#ubuntu-uk 2011-08-15
<hamitron> bigcalm_lappy486: 486?
<bigcalm_lappy486> hamitron: google it ;)
<hamitron> you can't be serious
<hamitron> ;/
<bigcalm_lappy486> It's an oldish webthingy that has become a meme
<hamitron> ah
<hamitron> strongbad
<hamitron> I remember asking some other time
<hamitron> laters o/
 * StevenR orders arduino stuff :D
<gord> its 1am and i'm on mini-itx.com - this rarely ends well for my bank balance
<bigcalm_lappy486> I think it might be time for sleep
<ubuntuuk-planet> [Ralph Janke] Ubuntu-ca LoCo Project for Global Jam in September 2011 - http://drupal.txwikinger.me.uk/content/ubuntu-ca-loco-project-global-jam-september-2011
<MonsterKiller> idk if anyone know about this but when i do screen on my ubuntu server via putty, at the bottom it says no more PTY's then closes
<zac1256> who hate ubuntu 11.04
<MooDoo> morning all
<TheOpenSourcerer> morning all
<MooDoo> morning
<MartijnVdS> \o
<hoover> morning all
<diplo> Morning all
<davmor2> morning all
<davmor2> czajkowski: get up you slacker!
<MooDoo> morning davmor2 :)
<MooDoo> czajkowski: get up you slacker ;)
<MooDoo> hmmm lunchpad.net not found, think my typing is trying to tell me something?
<jpds> MooDoo: Too early for lunch.
<MooDoo> jpds: i'm hungry though :p
<jpds> MooDoo: Try breakfast.
<MooDoo> jpds: ah yeah
<MooDoo> :)
<davmor2> morning MooDoo
<MooDoo> morning davmor2 how goes it?  good weekend?
<davmor2> MooDoo: so so I wasn't at oggcamp though in London now though I'll make them suffer
<MooDoo> lol i didn't go to oggcamp either, but it sounded fab.
<christel> it was good! they did well
<AlanBell> morning all
<MooDoo> i was in #oggcamp and did watch twitterfall, so i was kinda [in a very slim way] there :)
<MooDoo> morning AlanBell
 * AlanBell posts "popyironing.mpeg" to google plus . . .
<AlanBell> popey even
<christel> good morning AlanBell
<AlanBell> hi christel
<TheOpenSourcerer> morning AlanBell
<TheOpenSourcerer> How is your head today?
<AlanBell> o/ TheOpenSourcerer
<AlanBell> surprisingly good after an unexpectedly long session in Aldershot
<TheOpenSourcerer> lol
<AlanBell> got to take back the video camera to the rental place now
<christel> i have taken delivery of one Dave2
<gord> morning all, oggcamp go well this weekend?
<christel> he seems to be in fairly good condition
<AlanBell> https://plus.google.com/109175303602657131317/posts/Z7TFNKqVYjb the place I got the cameras from
<oimon> enjoyed saturday @ oggcamp although couldn't make the sunday...next year hopefully
<Dudley-puppy> hi, I have decided to install ubuntu along side windows, is there anything I need to do before installing
 * Dudley-puppy has bad memorys of this channel
<Dudley-puppy> any ideas or are you all asleep today
<brobostigon> good morning everyone.
<Dudley-puppy> ahh someone who can help me
<brobostigon> Dudley-puppy: make sure you do through backups, so if something goes wrong, you dont loose anything.
<Dudley-puppy> ok I will back up then install
<Dudley-puppy> how long should it take to install
<Dudley-puppy> ?
<brobostigon> Dudley-puppy: depends on the machine.
<Dudley-puppy> what do you need to know to work out how long it'll be
<Dudley-puppy> ?
<brobostigon> Dudley-puppy: i would give a couple of hours, that is what it took on my eppc, also sdome time incase of any issues.
<Dudley-puppy> oh good I have a few hours
<brobostigon> eeepc*
<Dudley-puppy> the server room.smells of hot pcs and Axe deodorent
<Dudley-puppy> ubuntu doesnt need a licence key does it?
<brobostigon> no.
<brobostigon> definatly not.
<brobostigon> never.
<Dudley-puppy> oh ok
<Dudley-puppy> it it.normal for a hdd to make bipping noised
<Dudley-puppy> it doesnt work stupid.external hdd
<christel> AlanBell: do you have annbjorns email? and i'll see if we can somehow help him with his research
<Dudley-puppy> I cant backup as my.external hdd is biping and not doing anything
<Dudley-puppy> any ideas how to.make it work again
<brobostigon> Dudley-puppy: are you in windows or linux?
<popey> Dudley-puppy: we know you don't we?
<Dudley-puppy> I am in windows
<Dudley-puppy> popey that you dont wanna know
<brobostigon> cnt help with that, sorry.
<popey> Dudley-puppy: you're phineas / ferb / bolt aren't you?
<Dudley-puppy> popey yeah but.dont ban me.or anything I havn't done  anything
<gord> neat, mini-itx does 6 lan router boxes, should of got one of those instead of my new router *makes note*
<kazade> morning all
<brobostigon> morning kazade
<kazade> I have an important question...
<gord> 42
<kazade> where can I find the video of popey extreme ironing?
<popey> Dudley-puppy: you're getting exactly one warning. any stupidity and you're gone.
<christel> i hear it will be part of the advertisement camp for the ogglympics
<bigcalm_lappy486> Good morning kids :)
<Dudley-puppy> popey got it
<christel> morning bigcalm_lappy486 :)
 * bigcalm_lappy486 hugs christel a merry morning :)
<christel> wooo
<christel> merry morning to you too! :D
<bigcalm_lappy486> christel: I didn't get to say good by and have one last hug last night
<bigcalm_lappy486> popey: Good morning to you sir
<christel> bigcalm_lappy486: i know, you were all the way on the other side and i didnt want to interrupt the Daviey anecdotes to disturb you all!
<bigcalm_lappy486> Awww
<bigcalm_lappy486> I'm "glad" that I now know the stories
<christel> hehe
<bigcalm_lappy486> But I shall have to hug you a-new some time
<christel> i should hope so! ;)
<christel> say hello to your pretty little lady and tell her it was nice meeting her :)
<bigcalm_lappy486> I shall do indeed :)
<bigcalm_lappy486> She's in the shower, so guess what's I'm doing
<christel> i dont dare think what you're doing, im confident it's not appropriate for -uk!
<christel> :p
<MooDoo> bigcalm_lappy486: 15 things come to mind and non of them good lol
<MooDoo> christel: beat me to it :)
<bigcalm_lappy486> Haha
<christel> :P
<MooDoo> :p back ner ner ner ner ner
<oimon> if i have a single entry per line in a bash file, i can type for uuu in `cat dog.txt` ; do echo $uuu ; done
<oimon> but what if i have 3 entries per line?
<Dudley-puppy> the only ubuntu I have is 9.04 beta
<Dudley-puppy> is this recent enough
 * MooDoo is running 10.04 LTS at the moment
<oimon> 9.04 beta is no longer supported AFAIK
<oimon> Dudley-puppy: do you have a decent internet connection?
<Dudley-puppy> not atn
<Dudley-puppy> atm
<Dudley-puppy> but I can do
<oimon> i recommend getting a newer version
 * Dudley-puppy is thinking about it
<oimon> Dudley-puppy: http://www.ubuntu.com/business/desktop/long-term-support
<MooDoo> i'm running 10.04 LTS and it's great until you want newer versions of software...shotwell for instance...i can't upgrade :(
<MooDoo> blimey didn't know pitivi was coming off the oneiric iso :S
<oimon> what's the default vid editor now? openshot?
<MooDoo> oimon: no replacement
<MooDoo> according to wikipedia...so not 100%
<czajkowski> MooDoo: davmor2 i am up
<oimon> right now in oneiric there's no way to see all applications installed
<oimon> they had better fix that.
<MooDoo> oimon: i had problems with connecting to cifs shares, it kept rebooting my laptop :D
<davmor2> czajkowski: liar this is just a script
<diplo> I think it's a good idea not to install a video editor by default tbh
<diplo> More space for other things, they are there in the repos if required.
<MooDoo> davmor2: prod czajkowski if you get stabbed then she's awake
<czajkowski> meh
<MooDoo> diplo: what other things?  i would of thought a video editor installed by defaulkt would be good for the home user
<davmor2> czajkowski: prod
<christel> good morning princesskowski!
<czajkowski> sleepy
<MooDoo> davmor2: she needs to be prodded more to wake up, some of us have been up since 6 :p
<diplo> Sorry MooDoo phone went
<diplo> Always see that they don't have space to add this feature or that because of lack of space
<diplo> on the CD
<diplo> A video editor isn't something used by someone off the bat from every install imo
<diplo> It's defo something used but should be installed, office products are used, browsers are used, email clients etc
<diplo> Its how I see it anyway
<AlanBell> Dudley-puppy: http://ubuntu-uk.org/free-cds/
<Dudley-puppy> AlanBell ahh save me buying more cds
<bigcalm_lappy486> Time to go home. Thanks for a fun weekend peeps :) See you soon!
<oimon> t's not just you!Â http://ubuntu-uk.orgÂ looks down from here.
<AlanBell> bye bithir
<AlanBell> oimon: that is an interesting point. Daviey or popey will probably fix that
<MooDoo> same here too
<Myrtti> boo, daubers isn't online
<MooDoo> Myrtti: i'm sure he will be at some point :D
<MooDoo> ooo even then planet has quit :)
<MooDoo> has popey broke the site/server then?
<popey> nah
<popey> blame freenode
<diplo> blimey popey do yourself an injury doing that ironing :D
<diplo> Hard enough in the front room
<diplo> Sound out of breath as well
<AlanBell> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5smhy9OB-CM
<MooDoo> oh that's so getting tweeted :D
<MooDoo> AlanBell: poor poor ironing board ;)
<AlanBell> MooDoo: it is all back together now
<MooDoo> :)
<AlanBell> http://www.flickr.com/photos/mattdaubney/6041112753/
<shauno> display errors leading to some fun conversations this morning.  "the green seems *very* green.  except when it's purple."
<duanedesign> AlanBell: popey czajkowski dia I mention the Ubuntu One Application Developer Event coming up.Thursday 1st of September Thursday 1st of September
<duanedesign> weâre inviting any interested developers to an evening of talking Ubuntu One apps and a drink or two with our futures architect, Stuart Langridge, at Manchester Metropolitan University in the UK from 7pm
<duanedesign> we would love if anyone could help spread the word. It is the first event and the success of this event will decide if rheir are futeure events, So we could really use you help. Thank you!
<christel> is there a url with more info anywhere duanedesign ?
<duanedesign> christel: haha, good catch
<christel> ;)
<duanedesign> http://voices.canonical.com/ubuntuone/?p=1053
<duanedesign> also please encourage people to register so we know how much tshirts and stuff to bring
<TheOpenSourcerer> Big Deal... http://investor.google.com/releases/2011/0815.html
<TheOpenSourcerer> Google Buys Motorola Mobile division. All about Patents I reckon.
<TheOpenSourcerer> "Our acquisition of Motorola will increase competition by strengthening  Googleâs patent portfolio, which will enable us to better protect  Android from anti-competitive threats from Microsoft, Apple and other  companies."
<dwatkins> Google tried to buy some patents directly recently, but couldn't.
<gord> patents these days just seem to be a way of keeping lawyers in employment through the hard economic times
<Myrtti> I can hear a scream all the way from Finland atm
<dwatkins> it's an arms race, I think
<TheOpenSourcerer> Yeah - and Apple/MS will not be best pleased either ;-)
<dwatkins> http://googleblog.blogspot.com/2011/08/when-patents-attack-android.html indeed
<TheOpenSourcerer> Motorola "invented" the mobile. They must have some serious patents.
<dwatkins> They did? I always assumed that was Nokia.
<oimon> motorola invented the legendary brick phone
<Myrtti> go on
<oimon> and also the ear warmer
<oimon> http://www.retrofones.com/images/SV208021.JPG
<oimon> i had one of these
<Myrtti> 1981: The mobile era begins
<Myrtti> Nordic Mobile Telephone (NMT), the first international mobile phone network, is built.
<dwatkins> I had a Nokia 2110 first: http://www.minddriller.com/mind-driller/uploads/2011/07/1226158990mob_pic1Nokia_2110_Med.jpg
<Myrtti> 1984: Mobira Talkman launched
<dwatkins> I guess they had been around a while then, though.
<TheOpenSourcerer> There's a blog updating the conference call live if anyone is interested: http://techcrunch.com/2011/08/15/live-blog-the-googlemotorola-acquisition-conference-call/
<AlanBell> I wonder if this is worthy of a blog post from our telecoms correspondent
<oimon> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motorola_DynaTAC
<TheOpenSourcerer> Hah - and yesterday sabdfl said he was "short on Apple" Man - I bet he's going to well on this news.
<oimon> The first cellular phone was the culmination of efforts begun atÂ Bell Labs, which first proposed the idea of a cellular system in 1947, and continued to petition the FCC for channels through the 1950s and 1960s, and research conducted atÂ Motorola.
<oimon> TheOpenSourcerer: why's safbfdldld shorting apple?
<TheOpenSourcerer> Coz he thinks the value of their stock will go down.
<oimon> my ARM shares dropped 20% in a week due to the yanks farting around
<TheOpenSourcerer> That now looks like quite a shrewd position :-D
<directhex> i had a startac
<TheOpenSourcerer> directhex: Didn't think you were old enough!
<directhex> TheOpenSourcerer, :o
<directhex> TheOpenSourcerer, it was pretty old as a phone when i got it, but still unrivalled for weight & durability
<directhex> TheOpenSourcerer, i got it as a replacement for my previous phone, an NEC, which broken if you coughed near it. i wanted a phone which was indestructable
<directhex> let's see... nec db4000 -> motorola startac -> nokia 7110 -> samsung t100
<directhex> i think a d600 next?
<shauno> we still have nokia 6310's at work.  they just refuse to die
<directhex> had another samsung slide one after the d600 broke, but i forgot what. didn't like it at all
<directhex> then lg viewty, then htc hero
<shauno> altho it is nice having a phone that you can throw at someone, safe in the knowledge that it'll damage someone more than the phone
<oimon> it does seem to be about patents
<oimon> "Iâm really excited about protecting and supporting the Android ecosystem.Â "
<shauno> sounds about right.  that's all moto have had going for them for a long time
<directhex> that's not fair
<directhex> moto have made some decent efforts at android handsets
<directhex> the atrix is about the best battery life of any current-gen superphone
<shauno> I had two motos in a row 5-6 years ago.  the build quality was so bad, I decided never again
<shauno> altho having the microphone die on one after 4 months did make for an interesting role as mobile voicemail
<oimon> there's now a bestbuy in my home town...any good?
<directhex> oimon, kinda like pc world/currys. but not DSGi.
<oimon> surely better than PCW?
<directhex> <directhex> oimon, kinda like pc world/currys. but not DSGi.
<oimon> directhex: but are they better?
<directhex> they're not DSGi.
<oimon> which would normally mean better..but there are other bad companies
<directhex> how many of them abandoned their entire branding strategy, because their brand was so tainted as to be unusable on the high street?
<oimon> directhex: i thought they were just clueless
<shauno> I've only used bestbuy in the states.  based on that, they're so bad that it actually has some comedic value.  (no idea how dis/similar they are in the UK)
<directhex> oimon, why do you think "dixons" disappeared, and Dixons Stores Group International became DSGi?
<oimon> i have heard anecdotal stories of USians complaining about how bad BB were and always compared them to PCW
<oimon> everything about them looks like a PCW copy, i am thinking they will be just as crap
<shauno> in the US, they're bad in ways that wouldn't even be legal in the UK.  so I'm not sure it'd be safe to draw a straight comparison
<Myrtti> bestbuy isn't good even in US
<popey> how does one remove one of those giant stereos from a car these days?
<oimon> ask a chav
<popey> I am
<popey> :D
<shauno> diamond picaxe
<Myrtti> and I wholeheartedly agree with any american that complains about BestBuy
<popey> hah
<daubers> Afternoon
<popey> cd stuck in the drive
<popey> I want to power down the radio
<directhex> shauno++
<shauno> I've no idea.  my car's from 1974.  removing my tape deck just means peeling off the duct tape I used to stop it sliding around :/
<oimon> google are paying $40 per share, when the current price is $26
<diplo> Last time I did one popey it was the same as old way
<diplo> You should have a removal pins and slides out
<popey> this doesnt have the same holes as a DIN-E one
<czajkowski> duanedesign: yes multiple times and it's on my slides
<diplo> Quite often have to buy them off ebay :(
<diplo> lol @ shauno
<diplo> Luckily my '04 still had old style slot
<diplo> So just replaced with aftermarket
<shauno> of course, the fun bit will be when you put it back, and it wants a pin code to unlock it :/
<duanedesign> czajkowski: :)
<czajkowski> duanedesign: and we've sent a freenode wallop
<duanedesign> awesome
<daubers> Woot! Rendering footage into something editable :)
<MooDoo> :)
<czajkowski> daubers: whooo
<daubers> should be finished tomorrow
<czajkowski> daubers: all of them?
<daubers> czajkowski: They'll be editable then, and assuming some bad things don't happen and I'm in the office tomorrow, I should have 5 or 6 uploading tomorrow evening
<AlanBell> awesome \o/
<daubers> However.... if the bad thing happens.. I may not be in the office until Thursday/Friday :( But we shall see
<MooDoo> daubers: bad thing?
<MooDoo> you ok?
 * Myrtti pokes daubers 
<directhex> ikonia, did you see the latest?
<daubers> MooDoo: At the moment all is well. Missus' 90 odd y/o nan is in hospital and the sugeons have decided not to operate on her hip as she probably wouldn't survive the surgery. Waiting on some test stuff this evening
<MooDoo> daubers: hugs :D
<daubers> She's a tough old bird, so she'll probably be fine
<MooDoo> awesome
<ali1234> HazRPG: got to choose your battles
 * Myrtti would tag herself in the group photo...
<daubers> Myrtti: But flickr is dumb?
<Myrtti> yup...
<daubers> Open to suggestions on where to put it where everyone can tag themselves :)
<MooDoo> leave it where it is and just make it taggable :)
<daubers> How do I do that?
<MooDoo> erm
<daubers> Ah ha!
<daubers> Found it
<MooDoo> daubers: check your global settings :)
<daubers> didn't realise you couldn't do that by default :)
<MooDoo> pah! to slow
<MooDoo> :)
<daubers> http://www.flickr.com/photos/mattdaubney/6041112753/ <- Can now be tagged
<ubuntuuk-planet> [Kwabena Aning] Installing Scala on Debian Based Systems (e.g Ubuntu) - http://blog.kaning.co.uk/archives/306
<oimon> mozilla earned > $104M in 2009..what do they do with the cash?
<Laney> look at the accounts
<czajkowski> Laney: meego conferences :)
<oimon> Laney: $40M spent on "software development"
<oimon> lots of cash banked
<gord> i wonder how much of that comes straight from google
<oimon> most of it, from web search
<oimon> royalties on google search ~100M
<oimon> in 2009
<gord> wonder if thats the real reason google made chrome
<oimon> and why firefox are now copying chrome
<oimon> hey, don't change! look, we're the same as chrome!
<gord> erm, i don't think thats it at all
<oimon> looks like the organisation is as bloated as the browser though
<gord> good ideas are good ideas, ignoring them would be stupid
<oimon> i prefer firefox, i just use chrome because firefox started sucking performance-wise since ff4
<gord> firefox 6 seems plenty performant here
<oimon> gord: any change from ff5?
<oimon> or ff4
<gord> can't remember
<gord> i roll with the latest firefox beta's so i'm not sure what was in at stable
<oimon> TheOpenSourcerer: AAPL stock has gone up today
<oimon> i'll try the ff6 if i can get it on lucid
<oimon> reading about LUG camp in switzerland http://www.linux-magazine.com/w3/issue/130/055-055_Charly.pdf
<daubers> First talk is now titled and compressing \o/
<popey> \o/
<andypiper> whence will it be delivered...
 * andypiper watches blip
 * TheOpenSourcerer get ready to go to the pub - meeting an old mate for a beer in 1/2hr.
<daubers> andypiper: I'll do a batch by batch upload to blip tomorrow evening. Will take a couple of hours to compress
<lazarus_> sniggers at the fact that when microsoft bought skype the linux version as of 2.2 sux ass
<HazRPG> ali1234: hmm?
<HazRPG> afternoon all :)
<brobostigon> good evening HazRPG :)
<HazRPG> brobostigon: how's it going?
<HazRPG> everyone have fun at oggcamp?
<czajkowski> indeed we did
<brobostigon> HazRPG: not bad, could be better, eczema calming alittle. and you?
<HazRPG> brobostigon: that's good to hear :). Yeah, can't complain really.
<brobostigon> HazRPG: :)
<daubers> Evening
<popey> pip pip
 * popey invites daubers to #oggcamp whereupon he can receive pokes repeatedly from people wanting video online :D
<daubers> What what whaaat?
<ahayzen> Hi I am having an issue with my HDD where the PC won't boot ... either Ubuntu gets stuck loading or it gets stuck at BIOS 'Detecting IDE drives' ... I have booted off a live cd and have run a few commands and can't even access the HDD ..
<ahayzen> 'sudo fsck.ext4 -v /dev/sda1
<ahayzen> e2fsck 1.41.14 (22-Dec-2010)
<ahayzen> fsck.ext4: Attempt to read block from filesystem resulted in short read while trying to open /dev/sda1
<ahayzen> Could this be a zero-length partition?'
<ahayzen> I feel that it is a SATA controller issue as it seems to be temperamental but has now stopped the pc from working.
<ahayzen> Can anyone help me?
<ahayzen> Andy
<czajkowski> ahayzen: hi
<ahayzen> Hi
<czajkowski> ahayzen: just ask the question
<ahayzen> can you help me debug the machine?
<czajkowski> ahayzen: start at the beginging and tell us what's wrong
<czajkowski> and we can see if we can help ok
<ahayzen> well I started my machine a few weeks ago and all was fine ... then upon high IO it froze ....
<ahayzen> i rebooted and then it would boot and got stuck at the cursor ...
<czajkowski> ahayzen: what version are you running
<ahayzen> so i rebooted again and the BIOS got stuck at 'Detecting IDE drives'... then i moved the drive to a different SATA port and managed to get POST BIOS and boot a livecd .... Ubuntu 11.04
<ahayzen> ... From there i rebuilt GRUB and the machine magically worked again ...
<ahayzen> then it did the same and stopped working completely this time...
<AlanBell> evening all
<ahayzen> eg ..sudo fsck.ext4 -v /dev/sda1 returns e2fsck 1.41.14 (22-Dec-2010)
<ahayzen> fsck.ext4: Attempt to read block from filesystem resulted in short read while trying to open /dev/sda1
<ahayzen> Could this be a zero-length partition?
<AlanBell> sounds like hardware one way or another
<ahayzen> about 6 months ago on a previous HDD i had a similar issue and i found the RAM was faulty and got a new HDD at the same time ... but this time the RAM is fine... i think it is a SATA controller issue but i'm not sure
<AlanBell> any information from SMART?
<ahayzen> SMART doesn't appear to be working?!??!
<ahayzen> it says 'Not supported' ... although i thought it was :-/
<AlanBell> anything on the disk that you care about?
<ahayzen> well i managed to backup everything when it first died ...
<ahayzen> so i have all the data
<AlanBell> good
<ahayzen> but i do have / and /home on separate partitions
<ahayzen> when i try and mount the HDD through nautilus i get ... 'mount: wrong fs type, bad option, bad superblock on /dev/sda6'
<AlanBell> drives fail more than sata controllers do
<ahayzen> but i got a new HDD? ... cause it went wrong around 6 months ago and i got a brand new HDD at the time ...
<AlanBell> yeah, that is a thoroughly unhappy filesystem at this stage
<ahayzen> so i thought it would be pretty unlikely ...
<ahayzen> is there any way i can test if it is the HDD/Sata controller/or other?
<ahayzen> how often do SATA cables fail?
<ahayzen> could tht be the cause?
<AlanBell> you can test the drive in a known good system
<AlanBell> I don't know about cables failing, but you could check for obvious damage
<ahayzen> hmm ... could do ... but the other machine in the house are M$ :( ... and i don't want to break them
<AlanBell> cracked plastic in the end bits perhaps might make a loose connection
<ahayzen> I am running from the liveCD at the moment so does tht eliminate parts of the machine?
<AlanBell> sudo smartctl -i /dev/sda
<AlanBell> what does that report exactly?
<ahayzen> sudo: smartctl: command not found ...does the livecd not have smartctl?....
<AlanBell> sudo apt-get install smartmontools first
<AlanBell> you can do that from a liveCD, but no, it isn't on the disk
<ahayzen> :)
<ahayzen> installing...
<ahayzen> 'ubuntu@ubuntu:~$ sudo smartctl -i /dev/sda
<ahayzen> smartctl 5.40 2010-07-12 r3124 [i686-pc-linux-gnu] (local build)
<ahayzen> Copyright (C) 2002-10 by Bruce Allen, http://smartmontools.sourceforge.net
<ahayzen> Device: /3:0:0:0  Version:
<ahayzen> scsiModePageOffset: response length too short, resp_len=47 offset=50 bd_len=46
<ahayzen> >> Terminate command early due to bad response to IEC mode page
<ahayzen> A mandatory SMART command failed: exiting. To continue, add one or more '-T permissive' options.
<ahayzen> '
<ahayzen> 'ubuntu@ubuntu:~$ sudo smartctl -i /dev/sda1
<ahayzen> smartctl 5.40 2010-07-12 r3124 [i686-pc-linux-gnu] (local build)
<ahayzen> Copyright (C) 2002-10 by Bruce Allen, http://smartmontools.sourceforge.net
<ahayzen> Short INQUIRY response, skip product id
<ahayzen> A mandatory SMART command failed: exiting. To continue, add one or more '-T permissive' options.'
<ahayzen> this is bad right?
<AlanBell> yeah, I would say that is bad
<AlanBell> !paste
<lubotu3> Pastebin is a service to post large texts so you don't flood the channel. The Ubuntu pastebin is at http://pastebin.ubuntu-uk.org (make sure you give us the URL for your paste - see also the #ubuntu channel topic)
<ahayzen> oh yh forgot about pastbin ... sorry
<AlanBell> http://paste.ubuntu.com/666726/
<AlanBell> no problem
<AlanBell> above is what I get from that command
<ahayzen> i can tell u tht information i u need it ... i have a WD Black 500GB ... SATA 2...
<ahayzen> but i guess it should work it out itself?
<ahayzen> if it is working
<AlanBell> I think I have about run out of knowledge and suggestions at this point. The thing looks broken to me if it won't respond right to smart
<ahayzen> but the problem is, is it HDD or MOBO?
<ahayzen> so if it was a SATA controller getting a PCI card with a SATA controller would solve the issue? ...
<AlanBell> think I would still bet on it being the HDD
<ahayzen> and if the HDD didn't work in another PC then this would point to a HDD failure...
<ahayzen> i have another HDD in my machine ... but it unplugged and probably still corrupt from when it went wrong last time ...
<ahayzen> that was a RAM issue then
<AlanBell> if you got a new SATA controller the filesystem on the disk might still be corrupted but a reformat should make it happy again
<ahayzen> well i haven't got a new SATA controller ... but if i figure tht is the issue thts wot i'll buy rather than a new MOBO
<ahayzen> ooo... a off topic question how do u format ur HDD's with the different partitions?
<ahayzen> I usually do / /home and swap but is it better having /boot /usr /var as separate?
<AlanBell> formatting and creating a filesystem is the same thing really
<AlanBell> so you create partitions, and put filesystems in the partitions. different partitions can be formatted to different filesystems
<mgdm> ahayzen: the only one I ever bother with on a desktop is /home. Ona  server I might do /home and /var as another partition
<AlanBell> personally I just have / and swap
<ahayzen> i mean wht structure do u use with ur different partitions? do u do 1 or lots like /home /use etc
<ahayzen> ok ...
<ahayzen> ok i'll continue having a play about with the HDD in different machines etc..and see if i can narrow it down a bit :) ....
<ahayzen> thank you for ur help
<AlanBell> on one machine I have running 24/7 I boot from a small SD card and have a HDD which is mounted but not spinning most of the time
<ahayzen> well at the moment while my machine is dead i'm running of a USB memory stick on my netbook :) ...
<ahayzen> Once my machine is back running i would like to help the community more ... previously I assisted in testing unity-2d for natty and have started my own project with a friend... I have been using python and pygtk for around 4 months and enjoying it ... wht sort of involvement is there that I could do in the future?
<AlanBell> cool, lots of stuff really :)
<AlanBell> one thing we want to do is an en_GB localised iso - there is a new project and infrastructure to do that
<ahayzen> so all the applications would have the en_GB language pack rather than en_US as default in tht iso?
<AlanBell> something like that
<ahayzen> ok well thanks for your help :) ... hopefully i will be up and running soon and then inbetween school i will try and help the community a bit more :)
<AlanBell> yay
<gord> "Password - Please choose a password with at least 6 characters. Please use only letters, numbers and the underscore character in your password." - *facedesk*
<AlanBell> gord: http://xkcd.com/936/
<gord> AlanBell, easy to remember, easy to typo, takes forever to input ;)
<ali1234> what's the problem?
<ali1234> you insist on using punctuation?
<ali1234> the problem with the suggestion of xkcd is it's a lot easier to shoulder surf passwords like that
<gord> my passwords are not alpha numeric only
<funkyHat> gord: I'm going to assume they are composed of only characters that can be typed on a regular keyboard without using modifiers other than shift, though
<gord> sure. but why would a website put this unnecessary imposition on me? the only reason i can think of is that they store the password in a database field that only allows alpha numeric and thus, they don't hash
<funkyHat> pwdhash looks quite interesting to me
<funkyHat> Not that it's relevant to that site
<HazRPG> hmm, "sudo dmidecode -t 17" doesn't seem to know what my RAM is on this machine
<HazRPG> it seems to pick up my CPU fine
<HazRPG> well, aside for the fact that it says "Family: <OUT OF SPEC>"
<HazRPG> and "Serial Number: To Be Filled By O.E.M."
<mgdm> cheap RAM per chance? :)
<christel> mgdm! you are the man i need
<mgdm> christel: !
<christel> <3
<mgdm> How are you? LTNS :)
 * AlanBell predicts MooDoo jumping to the wrong conclusion again
<christel> i am well! all buzzed after a magical oggcamp weekend -- how are you? :D
<christel> AlanBell: haha
<mgdm> pretty good. Getting stuff ready for FrOSCon \o/
<christel> exciting! :D
 * mgdm is in suspense
<christel> oh yes! duh, i should tell you what i want you for
<ubuntuuk-planet> [Jono Bacon] Ubuntu Membership and Developer Surveys - http://www.jonobacon.org/2011/08/15/ubuntu-membership-and-developer-surveys/
<brobostigon> good night everyone, sleep well.
<dwatkins> ciao brobostigon
<brobostigon> good night dwatkins
 * dwatkins is taking a trip down memory lane with Mr Benn on DVD
<babu> ok
<babu> I am brand new to irc, so go easy on me
<AlanBell> hi babu
<babu> hi allanbell
<AlanBell> are you the babu who was at oggcamp?
<babu> I am the same
<AlanBell> o/
<babu> it was great fun and informative
<dwatkins> welcome, babu
<babu> thanks dwatkins
<dwatkins> are you also new to linux/ubuntu, babu?
<babu> in a sense, I did work in IT about 20 years ago
<dwatkins> May I ask what industry you transferred to, babu?
<babu> I now work in sales, selling BT products, but I moved through finance
<dwatkins> interesting
<babu> what do you do dwatkins
<dwatkins> I know someone on another channel who spends his days installing Asterisk linux-based telephone systems ;)
<AlanBell> that reminds me, must book a new BT engineer visit
<dwatkins> I'm in tech support, babu
<babu> great, I'm still getting into ubuntu
<dwatkins> I like being able to customise so much of the OS.
<dwatkins> Also, there are some nice little tricks - although I'm not sure you can still run an application on the desktop background with Unity.
<gord> if you could do it with nautilus, you can
<babu> what tricks
<dwatkins> It requires you to stop nautilus from managing the desktop, then you run xmatrix or xmountains within devilspie to get it to draw under all the windows
<dwatkins> this, for example, babu http://rowla.dyndns.org/xmountains/
<dwatkins> anyway, that's not something I would reccomend for the failt-hearted
<babu> no, but looks interesting
<dwatkins> I prefer minimalist window managers, so also played around with Gnome themes quite a lot.
<babu> I'll have to try some new themes
<dwatkins> I don't know if they're also compatible with Unity, but there are loads of them on art.gnome.org, such as http://art.gnome.org/themes/metacity/1124
<babu> thanks, I'm off to bed
 * Laney congratulates Daviey on making the DPN! http://www.debian.org/News/weekly/2011/12/
<Azelphur> popey: latest update breaks all source based games, not an optional update. Hahaha
<Azelphur> by breaks I mean, crash on startup, for everyone \m/
<Azelphur> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/24583970/funnyshit/i_dont_always_test_my_code.jpg
<ali1234> even windows users?
<Azelphur> ali1234: yep
<Azelphur> ali1234: when I say everyone I mean EVERYONE
<Azelphur> the player count dropped 7k in 60 seconds haha
<ali1234> nice
<Azelphur> ali1234: http://steamcommunity.com/groups/azelphur-servers/announcements/detail/1405341570573491370 lol
<Azelphur> LOL THAT MANY COMMENTS IN LIKE 5 SECONDS
<Azelphur> zomg lol
<hamitron> Azelphur: they planned it
<Azelphur> xD
<hamitron> offer tf2 on f2p, then break it later.... players get bored and buy more games
<Azelphur> lol
<ali1234> well, not all source games are free right?
<Azelphur> hamitron: that would work except I think they broke all source games
<Azelphur> 3 pages of comments on that announcement now, 4 minutes
<hamitron> yeh, but they get commission for all games
<Azelphur> 1 page of comments a minute, haha
<hamitron> I bet there was a huge increase in steam users, with "free stuff"
<ali1234> they already had free stuff before....
<ali1234> i joined when they had portal on for free
<hamitron> hehe
<hamitron> :D
<hamitron> this was f2p forever
<ali1234> now that and tf2 are the only 2 games i have
 * hamitron shakes head at the tight git in the corner
<hamitron> ;)
<ali1234> tbh i think portal was overrated
<hamitron> I got it for free, but not tried it yet
<ali1234> i mean it was good, but it's only about 1/4 of a game. and it still gets repetitive
<ali1234> also i really don't like the way valve does storytelling
<hamitron> :/
<ali1234> hl2 being a good example of this
<ali1234> you don't actually do anything of importance in that game at all
<ali1234> all you do is walk across a wasteland, then get stuck in a teleport for a week, by which time the humans have pretty much already won (and you missed it all)
<hamitron> it showed some good tech on release though
<ali1234> yes there is no doubt of that
<hamitron> but this the game makers need to learn
<ali1234> but you know what they say about storytelling - show it, don't tell it
<hamitron> it isn't the tech that makes the game
<hamitron> :/
<gord> well, i think hl2 is more about the personal story between gordon and alyx than the overarching plotline of rebellion
<ali1234> i didn't play the episodes, i heard they are a bit different
<ali1234> but... meh
<hamitron> I refuse to buy much more from steam
<hamitron> all these online accounts that basically take control away from me, of what I bought
<hamitron> and then my personal details getting leaked
<hamitron> jsut had enough
<hamitron> :/
<ali1234> steam had a leak?
<hamitron> no
<hamitron> but sony and codemasters have
<ali1234> ok
<hamitron> but it all carries that same risk
<hamitron> having online accounts
<hamitron> steam upset me when they dropped win98 support
<hamitron> not trusted these online services since
<ali1234> hmm. after that recent flash update the white rectanlge bug has got worse
<ali1234> now it affects more sites :(
<em> Good eve
<em> ali1234: some sort of odd thing messed up my updates i hope it sorts itself out
#ubuntu-uk 2011-08-16
<ubuntuuk-planet> [Jono Bacon] Community Leadership Summit 2011: Rock and Roll - http://www.jonobacon.org/2011/08/16/community-leadership-summit-2011-rock-and-roll/
<HazRPG> anyone around that's done android rooting/flashing?
<scoundrel50a> um, I have a problem, I had an update via update manageer just now, and went through the process, and it looked like there was a kernel update too, so it asked to reboot. My browser I use, is Google Chrome, which I had no problems with before the update, now, it crashes all the time, I can barely use it. Would anybody have any ideas why it would suddenly be like that.......I am running Ubuntu 10.10
<scoundrel50a> when I restart it, ti keeps asking me if I want to restor back to what I last cloed but that is an error, I didnt have a problem with closing it before, but that restore keeps coming back all the time,  but I cant do anything because it keeps freezing
<scoundrel50a> the version of Google Chrome I have is 13.0.782.112......
<scoundrel50a> I went back a kernel and it seemed to fix the problem and it doesnt seem to be freezing, so the update did something to Google Chrome
<AlanBell> scoundrel50a: you might try moving or renaming the browser profile
<AlanBell> probably in .chrome or something
<scoundrel50a> ok, how would I do that?
<AlanBell> or try chromium-browser
<AlanBell> just rename the ~/.chrome directory (if there is one)
<scoundrel50a> I teid that, adn it worked but they still havent got everything to work in Chromium
<AlanBell> might be called googlechrome or something
<scoundrel50a> where would I find it?
<AlanBell> in your home directory
<AlanBell> in nautilus ctrl+h to see hidden stuff
<scoundrel50a> I am in the old kernel, should IO go into the kernel to do this?
<AlanBell> err no
<scoundrel50a> ok, will have a look
<AlanBell> it is a folder in your home directory
<scoundrel50a> no, its not in there
<scoundrel50a> I installed it from the internet, so would it go somewhere else?
<scoundrel50a> I found it in /etc/ would that still be the same
<scoundrel50a> I cant find it.....anyway thanks
<christel> good morning
<scoundrel50a> oh well, I am still none the wiser and I cant use google chrome, I wish when they did updates, it would break stuff
<scoundrel50a> it wouldnt break stuff
<MooDoo> hello all
<MooDoo> morning davmor2
<dwatkins> hihi
<davmor2> Morning MooDoo
<hoover> Good morning all
<davmor2> morning hoover
<davmor2> morning all
 * davmor2 prods czajkowski cause she isn't up yet
<scoundrel50a> Hi, well I been fiddling, uninstalled Google Chrome, reinstalled it, no change, went to use Chromium, and that freezes also, so both Google Chrome and Chromium now wont work since the kernel update.....I still cannot fint out where Google Chrome is situated in the Home folder
<diplo> morning all
<MooDoo> morning
<popey> scoundrel50a: ~/.config/google-chrome/
<popey> thats not where chrome is, thats where the config/profile is
<scoundrel50a> but where it then, I still cant find it, i just found Chromium
<MartijnVdS> dpkg -L google-chrome-beta
<MartijnVdS> or google-chrome-stable
<popey> scoundrel50a: what are you trying to do?
<popey> https://market.android.com/details?id=com.mojang.minecraftpe
<popey> ooooo
<scoundrel50a> ok, this morning I was using Chrome as I ahve done for months with no problem, then came a kernel update, and Chrome broke, tried Chromium and that wont work either, everything just freezes, whatever I do in it
<scoundrel50a> if I go back a kernel, they work ok
<popey> what are the two kernel version numbers?
<scoundrel50a> how do I find out without logging on and off
<popey> uname -a
<scoundrel50a> k, one sec
<popey> will tell you the current one
<scoundrel50a> 2.6.35-30-generic
<popey> scoundrel50a: so you're on Ubuntu 10.10 right?
<scoundrel50a> yes
<popey> is this the one that works or the one that doesnt?
<scoundrel50a> this omne does, the 2.6.35-29 generic works
<popey> eh?
<scoundrel50a> sorry, this one doesnt
<oimon> fire alarm :(
 * popey evacuates the channel
<scoundrel50a> the 2.6.35-29 generic works
<oimon> false alarm...man that went on a bit too long
<scoundrel50a> cant even get any error messages as it freezes all the time
<popey> scoundrel50a: does the entire machine freeze or just the browser?
<AlanBell> what freezes, the app or the system?
<scoundrel50a> browsers
<AlanBell> so you can still move the windows about
<popey> scoundrel50a: what make of video card do you have?
<scoundrel50a> I can close them, but that is about it
<scoundrel50a> GC I have to use the force quite sometimes to close, as it just does nothing
<scoundrel50a> not sure, how do I find that out?
<popey> scoundrel50a: does it crash instantly or when you're on certain sites?
<scoundrel50a> does this mean anything an intel GMA 4500M
<popey> thats what you have is it?
<scoundrel50a> yes, found that on the side of the laptop
<scoundrel50a> next to what looks like the graphics card icon
<popey> ok, so that theory is out the window
<AlanBell> curious
<AlanBell> is it switchable graphics?
<popey> you are not alone
<popey> others have this issue too
<popey> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?p=11149239
<gord> hrm, was 10.10 the time that firefox introduced acceleration or was that 11.04?
<scoundrel50a> AlanBell: what does that mean?
<gord> i had a lot of problems with that, ended up disabling it
<popey> scoundrel50a: do you have pastebinit installed?
<scoundrel50a> since the upgrade to the new kernel, each time I start Google Chrome or Chromium I get at the top a message saying do I want to restore the session but it never had a broken session to start, I click on that, it works for a page or two then freezes
<popey> if so, can you cause chrome to crash and then "pastebinit /var/log/kern.log"
<scoundrel50a> yep, I  think so
<popey> scoundrel50a: right, start chrome and _don't_ click restore
<popey> then open your regular pages one by one
<popey> see which one crashes it
<scoundrel50a> did that, and went to click on speed dial, and its frozen already, with the apage unresponsive box showing
<popey> ok
<scoundrel50a> its just stuck
<popey> so do that and pastebin your /var/log/kern.log pls
<scoundrel50a> how do I get the pastebin it to work in the terminal
<popey> "pastebinit /var/log/kern.log"
<popey> type that
<popey> (without the quotes)
<scoundrel50a> thought that was right, it didnt give out a url, I have to add it to paste bin, one sec
<scoundrel50a> http://paste.ubuntu.com/667092/
<popey> no, that didnt work
<gord> i got annoyed with not having access to that google bar all over the web, so i added +Gord, Gmail, Calendar, Documents... and so on to my firefox bookmark toolbar thing :) almost as good
<scoundrel50a> sorry :(
<popey> you'll have to manually open /var/log/kern.log using gedit and paste to paste.ubuntu.com
<scoundrel50a> umok, one sec, I'll see if I can find it
<bigcalm> Howdy peeps :)
<oimon> wow, just ran software-center-gtk3 in oneiric. talk about "busy" screen!
<gord> yeah, but i quite like it
<gord> or at least, i like the idea
 * popey reboots into oneiric
<oimon> maybe i just get used to the current stuff and don't like change :-|
<oimon> it obviously will get a bit more work
<scoundrel50a> sorry, having a few problems, will post the pastebin when I can get it
<ClarkNova> Good morning
<MooDoo> morning
<scoundrel50a> http://paste.ubuntu.com/667101/
<scoundrel50a> I dont know if that is enough, it kept on freezing firefox
<EditorDaub> lo
<popey> lo daubers
<MooDoo> lo daubers, how goes it
<EditorDaub> Good :) Just editing videos
<popey> scoundrel50a: I would file a bug with "ubuntu-bug linux"
<scoundrel50a> ok
<directhex> http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=320744355779&ssPageName=ADME:L:LCA:US:1123
<popey> heh, firefox has just locked up for me :D
 * popey bets thats a Sony experia?
<scoundrel50a> do you know the url for that ubuntu-bug linux
<gord> popey, minecraft is now available on the experia play y'know? maybe time to pick one up ;)
<bigcalm> ooooo
<popey> nah, its not proper minecraft
<popey> only the local play one
<popey> scoundrel50a: its not a url, type that in a terminal
<gord> yeah i think its closer to lego, but its an "alpha" deal-y. maybe in the future
<popey> wheee, software updates on oneiric are much more bareable on an SSD!
<popey> gord: what do I have to do to get someone to look at the drop shadow in oneiric?
<davmor2> popey: pay them?
<scoundrel50a> ok, did that, and filled in a bit, the terminal started to produce something but has stuck on 'Attemting to load the system libmoon, and I dont know what to do now with the bug report,
<gord> popey, ayatana-dev - its the ayatana mailing list we (programmers) actually read :) - designers read the ayatana ml but not us
<popey> ok
<gord> popey, at the very least, i'm pretty sure the guys involved know the problem but are swamped with other stuff. so if they detail the problem, one of the awesome community peeps might take a look
<gord> seriously, those guys do crazy stuff these days
<AlanBell> popey: can you type into a unity text box using onboard yet?
<popey> hang on, the act of "go on ayatana-dev" list has me now discovering 3 other bugs
<bigcalm> Is it possible to install older versions of FireFox along side the default v5?
<popey> need to file those first before I forget
<popey> so frustrating
<popey> can't do CTRL+ALT+T to open a terminal
<popey> middle click on icon doesn't open new window
<AlanBell> scoundrel50a: did you get as far as getting a bug number?
<scoundrel50a> yes, here it is Bug #827198
<lubotu3> Launchpad bug 827198 in linux (Ubuntu) "Kernel update google Chrome and Chromium freeze" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/827198
<scoundrel50a> looks like it added loads ofthings to the bug report
<scoundrel50a> should have done that for the backlight problem might have helped more
<popey> !
<AlanBell> great, next it needs to be confirmed, you need to try and find someone else who can reproduce it
<oimon> people on the ubuntu forums :P
<oimon> scoundrel50a: do you have a ubuntu forums accoint?
<popey> AlanBell: you can't even _paste_ into a unity box yet
<AlanBell> indeed, but that doesn't answer the question :)
<scoundrel50a> yes I do, I was going to ask, is there a thread in the Ubuntu forums showing this
<oimon> yes, popey posted it earlier http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?p=11149239
<popey> AlanBell: see previous statement about bugs
 * AlanBell takes popey's point
<AlanBell> I will have a go later
<Dudley-puppy> Im back again
<MooDoo> welcome back
<scoundrel50a> sorry, didnt see, thank you for posting again, will go ask if somebody can confirm this bug for me
<feisar> good morning, what do people use as IDEs for css & html in ubuntu?
<directhex> vim!
<AlanBell> gedit
<directhex> someone was gonna say it, i wanted to be first
<feisar> im using gedit at the mo but autocomplete would be useful
<hoover> emacs
<hoover> ;-)
<feisar> I love vi and gedit!
<davmor2> geany
 * Dudley-puppy has a fussy pc that doesnt boot.from.cd so.installing ubuntu is tricky
<feisar> davmor2: is that to me?
<davmor2> feisar: yeap I use it for most things it's basically gedit set up for dev mode :)
<feisar> davmor2: sounds good, thanks : ] In the default repos too...
<davmor2> feisar: Yeap
 * bigcalm cracks up: http://www.flickr.com/photos/mattdaubney/6041112753/ # Just got into the photo
<scoundrel50a> added my bit and the bug number
<scoundrel50a> thank you
<brobostigon> good morning everyone.
<Dudley-puppy> good morning to.you too
<brobostigon> morning Dudley-puppy
<Dudley-puppy> thanks
<Dudley-puppy> :)
<oimon> oh :D DÃ©jÃ  Dup in Ubuntu 11.10 now supportsÂ Ubuntu OneÂ backups
<oimon> "Deja Dupâs Ubuntu One support, it will create a new cloud folder that is not (by default) synchronized to your computers. Thus, it doesnât waste space duplicating the same bits on all your machines."
<popey> i have set to English(UK) in 11.10, but the layout is wrong
<popey> it has @ on number 2
<davmor2> popey: I'm betting one is set to English(US) still
<Dudley-puppy> good morning to you popey
<AlanBell> if people would like to make the reapproval form look more awesome that would be fantastic
* AlanBell changed the topic of #ubuntu-uk to: Welcome to #ubuntu-uk! http://ubuntu-uk.org | This channel is publicly archived http://irclogs.ubuntu.com | Mailing List http://tinyurl.com/uukml | Support Guidelines http://tinyurl.com/uuksupport | Meeting 29th August 21:00 UK time #ubuntu-uk-meeting | Reapproval meeting tonight!! 9PM #ubuntu-meeting
<popey> davmor2: no, it was set to some other whacky thing
<popey> davmor2: fixed with a change and logout/in
<popey> also fixed terminal on ctrl+alt+t \o/
<popey> AlanBell: how am I supposed to use onboard?
<popey> if I press super key, unity gets focus, away from onboard
<popey> if I click on onboard the unity box goes away
<popey> and pressing the ubuntu key in onboard doesnt make the unity thing appear
<oimon> popey: you found a way to show all applications yet?
<popey> oh
<popey> no
<popey> "Clear attention" in the messaging menu looks odd
<bigcalm> AlanBell: what do we need to do?
<bigcalm> I'd like to take a more active role in the team rather than just sitting in here and helping peeps now and then
<Dudley-puppy> yay ubuntu is now installing (for once)
<directhex> xperia minecraft supports wifi local play? that's pretty sweet
<AlanBell> popey: sounds like it doesn't work then
<AlanBell> bigcalm: make the application look awesome
<oimon> popey: try alt-tab :D
<oimon> i get weird results
<AlanBell> bug 739812
<lubotu3> Launchpad bug 739812 in unity (Ubuntu Natty) "Must use hardware keyboard to perform search for applications in Unity" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/739812
<daubers> bigcalm: The oggcamp photo probably needs putting in :)
<AlanBell> it is I think
<AlanBell> dates and sorting stuff into years would be good
<oimon> should app descriptions in the software centre have the local language applied?
<diplo> popey, When you got HDD's for you HP Micro server did you look into it at all or just buy what you thought was best
<diplo> ?
<diplo> Just about to order myself one in next few days wondering if you recommend any hdd's or worth investigating
<diplo> Going in the front room, so would like it to be as quiet as poss
<shauno> you're playing straight into his ssd addiction here :p
<diplo> :)
<diplo> Might be out of my price range, need space more than spee
<diplo> speed*
<bigcalm> If you need space over speed, have you considered tapes?
<directhex> mag tapes! on end-to-end reels!
<diplo> Not for backups bigcalm
<diplo> Well.. it's for my film collection, use it as a NAS
<diplo> to my Revo
<diplo> I have a multitude of drives in varying sizes, want to buy maybe 2 x 2TB discs
<diplo> And consolidate or my data to one box
 * czajkowski stabs davmor2 
 * davmor2 prods czajkowski then prods some more
<oimon> i discovered a cool way to store my film collection. since i rarely watch a film more than once, it remains on dvd upstairs somewhere :D
<czajkowski> davmor2: you in london ?
<diplo> oimon, I quite often watch films more than once, I wrote a plugin a long time ago to randomly pick a film from my few 100
<MooDoo> davmor2: czajkowski you two behave....don't make me put you on the naughty step
<diplo> Also wrote one to play all the kids series that I have bought in random order, before i had sky back
<oimon> i have a bit of a thing about watching/reading things i remember too well. there is nothing worse than yesterday's newspaper to me
<czajkowski> MooDoo: eh since when you in charge mister
<czajkowski> don't be getting any ideas
<davmor2> MooDoo: I'm already there so your idle threat worries me not :P
<oimon> i wish i could watch endless repeats on telly like my missis seems to enjoy
<gord> i pretty much see the three of you all sitting on the naughty step arguing ;)
<MooDoo> czajkowski: davmor2 right that's it, go to your rooms
<czajkowski> gord: wanna join
<Dudley-puppy> my wireless card is not recognised by ubuntu
<davmor2> gord:  goto #naughtystep I'm right there
<MooDoo> davmor2: was up at 5 with laddo wanting to play
<MooDoo> oooo loco renewal this evening
<AlanBell> yes (help)
<Dudley-puppy> help my wireless is not.working
<Dudley-puppy> it does not detect any networks
<MooDoo> Dudley-puppy: what wireless card is it as it might need additional drivers
<Dudley-puppy> its a bt voyger 1040 wireless card
<MooDoo> Dudley-puppy: from google - http://www.linuxformat.com/forums/viewtopic.php?p=76875
<Dudley-puppy> yeah its supported
<czajkowski> canot believe there is nobody in mill bank to give emily on the ML a working Ubuntu machine :/
<Dudley-puppy> but I can't install.as I dont have internet on the pc
<Dudley-puppy> lspci says I have a wireless care
<Dudley-puppy> card
<Dudley-puppy> but i.realy have know idea what Im doing
<Dudley-puppy> any ideas
<popey> czajkowski: sure you can
<Gary> say hello to Jay15, a friend of mine :-)
<czajkowski> Jay15: aloha
<bigcalm> Ug ug
<Dudley-puppy> ug ug??
<Jay15> hello every one! :D
<Dudley-puppy> hi Jay15
<Jay15> hey cz<tab> (lol) how ya doing?
 * bigcalm sneaks off to find lunch
 * Dudley-puppy follows bigcalm
<Jay15> czajkowski, i hear you are a very nice person, and a good friend of gary?!
 * Gary wonders if czajkowski is going to hurt him for that
<Jay15> no czajkowski should hurt you for telling me to do that! i am new to this and you are already making me have enemies! :D :S
<MooDoo> Gary: you giving Jay15 incorrect information about czajkowski ??
<czajkowski> oi
<Gary> I'm starving, what can I nom on when I cannot open my mouth too far?
<popey> Gary: soup
<Gary> MooDoo: yessir
<Jay15> hello MooDoo
<MooDoo> hi Jay15
<Gary> I did a silly on Sunday, kinda faceplanted the pavement!
<Jay15> yes Gary is miss leading me already! not good :'(
<Jay15> yeah and now you look really funny Gary :D
<Jay15> sorry czajkowski for the cz<tab>, its gary miss leading me. :S thnks Gary :D
<MooDoo> Jay15: don't worry czajkowski is lovely really lol ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha :)
<Dudley-puppy> how do I add support for.mp3 s without internet
<andypiper> how do you use irc without internet
<MooDoo> Dudley-puppy: you can't really
<MooDoo> Dudley-puppy: can't you teather your computer with your phone?
<Jay15> ok but didn't make a good first imprseeion really
<shauno> the lost art of the sneakernet :/
<Dudley-puppy> MooDoo I dont think I can with ubuntu
<MooDoo> Dudley-puppy: what phone you got?  it's not a android phone is it?
<Dudley-puppy> yes its android
<MooDoo> and does it have wireless?
<MooDoo> sorry 3g not wireless
<MooDoo> lol
<Dudley-puppy>  yeah it does
<MooDoo> then have you tried connecting it via a usb cable ?  and enabling teather mode from your phone?
<Dudley-puppy> yeah but there is no tethering mode
<MooDoo> oh
<MooDoo> what android phone you got?
<Dudley-puppy> Sony Ericsson xperia x8
<MooDoo> there are a couple of apps to get tethering working on that phone
<MooDoo> might be slow but you could try that....other than that, without an internet connection you'regoing to truggle
<Dudley-puppy> yeah but none work.with ubuntu
<MooDoo> you don't need a tethering app for ubuntu, you'd install it on your phone, then ubuntu would recognise it as a modem and use your 3g as connection
<Dudley-puppy> which app do I get
<MooDoo> Dudley-puppy: up to you, there are a few, go reasearch good
<MooDoo> google
<AlanBell> which version of android
<AlanBell> it is built in for the new versions
<Dudley-puppy> 2.1
<MooDoo> don't think the x8 has it iirc
<AlanBell> ok, if it isn't in the settings menu then some kind of app would be in order I guess
<MooDoo> PDANet or Easyteather, they are trial apps but you could try one
<MooDoo> ps i'm finding all this from google, so it's not hard to find.
<shauno> if the mp3 support comes in from repos, apt-zip would be a completely different approach
<directhex> ubuntu's official mp3 support comes from the package gstreamer0.10-fluendo-mp3
<directhex> well, gstreamer0.10-fluendo-plugins-mp3-partner
<directhex> if you just download that deb, that'll add mp3 to gstreamer apps
<Dudley-puppy> which package do I need amd64 or the other one
<directhex> Dudley-puppy, do you have amd64 or i386 ubuntu?
<directhex> "uname -m" in a terminal.
<Dudley-puppy> I dont know
<MooDoo> ^^^ see above
<Dudley-puppy> i386
<MooDoo> then you need that version :)
<Dudley-puppy> i686 sorry
<MooDoo> amd64 is for 64bit os version
<directhex> http://archive.canonical.com/pool/partner/g/gstreamer0.10-fluendo-plugins-partner/gstreamer0.10-fluendo-plugins-mp3-partner_7.0.20100316-3_i386.deb
<Dudley-puppy> but its not fedora
<directhex> ......
<MooDoo> Dudley-puppy: what's that got to do with anything?
<directhex> if i express myself as i desire at this point, i'll get kickbanned.
<Dudley-puppy> oh soz
<directhex> it may involve words which sound like "duck"
<MooDoo> directhex: calm it down :D
<directhex> MooDoo, EVERY TIME i go out of my way to help - not just giving hints, but the full answer with links to everything that could be desired, it turns out to be something like this.
<directhex> never happens when i just give a throwaway answer which is right-ish but largely unhelpful. only when i go the extra length.
<MooDoo> directhex: pita i know, but we all have to learn and i'm guessing that not all people are as old as us ;)
<MooDoo> Dudley-puppy: ARE YOU USING FEDORA OR UBUNTU?
<popey> MooDoo: he's already said he's installed Ubuntu
<Dudley-puppy> ubuntu
<MooDoo> ah cool sorry  :)
<popey> 10:45:10 < Dudley-puppy> yay ubuntu is now installing (for once)
<MooDoo> ah must of missed that :)
<directhex> <Dudley-puppy> but its not fedora
 * MooDoo wonders if he should mention RPM Fusion :p lol
<MooDoo> Dudley-puppy: just out of interest, unless i've missed this too, how are you on IRC?  at work? and computer is at home?
<popey> MooDoo: you missed it, he's on a phone
<MooDoo> aha!
<oimon> but also dual boot with windows, right?
<oimon> isn't the issue to get the wireless working rather than mp3 without internet
<popey> i suspect so
<Jay15> hello :D
<Jay15> sorry ignore that
<oimon> using this website reminds me of unity: http://www.calgary.ca/SitePages/cocis/default.aspx
<diplo> What type of micro SD card do I want for a mobile, if anyone can recommend, used to buy the cheapest but does anyone know better
<diplo> ?
<dwatkins> I can't imagine the speed/class matters, diplo - I'd get as large as is affordable, in case you need to transport large amounts of data or music
<ClarkNova> You can get a 16gig card for ~Â£15 nowadays I think
<diplo> yeah, seeing different classes are better for speed
<diplo> yeah got a sandisk one here for Â£13.99
<diplo> But it's a type2 ?
<ClarkNova> I think you only need a fast speed card if you are doing something like writing his-red video to the card. For music I would just buy a cheap card.
<ClarkNova> Type 2 is what I have, no problems with it for the most part. Only issue is if I want to record video at 1080p, gets a bit jerky because it's not writing fast enough I think.
<daubers> Woot! Lunch time
<diplo> Cheers
<Gary> I got a class 6 for my phone, I use apps to sd a bit and have seen the performance improve from the class 2 I had before
<diplo> Will take a look at price difference ta
<diplo> Hmm, tenner dearer
<Gary> what site diplo ?  ebuyer seems good pricewise, so is play.com
<oimon> diplo: i got a class 10 for my phone
<oimon> had been having issues recording HD video to the sd card with a class 2
<diplo> Sorry wen twith Amazon has i had a fiver left on a voucher
<diplo> Going to go for class6/10 next pay day
<diplo> Have a backup card with the 2 and replace it
<diplo> Not got HD video yet so need to worry on that side
<Dudley-puppy> who highlighted me?
<Dudley-puppy> dependency is not satisfiable: lsusb-1.0-0
<Dudley-puppy> what does this mean
<Dudley-puppy>  and how do I solve it
<MooDoo> it just means you're trying to install something that requires something else that is a specific version.....
<MooDoo> to fix it, i would google it.
<Dudley-puppy> I dont know what to do
<MooDoo> neither do i to be honest, but there may be something on google that could help you, especially if no one knows here.
<Dudley-puppy> *sigh* ok then
<MooDoo> no need to sigh, we're trying to help, but you also need to try to help yourself :)
<directhex> or provide detailed info required to give specific answers
<directhex> e.g. in this case, the version of ubuntu you're using would be a start
<MooDoo> what version is it?
<Dudley-puppy> 9.10 beta
<MooDoo> beta?
<hoover> That's quite old Dudley-puppy
<MooDoo> don't you have a later version?
<Dudley-puppy> yeah
<Dudley-puppy> I know and I cant update without the internet
<MooDoo> Dudley-puppy: are you unable to get a copy of natty?
<hoover> you might pick up some cover disk at the local newsagent#s
<Dudley-puppy> not that I know of
<directhex> you know that'll be the main problem with your wifi, right?
<directhex> i.e. a release from 2009 won't have modern wifi drivers
<Dudley-puppy> not without the internet
<Dudley-puppy> I think.so
<directhex> plus, 9.10 isn't supported anymore, so any guides etc you find will no longer apply
<oimon> e.g. Ubuntu User magazine
<hoover> I'd check the local store for a disc with something newer on it.
<diplo> Dudley-puppy, you could go to a library and get all required files for an update, if i remember correctly you can export to a text file what a system needs to update and go to the library or a friends and grab them all ?
<Dudley-puppy> I have just asked work if the router is working (that might be the issue)
<diplo> If you have internet there but your wireless doesn't work, can't you try hard wiring it ?
<Dudley-puppy> just reset the router hopefully it works now
<shauno> a network .. with a network cable?  that's crazy enough that it might work
<directhex> cables are old school. these days you get your internets wirelessly and charge wirelessly
<Dudley-puppy> dont have a Ethernet care soz
<oimon> personally i think you are gonna enter a world of fail running an unsupported version, and a beta version at that
<popey> Dudley-puppy: http://ubuntu-uk.org/free-cds/
<oimon> \o/
<Dudley-puppy> popey that would be helpful if my phone liked the site
<popey> Dudley-puppy: http://paste.ubuntu.com/667284/
<ali1234> have you thought about making a "ubuntu-uk" android app?
<ali1234> (or iphone if you like)
<EditorDaub> writing stuff for iphones sucks
<Dudley-puppy> my wireless shows no networks still
<MooDoo> Dudley-puppy: have you updated software, ran all the stuff from the links we've given you?
<Dudley-puppy> I dont see anything
<popey> Dudley-puppy: did you see the pastebin link I just gave you?
<Dudley-puppy> yup
<popey> so you know how to get a new cd then?
<Dudley-puppy> kinda
<Dudley-puppy> you just "g**r-%**+-" (thats what came up)
<popey> http://popey.com/~alan/cd.txt
<popey> what do you see there?
<Dudley-puppy> a bunch of text
<hoover> helpful text ;-)
<MooDoo> Dudley-puppy: i think the hint was to read it :D
<popey> Dudley-puppy: the text describes how you can get a free cd
<Dudley-puppy> oh so you email someone
<AlanBell> me
<Dudley-puppy> AlanBell I guessed that
<Dudley-puppy> ahh malwere attack
<Dudley-puppy> and its gone
<bigcalm> o.O
<Dudley-puppy> AlanBell it sent
<Dudley-puppy> sent the e-mail
<popey> does anyone else on 11.10 have two alt-tabs come up?
<oimon> popey: i did
<popey> the one that was on ctrl+tab is now on alt-tab too
<popey> so two windows appear
<oimon> then i fixed it with unity --reset
 * popey does that
<oimon> bug 824929
<lubotu3> Launchpad bug 824929 in unity "alt-tab showed two switchers" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/824929
<Dudley-puppy> how do I force install a .den package
<Dudley-puppy> .deb
<popey> double click it
<MooDoo> sudo dpkg -i --force-depends package.deb is another way i think
<Dudley-puppy> then I get dependency is not satisfiable: lsusb-1.0-0
<oimon> popey: did that fix your issue?
<EditorDaub> 1/3 of the way through editing the videos now
<oimon> woo
<oimon> EditorDaub: how are they turning out?
<EditorDaub> oimon: Good :) Quad core box is munging the compressions too, just hoping theyturn out small enough to go up onto blip (stupid 1GB limit)
<oimon> Was the audio recorded via the sound desk?
 * oimon assumes so
<EditorDaub> oimon: Unfortunatly not in this instance
<EditorDaub> oimon: Since we're doing this ourselves this year, start simple and extend next year :)
<oimon> :)
<oimon> the only time i've had geek envy lately is when i saw simon phipps with an eee pad transformer
<popey> oimon: yes, and what made it even better was rebooting into natty
<popey> Dudley-puppy: what are you trying to install?
<Dudley-puppy> some teathering app
<Dudley-puppy> but I gave up
<popey> I dont understand why you're installing stuff on ubuntu
<popey> the tethering apps go on the phone
<directhex> tethering apps make your phone get detected as a usb modem, or a wifi access point. nothing on ubuntu will change that
<EditorDaub> Dudley-puppy: I'd suggest you go speak to your local lug. If you take the machine with problems to them they can probably help you fix it better than we can, as they'll have the machine in front of them and be able to explain things better in person (probably)
<EditorDaub> !lug
<lubotu3> Lug's are Linux User Groups. You can find your local group here: http://www.linux.org/groups/
<oimon> EditorDaub: ...and supply a recent version of ubuntu
<MooDoo> i'm sure i mentioned this earlier.
 * popey noted EditorDaub mentioned "next year"
<EditorDaub> popey: Indeed :)
<EditorDaub> popey: If it's constantly mentioned, you'll get used to the idea and then it will happen
<AlanBell> Dudley-puppy: "2nd large" is the stamp you need on the outside and inside package
<AlanBell> or that was what worked on the last one that went through
<scoundrel50a> the updates this morning, to the new kernel, were they security updates, and if I went back to the kernel before, till you can get the problem with Google Chrome fixed, and its been confirmed by the way, will I have any securoty problems with the kernel before this new one...
<ali1234> read the changelog and find out
<Dudley-puppy> AlanBell okey
<scoundrel50a> how do I find the changelog
<ali1234> apt-get changelog
<scoundrel50a> thank you
<popey> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-security-announce/2011-August/thread.html
<popey> i see no security updates to the kernel in the last few days
<popey> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-security-announce/2011-August/001389.html is the most recent to 10.10
<popey> have you not updated for a week or so?
<scoundrel50a> ali1234: says that is an invalid operation
<scoundrel50a> that up0date didnt come through till today
<popey> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/2.6.35-30.56
<popey> thats the changelog
<scoundrel50a> popey:thank you for the info
<popey> bug #827198
<lubotu3> Launchpad bug 827198 in linux (Ubuntu Maverick) "Kernel update google Chrome and Chromium freeze" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/827198
<scoundrel50a> yeh, that wa the one I entered and just got a message saying it was confirmed
<popey> http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-security/cve/2011/CVE-2011-1020.html
<ali1234> ooo nasty
<scoundrel50a> oh that reminds me, I have to change my default browser, I cant open those links,
<scoundrel50a> ok, well I will go back to the last kernel, till they patch it hopefully
<scoundrel50a> thank you
<scoundrel50a> logging off
<bigcalm> Humm
<bigcalm> Is LibreOffice (and OOo) unable to open password protected spreadsheets read-write?
<Dudley-puppy> how do I install a .tar.gz package
<dogmatic69> Dudley-puppy: you should mostly be installing with apt-get etc
<Dudley-puppy> yeah but how do I install it
<MooDoo> you need to unpack it and read the instructions....
<bigcalm> Dudley-puppy: you will need to extract the archive: tar zxvf filename.tar.gz
<popey> what is it you're installing Dudley-puppy ?
<Dudley-puppy> lame
<directhex> lame the mp3 ENCODING command-line tool?
<bigcalm> I hope that's the package and not an insult ;)
<Dudley-puppy> what command do I run
<popey> why not just install it the right way?
<Dudley-puppy> cos I dont have internet
<MooDoo> why don't you wait till you do, it'll be so much easier.
<bigcalm> Dudley-puppy: you can download .deb files to install from
<popey> you're now on Sky broadband which says to me you have a sky broadband router that you could plug into?
<ali1234> how did you download a tgz if you don't have internet?
<ali1234> how are you even talking to us??
<popey> on his phone
<Dudley-puppy> dont have a Ethernet
<MooDoo> you're still trying to do this on 9.04 i would give up and wait till you have a later version
<popey> I'd buy an ethernet cable
<ali1234> are the repos even still available for 9.04?
<popey> its 9.10, not 9.04
<ali1234> ok
<ali1234> are the repos even still available for 9.10?
<popey> and yes, on old-releases
<shauno> u-uk needs a fleet of lil guys on scooters delivering free dvds.  this conversation could have been 5 hours shorter that way :o)
<scoundrel50a> sorry, just had a e-mail from the bug report saying status confirmed > Invalid, what does that mean?
<popey> it's not a general problem
<popey> only in the kernel specifically in 10.10
<scoundrel50a> oh, ok just wanted to know that is all, I am using the old kernel, I hope that gets fixed, that will another problem added to the back light problem
<oimon> shauno: http://www.ubuntu-user.com/Magazine/Archive/2011/9
<oimon> fleet of guys on scooters deliver to whsmith
<shauno> not quite the same mental picture :)
<oimon> they also have a way of converting the cds into 1s and 0s and then go down a tube , come out at the end, and end up on a CD..amazing :D
<popey> is the tube called "royal mail"?
<oimon> smaller tubes...like fibre or copper
<shauno> just picking up an ethernet cable is a fine suggestion.  I just like the mental picture of having a 'geek squad' that's actually geeks
<oimon> alanbell coming out of the like wallace and gromit with a cd strapped on his helmet?
<bigcalm> Getting jaw ache from consuming this malt loaf
<popey> haha
<popey> reminds me, I have some MSG now
<bigcalm> Thank you for the tip on sawing
 * popey wonders what to put it in
<bigcalm> EVERYTHING
<popey> there is that, yes
<bigcalm> How about a nice stir-fry?
<popey> someone said to me "have you got that so your crap cooking tastes ever so slightly less crap?"
<popey> ooo, good call
<bigcalm> I think I should do one here as well soon
<bigcalm> Doubt that MSG will make it into the mix though
<oimon> doesn't msg give bellyache?
 * oimon is going offline for a week
<oimon> behave without me
<scoundrel50a> ok, just had an e-mail through from canonical, and its gave me this to install instead wget http://kernel.ubuntu.com/~rtg/lp-827198/0/linux-image-2.6.35-30-generic_2.6.35-30.58_amd64.deb I just installed it, but I want to make sure I click on the right one when booting up, so I did this in the command line uname -a and got this Linux droopal-laptop 2.6.35-30-generic #58 SMP Tue Aug 16 15:05:36 UTC 2011 x86_64 GNU/Linux, is that the same?
<scoundrel50a> if it is, its not working
<scoundrel50a> is it the same? Can somebody let me know, so I can get back to canonical and let them know
<popey> scoundrel50a: looks good
<scoundrel50a> well, it doesnt seem to work, in GC I am still getting unresponsive pages
<scoundrel50a> oh welll, thanks popey
<scoundrel50a> I'll let canonical know
<dutchie> scoundrel50a: fwiw i am seeing the same issue
<dutchie> i might test with mainline kernel later
<scoundrel50a> ah, thank goodness for that, thanks for letting me know, I really appreciate it
<scoundrel50a> sorry, your having problems too, though
<ali1234> does anyone know how to download ipad apps when you don't have an ipad or a mac or itunes and you just want to reverse engineer it? (lol)
<Azelphur> haha
<Azelphur> ali1234: what app? :D
<ali1234> the bbc iplayer global one
<drussell> ali1234: find someone else that has an ipad or a mac and itunes ;o)
<ali1234> actually i have a mac if that helps
<ali1234> but no ipad
<Azelphur> lol
<brobostigon> i dont think it is like android, where you can frely make and or pickup apk's.
 * popey looks on his mac
<popey> i suspect i wont be able to download it because I am UK based?
<ali1234> right.
<ali1234> anyway we got the answer we needed
<popey> ok
<popey> what was the question?
<ali1234> does it use apple's payment api?
<popey> ahh, does it?
<ali1234> (it does - "top purchases" on the itunes description page are 6.99 and 49.99 which are the subscription fees)
<popey> blimey
<popey> 6.99 a mo, and 49.99 a year?
<shauno> starting to make an ipad look like an interesting buy =x
<directhex> ipad's for girls. touchpad!
<jacobw> how was oggcamp for everybody?
<popey> jacobw: see http://pad.ubuntu-uk.org/OggCamp11BlogPosts
<ali1234> popey: yeah i guess so... less than the license fee tho...
<ahayzen> Hi I was speaking to u guys yesterday about a HDD issue ...
<ahayzen> @AlanBell: I have just changed my SATA cable and put the HDD into a different port and the HDD now appear in the livecd with SMART working :)
<ahayzen> although it says that it has a 'Bad sector'
<ahayzen> I can also access all the data now ... does this mean i should be able to boot normally?
<ali1234> popey: that's euros as well of course
<ahayzen> would i just run a 'Check Filesystem' from Disk utility to fix the bad sectors?
<jacobw> popey: thanks
<ahayzen> sorry din dins ... will ask again later :) ...
<bernhard2> Having about 5 errors in my log during bootup. help fixing these would be great.. check em out here..  http://pastebin.com/dFABgSqe
<tsimpson> bernhard2: cross-posting is rude, fyi
<ali1234> bernhard2: for the first one install package linux-firmware-nonfree
<ali1234> bernhard2: second one is normal, it just means there was no resume image, which is normal if you didn't suspend
<ali1234> third is only an issue if you need to use pci hotplugging (you almost certainly don't)
<ali1234> sorry that's the 4th one
<ali1234> 5th is to do with motherboard temperature sensors - they changed how those all work recently, and some drivers still lag
<exobuzz> lol @ popey
<exobuzz> your not going near my ironing!! rotfl
<exobuzz> you're
<ahayzen> Hi ... If my disk has a bad sector do i just run 'Check Filesystem' from disk utility to resolve this issue? Thanks in advance.
<exobuzz> ahayzen, i tend to do a selftest with smartctl and then see where the bad block is, and then use hdparm to overwrite it at the drive level.
<ahayzen> how would i do this?
<ahayzen> 'Run self-test' :) ?
<exobuzz> smartctl -t long /dev/drive
<ahayzen> ok
<exobuzz> smartctl -a /dev/drive to see the results. then if you have a bad block marked, you can use hdparm --write-sector with it. - with care. i take no responsibility heh
<ahayzen> how can i work out which sda has the bad sector?
<ahayzen> cause the disk utility just says the drive does
<exobuzz> its in an array ?
<ahayzen> no it has partitions
<exobuzz> we are working on the raw device. not partitions
<exobuzz> to be honest, i wouldnt do this unless you are confident you know what you are doing
<ahayzen> well my HDD is formatted with ext4 :S
<exobuzz> run a long test on the drive with smartctl.
<exobuzz> and read the logs - it will log errors should already have some stuff in the log if it had read errors
<ahayzen> i have sda1, sda2, sda5 -> swap, sda6 is there a way to work out which partition has the bad sector rather than running the test on each?
<exobuzz> note - everything i am saying assumes you have a full daily backup of your files etc
<exobuzz>  /sda - we are working on the actual drive. not logical partitions
<ahayzen> i have my files backed up but i'm running off a livecd
<exobuzz> you run the test on the drive. not a partition
<ahayzen> ah ... will this delete any data or just fix the bad sectors?
<exobuzz> no. it will read the entire disk and some other stuff
<exobuzz> do smartctl -a /dev/sda and paste the output somewhere
 * AlanBell returns home at last
<AlanBell> hour and a bit to the reapproval meeting in #ubuntu-meeting
<StevenR> AlanBell: anything that needs doing before then?
<AlanBell> probably :)
<exobuzz> some more ironing ? :)
<ahayzen0> @exobuzz: here is the link ... http://paste.ubuntu.com/667580/
<AlanBell> any improvement that can be made to the application would be great
<AlanBell> I have just walked in the house and I am preparing a sausage sarnie and a pint of pimms
<exobuzz> ahayzen0, ok so you have a pending sector. now do smartctl -t short /dev/sda if it finds nothing do smartctl -t long /dev/sda
<ahayzen> ok ....
<exobuzz> strange there are no errors logged mind. we shall see after the test. this just does some read tests btw. it doesnt write anything 9apart from to smart log)
<ahayzen0> the test has started?!? .... 'Please wait 2 minutes for test to complete.'... how do i view the results?
<exobuzz> smartctl -a shows everything .
<exobuzz> AlanBell, pint of pimms? straight? :) heh
<AlanBell> with lemonade
<AlanBell> end of a jug from the BBQ
<ahayzen0> ok so run tht in ~2 mins
<exobuzz> or whever you like to see progerss
<dutchie> AlanBell: sounds lovely
<brobostigon> AlanBell: 9pm it is yes?
<AlanBell> yes, 9PM
<brobostigon> ok,
<ahayzen0> @exobuzz: shall i pastebin the output?
<exobuzz> please
<ahayzen0> http://paste.ubuntu.com/667589/
<exobuzz> ok so now, you can see the lba of a failed sector
<ahayzen0> in disk utility after refreshing it says 'Self tests: FAILED (Read)'
<ahayzen0> ok
<exobuzz> you can do "hdparm --write-sector 148493569 /dev/sda" note this will write over data on the disk.
<ahayzen0> but just over tht sector?
<exobuzz> yes
<ahayzen0> 'Please supply the --yes-i-know-what-i-am-doing flag if you really want this.' <- lol
<exobuzz> first of all. try this
<exobuzz> hdparm --read-sector 148493569 /dev/sda
<ahayzen0> ok..
<ahayzen0> 'reading sector 148493569: FAILED: Input/output error'
<exobuzz> ok.. now write it with hdparm
<ahayzen0> ok
<exobuzz> and then try reading it again
<ahayzen0> what is the '--yes-i-know-what-i-am-doing flag'...
<exobuzz> you have to add that. i didnt tell you that. thats part of the test :)
<exobuzz> its to make sure you dont accidently run stuff that is potentially dangerous
<ahayzen0> hmmm but it doesn't then run ...
<ahayzen0> 'sudo hdparm --write-sector 148493569 /dev/sda --yes-i-know-what-i-am-doing' just outputs the options for the cmd
<exobuzz> /dev/sda comes last
<exobuzz> btw are your partitions unmounted. i didnt ask that. i assumed heh
<exobuzz> since you are booting from livecd
<ahayzen0> yep :)
<ahayzen0> 're-writing sector 148493569: succeeded'
<ahayzen0> so now test the read
<exobuzz> now try the read again. if it works. then do the smartctl test again and wait
<ahayzen0> 'reading sector 148493569: succeeded' ... and then lots of 0000 :D
<exobuzz> good
<ahayzen0> right so now the disk is 'Healthy' ...
<ahayzen0> hopefully now i have changed the SATA cable to one tht worked the PC will start working :)
<exobuzz> run the short test. then if thats good, fsck every partition
<ahayzen0> could u just remind me of the fsck cmd
<exobuzz> note we will have overwritten data on the disk, so its wise to restore from the backup on the partition that had the problem
<ahayzen0> ok :)
<exobuzz> fsck.ext4 /dev/sdaX for ext4
<ahayzen0> is there any way of actually working out wht bit of data tht was?
<exobuzz> -f to force it
<ahayzen0> thx
<exobuzz> fsck.ext4 -f /dev/sdaX
<exobuzz> there is a way, but its slightly complicated.
<ahayzen0> ok :(
<ahayzen0> could u work out which partition?
<ahayzen0> so i know if it is / or /home or swap
<ahayzen0> 'Self-tests: Completed OK' :)
<exobuzz> the info you need is in http://smartmontools.sourceforge.net/badblockhowto.html
<ahayzen0> ok thx
<exobuzz> however just fsck the drives and you will likely find out anyway
<exobuzz> the partitions i mean
<ahayzen0> running sda1 atm
<ahayzen0> 'Error reading block 146 (Attempt to read block from filesystem resulted in short read).  Ignore error<y>? '
<ahayzen0> do i say no?
<exobuzz> ctrl+c and do a smartctl -t long /dev/sda on the disk first
<exobuzz> to make srue there are no more bad blocks
<ahayzen0> ok
<exobuzz> it can take a few hours
<exobuzz> if you have plenty of errors, send the drive back :)
<ahayzen0> u weren't joking ... 22:00 it will finish
<exobuzz> (if it's in warranty)
<exobuzz> yeh heh
<ahayzen0> well i think it is more the SATA cable...
<exobuzz> oh. well get that replaced right now and stop everything heh
<ahayzen0> cause yesterday i couldn't even read the disk ... so today i tried a different SATA cable in a different port and it seems to be working a bit better
<ahayzen0> i'm on a different SATA cable at the moment :) thts why it is able to read the disk
<ahayzen0> in the current state wht would happen if i just ran the Ubuntu install would it then write over the bad sectors or should i wait for the test to end?
<exobuzz> wait for the test.
<ahayzen0> it appears one bad sector has already been found
<exobuzz> basically you can do as before. read it with hdparm. fails. write it (block gets remapped). retest. you may have a bunch of them. if drive is under warranty send it back. else rinse and repeat this, and maybe reinstall once its "clean".
<ahayzen0> ok thx :)
<ahayzen0> ok ... thank you for ur help ... i was really worried the other day because the machine couldn't get POST BIOS as it kept getting stuck at 'Detecting IDE drives' i thought tht this was the end of my disk/mobo but it appears to be the cable (yn)
<AlanBell> 10 minutes everyone
<AlanBell> if you could all pile in to #ubuntu-meeting that would be great
<brobostigon> :)
<AlanBell> 5 minutes
<AlanBell> 3 even
<AlanBell> right now, and we are first up
<bigcalm_lappy486> Wondered why it was quiet in here
<bigcalm_lappy486> Support in what sense?
<AlanBell> bigcalm_lappy486: say hi in #ubuntu-meeting *right now*
<bigcalm_lappy486> I've never attended a meeting before so have no idea how they work
<bigcalm_lappy486> Don't want to put my foot in it
<brobostigon> AlanBell: ubuntu-cymru might be worth a mention.
<popey> :D
<popey> \o/
<AlanBell> \o/
<bigcalm> Was there really any worry? With the amount of work you lots put in
* AlanBell changed the topic of #ubuntu-uk to: Welcome to #ubuntu-uk! http://ubuntu-uk.org | This channel is publicly archived http://irclogs.ubuntu.com | Mailing List http://tinyurl.com/uukml | Support Guidelines http://tinyurl.com/uuksupport | Meeting 29th August 21:00 UK time #ubuntu-uk-meeting | We got our Reapproval \o/
<daubershome> Sorry for being late!
<bigcalm> Time for Minecraft then :D
<daubershome> Also! Well done AlanBell and others on the hard work on the application :)
 * AlanBell sits down with a stiff drink
<brobostigon> :)
<airurando> congrats ubuntu-uk
<airurando> enjoy the drink AlanBell. Well deserved!
<StevenR> woo
 * StevenR glares at openvpn that won't start on boot
<bernhard1> cant seem to disable sinhosun in php.. idears ?
 * daubershome adds that to the list of "good" things that happened this evening
<StevenR> right. that's special of it. It's trying to start before the network is ready
<StevenR> so it attempts to bind to the static IP that isn't there yet
<czajkowski> poor AlanBell you'd swear he was beaten u
<czajkowski> *up
<daubershome> czajkowski: I watched some of your talk today :) Not too bad on the talking fast thing this time
<TheOpenSourcerer> Have you all seen this? http://madebyevan.com/webgl-water/ Need to use Chrome. It's really freaky...
<TheOpenSourcerer> Especially when you turn on Gravity.
<czajkowski> daubershome: how slow did you go
<daubershome> I didn't in the end
<czajkowski> daubershome: when yer finsined wth mine can you mail cypher@skynet.ie
<czajkowski> thanks
<daubershome> Can do :)
<shauno> heh, the talking fast thing must be awkward.  most people assume it means you're nervous.  here, it just means you're local
<daubershome> If they deinterlace ok, Im hoping to start uploading tomorrow
<diplo-> TheOpenSourcerer, Doesn't work in Chromium ?
<TheOpenSourcerer> Dunno?
<diplo-> Your browser does not support WebGL
<TheOpenSourcerer> No then.
<czajkowski> shauno: yeah and I talk fast :/
<shauno> in the states I just told people they were listening too slow.  that doesn't work so well when you're not trying to offend people tho :/
<TheOpenSourcerer> Think I am going to have an early night. Laterz all.
<AlanBell> o/
<bigcalm> Goodness it is early
<bigcalm> Tempting to not do anything more for the evening
<popey> AlanBell: your mail looks like arse
<shauno> heh.  oops.  I'd have to agree
<shauno> (on the plus side, that's a pretty guaranteed way to get people to go and read it)
 * daubershome heads to bed
<czajkowski> popey: you have a way wiht words
<AlanBell> popey: it does
<judgey> hey guys i need some help, i have installed ubuntu server and setup a forum but as i dont have my domain yet i can not access it so need to do it via ip, i have my own server so there is no username as such. How would i get to my foums just using the IP ?
<judgey> forums*
<Azelphur> judgey: http://i.p ?
<Azelphur> replace i.p with the ip of course
<judgey> i can get to the ip but it just loads my hosting pannel
<judgey> not the forums
<Azelphur> hosting panel?
<judgey> yer sorry
<Azelphur> you installed ubuntu, you installed a hosting panel too?
<judgey> yep ehcp
<Azelphur> so your ubuntu server machine is at home
<judgey> no server in france
<Azelphur> oh ok
<Azelphur> a dedi?
<judgey> yep
<Azelphur> ah, making sense :D
<judgey> heh :) sorry my bad
<brobostigon> good night everyone, sleep well.
<Azelphur> ok and you have ehcp on there and you want to go to your website not ehcp
<Azelphur> Can you not move ehcp to a subdirectory or something?
<judgey> yer if thats pos
<Azelphur> ex 127.0.0.1/ehcp
<Azelphur> what webserver are you using
<judgey> apche2 u mean?
<Azelphur> yep
<judgey> thats the one
<Azelphur> did you install ehcp with apt?
<judgey> no from source
<Azelphur> looking at this ehcp thing it doesn't exactly look like something I'd want on my server :x
<judgey> wget www.ehcp.net/ehcp_latest.tgz
<Azelphur> what does it even do?
<judgey> its just to host domain and mysql
<judgey> just easy for me to use
<Azelphur> heh, ssh is easy too :D
<Azelphur> judgey: so you downloaded this tgz then what did you do with it
<judgey> after untar ./install.sh
 * Azelphur reads install.sh to see what it does
<judgey> if it was just pleask or somthing how would u do it? would it not be the same ? Im a newbie so im not to clued up
<Azelphur> cat debug.txt | sendmail bvidinli@gmail.com > /dev/null 2>&1
<Azelphur> wow, seriously why are you using this thing
<Azelphur> woa wtf
<Azelphur> judgey: uninstall this thing, seriously
<Azelphur> ps aux > debug.txt and cat debug.txt | sendmail bvidinli@gmail.com > /dev/null 2>&1
<Azelphur> in install.sh
<Azelphur> judgey: you know what that does?
<judgey> no lol
<Azelphur> wtf it sends your syslog too
<judgey> its on forums :|
<Azelphur> judgey: it's scanning your system, looking at everything you have installed, everything that's running, system logs,
<Azelphur> and then sending it to bvidinli@gmail.com
<Azelphur> wtf and it's adding nginx repositories even if you use apache
<judgey> its on ubuntu forums i though it would be safe
<Azelphur> maybe time to get a Ubuntu forum mod to take it down then, that things at best a major privacy violation
<Azelphur> can you link the thread?
<judgey> let try and find it sec
<judgey> load of posts on the forums
<judgey> http://ubuntuforums.org/search.php?searchid=82516017
<Azelphur> bad :/
<Azelphur> judgey: I'd be tempted to just reinstall ubuntu server to ensure all the crap this thing has done is gone
<Azelphur> it's doing some very dodgy, weird things that it absolutely doesn't need to be doing
<judgey> if there somthing eles i can use thats newbie freindly?
<Azelphur> judgey: what does EHCP even do?
<judgey> easy host control panel
<judgey> or somthing
<Azelphur> yay now I know what the acronym stands for but that doesn't answer the question
<judgey> liek plesk
<judgey> like
<Azelphur> your aiming at reselling webspace?
<judgey> no just for my forums and a private tracker
<Azelphur> right so the answer is you don't need ehcp at all
<Azelphur> lol
<judgey> lol i dont know how eles todo it
<Azelphur> for the love of FSM, what is "it"
<judgey> i have tryed but allways get lost
<judgey> like host my forums and install apche2 mysql
<judgey> a web server
<Azelphur> right, ehcp doesn't do any of that though
<Azelphur> >.<
<Azelphur> judgey: have you done much work, is it easy for you to just reinstall ubuntu server fresh?
<judgey> yer all i have done is teh install of the server and ehcp
<judgey> the
<Azelphur> start off by doing that then, so we can get rid of the ehcp stuff
<Azelphur> it looks rather dodgy :p
 * diplo- agrees with Azelphur 
<judgey> Azelphur: right this sec i dont have time, will u be about tomorrow?
<judgey> and do u mind helping me?
<judgey> i will uninstall this now tho ill do a reinstall of the os
<Azelphur> judgey: I may be here, if I am I'll help
<Azelphur> if not, sudo apt-get install tasksel && sudo tasksel install lamp-server
<diplo-> Me 2
<Azelphur> tada you have apache mysql php all setup >.>
<Azelphur> (that's all install.sh does, only in a much more haphazard manner)
<Azelphur> (on top of the mailing of various system information, too)
<judgey> lol thats great Azelphur  and diplo-  ;) i wish it was that easy i allways get stuck
<Azelphur> :)
<judgey> u both uk?
<Azelphur> I am, yes
<diplo-> Where is the server located judgey at home ?
<diplo-> Yep
<judgey> no france OVH
<Azelphur> judgey: kimsufi? :)
<judgey> yer lol
<Azelphur> not a bad choice, I know a few people who host with them
<judgey> Kimsufi 16G
<Azelphur> judgey: hehe, I have a slightly bigger server :)
<judgey> ovh?
<judgey> i wish i had more money
<Azelphur> nah, http://reliablesite.net/v4/dedicated-server-detail.aspx?server=intel-core-i7-860
<judgey> just money os tight
<Azelphur> I needed the high connection quality
<judgey> nice :)
<judgey> i got the car MOT at 2pm so will be after that :) thanks for the heads up and i shall be back to bother u loads im sure :)
<diplo-> As Azelphur says it's really easy to set up a basic install
<judgey> can not wait now lol can not belive ehcp has all that bad stuff my bad
<diplo-> For me, I just install from repos
<diplo-> Rarely from anywhere else, you always get security upgrades and you know from a source you can trust
<judgey> Ubuntu Server 11.04 "Natty Narwhal" --- Ubuntu Server 10.10 "Maverick Meerkat" --- Ubuntu Server 10.04 LTS "Lucid Lynx"
<judgey> whats the diffrence?
<judgey> its on my list of os i can install
<diplo-> LTS is long term support
<diplo-> So server gets 5 years i believe of security upgrades
<diplo-> Where as mav and natty are i think 3 years
<judgey> oic
<diplo-> Depends if you want latest and greatest versions of php/mysql etc
<diplo-> Or stable security.
<diplo-> I personally run natty as i am not worried about being overly stable
<diplo-> Well not stable..
<shauno> I tend to recommend LTS for servers, unless you really want to babysit a major upgrade every 6 months.  because the other huge catch is that you can upgrade from one LTS to the next, every 2 years.  for non-LTS releases, you need to upgrade via each consecutive 6-monthly release
<diplo-> And that's the other side :)
<diplo-> Glad you typed that and not me
<diplo-> :D
<judgey> kool thx for heads up
<judgey> i have dyslexia just so u know thats why my spelling is bad so not a kiddy :)
<judgey> even tho its looks liek i am
<judgey> by the way i type
<judgey> like*
<judgey> had to google dyslexia btw ;)
<diplo-> Typing is fine, most people online don't type that well i find.
<judgey> :)
<judgey> oky im off night and will cya 2mos thanks again
#ubuntu-uk 2011-08-17
<harry_> whats the diffrence between 'su' command and 'sudo su -' command ???
<fUDGEx> E.NET
<AlanBell> morning all
<popey> lo
<TheOpenSourcerer> Morning
 * TheOpenSourcerer wonders if AlanBell is wake yet. Perhaps he has been celebrating the UK loco reapproval with oodles of pimms.
<AlanBell> TheOpenSourcerer: yes
<TheOpenSourcerer> Ambiguous answer ;-)
<AlanBell> I had about a pint and a half of pimms+lemonade
<MartijnVdS> at this time in the morning?
<MooDoo> AlanBell: congrats on the re-approval, apologies i couldn't make the meeting, someone decided to have fake contractions last night ;)
<MooDoo> oh morning all
<diplo> Morning all
<diplo> They are great aren't they MooDoo
<MooDoo> morning
<MooDoo> diplo: fake contractions?
<diplo> yep
<diplo> :)
<MooDoo> diplo: not when you're at 8+15 :)
<diplo> Been a few years for me now, but the unknown bit gets the heart pumping a bit
<diplo> :)
<MooDoo> diplo: yup :D  shame as i really wanted to come to the re-approval meeting......
<MooDoo> lol
<diplo> lol, I like your priorities :P
<diplo> No IRC on the phone ?
<MooDoo> diplo: oh yeah, you know how it is, think you're wifes in labour and PANIC!!!!! :D
<MooDoo> lol
<daubers> Gah, stupid ffmpeg
<popey> wassup?
<christel> morning
<MooDoo> morning
<christel> MooDoo: i gather you had an exciting day huh? :)
<MooDoo> christel: evening, yes, false alarm though :S AGAIN!!!! lol
<livingdaylight> greetings
<christel> the joys of braxton-hicks!
<livingdaylight> Anyone familiar familiar with subsonic? just dl it but do not see it anywhere in menu. Alt+F2 and "subsonic" doesn't launch it either. anyone?
<MooDoo> christel: that's the one :D
<MooDoo> christel: but we're so close now, i could be the real thing :)
<christel> :)
<christel> super exciting times ahead :D
<MooDoo> christel: oh yes, little brother is dead excited, albeit it VERY clingy :D
<christel> :D
<diplo> livingdaylight, Open a terminal and try running it rather than alt f2
<diplo> So you can see any output
<livingdaylight> diplo cheers
<livingdaylight> livingdaylight@pebble:~$ subsonic
<livingdaylight> Started Subsonic [PID 2408, /var/subsonic/subsonic_sh.log]
<livingdaylight> What does that mean?
<MooDoo> looks like it's ran :)
<popey> "Started Subsonic" what do you think that means?
<MooDoo> livingdaylight: it looks like it's started as a daemon
<MooDoo> ps -ef | grep subsonuc     see if it's running :)
<diplo> It's also outputting to a log file, maybe worth seeing if anything in there
<livingdaylight> ok, guys, apparently its running but can only be accessed from a browser
<livingdaylight> I'll check into that
<daubers> popey: ffmpeg seems to have decided to crop the videos I compressed overnight, even though I've not put a crop thing in
<popey> daubers: crop by how much?
<daubers> enough to take the presenter off the right hand side and just show the slides
<popey> odd
<popey> did it change aspect ratio?
<daubers> No, same aspect
<daubers> Done it to all 13 videos I was compressing
<popey> I'd do one at a time then âº
<daubers> popey: Was fine until I added a deinterlace step
 * daubers wonders if a compressor cluster would be quicker]
<daubers> Is it me, or is this startting to look a little bit lcars with the thick darker lines running around the edges http://www.markshuttleworth.com/?p=717
<popey> looks too busy to me
<popey> also.. having pirated films in a screenshot fail
<popey> also the black blob next to pidgin where he painted by accident
<diplo> lol popey I hadn't noticed that
<diplo> Anyone let him know ?
<daubers> seriously, it's not far from that to this http://www.lcars.org.uk/
<diplo> :o
<MartijnVdS> that would make it more Enterprise-y
<MartijnVdS> NCC-1701-D Enterprise-y :)
<daubers> I for one welcome our new Federation overlords......
<MooDoo> kaplah!   oops damn found out :)
<bigcalm> Ug Ug
<bigcalm> I think I'm still recovering from the weekend
<MooDoo> :)
<christel> poor bigcalm
<bigcalm> Thank goodness that it's a 4 day week
<bigcalm> Good morning my dear christel :)
<christel> Good morning <3
<gord> thats not an actual screenshot btw ;) just a mockup
<gord> of what users might have
<popey> sure
<popey> that makes it worse
<popey> someone actually _thought_ about what goes on screen rather than just pressing print-screen
<gord> fun little fact that no one has picked up on but i spent like, an entire *day* working on! if you change your wallpaper, we pick out a colour from it and change the colour of unity to suit :)
<popey> he says that in the post
<ubuntuuk-planet> [Paul Mellors] Movies on demand. - http://paulmellors.blogspot.com/2011/08/movies-on-demand.html
<davmor2> morning all
<bigcalm> Morning
<MooDoo> morning
<^aDaM> Morning all.. :)
<diplo> MooDoo, have you tried handbrake as well to rip dvd's ? I prefer it over acid rip
<MooDoo> diplo: nope, i did actually just try the first one i found and it seemed to work ok :)  i'll look into it though cheers :)
<popey> handbrake is good
<MooDoo> yeah it looks it, i'll give it a try
<MooDoo> anything to stop my son driving me nuts ;)
<gord> mini-itx gave me a tracking number, the tracking number gives you a specified time when the item will be delivered of about an hour, taking all the fun out of refreshing the page constantly
<popey> MooDoo: what's he doing?
<MooDoo> popey: ah just normal toddler stuff, want to watch that dvd, 2 mins later, no that one, not that one no that one....lol
<popey> "no" is the answer
<popey> "You watch this one or none at all"
<MooDoo> i know i know, just wanted a better solution than changing dvds all the time :)  it's the ggek in me :D
<diplo> MooDoo, exactly the reason why I started 'backing' mine up
<gord> "you watch this one or i'm putting on the live stream of parliament"
<popey> :D
<diplo> Also the problem with finger prints all over the DVD's
<popey> zzzzzzzzzzzzzz
<popey> ooo
<popey> minecraft 1.8 will have beef!
<gord> love film has streaming of kids shows if you have that and a ps3 or something
<gord> popey, i thought minecraft already had beef? from punching cows?
<MooDoo> that reminds me, not looked at the map in ages
<popey> nope
<popey> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TCm6cPkLBJY
<gord> oooh pork
<diplo> gord, do you have LoveFilm ?
<gord> diplo, yup
<diplo> Been thinking about trying it for ages
<diplo> Do you use it on your PS3 ?
<gord> yup
<diplo> Might try there trial thing on there then
<diplo> I'd rather that than get Sky Movies I think
<diplo> Which package are you on ?
<gord> iruno
<gord> one that gives me streaming and two disks
<bigcalm> popey: looks like pork will be stackable as well?
<czajkowski> hmmm
<bigcalm> Things that makes you go...
<ubuntuuk-planet> [Jonathan Riddell] 245 Desktop Summit Names to Find - http://blogs.kde.org/node/4470
<HazRPG> morning boys and girls :)
<dogmatic69> o/
<brobostigon> good morning everyone.
<MooDoo> hi
<brobostigon> hi MooDoo
<judgey> hey guys im just setting up lamp on ubuntu server - im doing sudo  tasksel - how do i pick lamp in ssh. I press enter and it just shuts down
<judgey> dont worry i worked it out, space bar ;)
<diplo> :D
<gord> hehe i like that it shuts down when you press enter
<gord> cos i mean, who would do that?!
<MooDoo> judgey: spooky, i've just ran that myself :)
<judgey> lol
<judgey> u installed this yet?
<judgey> sudo  apt-get  install  phpmyadmin
<judgey> i can not load it in my web page
<diplo> Didn't know they had packaged it :) shows how little I use it
<judgey> http://ip/phpmyadmin
<diplo> Had a look in error logs ?
<judgey> hehe
<judgey> it installed ok by the looks of it just says it aint there
<judgey> when i try and load teh page
<diplo> Restarted apache ?
<judgey> tryed that to :|
<diplo> /etc/init.d/apache2 restart
<diplo>  /var/log/apache2/error.log
<diplo> ?
<diplo> See if any errors
<judgey> The requested URL /phpmyadmin/ was not found on this server.
<judgey> oky
<diplo> Not sure how it works with it symlinks into it or whether it's added to httpd.conf
<diplo> I'll just google a mo
<diplo> Ok, it uses phpmyadmin.conf in /etc/apache2/conf.d/
<diplo> Just have a quick look and see if that looks okay
<judgey> kool
<judgey> ill look now thx
<judgey> wot am i looking for diplo
<diplo> Where it's linked to, I suppose I could install it a mo and take a look, I do all my mysql via cmd line
<diplo> Downloading now
<judgey> thanks loads
<judgey> brb need some coco pops lol
<diplo> sudo ln -s /etc/phpmyadmin/apache.conf /etc/apache2/conf.d/phpmyadmin.conf
<diplo> Seems to not be symlinking
<diplo> It says its caused by not selecting apache2 on install
<diplo> But I  defo did and had same issue
<diplo> The above fixed mine
<judgey> wow kool nice one, will i have to use that cmd again if i reboot the server or anyrhing?
<diplo> No should be fine
<diplo> Unless you rm it
<judgey> kool, right next thing i need to do/learn is to add users and passwords for mysql databases
<judgey> found it
<judgey> haha kool
<MooDoo> judgey: just click the privaliges tab :)
<judgey> lol just found that ;p
<diplo> Or via the command line is just as easy :)
<judgey> ok thats all good forums and database all done and working, now to add a domain is the a controll panel for that?
<MooDoo> not really, you'll need to edit/create a conf file.
<diplo> http://www.ubuntugeek.com/howto-create-name-based-and-ip-based-virtual-hosts-in-apache.html
<diplo> Basics there judgey
<judgey> cheers will read mow :)
<diplo> bbiab
<directhex> i ordered my new phobile moan \o/
<popey> go on!
<popey> new pre?
<Myrtti> oh my how expensive the N9 is going to be :-/
<popey> and oh my how unavailable..
<Myrtti> it's a good thing I'm fairly depressed already at everything
<Myrtti> this would make me even more sad, if it were possible
<Myrtti> AlanBell: where do you want me to file a bug about the Ubuntu UK map? :->
<Myrtti> alternatively, do you have any advice on how I should be doing the addition of second pin? I seem to be failing, still
<bigcalm> Myrtti: if you are failing, then there is a ui bug
<Myrtti> or documentation bug
<bigcalm> Yus
<HazRPG> brobostigon: hey dude, you got a moment?
<HazRPG> brobostigon: Android based question :)
<MooDoo> HazRPG: ask away, others might know ;)
<HazRPG> Its rooting related :)
<MooDoo> hehe rooting rocks, i bodged my way through updating mine to cyanogen :D
<HazRPG> I haven't done it before, so its new to me... seems I can backup fully (as in Nandroid backup) without root, I can't get root without first unlocking the bootloader... and to do that it wipes your phone (*sigh*)
<HazRPG> I think this is the only thing I've ever been worried about rooting/hacking
<HazRPG> doesn't help that there's more than one way to do it
<HazRPG> question is, which is the best way?
<HazRPG> or which has people done they would recommend
<MooDoo> i just followed the instructions on the cyanogen site and hoped for the best [which isn't the best way:)
<HazRPG> I've already gone the MyBackup/SMS Backup+ stuff to make sure everything is backed up... currently undergoing an SD card backup to grab all those things and have them sitting at my desktop.
<brobostigon> HazRPG: i have yes, but it seems MooDoo is helping you.
<HazRPG> brobostigon: did you just follow the cyanogenmod directions too?
<MooDoo> brobostigon: help away, i did the bodge it and scarper mention :)
<MooDoo> s/method
<directhex> popey, yeah, new pre. on the company plastic
<popey> does the pre use gstreamer then? :D
<brobostigon> HazRPG: mostly, yes,
<judgey> wot phone?
<judgey> ic
<HazRPG> Nexus One :)
<directhex> popey, as it happens, yes
<judgey> have u seen
<judgey> http://forum.xda-developers.com/wiki/index.php?title=Nexus_One/Guides_%26_Tutorials#Root
<judgey> superoneclick
<judgey> god this is so hard
<judgey> adding a domain is the hardest part
<HazRPG> I have read about SuperOneClick, but I read somewhere that it doesn't work with 2.3.4 I think
<judgey> yer i just saw m8
<judgey> sorry
<judgey> http://forum.xda-developers.com/forumdisplay.php?f=556
<judgey> loads of stuff here tho
<directhex> HERE IS MY DETAILED GUIDE TO ROOTING A WEBOS DEVICE: type "upupdowndownleftrightleftrightbastart". touch the "developer mode" button. flick the developer mode switch, click restart
<directhex> you now have root. enjoy.
<HazRPG> heh
<Howie> good afternoon everyone
<MooDoo> hiya
<judgey> HazRPG:  here is a diffrent one click thing
<judgey> http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=747598
<directhex> to access your rooted device, plug into a PC with the SDK installed, and run "novaterm" to get a root shell. or install a terminal emulator directly on the device via palm-install or some other utility
<Howie> is ubuntu ment to beep on shutdown?
<directhex> depends on the hardware, i think
<Howie> I press shutdown and the bios speaker beeps loudly
<HazRPG> judgey: just looked through the list, seems that only Nexus One (2.2) has been tested, but it might not work
<judgey> :(
<Howie> is this ment to happen or it it a mistake?
<Howie> or is it just me?
<MooDoo> i can't remember if my laptop does it or not
<HazRPG> My sister's laptop (DELL & Acer) use to beep on reboot/shutdown, so I wouldn't worry about it
<HazRPG> its a BIOS feature, think it can be turned off (but don't quote me on that)
<HazRPG> its just to alert the user that a shutdown/reboot has been instigated
<MooDoo> turn off system sound in biod
<MooDoo> bios
 * Howie goes into bios setup
<Howie> what menu is it cmos setup (standard) or something else?
<HazRPG> should be CMOS stuff :)
<drussell> other way would be to blacklist the pcspkr
<drussell> http://ubuntuguide.net/disable-the-annoying-beep-when-you-shutdown
<Howie> or just unplug the speaker?
<drussell> Howie: well, I wouldn't recommend diving inside your laptop to do that
<Howie> its a desktop
<Howie> not a laptop
<Howie> so will it work or muck it up?
<dwatkins> there should be an option for that, Howie - you shouldn't ned to disable the speaker entirely (although some BIOSes allow you to do this)
<drussell> Howie: yeah that will work fine, but the software change is easier than getting the case open ;o)
<drussell> dwatkins: depends on the bios, some do, some don't, just luck of the draw
<dwatkins> indeed drussell
<Howie> so where will it be in setup on an amibios
<drussell> Howie: if you can't see it, it's probably not there
<Howie> in that case its not there
<HazRPG> brobostigon: did you pick clockwork mod or amon_ra's recovery method?
<brobostigon> HazRPG: amon_ra
<HazRPG> brobostigon: any reason for picking that one?
<HazRPG> Or are both the same?
<brobostigon> HazRPG: i dont remeber. but on my htc dream, there were some differences, yes.
<HazRPG> brobostigon: hmm, seems this wiki doesn't tell you how to get root, it just shows you how to unlock the bootloader
<brobostigon> HazRPG: the wiki did say how to get root her, it was to go back to a specific android version, that you could directly su into root, from terminal.
<popey> http://www.andypad.co.uk/
<popey> interesting
<mgdm> ooo
<Myrtti> nice
<MooDoo> popey: it's rubbish, angry birds isn't installed by default ;)
<gord> woo, new mini-itx machine is built, dual core atom this time, i can *feel* the power
<popey> I want a datacentre full of ARM servers
<popey> http://vimeo.com/27496401
<czajkowski> how do you tell what version chrome you're using :/
<popey> you dont :D
<popey> you just use the latest
<czajkowski> how do I know I'm running the latest
<popey> PS. click the spanner then About Google Chrome
<brobostigon> czajkowski: in the spanner menu, about * .
<gord> i was waiting for a nice arm board to come out, but i couldn't wait in the end :(
<popey> which arm boards did you dismiss?
<czajkowski> spanner
<czajkowski> thats what I missing
<czajkowski> thanks
<popey> yes, spanner
<MartijnVdS> czajkowski: Chrome puts a file in /etc/apt/sources.list.d pointing to the Google server with new versions on it
<brobostigon> czajkowski: top tight.
<judgey> got to go for teh car mot now sooo hope it passes, ill be back laster to finish of the domain :| afk
<popey> czajkowski: what version you got there?
<MartijnVdS> if you use the update-manager (or apt-get update) regularly,  you have the latest version
<popey> 12.0.742.124
<czajkowski> 13.0.782.107
<popey> ?
<gord> i couldn't actually find any to buy :)
<brobostigon> 15.0.855.0
<popey> 127893129312.0.235.12351825
<MartijnVdS> 14.0.835.94 beta
<popey> http://uk.farnell.com/texas-instruments/beagle-xm/kit-dev-beagleboard-xm-omap35x/dp/1823269
<MartijnVdS> popey: your time machine is malfunctioning
<gord> eh, arm is supposed to be cheep. that thing costs more than the mini-itx i got
<gord> and doesn't have sata at all
<popey> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5vEHMBKKZwI
<gord> how not to run a web store selling ethernet cables "Belkin Cat5e Snagless UTP Patch Cable (Grey) 5m -Buy new: Â£3.02 - Usually dispatched within 1 to 2 months"
<daubers> gord: I'm waiting for something to say "Usually dispatched never"
<MartijnVdS> â« Six to eight years to arrive
<MartijnVdS> </smashmouth>
<davmor2> gord: I'm seeing both alt-tab versions currently should I be and how can I turn one or the other off please?
<gord> davmor2, either turn off one in ccsm or unity --reset
<davmor2> gord: thanks
 * Howie is still here
<MooDoo> hello Howie
<Howie> hello again MooDoo
 * Howie just got a shock of off the psu
<brobostigon> :(
<MooDoo> ouch
<Howie> yeah ouch
<gord> ... don't touch it
<Azelphur> woo, my G930 arrived
<Azelphur> works ootb with Ubuntu :D
<Azelphur> also [38954.494487] input: Logitech Logitech G930 Headset as /devices/pci0000:00/0000:00:1d.2/usb8/8-1/8-1:1.3/input/input15
<Azelphur> headset is an input device, because I can.
<directhex> Azelphur, it has buttons for volume, presumably
<Azelphur> directhex: haha, it has more than just that :D
<gord> oh a headset, i guessed phone
<Azelphur> hehe
<MartijnVdS> Azelphur: more than volume? it has a keyboard attached to it?
<Azelphur> MartijnVdS: yep.
<Azelphur> I got the full logitech gaming set now, http://gamesweb.sk/editor/images/pages/2/13357/logitech-gseries.jpg \o/
<Azelphur> apart from I use a Logitech TrackMan instead of that mouse
<directhex> i need a new mouse. care to mail me a g9?
<Azelphur> haha
<Azelphur> I have a G5, but my brother uses it
<directhex> my wife has a g5
<Azelphur> tis a nice mouse :)
<MartijnVdS> Azelphur: money > sense? :P
<Azelphur> noes
<MartijnVdS> not anymore then
<Azelphur> MartijnVdS: haha
<diplo> Anyone know much about Perl DBI ?
<diplo> perl.org down and can't find an answer atm
<MartijnVdS> diplo: I know a bit
<diplo> For watever reason some one at my work place is running XAMPP on our boxes
<diplo> DBI is installed
<diplo> But the path it's looking for the mysql.sock is /var/lib/mysql/mysql.sock
<diplo> Where as XAMPP puts it in xampp
<diplo> Just wondering if i can configure DBI to tell where the sock file is
<diplo> Rather than ln -s
<MartijnVdS> diplo: try looking in the DBD::MySQL manual
<diplo> Will google that now ta
<MartijnVdS> diplo: I think it might work in the hostname field
<MartijnVdS> diplo: in DBD::mysql it says
<MartijnVdS> diplo: "DBI:mysql:databasename;mysql_socket=/path/to/socket"
<diplo> heh just found that as well thanks,
<diplo> Hmm, still not happy..
 * diplo digs some more
<MartijnVdS> diplo: what's the error?
<MartijnVdS> diplo: are you allowed to open the socket?
<Azelphur> Anyone know if there's a way to just loop what I'm saying back through the headset?
<diplo> ah good point..
<Azelphur> noise cancellation is so good I can't hear myself speak >.<
<diplo> failed: Cant connect to local MySQL server through socket
<MartijnVdS> Azelphur: it's an option I think?
<MartijnVdS> Azelphur: in the sound prefs?
<Azelphur> yea but where abouts :P
<diplo> Fails as root as well
<diplo> mysql.sock is owned by nobody so should be fine
<MartijnVdS> diplo: what's the message? :)
<diplo> failed: Cant connect to local MySQL server through socket
<MartijnVdS> diplo: maybe it wants to connect to localhost?
<diplo> I just read about that, set to localhost atm
<diplo> Wondering about changing to loopback
<MartijnVdS> don't set a hostname
<MartijnVdS> then it shuold use the local socket
<diplo> ok
<diplo> Done, thanks!
<ali1234> regarding that screenshot... this is why zeitgeist is a terrible idea
<popey> heh
<ali1234> at least it wasn't midget porn
<popey> lol
<MartijnVdS> there's always the next screenshot, ali1234
<ali1234> yeah, unless someone comes to their senses and redesigns unity from scratch
<MooDoo> that aint going to happen.
<MooDoo> i'd love a key stroke that hides the menu bar from view and doesn't come back until you hit the keystroke again
<MooDoo> instead of the mouse over
<brobostigon> like the superkey in gnome-shell.
<MooDoo> yeah
<gord> everyone should own a revo, if only for the awesome little useful keyboard you get with it
 * daubers starts test render 5
<dogmatic69> new meaning to a computer crash... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZjK4_sAl904
<daubers> popey: Just got the following text message "SAP is a very, very naughty word. AdHoc Query is worse.
<daubers> "
<MooDoo> davmor2: where you been slacker?
<davmor2> MooDoo: I'm in a QA sprint in London so swapping between rooms etc
<MooDoo> cool
<Howie> afternoon all
<gord> hrm, anyone know why dhcp might not be working on my server?
<judgey> hey :)
<judgey> my car passed yippy
<davmor2> MooDoo: yeah learning how to break czajkowski^WSoftware in new and interesting ways
<MooDoo> davmor2: czajkowski will love you for that......
<Howie> judgey car passed what mot?
<czajkowski> davmor2: I can't use gwibber any more :/
<judgey> my car had its mot today and passed
<davmor2> czajkowski: on oneiric or natty?
<czajkowski> natty
<czajkowski> crashes on start up
 * MooDoo doesn't like gwibber in oneiric
<MooDoo> so use tweet deck lol
<bigcalm> I thought air had been pulled from linux?
<MooDoo> bigcalm: i just download it from the adobe site.
<MooDoo> i'm not using 64bit natty
<bigcalm> Fair enough :)
<diplo> judgey, Get it all sorted ?
<judgey> not yet im so lost with adding the domain :|
<diplo> Where have you got to ?
<judgey> o sorry
<judgey> get my car moted
<judgey> :)
<judgey> passed
<judgey> yay
<judgey> sorry im reading it all wrong
<Azelphur> judgey: you was the ehcp guy from yesterday right?
<judgey> yer hey
<Azelphur> cool
<judgey> i have done all of lamp
<Azelphur> how goes it?
<judgey> im kool thx dude u?
<judgey> i di da reinstall
<MooDoo> -did the :)
<MooDoo> sorry lol
<judgey> done lamp and phpmyadmin
<judgey> lol
<diplo> How far have you got with v hosts ?
<judgey> just stuck at adding a domain im reading this...
<judgey> http://www.ubuntugeek.com/howto-create-name-based-and-ip-based-virtual-hosts-in-apache.html
<judgey> just lost with it all
<Azelphur> judgey: nice :)
<Azelphur> I use lighttpd myself
<diplo> I take it you have pointed domain to your box ?
<judgey> not done named servers yet
<judgey> will do when i have this sorted cos i want as less downtime as pos
<judgey> its still pointing to the old server
<judgey> with ehcp on it
<diplo> It's quite simple to set up a basic vhost
<judgey> :o
<diplo> Live ?
<judgey> yer on the old server
<judgey> only a few more days on it so nps
<judgey> new server will never have it again
<Azelphur> judgey: are you running Ubuntu at home too?
<Azelphur> (not on the server, but at home)
<judgey> no win7
<Azelphur> boring :p
<Azelphur> you can test the vhost setup on ubuntu without changing the domain, I think you can on windows too but dunno how
<judgey> do i need to edit /etc/apache2/sites-available
<judgey> defalt file?
<judgey> defalt
<Azelphur> that should be a folder not a file
<Azelphur> I think
<diplo> 001-default I think he is meaning
<diplo> Inside said folde
<Azelphur> ah
<diplo> r
<judgey> yer
<diplo> yeah, that should link to sites-enabled/001-default
<MooDoo> edit the hosts Azelphur
<Azelphur> my apache knowledge is weak, I'm a lighttpd guy, someone else be useful :P
<MooDoo> same as ubuntu but it's just in a differnt location
<Azelphur> :)
<judgey> got to be a newbie guide somwere
<gord> every time i setup an ubuntu server i hit this wall with dhcp... then i figure it out, then instantly forget how =\
<judgey> lol ;p
<diplo> So judgey
<diplo> in 000-default
<diplo> You need <VirtualHost <hostname>>
<judgey> i have file called default :o dont have 000- dose that matter?
<diplo> Inside ServerAdmin <emailaddresscontact>
<diplo> Probably fine, mines 000 that's all
<diplo> DocumentRoot /var/www/html <IE Path to your web dir>
<diplo> I think that's all you basically need to get a Vhost up on a very basic level
<diplo> Just need to point domain to it then
<popey> laura
<diplo> Just reading up it is better to create a file called yourdomain.conf in sites-available
<diplo> and then ln -s domain.conf sites-enabled/domain.conf
<judgey> kool let me just try :)
<diplo> It's been a while since I played with vhosts unfortunately, run everything on my localhost and used a shared hosting
<diplo> But I know you can setup a very basic vhost then add options as you need them
<judgey> ln: creating symbolic link `sites-enabled/host2k10.conf': No such file or directory
<judgey> but its defo there
<judgey> i put
<judgey> ln -s host2k10.conf sites-enabled/host2k10.conf
<bigcalm> judgey: use a2ensite
<bigcalm> Saves messing around with directory paths
<diplo> :D
<diplo> I just read that, never used that in my day ! :P
<bigcalm> cd /etc/apache2/sites-available; a2ensite host2k10.conf; /etc/init.d/apache reload
<diplo> judgey, if you do carry on the other way it's probably because you are not in sites-available
<ali1234> how do i kill zombies when the parent process is init?
<bigcalm> Shotgun?
<bigcalm> Oh, and a chainsaw
<shauno> (I've a feeling he is in sites-available, so needs ../sites-enabled rather than site-enabled.  but a2ensite.  does what it says on the tin.)
<bigcalm> You also have a2enmod, which is handy for enabling mods :)
<judgey> sec guys
<bigcalm> Actually. You don't need to cd to the dir. Just: a2ensite host2k10.conf
<ali1234> is it worth reporting fglrx bugs?
<gord> i hate linux :( why can't it just work
<judgey> here is my config but its wrong so says apche
<judgey> http://pastebin.com/7YAiULGK
<diplo> heh
<diplo> 2 secs will edit
<diplo> http://pastebin.com/7kPSeh37
<diplo> Dont want the Inside part as well
<diplo> Sorry meant inside the tags <VirtualHost>
<diplo> :D
<diplo> I'm not great at explaining am I
<judgey> lol ;p
<shauno> fwiw, the config I use is http://pastebin.com/wpCAEY8K  .. I literally just replace every occurance of TEMPLATE with the domain, and I'm done
<judgey> sec
<diplo> Or just copy shauno one which is fuller :)
<judgey> :o
<judgey> lol
<judgey> ok
<judgey> oky that seemed to go without any errors, sorry to be a nub but how dose it no my domain from that?
<judgey> ha wait
<judgey> ServerName TEMPLATE << template is my domain?
<bigcalm> Yes
<judgey> haha
<judgey> sorry
<judgey> iwthout www. ?
<bigcalm> You can also have ServerAlias
<judgey> with out www.
<bigcalm> ServerName example.com
<bigcalm> ServerAlias www.example.com
<judgey> kool
<judgey> and thats it then just need to point the domain to my server?
<judgey> and /var/www is were i put index and stuff dont need to make the folder host2k.info
<judgey> as my DocumentRoot /var/www/ < is that
<judgey> or do i need to make the path /www/mydomainname.here/httpdocs/
<bigcalm> judgey: I would suggest having a sub directory for your website
<bigcalm> It's up to you as to where you have it
<judgey> will i have to change the document root?
<bigcalm> If the DocumentRoot is to be other than /var/www, then yes
<judgey> kool
<ali1234> bug 709505
<lubotu3> Launchpad bug 709505 in fglrx-installer (Ubuntu) "[MASTER] fglrx failed to install/upgrade due to being incompatible with 2.6.38 kernel" [Critical,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/709505
<gord> heh, spent five minutes learning how to write an upstart script. they are completely right, its easy
<bigcalm> This isn't fun
<bigcalm> PHP Fatal error:  Class 'DateTime' not found
<bigcalm> Version of PHP on this server is 5.3.6
<mgdm> bigcalm: using a distro package?
<mgdm> bigcalm: chances are the packagers have broken^Wfiddled with it
<bigcalm> mgdm: RHEL server. I'm not installing anything
<bigcalm> Client's tech is responding to my requests via email
<bigcalm> I do get to alter php.ini though if I need to
<bigcalm> So, where would I look to see if the right bits are being included?
<bigcalm> Date is showing up in phpinfo()
<AlanBell> !ati
<lubotu3> For Ati/NVidia/Matrox video cards, see https://help.ubuntu.com/community/VideoDriverHowto
<AlanBell> so what is going on if the additional drivers window is empty?
<ali1234> ati sucks
<ali1234> see rant on #ati
<hamitron> ATI drivers have a nice GUI to build a .deb
<ali1234> yeah a nice gui that DOESN'T WORK
<hamitron> minor issue
<hamitron> ;)
<ali1234> to go with their APP SDK installer that ALSO DOESN'T WORK
<AlanBell> where do I find the nice non-functional gui?
<ali1234> and does REBOOT YOUR COMPUTER WITHOUT WARNING
<ali1234> AlanBell: you don't want it, even if you fix it so it produces a deb, the resulting drivers don't work properly anyway
 * hamitron offers ali1234 a coffee to calm down
<AlanBell> mkay
<Azelphur> ali1234: so...I got a G930 :D
<Azelphur> seems to work ootb though :)
<mgdm> bigcalm: weird one. Can you get a phpinfo output and paste it?
<AlanBell> so I just go with the flow on the 2d driver then?
<ali1234> the distro driver works better than the latest one
<ali1234> here is the new catalyst driver if you feel like wasting your time: http://www2.ati.com/drivers/linux/ati-driver-installer-11-8-x86.x86_64.run
<ali1234> you must sudo apt-get install debhelper dh-modaliases execstack
<AlanBell> http://paste.ubuntu.com/668495
<ali1234> and then --buildpkg Ubuntu/natty
<ali1234> then install the debs it builds
<ali1234> Rage XL?
<ali1234> what is that??
<AlanBell> dunno, on the mobo of an HP Proliant DL360
<AlanBell> really don't care much if it doesn't work, but I thought I would try
<mgdm> it's an ancient ATi chipset, roughly 4MB or maybe 8MB
<ali1234> i don't think catalyst is gonna support that
<mgdm> around about 1999 vintage IIRC, but they soldiered on for server motherboards for a few years
<mgdm> I used it in VESA mode
<mgdm> dunno if that still works
<mgdm> s/mode/driver/
<AlanBell> it does 2d no problem
<ali1234> ok how do i roll back to the old debs from command line?
<ali1234> Azelphur: what's a G930?
<Azelphur> ali1234: more G-Series devices for the driver :D
<Azelphur> it's a headset complete with G-Keys on the headset
<Azelphur> ali1234: http://hotronica.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/11/g930_side.jpg
<Azelphur> Is there a nice service that provides free wikis?
<mgdm> Azelphur: wikia.com?
<AlanBell> no
<AlanBell> there are services that provide wikis though
<Azelphur> AlanBell: that's what I mean, :)
<Azelphur> wikia sounds good I guess :)
<AlanBell> also wants libqtgui4 and libqtcore4
<AlanBell> aticonfig: No supported adapters detected
<ali1234> um... well
 * AlanBell gives up on that then :)
<ali1234> you have a card that is 10 years out of date
<AlanBell> and is on a server that will be running headless
<AlanBell> I just wanted to see what the current ATI install process was really
<ali1234> it's identical to the nvidia install process
<ali1234> if you have a supported card
<ali1234> the card you are using is equivalent to like a nvidia TNT card or something
<hamitron> make
<ali1234> hmmmm
<mgdm> is MSN messenger broken for anyone else?
<ali1234> i'm connected
<ali1234> no one is online though
<ali1234> so i dunno
<webpigeon> I'm online
<Howie> how do I make my pc boot from usb
<Howie> cos it ant doin it
<webpigeon> Howie, check the boot order in your bios?
<bigcalm> Howie: you will need to change the boot device order in the bios
<Howie> what one.do I.select to go first
<webpigeon> It depends on the bios
<Howie> I have an amibios
<oly> hum, any mail gurus who are able to help with a fetchmail / maildrop issue ?
<bigcalm> Howie: I personally use this order: USB -> CD -> HDD
<webpigeon> I do when i'm setting up, but i set as HDD when done - then lock the bios with a password :P
<oly> basically i want to replicate the remote folders locally if possible ?
<oly> i have got the mail coming down fine but i loose the folders grouping so curious if there is  way around this ?
<Howie> usb fdd?
<webpigeon> Howie, what other options are there?
<webpigeon> my older mashine only boots from usb if you set the boot option to usb zip which is damned odd
<Howie> cdrom ide-0 ide-1 scsi network floppy zip atapi. disabled
<Howie> thats all
<bigcalm> Howie: how old is the machine?
<ali1234> how old is this computer?
<bigcalm> Jinx ;)
<ali1234> no u
<Howie> quite old
<ali1234> 6 years?
<bigcalm> Howie: the bios might pre-date the ability to boot from usb
<bigcalm> You could look for a bios update, but I wouldn't be too hopeful
<Howie> it struggles with booting from cd or hdd as well
<webpigeon> oggcamp show \o/
<webpigeon> bigcalm, there is a work arround where you boot from cd and that boots from usb
<webpigeon> I don't remember the link though :(
<Howie> weird pc
<Howie> belonged to a prep school previously
<Howie> also it makes weird noises sometimes
<Howie> and it used to boot from usb but now it doesnt
<bigcalm> Maybe it only booted from 1 or 2 specific USB ports
<bigcalm> Try different ones
<Howie> mabe its my hub
<ali1234> it is
<ali1234> usb boot doesn't like hubs
<ali1234> also you might not be able to boot from every usb port
<Howie> nope just boots into ubuntu
<Howie> port 1
<Howie> (annoying noise followed by hdd boot
<bigcalm> There we go then :)
<Howie> nope it dont boot from usb
<bigcalm> Oh
<Howie> curse you prep school.kids who fiddle with things till they break
<ubuntuuk-planet> [Ubuntu UK Podcast] S04E13  When Two Worlds Collide - http://podcast.ubuntu-uk.org/2011/08/17/s04e13-when-two-worlds-collide/
<ubuntuuk-planet> [Tony] That Was The OggCamp That Was - http://tonywhitmore.co.uk/blog/2011/08/17/that-was-the-oggcamp-that-was/
<bigcalm> :OOOOO
<bigcalm> To the gpodder!
