#ubuntustudio-devel 2010-11-29
<TheMuso> ScottL: I see nobody has sponsored the studio meta upload, so I'll make sure to take a look today some times.
<TheMuso> time
<ScottL> TheMuso, thank you!  that would be fantastic, please let me know if there is anything i can assist you with
<TheMuso> Sure.
<paultag> yo there ScottL 
<ScottL> hi paultag :)
<paultag> :)
<TheMuso> ScottL: THis diff for the studio has a few things. I'll update it, show you the corrected diff, and explain what the problems were.
<ScottL> TheMuso, thank you, i look forward to understanding better
<TheMuso> No problem.
<TheMuso> ScottL: http://paste.ubuntu.com/537735/ is the diff, with some corrections.
<TheMuso> I am going to upload now so we can get it in by Alpha 1.
<ScottL> TheMuso, holy smokes, that is one big diff!  i'll try to explore it tomorrow and during the week
<TheMuso> ScottL: Right, you can ignore all the *-amd64/i386/armel/powerpc stuff
<TheMuso> I should have filtered that actually. Let me do that now.
<holstein> paultag: im around now
<holstein> ScottL: youll be able to facilitate the meeting right?
<holstein> tuesday?
<paultag> holstein, what's up
<paultag> :)
<holstein> not much
<holstein> you mind if a /q you for a sec?
<paultag> holstein, go for it
<TheMuso> ScottL: http://paste.ubuntu.com/537749/ is the filtered diff.
<ScottL> holstein, i thought the meeting was on wednesday for us, at 7:00 am?
<ScottL> but i'll check the time again later this morning
<ScottL> this week will be very busy for me during the morning
<ScottL> on wednesday i can make 7:00 am but i will _only_ have thirty minutes though
<ScottL> TheMuso, thank you
<scott-work> ack, holstein, i think i'm an idiot
<scott-work> it looks like i was wrong earlier (a few days ago) when i said your schedule for the website meeting was off
<scott-work> http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?month=12&day=1&year=2010&hour=1&min=0&sec=0&p1=0
<scott-work> this puts my local time a 7:00pm :)
<scott-work> TheMuso: it didn't look like too much change between my version and yours
<scott-work> +  * Remove lpia and ubuntustudio-audio package list files
<scott-work> this was the only major thing i saw
<scott-work> granted i quickly scan through it all
<holstein> scott-work: morning :)
<holstein> i just wanted to make sure you were either going to be there
<holstein> OR if you could get me links and whatever needs to be covered
<scott-work> holstein: since i know now that it is tomorrow night it shouldn't be a problem to attend :)
<holstein> scott-work: COOL
<scott-work> persia: yay!  + [apw] write a skeleton document for outside consumers to reference for migrating from older versions/flavours:DONE
<scott-work> persia: doh, sorry, that wasn't what i thought it was :( 
 * scott-work is trying to do WAY too much concurrently this morning
<TheMuso> scott-work: No there weren't, but there were a few important bits that need fixing. I also suggest you take a look at the bzr branch for the seeds.
<scott-work> TheMuso:  to be clear, you also made changes to the seeds?
<TheMuso> Yes.
<scott-work> ah, i see the revision
<scott-work> i'll dig into that tonight or tomorrow
<TheMuso> Ok cool.
<scott-work> okay, i looked right now :P
<scott-work> i see that adding the task-seeds line takes care of something per.sia had mentioned before
<scott-work> i thought that was taking care of during the STRUCTURE file
<scott-work> where it mentioned "generation: audio-common"
<scott-work> TheMuso: i also see the changes for boot and desktop-common...wow
<TheMuso> No its not. The structure file lays out how things are built on each other, it doesn't say that the contents of one seed should be included in another.
<scott-work> TheMuso: when we offer the -lowlatency kernel will we need to reimplement these
<scott-work> ?
<TheMuso> scott-work: Yeah, until we ship our own different kernel again, we don't need those hanging around.
<TheMuso> Yes for low latency, we will need those again.
<scott-work> haha, i think that answers myq uestion
<scott-work> okay, i don't feel too bad about those changes then  :)
<TheMuso> Ok cool.
<scott-work> of course i'm going to go through other seeds and see if i can find other instances of the task-seeds line
<TheMuso> Ok.
<scott-work> i'm excited about having the changes made, we should see all these implemented in tomorrows build, yes?
<TheMuso> Yes, but there is one more change that needs to be made, I just need to send Colin a patch for the build scripts to know about the new tasks.
<TheMuso> The patch in question is against the version of debian-cd used to build all Ubuntu disks.
<TheMuso> Ok, patch made and a merge proposal sent to Colin.
<scott-work> TheMuso: i talked to colin almost a week ago and he said he had a script that updates the tasks and even told me when it was compelte
<TheMuso> scott-work: This is different.
<scott-work> TheMuso: ah, okay :)
<scott-work> apparently unity is now turned on in the natty daily builds
<scott-work> i wonder how this will affect ubuntustudio
<holstein> cool
<holstein> i was wondering about that
<holstein> scott-work: the ubuntustudio-desktop shouldnt be effected right?
<scott-work> and i am looking forward to downloading a vanilla ubuntu daily build and seeing it from a live cd
<scott-work> holstein: i haven't a clue to be honest
<holstein> gnome is about to get some cool stuff i hear
<holstein> some funding
<holstein> im sure there will be gubuntu
<scott-work> holstein: i would defer to TheMuso or persia about how unity being turned on by default will effect ubuntu studio, or i'll just download a new ubuntu studio daily tomorrow :)
<TheMuso> Studio won't get unity, as its not in the seeds.
<holstein> i was worried about it
<holstein> but i think we should just roll on with gnome
 * scott-work is going home, ciao
<quadrispro> ScottL, mda-lv2 has joined Debian unstable
<ScottL> quadrispro, super sweet!  i've been researching mda a bit
<ScottL> it looks like we are beginning to have quite a stable of plugins
<ScottL> i wonder if we (i.e. ubuntustudio-devs) parse through them at some point and be more selective about which ones we ship
<ScottL> quadrispro, also:  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuStudio/Backports
<ScottL> it's not done, but it's got a lot to it
<ScottL> quadrispro, how did you get mda into unstable?  shouldn't it reside in debian-new until release?
<quadrispro> no, ftp-masters (slowly) process packages in NEW
<quadrispro> BTW, they will not enter squeeze
#ubuntustudio-devel 2010-11-30
<ScottL> huh, i played with the vanilla ubuntu live cd and unity...it's, uh, interesting
<ScottL> couldn't find the terminal though and it got me frustrated after a while
<TheMuso> ScottL: It is still in very early development, particularly as its being ported from clutter to compiz.
<scott-work> TheMuso: sorry, didn't mean to slag unity, i'm sure for normal desktop use it will be brilliant
<scott-work> TheMuso: i was thinking of it in ubuntu studio terms
<scott-work> to be honest, i've desired a sidebar for a while for studio work
<scott-work> however, i thought it would be quite handy to have a task launcher that could be programed for several workflows
<scott-work> perhaps the first icon let you choose which version or flavour of the task launcher you wished to use
<scott-work> therefore could have a task launcher devoted to an audio recording workflows (qjackctl, ardour, envy24control, hydrogen, rakarrack, lv2rack, etc)
<scott-work> another for tone generation (qjackctl, qtractor, hydrogen, hexter, whysynth, etc)
<scott-work> and perhaps even some for website development or graphics
<bittin> has the meeting started or did i miss it?
<scott-work> bittin: do you mean the website meeting?  it should start in a little over four hours
<bittin> ah
<bittin> thx for the info, but then i think i sleep swedish time :p
<rlameiro> so, meeting in 1h30???
<holstein> hey rlameiro :)
<holstein> thats the plan
<holstein> you gonna be able to make it?
<rlameiro> I am here already :D
<holstein> :)
<rlameiro> holstein: do you know if stochastic can make it?
<holstein> AH
<holstein> i hope so
<rlameiro> k
<holstein> stochastic_: meeting awarness ping
#ubuntustudio-devel 2010-12-01
<ScottL> hi rlameiro :)
<rlameiro> ScottL: hey :D
<ScottL> rlameiro, would you be interested in helping to test some backports?
<ScottL> if we get two people to test packages we should be able to get them accepting into the official backports
<rlameiro> I can test stuff on 10.04
<rlameiro> i am running it, its my main enviroment, so no prob
<rlameiro> I do audio stuff on another install
<ScottL> rlameiro, here is the plan for the lucid backports:  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuStudio/Backports
<ScottL> if you were curious to help with packaging https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuStudio/BackportsHowToHelpfor the backports here is the build documentation i'm working on : 
<ScottL> crappy touch mouse moving my cursor
<ScottL> if you were curious to help with packaging for the backports, here is the build documentation that i'm working on:  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuStudio/BackportsHowToHelp
<rlameiro> i will look into that
<rlameiro> at the moment i am kinda busy with the thesis, but after that i will try stuff
<ScottL> no rush rlameiro, it will be a continuing work in progress without any particular due date :)
<rlameiro> ohh ok
<rlameiro> ScottL: cont with me
<rlameiro> when you have stuff to test nock me up :D
<rlameiro> I will look later into the package stuff
<rlameiro> another stuff I need to do, is to define the specific test to each workflows, or maybe if it is possible a more than a test for each
<rlameiro> ScottL: just corrected a typo on the lucid number :D
<rlameiro> holstein: maybe you could send a 15 minutes notice to the mailing list :D
<holstein> on it
<rlameiro> holstein: lol, I was joking :D
<rlameiro> but ok
<rlameiro> he he scott-upstairs has moved to upstairs :D meeting on :D
<holstein> rlameiro: hehe
<holstein> i did it ;)
<holstein> i meant to do one at an hour out
<rlameiro> its nice, maybe people can remeber it :D
<holstein> oops
<holstein> that was an irc meetin reminder 
<holstein> oh well
<rlameiro> lol
<rlameiro> crimsun: are you on?
<holstein> i'll grab the text out of that freenode webchat client
<holstein> and email it around after the meet :)
<rlameiro> you should check if it logs :D
<holstein> ubottu or ubuntulo1 probably do right?
<ubottu> Error: I am only a bot, please don't think I'm intelligent :)
<holstein> the channel is logged somewhere
<rlameiro> yes it is
<rlameiro> http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/
<rlameiro> they are logged if the bots are logged in
<scott-upstairs> for those who are curious, you can find the logs at: http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2010/
<scott-upstairs> navigate through the month and day, then find ubuntustudio-devel.html or .txt
<holstein> cool
<holstein> ill just find it there to email out later
<holstein> hey tomwilso 
<rlameiro> TIME!
<holstein> #startmeeting
<tomwilso> hey holstein how are you this evening?
<scott-upstairs> just curious, who is here for the meeting?
<holstein> tomwilso: not bad at all
<scott-upstairs> obviously me :)
<rlameiro> I am for the meeting
<holstein> scott-upstairs: o/
<scott-upstairs> stochastic_,  are you going to make it?
<rlameiro> stochastic_: are you there?
<holstein> abogani: 
<holstein> astraljava: ??
<rlameiro> a ping channel function would be awesome :D
<holstein> you can right?
<holstein> i just dont know how
<rlameiro> is it possible?
<rlameiro> i dont know f it is 
<holstein> i guess not a ping really
<rlameiro> well, maybe we could wait a little bit more, else this will not be much productive anyway
<holstein> yeah
<holstein> 5 or 10
<scott-upstairs> i noticed the alpha1 image isn't available anymore, i wonder why
<superchinawokvid> hey there
<scott-upstairs> hi superchinawokvid, are you here for the meeting?
<holstein> hello superchinawokvid :)
<superchinawokvid> i am
<superchinawokvid> im luis
<rlameiro> well, people is coming from the web interface :D
<superchinawokvid> louiethecuban@gmail.com
<superchinawokvid> super china wok video drivers, OI!
<holstein> we might hold for a few minutes
<holstein> not long though
<holstein> and you axman1971 ??
<holstein> welcome :)
<axman1971> thanks
<axman1971> first meeting, hello room
<rlameiro> hello
<superchinawokvid> so how is everyone
<holstein> i think this is the first meeting in a while anyways
<rlameiro> cold brrrrr
<holstein> yeah, it got cold here too
<axman1971> forgive me I'm currently multitasking.
<holstein> rlameiro: not as bad as where you are though
<rlameiro> holstein: sure? we have 6 C over here now...
<superchinawokvid> word
<rlameiro> i tought you were on a colder place than me...
<holstein> not right now
<superchinawokvid> i was looking at the us site today
<superchinawokvid> and its really depressing
<superchinawokvid> am i the only one
<superchinawokvid> who thinks this
<holstein> nah
<holstein> thats why we are here :)
<rlameiro> superchinawokvid: well, i think a lot of us share the same feeling
<holstein> or the main reason
<rlameiro> if not all
<rlameiro> the feeling it gives me its like the site its a fas hack
<rlameiro> fast*
<holstein> personally, i dont mind the old site
<holstein> but, im into a change as well
<holstein> moving forward
<rlameiro> well, there is little info for new comers
<holstein> right
<holstein> i dont think its clear that the audience is newcomers
<holstein> OR was
<holstein> when that site was put up
<holstein> and thats one perspective as well
<rlameiro> well, it should be also, at least for the studio, not for linux
<holstein> i think a lot of thought has been going into who the target audience is
<holstein> and who it should be
<rlameiro> of course, its a simple site that did its job
<holstein> i think the workflow ideas are great
<superchinawokvid> yeah
<superchinawokvid> i reallllly dig opensuse's site
<superchinawokvid> i mentioned this earlier in the emails
<holstein> someone coming from another OS can see how we do a specific task
<rlameiro> holstein: is there some agenda?
<holstein> rlameiro: i think scott-upstairs is just going to facilitate
<holstein> drop some links
<superchinawokvid> also where is scott
<holstein> i dont think we have an official agenda
<superchinawokvid> http://www.opensuse.org/en/
<rlameiro> ok.
<holstein> its really just site talk that needs to happen
<superchinawokvid> who is going to do this though
<superchinawokvid> there was a sweet mock up
<superchinawokvid> what happened to that
<rlameiro> well, maybe we should talk about that when meeting starts
<holstein> i really like http://ubuntu-tweak.com/
<holstein> superchinawokvid: i think there are several mockups
<stochastic_> hi all
<stochastic_> sorry I'm late
<tomwilso> http://ubuntu-tweak.com/ I really like that site as well
<rlameiro> stochastic_: !!!! ma man!!
<holstein> stochastic_: hey :)
<holstein> nah, your right on time
<scott-upstairs> i'm here (scott)
 * stochastic_ reads back scroll
<scott-upstairs> hi stochastic_  :)
<rlameiro> holstein: 2 more min.?
<holstein> sure
<scott-upstairs> if you recieved a qatracker email and tried to follow the link to test the image, it's a bad link apparently
<scott-upstairs> use this instead:  http://cdimages.ubuntu.com/ubuntustudio/daily/20101130/
<scott-upstairs> if you _didn't_ receive an email from qatracker...sign up! :)
<holstein> i had no idea
<rlameiro> i did.. didnt followed the link tough
<scott-upstairs> http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/build/ubuntustudio/all
<rlameiro> persia: up for the meeting?
<superchinawokvid> i have to go in about 20 minutes unfortuanetly
<superchinawokvid> when will this begin
<rlameiro> well, then maybe we should kick it
<holstein> yup
<holstein> go for it
<rlameiro> scott-upstairs: the room is yours man!
<scott-upstairs> oh, okay
<scott-upstairs> for those who haven't seen it, here is the website development page:  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuStudio/TaskWebRevamp
<scott-upstairs> i don't really have a plan, maybe we should open it up to see people's thoughts
<holstein> i do like the darker ones
<rlameiro> i really like the first dark theme
<stochastic> I personally like the "Impact" theme as a mockup - does need a touch of refining though
<holstein> yeah, impact is great
<rlameiro> yeap, i dont dislike it either
<rlameiro> it has a more clean look
<scott-upstairs> i like the dark theme for audio horizons, namely the layout and the functionality already presented
<holstein> audio horizons seems very polished
<holstein> you guys think its too busy?
<scott-upstairs> it seems the major consensus is that *a* dark theme is preferred
<rlameiro> I dont.... but i am no designer
<rlameiro> scott-upstairs: i would say yes
<rlameiro> at leas to be on pair of the ubuntustudio theme
<stochastic> in general I think the final look of the revamped site is on its way, however the next major obstacle for us to concentrate on is the functionality changes of the new site
<scott-upstairs> stochastic, would a breakdown of functionality per page help?
<stochastic> holstein, I would say I find audio horizons to be a touch busy
<rlameiro> I think on planet
<superchinawokvid> impact is the way to go
<rlameiro> voting?
<holstein> i like them both
<holstein> i think i would have to go with impact in a vote now though
<rlameiro> superchinawokvid , axman1971  pitch in when you see fit please
<scott-upstairs> i'm good with impact if we can incorporate some of audio horizon's functionality into it
<stochastic> rlameiro, a vote would be a good thing - then we can settle on one design and refine it 
<holstein> scott-upstairs: agreed
<rlameiro> yes, that goes on the direction stochastic pointed, functionality
<superchinawokvid> okay
<rlameiro> well should we vote?
<superchinawokvid> yes
<superchinawokvid> lets do it
<rlameiro> I will start
<scott-upstairs> #OKAY, VOTE EITHER "AUDIO HORIZONS" OR "IMPACT"
<rlameiro> #AH
<holstein> impact +1
<superchinawokvid> "IMPACT"
<tomwilso> impact
<stochastic> #IMPACT
<scott-upstairs> looks like impact is it :)
<holstein> i think the impacts have it
<rlameiro> ok.
<rlameiro> design choosed
<superchinawokvid> i think it makes the most sense
<rlameiro> now to the stuff
<holstein> yeah
<rlameiro> #NEWS --------------------------------------------------------------
<holstein> stochastic: do you feel like the functionality changes are being addressed?
<scott-upstairs> one thing i do like about audio horizons is the landing page how he has tabs that bring up differnet information about ubuntu studio
<holstein> scott-upstairs: i like that as well
<rlameiro> scott-upstairs: impact has a top menu
<stochastic> holstein, is that not what we're about to start discussing?
