64 is experimental for Mer too, it seems. I found a forum post, but I'll let you find your thing first
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> @UniversalSuperBox, What ?
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> I doubt I can find it here @UniversalSuperBox as it was irc log and I'm on mobile
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Ah, okay.
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> @akshat2K2 maybe this will help: https://together.jolla.com/question/135477/unresolvable-r_aarch64_condbr19-relocation/
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> There isn't much information about an error like this online.
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> Hmm
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> That patxh
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> If it doesn't help any, we might need to wait for Bhushan and his savior IRC logs. Would be a few hours.
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> Ok
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> @akshat2K2 I'll ping you in morning
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> OK sar
<tgBot> petya230 was added by: petya230
<tgBot> <developerfect> Hello @petya230  and welcome!  I'm part of the Ubports Languages team.    â¦ To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
<tgBot> <Rocco> @Crash_Burn, Yes yes yessssss... That resolved my problem. Thanks a lotðð¼ðð¼ðð¼ðð¼ðð¼
<tgBot> <Rawcode> How can I can get notifications from telegram without Ubuntu one?
<tgBot> <Flohack> @Rawcode, Its simple, you cant ^^
<tgBot> <PhoenixLandPirate> Yet
<tgBot> <PhoenixLandPirate> ?
<tgBot> <Xorpad> hi guys
<tgBot> <Xorpad> is there a repository where we unify UT?
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I think things would make more sense if we had a unified build tree
<tgBot> <Flohack> @Xorpad, Erm what exactly could that mean in technical terms? what is not unified?
<tgBot> <Xorpad> Well, like, lineage os has a build tree that can be used to build for any device
<tgBot> <Xorpad> it's all one thing
<tgBot> <Xorpad> for example I have a tree for mako, hammerhead, and bullhead. It can build for all 3
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> I have a tree for bullhead and potter
<tgBot> <Flohack> you mean the device-specific part?
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> 7.1 devices can sit in the same tree
<tgBot> <Flohack> will be a lot of if then else but otherwise ok
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> 5.1 devices can sit in the same tree
<tgBot> <Xorpad> exactly @UniversalSuperBox. We should have a 7.1 tree somewhere public that people can fork and make PR's for new devices
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Um
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> We do
<tgBot> <Xorpad> Last time I looked I didn't see it
<tgBot> <Xorpad> that was over a month ago though
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> That hasn't changed since Halium started
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> http://docs.halium.org/en/latest/porting/get-sources.html
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> You get a whole tree, no?
<tgBot> <Xorpad> Yeah, I know where the docs are
<tgBot> <Xorpad> well, yeah
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I dunno, like I mean a tree on github that people can sync a tree to build their port
<tgBot> <Xorpad> so you just pop in a kernel, device tree, and vendor repos, and mod them to suit the tree
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> That's what you get when you do `repo init url`
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> And then add your manifests
<tgBot> <Flohack> We will not unite 180 repositories in one
<tgBot> <Xorpad> Why not?
<tgBot> <Flohack> where other upstream people constantly make changes
<tgBot> <Flohack> maintenance effort?
<tgBot> <Flohack> those are not our codebase
<tgBot> <Xorpad> yeah but we could have one... I dunno it's not my call
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Not to mention the time it'd take just to do `git status`
<tgBot> <Flohack> we cannot, until we got people maintaining this blod
<tgBot> <Flohack> blob
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Repo and Gerrit were created to solve the problems that one big repository caused
<tgBot> <JBBgameich> I started collecting a few ports here: https://github.com/JBBgameich/halium-devices
<tgBot> <Xorpad> well, it's up to you guys... i put it out there
<tgBot> <Flohack> @JBBgameich, This is not the point, he is talking about the 180 repos that the build tree consists of
<tgBot> <Flohack> the part you get by repo init
<tgBot> <JBBgameich> I thought he wants to add the ported devices to the tree and upload the whole thing in one repo ...?
<tgBot> <Xorpad> @JBBgameich I want to have a tree where ports can benefit from everyone elses work, only having to directly maintain device/kernel/vendor
<tgBot> <Xorpad> then everything people do to the platform, echos to all ports
<tgBot> <Rawcode> How can I install paps from the Ubuntu store? If I click to install nothing appends
<tgBot> <JBBgameich> You can already benedit from the others work in Halium?