 * Howie yawns loudly
<AlanBell> Myrtti: each pin needs a different description
<Myrtti> AlanBell: sorry?
<AlanBell> Myrtti: you can't do two pins, both with a blank description
<Myrtti> ah right, had to go to read my lastlog before things clicked
<AlanBell> :)
<bernhard2> any has knowledge on exim4 and tsl
 * AlanBell tickles Daviey 
<AlanBell> ok, so the Ubuntu UK happy hour
<AlanBell> where shall we do the first one?
<ali1234> the what now?
<AlanBell> pick a pub, any pub
<mgdm> The Ben Nevis, in Glasgow
<mgdm> at a stretch, the Bon Accord has more seating
<AlanBell> great, where next?
<AlanBell> http://ubuntu-uk.org/happy-hour/
<popey> prince of wales, farnborough
<AlanBell> now where?
<mgdm> The Jolly Judge in Edinburgh? Bit mobbed at this time of year
<mgdm> I'd also suggest MacNeil's in Stornoway
<popey> AlanBell: The Swan and Bottle, Uxbridge âº
<AlanBell> need some in the middle kind of options
<popey> there are some great camra pubs in brum
<AlanBell> I know the Nottingham contingent wanted one
<popey> AlanBell: The Hobgoblin on Broad Street, Reading
<popey> The Warwick on King's Road, Reading
<popey> The Back of Beyond, also on King's Road
<popey> (apparently the best of the wetherspoons)
<popey> Getting this data from a local yokel
 * popey pokes Ng 
<popey> what pub (if any) would canonical people be seen in, in that london
<ali1234> home in nottingham does the best steaks evar
<ali1234> it's not in the city centre though
<ali1234> and the pub bit is a bit rough
<ali1234> but those steaks are amazing
<ali1234> http://www.homeloungebar.co.uk/
<bernhard2> how can i check if Exim was compiled with OpenSSL (or GnuTLS) support
<ali1234> check the package depends
<ali1234> exim4-daemon-heavy depends on libgnutls26
<ali1234> and so does -light
<bernhard2> so whats the command ?
<bernhard2> dpkg -l "exim*"
<bernhard2> ?
<ali1234> apt-cache showpkg exim4-daemon-heavy
<bernhard2> so does this mean.. those are installed and in use ?
<bernhard2> Dependencies:
<bernhard2> 4.72-6+squeeze2 - exim4-base (2 4.72) libc6 (2 2.7) libdb4.8 (0 (null)) libgnutls26 (2 2.7.14-0) libldap-2.4-2 (2 2.4.7) libmysqlclient16 (2 5.1.21-1) libpam0g (2 0.99.7.1) libpcre3 (2 7.7) libperl5.10 (2 5.10.1) libpq5 (2 8.4~0cvs20090328) libsasl2-2 (0 (null)) libsqlite3-0 (2 3.7.3) debconf (18 0.5) debconf-2.0 (0 (null)) mail-transport-agent (0 (null)) exim4-base (1 4.61-1) mail-transport-agent
<bernhard2> (0 (null))
<ali1234> it means the package needs all of that stuff to work
<ali1234> so it must be using gnutls
<ali1234> at least compiled with it
<bernhard2> Configuring Exim4 to use TLS. Configured 03_exim4-config_tlsoptions but when i restart exim4 and check with:  exim4 -bP | grep tls_
<bernhard2> i get this output..     http://pastebin.com/VYwTEihg (it does not show what i have configured) when i test get this message  Host did not advertise STARTTLS
<ali1234> well that is probably a configuration issue
<ali1234> omg
<ali1234> i can't do basic math :(
<ali1234> 16+12 != 24
<directhex> mats is unpossible!
<ali1234> what i wanted was the first 12, skip 4, then the next 12
<ali1234> so i wrote: for line in range(12)+range(16,24):
<ali1234> doh
<ali1234> and lost 4 lines from each file
<ali1234> then spent an hour trying to figure out why
<ali1234> i had actually ruled out errors in every other part of the code and decided that the problem must be in that line, before i saw it
#ubuntu-uk 2011-08-18
<sg> hello
<MartijnVdS> popey: http://nyantardis.com/
<MooDoo> morning all
<nigelb> Morning!
<popey> Morning
<Gary> morning
 * Gary is still feeling sorry for himself
<MooDoo> wassup Gary ?
<MooDoo> morning popey
<DJones> Morning all
<DJones> AlanBell: COngrats on the reapproval, sorry I couldn't join in, but deepest darkest derbyshire doesn't have much in the way of internet or mobile signals
<smittix> Morning all
<popey> hi smittix
<smittix> How goes it?
<popey> how was the holiday DJones ?
<popey> smittix: need coffee
<smittix> heh
<Gary> MooDoo: morning, things are okay, still in pain tho :'(
<MooDoo> Gary: feeling poorly.
<Gary> yeah, came off my bike on sunday, faceplanted the pavement
<MooDoo> Gary: ouch, done that a few times :S
<DJones> popey: It was good, nice and relaxing, lots of walking (dog now has legs that are about 2 inches shorter), visiting places, drinking wine/beer/southern comfort etc
<popey> excellent
<popey> feeling refreshed?
<DJones> Knackered :)
<Gary> MooDoo: I broke my hand too!  and have since been feeling rather sorry for myself
<DJones> 5 mile walks up hills & down dales
<christel> poor Gary :(
<MooDoo> Gary: hugs
<DJones> Gary: Sorry to hear about that, hope the recovery doesn't take too long
<czajkowski> aloha
<MooDoo> morning czajkowski *poke*
<gord> "Just letting you know your bi-monthly candy was just sent from Japan and should be arriving to you in about a week." :D
<Gary> candy!
<MooDoo> :D
<Ng> popey: the Morpeth on Millbank often has canoniclers on a friday
<Ng> but many of us prefer to scurry home to our burrows ;)
<popey> :D
<kirrus> gord: you get candy from Japan?
<gord> kirrus, yup
<Myrtti> pocky â¥
<kirrus> gord: ordered from a site, or just a friend being friendly? :)
<gord> from a site, its a club, every other week you get sent new candy
<gord> for â¬15 a month
<HazRPG> morning all \o
<kirrus> sounds good.. gotta link? ;)
<gord> um candyjapan.com maybe? something like that? i have no idea
<MooDoo> http://www.candyjapan.com/
<kirrus> woo, thanks :)
<diplo> morning all
<diplo> That's the first time in 20 years that I have overslept for work :D
<MooDoo> diplo: no excuse :D
<diplo> Nope :(
<diplo> Luckily on my own at work this week
<Gary> anyone notice?
<diplo> Not yet, work remotely from our headoffice in Nottingham
<diplo> No missed calls, just wasn't on msn/skype
<diplo> "I forgot to sign in this morning"
<diplo> :D
<MooDoo> Nottingham O_o :)
<MooDoo> Us Nottingham Ubuntu-ers definately need a meet up :D
<smittix> I concur!
<diplo> I'm up on my own next month for 2-3 days
<diplo> Staying in a hotel in the town centre
<MooDoo> cool, pub night :D
<diplo> So up for a meet up
<Howie> I have returned
<smittix> Moodoo, are you on google,
<smittix> bah
<smittix> s/google,/google+
<MooDoo> smittix: yup
<MooDoo> Paul Mellors
<smittix> Coolio
<popey> \o/ Google+
<popey> I've been playing some games on it recently
<smittix> Not related to John Mellors by any chance?
<popey> its nice that they keep game stuff to the game stream
<smittix> popey: You're already in my Linux Peeps circle
<popey> heh
<MooDoo> smittix: no :)   and i've added you :D
<MooDoo> smittix: John?  Johnathan?
<MooDoo> i have an uncle Johnathan
<smittix> How old roughly?
<smittix> The John I know is 27ish
<MooDoo> nah not the one, he's my uncle and i'm 40 :D
<MooDoo> well 39 :)
<smittix> ahh heh
 * Howie is still.here
<MooDoo> i'll contact you guys in a couple of weeks about a beer, still waiting for the new nipper to drop.
<Howie> help ubuntu has got stuck on a 30 second loop, and its driving me up the wall
<Howie> any ideas
<popey> not with that level of detail, no
<Howie> I cant see any open aplocations and the pc is stuck.on stand by
<Howie> and I cant stop it or get the pc off stand by
<bigcalm> Do you have sshd running on the machine?
<Howie> in English please
<bigcalm> That'll be a no then
<MooDoo> Howie: the ssh deamon, the program that allows you to SSH into your box
<Howie> I have no idea what that is anyway
<Howie> right
<bigcalm> I have SSHd running on all of my linux machines, so that if they freeze, I can connect from another machine and kill whatever is causing the freeze
<popey> Howie: have you tried turning it off and on again?
<bigcalm> IT Crowd to the rescue
<Howie> popey it wont turn off
<bigcalm> Pull the power cable out
<bigcalm> Or remove the battery
<MooDoo> Howie: press and hold the power button for 15 seconds
<MooDoo> it should then power off
<bigcalm> Yes, what MooDoo says
<Howie> it beeps twice and continues to run
<popey> pull the power out
<bigcalm> If it still runs after that, you have bigger problems
<MooDoo> bigcalm: and i want to know his secret as it's running with no power :D
<bigcalm> :)
<Howie> wth battery backup mode active just appeared on screen for a few seconds and then it contonues being annoying
<bigcalm> Reminds me of one of the few x-files eps. I can remember: Ghost in the Machine
<popey> Howie: take your trolling elsewhere
<MooDoo> Howie: just remove all power to the machine...that will sort it.....
<popey> I believe howie to be wasting our time here.
<Howie> popey its not trolling its me forgetting that I put a backup battery in iy
<popey> bullshit
<MooDoo> Howie: that won't effect anything
<MooDoo> popey: i think that was a little harsh :S
<christel> FIST OF DOOM
<MooDoo> imho
<popey> heh
<popey> MooDoo: feel free to go back over the last year of crap we've had from him and undo that
<popey> then come back to me and tell me it was harsh
<MooDoo> popey: ah ok
 * MooDoo stands corrected
 * MooDoo wonders if it's pushing it a little too far if i mention language ;)
<popey> yes, it is
<bigcalm> Oh, it's him
<popey> indeed
<bigcalm> And now, for something completely different: http://eddirt.frozenreality.co.uk/index.php?id=783
<popey> haha
<bigcalm> I want me a kitten
<smittix> That sums my cat up
<AlanBell> MooDoo: name a pub in nottingham
<popey> "The MooDoo Arms"
<bigcalm> I name this pub...
<bigcalm> Just don't break the bottle
<diplo> I do like the pubs in Nottingham, and the people seem quite nice as well
<czajkowski> hmm
<czajkowski> I tried to add a pin to where we are on the UK map the other day
<czajkowski> I think I failed
<czajkowski> :/
<czajkowski> feck
<AlanBell> czajkowski: did it tell you that you already had said that?
<MooDoo> AlanBell: the trip to jerusalem?   the bell in, the salutation inn
<AlanBell> MooDoo: pick one
<czajkowski> AlanBell: no I couldnt move the pin to anywhere other than "London" and I was trying to be specific
<czajkowski> so not sure it saved
<smittix> diplo: Except for the rioting scumbags which were in the city center not long ago.
<MooDoo> AlanBell: salutation
<diplo> The Bell inn is our usual I believe, that just down / opposite a tescos/mcd's ?
<diplo> I forgot to ask my work peeps about that smittix, was it that bad ?
<smittix> diplo: Yeah The Bell is a good pub
<AlanBell> czajkowski: it did save, somewhere
<bigcalm> Oo, Nottingham is only 1.5hours from here
<smittix> diplo: Yeah It was worse than the media made it out to be. They didnt report on half the things that happened.
<czajkowski> hmm ok
<diplo> smittix, :(
<AlanBell> czajkowski: it saved in Westminster, want it deleted?
<czajkowski> I am the only person in London
<czajkowski> I find this hard to believe
<czajkowski> nah tis cool
<smittix> diplo: But I have to hand it to Nottinghamshire Police they did a great job.
<MooDoo> smittix: the only things i heard about was in st anns and mansfield
<diplo> Nowt happened in my small town, I didn't actually here about it till monday night/tuesday morning
<smittix> MooDoo: Bulwell, Sneinton, Meadows, Basford, Radford, St Anns.
<czajkowski> AlanBell: can you RT my last tweet :)
<MooDoo> smittix: where are you living at the mo?
<smittix> MooDoo: Bulwell, Stanns, Meadows and Oxclose lane police stations were all attacked.
<smittix> MooDoo: Cinderhill.
<MooDoo> didn't know oxclose was :S
<MooDoo> smittix: Calverton here
<MooDoo> Ubuntu UK Road Trip - Nottingham '11 :D
<czajkowski> AlanBell: thanks
<popey> :D
<smittix> MooDoo: Yeah, I remember you saying :). One person from Calverton was arrested.
<MooDoo> smittix: yay :D lol
<MooDoo> smittix: don't know the name do you?
<smittix> I will have a look
<MooDoo> s'ok i got it
<MooDoo> *sigh*
<diplo> Rain is horrible :(
<bigcalm> I quite like the rain
<diplo> Want to go home put heating on and watch a movie, not really making me want to stay at work
<bigcalm> Expect when it causes flooding and I lose my car to it in 2007
<gord> why must every program have a different key combination for re-do :(
 * MooDoo started encoding his movies last night, shame all i've got is a laptop 2.5 hours to encode a movie :S
<gord> we all decided on undo!
<popey> gord: you should try SAP one day
<gord> oh really?
<popey> they have different function key combinations within the application on different screens
<gord> ha nice
<popey> refresh might be F5, F8, or perhaps Shift F2
<bigcalm> Fun
<popey> yeah
<AlanBell> right, more people tell me about pubs where they live, postcode and name please
 * popey pokes AlanBell DJones and whoever else with -irc
<DJones> ok
<bigcalm> Humm?
<bigcalm> AlanBell: the LUG in my county meets here: http://shropshirelug.wordpress.com/meetings/
<bigcalm> AlanBell: not the biggest pub, but they do have an upstairs room the LUG gets to use
<czajkowski> http://www.jonobacon.org/2011/07/05/free-official-ubuntu-book-for-approved-loco-teams/ for offical locoteams
<MooDoo> :)
<AlanBell> czajkowski: applied for it when that was posted (deadline was monday)
<MooDoo> I have the one for 10.04 LTS if any one is interested in borrowing it :D
<gord> heh, neat. found my suse thing :) http://ubuntuone.com/p/1BCk/
<gord> *puts it next to the wookie that guards his computer from viruses*
<popey> hehe, i have one of them
<popey> it's in Sams bed
<MooDoo> gord: not seen mine in years :)
<gord> mine was behind the coffee in the kitchen cabinet - smells like coffee now :)
<gord> oh right yes, i took a photo on my phone *watches u1 notify-osd spam me on all my computers*
<smittix> I want one of those Tux Droids
<AlanBell> http://ubuntu-uk.org/happy-hour/
<AlanBell> need moar pubs
 * popey will tweet this.
<AlanBell> then I will mix the order up a bit
<popey> can you put some text on that page which describes what we plan?
<gord> the planned route isn't too helpful, just lots of red lines with no progression indicatied
<diplo> That is some distance to travel AlanBell :D
<MooDoo> is there a way to add a pub yourself?
<AlanBell> MooDoo: sure, register on the site and I will bump you up to editor
<MooDoo> ok thank you
<TheOpenSourcerer> popey: Have you discovered whether the WP/Apache/PHP issue is still there on a later version of Ubuntu?
<AlanBell> http://ubuntu-uk.org/happy-hour/
<bigcalm> Zoomed out, the pin looks as though it's in Wolverhampton. It's Telford if that gives and +/- points :)
<popey> TheOpenSourcerer: no, all of them run LTS
<TheOpenSourcerer> ok
<TheOpenSourcerer> ty
<TheOpenSourcerer> Anyone know how to get schema and data out of MSSQL so it could be imported in MySQL or something more free and useful?
<smittix> I should be ashamed of myself. Its the first time I have installed 11.10
<smittix> Liking the login screen.
<TheOpenSourcerer> smittix: I'm still on 10.10 currently. Can't bring myself to get all unityfied just yet.
<directhex> TheOpenSourcerer, don't blame you
<smittix> TheOpenSourcerer: To be honest I hated unity to start with because it was so different. But now I love it.
<MooDoo> i was in oneiric, then it crashed to much, so went to 10.04, just upgrated to maverick last night
<directhex> unity's implementation in natty is really really really really really really really really bugged
<smittix> I have no problems in Natty at all.
<DJones> Ouch, on exam results day, the UCAS website has crashed and had to been taken offline
<MooDoo> ooops
<kirrus> TheOpenSourcerer: you can upgrade, and still use Gnome2, just on the login screen select 'Ubuntu Classic'. I had to, as Unity kept flipping my workspace orientation, so nothing was where I put it :/
<bigcalm> If only they could have predicted when it will be in high demand...
<TheOpenSourcerer> kirrus: Yeah I can, but why? 10.10 is stable and reliable. I use this for work and don't really have time to get to grips with all the other UI changes right now.
<kirrus> Newer version of firefox? I tend to upgrade just because I've seen what happens to machines that don't get upgraded, ever. (i.e. they're a pig to get up-to-date, or they just break when you try)
<TheOpenSourcerer> I am running FF6 this morning.
<bigcalm> Same here (think I was yesterday as well). When will this crazyness end?
<bigcalm> The guy who does the HTML Validator extension has stopped releasing until the API settles down :(
<directhex> bigcalm, never, then
<TheOpenSourcerer> I'm not very happy about the Mozilla 6weekly release schedule. As an extension dev (for Thunderbird which is also now on the 6 week cycle) it is a pain in the bottom.
<TheOpenSourcerer> It's just a number! WTF can't they update a minor one rather than a major?
<gord> the new api they are making is supposed to fix that problem
<gord> if its just a number why does it matter?
<TheOpenSourcerer> The way you specify the version an extension relies on major numbers.
<directhex> install.rdf, isn't it?
<TheOpenSourcerer> Yeah
<diplo> TheOpenSourcerer, re MSSQL, could use php/perl to extract and put into mysql
<diplo> I did it at my last job
<TheOpenSourcerer> <em:minVersion>3.0</em:minVersion>
<TheOpenSourcerer> <em:maxVersion>6.0.*</em:maxVersion>
<directhex> who te hell uses toy products like mssql?
<AlanBell> one of our customers
<MooDoo> o/
<AlanBell> so we are going to put it in a real database
<AlanBell> but there is a lack of sensible export options from MSSQL
<directhex> that's not how lock-in works
<AlanBell> http://www.convert-in.com/mss2sql.htm this looks like it might work
<diplo> heh, we had quite a few software companies dependant on it, so we let them use it and exported the data to mysql to do with it what we wanted
<TheOpenSourcerer> There are a few commercial tools. There used to be a MySQL tool but that EOL'd in 2008
<diplo> yeah that was the issue I came across TheOpenSourcerer
<AlanBell> however a free softare mysqldump tool for mssql would be kind of nice
<TheOpenSourcerer> http://ms2my.sourceforge.net/
<diplo> There is AlanBell, you can do CLI with MSSQL
<diplo> trying to remember commands, has been a while since I had to do it
<TheOpenSourcerer> Last Update   2009-07-17   :-(
<diplo> Not sure if it's human readable though like mysqldump
<diplo> Also seems to be http://sqldump.sourceforge.net
<diplo> lol 2002
<diplo> :D
<diplo> 2005 MSSQL ?
<TheOpenSourcerer> http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/Aa174646
<TheOpenSourcerer> Can't tell if that handles the schema or not.
<diplo> yeah looks like what I used
<diplo> http://blog.simonholywell.com/post/374215441/sql-server-2005-dump-to-sql-statements
<diplo> My brother is a MSSQL chap, want me to ask how to dump the schema ?
<kazade> morning all
<TheOpenSourcerer> That would be kind diplo - thanks. If he has time of course.
<TheOpenSourcerer> That blog post and the DPW look to be helpful too. Thanks.
<smittix> Does anyone here have a Vega Tablet?
<diplo> Will send him a text now, he was always my fall guy when I got stuck with MSSQL, not really my speciality by any means, but I normally get by, but not having to touch it for nearly 2 years doesn't help :)
<AlanBell> Â£875 for a linux ODBC driver for MSSQL!
<AlanBell> http://www.easysoft.com/products/data_access/odbc-sql-server-driver/index.html
<diplo> Don't need it.. can do it with a pear module
<jml> hello
<diplo> http://pear.php.net/package/MDB2_Driver_mssql/redirected
<diplo> I believe
<jml> so, after a very long and painful process, I've got cuts, in .ogv, for all the bits of my screencast that I want.
<jml> now I want to put them together and publish them
<jml> I basically have no idea how to do this
<AlanBell> openshot \o/
<jml> mencoder doesn't output ogv for me
<jml> AlanBell: openshot is fail
<jml> AlanBell: it snips off beginnings and ends of clips
<jml> AlanBell: at least when I am playing back within openshot
<AlanBell> hmm, try a test render, I have not seen that problem
<smittix> Hmm my Google+ Invites arent going down.
<HazRPG> MartijnVdS: I can't stop playing "Kakkaoi!" song :P
<smittix> If you listen to this you will not get it out of your head http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-bAN7Ts0xBo
<HazRPG> smittix: heh, man I haven't heard that in years XD
<diplo> No mine don't either
<diplo> Don't think they are are really doing it, just a ploy to say it's in "Beta"
<HazRPG> when me and my friends first heard that song in like 2000, we all went out and were doing the dance constantly
<smittix> HazRPG: I actually like it.
<HazRPG> then WoW:BC came out, people all thought we were imitating the Draenei dance
<MooDoo> morning davmor2
<davmor2> morning MooDoo
<smittix> HazRPG: haha
<HazRPG> smittix: yeah I do too, I first heard heard the song in Saudi on the asian Channel V music channel, it use to be a random channel, mainly English songs played - but they're occasionally do music from all across asia (india, china, korea, japan, etc)
<HazRPG> there was another Punjabi song I really liked back then, but because I can't really remember the lyrics (and since you can't do a google search on an image that's in your head) ... I could never find it
<smittix> HazRPG: This one makes me laugh. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sdyC1BrQd6g
<jml> AlanBell: basically, Openshot's internal playback is very unreliable for me
<jml> but the output render seems to go ok
<AlanBell> I think the internal renderer tries to play back realtime even if it can't get the data on screen fast enough
<diplo> Anyone else here having issues with Chomium recently since a recent update, seems to just lock up ( go grey )
<diplo> Just from a selecting a link
<HazRPG> smittix: heh that dude looks familiar!
<directhex> diplo, close all chromium windows. run a ps -ef | grep chromium. you may have a defective chromium flash process
<HazRPG> smittix: haha no wait, I have heard this song before XD
<andybleaden> I would love to get an Ubuntu hour up here in Manchester...perhaps one of the wifi friendlier pubs in the city...
<HazRPG> smittix: it was another song I heard on Channel V
<diplo> It keeps happening directhex even after reboots since maybe 2 days ago
<MooDoo> andybleaden: tell AlanBell about a put and get it added to the list :)
<MooDoo> andybleaden: pub not put :)
<AlanBell> andybleaden: pick a pub name and postcode
<andybleaden> does it have to have wifi
<andybleaden> or just nice beer
<AlanBell> beer
<andybleaden> dont rush now!
<andybleaden> I would go for the marble arch then
<sally> I nominate the Crown Beeston Nottingham NG9 1FY http://www.everards.co.uk/pubs/crown_inn_173/
<MooDoo> sally: FTW!
 * AlanBell adds that to the list, thanks sally
<MooDoo> sally: another nottingham user eh :D
<andybleaden> Marble Arch 73 Rochdale Road Manchester M4 4HY
<andybleaden> brew their own beer too!
<MooDoo> #ubuntu-uk-notts-branch :)
<andybleaden> http://www.marblebeers.co.uk/
<sally> MooDoo :) link?
<MooDoo> sally: i was just creating a irc channel as a joke :) although i'm in it lol
<andybleaden> Marble is also easy public transport wise in Manchester and away from the noisy part
<andybleaden> many others here in GM area?
<HazRPG> smittix: if you wanna hear something really random... just before saudi arabian channel 2 (they only had 2 local TV channels) was turned on or opened up, this was the song that played, just to let you know they were about to start the first program: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ajf6WO4MuSg
<christel> AlanBell: i nominate the hop blossom
<diplo> TheOpenSourcerer, my brother is on hols but said ossql is what you want
<diplo> http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/aa213088%28v=sql.80%29.aspx
<Laney> wait more notts people?
<diplo> I remember now that is what I used
<diplo> o/ - Sorta
<diplo> I pop up for work every other month or so
<andybleaden> AlanBell,  Marble Arch 73 Rochdale Road Manchester M4 4HY
<MooDoo> Laney: a few more yeah :)
<HazRPG> smittix: heh, score managed to find it... was trying to find a song that I head on Channel V on my last holiday to the Philippines. Ironically their influence is Michael Jackson (and you can tell from the style of the music and the dance): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ja3T8GdADIs
<MooDoo> Laney: diplo smittix and sally was here, she's from beeston :D
<MooDoo> Laney: got her in #ubuntu-uk-nottingham lol :)
<Laney> heh
<Laney> i live in beeston too
<Laney> small world eh
<MooDoo> Laney: yeah considering i used to live in chilwell :)
<popey> \o/ subteams
<directhex> i live in a pineapple under the sea
<MooDoo> yup #ubuntu-uk-nottingham is alive and well :D
<MooDoo> *snigger*
<paddax_> j lwjgl
<MooDoo> does that mean AlanBell / popey / czajkowski will have to do uk subteam approvals ;)
<smittix> HazRPG: Catchy song!
<smittix> Laney: Cinderhill Here :)
<HazRPG> smittix: isn't it just! Its korean iirc
<AlanBell> MooDoo: yes, but I have heard the UK subteam approval board is quite corrupt and open to bribery
<Laney> arr, good ol' phoenix park
<MooDoo> AlanBell: i should hope so :)
<hoover> morning all
<Laney> MooDoo lives in some strange village out in the sticks
<hoover> or good afternoon rather
 * MooDoo would like to have the #ubuntu-uk-nottingham subteam approved....cash on its way to AlanBell :)
<MooDoo> Laney: pah! yeah ok your right :D
<Laney> it's alright, working in the city qualifies you for membership
<MooDoo> phew :)
<MooDoo> and not far from the trip either ;)
<Laney> heart, right?
<MooDoo> yeah
<Laney> near the donor centre
<MooDoo> Laney: are you stalking me ;)
<Laney> no, i just see it when i go there to donate
<HazRPG> smittix: I thought I wrote more song titles down in my journal, but seems not! Must have had them down on a piece of paper or something and lost them
<MooDoo> ah cool :)
<Laney> which I hope you do too :-)
<MooDoo> Laney: alas no
<MooDoo> Laney: i carry a medical green card which means i'm not allowed
<Laney> :(
<MooDoo> Laney: which does annoy me seeing as i work next door lol
<gord> Android fans! is there any way i can block text numbers?
<directhex> i can't donate
<directhex> they get tetchy when you pass out from just being in te building
<MooDoo> gord: there is if you're using cyanogen, i'm not sure it blocks texts though
<Laney> I have a pretty cool hole pattern on my inside elbow from donating
<czajkowski> kazade: did you get your mac issue resolved?
<HazRPG> smittix: haha, this one's random too... more korean stuff: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U7mPqycQ0tQ (song doesn't start until 0:20 or so)
<HazRPG> I'll leave it at  that, otherwise I'll just spend all day on youtube lol
<gord> MooDoo, using stock :)
<MooDoo> ok
<gord> getting spamvertisements about my "accident"
<gord> are they talking about when i tripped over my cat? i don't want to sue my cat
<MooDoo> well if any nottingham users have anything they want to say and don't want to spam this main channel the other one has a guard on it now.....i can delete it any time :D
<Myrtti> popey â¥
<DJones> gord: If your phone company don't offer teh facility to block certain numbers from sending texts, this may help https://market.android.com/details?id=org.baole.app.antismsspam&feature=search_result
<dutchie> quick question: usb wireless adapters: likely to Just Work with 11.04 or not?
<gord> DJones, neat, thanks
<kazade> czajkowski: nah, but I found a bug report somewhere. Basically I can tap to click, but clicking the actual button confuses Ubuntu (it thinks I'm multitouching)
<czajkowski> :/
<kazade> it's not a big deal - I fixed a shedload of other weird quirks...
<czajkowski> ah ok
<kazade> my biggest annoyance is the Nvidia drivers - which suck
<czajkowski> indeed
<kazade> I can't hot plug my external monitor because Nvidia *STILL* don't support xrandr - which everyone else has been supporting for ages
<directhex> you can hot plug it via nvidia-settings though
<kazade> you mean, opening the nvidia settings window and enabling it?
<gord> kazade, not tried nouvou or however its spelt?
<kazade> Nouveau works like a dream...
<kazade> but freezes about once an hour - forcing a hard reset
<directhex> kazade, right. nvidia-settings can enable/disable monitors without restarting x
<kazade> directhex: true, but, I have my external monitor set as my primary, guess what happens if I unplug it?
<kazade> I lose the side of my desktop with gnome shell on it
<directhex> joyfun
<kazade> indeed
<kazade> nouveau works awesomely in that regard - but it freezes :(
<Gary> hey Matt
<AlanBell> hi Gary
<AlanBell> Gary: do you have an irssi command to alias /20 to /window 20 for all numbers at once?
<Gary> erm, yes, somewhow
<Gary> window_switcher.pl is what I use
<Gary> http://scripts.irssi.org/html/window_switcher.pl.html
<AlanBell> ok, nice, but not quite what I was after
<Gary> I think thats what I use
<Gary> I just do a /23 to go to window 23
<popey> i just have a giant list of aliases
<gord> i just stopped using irssi once i got over 20 windows ;)
 * Laney has a window list
<popey> ditto
<Laney> >> (e=13|#ubuntu-uk r=14|&bitlbee   t=15|#ub~eeting y=16|#debi~evel et cetera
<popey> http://popey.com/~alan/irssi.png
<Laney> http://orangesquash.org.uk/~laney/irssi.png
<Laney> ancient (phorm reference!) but it's pretty much like that still
 * MooDoo feels left out that he only has 9 irssi windows
<dwatkins> I try to keep mine down to 15 or so
<Myrtti> I just remember them by number...
<popey> Laney: I couldn't copye with the abbreviations :D
<Laney> i kind of got used to them
<Laney> muscle memory tells me where most of the important channels are
<Myrtti> ^
<popey> heh
<mfraz74> I'm trying to follow the tutorial at http://developer.ubuntu.com/packaging/html/packaging-from-scratch.html, but I'm getting stuck at the "make" stage
<AlanBell> hi mfraz74
<mfraz74> hi AlanBell
<mfraz74> paste.ubuntu.com/669191
<mfraz74> any ideas?
<AlanBell> not really, but that looks more like "doesn't compile" than it "doesn't package"
<AlanBell> did you write the code?
<mfraz74> no, i was following the tutorial I iposted, cmake worked and then I tried make which failed
<AlanBell> oh, right
<AlanBell> did you install libqrencode-dev libzbar-dev libzbarqt-dev
<gord> heh neat, my little experiment with only passively cooling this atom machine worked out well, cpu is at 20 degrees after a day of running :)
<mfraz74> AlanBell: yes, they are all installed
<MooDoo> Laney: you on google+
<Laney> yes
<AlanBell> mfraz74: what version of Ubuntu are you using?
<popey> jml: just watched your video, so does this mean Launchpad now accepts binary-only packages in ppas? I thought it only accepted open source packages that build on launchpad farm?
<jussi> popey: DAMN!!! that media player looks amazing for the price
<popey> yeah
<mfraz74> AlanBell: kubuntu 11.04
<jussi> popey: I might have to get you to order and send it to me - seems ebuyer doesnt do overseas
<jml> popey: terms of service are still the same: you can use PPAs for free only if you're uploading open source stuff
<jml> popey: we use PPAs as the mechanism to distribute commercial games etc in the software center
<popey> so that demo wouldn't work for me?
<popey> if I got pkgme and tried to upload a blob?
 * nigelb notes popey should have been there at jml's Q & A. :)
 * popey notes he didnt know there was a Q & A.
<jml> popey: it would, (although see the follow-up blog post http://code.mumak.net/2011/08/how-dependency-guessing-works.html) ... but you'd be violating the Launchpad terms of service, and we'd take it down when we found out about it.
<smittix> Any nottingham users I can add to my NottsLinux Circle on google+?
<nigelb> popey: I wish there was more pbulicity planned.
<popey> jml: so at some point of time in the future when developer.u.c is working and pkgme is done, I could somehow register for a special ppa which lets me upload blobs, and do effectively what you did?
<jml> popey: LP is a libre code base providing a gratis service for libre apps, and a paid service for proprietary apps
<jml> popey: yes, pretty much.
<popey> of course, yes
<popey> I forgot about the pay-for service
<popey> does the pay-for service come at an apple-like XX$/yr or is it %age of revenue or a mix of both?
<jml> there are some interesting things that come out of this, though
<popey> or is that not known yet?
<jml> popey: umm... it is known, but I don't actually know off the top of my head
<popey> is it public info?
<AlanBell> mfraz74: I would suggest trying some other random app
<popey> or commercially sensitive canonical info?
<jml> I don't know :\
<popey> (I am not trying to trip you up, just wondering)
<mfraz74> AlanBell: OK, I'm trying to build akonadi-facebook now
<jml> I'm looking for a public source
<AlanBell> not sure who is responsible for developer.ubuntu.com but there shouldn't be tutorials there which don't work
<jml> popey: fwiw, you can submit binary blobs now, it's just that someone at Canonical will package them manually for you.
<jml> or you can package them yourself, as rickspencer3 did w/ photobomb
<popey> AlanBell: previews of upcoming functionality are good though
<jml> popey: I can only find internal information, so I'm going to assume it's company-confidential for now. Sorry.
<popey> ok, no worries
<popey> if/when I get to that point, I'll ask :D
<jml> :)
<jml> to me, there's interesting stuff that comes out of this
<popey> totally
<jml> making it easy for commercial apps to get into the software center for stable ubuntu releases is great
<jml> but, imo, it's got to be as easy for free apps
<popey> http://developer.ubuntu.com/publish/commercial/ lol
<jml> yeah :)
<popey> we (podcast) should talk to someone about this in an interview
<popey> who would be the best person to talk to?
 * popey glares at jml
<jml> http://developer.ubuntu.com/myapps-packages/ is the only other thing I can think of
<MartijnVdS> wow, mono is shiny in oneiric today
<jml> popey: me, rickspencer3, maybe Steve George.
<popey> shall I mail all three?
<popey> or do you want to sort it out amongst yourselves :D
<jml> popey: email me & I can do the internal shuffling :)
<popey> will do
<jml> popey: also, the transcript from my https://wiki.ubuntu.com/WeeklyQandA might be worth reading.
<popey> thanks
<popey> your first name at ubuntu dot com?
<jml> popey: no, that's riddell. :) I'm not an Ubuntu member.
<jml> popey: my nick at canonical.
<popey> ah, doh :D
<daubers> urgh, it's a touch wet outside
<HazRPG> and off we go on the android sdk wacky install races!
<HazRPG> daubers: hurray for UK weather \o/
<HazRPG> hmm, interesting, java 7 just recently got released
<daubers> HazRPG: it breaks bits of apache
<popey> \o/ Java 1.4.2
<HazRPG> does it? How so?
<daubers> HazRPG: http://www.developerfusion.com/news/123346/java-7-breaks-apache-projects/
 * hoover just wrote his first greasemonkey script, yay ;-) 
<TheOpenSourcerer> It is *really* raining here.
<MooDoo> lets hope it stays there then :)
<popey> oh look, bug 754505
<lubotu3> Launchpad bug 754505 in Ubuntu Developer Portal "Populate http://developer.ubuntu.com/publish/commercial/ with revenue share details" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/754505
<TheOpenSourcerer> Bloody hell - rain getting heavier
<daubers> Today I mostly wish to scream
<bigcalm> Sun is shining here
<bigcalm> This is despite the forecast of heavy rain all day
<daubers> bigcalm: It'll be back
<daubers> and there it is :)
 * daubers needs spotify suggestions
<bigcalm> What's your mood?
<christel> http://open.spotify.com/track/1Nukcy7xk7AbS7MtkaiOe3
<bigcalm> Bouncy
<daubers> bigcalm: trying to calm down and not be shouty at really dumb people
<hoover> cheers all
<bigcalm> daubers: not this then? http://open.spotify.com/track/3iv0TOFQ0dzLhGY4jSSXt0
<daubers> bigcalm: Probably not
 * bigcalm likes that track a lot
 * popey clicks "I have spotify" then "Launch application". Nothing happens
<bigcalm> The app launches for me
<bigcalm> But never opens the track/album
<bigcalm> I have to copy the http url and change it to a spotify:one
<bigcalm> That's linux for you, pfft
<daubers> popey: snap
<bigcalm> WOOP!
<bigcalm> New DMSB
<daubers> DMSB?
<daubers> Domineeringly miniscule suave brother?
<bigcalm> Anybody else know? :)
<DJones> google throws up a few suggestions http://acronyms.thefreedictionary.com/DMSB The McDonalds sounds the best option :)
<bigcalm> It's a podcast
<bigcalm> Hopefully that'll narrow it down
<bigcalm> David Mitchell's SoapBox
<popey> ooo
 * daubers needs caffeine
<MooDoo> fourstone1!
<MooDoo> ooops
<MooDoo> lol
<livingdaylight> anyone play with the weather screenlet? Seems set to Korea by default and don't see how to change it. In properties there is a zip code dialog, but enterming my postcode returns an error
<ubuntuuk-planet> [Jo Shields] Why we mustnt allow smartphones to become a 2 or 3 horse race - http://apebox.org/wordpress/rants/391/
 * daubers prods ldap with a stick and runs
 * MartijnVdS watches LDAP rise up and eat daubers 
<daubers> MartijnVdS: Thats what normally happens when I poke it
<bigcalm> Â¬.Â¬
<jchristel> i say
<bigcalm> I wonder if he's being attacked
<bigcalm> Providing services leaves one open for abuse from unhappy people
<gord> being attacked doesn't cause you to excess flood surely
<bigcalm> That's what I thought, but I'm trying to think back to my ircnet days
<bigcalm> I recall a silly attack where you send a butt load of messages to a user and their quit message was usually Excess Flood, rather than Ping Timeout
<bigcalm> This was late 90s though
<Lcawte> Hmm, wonder if the nvidia-96 driver has been updated yet
<popey> er
<Myrtti> tsktsk
<Myrtti> looks like it's stable now
<bigcalm> Is there a block select in Eclipse?
<andypiper> I thought so
 * andypiper tries to remember how to invoke
<andypiper> alt+shift+a toggle?
<bigcalm> Turns out it was quicker to do it by hand than to find the key combo
<andypiper> lol
<andypiper> soz
<bigcalm> No worries ;)
<bigcalm> But, it's good to have for future needs, thanks :)
<andypiper> i think that's it, might be editor-specific though
<bigcalm> alt+shift+a worked for me
<Myrtti> Azelphur: connection problems? or trying a new silly IRC client?
<popey> bah!
<hamitron> indeed
<hamitron> what would make a chroot jail running bash, close?
<MartijnVdS> hamitron: schroot?
<MartijnVdS> uhr ait
<MartijnVdS> wait
<MartijnVdS> hamitron: anything that kills that bash process
<hamitron> I was supposed to be compiling stuff and installing in a chroot jail
<hamitron> and now I notice I have no jail
<hamitron> \o/
<MartijnVdS> If I have to manage chroots, I use schroot
<MartijnVdS> it's ++
<hamitron> k :)
<MartijnVdS> hamitron: Debian (and Ubuntu)'s default bashrc has a cool feature for it
<MartijnVdS> it shows a marker in your prompt if you are in a schroot-chroot
<hamitron> I think I probably used none defaults
<hamitron> as lfs instructions say
<hamitron> ;)
<dwatkins> My prompt has a smiley to reflect success or failure of a command.
<MartijnVdS> dwatkins: cool :)
<MartijnVdS> dwatkins: how do you do that?
<ging> i want a smilie prompt
<judgey> omg omg omg i had some nightmears :(
<MartijnVdS> and it's not even night!
<judgey> tell me about it lol
<judgey> anyhow i was in here lastnight, i got a line of code and now i dont know it, i just installed lamp again and phpmyadmin but there was a line of code to make phpmyadmin to work.
<MartijnVdS> judgey: isn't it on https://help.ubuntu.com/community/phpMyAdmin ?
<judgey> thanks MartijnVdS  ;)
<MartijnVdS> \o/
<judgey> reinstalling again plz plz be last time
<popey> AlanBell: http://twitter.com/#!/JohnPinner/status/104226443424309248
<popey> AlanBell: http://twitter.com/#!/rmounce/status/104224474227945472
<popey> AlanBell: http://twitter.com/#!/davmor2/status/104257753823969280
<popey> :D
<davmor2> popey: what's with the LOL on that one  serious options :P
<davmor2> popey: oh you down to like 5 meg then
<Myrtti> awww, poor popey :-(
<MartijnVdS> The UK has bandwidth caps on wired connections?
<MartijnVdS> How 1990s ;)
<dwatkins> If you pay enough they give you so-called unlimited bandwidth.
<dwatkins> Not all ISPs cap in this way, however.
<MartijnVdS> We only have it on mobile internet connections here
<MartijnVdS> Those used to be "unlimited" but now you get them in 100MB increments for way too much money :(
<judgey> can a website run from this path?
<judgey> .../home/host2k10/public_html
<judgey> i though tit had to be www.
<judgey> it
<judgey> just playing with somthign and it installed it there
<judgey> seems it dose
<daubers> Evening
<ikonia> directhex: ping
<directhex> ikonia, i don't wanna hear it -__
<directhex> -_-
<ikonia> I've still not heard it
<ikonia> you are breaking it to me, I've just sent a text to a collegue
<directhex> i informed my colleagues too. we're contractors working on touchpad!
<ikonia> I sat in a meeting on Friday of last week with the product manager
<ikonia> nothing was hinted at at all
<mgdm> directhex: eek :/
<ikonia> stern faced he said "all on track"
<ikonia> directhex: I'm sorry
<ikonia> tomorrow will be interesting for me now
<directhex> ikonia, my pre3 shipped from the palm webstore 30 minutes ago! >_<
<ikonia> whoaaaa
<ikonia> now that stings
<andylockran> hey guys
<bigcalm> Hola
<andylockran> I could do with some advice, I want to parse a html file using python
<dutchie> beautifulsoup
<ali1234> dont use regexps
<andylockran> i.e. the page is a 'structured' report
<andylockran> I'm having issues with BeautifulSoup printing chinese :)
<ali1234> set the encoding on your strings
<andylockran> ali1234: how to do?
<andylockran> I'll dpaste my code
<ali1234> print mystring.encode('utf8')
<andylockran> http://paste.debian.net/126651/
<ali1234> don't forget to paste the error message as well
<andylockran> ali1234:
<andylockran> I don't get an error message
<andylockran> if I uncomment the prettify command
<ali1234> s is an object
<ali1234> use the methods
<andylockran> ok
<andylockran> http://pastebin.com/Gxmjq5dt
<andylockran> ali1234: can you explain why that works, and mine doesn't?
<ali1234> not unless you show me the dods.html
<ali1234> and the way you invoke the script
<ali1234> if you don't get an error message, how do you know it doesn't work?
<andylockran> ali1234: it prints a load of unicode stuff
<ali1234> why is that wrong?
<andylockran> dunno
<andylockran> i expected 'prettify' to print it out indented like that example I pasted showed it
<ali1234> and what does it print instead?
<andylockran> loads of lines of \xe0\xa0....etc
<andylockran> http://dpaste.com/597597/
<andylockran> thats the tail of the output
<ali1234> that's not unicode
<ali1234> how do you invoke the script?
<ali1234> i suspect your html file is gzipped or something
<andylockran> it looks normal enough to me
<mgdm> that's not necessarily unicode
<mgdm> just looks like the script is outputing hex values instead of the actual chars
<mgdm> could be fixed with a one-liner in PHP, or some such
<mgdm> andylockran: you get PM?
<mgdm> ali1234: it is Unicode, just UTF-16LE
<ali1234> this is why i asked how the script was invoked
<ali1234> the only way this can happen in python is if it totally failed to understand the encoding of the input file
<mgdm> I think it has a broken BOM at the start of it
<mgdm> there's certainly something iconv can't understand, then a broken MS Office header thing
<bernhard2> cant seem to enable tls on exim4 anybody want to shed some light on my issues ?
<popey> directhex: any regrets? http://www.theregister.co.uk/2011/08/18/hp_kills_webos_tablets_and_phones/
<directhex> popey, a deep sadness, but it's the company's money that went on the pre3, not mine
<popey> it's bonkers
<directhex> i can fire up a new contract on some android bullshit whenever i like
<popey> utter madness
<ali1234> http://dilbert.com/fast/2011-08-16/
<ali1234> popey: http://www.gizmag.com/popemobile-auction/19440/
<popey> I get that a lot
<ali1234> heh
<Azelphur> popey: you get throttled for 40GB/day?
<AlanBell> popey: a new version of openERP was released today as well
 * bigcalm wishes his could understand his client's requirements
<bigcalm> Sod it, time for some MC
 * Azelphur did 600GB last month :D
<Azelphur> did like 38GB in one day got no complaints
<ali1234> you don't get a warning on VM, it's a secret cap
<AlanBell> 28MB for the server and 1.1MB for the client
<Azelphur> secret cap ftw
<ali1234> throttling only lasts 1 day anyway
<ali1234> well, that's how it worked when it was called NTL anyway
<ali1234> i haven't used them since then
<Azelphur> This is why I like Sky, they have no caps or throttling that I know about
<Azelphur> and I hit it pretty heavily.
<mgdm> popey: did I see you say that Apache had OOMed again?
<Azelphur> I pay for 24mbit and actually get around 12mbit, I average 20GB/day and I've seen no throttling/letters/... from sky :D
<Azelphur> so they seem to live up to their "really no FUP" advertising
<Laney> that's a lot of linux isos
<Azelphur> indeed, lots of Linux isos :p
<Laney> maybe some creative commons licensed music in there too?
<Azelphur> sure, and movies
<ali1234> oneiric had 200mb of updates today
<Azelphur> have you seen the yes men, it's awesome :D
<ali1234> and 300mb the day before
<ali1234> i don't even use it
<ali1234> i only keep it updated so that i can test my bugs
<ali1234> over and over and over again
<ali1234> yes, this bug has not been fixed
<ali1234> yes, my system is up to date
<andylockran> ali1234: I got quite a big further with BeautifulSoup :)
<andylockran> I've been able to parse a few tags,
<andylockran> Thanks for your help
<andylockran> http://paste.debian.net/126667/
<dlssss> hi
<dlssss> libnet-akamai-perl This package provides a perl module to interact with Akamai CCUAPI to handle multiple purge requests. ne ideas what this is
<dlssss> on software centre
<mgdm> You very probably don't need it
<mgdm> Akamai are a content-delivery network - effectively a very large caching system for websites - that package lets you tell them to clear things from their cache
<dlssss> right
<dlssss> the thing is..
<dlssss> when i open firefox in gnome and check firestarter log, alot of ips open up with dns of akamaitechnologies
<mgdm> Yup
<dlssss> is this normal
<mgdm> lots of websites use Akamai to handle their images
<dlssss> so even just on google search homepage its usual to have a few ips pointing to akamai
<mgdm> You'll see a lot of "llnw.net", too - that's Limelight, who do similar things
<mgdm> it wouldn't surprise me
<dlssss> is saw something like  -in-f101e or something like that
<dlssss> as dns
<mgdm> they have thousands of machines, so they have funny names
<dlssss> ah ok then thanks
<dlssss> one of their dns is on a blacklist sight
<dlssss>  so panicked
<dlssss> i know a few things but alot i dont so thanks for help
<mgdm> it's probably that they ended up, by accident, storing some content that was 'bad'
<dlssss> ok ta for that then
<mgdm> but if you block Akamai you'll block much of the Web :)
<mgdm> No bother
<dlssss> just interesting also to find out these hidden companies that must have alot of power on web
<dlssss> would never have known. there you go. ta ta :)
<sg> anybody about?
<StevenR> yes?
<hamitron> about what?
<hamitron> :)
<sg> about this channel ^^
<sg> this isn't specifically ubuntu-related but this is the only channel i could think of that has a predominantly british userbase
<sg> basically i'm a soon-to-be american university student, but im curious about studying computer science at durham or another uni in the UK
<sg> i was wondering what the job prospects look like in the UK after graduation for CS majors, and how it compares to other countries like the US
<directhex> sg: the job market isn't great right now, anywhere
<directhex> better for tech people than non-tech people, though
<sg> directhex: what about starting salaries and the like
<StevenR> depends massively on the role
<directhex> sg: depends on what you want to go into. i think good programmers get something in the mid-high 20k range, excluding london, as a reasonable starting point
<sg> software engineer i suppose
#ubuntu-uk 2011-08-19
<HazRPG> I has emulated android on my desktop \o/
<HazRPG> (SDK ftw \o/)
<Azelphur> anyone know who sam ripling is? :p
<Azelphur> just noticed he's right next to me on the Ubuntu map o.O
<dsas> I think I've just effectively deleted someone from the map by plonking my marker down directly on top of theirs.
<Azelphur> hax.
<AlanBell> morning all
 * AlanBell is in gatwick waiting for a gate to be announced
 * AlanBell goes to gate 16
<Gary> morning all o/
<MooDoo> morning
<diplo> Morning all
<hoover> mornin all
<hoover> brb
<DJones> Morning all
<MooDoo> morning DJones davmor2
<DJones> Hi MooDoo
<DJones> Any news on the little ones arrival yet?
<MooDoo> nope :S potentially a few weeks, although she's measuring at 42 weeks
<davmor2> morning all
<davmor2> morning MooDoo
<czajkowski> Aloha
 * davmor2 prods czajkowski 
 * czajkowski stabs davmor2 
 * MooDoo shakes davmor2's hand and gives czajkowski a kiss on the cheek complimenting her on how stunning she looks this morning....as usual :D
<czajkowski> eh... who are you and gimmie back my old MooDoo
<MooDoo> czajkowski: but laura, you are the apple of my eye, the angel of delight :)
<czajkowski> oh shrup
 * davmor2 whacks MooDoo with a baseball bat 
 * MooDoo stabs davmor2 and pokes czajkowski ..... and i'm back :)
<MooDoo> cheers davmor2 :)
<gord> got a bunch of 2TB drives arriving today, so exciting :)
<MooDoo> woohoo
<MooDoo> gord: i need to upgrade my nas at some point too....only got 500gb drives in there at the moment.
<gord> these were pretty cheep :) good time to be buying
<gord> 50 quid a pop
<andylockran> is there an issue with he ubuntu package servers at teh moment, seem very slow
<andylockran> security.ubuntu.com
<gord> andylockran, just upgraded my machine at 300kb/s (my max)
<gord> they felt slow for me yesterday though
<andylockran> gord: I'm updating at ~25kB/s at the moment
<andylockran> (and this is on a colo'd server)
<gord> andylockran, dang, switch mirrors?
<andylockran> possibly have to do that yeah..
<daubers> andylockran: snap...
<daubers> How unstable is oneiric at the moment?
<MooDoo> daubers: general use for me was ok, it just crashed a lot when i was trying to mount cifs shares...
<daubers> MooDoo: Hmmm... might update my laptop shortly
<MooDoo> daubers: i've removed it for the moment, back on natty.
<daubers> heh :)
<daubers> I can fall back on the netbook/mac mini if needed
<MooDoo> i'm glad that natty has ubuntu classic mode as well :D
<davmor2> daubers: I'm at a canonical qa sprint using an oneiric only laptop seems fine.
<daubers> Heh :)
<waveform> andylockran: certainly seems there's something odd with the update servers - I'm getting 30kb/s at the mo (usually get anywhere between 2mb/s and 4mb/s here)
<bigcalm> Anybody else catch something nasty from the oggcamp weekend? My throat is rough is flip and swallowing hurts
<hoover> ugh... sorry to hear that biggie. Shouldn't have shared those beer mugs ;-)
<andylockran> waveform: sure - there seemed to be a big release of debian security updates y'day - not sure if that has anything to do with it?
<bigcalm> My upgrade download seems to have stalled
<Neoti_Laptop> hi all .. been a long time since i was in here ... hope alls well .. i would just like to know when Ubuntu will have support for playback of Bluerays direct from the disk ... with out ripping them for playback in XBMC ....
<bigcalm> I'm getting 28.7KB/s now \o/
<bigcalm> While getting the kernel
<andylockran> bigcalm: :|
<waveform> yup - definitely not normal - oh well, guess there's something up with the uk mirror
<andylockran> waveform: bigcalm do you know where best to get info on what's up with them?
<jpds> andylockran / bigcalm / waveform: traceroutes please.
<jpds> gb.archive looks like it's ticking along, business as usual.
<waveform> jpds: http://paste.pocoo.org/show/460661/
<popey> bigcalm: oggflu?
<ubuntuuk-planet> [Dave Morris] Android remote for Banshee - http://davemorris.wordpress.com/2011/08/19/android-remote-for-banshee/
<popey> !membership
<lubotu3> Ubuntu Membership means recognition of a significant and sustained contribution to Ubuntu and the Ubuntu community.  For more info see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Membership
<jpds> waveform: Well, I can't see anything wrong with the host.
<waveform> jpds: yeah, the traceroute looks perfectly happy - although I've just noticed it's actually security.ubuntu.com that apt-get's downloading at a snail's pace from - traceroute for that looks normal too though
<waveform> (can paste if you want still)
<jpds> waveform: Oh, that's probably busy as ever too.
<waveform> hmm, a modem worthy 32kb/s is unusually slow in my experience - still, no big deal - I'll just leave it
<bigcalm> popey: I'd say so. *gruff cough*
<bigcalm> 50ish K/sec now
<bigcalm> Ah well. It'll just mean a system reboot when it's finished. So I'm in no rush :)
<bigcalm> There's something to be said for drinking tea out of this chunky oggcamp 11 mug
<MooDoo> bigcalm: big mug?
<bigcalm> MooDoo: smaller than last year's
<bigcalm> MooDoo: but chunky
<MooDoo> cool
<bigcalm> https://plus.google.com/113834766641843352499/posts/JXLeyxNzGro
<andypiper> SMALLER THAN LAST YEAR?
<andypiper> I have been ROBBED
<oimon> bigcalm: just read the scrollback..i got the throat thing too
<bigcalm> Ha!
<tonytiger> I think they are bigger.
<tonytiger> But haven't carried out a scientific test.
<bigcalm> tonytiger: how's your throat?
<tonytiger> Croaky
<bigcalm> I definitely caught something
<oimon> i only attended saturday though, i could have caught it off my son
<tonytiger> I think I caught this off mark
<tonytiger> he was sitting in my front room on monday looking ill
<oimon> i should probably take alcohol gel to those things to avoid picking things up..nobody would think it weird at a geek event
<bigcalm> Well, if you will go kissing strange men
<andypiper> what tonytiger and marxjohnson get up to in the privacy of studio A...
<oimon> btw are hp really ditching webos? or maybe another comapny will take it on
<andypiper> sounds like it
<andypiper> amazing given the push they did for devs in Europe over the early summer
<oimon> might get new life if other vendors could sell it
<andypiper> webmink seemed to think it had a good opp as OSS
<oimon> would be nice
 * andypiper is away: away right now...
<popey> Laney: when is the deadline for DMB membership proposals?
<popey> ooo found your mail
<Laney> 22nd
<popey> ta
<popey> done
<Laney> done what?
<popey> nominated someone
<Laney> aha
<Laney> wonder who ;-)
 * Laney looks around
 * popey stands in front of various people
<popey> looking nonchalante
<popey> not easy to spell or do
<MooDoo> huh?
<Laney> you confirmed with $person that $person is happy to be nominated?
<davmor2> oneiric's flash is dead on 64bit Yay :(
<MooDoo> what are you two on about :)
 * Laney passes MooDoo a brown envelope
<MooDoo> cheers Laney , er i think :)
<Laney> also the Official Secrets Act
<popey> Laney: ya, because that was in the requirements of your mail
<bigcalm> tonytiger: filled to the brim: oggcamp 10 mugs measure 400ml, oggcamp 11 mugs measure 320(ish)ml
 * popey followed Laneys orders
<Laney> gots to check
 * popey points bigcalm at another channel
<MooDoo> Laney: you cheap skate, the envelope is full of loo paper ;)
<popey> valuable loo paper
<bigcalm> Awww
<bigcalm> And that's the power of an SSD. Rebooting takes no time at all ;)
<popey> heh
<MooDoo> oh hell yeah ssd = ftw!
<gord> most of my time during boot is spent in the bios ;)
<MartijnVdS> gord: same here
<MartijnVdS> \o/ ssd
<MartijnVdS> oh Unity wins second place though, even after reinstall
<zmo_> hi, how can i flush every "-i ethX" rules in my iptables ?
<brobostigon> morning everyone.
<dwatkins> !iptables
<lubotu3> Ubuntu, like any other Linux distribution, has firewall capabilities built-in. The firewall is managed using the 'ufw' command - see https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UFW | An alternative to ufw is the 'iptables' command - See https://help.ubuntu.com/community/IptablesHowTo | GUI frontends such as Gufw (GNOME) and Guarddog (KDE Lucid and Maverick) also exist.
<MartijnVdS> removing all rules from a specific interface will require some scripting though
 * daubers likes jammy dodgers
<dwatkins> I thought it was just a case of flushing the tables (which I wouldn't reccomend on a system connected directly to the internet as it will make it insecure)
<czajkowski> CUSTARD CREAMS ftw!
<dwatkins> davmor2: they're called TARDIS detonators in our home ;)
<czajkowski> danfish: so when we organising our next rugby meet up!
<MooDoo> czajkowski: remind me not to make stupid england/ireland comments if i go this time :)
<diplo> iptables -F ?
<diplo> Been a while since I've done any iptables stuff now
<MooDoo> http://www.cyberciti.biz/faq/flush-iptables-ubuntu-linux/
<MartijnVdS> MooDoo: that's flushing them all
<MartijnVdS> not just the ones with -i ethx
<MooDoo> a
<MooDoo> ah
<gord> got fed up with the google bar thing not being available all the time, so i made bookmarks of them all for my bookmark bar in firefox :) its worked out well
<waveform> zmo_: here's a quick start which should dump the chain and rule-number of each rule which mentions eth[0-9]: iptables -L -n -v --line-numbers | awk '$1=="Chain" {chain=$2;} $7 ~ /eth[0-9]/ {print chain, $1;}'
<waveform> given that they're rule numbers I'd pipe that through tac to reverse it (otherwise deletion will go a bit wrong) and pipe that with xargs to "iptables -D" (using the option for one invocation per line - can't remember what that is off-hand)
<zmo_> waveform, thanks for  help, ive started to operate on the text with awk .. but i ve solve dedicating a chain to certain rules and doing iptables -X chain-name when done
<waveform> ah, -L is the thing you need for xargs, so something like this should do the trick: iptables -L -n -v --line-numbers | awk '$1=="Chain" {chain=$2;} $7 ~ /eth[0-9]/ {print chain, $1;}' | tac | xargs -L 1 echo iptables -D
<waveform> (remove the echo to get it to actually execute - I just put it there to see what it'd do)
<daubers> why are big FOSS projects so badly documented :(
<zmo_> waveform, i also always put "echo" testing my stuff :)
<MartijnVdS> https://twitter.com/#!/Queen_UK/status/104506799096463360
<daubers> MartijnVdS: If only that was the real Queen.
<MartijnVdS> daubers: it's not?!
 * AlanBell is outside the scope of that announcement anyway
<MartijnVdS> AlanBell: Where are you?
<AlanBell> County Clare
<MartijnVdS> wrong part of Ireland ;)
<MartijnVdS> of the island it's on*
 * MartijnVdS steps out of the political/potential muck that is (Northern) Ireland in politics
 * AlanBell can see the sea
<MartijnVdS> not the ocean?
<AlanBell> yup, the atlantic
<AlanBell> cold and wet. I went for a paddle earlier
<daubers> AlanBell: There's sharks and people poo in the ocean!!!!
<MartijnVdS> I returned from Riga yesterday, it was hot and humid :)
<hoover> nice AlanBell
 * hoover 's headed for Crete tomorrow morning
<MartijnVdS> Ah, to invest in the Greek economy?
<daubers> MartijnVdS: s/invest/take advantage of/
<MartijnVdS> daubers: "doing his part in the bailout" :)
<AlanBell> is http://libertus.co.uk and http://www.libertus.co.uk working?
<AlanBell> just did a DNS change
<MartijnVdS> seems to work for me
<MartijnVdS> blue/green page?
<AlanBell> yeah, thanks
<hoover> MartijnVdS: sort of ;-)
<hoover> we've been dumping our hard-earned euros there a few times in the past
<hoover> didn't help much though
<hoover> cheers all
<daubers> hmmm.... dns mystery
<daubers> Anyone got a decent phone number for UK2? Not one that is on their website, tells yo uto redial another number that then doesn't exist?
<MartijnVdS> daubers: the 0800 one or the +44 one?
<daubers> MartijnVdS: the +44 one if you have it
<MartijnVdS> daubers: that's on the site..
<daubers> The one that ends in 0086 just rings out :)
<daubers> then tells me it's not been recognised
<MartijnVdS> Just ring sales, ask them to connect you to the right person :)
<daubers> Ahhh, the forever ringing phone line
<daubers> (again)
 * daubers waits for the inevitable "We're sorry, the number you've dialled has not been recognised"
<daubers> but apparently the other person has hung up
<MartijnVdS> daubers: Maybe Canary Wharf disappeared off the face of the earth?
<DJones> daubers: Its lunchtime on a friday afternoon, they'll all be in the pub
 * popey pokes daubers with #oggcamp
<daubers> \o/ For some reason they'd taken our zone records out of the DNS servers
<daubers> No business critical email for at least 24 hours now
 * daubers goes to find another DNS provider
<MartijnVdS> gandi \o/
<brobostigon> :)
 * brobostigon has hashings of ginger beer.
<brobostigon> lashings*
<dogmatic69> hehe http://mthruf.files.wordpress.com/2011/08/job-fails-then-press-any-key-to-continue.jpg
<Azelphur> Loving that my new headset charges via MicroUSB :D
<Azelphur> Step 1) Buy 5000mAh phone battery pack, Step 2) Velcro, Step 3), 10x battery life
<MartijnVdS> Azelphur: Or step 1 -  buy car battery.. :)
<MartijnVdS> Azelphur: step 2, buy car phone charger
<MartijnVdS> Azelphur: step 3, 1000x battery life :)
<Azelphur> hehe
<MartijnVdS> Azelphur: http://www.ikonglobal.com/
<Azelphur> MartijnVdS: only cost me Â£16 for the charger too, they are doing Â£9 off special offer today :D
<Azelphur> haha
<popey> which phone battery pack?
<Azelphur> http://www.amazon.co.uk/New-Trent-ultra-pack-5000mAh-Universal/dp/B003Y58CVC/ref=pd_sxp_grid_pt_2_0
<popey> it has a normal usb a port?
<Azelphur> popey: logo on the front of it has a big picture of a USB port on it :D
<Azelphur> http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/61wBvZdMIPL._AA1362_.jpg I'd hope so
<shauno> I have something similar.  has a microusb port to charge from, and a regular usb port to power my toys
<popey> neat
<Azelphur> yea I'm wondering how you charge it now
<popey> heheh
<Azelphur> and what the power button is for
<popey> i was wondering that
<popey> "New Trent was marketed exclusively by New Trent. AC Charger is not included but you can use iphone AC charger, 6 months product warranty
<popey> "
<popey> http://www.amazon.co.uk/TeckNet-Dual-Port-Universal-Incredible-Blackberry/dp/B000NDQ92W/ref=pd_bxgy_ce_img_b
<popey> also looks good
<popey> multiple ports
 * Azelphur looks up reviews
<MartijnVdS> They sell these over here: http://www.philips.nl/c/voedingsoplossingen/25942/cat/nl/
<MartijnVdS> hm, that's the category page
<Azelphur> reviews say "It does not work as a USB charger" wtf but item title is Universal USB battery pack
<Azelphur> :S
<ging> that charger 5000mah has 3x as big a battery as my phone
<ging> i wonder how efficently it can deliver that charge into a phone
<ging> Azelphur: might be that someone has tried to charge a phone that doesn't support charging via the usb port, i know a lot of nokias didn't used to
<Azelphur> I see
<shauno> my nokia used to charge off 6v, not 5, so usb wouldn't work without a charge pump
<Azelphur> ging the main thing I'm worried about here is can I charge it while I'm using it
<Azelphur> because if I can't I need to cancel the order :P
<hamitron> my nokia usb charger splits into 2, 1 end for data and other into the standard nokia power plug
<ging> Azelphur: why wouldnt you be able to?
<Azelphur> ging because I can only see one socket on that thing
<ging> Azelphur: oh so you want to be able to charge the external battery up while your charging your phone off of it?
<bigcalm> Do they charge at USB speed or mains speed?
<Azelphur> ging exactly
<shauno> mine won't do that; the phone charges, or the battery charges; not both together
<Azelphur> ging only s/phone/headset with mircousb socket
<popey> buy a UPS :D
<Azelphur> HEADSET UPS!
<popey> plug phone charger into that
<Azelphur> lol
<popey> somewhat overkill
<Azelphur> popey: only reason I don't have an UPS is because I don't think there's anything out there short of Â£10k units that'd be able to hold my system up for any sane amount of time
<popey> hah
<shauno> that's the one problem with mine; it charges faster than the mains adaptor.  makes my phone rather warm
<popey> the point of a UPS isnt to keep it up
<Azelphur> hehe
<popey> its to stop it falling over
<popey> so you can shutdown nicely
<ging> Azelphur: i don't really get it, you want to charge a head set off a portable power source but you need to be able to be charging that portable power source at the same time off of another power source, why do you need it at all?
<Azelphur> popey: yea I guess
<popey> but yeah, you could put one of your screens on it, rather than all
<popey> to reduce the load
<Azelphur> ging because sometimes the battery goes flat, when it does I still need to be able to use my headset.
<popey> you need it on to provide net access?
<shauno> I prefer not to put screens on the ups at all.  if it's setup properly, the machine should hibernate when it gets the powerfail signal from the ups.
<popey> sure
 * hamitron wonders how we have survived with no wireless gear for so long
<shauno> if you leave screens connected, it encourages people to screw around with it
<Azelphur> I see, fun
<Azelphur> ging do you know if the trent thing can do it or not?
<ging> Azelphur: well i'm guessing not but i still don't really understand what you are trying to do
<Azelphur> ging extend the battery life of my headset is the end goal
<Azelphur> by sticking a battery to it.
<hamitron> be green and go solar
<hamitron> :D
<hamitron> A4 sized solar panel on top of your head
<ging> oh so you just don't want the hassle of having to faff around switching plugs around between when you do have power and you don't ?
<Azelphur> exactly
<ging> i have a duel feed usb cable you could probably use something like that
<Azelphur> I can see that the one popey linked definitely does it
<ging> it was for my usb hard drive which draws more power than some usb ports provide so you can plug it into 2 usb ports
<Azelphur> ging I doubt sending power in and out on a splitter cable would end well
<shauno> I think he means taking two ports worth of power from the original powersource
<ging> i think it would work fine, i recon they are all just hard wired together
<Azelphur> oh
<ali1234> derp
<Azelphur> no I don't want 2 ports of power from the original power source
<ali1234> power doesn't work like that
<ging> shauno: yeah that's what it's for but i think he could use 1 to do what he want to do
<ali1234> especially if it has a lithium battery
<Azelphur> ali1234 indeed :P
<ali1234> which it probably does
<shauno> eg, usb2 is meant to be 500mA; if your headset is expecting 500mA to charge from, and the battery is expecting 500mA to charge from, you can't just have 500mA from the source
<ali1234> the charging input draws however much current it draws
<ali1234> if it tries to draw more than 500mA the USB port stops working
<Azelphur> basically I want to do PC USB > Battery > Headset internal battery
<ali1234> if it doesn't and you connect it to a 1000mA source it still will only draw 500mA
<Azelphur> so Battery keeps headset charged
<Azelphur> and when all the batteries run out, I can still charge it while using it with USB
<hamitron> ali1234++
<hamitron> although, USB 3.0 provides more power, as do some USB 2.0 ports
<hamitron> if the device needs that power
<ging> ali1234: i think the cable i have is for when things like laptops cannot provide the full 500mA
<mfraz74> i did hear that there's going to be another usb standard that can provide even more power
<MartijnVdS> the Philips one can charge laptops
<ali1234> Azelphur: just google for usb battery pack
<shauno> I wouldn't leave my battery tethered long-term.  it has 1.6A on the output, which tends to make things a lil toasty
<MartijnVdS> shauno: most phones stop charging if they're >90% and too hot
<Azelphur> ali1234 yea I just ordered one then someone pointed out to me I might not be able to charge it while it's charging the headset
<Azelphur> which would be bad :(
<ali1234> i doubt it
<MartijnVdS> shauno: (to cool down a little before continuing charging)
<Azelphur> ali1234 you think it won't be able to or it will?
<ali1234> it will
<Azelphur> cool
<ali1234> that would be like "you can't use your laptop while you charge the battery"
<MartijnVdS> ali1234: I've had one laptop like that
<ali1234> broken, you mean?
<Azelphur> ali1234 indeed, thing is I only see one socket on this charger
<MartijnVdS> ali1234: no wait, that was "while you chaNge the battery"
<MartijnVdS> as in, swap out
<hamitron> MartijnVdS: remind me to never buy something you have ;)
<mfraz74> Been trying out Oneiric this morning on my netbook and I notice that my network connection was 65mbps, does that mean it is using wireless 'N"
<ali1234> Azelphur: you should have got the duracell one
<hamitron> electronic bunnies work for longer with duracell
<Azelphur> ali1234 I cancelled the order anyway, link?
<Azelphur> :P
<ali1234> Azelphur: http://www.amazon.com/Duracell-Instant-Charger-Lithium-universal/dp/B002FU6KF2/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1313768455&sr=8-1
<shauno> hm.  irssi just exploded into a whole different character set.  not sure how to fix that :/
<Azelphur> hamitron it's quite heavy and also only 1100mah :(
<Azelphur> I want a bit more than that, I'm looking for 2000+
<ali1234> buy two
<hamitron> why highlight me? :|
<hamitron> blame ali1234
<hamitron> ;)
<hamitron> tbh, I think a better thing would be a heavier usb cable to your comp, so you don't break it
<Azelphur> ali1234 buy two for more pricey, 6x the weight and still not as good? D:
<hamitron> batteries never last as long as cables
<ali1234> whatever
<Azelphur> lol
<Azelphur> hamitron exactly why I bought a wireless headset, so I don't break the cable
<hamitron> go to a DIY store, buy cable for an Iron, and use that
<popey> eh
<Azelphur> hehe :)
<popey> you bought a wireless headset but you're goijng to plug wire into it?
<hamitron> hooked up to your USB ofc, not the mains
<ali1234> no buy that armoured cable for sheds
<hamitron> ;/
<hamitron> ali1234: yeh
<hamitron> :)
<Azelphur> popey: no, I'm trying to avoid plugging a wire into it for as long as possible
<Azelphur> which is generally the goal with wireless :P
<popey> how long does it normally last?
<ali1234> buy a tesla coil
<Azelphur> around 5 hours
<ali1234> wireless electricity
<ali1234> problem solved
<Azelphur> ideally I'd like to bump it up to 20 or so
<hamitron> ouuu, I may go play C&C red alert
<Azelphur> then I can just charge it overnight, and be happy
<popey> how much was the headset?
<Azelphur> Â£70
<popey> buy another one
<hamitron> :D
<Azelphur> wat o.O
<popey> leave it plugged in
<ali1234> that's not a bad idea actually just buy two headsets and then swap every 8 hours
<popey> when battery dies in one you're using, swap
<popey> yup
<Azelphur> haha
<Azelphur> expensive though, I won't get another one for Â£70
<popey> plug both in overnight
<popey> pffft
<Azelphur> I only got this one because I found a guy who had it as part of a hardware bundle and didn't want it
<Azelphur> they are usually Â£140
<Azelphur> lots more expensive than a phone charger and a piece of velcro :D
<hamitron> what was wrong with that beefy USB charger?
<gord> i'v stopped trusting anything wireless recently, wireless is becoming another way of saying "will cut out sometimes and annoy the crap out of you"
<Azelphur> hamitron I'm not sure if I can charge it while it's charging the headset
<popey> reminds me, I have 6 wifi dongles, what shall I do with them? âº
<popey> (usb ones)
<hamitron> Azelphur: to do so would mean plugging it in!!!!!!!!!!!!
<Azelphur> hamitron correct
<popey> make a portable wifi cracking unit? :D
<Azelphur> I want the option of plugging it in when the battery is dead
<Azelphur> rather than "haha no sound for you"
<hamitron> Azelphur: buy a USB cable for your headset then
<hamitron> :/
<ali1234> wireless is dumb anyway
<ali1234> it never works
<Azelphur> hamitron I have one, I just want to bump the life up
<Azelphur> :D
<hamitron> you can charge the external battery seperately
<Azelphur> but I don't wanna have to take it off :(
<hamitron> then power the headset with usb
<hamitron> then why use velcro?
<hamitron> :|
<ali1234> this whole idea sucks
<Azelphur> lol
<Azelphur> lies
<Azelphur> only thing that's blocking is I'm not sure if I can charge while charging
<ali1234> just buy a normal cabled headset
<Azelphur> this whole idea is fine, don't hate my idea D:
<hamitron> dedicated professionals use wires
<hamitron> \o/
<Azelphur> and this headset is great, wireless never cuts out and sound quality is really nice lol
<Azelphur> just want to bump the life up a bit more with a little hack :)
<popey> i bought a pair of hd212 pro headphones, and when the cable broke, got a new cable, win.
<gord> so the problem with normal cabled headsets is that the wires get everywhere, you trip up on them, they get in the way and eventually, you snap them. so put the wire on a spring spindle or something that reels in the slack
<gord> problem solved!
<hamitron> or hook it from the ceiling
<hamitron> :D
<MartijnVdS> Or just stop moving around while you're wearing them
<popey> loop it round your neck to take up the slack
<hamitron> yeh, Azelphur: you will never perfect them dance moves anyway
<popey> he has 24 screens, he can't not move
<hamitron> hehe
<hamitron> that is actually true
<hamitron> :/
<Azelphur> sent a question to tecknet asking if I can do it
<Azelphur> :D
<MartijnVdS> ooh, multiarch on oneiric
<MartijnVdS> I can now install package:i386 and it works
<hamitron> multiarch?
<MartijnVdS> hamitron: I can install i386 packages on amd64.. apparently it's called that
<hamitron> oh
<hamitron> so oneiric still needs an i686
<hamitron> :/
<MartijnVdS> no
<hamitron> no?
<MartijnVdS> well yes
<MartijnVdS> but the packages are called "i386"
<Myrtti> AFAIK multiarch doesn't mean that you can install i386 packages on amd64
<Myrtti> it means that the multiarch package contains versions for both i386 and amd64
<hamitron> MartijnVdS: stupid people labelling stuff wrong
<hamitron> :/
<MartijnVdS> Myrtti: I just did.. apt-get install libcurl-gnutls:i386 -> it installed, and flash started working again
<Myrtti> correct me if I am (probably) wrong
<MartijnVdS> Myrtti: there are 2 debs, and they're installed side-by-side
<hamitron> slackware labels stuff i486 for i486, ubuntu and centos label i686 as i386
<hamitron> :/
<Myrtti> what a wonderfully messed up way of doing things
<Myrtti> oh well
<MartijnVdS> Myrtti: with the same package name, so with dpkg -L you need to include the architecture (or it'll show only the contents of the "amd64" version)
<Laney> why is that messed up?
<ali1234> there is no such thing as i585
<ali1234> i mean i686
<ali1234> oh and btw Myrtti you are completely wrong
<MartijnVdS> the old was was more messed-up
<ali1234> the old way was to put i386 versions of every library ever made in ia32-libs
<ali1234> creating a package with several gigabytes of source that just duplicates a bunch of stuff that already exists
<ali1234> the new way is you just install the i386 package that already exists
<ali1234> for only the libs you need
<kazade> more info: http://wiki.debian.org/Multiarch :)
<ali1234> that webpage actually has less info than i've just given
<HazRPG> ali1234: heh, nice one with the video dude :)
<HazRPG> just spotted that email for the bug
<ali1234> i had to watch an hour long video of the guy explaining it to determine what multiarch actually is, because that wiki page is so useless
<Myrtti> ali1234: hardly completely wrong, there's plenty of things that I know I'm right about... just to nitpick
<Myrtti> ali1234: but this time, perhaps on this subject, yes
<judgey> I changed my named server and when i whois it its pointing at the new ns but when i load it up in firefox its stil going to the old server
<StevenR> judgey: can you be more precise as to what you changed?
<judgey> i moving servers, i changed the named servers for my domain to goto the new server that was about 20 hours ago and its saying in "whois my domian" that the new named servers are listed but its still going to my old server when i go on firfox
<bigcalm> judgey: dig @your.isps.name.server your.domain.name
<bigcalm> Your ISP might have a horrible cache time on the record
<judgey> if i give u the domain could see if u can see it?
<judgey> host2k10.info
<bigcalm> Sure
<judgey> should say "it works"
<bigcalm> 91.121.81.217 is the IP I get from host
<judgey> thats the old one
<judgey> :|
<bigcalm> http://paste.ubuntu.com/670248/
<bigcalm> That's what I see in the browser
<judgey> yer thats the old server
<judgey> just keep waiting?
<bigcalm> whois host2k10.info
<bigcalm> Tells me
<bigcalm> Name Server:NS.KIMSUFI.COM
<bigcalm> Name Server:KS384479.KIMSUFI.COM
<judgey> thats the new
<judgey> server
<bigcalm> http://paste.ubuntu.com/670249/
<bigcalm> Is what I get from dig
<bigcalm> So the nameserver is pointing at the old IP address
<judgey> but if u goto KS384479.KIMSUFI.COM
<judgey> its the new server
<bigcalm> There's no reference to 46.105.123.125 in the dns record
<judgey> would should i do bigcalm
<bigcalm> You need to change the A record from 91.121.81.217 to 46.105.123.125
<bigcalm> And, unless the new server really is the 2nd nameserver, remove it from the name server list
<judgey> i thought it was meant to be 1st
<bigcalm> Who hosts the DNS record?
<judgey> ovh
<judgey> i changed it anyhow
<judgey> Nameserver 1: NS.KIMSUFI.COM
<judgey> Nameserver 2 : KS384479.KIMSUFI.COM
<bigcalm> OVH should have told you what IP addresses or host names to use for 1st, 2nd (and possibly 3rd, 4th) name servers within the domain registry record.
<judgey> yer the 2 above
<bigcalm> You would then alter the DNS record on OVH's server to point host2k10.info at 46.105.123.125 as an 'A' record
<judgey> oky i shalll play thx for heads up :)
<bigcalm> Have fun
<judgey> heh
<bigcalm> The TTL is set for 24 hours, so you might be waiting a while again :(
<judgey> omg omg lol no probs ill play with somthing eles then
<bigcalm> If you can lower the TTL for your DNS records (14400 for example is 4 hours), then you will have less of a wait the next time you need to make a change
<judgey> done
<judgey> waiting game now
<paulmellors> hi all its moodily testing androirc on the phone
<paulmellors> PAH moodoo
 * bigcalm pats MooDooily
<jamesanslow> Has the ubuntu update server issue been resolved?
<gord> sure is fun when you get an error, that after googling just leads to a bunch of empty threads of people asking for help
<gord> so... i found the issue i was having
<gord> turns out there was a tiiiny bit of metal jammed in to the sata port =\
<gord> frankly i amazed it was running at all
<MartijnVdS> gord: ouch
<gord> still, good advertisement for linux "it runs even when its full of shrapnel"
<gord> must make note, yell at Ng, alt+up/down is broken in terminator :(
<gord> workflow *destroyed*
<MartijnVdS> what does alt-up/down do?
<gord> moves up/down a terminal
<gord> so if you have two split, stacked on top of each other, you can navigate between them
<gord> instead of clicking
<MartijnVdS> useful
<diplo> Evening all
<MartijnVdS> \o diplo
<HazRPG> probably outside of the scope of this channel... but am I right in thinking that 16bit flac files, are equal to (if not exactly) the same as a CD file... and 24bit flac is essentially only available from the studio that's doing the recording
<MartijnVdS> HazRPG: Studios, or some artists offer them on their site
<MartijnVdS> HazRPG: I've had a 24-bit flac download free with an LP once
<MartijnVdS> HazRPG: also, DVD-Audio is 24-bit (but lossy).. lossless BD-Audio is also 24-bit
<MartijnVdS> it's not useful to encode CD audio as anything >44100/2ch/16bit, as that's how it's encoded on the disc :)
<ali1234> stupid nokia
<ali1234> not only do they want me to sign up for ovi before i can update
<ali1234> they also refuse to update a phone without a sim in it
<HazRPG> MartijnVdS: indeed... I was just looking into it, because I noticed that FLAC in banshee only has one profile for it
<HazRPG> but it makes sense, and I'm guessing Banshee just rips at full CD available quality
<MartijnVdS> HazRPG: DVD-Audio and BD-Audio ripping isn't available in Linux, afaik
<HazRPG> I think I saw some experimental methods back when I was looking into PS3 hacks, but not sure if anything ever came of them or not
<MartijnVdS> HazRPG: you have to rip the special DVD-Audio track though, not the "normal" DVD-video-with-audio one
<MartijnVdS> HazRPG: (DVD-Audio is special like that)
<HazRPG> DVD-Audio also never really took off as much as CD's have ^_^
<MartijnVdS> no, because they mostly released concerts
<HazRPG> I've only ever seen one DVD-Audio disc in the music shop here
<MartijnVdS> I have several concerts on DVD-Audio, but I can't play the DVD-A part
<HazRPG> and even then it was literally a batch of 10 that they had... and when I went back the next day, they were sold out, and weren't planning on getting anymore
<MartijnVdS> only the video track (with the same concert, but with video)
<MartijnVdS> But I want 7.1 surround studio albums! :)
<HazRPG> Me too :)
<MartijnVdS> Imagine minimal techno with surround
<HazRPG> or at least 5.1 (cos that's what my current gear is)
<MartijnVdS> 5.1 is good enough, yes
<HazRPG> :)
<HazRPG> always feels a shame that the only time I get to fully utilise my 5.1 is with either movies... or games with 5.1 enabled for their sound
<HazRPG> oh wait no!
<HazRPG> I recall one version of winamp that started getting 5.1 support, and it came with 2 free 5.1 tracks!
<HazRPG> one of them was "winamp, winamp, winamp, it really whips the llamas ass... from every direction!"
<HazRPG> the other was some unknown artist
<MartijnVdS> heh
<HazRPG> indeed
<MartijnVdS> I have a concert on bluray as well
<MartijnVdS> quality = ++++
<HazRPG> I can imagine :)
<HazRPG> exit
<HazRPG> bah, wrong box ^_^
<HazRPG> that was meant for the ssh terminal ^_^
<MartijnVdS> use Ctrl+D :)
<MartijnVdS> won't show up on IRC if you do it in the wrong one
<HazRPG> heh, cool :)
<MartijnVdS> Ctrl+D = End of File
<MartijnVdS> so the terminal process thinks you've closed the window
<HazRPG> nice
<MartijnVdS> HazRPG: btw, I bought a car
<HazRPG> MartijnVdS: Awesome :)
<HazRPG> MartijnVdS: What kind?
<MartijnVdS> HazRPG: https://s-hphotos-ash4.fbcdn.net/287415_10150281316132311_736907310_7371588_5467837_o.jpg
<MartijnVdS> (hope htat works)
<HazRPG> cute :P
<HazRPG> MartijnVdS: didn't realise you had a licence
<MartijnVdS> HazRPG: had one for 10 years, never owned a car before :)
<MartijnVdS> HazRPG: this one is currently my sister's
<HazRPG> I suppose if you've never had a need for a car, makes sense :)
<HazRPG> does that mean you'll be driving to the UK next time :P?
<MartijnVdS> I might be tempted to take a boat
<HazRPG> :P
<MartijnVdS> Allows me to go to someplace other than London more easily
<HazRPG> true true
<MartijnVdS> (yes trains exist I know)
<HazRPG> :P
<gord> trains exist? *mind blown*
<HazRPG> was an unintentional pun, but yeah :)
<MartijnVdS> gord: They think, therefore they are.
<HazRPG> gord: technically, everything exists... just depends on the timeline ;)
<HazRPG> on a different timeline, teleportation might exist!
<HazRPG> or better yet, portals \o/
 * MartijnVdS gets in his TARDIS
<MartijnVdS> \o/ next week (apparently)
<HazRPG> :P
<diplo> God awful cars MartijnVdS :(
<diplo> Is it a freebie ?
<MartijnVdS> diplo: no, but it's cheap
<MartijnVdS> diplo: also, I like it
<MartijnVdS> diplo: so meh
<diplo> heh
<MartijnVdS> diplo: what's the "normal" fuel efficiency unit in the UK?
<MartijnVdS> diplo: not kilometers per liter, I guess
<diplo> MPG
<MartijnVdS> (or l/100KM)
<diplo> Miles per gallon
<MartijnVdS> 56.5 mpg (Imperial), or 47.0 mpg (US)
<MartijnVdS> 20l/100km
<MartijnVdS> I like that bit
<MartijnVdS> according to google, that is
<diplo> heh
<MartijnVdS> wait
<diplo> I never trust mpg's till i use the car
<diplo> Also down to how you drive it
<MartijnVdS> diplo: I trust my sister :)
<diplo> ah so the results are your sister, just the conversion
<MartijnVdS> yes
<diplo> :)
<diplo> Max I can get from my car is 42/43mpg
<MartijnVdS> What kind of car?
<diplo> And that really is max
<diplo> Vauxhall Zafira
<diplo> Ex wife wanted it
<diplo> Wanted an Audi A4
<MartijnVdS> Zafira isn't bad
<MartijnVdS> my dad has a Meriva
<diplo> Thats the smaller one isn't it
<MartijnVdS> it is
<MartijnVdS> but it's VERY nice to drive
<MartijnVdS> compared to his old Citroen Xsara Picasso
<diplo> Dont get me wrong nice car, but im single now :(
<diplo> Need to do the man thing and get myself something sporty :D
<diplo> Not that I can afford it!
<MartijnVdS> diplo: not even with trade-in?
<diplo> Me and ex took a loan to get the car, loan still 4k+ and car now only worth 3k+
<diplo> :/
<bernhard2> Is there a web based administrator for exim4 or dovecot ??
<MartijnVdS> bernhard2: not easily, I think
#ubuntu-uk 2011-08-20
<ali1234> does anyone know an algorithm to detect sequences when the input has error?
<ali1234> eg given the sequence 012345012345012345 and i want to split it on 0
<ali1234> but sometimes the zero is a 2 instead
<ali1234> and sometimes there's randomly a 9 in there for no reason
<dwatkins> hat are you processing the input with, ali1234? bash, C, perl?
<ali1234> python. not that it matters
<ali1234> that was only an example
<ali1234> the real thing is more complex
<ali1234> but in the end i have a sequence of numbers where the errors are extremely easy for ahuman to spot
<dwatkins> I guess you'd have to process it character by character and compare each one in turn to the previous one.
<dwatkins> it would probably be a single line of bash with {i:j:1} syntax
<ali1234> each character has to be looked at in context
<ali1234> it has to handle a string like 01234501121301230012341234
<ali1234> that should return 12345,1,12,13,123,,1234,1234
<ali1234> oh and it also has to handle 12354 and return 12354 as a single unit
<ali1234> not 1235,4
<ali1234> there are ambiguities
<ali1234> so there needs to be a weighting system that decides whether the sequence has gone over the threshold of starting a new substring
<ali1234> now, i could sit and write an algorithm to do this
<ali1234> but it usually turns out someone already did it
<ali1234> hence the question
<ali1234> the substrings here are about 26 bytes long
<ali1234> sometimes a few bytes will go missing
<ali1234> sometimes extra random garbage is added
<dwatkins> $ echo "01234501121301230012341234" | awk -F '0' '{print $1" "$2" "$3" "$4}'
<ali1234> sometimes both happens and it is the right length but in the wrong order
<ali1234> splitting on 0 is not an option
<ali1234> sometimes the 0 gets lost
<ali1234> the only rule is that the substring will mostly increase at a linear rate
<dwatkins> ah, so each section consists of increasing digits?
<ali1234> and be approximately 26 bytes long +/1 about 3 bytes
<ali1234> it doesn't only consist of increasing digital
<ali1234> sometimes there might be an incorrect 0 in the middle of it
<ali1234> it may go 0123406789
<ali1234> the second 0 there is obviously meant to be a 5
<ali1234> i need the algorithm to figure that out too
<dwatkins> I suspect you're just going to have to process it character by character, comparing each one to the previous one
<ali1234> comparing to the previous char is not enough
<ali1234> it might go 0123430789
<dwatkins> I'm confused as to what the sequence is,.
<ali1234> it's just a sequence of bytes
<ali1234> from 0 to 26
<dwatkins> I mean what the rules are.
<ali1234> there are no rules
<ali1234> the corruption is random
<dwatkins> what about when the numbers are right?
<ali1234> the rules of the original signal are simple. you just split whenever you see a zero
<dwatkins> what is correct?
<ali1234> correct is 0, then 25 of any other byte
<ali1234> however in practice it is nearly always 0 then 1-25
<ali1234> the corruption randomly removes, inserts, and shuffles any bytes, including the 0s
<ali1234> maybe i can do it in two passes
<ali1234> any character 1 more than the previous and 1 less than the next is assumed to be correct
<ali1234> then work backwards to figure out what is up with the others
<ali1234> the problem is with rewinding the algorithm
<ali1234> did i mention the sequence is approximately 440000 characters long?
<dwatkins> oh my
<daev> when i create a new user on my server  i use {sudo chmod 0750 /home/username} to allow privacy. how do i extend the same privacy to the base system files. My concern is that users can traverse, list and read the base system files such as /etc or places where ssh keys are stored. It this normal nominal securty?
<daev> oh dear it's been a long night let me try that again. when i create a new user on my server  i use {sudo chmod 0750 /home/username} to allow privacy. how do i extend the same privacy to the base system files? My concern is that users can traverse, list and read the base system files such as /etc or places where ssh keys are stored. is this normal nominal securty?
<HazRPG> daev: I like how you said the same thing twice, but only changed 2 characters ^_^ (the '.' -> '?' and "It" -> "is"), I'm sure others knew what you meant :)
<HazRPG> ali1234: if I could remember the name of such an algorithm, I'd help you find one... but sadly my memory is failing me on that one.
<HazRPG> ali1234: I have an interesting question for you... have you noticed using the fullscreen hack you made for the browser... that each time you load up chrome, it says "Would you like to set chrome as your default browser?" despite the fact that it already is the default browser...
<HazRPG> if I take away the preloader for your library, it doesn't ask this... but if you add it in, it does... its rather odd
<HazRPG> do you think its because a checksum is failing somewhere... or just chrome genuinely being stupid
<dwatkins> daev: I think you need the linux hardened channel or 'SE Linux' for that.
<HazRPG> dwatkins: you mean #selinux ?
<HazRPG> or possibly just simply ##security
<HazRPG> I love alis, she lists channels so nicely :)
<HazRPG> right, missed torchwood this week... time to watch :) (thanks get-iplayer!)
<dwatkins> oh yeah, forgot that was back, ta
<HazRPG> heh ^_^
<HazRPG> currently on episode 6 at the moment
<brobostigon> good morning everyone.
<MartijnVdS> hi brobostigon
<brobostigon> hi MartijnVdS
 * MartijnVdS has a fresh pot of Darjeeling tea
<brobostigon> yummy.
 * brobostigon has fresh coffee
<popey> Morning
<brobostigon> morning popey
<MartijnVdS> \o popey
<mgdm> Moring
<mgdm> Morning, even
<MartijnVdS> Mooring ;)
<brobostigon> morning mgdm
<MartijnVdS> http://i.imgur.com/W694w.jpg <-- water rabbit
<shauno> yes, that's what my head needed at 9am on a weekend :(
<shauno> funny feeling I'm going to be stuck in windows for much longer than I planned on - http://dl.dropbox.com/u/23042/awhile.png
<MartijnVdS> Apparently, you should visit swtor.com :)
<andrewclegg> morning all... if I'm doing a dist upgrade from maverick to natty, can I tell it *not* to uninstall certain packages? my gf wants to stick with openoffice for now, as she has a heavily customized setup, but the installer removes it
<directhex> andrewclegg: i doubt she'll notice much difference
<directhex> andrewclegg: but google "apt pinning"
<togster> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/PinningHowto
<andrewclegg> actually when she went from 10.04 to 10.10 it blew away lots of her settings, and that was OOo -> OOo !
<andrewclegg> but thanks, I'll check that out
<brobostigon> http://wiki.debian.org/AptPreferences
<andrewclegg> I'm thinking Holding rather than Pinning, because OOo and natty's LibreOffice are distinct packages... right?
<andrewclegg> well I'll test it and see
<MartijnVdS> omg, I just notices on Oneiric:
<MartijnVdS> if you minimize a window, a bright "flash" goes around the icon
<MartijnVdS> It sort-of looks like it's licking its lips after eating something (it's just a bright flash, but the movement looks like that :)
<shauno> and this is why I'm a fan of the dutch stance on recreational drugs ;)
<MartijnVdS> shauno: no really!
<bigcalm> Hehe
<pure> hello  , i need help.
<pure> i've litte problem with Ubu.
<sagaci> what is it
<pure> my Ubuntu not work ...., im run Ubuntu from Live CD and type in termina "sudo mount /dev/sda5 / && mount /dev/sda6 /home" , so later i type "/sudo gedit /etc/modprobe.d/blacklist.conf " , and a'm trying to blacklist sp5100_tco drive. I  click SAVE.... but after reboot not working , a'm again loock to blacklist.conf  , and this driver is not blacklister ( not saving) What i wrong do?.
<pure> driver*
<pure> i've SP5100 TCO time : mmio adress 0xfec00-00f0 in use , none  guidance in the network does not help me, how to fix it, or what U do something wrong.
<StevenR> pure: why do you need to use the live cd?
<pure> becuasde my OS dont boot...
<pure> so i try repair it from Live CD.
<StevenR> you need to blacklist the module to fix it?
<pure> google and ubuntu forums talk : "yes"
<pure> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=166624&page=2
<StevenR> create a new file called blacklist-local.conf in /etc/modprobe.d ?
<StevenR> and put your blacklist line in that?
<pure> but i do it from Live CD, because from HDD cannot  wirte commands....-.- ( blackscreen) from CTRL++ALT+F1~F12 cannot write commands
<pure> yup , nothing work
<StevenR> what do you mean "nothing work" ?
<pure> i'm not have  any idead
<StevenR> did you try creating a new file ?
<pure> after select OS from boot i'm see only black screen with "_" in left top.....
<sagaci> pure, can you boot into recovery mode
<pure> not
<pure> stop in 8 sec
<pure> 7.1
<pure> [7.1XXXXX} SP5100 TCO timmer: mmio adresss 0xfec000fo in use
<pure> big bang!
<MartijnVdS> big bang?
<pure> big bang - big boom
<MartijnVdS> As in, you computer literally exploded?
<pure> my os exploded huh :D
<MartijnVdS> what kind of hardware do  you have?
<pure> PC  / CPU AMD Athlon 245 X2 X64 , GPu: gf nv250GTS DK1G , 6gb ram ddr3... :P
<pure> hdd over 3tb
<pure> hdds*
<MartijnVdS> I don't know athlon numbers, but you might need UEFI if your startup disk is >2TB, I think
<pure> No no i have 3x 1tb + 1x 80gb
<MartijnVdS> ah
<daev> when i create a new user on my server  i use {sudo chmod 0750 /home/username} to allow privacy. how do i extend the same privacy to the base system files? My concern is that users can traverse, list and read the base system files such as /etc or places where ssh keys are stored. is this normal nominal securty?
<pure> when ubuntu is in 80gb hdd :D
<MartijnVdS> daev: the SSH private key is already protected
<MartijnVdS> daev: it's only readable by root (check "ls -l")
<daev> how?
<MartijnVdS> daev: -rw------- 1 root root   1679 2011-08-04 18:26 ssh_host_rsa_key
<pure> my ubu dont loading splash.... idk why! , why he do this! ;(
<MartijnVdS> pure: Which version of Ubuntu are  you trying? Have you tried a different version?
<MartijnVdS> pure: Are you starting from CD? From USB stick?
<pure> 11.04 ^^
<pure> um trying to repair from Live CD , and Ubuntu has been installed  from CD.
<MartijnVdS> but if the live CD doesn't start, it sounds like the CD is broken
<pure> No no...i;m trying to boot  from HDD
<pure> Grub is loading ... itks.. omy when i select   " Linux ubuntu ........ -pae" ... i'm see only "black screen' and  white "_" on left top and nothing more...
<MartijnVdS> Uhrm.. you just said you were using the live CD
<pure> to repair...
<MartijnVdS> Are you using the live CD to start (and repair) or are you booting from the HDD?
<MartijnVdS> Does the live CD work?
<pure> becuase i;m must editing files from /dev/sda5 ( "/ "
<pure> Live work... men! ....
<pure> My Ubuntu is creazy! , yesterday on midnight working! , today not working...
<MartijnVdS> !pm > daev
<lubotu3> daev, please see my private message
<pure> "SP5100 TCO timer: mmio address 0xfec000f0 already in use".... and Ubuntu not starting...
<MartijnVdS> pure: Yes, you've said that before, you don't have to keep on repeating
<daev> apologies lubotu3 & MartijnVdS, i was unaware of the protocol
<daev> I just checked what you said and that's true. ssh_host_rsa_key.pub is readable and has roots key in there. but root should be disabled so that's ok. otherwise.... is it ok for users to have free roam of reading system files? I know a portion of them must be readable for certain services to work properly for the user. but is there anything a rogue could use to breach security?
<MartijnVdS> daev: no, /etc/ssh/ssh_host_rsa_key.pub is the server's key
<MartijnVdS> daev: wait.
<pure> Becuase all possibles of repairs in Google not helping me ..... so , now i dont know how to repair it
<MartijnVdS> daev: .pub are the public keys, those are public -- look up public key cryptography -- the private keys (without .pub) are not readable by normal users, only root.
<MartijnVdS> pure: Are older kernels listed in grub? Have you tried one of them?
<pure> not
<pure> i've only one kelner :P. + recovery
<MartijnVdS> pure: OK, did you do anything that might have caused this?
<MartijnVdS> Did it ever work?
<MartijnVdS> pure: You could try this page: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebuggingKernelBoot
<pure> Not , omly only turn off PC , and go to Sleep.... when i'm get up and power on my PC... i got this messanges
<MartijnVdS> pure: it could be a hardware problem, I don't know. You could try resetting the BIOS to defaults, I guess
<daev> MartijnVdS, thanks for clearing that up for me. not to insult the devs intelligence but is there anything to be concerned about is a user goes looking thorugh /... to find information. could it lead to a breach?
<daev> -i'm sure it's very secure from default. but if i am missing a step i'd love to know thanks :(
<daev> :)**
<MartijnVdS> daev: The default permissions are considered "safe" (private keys for everything are unreadable)
<MartijnVdS> daev: but if you really want to, for some daemons, you can make them more strict
<MartijnVdS> But it also contains useful information for users -- and config files that are read when they log in, for example
<daev> i didn't want to go into chroot incase it prevents services from being used correctly without faff. is default security enough to keep then from finding a way to trick the system do you think? thanks
<MartijnVdS> daev: It really depends -- are you going to provide shell accounts to the general public?
<MartijnVdS> daev: or just some friends/coworkers?
<daev> very good point :)
<MartijnVdS> Also, don't forget to keep your security patches up to date
<daev> no. if any guest accounts were given they would be very restricted. but my concern is any users who, although have no SUDO rights, might try to violate the server some day. Thanks for the advice, i'm always concious of sec patches
<MartijnVdS> daev: those users will always exist, and you'll want to look at "hardening" in that case
<MartijnVdS> daev: also, something like logwatch that emails you "strange" (or unexpected) log messages (if they are found) every night
<daev> is hardening the terminology used by the scene?
<daev> that sounds useful, thank you
<MartijnVdS> daev: Hardening is used by the security people
<MartijnVdS> daev: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Security/Features
<MartijnVdS> daev: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Security/Features#Userspace_Hardening
<daev> MartijnVdS, it's always a pleasure to speak with someone who's in the zone, thank you.
<GirlyGirl> hi
<MartijnVdS> \o GirlyGirl
<oimon> wondering if the touchbook will be dirt cheap in the uk...not likely :(
<StevenR> touchbook?
<oimon> yeah,the awesome tablet hp just canned
<oimon> in the states i've heard of reductions from $400 to $99
<oimon> touchpad
<penguin42> yeh I was hoping for that to be cheap - I'm sure it can't be hard to squeeze Android or Ubuntu onto it
<penguin42> they seem to be down to 291 - but you can get other similar spec tablets for less
 * penguin42 wonders how I tell G+ suggestions I really am not interested in adding someone
<czajkowski> I block
<penguin42> czajkowski: Well I haven't added them to any circles, so I don't need to block - but I just want to influence the suggestion
<penguin42> ah, select the victim and click remove
<oimon> penguin42: where are they 291?
<daubers> Afternoon
<oimon> can't work out if this guy is deliberately trolling: http://www.amazon.co.uk/review/R17B5Q1XPFEOH0/ref=cm_cr_pr_cmt?ie=UTF8&ASIN=B004TB0EXY&nodeID=&tag=&linkCode=#wasThisHelpful
<oimon> gave the eee pad 1/5 because it doesn't run MS software
<shauno> sounds like a valid point to me.  I mean, who doesn't use publisher?!
<ali1234> it is a completely valid point
<ali1234> but complaining about it is about as useful as me complaining about unity
<ali1234> 99% of people don't care
<ali1234> they only want facebook and youtube
<ali1234> and, the android youtube app is massively better than anything else
<ali1234> these new UIs are great if you only want to go on the internet, listen to music, and look at pictures
<ali1234> they are worthless (all of them) if you want to do anything productive
<ali1234> but it isn't a problem because most people never do anything productive
<ali1234> it's only a problem for the minority that does
<marxjohnson> czajkowski: thanks, looks like it's working at last :-)
<HazRPG> hmm, I just logged out of my system, and logged back in again... and on logging out I noticed "I/O error" or something along those lines (it flashed very quickly, so didn't get chance to read it...)
<HazRPG> where are those kind of messages stored?
<HazRPG> (log file wise)
<HazRPG> so I can see what's up...
<bigcalm> dmesg
<bigcalm> Might have some info
<bigcalm> You may have luck with /var/log/messages
<HazRPG> wow, looks like there's a lot of bad stuff on here
<bigcalm> :(
<HazRPG> "2:3:1: cannot get freq at ep 0x82"
<bigcalm> Time for a new drive and back up what you can while you can
<HazRPG> "sd 12:0:0:0: rejecting I/O to offline device"
<HazRPG> "Buffer I/O error on device sde1, logical block 7306752"
<bigcalm> Yes, that's not healthy
<HazRPG> I don't even know which one sde1 is
<bigcalm> Might be an SD card or such?
<bigcalm> Or an external disk
<HazRPG> no SD card reader on this thing
<bigcalm> A USB drive?
<HazRPG> and no external drive plugged in
<HazRPG> opening up gparted to see if I can work it out from there
<HazRPG> (also, gnome panels hasn't loaded up for some reason - good thing I've got terminal set to a mod4+T)
<HazRPG> I don't have any sde devices...
<HazRPG> interesting...
<HazRPG> could that be why I'm getting errors?
<bigcalm> *shrug*
<HazRPG> http://www.hazrpg.co.uk/ubuntu/dmesg.txt
<HazRPG> so glad I'm use to using the terminal a bit more, cos that's the only thing I've really got access to at the minute :P
<HazRPG> I think that should have copied over right
<HazRPG> not quite understanding what the /var/log/messages stuff means
<HazRPG> seems like the same happens each time I reboot the system
<HazRPG> oh wait, heh wrong system
<HazRPG> the dmesg.txt is the right system however
<HazRPG> i wish i understood what any of that means
<HazRPG> sr0 is usually the CD/DVD drive correct?
<HazRPG> hmm, I just realised, sde would have been when I plugged my phone...
<HazRPG> that means the SD card in my phone needs replaced :(
<bigcalm> How long have you had the card in your phone?
<ubuntuuk-planet> [Andrew] Creative ZEN Stone Tango Icon - http://whyareyoureadingthisurl.wordpress.com/2011/08/20/creative-zen-stone-tango-icon/
<HazRPG> I've just realised I still have those files from the Global Jam we did of installing natty
<bigcalm> On your phone?
<ali1234> if i acidentally deleted a file while firefox was downloading it, can i undelete it?
<ali1234> firefox still has the fd open
<ali1234> but the link in /proc shows (deleted)
<ali1234> can i do some hardlink trickery or something?
<penguin42> you can try cp /proc/whatever/fd/whatever tosomewhereelse
<ali1234> i'd have to catch it exactly when the download finishes
<ali1234> ut before ff closes the fd
<ali1234> http://www.barricane.com/undelete-open-file-from-inode
<ali1234> :)
<ali1234> ah, if i use tail
<ali1234> i will get the whole thing
<ali1234> perfect
<ali1234> tail -f -c +0 <fd> > whatever
<dsample> paste.ubuntu.com down?
<dsample> or rather, not working?
<ali1234> http://paste.ubuntu.com/671188/
<suprengr> evening all. back home after yet another week in
<suprengr> evenin' all.. back home from yet another stint away [while the lucky ones were at Ogg]... only 1 extra injury [anyone know if superglue is actually *better* than stiches ;)  ....but sooo quiet here tonight - so ... boo!
<AlanBell> boo
<Laney> wiggle wiggle
<Myrtti> wobble wobble
<DJones> waggle waggle (a bit late)
<suprengr> ;D
<ali1234> awesome, someone made a tool that rips firmwares from the nokia care server
<ali1234> i find it highly ironic that the software use to crack nokia phones comes with a hardware DRM device to stop people pirating it
<zleap> lol
<zleap> yeah people think its ok to crack other peoples software but don't want em to crack theirs
<zleap> i can see the irony in that too
<ali1234> the most ironic part is that they thought it would actually work, given their customer base
<zleap> yeah
<zleap> thing is I support freedom etc but I still want to proterct my IP e.g photos, however i release stuff under creative commons
<ali1234> i just want to downgrade my nokia to the old working firmware
<ali1234> nokia won't allow it, not even with their service tools
<ali1234> this software claims it can do it
<ali1234> but we'll see
 * hamitron wants to reflash his ngage qd
<hamitron> just so it starts
<hamitron> ;)
<zleap> i am sure it's possible
<ali1234> oh it's possible
<zleap> they just use doing things like that as an excuse to invalidate the warranty
<ali1234> the nokia service software performs the reflash but the phone won't boot after
<ali1234> you have to cold flash it back to newest firmware
<ali1234> they must have updated the bootloader with a new signing key
<ali1234> hamitron: what is wrong with your ngage?
<hamitron> white screen of death
<hamitron> :(
<ali1234> how did that happen?
<hamitron> it is a known fault
<zleap> makes a change from blue screen eh
<ali1234> so... get phoenix and do a cold flash?
<ali1234> can't make it worse
<hamitron> indeed
<hamitron> just scared
<hamitron> ;)
<ali1234> phoenix is safe
<hamitron> I got a normal ngage as a spare for now
<hamitron> well, I need a cable I think
<ali1234> just the normal usb cable
<hamitron> no, the cable with pins to go inside
<ali1234> wut
<ali1234> i doubt you need that
<hamitron> from what I've read, I do
<ali1234> there is too much rubbish on forums
<hamitron> well, the QD doesn't have a USB connector either
<hamitron> :D
<hamitron> so i can assume not
<ali1234> how do you copy files on to it?
<hamitron> bluetooth or mmc reader
<ali1234> that sucks :(
<hamitron> the normal ngage has a USB connector, but that is only for writing to the MMC too
<hamitron> :/
<hamitron> I've read I need some special box to flash it
<hamitron> but also seen some simple circuits
<Seeker`> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IfeyUGZt8nk
<directhex> still don't have my pre3. dhl are worthless Â¬_Â¬
<gord> yup they are
<penguin42> directhex: Given that HP have just canned them, that's about to be a rareity
<directhex> penguin42: indeed. i am the telephone hipster!
<bernhard2> using exim4 with dovecot (its 80% functional).. i would like to setup virtual domains with virtual mailboxes. are there  any good tutorials ?
<popey> will there be lots of HP tablets going cheap now?
<penguin42> popey: Someone said that in the US they're going for $99 - I wish that was true here
<directhex> popey: in the US. trying to find someone to do a bulk import
<gord> they were going for $99 - they are all gone now
<directhex> there was meant to be a LOT of back stock to clear
<gord> wow, sshd uses up a lot of cpu when you are copying over at 11mb/s
<directhex> encryption is hard, let's go shopping
<gord> oh and great i forgot to remove the / from a tab complete so rsync spewed the entire contents of that directory all over the output directory :(
<Andres-kain> congratulations on reapproval!
#ubuntu-uk 2011-08-21
 * penguin42 wonders why x=y?:z is legal (nothing in the true path)
<ubuntuuk-planet> [Miia Ranta] And then, unexpectedly, life happens - http://myrtti.fi/blog/2011/08/21/and-then-unexpectedly-life-happens/
<ali1234> so when i make a public post on google+ does it go to everyone in all my circles?
<ali1234> or just my "wall" thingy?
<ali1234> (btw sorry if my symbian rant is annoying anyone)
<HazRPG> ali1234: as far as I know, "public" means anyone can see it
<HazRPG> ali1234: only if you use "your circles" can people in your circles see them
<HazRPG> in theory, something in "Public" can be searchable via Google's search engine
<bigcalm_lappy486> On the off chance that anybody is awake: Good morning :)
<MartijnVdS> \o
<MartijnVdS> off to run 7.5 miles now though :)
<Myrtti> bigcalm_lappy486: moin
<bigcalm_lappy486> Hola Myrtti
<bigcalm_lappy486> Huva moin
<Myrtti> had to check what "rant" actually means in English from Merriam-Webster to check what went wrong with my blog post when a commenter automatically seems to have understood that if I "rant about Arduino" it means that I have nothing but negative to say :-/
<bigcalm_lappy486> Eh?
<bigcalm_lappy486> To rant about something is to be negative
<bigcalm_lappy486> To rave about something is to be positive
<Myrtti> intransitive verb
<Myrtti> 1
<Myrtti> : to talk in a noisy, excited, or declamatory manner
<Myrtti> 2
<Myrtti> : to scold vehemently
<bigcalm_lappy486> On myrant.net I complain about things
<Myrtti> ? or have I now understood the 1. wrong now?
<bigcalm_lappy486> I guess that 1. does apply, but these days 2. is the norm
<AlanBell> I think the use is evolving
<bigcalm_lappy486> Are you complaining about your Arduino?
<Myrtti> not all the time :->
<bigcalm_lappy486> Hehe
<bigcalm_lappy486> Morning AlanBell. How's the surfing? I too think that suit with blue looks better
<nigelb> Morning
<nigelb> Acutally, afternoon.
<nigelb> Myrtti: I'm curious, what specific rants did you have? :)
<AlanBell> bigcalm_lappy486: surfing was fun
<AlanBell> bodyboarding really
<AlanBell> I might wear the blue one today, due to popular demand
<nigelb> heh
<Myrtti> nigelb: "soldering is fun" "decisions on what arduino to buy" "frustrations over not getting my head around example codes"
<AlanBell> bit surprised that the internet cares and has an opinion about what wetsuit I look best in
<nigelb> Myrtti: ah
<nigelb> AlanBell: well, when you involve the internets in the decision making
<nigelb> Myrtti: I agree with soldering is fun  ^-^
<nigelb> I wonder what popey was soldering the other day.
<nigelb> apparently he had no clue either ;)
<Myrtti> Nanode, like I did :-)
<nigelb> Ah
<nigelb> nanode sounds like fun
<bigcalm_lappy486> Think it might be time for a new mattress. Any shop suggestions?
<bigcalm_lappy486> I shall name it Zim
<bigcalm_lappy486> That was lost on everybody then
<KrimZon> what was?
<bigcalm_lappy486> That when I get a new mattress, I shall name it Zim
<KrimZon> after the desktop wiki program?
<bigcalm_lappy486> It's not worth explaining :)
<bigcalm_lappy486> Oh sodd
<bigcalm_lappy486> -d
<bigcalm_lappy486> Zem, not Zim
<KrimZon> hahah
<KrimZon> after the headphones? the footwear? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ZEM ?
<MartijnVdS> Probably the H2G2 thing
<MartijnVdS> this being a channel full of geeks ;)
<bigcalm_lappy486> MartijnVdS: indeed. I did say it wasn't worth explaining :)
<brobostigon> good morning everyone.
<MartijnVdS> \o brobostigon
<brobostigon> o/ MartijnVdS
<MartijnVdS> Time for some fresh tea.
<brobostigon> :)
<KrimZon> ahh, that makes more sense than a pop rock band
<MartijnVdS> KrimZon: Sex, drugs, rock&roll :)
<brobostigon> :)
<Guest96266> good morning this is the first time I have connected how do I find #ubuntu-beginners
<AlanBell> hi
<Guest96266> hello
<AlanBell> Guest96266: you can do "/join #ubuntu-beginners"
<AlanBell> and/or just stick around here
<Guest96266> thank you AlanBell
<brobostigon> morning AlanBell
<AlanBell> hi brobostigon
 * AlanBell thinks about going to the beach
<czajkowski> aloha
<AlanBell> aloha czajkowski
<gord> konichiwa
<MartijnVdS> howdy
<brobostigon> moin
<mvrtechlinux> hi
<bigcalm_lappy486> Mornin' czajkowski :)
<adrian__> hi
<adrian__> hi I have just installed ubuntu 11.04 Desktop on my Presario-V6000 (hp laptop)the v6000 has broadcom network and wireless built in and needs the commands 'sudo modprobe -r b43 ssb' followed by 'sudo modprobe b43' to switch the wireless on everytime ubuntu is started how do I now make this module part of my kernel build?
<bigcalm_lappy486> I would say that you don't need to have it staticly built into the kernel if it works ok with modules.  You can auto-load modules by editing /etc/modules
<bigcalm_lappy486> adrian__: ^^
<AlanBell> adrian__: I think you need to blacklist the modules you don't want to load
<AlanBell> so in /etc/modprobe.d/blacklist you would have a line "blacklist ssb"
<bigcalm_lappy486> I was about to say that too :)
<AlanBell> not sure why you are removing b43 then adding it back though
<bigcalm_lappy486> Add "blacklist ssb" to /etc/modules.d/blacklist.conf. Add "b43" to /etc/modules
<adrian__> Thank you as you can see I am new to this I will look at it just seems to need this to work its fine afterwards /etc/modules and come back thank you guy's
<bigcalm_lappy486> adrian__: reboot after that and let us know how you get on :)
<adrian__> thanks off to play
<bigcalm_lappy486> I was surprised but pleased that once I installed Ubuntu on this laptop, no tinkering was required for all of the hardware to work
<bigcalm_lappy486> Thank you Dell :)
<matti> :)
<Guest70067> well that was brilliant thanks guys on had lp in modules so added 'b43' and blacklisted as you said and all is great thank you
<brobostigon> matti: good morning, :)
<adrian_> first time I have used xchat as well couldn't even log in in time I dont stand a chance -lol  well that was brilliant thanks guys only had lp in modules so added 'b43' and blacklisted ssb as you said and all is great thank you bigcalm_lappy486, AlanBell and all who share their time here
<matti> Hey brobostigon
<matti> :)
<daubers> Afternoon
<bigcalm_lappy486> adrian: you are welcome :)
<jchristel> bigcalm_lappy486! <3
<bigcalm_lappy486> jchristel: good morning my dear *squeeze* :)
<jchristel> \o/
<bigcalm_lappy486> jchristel: how are you today?
 * suprengr has just caught up & listened to U-UK OggCamp podcast - nice one.  but now I'm even more jealous :-/
<popey> heh
<bigcalm_lappy486> I'm still glowing from the joy that was the oggcamp 4 day weekend
<jchristel> aww
<bigcalm_lappy486> I'm also still suffering with #oggflu
<mgdm> o/
<bigcalm_lappy486> Hiya mgdm
<bigcalm_lappy486> And good morn^Wafternoon popey
<suprengr> bigcalm_lappy486, is #oggflu similar to a hangover by any chance?   ;)
<bigcalm_lappy486> suprengr: I had 2.5 hangovers that weekend
<suprengr> :D
<bigcalm_lappy486> suprengr: oggflu is similar to conflu
<suprengr> :D :D
<popey> similar to ubuflu that happens at ubuntu developer summits
<popey> although ubuflu tends to be more severe
<suprengr> :D :D :D
<popey> We had something like 320 people turn up to oggcamp
<popey> wonder if we could get 500 next year :D
<bigcalm_lappy486> Geting enough unwashed people in the same place and viruses will spread
<suprengr> [you could have 501 if you sent me ticket now...}
<bigcalm_lappy486> popey: having it down south on a non football match day helped
<bigcalm_lappy486> suprengr: it's free (so far), just be interested and give support where you can :)
<suprengr> support ...like a tent pole perhaps?
<bigcalm_lappy486> Hayley is hungover, I've got some sort of virus. Despite this, we're off for sushi!
<bigcalm_lappy486> Laters kids :)
<popey> :D
<popey> o/
<suprengr> ...& could Ogg please ensure that /me is not sent to Brum to fix riot damaged hardware next year please
<penguin42> ouch
<penguin42> suprengr: Well after the riot?
<suprengr> nope... in the midst of & during... & then some sites took 6 sixs for 'access' "for security reasons" :D
<suprengr> *six days
<penguin42> yeuch - wouldn't want to be going anywhere near it until they'd got rid of the rioters
<suprengr> [you too can go into a burnt out building to get pooters & connected machines working!]
<suprengr> ...if you fancy the job... pretty please
 * penguin42 hadn't realised that Brum had burnt out buildings; the news seemed to concentrate on London and here in Manc oh and Brum's unfortunate car incident
<suprengr> [I think if I say much more - you'd guess what type of 'machines' I refer to ;)   [damn the press coverage]
<suprengr> imho... only hero in the brum riot scene... the father of of those dead kids who pleaded for reason.
<suprengr> *one of
<penguin42> nod
<ali1234> HazRPG: but you didn't answer my question
<Westerham> Sorry didn't get the question.
<ali1234> do posts marked public on google plus appear in all my followers streams?
<Westerham> Sorry, not on this thread.
<ali1234> I got a reply so i guess they do
<mgdm> I thinks  o
<Westerham> Hello, Apologies if I'm doing this wrong - first time on an IRC ever. Since doing an Ubuntu update around 5th August I've found the account login on my Ubuntu machine really slow - you have to keep each key for the password depressed for sometime.  The keyboard works fine once I'm logged in and on an elderly Apple Mac as well.  I've run Log Viewer and found this bit around the keyboard but I'm none the wiser (apart from thinking 
<penguin42> Westerham: Welcome!
<penguin42> Westerham: Which version of Ubuntu? Standard Ubuntu or KDE? How much memory do you have?
<Westerham> Hello - I'm running Natty 32bit with 4GB of RAM.
<penguin42> ok, can you get the logs onto the web somewhere so we can have a look - may be using a pastebin  ?
<Westerham> Got a log but don't know how to use a paste bin or where to 'paste' it.
<brobostigon> pastebinit *.log
<brobostigon> :)
<Westerham> pastebinit *.[ Â  Â 3.451152] input: Â USB OPTICAL MOUSE as /devices/pci0000:00/0000:00:02.0/usb2/2-3/2-3.2/2-3.2:1.0/input/input3 [ Â  Â 3.451216] generic-usb 0003:15D9:0A4D.0002: input,hidraw1: USB HID v1.11 Mouse [ USB OPTICAL MOUSE] on usb-0000:00:02.0-3.2/input0 [ Â  Â 3.525043] usb 2-3.3: new low speed USB device using ohci_hcd and address 5 [ Â  Â 3.658168] input: Justcom Technology USB KVM Switch as /devices/pci0000:00/00
<penguin42> Westerham: No, in a terminal run the command pastebinit filename
<penguin42> Westerham: Then it will upload that file to a pastebin and give you a URL that you can tell us
<Westerham> Sorry, realised that wasn't what you wanted as soon as it posted. Will give it a go and get back to you.
<Azelphur> Hmm, OT math sort of question. Given pitch and yaw, how can I calculate the vectors for throwing something?
<dutchie> "pitch and yaw"?
<dutchie> """vectors for thrwoowing"!?
<dutchie> arg
<Azelphur> lol
<dutchie> you know what i mean
<Azelphur> pitch and yaw, IE the direction your looking in
<Azelphur> and the vectors for throwing things, game programming stuff \o/
<dutchie> what data do you have in what form and what do you want to get out?
<Azelphur> I have pitch and yaw, aka the direction I'm looking in
<Azelphur> and I want to throw an item in front of me using xyz vectors
<dutchie> what are pitch and yaw? angles?
<Azelphur> yea
<dutchie> and you want a vector basically in the direction of those angles?
<dutchie> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spherical_coordinates#Cartesian_coordinates
<dutchie> see the bit at the bottom about transforming back to cartesians
<Azelphur> weee, complicated math \o/
<Azelphur> I'm doing contrib to bravo, the python minecraft server btw :)
<dutchie> oh cool
<Azelphur> when items drop there's no throw at all, so it just appears in front of you
<Azelphur> I already wrote item bounce for when you destroy a block, that's working
<dutchie> you might have to do things like add or subtract right angles with those formulae
<Azelphur> so now I'm just writing the stuff for when you throw something out of your inventory
<Azelphur> then I'll commit :D
<Azelphur> hehe
<dutchie> but it should work just fine
<shauno> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trajectory has a lot on the maths behind ballistic paths
<Azelphur> only problem is I don't understand the mathematical notations they are using
<Westerham> Hello. Have posted bit of log featuring keyboard etc at http://paste.ubuntu.com/671690/
<Azelphur> high school dropout, it has it's downsides *shrug*
<dutchie> Azelphur: heh, it's a bit hard to explain this over text only
<Azelphur> indeed
<dutchie> ideally i could draw diagrams and wave hands around
<shauno> most of it is just modelling a parabola; and then figuring out where on it you're starting from
<gord> um if your doing it in python, chances are there is some module that will do this for you
<shauno> (which is gonna be complete overkill for dropping items; but good fun when you start firing arrows)
<gord> batteries included and all that
<Azelphur> gord: indeed
<ali1234> no
<ali1234> no to everything everyone said so far about this
<Azelphur> lol
<mgdm> \o/ Arduino
<Azelphur> ouÄ±npÉ¹â /o\
<mgdm> heh
<andylockran> mgdm: how's germany?
<mgdm> andylockran: pretty good :)
<Myrtti> hm
<Myrtti> I was about to do something but I forgot what
<penguin42> sleep?
<Laney> give laney lots of money
<czajkowski> Westerham: how are you doing, did you get your issue resolved
<Myrtti> raspberries â¥
<Myrtti> Laney: I don't have lots of money to give
<mfraz74> raspberry pi?
<Myrtti> no, real raspberries
<Westerham> Have pasted log extract at http://paste.ubuntu.com/671690/ as requested but no observations yet. Sorry, have to go. Will try to log in later this week or next weekend.
<czajkowski> hmm
<czajkowski> wish he's stay around more
<czajkowski> he only seems to be able to irc on the weekends but posts to mailing lists for help
<bigcalm_lappy486> !ping
<lubotu3> another contentless ping... sigh...
<bigcalm_lappy486> Poor  lubotu3
<czajkowski> http://paste.ubuntu.com/671749/  to remind me later
<bigcalm_lappy486> What an odd problem
<oracology> hi from canada everyone! i'm back home to visit for a bit.
<ali1234> czajkowski: sounds like USB IRQ problems (yet again)
<HazRPG> ali1234: oh, didn't realise that's what you meant... well I saw one of your posts in my stream, so I would assume so. It depends how people are subscribed to you - if they have you in a circle, then yes, if they have you in the "following circle" then no, they will show up in the "incoming" section.
<ali1234> HazRPG: yeah that's all i wanted to know
<ali1234> HazRPG: i'm getting comments from people now so they must be showing
<ali1234> i feel like i should post something not symbian related
<HazRPG> ali1234: I usually just post things into "your circles" and only put stuff into "public" if I want the whole world to be able to see it (via my "wall")
<ali1234> i wanted to post links to the posts on another forum
<popey> Evening ratfans!
<ali1234> the only reason it is even on g+ is because the g+ auto photo upload is super easy to use
<HazRPG> indeed
<HazRPG> I have a feeling I won't be scrapping facebook any time soon though :(
<czajkowski> ali1234: aye but the guy seems to have one day to irc
<czajkowski> and was told to wipe his system
<czajkowski> i suggested irc
<czajkowski> he unfortunately chose a time when ther were few people around so i have it on pastebin so i can ask tomorrow
<czajkowski> popey: ahoy
<directhex> Nafallo, do you have root on the buildds?
<ali1234> czajkowski: who suggested to wipe the system? that never works
<czajkowski> ali1234: a guy on the surrey lug mailing list
<czajkowski> my reply was no log on here and we can see if we can help
<czajkowski> however 5pm on a sunday not many around
<ali1234> it's unlikely anyone can help unless they are in front of the machine
<czajkowski> aye shame he's gonna wait another week for the issue
<czajkowski> not heard of any of the mac folks having similar issues
<czajkowski> it's hot today!
<popey> czajkowski: who is he on surrey list?
<popey> i must have missed this thread
<popey> oh, found it
<czajkowski> popey: aye from last weekend give or take
<czajkowski> popey: http://paste.ubuntu.com/671749/  is all his details/issues
<suprengr> rule no. 1 if having a bath - remember you superglued a cut on forehead back together earlier in week...forget it:  ooooh boy; a distinct ouch :(
<DJones> suprengr: That'll teach you not to do a triple twist with pike into the bath
<suprengr> [I deny keeping pike in my bath!]
<DJones> Don't blame you, pike have too many teeth to be friendly in a bath
<suprengr> ...a few sea-horses, a couple of terrapins and a squid maybe... but *no* pike*
<suprengr> DJones,  would you be a a certain person G+ with no photo? if so - ok to add to mon U-UK circle?
<DJones> Could be, I've not added anything G+
<gord> advantage of having far too many fans on your computer - makes for an excelent way of drying out a laptop after spilling a can of coke on it...
<suprengr> as in not there?
<DJones> suprengr: I'm listed as "Dave" on the home page
<suprengr> DJ?
<suprengr> [without giving too much away ;)  }
<DJones> suprengr: just pm'd my email address for g+
<suprengr> gord, with enough fans thew coke never gets to the pooter in the first place!
<suprengr> DJones, cheers
<gord> this is why you need quad cores, burn the coke off before it gets anywhere near the electronics ;)
<suprengr> ...or not snorting coke in the first place is probably as good ;)
<dwatkins> You superglued a cut on your forehead, suprengr?
<suprengr> yup.. standard "field" dressing technique... 10x better than waiting in a&e dripping forehead onto floor!
<suprengr> [superglue = standard procedure for both those in A&E and for those avoiding it!  ;D
 * penguin42 guesses the trick is not to glue it to anything else
<shauno> glue a pillow to your forehead, stop it happening again ;)
<penguin42> shauno: Makes falling asleep on the keyboard more comfy
<suprengr> shauno, :D
 * penguin42 burps Eves pudding
 * suprengr burps Adam's apple
 * StevenR wonders how often to make the very little computer take a photo (arduino+servo to control my camera) for a "24 hour" video
<shauno> surely just 86400/how many images the camera can store?