<holstein> however, i thought it was one of the things that made me find it busy
<stochastic> maybe I should explain what I mean by functionality discussion
<holstein> stochastic: yeah, i was just wanting to hear more about what your thouhts were
<stochastic> In Drupal (or Wordpress if we decide to switch to that) we will be faced with a task of loading new modules in for many of the items suggested under the "rough site map" section - items like developer's blog aggregation, social media integration, or user suggestions
<rlameiro> I dont want to be picky, but we should have some solid and firm decisions about the site today, in order to give directions to the people that will build the site
<stochastic> all of these new modules of the site will need to be approved by canonical's security review panel before we're allowed to load them onto their servers (assuming we stick with canonical hosting)
<holstein> rlameiro: agreed
<stochastic> all of these approvals will take time and effort
<tomwilso> Social media integration is definately the way to go I think
<stochastic> so we should probably look over each of the "features" of that listing and start to pick ones that are higher priority and lower priority
<scott-upstairs> excellent idea
<holstein> stochastic: i like it
<rlameiro> stochastic: agreed
<holstein> your looking at the proposed site map?
<rlameiro> I think top priority is Examples
<rlameiro> show workflows etc
<scott-upstairs> stochastic, i would like to stay with canonical hosting if viable
<scott-upstairs> it just seems practical for the long term
<stochastic> scott-upstairs, I agree totally on staying with canonical - it just makes the most sense
<scott-upstairs> due to funding, i should add
<rlameiro> well, canonical has a set of #LoCo Modules and other stuff pre aproved, at least for drupal
<holstein> i think we can vote on that if needed
<holstein> i agree on staying with connonical
<stochastic> rlameiro, do you know where a list of those drupal modules are?
<holstein> even if we have to scrap some features
<rlameiro> stochastic: digging
<scott-upstairs> we might even consider having a series of short meeting if necessary
<stochastic> tomwilso, what type of social media integrations do you think would be needed for the site?
<rlameiro> http://profarius.com/content/ubuntu-drupal-modules-released
<holstein> i agree with some social media integration
<holstein> but we dont want to detract from the forums that are already in place
<holstein> maybe just highlight them
<scott-upstairs> i think that social media might be one of the lower priorities at this point
<holstein> going with something like drupal is a great idea though
<holstein> its easy-ish to go in and add things later
<holstein> without drastically revamping the whole thing
<stochastic> holstein, we're already running drupal so that does make the most sense for the future
<rlameiro> and AFAIK is the most used tool in ubuntu for websites
<holstein> adding a module
<holstein> here and there
<rlameiro> cant connect to ubuntu servers... weird
<rlameiro> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LoCoCreatingWebsite
<rlameiro> can someone try this?
<rlameiro> it doesnt open
<scott-upstairs> i'm having trouble as well rlameiro 
<rlameiro> ok, canonical webservers might be down
<tomwilso> stochastic, really just facebook so that artists and musicians on facebook can "like" or be friends with Ubustu site,  maybe occasional updates when new things happen on the site
<rlameiro> dont refres the trevamp wiki!!!!
<holstein> http://downforeveryoneorjustme.com/https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LoCoCreatingWebsite
<holstein> tomwilso: OK
<holstein> that should be easy enough
<holstein> and its just a link on the site
<holstein> shouldnt be any security concer
<stochastic> scott-upstairs, would you possibly be able to itemize what you think the priority feature set would be - I recall your ideas in this area to be fairly potent
<holstein> my ubuntu loco team has facebook links up
<scott-upstairs> news section, downloads, screenshots, tutorials, links to help (forums, help.ubuntu), user contributed media are among those i think are top priority
<rlameiro> for me the top most are some workflows
<rlameiro> they already give a lot of information
<rlameiro> wich software the distro has, how to use, how to connect jack et etc etc
<scott-upstairs> FAQ as well
<holstein> yeah
<stochastic> FAQ can be a difficult page to do well
<holstein> FAQ in help
<scott-upstairs> i realize that most of the things i listed are probably simple pages not requiring special modules
<holstein> could be
<stochastic> scott-upstairs, quite right
<rlameiro> and that is a good thing :D
<stochastic> but blog aggregation would not be
<rlameiro> stochastic: but ubuntu already has a planet
<scott-upstairs> yes, but ubuntu studio planet would be music/graphic/video focused
<rlameiro> maybe it only a matter of asking the code
<stochastic> rlameiro, the planet module is still in development
<stochastic> not stable yet
<scott-upstairs> stochastic, it was really just a suggestion, not release critical in my opinion
<rlameiro> well, but ubuntu uses it doesnt?
<stochastic> no, that's differnet
<rlameiro> i am not talking about the module
<rlameiro> I am talking about a planet.ubuntustudio.org
<rlameiro> not a module 
<rlameiro> it could be a segway to the stable module after
<rlameiro> ok
<rlameiro> maybe we should focus on the more important stuff
<rlameiro> What is definetively needed for Natty launch?
<holstein> in the site?
<rlameiro> yes
<scott-upstairs> my opinion is that our original focus for the feature set would be to help new and inexperienced users understand _what_ ubuntu studio is and _how_ to use it
<holstein> rlameiro: i dont know if there is anything really natty specific yet
<holstein> that we need to think about for the site
<holstein> i cant think of anything...
<rlameiro> isnt the idea to launch the new site at the same time?
<holstein> just updating the links when its final and all that
<holstein> rlameiro: AH
<holstein> maybe
<stochastic> I was under the impression that no timelines were determined yet
<tomwilso> also what makes ubuntu studio a better choice for some over protools, logic (other than price)
<rlameiro> ohh, my bad then
<holstein> yeah, im not sure about the timeline
<stochastic> scott-upstairs, I like that as the main focus
<scott-upstairs> stochastic, thank you :)
<holstein> tomwilso: yeah, i like that
<rlameiro> Well, then we should set a timeline, or else it will take ages
<holstein> tomwilso: i like the way ardour covers that
<tomwilso> holstein: me too!
<scott-upstairs> holstein, you have a link?
<holstein> http://www.ardour.org/download
<holstein> it doesnt look good
<holstein> BUT
<stochastic> a secondary focus could be marketing of Ubuntu Studio (this would cover tomwilso's idea)
<holstein> the scrolling deal at the bottom
<holstein> where you pay
<holstein> where it lists the prices of other DAWs
<scott-upstairs> stochastic, good idea and i have some ideas about that as well when we get to that :)
<holstein> not really the way we would want to tackle it
<holstein> since we are not going for donations like that
<holstein> BUT i like the way the information is presented there
<stochastic> a quick side question - have we ever gotten permission to make money off Ubuntu Studio products (i.e. should the store be deleted)?  TheMuso or Cory would know (maybe jussi?)
<tomwilso> we could play on the fact the it is driven by like-minded musicians and artists for the sake of creativity and not by a corporation for the sake of a bottomlone
<scott-upstairs> stochastic, part of the marketing would also be included on the landing page that audio horizons presents
<holstein> to get a powerful computer with a DAW and something like JACK and all the MIDI and synths and everything else offered
<holstein> who knows what that could cost
<scott-upstairs> stochastic, i don't think the store ever got off the ground (i could be wrong)
<scott-upstairs> but i was hoping to get that going again
<scott-upstairs> but i wanted to settle some other things first before i dug into it (udpate seeds, website moving forward)
<rlameiro> it could be nice, the money could go to pay devs to go to conferences
<rlameiro> or sponsor the programming of a LV2 plugin:D
<holstein> yeah, pay someone to write some things :)
<rlameiro> well, we should focus...
<holstein> yeah
<holstein> we're approaching an hour
<rlameiro> almost 2 AM over here
<stochastic> okay, so we've narrowed down the primary focus of the features (and possibly a secondary one of marketing)
<holstein> i think we're in a good spot
<holstein> we could have another meeting about the site if needed
<rlameiro> What would be inside the help menu?
<holstein> seems like we got the basics
<rlameiro> links to the forum
<holstein> scott-upstairs: how do you feel about it
<rlameiro> IRC
<holstein> rlameiro: it could start that way
<rlameiro> Wiki and help.ubuntu
<holstein> FAQ's
<rlameiro> where will the workflows get in?
<stochastic> I'd sort of like to hear what the next few steps will be for the development of the site
<rlameiro> scott-upstairs: ?
<scott-upstairs> holstein, how do it feel about our current position?
<holstein> yup
<scott-upstairs> we seem to have made some definitive decisions
<holstein> on moving forward with the site
<scott-upstairs> i think we probably need to document some of them and prepare for the next meeting
<rlameiro> I would say, at first implement the mockup on real 
<holstein> scott-upstairs: i like it
<stochastic> does anyone have a server that can be dedicated to a mockup development?
<scott-upstairs> stochastic, i do
<rlameiro> ok
<scott-upstairs> however, rlameiro, i think we should make a definitive list of what each page should entail before we move forward
<rlameiro> for the next meeting, what nneds to be compiled?
<tomwilso> rlameiro: workflows I would think would need to be one of the first things on the site after feature's as they really show what can be done and how
<scott-upstairs> tomwilso, that would fall under showing people "how" to use ubuntu studio
<scott-upstairs> and would definitely be included
<rlameiro> Well, my idea is to have some splash to link to workflows
<rlameiro> like Do stuff, check here how!
<rlameiro> some kind of slogan like that
<scott-upstairs> can we talk about a landing page?  do people like the idea, do they hate it?
<tomwilso> scott-upstairs, rlameiro: I dig it!
<holstein> what do we mean by landing page?
<holstein> like a pre-home page?
<stochastic> scott-upstairs, we should have a private chat after the meeting (if you have time) about setting up the mockup development then
<rlameiro> I would vote on having a nice enphasis on a direct link to workflows on the landing page
<scott-upstairs> stochastic, certainly
<scott-upstairs> holstein, sort of
<holstein> ive never liked landing pages
<holstein> BUT im flexible
<scott-upstairs> by landing page i wanted a simplistic page that gives a good overview of _what_ ubuntu studio is
<scott-upstairs> think of who will be searching for the website
<stochastic> I do think that a landing page would be best (and it is included in the already agreed upon "Impact" theme)
<scott-upstairs> it's probably people that really don't know much about ubuntu studio
<scott-upstairs> and they probably don't even understand exactly what it is
<holstein> im sure i'll like it when its laid out properly
<rlameiro> well, that would mean that the home menu will point to a different page or to landing page?
<scott-upstairs> might even be people who are unfamiliar with linux/ubuntu
<stochastic> scott-upstairs, I sort of disagree with that analysis of who will be searching for the site
<stochastic> there are both those people, and our current user base
<scott-upstairs> stochastic, i also include people who have installed it and want to learn how to use it
<scott-upstairs> more
<rlameiro> stochastic: i think something like you, we should provide to our current user base too
<stochastic> every release our users return to the website to find the newest version - even the expert users
<rlameiro> ok
<rlameiro> voting
<stochastic> the website serves a number of different scales of user - and we shouldn't ignore any of them
<scott-upstairs> stochastic, really?  i figured most would go directly to the canonical server download page
<rlameiro> LANDING PAGE ---- #YES or #NO
<stochastic> #YES
<scott-upstairs> #Yes
<rlameiro> #YES
<tomwilso> #yes
<rlameiro> come on guys
<holstein> #no
<rlameiro> so it seems land page it is
<holstein> landing page is a go :)
<scott-upstairs> looks like we have a landing page, although that should be easy enough to change later if we don't like it
<rlameiro> if it looks terrible, i think it is not mandatory to keep it tough :D
<scott-upstairs> if i remember the little bit of drupal i learned before
<rlameiro> ### LANDING PAGE ----> YES
<rlameiro> ok, what will be inside of the landing page?
<scott-upstairs> rlameiro,  i like the audio horizons first page
<scott-upstairs> it gives a nice overview of ubuntustudio but has tabs to describe other aspects of it, like jack
<holstein> that would be a way to mix the ideas together
<holstein> use that layout for a landing page
<rlameiro> I tought on having a kind of "rooling track" with different stuff 
<holstein> wouldnt have to have so much text
<stochastic> The contents of the landing page would be determined by the final design of the site map
<scott-upstairs> but i don't know if having "tab" is a go with drupal
<holstein> and linkx
<holstein> stochastic: is that the way it will be?
<rlameiro> stochastic: ok, so should we move to content?
<holstein> OR would that be the home page?
<holstein> and the landing page just links to the home page?
<rlameiro> holstein: it will be like a page with links to most important stuff
<holstein> OK
<stochastic> usually a landing page is the homepage - it just has a different layout than the content pages
<rlameiro> so content???
<rlameiro> Priority content? 
<stochastic> we basically need to refine the site map that has been roughed out on the wiki
<rlameiro> ok, so we will pass by it now
<stochastic> I think now that we have a priority focus and a secondary focus for the features the site map can be refined
<rlameiro> ----#stay or #go------
<stochastic> maybe someone could volunteer to draft a 2nd site map
<rlameiro> #News
<scott-upstairs> stochastic, i'd be happy to do it
<rlameiro> do we need to know what to refine?
<stochastic> sounds good to me, do others agree with scott doing that?
<tomwilso> I agree
<stochastic> rlameiro, I trust scott's judgement
<rlameiro> i agree, I a like scott-upstairs judgement
<rlameiro> lol
<scott-upstairs> although i think it would be good to get other's involvement
<scott-upstairs> i fear this might become too one-sided from my involvement
<stochastic> true, tomwilso would you be interested in helping scott?
<tomwilso> So what exactly are we trying to do with the site map? trm it down?
<tomwilso> absolutely, what kind of timeline are we looking at?
<rlameiro> you can discuss that directly with scott if you accept :D
<stochastic> I'd just say look through the first draft and correct anything that seems not needed or add anything that's missing now that we understand the site goals more
<tomwilso> I'm down
<tomwilso> :)
<rlameiro> stochastic: any technichal issues you would like to add, since you are the more experienced over here about the website and its canonical connection?
<scott-upstairs> stochastic, how soon would you like the 2nd site map draft?
<scott-upstairs> a week, two weeks?
<stochastic> I'm not in any rush for it
<stochastic> I'm still working 60+ hour weeks
<stochastic> I'll let you set your own timeline
<stochastic> rlameiro, I don't think there are any immediate considerations that need to be talked about
<rlameiro> ok
<rlameiro> so will it be Drupal or Wordpress?
<rlameiro> do we need to vote?
<stochastic> I don't see any reason to switch away from Drupal
<rlameiro> this could possible have inplications on the design side that i am not aware
<scott-upstairs> rlameiro, i think we can probably get most of the features we need via modules in either
<rlameiro> I cant really vote on this matter, I think we should vote on the one that can provide more stability
<rlameiro> and it seems to be drupal
<rlameiro> since canonical uses it
<rlameiro> ok
<rlameiro> DRUPAL is it?
<scott-upstairs> well, canonical seems to be using both these days
<scott-upstairs> but i think there will be less friction if we stick with drupal at this moment
<rlameiro> its one more thing that gets decided and out of the way
<stochastic> I should publicly note that I have a copy of the current site (in it's entire server form) that we can work off of - though access to this should be kept very very tight, so I will not readily be giving out copies or anything
<scott-upstairs> let's stick with drupal because it currently has many advantages for us
<rlameiro> ok # Platform is DRUPAL
<stochastic> yes, unless there are a group of developers that are much more comfortable with wordpress (which it doesn't sound like) then there's no reason to move away from Drupal
<holstein> drupal +1
<tomwilso> drupal for sure
<rlameiro> ############ DRUPAL is the platform for the new site ###########
<stochastic> I like drupal ;)
<stochastic> let's go with drupal.
<rlameiro> anything more about the site?
<stochastic> rlameiro, I think we're probably good for toady.
<rlameiro> ok
<rlameiro> anything anyone want to pitch in about natty?
<stochastic> should a next meeting time be estimated? like a month from now or so?
<scott-upstairs> thank you everyone for participating, your involvement is both very helpful and appreciated
<rlameiro> stochastic: did you know about pd extended comming into debian?
<holstein> w00t
<rlameiro> they are making a lot of packages 
<stochastic> rlameiro, I think you said something about that to me
<holstein> great meeting guys :)
<scott-upstairs> stochastic, i think having the next meeting in a month's time sounds good
<stochastic> new years eve it is then
<stochastic> ;)
<rlameiro> scott-upstairs: about the website or the distro?
<scott-upstairs> rlameiro,  i was thinking for the website actually
<scott-upstairs> do you want to discuss the distro?
<rlameiro> maybe we should aim at somewhere between christhmas and new year
<rlameiro> ahh
<holstein> maybe december 21st
<rlameiro> I think distro will need some discussing before that
<holstein> if that seems to soon
<holstein> after the new year
<rlameiro> at least for the testing stuff, and maybe backports
<rlameiro> scott-upstairs: well, 21 seems a nice time to do both together...
<rlameiro> 21 or around
<tomwilso> I'm all for the 21st
<holstein> seems like this is an OK time of day
<holstein> i mean, you cant please everybody :/
<rlameiro> stochastic: what is the best time for you? this?
<rlameiro> its alittle bit late for european time.... starting the meeting at 1 AM
<scott-upstairs> rlameiro, i think we probably shouldn't have both meetings together, we'd end up with a 2 hour meeting
<rlameiro> but I am a night Owl...anyway
<scott-upstairs> we are already at 1:30
<rlameiro> scott-upstairs: yea.. true
<holstein> rlameiro: we cant really go much earlier
<holstein> folks getting out of work
<rlameiro> maybe some agenda will be needed for next meetings
<rlameiro> holstein: I get it, i just were justifying the people that couldnt make it
<stochastic> this meeting started at 5pm on my "sunday" and I occasionally do have a shift that starts at 6pm that day, a day earlier would be just fine for me at almost any hour
<rlameiro> DEC. 20 could be
<holstein> we could try the weekend
<holstein> maybe 4p on a sunday
<holstein> EST
<tomwilso> works great for me :)
<rlameiro> ...... not good idea, family and stufff, we should enforce time off :D
<holstein> more like 9p for you rlameiro 
<rlameiro> for me its ok, but i dont know for scott
<holstein> well, think about it
<holstein> i'll probably just go for the same time on the 21st
<holstein> for now
<scott-upstairs> i'm good for almost any time
<rlameiro> wait a sec..
<scott-upstairs> holstein, can we make it on a tuesday for stochastic 
<scott-upstairs> ?
<holstein> yeah
<holstein> 21st is a tuesday
<holstein> IF we're talking december
<rlameiro> holstein you coul set a doodle
<rlameiro> http://www.doodle.com
<holstein> rlameiro: i'll bookmark that
<holstein> and give it a look
<holstein> anything to simplify the process ;)
<rlameiro> ok
<rlameiro> finished then??
<holstein> i feel good :)
<rlameiro> scott-upstairs: close the beast man!
<stochastic> usually official meeting dates are posted to the ubuntu fridge
<holstein> stochastic: maybe i'll hit you up on how to make that happen
<holstein> or i'll ask akgraner
<rlameiro> stochastic: are you still DJing?