<tgBot> <Rawcode> Apps*
<tgBot> <Flohack> @Xorpad, But it does, as we are only using upstreams beside device and kernel part
<tgBot> <Flohack> So if someone makes a pr to an upstream it will sync to your tree as well
<tgBot> <JBBgameich> Only device/vendor/codename and kernel/vendor/codename are not in the official tree, everything else is shared
<tgBot> <Xorpad> well, I dunno, like I said, I trew it out there
<tgBot> <Xorpad> It's not my choice really, all I can do is make stuff and submit it
<tgBot> <Flohack> @Xorpad, Sorry lost in translation maybe
<tgBot> <Xorpad> @Flohack Basically you said you don't want what I think is good, that's fine, I'm free to develop however I want and you can choose to accept the code or not
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I knew when I came here that I'd have to compromise on things
<tgBot> <Flohack> @Xorpad, I dont understand in which part Linegae is different to our manifest.xml
<tgBot> <Xorpad> @Flohack Well, for one thing pulling -b halium-7.1 pulls a lot of stuff that there is better versions of in los but it pulls from aosp
<tgBot> <Gabigol> Anyone has the click file from Dekko (the one at UBuntu Store)? If yes, share it please :)
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I changed like 75% of the repositories in manifest.xml
<tgBot> <Flohack> @Xorpad, yeah then make a PR for it, makes sense maybe
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I will once I get everything working
<tgBot> <Flohack> I was thinking you want us to fork 180 repos
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I don't feel like making PRs for things that aren't proven
<tgBot> <Xorpad> @Flohack no, I just want to have a lineage style system where you can breakfast any device that's supported
<tgBot> <Xorpad> and it will sync device specific stuff when you breakfast the device
<tgBot> <Xorpad> so that the platform is all the same across all devices even though kernel and system
<tgBot> <Xorpad> are different
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I dunno... I am doing it for myself so I can work on multiple ports
<tgBot> <Xorpad> but I just started doing it last night
<tgBot> <Flohack> Well currently we are in the same position like you, we dont want to publish unproven stuff. So, no Halium device is usable with UT so far. So not much sense to publish it now
<tgBot> <Xorpad> @Flohack maybe a organization specific unlisted repository?
<tgBot> <Xorpad> because right now a bunch of us all are all doing stuff that could benefit from eachothers work
<tgBot> <Xorpad> we could host it invite only on gitlab.com, cause you can make free repositories with large files like the prebuilts, without a paid account on gitlab
<tgBot> <Cesar_Herrera> (Document) https://irc.ubports.com/hHrF6abL/file_2540.click
<tgBot> <Gabigol> @Cesar_Herrera, Big Thanks!! ;)
<tgBot> <Rawcode> Where did you found the click file of the ubuntu store?
<tgBot> <Flohack> @Xorpad, Ok maybe if you draw the structure and the content of this repo I will understand. sorry its late here maybe Im too stupid
<tgBot> <Cesar_Herrera> I made it from app installed. I'll send a link to do it.
<tgBot> <Xorpad> @Flohack I will publish it once I finish constructing the tree
<tgBot> <Flohack> oki
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I'm just dealing with some issues right now with my setup
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I had it done last night, then I erased it all lol
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I'll post it when it's done, and people can use it, or make their own... it's up to them
<tgBot> <Cesar_Herrera> https://askubuntu.com/questions/784372/how-can-i-make-a-click-file-from-an-installed-app/784374#784374
<tgBot> <Rawcode> @Cesar_Herrera, But how can I install paps from the ubuntu store?
<tgBot> <Rawcode> Apps*
<tgBot> <Cesar_Herrera> You intall the app from Ubuntu store.
<tgBot> <Cesar_Herrera> Or OpenStore.
<tgBot> <Rawcode> If I click to install, nothing  appends in Ubuntu store. Openstore works well
<tgBot> <Cesar_Herrera> I'll see.
<tgBot> <Rawcode> Thanks
<tgBot> <Cesar_Herrera> For me Ubuntu Store works ok.
<tgBot> <Wildnislehrer> @Cesar_Herrera, What is the difference with dekko from ubuntustore?
<tgBot> <Cesar_Herrera> Dekko from Ubuntu Store is now the correct version. Dekko2 is beta.
<tgBot> <Cesar_Herrera> @Rawcode, To install from UbuntuOne you need an account in Ubuntu One.
<tgBot> <Cesar_Herrera> *UbuntuStore
<tgBot> <Rocco> I installed dekko 2. I have an issue to configure an account  because the keyboard don't shows
<tgBot> <Cesar_Herrera> Dere is a bug. Open another app a d click the keyboard. Then if you go to dekko the keybard appears.
<tgBot> <Cesar_Herrera> @Rocco, There is a bug. Open another app and click the keyboard. Then if you go to dekko2 the keybard appears.
<tgBot> <Cesar_Herrera> @Rocco, There is a bug. Open another app and click the keyboard. Then if you go to dekko2 the keybard appears.
<tgBot> <Seumas> We understand that Ubports provides up to date security for things such as the default web browser. But how does this extend to the Firefox browser under Libertine?
