#ubuntu-desktop 2009-07-20
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, are you going to package gnome-mag 0.15.7?
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: oh I missed that upload. Yes, I will do it, thanks.
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, cool.  I thought it might have slipped through
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, can you upload compiz 0.8.2-0ubuntu15?
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: Sure. I assume its in bzr?
<TheMuso> nvm found it
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: where is ubuntu15?
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, yes, it's in bzr
<TheMuso> hrm ok, I don't see it anywhere
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, oh, it's under the compiz user: lp:~compiz/compiz/ubuntu
<TheMuso> Yeah thats what I pulled.
<TheMuso> oh its ubuntu14
<TheMuso> ...or not
<TheMuso> LP might be playing up.
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, my bad.  I hadn't pushed.  Should be there now
<TheMuso> Ok thanks.
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: The package FTBF sfor me.
<TheMuso> *FTBFs for
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, hmm... i'll fix that...
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, the compiz package has patches that apply to files in debian/ - have you ever seen that before?  I'm probably going to remove those patches and just apply directly
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: No never seen that. Thats rather stupid if you ask me.
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, ok, updated.  Should build now
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: ok thanks
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: uploaded.
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, thanks
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: np
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, btw, are you also aware onboard 0.91.2 has been released?
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: No, I will update it later.
<pitti> Good morning
<pitti> mac_v: no manpages for gdm.schemas; gconf provides inline explanations (or not, if the author didn't supply them)
<pitti> hyperair: sounds like a known bug
<mac_v> pitti: the gconf doesnt have all the options, listed in the gdm.schemas , or maybe i'm not looking at the right place... i just want to turn on the auto login and set the timer from 30->10 secs... any ideas?
<pitti> mac_v: timed login doesn't work ATM, I'm afraid; autologin is currently defined in /etc/gdm/custom.conf
<mac_v> pitti: ok.... also do you have any plans on removing/moving the Language,accesibility & keyboard options?
<pitti> "moving"?
<pitti> well, the entire design of that greeter is at disposition, I guess
<pitti> but for now I'm still worried in making it work (DX team will make it pretty)
 * pitti pokes at bug 401201 and bug 395103
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 401201 in gdm "Files in /etc/X11/Xsession.d/ aren't sourced anymore" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/401201
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 395103 in gdm "Gnome doesn't have my configured keyboard layout after login anymore" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/395103
<mac_v> pitti: moving the those options to a menu item labelled "Options" , as they are not frequently used anyway
 * mac_v feels uncomfortable with the gdm , likes the gdm to look something non-fedora
<asac> hi
<mac_v> pitti: i just need to add "AutomaticLoginEnable=True"  in /etc/gdm/custom.conf after the [daemon] line.. right? just asking , dont want to mess things up
<pitti> hey asac
<asac> moin moin ;)
<pitti> asac: yes, and AutomaticLogin=yourusername
<pitti> erm, mac_v ^
<mac_v> pitti: ok... thank you
<mac_v> asac: about editing the ff35 link which points to your blog? , for the firefox-3.5-gnome-support
<robert_ancell> hey pitti
<pitti> hey robert_ancell, how was your weekend?
<robert_ancell> pitti, good
<asac> mac_v: what?
<asac> mac_v: what do you suggest?
<mac_v> asac: we discussed the other day on the ubuntu mozilla irc,maybe you forgot, you could add a mention in the firefox 3.5 link that mentions the need to add the firefox-3.5-gnome-support package in addition in Jaunty, some users are getting confused, why firefox 3.5 doesn get set as the default
<mac_v> !ff35
<ubottu> Firefox 3.5 Final is available for Jaunty by installing the package firefox-3.5 | FF3.5 is referred to as Shiretoko on your UI, see http://is.gd/1reB3 for an explanation | Hardy & Intrepid: http://is.gd/1jkNY
<mac_v> s/that mentions/to mention
<asac> mac_v: thanks for the reminder. added
<pitti> geser: are you sure that the bug in gdm is exactly the same? when I switch to German keyboard layout in console-setup, now gdm itself uses US layout
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hey pitti
<chrisccoulson> good weekend ?
<pitti> yes, I had; quiet, but relaxing; and you?
<seb128> good morning there
<seb128> hey pitti!
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<chrisccoulson> pitti - my weekend was quite relaxing too, apart from moving my computer in to its new home
<chrisccoulson> hey seb128
<seb128> hi chrisccoulson
<pitti> chrisccoulson: you move your computer without moving along yourself?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i only moved it in to another room in the house. the old room has to be used for something else now ;)
<didrocks> good morning o/
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i did the gnome-settings-daemon update last night. i dropped the gstreamer volume patch from the update, seeing as we're now using the pulseaudio volume control applet - i wasn't sure whether you wanted to do that though
<chrisccoulson> i can re-add it again if not ;)
<seb128> no that's good
<chrisccoulson> cool. the notifications patch needed a bit of reworking to work with the new code too
 * seb128 is catching up on weekend emails now and will do sponsoring after that
<seb128> pitti, gdm 2.27.4 tarball available if you want to do the update
<pitti> seb128: already done in bzr
<pitti> seb128: currently fighting with bug 395103 again
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 395103 in gdm "Gnome doesn't have my configured keyboard layout after login anymore" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/395103
<seb128> pitti, you wake up way earlier than me apparently ;-)
<pitti> seb128: usually I start around 8
<didrocks> seb128: when you have some time, can you please just give a look at my gobject-introspection merge? I didn't upload it (http://www.didrocks.fr/temp/gobject-introspection_0.6.3-1ubuntu1.dsc). I mostly wondered by the DM didn't add replaces/conflicts against python-girscanner in gobject-introspection (to remove the python-girscanner package from system, even if now shipped files changed their path)
<seb128> didrocks, replaces is only required when overwriting content
<seb128> didrocks, not using conflicts is probably an oversight if the new version is an update of the old naming
<didrocks> seb128: yes, but conflicts alone won't remove the package and just forbide to upgrade
<seb128> that would be an apt bug
<seb128> or not bug but upgrade calculation issue
<seb128> do you have anything depending on the old naming and the new one?
<didrocks> it doesn't prevent from upgrading and will remove the conflicting package?
<seb128> well that's what dist-upgrade is supposed to do
<didrocks> no, I didn't try to just put conflicts alone (and there is no depend on the old naming), it was more a theorical thought
<seb128> it puts things on hold when using Breaks
<seb128> but when using Conflicts it should install the new one
<didrocks> ok, so I can only put Conflicts
<seb128> yes, as said Replaces is only if you overwritte content
<didrocks> I knew that, but I previously (and wrongly ) thought that's the couple Replaces/Conflicts was needed to remove the conflicting package. My bad so ;)
<didrocks> I will change that this evening, test it and upload the package, so. Thanks :)
<seb128> didrocks, you're welcome
<geser> pitti: I'm not sure that't the same bug, but the result is the same: I have now again a USA layout till it reset it back to german
<seb128> pitti, bug #589024, did you ship the new binary in some .install?
<ubottu> Error: Launchpad bug 589024 could not be found
<seb128> pitti, could explain all the bugs about nautilus not storing positions, etc
<seb128> bug #401367
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 401367 in nautilus "View mode always changes to Icons" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/401367
<davmor2> pitti: How are the iso's looking?
<rodrigo_> dh: --with quilt not supported or failed to load module Debian::Debhelper::Sequence::quilt
<rodrigo_> getting ^^ on jaunty, any idea what's missing?
<rodrigo_> on karmic it builds ok
<didrocks> rodrigo_: debhelper jaunty version is not new enough
<rodrigo_> hmm
 * seb128 managed to clean weekend emails backlog before lunch this week
<seb128> short break and sponsoring coming next
<didrocks> seb128: congrats! I really don't want to imagine the number of bug mails you can receive within a weekend :)
<seb128> didrocks, july is quiet
<seb128> I had some 300 bug emails since saturday when I did read my emails
<seb128> and maybe 80 other emails
<seb128> it's sometime over 800 emails after weekend on busy weeks
<didrocks> that's still a high volume of bug emails, even 300 in july
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - you need a secretary to read your mail ;)
<seb128> ah ah
<maxb> rodrigo_, didrocks: It's the quilt version in jaunty that isn't new enough, as far as that particular error is concerned
<pitti> re (sorry, was on VTs, debugging gdm)
 * pitti radiates hate towards gdm, it keeps breaking
<pitti> 2.27.4 is an absolute desaster
<rodrigo_> maxb: ok, trying to build it without the --with-quilt version
<rodrigo_> pitti: yes, switch user crashes my desktop :(
<pitti> no, the greeter crashes instantly
<pitti> seb128: you mean it's missing a file? could be, haven't checked
<maxb> rodrigo_: If it has quilt patches, simply not applying them isn't going to be a good option
<seb128> pitti, yes, the new backend which does all the properties handling for nautilus
<rodrigo_> maxb: yeah
<pitti> seb128: thanks for spotting
<seb128> pitti, I'm about to do a 15 minutes break and then will do sponsoring and will have a look at gvfs after lunch if nobody is faster
<pitti> seb128: cool, thanks; I hope I can unbreak gdm today (&#($*#$ keyboard layout)
<seb128> pitti, you're welcome, that's just upstream comment asking if that new backend was running which made me think about that
<pitti> do other people have US layout in gdm itself now, too?
<maxb> rodrigo_: So basically the options are to backport quilt as well, or to modify the rules file of the other package to build in the logic that --with quilt would invoke
<seb128> I'm not using your git snapshot but I can if you want
<seb128> pitti, ^
<pitti> seb128: oh, what do you use?
<seb128> pitti, 2.26.1-0ubuntu7, I just didn't dist-upgrade since friday
<pitti> ah, ok
<seb128> will do that now
<seb128> brb testing new gdm
 * pitti -> off again for gdm debugging
<seb128> re
<seb128> pitti, yes, keymap is USA by default now
<pitti> seb128: where exactly?
<pitti> I just tried it, and for entering passwords I get the system layout (correctly)
<seb128> pitti, when I click on my user name the combo box for keyboard
<pitti> but if I go to "other", it defaults to USA
<pitti> or any other user name, yes
<pitti> seb128: but for entering your password it's correct, right?
<seb128> let me try, I did pick french before entering the password
<seb128> but I think the combo is for the user session
<seb128> not the login screen itself
<pitti> right
<pitti> well, if I select "other", and type the user name, I get US
<seb128> ditto
<seb128> that's the bug
<seb128> it should use the system default
<pitti> seb128: did it really get that right with 2.26.1?
<geser> pitti: if it matters, I've auto-login enabled and get a us layout
<pitti> geser: ah, so you never picked the layout
<seb128> pitti, I'm not sure now
<pitti> geser: can you show me your ~/.dmrc?
<geser> no
<pitti> if I pick the layout once, it's fine
<pitti> ok, then I think I know what to do
<geser> [Desktop]
<geser> Session=gnome
<pitti> no Layout= then
<seb128> pitti, btw your xsession script change made seahorse-agent not be run
<pitti> ok, that explains it then
<pitti> seb128: I know, already fixed in bzr
 * seb128 hugs pitti
<seb128> you rock ;-)
<pitti> seb128: but I need to back out 2.27.4, it makes the greeter crash
<seb128> fixing bugs faster than we notice those ;-)
<seb128> do you have a stacktrace?
<pitti> yes
<seb128> can I see it? ;-)
<pitti> was overwritten by my last gdm restart, but I'll get it again
<seb128> ok
<pitti> lots of gobject stuff and a failed assertion
<seb128> don't bother too much I can have a look with a local build later
<seb128> there is not too many commits between your snapshot and the tarball should be easy to find the buggy one
<pitti> I already tried to revert the two major ones
<pitti> gdm-check-worker-state.patch and gdm-duplicate-usernames.patch
<pitti> those weren't it
<didrocks> pitti: (just as a notice, nothing really urgent there). I played this week-end in integrating distutils-extra auto to quickly. I have found some annoying things and some of them can be called bugs. I didn't opened them yet as I think you can want to have a look at them first: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DidierRoche/distutils-extra.auto
<didrocks> pitti: I tried to categorize them, but it can be wrong and only from my point of view :)
<didrocks> feel free to edit the page to comment when you have some time
<pitti> didrocks: clean> did you try ./setup.py clean -a ?
<pitti> didrocks: good stuff ther
<didrocks> pitti: hum, no. I will try it :)
<didrocks> pitti: thanks
<pitti> seb128: ok, got the keyboard thing nailed now; I'll bisect now to find the 2.27.4 breakage
<seb128> chrisccoulson, gnome-session uplodaed, gnome-settings-daemon has a small .install issue
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - thanks, i didn't notice that :-/
<pitti> seb128: meh, I reverted all patches now, and it still breaks; will take some more time
<seb128> pitti, do you want me to test build the bzr version to see if I get the issue too?
<pitti> seb128: if you have time, but I don't think it's something local
<pitti> if I re-build the karmic version on current karmic, it still works (i. e. it's not a build-time failure against newer gobject or so)
<seb128> pitti, let me run a build it shouldn't take too long to test
<pitti> seb128: ok, it wasn't "all" patches yet, I didn't include the NEWS and translations changes
 * pitti dives into diff harder
<vuntz> seb128: yop
<seb128> lut vuntz
<vuntz> seb128: I believe you guys are using the compiz-manager script, but install it as compiz (and rename compiz to compiz.real). Is this right?
 * pitti hugs vuntz
<seb128> vuntz, correct
<vuntz> seb128: okay... Trying to figure out how to make compiz-manager usable from upstream gnome-wm
<vuntz> seb128: was planning to do something like "if test "x`which compiz-manager`" != "x"; then use compiz-manager, else use compiz"
 * vuntz hugs pitti 
<seb128> vuntz, looks good to me
<vuntz> seb128: ugh, the gnome-wm tweaks you do in a patch are weird
<vuntz> seb128: do you really need /desktop/gnome/applications/window_manager/default?
<seb128> why?
<vuntz> seb128: (you'd probably need to add a link from compiz to compiz-manager to not have to patch out the gtk-window-decorator call, btw)
<seb128> vuntz, the gconf key is there for compatibility reasons I think
<mat_t> seb128: hi
<seb128> hey mat_t
<mat_t> seb128: do you know anything about the planned features for the new gdm?
<seb128> mat_t, nothing planned over what we have now in karmic
<seb128> mat_t, what sort of feature are you looking after?
<mat_t> seb128: in particular, what the prefs menu will cover
<seb128> mat_t, upstream doesn't want a preference menu or dialog
<seb128> mat_t, they want autologin to be a checkbox in the user account tool
<mat_t> seb128: cool, that sounds good!
<mat_t> seb128: so what will the options be: autologin/no autologin, what about the face browser?
<seb128> mat_t, there is no face browser yet and will not be one for karmic
<seb128> mat_t, input from the design team on where a such option should go would be welcome though
<mat_t> seb128: I meant user picker
<seb128> ?
<mat_t> seb128: atm I've got a user icon and user name next to it
<seb128> right, those are the accounts on the system
<mat_t> seb128: I click on the user name to access the password
<seb128> ie the "about me" capplet let you set those
<mat_t> I see
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - fedora have a g-c-c patch for applying themes sytem-wide from gnome-appearance-properties (eg, to change the GDM theme) - do you think we should use this patch?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, no opinion, it has been discussed upstream for a while now
<seb128> I would welcome opinion from the design team about that too in fact
<mat_t> chriscoulson: does that mean ability to apply any gtk theme to the gdm, regardless of the individual user settings?
<seb128> does it make sense to split options in different dialogs or de we want a gdmsetup tool
<chrisccoulson> ok, no problem. i noticed it when looking at their polkit-1 patch, as that patch touched code that only they have in their version
<mat_t> chrisccoulson: sorry mistyped your nick ^
<chrisccoulson> mat_t - it would allow you to change the default system theme, much in the same way that you can change the default keyboard layout already
<seb128> chrisccoulson, it's bug #536531
<seb128> gnome bug #536531
<ubottu> Error: Launchpad bug 536531 could not be found
<ubottu> Gnome bug 536531 in Appearance "Allow setting the default background" [Normal,New] http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=536531
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, thats the one
<mat_t> chrisccoulson: that sounds like a good idea
<chrisccoulson> mat_t - yeah, i thought so. i'll take a look at that patch
<seb128> the thing is how do you change the login background then?
<seb128> you change your, use the set system default
<seb128> and then select back the one you want for your user?
<mat_t> chrisccoulson: great!
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - changing the system default will change the GDM background and that of new users and users who are stll using the default
<seb128> brb
<mat_t> seb128: chrisccoulson: can you explain what the background behaviour would be?
<mat_t> chrisccoulson: would the user be able to set the gdm background?
<chrisccoulson> yeah, the button would change the system default background. This would set the GDM background, and would also set the background adopted by new users created on the system in the future
<chrisccoulson> GDM adopts the system defaults currently, just like any other user on the system
<mat_t> I seer
<mat_t> see ^
<mat_t> :)
<chrisccoulson> i don't think it's ideal, but it's better than nothing and seems to be the direction that upstream are going in anyway (ie, no separate login screen preferences)
<seb128> re
<mat_t> chrisccoulson: yes, I think it's a good direction
<seb128> chrisccoulson, well I think we should get input from the design team if they think it's better to have a tools or not
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, i don't mind either way
<mat_t> chrisccoulson: where would that be set from? Gdm menu?
<seb128> mat_t, well it makes easy to use your background for gdm too
<seb128> mat_t, but is that something people want to do usually? I don't want to login screen to have a personal photo I'm using for example
<mat_t> seb128: good point
<seb128> so the button to set as system default means I've to unconfigure my background to set the gdm one and then configure it back
<seb128> pitti, greater crash here too, seems to be keyboard thing
<mat_t> seb128: hmm that sounds a bit confused
<pitti> if I may throw in my 2 cent, the only logical place for me would be in the gdm screen itself
<pitti> I would probably never suspect my personal background image config dialog to be able to set the gdm screen
<pitti> seb128: just captured a log with debug info
<pitti> seb128: http://people.ubuntu.com/~pitti/tmp/gdm-greeter.log
<pitti> but I still don't understand it
<mat_t> seb128: I think the gdm should remain unpersonalised. It's a bit like a public door to the house with many flats - some tenants may not like your choice of grafitti on it :)
<pitti> well, we do need to be able to configure autologin
<pitti> and that's so unrelated to "about me"
<pitti> I'd much rather like to see it in gdm itsefl
<seb128> pitti, we were speaking about background, autologin in user account was not controversial
<mat_t> correct
<seb128> pitti, yeah, same crash here
<mat_t> seb128: pitti: the avatar in the user picker makes it personal I guess. The problem now is that it's very difficult to discover how to change it
<mat_t> seb128: pitti: will that option be available while you set up your user account?
<seb128> you mean the face for your user or the computer icon?
<pitti> mat_t: ubiquity offers to configure autologin, yes
<mat_t> pitti: inc. avatar?
<pitti> mat_t: not right now
<pitti> mat_t: and I guess the installer is a bad environment to set it, too, since you usually don't have access to your photos there
<mat_t> pitti: I'm more interested in first run, although installer is the valid case, too
<pitti> seb128: meh, it didn't change anything in gdm_get_layout_from_name() or related..
<pitti> mat_t: we don't have a "first run" wizard
<pitti> (by design)
<mat_t> pitti: I'm referring to the set-up that you perform when you buy, e.g. Dell with Ubunu preinstalled
<pitti> ah, oem-config
<mat_t> yes
<pitti> mat_t: that's pretty much the same as in ubiquity now
<mat_t> I see
<pitti> but again, at this time the computer is virgin, and doesn't have your files?
<pitti> so you could only choose between a few default avatars
<pitti> which is proably reasonable
<mat_t> Sure, but we could offer a nice selection to start with, and info how to change it later
<pitti> just mentioning that you probably won't have access to personal files
<mat_t> yeah
<pitti> right, avatar should be in "about me"
<mat_t> atm it's in the "Account information..." in FUSA menu
<mat_t> Is that "about me"?
<pitti> yes
<mat_t> cool
<pitti> it's also in system->prefs
<mat_t> ok, that makes a lot of sense then. So the conclusion would be that gdm background should not be editable
<mat_t> atm we're working on theming for the boot, os switcher and the gdm
<mat_t> so that it's a smooth experience
<pitti> fine for me
<pitti> but that still leaves the question where to put autologin settings
<mat_t> should be ready before the Dublin sprint
<mat_t> I think it should go into the "About me" section, as a tick box
<didrocks> mat_t: but there can be an "autologin war" between users having sudoer privileges
<mat_t> didrocks: good point, how has that been solved up until now?
<didrocks> each user ticking the box in its own "About me" dialog in his/her session, without noticing that other user already uses autologin
<didrocks> mat_t: as it is in a common dialog now, people see that another account is already using autologin
<mat_t> didrocks: IMO if there's more that 1 sudo user that option could just be switched off
 * mat_t looks
<mat_t> didrocks: not sure which common dialog you have in mind
<didrocks> don't know, it was just a tought. Someone can change a value touching other users experience without noticing that there were another user using it.
<didrocks> mat_t: gdmsetup
<seb128> didrocks, you can disable a "another user is already set, do you want to unset it now"
<seb128> disable -> display
<didrocks> seb128: good point
<pitti> mat_t: also, which user is loggedin automatiacally is a property of gdm, not a property of that user IMHO
<seb128> and maybe write a currently <somebody> next to the checkbox
<pitti> it's a confusing place to configure it
<didrocks> I agree that configuring autologin (and gdm background) which are "global gdm value" in a user property related dialog is less than ideal
<pitti> it should be a combobox with all users, plus "disabled"
<pitti> and look the same for all users
<pitti> this would at least avoid the "multiple autologin" case
<pitti> but it still needs policykit, a backend, etc. pp.
<pitti> which both makes the about me patch very intrusive, as well as still being a bad place for it
<pitti> what's so wrong about configuring that right in the gdm screen itself?
<didrocks> pitti: without being logged and using polkit to say "I am acting as xxxx sudoer user to change that"?
<pitti> yes, PK does allow that
<pitti> of course it needs to be somewhere else as well
<pitti> since if you use autologin, you need to be able to reset it
<mat_t> I think a "sudo-autologin war" is potentially a source of great confusion
<didrocks> yes, being able to reach in gdm itself seems local, appart from this autologin issue (we don't need dbus/gconf stuff?)
<didrocks> s/local/logical
<mat_t> pitti: didrocks: from the user perspective, in majority of cases there's probably only 1 sudo-user on the machine
<mat_t> pitti: didrocks: and that user will expect to be able to set autologin on/off for himself
<mat_t> pitti: didrocks: if there's more than 1 sudo user it probably means that we don't know which one is "more sudo" than the other :)
<pitti> mat_t: both are equally "sudo"ish
<pitti> i. e. both are allowed to change autologin settings
<mat_t> yes
<mat_t> both or none
<didrocks> mat_t: that's for sure. But I really think we don't have to change global gdm value in a user property dialog. Conceptually, there is no sense to do that
<mat_t> didrocks: explain
<pitti> didrocks +1
<didrocks> mat_t: the "About me" dialog is there to enable changing user related value (figure, name, password). autologin and gdm background are system-wide value, related to gdm, not binded to an user
<asac> bryce: tjaalton: any hint when xserver 1.7 will hit the archive?
<pitti> mat_t: which user gets autologged in gdm is not a property of the "martin" user (or anyone else's)
<pitti> it's a property of gdm
<mat_t> pitti: but it's a user's choice!
<mat_t> pitti: didrocks: it is a user-related value from that perspective
<pitti> mat_t: well, everything is an user's choice
<pitti> mat_t: if I install a new package, that's my user choice as well
<pitti> but it certainly shouldn't be done in "about me"
<pitti> "about me" is my name, my ICQ number, password, and whatnot
<pitti> but I wouldn't like it to be cluttered with system preferences
<mat_t> yes, I agree
<mat_t> where else then?
<pitti> as I said, bring back the old gdmsetup, and/or allow configuring autologin directly in gdm
<pitti> system -> admin -> login manager wasn't a bad place IMHO
<pitti> do you think it was?
<mat_t> pitti: I'd rather go for directly in gdm
<mat_t> I think it was hard to discover and too complex
<pitti> mat_t: *nod*
<didrocks> I think that pitti's proposal is the most reasonable
<mat_t> I agree
<mat_t> Just wanted to test if there's anything better
<mat_t> :)(
<mat_t> OK, so what about the sudo-war
<mat_t> how can we solve that?
<pitti> we don't?
<pitti> if it's not in about me, but in gdm itself, there's no conflict
<didrocks> mat_t: if it's a separate dialog only runned as a sudoer, the existing drill, seing another account is already using autologin is enough
<didrocks> seeing*
<pitti> Log in this user autoamtically: [martin]
<pitti> with the combobox offering all users, plus "nobody"
<mat_t> hmmm, that sounds super-complex
<pitti> how so?
<mat_t> I thought about avoiding separate meny whatsoever
<pitti> gdm already knows which users exist
<mat_t> hold on
 * mat_t checks his wireframes
<didrocks> (bbl, away for half an hour)
<mat_t> ok, so when you select your user in gdm and have a password field ready, there would be a checkbox below with "Log in automatically"
<pitti> but that wouldn't work
<pitti> you could never have a non-sudoer autologin then
<pitti> and it would give the "autologin war" confusion
<mat_t> hmmm
<pitti> it's the very same problem as with "about me"
<pitti> the autologin user simply isn't attached to any particular user, it's attached to gdm
<mat_t> technically yes
<mat_t> but it is a preference of a particular user
<mat_t> "I want to autologin"
<mat_t> Am I missing something?
<pitti> no, it's not
<pitti> it's a system-level setting, to be done by an admin
<pitti> a non-admin can't ever configure autologin
<mat_t> right
<pitti> well, if you find a sensible workflow with just a checkbox, sure, but I don't see how this would work
<pitti> we could bring up a Polkit dialog if a non-admin tries to autologin
<pitti> and don't show the checkbox if you already set autologin for another user
<pitti> but that makes it utterly nondiscoverable how to change it then
<mat_t> ok, so my concept was: when you select your user, gdm knows if it's an admin, right?
<pitti> yes
<pitti> (brb)
<mat_t> ok
<mat_t> mat_t > lunch
<pitti> mat_t: enjoy! (good idea!)
 * mat_t will do some more thinking and come back to the problem :)
<mat_t> thx!
<mat_t> thx!
<pitti> seb128_: ok, I give up; I'll upload the current git snapshot with two fixes for keyboard layout and Xsession.d, and file an upstream bug for now
<seb128_> pitti, ok thanks
<rodrigo_> seb128_: where can I get a LICENSE file for a LGPL lib? (to include in a package to be subvmitted to REVU)
<Laney> is there a bug for alt-fX shortcuts not working?
<seb128_> rodrigo_, any COPYING in a GPL tarball?
<seb128_> rodrigo_, or /usr/share/common-licenses/GPL
<rodrigo_> ah, I've been asked to submit with COPYING and LICENSE -> http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/couchdb-glib
<seb128_> I read too quickly, replace GPL by LGPL there
<seb128_> rodrigo_, "or"
<rodrigo_> ah
 * rodrigo_ misread it :)
<seb128_> rodrigo_, ie you need to license text in the tarball
<seb128_> rodrigo_, you can name it COPYING, LGPL, LICENSE, whatever you want
<rodrigo_> ok
<chrisccoulson> pitti - did you figure out your GDM crash?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - if you haven't figured it out already, it looks like a xklavier bug. The way that the "fearures" flag type is registered in the new version has changed
<chrisccoulson> it's registered with g_enum_register_static in the new version and i think that should be g_flags_register_static
<seb128_> it crashes due to a gdm_layout_activate (NULL);
<chrisccoulson> ah
<seb128_> well that didn't change
<seb128_> that's just what triggers the crash
<seb128_> chrisccoulson, where is the register thing?
<chrisccoulson> "GLib-GObject-CRITICAL: g_param_spec_flags: assertion `G_TYPE_IS_FLAGS (flags_type)' failed " is because of the problem i just mentioned
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - it's in the xklavier source "libxklavier/xkl-enum-types.c"
<chrisccoulson> the type is registered incorrectly in the new version
<seb128_> chrisccoulson, it's weird that the gdm snapshot built using the same libxklavier doesn't break though
<chrisccoulson> yeah, that is a bit wiered
<chrisccoulson> right, i've got to go for lunch
<seb128_> chrisccoulson, thanks for the pointer looking at that now
<seb128_> chrisccoulson, indeed http://webcvs.freedesktop.org/xklavier/libxklavier/libxklavier/xkl_engine.h?r1=1.8&r2=1.9 fixes it
<seb128_> pitti, ^
<seb128_> chrisccoulson, want to backport the patch after lunch since you tracked the issue? I will do it otherwise
<seb128_> pitti, I can verify that the change fixes gdm greeter crashing
<seb128_> https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=21578 is the corresponding bug
<ubottu> Freedesktop bug 21578 in General "Use glib-mkenums to generate enum descriptions" [Normal,Resolved: fixed]
<mat_t> pitti: hey
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i don't mind doing that, but it would have to wait until i finished work. i will do it then if you havent already done it
<seb128> chrisccoulson, when do you finish work? ;-)
<chrisccoulson> 1630 usually;)
<seb128> ok, I think I will backport the change and credit you in the changelog then
<seb128> I'm sure you will find other tasks for after work ;-)
<chrisccoulson> thanks:)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, thank you for the good catch, how did you notice the issue was coming from there btw?
<chrisccoulson> i was just looking at the trace that pitti got earlier (http://people.canonical.com/~pitti//tmp/gdm-greeter.log)
<chrisccoulson> and saw it was crashing in g_param_spec_flags somewhere
<seb128> I'm still a bit puzzle about why the previous version doesn't crash when built on the same libxklavier
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i don't understand that either
<chrisccoulson> does the previous version call xkl_engine_get_instance anywhere?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, yes, they do the same libxklavier use apparently
<seb128> chrisccoulson, don't bother, actually fixing the bug will do ;-)
<Ampelbein> seb128: hey... I know it's not a high priority, but did you have a chance to look at gnome-nettool? I linked my branch to bug 400016 but as I said I did not get the launchpad integration to work, no menu items are loaded. I did a strace and the launchpad-integration library gets loaded, so it's not a problem with the build-process, I think.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 400016 in gnome-nettool "Please sponsor version 2.27.4 in karmic" [Wishlist,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/400016
<seb128> Ampelbein, no, but I will do that today
<Ampelbein> ok, thanks
<pitti> chrisccoulson: no, I didn't (was off for lunch)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: my next plan was to git pull, build a tarball from that, and build it, to ensure it's not something in upstream's orig.tar.gz
<pitti> oh, you guys figured it out? thanks!
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, i think so:)
 * pitti hugs chrisccoulson and seb128
 * seb128 hugs pitti
<pitti> see, it does make sense to go to dinner :-)
<pitti> I'll close my filed upstream bug then
 * chrisccoulson hugs seb128 and pitti
<seb128> pitti, already done for the upstream bug
<seb128> pitti, you can go for ice cream or something now and maybe your next bug will be fixed when you come back ;-)
<pitti> seb128: ah, nice
<pitti> heh
<pitti> actually, I planned to work on my specs this morning, and then wasted 4.5 hours on gdm :/
<pitti> well, "spent", half of it was for the other bugs
<chrisccoulson> pitti loves GDM really ;)
<pitti> do we track the libxklavier bug somewhere? or should we just upload it?
<seb128> pitti, I will upload in a bit
<seb128> pitti, I do the libxklavier fix and gdm update and you fix the gvfs missing file while I'm on that? ;-)
<pitti> seb128: deal!
<seb128> good ;-)
<pitti> seb128: so you just need to revert r55 then
<seb128> pitti, right, I will do that and add a Conflicts on libxklavier versioned
<didrocks> if callable(item):
<didrocks> ooooopsss
<seb128> pitti, the conflict can be dropped in next upload, it's to avoid race upgrades
<pitti> yep, makes sense
<mat_t> pitti: the language selector in the gdm doesn't seem essential... what's the current rationale for including it?
<pitti> well, selecting your language?
<pitti> but you can do that in the desktop, too
<pitti> I agree that it's sort of dispensable
<seb128> mat_t, different users might use different languages
<pitti> session could be hidden in a menu
<pitti> well, actually all of keyboard/language/session could be hidden in a menu
<mat_t> seb128: would they not have defined them in their desktop session?
<pitti> these aren't common options, but they have to be available
<mat_t> pitti: exactly my thoughts
<seb128> mat_t, where? and that means they would have to log at least once in english to find their way to the option
<pitti> I liked the menu in the old gdm actually, but I don't have a strong opinion about it
<mat_t> seb128: would they not have their account created with a particular language pre-set?
<seb128> pitti, it could, but would that be much better? there is plenty of space on the bottom bar
<pitti> could get a little tight on 800 pixels, but I guess we don't care much about that
<pitti> it's fine here on 1024
<seb128> mat_t, well, they could if somebody was writting the code for that
<mat_t> ah
<mat_t> :)
<seb128> mat_t, an university machine for example would have accounts for all student but the sysadmin would probably not spend days settings locales for each accounts, etc
<mat_t> right
<mat_t> it's a rare, but valid use case
<seb128> what is the issue with that selector?
<mat_t> I think it's rare enough for the language option to be hidden in the Options menu
<seb128> it doesn't look good?
<seb128> there is no options menu
<mat_t> seb128: it's quite ugly and it's going to be used extremely rarely
<pitti> likewise for the session selector, though
<mat_t> There could be - if we go for pittis concept of autologin prefs in gdm
<pitti> usually you seelect your session exactly once, or perhaps temporarily use the xterm one
<seb128> we should settle on what we envision for that and discuss it with upstream then
<mat_t> seb128: I agree
<mat_t> seb128: I'm drawing up some wireframes atm
<seb128> ok
<mat_t> seb128: do we have a wiki page for login experience?
<seb128> do you try to get ride of the whole bar or just from the combos boxes?
<seb128> mat_t, not that I know
<mat_t> seb128: the bar could go, we would only have buttons: {[Accessibility (icon only)] [Login options]                                             [Power (icon only)]}
<mat_t> seb128: that would keep it nice and clean
<pitti> seb128: hm, installing the metadata daemon and .service doesn't make a differnce, and the daemon doesn't even get started, hmm
<seb128> mat_t, well the bar is a countain for the notification area icons too
<seb128> pitti, did you restart your session and gvfs then nautilus?
<pitti> seb128: I checked with list-missing now
<pitti> seb128: yes
<seb128> weird
<seb128> can you run it by hand?
<mat_t> seb128: what icons exactly?
<pitti> well, I restarted gvfs and nautilus
<seb128> does it crash
 * pitti tries restarting session
<seb128> ?
<pitti> oh
<seb128> pitti, it could be autospawned when required
<pitti> hah
<seb128> pitti, try moving icons on the desktop or something
<pitti> $ /usr/lib/gvfs/gvfsd-metadata
<pitti> process 18608: arguments to dbus_bus_request_name() were incorrect, assertion "(error) == NULL || !dbus_error_is_set ((error))" failed in file dbus-bus.c line 1114.
<pitti> seb128: good intuition!
 * pitti pokes, thanks
<seb128> hehe
<seb128> mat_t, the battery one for example
<SteveA> I know suspend / hibernate is fragile generally... it was working find on this laptop running jauty.  Now, with karmic, suspend and hibernate don't work.  The screen goes dark for a while when I ask it to suspend then a minute or so later I get the "enter password to close the screensaver" screen.
<SteveA> should I file a bug?  against what package?
<mat_t> seb128: I don't think there's a benefit from having a battery there
<seb128> mat_t, well, even those icons you mention, you can't get icons in the middle of nowhere
<crevette> does anyone experience this problem http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=588895 ?
<mat_t> seb128: yeah, that's more of a styling issue
<seb128> SteveA, not sure, that doesn't seem really desktopish, try #ubuntu-devel maybe
<ubottu> Gnome bug 588895 in GIO "nautilus crashes every time I access a gvfs location" [Major,Unconfirmed]
<seb128> crevette, libnautilus-ubuntuone.so
<seb128> crevette, I closed the bug
<mat_t> seb128: right now it's more important to decide what options we'll include
<seb128> crevette, wait for an update ubuntuone-client-gnome
<seb128> or uninstall it
<seb128> mat_t, right
<crevette> ah okay thanks
<mat_t> seb128: I found this: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Spec/GDMConfigureTool
<mat_t> seb128: looks like Robert Ancell is working on it
<seb128> mat_t, right, that's the one for the configuration tool
<seb128> mat_t, that's not for the login screen look though, just for how we will configure options and which ones rather
<pitti> seb128: hah, missing dbus_error_init, easy
<mat_t> seb128: right
<mat_t> seb128: so there is no blueprint or spec for it yet
<seb128> pitti, ok
<mat_t> :]
<mpt> mvo_, ok for a call now?
<crevette> seb128, whould it be possible to define the GTK also in the GDM configure tool?, should I modify the spec, or see that with robert ?
<mat_t> seb128: pitti: is it a good idea to create a blueprint for the login experience on LP? And then link a spec to it?
<pitti> sure, a wiki spec is always nice to get an agreement on, point upstraem to, etc.
<seb128> mat_t, having a wiki page would be nice, not sure if that require a blueprint too
<mvo_> mpt: yes
<seb128> crevette, you can add a suggestion at the bottom of the spec
<crevette> okay
<mat_t> seb128: OK, should I create one under the Desktop team or DX team?
<seb128> mat_t, as you prefer, I would say desktop team since I doubt dxteam will work on that soon but I've no strong opinion
<mat_t> ok
<mat_t> thx
<mat_t> seb128: pitti: it'll be here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Specs/Karmic/LoginExperience
<seb128> mat_t, thanks
<mat_t> np
<geser> pitti: where does the new gdm fetch the keyboard layout from? I got now a german layout ("Germany") but with dead keys (instead of the configured nodead keys variant)
<pitti> geser: from hal
<pitti> geser: which again gets it from /etc/default/console-setup
<geser> pitti: the XKB* values?
<pitti> yes
<geser> I've there XKBVARIANT="nodeadkeys" but I still got dead keys at login
<mpt> mvo_, how can I get the app-install-data counts myself? e.g. find out how many items there are in total, or how many are in the "Games" category
<pitti> geser: right, the hal patch just gets layout, not variant :/
<geser> I've also XKBOPTIONS="compose:menu" set but did check yet if it's used or not
<mvo_> mpt: the total is easy, just count the desktop files in /usr/share/app-install/desktop/ - for the categories its a bit more tricky
<mclasen> gdm doesn't do anything for complicated configurations with variants and options
<geser> I'd be happy if my gnome desktop used the variants and options I configured
<geser> I don't care if they are used during gdm login (I've autologin enabled anyway)
<pitti> it always sets GDM_KEYBOARD_LAYOUT again, so gdm would have to know about the variants
<pitti> or stop setting GDM_KEYBOARD_LAYOUT if the user didn't change it (probably safer)
<mpt> mvo_, "cat /usr/share/app-install/desktop/* | grep Categories | grep Game | wc -l" returns 436. That seem right?
<mvo_> mpt: yes
<mpt> thanks
<mvo_> mpt: in theory it may be more compicated (the applications.menu file in the desktop directory can have includes/excludes for certain categories). but in practise I think this is good enough
<pitti> geser: followed up on upstream bug report
<seb128> tedg, hey
<seb128> tedg, how is the fusa update going?
<tedg> seb128: Generally okay, adding features.  I hope to have it mostly working this week.
<seb128> good
<tedg> seb128: I finally upgraded to Karmic even ;)
<pitti> didrocks: hmm
<pitti> Searching packages which provide required Python modules:
<pitti> launchpadlib.launchpad ... python-launchpadlib
<pitti> didrocks: this works for me
<didrocks> pitti: hum? strange. I had to add it manually saturday. I will check again tonight.
<SteveA> darn... all the icons on my gnome desktop have been rearranged into neat columns
<SteveA> on upgrading
<seb128> SteveA, welcome to unstable distribution versions, should be fixed when you install the gvfs update pitti just uploaded
<SteveA> seb128: cool :-)
<hyperair> can someone run /usr/lib/notify-osd/notify-osd in a terminal and see if it complains about not being able to detect a panel?
<seb128> hyperair, it complains about another instance running
<hyperair> seb128: kill it first.
<hyperair> killall notify-osd
<hyperair> then run it in a terminal
<hyperair> and run notify-send bla
<seb128> well notify-osd works fine there
<SteveA> my bluetooth keyboard now works on booting, and on turning it on and off, without my needing to reassociate it. FTW.
<seb128> didn't you say that was multiscreen specific the other day?
 * SteveA wonders which bug that is...
<hyperair> seb128: yes it's multiscreen specific, but on both single and multi screens, it doesn't detect thep anel.
<hyperair> ** (notify-osd:6860): DEBUG: no panel detetected; using workarea fallback
<hyperair> something like this
<seb128> works there
<hyperair> hmm how strange.
<hyperair> compiz?
<seb128> yes
<hyperair> hmmm how strange.
<hyperair> poking notify-osd using gdb led me to nail it down to this:
<hyperair> 2107     if (gdk_window_get_type_hint (win)
<hyperair> 2108         != GDK_WINDOW_TYPE_HINT_DOCK)
<hyperair> for some reason, gdk_window_get_type_hint (win) returns GDK_WINDOW_TYPE_HINT_NORMAL
<hyperair> and win is definitely the panel.
<crevette> SteveA, there is a lot of bugs complaining about not being able to connect its keyboard after reboot, pick the one you wish :)
<hyperair> seb128: what's your gnome-panel version?
<seb128> hyperair, in fact it does display the warning when sending a bubble, just not when running notify-osd
<seb128> hyperair, but bubbles are correctly displayed
<hyperair> ah so it does display the warning then?
<seb128> just when displaying a bubble, not when stating
<seb128> starting
<hyperair> yes yes
<hyperair> that's why i wanted you to send a bubble
<hyperair> using notify-send
<seb128> well I did read the can somebody rung and see if it complains
<hyperair> ?
<seb128> didn't read the details since I know how to stop and start it ;-)
<hyperair> huh?
<seb128> well your first question didn't mention "when getting a bubble displayed"
<hyperair> oh. right X_x
<seb128> "see if it complains about not being able to detect a panel?"
<seb128> it doesn't ;-)
<SteveA> crevette: there was one I either filed, or commented on a lot.  I'll find it...
<hyperair> right right
<hyperair> anyway
<seb128> but right it does once I get a notification
<hyperair> the next line after that says: ** (notify-osd:6860): DEBUG: top corner at: 2295, 23
<hyperair> my panel is on the first monitor
<hyperair> and my setup is 1280x1024 + 1280x800
<seb128> so it displays on the second monotir?
<hyperair> for some reason, the bubble isn't displaying, not even in the second monitor
<seb128> weird
<hyperair> it should, but doesn't.
<hyperair> but the main thing is that it should be displaying on the first, where the panel is.
<seb128> talk to MacSlow he's the notify-osd upstream hacker
<hyperair> okay
<hyperair> i kind of think it's more a gnome-panel issue though
<seb128> yeah, seems the gnome-panel detection code is buggy
<seb128> well, or notify-osd making wrong assumptions
<hyperair> no what i meant to say is that.. is gnome-panel setting the type hint correctly?
<seb128> vuntz, ^
<hyperair> bbl (have to fetch my sister)
<seb128> hyperair, it's TYPE_DOCK according to xprop log
<pitti> didrocks: I updated https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DidierRoche/distutils-extra.auto ; all medium issues and 2/3 important issues fixed
<pitti> (or explained)
<pitti> debuild -i commented as well
<didrocks> pitti: yes. I've just read them. I know about the .pyc not put in the bin .deb I just believed they were compiled in /usr/share/pyshared/quickly/. I will check for them in /usr/lib/python*/dist-packages/
<didrocks> pitti: thanks for your reactivity :)
<pitti> didrocks: you're welcome, I know that it blocks you guys
<pitti> didrocks: poking at updating debian/control now
<didrocks> pitti: I will try debuild -i again, but I still had the issue yesterday.
 * didrocks hugs pitti
<pitti> oh, hang on
<pitti> didrocks: sorry, you need -I.bzr
<didrocks> yes, updating debian/control is the major blocker for quickly
<pitti> didrocks: -i is just for the diff.gz
<pitti> but you are building native packages, I assume
<didrocks> oh, ok. it handled differently for diff.gz and orig.tar.gz
<didrocks> that explains this :)
<pitti> didrocks: -I without arguemtns should ideally include .bzr nowadays
<pitti> didrocks: wiki page updated
<didrocks> pitti: I agree. But I can still use that as a workaround until it's fixed
<didrocks> pitti: thanks a lot :)
<pitti> meh, I want devhelp back
<pitti> I got addicted to it
<pitti> seb128: btw, is the breakage of that because we now use webkit, or because we don't? (and it's a xul breakage)?
<didrocks> this is good drug :)
<seb128> pitti, dunno I've not looking to that yet, I didn't notice it was broken in fact
<pitti> ok, nevermind
<seb128> looking -> looked
 * pitti is just whining
<pitti> Depends: libwebkit-1.0-2
<pitti> seems so
 * pitti retries build, hopes that it won't ftbfs again and magically fix everything
<vuntz> seb128: what is wrong with the panel? :-)
<seb128> vuntz,
<seb128>  for some reason, gdk_window_get_type_hint (win) returns GDK_WINDOW_TYPE_HINT_NORMAL
<seb128>  and win is definitely the panel.
<seb128> vuntz, hyperair wrote that before
<seb128> but here xprop shows it's a dock so dunno
<vuntz> seb128: pretty sure this is working fine, but I could be wrong, of course
<hyperair> is there some utility which can detect what type the said window is?
<hyperair> like some xwininfo invocation?
<seb128> hyperair, xprop
<hyperair> ah xprop
<hyperair> _NET_WM_WINDOW_TYPE(ATOM) = _NET_WM_WINDOW_TYPE_DOCK
<hyperair> hmmmm
<hyperair> how strange. =\
<seb128> hyperair, no, it's normal
<seb128> what else would you expect?
<mclasen> jcastro: hey, I just stole http://patches.ubuntu.com/libg/libgweather/extracted/01_gettext_not_xml.patch - one for your list of  'forgot to upstream' patches...
<hyperair> seb128: a value that's off.
<hyperair> i can be hopeful, right? =p
<seb128> mclasen, no, vuntz said he was not interested to get this one
<mclasen> well, I am
<seb128> mclasen, he said that's no win over the current split and that he would not take the patch upstream for GNOME
<seb128> mclasen, well you can't say it has not been upstream, maintainer refused the change rather
<pitti> didrocks: ... and fixed :)
<didrocks> pitti: thank you so much :) I will give a try to all of those fixes tonight (do you want to bump the revision number?)
<hyperair> seb128: is there any reason why gdk_window_get_type_hint returns GDK_WINDOW_TYPE_HINT_NORMAL rather than GDK_WINDOW_TYPE_HINT_DOCK for that window?
<mclasen> seb128: vuntz said to me "patch was never sent upstream iirc"
<pitti> didrocks: uploaded 2.7 to sid/karmic, and 2.7~jaunty to PPA
<pitti> didrocks: and wiki page updated; so could you try 2.7, and delete the stuff that's fixed now after confirming?
<didrocks> pitti: perfect... and yes, I will do that :)
<pitti> yay
<seb128> mclasen, no, I asked vuntz on IRC if he would be interested by the change and he said that he was not, that he preferred to split the .xml by locale and that it was not worth sending the patch to bugzilla since he didn't intend to do a such change
<seb128> vuntz, ^
<seb128> bratsche, hey, gtk 2.17. =5 directfb still doesn't build, lack _gdk_window_impl_new, could you have a look?
<jcastro> seb128, we should make sure vuntz answers on mailing lists instead of on irc so we can document his forgetfullness.
<jcastro> vuntz, just kidding.
<seb128> jcastro, ;-)
<mat_t> pitti: do you know what happens when there's many user accounts on one machine? How long can the list get?
<mat_t> pitti: does it scroll?
<vuntz> mclasen: I think the point was "opening a small xml file + a mo file" vs "opening a small & compressed xml file" (trying to remember when this was discussed)
<bratsche> seb128: Yeah, I missed that in my last commit for lack of time and then didn't get a chance to do it this weekend.  I'll take a look at it.
<seb128> bratsche, thanks
<mclasen> vuntz: the mo file is a win as soon as you have two users of the data
<mclasen> even if you discount the space savings due to reduce xml clutter
<vuntz> mclasen: how is it a win?
<mclasen> because it gets mmapped and shared
<mclasen> rather than parsed and stored in private memory for each users
<vuntz> mclasen: but both users still have to open the xml file. So it's still more
<vuntz> mclasen: (C xml file)
<vuntz> mclasen: you have parse + gettext vs parse
<mclasen> the untranslated xml ought to be noticeably smaller than the translated one; I wonder why it isn't
<vuntz> mclasen: why would it be smaller?
<mclasen> because the translations take up space
<vuntz> mclasen: but they replace the C strings
<mclasen> no
<vuntz> mclasen: sure about that?
<mclasen> well, it replaces the <name> element, but you gain an id attribute with the C string, no ?
<mclasen> plus you have a bazillion xml:lang="foo"
<vuntz> mclasen: no
<vuntz> mclasen: I for sure can't find "Venice" in the fr xml file. It's Venise there
<mclasen> yeah, I was wrong about the id
<mclasen> vuntz: I guess it comes down to: you are happy with the split xml solution because you have langpacks...I don't
<mat_t> pitti: ping
<hyperair> eureka! it works! (using wnck to get the window type instead of gdk)
<seb128> hyperair, I doubt they will make notify-osd depends on wnck though
<hyperair> seb128: it already does.
<hyperair> seb128: all i did was add one include (libwnck/window.h)
<hyperair> there were other libwnck includes already
<hyperair> in the same file
<seb128> oh ok
<seb128> weird
<seb128> and do you know why the gdk call doesn't work?
<hyperair> i have no idea.
<seb128> could be a gtk bug then
<hyperair> i'm thinking either a bug in gdk, or that gdk_window_get_whatever_it_was_i_was_using doesn't fully document what it's not supposed to do.
<hyperair> are all gdk_window_whatever functions supposed to work with windows that don't belong to the app?
<pitti> mat_t: it just shows the most popular users (in terms of how often they logged in)
<seb128> hyperair, works when ldpreloading gdk 2.16
<pitti> mat_t: I didn't try how long the list can get, I hope that it stops at 5 or so
<seb128> hyperair, not sure, especially in the client side gdk world
<hyperair> seb128: wait, you mean it detects your screen when you ldpreload gdk 2.16?
<hyperair> i mean panel
<pitti> mat_t: BTW, I'm happy if you want that ripped out, and replaced by two input lines (user/pwd)
<seb128> hyperair, yes
<hyperair> i see.
<hyperair> hmm
<seb128> hyperair, I got the jaunty deb, dpkg-deb -x it and LD_PRELOAD
<hyperair> how strange, eh.
<hyperair> oh
<hyperair> jaunty deb eh.
<seb128> well, 2.16
<hyperair> that means it's a regression in gtk
<seb128> karmic is 2.17
<hyperair> yes yes
<seb128> or a wrong assumption of what you can do from notify-osd which used to work by luck
<hyperair> hmm
<mat_t> pitti: I've just added 10 users and the list just scrolls endlessly
<mat_t> pitti: I think we should keep the user picker, but replace it with user/pwd if there's more than 6 users
<mat_t> pitti: also, user/pwd should be default if there's a network
<mat_t> setup
<seb128> mat_t, why not displaying the n most frequent users and the other entry?
<mat_t> seb128: I don't like the list being dynamic depending on whether someone logged in more often
<mat_t> seb128: imagine that situation in the family, when mum suddenly can't log in
<mat_t> and she's baffled
<mat_t> :)
<seb128> mat_t, it means that if you have 15 accounts and only 3 people using the machine you prefer to not list those just because the system has unused accounts?
<mat_t> yes, I think that's better than unpredictable behaviour
<seb128> well, sorting by commonly used is not unpredictable
<mat_t> "Where's my user gone?!" "I don't know mum..."
<mat_t> it is
<seb128> well, make an account for somebody and next login your user list has vanished for no obvious reason
<seb128> want to bet we will get bugs about that too? ;-)
<mat_t> :)
<mat_t> it's a tricky one
<mat_t> but in 99% of the cases when there is +6 users on one computer it is not a normal "family" setup
<mat_t> seb128: but you are right, it is a potentially disruptive situation
<hyperair> seb128: poking libgtk with gdb revealed that the said function earlier stops at this point:
<hyperair> 2028   if (GDK_WINDOW_DESTROYED (window) ||
<hyperair> 2029       !WINDOW_IS_TOPLEVEL (window))
<hyperair> 2030     return GDK_WINDOW_TYPE_HINT_NORMAL;
<hyperair> seb128: i know why the notifications don't appear for me now!
<hyperair> seb128: the coordinates specified earlier aren't displayed due to my secondary monitor being shorter, and their bases aligned
<mat_t> pitti: seb128: Ok, I've changed my mind. I've just imagined a class with 20 kids somewhere in Africa, where every child has his own avatar... having a usr/pwd just because it's more than 6 of them seems inhumane
<mat_t> :)
<seb128> lol
<mat_t> So I think the list can adapt to display most often logged users, but should always display all users
<seb128> mat_t, ok, having a scrollbar then?
<mat_t> yeah
<tedg> seb128: Are we supporting people using the old GDM?
<tedg> (on Karmic)
<seb128> tedg, no, there is no old gdm, they are not different packages
<seb128> t's a new version of the same gdm software
<seb128> it's
<tedg> seb128: Okay.  Cool.
 * seb128 does a break bbl
<mat_t> seb128: could we populate random avatars for newly created users from the usr/share/pixmaps/faces ?
<mpt> A computer screen could easily show 20 icons, it's just the 1-D scrolling layout that doesn't
<mat_t> mpt: true
<pitti> mat_t: ok; personally I'd value an easier method to access "other", without having to use the mouse
<mat_t> pitti: you can filter with keyboard, can't you?
<pitti> hm, I don't know
<mat_t> you can :)
 * mat_t just tried that
<mat_t> pitti: could we populate random avatars for newly created users from the usr/share/pixmaps/faces ?
<pitti> mat_t: I guess we can
<mat_t> cool, that would bring this thing to life
<pitti> hm, apparently I lost gnoem-keyring ssh agent with one of the recent updates
<pitti> dobey: could you please add Vcs-Bzr: https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntuone-control-tower/ubuntu/karmic/ubuntuone-storage-protocol/karmic to debian/control? (likewise for ubuntuone-client)? It needs to go into the first record (for the source package)
<pitti> dobey: this will point out that the package is managed in bzr, and enable tools like debcheckout to work
<Ampelbein> pitti: regarding gnome-keyring, does echo $SSH_AUTH_SOCK give an empty reply?
<pitti> no
<Ampelbein> pitti: and it points to /tmp/keyring-bla/socket.ssh
<Ampelbein> ?
<pitti> srwxr-xr-x 1 martin martin 0 2009-07-20 15:33 /tmp/keyring-tYQTmS/socket.ssh
<pitti> it exists, but the variable doesn't exist
<pitti> hah, indeed SSH_AUTH_SOCK=/tmp/keyring-tYQTmS/socket.ssh ssh .. works
<Ampelbein> pitti: I don't know where that get's sourced. for the seahorse-agent (gpg stuff) it's in /etc/X11/Xsession.d
<pitti> right, and that works again with latest gdm
<mac__v> pitti: silly ques , when can we expect FUSA back ?
<pitti> tedg said he's working on it, in a week or so
<mac__v> \o/
<mpt> mat_t, ^^
<mac__v> mpt: why do you insist in keeping the name rather than the icon for FUSA? just trying to get your perspective
<mpt> mac__v, do you mean for the menu title?
<mpt> or for each item?
<mpt> mac__v, either way, I'm not "insisting" on anything, I haven't had time to do any design work on Fusa
<mac__v> bug 400383
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 400383 in hundredpapercuts "Panel separator between clock and FUSA is not meaningful" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/400383
<mac__v> mpt^
<mpt> mac__v, that's about the gap before the title, it's not about whether the title should include an icon.
<mac__v> mpt: oh ... ok, seperator surely looks odd , but removing the separator makes the date flow into the name, seemed awkward , either a smaller separator or if the separator was to be removed we could use just the icon instead
<mac__v> btw the david's screenshot is *not* FUSA
<mpt> mac__v, then maybe the gap's too narrow.
<mat_t> mac__v, try spreading the two menus on your panel a bit and remove the separator - works just fine
<djsiegel> rickspencer3_: http://davidsiegel.org/100papercuts-round-3-progress-report/ (fyi)
<mac__v> mpt: yeah, you are right, just have a look in the end, when FUSA is done. it doesnt seem nice without the separator and no space atm
<mac__v> mat_t: you are right about adding the space
<mac__v> mpt: djsiegel: bug 400047 , another simple one for papercuts
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 400047 in hundredpapercuts "Partitioner should be more clear/specific" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/400047
 * djsiegel looks
<djsiegel> mac__v: ah, not really a paper cut
<mac__v> djsiegel: when the install icon in Live CD is discussed , why not this?
<mac__v> label  that is
<djsiegel> it's more trivial
<djsiegel> the install icon is so much simpler to improve
<djsiegel> also, it appears in your normal boot environment
<mac__v> djsiegel: this is also just rewording
<djsiegel> when you upgrade
<djsiegel> mac__v: is there a mockup?
<mac__v> ok
<djsiegel> ask the OP to do one
<djsiegel> "partitioner is unclear" make the bug seem non-trivial :)
<mac__v> djsiegel: not sure what mockup , could you just add the comment
<mac__v> the first option is just poorly worded
<mat_t> bratsche: hi
<bratsche> Hi mat_t
<mat_t> bratsche: any news from the world of morphing? Just thought the new gdm would find a perfect use for it...
<bratsche> mat_t: I actually am finally starting on this.  But I'm limiting the scope of it to the message dialogs that are in the notify wiki page that mpt made, and once this is done I figured we could make it more generic.
<mat_t> cool
<bratsche> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NotificationDesignGuidelines#Morphing%20alert%20box
<bratsche> I'm starting with just what's on this page.
<mat_t> but the generic stuff is post-Karmic, right?
<bratsche> mat_t: Probably, but maybe doable sooner.
<mac__v> djsiegel: http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_W1ueYt1O3xs/SdX6SkcEabI/AAAAAAAAQNc/RD4b7Ivsbqo/s400/dual+boot+windows+7+and+ubuntu-4+764x670.jpg the shot of the installer
<mat_t> bratsche: what do you think about the user list in the new gdm?
<bratsche> mat_t: Do you know kind of what you want to do with it in gdm?
<bratsche> mat_t: Do you have a link for it?
<mat_t> bratsche: yeah, morph from user list to usr/pwd
<mat_t> bratsche: it's just a simple scrollable list
<bratsche> mat_t: So that's kind of like the stuff in the videos you and Mark were showing in UDS right?
<mat_t> much like https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NotificationDesignGuidelines?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=morphing-window.png
<bratsche> Oh right.
<djsiegel> bratsche: mpt and I discussed a pretty sweet paper cut you might be interested in: don't show accelerator underlines unless Alt is pressed
<mat_t> bratsche: not sure which videos you're referring to
<bratsche> mat_t: I'm not sure about this one yet.. the treeview stuff might be tricky, and I need to think about how it should work.
<bratsche> djsiegel: Hmm.. that sounds kind of nice.
<mat_t> bratsche: treeview?
<bratsche> mat_t: Yeah, in this screenshot you linked.. it's Firefox, but the gtk equivalent is GtkTreeView.
<dobey> pitti: sure. will do
<pitti> dobey: thanks
<pitti> dobey: both uploaded, btw
<bratsche> mat_t: I think I should get the new message dialog stuff done fairly quickly, and I'll try to figure out how to do this one next.
<dobey> pitti: great, thanks
<seb128> does the new ubuntuone-client fixes the zillion nautilus crashes?
<seb128> (if that's the case you could have mentioned it in the changelog)
<bratsche> djsiegel: I think that would be a fun one to hack on.  But I think we'll need you guys to come up with a good explanation of why it's a good idea in order to convince gtk+ maintainers.
<seb128> dobey, pitti: ^
<djsiegel> bratsche: ok
<pitti> seb128: I played around with it a little, no immediate crashes
<dobey> seb128: yes
<bratsche> djsiegel: But I think I could hack on that and talk to mclasen about getting it in sometime.
<djsiegel> bratsche: awesome
<djsiegel> bratsche: any news with the dim-on-cut work?
<djsiegel> (sorry to inundate you)
<bratsche> djsiegel: I have most of the patch updated against Nautilus master sitting on my laptop.. I need to finish that up and test it.
<mac__v> mpt: now i'm not sure if the wording really needs a change ! anyway screenshot> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/29292485/Ubiquity.png
<mac__v> changed^
<bratsche> djsiegel: I'll try to get it in a better state tonight.  If you guys are serious about the gtk+ thing, I think that should be higher priority because that's something we probably can't ship a patch against.  So we would need to get it into gtk master sooner rather than later, otherwise put it off until Karmic+1
<pitti> Taekwondo time, cu tomorrow!
<djsiegel> bratsche: ok, I will write an argument today, file a launchpad bug, and ping you
<bratsche> djsiegel: The dim-cut-files thing could probably be shipped as a patch if we can't get it into Nautilus on time.
<bratsche> djsiegel: Cool, sounds good.
<djsiegel> but now I have to file round-4 papercuts upstream and get the wheel turning...
<mat_t> seb128: pitti: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Specs/Karmic/LoginExperience#Standard%20login%20screen%20with%20user%20picker
<seb128> mat_t, looks good, thanks for working on that!
<mat_t> seb128: np!
<mat_t> seb128: we'll discuss tomorrow
<mat_t> seb128: have a good evening
<seb128> mat_t, thanks, you too
<mat_t> rickspencer3_: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Specs/Karmic/LoginExperience fyi, kicked this off today
<rickspencer3_> mat_t: great!
<rickspencer3_> thanks so much
<mat_t> np, pleasure!
 * mat_t > home
<seb128> lool, any clue about bug #401787?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 401787 in totem "Totem erroneously launches 'gstreamer-install-codec' which then crashes." [Low,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/401787
<seb128> lool, not sure what gstreamer-install-codec is but the user says it comes with unr
<crevette> does someone experienced http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=588933?
<ubottu> Gnome bug 588933 in General ""Modify image" doesn't display picture but artifacts" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<lool> seb128: update-alternatives --display gstreamer-codec-install
<seb128> lool, thanks ;-)
<lool> np
<seb128> crevette, another duplicate of yours yes
<crevette> ah didn't find in lp
<crevette> ah I didn't look in gtk+
<seb128> crevette, look to the recently open gtk+ on bugzilla.gnome.org
<seb128> crevette, it's a csw issue, I've opened it there
<crevette> yeah, I'm looking to dup it
<crevette> thx a lot
<seb128> bratsche, there?