<stochastic> rlameiro, nope, no time to these days
<holstein> alright... im off for a bit... thanks again
<rlameiro> stochastic: sad man :(
<stochastic> still have the equipment, but just don't use it
<scott-upstairs> ubuntu servers are back up apparently
<rlameiro> yep they are
<rlameiro> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDrupal
<tomwilso> have a great night all!
<tomwilso> I enjoyed it very much
<rlameiro> tomwilso: you too
<rlameiro> well it was a great meeting
<rlameiro> a little bit confusing but :D some progress were made :D
<rlameiro> thanks scott-upstairs and stochastic and superchinawokvid and holstein 
<rlameiro> cya all later
<rlameiro> bye
<scott-upstairs> thank you rlameiro and very true
<superchinawokvid> thanks everyone for participating
<superchinawokvid> i just got back from work
<superchinawokvid> im sorry i couldnt contribute much
 * abogani waves all
<scott-work> TheMuso:  there is a report about ubuntustudio pre-alpha1 image not running a windows manager, do you think this might have anything to do with removing the desktop seed?
<scott-work> sorry, we removed desktop-common
<paultag> Wait, you did what?
<paultag> I thought that has deps for the X11 and everything, so that the other seeds don't have to spec that, so long as it provides an X11 server + window manager
<paultag> otherwise it starts doing silly things
<paultag> I thought
<TheMuso> scott-work: Don't know without checking for myself to be honest.
<TheMuso> scott-work: There is a good chance that something is crashing though.
<scott-work> TheMuso: sorry if i bugged you while you were asleep
<TheMuso> Likely compiz, as its rather new at the moment.
<TheMuso> np
<scott-work> compiz was updated?  changes because of unity?
<TheMuso> Yes.
<scott-work> hmmm, unfortunate timing coinciding with the seeds update :/
<holstein> disable compiz?
<scott-work> i've been working on the ubuntu studio team report  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuStudio/TeamReports/10/November
<scott-work> if anyone wants to add anything, please feel free :)
<scott-work> TheMuso:  i would be happy to assist you in anyway i can, i can even leave work early today if needed
<TheMuso> scott-work: assist with what?
<scott-work> TheMuso:  with the compiz situation
<TheMuso> ah I don't know whats going on there.
<TheMuso> Just that people have been experiencing crashes even for vanilla ubuntu
#ubuntustudio-devel 2010-12-02
<scott-work> fielded a request to offer updated for TechOverview for Natty Alpha 1:  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NattyNarwhal/TechnicalOverview#Ubuntu%20Studio
<scott-work> if anyone sees something wrong or think something should be added please let me know
<TheMuso> scott-upstairs: I was thinking about the lack of a window manager issue that was reported, and I think I know what the problem is.
<TheMuso> There are 2 different sessions now, one for unity, and one for GNOME. I suspect studio still has the unity session set by default, but since unity is not on the disks, things don't go right/something probably crashes. I think we shoudl explicitly set the classic GNOME session to avoid any possible problems.
<TheMuso> As to how that is done, I am not yet sure.
<ScottL> TheMuso, charlie-tca notes that "switching to classic" worked for him
<TheMuso> Right.
<TheMuso> SO that explains it then.
<ScottL> TheMuso, if there is any testing you need or want me to contact someone for information, please let me know
<TheMuso> ScottL: Sure, I just need to work out how to change the default session.
#ubuntustudio-devel 2010-12-03
 * abogani waves all
<ScottL> hi abogani , how are you?
<abogani> ScottL: I'm very well, thank you.
<abogani> ScottL: How are you?
<ScottL> abogani, i am well, but it doesn't feel like i have time for the things i want to do :/
<ScottL> although i am hoping to finish some recording this month that were started almost two months ago :)
<abogani> ScottL: :-)
#ubuntustudio-devel 2010-12-04
<ronj> hoy hoy, just filed https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntustudio/+bug/685049
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 685049 in ffmpeg-extra (Ubuntu) "libavutil-extra-50 & libavcodec-extra-52 conflicts cause ubuntustudio natty alpha1 iso install to fail" [Undecided,New]
<kubotu> why not just kubuntu-dvd ?
<ronj> also, currently there are (probably due to unity and ubustu metapackages not updated) no gnome-panel
<falktx> hi
<kubotu> KDE bug 258400 in powermanagement "[powerdevil] suspend / hibernate not avaliable without hal in KDE
<ubottu> KDE bug 258400 in powermanagement "[powerdevil] suspend / hibernate not avaliable without hal in KDE 4 6beta1" [Normal,Resolved: fixed] http://bugs.kde.org/show_bug.cgi?id=258400
<kubotu> oh, I've noticed that since removing HAL I no longer get suspend/hibernate options in KDE 4 6beta1" [Normal,Resolved: fixed]
<falktx> persia: hi
<falktx> persia: i noticed alessio is looking for a fix for composite
<falktx> persia: I have the patch to fix, do you have alessio (quadispro) mail?
<ScottL> falktx, i think you can use the "Contact This Person" button on his launchpad page
<ScottL> kubotu, why do you keep talking about kde here?
<ScottL> kubotu, are you a bot?
<kubotu> which emmc bin are you downloading?
<falktx> ScottL: yep, I did it
#ubuntustudio-devel 2010-12-05
<ScottL> holstein,  ping me when you get back
<holstein> ScottL: ping
<ScottL> holstein, hey, could you email the mailing list about the website meeting?
<ScottL> holstein, mention the decision made and the date/time of the next meeting?
<holstein> ScottL: i'll get on it 
<holstein> if you dont see it tonite, feel free to remind me again
<holstein> ill try to find a link to the logs from last time
<ScottL> holstein, thanks :)   how are you doing this weekend?
<holstein> not bad
<holstein> my face is much better
<holstein> less swollen from my surgery
<holstein> and i got some work
<holstein> ScottL: hows about you?
<ScottL> i saw on #OSMs guitarman telling you to take your medicine to reduce the swelling
<ScottL> cool about the work
<ScottL> holstein, this weekend started a little rough, i found out friday afternoon that a good friend (who i worked with also) died friday morning
<holstein> w0w
<holstein> sorry to hear that
<ScottL> i don't know the cause of death at this moment, i suppose we'll get the word monday morning
<ScottL> thanks holstein 
<ScottL> holstein, this will probably help: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuStudio/TeamReports/10/November
<ScottL> i think it has all the decisions that were made, plus the irc logs
<ScottL> the only thing i think it is missing is mentioning a decision for another meeting and the date for it
<ScottL> holstein, thanks for getting the email out
<ScottL> i still don't know who tomwilso is :/ 
<ScottL> do you?
<holstein> lol
<ScottL> i wonder how reliable he will be about preparing for next meeting
<holstein> no idea
<holstein> i dont think its a hinge point for the meeting
<ScottL> what do you think will be important for the next meeting?
<holstein> trying to make all the decisions on the site content
<holstein> or more 
<holstein> ScottL: i would like to talk more about revenue as well
<holstein> you mentioned that i think
<holstein> collect some funds for development
<ScottL> holstein, re: website, i think that is what tomwilso was doing, refining the rough site map to parse out only the necessary content into a 2nd draft or list
<ScottL> holstein, re: revenue  -  shoot
<ScottL> re: website, i'll work up a list as well just in case tomwilso doesn't come through
<holstein> maybe just exactly what it will take to eccept donations
<holstein> and/or sell things
 * ScottL doesn't want to impugn anyone's honor, but really, really want to make this all happen :)
<holstein> ScottL: nah, i think its cool
<holstein> the email is out
<holstein> ScottL: actually
<ScottL> holstein, i think we need to first clear that we _can_ sell ubuntu studio stuff
<ScottL> get in touch with someone with canonical
<holstein> i think it would be fine to say 'who is tom, and respond here please'
<ScottL> we might email cory first, he had explored this before and see if he had any contacts we could follow
<holstein> ScottL: maybe we can get someone to cover that
<holstein> at the next meeting
<holstein> an ubuntustudio representative
<holstein> to ask connonical
<holstein> or whoever
<ScottL> then if it clears canonical then i guess we need figure out what and how
<holstein> ScottL: cool
<holstein> yeah, cory :)
<ScottL> do you want to discuss other ubuntu studio topics other than the website at the next meeting?
<holstein> i dont really have anything yet
<holstein> if these stay regular
<holstein> we can work out those workflows
<holstein> and whatever else we need
<ScottL> if we plan on covering more topics we should probably be better organized
<ScottL> either create a wiki page with topics and email it to people
<ScottL> or email a list directly to the mailing list
<ScottL> personally, i think it would behoove us to do this anyway
<holstein> yeah, an egenda maybe
<holstein> i dont mind keeping it simple too
<holstein> shorter one topic productive meetings
<holstein> 'we'll talk about the podcasting workflow and news about whatever'
<holstein> we could easily have a 4 hour meeting
<holstein> and not get anything done ;)
<ScottL> haha, very, very true!
<holstein> biab
<holstein> i gotta put tension back on my bass strings before the gig...
<holstein> OK:)
#ubuntustudio-devel 2011-11-28
<stochastic> ScottL, I know you're probably sleeping now, but can you take a look at this group in launchpad https://launchpad.net/ubuntustudio-resources  Should it be tidied up and removed or should more be added to it?
<scott-work> abogani: did you see my email about the rtirq status?
<abogani> scott-work: No.
<scott-work> it's on the -devel mailing list
<scott-work> i wonder if ailo_ can do the same ;)
<ailo_> scott-work, I already posted mine here
<ailo_> len probably hadn't installed rtirq-init
<scott-work> ailo_: oh, i didn't see you posting it here, sorry
<holstein> abogani: i have one of those as well
<holstein> ailo did it
<abogani> scott-work, ailo_, holstein: Thanks
<abogani> holstein: Your is buggy
<holstein> abogani: ?
<abogani> holstein: 703 FF      85   - 125  0.0 S    irq/17-radeon
<holstein> abogani: i did not install the proprietary driver
<abogani> holstein: No matters. rtirq fails in your case.
<holstein> cool... let me know abogani 
<holstein> i can try some other/better hardware easy enough
<abogani> scott-work: So rtirq isn't perfect (1 fail over 3 report).
<abogani> scott-work: I hope to have an -realtime kernel for next week.
<scott-work> abogani: oh, that will be interesting then
<scott-work> i need to get back in touch with steve (from the kernel group) and see what he wants us to do next for testing
<scott-work> i don't know if what we gave him was enough already or he needs further information from us
<scott-work> or if he wants to do a larger and more public series of testing because he feels good about what we have done already
<shnatsel> ScottL: I'm afraid thorwil is not going to help you
<shnatsel> ScottL: but doctormon seems to be interested. He suggests writing the exact requirements (what do you need to be done by a designer) to a blueprint or something like that.
<shnatsel> ScottL: exact definition needed
<scott-work> shnatsel: i was expecting thorwil to decline, not that i blame him
<scott-work> shnatsel: but thank you for asking
<shnatsel> scott-work: there are other interested people out there
<scott-work> shnatsel: besides doctormo ?
<shnatsel> scott-work: yeah, I'm pretty sure there will be
<scott-work> dick macinnis is interested as well
<shnatsel> scott-work: draft the requirements for a start
<scott-work> shnatsel: i will do that this weekend then
<shnatsel> <doctormon> shnatsel: So 1 wallpaper and 1 plymouth? Do you have a link to the briefs for each of those?
<shnatsel> <shnatsel> doctormon: for Plymouth - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Documentation/Plymouth
<shnatsel> <shnatsel> doctormon: and examples at http://brej.org/blog/?p=238
<shnatsel> <shnatsel> doctormon: and LightDM is expected to look similar to GDM, but nobody really knows that yet :(
<shnatsel> * thorwil ÑÑÐµÐ» (Quit: Leaving)
<shnatsel> <shnatsel> doctormon: like this: http://iloveubuntu.net/pictures_me/lightDM%200.9.2%20Oneiric.png
<shnatsel> ScottL: <doctormon> shnatsel: That sounds great, make sure he'll be specifying tone, logos and a list of don'ts.
<scott-work> thanks again, shnatsel 
<scott-work> i like the part where thorwil (Quit: Leaving), somehow that was poignant :P
<shnatsel> lol
<scott-work> :)
#ubuntustudio-devel 2011-11-29
<abogani> scott-work: https://launchpad.net/~abogani/+archive/realtime
<scott-work> thanks abogani (sorry for the delay, work is really, really busy this week)
<scott-work> and thank you very much for the reply email as well :)
<abogani> scott-work: Sorry for succinct replies. :-)
<scott-work> abogani: hehe, no problem my friend, i have been accused of the same, but it is merely because i have so much limited time
#ubuntustudio-devel 2011-11-30
<scott-work> good morning :)
<astraljava> o/
<scott-work> how are you this morning astraljava ?
<astraljava> That's funny, technically you could call this still as my morning as well. Woke up 2 hours ago.
<astraljava> Well, tired as usual. But on a tad better mood. Thanks for asking, and you?
#ubuntustudio-devel 2011-12-01
<ScottL> astraljava, sorry, was in a five hour meeting this morning and then the rest of the day was a disturbingly busy blur
<scott-work> good morning
<fr-z> good morning :) here is after lunch ^^
<fr-z> brb
<scott-work> i plan to start the -default-settings and -artwork packages today to begin the transition phase for moving to xfce
<scott-work> will be basing on xubuntu's work
<scott-work> xubuntu-devs, we <3 you guys :)
<shnatsel> scott-work: I'm hacking elementary's defaults right now. You're so lucky you don't have to mess with gnome-session!
<scott-work> hehe
<ailo> scott-work, I told you give me a month to decide whether I will participate in US development this cycle. I can only promise to help testing the -lowlatency kernel pretty much.
<scott-work> ailo:  no problem, do what you can where/when you can :)
#ubuntustudio-devel 2011-12-02
<knome> who was the one who knew most of alternative ubiquity package set installing?
<quadrispro> ScottL, ehy man, how are you? :)
<quadrispro> hi all!
<ScottL> hi quadrispro, i am doing well (finally getting over being sick), how are you doing?
 * ScottL is leaving for work now, will be there in ~30mins
<quadrispro> ScottL, well, come back from Bonn a week ago and I've already planned to get back there soon to spend more time with my girlfriend
<quadrispro> (so, another opportunity to escape from Italy, yeah!:))
<shnatsel> knome: maybe me?
<shnatsel> knome: in case you mean https://docs.google.com/document/d/1JinRIl_hYWJA4L0COe9r5uAX4ZgmfqyIYmC5Tdhfn3o/edit
<scott-work> good morning
#ubuntustudio-devel 2011-12-03
<shnatsel> hello everyone
<shnatsel> hey ScottL 
<shnatsel> is there any work you want me to do? e.g. seeds?
<shnatsel> ping me anytime if there is
<falktx> hey
<ScottL> what i need help with at the moment is getting good tasks and work flows for graphic designers
<ScottL> i've been poking the libre graphics people about this but haven't gotten anything at this time :(
<ScottL> maybe if everyone emailed them and told them how much we wanted to learn about what they do so we can better support them (and others like them) they would tell us more
<ScottL> ;)
<shnatsel> ScottL: I'm terrible at emailing people
<shnatsel> ScottL: hmm... oh btw, CinePaint 1.0 is released, and the website is alive again
<shnatsel> ScottL: we gotta package it
<shnatsel> ScottL: I'm still screwed in terms of Debian processes, the tools shipped by Ubuntu seem to be buggy and that's probably the most counter-intuitive thing I ever used
<shnatsel> ScottL: I think I should email Debian multimedia list, or whatever body deals with graphics in there
<ScottL> shnatsel, i can help with the cinepaint thinge with contacting the debianmultimetida people
<shnatsel> ScottL: can you just forward them the list of stuff I posted to US mailing list a while back, and add a request for packaging CinePaint, too?
#ubuntustudio-devel 2011-12-04
<astraljava> o/
<astraljava> Anyone here to chat in an informal meeting?
<shnatsel> nope
<shnatsel> too busy
<ScottL> astraljava, i'm here, was upstairs working on some stuff
<ScottL> (as most times) i'm out and about but check irc pretty often
<ScottL> working on a spec for new plymouth, lightdm greeter, wallpaper images for 12.04
<ScottL> and some other things
<astraljava> Right. I've been very busy with other life, but I'll try to start working on documentation and bug fixing.
<ScottL> and wondering how i should start the theme update, specifically how do i handle basically purging all the old settings and code from -default-settings and starting fresh with the xubuntu-default-settings code
<astraljava> Hmm... I'm not familiar with that at all, but shouldn't it be as easy as replacing the file(s), committing and uploading?
<ScottL> i'm not sure, i was going to ask TheMuso or micahg about it later
<astraljava> Okay. If you have trouble with that, let me know and I can have a look at it.
<ScottL> astraljava, i know that i can completely replace the code in the package, but i figure someone will say afterwards, "oh, what you _really_ should have done is...." ;)
<ScottL> shnatsel, in what form should i do the spec for the artwork
<ScottL> ?
<ScottL> i was trying to find doctormo to ask him, but he hasn't been on much lately
<shnatsel> ScottL: see the logs... I copy-pasted everything they said to yoy
<ScottL> (not that i blame him with a new baby)
<shnatsel> *copy-pasted to you
<ScottL> shnatsel, i'll check
<scott-upstairs> shnatsel, i looked at the logs (http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/11/28/%23ubuntustudio-devel.html) basically just said to specify things but didn't give preference where
<scott-upstairs> shnatsel, could this be part of this: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Artwork/Specs  ?
<shnatsel> scott-upstairs: blueprint
<scott-upstairs> roger that, will do blueprint then :)
<shnatsel> scott-upstairs: well, blueprint should link to wiki page or google doc
<shnatsel> scott-upstairs: for the full specification
<shnatsel> scott-upstairs: I prefer gdocs personally
<shnatsel> scott-upstairs: we use them in elementary and we're quite happy
<shnatsel> with them
<astraljava> ScottL: That's a good point.
 * jussi slaps astraljava
<jussi> btw, anyone here any good with cad/cadlike applications ?
<astraljava> No idea where that came from, but I guess I deserved that.
<jussi> astraljava: just because its preemtive - Im sure you havent done what you promised yet :)
#ubuntustudio-devel 2012-11-26
<ttoine> hello !
<zequence> ttoine: How are you?
<ttoine> zequence, fine, thanks. starting to learn ubuntu server, ssh, etc... because I need to go on a VPS for my clients
<ttoine> and if ethernet works well, I can't setup the wifi at startup...
<ttoine> command line and in terminal text edition are not my favourite way
<ttoine> and you ? what's up ?
<zequence> ttoine: I spent about a month setting up my own server first time :). 