<StevenR> well, actually, I need to look at jpegvideo or whatever it's called
<StevenR> so I can work out how much padding, how many fps, etc, and thus how frequently I need to take photos to make a suitably short video
<StevenR> (I want the video to show 24 hours, not actually be 24 hours :) )
<shauno> in the past, I've done it completely the other way around.  just pure trial & error depending on the subject
<shauno> eg, clouds move much faster than tides or plants.  so there's not one answer to fit all 3
<StevenR> well, for theatre get-ins, every 10 minutes should be ok
<StevenR> but for say "sunrise-sunset" type stuff, I'm gonna need to think about it a bit more
<shauno> 10 minutes is likely going to turn out to be far too long for most things.  that's 144 frames a day, and less than 5 seconds at 30fps
<StevenR> theatre doesn't change that quickly (4 hours is the actual elapsed time)
<shauno> one thing that did catch me out, primarily with sunsets, but may catch you with theatres too, if it's dark enough; all the math on paper went wrong when the exposure time got longer than the interval
<ali1234> take more photos that you need
<ali1234> higher frame rate always looks better
<ali1234> plus you have an out in case a bird flies in front of the camera or something
<shauno> I didn't like having spares, depending on how fluid the scene is.  it becomes difficult to remove them without making it jumpy
<ali1234> yeah always go for 2x or 3x or 4x etc
<ali1234> basically do as many frames as you have storage for
<StevenR> shauno: the light level isn't going to change much, the stage is lit with fluoros
<ali1234> but if you have 4x frame rate then frc isn't going to be noticable if done properly
<shauno> I mostly ran into limits that I didn't see coming (but should have).  my camera going to sleep if it was too slow, the buffer filling if it was too fast, etc
<ali1234> also be aware that 80000 file in one directory will choke a lot of applications
<gord> i wonder if there is anything listed on ebay that isn't listed as RARE
<gord> if there are ten other listings next to yours for the same product, its not rare
<StevenR> gord: led torches and usb cables.
<stuphi> \quit
<bigcalm> Good evening peeps
<bigcalm> I almost responded to my own greeting
<bigcalm> I am ill
<penguin42> :-(
<penguin42> bigcalm: What's up?
<bigcalm> Oggflu
<penguin42> doesn't sound good - I'm not feeling great; running a bit hot (but otherwise fine)
 * penguin42 is watching a fascinating prog on Beeb 1 about dolphins
<dwatkins> Are they still cruel, penguin42?
<penguin42> who? The people or the Dolphins?
<shauno> they're whales :/
<penguin42> dwatkins: There was one example of two groups of males having a fight - but given they were just doing it by making threatening squeeks at each other I'd say that's reasonably civilised
<dwatkins> penguin42: I heard they do unspeakable things to each other at times
<dwatkins> I hope that was wrong.
<penguin42> ooh unspeakable
<shauno> I think that's just narwhals :p
<dwatkins> ...or just bottlenosed dolphins, perhaps.
<penguin42> dwatkins: They seem smart enough to be able to do bad things
<dwatkins> yeah, I imagine it's a case of there being bad and good ones.
<dwatkins> Not every human is evil etc.
<penguin42> dwatkins: One of the scientists gave a bunch a machine that blew bubble rings - they loved it
<dwatkins> I'd like to have a conversation with a dolphin, but right now I think I need to cook, later dudes and dudettes :)
<shauno> this is still the type of show that the bbc seem to do better than anyone else
<penguin42> oddly they have Steven Fry doing the narration; which was even odder last week when it mostly seemed to be about sex
<shauno> I say that, and then my ntl signals starts dropping out.  ugh.
<penguin42> scary, I can't see a way of setting the font
<penguin42> oops - wrong window
<suprengr> "time for bed", said Zebedee....  "boing", said suprengr
#ubuntu-uk 2012-08-13
<Liboan> ~
<christel> morning :)
<jacobw> morning
<dwatkins> g'day
<popey> Morning
<czajkowski> ALOHA!!!
<rajeev> i am installing ubuntu 1st time
<rajeev> and i want to install it with window 7
<rajeev> while i am installing it with window7 it creats error
<rajeev> no root file system is defined
<rajeev> plese tell me somehing regarding this
<rajeev> please help me
<rajeev> give me my answer
<AlanBell> hi
<AlanBell> did you let it resize the partitions?
<rajeev> yes i shrink the volume
<rajeev> with 20 gb of space
<TheOpenSourcerer> AlanBell: You are supposed to be on holiday ;-)
 * czajkowski managed 9 days off IRC 
 * TheOpenSourcerer loved this picture at Stratford Station this morning: http://yfrog.com/mg9ybnj
<rajeev> hey please anyone give me my answer
<AlanBell> http://askubuntu.com/questions/80455/no-root-file-system-defined-error-while-installing-ubuntu
<AlanBell> snorkling or surfing or sandcastles
<AlanBell> I cam't decide
<TheOpenSourcerer> Why not build a sandcastle with a snorkel in the surf?
<bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
<christel> bigclam!
<christel> czajkowski!
<bigcalm> chirstel!
<czajkowski> christel: ello ello
<bigcalm> czajkowski: love the new photo, it's so sweet :)
<bigcalm> christel: how are you my dear?
<christel> how are you pretty girl?
<christel> bigcalm: i am well!
<bigcalm> Yay :)
 * bigcalm is a pretty girl?
<czajkowski> bigcalm: thanks
<christel> bigcalm: haha that was for czajkowski silly
<christel> for a girl you're not at all pretty, sorry :P
<bigcalm> :P
<bigcalm> Haha
<czajkowski> :)
 * bigcalm scratches his stubbly chin
<christel> david is "kindly" playing the piano for us
<christel> it is rather... dramatic
 * bigcalm imagines Peanuts
 * TheOpenSourcerer has just booked his ticket for the West Dean Chilli Fiesta :-D
<christel> .4
<christel> er
<christel> TheOpenSourcerer: ooh did you do well with your chillis this year btw?
<TheOpenSourcerer> No. :-(
<christel> oh :(
<TheOpenSourcerer> They are in the greenhouse - I have a few fruit but not much.
<TheOpenSourcerer> The seedlings did something very odd early on. They just "stopped" growing for about 2-3 months.
<TheOpenSourcerer> Didn't die. Just stopped. Only at the 2-leaf stage. So the plants are now well behind and have little chance of catching up before the end of the season.
<christel> how bizarre
<bigcalm> How do you find out which branch a git repo is using from the CLI?
<directhex> bigcalm, "git branch", the one with a star next to it?
<bigcalm> directhex: ta
<bigcalm> Ug, I can't tell if it's the project's information I'm getting or the sub-repo
 * bigcalm kippers technical things
<czajkowski> bigcalm: sort out a plan B yet
<bigcalm> czajkowski: not yet. I want to discuss with my boss and see what he's willing to provide
<czajkowski> bigcalm: you work from home you provide :)
<bigcalm> czajkowski: maybe with your company :)
<czajkowski> bigcalm: every company :)
<czajkowski> dell install a logged on laptops
<brobostigon> good morning everyone.
<mungojerry> does gnote offer web sync like tomboy yet?
<mungojerry> hmmm looks like it will come soon "  * Added core synchronization support"
<directhex> web sync is much harder than file sync
<mungojerry> ssh and web dav sync is done already
<mungojerry> so looks like they are progressing
<mungojerry> haven't seen any discussion on a devs list about it though, would be nice to see milestones etc
<popey> gnote has promised web sync since it was started
<popey> and has as yet not delivered
<mungojerry> popey, as yet no, but the sync stuff they have added has all been done in last 6 months
<mungojerry> so are getting there, albeit a little slowly
<mungojerry> i realised tomboy is the last mono app on my system
<popey> you mean.. 6 months ago
<ali1234> "patches welcome"
<mungojerry> separate releases over the last 6 months, the latest being july
<mungojerry> july 0.9.1 added webdav sync
<popey> ah ok
<mungojerry> i have no major agenda against mono but a c++ app for such a useful yet small app fwould be welcome
<mungojerry> otherwise it adds quite a lot of MB just for a note app
<mungojerry> similarly i don't install digikam because it requires half of kde
<popey> yeah, i tried out gnote recently
<popey> still have it installed, but the lack of sync is annoying
<mungojerry> which version?
<popey> whatever is in 12.04
<popey> i note 0.9 is in quantal
<popey> updated a couple of weeks ago with those updates
<popey> could try installing that package to test the sync stuff
<mungojerry> webdav sync allows DIYers to use owncloud for sync
<popey> http://ubuntu.mirror.cambrium.nl/ubuntu//pool/universe/g/gnote/gnote_0.9.1-0ubuntu1_amd64.deb
<popey> that installed okay on 12.04
<popey> and runs okay, and sees all my tomboy notes
<mungojerry> u1 sync is pretty critical for me atm, as i use tomdroid onthe phone
<daubers> I was almost tempted to run a web service using mono's asp.net implimentation. Then I realised I was being sentimental for when I used to work in Windows and forced myself to do it in the language I'm supposed to be specialising in
 * popey tries gnote for a week
<mungojerry> popey, how will you sync?
<popey> files to u1
<mungojerry> i thought you told me you did that once and it went BAD
<popey> hmm, status bar icon doesn't work
<popey> depends how you do it
<popey> i no longer sync to osx/windows
<popey> and only ever have gnote/tomboy open on one machine
<popey> whereas back then I had it open on all 3 platforms a lot of the time
<popey> so would get conflicts and notes would vanish as dropbox/u1 messed up
<mungojerry> i see
<gord> something feels wrong about watching a youtube video in HD, when its just zx spectrum games
<daubers> gord: Horace goes ski-ing?
<gord> ashens
<czajkowski> anyone here running Jellybean and 12.04 ??
<sagaci> czajkowski, yep, android 4.1.1 and 12.04
<davmor2> morning all
<czajkowski> sagaci: when you hook your phone up to ubuntu does it open?
<czajkowski> mine just spins and refuses to open
<bigcalm> Morning davmor2
<davmor2> czajkowski: Prod, Prod, Prod, Prod, Prod, Prod, Prod, Prod, Prod, Prod.......That'll teach you to go on holiday :P Morning
<popey> czajkowski, what spins, the phone or ubuntu?
<Dave2> imagining the phone being plugged in, levitating, then rotating.
<sagaci> mine works normal, OK to USB storage and turns up as a device in nautilus, opens two dialogs - one asking what to do with digital photos and the other for audio
<sagaci> nexus S
<czajkowski> popey: phone
<czajkowski> davmor2: miss me much eh
<czajkowski> sagaci: thanks
<czajkowski> will try again
<popey> what does dmesg say?
<davmor2> czajkowski: Nah picked on christel instead to ease the withdrawal :D
<czajkowski> popey: [14084.474083] usb 1-1.3: new high-speed USB device number 3 using ehci_hcd
<popey> that all?
<popey> i thought you have to tell the phone to be a mountable device or something
<czajkowski> popey: Sorry, could not display all the contents of "Galaxy Nexus": DBus error org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.NoReply: Did not receive a reply. Possible causes include: the remote application did not send a reply, the message bus security policy blocked the reply, the reply timeout expired, or the network connection was broken.
<popey> bug 972311
<lubotu3> Launchpad bug 903422 in udev (Ubuntu Precise) "duplicate for #972311 Mount / Provide access to Android 4 (Ice Cream Sandwich, ICS) MTP devices" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/903422
<czajkowski> ahh
<TheOpenSourcerer> Hah - Good bet here against the Aussies: http://www.culture.gov.uk/news/news_stories/9232.aspx
 * popey notes all I did was google the text you posted czajkowski and that bug was first hit :)
<czajkowski> anyone coming to tje open stack meet up in London in September ?? http://www.meetup.com/Openstack-London/events/77153502/
<TheOpenSourcerer> czajkowski: Yeah - I am.
<czajkowski> popey: only stumlbed upon it since coming back just wondered off hand
<czajkowski> popey: thanks :)
<TheOpenSourcerer> PC h/w boffs: I need a cheap upgrade to the kids' desktop PC. Case & PSU OK. Does this look OK for "daily use"? http://www.ebuyer.com/lists/list/33111
<davmor2> bigcalm: good weekend?
<bigcalm> davmor2: I think so. Managed to get a hair cut
<davmor2> bigcalm: was it that long one at the back?
<bigcalm> davmor2: the one on my shoulder actually
<popey> TheOpenSourcerer, you got a 3d card for that?
<TheOpenSourcerer> no - wont the built-in gpu be enough?
<popey> for what?
<TheOpenSourcerer> Unity & Minecraft
<popey> might have to dial down the detail on minecraft a bit
<popey> dunno, i3 has a not-very-stellar GPU
<TheOpenSourcerer> Hmm, ok. What about the AMD chips with the built-in Radeon then... Any good?
<popey> I wouldn't touch AMD Radeon with a very long very shitty stick
<TheOpenSourcerer> lol
<TheOpenSourcerer> hmm - http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/cpu/display/amd-fusion-intel-core-i3_7.html
<popey> i5 3570K has nicer GPU
<TheOpenSourcerer> That's way out of my price bracket for now.
<popey> i5 2320 has the same as the i3 you looked at
<popey> yeah, bit spendy
<Oli> It's a shame AMD can't made a decent CPU these days.
<ali1234> all kids need hardware vx support
<ali1234> wow, all those CPUs actually support it
<drussell> TheOpenSourcerer: yeah I'd say that's not bad for the price
<TheOpenSourcerer> Think I'm going to grab a 2125 instead of the 2120 (better IGP)
<drussell> TheOpenSourcerer: either way it'll be a HUGE step up from the AMD 3400+ ;o)
<drussell> TheOpenSourcerer: I've got a low power/silent box which has the AMD A450 APU in it, and while for my purposes it's very good, I'd struggle to recommend it due to it requiring the closed source amd/ati drivers, radeon driver doesn't drive it enough yet
<AlanBell> http://ratemyspicerack.com/martijnvds/
<shauno> these people are making me feel quite bad about the mess I call a kitchen
<christel> ooo spicy racks \o/
 * Dave2 still needs a rack
<TheOpenSourcerer> popey: drussell: thanks for the input - just ordered with the 2125 from Amazon for Â£6 more than the 2120 from Ebuyer :-)
 * TheOpenSourcerer failed to get his massive spice collection pictured and annotated yesterday.
<drussell> TheOpenSourcerer: hehehe good job
<drussell> TheOpenSourcerer: me too (wrt RMSR) maybe later this week
<popey> ooh TheOpenSourcerer the 2125 is a nice balance
<TheOpenSourcerer> Yeah - it has the HD3000 IGP
<TheOpenSourcerer> Ebuyer didn't list it.
 * TheOpenSourcerer and his two boys will all be visiting the dentist a bit later...
<brobostigon> good luck.
<TheOpenSourcerer> Woah - "... on the busiest day, the BBC delivered 2.8 petabytes, with the peak traffic moment occurring when Bradley Wiggins won Gold with over 700 Gb/s"
<TheOpenSourcerer> http://www.bbc.co.uk/mediacentre/latestnews/2012/sport-online-figures.html
<czajkowski> dates for FOSDEM are out folks!!! https://fosdem.org/2013/
 * andatche sigh
<andatche> upstart
 * bigcalm returns from the depths of hell that is Tesco
<dwatkins> impressive stuff, TheOpenSourcerer
<dwatkins> bigcalm: I assume you know of the boycott movement against Tesco, or do you just mean that it's full of screaming people? ;)
<bigcalm> dwatkins: small children
<davmor2> bigcalm: that's not fair.......on hell
 * bigcalm grumbles
<bigcalm> dwatkins: Geoffrey?
<dwatkins> bigcalm: sorry?
 * dwatkins is a Dom not a Geoff
<bigcalm> Geoffrey Boycott
<bigcalm> Anyway...
<dwatkins> ahhhh
<dwatkins> on other news...
<dwatkins> ...Debian is switching to xfce
<bigcalm> Dave2, christel: we've lost cz<tab>. Quick, fix things and bring her back!
<Dave2> bigcalm: crisi seaverted
<Dave2> er
<Dave2> crises averted
<Dave2> crisis
 * Dave2 really needs more sleep.
<bigcalm> Dave2: I agree. Best get some before the weekend eh?
<Dave2> bigcalm: I've consistently failed every day for about 3 weeks now, I'm hoping I can on Thursday/Friday
<bigcalm> Dave2: you expect to sleep Friday night?
<Dave2> no, Thusday night/Friday morning
<bigcalm> I see
<Dave2> From what I can remember of sleeping in hotels, I'm horrible at it, regardless of anything else.
<Dave2> At least, I failed at LRL 09, 08, and 07. I think they're the most recent times I've been in a hotel.
<Dave2> Maybe not the most representative
<gord> the trick is to stay awake drinking all night until you are so tired you fall asleep instantly
<Dave2> That doesn't work for me :(
<bigcalm> gord: are you going to oggcamp this year?
<Dave2> I think the last time I was in a hotel before LRL2007 was in 1996. That can't be right.
<gord> nope
<bigcalm> Sucky
<bigcalm> And it's not that far away from you
<christel> SUCKY SUCKY
<directhex> TEN DOLLAH
<mungojerry> ahem
<mungojerry> glad i didn't arrange to go to oggcamp this year. wifey has turned into an invalid due to morning sickness and i am single parent atm
<czajkowski> poor wifey with hubby who descibes her as that
<popey> anyone here use vmware to run ubuntu inside?
<popey> vmware has similar "guest extensions" to virtualbox right?
<ali1234> yes
<ali1234> i have not used it in years though
<directhex> v,ware tools
<popey> are they in the repo?
<popey> or do you have to install them post-install?
<popey> with virtualbox they get automagically installed AIUI "virtualbox-guest-x11" is pulled in by ubiquity
<popey> but I don't know what happens in parallels and vmware
<ali1234> not here it wasn't
<ali1234> have to download the CD image through virtualbox UI every single time
<ali1234> i would guess that if vmware tools is in the repo, it's probably going to be behind the vmware current release, and you need the tools to match the host version... so if vmware wasn't from repos, download it manually anyway
<directhex> bigger issue: kernel vers
<popey> and xorg abi
<directhex> vmware sucks at tracking kernel api
<ali1234> this is why i haven't used it in years
<ali1234> what's the deal with transfering iTunes to a new computer?
<gord> and whats the deal with airline food?
<ali1234> do i need to do anything special?
<ali1234> the apple docs are well confusing
<czajkowski> popey: can you mod a mail please :)
<popey> czajkowski, eh?
<czajkowski> bah thought that went to pm
<ali1234> interesting...
<ali1234> if you download skype from skype.com using ubuntu it just gives you the installer
<ali1234> if you use windows it tries to make you sign in first
<ali1234> this is when downloading the windows version
<gord> they have a different installer
<gord> it comes pre-setup and stuff
<ali1234> yes. they must recognise that since i am downloading the windows version on ubuntu, i am most likely installing it for someone else
<ali1234> which is true
<jacobw> evening
<Flashtek> evening
<sebsebseb> hi
<dwatkins> lo
<Azelphur> got one of my funky korean monitors today
<Azelphur> :D
<Azelphur> I think the other ones missed the plane and will arrive tomorrow lol
<Azelphur> got my galaxy S3 coming tomorrow, think I'mma pull an all nighter and just camp in front of the door jumping up and down like an excited puppy. XD
<bigcalm> Evening peeps :)
<dogmatic69> sup
<bigcalm> Erm, sleep :D
<bigcalm> Night peeps :)
<shauno> may be interesting to a couple here, that mk802 "android on a thumbstick" gizmo 55 quid on ibood
<Azelphur> shauno: I'd rather just get a nexus 7 xD
#ubuntu-uk 2012-08-14
<christel> good morning my pretties
<MartijnVdS> \o
<christel> MartijnVdS \o/
<AlanBell> morning all
<christel> morning AlarmBell \o/
<bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
<popey> morning
<bigcalm> Eye spy a popey
<christel> bigcalm, popey o/
<SuperMatt> morning
<christel> SuperMatt \o/
<SuperMatt> ahoy!
 * bigcalm tickles christel hello :D
<christel> RAWR
<christel> i do enjoy a good tickle in the morning
<SuperMatt> today's extremely exciting task is to learn all about puppet
<christel> hehe
<SuperMatt> /o\
<mungojerry> yay puppet
<bigcalm> Thanks, I now have this firmly lodged in my brain http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nrs8CgpH980
<MartijnVdS> SuperMatt: Puppet is coolness
<christel> i can smell waffles
<needhelpperson> anyone here use weechat and willing to help a n00b?
<brobostigon> good morning everyone.
<popey> hello brobostigon
<brobostigon> hello popey
<davmor2> Morning all
<brobostigon> morning davmor2
<davmor2> brobostigon: morning
<mungojerry> shauno, looks good. however is the mk802 v2 a better one to get?
<mungojerry> at least it looks safer
 * popey hugs his air con
<andylockran> howdy all
<andylockran> trip to Aberdeen later today
<brobostigon> hi andylockran
<shauno> mungojerry: I didn't realise they were onto a 2nd generation already.  I'd just heard that device mentioned a few times, so raised an eyebrow when it plopped in my inbox
<shauno> it'd explain moving them at half price though
<popey> shauno, whats that?
<shauno> mk802 'android on a thumbstick' thingo, today's ibood deal
<popey> ahh!
<mungojerry> looks sweet but i don't have hdmi telly
<mungojerry> or monitor
<mungojerry> also, http://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/Free-shipping-2-4G-wilress-qwerty-mini-keyboard-with-touch-pad-10A/810525_535669384.html
<popey> i have a boxee remote I'd use for this kind of thing
<popey> don't like the idea of using a pointing device with telly
<mgdm> +1
<shauno> I use my ipad as a remote for xbmc.  sure it hates freedom, but it works well
<gord> i have two xbmcs installs. for one i use a real usb IR remote, for the other i use the xbmc remote. its nice to be able to pick shows from the remote, but damn navigating anything with it is a pain
<gord> touch devices are a pain in general
<popey> xbmc remote?
<popey> oh, on a device?
<gord> yeah my phone
<gord> your thumb is just really bad at figuring out if you are hitting UP or ENTER without having bumps of some kind
<Pendulum> morning
<bigcalm> Who is messing up the Rackspace cloud?
 * bigcalm grumbles at tech yet again
<hoover> any postfix experts around?
<hoover> hey biggie
<hoover> I could use some help with header_checks
<mgdm> hoover: what about it?
<hoover> I need to restrict mails to a single recipient domain
<hoover> my header check works with the postmap check, but not within postfix (all mails are rejected)
<hoover> I've tried this regexp:
<hoover>  !/^To:.*@good-domain.*/ REJECT illegial recipient
<lubotu3> hoover: I am only a bot, please don't think I'm intelligent :)
<hoover> and this apparenty works fine with postmap -fq
<mgdm> err
<mgdm> why are you doing that, rather than just telling postfix to only accept mail for that domain?
<andylockran> recepient_doamin or summat innit?
<hoover> hm
<hoover> it's supposed to be a mail relay server
<hoover> recipient_restrictions maybe?
<hoover> I'll check into it
<shauno> I'd think you'd just trim down smtpd_recipient_restrictions ?
<hoover> Weird, doesn't seem to work either
<shauno> relay should be quite simple, relay_domains = a list of hosts you accept for, and relayhost = the host to relay them to
<hoover> I'll try the relay_domains param
<mungojerry> going back to these mk802 things, is there a timeline for getting hardware acceleration for the mali 400 gpu?
<mungojerry> on ubuntu
<mungojerry>  /linux
<hoover> Hm, maybe it's because I'm sending mail off localhost instead of using the relay properly?
<shauno> could be; if localhost is in $mynetworks (and it usually is), it'll be a lot more liberal with where it'll accept for
<hoover> ok thanks shauno
<hoover> though this blog entry claims localhost mail should also work:
<hoover> http://thinlight.org/2012/03/10/postfix-only-allow-whitelisted-recipient-domains/
<hoover> ah ok, that's the reason, mail is rejected when talking smtp via telnet from another client
<shauno> his smtpd_recipient_restrictions (step1) is relevant there.  he has only recipients matching the hashfile.  most configurations will also have permit_mynetworks in that list, which gives localhost carte blanche
<hoover> Hm, I copied his restrictions line verbatim
<hoover> No other entries in main.cf, either
<hoover> so it's weird localhost should have the card blanche
<hoover> Sorry, I meant localhost mail should be blocked in 07:49
<mungojerry> card blanche? is that like mange all? or petits peas
<mungojerry> how do i create a distribution curve in libreoffice?
<bigcalm> mungojerry: has google not helped?
<mungojerry> bigcalm, i got some incorrect answers and started installing mathematica instead
<mungojerry> i guess it's not straightforward since i need to put the results into "bins" so that it counts the frequency
<mungojerry> all i have is the raw stats e.g. 113.4 , 113.5, 119.5, ...
<mungojerry> 39000 of them
<MartijnVdS> gnuplot!
<MartijnVdS> http://www.ruskabebic.com/wp/gnuplot-for-commoners/gnuplot-3/
<MartijnVdS> mungojerry: ^
<Azelphur> halp, my headset isn't working :( https://dl.dropbox.com/u/3832397/screenshots/2012/August/pulseaudio.png
<Azelphur> it worked before, I think an update may have killed it
<mungojerry> MartijnVdS, thanks, i'll try that
<Azelphur> fixed it, killall pulseaudio saves the day for no apparent reason.
<mungojerry> MartijnVdS, mathematica does it in 3 lilnes though
<popey> thats one proper fugly theme you have there Azelphur
<Azelphur> popey: <3
<popey> :)
<Azelphur> yea, gtk 3.x broke the theme I use
<popey> also, hows the bitcoin mining going?
<Azelphur> I need to find a new one
<popey> what pool / software do you use these days?
<gord> i am also curious about how bitcoin mining goes... in the summer heat
<Azelphur> popey: not too bad, I don't make anywhere near as much as I used to (only like Â£100 a month), I'm selling the hardware now
<popey> the value of blocks is rising steadily
<Azelphur> popey: I'm on a private pool for people with high hashrates, the pool pays me rather than me paying the pool :P
<popey> ahh
<Azelphur> and I use phoenix on BAMT
<gord> the value of blocks rises but the time taken to get a block also rises no?
<Azelphur> popey: I have ASICs on preorder for October
<Azelphur> 120GH/sec
<popey> golly
<Azelphur> yep, serious business
<Azelphur> I mostly play bitcoin investments now though
<Azelphur> it's super easy to get 6.9% a week
<Azelphur> but on some insane lucky days I've done like 200%
<Azelphur> popey: are you after a setup for yourself?
<popey> maybe
<Azelphur> popey: well I'm quite happy to educate you a bit, are you buying hardware or using existing hardware?
<popey> oh, nothing anytime soon
<popey> i have a box i generated some blocks on ages back
<Azelphur> :O
<Azelphur> you generated some /blocks/ and you still have the coins?
<Azelphur> as in, you have multiplies of 50 coins?
<popey> sorry, coins
<popey> meh
<Azelphur> lol
<Azelphur> was gonna say
<popey> i have more than 50 coins though, yeah :)
<Azelphur> popey: that's quite a lot of money you know :)
<popey> i know :)
<Azelphur> hehe
<Azelphur> popey: I once actually bumped into someone who had done that, he tried out bitcoin when it first came out, mined a few blocks, got bored and forgot about it
<Azelphur> saw me talking about it in IRC and said "Oh yea I did that when it came out mined a few blocks"
<Azelphur> turned out he had about Â£2k worth of BTC haha
<popey> yeah, i forget about it for a while now and then
<popey> then check the price
<Azelphur> popey: you might be interested in dumping some of that cash into one of the bitcoin banks (make your money work for you \o/)
<ali1234> lol
<ali1234> there are no bitcoin banks worth trusting
<Azelphur> or as ali1234 points out, have the bank run away with your money and laugh at you
<Azelphur> xD
 * Azelphur is banking on the former
<ali1234> they are all pass throughs for the pirate ponzi scheme
<popey> heh
<popey> i bought most of mine back when they were ~2USD/coin
<Azelphur> I have my money spread out between a lot of investments, so assuming the whole house of cards doesn't come crumbling down it should be good
<Azelphur> popey: 6.9% a week is hard to turn down though :P
<popey> depends how much time/effort/cost is involved
<Azelphur> make account > put money into account > put feet up and either A) Watch your money grow, or B) Watch your money disappear
<Azelphur> xD
<Azelphur> that said there's been no known cases of the banks defaulting (yet)
<ali1234> that's because every single one of them just takes your money and puts it in pirate
<ali1234> also, bitcoinica defaulted
<Azelphur> ali1234: bitcoinica wasn't a bank, and while there are a lot of pirate passthroughs, there are lots of others too :)
<ali1234> bitcoinica was a bank actually
 * Azelphur shrugs
<ali1234> they were paying interest on deposits near the end
<Azelphur> I avoided it from the get go anyway
<ali1234> it's certainly more of a bank than pirate
<ali1234> i mean they had a disclosed business mode, even if it was stupid
<Azelphur> that pretty much goes with what I was saying anyway, it's risky :)
<Azelphur> but the rewards can be good too, I'm up >50% on my initial investment with pirate now
<popey> what does "puts it in pirate" mean?
<Azelphur> sorry, >100%
<directhex> i assume bitcoin difficulty currently means you need a cluster of 4-gpu machines working for 72 hours per coin
<Azelphur> popey: pirate runs a bank
<ali1234> popey: pirate runs a ponzi scheme
<Azelphur> opinions are fun :D
<ali1234> he pays 6.9% interest per WEEK
<ali1234> he has never disclosed how he does this
<ali1234> nobody knows who he is
<ali1234> his ponzi scheme has minimum investment limits
<ali1234> and he has a pyramid scheme type system for "resellers"
<popey> right
<Azelphur> he also pays out, and so far nobody actually has any proof that he's a ponzi scheme
<ali1234> basically do not touch it with a long stick
<Azelphur> he also has a huge trading reputation on -otc
<popey> and then one day everyone tries to withdraw their money...
<Azelphur> popey: all banks fall over if there is a run on the bank
<Azelphur> so that's kinda a null point
<Azelphur> but yea, it is a gamble to invest in pirate, high risk high reward, I've taken huge payouts from pirate.
<ali1234> the difference between pirate and a bank is a bank fails if everyone withdraws their balance
<ali1234> pirate ponzi fails if everyone tries to withdraw their interest
<Azelphur> ali1234: you realise most of the resellers default to pay out the interest, right?
<ali1234> so what?
<ali1234> most is not 100%
<Azelphur> lol
<ali1234> as soon as new suckers stop buying it it will default
<Azelphur> ali1234: but yea, I've already made the amount I put in back, so as usual I've already won :)
<Azelphur> worst case scenario I come out with 0, back where I started
<Azelphur> XD
<ali1234> when it happens people will be shocked to find there is no money and pirate is just some 14 yo kid in his parents basement who recently bought a ferrari despite having no job
<Azelphur> haha
<Azelphur> ali1234: and in the meantime I'm happily bringing in Â£300+ a week worth of btc in interest payments alone :D
<bigcalm> Have you tried converting any of that into real money?
<Azelphur> bigcalm: yup, huge amounts.
<Azelphur> I have converted about Â£2,000 out, and I have approaching Â£15,000 in.
<Azelphur> I'm playing for a house :p
<mungojerry> MartijnVdS, ended up using gnuplot :D
<mungojerry> Azelphur, but your capital remains in the pirate bank?
<mungojerry> take it out now and you win
<Azelphur> mungojerry: no, I've actually withdrew (and spent) most of my initial investment
<mungojerry> ah ok
<mungojerry> then you are the near the bootom of the pyramid
<Azelphur> admittedly straight back into the bitcoin economy, but nothing to do with pirate :p
<mungojerry> these schemes only work on jealousy. because the whole idea of bitcoin is crazy, but so long as you hear of peple making money, then suckers keep coming
<extrasolar> anyone here still use Hams?
<mungojerry> a bit like the dotcom bubble in the 90s
<Azelphur> if it is indeed a ponzi, which is unprozen at present :)
<mungojerry> well, it pretty much is proven since the new investors money pays the interest
<ali1234> nobody can prove it is a ponzi until it defaults
<Azelphur> how do you know that?
<Azelphur> indeed
<ali1234> this is true of all ponzis
<mungojerry> when that stops everyone loses evertything
<ali1234> what's the minimum investment now? 1000 btc/$12000?
<Azelphur> ali1234: something like that, he usually only deals with passthrough people now
<extrasolar> Doesn't it cost more in electicity
<extrasolar> than the value of the bitcoins?
<Azelphur> extrasolar: nope
<extrasolar> in that case, sounds worth it
<extrasolar> how easy is it to change them to real currency
<Azelphur> relatively easy assuming you have a bank account
<ali1234> the elctricity cost is about 75-90% the value of the bitcoins
<Azelphur> it's about 50% for me, mining on a old GPU rig
<Azelphur> (Mining on standard PC hardware is unprofitable in the majority of cases, and will soon be unprofitable in all cases)
<extrasolar> interesting
<extrasolar> what are the cons?
<extrasolar> what's the deal....
<Azelphur> people like ali1234 run around calling everything a scam and a ponzi
<Azelphur> :D
<ali1234> the cons are that bitcoins might be worth nothing tomorrow
<extrasolar> ah
<Azelphur> ^ that's a valid con
<Azelphur> brb :p
<extrasolar> how about exchanging them daily?
<Azelphur> you can do that
<ali1234> also if you are not extremely paranoid you will get scammed or hacked
<directhex> i made a few hundred then jumped ship
<grogoreo> hi
<grogoreo> In Unity 12.04 how can  you stop the window border and controls being put in the global menu?
<popey> not sure you can easily
<grogoreo> I wondered if you could just delete one of the ayatana packages, but still keep the global menu
<Azelphur> hmm, should I give someone a negative/neutral rating on ebay for taking a full 10 days to dispatch an item?
<czajkowski> Azelphur: depends when they said they would
<czajkowski> some say they wont post till x day which could be after you paid as they only go to a post office some days
<Azelphur> well I ordered it, waited for the estimated delivery, contacted him and he said he was sorry and he'd ship it tomorrow, then he didn't ship it for another 4 days -_-
<czajkowski> well if everything ese was fine mark it down on shipping
<czajkowski> or communication
<Azelphur> yea
<Azelphur> the delay in shipping is making me think it's a stolen phone, I have a sneaky suspicion
<Azelphur> will have to find a way to check the IMEI when it gets here
<TheOpenSourcerer> If you find out could you be done for receiving stolen goods?
<Azelphur> I doubt it, not if I report it
<TheOpenSourcerer> Did you pay with PayPal.
<Azelphur> yep
<TheOpenSourcerer> OK should be able to get it refunded then.
<Azelphur> indeed
<czajkowski> Azelphur: did the seller have a good rating ?
<Azelphur> czajkowski: he had like 25 good feedbacks
<Azelphur> bit low but I figured I'd go with it
<czajkowski> not a lot
<Azelphur> but yea, with the multiple delays in shipping I'm tempted to say it was the time required to "procure" the phone
<Azelphur> so will definitely check it when it gets here
<Pendulum> Azelphur: where did it ship from?
<Azelphur> Pendulum: UK
<Pendulum> Azelphur: Ah, okay. I have a friend who works for a mobile phone seller (handles phones from multiple providers) where they've started having real problems with people buying phones on a contract, then selling the phones on ebay to Europe and defaulting on the contract
<Azelphur> fun
<Pendulum> because they default on the contract, it means the seller has to reimburse the provider for the phone
<ali1234> hopefully it becomes such a problem that they quit doing that whole "free phone then you pay 3x over in monthly fees" deal
<Pendulum> so they've started getting extra strict on verifying credit (in fact during the "credit verification call" the provider will ask the seller if they think it's a legit sale or not and will turn down if they say no)
<sebsebseb> hi
<jacobw> evenage
<jacobw> bavarian holidday tomorrow \o/
<christel> \o/
<brobostigon> o/
<brobostigon> beer :)
<davmor2> christel: how's your break?
<christel> it could be worse! :D
<davmor2> christel: Yeah you could be at home :D
<christel> hahaha
<christel> i like it at home tho :P
<sebsebseb> christel: oh your in Norway?
<sebsebseb> I assume
<christel> i am indeed :)
<sebsebseb> Why' that anyway, got relatives there? Or just a holiday?
<christel> visiting family yeah :)
<sebsebseb> You're part Norweigan?
<christel> i am entirely norwegian!
<sebsebseb> oh
<Pendulum> sebsebseb: you sound a bit disappointed there
<jacobw> (viking)
<sebsebseb> Pendulum: lol why?
 * sebsebseb half Sweed
<Pendulum> sebsebseb: the "oh" just came across slight disappointed to me for some reason
<sebsebseb> Pendulum: no it was like a oh right, well meant to have been one
<davmor2> christel: I'd of said mostly mad, with part hilarious myself, but you kid yourself that you are entirely Norwegian if it makes you feel better ;)
<sebsebseb> been like that
<christel> davmor2: :P
<christel> i am not sure i could feel any better...
<davmor2> christel: Sorry couldn't resist :)
<Pendulum> christel: that's because you're perfect the way you are ;)
<christel> davmor2: oh irresistible too...
<christel> Pendulum: <3
<davmor2> christel: :) hahaha, indeed :)
<SuperEngineer> Only one hour to go before it's #UUPC100  :D
<christel> oh so it is!
<sebsebseb> I don't normally listen to Ubuntu UK Podcast, have a bit before though
<sebsebseb> ,but i'll take part in this one Live  in IRC :d
<christel> :D
<sebsebseb> christel: :D :D
<sebsebseb> christel: So I assume your fluent at Norweigan, but what you like at the similar Swedish language? :D
<christel> pretty decent ;)
<sebsebseb> ockj :)
<christel> hehe
<jacobw> dang, no coffee left :(
<christel> aw
<christel> make moar coffee!
<jacobw> i'm totally out of coffee
 * jacobw doesn't remember this ever happening before
<christel> oh wow
<jacobw> i guess i'll just have to go to sleep :P
<christel> haha
<christel> not go out to buy coffee!?
<jacobw> everything seems to close at 8 here
<jacobw> i need to go for a walk anyway, so i'll find out soon
<christel> hehe
<jacobw> i'm enjoying mad men far too much right now
<sebsebseb> jacobw: That's the show they put on Sky Atlatnic I think
<sebsebseb> don't get that channel oh well
<sebsebseb> there's  Mad Dogs and Mad Men
<jacobw> mad men :)
<sebsebseb> there was another show with a similar name showing on Sky One
<jacobw> sad men?
<jacobw> er, or suits
<ali1234> anybody know what WER*.tmp.hdmp files are?
<ali1234> ok, they are crash reports
<brobostigon> x-files, :)
<diplo> evening all
<bigcalm> Hi diplo
<christel> diplo!! how was camping? :D
<christel> (and hi bigcalm!)
<diplo> christel: Enjoyable but exhausting!
<christel> :D
<diplo> I can barely move now, off to sleep shortly i think
<diplo> 4 loads of washing done already
<christel> hehe
<christel> well done!
<bigcalm> Hey hey christel :)
<christel> HALLO
<zleap> hello
<christel> heya zleap! \o/
<zleap> hows you
<christel> i am well! yourself? :)
<zleap> i am good
<zleap> working on the club website atm, well nearly finished,  updating stuff
<christel> :D
<zleap> i keep finding stuff to respond to mainly
<christel> hehe
<christel> is that good (or bad?)
<zleap> good really,  its simple stuff mainly
<zleap> e.g messagfe on news page about needing new players for under 6/7 so i responded with an e-mail addy for the coach
<zleap> also put stuff on the forum,  which I know people ready as  I posted a message about the raspberry PI got 39 people reading it
<christel> :D
<zleap> yeah its called sneaking in a plug cos I can :)
<zleap> well a plug disguised as asking if anyone else has one
<christel> *grin*
<zleap> yep
<zleap> which reminds me the devon and cornwall thread on the rasp pi site has gone quiet,
<zleap> it was qujite acive for a few days well me and another user
<zleap> quite
<christel> i am pondering embracing my inner gay and buying a new case for my pi (http://www.pibow.com/pages/pre-order-a-pibow.html -- they are supercute)
<zleap> yeah that looks nice
<zleap> i am getting a basic case friday
<mgdm> I didn't get a preorder code thing for a PI
<mgdm> no idea how I'm going to get one now :)
<zleap> hmm
<zleap> they should e-mail you when you can order
<mgdm> well, I never signed up
<zleap> ah
<mgdm> so I think I'll be waiting around about (2^32) - 1 years
<christel> aw
<zleap> naa,  the are making something like 4000 a week atm and you can order more than one
<christel> zleap: i just have one of those laser cut crust cases atm -- that one is cute though (the pibow)
<mgdm> I know someone with a 3D printer and a laser cutter
<mgdm> I can make my own case
<mgdm> \o/
<christel> mind some guy that turned up to AlanBell's jam had a wicked awesome case made from lego :D
<Dave2> mmm, jam
<zleap> yeah the pibow looks really nice,  however i just ordered a basic one as it simply protects my Pi from damage, I can take it places without worrying about it getting damaged or use it with out worrying about short circuits etc
<christel> :)
 * zleap hopes to demo at work when i get back in september - teachers seem interested
<christel> :D
<zleap> not sure if schools have lots of monitos with hdmi input,   may be something they can get for the after school IT club or something initially
<bigcalm> Keep forgetting that json doesn't like optional , on the last element in an array
 * bigcalm un-breaks stuff
<christel> bigcalm == toni braxton
 * bigcalm is pretty :)
<christel> ajaja
<christel> er ahaha
<MartijnVdS> kekeke?
<christel> i'm azn. kekeke
<christel> dus dus.
<MartijnVdS> Zzz o'clock
<christel> nn MartijnVdS, slaap lekker!
<MartijnVdS> christel: dankje! :)
<christel> <3
<bigcalm> Sleep now :)
#ubuntu-uk 2012-08-15
<AlanBell> morning all
<diplo> Morning all
<Azelphur> :( ebuyer are now irritating me too, Buy a nexus 7 they said, free next day shipping they said...what they actually meant was Â£7.99 for two day shipping xG
<Azelphur> XD
<DJones> If you have android and you don't have flash player installed and are likely to ever want it in future, http://www.theregister.co.uk/2012/08/14/adobe_pull_android_flash_wendesday/
<Azelphur> yay
<DJones> Has anybody come across a working way of having a google drive mounted as a folder yet in ubuntu, last time I looked the google-docs-fs seemed to have vanished/been disabled
<bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
<ali1234> nice. well i guess it isn't same to write to NTFS any more with ubuntu
<ali1234> anything you write just ends up in lost files
<brobostigon> good morning everyone.
<czajkowski> aloha
<brobostigon> morning czajkowski
<brobostigon> today is going to be interesting, humid, heavy winds, and heavy rain.
<christel> PRETTIES <3
<brobostigon> morning christel
<christel> helllooooo brobostigon and awesomekowski!
<bigcalm> Good morning awake people :)
<brobostigon> morning bigcalm :)
<christel> "awake"
<brobostigon> just about/
<diplo> <-- Asleep if I'm honest!
 * diplo is not really functioning today
<brobostigon> last night, i actually got some sleep, first in weeks.
<bigcalm> Started the day with a shower. Feeling more awake than I usually do
<mungojerry> started the day with half-hour of train delays and a packed train :(
<bigcalm> Working from home has it's perks :)
<mungojerry> read a blog post about calligra author, looks interesting but seems to be vapourware atm?
<mungojerry> strange that the announcement was the start of a project but was worded like a first release
<mungojerry> is this the ugliest app around? http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-chUMkxEmTrc/UCkdrQd2VFI/AAAAAAAAAH8/er4ilQcyXoQ/s1600/amarok-2.6.0-screenie-take-1-orig.png
<christel> i didnt go to bed all that late so i have no idea why i am so tired today
<ali1234> it doesn't look any worse than other KDE app
<ali1234> oxygen theme is really the only thing wrong with it
<MartijnVdS> "Ooh there's some unused space. Let's add more bells and whistles!"
<popey> kde still looks like a bad shareware app from the 80's
<ali1234> have you guys used windows recently?
<ali1234> it looks exactly like KDE
<ali1234> everything has menus and tabs and ribbons
<ali1234> and side panels
<mungojerry> windows 7 did look a lot like kde 4
<ali1234> windows just has a nicer theme... and nicer fonts
<ali1234> and a slightly more sane taskbar
<mungojerry> the amarok screenshot is so cluttered and incongruous
<mungojerry> it used to be a nice looking app in the 1.4 days
<ali1234> that amarok screenshot is a massive improvement over what it used to look like
<mungojerry> no way
<ali1234> in like 2.0
<mungojerry> ok
<mungojerry> 2.0 has loads of bare spare in weird places
<ali1234> this is what 2.0 looked like: http://al.robotfuzz.com/~al/random/kdefail.png
<mungojerry> 2.6 is still an affront to my eyes
<ali1234> they finally got the vertical text to be in the middle of the tabs
<Azelphur> ah, gotta love ebay
<Azelphur> what you ordered: Item condition new, Galaxy S3 in perfect condition, comes with box, charger and earphones
<Azelphur> what you got: galaxy S3 with scratches and holes punched in the casing, no earphones, no box, and screen lock still turned on.
<Azelphur> LOL AND THE CHARGER IS BROKE
<MartijnVdS> Azelphur: so.. file complaint with ebay/paypal, get money back
<Azelphur> yea, I'm gonna
<Azelphur> gonna message him first to see what he says
<mungojerry> not much he can say is there?
<mungojerry> he lied
<Azelphur> ye
<Azelphur> p
<Azelphur> http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=221091503643&ssPageName=ADME:X:RTQ:GB:1123#ht_500wt_1415 is what I ordered xD
<Azelphur> gonna snap some photos lol
<MartijnVdS> Azelphur: exactly what I was going to suggest
<MartijnVdS> Azelphur: ebay may ask for proofs
<Pendulum> morning
<Azelphur> photos are uploading...
<DJones> Azelphur: Looks dodgy to start with "selling due to upgrade" :)
<Azelphur> indeed xD
<Azelphur> https://www.dropbox.com/sh/x1btb0c9w9futq4/3mEOQEpIEW photos
<Azelphur> http://pastebin.com/TgqZi6U5 is what I'm thinking of sending to the seller, sound good?
<MartijnVdS> Those holes.. did it drop off the back of a lorry or something?
<Azelphur> god knows man, seriously lol
<Azelphur> this has clearly taken a heavy beating
<MartijnVdS> the password suggests stolenness
<Azelphur> especially image 3 of 10, you can't see it properly in the photo but that hole goes right through to the inner casing
<Azelphur> I thought that too, I should check the IMEI
<MartijnVdS> Azelphur: next time, http://www.clove.co.uk/samsung-galaxy-s3-blue ;)
<Azelphur> hehe
<Azelphur> only Â£142 more XD
<Azelphur> also just what I always needed, norton!
<MartijnVdS> just sell a bitcoin 8-)
<Azelphur> haha
<Azelphur> hmm, this thing has a password lock on it
<Laney> yeah, clearly nicked
<Azelphur> oh that's good the IMEI is on the back
<MartijnVdS> behind the battery, usually
<Azelphur> yea
<Azelphur> that's weird the IMEI has slashes in it and this site I'm using says it should only be numbers
<MartijnVdS> Azelphur: sometimes they add dashes for readability
<Azelphur> ah
<Azelphur> so just truncate the dashes
<MartijnVdS> Azelphur: as long as you have the 15-16 digits you're good
<Azelphur> yep, at least it doesn't appear to be stolen
<Azelphur> MartijnVdS: there's a sticker on the inside behind the battery, small square, and it's got X's all over it, is that the water damage indicator telling me it's been water damaged?
<MartijnVdS> Azelphur: no idea
<Azelphur> to the internets
<Azelphur> nope, that's not water damage, that's at least one point in it's favour
<mgdm> the water damage things are smalll cicles of paper with ink on the back
<mgdm> if it gets wet, the ink goes through
<Azelphur> yea
<Azelphur> lol the inside of the phone is so dusty too
<Azelphur> message sent
<jacobw> morning
<directhex> looks nicked to me
<directhex> nicked but unreported?
<directhex> "selling due to upgrade" - upgrade from sg3? to what, a bullion bar with an antenna in the top?
<mungojerry> is there a password on the lock screen
<mungojerry> lol, so he couldn't unlock it so sold it
<directhex> er, you're not the only scamee.
<directhex> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/221090440055#ht_500wt_1182 - negative feedback
<directhex> "Acts like a scammer and doesn't deny it. Never do anything outside paypal."
<jacobw> quick question, i'm working on a package that's >1GB unpacked, i don't want to repack it each time i change the DEBIAN/ files, i can't imagine the packagers unpack and repack large packages all the time
<directhex> Azelphur, looks like a hacked ebay account. it's their first time selling ever, and it's a nicked mobile phone?
<gord> jacobw: thus, foo and foo-data packages
<directhex> jacobw, you don't change DEBIAN/
<Azelphur> directhex: it's not nicked as far as I know
<mungojerry> my friend had his gmail hacked, and immediately they started buying of ebay
<directhex> DEBIAN/ is machine generated from debian/ in the source package. if you're editing DEBIAN/ you're doing it wrong. also what gord said
<Azelphur> directhex: yea, I noticed that, that feedback was placed after I bought it I guess
<Azelphur> he had 100% when I bought it
<directhex> Azelphur, sure. but it *is* though. it's a nicked phone on a nicked account.
<Azelphur> directhex: how do you know that?
<davmor2> morning all
<davmor2> czajkowski: prod
<jacobw> directhex: that makes sense, however i'm not packaging for the debian project, i'm just packaging for my own repository
<czajkowski> davmor2: ello
<directhex> jacobw, your call. you're just generating work for yourself is all.
<mgdm> morning campers
<jacobw> directhex: mysql-cluster-server being dropped from precise is generating work for me ;)
<popey> how is that 1GB!?
<directhex> Azelphur, you think a user who's never sold anything on ebay before suddenly has two never-used brand-new galaxy s3's spare due to an upgrade, which are neither new nor unused, and sells them on ebay?
<Azelphur> directhex: he had 100% (25) feedback, that's not nothing, admittedly not much
<jacobw> popey: oracle's package for squeeze (which only unpacks their binary distribution for squeeze to /opt) is statically built
<popey> golly
<directhex> Azelphur, 25 positive feedback *as a buyer*
<Azelphur> ah
<jacobw> i understand why it was dropped from precise, because the release from oracle wasn't ready in time and it was unclear what was going on at oracle
<Azelphur> seller just got back to me, http://pastebin.com/rd92Cyfi
<directhex> Azelphur, fingers crossed. still 101% super dodgy
<Azelphur> indeed
<mungojerry> it might be one s3
<jacobw> can you bump your $overall_rating by buying from yourself and returning positive reviews?
<AlanBell> these accounts buy stuff from each other for 1p each
<popey> sounds like bs
<mungojerry> and the first attempt to sell failed
<directhex> Azelphur, an any-condition sgs3 goes for Â£300 at fonebank.com, if he wanted to sell a knackered phone for lots of cash he could have done
<AlanBell> jacobw: if you have multiple sock puppet accounts
<Azelphur> directhex: *shrug*
<popey> looks like delaying tactics
<directhex> Azelphur, you paid via paypal?
<Azelphur> directhex: yup
<directhex> well, there's that at least, ifwhen he fails to give you a refund
<Azelphur> yea
<Azelphur> I've been told you can chargeback a direct debit?
<directhex> chargeback against paypal? yikes, i wouldn't
<Azelphur> apparently they just take it straight from the seller
<directhex> paypal dispute procedure is much less likely to result in lawyerage
 * Azelphur shrugs
<directhex> ebay is stacked against sellers these days. show good faith by waiting his little waiting period, then file a formal dispute via ebay
<directhex> you'll get your money back, and be wiser
<Azelphur> guess so
<Azelphur> it's tempting to try and scam him back, but probably not a wise move
<popey> *boggle*
<directhex> terrible move. you'll lose your money
<Azelphur> indeed
<Azelphur> I shall go the sane route and wait
<directhex> play by ebay's rules. they're brutally stacked against sellers.
<Azelphur> yea
<Azelphur> plus I got all this evidence, hard for him to really have a leg to stand on
<popey> the description doesn't say "original box"
<popey> it just says "box"
<directhex> it does say new though.
<Azelphur> popey: hehe I noticed, but that doesn't change the new, perfect condition, earphones, etc
<directhex> Condition:	
<directhex> New: A brand-new, unused, unopened and undamaged item in original retail packaging (where packaging is applicable). If the item comes direct from a manufacturer, it may be delivered in non-retail packaging, such as a plain or unprinted box or plastic bag. See the seller's listing for full details.
<popey> ahh
 * AlanBell wonders if the holes are because it was a working display unit in a store that got ripped off the fixture
<directhex> AlanBell, store display units are very VERY rarely real phones. they keep real phones behind the counter
<Azelphur> I plugged the IMEI into a stolen phone finder, and into google and got nothing
<AlanBell> I was in CPW farnham when two lads walked in an nicked an iphone
<Azelphur> so if it has been stolen, nobody has bothered to register it
<directhex> yeah, iphone is an exception, they have real display units. people are too reverential to damage them
<directhex> seen the abuse all other display units get?
<AlanBell> they had a display stand with a working iphone on it, the little lad ripped it off and ran out with it the big guy walked out slowly making sure nobody followed
<directhex> scum are scum, news at 11
<popey> i doubt the IMEI would show up online
<directhex> Azelphur, plenty of idiots wouldn't think to report their phone nicked
<Azelphur> true
<popey> and the networks aren't obliged to share that data
<directhex> i don't know my imei, but wp7 has remote lock/wipe
<popey> you could phone each uk network and tell them you bought a phone and ask if they supplied it :)
<popey> they dont have to tell you of course
<popey> but you could try
<Azelphur> popey: it's a 3 phone
<Azelphur> (it's branded)
<popey> that makes things easier :)
<Azelphur> I wonder if 3 would tell me if it was stolen if I called them
<directhex> they'd know who they sold the phone to, by imei
 * Azelphur shrugs
<Azelphur> yea, I imagine a name wouldn't help me too much
<directhex> still, question remains r.e. dodgy description: what does one upgrade to from an sgs3?
<Azelphur> directhex: some people like iphones xD
<DJones> Aren't the operators required to block all reported stolen phones now by IMEI anyway, I thought that was brought in across Europe last year
<directhex> yeah, i'm sure he paid for a retail sim-free iphone
<popey> heh, i did :)
<directhex> weirdo
<directhex> when you could buy a lumia 710 for a hundred quid
<popey> still no phones to match it :)
<Azelphur> lol
<directhex> wife is considering selling her htc sensation, and buying something on wp7. largely due to battery life. wp7 goes miles further on the same size battery
<MartijnVdS> DJones: they do it in the UK, but in the Netherlands we don't have a stolen-SIM-register
<MartijnVdS> directhex: because it can do less :P
<popey> because it stays in your pocket?
<directhex> popey, she can burn through most of the battery in less than an hour of active use. i can use mine as an mp3 player for 4 hours, actively use it for browsing etc for 2 hours, and still have 60% battery
<popey> golly
<popey> my htc hero was a bit rubbish on battery
<Azelphur> I never run out of battery on anything ever http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=170846891179
<MartijnVdS> My Galaxy Nexus can go for more than a day of moderate use
<MartijnVdS> I _can_ burn the battery in a few hours if I want to.. but I don't want to :)
<Azelphur> my solution wins, game over :P
<directhex> she's also suffering from a horrid stuttering issue. frequently the ui just goes totally unresponsive, takes ~30 seconds to react to taps
<MartijnVdS> Azelphur: you just buy a new phone every time the battery runs out? :P
<Azelphur> MartijnVdS: hahaha
<Azelphur> MartijnVdS: 15,000mAh portable battery, it can charge my laptop and phone multiple times
<Azelphur> well my old laptop anyway, it doesn't seem to be compatible with my new lenovo :<
 * TheOpenSourcerer finds the battery life on his S3 to be most excellent.
 * Azelphur shall try and hack it
<Azelphur> TheOpenSourcerer: did you see my brand new perfect condition S3 photos? XD
<jussi> TheOpenSourcerer: I agree, I find similar
<ormiret> Azelphur: what kind of laptop did you have that 67Whr was enough to charge it multiple times?
<davmor2> my s3 is much better now I have full charged it a few times
<Azelphur> ormiret: inspiron mini duo, I only got the battery recently, but it did a full charge on it and the battery still had >50% remaining
<directhex> every time i use an android phone, it's slow, unresponsive, and has crap battery. every time i moan about it, i'm told "oh, yeah, that happened on old phones. you need a new one, with moar cores and moar ram, it doesn't do that anymore"
<directhex> and then i use a new one, with moar cores and moar ram. know what happens next?
<Azelphur> it bursts into flames?
<directhex> it's slow, unresponsive, and has crap battery. so i moan about it.
<TheOpenSourcerer> Azelphur: Nice. My S3 is in much better condition and I was one of the first to get one in the UK.
<directhex> and i'm told "oh, yeah, that happened on old phones. you need a new one, with moar cores and moar ram, it doesn't do that anymore"
 * Laney is still on N900 yo
<Azelphur> directhex: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kDsOtdRtG0Q&t=0m35s very slow phone here :p
<Azelphur> TheOpenSourcerer: nice :)
<TheOpenSourcerer> And I still haven't got round to buying a case...
<Azelphur> hehe
<directhex> i loved the pre3, but it was soooooo buggy
<directhex> i mean, crazy buggy
<directhex> no idea how they shipped it so buggy
<TheOpenSourcerer> WebOS is/was quite a ncie GUI in concept.
<directhex> worse than evolution in precise
<directhex> i didn't like the n9 one bit
<directhex> better than the n900, maybe even by a couple of orders of magnitude
<directhex> in that it took me a week to decide "er, no" not 15 minutes
<directhex> pre3 was <3, if not for the bugs.
<directhex> e.g. memory leak. it never freed memory in apps you quit, so it needed rebooting frequently
<directhex> actually i think it was file descriptors or mountpoints or something it leaked, not memory, but some finite resource was never freed
<directhex> and the mp3 player paused every few songs. infuriating!
<directhex> loved the hardware and the ui. loved them. so nice.
<directhex> battery life was on the short side, but better than htc sensation.
<directhex> also, very hackable. real linux.
<directhex> well..... real gnu. not "real linux". android kernel, since all embedded cpu devs these days only make android kernels
<brobostigon> interesting,
<Azelphur> directhex: you know what I should do, ask for a partial refund (Â£100) and then sell it to that site you mentioned for a profit XD
<Azelphur> if it goes to dispute resolution anyway
<AlanBell> then you get in trouble for selling a nicked phone
<Azelphur> good point, *avoids that too*
<jacobw> i think you should restrict yourself to backtracking only :)
<Azelphur> indeed
<Azelphur> it's #androids fault, they keep suggesting I do bad things
 * Azelphur points
<jacobw> haven't you read 'do android dream of electric sheep'?, they're all out to get us :p
<Azelphur> haha
<mungojerry> is the picture quality degraded if i use a vga-vga cable rather than hdmi-hdmi cable from laptop to 24 in ch monitor
<AlanBell> yes
<gord> technically yes, you won't notice the difference
<mungojerry> even if i'm working 1ft away?
<AlanBell> you will notice the difference if you are using it as a monitor for text and general computerish stuff
<mungojerry> not sure if it's the monitor or the cable
<AlanBell> movies you will get away with it
<mungojerry> doing text and close stuff
<gord> eh what makes you think you'll notice the difference?
<mungojerry> seems a bit dim and colours are a bit meh
<AlanBell> because I notice the difference on my monitors between VGA and HDMI
<mungojerry> even thought i've played with the monitor settings
<gord> i think you have a dodgy monitor then ;)
<mungojerry> the monitor only takes vga/dvi/dp
<mungojerry> i have vga-vga or hdmi-hdmi
<AlanBell> it might vary according to the quality of your VGA port (on the computer side mostly I expect)
<ormiret> depends on your general noise environment and the DAC + ADC for the analogue path and how well shielded the cable is etc. Generally better off sticking to digital formats.
<mungojerry> ok i just stole my colleagues hdmi-dvi cable and the difference is huge
<AlanBell> yus, no need for gold plated connectors on digital formats ;)
<mungojerry> the text is now clear and the calrity and colours are better
<gord> i think you guys just have badly calibrated monitors ;) the signals are comparible unless you are doing something horrible like interlacing
<popey> i have two monitors next to eachother driven from the same machine, one VGA, one DisplayPort, both are identical
<AlanBell> there is a teeny tiny bit of bleed between pixels which makes it less sharp for me with VGA
<mungojerry> the difference is very real here
<Azelphur> popey++, my 4 monitors, one of them is an E2607WS (with DVI) while the others are E2607WSV (VGA Only), and you cannot tell the difference at all side by side
<Azelphur> and I used them for like 3 years, so any differences between them I would have most likely noticed
<AlanBell> yeah, probably decent graphic cards do fine, this is a built in laptop port
<popey> this is built in laptop :)
<AlanBell> yeah, but yours is a nice thinkpad and mine is a cheap Samsung (that I like very much)
<jacobw> mungojerry: you can get cheap hdmi/dvi adapters
<mungojerry> for the time being i hope that my colleague will not notice ...it was dangling unused
<mungojerry> another strange effect is that swapping my wireless keyboard for a wired one has sped up my typing
<mungojerry> does forwarding spam SMS to 7726 do anything?
<mungojerry> apparently it reports it to your network provider
<mungojerry> outlook.com reports 4 messages in my inbox. only 2 there.
<popey> i have exactly two mails in my outlook.com inbox
<popey> "Getting started with hotmail"
<popey> "Get to know what's new in outlook"
<Azelphur> yay for microsoft spam
<mungojerry> popey, almost the same, but it thinks theres 4
<mungojerry> did you get popey@outlook
<popey> nope
<mungojerry> thats cos i got 5 aliases and nicked it :)
<mungojerry> *may not be true
<popey> i dont plan on using it, so I don't care
<mungojerry> nor me, but hey
<popey> just looked in to see what the fuss was about
<mungojerry> ditto everybody else
<mungojerry> they don't do the dot thing
<mungojerry> so mungojerry@  is different from mungo.jerry
<mungojerry> to be fair, gmail is the only one i've seen do that
<popey> ok, so now I do have popey@outlook.com
<mungojerry> :D
<popey> :)
<mungojerry> balance restored to universe
<popey> hah
<directhex> i had 3700 new mail in my outlook account
<mungojerry> converted from hotmaail?
<directhex> mostly spam from 2010 and earlier. hotmail antispam didn't work prior to then
<mungojerry> which is why everyone moved to gmail in 2007
<davmor2> directhex: were 3000 of them Microsoft says I see you are using an incompatible operating system would you like to upgrade now, click link to install windows 7 now!
<mungojerry> mmm scampi lemon nik naks
<directhex> davmor2, lots of reported posts from a forum i moderate
 * mungojerry finds an appriopriate tshirt http://www.threadless.com/product/2047/Alt_of_Ctrl/?j=16954684
<jacobw> mungojerry: faster typing on a wired keyboard?
<mungojerry> yeah, i think it's because the wireless one had lame amount of key depress
<mungojerry> unsatisfying
<mungojerry> but from a human perspective it just felt more sluggish than the wired one
<mungojerry> ooh this looks cool, i wonder if i can get gnuplot to handle this http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tupper%27s_self-referential_formula
<jacobw> check out usbcore.autosuspend settings, sometimes the autosuspend settings for a USB port are set to turn it off after something like 0.1s of inactivitz
<jacobw> http://www.thinkwiki.org/wiki/How_to_reduce_power_consumption#USB_Subsystem
<jacobw> a value of -1 prevents autosuspending
<mungojerry> jacobw, interesting. i think i'll stick with the nicer wired kb but i'll bear that in mind when i use a tv under the telly with wireless kb
<mungojerry> what does  100.0%                      Device         Audio codec hwC0D0: Analog Devices mean in powertop?
<mungojerry> the other entries are 1us and stuff liek that
<MartijnVdS> it means your sound device is eating battery
<mungojerry> it's on my desktop, but could it cause slowness?
<mungojerry> this PC is allegedly faster than my previous work PC but is incredibly sluggish, especially at i/o
<MartijnVdS> could be, but unlikely... I guess
<mungojerry> today is boring :(
<directhex> set something on fire
<directhex> instant excitement
<mungojerry> or instant excrement
<mungojerry> owncloud is looking really decent nowadays
<directhex> wow. Â£250 keyboard, for the Azelphurs of the world. http://www.cyborggaming.com/strike7/
<mungojerry> don't think i've ever paid for a keyboard
<Laney> DAS KEYBOARD
<mungojerry> u1 are now doing referrals a la dropbox
<mungojerry> http://voices.canonical.com/ubuntuone/2012/08/15/invite-your-friends-and-get-more-free-storage/
<MartijnVdS> oooh
<Laney> I was going to go to town and buy my new telly this afternoon
<Laney> but the rain is mental :(
<christel> aww
<Laney> maybe I still will
<gord> crazy people who still go to shops to buy things
<Laney> can't beat a bit o'richer sounds
<directhex> RS are usually no more expensive than the interwebs
<directhex> for decent brands
<directhex> i think they even price match the internet, not that i've ever been able to call them on it
<directhex> http://www.richersounds.com/information/pricebeat
<Laney> their 5 year warranty is really rather cheap too
<Laney> which is mainly how they'll get away with not price matching amazon here i suspect
<directhex> picking up something in person > waiting for a terrible courier like city link to put a "you were out" card through the door
 * Laney dons snorkel and braves the river that once was known as Queens Road
<MartijnVdS> so.. Queens River?
<mungojerry> i don't shop in richard sounds due to their offensive staff
<directhex> offensive?
<mungojerry> i was in there an the bloke asked what stereo i had, then in his best pcworld eejit voice he said yeah i think my nans got that one
<mungojerry> to be precise i just chose not to frequent their london bridge store due to that kind of snobby attitude
<czajkowski> http://blog.launchpad.net/notifications/launchpad-downtime-august-16th  FYI folks
<mungojerry> a bit like when the boys in currys talking about linux users not having girlfriends right next to me after i asked for the eee pc running linux
<mungojerry> anyone running debian? does it have ubuntu one?
<SuperMatt> ok, just noticed something that has to change in quantal. If you hover your mouse over the dash button, it says "Dash Home" which seems more like an instruction rather than what it does.
<mungojerry> :D
<mungojerry> yabba dabbo dooo!
<SuperMatt> as instructions go, it's a pretty good instruction, but it's not what I want to do
<jacobw> mungojerry: it doesn't
<mungojerry> i was wondering what this bug is sying http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=594143
<lubotu3> Debian bug 594143 in wnpp "ITP: ubuntu-sso-client -- Ubuntu Single Sign-On client" [Wishlist,Fixed]
<mungojerry> i think that was the dependency for u1 in debian
<bittin> might go to UK in november or december
<gord> bring a coat
<gord> and a brolly
<popey> and a shovel
<gord> for our winter hibernation we have to build underground tunnels and houses like the wombles, so if you want to say hello you'll need to dig down
<popey> pfft, schoolboy error digging straight down
<popey> everyone knows that
<gord> might fall into lava?
<mungojerry> OH:"a straw man is better than none"
<popey> exactly
<MartijnVdS> nice: http://paste.ubuntu.com/1149013/
<bittin> =D
<bittin> going with Norwegian some random strange girl from the internets wanted to meet me :D
<MartijnVdS> bittin: probably a 40-year old man
<jacobw> christel?
<bittin> MartijnVdS, who knows :D
<bittin> jacobw, no some Anna
<MartijnVdS> bittin: Boten Anna?
<bittin> if not i guess i can hang around with some irc people :p
<bittin> MartijnVdS, nope
<MartijnVdS> bittin: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RYQUsp-jxDQ
<bittin> Boten Anna is a swedish thing
<jacobw> christel is a norwegian member of this channel :)
<bittin> MartijnVdS, i live in .SE i have heard that thingie before :D
<MartijnVdS> jacobw: s/a/the token// :P
<bittin> and MartijnVdS here is a better version: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZHWlzOBSmh0
<bittin> all shitty songs gets better on MOS6581
<bittin> MOS SID 6581 even
<MartijnVdS> MOS EISLEY
<bittin> but well i have 4-5 friends in UK
<bittin> i guess i can find somewhere to sleep if in trouble :D
<MartijnVdS> .. if you can get to them in time :P
<bittin> and if i go in Novembers its after my birthday and guess i will atleast get some money then
<bittin> *November
<jacobw> just find a bar that's open til 4am or something, and start your day early
<bittin> think i will just stay in 1 weeks
<bittin> jacobw, =D don't think i feel great doing that a whole week
<MartijnVdS> Hotels are supposed to be cheap now/soon
<bittin> ah well if i book now for November :D
<bittin> i think they are pretty cheap
<MartijnVdS> wow
<MartijnVdS> Chrome eats 400% CPU, until I go to youtube.. then it drops to 30%
<MartijnVdS> wut
<bittin> my friend is not moving to UK until Oct anyways
<bittin> now she lives in CZ
<MartijnVdS> strange people, moving around :)
<GirlyGirl> Hi, what do you guys expect the resale value of a 2010 corolla axio trd to be?
<bittin> i only know strange people :(
<popey> GirlyGirl, I'd look in autotrader
<popey> see what comparable models go for
<gord> popey: any idea what package is supposed to provide the org.gnome.desktop.wm.preferences gsettings schema?
<GirlyGirl> It has scratches on one door, damage to front and rear bumpers, denting on hood and a boot that doesn't always close so that would lower the value I guess
<popey> gord, not off the top of my head
<GirlyGirl> Blame the ex-owner for the scratch, me for the front damage and my sister for the rear damage lol
<gord> grumble
<bittin> you drive on the wrong side of the road there anyways :(
<popey> s/wrong/left/
<bittin> must try to not forgot that when going there
<MartijnVdS> yeah.. I want to go practice driving on the left
<GirlyGirl> bittin: Why would I drive on the wrong side?
<MartijnVdS> _before_ driving all the way to Cornwall in May :)
<bittin> GirlyGirl, iam in sweden and here we drive on right side :D
<MartijnVdS> so I might take a boat around Decemberish
<bittin> but i don't even have a drivers license
<MartijnVdS> bittin: you used to drive on the wrong side thoguh
<bittin> yepp
<bittin> but we stopped 1967
<bittin> years before i was born
<GirlyGirl> I'm still deciding different things here 1) Sell it as it is 2)Repair and sell 3) Cut the bumper with a saw and keep using it
<MartijnVdS> it's 2 years old.. wouldn't repair be worth it?
<GirlyGirl> MartijnVdS: You don't get parts as its not sold here ... only in Japan
<MartijnVdS> GirlyGirl: you don't need to, the repair people get the parts ;)
<GirlyGirl> MartijnVdS: I know but its too expensive
<GirlyGirl> because they need to get the parts
<MartijnVdS> GirlyGirl: how are the parts only available in Japan? Was the car specially imported?
<MartijnVdS> Because if the model was sold "normally" the parts should be available "normally"
<GirlyGirl> MartijnVdS: Its a second hand import
<GirlyGirl> Since the model is not sold here new, Toyota UK dealers refuse to service it
<GirlyGirl> besides its functional and the damage doesn't bother me that much .. just that the bumper touches the tyre
<MartijnVdS> what was the model again?
<GirlyGirl> Corolla Axio TRD
<MartijnVdS> I'd shop around for what people are willing to buy it for
<GirlyGirl> But I'm unlikely to get a replacement car for the money it sells
<MartijnVdS> but that depends on your situation really -- would selling it (and buying a new one) be cheaper than repair
<GirlyGirl> Thats why I thing I'll use it with the damage ... definitely the cheapest
<MartijnVdS> Open a savings account somewhere for the repair ;)
 * MartijnVdS 's SMART needed a spring replaced last month.. and tyres.. and some other small things
<GirlyGirl> Well I did repair the front once and it was expensive, then I felt like I wasted money when the same place got damaged again
<MartijnVdS> GirlyGirl: Keep it in mind when buying your next car ;)
<GirlyGirl> MartijnVdS: How would keeping that in mind help?
<MartijnVdS> by buying a car that's built more like a tank than this one, with readily available parts ;)
 * MartijnVdS afk for a run
 * brobostigon would so love a "handy2 mobile, equal to his nexus7, would rock.
 * GirlyGirl should buy a tank
<brobostigon> "handy"*
<brobostigon> mobile*
<brobostigon> oddity, the german word for mobile phone, colloquely, is 'handy' . very weird.
<brobostigon> slang*
<jacobw> brobostigon: i know, i live here/there, i find it odd
<brobostigon> jacobw: very odd, yes.
<popey> woah, my virgin superhub admin tool has changed
<Dave2> for some reason I parsed that as being a nonsensical statement from a bMotion.
<bittin> haha all girls in this movie is trying to pickup the math teacher :D
<MartijnVdS> bittin: Revenge of the Nerds?
<bittin> MartijnVdS, nope LOL :D
<bittin> http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1592873/
<bittin> Revenge of the nerds is actully good :D
<davmor2> popey: since I turned mine to modem only mode I haven't looked at it :D
<popey> what do you use behind it davmor2 ?
<davmor2> popey: my old router it was the only way I could make a connection last longer than an hour
<popey> hmm, i may do same
<popey> i have two networks here at the moment
<popey> which is a mess
<davmor2> popey: the only issue I have now is every now and again the memory on my old cheapo router gets full so I have to switch it off and on again :)  plug your router into the socket nearest the coax cable
<popey> http://techcrunch.com/2012/08/15/people-still-believe-in-nokia/
<popey> first comment...
<popey> "Yes! Love my Lumia, best phone I've ever had!"
<MartijnVdS> popey: people believe in lots of things that aren't real
<popey> "Marcos Pinedo Â· Regional Director, Developer & Platform - South East Asia at Microsoft"
<mgdm> there's a couple of WP7 fanbois in this offic
<MartijnVdS> WordPerfect 7?
<bittin> Windos Phone 7
<jacobw> android ftw
<popey> iOS ftw! :D
<davmor2> popey: surely you mean Ubuntu Phone FTW! right :)
<popey> if it existed, yeah
<davmor2> popey: what's wrong with just going with the concept till it does :)
<popey> non-existent products are hard to make phone calls on
<davmor2> popey: Your just creating flaws in the perfect solution :D
<popey> indeed
<ali1234> how much do yo reeeeeaaaaally use those smartphone  features?
<ali1234> i mean smartphones are nice and all that. the idea of having one anyway
<ali1234> but when i got one i never used it
<MartijnVdS> was this back in the '00s, when a Nokia 3650 was considered a "smart phone"?
<ali1234> no
<ali1234> the first smartphone i had was a windows mobile
<popey> i use mine near constantly
<MartijnVdS> I use mine as podcast/spotify player
<MartijnVdS> oh and calendar thingy
<MartijnVdS> and â¥ Google Now
<ali1234> for me the killer app is photo shync with g+ and u1
<ali1234> and maps
<MartijnVdS> g+ photo sync yes, that too
<ali1234> because i go everywhere on foot
<MartijnVdS> I've actually used turn-by-turn navigation while walking
<MartijnVdS> "Turn left here"
<MartijnVdS> it's a bit weird (it's late when saying the street names you turn into, imho), but it works :)
<ali1234> that's because it expects you to move faster
 * jacobw wonders if that's a joke or not
<ali1234> ok, i am not happy
<ali1234> ubuntu has totally corrupted this ntfs filesystem
<ali1234> files are randomly showing up as 0 bytes and it's bluescreening and freezing like crazy
<ali1234> now i've got to do a factory restore
<popey> nice
<ali1234> i can't report a bug because the wireless doesn't work, i can't report that bug either
<popey> no wired?
<ali1234> if you ever have a lenovo ideapad u410, do not attempt to use 12.04 with it
<popey> ali1234, http://askubuntu.com/questions/125529/wireless-doesnt-work-on-a-broadcom-bcm4312/126798#126798
<popey> ?
<ali1234> no, that isn't the problem
<bigcalm> Humble Indy Bundle for Android 3 nabbed \o/
<MartijnVdS> spacechem \o/
<ali1234> th wireless is detected, it sees my network and connects to it
<ali1234> but as soon as i send a packet it drops the connection and endlessly asks for password
<ali1234> it does that thing where it opens endless password dialogues
<ali1234> so if you walk away and come back there's like 50 of them
<ali1234> i hope this recovery system actually formats the drive
<ali1234> because there's serious FS corruption
<ali1234> it's called "onekey recovery" which sounds just a little bit too much like "wonkey"
<MartijnVdS> monkey recovery
<jacobw> ali1234: onecare sound worse in certain acents
<MartijnVdS> jacobw: Northern ones, mostly
<jacobw> :)
<ali1234> does ntfs have "formatted date"?
<ali1234> yes, http://superuser.com/questions/377339/is-it-possible-to-determine-when-a-ntfs-partition-was-created
<ali1234> hmm i think the fs corruption is caused because this system has a hybrid SSD/HD
<ali1234> in a software raid
<ali1234> something weird like that anyway
<jacobw> in the same raid?
<ali1234> dunno
<ali1234> i have no idea how it works
<jacobw> that sounds scary
<ali1234> yeah, well, OEM pcs usually are
<ali1234> this is why i only buy second hand old stuff
<popey> sounds plausible
<ali1234> this system has UEFI as well
<ali1234> no windows 8 though, it's disabled
<ali1234> security that is
<ali1234> you can enable it though i suppose
<directhex> another LCD-equipped keyboard. http://kotaku.com/5935044/razer-making-non+star-wars-version-of-its-fancy-star-wars-keyboard-and-the-lcd-panel-may-actually-be-useful-this-time
<bittin> is it true stores are closed in UK when its winter?
<jacobw> no
<bittin> okay
<AlanBell> yes, we all hibernate from November to February
<jacobw> the economy doesn't hibernate
<jacobw> despite george osbourne's claims to the contrary
<bittin> somone said you could not get any food in UK if you go there in November
<jacobw> that would imply a famine ;)
<AlanBell> someone has been teasing you
<bittin> AlanBell, ah good =)
<dogmatic69> o/
 * dogmatic69 has a little daughter now \o/
<bittin> o/
<jacobw> \o/
<AlanBell> yay dogmatic69 \o/
<dogmatic69> 6lb 0.5oz
<dogmatic69> tiny
<dogmatic69> 2.7kg for those using a decent measurement system :P
<mgdm> dogmatic69: congrats to you all :)
<dogmatic69> tx
<zleap> dogmatic69, congrats
<zleap> dogmatic69, v2.0 :D
<dogmatic69> hehe
<dogmatic69> thanks
<zleap> np
<Pendulum> dogmatic69: congrats!
<dogmatic69> tx Pendulum
<bittin> is any fun geekywise happening in UK end of November?
<zleap> bittin, what part of the UK u in ?
<bittin> zleap, going to London
<zleap> ok
<bittin> now iam in .SE :p
<zleap> not sure,  I am in Devon
<Pendulum> bittin: poke AlanBell. He seems to be the social organiser for that part of the country
<bittin> was planning to go US for vacation but seems UK was far more better
<zleap> http://www.linux-magazine.com/Resources/Event-Calendar
<zleap> event calander,  does look like much is happening in London but only scanned through it
 * AlanBell looks up from the beer
<bittin> now when BLIP Festival got canceled and i remember i knowed more people in UK
<AlanBell> London end of November, OK can do
<bittin> AlanBell, yeah can i do anything fun then :p
<bittin> if my friends are boring :D
<AlanBell> bring friends!
 * AlanBell decides to organise some eventy stuff
<bittin> :D
<zleap> sounds a good plan
<bittin> iam about to meet this random 18 year old girl from the internet :p
<zleap> ok
<bittin> but if she fails me i got some geeky friends that i know that works at Verizon :p
<bittin> but they live in nottingham
<bittin> that i actully meet before
 * AlanBell wonders if fossdem is a good thing to go to
<bittin> AlanBell, i heard its cool
<bittin> but never been there
<bittin> only opensource con i been to is FScons :p
<AlanBell> czajkowski is very keen on fossdem
<christel> fosdem is <3
<czajkowski> FOSDEM rocks
<christel> dogmatic69: congrats :)
<christel> AlanBell: how many eventy things have you organised now? :P
<AlanBell> none
 * AlanBell ponders and prevaricates
<christel> i need a happy hour when i return to england (and another jam!) and we need one when bigcalm is down in september
<christel> and we need a launch party in october i suspect
<christel> and a swedish party for bittin in november
<AlanBell> and something in November
<AlanBell> sauna party \o/
<christel> (which could double as a fancy dress party!)
<christel> ooh yes, sauna party! :D
<christel> and of course CHRISTMAS PARTY
<christel> :D
<bittin> :D
<bittin> ah well not sure if i go 1 weekend or 1-2 weeks
<christel> we can do a 2 week party!
<bittin> depends on if i find somewhere to sleep
<bittin> somone can buy this then: http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/555281510/drunk-quest
<bittin> :D
<christel> oh my! a drinking game
<christel> i am in!
<bittin> saw it in another irc channel seems fun
<bittin> but i should sleep now, cya later :)
<christel> god natt bittin!
<christel> sov gott!
<bittin> detsamma
<bittin> hej sÃ¥ lÃ¤nge :p
<christel> tack! hej hej \o
 * bigcalm peeks in due to being mentioned and thus emailed
<bigcalm> (Only happens when I'm disconnected from my proxy)
<Pendulum> bigcalm: christel is listing all the reasons for events that need to happen in the next few months
<christel> :D
<christel> of which you are one
<christel> (a reason that is)
<bigcalm> All of the reasons for beer?
<bigcalm> Hehe
<bigcalm> I can be an event if you like :P
<christel> oh you are such an event ;)
 * bigcalm has been on the Belgian beers again :D
<christel> <3 belgian beer
<bigcalm> Quite weak though at only 6.3%
<christel> fittingly i think my favourite is delirium tremens :)
<dogmatic69> thanks christel
<bigcalm> So, have we agreed upon any September events yet? ;)
<bigcalm> (selfish reasons)
<christel> no :(
<AlanBell> bigcalm: what date?
<bigcalm> Boo
<christel> he keeps slacking
<bigcalm> AlanBell: I'm in Farnham 20th to 23rd
<christel> i don't know why we pay him the big bucks
 * AlanBell wonders what hotel bigcalm is staying in
<bigcalm> Haha :P
<bigcalm> AlanBell: your mind is full of smut. It will do you no good!
<christel> AlanBell: bigcalm is starting a band
<bigcalm> LOL
<christel> it is called "Iain and the love swings"
 * bigcalm shakes his head :P
<AlanBell> so, October 18th is the release date for Quetzal, we should do a party thing then
 * brobostigon yawns, he had 4 hours sleep last night.
<bigcalm> Goodness, 12.10 is so close already
<christel> AlanBell: yes!
<czajkowski> christel: coming to skycon :)
<czajkowski> a weekend in limerick
<czajkowski> and listening to mr. xkcd :D
<christel> oh yes! what's the dates for that again
<christel> (alanbell you should also go to limerick for skycon)
<czajkowski> 6/7 oct
<bigcalm> Randal will be there?!
 * bigcalm is jelly
<christel> that works!
<czajkowski> yup
<czajkowski> as will UUPC :)
<czajkowski> and sabdfl
<czajkowski> http://skycon.skynet.ie/2012/
<bigcalm> I fear that Oggcamp and whatever happen in September will be my last bit of fun for the year :|
<bigcalm> Going places is getting expensive
<christel> LAST BIT OF FUN? gosh you sound like you're about to get married or something...
<christel> oh wait, you are
<bigcalm> Next year. I hope we have spare monies
<bigcalm> Sleepy time!
<bigcalm> Good night peeps :)
<sebsebseb> hi
<sebsebseb> anyone about?
<christel> they all just snuck off to bed
<sebsebseb> christel: we haven't
<christel> true! the rest just have no staying power
<sebsebseb> Day people! heh heh
<sebsebseb> nearly mid night is seen as late
<sebsebseb> christel: and since your an hour a head at the moment, nearly 1am, is seen like what you still doing awake?  unless with a proper enough reason
<christel> mmm i am just about to sneak off to bed :)
<sebsebseb> christel: oh ok
#ubuntu-uk 2012-08-16
<AlanBell> morning
<DJones> ^^ What he said :)
<Azelphur> morning all, good news re my "perfect condition" phone
<Azelphur> I have my money back, and I have the phone too.
<Azelphur> I'm waiting back from the seller to see if he wants to pay shipping to have it back
<hoover> good morning all
<MartijnVdS> Azelphur: woohoo
<Azelphur> indeed :D
<christel> morning pretties
<TheOpenSourcerer> Anyone in Somerset looking for a Python/Linux dev job? http://www.computerfutures.com/en/job/Python-Developer-Somerset-30-000/Somerset/Perm/1/597916/
<bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
<christel> morning clam
 * bigcalm tickles christel
<bigcalm> Mmmm, dubstep to rumble me awake
<christel> :)
<bigcalm> :O http://cheezburger.com/6508261632
<bigcalm> Big Hair and Deadly Stare
<mungojerry> !info bamf
<lubotu3> Package bamf does not exist in precise
<gord> libbamf
<gord> and bamfdaemon
<AlanBell> http://zareason.blogspot.co.nz/2012/08/removing-barriers-for-linux-hardware.html is an interesting read
<brobostigon> good morning everyone.
<christel> good morning brobostigon :)
<brobostigon> good morning christel :)
<bigcalm> Hi brobostigon
<brobostigon> hi bigcalm
<Azelphur> https://dl.dropbox.com/u/3832397/Photos/2012/August/20120816_090349%280%29.jpg imported korean monitors = good :D
<MartijnVdS> Azelphur: Your motto is "there's no kill like overkill"?
<Azelphur> MartijnVdS: yup
<mungojerry> interesting: a level A grades fell for the first time in 20 years
<mungojerry> pointing to a possible stabilisation?
<mungojerry> Azelphur, that PC stays there all the time?
<mungojerry> ah, it's next to the wall, i got the sense of perspective wrong, i thought it was middle of room and prone to getting knoecked off
<Azelphur> mungojerry: yea?
<Azelphur> where would it go? o.O
<mungojerry> i was confused. thought the desk was 10 ft from the wall
<mungojerry> but was 10cm
<mungojerry> (on the floor?)
<Azelphur> mungojerry: haha
<Azelphur> mungojerry: the desk is literally right up against the wall
<Azelphur> it's a pretty big desk (although I clearly need a bigger one
<Azelphur> I should try and move the monitors back a bit.
<mungojerry> my study is full of junk and i literally plop into the cockpit seat and it's hard to get out
<Azelphur> same lol
<Azelphur> you just about see the start of the junk on the side table, I've been trying to tidy up ;)
<DJones> Does anybody want a 90 day trial version of Windows 8 http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/evalcenter/jj554510.aspx
<DJones> I'm tempted to download it and have a look
<davmor2> Morning all
<brobostigon> morning davmor2
<davmor2> czajkowski: PROD!!!!
<davmor2> brobostigon: morning
<AlanBell> innodb_flush_log_at_trx_commit=0 makes mysql a happy database
<AlanBell> well a fast one at any rate (with slight ACID noncompliance)
<bigcalm> Hi davmor2
<Azelphur> http://reuters.livestation.com/demo police swarming outside the ecuadorian embassy which is currently harbouring assange (live)
<davmor2> bigcalm: hey dude, how's life?
<bigcalm> davmor2: if I were able to feel stress, it would be stressful right now
<bigcalm> I'm off work tomorrow to go to oggcamp and then a 4 day course in London next week
<davmor2> bigcalm: hahhaha
<bigcalm> So trying to get LOTS of work done up to the wire
<bigcalm> I bet I find myself doing work in the hotel room
<gord> good luck with your internet connection in the hotel room ;)
<bigcalm> gord: I'll be working either on 3g or on my local git repo
<davmor2> gord: your alive
<gord> barely, feature freeze is upon
<davmor2> ...us
<bigcalm> Him
<davmor2> bigcalm: no it is upon the entire company :)
<bigcalm> christel: new photo, is it you? :)
<christel> haha yes
<christel> i was ickle
<bigcalm> So sweet :)
<christel> :P
<bigcalm> ;)
 * bigcalm had forgotten how painfully slow it is to work with other developers on the same code
<christel> hehe
<czajkowski> bigcalm: be nice and learn how to play with others
<bigcalm> Heh
<bigcalm> czajkowski: it's my boss :|
<czajkowski> play very nicely then
<bigcalm> For a long time I was the only active dev, he's working on the same project as me now though
<czajkowski> so team work :)
<mgdm> we have 8 devs on the same code at work
<mgdm> not too many issues :)
<bigcalm> mgdm: we're not in the same office and he keep disappearing :)
<czajkowski> bigcalm: eh none of our team are even in the same timezone sometimes and they manage just fine
 * czajkowski thinks bigcalm should pack coding in and open a book store, less stress and no coding team :)
<MartijnVdS> No coders? Don't stock O'Reilly!
<directhex> i should switch from sysadminnery to plumbing
<shauno> there's a difference?
<directhex> yeah, you deal with less crap as a plumber
<SuperMatt> I find that the new gtk theme in quantal is so nice, I'm using epiphany instead of web to browse cos it fits in natively
<SuperMatt> s/web/firefox
<SuperMatt> I still can't decide if I want the window decorations to change or not
<aquarius> czajkowski, what am I checking my mail for?
<czajkowski> ticket
<czajkowski> you now have one
<aquarius> czajkowski, aha! I do indeed. That was you, was it? nice one :)
<czajkowski> yes of course it was me
<czajkowski> :)
<GirlyGirl> Hi
<Flashtek> hi
<zleap> hi
<GirlyGirl> Finally got my car into a usable condition by cutting of some bumper plastic. So glad I can use it again
<MartijnVdS> hope it passes MOT like that
<Flashtek> as long as there are no sharp edges, you'll be ok
<Flashtek> if there are use ductape
<GirlyGirl> Flashtek: None all, I didn't exactly cut it just pushed it forward mostly, the bumper isn't that damaged but has moved inwards
<Flashtek> probably be fine then
<Flashtek> did you have a shunt ?
<GirlyGirl> No
<GirlyGirl> Still I do hear some rattling noise while driving it, guess that is ok though
<GirlyGirl> mainly when braking
<GirlyGirl> If I get to boot to close better myself without spending Â£ I'd be overjoyed though
<mungojerry> does htc desire have CM9 release?
<Flashtek> mungojerry: why not look on the website...?
<mungojerry> i'm looking but doesn't seem to be there
<mungojerry> shame
<Flashtek> if its not there...
<mungojerry> then it's somewhere else?
<mungojerry> there's a few desire owners in here so thought i'd try
<mungojerry> should prob put CM7.2 on it though
<mungojerry> i'm still rocking 7.03
<davmor2> mungojerry: http://forum.cyanogenmod.com/topic/49393-can-we-get-any-cm9-updates/
<directhex> mungojerry, there may be ~CM9 nightlies
<mungojerry> i need to find a way of creating more space on this device, always down at that 15MB of free internal space even with a seemingly unused 128mb partition on the phone
<davmor2> directhex: there is no kernel currently for the desire + cm9 so you have to build your own so it isn't ready for general release yet and the image if it gets done likely won't be official
<mungojerry> hardly sounds worth it
<mungojerry> i just want speed improvements, i don't notice any bugs with the OS or any features required
<mungojerry> i'm not sure that's even worth it if i have to reinstall the whole os and apps all over again
<directhex> is the desire ARMv7?
<mungojerry> yes directhex
<directhex> hm, should be okay then for speed. ICS is slow on ARMv6
<mungojerry> no compelling features in ICS over 2.3 for phones though afai see
<mungojerry> i'm using ICS on touchpad and haven't noticed much difference except for some apps and UI tweaks
<directhex> CM9?
<mungojerry> yesh
<directhex> nightly?
<mungojerry> well one from july
<directhex> and that's it? if you want bug fixes since then you reformat?
<mungojerry> no, touchpad is OK, i'm referring to the state of android on my desire
<mungojerry> just saying that the diff between android on my desire (CM7.03) and touchpad CM9  isn't huge
<mungojerry> although android 2.3.4 has google video chat which would be nice
<popey> anyone got an android 4.x device handy?
<popey> I need to change a device from chinese to english
<popey> but don't know which menu it is
<popey> ooh, found it by random tapping
<DJones> I've got one to hand if you need anything else
<GirlyGirl> Speaking of Android, is there an android device that is likely to get updates for a really long time like a pc
<popey> pcs dont get updates for a really long time
<popey> try getting a BIOS for a 3 year old laptop
<Flashtek> Dell Latitude D6xx
<Flashtek> simple
<Flashtek> :-P
 * Flashtek heads off for a snooze, in pain
<GirlyGirl> popey: Not in that sense but you can run the lastest ubuntu or Windows for 7 years approximately on PC's newer than 2003
<GirlyGirl> I've had some laptops get a bios update after 3 years too
<gord> i don't think you really get android device updates for longer than a few years..
<gord> i don't get updates for my n1 anymore
<directhex> lolyears
<mungojerry> whats a device update?
<directhex> no android phone has had official updates for 2 years yet afaik
<directhex> king is iphone 3gs, >3 years & counting
<mungojerry> CM will get OTA facility soon
<GirlyGirl> gord: IPhone 3gs will get the upcoming iOS6
<gord> thats nice? but i don't think that the iphone is an android device
<directhex> android update cycle == joke
<GirlyGirl> gord: I know, but an Android device that gets updates longer would be nice ... manufacturers stop supporting phones that can sometimes be very capable of running the latest version
<directhex> nexus s is most well-supported device i think. released dec2010, has 4.1.1
<mungojerry> although unofficial, i think the CM releases keep android devices alive longer than iphones
<directhex> Azelphur, how's the galaxy s3 situation?
<directhex> mungojerry, statistical noise. most android devices run 2.3
<directhex> 60% are 2.3.3 -> 2.3.7
<directhex> ICS is 16%, same as 2.2
<Azelphur> directhex: got my money back :D
<Azelphur> I told him to pay postage if he wants his phone back, which he didn't
<mungojerry> win
<Azelphur> indeed
<Azelphur> I think I'll give him 7 days, then tell him if he doesn't reply within 7 days after that I'll be keeping it, then keep it
<directhex> still smells dodgy++ but at least you're not out of pocket
<GirlyGirl> Anyone here knows a good (but not to expensive) car body repair place near cambridge?
<mungojerry> let me just say that owncloud is flipping awesome
<mungojerry> everything a man could need
<popey> mungojerry, tell me more
<mungojerry> super simple setup, clients for all devices, (or webdav for those who like that kind of thing), stable and mature
<mungojerry> i also like that there's a clientsync folder, but another folder level above that, so if you want to store files on the server that you don't want to sync to all devices (because of disk sapce), then you can do that, essentially making it a backup server as well as sync server
<mungojerry> popey, also does versioning history
<GirlyGirl> mungojerry: Its nice but I have a personal server
<mungojerry> owncloud is a personal cloud solution
<mungojerry> for your own server
<mungojerry> just need port 443 open
<AlanBell> cloud in this instance meaning file storage?
<mungojerry> yes, with whistle
<mungojerry> because if you want you can add plugins easily to the web interface to stream music, edit latex, stream video..
<mungojerry> server side encryption of files.
<gum-ball-machine> Hi all, does anyone know how to make settings from "myunity" persist accross logins/reboots?
<gum-ball-machine> eg: my custom coloured Unity side panel will not persist accross logins
<kirrus> popey: I've pointed one of the guys from rockpapershotgun.com your way.. he's got questions about licencing, and thought you might be able to help him :)
<christel> 1
<popey> kirrus, ok!
<davmor2> christel: where's our postcard :P
<christel> ahahah oh yes! i must remember to send that
 * OrangutanMan goes "OOh OOh OOH!"
<christel> oh oh oh indeed.
<Azelphur> haha
<Azelphur> suddenly, a random OranguntanMan
<Bagheera> Hi Everyone
<AlanBell> hi
<popey> hi
<MartijnVdS> \o
<mgdm> Right - any suggestions for a Twitter client that isn't Gwibber or Hotot? :-)
<MartijnVdS> google chrome
<popey> i just have a tab open for twitter
<mgdm> actually it's not that bad that way
<mgdm> it'll do
<DJones> I'm still using polly, that works fairly well, although it does crash regularly
<MartijnVdS> Strange ears.. I heard "American and Comedian scientists" when they said "American and Canadian scientists"
 * AlanBell wonders what pub for the Farnham happy hour when Bigcalm is down
<christel> All the pubs!
<christel> pub crawl o clock \o/
<christel> oooh
<christel> actually
<christel> we pubcrawl when i return to work out the best route/pub for the happy hour
<christel> <- genius!
<KrisDouglas> Pubs are bad, mmmk? :P
<christel> sssh
 * christel pokes AlanBell to approve of this PLN
<christel> popey should partake in pub investigations too, i value his input tremendously
 * christel nods
<popey> hmm
<christel> excellent that's settled then!
<Dave2> :o
 * Dave2 wonders if a passport is needed for going to Liverpool
<zleap> lol
<christel> Dave2: haha
 * AlanBell mails the list
<AlanBell> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-uk/2012-August/034895.html
<AlanBell> slug and lettuce on the 22nd September bigcalm
<christel> the slug and lettuce?! could you not pick anywhere worse?
<christel> :P
<christel> otoh they do have silly cheap pitchers of cocktails...
<AlanBell> not my first choice of pub for a quiet drink, but a reasonable place to meet up with people as a starting point
<AlanBell> we don't have to stay there
<christel> mmhmm :P
<christel> yay christmas
<christel> it is so very nearly christmas :D:D:D
<bigcalm> My ears are burning, somebody talking about me again?
<christel> (this excites me greatly)
<christel> bigcalm: always
<popey> christel, why is that the worst pub?
<AlanBell> because christel has high standards
<christel> it is just not very atmosphere-y ;)
<christel> but they have cheap cocktails so it's ok
 * AlanBell wonders if it is marianna at Canonical who is the launch party person again
<cliftonts> Hi guys
<Laney> probably a good first bet
<Pendulum> popey: it's only the worst pub until christel has had some cheap cocktails. Possibly the lack of remembering anything after the cocktails is why she doesn't like it ;)
<popey> ahh
<AlanBell> hi cliftonts
<cliftonts> Hi AlanBell, how's it going?
<AlanBell> not too bad, just sorting out christmas :)
 * bigcalm has caught up
<cliftonts> I've had a fall out with Python, it's developed an attitude
<popey> oh golly, september, nearly christmas!
<bigcalm> I'll happily be led to any pub when I'm in Farnham ;)
<popey> i thought the one near the train station with the find burgers was nice enough
<bigcalm> You lot are crazy :P
<AlanBell> popey: yes, that one is good too
<cliftonts> What's on the cards for Christmas then?
<bigcalm> popey: nice food, didn't seem as cosy as the W.C.
<AlanBell> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-uk/2012-August/034895.html
<AlanBell> various christmas options available
<cliftonts> I was rather uncertain about last year's choice. I'm not sure I'd be comfortable with the whole dark thing
<popey> WC?
<AlanBell> well it is kind of intended to push you a bit out of the comfort zone
<AlanBell> but yes, not doing dans le noir again, that is kind of a "do it once" experience
<cliftonts> When it comes to Christmas dinner I'm very happy with my comfort zone
<bigcalm> popey: william cobbett
<bigcalm> popey: I had to google the spelling, hence the w.c
<popey> ah
<popey> I quite like WC
 * AlanBell was thinking Wing Commander
<bigcalm> Heh
<popey> but the burger one is better for sitting down inside :)
<bigcalm> Everything depends on busyness :)
<cliftonts> I just hope I've sorted my life out enough to join in this year.
<AlanBell> I was thinking of meeting at the slug, then perhaps moving on to the Kar Ling Kwong or something
<popey> winner
<popey> acceptable solution to the quandary mr bell
<cliftonts> Can anyone here tell me why python says no? http://pastebin.com/tCG08tyE
<popey> ooh, thats nice
<cliftonts> ??
<popey> what is the source you're running?
<AlanBell> gosh, that is an odd error
<cliftonts> nothing, I just typed it right in
<popey> you typed "python" then type "import random"?
<cliftonts> yes
<AlanBell> oh, is there a file called random.py in the current directory?
<mgdm> have you got a random.py in your current dir?
<cliftonts> shouldn't be
<popey> i suspect you have a broken package system
<cliftonts> bloody hell! there was
<popey> haha
<cliftonts> I remember learning that I can't have that. I assumed I'd renamed it
<AlanBell> hehe
<cliftonts> Now I'm really confused
<cliftonts> http://pastebin.com/jPerjwsu
<cliftonts> Oh yey! Canonical just turned me down for a job. Don't I feel appreciated!
<popey> welcome to the club!
<AlanBell> canonical turn down lots of people all the time (including a lot of people currently working at canonical)
<popey> I got turned down twice
<cliftonts> Trouble is I don't translate onto a CV very well. They'd have to actually talk to me or I have no hope
<cliftonts> Did you see that second error. I don't have a random to import any more!
<popey> you typed import python
<popey> you meant to type import random
<cliftonts> oh for god's sake
<cliftonts> can you tell it's too late?
<AlanBell> it is getting late!
<popey> yes :)
<cliftonts> finally. I've been trying to get that thing going for days.
<cliftonts> Coding in python is a bit of a culture shock compared to quick basic. The interpreter keeps pushing you back on the right track and you don't realise just how much it did until it's gone.
<popey> heh
<christel> popey: yah i like the mulburry :)
<popey> quick basic.. I haven't touched that since....
<popey> 1993
<popey> i think
<christel> the cobbett is also nice
<christel> (i am backlogging)
<popey> i found a nice love2d / lua tutorial the other day
<popey> i might use that instead of python for a game sophie wants to write
<cliftonts> popey: Yeah but deciding to learn a modern language and then coming head to head with visual basic put me off programming in anything else for over 10 years!
<popey> the good thing about python is that there are zillions of tutorials
<popey> many really good ones
<popey> http://cupm.net/public/love2dtutorial/
<popey> thats a nice love2d one
<cliftonts> I've converted one of my programs and it works fine. I now need to make it pretty. Experiment with the things qbasic couldn't do
<popey> https://github.com/kikito/love-tile-tutorial/wiki also good
<ali1234> making 2d game?
<ali1234> best thing about python is list comprehensions and slicing
<ali1234> if you only did basic, C etc, you need to learn that, because it's an amazing time saver
<cliftonts> I haven't played with that yet
<ali1234> it's also incredibly simple like everything in python
<popey> ali1234, yeah, my daughter wants to do a simple 2d mario style game
<cliftonts> One of the problems I'm finding is that there are certain things you have to do the hard way in basic where in python one command will do it. I'm figuring out how to do them the hard way again without realising there is a better way.
<ali1234> in basic you have to do everything the hard way
<cliftonts> yup
<cliftonts> brb
<cliftonts> I swear I'll never get past having to look up commands in the tutorials!
#ubuntu-uk 2012-08-17
<Jonni_> nice to meet you
<AlanBell> morning all
<popey> hi
<agent_linux_1520> hi there
<popey> hi
<agent_linux_1520> hi..h u doin
<agent_linux_1520> is any body here
<agent_linux_1520> i think all r sleepin
 * popey goes back to sleepin
<open_source> hiya
<ali1234> well this java issue is really starting to annoy me now
<open_source> all u need is to update it
<open_source> u can try
<ali1234> that is precisely the thing that does not work
<ali1234> but this is a windows issue, so no surprises that it fails hard
<ali1234> microsoft + oracle... it doesn't get any worse than that
<open_source> microsoft...:)
<open_source> wat a joke
<ali1234> the thing is, i can;t install java using the online installer. if you google for this it is an extremely common problem caused by a number of different issues
<ali1234> the answer is always the same though: install using the offline installer
<ali1234> if i do that, then i can never update it, because updates work the same way as the online installer
<ali1234> the odd thing is it worked fine three days ago. today it doesn't
<ali1234> since then, oracle released update 6. but it isn't on the downoad pages yet
<ali1234> so i dunno if they have screwed up the download servers somehow or what
<ali1234> afaict the download pages still point to the same files they did 3 days ago
 * AlanBell just cleaned the laptop fan
<AlanBell> a 40 minute job involving *lots* of screws
<hoover> morning all
<christel> morning pretties
<MartijnVdS> \o
<diplo> Morning all
<hoover> Hey diplo
 * hoover still cannot connect to is galaxy s3 via mtp on 12.04
<hoover> (his)
<hoover> I flashed it with CM9, but still no joy 8(
<extrasolar> sup peple
<extrasolar> people
<AlanBell> hi extrasolar
<AlanBell> http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/ubuntu-uk/1906/detail/
<AlanBell> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-uk/2012-August/034895.html what do people think about the other things on the list?
<popey> like the idea of a global jam
<popey> be interested in taking part in that
<popey> especially if we can find a decent size venue
<popey> room at the maltings?
<AlanBell> could do
<AlanBell> do the new Canonical offices have any useable section?
 * AlanBell has not been invited to visit yet
<popey> I'll find out
<AlanBell> got an out of office from Marianna when emailing about the launch party
<extrasolar> Can you just turn up to these events or do you need to be a sys admin or developer?
<AlanBell> just turn up
<extrasolar> sweet
<AlanBell> most events involve the ability to hold a pint glass (or other glass if preferred)
<extrasolar> That's my speciality
<AlanBell> the global jam is more computer based, testing and filing bugs and maybe packaging stuff
<AlanBell> partly learning, partly doing. All depends on what people want to do
<gord> Achievement unlocked: scared by own roomba.
<AlanBell> popey: I can't do the thursday/friday of the global jam, Paralympic shifts
<popey> AlanBell, marianna will be back start sept, it can wait till then/
<popey> ?
<popey> (the release party that is)
<AlanBell> ok, sure
<christel> :)
<extrasolar> So a friend wanted to meet me at a tea room in London. As I entered the place every damn table had a macbook on it
<AlanBell> that is the native habitat of the macbook
<extrasolar> it was a situation I've never been in before
<extrasolar> So I got out my cheap acer
<extrasolar> :P
<davmor2> Morning all
<extrasolar> morning
<extrasolar> just woke up?
<davmor2> To everyone off to oggcamp, Have a great weekend guys 'n' gals
<davmor2> extrasolar: nope just started work
<extrasolar> what's the daily amount of coffee you shouldn't exceed?
<christel> yar, have fun at oggcamp \o/
<Laney> 6 music are playing the singing from "Genie in a Bottle" by Christina Aguilera on top of the music from "Hard to Explain" by The Strokes
<Laney> it's grim and yet somewhat compelling
<mgdm> I heard that one around 2005, I'm sure
<mgdm> if not before
<mgdm> <-- used to work in a student union doing sound
<ali1234> it's much older than that
<ali1234> 2002 at least
<mgdm> I left there in 2005, so that's the latest I could've heard it :)
<mgdm> but I couldn't remember when the originals came out
<ali1234> hard to explain was out in 2000 i think
<hoover> wohoo, finally I'm able to connect to the SIII using jmtpfs
<hoover> had to compile from source (including libmtp), but that wasn't too hard.
<Laney> she said it came out in 2001/2
<Laney> i feel an urge to hear it again
<ali1234> it's called "a stroke of genius" by freelance hellraiser
<brobostigon> good morning everyone.
<hoover> morning brob
<brobostigon> morning hoover
<AlanBell> http://www.remainsofthegames.co.uk/ lots of interesting stuff to collect from Nottingham
<arsen> so i've whacked 12.04 onto an amd box with a quadro 400 something nvidia card in it
<arsen> activating two screens seems to give some strange almost elastic behaviour to the cursor transitioning between displays, is that normal now?:s
<AlanBell> you can turn it off in the display settings
<arsen> orly
<arsen> so it's a feature :D
<arsen> (thought it was a bug..)
<ali1234> it gets harder to tell every day
<AlanBell> yes, it is a feature that looks like a bug
<AlanBell> anyone running quantal with two displays and got the launcher on only one of them? whatever I do it displays on both screens
<davmor2> arsen: it's so you have to deliberately move from one display to another and not do it accidentally
<ali1234> actually it's to make revealing the launcher when it is hidden possible
 * directhex moos
<directhex> moo!
<AlanBell> never mind, it works on a guest session, must be something wrong with my profile somewhere
<AlanBell> arsen: you can use ccsm to tweak the amount of force required to transition between screens, default is the "erk, how on earth do I get over there?" level of friction
<arsen> orly.
<arsen> yeah, the thing for me is i run 8 screens and i'm constantly moving around, cant see id want that on by default.
<ali1234> why would you even want unity on a setup like that?
<arsen> does anyone use ubuntu in the office as a desktop os? ive picked up an environment backed by NIS auth and i'm not a huge fan, but looking for ideas to replace.
<arsen> i'm not sure i do want unity on it :p its just out of the box install ali1234  :)
<AlanBell> I use it in the office as a desktop OS, but no clever auth stuff going on here
<AlanBell> Canonical don't appear to be going in the direction of the office PC very aggressively
<arsen> yeah noted.
<AlanBell> they do have customers using it in the office, but the development is more consumer focussed and server/cloud stuff
<AlanBell> not integrated fleets of desktops
<directhex> it's interesting, aiming for consumer
<directhex> the "year of the linux desktop" has been a constant disappointment, but the ubuntu app store seems serious, and with steam landing soon, it might just happen that suddenly, desktop linux is worthwhile to the universe
<arsen> i like the app store
<arsen> i just installed some 2d tux platform game :d
<ali1234> yeah. and we only had to fill it with proprietary software and remove any semblance of choice in order to achieve it
<directhex> ali1234, who cared about "choice" other than nerds who are statistical noise?
<ali1234> you mean the nerds who actually wrote all the software?
<directhex> yeah, them
<AlanBell> does anyone have a local network of machines that share authentication?
<ali1234> sure
<ali1234> i can log in to any machine on my network using the same ssh key
<AlanBell> so can I because I copied it to all of them
<ali1234> \o/
<AlanBell> and created a user on each of them
<ali1234> define "share" properly then :)
<arsen> and how do you get onto your machine to do that?
<AlanBell> ok, I have my machine, and three kids have machines, they each have an account on their own machine but each one is a separate individual device, they can't go log onto another machine and get their stuff there
<arsen> ^ :)
<ali1234> so you want some kind of shared filesystem too
<davmor2> popey: check your broadband speeds now too I think you might be surprised for me I went from 28-35 meg to 60 using modem only mode
<arsen> the worst thing im enduring at the moment is an entire team's /home being on an nfs share
<arsen> = nightmare
<AlanBell> yes
<AlanBell> would be quite happy if you could sit down at any Ubuntu desktop and log into it with launchpad credentials (or Ubuntu SSO) then Ubuntu One Syncs down the important bits of your profile like the dot files and you just carry on
<ali1234> given how slow U1 is, i don't think i would like that
<ali1234> especially since it would have to download everything before displaying any kind of UI
<ali1234> dotfiles = dconf now anyway
<AlanBell> .mozilla isn't dconf
<ali1234> the only other thing in there is monstrous stuff like firefox cache
<ali1234> you really really really do not want to put firefox cache onto your synced homedir
<AlanBell> oh yeah, that is bigger than I thought it was
<mgdm> what's dconf? /me hasn't been paying attention
<ali1234> it's like gconf only the wheels are a different shape
<AlanBell> it is gconf but new
<AlanBell> so some things use dconf and some things use gconf
<mgdm> yay, brilliant
<directhex> we need to unify them
<directhex> uconf!
<AlanBell> http://xkcd.com/927/
<ali1234> someone get lennart on the job
<mgdm> ali1234: NOOOOOOOOOOO
<extrasolar> Hi I want to log into my system a different way. instead of the gdm I want a terminal log in
<extrasolar> any idea how to do this
<ali1234> yes.
<extrasolar> I use xmonad as a windows display manger
<extrasolar> ?
<ali1234> http://askubuntu.com/questions/6357/dont-start-xserver
<ali1234> that is probably out of date
<arsen> i get the feeling he wants xserver, but not for login?
<ali1234> also you shouldn't do that whole "log in on terminal, run X manually" thing
<ali1234> it's insecure because you can lock the screen, and then I can just ctrl-alt-backspace and get to your terminal
<ali1234> assuming you have turned off dontzap like any sane person would
<extrasolar> :o
<extrasolar> damn
<ali1234> what you should actually do is make a gdn session for xmonad
<ali1234> this is not as hard as it sounds
<ali1234> *gdm
<extrasolar> so you wouldn't recommend this?
<ali1234> don't disable the xserver
<extrasolar> how about this though http://www.debianadmin.com/how-to-disable-x-or-gui-on-boot-in-debian.html
<ali1234> yeah same principle applies
<ali1234> unless you don't want to use X11 at all, use a login manager, not startx
<extrasolar> hmmm
<ali1234> http://www.haskell.org/haskellwiki/Xmonad/Using_xmonad_in_Gnome#Ubuntu_Oneiric
<ali1234> this is how to do it properly
<ali1234> configure the xmonad.session however you want
<ali1234> and then login using the normal login manager
<extrasolar> hmm well I am actually using debian
<ali1234> well they have instructions for debian too
<extrasolar> yep
<extrasolar> cheers
<extrasolar> Why would you want to disbale x or GUI on boot? I only want to do it because it's cool
<extrasolar> is there any other coo reason/
<extrasolar> practical *
<ali1234> well yeah, if you have no monitor cos it's a server and you accidentally installed from desktop cd...
<ali1234> you might also want x server installed on a server so you can xhost software from it, but it doesn't need to run a server to do that
<ali1234> but it does need most of one installed
<extrasolar> ahh ok
<extrasolar> well cheers for your help I am off to test
<extrasolar> :D
<AlanBell> my laptop is nice and cool now I cleaned the fan
<brobostigon> :)
<Azelphur> directhex / AlanBell got a response from the seller http://pastebin.com/dVaG9uRg
<Azelphur> at the bottom is what I'm planning to reply with
<arsen> epic. good show Azelphur.
<directhex> You're. and the last para seems petty IMHO
<Azelphur> directhex: fair enough, will drop it
<Azelphur> directhex: where should the you're be? I've read through and can't see it o.O
<directhex> last para ;)
<arsen> the first word of your last para :)
<Azelphur> oh, I dropped the last paragraph anyway because you're right it seems better
<Azelphur> petty*
<arsen> directhex are you still workin at the same place these days?
<Azelphur> http://typewith.me/p/rmMsmKd7MQ is what I have now
<Azelphur> kinda tempted to bill him for my time too if he keeps up with this crap :P
<directhex> arsen, collabora? yes
<Azelphur> righto, gonna send that :)
<arsen> oh no, i'm behind the times then. last time i knew where you worked involved a university.
<directhex> arsen, quit at the end of 2010!
<arsen> :(
<Laney> people always talk about billing others for their time
<Laney> how in the world would you possibly go about doing that
<AlanBell> get a purchase order in advance
<ali1234> Azelphur: your bad at grammar
 * mgdm completes packing for Oggcamp
<ali1234> if he didn't publish it on ebay who did??
<ali1234> also guy who calls himself "azelphur" telling someone to grow up. LOL
<ali1234> so yeah... i wouldn't argue with the guy. do what you are legally required to do and no more
<popey> +1
<cvmori> 23
 * daubers awaits a final video camera before pushing off to Liverpool
<ali1234> damn this laptop is getting worse
<hoover> cheers all, have a good weekend
<popey> bug 1
<lubotu3> Launchpad bug 1 in Ubuntu "Microsoft has a majority market share" [Critical,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1
<popey> stupid bot
<popey> bug 1033531
<lubotu3> Launchpad bug 1033531 in Ayatana Design "Single click inside the Workspace Switcher should always return to a workspace" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1033531
<popey> why doesn't it reply in pm?
<Guest74513> hi guys. I am planing to buy a laptop and I want it to be compatiable with ubuntu especially the graphics. I am looking for one with descrete graphics card. any suggestions
<popey> Guest74513, my standard answer is "thinkpad"
<popey> but you generally can't go wrong with dell these days
<popey> pretty much their entire range is certified to run Ubuntu
<popey> bug  #1036490
<lubotu3> Launchpad bug 1036490 in compiz (Ubuntu) "[regression] compiz crashed with SIGSEGV in g_main_context_iteration() from ... from CcpScreen::timeout()" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1036490
<Guest74513> I had a bad experience with switch-able graphics on HP pavilion and ubuntu. do not want to get into that trouble again
<Guest74513> popey, is the nividia graphics card better supported on ubuntu?
<gord> if it says optimus and its a fairly new gpu, you are gonna have a bad time
<aquarius> Guest74513, it might also be worth looking at machines sold with Ubuntu on them. You *know* everything on them will work :)
<AlanBell> aquarius: that would be just linuxemporium.co.uk in this country I think
<aquarius> AlanBell, system76 will ship internationally, I think. Not sure about zareason
<Azelphur> AlanBell / directhex, pwned https://dl.dropbox.com/u/3832397/screenshots/2012/August/pwned.png :D
<Laney> not very nice to publish this guy's address is it :(
<Azelphur> Laney: I don't particularly care, he's a scammer (multiple times on ebay)
<Azelphur> you don't get no nice treatment when you lie and steal :)
<gord> you still shouldn't publish addresses in public like that
<gord> not cool
<Azelphur> AlanBell / directhex also this is how I'm sending it back like: https://dl.dropbox.com/u/3832397/Photos/2012/August/IMG_20120817_163323.jpg
<Azelphur> :D
<AlanBell> what is the scam?
<Azelphur> Anyone have experience with PPPay, ebid and escrow? is it really 100%?
<Adriannom> hi.  i'm running xubuntu 12.04 and have an NVIDIA GeForce 7300 GS.  i'm using a newer, bigger monitor (HP LP3065) than before but my selection of resolutions is lower than before.  the maximum i can achieve now is 1200x800.  anyone got any tips on diagnosing the problem?
<Azelphur> wow that thing is supposed to do 2560x1440, nice monitor
<Azelphur> are you using nvidia proprietary?
<Adriannom> yeah
<Azelphur> oh wait hold on
<Azelphur> I'm pretty sure that graphics card won't drive that monitor
<Adriannom> heh, well i'm reading your messages on it ;)
<Azelphur> Adriannom: not at full res, I mean :)
<Adriannom> sure, but would that mean i would be able to use LESS resolutions than before?
<Azelphur> well yea, because the aspect ratio changed
<Azelphur> and your in an unsupported setup
<Adriannom> ok
<Adriannom> poo
<Azelphur> you need a new card I'd think
<Azelphur> I mean I'm not 100%
<Azelphur> but I know when I bought my new 2560x1440 monitors they wouldn't work with my 9500GT
<Azelphur> so it's unlikely your 2560x1600 will work with a 7300GS
<Adriannom> my friend just said he has a spare card
<Adriannom> if it'll fit
<Adriannom> :P
<Azelphur> what type?
<Azelphur> yea, cnet says max resolution on 7300GS is 1920x1200
<Adriannom> yeah that res is fine by me
<Adriannom> but i guess i can't have it with this gfx
<Adriannom> anyway his card will definitely run it
<Adriannom> so i guess i'll go see if it can fit in my pc
<Azelphur> and the monitor requires a dual link DVI connection, as I thought
<Adriannom> right
<Azelphur> Adriannom: what card is it?
<Adriannom> no idea :P
<Azelphur> lol
<Adriannom> geforce hd 4780x2 he's guessing
 * Azelphur facedesks
<Azelphur> so basically you don't know
<Azelphur> geforce is an nvidia line
<Azelphur> hd is a ati line
<Azelphur> 4780 doesn't exist anywhere
<Azelphur> lol
<Adriannom> lol!
<Adriannom> it says 4870x2
<Azelphur> 4870 exists that's an ATI card
<Azelphur> it's also pretty old
<Adriannom> it defo works with this monitor
<Adriannom> just maybe not my pc
<Azelphur> it does apparently support 2560x1600 dual link DVI though
<Azelphur> so it should be ok
<Adriannom> anyway you've been a great help :)
<Azelphur> yw :)
<Azelphur> Adriannom: you can get new cards that'd knock the crap outta that for about Â£40, btw
<Azelphur> oh wait, or not it's not as bad as I thought
<Azelphur> carry on, you should be fine :p
<Adriannom> :P
<Adriannom> hm, psu is only 500w
<Adriannom> needs, 500w+, 600w recommended
<Adriannom> ah well, here goes nothing, thanks again Azelphur
<Azelphur> :)
<jacobw> MOOO
 * Azelphur puts a cow hat on jacobw
<jacobw> have you seen my fedora cloak ;)
<jacobw> i might as well have a cow hat
<jacobw> fridaz means a new episode of 'suits'
<Azelphur> hehe
<Azelphur> http://uk.ebid.net/help_payments.php#2 this sounds pretty cool
<Azelphur> should make it safe to buy from anyone regardless of rep? o.O
<jacobw> time is money
 * Azelphur is in no rush
<jacobw> my /etc/issue has changed to 12.04.1
<jacobw> why?
<Azelphur> ali1234: whelp, BS&T closed
<Azelphur> we shall find out if it's a scam or not on monday
<DJones> jacobw: I assume that 12.04.1 Has been released, although I didn't expect that the .1 release until 23rd
<jacobw> it's a little worrying to see verion strings changing before planned
<DJones> Maybe the release was ready, I've seen 2 different dates, 17th and 23rd
<bigcalm_laptop> Ello peeps :)
<brobostigon> evening bigcalm_laptop :)
<bigcalm_laptop> Hi brobostigon :)
<christel> hoi bigcalm_laptop
<bigcalm_laptop> Hey hey christel :)
<brobostigon> evening christel :)
<christel> heya brobostigon \o/
<brobostigon> \o/
<christel> bigcalm_laptop: did you see there is a HAPPY HOUR IN YOUR HONOUR?
<bigcalm_laptop> christel: Indeed, I'm super excited :D
<cliftonts> evening all
<christel> :D
<bigcalm_laptop> christel: did you see that I've been taking video of men's toilets?
<christel> excited is good :D
<christel> hahaha really?
<christel> peeping iain!
<bigcalm_laptop> Linked to on Twitter, Facebook and G+
<cliftonts> Oh what have I walked in on?
<christel> hehe
<bigcalm_laptop> What have I missed today by not being at work?
<brobostigon> ok, is there an android app, to view and or edit your google contacts, without the normal google apps, and account syncing. ?
<christel> bigcalm_laptop: i  bought lots of yarn, you missed that
<bigcalm_laptop> christel: I bet you tell a good yawn
<bigcalm_laptop> yarn
<christel> :o
<AlanBell> bit of a freudian slip there bigcalm_laptop
<bigcalm_laptop> a,
<bigcalm_laptop> AlanBell: I've already been drinking and now typing in the dark ;)
<bigcalm_laptop> We're recovering from tea before venturing into the bar for more drinks :D
<christel> typing in the dark eh?
<christel> oh you're oggcamping, i forgot it was thisw eekend
<christel> weekend*
<bigcalm_laptop> Yus :)
<bigcalm_laptop> We miss you all
<christel> aww
<bigcalm_laptop> Though we've only met Tony and Laura so far
<bigcalm_laptop> I'm guessing that there are other people here based on tweets
<Pendulum> christel: how could you forget that oggcamp is this weekend? we have our club, remember?
<christel> i know, we are so much more awesome than them
<bigcalm_laptop> :O
<bigcalm_laptop> This hotel has free wifi, yet I can't get it to work
<brobostigon> :(
<christel> aww
<christel> it is only free for all bar you
<bigcalm_laptop> Me and Hayley :(
<christel> aww
<ali1234> Azelphur: deeeeeerp
<bigcalm_laptop> Time to go and have drinks
<bigcalm_laptop> Toodles for now :)
<christel> enjoy
<brobostigon> i just found south park, on the tv, on some obscure channel, called, viva.
<Azelphur> ali1234: haha, not derp yet, he seems to want to pay out :)
<ali1234> yah but so what? he can't, because he has no money
<Azelphur> haha
<Azelphur> ali1234: so if he pays out, does that mean I win?
<ali1234> if he pays out 100% of everything he owes then yeah i guess
<Azelphur> :D
<ali1234> to everyone that is
<Azelphur> I'm in an account that was one of the first, so I get paid back first
<ali1234> if not, you're just a lucky douchebag
<Azelphur> front of ze queue :)
<Azelphur> hehe
<ali1234> congrats for stealing from people eve more gullible than yourself :/
<ali1234> anyway i guess we find out soon enough
<Azelphur> xD
<ali1234> i can't find any information about this
<Azelphur> https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=50822.0
<ali1234> but clearly everyone knows but me. i can tell this by looking at gox chart
<Azelphur> hehe
<Azelphur> ali1234: price skyrocketing?
<ali1234> no, it dropped by about 35% in the past 2 hours
<ali1234> $14.7 -> $11.3
<Azelphur> haha oh yea
<Azelphur> ali1234: lol damn it was Â£9.8 earlier
<ali1234> yeah i sold a couple
<ali1234> i figured it was crazy friday
<ali1234> and crazy friday always followed by bipolar saturday
<ali1234> i didn't really expect this though
<ali1234> thought irate had another couple of months left in him
<Azelphur> ali1234: yea I sold some at 8.2 the other day
<Azelphur> Â£570 worth
<ali1234> i never trade that much
<Azelphur> ali1234: I have a little south of 2k btc :p
<ali1234> maybe pirate is actually a genius. imagine if he does this:
<ali1234> run a ponzi with btc until breaking point
<ali1234> then lock all accounts, sell *all* the btc, and invest the USD ina  brand new HYIP which is obviously also a ponzi, but is brand new
<ali1234> then immediately withdraw it a couple of days later, thus making a huge profit
<ali1234> then pay everyone back and look like a genius
<ali1234> this would also explain the massive dip in btc price
<ali1234> it's a huge gamble though
 * Azelphur shrugs
<Azelphur> ali1234:  lol wtf it's gone back up again
<ali1234> dead cat bounce?
<Azelphur> apparently so
<Azelphur> ali1234: http://bitcoincharts.com/charts/intrsngGBP#rg1zig1-minztgTzm1g10zm2g25zv
<ali1234> dude, nobody cares about intersango
<Azelphur> D:
<Azelphur> http://bitcoincharts.com/charts/mtgoxUSD#rg1zig1-minztgTzm1g10zm2g25zv mtgox says the same just with increased resolution
<ali1234> trouble with gox is it always goes really slow at times like this
<Azelphur> hehe
<Azelphur> ali1234: did you hear my funny phone story btw?
<ali1234> yeah
<Azelphur> hehe
<Azelphur> ali1234: did you hear that I finally got him to pay postage, and see how I'm planning on sending him the phone? :P
<Azelphur> ali1234: (22:19:56) pirateat40: ErebusBat, I've signed a contact to do a tell all with a company.  I'm sure you'll see it it soon enough.
<directhex> moo.
<brobostigon> meep
<jacobw> shepp
<simplyska> Hey guys, I was wondering if someone could help. My Ubuntu box is connected to my network fine, but for some reason does not have internet access, and I can't figure out what's gone wrong. It's connected via Ethernet. I'm not running a GUI either. Thanks.
<brobostigon> simplyska: have you checked it is getting an ip, and dns is working correctly.?
<simplyska> Yeah it's getting an ip via dhcp. I can ping localhost, however nslookup localhost seems to time out. I have virgin medias name servers in resolv.conf
<brobostigon> any firewall, to block stuff?
<simplyska> No only the firewall on my vm superhub, but I've tried disabling that to no avail.
<simplyska> Aha I found the culprit, I had it in the MAC filter list for some reason.
<simplyska> Cheers for your help
<brobostigon> :)
<ali1234> jaaaaaaaaaaavaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!!!!!
#ubuntu-uk 2012-08-18
<SuperEngineer> never seen one before
<jacobw> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Macroglossum_stellatarum
 * SuperEngineer opens that link
 * SuperEngineer loves the name Macroglossum stellatarum - that summed it up straight away!