<bratsche> seb128: Hey, yeah.
<seb128> bratsche, hello
<seb128> bratsche, gtk question for you
 * bratsche hides :)
<seb128> we have a gtk application using gtkbuilder which does that
<seb128> 	builder = gtk_builder_new ();
<seb128> 	ui = GTK_UI_MANAGER (gtk_builder_get_object (builder, "uimanager1"));
<seb128> 	launchpad_integration_add_ui (ui, "/ui/menubar1/help1/LaunchpadItems");
<seb128> 	g_object_unref (G_OBJECT (builder));
<seb128> 	gtk_main ();
<seb128> basically
<seb128> is the g_object_unref correct there?
<seb128> bratsche, the launchpad function is basically a wrapper around gtk_ui_manager_add_ui()
<bratsche> seb128: I'm not sure.. but seems like it's probably fine.
<seb128> bratsche, the menu items are not displayed but they are displayed if the g_object_unref call is commented
<seb128> which sort of puzzle me now ;-)
<seb128> so I'm trying to figure what's going on
<bratsche> Oh, well then I guess I'm wrong. :)   I actually have not used gtkbuilder for anything yet personally, so I'd just go with what works.
<seb128> well I'm wondering what's going on
<bratsche> It does seem kind of unintuitive.
<seb128> gtk_builder_get_object() doesn't increment the ref count
 * bratsche takes a peek in the code
<seb128> but I would expect I can free the object after the gtk_ui_manager_add_ui() call
<seb128> bratsche, if you don't know don't bother, I figured you might have a clue, thanks anyway
<bratsche> seb128: Oh okay.. interesting.  So if you look at gtk_builder_get_object() it's doing: return g_hash_table_lookup (builder->priv->objects, name);
<bratsche> seb128: Try refing the UIManager after you get it, before you unref the builder.
<bratsche> Just a thought.
<bratsche> seb128: gtk_builder_get_object () docs say it doesn't ref the returned object.. and then the next thing you're doing is unrefing the builder, so that probably unrefs your UIManager.
<seb128> bratsche, that works, which is somewhat what I guessed but I don't understand why
<seb128> bratsche, right, <seb128> gtk_builder_get_object() doesn't increment the ref count
<bratsche> Yeah.. when you said that it hadn't yet occurred to me that when you're unreffing the builder that it's probably unrefing the UIManager.
<seb128> bratsche, but the uimanager is on screen as part of the gtkbuilder ui, should it be still refed somewhat?
<bratsche> Since the UIManager is contained in the builder.
<seb128> or those a different memory spaces?
<seb128> a -> are
<seb128> I mean the program is running, the UI is on screen as are the menus
<seb128> so the object are referenced somehow
<bratsche> What does launchpad_integration_add_ui() do?
<seb128> but not in this sourcefile
<seb128> bratsche, gtk_ui_manager_add_ui() basically
<seb128>     gtk_ui_manager_insert_action_group (ui, action_group, -1);
<seb128> 	gtk_ui_manager_add_ui (ui,
<seb128> ...
<seb128> I guess I will just refcount it and not try to understand
<seb128> I though that would add the items to the existing object
<seb128> and that we would not need to keep the reference in the source but that might not be the case
<bratsche> I'd have to dig into it further.. but my guess is that UIManager is being unref'd before the menus get merged in somehow.
<bratsche> seb128: Oh oh oh..
<seb128> bratsche, that would explain it, is there a way to force the uimanager update or something?
<bratsche> seb128: Probably because when you unref the builder, it unrefs the UIManager immediately.  But when you gtk_ui_manager_add_ui() some of the fu in there may not happen until the next GMainContext iteration.
<seb128> not that I care referencing the uimanager once, I'm rather curious there
<bratsche> seb128: s/Probably/Possibly anyway :)
<seb128> bratsche, that's it! thanks!
<seb128> bratsche, adding while (gtk_events_pending ()) gtk_main_iteration (); before the unref makes it work
<seb128> bratsche, any other better way to do that? ;-)
<bratsche> I've thought of this idea before that g_object_unref() should not immediately free the object if it hits 0, until the next context iteration.
<bratsche> seb128: Yeah, maybe putting it in an idle callback?
<seb128> what, the unref?
<seb128> I think I will just go with the "g_object_ref (ui);"
<seb128> as said I doubt referencing ui once in the program run will make any difference
<bratsche> k
<seb128> and that's by far the easiest way suggested there ;-)
<seb128> bratsche, but thanks for the explanation, now it makes sense
<seb128> I didn't though that the unref could act before the menu merging
<seb128> Ampelbein, ^ the issue with your update explained
<seb128> ups wrong focus
<bratsche> heh
<Ampelbein> seb128, bratsche: thanks, will read it
<seb128> Ampelbein, I'm doing the tweak and upload
<chrisccoulson> seb128 / bratsche - that's interesting. i was also quite confused by Ampelbein's issue too
<bratsche> Yeah, I've run into similar issues a few times in the past.  This is why I wish the actual memory freeing happened on the next context iteration.
<bratsche> But I'm afraid of trying to propose a change like that because it seems like something that may potentially cause problems.  I don't know, I should ask other gtk people what they think.
<bratsche> It seems like it should work correctly.
<seb128_> bratsche, sorry got disconnected and probably missed what you wrote just before, but yeah behaviour changes are always tricky
<seb128_> though in this case it should just make work things which are sort of racy now
<bratsche> <bratsche> Yeah, I've run into similar issues a few times in the past.  This is why I wish the actual memory freeing happened on the next context iteration.
<seb128_> that would be nice indeed
<seb128_> chrisccoulson, yes
<seb128_> chrisccoulson, "yeah" I mean ;-)
<chrisccoulson> heh ;)
<seb128_> or "hey"
<seb128_> doh, I'm sleepy already!
<Ampelbein> at least i'm glad it was not a "ohh, how could he not see that" issue ;-)
<seb128_> Ampelbein, ;-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, i'm quite sleepy too
<chrisccoulson> and i'm up at 430am tomorrow:(
<bratsche> Yeah, you're up pretty late.
<bratsche> eek
<seb128_> chrisccoulson, will you fix the g-s-d .install tonight?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, just doing that now
<seb128_> chrisccoulson, urg, you should go to bed now
<chrisccoulson> then i should probably go to bed
 * chrisccoulson hates early mornings
<seb128_> chrisccoulson, I was going to say that you can include your disk space change too if you want
<bratsche> After getting back from GC, I'm trying to get in the habit of being up a bit earlier since most people on my team are in Europe.
<seb128_> chrisccoulson, but you probably want to sleep rather ;-) and next tarball are due in a week
<bratsche> So I've been pretty good about getting up around 7-7:30am now.
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, i don't mind. it's been committed to git now
<chrisccoulson> it wouldn't take long to include it now
<seb128_> bratsche, 7am is really the basis line for me, before that it's way too early
<seb128_> I like waking up between 8am and 9am
<seb128_> and start working around 9-9:30
<chrisccoulson> those are my sort of hours too ;)
<seb128_> but I'm lucky to be in Europe where most of my team is ;-)
<chrisccoulson> but the people i'm working with tomorrow are all early starters
<chrisccoulson> i shall finish at 2pm on-the-dot though when they stop paying me
<bratsche> seb128_: Well, in school I got into the habit of studying and practicing very late.. and I'd usually get to sleep around 4:30-5:00am.  And my last job was 9 hours behind me, so I was still on this "get up at 11am" schedule and it was just fine with them. :)
<seb128_> chrisccoulson, you work with people in other countries or just start really early?
<bratsche> Of course, I also worked until 8pm or later there. :)
<seb128_> hehe, I know this school schedule ;-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i'm working away tomorrow, and the people i'm working with start much earlier than me
<seb128_> I was doing 3am to 11am at school too
<seb128_> chrisccoulson, oh ok, good luck then!
<seb128_> I will not make you stay away from your upgrade and sleep then ;-)
<bratsche> I went to music school, and it was hard to find space to practice in during the day.. but it was easier to find practice rooms at midnight and later. :)
<chrisccoulson> i've set the timer on the coffee machine, so i will have fresh coffee as soon as i roll out of bed;)
<seb128_> chrisccoulson, if you can drink it that's good ;-) my stomach is not happy to digest anything before 6am usually
<seb128_> ie when I have to wake up early I just go and get coffee later
<chrisccoulson> me neither, but i can usually manage some coffee. i just cant eat any food at that time
 * bratsche doesn't drink coffee at all so this is one less thing to worry about in the morning :)
<chrisccoulson> i couldn't survive without it ;)
<bratsche> I'm unfortunately addicted to diet soda now in the afternoons.  I'd like to quit that stuff.
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i tend to stay away from carbonated drinks
<bratsche> I'm sure it's very unhealthy, although I don't know exactly how.  Maybe if I knew then I'd have an easier time quitting though.
<seb128_> better diet soda than soda though ;-)
<chrisccoulson> yeah, less sugar
<seb128_> I don't like the fake sugar taste
<bratsche> I kind of got used to it, and now I don't like the non-diet soda.  Which is kind of weird.
<chrisccoulson> i'm not a big fan of sugar or sweet things anyway
<dobey> bratsche: i guess you'll know when you get cancer or diabetes :)
<bratsche> dobey, Yeah. :(
<bratsche> dobey, I should have stayed in Baltimore where I have a higher probability of dying quickly by a violent crime.
<bratsche> Although here I have a higher chance of dying quickly in a horrible car crash.  Hmm.. hard to measure which is better.
<dobey> in dallas? it's the book depositories you really have to watch out for
<bratsche> dobey, Oh yeah.. good point.
<lool> seb128: nautilus recommends ncb/brasero which we don't want in UNR; is it ok if I downgrade that to suggests?  desktop seed pulls brasero
<seb128> lool, hum
<lool> Yeah that's what I was thinking as well  :)
<seb128> it's sort of wrong
<seb128> but I've no better suggestion
<lool> I feel the same
<seb128> go for it if that's really an issue for unr
<seb128> the other way would be to add "| unr" to the recommends but I don't like that either
<lool> First I need to hit Robert for pushing to the bzr branch   :-P
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> jcastro, I don't like much this install things on one click for random emails
<seb128> jcastro, it really makes easy to trick users in installing a trojan or something
<jcastro> seb128, ok fair enough.
<seb128> jcastro, I'm not a security guy and I don't like it in webbrowsers either but it didn't stop other people doing that
<seb128> jcastro, so basically I will not stay in the way of asac if he wants to do the change but I will not to do
<jcastro> ok
<jcastro> I am not too passionate about it one way or another
<lool> seb128: Would it make sense to hide brasero if you don't have a burner
<seb128> lool, not sure, you can use it to build cd images for example
<lool> seb128: I think we don't mind having the files and plugins in the UNR image, but the icon in the UNR menus kind of reminds users they don't have a CD drive and is mostly useless on netbooks without a CD burner
<lool> So it might turn out useful and we could show it by default for people with burners but we wouldn't that on netbooks without a cd drive
<seb128> lool, we don't have way to dynamic list menu entries right now though
<lool> Ok; let's forget about that
 * lool defers that whole thing
<seb128> lool, we could have a NotShowIn=UNR though if you need that
<seb128> lool, and you could teach UNR to respect the NotShowIn
<lool> Hmm that would probably work
<lool> seb128: I'll defer to StevenK who's leading the UNR integration
<seb128> lool, ok
<seb128> lool, otherwise feel free to lower the recommends to a suggests for now
<lool> seb128: Nah I know you'll get me in 5 years asking why we had lowered that recommends to a suggests and I wont have any log of this   ;-P
<seb128> lool, lol
<seb128> so I can't use that trick twice against you ;-)
<vuntz> pitti: ping?
<seb128> vuntz, he just went to bed I think
<seb128> vuntz, better to let your question there
<vuntz> seb128: ah, lazy him ;-)
<vuntz> just wondering about the gdm guest session stuff
<vuntz> pitti: just wondering about the gdm guest session stuff, if you have some time to discuss this tomorrow...
<seb128> vuntz, you can look to gdm-guest-session in jaunty
<vuntz> seb128: yeah, I'm looking at it :-)
<seb128> vuntz, the scripts should be pretty easy to understand, it's basically adding an user, login in using it and clean after logout
<lool> seb128: I wonder whether it would help to move the libgdk-pixbuf definition before the pixbuf loaders in Makefile.am, otherwise no idea about the gtk+ build bug, it's ugly
<seb128> lool, I was going to upload a non change update to see how it goes
<seb128> lool, the makefiles didn't change between versions that somewhat puzzle me
<lool> seb128: libtool changed in april, that seems far away
<seb128> lool, indeed
<lool> seb128: Otherwise perhaps all the loaders need proper _DEPENDENCIES on the lib
 * lool has no idea and would need to try it out
 * lool bed &
<seb128> lool, thanks for the suggestions, I will try the non change upload and go to bed too
<asac> seb128: what did jcastro ask about single click install?
<asac> seb128: let me guess: apturl in evolution ;)
<seb128> asac, right
<asac> seb128: did you know that me and mvo are the ones that stay hard on keeping high barriers for getting whitelisted in apturl?
<asac> seb128: so you cannot really easily get a trojan installed by that
<asac> seb128: we wont allow automatic install of random repositories
<seb128> asac, I've no clue about what apturl is doing, I just don't like the idea of one click in an email installing random debs from the internet
<asac> seb128: its not that
<asac> seb128: think about it as installing packages from the ubuntu archive
<asac> seb128: anyway, this reminds me: do you disable running gdebi from evolution?
<asac> we should certainly do that
<seb128> the default action is to store the file but gdebi is in the list I think
<asac> e.g. just allow debs to be safed to desktop instead of being opened in gdebi
<asac> right. we will remove that for firefox ... similar to what they do on windows with .exe
<seb128> the firefox open with dialog is not really nice
<seb128> that's one of the things I've issue with since I switched
<asac> still ... .debs and executables linked from potentially insecure sources should only be allowed to be saved
<seb128> the other one is the lack of easy quick bookmarks entries
<seb128> ack
 * asac  adds a note to file a bug on all relevant bugs
<asac> packages
<asac> ;)
<asac> seb128: do you know if the gnome mime database has a flag like "unsecure content" or something?
<asac> insecure
<asac> i think i saw mozilla code checking that somehow
<seb128> asac, I don't think it has no (the database is a xdg one)
<asac> but could be that it was just meta data they make up on their own on top
<seb128> vuntz, ^
<vuntz> no idea
<seb128> asac, btw is there a way to open new tabs when you middle click in a page just after the tab you are using?
<asac_> seb128: reconnected ... i always add new tabs to the end - what key combo does ephy use?
<seb128> asac_, none, you can just set it to open tabs next to where you are or at the end
<seb128> asac_, I often open the upstream task for a bug by middle clicking on it
<seb128> asac_, it's sort of suboptimal to have to go 15 tabs further to have a look and come back
<asac_> i agree
<seb128> asac_, and I guess there is no option to add text entries for quick bookmarks the way epiphany does?
<seb128> I find having to type keyboard slow and complicated compared to entries ;-)
<seb128> otherwise no complain about firefox it works correctly
<asac_> you mean like live bookmark? but in the search box?
<seb128> I've "launchpad/bugs/%s" = lp keyword
<asac_> https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/1956 ... or https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/1122
<seb128> so I do "lp 678"
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 678 in baz "bazaar allows committing with an empty summary" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/678
<asac_> for advanced tab stuff
<seb128> or "lp 123"
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 123 in rosetta "There's no direct way to see the project info when translating it" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/123
<asac_> but personally i would agree that it would be beter to have an option
<seb128> but you have to type text and remember the keyword to use
<asac_> however, mozilla always tries to keep amount of available options low to keep UI easy
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-07-21
<seb128> have text entries allow to middle click in the one you want
<seb128> it's visually easy and really quick since you don't need the keyboard
<rickspencer3_> robert_ancell: good morning
<seb128> yeah, I expect that's not a standard usecase ;-)
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3_, hi rick
<seb128> the quest for a non buggy and efficient webbrowser is not an easy one ;-)
<rickspencer3_> seb128: lynx?
<seb128> rickspencer3_, do I look like one of those mutt users? ;-)
<rickspencer3_> lol
<seb128> I'm getting used to firefox in fact after a week
<asac_> seb128: http://www.makeuseof.com/tag/making-your-own-firefox-search-plugins-other-tips/
<seb128> I just miss the quick bookmark entries
<asac_> seb128: for most sites you can add existing searchplugins: http://mycroft.mozdev.org/search-engines.html
<asac> there are zillions sites prepared there
<seb128> that's the most efficient thing you can get in a webbrowser ;-)
<seb128> asac, ok thanks
<seb128> that one extra click compared to a bar of entries but that might be good enough ;-)
<asac> seb128: ah you want search fields directly added to bookmark toolbar
<asac> most likely there is an extension available too
<seb128> right
<seb128> have you ever used galeon? I think they do that by default ;-)
<seb128> ie I've usually 7-8 of those
<seb128> bugs numbers for launchpad, gnome, fd.o, list of bugs for those and some extra ones
<seb128> so I just have to select a bug number and middle click it in the right entry
<seb128> I might get used to the firefox way, I keep mixing my keywords right now though ;-)
<asac> yes, thats why i remembered that now - because i had this in galeon; i think i actually used it in ephy too
<seb128> time to go to bed, 'night
<bcurtiswx> hey all, https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-sounds/+bug/400485 i think is fairly important is were making empathy default... but its my own bug.. i don't want to appear biased :-/... thoughts?
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 400485 in ubuntu-sounds "Empathy sounds not in default ubuntu theme" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<pitti> Good morning
<TheMuso> Morning pitti.
<didrocks> good morning pitti
<seb128> good morning there
<pitti> hey didrocks, hey seb128
 * pitti continues the CD size war
<seb128> hello pitti
<pitti> I dropped some packages yesterday, and today's amd64 daily grew by 2 MB
<seb128> pitti, gtk fix confirmed to work on amd64?
<pitti> seb128: yep, works fine here; thanks
<seb128> good
<didrocks> lut seb128
<seb128> 'lu didrocks
<didrocks> good luck pitti with alpha3 :)
<pitti> thanks didrocks
<pitti> we need to downsize pidgin
<seb128> didrocks, did you need some other reviewing for your gir update?
<pitti> seb128: do you know about the chance to use webkit or xul in evolution, instead of gtkhtml?
<seb128> pitti, what is the issue with pidgin it didn't change recently
<pitti> seb128: telepathy depends libpurple depends pidgin-data
<seb128> pitti, webkit for evolution no chance this cycle, they work toward rendering using it but not editing yet
<pitti> ok :/
<seb128> pitti, well that's nothing new, should not explain the difference since yesterday
<pitti> seb128: no, not for this differnce (that was mainly bzr, man-db, and a few bits)
<pitti> I threw out bzr from amd64/alternate ship
<pitti> and now rebuild perl against db 4.7 (another .5 MB)
<slomo> seb128: you had a patch for glib 2.21 that used /usr/share/gnome/applications hardcoded instead of the user data directory... since which gnome-session version is this patch unnecessary?
<slomo> seb128: also you'll probably see some bugreports on gstreamer packages that seeking is broken since 0.10.23.2/.3, this will be fixed soon (and of course before 0.10.24)
<mac_v> seb128: hi... have the problems with ubuntu-client been fixed? had it uninstalled since it kept crashing nautilus
<mac_v> ubuntuone that is^
<seb128> slomo, hum, let me look, not sure what patch you refer to
<seb128> mac_v, should be since yesterday yes
<mac_v> oh.. ok thanx
<seb128> slomo, we didn't have any ubuntu specific change in karmic that I can tell
<slomo> seb128: oh, i've misread the diff... 02_usr_share_gnome_applications.patch and it's usage was dropped in debian. so you can drop it for ubuntu too ;)
<seb128> slomo, right, that one was coming from Debian, thanks
<seb128> slomo, updating to 2.21 in debian?
<slomo> yes
<seb128> slomo, thanks for the gstreamer warning, should we track experimental pre-versions? ;-)
<slomo> yes, track them if there are still a few weeks for updating to the releases ;)
<slomo> seb128: and you probably want to get libgdata from pkg-gnome svn to enable the youtube plugin in totem again
<seb128> slomo, ah thanks, waiting in NEW for debian?
<slomo> yes, it was rejected last time because there were unversioned files in the library package *sigh* :)
<slomo> svn has libgdata 0.4.0, this is the version you'll need for totem 2.27.2 (which will be released in the next days)
<seb128> ok good
<slomo> and you need the gstreamer pre-releases for totem 2.27.2 anyways
<seb128> slomo, anything exciting in the new totem?
<seb128> still better dvd playing I guess? ;-)
<tjaalton> asac: re xserver 1.7; iirc it hasn't been branched yet, nor is master abi stable yet
<slomo> seb128: yes, and many bugfixes and totem now tries to mount gio locations if they're not mounted yet
<seb128> slomo, ah good!
<slomo> but you still can't play your non-ac3 dvds unfortunately :) did you try the patch in bugzilla already?
<seb128> slomo, oh, forgot about this one, I was travelling what you added the comment, will do that this week
<slomo> seb128: ok, that will show us at least if that's the reason for your problem (the patch is far from perfect yet)
<seb128> slomo, I need to try DVD playing in karmic, the 2.26 totem was very buggy for that, lot of users complaining about permission issues
<pitti> nautilus-sendto | 1.1.5-0ubuntu1 |        karmic | source, amd64, i386
<seb128> which could also be due to libdvdcss or libdvdread but totem doesn't make that clear
<pitti> nautilus-sendto-universe | 1.1.2-0ubuntu3 | karmic/universe | source, amd64, i386
<pitti> any idea what the latter package is good for?
<seb128> pitti, to build options for things which are not in main
<seb128> pitti, the empathy one should be moved to the main version now but there is still upnp
<seb128> pitti, the main reason was to have the empathy option available somewhere in jaunty
<pitti> I was going to do a no-chagne rebuild to NBS out the old libempathy libs
<pitti> ah, ok
<seb128> pitti, any hurry to clean that? I can do the changes a bit later if you want (busy on some other things right now)
<pitti> just doing some NBS cleanup
<seb128> pitti, feel free to do a no change rebuild for now if you want to clean that quickly
<pitti> (already done)
<didrocks> seb128: I didn't have the time yesterday and surely not this evening to update clutter. I think I will do it on Thursday (gobject-introspection has been uploaded). Let's first fix some "quickly" bugs and distutils-extra merge proposal :)
<seb128> didrocks, ok, no hurry, thanks
<slomo> seb128: other than that, are you aware of any other new gstreamer/totem bugs that are reported often? :)
<pitti> seb128: my main concern is http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/testing/karmic_probs.html right now, so I spotted it
<seb128> slomo, recent issues or just bugs which annoy users over cycles?
<slomo> seb128: both
<seb128> slomo, one of the annoying thing is that the gio totem doesn't ask for login password when trying to play an online ogg on a protected website
<seb128> not sure that's a common usecase but it's annoying some people there since we have some of those on canonical websites
<seb128> otherwise the most frequent complain in jaunty is DVD playing raising permission errors
<slomo> that's what i've fixed for 2.27.2, at least if the gio plugin is used... if the soup plugin is used that's still a problem
<seb128> is the gio plugin ranked higher?
<slomo> nope :) and it shouldn't because gio's http support is very minimalistic... hm, i might take a look at fixing this with the soup plugin too in the next days
<seb128> would be nice ;-)
<seb128> otherwise out of DVD playing which should already be better in karmic no real common complain
<slomo> ok :)
<seb128> lot of "no sound" issues often due to pulseaudio but totem doesn't make clear what's going on
<seb128> not sure it could though
<seb128> and one complain which comes every now and then is that buffering seem to suck
<seb128> at least in the webbrowser player
<seb128> ie bug #108623
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 108623 in totem "totem isn't buffering correctly" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/108623
<slomo> that should be better now too
<seb128> ok
<slomo> seb128: is there an upstream bug for the http authentication stuff?
<seb128> slomo, gnome bug #556708
<ubottu> Gnome bug 556708 in general "totem does not prompt for authentication on network locations" [Normal,New] http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=556708
<slomo> thanks
<asac> tjaalton: so we might not get Xserver 1.7 for release? or just later?
<seb128> pitti, any objection to me uploading notify-osd new version in karmic now?
<pitti> seb128: no, if you test it and it works, go ahead
<seb128> pitti, ok thanks
<pitti> general attitude is "upload with care and don't break anything" (library transitions, etc.)
<pitti> not "don't uplaod anything"
<ara> seb128, are you referring to the tar.gz that MacSlow announced yesterday?
<seb128> ara, yes, why?
<ara> seb128, is there a PPA already? (I would love to test it)
<seb128> ara, dunno, that would be a question for MacSlow, I'm about to do a karmic proper upload
<ara> seb128, excellent, thanks :)
<cassidy> hey guys. What's https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/karmic/+source/desktop-data-model/1.2.5-2build1 ?
<seb128> cassidy, apt-cache show libddm-1-0
<seb128> "Description: Desktop Data Model library
<seb128>  Desktop Data Model (DDM) is a library used by the Mugshot client and all
<seb128>  Online-Desktop programs."
<seb128> cassidy, ^
<cassidy> I didn't know they were using empathy
<pitti> cassidy: apparently they do; I uploaded a rebuild against the current soname
<pitti> (beyond that, I have no clue whatsoever what ddm is)
<lool> seb128: Wow the no change reupload of gtk did fix things??
<pitti> lool: just as mysteriously as it got broken in the first place :)
<lool> I don't like that but well
 * lool kills his gtk+ build
<seb128> lool, yes
<seb128> lool, I don't like it either but that would take a day of debugging and I've other things I prefer to do ;-)
<seb128> MacSlow, notify-osd 0.9.15 uploaded to karmic
<ara> MacSlow, are durations working with this release?
<pitti> ok, release engineering bits done for now, /me looks at the gnome-keyring ssh breakage
<seb128> pitti, I don't get the issue there on current karmic for what is worth
<pitti> hm
<pitti> the daemon works, but my session doesn't have $SSH_AUTH_SOCK
<pitti> I'm going to reinstall my box with current karmic daily today anyway
<pitti> so perhaps it's just some local cruft
<pitti> /etc/X11/Xsession.d/75dbus_dbus-launch seems to trigger now
<pitti> martin    3859  0.0  0.0  26156   516 ?        S    Jul20   0:00 dbus-launch --exit-with-session gnome-session
<pitti> but gnome-keyring doesn't use any Xsession.d scripts
<pitti> seb128: do you know how my session is supposed to get the $SSH_AUTH_SOCK variable?
<seb128> pitti, over dbus, there is an api to export environment
<seb128> pitti, but you are right, gnome-session doesn't have it set
<seb128> strings /proc/$(pidof gnome-session)/environ | grep SSH
<seb128> nothing
<seb128> gnome-panel does though
<seb128> and I start my g-t from a launcher
<seb128> which explains why it works there
<seb128> pitti, downgrading to gnome-session 2.26.1 makes no difference
<seb128> pitti, I would tend to blame dbus there
<pitti> ah, I start it from a ~/gsession script
<pitti> strings /proc/$(pidof gnome-panel)/environ|grep SSH -> nothing
<mat_t> seb128: pitti: morning!
<pitti> hey mat_t
<mat_t> pitti: fyi https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Specs/Karmic/LoginExperience#Design started putting that together yesterday
<seb128> pitti, weird
<seb128> $ strings /proc/$(pidof gnome-panel)/environ|grep SSH
<seb128> SSH_AUTH_SOCK=/tmp/keyring-cwnYZr/socket.ssh
<seb128> hey mat_t
<mat_t> hey seb
<pitti> mat_t: I saw, looks great!
<mat_t> cool!
<didrocks> pitti: when you have some time, if you can review and merge my branch for disutils-extra (https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~didrocks/python-distutils-extra/update_control_file/+merge/9090). Other changes you made works perfectly. Thanks a lot :)
<MacSlow> ara, no
<MacSlow> seb128, thanks
<mat_t> pitti: seb128: I'll be adding more stuff today, will keep you updated
<MacSlow> seb128, any issues with building the .deb for 0.9.15?
<seb128> MacSlow, no, it went just fine
<seb128> MacSlow, you have almost 80 bugs though, time for some triage maybe there? ;-)
<MacSlow> ara, the blur- and surface-cache work which went into 0.9.15 was a needed preparing-step for the durations
<seb128> mat_t, ok thanks
<ara> MacSlow, OK, thanks :)
<MacSlow> seb128, no need to remind me about that
<mat_t> ara, MacSlow: hi
<pitti> seb128: I downgrade d-bus, and check where the regression is, and file a bug
<ara> hey mat_t ;-)
<mat_t> :)
<MacSlow> seb128, dx is making sure my todo-list if filled
<seb128> pitti, good luck, let me know
<MacSlow> seb128, but some bugs will be "implicitly" fixed by the coming (feature) work
<seb128> MacSlow, well there is a crasher with some 7-8 duplicates
<seb128> could be worth looking at it
<MacSlow> seb128, ara: with 0.9.15 there is on "major" regression though... the over- and undershoot-effects for feedback/sync. bubbles (e.g. volume, brightness) are not working
<seb128> indeed, I can confirm that
<MacSlow> mat_t, hi there
<seb128> ok, I'm away to buy food and some other things, bbl
<asac> mvo_: any chance we get a kde enabled apturl backend?
<asac> ;)
<asac> or is that off the radar for karmic
<mvo_> asac: its not on my radar, but it should be easy to do, maybe I should just do during the freeze or something
<mdz> pitti, I see the same as you (no ssh agent in my session since last login)
<pitti> mdz: right, currently trackig that down
<pitti> downgrading d-bus doesn't help
<pitti> so that's not it
<mdz> pitti, ~/.xsession-errors says SSH_AUTH_SOCK=/tmp/keyring-uZ6Zb2/socket.ssh
<pitti> mdz: mine too, and starting ssh with SSH_AUTH_SOCK= ... ssh works
<pitti> but the variable isn't exported
<mdz> pitti, should I open a bug report about the SSH_AUTH_SOCK issue?
<pitti> mdz: please go ahead; I still don't know which package is to blame yet
<pitti> I downgraded dbus, gnome-session and gnome-keyring, no success so far
<pitti> I'm investigating gdm now
<vuntz> it's not me!
 * vuntz is afraid seb128 will blame him ;-)
<didrocks> vuntz: ahah :-)
<tkamppeter> pitti, foo2zjs updated.
<mdz> is anyone else seeing bug 401055?  it's just happened to me again
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 401055 in firefox-3.5 "Gdk-ERROR **: The program 'firefox-3.5' received an X Window System error (BadWindow)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/401055
<mdz> Gdk-ERROR **: The program 'firefox-3.5' received an X Window System error.
<pitti> tkamppeter: danke!
<seb128> mdz, can you get a stacktrace for the crash?
<mdz> seb128, yes, it leaves behind a crash report thanks to apport handling aborts now :-)
<mdz> seb128, but it's my understanding that usually these are useless without --sync
<pitti> oh, I didn't even implement that yet :)
<pitti> apport needs to fish the abort message from the coredump
<seb128> mdz, right, you might want to hack apport to add a --sync option to the call
<seb128> mdz, you only get the issue when using apport? does using the same command which is listed in the .crash lead to the crash?
<mdz> pitti, oh, it's SIGTRAP, not SIGABRT in this case
<pitti> seb128: any chance that we could drop the second mixer applet for alpha-3?
<mdz> seb128, I have not been able to reproduce it by running firefox manually, even with the same command line
<seb128> pitti, I'm not decided or what to do there, I can foresee people complaining about not letting it built as an option to use
<pitti> seb128: so one is the master level, the other is the pulseaudio virtual "software" mixer?
<pitti> I'm not quite sure what the second is all about
<pitti> and it uses the vertical slider, just as in intrepid
<seb128> mdz, I can confirm the crash there
<seb128> pitti, the notification area icon is the pulse modern upstream way
<seb128> pitti, the applet is the old deprecated mixer which you can still build using a configure option
<pitti> seb128: so the vertical slider one is actually the "new" one?
<seb128> yes
<seb128> it's not an applet
<seb128> it's a notification area icon
<pitti> ah
<pitti> seb128: so perhaps we could ship the applet, but not enable it by default?
<seb128> pitti, right, but that doesn't fix the upgrade issue
<pitti> I was already about to document it as a known issue for alpha-3, but then I realized that I don't even know what the bug is, i. e. which one is right
<seb128> mdz, downgrading libgtk workaround the crash
<seb128> mdz, I reassign the bug to gtk+ now
<pitti> seb128: the applet could just hide itself/quit if pulseaudio is running, perhaps?
<seb128> pitti, we had the same issue for half of jaunty for what is worth so maybe it was documented there
<seb128> ie have a look to jaunty alpha notes
<asac> mdz: did you manage to get a backtrace? i think it had something to do with XQueryTree either erroring directly or returning a BadWindow that causes this error later. like in http://mxr.mozilla.org/mozilla-central/source/widget/src/xremoteclient/XRemoteClient.cpp#471
<seb128> pitti, I don't like the "have an applet use memory etc for ever after upgrade"
<mdz> pitti, filed bug 402161
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 402161 in gnome-keyring "gnome-keyring-daemon is running, but SSH_AUTH_SOCK is not set in the session environment" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/402161
<seb128> pitti, ie if it's masked it's still running and you have no way to drop it
<pitti> seb128: could it disable itself (in gconf) in that case, and just quit?
<pitti> ah, that would make gnome-panel freak out
<seb128> yes
<mdz> asac, I have not tried with --sync yet, though it's easy to reproduce so I will try it now
<pitti> so I guess "disable itself and hide"
<seb128> you would get the "applet crashed" dialgo
<seb128> dialog
<pitti> and the next session wouldn't start it any more
<pitti> mdz: thanks
<seb128> asac, mdz: doesn't happen with previous gtk so it could be a gtk bug
<asac> when i had that, --sync made it go away unfortunately
<asac> seb128: its odd. i saw it in the middle of the jaunty cycle
<seb128> mdz, pitti: I doubt the gnome-keyring-daemon ssh issue is a gnome-keyring one
<mdz> seb128, I didn't know where else to put it
<seb128> asac, well, I get it every time and dpkg -i libgtk2.0-0 2.17.2 and it works
<pitti> seb128: I downgraded gnome-keyring, gnome-session, and dbus, these aren't it
<pitti> I suspect gdm, investigating right now
<seb128> pitti, next is gdm?
<seb128> ok, same though
<pitti> given that gdm broke everything else recently, too :)
<pitti> but before... lunch!
<seb128> asac, hum, it doesn't crash but it's not happy either
<seb128> (firefox-3.5:24830): GLib-GObject-WARNING **: IA__g_object_weak_unref: couldn't find weak ref 0xed08a0(0xb2eb2ec0)
<seb128> with "old" gtk
<seb128> asac, in fact it crashed on second try so maybe not gtk
<asac> seb128: i think we see some weird Xid caching bug again
<asac> from what i know gdk maintains their own xid caches and so if you someting directly with X skipping gdk it might cause some troubles
<asac> seb128: so you still see the BadError with older gtk?
<seb128> asac, yes but not every time
<asac> yeah. and --sync fixes it
<seb128> asac, $ firefox-3.5
<seb128> (firefox-3.5:25746): GLib-GObject-WARNING **: IA__g_object_weak_unref: couldn't find weak ref 0xbe78a0(0xb4ff1ad0)
<seb128> asac, do you get those warnings too?
<asac> seb128: oh yeah. i am sure i didnt get them when i had the BadWindow bug last time
<mdz> asac, I'm unable to get it to crash by substituting a shell script (/usr/lib/.../firefox-3.5 --sync "$@") for gnome-open
<mdz> I see the same glib warnings as seb128
<mdz> without changing my gtk
<asac> seb128: do you happen to know what that warning mean? e.g. the weak reffed object is already freed or the object was never weak reffed at all?
<mdz> running gnome-open <url> doesn't crash either
<mdz> the only way I can get it to happen is with apport so far
<mat_t> pitti: some additions to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Specs/Karmic/LoginExperience#Design Basically the idea is to go straight to password entry if there's only 1 user account
<mat_t> pitti: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Specs/Karmic/LoginExperience#Login%20screen%20with%20user%20picker%20and%20one%20user%20account
<seb128> asac, dunno
 * mat_t > food
<mdz> asac, ok, I have got a crash with --sync by diverting /usr/lib/firefox-3.5.1/firefox-3.5
<mdz> asac, filed bug 402165, awaiting retrace
<ubottu> Bug 402165 on http://launchpad.net/bugs/402165 is private
<tjaalton> asac: later, I think, unless it's delayed too much
<asac> mdz: how did you divert firefox-3.5?
<mdz> asac, mv
<mdz> perseus:[/usr/lib/firefox-3.5.1] cat firefox-3.5
<mdz> #!/bin/sh
<mdz> exec /usr/lib/firefox-3.5.1/firefox-3.5.real --sync "$@"
<asac> seems its just hard to reproduce. after trying 20 times it really crashed for me too. great.
<asac> retrace failed :/
<mdz> asac, I just noticed that as well :-/
<mdz> asac, I'm doing a local retrace
<asac> mdz: you might get better results if you gdb it locally with firefox-3.5-dbg and xulrunner-1.9.1-dbg (and maybe gtk et al)
<asac> right
<mdz> that's what I'm doing
<pitti> re
<mdz> asac, https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/firefox-3.5/+bug/401055/comments/2
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 401055 in firefox-3.5 "Gdk-ERROR **: The program 'firefox-3.5' received an X Window System error (BadWindow)" [Undecided,New]
<mdz> (stack trace with symbols and --sync)
<pitti> seb128, mdz: $SSH_B0RK is gdm bug
<seb128> pitti, iz gdm bog? I'm not surprised, seems to be the gdm month or something ;-)
 * pitti sighs
<pitti> . o O { why exactly did we upgrade? :-) }
<mdz> pitti, I tried to move it but you got there first
<rodrigo_> hmm, new gdm doesn't let you select sessions in /usr/share/xsessions, right?
<seb128> rodrigo_, it does
<rodrigo_> and it doesn't seem to read .xinitrc/.xsession
<pitti> works here
<rodrigo_> seb128: oh, how?
<seb128> rodrigo_, click on an user and you get a combo in the bottom bar
<pitti> rodrigo_: as soon as there's more than one, it displays a combobox
<rodrigo_> ah
 * rodrigo_ tries
<pitti> nowadays there's at least GNOME and xterm there
<rodrigo_> I just added a jhbuild one, but when I right/left click on a user, it just goes to the asking for password steo
<rodrigo_> no combobox here
<rodrigo_> ah, on the bottom bar, sorry :)
<asac> mdz: thanks. thats the code i had in mind.
<lool> vuntz: I'd love to hear what you think of https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=589241
<ubottu> Gnome bug 589241 in Assistive Technology Preferences "Could check a11y gconf key in the autostart .desktop files" [Minor,Unconfirmed]
<Keybuk> seb128: does new-gdm have the same "prefetch" stuff that old-gdm did?
<pitti> hah, gotcha
<seb128> Keybuk, no
<Keybuk> seb128: does it have any kind of scripts it runs synchronously to set up the user's session?
<pitti> all of Xsession.d/
<pitti> and I guess the first phase of autostart desktop files blocks until all are done, and the second phase is started?
<Keybuk> if I put a script in Xsession.d, gdm will wait for that script to finish before moving onto the next one?
<pitti> they are all sourced in order (they need to)
<pitti> they shouldn't do anything expensive, if they do, that's a bug
<Keybuk> well
<pitti> it's mostly used to build a startup command line
<Keybuk> would it be ok to run readahead from there? :)
<pitti> if it helps
<Keybuk> it'd block while it loads in all the blocks that the rest of the desktop is going to load
<pitti> ah, I thought you found an expensive script there and were going to spank us :)
<Keybuk> nope, I'm not going near desktop this cycle ;)
<Keybuk> karmic is all about getting to X fast
<Keybuk> what happens after that is your problem this release ;-)
<pitti> Keybuk: :)
<Keybuk> but since I'm fiddling with readahead
<pitti> Keybuk: so yes, Xsession.d/ is an appropriate place for readahead
<Keybuk> and only have an HDD-based Mini 10 right now
<pitti> but I think it could do better
<Keybuk> I thought I may as well move bits around and see if I can't speed things up a little
<pitti> since ideally it would already start readahead when the gdm greeter is done
<pitti> while the user types name/password
<pitti> in other words, it could become a gdm autostart .desktop file
<seb128> Keybuk, is the bootspeed much different on that one compared to the ssd you had?
<vuntz> lool: hrm, not sure what's the best thing to do there
<pitti> I'm not sure whether gdm's session itself uses some kind of Xsession.d/ script
<james_w> pitti: how does apport determine that it has shown a problem to the user?
<pitti> james_w: mtime != atime of the .crash file
<james_w> I'm getting an "infinite loop" on a kernel problem report
<pitti> (< in particular)
 * asac lunch
<pitti> yay ssh gnome-keyring
 * seb128 back from lunch now
<pitti> this was driving me nuts
<seb128> pitti, what was the issue?
<pitti> I have all my offlineimap etc. through ssh
<seb128> I'm wondering why it still works for me
<pitti> seb128: missing OPTIONFILE in /etc/gdm/Xsession
<pitti> seb128: which caused /etc/X11/Xsession.d/75dbus_dbus-launch not to be called properly
<james_w> thanks pitti, seems to a kerneloops bug
<pitti> james_w: ok, thanks
<seb128> pitti, ah ok
<Keybuk> seb128: of course, HDD is much slower
<pitti> james_w: that's still not fixed: I ran into that loop months ago :/
<Keybuk> pitti: how would I write one of those?
<pitti> Keybuk: /usr/share/gdm/autostart/LoginWindow/readahead.desktop
<james_w> pitti: I'm rewriting it now
<pedro_> seb128, bonjour, I'm planning to run an hug day based on Evolution on Thursday and will add some of the evolution-mapi bugs in case someone could reproduce any, that ok to you?
<pitti> Keybuk: and Exec=/usr/bin/readahead blabla
<lool> vuntz: me neither; the enable/disable flags seem a bit redundant
<pitti> Keybuk: just copy e. g. metacity and update it accordingly
<Keybuk> pitti: is that run with auto-login?
<lool> With the a11y flag and with the possibility of using the app setting to disable it
<pitti> Keybuk: ah, good point; it's not
<seb128> do you need that on autologin?
<seb128> you don't have a non-busy wait time you can use anyway
<seb128> reading while gdm is loading or just after shouldn't make a real difference, does it?
<pitti> Keybuk: well, if you just want to play with it, just use an Xsession.d script for now
<Keybuk> seb128: it makes a big difference on HDD
<pitti> Keybuk: if that's worth it, I'm fine with patching it into gdm itself, so that it's always run at a convenient time, also with autologin
<Keybuk> on HDD, you really don't want readahead to run alongside anything else
<Keybuk> since it relies on being able to drive the hard drive head in one direction
<seb128> Keybuk, well, do you need any readahead if you don't have a stop time to do it?
<pitti> when I moved all the gnome stuff to /etc/readahead/boot, that reduced gnome startup from ~ 30 to ~ 7 seconds
<Keybuk> seb128: that's why I was looking for a point in gdm when it could run readahead and wait for it to finish
<Keybuk> pitti: I'm not getting those kinds of results yet
<pitti> Keybuk: with autologin I don't think that there's a scriptable place, but it sounds like a trivial patch
<seb128> pitti, well, your readahead had all the datas for your user no? ie gconf, etc
<pitti> but Xsession.d/ for autlogin is probably as good as it can get anyway
<seb128> and that was a profile with datas
<pitti> seb128: hm, not sure, but I don't think it had /home in there
<seb128> ie it makes a higher difference
<pitti> oh, hang on, I still have that profile
<pitti> (until this evening, when I'm going to reinstall)
<pitti> no /home there
<pitti> I think it's clever enough to filter out /home
<seb128> weird that you reach a lowing so fast with your slow disk without caching gconf, etc
<seb128> lowing -> loging
<pitti> whcih also explains why startup is still much slower with that than with a true hot cache (then it's like 3 seconds)
<Keybuk> not really
<Keybuk> readahead is a kinda "best guess" thing
<Keybuk> it works on paper, but not so well in practice
<seb128> well by time you have loaded gdm you have read most of what you need
<seb128> since gdm uses the whole gnome stack included gnome-session, gconf, etc
<Keybuk> except you probably haven't
<pitti> but not nautilus, panel, compiz
<seb128> everything remaining is mostly user data
<Keybuk> things may have been loaded, and then flushed back out of the page cache to make way for other things
<seb128> pitti, those are just a bunch of binaries though, not an hundred of libs
<seb128> Keybuk, how does readahead make sure that doesn't happen?
<Keybuk> seb128: it can't
<Keybuk> in fact, readahead relies on that *not* happening
<Keybuk> as soon as it does, it becomes a performance penalty rather than improvement
<seb128> well, why would it happen to gdm but not readahead?
<Keybuk> seb128: it does happen to both
<seb128> so you best have to do readahead after everything else to make sure nothing else comes and flush things out?
<Keybuk> before
<seb128> well, I was thinking "gdm loads; you do readahead for session and sit on password prompt; then session load"
<Keybuk> right
<Keybuk> but you also need to make sure it works for autologin too
<seb128> hum, so an autostart + a Xsession.d script for autologin cases
<Keybuk> am currently playing with having a readahead pack for rcS
<Keybuk> and a separate one for rc2+60s
<Keybuk> this doesn't seem to be any faster than just having one large readahead pack for the entire boot
<pitti> one large pack works reasonably well here, except that it blocks the boot for 20 secons very early on
<pitti> so it's not good for the "bring up X ASAP" approach
<Keybuk> http://people.canonical.com/~scott/boot-performance/sam-karmic-20090721-2.png  - one large pack running in the background
<Keybuk> http://people.canonical.com/~scott/boot-performance/sam-karmic-20090721-2.png  - one large pack running in the foreground
<Keybuk> http://people.canonical.com/~scott/boot-performance/sam-karmic-20090721-8.png  - two packs in the foreground
<Keybuk> err
<Keybuk> http://people.canonical.com/~scott/boot-performance/sam-karmic-20090721-3.png  - one large pack running in the foreground
<pitti> . o O { waah xkbcomp }
<Keybuk> doesn't seem to be much in it between -2 and -3
<seb128> pitti, what was the magic again to drop caching?
<pitti> seb128: echo 3 | sudo tee /proc/sys/vm/drop_caches
<seb128> pitti, danke
<mdz> Keybuk, how big is the readahead data?
<Keybuk> mdz: 1969 files, 73604KB, 2318 fragments  (HDD optimised)
<Keybuk> mdz: 1977 files, 67963KB, 2320 fragments  (SSD optimised)
<mdz> interesting, smaller than I might have guessed
<Keybuk> this is using sreadahead rather than readahead-list
<Keybuk> so the pack is the "set of files opened during boot that are still in the page cache by the end"
<Keybuk> this may or may not mean it's self-limiting in size
<rickspencer3_> Hi all
<rickspencer3_> I forgot to send the reminder mail regarding the team meeting and activity reports :(
 * rickspencer3_ notices that most people sent them anyway
<seb128> hey rickspencer3_
<pitti> hey rickspencer3_
<rickspencer3_> hi guyses
<Keybuk> pitti: do you run i386 or amd64?
<pitti> Keybuk: amd64
<Keybuk> pitti: ah, ok
<Keybuk> you'd need to build a kernel to try my sreadahead stuff
<pitti> Keybuk: I'll reinstall my box this evening or tomorrow morning
<Keybuk> why reinstall?
<pitti> I'm not much fussed about which CD I'll use
<pitti> Keybuk: alpha-3 testing
<pitti> I just do it from time to time
<Keybuk> ahh
<Keybuk> was actually after numbers from a not-recently-reinstalled box ;)
<pitti> I have nice scripts to turn a virgin install into "my" workstation, so it's relatively painless
<Keybuk> freshly installed is boring, because the files are all in order on the disk
<pitti> Keybuk: ah, ok; this install is from jaunty RCish, I think
<pitti> with files and packages moved and hacked all over the place
<pitti> Keybuk: throw your kernel into a PPA?
<Keybuk> pitti: don't have a source or changes for it
<pitti> oh
<vuntz> seb128: do you use $XDG_CONFIG_HOME/compiz/enable-compiz or $XDG_CONFIG_HOME/compiz/disable-compiz? (wondering if this is something that is upstream)
<seb128> vuntz, dunno, what are those?
<vuntz> seb128: files to tell whether or not to use config (force a configuration for the user)
<seb128> vuntz, ask mvo, I've no clue where those are stored and what value we use
<vuntz> mvo_: hi :-)
<didrocks> pitti: are you aware about any easy access to prefix or data_dir specified by the user to retrieve it in setup.py with distutils-extra?
<pitti> didrocks: -EPARSE, I'm afraid
<pitti> didrocks: there is --prefix (/usr vs. /usr/local) and --root (like $DESTDIR)
<pitti> i. e. ./setup.py install --root=/tmp/x would install /tmp/x/usr/local/bin/
<didrocks> pitti: and I have to parse the command line to retrieve this? distutils doesn't gave any automagic function available when it's imported?
<pitti> didrocks: I'm afraid I still don't understand what you want to do
<didrocks> pitti: I just want to know where data files will be install when calling ./setup.py install (with eventually, --prefix= --root=...)
<didrocks> installed*
<pitti> aah
<pitti> didrocks: you need to do that in the 'install' command subclass
<pitti> didrocks: look at auto.py, class install_auto, def run
<pitti> self.root is the --root argument
<didrocks> pitti: ok, I imagine there is the same with prefix and home :) Thanks a lot pitti
<dobey> hrmm
<pitti> didrocks: right, there should be similar properties
<dobey> what would be the implications of disabling nautilus start-up by default?
<mvo_> hi vuntz
<mvo_> vuntz: we don't use this right now, but if its part of compiz-manager (the upstream script) than we will when someone updates the script :)
<vuntz> mvo_: I think it's part of ccsm
<vuntz> mvo_: simple-ccsm, actually
 * hyperair scratches his head and wonders why root privileges are required in order to eject a dvd.
<seb128> hyperair, devicekit bug
<dobey> anyone want to see a really cool bug? set the gconf key /apps/nautilus/preferences/show_desktop to false in karmic :P
<dobey> i'd recommend doing it in gconf-editor though, so you can toggle it back on easily
<arand> dobey: window list spam, eh?
<pitti> nautilus auto-exiting fighting with autostart .desktop file auto-respawning?
<dobey> arand: apparently gnome-session keeps trying to restart it
<dobey> pitti: i can't find an autostart file. looks like gnome-session is doing it directly
<arand> Hello, I'm trying to push for an SRU in https://bugs.launchpad.net/gnumeric/+bug/316502 and I was wondering if I could get some help from here in making a debdiff?
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 316502 in gnumeric "cannot release a graph in gnumeric after click and drag" [Medium,Fix released]
<hyperair> ah devicekit
<pitti> didrocks: hm, your new branch changes the entire debian/control
<pitti> didrocks: I deliberately didn't do that, since the user might make customizations
<pitti> didrocks: if you really want that, you could just have quickly unlink debian/control before calling python-mkdebian (or we add a --force switch?)
<didrocks> pitti: but you already override user depends custumization, no? And yes, I defintively need that for quickly as some values can be changed by the user in setup.py (like author not present the first time the user build a debian package)
<didrocks> pitti: and I think that not having this kind of stuff in distutils, and so, having setup.py and debian/control not in sync is source of user frustration
<pitti> didrocks: for newly added fields, that's no problem (long desc, author, etc.)
<didrocks> so, the --force switch can be a solution :)
<pitti> didrocks: ok, so I'm fine with --force
<pitti> which is pretty much equivalent to rm -r debian/
<pitti> :)
<pitti> to regenerate all the files
<didrocks> pitti: not really, as we keep the debian/changelog :)
<pitti> ah, true
<didrocks> pitti: do you want me to add the --force switch?
<pitti> if you want, please go ahead
<pitti> didrocks: I'm a bit busy with alpha-3 stuff
<didrocks> pitti: ok, I will do it in a couple of hours
<didrocks> I imagine, that's why I propose that to you :)
<pitti> speaking of which, *nnnng* http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily/20090721.4/
<pitti> how many RMs does it need to produce a working set of isos?
 * pitti wonders what's broken this time
<pitti> oh, *phew*, just mirror lag
<pitti> Keybuk: FYI, I sub'ed you to dx-karmic-os-switcher, since it's not quite clear how the graphical OS selector will be put in between X and gdm startup, and how to make sure that it stays around long enough to be useful without stalling boot
<pitti> Keybuk: (I'm worried that they plan to add a sleep 5 or so)
<Keybuk> I still think the OS switcher should be an option in the gdm/user session shutdown dialogs
<pitti> rickspencer3_: meeting now? or am I confused?
<rickspencer3_> pitti: I *think* it's in 57 minutes from now
<pitti> ah
<rickspencer3_> asac: seb128: Riddell: etc...
<seb128> pitti, you are confused
<rickspencer3_> ^ ?
 * rickspencer3_ wipes sweat from brow
<asac> if we want we can meet now ;)
<asac> i am ready
<hyperair> hmm for some reason frets on fire appears to be having issues with pulseaudio.
<mat_t> Keybuk: it should - that's still the plan (I think)
<mat_t> Keybuk: it should be basically available at any stage (boot, gdm, user session)
<Keybuk> mat_t: that means writing a separate OS selector implementation for each stage though
<mat_t> Keybuk: how separate?
<Keybuk> well, during boot you would been to write an implementation inside the splash screen
<mat_t> Keybuk: (I'm not surprised btw)
<Keybuk> then you'd need to write a separate implementation for when X is up but gdm hasn't started
<Keybuk> and then you'll need yet another implementation for the gdm shutdown dialog and user session
<mat_t> Keybuk: well, on boot it'll be running under X right
<Keybuk> once X is up, yes
<Keybuk> they might be checking filesystems, for example
<mat_t> Keybuk: yeah, I didn't expect it to be easy :)
<Keybuk> as long as there's a "no sleep 5" understanding ;)
 * mat_t didn't get the "no sleep 5" bit... 
<mat_t> Keybuk: btw, how can I tell visually when the X is up - when the mouse appears or when the usplash disappears?
<Keybuk> mat_t: mouse appears
<mat_t> I see, so now it's around 10 secs
<mat_t> on my mini 9
<Keybuk> yeah, getting there slowly
<mat_t> :)
<mat_t> pitti: got a sec?
<rodrigo_> pedro_: going out now, but please poke me later or tomorrow for buying your books, I've completely forgotten about it :)
<pedro_> rodrigo_, oh! i've forgot about it too, ok will ping you tomorrow ;-)
<rodrigo_> ok
<bryce> morning
<kenvandine> hey bryce
<pitti> mat_t: I meant, if there are normally two seconds between "X starts" and "gdm starts", you wouldn't have lots of time for showing the OS selector
<pitti> and enlarging that period with sleeps is evil
<mat_t> pitti: why sleeps?
<pitti> since it's directly working against all the speedup work that Keybuk is doing
<pitti> mat_t: otherwise it would be too fast?
<pitti> mat_t: or is that compensated by the possibility of changing OS on shutdown or in gdm?
<pitti> (that would be great)
<mat_t> pitti: ok, so the idea is that the user would be able to invoke the os switcher during boot, but that would not stop the boot process. The OS switcher would be displayed independently of the gdm/desktop session
<mat_t> pitti: in terms of slowing down, if you decide to reboot into another OS, you've interrupted the boot anyway. If you don't, it won't affect the boot at all (shouldn't)
<Keybuk> ie. it's an always-on-top window?
<pitti> mat_t: so if the OS selector during boot is just displayed 2 seconds, because you have a fast box (and/or Keybuk rocks), you can compensate by just changing in gdm's option menu or something?
<rickspencer3_> team meeting time
 * rickspencer3_ taps gavel
<Keybuk> you see your desktop session (or gdm) underneath?
<mat_t> pitti: and yes, ultimately the OS switcher should be available in gdm and desktop, too
 * rickspencer3_ ahem
<pitti> mat_t: thanks
 * pitti STFU
 * Riddell googles gavel
 * seb128 is there
<rickspencer3_> ArneGoetje: asac bryce kenvandine awe seb128 pitti Riddell
<mat_t> pitti: we'll talk more tomorrow, thanks!
<asac> good day
<rickspencer3_> sorry to interrupt the conversation
<tkamppeter> hi
<rickspencer3_> mat_t: feel free to hang out for our meeting
<rickspencer3_> hi tkamppeter
<mat_t> rickspencer3_: sure, pleasure!
<rickspencer3_> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-07-21
<rickspencer3_> we start with actions from the previous meeting
<rickspencer3_> please see the wiki for status there
<rickspencer3_> nothing to discuss, I think
<rickspencer3_> I will ask TheMuso about accessibility + empathy in the Eastern edition meeting
<pitti> what was the a11y webkit result?
<pitti> right
<rickspencer3_> I have an announcement about bluetooth
<seb128> GNOME is still discussing the topic
<seb128> (webkit)
<rickspencer3_> I arrange it so that we can all spend up to about $50 US on bluetooth equipment ...
<seb128> discussion is active on d-d-l
<asac> thx seb128
 * rickspencer3_ sorry
<rickspencer3_> go ahead
<seb128> rickspencer3_, that was all ;-)
<asac> seb128: can you add archive pointers to wiki?
<asac> list archive
<seb128> asac, will do when they reach consensus
<rickspencer3_> I always manage that in the most awkward manner, don't I?
<seb128> lol
 * rickspencer3_ tries not to interrupt again
<asac> rickspencer3_: good news. wonder how we can coordinate that we have different devices. maybe we should setup a wiki page with bt hardware owned by desktopers?
<rickspencer3_> asac: great
<rickspencer3_> idea
<seb128> do we have a list of "common devices"?
<seb128> ie things we should be testing
<rickspencer3_> I wanted to say, don't use the subsidy unless you are willing to ensure that you get it working for Karmic!
<rickspencer3_> seb128: good question, I don't know
<rickspencer3_> I was going to suggest we all try to get "different" things
<asac> i think for dell hardware we have superm1 ... so maybe thats covered
<rickspencer3_> like if we all get the same headset, it won't be so useful
<pitti> so I can test obex and GPRS tethering here, I don't have audio hw
 * kenvandine will get bt headset
<rickspencer3_> asac: would you be willing to set up the wiki page to track?
<awe> i just bought a new headset this morning.  good timing i guess!  :)
<asac> rickspencer3_: i will
<Riddell> the getting it working part is probably quite hard in my case, I don't think KDE bluetooth is in a great state
<asac> on this front i would like to push back the decision on what i default for a week.
<rickspencer3_> ACTION: asac to set up wiki page to track bluetooth devices for desktop team
<Riddell> but worth trying
<rickspencer3_> Riddell: should we be helping with that?
<rickspencer3_> I'm not sure on how much infrastructure is cross desktop
<asac> i got side tracked by too many things this week; also i think we need to get latest gnome-bluetooth in the archive to do the final evaluation
<rickspencer3_> asac: ack
 * rickspencer3_ notes asac had a very full week
<pitti> ah, so that could fix some of the gripes I mentinoed on the ML (hangs, etc)
<asac> Riddell: could you find out about the current KDE state on bluetooth?
<Riddell> rickspencer3_: needs some upstream love to get up to get it up to date with the current infrastructure, it would be nice if we did help but then there's a load of stuff that would be nice that we're already trying to find time to do
<Riddell> asac: yes I should
<asac> knowing that it doesnt work is better than not knowing that
<rickspencer3_> ACTION: Riddell to report on current state of BT in Kubuntu Karmic
<rickspencer3_> I suppose we should all try our devices in Kubuntu as well
<rickspencer3_> ok, if you have questions about expensing the bluetooth gear, please let me know
<rickspencer3_> move on?
 * rickspencer3_ hands mic to kenvandine
<rickspencer3_> partner update
<kenvandine> partner update
<pitti> nice choir
<kenvandine> everyone can view the current u1 integration status at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuOne/DesktopIntegration/Status
<kenvandine> progressing
<kenvandine> got more MIRs this week and more coming for next week
<kenvandine> the new packages are trickling in
<asac> ack. i saw my queue growing
<kenvandine> firefox extension and desktopcouch should be in REVU by the end of the week
<pitti> I currently have some stomachaid to fit them on the CDs
<kenvandine> evo couch integration is in revu now
<pitti> (later)
<awe> kenvandine: do you know if the team plans on making symbolic links work in the karmic time frame?
 * rickspencer3_ points quietly at the GIMP
<kenvandine> awe, i do not know
<kenvandine> got a bug #?
<awe> no
<kenvandine> ok, i can ask
<pitti> please file one, though
<rickspencer3_> U1 does not work with symlinks?
<rickspencer3_> that explains a lot
<kenvandine> yeah, i suspect there is one already
<awe> me too, but i'll check
<kenvandine> rickspencer3_, not outside of the Ubuntu One dir
<kenvandine> also
<kenvandine> gtk-contact-picker has been moved out of scope for karmic
<kenvandine> screen sharing might get post poned as well, not sure yet
<rickspencer3_> ah
<kenvandine> we should get that with telepathy anyway
<rickspencer3_> so those can be reflected in your table next week
<kenvandine> so it would just be the u1 integration that would get punted
<kenvandine> rickspencer3_, yes
<rickspencer3_> sweet
<kenvandine> DX update
<kenvandine> fusa rework (SUS) will be ready to integrate at the sprint
<kenvandine> so should be good times :)
<pitti> "SUS"?
<kenvandine> the replacement for fusa
<rickspencer3_> slow user switcher?
<kenvandine> not sure what it stands for :)
<kenvandine> hehe
<kenvandine>  Status-Users-Session
<rickspencer3_> kenvandine: relative to Dx, I'd like to see some progress in making the GDM greeter *look* nicer
<kenvandine> i guess the three things it controls
<rickspencer3_> I'm seeing if I can get some resources for that
<kenvandine> rickspencer3_, yeah... i think there is some debate about that
<rickspencer3_> oh?