<zequence> I'm hoping Scott could appear soon and give some feedback on the PR stuff, so we can move further with it
<zequence> I'm doing more and more work with the terminal. And I usually find nano enough for most things. Haven't yet tried to learn vi, or others
<ttoine> zequence, it should be great to go ahead with PR
<zequence> pulseaudio gets borked sometimes on 13.04
<zequence> Need to restart it sometimes in order to get some applications running with it
<zequence> http://lwn.net/Articles/520704/
<Len-nb> zequence, interesting. It would be nice to be able to run RT without patch.
#ubuntustudio-devel 2012-11-27
<zequence> Len-nb: in deed
<zequence> As -lowlatency is greatly improving performance over -generic, we still lack a few ms 
<Len-nb> The trends in hardware and software seem to be throughput over latency. I read through the PCIe versions and that is the progression.
<Len-nb> The overhead for small packets is the same as for large packets.
<Len-nb> It was good to get an understanding of why serial is able to do faster data movement than parallel.
<zequence> Len-nb: You into classical? Found some old stuff I did about 10 years ago https://dl.dropbox.com/u/12809728/1%20-%20Orchestral%20piece%20in%20g%20flat%20minor.flac
<Len-nb> Almost sounds like a pipe organ in some places, but then I guess the pipe organ is one of the earliest tries at trying to sound like an orchestra.
<Len-nb> zequence, well from a keyboard
<zequence> Len-nb: It's my Roland XV-5050. 
<zequence> I've made some of the sounds myself. And the register at which some instruments are playing wasn't exactly optimally orchestrated
<Len-nb> Synth and not sample?
<zequence> Synth
<zequence> I was working a lot with the synth module for orchestral sounds. The default sounds are not really all good for that
<zequence> Of course, I didn't create the synth "samples"
<zequence> There's a bank of several hundreds of samples of which all presets are based on
<zequence> waveforms. I'm sure you know
<zequence> Here's a fugue https://dl.dropbox.com/u/12809728/4%20-%20Fugue%20in%20C.flac
<zequence> And a cinematic sort of piece https://dl.dropbox.com/u/12809728/2%20-%20Cinematic%20Piece.flac
<zequence> I did a whole lot of music, but have deleted most of it
<zequence> This is more 1910 style https://dl.dropbox.com/u/12809728/3%20-%20Piano%20Piece.flac
<zequence> All of them style studies, compositional practices
<Len-nb> zequence, while I do have more appreciation than at one time, the fact that I can't read music in time says a lot  :)
<Len-nb> I do chord charts and follow peoples hands and my ears.
<zequence> I got into classical music after seeing Amadeus as a teenager. Went to music high school. Got in after only playing music for 1 1/2 years, and learnt notes just before the auditions. During my time in school I felt the time spent on theory/composition was so small, I really just kept learning on my own. Went through everything they had in the library
<zequence> Applied to University, but didn't realize what they were looking for in composition students, so I failed to enter. I could easily get in now, but haven't felt like applying for the longest time
<zequence> I have a problem with the institutions around that sort of music
<zequence> It's not that uncommon for people to start studying again at a later age. Schubert went back to school in his 30s
<zequence> Takes a long time to get your compass straightened out.
<zequence> Just like in life as a whole
<Len-nb> zequence, ya, been there alright.
<len-dt> zequence, interesting thread about RTC and HPET on LAU the last few days
<zequence> len-dt: Yep
#ubuntustudio-devel 2012-11-29
<ttoine> hello
<zequence> hi ttoine 
<ttoine> hi zequence 
<ttoine> I saw that I can work on the content of the website
<ttoine> thanks
<zequence> ttoine: Oh, I didn't do that. :)
<zequence> I'm still waiting for the plugin to be installed. Canonical are working on it
<ttoine> zequence, ok
<zequence> ttoine: and we still need to decide on who does what, and what sort of things we post
<ttoine> zequence, yes
#ubuntustudio-devel 2012-11-30
<ttoine> hello
<scott-wokr> good morning everyone
<len-dt> scott-wokr, good morning...
<scott-wokr> oops
<len-dt> holstein, just a note.. I have been doing a little reading and it appears there is a trade off between throughput and latency. Higher latency/larger chunks of data works better for throughput... and most of the version changes for PCIe have been made to increase throughput,
<len-dt> but... to make bigger data chunks requires bigger headers.
<len-dt> For low latency the data chunks need to be smaller.
<len-dt> on a high throughput system that means the data headers may be as big as the data.
<len-dt> For most uses, bigger throughput seems faster... program loads faster off the disk for example
<len-dt> Audio has different needs.
<len-dt> All that to say, the low latency kernel should not slow the system down unless something is using the lowlatency parts, in which case the desktop may seem slower
#ubuntustudio-devel 2012-12-01
<holstein> len-dt: thats what i was thinking
<holstein> might seem slower actually, instead of faster
<holstein> i think folks read the term "realtime" and want a piece of it.. like its going to speed their machine up
<len-dt> holstein, its all a matter of what the machine is focusing on. Give it less to focus on and it will be faster...
<smartboyhw> Hi zequence. how's it going?
<zequence> smartboyhw: fine. just recovered from the flu
<zequence> you?
<smartboyhw> zequence, you got a flu!?!?!? Thats
<smartboyhw> bad
<smartboyhw> I'm better (for now). Got too busy with tests the past 5 days
<zequence> I was never very sick, but stayed home to not make others sick
<zequence> Bad thing is I can't exercise so much when I'm sick
<smartboyhw> zequence, oh OK
<zequence> I usually go running or cycling almost every day
<smartboyhw> zequence, so hmm I looked at the whole pile of "You want Alpha 1 or not?" emails, and it seems Alpha 1 won't even exist!!!!
<zequence> It would exist for those who want it
<zequence> I think Kubuntu might be the only ones interested in that
<smartboyhw> zequence, yeah. Even Edubuntu quit (I thought Edubuntu was the only one interested:P)
 * smartboyhw goes to look at the UDS pads
<smartboyhw> I painfully discover that the pad is missing:P
<smartboyhw> Not missing, but the whole UDS-R disappeared
 * smartboyhw is very unhappy that Xfce still can't approve a Chinese (Hong Kong) translation team after 3 weeks, with enough people supporting this already
<astraljava> zequence: If it's only flu, though, you will not be making others sick any easier than when you're healthy. It's a misconception, albeit a very common one at that.
<astraljava> A stomach flu, though, is a whole 'nother bomb. :)
<zequence> astraljava: I'm pretty sure you're infectious, especially in the early stages http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Influenza#Mechanism
<astraljava> zequence: Well, you can be spreading it few days before you feel you're sick, or several days after. But yeah ok, cutting a few days off of, say, ten, might still make a difference. :)
<zequence> You're the most infections at the beginning. It's hard to avoid infecting people before feeling symptoms. In my case, there might have been one day when I was doing that. 
<zequence> After the body has started to get a hold of the virus, you may still have a runny nose, but you aren't even nearly as infectious
<zequence> By Monday, I won't be
<zequence> I was staying at home for two reasons really. One because of sickness. Two, I had the chance to take care of other things
<zequence> In Sweden we can stay home from work up to one week at a time, without a doctors report
<astraljava> Yes, that's actually my main reason to stay home whenever I feel sick the slightest. :)
<zequence> I know in Finland, it's a little harder :)
<astraljava> Here that's only three days.
<astraljava> Yeah.
<zequence> When I worked in Finland, I had to show evidence of sickness on the first day
<zequence> This was a summer job at VR
<zequence> I was cleaning trains, and making beds
<astraljava> Ok, it might be tougher for temps.
<zequence> 2003, I think it was
#ubuntustudio-devel 2012-12-02
<ScottL> good morning everyone
<smartboyhw> Hey ScottL 
<ScottL> how are you this morning smartboyhw ?
<ScottL> do you still want to write news for the website?
<smartboyhw> ScottL, good
<smartboyhw> ScottL, yes
<ScottL> i'm hoping to tidy a few things up today, including some wiki stuff, and i hope getting the PR team stuff lined out is one of them :)
<smartboyhw> ScottL, oh good:D
<ScottL> although i am beginning to suspect that this page might be better if it were actually several pages...there is a lot of information that should be included IMO
<ScottL> but i'll do one page for now just to get it done, we can adjust things later as needed of course
<zequence> ScottL: Which wiki page is that?
<ScottL> the PR team page
<ScottL> i was adding a few things about the team itself along with converting what ttoine did into a matrix and completing the milestone vs channel data
<zequence> ScottL: A new one, or this one https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuStudio/PublicRelations ?
<ScottL> also giving it a logical structure
<ScottL> should be that one
<ScottL> yes, that one
 * ScottL is listening to moonlight sonatat
<zequence> ScottL: Moonlight was added afterwards. I suspect, the first piece in that sonata is more of a song of lost love
 * smartboyhw is typing...
<ScottL> i've always found this a very moving piece
<zequence> It's one of a kind
<zequence> ScottL: A task that I put on myself, but haven't finished yet, is deciding on events to post about.
<ScottL> we have a fairly comprehensive list on the page already....i had worried about making sure that we weren't missing any possible event. then i realized i'm trying to make things perfect again, so i'll moving forward with what we have and we can fix and iterate as needed
<ScottL> i'm really trying to avoid that paralyzing "strive for perfection" that has inhibited me too often
<smartboyhw> ScottL, that list is enough for me also:D
<ScottL> aye, smartboyhw, i actually expect that we will most likely _remove_ items from there as "official events for PR" :P
<zequence> I think we can really post everything on social sites, if we want to. While, on mail lists, we need to be more restrictive
<ScottL> zequence: definitely agreed!
<smartboyhw> ScottL, oh:P
<smartboyhw> zequence, +1
<smartboyhw> mailing lists aren't for that much spam
<ScottL> i feel that social is more informal 
<smartboyhw> (well of course that is not spam but...)
<smartboyhw> ScottL, if social is not more informal that what is?
<zequence> So, a matrix for those two channels would be pretty easy to follow
<smartboyhw> zequence, +999999999
 * smartboyhw is syncing the Chrome OS source code to see how he should make of it
<ScottL> but i also wanted to define a few things like the team structure, how to join, what the strategy for PR is, etc, etc...just so others can easily understand a few things wihtout having to bug others :P
<smartboyhw> ScottL, of course we have to:P
<ScottL> smartboyhw: i meant is that i view social media is more informal (and therefore we can "spam" it more) than ML, which might be used in a more "formal" way
<smartboyhw> ScottL, yes that's what I meant
<zequence> Technically, one will only need to do a maximum amount of three different posts. One via WP to all social channels, except G+. A separate post to G+. And one to mail lists. 
 * smartboyhw agrees
<zequence> ScottL: I also think it might be a good idea to have some type of posts reserved for those who are responsible. Such as project lead should post release notes. Testing should post about testing, etc
<ScottL> aye, i wasn't defining that at this point, but i was noting that this should most likely be done
<zequence> Probably anything that is posted on mail lists will be reserved, since all of that is pretty formal
<zequence> So, the informal stuff would only be on social channels
<smartboyhw> Yep
<zequence> ScottL: These are all things I've been thinking about adding myself to the wiki
<zequence> ScottL: Oh, and of course, there's a difference between posting on our own mail lists, which is almost on the same level as social sites
<zequence> between our lists and other mail lists..
<zequence> Our lists are a bit more informal..
<zequence> These next two weeks will be very busy for me, so I won't be doing any work on Ubuntu Studio, other than what is nessecary
<smartboyhw> zequence, eh I can't understand why OUR list is more informal
<ScottL> zequence: how do you feel about posting on the website? should there be a functionality for "informal" posts by any PR team member? for example, what if holstein wanted to post that he was about to start testing something or howard was to say that he was starting coding something?
<smartboyhw> ScottL, then it should be about multimedia (which probably I am not gonna code anything in it)
<zequence> ScottL: I don't think it's a good idea for us to post anything about personal engagements, as it is better to do that on personal blogs/channels. 
<zequence> ScottL: unless of course, some of us was interviewed, and we wanted to share that on our channels
<smartboyhw> zequence, OK then first thing we are gonna add is your interview video during UDS
<smartboyhw> (:P)
<ScottL> zequence: right, i might all ubuntu studio related posts, but the types of quick notes almost, as opposed to a more thoughout, expansive, or formal news post
<ScottL> s/might/meant
<ScottL> if "news" posts on the ubuntu studio website are going to be automatically pushed to the social media channels, this might be a good and easy idea
<zequence> ScottL: I'm not against everything being posted on our website news page. The problem might be that it could get flooded
<zequence> ScottL: If that is a danger, than we should probably only post formal stuff, like we do on mail lists, other than Ubuntu Studio
<ScottL> it could, and it might at first, but i would suspect it would level off as well :P
<zequence> But, have links to our social sites
<zequence> we could also add a new feed to the website, showing a few posts from social sites
<ScottL> when i post things for ubuntu studio i actually use my laptop with vanilla ubuntu and use the 'broadcast' app which is very helpful
<zequence> So, when you go to see news, you see the formal stuff as posts, but in a sideview you'd see some social posting as well
<zequence> ScottL: Just remembered, the plugin. So, whatever is posted on social sites will also be posted on the main site
<smartboyhw> zequence, that's quite good. So when I go to ubuntustudio.org I can see the twitter/g+/gwibber/facebook posts about Ubuntu Studio rolling in the sideline, while the main news is in the middle. Great impression:D
<zequence> ScottL: And the easiest way for the visitor to filter posts, is to use the category links on the sidebar.
<zequence> smartboyhw: Yeah, I don't think that's an option right now, though. We'd need to do some coding on the website theme
<smartboyhw> zequence, yep. 
<ScottL> zequence: we might be discussing two different plugins. i believe you mentioned one that i call a 'social media ticker' which scrubs social media and shows a real-time, updating display of posts with a certain hashtag
<ScottL> zequence: i was talking about something ttoine had mentioned, a plugin that would broadcast our news items from the website out to various social media
<smartboyhw> ScottL, we should implement both
<ScottL> smartboyhw: i am not suggested we choose one or the other :)
<smartboyhw> LOL
<ScottL> i was only asking zequence's thoughts on how formalized we should make "news" posts on our website (ones that we create and then hit the 'publish' button) given that these can also be pushed to social media
<ScottL> at this point, i like the idea of people (on the PR team only) making small announcements on the website, like "i'm starting work on foo and bar now. hope to have something in time for next week"
<zequence> ScottL: No, because at first you were talking about what sort of posts we should have at our website. And I suggested, in order to separate formal from informal, we could recode the website to show posts in two different places. But, then I remembered how the plugin works, so at least for now, I'm not sure how that works. Since we have to do all posts to social sites from the website
<smartboyhw> ScottL, hmm no. Then almost everybody will need to be in the PR team then///
<zequence> I think we can probably post something, then make it a draft on the website, if we really wanted to filter out informal postings from the website news
<zequence> ScottL: I think we have a very different idea of what the material for postings should be. Until now, I have not heard anyone talking about posting about personal work
<zequence> ScottL: Only stuff like is already listed on the wiki
<ScottL> zequence: by "personal work" do you mean non-ubuntustudio?
<zequence> ScottL: I mean like what you just proposed. Just like diary notes from people working on Ubuntu Studio
<ScottL> okay
<zequence> Just because the posts go on social sites, doesn't mean we need to post from a personal point of view. The person is Ubuntu Studio after all
<zequence> ScottL: I think maybe this discussion is just complicating things
<ScottL> right, i was going to gently drop it, actually :D
<smartboyhw> LOL
<zequence> Personally, I only feel what is lacking from the wiki is the clear oversight of what posts go to which channels, and who does some of the formal postings
<zequence> Once that is done, I think everyone can just go to work.
<smartboyhw> zequence, yeah 
<zequence> Once the plugin is installed, and ready to be used, that is..
<ScottL> zequence:  which plugin? and any ETa on it?
<zequence> ScottL: The plugin that I linked to in my email a while back. rt.ubuntu.com has changed the status of my request, but no word on ETA
<ScottL> this is the one that pushes to social media, right?
<zequence> Yea. jetpack
<zequence> I haven't been talking about any other plugins
<smartboyhw> bye zequence ScottL 
<ScottL> bye smartboyhw 
<ScottL> i am finished at this point with the PR website wiki page: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuStudio/PublicRelations
<ScottL> the matrix is NOT complete, i simply put enough in there so others can understand the purpose (hopefully), it will need to be complete by adding other channels (listed below) and correcting the Y's and N's
<ScottL> i need to get other things done today, but i will come back to this page later this afternoon
<ScottL> len-dt: do you remember what was decided for the version number being included in the plymouth text theme?
<len-dt> ScottL, I am thnking you wanted me to remove the version from plymouth and ad it to lightdm.
<ScottL> len-dt: ah, yes. i remember now. thank you :)  i was just saying that if we are hardcore about a version number it could be in the lightdm background...if we really want the version number
<len-dt> ScottL, in any case I should remove the version in plymouth.
<ScottL> len-dt: not trying to be difficult with this question, but...
<ScottL> does it make sense to remove it from plymouth?
<len-dt> ScottL, personally I am good either way.
<len-dt> The graphic theme has no version and the text version does
<len-dt> ScottL, In the end, all I am waiting for is someone to say "make it so"
<ScottL> len-dt: "make it so, number one"
<ScottL> there :D
<len-dt> ScottL, Make so which way? Versioned or not?
<ScottL> i would make the plymouth theme unversioned
<len-dt> Right. got it.
<ScottL> if we are very, very concerned about showing a version (which i really don't think it all _that_ important), we can always do so in the lightdm background
<len-dt> ScottL, probably even have a script that does it based on the version number
<ScottL> oh yeah
<zequence> ScottL: I redid the matrix bit, and really tried to simplify it as much as possible https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuStudio/PublicRelations
<zequence> I hope the assignee part is ok with everyone
<ScottL> i think it is brilliant,very much easier to read, understand, and follow
<ScottL> heh, i just noticed that some of the links have syntax errors
<zequence> ScottL: What links?
<zequence> Oh, and I'm not sure about what would be the preferred way to edit the actual posts
<zequence> I'm thinking we want to add links and pictures sometimes
<ScottL> forums and maybe the user mailing list one
<zequence> Yea
<ScottL> user's list still has the pipe in the middle of it
<zequence> The website posts may be a little different. One could just add some stuff to those posts
<zequence> ScottL: The user mail list is written like that, is not?