<SuperEngineer> jacobw: nope- wasn't that one, no audible humming noise, no orange flashes on wings
<SuperEngineer> following links - it appears it was however, some sort of Sphinx moth
 * SuperEngineer has been bleesed by a sphinx?  ;)
<SuperEngineer> *blessed
<jacobw> ooh that's pretty
<Azelphur> *facedesk* lodger just showed me a newspaper clipping telling everyone that the ipad 2 is better than the nexus 7
<Azelphur> this is why I never read newspapers, yay for uneducated crap
<SuperEngineer> Azelphur: suggestion - teach yourself [& more so the *facedesk* lodger?] self censorship!!!
<Azelphur> haha
<Azelphur> self censorship?
<MartijnVdS> http://tardis.wikia.com/wiki/The_Lodger_(TV_story) ?
<dogmatic69> Azelphur: haters gonna hate :P
<SuperEngineer> let their brain know as well the difference between reading truth & rumour
<Azelphur> SuperEngineer: yea, I just pulled up side by side specs on gsmarena and said look, if this newspaper had done any research at all it'd be obvious
<MartijnVdS> If you already have an ipad/phone and have bought apps, ipad might be a better choice
<MartijnVdS> if you already have android stuff, go for the nexus
<SuperEngineer> *self censorship  - the art of ignoring all the c**p - sorry, rubbish, that's out there
<MartijnVdS> If you have neither.. go by the specs/your anticipated future needs
<MartijnVdS> how hard can it be
<Azelphur> MartijnVdS: nah they are talking about buying one straight, and the ipad 2 being Â£330, and the nexus 7 being Â£200 (It's actually Â£170)
<Azelphur> and even if you do have a stockpile of apps, it's still economically unsensible to buy an ipad 2 over a nexus 7
<jacobw> if it's a newspaper it must be true
<Azelphur> I doubt many people have Â£160 worth of apps haha
<Azelphur> jacobw: yea, that's what people think :(
<SuperEngineer> jacobw: lol
<MartijnVdS> jacobw: but if it's on the internet is MUST also be true
<MartijnVdS> how can it be true and false at the same time?!
<Azelphur> indeed :P
<jacobw> MartijnVdS: the world's gone mad
<dogmatic69> Azelphur: also, why compare the iPad2 that is a year older?
<SuperEngineer> MartijnVdS: double lol
<dogmatic69> like comparing a i7 with a 486
<Azelphur> dogmatic69: I have no idea, but that's what htey did
<jacobw> i hate that phrase so much
<Azelphur> the funny part is even the ipad 3 vs the nexus 7, the nexus 7 still beats the ipad 3 in a lot of important areas while being less than half the price
<SuperEngineer> anyone else tried "Zorin OS"... damned if it'll run [for me] in a vm!  giving up methinks
<SuperEngineer> if I was really that bothered btw - I'd check the md5
<dogmatic69> Azelphur: the iPad3 kicks ass in pretty much every category http://www.gsmarena.com/compare.php3?idPhone1=4620&idPhone2=4850
<ali1234> isn't zorin the bad guy from that james bond movie?
<Azelphur> dogmatic69: really? dual core 1ghz > quad core 1.3?
<ali1234> didn't he have a space laser or something?
<Azelphur> powervr > geforce?
<Azelphur> same ram = kicking ass? :p
<ali1234> moonraker?
<penguin42> Azelphur: nice display
<SuperEngineer> ali1234: zorin might the the jb bad guy - but curently he's the bad guy on my iso storage partition ;)
<Azelphur> penguin42: yep, the ipad 3 has some cool stuff that the nexus 7 doesn't, but it's the same vice versa
<Azelphur> and when you consider how much the nexus 7 has over the ipad 3 while still being half the price, it's pretty impressive imo
<dogmatic69> Azelphur: *if* android apps can manage using the cores, no.
<penguin42> Azelphur: Could be argued 4 cpus and so little ram could be a waste
<ali1234> oh right yeah, it's the one where christopher walken wants to sink california with an earthquake machine
<Azelphur> penguin42: *shrug* it works great for me, lots of gaming etc :p
<Azelphur> been playing GTA 3 on it hehe
<SuperEngineer> I'm very tempted at this point to suggest somebody starts up a "download a kindle" website ;)
<Azelphur> and tether it to my phone so I get internet everywhere without the extra bill
<Azelphur> SuperEngineer: seen download more ram? :P
<SuperEngineer> Azelphur: ;)
<Azelphur> http://www.downloadmoreram.com/ most useful website ever, highly recommended
<dogmatic69> the ipad has a better / bigger screen
<Azelphur> dogmatic69: ipad 3 yes, ipad 2 no
<penguin42> Azelphur: And doesn't it just have one camera on the nexus ?
<dogmatic69> yep
<dogmatic69> 1.2mp
<Azelphur> penguin42: yes, in the article they are comparing the ipad 2 to the nexus 7 though :)
 * AlanBell is on a cable car
<dogmatic69> ipad2 == dinosaur tech
<Azelphur> yep lol
<SuperEngineer> Azelphur:  just done downloading a [failed] zorin iso to sneak a peek, that's enough for my patience for one day
<MartijnVdS> IT IS HOT
<Azelphur> MartijnVdS: MAKE IT COOLER
<penguin42> AlanBell: Hmm, that might be an irc first - where?
<SuperEngineer> MartijnVdS: stop calling me hot!
<dogmatic69> so compare ipad3, that is still older than the nexus (and better)
<MartijnVdS> SuperEngineer: you're IT?
<SuperEngineer> you naughty person you
<Myrtti> oh look, it's professor Slughorn from Hogwarts discussing with Indiana Jones on BBC
<jacobw> 31.9C here
<SuperEngineer> MartijnVdS: I am IT, I am Hot, I am SuperEngineer
<SuperEngineer> ;)
<jacobw> Super Hot IT?
<jacobw> that's not a good acronym :p
<MartijnVdS> what does that abbreviate to
<SuperEngineer> jacobw: sorry mate... suffolh beat you
<SuperEngineer> *suffolk
<jacobw> 32.6 C at 12:54
 * jacobw edges suffolk
<SuperEngineer> jacobw: hmm -worryingly - I use Hotot for my twitter client - nearly all the initials there in one!
<jacobw> (bavaria)
<jacobw> :)
<SuperEngineer> jacobw: that's a big youch - last time /me was near [but above] those temps - I was in Gambia!
<jacobw> hehe
<SuperEngineer> loved the heat so much I went back for a 2nd visit 2months later
<penguin42> hmm, that reminds me, I hadn't installed yawp
<SuperEngineer> ..but then I came back to UK .... brrrrrr
<ali1234> we had a power cut last night so when i woke up this morning first thing i wonder is "why is it so quiet?", and next thing was "why is it so cold?"
<SuperEngineer> oh the joys of one's travels
 * SuperEngineer sends ali1234 a virtual household ups
<SuperEngineer> [hope you enjoy the virtual voltage]
<penguin42> hmm, yawp says it's 18c - but it feels nicer
<SuperEngineer> Zorin - your last chance - I'm wasting DVD on you to see if you'll boot live - if you don't - get your darn download sorted - uupc plug or not.
<AlanBell> I am on a boat
 * SuperEngineer is jealous of AlanBell 
<christel> looooooooveboaaaat
<SuperEngineer> AlanBell: das boot?
<SuperEngineer> [litery pun there folks]
<AlanBell> thames clipper
 * SuperEngineer even more jealous - stop it
<AlanBell> Emirates cable car is cool
<SuperEngineer> the cable car taking you to the peak of mountain in Austria from where you see 3 counties & shi down is pdg as well
<SuperEngineer> *countries
<SuperEngineer> *ski
<SuperEngineer> [damn my keyboarding (lack of) abilty]
<christel> wine.. should i drink wine?
 * SuperEngineer thinks: cross a river in a cable car or travel topside in a cable car? hmmm... 2nd 1
 * brobostigon is.
 * brobostigon is christel 
<SuperEngineer> christel: yes - it's very hard to eat
 * christel nods
 * SuperEngineer looks out window - *very* pretty sky
<SuperEngineer> complete with hot air balloon
 * penguin42 waits for his ice cream to soften
<christel> :)
<christel> i want ice cream
<christel> and hot air balloons
<christel> i've always wanted to go in one but i am a wuss :(
<penguin42> yeh a hot air balloon would be interesting
 * christel nods
<penguin42> christel: You think something held up purely by hot air is too risky?
<christel> AlanBell: hey there's an event idea!
<christel> penguin42: nooo i just don't trust myself not to fall out!
<penguin42> christel: Oh I think that's the least of the worries - the biggest problem seems to be them flying into power lines
<christel> hehe
<SuperEngineer> christel: just think of it as trying a release version odf a distro - you could even call it Quantel Quistel
<SuperEngineer> so - trying to see what the Zorin distro looks like - will not load in a vm but copied to a dvd it loads live 1st time on netbook
<SuperEngineer>  -what the heck setting do I need to change in VirtualBox?
<MartijnVdS> use kvm?
<christel> hahaha
<christel> <3 SuperEngineer
<SuperEngineer> ooo - cruel
<SuperEngineer> I blame uupc - they plugged it
<SuperEngineer> I just wanted to have a looksee
<jacobw> SuperEngineer: it looks like a debian/ubuntu derived desktop distribution based on gnome2
<jacobw> SuperEngineer: i'm sure what special about
<MartijnVdS> Which HP Microserver was so popular again?
<MartijnVdS> The N40L or the N36L? What's the difference anyway?
<penguin42> MartijnVdS: There are only two aren't there?
<penguin42> MartijnVdS: I think one is just a newer than the other; more RAM/CPU I think
<MartijnVdS> ah yes
<MartijnVdS> newer Turion
<MartijnVdS> Not enough power :(
<MartijnVdS> Might need to save money for a new PC and repurpose current one then
<MartijnVdS> (as a hom VM host)
<MartijnVdS> home*
<MartijnVdS> on the other hand, faster H.264 encoding++
<SuperEngineer> hmmm... zorin [free / base version] - good, but not enough unless you pay methinks - darned if I'm paying to see if I'd even consider a recommendaton
<AlanBell> I am on a train!
 * MartijnVdS will be on a train tomorrow
<MartijnVdS> To the land of the Germans
<SuperEngineer> Rumour has it EA Games is up for sale... let's start another rumour... thev've only had to do this because they weren't the ones who joined the Linux community ;)
<MartijnVdS> 8-)
<jacobw> MartijnVdS: sehr geehrter :)
<Azelphur> valve announces major web video innovation, http://steamcommunity.com/groups/NewSteamCommunityBeta/announcements/detail/1639562542651419978 \o/
<AlanBell> car, bus, train, tube, DLR, cable car, boat, train, bus, car
<penguin42> no plane?
<AlanBell> well the emirates cable car likes to think it is a plane
<christel> :o
<christel> once upon a time i wanted to be an airport when i grew up
<christel> i wasn't a very clever child
 * SuperEngineer decides it's time for sleepyland - been up since 5am - have fun folks, enjoy.
<brobostigon> good night everyone, sleep well.
<christel> nn brobostigon :)
<zumo__> Good morning interwebs.
<zumo__> Anyone have a benchmark tool suggestion?
<zumo__> I want to see which of the two machines I have is better. I know what one is better spec wise, But I have a feeling the other machine actually preforms better.
<ali1234> depends what you want to test
<sam_> hi
<penguin42> zumo__: Yes as ali1234 says - depends on what to test, I think phoronix have a whole suite
<zumo__> Yea im just looking at that now
<ali1234> yeah, but phoronix suite is huge and the results are rather hard to interpret
<zumo__> I just need to compare the CPU and probally the memory (I will be using the same sticks so its probally a motherboards use of it id be testing)
<zumo__> Yea, I need to see what CPU actually performs better.
<ali1234> memtest86 will benchmark your ram bandwidth
<zumo__> Ive used memtest86 for checking to see if my ram is good, Beyond that, I have no idea on using the tool correctly
<penguin42> zumo__: Well do something you normally do - e.g. if you're a programmer try a big compilation
<ali1234> CPU is again difficult to benchmark... it depends what kind of operations
<zumo__> The PC's im using are old rubbish, Throw together from bits.
<ali1234> maybe you could tell us the two specs, and what operations you think are slower than they should be
<zumo__> One machine is an AMD single core clocked at 2Ghz
<zumo__> Whilst the other I think its a celeron clocked at 2.9Ghz I think
<ali1234> that doesn't mean a great deal... need to know processor family etc
<ali1234> cat /proc/cpuinfo | pastebinit
<zumo__> The machines had windows on them but they crawled, Can't figure out if its the Ram the CPU or the motherboard, Or how its setup as a whole. Even throwing linux on them felt slower than what I had been used to
<ali1234> if you put ubuntu on old machines it won't go fast
<penguin42> zumo__: My dad's running an athlon of about 2.2GHz; it's not too bad, but some things suck
<zumo__> Thier newer than what I had been using.
<penguin42> zumo__: I run Mint with the MATE interface (i.e. Gnome2) on it for him
<penguin42> zumo__: One thing to watch out for is that Linux Flash is broken on some Athlon's
<zumo__> I just want to use the "fastest" one for web browsing. mainly
<ali1234> you also need to check graphics card and probably hard drive speed
<penguin42> zumo__: Go for the celeron
<ali1234> nvidia driver is great for gaming but dog slow with compiz
<ali1234> especially if you have a slow CPU
<Azelphur> OT question, I'm thinking about getting a credit card so I can build up a credit rating and have protection for online purchases to use instead of my debit card, any recommendations? I pretty much know nothing about the credit world lol
<ali1234> they are all the same
<Azelphur> pick the one with the prettiest logo?
<ali1234> if you pay it off every month then sure
<Azelphur> yea, that's pretty much what I was planning on
<Azelphur> can I get points / cashback things? :)
<ali1234> sure
<ali1234> they are dumb though
<ali1234> especially the points
<Azelphur> o.O
<ali1234> it's always for stuff i would never in a million years want
<ali1234> like gym memberships, or topshop
<Azelphur> ali1234: rofl, reminds me of when my brother tried to get me to switch to lloyds because they were offering air miles and a free massage
<ali1234> air miles i might actually use
<Azelphur> I'd be interested in points towards buying gadgetry or something
<ali1234> yeah good luck with that
<Azelphur> D:
<ali1234> maybe oyu can get a amazon or google credit card?
<Azelphur> that'd be fun
<ali1234> maybe you can find a cash back one
<Azelphur> what's the deal with cash back? I spend money and they give me cash sometime later?
<ali1234> no idea
<ali1234> read the websites?
<Azelphur> spose so :)
<ali1234> you should get a cash ISA too
<Azelphur> ali1234: I looked into those, the interest rates don't seem worth the effort to get it set up
<ali1234> the interest rates are tax free though
<Azelphur> talking about getting paid Â£100 a year tops with the amount of money I have
<ali1234> that's the whole point
 * Azelphur shrugs
<ali1234> and, they are worth it
<ali1234> i get 3.9% on mine
<ali1234> with no minimum amount
<Azelphur> yea, that works out at like Â£80 for me lol
<ali1234> you won't get that on any normal savings account
<ali1234> also, it is not hard to set up at all
<Azelphur> ali1234: I get more than 10x that flipping shares in bitcoin lol, so I figured my time was better spent elsewhere
<ali1234> you don't need to do anything
 * Azelphur shrugs
<Azelphur> it's usually difficult for me to sign up for things like this since I don't have a passport or drivers license
<ali1234> well get one?
<ali1234> jeez
<ali1234> get a passport man
 * Azelphur shrugs
<ali1234> cash ISA is absolutely the best way to invest for zero risk and zero work beyond setting it up and moving it every couple of years (means writing one letter)
<ali1234> it's so good there a yearly limit on how much you can invest in it
<Azelphur> spose so :)
<Azelphur> ali1234: when I bumped into ISAs I was already into the interest rates I get from bitcoin banks so the whole thing just seemed a bit meh
<ali1234> yeah well bitcoin banks are a huge gamble
<ali1234> you might as well go to the casino and put everything on red
<Azelphur> haha
<Azelphur> everybody looses in zero sum games eventually
<Azelphur> bitcoin isn't zero sum :)
<ali1234> wat
<penguin42> Azelphur: The cashback stuffs are often difficult to get; they often have things like 0.25% cashback that drops over time, and only actually gets paid if you spend more than say 10k a year
<ali1234> that is by definition not true
<Azelphur> penguin42: http://www.aquacard.co.uk/credit-cards/reward-card I found this that looks kinda cool
<Azelphur> says 3% on all purchases
<Azelphur> but I'm not sure if it's limited to Â£100 cashback
<ali1234> it says "3% on all purchases*"
<penguin42> Azelphur: That's pretty good as it goes actually
<Azelphur> ali1234:
<Azelphur> Representative
<Azelphur> 34.9%APRÂ (variable)Apply NowWe believe that sensible spending and careful account management deserve to be rewarded, so weâre offeringÂ 3% cashback on all your purchases*. A big bonus if youâve not been able to get credit before.Itâs one of the most generous cashback credit card reward rates available in the UK â and you could be eligible for it!Hereâs how the aqua Reward credit card works:Manage your account carefully by paying at least the 
<Azelphur> 3.141% or 3.432%34.92% or 39.95% or
<Azelphur> 44.94% or 49.92%Cash AdvancesN/A2.840% or 3.432% or
<Azelphur> 3.717% or 3.992%39.95% or 49.92% or
<Azelphur> 54.95% or 59.95%Balance TransfersN/A2.527% or 2.840% or
<Azelphur> 3.141% or 3.432%34.92% or 39.95% or
<Azelphur> 44.94% or 49.92%We may apply the standard interest rate to transactions before the end of the special promotion period if in any month you do not make at least your minimum payment by the payment date or if you exceed your credit limit at any time.Interest Free PeriodYou will not pay interest on purchases if you pay your balance in full and on time each month. See section 3.7 of the terms and conditions for full details.There is no interest free period 
<Azelphur> InformationYou will not pay interest on new purchases if you pay your balance in full and on time. Otherwise, the period over which interest is charged is as follows:Â FromUntilPurchasesDate debited to your accountPaid in fullCash AdvancesDate debited to your accountPaid in fullBalance TransfersDate debited to your accountPaid in fullAll Other AmountsDate debited to your accountPaid in fullAllocation Of PaymentsIf you do not pay off your balance in full
<Azelphur> Commission0%Balance Transfer Fee3% or minimum Â£3Cheque Fee3% or minimum Â£3 (on promotional rates except introductory offer)Copy Statement FeeÂ£5Statement Date
<Azelphur> Change FeeN/AProcessing Any Foreign
<ali1234> blarg
<penguin42> Azelphur: I bet they drop the 3% as soon as the contract lets them
<zumo__> Azelphur Try your bank. Avoid capital one or vanquis or anything aimed at building up your credit file. Vanquis will give you a stupidly large limit, Very easy to misuse.
<penguin42> Azelphur: Halifax has a 'reward' card that gives you 5 every month you spend over 300
<Azelphur> sorry about that, terrible failpaste
<Azelphur> ali1234: the * says that it'll be fine as long as I don't exceed my credit limit and make my payments on time
#ubuntu-uk 2012-08-19
<Azelphur> penguin42: 5 what? o.O
<penguin42> gbp
<Azelphur> hehe
<penguin42> my synergy has moved from mapping keys wrongly to mapping everything except the   key
<Azelphur> zumo__: yea, I don't think I'll have a problem with that I'm used to a debit card and will usually go by my bank balance, so I'd just pay off every month
<zumo__> I said that. Life went wrong, I had no cash. Missed payment, Very easy to spiral out of control with no help from them at all. Bank Credit cards on the other hand, You can talk to a bank manager for help
<em> is it possible to install ubuntu in the old fashioned way where you use fdisk and such?
<ali1234> yes
<ali1234> https://help.ubuntu.com/12.04/installation-guide/powerpc/linux-upgrade.html
<ali1234> just ignore powerpc specific stuff
<em> okay thanks
<zumo_> Has anyone tried madori browser?
<aLurey> uhh sup u fuckers
<Azelphur> ali1234: https://blockchain.info/address/1DkyBEKt5S2GDtv7aQw6rQepAvnsRyHoYM looks like pirate is getting ready to return the monies
<Azelphur> this is going to mess with the btc price so much haha
<zumo_> I've never really understood teh whole bitcoin thing
<christel> morning
<MartijnVdS> \o christel
<christel> helloooo my lovely dutch <3
 * MartijnVdS finishes packing his bag for YAPC::EU::2012
<MartijnVdS> http://act.yapc.eu/ye2012/
<christel> oooh :)
<christel> have lots of fun perling!
<namoamitabuddha> Hi, folk!
<namoamitabuddha> Are you all Englishmen?
<MartijnVdS> No
<MartijnVdS> Some of us are not even British ;)
<namoamitabuddha> I have some questions about this channel.
<christel> furriners, everywhere
<christel> some are not even men!
<namoamitabuddha> Bot, haha.
<MartijnVdS> christel: What?!
<namoamitabuddha> !uk
<lubotu3> Join us for a discussion using the Queen's English in #ubuntu-uk
<christel> MartijnVdS: shocking isn't it? :)
<namoamitabuddha> This is not human.
<namoamitabuddha> christel: What do you mean by "some are not even men!"?
<MartijnVdS> namoamitabuddha: some are women!
<namoamitabuddha> Well, I misinterpreted.
<namoamitabuddha> Why can't woman use Ubuntu?
<christel> and some are MACHINES
<christel> they can't?
<namoamitabuddha> !us | christel
<namoamitabuddha> !uk | christel
<lubotu3> christel: Join us for a discussion using the Queen's English in #ubuntu-uk
<namoamitabuddha> christel: That's obviously machine.
<namoamitabuddha> a machine
<namoamitabuddha> Well.
<namoamitabuddha> I have some questions about this channel.
<namoamitabuddha> Is the topic of this channel strictly limited in Ubuntu?
<namoamitabuddha> Or just a linux channel?
<christel> as the name would suggest it is an ubuntu channel, specifically that of the UK loco team -- we talk about ubuntu and about not-ubuntu, we're quite nice people so we're unlikely to get annoyed if people ask a non-ubuntu specific question -- but might direct someone who does elsewhere if we feel they'd get a better answer/more help elsewhere :)
<Myrtti> gm
<Myrtti> hot, innit
<christel> morning hotti!
<Myrtti> by l
<Myrtti> lol at backlog
<christel> hehe
<Myrtti> just realised tHis is a perfect moment for us 2 to chat
<christel> WINK WINK NUDGE NUDGE?
<Myrtti> yup
<namoamitabuddha> christel: Fair enough.
<Myrtti> I wonder where have I put my tablet stylus
<Myrtti> would ease desiging knittig patterns on the Nexus7
<namoamitabuddha> So something on-topic and something off-topic are not strictly isolated.
<namoamitabuddha> Am I right?
<Myrtti> to some extent
<christel> Myrtti: ooh what are you knitting? :)
<Myrtti> I bought laceweight purple orange for knitting a scarf for elky as a christmas present
<christel> ooh nice
<Myrtti> https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10151075125863679&set=a.87958848678.79892.77499153678&type=1
<Myrtti> very Ubuntu colours
<christel> beautiful yarn :)
 * AlanBell likes channels that pass the bechdel test
 * MartijnVdS tries to prepare for 38C
<MartijnVdS> how does that even work?
<AlanBell> 29C here later it seems
<mattt> morning morning
<AlanBell> might have to paint the fence today
<MartijnVdS> and the bikeshed? :P
<AlanBell> already painted that, you can't comment on the colour
<AlanBell> and it isn't #dd4814
<MartijnVdS> hot pink with polka dots?
<AlanBell> dark green
<christel> :o
<christel> untangling toddler-induced knots in yarn is a bit of a challenge
<brobostigon> good morning everyone.
<SuperEngineer> morninks brobostigon
<brobostigon> morning SuperEngineer
 * SuperEngineer supposes most peeps are recovering from oggcamp "Saturday Night fever" ;)
<brobostigon> lol
<mattt> bleh, hot out
<mattt> just got back from asia, was looking forward to some miserable weather :P
<brobostigon> film4, dr strangelove, :), such a good film.
<SuperEngineer> heehee, tonytiger reports on twitter:
<SuperEngineer> "The #oggcamp12 hotel is hosting an AA meeting the day after the Saturday night party. Coincidence?"
<brobostigon> lol
<SuperEngineer> In case anyone on here lives in Monmouthshire... Flood warning by Environment Agency http://tinyurl.com/d7lxq33
<Myrtti> why can't there be inland swimming beaches and areas like there are in Finland...
<SuperEngineer> Myrtti: there are about to be some in monmouthshire according to the environment agency!
<Myrtti> oh nice
<shauno> I went to one of these swimming lake things in slovakia recently.  having lived on various coasts my whole life, having to pay to go swim was odd
<shauno> and much less entertaining than swimming in the atlantic too
<Myrtti> because swimming pools and halls close for the summer in Finland in most places for people to go swim in the lakes. It's a bit baffling to see island nation with canals, meres, lodes and whatnots not using it all. also, LOL 25 meters? ridiculous. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_swimming#Lessons
<SuperEngineer> Every once in a while a Ubuntu pooter throughs me a surprise... this time Hamster Indicator found not to work on 1 netbook using UBR, but does on another!
<SuperEngineer> dconf editor used to add "all" to panel on both, both running UBR
<SuperEngineer> hmmmm.... any suggestions?
<SuperEngineer> uh oh!  barometer falling, wind speed increasing, clouds darkening....
<SuperEngineer> has somebody pulled the good-weather-plug?
<penguin42> plagues of frogs?
 * SuperEngineer checks sky for frogs
<SuperEngineer> nope... no frogs so far
<penguin42> SuperEngineer: It's because I've got the week off :-(   About Thurday the Times was predicting that tomorrow would be wonderfully sunny
<SuperEngineer> penguin42: cairo-docl weather applet still showing 5 days of sunshine here; it's internet based so surely it must be right ;)
<SuperEngineer> *dock
<penguin42> YaWP is showing sun+rain mon,tue,thu and cloud on wed
<penguin42> it might be a case of finding the sunny place and getting on a train to it
<SuperEngineer> & weather Indicator says "partly cloudy" for me here
 * SuperEngineer checks wikipedia for meaning of "partly" ;)
<penguin42> it means over where you are, leaving the gap and sunshine for the other person
<SuperEngineer> penguin42: lol
<penguin42> SuperEngineer: I'm not sure if they still do; but they used to measure cloud cover in 'octa' - or eigths of the sky; so I guess partly is some range of that
<SuperEngineer> hmm... so "partly" right now means approx 9 eighths ;)
<penguin42> yes, 1 extra just for spite
<SuperEngineer> on the bright side [pardon the pun]: glad I'm in Gloucestershire, not Monmouthshire
<SuperEngineer> [though we have been known to have a wee bit excess water around here a few years back ;)
<SuperEngineer> need to log off for a mo.  brb
<penguin42> hmm
<dogmatic69> anyone having internet issues?
<dogmatic69> not sure if its local or BT. Suddenly nothing loads fully :/
<penguin42> dogmatic69: No, but freenode blinked an hour or so ago
<dogmatic69> ye, its been about an hour or something.
<dogmatic69> (that I noticed)
<dogmatic69> cant play youtube / browse reddit. might have to do something productive.
<dogmatic69> It almost seems like UK servers are ok, outside is not
<penguin42> no, youtube is fine here
<TheOpenSourcerer> Boo - anyone got any idea how to fix this? No space left on device message but I have *loads* of space: http://paste.ubuntu.com/1155426/
<dogmatic69> eg: bbc.co.uk loads instant, nbc.com takes minutes
<dogmatic69> TheOpenSourcerer: rm -rf /
<dogmatic69> :D
<penguin42> TheOpenSourcerer: Odd, try df -i
<TheOpenSourcerer> thanks but I'll pass on that one.
<TheOpenSourcerer> dogmatic69:
<penguin42> dogmatic69: nbc.com comes up fine here - on demon
<TheOpenSourcerer> /dev/sda5             610800  608155    2645  100% /
<dogmatic69> "on demon" ?
<TheOpenSourcerer> penguin42: can I add more inodes?
<dogmatic69> TheOpenSourcerer: the "free" is pretty low there
<dogmatic69> and IUse is 100%
<dogmatic69> TheOpenSourcerer: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/653096/howto-free-inode-usage
<dogmatic69> that seems like your issue exactly
<TheOpenSourcerer> http://www.ivankuznetsov.com/2010/02/no-space-left-on-device-running-out-of-inodes.html
<dogmatic69> TheOpenSourcerer: you do php dev?
<TheOpenSourcerer> some.
<dogmatic69> "my problem was to have an incredible amount of sessions in the /lib/php/sessions directory. "
<dogmatic69> might be a good start
<TheOpenSourcerer> Yeah - just read that.
<TheOpenSourcerer> nope
<penguin42> TheOpenSourcerer: You can't easily - the best bet is to find them; now what looks a little odd there is that you've only got 600k inodes allocated - how big is / ?
<penguin42> hmm, 9G
<TheOpenSourcerer> At least I know what I'm looking for now.
<penguin42> TheOpenSourcerer: Hmm is this a standard Ubuntu install?
<TheOpenSourcerer> Yes. 10.04 server
<penguin42> TheOpenSourcerer: OK, if you find you haven't got any extra few hundred thousand tmp files somehwere then you may be finding the default allocation of inodes might be too low and it would be a bug; it's a heuristic where it allocates so many inodes per MB of space; you can tweak it during fs creation, but perhaps it might be better to increase it for small filesystems in some case
<TheOpenSourcerer> It's a low-power machine so running for i in /*; do echo $i; find $i |wc -l; done is taking a while but I'm sure I can find enough to cleanup the system. TY
<penguin42> np
<zumo> Does anyone have suggestions on "Must have" applications?
<directhex> bastion!
<directhex> spacechem!
<directhex> psychonauts!
<zumo> No games :P
<zumo> Bastion I play on teh xbox
<MartijnVdS> \o from Frankfurt
<directhex> well those are the must-have apps. anything else is optional.
<zumo> How about optional applications you would suggest.#
<dogmatic69_> zumo: google chrome
<dogmatic69_> penguin42: rebooted the router, internet is good again \o/
<penguin42> hmmm
<dogmatic69_> really good... +- 7Mbps better than usual
<zumo> dogmatic69_: Thats not optinal thats a must in my opinion! That or chromium
<dogmatic69_> zumo> Does anyone have suggestions on "Must have" applications?
<zumo>  I thought you were refering to my later comment.
<dogmatic69> zumo: the apps depend on what you do. eg: if you were a programmer shooting off a bunch of graphics packages would be pointless.
<dogmatic69> maybe tell what you do with your pc
<dogmatic69> or want to do
<zumo> just general day to do stuff
<dutchie> personally i find nuvolaplayer very useful: http://nuvolaplayer.fenryxo.cz/Home.html
<Azelphur> ali1234: rofl bitcoin price is major tanking XD
<ali1234> i know
<Azelphur> the value of my bitcoins went down ~Â£3620 in the space of a day, haha
<Azelphur> bitcoin is fun \o/
<ali1234> $14 was not a realistic price
<brobostigon> and pointless, unless you happen to have a cray lieing around.
<ali1234> reasonable price is $10 in january
<penguin42> brobostigon: I get the feeling Azelphur's bedroom would put a 10 year old cray to shame
<Azelphur> penguin42: probably :P
<brobostigon> penguin42: i see.
<Azelphur> ali1234: I'm quite proud of myself really, I made all the right choices again
<Azelphur> I did a partial cash out, right at the peak, just before BS&T closed
<Azelphur> and now it's time to hole up and wait for the price to spike again
<Azelphur> and perhaps buy low :P
<dutchie> bitcoin/currency speculation feels too much like gambling to me
<dutchie> i don't know enough about finance/economics for it not to just be blind luck
<Azelphur> dutchie: I'm blind luck that somehow manages to get it right every single time without fail
<dutchie> see, as a mathematician, i would stop now
<ging> dutchie: i can teach you all you need to know in 1 sentence
<ging> by low sell high
<Azelphur> xD
<ging> *buy
<Azelphur> also, I bought a mining rig, paid it off in the first month
<dutchie> well yes, but what is "low" and what is "high"?
<Azelphur> everything I play with at this point, is money I made mining / investing / trading
<ging> dutchie: don't complicate it
<Azelphur> so, nothing ventured nothing lost so to speak
<dutchie> fair enough then Azelphur
<soreau> dutchie: low is lower than high and high is higher than low
<dutchie> watch out, the tautology police are coming
<Azelphur> soreau: got it in one :P
<Azelphur> soreau: it's funny to watch all the silly people panicing, my bitcoins have lost about $6k in value today haha
 * Azelphur isn't even worried
<dutchie> at least with poker or something i have an understanding of what is going on, and my fate is in my own hands a lot more
<dutchie> bitcoins are pretty much at the mercy of the market (at my level at least)
<Azelphur> indeed
<ali1234> lol
<ali1234> pretty much whatever happens with pirate was going to cause a crash sooner or later
<ali1234> even if he pays out and the price recovers (which looks unlikely for several reasons) then that would lead to hundreds of copycats (who won't pay out)
<Azelphur> xD
<Azelphur> ali1234: but pirate is a scammer ponzi he ain't gonna pay out :p
 * Azelphur intends to do full face rubbing at the end of this
<ali1234> yes
<ali1234> also, even if he does, people will sell the payout
<ali1234> so either way really
<Azelphur> :P
<Azelphur> I ain't selling my payout, I'm reinvesting
<Azelphur> already have a couple of opportunities lined up
<daubers> o/
<AlanBell> o/ daubers
<AlanBell> I appear to be running out of rubbish beer
<TheOpenSourcerer> better find some un-rubbish beer then AlanBell
<AlanBell> yeah, I might have to break out the decent stuff
<daubers> So I realised over the weekend that I haven't really had a lot to do with this place recently, what's been happening?
 * TheOpenSourcerer is waiting for a Spice Station curry delivery.
<AlanBell> daubers: I made this: http://ratemyspicerack.com
<AlanBell> and some event stuff in the works: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-uk/2012-August/034895.html
<daubers> AlanBell: I saw the spice rack thing! Was all over my Twitter feed until I left
 * TheOpenSourcerer runs this most excellent command on his home-server to free up several hundred thousand inodes...
<daubers> Also, would be up for a Christmas something
 * TheOpenSourcerer ( \
 * TheOpenSourcerer KERNEL_HIGHEST=$(dpkg -l 'linux-image-[0-9.]*-[0-9]*-[a-zA-Z0-9]*' | grep ^ii | tail -n 1 | sed 's/^.*linux-image-\([0-9.]*-[0-9]*\)-[a-zA-Z0-9]*.*$/\1/') ; \
 * TheOpenSourcerer KERNEL_CURRENT=$(uname -r | sed "s/\(.*\)-\([^0-9]\+\)/\1/") ; \
 * TheOpenSourcerer sudo apt-get purge $(dpkg -l 'linux-*-[0-9-]*' | grep ^ii | awk '{print $2}' | sed "/$KERNEL_CURRENT/d;/$KERNEL_HIGHEST/d" ) ; \
 * TheOpenSourcerer )
<AlanBell> that is a command and a half
<TheOpenSourcerer> http://www.tolaris.com/2012/07/19/removing-old-kernels-from-ubuntu/
<TheOpenSourcerer> It is indeed
<AlanBell> kernel source trees is it?
<TheOpenSourcerer> Old kernels
<TheOpenSourcerer> I have ~500k indoes of old kernel trees
<penguin42> haha - that's where they went :-)
<AlanBell> oh modules
<TheOpenSourcerer> dkms
<TheOpenSourcerer> headers
<TheOpenSourcerer> shedloads
 * TheOpenSourcerer also broks a 10.04 - 12.04 upgrade today - got into a dependency broken hell loop. Will probably need to do a re-install on kid's PC.
<dutchie> daubers: you aren't the only one who has been neglecting #u-uk!
<TheOpenSourcerer> curry est arrive :-)
<TheOpenSourcerer> ttfn
<TheOpenSourcerer> 0 upgraded, 0 newly installed, 68 to remove and 2 not upgraded.
<TheOpenSourcerer> After this operation, 3,515MB disk space will be freed.
<TheOpenSourcerer> :-D
<TheOpenSourcerer> And about 400k inodes
<daubers> dutchie: Aren't you off busy being educated or somesuch?
<popey> pip pip
<popey> daubers, saw you at the stop on the m6 toll, as we drove out you walked into the place
<AlanBell> o/ popey
<dwatkins> ahh the M6
<czajkowski> aloha
<daubers> popey: hah
<daubers> popey: At least the 3h30min journey did only take 3h30 today!
<czajkowski> our 2 hrs train takes over 3 hours this time
<bittin> booking my UK tickets soon :p but only staying for 1-4 days
<TheGurkha> bittin - where in the UK are you coming to?
<bittin> TheGurkha, London
<TheGurkha> cool
<TheGurkha> I live in North Wales
<TheGurkha> we're still in the 18th Century
<bittin> :p
<TheGurkha> lol
<TheGurkha> North Wales is ace, but the tiny village I live in still doesn't even have main sewage!
<bittin> ah well i live in Stockholm lol
<TheGurkha> awesome
<dutchie> daubers: i'm on holiday!
<dutchie> but yes, most of my time is being spent learning completely useless maths
<zumo> Can anyone here help me setup my old machines hardware for the best machine?
<penguin42> zumo: Sure
<zumo> penguin42 http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?p=12182283#post12182283
<penguin42> zumo: I'm confused - the HD5450 is a PCIe card, but the motherboard is PCI
<zumo> Give me a second till I look
<zumo> Just looked. Its defo PCI Express
<penguin42> zumo: Well is that the right motherboard you're listing?
<zumo> Yup
<penguin42> oh I see
<penguin42> sorry
<penguin42> It's got 1 big PCI-e slot, and 3 PCI - that's very odd!
<penguin42> zumo: OK, so it's fairly simple; go for the HD5450 and probably the P4 2.66GHz,
<zumo> Any ideas on bios settings?
<zumo> I know the board lets me do some overclocking and voltage stuff
 * penguin42 tends not to overclock stuff
<zumo> ram settings?
<penguin42> I'd go with whatever the BIOS decides - it should read it off the DIMM
<penguin42> (Yes, you probably can get a little more perf out of it but test a lot to see if it's stable)
<penguin42> zumo: so that's an OK graphics card on a very old CPU and motherboard/RAM; a slightly odd mix
<zumo> Yea my PCs are usually build out of salvaged machines.
<penguin42> zumo: I mean my dads machines are similar ages - although he doesn't have a graphics card that nice
<penguin42> zumo: So you're OK, it *should* work
<zumo> I picked it up to help my minecrafting
<zumo> However I ran into stupid issues getting it to work on linux mint.
<zumo> So back to windows I went.
<zumo> Hence why I have backup hardware!
<penguin42> zumo: That should work on mint - I mean I'd recommend Mint, and MATE in particular as a desktop given that hardware; I use the older HD4xxx series Radeon on my i7
<zumo> Planning on running lubuntu as the damn machine normally feels piss poor
<penguin42> yeh that should work
<zumo> Can't wait to be able to actually being able to BUY a machine again instead of salavaged scrap.
<penguin42> zumo: Well, I was going to wonder what you could get for your spare CPUs and graphics card; but I doubt it's enough for a usefully newer CPU and board and RAM
<zumo> I have every intention of buying this once I have money
<zumo> http://www.ebuyer.com/389623-zoostorm-desktop-pc-7873-1066
<zumo> give it a ram upgrade and it will do anything I need it to do for the next year. when I will buy whatever kicks i7s ass by then,
<penguin42> heck; that's cheap :-)  The cheapest I managed was about 200 for the machine I bought my mum last November, that was a Dual core Celeron with 4GB (or is it 8GB) - pretty much cheapest on everything at Scan
<zumo> Somethuing like this?
<zumo> http://www.ebuyer.com/389049-zoostorm-desktop-pc-7873-1060
<zumo> Yea what ive found machines like that are cheaper to buy than build. The fact it has no OS helps too
<penguin42> yeh, similar
<penguin42> but yeh, it might be time to upgrade my dads machines - as you find out, with hardware that old it's a pain to keep stuff up to date
<zumo> Yea ive had to dig this out becasue I NEED it. Not becasue I want to :/
<zumo> Looking at basic machines, I dislike these new intel machines
<penguin42> why?
<zumo> Anything with the word pentium or celeron just confusses me these days.,
<zumo> Probally due to the fact I still use P4s and celerons and celeron ds
<penguin42> zumo: Oh, just read them as 'low end version of...' and then you still have to figure out what gen they're a low end version of
<penguin42> zumo: ark.intel.com is the best site for decoding them IMHO
<zumo> Yea I won't be picking up an intel processor if its not i3/5/7 or newer
 * penguin42 pats his i7
<zumo> Yea yea rub it in it.
<zumo> Me and my P4 are away to find the thermal paste.
<zumo> I'll rub it right in.
<zumo> Sounds mildly sexualy o.O
<penguin42> always good to keep your thermal paste handy
<zumo> Its in a one of my drawers.
<zumo> Its a shame its cheap nasty goo.
<zumo> I hate thermal paste
<Seeker`> why?
<zumo> The stuff I have is cheap crap and its a nightmare to clean.
<zumo> Also im never sure how much to use!
<zumo> penguin42 I have a CPU here I WISH i could use, but I am still to find a salvagable board for it.
<penguin42> what's that?
#ubuntu-uk 2013-08-12
<sVooX> ="
<knightwise> morning everyone
<MooDoo_> morning
<knightwise> hey MooDoo ! :)
<knightwise> how are you today :)
<MooDoo> knightwise: it's 07:27 and I'm in the office.....er FAB ;)
<jussi> MooDoo: do you have a long trip to your office?  (Im often in mine at that time)
<MooDoo> jussi: no it's about 40 mins from my house, I'm on the 7am start this week
<jussi> MooDoo: ahh much longer than my commute then. :D
 * jussi 's commute is approx 15 steps :D
<MooDoo> jussi: ah work from home?
<jussi> MooDoo: yep
<jussi> MooDoo: what kind of work do you do?
<MooDoo> jussi: tech support for an web hosting company
<jussi> ahh yeah. Im one of those nasty salespeople (although for a software/open source type company)
<MooDoo> :)
<jussi> (and no, its not canonical :P )
<MooDoo> hehe
<MartijnVdS> jussi: as long as you don't sell things the devteam can't make.. ;)
<jussi> MartijnVdS: of course I do!
<jussi> :P
<knightwise> anyone know a good command line bittorrent client ?
<MooDoo> rtorrent i think
<dwatkins> yeah, rtorrent is pretty nifty
<TheOpenSourcerer> morning earthlings
<dwatkins> greetings TheOpenSourcerer
<MooDoo> mornign
<MartijnVdS> \o TheOpenSourcerer
<dwatkins> ...and everyone else ;)
<TheOpenSourcerer> Back after a week off.
<TheOpenSourcerer> Not terribly motivated this morning. :-(
<MooDoo> I can believe it
<MartijnVdS> TheOpenSourcerer: This week: http://www.gbbf.org.uk/
<MartijnVdS> TheOpenSourcerer: if you want something to look forward to ;)
<TheOpenSourcerer> Ahh
<TheOpenSourcerer> I've been to that a few times recently.
<TheOpenSourcerer> Yesterday I was here: http://www.westdean.org.uk/Garden/News%20and%20Events/ChilliFiesta.aspx
<MartijnVdS> TheOpenSourcerer: cool (hot?)
<TheOpenSourcerer> yep
<AlanBell> morning
<TheOpenSourcerer> \o AlanBell
<DJones> Morning
<brobostigon> good morning everyone,
<popey> Morning.
<brobostigon> morning popey
<SuperMatt> morning funky-hatted people
<JamesTait> Good morning all, happy Youth Day! :-D
<SuperMatt> bah
<SuperMatt> youth
<SuperMatt> I remember that
<bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
<DJones> SuperMatt: Remembr youth? If I wasn't going senile, I might remember it
<mungbean_> what class of micro sd card should i be getting for my phone?
<popey> AlanBell: you said alt-tab was better in 13.10, can you test something for me pls?
<popey> on workspace 1, open some apps (terminal and browser for example), then switch to workspace 2, open a terminal there so it's the in-focus app
<popey> now switch back to workspace 1, alt-tab
<popey> note that it keeps you in terminal, rather than taking you to the browser
<Guest14455> nick mungbean
<mungbean_> is there anythig faster than a class 10 micro sd?
<directhex> yes
<directhex> UHS grade 1
<directhex> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Secure_Digital#Speeds
<mungbean_> still 10MB/s?
<mungbean_> my sd card is struggling as i've offset my internal phone storage onto it for apps et
<mungbean_> cos the htc desire has pitiful internal storage
<mungbean_> makes even the keyboard laggy
<mungbean_> but i already have a class 10
<DJones> mungbean_: I've got a class 10 in my Galaxy S3 with quite a few apps on the card, I can't say I've noticed any speed issues, that may just be because its a newer & faster phone though
<mungbean_> i'm not doing the android "move to SD" thing though
<mungbean_> rather formatted part of the sd card to use as internal storage
<bigcalm> mungbean_: I think that you'll be limited by the hardware of the Desire
<mungbean_> :(
<bigcalm> This is my idle speculation
<mungbean_> it speeds up when i clear cache etc
<bigcalm> Yes, I found that with my Nexus One, before I sold it to my Dad
<DJones> mungbean_: http://androidforums.com/htc-desire/304477-whats-fastest-sd-card-htc-desire-can-handle.html Suggests that even if you put a class 10 in, the desire is only capeable of accessing at class 6 speeds
<mungbean_> bah
<mungbean_> looks like i have to put up with it then
<mungbean_> my missis doesn't suffer the same
<mungbean_> (or doesn't complain)
<DJones> The comment could be something thats not supported by facts though, maybe have to check the hardware spec to confirm it
<mungbean_> apps are certainly getting a lot bigger
<mungbean_> why is ebay and amazon app 10mb+
<bigcalm> Partly why I continue to use web interfaces rather than apps
<bigcalm> Very much so for Facebook, but then I don't use FB a whole lot any way
<directhex> also, remember that the controller matters as much as the card
<directhex> and most cards on the market are fakes which don't meet the stated speed class
<DJones> The app's are 512K, its the adverts that make up the other 9.5Mb :)
<mungbean_> it works OK sometimes but suffers from android lag
<mungbean_> i was sad to hve to replace tweetdeck
<mungbean_> installed the official twitter app and i have to sign in each time,. doesn't remember password
<popey> damnit, made a cup of tea, left it in the kitchen #fml
<bigcalm> Ha
<bigcalm> popey: nothing worse in life eh?
<DJones> That'd be more of problem if it was the kitchen at home and you were in the office
<mungbean_> ewww tea
<bigcalm> Will be sad not to go to oggcamp this year. Will somebody bring back a mug for me? :D
 * popey no longer drinks coffee â¹
<bigcalm> That said, winning 2 mugs last year in the raffle was a little much
<bigcalm> (which have yet to be used)
<popey> i use mine daily
<bigcalm> Oh, the oggcamp mugs we use, I mean the chalk board mugs are still in their boxes
<Oli> Any electricians (amateur or otherwise) in here? I'm looking for a crimp that can securely hold two wires that have been twisted together without anything else come in and touch them. Sort of like a poor man's terminal connection. Certain they exist but I can't convince Google or Amazon to show me them. What's the proper name?
<DJones> Duct tape?
<Oli> That is my current option, yes
<DJones> Thats about as near as I could come up with
<bigcalm> Oli: so you don't want to use a chocolate block?
<DJones> Chocolate blocks
<Oli> bigcalm: truth is there may be more than one cable... There may be three or four.
<popey> yeah, you should use choc blocks
<Oli> Oh okay, you win
<popey> http://www.amazon.co.uk/BLUE-BUTT-TERMINAL-CRIMP-CONNECTORS/dp/B0046V1G9I/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1376302033&sr=8-2&keywords=crimp+connectors
<popey> or those are what you specifically asked for?
<DJones> There are some I've used on a car that take a 2 cables into a connector, the connector has a hole at each end and just compresses using pliers
<popey> http://www.amazon.co.uk/Way-Gel-Filled-Connector-Crimps-Packet/dp/B007FGX3TW/ref=sr_1_8?ie=UTF8&qid=1376302050&sr=8-8&keywords=crimp+connectors
<popey> or those for multi-way
<DJones> Hmmh, popey read my mind
<popey> amazon did
<davmor2> Morning all
<Oli> Butt terminals could do the job...
<DJones> That was exactly what I was thinking of anyway
<Oli> That gel one looks a bit whacky
<bigcalm> Waterproof though
<Oli> True
<DJones> That just makes want to go out and buy a packet of gummi bears
<Oli> These are what I was thinking of origininally: http://img.alibaba.com/wsphoto/v0/602861800_1/free-shipping-1000-pcs-Nylon-Crimp-Caps-Gauge-Wire-Connectors-Terminals-Close-End-Wire-Terminal.jpg
<bigcalm> I think that there is a kind of screw on version of those as well
<Oli> That sounds familiar
<bigcalm> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twist-on_wire_connector
<AlanBell> popey: yes, it does
<AlanBell> hmm, is that expected or not I wonder
<popey> seems like a bug to me?
<AlanBell> dunno, I expect the developers would dispute that
<AlanBell> however the designers might not
<AlanBell> alt-tab takes you to the last application type you had focus on, which was terminal, on the other workspace
<popey> i will poke a designer
<popey> and then talk to them on irc
<AlanBell> or it takes you to the last window you had open, which was terminal on the other workspace
<mungbean_> should i be able to add my ssh key to a keyring so i never have to type the password after logging in?
<mungbean_> doesn't seem to work for me
<directhex> yes, you should.
<mungbean_> ah, under details i had "lock this key when i log out" selected
<popey> AlanBell: confirmed with design it's a bug, can you confirm pls https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/1211261
<lubotu3> Launchpad bug 1211261 in unity (Ubuntu) "alt-tab selects incorrect window when using workspaces" [Undecided,New]
<AlanBell> popey: do you sometimes see the top bar shadow overlayed on browser tabs of maximised browsers?
<AlanBell> especially after changing monitor configurations a bit
<popey> i can't say i have
<popey> but i haven't plugged my laptop into an external display for a while
<popey> bigcalm: i may have to duck out of the real ale train â¹
<bigcalm> Noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo :(
<bigcalm> Life happens to us all but you shall be missed
 * TheOpenSourcerer will also not be going on the RAT - I'll be in Italy. Anyone want to buy my ticket?
<popey> well, i _could_ go, but i am off booze, so I would have to set around watching you lot get drunk
<bigcalm> :O
<bigcalm> Oh gawd
<popey> guess i could go â»
<popey> and drive home after â»
<AlanBell> designated driver \o/
<popey> yeah, why not, i love steam trains and I've already paid for the ticket :D
<mgdm> I was thinking about going but it's a bit of a trek
<jussi> popey: just make it 10Â£ per person for a lift home, and youll end up with more than you came...
<mgdm> TheOpenSourcerer: I might, I will investigate further after lunch
<popey> haha
<bigcalm> Is this a short term change of drinking habit, or does it continue to the 25th October?
<popey> good idea!
<popey> bigcalm: not sure
<popey> see what doc says
<mgdm> Oh, medical reasons :/
<bigcalm> popey: there will be other drinks, so as long as you come :)
<TheOpenSourcerer> popey: Change your doc. Mine recommends 21 Units a day ;-)
<jussi> haah
<bigcalm> Nice
<jussi> TheOpenSourcerer: are you your own doctor? :D
<bigcalm> mgdm: a bit of a trek, but a damn good night out
<TheOpenSourcerer> lol - nope.
<mgdm> bigcalm: where is it again?
<popey> alton
<bigcalm> mgdm: http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/ubuntu-uk/2320-real-ale-train/
<bigcalm> (not Alton Towers)
<JethroTroll> We need an #ubuntu-uk meet at Alton Towers!!
<JethroTroll> AlanBell will smuggle the food in.
<bigcalm> Did somebody mention cake? What a good idea
<jussi> bigcalm: the cake is a lie!
<MartijnVdS> </predictable>
<bigcalm> This cake is no lie :D
<davmor2> it is a lie to us :P
<bigcalm> http://pushingthewrongbuttons.tumblr.com/post/57971649835/sunday-is-cake-baking-day
 * bigcalm noms
<davmor2> bigcalm: very nice
<bigcalm> davmor2: I may have over done the butter icing a little
<andylockran> morning alls
<bigcalm> For a moment, I thought you were only greeting the Alans of the channel
<mungbean_> i think this page needs removing http://ubuntu-uk.org/ircstats/
<MartijnVdS> it's almost a year old
<Oli> But weren't we all, once?
<bigcalm> I think some of us still are
<Oli> I'll have you know I'm at least one and three quarters.
<Oli> Apologies, I think I'm having an alergic reaction to Monday. It's making me very silly.
<popey> i'll set it to redirect to brobostigon's stats
<popey> where are they?
<dvrr> chkconfig  not install  in ubuntu12.10
<popey> sudo apt-get install chkconfig
<dvrr> i try to install  apt-get  i face  problem   "E: Package 'chkconfig' has no installation candidate"
<dvrr> popey
<popey> ooh, seems it's been removed
<popey> i wonder why
<popey> http://askubuntu.com/questions/221293/why-chkconfig-is-not-available-in-ubuntu-12-10
<davmor2> man gvfs has a big hit on speed, nautilus over ssh using gvfs 4.2 Gb/s,  scp 11.8 Gb/s on the same file
<Guest22339> why does Firefox not use libnotify other than it not linking directly to downloads folder after a download being completed
<bigcalm> davmor2: GB not KB?
<bigcalm> Or even MB
<davmor2> bigcalm: it's a backup on the local network
<bigcalm> I would be happy with 4.2GB/s over a network connection :)
<davmor2> bigcalm: no you're right sorry Mb/s
<davmor2> but still it's a huge performance hit
 * bigcalm prints and frames
<davmor2> bigcalm: only this time most of the time you're wrong :P
<bigcalm> Ha
<davmor2> bigcalm: as I say though it's still a huge speed difference scp for the win me thinks :)
<bigcalm> Quite
<bigcalm> I see the same over CIFS. Haven't checked the speed of NFS yet
<dwatkins> I've got my NAS mounted via NFS, and I get 11 Megabytes/s out of it.
<dwatkins> nfsstat tells me I'm using NFS v3.
<^2fC> lo :)
<Oli> I get 113MB/s read over gigabit+NFS
<Oli> Fades a bit after a few seconds to ~100-110MB/s
<Oli> And that's a pv copy from RAID5 (nfs server) to /dev/null (so there's no write slowdown factored into that)
<dwatkins> I imagine my speed is somewhat reduced by being over 100 MBit/s ethernet and to a rather old netbook.
<mungbean> just ate the most disappointing sandwich ever.
<dwatkins> what was in it, just margarine, mungbean?
<mungbean> plum sauce and duck
<mungbean> sounds lovely but was tasteless and minging
<SuperMatt> mmm duck
<brobostigon> i hope the stats are working right.
<mungbean> i've lost the tux babygro ..wonder if my wife has "lost" it
<mungbean> wanted to put my daughter in it
<MartijnVdS> https://github.com/philipl/pifs
<Guest67532> why doesfirefox not use libnotify for notifications
<popey> brobostigon: link?
<brobostigon-quas> taylorworld.me.uk/ubuntu-uk.HTML
<brobostigon-quas> sorry, it messed up the case.
<popey> looks like it's working fine
<brobostigon-quas> cool, good.
<mungbean> do you also collect monthly stats rather than alltime brobostigon-quas ?
<mungbean> and what happened to gord?
<brobostigon-quas> umm.
<popey> http://ubuntu-uk.org/ircstats/ now redirects
<popey> he left canonical to do other things
<popey> some while back now
<brobostigon-quas> OK. I will do my best to keep it running properly.
<mgdm> mrevell: did Chris Molozian move to another company?
<mungbean> sorry i didn't explain, i mean, "most active nicks" is often more useful over a month period rather than all time , innit?
<mrevell> mgdm, I think he is contracting.
<mgdm> mrevell: Ah. I got an email from Lee this morning saying 'Chris is no longer with us', which I took to mean he'd left the company, not that he'd left this existence...
<mrevell> hah, no, he is alive :)
<mgdm> hehe
<mgdm> good :-)
<mungbean> "Please clear this box if you would not like to receive offers and information from us"
<mungbean> arggh confusing!!
<popey> mungbean: i hate the ones that have two boxes, one you have to tick, one you have to not tick
<mungbean> yes, there followed a similar reverse question
<mungbean> was stressful enough jst buying the product
<popey> heh
<mungbean> roofbars for my motor
 * bigcalm returns from a lunch time nap - working from home++
<mungbean> i wonder if g+ will ever take off
<mungbean> i just have loads of contacts who never post anything, and nr do i
<dwatkins> I use it quite a lot, but most people I know on there are technical-types.
<mungbean> ask.fm must have benefitted from a lot of free publicity from the dailymail as somebody has signed up with my email address.
<dwatkins> how does that get them free publicity?
<popey> I'd say G+ has taken off
<bigcalm> I've stopped looking at it
<popey> given both my brother and sister out of the blue said they want to leave facebook, and try something else like twitter & G+
<popey> neither of them are techy at all
<popey> and I never talk about G+ to them, so it's not my influence
<dwatkins> my niece left Facebook for a week.
<mungbean> i like facebook
<dwatkins> she's 15, though, this sort of thing is just what I expect as the on-going drama of being a teenager ;)
<dwatkins> I saw the reason why - some kid at her school was horrid
<dwatkins> (in a completely inappropriate way, too, but I won't go into details)
<Oli> It's going to be amazing for kids these days when they're 40 and they look back at all this crap that Facebook kindly logged for them.
<popey> my aunt created a new account because "my old one had thousands of friends, and I wanted a clean start"
<popey> my neice posted photos of her driving license online â¹
<zleap> i just got bored with facebook
<zleap> ended up with 2 accounts as someone invited me and i was unable to work out how to add them to what i already had
<mungbean> my family alone is around 70 people
<mungbean> maybe nearer 100
<mungbean> cousins and brothers , uncles etc
<Oli> That's a lot of people.
<popey> i have "30 friends" apparently
<Oli> On facebook or just generally?
<popey> fb
<mungbean> i have about 30 in my staging area
<mungbean> similar number waiting in linked for rejection
<Oli> You make your friends audition?
<popey> and i follow 1100 people on G+
<Oli> cripes
<AlanBell> if I post a picture of my kids building a robot arm, on Facebook people are more interested in what my kids are up to in the holidays, on G+ people want to know what python library we used
<bigcalm> :D
<mungbean> fb has more control and access to comments and notifications
<mungbean> g+ handling of all that is terrible
<AlanBell> I have zero clue who sees what on facebook
<AlanBell> and why stuff turns up in my feed
<zleap> AlanBell, cool re robot arm
<popey> some of my family found out of my fathers death because someone tagged him and said something
<zleap> tom on the dclug has a voice controlled robot arm
<popey> so everyone who is a friend of his found out
<zleap> not good i guess
<popey> indeed
<mungbean> unless you want that info out there, then its an excellent medium
<dwatkins> I tagged someone on facebook who I wasn't aware had passed away :(
<AlanBell> at some point I will probably unfriend pretty much everyone who isn't a relative on facebook
<popey> thats exactly what I did
<popey> and only use fb for family and for school / ballet groups, and admin of UUPC etc
<mungbean> i belong to a large church (well over 1000 ppl each week), so there's a massive social side too
<zleap> i just go to the page of my local rugby club,  theyh have several, i can't be botered enough to make an account and trawl all the different club fb pages for info
<mungbean> its a good way for people to share their lives when you don't get chance to see them each week
<zleap> yeah but if done properly
<popey> yeah, since my dad went, his wife is on fb a lot, staying in contact and asking me for pc support
<zleap> but the club also has a website it would be better to put events there and then have everyone share on their individual pages
<zleap> i like the look of the plymouthwebdev group it has one simple webpage and a twitter link
<zleap> so nice and simple,  the page as info about them and info as to when the meetings are
<directhex> http://www.bbc.co.uk/cbeebies/lingo-show/songs/lingo-show-blodwen-hello/
<Oli> What is this?!
<Oli> It burns.
 * popey chuckles at @straightprideuk going full streisand
<popey> although pretty sure it's an elaborate troll.
<AlanBell> it is probably Anne Widicombe
<mungbean> considering they mention gingerpride...pretty sure.
<AlanBell> is codeplex good or bad? http://phpexcel.codeplex.com/ looks potentially useful
<halt> HI guys, i try to configure sudo but got a syntax error could you guys have a look at it ?
<AlanBell> halt: that doesn't quite make sense, but do ask your real question
<halt> I have just simple file called user in the /etc/sudoers.d folder with 0440 permission, and the content of the file is "user ALL=NOPASSWD:/bin/su admin_user"
<AlanBell> oh, maybe it does make sense :)
<halt> i got the >>> /etc/sudoers.d/user: syntax error near line 0 <<<   message
<halt> AlanBell: got it I think it's a bug
<halt> i have to open one more line in the file
<halt> then it's wroking, so if i have one single line then it's give me a sytax error, if i have one enter on the end of the line then it's works
<Azelphur> popey: do you do full drive backups with rsnapshot? if so, can you show me your backup line? :)
<bigcalm> rdiff-backup FTW :D
<popey> Azelphur: backup line?
<Azelphur> yea, the line with all the excludes and scuh
<Azelphur> such(
<popey> i dont have excludes in the individual backup lines
<popey> i have excludes separately
<Azelphur> oh?
<popey> because i do the same excludes on all machines
<Azelphur> I see
<Azelphur> I'm game for that anyway tbh, would be nice to have full drive backups of all my stuff
<popey> i exclude /dev /proc /tmp /sys /lib/udev/devices and /home/.ecryptfs
<Azelphur> cool, ty :)
<popey> np
<awilkins> Just wasted 40 minutes of my life checking DLL versions on Windows copies of Apache2 / OpenSSL
<diddledan> awilkins: why?
<DJones> Can anybody suggest a reason for this http://imagebin.org/267290 Updated software is available, do I want to install it, but it doesn't tell me what it wants to update
<awilkins> diddledan, Because our IT department gives us a free Security Check and sends us horrible vulnerability reports
<awilkins> diddledan, The real question is : why the hell are we running services that run entirely off Apache, Java and Tomcat on *!&^^Â£!"Â£ Windows 2003 server
<diddledan> DJones: it's a malware update :-p
<awilkins> The philosophical question is : Why doesn't Windows have a proper fricking package manager
<diddledan> awilkins: ouch, and yes, it should be running on a POSIX system!
<DJones> diddledan: At least updating in a terminal tells me its bamfdaemon, libbamf3-1 and libdvdnav4
<awilkins> The answer to the question is that these are virtual machines and our ICT dept is too "underskilled" to support Linux in a VM
<diddledan> DJones: as I said, malware :-p
<diddledan> whart?!
<awilkins> Bah
<awilkins> diddledan, They only have people who know how to break Windows, ysee
<diddledan> thank god our techy team (including me in that) is entirely linux-based
<diddledan> we're only small though, so we're able to be agile in that way
<awilkins> Right, I'm blowing this popsicle stand and going home
<diddledan> I've finally started moving our old outdated gentoo systems to ubuntu \o/
<diddledan> our issue tracker and nagios setup are going to be the first to go
<daftykins> some snaps of my island if anyones interested
<daftykins> https://www.dropbox.com/sh/em6gqyhhbc4e01p/gT4UekIhov
<popey> pretty place
<diddledan> daftykins: I'm not sure you can claim ownership
<daftykins> diddledan: after an accident one day i was left with a scar on my hand in the exact shape of the island, now i'm King due to old laws
<daftykins> it's just yet to sink in to general knowledge... ;)
<diddledan> lol
<daftykins> popey: sure can be!
 * davmor2 has an image of Braveheart in his head with daftykins saying My Island
<diddledan> <weird accent>they can take our homes and our familiies and everything, but they cannot take our FREEDOM! oh wait, hang on.</weird accent>
<diddledan> obviously that's paraphrased a bit
 * dwatkins hands diddledan the blue paint
<diddledan> mmm, tasty
<diddledan> so, ubuntu phased updates. will they be used for security patches or only non-security updates?
<TheOpenSourcerer> https://plus.google.com/u/0/104060033182234025482/posts/FAhn1YNnkjv
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> there's a guy over here who has a second bike frame mounted on top of a first, so he's sat right up high like stilts height
<daftykins> seems a frightening thing to ride
<TheOpenSourcerer> Yay! England win the Ashes!
<brobostigon> the brobostigon'ator is watching TBBT.
<diddledan> o_O
<diddledan> is that another simon cowell thing. first there was britain's got talent (BGT) now there's TBBT (The best British Talent)?
<mgdm> The Big Bang Theory
<diddledan> aah
<diddledan> close
<diddledan> I nearly got it first time
<brobostigon> he blasphemed, not knowing TBBT, :D
<diddledan> be honest, sciency types can't blaspheme, that's a religious thing.
<diddledan> ok, closest seaside has to be more than 50 miles away, yet I keep hearing dozens of gulls
<brobostigon> diddledan: yes , i know, cant one make a joke?
<diddledan> brobostigon: in your case, probably not. certainly if that's your best effort :-p
<ali1234> burn
<diddledan> I'm a witch now?
<mgdm> diddledan: you're in no position to be revoking anyone's licence to make jokes. :P
<diddledan> mgdm: but.. I have a homemade "humour police" shield and everything!
<brobostigon> diddledan: my best recent joke, is designing a baby brow for my brother and his partner, that says the following on a prison patterned texture, "i have been inside for 9 months"
<diddledan> brobostigon: lol
<brobostigon> grow*
<brobostigon> diddledan: now thats a joke. :)
<TheOpenSourcerer> Time for University Challenge...
<diddledan> I'm not geek enough to do well at university challenge
<diddledan> the computer related questions are always widdle-easy though.
<diddledan> I'm sure they must have had a question along the lines "after what mammal is a computer's pointing device named?"
<mgdm> the last computer question I remember was 'what does the A in LAMP stand for?'
<diddledan> did paxman pretend he knew the answer?
<mgdm> he didn't have to pretend, seeing as it was written in front of him
<diddledan> yeah, but sometimes he's incredulous that the teams don't know
<diddledan> so he rubs their nose in it
<diddledan> he's somewhat confrontational
<diddledan> with his "come on!!!!"s
<AlanBell> popey: when you hover over the sound indicator, and use the mouse wheel, should it change the volume like it used to do, or should you have to click it and hover over the slider and roll the wheel in what feels to me like the wrong way?
<popey> heh
<popey> i didnt know you used to be able to by just hovering over the indicator
<popey> i thought you always had to open the indicator menu up
<MartijnVdS> i filed a bug about that 2 weeks ago
<popey> yay
<MartijnVdS> let me find the number
<MartijnVdS> bug 1220470
<lubotu3> Error: Launchpad bug 1220470 could not be found
<MartijnVdS> which got merged into bug 1204036
<lubotu3> bug 1204036 in The Sound Menu "Mouse wheel stopped working on Saucy" [Undecided,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1204036
 * popey "Me too's"
<AlanBell> I guess the dash downloading and showing you screenshots of applications you ask it to launch is a feature though
<AlanBell> oh, maybe they stopped that now
<AlanBell> yay, they did
<ali1234> wow, i thought everyone knew about the mouse wheel thing
<ali1234> i wonder if that is broken if you use the sound indicator on gnome-panel?
<AlanBell> it is a really nice feature, because you can change it without taking focus from any windows
<ali1234> yes
<ali1234> switching focus is always risky
<ali1234> although technically clicking the indicator doesn't remove focus from the current window, at least not with gnome-panel and metacity
<AlanBell> mainly because videos tend to un-fullscreen themselves, even if you do something on another monitor, but you can (could) do the volume change
<ali1234> yeah there's that
<ali1234> although i have seen applications that will un-fullscreen if you even so much as use the keyboard volume controls
<ali1234> and then there's stuff that blocks keyboard controls and trap the mouse inside the fullscreen window (SDL!!!)
<ali1234> i think that's fixed in SDL2 though
<mungbean> man, i still cannot disable the ubuntu bongos in 12.04
<ali1234> my dad accidentally booted into ubuntu one time and then asked me "what's umbongo tv?"
<mungbean> :D
<mungbean> they drink it in the congo
<mungbean> ah, dconf-editor has a setting, maybe 3rd time lucky
<diddledan> umbongo tv? where'd the tv come from?
<diddledan> I love that about mikrotik software/hardware - lose your router ip and you can still admin it via mac address to reconfigure it's ip to something known (provided you're on the same L2)
<diddledan> added benefit is it stays connected even when your local IP changes, such as when you're fiddling
<diddledan> and we all know what sysadmins are like for fiddling (I'm no exception there!)
<ali1234> i dunno
<shauno> they're still problems?  ipv6 solves that for me
<ali1234> you can do the mac trick on any router
<ali1234> you have to know it's subnet though
<AlanBell> how does that work then?
<diddledan> knowing the subnet isn't a given
<ali1234> you create a fake entry in the arp table for a made up IP, then anything you send to that IP will go to the router's MAC
<ali1234> you won't get any packets back though if the subnet is wrong, because the router will just get "no route to host" when it tries to reply
<diddledan> mikrotik works without knowing anything about the device other than it's mac
<ali1234> most likely it has a special service which broadcasts the router address when it receives a special packet
<diddledan> how would that work when I'm in a different subnet tho?
<ali1234> because when you're in a different subnet you can send a packet to the router by arp spoofing
<ali1234> you just can't receive anything back
<ali1234> so the router gets the packet and sends a broadcast packet
<shauno> pretty much the same as dhcp, but in reverse order.  you broadcast the answer instead of the question
<diddledan> hmm
<ali1234> yeah. needs special software on the router, but it's trivial to implement
<ali1234> there are other tricks you can use if you don't have that
<diddledan> they totally need to implement that kind of feature into ssh(d)
<ali1234> why sshd?
<diddledan> because most equipment these days has an sshd installed so if you lose a device you will still be able to ssh to it
<diddledan> I certainly am not going to advocate using telnet
<shauno> I don't get why it's ssh's problem to fix though
<diddledan> so who should fix it then?
<shauno> well, it's already fixed.  ipv6 link-local addresses + avahi
<shauno> ssh is really one of those things that should be left alone to concentrate on what its there for, rather than trying to turn it into a featureset clown car
<diddledan> brb, rebooting router
<ali1234> "clown car" :D
<ali1234> few network devices are completely silent on the network so a good trick is "sudo tcpdump -n -i eth0 ether host aa:bb:cc:dd:ee:ff" and then reboot it
<diddledan> wow, did I reboot so quickly my connection didn't drop?
<JethroTroll> Who diddled diddledan?
<diddledan> that'll be shauno , JethroTroll
<diddledan> he's always diddling me
<shauno> yeah I've done that before ali1234.  if I don't know what subnet it thinks it's on, just listen for a 'whohas' and make a good guess
 * AlanBell contemplates sitting outside watching for perseids
<diddledan> too light here
<diddledan> bloody streetlighting
#ubuntu-uk 2013-08-13
<MooDoo> morning all
<Myrtti> hiya B-)
<MooDoo> guess it's just us up eh Myrtti
<Myrtti> indeed
<Myrtti> but then again I'm two hours ahead of you
<MooDoo> there is that
<jussi> Im also in same tz as Myrtti, and Im awake :)
<jussi> MooDoo: early shift again?
<MooDoo> yeah
<Myrtti> I'm just listening to Stevie Wonder
<jussi> I have wild blueberries and yoghurt for brakfast :D
<jussi> and they are NOM
<Myrtti> apparently I should make a cake
<jussi> Myrtti: why is that?
<Myrtti> cakeday today
<MooDoo> yay cake
<neuro> Myrtti: happy cake day!
<Myrtti> neuro: â¥
<Myrtti> thanks
<neuro> just think of it less as another year older, but more as an excuse to caek
 * neuro is listening to "Viva Las Vegas" by Dead Kennedys, from the album Fresh Fruit for Rotting Vegetables. 256kbps AAC 
<neuro> ^ happy tuesday
<Myrtti> I've had this in my head since yesterday, because not only do I have a cakeday, but it seems like my luck is taking a turn for better, finally
<Myrtti> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FchMuPQOBwA
<neuro> HOLY CRAP, that was close
<neuro> that played for like 0.5 seconds
<Myrtti> :-D
<MartijnVdS> dead kennedys at 256kbps AAC? does that really make a difference? ;)
<neuro> no idea, it's what streamed down off iTunes Match
<Myrtti> MartijnVdS: could be worse
<Myrtti> could be nickelback
<MartijnVdS> Myrtti: low blow :)
<neuro> I am proud to say ...
<neuro> grissom:Music neuro$ find . -name Nickelback
<neuro> grissom:Music neuro$
<MartijnVdS> finn . -iname \*nickelback\*
<MartijnVdS> find*
<neuro> grissom:Music neuro$ find . -iname \*nickelback\*
<neuro> grissom:Music neuro$
<neuro> my collection is pure
<MartijnVdS> I have one Nickelback song. On a festival sampler CD I got for free once.
<neuro> burn it
<MartijnVdS> Muziek/Various Artists/2002 - A Campingflight to Lowlands Paradise 2002/1-01 Nickelback - Where Do I Hide.flac
<MartijnVdS> it's the first track.. of the first disc..
<neuro> destroy
<MartijnVdS> neuro: but it also has Dimmu Borgir on it!
<neuro> so?
<MartijnVdS> .. to compensate?
<neuro> there is no compensation for Nickelback
<jussi> I cant see the fuss about nickelback... they are no worse than some of the other crap out there, miley cyrus comes to mind :P
<neuro> your collection is unpure
<neuro> it must be purged
<MartijnVdS> neuro: http://www.discogs.com/Various-A-Campingflight-To-Lowlands-Paradise-2002/release/803057 :)
<jussi> neuro: you are thinking about nickel back... and you just lost the game :P Having a bad day?
<jussi> :P
<neuro> i haven't lost anything
<MartijnVdS> jussi: Q: What concert costs $0.45?
<MartijnVdS> jussi: A: 50 cent, featuring Nickelback.
<jussi> oh dear....
<jussi> worse than my fathers jokes...
<dwatkins> jussi tells jokes about fathers.
<jussi> dwatkins: grammar nazi :P
<dwatkins> well it did change the meaning, jussi ;-p
<jussi> dwatkins: true, but SSSSSSSSSSHHH
<jussi> :P
 * dwatkins goes to put the oven on for grandma
<TheOpenSourcerer> A rather nicely composed piece on Canonical for once: http://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2013/08/why-ubuntus-creator-still-invests-his-fortune-in-an-unprofitable-company/
<MooDoo> nice read
<MooDoo> They will have to hurry up and give Redhat a run for their money
<TheOpenSourcerer> Hmmm - same price as HS2 approximately: http://arstechnica.com/business/2013/08/hyperloop-a-theoretical-760-mph-transit-system-made-of-sun-air-and-magnets/
<knightwise> morning
<neuro> not heard of this "Redhat" ... are they new?
<MartijnVdS> neuro: alternative name: Little Red Riding Hood
<MooDoo> neuro: yeah recent company
<neuro> I'm going to start saying "Ubunto" :)
<neuro> right, brekkie (in so much as breakfast counts as breakfast when you've been up and working for 5.5 hrs)
<MooDoo> neuro: ever heard of this thing called sleep?  new concept i know ;)
<neuro> early shift
<MooDoo> ah
<neuro> went to bed at 8 last night
<MooDoo> 7am start for me
<AlanBell> HS2 can stop at stations on the way though :)
<AlanBell> and probably won't squish passengers into a smooth pate if something goes wrong
<MartijnVdS> AlanBell: except high-speed trains shouldn't do that
<MartijnVdS> AlanBell: because it takes time to accelerate/decelerate
<TheOpenSourcerer> Train wouldn't  be very fast if it kept stopping.
<TheOpenSourcerer> Currently it's about Â£50bn for a saving of 20 mins
<MartijnVdS> also, USA = big. Really big. You just won't believe how vastly hugely mindbogglingly big it is...
<TheOpenSourcerer> could build ~5 hyperloops for that (and SF to LA is a bit further than London to Birmingham)
<AlanBell> hyperloop does look cool
<jussi> does the pdf not work for anyone else?
<directhex> i live by the current london/birmingham line
<directhex> it's a well-run line compared to most
<AlanBell> document is damaged jussi
<jussi> AlanBell: yeah, I cant get it to open at all
<jussi> google chromes built in pdf reader or okular
<MartijnVdS> teslamotors.com seems to be having a hard time with the pdf
<MartijnVdS> http://www.spacex.com/sites/spacex/files/hyperloop_alpha-20130812.pdf works
<MartijnVdS> (Musk's other company ;))
<mungbean> does shuttleworth really wear velcro shoes?
<mungbean> (from the ars pic)
<mungbean> millionaires can do what they want i suppose
<MooDoo> billionaries ;)
<mungbean> citation needed
<mungbean> http://www.therichest.com/celebnetworth/celebrity-business/entrepreneurs/mark-shuttleworth-net-worth/
<MooDoo> I stand corrcted
<MartijnVdS> Bazillionaires.
<mungbean> is he married?
<ivanka_> height N/A hehehe
<MooDoo> no
<TheOpenSourcerer> "Mark Shuttleworth Height" N/A ;-)
<ivanka_> TheOpenSourcerer, :-) ^
<MooDoo> he's a dwarf just the camera angles make him look tall ;)
<ivanka_> TheOpenSourcerer, first thing that made me chuckle too
<MooDoo> lol does it really matter?
<TheOpenSourcerer> no - but it's just amusing.
<TheOpenSourcerer> He's not the tallest chap in the world...
<MooDoo> I'm too tall sometimes lol
<ivanka_> neither is he what you would describe as short
<MartijnVdS> MooDoo: hence the squatting on your blog/profile pic? ;)
<MooDoo> MartijnVdS: yeah ;)  I used to have long hair until I started banging my head on door frames ;)
<popey> Morning.
<MooDoo> good morning popey
<mungbean> wow. just reading this article http://www.engagecsi.co.za/docs/Mark%20Shuttleworth%20on%20CSI.pdf
<mungbean> who will inhreit the shuttleworth fortune?
<MooDoo> mungbean: the cat
<MooDoo> ;)
<TheOpenSourcerer> Like the line about Miss World - so very South African...
<popey> the dogs more likely
<popey> and the bees
<mungbean> BEEES
<MooDoo> he'll donate it all back to the ubuntu community $10 for every ubuntu member ;)
<popey> yeah, your ubuntu membership certificate is your voucher â»
<MooDoo> hehe :D
* AlanBell changed the topic of #ubuntu-uk to: Welcome to #ubuntu-uk! http://ubuntu-uk.org | This channel is publicly archived http://irclogs.ubuntu.com | Mailing List http://tinyurl.com/uukml | Support Guidelines http://tinyurl.com/uuksupport | IRC stats: http://tinyurl.com/uukstat | next meeting TBA | ubuntuî¿ | happy birthday Myrtti!
<popey> â»   /  â¹
<popey> was hoping for a meeting date to be added there
<mungbean> when you're a gazillionaire you can reverse vasectomies i suppose
<AlanBell> yeah, I was looking at that TBA as I did that
<brobostigon> good morning everyone,
<MooDoo> morning
<brobostigon> morning MooDoo
<MooDoo> hope you're well
<popey> mungbean: the article says he put some swimmers on ice, so no need to reverse it
<popey> and from what I've seen he lives a pretty frugal life
<brobostigon> MooDoo:  not bad, unsettled sleep, otherwise fine. and you?
<MooDoo> brobostigon: yeah good thanks, building my neice an ubuntu pc :D
<brobostigon> MooDoo: :)
<MooDoo> brobostigon: had a few friends ask about me building them one too so she's the ginue pig :) lo
<brobostigon> MooDoo: cool, hope it works out.
<MooDoo> brobostigon: yeah me too :d
<brobostigon> MooDoo: :)
<mungbean> today on the train i saw a bizarre commuter: shirt and jacket..OK, then neckbeard and headscarf..hmm..then cargo shorts and socks and sandals ARRRGH
<MartijnVdS> mungbean: so.. someone who works for a startup?
<mungbean> it was near shoreditch
<MartijnVdS> so, a startup? :)
<mungbean> they didn't look good.
<MooDoo> MartijnVdS: probably a lecturer at the uni mungbean works at ;) or a mature student :D
<MartijnVdS> MooDoo: Ah, someone with tenure :)
<mungbean> there weren't going towards uni
<mungbean> although once i saw a comp sci student wearing a utility belt that had laptops and tablets in
<popey> a virginity belt.
<popey> or chastity belt rather
<MooDoo> lol
<mungbean> i've never seen one that can accomodate laptops
<mungbean> mother in law has 8 of these puppies atm http://i.imgur.com/NiBDdZi.jpg
<mungbean> baby ewoks
<bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
<DJones> mungbean: What breed are they
<mungbean> pomerians i think
<bigcalm> And big congratulations to christel (even though she isn't in here)
<DJones> mungbean: They look nice and cute anyway
<mungbean> free to a good home ;)
<DJones> Heh, I'd love one, but mine would probably think it was a squeaky toy
<mungbean> i have a jack russell who loves to kill squeaks
<Myrtti> I need a smack on the face, I'm way too happy for myself
<DJones> All of mine and my parents dogs all do the same, they'll lie down with a toy and just nibble with their front teeth until they find the squeak and then kill it
 * bigcalm smacks Myrtti with a HAPPY BIRTHDAY!
 * MooDoo smacks Myrtti with a wet fish leaving a happy birthday imprint on her forehead
<Myrtti> I may have gotten a job offer yesterday, so I'm super duper happy
<bigcalm> Yay
<bigcalm> You're not sure if you got an offer or not?
<popey>            ,,,,,
<popey>           _|||||_
<popey>          {~*~*~*~}
<popey>        __{*~*~*~*}__
<popey>       `-------------`
<bigcalm> Hehe
<AlanBell> that cake is not a lie
<DJones> Myrtti: Must be something wierd going on, I share the same birthday with you and I've just had a job offer confirmed this morning
<popey> \o/
<dwatkins> hippy burpday, DJones and Myrtti :)
<Myrtti> bigcalm: it's pending negotiations about who pays, what are they paying for, how they pay, when they pay, etc
<DJones> Thanks
<bigcalm> Ah
<DJones> Hope you get the right deal for you
<Myrtti> DJones: happy birthday buddy!
<Myrtti> and thank you â¥
<popey> bigcalm: happy unbirthday buddy!
<DJones> Thank you, same to you
<bigcalm> popey: and a very happy unbirthday to you!
<mungbean> group hug
<Myrtti> group hug!
<DJones> Heh
<JamesTait> Good morning all, happy Lefthanders' Day! :-D
<mungbean> YAY
<mungbean> how can i celebrate?
<DJones> A day early, but SKy had the episode where Ned Flanders opened his left handed shop on last night
<JamesTait> mungbean, I don't really know.  Hug someone who's left-handed?
<MooDoo> I'm ambigextrous :D
<MooDoo> or however you spell it
<Seeker`> ambidextrous
<dwatkins> Ambidextrous?
<DJones> Ah well, job offer now means I've got to plan sorting, organising and filling boxes with ancient junk from my predecessor
<MooDoo> DJones: you moving jobs?
<mungbean> maybe i'll shake peoples hands with my left hand only today
<JamesTait> mungbean, that's the handshake of the Scouting movement.  Or used to be, at least.
<MartijnVdS> JamesTait: yay! a day for me!
<DJones> Not really, been working here as self employed on a part time basis since February, they've just asked me to go full time and take over the full job so the guy who'd ding it now can retire
<mungbean> high fives MartijnVdS with his left hand
<Myrtti> uhoh
<DJones> I thought left handed shakes were the Freemasons
<MartijnVdS> DJones: only in private
<MooDoo> well kinda congrats then ;)
<mungbean> they do funny finger things
<MartijnVdS> mungbean: that's gangstas
<mungbean> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2MZOBleh0uk
<mungbean> i think freemasonry was just a childrens club invented in a garden shed
<MooDoo> one sock up one down?
<DJones> MooDoo: Thats just school kids
<DJones> At least the ones from the local comprehensive anyway
<MooDoo> heh
<mungbean> was up feeding baby last night so i thought i'd have a look at the perseids. bit overrated, no?
<MooDoo> never saw any myself.
<DJones> The nearest I got to seeing them was flashing lights when I shut my eyes just before snoring
<dwatkins> mungbean: http://i.imgur.com/zRmjIRb.jpg ;)
<mungbean> lovely dwatkins i'll send to my wife for her laptop wallpaper :D
<DJones> dwatkins: The original photo for that would make a great desktop wallpaper
<dwatkins> mungbean: in that case, there's a gallery here http://imgur.com/a/wGZUA?gallery
<mungbean> the perseids are about one streak/shooting star effect every few minutes
<dwatkins> no idea where the photo is from
<dwatkins> that reminds me, I should look out for them tonight, although I doubt I could get an exposure photo this awesome: http://pcdn.500px.net/42957746/63ddc3a5d612260ca52ef9ffd98bcae58c65de5e/2048.jpg
<MartijnVdS> dwatkins: cool!
<MooDoo> dwatkins: yeah you could
<dwatkins> I might have to take my 350D into the Pentlands with a tripod.
<mungbean> perseids only look good on a long exposure, rather than naked eye ;)
<dwatkins> ah ok, I was hoping I'd at least see the odd shooting star or two
<dwatkins> no idea about long exposure stuff, I'd need to read up on times and aperture settings
<dwatkins> I have a lens that goes down to F1.8, though.
<JamesTait> I used to understand all that stuff.
<JamesTait> I'll have to relearn it.
<mungbean> i took a picture of the moon in the city
<dwatkins> I was tempted to make a controller for my camera for the Nintendo DS.
<mungbean> my neighbours security light kept coming on though
<JamesTait> Instead, I spent a couple of hours experimenting with settings and getting some nice photos of stars, with the occasional streak across them.
<dwatkins> http://www.gizmag.com/nintendo-ds-digital-slr-controller/14746/ for the curious
<MooDoo> dwatkins: 1.8's are good, i have a 35mm
 * dwatkins discovers custom searches in Chrome
<dwatkins> that makes life a lot easier
<neuro> wp stuff
<neuro> tis a handy one
<MartijnVdS> custom searches?
<brobostigon> fiber will be installed tmrw, yay
<neuro> although searching for google becomes troublesome, so you have to prepend searching for google something with either ? or google
<bigcalm> brobostigon: to the house?
<neuro> brobostigon: moved to the states, have we? :)
<brobostigon> bigcalm: not sure, i havent read all the details from my dad.
<brobostigon> neuro: no.
<neuro> brobostigon: just curious since you said "fiber" ;)
<MartijnVdS> le fibre
<bigcalm> Heh
<neuro> brobostigon: what speeds are you going to get?
<brobostigon> neuro: they are claming 100mbps i think.
<neuro> who's they, just out of interest?
<brobostigon> neuro: BT.
<neuro> hmm
<neuro> their FTTC only goes to 80
<neuro> FTTP is 160-300
<brobostigon> hmmm
<neuro> not sure how you'd not get 160 with FTTP
<dwatkins> MartijnVdS: http://cogdogblog.com/2011/04/08/search-shortcuts/
<brobostigon> neuro: me neither, i am going to wait an see.
<neuro> unless you're getting something that isn't consumer broadband, e.g. a WEES or something
<dwatkins> now I can type "de Eintrag" and get Chrome to search http://dict.leo.org/ for example
<neuro> but that is ridiculously expensive
<brobostigon> agreed neuro
<neuro> 100 each way would be nice though :D
<brobostigon> neuro: oh yes, :)
<neuro> for purely lawful reasons of course
<neuro> *cough*
<brobostigon> lol. :D
<neuro> mind you, watching an ubuntu torrent run at 100Mbps is rather scary
<neuro> i've done that a few times on one of my dedicated thingies
<brobostigon> i use mirror.ox.ac.uk/debian myself, pretty fast already.
<neuro> no, i mean watching the uploads
<brobostigon> ah,
<neuro> watching iftop is just nuts :)
<brobostigon> :)
<neuro> i'm waiting patiently for vodafone to get back to me
<DJones> Ooh, Fibre to cabinet for my exchange is scheduled to go live from 1st September
<neuro> to omit a stupidly long story, they decided to waive an ETF for me, and put an extra credit on my account
<neuro> got my bill yesterday: no credit, and ETF added.
<neuro> have mailed them back and said "thanks for lying to me"
<neuro> will see how they take it.
<neuro> i've asked them for the earliest date I can cancel my contract as well (without incurring additional cost) just to drive the point home
<neuro> really unimpressed with voda lately :(
<neuro> funny thing is, i missed a call from their "we have special offers for you" types yesterday. if they phone today, they're getting a right earful.
<brobostigon> question, if it is fttc, then what would our connnection to that be? equal to adsl to it ?
<neuro> depends on line length to the cab and the product selected
<neuro> there's usually a substantial uplift from ADSL2+ speeds, especially on long lines to the exchange
<neuro> my folks get 3Mbps at the moment, they should get 60-70 on VDSL
<brobostigon> the nearest to here is about a mile away, roughly,
<brobostigon> the exchange is about 2/3 mile away i would guess, i can see it from my bedroom window.
<directhex> for me, the best part was reliability
<directhex> my adsl2+ dropped multiple times per day. vdsl is rock solid
<neuro> as the crow flies distance isn't always useful
<neuro> my exchange is ~ 750m away
<neuro> but my line lengths are 1.6-1.7km
<brobostigon> so directhex is that most liely what Bt will do ?
<neuro> directhex: i still get the occasional drop on sky, but pfsense just punts me over to BT automatically, then switches everything back when sky comes back up
<neuro> BT line usually rock solid
<neuro> DJones: don't forget that cabs need to be installed or upgraded as well, so the exchange being enabled is only step 1
<DJones> neuro: Thats why I'm happy, they;ve just put a new cabinet in about 50 yards from our house
<directhex> you can spot a fttc cabinet
<directhex> they're taller, narrower, and darker, than regular cabinets
<neuro> and they have big posters on them saying "FASTER BROADBAND IS HERE!"
<directhex> with lots of vents for cooling
<directhex> neuro, my cab doesn't have that branding
<neuro> mine does
<DJones> This one still has bollards and a trench around it
<directhex> http://community.bt.com/t5/image/serverpage/image-id/16436iEA095A7E1BBE7C0A/image-size/original?v=mpbl-1&px=-1
<brobostigon> just checked, yes apparently it is fttc, and uses vdsl for the lest bit.
<popey> do other countries have cabinets by the side of the road like that?
<mungbean> wow thats massive
<mungbean> a friend of mine is deaf is one ear due to coming round the bend on his bike too fast aged about 10 and smacking into one
<popey> our local one is half open
<popey> all the time
<MartijnVdS> popey: we have them at the side of houses
<mungbean> yeah, i shared earlier about one on bethnal green that the druggies use as drop offs
<MartijnVdS> popey: or in areas that are "green" anyway
<mungbean> often filled with vomit
<mungbean> that looks about 6ft tall, would ruin a view from a house
<MartijnVdS> http://goo.gl/maps/DleN3
<MartijnVdS> http://goo.gl/maps/I0paX
<MartijnVdS> http://goo.gl/maps/GbUxK
<popey> its funny how these things just sit there and are mostly ignored by 99% of the population
<brobostigon> native ipv6 would also be cool, but that would be such a huge longshot, it would be basically impossible.
<mungbean> hiding in plain sight
<neuro> brobostigon: BT are planning native v6 for this year
<mungbean> the last one, why is it not next to the wall?
<brobostigon> like those innocous black cubes, in that Dr Who ep.
<brobostigon> neuro: wow, amazing,
<MartijnVdS> everyone is "planning it"
<brobostigon> neuro: thats good to hear, where are the details of this?
<MartijnVdS> nobody is actually "doing" it
<neuro> brobostigon: it's buried in a release about their CGNAT pilot: http://www.thinkbroadband.com/news/5818-bt-retail-in-carrier-grade-nat-pilot.html
<brobostigon> neuro: i see, ok let me read.
<neuro> it's a single sentence, it won't take you long :)
<brobostigon> i suspect i will still have to use my rpi with my tunnel and radvd, for some time to come.
<neuro> well, yeah
<mungbean> i think my two msot hated words atm are: phablet and xbone
 * popey runs phablet-flash
 * neuro is waiting patiently for the xbox one release date
<mungbean> did anyone read the article about hacking hard drive controller boards?
<neuro> hope it's not too much longer after the battlefield 4 release date :P
<mungbean> http://spritesmods.com/?art=hddhack
<davmor2> Morning all
<MooDoo> morning da
<MooDoo> morning davmor2
<davmor2> morning Moo hit enter instead of tab did we ;)
<MooDoo> davmor2: no just being street this morning word.... ;)
<MooDoo> ahem
<davmor2> haha
<mungbean> weird. i have a strimmer with a nylon type of "blade" line, but it breaks if you fart if the vicinity of it
<mungbean> makes it useless
<MooDoo> well don't fart then
<popey> or fart further away
<mungbean> i think even a spider fart will break the linie
<mungbean> breaks every 30 seconds
<popey> dunno where I got mine from, but mine doesn't break
<mungbean> you have real blade though?
<popey> no
<mungbean> oh
<popey> thick wire
<mungbean> thought you had super duper strimmer
<popey> it's petrol, but still has plastic wire stuff
<mungbean> gonna do some ebaying/amazonning for some stronger wire
<mungbean> trouble is, the grass i wanna cut is off the lawn, so interspersed with thicker weeds
<MooDoo> mungbean: just get a thicker grade strimmer wire, although to be honest they all break quite a lot
<mungbean> man, work is boring during summer season
<mungbean> cannot do anything because everyone else is off
<dwatkins> I have more and more cases each day in the summer.
<jussi> mungbean: Frustrating is the word I have for it...
<MooDoo> we get quieter as more and more are of, come sept, it'll be a knightmare
 * TheOpenSourcerer drilled out the hole a bit in his strimmer and went from a 1.8mm to a 2.4mm line - that's much better.
<jussi> (given Im a sales man, and Finland is off in July, rest of europe in august)
<TheOpenSourcerer> Petrol strimmer.
<mungbean> have to test an application running on 50 pcs later
<jussi> TheOpenSourcerer: good idea. what kind do you have?
<mungbean> gonna be tedious
<MooDoo> mungbean: all linux or windows/mac/other
<mungbean> gonna be x-displaying application from a cluster to a win box, massive kludge
<TheOpenSourcerer> Can't recall now - it's fairly small and has the bend in the main tube (so it's not as robust as the completely straight fixed drive models professionals use).
<mungbean> need to test if the 50 pcs can do it simulatenously without a bottleneck
<MooDoo> anyone got $23 million to get the edge made?
<dwatkins> Shuttleworth?
<jussi> TheOpenSourcerer: not a Partner brand?
<jussi> TheOpenSourcerer: I have one of these: http://www.alpinagarden.com/products/en/brushcutters-trimmers/white-range/petrol-brushcutters/b-28-j.html
<MooDoo> dwatkins: I doubt even he'd put the rest in
<dwatkins> shame, MooDoo
<TheOpenSourcerer> jussi: Yours has the straight drive so should be able to cope with thick line easily.
<jussi> TheOpenSourcerer: yeah, not sure whats on it now anyway, but it breaks quite often and the tap and go on that thing is rubbish
<mungbean> i think i have this http://www.amazon.co.uk/Bosch-Easytrim-Electric-Trimmer-Diameter/dp/B0007P24UW
<TheOpenSourcerer> I bought mine from B&Q *years* ago (~12) and still going strong. Cost Â£99 IIRC.
<TheOpenSourcerer> It's got a small Briggs & Stratton motor
<mungbean> "This is incredibly useless and a complete waste of money. Just does not do what it is sold to. I have yet to trim the grass edge yet for more than five seconds without the trimming line breaking. Then it takes two minutes to feed through again. I am so annoyed at this happening I have come in from the garden specifically to write this review as it happens every single time. Now going to go back out into the garden with a pair of scissors for t
<TheOpenSourcerer> Strimming cord varies from manufacturer to manufacturer. Even the same weight I find breaks really easily from some places and not from others.
<TheOpenSourcerer> tl;dr When you find a line that's strong enough buy loads of it.
<AlanBell> I have a little petrol strimmer from Argos, was about Â£50
<AlanBell> I have no idea how they manage to make a petrol engine for that price
<mungbean> should the cord last for more than a couple of minutes?
<TheOpenSourcerer> depends what your are trying to strim with it mungbean
<AlanBell> you are supposed to just let the end of the cord do the cutting
<AlanBell> don't press it up hard against things
<mungbean> oooer
<AlanBell> every few minutes you would thump it down to release a bit more cord
<TheOpenSourcerer> Mine auto-feeds
<mungbean> also, on the topic of gardens
<mungbean> my shears are rubbish and blunt
<mungbean> should i get a nice pair or buy a sharpening stone?
<popey> yes
<MooDoo> yay just got my first ever 1TB drive....lol
<DJones> mungbean: Forget shears, go for one of these http://www.trueswords.com/grim-reaper-monster-scythe-80in-p-3350.html
<DJones> And then get the sharpening stone
<mungbean> wow
<mungbean> "The reaper scythe is the most ubiquitous symbol known to mankind"
<DJones> I don't know whether I'd agree with that, I only ever think of it in terms of Bill & Teds Excellent Adventure
<mungbean> and family guy
<DJones> Never watched that
<dwatkins> How can something be the "most ubiquitous" anything?
<MartijnVdS> the very most ubiquitousest
<dwatkins> the most omnipresent thing which was found everywhere the most...
 * DJones looks out of the window at the amount of rain coming down, blames friends from Finland coming here and going camping
<MartijnVdS> DJones: wait.. it only rains if there are people visiting from overseas?
<MartijnVdS> s/if/when/
<brobostigon> no rain here yet.
<DJones> MartijnVdS: Not quite, it only rains when there's people camping
<mungbean> after we were talking about these , i noticed one as i was going to the cafe for lunch
<mungbean> http://i.imgur.com/SgKIWtX.jpg
<mungbean> you have to look for them to notice them, massive as they are
<mungbean> also, what you people think happens in here? http://i.imgur.com/1jAfBax.jpg
<MartijnVdS> mungbean: freenode hq
<mungbean> fact: there used to be a nuclear reactor in there
<MartijnVdS> iReactorCore?
<shauno> those green street cabinets have been driving me nuts lately.  I had to snail mail something for the first time in 10+ years. the post office here use little green boxes.  turns out, *everyone* uses little green boxes here.  phone, electric, cable ..
<Myrtti> it's pissing down here too, so don't blame us
<MartijnVdS> shauno: where's that?
<shauno> ireland
<MartijnVdS> shauno: those aren't little, are they?
<MartijnVdS> shauno: I mean.. http://www.flickr.com/photos/treenaks/8136316676/
<shauno> went looking for a postbox, and have been seeing little green boxes *Everywhere* ever since
<MartijnVdS> they're quite obviously post boxes
<DJones> Myrtti: Ah well, can't blame Finland then
<shauno> ours look nothing like that
<MartijnVdS> shauno: that one is in Ireland..
<mgdm> There's a particular style of green street cabinet used in Glasgow. They all appear with a similar railing and a distinctive manhole nearby. Apparently, it's the vents for some kind of utility tunnel
<mgdm> once you see them once, you see them everywhere ;-)
<mgdm> well, along the line
<shauno> MartijnVdS: around here I'm more likely to find something like http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-35sHBVDfQnI/TlWNpckQOSI/AAAAAAAAJOY/hUSg9LdUbfA/s1600/2011-08-25+001+002+%2528375x500%2529.jpg
<MartijnVdS> shauno: awwww, cute :)
<shauno> I just never realised how many of these street cabinets there are until I went looking for a "little green box".  Turns out there's three within 10 meters of my house, and I apparently completely tuned them out
<mungbean> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fnord
<mungbean> It is a subliminal message technique, a word that the majority of the population since early childhood has been trained to ignore (and, of course, trained to forget both the training and the fact that they are ignoring it), but which they associate with a vague sense of unease. Upon seeing the word, readers experience a panic reaction. They then subconsciously suppress all memories of having seen the word, but the sense of panic remains. They t
<MartijnVdS> they t....
<MartijnVdS> it cut off
<shauno> heh, it's enough to see the parallel
<shauno> it's also left me wondering what on earth I'm goign to do with 9 spare airmail stamps.  at my current rate of usage, I'll be dead before I've finished this little book
<mungbean>  They then subconsciously suppress all memories ofhaving seen the word, but the sense of panic remains.
<mungbean> which reminds me, i have a load of virgin media junk mail to return
<MartijnVdS> mungbean: imagine being dyslexic and not being able to see "Ford"
<shauno> not a great example, you wouldn't be missing much
<mungbean> or skyrim..http://i.imgur.com/5MeYa4n.jpg
<MartijnVdS> shauno: "You crashed into *another* Ford?"
<MartijnVdS> shauno: </insurance-agent>
<mungbean> cover of this months time magazine..BEEEEES! http://www.time.com/time/magazine/europe/0,9263,901130819,00.html
<SuperMatt> huh, just looking at an article on ars about canonical
<SuperMatt> someone spouting that canonical just doesn't commit as much to the kernel as red hat does
<SuperMatt> 0.8% compared to 8%
<SuperMatt> then I looked at the numbers. Red hat has about 10x as many employees as canonical
<mungbean> is that an old article?
<MartijnVdS> SuperMatt: those people always come out of the woodwork
<MartijnVdS> mungbean: no, today's article I think
<SuperMatt> so if we do the math, on a per employee basis, canonical is doing just as well as red hat
<mungbean> also, its the kernel. i thin the kernel is in good health
<MartijnVdS> the salespeople should write kernel patches too!
<SuperMatt> considering canonical's far smaller staffing, you've really got to hand it to them for doing what they're doing!
<mungbean> i think they are doing too much
<SuperMatt> it's possible they may stretch themselves too thin
<mungbean> yes
<mungbean> very
<directhex> mungbean, what's the matter? you can't stand the sight of a strong fnord woman?
<mungbean> rapid expansion tends to make your cake collapse
<SuperMatt> I also don't like that people say that canonical never contribute. Redhat 6 and Debian 5 both use upstart
<SuperMatt> wait, no
<SuperMatt> debian never got around to upstart
<mungbean> most people who complain are blogtards or "media"
<SuperMatt> but chromeos and android us it
<mungbean> i've finished reading the internet
<mungbean> bored now
<SuperMatt> aww man
<SuperMatt> that must suck
<MartijnVdS> mungbean: have you read reddit's /new?
<SuperMatt> especially as it means you've probably watched all the porn too
<SuperMatt> you must be a little sore
<mungbean> feeling demotivated
<SuperMatt> did I just see click packages appear in my updates?
<SuperMatt> yes I did :)
<SuperMatt> oh sneaky, they appeared a week ago!
 * mungbean hasn't moved from 12.04
<davmor2> SuperMatt: no I think it is the click system rather than a click package maybe
<SuperMatt> sure sure
<SuperMatt> that's what I meant
<mungbean> no compelling features since then
<SuperMatt> but it means my pc now has the ability to install them
<davmor2> SuperMatt: that has been in for a while it just got updated
<SuperMatt> oh right /o\
<SuperMatt> show how much attention I'm paying
 * mungbean takes a look at owncloud 5.x
<SuperMatt> I hope that other distros pick up click packages, it'd be nice to finally have one package management system that is consistant across distros
<SuperMatt> mungbean: it's awesome
<SuperMatt> I've been running my own for a few months now
<mungbean> vs v4 ?
<mungbean> i've run v4 for lon gitme
<mungbean> logtime
<mungbean> agh
<SuperMatt> I don't know about vs v4
<SuperMatt> all I know is that I got tired of relying on other companies for stuff like this, and 5 had just been released
<SuperMatt> so I dived in
<mungbean> it saved my butt when a colleague kicked over my pc and the drive died
<SuperMatt> ouch
<mungbean> i do worry about security though
<SuperMatt> anything in particular?
<mungbean> only have firewall allowing by IP atm
<mungbean> upgrading OC is manual atm
<mungbean> and you miss the updates
<mungbean> or too busy and your precious data could get pwned
<mungbean> oh, it's on repos now for 12.04 and above
 * SuperMatt nods
<SuperMatt> and they have their own repos, which I install from
<Azelphur> ali1234: https://www.dropbox.com/s/x3mdtug3uu6qnqq/2013-08-13%2014.28.21.jpg
<popey> they arrived then?
<Azelphur> popey: they did indeed :)
<popey> nice, they chugging along?
<Azelphur> I love how ghetto engineering they are, USB cables that don't fit, no power supplies, not painted properly, rickety fans and they literally smell.
<popey> hah
<Azelphur> but yep, chugging along :D
<Azelphur> this is what $4k gets you in bitcoinland, haha
<popey> hah
<popey> once everyone has their BL asic, will the difficulty ramp up quickly do you think?
<Azelphur> popey: everybody does have it, and difficulty is ramping up quickly
<Azelphur> that was expected, though
<Azelphur> difficulty is set to jump from 37 mill to 50 mill
<popey> yeah
<Azelphur> so while I'm making Â£160/day right now
<Azelphur> that's gonna drop real fast
<Azelphur> prolly be Â£100/day by the end of the week :p
<Seeker`> Azelphur: did you really spend $4k on bitcoin mining?
<Azelphur> Seeker`: yup
<Seeker`> why?
<Azelphur> because...profit?
<shauno> it sounds like that's where the 4k came from in the first place, so re-seeding some of it seems sensible enough
<davmor2> Seeker`: at Â£160-Â£100 per day 4K is made back in just over a month
<Azelphur> shauno: correct :)
<Azelphur> davmor2: your math is dodgy, it's just over two weeks.
<Azelphur> :P
<davmor2> Azelphur: I was basing it on the Â£100 a day rather than the 160
<Azelphur> davmor2: ah :)
<shauno> Â£100-160 is 2-3 weeks if $4K is USD rather than lazy typists
<Azelphur> yea, it's USD
<Azelphur> technically it was 3.9, but I say 4 because lazy.
<Azelphur> but yea, why did I buy them? because...buttloads of money.
<Azelphur> :D
 * DJones tries to think of a reason not to wait for the release of the nexus 7-2 as he wants a new tablet and work will be paying
<DJones> Wonder what the chances of getting an Ubuntu install on it will be
<mungbean> reddit enhancement suite now wants to access data on 14 other websites ...hmm
<neuro> yeah
<neuro> sites it pulls images from
<neuro> like imgur, meme sites, etc
<mungbean> seemed to work before, what changed?
<neuro> new sites
<SuperMatt> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-23680689
<SuperMatt> if anything proves that web filters don't work, it's this
<mungbean> will probably block the bible too
<neuro> aha here it is
<neuro> 2 new sites added to the image viewer
<neuro> so it's gone from 12 to 14 sites
<neuro> shows how concerned you were when you installed it ;)
<mungbean> maybe i'd like the option not to include extra sites..
<neuro> then you'll lose functionality
<neuro> http://www.reddit.com/r/Enhancement/search?q=permissions&sort=hot&restrict_sr=on
<mungbean> its foolish to do it atm though
<mungbean> people are twitchy about snooping
<neuro> because?
<mungbean> nobody was missing those feature so they probably lost a whole bunch of users now
<mungbean> i don't use the image expandos
<neuro> nobody was missing the inline image expandos?
<mungbean> A bunch were added: livememe, mediacrush, etc. -- especially after quickmeme got kibbutzed.
<neuro> i would have missed it :)
<mungbean> i don't visit subs with memes
<mungbean> nor do lots of other users
<neuro> so why don't you fork res and make your own?
<neuro> one that doesn't do inline images
<mungbean> or just disable it
<neuro> you'd need to remove the feature
<neuro> even if the feature is click-enableable/disableable (are they words?!), the plugin still needs the perms to do stuff when the feature is enabled
<neuro> and perms are set at install/upgrade time in chrome
<neuro> and yes, Inline Image Viewer has a big ass "on/off" button in the res settings :)
<neuro> just that the permissions are required because you may actually switch it on
<mungbean> i guess so
<mungbean> chrome doesn't help in that it wouldn't tell you the sites
<dwatkins> perhaps there's a plugin to monitor other plugins...
<daftykins> ah-har another patch tuesday is here
<neuro> bah
<neuro> bloody apple display crapped out on me
<neuro> had to reboot :(
<neuro> i feel slightly filthy having to reboot a mac
<bigcalm> neuro: you're the one using a mac in the 1st place
<neuro> wut? :)
<daftykins> uh-oh, don't go there
<neuro> i mean filthy as in having to reboot a unix system
<daftykins> neuro: can't you recover from that?
<neuro> daftykins: i opened the macbook to bring it out of clamshell and eventually it deigned to give me the internal display back, but unplugging and unplugging the mini DP didn't bring the lcd back
<neuro> so decided to reboot
<neuro> i've had a few gpu related funnies lately, i'm starting to think the intel 3000 isn't designed for hard use
<daftykins> what's 'hard use' ?
<neuro> driving a 27" LCD
<neuro> a lot
<neuro> while in clamshell mode (hot)
<neuro> i'm starting to think my 15" mbp should be my primary machine for work, not my 13"
<neuro> at least it has a GT650M
<neuro> pain in the bum to switch over though
<popey> wondering what to do with an old laptop
<daftykins> i certainly wouldn't be blaming the on-die graphics just for driving an external display
 * popey checks ebay for current prices
<daftykins> popey: what kind of spec?
<neuro> daftykins: i'm hoping it's a one off tbh
<popey> oldish
<daftykins> hah
<neuro> 386?
<neuro> 486?
<popey> http://www.ebay.co.uk/ctg/Toshiba-Portege-M400-12-1-Tablet-PC-Customized-/118259882
<popey> one of them
<neuro> Centrino?
<popey> ish
<popey> c2d
<neuro> waaaaaat?
<neuro> dude, that laptop is like well broken
<daftykins> centrino is a combination of intel processor, chipset and wireless card, not a processor
<popey> hah
<neuro> the screen's like hanging off man
<popey> :D
<neuro> daftykins: yes yes i know
<daftykins> :P
<neuro> i've lived through it all
<popey> never ever used it as a touch thing
<daftykins> and yet misused it :(
<neuro> centrino, vPro, yadda yadda
<neuro> not necessarily
<diddledan> vPro doesn't make sense to me
 * neuro avoids the rest of this conversation thread :)
<neuro> they always seem to get me into trouble :)
<diddledan> lol
<daftykins> XD
<daftykins> mistakes do that :<
<daftykins> ;)
<daftykins> right, should really do something about this RAID with a dead disk
<neuro> yes
<neuro> please do something other than start to wind me up :)
<diddledan> yes, do that
<daftykins> though people that don't reply to emails frustrate me
 * diddledan pushes archive on daftykins ' email
<neuro> vodafone not replying is frustrating me
<neuro> i may have to hassle their twitter types
<daftykins> diddledan: harsh :(
<diddledan> neuro, write to the big cheese
<diddledan> neuro, my brother did that and got a load of discounts and freebie phone
<neuro> hehe
<daftykins> must be a really impatient guy
<daftykins> 'oh just pay them off and get rid of them!'
<neuro> streisand effect
<neuro> companies don't want hassle
<neuro> and CEOs generally don't want hassled, full stop
<diddledan> he complained about a salesperson trying to convince him to stay by stating that vodafone's mobile signal is better than EE's because , and I quote, "our transmitters are connected via fibre optic cables"
<daftykins> neuro: i love how you take what we're all thinking and type it <3
<daftykins> diddledan: lmao, that's ace
<neuro> PAs will interdict crap like that and bounce it off to the full monty customer retentions
<neuro> daftykins: i'm awesome that way
<neuro> diddledan: and EE's aren't? :)
<neuro> "Hi, we're EE, we have an awesome 4G LTE network, but our mast backhaul network is made up of the intertwined fur from kittens!"
<diddledan> neuro, it doesn't matter whether they are or not. how does connecting it via fibre improve wireless propagation?
<neuro> exactly
 * AlanBell wonders how ali1234's race game is getting on
<neuro> to be honest, the frequency is more of an issue
<neuro> 900MHz beats 1800MHz
<daftykins> nothing like a spot of QAM in the afternoon
<diddledan> tasty
<neuro> :)
<neuro> i love the smell of GSM in the morning
<MartijnVdS> QEMM386?
<diddledan> o_O
<diddledan> I don't know that reference
<neuro> the memory management geeks are over that way ->
<diddledan> aah
<neuro> i guess that's one way to estimate the age of someone :)
<diddledan> dos days
<neuro> CONFIG.SYS mofo!
<popey> so doesn't look like Id get much for my laptop
<popey> its a bit tatty
<neuro> hold onto it then
<popey> it runs ubuntu fine
<daftykins> popey: did look a fair bit chunky
<neuro> maybe give it away / sell it cheap at a LUG meet or something?
<diddledan> neuro, I kinda missed the emm386 days because my pc was too old to have extended/expanded ram and I jumped from that straight to w95
<neuro> the windows 95 startup sound just played in my head
<popey> DOS=HIGH
<neuro> that was a bit harrowing
<diddledan> popey, DOS=HIGH,UMB ftw
<neuro> UMB \o/
<popey> indeed
<neuro> i replaced my startup sound with the PlayStation boot noise
<diddledan> gotta remember to put it in the UMB
<neuro> best boot noise ever
<popey> i used to get calls from friends to go to their house to optimise their config.sys
<popey> dont know that noise
<neuro> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ekqYhP8PhMg
<popey> ya, tis good
<diddledan> popey, shame linux wasn't mainstream enough back then
<popey> [APPROVED]
<popey> nah, shame I wasnt into linux back then
<popey> some fat oaf at college first showed it to me
<popey> i later saw him on the beer train, a year or two back
<popey> i should thank him.
<diddledan> neuro, I'd forgotten all about that awesoem startup noise of the ps1
<daftykins> haha
 * popey looks for other things to ebay
<AlanBell> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/181194059541
<AlanBell> is what I am ebaying at the moment
 * popey cringes at games out of their boxes
<AlanBell> yeah, we threw them all away
<AlanBell> all cd and DVD cases too
<diddledan> popey, aye, games without boxes are evil incarnate!
<diddledan> I miss the old-style boxes that took up loads of shelf-space
<AlanBell> unneccessary bulk :)
<diddledan> thankyou mist
<diddledan> now, to reset my password..
<diddledan> :-p
<diddledan> I wonder what's actually broken
<diddledan> sysadmin in me wants to know
<popey> http://myworld.ebay.co.uk/popeydc  <- stuff I am ebaying :D
<daftykins> but the scratch potential!
<AlanBell> is a second hand YubiKey a good idea?
<celesteh> Hello, I'm working on an art project about surveillance and I just read that London bins are recording the MAC addresses of everyone who walks by.  Is there an easy linux tool to do this with?
<popey> its not second hand
<AlanBell> the london bins are not doing that any more celesteh
<celesteh> AlanBell: that's good but I still am interested in doing it for a small art installation (data would not be kept afterwards...)
<daftykins> yeah it got called off already
<ali1234> http://www.aircrack-ng.org/
<daftykins> or just 'kismet'
<ali1234> kismet never worked for me
<daftykins> uh-huh
<celesteh> ta alil234
<diddledan> yeah, tab-complete ftw
<diddledan> this sucks, I need to install photoshop
<diddledan> I would say I hate when clients bypass our internal design team by providing their own psd's but it does give me more leeway when it comes to slicing and dicing the file to usable assets
<Guest2162> Hello?
<Guest2162> Can anyone see these messages?
<popey> Guest2162: yes
<Guest2162> Oh. Sorry, I thought I might have to make an account or something.
<Guest2162> This is basically an open support chatroom, right?
<popey> yeah, effectively
<Guest2162> Great. I'm just about to set up Windows 8 and Ubuntu 13.04 Dual Boot and wanted to make sure I'd have some on the spot help.
<popey> #ubuntu is the official support channel, but we're here too
<daftykins> probably easier to follow here ^_^
<Guest2162> If I know you're on UK soil, I can find you and kill you when you trick me into burning my hard-drive.
<Guest2162> I'll be sure to ignore any advice involving lighters.
<neuro> wtf?
<diddledan> hint, petrol + maritime flare
<popey> oooooohkay
<Guest2162> Oh. Thanks, diddledan. I guess that'll do it. I'll be right back with the results.
<diddledan> :-)
<popey> its okay I'm busting open a laptop power supply, I'll be dead before you get here
<diddledan> ergh, Jono, kill the lawyers! :-p
<Guest2162> You'll live on in this channel forever.
<popey> well, till the logs get deleted anyway
<neuro> rm -f $(grep -iw -e neuro -e popey -e bum -e lollipops -e "Windows 8" /data/logs/*.log | cut -d: -f1 | sort | uniq)
<Guest2162> Does anyone know if I might be able to run Windows 8 in a Virtual Box by using recovery media?
<popey> yay, fixed without dying
<Guest2162> I don't have the installation media but it's the next best thing.
<Guest2162> And congratulations.
<neuro> laptop power supply?
<neuro> pshaw
<neuro> what's that, like 3A?
<neuro> i had a poweredge PSU electrocute me once, that wasn't fun
<Guest2162> Electrify. Electrocution is when you die. Sorry to be a pedant.
<diddledan> an old CRT power rail will give you the biggest jolt out of consumer electronics
<neuro> Guest2162: vmware workstation used to be able to do something like that
<neuro> and pedantry is fine in my book
<neuro> i do it all the time in here
<neuro> bloody CRTs
<neuro> glad to see the back of them
<diddledan> me too
<neuro> before my hearing started to go i could hear them whine
<neuro> hated it
<diddledan> 12000V isn't a good idea to have in your living-room
<neuro> do you keep gas lasers in your living room or something?
<diddledan> CRTs use something around there, don't they?!
<neuro> to the internets!
<Guest2162> Sorry to interrupt, but the messages with the yellow nametag, are those part of the private chat thing I see in XChat?
<neuro> good question
<popey> its just people who mentioned your name
<popey> i think
<diddledan> they go up from 5kV to 30kV ish probably more
<neuro> 20-50kV for NTSC 15.734 kHz devices
<diddledan> BINGO!
<diddledan> either that or "you sunk my submarine!"
<neuro> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q5pESPQpXxE
<neuro> sunk my battleship, shurely?
<neuro> Guest2162: and feel free to interrupt. If we're talking crap about flyback transformers and the like, I'd say ubuntu chat takes precedence :)
 * neuro swears at EA
<neuro> yet again, the yanks get battlefield before us :P
<Guest2162> I'll be sure to interrupt very frequently with my annoying quasi-issues.
<popey> Guest2162: please do
<neuro> and now i need to pray that the stars align and microsoft decide that the 1st of November is Novembery enough to release the xbox one on
<ali1234> the chat on ubuntu-phone about app security and sandboxing...
<neuro> is it boring?
<ali1234> it's like android never happened
<neuro> or is it a clusterfrak?
<ali1234> the latter
<neuro> the dangers of creating a new OS
<neuro> wheel reinvention and shed painting
<diddledan> the problem is ubuntu wants to still be linux whereas android doesn't
<neuro> heh
<ali1234> that's not really the problem at all
<neuro> the abstraction layers are interesting
<neuro> Google: it's Android, not Linux!
<Guest2162> Cross your fingers everyone, I'm about to reboot into the new dual boot system.
<neuro> Samsung / Amazon: it's not Android!
<ali1234> Canonical: It's Ubuntu, not Linux!
<Guest2162> And no offense intended to any amputees.
<neuro> fingers crossed
<neuro> lol
<ali1234> try to find the word "linux" anywhere on ubuntu.com
<neuro> stand back everyone, we've got a comedian here
<diddledan> Guest2162, at least you didn't mention the midgets
<neuro> googling for site:ubuntu.com linux gives: About 1,280,000 results (0.28 seconds)
<diddledan> wow
<ali1234> neuro: click on the first hit, ctrl-f, "linux" - oh look it's not there
<diddledan> the fora aren't even hosted on a subdomain of that either
<popey> http://www.ubuntu.com/about/about-ubuntu
<neuro> ali1234: yeah, i know
<neuro> i don't even know where that text is coming from
<neuro> it's not in the meta tags
<neuro> tho there is a "linux" keyword
<ali1234> popey: it's not on that page either
<popey> yes, yes it is.
<ali1234> oh wait, i have case match turned on
<popey> 4 occurrances
<ali1234> yeah, it's on there, let me chek the main page again
<neuro> melbourne:~ neuro$ curl -s http://www.ubuntu.com/about/about-ubuntu | grep -ic linux
<neuro> 3
<diddledan> hmm, I get the homepage first
<popey> twice on one line neuro
<Guest2162> Everything seems just peachy. I was worried Ubuntu wouldn't play well with my weird graphics card.
<popey> Guest2162: how weird?
<diddledan> with the snippet "Official site; Commercially sponsored Debian-derived Linux distribution that focuses on usability, a regular 6-month release cycle, and a commitment to at least" which I can't find on the page
<neuro> diddledan: my point exactly
<popey> Maxtrox Parhelia weird or SiS weird?
<neuro> nvidia quadro?
<Guest2162> It's an AMD card but I'm pretty sure it's one they've stopped supporting and the general concensus is that it's crap.
<popey> aren't all AMD cards crap?
<Guest2162> It doesn't support bloom or something. Maybe there's a technical term for it.
<diddledan> amd eyefinity ftw
<diddledan> Guest2162, ancient?
<diddledan> that's a technical term for lots of breakage
<Guest2162> Just got it up, it's the AMD HD 7660D.
<diddledan> that's modern
<diddledan> 7660 is that an integrated unit or discrete?
<Guest2162> Maybe the only reason people call it crap is because of that lighting thing. I was on a gaming forum when I saw that it was evil incarnate.
 * neuro sighs
<neuro> seems even the voda twitter types don't want to help me
<Guest2162> I don't know enough about computers to answer that question. Don't crucify me.
<neuro> Guest2162: is it on the motherboard or is it an add-in card
<Guest2162> I'm guessing it's on the motherboard. It came with the thing anyway.
<diddledan> google says it's part of the A10 CPU
<neuro> A10? ouch
<Guest2162> I've got some cheapo Medion Akoya shtick that was partnered with ASDA.
<Guest2162> At least it wasn't partnered with LIDL or something.
<neuro> Medion: the mark of quality
<popey> dont think I've ever been in a Lidl
<neuro> popey: they do some good stuff in lidl actually
<Guest2162> I don't know if there's one near me. I know there's an ALDI.
<popey> yeah, so people keep telling me
<neuro> probably worth a nosey one day
<popey> there's a new morrisons near me, which apparently has a very nice selection of herbs and veg
<popey> yeah, true
<neuro> yeah, we're supposed to be getting a morrisons next year
<neuro> do they do home deliveries off their interwebby site? i've never bothered to look
<Guest2162> I've never heard of them doing home deliveries and I've never seen a delivery van of theirs.
<diddledan> I'm a sainsbury's fanboi
<neuro> i shall look at their website, for that is what one must do if one doesn't know something
<neuro> ah, they're doing a deal with ocado to enable home deliveries
<neuro> ocado already do deliveries for waitrose
<Guest2162> They're doing a deal or it's done?
<neuro> partnership signed in may apparently
<neuro> morrisons buying an ocado distribution centre in warwickshire for 170m
<neuro> http://www.moneysavingexpert.com/news/shopping/2013/05/morrisons-to-launch-home-deliveries-after-signing-ocado-deal
<diddledan> waitrose do their own deliveries but ocado do deliveries with waitrose products available
<neuro> ah ok
<diddledan> ocado was originally waitrose-sponsored but waitrose have been trying to end the deal and run their own service afaicr
<neuro> fair enough
<neuro> waitrose are an unknown quantity to me
<neuro> we don't have them up 'ere
<diddledan> they're the poshyposh
<neuro> up in the hinterlands
<neuro> yeah, i know that much
<Guest2162> I think there's one a little way towards Manchester near me.
<Guest2162> Never been in one.
<diddledan> kate of cambridge shops in waitrose on anglesea
<ali1234> waitrose in manchester? wut
<popey> http://jalopnik.com/google-maps-has-an-incredible-dr-who-easter-egg-1121878011
<popey> need "old" gmaps for it to work
<Guest2162> Is the "new" one default now or is it still opt-in?
<neuro> opt-in
<neuro> i still get "preview" in the url when i go there
 * neuro opens link in incognito mode :)
<popey> exactly what i did
<diddledan> incognito mode: for pr0n and google maps
<neuro> looks like something from one of those dr who experience thingamabobs
<neuro> this is funny though: http://jalopnik.com/google-street-view-car-captures-google-street-view-bike-531205395
<neuro> diddledan: i have no idea what you're talking about
<Guest2162> Do you reckon they'd recover the footage if he got ran down?
<neuro> THE FOOTAGE IS ALL THAT MATTERS
<diddledan> Guest2162, of course, it's got important personal details of everyone nearby
<diddledan> google needs that for adsense
<MattJ> XMPP \o/
<MattJ> (kinda)
<diddledan> o_O
<luke__> And I'm back.
<daftykins> woohoo
<diddledan> phew
<luke__> How come on my laptop, I was Guest26 whatever and I have a nickname on here?
<neuro> because the first time you joined, you joined as "luke", and someone on freenode has registered that name with nickserv
<neuro> so nickserv changed your nick to Guestyaddayadda because you didn't auth (or couldn't auth)
<luke__> Ah. Gotcha.
<Myrtti> I feel like I'm spoiling myself, bought Daim cake as a birthday cake and some Angry Birds blueberry handlotion
<Myrtti> orange Daim cake even
<neuro> i thought you were *making* caek?
<jussi> Myrtti: you didnt end up making one?
<jussi> hehe
<neuro> :)
<Myrtti> yeah, laziness won
<Myrtti> decided to save myself the stress
<popey> \o/ laziness
<jussi> btw Myrtti, a big happy birthday from all of us here.
<jussi> Myrtti: Sari still remembers you :)
<Myrtti> thanks
<daftykins> Daim cake as in a cake of Daim bars? D:
<popey> woah, since when did The Cloud become a sky company?
<neuro> ages ago
<neuro> january 2011, according to the internets
<neuro> basically bootstrapped their wifi-for-broadband-customers offering fast so they could compete with BT
<popey> blimey
<luke__> Does anyone here use PlayOnLinux or Wine with any popular PC games?
<daftykins> looked at Steam?
 * neuro unfortunately uses Windows 8 to play popular PC games
<diddledan> neuro, charlatan!
<diddledan> that's a word I've not used, or seen used, in forever
<neuro> wut?
<luke__> Yeah, daftykins. A few of the games I was after are on there like Guns of Icarus Online but I wanted WoW as well.
<neuro> you keep using this word, i do not think it means what you think it means
<luke__> A person falsely claiming to have a special knowledge or skill; a fraud.
<daftykins> ok just checking.
<neuro> diddledan: you know fine well that I don't use any Linuxes on the desktop :) or at least you should
<diddledan> heretic!
<neuro> how does that make me a heretic?
<diddledan> I'll get back to you on that one when I've figured out an argument
<neuro> lol
 * neuro points to the staggering number of ubuntu, debian and rhel servers he's had access to over the years
<neuro> at second life, it was in the thousands
 * diddledan glazes over
<luke__> Do you guys know if I can open up a terminal and check on an installation is USC? PlayOnLinux has been applying changes for a good 10 minutes.
<luke__> An installation in USC, even.
<ali1234> USC always does that
<ali1234> the best thing to do is not use it
<luke__> Use Terminal instead?
<ali1234> there is a way to check the progress
<ali1234> but it is really complicated and i can't remember it
<ali1234> i use synaptic for package searching and browsing
<neuro> ps axu | grep -iw dpkg ?
<ali1234> nah, that won't tell you much
<ali1234> other than "dpkg is running" (or not)
<neuro> well it would tell you if shenanigans were occurring
<neuro> yeah
<ali1234> USC normally gets stuck because the package DB is locked
<ali1234> it doesn't bring up a message when that happens, it just waits forever
<ali1234> the DB can be locked by update manager
<hamitron> USC?