#ubports 2017-12-03
<tgBot> <Xorpad> If there are known vulnerabilities they will be patched up-stream, so on any of the 3 devices currently recieving builds you can expect up-to-date security patches within a reasonable amount of time
<tgBot> <Xorpad> Like, it all depends who is maintaing what and I'm not sure about that, but the 3 official devices get almost daily sometimes more updates per day
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I got my S7
<tgBot> <Flohack> @Seumas, How can we be responsible for 3rd party SW
<tgBot> <Flohack> I mean it depends from which package you install Firefox, if it is distro, then the distro will manage security. If its website download you need to do it yourself. In the distro case we can only help if it affects a package what we are installing via our root fs. Whats inside the libertine container is probably not coming from our build server
<tgBot> Tina119 was added by: Tina119
<tgBot> <peternerlich> Hello @Tina119 and welcome! I'm part of the UBports welcoming team. â¦ To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
<tgBot> <peternerlich> Also, you might be repelled by the amount of messages going through our groups at times, but still interested to stay up to date about our project. In this case, lucky you, there's a brand new News Channel! @ubports_news
<tgBot> <Tina119> @peternerlich, Sorry, I made a mistake
<tgBot> <peternerlich> @Tina119, Hey, no problem. Can I help you with something or did you just accidently join the wrong group?
<tgBot> <Canyouguesswhoireallyam> Hi, â¦ Curious if anyone also has any experience with plasma mobile seeing as its open source. I just saw it was available so if anyone knows if it's similar to ubports I'm keen to know. Thanks.
<tgBot> <Tina119> @peternerlich, Thanks,nothing right now,if I need,letâs you know....yes.... I did join other wrong group....and I deleted all
<tgBot> <Tina119> @peternerlich, No,no..... I doesnât repelled any messages,I can studying better
<tgBot> <peternerlich> @Tina119, If you don't mind, I would like to have a short chat with you, but we would better do that over in the welcome room than in the supergroup: https://t.me/joinchat/Baj4lhJ4XRotoeGk1QxuRQ
<tgBot> <Tina119> @peternerlich, Sure
<tgBot> <dohbee> @Xorpad, Already works that way
<tgBot> <dohbee> @Rawcode, Sign in to u1 and tap install, assuming server is still up
<tgBot> <Xorpad> @JBBgameich cool, well I already have my repo manifests set up to the way I want them, then I'm gonna push the whole tree to gitlab including prebuilts
<tgBot> <Xorpad> and .repo sanatized
<tgBot> <Xorpad> .repo will be empty except for the manifests
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> @Xorpad, You don't need to push whole tree.. you always push individual repos..
<tgBot> <Xorpad> @bhushanshah yeah, i realize that. I'm making a repo server though for the tree, hoping other will hop on the bandwagon... I just am doing some stuff first, that's the next step
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> I... don't think that's how repo works?
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Doesn't it hold all of the git repositories?
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> What you are trying to do is broken workflow well... I've explained it thousand times and not sure why I bother to tell one more time if you don't want to listen
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> *sigh*
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> I guess we wait and see what actually comes of it?
<tgBot> <Xorpad> @bhushanshah and I got what you said... but when I did what   I learned from what you said, I found the branchs in question mostly in horrible shape
<tgBot> <Xorpad> Like, bullhead kernel was a real mess of bad stuff
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> What specifically was changed?
<tgBot> <Xorpad> @UniversalSuperBox in my copy or in the ones I didn't like?
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> What did you change to make it not 'bad stuff'?
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> I see NO changes in bullhead halium kernel in whole month so I am not sure what you are talking about
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I started with cm-14.1 sources instead of halium forks
<tgBot> <Xorpad> because I haven't pushed them
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Right, as we do
<tgBot> <Xorpad> and it didn't take very many anyways
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> @Xorpad, Why? When we already have a fork?
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> If you're trying to reduce the number of projects, that would be okay if you can be sure that no device touches the removed ones
<tgBot> <Xorpad> because when I got the fork you told me to, after you educated me on git and branches and stuff, I was very dis-satisfied with the differences and issues I found
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> The Halium forks of the projects are there because the ones from cm don't work
<tgBot> <Xorpad> There was a ton of warnings and when I started investigating them I saw a lot of bad coding practices
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I am not amazing, I'm really not, but I don't like that way that stuff was coded and I think I can do better
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> And that wasn't the case in Lineage?
<tgBot> <Xorpad> lineage kernels are good, but there is some stuff you have to change in the kernel defconfig to comply with halium/hybris-boot specs that open up bugs/missing code in stuff that was never intended to be configuered the way the defconfig is, so I had to merge in a lot of code from other linux kernel forks and mainline linux to get it to compile
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Right... like the Halium fork
<tgBot> <Xorpad> yeah, i'm trying to make it a halium compatible thing
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I'm trying to do it halium/ubports way as much as possible while still doing stuff the way I think is the best
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I want my work to be officially adopted, so I'm trying to stay in line as much as possible with what you guys are doing
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Honesly, I can't say whether it is or not
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Since we can't see it
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Also, you said that you got DRM running the other day? Did you hack on Freedreno for a few eons or what?