<kenvandine> well nobody is working on it yet
<rickspencer3_> right, that's what I would like to fix, if possible
<kenvandine> and i think there isn't agreement on how
<pitti> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Specs/Karmic/LoginExperience
<kenvandine> like modify what is there
<kenvandine> or write a new greeter
<kenvandine> i think they are discussing it
<rickspencer3_> pitti: right, but that's functional
<mat_t> rickspencer3_ I'm hoping to have a meeting with sabdfl next week to discuss
<rickspencer3_> I'd at least like to see some "skinning", even if we can't make functional changes
<mat_t> "skinning" is the plan minimum
<rickspencer3_> but there may not be resources for that even, and we'll just live with the default for Karmic
<pitti> rickspencer3_: not really functional, most of the functinoality there is already present
<kenvandine> mat_t, good
<pitti> except for the autologin configuration, which we committed to anyway
<rickspencer3_> ok
<kenvandine> that is all i have
<rickspencer3_> ACTION: rickspencer3 to update on gdm greeter skinning resources at next meeting
<rickspencer3_> thanks kenvandine
<Le-Chuck_ITA> Hi all, there's an ubuntu-specific bug in gnome-volume-control: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-media/+bug/400820
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 400820 in gnome-media "gnome-volume-control-applet takes up to 40% cpu" [Low,Confirmed]
<seb128> Le-Chuck_ITA, you are in the middle of a meeting there
<Le-Chuck_ITA> sorry
<rickspencer3_> Le-Chuck_ITA: no problems
<rickspencer3_> feel free to hang out, we'll get back to you when done
<rickspencer3_> :)
<Le-Chuck_ITA> change the topic perhaps, bye and have fun :)
<rickspencer3_> so where were we
<seb128> Le-Chuck_ITA, we don't change the code so no reason for it to be ubuntu specific
<rickspencer3_> right
 * rickspencer3_ hands mic to Riddell
<Riddell> Kubuntu Update
<Riddell> -Alpha 3 currently blocked on a problem in Ubiquity, currently testing a fix
<Riddell> -Social from the start now implemented, microblogging and opendesktop applet on desktop, kopete-facebook installed, still some touching up to make sure it doesn't get in people's way
<Le-Chuck_ITA> seb128: do not want to break your meeting but read the bug and then eventually complain with the gnome developers who said it's ubuntu specific!
<Riddell> -Kubuntu Netbook now has settings package and should see its first release with alpha 3
<rickspencer3_> Le-Chuck_ITA: seb128 please wait until after the meeting, we are done soon
<rickspencer3_> thanks :)
<Riddell> (although currently it's just the desktop with different font sizes, that'll change though)
<Riddell> -New Kubuntu council elected
<Riddell> -ayatana patches merged upstream and backported to our packages, notifications now shared between KDE and Gnome, result!
<rickspencer3_> !
<kenvandine> woot!
<mat_t> nicely done!
<pitti> congrats!
<Riddell> and the freedesktop.org process seems to be making progress following GCDS (agateux's ayatana work highlighted that it wasn't currently working as it should)
<Riddell> -Question: when is apport being turned on?  we have some experimental stuff and upstream are getting bug reports that would be better sent to us
<Riddell> </end>
<rickspencer3_> Thanks Riddell
<pitti> Riddell: apport> last night
<Riddell> "fixed yesterday" always a good answer :)
<bryce> pitti, oh apport has been off?  ah that explains a bit...
<asac> hehe
<pitti> bryce: it doesn't make much sense for the initial wave of merges, syncs, and upstream betas
<pitti> stuff gets fixed faster than people can report/process/close/test
<bryce> shucks here I thought I was making such headway against the bug influx for a change :-)
 * rickspencer3_ has empathy and evo crashes to apport
<pitti> but I think alpha-3 is a good cutting point
<bryce> yeah makes sense
<pitti> bryce: that was the idea :)
<pitti> (I'm serious)
<rickspencer3_> lol
<seb128> no need to collect thousand of bugs which will be deprecated before we look at those
<rickspencer3_> right
 * bryce nods
<rickspencer3_> pitti: seb128 that was a good idea
<seb128> note that we do that every cycle ;-)
 * rickspencer3_ takes note
<rickspencer3_> learn a little bit every turn of the crank ;)
<rickspencer3_> move on?
<rickspencer3_> support bugs ....
<rickspencer3_> this is just a quick think about when our support team escalates bugs to us
<rickspencer3_> please note that the key thing they need is for us to respond quickly with the status
<rickspencer3_> rather then necessarily fix the bug
<rickspencer3_> note that the process is covered on the wiki
<bryce> rickspencer3_, that's a good point but can you explain how that works for them?
<pitti> on the discussion we agreed on them assigning to canonical-*-team, is it that?
<rickspencer3_> please assign the bug to yourself, and ping me
 * rickspencer3_ gets link
<pitti> (and we review/assign to a person/comment and unassign)
<rickspencer3_> sorry world, this is an internal link
<rickspencer3_> http://wiki.canonical.com/SupportDistroEscelation
<rickspencer3_> pitti: sure, that's fine
<asac> https://wiki.canonical.com/SupportDistroEscalation is the right one
<rickspencer3_> this is a reminder to do that
<bryce> rickspencer3_, i.e. if it is a bug reported against jaunty, is it enough to let them know when it's fixed in karmic, or do we also owe a backport to fix the customer's machine?  (sometimes backporting is easy, sometimes it's a PITA)
<rickspencer3_> and a reminder that the goal is to allow support to give the customer a status update asap
<rickspencer3_> rather than fix the bug asap
<rickspencer3_> bryce: just tell them the status first
<rickspencer3_> they want to be responsive to the customer with information first
<pitti> the primary idea of this process is to connect the right people and evaluate the status/cost/etc.
<pitti> often, support cases are fine with a valid workaround, or even a "works for me" PPA package
<pitti> but we had cases where important bugs were just ignored, since they weren't assigned, and we didn't know about them, etc.
<rickspencer3_> pitti: right, and we recently had an opposite case, where a less important bug was escelated
<pitti> bryce: so if you say that a fix is hard to backport (like, KMS fixes a machine), this should be said so in the bug
<rickspencer3_> and the engineer, trying to do the right thing, invested hours in trying to fix the bug
<bryce> is there a listing of bugs support is waiting for response on, or do we need to track those ourselves?
<rickspencer3_> bryce: you should be contacted directly in irc by the QA team if a support bug is escelated to you
<rickspencer3_> you don't have to pole
<rickspencer3_> make sense?
<bryce> rickspencer3_, right and that's working fine
<pitti> bryce: no polling, please; it's the support/business team's responsibility to initiate the process
<bryce> rickspencer3_, often though after the initial go around I don't hear back from them, but I know the bug's still open, so I never know if the workaround/status update was sufficient for their purposes, or if they want me to keep plugging away at doing a backport or whatever
<rickspencer3_> after your initial reply, they will follow up with you if they need anything else
<bryce> alright
<rickspencer3_> that's why it's important to ensure that the bug is assigned
<rickspencer3_> so that it can be *unassigned*
<pitti> and has the right status
<rickspencer3_> yes
<pitti> i. e. "incomplete" or "wontfix" are quite clear on whose side the ball is
<pitti> (for the stable task)
 * rickspencer3_ hands mic to pitti
<pitti> so, we have alpha-3 on Thursday
<rickspencer3_> release stuff
<pitti> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/ReleaseStatus reflects our current status
<pitti> looking fairly good so far
<pitti> we managed to get the structural changes planned for alpha-3 all settled by last week
<pitti> and the current CDs now look reasonable
<pitti> my main issue with them is size
<pitti> I spent some time fixing overflows, but they are still too big
<pitti> so, any idea about downsizing appreciated
<pitti> we currently have quite a lot of library/functionality duplication
<seb128> documentation languagepacks?
<pitti> the soyuz support for /usr/share/gnome/help is underway, but not done yet
<pitti> (or, rather, the buildd changes)
<rickspencer3_> pitti: didn't we decide this weeks ago?
<rickspencer3_> move the GIMP off the disk if needed?
 * rickspencer3_ ducks
<pitti> we have stuff like xul vs. gtkhtml vs. xulrunner, or old vs. new policykit, etc.
<pitti> rickspencer3_: next against the wall, but it's "just" 6 MB
<pitti> we already dropped documentation to fit empathy and general growth
<asac> pitti: xul vs. xulrunner?
<pitti> gimp removal will immediately be consumed by erlang plus couch db
<rickspencer3_> ouch
<pitti> and we need to fit in kenvandine's huge list of new packages still
<bryce> pitti, rickspencer3_:  You can take nv â nouveau off the planned plumbing changes.  we'll shoot for getting kms enabled in nouveau but I don't think that it'll be stable enough to have on as the default
<pitti> bryce: oh, ok
<kenvandine> pitti, yeah they really add up
<pitti> bryce: done
<bryce> pitti, I figure we should EITHER do nouveau+kms, or nouveau+by-default, not both.  And KMS seems more important
<rickspencer3_> pitti: are you looking for a "permanent" solution, or just for the alpha?
<asac> what is using gtkhtml on CD?
<pitti> rickspencer3_: the alpha is fine
<pitti> a more permanent solution
<rickspencer3_> what about removing the games package for the alpha?
<pitti> asac: primarily evolution so far, but fixing that isn't trivial (and certainly not the type of thing we do ourselves)
<asac> oh right. evo. for a moment i thought it was not on CD ;)
<pitti> and we still don't have a single langpack
 * seb128 slaps asac
<rickspencer3_> lol
<seb128> pitti, expect clutter to maybe be added to the CD soon too
 * rickspencer3_ groans
<pitti> ..
<asac> how much oversizing are we lookg at atm?
<pitti> anyway, whenever you stumble about something, please tell me
<seb128> drop openoffice?
 * seb128 runs
<pitti> asac: I managed to squeeze it < 700 MB for alpha-3
<pitti> it's more of a longer-term problem
<pitti> most of the OLS stuff didn't land for a3 yet
<kenvandine> they will be small, but do add up
<rickspencer3_> fewer games perhaps would saves some space?
<pitti> for now I dropped bzr and sl-modem from ship, rebuilt perl against db4.7 (dropping db4.6), stuff like that
<pitti> rickspencer3_: yeah, they are quite big
<rickspencer3_> robert_ancell would need to refactor the packages quite a bit, right?
 * crevette would suggest to shave gnome-games
<asac> pitti: can you do another CD spin please? i think i communicated to the wrong person (steve) that ffox 3 was going to be uploaded today (which is done now)
<kenvandine> rickspencer3_, i think robert_ancell is already planning on that
<pitti> asac: tomorrow morning's dailies will probably be "the" images
<seb128> rickspencer3_, we were speaking about splitting gnome-games
<rickspencer3_> kenvandine: right,but "planning" and "doing" aren't always the same
<pitti> asac: live build currently running, but more for smoke testing
<seb128> rickspencer3_, but that will win 1.5meg
<asac> ok thats good enough
<seb128> rickspencer3_, ie not a lot
<rickspencer3_> only 1.5?
<seb128> yes, games are 2d cards, etc games
<pitti> 1.5 MB isn't to be sneezed at
<seb128> we already splitted documentation
<rickspencer3_> I think this might need some more focused thought
<pitti> I guess we can't build empathy with gtkhtml or xul?
<pitti> to drop webkit?
<seb128> pitti, no
<pitti> nothing else is using it, right?
<rickspencer3_> pitti: how do you suggest we go about making this deciscion?
<seb128> pitti, and GNOME will bring webkit in anyway
<seb128> pitti, well if GNOME decide webkit is a11y ready it will be install by default
<seb128> yelp, etc will use it
<pitti> so we have one app using webkit, one app using gtkhtml, one app using xul
<asac> seb128: which components besides devhelp and yelp?
<seb128> if it's not we will not build empathy with it
<rickspencer3_> perhaps a table with less important apps, and how much space they would save would be a good starting point
<asac> seb128: err devhel pisnt on CD
<mpt> bug 376744
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 376744 in gnome-games "Split gnome-games into one game per package" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/376744
<pitti> asac: I'm not counting devhelp (not installed by default), but indeed, yelp is the 4th
<seb128> asac, yelp and evolution for the rendering maybe
<rickspencer3_> along with a sense of how much space we will need
<pitti> rickspencer3_: for games? ubuntu-devel@ discussion?
<rickspencer3_> not just games .. the whole problem
<seb128> mpt, the bug is outdated there is an ongoing email discussion with pitti and robert_ancell
<aboSamoor> I upgraded from jaunty to karmic, and I got a black screen instead of gnome login, any help ?
<rickspencer3_> it seems like we can generate some ideas here, but the actual decision making process will need to me somewhat more systematic
<pitti> rickspencer3_: ah; well, I wouldn't do that on a ML, too many people and too much bikeshedding
<seb128> aboSamoor, try #ubuntu
<rickspencer3_> pitti: right
<bryce> aboSamoor, --> http://wiki.ubuntu.com/X/Troubleshooting/
<pitti> rickspencer3_: in fact, desktop team meeting seems like the right forum for this IMHO?
 * kenvandine agrees with pitti
<mpt> seb128, I don't see anything outdated about it, and it was reopened five days ago.
<rickspencer3_> pitti: agreed, but I think we need some more structure before we decide
<rickspencer3_> more documented facts
<pitti> it's a well-known problem, discussed twice every cycle :)
<seb128> mpt, it lacks argument about the discussion we had by email since
<seb128> mpt, I will update it
<mpt> great
<pitti> s/firefox/epiphany+webkit/? :-)
 * pitti ducks from asac
<bryce> pitti, since IIRC windows comes with a couple games, it would seem prudent to also keep at least a couple games.  Solitaire and Mines.  The other games are fun but maybe not so interesting to a newb
<asac> pitti: well, ephy+webkit would be nice to have at all
<pitti> bryce: yes, I wouldn't like to kick them all
<davmor2> pitti: issues with codec selector using rhythmbox it's trying to find gsteramer input-selector rather than the mp3 codec
<asac> its not yet decided upstream even
<pitti> davmor2: later, please (meeting)
<pitti> ok, I'm done
<asac> so most likely we end up with another self-made gecko port for epiphany
<pitti> if something catches your eye in your daily work, please let meknow
<seb128> asac, sudo apt-get install epiphany-webkit
 * asac being pessimistic
<pitti> but so far, big kudos to the team for a nice alpha-3 status
<pitti> the biggest wart so far is "two mixer applets in the panel"
<pitti> we had far worse
<seb128> ;-)
 * pitti hands mike back to rickspencer3_
<rickspencer3_> ok
<rickspencer3_> any other business?
<rickspencer3_> One last thing ...
<rickspencer3_> I was thinking about all the cool stuff in Karmic ...
<tkamppeter> I have updated the https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Halsectomy, the replacement for hal-cups-utils is under heavy developm,ent currently.
<pitti> oh, wrt. cool stuff; please everybody check https://wiki.ubuntu.com/KarmicKoala/TechnicalOverview if I forgot something
<tkamppeter> So probably alpha-4 will do Plug'n'Print via udev.
<pitti> tkamppeter: \o/
<rickspencer3_> yeah I was able to just down a bunch of stuff in like one minute, check wiki for this meeting
<rickspencer3_> tkamppeter: great news
<tkamppeter> I have also completed a script on the OpenPrinting server to auto-build driver packages. So in the Karmic age we will probably have auto download of binary driver packages.
<rickspencer3_> neat
<rickspencer3_> that's been a goal of yours for a while, I think
<pitti> (do I hear a "we can drop some from the CDs" there?)
<rickspencer3_> hehe
<pitti> (although that's unrelated, we can still have them packaged)
<Riddell> tkamppeter: will that mean I need to make changes to system-config-printer-kde?
<tkamppeter> Riddell, I will soon upload a new system-config-printer, at that stage you have also to resync with the 1.1.x git to catch the new udev part.
<Riddell> mm, ok
<tkamppeter> Riddell, This part of s-c-p replaces the hal-cups-utils package then, so s-c-p will obsolete out hal-cups-utils (we have to go through the bugs to see what goes away and what goes to s-c-p).
<asac> pitti: removed me from jabber?
<tkamppeter> Riddell: Stop, can be that there is nothing to do for you. The udev stuff is all non-GUI background code, so it goes into system-config-printer-common.
<pitti> asac: sorry, empathy bug
<asac> pitti: ah ok ;) ... i will rerequest
<tkamppeter> Riddell: There I put it in and it is simply there, also for you.
<Riddell> tkamppeter: ok we'll see what breaks, I hope to find a bit of time for s-c-p-k love anyway
<pitti> asac: moving between groups copies instead of moves, and deleting the copy deletes the other one as well
<kenvandine> hehe... sub-optimal :)
<rickspencer3_> oops
<asac> pitti: yeah. but seems it auto authorized at least
<rickspencer3_> any other business?
<seb128> no
<kenvandine> nope
<rickspencer3_> thanks to pitti for organizing alpha3 !!
<asac> thanks!
<tkamppeter> Riddell: Tim is working a lot on the GUI, too, so you should try to catch up with him (I did not look into the newest GUI changes of 1.1.x yet).
<rickspencer3_> also, Karmic is already a great release, I can't wait until we release this!
<rickspencer3_> it's going to be epic
<pitti> rickspencer3_: I'm just next in the RM food chain :/
 * rickspencer3_ taps gavel
<rickspencer3_> thanks all!
<rickspencer3_> you guys are really rocking this release
<seb128> thanks!
<ArneGoetje> thanks
<pitti> thanks all
<pitti> 1 h 0 mindesktop team meeting
<pitti> wow, punctuality!
<seb128> btw I expect the GNOME move to pulseaudio will be an issue again this cycle
<pitti> (and wow broken whitespace copy&pate)
<bryce> thanks
<rickspencer3_> seb128: really? seems to be improving for me
<ArneGoetje> pitti: we could replace ttf-arphic-uming with ttf-wqy-zenhei on the CD
<pitti> ArneGoetje: nice, what would that break?
<seb128> rickspencer3_, the capplet still doesn't allow to do some things
<pitti> would give us 2.1 MB
<pitti> ArneGoetje: is that just a matter of changing seeds, or does that need any fontconfig voodoo?
<seb128> rickspencer3_, and what Le-Chuck_ITA was complaining about before is that skype is not working when using pulseaudio for some people appareantly
<Le-Chuck_ITA> I will now retry
<davmor2> pitti: I gotta shoot out for a bit.  If you fire up rhythmbox and then try any of the radio stations or magnatune or last.fm the codec searcher looks for input-selector rather than the codec required.  I'll throw a bug together after but it's been confirmed by fader_ and sbeattie on #u-testing
<pitti> davmor2: ah, thanks for the bug
<ArneGoetje> pitti: ttf-wqy-zenhei is more complete than ttf-arphic-uming, but lacks Hong Kong characters. WQY Zenhei also fits better to sans-serif.
<rickspencer3_> seb128: is Skype getting rebuilt?
<ArneGoetje> pitti: should be only seeds and live-cd, but need to test
<rickspencer3_> I noticed that when I have a flash movie playing in FF, nothing else plays sound
<ArneGoetje> pitti: and update language-support-fonts-zh
<pitti> ArneGoetje: ah, to pull in -uming?
 * Le-Chuck_ITA is going to reboot, test latest pulseaudio+skype, and report back
<ArneGoetje> pitti: yes. Then wqy-zenhei will be the default Chinese font and uming an extra font from the archive
<pitti> nice
<pitti> ArneGoetje: could you test that, or did you already and foudn it working?
<seb128> rickspencer3_, skype? it's closed source no?
<ArneGoetje> pitti: need to test... unfortunately my virtualbox is not working... :( need to make a fresh install on a USB stick...
<rickspencer3_> seb128: right ... so are users using a binary from Jaunty, and finding it doesn'
<rickspencer3_> t work?
<pitti> ArneGoetje: ah, language-support-fonts-zh already pulls in both, which is fine, I think
<pitti> ArneGoetje: ok, let's do it post-a3 then
<ArneGoetje> pitti: yup
<pitti> ArneGoetje: thanks!
<awe> rickspencer3_: skype talks directly to ALSA
<seb128> rickspencer3_, I've no clue about it, Le-Chuck_ITA was complained about it not working when using pulseaudio
<pitti> awe: i. e. to pulse's alsa emulation then, I guess?
<awe> rickspencer3_: yea
<pitti> I'm off for some dinner and fresh air
<awe> pitti: i remember at uds that it was mentioned that skype abuses the alsa api
<pitti> see you around tomorrow, or late night
<seb128> me too, dinner
<pitti> awe: right, I remember
<seb128> pitti, interesting nautilus profiling, we can chat about it tomorrow
<pitti> dtchen's "why sound is broken" talk
<awe> bingo
<seb128> 8 seconds on a 20s start are due to brasero and totem options
<pitti> seb128: "nautilus profiling"?
<pitti> ah, that
<pitti> seb128: right, TTYL, enjoy dinner!
<rickspencer3_> seb128: cool
<seb128> dinner time, bbl
<rickspencer3_> bye bye
<mat_t> rickspencer3_: did you have a chance to peep at the boot exp/os switcher spec?
<rickspencer3_> mat_t: yes
<mat_t> rickspencer3_: looks like it's a potential artery clogger
<rickspencer3_> mat_t: does the DX team have resources dedicated to it?
<mat_t> rickspencer3_: MacSlow probably
<rickspencer3_> mat_t: what about the greeter, though?
<mat_t> rickspencer3_: well, exactly - it needs skinning *at least*
 * kenvandine suspect that would be MacSlow
<mat_t> + the ability to populate random avatars for newly created users
<rickspencer3_> right, but I didn't see anything about that in spec (not that I read it that carefully)
<mat_t> :)
<rickspencer3_> mat_t: that sounds complex
<mat_t> yes, we need to discuss with sabdfl first
<rickspencer3_> what if we get no functional changes, is it possible to make it *look* better
<rickspencer3_> ?
<mat_t> rickspencer3_: we have a folder with avatars in the system already
<mat_t> pitti said it should be doable
<mat_t> usr/share/pixmaps/faces
<rickspencer3_> mat_t: that's not my question
<rickspencer3_> if we get no functional changes, do you think you can provide a skin that would make it look better?
<rickspencer3_> or are the form and function too tightly bound?
<Le-Chuck_ITA> rickspencer3_: seb128: it seems the presence of pulseaudio also impacts jackd applications e.g. ardour
<mat_t> sorry, was referring to the earlier question
<rickspencer3_> Le-Chuck_ITA: hmm
<mat_t> yes, we can have the designs ready before the Dublin sprint
<rickspencer3_> ardour works for me so long as I start it before anything else that uses pulse
<rickspencer3_> mat_t: good, thanks
<Le-Chuck_ITA> rickspencer3_: perhaps this is not the place to talk about it, but this is very bad. I mean: gnome is currently aiming at replacing the "macos experience"
<rickspencer3_> Le-Chuck_ITA: right
<Le-Chuck_ITA> and for that we need cool programs such as ardour
<rickspencer3_> pulse audio has a lot of promise for the future, but is under development ...
<rickspencer3_> and exposes lots of bugs and other problems in drivers, applications, etc...
<Le-Chuck_ITA> rickspencer3_: yes but how is the average karmic user supposed to use ardour?
<rickspencer3_> Le-Chuck_ITA: the work around for now is to close any firefox windows running flash, or other apps that are using sound, .. and then star ardour
<rickspencer3_> but the community needs to continue to fix bugs in the stack until everything works perfectly ... this will take some time, but we will get htere
<Le-Chuck_ITA> rickspencer3_: I did that right now and does not work
<rickspencer3_> hmm
<rickspencer3_> so Jack doesn't start for  you?
<rickspencer3_> I would suggest:
<Le-Chuck_ITA> "the playback device "hw:0" is already in use."
<rickspencer3_> 1. hopping into #ubuntu for some support
<rickspencer3_> 2. making sure there is a bug logged, or log a new one if necessary using ubuntu-bug
<Le-Chuck_ITA> rickspencer3_: forget about the support I can disassemble my ubuntu piecewise, and can certainly remove pulseaudio
<Le-Chuck_ITA> 2 is ok
<rickspencer3_> we don't really want to remove pulse audio, so much as making sure that it works as well as possible for release in October
<rickspencer3_> so if you figure out a solution the problem, let TheMuso know
<rickspencer3_> even if you just figure out the problem, and not the solution ;)
<Le-Chuck_ITA> before reporting the bug I want to find a solution, just a question do you know how are the alsa devices called, for using fuser?
<rickspencer3_> I don't know
<rickspencer3_> I know very little about the sound stack
<rickspencer3_> TheMuso is based in Syndey ... but he'll be a good person to track down to discuss with
<rickspencer3_> Le-Chuck_ITA:  thanks for helping us with this!
<awe> rickspencer3_, Le-Chuck_ITA: at UDS dtchen talked about pulseaudio being the solution for consumer desktop, and jackd being the solution for pro audio type setups.  It doesn't sound to me like they're going to play well together in the short term
<rickspencer3_> awe: true, but it should be possible to make them work together
<awe> rickspencer3_: not too sure about that...
<rickspencer3_> or not *together* at the same time, so much as together on teh same computer
<awe> rickspencer3_: correct
<rickspencer3_> like, I should be able to switch between them (and in fact I can)
<Le-Chuck_ITA> rickspencer3_: thank you for your patience
<Le-Chuck_ITA> awe it's not my fault if the good music application use jack and ordinary people (e.g. mac users) also want to record music with their laptops just for fun
<awe> Le-Chuck_ITA: i agree 100%
<rickspencer3_> Le-Chuck_ITA: keep chipping away it, we'll make it work!
<rickspencer3_> sooner or later
<rickspencer3_> Le-Chuck_ITA: you're on Karmic, right?
<rickspencer3_> I've been assuming you've been talking about Karmic and not Jaunty
<Le-Chuck_ITA> awe but pulse can do that: it should just leave the device free for others, either on user's request or with some automagicality. Esound did that when alsa was just a buggy bad dream
<Le-Chuck_ITA> rickspencer3_: of course
<rickspencer3_> phew
<mat_t> rickspencer3_: np, please let me know if there's anything your guys are missing/something isn't clear/etc. I'll keep you posted anyway
<awe> Le-Chuck_ITA: as far as i know, pulse wants to own *all* of the audio on the system.  it also configures a plugin so that native ALSA calls get re-routed to pulse
<awe> Le-Chuck_ITA: unfortunately, i haven't played around with ardour in a long time, so i'm not that familiar with jack
<Le-Chuck_ITA> that's nice but all unix applications can call close(2) :)
<awe> Le-Chuck_ITA: yea, but if you shutdown pulse, you lose system sounds, flash, etc...
<awe> Le-Chuck_ITA: i don't think pulse was designed to turn on/off
<Le-Chuck_ITA> that's because jack owns the hardware. That's correct because it needs realtime priority on it
<Le-Chuck_ITA> so no surprise that you can't hear flash while recording your guitar
<awe> Le-Chuck_ITA: you might want to check with folks on #ubuntu-studio
<Le-Chuck_ITA> yes I certainly will thanks for the suggestion
<Le-Chuck_ITA> I had forgotten about them
<awe> np
<Le-Chuck_ITA> ok thanks and bye.
<chrisccoulson> hey seb128
<chrisccoulson> you had a good day today?
<seb128> hello chrisccoulson
<seb128> yes, what about you and your middle of the night waking up today?
<chrisccoulson> i was very tired this morning. and i ended up working until 6pm too
<seb128> urg
<chrisccoulson> i have to do it all again on thursday too. i might try and get friday off work though ;)
<seb128> that would be deserved with the days you are having
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i hope so. i'll sleep well tonight anyway!
<pitti> good night everyone!
<seb128> 'night pitti
<chrisccoulson> good night pitti
<pitti> some CD testing still and then bedtime
<pitti> burned the midnight oil too long yesterday, tired :(
<seb128> pitti, same here, need to get some sleep too
<seb128> pitti, I don't agree with the gdm changes but we can discuss that tomorrow
<seb128> ie the suggests should be recommends
<chrisccoulson> i see main is frozen now. no need for me to rush on the g-s-d update then ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, soft freeze but right
<chrisccoulson> i've pretty much done it, but i had to get some sleep in the end last night
<chrisccoulson> and i've been removed from civilisation today, so no chance for me to do anything useful ;)
<Le-Chuck_ITA> rickspencer3_: where would you report the bug that ardour can not be used in the default desktop? I would really like this to be requirement-driven, that is "I want to run ardour in a fresh ubuntu installation", rather than hunting for who is the culprit
<Le-Chuck_ITA> perhaps pulseaudio in both cases?
<davmor2> okay so what's the name of the easy codec installer?
<TheMuso> Good morning.
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, hey
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3_, hi
<TheMuso> Hey rickspencer3_.
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: Looks like you're going to have quite a mild day down there today. :)
<rickspencer3_> hi guyses
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, is it rough out west?
<TheMuso> Its rather windy, and very mild.
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-07-22
<rickspencer3_> well, guess it's time to meet?
<rickspencer3_> robert_ancell: TheMuso?
<TheMuso> Hey rickspencer3_.
<rickspencer3_> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2009-07-21
<rickspencer3_> so it seemed like it worked well last week, when we only covered highlights?
<TheMuso> yes
<rickspencer3_> do either of you have agenda items?
<TheMuso> no
<rickspencer3_> robert_ancell: ?
<robert_ancell> no
<rickspencer3_> alrighty, then
<rickspencer3_> in terms of action items from last week ...
<rickspencer3_> ACTION: TheMuso to test accessibility of empathy built with webkit
 * TheMuso tested empathy
<TheMuso> I think I documented it in my activity report.
 * TheMuso checks.
<TheMuso> Yes, I did.
<rickspencer3_> TheMuso: you mentioned a couple of bugs, yes
<rickspencer3_> but are you concerned about moving to empathy in Karmic?
<rickspencer3_> do you feel that the issues can be reasonably addressed, or do you see a significant risk
<TheMuso> TO elaborate, the dialogs and menus are fine, but the contact list is not properly read. The only way to get contact list items read is to open chat windows for each of them, and close the window again.
<TheMuso> Online status combo was not readable properly.
<rickspencer3_> hmmm
<rickspencer3_> is this a regression for pidgin?
<TheMuso> As far as my knowledge of the architecture goes, I think they can be addressed, but they may end up being bugs in webkit.
<TheMuso> Yes this regresses from the accessible use of pidgin.
<rickspencer3_> ok
<TheMuso> It also doesn't help that as far as I have checked, there is no expanded orca support for empathy.
<rickspencer3_> I would like to see release blocking bugs for this
<TheMuso> Ok.
<rickspencer3_> so that if they are not fixed by, say, beta, we pull empathy and switch back to pidgin
<TheMuso> Ok.
<rickspencer3_> we should discuss with the rest of the team, but this seems reasonable to me
<rickspencer3_> thoughts?
<TheMuso> me to.
<rickspencer3_> robert_ancell: ?
<rickspencer3_> thoughts
<robert_ancell> I agree we should block on these issues
<robert_ancell> If we make enough noise people will hopefully step up and fix them
<rickspencer3_> ACTION: TheMuso to target bugs for empathy accessibility to karmic, and to set to appropriate milestone (beta)
<rickspencer3_> ok, thanks
<rickspencer3_> thanks TheMuso
<rickspencer3_> an announcement ...
<rickspencer3_> I've arrange for a $50 subsidy us per canonical desktopper so that you can
<rickspencer3_> expense some bluetooth device ...
<rickspencer3_> provided that you agree to get it working in Karmic :)
 * TheMuso already has bluetooth hardware that works,.
<rickspencer3_> this is to encourage wider testing of BT
<rickspencer3_> TheMuso: great news ... perhaps there is something else that may not work?
<rickspencer3_> robert_ancell: maybe it's time for you to get a mic - :)
<TheMuso> Well if there is, I can't think of it. I have the two common use cases being a phone and a headset.
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3_, I read that before and I will get a mic now :)
<rickspencer3_> lol
<rickspencer3_> TheMuso: sounds good
<TheMuso> The only thing that would be useful is DUn/teathering, which is an app issue.
<rickspencer3_> missing from the wiki is the discussion of making room on the CD
<rickspencer3_> looks like long term we are going to run out of room
<rickspencer3_> as we make room for new features from OLS and others, especially
<TheMuso> Yeah.
<rickspencer3_> the games package was mentioned, as well as Gimp (by me)
<robert_ancell> I am proposing to reduce the number of games by default
<rickspencer3_> robert_ancell: yes, perhaps just the two or three that take up the least room ;)
<TheMuso> There are a lot of packages that ship wav files for sounds. I should look into how they play their sounds, and see if we can't compress them to ogg.
<robert_ancell> Not reducing that much!! :)
<rickspencer3_> well, 1 meg is a significant savings at this point
<rickspencer3_> lastly, Till has made some progress regarding some printing related issues, also not on the wiki yet
<robert_ancell> The games are about 50M decompressed, I'd expect we can halve that
<rickspencer3_> not sure that impacts either of you
<rickspencer3_> 50 megs!
<rickspencer3_> decompressed, I read "compressed"
<robert_ancell> 25M compressed (i.e. as .debs)
 * TheMuso hardly prints as it is.
<asac> (TheMuso: dun works in blueman ... though in the end it should work directly in NM/connman yes.)
<rickspencer3_> in terms of saving space, I'd like to get a little bit systematic about finding targets of opportunity
<TheMuso> sound files is one, as I said.
<robert_ancell> I bought a printer the other week and it works great for me
<rickspencer3_> robert_ancell: you have Till to thank for that
<robert_ancell> :)
<rickspencer3_> tkamppeter, his is impressive indeed
<rickspencer3_> ok
<rickspencer3_> that's it
<rickspencer3_> any other business?
<robert_ancell> I'm thinking of attending Linux.conf.au, proposals close this week
<TheMuso> nothing from me.
<rickspencer3_> robert_ancell: sounds good , but ...
<rickspencer3_> we general have time off for one conference per year (other than UDS of course ;) )
<rickspencer3_> same with supporting travel, etc...
<rickspencer3_> we should discuss in our next call, though
<robert_ancell> sure, will do
<rickspencer3_> as we can make exceptions for important things
<rickspencer3_> so that's it for the meeting, you guys can get back to your coffee machines ;)
<TheMuso> there is about 2.6MB of wav files in usr/share/sounds.
<TheMuso> My coffee is a walk of a morning. :)
<rickspencer3_> TheMuso: you are too healthy
<TheMuso> So if we can get that down somewhat, that would be good.
<rickspencer3_> my coffee is coffee
<rickspencer3_> TheMuso: right, plus ogg is open goodness
<TheMuso> Indeed.
<rickspencer3_> in terms of fitting onto the CD, I'd like to see a bit of a system for figuring it out:
<rickspencer3_> 1. estimate how much space will we need
<rickspencer3_> 2. a list of things that can be done to save space
<TheMuso> It all comes down to whether the app needing the sounds can play ogg somehow./
<robert_ancell> Is there a summary of what is on the CD?  I was looking for a package list and even finding that is hard
<rickspencer3_> 3. a decision making process to determine which items from #2 to do
<TheMuso> The seeds are the best place to look./
<rickspencer3_> robert_ancell: I think this is hard
<rickspencer3_> right, you have to look at the seeds
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, I've looked at the seeds but I really want the output of the seeds
<rickspencer3_> I think we can brainstorm the items for #2
<TheMuso> lp:~ubuntu-core-dev/ubuntu-seeds/platform.karmic and lp:~ubuntu-core-dev/ubuntu-seeds/ubuntu.karmic
 * rickspencer3_ goes back to updating tutorial for quickly
<rickspencer3_> ug
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, yes but how do I convert those into which packages get pulled in?
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: the ubuntu-archive home dir on the people.ubuntu.com server is probably the best place to find such info.
<TheMuso> I think there is a list in there somewhere. pitti or cjwatson would be able to give you more info.
<robert_ancell> http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/germinate-output/ubuntu.karmic/desktop ?
<tkamppeter> robert_ancell: Which printer did you buy?
<robert_ancell> HP Deskjed F4280 printer/scanner
<robert_ancell> Was about $60 from office works
<tkamppeter> robert_ancell: HP does a good part on it, with their HPLIP drivers and also giving me their printers for testing.
<tkamppeter> robert_ancell: Currently I work on the new udev-based Plug'n'Print to make it scale, with a laptop and 10 USB printers connected to it.
<robert_ancell> tkamppeter, I bought HP because of what I had heard about HPLIP.  The scanning works well but xsane is a terrible interface
<robert_ancell> tkamppeter, that's a lot of printing!!
<tkamppeter> robert_ancell: In Karmic xsane is about to be replaced.
<tkamppeter> by something (hopefully) more sane.
<robert_ancell> tkamppeter, printing is great in Ubuntu - I had the father test and he said it was easier than in Windows (and I didn't need a support call)
<robert_ancell> :)
<tkamppeter> Windows is this old-fashioned Plug'n'Play: You put in the CD and play for hours, rebooting, connecting the printer, rebooting again ... And Linux has Plug'n'Print.
<rickspencer3_> tkamppeter: lol
<TheMuso> rickspencer3_: but its so true.
<rickspencer3_> TheMuso: I wouldn't know
<rickspencer3_> I haven't used Windows since I worked at Microsoft
<rickspencer3_> well, not entirely true, I installed Windows in a vm so I could sniff the USB interacton with this little photo viewer keychain thing I bought at Fry's
<TheMuso> Right. I remember setting printers up for people and having to do a similar procedure to what tkamppeter outline.
<TheMuso> outlined
<rickspencer3_> I tell this story all the time ...
<rickspencer3_> about a year ago, I bought the very first eeepc model, like the first week they were out
<rickspencer3_> got ubuntu running on it ... I plugged it into the usb printer, and went to get a chair so I could sit down and configure the printer ...
<rickspencer3_> in the moments I was gone, it had configured itself! there was a little pop-up: "your printer is ready" (or similar)
<TheMuso> Ubuntu is at the point where if things work, they work very very well.
<TheMuso> so that doesn't surprise me.
<ajmitch> TheMuso: and if they fail, they fail in spectacular ways?
<TheMuso> ajmitch: Depends on the hardware I think.
<TheMuso> Audio for example, is very much a mixed bag./
<pitti> Good morning
<ara> mmm, my panel has now two different volume applets. Is that expected? why are they different?
 * ara is running karmic
<pitti> ara: it's a known problem indeed
<pitti> but not entirely trivial to solve
<ara> pitti, can you provide some background (or a bug number), please
<pitti> ara: you'll still see the classical "applet" with the horizontal slider, from gnome-applets
<pitti> but recently, pulseaudio started to have a notification area icon as well
<ara> pitti, I do
<pitti> we somehow need to remove the former on upgrades
<pitti> disabling the former by default should be easy
<ara> pitti, which one are we going to remove? the gnome one or the pulseaudio one?
<pitti> the gnome one, I think
<ara> mmm, the pulseaudio one does not mute on double click, which is a really nice feature
<TheMuso> Note that the pulseaudio one is provided by gnome-media.
 * robert_ancell is going mad battling glib+dbus+policykit
<pitti> hey robert_ancell
<robert_ancell> hey pitti
<pitti> robert_ancell: what are you working on? gdm config?
<pitti> robert_ancell: btw, I was gonna ask you about that
<robert_ancell> pitti, yes - I figure we need to have some PolicyKit in gdm to control writing the configuration
<robert_ancell> ask away
<pitti> robert_ancell: I assume that /etc/gdm/custom.conf is just a backwards-compatibility crutch, and it should actually be configured through gconf?
<pitti> robert_ancell: can we use the existing PK magic in gconf for that?
<robert_ancell> pitti, No, it appears to be actual configuration though why it hasn't been migrated to gconf I don't know
<pitti> otherwise we'd need a PK service to gdm itself to write custom.conf
<pitti> hm, that's bad
<robert_ancell> there is a dbus service to read and write that config but you need to be root to use it
<pitti> oh, there is already? nice
<robert_ancell> pitti, I believe they had trouble having a daemon running gconf which is why it ended up like that
<pitti> then the PKification shouldn't be too bad
<pitti> robert_ancell: ah, I thought they'd use it for the greeter session
<pitti> but the greeter might not even run for autologin
<robert_ancell> pitti, or so I thought... Are you a PK expert?  I'm trying to gather up information to work out how to use it.  It seems very intolerant of my errors
<pitti> robert_ancell: expert is too much, but I did use it myself in jockey
<pitti> but I only ever implemented it myself in Python, not C
<pitti> although with the libpolkit-gobject stuff it should actually be much easier in C than with the raw d-bus API in Python
<pitti> robert_ancell: so by and large, you define a new privilege in /usr/share/polkit-1/actions/org.gnome.gdm.policy (say "org.gnome.gdm.set_autologin")
<robert_ancell> The current problem I have is passing a GError on authentication failure causes the error "arguments to dbus_message_new_error() were incorrect, assertion "_dbus_check_is_valid_error_name (error_name)" failed in file dbus-message.c line 1211".  I have no idea why is wrong with my GError
<pitti> allow_any =auth_admin should do
<robert_ancell> pitti, which has to be in lowercase I found out
<pitti> right
<pitti> robert_ancell: did you initialize the GError before?
<pitti> (or set NULL if it initializes one for itself)
<pitti> I usually see this if doing something like
<pitti> GError e;
<robert_ancell> Yes, it's a standard GError - looking through the dbus code it gets the GError "name" and checks that is "asd.asdasd.asd" or similar
<pitti> call_function (..., &e)
<robert_ancell> But I can't find out what I'm supposed to do to make a dbus-compatible GError
<pitti> hm, that's the part I didn't do in Python then
<pitti> might be worth stealing some code from existing PK services, such as ConsoleKit or devkit-disks
<pitti> robert_ancell: do you have your current code somewhere?
<robert_ancell> Yes, been looking though those
<robert_ancell> sure
 * pitti takes a look
<robert_ancell> http://paste.ubuntu.com/224142/
<pitti> hm, polkit_authority_check_authorization() doesn't even take a GError?
<robert_ancell> So it fails in dbus_g_method_return_error
<pitti> uh, I'm afraid I never touched that
<pitti> robert_ancell: does it get passed "NULL" or so?
<seb128> good morning there
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<seb128> hey robert_ancell pitti
<robert_ancell> hey seb128
<seb128> robert_ancell, btw I chatted with rick yesterday who said you found polkit complex
<robert_ancell> pitti, no, the printf about works
<seb128> robert_ancell, did you look at polkit1 or the previous version?
<robert_ancell> seb128, I'm just looking at the Ubuntu packages and the latest docs.  What is the difference?
<didrocks> hey pitti, seb128 and robert_ancell
<seb128> robert_ancell, I don't use polkit but patches for using the new one are usually dropping some hundred lines of code
<seb128> robert_ancell, policykit-1 is the new one
<robert_ancell> seb128, what is the Karmic installed version?
<pitti> robert_ancell: no idea about the dbus_g_method_return_error(), I'm afraid
<robert_ancell> I see libpolkit2
<robert_ancell> pitti, thanks for looking
<pitti> oh, indeed, that's policykit 0.9 code
<seb128> robert_ancell, we have both because things are not migrated yet to policykit-1
<pitti> robert_ancell: in polkit-1, you don't need to do anything on the client side, and the server-side code is much easier
<pitti> http://people.freedesktop.org/~david/polkit-0.92-newdocs/
<pitti> http://cgit.freedesktop.org/PolicyKit/tree/docs/PORTING-GUIDE
<seb128> robert_ancell, btw, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Specs/Karmic/LoginExperience too is worth reading if you didn't yet
<robert_ancell> polkit-1 looks a lot better.
<seb128> robert_ancell, doing the change to add the option menu should be easy enough and would be the place where to have the autologin option or a way to start the gdmsetup dialog
<seb128> robert_ancell, right ;-) that's why I mentioned it, I was not sure if you were looking at the new version
<robert_ancell> The PolKit web presence could do with a tidy up :)
<pitti> robert_ancell: yeah, it got much cleaner in the rewrite
<pitti> before that, the client had to do all the juggling to get authentication, etc.
<robert_ancell> seb128, do you know if the design team wants to have a password prompt when setting the default user?
<robert_ancell> I guess there has to be one
<seb128> you mean have to enter your password to change the default autologin user?
<robert_ancell> yes
<seb128> yes probably or anybody could do it on the login screen
<pitti> it needs to ask for an admin user, and her password, yes
<pitti> this also means that we need to start polkit-gnome in the gdm session
<robert_ancell> yeah
<pitti> I'm off for an hour for some errands, bbl
<seb128> pitti, see you
<mvo_> I get a conffile prompt on jaunty->karmic upgrade for gdm/custom.conf - is that a known issue?
<seb128> mvo_, no, custom.conf didn't exist in jaunty
<mvo_> seb128: this is a automatic install, I did not do any customization with it
<mvo_> seb128: what does normally create it?
<mvo_> (image was created with ubuntu-vm-builder)
<seb128> mvo_, it's shipped with the new gdm in karmic
<seb128> mvo_, we used to have a gdm.custom-conf in jaunty
<mvo_> seb128: its custom.conf, I just checked the log
<seb128> mvo_, well it was gdm.conf-custom in jaunty
<mvo_> seb128: right, it seems like its doing some magic in the preinst that may well confuse the dpkg conffile prompt code
<seb128> mvo_, the preinst code just rename the file
<seb128>     if [ -f /etc/gdm/gdm.conf-custom ]; then
<seb128> 	echo "Renaming /etc/gdm/gdm.conf-custom to /etc/gdm/custom.conf" >&2
<seb128> 	mv /etc/gdm/gdm.conf-custom /etc/gdm/custom.conf
<seb128>     fi
<seb128>     dpkg --compare-versions "$2" le-nl "2.26.1-0ubuntu5"; then
<seb128> mvo_, ^ basically
<mvo_> I see a echo '[daemon]' >> /etc/gdm/custrom.conf here too
<seb128> mvo_, that's only if there is an autologin setting to migrate
<seb128> and there is a typo in the next line, going to fix this one
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<seb128> hey ch
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson
<mvo_> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hey seb128, mvo_
<mvo_> seb128: I have a look why I get the prompt
<mvo_> but I promise I did not do customization :)
<seb128> mvo_, ok, ignore the typo on the echo $settings line
<seb128> mvo_, did you enable autologin in the installer?
<mvo_> seb128: no
<seb128> ok, so the echo lines should not be used
<mvo_> seb128: is gdm in bzr?
<seb128> mvo_, yes, why?
<mvo_> seb128: to get rid of my conffile prompt :)
<seb128> mvo_, apt-get source gdm should tell you ;-)
<seb128> mvo_, what do you want to change?
<seb128> mvo_, don't worry I'm just curious about what is the bug ;-)
<chrisccoulson> hey seb128 - i finished the g-s-d update last night, including the fix for the disk space warning that seems to be annoying people
<seb128> chrisccoulson, hey good, I was just looking to the sponsoring bug but it didn't change
<mvo_> seb128: so it seems like gdm checks for gdm.conf-custom and (unconditionally) moves it to the new custom.conf - but it has a different md5sum from the custom.conf that is shipped in new-gdm. because it happens in preinst dpkg thinks the user has modified the file
<chrisccoulson> i had to make a small change to that though, as i noticed a couple of bugs ;)
<seb128> mvo_, oh, how do we fix those sort of issues?
<robert_ancell> later all
<mvo_> seb128: I'm not sure what is ideal, I guess not moving if the old gdm.cutom-conf was not modified
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i pushed the changes to my own branch for now. i can push them to ubuntu-desktop unless you want to review the changes first
<davmor2> seb128: morning
<seb128> chrisccoulson, is there many changes? it seemed mostly a .install update a patch from git
<mvo_> seb128: but that would still leave users with a customized one with a conffile prompt
<seb128> chrisccoulson, ie those should be fine for ubuntu-desktop directly
<seb128> davmor2, hi
<seb128> mvo_, which means the majority of users, almost everybody used gdmsetup one day
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, that's basically it. i had to make a small change to the patch from git though, as i noticed some small bugs
<chrisccoulson> i'll send those upstream today
<mvo_> seb128: its way to difficult to do this kind of stuff IMO, just look at http://wiki.debian.org/DpkgConffileHandling
<davmor2> seb128: gnome-codec-install issue was confirmed yesterday by sbeattie and fader_ on #u-testing
<seb128> mvo_, I told pitti that we should keep using gdm.conf-custom as naming
<mvo_> seb128: you think so? I never used it :) but yeah, if its a big portion, then the solution is not good enough
<seb128> davmor2, good for them?
<davmor2> I thought I'd added details for it but that was in a previous attept to write the bug that kept timing out  sorry:)
<seb128> davmor2, we get some hundred bugs confirmed every day, that's useful work but not worth mentioning on IRC
<seb128> davmor2, not even sure what bug you are talking about there
<mvo_> seb128: but the code in the wiki page does not move between package AFAICS
<seb128> mvo_, anybody who enabled timed login, autologin, changed the theme, etc
 * mvo_ nods
<davmor2> bug 402773
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 402773 in rhythmbox "Karmic: gnome-codec-installer is not finding mp3 but rather looking for input-selector" [Low,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/402773
<mvo_> seb128: yeah, I'm sure that are many people
<seb128> davmor2, well the bug is basically useful, it doesn't describe the issue or what to do to trigger it
<mvo_> I wonder if we could just ship the same file in the new gdm (with all the header text) so that the md5sums of the original match
<seb128> davmor2, would be useful if rather than confirming bugs people could describe what they do to trigger the error
 * mvo_ scratches his head
<seb128> mvo_, we used to distro patch the gdm.custom-conf to undo upstream change for that purpose before
<seb128> mvo_, sometime conffile handling is ridiculously complex
<mvo_> ++
<davmor2> seb128: Yes again sorry for that I got tied and lp kept timing out on the bug I wrote manually so in the end triggered ubuntu-bug in the hope that lp would accept the report
<mvo_> we could not ship one in the package but create it on the fly (if there is none already)
<seb128> davmor2, anyway IRC confirmation are not so useful, could you rather reply to the asked details on the bug?
<seb128> davmor2, I don't doubt it's an issue for some user but they don't say what they try to play, how, etc
<davmor2> seb128: I have.  would it be useful to add a screenshot of the end result too?
<seb128> mvo_, we don't need to ship one at all, that's only a file for user config
<hyperair> hmm are there supposed to be scripts installed into /etc/pm/sleep.d? i thought the correct place for all package-managed pm-utils scripts was /usr/lib/pm-utils/sleep.d
<seb128> davmor2, you are not new to bug reporting right? anything which make easy to trigger the bug or explain it correctly ...
<seb128> davmor2, it's not complicated, a bug just need to be clearly described, ie have easy steps explaining it or a screenshot if you fail to describe those
<seb128> ie
<seb128> * start rhythmbox
<seb128> * add a mp3
<seb128> * double click on it
<seb128> or whatever you are doing
<seb128> neither the description nor the error are clear in that bug
<seb128> "is actually looking for gstreamer input-selector"
<seb128> how do you figure that?
<seb128> is that an error? something listed in g-c-i
<seb128>  
<seb128> hyperair, not sure you are on the right channel for that question
<hyperair> seb128: hmm whoops.  which channel should i be on then? -devel?
<seb128> well you can try
<seb128> I mean I've no clue about pm-utils
<seb128> and I guess it's the case for most of desktopers
<seb128> you can wait for pitti to come back or try another channel
<hyperair> alright.
<seb128> slomo, hi
<mvo_> seb128: what is the new gdmsetup called - is there one ?
<seb128> mvo_, no there is none but robert_ancell is working on writting one
<mvo_> ok, he will have to make sure it works without a custom.conf :)
<seb128> mvo_, ;-)
<mvo_> seb128: I think we should be fine with http://paste.ubuntu.com/224167 - unless I miss something, but gdm still starts without a custom.conf for me
<mvo_> seb128: I just tested 2.26 -> 2.27 and no conffile prompt for me anymore (but for a really meaningful test I have to wait until its in the archive and the auto-upgrade tester can make its job)
<seb128> mvo_, that's fine with me
<seb128> mvo_, do you want to do the upload now?
<mvo_> seb128: ok, I will commit and we can upload after the freeze
<seb128> ok good
<seb128> mvo_, https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-karmic-gdmconfig
<pitti> hah, got my climbing equipment rented now
<seb128> mvo_, if you want to add a note there
<mvo_> seb128: should I fix the typo (gdm.conf.conf along the way?)
<seb128> pitti, you go climbing? sounds dangerous, be careful we need you ;-)
<seb128> mvo_, yes please and upload then ;-)
<pitti> mvo_: perhaps we should not make custom.conf a conffile in the first place?
<seb128> mvo_, you don't want to clean the autologin option at each upgrade
<mvo_> pitti: yeah, I currently just removed it from being shipped
<pitti> seb128: just a fixed rope route, not _that_ dangerous :)
<seb128> ups
<seb128> pitti, ^
<seb128> pitti, good ;-)
 * seb128 hugs pitti
<pitti> seb128: "clean the option"?
<seb128> pitti, well if custom.conf is not a conffile it will be overwritten at each upgrade
<pitti> how so?
<seb128> pitti, better to just not ship a custom.conf at all
<pitti> the migration removes the old gdm.conf-custom
<pitti> seb128: right, I don't particularly mind
<seb128> pitti, if you have a custom.conf in the gdm binary upgrade will install the new version on disk no?
<pitti> the postinst coudl create one for having a template for the user to change
<pitti> seb128: that would be a conffile
<slomo> seb128: hi :)
<seb128> <pitti> mvo_: perhaps we should not make custom.conf a conffile in the first place?
<seb128> pitti, I'm not sure to follow the discussion ;-)
<pitti> seb128: right; it's currently a conffile, which causes the dpkg prompt
<seb128> slomo, hey, is https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/totem/+bug/402221 a known issue?
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 402221 in totem "[Karmic ] GstDecodeBin2: This appears to be a text file" [Undecided,New]
<pitti> so if we make it a normal config file, handled by postinst, we avoid the prompt
<seb128> pitti, ah right, that would work too
<seb128> though I'm in favor of as little postinst work as possible
<pitti> seb128: operationally it's pretty much the same, but providing a default is easier for admins to change, IMHO
<pitti> right
<seb128> ie if having no config in the package and no postinst magic is possible the better
<pitti> it's possible
<seb128> we could still have an example config in /usr/share/something
<pitti> but right, once Robert implements the GUI for configuring gdm, we would have had the same problem again
<pitti> seb128: *nod*
<seb128> pitti, why? there is no conffile prompt if you don't have a conffile
<seb128> is custom.conf would be an user written data
<seb128> not something managed by a package
<pitti> seb128: right, I meant "with the current version'
<pitti> i. e. it doesn't matter how the file is named, we'd have the same problem with a conffile
<pitti> -> conffile is bad
<seb128> right
<seb128> so let's not ship any custom.conf at all
<seb128> and let the gdmsetup write one
<pitti> mvo_, seb128: so we should fix .install to instlal /etc/gdm/custom.conf into /usr/share/gdm/examples/ ?
<seb128> +1
<mvo_> pitti: sure, we can do that too
<slomo> seb128: one moment
 * mvo_ changes bzr
<pitti> mvo_: ah, you already changed it; nevermind
<seb128> well just change the rules line to a mv one
<seb128> easy enough ;-)
<pitti> omph, nasty typo, thanks for fixing
<mvo_> yeah, just go ahead
<slomo> seb128: not known but interesting, thanks :)
<seb128> slomo, do you want me to bugzilla it?
<mvo_> should it still be uploaded even though we are in the freeze?
<pitti> mvo_: yes, I think so
<seb128> mvo_, ask pitti, I tend to be liberal about small fixes during soft freezes
<pitti> target of opportunity, and it's not intrusive
<pitti> and fixes upgrades
<seb128> but that's only me I don't want to recommend that to everybody ;-)
<slomo> seb128: yes, might be a totem bug though but first file it on gst-plugins-base
<seb128> slomo, ok, doing that
<mvo_> ok
<pitti> things to avoid now: polkit-1 migration and soname breaks
<pitti> things encouraged: fix RC bugs and other bugs which don't change package structure and are tested
<slomo> seb128: oh wait
<pitti> mvo_: please go ahead; I'm a bit busy with alpha-3 stuff
<mvo_> pitti: sure, can do
 * pitti hugs mvo_, thanks for the fixes
<slomo> seb128: http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=587704
<ubottu> Gnome bug 587704 in gst-plugins-base ""GstDecodeBin2: This appears to be a text file" error when playing files from a samba share" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<mvo_> np
<pitti> mvo_: oh, and thanks for adopting gdm :-P
<mvo_> *muuuraaagghhh*
<seb128> slomo, doh, just opened a bug so closing it now
 * mvo_ crawls under a rock
 * pitti watches mvo_ run away screaming
<slomo> seb128: sorry but at least you have bug closing powers :)
<pitti> mvo_: so you did an upgrade test to current karmic? how bad is it?
<seb128> slomo, no problem ;-) you don't?
<mvo_> pitti: suprisingly good actually
<mvo_> pitti: just the conffile prompt during the upgrade
<seb128> slomo, comment added upstream on the other bug and new one closed, thanks!
<mvo_> pitti: no errors, it still boots afterwards
<slomo> seb128: i do but often i have to close bugs where the reporter writes a comment that it can be closed ;)
<pitti> mvo_: nice, can you please add that to http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/test/2808 ?
<seb128> slomo, btw do you know if anybody fixes libmms issues? got another totem crasher due to it
<mvo_> pitti: adding it now
<slomo> seb128: i don't know, at some point upstream was dead, then someone else took it. no idea if someone is maintaining it currently
<seb128> slomo, ok
<seb128> mvo_, congrats on take over gdm btw ;-)
 * mvo_ is still hidding under a rock
<mvo_> oh, we even have system/shutdown back :) ?
<seb128> mvo_, you have been living under this rock for how long now? ;-)
 * seb128 hides
<mvo_> seb128: I tend to shutdown my machine with "sudo halt" :)
<seb128> as all real men do? ;-)
<mvo_> seb128: but thats great to have it back
<pitti> well, that certainly works :)
<pitti> real men yank out the power chord
<pitti> and have journalling
<seb128> mvo_, it's temporary until the slack^Wdxteam update fusa
<mvo_> :/
<seb128> mvo_, otherwise we would have no action to stop the box at all right now
<hyperair> pitti: yanking out my cord switches me to the battery! =p
 * hyperair uses gnome do to shut down
<pitti> not for me, I don't keep the battery in the laptop usually
<hyperair> hmm saving the battery life?
<pitti> yes
<pitti> constantly charging/discharging it isn't exactly helpful
<pitti> and even if it's fully charged, they still get a constant trickle of charging power
<mvo_> seb128: could you please have a look at the gdm bzr (just so that I don't upload with embarassing typos/thinkos or anything)
<pitti> I wish any notebook vendor would invent a simple switch to physically disconnect the battery without ahving to take it out
<seb128> mvo_, ok
<mvo_> pitti: I guess part of the problem is that this won't stop the heat from the machine to get to the battery
<pitti> mvo_: looks good to me
<mvo_> pitti: thanks!
 * pitti injects "debcommit -r" into mvo's brain
<didrocks> pitti: new merge proposal (https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~didrocks/python-distutils-extra/update_control_file/+merge/9090). Just to comment on the "erasing the entire debian/control", that's not what my code does. It's only updating the automated generated fields, leaving fields order or added fields pristine. Btw, I added the force-control switch :)
<pitti> didrocks: ah, nice
<seb128> mvo_, looks good to me too
<seb128> hey didrocks
<didrocks> hey seb128 (seems everyone missed my "good morning" on the chan two hours later ;))
<didrocks> (sorry, my "good morning" missed everyone... damn English ;))
<pitti> bonjour didrocks!
<didrocks> Guten Tag pitti :)
<seb128> slomo, any idea about https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/402773 too?
<chrisccoulson> good morning didrocks ;)
<didrocks> hi chrisccoulson
<mvo_> hey didrocks!
<didrocks> Guten Tag mvo_ (it's like a FIFO list with one element at each time ;))
<slomo> seb128: yes, fixed with gs-tplugins-base 0.10.23.3 (input-selector was needed by playbin2 but is in gst-plugins-bad)
<seb128> slomo, ok thanks
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 402773 in rhythmbox "gnome-codec-installer is not finding mp3 but rather looking for input-selector" [Low,Incomplete]
<seb128> slomo, ok thanks
 * didrocks hopes that KMS will soon enable less seb128 flickering :)
<seb128> didrocks, lol
<seb128> could the ubuntuone-client guys stop turning nautilus is a crash land?
 * seb128 reassign 3 new nautilus crashes to ubuntuone-client
<pitti> seb128: all dupes? should we set up a bug patterN?
<seb128> pitti, well those are new ones, doesn't help that none of the 15 retracing I looked at this morning all failed to give any debug symbol
<seb128> I'm wondering if the retracers are broken
<pitti> would be worth checking the log for one of the bugs, perhaps dbgsyms are missing
<seb128> pitti, well, that's over 6 different components now
<seb128> nautilus, gnome-media,ubuntuone-client,notify-osd, gedit
 * seb128 has a look to the retracer log
<seb128> nothing obvious in the log
 * seb128 logs into a amd64 karmic retracer
<seb128> what the?
<seb128> # ls /usr/bin/gnome-volume-control -l
<seb128> -rwxr-xr-x 1 1000 2552 144656 Jul 16 22:40 /usr/bin/gnome-volume-control
<seb128> # gdb /usr/bin/gnome-volume-control CoreDump
<seb128> ...
<seb128> /usr/bin/gnome-volume-control: No such file or directory.
<seb128> (no debugging symbols found)
<seb128> Core was generated by `gnome-volume-control'.
<seb128> Program terminated with signal 11, Segmentation fault.
<seb128> #0  0x00000000004100a3 in ?? ()
<seb128>  
<seb128> "No such file or directory."?
<pitti> seb128: fakechroot bug? try a relative path?
<seb128> # /usr/bin/gnome-volume-control
<seb128> ** (gnome-volume-control:5799): WARNING **: Cannot open display:
<seb128> # gdb gnome-volume-control
<pitti> but it might explain broken retraces
<seb128> /usr/bin/../lib/debug//usr/bin/gnome-volume-control: No such file or directory.
<seb128> gnagnagna
<pitti> gdb usr/bin/gnome-volume-control I meant
<seb128> /usr/bin/../lib/debug//usr/bin/gnome-volume-control: No such file or directory.
<pitti> I tried the apport chroot test suite on current karmic, it worked, but it doesn't cover everything
<seb128> I think retracers are officially broken
<seb128> should we comment the cron job?
<pitti> please just comment the karmic entry in chrootmap
<pitti> unless you are sure that juanty/hardy etc. are affected as well
<seb128> pitti, I will check that and comment the 9.10 line if jaunty is working
<pitti> seb128: thanks muchly
<seb128> you're welcome
<seb128> brb
 * pitti continues to fight with CD builds
<seb128> pitti, the jaunty retrace seem to work so I only commented karmic
<pitti> seb128: thanks
 * pitti blames fakechroot
<seb128> we will have to retag bugs once that's fixed, we have some hundred of failed retraced this week
<seb128> not the perfect time to enable apport by default
<pitti> seb128: ok, can you please give me a quick heads-up what you did? I'm done wrestling with CDs for now, and can look into this
<seb128> pitti, I just commented the 9.10 line for now
<seb128> to get the issue?