<zequence> I misunderstood your one comment. Didn't realize you were talking about syntax errors
<zequence> Ah, now I see it
<zequence> fixed it
<zequence> ScottL: If you're ok with it, we could just delete the legacy data. If we have everything we need as is
<ScottL> yeah, yeah. i was going to ask you about deleting it as well
<zequence> ScottL: Ok, so we are all set then, I guess. I think for now, probably the only person who'd have anything to do is ttoine, and holstein (when he'll have the time)
<zequence> Of course, you and me could do some non formal posting as well, if we wanted to
<zequence> Ahh, but the plugin is not in place. Keep forgetting that
<ScottL> it looks good zequence, thank you very much
<ScottL> do you want to update the blueprint for the matrix tasks?
<ScottL> zequence: i think i can add other to the existing g+ ubuntu studio page. would you like me to try your warpmail email for an invitation?
<zequence> ScottL: My main mail is zequence@mousike.me
<ScottL> incidentally, 'owners' and 'managers' for g+ are explained here; http://support.google.com/plus/bin/answer.py?hl=en&p=pages_multi_admin&answer=2380625
<ScottL> sending invite now
<zequence> ScottL: Cool. It works
<ScottL> outstanding! i'm not sure that is a task to mark done but i want to
<ScottL> ;)
<ScottL> afk a bit again
<zequence> I wonder if we are getting too much credit sometimes http://www.muktware.com/articles/3260/download-awesome-ubuntu-studio-wallpaper?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed:+muktware/feeds+%28Muktware.com%29&utm_content=Google+Reader#.ULvpn5GDAdM
#ubuntustudio-devel 2013-11-28
<cub> Hello people!
<knome> good day
<cub> knome, any winter in Finland yet?
<knome> if that equals snow or below zero, nope
#ubuntustudio-devel 2013-11-30
<cub> What language is most often used for the applications we use in US?
<cub> programming language that is
#ubuntustudio-devel 2015-11-23
<sakrecoer_> OvenWerk1: thanks! good to know :)
<zequence> sakrecoer_: Nice work on the graphics workflow. I might not look at it for a couple of days, so don't feel bad if I don't answer yet.
<sakrecoer_> zequence: no worries! :) is there a complete list of all devs and different team members with  their email somewhere? i'm thinking about those interviews....
<sakrecoer_> maybe i should just post a call for the purpose on the user list...?
<sakrecoer_> yesterday was GIMP's birthday <3 20 years!!!! 
<sakrecoer_> like we say in sweden: "systemmyndig"... (system authority) you have to be 20 to go to the licorstore here which is a statemonopoly company called "Systembolaget"... sorry for OffTopic, thought someone might giggle a bit about it :D
<OvenWerk1> sakrecoer_: :)
<OvenWerk1> sakrecoer_: In Canada The age varies from 18 to 21, 19 where I am in BC
<zequence> sakrecoer_: No list, really. There's the launchpad teams, pretty much.
<sakrecoer_> good enough! i'll post something to the user list anyways. I think its about time you longterm devs get a bit of love for your work, so i'll start with you. But i'm sure there must be lots of great content creators on the userlist too.
<sakrecoer_> by dev i mean the hole team from pr, to support and all that :)
<OvenWerk1> Some of the people on the user list have been around a lot longer than I have.
<sakrecoer_> i wont include myself tho, at least for the comming future... i think it would remove a bit of the authenticity. selfpromotion is delicate subject on internet i have noticed...
<sakrecoer_> i know some of you mostely code, but i think that is a creativity that needs some love too. so i will forge questions for that aswell.
<sakrecoer_> and its good for the community to get to know a little bit about the humans behind it. make it lively... :)
<sakrecoer_> didn't see your reply OvenWerk1 ... sorry for typing you by...
#ubuntustudio-devel 2015-11-24
<OvenWerk1> zequence or micahg: if possible I would like to have ubuntustudio-menu uploaded. Speed is not required :)
<OvenWerk1> https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntustudio-dev/ubuntustudio-menu/ubuntustudio-menu
<zequence> OvenWerk1: I'll upload in a few moments
<zequence> Hmm, think I did an upload before, and forgot to push it our bzr repo :P
<sakrecoer_> thanks zequence , strange, my first mail with the question didn't make it trhu..
<sakrecoer_> does this mean that when i will do sudo apt-get update/grade next time i  my dev install, the menu will be corrected?
<zequence> sakrecoer_: Yes, once the package appears in the archive
<zequence> sakrecoer_: It's in the main archive now as it seems
<zequence> not sure about mirrors
<sakrecoer_> so cool! <3 :)
<sakrecoer_> i'm a bit nervous about adressing the hole user list....giving me blankpaper-complex lol...
<sakrecoer_> i'm thinking about the possiblity to get stuff that is plain bad publicity for all kindsof reason, and how to deal with refusal...
<sakrecoer_> anyways, i'll send it to the dev list this afternoon for approval first.
<sakrecoer_> but one ideas is to ask them to send me their work, explain that there will be some sort of selection involved, and those selected will be interviewed. But it would be nice to have a "comfort prize" for those who get refused, in order to motivate the troops...
<sakrecoer_> maybe the PR-team can form some sort of jury...
<zequence> sakrecoer_: I think you should go ahead and just make decisions as much as possible, since most people here won't have much time for it
<zequence> Instead of having a competition, just say you would like to interview as many as possible, but it also depends on time
<sakrecoer_> excellent one!!
<sakrecoer_> its out there... thanks for the push zequence !
<sakrecoer_> I send it to dev list anyways, no reason to exclude it..
<zequence> sakrecoer_: I answered your post on the mail list. Would you like to learn the whole procedure of building packages?
<zequence> ubuntustudio-menu is a perfect package to start with, so if you have ideas for changes later, you could do the changes yourself.
<zequence> Whenever you get any ideas for changes to it, just let me know, and I'll walk you through the whole procedure
<zequence> OR, if you want to just learn how to build and upload to a PPA, we can do that anytime
<zequence> sakrecoer_: Double posting, or cross posting is usually not recommended. But, it's your soup :)
<sakrecoer_> oh... right.... i actually know it.... typical nervous me.... :/
<sakrecoer_> hopefully, it will make sense anyway, i ask people to answer me directly....
<sakrecoer_> na well... first response dropped in. looking friendly :)
<sakrecoer_> zequence: i'd love to learn the whole procedure!
<zequence> sakrecoer_: So, have you made uploads to a PPA before?
<sakrecoer_> i think you walked me through a bit with the scribus icon bug..
<sakrecoer_> but... i wouldn't say i'm confient about it yet..
<zequence> Right. I should add some really basic examples to our wiki.
<zequence> Ok, time for a siesta on my part
<sakrecoer_> i have to go to work now.... putting it in the wiki will make accessible to more of us..
<sakrecoer_> haha! sweeeeeeet! i dream of siesta :)
<sakrecoer_> have sweet siesta dreams!
<zequence> sakrecoer_: Have fun at work :)
<OvenWerk1> zequence: Thankyou.
<zequence> OvenWerk1: No need to thank me, Len. It's my part of the job until someone else gets upload rights :).
<sakrecoer_> feeling like Bill Medley and Jennifer Warnes at work, and i owe it all to youbuntustudio :D maybe those imagemagick entries are intended for me to learn?
<sakrecoer_> looks like imagemagick is a synfig dependency
<OvenWerk1> sakrecoer_: just sent you email re imagemagick.
<sakrecoer_> Your rock OvenWerk1 :) just answered!
<sakrecoer_> read y'all tomorrow!
#ubuntustudio-devel 2015-11-25
<OvenWerk1> something has changed in the 1604 upgrades, pulse handles logout/in now.
<OvenWerk1> gedit on the other hand greys out a "picture frame" around itself and has no window decorations. Or rather it makes it's own decorations. We may be looking for another text editor :P
<OvenWerk1> Pulse in 16.04 has more options in using jack-sink/source. So my startup script doesn't work for 14.04.
<OvenWerk1> everything is basically working for my autojack starting script. I just have to make sure I don't double start the user's choice device if it is not default :)
<OvenWerk1> sakrecoer_: The extra desktop file in imagemagick may have been fixed. It is not listed as one of the files installed by the package. SO it may have been fixed but the new install did not remove the old file for some reason.
<OvenWerk1> sakrecoer_: It may need to be verified that a live session from a new ISO only has one menu entry.
<OvenWerk1> zequence: medit has more features than mouse pad and looks similar to what we have had with gedit in the past.
<OvenWerk1> sakrecoer_: Imagemagick seems to need a file on the command line to open. Unfortuately, we are not the dev or packager so we can't really second guess what they mean. For our use, adding "Don't show" (or whatever) to the desktop file would make mosty sense... if it is meant to be opened from the menu, the it needs to start with no file.
<OvenWerk1> zequence: in the case of adding extra audio interfaces with zita-ajbridge, I have set it to two channels only (the default) but maybe it should be all. Comments?
<OvenWerk1> wow zita-ajbridge now allows no SR if the devices are already synced.
#ubuntustudio-devel 2015-11-26
<zequence> OvenWerk1: I would add all channels. Why would anyone add more cards, but only two channels from each?
<sakrecoer_> OvenWerk1: the grey-out frame arround the window in 16.04 is also present arrouund the menus that pop up from the xfce4-pannel icons...
<sakrecoer_> must be some png that was saved without the gammalayer
<sakrecoer_> or is missing..
<sakrecoer_> in gedit, the png frame is there, there is clearly a shadow shade... 
<sakrecoer_> in xfce4-pannel, its only the indicator plugin that gives the grey frame.
<OvenWerk1> zequence: yes, I will add them all. I have to find out how many there are first as zita-ajbridge does not have a "useall" option.
<OvenWerk1> sakrecoer_: While I am sure the grey frame will get "fixed" in gedit, I am not so sure it will look like it belongs as it wants to draw it's own window decorations that are different from the rest.
<OvenWerk1> zequence: I think I also need to be able to add interfaces to ignore: IGNORE=CAMERA AudioPCI,1
<OvenWerk1> For example. (hw:AudioPCI,1 happens to block the input for AudioPCI,0)
<OvenWerk1> ... not that very many people have those any more, I would actually block both because my purpose for the card is the MIDI port.
<sakrecoer_> OvenWerk1: yeah... i struggled to understand what was missing at first. i think it looks good, but i don't think it is very clever of the gedit devs to do it like that...
<OvenWerk1> sakrecoer_: it looks good if everything else looks the same. In times gone by it was always a problem that kde apps looked very different from Gnome apps and older apps are different again.
<OvenWerk1> sakrecoer_: so there was an effort to make things so they could be somewhat unified.
<OvenWerk1> That seems to be going out the door again.
<OvenWerk1> sakrecoer_: take a look at xfig for what I mean by old  :)
 * OvenWerk1 still uses xfig from time to time.
<Accidentalmeme> Hello
#ubuntustudio-devel 2015-11-27
<sakrecoer_> OvenWerk1: hehe.... old and classy! Look up "vapor wave" and you will start to wonder, weather your old xfig isn't going to become modern again soon :D
<sakrecoer_> anyways i fully agree that matching desktop is the way to go...
<OvenWerk1> zequence: Can we try clearing out our desktop seed and just putting in xubuntu-desktop? (just to see what happens) We may need to add replaces lines in some of our setting packages and blacklist some of their other packages... but maybe not too.
<OvenWerk1> zequence: maybe if we load some of our settings packages before the desktop with the right "replaces" in place it will "just work"
<zequence> OvenWerk1: I think we should try by just creating some custom packates on a PPA. Should be possible to do custom installations with ubiquity making changes to the sources before installing
<zequence> Haven't tried that yet
#ubuntustudio-devel 2015-11-28
<zequence> OvenWerk1: Maybe it will take me more than a day to sync with Xubuntu. I started looking at default settings.
<zequence> I'm doing other things today as well
<zequence> A note to myself, or anyone else. The Xubuntu maintenance script, debian/xubuntu-default-settings.maintscript has some stuff in it that we may or may not want to include
<zequence> One change they did was rename /etc/lighdm/lightdm.conf.d/10-xubuntu.conf to /<path>/50-xubuntu.conf
<zequence> I'm adding that, but will check other settings later, if needed
<zequence> OvenWerk1: I will not make changes to what is in /etc/xdg/xdg-ubuntustudio/menus. Perhaps you would like to have a look at that once the new ISO is out (today, or Monday the latest), and see if you want to change something there
<zequence> Ok, -default-settings is done, except for the .maintscript and the menu stuff.
<zequence> I'll do the seeds later..
<zequence> Xubuntu has done more work on their core and desktop seeds, removing core stuff from desktop as it seems. We'll do the same, and this also means we could provide a -core desktop alternative to the full -desktop
<zequence> Ok, all uploaded. Let's hope it works :).
<zequence> Downloading latest ISO now. Been a while since there were any big surprises :P
<zequence> Well, the studio icon is missing from the menu, at least
<OvenWerk1> zequence: That is really very minor.... well, it does mean config of the panel, which means we keep /etc/dxg/xdg_ubuntustudio/
<OvenWerk1> zequence: which menu?
<OvenWerk1> zequence: which icon theme?
<zequence> From the whisker menu button
<zequence> Only did a quick run in VBox so far.
<OvenWerk1> zequence: That makes sense as whisker has different config from the panel menu.
<OvenWerk1> it does use the same xdg menu files though.
<hanno> Hi. I have a question about packaging for Ubuntu and jackd.
<hanno> I know that you guys are using jackd by default.
<hanno> I'm trying to package Sonic Pi to .deb
<hanno> That works, but the jackd stuff is a hurdle for users.
<hanno> I wonder if Sonic Pi is using jackd the "right" way or not.
<hanno> SP comes from the Raspberry Pi and there it works out of the box, but not on default Ubuntu.
<hanno> I want to package that .deb so that it works out of the box on Debian, Ubuntu (all flavours) and Raspbian...
<OvenWerk1> hanno: linux is ALSA. Jackd or pulse or almost anything in the linux world needs ALSA at some point.
<hanno> Sonic Pi relies on jackd.
<OvenWerk1> hanno: Really? jack is not trivial on the r-pi
<hanno> Really.
<hanno> Sonic Pi is an IDE to a ruby-based interpreter that makes sound through SuperCollider. And SuperCollider sends its audio to jackd.
<OvenWerk1> there are two jackd packages in ubuntu (or debian where the ubuntu packages come from): Jackd1 and jackd2
<OvenWerk1> that makes sense.
<hanno> You can try it yourself here: https://launchpad.net/~hzulla/+archive/ubuntu/sonic-pi/+packages
<hanno> That's what I got so far. What I need now is some sort of review by other people who package audio-related software that needs jackd.
<hanno> Who'd want to tell me how to get it "right".
<OvenWerk1> so depends need to be either/or for the two packages though to be honest many jack related packages in debian just look for jack2 and jack1 uninstalls a bunch if not done right. :P
<hanno> I'm just a casual contributor. The Sonic Pi main developers write their stuff on OS X and test on the RPi. x86 Desktop Linux isn't their main target and thus it doesn't work perfectly.
<OvenWerk1> :)
<hanno> The code starts jackd from inside the application https://github.com/samaaron/sonic-pi/blob/master/app/server/sonicpi/lib/sonicpi/scsynthexternal.rb
<hanno> I'm not quite sure if this is "right", but know next to nothing about developing for jackd and so I'm asking here.
<OvenWerk1> killall is not very nice. The idea is that jack runs and clients don't turn it off or on, just use it if it is there.
<OvenWerk1> anyway, a killall jackd will not work.
<hanno> Is there an Ubuntu .deb that shows how it's done right?
<OvenWerk1> you would need to killall -9 jackd jackdbus.
<OvenWerk1> There are some audio interfaces that will not start at all at 44100hz, most are designed for 48000 for best sound.
<OvenWerk1>  A good reason to let the running jack handle things.
<OvenWerk1> Ah, I was looking at the rpi code, linux is below.
<OvenWerk1> you might try -n 2 or -p 1024 (not both) I know at least one of my audio IFs will not work above 2048 at 2 frames.
<OvenWerk1> buffer isn't big enough.
<OvenWerk1> hanno: Are you saying this script will not startjack?
 * OvenWerk1 installs SC
<hanno> I'm more concernced if this is the right way to handle jackd.
 * hanno got to go now.
<hanno> If you have suggestions about how to improve this, please send me an email (it's in the changelog) or write to the team via a github issue.
<hanno> I'd be very thankful to find out how to make this thing more Linuxy.
<OvenWerk1> I would let the user run it, but it looks like it would work most of the time... -p 1024 I would go with.
<hanno> We want to make this work out of the box and painlessly.
<hanno> But that's not the case right now, except on RPi.
<hanno> Thanks OvenWerk1!
<OvenWerk1> Ya, I can see that. Except on a distro with jack built in just getting it set up and understanding jack's limits is a pain.
#ubuntustudio-devel 2015-11-29
<EtroS> Hey everyone, just thought I'll drop by and say Thanks for the awesome system
<NoklaM> Just joined the testing team, although not sure where to go from here
<zequence> NoklaM: You want to help with testing?
<zequence> Make sure to subscribe to our -devel mail list, and keep up with what is going on, and just jump in when there's something that you can help with.
<zequence> Our testing lead is Ross Gammon. He's preparing testing for this development release.
<zequence> You can read a bit more about that here https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-studio-devel/2015-November/007124.html
<NoklaM> Yup, defo gonna help with testing, I think I subbed to the devel list, I've also installed the 16.03 version :)
<NoklaM> s/.03/.04
<NoklaM> + the .iso from the topic worked only with UEFI mode on mobo, refused to boot in legacy mode, just mentioning, dunno where to put this
<zequence> NoklaM: Most probably the boot problems are the same on all flavors, so double check with vanilla Ubuntu, and if you have the same problem, report a bug.
<zequence> And, this is how you report the bug:
<zequence> Legacy mode did not work, so you boot into UEFI mode. Open a terminal. type: ubuntu-bug grub
<zequence> Sorry
<zequence> ubuntu-bug grub2
<zequence> Here's something about testing ISOs, specifically about the bug part https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuStudio/Testing/ISOTesting#If_you_find_bugs
<zequence> NoklaM: Welcome to the team, btw! If you like, present yourself on our -devel mail list, and let others know you exist and want to help
<NoklaM> Thanks :), will do as soon as i figure out how to post to it :)
<NoklaM> might sound lame but in my 20 years on pc never used a mailing list
<zequence> NoklaM: Just write an email to the email address Ubuntu-Studio-devel@lists.ubuntu.com
<NoklaM> ah wicked, so simple
<zequence> It will only go through if the sender is subscribed
<zequence> Currently we are doing some changes to the desktop, so if you find any problems with it, let us know. Here, or on the mail list. Both work.