<tgBot> <Xorpad> Well once I finish what I'm doing now(an experiment that's been going on 7 hours with no end in sight about building a halium 7.1 tree with modified repos in .repo manifests, hoping to get a good base
<tgBot> <Xorpad> no I didn't get DRM running, I got tests on the drm I compiled working
<tgBot> <Xorpad> DRM is still not done
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> I honestly don't know what you're doing, and I'm going to hope for the best
<tgBot> <Xorpad> Well, I didn't get DRM running, but I'm planning on it, so getting DRM components to compile and pass unit tests is something I've put time into
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> There are no drivers for that GPU, though
<tgBot> <Xorpad> Well, there's the driver blobs
<tgBot> <Xorpad> they can be disassembled
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> I don't know if we could include that without a licensing nightmare on our hands
<tgBot> <Xorpad> that's really something for later i just started doing it on a tangen t and tucked it away
<tgBot> <Xorpad> @UniversalSuperBox Oh
<tgBot> <Xorpad> Well, I will make it happen in the HAL then
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I will not RE the drivers, I will use the android blobs linked to the kernel
<tgBot> <Xorpad> the kernel will call stuff to the drivers in a way that works with the the HAL
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> I don't understand that sentence and I don't know if it makes sense, so I guess we wait to see it working.
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> You're talking about doing it without the Android container, then
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Which hasn't been tried anywhere ever
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I've done it
<tgBot> <Xorpad> With 14.4 mainline linux kernel on nexus 5
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I was able to link against drivers of every version from 4.4-7.1.2
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> I suppose we wait and see, then...
<tgBot> <Xorpad> It took weeks of obsessing and needs more work
<tgBot> <Xorpad> @UniversalSuperBox I will still use the container
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> A portable, open source version of that could completely change the landscape of non-Android ROMs. And Android ones too. So... forgive my skepticism
<tgBot> <Xorpad> but the container will have a way for the kernel to interact with the hardware
<tgBot> <Xorpad> well that's why I did it
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> We'll be here when it's ready
<tgBot> <Xorpad> Okay
<tgBot> <Xorpad> Well that's a different project
<tgBot> <Xorpad> That's proprietary
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I'd rather port UT
<tgBot> <Xorpad> so I'll do it mostly your way with some stuff I think should be done
<tgBot> <Xorpad> anyways, I gotta do something... I'll be back in like 15-20 mins I think. You'll see when I get some serious progress made, because so far all i've done is learned a fair bit, a large portion of what I need to know about the code, how you guys do stuff, what I think should be done, and how/what I have to do. but I'm feeling really good about this experiment I'm doing and once I get it done and compiling I'm gonna make a gerrit server to host a repo r
<tgBot> and hopefully you guys will jump in and jmake alternate branches that use the code of mine I think you want to, while avoiding stuff you prefer to do your way
<tgBot> <Xorpad> like I said when I came here, I'll code the stuff I want and you can accept it or not
<tgBot> <Xorpad> :D
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> You're looking for Gerrit?
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I have a guide bookmarked on how to set it up, looks pretty comprehensive
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Becuse, uh... http://review.ubports.com/
<tgBot> <Xorpad> Oh
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> We don't use it much
<tgBot> <Xorpad> well, can I just make an account and use it?
<tgBot> <Xorpad> or should I make my own
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Most fixes don't require the sweeping changes between tons of repositories that AOSP does
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> You can log in with GitHub, I think
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I see
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Question is... @bhushanshah is Gerrit fully set up for Halium-7.1?
<tgBot> <Xorpad> Okay, I'll do that, but I'm also gonna make one and use to back up stuff
<tgBot> <Xorpad> anyways i gotta go, be back soon
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Oh, also. We like small PRs anyway. They're easier to test for. So that's another reason we prefer GitHub single-repositories PRs over Gerrit
<tgBot> <Xorpad> @UniversalSuperBox okay
<tgBot> <Xorpad> well when I do something that I consider more than a hackish exeriment to try different ways of things, and write [rpoper code meant for production builds, I will make github repos of everything then
<tgBot> <Xorpad> like right now all the code I wrote needs to be put it the right files, there's some things i'm going to need to test when I get to a point where i can,and I'm sure I'll find problems
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> @UniversalSuperBox, Gerrit is not setup precisely due to reasons you mentioned in 2nd message
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I hope when I make some real progress and show you guys that you'll like it
<tgBot> <Xorpad> but i'm not at the real progress stage i'm at the hacking stage
<tgBot> <Xorpad> just messing around, tryng things, constantly starting over to do something a better way
<tgBot> <Xorpad> like I've got backups of most of the build trees i deleted, but as of yesterday morning I started over to re-do things better, and it's like the 7th or 8th time i've started over
<tgBot> <Xorpad> I have very high standards for myself, it has to be the best way and if I think of something that makes me have to rewind back it time, i'm gonna do it to make a better product
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> @bhushanshah, Sur !-!
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> U didn't ping me;-;
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> @akshat2K2 Have you tried what was suggested in the forum post?
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> Which
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> @UniversalSuperBox, This didn't work BTW it was already present
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> @UniversalSuperBox, .