 * pitti logs into i386 chroot
<pitti> yes
<seb128> logged into a karmic amd64 retracer
<seb128> apt-get install gnome-media-dbgsym
<seb128> got a crashdump from a launchpad bug
<seb128> and tried to use gdb on it
<seb128> got the file no exist error
<seb128> where running the binary by hand works
<pitti> ah, you just downloaded the core dump, I guess?
<seb128> yes
<pitti> which bug#?
<seb128> I wanted to try if the coredump was working in gdb
<seb128> pitti, bug #402827
<ubottu> Bug 402827 on http://launchpad.net/bugs/402827 is private
<pitti> seb128: merci
<seb128> pitti, bug #402827
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 402827 in gnome-media "gnome-volume-control crashed with SIGSEGV in IA__g_closure_invoke()" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/402827
<seb128> set it public now it's only a mixer crash
<pitti> root@ronne:/# /usr/bin/gnome-volume-control
<pitti> /usr/bin/gnome-volume-control: /lib/libc.so.6: version `GLIBC_2.9' not found (required by /tmp/tmplPa6MR/usr/lib/libgio-2.0.so.0)
<pitti> meh
<seb128> was working for me
<seb128> or rather I was getting a no display set error
<pitti> I'm in the i386 chroot
<pitti> anyway, "gdb /usr/bin/gnome-volume-control" reproduces the problem perfectly well
<seb128> right
<seb128> I'm really clueless about how to debug such issues
<pitti> exec-file usr/bin/gnome-volume-control
<pitti> that works
<pitti> #($*#$ fakechroot *(*#$
<seb128> what is exec-file?
<pitti> in gdb
<seb128> doing gdb usr/bin/gnome-volume-control works
<pitti> same as $1
<seb128> but it doesn't manage to find the debug symbols then
<pitti> really? that doesn't even work here
<pitti> /usr/bin/../lib/debug//usr/bin/gnome-volume-control: No such file or directory.
<seb128> right
<seb128> that's what I mean
<pitti> 14937 stat64("/home/ubuntu-archive/apport-retracer-i386/chroots/karmic/usr/bin/gnome-mount", {st_mode=S_IFREG|0755, st_size=80860, ...}) = 0
<pitti> 14937 open("/usr/bin/gnome-mount", O_RDONLY) = -1 ENOENT (No such file or directory)
<pitti> so, it's not wrapped correctly
<seb128> that's all magic to me how that thing is working
<pitti> seb128: essentially, it is a preloaded library which wraps all libc calls like open(), stat(), etc.
<pitti> and prepends the fake chroot path
<pitti> but newer glibcs tend to introduce newer variants of calls, which fakechroot has to catch up with
<seb128> pitti, well it didn't change recently in karmic why does it break out of the blue now?
<seb128> ah ok
<pitti> glibc did change
<seb128> so it's doko's fault
<seb128> ;-)
<pitti> oh, nice
<Keybuk> EGLIBC BROKE OUR DEBUG PROCESS!
<pitti> it does work in a karmic dchroot
<seb128> Keybuk, right ;-)
<seb128> pitti, can we retrace jaunty bugs also there?
<pitti> seb128: that's what I'm going to check right now
<pitti> I wouldn't like yet another duplication of retracer setups
<pitti> I'm testing jaunty dchroot with intrepid/jaunty/karmic fakechroots now
<pitti> /CoreDump" is not a core dump: File format not recognized
<pitti> huh?
<pitti> oh, it's an amd64 core
<seb128> pitti, want a i386 one?
<pitti> looking
<pitti> meh, suddenly all bugs I'm looking at are amd64
<pitti> anyway, I'm fairly sure it works in the jaunty dchroot
<seb128> pitti, bug #402940
<ubottu> Bug 402940 on http://launchpad.net/bugs/402940 is private
<seb128> pitti, bug #402202
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 402202 in evince "evince crashed with SIGSEGV in cmsDoTransform()" [Medium,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/402202
<pitti> meh, no luck in karmic dchroot
<seb128> I would argue to have karmic working and break jaunty if we can have only one right now
<seb128> ie quick way would be to switch to karmic and comment jaunty
<pitti> right, if only karmic would work in the karmic dchroot
<pitti> but apparently it doesn't
<seb128> <pitti> oh, nice
<seb128> <pitti> it does work in a karmic dchroot
<seb128> ?
<pitti> I tested that with /usr/bin/gnome-mount
<seb128> ah
<pitti> hrmpf
<pitti> seb128: is there a bug for the two mixer applets already?
<chrisccoulson> 2 mixer applets? or 1 mixer applet and 1 g-v-c-applet?
<chrisccoulson> i'm sure i've seen a bug for that
<chrisccoulson> pitti - bug 401294
<pitti> well, applets, notifications, etc.
<seb128> pitti, you seem to be strongly annoyed by that one ;-)
<chrisccoulson> bug #401294
<chrisccoulson> hmmmm
<pitti> seb128: I need it for the release notes
<seb128> chrisccoulson, bot is being slow recently
<pitti> seb128: it seems fixing that for new installs/live images is trivial, it just needs a solution for upgrades?
 * hyperair tossed the panel applet away
<pitti> thanks
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i was just about to ask if the bot was sleeping ;)
<hyperair> the other one went into the notification area didnt it?
<seb128> pitti, right, I'm still not clear what we should be doing
<chrisccoulson> should we not just disable the mixer applet in gnome-applets?
<pitti> well, if the pulseaudio notification icon is the new thing, then we should use it
<seb128> pitti, the switch to the new capplet in karmic renewed the oem complains about lack of feature in this version
<pitti> and disable the old applet by default
<seb128> pitti, so I'm trying to not run into things which will make a potential rollback harder
<pitti> I see
<pitti> (that's a separate issue, though, isn't it?)
<seb128> I'm still not sure how much oem need things which are not working
<chrisccoulson> should we not try to get these missing features in to the new applet?
<seb128> and what we can do for karmic
<chrisccoulson> rather than shipping 2
<seb128> chrisccoulson, nobody said we should ship 2, I'm just trying to not wipe the applet from configs if we are going to roll back
<pitti> but both applets bring back the very same dialog?
<seb128> yes, the capplet is orthogonal
<seb128> it's just than we can roll back to the previous capplet quite easily
<seb128> but once the applet has been cleaned from the user config it will not be added again automatically
<james_w> why is it a notification icon now?
<james_w> isn't an applet better?
<seb128> james_w, I expect because the redhat guys don't have applet in their gnome-shell world
<james_w> s/better/preferable/
<james_w> hmm
<pitti> seb128: right, but the upgrade issue is a bit less distracting than new installs/live systems
<pitti> anyway, I'll release-note it
<seb128> pitti, I think you are making a bigger deal of that that it is, ie it's mainly visual glitch
<seb128> which is expected from an alpha version anyway
<seb128> we had the issue for several jaunty alphas too
<pitti> right, but I expect duplicates to be filed
<pitti> so I'd like to point it out as a known issue
<seb128> right, makes sense
<james_w> given that they launch the same dialog, why not just use the applet anyway?
<james_w> I guess it's unsupported now?
<seb128> james_w, well the applet doesn't control pulseaudio directly I think
<seb128> james_w, my understanding is that alsa mixer should be set to max and pulseaudio used for control
<james_w> ok
<seb128> having a mixer changing alsa volume break that model
<pitti> ok, I applied an apport workaround to the i386 karmic fakechroot, testing
<seb128> pitti, you are a superstar ;-)
<pitti> meh
<pitti> seems I'm not :/
<pitti> bug 402972
<seb128> no bot
<pitti> crappy retrace again
<pitti> oh, wait
<pitti> no nautilus dbgsym for 2.27.4
<pitti> we lose
<seb128> ?
<seb128> how come
 * pitti wants soyuz ddeb support
<seb128> pitti, they are on http://ddebs.ubuntu.com/pool/main/n/nautilus/ weird
<pitti> so index generation failed; I'll trigger a rebuild
<seb128> oh, not the ubuntu2 version
<pitti> but I'll apply/test the workaround for amd64 first
<didrocks> yeah, -ubuntu2 dbgsym failed for i386, lpia and powerpc
<didrocks> (armel too)
<pitti> meh, not my day today
<seb128> didrocks, how "failed"?
<pitti> failing desktop CD builds, failing ddebs, failing fakechroot
<pitti> time for holidays
<didrocks> I just looked at ddebs. I'm heading to LP
 * seb128 hugs didrocks
<seb128> didrocks, right, I figured so far that they were not there ;-)
<seb128> dpkg-deb: building package `nautilus-dbgsym' in `../nautilus-dbgsym_2.27.4-0ubuntu2_i386.ddeb'.
<didrocks> seb128: oh sorry, read too fast and missed your "<seb128> oh, not the ubuntu2 version"
<seb128> pitti, can you check if those have been stored where they should but just not moved?
<seb128> pitti, where I those stored and where is the code running again?
<seb128> I know I had a look during some distro sprint but didn't take notes
<pitti> seb128: macaroni.ubuntu.com, ubuntu-archive, see crontab -l
 * pitti runs for d in 20090716 20090717 20090718 20090719 20090720 20090721 20090722; do ~/ddeb-retriever/ddeb-retriever $d; done
<seb128> pitti, thanks, looking
<seb128> ah that's it
<pitti> this should re-fetch all the ddebs from the last week
<seb128> previous time lp pages changed and parsing broke
<seb128> I remember now
<pitti> seb128: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-media/+bug/402827
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 402827 in gnome-media "gnome-volume-control crashed with SIGSEGV in IA__g_closure_invoke()" [Medium,New]
<pitti> seb128: it's not really nice, but at least it somewhat works again
<seb128> pitti, see you are a rockstart I knew it ;-)
<pitti> all the gstreamer packages are outdated, but that shouldn't really make a difference?
<pitti> seb128: well I think I leave it running for a while again
<pitti> seb128: please stop them again if they still wreak havoc
<seb128> pitti, no it shouldn't
<seb128> pitti, ok
<seb128> pitti, do you have magic to retrace everything which failed this week?
<pitti> no, that requires log parsing, collect the bug numbers, and using ./mass-tag.py
<seb128> pitti, will do that
 * pitti hugs seb128
 * seb128 hugs pitti back
<pitti> thanks; I need to get back to unf*** CD builds, I'm afraid
<seb128> Keybuk, hey
<seb128> Keybuk, could you do a bootchart with /usr/lib/nautilus moved away to compare with it being there?
<seb128> Keybuk, just to give us a clue about how much time in nautilus startup is being spent there
<seb128> by local testing it seems to take 3 seconds on a 8 seconds startup with empty cache
<pitti> http://ddebs.ubuntu.com/pool/main/n/nautilus/ has the current ddebs now
<pitti> regenerating package indexes now
<seb128> pitti, \o/
<seb128> another mysterious failure there but if that works now...
<pitti> well, let's see for how long
<pitti> I wish that apt-ftparchive wouldn't need a million years
<pitti> then I could run it more often and avoid dropping packages
<Keybuk> seb128: can I do it once I have the SSD-based Mini? that's the "official" benchmark
<seb128> Keybuk, yes sure, thanks
<seb128> I've just started looking at what is taking time nautilus start by using federico's printf and strace way
<mvo_> pitti: it takes a million years even with the db cache?
<pitti> yes
<seb128> pitti, hum, we install contact-lookup-applet by default, I think we can stop doing that
<seb128> hey rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> hi seb128
<seb128> mvo_, did you start working on porting synaptic to gtkbuilder?
<pitti> hey rickspencer3
<mvo_> seb128: yes, but just briefly, the glade code there is pretty old, I got a lot of error from glade-3
<seb128> urg
<mvo_> seb128: then I got a bit anoyed and did something else :)
<seb128> mvo_, how likely is it for karmic?
<seb128> mvo_, I'm just updating the GNOME3 spec
<mvo_> seb128: 50/50 - I would like to do it, but my workload is relatively big currently
<seb128> mvo_, ideally we want everything using gtkbuilder before ll
<mvo_> seb128: ll ?
<mvo_> lazy lizard?
<seb128> karmic+1
<seb128> yeah ;-)
<seb128> ie not having to use libglade in the default lts install would be cool
<pitti> seb128: oh? it's not part of gnome any more?
<seb128> pitti, gtkbuilder is what should be used now
<pitti> seb128: I meant contact-lookup-applet
<seb128> pitti, oh, it has never been
<mvo_> seb128: ok, I will bump priority, is there a list of stuff that needs to be ported?
<seb128> mvo_, don't, we have a good 8 months for it
<seb128> pitti, c-l-a didn't change since gutsy
<seb128> pitti, it gives an indication of how active upstream is ;-)
<seb128> and I don't know of anybody using it, the bug list also doesn't suggest it's a lot
<pitti> ok
<pitti> seb128: so, it saves us 29 kB :)
<seb128> lol
<seb128> well we can let if you want
<seb128> it's just on the "still use libglade" list
<seb128> and I was surprised to see we have it on the CD
<pitti> seb128: oh, let's kick it for uncruftification's sake
 * pitti unseeds
<pitti> seb128: done
<seb128> pitti, danke
<pitti> will be gone after alpha-3
<pitti> seb128: out of interest, how many libglade and libgnome rdeps do we still have on the default install now?
<pitti> (roughly)
<seb128> pitti, mvo: https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-karmic-gnome-3
<seb128> bottom of the whiteboard has the alpha3 current list
<seb128> "libglade default installation:"
<pitti> ah, thanks
<seb128> pitti, so after next GNOME updates round (ie next week) we should be around 7-8 of those to tackle
<seb128> pitti, so when not building the applet you get a message telling you that the mixer is not available in new GNOME at next login
<seb128> do we want that?
<pitti> for upgrades?
<seb128> yes
<pitti> it's a wart, but we can't leave it there forever
<pitti> seb128: but why wouldn't we build the applet?
<tedg> No, we don't want that.
<pitti> I thought we just want to disable it by default?
<tedg> The warning is not okay.
<seb128> pitti, how do you do that?
<seb128> tedg, you would just silently clean the config?
<pitti> seb128: oh, I thought it'd be a gconf schema change or so
<pitti> seb128: (at least for new installs)
<tedg> seb128: Either that or create a "NULL" mixer applet.
<seb128> tedg, well that's what the null applet do basically
<chrisccoulson> the null applet is what asks you if you want to remove it from your config i think
<seb128> not sure why they decided to display a message now
<tedg> seb128: Not cause an error on login ;)
<chrisccoulson> it would be easy to patch the null applet to remove from the config without asking
<seb128> it used to just clean the config I think
<seb128> tedg, it's not an error it's an information dialog telling you what is happening to your applet
<seb128> chrisccoulson, right, which is basically what I was asking, if we want to do that
<tedg> The problem is people who have home directories that are on different releases of Ubuntu.
<tedg> seb128: It reads like an error.  I wouldn't say it's informational at all.
<seb128> tedg, have you seen the dialog?
<pitti> well, it's confusing, since from the perspective of the user you still have it
<tedg> Yes, remember, I write all these little applets.  My panel config looks like crap.  I get all kinds of fun errors :)
<pitti> (yes, it's the pulse notification thing, but looks all the same)
<seb128> pitti, right, what I though
<chrisccoulson> what pulls in gnome-media on xubuntu?
<chrisccoulson> (sorry, i can't check right now at work)
<pitti> xubuntu-desktop -> xfce4-xfapplet-plugin -> gnome-applets -> gnome-media
<pitti> perhaps?
<pitti> oops, no, that's just a suggests
<chrisccoulson> it seems xubuntu users are getting gnome-media, which has gnome-volume-control-applet, which goes crazy when pulaeaudio is not available
<chrisccoulson> we should probably patch the desktop file to only start in gnome
<seb128> chrisccoulson, or add a recommends on pulseaudio
<seb128> since the mixer applet and dialog depends on it now
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - we could do i suppose. but the dependency on libpulse should be enough shouldn't it? or do we add a PA dependency for every application that uses it?
<chrisccoulson> or should libpulse depend on PA?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, the fact that you use libpulse doesn't mean you depends on pulse
<seb128> ie the old capplet was able to use gstreamer or alsa
<chrisccoulson> yeah, thats true actually
<seb128> but the new codebase apparently does require pulseaudio to be running to be useful
<chrisccoulson> well, it requires it to be installed. it doesn't need to be running, as it will automatically start it if it isn't
<chrisccoulson> but that's the issue with the high CPU usage
<seb128> right
<chrisccoulson> i did suggest a fix to upstream to lower the CPU usage, but i don't know if they'll consider it
<chrisccoulson> charlie-tca - how does gnome-media get installed on your xubuntu machine (what depends on it)?
<charlie-tca> I have no idea. Does alsa install it?
<chrisccoulson> i doubt it
<Laney> aptitude why gnome-media
<charlie-tca> metacity, gnome-session
<charlie-tca> gdm
<chrisccoulson> Laney - thanks - i didn't know that
<Laney> tis useful sometimes
<Laney> there's also whynot
<chrisccoulson> charlie-tca - thanks. that makes sense
<charlie-tca> You are welcome
<charlie-tca> Thanks, Laney
<chrisccoulson> it seems xubuntu currently uses half of gnome just for the login screen now
<charlie-tca> Yeah
<charlie-tca> I know...
<seb128> pitti, bug #401294 fix uploaded for new installs
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 401294 in gnome-applets "sound applet and notification icon create duplication" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/401294
<seb128> (ie removed the mixer applet from the default profile)
<pitti> seb128: yay, thanks
<pitti> seb128: should we keep the bug open for upgrades, though?
<seb128> pitti, the gnome-applets task is still open for that
<pitti> ah, I see
<seb128> pitti, I've the change to no build the applet I just need to silent the null applet cleaning the config on upgrade
<pitti> seb128: I need to rebuild the ubuntu desktops anyway (ecryptfs), so that might just make it
<seb128> pitti, I think retracers are still broken, should I stop those?
<pitti> seb128: *sigh* please
<seb128> pitti, they find the binaries now but not the debug symbol I think
<seb128> pitti, ie http://launchpadlibrarian.net/29390644/Stacktrace.txt
<seb128> for bug #402673
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 402673 in notify-osd "notify-osd crashed with SIGSEGV in tile_destroy()" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/402673
<pitti> seb128: so it seems it finds the executable file again, but not the debug symbols somehow
<seb128> pitti, right, similar to this morning when doing "exec-file usr/bin/binary"
<seb128> pedro_, fyi retracers are broken so don't touch crash bugs for now, ie stop cleaning crashdump we might be able to retrace later
<pedro_> seb128, got it, may you please ping me when they start working again?
<seb128> pedro_, will do!
<pedro_> seb128, thanks pal ;-)
<seb128> you're welcome ;-)
<seb128> pitti, we should install gnome-disk-utility by default btw
<seb128> pitti, it has been accepted as official GNOME 2.28 component
<pitti> seb128: ack
<seb128> asac, gnome-bluetooth and webkit have been accepted for 2.28
<pitti> seb128: please seed it (I'm @ phone)
<seb128> pitti, if you can do it quickly after your phone call please do, I will have a look otherwise but I didn't touch any seed for ages so I need to read documentation on where to get those again, etc
<pitti> seb128: ok, will do
<seb128> danke
<seb128> pitti, gnome-applets updated too to not build the mixer applet and clean config on upgrade
<pitti> seb128: wow, you rock!
<seb128> ;-)
<pitti> seb128: nice, the patch was just commenting out code in null-applet? interesting
<seb128> pitti, well the null applet is made to clean applets not built on upgrade, GNOME is just displaying annoying dialog at next login which I commented
<seb128> going to open a bug upstream for discussion now
<pitti> ah
<pitti> seb128: so that would affect other removed applets as well then?
<seb128> pitti, right, other applets in the list being inbox and cd player
<seb128> dunno what inbox is and cd player has no been built for years
<pitti> ah, it has an explicit list
<pitti> that sounds fine
<seb128> yes, it's in the null-applet.c
<chrisccoulson> i'm wondering if some of the other less useful applets should be removed?
<chrisccoulson> ie, battstatus, which uses a deprecated /proc/acpi interface, or HAL
<chrisccoulson> and modemlights seems to require network-admin, which is not installed by default anyway
<asac> seb128: ok. where is the announce?
 * pitti purges devicekit
<pitti> Keybuk: \o/
<seb128> asac, http://mail.gnome.org/archives/devel-announce-list/2009-July/msg00005.html
<seb128> asac, http://mail.gnome.org/archives/devel-announce-list/2009-July/msg00005.html
<seb128> ups
<Keybuk> pitti: you're updating DK-power before Î±3?
<pitti> Keybuk: no, but locally
<pitti> while I wait for infinity unbreaking live CD builds
<Keybuk> ah
<pitti> Keybuk: I added a Conflicts/Replaces devicekit to dk-p for cleanup love
<hyperair> is anyone familiar with gstreamer here?
<hyperair> it seems that the default installation of ubuntu has the alsa plugin used instead of the pulseaudio plugin.
<hyperair> this was a non-issue before, but now that we've got the volume control applet which integrates into pulseaudio, you get a lot of annoying output
<hyperair> in the case of banshee, it lists "mono" as the application, rather than showing a nice Banshee icon
<seb128> hyperair, slomo
<hyperair> ooh he's around today!
<hyperair> at least, his irc client is. =\
<mat_t> bryce: ping
<pitti> seb128: I just discussed some gnome-power-manager patches with hughsie and got a +1 for committing them; do you think you can be my commit bot for them?
<pitti> seb128: he said "just go ahead and commit trivial fixes, just consult me for UI/policy changes"
<seb128> pitti, seems a good opportunity for you to ask for commit rights to GNOME? ;-)
<pitti> heh, seems I should
<pitti> seb128: I'm currently doing a g-p-m patch review (while waiting for CD builds)
<seb128> you can probably have davidz vouching for you too
<pitti> seb128: I'll look at the procedure next week then
<seb128> pitti, http://live.gnome.org/NewAccounts
<pitti> seb128: can I throw three format-patches at you, and you commit them?
<seb128> pitti, yes
<pitti> tab opened, thanks
<pitti> doing them then
<seb128> pitti, I will go for dinner now but will commit that after dinner
<pitti> seb128: http://people.canonical.com/~pitti//tmp/gpm/
<pitti> tedg: is anything actually using gnome-power-manager-inhibit ?
<pitti> and what is it for, exactly?
<tedg> pitti: I do :)
<tedg> pitti: http://gould.cx/ted/blog/A_small_utility_you_probably_don_t_know
<pitti> tedg: ah, so it's not something other distro parts call?
<pitti> tedg: ok, thanks
<tedg> It came from a UDS session where people said that we couldn't do sleep by default because of command line apps.
<pitti> ah, thanks
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i've pushed the g-s-d changes now
<chrisccoulson> anyone know where i can find Jens Granseuer and what his IRC handle is? i can't see him on any channels i'm on, unless he has a really obscure IRC name
<Le-Chuck_ITA> Heya do you remember the discussion about pulseaudio+skype?
<Le-Chuck_ITA> there's a simple workaround which may be perhaps powered-up
<Le-Chuck_ITA> using "pavucontrol" one can go to the configuration tab, turn off the input and output of pulse, make a skype call, turn on input and output again and enjoy banshee again.
<Le-Chuck_ITA> the same for jack and thus ardour
<Le-Chuck_ITA> perhaps a simple control for this could be put in the default desktop, dunno, I tell you, you do whatever you please :)
<hyperair> interesting eh.
<hyperair> well skype + pulse worked nicely for me when i was in x86
<hyperair> but i'm getting a hell lot of underruns in x64.
<hyperair> i'm not sure whether it's something that changed in karmic or whether it's to do with x64.
<hyperair> the last time i used x86 was in intrepid.
<Le-Chuck_ITA> I constantly get underruns with pulseaudio+skype, but using alsa it works. As it's a buggy closed application, having it working is enough.
<Le-Chuck_ITA> But the problem is there also for jack apps so it's worth thinking about it
<hyperair> @_@
<hyperair> stupid skype.
<hyperair> if only ekiga worked properly through my uni's strange firewall
<hyperair> then i'd install it at home and use ekiga instead.
<hyperair> no wait, ekiga has underruns too.
<hyperair> i'm beginning to think it's the pulseaudio alsa plugin
<hyperair> rather than all the other apps
<hyperair> hell, even sdl can't access pulseaudio thorugh alsa
<Le-Chuck_ITA> ekiga works for me :) but I can't find a sip provider having a flat offer for the whole europe - but we are getting a bit offtopic
<Le-Chuck_ITA> and plus, ekiga is going to be replaced by empathy I suppose. And empathy-sip does not work at all for me.
<Le-Chuck_ITA> hyperair you know the drill: report the bugs! :)
<hyperair> hmm i haven't tried empathy sip
<Le-Chuck_ITA> bye for now
<rickspencer3> man, my day was going so smooth until about 1.5 hours ago, suddenly I was getting pinged from all directions!
<rickspencer3> </vent>
 * pitti stomps on rickspencer3's DSL cable
 * bryce pings rickspencer3
<bryce> (kidding)
<rickspencer3> heh
 * rickspencer3 pongs in random directions
<bryce> I've been pointing people at http://err.no/personal/blog/tech/2006-10-10-12-05_contentless_pings.html - I don't mind getting pinged a lot, it's just maddening when they don't say what they want :-)
<chrisccoulson> ping bryce
 * chrisccoulson runs
<rickspencer3> bryce: in terms of "contentless pings" it seems cultural
<rickspencer3> some channels seem to prefer it, and some channels it pisses people off
<seb128> hey rickspencer3, ping? ;-)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, he's on #control-center on irc.gnome.org usually but seems busy recently
<seb128> chrisccoulson, ie not often on irc
<seb128> pitti, ok thanks
<chrisccoulson> thanks seb128. i have another patch for him
<didrocks> Â« stop ping, make hugs Â»
 * seb128 hugs didrocks
 * didrocks hugs seb128 back
 * chrisccoulson hugs didrocks
 * didrocks hugs chrisccoulson too ;)
 * rickspencer3 gets set to install alpha 3 on my netbook - iso testing
<seb128> chrisccoulson, re, cf cleaning other old applets I think it's a good idea indeed
<seb128> chrisccoulson, could you email ubuntu-desktop@lists.ubuntu.com with a suggestion?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, i can do. i think it's only the 2 applets i've already mentioned so far
<james_w> anyone getting segfaults with gksudo?
<seb128> james_w, no
<james_w> just me then :-)
<james_w> I'll try and debug later
<pitti> james_w: again? :-)
<pitti> one broken sudo per day is clearly enough
<james_w> heh
<pitti> seb128: the current desktop CD is a work of perfection
<pitti> what should I complain about now?
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> gvfs crashes when connection to a ssh location there
<seb128> do you get that issue too?
<pitti> Mount(0): SFTP auf piware.de -> sftp://piware.de/
<pitti>   Type: GDaemonMount
<seb128> hum, k
<pitti> I opened my server bookmark and have nautilus
<pitti> how to reproduce now?
<seb128> well it works on my install but crash on current iso in kvm
<pitti> oh, trying
<seb128> just go on an empty workspace, ctrl-L, ssh://someip
<pitti> indeed, I get that too
<rickspencer3> pitti: ping
<rickspencer3> j/k
<rickspencer3> seriously, looks like the iso tracker is getting ticked off
 * pitti sends some flowers to rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> but need some testing for amd64 and server?
<pitti> I pinged the server guys (see #u-devel), they are on it
<rickspencer3> kewl
<rickspencer3> unr seems to be working fine, and someone else tested it while I was installing :)
<pitti> nice
<pitti> kubuntu netbook seems to be in some trouble, but by and large I hope that the images work now
<rickspencer3> ok
<rickspencer3> I'll try when I get back ... off to a lesson
 * rickspencer3 downloads kubuntu netbook iso
 * didrocks is going to get some rest now. Have a good evening/day everyone.
<pitti> good night everyone
<seb128> pitti, bug #403223 is the gvfs issue
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 403223 in gvfs "gvfsd-sftp crashed with SIGSEGV in strlen()" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/403223
<seb128> pitti, it crashes when the host is not known and it should display a dialog about it
<seb128> pitti, 'night
<chrisccoulson> good night pitti
<chrisccoulson> (few minutes too late ;))
 * chrisccoulson is not looking forward to another early start tomorrow
<seb128> chrisccoulson, do you get a free day in exchange at least?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - hopefully i'll finish before lunch tomorrow, if everything goes well
<chrisccoulson> but yeah, i will probably get some time off somewhere
<bryce> bleah, launchpad's out of service
<lajjr> well not out of service just read only..
<lajjr> for an hour.
<ajmitch> read only, except that you can't view bugs which is slightly annoying
<lajjr> yes I hear you, but upgrade is good.
<bryce> upgrades are fine, I just wish they didn't _always_ have to happen in the middle of my workday :-/  Esp. on the eve of an alpha release.
<lajjr> : -/ best done at night early morn..
<bryce> ok I'm done venting :-)
<lajjr> bryce it is good to vent sometimes.
<bryce> I am glad they have it available as readonly now.  But launchpadlib scripts still seem to get borked, unfortunately
<bryce> <class 'launchpadlib.errors.HTTPError'>: HTTP Error 503: Service Unavailable
<mat_t> bryce: hi
<mat_t> bryce: how possible do you think is it to use hw accelleration in the new gdm?
<rickspencer3> oh man
<rickspencer3> good morning robert_ancell
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, hi rick
<mat_t> hi robert_ancell, rickspencer3
<bryce> mat_t, depends
 * bryce waves to robert_ancell
<mat_t> rickspencer3: did "oh man" mean "it's way too late to think about it now dude"? ;)
<robert_ancell> hey bryce
<mat_t> bryce: go on
<rickspencer3> mat_t: it just makes me worry about what you have in mind
<rickspencer3> :)
<mat_t> :D
 * rickspencer3 is curious to hear
<mat_t> basically I'm wondering if we could use compiz as w-m
<mat_t> with all compiz effects normally available
<bryce> mat_t, in fact I recall some discussions early on about this
<rickspencer3> eh ... we can't reliably run compiz on the desktop after log in
<bryce> mat_t, but keep in mind compiz doesn't work for everyone
 * rickspencer3 thinks there are still many blacklisted cards
<mat_t> right, sure
<bryce> no, not many blacklisted cards anymore, just bugs here and there
<rickspencer3> sweet
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell: can probably speak to that ;)
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, I don't think there are any blacklisted cards in Karmic as I understand how the blacklisting works
<rickspencer3> that's great!
<bryce> in fact I think with either the current or next compiz update we'll be dropping the last two card blacklists
<robert_ancell> or that's the start of many bugs :)
<robert_ancell> bryce, that's already been released to Karmic
<bryce> it was just a couple 8xx cards
<robert_ancell> If you're running the latest Karmic then look at /usr/bin/compiz-manager, BLACKLIST_PCIIDS is empty and WHITELIST contains all the drivers
<rickspencer3> anyway, sorry to derail your question mat_t
<mat_t> bryce: so we could have a compiz-run option for most users and a non-composited fallback for example.
<rickspencer3> I'm not really trying to avoid it
<mat_t> rickspencer3: not to worry, that's why I'm here - to discuss it :)
<bryce> mat_t, well all of these are really !xorg questions to be honest
<mat_t> right
<bryce> yes, xorg can do it, the question is more of do you really want it ;-)
<rickspencer3> does it not take ages to load compiz?
<bryce> and then it's just a matter of wrestling gdm and compiz into compliance.  Nothing would need altered from xorg's perspective
<bryce> rickspencer3, yep
<mat_t> but we do load it at some point anyway
<bryce> mat_t, the other angle that I've seen discussed is using the compositing functionality in metacity
<mat_t> right
<bryce> which gives you less bling but (in theory) better performance and stability
<mat_t> basically, I'd like at least for the gdm window to fade in and out
<rickspencer3> mat_t: does changing the oppacity on a gtk window approach the effect you would like?
<mat_t> rickspencer3: that could do the job
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell: would that have a hope of working?
<robert_ancell> the opacity?
<mat_t> yes
<rickspencer3> right, like put a timer on that slowly changes the opacity
<rickspencer3> (I have no idea if this works in gtk, but does in dhtml ;) )
<mat_t> :)
<robert_ancell> I have never used it but I'd expect so.  Unless you are doing any complex effects standard GTK+ and metacity should be able to do a simple fade
<mat_t> that would be cool
 * rickspencer3 perhaps I could use quickly to quickly test that out?
<mat_t> robert_ancell: btw, did you have a chance to look at the comments I left under the gdm-config spec?
<robert_ancell> mat_t, I didn't see them, will have a look this morning when LP is back up
<mat_t> robert_ancell: so the plan is to access the config directly from gdm (not sure if that's a new decision though)
<robert_ancell> I think that's the best way of doing it - the gdm daemon already has a dbus interface to the config
<mat_t> robert_ancell: also, the recommendation was not to have the bg editable by the user, as it could cause "sudo-user conflict", basically the login screen should remain a "public space"
<robert_ancell> mat_t, not sure what you mean about sudo-user conflict?
<mat_t> robert_ancell: so it's easy to imagine a situation where two or more users share a machine, and one puts something in the login screen that others don't like :)
<robert_ancell> mat_t, sure - then how do we configure the background?  It could have different PK privileges
<mat_t> robert_ancell: I'd stick with one, neutral background
<robert_ancell> mat_t, I can just see the endless bug reports now... "Unable to configure login background" :)
<mat_t> robert_ancell: why?
<robert_ancell> mat_t, just because it can't be done!
<mat_t> oh I see what you mean
<mat_t> :)
<mat_t> was the bg easily configurable in the old gdm?
<robert_ancell> Well, in saying that we just need to point them to a forum post saying how to edit the config file
<mat_t> right
<robert_ancell> I'd support not having it easily user configurable - there's no sense in changing the background if you can't change the rest of the theme
<mat_t> exactly
<TheMuso> I thought gdm got its background from the GNOME wallpaper setting, which would be for the gdm user
<TheMuso> so that should be changable
<mat_t> robert_ancell: the time difference is crazy between us, it's 12am here :) I've got to head to bed...
<robert_ancell> mat_t, it sure is!  Thanks for the feedback, see you later
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, can you log in as the gdm user?
<mat_t> np, take care - drop me an email if you need anything!
<mat_t> 'night everyone
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-07-23
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: with sudo in a terminal possibly, but not sure really.
<TheMuso> The background could be set after the gdm user is created in the postinst.
<TheMuso> Or, that may be better done with the package that has the theme.
<TheMuso> hrm
<TheMuso> I am interested in doing this for studio as well, so I am giving this some thought.
<TheMuso> I think we need to abstract theme settings for gdm out somehow...
<TheMuso> So that derivatives can set things the way they want.
<pitti> Good morning
<TheMuso> Morning pittil.
<mac_v> hi.. all is alpha3 out?
<TheMuso> Not yet
<mac_v> TheMuso: ah... thanx... isnt it expected today?
<pitti> mac_v: right, but not that early yet
<pitti> need to wait until the USians get up, and do some announcement prep before
<mac_v> ok... ;p
<TheMuso> /c/c
<TheMuso> pitti: I see there are currently no studio alpha images on the tracker to test. Has the tracker even been updated for ubuntu/kubuntu etc images yet, or is it just studio that hasn't been updated?
<TheMuso> Sorry, should have asked that in -devel.
<didrocks> good morning o/
<seb128> good morning there
<pitti> hey seb128, hey didrocks
<seb128> hey pitti
<didrocks> hi seb128 and pitti
<seb128> lut didrocks
<pitti> seb128: can I ask you to be a patch monkey once more? http://people.canonical.com/~pitti//tmp/gpm/
<pitti> seb128: we are down to 5 distro specific patches now, plus one dubious one
<pitti> at the beginning of karmic we had some 25, it's much more manageable now
<seb128> pitti, sure
 * pitti hugs seb128
 * seb128 hugs pitti back
<pitti> seb128: cool, Richard added a gconf key for the suspend failure notification, so that patch of ours will become a trivial schema change now
<pitti> nice working with him
<seb128> you are doing a good job at working with upstream too ;-)
<pitti> thanks
<seb128> ie them being nice is mostly due to you rocking ;-)
<seb128> hey slomo
<slomo> hi seb128 :)
<pitti> hey slomo, how are you?
<seb128> slomo, I've been playing with totem and DVDs yesterday, works quite fine in karmic now
<seb128> slomo, I will try the one which has the sound issue with your patch a bit later today
<pitti> oh, speaking of totem, it's somewhat sad that the only video that we ship in example-contents doesn't get along with the default codecs :/
<seb128> slomo, one issue is that the sound, languages entries are not changing nor working ... is that a known issue?
<pitti> and searching for it fails and just says something like "gstreamer input blabla"
<seb128> pitti, the input thing should be fixed with the gstreamer syncs I did yesterday morning
<pitti> ah, cool
<seb128> pitti, are you sure you are uptodate?
<pitti> seb128: I didn't test it with the very latest ubuntu desktop CD
<pitti> will do again
<seb128> let me try
<seb128> brb switching to my laptop for testing that
<pitti> doing as well
<seb128_> pitti, the spirit of ubuntu one plays fine on the current iso there
<pitti> seb128_: confirmed; as usualy, you're ahead of me :)
<seb128_> lol
<seb128_> good to see if fixed ;-)
<seb128_> pitti, btw do you know if there is any move on the polkit devicekit-disks auth dialog at login thing?
<seb128_> pitti, the upstream bug didn't change for some weeks and davidz said he was blocking on landing his gvfs changes which he did since
<seb128_> ie could use a small nudge maybe?
<pitti> yeah, perhaps
<seb128_> pitti, seen on #commits
<seb128_> <CIA-1> martin.pitt * r9286af907243 gnome-power-manager/src/gpm-button.c: Make hotkeys work with modifiers
<seb128_>  martin.pitt * r70c79e645544 gnome-power-manager/data/ (2 files): Show .desktop files in XFCE, too.
<pitti> \o/
<pitti> seb128_: merci
<seb128_> you're welcome
<seb128_> now if somebody could fix gpm to not dim the light after 15 seconds not touching my laptop and not bring it back that would be nice
<slomo> hi pitti :) i'm fine but busy as always ;)
<seb128_> I don't get how that bug can be around for so long with nobody caring
<slomo> seb128: no idea if that's a known issue but the dvd language, etc selection needs some work in any case
<seb128_> I keep fighting the autodiming
<pitti> seb128_: new gdm is due on Monday, but I'm on vac; I'd like to do the update, but only on Wednesday, is that okay?
<seb128_> slomo, ok, and do you know if tracks should be listed in the playlist?
<mac_v> Amaranth: hi... in regards to your comment on bug 402821 , i'v added a comment , https://bugs.launchpad.net/hundredpapercuts/+bug/402821/comments/3 , do you foresee any problems ?
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 402821 in hundredpapercuts "Alt-Tab of a minimized window only shows icon" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 402821 in hundredpapercuts "Alt-Tab of a minimized window only shows icon" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/402821
<pitti> seb128_: since I want to re-do one of the patches to use the new gconf key which Richard just added
<seb128_> pitti, s/gdm/gpm ?
<pitti> seb128_: yes
<seb128_> pitti, no problem, nobody here is touching gpm usually
<Amaranth> mac_v: It's a hack that upstream will not accept
<seb128_> it was ted's and is not really maintained since
<pitti> seb128_: ah, so I guess it's stuck on me now :)
<seb128_> pitti, indeed ;-)
<seb128_> pitti, btw, http://git.gnome.org/cgit/gdm/commit/?id=384afa69ba2120a32f585fa419dd0fe0b3a8a23d
<seb128_> speaking about gdm
<slomo> seb128_: no, they're not listed in the playlist, that's intentional (you don't want to know about the tracks as they have nothing to do with the user visible structure of the dvd as seen in the dvd menu)
<seb128_> pitti, I think that's something you discussed with robert_ancell yesterday
<Amaranth> mac_v: currently such a hack would be easy to maintain (but somewhat difficult to implement) but if upstream gets active again it would be a load of work to maintain as well
<Amaranth> mac_v: Until upstream decides how to do it I don't see it happening
<mac_v> Amaranth: oh ... why they wont accept? or any links to discussions regarding this?
<Amaranth> mac_v: because it's a hack
<seb128_> slomo, ok, otherwise good work on gstreamer and totem to all of you who working on the changes, it works great ;-)
<pitti> seb128_: weird, shutdown/reboot works fine in gdm for me
<pitti> seb128_: but indeed we need it if we want to add gdm configuration to the gdm session, so great
<seb128_> pitti, probably because you have no user logged in
<mac_v> Amaranth: ah... ;) , could we do this in Ubuntu alone for now ?
<robert_ancell> seb128, interesting :)
<Amaranth> mac_v: the thumbnail plugin does it because the thumbnail plugin is controller by one person
<seb128_> hey robert_ancell
<Amaranth> mac_v: read everything I said
<robert_ancell> hey
<mac_v> Amaranth: oh ok...
<pitti> seb128_: ah, of course
<pitti> robert_ancell: hey
<seb128_> robert_ancell, I never know if you are still around, you are so quiet ;-)
<Amaranth> mac_v: If you want to implement such a hack and rebase it frequently go right ahead
<seb128_> going back to my desktop now
<robert_ancell> hey pitti
<Amaranth> mac_v: I suspect by the time you got it implemented in a way that wouldn't require poking it every time upstream makes any changes we'd have a proper solution
<Amaranth> mac_v: also, it uses a _lot_ of memory
<robert_ancell> seb128, I prefer to call it "sneaky"
<Amaranth> mac_v: fine in the thumbnail plugin since it isn't enabled by default, not so good in the default install
<Amaranth> mac_v: thus, hack :P
<mac_v> Amaranth: memory !  ok.. I'll see if i can work something out
<mac_v> ah... no thunbnails in default...  forgot that!
<Amaranth> mac_v: think 1MB or so for every window you have open
<mac_v> o.o
<Amaranth> and that's for a tiny 512x512 thumbnail
<Amaranth> iirc to get good looking thumbnails for the thumbnail plugin you have to boost it to 1024
<Amaranth> so 4MB
<mac_v> :(
<Amaranth> or maybe that was for the alt-tab switcher
<Amaranth> most likely
<Amaranth> such a hack was implemented in beryl
<Amaranth> the "proper" solution is to have minimize not unmap the window
<Amaranth> the wastes memory too and makes minimize kind of worthless though
<mac_v> Amaranth: the present behavior is actually not helpful... Also the M$ guys have done it, so i think we can do it better ;p ... i'll try to hack it and see if it doesnt eat memory... will report back *if* i get a good result
<seb128> robert_ancell, right ;-) how are you? enough things to do to keep you busy?
<Amaranth> mac_v: you could on-the-fly convert the thumbnails to png to save room, compiz has a png plugin (enabled by default) that could be used to display them again
<robert_ancell> seb128, busy at the moment.  Been bogged down getting my head around PolicyKit.  The links you guys sent yesterday were a big help, thanks
<Amaranth> mac_v: but you either have to hack core or each plugin needs to save a copy of the thumbnail
<mac_v> Amaranth: ah...  i think developing a separate plugin with such a behavior might be easier ;p
<Amaranth> mac_v: you still have to modify every plugin that wants to use it
<mac_v> :(
<seb128> robert_ancell, you're welcome
<Amaranth> mac_v: compiz and the plugins are so intertwined it becomes a bit of a pain maintaining such patches too
<Amaranth> mac_v: and of course you can at that point no longer forward most compiz bugs upstream
<seb128> I hate those blueprint whiteboard change emails
<seb128> they would send you the diff
<seb128> robert_ancell, what did you change in the gnome3 whiteboard? ;-)
<mac_v> Amaranth: could you comment this on the bug, for the record, this seems beyond papercut scope
<mac_v> pls
<robert_ancell> seb128, I checked on some upstream packages and one had gtkbuilder already applied in git :)
<robert_ancell> it was vino
<seb128> robert_ancell, ok thanks
<seb128> really not easy to read what changed launchpad just you the whole whiteboard text
<robert_ancell> yeah it doesn't email a diff does it?
<seb128> robert_ancell, no, just a "Whiteboard changed to" with the whole text
<pitti> perhaps the list should move to the wiki page itself?
<seb128> pitti, if I can stay away from wiki the better
<seb128> the thing is just so slow it's ridiculous and I manage to screw formatting all the time
<pitti> ok
<pitti> tagged bug reports might work better
<seb128> pitti, btw do you want me to change the whiteboard to have each package to change as a work item?
<pitti> with the wiki having a canned link to the list
<pitti> seb128: I don't particularly mind; don't waste too much time on it
<seb128> ok
<seb128> I need to chase mvo too
<seb128> he's using a weird simpleglade weird thing in his softwares
<seb128> he's a gtk hater or something ;-)
<seb128> not sure if we should look to convert this things to gtkbuilder
<seb128> or just make those applications use gtkbuilder directly
<Amaranth> mac_v: done
<pitti> I've seen this thing, but never used it myself
<pitti> pygtk is simple enough already :)
<seb128> same here
<mac_v> Amaranth: thanx :)
<seb128> especially loading glade files is no rocket science
<didrocks> we had some concerns yesterday with rick about quickly ubuntu-template licensing (not quickly core itself). As this code is copied and then modified by users to create their own project and we don't want to enforce GPL-V3 to them, what licence should we use? (we don't want to pollute the header of each .py files either and enable people to change it if needed). Bsd-like license would fit, how to make it non intrusive in headers?
<pitti> didrocks: public domain?
<pitti> BSD 2-clause should also work, yes
<mvo> seb128: hm?
<seb128> mvo, you use weird things in your softwares!
<seb128> mvo, you are a freedom hater I can tell it ;-)
<mvo> seb128: its a wonderful piece of technology ;)
<seb128> mvo, joke aside you have some weird wrapping class around pygtk glade apparently
<mvo> seb128: and makes porting trivial
<seb128> and I'm not sure what to do about it in this gtkbuilder world
<mvo> seb128: yeah, SimpleGladeApp - now there is SimpleGtkbuilderApp, just sed s/ the one with the other and your port is done
<seb128> switching applications from glade to gtkbuilder is trivial
<seb128> but switching all this magic I'm not so sure
<seb128> oh ok, didn't know that somebody did that already, good!
<mvo> switching with the wrapper is even more trivial ;)
 * seb128 hugs mvo
<mvo> seb128: take it from e.g. gebi
<mvo> seb128: what are you looking to port?
<seb128> mvo, right, I was expecting that, I just didn't know there was a wrapper yet for gtkbuilder
<seb128> mvo, language selector
<mvo> seb128: just go ahead :) if you have any questions, let me know
<crevette> hello
<seb128> mvo, ok, will do
<didrocks> pitti: do you have any example of headers for public domain license?
<seb128> lut crevette
<pitti> didrocks: not really; just say "This file is in the public domain", shouldn't that suffice?
<didrocks> pitti: I'm more up-to-date on gpl and CC licenses. If you say it should suffice, that's perfect ;) Thanks a lot
<pitti> IANAL
<didrocks> ok, I google it a little too to seek for examples :-)
<seb128> pitti, I know you have a really busy week but any chance you manage to fix the retracers today or give me some clues how to do so?
<seb128> would be nice to not waste all the alpha3 crashes now that apport is running by default
<pitti> seb128: I don't think it's that easy
<pitti> I would probably do something like this:
<pitti> - reproduce the issue locally in the apport/chroot.py test suite
<pitti> - strace the failed test run
<pitti> - add some debugging printf() into fakechroot's preloadlib, to see what it's doing
<pitti> - fix whatever is wrong
<pitti> it might be a new eglibc system call which needs wrapping (it's mostly a copy&paste thing)
<pitti> it seems a bit specific to gdb, so I'd pull the gdb source to check the code it uses for opening the binary and debug symbols
<pitti> seb128: an easier try would be to check if it works to use jaunty's gdb on karmic and apt-pin gdb for now
<seb128> pitti, ok thanks, seems not trivial, I might have a look but no guaranty
<seb128> that I can try
<pitti> seb128: perhaps try the gdb downgrade first
<seb128> doing that now
<seb128> pitti, otherwise what do you think about turning apport off again until retracers are fixed?
<pitti> the real fix sounds like a day of work, but I'm afraid I won't get to that until next week
<seb128> new GNOME is due on monday
<pitti> seb128: ok, let's do that if the gdb downgrade doesn't work, ok?
<seb128> ie we will probably outdate all the crash before they get retraced
<seb128> deal
<seb128> I'm trying the downgrade thing now
<robert_ancell> bye all
<pitti> bye rodrigo_
<pitti> oops
<seb128> he's quick to close IRC when he says bye
<seb128> pitti, jaunty gdb works!
<pitti> \o/
<seb128> so login --save, downgrade, apt-pin and close?
<seb128> and restart retracers?
<pitti> seb128: so, I guess rebuilding gdb against eglibc, or the new gdb itself changed something then
<pitti> seb128: right
 * pitti hugs seb128 for rescuing the retracers
<rodrigo_> pitti: bye, but I just arrived :)
 * seb128 hugs pitti for giving good hints
<pitti> then I can also remove my hideous and broken workaround
<pitti> hey rodrigo_ :)
<seb128> pitti, let me try on the amd64 one and restart it to see how it goes
<Ng> hmm, did I change some setting, or is firefox in karmic using a google custom search??
<Ng> -?
<Ng> it's all very well and good, but there are no links to cached versions of pages, which is a shame
 * pitti points Ng to asac
<asac> Ng: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/firefox-3.0/+bugs?field.searchtext=&orderby=-importance&search=Search&assignee_option=any&field.assignee=&field.bug_reporter=&field.bug_supervisor=&field.bug_commenter=&field.subscriber=&field.status_upstream-empty-marker=1&field.omit_dupes.used=&field.omit_dupes=on&field.has_patch.used=&field.has_cve.used=&field.tag=multisearch&field.tags_combinator=ANY
<asac> Ng: if your bug is not there, file one and add th "multisearch" tag please
<Ng> ok ;)
<Ng> -;)+:)
<asac> Ng: against ffox 3.0 (also add ffox 3.5 task)
<asac> Ng: thanks!
 * Ng confirms with a blank ff profile (mine is *very* far from default ff ;)
<asac> Ng: no need to. the "multisearch" extension was added for alpha3
<asac> Ng: disable the addon to get back to default behaviour
<Ng> asac: oh, I just looked at the extension list and completely failed to see it :/
<bryce> http://people.canonical.com/~bryce//upstreamer-0.png
<bryce> (tool to facilitate forwarding bugs upstream from launchpad to freedesktop)
<pitti> bryce: awesome!
<bryce> pitti: still a work in progress, but at least it looks nice finally :-)
<seb128> bryce, how does it work?
<seb128> bryce, does it take the launchpad description, etc?
<seb128> bryce, I start on a very basic one some time ago http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/lptognome.py
<seb128> that one takes a lp bug number, get the title, description, stacktrace and open a bugzilla page (GNOME) with title and description set
<seb128> it's done in a hackish way though, using ?title=... etc in the bugzilla url
<bryce> seb128, yeah what's in that screenie is unedited; that's what it generates after loading the bug #
<bryce> seb128, it grabs the description, title, submitter email address, attachments, etc. from the launchpad bug
<bryce> I've not done the logic to submit the multiple attachments to bugzilla yet though... that might be tough
<seb128> bryce, using greasmonkey?
<pitti> didrocks: "otherwise the effect will be drawned" -- what is that supposed to mean?
<bryce> in fact I've not tested it at all against bugzilla yet...
<bryce> seb128, no greasemonkey isn't powerful enough; this is a full cgi script
<seb128> ah ok
<seb128> any reason to do that in a web ui way?
<seb128> the version I started sucks because it's buggy but I sort of liked the "give a bug number and get the upstream bugzilla page prefiled with infos"
<seb128> ie I'm not sure we win anything to edit infos downstream, you can do that on bugzilla before clicking submit
<bryce> "any reason to do that in a web ui way?" > don't understand question
<bryce> ahh right
<seb128> bryce, your screenshot seems to indicate you do editing on the launchpad side
<seb128> where my approch was a "collect everything and open a bugzilla page prefiled with infos and edit there"
<bryce> the specific things this would save is that it parses/reformats the description, and it would allow you to select the attachments to be included via checkboxes, rather than individually having to download/upload each attachment individually
<seb128> that avoid the need for a server to run the forward tool ;-)
<seb128> I guess we are a different workflow
<seb128> GNOME bugs have almost never a file to attach
<seb128> and I inline stacktrace for easier bug reading and dup finding too
<seb128> ie what we usually need on GNOME bug is a copy of the description and the stacktrace if there is one
<seb128> but your tool seems powerful indeed ;-)
<bryce> ah yeah, your attachment situation is simpler (just the backtrace)
<seb128> well I like having logs inline in fact
 * bryce nods
<seb128> makes easier to read the bug and search in the page than having lot of logs
<seb128> but if you have lot of log that's doesn't really scale
<ara> seb128, gnometris is not longer a default game in ubuntu?
<bryce> true, however for X, Xorg.0.logs can be pretty long.  But I do like to put stacktraces inline.
 * seb128 declares victory on the retracer
<seb128> pitti, bug #403036 \o/
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 403036 in scim "scim-launcher crashed with SIGSEGV in scim::FrontEndModule::load()" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/403036
<pitti> seb128: *sniff* beautiful! /me wipes a tear
<seb128> pitti, ;-)
<pitti> that takes the pressure out of this thing
<seb128> right
<bryce> seb128, rickspencer3 also came up with a table to map launchpad importance to bugzilla priority/severity, so this does that mapping automatically
<seb128> will do the i386 one too now
<seb128> bryce, nice
<seb128> bryce, I expect you could easily add GNOME bugzilla to your service if the bugzillas behave the same way? ;-)
<seb128> pitti, want me to open a bug somewhere about the gdb situation, I'm not sure what the downgrade working tells us
<seb128> pitti, I will try on the i386 one the new gdb version from karmic which was built before eglibc to see if that makes a difference
<pitti> seb128: against fakechroot, please, as a reminder (assign it to me)
<seb128> ie if the issue started with the new gdb or after rebuild
<pitti> seb128: it would be interesting to see if it happens with jaunty's gdb built on karmic
<seb128> I can do some playing around that
<pitti> I rather suspect it's a glibc change, but it could be a gdb change as well (unusual open() )
<pitti> seb128: thanks
<seb128> you're welcome
<pitti> just throw it all in the bug report, I'll read it when I'm back from vac
<seb128> ok
<bryce> seb128, well I intend to focus just on freedesktop, but yeah most bugzillas work similarly.  I'd definitely accept patches to make it work against additional bugzillas.  Of course I'll have to prove it actually useful first :-)
<seb128> bryce, let me know when it's in a working state for fd.o I will have a look then
<seb128> thanks!
<bryce> sure :-)
<bryce> (unfortunately the tool is also slow...  python + launchpadapi != quick)
<bryce> (actually, it's mostly the attachment processing that slows it down)
<didrocks> pitti: hum, difficult to formulate... "Otherwise, we will be considered immediately outside of the current stenza". Is it clearer to you?
<didrocks> pitti: thanks for the merge
<pitti> didrocks: I just removed it, the code should be clear enough
<pitti> didrocks: I have another MP, after that I'll do a new upload
<didrocks> pitti: thanks :)
<didrocks> pitti: before you release, think about udpating python-distutils-extra version from 2.7 to 2.8 in debian/local/python-mkdebian
<pitti> didrocks: yep
<seb128> dpkg-source: info: applying gdb_6.8-3ubuntu2.diff.gz
<seb128> *** stack smashing detected ***: patch terminated
<seb128> ======= Backtrace: =========
<seb128> /lib/libc.so.6(__fortify_fail+0x4b)[0xf7f2b97b]
<seb128> /lib/libc.so.6(__fortify_fail+0x0)[0xf7f2b930]
<seb128> /home/ubuntu-archive/apport-retracer-i386/fakelibs/libfakechroot.so[0xf7f9fb44]
<seb128>  
<seb128> pitti, going to be trickier than expected, I think I will just downgrade, pin and restart for now
<seb128> I can't dpkg-source -x the jaunty gdb in the retracer environment
<pitti> wow
<seb128> grrr
<seb128> ubuntuone-client starts being very annoying
<seb128> they fixed a nautilus crashed but in exchange of a new one apparently
<seb128> pitti, and i386 retracer running and confirmed to do proper retracing
<pitti> seb128: good job, thanks!
<seb128> you're welcome
<seb128> thanks for the tips on how to get those running again
<seb128> pitti, oh, are SegvAnalysis and SegvReason new?
<seb128> I never noticed those before
<pitti> seb128: yes, courtesy of kees
<seb128> nice
<pitti> he does some analysis from the disassembly
<pitti> didrocks: 2.8 uploaded to sid, karmic, jaunty and hardy PPA
<seb128> slomo, the gstreamer change you suggested didn't fix the dvd sound issue
<mac_v> seb128: : hi... the recent update seems to have removed the volume applet and left the notification icon... is that change to stay?
<seb128> mac_v, yes
<seb128> mac_v, as described in the update changelog
<mac_v> seb128: and the volume slider is only going to move up-down?
<seb128> mac_v, that I know
<seb128> you would expect it to be a 3d clutter cube moving in the z axis too?
 * mac_v confused
<mac_v> seb128: actually i asked since there was a bug asking for the slider to be up-down rather than horizontal
<seb128> mac_v, good, one bug to close then
<mac_v> :)
<seb128> mvo, any idea how gksu crashes can have vorbis code in their stacktrace?
<seb128> ie bug #403005
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 403005 in gksu "gksu crashed with SIGSEGV" [Medium,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/403005
<lool> seb128: Mind syncing devhelp to fix the FTBFS?
<mvo> seb128: no :)
<seb128> lool, will do
<lool> seb128: gksu invoking gstreamer to check for codecs?
<seb128> mvo, doh, gksu have over 100 bugs in launchpad and lot of recent crasher looking corruption
<lool> Or gksu invoking update-manager invoking gstreamer in a postinst
<seb128> lool, because a sudo wrapper need codecs to be fun to use? ;-)
<lool> :-)
<lool> seb128: thakns for the sync
<seb128> you're welcome
<didrocks> thanks a lot pitti :)
<seb128> hey pedro_
<seb128> pedro_, retracers are fixed and running again now
<pedro_> seb128, yay! thanks for the info ;-)
<pitti> seb128: dude!
<seb128> pitti, alter!
<pitti> bug 123020, look at the status
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 123020 in soyuz "support shipping verbatim files in the exported tarballs" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/123020
<seb128> \o/
<chrisccoulson> good afternoon everyone:)
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hi pitti
<kenvandine> hey pitti
<kenvandine> i just got the update of devicekit-power from the ~ubuntu-desktop ppa
<kenvandine> it seems to have broken suspend
<kenvandine> not sure if it was the removal of devicekit or the changes to devicekit-power that broke it
<pitti> kenvandine: devikekit shouldn't matter, it's not used any more
<pitti> probably dk-power
<pitti> kenvandine: did you reboot after update? or sudo killall devkit-power-daemon ?
<kenvandine> i did reboot
<kenvandine> gnome-power-cmd suspend
<kenvandine> says i can't suspend
<kenvandine> pitti, i am happy to help debug... but it isn't urgent... just wanted you to know it might be broken before you move it to karmic :)
<pitti> kenvandine: does gnome-power-manager work? I don't think -cmd still works
 * kenvandine is hacking on desktopcouch atm... which is rather fun :)
<kenvandine> pitti, -cmd has been working
<pitti> kenvandine: ok, thanks for the warning; I'll test it here as well
<kenvandine> i use it all the time
<kenvandine> i don't get an option to suspend on shutdown either
<pitti> kenvandine: http://git.gnome.org/cgit/gnome-power-manager/commit/?id=c5e34acfbc1b57903bb18d84575b1beaa67e3344
<pitti> kenvandine: right, neither do I; I think this needs a new gnome-power-manager (port to polkit-1 as well)
<kenvandine> probably
<pitti> porting the bakcend (dk-p) without the frontend (g-p-m) won't work, I figure
<kenvandine> makes sense
<pitti> kenvandine: probably needs http://git.gnome.org/cgit/gnome-power-manager/commit/?id=af19ef18b93abb7f92cb6b1345cf4c633e6f8513
<kenvandine> the notify-osd patch was accepted to g-p-m the other day :)
<pitti> kenvandine: anyway, new g-p-m will release next Monday
<pitti> kenvandine: hm? I just did a g-p-m patch cleanup with Richard, and he rejected it
<kenvandine> oh?
 * kenvandine looks again
<pitti> "better not apply until this is official gnome"
<pitti> kenvandine: I committed some of our patches to upstream, and removed some obsolete ones
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson, manager to finish work at a reasonable hour after your early waking up today? ;-)
<seb128> dobey, kenvandine: could somebody look at ubuntuone-clients bug and try to bump priority on fixing nautilus crashers there?
<pitti> kenvandine: anyway, new g-p-m is due on Monday, I'll package it on Wednesday when I'm back, and test it together with the new dk-p
<seb128> dobey, kenvandine: 80% of the nautilus crashes we get are due to ubuntuone issues
<kenvandine> sure
<seb128> thanks
 * kenvandine goes searching
<dobey> seb128: the only crash i am of aware of being in ubuntuone is fixed. if there is another one, i don't know how to make it happen
<seb128> dobey, are you subscribed to ubuntuone-client ubuntu?
<seb128> dobey, the usual way when you "don't know how to make it happen", is to ask details to users, not to ignore the bugs
<dobey> seb128: yes, and i see the reports, but there is no explanation of what is happening
<seb128> dobey, they several crashes in g_object_unref with debug stacktrace sitting there
<kenvandine> pitti, looks like richard did merge that patch... after rewriting it
<kenvandine> bratsche: have you checkout out git master for g-p-m?
<pitti> kenvandine: oh? http://git.gnome.org/cgit/gnome-power-manager/commit/?id=d2251e9373add05113623c0a812a86bdd35d9116 looks related, but it doesn't look like notify-osd
<kenvandine> http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=423186
<ubottu> Gnome bug 423186 in gnome-power-manager "Battery info shouldn't be a notification" [Minor,Resolved: fixed]
<kenvandine> commit 3c721b77404f59e23ab712c099b0c179fd1e491c
<pitti> well, so much the better
<kenvandine> yup
<pitti> kenvandine: ah, *that* patch
<kenvandine> i'll try to make sure it does the job before he releases
<pitti> I meant http://bazaar.launchpad.net/%7Egnome-power-manager-team/gnome-power/trunk/annotate/head%3A/debian/patches/02-notify-osd-support.patch
<kenvandine> oh... that is different :)(
<kenvandine> he won't take that
<kenvandine> seb128, wow... there are alot of crashers
<kenvandine> lots are old
<seb128> kenvandine, yes :-(
<seb128> would be nice to send back the way the message that software quality is important
<seb128> ie somebody should look at crashers
<kenvandine> yup
<chrisccoulson> hey seb128 - yeah, i managed to finish work at lunchtime today:)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, good ;-)
<chrisccoulson> i might sleep for a bit this afternoon ;)
<seb128> good choice
<kenvandine> seb128, is there an easy way to find all the crashers for people with u1 installed?