<ali1234> software center
<hamitron> ah yeh, I stopped using the default install because of it
<luke__> United Space Centre.
<luke__> I'll probably have to wait until it's stopped doing whatever it's doing to install Synaptic as well.
<hamitron> aptitude ftw
<hamitron> ;)
<neuro> Unilateral Sausage Confectionery
<neuro> aptitude, bleugh
<luke__> You took a while thinking of that one, didn't you, Neuro?
<neuro> why don't you just run something in java instead
<neuro> luke__: no, not really
<neuro> was doing something else and didn't have irc in focus :)
<luke__> Sure. You're just making us think you're some acronym genius.
<neuro> i am
<ali1234> aptitude really is horrible - it has all the problems of a GUI (confusing complicated layout) combined with all the problems of a terminal app (need to memorize lots of comlicated keyboard controls) and none of the advantages of either
<hamitron> ali1234, but it.... has a cool name
<hamitron> ;)
<hamitron> tbh, I like the search function
<luke__> Is it safe for me to quit USC with this thing in progress or will that not even stop it?
<ali1234> luke__: that probably won't even stop it
<diddledan> it'll carry on in the background
<ali1234> luke__: however, the background daemon that is trying to do the install has probably crashed anyway
<luke__> I'll go and get the lighter to melt my hard drive.
<hamitron> just install flash
<hamitron> ;/
<hamitron> gets my machine every time
<luke__> ali1234, is there a way I can exorcise the demon you mentioned?
<luke__> I think I have the new testament upstairs.
<ali1234> luke__: the package database has a lock anyway, so if you can install packages from the terminal or some other app, it means USC isn't actually doing anything
<ali1234> only one app can install things at a time
<luke__> I'll see if I can install Dungeon Crawler.
<luke__> It says something or other is in use.
<ali1234> ok so USC daemon is still running
<ali1234> in that case leave it for a bit
<ali1234> how long have you been waiting so far?
<luke__> Will speaking in tongues help? And it's been about 7-10 minutes
<ali1234> davmor2: whhere's that log that tells us what USC is really doing again please?
<ali1234> (brb, checking log for last time he told me)
<diddledan> there's /var/log/apt/{history,term}.log
<davmor2> ali1234: ~/.cache/software-center
<ali1234> luke__: ok so try this: tail -f ~/.cache/software-center/software-center.log
<ali1234> davmor2: thanks
<luke__> There's some error to do with not finding typelib for LaunchpadIntegration.
<luke__> Something to do with skipping some exhibits.
<luke__> And at the end it says it found a running software-center on dbus, reconnecting.
<ali1234> hmm that looks exactly the same as mine
<ali1234> maybe this isn't the right one
<luke__> I'm guessing I can't just pay its fare for dbus?
<daftykins> XD
<luke__> There's some stuff on the interwebs that says to kill the dpkg process. Do I have to find its ID or something first?
<daftykins> loved that :)
<daftykins> yeah process ID (PID), from ps -ef for example
<luke__> Thanks. I'm here all week. Try the veal.
<daftykins> :D
<luke__> I found one mention of the unholy demon and one of "dpkg". You reckon I should just kill the one with it in the name?
<luke__> In fact, there's a few demons. I'm blind.
<Myrtti> oh dear.
<luke__> Damn straight. Call me a priest.
<luke__> I'm going to kill nautilus-drop because someone on a forum told me to.
<ali1234> no i don't think you should kill things
<luke__> That's not what the voices in my head tell me.
<luke__> Well, that did bugger all.
<luke__> I'ma relog and see if it fixes it.
<diddledan> I wonder how many packages I'm compiling for a full openwrt archive
<diddledan> hmm, about 2000
<diddledan> according to wiki.openwrt.org/doc/packages
<luke__> Huzzah! Call off the priest, it worked.
<daftykins> i was all about to shout 'The power of Tux compells you' 'n' all :(
<diddledan> I now pronounce you penguin and wife
<diddledan> wait, what?
<daftykins> that's my line
<diddledan> hmm. my desktop needs to be bigger
<diddledan> desk*
<diddledan> I'm completely room'd out
<luke__> Uhhh... How do I install Synaptic from the terminal? Is it just called synaptic?
<diddledan> I've taken to plonking on laptop directly on top of the closed other laptop
<diddledan> one*
<diddledan> luke__, yeah
<luke__> Magical.
<diddledan> although there might be gtk and qt versions
<diddledan> in which case they'll be suffixed -gtk and -qt
<luke__> I don't know what that means so I'm going to assume I don't need them.
<diddledan> by default the desktop you look at uses gtk-based ui (buttons, sliders, scrollbars, etc.)
<hamitron> it is gtk init?
<diddledan> hamitron, I believe so. was just throwing the possibility out there
<luke__> Jesus Christ...
<luke__> Is anyone seeing an updated YouTube homepage?
<mgdm> I'm not often on it enough to know the difference
<hamitron> the huge advert?
<luke__> I don't think much has changed but for me the Guide GUI seems a bit different and it's not open by default
<hamitron> it is such a "clever" site, "knowing" the type of thing I watch :(
<mgdm> the huge advert is nothing new
<mgdm> they have them for occasional campaigns here and there
<luke__> I get lucky sometimes and there'll be an interview with a GoT cast member there that I haven't seen.
<hamitron> amazing, they "know" I wanted some exercise gear and the exact thing I want is available at amazon
<hamitron> I'm so going to give up browsing
<ali1234> hey i've got a question
<ali1234> why is it ok to say "turn off ad block if you like our website" but not ok to say "click on all the adverts and don't buy anything if you like our website" - ?
<daftykins> ooh, do share.
<daftykins> come now, you know the answer to that
<ali1234> no, i don't
<ali1234> as far as i am concerned they are exactly the same
<hamitron> one is actively stopping adverts, and the other is actively milking them
<hamitron> ;)
<daftykins> in my opinion one provides the opportunity to legitimately consider adverts, whilst the second falsifies interest to the sponsors
<hamitron> adverts are cool, they give you reason to be distracted and spend money
<hamitron> ;/
<daftykins> some make sounds i do not enjoy
<hamitron> :\
<mgdm> if you run video adverts on your site you get paid for them being viewed even if nobody clicks
<ali1234> what's the difference between looking at an advert you wouldn't normally look at vs visiting a webpage you wouldn't normally visit?
<luke__> I jump when the toaster pops up or when the kettle clicks. I get terrified when some booming voice asks me if I want to make money fast.
<shauno> it's probably nice and straight-forward.  asking your users to click adverts is non-organic traffic that google etc will kick you off adsense for
<ali1234> but so is asking users to turn off ad-block on just your site
<shauno> that's not something google will banhammer you for though
<hamitron> no, that is asking them to view the website as its creators intended
<ali1234> i know, but that doesn't mean it's not morally the same thing
<hamitron> ;)
<hamitron> personally I think adblock is a really bad thing, almost as bad as invasive adverts
<luke__> I'm pretty sure there's a window open that is' on my launchpad thing and won't show up in Alt+Tab is there any other way to get to it?
<luke__> Sorry, "isn't on my launchpad thing".
<ali1234> almost as bad but not quite bad enough to make me stop using it :)
<ali1234> luke__: you mean the launcher right? launchpad is a website
<luke__> Yeah. I was just testing you.
<hamitron> ali1234, haha, yeh, I'm thinking from the point of view of the financial viability of some online services
<ali1234> luke__: if it's not on the launcher and it's not on alt-tab, and you can't see any part of the window on the screen... then no. it's gone forever
<luke__> Damn. Oh well. I don't think it's that important.
<luke__> Well, bye guys. I'm off to sleep on a park bench.
<daftykins> enjoy
<hamitron> what he mean by that?
<daftykins> the sleeping on a park bench bit?
<hamitron> yeh
<daftykins> not the faintest of ideas
<daftykins> just a bit of a joker i think
<shauno> popey: that "streisand effect" you mentioned yesterday.  if you want a cheap laugh, someone else has control of their twitter account now
<diddledan> streisand effect?
 * diddledan prods shauno 
<neuro> diddledan: google it
<linuxliam> im trying to compile aptana from source but when i cd to the source dir and run make it syas no makefile found
<linuxliam> from here TJ https://github.com/aptana/studio3/tree/release
<neuro> what source directory?
<linuxliam> the source cod was taken from the github url
<neuro> yeah but what are you trying to compile?
<linuxliam> the IDE itself
<linuxliam> sorry lil noobisj at this sort of thing
<neuro> it doesn't look like that kind of source release
<neuro> looks like they've released their code to core parts of the IDE and that's it
<neuro> ah, i see
<neuro> aptana is basically a bunch of add-ons for eclipse
<neuro> so you'd need to build eclipse first
<neuro> why are you trying to compile it anyway? what's wrong with their prebuilt downloads?
<linuxliam> just trying to package it
<neuro> as a deb?
<linuxliam> yup yup
<neuro> i'd download the eclipse plug in files and package those with eclipse as a dependency
<neuro> the source code on github just looks like it's there to meet their chosen GPL requirements
<linuxliam> the github code confused me a lil
<diddledan> aparently the prebuilt package has been downloaded 6 meelion times (according to aptana.com)
<neuro> looks pretty straightforward to install: http://www.samclarke.com/2012/04/how-to-install-aptana-studio-3-on-ubuntu-12-04-lts-precise-pangolin/
<neuro> so i guess i'd just duplicate steps 3-4 in the deb
<neuro> except modifying the paths appropriately to fit packaging conventions
<neuro> and then making sure it works, i guess :)
<linuxliam> yea i know how to install it just a few people have asked why it hasn't been packaged
<diddledan> looks like it's EOL as aptana studio
<diddledan> appcelerator have renamed it titanium-studio and retargetted it as a javascript ide for their mobile development sdk
<neuro> yeah, news page is broken, twitter and facebook not updated for over a year
<diddledan> http://www.appcelerator.com/platform/titanium-studio/
<diddledan> no mention of webdev... at.. all
<linuxliam> i mean i could look for a better IDe for web dev but idk i haven't found many
<linuxliam> any ideas
<neuro> vim
<linuxliam> i was looking for somthing along the lines of webmatrix
<diddledan> there aren't many full-blown IDEs. I tend to use sublime text
<neuro> that was going to be my next suggestion :)
<neuro> best $70 (or whatever) I've spent in a long time
<neuro> linuxliam: best way to do web dev is to have as little abstractions as possible
<neuro> and you're talking to someone who's done web dev on and off since 1994
<neuro> vim, sublime text, et al ... any serious editor will do code highlighting
<linuxliam> its more of a hobby for me used to do some when i was in college
<linuxliam> i'd like to learn python but i cant get my head around it
<neuro> http://www.diveintopython.net/
<neuro> http://www.diveinto.org/python3/
<linuxliam> neuro: thanks
#ubuntu-uk 2013-08-14
<mungbean> !ping
<lubotu3> pong!
<MartijnVdS> good morning!
<mungbean> thought my session had hung
<mungbean> last update 11:26pm
<MooDoo> morning
<MartijnVdS> I have a few nickchanges from earlier this morning
<mungbean> i put those on ignore
<MartijnVdS> I have joins and parts on ignore, nick changes can be useful sometimes
<mungbean> http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&ll=51.492159,-0.19092&spn=0.005291,0.013937&sll=51.492140,-0.193028&layer=c&cid=12502927659667388442&panoid=c9UMhWP_MWm9U0L48xEjYw&cbp=13,291.8,,0,18.86&gl=US&t=m&cbll=51.492132,-0.192862&z=17
<mungbean> follow the >> arrows...
<MartijnVdS> mungbean: woo :)
<MartijnVdS> mungbean: it's bigger on the inside!
<MooDoo> lol
<mungbean> i always drink my chocolate milk too fast :(
<mungbean> ouch
<mungbean> how do i selectively block a user's twitter updates that are getting sent to facebook?
<MartijnVdS> I think you can't? Except for disabling the auto-forwarding
<mungbean> it used to be possible to hide eejit@twitter updates selectively
<mungbean> its possible to choose to unselect games, comments and likes etc, and "other activity"
<brobostigon> good morning everyone,
<MartijnVdS> heh http://www.shouldireadthedailymail.com/
<JamesTait> Good morning all, happy Soyuz TM-25 landing day!
<MartijnVdS> JamesTait: Not TM-34?
<JamesTait> MartijnVdS, not according to Wikipedia.  That landed on November 10th, apparently.
<MartijnVdS> JamesTait: but they're more Ubuntu-relevant
<MartijnVdS> s/they're/that one is
<JamesTait> What is this relevance of which you speak?
<mungbean> mir?
<JamesTait> No, I mean "relevance".  What is it?
<MartijnVdS> sabdfl was on TM-34.. though the TM-25 "Mir" connection is good ;)
<mungbean> why does shuttleworth look completely different in the space pics?
<mungbean> he doesn't look like the same person
<MartijnVdS> does he?
<mungbean> http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e4/Mark_Shuttleworth_NASA.jpg
<neuro> short hair
<neuro> younger
<neuro> freefall
<mungbean> Shattlbort
<mungbean> is the russian name
<MartijnVdS> b=v, so shattlvort
<mungbean> Shattlvort
<neuro> nu par ruski?
<MartijnVdS> (Voldemort?)
<mungbean> da konechno
<mungbean> blurry pic
<mungbean> ya lublu morozhenoe
<mungbean> that pic looks photoshopped head
<neuro> khorosho dlya vas!
<neuro> and what flavour?
<neuro> ya lyublyu lampy
<neuro> ya lyublyu kover
<MartijnVdS> Wait.. this is #ubuntu-uk(raine) now?
<neuro> haha
<neuro> was just thinking that
<bigcalm> o.O
<mungbean> koshka v sadu
<neuro> the number of times i've seen people mess up mailman installs because they pick 'uk' for the language rather than 'gb' ...
 * neuro is about to throw his phone out the window
<MartijnVdS> neuro: time for a Win8 phone?
<neuro> bloomin' constant gmail notifications about the same bloody email over an hour ago
<neuro> gonna have to reinstall the gmail app
<neuro> again
<neuro> i have to do this like every couple of months
<mungbean> CM or stock android?
<neuro> you're funny
<MartijnVdS> mungbean: neuro is a microsoft supporter (proof: he pre-ordered an xbone)
<neuro> iOS 6.1.3 (10B329)
<neuro> MartijnVdS: i'm platform agnostic
<neuro> best tool for the job and all that
<dwatkins> I'd prefer a zbox.
<mungbean> the best tool is android
<neuro> although i wouldn't say i'm a "microsoft supporter"
<mungbean> have you, or do you buy their products?
<neuro> out of all the computers i've bought over the years, i've only kept a microsoft OS on four of them
<dwatkins> considering MS make a loss on the xbox, buying it doesn't really constitute supporting them...
<neuro> dwatkins: i buy games too
<dwatkins> ...and I got Windows 8 for Â£25, so I imagine they made a loss on that too.
<dwatkins> neuro: fair enough, I buy them too, but often a long time after release
<neuro> yeah but MS take the same slice off the top regardless
<mungbean> surely each licence is a profit?
<neuro> depends what the dev cost was
<dwatkins> My employer buys laptops which come with Windows, I can't really do anything about that apart from insist on having a Mac.
<neuro> \o/
<dwatkins> <-- bucking trends in computer technology since 1981
<neuro> lol
<dwatkins> (we got a BBC micro)
<neuro> hardly
<mungbean> acorn electron -> acorn a3000 -> uni -> PC running win95 -> 98se -> XP/linux dual -> linux
<neuro> yeah but buying a mac is hardly bucking a trend
<dwatkins> BBC Micro - > 486 DX/2 66 (Win 3.11 and Slackware) -> many many self-built PCs
<DJones> I can remember selling the BBC Micros when they were first released, there were queue's out of the door and for about 50 yards down the road
<neuro> apple hammered everyone last quarter
<dwatkins> wow, DJones - didn't realise they were that popular
<neuro> if you include ipads :P
<dwatkins> Android is much more popular than iOS if you look at the stats for OS instead of the manufacturer, iirc.
<neuro> ipad 2 + ipad 4 + ipad mini + imac + macbook pro + macbook air + mac mini + mac pro = 18.6m units in Q2 2013 (17.1%)
<mungbean> "pple hammered everyone last quarte"?
<mungbean> in the courts maybe
<neuro> then lenovo (13.1m), hp (13m), samsung (10.8m), dell (9.4m)
<DJones> dwatkins: It was probably because schools were recommending them & were buying them for their own computer classes, we were selling those, Atari's, Spectrums, Dragon's, Oric's and the like at the time
<DJones> Occasional Apple's
<neuro> apple's what?
 * dwatkins steals all the apostrophes
<neuro> <- grammar nazi
<DJones> But they were the 'top end' machines
<DJones> neuro: Apple II's
<dwatkins> yeah, and the beeb was more expensive
<neuro> Apple II's what?
<neuro> schools were recommending beebs because the gubment selected them
 * DJones kicks neuro in the apostrophe
<DJones> 's :)
<neuro> DJones: start using the apostrophe correctly and i'll stop pointing it out :)
<neuro> and sorry, not the gubment, the BBC
<DJones> I use what feels right
<SuperMatt> has... has something changed to screen locking in saucy?
<dwatkins> http://i.imgur.com/IhXffyP.jpg
<neuro> exactly!
<neuro> you can't just go around throwing down apostrophes because you feel like it
<MartijnVdS> SuperMatt: why?
 * DJones Hands neuro a shift key to capitalise the start of sentences to correct the grammar
<neuro> why did you capitalise "hands"?
<neuro> where are your full stops?
<neuro> come on man, put your game face on :)
<mungbean> sigh
<DJones> :)
<neuro> mungbean: I'M KIDDING, YOU FRUIT LOOP
<mungbean> capitals are so last century
<MartijnVdS> neuro: poker face? ð
<SuperMatt> MartijnVdS: nm, it was just a result of some packages I installed and removed
<neuro> MartijnVdS: and you can ram that unicode where the sun don't shine ;)
<MartijnVdS> SuperMatt: stop doing that ;)
<SuperMatt> though the effect was pretty good
<SuperMatt> the "lock" screen was the login screen, which was much prettier than what we have now
<MartijnVdS> neuro: ð©
<neuro> STOP IT
<MartijnVdS> neuro: â« neuro can't stand unicode âª
<neuro> /ignore
<dwatkins> How do you write "/ignore" without a space at the start of the line?
<neuro> /say
<dwatkins>  /say
<dwatkins> oh right, siily me
<mungbean> /say
<neuro> :)
<dwatkins> /ignore
<dwatkins> thanks
<mungbean>  /say /say
<mungbean> /say /say
<mungbean> :P
<dwatkins> Insayption!
<dwatkins> I think I need to go lie down now.
<mungbean> i've never seen any of these films that the reddit kids meme about
<dwatkins> I vaguely remember the plot to Inception, but it wasn't very awe-inspiring.
 * neuro watched it again just last week
<neuro> mungbean: how old are you, 91? :)
<mungbean> between 30-40
<mungbean> a lot of redditors are excited 17 yr olds
<mungbean> especially in default subs
<dwatkins> There was a trend on some photo site a while ago to take a photo of the computer displaying an image, print it out, and do other silly things to increase the layers of abstraction, but I don't remember where I saw it.
<mungbean> repeating the same stuff they just learned ad naseueum
<dwatkins> yeah, that gets old very easily
<mungbean> i hate memes and "in-jokes"
<mungbean> which is which slashdot died for me
<mungbean> in soviet russia...on *every* thread
<BigRedS> haha
<mungbean> wine is not an emulator...
<dwatkins> I havn't looked at Slashdot for more than a moment in years,
<BigRedS> I think they've stopped that now most of the /. commentors don't know what soviet russia is
<mungbean> i used to have it on twitter but i stopped reading twitter
<dwatkins> I quite like Hacker News, the comments there actually seem to be fairly sensible at times.
<BigRedS> really?
<BigRedS> every time I go to HN i read the top few comments and it puts me off the rest
<neuro> dwatkins: http://neuro.me.uk/2004/11/05/ui9-redux/
<dwatkins> neuro: nice
<DJones> Does anybody have a Nexus 7, how is connectivity with 13.04, just wondering if it connects for copying files etc by cable
<dwatkins> You're looking at the screensaver, kid! http://images.fineartamerica.com/images-medium-large/boy-at-computer-displaying-seti-40home-screen-saver-david-parker.jpg
<dwatkins> It's even written in the image filename...
<neuro> dwatkins: or did you mean something like this? http://www.flickr.com/photos/neuro/7467721/in/photostream/
<dwatkins> neuro: that's neat too, but I was thinking more of the loss of quality with each different type of reproduction, from monitor to photograph of monitor to printout of photograph of monitor etc.
<neuro> oh, right
<neuro> pff no idea :)
<popey> i met the chaps behind /. at oscon this month. nice chaps
<popey> most of their content goes on the sister sites, not /. itself
<mungbean> my fingers rebel against me when trying to type /.
<popey> ditto
<neuro> mungbean: in soviet russia, thread hates you
 * mungbean stabs neuro
<neuro> actually that would have been funnier if i'd managed to type what i'd intended to type
<neuro> in soviet russia, meme hates you
<neuro> never mind
<mungbean> my boy is coming to the office today to see me :D
<davmor2> Morning all
<AlanBell> http://www.indiegogo.com/projects/ubuntu-edge creeping up on $10,000,000 soon, maybe another hour or so
<daftykins> not really too relevant that, though?
<AlanBell> indeed, not really. It is SchrÃ¶dinger's money. Lots in the box, unless you look at the target, at which point the waveform collapses and it is nothing
<neuro> actually, it's real money
<neuro> it just hasn't been refunded yet
<neuro> but it has actually been taken from people's bank accounts and credit card balances
<popey> not relevant?
<DJones> 13.10 seems to have gotten a noticable speed increase over 13.04 even in virtualbox
<popey> $10,266,845
<popey> thats a nice number to beat
<davmor2> DJones: it's the improvements that have been made so it runs on mobile,  in theory once unity7 is replaced with unity8 it will become faster still
<ali1234> so i opened a paypal account the other day. today i got a letter asking me to "complete account setup" by adding a bank account. a real letter. by post.
<daftykins> nice
<ali1234> i wonder if this letter would serve as proof of identity for opening a bank account
<daftykins> probably not
<dwatkins> sounds a bit circular.
<popey> \o/ $10M
<diddledan> only another 22 to go
<popey> indeed!
<popey> not long now! :D
<AlanBell> still a few quit short on my screen
<diddledan> I really want it to succeed but I'm feeling I'll be getting my money back
<AlanBell> $9,997,012
<popey> yeah, my indicator rounds up â»
<popey> wish it rounded up to 32M â»
<diddledan> at least I can say I put money into it
<diddledan> I "did my bit" :-)
<directhex> i wonder whether the edge's failure will nevertheless serve as an advert for ubuntu touch to the real clients - i.e. verizon etc
<diddledan> directhex, hopefully
<AlanBell> the background sustainable looking level of sales is quite good
<popey> i suspect it already has
<diddledan> popey, you'd probably not be allowed to tell us until a product is announced anyway, because of damned NDAs
<directhex> popey, maybe. maybe not. canonical has struggled to sell ubuntu to OEMs for various verticals - IVE, TV, etc - in the past.
<popey> indeed
<popey> that was before showing a clear demand
<diddledan> yeah, one thing that can be said is that even with something that doesn't exist canonical can raise 20,000 paying customers
<AlanBell> if you look at http://ubuntu-edge.info/#change and ignore all the big peaks, and extend at that background level for 12 months you get 62M in sales (rough guess)
<AlanBell> plus add in all the business sales locked out by unneccessary VAT and general admin daftness
<popey> ok, _now_ it's over $10M
<AlanBell> yay, bit of a phyrric victory, but yay
<AlanBell> I am curious what is going through the minds of people pledging at this point
<diddledan> AlanBell, probably that they'll get their money back in a week
<AlanBell> yeah, but they are going to get a refund to a paypal account I think, so you pay money from credit card now, next week it is refunded to paypal, and you have to spend it there or take a transaction fee to remove it?
<diddledan> AlanBell, withdrawals to bank accounts are free (at least in the uk)
<AlanBell> oh, OK
<bashrc> Personally I don't really care about the phone crowdsourcing.  I'm more of a desktop/laptop user.
<directhex> http://releases.ubuntu.com/raring/ is broken?
<directhex> http://ddj9plya1d2mr.cloudfront.net/ubuntu-13.04-desktop-amd64.iso -> This web page is not available
<diddledan> works for me
<diddledan> odd that you're getting cloudfront urls
<directhex> *shrug*
<directhex> at least cloud-to-butt isn't converting them to mybuttfront.net urls
<diddledan> o_O
<directhex> breaking the torrenting rules for the office. hope the it manager doesn't catch me
<diddledan> it would be worse if you swapped butt and front about
<directhex> https://github.com/panicsteve/cloud-to-butt
<diddledan> riiight
<AlanBell> that should be part of the juju project really
<ali1234> what exactly does lavabit do that i cannot do with PGP and any email account in the whole world?
<ali1234> *did
<popey> there was a technical document posted recently
<popey> http://possibility.com/LavabitArchitecture.html
<mungbean> rather high for POP
<mungbean> in 2009, 80% POP, 10% IMAP, 10% webmail
<brobostigon> can i get fail2ban to work with ipv6? or is there something similer which does work with ipv6?
<diddledan> I still don't see what's so special about them other than using a proprietary advertising daemon
<SuperMatt> ali1234: I guess the real advantage was that you didn't have to rely on third parties to be able to encrypt, because it's all stored encrypted on your end
<SuperMatt> although if the nsa had access to the third party's inbox, it really didn't matter
<ali1234> i don't understand
<ali1234> none of this actually explains what service they provide
<shauno> worth noting that only lavabit's paid tier got the encrpytion offering, and that's a slim slice of the pie
<diddledan> ali1234, I don't get it either
<mungbean> the document seems to describe a standard cyrus setup
<mungbean> by 2013 the company bring in around 100k revenue.
<mungbean> never heard of them before they shut
<shauno> to be fair, we don't hear much about most mail providers, with the 10-tonne gorilla being so popular
<AlanBell> plain text emails are encrypted for the eyes of the mailbox owner before being written to disk, do other things do that?
<BigRedS> brobostigon: fail2ban just runs iptables rules doesn' tit?
<mungbean> AlanBell: automagically?
<AlanBell> yeah, by the server, it would wrap up encrypted mails too I guess
<mungbean> i didn't notice this in the doc. i did skim it though
<brobostigon> DJones: yep.
<AlanBell> * Do you use any particularly cool technologies or algorithms?
<brobostigon> i mean BigRedS
<BigRedS> Haha, that's a new one :)
<brobostigon> my fingers slipped.
<ali1234> yeah see that's the thing - if you're sending or receiving plaintext emails it doesn't really matter if it is encrypted on your email server
<AlanBell> so as soon as it is on disk, the service provider has plausible deniability
<BigRedS> then it should be ble to do ip6
<ali1234> they can just sniff it in transit, or in the receiver's mailbox
<BigRedS> yeah - surely if you're paranoid the server's receiving crypted mail and it doesn't matter how it stores it
<AlanBell> yeah, but you can't raid the server and take the lot
<brobostigon> BigRedS: so just change and or add it to include ip6tables inclusive to iptables ?
<ali1234> you don't need to. you just go to the upstream provider and have them install a tap...
<mungbean> most of the users are using pop anyway
<shauno> you still want paranoia wherever possible anyway (ssl in transit, asymmetric on-disk), else gpg isn't hiding *Who* you're talking to
<AlanBell> I am not saying it is wonderful, but I think that is the thing that it is about
<mungbean> probably not keeping much on the server
<BigRedS> brobostigon: I don't know for sure, but there's no good reason for it to do anything but Just Work as far as I can see
<brobostigon> BigRedS: i see, ok. i will test that out.
<AlanBell> presumably the NSA didn't go far enough upstream when attempting to install the tap
<shauno> he says (and that appears to be 2009) 140,000 accounts, 1500 paid customers, and that the encryption is "Alas, right now this is only available to paid users".  So the 1% that are actually encrypting disappear in pop/imap/etc stats
<ali1234> nah. more likely they got some incriminating emails from an upstream tap, but in a way that makes them inadmissible
<ali1234> so now they need to compell lavabit to hand them over legally, by a warrant
<SuperMatt> I have a feeling that the NSA didn't want details of other customers, instead, they probably wanted something in place so that the NSA could read anything going in and out of snowden's account. That of course would have compromised the secuirty of all accounts, so he shut it down
<SuperMatt> feds can't track what's no longer going in and out
<ali1234> probably that too
<shauno> from how it reads with the asymmetric encryption, they'd need to keep it live to let snowdon log-in, since his password is the private key for the on-disk encryption
<shauno> if he can't log in, they can't capture that, and lavabit can't decrypt the data at-rest
<mungbean> se they are mopping up the top tier of email providers, now going for tier 2 and lower
<mungbean> alternatively he could move operations to sweden/elsewhere
<mungbean> or sell to kimdotcom
<diddledan> he needs to run it himself like all the bad boys do
<diddledan> or use tor
<diddledan> as in snowden does
<diddledan> alan_g|tea, that sounds like a plan
<BigRedS> most people who run it themselves do so on a VPS, though
<shauno> I'm still on the hunt for a reasonably priced vps provider in iceland (who isn't owned by an overseas parent)
<mungbean> most of my emails are from the train company and amazon
<mungbean> hence gmail
<shauno> I don't particularly have anything to hide, I just find it an interesting challenge
<mungbean> i have a self hosted zimbra server too
<diddledan> ewww
<diddledan> zimbra == bloat
<mungbean> :-|
<mungbean> not if you're running your company infrastructure off it
<diddledan> hmm
<shauno> I mean, I don't care who reads my mother's birthday card, but I still seal the envelope
<diddledan> yeah that improves it's size-to-benefit
<mungbean> its fantastic
<diddledan> but for individuals or for resellers it's evil
<mungbean> and solid
<SuperMatt> can I email someone to test I have my enigmail set up correctly?
<mungbean> bigbarry@whitehouse.gov
<SuperMatt> lollers
<diddledan> bigbarry? whosat?
<MartijnVdS> nobody@nsa.gov
<mungbean> i hope thats his real addy
<mungbean> barry obama
<diddledan> aah
<MartijnVdS> obi-one (where "obi" is short for "obama" ;)
<diddledan> I've not heard him referred to as barry often enough to associate the name
<shauno> if you're going to go for barry, at least make him an o'bama ;)
<mungbean> he woulda got elected if he called himself barry o'bama
<mungbean> the irishmans choice
<shauno> I dunno if you've caught the news in the last 7 years, but he did get himself elected
<diddledan> didn't he get elected anyway?
<mungbean> wow
<mungbean> it worked then
<mungbean> wasn't the other guy a mormon?
<diddledan> moron*
<SuperMatt> I love how no one has offered up their email address :(
<mungbean> he won by default then
 * SuperMatt cries in the corner
<diddledan> SuperMatt, I don't have decipherability set up
<mungbean> u wanna encrypt a mail?
<mungbean> you need my pub key?
<SuperMatt> surely it'll find out your pubkey from keyservers, no?
<mungbean> i haven't registered with one
<SuperMatt> oh right
<SuperMatt> then yes?
<mungbean> i don't have a pub key (for GPG)
<mungbean> anymore
<mungbean> i sort of lost it
<diddledan> that's a good idea.. I need to copy my private key onto this machine
<mungbean> need to work out whether AMD 8380 or Xeon X5570 are faster
<mungbean> i think its the intels
<directhex> intel.
<directhex> there, easy answer
<mungbean> users have a choice of 1 queue with 32 cores of AMD or submit to the blades queue with 64 cores of intel
<mungbean> guess what they choose
<diddledan> ok SuperMatt you can try me at dan@bang-on.net - my public key id is 0349ED21
<SuperMatt> diddledan: I've emailed you, though I'm not sure what to do with your key id? :/
<SuperMatt> I've signed my email
<diddledan> SuperMatt, the key id is only if you want to encrypt
<SuperMatt> of course
<SuperMatt> because it needs your public key
<SuperMatt> ok, well you should have something signed from me
<diddledan> hmm, it doesn't seem to want to verify it in enigmail - let me try the commandline
<SuperMatt> eep
<diddledan> aah, might be that it can't find your pubkey in my keyring - I've not imported it yet
<SuperMatt> B46A6CE6
<diddledan> it verifies correctly on the commandline so your signature is good
<diddledan> just wondering why my enigmail isn't working *prods it*
<SuperMatt> lol
<directhex> enigmail doesn't woek
<diddledan> ?
<directhex> it just fails to wire into the right point in the thunderbird pipeline, meaning a high likelihood that any mail you send from enigmail won't validate in gpg
<SuperMatt> I think I understand what you mean
<BigRedS> I thought that to validate it just had to have the line "-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- " at the top. That's how I've been encrypting my mail for years
<diddledan> so what would work better for gpg-based comms?
<BigRedS> er, that'd be signing, obviously
<shauno> mail.app wfm ;)
<BigRedS> mutt works for me :)
<diddledan> shauno, I'm not on os x atm
<diddledan> and isn't gpg in mail.app an evil unsupported hack?
<shauno> sure, but it works
<mgdm> if it's a hack, it's quite a well-done one
<diddledan> mail.app doesn't provide an api
<diddledan> so it's using undocumented stuff, i.e. hack
<shauno> that's what prompted my (admittedly bad) sense of humour.  thunderbird does have an api.  apparently api!=results :p
<mungbean> the funny thing about our internal irc channel at work is the regularity you get root passwords copy pasted into it
<diddledan> mungbean, I won't believe it until I see the logs
<SuperMatt> diddledan: would you mind encrypting something for me?
<diddledan> done
<SuperMatt> got it, thanks :)
<SuperMatt> encrypted reply... nice :)
<diddledan> ssshhhh!
<diddledan> dammit, now everyone knows
<SuperMatt> oh man
<MartijnVdS> traffic analysis
<popey> i have a plugin in my browser which lets me do gpg in gmail
<MartijnVdS> popey: oh, shiny
<popey> mailvelope
<popey> http://www.mailvelope.com/
<BigRedS> oooh
<SuperMatt> diddledan: you need to get your key signed by a trusted third party!
<diddledan> yeah
<diddledan> but who do I know that is going to go on record as actually knowing me?!
<ali1234> evil mole pa...
<SuperMatt> surely a friend or something?
<shauno> I think he's right there.  dan doesn't have many friends that'd admit it :p
<diddledan> :-D
<SuperMatt> hahaha
<diddledan> seems enigmail works for encrypted messages automatically decrypting them, but doesn't recognise a signed message
<diddledan> this is in ubuntu serious salami
<SuperMatt> maybe updates to thunderbird have messged it about a bit
<mungbean> maybe geary should resubmit their kickstarter but for raising $20k to add very smooth PGP support
<SuperMatt> they need pgp, simple archiving like thunderbird has got, and saving outgoing messages to sent
<SuperMatt> because I'm very surprised that's not in there already
<MartijnVdS> proper gmail-imap support
<MartijnVdS> I know it's not "normal" IMAP, but just support it natively. Please :)
<diddledan> I really need to move away from gmail - it's sucking my lifeforce
<SuperMatt> I've configured my own mail server
<MartijnVdS> diddledan: at least it's not reddit
<mungbean> the 100$K kicstarter was promsiing transparent GPG
<diddledan> SuperMatt, I'm thinking of doing the same
<diddledan> I've already got a decent server that I pay for.. might as well use it
<SuperMatt> indeed
<SuperMatt> I run mail and web on a single 1gig vps
<SuperMatt> it's enough for me
 * diddledan hides his monster
<diddledan> I've got a dedicated unit at hetzner
<SuperMatt> and now I'm looking in to getting a class 2 ssl cert
<diddledan> is that physical-address-validated?
<SuperMatt> yup
<diddledan> I've got a wildcard ssl cert that's domain validated
<SuperMatt> well I'm trying to get the wildcard bit
<SuperMatt> cos I've got a number of certs right now
<diddledan> I can't remember who I went with for mine now
<diddledan> hopefully they'll email me when it comes to renewal
<diddledan> looks like it was a geotrust reseller
<diddledan> so how does one keep gpg keyrings in sync across several devices?
<shauno> I don't.  if I need a key, it's on the keyserver
<shauno> seems little benefit in curating my own personal stash
<diddledan> what about syncing your own key tho, say you get it signed by someone at oggcamp how do you ensure all your devices have that signed version as opposed to the naked version?
<shauno> don't you get the your public key signed?
<shauno> so that'd just go back to the keyserver too
<diddledan> hmm
<diddledan> furry nuff
<diddledan> damned clients. damn them all to having clients of their own!
<diddledan> latest issue is we have a client that tells us our code doesn't work but doesn't tell us how it's not working
<diddledan> just sends screenshots with nothing indicating what's actually wrong. just a screenshot of a webpage in IE.
<diddledan> we're supposed to determine exactly what's wrong with that with no other hints
<bigcalm> Best to have a phone call with the client
<diddledan> yeah, I might try that tomorrow, but I'm supposed to be on a different job that's rush rush
<joshmyers> hey guys, I want to pass arguments into a simple bash script, but I would like to set some sane default for of the arguments are not passed in. How could I do that here? https://gist.github.com/2429412bc9c7deaadb5e
<shauno> stage=${1:-"Default"}
<shauno> not the prettiest construct, but effective
<joshmyers> ah ok
<joshmyers> great thanks shauno
<joshmyers> and I can do that for any of the arguments
<shauno> yeah.  and you can mix the literal & vars too, so stage=${1:-$defaultstage}, etc
<shauno> the '1' is the same one from $1, you're just saying "$1 or else $defaultstage"
<joshmyers> ok gotcha
<joshmyers> like this: https://gist.github.com/50be6aa6c77f3c6ef6de
<shauno> you got it
<joshmyers> awesome, muchos thanks
<ali1234> argh... just don't write complex stuff like that in bash
<MartijnVdS> yeah, use perl instead
<ali1234> eh... i'd prefer that tbh
<ali1234> perl fits that niche pretty well... of things to complex for a shell script but not quite complicated enough for a real programming language
<Myrtti> uh, I'm having a slow moment
<Myrtti> but
<Myrtti> http://m.flickr.com/#/photos/myrtti/9512199206/
<Myrtti> should I try fsck -A?
<ali1234> what have you got to lose?
<ali1234> you should probably image the entire drive before attempting repair if there is anything important on it
<Myrtti> I don't know, I've never manually run fsck before
<Myrtti> well.
<Myrtti> here goes nothing
<Myrtti> time to do backups
<Myrtti> so yeah
<Myrtti> managed to fix it with fsck but taking backups
 * neuro larts davmor2
<davmor2> neuro: stick frankie boyle in too for good measure then at least one of the proclaimers is going :)
<neuro> but frankie boyle wasn't in The Thick of It
<davmor2> neuro: true
<neuro> which was kind of my point
<davmor2> neuro: I still stand by my statement you have too much time on your hands :P
<neuro> err a thought that took 5 seconds to come to, and another 60 seconds to send the tweet?
<neuro> i never understand these sort of comments ... "you have too much time on your hands" ... "go outside and get a life" ... etc
<davmor2> neuro: too much time I tell you far to much
<christel> one of our staffers, kloeri, looks exactly like the proclaimers
<MartijnVdS> christel: would he walk 500 miles?
<brobostigon> lol.
<davmor2> MartijnVdS: more important would he walk 500 more?
<christel> he totally would!
<christel> ;)
<MartijnVdS> And would he do it so he can be the man who walked 1000 miles to fall down at your door?
<christel> no :(
<MartijnVdS> Speaking of this.. has everyone seen the latest xkcd what-if?
<MartijnVdS> http://what-if.xkcd.com/58/
<davmor2> wouldn't you fall at a door if you just walked a 1000 miles :D
<MartijnVdS> davmor2: a mile a day is very doable.
<MartijnVdS> davmor2: it'll take 2.5 years.. but it's doable
<davmor2> neuro: I take it back MartijnVdS has way too much time on his hands you only had some time on yours :)
<MartijnVdS> davmor2: I do? :)
<MartijnVdS> \o/ XBone launch in .nl has been delayed already.
<neuro> what is this "xbone" of which you speak?
<MartijnVdS> neuro: the thing you pre-ordered.. XBox 180
<neuro> didn't order one of those
<MartijnVdS> neuro: Isn't that the new XBox MS are launching?
<neuro> which is called the Xbox One
<MartijnVdS> Yeah, and because Microsoft changed a lot about the game-loading and online/sharing bits after Sony announced the PS4, poeple started calling it the "XBox one-eighty"
<neuro> whatever :)
<davmor2> surely an xbone is either soil or ash
<MartijnVdS> also, people call it "xbone", for "XBox ONE"
<neuro> yes, i know
<neuro> i'm not one of those people
<neuro> i'm also not one of those people who say "Micro$oft"
<neuro> or "Crapple"
<MartijnVdS> When did I say "Micro$oft"?
<MartijnVdS> (yeah just now)
<neuro> you didn't
<neuro> but it's the same idea
<MartijnVdS> neuro: what about micros~1? ;)
<neuro> never did that either
<neuro> it's childish
<davmor2> neuro: wait a minute I've never seen you and RMS in the same room are you sure you don't say Crapple as your alter ego ?
<neuro> i've met rms and there were witnesses, so let's just put that conspiracy theory to rest :)
<MartijnVdS> neuro: you're his puppeteer?
 * neuro wanders off to watch the football
<mungbean> i was gonna do stuff tonight :(
<mungbean> feel like i've been hit by the tired stick.
<neuro> well, that was a shame
<neuro> but a good game nonetheless
<ali1234> wow, i didn't know the radio times even had a website
<shauno> I sometimes wonder if even the bbc know how many websites they own
<ali1234> wouldn't surprise me if the streaming site they intended to block was being run on the side by some bbc IT bod
<bigcalm> Good evening peeps:)
<diddledan> can someone tell me if they're getting nginx reporting "bad gateway" on dev.openwrt.org? I can't seem to access it atm
<shauno> it seems to be much easier than that.  a blocked site creates a dns record under their domain, pointing to an innocent third-party.  you then try to visit that record from within the block, and the IP gets added to The List
<bigcalm> diddledan: taking a long time to get a response from that URL
<diddledan> bigcalm, thanks
<shauno> that's how they got torrentfreak blocked last week
<diddledan> it's not just me then :-)
<bigcalm> 504 Gateway Time-out
<diddledan> shauno, huh?
<diddledan> shauno, you sense make no
<ali1234> diddledan: he was replying to me, not you :P
<diddledan> ali1234, even so, it doesn't make much sense afaict
<ali1234> yeah it does
<ali1234> what happens is they order a block on the ip of www.piratedownloadz.com
<ali1234> so them www.piratedownloadz.com just gets a new IP. then they block that
<ali1234> so then they point their hostname and some legit site, and the autofilters block that
<ali1234> that's the simple version anyway
<ali1234> but i'm not so sure that's what happened here
<ali1234> it looks like a lot of sites are all on the one IP for some reason - maybe nt though, i dunno
<shauno> that's what happened to torrentfreak earlier in the week, and seems easily repeatable
<ali1234> yeah
<diddledan> torrentfreak got blocked by some blocked site pointing to it? o_O
<ali1234> yeah the filtering software is basically a minimal effort, possibly even designed to fail
<diddledan> two birds one stone
<diddledan> torrentfreak surely should have been blocked anyway?
<ali1234> why? it's just a news site
<diddledan> really?
<diddledan> I wouldn't know, I don't frequent underground sites
<ali1234> torrentfreak isn't an underground site
<ali1234> it's just a blog, like slashdot
<diddledan> "torrent" is classed as underground by "the man"
<diddledan> like kazzaa
<ali1234> http://torrentfreak.com/radiotimes-com-blocked-by-uk-isps-due-to-rightsholder-error-130814/
<ali1234> "According to PC Pro,  the problems were not caused by an EZTV-style DNS issue, but a  long-feared problem â that sites with shared resources would be all fall  victim to overbroad blocking."
<shauno> the official line is that radiotimes was actually sharing an IP with "a naughty site".  which seems implausible, since radiotimes is half on akamai (if that'd been blocked we'd notice), and half inside a netblock owned by the BBC
<diddledan> there was nothing illegal about kazzaa just like there's nothing illegal about torrent but the association caused by illegal use causes people to see "torrent" and assume it's illegal
<ali1234> yeah, that's what seems implausible about it to me too
<ali1234> my ISP doesn't participate in any of this nonsense anyway
<diddledan> mine either
<diddledan> and if it did I'd move
<diddledan> I use third-party dns resolvers, too
<shauno> mine block tpb, but nothing else yet
<shauno> (but they at least dragged it through the courts first, instead of just rolling over like the other big ISP here)
<diddledan> bt, virgin and sky are all rolling over and playing dead
<diddledan> they don't care whether it's censorship as long as consumers pay them
<mibofra_cell> diddledan oh hi :)
<diddledan> moo
<diddledan> I like aaisp's response to david "dictator" cameroon's great smutwall
<shauno> I'm hoping that'll end up an acceptable response.  be nice to see people acting like adults for a change
<diddledan> https://order.aa.net.uk/h1order.cgi <-- see the "active choice" section
<diddledan> in fact, that's not the right one
<shauno> as I understand it, the govt position is "play ball or we'll have to create legislation.  and you know how messy that'll be" ?
<diddledan> yeah
<diddledan> it sucks
<ali1234> oh great, the smb client in nautilus is broken
<ali1234> smbclient -L -U works fine, nautilus just asks for a password over and over
<diddledan> either "do it like we said, or we'll make you do it like we said"
<shauno> that makes things like AA's response awkward, because it might work today, but we don't know if it'll count as "playing ball" yet
<diddledan> see, it worries me because I obviously need to click the "yes, tell the government I'm a pervert" button
<mibofra_cell> diddledan did you rember my problem with minecraft? It was a problem by mojang auth xD . 1)desabilitated auth control on server 2)after I've recived an mail from mojang that said my account was abilitated to multiplayer game xD
<mibofra_cell> And I was going crazy with java and ufw xD
<diddledan> mibofra_cell, not really, no
<mibofra_cell> Ok so that's the conclusion
<diddledan> shauno probably has a good simile for the way my memory works
<mibofra_cell> *anyway
<shauno> it doesn't.
<diddledan> bingo!
 * Monotoko sighs
<Monotoko> I hate IRC sometimes
<diddledan> Monotoko, sorry
<Monotoko> not you :P
<diddledan> :-p
<ali1234> mibofra_cell: i remember
<ali1234> glad you sorted it
<Monotoko> vital emergency at work... postfix appeared to be bouncing everything, I've barely touched postfix in my life so I couldn't figure out why
<Monotoko> all I got was RTFM
<diddledan> ergh
<ali1234> stack exchange is usually pretty helpful with postfix
<ali1234> not much use in a hurry tho
<diddledan> yeah, sometimes real-time help can be less approachable than the qmail crowd
<Monotoko> IRC is the most use in a hurry if you can get someone to help... I ended up restoring the postfix conf from a backup
<Monotoko> which appeared to fix it
<ali1234> if i had to run postfix servers i would be angry too (angrier)
<diddledan> begs the question what changed
<ali1234> maybe just a restart?
<Monotoko> tried a restart
<Monotoko> and a hard reboot
<Monotoko> (never a good idea on a live server)
<diddledan> ali1234, what do you run mailwise if anything?
<ali1234> diddledan: whatever you get on an ubuntu server
<ali1234> and i just let it get on with it
<diddledan> ali1234, postfix
<ali1234> i don't use it for receiving
<Monotoko> it gets mail, connects to MySQL then forwards it to whichever address is in the mysql table
<diddledan> :-p
<ali1234> only sending out wordpress sign up emails etc
<diddledan> aah
<Monotoko> and suddenly it decided "user not found" for everyone
<ali1234> for real mail, i use gmail
<diddledan> yeah it's pretty fire and forget for that
<ali1234> even so, it's caused me problems
<ali1234> minor ones, which i was eventually able to solve, but problems none the less
<Monotoko> is there any kind of simple interface to postfix, or something smaller which is easier to use?
<diddledan> Monotoko, postfix is about the easiest of the smtpd available afaict
<Monotoko> >.<
<diddledan> sendmail is evil
<diddledan> exim is weird
<diddledan> and qmail is outdated
<diddledan> although I like the architecture of qmail
<Monotoko> I wish that was the worst of it
<Monotoko> this is the SQL query it runs: http://pastebin.com/biNLSAGC
<Monotoko> I looked at that and had to step outside for a smoke
<Monotoko> felt like not returning at that point
<diddledan> erm
<ali1234> i can totally understand the whole NOSQL thing
<diddledan> ...
<ali1234> not that the alternatives are really any better
<diddledan> those where split_str() bits are nuts
<Monotoko> diddledan, I can run a basic SELECT, even throw a few JOIN's in there and some UNION's and I'm generally okay
<Monotoko> but that
<diddledan> I'm betting that sql query takes a long time to run
<Monotoko> that makes me cry
<Monotoko> I haven't really checked how long it takes, postfix runs it
<diddledan> it looks like it's three very similar queries unioned together
<Monotoko> we had a Merlyn in the company before I arrived... he wrote it, quite a fitting name I think
<Monotoko> There used to be three sysadmins apparantly, they quit around the same time and my boss only hired me -.-
<diddledan> ouch
<Monotoko> I'm dealing with Win2k machines, classic ASP, Win2k8 and various Linux boxes with squid and some with whole applications on them
<diddledan> I can trump that. gentoo
<diddledan> :-p
<Monotoko> we have an Arch Linux box!
<Monotoko> :P
<diddledan> hehe
<Monotoko> I was told I'd only be working with Perl and Debian 95% of the time... how much of a lie that was
<diddledan> does classic asp even get any security patch exposure?
<everydaylinuxuse> does anyone ever end up doing the job they were hired to do
<Monotoko> it's running on IIS 5... securitymetrics gave it the highest possible fail it could
<diddledan> yey
<Monotoko> it's running behind a squid box thankfully... but I'm sure any competant user could work their way in
<Monotoko> it's a dead service... still brings in some money, and was the flagship product that started the company in '97
<Monotoko> way past it's prime and not worth upgrading, but my boss wants it left running
#ubuntu-uk 2013-08-15
<MooDoo> morning all
<mibofra_cell>  good morning  MooDoo
<mibofra_cell> :)
<MartijnVdS> morning everyone!
<MooDoo> morning
<popey> Morning
<MartijnVdS> hi
<AlanBell> morning all
<popey> AlanBell: alt-tab in 13.10 is even more broken than i first thought
<popey> if you have multiple workspaces
<popey> alt-tabbing will flip to the last window on another workspace, which it should never do
<mungbean> its not that hard is it?
<mungbean> other DEs have managed for years
<MartijnVdS> but unity is special
<mungbean> "special"
<mungbean> it rides in the special bus
<MartijnVdS> "What does your window taste like today?"
<AlanBell> I don't use multiple workspaces that much now
<AlanBell> since the cube was taken away
<mungbean> cube ftw
<mungbean> i used to play with it as a distraction from work
<MartijnVdS> I prefer the flat layout myself.. I tried the cube.. but it's not for me
<AlanBell> I now have a primary workspace and I occasionally put things on other workspaces to put them out of the way
<mungbean> i try to remember the multiple workspace thing but always get out of the habit after a few days
<mungbean> after needing to copy paste stuff from firefox to terminal
 * TheOpenSourcerer uses multiple workspaces all the time.
<mungbean> suspects TheOpenSourcerer is a fvwm guy
<mungbean> is/was
<MartijnVdS> mungbean: not twm?
<TheOpenSourcerer> Nope - 31.04 on my laptop and 12.04 on my desktop at home.
<mungbean> i used workspaces a lot in solaris openwindows
<TheOpenSourcerer> opps meant 13.04
<TheOpenSourcerer> Motif!
<MartijnVdS> TheOpenSourcerer: Been using your TARDIS again then? ;)
<TheOpenSourcerer> Lovely looking WM
<mungbean> pre motif
<mungbean> olwm
<mungbean> http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/c/cd/Openwindows.jpg
<mungbean> although in my memory it looked better than that
<bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
<TheOpenSourcerer> http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/3/38/Mwm.jpg
<mungbean> ewww
<mungbean> too.....spongey
<diddledan_> o_O
<diddledan_> spongey?
<mungbean> somehow motif felt spongey to me
<mungbean> in the same way that KDE was sharp
<mungbean> and could cut you
<TheOpenSourcerer> Is that pronounced "spunjee" or "spongee"?
<diddledan_> yeah, many cuts I got off KDE
<brobostigon> good morning everyone.
<popey> mungbean: its a bug
<popey> mungbean: so yes, other desktops including unity have "managed" it hjust fine for years, but sometimes there are bugs in the development release. fancy that huh?
<TheOpenSourcerer> Time for a #2. Laterz.
<bigcalm> ...
<mungbean> oh, unity has had weird alt-tab behaviour every time for me
<mungbean> i think its by design
<popey> AlanBell: if you have a moment bug 1212586 could do with confirming
<lubotu3> bug 1212586 in unity (Ubuntu) "alt-tab switches workspaces to focus apps, but shouldn't" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1212586
<MartijnVdS> But if I have one app, with two windows, both on different workspaces.. should alt-tab tab between those
<MartijnVdS> ?
<popey> no
<popey> alt-tab never crosses workspaces
<mungbean> is there one that does?
<mungbean> alt+` ?
<popey> no, alt+` switches windows of an app
<popey> alt+tab switches all windows on the current workspace
<MartijnVdS> But is there a workspace-crossing "alt-tab like" key?
<popey> ctrl+alt+tab switches across workspaces
<popey> so yes, there is one
<bigcalm> Oh, that's handy :)
<JamesTait> Good morning all, happy Lion Day! :-D
<dwatkins> What's the service which caches command names to offer alternatives if you type 'sudo' wrong, for example?
<popey> command-not-found
<dwatkins> cheers popey
<JamesTait> popey, I never knew about ctrl-alt-tab, thank you!
<MartijnVdS> ctrl+alt+` doesn't work though :(
<mungbean> wow, alistair darling could have been the next master in dr who http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/42962000/jpg/_42962555_darling203.jpg
<bigcalm> That's disturbing
<MartijnVdS> mungbean: I thought BBC had a fear of beards, or so I read?
<mungbean> i think the master is to blame for all fear of beards
<DJones> popey: Just tried Alt+tab on 13.10 in vbox I don't see that bug, Following the how to reproduce, I just switch to the browser on workspace 1
<AlanBell> I can't reproduce it popey
<mungbean> !info molly-guard
<lubotu3> molly-guard (source: molly-guard): protects machines from accidental shutdowns/reboots. In component universe, is extra. Version 0.4.5-1 (quantal), package size 11 kB, installed size 84 kB
<DJones> How far along would people say that 13.10 is in usability & not having major breakages, contemplating upgrading my laptop to test in regular use
<diddledan_> DJones, I've been using it at home fine even with mir
<diddledan_> xmir*
<DJones> diddledan_: Is that now installed by default, or is that still to filter through to the default install
<diddledan_> I haven't upgraded this machine because it's my primary work machine and even though I've had good luck so far I'm still not prepared to commit everything to it
<diddledan_> no, xmir is still a ppa I believe
<DJones> Last I'd read about it, it was still install at own risk
<diddledan_> at least I'm getting my xmir from ppa
<DJones> Thought that was the case
<DJones> I may wait until that filters through to default, then do a fresh install
<diddledan_> I just found a cron entry that was set to fire at 34:00 (yes, 34 o'clock)
<brobostigon> lol
<diddledan_> I can only assume it should have been 00:34
<DJones> Did it actually work though?
<diddledan_> nope
<DJones> LOgic prevails then
<JamesTait> DJones, xmir isn't installed by default, but it's in the default repo now.
<JamesTait> DJones, I switched to it on Sunday.  For the most part I haven't been able to tell the difference, but Chromium seems to fairly reliably crash it.
<JamesTait> YMMV.
<AlanBell> JamesTait: are you on a single monitor?
<AlanBell> diddledan_: xmir is now in the repos
<AlanBell> but not enabled by default
<JamesTait> AlanBell, I am.  Well, my laptop display.
<JamesTait> AlanBell, I plugged my TV into my HDMI port the other night and it worked flawlessly for the first time since I've had the laptop - but I'm pretty sure that would have been before I switched to xmir.
<JamesTait> But after switching from the nvidia driver to nouveau.
<AlanBell> yeah, as far as I know multi-monitor on xmir is at a very rudimentary level
<JamesTait> I'll give it a bash tonight.
<diddledan_> the xmir ppa works on my own multimonitor setup
<diddledan_> thanks AlanBell
<AlanBell> works as in displays different stuff on different monitors, or just mirroring?
<diddledan_> different stuff on different monitors
<diddledan_> spanning
<diddledan_> even plays well with synergy
<diddledan_> unless it's dropped into fallback mode and I've not noticed
<diddledan_> I'll double check when I get home if I remember
<NET||abuse> hi folks, i'm streaming two camera from laptops at home with motion, but if i want to get full streaming rather than jpeg stream? What's the next option?
<popey> probably ffmpeg.. Azelphur has done similar
<NET||abuse> hrm..
<NET||abuse> that sounds hard
<NET||abuse> longer term project for now
<NET||abuse> seems motion has a bunch of ffmpeg stuff,, mpeg4 encoding, bitrates, resolutions..
<NET||abuse> so might be possible with the existing program
<MartijnVdS> zoneminder?
 * hamitron would just use what is there if it gets the job done
<NET||abuse> for now it's fine, would just enjoy smoother streamed video
<NET||abuse> my dog plays around with his toys, so it would be cool to be able to capture the occational fun moment in nice quality
<hamitron> just a risk of it becoming one of those things where you say "I will do that sometime", but never around to it
<hamitron> :/
<hamitron> at least that would be the case for me
<hamitron> :D
<DJones> NET||abuse: I used to do the same with Motion to keep an eye on my dog, I thought it'd be quite entertaining, then as time went on, you realise that the dog sleeps all day and only spends about 30 seconds moving the toys around just before I came home to make it look like he'd been playing
<NET||abuse> yeh, can happen to me too, but in this case, i really want to do it. I'll be having a neighbours dog over on occasion who has proven a reliable well behaved visitor so it would be great to offer htis to my neighbour when he is at work also.
<NET||abuse> DJones: those devious animals :)
<NET||abuse> ooh, standup meeting... brb
<MooDoo> AlanBell: I bet there will be pledges for the edge even on the last day when it's still millions off the mark
<NET||abuse> It's a pitty, as I do see the idea of the next evolution of convergence devices like the edge
<NET||abuse> I think there's something to be said for that kind of all in one, but at the same time. I love my laptop :)
<MooDoo> it would of suceeded if the amount was a lot lower, I suspect realistically it was set that high as they knew it would fail.
<NET||abuse> I imagine the cost to get anything off the ground might be just htat high with the manufacturers regardless. so they had no choive
<NET||abuse> choice
<NET||abuse> maybe Mark will just swoop in and swallow the difference at the end :)
<MooDoo> NET||abuse: oh so naive [and if it does i'll apologies then and buy you a beer] ;)
<mungbean> that would be silly
<MooDoo> s/it/he
<NET||abuse> hehe :)
<NET||abuse> I eagerly await that beer
<MooDoo> lol
<AlanBell> NET||abuse: no, he won't though indiegogo, far far too expensive to do that
<SuperMatt> wheeee, getting a class two cert for supermatt.net :D
<AlanBell> 4% to indiegogo, 4% to paypal, 20% VAT
<mungbean> you can still change the target with indiegogo , vbut wahts the point
<AlanBell> don't think you can
<MooDoo> SuperMatt: is that a good thing?
<SuperMatt> MooDoo: yup, because it means I have have a wildcard cert, and browsers trust it more
<SuperMatt> less warnings = good
<MooDoo> SuperMatt: SSL?
<SuperMatt> yup
<MooDoo> what's the point if you're not selling stuff?
<MooDoo> just trust?
<SuperMatt> trust
<MooDoo> expensive way of doing it :D
<SuperMatt> plus, I've started hosting my own stuff, like tt-rss and owncloud, which I'm also sharing with my friends, so I want a proper cert for them to use
 * hamitron trusts nobody
<SuperMatt> something which they can trust
<hamitron> and I don't mean the user nobody
<hamitron> ;/
<MooDoo> ah that makes sense
<popey> AlanBell: i think it's oversimplistic to think mark will pull out a platinum credit card and punch it into indiegogo
<mungbean> your owncloud is on public internet?
<popey> we talk to indiegogo daily
<SuperMatt> it's on my vps
<mungbean> i can acess it?
<mungbean> i am scared of securty issues with owncloud
<SuperMatt> you can't sign up, if that's what you mean ;)
<mungbean> i'm scared of security vulnerabilities that would allow an attacker to get my precious
<popey> yeah, ditto
<SuperMatt> I don't put anything precious there ;)
<mungbean> there are regular security issues with it
<SuperMatt> and if I do, it's locked up in a truecrypt container
<mungbean> i have a server that is firewalled, but ideally vpned
<SuperMatt> thing is, I use my owncloud to access from work, home, my parents place, etc, so I don't always have the same IP, and I don't wanna tweak the filewall all the time.
<mungbean> vpn then
<SuperMatt> it's just there for saving stuff that I might wanna get at from a different local later
<mungbean> its more useful than that tho
<SuperMatt> vpn is a bit overkill, especially as I use own cloud on my phone, tablet, laptop, work pc, etc
<SuperMatt> If there's something *really* precious I don't want anyone to have, it really won't be on my owncloud, at least not without being in a truecrypt container
<mungbean> truecryp container on your pc , then sync it?
<mungbean> my keyboard is missing letters today
<SuperMatt> mungbean: yup
<SuperMatt> just a small one, to contain various things I need to keep safe
<bigcalm> TE UIC RWN  JUED VER TE LAY DG
 * bigcalm giggles to himself
<MartijnVdS> bigcalm: U WOT M8?
<bigcalm> MartijnVdS: hold down both shift keys and then type: the quick brown fox jumped over the lazy dog
<MartijnVdS> bigcalm: it looks vaguely Irish
<bigcalm> I'm sure my keyboard would fair better if I didn't have to convert PS/2 to USB
<shauno> odd.  does the same on a usb keyboard here, but on neither laptop keyboards
<bigcalm> This is via a Alienware USB keyboard: HE QUIK BRON FO JUPED OER HE LA DOG
<davmor2> THE QUICK BROWN FO JUMPS OVER THE LAZY DOGS
<AlanBell> popey: indeed, if indiegogo will accept a different bulk pledge amount without going through the process then maybe it could work
<davmor2> meh so it looks like microsoft hardware really does rock
<shauno> not sure I get what's going on
<AlanBell> where the money doesn't actually change hands, but it brings the total up to meet the target
<bigcalm> It's a test of multiple key press processing. Something directhex was interested in for gaming, I think
<AlanBell> and it doesn't qualify as a sale, or an investment
<shauno> curious why it has no issues on either laptop keyboards here
<popey> mac?
<shauno> one mac, one HP
<MartijnVdS> My Logitech keyboard gets the TE UIC RWN  JUED VER TE LAY DG one
<shauno> my dell keyboard does the same too
<bigcalm> Just tried to move my glasses and poked myself in the eye because I'm not actually wearing them
<MartijnVdS> bigcalm: http://imgur.com/a4CVG ?
<popey> i punched myself in the face doing up shoelaces the other day
<davmor2> popey: hahahahahahahahahaha
<MartijnVdS> popey: https://www.gov.uk/report-domestic-abuse
<davmor2> popey: Thanks that's made my day :)
<MartijnVdS> popey: also.. HOW?!
<popey> looking down, pulling laces up tight, laces slip out of hand, hand carries on going upwards to face
<popey> HELLO FACE
<NET||abuse> hmm, can't switch motion over to not just do jpg saving.
<NET||abuse> right, ffmpeg server approach later
<NET||abuse> need to work.
 * czajkowski pokes davmor2 and goes back to work 
 * davmor2 prods czajkowski and opens a terminal, the prods czajkowski and does some work
<bigcalm> Terminal prodding
<diddledan_> I like fingering random people in the terminal
<diddledan_> I find it invariably says they're unknown tho
<diddledan_> $ finger bigcalm
<diddledan_> finger: bigcalm: no such user. <-- see?
<bigcalm> o.O
 * DJones remembers early programming days and having to poke memory addresses
<diddledan_> that the beeb or the sinclair?
<diddledan_> or both?
<DJones> Neither, Vic 20
<DJones> And later Commodore 64
<DJones> Still don't think I ever filled the 3.5K ram on the Vic 20 with anything I ever did
<shauno> only thing I remember actually having to poke, was to read the weird buttons on the atari 600
<DJones> Probably also on whatever the Apple ][ basic language version was before using Cobol
<DJones> I liked the Atari's, the cartridge slot hidden under the flap right on top of the case always seemed a cool idea
<DJones> Remembering those machines certainly shows my age
<davmor2> bigcalm: wifey surprise present arrived yesterday http://shop.constantin-weisz.com/de/Herrenuhren/Herren-Automatik/Constantin-Weisz-Herrenuhr-Automatik115.html  I recommend opening it in chrome/chromium for the page translation if you want to know details :)
<Monotoko> whoever decided to put MySQL and Postfix together is an evil, twisted human
<davmor2> DJones: you know you are old when you say when I were lad I remember changing valves on colossus
<DJones> davmor2: Nah, when I were a lad, the colossus hadn't been built yet :)
<diddledan_> Monotoko, fighting email again?
<davmor2> DJones: when my wife looked after old people, there was one lady who would chat about how hard the rationing was and gas street lighting and then that new fangled electric came along and then blow me wasn't there a second world war :D that is old
<mungbean> i think my wifes gt grandfather was a street lamp lighter
<Monotoko> diddledan_, indeed... I need to get all-(post)@(club).(district).org to go to all the posts in that club in that district
<diddledan_> ergh
<Monotoko> the previous sysadmin said it'd take him 2 hours before he left... I don't believe him
<mungbean> history | less
<shauno> it's a bit odd to think there's people who lives through two world wars, the advent of flight, the space age, etc etc.  I already feel old, and all I've got is "I went to school.  and then I got the internet."
<mungbean> falklands war, iraq war, afgan war,..
<Monotoko> 9/11
<diddledan_> shauno, you went to school?!
<diddledan_> 11/9
<DJones> mungbean: Falkands wasn't a war, you can't count that one
<diddledan_> I hate that the americans have twisted the date for 7/7 so now we have to call it 7/7 instead because they coined it first!
<DJones> Although the people who dies/got injured in it would dispute that
<Monotoko> :P
<diddledan_> mm, lunch
<diddledan_> that's a good idea
<Monotoko> hmm, any idea how I'd do the all- thing diddledan_ ?
<diddledan_> none whatsoever! :-p
<diddledan_> I suck!
<DJones> Hmmh, lunch... Thats going to be wierd, getting a lunch break
<davmor2> mungbean: that'll be cold war, falklands, kuwait/iraq, afgan, iraq again, iran (that we weren't in honest gov'nor ;) )
<diddledan_> DJones, who said anything about a break?!
<shauno> none of those really affected me though, which I think is what makes the world wars really stand out
<diddledan_> iraq first time is as far back as I go
<diddledan_> in terms of memory
<DJones> diddledan_: Thats true, although working as a contractor, I don't get lunch, changing to employed means I will
<diddledan_> aah
<Monotoko> being employed means you officially get a lunch
<Monotoko> but in reality
<Monotoko> you don;t
<DJones> I've always eaten at my desk, although I will need to do a lot of office cleaning once I take over & move into the office first, I'm working on it'll be a "one skip" tidy
<christel> EAT THE DESK
<MartijnVdS> lots of fibre!
<AlanBell> christel \o/
<christel> hello AlanBell \o/
<brobostigon> hello christel
<christel> hellloooo :D
<brobostigon> :)
<DJones> christel: Looking at the dodgy looking cafe over the road from here, I suspect eating the desk would be the healthy option
<christel> haha
<davmor2> christel:  you desprogged congrats
<christel> danke schoen :)
<bigcalm> davmor2: cool watch
<davmor2> bigcalm: ta :) I love it, like you with your pens :)
<bigcalm> :)
<bigcalm> davmor2: did you see the one Hayley gave me for my birthday?
 * Monotoko cries
<Monotoko> I'm going to throw our email server outta the bloody window in a moment
<MartijnVdS> Monotoko: that bad?
<bigcalm> Really good review of my birthday present: http://www.fountainpennetwork.com/forum/index.php/topic/232695-sailor-hakone-yosegi-zaiku/
<Monotoko> MartijnVdS, I'm having one of those days, and Postfix just doesn't help that at all
<mungbean> what's the milestone? 10.2m?
<AlanBell> bit more than that
<mungbean> well 32m but what's the other milestone?
<mungbean> 10.2m exactly?
<AlanBell> $10,266,845
<mungbean> cheers
<mungbean> pebble lol
<mungbean> they are lame
<bigcalm> :|
<mungbean> i know somebody with one and they are v gimicky IMO
<bigcalm> One what?
<popey> Pebble watch
<bigcalm> Oh
<bigcalm> Wondering what Samsung will come out with
<mungbean> so a few months on, what's the opnion of the ouya?
<davmor2> bigcalm: wow to be fair that is impressive :)
<bigcalm> davmor2: It's very much my every day pen now. I'd take it with me if I didn't value it so much
<mungbean> pen? for writing..?
<mungbean> love letters?
<davmor2> bigcalm: iirc there is a mother in pearl, black onyx checkerboard pen I've seen somewhere that reminds me of that,  I bet that is expensive though ;)
<bigcalm> There are 5 fountain pens on my desk. I really need to stop
<bigcalm> Oops, just found 2 more
<mungbean> i have disdain for such things as i am a left hander
<bigcalm> A pen is not hand centric
<Monotoko> I never have a pen on my desk...
<MartijnVdS> bigcalm: they are though.. pens with flowing ink = coloured hand
<MartijnVdS> bigcalm: for me, anyway
<bigcalm> :D
<MartijnVdS> bigcalm: (fast-flowing ink)
<davmor2> bigcalm: yes they are, lefthanded nibs are more expensive and less common
<bigcalm> davmor2: that's only if they are cut at a slant. All of my pens can be used by either hand
<davmor2> bigcalm: no you can get lefthanded no slanting nibs, iirc it's to do with the thickness of leading vs trailing nib tips.  The only exception as far as I am aware are the really strong metal nibs like titanium etc.  but softer metals like 22crt gold for example has different nib tip weights
 * bigcalm shrugs :)
<davmor2> bigcalm: see you didn't know there was that much to nib technology did you ;)
<bigcalm> davmor2: not something I pay much attention to. I like driving cars, but I don't know how to build one ;)
<davmor2> bigcalm: yeah you do, one lego brick at a time following the instruction in the book :D
<bigcalm> Mmmm, lego
<MartijnVdS> hmmm.. lego
<davmor2> bigcalm: we were planning a trip to legoland windsor for my birthday but with the mil being so poorly we couldn't get away hence the surprise watch pressie instead
<bigcalm> Badminton tonight, I wonder if we'll end up in that crazy Thai restaurant again in Compton
<bigcalm> davmor2: I can imagine you tearing up the road in their lego cars
<mungbean> even biros are a problem for left handers
<mungbean> unless you live in arabic RTL countries
<MartijnVdS> even pencils can be
<Seeker`> erm
<Seeker`> biros and pencils aren't a problem :P
<mungbean> no, i type instead.
<Seeker`> fountain pens aren't even too bad really
<MartijnVdS> Seeker`: pencils = grey side of hand
<MartijnVdS> Seeker`: biros are fine, but bad ones can rip up paper
<mungbean> or contortion
<Seeker`> MartijnVdS: is your hand made of rubber? :P
<MartijnVdS> Seeker`: fountain pens = blue side of hand
<mungbean> biro ink = smudge too
<MartijnVdS> mungbean: for those "gel" pens maybe
<Seeker`> I use a biro a lot and don't smudge it.
<mungbean> you are a leftie?
<MartijnVdS> mungbean: I am
<Seeker`> I don't think I recall getting grey hands from HB pencils either
<Seeker`> I am
<mungbean> i can take notes but not fill a page of text
<brobostigon> worst, try using a fountain pen as a left hander,
<mungbean> its grim and also scratches weirdly
<MartijnVdS> wait.. #ubuntu-lefthanded?
<mungbean> INTJ and lefthandies ftw
<brobostigon> #fountain-pen-blue-hands
<brobostigon> more like.
<mungbean> writing is overrated
<Seeker`> I think aobut 10% of people are left handed
<mungbean> 15-19%
<Seeker`> so you'd expect 12 people or so in this channel to be left handed
<MartijnVdS> "Globally, roughly 12% of men and 10% of women are left-handed."
<MartijnVdS> Seeker`: but not everyone on the channel is active
<mungbean> only around 15% of the chan are active
<MartijnVdS> and they're ALL left-handers ;)
<Seeker`> maybe it is because the wrong-handed people are scared of us?
<mungbean> its genetic
<MartijnVdS> the fear?
<mungbean> without the RH gene, then its 50/50
<bigcalm> Hehe
<mungbean> thats what i heard and chose to believe without checking anyway
<nihad> hello
<bigcalm> Hi
<Seeker`> my parents are both right handed, me and my brother are left handed
<mungbean> me too
<mungbean> i am 1/5
<mungbean> 2/5 are lefties
<Seeker`> although I play the guitar right-handed, and can use a mouse with either hand etc.
<davmor2> Seeker`: that doesn't mean that both of them aren't actually lefthanders that were forced to use their right hands
<MartijnVdS> Yeah, the mouse is a special case for me too.. but that's just because of how it was always set up
<mungbean> i do nearly everything right handed except writing, scissors, fine painting
<Seeker`> scissors I can do with either hand
<Seeker`> I'm equally bad at snooker with either hand
<MartijnVdS> scissors I'm bad with
<davmor2> I can't cut straight if my depended on it
<Seeker`> takes me slightly longer to cut stuff in my right hand, but its not too bad
<davmor2> stanley knife and a cutting board and I get a better result than I do with a pair of scissors
<mungbean> i tried cutting our blinds because i got impatient hile wifey was out
<mungbean> fail
<mungbean> although i cut my sons hair and did great
<MartijnVdS> "almost no blood!"
<Seeker`> your blinds...grow?
<popey> 1984 Nobody died
<popey> 1985 Nobody died
<popey> etc
<popey> (c) Steve Coogan
<mungbean> ?
<popey> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ob1rYlCpOnM
<Seeker`> brass eye?
<mungbean> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Oldelpaso/No-one_died
<popey> Day Today
<Seeker`> close enough :P
<mungbean> whats is this referring to popey ?
<dwatkins> is there a good book on sysctl variables? I'm trying to find out the implications of setting kernel.shmmax but I can only find stuff about it being set too high to be sensible
<dwatkins> http://www.puschitz.com/TuningLinuxForOracle.shtml#SettingSharedMemory explains some but not all of the implications of changing this, for example
<popey> it was just me picking up on "almost no blood"
<mungbean> ah lol
<mungbean> i did make a little mistake and he has a v short bit at the back but if you ruffle his hair it doesn't show
<MartijnVdS> dwatkins: http://www.postgresql.org/docs/9.0/static/kernel-resources.html explains a little
<dwatkins> thanks MartijnVdS :)
<MartijnVdS> dwatkins: and I think there's extensive documentation in the kernel source tree (Documentation/ dir)
<mungbean> http://torrentfreak.com/down-torrent-pirates-130813/
<mungbean> EBook Sellers Strike Deal To Share Customer Details With Anti-Piracy Outfit
 * Seeker` needs to re-watch brass eye at some point
<dwatkins> aha, I'd best get me some sauce installed, thanks again MartijnVdS
<mungbean> or they could spend their energy making it cheap and easy to buy portable ebooks
<davmor2> mungbean: netbooks monthly fee like netflix but you get to loan books
<mungbean> have you seen what they offer in libraries in terms of ebooks? mostly smutty mills and boon type stuff
<shauno> same as netflix here (.ie), it's all bollywood and chinese.  folks that'll licence worldwide without a fight, instead of fighting per-region like the big names
<dwatkins> The office has run out of milk #BritishProblems
<bigcalm> dwatkins: have you no backup boxes of UHT?
<dwatkins> bigcalm: I don't care, I have my own milk ;) (LactoFree)
<bigcalm> Ah
<dwatkins> It's only a problem when people start stealing mine.
<bigcalm> That's very intolerant of you
<mungbean> i think i'm banned from posting on britishproblems
<dwatkins> mungbean: what did you do?
<shauno> rate-limited ;)
<mungbean> i submitted a post and then realised i made a mistake in teh title
<mungbean> so i deleted it
<mungbean> then resbmitted
<dwatkins> shicking behaviour
<dwatkins> *ahem* shocking, I mean
<mungbean> now any stories i submit since then never appear
<mungbean> even though previously i submitted stuff with 500 upvotes
<mungbean> i don't care really , i can change username
<mungbean> /r/britishproblems has turned to crap anyway
<mungbean> daily mail, tea, more fake daily mail outrage
<mungbean> who upvotes the 10 stories about daily mail and kevin bacon?
<shauno> DM really should be banned from the internet.  I keep running into people who think it's a real newspaper, which just makes me sadface
<dwatkins> I don't even know if I'm subscribed to it any more.
<dwatkins> shauno: do they work for the Daily Mail?
<mungbean> DM outrgage is dispropritionate to other newspapers
<mungbean> check this
<mungbean> http://www.pressgazette.co.uk/content/goundhog-day-why-daily-express-front-pages-may-leave-readers-sense-deja-vu
<shauno> most the newspapers in the UK are pretty disappointing, to be honest.  DM irk me in particular because they seem to crop up everywhere, constantly
<mungbean> mainly because of the mock outrage and then people post the link
<mungbean> also, when a jounralist dies in a war zone the media go crazy
<mungbean> top story on every TV and paper
<mungbean> completely insular, you'd think only media and politics are important in this world
<mungbean> just remembered i brought a massive hunk of watermelon to work :D
<popey> bro, you like cantalope?
<popey> i need to do 8000 more steps today
<popey> well, 7000
<mungbean> is that a quote?
<popey> no, just somehting silly i saw on imgur today
<popey> http://imgur.com/gallery/bl3NCr4
<popey> roughly
<mungbean> lol
<mungbean> my wife visited me at work yesterday
<mungbean> i met her at bethnal grn
<mungbean> in the distance i saw her coming , and a mad person had accosted her
<mungbean> i keep telling her about mad people here, and with in 5 mins of arriving she's been madded
<popey> also, i want to do this http://imgur.com/gallery/YaCLH
<popey> although i have none of the ingredients or equipment to do it
<mungbean> if only there was a website to show me the best bits of imgur
<mungbean> mmm molasses
<mungbean> lol @ dogs
<mungbean> my brother hated on melon his whole life, then one day said have you tired this cantaloupe, you gotta try it , its lovely. i said i thought you hated melon and said it was like cucumber? nah i never said that
<SuperMatt> man, I can't decide whether to install saucy for apache2.4, or compile it from source
<mungbean> never compile
<mungbean> nevr trust someone who uses a fake name. Dave lee travis
<Monotoko> ... I need to pay my AWS bill
<Monotoko> before my server's shut down >.>
<mungbean> http://www.networkworld.com/news/2013/081413-vmware-ceo-openstack-is-not-272867.html?hpg1=bn
<DJones> gnuweb: foureight84 /lastlog dog
<mungbean> password?
<DJones> mungbean: What was the dog reference?
<DJones> Just wondered if it was anything to do with this http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-china-23714896
<mungbean> it was the link popey posted about rum
<DJones> Ah
<mungbean> and a pic of dogs waiting
<DJones> Ah
<DJones> I was trying to decide if the Whythe rum is not gone picture was a port-a-potty
<neuro> doo de doo
<neuro> anyone know anyone around oxfordish way looking for php dev work?
<neuro> $work is hiring, you see
<shauno> man, kvm without ipv4 is a bit of a trial
<Monotoko> neuro, freelance or employment?
<neuro> latter
<neuro> fulltime
<neuro> perm
<Monotoko> :( I've just settled in Exeter
<Monotoko> with a full time job
<Monotoko> what's the salary like?
<neuro> so why are you wasting my time? :)))
<neuro> i don't know yet, will find out tomorrow
<Monotoko> well, it could have been freelance - in which case I could do with more freelance work :P
<neuro> :)
<neuro> yeah, it's not, soz
<daftykins> GTA V Online trailer video \o/
<neuro> i see the telegraph has decided to wow their readers with unsolicited teenage bare midriffs: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/educationpicturegalleries/10244946/baremidriffs.html
<neuro> (it's pics of a-level result-receiving jumpy people)
<daftykins> ...right.
<neuro> i was never that excited about exam results
<daftykins> i never cared for exams
<neuro> me either, hated em
<daftykins> but then i also believe revision is cheating :)
<neuro> was glad to see the back of school, college and uni
<neuro> (yep, i did the trifecta)
<neuro> well, did as in i went ... i dropped out of uni :)
<daftykins> it can be a pretty challenging time to pay for the priviledge of having someone tell you to go off and learn x
<neuro> pay? :)
<neuro> all i paid for was my travel, food and books
<daftykins> one of the world's rather sick jokes is that us Channel Islanders have to pay the tuition fees of foreign students
<neuro> and beer, lots of beer
<daftykins> often get housed in the same blocks as people from the other side of world too
<neuro> all i got out of uni was beer, laid and unix
<shauno> seems like a straight-forward side effect of being a tax haven?
<daftykins> how would you say the two have any relation?
<shauno> well that's what pays for everyone else's "free".  you pay less, it buys you less
<daftykins> well, tax does go to our government instead
<daftykins> but you'd have thought there'd be a tiny bit of cooperation seeing as our passports say 'British' Â¬_Â¬
<daftykins> but ah well
<neuro> cooperation about what?
<daftykins> http://i.imgur.com/he17wYl.jpg
<neuro> channel isles are crown dependencies
<daftykins> couple of cruise ships are in today
<neuro> not actually part of the UK
<daftykins> you just look that up? :)
<neuro> nope
<neuro> I Know Things
<daftykins> lies
<neuro> sure, whatever
<daftykins> can always tell cruise ship days, you can never get along the high street Â¬_Â¬
<neuro> is there a particular reason you don't like me, or are you just always like this?
<daftykins> eh, that's just messing and you're not used to me i guess
<neuro> well it's one thing to fanny about, but it's another thing to accuse someone of lying
<daftykins> are you serious?
<neuro> i couldn't tell if you weren't
<daftykins> i think you need to calm down a bit
<neuro> i'm perfectly calm
<neuro> i'd be using caps and stuff if i was kicking off
<neuro> and you know what i'm like with caps
<daftykins> i've forgotten already thankfully
<neuro> i could remind you if you like :)
<neuro> caps are awesome
<neuro> although one thing that winds me up is people who Capitalise Every Word In A Sentence For Some Odd Reason
<daftykins> also yeah, i make no secret that i'm not too fond of you
<neuro> and i've politely asked why
<daftykins> you're not very pleasant to converse with because you're highly opinionated and don't seem to be capable of opening your mind to alternative points of view
<neuro> which is your opinion, of course, and you're entitled to it
<neuro> thanks for answering honestly
<neuro> i do actually appreciate it
<neuro> anyway, in other news
<neuro> https://stripe.com/blog/introducing-stripe-uk
<awww> hey , i have some ubuntu 12.10 problems
<awww> can anyone please please help me
<neuro> !ask
<lubotu3> Please don't ask to ask a question, simply ask the question (all on ONE line and in the channel, so that others can read and follow it easily). If anyone knows the answer they will most likely reply. :-) See also !patience
<awww> k , i have dual OS , one is winodos 7 and one is ubuntu 12.10 , I think it is nvidea graphic card driver problem , I try to boot in nomodeset mode , but also i am getting a black screen , anyone kbows
<daftykins> adding nomodeset should've worked
<daftykins> (for a single boot)
<awww> @dafty , i replaced the quiet splash by nomodeset , yet getting the same black screen
<daftykins> how odd, this is in the installed version? did the livecd work?
<neuro> alan_g|EOD: bomb squad? :)
<neuro> #ubuntu-in must be really dead for indian folk to keep coming into -uk
<daftykins> pretty much all of the localised channels beyond this and main are dead
<neuro> shame :(
<Seeker`> I thought -de had quite a big community?
<neuro> have you seen the amount of US channels?
<neuro> they've set one up for each state
<daftykins> at least that's the opinion i get from the fact that in #ubuntu everyone tends to send the foreign support seekers to their respective channels, then they come back saying nobody's talking in there
<neuro> i guess that's both upside and downside of geeks usually having at least a basic grasp of english
<Seeker`> neuro: that might be because of the size of the states
<neuro> oh sure, some of them :)
<neuro> ca, tx, ny, etc i can understand
<neuro> but i wonder how many alaskan ubuntu users there are :)
<awww> @datty , has anyone answered my question , my net got disconnected
<awww> please cpy and paste whoeva has answered it
<shauno> I know a couple.  and AK seems an obvious choice for a colo, given that they can't just pop next door
<shauno> er, loco
<Seeker`> There are 11 states bigger than the UK
<Seeker`> apparently
<neuro> heh i was wondering about 'colo' :)
<neuro> yup
<neuro> tis a big country
<neuro> california will be at the top of the list, i guess
<awww> can you check my problem
<daftykins> awww: i asked if it wasn't working with nomodeset on an installed copy, but worked with the liveCD?
<Seeker`> alaska, texas, california
<neuro> alaska???
<shauno> alaska's freaking huge.  it just doesn't look like it in most map projections
<neuro> where are you getting these numbers? just checked wikipedia ... uk pop in 2011 was 63.182m
<neuro> ca pop in 2012 was 38.041m
<Seeker`> neuro: I was talking interms of area
<awww> yea , it dint work on the installed one  , i tried with livecd and when i give run with usb , i get a terminal with " ubuntu@ubuntu " Idk what to do next
<neuro> ak pop was 731K
<neuro> oh *area*
<neuro> awww: what nvidia card do you have?
<shauno> area-wise, this is what it never gets credit for; http://www.wtv-zone.com/kingdon/Photos-1/alaska.jpg
<neuro> good grief
<Seeker`> the original idea for locos was mainly ubuntu advocacy in 'local' areas
<Seeker`> afaik
<awww> nvdiia Geforce Gt 525M
<awww> @datty , replied back
<neuro> ah 525Ms don't work with stock ubuntu apparently
<neuro> awww: read this: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=2075423&p=12315916#post12315916
<daftykins> hehe you really don't want to be telling people to install bumblebee that can't even boot :)
<neuro> that should solve your problem (I think!)
<neuro> daftykins: they said they got to a prompt
<diddledan_> shauno, that link no load
<daftykins> livecd only
<Seeker`> "Ever since the birth of computers, enthusiasts and fans around the world have collected together in garages, universities and pubs to talk about their interest, learn from each other and help promote their interest. Combine this with the huge popularity of Ubuntu, and you have the Ubuntu LoCo project."
<neuro> ah doh
<shauno> diddledan_: works on my pithy 3g connection :/
<daftykins> awww: if you installed ubuntu with an internet connection, it may've installed updates at the same time. you could reinstall with updates disabled / the internet connection disconnected
<neuro> awww: sorry - if you boot into your installed Ubuntu OS, get the black screen, try pressing CTRL+ALT+F1 and that should get you to a login prompt.  You should be able to log in with the user you created when you installed, and from there you can follow the instructions in that forum post
<daftykins> most people that install bumblebee on optimus setups before anything much else is working end up with bricked installs
<daftykins> but ah well, maybe he'll be lucky
<neuro> sounds somewhat bricked to me already :)
<awww> @neuro dude , i Have some problems in that terminal 1 ctrl alt f1 , the thing is I give right username and password , it doesnt allow , even that bug exist
<neuro> awww: use my instructions at your own risk then, sounds like it may not be 100% fix
<neuro> awww: i'm not sure, then
<neuro> is there a reason why you're using 12.10 and not 13.04?
<awww> there's no reason , just havent updated , was happy until it stopped workin
<daftykins> ^ i nearly asked that. it should either be 13.04 or 12.04.2 LTS really
<awww> dont want any nvidea thing o somethin , just want ubuntu to work
<awww> @dafty , dude do you have a solution
<daftykins> awww: yeah do you see above @ 16:03 when i replied?
<daftykins> i said reinstall with updates turned off
<neuro> if you don't want nvidia, sounds like you'll need a different computer :)
<daftykins> nah it sounds like an optimus setup, neuro
<neuro> i know
<neuro> wait, it was working already?
<awww> no no
<awww> @dafty
<daftykins> awww: download one of the other versions, bear in mind 13.04 is dead come January though
<daftykins> ebay user agreement update 0o
<neuro> "give us your first born"?
<awww> ok , after i boot from livecd i get ubuntu@ubuntu in the terminal
<awww> what next ?
<daftykins> are you connected to the internet with it?
<daftykins> cat /var/log/Xorg.0.log | pastebinit
<awww> no , how do i ? i only get a black terminal @dafty
<awww> no gui @dafty
<daftykins> is it a laptop you have to use wirelessly or something?
<daftykins> if you were connected with a cable it'd be able to be online
 * neuro sits down and sings a song about Ethernet cables
<awww> ok , if i have a dongle then ?
<daftykins> yeah that's not going to be easy
<daftykins> i think you should download a different version to try
<neuro> the bit that i'm interested in is that it was working previously
<neuro> awww: did you mean that 12.10 was working for you fine until something changed and it stopped working?
<awww> yes ! all of a sudden this happened ,
<awww> http://askubuntu.com/questions/330835/no-native-mode-forcing-panel-scaling
<awww> i posted this on forum
<daftykins> oh so you have an existing install that broke?
<daftykins> i'd hold shift on startup and pick an older kernel to try booting with
<awww> after that , some day i tried with changing the brightness in windows and restarted , it worked fine until today
<awww> i have the advanced options with recovery mode
<awww> but i dont know what to do to get my org back
<daftykins> no just pick a different kernel version if there is more than one listed
<awww_> my net got disc
<awww_> sorry
<awww_> !
<awww_> can someone please post
<awww_> windows sucks
<daftykins> post what?
<awww_> the solutions if u have posted
<daftykins> awww_: hopefully more than one kernel version is listed on the holding-shift down GRUB menu, pick an older version to try
<awww_> that wont take me to some terminal or any weird thing right ?
<awww_> ?
<daftykins> well, depends if it works or not
<daftykins> you don't want the 'recovery' ones though, just an older version
<daftykins> support over disconnections, funsies? no sir...
<daftykins> nor the seeming language barrier
<neuro> never fun
<popey> india
<neuro> yup, mumbai
<popey> why do we get so many non-uk people here?
<neuro> see conversation above :)
<aww_> @dafty if ur there , tried all kernels not workig
<daftykins> ok, i'm out of ideas then
<Guest51651> open source ! help please :P
<Guest51651> my nick is aww itself
<Guest51651> @dafty , is my laptop optimus
<Guest51651> ?
<davmor2> popey: cuz wez rockin outda house
<daftykins> if it's got mixed intel on-die and nvidia yeah, it's likely
<Guest51651> k k , dafty provide me a solution dude
<Guest51651> ur the only hope
<neuro> obi daft kenobi
<neuro> davmor2: woop woop hands in the air! :)
<davmor2> Guest51651: what's the problem?
<popey> haha BPI guy on the news talking up vinyl
<daftykins> Guest51651: i'm out of ideas. i'd reinstall with a different version
<neuro> davmor2: black screen on GT525M optimus on 12.10
<neuro> popey: yeah there was a beeb news article today about selfmade vinyl
<neuro> haven't read it, just saw the headline
<neuro> good to see they're keeping up with the times though :)
<Guest51651> @davmor2 , I have dual OS , one is win 7 and is ubuntu 12.10 , the ubuntu doesnt boot coz of nvidea graphic card problem
<neuro> they probably think vinyl is the ultimate anti-piracy format
<popey> inded
<popey> and they make money from it
<popey> Guest51651: have you tried in #ubuntu ?
<neuro> "rip *this*, you rebel scum!"
<davmor2> Guest51651: turn the brightness up.  there is a bug in pre nvidia 319 version that means the brightness is set to 0 because the nvidia bit doesn't work
<neuro> ooh, he did say he'd fiddled with the brightness
<Guest51651> yea i did
<Guest51651> where do i  inc my brightness  , is it in windows 7 ?
<Guest51651> @davmor2
<davmor2> Guest51651: there should be a button combo to do it
<Guest51651> yea yea , do i have to do in winows 7 ? or ubuntu ?
<davmor2> Guest51651: in ubuntu  wait till you hear the drums then turn the brightness up, if you don't hear the drums give it 30+ seconds and then do it
<Guest51651> i dont run ununtu on virual box or some software liek that
<neuro> awww: have you tried going into your laptop bios settings to disable the discrete (nvidia) gpu?
<neuro> not sure if you can do that on an optimus setup
<Guest51651> nopes , but then i want nvidea for win7 man
<neuro> i mean temporarily
<davmor2> neuro: you can't it is run intel first or just run nvidia I think but forcing nvidia is kinda sucky under linux
<neuro> :(
<neuro> ooh, new email ... "Dear William, You haven't told us yet that you want to keep playing Lotto by Direct Debit."  Damn skippy, I haven't.
<diddledan> I've never had any luck with my nvidia optimus setup
<neuro> ~ Â£36 a month? forget it
<diddledan> neuro, it's only 36Â£ if you play every draw
<davmor2> Guest51651: you're life gets a lot easier in 13.10 with nvidia-319 and nvidia-prime just need the nvidia-persistence to land and it's complete
<Guest51651> @didledan , did u eve solve it
<neuro> diddledan: na, i put two lines on, so i'm ~ Â£18/mo currently
<Guest51651> i have nvidia geforce gt 525 m btw  @davmor2
<diddledan> neuro, aah, ditto.. I didn't look to see how much that would cost me
<daftykins> neuro: nope not possible, there are no controls over the GPUs in optimus systems BIOSs (i'm typing from one now)
<neuro> whatever it's costing you now, double it
<neuro> Â£2 a line per draw now
<neuro> well, not now
<neuro> from 5th oct
<diddledan> yeah
<diddledan> sucky
<neuro> daftykins: ah :(
<neuro> the only dual GPU systems i've used have been macbook pros, and they Just Work :(
<Guest51651> @davmo2 if that doesnt help , then ?
<diddledan> lol
<diddledan> my mbp only has intel :-(
<daftykins> neuro: 'cept when the people install ubuntu on them, as well ;)
<neuro> which i don't ;)
<daftykins> funny, that
<neuro> yup!
<neuro> i mean i *do*, just as a parallels vm
<neuro> and i binned it a while back
<neuro> upgraded it to 12.10 and it went haywire
<Guest51651> @neuro , ubuntu sucks man ! and now that it is unity
<neuro> awww: you're in the wrong place to say "ubuntu sucks", dude
<diddledan> if you think ubuntu sucks now, just wait, Microsoft are sure to ruin the next version for sure
<davmor2> neuro: 12.10 sucked donkeys, 13.04 was way more stable than 12.10
<neuro> i'm looking forward to the end of the month actually ... simcity finally landing on OS X. I get the chance to kick the crap out of my 650M :)
<neuro> davmor2: don't think i've tried 13.04 on parallels yet
<neuro> the whole unity thing has put me right off to be honest
<davmor2> diddledan: you mean they didn't already with windows 8
<daftykins> glxgears could do that to a mobile chip XD
<diddledan> davmor2, hmm, morerer
<neuro> good word usage there :)
<diddledan> :-D
<neuro> just as well you didn't say "moreish", i'd have been forced to hunt you down, liam neeson style
<davmor2> Guest51651: can you get into repair mode?
<daftykins> what if he said 'these distros are moreish' ?
<awww> @neuro , what do you do ?
<neuro> i'm a sysadmin, why?
<diddledan> I'm a devadmin
<neuro> daftykins: nicely done :)
<neuro> "I don't know who you are ..."
<daftykins> so that was ok? :O
<neuro> well you said it in quotes, soooo ...
<diddledan> I need to watch part 2
<neuro> diddledan: it's rubbish
<diddledan> oh
<davmor2> I break ubuntu :) well I most deal with incoming apps at the moment and part time break ubuntu, but I'm good at it :)
<neuro> diddledan: *but*, it's entertaining rubbish
<diddledan> phew
<neuro> it's nowhere near as good as the original, it's a retread with a stupid plot
<diddledan> bah
<diddledan> they had a great potential
<neuro> but it has liam neeson kicking arse, so, you know, there's that
<neuro> plus, famke janssen.
<diddledan> mmmm
<neuro> exactly
<diddledan> tasty
<neuro> i still haven't watched more than the first 5 minutes of Unknown, i really should
<neuro> at least just to say i've seen it
<diddledan> o_O I've received a spam that says in the subject line (gmail didn't alter it!) "[suspected spam]" <-- is there a benefit to alerting your userbase that you're emailing them crap?
<diddledan> on the plus side, however, I must have had a wayward youth judging by all the old friends that have just broken with their boyfriend and want to sleep with me
<daftykins> 0o
<daftykins> all being >1?
<diddledan> several per day. the problem is I don't remember knowing them.
<daftykins> oooh i see now, you refer to more spam mails
<daftykins> :D
<diddledan> :-)
<daftykins> i really am far too slow these days
<daftykins> =|
<diddledan> lol
<Azelphur> In debian, how do I see what DNS server it's using?
<diddledan> Azelphur, isn't it in /etc/resolv.conf?
<neuro> /etc/resolv.conf
<awww> @davmor2 : did not work
<Azelphur> diddledan: yea, is that definitely the one it's using?
<Azelphur> because according to that file I'm using google DNS and...its down
<daftykins> both of them?!
<Azelphur> daftykins: 8.8.8.8 seems unreachable
<Azelphur> that's the only one I have set
<daftykins> /etc/nsswitch.conf will show you the ranking order of what priority configured nameservers use
<daftykins> i think they have 8.8.4.4 too
<diddledan> they're both responding to me
<daftykins> also use opendns as a fallback?
<awww> is davmor2 there here
<daftykins> Azelphur: if it can't reach them, is your default gateway not borked?
<awww> i tried his method dint work @neuro
<Azelphur> daftykins: don't think so, I'm ssh'd in ok.
<davmor2> awww: pass then maybe have a look on askubuntu
<daftykins> Azelphur: routes don't affect data coming in
<awww> hav posted there also , but what do i when i get a termianl where ubuntu@ubuntu is appearing
<Azelphur> daftykins: how do I check the route?
<daftykins> Azelphur: route -n
<Azelphur> daftykins: route isn't installed
<daftykins> oh balls
<daftykins> err
<diddledan> o_O
<neuro> ip route
<Azelphur> daftykins: traceroute looks sane
<Azelphur> http://pastebin.com/XvsabYUe <-- route
<Azelphur> http://pastebin.com/aSVfkyGm <-- traceroute
<awww> ?
<neuro> last hop is google
<awww> lol :P that is the first hope
<Azelphur> neuro: yea, I just realised that myself!
<Azelphur> google DNS...officially broke?
<neuro> you're in ny?
<Azelphur> neuro: server is, yes.
<neuro> right
<diddledan> google dns is anycasted so it uses a local system
<diddledan> i.e. the server uses a different system to me in the uk
 * neuro has a nosey from new jersey
<diddledan> so I can tell you that both dns servers are running fine but it doesn't map to what your server sees
<Azelphur> added 8.8.4.4 to work around it in dns
<daftykins> 208.67.220.220 and 208.67.222.222 are opendns' ones
<daftykins> wouldn't hurt to have a fiddle
<neuro> yeah, i'm hitting the same 72.14/16
<daftykins> so 'nslookup domain' is failing? or stalling
<neuro> i can get to 8.8.8.8
<Azelphur> daftykins: couldn't ping 8.8.8.8 or resolve any DNS
<neuro> neuro@challenger:~$ host sony.jp 8.8.8.8 | grep "has address"
<neuro> sony.jp has address 202.248.19.138
<Azelphur> fun
<Azelphur> neuro: guess the particular server my server was directed to was down (probably round robin or something?)
<neuro> yeah maybe?
<neuro> i can't route to the last hop
<neuro> as in i can't get out of whatever local network i'm tracing from
<neuro> in your trace, the third hop is above.net
<neuro> then hops 4-9 are all google
<Azelphur> fun
<Azelphur> well, set up lots more redundancy on the DNS now, and it works fine
<neuro> i can only get to hop 5
<neuro> 6-9 are unreachable for me
<Azelphur> so solved, was obviously on googles side though (8.8.8.8 didn't work, added 8.8.4.4 as a fallback, and it worked)
<neuro> yeah totally google's side
<Azelphur> fun :)
<neuro> either that or your provider's router hasn't had its routing table updated
<Azelphur> well, provider is InterNAP tier 1
<daftykins> you should always have more than one server entered
<Azelphur> so, it should update real fast
<Azelphur> daftykins: indeed, I now have 4 (google and open)
<neuro> your first hop is internap?
<Azelphur> neuro: yup
<neuro> blimeh
<neuro> still, they're manned by hoo-mans
<daftykins> that the new service from your dad's connections?
<neuro> and hoo-mans make mistakes
<neuro> lol
<Azelphur> daftykins: nope, that's my server.
<neuro> would be funny if it was
<Azelphur> hehe yea, wouldn't mind 1gbit at home ;)
<neuro> what, this? this multimode 10G fibre coming into the house? pfff, tis nothing.
<Azelphur> haha
<daftykins> oh i get you now
<neuro> would nice to be an ISP just to have a Netflix edge cache server in my spare room
<daftykins> doesn't anybody store the medias anymore :(
 * neuro points to his 13TB of NAS
<daftykins> some, then
<neuro> ja
<daftykins> i cba to upgrade my 5TB one
<neuro> plus, you know, they have blinkenlights
<daftykins> my 3ware 9650SE can probably only take 2TB disks max
<neuro> :(
<neuro> same with my readynas nv+
<neuro> i think my nv+ v2 can take 3TB
<daftykins> 197GB free on that now - don't even really get anything
<daftykins> so lately i've just deleted rubbish films to regain some space
<neuro> see, that's what netflix is for :)
<neuro> if they have the rubbish films, you just bin your local copies
<neuro> actually, i'd be tempted to do that were it not for the fact their library floats, varying in line with their current licensing deals
<daftykins> nah i'm not paying anyone for that
<neuro> tut :)
<daftykins> to have access to rubbish films, i mean
<daftykins> :D
<neuro> ah :)
<neuro> i'm one to talk
<daftykins> ;)
<neuro> i keep paying my lovefilm sub despite the fact i never use the thing
<daftykins> D:
<daftykins> madness
<neuro> picture quality is awful
<neuro> they usually use PAL masters
<neuro> which is actually my biggest gripe
<neuro> movies were not meant to be played at 25fps
<davmor2> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZyhrYis509A&list=RD02etviGf1uWlg
<daftykins> don't click that D:
<neuro> dammit!!!!!
<daftykins> it's not safe D:
<neuro> just managed to close it before it started playing
<daftykins> that's a BAD davmor
 * neuro larts davmor2
<daftykins> neuro: same XD
<neuro> all i saw was the title and i was like nononononononononono
<daftykins> this channel needs title reading bot functionality
 * popey watches http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0080339/ on netflix on ipad
<diddledan> dear god that's evil
<davmor2> haha
<neuro> cmd-w! *mash*mash*mash*
<popey> one of the best films ever
<diddledan> why would anyone do such a thing
<diddledan> thank god I closed it in time
<neuro> because they are pure unadulterated evil
<neuro> popey: i picked a helluva day to stop sniffing glue
<popey> â»
<davmor2> I clicked on the playlist for THE BOMB (these sounds fall into my mind)  And it's been great till that came up and I thought I shouldn't suffer alone
<neuro> there was no need to inflict that on us
<neuro> you can close browser tabs, you know
<neuro> no-one's forcing you to watch youtube
<neuro> or ... wait ... are they?
<daftykins> i wonder what Barbie Girl would sound like, if autotuned
<neuro> worse
<MartijnVdS> davmor2: I have a spotify playlist of 90s music if you want
<MartijnVdS> davmor2: http://open.spotify.com/user/martijnvds/playlist/1g55QqilucQ0qr1x4Sv5fw
<davmor2> neuro: the men with green skin only go when I listen to youtube ;)
<davmor2> MartijnVdS: I have my own collection this was just to see if the music it picked was any good :)
<daftykins> neuro: thats... possible? @_@
<MartijnVdS> davmor2: ok, but if you ever need inspiration, feel free ;)
<davmor2> MartijnVdS: :) will do
<ali1234> the bomb isn't even on that playlist :S
<ali1234> i thnk you just wanted to make us listen to barbie girl
<davmor2> ali1234: the bomb was the track I wanted to play initially and then I notice the play list it pulled up to the right so thought I would let it play
<davmor2> ali1234: to be fair it's been pretty good up till barbie girl
<davmor2> oh nirvana next
<MartijnVdS> whoa.. https://www.humblebundle.com/
<popey> Do you like movies about gladiators?
<popey> 4 million!?
<popey> jeez
<davmor2> so edge is getting closer to the magic pebble sum
<popey> â»
<popey> not really magic
<popey> symbolic maybe
<davmor2> popey: why can't it be magic, 3 is magic it's a number :P
<diddledan> did or does anyone ever use cacert.org certificates?
<popey> i have a friend who did
<MartijnVdS> I've used them, but they were a hassle (don't know if they still are)
<diddledan> is there a benefit of using their system over gpg, I wonder
<diddledan> central authority does have it's perks
<diddledan> as well as it's detractions
<daftykins> i was going to play with hosting my own firefox sync setup, i think i'd have to buy an SSL cert though
<MartijnVdS> diddledan: more clients understand S/MIME (Outlook even supports it!)
<MartijnVdS> but good luck finding people with the CaCert root cert installed
<diddledan> yeah, that's the suckage
<diddledan> nobody has the cacert root cert
<diddledan> not even mozilla are willing to use it by default
<MartijnVdS> diddledan: StartSSL has free S/MIME certs
<MartijnVdS> diddledan: http://www.startssl.com/?app=1
<diddledan> yeah, startssl are pretty good
<popey> clear night for an iss flyover at ~22:10
<popey> AlanBell: we haven't passed the pebble yet
<popey> $10,227,335
<popey> pebble=$10,266,845
<MartijnVdS> ooh.. ISS in 2 minutes here?
<diddledan> hergÃ©'s adventures of 22:10
<diddledan> ooh, so close
<popey> eh
<popey> how can it be in 2 mins
<popey> its over the pacific
<MartijnVdS> popey: spaceweather says 10:24 PM..
<MartijnVdS> wait.. why is it showing YESTERDAY
<AlanBell> popey: yeah, I started writing that and hit post when I finished writing, and forgot to wait
<MartijnVdS> popey: false alarm.
<popey> heh
<MartijnVdS> Missed one today @ 21:35
<daftykins> d'aww
<MartijnVdS> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/C/2012_S1
<MartijnVdS> ^ that one might be cool
<MartijnVdS> "Around the time it reaches perihelion on 28 November, it may become extremely bright if it remains intact, probably reaching a negative magnitude." (= very bright)
<ali1234> how bright?
<ali1234> not brighter than a very bright star, apparently
<AlanBell> is there a nova to look at? I saw something earlier about one but can't find it now
<AlanBell> http://www.planetary.org/blogs/emily-lakdawalla/2012/3390.html is a lovely image that kind of shows our insignificance
<AlanBell> the total perspective vortex
<daftykins> :)
<daftykins> insignificant factor 10
<ali1234> it's so much worse than that, when you look at the distance between galaxies
<ali1234> and how many of them there are
<daftykins> yip
<AlanBell> yeah, there are more than several galaxies
<daftykins> it's bad enough at that point though
<AlanBell> a long time ago in a galaxy far far away
<daftykins> an overrated franchiese got sold to Disney
<daftykins> -e
<ali1234> franscheisse?
<daftykins> cunning
<shauno> I've never actually seen that before.  susprisingly bright
<popey> yeah
<popey> wifey has friends over, dragged them outside to see it
<AlanBell> I just saw the ISS too :)
<AlanBell> that was cool
<shauno> but slightly odd standing outside on my own thinking "well according to popey, I should wave .."
<popey> heh
<daftykins> he tricked you again huh :(
<popey> Today I learned empty alkaline AA batteries bounce when dropped, full ones don't.
<diddledan> that's because they're hollow when they're empty
<diddledan> the juice gets sucked into the electronics leaving an empty shell
<daftykins> 0o
<ali1234> lies
<ali1234> i don't believe that
<diddledan> which bit?
<ali1234> what popey said
<diddledan> aah
<diddledan> which by process of elimination means you believe what I said
<daftykins> you wouldn't want to give them such a bashing anyway
<ali1234> sure
<popey> i just watched 3 videos showing it
<popey> http://www.eevblog.com/2013/08/15/eevblog-508-can-you-test-battery-charge-by-dropping-it/
<ali1234> i still don;t believe it
<diddledan> ali1234, a random blog says it's true!
<ali1234> it's too perfect
<popey> he's quite a well known engineer
<diddledan> it's the internets, it knows everything!
<diddledan> ... including what colour my undies are... :-/
<popey> watching one of his vids where he tears down an archimedes a3000
<ali1234> we need to do a proper double blind test
<ali1234> or rather someone else does, cos i still think it's a joke
 * AlanBell has some batteries
<AlanBell> some are bouncier than others, not entirely sure it correlates to charge levels yet
<AlanBell> the not-bouncy ones seem to work fine in my LED torch
<AlanBell> going to run a pair of bouncy ones totally flat in the torch (might take some time)
<ali1234> hmmmm
<ali1234> i have a theory
<ali1234> i would guess the chemical reaction is producing a small amount of gas and pressurising the cell
<ali1234> perhaps it is a secondary effect. perhaps the battery heats up during discharge, which causes the material inside to expand, deforming the case somehow
<ali1234> someone try this with brand new rechargables vs empty ones vs ones you charged
#ubuntu-uk 2013-08-16
<dvrr> MooDoo: Hiiiiiiii
<MooDoo> hiiiiiiiiii
<MartijnVdS> iiiiiiiiiiih
<AlanBell> morning
<AlanBell> well it looks like the phone went past the pebble watch milestone
<MartijnVdS> \o/
<ali1234> reaching 50% is still a possibility
<ali1234> it isn't beyond the imagination that they've already lined up a deal with a big backer who will put in 50% or whatever is left at the end, but only if the community reaches 50% first
<bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
<DJones> Morning
<mungbean> morn
<MooDoo> morning
<JamesTait> Good morning all, happy Friday and happy Tell A Joke Day! :-D
<dvrr> ubuntu server cpu utilization 100 percent
<dvrr> MooDoo:ubuntu server cpu utilization 100 percent  taking please tel me
<dwatkins> dvrr: what does "top" show is using the most CPU?
<dvrr> please open this url http://paste.ubuntu.com/5992028/
<dwatkins> ok, so you have a java application that's using up all your CPU time
<MooDoo> what java stuff are you running?
<dwatkins> well, most of it.
<MooDoo> running a minecraft server? ;)
<dvrr> jdk1.7
<MooDoo> yeah what you running on the server that uses the jdk?
<mungbean> you are running everything as root :-|
<mungbean> (not the actual problem but an observation anyway)
<MartijnVdS> mungbean: it *is* an actual problem, usually
<dwatkins> it's a security problem at least.
<MartijnVdS> especially with Java's notable insecurities
<mungbean> a problem , but not *the* problem in hand
<MooDoo> well that's a side note, lets see if we can help his java issue ;)
<dvrr> present running applications liferaytomcat, mysql, apache,mod_jk
<mungbean> ps -ef | grep 2954
<MooDoo> do any of them use java?
<MartijnVdS> well if you don't run it as root, it's also easier to set limits (CPU usage limits, memory limits, etc.) :)
<mungbean> rather large mem too, must be tomcat
<MartijnVdS> *le shuddre*
<mungbean> ps -ef will tell yout he parent process and the command line too
<MartijnVdS> mungbean: oh, I've always used "ps faux" for that :)
<MartijnVdS> or "ps fax" if I don't care about usernames
<mungbean> or ps -efl
<dvrr> # ps -ef | grep 2954   using   root     28969 28919  0 14:26 pts/0    00:00:00 grep --color=auto 2954
<mungbean> that's it?
<mungbean> seems like the java process has stopped or respawned with new process id
<MartijnVdS> have you checked its logfiles?
<mungbean> top will tell you again
<MartijnVdS> it could be in a start-crash-restart-loop
<dvrr> java process stop my tomcat  server also  stop
<MartijnVdS> dvrr: please check its logfile, it might contain hints about what's wrong.
<dvrr> which log files tomcat or system logs
<MartijnVdS> both, but start with tomcat logs.
<dvrr> please wait  i will check log files
<bigcalm> Please hold the line, your call is important to us
<mungbean> do-do-do-doooo-do-do-doooo
<dwatkins> The number you are calling knows you are waiting...
<mungbean> you are number....one in the queue
<dwatkins> please note your call may be recorded for training and quality purposes.
<MooDoo> calls are currently being charged at a pound a minute, max call length 30 mins.
<mungbean> http://twistedsifter.files.wordpress.com/2013/08/internet-usage-of-the-world-based-on-time-of-day_2.gif
<dwatkins> mungbean: are you subscribed to /r/mapporn as well? ;)
<mungbean> the small print suggests the premise is a bit flaky though
<dwatkins> (safe for work, it's just maps)
<mungbean> /r/dataisbeautiful
<dwatkins> ah yes, sorry, that's the other one I'm on
<mungbean> i refuse to sub to any /r/ called *pron
<mungbean> cos its just silly
<dwatkins> yeah, it's a silly naming convention
<mungbean> dvrr could give us a whole ps -efl listing and we could see command line and parent pid
<mungbean> front page of linux magazine sep2013 issue: GNU Hurd, discovering the lost OS
<dwatkins> Wow, I'd assumed Hurd was a forgotten project.
<mungbean> only one in the office today. this has been an unsatisfying week
<dwatkins> Loads of people are on leave, so not a lot is getting done.
<mungbean> i hate turning up when there's nothing to do. i could work at home instead
<mungbean> hmm somebody is coming
<dwatkins> quick, hide the linux magazines! ;)
<MartijnVdS> eww, why are the pages all sticky
 * dwatkins is reminded of Doctor Doolittle and the map book which the monkey filled with jam to make sure they went where he wanted them to go
<dvrr> mungbean: ps -efl   http://paste.ubuntu.com/5992104/
<mungbean> dvrr: seems to be truncated
<mungbean> don't see most of the processes from top
<dvrr> i am running only three app but it's taking 100 present  & my RAM  16 gb
<dvrr> how to fix this problem
<MooDoo> I think you need to go do some research via google.
 * popey slaps MooDoo 
 * MooDoo sits in the corner and sulks
<MartijnVdS> serverfault then?
<popey> dvrr: if java is eating lots of cpu then chances are the java application you're running is making it do that
<dwatkins> is there nothing useful in the log files? does the problem occurr after a reboot as well?
<popey> dvrr: and that application (tomcat?) should be the first thing to examine
<popey> as dwatkins says, log files for tomcat may reveal insights
<mungbean> we didn't see the whole process list
<popey> indeed
<popey> -!- MooDoo [~paulmello@unaffiliated/moodoo] has left #ubuntu-uk [RAGEPART!]
<dvrr> how to see java howmuch cpu taking
<popey> This may help.. http://rajikak.blogspot.co.uk/2011/08/debugging-high-cpu-consumption-java.html
<dvrr> thank you
<mungbean> anyone use nuvola music player?
<davmor2> Morning all
<bigcalm> Morning davmor2
<Monotoko> can't wait for lunch,,,
<Monotoko> *...
<bigcalm> Then don't
<bigcalm> Go go go
<mungbean> wonder what the chacnes that sainsburys have put the ready meal i want on the shelves by now
<mungbean> shelf was bare at 9;30
<mungbean> version control in owncloud works pretty smooth
<NET||abuse> hi guys. i'm trying to rtp stream audio from my mic on my home laptop to vlc locally
<NET||abuse> my i'm not hearing anything yet
<NET||abuse> i run avconv -f alsa -i hw:0,0 -acodec libmp3lame -ab 32k -ac 1 -re -f rtp rtp://192.168.7.11:1234
<NET||abuse> the comand line shows stuff happening, ffmpeg(avconv) seems happy
<MartijnVdS> does recording it to a file work?
<MartijnVdS> (and then playing back later)
<MartijnVdS> is the mic muted?
<MartijnVdS> or low-volumed
<NET||abuse> i port forward with ssh so localhost:1234 maps to 192.168.7.11:1234 and use vlc localy
<NET||abuse> emm, that's a good idea, i'll try that
<NET||abuse> need to make ffmpeg record to a file for a minute and then transfer the file.
<NET||abuse> alsamixer on the command line seems to be ok, i turned capture of the mic up real high
<NET||abuse> and mic boost, but not getting even background noise outa vlc locally.
<dvrr> popey:  java run different process id's in top command which one i have to kill  please open this url http://paste.ubuntu.com/5992304/
<popey> i have no idea dvrr
<dvrr> please  tel me
<popey> dvrr: i dont know
<NET||abuse> awsome... audio to mp3 worked!
<NET||abuse> now, just to figure out why hte stream doesn't
<mungbean> are you snooping on somebody NET||abuse :P
<NET||abuse> on my doggies
<mungbean> snuffle snuffle chomp slurp woof
<NET||abuse> well, i have a friends dog over and they were curious if he would bark if he had company as he apparently does on his own
<NET||abuse> so i want to turn on audio and just have it in the background to get a sense of how much noise he makes when in company of my dog
<NET||abuse> I have motion seeing what they get up to, and they're rolling around every few minutes play fighting
<NET||abuse> I might be mis understanding the -f rtp rtp://x.x.x.:1234  bit,, the machine which is hosting the mic and webcam, do i put it's ip and a port for it to listen on in that address?
<mungbean> http://stackoverflow.com/questions/14298400/using-avconv-to-stream-live-audio-from-in-line-alsa-hw0-0-over-wireless-acces
<mungbean> is it over WAN or same lan?
<NET||abuse> ahh, hmm , i'm sshing in from office
<NET||abuse> so from office i do ssh -L 1234:ipofwebcambox:1234
<NET||abuse> then point my vlc player at office laptop localhost:1234
<NET||abuse> so i don't want to do that as the rtp stream is a directed stream, not a server waiting for me to just start listening to the stream
<NET||abuse> is that right?
<mungbean> :-S dunno
<NET||abuse> hmm, tried directing the rtp://x.x.x to the ip of the box i'm ssh'ing to, then -L 1234:127.0.0.1:1234  then vlc on office laptop i'm sshing in from opening localhost:1234
<NET||abuse> still no audio
<isleofmandan> Forgive me if I sound stupid. Currently running Dell XPS 13 DevEd with stock kernel (3.2.0-52) and having terrible wifi issues. Forums suggest "apt-get install linux-backports-modules-cw-3.8-precise-generic". Can someone confirm that this will just add latest wifi drivers to my current kernel? I don't want to break all the other nice things about this laptop!
<isleofmandan> also, if I want to back out of the change, can I just "apt-get remove linux-backports...." ?
<Monotoko> anyone here know how Postfix deals with SQL?
<Monotoko> I have an SQL query (absolutely horrible) but I'm not sure how the query knows which email is being used...
<mungbean> isleofmandan: http://www.ubuntuupdates.org/package/canonical_kernel_team/precise/main/base/linux-backports-modules-cw-3.8-precise-generic sys it's an empty package :-|
<mungbean> http://pastebin.com/Dihg66Wk
<mungbean> contents of the deb file
<TheOpenSourcerer> Anyone fancy answering a simple Java question? I have a string. If that string does not have a leading zero I want to add one. It may be of variable length?
<MartijnVdS> TheOpenSourcerer: Strings in Java are immutable, you'll have to create a new instance (of type String ;)) and return that
<MartijnVdS> TheOpenSourcerer: you might want to look at the "StringBuilder" class
<MartijnVdS> TheOpenSourcerer: StringBuilder MyStringBuilder = new StringBuilder("World!");
<MartijnVdS> MyStringBuilder.Insert(0,"Hello "); // Hello World!
<TheOpenSourcerer> String.format() seems to be the cookie but I can't get the syntax.
<MartijnVdS> TheOpenSourcerer: String result = String.format("The format method is %s!", "great");
<TheOpenSourcerer> So, can I test for a leading zero and add one then?
<MartijnVdS> TheOpenSourcerer: it sounds like you have a number instead of a string?>
<MartijnVdS> TheOpenSourcerer: you can say:
<MartijnVdS> String result; if (!original.startsWith('0')) { result = String.format("0%s", original); } else { result = original; }
<MartijnVdS> or something similar
<TheOpenSourcerer> Thanks: !row12.Office_Phone.startsWith("0") ? "0" + row12.Office_Phone : row12.Office_Phone
<MartijnVdS> that works?
<MartijnVdS> <-- not a professional java wrangler ;)
<ali1234> you could remove the double negative there
<popey> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/171104024854 has gone on sale
<MartijnVdS> Â£60?!
<mungbean> specs?
<mungbean> RAM, storage?
<MartijnVdS> 1.0 GHz Cortex-A5
<MartijnVdS> 512 MB ROM, 256 MB RAM
<MartijnVdS> 3.5" TFT 320 x 480 Pixels
<mungbean> wheres that written?
<mungbean> sounds similar to my htc desire
<MartijnVdS> mungbean: behind the "Specifications" link on the ebay page
<ali1234> well that's certainly a bit more affordable than the edge :)
<popey> 137 sold
<mungbean> cheers MartijnVdS missed that bit
<mungbean> worse display than htc
<mungbean> http://www.gsmarena.com/htc_desire-3077.php
<popey> it is a stupidly cheap phone though
<mungbean> but i wonder how that display looks
<MartijnVdS> mungbean: probably similar to most previous-era phones
<mungbean> its essentially a 4yr old phone
<mungbean> its the htc g1
<mgdm> My girlfriend needs a new phone, but I'm not sure how beta the OS is
<popey> you could probably put CM on it?
<mungbean> which one of you just bought one :P
<mungbean> as the football season is about to start, have a little lol at this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MusyO7J2inM
<mungbean> it looks like the zte san francisco phone which was Â£99 last year
<isleofmandan> mungbean: Thanks. I assume there's no point installing empty packages!
<mungbean> isleofmandan: there could be
<mungbean> might check for presence of package and do something else
<mungbean> i'd go for it
<mungbean> and reboot
<mungbean> check what dmesg says before and after
<isleofmandan> mungbean: OK. I'll give it a shot. There's a user in Dell support forums who claims it has fixed things for him.
<mungbean> i saw that
<isleofmandan> I hope it does. Droppy-out wireless on a machine without an Ethernet port is very annoying :)
<isleofmandan> dependecy hell ensues... Oh well.
<isleofmandan> It doesn't want to install
<popey> https://plus.google.com/u/0/115831017343671643958/posts/eFnigFXxhM5
<popey> â»
<mungbean> what's all this about? http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/100-Genuine-HTC-Desire-C-top-power-button-Silver-side-on-off-wake-switch-key-/300932380622?pt=UK_Replacement_Parts_Tools&hash=item4610f7b7ce
<mungbean> price 995 , and 2 sold?
<mgdm> **** Temporarily re-priced to prevent purchase whilst missing stock is located ****
<mgdm> check the description
<mungbean> ah
<mungbean> saw a few v high ones
<SuperMatt> I'm quite surprised that the news that Ubuntu has broken all crowd funcding records hasn't surred a push to get it past 32mil
<mungbean> :-|
<mungbean> optimistic
<mungbean> isleofmandan: what errors did you get?
<popey> any of you on giffgaff?
<SuperMatt> yo
<mungbean> popey: yes
<popey> i want an app for ubuntu touch like the giffgaff app
<mungbean> is this gonna be about the APN
<popey> no
<popey> API
<popey> so close ã
<mungbean> whats the GG app
<popey> the mobile app
<mungbean> never seen it
<popey> it tells you your current remaining mins/data etc
<SuperMatt> ah, I don't have that on my phone
<SuperMatt> but seems very useful
<mungbean> i get a popup that tells me after a call
<SuperMatt> me too
<SuperMatt> mostly I have free minutes so I don't see ito
<SuperMatt> -o
<isleofmandan> mungbean: The following packages have unmet dependencies.
<isleofmandan>  linux-backports-modules-cw-3.8-precise-generic : Depends: linux-backports-modules-cw-3.8-3.2.0-52-generic but it is not installable
<mungbean> what kernel version you have? (uname -a)
<isleofmandan> mungbean: Linux Laptop 3.2.0-52-generic #78+kamal16~DellXPS-Ubuntu
<mungbean> popey: official GG app?
<popey> ya
<mungbean> giffgaff app
<mungbean> quetonix
<popey> Êâ¿à² 
<mungbean> doesn't look official
<popey> https://itunes.apple.com/gb/app/my-giffgaff/id571246020?mt=8
<popey> â»
<mungbean>  quetonix August 9, 2013
<mungbean> Giffgaff have not opened API access to the public. What this means is I cannot retrieve data from giffgaff servers as I am not affiliated with giffgaff. Therefore there is no way for me to retreive account details and can only nest a webview. This app contains many more functionalities other than the webview. Please look in the preferences section.
<popey> yeah, bummer
<mungbean> i forgot other phone OS were available
<popey> i put a proxy between my phone and giffgaff
<popey> i ass u med there was an app for your legacy platform
<popey> i was looking at the traffic to see what it did
<popey> http://paste.ubuntu.com/5992675/
<mungbean> "Remember you've got time until midnight on the 12 JUNE 2013 to change your decision if you need to."
<mungbean> giffgaff page after i selected for chasback
<mungbean> unsure if i have achieved anything today
<mungbean> summer sucks
<isleofmandan> mungbean: You've helped me out :)
<mungbean> unsuccessfully so far...
<mungbean> did you add the depends package to the isntall line?
<davmor2> isleofmandan: if you try and install linux-backports-modules-cw-3.8-3.2.0-52-generic what error do you get then?
<isleofmandan> mungbean: Well, Dell's own support only seems of swapping Intel cards for Atheros ones, or vice versa without acutally solving anything, so don't beat yourself up! ;)
<mungbean> i get cc'd on the weirdest unconnected emails
<MartijnVdS> mungbean: are you a manager? ;)
<mungbean> bank -> scott cc mungbean blah blah bank acount
<mungbean> publisher -> author cc mungbean "Would you do me a favor and send the latest interior of the Berger book as well as the cover file to Barbara, but before you do, can you mark across the cover as well as the first page of the interior "Uncorrected Proof"--this way when Barbara sends it to people it will be clear that this is not the final version?"
<mungbean> this is my personal gmail account
<mungbean> its like a crossed line
<mungbean> on average a few per week
<isleofmandan> davmor2: Note, selecting 'linux-backports-modules-cw-3.8-3.2.0-52-generic' for regex 'linux-backports-modules-cw-3.8-3.2.0-52'
<isleofmandan> E: Unable to locate package generic
<davmor2> isleofmandan: report a bug, and have a chat about the bug on #ubuntu-kernel
<mungbean> try just linux-backports-modules-cw
<mungbean> nah
<isleofmandan> mungbean: unable to locate... etc
<mungbean> sudo apt-get install linux-backports-modules-cw-3.8-precise-generic-pae
<mungbean> hmm they seem to be 32 bit versions
<mungbean> http://pastebin.com/tympCx67
<mungbean> what results do you get for that command?
<isleofmandan> davmor2: I'm not sure exactly what bug to report really. All a bit complex. There are already a few bug reports about XPS13 wirless. It doesn't help that Dell has shipped more recent machines like mine with a different card. Wifi still drops, but it appears to be for different reasons to the Intel cards.
<mungbean> "The energy giant today revealed it would now only ring those households that "have a relationship" with the business, or ones that have agreed to call, such as by ticking a box on an internet comparison site." cheeky.
<mungbean> gocompare etc don't make it easy to unselect the box
<davmor2> isleofmandan: one would be that you have naff wifi, the second would be that you can't install linux-backports-modules-cw it is blocked, that is the bit that you can approach the kernel guys about it maybe that it is just a misconfigured module.