<NoklaM> I noticed that during the installation, the desktop on live showed the XFCE manu
<NoklaM> i was scared it's gonna persist trough the install to the final stage
<zequence> Yeah, that one needs to be fixed
<zequence> I just made the changes yesterday, so I missed something. Will try to fix that tomorrow.
<NoklaM> I've just read on the mailing list that there is some mention of a in house desktop menu or environment, I did some UX while back
<zequence> UX?
<NoklaM> user Experience design
<NoklaM> Sorry, my father decided it's perfect time to reset the router without informing me 
<NoklaM> Where did it cut-off zequence ?
<zequence> NoklaM: Ah, I was away for a while.
<zequence> You said "user Experience design"
<NoklaM> Ah, basicly making the menus and interface as painless as possible for the end user, that's UX in short
<zequence> Ok. Well, we're actually trying to get away from most of the DE stuff, since there are too few people interesting on working on that.
<zequence> Our custom menu looked better in the old menu (we started using the new one, "whiskers" yesterday)
<zequence> Also, the menu should work with any freedesktop compatible menu, like the KDE menu
<zequence> What happens is a few new submenus are added
<zequence> The logic behind the submenus comes from freedesktop categorization
<zequence> http://standards.freedesktop.org/menu-spec/latest/apa.html
<zequence> Though, we aren't following it yet, perfectly
<NoklaM> As far as I understand most DE's are themable right?
<zequence> Sure
<NoklaM> Once one is set in stone I might look in to it and make it look less stock like :P
<zequence> We don't really have our own theme currently
<NoklaM> Although there is nothing wrong with stock
<zequence> We only have a few custom icons
<zequence> We had a custom theme back when we were still using gnome2
<NoklaM> I seen there is colour picked for the icon as a standard one, could work around that
<zequence> I had the idea to have specific colors for the different workflows, and worked together with our art lead, Zak, and some other folks a couple of years ago to sum those up
<zequence> Been a while, so I would need to look through that again to see what it was we were doing
<zequence> Zak is not around much, but he will be art lead this cycle. He's the guy who made the wallpaper and our social channel artwork
<zequence> The blue is a classic Ubuntu Studio theme color
<zequence> If you want to check out some of the artwork, you can get it from our bazaar branch
<zequence> First, install bazaar: sudo apt-get install bzr
<NoklaM> :)
<zequence> Then, also in the terminal, do: bzr branch lp:ubuntustudio-artwork
<zequence> It's not complete, and in total disorder
<NoklaM> just checking now
<NoklaM> that's some nice assets there
<zequence> If you google "Ubuntu Studio desktop theme" you should find some pics of the old gtk2 theme
<zequence> black, dark grey, white and blue
<NoklaM> Purely theoreticly, HTML5 as layer on top of the DE, would that work?
<zequence> Gnome3 uses css
<zequence> NOt sure about gtk3, which is everything within the window borders. XFCE uses it also, but lot of things there I'm not sure of
<zequence> A guy called cfhowlett has been working on porting the old gtk2 theme to gtk3. I've been planning on including it as an alternative, but that's about as much work we've done on desktop theming for the past few years.
<zequence> Anyway, got to go. I'll check in later, so if you think of anything just write here or on the mail list.
<NoklaM> Sure thing, have a good one
<flocculant> hi Rosco2 :)
<Rosco2> hi
<flocculant> wish you all the luck in the world getting testcases done :)
<Rosco2> It is a hard sell :-)
<Rosco2> I am sure I will have to do a lot myself
<flocculant> really? never noticed ha ha 
<flocculant> I'd have likely been more available last cycle to help out - but got my own lts to worry about
<flocculant> I will though do what I can to help get things on the tracker and available for you
<Rosco2> Yeah - thanks
<Rosco2> It is good to have someone to help me through the learning curve
<flocculant> what might be a useful thing to do is create a folder on the project for studio specific tests - keeps them in one place 
<flocculant> we do that for xubuntu - xfce stuff is seperate from things others might use like mousepad
<flocculant> Rosco2: I'm only ever a ping or mail away, so whenever you have a question, and I'll hang about in this channel too 
<Rosco2> folder? do you have a link, or do you mean bzr branches on the us-testing team launchpad?
<flocculant> if you want to do that with a folder ubuntu-manual-tests/testcases/packages/studio soon ish I'll merge it asap
<flocculant> Rosco2: nope on the manual testcases
<Rosco2> got it - thanks
<flocculant> I did do Agave basic test a while back - so one's done :p
<NoklaM> don't worry Rosco2 I'll help ya with those test cases :P
<Rosco2> NoklaM: Excellent news
<Rosco2> Let us know how you get on as you get started
<NoklaM> I'm going over the list looking for programs I have a clue about. Do we do only basic test like the ones described or can we go in "deeper"
<Rosco2> I would like to start with a small quick test for as many as possible
<Rosco2> we can add more depth later
<Rosco2> If the tests are too long some testers may give up
<flocculant> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-testcase/ubuntu-manual-tests/trunk/view/head:/testcases/packages/1662_Agave
<Rosco2> Expert testers can always go deeper anyway and report bugs they find
<Rosco2> flocculant: Was just looking at it
<Rosco2> Good idea to have a folder like Xfce
<flocculant> yea 
<flocculant> Rosco2: actually I'll just do that if you like now - just what to call it ? studio would be my fave :p
<NoklaM> ok, kinda got lost after setting up my name in bzr
<flocculant> NoklaM: how far did you get? 
<NoklaM> d'oh and Studio crashed when alt-tabing
<flocculant> bzr whoami "NoklaM <noklam's e-mail> should do it - bzr whoami should return who it thinks you are, then bzr launchpad-login LPusername 
<flocculant> afaik
<NoklaM> i think that worked
<flocculant> :)
<NoklaM> and which branch do I add or do I add any?
<Rosco2> flocculant: studio would be fine
<flocculant> NoklaM: hang on - let me set up this new home for studio 
<NoklaM> okie dokie
<flocculant> Rosco2: ok - all done 
<flocculant> NoklaM: bzr branch lp:ubuntu-manual-tests
<NoklaM> tyvm kind sir
<flocculant> open that up once it's there - in testcases/packages you will see a studio folder - create your testcases in there :)
<Rosco2> Yes - just name the new file after the app
<flocculant> don't add a number though - that gets added elsewhere and by admins
<Rosco2> You beat me. A sequential number gets added to the filename later in the process
<Rosco2> I remember wondering about that last time
<flocculant> Rosco2: :)
<NoklaM> Got it
<flocculant> NoklaM: also assign yourself to bug associated with the testcase your writing, link your code to it, then it all gets tied up properly down the road :)
<NoklaM> D'oh run Jack AUDIO server with aeolus for testing, now not sure it should disable my normal headphones audio or is it a feature
<NoklaM> I'll better stick to what I know
<flocculant> sounds familiar - that'll be why I started looking and stopped :p
<NoklaM> I'm doing krita, actually used to for 30 minutes before, just could somene guide me through hand on adding the file?
<NoklaM> I mean when I do bzr add krita, it throws an error that the file doesn't exist
<flocculant> NoklaM: bzr add
<flocculant> bzr knows what it has - you just tell it to add and it does 
<flocculant> NoklaM: then you want to commit your changes bzr commit -m 'new testcase for foo' for example
<NoklaM> ah I see, I didn't create the file in the first place manualy
<flocculant> not sure what you mean
<NoklaM> What I had to do was create a krita file in the Studio folder
<NoklaM> then add it :P
<flocculant> aah - yes :)
<flocculant> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/QATeam/ContributingTestcases/Manual/Writing and https://wiki.ubuntu.com/QATeam/DevelopmentToolsUsage
<flocculant> go through from grabbing the branch, doing your thing, pushing it 
<NoklaM> wicked, thanks :D
<flocculant> welcome :)
<flocculant> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/QATeam/ContributingTestcases/ManualStyleGuide/test_case_format_script makes sure that what you've written passes for syntax
<flocculant> then you wait for a tame testcase admin to check it out :D
<NoklaM> Can I show my file to someone before I push it?
<NoklaM> Literally paranoid that I made 10x mistakes in 3 tests
<NoklaM> in the file writing that is
<flocculant> NoklaM: if you want pastebin it and I'll have a quick look 
<NoklaM> http://pastebin.com/KgJYRBsb <-- flocculant 
<flocculant> kind of :)
<flocculant> 2 ticks
<NoklaM> what did I mess up?
<flocculant> http://pastebin.com/A4GUBDML
<flocculant> not that you messed up
<flocculant> basically
<flocculant> this test tests foo
<flocculant> <dt> do this
<flocculant> <dd> this happens 
<flocculant> imagine someone who learnt english following it - make it as obvious as you can
<flocculant> also - not that you did, never use UbuntuStudio or Xubuntu or Ubuntu - just use FAMILY in uppercase and then it works out which flavour you're testing :)
<flocculant> NoklaM: what we try to do is make tests as agnostic as we can - so anyone can use a test 
<NoklaM> Ah I see
<NoklaM> so just KISS method
<flocculant> yep
<NoklaM> and I have to add the <strong> section also
<flocculant> yea 
<flocculant> that is in all testcases
<NoklaM> just checking before i push "bzr push lp:~noklam/ubuntu-manual-tests/testcases/packages/Studio"
<NoklaM> Sorry for the amount of questions
<flocculant> you're welcome - push to bzr push lp:~noklam/ubuntu-manual-tests/studio
<flocculant> or
<flocculant> you could lp:~noklam/ubuntu-manual-tests/krita
<flocculant> when I do it 
<flocculant> I find the bug I'm fixing and use the number 
<flocculant> so
<flocculant> lp:~noklam/ubuntu-manual-tests/1183889
<flocculant> up to you really :)
<flocculant> and assign yourself to https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-manual-tests/+bug/1183889
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1183889 in Ubuntu Manual Tests "Test Needed: Krita" [Undecided,New]
<flocculant> then link your mp to that bug 
<NoklaM> I broke it /panicmode
<flocculant> heh
<NoklaM> Oh the bot just anounces it
<flocculant> NoklaM: ok I can see that 
<flocculant> you need to propose for merging - you can put my nick in the reviewer box
<flocculant> it might all seem long winded at the moment - but it does make it all followable in 6 months time :)
<NoklaM> I can imagine it looking funny if people didn't follow rules and after 6 months everyone was like /oops
<NoklaM> Source branch it will be merged to is the ubuntu-manual-tests development focus one?
<flocculant> NoklaM: one last thing and I'll deal with it :)
<flocculant> https://code.launchpad.net/~noklam/ubuntu-manual-tests/studio
<flocculant> see where it says Link a bug report? 
<flocculant> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-manual-tests/+bug/1183889
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1183889 in Ubuntu Manual Tests "Test Needed: Krita" [Undecided,New]
<flocculant> use the number there - and assign you to the bug
<NoklaM> You mean report a bug?
<flocculant> nope - the bug is already there link above, assign it to you - that shows everyone it was you who fixed the bug
<flocculant> and link it to your code which fixes it 
<OvenWerk1> NoklaM: with reguard to ISO boots. The last ISO I booted I was able to boot either way (bios/efi). Some of this stuff depends on the system I guess.
<NoklaM> My mobo is picky I guess, but it didn't like windows 7 either
<NoklaM> I got a feeling I broke something
<NoklaM> just not sure what yet
<OvenWerk1> Things do change from iso to iso as well, I installed mine two weeks ago. I am DL the new one so I can fix the menu :)
<NoklaM> Oh I got a fresh one this morning I think
<NoklaM> from the link above /topic
<flocculant> NoklaM: ok - merged that, linked the two, in future can you mark bugs as fix commited though - fix is released when someone adds it to the tracker database 
<OvenWerk1> I am using zsync which says there is a 22% difference from the last one I downloaded.
<flocculant> hi OvenWerk1 
<OvenWerk1> o/
<NoklaM> okie dokie, thanks
<NoklaM> eh, I just realised I could have tested pressure sensitivity and all those gimmicks in krita with my tablet
<NoklaM> o.O
<NoklaM> got a wacom bamboo, might as well do another graphics app and test it there
<OvenWerk1> Ah, we need more people who are graphics centered.
 * OvenWerk1 is almost completely audio headed.
<NoklaM> I got AKG microphone but that's about it, bought it, heard my voice on recording and ditched it
<flocculant> ha ha 
<OvenWerk1> my vision is to see Studio work as well out of the box for graphics and video as it does for Audio. But I don't know what would be useful in those areas.
<NoklaM> Well GIMP does work great out of the box so does Krita
<OvenWerk1> NoklaM: setting up colour on the monitor maybe not..
<NoklaM> I'll check that
 * flocculant hasn't a graphic bone in his body, nor musical unless you count listening all day :p
<NoklaM> Is there any streaming - as in spotify type - programs for Linux?
<OvenWerk1> I expect the apps themselves work well, but any system tweaks to make the tools like tablets for input and monitor set work would be great.
<OvenWerk1> do you have a link I could look at?
<NoklaM> link to ?:P
<OvenWerk1> a page that tells me what spotify is?
<NoklaM> oh :D
<NoklaM> spotify.com
<NoklaM> It's a commercial app for streaming music
<NoklaM> is even free if you don't mind few adds
<OvenWerk1> There are certainly streaming tools like icecaste that one can stream their own music through. Most of the Linux players already are able to use it.
<OvenWerk1> there is idjc which has everything needed to set up a radio studio with mics, playlist, jingle lists, phone i/o  crossfades etc.
<NoklaM> That sounds awesome
<OvenWerk1> I had set something like that up at home here, but my family has such distinct tastes...
<NoklaM> What music you in to?
<OvenWerk1> Lots of things from older rock from the last century to country, blues, folk etc.
<OvenWerk1> Lots of things from older rock from the last century to country, blues, folk etc.
<NoklaM> Bluegrass by any chance?
<NoklaM> The joys of running a unstable release
 * OvenWerk1 finds there is a lot of music he enjoys playing but not listening to so much :)
<OvenWerk1> I like some bluegrass too.
<NoklaM> It's very Irish folk like, 
<NoklaM> Also drumkv3 crashed my pc a second ago
<OvenWerk1> I got soured on it a bit a few years ago I had a friend who could play only one song on his banjo and so got tired of it.
<NoklaM> I had an urge to buy a banjo not so long ago
<OvenWerk1> gtk and qt based audio plugins are going through some upheaval just now.
<NoklaM> but I still didn't recover from the sore fingers from guitar
<NoklaM> My underbed is full of old instruments I'd like to play but I'm to busy with the pc
<OvenWerk1> I play bass and guitar. I have started playing mandolin as well.
<NoklaM> Now bass is awesome, I had a go at a pwn shop, I literally just plucked the strings and they sounded awesome
<OvenWerk1> The mandolin was passed down from my father a few years ago, but I only played it in public the first time a few weeks ago.
<NoklaM> Do you have a beard?
<NoklaM> Cause that should be a part of the kit when playing mandolin
<NoklaM> Also the docker at the bottom of the screen, is there a way to get rid of it?
<OvenWerk1> easy to get rid of
<NoklaM> I just clicked it and it vanished, well the - on it
<OvenWerk1> right click on it, pannel->pannel prefferences
<OvenWerk1> in the dialog click the big red minus sign
<NoklaM> That should come with the manual
<OvenWerk1> I made mine vertical and put it on my right monitor in a smaller size.
<NoklaM> Honestly It's been 8 year since I go tmy 1st Ubuntu CD and I still only know how to brake it
<NoklaM> I got stuck in the windows zone, but since I kinda dislike constant spying and value my privacy a bit I switched back for good
 * OvenWerk1 plays this bass: http://www.ibanez.co.jp/products/u_eb_page15.php?year=2015&cat_id=2&series_id=51&data_id=51&color=CL01
<NoklaM> wow
<OvenWerk1> I want to get a matching bass with frets
<NoklaM> It's mahogany, i probably wouldn't be able to afford the body of it
<OvenWerk1> I have an old Squire I got cheap. I pulled the frets out and filled the slots so I could try fretless playing.
<NoklaM> How did that go?
<OvenWerk1> I ended up using it a lot because it is 3 pounds lighter than my RIC
<NoklaM> that's like 1.5kg
<OvenWerk1> It was ok, but once I got the SR I realized how a ready hard neck makes a huge difference in playablility.
<OvenWerk1> Ya, I was using my shoulders a lot at work (letter carrying for Canada Poste) and needed less on my days off.
<NoklaM> Don't they give you cars?
<NoklaM> Or you have to carry a bag?
<OvenWerk1> I had a footwalk. On a heavy day I might deal with as much as 350 pounds of mail.
<NoklaM> oh man, ouch.
<OvenWerk1> that is in 35 pound or so chunks
<NoklaM> I've yet to see postman on foot in Ireland
<NoklaM> They got so used to cars they do 25m2 block with a car
<OvenWerk1> They are woring to do tha here too, but I would rather do the walk
<NoklaM> It would be a national protest here if they told em to go on foot
<NoklaM> I bet
<OvenWerk1> they would have to hire more people... that could be a good thing too
<flocculant> hah - they walk about where I am in england
<OvenWerk1> The reason they want to go to trucks here is to use less people.
<NoklaM> I live in the sticks, so everything is kinda far away from each other
<OvenWerk1> Our rural routes are all truck.
<NoklaM> closest shop? 20 mnutes walk
<flocculant> 15  minutes here
<NoklaM> 20s to Tesco, not good for me:( no deli haha
<NoklaM> If I walk I do another 5-7 minutes to a petrol station with a deli
<NoklaM> Did you lads see mcdonalds replacing workers with menu machines
<flocculant> nah
<OvenWerk1> not here.
<NoklaM> They got few out in US i heard because of the higher wages 
<NoklaM> Doesn't bother them in Ireland tho, 9.05 or 9.15 Eur from January
<NoklaM> that's what they have to pay to the over 18s in full time
<OvenWerk1> There are too many people here who would not be able to use a machine. (lots of older people)
<flocculant> or ones like me who just refuse point-blank to do so 
<flocculant> I don't use them in supermarkets either
<NoklaM> but in all honesty it's kinda going that way, automotion
<OvenWerk1> I don't use selfserve checkouts either.
<OvenWerk1> no choice for gas... (petrol?)
<NoklaM> Self Service petrol station?
<OvenWerk1> all of them.
<NoklaM> Oh wow, i seen one nearby Dublin once
<NoklaM> But that's about it
<OvenWerk1> There may be one or two full service places around, but you have to know where they are.
<NoklaM> oh wow
<NoklaM> And I thought if I move to Canada it will be easy to find a job
<NoklaM> but with my qualifications clerk on petrol station is max
<OvenWerk1> depends where (and when)
<NoklaM> I'd like somewhere sunny :P Is that an option in Canada?