<seb128> kenvandine, no
<kenvandine> figured :/
<seb128> kenvandine, I reassign the nautilus one by looking at the stacktrace
<kenvandine> ok, so you have been assigning them to u1?
<seb128> kenvandine, ubuntuone-client source package on launchpad yes
<dobey> it would be nice if the nautilus apport hook figured out what packages provide nautilus extensions, and ran the apport hooks for all of them as well
<kenvandine> ok
<dobey> (and same for any other packages which provide some pluggable interface)
<seb128> dobey, that should be doable I think, maybe pitti has some pointer on that
<dobey> then at least i could tell which versions of what everyone is using, without having to ask individually and hope that they actually respond
<seb128> dobey, the g_object_unref crash are using the current karmic version for sure
<seb128> but yes, that would be nice to have the versions for everything shipping something in /usr/lib/nautilus
<pitti> dobey: good idea
<seb128> dobey, btw
<seb128> dobey, apt-cache showsrc gnome-python-desktop
<pitti> right, the nautilus apport package hook could just iterate over the plugin directory, find the package with apport.packaging.get_file_package(file), and then call apport.hookutils.attach_related_packages(report, package_list)
<seb128> dobey, karmic has each component splitted in a binary, and the only reason we still have python-gnomeprint and libgnomeprint* on the CD is ubuntuone-client
<pitti> u-c uses gnomeprint??
<dobey> seb128: ok, i didn't know it was split already in karmic
<dobey> no
<seb128> dobey, that's why I opened the bug ;-)
<seb128> I was looking at why we still had libgnomeprint* on alpha3
<seb128> pitti, no, it depends on python-gnome2-desktop rather than python-gnomekeyring etc
<dobey> how do i specify the python depends correctly then? since dpkg doesn't seem to pick it up
<pitti> aah
<seb128> pitti, so it triggers python-gnomeprint which depends on libgnomeprint*
<pitti> seb128: right, I understand
<seb128> dobey, add the ones you need in the Depends line of control
<seb128> there is no magic that I know to make the list
<dobey> seb128: there isn't some special ${python:Blah} thing?
<seb128> grep for the import in your source and look at the matching binaries
<seb128> not that I know no
<dobey> :(
<seb128> there is no real way to guess depends with python
<seb128> ie you could grep for imports but you don't know if you will find code used or example or things not built, etc
<dobey> eh? the way rpm does it works fine afaik
<seb128> dobey, which is?
<seb128> rickspencer3, hey
<pitti> phew, a3 is done
<dobey> seb128: but i guess i can do (python-gnomekeyring || python-gnome2-desktop) right?
<pitti> rickspencer3: good morning
 * seb128 hugs pitti, good work!
<rickspencer3> hi seb128 and pitti
<seb128> dobey, yes
<seb128> dobey, or rather |
<seb128> "depend | alternative"
<rickspencer3> seb128: empathy has had the weird habbing of starting up with my user name set to someone else :(
<rickspencer3> yesterday I was Cody
<seb128> rickspencer3, urg?
<seb128> waouh, that's weird
<rickspencer3> today I was Quintasan
<didrocks> rickspencer3: was it the last person you talked with?
<dobey> seb128: it greps the installed python files for imports, and adds Requires: Python:module or something like that, and all the python module packages end up doing Provides: Python:module or similar
<rickspencer3> didrocks: nope
<rickspencer3> it seems pretty f'ing random
<rickspencer3> :)
<dobey> seb128: it also does similar things for PERL, C#, etc...
<seb128> dobey, well you will get depends coming from examples or code you are not using, etc
 * rickspencer3 will log bug this morning
<dobey> seb128: i think it skips $docdir and only looks in binary/lib/whatever
<seb128> everybody hug pitti for getting alpha3 out
<seb128> pitti, \o/ ;-)
<dobey> seb128: i already have lots of dependencies for code i don't use, anyway... :)
<rickspencer3> congrats pitti
<rickspencer3> nice job, a very solid releas
<pitti> thanks :)
 * didrocks hugs pitti 
<dobey> like the majority of kernel modules installed on my system
<rickspencer3> this alpha is better than final releases for certain other distros I could mention, but won't ;)
<seb128> dobey, I think there is some ongoing work to do a depends system this way in debian, didn't follow what they do recently though
<seb128> rickspencer3, you just went to far and are not credible now :-p
<bratsche> kenvandine, no I haven't, why?
<seb128> too
<dobey> hrmm
<rickspencer3> lol
<kenvandine> bratsche: he asked for you to test it :)
<dobey> i just installed ubuntuone-client-gnome from karmic proper and did nautilus --quit like 15 times with no crashers :(
<bratsche> kenvandine, oh he did?  I missed that. :)
<kenvandine> he rewrote your patch :)
<seb128> dobey, there could be a difference between a proper --quit and a GNOME session close
<bratsche> Yeah, I knew he rewrote the patch because he rewrote that entire source file or something.
<dobey> seb128: well i got a crash with trunk, but the line #s are different betwen that and the reports, so i can't tell who is running what, and where the crash actually is... even with trunk gdb is telling me the crash is in the line in class_init(), which is obviously wrong
<dobey> blah, now i can't make trunk crash
<seb128> pitti, https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.tag=gnome3-gtkbuilder
<fta> how do i prevent a user from appearing in the new gdm?
<fta> lower uid?
<pitti> seb128: ah, nice! much easier to read/autoclose
<dobey> ugh, now rhythmbox requires brasero :(
<mvo> seb128: is there a supported way to hook into the gnome-session logout process (asking for  the updates on shutdown spec)
<seb128> mvo, not idea, maybe vuntz or chrisccoulson know better
<seb128> pitti, around? I've some build issue and I think it's due to python-distutils-extra
<mvo> thanks, I keep wondering if it shouldn't just start its own xsession or something
<seb128> mvo, start a new session on logout?
<mvo> yeah, a empty one with just the unattended-upgrade-gtk process
<seb128> mvo, you could as well patch gnome-session?
<chrisccoulson> mvo - i don't think there's currently anyway to do what you want to do (without patching gnome-session)
<mvo> thanks chrisccoulson and seb128 - when I finished with the actual code, I look into it
<rickspencer3> hi
 * rickspencer3 feels like himself again ;)
<seb128> wb rickspencer3
<seb128> pitti, unping that was an issue there
<dobey> oh, thanks apport for automatically ignoring nautilus crashing :(
<seb128> it ignores after 3 crashes
<seb128> to not send the same crash 3 zillion times
<dobey> unfortunately apport is the only way i can debug nautilus
<dobey> how do i make it not do that?
<seb128> dobey, clean /var/crash
<seb128> dobey, the counted is in the .crash
<dobey> thanks
<pitti> seb128: hi
<seb128> pitti, hello again ;-)
<awe> /away break
 * seb128 ported usb-creator to gtkbuilder
<MacSlow> anybody running kwin or xfce here?
<seb128> MacSlow, not me
<rickspencer3> MacSlow: try in #kubuntu-devel, likely to be running kwin there
<MacSlow> rickspencer3, bingo
<rickspencer3> MacSlow: really nice job on the notify-osd updates
<rickspencer3> looks great
<MacSlow> rickspencer3, well thanks.. but a lot of clean up is still to do
<rickspencer3> MacSlow: glass half full!
 * seb128 wants text he can read back
<seb128> otherwise good work ;-)
<MacSlow> seb128, I've the "green light" for gconf-keys sort of
<seb128> \o/
<MacSlow> rickspencer3, lazy bunch on #kubuntu-devel :)
<pitti> \o/ patch cleanup day
<pitti> yesterday gdm, now consolekit
<pitti> they committed all our patches (8), now just 4 debian patches left
<pitti> kenvandine: ah, just saw your couchdb patch; please test it, while dpkg usually retains permissions, it might not do that for conffiles (they are magic and special in lots of ways)
<pitti> kenvandine: so while the fix is correct, it might not fix the issue on upgrades (that'd need a postinst snippet)
<pitti> I'm off for today, and on holiday until next Tuesday
<pitti> have a nice weekend everyone, and try not to break everything so hard :-P
 * pitti -> packing
<pitti> I'll disable my IRC proxy, so please give me a phone call on urgencies; I'll also look into my mail every day
<seb128> pitti, enjoy!
<seb128> pitti, don't worry we will watch for you while you are not there ;-)
 * pitti hugs the team
 * seb128 hugs pitti
<fta> rah, just lost of 3 pages email because evolution crashed on me, damn spell checker
<fta> bug 386139
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 386139 in evolution "evolution crashed with SIGSEGV in free() when spell check replaces words (dup-of: 389101)" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/386139
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 389101 in evolution "evolution crashed when correct new message" [Unknown,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/389101
<fta> Fix released??
<pedro_> fta, the fix released status is coming from the upstream task not from the one in ubuntu
<pedro_> http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=584243#c4
<ubottu> Gnome bug 584243 in Editing "Crash when replacing a mispelled word" [Critical,Resolved: fixed]
<pedro_> said that the fix was applied to gtkhtml 3.27.5 which is not yet available on Ubuntu
<fta> oh, i've been hurt by that for a while now, any eta to have that in ubuntu?
<pedro_> seb128, ^ ?
<seb128> pedro_, GNOME 2.27.5 due next week
<seb128> so before next tuesday
<fta> ok, thanks
<seb128> you're welcome
<seb128> fta, you should have got a draft of your email though
<seb128> it should ask after next start
<fta> i also a bunch of tiny regressions with my desktop, for example, when i untray rhythmbox, it no longer re-appears on the front if it was trayed lower, it's confusing
<fta> i have a few keys bound to play / pause / next etc (it's not a multimedia keyboard, so i mapped F5/F6/F7/F8), if rhythmbox is idle for too long (not sure it's the cause though), all the bound keys no longer do anything
<fta> xchat systray does not appear on 1st run (new gnome session), i've already mentioned that here
<fta> and a few other tiny-but-annoying regressions..
<seb128> fta, patches are welcome
<fta> if i knew what it was, i would not even ask
<chrisccoulson> fta - i had a look at your xchat issue a couple of weeks ago
<chrisccoulson> i can't figure it out though. it works with an old gtk version
<chrisccoulson> but i can't see what xchat does differently to other applications that work correctly
<chrisccoulson> (i assume we're thinking about the same issue here anyway)
<fta> chrisccoulson, i remember. it seems xchat is the 1st to appear on the desktop, while the panel is still empty
<chrisccoulson> fta - i ran xchat with GTK_DEBUG=plugsocket, and then killed the panel. you see some messages when the notification area disappears, but xchat never notices when it appears again
<chrisccoulson> i did the same with nm-applet, and saw some debug messages everytime i killed and reloaded the panel
<chrisccoulson> i've had a look through the gtk code, but i can't figure out whats going on
<chrisccoulson> so, i got a bit stuck there
<fta> i will add a wrapper and see when i next restart my desktop
<seb128> re
<seb128> chrisccoulson, your g-s-d upgrade still has 2 files listed in dh_install --list-missing, one .glade and one .xml
<chrisccoulson> hmmm :-/ i'll look at that now - i should do these updates when i'm more awake;)
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i've pushed g-s-d with the missing files included now
<geser> I usually use auto-login in gdm so I didn't notice this before. To test a bug I disabled auto-login and did a re-login. When I fist saw the greeter I didn't know how to login as I just had 3 buttons but no user to select which took a few seconds to appear. is that normal? a notice would be great that gdm is collecting the user list or so
<seb128_> geser, there is some bugs about the list being too slow to be computed
<seb128_> I don't think we need a different bug for the animation
<geser> ok
<seb128_> either we make it fast or add a visual clue but that's the same bug
<geser> as long as it's known, it's fine for me
<Quintasan_> kenvandine: in reference to your code review ...
<Quintasan_> damn it!
<ricspencer3> kenvandine: ok, it'
<seb128_> ricspencer3, I understand what you meant now
<ricspencer3> hi seb128_
<ricspencer3> you mean about empathy making me impersonate people?
<ricspencer3> ;)
<seb128_> ricspencer3, you did a typo in your nickname ;-)
<seb128_> ricspencer3, yes
<ricspencer3> seb128_: did it happen to you?
<ricspencer3> or am I the only one using empathy for IRC?
<seb128_> ricspencer3, no but I'm not using an IM for IRC, sorry I know we should be testing what we ship but I need a decent IRC client ;-)
<ricspencer3> heh
<ricspencer3> well ... I'm testing it
<ricspencer3> I'll try to repro the bug when I have chance
<seb128_> open a bug even if it lacks information
<ricspencer3> it always sets me to the same two people, Code or Quintasan
<seb128_> maybe upstream will have a clue
<ricspencer3> will do
<seb128> note to self, suspend on this desktop doesn't ask for password on the login screen and crash the box
<chrisccoulson> what IRC client do you use seb128?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, xchat-gnome
<chrisccoulson> i haven't tried that. i just use pidgin for everything currently
<chrisccoulson> i probably get testing empathy really
<seb128> I don't like using IMs to do IRC
<chrisccoulson> i haven't tried xchat-gnome before, so i don't know the features of a decent IRC client
<seb128> I think that im clients are made to send messages to people
<seb128> you don't want the same interface for IRC, you want a user list, IRC functions, not thing to pop up on screen as private messages do etc
<chrisccoulson> yeah, that makes sense
<dobey> i certainly don't want the same interface for channel-based chat, as for private messages
<chrisccoulson2> hmmm, yeah, xchat-gnome looks ok
<chrisccoulson2> i could probably get used to it;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson2, I'm not trying to convince anybody, I was just using IRC clients before any of my IM client was doing IRC
<seb128> and I get used to have different workflows, etc for those
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-07-24
<didrocks> good morning
<crevette> Ã²la
<didrocks> lut crevette
<crevette> salut didrocks
<didrocks> hey seb128
<seb128> hello didrocks
<seb128> ca va ?
<seb128> brb after upgrade session restart
<seb128> ok
<seb128> should be good now
<seb128> hum, does anybody know if suspend is supposed to work on desktop configs?
<seb128> it crashes my desktop apparently
<seb128> robert_ancell, hey
<seb128> robert_ancell, libgdata is waiting in debian NEW we will sync from there when ti's accepted
<robert_ancell> hey seb128
<robert_ancell> seb128, the all knowing seb :)
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> robert_ancell, we don't need blueprint for every changes
<seb128> robert_ancell, ie a binary split is good for bug or mailing list discussions
<robert_ancell> seb128, I wanted to bring all the info into one place.  Things get very frayed in email :)
<seb128> robert_ancell, the bug would be good enough for that I think
<robert_ancell> seb128, sure
<robert_ancell> ok, I'm outta here - have a good weekend
<mvo> bye robert_ancell
<robert_ancell> cya
<didrocks> seb128: bien, et toi ? :)
<seb128> didrocks, trÃ¨s bien merci ;-) juste un peu fatiguÃ© comme tous les vendredis
<seb128> ArneGoetje, hello
<seb128> ArneGoetje, I switched language-selector to gtkbuilder could you review it?
<mac_v> mvo: hi... just wondering...why are you accepting feature tweak/request bugs when synaptic is going to be replaced by AppCenter?
<mac_v> i feel ,its unnecessary work/duplication load for you
<mvo> mac_v: sentimental reasons?
<mac_v> :) oh... ok
<mvo> mac_v: but I also don't think it will go away, its still a nice tool and has users that love it
<mvo> mac_v: at least the initial appcenter will not work on a package level (later versons will) so its still useful until then at least to keep synpatic in shape
<mac_v> mvo: yeah, there are a *lot* of fans.
<ArneGoetje> seb128: I can try
<mac_v> mvo: BTW , are you working on Appcenter too?
 * proppy reading https://wiki.ubuntu.com/AppCenter
<mvo> mac_v: yes, mostly research/non ui stuff up until now
<seb128> ArneGoetje, good, one minute I do a small change and push that online
<mvo> like xapian integration
<ArneGoetje> seb128: although it might be better if mvo reviews and does the merge... I don't have upload rights anyways.
<seb128> ArneGoetje, I've upload rights no worry
<mac_v> mvo: can anything be done so that update-xapian doesn eat resources?
<mac_v> doesnt^
<mvo> during the indexing?
<mac_v> yeah
<mvo> or later when its actually used?
<mvo> well, some improvements are there now, there is a --upate switch that only re-indexes changed packages. so on my system a re-index in the morning takes ~4s instead of 40 now
<mvo> its also run with ionice, but its difficult to get it down even further
<mac_v> \o/ nice
<rodrigo_> shouldn't REVU send mails for the comments added to the submission?
<rodrigo_> I don't recall getting one for the last comment from pitti in http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/evolution-couchdb
<mvo> ArneGoetje: I can review it, a second pair of eyes would be nice though (and/or a bit of testing)
 * mvo looks at the diff
<seb128> ArneGoetje, lp:~seb128/language-selector/gtkbuilder
<mvo> ArneGoetje, seb128: diff looks fine to me (code-wise). I have not tested/loaded the UI
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson
<seb128> chrisccoulson, do you plan to fix the g-s-d .install today or should I do it? ;-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i did it last night didn't i?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, didn't get any bug comment
<seb128> or, you just changing it to new but didn't write anything
<seb128> I didn't get that was done sorry
<chrisccoulson> ah. i pinged you in IRC i think. perhaps you missed that?
<seb128> yes
<chrisccoulson> sorry, i probably should have commented on the bug too
<seb128> sorry about that
<chrisccoulson> thats ok:)
<seb128> yeah, everything alright
<chrisccoulson> so, everybody is winding down for the weekend now are they?;)
<seb128> annoying that it stil use glade
<seb128> chrisccoulson, yeah, did you get a day off work?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - not today - i had yesterday afternoon off instead
<seb128> ok
<chrisccoulson> although, there's never any point in coming to work on fridays really
<seb128> ;-)
<chrisccoulson> friday's are a "slow work day" for me;)
<seb128> good, you can triage some ubuntu bugs :-p
<chrisccoulson> i could do. but i have to finish my coffee first;)
<seb128> lol
<seb128> chrisccoulson, g-s-d looks good now ;-)
<seb128> out of the fact that they still use glade grrr
 * chrisccoulson breathes sigh of relief
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i didn't realise they still used glade. that's why i renamed .glade to .ui in the install file
<chrisccoulson> there's not much using glade though is there? perhaps it could be something easy for me to port
<seb128> would be nice to automate dh_install --list-missing in builds and break if it's not empty or something
<chrisccoulson> yeah, that would be nice
<chrisccoulson> although it wouldn't be good to break in builds where you deliberately miss out files
<seb128> well you could clean debian/tmp in the rules
<seb128> well or at least have a variable to set to stop you on dh_install --list-missing when not empty
<seb128> asking to ack that you want to ignore those
<chrisccoulson> yeah, that's quite a good idea
<seb128> chrisccoulson, g-s-d is fixed in git already
<seb128> I mean the remaining .glade has been converted there
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - thanks, thats good to know. so thats one more package that won't depend on glade soon then:)
<seb128> anybody wanting to tackle some of the available upgrades today? ;-)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, yeah, I'm keeping track of those on https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-karmic-gnome-3
<seb128> we will still have some libglade use in default karmic
<seb128> but should manage to tackle those before the lts
<chrisccoulson> yeah, there still looks like there's a fair bit left to do, but at least upstream are quite active with porting the remaining applications across too
<seb128> chrisccoulson, well, if you clean apps fixed in git or those with patches ready you only have 7-8
<seb128_> ArneGoetje, any comment on the gtkbuilder version?
<mvo> seb128_: I put something that we may need for the install-updates-on-shutdown to lp:~mvo/gnome-session/run-on-shutdown
<vuntz> mvo: hrm, is this something like http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=528812 ?
<seb128_> mvo, ok, I've no real objection with the change but upstream might not agree with it
<ubottu> Gnome bug 528812 in gnome-session "Logout sound not playing at all" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<seb128_> vuntz, no, it's to run a command in a sync way before closing
<seb128_> mvo, open a bugzilla bug for it?
<vuntz> seb128_: you didn't read the bug ;-)
<seb128_> vuntz, ah right
<seb128_> mvo, ^
 * mvo reads
<mvo> seb128_: upstream may not like it? I'm sure with enough ice-cream ...
<vuntz> pretty sure that the bug I linked too is the right way to do it
<vuntz> if you need to do things on shutdown only, we might just set an environment variable before running the stuff
<seb128_> mterry rocks ;-)
<vuntz> like GNOME_SESSION_LEAVING={logout,reboot,shutdown}
<seb128_> mvo, I'm still not sure if that should be run in the user session though
<mvo> vuntz: that sounds pretty good - will it be able to block the logout a certain amount of time too?
<seb128_> ie I feel it would be cleaner to close the session and run an upgrade session
<seb128_> but that might be not as easy
<mvo> seb128_: my initial idea was to run it in usplash even
<seb128> that's what I was thinking this morning
<vuntz> mvo: well, we were talking about having a timeout to not block forever
<seb128> but I figured it would not be nice looking
<seb128> vuntz, context there is to do upgrades before shutdown
<vuntz> would this imply having some graphical stuff running?
<mvo> vuntz: yes
<vuntz> hrm
<vuntz> hopefully, they don't need to interact with anything else on the desktop since, well, everything else would be dead ;-)
<mvo> thats ok
<mvo> the idea was that its totally non-interactive
<mvo> but its still nice to have X around :)
<mvo> much nicer progress bars
<vuntz> so the thing is that you really can't have a timeout for the upgrade case
<vuntz> since you don't want to kill it
<mvo> vuntz: if that patch is the right way forward, I will clean it up and merge it into our packages
<mvo> vuntz: yeah
<seb128> mvo, do you need to be able to click on button, ie skip the upgrade or something?
<mvo> vuntz: it will have a timeout, but it will be a internal one
<mvo> vuntz: internal to the updates-on-shutdown stuff
<mvo> seb128: yes, there will be buttons too (to cancel)
<seb128> ok
<vuntz> mvo: by default, gnome-session should have a timeout. It's just that there should be a way to disable it for your use case, I guess
<mvo> seb128: it should also be part of the shutdown dialog (I guess) - shutdown, shutdown with applying patches
<mvo> vuntz: sounds ok to me
<seb128> mvo, the way microsoft does it I think is to use a modifier when clicking the action or click on an icon next to it
<seb128> mvo, I wouldn't like having yet another option in the list
<mvo> I don't mind how its triggered :)
<mvo> I guess I will sumon the design team and ask for input
<vuntz> mvo: so yeah, I think it'd make sense to clean up the upstream patch. Just not sure how to add the "disable gnome-session timeout" part
<seb128> yeah
<seb128> why not having a some hour timeout?
<vuntz> especially since, well, you don't want random stuff to disable this timeout
<seb128> do we have cases were upgrades run over 6 hours?
<mvo> yeah, I guess if the timeout is long enough?
<mvo> or maybe just have something in (system) gconf that adds a process name for exceptions from the timeout
<mvo> so timeout by default for everything that is not in this exception list
<seb128> MacSlow, the fact that notify-osd doesn't call gtk function directly doesn't make the bug not be a bug
<seb128> MacSlow, ie the bug could be an incorrect gtk use, or a gtk bug, or a confusing gdb stacktrace
<MacSlow> seb128, but how should I debug that?
<seb128> MacSlow, well ask for a valgrind log or a debug stacktrace or ask for steps to trigger the issue
<seb128> MacSlow, if apport catch a crash that's usually because the application crashed and there is a reason
<seb128> could be a gtk bugs in which case they should be reassigned and not closed
<seb128> MacSlow, anyway you are right to focus on bugs which are clearly notify-osd issues first ;-)
<asac> seb128: my system hung up for the second time today (e.g. suddenly no keyboard anymore) ... i got this in my syslog: http://paste.ubuntu.com/230629/
<asac> have you seen this? maybe it triggered this problem?
<seb128> asac, nop, didn't see anything similar
<asac> i booted with previous kernel now. if it doesnt happen again its -3
<seb128> asac, what gnome-session version do you have?
<asac> otherwise i probably will see the same in syslog again and come back
<asac> let me check
<asac> 2.27.4-0ubuntu1
<seb128> ok, so that's not it
<asac> seb128: what debug packages should i install to make the backtrace more useful?
<asac> (in case i get one again)
<seb128> could you install gnome-session-dbgsym?
<seb128> trying to get an useful stacktrace
<asac> anything else?
<seb128> libglib2.0-0-dbg
<seb128> libgtk2.0-0-dbg
<asac> seb128: yeah sure. does gnom-setssion catch segfaults?
<seb128> should be enough
<asac> maybe it should re-throw them so apport could pick them up
<asac> yes will install those
<seb128> it didn't use to but your log seems to suggest it does now
<seb128> ok
<dobey> Your computer does not have enough free memory to automatically analyze the problem and send a report to the developers.
<dobey> nice :(
<dobey> how do i figure out why the hell the rhythmbox import helper binary thing is SIGABRTing? apport seems to ignore SIGABRT, and i can't import my new music into rbox :(
<mat_t_> hi all
<mat_t_> seb128: pitti: do you think we could show the animated throbber between the gdm and the user session? Right now it takes a long time to load the desktop session and nothing happens on the screen
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i'm confused about gnome-session catching crashes. it doesn't seem to do that intentionally
<chrisccoulson> is it possible for external libraries to register signal handlers
<chrisccoulson> ?
<chrisccoulson> i had this issue when debugging the last gnome-session crash (which didn't actually crash in the end, but it froze in the signal handler after catching the SIGSEGV)
<chrisccoulson> ah
<chrisccoulson> actually, it does catch it
<seb128> mat_t_, we had a transition effect but Keybuk turned it down because it takes login time
<Keybuk> that wasn't a transition effect
<Keybuk> that was a pointless animation from a black screen
<Keybuk> done at a random time while everything else was busy
<seb128> chrisccoulson, gnome-session/gdm-signal-handler.c:        gdm_signal_handler_add (handler, SIGSEGV, NULL, NULL);
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - thanks, i just spotted that
<seb128> mat_t_, the goal was rather to have things loading fast than to add animations though
<mat_t_> seb128: yeah good point
<seb128> but I guess we could do a small animation if that's not fast enough
<seb128> better than the one we had which had issue as Keybuk said
<mat_t_> seb128: yes, just a small throbber
<mat_t_> that should not slow the boot down I guess
<seb128> probably not much
<Keybuk> mat_t_: if it does, I know where you live
<seb128> lol
<mat_t_> hahaha
<mat_t_> Keybuk: I make sure it does, just to check how quickly you can move ;)
<mat_t_> Keybuk: btw, do you think there is any reliable way of smoothing the transitions on user-switch? Basically now we reset the X session, which is a sudden "blackout" and then the screen pops back in
<Keybuk> mat_t_: not for karmic
<Keybuk> that would involve re-using the X server
<mat_t_> uhm
<Keybuk> and I don't think anyone's even thought about thinking about that yet
<mat_t_> yeah
<mat_t_> at least it is fast now :)
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - how would you feel about stopping gnome-session from catching SIGSEGV for now, so people can submit crash reports with apport in the usual way?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, +1
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - just looking at bug 404219
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 404219 in gnome-settings-daemon "Touchpad Tap Clicking Broken (scrolling also)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/404219
<chrisccoulson> seems upstream changed the location of the gconf keys :-/
<chrisccoulson> they were in /desktop/gnome/peripherals/mouse in the old version but are in /desktop/gnome/peripherals/touchpad in the new version, which I assume means that gnome-control-center modifies the wrong keys now
<seb128> chrisccoulson, could be
<seb128> would be easy enough to add copy to read old key if it has a value and copy it
<chrisccoulson> so, i don't know whether to reassign that to g-c-c and change the gconf keys there. if we do that, then we probably need some way of migrating existing configs from jaunty
<seb128> and clean it
<chrisccoulson> ok, so we can update g-c-c and also patch g-s-d to copy the old config to the new location?
<seb128> right
<chrisccoulson> i can work on that then if you agree that's the right way to do it
<seb128> well we don't have good ways to do user config changes on upgrade
<seb128> so I don't see a better way right now
<seb128> that forces us to keep a patch but that should be easy enough and work
<seb128> time for dinner
<seb128> bbl
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - agreed. i'll work on a patch for that
<chrisccoulson> enjoy your dinner
<seb128> thanks, you too
<didrocks> quickly 0.1 is released \o/ Check it out at https://launchpad.net/quickly :)
<crevette> what is quickly
<didrocks> crevette: The main page should give a good description of what it is :)
 * crevette is looking at the page
<rickspencer3> didrocks: congrats!
<rickspencer3> $quickly release
<didrocks> rickspencer3: thanks, congrats to you too :)
<kenvandine> didrocks, quickly 0.1...  awesome!  thanks!
<chrisccoulson> hey, congrats didrocks \o/
<didrocks> thanks chrisccoulson :)
<chrisccoulson> hey didrocks - not sure if you're still awake or not. are you working on the g-c-c update still?
<chrisccoulson> i'm going to push a change to fix bug 404219 shortly. if you're quite close to finishing, then you could probably incorporate the change in to your update
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 404219 in gnome-settings-daemon "Touchpad Tap Clicking Broken (scrolling also)" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/404219
<chrisccoulson> asac - did you figure out what happened with your gnome-session crash?
<asac> chrisccoulson: nope. i think the complete hang was really rather linux ralted ... its working now since i have -4
<asac> i instlaled the -dbg packages and didnt have a crash yet
<chrisccoulson> asac - thanks. i've just pushed a change to gnome-session to stop it catching these crashes now anyway
<chrisccoulson> it would be useful if apport caught them so people could report them
<asac> thx. thats good.
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-07-25
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: you can push a change now. I didn't have the time to work on this yet due to quickly
<chrisccoulson> hi didrocks - it seems that the change i was going to push is actually already in the new version
<chrisccoulson> 2.27.4 fixes bug 404219
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 404219 in gnome-settings-daemon "Touchpad Tap Clicking Broken (scrolling also)" [Low,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/404219
<chrisccoulson> so, i'll leave it for now:)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: ok, perfecct :)
<didrocks> perfect*
<chrisccoulson> thanks didrocks. i'm going to relax now instead;)
<didrocks> that's a good plan ^^
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-07-26
<Sarvatt> hmm, the g-s-d touchpad tab in mouse settings is adjusting things in /desktop/gnome/peripherals/mouse/ and not /desktop/gnome/peripherals/touchpad where the keys actually work now
<mac_v> Sarvatt: i think touchpad ,settings are from gsynaptics
<mac_v> i just had problems and installing gsynaptic fixed all
<Sarvatt> no /desktop/gnome/peripherals/touchpad is from http://git.gnome.org/cgit/gnome-settings-daemon/commit/?id=4eb9bd09219afbb56f114a2d10bc585e24db803e
<Sarvatt> gsynaptics doesnt work on my system because xserver-xorg-input-synaptics dropped SHMConfig support
<mac_v> Sarvatt: have you tried gpointing-device-settings ? but that has no tap-to-click
<Sarvatt> i can adjust things with fine its just g-s-d is loading the default settings for /desktop/gnome/peripherals/touchpad every boot which has tap to click false after it loads the hal settings
<Sarvatt> yeah, its not a problem changing things here, i'm talking about the package being broken for some reason
<mac_v> oh... ok
<Sarvatt> its like loading the old touchpad menu thats adjusting the settings in /desktop/gnome/peripherals/mouse even though the patch that added that was dropped..
<Sarvatt> and not the new touchpad menu with all of the new options that works right
<mac_v> ah... got it
<Sarvatt> oh i see, its a gnome-control-center problem
<Sarvatt> http://git.gnome.org/cgit/gnome-control-center/commit/?id=e14a84a718d9882d320de1f359c0547836a9b4e3
<Sarvatt> so we dropped the custom one that was changing settings in mouse and have nothing interacting with the touchpad gconf keys, and the touchpad tab is doing aboslutely nothing right now
<Sarvatt> oookay I give up trying to add http://git.gnome.org/cgit/gnome-control-center/commit/?id=e14a84a718d9882d320de1f359c0547836a9b4e3 to fix the touchpad stuff  :D cant figure out how to add it since it patches configure.in and that change doesnt get picked up so it builds without xinput support so no touchpad tab
<huats> hello  everyone !
<chrisccoulson> hello huats!
<huats> hi chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> you just missed something exciting. some tumbleweed appeared and then went away a few minutes before you arrived
<chrisccoulson> (it's very quiet in here ;))
<chrisccoulson> Sarvatt - just saw your earlier message regarding g-c-c - didrocks is already working on the update
<Sarvatt> ah good to hear! thanks for the info chriscoulson
<chrisccoulson> but if you're desparate for the update - you need to do an autotools update with "autoreconf -i" after touching configure.in
<hyperair> tumbleweed?
<Sarvatt> ahh silly me was using -f with autoreconf, thanks for the tip :)
<hyperair> -vfi, to be exact
<hyperair> that's what i see in most debian/rules scripts
<Sarvatt> yeah i used that and just autoreconf, both used -f and -f screws it up
<chrisccoulson> i've seen people say that you should never run it with -f
<Sarvatt> seems like its taboo on all gnome packages the way they build at least :D
<Sarvatt> oops almost forgot libxi-dev in build depends now
<Sarvatt> well that was *horribly* convoluted and i dont know exactly what I did to make it work but its compiled now, thanks again for the help chrisccoulson!
<Sarvatt> just removing patches 26 and 28, applying the git commit by hand, removing 99_autoreconf.patch, touching configure.in and running autoreconf -i  didn't work, got this
<Sarvatt> gnome_appearance_properties-appearance-main.o: In function `main':
<Sarvatt> /opt/source/xorg-pkg-tools/gnome-control-center-2.27.3/capplets/appearance/appearance-main.c:174: undefined reference to `effects_init'
<Sarvatt> collect2: ld returned 1 exit status
<Sarvatt> which i was assuming was because of the new stuff added in 95_desktop-effects-integration.patch not getting picked up in that autoreconf -i
<Sarvatt> so i paused it after the patch was added, touched a ton of .in's because autotools is the devil and ran autoreconf -i again, then it built fine
<Sarvatt> http://sarvatt.com/downloads/sheworks!.png
 * Sarvatt cheers
 * diverse_izzue tunes into Sarvatt's cheers
<hyperair> Sarvatt: still doesn't have circular scrolling? =(
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-07-26
<pitti> Good morning
<TheMuso> Hey pitti.
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> hey didrocks, how are you?
<jcastro> hi didrocks
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson, had a safe trip home?
<chrisccoulson> hi pitti, yes thanks. did you?
<chrisccoulson> (the flights were a little bumpy though)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: was easy for me, just 2 train hours; I was home at 9 pm on Friday
<chrisccoulson> that's not too bad. i got home at 17:20 on saturday, but most of my travelling time was spent sitting in amsterdam airport
<chrisccoulson> i should get a direct flight next time ;)
<nigelb> chrisccoulson: train?
<chrisccoulson> migelb - i flew from prague to amsterdam and then from amsterdam to birmingham
<nigelb> Ah
<nigelb> chrisccoulson: still train's more fun ;)
<didrocks> pitti: I'm good thanks, just the Internet connexion isn't really great. And you?
<jcastro> hi kenvandine
<kenvandine> hey jcastro
<kenvandine> good morning!
<kenvandine> enjoying prague?
<jcastro> yeah
 * kenvandine misses the weather... came home to 104F weather
<jcastro> vino and ibus app indicator patches should be in your queue iirc
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> seb128, i'll be out for a little bit this morning, taking my kids to school since i missed their first day back
<jcastro> kenvandine: lmk if they are not
<jcastro> I think I assigned them to the right team and alpah 3
<kenvandine> well technically today is still my son's first day :)
<kenvandine> jcastro, i'll check when i get back
<kenvandine> about an hour or so
<jcastro> no worries!
<seb128> kenvandine, hey, did you have a nice flight back?
<seb128> kenvandine, ok, have fun with your kids, see you later ;-)
<pitti> didrocks: ah, you are GUADECing the connection? :-)
<jcastro> didrocks: any idea how the fixes are coming along for the usb keys?
<jcastro> didrocks: in hindsight I should have left them with you so you would have them already
<didrocks> jcastro: I'm whinning to the dx team, they wait for Jason to be back
<didrocks> jcastro: as the Internet connection is bad there, it makes things bad
 * jcastro nods
<didrocks> jcastro: let's see once Jason is there
<jcastro> didrocks: so in other words, we'll be up all night tomorrow? got it. :D
<didrocks> jcastro: something like that, *if* we get some Internet at the hotel, which wasn't the case yesterday
<didrocks> :)
<didrocks> jcastro: pizza party again?
<didrocks> jcastro: we can get to fastfood near the hotel, they get wifi :)
<jcastro> how far is the hotel from guadec?
<vish> kenvandine: hi , could you commit Bug 596022 [looks like you've been doing the xchat-gnome uploads :) ] , there is a debdiff for that..
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 596022 in xchat-gnome (Debian) (and 2 other projects) "Package description is unhelpful (affects: 4) (heat: 20)" [Unknown,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/596022
<didrocks> jcastro: not very far, just 15 minutes by feet
<kenvandine> vish, sure
<vish> kenvandine: thanks.
<fta> kenvandine, hi, is xchat supposed to hide itself when closed with "x" or quit for good?
<kenvandine> neither afaik
<kenvandine> nm... quit :)
<kenvandine> actually i don't know about xchat, but xchat-gnome should quit
<kenvandine> i would prefer it just hide
<fta> kenvandine, ok, xchat also quits, or crashes (in dbus) :(
<fta> kenvandine, my xchat crash seems related to the indicator, there are two dupes
<fta> bug 549972 and bug 550959
<ubot2`> fta: Bug 549972 on http://launchpad.net/bugs/549972 is private
<ubot2`> fta: Bug 550959 on http://launchpad.net/bugs/550959 is private
<fta> grrr
<asac> didrocks: ping pong peng
<asac> didrocks: where is your meego page ;)?
<and471> hyperair, I just commented on this bug report https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/banshee/+bug/609750
<ubot2`> Ubuntu bug 609750 in banshee (Ubuntu) "update to 1.7.3 in Lucid gives error message (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<vish> kenvandine: for the gedit bug , there is a patch from the gedit devs too > https://bugzilla.gnome.org/attachment.cgi?id=156042
<vish> or is that the same one bilal mentioned?
<kenvandine> same
<kenvandine> well, nearly the same
<kenvandine> he is going to update the gnome bug
<vish> oh.. :s
<and471> hyperair, is there a way to use the amazonmp3 banshee integration in the daily builds, it doesn't appear in the window
<vish> kenvandine: in a committing mood today? :)   Bug #395692  has a debdiff too and upstream is unmaintained :s
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 395692 in alacarte (Ubuntu) (and 2 other projects) "Drag-and-Drop behavior in the menu editor is inconsistent and confusing (affects: 3) (heat: 26)" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/395692
<hyperair> and471: not yet, i haven't updated the packaging for the daily uilds.
<and471> hyperair, okay thanks, any idea when?
<hyperair> and471: maybe tomorrow.
<and471> hyperair, thanks :)
<hyperair> and471: is there a package called amazonmp3?
<and471> hyperair, yeah, it is downloaded from here http://www.amazon.com/gp/dmusic/help/amd.html
<and471> hyperair, just a DEB file
<hyperair> and471: uninstall it. looks like it conflicts with banshee.
<and471> hyperair, yeah, I have done :)
<hyperair> and471: this isn't a bug in banshee's package -- amazonmp3 doesn't exist in the archives.
<and471> hyperair, I suppose with banshee's downloader capabilities, they don't really need to co-exist anyway
<hyperair> and471: no they don't =)
<hyperair> and471: actually i believe they're probably shipping the same xml file.
<hyperair> and471: it just ships a new mime type for *.amz
<and471> yup
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-07-27
<TheMuso> RAOF: Hey Chris. How was your trip?
<RAOF> TheMuso: Morning Luke.  Pretty much as can be expected.
<TheMuso> Yeah same here. Have you recovered somewhat?
<RAOF> Somewhat.
<RAOF> I don't think this is going to be my most productive day ever, though :)
<TheMuso> Yeah thats how yesterday was for me. :)
<RAOF> There was a certain amount of excitement leaving Prague - the flight from Prague was delayed a bit, so there was some concern about making my connection at Heathrow.
<TheMuso> Ouch.
<RAOF> It turned out fine.
<TheMuso> Yeah I gathered as much,
<RAOF> While they recommend allocating 2 hours for transfer at Heathrow, turns out you can do it in ~30 minutes :)
<TheMuso> wow that is quick.
<RAOF> Your flights were pleasantly uneventful?
<TheMuso> Yep
<TheMuso> Still don't feel 100%, but a few early nights should fix that.
<TheMuso> Plus some exercise.
<RAOF> Yeah.
<TheMuso> Nice to be back on the desktop again.
<pitti> Good morning
<TheMuso> Hey pitti.
<micahg> good morning pitti
<huats> morning
<vish> seb128: hi , you at guadec? or .. back ?
<TheMuso> vish: He is at guadec this week.
<vish> TheMuso: ah .. cool  thanks :)
<TheMuso> np
<seb128> vish, GUADEC for the week
<vish> seb128: have fun :)
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> vish, do you need anything?
<chrisccoulson> hey seb128, having fun?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, yes
<seb128> though opening days are sort not so well organized
<vish> seb128: nah , nothing urgent , just a few bugs wanted to ask you about. it can wait a week :)
<seb128> but nice to talk to people there
<seb128> vish, just ask
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, xchat crashed :/
<vish> seb128: well , there are a few bugs which are specific to Ubuntu changes and they have patches.. they need to be reviewed. we missed them last cycle too , was wondering if there is a way to make sure we dont miss it again
<seb128> can you build a list of those and maybe tag them in some way?
<seb128> we will review them then
<vish> seb128: and about Bug 15495 , i believe we already carry your patch  , but it just needs a a little change in the titlebar
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 15495 in file-roller (Ubuntu) (and 3 other projects) ""Archive Manager" doesn't mean anything if you don't know what an "archive" is (affects: 6) (dups: 1) (heat: 55)" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/15495
<vish> seb128: sure , i have the list , its about 10-12 bugs .. hence wanted to wait :)
<tseliot> vish: did you get any reply from other gtk+ devs on the right-click bug?
<vish> tseliot: yeah , i dint know how to proceed further with that one either..  should we just get bratsche to commit or ..?
<tseliot> vish: yes, whoever has the authority to do so
<vish> bratsche: can you commit this one > https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=591258  the accessibility team has also reviewed it and given it a green light
<ubot2> Gnome bug 591258 in gtk "Easy to accidentally select first option in popup menus" [Minor,Unconfirmed]
<vish> bratsche: and ebassi has reviewed it too , but dint commit it yet..
<bratsche> tseliot, vish: It looks fine to me I think.  I'm running a quick build first just to test it though.
<bratsche> I'll comment on the bug# in a little bit.
<vish> bratsche: thanks :)
<tseliot> bratsche: fantastic. Thanks
<bratsche> Anyone know where the source for clearlooks is by any chance?
<bratsche> Ah, nevermind.. I found it in gtk-engines
<bratsche> tseliot: I forgot that someone has my second monitor since I haven't been using it.. do you have a 2-monitor setup that can reproduce that rgba issue?
<tseliot> bratsche: sure
<bratsche> tseliot: What's the error? Is it causing a crash?
<bratsche> tseliot: I updated my patch a few days ago to set an X error handler, and if it traps a BadMatch error then it tries to revert the colormap to the system one.  This seems to fix some things.
<tseliot> bratsche: nice, it the new patch in maverick?
<tseliot> s/it/is/
<bratsche> Nope, I'm trying to find the list of bugs in Launchpad so I can do some testing first.
<bratsche> Unfortunately, Launchpad is not the easiest thing to find things in. :)
<tseliot> bratsche: ok, let me find the bug report
<tseliot> I think there should be an entry in the changelog with my name
<tseliot> that should contain the bug number
<tseliot> in nautilus
<bratsche> Okay cool.
<tseliot> bratsche: LP: #508890
<tseliot> bug #508890
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 508890 in nautilus (Ubuntu Lucid) (and 2 other projects) "Nautilus crashes when there are multiple XScreens (affects: 35) (dups: 9) (heat: 234)" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/508890
<tseliot> the details there should help you
<bratsche> tseliot: Thanks!
<tseliot> np, thanks for working on it
 * tseliot reboots
<chrisccoulson> hi mvo - do you know why apturl doesn't ship a apturl.js preferences file for firefox anymore?
<chrisccoulson> it used to many releases ago, but seems to have been dropped at some point
<mvo> chrisccoulson: no, that sounds like a mistake
<mvo> chrisccoulson: I can dig into the bzr history
<chrisccoulson> i was going to add it back again so that apturl registers as a protocol handler in firefox again
<mvo> thanks, please do
<chrisccoulson> mvo - no worries, i will just resurrect the old file
<chrisccoulson> thanks
<mvo> and just commit
<mvo> thanks :)
<vish> mvo: hi , for Bug 602705 and Bug 602820 , the maintainers dont seem to know why the wrong package/description is being pulled
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 602705 in software-center (Ubuntu) (and 1 other project) "Description: Akonaditray (affects: 1) (heat: 8)" [Low,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/602705
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 602820 in software-center (Ubuntu) (and 2 other projects) "Wrong Firefox package is displayed by default in SC (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Low,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/602820
<vish> kiwinote: too ^^
<vish> hehe , everyone says mvo is python overlord who would know :D
<mvo> vish: I check that, thanks
<vish> mvo: thanks  :)
<chrisccoulson> mvo - the issue with apturl was just that the file was being installed to the wrong place (due to a firefox change)
<chrisccoulson> i can upload it now, but can't push to the bzr branch, do you just want to merge in my changes afterwards?
<mvo> chrisccoulson: I'm fine with merging, but isn't that in ~ubuntu-core-dev?
<chrisccoulson> mvo - it is, but i'm not a core-dev (but the package is in the ubuntu-desktop packageset)
<chrisccoulson> which is a bit weird ;)
<mvo> chrisccoulson: yeah, I can merge, thats fine
<chrisccoulson> mvo - it's uploaded now, and i've pushed my changes to lp:~chrisccoulson/apturl/apturl.lp576944
<mvo> chrisccoulson: commited a r97 - sounds like we need to put a bit of work into it to celebrate r100 soon ;)
<seb128> pitti, hey there, could you get unity build score raised?
<seb128> didrocks, ^
<didrocks> mvo: thanks for your plugin viewmanager branch. It's working perfectly (with the fact to add to the model, which isn't a big deal for now)
<didrocks> mvo: and the cache model is refreshed once integrated, work nicely :)
<didrocks> it seems that clicking directly on install/remove doesn't work though, don't know why (only add all/remove all)
<pitti> seb128: bumped
<didrocks> pitti: seb128 thanks :)
<didrocks> pitti: once built and published, I'll ask you for a respin of the iso if possible
<didrocks> mvo: the viewmanager seems to switch the current view sometimes unexpectidely, not sure if that's because of the plugin or a general issue
<seb128> pitti, thanks
<mvo> didrocks: nice!
<mvo> didrocks: I think that is a general issue
<didrocks> mvo: thanks again :)
<mvo> didrocks: I had the problem too
<didrocks> ok
<didrocks> well, I'll package oneconf now and get it into universe
<mvo> didrocks: yeah, I'm very happy too :) I think it made the code a lot better, far from perfect, but a lot better
<mvo> didrocks: cool
<mvo> didrocks: can't wait for it to be availalbe
<didrocks> mvo: yeah, I saw your changes, it's way way better :)
<mvo> didrocks: let me know once there is a debian/ dir and I will beta test
<didrocks> great! ;)
 * didrocks hugs mvo for make it possible
<mvo> didrocks: I want to upload the new s-c today or tomororw (probably today)
 * mvo hugs didrocks back for his patience (and endurance)
<didrocks> that will fit nicely so :)
<pitti> didrocks: sure, please do
<kenvandine> seb128, the sqlite branch for gwibber is nearly complete :)
<kenvandine> seb128, i am going to bump the test suite work items to beta, since it isn't features
<kenvandine> gotta finish this telepathy-indicator service and the port to sqlite for gwibber
<kenvandine> ryan dropped some stuff in the merge, i got most of what he dropped ported back over last night
<kenvandine> so looking pretty good
<kenvandine> and no dep on desktopcouch :)
<mvo> kiwinote: hi, around?
<kiwinote> hi mvo
<mvo> kiwinote: sorry that I neglected your branches, they are not forgoten :)
<kiwinote> mvo: nice to hear. If you want me to merge them against trunk just let me know..
<mvo> kiwinote: a quick question, have you put any though in how to ask s-c to show (app,pkg) ? what do you thin kabout "software-center "Firefox Web Browser;firefox"" (assuming that is a app name?
<mvo> kiwinote: the merge is going to be a little bit painful as there was a bit of churn around logging and the viewswitcher/manager class
<mvo> kiwinote: but nothing fundamental changed fortunately :)
<kiwinote> mvo: I though about that appname stuff, but at least as startup arguments I didn't see what benefits that would give us, as pkgnames are unique, but appnames aren't
<mvo> kiwinote: yeah, it always has to be "appname;pkgname" as a tuple, otherwise it will not work
<kiwinote> mvo: do you have any usecases for using mixed appnames and pkgnames?
<mvo> kiwinote: the use-case is basicly to show the right icon when a pkgname contains multiple ones
<mvo> kiwinote: multiple apps
<kiwinote> mvo: I think the icon stuff does work multiple apps, it's the screenshots which don't
<kiwinote> mvo: using sgt-puzzles as an example
<kiwinote> mmvo: just going to find mpt now
<kiwinote> be back later
<mvo> vish: ff should be fixed with the next app-installl-data update
<vish> mvo: neat! thanks.
<seb128> kenvandine, hey
<seb128> kenvandine, ok, nice, thank you for the update
<seb128> kenvandine, delaying the test to beta does make sense
<kenvandine> yeah... no new features
<mvo> thank you vish for bringing this up
<kenvandine> but it worries me... letting it slip usually means it doesn't get done :/
<kenvandine> but getting gwibber with sqlite will make lots of folks happy
<seb128> kenvandine, right
<seb128> we were talking e
<seb128> we were talking yesterday about how dropping couch from the default installation would be nice
<kenvandine> yeah :)
<kenvandine> although we need a migration path for existing users
<seb128> is there any plan to use the gobject equivalent client on the desktop for other things?
<kenvandine> which would require couch :/
<seb128> I don't remember the name of it now
<kenvandine> oh... midgard?
<seb128> yes
<seb128> do you know if there is any plan to switch to it?
<kenvandine> not yet
<seb128> ok
<seb128> I guess it will be a topic for UDS
<kenvandine> so for maverick we will need to keep desktopcouch around, to migrate accounts
<kenvandine> yeah... for sure
<kenvandine> we need to look at it very seriously
<kenvandine> seb128, so next on my plate related to that is migrating accounts from couch to sqlite
<seb128> ok
<kenvandine> then we can do a release and see what is broken :)
<seb128> do you plan to work on that first or finish the empathy thing before?
<kenvandine> i think first
<kenvandine> anxiously want to get something in the wild so we can get bugs flowing in
<kenvandine> and it is really close
<seb128> ok
<seb128> I've no strong opinion so whatever you think needs testing first will do
<kenvandine> seb128, meeting today?
<seb128> kenvandine, no
<kenvandine> ok
<seb128> kenvandine, I will send a notice to the team, thanks
<kenvandine> ok, thx
<seb128> kenvandine, rick and I are busy and we just got back from the sprint so there should not be lot to discuss
<kenvandine> yeah, i figured
<kenvandine> hey rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> hi kenvandine
<rickspencer3> 'sup my friend?
<rickspencer3> what did I forget now?
<rickspencer3> :)
<kenvandine> hehe
<kenvandine> notta
<kenvandine> just saying howdy
<kenvandine> the sqlite branch of gwibber is about to land :)
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, sweeeet
<kenvandine> i've added back all the stuff ryan dropped in his merge
<kenvandine> just need to code up a migration path to import the accounts from couch
<ltyr> hi
<ltyr> is there a GUI tool for doing backups
<ltyr> or most of them are command line?
<ltyr> basically im looking for something that's GUI to do backups using RAR ....
<kiwinote> mvo: I saw that you have resolved it with pkgname/appname. Looks good. I'll update the deb-files branch to use it.
<and471> mvo, kiwinote, vish, hiya
<and471> vish, I am progressing further on the shotwell one :)
<kiwinote> hi and471
<and471> vish, shall be glad when it is over :D
<vish> and471: hey. neat ;)
<YokoZar> meeting now?
<seb128> no meeting this week
<ltyr> ok any hints anyone?
<seb128> GUADEC going on
<YokoZar> seb128: ahh all right
<seb128> ltyr, try #ubuntu
<mvo> and471: hey, nice to see you
<and471> mvo, hi how have you been?
<mvo> and471: good, good, I was traveling, but now I'm back and in action to merge $stuff :)
<and471> mvo, hehe same, I have been in Belgium :)
<Riddell> can sexy-python be removed?  it's gone in debian
<pitti> Riddell: seems so; only reverse recommends is exaile, no rdepends
<pitti> good night everyone
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-07-28
<Riddell> removing gdesklets-data package
<pitti> Good morning
<bilalakhtar> Someone, kindly sponsor fix for bug #585892
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 585892 in gwibber (Ubuntu) (and 1 other project) "Message text should use Document Font, not Application Font (affects: 2) (heat: 65)" [Low,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/585892
<pitti> didrocks: eww, UNR failed to build
<pitti> The following packages have unmet dependencies:
<pitti>   computer-janitor: Depends: python-fstab (>= 1.2) but it is not installable
<pitti>   libmailtools-perl: Depends: libtimedate-perl but it is not installable
<pitti> seems some MIRing is in order
<pitti> ah, c-j 2.0.2-0ubuntu2 fixed that
<pitti> didrocks: respinning u-netbook
<RAOF> Could someone please sponsor mesa 7.8.2?  http://cooperteam.net/Packages/mesa_7.8.2-2ubuntu1_source.changes & http://cooperteam.net/Packages/mesa_7.8.2-2ubuntu1.dsc - it's got a couple of fixes, most importantly a fix to stop Xserver 1.9 crashing when unity starts, so it needs to go in before 1.9 :)
<pitti> didrocks: argh, failed again; c-j isn't built yet, and the buildds are clogged :-(
<pitti> RAOF: sure
<RAOF> pitti: Ta.
<and471> mvo, is there any point me working on this bug if we are going to replace gdebi with SC? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gdebi/+bug/376966
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 376966 in gdebi (Ubuntu) (and 1 other project) ""Automatically Close" checkbox is not remembered (affects: 4) (heat: 24)" [Low,Triaged]
<and471> mvo, if there is me worth in fixing it, I wish to have consistency in synaptic and gdebi, so how do I access the configuration of synaptic?
<and471> (from gdebi)
<bilalakhtar> mvo: you there?
<mvo> and471: it would still be nice to fix it, other distros may wish to keep gdebi because it has less dependencies for example
<mvo> bilalakhtar: yes
<bilalakhtar> mvo: you got my mail?
<bilalakhtar> mvo: about synaptic
<bilalakhtar> and s-c
<mvo> bilalakhtar: yes, just read it, sorry that I haven't looked at the branches earlier and many thanks for working on it!
<and471> mvo, ok, so how do I access synaptic's config from another app (could you point me to a config file etc.)
<mvo> bilalakhtar: I check the code right away :)
<bilalakhtar> Super Thanks mvo !
<mvo> and471: its a "normal" apt config file that lives in /root/.synaptic, I can give you the magic to open it, hold on a sec
 * and471 is cloning evolution from git... urghh I thought git was meant to be fast...
<bilalakhtar> and471: bzr rocks! git is slow, that is known worldwide
<mvo> and471: apt_pkg.read_config_file() is the one
<and471> bilalakhtar, :)
<and471> mvo, thanks, I shall try to get it working
<bilalakhtar> and471: reason for that is that the .git folder in git trees is huge
<and471> bilalakhtar, yup...and my internet connection sucks :D
 * bilalakhtar has used git for one of his projects, then dumped it for bazaar
<and471> mvo, for apt_pkg.read_config_file(configuration: Configuration, filename: str)
<mvo> bilalakhtar: s-c fix commited, thanks
<and471> mvo, how do you recommend I create the config object?
<mvo> and471: well, you can use the apt_pkg.config one
 * bilalakhtar celebrates the sponsorship of his s-c fix thanks to mvo
<mvo> and471: I think :) its global, but synaptic has his own namespace
<bilalakhtar> mvo: and what about synaptic? is it needed? i suppose
<and471> mvo, yes but should I just create a blank one, or use the global?
<mvo> bilalakhtar: I modified it a tiny bit because dialog.run() would still block, check r949 if you are interessted (ideally the hide() bit would go into the glade file, for some reason that did not work when I tried it, but maybe you can make it work :) ?
<mvo> and471: the global one should be fine
<mvo> and471: all the stuff in the config file from synaptic is prefixed with "Synaptic::"
<mvo> and471: so no namespace clashes
<and471> mvo, ok cool thanks
<mvo> bilalakhtar: synaptic I look at next
<mvo> bilalakhtar: could you please set https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~bilalakhtar/ubuntu/maverick/software-center/papercut-fix-550955/+merge/30883 to merged? I merged it into lp:software-center and LP does not get that and waits for it to appear in lp:ubuntu/software-center (which it will only after the next upload)
<and471> mvo, sorry for bugging you, but I am using gdebit from launchpad to solve a bug, but I get this messageAttributeError: type object 'DebPackage' has no attribute 'VERSION_NONE'
<bilalakhtar> ok
<and471> mvo, do I need a new version or something?
<bilalakhtar> done
<mvo> and471: that sounds like a bug in the code, can you give me the full backtrace please?
<mvo> bilalakhtar: thanks, the synaptic fix looks nice too
<and471> mvo, http://pastebin.ca/1909926
<bilalakhtar> mvo: done
<bilalakhtar> ?
 * bilalakhtar celebrates again!
<mvo> and471: do you have the latest (maverick) python-apt ?
<and471> mvo, probably not
<mvo> and471: I think thats the reason, should be safe to get it from maverick
<and471> ok
<mvo> and471: or build a local version from lp:~ubuntu-core-dev/python-apt/ubuntu
<mvo> (or from lp:ubuntu/maverick/python-apt :)
<and471> mvo, I tried that but debuild shouted at me :(
<and471> hehe
<mvo> oh
<mvo> hm, try copying apt/debfile.py (the cowboy method ;) - that contains iirc all the required changes
<and471> haha
<mvo> bilalakhtar: you can set both synaptic branches to merged now, thanks again
<bilalakhtar> mvo: I should thank you!
<pitti> mvo: I'm currently trying the verification steps on bug 570583
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 570583 in ubuntu-system-service (Ubuntu Lucid) (and 1 other project) "does not check all required locks in is_package_system_locked (affects: 2) (heat: 53)" [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/570583
<pitti> mvo: but starting update-notifier doesn't seem to dbus-activate ubuntu-system-service at all
<pitti> so step 4 fails for me
<mvo> pitti: hm, that is odd
<pitti> ah, hang on, PEBCAK
<pitti> "apt-get install ubuntu-system-service/lucid" didn't actually downgrade, sorry
 * pitti runs again
<pitti> ah, works now
<mvo> cool :)
<and471> mvo, hmm, I just installed the package from here https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/maverick/i386/python-apt/0.7.95ubuntu2 but still get that error
<and471> mvo, is that a recent enough version?
<mvo> and471: yeah, that should be fine. so maybe its a real bug afterall, let me look again
<mvo> and471: yeah, real bug, let me fix
<mvo> and471: fixed in gdebi trunk (r327) - could you please check/verify?
<and471> mvo, sure
<and471> mvo, still get Exception while reading the filelist: ''DebPackage' object has no attribute 'control_filelist'' but it doesn't crash :)
<and471> mvo, thanks
<and471> mvo, after doing apt_pkg.config.set("Synaptic::closeZvt", str(autoclose))
<and471> mvo, do I need to call a function to update the synaptic config file
<mvo> and471: yeah, there is a dump() method, but it seems to be not exported via python-apt
<mvo> and471: actually I was incorrect, the python-apt version in maverick is slightly outdated, I fix that now
<and471> mvo, ok, so how do I update the config file?
<mvo> and471: I need to check what is the easiest way
<and471> mvo, ok thanks, no rush bbiab
<mvo> and471: maybe its to add the Dump() maethod
<and471> mvo, any progress?
<mvo> and471: not yet, sorry. got distracted
<and471> mvo, np
<and471> mpt, could I have a concrete decision on this so I can make a patch?
<and471> ...
<mvo> and471: here is how synaptic is doing it
<mvo> http://paste.ubuntu.com/410177/
<and471> come on launchpad....
<mpt> and471, sorry, on what?
<and471> mpt, sorry my internet is slow, I am waiting for a link to a bug...
<and471> mpt, here we go https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/lernid/+bug/546968
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 546968 in lernid (Ubuntu) (and 2 other projects) "Inappropriately appears in Ubuntu Software Center "Developer Tools" > "Python" (affects: 2) (heat: 37)" [Low,Confirmed]
<and471> mvo, wrong link?
<and471> mvo, that is some docky traceback
<mvo> and471: ups, sorry http://paste.ubuntu.com/470177/
<mpt> and471, I've never used Lernid, I've just read about it. From what I've read, it seems like Education would be a good category for it inside Applications as well as in USC.
<and471> mvo, yuck xO
<and471> mpt, it is just one else has responded, and so I just wanted to make sure there was someone else that agreed with Education
<mvo> and471: yeah :/
<and471> mpt, I shall make the patch now
<and471> mvo, I shall have a look at that in a bit
<and471> mvo, with the apt configuration format, I have Synaptic "" { at the start, what is the ""?
<karim__> something wrong with my ubuntu. sometime when I switch on the window border disappears.
<asac> is seb128 travelling?
<mvo> asac: yes, guadec
<mvo> asac: like the rest of the desktop team ;)
<asac> lazy bastardo ;M)
<asac> ah, so an orgy like situation ;)
<mvo> that describes a guadec pretty well I think
<asac> mvo: is someone taking lead responsibilities for desktop team while he is away?
<mvo> asac: I think he will be around on irc every now and then and read his mail
<mvo> asac: what do you need?
<asac> mvo: i need a say on whether desktop team is positive on getting mlterm in main
<asac> the RTL folks want a new terminal it seems ;)
<mvo> hm, my gut feeling is that we should make gnome-termianl better
<mvo> instead of having two
 * rickspencer3 reads up with interest
<rickspencer3> asac, I'm not sure that we need yet another terminal
<mvo> I guess guadec is the *perfect* opportunity to talk to g-t upstream about missing features for RTL
<rickspencer3> mvo, I might do that if I had a reason to care ;)
<chrisccoulson> hey rick, how's guadec going?