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> @akshat2K2, .
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> First of all I wonder if your broken build environment is causing this... (you have run some builds as root user)
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> hmm
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> Without root it doesn't start
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> It says permission denied and Bla bla bla â¦ .
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> well
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> you would want to fix permissions then and not start it as root to mess permissions again
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> fix cause not symptoms
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> Ok
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> https://hastebin.com/kebuforuho.sql
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> This is what I get
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> @bhushanshah
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> Essentially what you want to do is either a) remove whole of out folder or chown -R <yourusername>:<yourgroup> $OUT
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> @bhushanshah, What's group ?
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> id command would tell you what's your user's group name
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> or lazy method is, run ls -l  â¦ ```drwxr-xr-x 3 bshah users 4096 Dec  3 11:15```here users is group
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> (Photo, 1280x128) https://irc.ubports.com/w8u7CFkd/file_2542.jpg
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> @bhushanshah
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> what did I tell? what did you do? :P
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> @bhushanshah, .
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> I did this
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> No you didn't
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> Read your command
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> (Photo, 1280x172) https://irc.ubports.com/RiHPNzAG/file_2544.jpg
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> are you running this command from android build env?
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> i.e where you have run breakfast and lunch commands?
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> @bhushanshah, Here only
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> well, in that case maybe instead of running it with $OUT, just specify path of $OUT folder
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> Ok
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> Chown done successfully but got this error https://hastebin.com/imuwuroton.tex
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> ;-;
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> well
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> fix permission for directory it says
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> Ok
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> Same error
<tgBot> <Rocco> @Cesar_Herrera, Yes... i discovered. Thanks
<tgBot> <petya230> Hi! â¦ Ubuntu touch is 64 bit too?
<tgBot> <Flohack> @petya230, Not now, we do not have a working port for arm64
<tgBot> <petya230> Soo â¦ I cant make ub to p9 lite? :(
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> Well there is armhf rootfs which would work just fine or arm64 device
<tgBot> Jonasz was added by: Jonasz
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> @Flohack, Crap
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> ;-;
<tgBot> <Stereofont> @Jonasz, Hello Jonasz and welcome!  I'm part of the UBports welcoming team.    â¦ To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
<tgBot> <petya230> I will never have ub on my phone :(
<tgBot> <Stereofont> @petya230, Why is that?
<tgBot> <Stereofont> @akshat2K2, Please be a little more polite
<tgBot> <developerfect> We will never have ub on arm64 phone ð¢
<tgBot> <JBBgameich> Why not, the armhf rootfs works on arm64 too
<tgBot> <Stereofont> Florian said that we do not have a port now. Since 64bit is the new normal, that will obviously have to change at some point. It just won't be immediate
<tgBot> <anpok> well do we gain something from arm64 applications?
<tgBot> <anpok> .. other than losing memory..
<tgBot> <anpok> there will be a time when convergent workloads require 64bit..
<tgBot> <anpok> but not with this hardware generation
<tgBot> <Stereofont> @petya230, Ah I see. The device which doesn't look even slightly like an iPhone ð. Well, in general, target devices have Qualcomm processors so I would say that the chances are really very low for your phone. Sorry but each device requires a lot of work
<tgBot> <dohbee> @developerfect, We shipped a retail armv8 phone with ubuntu
<tgBot> <dohbee> aarch64 kernel/Android, armhf rootfs
<tgBot> <arudy> FYI :)    â¦ (call for booth/talk not yet open)
<tgBot> <arudy> Fwd from sergiqp: Ubucon Europe 2018: https://community.ubuntu.com/t/ubucon-europe-2018/2467
<tgBot> <dohbee> @anpok, Depends on the application really. Browser doesn't buy much. Image processing has benefits though
<tgBot> <sopernam> hi
<tgBot> <sopernam> can you port xperia z5?
<tgBot> <fronCode> Hello, is it possible to port UT to MediaTek processor? Device: nikel
<tgBot> <Stereofont> @fronCode, It has been done with Mediatek devices in the past but they are very closed proprietary. Qualcomm is easier to deal with, so will almost always be preferred
<tgBot> <Stereofont> @sopernam, âCan it be portedâ would be a better question. Porting is slow and difficult. There is no team looking out for opportunities. If someone decides to take a lead on the Z5 maybe it can happen but they would have to find new resources from somewhere
<tgBot> <fronCode> @Stereofont, Ok, thanks..
<tgBot> <Stereofont> https://docs.halium.org/en/latest/supplementary/devices/yuga.html. not Z5 though
<tgBot> <JBBgameich> The Z Tablet is also working already
<tgBot> <Stereofont> @JBBgameich, There may be some common features - only maybe - but if that gives a 20% start, that is much better than 0%
<tgBot> <milkor73> @Rawcode, This is strange Federico, it should works
<tgBot> <matv1> who has a working sync going between a Nexcloud Calendar and the calendar app?