<isleofmandan> mungbean: linux-backports-modules-cw-3.8-precise-generic-pae:i386 : Depends: linux-backports-modules-cw-3.8-3.2.0-52-generic-pae:i386 but it is not installable
<mungbean> do you have backports enabled?
<mungbean> ah, try the pastebinned command i did
<isleofmandan> mungbean: linux-backports-modules-cw-3.8-precise-generic : Depends: linux-backports-modules-cw-3.8-3.2.0-52-generic but it is not installable  (with the command from pastebin)
<mungbean> is backports enabled in software centre?
<isleofmandan> let me check...
 * mungbean checks too
<mungbean> im on precise too
<mungbean> ah, on 3.2.0.51 though
<mungbean> i think thats your probs
<isleofmandan> Unsupported Updates (precise-backports) is ticked
<mungbean> where did the .52 kernel come from?
<mungbean> i'm not offered that one
<isleofmandan> It shipped with the machine. I think It's tweaked by Dell to make sure things like screen brightness, volume controls etc  work...
<mungbean> the error message is real
<popey> isleofmandan: just catching up
<mungbean> you could possibly kludge by downloading the debs required for the .51 kernel , since there are just "empty"
<popey> you running 12.04 on an xps 13?
<mungbean> dpkg --contents shows whats in a deb
<popey> seeing dodgy wireless?
<popey> there is a fix
<isleofmandan> I'm guessing now though, TBH ;)
<isleofmandan> I'm back.. (yup, wifi again!)
<popey>  linux-generic-lts-quantal is the kernel you want on 12.04
<popey> apt-get install that
<mungbean> is that 3.5 or 3.8 popey?
<popey> 3.5
<popey> 3.8 is raring
<popey> linux-generic-lts-raring
<isleofmandan> Is there an IRC command that allows me to catch up last few mins? I've missed a few lines while wifi dropped, it seems!
<popey> isleofmandan: just sudo apt-get install linux-generic-lts-quantal
<popey> that'll fix your wifi
<popey> then you can catch up with the irc logs on the web
<mungbean> forums are annoying for this reason
<isleofmandan> popey:  Thanks. Will it leave hotkeys, suspend, hibernate and all that working too?
<mungbean> out of date info sends you down rabbit holes
<popey> i believe so
<popey> indeed, forums suck
<isleofmandan> OK. here goes :)
<mungbean> you'll still be able to choose the old kernel at boot time just in case
<mungbean> 3.5 fixed an annoying GPU lockup for me
<mungbean> eventually made it back into 3.2 though
<isleofmandan> popey: I have the newer Atheros Killer card rather than the Intel one, if that matters?
<popey> nope
<isleofmandan> good :) Installing now
<popey> stop asking questions and install it â»
<mungbean> go down the road to sadbfl and ask him :P
<popey> heh
<isleofmandan> It's tempting... Although I never get invited to his BBQs
<mungbean> how big is IOM?
<mungbean> diameter?
<isleofmandan> about 13 miles wide
<mungbean> the IOM irc must be pumping.
<mungbean> so the size of london
<isleofmandan> I've been trying to start IoMLUG for years...
<isleofmandan> 80,000 people here
<MartijnVdS> all LUG members?
<isleofmandan> so smaller than London that way!
<mungbean> i wonder if london could sink it
<mungbean> if all the people came and jumped on it
<isleofmandan> mungbean :)
<mungbean> maybe its like the floating island in life of pi
<popey> isleofmandan: were you born there or did you move there?
<isleofmandan> popey: Moved here in 2007
<mungbean> everyone must be either rich, an inbred or motorbike fan?
<popey> or all three?
<mungbean> or migrant
<isleofmandan> Install done. I assume it's sudo reboot time now?
<popey> DO IT
 * isleofmandan hopes shiny new laptop isn't a doorstop...
<isleofmandan> back soon
<SuperMatt> KABOOM!
<mungbean> KERPOW
<popey> quick, everyone hide
<mungbean> whats that smoke coming from yonder out North west
<mungbean> speak ukrainian
<popey> or upside down
<isleofmandan> This thing is fast :)
<mungbean> did you google that XPS issue or already know?
<popey> ÊÉ¹oÊ ÊÄ± pÄ±p 'uÉpuÉÉ¯ÉoÇlsÄ± Ä±É¥
<popey> i knew
<mungbean> maybe askubuntu might like to know
<mungbean> if it works
<isleofmandan> My old PC reboot takes about 5 minutes..
<isleofmandan> Anyway, how do I double check I'm using new kernel.. uname -a ?
<popey> ya
<mungbean> yep
<isleofmandan> 3.5 :)
 * isleofmandan goes to press all the buttons...
<isleofmandan> Vol, keyboard backlight, screen brightness all good
<isleofmandan> *Thanks Alan*  :)
<popey> np
<isleofmandan> Have spent weeks researching via forums.
<mungbean> cant help but think this should be written down somewhere...
<isleofmandan> I'll create a Dell account just so I can update the Dell support forum and save others the hassle I've had
<mungbean> yeah, i found that page too
<isleofmandan> mungbean: Thanks to you too, of course
<mungbean> couldn't find any askubuntu questions about it
<mungbean> np. still too early to go home though :(
<mungbean> gonna have to tell my boss i've finished all the work , please sir can i have some more
<dwatkins> can you do some of mine?
<mungbean> hmmm
<dwatkins> my boss just went home early, so I can't really complain
<mungbean> my boss on hols
<mungbean> whole company is on hols
<mungbean> literally nothing to do
<dwatkins> sometimes that makes matters worse
<dwatkins> like when you have to escalate stuff
<mungbean> its a new team so not much historical issues to resolve
<mungbean> usually in summer i used to fixed niggling old problems and replace crappy kit
<mungbean> do fw upgrades
<dwatkins> I don't tend to get any less busy at times like this, as the number of calls being reduced is balanced out by all the people with kids being on holiday a lot.
<dwatkins> calls, e-mails, chats, facebook posts, tweets etc. - we get cases from a variety of sources.
<isleofmandan> mungbean: I've posted a 'question' on askubuntu, which also contains the answer. Are there any other popular forums I should visit to save people scratching their heads?
<neuro> doo de doo
<neuro> gtav preordered \o/
<daftykins> \o/
<daftykins> i still resent only being able to get it on the current gen
<daftykins> but i'm not going to wait until maybe new year for the new consoles to settle down before *Maybe* being able to buy a copy
<mungbean> isleofmandan: askubuntu is where i'd hope to find good info, so should be sufficient
<mungbean> anyone know about sun grid engine?
<AlanBell> https://www.google.com/maps/preview#!data=!1m8!1m3!1d3!2d-0.192862!3d51.492132!2m2!1f291.8!2f71.14!4f75!2m5!1e1!2m3!1sc9UMhWP_MWm9U0L48xEjYw!2e0!7e5&fid=5
<AlanBell> and press cursor up
<mungbean> yeah AlanBell i saw that next week
<mungbean> oh cool, finally google maps has updated its picture of my house
<mungbean> now its my new car
<mungbean> and there's flowers in the window, proving i'm a great husband to alll the world
<daftykins> mungbean: did you come back from the future?
<daftykins> you saw it next week :O
<mungbean> yes, just my little relevant joke re the link
<shauno> I thought next week will be a totally appropriate time to see the tardis :p
<daftykins> ugh
<mungbean> i can tell what time of day the google maps pic was taken as my neighbour got snapped taking his dog for the regular walk
<mungbean> my road is a totally weird mix of aug2012, sep2012, then aug2012 again then sep2008, all in 100 yds
<daftykins> :>
<daftykins> perhaps the best bits were combined
<mungbean> or they went home
<mungbean> have you sen the one in itialy when you take one step and its winter
<mungbean> snow everywhere
<mungbean> o spooky, back to aug2012 again after 1 step
<mungbean> i wonder if anyone has caught their SO having an affair with thi
<popey> yes, they have
<popey> saw it somewhere amongst those lists of things you spot on gmaps
<linuxliam> http://paste.ubuntu.com/5993067/ any help?
<daftykins> reinstall with purge?
<linuxliam> i tried that
<daftykins> tried a new user?
<popey> which version of skype is it?
<linuxliam> 4.2.0.11-0ubuntu0.12.04.2
<popey> you're on 12.04?
<linuxliam> no
<linuxliam> 13.04
<popey> ok, np
<popey> i have the same version of skype here
 * popey opens skype for the first time in aeons
<linuxliam> it core dumps about 20mins into a vid call
<popey> maybe delete .config/Skype  and start again?
<popey> i have seen others report skype crash during a call
<SuperMatt> that's one of the things I loved most about linux. You balls up a config and it's *so* easy to get everything back to the start
<linuxliam> yup i deleted the skype config dir
<daftykins> because it's not in Windows 0o
<mungbean> maybe the NSA plugin crashed
<linuxliam> bahaha
<linuxliam> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-23723801 anyone read this
<mungbean> http://www.theverge.com/2013/8/15/4621514/gone-home-review
<mungbean> i liked these kind of exploring games
<mungbean> glad they've been updated so you can pick up and explore nearly everything
<mungbean> available for linux
<neuro> sod it
<neuro> knocking off time
<neuro> daftykins: re gtav, i think they just poured so much dev time into it on current gen that doing it for pc+next gen would have either spread their existing resources too thin or they'd have had to get too many extra folk in
<neuro> apparently on the 360 it's a 2 disc game, but the first disc is for the mandatory 8GB install; 2nd disc only required for actually playing the game
<daftykins> yeah
<daftykins> no surprises there
<daftykins> even XGD3 didn't really help matters XD
<neuro> gaaaah
<neuro> why office needs to close chrome to install updates is beyond me
<diddledan_> neuro, it wants to force you into using IE
<neuro> not entirely possible
<Monotoko> IT WORKS
<Monotoko> hell yes
<Monotoko> \o/
<diddledan_> Monotoko, you still messing with postfix? :-p
<Monotoko> diddledan_, not anymore! :P
<Monotoko> it works now
<diddledan_> yey!
<diddledan_> well done!
<diddledan_> that sql made my brian hurt
<Monotoko> mix two of my most hated things into one... SQL and Postfix, and it's gonna take me a while
<diddledan_> and I didn't have to fiddle with it
<Monotoko> I ended up writing another query
<Monotoko> and leaving that one the hell alone
<diddledan_> lol
<diddledan_> MOAR SQL!
<neuro> Monotoko: i bet if someone forcibly switched you to sendmail or qmail, you'd long for the days when you had postfix
<mgdm> qmail FTL
<mgdm> sendmail FTevenmoreL
<neuro> yes
<neuro> yay, office 2011 update installed
<neuro> what did i win?
<neuro> unspecified updates
<neuro> woot
<neuro> when vendor updates come with release notes that basically say "trust us, go on, it'll be fine", i get concerned
<SuperMatt> I'm using dovecot and postfix
<SuperMatt> I think I must have done something terrible in a past life
 * neuro uses the same setup
 * mgdm too
<neuro> a setup which, apparently, windows phone doesn't like
<SuperMatt> in all honesty, I think there is *a lot* that can be done to make smtp set up easier
<neuro> so my dad has to send emails via gmail's smtp rather than mine :P
<neuro> SuperMatt: postfix is pretty painless
<SuperMatt> there are so many options to it that it feels almost impenetrable to new users
<neuro> "users"/
<neuro> ?
<SuperMatt> wekk
<SuperMatt> well
<neuro> smtpds aren't for "users"! :)
<SuperMatt> people setting it up for the first time
<neuro> bloomin' users
<neuro> my life would be so much easier without users
<SuperMatt> haha, yeah, it would
<SuperMatt> I'm glad that my users are mostly the devs that have written the crap that's broken
<SuperMatt> so 99% of the time I just turn it back on them
<neuro> :)
<Monotoko> ... well shit
<SuperMatt> no swears in here
<Monotoko> sorry, just realised I made a huge mistake
<SuperMatt> it happens to the best of us
<SuperMatt> and the worst
<SuperMatt> it just seems to happen
<Monotoko> I just bombarded a group with every email sent through a highly sensitive system
<Monotoko> because I forgot to remove a static string and add a %u match
<Monotoko> >.>
<Monotoko> email is not my strong point
<zleap> oosp
<diddledan_> Monotoko, break it then go home and ignore it for the weekend
<Monotoko> diddledan_, not a good idea with my boss standing behind me
<Monotoko> I've fixed the issue now and added the dynamic bit back...
<diddledan_> what ever happened to the "boss key"?!
<diddledan_> time to go
<Monotoko> "boss key"?
<popey> i love the spam I get from my local curry house
<popey> its really personal
<popey> http://paste.ubuntu.com/5993420/
<linuxliam> thats kinda cool
<popey> yeah, he's a nice guy too
<popey> he comes over to your table and does little bits of origami
<linuxliam> hehe
<daftykins> popey: seems he's smarter than the average bear
<davmor2> daftykins: why are you calling him popey  quite obviously he's bobo if Yogi is talking to him :D
<daftykins> davmor2: you raise a fair point, sir
<davmor2> daftykins: just don't mention picnic hampers
<daftykins> p..p..p..picnic baskets! 8D
<popey> yeah, the word picnic in our house is _always_ suffixed with "bobo"
<daftykins> XD
<davmor2> daftykins: see told you he was bobo :D
<daftykins> you did, you did
<daftykins> i guess that makes us rangers
<davmor2> daftykins: I think czajkowski is the pink one, I'm not fussed over colours once the pink one is gone...........go go power rangers
<daftykins> i never saw that growing up
<daftykins> i think you had to have satellite TV
<davmor2> daftykins: there's your problem you grew up, grow back down again and you too can ignore the horror that is power rangers :D
<davmor2> daftykins: I'm pretty sure it's meant to be Thundercats but with real people and cornier :)
<davmor2> daftykins: that or battle of the planets without the space ship
<daftykins> just pushed the boat well and truly out, by buying a Â£3.45 DC power jack replacement for a laptop
<daftykins> oooh, i take such risks
<brobostigon> evening everyone,
<popey> pip pip brobostigon, exobuzz
<exobuzz> hi
<brobostigon> evening popey and exobuzz
#ubuntu-uk 2013-08-17
<bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
<brobostigon> good morning everyone.
<MartijnVdS> \o
<brobostigon> morning bigcalm and MartijnVdS
<MartijnVdS> Spa next week \o/
<MartijnVdS> s/^/F1 @/
<brobostigon> this is sad, i have been ssh'bombed by 76.72.167.2 for the last two days. someone doesnt have anything better to do.
<MartijnVdS> brobostigon: do you have fail2ban installed?
<brobostigon> yes.
<MartijnVdS> so they can't actually do anything. Yay :)
<brobostigon> was one of the first things i installed.
<brobostigon> :)
<MartijnVdS> you can also set up private/public key authentication and disable password auth completely
<bigcalm> Having SSHd run on a port other than 22 is also a good start :)
<brobostigon> definatly bigcalm
<brobostigon> MartijnVdS: i shall have to research how to import those keys into things like connectbot.
<MartijnVdS> brobostigon: that's possible, I have a key in my connectbot as well
<MartijnVdS> I even have one on my chromebook!
<brobostigon> MartijnVdS: cool, could work then. :)
<brobostigon> wicked.
<MartijnVdS> brobostigon: putty supports keys, and even an agent (with pageant)
<brobostigon> putty, isnt that for MS windows?
<MartijnVdS> brobostigon: (agent is useful if you don't want to re-type the key passphrase every time you ssh, also if you "chain-ssh" from one host to the next
<MartijnVdS> brobostigon: it is, but there's also an X version -- apt-get install putty
<MartijnVdS> http://mah.everybody.org/docs/ssh
<brobostigon> ah, i did not know that.
<popey> pip pip
<MartijnVdS> \o popeyman
<brobostigon> morning your popey'ness
<MartijnVdS> El Poperino?
<brobostigon> :)
 * popey recently discovered the joy that is bacon cooked in the microwave
<MartijnVdS> popey: but.. isn't that.. eww?
<popey> nope
<popey> two sheets of kitchen roll, lay the bacon on top, one extra sheet of kitchen roll on top
<popey> 3 mins, done
<brobostigon> does it not make a mess on the inside of the microwelle ?
<popey> nope
<popey> thanks to the top layer
<brobostigon> ah.
<brobostigon> sorry, microwelle, german. woops.
<popey> also, a better technique for poached eggs. bring water to boil, roll the eggs (in shells) in the water for ~10 seconds or so, then take them out and crack them in
<popey> makes the white a tiny bit solid so it doesn't separate out
<ali1234> i used to poach eggs that way if they're not fresh
<ali1234> but then i got some poach pods
<ali1234> http://www.lakeland.co.uk/12116/Green-poachpod
<MartijnVdS> brobostigon: DER MIKROWELLENOFEN
<popey> i have some of them
<popey> but rarely use them
<popey> easier to just crack into water
<brobostigon> MartijnVdS: yep, that thing, :)
<popey> also, the plate the bacon cooked on becomes hot, which is good for keeping the poached eggs warm
<popey> just need to wipe the moisture off with the kitchen towel you just used to cook the bacon
<brobostigon> this is where living in germany for almost ten years as a child and teenger blocks the mind.
<MartijnVdS> I want to try cooking an egg in my oven some time
<MartijnVdS> Takes 30m instead of 8-10-ish
<popey> \o/ crispy bacon
<popey> i had a pizza in cannes once which had an egg in the middle
<popey> was one the best best pizzas ever
<MartijnVdS> Cannes or cans?
<popey> heh
<popey> cannes
<MartijnVdS> I've had a pizza with egg as well, it was good. But this is more like a "boiled" egg, but instead of boiling it in water, you do the heat transfer using air in an oven.
<MartijnVdS> \o/ Cooking for Geeks
<popey> how odd
<popey> my local curry house does a "special" which is a chicken & "meat" curry which also has a boiled egg in it
<popey> its really nice
<popey> they score the egg so the curry flavour penetrates it
<MartijnVdS> stop making me hungry :P
<popey> heh
<AlanBell> I have an egg boiling machine
<AlanBell> kind of cooks them in bubbles of superheated steam
<AlanBell> and a poaching pan which I rarely use, never tried "real" poaching of naked eggs in water
<popey> wat!
<popey> its the best way
<AlanBell> whut!
<AlanBell> I would have let you just have it popey :)
<popey> hahah
<popey> â¹
<popey> tricky given it's on ebay and people had already bid for it
<AlanBell> yeah, well good luck :)
 * penguin42 has ordered his virgin
<popey> Êâ¿à² 
<popey> AlanBell: well if I don't get it, at least I pushed the price up a bit â»
<bigcalm> Good afternoon peeps :)
<bigcalm> Instant boredom. Getting dangerously close to doing some work
<bigcalm> Wish I could play Fez in Linux
<popey> bigcalm: its coming i hear
<bigcalm> \o/
<popey> bigcalm: fancy some minecraft?
<bigcalm> I'm close to completing it on Windows
<bigcalm> popey: sure
<popey> where? mine is down
<bigcalm> Snowflake? You can laugh at the parp I've been building
<popey> yay
<directhex> fez is a monogame game, so the porting is taking far too long imho
<directhex> i.e. the windows version is monogame, not xna
<ali1234> looks like a cool game
<directhex> indie game: the movie covers its creation. also braid and super meat boy
<ali1234> but if it is monogame why can't we just play the windows version directly?
<ali1234> "windows" version
<directhex> monogame is api-compatible across platforms, but not abi compatible
<ali1234> i thought the whole point of managed code was that you never have to worry about ABI compatibility
<directhex> yeah, well... the upstream monogame developers have a somewhat haphazard approach to such things
<bigcalm> If I can't play Fez in Linux, I can at least enjoy the music: http://disasterpeace.com/album/fez
<bigcalm> Love it when a torrent says 86 days remaining
<Myrtti> I really wanted to play it
<Myrtti> it was a bit nauseating though
<bigcalm> Tempted to take my machine down stairs and hook it up to the TV
<linuxliam> http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2013/08/first-look-at-brackets-for-linux
<sebsebseb> Not been in here for a while.
<sebsebseb> anyone about in here at the moment?
<Myrtti> somewhat
 * penguin42 has been out at a LUG
<penguin42> a fairly fun activity of looking through each others (sanitied) .bash_history files - interesting way to learn some new commands and options
<sebsebseb> penguin42: LUG's are fun generally yeah :)
<penguin42> sebsebseb: Yeh I've been going to ManLUG for many many years
<MartijnVdS> what do you do at a ManLUG? Manly things?
<penguin42> MartijnVdS: It's got to be said we are a little short of Women
<penguin42> MartijnVdS: It's ManLUG as in Manchester (UK)
<MartijnVdS> Ah :)
 * MartijnVdS just watched a stream of CHVRCHES playing at Lowlands Festival
<MartijnVdS> Album. Want. Now. :)
<MartijnVdS> (https://soundcloud.com/chvrches/the-mother-we-share https://soundcloud.com/chvrches/lies-mix-5-m for a few of their songs)
<daftykins> what's the current flash player version people are using?
<MartijnVdS> I use the one built into chrome
<daftykins> a bit surprised my HTPC just updated and put 11.2.202.297 on O_O
<MartijnVdS> 11.8.800.115
<daftykins> yeah i was sure we were up to .8
<daftykins> flashplugin-installer: downloading http://archive.canonical.com/pool/partner/a/adobe-flashplugin/adobe-flashplugin_11.2.202.297.orig.tar.gz
<penguin42> 11.2.202.297 apparently
<daftykins> 0o
<daftykins> ah-har not just me then ;)
<penguin42> daftykins: Hmph - is this a  different series or just old?
<MartijnVdS> yes
<daftykins> the system is my HTPC which i believe might be built on 12.04
<daftykins> waiting for the upgrade to finish to check
<daftykins> though it might be a modified lsb-release :D
<penguin42> so what would people suggest as a new PC to use as NAT box/firewall/mini-server - I want 4 ethers, not much money and low power
<daftykins> cor 4 interfaces
<daftykins> i thought you had lots of old systems spare kicking around, penguin42 ? :)
<daftykins> ah no it's built in 12.10
<penguin42> daftykins: I do, and I'm currently running a P90 for this job - but I don't think it'll manage the 30Mbps cable I have on order, and I want something quieter
<daftykins> ah-har :)
<penguin42> daftykins: The P90 has been doing it for a long time (it's 19 years old!)
<daftykins> \o/
<penguin42> was my 1st Linux box along time ago
<daftykins> to get so many interfaces would you aim for a multi-port intel card?
<penguin42> daftykins: Maybe but they used to be cheap but they now cost 100+ which is just silly
<MartijnVdS> TP-Link WDR4300 with OpenWRT :)
<MartijnVdS> Maybe the 4900 but that's less stable, or so I heard
<MartijnVdS> penguin42: ^
<penguin42> MartijnVdS: Those things tend not to have 4 real separate interfaces seen by the cpu
<MartijnVdS> penguin42: they do, if you configure them like that
<MartijnVdS> penguin42: (by assigning a vlan to each port)
<MartijnVdS> but yeah, you share the gbit
<penguin42> nod
 * penguin42 never really likes vlan stuff - but perhaps I should
<daftykins> sounds like a good plan imo
<daftykins> if the hardware's got enough oomph to push good speeds routing wise
<MartijnVdS> I saturate my 100/100 link
<MartijnVdS> (to the interweb)
<daftykins> wish i had nice upstream :(
<daftykins> that's cool
<daftykins> nice and low power too with an appliance i guess
<penguin42> finding an ARM board with multiple interfaces is annoyingly hard
<MartijnVdS> daftykins: It's fibre.. all I have are a gigabit media converter and a router :)
<daftykins> yeah i'm calling the router an appliance in this case
<daftykins> versus a full computer
<MartijnVdS> penguin42: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Intel-CPU-D61407-B-INTEL1000-Quad-Port-Gigabit-Ethernet-PCI-E-Adapter-Card-/281148107696
<penguin42> MartijnVdS: Yeh exactly, $120
<MartijnVdS> http://www.ebay.com/itm/Intel-Quad-Port-Gigabit-Network-Adapter-Intel-Pro-1000-MT-Nic/111144550835
<MartijnVdS> PCI-X though
<penguin42> yeh so the PCIe ones are really expensive for some odd reason; but PCI-x isn't too bad an idea, perhaps an older ITX board
<penguin42> in principal a dual card will probably do based on the motherboard having a couple if I find a good ones
<MartijnVdS> PCI-X isn't really current anymore though, is it?
<MartijnVdS> penguin42: I know of one 2-port motherboard
<penguin42> no, but a lot of stuff still has some PCI-x slots
<MartijnVdS> Gigabyte GA-C847N + LC-Power LC-1320mi
<MartijnVdS> penguin42: ^ those 2 + a low-profile PCI-e 2-port card should work
<MartijnVdS> oh wait
<MartijnVdS> "standard" PCI
<daftykins> PCI-X is ancient :D
<penguin42> MartijnVdS: Hmm they're not bad price - #69 for that board
<MartijnVdS> penguin42: yeah but it has normal pci only
<penguin42> MartijnVdS: Yeh but finding a dual port pci card can't be that hard
<MartijnVdS> is's all -e or -x
<MartijnVdS> probably because 33MHz PCI + 2GBit = cloud of magic smoke
<MartijnVdS> you can get a lot of 100mbit dual-port PCI cards though
<penguin42> http://www.mini-itx.com/store/~JNF9D-2550  hmm
<MartijnVdS> 3x Gigabit LAN Daughterboard Module (Intel 82541PI chipset)
<MartijnVdS> whoa
<penguin42> yeh exactly
<MartijnVdS> sounds like a winner to me :)
<mungbean> evening
<penguin42> MartijnVdS: Nod
<daftykins> that looks great
<daftykins> i was going to run a smoothwall box again at my main clients, with 3 x interfaces so that i could keep the wireless separated as like a guest network
<MartijnVdS> daftykins: vlans can do that too
<daftykins> yeah with a managed switch or capable device
<MartijnVdS> daftykins: OpenWRT on a TP-Link router (check if it's supported before buying ;)
<daftykins> no i'm just saying, this was ages ago
<MartijnVdS> ah, ok
<daftykins> the point was i already had the smoothwall box so i just dropped in two more NICs at the time
<daftykins> but now we've got VDSL2+ on the rock and so i've just gone with the ISP supplied routers
<MartijnVdS> I'm considering getting a proper mini-itx box to handle the pppoe/fibre traffic and put the TP-Link router somewhere else, so wifi coverage in my hosue gets better
<daftykins> :)
<mungbean> http://boingboing.net/2013/08/17/cross-a-border-lose-your-eboo.html
<daftykins> will you not be tempted to get something 802.11ac soon enough?
<MartijnVdS> daftykins: yeah, the TP-Link Archer looks nice, but I don't want to compile openwrt-trunk to get support for its wifi chip ;)
<MartijnVdS> ..yet
<penguin42> hmm they do a version of that board with 12v DC input - that's almost tempting
<MartijnVdS> wha?
<penguin42> MartijnVdS: Instead of normal ITX psu
<daftykins> how would you run that? like an AC adapter - or from an existing PC?
<MartijnVdS> daftykins: anything supplying 12V with a big enough fuse ;)
<penguin42> from an AC adapter, but it means you can do fun things like battery backup easily or maybe even solar charging
<MartijnVdS> penguin42: stop tempting me! ;)
<penguin42> probably less likely to be useful on cable than DSL on the basis the street cabs probably will lose power if our house does
<mungbean> ok guys i have a quiz question, who wants to try and guess it?
 * penguin42 raises flipper
<mungbean> its related to the internet
<MartijnVdS> sure
<mungbean> does anyone remember...
<daftykins> D:
<mungbean> the competitor to ebay in the late 90s
<daftykins> the suspense is killing me
<daftykins> omg
<mungbean> tick
<mungbean> tock
<mungbean> tick
<mungbean> tock
<penguin42> they had a competitor?
<daftykins> before my time i think
<daftykins> lol +1 penguin42
<daftykins> my thoughts exactly
<mungbean> also in the 00s
<MartijnVdS> mungbean: ibazar?
<mungbean> i bet popey will get it
<MartijnVdS> mungbean: that existed in .nl, .fr, .be, .it, .es, .pt, .br and .se :)
 * penguin42 remembers everyone and their dog tried to do something similar afterwards
<mungbean> not the one i'mn thinking of but can't remember the name of :P
<mungbean> may have had a q in it
<mungbean> had a weird auction model if i remmeber rightly
<MartijnVdS> cqout?
<mungbean> QXL
<MartijnVdS> quibids?
<MartijnVdS> http://www.theguardian.com/technology/blog/2008/may/07/sofarewellthenqxlitsbeen
<mungbean> yep just reading that lol
<mungbean> QXL floated on the stock exchange, was briefly worth Â£2bn
<penguin42> really - heck
<mungbean> was sold for 1bn anyway CRAZY
<daftykins> O_O
<mungbean> in 1999 ebay and qxl were neck and neck for a bit in UK
<daftykins> i saw ebay was offering for me to LINK my paypal account the other day
<daftykins> at long last! two logins was silly
<mungbean> i'm gonna end up clicking that by accident
<penguin42> kind of makes sense for me on the basis that it's pretty much the only time I use paypal
<daftykins> penguin42: same here
<mungbean> probably need to double the length of my password just in case
<mungbean> to 20 chars
<mungbean> or 25
<daftykins> hehe
<mungbean> gonna be even bigger target
<daftykins> i'm such a big spender
<mungbean> although your email account is the holy grail i suppose
<daftykins> just bought a Â£3.50 acer laptop DC jack on ebay yesterday to hopefully revive a laptop
<mungbean> i bought a 1/4 - 1/8 reducing adaptor for airbrush Â£1.99
<mungbean> free postage
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> aww you beat me
<mungbean> because i can't spare 30 mins to drive to machine mart and find they don't have one
<mungbean> excuse the ropey picture quality, i just finished my latest model
<mungbean> http://i.imgur.com/1nWDPAv.jpg
<mungbean> masking tape and elastic band staying on overnight just in case
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> hand painted?
<mungbean> yes
<daftykins> wowzer
<daftykins> looks impressive
<mungbean> ta, it will look nicer with proper camera
<daftykins> *nod*
<penguin42> nice
<daftykins> i never had the patience when i got an airfix or two as a kid
<mungbean> its this kit, http://www.vintage-airfix.com/images/51101.jpg
<mungbean> wifey got it for quid or two in the chraity shop, makes a change from the WWII planes
<daftykins> :O
<daftykins> hehe
<penguin42> not very vintage :-)
<daftykins> ^
<mungbean> although i made this one too a few years back: http://i.imgur.com/ZAKLGs8.jpg
<penguin42> nice
<mungbean> got some vauxhall opel car spray from halfords for that paint job
<mungbean> its such an enjoyable antidote to computers
<daftykins> sounds it
<mungbean> guardian still reporting on http://www.theguardian.com/business/2013/aug/16/smartphone-fundraising-ubuntu-10m-dollars
<mungbean> not sure if on the dread tree thing too
<sebsebseb> penguin42: I think most LUG's are probably lacking women/girls.  Linux etc is mainly a male interest unfortunatly.
<sebsebseb> penguin42: and by a long way as well
<penguin42> yes unfortunately true
<sebsebseb> penguin42: yeah can be annoying at times that actsually in certian situtaiotns in general, but well I blame society etc
<sebsebseb> and I mean computing in gneral here
<penguin42> nod
<sebsebseb> penguin42: however  not thinking about stuff like that much  today
<sebsebseb> just glad SKy is getitng more competition
<sebsebseb> and Virgin getting those channels no problem to :)
<sebsebseb> BT Sport
<sebsebseb> I mean that SKy is getting proper competition starting to :)
 * penguin42 guesses sebsebseb is talking about some sport thing
<sebsebseb> penguin42: yep
<sebsebseb> penguin42: I  don't watch much Sport on TV, but  yeah
<penguin42> no I don't do any sport watching either (well maybe Snooker occasionally)
<sebsebseb> penguin42: yep football occasioanly for me and that's about it really
<sebsebseb> ,but this is interesting http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ESPN_%28UK%29 :)
<penguin42> interesting why?
<sebsebseb> penguin42: ESPN being bought out by BT Sport, and Virgin losing it for two weeks when thath appended, access to those channels, and things like that
<sebsebseb> penguin42: I remember when Virgin/Telewest didn't have Sky 1 a few years ago, because they coudn't make a deal with Sky at the time and they got aill silly
<sebsebseb> companies aye hmm
<sebsebseb> penguin42: Sky got silly above that is
<sebsebseb> channels are generaly worth millions
<sebsebseb> and maybe more sometimes, and these companies only really care about money really
<penguin42> yeh I guess that's teh thing with selling individual access to slots rather than just selling bitstreams
<sebsebseb> penguin42: no I mean channels generaly get sold
<sebsebseb> and then also  the content gets sold to channels
<sebsebseb> ,be it general channels, Sport, movies etc
<sebsebseb> ok maybe not so much BBC or ITV, but I mean the paid channels
<penguin42> sebsebseb: Yeh I mean the problem is the whole concept of channels - which you then have to sell as a chunk
<sebsebseb> penguin42: back computer issues
<sebsebseb> penguin42: with the amount of polotics etc that can be invovled when it comes to channels,  amazing their are so many  really   in this country etc
<penguin42> well most of them are pretty awful
<sebsebseb> money and  polotics as well to an extent, that's what it's about when it comes to that
<sebsebseb> penguin42: yeah most of them are pretty awful BBC 1 for example
<sebsebseb> and ITV
<sebsebseb> and channel 4 and channel 5
<sebsebseb> penguin42: your probably going to disagree with me here though :d
<sebsebseb> ,but I don't like most British TV shows, with the exceptions of documenteries
<sebsebseb> and some movies here and there
<sebsebseb> and watch TV for news to here and there
<sebsebseb> penguin42: more American TV shows person, which means watching channels such as Sky One
<sebsebseb> since they usually have the kind of shows I want to watch
<sebsebseb> penguin42: now then what did you mean by awful though  when it comes to that?
<penguin42> just stuff I don't want to watch, and things like advertising channels and ones that only show really really crap films
<sebsebseb> true thre are shoping channels
<sebsebseb> and some  channels that turning into gambling channels late in the night and such,  in fact  ITV or whatever is doing that now
<sebsebseb> channel 4  one of htem
<sebsebseb> penguin42: then get the old  TV channels to
<sebsebseb> I don't mean Film FOur when I say that, however they do show a lot of old films to
<sebsebseb> ,but also some better newer ones
<sebsebseb> depends
<sebsebseb> sometimes some forigin movies etc :)
<sebsebseb> penguin42: might watch this Australlian one later on tonight depends
<sebsebseb> that was on there   the other night
<sebsebseb> whenever it was
<sebsebseb> penguin42: what don't you want to watch?
<penguin42> sebsebseb: soap operas, dramas, sports, most comedy
<sebsebseb> penguin42: wehn you say bad fioms, do you mean low budget films or?  some low budge films are quite good :)
<penguin42> sebsebseb: Oh some low budget is good
<sebsebseb> penguin42: ok so you don't want to see Eastenders and uhmm  Downton Abbey and uhmmm  Britains got talent, and  X Factor and things like that?
<penguin42> sebsebseb: there seem to be ones though that only show films that are really bad plot
<sebsebseb> which channels do you have in mind for that one?
<sebsebseb> bad plots
<penguin42> I was thinking of Moves for Men
<sebsebseb> uh there's a channel fo rhat?
<sebsebseb> don't have that one if so
<penguin42> http://www.movies4men.co.uk/programs
<sebsebseb> penguin42: uhmm you got Sky?
<sebsebseb> or what?
<penguin42> maybe 1 in 10 of the films you've heard of
<sebsebseb> if so you get more channels than most
<sebsebseb> penguin42: as far as I know Sky has loads of well Sky cusotmers only channels, that the rest of us hardly know anything about,  except for big ones such as Sky Atlantic
<penguin42> sebsebseb: I only get Freeview here - so just free stuff
 * penguin42 is too mean to buy other channels
<sebsebseb> penguin42: what's a bit strange though
<sebsebseb> sometims what actsauly happens is this
<sebsebseb> Freeview get some channels, but  well nope they aren't on Virgin Media  which people are actsualy paying for hmm
<sebsebseb> penguin42: maybe happens more than I think for that one actsualy
<sebsebseb> you would of though a paid  TV service, would have all the free channels, plus more, but nope it seems
<sebsebseb> penguin42: site for that one nothing about Virgin
<penguin42> that's normally mostly the case although I seem to remember there used to be a few cases where some were missing
<sebsebseb> so  your channel not on Virgin
<sebsebseb> doesn't even mention Virgin
<sebsebseb> penguin42: CBS Action,  CBS drama I think, but others missing
<sebsebseb> weird sin't it
<penguin42> sebsebseb: but in the UK since most (but not all) people can get virgin it's not a big problem
<sebsebseb> penguin42: my piont is  Virgin should get all the channels freeview and free sat has, plus more really
<sebsebseb> where as Sky tends to have it all or pretty much
<penguin42> sebsebseb: I think there's a small difference between freesat and freeview as well
<sebsebseb> or it has it all really, ok so peole have to get BT Sport  Seperalty as in pay a subscriotn to BT for it if on SKy, but the channels i otherwise waiitng for that on SKy
<sebsebseb> yes free sat has some more or whatever it is
<sebsebseb> penguin42: really  in a way we need more  community run channels :d  think like open source, but for channels,  sadly  things aren't so simple for that one
<sebsebseb> and I mean with good shows to :d
<sebsebseb> reallly in a way we need more shows made for fun etc,  and movies, there are a few examples out there, but  I mean like Creative Commons music :d
<sebsebseb> penguin42: channels, and TV shows and films, it's all very commerical,  that's a big issue with it right there realy
<sebsebseb> penguin42: in fact as a result of that,  they somteims axe reasaobnly good  Sci Fi shows in America for example
<sebsebseb> and instead make more of  stuff that is cheaper to make
<penguin42> yeh not sure where the bulk of the cost goes these days
#ubuntu-uk 2013-08-18
<sebsebseb> Oddessy 5 axed after one series
<sebsebseb> Jake 2.0 with a main guy from the previosu show, axed after one series
<sebsebseb> Terra  Nova axed after one series
 * penguin42 never watched any of those
<sebsebseb> even though Steven Speilberg was behind that one and such
<sebsebseb> penguin42: Terra Nova made it onto Pick TV
<sebsebseb> what used to be Sky Three,  and now a Freeveiw channel as well etc
<sebsebseb> they tend to axe Sci Fi that's my point
<penguin42> ah yeh I sometimes watch Pick
<sebsebseb> or so it seems, and stuff like that
<penguin42> sebsebseb: I caught a thing called 'The Lost Room' on there a few weeks back - a nice odd little series
<sebsebseb> penguin42:  finnished off Terra Nova two years later on Pick, since first itme round when was going to watch it well....
<sebsebseb> penguin42: yeah   Sky use Pick to get people a taste of Sky 1 shows basically
<sebsebseb> Sky 1/2
<sebsebseb> and try and get you to get Sky
<sebsebseb> penguin42: however apparnatly that was also showing the two premiure league games and such earlier,  or at least on Freeview  etc,  when I put it on  it just showed normal Pick stuff, but  Sky 2 for the games etc
<sebsebseb> penguin42: I think Sky are slighlty worried about BT Sport, so they did that :d
<sebsebseb> they need some more proper competition in general realy :)  they monopolise like everything otherwise
<penguin42> is happy for them to monopolise sport; I don't care about it
<sebsebseb> no I don't care much about it either in general
<sebsebseb> ,but even so, they could do with more proper competiton when it comes to that
<sebsebseb> ideally I would like a proper movie channel to compete against Sky Movies, done in a similar way :)
<penguin42> sebsebseb: But it's being obsoleted by netflix etc
<sebsebseb> penguin42: I was just thinking Netflix to though
<sebsebseb> why do people go to DRM's Netflix?
<sebsebseb> simple since they don;t have Sky Movies
<sebsebseb> and that's a lot of people
<sebsebseb> well some might have it that do as well, but if you have good movie channels, your less likely to use some streaming service with DRM
<sebsebseb> surely?
<sebsebseb> why pay for boht?
<sebsebseb> penguin42: Netflix is annoying as a Linux user,  since the Silverlight issue
<penguin42> but aren't the sky movies etc drmd at the box/hdmi level?
<sebsebseb> yeah possbily,but that's differnet
<sebsebseb> that's a proper TV
<sebsebseb> your not watching stuff online usauly like that
<sebsebseb> penguin42: DRM isn't my issue with Netflix realy,  it's SIlveright
<sebsebseb> and so as a result not being LInux compatible
<sebsebseb> I do understnad why they  would want some kind of dRM on it htough
<penguin42> right but I can watch it on a suitably equipped TV - so no worse than any of the other things I need a TV for
<sebsebseb> ,but why does it have to be done with technology that isn't Linux  compatible?
<sebsebseb> penguin42: yep Netflix can be watched on a TV to, if you got what is needed for that
<sebsebseb> penguin42: oh any point buying an Ubuntu Edge at this late stage? nope I don't think so
<sebsebseb> looks like everyone is going to get re funded
<sebsebseb> unless there are like 20 hidden companies who are waiting for the end to  spend money on it or something
<sebsebseb> penguin42: to be honest I nearly bought one before, but I knew I probably woudn't have been able to , but trie anyway,    but knew probably woudn't work, since some Paypal issues
<penguin42> shrug
<sebsebseb> that's the other sucky thing about  the Edge, but that's the site for it really, having to use Paypal
<sebsebseb> penguin42: looks like it may not even end at 14 million, have you been following that at all?
<penguin42> sebsebseb: Only vaguely
<penguin42> sebsebseb: It's not something I'd buy, my phone cost about #80
<penguin42> sebsebseb: But it's good they've gone for a high spec design, it would be nice to see it made
<sebsebseb> penguin42: yep
 * penguin42 wonders which is faster, a 1GHz celeron or a 1.5GHz Atom
<daftykins> hmm
<daftykins> a modern sandy/ivybridge sort of celeron?
<penguin42> http://ark.intel.com/products/56056/
<penguin42> daftykins: In particular one of these: http://www.scan.co.uk/products/msi-c847ms-e33-intel-nm70-intel-celeron-847-ddr3-sata-iii-pcie-20-%28x16%29-d-sub-hdmi-matx
<penguin42> a lot cheaper than the mini-ITX I was considering earlier, big heatsink and in a normal PC chassis should cool well
<daftykins> mmm
<daftykins> 1.1GHz is wowzer low
<penguin42> dual core I think
<daftykins> just didn't think celery went that low :O
<daftykins> it's even got VT
<penguin42> I don't see anything stating power consumption of the board
<penguin42> yeh I noticed that!
<daftykins> mm 35nm proc too,
<daftykins> i wish ark.intel would just say which generation something was
<daftykins> granted you know on the i-series because they're numbered for the gen
<penguin42> at that price I'm tempted to just buy it and try
<daftykins> *nod*
<penguin42> can put it in an old PC case
<daftykins> wow a serial port :D
<penguin42> daftykins: Designed for shoving in things for control I guess
<penguin42> and hey that's useful
<daftykins> definitely
<penguin42> it's the 4 slots which really make i t - 2PCI, 2 PCIe
<daftykins> some cheaper AV receivers can be updated only over serial
<penguin42> so I can use two existing PCI network cards and can just buy two more PCIe ones
<penguin42> but then how silent a silent ATX psu can I get
<daftykins> you're going to want *some* airflow at least
<daftykins> even a tiny bit
<daftykins> i think zalman do some passive PSUs
<penguin42> maybe one with a very controllable fan
<brobostigon> good morning everyone,
<nucc1> does anyone know if it is possible to see the linux "console" in an amazon ec2 instance?
<mungbean> myfastforum is down :S
<popey> Afternoon
<penguin42> hey Popey
 * linuxliam is pondering buying a NAS buy i want to be able to run freeNAS on it
<linuxliam> but*
<shauno> sounds like a job for that hp microserver
<bigcalm> Good afternoon peeps :)
<popey> yo
<popey> bigcalm: fancy some mc?
<bigcalm> Sure :)
<popey> yay
 * daftykins wonders why people fail to use the third person in /me's
 * bigcalm I do all the time
<bigcalm> :P
<daftykins> how heavily flawed of you
 * bigcalm has no idea what you're talking about
<daftykins> uh-huh
<DJones> ok. wierdest advert/childs toy/game ever http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JDyOD1C67J0
<daftykins> O_O
<bigcalm> Oh my
<bigcalm> That's not nice
<DJones> Maybe if it becomes popular, we'll see gangs of kids chasing dogs around with pooper scoopers
<DJones> In the "Don't try this at home" type comments you get
<penguin42> DJones: That is very odd, I assume you're posting that as a reply to Popey's top trumps
<DJones> penguin42: Nope, you need to watch the youtube video link
 * penguin42 did
<DJones> Just saw it advertised on tv
<DJones> Just couldn't believe somebody would even think about turning it into a game
<daftykins> XD
<daftykins> it's like something the onion would do
 * penguin42 bets there is a patent on it
<popey> that Plop Trumps was quite fun
<popey> might bring plop trumps to beer train
<DJones> I wouldn't be too sure about that, you'd think whoever signed the application would be too ashamed/embarresed, they'd never have any 'street cred' again
<mungbean> someone has just sent me a 3gp video to my email address by mistake
<mungbean> unsure whether to click on it :S
<daftykins> O_O
<MartijnVdS> mungbean: is it "adult content"?
<daftykins> could be... risky
<linuxliam> using XML files to automatically change backgrounds works but the transitions are laggy
<linuxliam> any ideas
<moreati> mungbean: are you worried about legal implications or security exploits?
<moreati> if the latter play it in a throwaway VM
<mungbean> i dont wanna see something gross/rude
<popey> moreati: it probably won't play on linux, don't worry â»
<popey> forward it to me, I'll test it for you
<popey> \o/ weekly shop has arrived
<penguin42> it's a hard job but someone has to do it
<popey> No longer mother hubbard
<mungbean> i watched it
<daftykins> popey: fancy not having gone to assist :(
<mungbean> it was footage of some baptism service in the states.
<mungbean> adult africans getting baptised
<MartijnVdS> those poor people
<moreati> being American isn't so bad
<MartijnVdS> moreati: I wasn't talking about that part
<moreati> MartijnVdS: i know
<popey> daftykins: assist?
<daftykins> in said shopping sir
<daftykins> or do you get it delivered 0o
<daftykins> i keep forgetting the futuristic tech England has :(
<popey> by "arrived" I mean, it arrived at the door, I then disappeared from irc to assist in putting it away
<daftykins> my bad
<popey> love having it delivered
<mungbean> took a proper photo of my gromit model http://i.imgur.com/paxAHCU.jpg
<daftykins> nice mungbean :D
<popey> heh, nice
<mungbean> felt the mobile pic in the dark didn't do it justice
<popey> \o/ more stuff on ebay
<popey> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/281153465524?ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1555.l2649
<popey> getting rid of lots since being evicted
<mungbean> lol i have a lload of linux magazine i want rid of
<daftykins> evicted!?
<popey> yeah, some young upstarts kicked me out
<mungbean> Â£3 post is cheap
<popey> yeah, they're not that heavy
<daftykins> what kind of upstarts?
<popey> my kids
<popey> my office has been converted into a "play room"
<daftykins> :(
<daftykins> that sucks
<popey> yeah, for now
<popey> I'll turn the garage into an office though
<mungbean> mancave
<popey> indeed
<mungbean> cold and damp in winter though :(
<mungbean> and spiders
<popey> I don't think it'll be too bad
<daftykins> trying to help a friend run crystaldiskinfo on windows to check if a borked windows laptop is due to disk failure
<daftykins> why are people so bad at simple file management O_O
<mungbean> same reason my socks are on the bedroom floor
<daftykins> the floordrobe principle? how can that be O_O
<mungbean> wheres the cheapest place to buy gaviscon?
<mungbean> think i;ll try asda
<Laney> xnox: just got back
<Laney> did you win?
<xnox> Laney: long time ago =)
<Laney> heh
<xnox> Laney: i think i was in at 8pm something.
<xnox> Laney: also I had a tomato, cucumber, spring onion salad.
<xnox> something i didn't have for a week!
<xnox> Laney: did you have delays, or it just takes that long...?
<Laney> non leaves
<Laney> no, this all went to plan
<Laney> although i did decide to walk the last bit
<Laney> could have made a eurostar 1 hour earlier but my ticket was non flexi
<Laney> randomly met wookey & others at gare du nord though so it was ok
<xnox> Laney: yeah wookey had interesting schedule down other swiss villages instead of via lausane
<Laney> indeed
<Laney> now. bed for a week.
<Laney> just removed a huge spider that was on the verge of acquiring squatters rights to my bath
#ubuntu-uk 2014-08-11
<shauno> hm, I can't tell.  most things I try it shows me them once I'm logged in too, but then refuses to play them
<shauno> (specfically with "This title is not available in your current region. Please select a different title.", not just "whoops?")
<mapps> hey all
<knightwise> morning mapps
<skinns> hello I was wondering if someone could help explain to me how I compile this https://github.com/t3rm1n4l/megacmd/ on ubuntu
<skinns> I am a noob when it comes to linux
<skinns> but usually I just follow the commands given
<skinns> in this one it said make the make install but it didnt do anything
<skinns> would really appreciate it if someone could give me a hand
<mapps> hey knightwise
<mapps> sup
<mapps> ah that guys gone he didnt wit around
<knightwise> hey mapps
<knightwise> yep , he couldn't wait
<knightwise> morning dude , howareya
<mapps> im ok
<mapps> normal..ya self?
<mapps> :F
<mapps> :D
<knightwise> working from home today
<knightwise> builder is coming to do some work on our garden wall that fell down
<mapps> i might be moving to spain in september
<mapps> :D
<mapps> #for 6months
<mapps> waiting for the decisions
<mapps> id be working in gib living in spain!
<knightwise> cool
<knightwise> quite an impact on your routine.
<knightwise> Brb : Need to quickly shower
<mapps> :D
<mapps> only lookking at it because its 6months free accomodation
<mapps> so i wouldnt lose money
<Myrtti> http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p024096c
<knightwise> and good for your resume mapps
<mapps> same company
<mapps> :)
<knightwise> but always good for experience
<knightwise> and spanish girls
<mapps> ya
<mapps> and i can learn spanish
<mapps> si
<mapps> dos cerbezas por favor
<mapps> :D
<Myrtti> oh nice, I hadn't realise Jemima Kiss has her public key on her bio page on Guardian. I wonder which other reporters have that
<mapps> whos that
<Myrtti> Guardian Head of Technology
<Myrtti> "Jemima Kiss joined the Guardian in 2006 and now leads the Guardian's team covering tech trends, gadgets, gaming and startups - helping translate and demystify technology for a wider audience"
<Myrtti> She is a permanent fixture on the Tech Weekly podcast and sits on the British Journalism Review editorial board.
<Myrtti> A proud graduate of Dartington College of Arts, Jemima has covered technology and media online since 2002.
<Myrtti> Public key: OXF87DA69E
<mapps> oh
<JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Monday, and happy Ingersoll Day! :-D
<occia> anybody here?
<Myrtti> I saw a white rabbit run past about 5 minutes ago
<Myrtti> said something about needing to hurry
<occia> = =.nobody say Chinese here?
<Myrtti> I suppose everything is possible but the channel is mainly for Ubuntu enthusiasts with a connection to the United Kingdom
<Myrtti> well not for them, but habited by them
<occia> ok sorry ... I log in this at the 1st time and just find this is the UK channel
<Myrtti> nothing to be sorry about
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
<brobostigon> morning bigcalm
<davmor2> Mornig bigcalm
<davmor2> morning even
<popey> https://mvexel.github.io/thenandnow/#12/52.5794/-2.0797  check out that - wolverhamton on OSM, 2007 vs 2014
<knightwise> ha :)
<knightwise> just installed terminator on my mac :)
<davmor2> popey: nice
<knightwise> bless you homebrew :)
<davmor2> oh just came back across this thanks to absolute 80's wanting songs with chess piece in.  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JjTV8i_KjXM
<foobarry> when did something ever taste nicer because of new recipe?
<foobarry> was eating a ready meal and almost threw it away as i thought something was wrong
<foobarry> turns out new recipe
<diplo> popey, not looked at osm fora while... just checked my town.. quite updated now as well, I've made a few changes in the past
<diplo> And I've just found out we have a mosque... never knew that :)
<foobarry> what is OSM?
<diplo> open street map
<foobarry> ah
<foobarry> remeber that facebook thing
<foobarry> the name escapes me
<foobarry> the alternative faceboko
<diplo> Diaspora ?
<foobarry> i wanna say diptheria
<foobarry> thats is
<foobarry> whatever happened to diaspora? or did't happen i guess
<diplo> Still going afaik
<popey> yup, still going
<popey> that that anyone uses it
<Myrtti> or as I've affectionately called it for years "the social network nobody remembers unless someone mentions it first"
<popey> +1
<foobarry> i couldn't even remember the name anymore, its been that ong
<mapps> so windy here
<bigcalm> All them beans
<mapps> all them beans?
<mapps> :D
<mapps> pff
<mapps> one of my bins had moved ..i guess the wind moved it..although id have thought it would blow it over
<davmor2> mapps: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R6dm9rN6oTs
<mapps> argh
<mapps> fell asleep during the strain e3
<mapps> so gotta watch again
<Myrtti> http://imgur.com/gallery/V8yqWVN
<bigcalm> Haha
<bigcalm> Reddit appear to have several bots for different interests. Reddit Ruby (a thing for the Ruby language I think) favourite this tweet https://twitter.com/bigcalm/status/498564385200410624 Silly bot
<Azelphur> I am looking at this page re youtube bandwidth, http://www.whistleout.com.au/Broadband/Guides/Broadband-Usage-Guide#section-youtube is it just me or is the math totally wrong?
<Azelphur> eg on the 1080p, if you've used 62MB in 5 minutes, then that's 1.65mbit/sec, not 20+
<daftykins> Robin Williams :(
<shauno> I realise this is frowned upon in here, but .. wtf
<daftykins> ?
<daftykins> RW? yeah :(
<shauno> right
<daftykins> seriously sucky news
<Azelphur> I just noticed too D:
<diddledan> I concur with the "wtf"
#ubuntu-uk 2014-08-12
<mapps> morning all
<knightwise> hey mapps
 * knightwise is downloading some brilliant ambient soundscapes from youtube to fall asleep to :) 
<mapps> aphex twin = -film
<mapps> :P
<mapps> best
<ali1234> "Skrillex posted this song on FB a little while ago saying it was his favorite song."
<ali1234> hahahahaha
<ali1234> master troll
<mapps> what song?:D
<ali1234> flim
<mapps> oh really
<mapps> aphex twin film is amazing tho
<ali1234> yes but skrillex fans will hate it, which is funny to me
<mapps> i guess hes got crazy groupie type fans
<mapps> that hang on his every word?
<ali1234> yeah, you could say that
<neuro> oh good, ppa is borked :(
<SuperMatt> which ppa?
<bigcalm> Is it me, or are the ubuntu.com servers a little unavailable this morning?
<bigcalm> Oh and
<bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<dutchie> morning bigcalm and brobostigon
<dutchie> we're having datacentre issues at work, not sure if ubuntu.com is running out of the same ones
<dutchie> popey tweeted about an outage
<brobostigon> morning dutchie
<DJones> Get your tinfoil hat out, suggestions on reddit are a DoS attack http://www.reddit.com/r/Ubuntu/comments/2dbhcz/ubuntu_archive_repos_down/ Can't see that myself, probably just popey kicked the mains lead out while hoovering his office
<bigcalm> Sounds about right for him
<dutchie> looks back up for me anyway
<dutchie> can't say the same for our servers :(
<popey> heh
<JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Vinyl Record Day! :-D
<bigcalm> Does anybody experience a double paste sometimes when clicking the middle mouse button?
<popey> i do not
<popey> but i dont use a mouse, but touch thing
<bigcalm> Ah, the nipple :)
<bigcalm> It may be my mouse becoming iffy
<bigcalm> Well, the wheel's micro switch
<awilkins> Shift-insert usually does the same thing
<awilkins> If you are going to paste and then type it may be quicker as well
<bigcalm> Two different buffers
<bigcalm> ctrl-c is separate from highlighting
<bigcalm> Shift-insert will paste the buffer from ctrl-c
<awilkins> Hmm, I thought it was for the select buffer
<bigcalm> I just tested and shift-insert gave me the same result as ctrl-v
<awilkins> Yes, it does
<bigcalm> thethethethethethethethethethethethethethe the the the thttthethethethethethethethethethethethehehe e
<bigcalm> Oops :)
<awilkins> Da doo doo doo, da daa daa daa, is all I have to say to _you_.
<popey> chris wadddle
<foobarry> http://www.wired.com/2014/08/i-liked-everything-i-saw-on-facebook-for-two-days-heres-what-it-did-to-me/
<foobarry> dunno why facebook can't just show me everything
<foobarry> so i get to choose
<popey> their argument is that your timeline would be flooded
<popey> you wouldn't be able to keep up
<SuperMatt> I can't keep up anyway
<SuperMatt> I can't keep up with my own social life *outside* of facebook
<popey> well, like twitter, i have no hope of reading every tweet in my timeline
<SuperMatt> you just need a PA like Mr Fry to do it all for you
<davmor2> SuperMatt: you have a social life
<SuperMatt> I do!
<SuperMatt> I'm actually looking forward to not doing anything on saturday
<davmor2> SuperMatt: are you sure it's not your partners social life and you tag along ;)
<dutchie> hmmm
<SuperMatt> I don't have a partner
<SuperMatt> I'm looking for one though
<dutchie> am i misremembering or does apt save the maintainer scripts after installing them
<SuperMatt> we're talking about dance partners, right?
<dutchie> if so, anyone happen to know where it puts them?
<SuperMatt> it's in the same location with .dpkg-something on the end, I think
<dutchie> i mean the scripts themselves
<dutchie> postinst etc
<SuperMatt> oh
<SuperMatt> I know they're in /var somewhere
<dutchie> yeah, that's where i'm looking
<dutchie> can't seem to find them anywhere
<SuperMatt> /var/lib/dpkg
<dutchie> aha, /info in there
<dutchie> ty
<SuperMatt> np
<SuperMatt> info is a weird name for it tho
 * bigcalm logs into parents' home server...
<bigcalm> New release '14.04.1 LTS' available.
<bigcalm> Run 'do-release-upgrade' to upgrade to it.
<bigcalm> \o/
<awilkins> "Here be Dragons."
<awilkins> "Rarr"
<bigcalm> Quite. I'm not doing a release upgrade remotely. It can wait until I visit them next
<ali1234> gmail removed the features where you can send from a non-gmail domain through gmail servers
<ali1234> now you have to have a smtp server to send through
<ali1234> so here's my question
<ali1234> all the emails on my domain are forwards
<ali1234> they all forward the mail to gmail
<ali1234> the domain provider doesn't allow you to log in to the smtp server unless you create mailboxes
<ali1234> so i made a mailbox postmaster@domain.com
<ali1234> so then i can put postmaster's login details into gmail and send from any address @domain.com
<ali1234> but is this going to land me in spam filters?
<foobarry> popey: some complaints about the rudder of the toy plane thing
<popey> yeah, i have seen some
<foobarry> others enjoy it
<popey> i bought 2 â»
<awilkins> That reminds me ; http://edtracker.org.uk/  (knight's move thinking, flight related)
<foobarry> u can only fly 1 at time
<awilkins> Charge one while the other flies ?
<foobarry> looks like the kickstarters are everyone's beta testers
<popey> i only plan to fly one at a time â»
<popey>  /48
<popey> bah
<mapps> hi all
<mapps> anyone know if an orange locked iphone works with orange in other countries
<mapps> like can i use an orange spain sim
<ali1234> i dunno but i can probably find out...
<ali1234> you might have to wait a couple of hours
<mapps> i googled and couldnt find anything:(
<mapps> hope it does
<ali1234> i have contacts...
<mapps> then i dont need to worry about unlocking:D
<ali1234> 2nd hit on google: http://www.expatforum.com/expats/spain-expat-forum-expats-living-spain/68707-mobile-phone-sim-cards.html
<ali1234> tl;dr it doesn't work
<ali1234> if it's only Â£20 to unlock then just get it unlocked
<ali1234> otoh this one says it should work: http://www.andalucia.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=35&t=30340
<ali1234> then someone else says it doesn't :/
<ali1234> on balance looks like no
<ali1234> you have to consider that orange UK is now EE, orange espana is france telecom
<ali1234> so they're probably not related at all any more
<mapps> ah
<mapps> thanks
<daftykins> hello mr.mapps
<daftykins> afternoon all \o
<mapps> yello
<mapps> whats uo
<mapps> up
<daftykins> mmm not too much going on here, took apart my keyboard today as it was driving me spare dropping keys all the time
<daftykins> https://www.dropbox.com/sh/rpfqi4xz9nxgx5j/AACAxEkpRRGQQnM2Lruz1Sira
<daftykins> first 5 pics
<awilkins> At least it's easy to put the caps back on...
<daftykins> sure is
<daftykins> for the main body of keys anyway, the ones with the wire i didn't touch :> (thoug those were actually from a totally different day weeks ago)
<daftykins> it was driving me spare though, i'd have to sit there pressing some keys over 5 times to get them to register once
<daftykins> which made logging in a serious pain
<walid> Hi everyone! Is there any method to join the homegroup network (windows) on ubuntu? I'm using 14.04
<walid> Not samba. Didn't work for me
<daftykins> lol homegroups.
<mapps> heh
<mapps> people never wait eh
<daftykins> indeed
<mapps> ask and then when no answer after 2mins..gone
<mapps> D;':D
<mapps> argh
<mapps> i planned on going and getting some euros today but couldnt be bothered
<mapps> tempted to order them online:)
<shauno> people still do that?  I just use an ATM
<Myrtti> getting money out of an ATM is more expensive than paying by card, but not all shops take cards.
<daftykins> my hairdressers just today was cash only :>
<daftykins> no appointments place \o/
<popey> i dont think I've paid for a haircut ever
<popey> maybe once or twice
<popey> \o/ hairdressers in the family
<daftykins> hehehe
<daftykins> i don't go too often, what with... https://www.dropbox.com/s/xyzjbvpjsa6hlm9/IMG_20140807_050231.jpg
<diddledan> daftykins: \o/
<daftykins> 8D
<diddledan> daftykins: is that the front of the back? :-p
<diddledan> or*
<daftykins> front hehehe, i just got it chopped back to around shoulder length though
<diddledan> cute kitty in the corner I see
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> would you like a closeup?
<diddledan> sure
<daftykins> https://www.dropbox.com/s/a5gzb8cafw1n2m7/IMG_20140304_155544.jpg
<daftykins> there's her 'helping' me type
<diddledan> nawwww
<diddledan> bless
<diddledan> :-)
<diddledan> cats are the best
<daftykins> ;D
<daftykins> here's video of her hating my bike gloves
<daftykins> https://www.dropbox.com/s/085j0m1tlkvurut/VID_20140713_024222.mp4
<diddledan> I think my chrome is busted again - silly os x preview releases
<daftykins> d'aww
<mapps> cats
<mapps> shauno,  taking money out on card costs money
<mapps> fees and that
<mapps> :
<mapps> :(
<daftykins> gotta run, fix your cat restraints, diddledan!
<diddledan> tata
<mapps> ;]
<popey> wow
<popey> i never had daftykins down as a hippie!
<smittix> Evening all
<diddledan> do the hippie hippie shake
<smittix> evening diddledan
<diddledan> allo
<smittix> How goes?
<diddledan> not bad ta
<smittix> Coolio
<diddledan> think I need to reboob
<smittix> Think I need to sort out why my battery is going down 1% every 2 minutes
<diddledan> ouch
<smittix> Yeah
<smittix> :(
<smittix> Fresh install
<smittix> diddledan: I think it's the Nvidia Optimus
<smittix> Using the Nouveau driver at the minute.
<ali1234> %1 every 2 minutes is still 200 minutes
<ali1234> over 3 hours
<smittix> It's going down at a faster rate now
<smittix> All I have is a terminal window open.
<diddledan> smittix, yeah the optimus is a pain
<smittix> I've just installed the Nvidia driver
<davmor2> smittix: nvidia has better battery than nouveau. but on battery unless you are playing games you might want to open nvidia settings and switch over to intel so you only use one gpu
<davmor2> battery management that should of read
<smittix> davmor2: Just done that :)
<smittix> Let's see how it goes.
<smittix> Thanks
<smittix> It was on 100% at 7:15
<smittix> It's now at 69%
<diddledan> I wonder how accurate that is - my UPS is reading an input voltage of 248V
<diddledan> which seems pretty high for a country that specs things at 240 and is supposed to have a network of 230V
<smittix> :/
<diddledan> europe is 220 I believe which means the old standard of 240 meant more difficult to share load between the mainland and blighty so they reduced britain's nominal to 230
<smittix> Never knew that.
<diddledan> everything still says 240 on it tho
<diddledan> or sometimes 220
<diddledan> but the nominal is supposed to be 230 so europe is below the nominal and britain is above but tolerences are close enough that they can share
<diddledan> yey for having an engineer as a dad :-p
<smittix> heh
<diddledan> he started off in telly-mending so he needed to know things like the nominal input voltages
<diddledan> those were the days when nobody owned their own telly
<smittix> ah yes
<diddledan> valves/vacuum tubes meant that every tv on the books likely needed a service visit every 6 months on average
<diddledan> welcome to #broadcast-engineering :-p
<smittix> heh
<smittix> Well at least my WD-Mycloud works nicely
<smittix> For the money I wasn't expecting much
<diddledan> \o/
<smittix> Rythmbox found all my music auto-magically :D
<diddledan> I decided to rip the hdd out of my mybook-live (the previous generation to the mycloud)
<smittix> Yeah I did the same to some other non-networked WD drives
<diddledan> how on earth did I get a hair stuck between my teeth?!
<shauno> the 230v thing is mostly imaginary
<shauno> we used to be 240v Â±6%.  now we're 230v -6% / +10%.  the voltage hasn't actually changed, just redefined so that the continent's 220 falls within tolerance
<diddledan> don't you just love semantics?
<shauno> it shows?  ;)
<diddledan> ok, does anyone know what the various efi binaries are that get installed by grub-efi on trusty? namely grubx64.efi, MokManager.efi and shimx64.efi
<diddledan> I assume grubx64 is the grub core itself
<diddledan> so I'm wondering what the other two are
<diddledan> I think the shimx64 is used for uefi signed booting
<smittix> Anyone know which version of Java to use for Minecraft?
<diddledan> smittix, 7 should be fine
<smittix> Open or Oracle/
<diddledan> try with openjdk first because it's opensource
<foobarry> sometimes our datacentre vokltage goes to 208v
<diddledan> foobarry, ouch
<foobarry> the UPS kicks in when that happens
<diddledan> foobarry, that's almost at brownout level, isn't it?
<foobarry> it's because some eejits put in a power "perfecter"
<foobarry> some voodoo about saving money by reducing voltage
<diddledan> o_O
<shauno> 208 is the nominal voltage for three-phase.  that's a suspicious number to land on
<diddledan> foobarry, a commercial version of the vphase thingy?
<foobarry> except the lifts and monitors stoped working properly
<foobarry> i dunno what a vaphse is.
<diddledan> http://www.vphase.co.uk/
<foobarry> but they do it to reduce voltage
<foobarry> and its bad for server rooms and ac
<foobarry> ac units
<shauno> (and lowering voltage usually won't achieve much savings - with less volts, you just draw more amps to achieve the same actual work (watts))
<diddledan> shauno, but they're cleaner amps :-p
<diddledan> shauno, you need to wash them first
<SuperEngineer> Has Linus Torvalds had a tiff with BBC News - latest kernel [for 14.04] downloaded this morning via software updater - no contact with any BBC News site in Firefox, Chromium or Liferea [RSS reader]
<diddledan> err
<SuperEngineer> previous kernel - all ok [just checked]
<diddledan> Linus Torvalds affects Ubuntu?
<SuperEngineer> diddledan: apparently so
<shauno> curious, after you checked, did you go back to the new kernel and try again?
<diddledan> and here I was assuming it was all south african
<SuperEngineer> yup
<SuperEngineer> same result
<SuperEngineer> .32 oh, .33 not ok
<SuperEngineer> *ok
<diddledan> ok, I'm on .32 atm
<diddledan> I could reboob to check the new kernel but I can't be bothered :-p
<shauno> pft.  be bothered.
 * SuperEngineer thinks he might also be if no cure ;)
<smittix> Which version SuperEngineer ?
<SuperEngineer> smittix: version of what?
<smittix> Kernel
<davmor2> diddledan: I think you boob enough on this channel without the need to reboob
<SuperEngineer> smittix: hang on - I'll just go get the full number
<SuperEngineer> 3.13.0-33
<smittix> Ah
<SuperEngineer> [all ok on 3.13.0-32]
<smittix> Working fine for me :)
<SuperEngineer> smittix: that makes me feel soooo much better :D
<smittix> heh
<SuperEngineer> ooo - got an idea - I'll boot to ..32 first - download anything thing I want to - switch back to ...33 after
<SuperEngineer> it would be a simple plan but just found other stuff is naffed as well [e.g facebook access in Firefox & Chromium]
<smittix> strange
<SuperEngineer> ...and that still works in ...32
<SuperEngineer> strange = wtf  ;)
<SuperEngineer> time to reject kernel methinks and go back to ...32
<SuperEngineer> hope there weren't too many security fixes in it!
<smittix> I have noticed I get this alot when installing things though "Unknown media type in type 'all/all'"
<SuperEngineer> ah hah!
<SuperEngineer> that's because you're being to specific :D
<smittix> Unknown media type in type 'all/allfiles'
<smittix> Unknown media type in type 'uri/mms'
<smittix> Unknown media type in type 'uri/mmst'
<smittix> Unknown media type in type 'uri/mmsu'
<smittix> Unknown media type in type 'uri/pnm'
<smittix> Unknown media type in type 'uri/rtspt'
<SuperEngineer> crikes!
<smittix> No idea what all that is.
<SuperEngineer> did that happen on .32 ?
<SuperEngineer> or only .33 ?
<smittix> Only .33
<SuperEngineer> hmmmmm
<SuperEngineer> #kernel_bug   !!!!
<SuperEngineer> Oi - Linus!!! you get on this channel!
 * SuperEngineer takes cover
 * smittix hides
<diddledan> omgzor the bbc are heralding the imminent end of the world: http://www.bbc.com/news/business-27974877
<smittix> Is that link just to tease SuperEngineer
<diddledan> yes, yes it is :-po
<SuperEngineer> if it is - the beeb forgot I can remove the kernel & revert to a working one!  :D
<smittix> All hidden files are unhidden too :( even when I ctrl H it still reverts back to unhiding everything in nautilus.
<SuperEngineer> smittix: perhaps I'm not the only one who needs to revert
<smittix> heh
<foobarry> anyone recommend a charger for a phone like the moto G?
<foobarry> had some patchy experience with chargers
<smittix> I'm an iPhone slave I'm afraid.
<SuperEngineer> btw diddledan - I need to reboot to previous kernel to see that page - thanks for the link though :)
<SuperEngineer> my version..  the bbc are heralding the imminent end of the .33 kernel in Ubuntu 14.04
<smittix> ;D
<SuperEngineer> Oh - just thought of a q/ if I reboot into .32 & remove the .33 will I get nagged to update it, will it update to .34 when it comes out if I am on .32
<SuperEngineer> ?
 * SuperEngineer ponders
<SuperEngineer> now finding other faults!  to heck with it - back to .32
<SuperEngineer> ttfn
<smittix> well the Nvidia driver did the trick.
<smittix> Still have 2hrs left.
<SuperEngineer> ok! successfully back on .32 kernel - someone please reminf d me when it's updated to .34!
<SuperEngineer> [forced to remove "linux-image-generic" as well
 * SuperEngineer thinks - let's try that kernel on Xbuntu mini & Lubuntu netbook... watch this space
<SuperEngineer> hmmm... working ok on Xubuntu
<mapps> i like xubuntu
<mapps> :D
<diddledan> SuperEngineer, could it be related to networking and/or dns?
<SuperEngineer> diddledan: maybe - that's Xubuntu down in the same way!
<SuperEngineer> safe to assume I'll find the same on Lubuntu
<SuperEngineer> really is a cock up
<SuperEngineer> *this kernel really is a cockup
<SuperEngineer> [or, of course, it's simply Linus proving his hatred of Ubuntu]
<SuperEngineer> ...but how did it get into a LTS release?
<SuperEngineer> ...  ^^  the REAL question
<ali1234> maybe it's the same reason why half of canonical went offline this morning?
<SuperEngineer> ali1234: whoops!
<ali1234> i'm kinda like "meh" about updating now
<ali1234> do you have exotic hardware?
<SuperEngineer> perhaps we all need to give up up our full time jobs & spend more time testing for them
<ali1234> all the flavours use the same kernel btw
<SuperEngineer> [ /me actually used a weeks leave for testing 12.04 prior to release ]
<SuperEngineer> ...I blame myself for takin a week off each update! - âI am to blame!
<SuperEngineer> ;)
<ali1234> i just use the development version
<SuperEngineer> ali1234: I read that as "I"m alright Jack"
<ali1234> but having switched to xubuntu there's not much point
<ali1234> xfce releases like once every two years...
<ali1234> the development version is pretty much the opposite of that... it breaks all the time
 * SuperEngineer releases every single morning! no constipation here!
<SuperEngineer> [that would look better if had appeared directly beneath your previous}  ;)
<SuperEngineer> BREAKING NEWS: having removed  the .33 due fail in so many ways - an idea occurred to me
<SuperEngineer> reinstalled it - only difference this time was that I also selected "linux-generic" in synaptic [noticed it was not in list last time]  - all now [so far] ok - back on .33
<SuperEngineer> ...and minutes later- all fails again - what the hewck is going on here!?
<SuperEngineer> [no bbc rss - no facebook - ndoesn't matter which application being used... something ain't right !
<SuperEngineer> why work first time - then not work afeter>
<SuperEngineer> *after
<SuperEngineer> has the rest of the world gone as crazy as I am??
<SuperEngineer> What has the BBC and Facebook got in common that as this update - complete fail???
<diddledan> ipv6?
<SuperEngineer> diddledan: now there's an idea!
<SuperEngineer> could it be a tinternet protocol prob me wonders?
<shauno> hm, I don't get a v6 address for bbc's feeds.  try "host feeds.bbci.co.uk"  ?
<SuperEngineer> shauno: just tried that - google comes up with a list but none get to destination
<diddledan> google?
<diddledan> o_O
<diddledan> it was a command not a search query afaict
<SuperEngineer> feeds.bbci.co.uk is an alias for news.bbc.co.uk.edgesuite.net.
<SuperEngineer> news.bbc.co.uk.edgesuite.net is an alias for a1733.g.akamai.net.
<SuperEngineer> a1733.g.akamai.net has address 213.120.157.34
<SuperEngineer> a1733.g.akamai.net has address 213.120.157.98
<diddledan> and `traceroute 213.120.157.34`?
<SuperEngineer> which leaves me going "que?"
<diddledan> akamai is a CDM
<diddledan> CDN
<diddledan> what does the traceroute give you?
<SuperEngineer> traceroute ain't installed! sob
<diddledan> try tracepath then
<SuperEngineer> thought it was part of standard network tools
<SuperEngineer> tracepath
<SuperEngineer> [sorry wrong screen]
<SuperEngineer>  1?: [LOCALHOST]                                         pmtu 1500
<SuperEngineer>  1:  api.home                                             74.786ms
<SuperEngineer>  1:  api.home                                             90.287ms
<SuperEngineer>  2:  esr6.reading4.broadband.bt.net                       45.829ms !H
<SuperEngineer>      Resume: pmtu 1500
 * popey hugs mtr
<diddledan> ooh, I didn't know that was defaultinstalled these days
<ali1234> so.......
<ali1234> is it totally dead or just really slow?
<SuperEngineer> sorry.. been watching it run - worst irs a 10% loss on one of the hops
<SuperEngineer> irs=is
<ali1234> could be a mtu/fragmentation issue
<ali1234> if small packets go through but whole webpages fail, and only on certain sites, this is likely the issue
<dogmatic69> any one notice subtle changes to mouse over the last while?
<SuperEngineer> agreed - also lookingt some there is *massive* difference best & worst times
<dogmatic69> right click selects on mouseup since a few weeks ago, and I have issues on reddit RES where clicking does a double click for example
<ali1234> so looking at the diff between .32 and .33 there's only like 4 patches
<ali1234> and one is "net: fix UDP tunnel GSO of frag_list GRO packets"
<ali1234> http://kernel.ubuntu.com/git?p=ubuntu/ubuntu-trusty.git;a=commit;h=0930bd6f0f7d3050b9216b94161445c46178bfc3
<SuperEngineer> but the diff between 29 & 287???
<ali1234> 29 and 287?
<SuperEngineer> sorry - took the wrong meaninfg from that ali1234
<ali1234> 	UBUNTU: Ubuntu-3.13.0-32.57 -> UBUNTU: Ubuntu-3.13.0-33.58 - those are the two versions you tried right?
<SuperEngineer> I was looking at ms - you were looking at kernels :D
<ali1234> yeah i usually find it helps. anyway my money's on that patch
<ali1234> it's something to do with GRO packets, which afaik are involved in path discovery
<SuperEngineer> I present the evidence m'lud - it all started immediately after the update m'lud
<ali1234> well there's literally only 4 patches so you could do a bisect
<SuperEngineer> the prosecution requests the update be convicted & punished to the maximum extent allowable m'lud
<SuperEngineer> [cries from the gallery of "hang the b*****d!"]
<ali1234> you could also try vanilla kernels
<ali1234> some of which probably have that patch
<ali1234> http://kernel.ubuntu.com/~kernel-ppa/mainline/
<SuperEngineer> well - at least that link gets there!  :D
<disf> hi
<ali1234> also try just manually lowering your MTU
<disf> i have to open port for vpn?
<SuperEngineer> ali1234: it's lucky I know what you mean by that! [could be worrying otherwise] ;-)
 * diddledan pulls SuperEngineer 's MTUs down
 * diddledan points and laughs
<SuperEngineer> YIKES!!!!
<disf> someone?
<SuperEngineer> draughty here, ain't it
<disf> i have to open port for vpn?
<ali1234> disf: it depends whether you are the client or server
<disf> ali1234: i have 2 laptops  that i want to connect together
<disf_> hi
<disf_> some here??
<disf_> to
<disf_> how i can connect 2 laptops??
<disf_> someone can help me?
<disf_> please
<SuperEngineer> disf_: just off to bed - saw your q so 1st question is: are you attempting peer to peer??? [please say no]
<disf_> SuperEngineer: i think i need a connection
<SuperEngineer> via a router?
<disf_> no, something like vpn so i can make like "LAN" but without to be in the same room
<SuperEngineer> ssh?
#ubuntu-uk 2014-08-13
<daftykins> popey: lol you best update your records on me as "chap what has quite some hair"
<diddledan> daftykins, hippieism is good for a geek :-p
<daftykins> ooh i dunno!
<daftykins> diddledan: sir check out the local rag - https://www.dropbox.com/s/f4j2iivt1j0urxc/IMG_20140812_224826.jpg
<diddledan> can someone confirm that I'm not barmy? trying to login to ubuntu software centre via various methods such as "turn on recommendations" or "reinstall past purchases" I get an error from the single sign-on dialog that it gets a 404 from the ubuntu one server
<diddledan> obviously "not barmy" is a bit of a misnomer because it's obvious that I am somewhat barmy
<daftykins> ;D
<daftykins> wish i could help sir but i don't think i can reproduce on windoze?
<diddledan> hehe
<diddledan> yeah I guess I should have highlighted the pre-requisite that you gotta be running ubuntu
<diddledan> :-p
<daftykins> i just figured we were the last two awake and i didn't want you to go unanswered ;_;
<diddledan> aww, how kind of you ;-)
<daftykins> ^_^
<diddledan> I guess shauno might be around, but he's on os x usually
<diddledan> mapps, ?
<diddledan> other than that I guess all asleep
<daftykins> tell you what, if you know any domains they're hitting i could try and check them?
<diddledan> it goes to an oauth endpoint at https://one.ubuntu.com/oauth/sso-finished-so-get-tokens/my@email-address.com?some-random-query-variables
<diddledan> I suppose I should point out that I genericated that a bit
<daftykins> o rly
<diddledan> speak of the devil
<daftykins> apache 2.2.22 0o
<diddledan> o_O
<diddledan> wow
<diddledan> aren't we supposed to be on 2.4 these days?
<diddledan> aah 2.2.22 is from precise (12.04)
<daftykins> D:
<daftykins> diddledan: http://i.imgur.com/HgXazWT.jpg
<diddledan> guess canonical aren't dogfooding :-p
<diddledan> haha, was that a response to dogfooding?
<shauno> "correct and correct"  (awake but don't use ubuntu on the desktop)
<daftykins> diddledan: nah you said that after, here XD
<daftykins> shauno: why ever not sir!?
<daftykins> oh you don't
<daftykins> don't mind me, i have too much Guinness in me
<diddledan> hic
<daftykins> ^
<diddledan> no wait, that was you, not me
<daftykins> it was an echo
<diddledan> :-D
<diddledan> I'm hungry
<ur1caao> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a8v-gM50QY0
<ur1caao> wrong channel
<diddledan> has anyone managed to get "desktop sharing" to work with a vnc client? I don't seem to get any redraws
<diddledan> I figure it hasn't worked since composited X11 came along, which means years. why hasn't anyone actually fixed it yet or has nobody noticed that since 2012 it's been broken?
<MartijnVdS> http://www.anandtech.com/show/8376/intel-disables-tsx-instructions-erratum-found-in-haswell-haswelleep-broadwelly
<MartijnVdS> oops
<DoloresUmbridge> morning
<Guest60018> hu akk
<Guest60018> ]all
<mapps> hi all
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<foobarry> diddledan: x2go works for me for desktop sharing
<foobarry> not exactly an answer to your qu. but its quite smooth
<OERIAS> Is there a way for ubuntu to hide certain folders ?
<nigelb> start the name with a .
<DoloresUmbridge> that works for filenames too.
<smittix> Morning
<JamesTait> Good morning all; happy International Lefthanders Day! :-D
<foobarry> \o
<bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
<DoloresUmbridge> hiya bigcalm
<popey> yo
<bigcalm> Happy new keyboard day :D
<awilkins> Ooh, which keyboard?
<bigcalm> http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B00F1DOUXY/
 * awilkins has an _old_ keyboard
<awilkins> Holy toledo that's an expensive Cherry-keyboard-with-USB-hub
<awilkins> Have an old one of these at work
<awilkins> http://www.amazon.co.uk/Cherry-Quality-Action-Keyboard-G80-3000LSCGB-2/dp/B0041KJKAG
<awilkins> Have a vintage Model M at home
<bigcalm> I spend my life at the computer, decided  that it was worth the expense
<awilkins> If it fails I'll try to get another or maybe shell out for a Unicomp
<awilkins> Oh, quite
<bigcalm> I have a Unicomp IBM Model M on my shelf now - it's what I was using prior to this one
<awilkins> Decided a long time ago that screen, keyboard, mouse are the components that survive multiple computers and you may as well shell out for the best
<awilkins> Would be interested to see how the Unicomp ones compare to the vintage ones
<awilkins> Any reason why you switched to the Das?
<awilkins> I love my model M
<bigcalm> My fingers were getting tired
<awilkins> I suppose the Cherry switches do have a lighter touch
<awilkins> And a different click
<bigcalm> Did some research on cherry mx switches and chose to go brown
<awilkins> I think mine are blues
<awilkins> I spilt smoothie in it the other day and had to pry off the caps
<bigcalm> Yeah, my wife was getting fed up of the clicking
<bigcalm> You can buy my Unicomp kb if you want ;)
<bigcalm> Actually, I have 2. The company sent me a US layout 1st by mistake
<bigcalm> THE QUICK BROWN FOX JUMPS OVER THE LAZY DOG
<bigcalm> Oops :)
<popey> bigcalm: ooh! you have a unicomp?
<awilkins> Oh dear
<awilkins> The new nvidia drivers appear to have brought a fun bug with them
<bigcalm> popey: 2 :P
<joshua__> Hey guys.
<awilkins> My mouse pointer is stuck in the left-right resize form
<awilkins> And now it can't escape from the right-hand monitpr
<awilkins> Or click on things
<joshua__> I want to cache DNS locally on some ubuntu servers, first hit should query the internal BIND dns server and then something like dnsmasq should cache the response for a set amount of time. Sounds sane?
<awilkins> Ok, it was Spotify
<awilkins> But an app shouldn't be able to trap your pointer like that <growls at the X server>
<awilkins> joshua__, Doesn't this already happen?
<bigcalm> Ooo, 5 red arrows just flew over
<awilkins> joshua__, I know the desktop distribution runs dnsmasq and uses it to cache DNS hits out of the box
 * awilkins fires up his server VM to check that too
<joshua__> hmm, server doesn't seem to be doing that..
<awilkins> Nope, isn't running dnsmasq
<joshua__> So I setup dnsmasq to listen on 127.0.0.1 and in the config file put my upstream DNS servers to query?
<joshua__> sorry, being lazy here really
<smittix_> Hi all, have a bit of a problem. Currently trying UbuntuGnome and when I install the nvidia drivers it doesn't go past the encryption password input box. If I purge nvidia* everything works as it should.
<Laney> why's everyone discovering the tuesday printing bug today?
<popey> Laney: front of hackernews
<popey> https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8171956
<foobarry> i used OOo for years on ubuntu every day
<foobarry> now LO of course
<foobarry> oh, old bugs
<popey> [Wed Aug 13 13:19:53.332166 2014] [authz_core:error] [pid 9671:tid 140029791811328] [client 213.104.208.104:33703] AH01630: client denied by server configuration: /var/www/
<popey> bah!
<popey> http://146.185.188.87/index.html 403... but it's owned by www-data ...
<popey> \o/ fixored
 * popey hugs stackoverflow
<popey> especially when they have ubuntu screenshots in them â»
<popey> http://stackoverflow.com/questions/18392741/apache2-ah01630-client-denied-by-server-configuration
<Azelphur> Are there any remote desktop systems that don't suck? I tried splashtop but the package in the repositories is broken, nomachine works "great": https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/3832397/screenshots/2014/Aug/Screenshot_2014-08-13-03-59-28.png, VNC is slow, x11rdp is a bitch to install and crashes on connection for me anyway xD
<davmor2> Wow that makes a change, works with Windows mac and Linux http://www.zead.co.uk/default.asp?Page=14&Categories=1
<foobarry> x2go WFM
<davmor2> oh and better still http://zead.co.uk/docs/Z-200_User_Guide.pdf  linux (Ubuntu)
<Azelphur> foobarry: sadly, no android client
<foobarry> oh
<foobarry> freenx ?
<foobarry> nomachine should work with it
<Azelphur> foobarry: I dunno, it might work if I could force it to only serve one machine
<diddledan> I don't get it 'cos Ubuntu installs "desktop sharing" but it doesn't work
<Azelphur> serve one monitor*
<Azelphur> I need like, x11vnc -clip but faster :)
<davmor2> Azelphur: splashtop maybe
<Azelphur> davmor2: broken packages, managed to get it to install but it crashes on connect
<davmor2> Azelphur: meh yeah I forgot about that
<Azelphur> davmor2: the problem with the nomachine client is that it has no sane screen scaling, and in a multi monitor setup it's unusable
<joshua__> Hey guys, am using dnsmasq on my servers to cache DNS, and have set upstream to be my bind DNS servers, which do not have dnsmasq. It looks like servers intermittently resolve OK, using dig for example, but more often then not, it looks like it only queries localhost and doesn't get the answer..
<mapps> well
<mapps> that was rubbish as expected
<mapps> expendabls 2
<diddledan> mapps, lol
<diddledan> mapps, RED 2 was fun, however
<mapps> i was considering watching the3rd so thought id better watch 2nd first
<mapps> yea seen red2
<daftykins> didn't even know there's a red sequel :O
<mapps> i enjoyed purge 2 if you fancy a horror
<mapps> first did suck tho
<mapps> might go see the new apes film tonight.only because it sorange weds
<mapps> might not also
<mapps> :D
<mapps> only film possibly worth seeing ..dont wanna ay to see inbetweeners 2 ugh
<daftykins> mapps: how are you getting on with the edX course?
<php_> hi everyone. why the hell my site sometimes can be seen only by some device and in other devices I've got an error that says "Account unavailable  Maybe account have been moved, deleted, suspended or not activated yet.  The requested resource could not be found but may be available again in the future."??
<daftykins> php_: talk to your hosting provider
<php_> oh! ok! thanks!
<mapps> hhey daftykins
<mapps> up to section 15 u done it all?
<daftykins> nah been pretty occupied here and there
<daftykins> on chapter 6 today, but it's all looking pretty easy so i've not written anything in ages now :>
<MartijnVdS> http://i.imgur.com/0OiHe6d.jpg
<davmor2> MartijnVdS: but in the final frontier I'm pretty sure it was god who punish Kirk and tried to kill him :)
<davmor2> Surely he has that sign completely wrong :D
<mapps> hm
<rindolf> Hi all. Anyone around Cambridge, UK here? I'm here for a visit and we can meet for a drink or icecream.
<mapps> waiting on 5 more things from amazon
<mapps> working well that i put my sign #leave round gate' :D
<mapps> dont get woken up
<mapps> icecream? sweets are bad
<mapps> :D
<daftykins> seems legit
<mapps> hewwo daftykins
<daftykins> :>
<mapps> :>
<dwatkins> I'm lactose-intolerant, so ice cream is bad for me.
<dwatkins> (I'm also not in Cambridge either, sorry)
<daftykins> i'd hate to have that
<mapps> o
<mapps> have what
<daftykins> lactose intolerance
<rindolf> mapps: re icecream/sweets - see https://twitter.com/shlomif/status/491809376412266496
<mapps> co
<daftykins> just had yet another one of my classic "someone's signed up my email account as them" situations
<daftykins> i've managed to track down the guy in Ohio, find his phone # and ask him what has been going on :>
<daftykins> he told me he doesn't even HAVE an email address XD
<ali1234> you rang him up?
<daftykins> yep
<diddledan> o_O
<daftykins> politely, of course
<ali1234> it's probably spammers
<diddledan> how did you track him down?
<ali1234> similar same?
<ali1234> *name?
<daftykins> i reset the password on the account for this website, which is legit... (farming related by the looks) then found a postal address then started googling
<daftykins> actually i didn't even reset it, i got sent an email saying my new temporary password was...
<daftykins> http://www.cargillag.com/
<daftykins> 'tis from this :>
<daftykins> so this company is a farmer produce selling contractor by the looks
<ali1234> that's ... weird
<daftykins> over skype he told me he'd just gone through renaming his farm or whatever
<daftykins> and mentioned this company was helping with that process
<daftykins> so i've just found his local rep and asked him by email to sort it out
<daftykins> :D
<ali1234> website doesn't work
<daftykins> aaah, nothing like a good bit o' Sherlock'ing
<daftykins> really? i'm on it :>
<ali1234> this happened to me the other day, but the account was just a fake name and random username (like akjfdskjhgf or something)
<daftykins> ah right
<daftykins> basically my gmail is <first initial><surname>@
<ali1234> so obviously someone trying to pump up their user count
<daftykins> and i keep getting peeps like this guy with a different first name but same first initial
<daftykins> last time was Deborah from Arizona
<daftykins> she became a real pain in the ass, i was politely forwarding the emails to begin with once i found her work email
<ali1234> yeah that happened to me one time and the guy posted in "that" part of craig's list
<diddledan> daftykins, dkins@gmail? :-p
<daftykins> contacted her employer and asked wtf
<daftykins> she started buying office supplies and signing up my email, thinking i'd forward them to her work
<daftykins> so what i did was login, cancel the order and move on :)
<diddledan> lol
<diddledan> haha
<daftykins> one day i got an email saying "here's a copy of the email where you asked us to cancel the order..."
<daftykins> 8D
<daftykins> needless to say she has not done it since.
<daftykins> so yeah, don't mess with the kins
<daftykins> or i'll extremely subtly inconvenience you
<diddledan> I had an american swear blind to me that subtle wasn't a real word
<daftykins> i feel like a diddledan pun is coming...
<diddledan> to be fair it was written down so he might have got confused with the spelign. I guess his version is suttel
<daftykins> ah
<diddledan> this was years ago on aol instant messagey thing though so he was probably a mormon
<diddledan> http://www.hotforsecurity.com/blog/how-your-neighbours-cat-could-be-hacking-your-wifi-9888.html
<daftykins> ;)
<daftykins> seen the headline for that one already
<diddledan> "Sure enough, Coco came home with a ton of data about nearby poorly-secured wireless networks â and a dead mouse."
<daftykins> good lad!
<daftykins> or lass
<daftykins> i think my cat would cut me to ribbons if i tried to put something on her
#ubuntu-uk 2014-08-14
<daftykins> diddledan: i won! the email has been changed \o/
<diplo> Morning all
<OERIAS> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P1CyPjQQTAM
<bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
<Myrtti> moin bigcalm
<bigcalm> Happy belated birthday, Myrtti :)
<DJones> Maybe the wrong channel to ask in (computer people don't always have a good reputation for doing excercise) Anybody know a great deal about home multigyms? Looking at two & wondered if anybody can see any obvious differences that one is better than the other
<Myrtti> bigcalm: thanks :-D
<bigcalm> Myrtti: I thought you were a bit younger than FB tells me. So, well done on that ;)
<Myrtti> no, I'm about two weeks younger than Harry Potter :-P
<Myrtti> that old git
<bigcalm> Hah
 * bigcalm scratches his head
<bigcalm> Daniel Radcliffe is 25
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<Myrtti> bigcalm: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harry_Potter_%28character%29
<bigcalm> Myrtti: good point, I didn't think about when the character may have been 'born'
<bigcalm> I would like to read the books. But having watched the films, I fear that the written word won't be as magical
<Myrtti> I don't have big issues with the books vs. movies
<Myrtti> I listened to the books first before seeing the films, and I didn't have huge issues with the films
<bigcalm> Ooo, audio books
<bigcalm> Abridged?
<Myrtti> you can tell which bits have been omitted, but there isn't that much that was lost
<Myrtti> oh no, unabridged.
<bigcalm> Great
<Myrtti> by Stephen Fry
<bigcalm> I wonder if they are on Spotify
<bigcalm> Humm, maybe not
<popey> What an _excellent_ morning
<Myrtti> popey: _excellent_ or *excellent*?
<Laney> /excellent/
<popey> -excellent-
<popey> Anyone know a good technical writer looking for work?
<Myrtti> I'm trying to gauge the sarcasm
<Myrtti> so was it sarcastically excellent, or genuinely excellent
<popey> well. i successfully did some python/postgres/shell stuff which I haven't touched for a while, and that was fun
<popey> worked till late yesterday to make it work, and this morning made and proposed a merge for it
<popey> so yeah, thats good. just need to get it deployed
<foobarry> why do i always wake up exhausted on my day off?
<foobarry> day with the kids and my muscles are not working  toda
<Myrtti> I wake up exhausted every day
<foobarry> me too but especially bad on weekends
<foobarry> and after chinese food
<popey> ooh
<popey> i know what I'm having for lunch, thanks foobarry
<foobarry> leftovers?
<foobarry> my wife had them for breakfast
<foobarry> which is so wrong
<popey> no, there's a chinese near here that does a lunch pack
<popey> McChina Wok Away
<foobarry> special fried rice with everything in
<foobarry> i went to my local who i've gone to for 25 years
<foobarry> she was asking about my brother who doesn't look much like me but she thinks we look the same
<foobarry> then she said, your family always order chicken chop suey.
<foobarry> i thought everyone always ordered it?
<Laney> that's a takeaway-customer confidentiality violation
<Laney> DISGUSTING
<foobarry> is true though, i don't think there has ever been a foobarry family member who didn't order number 36 as part of a meal in 25 years
<foobarry> my mum goes there too, and so did my dad
<foobarry> and my sis
<foobarry> so good business from them
<popey> i have never ordered chicken chop suey
<foobarry> :o
<foobarry> :ooooooooo
<foobarry> mind you, it varies from place to place. my local does the best i ever tasted
<foobarry> and comes with a tomatoey sauce
<foobarry> and their kitchen is on full view so you can see him cook it
<Myrtti> we always do chicken and sweet corn soup. It's nice to dip the prawn crackers to
<foobarry> http://www.buzzfeed.com/danieldalton/welcome-to-jurassic-park
<foobarry> the "ghost ones" are wird
<popey> we usually have duck+pancakes, and often szechuan spicy beef and probably lemon chicken.
<foobarry> weird.
<foobarry> sorry for buzzfeed link :P
<popey> ooo, i haven't had chicken & sweet corn soup for years, could do with that
<foobarry> if i ever have a last meal, it might be kung po chicken. since i can't eat that any more :(
<popey> ooh not had that for a while either
<popey> dammit, lunchtime needs to hurry up
<popey> omg, i can order online
<popey> This. Changes. Everything.
<OERIAS> I just ran out of toilet paper!
<bigcalm> Haha
<popey> http://blog.highfivehq.com/posts/a-little-known-hack-from-japan-to-get-your-notebook-organized  gosh
<bigcalm> Wow, cool
<smittix> \o/
<bigcalm> I know this is only day 2, and I've already raved about it, but I can't get over how much of a wonderful difference a decent keyboard is making. My hands are not getting tired and I'm typing more quickly.
<bigcalm> I'm confused by the media keys on my new keyboard
<bigcalm> In Keyboard Shortcuts, Sound and Media, I can set the various controls by pressing the media keys on the kb. But then using them doesn't do anything
<bigcalm> So the Keyboard settings system is registering that I'm pressing the media keys. But then the media keys don't do anything
<bigcalm> If I do something like shift+f8, that registers and works. But Fn+F1 doesn't
<directhex> which keyboard?
<directhex> i have a new keyboard arriving in a couple of hours
<bigcalm> directhex: http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B00F1DOUXY
<directhex> i too am getting an mx brown based keyboard
<bigcalm> \o/
<directhex> personally i think the pricing on Das is excessive, for what you get
<bigcalm> I am in love with these switches
<bigcalm> Maybe so. I'll be happy if they kb lasts for several years
<directhex> nerds are a much smaller niche than gamers. for some market segments, the size of the gamer market massively lowers the baseline price. this includes mechanical keyboards
<directhex> i'm paying the same money for a keyboard with the same switches... with backlit keys, and an aluminium design rather than plastic
<bigcalm> Ah well :)
<directhex> mostly i went with colour coordination :p
<Laney> I'd pay /not/ to have backlit keys
 * Laney shivers
<bigcalm> Yeah, for me that's just something to go wrong
<bigcalm> It's a feature that is sometimes handy on my laptop. But I don't have a need for it at my workstation
<OERIAS> Aah shit! some asshole smeared his seat on the toilet!
<bigcalm> !ohmy | OERIAS
<lubotu3> OERIAS: The main Ubuntu channels require that you speak in calm, polite English. For other languages, please visit https://wiki.ubuntu.com/IRC/ChannelList
<bigcalm> That factoid has changed :S
<OERIAS> bigcalm, I will speak in calm language
<OERIAS> sorry
<popey> OERIAS: you pulled the same "gag" in #ubuntu. Don't do it here. Find somewhere else to be childish.
<OERIAS> okay i promise to moderate my language.
<popey> !guidelines | OERIAS
<lubotu3> OERIAS: The guidelines for using the Ubuntu channels can be found here: http://wiki.ubuntu.com/IRC/Guidelines
<davmor2> popey: oh that is a nice trick with the notepads
<foobarry> does anyone find their chromecast shows colours too saturated and a bit dark?
<foobarry> not sure how to fix, since watching normal telly is OK so i don't want change the brightness etc...unless it remembers settings per source?
<foobarry> it=TV
<popey> nope
<foobarry> hmm
<foobarry> colours are far too saturated
<smittix> foobarry: what are you casting from?
<foobarry> the youtube site on my laptop
<foobarry> which means that the cc streams direct from youtube
<smittix> ah
<smittix> I need to find a decent DLNA media player
<smittix> Something that I lets me watch videso from my NAS on my tv
<foobarry> i am using plex + CC
<smittix> That works then?
<foobarry> yes
<smittix> oh right
<smittix> I will do that then.
<foobarry> what's ur nas
<smittix> WD My Cloud
<foobarry> can u install plex server on it?
<smittix> not sure
<smittix> I'll check
<smittix> Bah doesn't look possible
<foobarry> buy a cheapo media player that u can connect the nas to?
<smittix> Yeah just looking now.
<smittix> http://web-systems.co.uk/?page=Products&pid=7909
<smittix> Looks ok
<shauno> way, way OT, but does anyone know the legalities of working remotely for a US corp?
<directhex> The quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
<popey> I can haz kung po chicken â»
<directhex> The quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog
<directhex> hm
<popey> yeah, i started using plex, works brilliantly to cast to cc
<directhex> i definitely feel a bit more resistance than on my wife's keyboard, but i don';t think i type with enough delicacy to really notice the tactile feel
<Myrtti> cc?
<Myrtti> chromecast.
<popey> ya
<popey> ended up re-watching Adjustment Beureau
<popey> -typos
<Myrtti> uh
<Myrtti> my sister's cat sat on my laptop and managed to change something in the settings so that the only thing that is on normal brightness setting is the top bar
<Myrtti> any ideas what went wrong?
<Myrtti> or should I just reboot and hope for the best?
<Myrtti> ah-ha
<Myrtti> they managed to press F9 and put my Unity into Widget mode
<popey> i have no idea what widget mode is â»
<Myrtti> popey: sticky notes and stuff like on Mac
<popey> oh
<popey> neat
<Myrtti> assuming you've got an app that does widgets
<Myrtti> bah. Stupid CoolComponents
<Myrtti> why can't my RoyalMail tracking number actually show something
<smittix> What's the best way to install Oracles Java in 14.04?
<ujjain> I paid Â£10 to charity. They will receive Â£12,50, because I'm a UK tax payer, roight?
<Laney> if you asked to use Gift Aid when you donated
<Laney> otherwise you can contact them and they can claim it retrospectively
<popey> smittix: define "best" ?
<smittix> popey: For some reason I cannot get java to work with chrome
<smittix> Trying to access an online device that requires java. I've installed J7 and it doesn't seem to work.
<diddledan_> ubuntu touch is suddenly much more responsive on my maguro (galaxy-nexus) after a reflash with a utopic-daily-touch-preinstalled.img from a day or so ago - it's actually almost usable now - I'm thinking the slowness inherent in the device is something to do with IO maybe
<diddledan_> I need to install iotop to check that theory
<diddledan_> in other news: morning fellas :-)
<popey> blimey, surprised it works on galaxy nexus
<diddledan_> popey, it's partially a custo-job - I compiled the androidy bits myself and used the ubuntu bits from the pre-compiled download
<popey> nice!
<popey> is there an image you could make available?
<diddledan_> I flashed using rootstock which doesn't make a nice image first but does everything on the device. Is there a howto for building a redistributable image anyplace?
<daftykins> diddledan_: i wonder if TRIM on the NAND being available or not could have an impact?
<diddledan_> daftykins, good thinking
<diddledan_> IIRC TRIM was an issue on the GNex?
<daftykins> i think it's attributed to all smartphones performance degradation when they've never been updated to android 4.3+ or simply never had it
 * diddledan_ runs fstrim on it
<daftykins> http://anandtech.com/show/8327/browser-faceoff-battery-life-explored-2014
<daftykins> interesting article
<diddledan_> hmm, unity8-dash is using a ton of ram - nearly 240MB
<popey> colour me unsurprised
<diddledan_> using over 256MB of swap on there in total now
<diddledan_> I think the slowness can possibly be chalked up to just swapping
<mapps> goijhow on earth have i amassed all the bad habbits
<diddledan_> all of them?
<diddledan_> that's a lot of bad habbits
<arsen> anyone carry around a 15" mbp/retina? i want some case ideas for mine :(
<mapps> whats that
<daftykins> macbook pro
<daftykins> arsen: ah-ha, back to the premium system eh ;)
<arsen> hihi :)
<arsen> yeah, brand new thin 15
<arsen> :D
<arsen> i7/16gig/500gig ssd
<mapps> :D
<mapps> nice
<mapps> i want 17inch tho thats why i dont buy one
<arsen> kinda wanted to at least be able to carry this
<arsen> but needs to power two thunderbolt displays
<diddledan_> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FzD01Hu1nPs :-D
<daftykins> 17 >_<
<mapps> carry where
<arsen> home/office, flights/business travel
<diddledan_> hmm, chromium done hung
<arsen> i may actually flip to a 13'mbp but tbd.
<mapps> argh
<mapps> i cant find my cigarettes
<mapps> :(
<mapps> nearest shop is 20min walk
<MartijnVdS> no better time to quit then
<DJones> mapps: Thats a hint, give up
<DJones> Heh MS updates bring about BSOD http://tech.slashdot.org/story/14/08/14/1713227/microsoft-black-tuesday-patches-bring-blue-screens-of-death?utm_source=slashdot&utm_medium=twitter
<MartijnVdS> heh oops
<daftykins> not the first time and certainly won't be the last
<diddledan_> is it cyber-wednesday the day after black tuesday?
<daftykins> all my ones i'm responsible for are fine
<daftykins> of course, i keep hearing about bricked updates in #ubuntu ...
<diddledan_> I've never heard patch-tuesday referred to as "black tuesday"
<daftykins> nah, nor i
<diddledan_> and actually perpetuating that idea (black) suggests to the layman that it's a bad thing
<diddledan_> patching is good for security people, I don't care what OS you're on, as long as you patch it up the wazoo
<daftykins> *nod*
<diddledan_> IE8 is going to stay around until 2016 according to microsoft :-(
<diddledan_> that sucks
<daftykins> nice that they're piling on the pressure though
<diddledan_> at least with XP's retirement I can finally have an argument with clients over IE6 and 7
<daftykins> this 'disabling outdated java plugins' is a nice one too
<arsen> maybe i'll just get a sleeve until i decide
<arsen> i like the booq mamba slim bag but its $$$$$$
<daftykins> if this 64GB Oneplus One i ordered ever turns up i'll be on the case dilemma bandwagon
<diddledan_> ooh
<Azelphur> daftykins: got a oneplus? nice
<diddledan_> you went for one of those, eh?
<diddledan_> I'm not sure I could do without google-mind-control
<daftykins> Azelphur: well i got an invite, it explicitly said they don't ship to Guernsey =| as is becoming the new norm
<diddledan_> ffs
<diddledan_> why?
<daftykins> so i ordered to Guernsey, UK :D
<diddledan_> lol
<daftykins> so it *might* be shipped, i can't really tell
<Azelphur> daftykins: haha
<daftykins> i really don't know why they refuse us, it's really quite frustrating
<diddledan_> I don't get what reasoning companies have for excluding the Channel Islands
<daftykins> could be something to do with Google telling them 'don't sell android devices to these places where we refuse to deal with VAT deduction'
<diddledan_> yeah, jink
<diddledan_> jinx
<daftykins> 'cause i think as i may have mentioned to you guys before, Google's Play store doesn't let us buy apps or media
<diddledan_> that sucks
<daftykins> ooh i got the replacement WD 2TB Re (enterprise) disk to replace the 6th of an array of 8 in my clients file server today
<daftykins> 6 of 8 WD2002FYPS' have now died, at varying intervals during their 5 year warranty
<diddledan_> \o/
<daftykins> with any luck the last two will pop within the next 200 days to remain in-warranty :D
<diddledan_> that's quite handy - it would be less so if it was a personal system without any redundancy/backup
<daftykins> well, the films on it are his DVD collection all ripped 1:1
<daftykins> for the various XBMC HTPCs i have setup around the house
<diddledan_> hehe
<daftykins> so those aren't getting backed up, but the important data is
<diddledan_> nice setup
<diddledan_> it's still a RAID array tho, so a single drive isn't going to lose the data
<daftykins> he has asked about backing it up, so what i said was when the warranty on these end, we'll get another set of disks and use that set as a copy
<daftykins> yep, double parity mode 6 too so it needs 3+ failures at once
<mapps> ugh
<mapps> the net still sucks on trai ns
<mapps> theyu always say theyre improving it..yea sure
<mapps> total toilet
<Azelphur> I just tether everywhere
<daftykins> it's these little times free from connection that you should enjoy :)
<directhex> the wifi on trains is provided by 3g, so if the 3g reception sucks, so does the wifi
<Azelphur> directhex: except it's probably congested
<Azelphur> my phone is my connection with no caps \o/
<directhex> i'm on orange, i have no bandwidth
<mapps> pfff daftykins
<daftykins> <every orange subscriber i've known> but i get film tickets!
<mapps> yea directhex
<daftykins> Â¬_Â¬
<mapps> except my phone seems better
<directhex> i have a kid, when am i going to go to see a movie?
<mapps> ah yea so its 3g shared whereas my 3g is on my own
<mapps> :D
<directhex> if i get a day off from the kid, i'm going to an orgy, not a cinema
<mapps> im on orange directhex  and 3g has got worse in last 6mths
<directhex> it takes a few minutes for twitter links to load for me
<mapps> yea
<mapps> it sucks
<directhex> i am jelly of wife's Three
<mapps> 4g is ok..ive got a 4g contract too atm and unlimited 3g with orange
<mapps> iphone 5 and 5s
<mapps> :D
<diddledan_> I've made an effect using css(3?) which is actually quite effective yet surprisingly simple to produce: https://www.dropbox.com/s/5xtb960lwpro1ou/Screenshot%20from%202014-08-14%2019%3A04%3A46.png
<mapps> i got all my amazon orders now yay
<mapps> was waitong for like 11 things
<mapps> :D
<daftykins> :O i love waiting for things
<daftykins> i specifically choose the cheapest/free shipping these days so i get the best part for longer
<daftykins> think of the cumulative savings too O_O
<shauno> you must love China then ;)
<daftykins> lawl
<diddledan_> how would you describe this heading: https://www.dropbox.com/s/5xtb960lwpro1ou/Screenshot%20from%202014-08-14%2019%3A04%3A46.png
<diddledan_> I'm trying to think of a name to give it
<diddledan_> needs at least two parts
<diddledan_> part1-part2 e.g.
<smittix> woe is me
<diddledan_> I'm thinking it's similar to train platform signs
<daftykins> smittix: why-so?
<smittix> Computer troubles all day heh
<daftykins> fun times
<daftykins> Meanwhile, on Guernsey - https://www.dropbox.com/s/cknwz15dzskq2jo/IMG_20140812_232336.jpg
<shauno> I guess they didn't have much luck with the fishing equipment
<davmor2> daftykins: why would they won't crabs, don't they know that would be the end of there love life :D
<davmor2> Lobsters and oysters are the ones to get surely
<daftykins> lol, you have some quirky typing sir, but i got it
<davmor2> daftykins: deliberately :)
<daftykins> deliberate 'won't for 'want' 0o
<daftykins> and 'there' fail
<daftykins> y u do dis!?
 * daftykins chases davmor2 with an English refresher course
<davmor2> daftykins: dyslexia is a git, I go with the one that sounds right
<daftykins> oh you're that guy :) my bad
<daftykins> my nick database seems off today
<davmor2> daftykins: I think bigcalm too and I'm sure there was someone else too
<diddledan_> daftykins, "that guy"
<bigcalm> Humm?
<bigcalm> What me too?
<bigcalm> Or, me too what?
<diddledan_> I think dyslexia is God's way of punishing those of us that like to pretend we're clever
<davmor2> bigcalm: dyslexia
<bigcalm> Oh
 * bigcalm goes away again
 * diddledan_ chases bigcalm 
<davmor2> diddledan_: I just thought it was a thing for busy minds,   My head is too busy thinking up new ways to destroy your software to possibly think how to spell a word
<diddledan_> davmor2, yeah, that might make sense. My mind is usually a dark void so it has time to spot "mistakes" but is so set in it's ways that it refuses to assume dyslexia or other patterns and instead moans and gets me into trouble with the "offender" for being offensive
<diddledan_> my brian is a curse
<diddledan_> (yes I spelt that correctly!)
<davmor2> diddledan_: you have a brian
<diddledan_> :-)
<davmor2> diddledan_: is it your son, and is the curse hear oi bry everywhere you go?
<diddledan_> I don't have any kids :-)
<diddledan_> brian is the strange bloke who sits inside my head
<diddledan_> he makes me do bad things :-p
<davmor2> diddledan_: oh that's worse still :D
<diddledan_> http://www.theverge.com/2014/8/13/5998273/who-owns-a-language-wikipedia-palawa-kani-raises-old-debate
<diddledan_> interesting
<zleap> hey Pendulum
<zleap> sorry hey popey
<diddledan_> I've packaged my method into a "web component" for polymer: http://diddledan.github.io/broadway-heading/
<diddledan_> I guess I need to point out that it's for polymer
<daftykins> any thoughts on whether 14.04 would be having issues run on an old NVIDIA Quadro FX 350M ?
<daftykins> it's borked after an upgrade from precise
<daftykins> nouveau seems to come up with some funky issues with detecting the aspect ratio, heh
<popey> ooh, thats old isnt it
<daftykins> indeed! XP era machine
<daftykins> http://www.notebookreview.com/notebookreview/dell-precision-m65-review-pics-specs/
<zleap> daftykins, there is a ubuntu system called Torios in development based on 12.04 for v1 and then 14.04 for v2  that is designed to be minimal may be good for old XP machiens
<popey> that wont help
<popey> the video driver will be the same
<daftykins> certainly won't help this user with a broken install
<popey> eek
<daftykins> well apparently it gets to login ok, but the user session fails to start
<popey> zleap: what desktop does Torios use?
<zleap> jwm
<popey> wossat?
<zleap> http://torios.org/
<zleap> hold on
<popey> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JWM
<popey> found it
<zleap> yeah
<zleap> http://joewing.net/projects/jwm/
<diddledan_> is jwm any relation to joe the text editor? :-p
<diddledan_> "Joe's window manager"
<zleap> not sure
<zleap> i use joe text editor
<zleap> in fact I wrote a command reference thingy for it
<diddledan_> I think it's a bit narcissistic to name something after yourself :-p
<zleap> diddledan_, where do you think Linus got Linux from
<diddledan_> hehe
<diddledan_> mikeos is where it's at
<diddledan_> http://mikeos.sourceforge.net/
<zleap> diddledan_, that looks useful or some of the links from there do
<diddledan_> zleap, yup
<daftykins> diddledan_: hey buddy old pal...
<daftykins> http://paste.ubuntu.com/8048891/
<daftykins> none of that would prevent a session starting would it :/
<diddledan_> french >.<
<diddledan_> :-p
<daftykins> ;D
<daftykins> yeah i thought that, but skype going funky shouldn't affect a whole session right 0o
<diddledan_> I don't think so - nothing looks relevant there
<daftykins> i've even suggested a unity reset, but that did nothing
<diddledan_> grr
<daftykins> i wonder if it's worth trying an nvidia driver, the Xorg log looks alright though
<daftykins> http://paste.ubuntu.com/8048532/
<diddledan_> you mentioned that it's getting the login prompt but not further?
<daftykins> apparently a single window opens stating "system problem detected"
<daftykins> but no mouse pointer and nothing bar a purple image
<diddledan_> is there an ".xsession-errors" in the user's home folder?
<arsen> bwaha winning. i have work branded free clothes :D
<diddledan_> or similar naming I never get that correct
<zleap> daftykins, i get that with xubuntu
<daftykins> arsen: O_O
<daftykins> diddledan_: that's what the first link above was
<diddledan_> aah
<diddledan_> ignore me then :-p
<daftykins> hehe no worries
<daftykins> i don't know anything beyond the above to diagnose this one
<daftykins> i'm suggesting running a unity reset whilst it's sat there stalled this time
<daftykins> before i suggested doing so after stopping lightdm
<zleap> i am pff
<daftykins> zleap: hmm? :)
<zleap> off
<zleap> sorry
<daftykins> oh, nn sir
<zleap> i will see if I can find out how to find out why i get system problem detected
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> this one was a botched upgrade
<zleap> this is a clean install
<daftykins> preserved /home or nothing at all?
<zleap> but it must be more to do with ubuntu as i had the same with xubuntu and lubuntu
<zleap> fully clean then copied /home contents back over
<zleap> i will chat tomorrow anyway
<zleap> nite
<diddledan_> daftykins, it might be a problem with preserved settings in which case to test that theory you can try adding a new user account
<daftykins> *nod* sounds good sir
<daftykins> the other thing i would've done is maybe move .config to .configold as a quick test
<diddledan_> if it is a problem with saved settings then the simplest way to fix it is to nuke a couple .folders
<daftykins> but yeah, better not to mess with user data
<diddledan_> yeah, .config is one, I think .local is the other
<daftykins> vewy gewd
<diddledan_> the problem is doing that kills off unrelated program settings too so many many many apps start with a blank slate
<daftykins> *nod*
<daftykins> as long as none are run and it's just used as a quick test it should be grand
<diddledan_> jeez, they're still making new police academy films
<diddledan_> (it was the "many many many" that got me googling)
<daftykins> O_O!
<daftykins> where'd many many many come from?
<diddledan_> I can't find any clips of it but it's the old boy, eric lissard who goes on about his "many many many fine officers" and other things
<daftykins> aaaah :D
<daftykins> diddledan_: lol i suggested .cache, .local and .config be renamed, still no go
<diddledan_> foo
<daftykins> at this point i think it might be too broken for a new user even
<daftykins> kinda tempted to try an nvidia driver anyway just to be sure
<diddledan_> might it be worth a check on a live-disc-based boot?
<daftykins> mmm that would make sense, wonder if it's an option
<daftykins> apparently it's the only computer
<daftykins> heh
<diddledan_> oh, you're remote?
<daftykins> what about installing an alternative DE like xfce?
<daftykins> yeah me to someone to someone via phone i'm horrified to say :S
<diddledan_> eek
<daftykins> they told a friend to use ubuntu on this antique and now it's totally trashed :D
<diddledan_> well if it's missing any packages then running tasksel and selecting "ubuntu desktop" should install all the default packages if they're not present. follow it with a reboot if it installed anything and check logging-in again
<daftykins> mmm, wonder if i could also say to remove ubuntu-desktop and install xubuntu-desktop
<diddledan_> oh, looks like it needs installing first, so sudo apt-get install tasksel
<daftykins> or skip the first and just go straight to xubuntu-desktop
<arsen> reminds me, need to reinstall my laptop
<arsen> or fix the laptop suspend .. somehow on resume it fails to turn the screen back on :/ pita
<daftykins> did you say you were using xubuntu?
<daftykins> as i think someone said that's in the release notes as a known bug, heh
<arsen> gnome classic, but happens regardless of DE
<arsen> mine doesnt seem to be the common bug (use osmething other htan xubuntu)
<daftykins> hrmm
<daftykins> i'm typing from this old Sony of the boss's today
<daftykins> kinda funny not being able to watch a flash vid 'cause it sucks so bad
<diddledan_> HEXIE!
<diddledan_> damn that peer
<daftykins> every time :(
<diddledan_> chromium has hung on me again
<daftykins> d'aww
<popey> yeah, i switched to chrome after chromium went down hill recently
<diddledan_> do the unity added sugar work with google's chrome?
<diddledan_> i.e. unity-chromium-extension and unity-scope-chromiumbookmarks
<daftykins> apparently editing ~/.dmrc is enough to change default session at login? 0o
<diddledan_> daftykins, seems legit
<daftykins> wow, user didn't have the file
<popey> dunno
<daftykins> user got xubuntu-desktop installed but i think it was stuck on running unity as the default session
<daftykins> lightdm.conf might be the next option
#ubuntu-uk 2014-08-15
<daftykins> https://www.dropbox.com/s/8n10wp6k8mapf5h/VID_20140815_010649.mp4
<daftykins> my cat is kinda driving me bananas
<daftykins> trying to teach her to come inside with this electric flap
<diddledan_> boh yakasha
<diddledan_> !@
<diddledan_> I got ubuntu chromium extensions running in google's official release by symlinking /usr/share/chromium to /usr/share/google-chrome
<daftykins> O_O
<daftykins> you sneak!
<diddledan_> oh dear, cliff richard is in the spotlight for sex offences now?
<diddledan_> there's going to be no celebrity from the 80s left
<daftykins> diddledan_: i know :/
<daftykins> diddledan_: lucky he's not in a death penalty US state, else he'd be more than wired for sound :/
<daftykins> diddledan_: this is pretty cool, i once got someone to use UPnP to open a port on a router they had no access to
<daftykins> this persons friend has the same issue, so i started looking into UPnP command line only clients
<daftykins> miniupnpc is the winner, it's able to list me my forwarded ports
<daftykins> now i just need to work out how to make it ask for another to be opened :>
<daftykins> oh wow
<daftykins> you can get line stats over upnp
<daftykins> !
<diddledan_> there's a *d version for linux-based routers (whether that be wrt or pc-in-the-cupboard)
<daftykins> yarr, i saw the package :)
<diddledan_> so that is the server end of the protocol whereas the *c is the client
<daftykins> MaxBitRateDown : 45600000 bps (45.6 Mbps)   MaxBitRateUp 11171000 bps (11.1 Mbps)
<diddledan_> nice
<daftykins> that's line only though, i'm provisioned 40/5 :<
<diddledan_> https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/--PicQp6clqs/U-LVh_VWrkI/AAAAAAAAf2U/9jb9_pZhJmM/w640-h480-no/2014%2B-%2B1
<daftykins> cool it can do it though as the web admin doesn't show that
<daftykins> still that good huh? :D
<diddledan_> I wonder what mine reports
<diddledan_> I'm on an 80/20
<daftykins> do you have cable or xDSL on a phone line?
<diddledan_> looks like the command to open a port is "upnpc -a 192.168.0.100 80 80 tcp" <-- internal-ip internal-port external-port protocol
<diddledan_> it's an FTTC phone-line-based DSL
<diddledan_> the sky fttc running on bt's infinity infra
<daftykins> ah yeah, do you have the white Huawei BT branded modem in front on the line itself?
<diddledan_> yup
<diddledan_> HG612 if memory serves
<daftykins> indeed :D i've got one of those modded with the Huawei firmware
<diddledan_> I could close my laptop and pick it up to verify
<diddledan_> the box is directly behind my laptop
<diddledan_> about 2.5 feet from me
<daftykins> you can make it do lovely line stat graphs
<diddledan_> nice
<daftykins> also turn it into a full NAT router :>
<daftykins> though obviously no wifi then
<diddledan_> looks like the sky router's upnp doesn't list maxbitrates
<daftykins> awww
<diddledan_> http://paste.ubuntu.com/8049743/
<daftykins> i guess it doesn't know since it's an intermediary device
<diddledan_> maybe
<daftykins> the one my values are coming from are actually my ISP supplied all-in-one device
<diddledan_> actually the sky web admin shows the speed
<daftykins> provisioned vs. line though?
<diddledan_> this is what the webadmin shows: http://paste.ubuntu.com/8049762/
<daftykins> yarr thems separate to the line stats
<diddledan_> lol @ popey's photo: https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-w3vpw56wvIs/U-bB9W4FWTI/AAAAAAAArs0/PmesW_Dt2PI/w1335-h1001-no/IMG_4219.JPG <-- as seen on youtube
<diddledan_> for when you're not famous enough to be "as seen on TV"
<daftykins> XD
<diddledan_> o_O if you have a long piece of string, the label says, you could strangle yourself with it - string not included
<diddledan_> so is that like when you're looking for jeans and the label says "risk of suffocation if you leave the space shuttle during flight"
<daftykins> lmao
<daftykins> they totally look like Haribo to me
<daftykins> i'd be half way through a packet before asking what they are
<diddledan_> lol
<diddledan_> yeah there is that
<diddledan_> lol, I like: https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-T6LHdOlIg-A/U-YOjuVATKI/AAAAAAAArpQ/zACHhC9MlEQ/w601-h1001-no/device-2014-08-09-130121.png
<diddledan_> I wonder what logic it uses to determine the existance of existance
<daftykins> perhaps a quick curl!
<daftykins> wow, Dust - An Elysian Tale is really a seriously impressive game
<daftykins> especially for being made by one guy
<mapps>  this bloody drink is gonna kill me eh
<smittix> Moaning
<OERIAS> Do ops keep a channel log of this channel?
<shauno> it's logged publicly, link is in the /topic  (This channel is publicly archived http://irclogs.ubuntu.com )
<popey> Morning all
<shauno> o/
<davmor2> Morning all
<davmor2> JamesTait: what day is it today?
<bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
<smittix> ;;o/
<smittix> \o/
<bigcalm> Yeah, I'm excited to see me too
<JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Friday, and happy Relaxation Day! :-D
<JamesTait> Also, happy Men's Grooming Day!
<foobarry> my son asked me to shave today
<foobarry> stubble itched when i kissed him goodbye for work
<JamesTait> (That's a Men's Grooming Day that I hope will be happy, not a Grooming Day for happy men).
<JamesTait> My youngest told me I need to grow my beard longer, so I can "be a smart guy".  My wife was not impressed.
<JamesTait> I casually ignored the insinuation that I'm not already a "smart guy", just because he gave me an excuse to grow my beard.
<JamesTait> "Well, you're always telling me I should do more things the kids want me to do...."
<bigcalm> Haha, nice
<bigcalm> My wife hates me having a beard. She'd have me shave every day. I just lack the willpower
<bigcalm> I did shave last night, so that made her happy
<JamesTait> I shave every other morning.
<Myrtti> dsample looks like 15 year old without at least a stubble
<Myrtti> so I don't mind when he doesn't shave
<JamesTait> I keep my top lip trimmed, but I've been trying to grow my chin fuzz.
<bigcalm> I do look younger once shaved. Thankfully, not too young: https://www.flickr.com/photos/bigcuthy/14464905040/
<bigcalm> I think that my eyebrows turning white helps me look old
<popey> \o/ I can haz face fuzz
<popey> kids complain at bed time "daddy, you need a shave"
<bigcalm> I'm jelly
<bigcalm> Though, what do the kids make of it?
<popey> a hat, or a broach or a pterydactil
<bigcalm> Of it, not with it :P
<bigcalm> Argh, I'm trying to remember what that was from. I can see the bloke doing the actions
<bigcalm> Airplane
<foobarry> bigcalm looks somehow familiar
<bigcalm> \o/
<bigcalm> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L8oAQOvOEXY
 * bigcalm hugs popey for bring such joy to this Friday morning
<bigcalm> foobarry: I do?
<Myrtti> I hate that film
<bigcalm> foobarry: I am the one in the suit, not the green dress
<bigcalm> Awwww
<popey> lost count of the number of times I've watched that film
<popey> took a vhs tape with it on to school. used to watch it in the lunch breaks
<Myrtti> http://imgur.com/gallery/zxel35t/comment/250700674
<popey> 25 years ago!
<Myrtti> link related.
<Myrtti> I should check in
<Myrtti> blaah
<bigcalm> Check into what?
<Myrtti> flight
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<Myrtti> whee finally my CoolComponents order shows properly up on RoyalMail website \o/ yay birthday presents!
<bigcalm> tree -ando tree.txt --dirsfirst --charset ansi
<bigcalm> Oh, this isn't twitter, is it?
<Laney> #whoknows
<bigcalm> Oh god
<bigcalm> My boss just wrote "@iain" within an email to our team to direct a question at me
 * bigcalm cringes
<SuperMat1> :(
<davmor2> popey: man your old
<Myrtti> how bad is it when I don't want to tot up the value of all four Arduino related orders?
<davmor2> you're even]
<davmor2> JamesTait: I don't want to groom so I'll go with the happy and relaxing which I'll be doing after Lunch :)
<davmor2> anyone else having their widows bombarded by these things http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Green_stink_bug
<bigcalm> Not here
<Myrtti> windows?
<Myrtti> we just had thrips
<Myrtti> stink bugs atleast in Finland have a tendency of ruining whatever berries you're picking
<davmor2> I keep hearing this loud clunk and it's one of those bugs crashed into the window and stood there.