<rickspencer3> hi chrisccoulson
<ogra> alternatively just drop g-t :)
<rickspencer3> I haven't gotten to see too much of it so far
<ogra> mlterm can do LTR just fine *g*
<chrisccoulson> ogra - have you tried using mlterm? ;)
<ogra> chrisccoulson, not really, no, i'm just joking
<chrisccoulson> ogra - last time i tried it, it had a feature set on par with xterm ;)
<ogra> isnt that enough ?
<mvo> rickspencer3: heh :) I'm sure the arabic, hebrew, urdu and syriac users will much appreciate if we support them :)
<ogra> whi needs more than xterm
<ogra> *who
<mvo> but I don't really know what the problem with g-t is, what is missing to make it work etc so I better shut up
<rickspencer3> those languages don'
<rickspencer3> t work with g-t?
<rickspencer3> oh wow, there are a lot of supported encoding in mlterm
<mvo> I don't know if g-t is not working, or just not working well enough
<rickspencer3> or maybe it's find and they are asking out of reasons of pure irrelevant preferences
<rickspencer3> I'll choose that answer, since it means less work ;)
<mvo> haha
<mvo> indeed
<rickspencer3> oops
<rickspencer3> time to run to the session
<rickspencer3> later all
<asac> Riddell: ah you are here
<asac> rickspencer3: oops ... you ;)
<asac> rickspencer3: bug 603022
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 603022 in mlterm (Ubuntu) "[MIR] mlterm (affects: 4) (heat: 32)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/603022
<asac> could you say yes or no in that bug? i think arne was in favour, but i see the point posted that if users really need a RTL terminal as an end user
<asac> they will know how to get it
<rickspencer3> asac, why can't users just install it from Universe?
<asac> right
<asac> personally i think thats fine.
<asac> i asked if it wasnt confusing to have two terminals ... and he answers that RTL users will know
<asac> similarly i think they would know how to get it from software-center
<mvo> didrocks: if you see seb, can you ask him if gtks event handling had a massive regression in performance? just filling a gtk.ProgressBar from 1-100 takes 1.7s on my maverick system, my lucid netbook does this in 0.7 (and its a netbook, not a core2 duo etc)
<mvo> didrocks: regression in maverick
<asac> i lost all but 2 tomboy notes :((
<asac> loss rate: 998/1000
<highvoltage> asac: maverick?
<asac> anyone knows where tomboy stores them? i deleted some .XXX dirs during cleanup ... so it could be me rather than maverick
<asac> but the fact that 2 notes are still there feels like it was maverick
<asac> highvoltage: yes :(
<jpds> ~/.tomboy/
<asac> i didnt delete that ://
<highvoltage> I believe ~/.tomboy is the old location
<highvoltage> I think it's ~/.local/share/tomboy now
<asac> yeah. so i think i deleted those that were in .local
<asac> that sucks ;)
<highvoltage> hopefully you have backups :)
<asac> hope
<asac> nope
<highvoltage> :(
<asac> i really dont like .local ... that was 5GB in size
<asac> and i delted it because i didnt know that stuff is living there now ;)
<asac> but well. guess i will not do that again :/
<highvoltage> yeah getting used to it is kind of hard. but I kind of like that config is moving more and more to .config and local user data more to .local, it means I have less hidden files in my home directory to worry about (and it makes it easier to identify important directories to back up)
<didrocks> mvo: seb is looking at it
<mvo> didrocks: I can send him a small demo script if that helps
<seb128> hey mvo, would be useful
<seb128> could you give me details on your gtk version as well?
<seb128> mvo, unset UBUNTU_MENUPROXY
<seb128> does that make any difference if you do that before running your test?
<mvo> seb128: hey! I have the latest gtk in maverick
<seb128> mvo, can you give the exact version?
<seb128> mvo, just to make sure you don't have a ppa rgba or something?
<mvo> 2.21.2-0ubuntu5
<seb128> ok
<mvo> eh, sorry
<mvo> 2.21.2-0ubuntu6
<mvo> actually
<seb128> did those issues started recently?
<mvo> seb128: not sure, I recently noticed it, but I have no idea how recent it started
<seb128> mvo, did you try the unset?
<mvo> seb128: yes, no change, but I don't think its even set for me
<mvo> seb128: might be theme too, not sure. I see that u-m is slow as a crawl when it does "building data structures". this is partly a bug in python-apt that it calls update() too often
<seb128> ok
<mvo> seb128: but that was the same in lucid and there it was not *that* slow
<mvo> seb128: do you see the super slow update as well?
<mvo> seb128: or is it maybe card specific?
<seb128> mvo, the initial "loading"?
<seb128> it has always been slow there
<seb128> I'm not sure how much slower it is or not
<seb128> it takes some 5 seconds on my laptop config
<mvo> seb128: 5s is nothing, takes minutes here now (on both nouveau and ati)
<seb128> mvo, urg
<seb128> I didn't see that on any of my boxes
<seb128> using intel though
<seb128> mvo, could you try to force downgrade cairo to 1.8?
<mvo> seb128: script is here http://paste.ubuntu.com/470231/
<mvo> seb128: let me know what time it takes for oyu
<seb128> took:  0.179011106491
<seb128> mvo, ^
<mvo> seb128: woah, takes up to 3s for me
<mvo> seb128: imagine!
<mvo> seb128: radiance theme
<mvo> seb128: I will try the downgrade next
<seb128> mvo, same theme there
<seb128> mvo, try old cairo
<seb128> mvo, you can probably ld_preload it
<mvo> seb128: I can not downgrade it in isolation, I try downgrading the stack now and see what it gives me
<seb128> mvo, you can unpack the deb and ld_preload it
<seb128> no?
<mvo> seb128: too lazy ;)
<mvo> seb128: ok, so with downgraded stack 0.27s
<mvo> seb128: next is the ld_preload one
<mvo> seb128: new libgtk, old cairo, no change, still fast
<mvo> seb128: new cairo> slow
<seb128> right
<seb128> I've read some bugs about similar issues with firefox
<seb128> it seems worth raising on the cairo bug tracker
<seb128> seems driver specific
<mvo> seb128: yep, LD_PRELOAD confirms it, do you want a bug report?
<seb128> no, I've some
<mvo> seb128: with script and numbers?
<seb128> I want somebody having the issue to raise it to upstream
<seb128> new cairo hits a path which is slow on some drivers I think
<seb128> but not on intel
<mvo> seb128: ok, then please give me a bugnumber and I will attach my data
<fagan> mvo: I cant do much at the moment without a ubuntu computer to test on could you finish off my patch its in https://code.launchpad.net/~shanepatrickfagan/software-properties/software-properties-updates-changes
<fagan> the ui stuff is done
<fagan> just needs the backend to be finished
<mvo> thanks, I have look. but I'm afraid the "just" is more than just a just :)
<fagan> well the checkbox was removed and the rest is just more or less a rewording
<mvo> I mean, fixing the backend is a bit of work
<fagan> Oh yeah
<fagan> with the dbus stuff and all
<fagan> but I wasnt counting that :)
<mvo> yeah
<mvo> :)
<seb128> mvo, bug #595845?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 595845 in update-manager (Ubuntu) "During "Building data structures" when starting the update-manager Xorg takes up 100% cpu (affects: 12) (heat: 60)" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/595845
<seb128> mvo, I don't find the firefox bug now, need to search in my emails
<mvo> thanks seb128
<seb128> mvo, see bug #604822
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 604822 in cairo (Ubuntu) "libcairo2 1.9.10 makes Ubuntu 10.10 unusably slow (affects: 1) (dups: 1) (heat: 315)" [Low,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/604822
<seb128> mvo, not sure why it got closed
<mvo> seb128: ok, I moved bug #595845 to cairo
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 595845 in cairo (Ubuntu) "During "Building data structures" when starting the update-manager Xorg takes up 100% cpu (affects: 12) (heat: 60)" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/595845
<mvo> seb128: is it realisitic to get that in for alpha3? otherwise it will be not very useful for nvidia/ati users? or should I start adding hacks^Wworkaround for a3?
<seb128> mvo, try to talk to ickle on #cairo maybe about it
<seb128> mvo, I would like to know when that started and what users are affected
<seb128> mvo, "that" being a fix? I think somebody having the issue needs to talk to upstream
<seb128> but it seems it's buggy drivers
<seb128> so I doubt it will change this week
<seb128> bug #604824
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 604824 in cairo (Ubuntu) "libcairo2 1.9.10 makes Ubuntu 10.10 unusably slow (dup-of: 604822)" [Low,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/604824
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 604822 in cairo (Ubuntu) "libcairo2 1.9.10 makes Ubuntu 10.10 unusably slow (affects: 1) (dups: 1) (heat: 315)" [Low,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/604822
<seb128> ok, that's a duplicate of the one from before
<mvo> RAOF: do you have a idea aobut the driver issues around bug #595845
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 595845 in cairo (Ubuntu) "libcairo2 1.9.10 makes Ubuntu 10.10 unusably slow (affects: 12) (heat: 60)" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/595845
<seb128> mvo, try #cairo
<seb128> mvo, though I guess some of them are busy at GUADEC
<asac> alf__: there?
<asac> oops
<asac> lets move to right channel
<seb128> mvo, Company says a sysprof log would be useful on a bug
<seb128> if ickle doesn't have an idea about the issue
<mvo> seb128: sorry, I did not manage to talk to him yet (ickle)
<seb128> mvo, no worry he doesn't seem to be online, just open a bug if you want and I will ping him later about it
<mvo> seb128: ok, will do, thanks
<and471> vish, mvo, I have fixed the gdebi papercut and it should be ready for merging https://code.launchpad.net/~and471/gdebi/fix-376966
<and471> vish, there I think two more papercuts with fixes :)
<vish> and471: cool , now let me track down the maintainers.. gdebi is taken care of above^^ ;)
<and471> vish, hehe
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-07-29
<TheMuso> Anybody else get only a small amount of bugmail in the last 12 hours or so? Or did I really receive no audio bugmail overnight? :)
<Sarvatt> TheMuso: i got about 50 or so bug mails from ubuntu-x-swat in the past 12 hours, it does seem quiet :)
<micahg> TheMuso: ah, there was some LP read only time today, maybe that affected it
<TheMuso> Sarvatt: hrm ok
<TheMuso> micahg: Likely yes.
<pitti> Good morning
 * pitti merges libwmf to get desktop installable again
<baptistemm> hi there
<and471> mvo, mornin
<mvo> hey and471!
<and471> mvo, I have fixed the gdebi papercut and it should be ready for merging https://code.launchpad.net/~and471/gdebi/fix-376966
<mvo> and471: a quick question  lp:~and471/software-center/login-and-reviews-frontend	 <- should I merge this one ? or merge but exclude the review dialog bits?
<mvo> and471: nice, I have a look
<and471> mvo, gimme a sec
<mvo> and471: gdebi> looks good! many thanks
<and471> mvo, the method I use to write the config file is just as dirty as synaptic :D
<mvo> and471: yeah, not worse at least ;)
<mvo> and471: I have a look at the python-apt one (i.e. if I can add bindings to "Dump")
<and471> mvo, ok, it should be easy enough to drop that in
<and471> mvo, ok with lp:~and471/software-center/login-and-reviews-frontend
<and471> mvo, IIRC the login dialog works and meets the spec
<mvo> and471: login-and-review> ok, cool
<and471> mvo, the review dialog is not yet finished
<and471> however when you click the review button in the appdetailsviewgtk, it calls it up
<and471> (the login dialog)
<and471> so I suppose you could merge all as the login would appear, but not the review dialog as it is not hooked up to the login dialog yet
<mvo> and471: ok, should I just not include those bits in the merge?
<mvo> I guess the later
<and471> mvo, having the review dialog stuff in there wouldn't impact it, it just wouldn't ever be run
<mvo> and471: ok, if it does not break anything that should be fine :)
<and471> mvo, hehe don't blame me if it does :D
<mvo> lol
<mvo> and471: python-apt has a dump() method now, but it will not to nice indention
<and471> ah ok :)
<and471> mvo, can you drop that in, in the merge?
<mvo> sure
<didrocks> hey pitti
<didrocks> pitti: not only UNR, the desktop failed yesterday too, not matter. I took previous image first :)
<pitti> didrocks: I retried the librsvg build and merged libwmf, so it should be better now
<pitti> seems every day there's something else which breaks it
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, unfortunately :( Well, too late for the unity image, but good for A3 ;) thanks!
<pitti> didrocks: you can still use persistency and dist-upgrade
<pitti> didrocks: does it work reasonably now?
<didrocks> pitti: that's what I've done in fact, taking Monday's image and dist-upgrade
<didrocks> it works well, yes :)
<and471> see ya
<huats> morning
<ogra_> pitti, gwibber seems broken too
<ogra_>   gwibber: Depends: python-pysqlite2 but it is not installable
<ogra_>   gwibber-service: Depends: python-pysqlite2 but it is not installable
<pitti> ugh, http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/testing/maverick_probs.html is quite horrible
<pitti> something for kenvandine to fix, as it seems
<pitti> python comes with a current sqlite3 module
<ogra_>   * debian/control
<ogra_>     - Added a Depends for python-pysqlite2
<ogra_> ...
<ogra_> from the changelog :)
<pitti> kenvandine: ^ don't :)
<pitti> import sqlite3 as dbapi2
<pitti> is all you should ever need in python
 * ogra_ wonders why linux vs linux-meta is out of sync on arm
<ogra_> argh !
<ogra_> pitti, do you have power to promote a kernel from universe to main ? http://ports.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-ports/pool/universe/l/linux/
<pitti> sure
 * ogra_ doesnt get why that happens from time to time
<pitti> NEWing error, I assume
<pitti> someone forgot to override it to main
<ogra_> every tenth kernel upload or so
<ogra_> ah, its all manual ?
<ogra_> i thought there were some automatisms in place
<pitti> nope
<pitti> let me finish my current NBS slaughtery
<tkamppeter> I have a question about bug 610982. seb126 marked it "Invalid" without giving a comment. What is wrong with it?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 610982 in gconf (Ubuntu) "Problems when running gconf-based applications on a remote desktop (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [High,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/610982
<pitti> no idea
<pitti> might have been a glitich
<pitti> ogra: moved to main
<ogra> thanks a lot
<tkamppeter> pitti, so should I simply move it back to "New"?
<pitti> tkamppeter: please do
<tkamppeter> pitti, or add tasks for Thunderbird and OOo hoping that the maintainers of these apps would put more effort into it?
<tkamppeter> pitti, set back to "New".
<pitti> tkamppeter: it doesn't look liek a gconf problem, though, much rather a d-bus session bus one
<ogra> yeah
<tkamppeter> pitti, is seb128 on the GUADEC currently?
<ogra> we have that prob in ltsp since years
<pitti> tkamppeter: yes
<pitti> something needs to launch a session d-bus when you log in remotely
<ogra> its the problem that dbus cant connect to your local machine over the network
<tkamppeter> pitti, which package should I add then?
<ogra> there should be a session dbus but its not connected to the right instance
<pitti> tkamppeter: d-bus, but I'm sure there's an existing bug for it already
<tkamppeter> pitti, "dbus" added.
<tkamppeter> pitti, ogra, the app should connect to the GConf on the remote box, then it would not need to reach over the network. And it should fall back to defaults in case it does not find any GConf (for example if remote box is headless app server).
<ogra> connecting to an already running gconfd remotely has likely an xauth problem you need to solve first
<ogra> as a workaround you could just add a wrapper script that fires up a gconfd instance and a session dbus inside your ssh session
<tkamppeter> ogra, can I somehow reset the XAUth for this connection? Note that it works partially, I can open X applications which do not use GConf.
<ogra> i dont know, i havent touched xauth for two years and a lot changed
<rickspencer3> RAOF, are you still around at all?
<tkamppeter> ogra, thanks for the hints. I typed
<tkamppeter> /usr/lib/libgconf2-4/gconfd-2 &
<tkamppeter> in my SSH session and afterwards started "ooffice" out of it and it came up without any problems.\
<ogra> perfect
<tkamppeter> Also the already running thunderbird stopped freezing (so it caught up the gconfd).
<ogra> though be careful if you run a session on the machine that has a gconfd running too, they access the same db
<ogra> (if its the same user)
<tkamppeter> ogra, now the problem is how to get it automatically working, as before Maverick it worked.
<tkamppeter> ogra, this will be the subject of the bug now.
<ogra> i dont think there is a way apart from a wrapper script
<tkamppeter> ogra, did Thunderbird and OOo change so that they require GConf now (and so they worked correctly before Maverick as that time they did not need GConf)?
<ogra> i think they did require gconf before
<tkamppeter> ogra, but why did they work then before?
<ogra> heh, i dont know :)
<ogra> surely something has changed if it worked before
<ogra> but i wouldnt think the apps did in that respect
<ogra> gconf, dbus or xauth defaults changed i guess
<tkamppeter> ogra, which package provides the xauth defaults?
<ogra> i think thats xauth
<tkamppeter> ogra, added it
<RAOF> rickspencer3: Yeah, ish
<tkamppeter> ogra, thanks, I have added your suggestion to the bug report.
<rickspencer3> RAOF, nm
<rickspencer3> I was interested in working on my web cam widget
<rickspencer3> but it can wait until you're properly at work
<RAOF> Ah, ok.
<RAOF> I should point you at the gstreamer bug report about that, at least.  There's useful info there.
<rickspencer3> thanks RAOF
<RAOF> https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=599885 is the relevant bug, which suggests calling gdk_window_ensure_native in the realized callback for your window.
<ubot2> Gnome bug 599885 in gst-plugins-gl "[gtk examples] unstable behaviour with recent gtk (post csw merge)" [Normal,Resolved: fixed]
 * RAOF returns to his regularly scheduled thoughless daze.
<seb128> hey
<seb128> pitti, could you review the gnome-keyring sru I uploaded?
<seb128> it should fix gnome-keyring breaking in some locales when running a python-gnomekeyring software
<lool> Hmm I get:
<lool> [540752.124868] type=1400 audit(1280398892.803:86):  operation="file_mmap" pid=32403 parent=1 profile="/usr/bin/evince" name="/usr/lib/gdk-pixbuf-2.0/2.10.0/loaders/svg_loader.so" pid=32403 comm="evince" requested_mask="m" denied_mask="m" fsuid=1000 ouid=0
<lool> and some icons are broken
<lool> This looks like our apparmor profiles need an update
<lool> /etc/apparmor.d/abstractions/evince mentions /usr/share, but not /usr/lib
<seb128> hum, feel free to do the changes, not sure we will manage to do it from GUADEC
<lool> I looked, it seemed I would be able to do them but I don't trust myself to touch the apparmor profile
<seb128> can you cc jdstrand on the bug?
<seb128> he usually do those tweaks
<lool> Yup, saw him in the changelog
<pitti> seb128: we have an SRU freeze until after 10.04.1, unless it's a really urgent one
<seb128> pitti, it's breaking ubuntuone login on locales with non ascii chars in "default"
<seb128> ie french
<seb128> ie if that's the first keyring client you run the default keyring creation break and ubuntuone client crashes
<lool> LP #611248
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 611248 in evince (Ubuntu) "Broken icons in top bar (affects: 1) (heat: 8)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/611248
<seb128> we got bad press due that issue
<seb128> lunch time, got to go
<seb128> bbl
<didrocks> pitti: seb128 will read the backlog on my computer
<pitti> ah
<pitti> didrocks: well, as I said, we are currently SRU-frozen
<asac> hmm. latest gtk blasts my console with this:
<asac> (meloc:17190): GdkPixbuf-WARNING **: Cannot open pixbuf loader module file '/usr/lib/gdk-pixbuf-2.0/2.10.0/loaders.cache': No such file or directory
<asac> is that a known bug or did i hack a bug in my app ;)?
 * asac wonders if last upgrade maybe failed in the middle and checks
<didrocks> asac: seb128 says it's likely due to the gdkpixbuf split
<asac> great
<pitti> there was some churn this morning about that indeed
<asac> not so great i mean
<asac> seems that the pixbuf rendering is completely broken now (e.g. my gps map doesnt paint at all anymore ;))
 * asac goes and checks if a fix is already building
<asac> ah ... depenency problems prevented gtk stuff to configure
<asac> lets see if install -f cures it
<pitti> didrocks/seb128: do you think this can be tested very fast? we are still waiting on a new mysql, which will hopefully land today
<kenvandine> pitti, oh... doh!
 * kenvandine fixes
<pitti> hey kenvandine, good morning
<pitti> kenvandine: thanks
<pitti> kenvandine: oh, so it already used the sqlite3 module? that was easy then :)
<kenvandine> pitti, yeah... my mistake :)
<seb128> hey
<seb128> pitti, yes, it's easy to test
<seb128> pitti, just start a guest session in french and run a pythong-gnomekeyring software
<seb128> asac, did you fix your pixbuf issue?
<pitti> seb128: ok, looking
<pitti> seb128: so, no gnome 3.0 this time after all, eh?
<asac> seb128: i need to force upgrade
<asac> seb128: and then rebuild my project
<asac> (reconfigure + make)
<asac> i dont think thats the goal ;)
<asac> ... but yes, i am not blocked
<seb128> asac, why force upgrade? what conflicts do you get?
<seb128> pitti, you can run /usr/share/doc/python-gnomekeyring/examples/keyring.py
<seb128> to test
<asac> seb128: i dont know anymore... my upgrade apparently aborted and dist-upgrade lead to this afterwards:
<asac> You might want to run `apt-get -f install' to correct these.
<asac> The following packages have unmet dependencies: libgtk2.0-dev: Depends: libgdk-pixbuf2.0-dev (>= 2.21.0) but it is not installed librsvg2-dev: Depends: libgdk-pixbuf2.0-dev (>= 2.21.6) but it is not installed
<asac> E: Unmet dependencies. Try using -f.
<asac> -f fixed that
<seb128> did you have any file conflict in the log before?
<asac> seb128: http://paste.ubuntu.com/470693/
<asac> that caused:
<asac> (gtk-update-icon-cache:16320): GdkPixbuf-WARNING **: Cannot open pixbuf loader module file '/usr/lib/gdk-pixbuf-2.0/2.10.0/loaders.cache': No such file or directory
<asac> Errors were encountered while processing: /var/cache/apt/archives/libgdk-pixbuf2.0-dev_2.21.6-2ubuntu1_i386.deb
<asac> Log ended: 2010-07-29  12:35:29
<asac> which made this configuring fail
<seb128> hum, k, weird
<asac> seb128: do you need more info?
<asac> i think its a migratio nissue ... maybe you moved something that is missing during configure?
<seb128> asac, robert_ancell did the update and we are at GUADEC this week
<asac> also the fact that my app previosly built against the old gtk failed then doesnt feel right
<seb128> asac, I will ping you next week if I need infos
<asac> e.g. why do i need to reconfigure/rebuild.
<seb128> well upgrade worked fine there
<seb128> you should not need to, there is a trigger which should update that cache
<asac> ok. i think it was not "running", but just building
<asac> so thats fine i guess
<seb128> I'm wondering if that's another case of "the directory the triggers watch was not there before upgrade so the trigger doesn't work"
<asac> e.g. reconfigure was needed to find the right files during build etc.
<micahg> seb128: good call on GNOME 3:)
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> re
<seb128> mvo, hey
<seb128> asac, is your upgrade log somewhere online?
<seb128> asac, /var/lib/dpkg/info/libgdk-pixbuf2.0-0.postinst does create this cache
<seb128> I'm not sure how that broke
<mvo> hey seb128
<seb128> mvo, how are you today?
<mvo> seb128: good, thanks. better than yesterday :)
<mvo> seb128: how are you? how is guadec?
<seb128> mvo, got a cold
<seb128> other I'm fine
<seb128> GUADEC is nice
<seb128> nice to talk to people there
<seb128> the presentations are not so interesting though
<mvo> seb128: hope you get well soon
<mvo> seb128: I can imagine its great to talk to all the people face-to-faceagain :)
<seb128> yeah
<cassidy> seb128, that's because you didn't saw my presentation yet :p
<seb128> cassidy, I guess ;-)
<seb128> asac, do you use the ubuntu-desktop ppa?
<asac> seb128: i hope not
<seb128> asac, ok, can you put your upgrade log online?
<and471> mvo, thanks for the merge
<mvo> and471: hi! cheers, not in trunk yet, but not much missing :)
<and471> mvo, thats fine :)
<mvo> and471: the state transitions seems to be not fully caputred yet, but I got distracted by other work
<mvo> it looks very nice
<and471> mvo, are we talking about gdebi or SC?
<and471> mvo, just got your email, I was thanking for the merge of gdebi :)
<and471> mvo, yeah the login stuff is not fully completed yet, hopefully I should be able to do some more work on it
<mvo> and471: oh, gdebi - yeah, thanks for this too :)
<and471> mvo, so gdebi is in trunk, but not SC?
<mvo> and471: yeah, see mail. sc has some small issues, probably just a matter of ~30min of debugging and tweaking
<and471> mvo, yeah, the SC thing is fine, I stopped work on it a while back so I could not really remember whether it was fully implemented
<mvo> ok
<and471> mvo, you have any experience with gstreamer?
<and471> jono, or could you help out? http://pastebin.ca/1911073
<and471> this doesn't seem to work, and yet the cli pipeline works fine
<jono> and471, what are you doing? recording video and audio?
<and471> jono, yup
<jono> and471, I recommend you ask in #gstreamer - I haven't hacked with gst for quite a while
<and471> jono, ok, I asked in there but maybe I should wait a bit longer
<jono> and471, :)
<Jefro> hi folks - anyone going to LinuxCon with Ubuntu 10.04 CDs?  I'm giving a desktop linux presentation and would love to have a few CDs from each distro on the table.
<tatertot> I was wondering if anyone has any relevant information on what career is looking more promising.  I am trying to decide between Network Admin. and Database Admin.  I need to lock it down before I start selecting classes for Summer semester.  Any advice?
<desrt> free software hacker is looking pretty good
<desrt> i recommend that one :)
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-07-30
<cjohnston> kenv[phone]: its been 5 hours since gwibber updated FB
<kenv[phone]> Gt
<kenv[phone]> That is facebook throttling us :(
<cjohnston> :-(
<cjohnston> when you get a chance to chat, I have something I want to talk to you about.
<cjohnston> I thought that there was supposed to be a chance that fixed the throttling
<kenvandine> cjohnston, yeah it'll take time
<kenvandine> we need enough users to get the update so the usage goes down
<pitti> Good morning
<baptistemm> heya
<pitti> mvo: guten Morgen
<mvo> hey pitti, good morning
 * pitti hugs mvo
<and471> mvo, hi, to work on the logindialog stuff, do I use the trunk branch or my branch? (have you done more work on in, on top of mine in trunk)?
<and471> hi mpt, vish
<mpt> Good morning
<and471> grhh, I just read the whole GNOMe census thing and now I am grumpy :(
<mvo> and471: I think best is to just merge my changes into your branch and then work from that
<and471> mvo, ok, will do
<didrocks> good morning
<and471> didrocks, mornin
<didrocks> hey and471
<didrocks> vish: thanks for the link, I'll have a look at next cheese upload
<pitti> hey didrocks
<didrocks> good morning pitti, how are you?
<pitti> I'm great, thanks. how are you? last guadec day?
<seb128> hey
<seb128> hey pitti
 * pitti hugs seb128
 * seb128 hugs pitti back
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, last guadec day :)
<and471> mvo, I have some conflicts in appdetailsview_gtk
<and471> mvo, what is the 'application-request-action' signal?
<mvo> and471: its when the app wnats to get installed or removed
<mvo> and471: we handle that in app.py to not have action code in the view itself
<and471> mvo, ok
<and471> mvo, is that recent?
<mvo> and471: yeah, sometimes last week iirc
<and471> ah ok
<and471> mvo, is the signal (that I have created) ok 'review-submit-requested' (in terms of phrasing etc.)
<mvo> and471: yeah, I thnk that is fine
<vish> hey didrocks and471 :)
<and471> mvo, http://paste.lisp.org/display/112974
<vish> didrocks: np , neat thanks.
<vish> and471: yay! michael committed the lernid fix ;)
<seb128> mvo, hey
<and471> vish, :)
<vish> and471: pretty soon upstreams are going to get tired of me ;)
<and471> vish, haha
<seb128> mvo, is there any way to run something in a package directly after unpack?
<seb128> ie not wait on the postinst to run
<vish> and471: i think we would need a debdiff for that to get fixed for the Ubuntu package
<and471> vish, yeah or wait for a new packaging
<and471> vish, ask michael if he intends to do a new release in ubuntu anytime soon because if not then we will need to make a debdiff
<vish> and471: hmm , i dont think he does the packaging , didrocks uploaded it last time
<vish> and471: lernid hasnt changed much either , since the last upload
<and471> vish, I shall have a look later today
<vish> and471: or maybe it has, there have been a few commits since 2/24.. :)
<huats> morning
<mvo> seb128: hi, what is the use-case?
<seb128> mvo, gtk update
<seb128> mvo, there is a cache for the pixbuf loaders
<seb128> but the cache update happens in the postinst and triggers now
<mvo> seb128: so you want to break the "unpack/configure" cycle for gtk so that its immediatley configured
<seb128> but it seems some other postinst scripts need the loaders and run before the gtk postinst script
<mvo> seb128: what about a dpkg trigger? not quite immediate though
<seb128> well we have a trigger
<seb128> asac had the issue yesterday
<seb128> I had similar issues in my log
<mvo> seb128: so the cache format is no longer compiatible, is that the issue?
<seb128> gtk-update-icon-cache can be used in other postinsts before gtk update the cache
<seb128> no
<seb128> we used to patch gtk to not use a cache but go read all the files in a dir rather
<seb128> slomo dropped that in favor of a trigger now
<seb128> but it seems that's not doing the job
<mvo> seb128: do you have a bugreport or something to look at? I don't fully understand what breaks, if something else updates the icon cache, that should be fine, no? its a cache etc?
<seb128> what I understand of the issue is
<seb128> gdk-pixbuf is unpacked
<seb128> other things are unpacked
<seb128> <software> is configured
<seb128> the software.postinst runs update-gtk-icon-cache
<seb128> which complains that there is no svg gdk pixdbuf loader installed
<seb128> that's because it doesn't find the cache which lists the pidbuf loaders
<seb128> then gdk-pixbuf is configured
<seb128> which creates the cache
<seb128> but the update-gtk-icon-cache call in the middle failed to work
<seb128> mvo, you can ask asac for a debug log
<seb128> asac, I got your email but the log file is not in your userdir
<and471> mvo, I seem to have python-debian installed, but 'from debian import deb882' doesn't work - no module named debian
<geser> and471: which version of python-debian?
<and471> geser, in the lucid repos
<seb128> mvo, did you upgrade gtk yet since yesterday?
<and471> geser, do I need the maverick version?
<seb128> mvo, could you watch your upgrade log to see if you had warnings about loaders.cache?
<geser> and471: yes, python-debian 0.1.15 renamed "debian_bundle" to "debian"
<and471> geser, ah okay, thanks
<mvo> and471: you need the maverick version, but you can also add
<mvo> hey geser :)
<and471> mvo, thanks, geser got it sorted :)
<mvo> and471: you can add "try: import debian except ImportError: import debian_bundle
<mvo> and471: that is actually a good idea, as I suspect some people will follow development on lucid systems
<and471> mvo, will do
<and471> mvo, where did all the fancy hover effects for the categoryview go?
<mvo> thanks and471
<mvo> and471: a couple of days ago, I like them
<and471> mvo, sorry maybe you misunderstand, when I
<and471> used SC before
<and471> in the catview, there was a hover effect, like a GTK button
<and471> but now it is not there?
<mvo> and471: mpt did not like them
<mvo> and471: I liked them though
<and471> mvo, ah, yeah me too :(
<seb128> kenvandine, pitti: hey
<seb128> kenvandine, pitti: could one of you attend the r-t meeting today for our team?
<seb128> I will be in the train to the airport at that time
<pitti> unfortunately not, I have a job interview at 17:00
<seb128> ok
<seb128> kenvandine, ^
<seb128> I guess you are still sleeping but I don't know when I will be online later on
<seb128> just tell them that most people are at GUADEC and be available for questions if we can
<seb128> we -> you
<asac> seb128: the url i gave you doesnt work?
<asac> seb128: https://chinstrap.canonical.com/~asac/term.log
<and471> mvo, could you explain what the different login backends (SSO and launchpad) are actually for? I don't really understand :)
<mvo> and471: its a bit of a historal thing, LP was first, ideally eventually LP will go away
<mvo> and471: and we use single-sign-on exclusively
<and471> mvo, ok
<and471> mvo, how are we going to store the credentials of the SSO?
<mvo> and471: the gnome-keyring
<and471> mvo, I am setting it up, so that it should be able to work with remebered passwords and not ask everytime
<and471> mvo, however I don't have experience with gnome-keyring so I cannot do that backend part
<mvo> and471: there is a a tests/gnome-keyring.py
<mvo> and471: should should help you getting started (if you are interessted :)
<and471> mvo, ah ok, maybe I can then :)
<and471> mvo, yay reviewing is now hooked up :)
<cjohnston> kenvandine: gotcha
<nigelb> mvo: poke?
<nigelb> mvo: can you take a look at bug 399711? Somone just came into #ubuntu-reviews asking if someone can review it.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 399711 in software-properties (Ubuntu) "add-apt-repository ppa:username does not add deb-src entry (affects: 5) (heat: 36)" [Low,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/399711
<mvo> nigelb: sure
<mvo> nigelb: looks fine
<nigelb> awesome :)
<nigelb> you're set as reviewer, so maybe you can accept for now and merge it in later when you get the time :)
<asac> hmm ... pixbuf the second. firefox trunk doesnt build anymore here ;)
<asac>                  from /home/asac/Development/upstream/mozilla/mozilla-central/xpcom/base/nsSystemInfo.cpp:45:
<asac> ../../dist/system_wrappers/gdk-pixbuf/gdk-pixbuf.h:3: fatal error: gdk-pixbuf/gdk-pixbuf.h: No such file or directory
<asac> chrisccoulson: ^^
<asac> chrisccoulson: ignore it for now ;)
<chrisccoulson> asac - micahg saw that yesterday too with other software
<asac> i wanted to do a clean rebuild to update pkg-config info etc. but failed to do so it seems
<asac> chrisccoulson: yeah. i already had that with other software, but usually a reconfigure was enough
<asac> lets see what comes out of the fresh build i am doing now
<chrisccoulson> i've not had a chance to look at it yet
<asac> dont bother. most likely its fine
<asac> just a header relocation, which means you need to rerun configure in built trees
<asac> i will let you know what happens with the fresh rebuild here
<and471> mvo, you here?
<mvo> and471: yes
<mvo> and471: yes
<and471> mvo, I have hooked gnome keyring into the login backend so we can remember authorisations
<and471> mvo, is it okay we store the item in the login keyring?
<mvo> and471: I think it is
<and471> mvo, let me rephrase that, is that where you planned to put it?
<mvo> heh :)
<mvo> and471: I had/have not fully made up my mind yet, I'm not a keyring expert, but I think its fine, epiphany and friends use it too for this purpose, but its worth double checking that they actually do
<and471> mvo, yeah I was looking and eveything seems to store it in there, I don't think we want the user to have a separate password just for SC
<and471> sabdfl, great post :)
<sabdfl> thanks and471
<sabdfl> now trying to follow my own advice and not get sucked into the vortex
<and471> it is hard, I read that this morning and wanted to write some flamey blog post, but instead I watched Mock the Week and that calmed me down :D
<vish> and471: heh , will fizz out soon... ;)
<and471> I hope so Dr vish :D
<vish> :)
<and471> mvo, the gnome-keyring stuff is fully hooked up now, works perfectly :)
<and471> mvo, I shall push my fixes, not quite ready for merging tho
<mvo> and471: sweet
<and471> mvo, I need to speak with mpt as we can't remember the password - only the auth
<and471> mvo, so this https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SoftwareCenter?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=review-single-sign-on.jpg
<and471> mvo, doesn't really work
<and471> rephrase - make sense
<and471> mvo, do you know about the status of the online review service? Is that going to be ready anytime soon?
<mvo> and471: not for maverick I think, it would be awsome though. its not hard, just takes a person willing to work on the django code
<mvo> most of it is there
<and471> mvo, that would be too big a leap for me :)
<and471> mvo, for the keyring, do we need the secret?
<mvo> what secret?
<mvo> sorry, faulty memory :)
<and471> mvo, ah maybe I have implemented this incorrectly
<and471> mvo, right so with a keyring item you have an attribute called a 'secret'
<and471> mvo, and then a set of attributes/details
<and471> mvo, I have put all the auth stuff into the details, but maybe it should be in the secret
<and471> is there anyone with some expertise/knowledge on gnome-keyring?
<mvo> and471: yeah, the secret stuff needs to go there
<and471> mvo, ah ok
<and471> mvo, it is unfortunate, as the details are really easy to parse, they just come out as a python dictionary :)
<and471> mvo, you will see in the keyring stuff, instead of updating values, I have just told it if we already have a keyring in there, to delete it and create a new one
<and471> mvo, I have found it not to be reliable to update existing one, I just lost pretty much all of my keyrings :)
 * pitti pokes mvo
<mvo> and471: *meh* bad
<mvo> hey pitti - sorry was at dinner
<pitti> mvo: no problem :)
<and471> mvo, are there some docs for ubuntu sso? I need to find out the name of the person signing in
<mvo> and471: hold on, I vaguely remember about that
<and471> mvo, thanks, also I cam across this https://launchpad.net/ubuntu-sso-client. I just wanted to check there was no duplication of effort here
<and471> *came
<pitti> good night everyone, have a nice weekend!
<and471> you too
<mvo> and471: oh, this one. yeah, this is work that we may use. it depends on how far it is and how unbranded
<and471> mvo, I haven't done all this work for nothing have I?
<mvo> and471: no, I don't think so. but I hope the two can merge in the long run
<and471> mvo, oh good :)
<mvo> and471: but its a good point that you raise, we definitely need to talk
<and471> mvo, any luck with the docs?
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-07-31
<and471> didrocks, are you the maintainer for lernid?
<nigelb> and471: he's not
<nigelb> the maintainer is mbudde
<and471> nigelb, okay thanks
<and471> nigelb, is that in regards to packaging as well?
<and471> nigelb, that was my real question
<nigelb> and471: ah, its a universe package.  there isn't a point of contact maintainer like debian has
<and471> nigelb, yup, I was asking as I want to update the package
<nigelb> and471: if you want to do it, go for it
<nigelb> and471: ah, you want to do the "move lernid to appropriate section bug"
<nigelb> you can do it yourself and request sponsorship :)
<and471> nigelb, will do :)
<and471> nigelb, thanks for you help
<and471> *your
<nigelb> no problem :)
<and471> vish, attached a debdiff for https://bugs.launchpad.net/hundredpapercuts/+bug/546968
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 546968 in lernid (Ubuntu) (and 2 other projects) "Inappropriately appears in Ubuntu Software Center "Developer Tools" > "Python" (affects: 2) (heat: 16)" [Low,Fix committed]
<and471> vish, it fixes about 8 bugs
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-08-01
<hiredgun555> how do i change system sounds
<and471> vish, I am updating this gpsdrive package
<and471> vish, it is horrible Xp
<vish> and471: :)
<vish> and471:  hmm , about the other lernid debdiff , i dont think sponsors will upload a huge patch for that without a separate bug , have you asked in -motu about that diff?
<and471> vish, no not really
<vish> and471: err , i meant to say , *could you ask* in -motu :)
<vish> and471: iirc its one of those [needs packaging] bugs..
<and471> vish, well all the packaging is done, that debdiff just needs to be sponsored
<vish> and471: yeah , i *think* they prefer such changes as a needs packaging bug.. i'm not sure though ;)
<and471> vish, ok I will bear it in mind
<matthiaskrgr> hello
<matthiaskrgr_> I have a problem playing dvds
<matthiaskrgr_> Is this the right channel?
<and471> matthiaskrgr_, try #ubuntu, this is more for development
<matthiaskrgr_> ok, thanks
<matthiaskrgr_> bye
<and471> matthiaskrgr_, no problem
<and471> vish, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gpsdrive/+bug/498705/comments/10
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 498705 in gpsdrive (Debian) (and 3 other projects) "gpsdrive is incorrectly categorized in software-center (affects: 1) (heat: 8)" [Unknown,New]
<vish> and471: aw.. looks like you tried getting help from -motu too..
<and471> vish, :(
<and471> vish, I tried but I came to a point where I thought, if this package ends up working, it is by luck and will probably have loads of bugs - some with the real expertise needs to give it a crack
<and471> vish, plus I didn't really have a clue about the package itself
<and471> vish, though I did some of the hard work with the patches :)
<micahg> and471: does the newer debian version help at all?
<sense> Could anyone on Maverick check if any error messages are printed to the console when they execute 'import gtk; tmp = gtk.Menu()' in a Python console? I get errors about NULL pointers and invalid types when I do so.
<and471> micahg, no not really, it is updating a very old version of a package that has really changed a lot
<micahg> and471: a new upstream version bug has not been reported in debian, I would suggest doing that
<and471> micahg, sure, but the maintainer has not been active for a very long time https://bugs.launchpad.net/debian/+source/gpsdrive/+bug/498705/comments/7
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 498705 in gpsdrive (Debian) (and 3 other projects) "gpsdrive is incorrectly categorized in software-center (affects: 1) (heat: 8)" [Unknown,New]
<micahg> and471: 4 months isn't a long time
<micahg> and471: some people are impatient
<micahg> *inpatient
<and471> micahg, those aren't my words :) I didn't write that comment, just followed the advice of the commenter who knew more about the package than me
<vish> micahg: you were right the first time ;)
<micahg> vish: heh
<and471> micahg, I shall file a bug and hope something is done
<micahg> and471: sometimes, better to see for yourself http://packages.qa.debian.org/g/gpsdrive.html
<vish> yay! and471 on the way to becoming a motu ;)
<and471> heh, not even close...
<vish> and471: i said on the way , at the start of course ;p
<and471> :)
<and471> micahg, vish, filed in debian :)
<dupondje> hi guys, I got some question, want to report a bug on a strange issue, but don't know what package would be the issue
<dupondje> The bug is: when for example firefox is on top of my screen, and I close the app (press the cross left on top) it closes not firefox, but the other program that runs also (for example terminal)
<and471> dupondje, I have also seen this issue but neglected to file it...
<and471> dupondje, try filing it in metacity
<dupondje> i'll do :)
<recognizer> hi, everybody knows how to fix a problem with the mouse cursor?. It doesnt appear when I start my session
<recognizer> I have ubuntu 10.04 with Gnome
<dupondje> and471: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/metacity/+bug/612304
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 612304 in metacity (Ubuntu) "When closing application, not always the application with the focus is closed (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Undecided,New]
<and471> dupondje, cool :)
<and471> recognizer, try #ubuntu
<and471> sense, I get the behaviour you described on Lucid as well
<sense> and471: That's weird.
<sense> Must be a bug in GTK+ or PyGTK.
<and471> sense, bad update or something?
<and471> sense, I only just got it today, I have been developing on pygtk all this week without it
<sense> and471: Strange. Did you recently got an update for GTK+?
<and471> sense, can't remember, though I think I did recently update
<and471> sense, is there a list of recently updated packages?
<sense> and471: You could take a look at <https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gtk+2.0> to see if an update was recently released.
<sense> and471: Which was five weeks ago.
<sense> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pygtk
<sense> says the last release on Lucid as 28 weeks ago.
<and471> sense, yeah but I was hoping to see if there was a wider thing so I could look if any recent packages were associated with gtk :)
<sense> and471: There is a 'lucid-changes' mailing list.
<and471> sense, can you check that, I will check my software-center
<sense> ok
<and471> sense, the first thing I can see is yesterday I upgraded libgtk2.0-common
<sense> ah
<and471> sense, it has a weird version 2.20.1-0ubuntu2+menuproxy11
<sense> and471: That could explain the menu related thing: it means that GTK+ version contains aptches to enable GtkMenuProxy, which is required for AppMenu GTK+.
<sense> That gives me a clue where to search. :)
<sense> Thanks and471!
<and471> sense, no problem glad I could help :)
<and471> sense, make sure if you find the problem to backport it, these messages are annoying when developing :D
<sense> and471: Will do!
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-07-25
<didrocks> good morning
<RAOF> Hey didrocks.  Good morning!
<didrocks> hey RAOF!
<RAOF> My internal clock's all off.  pitti hasn't clocked on, so I don't know what time it is!
<didrocks> heh :-)
<jbicha> howdy
<jbicha> I got my first patch into Gnome today so I'm happy
<didrocks> jbicha: nice!
<TheMuso> RAOF: afaicr pitti is off for 2 weeks, as evident by him not actually being on IRC. :)
<RAOF> Yeah, I know.
<bschaefer> didrocks: Good morning for you, I am pretty sure this new patch is done. I just need to add some more test and do some more
<RAOF> But his lack is all messing up my regular schedule :)
<didrocks> bschaefer: excellent news! do you have any interaction with the debian maintainer? as he's upstream, I think he should be the contact point, and then, we "just" sync :)
<TheMuso> awwwww
<jbicha> I've got this ready for review: https://code.launchpad.net/~jbicha/ubuntu/oneiric/transmission/transmission-2.33/+merge/68936
<bschaefer> didrocks: Yup, I am pretty sure I handled everything he wanted changed
<bschaefer> didrocks: So just some more testing and then everything should sync up haha
<didrocks> bschaefer: excellent, tell me when he takes the patch upstream, then, I'll just sync ubuntu to his version
<didrocks> :-)
<bschaefer> didrocks: Alright!
<didrocks> bschaefer: thanks again for your tremendous work there!
<bschaefer> didrocks: No problem is was very fun acutally doing applied Formal Language instead of pure theory haha
<didrocks> heh, I don't know enough about xapian to qualify hacking on it is "fun" or not :)
<bschaefer> haha, yeah some of the code was pretty rough to read. That's why I just wanted to Lexer to handle the CJK
<bschaefer> but he wanted the parser too so I had to read up on the lemon parser generator then it was pretty easy to insert code
<didrocks> hum, about this parser generatorâ¦ It's like if you were talking chinese to me
<didrocks> which is totally in the context though :-)
<bschaefer> Haha yeah. I wish I knew at lease the semantics to any of the CJK languages
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<didrocks> hey chrisccoulson!
<didrocks> how was your week-end?
<chrisccoulson> hey didrocks. yeah, it was good thanks. how about you?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: was too short, but fine :-)
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i know that feeling :)
<didrocks> heh!
<didrocks> thunderbird wanted to give me a day off
<didrocks> I started it, and again, no treeview on the left
<didrocks> restarting it hasn't done anything
<chrisccoulson> same error as before?
<didrocks> i had to reboot my session (no upgrade nothing)
<didrocks> yeah
<didrocks> and then, it was ok
<chrisccoulson> hmmm :/
<didrocks> seems quite fragile, I haven't done any update since Friday
<chrisccoulson> no extension upgrades or installs?
<didrocks> now it's ok, but not that nice for users if they start and "where are my emails" :p
<didrocks> nothing at all, I generally boot, and then, do my upgrade
<didrocks> (after finishing the "morning backlog reading"
<didrocks> )*
<didrocks> do you think that those kinds of errors are only triggered by large mailbox?
<chrisccoulson> i wouldn't have thought so
<chrisccoulson> it's going to be a fun week :)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: why? :-)
<chrisccoulson> trying to figure out what's going on ;)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: oh, you meant s/week/cycle-from-now-and-for-ever-debugging-thunderbird-issues then? :)
<desrt> good morning, world
<chrisccoulson> good morning desrt
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, tkamppeter had the same issue as you on friday btw
<chrisccoulson> this one is going to cause me to lose some sleep ;)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: you mean, I'm not the only poor sool?
<didrocks> :)
<didrocks> soul*
<didrocks> hey desrt
<desrt> word up
<desrt> dbarth: g'morn
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: oh, you will take my long nights on evolution, but that's only because you wanted it! :)
<Sweetshark> Morning, all!
<dbarth> desrt: hi Ryan
<desrt> Sweetshark: hihi
<didrocks> hey Sweetshark!
<desrt> seb128: trying to fix the eventfd mess properly today
<seb128> hey desrt
<seb128> desrt, ok
<desrt> i'm writing a clean and easily-unit-testable abstraction for "give me something that i can use to wake up a poll in another thread"
<desrt> with unix pipe, eventfd and windows semaphore implementation
<desrt> will help avoid the #ifdef ratsnest in gmainloop and gcancellable
 * desrt is at the write-the-tests part
<seb128> robert_ancell, hey
<seb128> robert_ancell, how are you?
<seb128> robert_ancell, do you want the unity greeter to be default for alpha3?
<chrisccoulson> hey seb128
<seb128> hello chrisccoulson
<seb128> chrisccoulson, how are you?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, how are you?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I was just looking at your bluez bug
<chrisccoulson> i'm good thanks
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I'm fine thanks
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, i was going to just upload bluez, but i can't upload it ;)
<seb128> now in the desktop set?
<seb128> not
<chrisccoulson> it's not
<seb128> it's weird, we had a diff not building that part because it was moved to udev
<chrisccoulson> this bluetooth problem has been bugging me for weeks
<seb128> it got moved back to bluez now?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, it's been deleted entirely from udev
<seb128> ok, fair enough
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I can sponsor it for you but could you email cjwatson about getting it added to the desktop set?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, can do. do you think it's appropriate for the desktop set?
<seb128> yes
<seb128> in practice nobody out of desktop worked on it for years
<chrisccoulson> it seems what i really need to do is complete my application for core-dev ;)
<seb128> so if we do the actual work we can as well have the actual rights to do it
<seb128> that as well
<seb128> RAOF, hey
<RAOF> seb128: Ho!
<seb128> RAOF, how are you?
<Kaleo> desrt: hi hi
<RAOF> seb128: A bit cold.  Apart from that, pretty good :)
<seb128> great
<seb128> RAOF, I was wondering if you had a practical issue with the gnome-keyring SRU out of the fact that it modifies a session component
<Kaleo> desrt: it seems we have some issues with change notifications of dconf properties using dconf-qt from QML on Oneiric
<seb128> RAOF, seems your "doesn't apply for a SRU" make some users not happy ;-)
<RAOF> seb128: Mostly that it's a borderline SRU - it didn't seem to have a sufficiently high reward:risk ratio.
<RAOF> ie: It seemed to be annoying on boot, but not after that, and not that annoying.
<seb128> RAOF, some people have to enter their password 5 times on login and disagree with you
<RAOF> They'd be even less happy if the upload broke the cryptography, or caused the keyring to not work at all, orâ¦
<RAOF> That patch looked pretty safe and sane, though.
<seb128> right, that was going to be my point
<seb128> the patch is shipped in GNOME3, oneiric and we have proposed
<seb128> we can let it a few weeks in proposed if we can solid testing
<RAOF> As I said, it looked borderline to me.  I'm prepared to be convinced that there's a higher reward than I estimated.
<seb128> well I know it's one of the first things pgoodall talked to me about at UDS about natty
<desrt> Kaleo: which types of properties?
<seb128> RAOF, seems it's a pretty annoying bugs for lot of people and a bit of a show stopper to "sell" Ubuntu
<seb128> RAOF, it still is mostly cosmetic but having to enter your password 5 times seems to bother users who want to enter it 0 times a lot ;-)
<RAOF> :)
<seb128> RAOF, well I just wanted to made a point for it, I will not push further or force any decision ;-)
<RAOF> They're always going to have to enter their password at least once, which kinda makes autologin something we shouldn't actually allow.  It does suck, though.
<Kaleo> desrt: right now I am struggling with a string
<Kaleo> desrt: it works fine on Natty though
<seb128> RAOF, right, or we should call it unsecure and set an empty keyring password as well
<desrt> Kaleo: very odd....
<desrt> Kaleo: a backtrace could be helpful
<RAOF> seb128: That would also work.
<Kaleo> desrt: yeah
<Kaleo> desrt: right now my Oneiric machine died
<Kaleo> desrt: though it's trivial to reproduce
<Kaleo> desrt: http://pastebin.com/qbUrFyRv
<RAOF> seb128: I'll think it over again.
<desrt> Kaleo: i do not presently have the means to run that
<desrt> Kaleo: please get me a backtrace when you can
<Kaleo> desrt: it's going to be hard for you to fix if you cannot run it :)
<seb128> RAOF, thanks, no hurry to decide on it don't worry, I will comment on the bug to say that the issue is mostly cosmetic and the patch on a key session components so something that's not trivial to change in a stable update
<desrt> Kaleo: i was hoping you would fix it :)
<bschaefer> \msg njpatel, Hello and good morning for you.
<njpatel> bschaefer, hey hey
<bschaefer> haha opps
<bschaefer> njpatel I had a quick question about a Makefile.mk in Xapian
<bschaefer> njpatel: Olly wanted me to add the cjk-tokenizer.h in there but I see two places to put it
<njpatel> bschaefer, will have to see the file, one sec
<bschaefer> yeah I was pulling it up haha
<njpatel> bschaefer, which directory in xapian?
<bschaefer> xapian-core/queryparser
<njpatel> bschaefer, is the header needed by users of xapian or only internally?
<bschaefer> only internal
<bschaefer> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~brandontschaefer/xapian/cjk-support-patch/view/head:/xapian-core/queryparser/Makefile.mk
<bschaefer> I put it in the noinst_HEADERS but I saw Mikkel put a header file in the lib_src section also
<njpatel> bschaefer, I think noinst_HEADERS is fine
<bschaefer> njpatel: alright, I also finish merging the CJK tokenizer into the CFG/Parser sooo hopefully he will like it haha
<njpatel> bschaefer, excellent
<bschaefer> just trying to get the finishing touches on it to make another patch haha
<didrocks> desrt: I'm sure you are really eager to add that to dconf-qt http://people.canonical.com/~didrocks/02_link_again_dconf_dbus.patch :)
<seb128> GunnarHj, hi
<seb128> GunnarHj, just for info pitti is on holidays for 2 weeks
<seb128> GunnarHj, so better to ask review from ubuntu-desktop as well rather than blocking on him
<desrt> didrocks: i've already been carrying that patch for a white
<desrt> it's been on master for at least 20 seconds now
<GunnarHj> seb128: Hi Sebastien, thanks for letting me know; suspected that when I noticed he isn't logged in here.
<desrt> maybe more like 1 minute now that i think again :)
<didrocks> desrt: waow, time goes so fast! :)
<GunnarHj> seb128: Thought I'd ask you for help later today, since my latest idea involves multiple packages. Hope that's ok.
<seb128> GunnarHj, sure, seems another things worth an email to the ubuntu-desktop list
<seb128> GunnarHj, rodrigo works on the control center upstream and has been working on the region code so he would be good to talk to
<seb128> GunnarHj, today is an holiday is spain though, he will be back tomorrow
<GunnarHj> seb128: Yeah, I had planned to talk to Rodrigo as well. Possibly a mail list topic, not sure yet...
<seb128> ok
<seb128> didrocks, btw new zg in debian, do you want to take the .1 update and reverse the raptor build-depends to the old version while you are at it?
<didrocks> seb128: I commented on the sync request RainCT commented on and assigned it to doko
<didrocks> opened*
<seb128> hum, ok
<seb128> I would just reverse the build-depends in a -1~oneiric and tell doko to sync once he fixes the raptor issue
<seb128> but your call
<seb128> i.e I would fix zg now and block the sync on doko rather than blocking the fix on doko
<didrocks> seb128: can do as well, for sure
<seb128> well your call
<seb128> depends how much the breakage annoys the zg guys
<seb128> it might take a bit before doko has time for that
<seb128> especially if he's to debconf
<didrocks> yeah, let's do that
<didrocks> seb128: happy patch pilot day! :-)
<seb128> didrocks, thanks ;-)
<seb128> mvo__, hey
<seb128> mvo__, I'm having software-properties issues ;-)
<seb128> Traceback (most recent call last):
<seb128>   File "/usr/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/softwareproperties/gtk/SoftwarePropertiesGtk.py", line 641, in on_isv_source_toggled
<seb128>     self.backend.ToggleSourceUse(str(source_entry))
<seb128>   File "/usr/lib/pymodules/python2.7/dbus/proxies.py", line 143, in __call__
<seb128>     **keywords)
<seb128>   File "/usr/lib/pymodules/python2.7/dbus/connection.py", line 630, in call_blocking
<seb128>     message, timeout)
<seb128> dbus.exceptions.DBusException: com.ubuntu.SoftwareProperties.PermissionDeniedByPolicy: com.ubuntu.softwareproperties.applychanges
<seb128> mvo__, when tried to toggle a ppa in "other softwares" tab
<mvo__> seb128: ok, I check it. but you did do a successful auth?
<seb128> mvo__, it didn't ask me to auth
<mvo__> seb128: is the policykit agent running?
<seb128> mvo__, hum, seems not
<jibel> is there a way to disable the message indicator for thunderbird ? It is the same than xchat and I miss most of the pings on irc.
<seb128> mvo__, ok, that's it, sorry for the noise
<seb128> mvo: works great once it's running ;-)
<robert_ancell> seb128, yeah, been working like crazy trying to get everything finished, two weekends in a row :)
<robert_ancell> seb128, so yes, I'm just packaging the new version now - are you guys ok supporting it?
<seb128> robert_ancell, ok
<seb128> robert_ancell, yeah, supporting broken upstream code drop is our job :p
<mvo> <mvo> hrm, network is really unstable today
<mvo>  seb128: did you get my last question about the agent?
<robert_ancell> seb128, I really wanted to get it released last week, but the usual software issues crept up on me
<seb128> robert_ancell, but yeah don't worry about eventual issues we will deal with those
<robert_ancell> brb, just checking the package works
<seb128> robert_ancell, is there anything we can do to help you get the new version out?
<seb128> mvo, it was not running indeed, works once it's started
<robert_ancell> seb128, I'll tell you in one minute :)
<mvo> seb128: can we fix this please, like with a auto-restart flag in the desktop file ;)
<seb128> mvo, there is one, I'm just on partial update with a gnome which knows about Unity as a desktop value and with a .desktop which has OnlyShowIn=GNOME
<seb128> i.e stupid issue on my side
<seb128> need to get the update which added Unity to the OnlyShowIn
<mvo> eh, so â¦ it used to be possible to use try: except: with pygtk, if I try "try: Gio.Settings("something") except: something" my app does not catch any exception but instead runs into a GLib-GIO-ERROR. what is the way to do it in the new-world-order?
<mvo> seb128: great, thanks
<seb128> mvo, what are you trying to do?
<seb128> mvo, g_settings_new used to call abort on missing schemas, that's fixed in the glib update that is pending upload
<seb128> mvo, if the issue you are trying to fix is deal with missing schemas
<mvo> seb128: yeah, that is the issue
<seb128> mvo, it took only 2 years to convince desrt ;-)
<mvo> well, its fine to have a exception in this case â¦
<mvo> but not a unhandlable one
<seb128> well they say it's part of the installation and that if it's not installed your install is corrupted
<seb128> in the same way that the binary could be corrupted
<seb128> so there is no real point to try to deal with it out of stopping
<cdbs> didrocks: ping, brasero's done https://code.launchpad.net/~bilalakhtar/brasero/unity-launcher-integration/+merge/68940
<didrocks> cdbs: nice! I'll have a look shortly :)
<cdbs> didrocks: yeah, I've just updated the branch, a moment ago, if you have downloaded it already then pull it up :)
<didrocks> cdbs: the code looks good. However, I have no cd burner right now to test it, can you pease subscribe the sponsoring list as well?
<seb128> didrocks, do you need testing with a real drive to see it makes the right calls?
<didrocks> seb128: not sure, maybe it can work creating an iso from another iso in brasero, I never tried if it's even possible with brasero
<seb128> didrocks, ignore me, I though it was static .desktop lists, I've read the diff now
<didrocks> no worry :)
<seb128> didrocks, recording a directory to an iso should work I think but i'm not sure ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: oh, isn't it your patch pilot day? ;-)
<seb128> didrocks, indeed ;-) can have a look after lunch if you want
<didrocks> excellent, thanks seb128 :-)
<seb128> robert_ancell, I guess the half an hour before coming back is not a good sign for the new version?
<didrocks> still trying to figure out those qml non updating on dconf change
<seb128> didrocks, yw ;-)
<robert_ancell> seb128, heh, it's a bad sign for the unity greeter, I'll fix that tomorrow
<seb128> robert_ancell, does current gtk greater let you log in if you have no .dmrc or a protected user directory? ;-)
<seb128> robert_ancell, if it does I think we are fine for a3, though it would still better to not break the unity greeter for those who run it
<robert_ancell> seb128, I haven't tested that yet, it probably is still broken, will look at it tomorrow
<seb128> robert_ancell, ok, there is a one liner patch on the bug which is assigned to you
<seb128> robert_ancell, it's a check for a null value
<robert_ancell> seb128, the new package is in lp, could you test it?  Unity greeter users will revert to the GTK+ greeter, I'll upload a fixed unity-greeter package tomorrow
<seb128> robert_ancell, ok, do you need feedback now, or should I just play with it today and drop you an email to say how it went?
<robert_ancell> seb128, yeah, I saw the bug go by, but I've just been sprinting to get the 0.9 release out, only just got back to looking at bugs
<robert_ancell> seb128, I think if we're going to change to it for A3 we should do it with at least one day of testing.  I'm happy to upload it right now, but a second opinion would be good
<seb128> robert_ancell, ok, let me build it ;-)
<ronoc> mvo, ping
<ronoc> this com.ubuntu.systemservice - does it only appear when there is something to report ?
<ronoc> currently i have set up a watch on its dbus name
<ronoc> when it appears I will check the rebootrequired method
<seb128> robert_ancell, brb with new lightdm
<ronoc> mvo, I need though more information about this systemservice (because i can't see it through d-feet right now)
<ronoc> i presume because i don't need to restart
<robert_ancell> seb128, good news?
<seb128> re
<seb128> robert_ancell, no
<seb128> I had to use gdm to log in
<seb128> lightdm switched me to the gtk greater
<seb128> it let me enter my login and password and then seems to start loading the session for a second and send me back to the greeter
<robert_ancell> seb128, can you paste the log?
<seb128> which on? lightdm.log?
<robert_ancell> yup
<seb128> robert_ancell, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/651688/
<seb128> "[+38.68s] DEBUG: Adding session authority to /home/seb128/.Xauthority
<seb128> [+38.68s] WARNING: GError set over the top of a previous GError or uninitialized memory."
<seb128> robert_ancell, ^ I wonder if those are my logging try
<robert_ancell> yes, it looks like it
<seb128> robert_ancell, can I help debugging it in some way?