<tgBot> <matv1> I am told it should work but i am seeing weird behaviour
<tgBot> <matv1> I am on 15.04/devel btw
<tgBot> <matv1> when i create an NC account in online-accounts, it seems to work because the accounts get created and the calendar gives me the syncing-popup
<tgBot> <matv1> it doesnt however show me the available calendars
<tgBot> <matv1> also, which is even weirder, Serverside, Nextcloud simply shows a falied login
<tgBot> <matv1> i would appreciate any guidance on how to troubleshoot
<tgBot> <anpok> @Stereofont, working on that phone right now
<tgBot> <anpok> there are official github repositories from sony.. but I did not come very far with those.. eventually the result hat the same short comings as the one that was done about a year ago  no usb charging no wifi .. no .. alot of things
<tgBot> <anpok> but there is now also a lineage OS port to base on..
<tgBot> <maharudra108> Can Ubuntu touch be ported for mtk 32 bit?
<tgBot> <maharudra108> Or it need 64 bit device
<tgBot> <dohbee> it doesn't matter if 32 or 64
<tgBot> <dohbee> basically, if there's a lineageos port, it should be possible to port ubuntu
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> Not able to build for 64 bit
<tgBot> <dohbee> well, your having issues building on one device doesn't mean others will have the same issues for other devices
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> They said its not compatible for arm64 yet
<tgBot> <dohbee> there were 3 64-bit retail devices that shipped
<tgBot> <dohbee> the userspace is not 64-bit
<tgBot> <anpok> nobody builds that frequently
<tgBot> <dohbee> but there are 64-bit kernel devices already
<tgBot> <anpok> but I got very far building 64 bit android system image..
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> So
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> Can u help?
<tgBot> <sopernam> @Stereofont, Can it be ported
<tgBot> <dohbee> no. i don't know enough the technical details of porting, and i don't have whatever device you have
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> @akshat2K2, @anpok got this error
<tgBot> <maharudra108> @dohbee, I hv all custom roms even custom kernel
<tgBot> <dohbee> @akshat2K2 are you trying to build on ubuntu 18.04, or is the device name "bionic" ?
<tgBot> <anpok> @akshat2K2, never had that error .. how is your repo setup?
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> @dohbee, Ubuntu 16.04 LTS , device name is land
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> @bhushanshah I tried without root got same error.
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> I think about this error what needs to be done is somehow busybox is not happy with arm64 bionic, and possibly busybox can/should be forced to build for armhf and it may work
<tgBot> <dohbee> oh, bionic is the name of the libc
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> @dohbee, Yes
<tgBot> <dohbee> how obvious ð
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> :P
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> @bhushanshah, How can it be done?
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> in all fairness bionic existed before ubuntu named it's release bionic :P
<tgBot> <dohbee> also the name of the iphone x a11 cpu
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> @akshat2K2, I've no idea first hand.. sorry
<tgBot> <dohbee> @bhushanshah, so did "bionic woman"
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> @bhushanshah, OK
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> So I think I may need to drop the project
<tgBot> <anpok> I think by default on a 64bit build everything is built with the primary architecture
<tgBot> <anpok> and specific parts are built with both
<tgBot> <dohbee> https://stackoverflow.com/questions/38570495/aarch64-relocation-prefixes#38608738
<tgBot> <anpok> you would have to look in other mk files how something like that is configured..
<tgBot> <bhushanshah> https://source.android.com/setup/64-bit-builds#module_definition_in_android_mk <- you can try to define variable mentioned here in external/busybox possibly
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> @bhushanshah, Which one should I write
<tgBot> <Ern_st> @matv1, Connect to your phone and right before opening an window to create a nextcloud account, lunch this in a terminal : â¦ export OAU_LOGGING_LEVEL=2 â¦ export OAU_DAEMON_TIMEOUT=9999 â¦ online-accounts-service â¦ it will spit the log on the phone side.  â¦ In the mean time look in nextcloud database, if you have a lot of devices connected to your account, like me, you may face another problem.... :
<tgBot> https://help.nextcloud.com/t/solved-bruteforce-detection-blocking-my-ip-but-theres-no-oc-bruteforce-attempts-database/7652/3
<tgBot> <matv1> I had already disabled the bruteforce detection as it give me problems right from the start
<tgBot> <matv1> @Ern_st, i will try and raise the log level and see what gives. Thanks!
<tgBot> <Ern_st> for the calendar log look also in the sync-monitor.log and calendar log.
<tgBot> <matv1> do you know what the path is for those ?
<tgBot> <Ern_st> should be .cache/upstart. or you can do a find ./ -iname "*sync*" | grep log
<tgBot> <Ern_st> look also with the log app in the appstore
<tgBot> <matv1> oh right. good tip :)
<tgBot> <Gleb Lee ð¸ð¨> @wayneoutthere, Good proposal! Despite bad english I'll try to help. Thanks!
<tgBot> <matv1> @Ern_st hey Kevin, I got some logs but cant really tell whats actually causing the issue. Would you want to take a look?