<smittix> Does anyone know of any issues in the past with encrypted installs causing problems with nvidia drivers?
<smittix> I'm wondering if it's that thats causing me issues.
<smittix> davmor2: I have tons of them in my garden. Never knew they were called Stink bugs
<awilkins> Encryption shouldn't matter to nvidia drivers.
<awilkins> Unless they do something stupid that interacts with the bits of the kernel related to encryption
<directhex> never heard of such an issue
<bigcalm> directhex: how's the new keyboard?
<directhex> tactile switches are weird
<bigcalm> How so?
<Myrtti> AND TODAY my sister's computer offers an update to 14.04.1, of all days during my two week visit.
<Myrtti> goddarnit
<popey> â»
<popey> yeah, a few people in my lug mentioned it yesterday
<bigcalm> I've gone from a unicomp to mx brown keys. The biggest difference for me is that I don't have to apply so much effort in typing
<popey> so you could edit the releases file and tell it not to offer upgrades
<popey> then she wont see it and you can update when you next visit
<Myrtti> my sister doesn't run upgrades anyway
<Myrtti> I do it over ssh
<bigcalm> So do the realease-upgrade over ssh ;)
<popey> yeah, wuss ã
<Myrtti> that's risky
<popey> yeah, i haven't updated my mums from 12.04 to 14.04 yet
<Myrtti> but let's say I'd edit a file
<popey> not sure I will
<Myrtti> which file would that be? ã
<popey> /etc/update-manager/release-upgrades
<popey> set prompt=never
<Myrtti> thanks
<Myrtti> done just for my sanitys sake
<popey> wise
<Myrtti> thunder borked her modem in June and there was absolutely nothing I could do to any of her problems for a few months
<Myrtti> I've set up the port forwards now so there is atleast a theoretical possibility I could do something
<awilkins> Mum has a port forward and a dynamic DNS address :-)
<awilkins> Launchpad has a group for "My mum runs Ubuntu!"
<Myrtti> yeah, I've got a dyn updater script on my sister's computer too. Doesn't help when the modem goes bonk.
<awilkins> Maybe it should also have a "My mum has a dynamic DNS address!"
<popey> i removed my mums dyndns
<popey> i have prey installed on her machine, it checks in with my webserver every 10 mins, so easy to find her IP
<popey> home made dyndns â»
<diplo> Do you pay for prey popey ?
<Myrtti> I'm using dy.fi
<popey> diplo: PAY!? no
<popey> its in the repo
<popey> Helps that mum lives 1.0 miles away https://www.google.co.uk/maps/dir/Stourhead+Close/Coleford+Close,+Mytchett,+Camberley+GU16+6DX,+UK
<Myrtti> popey: could you go knock on the Jubilee sorting office door and demand that they'd sort my CoolComponents package quicker
<popey> heh
<Myrtti> dsample ordered some from Maplin, some from CPC/Farnell, I did my own orders from CoolComponents and Amazon
<Myrtti> end result: all the Arduino Lilypad/Adafruit Flora stuff \o/
<Myrtti> well, not quite
<Myrtti> but enough
<popey> busy weekend then
<diplo> popey, I just remember when I last looked it was limited to a certain amount of devices ? 2 or so ?
<davmor2> Myrtti: can we expect a super arm computer anytime soon?  Are you calling it skynet?  It's about that time right :)
<popey> davmor2: i dont use prey services, just the program, pointed to my own webservice
<diplo> ah right
<diplo> I may look at it again at some point
<popey> i have 10 machines all pointing to a specific domain I own
<popey> I just tail the webserver logs to see my machines checking in
<davmor2> popey: was that really meant for me?
<popey> what do you think? â»
<davmor2> popey: with you I never know, you're too weird :P
<popey> thank you.
<Myrtti> davmor2: you can expect a hat and a wedding dress, at some time in next two years.
<popey> Êâ¿à² 
<davmor2> Myrtti: oh nice
<davmor2> Myrtti: all lighty up and spangly
<shauno> that's what I did with prey .. knocked together some php that accepted its posts
<davmor2> popey: see that's the look I see on your face too often :D
<Myrtti> you can imagine some kind of laura cowen's twitter christmas tree rolling down the isle
<Myrtti> aisle, even
<bigcalm> directhex: I now have a ratio of 123 on StephensonsRocket93plus1.iso. Is this image still relevant?
<directhex> i reckon no.
<bigcalm> Last Activity: 8  hours ago
<bigcalm> That's a surprise
 * smittix is waiting for Beer o Clock
<davmor2> smittix: it's Saturday in New Zealand if that helps?
<smittix> It doesn't help but thanks anyway heh
<smittix> Only 4 hours to go so it isn't too bad.
<popey> oh my gosh these look amazing http://imgur.com/a/LK7Tl#0
<bigcalm> 4 hours?!
<smittix> bigcalm: Aye!
<bigcalm> Bah
<bigcalm> 6+ for me
<bigcalm> popey: top one from ep 7?
<smittix> I started at 5am today too.
<bigcalm> Fair enough
<popey> ya
<smittix> popey: Top one looks very sweet#
<smittix> Speaking of drinking, A polish friend bought me some Polish hazlenut vodka to try.
<bigcalm> smittix: bottom one is from ep 4
<bigcalm> "aren't you a little short to be a storm trooper?"
<smittix> heh
<popey> looks very agressive
<bigcalm> It does
<bigcalm> They've done a good job with it
<directhex> bigcalm: my wife and i have the same keyboard, other than the switches, so it's a proper 1:1 comparison
<directhex> bigcalm: the feel of red vs brown is totally different
<smittix> These also look nice heh http://imgur.com/a/Hj9Vb
<bigcalm> directhex: I went for brown because of the difference I could see when looking at reviews using animated gifs. Which do you prefer?
<directhex> i don't know. they're different. it'll take me a while to get used to it
<directhex> generally, gamer keyboards have linear switches and typist keyboards have tactile switches
<bigcalm> http://lifehacker.com/how-to-choose-the-best-mechanical-keyboard-and-why-you-511140347 - scroll down to 'Get to Know Your Switches'
<ali1234> none of those reflect how the model m worked
<directhex> none of them use a buckling spring, no
<directhex> the mx green is probably the closest in actuation force and feel, though
<directhex> also noise
<awilkins> The most important reason you'd use a mechanical keyboard is not there
<ali1234> the buckling spring system also used a membrane, like all cheap keyboards today
<awilkins> Nostalgia? PAH!
<ali1234> and not individual metal contacts
<awilkins> ali1234, USES... it's not dead... yeah, but the means of touching the membrane is the different
<ali1234> eh, not really
<directhex> topre switches are also hybrid mechanical-membrane
<awilkins> Standard membrane keyboards are a glorified TV remote
<directhex> but those are rare and expensive
<bigcalm> I'm happy to sell my 2 unicomp keyboards if you want buckling spring keys
<ali1234> really the only diffeence is the model m had a metal spring. cheap keyboards today have a rubber bubble that buckles instead
<bigcalm> I should add that both unicomp keyboard are PS2
<awilkins> Which leads you to the most important reason to use mechical keyboards - the rubber dome means you have to mash the key harder than necessary because there is no sense of positive contact
 * awilkins has 2 PS/2 -> USB adapters
<awilkins> Neither of my primary keyboards are USB
<ali1234> not true. the rubber dome buckles the same way the springs did
<directhex> the model m has a crap keyboard controller. don't try to game on it
<ali1234> about the only difference is that there's very little noise
<ali1234> yeah the model m has really bad ghosting
<awilkins> ali1234, there's not that moment when the spring buckles and the tension reduces
<ali1234> but so do all USB keyboards
<ali1234> awilkins: yes there is, because the rubber domes buckle exactly like a spring
<directhex> there are scales and degrees
<directhex> model m is bottom of the pile for ghosting
<directhex> any decent usb keyboard does better
<ali1234> yeah usb is slightly better with "any 6 keys then nothing"
<directhex> it's really not "any six keys"
<directhex> on many keyboards you won't make 3
<directhex> s/many/most/
<ali1234> that's the upper limit of what USB can do... because that's what HID reports can support
<ali1234> obviously many don't even manage that
<awilkins> ali1234, TYping on a model M now. There is a distinct point at which the key "Gives" and at that point you have made positive contact because there is a hammer at the end of the spring that does the contact
<awilkins> With a rubber dome, you have to make contact with the underside of the dome
<directhex> yes, that's the upper limit of what HID can do. but most consumer keyboards can't ever rech 6 anyway
<awilkins> The dome "gives" before it bottoms out
<awilkins> And you have to bottom them out to contact
<ali1234> so does the spring on the model m
<awilkins> ali1234, When the spring on a Model M gives it HAS bottomed out
<awilkins> Because the mechanism on the other end is what does the contact
<directhex> my usual quick ghosting demonstration: hold down both shift keys and type "the quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog"
<directhex> *both* shift keys at once, with your little fingers
<awilkins> ali1234, Because the spring giving is the same thing as contact you can then release the key
<ali1234> awilkins: yes, but you can continue to press the key down further
<awilkins> With a rubber dome you have to keep pushing for some indeterminate period of time
<directhex> e.g. here's a cheap USB keyboard from maplin, "genius" branded: HE QUIC BROWN OX UMP OVER HE Z OG
<davmor2> directhex: I lose o and u
<ali1234> works with my keyboard, logitech G19
<awilkins> ali1234, You _can_ but you don't have to and that's the point ; a skilled typist can use the feel of that to exert the minimum effort, which you can't do with a rubber dome
<awilkins> My mother was a legal secretary for decades ; they issued her with a rubber dome keyboard and her finger joint arthritis was really hurting her in the end
<directhex> corsair vengeance k70: THE QUICK BROWN FOX JUMPS OVER THE LAZY DOG
<awilkins> I got her a mechanical keyboard (ok, a Cherry) and it cleared up significantly in a couple of weeks. Rubber dome keyboards should be kept away from professional typists.
<ali1234> yeah, well, model m gave me tinnitus
<directhex> you never need to hold both shift keys in the real world, but it's an interesting demonstration
<ali1234> what if you're playing pinball dreams?
<directhex> real-world example: The Binding of Isaac is not playable on a logitech illuminated keyboard
<directhex> you can't move diagonally and shoot, at the same time
<ali1234> why not?
<ali1234> my logitech passed your test
<directhex> moving diagonally means holding e.g. A and W, and holding an arrow key to shoot. in some combinations, the Illiminated doesn't pick up all the events so either you stop moving diagonally and only move horizontally/vertically, or don't shoot, depending on the order you pressed the keys
<awilkins> I remember the ZX Spectrum being horrible for that
<awilkins> But I can't say I've ever had problems with it on a PC
<directhex> binding of isaac is the acid test for a cheapy keyboard with a crap control circuit
<ali1234> i'm pretty sure this keyboard reorders keypresses
<ali1234> if you type too fast
<ali1234> it never happened on my old ps/2 keyboard
<bigcalm> Das Keyboard Model S Professional: THE QUICK BROWN FOX JUMPS OVER THE LAZY DOG
<directhex> the G19 is a gaming keyboard, i would expect above-average key rollover
<directhex> my previous keyboard, a Mad Catz, missed one or two keys iirc
<ali1234> yeah i've never had rollover problems with it. just spelling mistakes
<ali1234> i want to build my own keyboard
<ali1234> i was looking at AVR chips... the old AT90USB had a ps/2 compatibility mode on the USB pins
<ali1234> but i can't figure out if this is still supported in the newer revisions. it disappeared from the datasheet. but it was only ever done in software anyway
<smittix> Submitted 2 photos to the 14.10 pool \o/
<popey> yay
<davmor2> I just want a white background with the slogan "Always be yourself, unless you can be a unicorn.....Then always be a unicorn!"
<smittix> heh
<davmor2> http://www.imagesbuddy.com/always-be-yourself-unless-you-can-be-a-unicorn-then-always-be-a-unicorn-quote-graphic/
<smittix> heres one https://www.flickr.com/photos/smittix/8792481875/
<davmor2> smittix: why did you set fire to that wood, you're an evil man ;)
<smittix> :)
<smittix> the other one https://www.flickr.com/photos/smittix/10742521275/
<awilkins> Quite like the looks (and feel, from visiting the showroom) of this one : http://www.scan.co.uk/products/corsair-vengeance-k70-mechanical-gaming-keyboard-gunmetal-cherry-mx-blue-switch-%28uk-english%29
<awilkins> If I had an epic keyboard disaster today that would probably be what I'd get.
<bigcalm> If I don't look at my left hand screen directly, it appears as though a page of white is ever so slightly flickering somehow. Is this an indication that the monitor is on its way out?
<popey> yes, give it to me
<bigcalm> :|
 * bigcalm wants to take the afternoon off
<bigcalm> 4 hours to go
<popey> I want to go to the park and play with my powerup
<popey> i spent a while last night folding paper aeroplanes
<popey> all charged up, now just need the weekend and some dry time
<foobarry> did you do the recommended planes popey , or your own
<popey> they recommend two types
<popey> invader and nakamura
<popey> i made nakamura ones
<awilkins> bigcalm, Is it an LED backlight or a cold cathdode?
<awilkins> LED screens adjust brightness by flashing the LEDs for different amounts of time
<awilkins> Usually persistence of vision means you don't perceive this
<awilkins> The periphery of your vision has a larger rod / cone ratio, which means it's more sensitive to light and has a lower refractory period
<awilkins> Which means you perceive flicker more easily in the periphery of your vision than the centre (presumably this is helpful in a world of animals that you want to eat / escape from)
<awilkins> So it could just be a normal phenomenon you've not noticed before, or because you reduced the brightness on that monitor recently and thus increased the fraction of time the LEDs are off for
 * awilkins has to have 100Hz TVs because 50Hz looks hella flickery to him.
<bigcalm> That would make sense. It's a Dell something :D
<ali1234> PWM should be at around 15khz, thus not visible (but sometimes audible if the monitor has a cheap PSU - that's why they put it outside the monitor now)
<awilkins> 50Hz CRTs also have that realllly annoying flyback transformer whine
<bigcalm> DELL E228WFP
<awilkins> Cold cathode tubes do flicker a bit sometimes as well
<bigcalm> According to nvidia settings
<awilkins> I have one with a tube and one with LEDs
<awilkins> The tube one flickers a bit when I change resolution settings on occasion
<foobarry> i've got lcds coming out of my ears
<foobarry> so many getting disposed of at work
<awilkins> I think that's caused by resonance waves in the plasma, they usually settle down after a minute
<foobarry> eddies in teh space time continuum
<awilkins> I've got his sofa.
<foobarry> a chesterfield
<bigcalm> foobarry: is he?
<awilkins> Some unsightly stains though. Looks like rabbit brains.
<foobarry> maybe new moto G announced on 4 sep?
<smittix> bigcalm: 20mins to go :P
<bigcalm> smittix: shush you :P
<smittix> I was going to wait until 4 but I've pretty much finished for the day.
<popey> i love it when one of the neighbours puts their house on the market, I get to have a good nose inside â»
<popey> http://www.gregjamesestateagents.co.uk/property-search~action=detail,pid=24
<foobarry> my mate put his house on the market and a guy came to view
<foobarry> he was carrying plastic shopping bags. a bit strange he thought
<foobarry> at the end of the viewing, my mate said, are you interetsed in the house
<foobarry> he said, oh no, i live across the road and wanted a look around
<foobarry> i don't think my friend's jaw closed until after the man had gone inside his own house
<popey> haha
<bigcalm> Oh god
<bigcalm> popey: what I've seen of your house looks nicer :)
<popey> haha
<popey> thanks
<Laney> wow, those pictures are bright
<foobarry> popeys walls are all painted ubuntu/sainsburys orange
<popey> yes
<davmor2> foobarry: and canonical purple as a feature wall
<foobarry> and a jono bacon duvet
<davmor2> foobarry: it's reversible it says community, community, community on the other side :D
<diddledan_> davmor2, wasn't there a video of someone delivering an empassioned "community, community, community" rant?
<popey> jono bacon inspirational picture
<diddledan_> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8To-6VIJZRE
<davmor2> popey: hahaha oh yeah must not forget that  :)
<popey> http://i.imgur.com/E2Gzh0O.jpg
<diddledan_> popey, I like that you took a break from your cuppa-tea/coffee to take that photo
<popey> heh
<diddledan_> tis a fancy micromaphone
<popey> ya
<diddledan_> and yes, I like the jono bacon pic too :-)
<davmor2> happy friday I'm in our caravan with war of the worlds playing away watching various birds attack the ground with their beaks and fly off and bunnies hopping around.  I may have to invest in a 4g mifi and park at the top of the hill for work though this slow broad band might kill me else :)
<bigcalm> Don't work
<popey> yeah
<davmor2> but popey  I have to find more blockers to upset nik90 you know how I like upsetting developers ;)
<popey> heh
<popey> ouch http://kitsilanosoftware.wordpress.com/2014/08/13/the-tizen-project-is-broken-we-will-be-spending-some-time-apart-3/
<ali1234> heh, so nothing changed then
<ali1234> except they swapped nokia for samsung
<Myrtti> yup
<Myrtti> thats when I finally jumped ship
<Myrtti> pattern was too obvious
<ali1234> i agree
<ali1234> i was only following meego for about a year but it was really obvious that both moblin and maemo had always been this way
<Myrtti> maemo was ok.
<ali1234> no, it was exactly the same
<ali1234> they tried to have a community in a bottle
<Myrtti> sure, but there was atleast a genuine attempt
<Myrtti> meego was just a fart.in tight jeans
<Myrtti> writing on the wall quite early on
<ali1234> right from the very start the relationship between nokia and the community was entirely one-way
<ali1234> lots of talking, no listening
<Myrtti> maybe I am a bit biased. My Finnishness pushing through
<Myrtti> I loved what I did for Maemo. Best fulfilling bits of my so far short career, still.
<ali1234> it was always a problem of corporate micro-management imo
<Myrtti> sure
<Myrtti> I'm not saying it wasnt priblematic
<ali1234> but the thing was... a lot of people were still defending nokia right up until the end
<Myrtti> Finns have an awful lot of NIH,I know
<ali1234> that's not even the problem. all the software nokia (or paid to be made) made was great
<ali1234> the trouble came from the way they managed the community
<Myrtti> I wish Iweren't on my mobile at an airport, I Could wax philosophical over this
<ali1234> make loads of promises, fail to deliver, and leave the community manager to deal with the fallout
<ali1234> i felt sorry for quim gil
<Myrtti> yeah
<Myrtti> he is a great guy
<Myrtti> knew him from Guadec 06
<foobarry> my laptop is hanging for ages after grub and before the ubuntu boot splash :S
<foobarry> dieing disk?
<directhex> nvidia?
<foobarry> intel
<foobarry> only recently started happening
<foobarry> purple scren, nothing happens for a minute or two
<diddledan_> foobarry, check dmesg directly after a successful boot
<diddledan_> any timeouts or the like will be in there if it's hardware related
<foobarry> there are ata1 timeouts
<foobarry> which is cdrom
<popey> is there a cdrom in it?
<foobarry> .880252] ata1: device not ready (errno=-16), forcing hardreset
<foobarry> [   31.880264] ata1: soft resetting link
<foobarry> nope
<popey> cable
<popey> or psu
<foobarry> it#s not booting off cdrom
<foobarry> and its plugged into the wall (the battery doesn't hold charge)
<foobarry> scsi scan: 96 byte inquiry failed.  Consider BLIST_INQUIRY_36 for this device
<foobarry> unsure if this is normal error
<popey> oh, laptop?
<foobarry> yesh
<popey> assumed desktop
<popey> so maybe the drive is bust
<foobarry> popped a dvd in, it works but ata1: slow to respond
<popey> google shows a lot of rresults for that
<popey> ata1: device not ready (errno=-16)  specifically
<foobarry> gonna pop the drive out and boot again..
<mapps> dc jack ordered yay
<mapps> so either gonna be able to fix it or endup with another useless laptop
<foobarry> looks like reseating the cd drive fixed it, thanks chaps!
<foobarry> too tired to do any leisure activities toinght :(
<foobarry> did anyone watch the programme about the red arrows?
<arsen> so latest gen mbp 13' has no intel gpu
<diddledan_> o_O
<diddledan_> does it have nv or ati instead or is it running off vapour?
<arsen> sorry
<arsen> that statement was a collection of bad re-writes where i didnt read what i'd already typed..
<arsen> what i meant was...
<diddledan_> lol
<arsen> so latest gen mbp 13' has no NVIDIA gpu
<arsen> 15inch does :/
<arsen> so thats how they shrank it
<diddledan_> yeah the 13 inchers never did have a discrete chip
<arsen> oh
<arsen> hmph. i want to play games on a 13 :(
<diddledan_> or rather I mean the 13 inch retina ones
<diddledan_> _some_ of the previous 13 inch models that weren't retina might have occasionally included discrete
<arsen> ah
<arsen> so i have a dilemma, firstworldproblems... i have a 15" i7
<arsen> retina.
<arsen> and want to swap to a 13, but no GPU means i hsould probably keep the 15
<diddledan_> decisions.
<arsen> (its actually a US spec 15, so i want to swap to a UK spec 15 anyway..)
<hirectdex> arsen, my work laptop is a 13" mbp
<arsen> oh hai hirectdex
<arsen> yeah thast what its for basically.
<arsen> i think im gona get a 13, and just.. not play games.
<arsen> i want to be able to sling it in my bag and cycle with it
<hirectdex> so, the thing about modern intel
<hirectdex> is it's okay! it is! but it's MASSIVELY resolution-bound
<arsen> hmm?
<hirectdex> so a game will be much much smoother in maximum detail 720p than low detail 1080p
<arsen> oh. interesting.
<arsen> i can see this winter's game being Insurgency, kinda fun.
<hirectdex> it's a memory bandwidth problem, since it uses your main RAM
<arsen> yeah
<hirectdex> which is sloooooooooooooooooooow compared to real GPU RAM
<arsen> hmm well.. i mean i can (lucky me!) have anything i want
<arsen> shame there's no real GPU in the 13 :/
<hirectdex> razer blade! not available in the UK :(
<arsen> whassat
<arsen> ooh
<arsen> US only?
<hirectdex> http://www.razerzone.com/gaming-systems/razer-blade/
<arsen> swish
<arsen> i'm in chicago, could get one i guess
<arsen> maybe it's a bit leet for the office
<hirectdex> of course it is! that's the point ;)
<arsen> similar pricepoint to macs
<arsen> less ram though.
<shauno> curious, can shutdown do a hard down?  reboot without going through init?
<shauno> I guess I'm trying to hit the reset button on the front, but remotely.  man shutdown says it can skip init, but with no detail, so I'm not sure if it means the same as I do
<arsen> i wasnt aware you could do that, shauno - be interested if you could
<arsen> i guess maybe via magicsysrq
<shauno> arsen: that was it in the end.  cat>/etc/sysrq-trigger
<arsen> yeah, thats the only way i know you can do it - but its not 'via shutdown
<arsen> didnt know your reqs :)
<shauno> I had a java process that was eating almost all of my ram, and refused to die
#ubuntu-uk 2014-08-16
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<Myrtti> morning UK
<Myrtti> morning brobostigon
<brobostigon> morning Myrtti
<OERIAS> Yay!
 * p42phone is at Wuthering bytes in Hebdon
<foobarry> is that nr hendon?
<p42phone> In
<p42phone> All very leafy and ducks quacking in the background of talks
 * StevenR waits impatiently for various LTS upgrades to finish
<foobarry> lots of ubuntu on bbc click this week
<Azelphur> Got an openwrt router which has dysfunctional wifi, logread says "daemon.warn dnsmasq-dhcp[1182]: DHCP packet received on wl0 which has no address" anyone have any suggestions?
<Azelphur> I wonder if it's something wrong with the eth0/wl0 bridge, but I don't know where to check
<SuperEngineer_> hmm - disconnected whilst downloading tails - coincidence?
<SuperEngineer_> [the beuty of torrents - it didn't care
<Myrtti> I should go play with my toys
<SuperEngineer_> dear Freenode - thanks for telling me - not that I already noticed og course!
<SuperEngineer_> *of
<Myrtti> downloaded arduino stuff allready
<Myrtti> SuperEngineer_: huh?
<Myrtti> Safari Oleg \o/
<foobarry> Myrtti: i made a freenode channel, and forgot to register it. then i lost ops. its been OK, but occasionally it gets quite busy , plus lurkers, so i can nevr regain ops - what can i do?
<DJones> foobarry: Might be worth asking in #freenode
<foobarry> i might do. freenode is a bit like #ubuntu for getting noticed
<DJones> Looks  like erry was around about 20 minutes ago
<foobarry> and the queen of freenode is usually the one who helps  :P
<foobarry> its not urgent tho
<Myrtti> foobarry: you know what the prerequisites for a # channel is, right?
<Myrtti> it is a #, right?
<mapps> IM GOING GO GIBRALTAR:D
<mapps> flights 23rd september
<mapps> yay
<mapps> staying there for 6months:D
<daftykins> \o/
<daftykins> good decision sir!
<mapps> :D
<mapps> bit of a bad date tho really
<mapps> as we had an apartmwenrt booked for 22-25 in ibiza
<mapps> cloearly cant go
<daftykins> ah well
<mapps> hope work pay for first class
<mapps> theyve got enough money so should do
<daftykins> XD
<mapps> b living in la linea de cocepcion
<mapps> only thing thats a bit annoying..il still be paying for my fibre/ee phone etc
<daftykins> i've always been so horrified at the prices for even going up to business (someone i know gets flights paid for all the time)
<daftykins> ah the downside of contracts
<mapps> i hope we fly from manchester too
<mapps> dont wanna have to get to london
<DJones> mapps: Where are you based in at the minute?
<DJones> I'm assuming as you want Manchester airport, you're north west based
<daftykins> he's in Brum i think
<bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
<daftykins> hello sir
<bigcalm> o/
<DJones> Brum..... Thats south...
<DJones> :)
<daftykins> of Manc? sure
<DJones> South of me anyway....
<mapps> stoke DJones
<DJones> Ah, thats northern as far as I'm concerned
<DJones> I think the north/south divide splits at nottingham
<daftykins> you're all northern to me :>
<DJones> Heh, Australia is north to you
<daftykins> DJones: wat! :)
<DJones> If you keep going north over the pole, you end up at Australia :)
<DJones> Maybe just a long way round
<mapps> gah damnit
<mapps> cant do anything with my raspberry pi
<mapps> got no stupid sd card reader so cant do anything
<mapps> grmpf
<daftykins> ooh i might be joining some mates on a mountain bikin' holiday come October
<daftykins> heh, doh
<mapps> cool
<mapps> to where
<daftykins> seems a couple of parks in Wales are on the cards
<Azelphur> Got an openwrt router which has dysfunctional wifi, logread says "daemon.warn dnsmasq-dhcp[1182]: DHCP packet received on wl0 which has no address" anyone have any suggestions?
<MartijnVdS> Azelphur: sounds.. weird
<MartijnVdS> well
<MartijnVdS> not really
<MartijnVdS> did you remove the IP from wl0 (or add wl0 to a bridge) after starting dnsmasq-dhcp?
<Azelphur> MartijnVdS: it's all default, I've done nothing special
<MartijnVdS> because then dnsmasq is listening for DHCP.. and is confused when it gets something
<MartijnVdS> then I have no idea
<daftykins> is that even after a factory reset?
<Azelphur> daftykins: yea, I think so, I haven't done a factory reset on it recently though
<daftykins> is it some branded device you've modded?
<Azelphur> It's an Asus RT-N16
<mapps> hnmmm
<mapps> my machines stuck in some kinda loop
<mapps> starting userspace bootsplash and it just says that screen flashes same thing
<mapps> :(
<Myrtti> mapps: so how about your russia trip then, still going ahead with it?
<daftykins> hmm beef mince 2 days after best before label, with a slight smell to it... do i trust...
<foobarry> Myrtti: no its a ## chan.
<SuperEngineer> Just wasted 3 hours trying to install a cheap [2pints if I get it working] Epson XP-412 printer
<Myrtti> foobarry: pm me the details; I'll have a look (tomorrow, if that's ok)
<Myrtti> I wasted good two hours earlier trying to find out why I can't upload code into my Flora board, turns out the miniUSB cable dug from the bottom of the cupboard was faulty.
<SuperEngineer> hee hee - gave up - went to rpson - downloaded the escp driver deb package - & it's now working
<SuperEngineer> ..guess I owe the bloke 2 pints now!  :D
<SuperEngineer> [& no, I don't I don't feel guilty, it may be "as new" - his business bought it - he & his biz are the ones who's wallet it came from
<SuperEngineer> [& it only took 7 failed tries using supplied software & onboard firmware: reboots, system cleans, try agains to do it!]
 * SuperEngineer goes & plays with printer....  bfn & sleep well folks
<daftykins> heh, poor SuperEngineer, i got one of those setup nicely for mother dearest
<Azelphur> Does anyone here use banking aggregation service  like moneydashboard?
#ubuntu-uk 2014-08-17
<dutchie> Azelphur: i have an account
<dutchie> i looked at it for the first time in months today actualy
<dutchie> it's ok
<dutchie> i'd like custom categories which a cursory glance doesn't find
<Azelphur> dutchie: how does it work in terms of security?
<dutchie> Azelphur: you give them your online banking login details
<dutchie> presumably they then screenscrape it
<Azelphur> yea, that worries me haha
<Azelphur> I think it voids your insurance with the bank
<dutchie> probably
<daftykins> hell, that enacts a face slap from daftykins for that level of retardation
<daftykins> D:
<dutchie> until banks offer apis etc there's not really another way to do it
<Azelphur> yea, that's silly
<dutchie> and i can't see that happening this decade
<Azelphur> I wonder how a screen scraper works with banks that do 2fa
<dutchie> expect you have to turn that off
<Azelphur> can you even turn it off?
<Azelphur> I didn't realise it was optional
<dutchie> idk, mine doesn't offer it
<daftykins> i wouldn't be surprised if in the regs it says if you do that, all your money are belong to strangers
<dutchie> not for login at leas
<dutchie> t
<Azelphur> yea
<Azelphur> so annoying, the banks need proper APIs for this stuff
<dutchie> they do
<dutchie> but it's not exactly a fast moving industry
<Azelphur> oh cool, where are they?
<Azelphur> if they have APIs, I'll just write my own things.
<dutchie> i meant "they do need apis"
<dutchie> hehe
<Azelphur> oh
<Azelphur> :<
<dutchie> i wonder how hard it would actually be to set up a bank with apis etc
<dutchie> or whether the regs make it really hard
<Azelphur> dutchie: very difficult, I know from the bitcoin side of things.
<Azelphur> I've been approached by people wanting to build banks before
<dutchie> mm, i expected as much
<Azelphur> it has a ~Â£100m entry point
<dutchie> jesus
<Azelphur> and that's just fort he insurance
<Azelphur> dutchie: I was just thinking whether you could emulate one of those 2fa boxes ;)
<dutchie> my immediate thought is "surely the point of them is you can't"
<dutchie> although i guess not
<dutchie> public key cryptography and all that
<Azelphur> dutchie: nah, the point would be without the card and pin
<Azelphur> which, in this scenario we have (yay!)
<dutchie> indeed
<Azelphur> if push comes to shove you could clone the card and use lego mindstorms to enter the pin
<Azelphur> haha
<Azelphur> dutchie: looks like the company that made the readers has a library, haha
<Azelphur> ^ I wonder how many watch lists I'm on now for the above conversation
<daftykins> they're like pokÃ©mon, gotta catch 'em all!
<Azelphur> indeed
<shauno> I can't see why you couldn't emulate devices for 2fa.  like the stuff google etc use, that's a public algorithm
<mapps> morning
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<mapps> hm strange
<mapps> so my machine only boots if i select ubuntu advanced options and select an older kernel .23
<mapps> .30 and it just gets stuck in a loop:(
<penguin42> you say stuck in a loop - what do you mean?
<mapps> basically says like bootsplash screen [ok] screen flashes then same thing
<penguin42> do you have any closed graphics drivers installed (nvidia or ati etc)
<mapps> nope
<penguin42> ok, so you've got a regression, it needs reporting, and then to figure out what's going on
<penguin42> I'd try booting into the broken one, then boot into the working one and see if it managed to leave anything in the logs from the broken one
<mapps> ok so reboot now
<mapps> where would it write the logs to ?
<mapps> . /var/log/?
<penguin42> yeh
<penguin42> kern.log or syslog or maybe Xorg.0.log from the previous boot
<mapps> ok booting it now
<mapps> 3.13.0-30-generic
<mapps> its booted now
<mapps> hmm
<penguin42> congratulations, you've got a heisenbug
<mapps> so i should look at the boot logs and see why it failed before still
<penguin42> nod, if you're lucky
<penguin42> popey: Are you coming up here for xda dev conference next month?
<bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
 * penguin42 yawns
<mapps> morning bigcalm
<popey> penguin42: yes
<popey> penguin42: take it you'll be there?
<penguin42> popey: I was thinking of being, I see there's a discount rate for only #25 and it'll only take me a few mins to get there
<popey> nice!
<popey> would be super to finally meet
<bigcalm> Are there any other subscription based television channel providers in the UK other than Sky and VirginMedia? Trying to see what our options are once we move house
<mapps> hmm dont think so
<penguin42> bt vision?
<mapps> hows that work?>
<bigcalm> penguin42: does that require taking out BT broadband?
<penguin42> I think so
<bigcalm> That's a bit pants then
<bigcalm> I think we'll make do with freesat
 * penguin42 just uses freeview
<bigcalm> New house already has a satellite dish, so freesat will give us HD channels
<penguin42> house comes with a satellite dish?
<bigcalm> penguin42: it's not a new build, it's new to us. Current (or previous) owners had satellite at some point.
<bigcalm> I rather doubt that the owners are going to take the dish with them
<DJones> bigcalm: From memory, Sky's satelite dish's go with the house anyway
<DJones> But its very simple to connect cables to the dish, especially fi its already been upgraded in the last few years to have 4 outputs (Sky do it for Sky HD, multiroom etc)
<DJones> s/fi/if/
<DJones> When we moved in, we had an old white sky dish on the side of the house, we've never had an issue with sky & kept up a subscription since we moved in, at some point when we upgraded toHD or multiroom, Sky replaced the dish for one of the mesh ones as well
<bigcalm> DJones: if memory serves me correctly, I think it has 4 outputs. Only 2 in use to the sittingroom. So would make use of the other two to the bedroom
<DJones> bigcalm: Yep (if its been upgraded for HD), we use 2 for HD into the living room, one for SD to the conservatory using a Freesat from Sky card and one for SD to the bedroom using Multiroom
<DJones> Cables for the bedroom & conservatory I fitted myself using cable from maplin
<MooDoo> pwd
<MooDoo> ooops
<bigcalm> DJones: single single cables to the two main bedrooms sounds like a good idea to me!
<DJones> bigcalm: Yeah, very easy, just screw thread connectors
<DJones> Hey its a MooDoo Hows the new job going
<DJones> Sheesh, Rupert Murdoc on twitter "NSA privacy invasion bad, but nothing compared to Google." Erm, What, Who owns the Sun & News of the World, why aren't you in jail
<Myrtti> I believe nobody forces people to sign up for Google services or to use their search engine, even
<Myrtti> NSA/GHCQ aren't opt-outable except by moving to ... well.
<DJones> Myrtti: exactly,
<DJones> I have no problem with the NSA/GCHQ reading my google account with all its ubuntu-uk mailing list emails
<Myrtti> using email is a bit fatalistic anyway
<Myrtti> unless you use PGP on everything
<Azelphur> Does anyone know that website that you can put someones email into and it sends them an abnoxious email about using the BCC field?
<Azelphur> I can't seem to find it xD
<DJones> Isn't that azelphur.com ?
<Azelphur> lol
<Azelphur> meh, I just sent them http://www.pleaselearntherules.com/
<DJones> A few weeks back, I had emails returned saying I wasn't replying, just returning the email, after about 6 emails, I pointed out that I was replying at the bottom of the relevant email,, they came back and said that it was wierd, nobody ever did that. Oddest thing was that I was emailing our IT/tech support contracter
<bigcalm> Anybody know how bitfolk compare to bytemark?
<diddledan_> really? http://www.macrumors.com/2014/08/17/another-image-new-lightning-cable/
<diddledan_> no more schroedinger plugs?
<daftykins> mmm i saw that, it doesn't look very sturdy though
<diddledan_> it doesn't does it
<daftykins> thing is when they say lightning, they just mean USB to lightning don't they?
<daftykins> it's quite misleading said like that
<diddledan_> yeah they do
<diddledan_> it's the usb end that's interesting this time
<zmoylan-pi> well i'm sure apple will have cheap replacements if they fail :-p
<daftykins> laaaaaawl ;)
<diddledan_> zmoylan-pi, yeah Â£20 a pop
<daftykins> cheap if you don't mind dying
<diddledan_> USB3.1 is going to replace USB connectors A and B in favour of a reversible thing soon, too
<daftykins> yeah i like the look of that
<zmoylan-pi> so instead of 3 attempts to plug in it'll only take 1, think of the time savinigs :-)
<daftykins> also 100W power and 10Gb
<diddledan_> http://www.extremetech.com/computing/187882-reversible-usb-type-c-connector-finalized-devices-cables-and-adapters-coming-soon
<daftykins> indeed!
<daftykins> so for a next upgrade i'd wait for DDR4 and USB 3.1 :>
<zmoylan-pi> fingers crossed the eu then pushes for a standard laptop charger over usb 3
<daftykins> indeed
<daftykins> and Apple opens up magsafe so all laptops use magsafe cables!
<zmoylan-pi> i'd also be happy if eu pushed for a standard ink cartridge or toner
<diddledan_> the problem I have with both Type-B and the new C is that they have a really thin bit in the socket that can easily break off given the correct angle of force
<zmoylan-pi> well didn't a deep fat fryer use mag power dohickey before apple?
<diddledan_> I think I'd prefer the thin bit to be part of the cable so that it's cheaper to replace if it breaks
<diddledan_> i.e. a lightning cable :-p
<diddledan_> I guess apple got there first and stamped a "nyer nyer" logo on the idea
<diddledan_> aka patent
<daftykins> the pin part of HDMI looks pretty darn flimsy in the socket too, if you ever stare at one closely
<zmoylan-pi> prior art still counts but no one wants to spend the dosh
<zmoylan-pi> you're not meant to plug hdmi in and out every day.
<daftykins> true, but still
<diddledan_> did nobody tell the EU that USB3.1 was coming when they decided to mandate that all phones use micro-usb connectors?
<diddledan_> they could have post-poned the decision and ensured future-proofing
<zmoylan-pi> well the micro usb thing was started years before that wasn't it?
<zmoylan-pi> and if they had waitied for ratification we'd already be eyeing the replacement before it was made law
<zmoylan-pi> they need to reimplement/replace the 'standard' every 2-3 years
<zmoylan-pi> and apple will ignore it
<daftykins> diddledan_: bit of a blow isn't it :( i just got a bedside table, so if i put mains sockets in, i'd have originally picked standard USB, but now they'll need to be changed if phone chargers change!
<zmoylan-pi> so some form of standard power extension cable then... :-)
<zmoylan-pi> i do have 2-3 of them with usb sockets about the place
<daftykins> i was gonna look into getting a two-gang wall socket plate with USB built in though, is what i mean
<daftykins> oh right
<daftykins> what ampage do they put out?
<zmoylan-pi> 1 which for the apple set is a little low
<zmoylan-pi> one of them is on 24 hour timer to turn on and charge a few devices for one hour a day
<daftykins> 0o interesting plan
<zmoylan-pi> so my olpc which i use irregularly is always ready to roll
<daftykins> is the timer built in?
<zmoylan-pi> nah, separate add on to the power extension is plugged into
<daftykins> ah
<diddledan_> http://phandroid.com/2014/08/15/ignore-no-more-app/
<daftykins> hahaha
<daftykins> and now that handy page exists to find out how to remove it
<daftykins> NICE!
<diddledan_> how abiout this one for funny, then? http://phandroid.com/2014/08/13/woman-steals-mans-phone-calls-911-after-he-wont-stop-harassing-her/
<daftykins> O_O
<zmoylan-pi> well she assumed the cops would help the woman in distress long enough for her to get away
<zmoylan-pi> it probably would work some of the time
<daftykins> believe me i'd be the first to call out the crazy of listening to a 'vinyl rip' on youtube
<daftykins> but - https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=2x3UNHNo1LA
<daftykins> this is simply amazing. Blade Runner soundtrack
<zmoylan-pi> i got some of vangelis's music from blade runner on cd.  wonderful
<daftykins> ooh
<zmoylan-pi> and if you like vangelis you might like https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nz1cEO01LLc
<zmoylan-pi> made without a synth
<diddledan_> daftykins, that's an hour long!1!
<zmoylan-pi> and the best scene in a hacker movie is when a bank is robbed to this tune... :-) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZygIVDql8Bk
<diddledan_> daftykins, pretty good audio, tho
<zmoylan-pi> people these days take vinyl very seriously
<daftykins> i've still never heard a proper vinyl on a setup, let alone one i can make comparisons with
<diddledan_> the audio is running at roughly 1MB/min
<daftykins> i presently believe it's mostly in peoples minds
<diddledan_> that's 16Kbyte/s or ~120Kbit/s
 * zmoylan-pi wonders how much was paid for the setup in the blade runner vinyl video
<daftykins> is that with the 720p version diddledan_ ? :D
<daftykins> zmoylan-pi: i wondered too
<diddledan_> it seems to be the 360 version
<zmoylan-pi> i remember in a book on douglas adams where he admitted to paying for a stereo setup about as much as you could pay for a house in some parts
<zmoylan-pi> not a pop down to the hifi store and pick up a new deck
<daftykins> diddledan_: i think it's said audio quality on YT goes up as you set the video, rather oddly
<daftykins> zmoylan-pi: :D rings a bell
<daftykins> my cat is going nuts over the snipped-off ends from cable ties
<daftykins> lol
<diddledan_> appears roughly the same on a 720 stream
<daftykins> not sure if i linked this already but i put in a new table today for my AV gear
<daftykins> https://www.dropbox.com/sh/gjqwx8bztjpek09/AADRQlfdtPl83pOCGuPOsL8ya
<diddledan_> ooh, that's pretty
<diddledan_> I love how a tv used to be "one plug" and now it's "you need more than that, matey"
<diddledan_> same with PCs
<diddledan_> I've got a shedload of sockets and can never find a free one
<diddledan_> I'm sure some of them just have a plug in which isn't connected to anything
<zmoylan-pi> and remotes...
<diddledan_> what do you do with xbmc? (I use my chromecast instead of an xbmc box these days)
<diddledan_> oh, remotes!
<diddledan_> remotes are the devil's business
<diddledan_> idle hands randomly punch buttons on the remote while you're watching something!
<diddledan_> I do that all the time with my own remote
<diddledan_> I sit there watching something and then my finger decides I want to watch something else
<diddledan_> problem is I feel I have to hold the remote in case a loud bit comes along and I need to quieten it down for fear of waking the neighbour
<daftykins> hehe, thankfully my amp and TV are clever so the TV's audio gets sent over the single monitor feed HDMI
<daftykins> (if i use something TV native like the smart apps, e.g. iPlayer)
<daftykins> XBMC i tend to just play TV and film over the LAN from my file server upstairs
<daftykins> lately i've been watching a friends twitch.tv game stream from his PS4 some nights too though :)
<daftykins> that blade runner vid is currently playing too
<daftykins> i have this firefox add-on to send YT links to the HTPC to play
<daftykins> though it crashes XBMC about 4 in 5 times =|
<daftykins> (old version) need to get around to upgrading
<diddledan_> lol
<diddledan_> I've got an old nvidia-ion-based aspire revo I should look at doing something with
<daftykins> that's what this is practically
<daftykins> atom 330 and ion 1 :)
<daftykins> https://www.dropbox.com/sh/uygo5tafy0xopgp/AABETB3cQ3sIvZTxJhg9ep-7a
<daftykins> i'd love to move up to something quieter
<diddledan_> that revo was the bee's whiskered wotsits when it came out for tv use, but cheaper arm-based things are trumping it these days I guess
<diddledan_> wasn't the ion the first low-power-mass-market chip capable of doing hardware video decoding?
<diddledan_> now we have the awesome raspi gfx chip
<daftykins> heh i'd still much rather run this than a pi
<daftykins> i'd say it probably was, yeah - nice little machines
<daftykins> especially with the little 40GB Intel X25-V i have it paired up with
<daftykins> makes the image loading instant in XBMC, so no ugly delays
<daftykins> i can control it from my android phone of course :) look like a real poser by having it auto-pause a film when someone calls me
<diddledan_> the revo specifically (rather than a self-build jobbie) was impossible to get into (I broke it when I tried! :-p)
<daftykins> or show my incoming texts up on-screen
<diddledan_> nice
<zmoylan-pi> as long as no one is about if a risque one arrives
<diddledan_> lol
<diddledan_> daftykins doesn't get many of those unless I've figured out his new number ;-)
<daftykins> zmoylan-pi: haha, everyones on whatsapp really these days
<daftykins> just a couple of friends and my dad who use bog-standard SMS
<zmoylan-pi> not me \o/
<diddledan_> yeah afaict nobody uses sms anymore
<daftykins> it's not a bad thing :)
<zmoylan-pi> my nokia dumbphone even came with whatsapp app
<diddledan_> which is probably why the networks have gone back to 1990s and bundled unlimited messages again
<daftykins> a dumbphone with whatsapp O_O
<diddledan_> I remember my first contract phone included unlimited local-rate/intra-network calls in 1998
<zmoylan-pi> that's why facebook bought them, they have a huge place on non smartphones
<diddledan_> don't tell anybody I was 15 at the time ;-)
<daftykins> ah, i had no idea they were off of iOS and android at all
<diddledan_> I'm sure my dad's credit score and my own have managed to get mixed up
<daftykins> text has always been a bit cheeky really hasn't it, ultimately once a telco's infrastructure is up, it doesn't cost anything for texts
<zmoylan-pi> facebook wants to add the next billion facebook users from places with no computers or smartphones
<diddledan_> just had this drop into my thingy: http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/feature.html/ref=pe_105601_52740671_pe_button/?docId=1000821793&ie=UTF8
<zmoylan-pi> just last week even ms released a dumbphone
<diddledan_> zmoylan-pi, I would expect that to be a remnant from pre-ms-nokia days
<zmoylan-pi> no it seems to be an ms keep android out of their hands jobbie.  even if it doesn't do internet
<diddledan_> is amazon saying it thinks I'm outside britain?
<diddledan_> the "EP" from that link says it's costing 1.99
<diddledan_> amazon says in the email it should be freebie
<diddledan_> aah, you need to be logged-in
<diddledan_> brb, reboobing to OSX
<diddledan_> aaand, I'm back
<diddledan_> try again, diddledan_
#ubuntu-uk 2015-08-10
 * diddledan does the finger-jive
<daftykins> hmm Captain Philips crossed off the films to watch list
<diddledan> yeah?
<diddledan> any good?
<daftykins> mmm, pretty interesting events
<daftykins> i always find myself doubting real life depictions though
<diddledan> I just got done watching the movie "continuum"
<daftykins> maybe they just all had tea and biscuits!
<diddledan> tea and crumpet
<diddledan> tiffin?
<daftykins> mmm chocolate tiffin from down Costa
<daftykins> i murdered a whole tub (those small ones) of haagen dazs (sp) cookies and cream before :(
<diddledan> https://youtu.be/CQFiKT7rtfs?t=105
<diddledan> ^^^ tiffin
<daftykins> oh a fight
<daftykins> :>
<diddledan> I might have got the time of that paste slightly wonky
<diddledan> scroll-back to 43s for the whole scne
<diddledan> scene
<diddledan> the karzi of kalibar - reminds me of https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KBIdcUxdgo0
<mappps> hi
<daftykins> lo
<mappps> :)
<mappps> sup
<daftykins> not much, watched Captain Philips... should head to bed now
<mappps> ah cool never ween
<mappps> good?
<daftykins> interesting tale yeah
<mappps> ;D
<mappps> im watching complications
<mappps> then true detective:)
<mappps> lol
<mappps> http://www.netgear.gi/acatalog/displays.html
<mappps> 4 tvs
<mappps> and cant order amazon to gib heh
<daftykins> hmm expensive
<mappps> yea
<daftykins> that the only shop you can find?
<mappps> and digital corner..can order a tv to spain but have to have someone drive it across border..cant get a taxi across lol and walking across would be a pain
<mappps> theres some odd rule like you ay tax in spain caiim it back in gib and then pay tax in gib
<daftykins> why are things so weird over there o0
<mappps> you tell me
<mappps> 5metres over the border amazon ship ANYTHING
<mappps> like phones/tvs/laptops etc like normal
<daftykins> you could open a business
<mappps> gib side..NOTHING
<mappps> not even books man
<mappps> http://www.digital.gi/products/Monitors/LCD-TV
<mappps> few more
<mappps> Samsung 40" Full HD, LED, Curve, Freeview HD, Quad core, Smart, 4 HDMI, 3 USB
<mappps> Ref: UE40J6300
<mappps> i was thinking might get that 539
<mappps> its 489 at tesco
<mappps> fell asleep during true detective:D
<davmor2> Morning all
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<bashrc> morning
<brobostigon> morning davmor2 and bashrc
<JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Monday, and happy Lion Day! ð
<zmoylan-pi> oooh, haven't had a lion bar in yonks...
<JamesTait> Today sounds like a good excuse.
<JamesTait> As if one were needed.
<davmor2> Cecil would be so proud JamesTait
<JamesTait> May he rest in peace.
<davmor2> JamesTait: also https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0cD9cBEaNBc
<JamesTait> davmor2, I'll set 'em up, you knock 'em down. ð
<davmor2> JamesTait: I like to be predictable
<bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
<zmoylan-pi> the only good part is that it's now a week till the next monday morning...
<popey> foobarry: was it you having trouble getting irssi to scroll down?
<popey> mine is doing that today
<popey> well, scroll up technically
<zmoylan-pi> there's always the scrollback command if your keyboard bindings are acting the goat... http://irssi.org/beginner/
<popey> its not the kb, it freezes like I've scrolled back a couple of lines
<popey> so when I switch to a channel it looks like there's been no activity
<popey> I have to press pgup/down a few times to unfudge it
<popey> i think the only "fix" I have found is to hold ALT+A to wipe out any channels waiting for me
<brobostigon> i have had something similer as well with irssi, where a channel doesnt scroll as people chat, but just stays, at a certain point.
<popey> yeah
<zmoylan-pi> that only happens to me if i scroll up and then don't scroll back to the bottom
<popey> yeah, thats the bug
<zmoylan-pi> i don't think that's a bug.  in some channels if it didn't stick there it would be unreadable
<popey> no, you're misunderstanding
<popey> the bug is that sometimes irssi gets stuck
<popey> I was just saying youre describing the way it sticks
<popey> exobuzz: hey, whats the best way to update my retropie without losing all my uh - data?
<popey> do I need to move ~/roms to another place, flash and put back ?
<exobuzz> what version are you running ?
<popey> good question!
<zmoylan-pi> it never hurts to have a backup
<popey> i have backups
<popey> just hoped for an in-place update
<exobuzz> I would backup /opt/retropie/configs and ~/RetroPie/ folders
<popey> exobuzz: how can I tell? :)
<popey> also, no all the buttons in my picade work, not sure if thats retropie or my dodgy wiring :)
<exobuzz> you can't tell really, apart from git log to find out where you are in retropie-setup
<popey> hah
<popey> I think I used an image
<popey> and dd'ed to an sd card
<exobuzz> you should wait 48 hours before updating.. new version is coming out imminently
<popey> oh, okay, thats fine
<popey> will backup in the meantime
<popey> need to find a good wifi adapter for my pi
<popey> and bluetooth
<exobuzz> the images have version numbers.. based on where we are with the script etc.. you can update via updating retropie-setup and then doing a full binary install. but you may get some left over stuff, and you will need to merge in manually new configs (they get named .rp-dist)
<exobuzz> do you have a pi1 or pi2 ?
<popey> pi2
<exobuzz> ok. i pm'd you
<popey> ta
<davmor2> MooDoo: that's why you weren't in the other channel https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rMvF2pPeb5E
<davmor2> JamesTait: ^ you too :)
<davmor2> popey: it amazes me how many instruments are required to reproduce the noise some geek in his bedroom produced on a computer :)
<popey> yeah
<popey> although to be fair, the geek has samples of all those instruments
<davmor2> popey: oh indeed :)
<mgdm> that was a great show
<mgdm> I was less impressed with the R6 one though
<mgdm> in that I fell asleep during the first 20 mins
<davmor2> popey: the only one I feel sorry for is drummer, everyone else seems to be moving in slow motion and he pounding the living daylights out of the drums like a mad man :)
<Azelphur> I want to generate a graph showing my internet speeds, I have a list of all the results (upload, download), what's the best way of doing it?
<Azelphur> I can use a bit of Python to format it however (maybe CSV?)
<mgdm> Python or maybe R
<mgdm> matplotlib in Python is the way I'd go http://stackoverflow.com/questions/13545388/plot-data-from-csv-file-with-matplotlib
<Azelphur> mgdm: well it's only a one off so didn't want to write code for all the generation
<Azelphur> was hoping I could do it with libreoffice or something?
<mgdm> Oh, sure, you can do that too
<mgdm> I just try and avoid office tools when possible :P
<Azelphur> why? :P
<mgdm> Because I dislike them
<Azelphur> lol
<bigcalm> I wonder who the office tool is at my work place
<bigcalm> I fear it might be me
<mgdm> haha
<davmor2> bigcalm: hey that's not fair tools are useful :P
<davmor2> bigcalm: love you really :)  Hey dude I have a serious question for you, In your work what backend language do you use the most and why?
<bigcalm> PHP because we are a PHP development company
<davmor2> bigcalm: fair enough just wondered if you used much python but the obvious answer to that now is no ;)
<bigcalm> :)
<diddledan> ello
<daftykins> diddledan: allo
<maps> yay gpt a new phone..still wish i could fix old
<daftykins> o0
<daftykins> spendy mcspenderson!
<zmoylan-pi> i could have sent you a nokia feature phone that would resist all attempts at breaking it :-)
<maps> well its hard withou a phone
<maps> heh
<maps> the issue seems to be the phones motherboard/storage
<maps> it wont flash a recovery rom or oriinal stock lollipop
<daftykins> or the bloke that trashed it :P
<maps> it says flashed successfully but then it isnt - and when you wipe user cache or factory reset it comes up with errors on the phone
<maps> well  it wasnt trashed its not damaged hysically it just wont boot into the os..black screen as i said
<daftykins> still trashed in my book :>
<zmoylan-pi> completely knackered
<zmoylan-pi> it is an ex phone, it has ceased to be
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> let this phone from henceforth be known as Polly
<maps> ;[
<daftykins> that sketch is only funny to quote :(
<zmoylan-pi> you want to do four candle sketch instead? :-D https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OCbvCRkl_4U
<maps> work time cya
#ubuntu-uk 2015-08-11
<mapito> hi :D
<bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
<bashrc> morning
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<bigcalm> Ahoy
<bigcalm> I have a server that is struggling with apt-get update and won't do a do-release-upgrade
<popey> wat wat?
<popey> what release is it on?
<popey> lsb_release -a
<bigcalm> 12.04.5
<popey> and what happens when you "sudo apt-get update"?
<bigcalm> http://paste.ubuntu.com/12054273/
<bigcalm> I was pointed at http://askubuntu.com/a/525859 but it didn't help
<popey> is this a vps somewhere?
<bigcalm> Yes, with Softcat
<popey> sudo apt-key adv --keyserver keyserver.ubuntu.com --recv-keys <KEY>
<popey> tried doing that for each key?
<popey> also, tsk root
<bigcalm> Why tsk root?
<popey> !rootsudo
<lubotu3> sudo is a command to run command-line programs with superuser privileges ("root") (also see !cli). Look at https://help.ubuntu.com/community/RootSudo for more information. For graphical applications see !pkexec (for older releases: !gksu and !kdesudo). If you're unable to execute commands with sudo see: http://www.psychocats.net/ubuntu/fixsudo
<popey> :)
<bigcalm> I understand what sudo is for, but not why you think it's a bad idea
<bigcalm> Anyway. I'll drop back to the user and use sudo
<bigcalm> I haven't tried adding the keys, will do so
<popey> that will likely "fix" it
<popey> assuming it's a genuine ubuntu install and not some bastardised rubbish
<popey> (some vps providers say its ubuntu but actually they fiddle with it)
<davmor2> Morning all
<popey> afternoon
<bigcalm> Good night
<bigcalm> zzzz
<bigcalm> popey: http://paste.ubuntu.com/12054305/
<bigcalm> I'll get the client to talk to the hosting company to find out why the connection is timing out
<bigcalm> They do odd restrictions with their firewall
<popey> does it fail every time?
<popey> could be a problem our end of course
<davmor2> bigcalm: try pinging gb.archive.ubuntu.com
<bigcalm> davmor2: that's fine
<popey> can you get to cassava.canonical.com ?
<popey> uh, keyserver.ubuntu.com ?
<JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Ingersoll Day! ð
<bigcalm> popey: yes
<jpds> bigcalm: It's more likely that they block port 11371
<jpds> bigcalm: Try: hkp://keyserver.ubuntu.com:80
<bigcalm> jpds: I've passed it back to the client/hosting company. But I'll try what you suggest if they won't unblock the port
 * bigcalm heads to bed to fight the ill
<bigcalm> Thanks for your help peeps :)
<davmor2> JamesTait: this might be cheating but I don't care https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8tI1_KlO6xI
<davmor2> bigcalm: get well soon dude
<bigcalm> o/
<JamesTait> davmor2, wrong Ingersoll. ð
<davmor2> JamesTait: I did say it was cheating but I didn't care :)
<davmor2> JamesTait: I could of gone for https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VdQY7BusJNU
<JamesTait> davmor2, Robert Green Ingersoll: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_G._Ingersoll
<davmor2> JamesTait: You'll prefer the time ones https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Bp2Eqrvuis
<davmor2> JamesTait: and as  for freethought agnosticism songs go you can't beat this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WlBiLNN1NhQ
<awilkins> Whoa, Firefox just started putting up "suggested" tabs in my new tab page
<awilkins> Do Not Like.
<awilkins> Is there a way to disable that?
<davmor2> awilkins: use w3m
<davmor2> awilkins: I think most browsers do it by default now
<zmoylan-pi> i switched new tab to just show blank page
<SuperMatt> http://devopsreactions.tumblr.com/post/126412784207/the-very-first-time-you-are-handed-access-to
<bashrc> access to production?
 * mgdm avoids getting access to production whereever possible
<bashrc> production as opposed to prototype
<zmoylan-pi> and new versions of firefox will only run signed extensions.  it's like mozilla wants to kill firefox
<bashrc> maybe so
<bashrc> does that have implications for iceweasel?
<zmoylan-pi> make it more popular?
<awilkins> Iceweasel is AFAIK just a hack around "Firefox" being a trademark
<awilkins> And thus not shippable by a strictly "Free Software" distro
<awilkins> "they will be basically identical" : Debian dev mailing list
<awilkins> It might take longer to get those changes, because it's the Debian Stable version
<diddledan> I crave sweeties
 * awilkins considers making an off-colour joke about how "it's not politically correct to call them 'sweeties' any more" but backs down
<diddledan> awilkins: what's more appropriate?
<diddledan> awilkins: maybe "hot mamas"?
<awilkins> "schoolgirls"
<diddledan> lol
<diddledan> I'm not sure I'd get away with chasing schoolgirls these days
<shauno> cardio  *nods*
<diddledan> I'm not sure that's a valid excuse
<diddledan> might be worth suggesting it to every 80s icon for when they're next in line for the paedo-hunt
<diddledan> speaking of, have we still got any left?
<shauno> well, the chuckle brothers are still squeaky clean, surprisingly
<diddledan> wow
<diddledan> that really is shocking
<shauno> also, the island was great fun.  hoping I can go back next year
<bashrc> Ubuntu One server open sourced https://insights.ubuntu.com/2015/08/10/ubuntu-one-file-syncing-code-open-sourced
<bashrc> this is a "code over the side" thing, but still good
<daftykins> https://www.dropbox.com/s/zh86tegf56e2a00/IMG_20150811_173451.jpg?dl=0
<daftykins> ASRock Ion330 -> Amazon FireTV ^_^
<diddledan> daftykins: are those firetvs any good?
<diddledan> ssl certificate chains - which order do they need to be? i.e. root -> intermediate -> server or vicky verky?
<daftykins> well i just sideloaded Kodi and it's playing bluray rips off my file server over wired LAN
<diddledan> heh
<daftykins> so... yeah if you ignore HEVC and 4K content which is obviously thin on the ground still, it's great for the Â£49 delivered i got it for
<shauno> I'm screaming at kodi at the moment :/
<diddledan> ooh, sky are giving me some monies
<diddledan> golden handshake :-p
<diddledan> I left them last month and it seems they want to reimburse me for the privilege
<daftykins> shauno: oh?
<daftykins> https://medium.com/@ValdikSS/beware-of-windows-10-dns-resolver-and-dns-leaks-5bc5bfb4e3f1
<daftykins> hrmm
<shauno> I can't get it to add movies to the library anymore :/
<shauno> figured it was because I have an ancient version of xbmc, so I tried kodi instead, same deal
<daftykins> did you let it take over your whole profile? i.e. ~/.xbmc -> ~/.kodi ?
<daftykins> always good to start afresh when changing version imo, regardless of what they say
<daftykins> otherwise enabling full debug logging might show it up
<shauno> nope, they're on different devices
<daftykins> what scraper do you use? is it film or TV?
<daftykins> ah movies you said
<maps> what to watch
<shauno> yeah, I'm playing with alternatives atm.
<shauno> just annoyed because I've never had to mess with this before.  it just worked
<daftykins> i always install the universal scraper and leave it set to IMDb
<daftykins> default comes from TMDb which i don't care for the ratings from :)
<maps> 2hr break at home..do i watch home... LEGO.Justice.League.Attack.of.the.Legion.of.Doom entourage or entourage or don jon hmm
<daftykins> watch less get out more ;)
<maps> ive got a 2hr break a work i meant
<maps> didnt mean to say home
<maps> lol
<shauno> I'm just grumpy because it used to work fine
<brobostigon> you havent talked to my gf then, grumpyness, wooops.
<brobostigon> sorry.
<brobostigon> or what she thinks of me, to be precise.
<brobostigon> sorry again.
<shauno> that's different.  this used to work :p
<daftykins> XD
<daftykins> i need to stop watching this film i fired up for testing
<zmoylan-pi> depends on the film of course...
<diddledan> look what I just got going! https://www.dropbox.com/s/g4eg05hzu9oqix2/gem-desktop.png?dl=0
<shauno> and I thought I was bored
<daftykins> Lenovo in shocker - forcing software installs (allegedly) from the EFI into vanilla Windows installs
<daftykins> http://arstechnica.com/civis/viewtopic.php?p=29497693
<daftykins> no idea if this is legit
<zmoylan-pi> i'm sure it's covered in the 30 page eula somewhere
<daftykins> ugh your comments are always the same ;/
<zmoylan-pi> if gem had a decent browser, email client, text editor and tools i'd give it a bash
<zmoylan-pi> i have a unopened pi2 and i keep thinking of trying risc os on it...
<diddledan> I've got one of those, too, unopened
<zmoylan-pi> my current pi b is still doing it's job well...
<MartijnVdS> I installed Debian on my desktop, and it "feels" a lot faster somehow. Like when I ssh in, it's almost instant instead of the 0.5 second delay I got on ubuntu
<MartijnVdS> what could be causing that?
<Nokaji> MartijnVdS: As I understand it (and i know nothing), ubuntu is an all bells and whistles version, kubuntu and lubuntu are lighter weight for perhaps older systems, all of them are light compared to windows though
<daftykins> lol.
<DJones> I always think of kubuntu as being heavier on resources than Ubuntu (but not used it since gnome 2 days, so maybe just comparing it to that)
<Nokaji> you could be right, I'm simply quoting one of the professional reviewers on youtube, they all have different stances, but I have to start somewhere
<shauno> I gotta admit, it's been a whole long time since I considered ubuntu lightweight
<daftykins> :D
<Nokaji> it comes down to using the same kernel (kde/gnome) and then the choice of applications ... a.i.u.i.
<Nokaji> plus of course whatever we are calling the HMI bit composed of unity or other options
<Nokaji> I'm ofc open to better explanations/interpretations as I'm just getting started myself, really
<DJones> shauno: Probably right there, I tried using kubuntu on a 10 year laptop about 4-5 years ago & it was struggling, now I'm on a new i7 with 8gb ram & ssd,so ubuntu flies
<diddledan> I've decided I like systemd
<diddledan> user-jobs are funkyawesome!
<diddledan> no more futzing around with sudo
<diddledan> or weird cron entries for @reboob
<Nokaji> hmh, apparently debian has a choice of desktops but ubuntu just the one (unity) so that doesn't quite explain the lag
<daftykins> no, ubuntu has all of them - but 'ubuntu' in name just comes with unity as default
<daftykins> they can have unity removed or just another installed beside, making it more akin to xubuntu for xfce, kubuntu for KDE, etc etc
<shauno> it's a weird one to pin down.  eg, his example of ssh'ing in shouldn't be affected by which desktop it has
<daftykins> MartijnVdS: does debian have all the same automagic networking cruft that ubuntu does these days?
<Nokaji> Indeed, and you can spend time converting one distro into another, too or filling up your drive with additional s/w but I was attempting to compare the stock versions.
<daftykins> Nokaji: how do you claim debian to have a choice and ubuntu not, then?
<Nokaji> when did i say that?
<MartijnVdS> daftykins: I am using network-manager
<MartijnVdS> daftykins: what other automagic network stuff is there?
<daftykins> Nokaji: above when you said debian has a choice but ubuntu just comes with unity?
<daftykins> MartijnVdS: all that dnsmasq rubbish
<MartijnVdS> daftykins: ah yeah I have that too
<Nokaji> daftykins: you are confusing what i said, i'm referring to stock versions
<MartijnVdS> maybe something doesn't do a DNS lookup where Ubuntu does though
<MartijnVdS> who knows
<daftykins> Nokaji: no i'm asking what you meant by how debian offers a choice but ubuntu doesn't
<daftykins> just the whole tickbox installer affair?
<Nokaji> daftykins: never said that at all
<daftykins> 20:38 < Nokaji> hmh, apparently debian has a choice of desktops but ubuntu just the one (unity) so that doesn't quite explain the lag
<Nokaji> if anything i said the opposite
<Nokaji> again, i'm referring to stock versions
<daftykins> ok you keep going around in circles, i was just asking what you meant but i guess you don't know either :)
<Nokaji> daftykins: we can keep going around in circles but i already answered what you are now asking - (20:42:03) Nokaji: Indeed, and you can spend time converting one distro into another - - obviously when you start modifying it form stock, you are going to affect the resultys so it makes eminent sense to refer back to sa known/stock version
<Nokaji> daftykins: why not answer MartijnVdS's question instead of spending your time laughing at me?
<daftykins> i'm not laughing, i asked you a genuine question to understand what you meant and you're flying off the handle
<Nokaji> i am?
<daftykins> mmhmm
<ali1234> MartijnVdS: what version of debian and what version of ubuntu?
<ali1234> my best guess would be something involving socket activation, but they should both be on systemd now
<shauno> could it be something simple like the system info banner that ubuntu has on ssh?
<ali1234> maybe
<shauno> (also, why does 'date' report my time as IST.  argh!)
<daftykins> that's true
<ali1234> or maybe it's that weird DNS proxy stuff
<diddledan> shauno: is that islamic state time?
<shauno> nope, indian standard time.  apparently Ireland is now in bangalore.
<daftykins> :D
<shauno> seriously, there's genuine names for these timezones.  WET and WEST.  you don't have to invent more just in the mad rush to not have ireland's timezone named bst
<MartijnVdS> ali1234: jessie and .. whatever latest non-dev ubuntu is
<shauno> for some reason portugal manages this just fine, but ireland loses its mind and starts inventing names
<ali1234> should have systemd then, assuming clean installs
<MartijnVdS> ali1234: yes, both have systemd
<ali1234> not sure what happens if you upgrade
<ali1234> note you can have systemd without having it managing everything
<ali1234> it's a bit of a mess to be honest
<ali1234> all that stuff about it being easier for maintainers... no
<ali1234> not until the old stuff is dead and buried anyway
#ubuntu-uk 2015-08-12
<mapito> hi all
<mapito> what to watch today hm
<zmoylan-pi> packets across your router? :-)
<mapito> ;]
<mapito> im thinkin maybe home
<mapito> and maybe chinese all you can eat in spain 15 euros
<mapito> 20 euros and you can drink as much as you want too
<zmoylan-pi> helpful in a heatwave
<mapito> heh
<mapito> wakeup hungover in a sweatbox ughh
<zmoylan-pi> [Gibraltar, Gibraltar] Condition: Fair | Temp: 26C/79F/299K/538R | Humidity: 30% | Wind Speed 8mph/13kmph
<zmoylan-pi> icky
<mapito> not as humid as normal
<mapito> 70%+ loads
<mapito> now thats gross
<zmoylan-pi> MegBot> [Dublin, DUB, Ireland] Condition: Fair | Temp: 7C/45F/280K/504R | Humidity: 100% | Wind Speed 3mph/5kmph
 * zmoylan-pi whistles nonchantly...
<mapito> lol
<mapito> 100% really
<mapito> thats yuk
<zmoylan-pi> i have seen it higher.  a computer error i hope :-)
<mapito> when it was 90/100 here it was all rey/foggy outside so hot and sticky just gross even tho it was only 24c#
<zmoylan-pi> i have fan on at them mo for a nice breeze
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<davmor2> Morning all
<brobostigon> morning davmor2
<nucc1> happy rubber duck day.
<zmoylan-pi> huzzah, i know were my rubber duck is
 * TwistedLucidity is the proud owner of a vampire ducky. It guards the cludgie.
<zmoylan-pi> i also have a squeaky rubber penguin which was handy for linux meetups...
<zmoylan-pi> 'look for the table in the pub with a rubber penguin on it'
<SuperMatt> http://devopsreactions.tumblr.com/post/126496204752/watching-a-vim-guru
<TwistedLucidity> I have a papercraft penguin. Somewhere....
 * zmoylan-pi ponders what an emacs guru looks like... ::shudders:: :-)
 * m6lpi has a quick query relating to sudo... would there be someone around that might be able to confirm my understanding ?
<jpds> mapito: We would if we knew what the query was
<m6lpi> I presume that should have been aimed my way?
<bigcalm> !ask
<lubotu3> Please don't ask to ask a question, simply ask the question (all on ONE line and in the channel, so that others can read and follow it easily). If anyone knows the answer they will most likely reply. :-) See also !patience
<TwistedLucidity> m6lpi: We cannot confirm your understanding as we do not know what your understanding is.
<m6lpi> https://www.irccloud.com/pastebin/sXuu7pYL/
<m6lpi> (pastebin for clarity)
<jpds> m6lpi: Well, service is in /usr/sbin to start
<jpds> m6lpi: Maybe that will make it work?
<TwistedLucidity> What's the actual question?
<jpds> TwistedLucidity: It's in the paste
<TwistedLucidity> I read that, I'm still none the wiser.
<jpds> They want to be able to have start/status/restart/stop at the end of the sudo command
<diplo> I believe it's 'How do I allow a user to start a service with sudo'
<diplo> :)
<m6lpi> k, found http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1505075
<jpds> m6lpi: You can always log in as the user and run: sudo -l
<TwistedLucidity> Thanks diplo. In which case, isn't it just a matter of hacking "sudoers"? fred ALL=NOPASSWD: /usr/sbin/service [name] *
<TwistedLucidity> Or %somegroup .....
<TwistedLucidity> etc
<m6lpi> jpds: sure... that's what I did and how I got the current command set. I need to feed upline what's needed however as things are not right
<TwistedLucidity> jpds: FYI service is linked from /usr/bin to /use/sbin
<shauno> well that's just ugly
<m6lpi> shauno: yes it is, but that's the way of things
<shauno> so let me guess.  systemd wanted to make service available outside of sbin because users can make services now, so it should be in user paths.  but things have the old path hardcoded, so they uglied out and went for both
 * m6lpi shrugs
<TwistedLucidity> shauno: http://devopsreactions.tumblr.com/post/124823725833/systemd-evolving :-P
<popey> saw https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/snappy-app-devel/2015-August/000302.html and thought of directhex
<jpds> Don't see why people really can't use stereo
<directhex> quadrophonic!
<brobostigon> quadraphenia.
<zmoylan-pi> i'll get me moped...
<brobostigon> :)
<brobostigon> wrroooommmmm
<brobostigon> vrroooommmmm
<zmoylan-pi> *meep meep*
<brobostigon> :)
<nucc1> jpds what's stereo?
<nucc1> i'm assuming it's nothing to do with audio.
<directhex> he's making a joke about mono the .net framework vs mono audio
<brobostigon> and or mono/stereo vision*
<shauno> why does stereovision sound like some marketting cheese from the 50s
<zmoylan-pi> in technicolor!
<brobostigon> technovision
<zmoylan-pi> what wasv gerry andersons one marionvision?
<nucc1> directhex: gotcha. I read the surrounding notes and thought stereo was some kind of competitor to snappy
<nucc1> shauno: nowadays, we have Dolby atmos and other similar encodings which you need 20k speakers to perceive
<brobostigon> zmoylan-pi: supermarionation ?
<zmoylan-pi> that's the one brobostigon!
<brobostigon> zmoylan-pi: :)
<zmoylan-pi> i loved that episode of star gate sg1 they did the puppets going through the star gate...
 * brobostigon remembers that one.
<brobostigon> :)
<shauno> I read 'muppets' there.  I was thinking, they did that most episodes :/
<zmoylan-pi> new muppet show on the way, kermit and miss piggie have split up
<SuperMatt> don't care, still get the muppets back
<zmoylan-pi> i still think one of the finest moments of tv was muppet show with monkeys typing scripts, when asked if they paid them in peanuts kermit says so and has a monolith delivered to them...
<SuperMatt> they've only split so a new audience can see them get together
<zmoylan-pi> those monkeys sure love their monoliths... :-)
<SuperMatt> which I'm ok with, because there are huge numbers of people waiting to be introduced to the muppets
 * brobostigon has been conpared to animal form the muppets previously.
<brobostigon> compared*
<SuperMatt> me too
<zmoylan-pi> ah, on youtube... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FZDrGaC5wO8
<shauno> I started shaving again :)
<brobostigon> SuperMatt: do you play the drums and have mad hair?
<zmoylan-pi> an-i-mal...
<SuperMatt> used to
<brobostigon> ah.
<m6lpi> lol
<badabum18> Hi, anybody to tell me how to make anacron 2.3 variable RANDOM_DELAY works on ubuntu ? my job appears as "Will run job `test' in 1 min." but 1 mins is the period and RANDOM_DELAY=120 is ignored... :-/
<celesteh> hello, I have run into this bug: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/wine1.6/+bug/1383214 A fix is committed for vivid. I don't know how to get the fix. Any advice would be appreciated.
<lubotu3> Ubuntu bug 1383214 in wine1.6 (Ubuntu Vivid) "msiexec no longer works" [High,Fix committed]
<daftykins> celesteh: you need to switch to the proposed repo i believe to get it sooner
<daftykins> celesteh: easiest might be to grab the .deb's for now and throw them on, test it for yourself first hand... someone else might shout at me if they disagree :)
<daftykins> are you using vivid? (15.04)
<daftykins> chop chop!
<ali1234> i would get the source deb for vivid and build it
<ali1234> but probably not for wine, it's huge
<daftykins> in terms of deps?
<daftykins> or just the single deb o0
<ali1234> no just in terms of wine
<ali1234> it's massive
<daftykins> celesteh: note that your bug link even had a wiki link on how to enable proposed... https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Testing/EnableProposed
<daftykins> :)
 * diddledan blows raspberry pis
<daftykins> diddledan: you can't do that!
<daftykins> good news people, i don't think i'm going to be so much of a liability out on the roads anymore
<daftykins> https://www.dropbox.com/s/rr2eu82c41h0w77/IMG_20150812_222835.jpg?dl=0
<daftykins> ;)
<diddledan> omg, you're an anonymous?
<diddledan> or lulzsec?
<daftykins> more a downhill mountain biker really
<daftykins> if i must have a label!
<diddledan> that's an odd name for a haxx0r
<daftykins> well all the leet has been taken up y'see
<daftykins> nasty that thar China explosions eh? *speaker volume warning* : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DLfen9rjfvI
<diddledan> what happened?
<daftykins> not heard a conclusive word yet, apparently the BBC claim a fuel dump exploded
<diddledan> the report I just found says explosives
<diddledan> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-china-33896292
<daftykins> that's the last time i trust someone on the internet then!
<daftykins> it's amazing how quickly we get word from around the world now
<diddledan> yes
<diddledan> (that word was send 40 minutes ago :-p)
<daftykins> ;)
<zmoylan-pi> not just words anymore, video
<daftykins> mmhmm
<daftykins> hmm got this craptop taking minutes to boot, lets try a disk swap
<zmoylan-pi> minutes to boot... what spec/os?
<daftykins> one that shouldn't take minutes :)
<daftykins> its' optical SATA channel doesn't work anymore though since overheating, so it's a quirky beast
<zmoylan-pi> even my 1gb ancient netbook is usable in less than a minute
<zmoylan-pi> i do remember back in the day reading a report of an nt server taking more than 4 hours to boot.
<daftykins> oy!
<zmoylan-pi> which as it was been used as an email server for a certain terrible mail server needed to happen once a week. on average
<daftykins> oh holy moly the failed battery in this thing is boiling
<daftykins> not putting that back in D:
<zmoylan-pi> not good
<diddledan> zmoylan-pi: I thought that was every 12 hours for reboobs
<daftykins> ooooh i'm being an idiot!
<diddledan> I didn't say a word
<daftykins> =]
<diddledan> y'eejit!
<daftykins> even having the DVD in is what causes this, 'cause it tries to talk to it through a fudge port
<daftykins> if i pop it again the old disk should work just fine
<diddledan> fudge port?
<daftykins> yep
<diddledan> do they need packing?
<daftykins> your mouth
<daftykins> ^_^
<diddledan> o_O
<daftykins> er i mean...
<zmoylan-pi> can you disable dvd in bios in a laptop...
<daftykins> this particular issue is more hardware level, so i'm not sure that'd help. the BIOS is quite restricted on this old HP too, but it's an easy slide-out affair
<daftykins> removed it and seeing how it behaves now :)
<zmoylan-pi> or make automount ignore dvd
<daftykins> but to answer you, it's an HP G6000 with a 1.9GHz AMD Athlon64 X2, 2GB RAM and 120GB Hitachi ancient-HDD :>
<zmoylan-pi> 120gb hd... even my ancient netbook has 320gb
<daftykins> i was given it with ubuntu on from a friends mum who wanted her data taken off in order to move to a... Mac
<zmoylan-pi> linux -> mac... we live in strange times :-)
<daftykins> yip! i'm going to throw an OS on this thing then give it to my friend at the art gallery to use it as simply a machine to view their security cameras on in the back office
<diddledan> wow, it's online! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=alqtKb17Ggo
<daftykins> no login edition: https://www.youtube.com/v/=lqtKb17Ggo
<daftykins> ah no i chopped the ID
<daftykins> https://www.youtube.com/v/alqtKb17Ggo
<daftykins> 'violent scenes' & 'edited out' & 'viewing pleasure' !?
<zmoylan-pi> where's the directors cut 'now with extra violence' :-)
<daftykins> why are diddledan and Abraham Lincoln fighting in that vid?
<daftykins> ;)
<celesteh> daftykins: man, I wish I'd seen that when you posted it. I've just spend the last few hours compiling wine :(
<daftykins> wat
<daftykins> heh mate just updated his CentOS box and pasted the output, shows it removing an old kernel - take that Ubuntu.
#ubuntu-uk 2015-08-13
<davmor2> Morning all
<daftykins> o/
<czajkowski> Aloha
<daftykins> mornin'
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<czajkowski> sw/c
<diddledan> marnin
<daftykins> diddledan: this is too early for you!
<diddledan> indeed :-p
<shauno> or late?
<m6lpi> wheee thunder
<daftykins> ah you might be getting the storm we had overnight
<daftykins> my mate in Jersey had it first then i did later on
<daftykins> http://www.raintoday.co.uk/
<daftykins> it's a big'un
<m6lpi> I was up a metal ladder when it started
<shauno> reminds me, I picked up a guernsey tuppence somewhere.  never crossed my mind you'd have your own moneys
<m6lpi> didn't stay there long
 * m6lpi in Portsmouth
<daftykins> ah-har i was at Uni there
<daftykins> had a place in Southsea for a few years
<daftykins> shauno: it's superior :D i love my Â£1 notes
<m6lpi> you guys still have Â£1 notes, that's cool
<daftykins> yip :) got our own notes and coins too
<daftykins> can't really spend them when coming over to England mind you
<shauno> good :)
<daftykins> except at points of ingress
<shauno> save you getting all ranty like the scots
<daftykins> hmm? going on about "we should be able to use this here" or similar?
<shauno> yeah
<daftykins> i learnt the lesson the hard way on holiday in Cornwall
<daftykins> my dad sent me to buy something i wanted by myself as a wee one, handed over the green Â£1 note...
<daftykins> "what on earth is this" shopkeep says
<shauno> scottish notes are technically no different, but many places don't like high-value notes if they're not familiar enough with them to know a dud from a good'un
<daftykins> ah yeah, that's fair
<daftykins> i know the landlord in my local pub was very keen to play with the UV light and my local money
<daftykins> m6lpi: if the folks are still running the Rutland Arms beside Devonshire square - just down from the Lidl and Fratton train station, that's a good spot for some ale if you're a fan :)
<shauno> that, and I think it's 3? different banks maintain their own notes up there, which makes them look even funnier
<daftykins> three! cor
<shauno> it's somewhat logical that since the bank of england issue ours, the bank of scotland issue theirs.  but so do rbs and clydesdale bank
<daftykins> didn't something confusing just happen with RBS o0
<shauno> I dunno about confusing .. the state just sold a bunch of their stake back
<shauno> they took a share when they bailed them out, so they'd have a say in how it was used.  now it's no longer required they gave it back
<daftykins> well there's a big RBS office near me, they had a cashpoint on the side that was labelled as RBS before, but now it's NatWest - now i know one owned the other or vice versa but i wasn't quite sure what prompted that swap
<shauno> it's only really notable because if the intent was turning a profit on their share, now wasn't a good time to do so
<diplo> One of our customer sites just got hit with Crypto Locker, seems they've not been changing their tapes on back up drive
<diplo> Most of data lost :/
<daftykins> >_<
<daftykins> wow, i thought that thing was dead
<m6lpi> daftykins: I work in Portsmouth... I don't socialise here...
<daftykins> ah ok
<diplo> Guess not :/ we don't do their PC support but offer samba shares to them from our software
<zmoylan-pi> not changing their backup tapes... i'm surprised these days when they do take care of their tapes...
<diplo> Guy said, well it would help if we need to authorise to the drive, no not really... as if the windows machine saves credentials it'll still have access
<m6lpi> daftykins: home is near Midhurst
 * daftykins looks that up
<m6lpi> Petersfield and turn right
<diplo> Customers won't spend money, so it's their problem not ours.. we've been advising of change for 3 years now
<daftykins> ah-har, inland :)
<m6lpi> yep
<zmoylan-pi> i must rewrite my home backup software... multiple stacks of important files backed up
<daftykins> heh it's always funny when i look at google maps, i know place names just from the train rides i took to visit people
<zmoylan-pi> sadly i don't think any trains go to these places... http://www.dailyedge.ie/funny-place-names-ireland-998203-Jul2013/
<daftykins> :)
<davmor2> popey: is it me or is edge ripping off the Ubuntu logo :)
<popey> edge?
<popey> the magazine?
<popey> oh, the microsoft thing?
<davmor2> popey: ms windows10 browser
<davmor2> popey: https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/microsoft-edge even more comedic when they add the aubergine header to it :)
<bashrc> doesn't look like the ubuntu logo http://money.cnn.com/2015/06/30/technology/microsoft-edge-logo/
<daftykins> yeah i'm not seeing it
<popey> there is a little circle of friends in the toolbar
<davmor2> bashrc: daftykins the share logo is like the circle of friends in the header part
<daftykins> are they people with arms, or nodes? ;)
<davmor2> http://www.tenforums.com/attachments/tutorials/22079d1434860543-microsoft-edge-favorites-backup-restore-windows-10-a-microsoft_edge_import_favorites-4.png
<davmor2> Myrtti: hippo birdie
<czajkowski> This may be of interest to some folks - http://blogs.bodleian.ox.ac.uk/adalovelace/events/ - maybe even an Ubuntu UK day out event ?
<Myrtti> davmor2: thank you!
<davmor2> Myrtti: you're welcome
<celesteh> Hello, I'm getting a run time error 445 with wine. I'm open to any and all suggestions!
<brobostigon> we need more inforation, have you started with looking up said sw in WineDB to see if this is a known error?
<davmor2> celesteh: ^ what he said
<diddledan> I want one: http://arstechnica.co.uk/gadgets/2015/08/samsung-unveils-2-5-inch-16tb-ssd-the-worlds-largest-hard-drive/ (I had a family unfriendly in my underwear when I saw this!)
<celesteh> Run Time 445 appears to be a catch-all for a broken DLL
<czajkowski> popey: and others in the area, https://twitter.com/robinwhittleton/status/631859007087579136
#ubuntu-uk 2015-08-14
<diddledan> anyone around?
<diddledan> v. quiet in here today
<zmoylan-pi> o/
<diddledan> \o
<mappps> hi all
<mappps> hey diddledan
<diplo> Morning all
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<awilkins> It's raining.
<davmor2> Morning all
<davmor2> Morning song Blue by Eiffle 65
<brobostigon> and humid and warm.
 * bashrc was like a drowned rat by the time he arrived at work
<brobostigon> is that like wet dog syndrome?
<bashrc> similar
<brobostigon> oh dear, not good then.
<davmor2> brobostigon: the worse one is when you wear a mac to protect yourself from the rain and wind up wetter from the sweat
<brobostigon> yes that very unpleasnt.
<Laney> i was pleased that the water butt was being refilled
 * Laney is officially middle aged
<davmor2> Laney: you're not old enough to be middle aged :P
<bashrc> depends how long you expect to live, I suppose
<brobostigon> if i get to 60's/70's i will be lucky i reckon.
<davmor2> brobostigon: you plan on making that many enemies ;)
<brobostigon> lolz.
 * awilkins is snuggled up in his dressing gown and blankie
<brobostigon> no teddy?
<awilkins> Dammit, man, I'm *working*
<awilkins> The teddy is not considered suitable business attire.
<bashrc> neither is a dressing gown
<bashrc> although I've seen folks wearing all kinds of things around here, including wizard hats
<diddledan> it's been really quiet the past few days
<diddledan> where's everyone gone?
<zmoylan-pi> tis august, some are on holidays and some are covering for those on holidays.
<zmoylan-pi> as a gamer it's difficult rounding up enough people for d&d games this time of year
<zmoylan-pi> come september it'll be all the fun happy people back to the normal daily slog
<diddledan> lol: http://www.revk.uk/2015/07/crypto-wars.html
<shauno> I'm working pretty much constantly to make up for all my recent jaunts :/
<shauno> this "week" I'm doing 10 days in a row, 8 10hr shifts and two 12
<zmoylan-pi> thankfully the irish summer (today was sunshine AND rain at same time) will mean you won't miss much :-)
<diddledan> did you get a rainbow?
<zmoylan-pi> no, i got wet
<shauno> summer was yesterday on this side :/
<diddledan> aww
<zmoylan-pi> and hot and sticky at same time
<shauno> it hit 16 degrees so they called an ice cream van out
<zmoylan-pi> but it was funny watching tourists in dublin trying to work out wether to wear rain coats or use umbrellas
<diddledan> we had an ice cream van tinkling it's chimes yesterday, too
<shauno> apparently when they got him out in easter, they arranged a discount by paying for 3 visits up-front
<shauno> so they've just spent all summer waiting for the sun to show up so they can call in on the other two
<diddledan> lol
<diddledan> bad idea in ireland planning for sunshine to happen
<shauno> well, this summer has been unusually bad.  this year all the jokes came true :/
<zmoylan-pi> unless it's exam time or first few days of back to school in which case the sun will be cracking the pavements :-)
<shauno> we didn't even have a good week for the leaving certs!  that one's almost a given
<zmoylan-pi> yeah, it was one of the wettest on record which in ireland is up against some stiff competition
<diddledan> lol
<diddledan> apparently britain got flooded yesterday?
<diddledan> I missed it by being comatosed
<zmoylan-pi> but i'm sure in a few weeks we'll be asked to limit water due to drought
<shauno> I got crispy burnt on the solent.  kinda unfair advantage when I haven't seen sun for 5 months
<zmoylan-pi> if you live in ireland long enough all it takes is a little wind burn to give you an all over tan :-)
<DJones> diddledan: Nowhere got flooded, just southerners whinged becacuse the sun wasn't out
<DJones> :)
<directhex> i'm expecting to tag a Stephenson's Rocket release in a couple of hours. will people be able to help me seed it, prior to doing the launch announcement?
<daftykins> sure
<daftykins> link me up!
<diddledan> ditto
<directhex> haven't tagged this iso yet
<directhex> it is EXCITING
<directhex> will tag once i'm done regression testing
<directhex> which is slow due to the slow usb stick i'm testing from
<daftykins> :(
<daftykins> i got a super fast teamgroup one the other day, was like Â£15 for 32GB too
<daftykins> i've thrown ISOs on in under 15 seconds
<diddledan> never heard of teamgroup
<shauno> ditto
<diddledan> google says http://www.teamgroupinc.com/en/index.php
<diddledan> I have a vague recollection of that logo
<diddledan> but that's about it
<daftykins> they are big for RAM
<daftykins> usually pretty cheap too
<directhex> 3/4 of HW regression tests passed, time to boot the last one
<diddledan> is that "three quarters" or just "three out of four"
<daftykins> they'd be the same
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> er, what am i on
<diddledan> well yes. but "four tests" doesn't sound as exciting as "many tests"
<directhex> it's 4 tests
<directhex> i hammer it out in vmware until it works reliably in vmware (both bios and uefi), then i test on a real (old) pc with a variety of GPUs fitted
<directhex> first doing the install once & swapping GPUs between boots, then again with particular GPUs fitted at install time
<directhex> * a supported geforce (which should use the valve-provided nvidia-glx)
<directhex> * a supported radeon (which should use the valve-provided fglrx)
<directhex> * an unsupported geforce (which should use the hex-provided legacy 340 version of nvidia-glx)
<directhex> * an unsupported radeon (which should use mesa)
<directhex> i don't test on intel, but it should follow the same code path as vmware & just work via mesa
<daftykins> http://itsfoss.com/ubuntu-official-ppa-graphics/ - i like this news
<diddledan> the news may be good, but that site is evil! :-p
<daftykins> *shrug* was linked by someone else
<diddledan> .. I moved my mouse out of the browser at the top of the window and was greeted with a lovely overlay that to get rid of other than closing the tab I have to click the link which is entitled "no, I hate linux"
<diddledan> see: https://www.dropbox.com/s/0soocbt1k1ydfrb/itsfoss-overlay.png?dl=0
<shauno> lol, "powered by OptinMonster".  quite aptly named
<diddledan> the close link is that teeny bit underneath the "Yes! I Love Linux" button which requires you to give them your email
<diddledan> allo shauno
<shauno> morning
<daftykins> my adblocker must've gotten that
<maps> just started the minority report series:D
<diddledan> maps: that doesn't air for another month
<maps> oh
<maps> well pilot has aired
<diddledan> aah
<diddledan> really?
<diddledan> my nzbdrone/sonarr says that's due in a month
<daftykins> tsk tsk
<maps> ;[
<diddledan> mr robot this week was twisty
<daftykins> i'm waiting for month end to try that still :)
<maps> ya
<diddledan> it's awesome!
<maps> i watch it
<maps> ;D
<maps> also a new series called lucifer
<diddledan> it makes me wanna be a haxx0r
<maps> pilot aired
<diddledan> I read the other day that sense8 got picked-up by netflix for a season2. Hopefully it'll not take ages to arrive
<diddledan> but. I guess they still need to film it
<daftykins> shame Extant is still going
<diddledan> apparently the actors are all contracted for a five-year run
<daftykins> for Extant!?
<diddledan> no, for sense8
<daftykins> *phew*
<diddledan> amazon seems to think I want a Â£450 intel i7
<directhex> magnet:?xt=urn:btih:63c0824c240a1eed1ea3d6d6e6a6ec17fa5e5715&dn=StephensonsRocket2.26plus1.iso&tr=udp%3A%2F%2Ftracker.publicbt.com%3A80&tr=udp%3A%2F%2Ftracker.openbittorrent.com%3A80&tr=udp%3A%2F%2Ftracker.ccc.de%3A80&tr=udp%3A%2F%2Ftracker.istole.it%3A80&tr=udp%3A%2F%2Fopen.demonii.com%3A1337
<diddledan> i.e. just the cpu
<daftykins> diddledan: well, amazon can't be wrong so best order it :)
<daftykins> connected to 1 of 2 peers
<directhex> ( http://download.stephensonsrocket.horse/release/StephensonsRocket2.26plus1.iso.torrent )
<daftykins> one of those trackers seems to be claiming 'no such host'
<diddledan> 2 hours
<daftykins> think it's the ccc.de one
<directhex> sigh. i wish i didn't have to keep changing trackers
<diddledan> 4 hours
<diddledan> 5
<directhex> at least 1 of them seems fine to me, it'll do for now
<diddledan> mathinks it's volatile
<directhex> :shipit:
<diddledan> :-p
<diddledan> and dead
<directhex> i'm pushing 6mbit... possibly that one's the LAN peer (i'm making my NAS do seeding too)
<daftykins> i'm occasionally hitting 200 up and 200 down
<daftykins> keeps grinding to a halt though :>
<daftykins> ah well
 * daftykins can see diddledan 
<diddledan> o/
<maps> get minority report diddledan ;)
<diddledan> jeez, amazon still uses silverlight
<daftykins> :(
<daftykins> what for?
<daftykins> IV Prime?
<diddledan> video
<diddledan> yeah prime
<diddledan> and it's not working either
<diddledan> >.<
<diddledan> "We're experiencing a problem playing this video. Please try again. For further assistance, contact Amazon Customer Service."
<daftykins> ooh err
<diddledan> interesting. that's in firefox - in chrome it uses html5
<daftykins> probably uses that DRM component that firefox doesn't have?
<shauno> I Think ff should now?  since v38?
<daftykins> oh that adobe 'Primetime Content Decryption Module' ?
<directhex> i see 3 peers
<directhex> 1 utorrent, 2 transmission
<daftykins> yip
<diddledan> well in firefox 40 apazon just tried using silverlight - I got a notice from firefox that it was blocked so I clicked allow
<shauno> yeah, the adobe one.  that's what netflix is using in firefox, at least
<maps> off to work
<maps> buh bye
<daftykins> enjoy o/
<maps> get minority report;D
<daftykins> haha ok
<shauno> lol, are you on commission?
<m0nkey_> want to take a quick vote on something.. toyota corolla or honda civic?
<daftykins> directhex: your client isn't capped is it o0 crawling along :)
<zmoylan-pi> cars most comfortable to be knocked down by? :-P
<m0nkey_> just trying to get a general consensus on them two
<directhex> daftykins: iirc BT do traffic shaping on torrent uploads
<daftykins> directhex: :( that's pure evil
<m0nkey_> ha! i don't have traffic shaping!
<m0nkey_> but i do have a data cap :/
<daftykins> ouch
<daftykins> nothing here - one thing the islands telco does right ;)
<daftykins> my friend has a fun exchange with their support right now as their service has reliable packet loss, i went over and we tested 3 routers from where his phone line comes out of the ground
<daftykins> still they were pushing to charge him to install a "Home500" socket, which is just that VDSL built in filters job
<daftykins> odd given the first point should be their responsibility
<brobostigon> is there a way to make apt-get ignore errors and continue processing, after the following error and apt-get/dpkg stops, "processing halted because there were to many errors".
<daftykins> quick glance over the man page didn't look promising, though i'd not like having any errors at all :)
<brobostigon> i just thought i would ask, incase i missed something. yes erro free would be good.
<directhex> sorry about the comedy low speeds, everyone :(
<directhex> i've triple-checked the Transmission config, it really shouldn't be blocked at my end. must be BT.
<directhex> super special seeding crew: grab https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B0RgGqWAMEw8aFY1TVVqTEpjSDQ/view?usp=sharing and seed instead of waiting on my capped BT line, if you prefer
<daftykins> sounds good, i'll do that then seed to the others a bit more
<daftykins> 5Mb up - that's a bit better :)
<daftykins> i think my client prefers shauno *whistle*
<daftykins> well, a user from israel wasn't my first guess of a peer at all
<directhex> saw him on google analytics
<directhex> christ, going to bed
<daftykins> o/
#ubuntu-uk 2015-08-15
<maps> hi;]
<maps> minority report seems good
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<shauno> morning brob
<brobostigon> morning shauno
<czajkowski> aloha
<knightwise> hey everon e
<brobostigon> evening knightwise
<knightwise> hey brobostigon , howzyou
<brobostigon> well, been abit of a hermit the last week, and am happy for it to be that way for abit. and you?
<knightwise> busy week for the company , but I did get a podcast out with my review of the Dell XPS13
 * brobostigon has it downloaded.
<daftykins> knightwise: where might one find that?
<moreati> https://www.tonic.to are optimists "100 years at $25.00/yr (US$2500)"
#ubuntu-uk 2015-08-16
<knightwise> daftykins: http://knightwise.com/kw1006-reviewing-the-dell-xps-13/
<MartijnVdS> knightwise: I installed Debian (Jessie) on mine (with a 4.1 kernel)
<MartijnVdS> it's so great.. the resolution alone! :)
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<MartijnVdS> \o brobostigon
<brobostigon> morning MartijnVdS
<SuperEngineer> morning folks - anybody fancy pointing me in right direction to find out the following:
<SuperEngineer> running 14.04, nvidia gpu, latest nvdia driver [] & using compiz for Expo.  On starting machine the Expo "hot corner" doesn't work...
<SuperEngineer> if I log out & back in it does...
<SuperEngineer> temp workaround is to start CCSM as a startup app - then it's always ok!
<SuperEngineer> [nvidia driver version coming up..]
<SuperEngineer> nvidia driver 346.82
<diddledan> ello
<SuperEngineer> l o
<penguin42> hey
<daftykins> http://anandtech.com/show/9505/skylake-cpu-package-analysis
<daftykins> thermal paste on the new intel chips is so bad that when overclocking a 20 deg C difference can be had o0
<penguin42> the guy replaced the thermal paste *inside* the package?!
<daftykins> yep
<daftykins> those overclocking folk know no bounds
<penguin42> that's insane
<daftykins> well there was a case back with ivybridge where intel didn't even put enough on
<daftykins> so... yeah :>
<god__>  /server 87.117.225.166:34501
<god__> oops
<diddledan> anyone gonna try that?
<daftykins> tempted
<daftykins> :D
<diddledan> :-p
<daftykins> but then i'll expose my precious IP
<daftykins> diddledan: you do it!
<daftykins> :D
<diddledan> OMG
<diddledan> sekrit IP
<brobostigon> maybe a quicj nmap?
<daftykins> yeah i thought about seeing if the port was even open but eh
<diddledan> yes it is
<daftykins> appears to be at minivps.co.uk
<daftykins> someone's playing with IRCd perhaps
<diddledan> whois says the IP is xavvo ltd of edinburgh (a /24 netblock)
<diddledan> subleased from iomart
<ali1234> what do i need to do to upgrade a 12.10 install to 14.04?
<diddledan> a lot
<diddledan> :-p
<diddledan> you'll need to upgrade to 13.04 then 13.10 then 14.04
<ali1234> yes i know
<ali1234> but 13.04 is not supported
<diddledan> I don't know if the upgrader will take care of that or not - the repos are available in archive form at old-releases.ubuntu.org (IIRC)
<ali1234> yeah i know that too :)
<diddledan> .com**
<ali1234> i already updated it from old-release
<diddledan> does this help any? https://help.ubuntu.com/community/EOLUpgrades
<diddledan> looks like once you've got the old-releases repo set the upgrader will take care of the rest?
#ubuntu-uk 2016-08-15
<MooDoo> morning all
<davmor2> diddledan: I got a feeling that tonight's gonna be a good night
<SuperMatt> is that some kind of stirring in your loins?
<davmor2> Morning all
<SuperMatt> good day
<davmor2> SuperMatt: nothing so course diddledan was complaining of not having a song for the day so now he has that one stuck in his head because I'm evil
<SuperMatt> I see
<davmor2> SuperMatt: I'm not superevil of course or I'd of gone with Fling a chicken in the air stick a deckchair up your nose or she wore an isty bitsy teeny weeny yellow poka dot bikini
<davmor2> or just startrekking across the universe
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<MooDoo> morning morning morning....roll on friday :)
<JamesTait> Good morning all!  Happy Monday, and happy Relaxation Day! ð ð
<davmor2> JamesTait, diddledan: can only be https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rCp2h5jslKY
<JamesTait> davmor2, not https://youtu.be/fLexgOxsZu0 ?
<davmor2> JamesTait: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=stlKHh_f0-0 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7XcTyEKSnYg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3YxaaGgTQYM   (wake me up inside that is really relaxed ;) )
<davmor2> JamesTait: I have more but I think that last one will set you up with a nice play list for the rest of the day right ;)
<JamesTait> Indeed. âº
<MooDoo> howdy JamesTait bakewell fan i see :)
<JamesTait> Yeah, really like the Dales. It's a crime that we live so close and don't spend more time there.
<MooDoo> we're there for a week next week :D father in law has a van just outside bakewell :) result
<davmor2> JamesTait, MooDoo: I like most tarts but bakewells are the best :)
<MooDoo> davmor2: hehe :D  can't beat a good bakewell tart, well you can but the police frown upon it ;)
<davmor2> MooDoo: is that not still a capital punishable crime
<MooDoo> davmor2: depends how the csi find the jam splatter ;)
<davmor2> this man seems to eaten the evidence of his crime
<MooDoo> hehe :)
<davmor2> JamesTait, MooDoo: the camping and caravanning club site there is nice but it is a pain in the arse to get too :)
<MooDoo> davmor2: JamesTait I'm here - http://www.greenhillsholidaypark.co.uk/
<davmor2> MooDoo: their website is wrong In the heart of the Peak Nation Park? Surely it is the Peak District National Park.....I Know what you're going to say "You're right but don't call me Shirley"
<JamesTait> how can you not love views like that?
<MooDoo> davmor2: JamesTait I love it, that's why we're there every other weekend and staying there for the week :D
<davmor2> http://www.campingandcaravanningclub.co.uk/campsites/uk/shropshire/shrewsbury/eburyhill?rmsrc=1&_$ja=tsid:60648|cid:96123860|agid:14893459820|tid:kwd-29210479951|crid:80546559980|nw:g|rnd:2605288901638362773|dvc:c|adp:1t1&gclid=CJv25dibw84CFQ26GwodVl0FTg this is what I have to put up with at the weekend oh it is such a suffering ;)
<davmor2> mostly cause I only get 20gig on my mifi ;)
<diddledan> anyone seen this "a message to our UKTI customers": http://www.sage.co.uk/
<davmor2> diddledan: nope
<daftykins> UKI
<diddledan> scary stuff considering the number of companies that use sage stuffs
<daftykins> maybe a disgruntled ex employee
<zmoylan-pi> are there are gruntled ones? :-P
<zmoylan-pi> *there any
 * diddledan gunts
<diddledan> grunts*
<daftykins> you know that feeling when you're tasked with getting other folks to do a job, but they never call back or turn up so you might as well do it yourself? :|
<zmoylan-pi> i think i know so much about computing as i got sick of waiting for other people to get back to me...
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> this is still that wonky TV situation up at my clients, looks like i'm just gonna buy an RF amplifier myself and get it done
<daftykins> bbl o/
<zmoylan-pi> o/
<ali1234> diddledan it was on bbc news website yesterday
<ali1234> i didn't read it cos i don't use sage
<diddledan> ali1234: yeah I heard it on radio2
<Azelphur> Wow, I'm having fun today
<Azelphur> bought some used parts from a gaming lounge I frequent, they told me I was buying a Mini-ITX board with a broken CPU in it, a power supply, a LED controller + LEDs, a Kraken X40 CPU cooler, bluray drive for Â£150
<Azelphur> Turns out I bought a working CPU, broken motherboard, LED controller with missing power cable, and kraken X40 with missing backplate threaded screws so I can't attach it to the board
<Azelphur> and they are refusing refund claiming "I bought what was in the box" - tempted to call the police in
 * zmoylan-pi now imagines a very bored very non technical police officer getting a lecture in pc gubbins... :-)
<Azelphur> fun times
<davmor2> Azelphur: did you have it from ebay?
<davmor2> or amazon
<davmor2> if so speak to them
<Azelphur> davmor2: no, I bought it all in a brick & mortar store
<zmoylan-pi> doesn't paying for it with a credit card in uk give automatic protections?
<Azelphur> paid in cash :(
<zmoylan-pi> ah....
<zmoylan-pi> i _think_ they would be required to have a sign saying the item was on a sale of some sort not to be able to refund...
<Azelphur> zmoylan-pi: https://Ç¢.cc/f-p that seems to be the answer.
<daftykins> Azelphur: you really ought to stop taking stupid risks with purchases if you don't want to get burnt
<daftykins> kinda how it goes...
<Azelphur> daftykins: buying stuff from a brick&mortar store is what most people define as not risky :(
<daftykins> right with broken parts from the word go XD
<Azelphur> daftykins: they assured me they had taken it down to CEX and had CEX test everything
<daftykins> lol
<Azelphur> which only makes the story worse, I went to CEX and spoke to them about it this morning
<daftykins> a mate was telling me that CEX just get their staff to take things home and have a play
<Azelphur> they assured me that they don't have, nor have they ever had, the facilities to test broken computer parts in that store, and that at current they simply do not purchase those parts and refer people over to the Ramsgate branch.
<daftykins> still, these situations seem to follow you a fair chunk
<Azelphur> I know, I get all the luck :)
<Azelphur> I think tbh part of it is that I just buy more computer kit than the average bear, I've seen some hilarious stuff even from places you would think are reputable
<daftykins> well if your average haul is asking for dodgy bits they're unsure of, heh ;D
<Azelphur> lol
<daftykins> still amazed you were going to go non-SSD, would've thought you'd picked up on that one by now!
<Azelphur> daftykins: on a cheap build it saves Â£50 for now :)
<Azelphur> can always add one later.
 * Seeker` remembers when Azelphur couldn't own an Arduino without frying it
<daftykins> XD
<Azelphur> Seeker`: I didn't kill the arduino :D it was a software issue
<daftykins> that's what they always say!
<Azelphur> I still have that Arduino, used it last month actually
<Azelphur> store was cool about it though
<Azelphur> but I admit recently I am pretty down on my luck with scammy people/businesses
<daftykins> aaah ordered an 8-way aerial splitter box for a client just before, that should sort out his inability to control the one sky box in his house from the rest of the place :P
<daftykins> seems like turning on his Marantz AVR no longer makes the freeview drop out, too!
<daftykins> yay for things that fix themselves o0
<diddledan> AVR?
<daftykins> audio video receiver
<daftykins> so amplifier + HDMI inputs and outputs
<diddledan> aah
<diddledan> was just googling to work it out
<diddledan> I got to "Aboriginal Voices Radio, an Aboriginal Canadian national radio network"
<daftykins> seems legit
<diddledan> "Atmel AVR, a family of microcontrollers" was pretty high on teh googs, too
<daftykins> it's a common term in HTPC circles but yeah... looks like not common enough!
 * pavlushka waves to Knightmare 
<SebthreeBQM10HD> 1 2 3
<daftykins> old girl bought me this t-shirt the other day o0 https://www.dropbox.com/s/6jae95ed96deu1p/IMG_20160815_234241.jpg?dl=0
<christel> aw
<daftykins> now i feel like i have to watch some :D
<zmoylan-pi> i still have a dangermouse pencil in my stationary box...
<daftykins> :D
#ubuntu-uk 2016-08-16
<diddledan> GETIN!
<diddledan> been messing with the ubuntu loco-team-directory code. finally got it up-to a modern version of django
<daftykins> unchained?
<daftykins> off to bed for me, nn - but congrats! :D
<MooDoo> howdy all
<diddledan> ello MooDoo
<davmor2> Morning all
<algern-n> morning
<MooDoo> morning morning
<algern-n> installing ubuntu server atm
<algern-n> damned argos is not opened yet to grab an ethernet cable. 6_6
<MooDoo> bum lol
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<davmor2> MooDoo: me owld mukka 'ow am ya
<JamesTait> Good morning all!  Happy Tuesday, and happy Wave At The Surveillance Cameras Day! ð ð¹
<SuperMatt> Christ, my arm would drop off from all that waving
<zmoylan-pi> the trick is to make a dummy substitute with a waving arm and then use a predator cloak to do your daily chores...
<TwistedLucidity> Are the surveillance cameras in your kids' bedrooms? Who knows who might be watching?
<zmoylan-pi> well if they're using tablets there...
<davmor2> JamesTait: easy https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OMOGaugKpzs
<JamesTait> davmor2, yep, that's the first that came to my mind.
<davmor2> JamesTait: had to really :D
<goojobpers> Incest is the best. Put your sister to the test
<goojobpers> Incest is the best. Put your sister to the test
<goojobpers> Incest is the best. Put your sister to the test
<goojobpers> Her pussy is tight dawg
<goojobpers> Watch her big twat twat expand
<goojobpers> My dick will fuck her in the ass and pussy
 * zmoylan-pi puts on the popcorn and waits for the hammer to fall
<DJones> zmoylan-pi: https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&sqi=2&ved=0ahUKEwiD2suf98XOAhVFJ8AKHYq-AuAQyCkIHzAA&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DJU5LMG3WFBw&v6u=https%3A%2F%2Fs-v6exp1-ds.metric.gstatic.com%2Fgen_204%3Fip%3D2a02%3Ac7f%3Aa425%3A400%3Ad496%3A547e%3A114d%3A6652%26ts%3D1471350367313803%26auth%3Ddm5abugkvg4ugbis76y4ugpbqcldjkle%26rndm%3D0.5346875068346726&v6s=2&v6t=3265&usg=AFQjCNHILpHJ6 ...
<DJones> ... -bA7g_K3K707nlweLDDxw&sig2=ycamUKcsJkNWKJKg1ENGdA&bvm=bv.129759880,d.d24
<DJones> Yuck, wrong link
<m0nkey_> Holy long URL batman!
<DJones> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JU5LMG3WFBw
<zmoylan-pi> can't go wrong with a little queen
<DJones> Certainly can't
<diddledan> I wonder if they checked their spambin? https://ostif.org/ostif-quarklab-and-veracrypt-e-mails-are-being-intercepted/
<SebthreeBQM10HD> hi
<SebthreeBQM10HD> popey, ping
<popey> SebthreeBQM10HD: pong
<SebthreeBQM10HD> did you see the onion 2 on kick starter?
<SebthreeBQM10HD> popey, wht's it really for I mean something iot with linux or arduion, so hardware programing ?
<SebthreeBQM10HD> popey, or omega  2 even
<SebthreeBQM10HD> the iot thing
<popey> i saw it
<popey> not something I am interested in
<SebthreeBQM10HD> popey, why not interested ?
<popey> i dont need it
<SebthreeBQM10HD> well yeah same here I Guess
<SebthreeBQM10HD> but it's for ike hardware hacking isn't it, or to try and get people into that ?
<SebthreeBQM10HD> popey, or do you mean you already do iot things, or can do
<SebthreeBQM10HD> I was thinking maybe get the starter kit since that would only be about 60 pounds,  and then could learrn something new maybe, but then it's like hold on,  would that actually be used enough or not
<diddledan> watching zoo. it's just landed on netflix. intriguing first episode
<SebthreeBQM10HD> diddledan  zoo hmm I turned Sky One on, on like two evenings ago and it was on I belive
<SebthreeBQM10HD> or yesterday even
<SebthreeBQM10HD> yesterday or day before yeah
<SebthreeBQM10HD> but well that wasn't a animal documetanry :d, something else
<SebthreeBQM10HD> not sure what zoo is actsauly about etc
<zmoylan-pi> and this goes out to all the firefly fans that lurk here... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=amse6MX0_Ck
<daftykins> i've still not watched more than 1 or 2, everyone has overhyped it for me
<zmoylan-pi> it was overhyped for me too but when i watched it i loved it... it had so much potential and was just hitting it's stride and then killed
<agoodm> a
<daftykins> b
<zmoylan-pi> a suffusion of yellow
<diddledan> I don't think I've seen any firefly, but I watched the spinoff movie and enjoyed that
<diddledan> anyway, I'll be in my bunk
<zmoylan-pi> the movie was great but not a patch on the 14 episodes of tv show
<daftykins> diddledan: yay did you buy bunk beds?
<zmoylan-pi> it's a line from the tv show
<daftykins> ah
<zmoylan-pi> their ambassador (super high class call girl/courtesan) brings a 'client' on board and it turns out to be a very elegant woman provoking a reaction from all the crew ending with jayne cobb the mercenary/public relations making that comment
<funkyHat> Serenity makes more sense if you've seen Firefly
<funkyHat> Pretty sure I've done a Firefly & Serenity marathon at least twice <_<
 * zmoylan-pi is currently doing b5 since mr. garibaldi died...
<funkyHat> You've eaten 5 garibaldi biscuits because the inventor of them died?
<daftykins> 5 packs
<funkyHat> â¢D
<zmoylan-pi> http://io9.gizmodo.com/rip-jerry-doyle-babylon-5s-mr-garibaldi-1784462252
<popey> ali1234: you going to http://teletextart.co.uk/tickets-for-the-teletext-and-digitiser-festival-on-sale-now ?
<ali1234> no
<daftykins> that b5 looked like it required a lot more imagination on the part of the viewer
<diddledan> b5 is epic
<daftykins> as a kid it was the scifi you found on TV during the day on weekends
<daftykins> so loved was it
<zmoylan-pi> trek is made by a company that has been doing sci fi since the 60s... b5 didn't have that to draw on.  but they put so much effort in and it shows
<diddledan> I first discovered b5 in the late 90s on channel4's friday night scifi zone
<zmoylan-pi> i kinda watched it then but had missed the start and it all links up so never got really into it.
<diddledan> yeah I wasn't an avid watcher, I only saw it every so often - I've since done a proper binge
<daftykins> hmm i don't recall much from channel 4 on friday nights late 90s apart from the debut of South Park, where you'd have that, Spin City and something else on in a row
<zmoylan-pi> g'kar and londo... developed so well
#ubuntu-uk 2016-08-17
<MooDoo> howdy all
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<davmor2> Morning all
<MooDoo> morning davmor2 :) ow am ya!
<davmor2> MooDoo: Bostin' you?
<davmor2> Got this stuck in my head again this morning after hearing on an advert last night https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RYPWxymohWs
<MooDoo> davmor2: cool, ready for me jollies
<davmor2> I got the 4 days after the bank holiday booked off nice long retreat
<MooDoo> davmor2: I'm off next week, so don't go back till the tues after the BH
<JamesTait> Good morning all!  Happy Wednesday, and happy Black Cat Appreciation Day! ð ð
<davmor2> JamesTait: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qH-rPt1ftSo easy
<MooDoo> JamesTait: It's also MooDoo is being thick day :(
<JamesTait> We all have them, MooDoo. ð
<davmor2> MooDoo: how is that different to any other day ;)
<MooDoo> davmor2: shush
<davmor2> Just heard Whole lotta love and it instantly took me back to Cheggers Play Pop
<nucc1> apt-get upgrade is normally sufficient to get you up to the latest point release if you're on an LTS, right?
<nucc1> like someone running 14.04 need not do anything special to be on 14.04.04
<davmor2> nucc1: depends if you want the new kernel stack or not
<nucc1> yea, don't care about newer kernel
<davmor2> nucc1: apt update && apt full-upgrade will update as normal
<nucc1> as long as the other packages are up to date, especially on security patches
<nucc1> never knew about apt full-upgrade before
<davmor2> nucc1: new to 14.04 it is the new apt package
<nucc1> curiously, it's trying to install kernel 3.13 for me, when I'm already running 3.18.2
<nucc1> errr
<davmor2> nucc1: apt update, apt upgrade, apt full-upgrade, apt search, apt policy, apt show
<davmor2> and in 16.04 you get apt autoremove and apt autoclean too
<nucc1> davmor2: 16.04 will be when we're migrated to PHP7
<davmor2>   Candidate: 1:7.0+35ubuntu6
<nucc1> huh?
<nucc1> i'm assuming that 14.04 doesn't dump php7 on me :)
<davmor2> nucc1: what's wrong with 7
<nucc1> nothing wrong with 7, but i can't guarantee the appss we're using will work without issue.
<nucc1> so need to wait until developers give the green light.
<nucc1> davmor2: so it would seem that do-release-upgrade is a bit misleading.
<nucc1> the upgrade notification tells me to go to 14.04.1 by using do-release-upgrade, but when i run the command, it wants to take me to 16.04 because that is the current LTS release.
<davmor2> nucc1: why it does an upgrade to a newer distro
<nucc1> upgrade preferences are set to prefer LTS
<nucc1> but that's not what the upgrade notification tells you
<nucc1> i should probably file a bug about this.
<nucc1> assuming i'm not horribly confused
<nucc1> i ahve a snapshot, so i'm going to go ahead with the upgrade to confirm this.
<davmor2> nucc1: it possibly was correct at the time of release if you are still on 14.04 rather than 14.04.x
<popey> can you screenshot the image?
<nucc1> popey: i can screenshot the image when it suggests that i should use do-release-upgrade to install14.04.1
<popey> yeah, that would be interesting
<nucc1> and also how it appears that the command is actually proposing to take me to 16.04
<popey> also, what does "lsb_release -a" say you're on now?
<davmor2> nucc1: also can you do sudo apt update && apt list --upgradable | grep do-release-upgrade
<nucc1> oddly, after i ran lsb_release -a
<nucc1> it now shows 16.04.1 as available
<nucc1> let me revert to previous snapshot.
<nucc1> btw, lsb_release -a says i'm on 14.04.5
<nucc1> sorry davmor2, popey it seems i was reading it wrongly. it actually says 16.04.01
<nucc1> somehow i read it as 14.04.01
<popey> Huzzah
<nucc1> that's what led me to ask if apt-get update was sufficient to get me on 14.04.5
<nucc1> because i thought it was telling me i'm still on something before 14.04.1 even after apt-get update && apt-get upgrade
<diddledan> http://insights.ubuntu.com/2016/08/09/howdy-windows-a-six-part-series-about-ubuntu-on-windows-for-linux-com/
<diddledan> seems the latest build of windows doesn't like itunes maybe?
<diddledan> since uninstalling itunes it is stable where previously I was having bsods
<diddledan> have to try reinstalling to see if the symptoms reappear
<popey> ho ho
<popey> sorry
<davmor2> popey: liar
<popey> true dat
<davmor2> popey: see I knew you weren't sorry about some guy having issue on windows with itune and venting about it in an Ubuntu irc channel ;) Not picking on you or anything diddledan Honest Gov'nor
<diddledan> :-p
<zmoylan-pi> now... about my os/2 installation... ;-)
 * popey hugs his Palm T|X
<daftykins> diddledan: perhaps it's the services doing something it doesn't like
<davmor2> daftykins: don't try and help him with sensible suggestions, stick with it is the bitter rivalry between apple and microsoft deliberately breaking each others software so you use their services ;)
<daftykins> oh the only sensible suggestion is removing it and purging all Apple devices from ownership, sir ;)
<daftykins> did you know that iTunes overtook even java to be the most exploited unpatched program on Windows in North America?
<daftykins> it's the wrong trousers, Gromit! https://i.imgur.com/sKiw8uV.mp4
<diddledan> daftykins: I'm concerned that it appears to be.. Erm.. Excited
<diddledan> The animal, I mean
<daftykins> from the rear o0
<diddledan> I can't really discern the direction. I'm currently on my phone
<daftykins> o0
<algern-n> hei so something really weird is going on
<algern-n> filezilla returns econnrefused from server. yet i can safely connect with putty's psftp
<algern-n> put and get objects easily. any ideas as to why?
<daftykins> describe this setup in a bit more detail
<algern-n> filezilla used to work just fine yesterday and there have been no changes on either the server or the client either
<daftykins> what OS on host A and B?
<algern-n> server is running ubuntu server and client is windows 10
<daftykins> grab WinSCP and try it
<algern-n> well really i was hoping that someone hhas encountered the same issue with filezilla
<algern-n> since i can just keep to psftp if i want to be using another program
<algern-n> but yeah, good idea. thanks. i might just do that sincee winscp is GUI and psftp is just cmd linee
<daftykins> yeah i imagined that's what you were after
<daftykins> if you're really married to continuing with filezilla, which makes absolutely no sense whatsoever, you'll need to provide some connection logs from both ends
<nucc1> filezilla defaults to port 21
<nucc1> very likely there is no FTP server running
<nucc1> make sure you're connecting to port 22 if you're doing SFTP
<nucc1> econrefused is the common string used to indicate that "server is not listening on this port" algern-n
<algern-n> oh thanks for the suggestion nucc1
<algern-n> i'll see to a ftp server being configured on server
<nucc1> avoid configuring an FTP server
<algern-n> oh? would you advocate using sftp over ftp?
<nucc1> the protocol sucks (but you probably don't care aboutthis) -- it's also insecure.
<daftykins> nucc1: that wouldn't explain it suddenly stopping working
<daftykins> algern-n: always, FTP is 90s trash
<algern-n> aw
<nucc1> sftp is a much better and easier to use protocol
<algern-n> ok winscp is working just fine on 22. thakns daftykins nucc1 :)
<nucc1> daftykins: if he closed filezilla and relaunched it, no surprise if he forgot to select the port while attempting to connect
<daftykins> doesn't it work on saved profiles? or make you pick SFTP? i don't use it
<nucc1> filezilla is designed for the FTP world, with SFTP bolted on
<algern-n> well you say you probably don't care about this and you would probably be right since i've no idea as to how exactly ftp protocol differs from sftp protocol or what ftp protocol *really* is
<nucc1> well, use SFTP 100% of the time if you can help it.
<nucc1> it's unfortunate that they happen to have similar names.
<algern-n> doesn't sftp stand for secure File transfer protocol?
<algern-n> :/
<daftykins> if these hosts are both on your private home LAN, then there's not really too much to be worried about
<daftykins> just to confuse you, there's ftps and sftp :D
<nucc1> i'd wager it's SSH file transfer protocol.
<daftykins> the former being standard FTP with SSL (still old and not great)
<nucc1> FTPS is the secure version of FTP, but it's not in widespread use...
<daftykins> yeah it's a mess to set up really, i used to run it for many years
<nucc1> contrasted with SFTP which is basically just install openssh-server
<algern-n> right right
<nucc1> so is filezilla working when you specify port 22?
<algern-n> nucc1 it does. however I had opensshserver installed on localhost so it seems peculiar that there'd be no listen on port 21 :/
<nucc1> no, it's not peculiar
<algern-n> perhaps it hasnt been ocnfigured?
<nucc1> SFTP runs on port 22
<nucc1> filezilla is just crappy, that it doesn't adjust the port for you when you choose SFTP
<algern-n> well yes, I meant why it wouldn't work with simple ftp protocol (port 21) rather than sftp
<nucc1> Winscp does this, and pretty much everything else, that's why they can connect just fine with no special effort
<nucc1> openssh doesn't talk FTP :)
<algern-n> aw
<nucc1> you'd need something like vsftpd for that.
<algern-n> he should've taken a languages module at uni then =O
<nucc1> which is not a recommendation to install it :)
<nucc1> he's actually just snobbish
<nucc1> only speaks the queen's english
<algern-n> patriarchal sexist society man. what is openssh is a woman eh? i mean it does say it's always "open" -_-
<daftykins> don't put FTP on a Linux host
<daftykins> anyone who does is announcing they have no idea what they're doing
<nucc1> not like the peasant ftp daemons out there that carry on like savages speaking broken english
<algern-n> aw. so I can carry on not knowing what I am doing without the whole network knowing it. neat
<nucc1> i mean, if the entire ubuntu is a woman, why can't tiny openssh be a man?
<daftykins> well no because you don't have FTP, you have SFTP
<daftykins> !sftp
<lubotu3> SSH is the Secure SHell protocol, see: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/SSH for client usage. PuTTY is an SSH client for Windows; see: http://www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/~sgtatham/putty/ for its homepage. See also !scp (Secure CoPy) and !sshd (Secure SHell Daemon)
<algern-n> the great ssh clit. tickle it just right and you're in the network 6_6
<daftykins> that's wholly inappropriate talk for this channel, don't do it again
<daftykins> family friendly at all times
<algern-n> !time
<lubotu3> Information about using and setting your computer's clock on Ubuntu can be found at https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuTime - See https://help.ubuntu.com/lts/serverguide/NTP.html for information on usage of the Network Time Protocol (NTP)
<algern-n> ok :)
<nucc1> when you ever decide to run for political office, i will pull these chat logs
<nucc1> and run your campaign to the ground, algern-n
<nucc1> :p
<algern-n> so I'm wondering if having this client ~ server connection going through a router is detrimental to speed transfer and the speed of the whole network as a whole.
<nucc1> no, it's not detrimental to speed.
<nucc1> it all depends on the competence of the router at hand, and what kinds of links are both sides of the router.
<algern-n> nucc1 you'd be the wikileaks to the hilary democracy train. -_-
<nucc1> the mere fact of passing through a router is not a problem.
<algern-n> mhm. however consider this for a second
<algern-n> if I am to get a network hub to link all computers at hand through (well.. server and client are the ones im interested in atm) would that affect the network in any way?
<nucc1> hubs are pretty much extinct.
<algern-n> momentarily the top speed i can transfer things is about 1mb/s which seems utter nonsese
<algern-n> nonsense *
<algern-n> i get more than that downloading p2p
<nucc1> your p2p traffic is passing through routers too
<nucc1> p2p doesn't imply absence of routers, it implies the absence of intermediary servers.
<algern-n> sure I wasn't arguing that
<nucc1> many things affect your connection speed, such as QOS policies on devices in the network that mediate you rcommunication.
<daftykins> using SFTP will slow down throughput though since it's encrypted
<nucc1> well, the CPU can encrypt the payload much faster than you rnetwork can send it
<algern-n>  I'm simply saying that I get faster speeds downloading p2p via internet than I get on my local network
<daftykins> if you just want to throw files about you'd be better off setting up one end with windows file sharing (aka samba on Linux) and using it that way.
<daftykins> nucc1: real world experience disagrees with that
<nucc1> daftykins: the thing that slows SFTP is not encryption, it's more protocol overhead.
<daftykins> well whatever you want to call it, it's not a good choice if throughput is desired
<nucc1> i wish i had time to do some benchmarks
<nucc1> sure, it will affect speeds, maybe 10% or something.
<daftykins> rubbish
<daftykins> i do, i have a 12TB Linux file server right beside me - and i guarantee if i fire it up, SFTP will suck big time compared with just samba over gigabit LAN
<nucc1> appreciate if you can do that :)
<nucc1> i'm curious.
<daftykins> yep will do in a couple
<algern-n> samba you say? ok
<nucc1> let me see if i can run a test using an ubuntu iso
<nucc1> samba or http
<nucc1> either one will be fine.
<nucc1> iirc, samba has a bit of overhead too.
<daftykins> err http would not be a sane 2 way file sharing protocol for between a Windows and Linux host
<nucc1> forget about idealness for now
<nucc1> we just want to see how much sftp affects throughput
<daftykins> no it needs to be appropriate to the task regardless
<nucc1> if that is so, then i think you ought to be comparing ftp and sftp, no?