<robert_ancell> could you touch ~/.Xauthority and see if that makes a difference?
<robert_ancell> I'm fixing up the GError code, damn this is easier in Vala...
<seb128> trying
<seb128> robert_ancell, is there a way to start a lightdm in xephyr or something from my session?
<robert_ancell> there's --test-mode, but you can't run a xephyr and have it register with lightdm (this release)
<seb128> robert_ancell, with a .Xauthority it starts
<robert_ancell> seb128, ok, interesting the regression tests don't pick that one up
<seb128> robert_ancell, I got keyring unlocking prompt after login so dunno if the pam integration got buggy with the new version or what's going on
<robert_ancell> I get that too...  it doesn't happen in GDM?
<seb128> no
<seb128> it didn't happen in lightdm before the update either
<ronoc> mvo_: did you see my questions above ?
<ronoc> mvo_, pinga ring ?
<seb128> robert_ancell, the new lightdm works fine on my nb btw, with or without a .Xauthority, dunno what's the difference
<robert_ancell> ok, that is weird...
<seb128> robert_ancell, dunno if that's to be with my user being on ecryptfs on my laptop
<robert_ancell> are you logged in on a terminal and keeping the home dir open?
<seb128> yes
<seb128> robert_ancell, brb doing another testing without Xauthority on this box
<sebguest> robert_ancell, re under a guest session
<sebguest> so lightdm refuses to let my user in after a fresh reboot
<robert_ancell> sebguest, hey, can you reproduce it?
<sebguest> switching to a vt and login in shows my user dir has a .Xauthority from now
<sebguest> i.e time I tried to log in
<sebguest> which is non null
<robert_ancell> sebguest, does it occur for users without encrypted dirs?
<sebguest> robert_ancell, yes, happens on a fresh boot on my laptop
<sebguest> robert_ancell, is there any way I can go back to the greeter to try to log with another user?
<sebguest> or should I log out of my guest session?
<sebguest> the indicator user switching doesn't do anything
<robert_ancell> sebguest, open d-feet, and go to org.freedesktop.DisplayManager.Seat0
<robert_ancell> and run SwitchToGreeter()
<sebguest> robert_ancell, ok, my test user works
<sebguest> so seems limited to my ecryptfs main account
<sebguest> let me ecryptfs an user on my nb to see if that bug as well
<sebguest> wth?
<sebguest> I can log in with my user by switching to the greeter now
<sebguest> brb
<seb128> re
<seb128> robert_ancell, ok, sorry for the delay
<seb128> robert_ancell, so yeah, same think on my nb with a test user
<robert_ancell> np, I tried an encrypted user and had the same problem
<seb128> it's somewhat ecryptfs specific
<seb128> robert_ancell, ok, anyway I'm set up to debug on my nb as well now but I guess if you get the issue you can as well directly debug ;-)
<robert_ancell> yeah, I'm scratching my head though
<cyphermox> good morning
<seb128> hey cyphermox
<cyphermox> hey seb128
<seb128> robert_ancell, it's weird I managed to log in a few times but I can't find steps to make it work or if that's random
<seb128> like before it worked when I switched to the greeter with d-feet and tried to log in but it doesn't do it now
<robert_ancell> seb128, I think it's the home dir not getting mounted, perhaps there's a race
<seb128> robert_ancell, but I can confirm the pam keyring integration being broken on any user, ecryptfs or not
<seb128> not sure if that could be the same bug
<mvo__> ronoc: hey, I did not see your question, I have a bit of network trouble today
<ronoc> mvo__, no worries, could you send me details via email the system service dbus interface, so as i can code it up.
<ronoc> mvo__, i need to grab some lunch
<robert_ancell> seb128, ok, I won't chase that red herring
<ronoc> mvo__, bbiab
<mvo__> ronoc: sure
<ronoc> mvo__, thanks
<ronoc> mvo__, does it only appear on the bus if a restart is required ?
<mvo__> ronoc: its a auto start service, one way is to query it after a transaction of aptdaemon, but I guess I can actually add something into aptdaemon so that you can check after a finished aptdaemon transaction if a reboot is required
<mvo__> ronoc: does that sound easier?
<glatzor> hello mvo__ what do you need?
<ronoc> mvo__, I was going to put a dbus watcher in place for it whereby once it appears on the bus I will query it. but yes it would be easier if I get all i need from the apt dbus interface
<ronoc> mvo__, I have the watcher in place though
<ronoc> so its okay as is, i'm assuming I will need to watch for that name appearing onthe bus
<ronoc> when it appears query for a systemrestart
<ronoc> simple as that i hope
<ronoc> mvo__, ^
<mvo__> glatzor: a property/information if a restart is required after the transaction finished. wdyt?
<ronoc> mvo__, yep property changed signal would be just grand
<mvo__> ronoc: eaiest is to simply ask after each transaction if a reboot is required, but I will talk with glatzor about that now too
<mvo__> ronoc: have lunch first :) afterwards we should have something worked out :)
<ronoc> ok i'll hold off and work on something else
<ronoc> mvo__, perfect I'm starving :)
<glatzor> mvo__, how do you want to get the information from the system? the old stamp file mechanism? or by using a package white list?
<mvo__> glatzor: yeah, the good old stamp file, if its not there before the transaction but there after, we know it got created
<mvo__> glatzor: not sure if its worthwhile to carry "no-reboot, new-reboot-notification, already-existing-reboot-notification". or if there should simply be a "restart recommended" property in the transaction if we find the file
<mvo__> glatzor: its on /var/run and should be safe to reply on
<seif> didrocks, around
<didrocks> seif: on debugging stuff right now :)
<seif> didrocks, why do i have an ugly "me indicator" besdie the session one
<didrocks> seif: define "ugly" :)
<seif> didrocks, http://imgur.com/tXh7u
<glatzor> mvo__, why do you want to put it into the transaction at all?
<glatzor> mvo__, we cannot make any predections if the file will be created during the transaction
<jbicha> seif: yeah, the portrait doesn't look anything like you, :-)
<didrocks> seif: if you see your name, it means that you have more than one user on your computer
<seif> and the icon :P
<seif> jbicha, yeah i thnk i am fluffier :P
<mvo__> glatzor: not before, but when it finished, we know. well, it does not have to be in it, it would just be a convinient way for the apps to show a reboot-recommended msg if needed and without the need to query another interface
<glatzor> should we add a property to org.debian.aptdaemon?
<seif> didrocks, what about the icon
<didrocks> seif: not sure about it, better to talk to John/mpt about it :)
<mvo__> glatzor: hm, that is a nice idea
<mpt> hi there glatzor
<seif> mpt, is this normal http://imgur.com/tXh7u
<seif> or do i have something wrong installed
<jbicha> could someone please fix bug 798951
<glatzor> hello mpt!
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 798951 in gnome-panel "Applications menu fails to open due to change to /etc/xdg/menus/gnome-applications.menu" [Undecided,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/798951
<mpt> seif, yes.
<mpt> seif, it follows the spec at least.
<jbicha> mpt: which spec?
<mpt> jbicha, for the device menu and user menu. I'll see if I have permission to make it public now that it has been implemented.
<didrocks> desrt: ah, so got a reproducible test case for some fun with qm and dconf-qt. So, if you take this qml file: http://paste.ubuntu.com/651733/
<didrocks> desrt: all is fine if you try to change the value with gsettings set org.gnome.desktop.background picture-uri "file:///usr/share/backgrounds/Fabric_by_Just_Jeanette.jpg" for instance
<mvo__> glatzor: do you want to go ahead with it or should I give it a go and propose a merge?
<jbicha> not trying to stir up trouble, but private design is annoying
<didrocks> desrt: if you try with g-c-c, I get: process 31085: type invalid 0 not a basic type
<didrocks> desrt: dconf-editor is working though, no idea of what g-c-c can do differently in the gsettings/dconf level?
<jbicha> it's hard to tell what's already been decided and what's still open to getting bugs and improvements
<desrt> didrocks: maybe g-c-c is doing multiple sets
<desrt> which causes the change signal to arrive differently
<didrocks> desrt: you mean, sending multiple values in a row or multiple times the same one?
<desrt> didrocks: could be that i handle that case incorrectly in either dconf-qt or libdconf-dbus-1
<desrt> didrocks: dconf has a facility for performing multiple changes at the same time
<desrt> ie: grouping multiple writes into one
<seb128> jbicha, hey, yeah having public spec is better
<didrocks> desrt: ah, yeah, that may be the cause then. Any chance you have a look?
<desrt> maybe gcc is doing that
<desrt> didrocks: maybe later today or tomorrow
<didrocks> desrt: no hurry, thanks a lot! :-)
 * desrt is trying to smoke this eventfd issue
<glatzor> mvo__, oh a merge would be nice :) my niece is paying me a visit and I am still sitting at my work doing DRBD perfomance tunings :)
<mvo_> glatzor: ok, I will hack on it next
<didrocks> desrt: they are indeed using g_settings_delay() so I think you're right :)
<desrt> didrocks: let me take a quick look at dconf-dbus-1
<didrocks> desrt: no hurry, make seb128 happy first! :-)
<desrt> oh god
<desrt> i hate libdbus-1
 * desrt remembers writing this code, bad flashbacks
<didrocks> :)
<desrt> nothing obvious.  is it a crash?
<desrt> can i get a trace?
<didrocks> desrt: it's not a crash, just a warning shown
<desrt> can you trace to the warning?
<didrocks> desrt: sure, one sec
<desrt> either enable fatal warnings or gdb and break on g_logv...
 * didrocks needs to build dconf-qt with dbgsym first
<kenvandine> didrocks, have you ever used the dee resource manager?
<didrocks> kenvandine: no, I don't even know what this is. I've just been a dee client right now, why? :)
<didrocks> cf your tweets from this week-end?
<kenvandine> i have it working for one model...
<kenvandine> not really
<jbicha> hmm, I have 2 gnome-shell patches sitting in bugzilla for over a week, I guess I have to chase someone down in IRC
<kenvandine> didrocks, it does the on disk cache of the model
<kenvandine> i want that for startup time
<kenvandine> i have it working for one of my models
<kenvandine> but not both
<kenvandine> the cached file is on disk... but it fails to load it
<kenvandine> with no error or crash
<kenvandine> so a pita to debug
<didrocks> kenvandine: I think you should either chase neil or kamstrup then :)
<kenvandine> and apparently on kamstrup has ever used it :)
<kenvandine> s/on/only
<didrocks> I just used it for one model
<didrocks> as an experiment :)
<kenvandine> the concept is awesome :)
<didrocks> (didn't know it was called dee resourcec manager now, was dee dump before)
<didrocks> desrt: hum, I'm afraid it's even not a gwarning: doesn't break on it, and it really doesn't look like that ("process 488: type invalid 0 not a basic type"). More a QML/qtdeclarative thing
<desrt> :(
<chrisccoulson> g'ah, invisible windows again
 * kenvandine wonders if it is possible for sourceforge to be any harder to use
<bdrung> is someone working on updating glib2.0 to 2.29.14?
<seb128> bdrung, yes, but it breaks gtk < current so they need to be updated together
<mclasen> you can update gtk first...
<seb128> bdrung, you can try an updated combo in the ubuntu desktop ppa if you want, there is the new glib and a patched gtk being tested there
<bdrung> thanks, but i will wait. i am busy with other stuff
<seb128> mclasen, can you? gtk 3.1.10 depends on glib 2.29.14
<seb128> mclasen, there is the unit change from desrt, and the 3.1 fix for the glib change doesn't check versions so shouldn't work on an old glib
<mclasen> seb128: ah, bummer
<seb128> well anyway I've glib done, I'm working on the new gtk and I will upload both ;-)
<mclasen> I just remembered that desrt committed an extra hack to make the pspec hack work with old and new glib
<seb128> right, he did on 3.0
<seb128> but not on 3.1 since git was already requiring the current glib for the new unit api
<mclasen> ah, right
<desrt> seb128: could you do an experimental upload for me?
<desrt> seb128: i have a somewhat sizable patch...
<seb128> desrt, sure
<seb128> desrt, you can probably upload easily in your own ppa as well
<desrt> true.
<desrt> except that fedora doesn't package dput :)
<seb128> dput is just a wrapper
<desrt> and (more importantly) i don't have a working gpg key here
<seb128> you can ftp and put
<seb128> ok, that's another issue ;-)
<desrt> both problems will be fixed once i return home
<seb128> where is the patch?
<desrt> let me figure out which patches are the important ones here
<seb128> can you email it to me maybe?
<desrt> do you prefer 4 separate or one big?
<seb128> what is best for you, one is probably easier
<desrt> okay.  let me rebase a bit.
 * desrt makes a new branch
<seb128> did you find an issue?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, did you say you got the same error in the error console with tbird this morning? (tree is undefined @ chrome://messenger/content/folderPane.js:885)
<chrisccoulson> or did you not check?
<chrisccoulson> and this was with the current beta (rather than the nightly)?
<desrt> seb128: i've found a few more, actually
<desrt> actually, i'm not quite ready yet.  sorry.
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: it was the current version in oneiric, and yeah, it was that error IIRC
 * desrt remembers one more bug he has to fix first
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, thanks. i'm wondering if the startup cache thing was a red herring. the current beta doesn't use the same mechanism for the cache as the nightly
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: I hope it's the issue and that people won't get it under a normal load
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: apart from that, I'm pretty please with thunderbird TBH
<chrisccoulson> cool :)
<didrocks> I just hoped that I can get a global "group by thread" property and I didn't have to tell for each subfolder to check to get the notification
<didrocks> but search is fast and responsive, contrary to jono, I'm pleased with it compared to evolution  :)
<didrocks> I never use tabs though
<chrisccoulson> didrocks:
<chrisccoulson> <chrisccoulson> can anyone think of a condition that would cause tree to be undefined at http://hg.mozilla.org/releases/comm-beta/file/4f152e919649/mail/base/content/folderPane.js#l889 ?
<chrisccoulson> <Standard8> chrisccoulson: bienvenu has a patch for that
<chrisccoulson> ;)
<chrisccoulson> (from #maildev)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: roh nice! that clearly means that you will maybe be able to sleep during nights and week-ends! :-)
<didrocks> lucky you ;)
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i'm glad
<seb128> hate hate update-manager
<sagaci> i disable it
<seb128> why do you list ppa updates if you refuse to install them because they are not signed
<seb128> let's use apt-get
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=658534
<ubot2> Mozilla bug 658534 in Folder and Message Lists "can't collapse+expand accounts in folder pane, tree is undefined" [Normal,New: ]
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: great, will you integrate that soon in our thunderbird beta?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, there shouldn't be any need. i think they'll land it on the current beta anyway
<didrocks> ok :-)
<desrt> seb128: okay.  you have the patch in a mail
<seb128> desrt, thanks
<desrt> seb128: running the tests here one more time to save you the trouble if i accidentally broke something while rebasing :)
<seb128> desrt, ok ;-)
<desrt> seb128: seems fine.  be sure to update the symbols file :)
<seb128> desrt, ok ;-)
 * kenvandine runs out for an early lunch break... be back in about an hour
 * desrt wonders what TZ ken is in
<ronoc> mvo, any decisions been made ?
<seb128> desrt, he's in north carolina
<seb128> desrt, it must be 10am his time
<desrt> early indeed :)
<seb128> desrt, but he wakes up at 6am or something
<desrt> ah
<mvo> ronoc: we will add a property to aptdaemon for the restart required, I will hack on it later
<ronoc> mvo, perfect, will move on to something else in the interim.
<ronoc> mvo, thanks
<mvo> thanks ronoc
<dobey> seb128: hi. is https://code.launchpad.net/~dobey/ubuntu/oneiric/ubuntu-sso-client/release-1-3-2/+merge/68910 on your list too? :)
<seb128> dobey, yes
<dobey> seb128: great, thanks
<seb128> yw
<GunnarHj> seb128: Thanks for your comment on the MP. Your reaction was kind of expected... ;-)
<seb128> GunnarHj, ;-)
<GunnarHj> seb128: Do you think it would a good idea to move those scripts to a package of their own? I mean a pure Ubuntu package for now, even if I agree that it would be good if it could go upstream later on.
<seb128> GunnarHj, you will have an hard time to get somebody to understand those changes before pitti comes back I think, but it can be good to try to get a bit of the logic and what we need described so we can start doing thinking on how that should work
<didrocks> mterry: hey, do you have some time for a short MIR review? bug #815919
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 815919 in dconf-qt "[MIR] dconf-qt" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/815919
<GunnarHj> seb128: It's not rocket science. :) But wouldn't a creation of a separate package contribute to a clarification of the logic?
<seb128> GunnarHj, yes, it seems those script should live in either a new source or in some of langpack or locale binary
<seb128> GunnarHj, i.e we should just have the logic to use them in the tools
<seb128> GunnarHj, thinking about it language-selector should work to have those
<seb128> easier than added a source
<GunnarHj> seb128: That was my original thought, but Martin didn't think it would be appropriate to make l-s a dependency of the other packages.
<seb128> GunnarHj, he has a point, but maybe the source should be l-s and they should create a new language-selector-scripts binary
<seb128> that one would be a pretty small depends
<GunnarHj> seb128: Yes, small indeed. :)
<GunnarHj> seb128: Martin mentioned accountsservice also, but personally I think the idea with a new l-s binary sounds like a better idea.
<GunnarHj> seb128: Would you like me to make an attempt to create such a l-s binary? That way the code would hopefully be better organized tomorrow when Rodrigo is back.
<seb128> GunnarHj, hum, thanks but I think that can wait a bit, we will probably not reach any conclusion while pitti is not there
<seb128> GunnarHj, what would help is a summary of the different pieces and what they do
<seb128> so we can think of what is doing what, where they should be hosted and if they can be done in an upstream friendly way
<seb128> what we will do over time is move some of those logical bits where they made sense and not as something ubuntu specific if we can
<seb128> like the list of locales, etc ought to be the same on any distro
<mterry> didrocks, ok
<desrt> seb128: poke me with the build link when you have it?
<seb128> desrt, will do
<desrt> thx
<seb128> desrt, I'm just finishing sorting the glib,gtk updates to oneiric and once the vcs is clean I will do a ppa update on top of that
<desrt> ah.  that sounds reasonable.
<desrt> did you get a 3.1 with the gparamspec fixes?
<seb128> desrt, yes
<seb128> 3.
<desrt> sweet
<seb128> 3.1.10
<mterry> didrocks, who is consuming the -dev for dconf-qt?
<didrocks> mterry: unity-2d right now
<mterry> didrocks, and the hope is that we try to avoid a maintenance burden by warning other potential users about the unstable ABI in the description?
<didrocks> mterry: indeed, it's really the same than using dconf directly btw
<didrocks> with the frontend/backend part
<didrocks> so I warn at least, what we don't do in other packages :)
<mterry> didrocks, I see, the QML is the stablish frontend?
<didrocks> mterry: indeed, it shouldn't change
<mterry> didrocks, but unity-2d is too special to use the QML?  :)
<didrocks> mterry: it uses a great part of C++ as well
<didrocks> not only QML
<GunnarHj> seb128: I fully agree that as much as possible should go upstream in the end. But since that reasonably won't happen before the Oneiric release, there is a need to do something in the meantime, and l-s is undergoing big changes anyway.
<GunnarHj> seb128: Since we are agreed that the scripts should not be in g-c-c, I think I'll move them to l-s for now, well aware of the risk that it may be a wasted effort. But that way I would achieve a set of MPs that at least I think make sense. :)
<GunnarHj> seb128: I'll also think about that summary of the different pieces you'd like to see.
<seb128> GunnarHj, thanks
<dupondje> In what package is the code to enable/disable touchpad? Cause I have a bug when enabling/disabling my touchpad.
<seb128> dupondje, gnome-settings-daemon
<seb128> chrisccoulson, oh, you had rights for bluez added, great one thing less to sponsor today :p
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah :)
<chrisccoulson> thanks to cjwatson
<chrisccoulson> it's nice that i can use my bluetooth adapter again :)
<chrisccoulson> i really missed that at the rally, as my travel mouse is bluetooth
<didrocks> seb128: short patch lifetime for nautilus \o/
<seb128> didrocks, nice work getting things upstream there ;-)
<didrocks> heh :-)
<ronoc> seb128, do you know much about gudev (i don't see pitti online)
<seb128> ronoc, not really, pitti is on holidays for 2 weeks
<ronoc> seb128, ah doh
<seb128> ronoc, try asking on #ubuntu-devel
<seb128> ronoc, or on #udev
<ronoc> seb128, will do thx
<mterry> tremolux, if a package has multiple .desktop files, how does software-center pick among them?
<mterry> (in terms of which .desktop file it grabs info from)
<tremolux> mterry: sorry, in a call, I'll be a few minutes
<didrocks> kenvandine: I'm talking with scottk, and they have appmenu-gtk2/3 for enabling by default appmenu support for gtk apps when you install some (they use appmenu in their netbook flavor)
<didrocks> kenvandine: he's suggesting that we downgrade the dep as suggests and try to avoid shlibs-gen to bringing it by excluding gtk2/3
<didrocks> I think it makes sense to make, WDYT?
 * kenvandine thinks
<didrocks> if we install an app using it, it will dep on gtk2 or gtk3
<didrocks> so we will have the dep
<kenvandine> sounds fine
<kenvandine> indeed
<kenvandine> how do we keep shlibs from bringing in the dep?
<didrocks> and without it, the component is just useless and won't be used
<didrocks> kenvandine: I'll do it if you want :)
<kenvandine> please do :)
<didrocks> it's a -X question, just need to find the right path
<kenvandine> cool
<kenvandine> awesome, thx!
<didrocks> yw :)
<Sweetshark> jasoncwarner_: ping?
<tremolux> mterry: heyo, so the short answer is that we show them all
<tremolux> mterry: is there a specific thing you are seeing?
<mterry> tremolux, well, let's say a package has two desktop files with different names.  Which gets used?
<mterry> tremolux, just wondering which .desktop file to put my X-Ubuntu-Software-Center-Name key in
<tremolux> mterry: when I tested that feature, I used deja-dup.desktop ;)
<mterry> tremolux, K.  Do you know why that one got picked?
<mterry> tremolux, (over deja-dup-preferences.desktop or deja-dup-ccpanel.desktop)
<tremolux> mterry: hmm, I'm not sure of the answer to that, let me look (fwiw I used it in my test because it seemed the obvious choice)
<tremolux> mterry: the reason is that those other desktop files are not included in app-install-data
<mterry> tremolux, ah, fascinating.  do you know how app-install-data decides which to slurp?
<mterry> tremolux, hmm, seems like it sucks down a tarball created by mvo on rookery
<mterry> tremolux, and newer versions of that tarball include deja-dup-ccpanel.desktop as well as deja-dup.desktop.  So I'm curious how software-center will act then
<didrocks> kenvandine: it seems that libdbusmenu takes more time to build all the packages itself than to build the upstream code
<kenvandine> yeah....
<kenvandine> it is a pita
<seb128> didrocks, the gir stuff is slow
<seb128> didrocks, if you want to optimize dh_gir... you're welcome ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: dpkg-genshlibs is slow as well :-)
<didrocks> and no, I've done some perl last week, it was enough for the month :-)
<didrocks> one punishment at a time :-)
<tremolux> mterry: the lists are blacklisted here (courtesy mvo): bzr+ssh://bazaar.launchpad.net/~mvo/archive-crawler/mvo/ in data/blacklist.cfg and blacklist_desktop.cfg
<tremolux> mterry: is deja-dup-ccpanel.desktop new?
<tremolux> mterry: seems it may need to be added there?
<mvo> or add X-AppInstall-Ignore=true to the desktop file
<seb128> didrocks, why do you need to change libdbusmenu and indicator... to drop appmenu-gtk depends?
<seb128> didrocks, just tweak the shlibs from the rules in appmenu-gtk?
<didrocks> seb128: didn't you follow the discussion above with kenvandine?  ^
<mvo> seb128: I upload a gtk3 apturl next, could you give it the special seb128 test ?
<seb128> didrocks, I did but you talked about appmenu-gtk and you uploaded libdbusmenu and indicator-appmenu so I'm lost
<seb128> mvo, sure
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, it was the first pass, then I look at the kubuntu seed to see what really brought gtk
<seb128> didrocks, I'm less happy about downgrading the indicator depends
<tremolux> mterry: ^^^ what mvo said, adding "X-AppInstall-Ignore=true" to deja-dup-ccpanel.desktop will accomplish it as well
<didrocks> seb128: hum, let me check for the indicator again
<tremolux> mterry: and then X-Ubuntu-Software-Center-Name goes in deja-dup.desktop and you are good to go
<seb128> didrocks, you are sure that if gtk is missing but the indicator so is there you will not take the unity loader down on a missing symbol or lib?
<seb128> indicator ".so"
<seb128> -unity
<tremolux> mvo: (thanks for suggesting that)  :)
<didrocks> seb128: crap, my badâ¦
 * didrocks blames on all those *indicator*
<seb128> didrocks, no worry ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: will fix the indicator* next time
<seb128> didrocks, thanks
<kenvandine> davmor2, your problem with gwibber opening the wrong url, that is when clicking on the avatar right?
<davmor2> kenvandine: indeed,  I think it might be an issue with ticket positions though it was opening Jono's twitter message on some one elses fb message
<kenvandine> no, it is signals not getting disconnected
<kenvandine> the downside to reusing these tile widgets... is making sure data and signals are all properly changed and disconnected
<davmor2> kenvandine: that would sound about right, if I closed gwibber and re-open it opens the right page
<davmor2> kenvandine: you still need me to file a bug on it or are you okay I didn't have time yesterday
<kenvandine> nah
<kenvandine> fixing it now
<kenvandine> just making sure that was the issue
<davmor2> kenvandine: sounds like it
<davmor2> guys is there a reason why restart is missing from the system indicator?
<didrocks> have a good evening guys!
<kenvandine> davmor2, i hadn't noticed that..
<davmor2> kenvandine: it is though isn't it please say it's not just me :)
<kenvandine> davmor2, indeed... it is missing
<davmor2> want a bug for that one :)
<kenvandine> tedg, is that per design?
<tedg> kenvandine, Uhm, I don't remember.
<tedg> kenvandine, I think we've gone back and forth on those a bit.
<kenvandine> tedg, i haven't seen the design for that
<tedg> kenvandine, I'm not sure where it ended up.
<tedg> kenvandine, I think even the docs we have are out of date.
<kenvandine> davmor2, file a bug and we can assign it to someone that can confirm
<davmor2> kenvandine, tedg I'll write a bug for it and then you can invalidate it latter if it is by design
<davmor2> kenvandine: you beat me to it :)
<kenvandine> :)
<davmor2> kenvandine: I'm taking it that it is the indicator-power correct?
<kenvandine> davmor2, fixed that link bug... hopefully get a release out soon
<kenvandine> no
<kenvandine> indicator-session
<davmor2> kenvandine: thanks
<davmor2> kenvandine: bug #816066
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 816066 in indicator-session "There is no restart option" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/816066
<kenvandine> davmor2, thx... i've assigned it
<seb128> bah, it's annoying that users running the unstable series can do trivial duplicate checks
<seb128> like the "no restart in session indicator" got 3 duplicates now
<seb128> kenvandine, the bug you commented on is a duplicate of bug #815077
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 815077 in indicator-session "restart is missing from SessionMenu" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/815077
<kenvandine> cool
<seb128> kenvandine, I would like to see the spec as well but I would not be surprised if they decided to show restart only when upgrades needing a restart are installed
<seb128> that would be typical design thinking, "why do users need to restart if there is no upgrade" ;-)
<kenvandine> :)
<seb128> kenvandine, next they will drop shutdown you will see ;-)
<kenvandine> hehe
<kenvandine> seb128, think you can look at gtkspell in binNEW?
<kenvandine> i want to roll a release of gwibber that needs that :)
<seb128> kenvandine, sure
<kenvandine> thx
<kenvandine> i added gtk3 support
<seb128> I noticed the upload
<seb128> great, it was on my "to check what to do with gtk3" list ;-)
<kenvandine> i am suprised nobody has yelled yet :)
<kenvandine> i saw quite a few things on google saying "can't port X to gtk3 because of gtkspell"
<seb128> ;-)
<kenvandine> sadly upstream looks nearly dead :(
<kenvandine> but i did submit my patch :)
<seb128> tedg, hey
<seb128> tedg, how is libindicate-gtk on gtk3 going?
<seb128> you have an a3 wi for it on our gnome3 spec
<tedg> seb128, Uhm, only took a quick look at it.
<tedg> seb128, Let me do that now actually.  Not in the middle of something, should only take a few hours.
<seb128> tedg, thanks
<seb128> kenvandine, ^
<kenvandine> woot!
<tedg> kenvandine, I thought you'd done the configure stuff, do you have a branch somewhere/
<kenvandine> tedg, i see how it is... i harass you and get ignored, seb128 does and you just do it :)
<kenvandine> tedg, no... i never even touched it
<tedg> kenvandine, What can I say, he comes from a better wine region ;-)
<kenvandine> i'll agree with that
<seb128> cyphermox, btw if you want some GNOME updates the evolution stack has 3.1.4 tarballs
<tedg> kenvandine, Fine, if you won't be trolled by that....  he comes from a place with a better hockey team ;-)
<cyphermox> seb128: cool, sure
<kenvandine> bah!
<seb128> cyphermox, thanks
<cyphermox> just finishing up some usb_modeswitch fixes first
<kenvandine> seb128, is there any benefit in installing the scaled png for icons?
<seb128> kenvandine, you mean the 256x256 icon when there is also a svg?
<seb128> not sure but I would like to know
<kenvandine> yeah
<seb128> check with dobey maybe, he should know about icons ;-)
<kenvandine> dobey, ^^
<kenvandine> i am finally making gwibber install proper icons
<kenvandine> and seems silly to create a bunch of pngs
<dobey> huh?
<seb128> I think gnome-shell uses those in its expose, which means they would be useful for alt-tab and lenses in unity as well but I'm not sure if having a svg is enough
<dobey> kenvandine: well, librsvg doesn't support everything inkscape does. so for gnome-icon-theme for example, everything gets rendered to PNG, and the PNGs get installed
<dobey> kenvandine: and for the scalable it just uses the 256 PNG, which scales about the same quality as a 256px SVG does
<kenvandine> dobey, so if librsvg renders the gwibber.svg fine, i should just install that?
<kenvandine> or forget the png?
<dobey> you can install the svg i guess. but librsvg isn't a requirement for gtk+ to work afaik, so if you want to rely on that, you should also add a hard dependency on librsvg
<dobey> or more specifically, on the librsvg gdk-pixbuf renderer
<kenvandine> ok
<dobey> also, even if the SVG loads fine, i think the PNGs might be faster still
<kenvandine> interesting... only installing the svg does make it look pretty bad
<kenvandine> dobey, is it sane then to install the 256 png instead of all the other sizes?
<kenvandine> dobey, that one file is smaller than all the common sizes combined
<dobey> no, you need to install the small normal sizes
<dobey> it doesn't scale down to 16x16 very well :)
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> seb128, have any time to look at gtkspell?
<seb128> kenvandine, doh, sorry got sidetracked, but I'm done with the other things, looking *now* ;-)
<kenvandine> woot :)
<kenvandine> i was going to upload with --disable-spell :)
<kenvandine> but i'll wait
<seb128> kenvandine, hum
<kenvandine> sounds like more work for me :)
<seb128> kenvandine, small thing, the dev for gtk2 and gtk3 should conflict
<seb128> of you need to do something about the documentation
<seb128> like add a new binary
<kenvandine> humm
<kenvandine> the package isn't building docs
<kenvandine> i don't think
<seb128> I'm tired
<kenvandine> hehe :)
<seb128> you installed it in the gtk3-dev only
 * kenvandine looks 
<seb128> kenvandine, the gtkspell binary is confusing
<kenvandine> oh...
<seb128> for one thing it will be empty on ubuntu
<kenvandine> yeah, i was puzzled what to do
<kenvandine> but including them with the libs would conflict
<seb128> not on ubuntu ;-)
<kenvandine> hehe
<seb128> we strip the translations
<kenvandine> yeah...
<seb128> but that said I would name it libgtkspell-common
<kenvandine> oh, i make the gtk2 dev package depend on the gtk3
<seb128> rather than gtkspell
<kenvandine> and the headers are only in the gtk3 package
<seb128> gtkspell is misleading in make you think it's an application
<kenvandine> true...
<seb128> when libgtkspell-common will not confuse
<seb128> where
<kenvandine> works for me :)
<seb128> can you rename it something with lib and common?
<kenvandine> what do you think of libgtkspell-dev depending on libgtkspell3-dev?
<kenvandine> it's awkward...
<seb128> just for the api?
<seb128> I would not bother
<kenvandine> so leave the headers out of the gtk2 package and not depend?
<seb128> hum
<seb128> there is the .h indeed
<kenvandine> i hate duplicating those
<seb128> do we have anything that will dual built gtk2 and gtk3 and need that lib?
<kenvandine> nothing yet...
<kenvandine> since there is nothing using it for gtk3 yet
<seb128> kenvandine, keep it like it is now and put a conflicts
<seb128> we will deal with dual installation if we need to
<kenvandine> ok...
<seb128> but it's not likely that we will dual build anything out of libs
<seb128> and we don't have libs depending on that one
<kenvandine> true
<seb128> kenvandine, I'm still around for a bit, do the gtkspell -> something-common rename please and I will new only the new binaries
<seb128> kenvandine, no need to deal with new binaries to drop on the next upload
<kenvandine> seb128,  ok, should anything depend  on libgtkspell-common?
<seb128> kenvandine, no
<seb128> it's going to be empty anyway
<seb128> kenvandine, oh, put the autoreconf rules before the debhelper one
<kenvandine> ok
<seb128> otherwise you will get some debhelper.log in the diff.gz
<kenvandine> oh... is that the trick!
<seb128> took me a while to figure why we had some of those
<kenvandine> that has been annoying
<seb128> yes...
<kenvandine> seb128, uploaded
<seb128> kenvandine, ok, you can upload gwibber as well, it will go depwaiting on it
<kenvandine> will do
<kenvandine> thx!
<seb128> yw
<seb128> kenvandine, btw did you find anything wrong with the messages counts or fb streams?
<kenvandine> not yet, haven't really looked
<kenvandine> fixed a bunch of other stuff though :)
<seb128> ok
<kenvandine> seb128, next on my list is gwibber-accounts and gtk3 :)
<seb128> \o/
<kenvandine> dropping wnck
<seb128> \o/ ;-)
<seb128> ricotz, hey
<seb128> ricotz, do you have the mx build log? the gir provides the old name and the build-depends is not versioned so it should install with the old name
<kenvandine> seb128, gtkspell just failed on amd64 ... sounds like the same problem
<seb128> kenvandine, "same"?
<seb128> than mx?
<micahg> seb128: the old binary is still in the archive, if that's removed it should work as is
<kenvandine> like what you just described for mx
<kenvandine> The following packages have unmet dependencies:
<kenvandine>  libgtk-3-dev : Depends: libgtk-3-0 (= 3.1.8-0ubuntu5) but it is not going to be installed
<kenvandine>                 Depends: gir1.2-gtk-3.0 (= 3.1.8-0ubuntu5) but it is not going to be installed
<seb128> kenvandine, no
<kenvandine> ok... :)
<seb128> kenvandine, that's the glib,gtk transition
<seb128> new glib makes old gtk segfault
<seb128> so I had to make it breaks libgtk
<ricotz> seb128, hi, https://launchpadlibrarian.net/75010602/buildlog_ubuntu-oneiric-amd64.mx_1.2.0-1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<seb128> glib failed to build first (testsuit timeout), it did success on a retry though
<seb128> so next publisher should have amd64 back on shape
<seb128> i.e in the next 25 minutes
<kenvandine> ok
<seb128> ricotz, seems like a clutter issue
<micahg> seb128: if gir1.2-json-glib-1.0 |   0.13.4-1 is removed, the provides should work, otherwise they won't
<seb128> micahg, oh, good point
<seb128> ricotz, well, why do we need a mx rebuild?
<seb128> ricotz, i.e can that wait for debian to fix it so we can stay in sync?
<seb128> or does it break something?
<ricotz> seb128, i know, i didnt find the debian repos :\, so i just reported it that way
<ricotz> rhythmbox will depend on it
<ricotz> so it might even need a MIR
<seb128> depends or optional depends for a plugin?
<ricotz> the visualizer plugin needs it, so it is optional
<seb128> ricotz, well cheese and totem use it as well so it might requires a mir for those
<seb128> having a mir is fine, on the CD will be another question
<seb128> ricotz, do you want to file the mir for it? ;-)
<seb128> ricotz, debian: http://packages.qa.debian.org/m/mx.html
<seb128> you can probably open a bug to say they need to rename it
<ricotz> i see, so if there are some main packages needing it a MIR is worth it
<ricotz> yeah, i actually looked for the packaging svn
<seb128> there might not be a vcs for it in debian
<seb128> ricotz, right, mir is worth it, totem will depends on it this cycle
<seb128> cheese has been demoted but kenvandine and ev wants it back in main so it might come back
<kenvandine> :)
<seb128> kenvandine, btw did you see the gst replaces bug?
<kenvandine> no...
<seb128> kenvandine, ok, I figure you might not have, I assigned it to you
<ricotz> seb128, ok, i hope someone likes to do the mir
<kenvandine> sorry... been heads down all day :)
<kenvandine> i'll look in the morning
<seb128> kenvandine, we go some conflicts with the new -gconf binary, you probably screwed the replaces version
<kenvandine> :(
<seb128> kenvandine, no hurry ;-)
<seb128> the "classic" upgrade order issu
<seb128> issue
<kenvandine> ok, gwibber uploaded... gotta run for a bit
<kenvandine> seb128, thx!
<seb128> kenvandine, have fun, see you tomorrow
<seb128> kenvandine, I will retry the amd64 builds after the publisher run and new libgtkspell
<kenvandine> thx!
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-07-26
<robert_ancell> RAOF, how do I make an X window transparent, i.e. so it doesn't have a background but the widgets inside it are visible as normal
<RAOF> If it doesn't move then you should be able to set the background to None.
<RAOF> If it does move, you want an ARGB colourmap and a compositor.
<RAOF> (I think the background None trick will work; certainly the compositor will)
<RAOF> robert_ancell: ^^^
<robert_ancell> RAOF, can you do that from GTK+?
<RAOF> You can certainly do an ARGB colourmap from GTK+.  I'm less certain about not drawing the background.
<RAOF> If you've got a compositor then a real alpha channel is the way to go.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, no compositor, it doesn't seem to work, i.e. setting to #00000000 just draws black
<robert_ancell> (and doesn't show the bg)
<RAOF> Yeah.  Setting an alpha channel will only work if you've got a compositor.
<robert_ancell> stupid x
<RAOF> Mechanism, not policy :P
<RAOF> Maybe you wanted that alpha channel to cause ponies to dance across the screen!  Who is X to say otherwise!
<robert_ancell> I just wanted it to leave the pixels in the frame buffer :(
<RAOF> You've got to specifically ask for that, and I'm not sure how to get GTK+ to do so.
<Amaranth> RAOF: Wasn't there some hacky optimization for None we carried for a while?
<RAOF> Amaranth: Yeah, to make fglrx suck less.
<didrocks> good morning
<TheMuso> Argh seems the latest round of GTK updates have broken terminal feedback for me, due to the gail/GTk transition.
<didrocks> TheMuso: hey, which transition? the activation or the gail compatibility layer?
<TheMuso> didrocks: The compatibility layer. Its being merged into gtk, or was a few weeks back or sooner. I suspect either gnome-terminal or vte need some tweaking to behave properly with a11y stuff again.
<didrocks> TheMuso: I see nothing in git trunks for gnome-terminal or vteâ¦
<didrocks> TheMuso: maybe ask on the gnome channels?
<TheMuso> didrocks: Hrm ok, I was about to look there myself.
<TheMuso> didrocks: Yeah have asked in #a11y but everyone is afk/asleep atm. I'll have to ask later.
<didrocks> TheMuso: second try is generally the good one :)
<didrocks> TheMuso: there will be a new unity-2d release today with the remaining a11y and keyboard navigation support in. Can you ensure that alpha3 is tested by the community for a11y?
<TheMuso> Yeah. Thank good ness for a second machine though.
<TheMuso> didrocks: Certainly can.
<didrocks> great :-)
<Sweetshark> Morn'ng!
<Sweetshark> jasoncwarner_: around?
<didrocks> hey Sweetshark!
<Sweetshark> didrocks: Heya, how are things going?
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<didrocks> Sweetshark: going well, still busy with Qt things, but hopefully, new unity-2d today! :)
<didrocks> and you?
<didrocks> hey chrisccoulson, how are you?
<chrisccoulson> hey didrocks. i'm good, but very tired. my daughter kept waking up all night :(
<chrisccoulson> how are you?
<Sweetshark> didrocks: Well, I integrated an 50KLOC branch upstream into the master on Sunday and it went reasonable smooth. Other than that quite a bit of politics with the Apache OOo stuff ...
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: urgh, I'm fine, thanks :) just being woken up by a bad dream, but nothing else :)
<didrocks> Sweetshark: excellent for integrating such *small* branches and don't break everything on the road! :-)
<Sweetshark> didrocks: well, to make things more exciting the branch was originally against OOo (by oracle) and I had to migrate it over to LibreOffice ...
<didrocks> Sweetshark: ah, indeed, a lot more fun! :)
<Sweetshark> (and of course it was originally in OOo mercurial repo, while LO uses multiple git ones)
<didrocks> did you keep the commits?
<Sweetshark> didrocks: I had too, to make sure the attribution is right. But I rebased the whole set of commit into a linear sequence (while it was a wild tree of merges and branches itself before)
<didrocks> waow, tediousâ¦
<RAOF> Sounds like 32 separate types of fun.
<Sweetshark> once you have a linear sequence of patches, it is reasonably easy to handle, but it really takes determination to get there ....
<didrocks> RAOF: good evening! :)
<RAOF> didrocks: Aloha!
<didrocks> RAOF: I seems I still have no acceleration with -6 (I didn't reboot for -7 yet). If I reboot with -3, I still have all the wonderfulness of my twice backed GPU!
<RAOF> didrocks: So nvidia isn't building against your newer kernels?  jasoncwarner_ was having the same problem, but we didn't manage to get any useful information.  We couldn't work out why it was failing; dkms didn't seem to be logging anything.
<Sweetshark> RAOF: the best part was mmeeks asking me on monday noon on IRC: "oh, you did merge?" I take that as a compliment, as he might have assumed lots of breakage making him notice it anyway.
<Sweetshark> ROAF: Sunrise was nice here btw, hope it look good as a sunset at your place ;)
<didrocks> RAOF: argh, if I can provide you any information, do not hesitate
<didrocks> at least, I test unity-2d hugely :-)
<RAOF> didrocks: /var/log/dkms* would be useful; you should also have a make.log in /var/lib/dkms.
<didrocks> RAOF: maybe, I should restart with latest kernel?
<RAOF> You could give that a whirl.
 * didrocks reboots
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF didrocks , I didn't end up doing anything special. I just apt-get remove nvidia-current and then reinstalled it via jockeyt
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF didrocks though, I have to reinstall everytime a new kernel comes down...
<RAOF> Gak.
<didrocks> RAOF: ok, it's even worse, no dkms nvidia-current built for -7 :/
<RAOF> jasoncwarner_ seems to be able to get things back by reinstalling nvidia-current each time a new kernel comes down.  Which suggests that maybe the dkms hook in the kernel packaging has broken.
<didrocks> let me try
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF and didrocks < i have to remove nvidia-current before reinstalling...otherwise it won't work
<didrocks> jasoncwarner_: thanks, doing that right now
<didrocks> jasoncwarner_: with jockey?
<jasoncwarner_> sudo apt-get remove nvidia-current and then reinstall/reactiveate with jockey
<didrocks> ok :) thanks jasoncwarner_!
<didrocks> argh, all apps fails on gail
<didrocks> ok, restarting, brb :)
<didrocks> jasoncwarner_: RAOF: indeed, it worked, thanks
<RAOF> Ok.  Why didn't it work before?
<didrocks> chaotic: argh, again thunderbird not showing the treeview
<RAOF> didrocks: I don't suppose you could remove the -6 kernel, reinstall it, and check that dkms actually gets called to build the kernel module?
<didrocks> RAOF: I didn't remove and reinstall nvidia-current before
<didrocks> RAOF: hum, it's not only one package to trigger this, isn't it?
<RAOF> didrocks: There are other dkms modules, yes.  You're probably not using any, though ;)
<didrocks> RAOF: the dkms module was built upon -6, but wasn't working in -5 and -6
<didrocks> (for nvidia-current, I mean)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: ^^ (on the treeview issue in thunderbird)
<RAOF> It was build for -6 but wasn't working in -6?
<didrocks> sorry chaotic :)
<didrocks> RAOF: yeah, I could see the -5 and -6 folders for nvidia-current
<didrocks> and yeah, it wasn't working
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: what was the trick aready? I had to remove some cache
<RAOF> Hm.  I don't think that was what Jason was seeing - his just plain wasn't built.
<didrocks> RAOF: so, it seems it built some invalid things for me, I looked at the .log (before removing nvidia-current which removed those dirs), and all seemed to be successful
<didrocks> RAOF: I didn't notice any major difference with -3 which was working
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, running "thunderbird -purgecaches" will actually remove the startup caches
<chrisccoulson> there is more than 1 cache to remove in the version in oneiric
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: it worked, thanks! :)
<didrocks> euhâ¦
<didrocks> if I then restart thunderbird
<didrocks> same issue
<chrisccoulson> heh
 * didrocks will run with -purgecaches now
<chrisccoulson> perhaps i should distro-patch it
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: oh yes please! :)
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, the other thing that might work is to set nglayout.debug.disable_xul_cache to true in about:config
<chrisccoulson> although, you'd need to remember to change it back when it's fixed
<chrisccoulson> else startuptime will suck forever ;)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: hum, I prefer to use the option for now then :)
<seb128> hey
<didrocks> seb128: hey, reminder to remind you about the meeting reminder :)
<seb128> robert_ancell, hey, how is hacking going?
<seb128> didrocks, thanks ;-)
<robert_ancell> seb128, hey, I got it to work, but I don't why...
<robert_ancell> but bzr is broken
<seb128> oh?
<desrt> seb128: looks like your builds worked, but failed
<desrt> ie: all the tests passed, but the build failed for unrelated reasons (symbols changes)
<seb128> desrt, right, did you need to use those or just to see if it builds?
<desrt> just to check
<desrt> i'll be landing the changes upstream today
<robert_ancell> seb128, are you fully updated?  does bzr branch lp:lightdm work?
<seb128> desrt, I didn't update the symbol on purpose because I wanted to test build without having the binary go out to users ;-)
<desrt> since they solve your problem and don't appear to introduce others
<desrt> seb128: ah.  nice :)
<desrt> seb128: interesting question for you
<desrt> seb128: how do you feel (theoretically, practically) about me removing symbols from the export list of libglib?
<seb128> robert_ancell, I'm not uptodate no but close to, I just select my upgrades and kept some out
<desrt> these are symbols that leaked by accident a few cycles ago
<desrt> they've never had headers installed...
<seb128> robert_ancell, trying
<seb128> desrt, if they never were meant to be used and didn't have corresponding include definition I think it's ok
<seb128> robert_ancell,     raise errors.ErrorFromSmartServer(error_tuple)
<robert_ancell> seb128, shit, same problem
<seb128> robert_ancell, you should ask on #launchpad or #bzr
<robert_ancell> do you have a checkout, can you bzr pull on it?
<desrt> seb128: cool.
<seb128> try #launchpad first maybe
<seb128> robert_ancell, no I don't, I've a checkout of the packaging vcs
<robert_ancell> I kept working on a branch, so now I cant get back the uploaded version to make a release
<seb128> robert_ancell, -> #launchpad
<seb128> robert_ancell, bzr merge lp:lightdm doesn't work either
<seb128> on my packaging checkout
<robert_ancell> seb128, I emailed you a tarball for 0.9.2, can you check and see if you can build the package with that and it logs in?
<robert_ancell> it's the version I've been running today, and it works with a test user using ecryptfs
<seb128> ok
<seb128> robert_ancell, ok, lightdm built, testing time
<robert_ancell> cool
<seb128> robert_ancell, that made my nb happy
<seb128> robert_ancell, trying a second boot but it never logged in with the protected user directory on the previous version
<seb128> robert_ancell, so I would say it looks good
<robert_ancell> cool...  now if I can fix this branch I'll release that one
<seb128> robert_ancell, did you ask on #bzr?
<seb128> robert_ancell, second login worked again ;-)
<robert_ancell> yes, but no help yet
<seb128> robert_ancell, did the bug I pointed helped?
<chaotic> didrocks: no worries :)
<seb128> lool, hey
<robert_ancell> I'm not sure what the command is for me to run
<seb128> lool, can you help robert_ancell maybe? ;-)
<chrisccoulson> hey seb128, how are you?
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson, I'm fine thanks, how are you?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, mostly good, except my daughter kept me awake for much of last night
<chrisccoulson> so a bit tired ;)
<seb128> oh
<seb128> is she ok?
<seb128> she had issues or just didn't feel like sleeping?
<chrisccoulson> she's had a cold this week
<chrisccoulson> but i think she does it just to annoy me ;)
<seb128> robert_ancell, did you try to bzr fetch-all-records -d lp:lightdm?
<robert_ancell> it needs a second branch, but I don't know how I pick that
<seb128> hum
<seb128> robert_ancell, do you have a working local copy? can you push to a new location?
<seb128> just curious
<robert_ancell> seb128, no, I've committed changes to it I don't want to release yet
<seb128> that sucks
<jasoncwarner_> hey everyone...just curious, who moved my cheese? ;)
<seb128> jasoncwarner_, how "moved"?
<seb128> hey jasoncwarner_
<jasoncwarner_> I did a reinstall today so I downloaded alpha2 (no upgrade from natty) and I realized something...I can't find how to remap keys in new keyboard settings manager?
<seb128> jasoncwarner_, I though americans didn't know about cheese? ;-)
<jasoncwarner_> seb128: it is a us expression for something being reluctant to change ;)
<jasoncwarner_> it is a REALLY terrible management movie they made me watch at IBM
<desrt> jasoncwarner, robert_ancell; good mornings
<seb128> jasoncwarner_, oh ok, I though you were speaking about "cheese" the webcam thingy, I moved that to universe recently
<seb128> jasoncwarner_, use ccsm
<jasoncwarner_> desrt: morning...you still in france with the didrocks?
<desrt> in france, but not with didrocks
<seb128> jasoncwarner_, the compiz<->gnome keybinding integration is not working with GNOME3
<robert_ancell> desrt, hello
<desrt> robert_ancell: how's lightdm slogging going?
<robert_ancell> lotso slogging
<desrt> sick of it yet? :)
<robert_ancell> not quite yet :)
<jasoncwarner_> seb128: where do I make the change in ccsm?
<robert_ancell> I just need more time
<desrt> give it to the end of the cycle, i guess :)
<chrisccoulson> oh, nice. most of the PPA builders disappeared again
<desrt> when jasoncwarner gets the whip out
<seb128> jasoncwarner_, different locations according to the actions
<jasoncwarner_> seb128: I just want to remap capslock to ctrl
<seb128> oh
<seb128> I though you wanted keybindings
<seb128> jasoncwarner_, that's in control-center, region, layout tab
<seb128> jasoncwarner_, don't worry GNOME in its tradition to drop things you use will drop that dialog in GNOME 3.2
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> (not joking, they say it's not things normal users tweak and so confusing rather than useful)
<jasoncwarner_> wow...that seems like a really, really odd place for that. especially considering there is a 'keyboard' setting pane literally RIGHT there
<jasoncwarner_> didrocks: hey, ? for ya. am I insane or did tab all of the sudden stop working in the dash?
 * desrt ponders another glib tarball to keep seb's life boring and repetitive
<seb128> desrt, ;-)
<didrocks> jasoncwarner_: hum, it shouldn't have worked from the beginning (I'm in unity-2d right now for next unity 2d release), but there is a grab preventing alt + tab working normally
<seb128> jasoncwarner_, unity reworked their event handling, there is quite some input breakages
<didrocks> oh, just tab
<seb128> jasoncwarner_, like you can't middle click on a launcher, or if you run a command you can't click on the history icons before typing
<didrocks> jasoncwarner_: yeah, there are a lot of keybindings issues since latest unity
<didrocks> jasoncwarner_: super + num
<didrocks> middle click as seb128 told
<desrt> vuntz: if you update the desktop file spec then i can cause even more disruption!
<seb128> desrt, btw so my "force eventfd to off in configure" was not enough, the glib upload to oneiric yesterday hanged once on amd64
<jasoncwarner_> didrocks seb128 ah...I thought I was going crazy, which is entirely possible.
<seb128> desrt, it built on retry
<desrt> seb128: :X
<desrt> and it's in the distro?
<didrocks> jasoncwarner_: one doesn't exclude the other :-)
 * didrocks needs to run very fast now
<seb128> desrt, that was stock upstream version with the eventfd forced to off and yes
<desrt> seb128: ouch
<seb128> desrt, why ouch?
<desrt> seb128: because if it has the bug then you're going to get the testcases of a bunch of other glib-depending things crashing on the builders
<chrisccoulson> debugging buildd hangs isn't fun is it? ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, indeed
<desrt> chrisccoulson: i just merged the fix upstream
<chrisccoulson> i've got a similar issue with firefox
<chrisccoulson> anyone fancy debugging that? ;)
<seb128> desrt, well, I've been told you will get a fixed version for me before it happens :p
<desrt> seb128: :)
<desrt> seb128: i'll check with the others.  a glib tarball could possibly come today
<lool> seb128, robert_ancell: Hey, not sure whether that would work, but you could try bzr fetch-all-records lp:somebranch .
<lool> if . is a local checkout of your branch, or an init-repo dir
<seb128> lool, hey, being sorted on #bzr but thanks
 * desrt wants to do just a bit more GMainLoop breaking while he's at it to solve that old old old "gtester randomly hangs" SIGCHLD race
<chrisccoulson> seb128, are you able to remove packages from the archive?
<chrisccoulson> ie, did pitti give you his axe before he went on vacation? :-)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, yeah, it's normal archive admin skill ;-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, nice. hopefully i will have a list of packages for you to remove later ;)
<chrisccoulson> (ie, the remainder of https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-o-mozilla-rapid-release-maintenance)
<seb128> ok
<chrisccoulson> then i can close that blueprint as finished
<chrisccoulson> \o/
<seb128> then you can do some desktop work? ;-)
<desrt> seb128: bzr url for glib source package?
 * desrt is having difficulty finding it again
<desrt> (for the web interface)
<seb128> desrt, https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/glib/ubuntu
<desrt> cheers
<desrt> seb128: what's your policy for 'official' vs 'ppa' uploads with respect to that repository?
 * desrt has been using your patches/ directory as a TODO list...
<robert_ancell> brb
<seb128> desrt, that vcs is the official distro one
<seb128> desrt, I will not commit ppa work there
<desrt> gotcha
<desrt> looks like you get to drop a couple more patches next time, in any case
<seb128> desrt, right, the gio dbus session one, the no fd one and the gio launch handler one as well
<desrt> multiarch compat can probably go soonish as well... once it's taken care of
<seb128> desrt, steve agreed on porting dx code to the official gio launcher api so I will drop the old patch we had as well
<desrt> then it's just desktop file translations and the silly debian G_HOME thing
<seb128> right
<seb128> how do you want to fix the multiarch thing,
<seb128> ?
<desrt> move all your gio plugin packages to be multiarch-enabled
<desrt> there can't be that many of them....
<seb128> oh right
<seb128> well I sort of kept it in case people "out there" were having local built ones
<seb128> but I case it's not a frequent case
<desrt> the patch is actually sort of evil anyway, since it will cause a arm libgio on my amd64 system to try to load amd64 libraries into an arm process
<desrt> (or similar cases like this)
<robert_ancell> seb128, ok, ready to upload, last chance to stop me
<seb128> robert_ancell, go go go
 * desrt waves his arms wildly to distract seb
<seb128> robert_ancell, are you there tomorrow or off tonight?
<robert_ancell> 3pm tomorrow
<seb128> robert_ancell, in case you break the world ;-)
<seb128> robert_ancell, ok, is there any bug or greater or whatever lightdm thing you think we should look at for a3?
<seb128> robert_ancell, I will drop you an email today if we run into a real issue with the new version and would welcome a look for you
<seb128> robert_ancell, otherwise enjoy your holiday, see you at the desktop summit!
<robert_ancell> seb128, the main issues are integration, i.e. the switcher, screenlock, ubiquity, gnome-control-center
<robert_ancell> will check email in the morning
<seb128> ok
<seb128> well those are not stoppers
<seb128> you will still have time after your holidays to get work done, we are just mid-cycle ;-)
<jasoncwarner_> seb128 and/or didrocks do you know why banshee isn't the default music app on a new install?
<robert_ancell> just keep an eye out for stability issues
<seb128> robert_ancell, I think we should discuss screenlock and g-c-c etc at the summit
<seb128> robert_ancell, will do
<robert_ancell> seb128, true
<seb128> jasoncwarner_, define "default music app"? where?
<robert_ancell> ok, it's uploaded, me -> dinner, will check in tomorrow. fingers crossed
<didrocks> jasoncwarner_: default for which kind of files?
<seb128> robert_ancell, ok, have a nice evening
<seb128> see you maybe tomorrow if I stay up a bit later
<seb128> otherwise in a few weeks ;-)
<jasoncwarner_> I'm just looking at dash, for 'listen to music', mine is 'movie player'
<seb128> jasoncwarner_, I think it's unity which is still using gconf
<seb128> where it should use the new mimetype thing
<jasoncwarner_> seb128: filing a bug, I guess? :)
<seb128> jasoncwarner_, no, "known issue
<seb128> jasoncwarner_, bug #805938
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 805938 in unity "Totem set as default music player after install instead of Banshee" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/805938
<seb128> though the bug suggest it should be fixed
<seb128> I'm using rb and it's correctly listed, not sure about new installs
<jasoncwarner_> seb128: sometimes I worry about you and didrocks. I think you have launchpad memorized or something.....scary :o
<didrocks> heh :)
<didrocks> seb128: did you forgot about the meeting reminder or do you prefer another reminder again? ;)
<seb128> didrocks, neither of those?
<seb128> didrocks, just wrote it 5 minutes ago, check your launchpad box?
<seb128> didrocks, but I used the "contact team" thing
<seb128> hum, don't edit the wiki yet
<seb128> I think I picked the old template :p
<didrocks> seb128: received it 2 minutes ago, which makes my messages 5 seconds before I receive!
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> didrocks, well I was typing it when you pinged
<didrocks> seb128: type faster! :-)
<seb128> can the wiki be any slower?
<seb128> trying to update to new template...
<seb128> ok, worked
<seb128> now you can edit https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2011-07-26 ;-)
<chrisccoulson> wow, i need to install so much stuff to build vlc
<didrocks> seb128: there is an "activity reports" in the template you copied
<seb128> didrocks, yeah, I'm not a slack techlead, you need to write activity reports again! :p
<didrocks> seb128: this will be copied, repeated, and amplified :-)
<seb128> bah, the commit to the new template didn't work
<seb128> didrocks, reload
<didrocks> ah, way better :)
<Tommeh> It doesn't appear that Evolution supports IPv6 SMTP servers.
<Tommeh> Which is a shame :(
<jbicha> seb128: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=655293
<ubot2> Gnome bug 655293 in general "Aisleriot includes LGPL code but no copyright notice" [Major,Unconfirmed]
<seb128> jibel, hey
<seb128> ok, I suck at understanding licenses requirements so tend to be conservatice
<seb128> conservative
<seb128> does anybody has a clue about this bug?
<seb128> if a source distributed under the GPL has LGPL files does it need to ship a LGPL copy?
<geser> seb128: I'd say yes to be able to read the LGPL license terms, but I'm not a license expert either
<jbicha> yeah, I don't know about licenses either, but paragraph 3 of http://www.gnu.org/licenses/lgpl-2.1.html
<jbicha> says they can relicense the file but they should update the copyright info in the file
<cyphermox> good morning!
<Laney> they can do it but must edit the headers
<seb128> ""To do this, you must alter all the notices that refer to this License, so that they refer to the ordinary GNU General Public License, version 2, instead of to this License."
<seb128> right
<jbicha> seb128: do you want to leave the followup comment or should I?
<seb128> hey cyphermox Laney
<Laney> hiya
<seb128> jbicha, well I would still like somebody who knows about licenses to confirm what should be done ;-)
<jbicha> oh ok, that's not me :-)
<seb128> jbicha, let's wait a bit if somebody else has an opinion on it ;-)
<seb128> usually tarballs which do that just ship a copy of the LGPL
<Laney> if you form a derivative with something that is not a library then you have to relicense to GPL and update the headers
<Laney> it's pretty clear
<seb128> right
<seb128> jbicha, well I guess reply saying they need to update those files to put them under the GPL then
<seb128> jbicha, thanks ;-)
<seb128> ok
<seb128> so who wants to do some GNOME updates?
<cyphermox> hmm. in doubt couldn't you just ship both licenses?
<cyphermox> seb128: was going to start evolution now, but I can do others if there are things "more important"
<seb128> cyphermox, no, you doing the evo stack would be nice
<seb128> cyphermox, cf the bug number just before you said hi there, that's what I was asking first, if they can ship a LGPL copy
<davmor2> guys got to say I installed the unity-greeter and it's really pretty :)  nice work
<seb128> kudos to robert_ancell
<jbicha> cyphermox: yes, they could definitely keep it under the LGPL but I think they'd rather keep it all under the same license
<jbicha> seb128: could you take a look at https://code.launchpad.net/~jbicha/ubuntu/oneiric/vino/vino-3.1/+merge/69196
<seb128> jbicha, yeah, it's my review list
<seb128> jbicha, seems easy enough ;-)
<jbicha> oh ok
<seb128> "it's on my review list"
<seb128> kenvandine, chrisccoulson, mterry: want to do some GNOME update?
<seb128> hey kenvandine mterry ;-)
<mterry> seb128, heh, you should do the niceties first, then ask for help  ;)
<kenvandine> seb128, maybe in a bit :)
<seb128> mterry, sorry, you know how rude the frenchs are
<seb128> ;-)
<mterry> seb128, OK, I can look at the list or you can give me some
<kenvandine> hehe
<seb128> kenvandine, empathy for you?
<kenvandine> seb128, did you see i got python-wnck dropped?