<tgBot> <matv1> i have some paste-bin exports. I did ofcource rename all the urls en credentials.
<tgBot> <matv1> https://pastebin.com/B5BQH34z
<tgBot> <matv1> https://pastebin.com/6JexbBDL
<tgBot> malamutegecko was added by: malamutegecko
<tgBot> <peternerlich> Hello @malamutegecko and welcome! I'm part of the UBports welcoming team. â¦ To help you get started, please take a look right away at our newcomers welcome page (https://ubports.com/page/telegram-welcome) and thanks again for joining us! :)
<tgBot> <peternerlich> Also, you might be repelled by the amount of messages going through our groups at times, but still interested to stay up to date about our project. In this case, lucky you, there's a brand new News Channel! @ubports_news
<tgBot> <Ern_st> @matv1 What version of Nextcloud are you using ?  Does the caldav account with the calendar was working previously ?
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> https://hastebin.com/kihozohuhu.nginx
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> new error
<tgBot> <dohbee> the first three lines show exactly where the problem lies
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> need to define them?
<tgBot> <delijati> "
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> can get how to solve them
<tgBot> <Walid> @mariogrip hi mario i want start port new device (medium range), but i can't make decision between Mot G 5 (version 3G fingerprint snapdragon cpu) and moto E plus (version 3G fingerprint mediatek cpu),
<tgBot> <vanyasem> @Walid, your can't port to a mediatek device period.
<tgBot> <vanyasem> does that help to make a decision?
<tgBot> <Walid> but BQ is mediatek right ?
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> The old ones are
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> https://hastebin.com/elariniqah.tex
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> We aren't trying to port to those
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> solved that bionic shig
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> @akshat2K2, got this
<tgBot> <Walid> i will start next week port , i think my choice will Moto G 5
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> @akshat2K2, any idea?
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> That error is telling you the problem exactly.
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> `Makefile:675: Cannot use CONFIG_CC_STACKPROTECTOR_STRONG: -fstack-protector-strong not supported by compiler`
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> so need to use other gcc
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Or disable the config
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> from kernel makefile right?
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> I find it more likely that it's in the defconfig
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> hmm
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> its not in deconfig
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> fixed
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> now whats the error in this https://hastebin.com/boloyamuli.tex
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Makefile:1486: *** extraneous 'endif'.  Stop.
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> You've removed an `ifdev` or `if` but not the matching `endif`
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> hmm
<tgBot> <Flohack> @Walid, BQ made a cooperation with Mediatek to get information for porting, which we cannot get. Their tree is not public
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> Fwd from akshat2K2: https://hastebin.com/xexezovabu.tex
<tgBot> <dohbee> @Flohack, The trees for the ubuntu retail devices are on github afaik
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> @akshat2K2, `aarch64-linux-androidkernel-gcc: error: unrecognized command line option '-implicit-function-declaration'`
<tgBot> <dohbee> @vanyasem, there are lineageos images for some mtk devices, so that's not entirely true
<tgBot> <Flohack> @dohbee, Maybe only kernle? Fact is, we did not get any working port mor modification done for them
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> @UniversalSuperBox, i dont have any idea about it
<tgBot> <Flohack> @dohbee, But with "unofficial" sources
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Something tells me that your device expects newer gcc somehow
<tgBot> <Flohack> We cannot go ways that are not backed by legal. We are going to be a foundation, so we are a legal entity and we do not want any legal battle with Mtk
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> @UniversalSuperBox, i have 4.9
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> It's using the one build into the tree
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> ya
<tgBot> <akshat2K2> what to do then
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> @bhushanshah have you ever seen compiler errors on this scale? It seems really likely it's our gcc, but... doesn't it come straight from AOSP?
<tgBot> <matv1> @Ern_st, I have Nextcloud 12. I sync the calendar to android and desktop apps and all works fine. its just the sync to UT calendar which doesnt work.
<tgBot> <anpok> @Walid, some are some are not... they also did some qualcom based phones
<tgBot> <Ern_st> @matv1, did you try with the caldav account ? is your nextcloud server under https ?
<tgBot> <matv1> i did try the caldav account as well. Also I tried both http and https. Makes no difference
<tgBot> <matv1> So you have no issues with NC Calendar sync on UT ?
<tgBot> <Ern_st> So all fail, correct ?
<tgBot> <matv1> yes
<tgBot> <Ern_st> Yep no problem with my Nextcloud serverS
<tgBot> <Ern_st> Is your ssl certification selfsigned ?
<tgBot> <matv1> nope its a letsencrypt one
<tgBot> <Wildnislehrer> How can i detect which applications consumed most power on UT? Nexus 5 Battery emtied within 5-7 ours without intensive usage. Wifi and BT are off outdoors.