<NoklaM> sick of rain and wind
<OvenWerk1> your pick, rain and wind or sun and cold and snow.
 * OvenWerk1 lives in the Comox Valley
<NoklaM> The thought of snow scares me, I seen it once in last 4  years and it was whole 2 inches that blocked the country
<OvenWerk1> there is a difference between dry snow and wet snow. Dry is easier to deal with.
<OvenWerk1> I grew up in Calgary Alberta.
<flocculant> NoklaM: don't forget that here and where you are, we don't really get snow, so don't spend â¬'s or Â£'s on dealing with it generally
<flocculant> hence Heathrow shuts with half an inch ... 
<OvenWerk1> Terrace BC if you like _lots_ of snow.
<NoklaM> Oh no, I'd stay away from it
<NoklaM> It's like rain, but its solid
<NoklaM> I never see people put winter tyres here
<NoklaM> And half or 1 inch drops and the whole country comes to a stop 
<OvenWerk1> Ontario sometimes has a lot too, because of the Great lakes. Alberta is cold but mostly sunny, the snow doesn't get that deep.
<OvenWerk1> NoklaM: The difference is that an inch of snow where you are vanishes the same or next day. In Calgary an inch of snow might stick around for 6 weeks.
<NoklaM> That's true I've never seen last longer than 2 days
<flocculant> I'm old enough to have seen it in England 
<NoklaM> I've only been here 10 years
<flocculant> I've been here since 1963 :D
<NoklaM> I'm not 10 btw :P
<flocculant> ha ha 
 * OvenWerk1 has to go.
<OvenWerk1> o/
<flocculant> cya OvenWerk1 
<NoklaM> See you mate, was nice chatting to you :)
<flocculant> I should too - got a session to be ready for later https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/xubuntu-devel/2015-November/010969.html
<flocculant> NoklaM might have an interest in that - it'll be xubuntu based, but the basics will be pretty much agnostic
<NoklaM> Was just thinking that
<NoklaM> Since I have ton a of questions
<NoklaM> And finally my mailing list is working
<NoklaM> I can reply /woopwoop
<flocculant> :)
<flocculant> NoklaM: well as long as a question works for me with my real hat on I'll answer it :)
<NoklaM> You won't probably believe it but I've been running circles on the launchpad website
<NoklaM> still can't find the one saying which softwar eneeds to be tested
<flocculant> oh right
<flocculant> I can link you to the list of bugs for needed testcases for Studio
<NoklaM> oh would be awesome
<flocculant> you won't find testing yet - that's not set up and lives somewhere else
<flocculant> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-manual-tests/+bugs?field.tag=ubuntu-studio&orderby=-id&start=0
<NoklaM> tyvm :)
<flocculant> NoklaM: just remember, find a bug, assign you, do the testcase, push MP, link bug to that MP, propose fix
<NoklaM> Just looking for the ones i have at least slight idea of how they work
<flocculant> yep - completely understood
<flocculant> and I'm good with you putting me as reviewer too 
<NoklaM> awesome :)
<flocculant> now you've got the basic hang of it - just push them, if there's an issue I will comment on the proposal
<NoklaM> There is few i might have an idea how to run
<NoklaM> and what they do
<NoklaM> Honestly I was overwhelmed with the amount of software that came with Studio
<NoklaM> Was either Studio or try to run Mac OSX on AMD cpu
<NoklaM> Windows just pushed the line
<flocculant> NoklaM: I would guess that the best thing to do if you're more graphic is to do those
<flocculant> I'm pretty sure that Rosco2 is just pleased to have someone helping and if you can do a % that's going to be \o/ 
<flocculant> this has whole testing thing's been floating about for quite a while
<NoklaM> d'oh shrini was faster than me on inkscape
<Rosco2> You bet :-)
<flocculant> :D
<Rosco2> Just been updating https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuStudio/Testing/Testcases
<Rosco2> Glad to add krita!
<flocculant> NoklaM: perhaps but if you look at the code from shrini I asked a couple of months ago if it was still being worked on
<flocculant> so - if you can actually do the deed and propose a test - that'll supersede something from Aug 2014 ;)
<NoklaM> I'll be glad to
 * flocculant is pretty much totally aware of what's going on with manual testcase code
<flocculant> Rosco2: at some point you're going to need to try and get your head around the admin side of the trackers - I'd be happy to help you out, but I'm guessing timezones will make week hard, so I would make myself available at a weekend for an hour or so 
<Rosco2> I just logged in actually.
<flocculant> might need zequence to add me to your release team temporarily so I can actually see things on the tracker
<Rosco2> Need to link the test cases to some test suites
 * flocculant can't admin studio stuff
<Rosco2> Like US Audio, visio graphics etc
<Rosco2> whoops video
<flocculant> Rosco2: perhaps start working with an etherpad on what you want to see it looking like
<Rosco2> good idea
<flocculant> I can make notes on what I've learnt about it all when I've time then :)
<NoklaM> argh bzr keeps commiting on the first file i created instead of the latest
<NoklaM> tried bzr help commit but there ain't much there
<OvenWerk1> bzr add?
<NoklaM> did that and still commits on the 1st file
<NoklaM> I wonder did it work
<NoklaM> d'oh
<NoklaM> how do I cancel a push?
<NoklaM> nvm:P
<flocculant> NoklaM: that's why I do that push to different branches bzr push lp:~flocculant/ubuntu-manual-tests/bug#foo example
<flocculant> you keep pushing to the same branch so the old stuff shows still 
<NoklaM> I just changed the dir and it updated it hinks
<NoklaM> I thinks*
<flocculant> as it is = please push it again so that inkscape is inside /Studio - don't need folders for everything :)
<NoklaM> ok :P
<flocculant> check out the /xfce branch of the testcase 
<flocculant> s
<OvenWerk1> I use two local directories (at least with GIT) So for https://github.com/ovenwerks/mcpdisp I have ~/software/mcpdisp/mcpdisp/ and ~/software/mcpdisp/work/
<flocculant> OvenWerk1: yea - I don't know enough about bzr to comment tbh
<flocculant> I just push my bugfixes to specific branches like bzr push lp:~flocculant/ubuntu-manual-tests/bug#
<OvenWerk1> I pull to the first and then do all my work in work... if I screw work up too much I can delete the whole directory and reclone from the local clean copy. For mcpdisp that is not too important, but for something like Ardour a reclone from the master takes forever.
<Rosco2> Yes. It is best to pull the latest bzr before starting a new testcase
<flocculant> NoklaM: aah yes - before starting on a new one bzr pull 
<Rosco2> And create a new branch from that to work on the bug as flocculant says
<OvenWerk1> bzr status   will normally tell you what you are going to commit.
<flocculant> assuming someone has done the merge
<flocculant> frankly when I was doing a lot - I just kept pulling branch afresh - and delete the old one
<flocculant> pulling here takes ~15 seconds :D
<flocculant> bzr still does my head in at frequent intervals I have to say :)
<flocculant> Rosco2: if nothing else - this was a really useful few hours :)
<flocculant> NoklaM deserves a Gold Star :)
<NoklaM> I'm still fighting with bzr :P
<flocculant> I could refer you to an earlier comment from me :D
<flocculant> NoklaM: frankly if push comes to shove - rename the branch with your work in it, pull the main branch and copy it in :)
<NoklaM> I managed to delete that directory xD
<NoklaM> I'm at that stage
<flocculant> I would say I'd done that one or twice - but the truth would be many more ;)
<Rosco2> Yes - very productive today
<flocculant> yep
<flocculant> I'm glad I popped by 
<Rosco2> I have deleted the odd bzr branch to start again too
<Rosco2> I still do it for git, but much less
<flocculant> I've only ever used bzr to work with, I've git cloned to get some xfce stuff in my other hat
<flocculant> I don't code - apart from Hello World ... 
<NoklaM> bzr push lp:~noklam/ubuntu-manual-tests/bug#1183022
<NoklaM> is that the right one? Just making sure
<NoklaM> i pushed a commit that deleted the directories and updated the original file
<flocculant> that works for sure
<flocculant> NoklaM: just make sure you've done the linking of bug to code ;)
<NoklaM> apparently it deleted my original file 
<NoklaM> brb got to smoke
<NoklaM> argh
<flocculant> NoklaM: can;t help immediately - but I do have a local copy now :D
<NoklaM> I have no idea what I did /insertMonkeyPictureWithKeyboard
<flocculant> done that
<flocculant> afk for a bit while we do our irc testing session 
<NoklaM> I'll be there in a moment
<NoklaM> managed to restore the file /lol
<NoklaM> bzr = the devil
<flocculant> \o/
<NoklaM> I think I'm gona write a post and publish it somewhere about how to avoid getting burned by bzr
<flocculant> I'd read it ;)
<NoklaM> that is if I did everything right in the last of me using it
<NoklaM> else { Go back to square 1 }
<Rosco2> Noklam: good idea to write it all down
<Rosco2> Plus links to helpful sites
<Rosco2> Over time you refer to them less and less
<NoklaM> I found the man page explained a lot but the removal part was bad in it
<NoklaM> I'll probably start a blog somewhere if for the future testers
<NoklaM> but untill i have all the knowledge written down, im gonna ask a lot of question :P
<flocculant> NoklaM: few typo's in latest
<NoklaM> d'oh
<NoklaM> i spell checked :(
<NoklaM> I'll fix
<NoklaM> Hopefully the gedit spellchecker is worth it
<flocculant> yea 
<flocculant> yanks 
<flocculant> can't spell English it seems :D
<NoklaM> I've just pushed the 362 revision which should (spell checker blame) have the spelling mistakes corrected
<NoklaM> buginstructions I just read that as begininstructions, must be tired
<flocculant> time for beer then ;)
<NoklaM> I literally didn't sleep 24h
<NoklaM> but that's because i have to go do bloods tomorrow
<NoklaM> and my sleep schedule is like swiss cheese
<NoklaM> so i can safely delete krita from my files and it won't commit it anymore by the dozens
<NoklaM> good night everyone
<NoklaM> see you tomorrow
<flocculant> night 
<zequence> Wow. Busy day :)
<flocculant> zequence: yep - and you haz tests :D
<zequence> Awesome!
<zequence> I've been recording all day. Noticed some problem with our desktop metas. Will have to investigate more tomorrow.
<zequence> It doesn't seem to be building, or something. The source is in -proposed, but no binaries.
<zequence> Well, the whole meta source package of course, but has something to do with the desktop seeds
<flocculant> bah
<zequence> I was expecting something like this. Didn't much look at the details the other day.
<flocculant> Rosco2: can you please get across to noklam that if they make sure to link bugs and code - someone else doesn't have to chase about making sure bugs get marked properly when code lands 0 thanks :
<flocculant> zequence: qa got busy all of a sudden ;)
<zequence> flocculant: It did! Nice to see someone like NoklaM show up as well, out of the blue :).
<flocculant> yea for sure - did what I could to help there :)
<zequence> flocculant: You're a giant help, for sure!
<zequence> Prolly sounds better in Swedish.
<flocculant> ha ha
#ubuntustudio-devel 2016-11-28
<andrericss> Hello! I want to contribute with Ubuntu Studio development. I'm musician and electrical engineer and have experience with signal processing. Thank you in advance!
<OvenWerks> andrericss: stick around... most of the people are in UTC or earlier
<OvenWerks> sakrecoer: ^^^
<andrericss> Hello! I'm musician and electrical engineer with signal processing experience and want to contribute Ubuntu Studio development. Any task?
<andrericss> Hello! I'm musician and electrical engineer with signal processing experience. Any task?
<eylul> hi andrericss did you join the Mailing List yet?
<eylul> I see various people missed you twice because you had left IRC by the time people saw your posts :) 
#ubuntustudio-devel 2016-11-29
<damo22> does ubuntustudio strip out pulseaudio yet?
<sakrecoer> hey guys. looks like i will be late :/ still on this train, and i'm not sure my battery will last until 19UTC... worst case scenario i'll be reading the logs...
<sakrecoer> gah... "guys"... have to drop that habit to call everyone and everything "guys"
<sakrecoer> :) looks like many of us are here! 
<sakrecoer> theoretically i have 30 more minutes of battery..
<eylul> hi
<sakrecoer> o/
<sakrecoer> should we wait some minutes to see if cfhowlett makes it?
<sakrecoer> OvenWerks, you arround?
<eylul> 3 more minutes then start if everybody else is here. then if he comes in, he can join in. 
<eylul> so while we are waiting. what are the items for today?
<eylul> 1) website
<eylul> 2) krita/godot packages (not a lot of stuff there this week) 
<eylul> 3) status updates on other things? 
<sakrecoer> sounds good! :)
<sakrecoer> krytarik: you know how to operate meetingology ?
<eylul> (also hi Rosco2!)
<sakrecoer> meetingology | help
<meetingology> sakrecoer: Error: "|" is not a valid command.
<sakrecoer> meetingology help
<meetingology> sakrecoer: (help [<plugin>] [<command>]) -- This command gives a useful description of what <command> does. <plugin> is only necessary if the command is in more than one plugin. You may also want to use the 'list' command to list all available plugins and commands. 
<sakrecoer> meetingology help topic
<meetingology> sakrecoer: Error: There is no command "topic".
<Rosco2> HI all
<sakrecoer> o/ Rosco2 :)
<sakrecoer> lets begin then...
<sakrecoer> 1) website... it seems my poking in RT gave 0 effect...
<eylul> ack
<sakrecoer> my impression is that : either we make it funky like they do, or nothing will ever happen....
<sakrecoer> i wanted to investigate in what other flavour is planning on using the community child theme, and coordinate a "bigger" poke...
<sakrecoer> but.. i haven't been able to find th time necessary...
<eylul> sakrecoer are you ok with continuing to take the initiative on that? 
<sakrecoer> initiative on poking RT?
<eylul> yeah and checking in with other distros...
<eylul> :)
<sakrecoer> i mean, i'm the least suited person to speak about wordpress issues...
 * eylul looks at Krytarik
<eylul> :D
<krytarik> Honestly, I'm not sure what more we can do at this point - as I said in the last meeting, we need at least *some* sort of reaction from them on the ticket.
<eylul> *nods*
<Rosco2> ANyone have a link to the ticket?
<eylul> rosco2: https://rt.ubuntu.com/Ticket/Display.html?id=29028
<Rosco2> Thanks - no luck logging in
<eylul> yeah.. I can't login either
<eylul> login server hiccup?
<Rosco2> Not that I could help - just trying to undrestand what we need
<eylul> Rosco2: the wordpress install does something unusual with theme folders, in a way that theme dependencies break
<Rosco2> Thanks
<sakrecoer> i can poke around, not as regularily ias i used to, but sure
<eylul> so either we adjust to their system, or ask them to follow how normal wordpress installs work. except sakrecoer emailed them twice on ticket about which route they prefer us to do.. 
<eylul> and we have been waiting for an answer. :) 
<eylul> I would still go with our last week's idea of if we don't hear back we just do one of the workarounds
<eylul> like lets give it a bit more time but... like put a deadline on this. 
<sakrecoer> eylul: yes at this point i think so too... but we risk having to do it over again when they decide to go standard... lol
<eylul> if we do the path thing, it literally is 2 line of code
<sakrecoer> whaat?
<eylul> if we do the option krytarik was mentioning he preferred (and it works) it literally is changing a line on the css
<eylul> if it breaks we can very quickly fix it
<sakrecoer> that sounds perfect! at least for now!
<sakrecoer> whats the catch? 
<eylul> the catch is that if they change the system, it does break
<eylul> until we fix it and submit the fix. 
<eylul> that's pretty much the only catch
<sakrecoer> haha... that is probably why they are reluctant to fix it in the first palce: many sites will go borked
<eylul> possibly
<eylul> so what deadline do we put on this? (I want us to have time for at least check-ins, especially since we have rosco2 here)
<sakrecoer> hmm... so it does make a lot of sense to try steer up some coordinated movement...
<sakrecoer> tuesday 13th december
<sakrecoer> wait... i was thinking 3 weeks...
<eylul> sakrecoer: frankly I think we are the only ones not using knome's default theme as it is. 
<sakrecoer> 20th...
<eylul> either we do 13th, or after christmas I'd say. 
<sakrecoer> ok 13th
<eylul> lets be realistic nobody will be answering tickets around holidays. as it should be ;)
<sakrecoer> i thought we were using knome's theme...
<sakrecoer> didn't we remove that plugin in the end?
<eylul> we are making a child theme with changes to it. 
<eylul> it has nothing to do with plugin
<eylul> refer to my summary last week ;)
<sakrecoer> ye... well.. i didn't say anything about not using knome's theme..
<sakrecoer> *it didn't say anything about that
<sakrecoer> anyways ok..
<eylul> we are the only ones with a child theme from what I can tell, everybody else is using knome's theme's default settings
<eylul> ok so Dec 13, then we move on. 
<eylul> any other issues and discussions on website? 
<krytarik> Move on to what exactly?
<eylul> package, if ovenwerks is here anything he might be working on
<eylul> we do have a new person who came to irc asking for tasks
<eylul> anything rosco2 has been working off (also I do have a question for rosco2: can we add snap packages to the default iso?)
<eylul> working on*
<Rosco2> Been mainly working in Debian
<Rosco2> SOft freeze coming 5th Dece
<eylul> *nods*
<Rosco2> I think we could produce snaps and add them to the store
<Rosco2> How we get them on the ISO - I don't know
<Rosco2> I was hoping to play with them some more when doing backports
<eylul> *nods*
<Rosco2> The demos I have seen don't deal with dependencies
<eylul> well Krita already compiles it on snap
<Rosco2> Need to dig into that area to understand how we would snap something like ardour
<Rosco2> If upstream have already done it for us - great :-)
<eylul> :D
<eylul> yeah an ardour snap would definitely be interesting!
<Rosco2> I will dig deepr at some point - just need more time
<eylul> *nods* don't we all
<eylul> :D
<Rosco2> We need to triage some of the ubuntustudio- * package bugs
<eylul> right
<Rosco2> I went through the us-meta ones, there loads of out of date bugs
<Rosco2> Then I plan to tidy up the default-settings package after we only half did the original plan last release
<eylul> actually rosco2: do you think you can prioritize the default-settings package? (unless sakrecoer and krytarik disagrees)
<eylul> I mean triaging bugs is probably something we can all do, but that one is harder to sort out
<eylul> (maybe next week's meeting we can make a party of it, and go through bugs)
<Rosco2> Yes - but I wanted to try and fix as many bugs as possible with one upload
<eylul> ah
<Rosco2> In any case I will try and prepare it before Christmas - probably after the 5th
<eylul> please tell us what we can do to help?
<Rosco2> Will do.
<eylul> ok
<eylul> thanks!