<daftykins> http compared with the others would be an apples to oranges comparison
<daftykins> not since we just got through bashing FTP into oblivion no, i won't entertain it at all
<nucc1> the protocol sucks (from a network admin and security POV), but it's a competent file transfer protocol
<daftykins> just no
<nucc1> well, lemme not keep you from running the tests
<daftykins> only just booting the machine :)
<nucc1> i'm downloading ubuntu iso into my VM
<daftykins> that's quite a rude move on your part though
<nucc1> to test HTTP and SCP.
<nucc1> rude move?
<daftykins> yeah akin to saying "get on with it"
<nucc1> ah, no
<nucc1> i just didn't want to keep you arguing and away from running the test
<nucc1> sorry about that
<nucc1> unless you can multitask lol
<daftykins> i don't have to, the computers can ;)
<daftykins> http://imgur.com/a/V5eY3
<daftykins> windows -> samba file share vs. WinSCP to the same
<daftykins> almost a 4 fold improvement with samba
<nucc1> yea
<daftykins> as Kryten would say, *smug mode*
<nucc1> daftykins: errr no
<nucc1> don't run them simultaneously.
<daftykins> lol, you're hilarious - btw my birth date isn't yesterday
<daftykins> i simply combined both transfers into the same image.
<nucc1> he he
<nucc1> interesting.
<daftykins> it'd also be faster but that RAID volume is geared toward protection of written data right now, in the default config
<nucc1> anyway, i think it's just the protocol itself, and not the encryption.
<daftykins> lets see, i'll repeat and check top
<nucc1> can't remember the name of the project that was aiming to speed up ssh
<nucc1> https://mosh.org/
<nucc1> i wonder how that one would fare...
<daftykins> 40% load from sshd during a single transfer
<algern-n> that's neat.
<algern-n> ^ imgur link. it's seeing a rabbit racing a turtle rly 6_6
<nucc1> the race is not always to the swift :p
<nucc1> didn't realise sftp was this bad for perf though.
<daftykins> totally depends on the task at hand
<daftykins> well, i like to think i don't tell any lies when i make a statement...
<daftykins> from what i'm reading mosh can't be used in this way
<nucc1> it seems so
<nucc1> i need to make a note to play around with mosh one of these days.
<algern-n> you're having a laugh....
<nucc1> having a laugh?
<nucc1> it was interesting info
<daftykins> who, and with regard to what?
<algern-n> I just bought a keyboard and I need to remap it as it doesn't have the "\" character
<algern-n> sorry, I was just surprised and I had this channel opened.
<nucc1> but it actually won't change my habits, because Samba is not an option for most of my needs
<daftykins> do you also have an enter key that only exists on one row? sounds like you bought a US layout one ;)
<nucc1> don't make the mistake of typing your password here though :)
<daftykins> nucc1: yeah, horses for courses, always
<algern-n> ******* :)
<algern-n> daftykins no and yes
<algern-n> it doesnt have the single row enter key but it is a usa layout :(
<nucc1> btw, daftykins could be that openssh is not leveraging CPU AES instructions... and is doing it all in software...
<algern-n> yet it's still better than the previous wired one. it resembled much a type writer in regards to the noise it was making.
<algern-n> sorry, i have the habit of going on in tangential thinking which seems a little disorganised.
<algern-n> while samba is feasible and preferable for speed of transfer on local network, it wouldn't be of much help if I were to start running on a hosted server
<algern-n> would it be fair to assume that?
<nucc1> why won't it be an option?
<nucc1> it's just that access control is a bit more involved
<algern-n> i thought the samba protocol is just over local networks.
<algern-n> I do admit i'm more than just a little in over my head. :)
<daftykins> nucc1: if it were you'd see at least one core maxxed out surely
<daftykins> algern-n: yes i wouldn't run samba over the internet, but i was under the impression you are using both at home
<daftykins> the ideal solution depends on the details of the task at hand, which we do not have
<algern-n> sure. it was hypothetical
<daftykins> have knowledge of, i mean
<algern-n> currently I'm  only trying to get magento (ecommerce) installed on a dedicated server and it was taking quite a while to get all archives loaded to the server
<nucc1> daftykins: possibly, but if network latency ties into it too, then that might explain why it's only 40%
<nucc1> this means there's probably room for some serious optimization.
<daftykins> it's on my idle gigabit network...
<daftykins> i'm face palming at you big time
<nucc1> remember that saying.
<nucc1> to fetch data from main memory to a CPU is like fetching food from pluto
<nucc1> to fetch from the 1ms network is like going to Andromeda
<nucc1> sure, your gigabit network has low latency by human standards, but it's a galaxy away for the CPU.
<daftykins> the numbers have already proved my claims, i don't see what you're going to prove with any further finger service :)
<nucc1> i'm not doubting your claims, i'm just thinking of explanations
<nucc1> what can you think of that will cause the transfer speed to be low, while the CPU is not maxed out?
<daftykins> it's already been said
<daftykins> i think i'd rather talk to someone who internalises those ramblings :P
<nucc1> is your fileserver an x86 or an arm?
<daftykins> the former, a proper full PC with an 8 disk RAID6
<daftykins> hardware controller, so it's not the RAID slowing anything down in the above
<nucc1> running linux?
<nucc1> i can't tell what cipher ssh used/uses, but you can use openssl to bench the crypto speed
<daftykins> yes, since that was the topic
<nucc1> openssl speed -elapsed -evp aes-128-gcm
<nucc1> well, that's not a particularly fast cipher.
<daftykins> is that the default?
<nucc1> i don't think so, but it would be an AES based cipher.
<nucc1> lemme see if i can gleam it from openssh config
<nucc1> #   Ciphers aes128-ctr,aes192-ctr,aes256-ctr,arcfour256,arcfour128,aes128-cbc,3des-cbc
<nucc1> now need to translate that into openssl language
<nucc1> easy lol, just picked the first one: openssl speed -elapsed -evp aes-128-ctr
<nucc1> assuming that the first cipher is used, we could try that.
<daftykins> i feel it's already lost relevance for me now, this topic
<nucc1> on my core-i5 desktop, i get 3626303K per second.. which is huge
<nucc1> assuming i'm not cross-eyed.
<daftykins> for 8KB?
<nucc1> 8KB blocks, yes.
<nucc1> i think that is 3GB/sec is it not?
<daftykins> i only threw an old core 2 duo in this, i'm seeing 361125.21k
<nucc1> so that's 361MB/sec
<nucc1> which is far more than your gigabit network can handle
<nucc1> so i think we can agree that encryption is not the bottleneck
<daftykins> no
<daftykins> 'cause i'm still not aware for certain what's in use by default
<nucc1> you can see this in /etc/ssh/sshd_config
<nucc1> the list of supported ciphers.
<nucc1> if you want, we can bench them all
<daftykins> right but we don't know what got negotiated
<nucc1> there are ordered by strength.
<algern-n> ugh. 21k for 8kb. i should upgrade it.
<daftykins> wat
<daftykins> what is it?
<nucc1> i think the last one on the list is the fastest
<nucc1> grep Ciphers /etc/ssh/sshd_config
<daftykins> please stop the patronising level, nucc1
<algern-n> oh nothing. i just ran nucc1 's openssl speed test and i got discouraged by the little numbers
<daftykins> pretty sure it's not #ubuntu-uk-school :P
<nucc1> come on man
<daftykins> algern-n: yes but what's the hardware it's on?
<nucc1> i just don't want to assume too much
<algern-n> oh i'm bluhsing merely thinking of it
<algern-n> intel atom, enough said
<daftykins> spit it out
<nucc1> it's not saying you don't know, it's just in case you don't know, there's the answer
<daftykins> which one?
<daftykins> grep -i model /proc/cpuinfo
<daftykins> nucc1: it's irritating.
<algern-n> ugh... i think it's a 1.66ghz
<algern-n> n model. hold..
<daftykins> model is more relevant than clock speed
<algern-n> n455
<daftykins> clocks are more a measure of opportunity
<algern-n> werid. i can access localhost
<algern-n> yet when i'm going for localhost/magento it returns error 500
<daftykins> we have no idea what you're doing, can't read minds
<algern-n> sorry
<nucc1> something's wrong causing an error in the web app
<nucc1> tail the apache error log perhaps
<algern-n> I am trying to install Magento (eCommerce software) on localhost.
<algern-n> i've just finished setting permissions for /var/www/html and somehow it won't run it.
<daftykins> localhost just means the machine you're on, of which we already know you have a minimum of 2
<nucc1> daftykins: interestingly, the second-to-last cipher in the list yields only 683MB/s on my machine.
<daftykins> so it's kinda daft to say localhost given we all have a localhost... :P
<algern-n> daftykins i mean localhost on server. I'm using putty to work on said n455 server
<nucc1> so i think the fastest ciphers are prefered by openssh
<daftykins> yeah so call it 'the atom server' perhaps ;)
<daftykins> KiTTY has some benefits over PuTTY by the way, like URL parsing if you turn it on
<nucc1> me, i just install cygwin
<algern-n> i think i'll redownload the software. perhaps there was an error there#
<daftykins> very 90s :)
<nucc1> tail /var/log/apache2/error.log
<nucc1> should tell you why you're getting a 500
 * nucc1 goes to water the garden
<MooDoo> evening all
<daftykins> \o
<mapps> ello
<diddledan> humble programming book bungle: https://www.humblebundle.com/books/joy-of-coding-book-bundle
<mapps> my interets so slow atm:((
<daftykins> http://imgur.com/a/fFo0Y
<daftykins> Hitman looks so good
<iamkey> [Wed Aug 17 23:42:32.992526 2016] [:error] [pid 16813] [client 77.102.214.57:58945] PHP Fatal error:  Call to undefined function simplexml_load_string() in /var/www/html/magento/$
<iamkey> [Wed Aug 17 23:42:32.992635 2016] [:error] [pid 16813] [client 77.102.214.57:58945] PHP Stack trace:
<iamkey> that does look neat daftykins. is it run in wine?
<diddledan> daftykins: now that folk have wsl running some gui stuff, what about running msoffice in wine in wsl in windows?
<diddledan> or maybe run msoffice in wine in wsl in windows in qemu in wsl in windows in virtualbox in <insert host here>?
<diddledan> mayeb pop an indirection between the windows in qemu to be windows in qemu in ubuntu in qemu
<diddledan> gotta love the speed of emulating an x86 inside an emulated x86 :-p
<diddledan> (none of this hardware-virtual nonsense. we want full emulation!)
<diddledan> maybe pop a bochs (ppc) emulator running osx tiger
<diddledan> an emulated x86 emulating ppc emulating x86 will be killerfast
<daftykins> today it's me playing the acronym game
<daftykins> i vote - World Surf League
<diddledan> women's sexy lingere?
<daftykins> just earlier i wondered why my (horrible) OS X vmware VM didn't run, i'd forgotten to patch its' binaries since the reinstall, since the winders 10 upgrade
<daftykins> weird you have to mod vmware really to make it run things it's capable of
<diddledan> yeah, it's an attempt by vmware to enforce something that apple mandate (seems silly that vmware want to do someone else's legal work for them)
<daftykins> Apple would probably block vmware fusion if they didn't comply :<
<diddledan> maybe
<daftykins> iamkey: no i run an OS my games work in
<diddledan> iamkey: he means OS/2 :-p
<diddledan> oh wait, that's zmoylan-pi
<daftykins> ;D
<daftykins> iamkey: you might want to stick to one nickname whilst you're here, so as to not confuse people
<diddledan> err. does that suggest I should know who it is?
<daftykins> nah
<mapps> hmmm what to watch;D
<daftykins> new person / lurker
<diddledan> lurkio?
<iamkey> daftykins network disconnects yet nicks don't ping time out until a little later ;)
<diddledan> then use an _ after your name to indicate a second iteration
<algern-n> no no, I do it for Aiur.
<daftykins> algern-n: which is why you kill your ghost and use appropriate alternative nicknames
<algern-n> but Casper is really cool, man. also can you kill ghosts?
<algern-n> aren't they like zombies?
<diddledan> /nickserv ghost <nick> <password>
<daftykins> and that's you ignored
<algern-n> toodle-loo
<algern-n> thanks dan
<daftykins> diddledan: so what was your meaning of WSL thar?
<diddledan> windows subsystem for loonecks
<daftykins> oic that wotsit
<diddledan> wotsits are fowl things
<diddledan> foul**
<daftykins> i used to get really sad when i'd open a pack and find it'd been torn open in the multipack bag in transit, so they'd all be hard and blech inside :P
#ubuntu-uk 2016-08-18
<SebthreeBQM10HD> hi
<mappps> hmm
<mappps> sleep...try do or watch new bourne
<mapps> hmm anyone here watch agents of shield? need a new show to watch
<mapps> 26c 69% humid here ARGHHHH
<knightwise> Morning everyone
<MooDoo> howdy :)
<knightwise> hey MooDoo
<knightwise> how are you doing today
<MooDoo> knightwise: yeah not bad, just winding down for my hols next week :D
<knightwise> Lucky
<knightwise> hmm. interwebz are spotty at work today
<MooDoo> I'm having fun with printers :D
<davmor2> MooDoo: dude you print on printers there is nothing fun to be done there, unless you are making a life sized firefly
<davmor2> Morning all
<MooDoo> davmor2: shush
<davmor2> MooDoo: Printers just aren't fun any more you plug it in connect it to the network and connect to it ;)
<knightwise> MooDoo is probably herding printers
<knightwise> or doing a printer dragrace
<MooDoo> having to use old cups drivers as it's rhel 5
<davmor2> MooDoo: ah there is you're problem :P
<knightwise> Shudders
<knightwise> *cups*
<davmor2> knightwise: how else do you drink tea?
<knightwise> I just chew the leaves and drink boiling water
<davmor2> knightwise: hahaha
<knightwise> Running Ubuntu mate in a Vm on the surface pro 4, :) Smooth as silk
<knightwise> Oooh :) John Carpenter , the guy who makes the "Stranger Things" music ... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3YZ60mQA4Q8
 * popey runs youtube-dl -x "https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3YZ60mQA4Q8&list=RD3YZ60mQA4Q8"
<knightwise> Popey , there is a link to an entire playlist there
<popey> yeah, that's what i posted :)
<knightwise> Aha :)
<knightwise> Great themes there , original Terminator, escape from new york etc
<popey> alan@gort:~/Music/John Carpenter/Vortex$ ls -l | wc -l
<popey> 48
<popey> \o/
 * knightwise happy to have made popey's day 
<davmor2> NSFW but funny as hell if you haven't seen it https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=13roSy7kdLI
<JamesTait> Roses are red, Or sometimes white, Or yellow, This poem is rubbish.  Happy Bad Poetry Day! ð
<knightwise> DAFFIDILS ...  EXTERRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRMINATE DAFFIDILS ... #dalekpoetry
<davmor2> JamesTait: there can be only one https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7UKpZxM-c9w
<knightwise> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F0HRJqUahlE
<davmor2> JamesTait: and for a song https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EjjMH_PdCvI
<brobostigon> good morning boys and girls.
 * knightwise looks for hot needle to pierce eardrums
<knightwise> morning brobostigon
<brobostigon> morning knightwise
<davmor2> knightwise: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A8JJH7ZL_Fk
<knightwise> YOU WIN this battle davmor2 , but you havent won the war !!!!!
 * knightwise cackles and disappears in a cloud of smoke
<MooDoo> davmor2: knightwise here's one for you https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tVj0ZTS4WF4
<davmor2> MooDoo: kinda reminds me of this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VXa9tXcMhXQ
<davmor2> MooDoo: which then reminds me of this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dwaxWoJPUC0
<knightwise> That is BRILLIANT
<davmor2> knightwise: no this is brilliant https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2NbnQZrK8xA
<davmor2> I love the way bill bailey head works :)
<knightwise> Fantastic
<knightwise> watching him battle "the match of the day" themesong
<knightwise> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jRGaoxBTA_0
<davmor2> knightwise: the full version from part troll or tinsel worm is better
<davmor2> knightwise: enjoy this after https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PHhlHhWGUhw
<popey> \o/ bill bailey https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m4wzJZdmelA
<davmor2> popey: you could of just left it at \o/ bill bailey ;)
<davmor2> duelling sitars
<user123> guys
<user123> using 14.04.5 lts, fglrx won't install
<user123> it says something is missing and that it is broken. fresh install
<daftykins> what card?
<daftykins> and kernel
<user123> ati radeon 5450 it is supported according to wiki
<user123> default kernel
<user123> 4.4.0
<daftykins> well that's only the default on a newer HWE stack but yeah
<daftykins> that's deprecated so you're better off sticking to the 'radeon' open source driver, you won't get newer with that card
<user123> yeah a suggestion online suggested to remove the stack but then unity breaks
<daftykins> it has long since moved to legacy status
<daftykins> yes you would have to install from 14.04.1 media then upgrade to stay on the 3.13 kernel really
<user123> i need fglrx. I downloaded this lts because i read that it supported it. now it appears to be a bug
<user123> fucccckkk
<user123> can't i just install 3.13 ?
<daftykins> don't use that language here
<user123> brb
<MooDoo> darn power cut
<daftykins> :o
 * zmoylan-pi says a prayer to thor that MooDoo's power is sorted...
<user123> yeah sorry for the language
<user123> would it be possible to use 3.13 kernel on my current lsb release?
<user123> and still get the fglrx to work?
<daftykins> didn't you only just install?
<popey> 14.04.5 ships with the HWE kernel
<daftykins> we've been over that, that's the problem
<daftykins> you can go and look up how to purge out the newer Xorg and all the components, drop to TTY and then reinstall 3.13 and its' X.org, but it'd be easier to just install 14.04.1
<popey> and never update
<popey> and end up with an unsupported system :(
<daftykins> no, it updates fine
<daftykins> no it will just run 3.13
<daftykins> it can still be 14.04.5 - it just won't use an HWE
<popey> hm, actually, true, he can stay on 3.13 I guess
<popey> wonder if 3.16 works?
<user123> i found that solution on stack-exchange but unity breaks with that solution
<daftykins> user123: why do you feel you need fglrx?
<popey> oh, forget that, yeah, stay on 3.13 then
<daftykins> user123: right it needs some work
<user123> daftykins: flash is slow and gaming
<daftykins> you have a legacy status card, you should just dump it
<user123> i need some decend netflix quality
<popey> \o/ new card day
<daftykins> if you insist, reinstall with 14.04.1
<user123> does 14.04.1 have the newer unity updates or at least similar version as to 14.04.5?
<daftykins> it's fine, it just bases on the original 3.13 kernel 14.04 came with
<user123> alright
<davmor2> user123: fglrx is removed from the kernel stack for xenial which is in 14.04.5 so it will not be installable on 14.04.5, You can I believe downgrade the stack by installing linux-lts-wily or something like that
<daftykins> already covered that davmor2
<daftykins> see the bit about unity breaking
<user123> so just for sake of clarity if I install 14.0.4.1 and I run apt-get upgrade it won't upgrade to 14.04.5 right?
<popey> well, it will
<popey> but not the HWE stack
<davmor2> daftykins: oh sorry I only saw kernel changing not the full stack
<user123> ok that is good enough for me
<daftykins> user123: you can run dist-upgrade just fine
<daftykins> (and should)
<user123> daftykins: so with dist upgrade it will stay with 3.13 kernel? what is the difference then between apt-get upgrade and dist-upgrade?
<daftykins> yes it will
<user123> also guys, what tool would you recommend me to use to get the iso to usb?
<popey> ddrescue
<user123> ok time to reboot
<user123> thanks
<popey> ddrescue -d -D --force path/to/iso /dev/sdX
<popey> (package is gddrescue)
<daftykins> cp :D
<popey> hah
<daftykins> another wrong channel customer aptly disposed of
<daftykins> those graphics card legacy status moves have a really surgical way of severing users
<davmor2> cat (Why not it's all just reading 1's and 0's from files anyway) :D
<daftykins> hehe
<zmoylan-pi> wait till quantum computing takes off. 1's 0's and boxes of cats...
<daftykins> i don't even know whether to buy food for the cats
<daftykins> it's a nightmare!
<zmoylan-pi> are they looking at you like you're the last steak in the house? :-P
<daftykins> they're all in boxes and i can't observe whether they're alive or dead
<zmoylan-pi> open the fridge door...
<gebruiker> http://old-releases.ubuntu.com/releases/14.04.1/ leads to 14.04.2  guys
<daftykins> look down the list and you will see the correct image
<daftykins> http://old-releases.ubuntu.com/releases/14.04.1/ubuntu-14.04.1-desktop-amd64.iso
<gebruiker> thanks
<daftykins> may want to pay a little bit more attention in future ;)
<gebruiker> yeah I have been up all night trying out distros. You know in search of the perfect one
<gebruiker> is there an alternative that you can recommend that has GUI instead of ddrescue?
<daftykins> you don't need a GUI to prepare a flash drive
<popey> ddrescue is awesome
<gebruiker> Also the opensource ATI Radeon driver, how does it perform in comparison to the proprietary driver  in terms of general use i.e netflix, youtube. espesially with a hd 5450?
<daftykins> the answer to that is on a card by card basis
<daftykins> there's no universal statement for all the cards AMD make/made
<daftykins> why ask that now when you've already been provided with the plan to avoid it entirely? :)
<gebruiker> daftykins, if I am dissapointed with the result of the proprietary driver then I have to either switch back to the latest LTS or decide this machine to be just a windows machine because netflix, youtube, office apps ran fine
<daftykins> no you do not need to switch back
<daftykins> gebruiker: or you could buy a Â£25 graphics card and all these problems go *POOF!*
<gebruiker> no job atm
<gebruiker> btw what works best? nvidia?
 * zmoylan-pi casts ward evil at mention of nvidia... :-)
<popey> generally, yes.
<gebruiker> intel then eyh?
<daftykins> nvidia
<gebruiker> I am unable to remove the files from my usb drive it is mounted as read only. Is there a way in ubuntu through the GUI to remount it easy?
<daftykins> the eject button beside the drive in nautilus
<daftykins> all this is much easier in the terminal :)
<zmoylan-pi> when you know all the commands to memory
<popey> you dont need to remove them if you dd over the top
<gebruiker> popey, are you sure because if something broks my install I have to start all over again
<daftykins> zmoylan-pi: if only there were an IRC channel perhaps with folk in that respond
<daftykins> ;D
<zmoylan-pi> on slack you say? :-P
<daftykins> hey you're supposed to like the old things, not the flavour of the week!
<gebruiker>  mount -o remount,rw /dev/sdc1 /mnt/ -t fat32mount: cannot remount block device /dev/sdc1 read-write, is write-protected
<zmoylan-pi> sorry, i read it on a bbs... :-)
<daftykins> gebruiker: you don't need it mounted at all, umount it
<daftykins> make sure no window has it open, too
<gebruiker> ddrescue is running to bad it does not format it
<gebruiker> i wanted to clean the usb drive first
<daftykins> when writing an image, formatting isn't necessary
<daftykins> no that's irrelevant
<gebruiker> daftykins, alright its finished. btw on windows i used c.flux any good alternatives you can recommend me?
<gebruiker> *f.lux
<gebruiker> f.lux makes your computer screen look like the room you're in, all the time.
<daftykins> you'll need to aim that to the rest of the channel, i don't use Linux on the desktop
<zmoylan-pi> windows user!! :-P
<gebruiker> alright going for a reboot now return later
<daftykins> \o/
<daftykins> typing from my Linux server :P
<zmoylan-pi> typing from console on rasp pi...
<daftykins> wouldn't console mean direct input? i thought you SSH'd over from some horrible netbook :D
<zmoylan-pi> from netbook running lubuntu, or s40 nokia phone or laptop running linux mint... still from console
<daftykins> i thought 'console' was only to mean using a TTY directly on the device itself
<user123> if netflix or youtube is going to perform poorly I might have to return to my previous OS :(
<user123> fingers corssed
<user123> dardevil is just a too good of a show hahaha!
<BigRedS> Hah, I use Android for tricky things like video playback
<daftykins> gebruiker: so you're actually new to Linux this week entirely?
<zmoylan-pi> i watch all my videos on android tablet... currently an 8" i got from argos sale for â¬99.  thinking of going back to my 4.5" one...
<daftykins> honestly it sounds like your hardware is not appropriate
<gebruiker> daftykins: yeap.. well I installed it 10 years ago
<gebruiker> daftykins: have to make the best with what I got :)
<zmoylan-pi> usually the older the hardware the better the linux support
<daftykins> not anymore
<daftykins> legacy graphics card and up to date distro = no go
<daftykins> thanks to AMD at least :)
<gebruiker> at the end of the day i just want something stable and that works and that doesn't spy on me :P
<zmoylan-pi> dos :-D
<daftykins> sigh. tinfoil hat alert
<gebruiker> I don't have large antena's attached to my tinfoil hat haha
<zmoylan-pi> and i thought we came to the conclusion lead foil is were it's at? :-)
<gebruiker> lol
<daftykins> progress is slow, sir
<daftykins> gebruiker: your requirements are many DRM related things that'll likely always work worse under Linux
<knightwise> gebruiker: you in .be or .nl ?
<daftykins> nobody should make a decision based on flash though, that's a dead duck
<gebruiker> knightwise: .nl
 * knightwise waves his .be flag :) 
<gebruiker> i like .be - great food and ppl
<gebruiker> daftykins: well still much in use it seems
 * knightwise points at the rest of the room .. See ! Belgians ARE cool :p
<daftykins> gebruiker: less and less, depends what you use
<daftykins> there are often alternatives / easily avoided
<gebruiker> daftykins: but wouldn't you rather spend time doing other things than finding work arrounds?
<daftykins> well i don't need to because i don't do flash things
<daftykins> gebruiker: and sure, that's why i run Windows :P
<daftykins> my games just work! :D
<knightwise> Only archeologists still do flash
<gebruiker> installation is done
<gebruiker> daftykins: you are such a tease
<gebruiker> brb
<daftykins> :o
<zmoylan-pi> you're in there daftykins :-P
<daftykins> having seen the topic went from how to get AMD to work to "i'm a tinfoil hat wearer, save me from the spying" i want nothing to do with this one anymore
<daftykins> this printer job i got asked to attend is looking better by the minute...
<knightwise> Compared to hear , monthy python is more predictable
<daftykins> that guy was just running an IRC client as root, too
<daftykins> you lot are welcome to that one ;)
<zmoylan-pi> what type of printer? :-)
 * zmoylan-pi imagines daftykins taking 12 hours explaining why a winprinter won't work on linux...
<daftykins> i'm told they've finally murdered their Ricoh multi-function and want something put in place of it as they still - no idea why - use fax with suppliers in England
<zmoylan-pi> ah... fax... that'll be easy... :-P
<daftykins> it was almost suggested on the phone that some cheap canon be put in place to handle fax, i'm not sure if they know that you can't plug a printer into another printer and share features
<zmoylan-pi> i've got a 2400 baud fax modem you can have... :-D
<knightwise> again : Archeologists
<zmoylan-pi> oh, if you want old, give me a day and i can a modem that draws more power than the 10 pcs in the same room... :-)
<zmoylan-pi> though i think it's limited to 300 baud...
<daftykins> anywho often the real job differs greatly from what that one says in a call, so it's anyones best guess ;)
<zmoylan-pi> oh yeah... my printers not working translates to my printer caught fire, was thrown out window, hosed down and now we want you to pop out and make it work again...
<zmoylan-pi> oops, 2nd story window, i always leave that little bit out for some reason... :-)
<daftykins> well they know it's dead, but the briefing was "we have some tiny canon we want to use temporarily"
<zmoylan-pi> temporarily... any time that was used... i once set up a computer to print 'temporarily' via ir till they got a cable 2 days later bouncing the ir signal off a strategically placed mug... 2 weeks later the mug was on a sheet of paper saying 'do not move'
<gebruiker> alright!
<gebruiker> it works! running apt-get upgrade as I type.
<popey> \o/
<gebruiker> is there anything I can do kernel wise to increase responsiveness?
<BigRedS> how are you defining 'responsive'? And why kernel-wise?
<diddledan> http://www.welivesecurity.com/2016/08/18/nsa-website-goes-hackers-auction-stolen-cyber-weapons/
<diddledan> it's up at the moment. maybe they've fixed it?
<gebruiker> BigRedS, well I am open for other options
<TwistedLucidity> Responsiveness in what way? You could overclock, for example, not burden the GPU with compositing or even a DE.
<TwistedLucidity> Fit and SSD...
<gebruiker> brb
<TwistedLucidity> i.e. what is the requirement?
<diddledan> intel is licensing arm IP now?!
<diddledan> ref: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-37106572
<popey> they have done for years
<popey> It's wierd, Intel could crush arm in a moment, but i guess that's anti-competitive
<diddledan> aye
<popey> tricky now softbank own them too
<diddledan> 24bn is a huge purchase
<davmor2> diddledan: no it isn't
<davmor2> diddledan: it's big not huge
<diddledan> said the actress to the bishop
<davmor2> oh get you and smutty innuendo, also why is the word innuendo so innuendous (or some word similar to that)
<diddledan> innuendish?
<diddledan> an innuendism?
<diddledan> innuit?
<davmor2> diddledan: muppet
<diddledan> no, I don't think muppet works
<Seeker`> diddledan: I don't think they're licensing from ARM, I think they're making ARM chips for clients
<davmor2> diddledan: so let me redefine, You Muppet!
<diddledan> I think I'm gonna rewire my PC today
<diddledan> I'm fed-up looking at the messy cable layout I made without thinking
<BigRedS> just put the lid back on the case, problem solved
<diddledan> unfortunately it's got one of those silly windows
<BigRedS> ah, that was silly
<BigRedS> err, is this linux?
<diddledan> o_O
<BigRedS> wrong box!
<BigRedS> experimenting with IRC in pidgin, getting confused
<diddledan> aah
<diddledan> apple showing stuff I don't understand but still awesome that it's low-level debug output they're showing: https://youtu.be/BLGFriOKz6U
<daftykins> diddledan: hilarious one, one of my wealthy clients bought an iMac for home use a bit ago, but he wants rid now because every time he goes to do something it's not like Windows in the office, so it makes his life a nightmare :D
<daftykins> proper smug mode on that one 'cause i warned of that
<diddledan> I'll take it if it's going free :-p
<diddledan> even better if you pay me to take it :-D
<daftykins> hahaha
<daftykins> it's a non optical drive cheese slicer edges one ;)
<daftykins> i dunno what he'll do with it
<zmoylan-pi> i got my first mac mini cheap second hand from a person who wanted to run windows apps in vm on mac but was confused by mac os
<popey> hah
<zmoylan-pi> i did have a pink imac prior to that from someone who couldn't sell it as it was pink... i bought it as i pointed out no one would ever nick it...
<zmoylan-pi> a steal for â¬150, whisper quiet, great for the bedroom
<diddledan> ICANN's job is "No As A Service": Dan Kaminsky's Black Hat keynote: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RAGwol-keXM
<diddledan> roughly at 35 minutes
<daftykins> zmoylan-pi: weird when they could've installed Windows natively, but yeah silly approach regardless :>
<zmoylan-pi> they had installed parallels but i think it might have been the lack of windows key on keyboard that really threw them off
<diddledan> :-o
<diddledan> no windows key?!
<zmoylan-pi> their loss was my gain
<diddledan> that's unpossible!
<daftykins> XD
<zmoylan-pi> and then when they tried using with windows keyboard mac os 'didn't make sense'...
<daftykins> bootcamp would've handled that ;) albeit had it in the wrong place
<zmoylan-pi> i think they wanted magic keyboard that changed depending on the os they chose to use that day...
<daftykins> standard user :)
<zmoylan-pi> rich standard user that they could just dump a mac and get a silly expensive replacement running windows
<daftykins> mac minis were quite underpowered iirc
<diddledan> I'm wondering how that decision process went: "I need this app which needs windows. I am comfortable with windows. I know, I'll get a mac!"
<daftykins> a wealthy client had a girlfriend who wanted a mac but wanted to run Windows once - as horrified as i was, i set it up
<zmoylan-pi> at the time macs were been described as some of the best hardware to run windows on
<daftykins> maybe aesthetically for people that way inclined, but they always run worse
<zmoylan-pi> but when people see something in print it's hard to prise that out of their memory no matter how wrong it is
<zmoylan-pi> unless you're allowed use a lart of course... :-)
<daftykins> lart?
<zmoylan-pi> luser attitude readjustment tool... http://catb.org/jargon/html/L/LART.html
<diddledan> live action role something
<daftykins> live action rotten tomato
<diddledan> mmmm
<zmoylan-pi> sometimes called a clue by four... :-)
<daftykins> these games are fun :D
<diddledan> live action rude tube?
<m6lpi> Beelink BT7. Ubuntu able?
<daftykins> m6lpi: can you try that one again in English?
<m6lpi> H as anyone had success with installing Ubuntu on a Beelink BT7?
<daftykins> http://www.gearbest.com/tv-box-mini-pc/pp_362725.html
<daftykins> i would say it isn't worth the risk to try
<daftykins> might work, might have a locked down EFI/BIOS
<m6lpi> We have one at my ARC and wanted to find out if it was doable
<m6lpi> I suspect it is locked down, but not too familiar with efi
<daftykins> sometimes these lower end things make it hard, can only find out if you start to give it a try really
<m6lpi> OK... I'll see what I can do with it...
<daftykins> eric in #ubuntu is great with EFI boot issues :)
<m6lpi> Cool, thanks for the pointer
<zmoylan-pi> 'issues'... :-)
<daftykins> yeah some budget end devices make it a challenge, sometimes they even used 32-bit EFIs to make it tough
<zmoylan-pi> pitting their wits against hackers... it's merely a matter of time, isn't it?
<daftykins> i don't think we've seen many anymore
<diddledan> mr robot today shows nano and nginx config
<daftykins> :)
<daftykins> i'm still not gonna touch it 'til it's done
<diddledan> squeely tires outside
<zmoylan-pi> probably someone detected a rare pokemon in your area
<diddledan> maybe
<diddledan> damned poke ya mom
<diddledan> ooh this episode has a big twist
 * diddledan zips the mouth
 * zmoylan-pi gets out the glove puppets and re-enacts the scene...
<mapps> ugh typical morrisons out of fans
<mapps> :(
<zmoylan-pi> you don't buy fans in summer, winter is the time to get them cheap
<daftykins> he might mean people to worship him
<zmoylan-pi> then tescos is the place for cheap fans... :-)
<daftykins> i sold one of the PCs yay \o/
<daftykins> only 5 left :P
<zmoylan-pi> huzzah \o/
 * daftykins spies kitten 
 * daftykins looks at christel 
 * daftykins squints
#ubuntu-uk 2016-08-19
<christel> daftykins: OOPS
<christel> :D
 * daftykins takes notes
<zmoylan-pi> lotus notes? :-)
<daftykins> i don't think i've seen that ever!
<zmoylan-pi> i got a demo from high ibm rep in ireland... it was beautiful, elegant and did what it did very efficently.  i then asked what's the point of it? didn't go well after that...
<daftykins> oops
<zmoylan-pi> well the person i was assisting was a single person and had no real need of a database synced across multiple users, sites around the planet
<zmoylan-pi> they were using a database for that but were barely touching large parts of that
<zmoylan-pi> database for notes
<zmoylan-pi> they could have used a million tools for wordperfect document to do the job as well
<daftykins> nn \o
<zmoylan-pi> o/
<mapps> hm
<mapps> im in Tarifa atm
<mapps> this hand of god doesnt sem that hood
<mapps> *seem
<mapps> *good damnit
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<knightwise> good morning brobostigon
<brobostigon> morning knightwise
<knightwise> Yawn-stretch-trycomealive
<popey> Morning
<brobostigon> morning popey
<knightwise> hmm.. just had a friend explain to me how easy it is to dual boot Ubuntu on a chromebook
<knightwise> even without using Chroots
<davmor2> Morning all
<JamesTait> Good morning all!  Happy Friday, and happy World Humanitarian Day! ð
<BigRedS> Gooood Morning!
<lornajane> happy friday :)
<davmor2> JamesTait: Obvious really https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1PWk3i9WT-8
<davmor2> JamesTait: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yWP6Qki8mWc might be longer
<lornajane> can anyone lend me a hand with a simple systemd question please?
<davmor2> lornajane: ask if we can help we will
<lornajane> davmor2: thanks, I think I got past the initial problems but I still have services that fail when they are started on boot, but start fine if I start them later on
<lornajane> also I provision this VM with ansible and I am struggling to get the right files into the right locations but perhaps I'm close with that one
<davmor2> lornajane: what version of ubuntu
<lornajane> 16.04
<lornajane> basically I am starting lots of services (a gunicorn, couchdb, some haproxy, a node process) on a VM and starting them all manually is a pain and I kept getting things wrong
<lornajane> I thought I would be able to take those commands, wrap them in services and ask systemd to run them for me.  So far, it's not really working out all that well.  Possibly because I'm a developer and really not a sysadmin so there is much I don't know
<popey> lornajane: is there a systemd specific channel maybe?
 * popey shrugs
<lornajane> I might need to go hunting.  I now have one script working and the others are just failing in a fairly non-informative way
<lornajane> they start fine if I start them manually so I'm not sure if they are depending on something I don't have yet
<lornajane> one working script at least gives me some idea that this thing does work and the rest is probably user error :)
<popey> :)
<diplo> lornajane: from the little i've done so far, journalctl can help you track down what is wrong with your systemd script, helped me anyone
<diplo> You can make it more verbose
<lornajane> ah, that might help`
<diplo> It's definitely a learning curve
<lornajane> I'm in a new job, everything is a learning curve and I kind of love it but I love it more when things work!
<diplo> I gave up on some of mine as I didn't have time, but I need a parent and child processes triggered, luckily service script still worked so going to leave those till I have more time
<diplo> Sounds like me! I'm supposed to be a developer now a days, but nobody knows anything more than they already know and aren't really willing to learn so it mainly falls on me
<zmoylan-pi> you need a bigger stick... :-)
<diplo> hah, mine are in a different county! need to be a big big stick
<zmoylan-pi> a tele stick...
<diplo> :)
<diplo> MooDoo: you used to work for heart internet didn't you?
<diddledan> interesting video from tom scott: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5uz6xOFWi4A
<diddledan> his videos are always interesting to be honest
<diplo> Recommendation for VPS ( incl Cpanel ) hosts
<diplo> I know I do this about once  a year :)
<BigRedS> You want cpanel?
<diplo> I don't, but I intend to leave shortly and the other staff will need it
<BigRedS> hahaha
<lornajane> good exit strategy
<diplo> I already run a VPS for the company on linode, but it's all manually setup ( documented though! ) but nobody else ever logs on to update and check it
<diplo> So get a fully managed one
<diplo> Apart from American sites the heart internet one seems best
<diplo> hmm apparently worrying, heart still offer 10.04 for managed hosts, but it's EOL :/
<diddledan> surprise? https://azure.microsoft.com/en-us/blog/powershell-is-open-sourced-and-is-available-on-linux/
<xnox> no, anticipated and expected
<ali1234> what does it do besides terminal emulation?
<diddledan> first thing I can think of is adminning windows systems from a linux host
<zmoylan-pi> report every keystroke to ms :-)
<diddledan> they tout their "object pipeline" which is a bit like stdio pipes but with extra stuff to allow them to be smarter
<zmoylan-pi> nothing worries me more than software trying to be 'smarter'
<diddledan> zmoylan-pi: at least it's not powering hell
<zmoylan-pi> true true, but i remember many moons ago my boss getting a new dot matrix printer with 'smart' paper handling.  the cursing and swearing, wailing and gnashing of teeth that printer caused...
<diddledan> and that was just the printer, swearing, wailing and gnashing it's teeth...
<zmoylan-pi> well it was a dot matrix... if any printer can, a dot matrix can
<diddledan> are any releases of ubuntu vulnerable to this tcp ack thingy?
<diddledan> specifically: http://cve.mitre.org/cgi-bin/cvename.cgi?name=CVE-2016-5696
<diddledan> gotta love bbc: https://twitter.com/BBCSport/status/766398447234625536
<zmoylan-pi> the alternative was to describe it as what brexit will do to the uk? :-P
<diddledan> zmoylan-pi: nono, that involves the other door
<SebthreeBQM10HD> hi
<diddledan> features are frozen
<SebthreeBQM10HD> diddledan for what
<diddledan> err.. opensuse?
<diddledan> maybe fedora?
<diddledan> oh I know, it's slackware!
<daftykins> tum te tum
<zmoylan-pi> ho ho ho, green giant
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> i thought i'd give MS' server 2016 evaluation preview a spin, BSODs in vmware workstation :D
<zmoylan-pi> giving you the real ms experience...
<daftykins> nah
<zmoylan-pi> it didn't touch your wallet? :-)
<daftykins> you can get 180 day licenses for any of their versions for free
<daftykins> just create a nice spammy outlook.com email, sign up and you get the download links :>
<zmoylan-pi> i have spent the evaluation period of ms software just trying to get it not to crash so that i could then use it for what we were trying it for...
<daftykins> you must do things really wrong :)
<zmoylan-pi> the wrongest :-D
<daftykins> i only dabbled with server 2012 R2 last because i may've gotten that role dealing with the mess that is hyper-v
<daftykins> i'd sooner have them signed up to free vmware education licenses and things just work, but such is the way at times
<daftykins> stupid staff politics!
<diddledan> daftykins: I hate those Sods of Bee
<daftykins> which specifically?
<zmoylan-pi> arbitary management decisions that make your job 10 times more difficult... i'm aware of their existince...
<diddledan> ones that happen in vmware?
<daftykins> oh i see
<daftykins> i mean i could try it on bare metal but meh, it's only a month 'til final
<diddledan> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8a13-JbxC98
<daftykins> you ought to start declaring what things are :P
<diddledan> where's the fun in that?
 * zmoylan-pi posts the cat came back... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bETCusT5kNM
<daftykins> client gets an email from one of his contacts where the attachments have been blocked, with the text "Contentcontrol has removed the following attachments due to policy reasons."
<daftykins> he forwards it to me as if i'm going to help this guy resolve his IT departments problems :(
<zmoylan-pi> ooooh outlook... i used to just rename the zip files i sent as piz and the server didn't raise a quibble
<daftykins> or he could even attempt to zip them - but yeah, i'm not their support so i'm not helping :)
<diddledan> zmoylan-pi: you mean you piz'd all over outlook?
<zmoylan-pi> at every opportunity diddledan
<daftykins> and it's not outlook but exchange server at their end to blame i should think
<diddledan> aye
<zmoylan-pi> exchange is the culprit here i suspect alright.  i hate that with the passion i normally reserve for pocketpc activesync
<mapps> hi;D
<daftykins> lo
<zmoylan-pi> i never had diddledan down as a quitter...
<daftykins> :<
<daftykins> doesn't he know this place is like the Hotel California?
<zmoylan-pi> shhhhh, he's back....
<diddledan> where'd I go?
 * zmoylan-pi whistles nonchantly...
<daftykins> The Twilight Zone crossed with The Outer Limits
<diddledan> alright, so you're nonchalant, quit rubbing our faces in it already
<zmoylan-pi> with a dilly dally in the muppet show
<diddledan> </zoidberg>
<diddledan> daftykins: twiglets?
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> i murder those things
<diddledan> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=remF2H383KM
<daftykins> only ever seem to get those silly mini ones at Christmas though, i'd prefer the full size
<diddledan> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zoiu8_K-eZg
<diddledan> there's zoidberg
<daftykins> why not Zoidberg?
#ubuntu-uk 2016-08-20
<daftykins> i'm giving http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1132620/ another spin
<daftykins> Swedish original of the Stieg Larsson Millennium trilogy, aka Girl with the Dragon Tattoo and so on
<daftykins> with the shocking IT references ;) although nmap showed up earlier
<brobosti1on> morning boys and girls.
<Guest54661> am I in the right place, I need to install a logitech cam
<diddledan> windy
<diddledan> I swear I didn't eat beans last night
 * zmoylan-pi raises hand and drops it quickly
<penguin43> Hello everyone - you're on the projector at ManLUG
<zmoylan-pi> vim is best!!! :-P
<zmoylan-pi> emacs users are still waiting for their editor to load before launching a witty response from it...
<penguin43> zmoylan-pi: Hey I did the vi talk at ManLUG about 15 years ago :-)
<zmoylan-pi> your work there is donw... :-)
<zmoylan-pi> *done
 * diddledan locks the n0rty people in the cupboard
<diddledan> hey, let me out!
<SebthreeBQM10HD> hi
<SebthreeBQM10HD> hi
<SebthreeBQM10HD> kitten hmm defoucs has irc cloaks the chat channel ?
<kitten_> SebthreeBQM10HD: yes
<SebthreeBQM10HD> kitten_, h eh a IRC cloak for chatting lots in a channel ?
<kitten_> yep
<SebthreeBQM10HD> kitten_,  ok :)
<bittin> kitten_: cool :)
<popey> Morning
<diddledan> allo allo
<marxjohnson> How do I overcome an issue like http://paste.ubuntu.com/23073354/ without borking my system? I'm on 14.04, when I try and do apt-get dist-upgrade it tells me various dependencies are broken
<marxjohnson> hmm doing apt upgrade seems happy enough
<popey> marxjohnson: remove unity8?
<popey> on 14.04 I'd purge all of unity8 and friends
<popey> so that would remove indicator-network too
<diddledan> anyone wanna be cortana? http://www.spirithalloween.com/product/adult-cortana-costume-halo/131382.uts
<zmoylan-pi> pffft. i'd prefer to be google, i already know everything... :-P
<m0nkey_> http://i.imgur.com/zkmkNF7.gifv
<daftykins> diddledan: find me a chicken sized one and i'll order it
<daftykins> get that chicken with the blue trousers and swap
<daftykins> i'm rocking the chocolate hob nobs tonight
 * penguin42 reaches across and pinches one
<daftykins> :D
 * zmoylan-pi liberates peanut lion bar from the cupboard...
<daftykins> pity the man that puts a lion in a cupboard and then has to retrieve it later
<daftykins> ;)
<zmoylan-pi> but your hobnobs will be protected
<daftykins> sadly there were only 3 left after last nights pig-out, so they're all dead now
<zmoylan-pi> it was either them or you...
<daftykins> i feel like dinking around with another distro, so i'm snagging fedora... but most of the time i get frustrated at not having a clue of another package manager and give it quite quickly :)
 * zmoylan-pi is looking at linux lite...
<daftykins> o0
<zmoylan-pi> no harm in trying it...
<daftykins> taking a look at some pics etc
<daftykins> thank Tux for this nice cool evening
<zmoylan-pi> todays walk was a damp wind blasted chill fest
<daftykins> ooh, i barely even left the house
<zmoylan-pi> my nuband fitness tracker counted 14000 paces...
<zmoylan-pi> at least there weren't many people blocking the pavements in damp weather
<daftykins> well i'm not too impressed with fedora's installer :)
<zmoylan-pi> i'm not sure i want to be impressed by an installer... :-)
<zmoylan-pi> it suggests they expect you'll be spending a lot of time in there...
<daftykins> well i suspect you won't be too pleased seeing it screw up partitioning and only offer to quit
<daftykins> that's what i mean by unimpressed!
<zmoylan-pi> ah... partitioning... the achilles heel of installing linux
<daftykins> well it's fine for my level of experience, but when you only offer me my multiple disks as a large pool of x TB in manual mode, it's just a guessing game as to which will be created where
<daftykins> also when you key in 132GB and it turns that into 122GB for no reason, have to wonder what's going on
<zmoylan-pi> the number of times i've installed some distro and found it's erased my laptops other partitions despites it's insisting it won't... usually windows, backed up so no real loss
<daftykins> :)
<zmoylan-pi> but i can't recommend them when they do that
<daftykins> here we go all copied now
<daftykins> i'm using my one remaining core 2 quad desktop :)
<zmoylan-pi> fingers crossed it boots ok...
<daftykins> 'tis no shadow of doubt!
<daftykins> "Delta RPMs reduced 695MB of updates to 298MB"
<daftykins> err, wow
<penguin42> daftykins: f24?
<daftykins> yep
<daftykins> http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/facebook/000/234/765/b7e.jpg <-- this is me
 * penguin42 has f24 installed so, ask away
<penguin42> (but I've not got any particularly fancy partitioning)
<daftykins> ah ty sir
<daftykins> just got myself updated after learning a bit of dnf, booting into the 4.6.6 kernel now and being shocked at how there's no mechanism or built in packages to get proprietary nvidia support
<daftykins> also find the TTY layout odd
<penguin42> ah I still type yum; hmm not sure about nvidia stuff, I stear away from that; what about the ttys - during install or during normal use?
<diddledan> awesome ladies are awesome: http://usat.ly/2batS8o
<daftykins> i'm installed now, 1 appears to show a flashing cursor, 2 goes to the gnome 3 DE and 3 is where normal TTYs start?
<diddledan> you're installed? as in physically?
<daftykins> shh
<diddledan> I wonder how one goes about getting themselves installed
<penguin42> daftykins: That's odd, for me 1 is the X desktop, and 2 onwards are normal ttys
<daftykins> looking for Xorg's log was also interesting, i ended up reading the README in /var/log and so running "journalctl | grep GDM" or something to see Xorg's log
<penguin42> yes, finding logs can be erm interesting
<penguin42> I simultaneously love and hate journalctl - it's very nice that you can tell it to get the logs for the current boot for a given service (or for boot n-3 say) but it's horrid at times
<diddledan> erm, this could be worrying: https://twitter.com/SwiftOnSecurity/status/767136640275980288
<diddledan> wait, you need a work permit to speak at a conference in the UK (if you're foreign)?!
<diddledan> ref: https://twitter.com/rachelnabors/status/766808673679138816
<penguin42> diddledan: I read that; from that the answer seems to be 'it depends'
<diddledan> https://medium.com/@rachelnabors/wtfuk-73009d5623b4#.t7dh1ltfr
<penguin42> diddledan: It was one of those things where they asked whether they got paid and they said no, but it turned out they had got paid for airfair etc and then it turned out the conference was organised by someone outside the UK; so basically they were beign a pain at the airport for no good reason
<diddledan> effed-up, that's what it is
<penguin42> diddledan: So only way to be sure not to get hastled seems to be to get the permit
<penguin42> diddledan: Yeh
<penguin42> diddledan: In the end it was the immigration people finding an easy target, tricking them and then getting into a mess - rather than concentrating on people it's useful to stop coming in
<daftykins> wow fedora seems to be geared around extending a middle finger to proprietary drivers
<daftykins> feels pretty outdated to rely on nvidia's own installer
<diddledan> daftykins: I thought the whole point of fedora was a middle finger to everything and everyone?
<daftykins> i have no idea
<daftykins> perhaps so far said finger is at me :)
<daftykins> well i cheated by adding a param to grub one-time to blacklist nouveau, as it seemed to ignore creating /etc/modprobe.d/blacklist.conf - now i'm at init 3 and running the installer
<daftykins> lets see if things turn into a ball of flames...
<daftykins> lol.
<daftykins> ok there we go
<daftykins> so it only needs a manual kernel boot param to blacklist nouveau followed by a good init 3 manual install
<daftykins> definitely a lot smoother on the desktop now...
<daftykins> penguin42: what's your DE of choice atop f24?
<daftykins> kinda satisfying that some experience from the past applies so even though i was reading through google's top result on nvidia installation for f24, i knew half of it was useless
<penguin42> daftykins: I'm using xfce
<penguin42> daftykins: But it does have pretty much everything; I used to kde4 but when fedora shifted to kde5 I shifted to xfce
<daftykins> i'm definitely not up for these 3D driven resource murdering ones
<penguin42> daftykins: It's got Mate as well
<daftykins> wow gnome3 seems to want to imitate Windows and Macs at the same time o0
<penguin42> yeh I really don't like gnome3
<daftykins> what happened with KDE5? i've never really touched KDE either
<penguin42> like the kde3->4 transition it's all a bit touchy still; might have settled down a bit by now; also all the setup I could find were  it was still a bit big
<daftykins> ah classic early adoption burn
<daftykins> well that was fun, i used the gnome3 account setup to add my google account - it auto configured evolution with the test gmail i used
<daftykins> nice to see *some* things progressing when it comes to usability
#ubuntu-uk 2016-08-21
<daftykins> lol i took a wiki thing to #fedora
<daftykins> "yeah that's been wrong for years..."
<daftykins> neat
<daftykins> pretty much being on exactly the other side of the fence from my time in #ubuntu ...
<daftykins> diddledan: http://i.imgur.com/2EWEwUe.gif
<mapps> helloL:D morning
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls
<popey> pip pip
<brobostigon> meep meep
<zmoylan-pi> *pew* *pew*
<SebthreeBQM10HD> hi woo
<SebthreeBQM10HD> just read it :)
<SebthreeBQM10HD> about time as well, Fedora 25 going Wayland by default
<popey> believe it when I see it
<ali1234> wayland by default as long as you don't use amd or nvidia?
<ali1234> or certain intel chipsets
<ali1234> or a DE that isn't gnome
<ali1234> or a login manager that isn't gdm
<zmoylan-pi> or a computer that uses 0's AND 1's... :-)
<ali1234> and no mir doesn't work any better
<zmoylan-pi> x all the way down...
<penguin42> hmm does look like this Virgin media upgrade worked; apt showing 7345kB/s
<SebthreeBQM10HD> popey, ali1234  zmoylan-pi  I think it's really going to happen with Fedora 25 goig by wht I read, as long as htey got certin bugs etc documented or whatever it said, plus thre's a way to get xorg still if wanting it as well
<SebthreeBQM10HD> now I could have otherwise copied in a link, but that doesn't work with Ubuntu touch devices yet!
 * penguin42 is trying to train himself to type apt instead of apt-get - it's hard work
<penguin42> especially while I'm waiting for the paracetamol to fully kick in and make this cold bearable
<popey> yeah, i still use apt-get sometimes
<popey> also often use apt-cache search rather than apt search
<popey> muscle memory is powerful
<penguin42> (and don't get me started on dnf - I always just type yum)
<diddledan> penguin42: yummy!
<diddledan> oh, major late to the party on my part there
<penguin42> :-)
<daftykins> penguin42: haha it's just symlinked though ;) but i was thinking about this earlier, it's easy for me to adapt since i'm new to it - but on ubuntu i still run apt dist-upgrade even though it's apt full-upgrade now (from what i gather)
<penguin42> daftykins: Is it? Oh I didn't know about full-upgrade
<daftykins> that's because of the newer 'apt' instead of 'apt-get' of course
<daftykins> at least i assume it's something newer being worked on, that's where my limitations come in - i have no idea how to find things out
<penguin42> daftykins: Why I wait for messages from people like you to tell me about things
<daftykins> XD
<daftykins> hmm i thought edx.org had some other interesting Linux courses but it seems to have gone
<blint> hello?
<popey> hi
<blint> oh hi :
<blint> i thought my net was off
<daftykins> seems not
<popey> !ping
<lubotu3> pong!
 * zmoylan-pi scribbles ping times on a post-it and fecks it through blint's window... :-P
#ubuntu-uk 2017-08-14
<Oli> Urgh, such an Americanised wrapper. And I'm not sure they're Europe's favoUrite. They might have the numbers but only because every cafe in France doles them out with a cuppa.
<Oli> Oh this is a rebranded Speculoos? I take it all back.
<davmor2> Morning all
<foobarry> =/me wave
 * foobarry wave
 * SuperMatt particle
<MooDoo> howdy all
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<MooDoo> Hello brobostigon
<brobostigon> hello MooDoo
<davmor2> MooDoo: me owld mukka
<MooDoo> hello davmor2 howdy tricks?   brobostigon howdy :D
<brobostigon> :)
<czajkowski> aloha
<MooDoo> howdy czajkowski :)
<czajkowski> MooDoo: hows things?
<MooDoo> czajkowski: yeah ok thanks, how's your good self....and speak up it's a bit noisy in here ;)
<czajkowski> been a bit busy recently but always on here even if I don't say much
<czajkowski> getting ready for crazy travel season in september
<MooDoo> safe journeys :)
<czajkowski> RAT doodle time https://beta.doodle.com/poll/drwv3c2pwcqs33ny
<foobarry> man i hate pinterest
<foobarry> requiring a login to see stuff
<SuperMatt> The worst part about it is that it's kinda creating a protection racket for the internet
<SuperMatt> I used to be able to google a term, and the image I wanted was the first one
<SuperMatt> Now it's moved down a couple of pages because all the other results are just pinterest
<zmoylan-pi> what! you didn't install the app and create an account to see if the image is what you wanted?!
<foobarry> and those pinterest links are just taken from other sites
<foobarry> when you add something to pinterest, they prefer that you don't upload oringinal content but link from other sites
<zmoylan-pi> and pinterest is a bit broken atm.  having trouble logging in on desktop and mobile over last few weeks
<foobarry> they make it much more of a faff to keep oringinal content there
<diddledan> SuperMatt: that's a very pertinent thought about the way we're getting walled-off areas of the tinternet
<diddledan> the same is happening with news going behind paywalls
<zmoylan-pi> that's been happening pre web with the likes of aol and compuserv
<SuperMatt> It's partly our own fault. We want free content, but nothing comes for free. We can either have ads, or we can pay for what we want
<diddledan> "human knowledge belong to the world" and "this is the real  world. and in the real world when you kill people they die. for real."
<foobarry> in other news i boguht GTA V
<popey> :)
<popey> I haven't played that for ages
<foobarry> i'm still playing skyrim though
<foobarry> the language in GATA is eye watering
<SuperMatt> I've gone off games
<popey> I'm mostly playing Rust recently
<SuperMatt> but now my wife is away for a week, and I don't know what I'm going to do with myself
<foobarry> i wish you could turn it off. i basically have to have the sound off
<diddledan> rust as in a game or rust as in programming?
<popey> Game
<SuperMatt> rustlang can eat my shorts. I'm a go daddy
<diddledan> :-D
<diddledan> I like that, go daddy
<SuperMatt> I just made it up
<SuperMatt> recruiters are loving seeing go on my cv
<diddledan> \o/
<diddledan> I've only written one whole thing in go: github.com/bowlhat/sftp-deploy - it uses a couple other packages that I wrote to wrap the ssh client and stuff but they were all written specifically for that prog
<SuperMatt> I've written a few things
<MooDoo> :)
<SuperMatt> https://github.com/SuperMatt/mlog - a simple logging library, https://github.com/SuperMatt/pulllist - a tool to list all the comics DC are releasing this week, https://github.com/SuperMatt/tubestatus - the current london underground status
<SuperMatt> That's all the stuff I can release on my github page, because I do have things I've written for work
<SuperMatt> Although this isn't written in go, it's my crowning glory: https://github.com/SuperMatt/countdown
<SuperMatt> also accessible here: https://matty.digital/countdown/
<ali1234> hey popey, i listened to that "ready steady code" podcast the other day. is the code they wrote released anywhere?
 * Gargoyle waves
<zmoylan-pi> o/
<diddledan> coooeeeyyy!
<diddledan> (that's a local way of saying "yooohooo")
<popey> flexiondotorg: see question from ali1234 .. where did the code get put?
 * flexiondotorg is a bad man.
<popey> i thought we'd put it on the podcast github repo
<popey> but can't find it
<flexiondotorg> I'll fix that later.
<popey> kk
<flexiondotorg> Not in out GitHub yet. It will appear, as if by magic, here later - https://github.com/ubuntupodcast/
<flexiondotorg> *our
<popey> ali1234: hows the pi stuff going? Got any more hardware projects on the go? (I use those usb adapters daily)
<ali1234> thanks
<ali1234> i'm working on software stuff at the moment
<ali1234> the goal is a ramdisk-based firmware with Qt and gstreamer, for kiosk stuff
<ali1234> i just rebased it on stretch and found a mountain of bugs
<ali1234> i keep seeing stuff about snap for embedded, but it doesn't work for me due to being too big, and not working on the pi zero
<ali1234> on the hardware side i built this: https://goo.gl/photos/FGiXMqUoBpsMvPYn9
<ali1234> that's one possible target for the ramdisk stuff, since it's liable to be powered off anytime
<popey> that's jolly cute
<ali1234> it involves some custom SLA printing from dirty pcb
<ali1234> it's really amazing what you can get made in china these days
<popey> yeah
<Seeker`> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vLxWsYx8dbo SpaceX launch in 25 minutes
<popey> ooh ta
<popey> is this the hp linux super computer one?
<ali1234> i got two of these for $2.50 each with free shipping: https://goo.gl/photos/qccBiWb3m2rpsgcs8 (it's the light guide that goes on the front)
<Seeker`> popey: think so
<popey> ali1234: 3d printed at home?
<ali1234> no in china :)
<popey> hah
<popey> for pennies?
<ali1234> yeah... and home printers can't print in anywhere near that resolution
<diddledan> nasatv are doing it too: https://www.nasa.gov/multimedia/nasatv/#public
<ali1234> it's SLA, so lasers and liquid resin, not the "squirt melted plastic out of a nozzle" stuff
 * diddledan squirts liquid resin at ali1234 
<popey> ahh
<diddledan> :-p
<diddledan> that's a cute lil clocky thing tho
<ali1234> i just uploaded a STL made in openscad and got the prints in the mail a couple of weeks later
<popey> guess it's more than just a clock
<popey> how many for how much?
<popey> if you dont mind me asking
<ali1234> for the prints?
<popey> ya
<ali1234> two for $2.50 each
<popey> shipped?
<ali1234> yes, free shipping
<diddledan> that's crazy cheap
<popey> sheesh
<ali1234> actually it might have been like $2.25 each and $0.50 shipping or something, i forget :)
<diddledan> they must have made a loss
<ali1234> it's ridiculously cheap anyway
<popey> their costs are super low
<ali1234> there's no wasted resin with SLA, you just top up the tank
<ali1234> they charge by weight of the finished print
<ali1234> which the website calculates
<diddledan> really awesome
 * diddledan tries to think of things to get printed
<ali1234> at the moment it really is just a clock, but you can add eg an audio board and make a upnp music player or something
<ali1234> which is why i'm working on gstreamer in a ramdisk :)
<popey> my latest toy is a nanopi air, which is super tiny
<ali1234> rpi has all the cool hardware tho, that's the problem
<ali1234> all the clock hardware is pimoroni stuff
<ali1234> just hats stacked together
<ali1234> it wouldn't be nearly as nice if it was a bunch of different sized boards cobbled together... but that's all it really is
<popey> i wanted something smaller but more powerful than the pizero
<popey> also, toy
<ali1234> you mean, something with ARMv7 right? ;)
<popey> :D
<popey> a bit of that, yes :)
<ali1234> whats the gpu like in nanopi?
<popey> dunno, only used it over serial console so far
<ali1234> i really like the videocore gpu
<ali1234> it works great with Qt through their proprietary drivers, it's as smooth as using an iphone
<popey> wow
<ali1234> if you write QML stuff, the animations are perfect
<ali1234> this is using EGLFS, so no bloated X11
<ali1234> really nice with their 7" touch display for rss reader or photo frame type stuff
<ali1234> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pGyPXc5nbNo
<popey> nice
<ali1234> about 14 out of the 15 seconds it takes to boot are spent loading the initrd from the sd card and uncompressing it
<ali1234> total size is 66MB compressed
<ali1234> also it's pure systemd... i loooove systemd now
<popey> hahah
<popey> was there ever any doubt?
<popey> (you don't need to answer that)
<ali1234> well i never really hated it
<diddledan> I used to be in the "why?" camp
<ali1234> yeah
<diddledan> I'm not in the "pretty useful" camp
<ali1234> but, like, now i understand
<diddledan> now*
<diddledan> I'm now in the "pretty useful" camp
<ali1234> 1 minute to rocket liftoff if anyone wants to watch that :)
<diddledan> flaming phaluses
<popey> already on second screen :)
<popey> great having that on in the background
<popey> weird that it's so commonplace now that it's just on as background noise here
<popey> smooth as silk
<diddledan> I remember watching the last spacex to explode on launch live
<popey> i dont think I have ever seen them explode live
<ali1234> was just thinking it will be weird whwen they launch so often that nobody cares to even bother streaming it
<diddledan> looking good
<popey> 1000 km/h is insane
<diddledan> I believe this is a reused first sstage, too
<popey> i love the landings
<popey> is it landing on boat or land?
<diddledan> they blow my mind
<diddledan> on land by the sounds of the commentary
<diddledan> going back to the cape
<popey> my kids are already blasÃ© about it
<diddledan> wow. epic view of the separation
<popey> same with when the ISS goes over
<popey> aside from the whole 'thing going into space and coming back' there's the fact we can watch this in pretty decent quality video
<diddledan> those direction control thrusters are showing up well on the distance view of the first stage
<popey> it's all a bit mind blowing
<popey> douglas adams was right
<popey> looks like it's properly plummeting like a rock
<diddledan> it looks out of control
<popey> amazing
<diddledan> wow, that was good
<diddledan> I wonder how much AI learning is being tasked to constantly improve the landing procedure
<popey> the presenter seems quite happy
<popey> i think he introduced himself as a firmware engineer
<popey> must be a tense time
<Seeker`>  this is insane, watching live video from space
<zmoylan-pi> i think when they were tweeting from marianas trench it was cooler imho
 * diddledan sings: hey mr. tallynadger, show me your banana.
<diddledan> ..daylight come, and me wanna go home.
<zmoylan-pi> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PMigXnXMhQ4
<zmoylan-pi> i canna find the comedy version though... :-(
<zmoylan-pi> ah ha... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4-9h1pjTP74
<daftykins> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-40927791
<daftykins> this story doesn't sit well with me
<diddledan> it's gonna give cyclists a bad rep when in reality he's just a moron
<daftykins> well the comments saying that brakes would've solved it is also rubbish
<zmoylan-pi> usually when a cyclist is a moron it's their own life they throw away.  this muppet will go to jail and this crime will follow him for the rest of his life
<daftykins> muppet for riding a fixie, or another element?
<daftykins> certainly posting to a forum about it is a bit iffy
<Gargoyle> Don't see why it's gone to trial!?
<zmoylan-pi> 1) muppet for riding a non legal bike
<zmoylan-pi> comments on forum won't help his case
<daftykins> never heard anything about legality to fixies on the road before o0
<zmoylan-pi> i think they do have you need front brakes thing, saw it mentioned a while back in some forum
<diddledan> what's the stopping distance for a well maintained bicycle going 20mph, I wonder
<daftykins> tonnes of variables there
<zmoylan-pi> depends if it's wet/dry/gutter filled with leaves
<daftykins> type of brake, whether the bike has both or not...
<Gargoyle> "In the case of a pure pedal cycle (no electrical assistance) these regulations are so simple, that the only parts that matter are the brakes."
<zmoylan-pi> weight of bike, speed
<Gargoyle> "The basic requirement is for two efficient braking systems, by which the front wheel (or wheels) can be braked independently of the rear wheel (or wheels). "
<daftykins> what are you quoting from?
<Gargoyle> http://www.cyclinguk.org/cyclists-library/regulations/construction-use
<zmoylan-pi> 90% of the time i put on the brakes, put both feet on the ground and lifted front wheel.  lots of sparks, lots of skidding. stopped fast
<diddledan> when are we gonna get self-cycling bicycles like the google cars
<daftykins> ;)
<diddledan> remove all humans from the equation and you're set :-p
<zmoylan-pi> till the robot rebellion...
<daftykins> rise of the cycling machines
<zmoylan-pi> on that day, stay away from the dildo factory... :-P
<diddledan> vibrated to death!
<diddledan> what's that series of films where there are gruesome deaths by robotic saws and stuff?
<daftykins> Saw? :P
<diddledan> I think it's called "hardware"
<daftykins> with Tim the toolman Taylor? :D
<diddledan> nope, screamers!
<diddledan> it was screamers
<diddledan> hardware is similar tho
<diddledan> maybe nsfw trailer: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WksPMueXkP4
<zmoylan-pi> meh, i'll stick with tremors...
<Gargoyle> I think you have issues with large vibrating things! ;-)
<diddledan> WEEEEEEE
<zmoylan-pi> have a nice split?
<daftykins> g'night \o
<diddledan> splitter
<zmoylan-pi> o/
<diddledan> :-p
#ubuntu-uk 2017-08-15
<diddledan> there we go, changed my password from a nickserv pass to a server pass in irccloud so it doesn't have to wait for nickserv to prompt me
<diddledan> sleepynow
<MooDoo> howdy all
<SuperMatt> morning chaps
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<davmor2> Morning all
<brobostigon> morning davmor2
<fjaiohgae> Morning all, I have some trouble with my headphones to get it connected, the bluetooth pairing worked, but the audio profile look like wrong, is it common to have driver issues with standard audio devices ?
<SuperMatt> Sometimes linux really sucks at bluetooth headphones. You may need to completely disconnect them and reconnect
<SuperMatt> I've had the same issues in Ubuntu and Fedora
<SuperMatt> And you may need to do the disconnect/reconnect thing a few times until it loads the correct profile
<fjaiohgae> done it few time no luck, unpair, pair, connect disconnect, and still no luck, but then I will use the windows method of reboot and reconnect and re-gret.
<fjaiohgae> "The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result." :(
<davmor2> SuperMatt: there is work afoot to try and help with that
<SuperMatt> wonderful
<fjaiohgae> hip hip hurray !
<popey> yeah, bluetooth is broken until bluez5, where it's less broken
<awilkins> Yay, Synaptic won't start on Wayland
<foobarry> https://askubuntu.com/questions/938606/dwarf-fortress-starting-during-apt-get-upgrade
<diddledan> *sigh* https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/aug/14/donald-trump-inauguration-protest-website-search-warrant-dreamhost
<popey> wow
<popey> he's a real snowflake
<foobarry> what is it about dictators and funny haircuts?
<popey> everyone too scared to tell them they look like tools?
<foobarry> there must be more to it
<foobarry> https://hubpages.com/style/Hairstyles-of-the-Dictators is so out of date it doesn't have USA or latest N Korea
<zmoylan-pi> he's president and he can order weird stuff to happen on a whim?
<diddledan> this is sucky for ladies :-( https://twitter.com/lydiajones_18/status/897437256646107136
<zmoylan-pi> have you not read the evil overlord list?  http://www.eviloverlord.com/lists/overlord.html
<diddledan> woman: "hi, can you help me?" man: "yes. let's have sex"
<foobarry> Vishal is an accomplished inspirational public speaker on sales, marketing, well being and branding. He regularly coaches start-ups and SME sector
<foobarry> on linkedin. same guy?
<foobarry> yep
<foobarry> so the thing is, these people organise 3 day book camp to motivate vulnerable people into thinking they can write a book in 3 days
<foobarry> churn out some drivel, pat everyone on the back and sell to friends, call yourself an author
<foobarry> don't think he has anything to do with tech though
<awilkins> Creepazoid hitting on 18 year olds
<awilkins> Maybe we should endorse him for that skill on LinkedIn
<awilkins> Shame you have to accept endorsements for them to be visible
<czajkowski> anyone else for the real ale train ... https://beta.doodle.com/poll/drwv3c2pwcqs33ny
 * Seeker` has been using DreamHost for...a decade? 
<awilkins> Where is the Real Ale Train physically located?
<Seeker`> I'm pleased by their response
<foobarry> on train tracks
<awilkins> Aha 8eac0-5d16a
<awilkins> c202e-ce6a4
<awilkins> 108be-0f5e0
<awilkins> f2aff-783df
<awilkins> b069c-5bcc0
<awilkins> f87c9-275f0
<awilkins> 300de-aff6d
<awilkins> 506c2-a1195
<awilkins> 7c0e3-f4106
<awilkins> 92bd4-945fb
<foobarry> fail
<awilkins> 188ef-8b782
<foobarry> fail
<awilkins> 450fb-e1be0
<awilkins> 1886a-36a02
<awilkins> 86167-45577
<awilkins> 26329-2fe76
<awilkins> 415d1-104b3
<awilkins> Oh crap
<awilkins> Megafail
<Oli> Oh dear.
<foobarry> fail^2
<ali1234> what are those?
 * zmoylan-pi tests this list for passwordds :-P
<foobarry> stnragely formatted mac addreses?
<zmoylan-pi> ...or are we turning this channel into a number station to flush out the paranoid? :-)
<awilkins> They're the set of Github 2FA recovery codes I just replaced with new ones
<ali1234> ouch
<foobarry> hahahaha
<diddledan> 2fa
<awilkins> What I meant to say was : https://www.google.co.uk/maps/place/Alton/@51.1519289,-0.9672465,15z/data=!4m5!3m4!1s0x0:0xcd485fe0a901f2f5!8m2!3d51.1519289!4d-0.9672465
<diddledan> lovely
<diddledan> that was an epic paste!
<foobarry> hunter
<awilkins> Why you posting lines of asterisks again, foobarry?
<foobarry> sourceforge makes me cry
<diddledan> how is sourceforge still a thing?
<awilkins> Sourceforge I just ignore now
<foobarry> except when you need source code
<awilkins> Inertia is the only thing keeping it alive
<foobarry> and source code
<awilkins> Even if their new owner is less evil, the stank left behind by the previous owner lingers
<awilkins> Source code needed keep SF alive any longer since any source you're allowed to copy can be migrated to a git repo somewhere else
<awilkins> If you really care about a particular project, set up a process to mirror any new revisions periodically.
<awilkins> Hell, you could probably do that with AWS Lambda for free (the free tier on Lambda runtime is so generous, and at the moment, free in perpetuity)
<Oli> If they're actively using SF though for bug triage, and everybody starts using your github tree, that might not be the most welcome idea to upstream.
<ali1234> SF has new owners?
<Oli> Few and far between, for sure... But I'm sure there are a few old grumblies refusing to move off svn.
<Oli> ali1234, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BizX
<ali1234> you can disable issues on github
<foobarry> does launchpad do git yet?
<diddledan> yes it does
<ali1234> lots of projects have semi-official mirrors on there
<Oli> foobarry, yeah
<foobarry> they missed the boat really though
<Oli> They did
<ali1234> SF is pretty useless if you just want to browse the source code or mailing list archive
<ali1234> the UIs for that are just awful
<awilkins> They missed the new boat, then they took an auger to the bottom of the boat they had
<Oli> We say that but many projects are using self-hosted Trac installs on top of their own self-hosted repos. Launchpad is still a clear mile ahead of some of those.
<ali1234> https://github.com/xfce-mirror for example
<ali1234> i'm not sure SF is actually better than self-hosted trac
<ali1234> not if you set it up properly anyway
<awilkins> I like Redmine
<awilkins> Poops all over Trac for features. Only wish it was written in Python and not Ruby.
<ali1234> repos on github, issues on LP
<diddledan> what about gitlab?
<awilkins> We use GitLab at work. Not decided about it yet. It's clearly very good at what it focuses on (to me, that's repo management and Continuous integration)
<foobarry> we use github enterprise
<awilkins> I'm probably keener on Mattermost than GitLab TBH
<foobarry> its sweeeeet
<Oli> I like Gitlab though haven't managed to use it in anger yet. All I ever seem to see about it these days is super-mega-urgent security fixes. I guess that means it's still getting plenty of developer attention (which is better than the other end of the spectrum)
<diddledan> isn't mattermost part of gitlab now?
<awilkins> Yes, hence the mention (otherwise it would have been a total segue)
<ali1234> the absolute worst i've encountered is when the project management system is written by the same people as the project itself
<ali1234> like, dude, you don't have time to do both
<zmoylan-pi> didn't linus write git? :-P
<ali1234> haha that's true
<ali1234> but i was thinking more about issue tracking
<awilkins> Things GitLab does that Redmine doesn't : has it's own CI server, does git-flow workflows. Things Redmine has that GitLab doesn't ; wiki, forum, time tracking (time spent on issues), gannt chart, calendar
<zmoylan-pi> it's those annoying exceptions... :-)
<awilkins> Anyone who writes their own issue tracker as a de-novo project in this day and age is either a software forge hosting company or a certified idiot
<ali1234> to be fair, git isn't perfect... all those command line options that dont make sense
<ali1234> and the bisect "good/bad" thing
<awilkins> I find once you understand the internal data model you can get by with very few commands
<ali1234> where good and bad don't actually mean good and bad, they mean before and after
<awilkins> And you only delve into the man pages when you want to do mad things
<ali1234> because git assumes you are looking for a regression, not the commit that fixed the bug
<zmoylan-pi> probably make perfect sense if you have a few decades of kernel programming behind you :-)
<awilkins> Like stitching together the histories from two separate SVN repositories that have been spawned as pushes from a Bazaar tree with the same library used by different projects...
<ali1234> yeah i only use about 1% of git commands
<ali1234> and i use it all the time
<awilkins> I liked Bazaar, and there was a period when it was totes the best VCS on Windows, bar none.
<awilkins> Then Git started working properly on Windows
<ali1234> i could never understand bzr... it doesn't even have bisect at all!
<awilkins> It has bisect as a plugin
<ali1234> an unmaintained plugin that doesn't work any more, yes
<ali1234> bzr seems to be designed for people who never ever look at the code history
<awilkins> Surely you can just check out a revision of Bazaar that still works with bisect... you can use bisect to find it!
<ali1234> lol
<awilkins> Oh.
<ali1234> you can always import the zr repo into git, and then bisect it that way
<awilkins> I have a bunch of users in my old job still using Bazaar
<ali1234> someone seriously, unironically told me to do that once
<awilkins> Bazaar had better 2-way interop with SVN than Git does
<awilkins> That was one of my main faves about it when I still had to work with SVN Old Grumpies.
<ali1234> svn... i literally never figured out how to use that one
<awilkins> You could share a Bazaar branch that was a pull of an SVN repo without trouble. With Git you're constantly rewriting history whenever you push to SVN so you can't
<ali1234> like, how do you commit changes?
<awilkins> In SVN? You do a commit. Everything in your tree that's changed is committed unless you tell it not to.
<ali1234> it always just says i don't have permission
<awilkins> Well, the server needs to think you have permission
<ali1234> yeah... that's what i never understood
<ali1234> how are you supposed to use it if you aren't a project member?
<awilkins> Pull it into a git repo :-)
<awilkins> (another reason DVCS rules the world now)
<ali1234> yeah :)
<awilkins> You can't just give everyone access to your SVN repo, they'd DoS the hell out of it.
<awilkins> Actually worked on a project that used SVN a bit like that. It wrote transaction logs for your local DB edits and pushed them to SVN.
<awilkins> Then everyone else ran the Tx logs to get up to date.
<awilkins> Problem was, it would write bad transactions. Your DB would be fine because they were written ex-post-facto the actual DB edits going through.
<awilkins> But you'd commit and everyone else would be hosed.
<diddledan> the WordPress.org dev repo, their plugin directory, and the theme directory are all on a massive svn system
<awilkins> One thing SVN helps you do : defer decisions about how to organize your code repos properly....
<awilkins> I have a theory for writing better SVN support for Git ; convert the entire root of the SVN filesystem, and then "thread" that with commit histories by detecting the real checkout trees you want.
<awilkins> The core problem with SVN is that though, that it's a filesystem with a Tau dimension, rather than a system for snapshotting entire trees like Git.
<awilkins> The Worst Thing people do with SVN : work on their super-special tree of code then cut the tree in their IDE and paste the new one in. Hey presto, their IDE / SVN plugin interprets this as "delete these files and add new ones", severing the file history forever.
<awilkins> Git just goes "Meh, that's two trees that look very similar"
<awilkins> And hence fixes this issue when you convert an SVN repo. SO helpful.
<diddledan> wow. I just had a full system lock-up
<diddledan> even the magic sysrq thing didn't work
<daftykins> diddledan: ooh-err
<daftykins> lurvely bay up north here on the rock - http://i.imgur.com/HQZC28R.jpg
<diddledan> that's disgusting!
<diddledan> you should be thoroughly ashamed!
<daftykins> wat
<diddledan> posting pornography like that!
<daftykins> island porn, mmm
<foobarry> did anyone do day trading in GTA V?
<daftykins> little bit
<daftykins> in single player?
<foobarry> yeah
<foobarry> is it linked to missions?
<daftykins> yep the Franklin assassination ones from Lester
<daftykins> as all 3 characters you can invest before doing the mission, then there'll be a big payout for them all
<daftykins> but it's better to wait until the heists are done so they have capital to invest
<foobarry> ah, but avoid at other times?
<daftykins> yeah just leave the Lester missions undone for Franklin until you've finished the main plot is some advice i read online
<daftykins> i was doing a replay on the xbox one version after i'd originally played it on the xbox 360 way back, but lost interest
<daftykins> in fact i was only playing it when limited for entertainment in my hotel apartment during the house works :D
 * diddledan wanders off to do some oven thing
<daftykins> diddledan: ooh you wanna be careful with those, do it just once and then you'll be hooked for life
<foobarry> https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2017/aug/15/crash-cyclist-shouted-charlie-alliston-pedestrian-lay-wounded fixed wheel bikes are illegal?
<daftykins> yeah i was shocked about that too
<daftykins> had no idea
<daftykins> they really are turning that guy into a villain now
<daftykins> of course you shout at idiot pedestrians as a cyclist, jeez
<zmoylan-pi> whatever mode of travel you use, you shout at _ALL_ the others
<foobarry> he might get off. the witness didn't see the build up to the incident
<foobarry> only saw at moment of impact
<foobarry> he could have shouted "why did you step into my path?"
<daftykins> mmm
<diddledan> "I SAY, GOOD LADY, WOULDS'T THOU PLEASE VACATE THE ROAD?"
<diddledan> period English would be fatal
<diddledan> I mean the difference in time it takes to say that vs "OI! MOVE!"
<zmoylan-pi> 'no brakes' in his case would be admitting to his crime...
#ubuntu-uk 2017-08-16
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<MooDoo> howdy all
<brobostigon> morning MooDoo
<MooDoo> how are you brobostigon ?
<brobostigon> average really, and you?
<MooDoo> not to bad really, thinking of a reason to learn docker lol
<brobostigon> :)
<SuperMatt> morning all
<SuperMatt> Gotta admit to being very impressed with the latest version of solus
<MooDoo> solus?
<diplo> Morning all
<diplo> MooDoo: https://solus-project.com/
<diplo> I run it on my Gem at work too SuperMatt
<diplo> Sorry NUC*
<MooDoo> is this another elemental?
<MooDoo> elementary*
<diplo> Nope, written from the ground up by a bloke called Ikey
<diplo> Fast, up to date, changes alot underneath though
<MooDoo> diplo: not based on another distro?  see it has support for ubuntu snaps
<diplo> Nope, well the base was clear linux project I think, ikey used to work for Intel till recently, but now gone full time on Solus
<MooDoo> cool, looking at the site now
<diplo> He wrote support in for snaps in a couple of days, the guy is a machine
 * diplo will try installing diddledan's Corebird I guess, but I think it's already newest version in solus repos
<MooDoo> diplo: downloading the iso now :)
<diplo> It's nice, needed to wait till now as needed certain packages for work
<davmor2> Morning all
<foobarry> http://imgur.com/a/lkUrO woops
<foobarry> need to close a few tabs
<diplo> jeesh foobarry
<foobarry> my tab use increased after bookmark functionality decreased
<knightwise> morning !
<MooDoo> diplo: it's certainly very pretty
<diplo> It is and quick I find
<diplo> Thunderbird can't attach from Samba shares created via nautilus it appears
<diplo> What is the correct way of mounting samba shares via cli now ? cifs is all the tutorials are mentioning, just want to confirm it is still that as I thought it was gvfs or something now ?
<MooDoo> diplo: I'm just running the live version from USB, but that's quick, took me a few mins to realise it's eopkg :)
<MooDoo> diplo: i've always done it mount -t cifs etc etc
<diplo> Yup, syntax has taken me a bit longer, alias apt to eopkg :P
<diplo> ah ok, will install cifs-utils then ta
<MooDoo> diplo: might replace my ubuntu partition with it, but we'll see live version is ok for today
<MooDoo> diplo: even from usb, it really is fast isn't it
<diplo> Yup
<diplo> I've been using Ubuntu Budgie for quite a while, but wanted to move over
<knightwise> morning guys
<knightwise> how are you doing
<diplo> morning knightwise, exhausted after taking my kids away for a 5 day break :D
<diplo> So bug 378425 on Thunderbird, can't attach files from smb share - opened 11 years ago!
<MooDoo> diplo: something for the weekend for you to look at? ;)
<diplo> god no! I'll use the workaround for now thanks
<diplo> I'll be sleeping all weekend
<knightwise> diplo: had a bit of a break too :) couple of days in the north of france :)
<diplo> oooh lovely
<MooDoo> I'm off at the end of the month, bank hol weekend, taking the kids to legoland for a couple of days. :)
<diplo> Oh nice, my youngest really wants to go back
<MooDoo> diplo: was going to drive down then go straight into the park, but just seen a travel lodge 20 mins from the park, might go down the day before now :D
<knightwise> oooh legoland
<knightwise> take me take me
<MooDoo> knightwise: if you can fit in the kids rucksack and they won't notice, then deal :) lol
<diplo> I was going to camp down there MooDoo, but decided against it, it's only a 1 1/2 for me, but was going to do 2 days
<MooDoo> we're there wed/thursday but i think i might be tired driving down there early wed morning
<diplo> You're in Nottingham still aren't you ?
<MooDoo> diplo: yes just looking at google maps now
<MooDoo> diplo: yeah 3 hours is
<MooDoo> ish
<diplo> That's fairly quick, takes me 4+ from Bath to Notts
<diplo> Do you hardcode creds for a samba share in fstab ever? load from a text file etc ?
<foobarry> is ff55 faster or the same old disappointment?
<foobarry> down to 24 tabs!
<diplo> I've seen a significant increase!
<diplo> Running on Windows and Linux, running 64bit version on both
<foobarry> lies!
<foobarry> they never deliver
<foobarry> upgrading now brb
<diplo> heh, they have this time
<foobarry> witchcraft!
<foobarry> sorcery!
<foobarry> will test with redmine, which it seems to be 5x slower than chrome
<diplo> I've heard 57 is faster still
<MooDoo> doesn't 57 use the new rendering engine?
<foobarry> awesome bar is broken :(
<foobarry> ah working now
<MooDoo> it's quite fast using the i3 window manager too :)
<diplo> Keep thinking about trying i3, watched a vid of it
<diplo> Been years since I distro hopped, now on my third in a few months :D
<MooDoo> diplo: I love it :) then again i'm a terminal junkie.
<MooDoo> diplo: I'm using ubuntu, just installed i3 :)
<diplo> May try it in a vm full screen one day
<davmor2> works fine here on neon
<davmor2> although I am only using it in home activity work is on chrome
<MooDoo> I prefer chrome myself
<diplo> I found it got heavier and heavier on my system, also had loads of caching issues
<diplo> So moved to FF for a bit, haven't moved back yet :D
<SuperMatt> FF 57 is amazing. I've moved my personal profile over to it and I hope to track it back to stable.
<foobarry> where's 57? beta?
<MooDoo> http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2017/08/download-firefox-57-nightly
<foobarry> the quit button is a bit abrupt
<foobarry> no questions just POOF
<foobarry> redmine still more sluggish than chrome
<knightwise> ok, Rasberry PI setup :) running Calibre server and ssh endpoint. Thank god for the 128 gig microsd
<foobarry> http://www.gearbest.com/tablet-pcs/pp_613003.html?lkid=10853351
<foobarry> :o
<foobarry> ubuntu/linux support forthcoming
<daftykins> the text on that page is so bad XD
<diddledan> dear God it's teeny weeny!
<foobarry> i fell for that trick with eee pc701
<foobarry> i'm not buying more shiny
<daftykins> glad to hear :P looks like the kind of cheap tat that'll get abandoned quick
<foobarry> i have footage of a UFO taking off
<foobarry> http://imgur.com/a/18Lzy
<daftykins> :D
<diddledan> hahaha. I love that
<SuperMatt> still can't install Solus to existing logical volumes
<daftykins> where can you? non-LVM?
<SuperMatt> yup
<SuperMatt> I can install it, but it would mean a lot of faffing to back up my stuff
<daftykins> does it have to be bare metal?
<diplo> Asked in #solus - ikey is quite active there as well as others in the channel
<popey> i saw some video review of the gpd thing a week or so ago where he tried kde
<popey> it mostly worked, but screen orientation was off
<zmoylan-pi> there's a revered gif version for the aliens landing...
<popey> I can't fathom why they have the Del key next to P on the GPD and backspace next to 0, odd layout
<popey> seems early versions were the other way around and they changed based on feedback
<zmoylan-pi> i do wonder if people who change the layout of keys are touch typists...
<popey> with tiny hands
<Azelphur> Hi folks, I'm looking at /proc/<pid>/fd and it has a lot of files which link to sockets, is there any way to find out more info about what those sockets are?
<Azelphur> eg "socket:[36745917]" isn't a particularly useful piece of info
<popey> Azelphur: what type of application?
<Azelphur> popey: stuff I wrote, aiohttp handling websocket connections.
<popey> won't they match open connections, like what you see in netstat?
<Azelphur> popey: they don't, no
<daftykins> lsof any use in that scenario?
<Azelphur> daftykins: actually much, dunno why I didn't think of that
<Azelphur> and now I know that my app is leaking connections to redis, woo. I'm a good programmer \o/
<daftykins> yay i knew a thing!
 * zmoylan-pi gives daftykins a peanut...
 * daftykins looks at it...
<daftykins> err, where's that been?
<daftykins> that was amusing, i just called up the travelinn i'm staying at outside of Stansted airport tomorrow evening, guy didn't really know how to get to them from the airport without blowing Â£20 on a taxi, oof
<zmoylan-pi> people still ask for directions?!
<daftykins> i'm an island bumpkin in a strange and foreign land :(
<daftykins> tbh my research did already point out a better answer than he offered, just no price
<daftykins> (local buses)
<zmoylan-pi> take out your string and tie off at starting point and trail it out behind you as you go... :-P
<daftykins> excellent, but what's this i hear of horseless carriages?
<zmoylan-pi> putting hardworking horses out of work... and people with shovels..
<daftykins> on Sark they have bins mounted on the wall sides you're meant to clean up after your own horse, with
<zmoylan-pi> some places now require horses to wear diapers
<zmoylan-pi> just need tescos to step up and provide changing tables... :-P
<daftykins> :D
<foobarry> popey: http://daniel-lnx.blogspot.co.uk/ fixed the rotation issue
<popey> nice
<popey> i think flexiondotorg has one of those GPD things on the way
<popey> maybe
<foobarry> tbh even a full size laptop is an annoyance for me
<foobarry> keyboard and desktop PC ftw
<foobarry> and moar monitors
<daftykins> +1 to that
<foobarry> and a big desk with all my gonks on
<foobarry> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7FtcW9u0GDE
<daftykins> hmm gonk was new on me!
<diddledan> what's that, skip, you wanna play with me didgerydoo?!
<Azelphur> lol, got one of those SMS's pretending to be my bank asking me to fill in my account details, looked at the domain and it was owned by a self-employed PC repair guy, so I phoned him and let him know
 * Azelphur is useful
<Seeker`> "You do know you're scamming people, right?"
<Azelphur> haha, was obviously a malicious user got control of his server
<Azelphur> and he just emailed me and let me know that he took it down, that probably saved a few peoples bank accounts
<Azelphur> good deed for the day \o/
<Seeker`> "oh, good catch, I'll *definitely* stop scamming people"
<Azelphur> haha
<popey> You should listen to the ReplyAll podcast, the guy gets friendly with one of those Windows scammers, and even goes to visit them in India. It's quite fun
<popey> https://gimletmedia.com/reply-all/ - episode 102 and 103
<Azelphur> that sounds fun
<Azelphur> Idea of the day: Friend is making me a SATA cable that takes the 5v line and puts it out into a female USB port, gonna buy a crappy GPS tracker off aliexpress for Â£5.60, and put it inside an unused drive bay in my laptop
<ali1234> Azelphur: three has a payg sim that gives you 200MB free per month if you top up Â£2 every six months
<ali1234> but you will need to get a tracker with 3G or they will kick you off because they don't support 2G
<Azelphur> ali1234: nice
<ali1234> also i odnt recommend using the drive bay that's the first place anyone wold look...
<ali1234> although if you can fit it all inside a case from a broken ssd that could work
<zmoylan-pi> aren't there software options for loading into firmware that will phone home if laptop is connected to internet?
<ali1234> yeah, computrace
<zmoylan-pi> i wonder how good the bt trackers are you see advertised around
<diddledan> this lookee funky: https://www.frontrow.com/
<zmoylan-pi> so another 'life trcaker'...
<diddledan> seems so
<zmoylan-pi> i'd love one that was small enough for a cat to wear with a wireless charging mat that i could slip into cats box that autouploaded pics to cloud
<zmoylan-pi> you could check what your murderfloof was up to when you weren't around
<diddledan> is google down?
<zmoylan-pi> panic \o/ ::goes to check::
<diddledan> I'm searching "you're awesome" and it's not returning
<zmoylan-pi> came up for me
<zmoylan-pi> haven't fired up google page in months... worked ok
<zmoylan-pi> vivaldi on linux mint
<diddledan> I wonder what voodoo is ocurring then
<zmoylan-pi> have you sacrificed chickens to the gods of wifi?
<diddledan> neither chrome nor firefox are loading it
<zmoylan-pi> and on your mobile device?
<diddledan> ok chrome finally loaded something
<zmoylan-pi> but you didn't type google into google? #justchecking
<diddledan> damn. that'ld do it
<diddledan> oops
<diddledan> google is working fine now
<diddledan> I wonder what I did to break it
<daftykins> must be the stuff you type into it, making it blush
<daftykins> my wealthy client has discovered Three's partner in France has issues today, no network association this lunch!
<daftykins> er since lunch, i meant
<zmoylan-pi> did you cast wiggle network cable? :-P
<daftykins> maybe ;D
<daftykins> still got him with an O2 service in his laptop for mobile data, so he's not entirely in holiday mode due to the service outage...
<zmoylan-pi> when i first got an iphone many moons ago the service was taken out for most of a day by rain... rain in ireland, who knew... :-)
<daftykins> cor!
<daftykins> did that become a regular thing when it rained?
<zmoylan-pi> http://www.rte.ie/news/2011/1001/306829-dublin_weather/
<daftykins> my my
<zmoylan-pi> nah, they had moved a bunch of servers into a basement i found out later, without checking for flood protection
<daftykins> :S
<daftykins> i should've asked you to translate for me when i had an Irish lass from EE during a call the other day
<daftykins> i swear i get the first 60% of sentences then they seem to allow all the words to hold hands by the end of the sentence
<daftykins> "Yes calling Guernsey from England will be 50p perminuteahoohaharemeraldisle"
<zmoylan-pi> one of my favourite films is i went down which provides a great example of inserting swear words into the middle of words when the sentence isn't long enough :-)
<zmoylan-pi> wow, 20 years old now... :-) http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0126344/
<daftykins> my my
<daftykins> what kind of a name is Git!
<zmoylan-pi> give it a watch, you will laugh out loud
<zmoylan-pi> in ireland a nickname can be more important than any other name
<daftykins> that's fair :>
<daftykins> now relaxing to some Cranberries
<daftykins> never did get to see them live, they cancelled
<zmoylan-pi> but it's a safe bet, anything with brendan gleason in it is pretty good
<zmoylan-pi> the guard, the general, in bruge
<daftykins> looks familiar, let's see
<zmoylan-pi> you will have seen in bruge
<zmoylan-pi> maybe not the other 2
<daftykins> hmm nah not heard of any
<daftykins> popped in the ol' unsorted bookmarks folder for a chaos storage rediscovery, anywho :D
#ubuntu-uk 2017-08-17
<diddledan> so I've set up a continuous integration/delivery system in my basement (read: under my desk)
<diddledan> it's based on gitlab's platform
<diddledan> for my super not really secret code
<diddledan> ee gads it's 3:30!
#ubuntu-uk 2017-08-18
<MooDoo> howdy all
<diplo> Morning all
<SuperMatt> morning
<davmor2> Morning all
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<foobarry>  does NOOBS allow raspbian 9 stretch to be installed?
<foobarry> seems to have recent release date of yesterday so thinking yes
<diddledan> yay storm
<diddledan> rain and thunder!
<zmoylan-pi> vvery frightening...
<Gargoyle> ohhh! Where are you diddledan?
<zmoylan-pi> somewhere here... http://en.blitzortung.org/live_lightning_maps.php?map=12
<Gargoyle> live lighning!! awesome! :D
<zmoylan-pi> and you can order pizza online in different window and enjoy the show... what an age to be alive... :-)
<Gargoyle> X-)
<diddledan> Gargoyle: I'm in Amazingstoke
<zmoylan-pi> about 10 miles from meh-on-the-weir? :-P
<diplo> We've had loads of lighting and thunder ( near bath )
<diplo> And the amount of rain, deludge would be an understatement
<diplo> But lasts about 5-10 mins and stops again
<zmoylan-pi> trying to make you think it's over and lure you out... #sneakyRain
<diplo> I normally walk around now in the afternoons
<zmoylan-pi> ditto, go for a 3hour walk to nearby town and back listening to podcasts
<davmor2> diddledan: don't lie to me there is nothing amazing about stoke
<diddledan> :-p
<davmor2> diddledan: actually that's not fair, it's amazing that you went, that's what is amaing about stoke ;)
<diddledan> NOT BRUCIE!
<diddledan> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-40978576
<diddledan> I made a thing: https://codepen.io/diddledan/pen/YxexMe
<diddledan> I also made one with a different spinner effect: https://codepen.io/diddledan/pen/jLZarL
<diddledan> the defenders is on netflix
#ubuntu-uk 2017-08-19
<markie-> so the other day, i was just walking down the street and dropped my keys, bends over to pick them up, as i was doing it i caught a man checking out my behind..
<SuperMatt> fascinating story
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<penguin42> has anyone roamed with 3 recently on PAYG - the 2 guys in the Three shop couldn't quite agree on what was supposed to happen
<daftykins> heh
<daftykins> do you have 'feel at home' ?
<penguin42> I *think* so
<daftykins> log into your account, might show up - i have a client with three right now and i think it shows up
<daftykins> unless you avoided having the account with PAYG :>
<penguin42> I think it does show up when I login; the qeustion was whether you need to do anything else - apparently at one point you had to convert PAYG to Addons for it to work, but they think that's no longer the case
<daftykins> phone in? :>
<daftykins> ooh i saw my first new nokia 3310 in Dixon's Travel at Stansted just earlier today, funky
 * penguin42 guesses he'll find out in a couple of months when he travels
<daftykins> client o' mine was hit by an outage across the whole of France on Wednesdayish which left him on his boat off the north coast unable to get a service XD
<penguin42> ah yes I heard about that
 * penguin42 is going to be in Prague for a couple of days near the end of October - that's about the limits of my travelling
<daftykins> ooh
<daftykins> tell you what's painful, i was just in England... 50p/MB data
<daftykins> we're not in the EU (Guernsey)
<penguin42> ouch
<zmoylan-pi> probably don't even have ascii there yet... still on ebdic... :-P
<penguin42> zmoylan-pi: They use fieldata - smaller bytes for a smaller island
<zmoylan-pi> this is a 7bit island and that's the ways we likes it... :-P
<popey> penguin42: i have a 3 sim which i only top up before I go out of the country. I just topped it up and went, didn't buy any addons because I couldn't figure out how
<popey> worked fine
<penguin42> popey: Cool is that on 3-2-1 ?
<popey> uh
<popey> dunno
<penguin42> and when you get somewhere-foreign what happens?  I couldn't find anything on the website; but the guy in the shop said that you get a text telling you which network you should be on
<popey> i just enabled roaming data and off I went
<penguin42> ok, thanks
<penguin42> I used to be on T-mobile, theirs you got a text on landing saying something like 'go to this page and do this for 1 days/100MB data' at some silly amount (before the new rules)
<popey> oooh
<popey> logging into the my three website I see the "turn credit into an add-on" button i couldn't find before :)
<zmoylan-pi> is it there in all browsers? :-)
<penguin42> popey: Ah now the guys in the shop were arguing about whether that was needed to roam on PAYG - but they checked their site and apparently not
<popey> clearly not as I roamed last month without doing it
<penguin42> popey: Thanks
<zmoylan-pi> i used to dread heading north when your phone jumped networks and data/calls/text went to silly money...
<ali1234> 3 backend infrastructure is terrible
<ali1234> their login is broken half the time
<ali1234> but you can't beat their prices
<penguin42> ali1234: My experience with T wasn't that much better
<ali1234> well that's because of orange tbh
<ali1234> they were good before they merged
<ali1234> i currently have two 3 sims, one for the phone and one for the laptop
<ali1234> but the laptop one i can't activate because their activation website is broken
<ali1234> invalid security certificate, and if you set an exception it still doesn't work
<penguin42> sounds about right
<penguin42> ali1234: Of course the only thing worse than the website of the phone companies are the people in the shops
<zmoylan-pi> i believe the correct method is to hack their website and fix it. then send them an email explaining how you did and get arrested... :-P
<penguin42> I think you mean 'an invoice'
<penguin42> actually talking of infrastructure, I forced one of the guys in the shop to check their website;  I'm not quite sure how ancient their windows install on the shop machine is, but it seems to involve opening a citrix client and going to what looks like firefox labelled as something like 'online chat'  and then going to their own site
<zmoylan-pi> then they set their rogue accountants on your account and you find a million wacky charges appearing forever...
#ubuntu-uk 2017-08-20
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<SuperMatt> ahoy
<brobostigon> ahoy hoy.
<BobMottram[m]> g'day
<Gargoyle> What is the correct way to restart gpg-agent? Seems to be spawned from "systemd --user" but I cant seem to identify a service unit name for it (service xyz restart, etc)
<penguin42> bytemark really trying to get me to convert to BigV now; they added something to let you carry legacy IPs over
<diddledan> AI is taking over - no driver on this bus: https://twitter.com/HackRead/status/899288384270737412
<penguin42> haha
<zmoylan-pi> stand back, i'm in i.t.!!
<diddledan> I know REGEX!
<zmoylan-pi> how is reg? :-)
<diddledan> bloated
<zmoylan-pi> it was always thus
<ali1234> if you have a USB LTE adapter, how do you read SMS from it?
<diddledan> via AT commands no doubt
<zmoylan-pi> quickly? :-P
<zmoylan-pi> nokia used to have a desktop app that could connect to your phone to do the deed, perhaps something similar exists for the device?
<ali1234> there's a cdc-acm device so that is probably it
<ali1234> 9600 baud, responds to AT commands
<zmoylan-pi> fingers crossed someone has documented all the at commands...
<ali1234> okay i got a sms out of the modem
<ali1234> but i had to disable network manager because it takes over the interface normally
<ali1234> apparently i need to do this instead: https://mail.gnome.org/archives/networkmanager-list/2012-January/msg00007.html
<ali1234> okay so this is all controlled by modemmanager and apparently indicator-messages should support it
<frank__> #debianboot
<frank__> #debian-boot
<frank__> how do I switch channel?
<zmoylan-pi>  /join #channel
<frank__> thanks
<diddledan> zmoylan-pi: you don't need to prefix with space. just double the /: //join
<diddledan> /join <-- does that
<zmoylan-pi> what can i say, i'm lazy... :-)
<diddledan> hitting the same key twice is surely more energy saving than hitting two distinct keys, though, no?
<zmoylan-pi> perhaps but my hand was resting on spacebar at the time...
<brobostigon> i generally always have some of my left hand fingers around the ctrl/alt/fn/shift buttons, unless when i am typing, in which case my little finger on my left hand hovers over those keys, :)
<diddledan> !isitoutyet
<lubotu3> Yes!
<diddledan> lies!
<zmoylan-pi> it's not a proper release till you get it on a magazine cover :-)
#ubuntu-uk 2018-08-13
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<knightwise> good morning brobostigon
<brobostigon> morning knightwise
<knightwise> hows it goin dude
<brobostigon> first coffee of the day dissappearing quickly, mostly asleep, and you?
<knightwise> havent had coffee yet , still on tea
<brobostigon> :)
<knightwise> Just posted the new podcast: https://knightwise.com/kw1302-a-look-at-knightwises-kindle/
 * brobostigon has knightwise's blog setup in his tt-rss installation, :)
<knightwise> :)
<knightwise> yeah ,  we have shows lined up untill mid october :)
<brobostigon> :)
<knightwise> been preparing a "retro 80's cartoon themesong cover episode"
<brobostigon> https://taylorworld.one my work in progress, :)
<knightwise> oooh RPG
<brobostigon> :)
<knightwise> Hmm.. been buying some of those BDM magazines in the shop
<knightwise> computerbooks about coding, raspberry pi etc
<knightwise> pretty low level but well done.
<knightwise> 180 page magazines full of projects and instructions
<knightwise> only now found out they are also available as online pdf's for half the price
<brobostigon> thats a big difference, magazines like that are inheritly expensive here, thats why my brother still buys the C'T magazine for me, which is 4.9 euro, which is Â£4.37, a magazine like that here would be 4 times that price.
<knightwise> I think i payed 19 euro's for the edition i got yesterday
<brobostigon> ouch.
<knightwise> But i would prefer to have the digital versions
<knightwise> I'm realy into digital reading
<knightwise> things kicked up a notch when I found an old kindle fire at the dump this weekend :)
<knightwise> now I have a small tablet to read pdf's and stuff :)
<brobostigon> :)
<knightwise> amazing what people throw away
<brobostigon> oh yes.
<knightwise> Its a secret hobby of mine.
<knightwise> going to the recycling center, dumpsterdiving in the electronics bin and bringing home stuff just to fix it up and give it away
 * knightwise loves that
<brobostigon> :)
<knightwise> hmm. now I just need to look for a Sonos replacement for the office
<knightwise> been thinking about using musicbox on a pi
<knightwise> or I might just install mopidby on an old imac I have lying around
<zxmoy-pi> i've had a few ereaders from 7" cool-er to 5" kobo and a few inbetween.  i usually just switch back to using phone after a while.
<knightwise> Nah , cant read on a phone
<zxmoy-pi> my first ereader was a palm iiix so i'm used to small screens. these days i use my nokia 3310 2017 edition for reading
<zxmoy-pi> the battery life is near infinite on the bugger :-)
<knightwise> yes ! Same for me
<knightwise> read a TON of books on that one
<knightwise> Palm
<knightwise> handspring visor
<zxmoy-pi> i tried reading on my earlier pda a psion 3a but it wasn't as comfy to hold to read a book
<knightwise> ipaQ (yes , that s a q)
<knightwise> then the Sony PRS 505
<knightwise> a kobo, a kindle and now a kindle oasis
<zxmoy-pi> i remember the compaq ipaqs. one of the better pocket pc devices iirc
<knightwise> yes
<zxmoy-pi> still dreadful but way better than the rest
<knightwise> I read the entire han solo trilogy on the iPaq
<knightwise> and then some , a lot by arthur c clarke and of course star trek novels
<zxmoy-pi> i have all clarke and star trek on my nokia :-)
<zxmoy-pi> about 10gb of ebooks
<knightwise> Rama was probably my favorite (the first one)
<zxmoy-pi> i like the sequels but the series should have stopped after the first one alright
<knightwise> yep , never got through the second one
<knightwise> this weeks podcast is about "what am i reading"
<zxmoy-pi> the last line in the first one left it a wonderful anticipation....
<knightwise> yep , but then the second books tanks
<knightwise> enjoyed the space oddissey series too
<zxmoy-pi> 2061 is the weak one of that series and i still enjoyed it... they keep saying they're going to make the film....
<diplo> Morning all
<diplo> Afternoon even
<knightwise> 2061  ? I thought that was the best one
<zxmoy-pi> 3001 > 2010 > 2001 > 2061 would be my order
<zxmoy-pi> but i suspect the movie version of 2010 really made me like it a bit more as it was so good
<zxmoy-pi> especially the way 3001 was left open for a sequel as i read it...
<knightwise> yep , but never finished
<knightwise> I thought the book was way better then the movie
<zxmoy-pi> it was but the movie did the ships well... they did zero gravity well, the aerobraking looked fantastic....
<knightwise> that is true
<knightwise> and the guy who did the lead (the guy from jaws) great lead
<knightwise> great cast
<zxmoy-pi> yup
<knightwise> teehee :) I found an old kindle fire at the dump yesterday ,
<knightwise> turns out the thing supports bluetooth keyboard and mouse ! hilarious
<zxmoy-pi> if it's new enough you should be able to plug in a usb keyboard and mouse via an otg cable....
<knightwise> ah ! i have one of those lying around too
<knightwise> sshd in via the fire :)
<knightwise> ha
<knightwise> insane that this thing even has a mini kb and mouse
<diddledan> seagulls are coming home to roost
<diddledan> big weird when the nearest sea is 50 miles away
<zxmoy-pi> very noisy outside as i walked home earlier.  suggests rain
<zxmoy-pi> about 2m from sea
<brobostigon> oh yeah https://photos.app.goo.gl/tqL6iLLYzif15Nf76 :)
#ubuntu-uk 2018-08-14
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<Nafallo> morning brobostigon
<brobostigon> morning Nafallo
<daftykins> morn \o
<daftykins> well well, DPD guy dropped off my 'repaired' LG Nexus 5x phone
<diplo> yay daftykins, all working as expected?
<daftykins> yep seems good, did take about an hour and a half to update through all the many chains of updates and then start to get things back to normal
<daftykins> soon the delight of moving all the 2FA stuff over will begin ;)
<diplo> Yeah, I'm moving my 2FA to the open source client from Authenticator
<diplo> So got to do a similar thing
<daftykins> any benefits to that?
<diplo> Just trying not to tie myself to any of the big three or four companies
<diplo> Authenticator is MS, another is from Google
<daftykins> hmm the one called Authenticator on mine is the Google one, i think MS renamed theirs to 'Microsoft Account' perhaps?
<daftykins> ah no it is indeed just Microsoft Authenticator too
<diplo> haha
<daftykins> knocked down to 55% already though, they certainly didn't give me a new battery xD
<diplo> hahah, don't expect too much! Are they sealed units or can you replace?
<daftykins> they're the kind with clips to attach the front and rear, the type you tend to snap when making your own attempt and leaving them never truly attaching well again after
<daftykins> i think they replaced the back on mine here, so they likely broke it the same way on opening it up! :D
<daftykins> really though since the post office banned batteries, it's really hard to get replacements onto the island now - so that's made it nigh-on impossible
<diplo> Does suck living there at times! but also save a fortune on other things :)
<daftykins> it's been interesting chatting to my neighbour who took a job here, but comes from England
<daftykins> there was a study done which said the cost of living based on food is 1.4x that in England - but she also mentioned her job seems to pay about 1.4x the same role in England, too
<daftykins> i cracked open an old CTX LCD monitor yesterday and diagnosed some faulty capacitors, so i get to have even more soldering training :D
<diplo> Brave man opening monitors, never touched them.. but I guess that's from the old CRT days
<diplo> But you don't pay the same taxes as we do right over there, so must be some large savings there ?
<daftykins> i did hop on here and ask some guys in another channel whether it needed to be discharged to be safely touched, but apparently using some nylon gloves and just staying away from the high voltage section can be enough
<zxmoy-pi> PLUS chance of star trek style monitor exploding.... :-P
<daftykins> still got 20% income tax, but there's no VAT yeah, so all electronics etc are much cheaper
<diplo> So get you to buy and transfer here
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> i may have muled a few laptops for friends in my time
<daftykins> *cough*
<diplo> hehe, right got to go and feed a dog, bbiab
<zxmoy-pi> honestly officer the 10 laptops are for personal consumption...
<daftykins> "om nom nom
<daftykins> "
<daftykins> jeez, Homebase closing tonnes of branches now eh
<daftykins> tonnes more, that is
<zxmoy-pi> how bad are things when you can't sell the british diy or gardening supplies....
<mgdm> from what I read it's because the new Australian owners tried to do what worked in Australia
<mgdm> so they didn't sell heaters in winter, for example :)
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> hilarious
<knightwise> hey peepz
<knightwise> how you doin gtoday
<daftykins> not too bad at all thanks, got my phone back from repair - and just set up yet another lovely nextcloud instance \o/
<daftykins> how are things in your neck of the woods?
<daftykins> hrmm i have the PSU from a monitor that has a few bulging capacitors within, i've desoldered one of each type i see and have noted their ratings - but i was recommended to consider the ESR value of each one when shopping for replacements
<daftykins> i have at my fingertips 'Asiacon' brand caps of 1000uF and 16v, with "LE 105 deg C" and "0506" written on
<daftykins> well, technically a couple are 10v but i hear i can just get 16v and they'll be grand too
<daftykins> no idea if i should consider much more detail then given 'ESR' is pretty new to me
<daftykins> think i'll just buy these Panasonics i found :) https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/111020269027?var=410162279756
<zxmoy-pi> star trek... exploding monitors...
<daftykins> :P
<zxmoy-pi> almost as bad as their klingon armour... did it ever once stop a blade or energy weapon?
<zxmoy-pi> i'm suprised the enterprise didn't explode every week...
<daftykins> what if it's all training sims, maybe they never left dry dock!
<daftykins> https://youtu.be/Gp_RnJcb8Ig - hmm the new Matt Groening thing
<diddledan> looks interesting
<diddledan> the animation style is very groening
<zxmoy-pi> creating the simpsos means some money will be spent on the animation
#ubuntu-uk 2018-08-15
<daftykins> toodle pipski
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<zxmoy-pi> belated o/
<brobostigon> o/
<daftykins> \o
<knightwise> hey everyone
<daftykins> heh some senior clients are struggling with being switched to G Suite email from Thunderbird
<daftykins> no way i'm going back to supporting naff desktop clients
<diddledan> is that senior as in important, or senior as in old fogeys? ;-p
<daftykins> the latter :D
<daftykins> self-confessed 'luddites'
<diddledan> \o/
<daftykins> i got tired of the emergency email recovery after the granddaughter repeatedly throwing drinks over the laptops and PCs over the years
<daftykins> much better to have something that's accessible from elsewhere in the event of another beverage bonanza ;D
<diddledan> in lookout.pst files?
<daftykins> nah they're too tight to license Office even
<daftykins> some seem to really resist threaded emails
<diddledan> o_O
<diddledan> weirdos
<zxmoy-pi> well... thunderbird... used to love it but they completely mozillaed it...
<daftykins> it's sucked from inception really, no decent import/export features so it's tough to get things out when you want to escape, too
<zxmoy-pi> when i was using it, it was like a better version of outlook express which was my preferred client on windows way back when
<zxmoy-pi> i could store my email profile on ipod classic and access it on mac or pc from the ipod
<daftykins> mmm though it's never hard to beat the MS defaults that should never be touched with a bargepole :D i think i did originally put it in for these folk in the early 2000s
<zxmoy-pi> back then it was good
<daftykins> i'd not go that far :D
<daftykins> the idea of a client at all now just makes me laugh
<diddledan> I _really_ hate the verbose reply header on lookout emails
<zxmoy-pi> i abandoned it when they 'improved' it by changing the database backend that slowed it down and made search broken
<diddledan> 5 lines for every reply
<daftykins> diddledan: huh?
<diddledan> let me dig one out
<daftykins> zxmoy-pi: seems they did give them a dev again so this new v60 is the first change in forever
<daftykins> i was horrified to see that an email account is mandatory before you can even start using it though, sometimes i want to just manipulate storage files with it, not use email
<diddledan> this is the header included on emails when you click reply in lookout:
<diddledan> https://www.irccloud.com/pastebin/kfHOYk75/
<diddledan> with the reply above that usually
<diddledan> backasswards replies :-)
<daftykins> ah in the message body?
<diddledan> yup
<diddledan> what's wrong with "On $date, $who said:"
<daftykins> once i've had a to and fro with folks i delete everything in replies and just have single sentence responses :D none of that repeated signature rubbish, too
<daftykins> or forced ongoing "hi, message, bye"
<diddledan> lookout doesn't indent the replied-to content either
<daftykins> oh another of my clients website guys has gone AWOL, not replied to either of us in months
<diddledan> oh dear
<daftykins> he seems to be using one of those security plugins for their wordpress so it's just locked out all login attempts on the first try, too
<daftykins> seems ace
<daftykins> :D
<diddledan> hah. just had an email from CPC claiming to promote "NEW IN: Freesat HD Recorders" - of the four products listed, one is a freesat box, the other three are freeview boxes
<daftykins> \o/
<zxmoy-pi> i really should get a tv when they sort out the whole digital tv thing.... any day now.... ::waits:: :-)
<diddledan> "why is this email saying it's freesat?" .. "well there's one freesat box"
<daftykins> what do you mean by 'sort it out' ?
<diddledan> wait, digital tv isn't sorted out?
<diddledan> oh, ireland
<daftykins> xD
<diddledan> thems be dragon waters
<daftykins> in fairness i've heard that a couple of channels have dumped freesat entirely so are only available on freeview now
<diddledan> yeah, some of the channel 4 stuff is only on freeview now
<daftykins> and Dave
<diddledan> oh yeah, dave
<daftykins> and you can't get much on freeview down here since nobody is willing to pay to broadcast it for some reason
<diddledan> :-(
<diddledan> so you're stuck with content-tv or statellites?
<diddledan> continent*
<daftykins> well because town here is on the east coast and built on a hill, the only line-of-sight transmitter is over on Jersey, that's the only reason i picked up a lot of French channels the time i played with the HDHomeRun box i got
<diddledan> or do you have a weird islands tv?
<daftykins> we either get local news or BBC south-west on the usual suspects
 * diddledan petpet hdhr
<daftykins> you got one is it?
<diddledan> yup
<daftykins> mines now in London so i can VPN up to my clients place then stream it from there :D
<daftykins> own personal IPTV
<diddledan> got my plex configured to use it
<daftykins> i wanted to play with that so his smart TVs down in Spain could tune in via the native Plex app, but the only thing we have to host PMS in London is the synology NAS which isn't a transcode capable model
<daftykins> so it was a non-starter sadly
<diddledan> dang
<daftykins> however with the help of a mate, we knocked up a .m3u playlist with all the channels, so you can just fire up a channel at will
<daftykins> (by loading the playlist in VLC)
<daftykins> that gets around needing the HDHomeRun client app, so it works fine over the VPNs
<diddledan> you should be able to access a rudimentary channel list on http://$hdhr-ip/
<daftykins> oddly we found that it'd permit the first 1 or 2 visits then the 3rd would get error'd
<daftykins> the channels aren't gonna change really though, so the static playlist works nicely
<daftykins> also means i can remove the unsavoury channels so their young son won't see them
<diddledan> yey
<zxmoy-pi> for me digitial tv's main problem is that everywere sells smart tvs and i don't want a smart tv... oh and reality tv filling the channels was a reason not to replace my last tv when it died...
<daftykins> you do need to get over the tinfoil hat approach to tech, if you don't want to use the features just don't put it on the network via wired/wifi - no reason to eschew the entire product line
<daftykins> the very same hardware providing the modern image processing tech is what guarantees a model becomes smart, so you can't have one without the other now really
<zxmoy-pi> you don't know me at all :-D
<daftykins> definitely agree on the utter tripe content on broadcast being a good reason not to bother, although i just tend to use mine as glorified monitors
<zxmoy-pi> i _have_ thought of getting a really nice monitor and adding a cheap media stick of some sort other than google
<daftykins> unlikely to get a truly normally behaving one with HDMI and speakers, even with smart TVs you'd end up going to an external device at some point since they get dumped for support after a couple of years
<daftykins> a friend up in England there had tried to go super cheap with a 'Seizo' brand TV from Currys, Â£160 and 32" - but the software seized up within 2 weeks of use, stopping all functions from working
<zxmoy-pi> yeah, sound i suspect i'd be ok with a bt headset or even wired headphones.
<zxmoy-pi> when you need to reboot your tv.... :-)
<daftykins> it'd be rare to even find a socket in a monitor though
<daftykins> can't avoid updates!
<zxmoy-pi> was reading a few days back of a phone shipped with bitcoin mining malware in rom... security and updates are a bad joke these days....
<daftykins> well they are when you buy the shifty unknown brands as that one was
<zxmoy-pi> which means there will never be a new up and coming brand?
<daftykins> also a lot of these reports refer to China where they typically get their apps through sharing the packages or using suspect third party sources so all bets are off from the outset, can't let the truth get in the way of a good headline though
<daftykins> sure there will, like OnePlus was... but then they had a bit of a fiasco about data harvesting from devices and so on too
<daftykins> i'm just pretty sure that particular story was an asia-only brand that didn't fill you with confidence just reading the name of
<zxmoy-pi> yeah, but i do see some wacky brands in some of the more obscure phone shops about dublin... how does the average punter protect themselves
<daftykins> it's not like the common man has ever truly been catered for with tech
<zxmoy-pi> all the 'best' phone shops are in working class areas here...
<daftykins> high street shop rent must be as insane as the town here
<daftykins> more empty spots than open shops, now
<zxmoy-pi> dublin is stupid money expensive... apple did look to open a store but decided dublin was too expensive... :-)
<daftykins> heh figures
<zxmoy-pi> unless they want to open a stall next to honest ivans phone repair shop next to the halal butchers on moore street.... :-P
<daftykins> hmm i should get another machine down to the charity shop today, help clear out my office ;)
<zxmoy-pi> any of the others sold, do you know?
<daftykins> the staff were still making space for it last i heard, but this is the last of the 3 i was gonna get them going on, then we'll see how it goes
<zxmoy-pi> fingers crossed...
#ubuntu-uk 2018-08-16
<ali1234> most of the bbc's rss feeds have gone dark
<knightwise> ali1234: oh , that doesnt look good
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<knightwise> hey brobostigon
<brobostigon> hi knightwise
<knightwise> how are you doing today man :)
<brobostigon> recovering from a cold.
<knightwise> hope you feel well soon dude
<knightwise> colds in the summer are a bitch
<brobostigon> thanks, :)
<brobostigon> oh yes.
<brobostigon> although i have a project to distract my mind, building a text adventure to test out one of my D&D campaign ideas.
<knightwise> Cool :)
<brobostigon> :)
<knightwise> ive been messing around trying to get mopidy to work on an old iMac to turn it into a sonos replacement / narrowcasting screen
<brobostigon> :)
<knightwise> hmm. macbook pro is back from the store
<knightwise> keyboard replacement
<brobostigon> working ok?
<knightwise> yeah, they had to replace the entire bottom half of the laptop just to swap out the keyboard
<brobostigon> any advice on software to use to help me create said text adventure?
<brobostigon> wow.
<knightwise> brobostigon: as in coding advice ?
 * knightwise = coding noob
 * brobostigon googles
<knightwise> what kind of help are you lookin for , actual coding ?
<brobostigon> just a place to start, i understand how games like that work and the logic, ans what i want to do.
<knightwise> :( Coding noob i'm afraid.
<brobostigon> https://github.com/evennia/evennia is a candidate.
<zxmoy-pi> so much simpler in 8 bit days when you had the likes of quill and paw to write text adventures...
<brobostigon> :)
<zxmoy-pi> didn't the zork people have a system for writing adventure games that might have been reverse engineered by now...
<zxmoy-pi> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Z-machine
<brobostigon> ty zxmoy-pi
#ubuntu-uk 2018-08-17
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<zxmoy-pi> o/
<brobostigon> o/
 * brobostigon just rolled an elven alchemist from pathfinder playtest, a very odd class to say the least.
<zxmoy-pi> i was an orc philosopher barbarian....
<zxmoy-pi> who never raged...
<brobostigon> lol.
<zxmoy-pi> the dm found an obscure skill were i could turn my rages into an enhancement to resistance on will checks
<brobostigon> cool.
<knightwise> heya everyone
<knightwise> hows it hangin
<brobostigon> hi, woken up finally, and you?
<knightwise> doing ok , last day of the week. looking forward to another busy weekend. Life of an entrepreneur , you know how it is
<knightwise> Ditched my macbook pro in favor of my Dell XPS13 today
<knightwise> (at least as my 'taking to work' machine)
<brobostigon> :)
<knightwise> I think my butterfly keys and me are "on a break"
<brobostigon> finally gave my elf some clothing, so now he isnt going edventuring naked. lol.
<knightwise> good ,
<knightwise> we wanted to talk to you about your naked hairy elf
<brobostigon> :)
<knightwise> ok , the bash shell integrationin in windows 10 is .. gloriously weird
<zxmoy-pi> have you sealed the macbook in a vacuum bag to preserve it from dust? :-/
<knightwise> been thinking about it
<knightwise> am thinking of getting a keyboard cover for 5$ at amazon
<zxmoy-pi> make sure it's lintless, repeat lintless.... :-P
<knightwise> lol yeah
<knightwise> hmm. checking out the bash integration in Win 10 :)
<knightwise> hilariously wierd to have Ubuntu command in what looks like a native cmd.exe window
<daftykins> afternoon all \o
<knightwise> hey everyone
<daftykins> got the capacitors for this old monitor's power supply, so i get to break out the soldering iron again for more practice :D
<zxmoy-pi> i hope you follow moss's rules with dealing with the soldering iron...
#ubuntu-uk 2018-08-18
<daftykins> never watched that
<zxmoy-pi> never watched the it crowd.... Oo
<knightwise> heya peepz
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<zxmoy-pi> o/
<brobostigon> o/
<brobostigon> who ever the person that is on on bbc saturday kitchen, has the most ridiculous hear style i have ever seen.
<brobostigon> hair*
<Nokaji> I knew someone once who had a ridiculous hear style - they heard everything twice so you had to say only half of what you wanted them to hear
<zxmoy-pi> *badum* *tish*
 * penguin42 grumbles at the price increase by Virgin
<zxmoy-pi> how much?
<penguin42> Â£3.50 increase/month from 1st October - that's about 10%
<zxmoy-pi> i blame brexit for the extra cost in import exporting bits...
<penguin42> well, I guess equipment does cost more; I also blame them getting bought out by Liberty a year or so back
<zxmoy-pi> yes... consolidation which never makes the service cheaper as they pass the cost of the acquisition on to the customers...
<penguin42> they were ramping the bitrate up, but seem to have stopped - frankly I don't need any more
<penguin42> some more upstream would be nice
<penguin42> unfortunately I don't have any other choice though, and tehir bandwidth and latency is pretty good
#ubuntu-uk 2018-08-19
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<zxmoy-pi> o/
<brobostigon> o/
<zxmoy-pi> too hot and humid to go for a walk today... and roads are blocked off for iron man race around the area...
#ubuntu-uk 2019-08-12
<brobostigon> morning
<zmoylan-pi> o/
<brobostigon> \o
#ubuntu-uk 2019-08-13
<brobostigon> morning
<zmoylan-pi> o/
<brobostigon> o/
#ubuntu-uk 2019-08-14
<brobostigon> morning
<zmoylan-pi> o/
<brobostigon> \o
<m0nkey_> ð
<zmoylan-pi> =^..^=
#ubuntu-uk 2019-08-15
 * m0nkey_ brings the daemons ð
<daftykins> D:
<brobostigon> morning
<zmoylan-pi> o/
<brobostigon> \o
#ubuntu-uk 2019-08-16
<brobostigon> morning
<zmoylan-pi> o/
<brobostigon> o/
#ubuntu-uk 2019-08-17
<brobostigon> morning
<zmoylan-pi> o/
<brobostigon> o/
#ubuntu-uk 2019-08-18
<brobostigon> morning
<zmoylan-pi> o/
<brobostigon> \o
<daftykins> power cut due to electricity company works :( have to shutdown as the UPS is unhappy! bbl with any luck ;)
<brobostigon> :(
<Azelphur> I bought a radeon yesterday, can confirm the drivers are still not great, https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=111416 and https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=111412
<lubotu3> Freedesktop bug 111416 in DRM/AMDgpu "4k 60hz on RX 560 over HDMI = no sound" [Normal,New]
<lubotu3> Freedesktop bug 111412 in DRM/AMDgpu "4k 60hz unavailable RX 560 over HDMI" [Normal,New]
<Azelphur> seems I have to choose between sound, or 60hz :(
<sonia83> Hello, I've got a Star Lite laptop that shipped with linux and some of the vendor-specific libraries are not upgrading correctly. sude apt-get update produces some errors including: unable to open '/usr/share/themes/StarLabs-Dark/gtk-3.0/assets/bullet-symbolic.svg.dpkg-new': No such file or directory. I've not moved anything.