<tgBot> <dohbee> i think there aren't any per-app battery metrics. probably something keeping screen on or keeping device from going into deep sleep, and you'll have to debug by examining syslog and checking in top for example to see if something is constantly eating cpu
<tgBot> <matv1> @Ern_st, But as I said, I also tried on a http connection and that fails too
<tgBot> <Ern_st> @matv1 do you have access with the browser to the webinterface ?
<tgBot> <matv1> Yes
<tgBot> <Wildnislehrer> @dohbee, Thanks. I will check this.
<tgBot> <Ern_st> @matv1 Would it be possible for you to create me a dummy acocunt of your server ?
<tgBot> <matv1> sure
<tgBot> <matv1> can I pm the credentials to you?
<tgBot> <Ern_st> Of course ^^
<tgBot> <matv1> ok hang on a minute
<tgBot> <matv1> and btw thanks very much again for thinking along here!
<tgBot> <Ern_st> no prob, do you have you root partition in rw ?
<tgBot> <matv1> no
<tgBot> <Flohack> @anpok, From last year on BQ uses only Qualcomm chipsets.
<tgBot> <Flohack> Thats the good news, we will eventually have ports for their newer stuff
<tgBot> <mimecar> Mediatek is a problem
<tgBot> <mimecar> sadly, Ubuntu Touch devices from bq use it...
<tgBot> <Flohack> @mimecar, yes but only the old ones. And tbh the 1GB E phones are not the daily drivers you want forever ^^
<tgBot> <mariogrip> (Sticker, 512x372) https://irc.ubports.com/V73LtUuk/file_2546
<tgBot> <vanyasem> hey @mariogrip
<tgBot> <vanyasem> how're you doing
<tgBot> <peternerlich> niccce
<tgBot> <Ern_st> Do you know how the DAV calendars are discovered by the sync-monitor app ?
<tgBot> joshumax was added by: joshumax
<tgBot> <joshumax> Hey all, Halium project member here :) Haven't been around ubports for a little while but it looks like the community effort is coming along quite nicely :)
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> â¤ï¸
<tgBot> <joshumax> Any need for maintainers for mako?
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Right now we aren't dealing with Mako at all under our own HAL
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> We just used Canonical's
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> So if you wanted to do that port... I think @anpok had started it. Are the sources somewhere, Andreas?
<tgBot> <joshumax> @UniversalSuperBox That's what I picked up from the device status â I'd be happy to do the port since I've kinda been phasing off of Linux kernel work
<tgBot> <joshumax> (For a job that is, not as a hobby)
<tgBot> <joshumax> I've been playing around with the N4 for a while and even got iOS working on it (although never completely got an accelerated graphics driver for XNU finished)
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> That sounds... ridiculous
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> In the best way
<tgBot> <vanyasem> @joshumax, videos/screenshots please?
<tgBot> <vanyasem> lol
<tgBot> <joshumax> @UniversalSuperBox It was done one a $5 bet XD
<tgBot> <joshumax> I'll pull some up when I get home but don't expect much more than a basic framebuffer that says welcome to Darwin :P
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> So you got Darwin working, not iOS. :P
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Technically correct is the best kind of correct, though
<tgBot> <joshumax> @UniversalSuperBox iOS in the sense that I could load an unmodified iOS rootfs :P
<tgBot> <joshumax> If I just were to bother to make a decent graphics stack I could probably get the UI bits to work
<tgBot> <joshumax> If you're in for something funny there was always this a few years back:
<tgBot> <anpok> @UniversalSuperBox, yes for 5.1 the google_msm kerne is being used.
<tgBot> <joshumax> https://www.androidheadlines.com/2015/06/android-ported-ti-nspire-cx-calculator.html
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Oh dear
<tgBot> <joshumax> @anpok, Thanks for the info! :)
<tgBot> <joshumax> And yeah... Not sure what I was aiming for there with that port
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> @anpok, your device tree isn't on GitHub at all?
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> I remember there was some considerable progress there?
<tgBot> <joshumax> So what major changes have happened wit hubports/halium over the last couple months? Do the newest images use halium as a base?
<tgBot> <joshumax> I heard some talk about that on the Halium channel a little while back
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> The Xenial images can use Halium, but they aren't production-ready yet
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Luckily a non-CAF device has very few problems running the images
<tgBot> <Lyokanthrope> The Nexus 6 seemed to hate mir
<tgBot> <joshumax> So for bringing mako up under your HAL should work be focused on using a halium base?
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Yep. It's working on the old one for now.
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> @Lyokanthrope, I don't know where that left off, sorry
<tgBot> <joshumax> @UniversalSuperBox, Gotcha!
<tgBot> <Lyokanthrope> @UniversalSuperBox, Unity 8 didn't want to load, couldn't use any of the mir tests
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> Oh right, and I said we could take a look but you'd moved on to Mer
<tgBot> <UniversalSuperBox> I member now
<tgBot> <Lyokanthrope> Yeah
<tgBot> <Lyokanthrope> I haven't touched it for a couple weeks though
<tgBot> <Lyokanthrope> Been way too busy /tired