<eylul> :)
<Rosco2> Once I know :-) Need to relook at all the commits
<eylul> *nods* fair enough. 
<eylul> meanwhile I'll continue to slowly follow the trail of the debian queue to see what is holding krita package stuck there. its not QUITE what I expected to do when I volunteered to learn packaging but hey! not complaining
<Rosco2> That one's fun - we have got into a bit of a mess
<eylul> how so?
<Rosco2> We don't get the package from Debian
<Rosco2> There is an epoch in the version
<eylul> yeah I did talk to the kubuntu team
<Rosco2> And krita seems to be moving/has move from one source package to anoother
<eylul> yeah
<eylul> well I think the thing is krita had some dependencies from calligra before, but now that the project is becoming more independent, it makes sense to package it separately?
<Rosco2> IS that what Debian are doing?
<Rosco2> Ideal if they are
<eylul> that's what QT/kde packaging team is doing
<Rosco2> Excellent
<eylul> but yeah krita has been developed more independently recently, they had 2 successful kickstarters
<eylul> but yeah the package is stuck on new queue for 2 months. 
<Rosco2> Aah - needs to be approved by the 5th or it is too late
<eylul> *sighs* hey! if you know somebody you can nag as well?
<Rosco2> Then we will be waiting until MArch or so
<eylul> oh dear
<Rosco2> 66 packages in new
<eylul> Rosco2: if you have any contacts on debian who can help us it would be great. (if not, we have options: namely ubuntu repos, apparently, and I am still hopeful about getting snap into ISO: I mean ubuntu core must be doing it somehow)
<Rosco2> Probably they all take the easy one first
<eylul> *nods*
<eylul> (also apparently we lost sakrecoer to the train)
<Rosco2> :-)
<eylul> I get that but at some point somebody needs to get the hard ones too. ;)
<eylul> its not like this is some obscure package, its only one of the 3 most commonly used open source graphic software ;D
<Rosco2> It depends what shape the copyrights & licenses are in
<Rosco2> The bigger the package, the longer it takes to review
<eylul> *nods*
<eylul> rosco2: is this a time that works for you reasonably well?
<Rosco2> Yeah - just about perfect
<Rosco2> Krita is targeted for experimentaal as well
<eylul> good. so if this works for everybody else as well, we might use this.
<eylul> *nods*
<eylul> how does that affect things?
<Rosco2> SO it would require a manual sync from there once it is accepted into the archive
 * eylul is asking more to learn
<eylul> ah
<OvenWerks> sorry just got here
<eylul> hi OvenWerks
<Rosco2> HI Len
<eylul> we are about to wrap up but do you have any updates?
<OvenWerks> just found out that cpu governor startu has changed
<OvenWerks> *startup
<eylul> oh??
<eylul> how so? and link?
<OvenWerks> and it is much easier to default to performance
<OvenWerks> I would like to add a file to /etc/defaults/ to do that.
 * eylul starts putting some of the things discussed into the whiteboard
<Rosco2> Would that be part of us-control Len?
<OvenWerks> I was just looking at the cpu freq file in /etc/init.d/ when I found it
<OvenWerks> -default-settings I was thinking
<Rosco2> OK - glad you said because we were thinking of dropping that package
<OvenWerks> it seems running in performance all the time doesn't make much (if any) differemce to the cpu temp... and therefore battery use.
<Rosco2> At the moment it only contains desktop settings
<OvenWerks> no, unless someone has changed things it has some other system setup
<OvenWerks> (swappiness for example)
<Rosco2> OK - I will double check
<OvenWerks> unless some of thesethings were broken out into another settings package.
<Rosco2> possibly
<Rosco2> I remember previous blueprints asking for changes to us-controls to do with audio preformance
<Rosco2> I will dig
<eylul> ok so wait
<eylul> I never actually had a chance to ask this one clearly, are we planning to write controls from scratch
<eylul> or modify what exists
<Rosco2> I don't reaaly know - it was Kai that was looking into it
<eylul> well
<eylul> considering two of you are the ones who will likely do short term changes to it
<eylul> what do you want to do
<eylul> ?
<Rosco2> Go with what's there of course :-)
<eylul> I mean putting default file to set laptops to performance is already slightly scary move :)
<OvenWerks> I have heard that performance helps video as well
<eylul> performance helps everything
<eylul> until you get a power outage
<eylul> :D
<eylul> (yes those things still happen :P)
<OvenWerks> are you aware that in our kernel ondemand is no longer supported?
<OvenWerks> They are using something else b y default now last I chanecked.
<eylul> *nods*
<OvenWerks> I have also heard that ondemand uses more battery than performance
<eylul> its powersaving by default? (I think?)
<OvenWerks> powersave sounds right.
<eylul> *nods*
<eylul> I am not against the idea of making performance default
<eylul> it would be nice to have a way to switch it off as user preference through
<OvenWerks> I have just done so on this laptop :)
<eylul> and have people test it on beta to make sure the whole: no really it doesn't change the overheating much, is actually true for multiple people
<OvenWerks> switching live takes a setroot appliaction
<eylul> isn't us-controls already that through?
<OvenWerks> or polkit setup
<OvenWerks> I think it uses polkit for somethings, but doesn't run as root... I could be wrong
<eylul> I see
<Rosco2> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuStudio/FeatureDefinitions/UbuntuStudioControls
<OvenWerks> any new applications are _supposed_ to only goto root for what needs it not the whole application (like synaptic is wrong)
<Rosco2> Was just reading the feature definition
<eylul> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/ubuntustudio-z-development (adding stuff here)
<OvenWerks> Ardour 5.5 should be out next month.
<eylul> rosco2, ovenWerks: maybe at some point we should sit down and go over this so that we can actually start working on it?
<eylul> I know there is at least 2 things I want to add to this: per application profiles (long term goal), and wacom settings. (short term goal)
<Rosco2> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xjadeo/+bug/1639409
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1639409 in xjadeo (Ubuntu) "Please move xjadeo to universe" [Undecided,New]
<eylul> well integrating existing wacom settings solution
<Rosco2> Apparently that is currently blocking Ardour 5.4
<OvenWerks> To me that is what -settings is for Adding settings that are for graphics/audio/video
<OvenWerks> Ardour doesn't _have_ to have xjadeo, but it is one of the better ways of doing the job.
 * eylul has totally missed it. *facepalm*
<eylul> (btw I'll step out at half past)
<OvenWerks> Part of the blender->ardour with xjdadeo workflow.
<Rosco2> Apparently it is only one of the archive managers with super powers that can move xjadeo to universe
<Rosco2> I looked to see if I can help - but no
<Rosco2> Should keep an eye and ping over the next months though
<OvenWerks> I do have a bash script that can go in /usr/sbin/ that changes cpu governor. I can update it to use performance/powersave rather that ondemand. But I will not have time to figure out -controls.
<Rosco2> Ok - I will call it quits. Thnks eylul & OvenWerks 
<OvenWerks> bye
<eylul> thanks Rosco2
<eylul> OvenWerks, anything else before I go and declare this meeting done?
<eylul> :)
<eylul> btw, just to clarify I am not against setting the default to performance. I do think we do need to keep an eye on betas for any issues with it through
<eylul> (and at some point we need to start working on us-controls. I was hoping to do that after the package things.. but things got.. interesting)
<OvenWerks> all I can think of right now.
<eylul> ok
<eylul> thanks for stopping by. also does our start time work for you?
<OvenWerks> -controls should be kept in a language most people can work with... probably c++ with fltk would not be good.
<eylul> heh. I thought there was some discussion of python
<OvenWerks> the time should be fine. I just forgot.... and my wife called me to be with her not by the co mputer
<eylul> ah
<OvenWerks> -controls is in python right now, but I am even worse with python than perl
<sakrecoer> no i havehey!
<sakrecoer> haha
<eylul> welcome back sakrecoer
<eylul> :D
<sakrecoer> yeah...
<eylul> we figured we lost you at the train
<eylul> Ovenwerks: one advantage of python is that you can make guis with it
<eylul> which we can't with perl. 
<eylul> I am happy to adjust to what you guys use through
<OvenWerks> perl-tk?
<OvenWerks> I think it can do gtk as well.
<eylul> *blinks*
<eylul> *blinks again*
<OvenWerks> pythons standard GUI is TK based though.
<eylul> *nods*
<OvenWerks> But I am pretty sure -controls uses gtk.
<eylul> I personally like QT aesthethic wise but as I said I am really happy to adjust to whatever you guys decide to use. 
<eylul> a lot of new programmers learn python which is why I suggested that but *shrugs*
<OvenWerks> I have not been able to get anything to work for me with qt so far... I may not be willing to put the time in.. I am learning avtk just now.
<eylul> ah
<eylul> yeah whatever we chose I'll have to learn gui side from scratch
<OvenWerks> (based on NTK which is based on fltk
<eylul> I know a few of these also have gui constructors on repos
<eylul> so that we can build the guis visually
<eylul> I think that should be a point in favor for less work to do
<eylul> (in case there is something that doesn't come with a builder)
 * eylul is really getting dated on this topic
<eylul> ok
<eylul> I really really need to go
<eylul> and get back to art. but see you next week ovenwerks?
<OvenWerks> Ok.
<eylul> :)
<eylul> --- meeting done ---
<OvenWerks> o/
<sakrecoer> \o
<krytarik> o/
<sakrecoer> \ohaj
<krytarik> :D
<sakrecoer> move on with what?
<sakrecoer> i suppose toward publication. :)
 * sakrecoer refers to 1) backlog 
#ubuntustudio-devel 2016-11-30
<sakrecoer> morning
<sakrecoer> krytarik asked a good question regarding the website yesterday that didn't get a proper answer, and i struggle with it myself: "move on with what".
<sakrecoer> i'm largely blocked in the website issue. If we know a fix that could work, we should move on with it now, not wait another 2 weeks to see if RT might reconsider...
<sakrecoer> and if we are the only ones using child theme, then i can poke arround the other flavours for 2 weeks, we already know they wont have any interest or need to put energy in it.
<sakrecoer> this said, thanks for driving that meeting eylul. i know i said it already in -ot but i want the props to be in the logs :D
<sakrecoer> this just in: pitti> sakrecoer: hey Set, how are you? I sent https://code.launchpad.net/~pitti/ubuntu-seeds/ubuntustudio.zesty.drop-pm-utils/+merge/312134 (trivial), would you have a minute to merge/pull it? 
<sakrecoer> i think i know how to do it, but i figure you guys need to know... will send a mail to the list also.
<sakrecoer> aaah... here we go with the "guys" again... lol
<OvenWerks> /etc/init.d/ondemand needs to die! (be removed) I wonder which package it comes from so I can bug it.
<OvenWerks> initscripts
<OvenWerks> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/sysvinit/+bug/1646245
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1646245 in sysvinit (Ubuntu) "/etc/init.d/ondemand keeps /etc/init.d/cpufrequtils from working" [Undecided,New]
<OvenWerks> sakrecoer: it's like the biblical term "man" which most often means human.
<krytarik> OvenWerks: With regards to your today's commit to -default-settings, can you fix the changelog please, since again v0.64 was never released?  And if you are eager, also strip down the .desktop file Ross added in r300 to avoid another bug report, as I did previously?
#ubuntustudio-devel 2016-12-02
<chamois> Hello everyone! I'm sorry I didn't log in during this last few days, I wasn't at home
#ubuntustudio-devel 2016-12-03
<OvenWerks> for any who care.... https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntustudio-dev/ubuntustudio-controls/trunk could be uploaded as there is a new commit.
<OvenWerks> ubuntustudio-controls can now set the cpu governor to performance or powersave. This is not something that stays set across boots. Right now there is a bug in sysvinit (bug #1646245) that will not allow cpufreq to do it's job.
<ubottu> bug 1646245 in sysvinit (Ubuntu) "/etc/init.d/ondemand keeps /etc/init.d/cpufrequtils from working" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1646245
<OvenWerks> If you would like to try out this new version of -controls it is available from https://launchpad.net/~ubuntustudio-dev/+archive/ubuntu/autobuild
 * OvenWerks goes off to try it on 32bit machine just in case.
<OvenWerks> Well it works fine on 32bit machines too (surprise, surprise) I am now wondering why the 32 bit kernel has more available governors than the 64bit kernel... Or maybe it is my machine.
<OvenWerks> Anyway, both have powersave and performance available and that is what I switch between. I have heard that ondemand actually uses more power than performance, so powersave may be better.
<OvenWerks> krytarik: I think I may remove the fix in -settings (rollback the commit) because of the bug in /etc/init.d/ondemand which keeps it from working.
<OvenWerks> If that gets fixed I can add it back as well as a checkbox in -controls "Make this setting default".
<OvenWerks> I am really not sure how it might get fixed. I would like to see it get removed, but that would make cpu-freq a required package, so it may make more sense to change ondemand to check /etc/defaults for /etc/default/ondemand which can have the default governor on a line.
<OvenWerks> Anyone who cares to confirm bug #1646245 might help.
<ubottu> bug 1646245 in sysvinit (Ubuntu) "/etc/init.d/ondemand keeps /etc/init.d/cpufrequtils from working" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1646245
<OvenWerks> dch
<OvenWerks> ... wrong window...
<OvenWerks> krytarik: fixed the changelog in -setting and removed the cpugovernor commit both.
<OvenWerks> krytarik: I am guessing it needs to be uploaded now. (along with -controls)
<krytarik> OvenWerks: Thanks.  However, 1.) now you merged your changes with Ross'; 2.) "* Undo last commit because bug 1646245 won't let it work" - you dropped that commit completely from the history; and 3.) I don't think something like "* Fix changelog version." or "* Fix changelog" needs to be in the changelog itself, as long as it wasn't released since.
<ubottu> bug 1646245 in sysvinit (Ubuntu) "/etc/init.d/ondemand keeps /etc/init.d/cpufrequtils from working" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1646245
<krytarik> ..And not to mention the dire uploader situation currently. >_>
<OvenWerks> I assume we don't have any?
<OvenWerks> (uploader)
<OvenWerks> Not sure which way to go on that.
<OvenWerks> (either the upload thing or fixing settings without making it worse)
<OvenWerks> But if there is no way to upload aything, "we may as well go home"
<krytarik> Well, we can try and let people who do have upload rights sponser things, as we did at the end of last cycle, after Kaj took off - but of course, that's rather impractical in the long run.
 * OvenWerks has to run, gotta pick up my wife.
<krytarik> And well, just do as you did before apparently - undo things and force-push. >_>
<krytarik> OvenWerks: Btw, feel free to enable the autobuilds for the relevant sources once you think the changes in them are worth it yet - but then I'd switch to '{debupstream}+bzr{revno}+{time}' for the versioning.
<krytarik> ..Oh, I mean for the Yakkety and Zesty series more specifically.
#ubuntustudio-devel 2016-12-04
<OvenWerks> krytarik: I am not sure how to enable/disable builds... or even which ones are worth doing. I am quite good at changing code, but packaging, pr, deciding which is the best way to go are difficult. I added governor changing to -controls becasue someone else suggested it would be good :)
<OvenWerks> krytarik: policy wise, would it be frowned on to (as a part of our -settings package) to rename /etc/rc2.d/S05ondemand to K05ondemand?
<OvenWerks> I guess I mean would it interfere with package updates? I know files in /etc/default/ can be changed/added/deleted ok, but not sure with this one.
<OvenWerks> Sorry I guess it is the one in rc5.d. I wuld actualy go through and do them all.
<OvenWerks> (we are using RL5 these days)
<krytarik> OvenWerks: "You must not include any /etc/rcn.d symbolic links in the actual archive or manually create or remove the symbolic links in maintainer scripts; you must use the update-rc.d program instead." - https://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-opersys.html#s9.3.3.1
<OvenWerks> krytarik: right. So we could have the -settings install script run the update-rc.d program instead?
<OvenWerks> krytarik: I was going by the README inside rc2.d which it seems is wrong.
<krytarik> OvenWerks: I just enabled autobuilds for -controls and -default-settings for the Yakkety and Zesty series, btw.  And thanks for the detailed report on that stuff on the ML!
#ubuntustudio-devel 2019-11-25
<teward> i'll take a look, time permitting today.
<teward> Eickmeyer: running a build now (via gbp)
<teward> against Focal.  Standby.
<teward> no dpkg-source errors this time
<teward> but lets see what Lintian says :P
<teward> Eickmeyer: still throws the lintian failure
<teward> E: raysession source: source-contains-unsafe-symlink src/bin/ray_control
<teward> 'Note that all absolute symlinks are unconditionally considered "unsafe" in this case (unlike in binary packages)."
<Eickmeyer> teward: Upstream fixed, I'll be dealing with it later today.
<teward> yep saw your ping in -devel
<teward> no problem :)
<teward> Eickmeyer: i think cjwatson just fixed it :)
<teward> we'll see
<teward> if so then I can ACK this and upload it
<Eickmeyer> teward: Well, upstream did a new release.
<teward> want me to wait then?
<teward> 'cause if this doesn't lintian fail I can push 0.8.2 in
<teward> and then supersede it later
<Eickmeyer> That sounds like a plan. Generally, it's best to go with upstream, right?
<Eickmeyer> teward: I thought it would take longer than it did, but I was wrong. It's ready to go, that #&@$ lintian error is gone.
<Eickmeyer> Source is lintian clean.
<teward> Eickmeyer: confirmed.  upload in progress to Focal.
<Eickmeyer> teward: Thanks
#ubuntustudio-devel 2019-11-27
<Eickmeyer> OvenWerks: Latest autobuild of -controls doesn't remember CPU governor between launches (not reboots).
<Eickmeyer> OvenWerks: Also noticed multiple instances of zita-a2j running, bogging-down CPU extensively.
<OvenWerks> Eickmeyer: huh. I haven't touched that. (governor)
<OvenWerks> zita is another problem... sometimes it doesn't quit when told to no matter which kill signal is sent.
<OvenWerks> perhaps removing all connections first may help... but I am pretty sure I have had it not go away even when not connected. I will look at more when I finish what I am working on now. Daily builds is not ready for use though.
#ubuntustudio-devel 2019-11-29
<OvenWerks> just looking at the zita-ajbridge code... the only signal handler is for SIGINT  :P
<OvenWerks> Eickmeyer: re: zita freezing: using SIGINT does seem to fix that.
<OvenWerks> Eickmeyer: It still leaves zombie processes but they use no CPU and are removed from memory except the return value
<OvenWerks> basically, It seems I need to read the return value and it will go away
<OvenWerks> it will also go away if we start anything...
<OvenWerks> that is if something is plugged in again.
#ubuntustudio-devel 2019-11-30
<mr-big_> hello