<desrt> mterry: isn't it nice that he wants your help? :)
<seb128> kenvandine, yes, thanks \o/
<kenvandine> seb128, yeah, i'll do that
<kenvandine> seb128, i tried going to gtk3, but ended up being huge... all the service plugins provide there only little bit of code that gets embedded
<kenvandine> they would all need porting
<kenvandine> and i want to drop all of that anyway
<seb128> ok
<seb128> well you will need to clean for the lts ;-)
<seb128> but you have time for that ;-)
<kenvandine> but at least wnck is using gi now :)
<kenvandine> indeed
<seb128> mterry, ok, we have some great choice for you sir, cheap upgrades today! ;-)
<seb128> mterry, you can pick in eog file-roller gconf yelp-xsl
<seb128> mterry, gnome-keyring (requires to package the new p11-kit from fdo though)
<seb128> mterry, if there is anything you like just write it on the etherpad and it's yours ;-)
<davmor2> kenvandine: just the man :)  there was a tweet earlier that mpt made where the bottom line was cut in half, not in gwibber but the popup message window and it looked ugly :(
<jbicha> seb128: I can take yelp-xsl
<seb128> jbicha, great, write it on the etherpad please, thanks ;-)
<kenvandine> davmor2, you mean notify-osd?
<davmor2> kenvandine: that's the one
<davmor2> kenvandine: I kept thing indicator and knew it wasn't that :)
<kenvandine> davmor2, which tweet was it?
<davmor2> kenvandine: I'll go grab it for you
<seb128> dobey, hey, your uploads from yesterday both failed to build
<davmor2> kenvandine: https://twitter.com/#!/mpt/statuses/95803899969150976 pretty sure it was this one the nicks were cut in two
<kenvandine> davmor2, ok, that doesn't look long enough to get truncated by notify-osd... but none of his recent ones look like it would
<kenvandine> gwibber doesn't do anything to truncate it... so it would be notify-osd doing it
<kenvandine> davmor2, actually... was it maybe "merged" with another post from @mpt?
<davmor2> kenvandine: It's not truncated the last line only the top halves showed
<kenvandine> oh...
<kenvandine> interesting bug!
<kenvandine> file a bug against notify-osd i guess
<seb128> with a screenshot
<davmor2> kenvandine: if it happens again I'll try and screenshot it
<kenvandine> have you changed default fonts or sizes?
<davmor2> seb128: I've been looking out for it since
<kenvandine> that would be useful to mention in the bug too
<davmor2> kenvandine: Nope
<kenvandine> ok
<dobey> seb128: odd
<dobey> ugh
<dobey> seb128: did something change with dh_python2 recently?
<seb128> dunno, you should rather ask barry about that
<seb128> I don't follow python much
<dobey> ok
<seb128> it built locally on my box
<seb128> so not sure what's going on
<jbicha> seb128: /j #bazaar
<jbicha> never mind
<dobey> seb128: ah, maybe it's not dh_python2 that's the problem. i guess all those ERROR: aren't errors.
<dobey> seb128: hrmm, how much qt stuff is going on CD? :)
<seb128> dobey, just what unity-2d needs
<seb128> dobey, why?
<seb128> dobey, no application
<dobey> seb128: the qt bits of ubuntu-sso-client/ubuntuone-control-panel get built regardless (because setuptools is a horrible build system), and so it's requiring some python qt pieces for setup.py build to work.
<dobey> seb128: though i guess it doesn't matter if that's on the CD or not, so long as it's in main
<dobey> so nevermind me :)
<rodrigo_> hello
<seb128> dobey, build-depends on qt should be ok, just don't bring a qt ui on the CD ;-)
<dobey> right
<seb128> rodrigo_, hey
<rodrigo_> hi seb
<dobey> still early here, so brain is still a bit slow :)
<rodrigo_> hi seb128
<seb128> rodrigo_, your g-s-d upload fail by lack of build-depends on upower
<rodrigo_> hmm, there are 2 seb's!
<rodrigo_> seb128, oh, ok
<seb128> didrocks, \o/ doing updates!
<seb128> didrocks, oh, file-roller is already claimed by jbicha
<didrocks> hum? I already did it?
<seb128> oh ok
<didrocks> where was it claimed?
<seb128> didrocks, see the "Things being worked on:" on the etherpad
<seb128> there is like 10 updates listed
<jbicha> well, LP wouldn't let me do a merge request anyway
<jbicha> for yelp-xsl
<seb128> jbicha, can you ask on #launchpad maybe?
<seb128> jbicha, seems you should push those to ~jbichar/component/something rather than oneiric/...
<seb128> well at least for things that are not coming from UDD but from ubuntu-desktop vcs-es
<didrocks> I listed on etherpad at start so that its more visible at it's a transient updates
<didrocks> jbicha: fyi, I already uploaded it
<seb128> didrocks, well see the section some 15 lines after yours
<seb128> didrocks, feel free to re-organize to have updates first
<jbicha> seb128: ok, I'll try that, it usually works though
<seb128> jbicha, seems it works if there is a launchpad component matching the name or something
<didrocks> seb128: I hope that working on those update will make you reviewing the merge req on brasero if you have the hardware to test :-)
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> it's on my list for today
<seb128> just pushing gconf
<seb128> then I sponsor vino and gnome-applets
<seb128> then will do that
<didrocks> nice!
<davmor2> kenvandine: gwibber related the last tile if it isn't completely on isn't visible however if you press the up arrow it's title is then press the up arrow again and it goes and again and it's back :)  great fun :)
<seb128> jbicha, kenvandine: random comment but no need to build-depends on gir binaries in oneiric, the libdev binaries have depends on their gir
<seb128> so ie a build-depends on libgtk-3-dev will bring in the gtk3 gir
<kenvandine> seb128, cool
<kenvandine> thx
<seb128> yw
<kenvandine> davmor2, yeah, known :)
<dobey> hrmm
<jbicha> seb128: ok, good to know
<dobey> how does one do binary-post-install/foo:: with pure dh? same as with cdbs?
<seb128> jbicha, oh, in the gnome-applets case you fixed a depends, you can use gir:Depends rather than list the individual girs
<seb128> ${gir:Depends}
<seb128> jbicha, ^
<didrocks> dobey: normally you override the dh_ target
<didrocks> like
<didrocks> override_dh_install
<didrocks> override_dh_install:
<didrocks>     dh_install
<didrocks>     [â¦]
<dobey> oh, so i'd do that to rm -f debian/tmp/usr/lib/nautilus/*.la for example?
<didrocks> dobey: indeed :)
<dobey> ok, thanks
<didrocks> dobey: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/libunity/ubuntu/view/head:/debian/rules for instance
<seb128> dobey, bug #764790, is that for you or nessita still?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 764790 in ubuntuone-control-panel "Provide a X-GNOME-FullName in the .desktop file" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/764790
<dobey> seb128: ah i guess roberta should have reassigned it back to nessita in april.
<dobey> seb128: i am staying out of that mess :)
<kenvandine> seb128, i have confirmed those counts in the messaging menu are rather inflated, not sure why yet though
<seb128> dobey, ok ;-)
<seb128> kenvandine, great!
<kenvandine> i need to leave for a bit in a few minutes... early lunch break
<kenvandine> bbiab
<seb128> kenvandine, reminder, it's meeting day, but I guess you will be back in 1:30 ;-)
<kenvandine> i will :)
<seb128> jbicha, eog is already done by didrocks
<seb128> jbicha, sorry it's a bit busy today ;-)
 * didrocks stops to let jbicha doing updates :)
<jbicha> seb128: ok, no problem
<didrocks> jbicha: just 3 lines before what you wrote on eth ;)
<seb128> jbicha, libpeas and tomboy are to do if you want some
<Laney> not tomboy (unless you want to do it in debian for me :-)
<seb128> jbicha, not tomboy then :p
<jbicha> ok
<seb128> Laney, I put your name for tomboy on the etherpad to avoid that issue :p
<Laney> you can put that I offer sponsorship if anyone ever wants to do it
<Laney> :P
<seb128> jbicha, telepathy-mission-control-5 is free
<rodrigo_> hmm, are we including transmission in main?
<seb128> rodrigo_, it's on the CD for years
<seb128> rodrigo_, so we are not including it, we keep it there ;-)
<rodrigo_> ah, jbicha added a comment to the etherpad
<rodrigo_> ah, but it's for dependencies!
<rodrigo_> sorry
<seb128> rodrigo_, it got new depends
<rodrigo_> yeah, just saw it
<seb128> rodrigo_, did you work on it?
<seb128> rodrigo_, if you want to sponsor the update please do it ;-)
<rodrigo_> no, didn't work on it, and yes, can do the sponsoring
<seb128> jbicha, oh, there is vinagre also if you want since you did the previous updates for this one
<rodrigo_> jbicha, hmm, your merge request is wrong, just includes removed files, so I guess it's proposed for merging into the wrong branch?
<chrisccoulson> dobey, you mentioned on friday about changes to how U1 updates may be distributed in the future (when i asked whether anybody was using extras). have you got any more details about that?
<jbicha> seb128: well, I don't know how to fix the amd64 build problem & it didn't change much this cycle
<seb128> jbicha, they ship the .convert for the settings
<seb128> jbicha, if you do the update I will fix the build issue ;-)
<dobey> chrisccoulson: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-o-ubuntuone-agile-delivery-of-u1
<jbicha> seb128: ok
<chrisccoulson> dobey, thanks
<seb128> jbicha, thanks
<chrisccoulson> i'm wondering if we should do something similar for our remaining mozilla extensions ;)
<jbicha> rodrigo_: you mean transmission?
<rodrigo_> jbicha, yes
<jbicha> rodrigo_: I drop the .pc stuff but I probably shouldn't bother as Launchpad will add it back
<seb128> jbicha, shouldn't it be a merge request against the ubuntu-desktop vcs?
<jbicha> rodrigo_: at the bottom it says the diff has been truncated for viewing
<seb128> mterry, didrocks already did it
<mterry> seb128, yup, just saw
<seb128> mterry, can you sponsor yelp-xsl?
<mterry> seb128, man, you people are fast.  I turn away to do something else and 3.1.4 has already landed  ;)
<jbicha> seb128: perhaps, when I did 2.32, I was told to go ahead and merge with the main ubuntu branch since it was newer
<mterry> seb128, which was a long way of saying "yes"
<rodrigo_> jbicha, oh
<jbicha> I prefer the ubuntu-desktop branch though
<seb128> mterry, otherwise on the "to update" list I think we still have: libgnome-keyring gnome-keyring (requires p11-kit) telepathy-mission-control-5 glibmm2.4
<rodrigo_> yes
<seb128> jbicha, ok
<seb128> mterry, gedit-plugins could be updated to 3.1 also
<rodrigo_> seb128, did you get the list of apps using the g-p-m bus interface?
<seb128> rodrigo_, no but I can do that now, what was the interface again?
<rodrigo_> seb128, org.gnome.PowerManager
<seb128> ok
<rodrigo_> seb128, thanks
<jbicha> desrt: dconf-editor will need an icon too if it's going to be visible
<desrt> jbicha: ya.  i noticed how ugly it is :)
<desrt> jbicha: know any artists? :)
<desrt> (i guess we could just steal one from the icon theme...)
<jbicha> desrt: I'd jut cheat and steal the gconf-editor one
<jbicha> *just
<didrocks> desrt: if you want, Julie can maybe do one
<desrt> hmmmmmm
<desrt> i can't imagine that it's very fun to come up with an icon concept for a settings editor :p
<dobey> can you make dconf-editor itself not be ugly too? :)
<dobey> desrt: that's easy. make it a DIP switch
<desrt> dobey: talk to robert :)
<seb128> ok
<seb128> jbicha, mterry, rodrigo_: I've added a "Still to claim:" list to the etherpad
<seb128> easier this way
<seb128> just move things to "Started" with your name next when you claim something
<desrt> man
<desrt> gconf-editor has a terrible icon!
<desrt> no way i copy that
<dobey> haha, it's for getting under the hood of the config system
<didrocks> desrt: I would suggest the kind of private joke icon that nobody can understand just to ensure that's obsfucated :) (like http://iris-bleu.i.r.pic.centerblog.net/o/bcfaa338.jpg)
<desrt> i think i'll just steal the system settings icon
<seb128> don't
<rodrigo_> seb128, ok
<desrt> seb128: any reason why not?
<dobey> use the icq icon
<seb128> desrt, it's not nice to have several items with the same icon in the same category ;-)
<desrt> didrocks: maybe i need a new icon, after all :)
<dobey> desrt: because people will go there thinking it is a nice ui to adjust settings
<dobey> desrt: steal the regedit.exe icon :)
<desrt> dobey: as microsoft DMCAs the gnome git server
<desrt> ;)
<didrocks> desrt: I'll ask if you want :)
<desrt> didrocks: only if she is really bored
<desrt> for now i will do the release with no icon
<dobey> heh
<didrocks> desrt: I'll ask her ;)
<desrt> thanks
<seb128> desrt, keep the entry hidden then?
<desrt> seb128: it's an unstable release
<seb128> desrt, ok, fair enough
<chrisccoulson> seb128, i think bug 816377 is ready for you now. i've fixed the 2 remaining packages holding python-gtkmozembed in the archive now
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 816377 in xulrunner-2.0 "Please remove and blacklist source and binaries from oneiric" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/816377
<jbicha> and dconf-editor is not installed by default
<seb128> chrisccoulson, ok, will have a look later if nobody beats me to it
<seb128> cleaning my stack of updates and sponsoring first
<seb128> jbicha, right, maybe we should ;-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, thanks
<seb128> we had gconf-editor installed by default
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, how about this for an icon? http://is.gd/2SFGrV
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: like I'll hammer you strongly if you don't install the schema?!? :-)
<chrisccoulson> heh
<desrt> didrocks: i'd like to introduce you to the new, softer, GSettings
<didrocks> desrt: I heard about a new cool feature there! :-)
<didrocks> not sure in what condition you did this!
<desrt> didrocks: i guess you heard about it before most others... :)
<jbicha> Adwaita's a bit weird, most apps use the traditional gray, but a few have opted into the dark variant
<jbicha> I'd prefer one or the other please
<didrocks> desrt: amazing, air sound speed > dsl you mean? :)
<seb128> jbicha, things like display content should be different in GNOME design or something
<seb128> like the viewers
<desrt> didrocks: speed of sound > speed of me typing "git push"
<didrocks> heh :)
<jbicha> seb128: Vinagre has some .la files in its plugin folder, but those are bad, right?
<seb128> jbicha, rather "not needed", they don't hurt but would be nice to clean yes
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, maybe i should do some gnome updates
<seb128> chrisccoulson, \o/
<seb128> chrisccoulson, see "Still to claim:" on the etherpad if you want to do some
<mterry> jbicha, I'll do the MIRs and reviews you've generated during this GNOME update
<mterry> jbicha, thanks for the awesome work!
<dobey> didrocks: that didn't seem to work :(
<didrocks> dobey: it surely works for all unity packages, you can try DH_VERBOSE=1
<dobey> didrocks: ah, had the path wrong, because stuff wasn't actually going in debian/tmp/, but debian/$packagename
<didrocks> dobey: ah! makes more sense then!
<dobey> didrocks: yeah, thanks :)
<didrocks> yw!
<dobey> hrmm. i wish bzr bd would use pbuilder
<Laney> can't you give it --builder?
<dobey> i don't know. too much work. it should jfdi :)
<GunnarHj> rodrigo_, seb128: Hello guys! Rodrigo, have you had an opportunity to look at https://code.launchpad.net/~gunnarhj/gnome-control-center/langfix/+merge/68997 ? It would be good if we could make progress with it and the two related MPs. Would a scheduled meeting help? Any other ideas?
<rodrigo_> GunnarHj, hmm, no, first notice I have about it, looking now...
<chrisccoulson> g'ah, libgnome-keyring rejected
<seb128> chrisccoulson, you know the deal... ;-)
<rodrigo_> GunnarHj, 1st thing is that you shouldn't be reading /var/lib/AccountsService/users/%, but use the AccountsService dbus interface for retrieving the user's language
<rodrigo_> GunnarHj, I'll add some more comments in the merge proposal
<seb128> jbicha, dunno if that's you who was asking about it yesterday, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DeviceMenuAndUserMenu
<GunnarHj> rodrigo_: I know. Haven't been able to figure out how to do that, and would appreciate a helping hand. Looking forward to your other comments.
<jbicha> seb128: ah, thank you
<rodrigo_> GunnarHj, see the code in the user-accounts panel, it has code to call SetLanguage, so the same can be done to retrieve the Language Dbus property
<jbicha> here I was hoping that the implementation wasn't as good as the design but I see the design has issues too
<seb128> jbicha, talk to mpt I guess ;-)
<GunnarHj> rodrigo_: Think I looked there, but will do so again, and get back to you.
<seb128> didrocks, chrisccoulson, Sweetshark, tremolux, kenvandine, didrocks, mterry, cyphermox, rodrigo_, tkamppeter: desktop team meeting coming
<didrocks> like, in 35s? :)
<rodrigo_> seb128, ok
<cyphermox> yup
<rodrigo_> didrocks, 28 now :)
<cyphermox> o/
 * pedro_ waves
<didrocks> rodrigo_: even less now! :-)
<seb128> pedro_, ups, sorry, hey ;-)
<cyphermox> omg omg omg
<pedro_> hello :-)
<seb128> did we loose mterry?
<davmor2> cyphermox: is that he new w w w ?
<seb128> ok, meeting time
<cyphermox> davmor2: :)
<seb128> kenvandine, hey
<seb128> kenvandine, are you back?
<kenvandine> yup
<kenvandine> partner update is on the wiki
<seb128> kenvandine, ok, partner update?
 * Sweetshark dances
<seb128> libindicate-gtk-gtk3 \o/
<kenvandine> yup!
<seb128> those lib(indic*)-gtk<n>-gtk<v> start being ridiculous :p
<seb128> oh, a mterry
<kenvandine> i am reviewing that now and will fix up the packaging
<seb128> mterry, meeting!
<kenvandine> we should be able to build gir and vapi now
<mterry> yup :)
<seb128> excellent
<kenvandine> tedg also fixed up the namespace problems
<seb128> ok
<seb128> kenvandine, what is u1 going to do exactly?
<kenvandine> i don't have much detail yet... but apparently RT has agreed
<seb128> they will have their updates out of the archive?
<kenvandine> for oneiric it will be a shim that only accesses main
<kenvandine> not for oneiric, i think
<seb128> ok
<seb128> did they agree with pitti as well? ;-)
<kenvandine> i haven't been in on the all the discussions, josh forwarded me more mails
<seb128> well I will let that to him when he's back :p
<kenvandine> i need to read
<seb128> it's not the sort of topic I want to step in
<seb128> questions for kenvandine?
<seb128> seems not
<seb128> thanks kenvandine
<kenvandine> :)
<seb128> didrocks, hey
<seb128> didrocks, unity update?
<didrocks> everything should be on the wiki :)
<seb128> didrocks, unity-2d on gtk3 \o/
<didrocks> I'm sure everyone is eager to see next update! :)
<seb128> no \o/ for unity-3d, I'm waiting for them to fix their events handling and leaks :p
<didrocks> let's see what we will get this week :)
<seb128> questions for didrocks?
<highvoltage> is the ubuntu-desktop team doing anything for gnome 3 fallback mode?
<highvoltage> we're planning to support it as an optional extra in edubuntu
<didrocks> highvoltage: the fallback mode is unity2d
<didrocks> for unity
<seb128> didrocks, GNOME3 gnome-panel is still supported but not on the CD
<didrocks> I think the same code is working for gnome-shell -> gnome-panel
<highvoltage> didrocks: no I'm specifically talking about gnome 3 fallback, or "the old gnome desktop"
<didrocks> highvoltage: it should work for the gnome-shell session (it was when I merged gnome-session)
<seb128> highvoltage, we have unity3d, unity2d, gnome-shell, gnome-panel on gtk3
<didrocks> seb128: I know that, but thanks :-)
<seb128> you can use whatever you want in edubuntu I guess
<seb128> didrocks, sorry, that was for highvoltage
<seb128> but I'm not sure I understood the question
<highvoltage> ok, I was just wondering if the desktop team planned any other work for it. I'll take that as a no then.
<seb128> we will package updates
<seb128> but that's about it
<highvoltage> ok
<seb128> thanks didrocks
<seb128> tremolux, hey
<didrocks> yw
<seb128> tremolux, s-c update?
<tremolux> seb128: hey! yes, I put it on the wiki
<seb128> hum, no tremolux?
<seb128> oh ;-)
<tremolux> new release has some cool stuff, editing and deleting of your reviews, new top rated section
<seb128> nice
<tremolux> and a great speedup of gdebi file load
<seb128> how is the gtk3 work going?
<tremolux> (a lot of people have been unhappy about that)
<seb128> tremolux, how is the gtk3 work going otherwise?
<tremolux> it is still moving forward and has some beautiful elements now, but there is a lot remaining before it can be in a state that we could consider making it the default
<seb128> ok, so not likely this cycle I guess?
<seb128> (I'm watching for the GNOME3 specs)
<tremolux> in other words, it's very rough still at this point...it's a very young effort relatively as this was spec'd well into the cycle
<seb128> ok
<tremolux> the issue is that the gtk3 port contains all of the new 5.0 design elements, rather than a straight port of what we have
<didrocks> tremolux: so, if I really want to push oneconf by default, should I target the gtk2 version?
<tremolux> so it's massive churn in progress
<tremolux> didrocks: is there a lot of UI involved?
<didrocks> as it's clearly what's block me at that point, the server part is all done :)
<didrocks> tremolux: well, the plugin that is changed everytime due to s-c API not being garranteed
<didrocks> tremolux: quite a lot of code, indeed
<tremolux> if the backend is pretty stable and the UI work is not too involved, it can be done in both branches
<tremolux> didrocks: right, the plugin api, does it keep changing?
<didrocks> tremolux: the plugin api is giving access to the full s-c, and yeah, it keeps changing :)
<tremolux> didrocks: well, the gtk2 branch should be getting quite stable at this point, I hope  :/
<didrocks> tremolux: ok, I'll try to target the gtk2 branch for oneiric then
<tremolux> didrocks: and yes, I think you'd want to target that because gtk3 is still quite rough and in a lot of churn
<didrocks> tremolux: ok, can we have a look that week of what changed? I'll try to keep the plugin as it is today then
<tremolux> didrocks: but I hate for you to put a lot of work into the gtk2 stuff because it is EOLing for 12.04 for sure
<didrocks> tremolux: yeah, but oneconf missed the target for everytime a new reason for 2 cycles already, I don't want it to be that 3 times :)
<didrocks> let's see how much work it is to port to the current gtk2 version
<tremolux> didrocks: I hear you loud and clear :)
<didrocks> I'll ping ou directly (or you can join #oneconf)
<didrocks> :)
<didrocks> or*
<tremolux> didrocks: ONECONF must happen!
<seb128> ok, seems like we should target the gtk2 version for oneiric rather
<didrocks> \o/
<tremolux> seb128: yes, sorry I didn't make that very clear
<seb128> it's getting late to land and stabilize the gtk3 one especially if lot of work is still needed
<seb128> tremolux, no worry, thanks for the update, keep the good work!
<tremolux> seb128: exactly, it's very rough still, my honest assessment
<seb128> didrocks, thanks for the oneconf work, let's cross fingers it lands this cycle ;-)
<seb128> let's move on
 * didrocks crosses his finger very hard as well :)
<didrocks> fingers*
<seb128> http://status.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-oneiric/canonical-desktop-team-oneiric-alpha-3.html
 * tremolux too
<seb128> so
<tremolux> thanks guys
<seb128> the curve is not an happy curve!
<seb128> so please everybody update your a3 wi
<seb128> let's discuss those a bit there
<seb128> kenvandine, hey again
<kenvandine> yeah
<seb128> kenvandine, gwibber still had 4 for "friends" topic
<seb128> is that on track? needed for a3?
<kenvandine> no... blocked on a e-d-s bug
<kenvandine> which rodrigo_ might fix :)
<kenvandine> from what i hear
<rodrigo_> kenvandine, hmm, which bug?
<kenvandine> the one BigWhale asked about
<kenvandine> one sec
<chrisccoulson> seb128, i can close 5 WI's in one go when you do bug 816377 ;)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 816377 in xulrunner-2.0 "Please remove and blacklist source and binaries from oneiric" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/816377
<seb128> chrisccoulson, ;-)
<chrisccoulson> that's a good motivator :)
<seb128> indeed
<kenvandine> rodrigo_, my awesome bar isn't findiing it :)
<rodrigo_> kenvandine, hmm, is it the one about get_contacts not working on the gir generated stuff?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, btw charline has a wi on the email client spec, do you know if she did the testing yet? did they publish it somewhere?
<kenvandine> yes
<seb128> kenvandine, seems like that feature could slip to next cycle without being a stopper anyway?
<kenvandine> yeah
<rodrigo_> kenvandine, oh, ok, i looked at it and the doc comments for the API include the correct info for the introspection stuff to be generated correctly, so not sure why it didn't work
<rodrigo_> kenvandine, if you find the bug # I'll have another look
<kenvandine> rodrigo_, i think it was crashing for him
<kenvandine> looking
<rodrigo_> kenvandine, because I don't remember the exact details
<rodrigo_> kenvandine, yes
<seb128> ok
<seb128> let's discuss that bug after the meeting
<seb128> kenvandine, can you make sure there is a bug and add it to the blueprint?
<seb128> with rodrigo maybe subscribed to it
<seb128> or assigned
<kenvandine> https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=654564
<ubot2> Gnome bug 654564 in Contacts "Querying EDS address book in Python results in a segfault" [Critical,Unconfirmed]
<kenvandine> rodrigo_,  ^^
<rodrigo_> kenvandine, ok
<geser> did the key to delete files in nautilus change or did I break my config? pressing "del" does nothing (in oneiric)
<cyphermox> ah, that could get fixed once 3.1.4 is ready no?
<seb128> geser, ctrl-delete
<kenvandine> rodrigo_, thx!
<seb128> cyphermox, which one of the reason we wait for your update: p
<seb128> ok, thanks kenvandine, rodrigo_
<cyphermox> yeah, working on it, e-d-s is ready just finishing evo so I can test that it roughly works ;)
<seb128> kenvandine, the feature is not a blocker for oneiric I guess?
<kenvandine> no
<seb128> ok, so let's see how it goes
<kenvandine> we really really really want it
<seb128> we can drop the milestone from it if needed
<kenvandine> but not a blocker
<kenvandine> yeah
<geser> seb128: thx, any reason why it changed?
<kenvandine> i am doing that
<seb128> thanks kenvandine
<seb128> geser, see upstream lists, basically one key was too easy to hit without noticing for some users
<seb128> some users complained for a while that it was too easy to delete files without noticing
<seb128> ok
<seb128> next
<seb128> chrisccoulson, you still have quite some email client and unity integration workitems
<seb128> how are those going?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, the calendar stuff probably isn't going to happen for oneiric
<seb128> :-(
<chrisccoulson> i wouldn't mind some input from design about what the default calendar experience should be like
<seb128> I guess the appmenu upstream one is not really something we block on, what we have now is working?
<chrisccoulson> yeah, there's no hurry to do that one
<seb128> the firefox download thing seems rather a "nice to have" that a needed
<seb128> well let's see where we stand next week
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i started an extension for that a while ago
<seb128> we will need to win some CD space back
<chrisccoulson> which sort-of works
<seb128> we need to win some 15mb
<kenvandine> ugh no calendaring?
<chrisccoulson> kenvandine, there is some work to get lightning to use eds, but i wouldn't want to ship that by default anyway
<kenvandine> :(
<kenvandine> so no way by default to get appointments in indicator-datetime
<chrisccoulson> and i'm not sure how to support lightning atm
<chrisccoulson> especially seeing as bindwood has been broken now for 5 weeks since we did the last firefox update
<chrisccoulson> i guess lightning will have the same problems with security updates
<seb128> kenvandine, what appointments? no calendar ui by default anyway
<kenvandine> right
<seb128> well that was a tradeoff we know about
<kenvandine> so unless people install evolution, they can't use that feature in the indicator
<chrisccoulson> i was thinking about writing a standalone calendar app that users can create and edit appointments with
<seb128> I will keep using evolution for calendars (well if the speed comes back to an usable level)
<chrisccoulson> not sure how hard that would be though
<seb128> we should maybe look at date
<seb128> ups
<seb128> dates
<seb128> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/dates
<kenvandine> is that still maintained?
<seb128> doesn't seem so :-(
<micahg> I can integrate lightning into the update testing if it's promoted
<seb128> well no calendar for this cycle I guess
<seb128> we will not sort that today anyway, let's move on
<kenvandine> yeah
<seb128> I should descope the screensaver spec as well
<rodrigo_> dates also is too targetted to maemo, so small screens
<seb128> seems not likely we will have time to work on that this cycle either
<rodrigo_> it can be improved though, of course
<seb128> rodrigo_, well we don't really need a complete client
<seb128> just something which let you configure a calendar
<seb128> hum
<seb128> is gnome-online-account enough to configure a gcalendar?
<seb128> or do you need evolution as well?
<seb128> well anyway seems otherwise we don't have obvious spec blocked
<seb128> questions or comments?
<seb128> seems not
<jbicha> I'd really like to see a fix for bug 798951 as it breaks Gnome Shell & Fallback pretty bad
<seb128> that's a wrap then
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 798951 in gnome-panel "Applications menu fails to open due to change to /etc/xdg/menus/gnome-applications.menu" [Undecided,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/798951
<seb128> thanks everybody
<cyphermox> ah, thought it was about this :P
<cyphermox> not sure if people noticed, but if you don't have IPv6 on your network you should be seeing a good speedup in getting connected; I applied and included a patch to commit both address families separately in NM, stgraber helped a lot with testing a bunch of use cases (and we have a few back and forths)
<seb128> cyphermox, what?
<seb128> jbicha, seems like a one liner in the rules
<cyphermox> seb128: I thought it was comments specifically about the WIs and all
<cyphermox> regardless, what I just wrote is just a public announcement ^^
<didrocks> thanks seb128 :)
<seb128> nice
<jbicha> seb128: well it's been broken for weeks
<seb128> jbicha, sorry, will look at it, I assumed that if people were annoying enough by it they would just submit a merge proposal to fix it
<seb128> seems like that's wrong assumption though ;-)
<seb128> jbicha, I've neither g-s or gnome-panel installed and my system is an upgrade
<jbicha> seb128: I'm not sure the correct way to fix it since Debian does it differently I believe
<seb128> but I can just tweak the rules that should work
<seb128> well, we do it the upstream way
<seb128> i.e we don't rename the menus
<seb128> seems like rodrigo_ broke it when he merge
<seb128> he didn't comment the rules .menus rename
<rodrigo_> hmm, me? no, it wasn't me!! :)
<seb128> but he did drop the debian code patch for the rename
<seb128> so the installed names and loaded one don't match
 * rodrigo_ looks
<jbicha> thanks :-)
<seb128> rodrigo_, gnome-menus, debian rename the .menus to prefix gnome-
<seb128> seems like you forgot to drop the rename from the rules
<rodrigo_> seb128, ah right
 * kenvandine is really digging the compiz modal dialogs, didn't think i would
<didrocks> kenvandine: don't get too used to it, it will be removed
<kenvandine> bummer
<kenvandine> i didn't think i would like it...  oh well :)
<seb128> kenvandine, I like it when it works
<kenvandine> hehe
<seb128> which means once a day
<seb128> like if you have some small dialog the file selector can't be used
<seb128> it also tend to shift things on screen
<desrt> tedg: hey hey
<lamalex> mterry, is there a deja-dup help channel?
<BigWhale> rodrigo_, while you're at that bug... I have another question that's, well, bugging me. :> Are there any working examples of pyton interaction with EDS? Because whatever I write, it fails to work. :)
<kenvandine> BigWhale, i suspect nothing that doesn't use python-evolution
<BigWhale> kenvandine, excellent news! ;> Why do I always start working on something that nobody has done before... I feel like James T. Kirk...
<rodrigo_> BigWhale, not that I know
<BigWhale> always going where no man has gone before :P
<rodrigo_> the introspection stuff is new, so you seem to be the 1st one :)
<BigWhale> rodrigo_, anyway, this is the code that fails to work: http://pastebin.com/9nHFX2Yk
<rodrigo_> ok
<BigWhale> (beside the bug that I reported)
<BigWhale> the one that makes python dump the core...
<seb128> oh, I forgot something during the meeting
<seb128> everybody please test the lightdm update today
<seb128> robert_ancell is still working half a day tomorrow and then off work for 2.5 weeks
<seb128> so if there is something broken we should let him know today so he has a chance to have a look tomorrow
<seb128> didrocks, mterry, kenvandine, chrisccoulson, rodrigo_, others: ^
<rodrigo_> seb128, ok
<chrisccoulson> seb128, sure
<seb128> thanks
<kenvandine> will do
<seb128> bah
<seb128> it's in NEW
<seb128> good that I looked :p
<kenvandine> seb128, should we focus on unity-greeter?
<kenvandine> or is that default now?
<didrocks> ok, will do
<seb128> kenvandine, test whatever greeter you use, unity greeter is not default yet no
<seb128> we agreed with robert_ancell that it's better to wait after he's back and updated version to switch
<seb128> the current has some issues especially with indicators
<seb128> he did update the gtk greeter to gtk3 though
<seb128> I've newed the binaries, they should be available in the next publisher run
<seb128> i.e around an hour
<chrisccoulson> is the unity greeter usable?
<chrisccoulson> i haven't tried it for real yet
<chrisccoulson> i tried the test mode ;)
<seb128> I'm using it for a few weeks
<seb128> it didn't have the "can't log in ecryptfs protected userdirs" bug
<seb128> well I was using it, until I tested the lightdm update, I just tried the stock gtk one on today's update
<seb128> but it's good that I tested it 0.9.1 wasn't able to log with ecryptfs again
<seb128> that should be fixed in 0.9.2 which is what robert_ancell uploaded
<chrisccoulson> seb128, i will get us back 3MB on the CD when i do the next tbird upload btw
<seb128> chrisccoulson, \o/
<chrisccoulson> unless you already counted that 3MB in the "need to find 15MB"
<seb128> turning optimization?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah
<chrisccoulson> https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=655003
<ubot2> Mozilla bug 655003 in Build Config "Sort out optimization defaults" [Normal,Resolved: fixed]
<seb128> no I didn't count those 3mb
<chrisccoulson> the last few comments
<seb128> so we "only" need 11 to 12mb now
<chrisccoulson> heh
<seb128> I think pitti mentioned we will win some extra 8mb once we get properly localized isos and can drop the langpacks we have
<seb128> those number include space to add clutter which I guess we will need
<seb128> still it's tight
<chrisccoulson> yeah
<chrisccoulson> we might be able to make firefox and tbird use the system nss and nspr libs for release (if we keep them up-to-date)
<seb128> kenvandine, btw if you want eds gir use example you can probably look at the addressbook for GNOME that alexl has been working on
<chrisccoulson> but we'd need to switch back soon after release, as the requirements for those are bumped in pretty much every update
<seb128> kenvandine, it's vala I think but should be closer than the old static bindings use
<chrisccoulson> that could save us another couple of MB
<seb128> chrisccoulson, oh, nice
<chrisccoulson> that would be a last resort though :)
<seb128> let's see, we still have some time for CD space settling
<kenvandine> BigWhale, ^^
<kenvandine> see what seb128 said
<chrisccoulson> it might save as much as 2.5MB actually
<BigWhale> kenvandine, ah!
<kenvandine> BigWhale, seb128 knows what everyone is up to :)
<BigWhale> seb128, is there a more general direction of where should I look? :)
<kenvandine> probably look at git.gnome.org and planet.gnome.org
<seb128> http://download.gnome.org/sources/gnome-contacts
<BigWhale> http://blogs.gnome.org/alexl/2011/06/13/announcing-gnome-contacts/
<seb128> corresponding git on git.gnome.org I guess
<BigWhale> this?
<seb128> yes
<BigWhale> ah yes
<seb128> he has been pushing to get the eds annotations fixed
<seb128> so I guess he's using them
<chrisccoulson> oh, lightdm is not published yet
<BigWhale> hm, this thing is pure vala...
<seb128> chrisccoulson, yeah, I didn't noticed in was in binNEW before doing the announce there
<seb128> so I newed it, will be available in some 45 minutes
<chrisccoulson> heh :)
<kenvandine> BigWhale, yeah, but it should be similar to the gir
<chrisccoulson> thanks
<BigWhale> I'll take a look. thanks, seb128
<kenvandine> BigWhale, doesn't prove it works with gir though
<seb128> yw
<BigWhale> kenvandine, yeah... I'll probably write small vala app, just to see if everything is working
<rodrigo_> BigWhale, so, running your code I get 'e_book_client_get_contacts_sync: assertion `contacts != NULL' failed', do you get that also?
<BigWhale> yes
<rodrigo_> so, I guess it expects an address there, right?
<rodrigo_> so for some reason contacts is being passed as NULL
<rodrigo_> how do you pass addresses in python, if that's possible?
<kenvandine> i bet that is the problem
<BigWhale> rodrigo_, if I initialize contacts with contacts = [0,1,2] (or whatever, just to have something in it) there is no assertion and it seems like the search is being performed, but nothing is returned
<rodrigo_> yes, so contactslist in the C API is a GSList **contacts
<dobey> you can't really use .gir in python as if it was necessarily a python binding
<rodrigo_> right, I guess you need to pass a GLib.GSList there
<dobey> passing a python list in as a GSList arg won't work
<dobey> right
<rodrigo_> BigWhale, ^^
<rodrigo_> you need to use the same data type the C API expects
<dobey> seb128: https://code.launchpad.net/~dobey/ubuntu/oneiric/ubuntu-sso-client/fix-ftbfs/+merge/69330 and https://code.launchpad.net/~dobey/ubuntu/oneiric/ubuntuone-control-panel/fix-ftbfs/+merge/69331 btw
<BigWhale> rodrigo_, I think I tried that...
<rodrigo_> BigWhale, also, you need to pass all arguments to the function, since, if not, it will get undefined values for some of its arguments
<rodrigo_> so, you need to add a GError ** also, or None, to the list of arguments
<kenvandine> this might be a good case for a gi.overrides
<dobey> also, you can't really use keyword args
<dobey> you have to pass all the args, in the right positions
<kenvandine> indeed
<rodrigo_> kenvandine, yes, I guess it could translate between glib's lists and python's lists
<kenvandine> right
<dobey> kenvandine: any language that isn't C is probably a good case for gi.overrides :)
<BigWhale> just a sec... latest update uninstalled my evolution... ?!
<kenvandine> BigWhale, so try that... if it works then we can wrap it with an overrides
<kenvandine> so it is more pythonic
<kenvandine> dobey, sad... but true :(
<rodrigo_> but, for the time being, to check if the gi stuff works, is there any way to pass args by reference in python? I remind reading something, but what I've tried so far doesn't work
<kenvandine> rodrigo_, i doubt it...
<dobey> rodrigo_: no. and yes. args in python are by definition, by reference
<dobey> BigWhale: you probably need to do contacts = None, then pass that in for the contacts arg, i guess
<BigWhale> dobey, no, that doesn't work
<BigWhale> TypeError: argument 2: Must be sequence, not NoneType
<rodrigo_> dobey, that doesn't work
<BigWhale> it requires a sequence
<dobey> BigWhale: then that's a bug in the gir
<BigWhale> I think I tried with GList too
<rodrigo_>  * @contacts: (out) a #GSList of matched #EContact-s
<dobey> right
<rodrigo_> I guess it needs some extra metadata there
 * rodrigo_ looks
<dobey> the problem is that python thinks it is a sequence expected, because of the **
<BigWhale> I'm trying to remember what I need to include for GList to become available... :> I was convinced it used to be GLib ...
<dobey> GSList and GList are in either GLib or GObject
<rodrigo_> GLib
<dobey> rodrigo_: some glib-only things are in GObject gir though
<dobey> rodrigo_: it's weird, yes :)
<rodrigo_> oh, really?
<asac> bryceh: hi!
<dobey> yeah, probably because gobject requires them
<BigWhale> from gi.repository.GLib import GList
<BigWhale> I think, this used to work...
<dobey> BigWhale: it doesn't matter, because what you need is GSList
<dobey> notice the big S in there :)
<BigWhale> oh
<rodrigo_> http://live.gnome.org/GObjectIntrospection/Annotations
<kenvandine> from gi.repository import GLib
<BigWhale> kenvandine, yeah.. that would be it... :>
<kenvandine> then GLib.SList
<rodrigo_> I guess it needs a (container) annotation
<rodrigo_> no, sorry
<BigWhale> TypeError: argument 2: Must be sequence, not SList
<BigWhale> it expects python sequence
<dobey> you can't pass SList in
<rodrigo_> yes, I think the gi stuff in ebook needs to specify the kind of argument it is
<rodrigo_> but can't find anything
<dobey> you have to pass a GSList variable which is initialized to NULL (in C terms)
<rodrigo_> and how do you that in python? :)
<kenvandine> rodrigo_, the gir file says it is a GList
<kenvandine> not GSList
<dobey> you should be able to do foo = None; and pass in foo
<kenvandine>             <type name="GLib.List" c:type="GList**">
<rodrigo_> hmm, maybe it got changed, I am looking at git master, and there it's a GSList
<dobey> rodrigo_: the gir is probably just wrong
<kenvandine> and it only takes two args
<dobey> but it's really irrelevant right this second
<kenvandine> query and contacts
<kenvandine> no error
<kenvandine> which is normal for gir
<rodrigo_> kenvandine, hmm, I have <type name="GLib.SList" c:type="GSList**">
<rodrigo_> kenvandine, what version of e-d-s do you have?
<kenvandine> for get_contacts?
<rodrigo_> get_contacts_sync
<kenvandine> looking at /usr/share/gir-1.0/EBook-1.2.gir
<kenvandine> oh
<BigWhale> The thing is that variables in python are always passed by reference
<BigWhale> as far as I remember
<dobey>  always and never
<kenvandine> i missed the deprecated warning
<BigWhale> kenvandine, the deprecated call to get contacts is even worse... it makes python dump the core :>
<rodrigo_> BigWhale, but that's because you are not passing all arguments, I think
<BigWhale> let me see
<BigWhale> rodrigo_, no, that's not the case...
<BigWhale> rodrigo_, it takes only two arguments
<BigWhale> threee
<dobey> the gir is broken.
<dobey> or at least, incomplete with regards to working with python
<BigWhale> is it time yet for me to curl up in fetal position and sob silently? or should I wait a bit more? :))
<dobey> what package is the gir file in?
<rodrigo_> BigWhale, I'm asking the introspection guys
<rodrigo_> BigWhale, but yes, seems e-d-s C source needs to annotate the argument correctly
<seb128> kenvandine, btw new g-s-d in oneiric
<seb128> kenvandine, so you can upload indicator-power
<dobey> rodrigo_: i have found that if there is a problem when using a gir, the probability that the gir is just broken is almost always 1
<dupondje> rodrigo_: About you change in gnome-menu. No app makes use of gnome-menu ?
<dupondje> of gnome-applications.menu I mean ofc
<rodrigo_> dupondje, afaik, no, seb128 should know better
<rodrigo_> dupondje, it's debian-specific
<seb128> dupondje, no, we never followed the debian specific gnome- prefixing
<seb128> dupondje, upstream name it the same way as we do
<mterry> lamalex, sorry, missed your ping.  There isn't a channel right now.  Might be a good idea?  Right now, most user support goes through Launchpad Answers
<dupondje> ah ok :)
<mterry> lamalex, you can always ping me too (though apparently my response time is poor :))
<BigWhale> rodrigo_, it should be done in a way that you can pass python list to the call... if I get back GSList then there isn't much that I can do with it, beside converting it to python list (or something similar)
<kenvandine> seb128, great
<kenvandine> will do
<rodrigo_> BigWhale, you can use it with the GLib.GSList API at least
<dobey> GLib.SList should be an iterable object in Python
<dobey> if it's not, i think that should be filed as a bug against glib
<lamalex> mterry, yah i sent you a pm
<BigWhale> dobey, I'll just wait for this bug to get fixed
<BigWhale> rodrigo_, should I file another bug for this gir stuff?
<dupondje> Another small question. If changing the Caps Lock behavior doesn't work. Where to report bug ?
<rodrigo_> BigWhale, no need, we can use the same one
<rodrigo_> BigWhale, as soon as I get an answer in #introspection, I'll write a patch
<BigWhale> rodrigo_, great!
<didrocks> good evening everyone!
<BigWhale> rodrigo_, do you think you'll have this done sooner than in a week?
<rodrigo_> BigWhale, I hope to have it tomorrow, as on Thursday I'll be on holidays
<rodrigo_> it should be easy to fix, I think, if there is an annotation for that
<rodrigo_> I'm mostly sure this is not the 1st case
<rodrigo_> some glib/gobject API uses GSList/GLis **, iirc
<dupondje> Any idea ?
<seb128> dupondje, not sure either xorg or gnome-control-center
<seb128> dupondje, but it's likely to be an xorg issue
<dupondje> Guess i'll open a bug on that :D
<seb128> good luck
<seb128> seems like the sort of issue that will be so low on the issues list that nobody will look at it
<seb128> GNOME 3.2 plans to drop the keyboard tweaking option list I think
<dupondje> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xorg/+bug/816588
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 816588 in xorg "Changing Caps Lock to Shift Lock does not work" [Undecided,New]
<seb128> dupondje, thanks
<dupondje> dunno if I can do more debugging
<dupondje> quite annoying isssue for me :)
<seb128> sorry about that
<dupondje> np :)
<seb128> but it's quite likely that it's only you ;-)
<seb128> that's one issue with having all those weird options
<seb128> they are handy for some users who got used to them but create lot of extra work if you want to maintain them properly
<dupondje> Yea Azerty keyboard ... ;)
<seb128> well I'm using an azerty keyboard
<seb128> but I just use the key as they are mapped by default
<seb128> works fine ;-)
<dupondje> Well I prefer Shift Lock instead of Caps Lock
<dupondje> also my keyboard itself shows 'Shift Lock'
<dupondje> but I wont die if it doesn't work :P
<seb128> hehe, I don't even understand what the difference is between caps lock and shift lock ;-)
<dupondje> Well
<dupondje> With caps lock enabled: the numeric keys give you: &Ã"'
<seb128> do you swap shift and caps lock behaviours?
<dupondje> With shift-lock enabled: 1234
<dupondje> I want to swap it
<dupondje> but the option seems to do nothing
<seb128> hum
<seb128> well to real test if that's xorg the thing to do would probably to figure the xorg command to change that and try it
<seb128> like an Xmodmap or something
<seb128> but it's over my xorg knowledge, maybe #ubuntu-x has a clue
<dupondje> seb128: it looks quite easy
<dupondje> keycode 66 = Shift_Lock
<dupondje> in a file
<dupondje> xmodmap <file>
<dupondje> and then it works fine ...
<BigWhale> New alt-tab (ctrl-tab) isn't raised on top of the windows...
<seb128> dupondje, the issue could be on the gnome-control-center side rather then
<dupondje> can that be debugged somehow ?
<chrisccoulson> hello 3MB
<seb128> chrisccoulson, \o/
<seb128> dupondje, well I guess so by somebody who understand xorg, keyboard layout, libxklavier, gnome-control-center
<BigWhale> Uhm
<BigWhale> Who said that we need to watch for lightdm bugs?
<BigWhale> I had to install irssi, because Xorg didn't start. lightdm is runing, tho... :>
<BigWhale> oh, lightdm failed to load session file and failed to start greeter ...
<seb128> what version?
<seb128> the new update? did you restart?
<seb128> or just log out?
<BigWhale> I did restart
<seb128> what greeter did you use before the upgrade?
<BigWhale> 0.9.2 is reported by lightdm
<BigWhale> I have no idea what was used before.. I just noticed that I didn't have unity-greeter installed
<seb128> hum :-(
<seb128> that's normal
<seb128> do you have lightdm-gtk-greeter
<seb128> ?
<BigWhale> no.. I am installing it now
<BigWhale> ok it works now yes
<seb128> hum
<BigWhale> but the greeter looks like something from 1993 :>
<seb128> yeah, it has no theme set
<seb128> you can try the unity-greeter if you want
<BigWhale> seb128: it used lightdm-gtk-greeter
<seb128> right, that's the default one
<BigWhale> seb128: where do I tell it to use unity greeter? /etc/lightdm?
<seb128> some other desktopers around to try dist-upgrading and tell me if there is a lightdm greeter installed
<seb128> ?
<seb128> BigWhale, lightdm.conf yes
<seb128> kenvandine, chrisccoulson, mterry?
<seb128> cyphermox?
<BigWhale> I did a dist-upgrade
<seb128> can somebody who doesn't have the new lightdm yet see if dist-upgrade bring lightdm-gtk-greeter?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, 1 second
<seb128> chrisccoulson, thanks
<BigWhale> and I got the new lightdm, but not the greeter
<seb128> BigWhale, yeah, I want to check if everybody will land with no greeter installed in which case we would need to fix it ;-)
<seb128> BigWhale, right, I want to know if that's a bug everybody has if there was an issue for you
<BigWhale> but I am running dist-upgrades since alpha1 so ...
<BigWhale> it might just be me :>
<chrisccoulson> my connection is going a bit slow, as i'm uploading all my daily builds ;)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, no, dist-upgrade doesn't bring in the greeter here
<kenvandine> seb128, checking
<seb128> chrisccoulson, thanks
<seb128> ok, fixing it
<kenvandine> seb128, yeah... it doesn't for me either
<cyphermox> seb128: dah, I was just pulling in unity-greeter
<cyphermox> lightdm has been broken for me for a while though
<seb128> can you try lightdm-gtk-greeter?
<cyphermox> sure
<seb128> the new version should work
<cyphermox> ok
<chrisccoulson> so, how do i change my default greeter to the unity one? :-)
<BigWhale> I am faling to find some obvious option to use unity greeter :'(
<BigWhale> lol
 * chrisccoulson needs crack
<chrisccoulson> :)
<BigWhale> everyone has a crack
<BigWhale> ;>
<chrisccoulson> lol
<cyphermox> ah, something else though; anybody else having unity-window-decorator suddenly stop decorating ? ;)
<BigWhale> there's no greeter=lightdm-gtk-greeter in lighdm.conf :>
<seb128> greeter-theme=unity
<BigWhale> seb128: I did that
<BigWhale> it didn't work
<seb128> in the right section?
 * BigWhale bursts into tears.
<BigWhale> yes
<seb128> you need to uncomment the [seat..] iirc
<BigWhale> the seat0 yes
<seb128> "Users should set [SeatDefaults] section with settings for
<seb128>         all seats, and can override each setting in a per seat configuration.
<seb128> "
<seb128> [SeatDefaults]
<seb128> greeter-session=
<seb128> greeter-session=unity
<seb128> something like that?
<seb128> without the "greeter-session=" line
<BigWhale> I broke something ...
<BigWhale> geez... it's been so many years since I used ALT-F1 and ALF-F2 so furiously...
<BigWhale> :>
<BigWhale> failed to load unity.desktop
<BigWhale> it seems that the name has to be unity-greeter
<BigWhale> ooooh... shiny
<BigWhale> [SeatDefaults]
<BigWhale> greeter-session=unity-greeter
<BigWhale> greeter-theme=unity-greeter
<BigWhale> one of these two works
<BigWhale> oh, and xchat-indicator isn't installed by default with xchat :(
<seb128> it is with xchat-gnome
<BigWhale> hmm what's the difference between xchat and xchat-gnome?
<seb128> they are different softwares
<seb128> xchat is a gtk application
<seb128> xchat-gnome a GNOME one
<seb128> well I didn't use xchat for a while, out of the obvious "the user list is hidden under a button in xchat-gnome" I'm not sure
<seb128> oh and channel are on the left rather than being tab at the bottom
<seb128> xchat-gnome integrates with notify-osd, unity launcher, etc but I guess xchat does the same
<maxb> Is CUPS / printing on topic here? Is there a more relevant channel?
<geser> maxb: not sure if this channel is right, but our printing guru is tkamppeter
<maxb> I'm wondering where I might go to discover why "lpinfo -m" shows many copies of the same printer, differing only by a small integer in the hplip uri
<BigWhale> So, there's no restart option un the system menu...
<BigWhale> s/un/un/
<geser> maxb: I discussed my last cups issue in #ubuntu-devel but talk to tkamppeter where he prefers the discussion
<dupondje> What was the fix again for lightdm ? :)
<dupondje> it died here /P
<dupondje> oho the greater :)
<tkamppeter> geser, van be #ubuntu-devel or #ubuntu-desktop
<tkamppeter> geser, maxb, there is no special printing channel at Ubuntu, simply discuss here.
<maxb> OK - I'm looking for any resource that might help me understand why hplip seems to be rendering multiple of each PPD into the CUPS "lpinfo -m" list
<maxb> identifiers like: hplip:0/HP/hp-color_laserjet_cp4020_series-ps.ppd hplip:1/HP/hp-color_laserjet_cp4020_series-ps.ppd hplip:2/HP/hp-color_laserjet_cp4020_series-ps.ppd hplip:3/HP/hp-color_laserjet_cp4020_series-ps.ppd
<tkamppeter> maxb, the PPDs are for different (compatible to each other) printer models, as one can see at the multiple "Product" lines in them. The PPD file compressor tool generates one listing entry per model, to assure that all models get this PPD assigned. To see that these entries are for different models, run the more verbose "lpinfo -l -m".
<seb128> re
<desrt> seb128: step away from the computer
<kenvandine> hehe
<seb128> desrt, I did for dinner and TV, I'm back now though ;-)
<desrt> crazy man
<seb128> desrt, you can talk!
<desrt> seb128: 'you should talk', i think you mean
<dupondje> And another question, what tool is responsible to handle enable/disable of touchpad ?
<dupondje> cause I have a shortkey to disable and enable it
<seb128> desrt, let me google, I guess I'm just wrongly using a french expression there ;-)
<dupondje> but it fails to re-enable it
<seb128> desrt, which basically mean "you are saying that to me, you, srly"
<seb128> ;-)
<desrt> seb128: if you were accusing me of being a hypocrit, then the english phrase is "you should talk1"
<desrt> s/1/!/
<seb128> "tu peux parler" in french
<seb128> desrt, thanks ;-)
<seb128> desrt, google says "look who's talking" works as well ;-)
<seb128> which seems close from the french variant
<desrt> yes.  that's also quite a good one.
<seb128> desrt, see I'm glad I came back, I learnt something ;-)
<seb128> desrt, when do you fly back btw?
<desrt> tomorrow
<desrt> i have to miss the codethink allhands meeting
<seb128> ok, I though it was today for some reason
<desrt> which is such a shame, because i love phone meetings
<seb128> lol
<seb128> desrt, I'm surprised that allhands calls work
<desrt> seb128: actually, they're starting to show some signs of bad scaling
<kenvandine> grrr... no vapi for libgtksourceview-3.0
<seb128> like I already find that calls with 5 peoples are difficult
<desrt> seb128: we're about 20 now...
<seb128> or rather than a few people talk and everybody else sit there
<desrt> seb128: it helps that 3/4 of the company is in one room and only a few are remote
<seb128> right
<seb128> kenvandine, do you need a vapi if you have a gir?
<kenvandine> for vala yes
<seb128> well typelib
<seb128> I need to look at vala one day out of doing small hacks on written softwares :p
<seb128> wouldn't it make sense for vala to use the typelib infos?
<kenvandine> it would
<kenvandine> :)
<seb128> what is missing there that requires you to have a vapi?
<kenvandine> i want to have text completion in a TextView
<desrt> seb128: .gir, not typelib
<kenvandine> SourceView has it, which derives from TextView
<desrt> seb128: and vala does have the ability to do this
<kenvandine> desrt, it does?
<desrt> seb128: but it actually makes a pretty poor fit -- there are a lot of overrides that tend to be required, so .vapi is favoured
<desrt> the .gir stuff changes too often to have a stable API for a compiled programming language...
<kenvandine> looks like the vapi was there briefly, was removed on monday
<kenvandine> Remove gtksourceview-3.0 bindings
<kenvandine> Wait until we can rename the GtkSource namespace to Gtk.
<kenvandine> from the commit log
<kenvandine> :/
<seb128> kenvandine, isn't valac-0.12 shipping one?
<kenvandine> i guess it was
<kenvandine> it was removed
<seb128> oh it's gtksourceview-2
<kenvandine> it was in git master... until monday
<seb128> "great"
<kenvandine> not sure how long it lived there though :)
<seb128> kenvandine, https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=627761
<ubot2> Gnome bug 627761 in Bindings "gtksourceview-3.0 bindings" [Enhancement,New]
<desrt> ubot2: botsnack
<ubot2> Yum! Err, I mean, APT!
<desrt> cute.
<kenvandine> hehe
<kenvandine> seb128, yeah... i am experimenting with that one
<seb128> kenvandine, chrisccoulson: did you upgrade your lightdm?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, i have done
<chrisccoulson> and i'm running the unity greeter too \o/
<seb128> did somebody didn't upgrade yet?
<seb128> I would like to know if the fix I did is enough
<cyphermox> lightdm now doesn't start for me
<seb128> did you install lightdm-gtk-greeter?
<cyphermox> no such package?
<seb128> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/oneiric/+package/lightdm-gtk-greeter
<seb128> ^ such package?
<cyphermox> heh, I don't know, it didn't come up before
<cyphermox> now it does
<seb128> the recommends are buggy in 0ubuntu1 I hope I fixed it in 0ubuntu2
<cyphermox> lightdm-gtk-greeter definitely didn't get pulled in the update, if that's what you meant
<seb128> it should with 0ubuntu2
<seb128> which is not published yet
<seb128> but yeah "known issue in 0ubuntu1"
<seb128> see channel backlog from 2 hours ago
<seb128> or a bit less
<cyphermox> right ok
<seb128> sorry about that
<cyphermox> np
<seb128> well technically it's robert_ancell's fault :p
<cyphermox> I'll give it one good shot later, I'll let robert_ancell know ;)
<seb128> I didn't catch it when he asked me to test the update since I local built and dpkg -i
<seb128> thanks ;-)
 * cyphermox -> eod
<rodrigo_> BigWhale, around?
<BigWhale> YES
<BigWhale> sorry
<BigWhale> yes :)
<rodrigo_> BigWhale, ok, so I've been told this API should work like this in python:
<rodrigo_> (ret, contacts) = get_contacts_sync (client, sexp)
<rodrigo_> but it doesn't work, so seems to be a bug in pygobject
<BigWhale> yeat it requires three parameters
<rodrigo_> even if you pass all parameters, it doesn't work
<rodrigo_> it complains about boolean type not being iterable
<rodrigo_> https://live.gnome.org/PyGObject/IntrospectionPorting#Output_arguments
<BigWhale> I see.
<dupondje> And another question, what tool is responsible to handle enable/disable of touchpad ? It seems like it doesn't get reenabled.
<seb128> dupondje, gnome-settings-daemon
<rodrigo_> dupondje, hmm, that was fixed recently, iirc, do you have the latest g-s-d?
<dupondje> 3.1.4-0ubuntu2
<rodrigo_> yes, that's the latest :(
<dupondje> â   â³ SynPS/2 Synaptics TouchPad              	id=14	[slave  pointer  (2)] This device is disabled
<dupondje> The icon shows correctly Disable / Enable when I press the shortkeys
<dupondje> but seems like it doesn't get enabled
<dupondje> rodrigo_: I open a new bug for it ?
<rodrigo_> dupondje, yes, please
<rodrigo_> dupondje, there was already one, which should be closed iirc, so try to find it
<rodrigo_> and reopen it
<seb128> poor rodrigo ;-)
<seb128> rodrigo_, not sure if there was or if you got real ping at the rally
<rodrigo_> yeah, I should be watching tv now instead :)
<rodrigo_> seb128, hmm, right, maybe it wasn't filed
<rodrigo_> I forgot with so many bugs :)
<seb128> rodrigo_, btw bug is a "would be nice to do" as well ;-)
<seb128> bug #816669
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 816669 in gnome-control-center "encrypted-home support in new user dialog" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/816669
<rodrigo_> seb128, ok
<dupondje> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-settings-daemon/+bug/816673
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 816673 in gnome-settings-daemon "Touchpad is not re-enabled after disable/enable" [Undecided,New]
<dupondje> there you are!
<dupondje> thanks for checking. Appreciate it :)
<seb128> dupondje, thanks
<rodrigo_> thanks dupondje
<rodrigo_> I'll look at it tomorrow, now it's time for some relax :)
<rodrigo_> so that seb128 doesn't send more bugs my way :)
<seb128> rodrigo_, yeah, go before getting new bugs ;-)
<dupondje> hehe
<rodrigo_> heh, you see :)
<dupondje> enjoy
<seb128> rodrigo_, grep on the powermanager dbus interface is running btw
<dupondje> if you need more info / debug info, feel free to ask :D
<seb128> no match yet
<seb128> rodrigo_, see you tomorrow
<rodrigo_> seb128, ok cool, let me know tomorrow
<rodrigo_> yeah, good night all
<seb128> bah
<seb128> kenvandine, you around?
<Sweetshark> jasoncwarner_: around?
<seb128> RAOF, not up yet I guess?
<Sweetshark> seb128: step back, RAOF is mine first!
<seb128> lol
<seb128> chrisccoulson, ok, you really need to apply for upload rights ;-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, bah, I need somebody to fix lightdm, do you know if that is in the desktop set?
<TheMuso> Europe is up late again I see. :)
<seb128> oh, .au is waking up it seems ;-)
<seb128> hey TheMuso
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, lightdm is in the desktop packageset
<micahg> seb128: it's in -desktop
<seb128> chrisccoulson, oh, it is? great
<TheMuso> seb128: Greetings.
<seb128> chrisccoulson, can you fix the conflicts on the -0 libs to add an extra -0?
<seb128> I'm on a lucid laptop with my gpg key
<seb128> so I'm not really useful to fix that upgrade issue now
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, i can do that
<seb128> with->without
<seb128> chrisccoulson, great
<seb128> chrisccoulson,
<seb128> Conflicts: liblightdm-gobject-0,
<seb128> that lib lacks a -0 to its name
<seb128> same on the next line
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, i can see what needs fixing now :)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, you should still apply for upload rights ;-)
<chrisccoulson> heh :)
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, i feel like i need some beer
<chrisccoulson> shame there isn't any in the house
<seb128> chrisccoulson, there are english houses without beer?! you are ruining the uk reputation there :p
<chrisccoulson> lol
<chrisccoulson> seb128, it seems that the only drinkable thing in the house is coffee
<seb128> not the right time
<chrisccoulson> and drinking coffee at this time of night without a supply of beer to negate the effects would probably not be a good diea
<chrisccoulson> **idea
<chrisccoulson> heh ;)
<seb128> indeed
<seb128> tap water is it I guess ;-)
<seb128> it is
<seb128> or that's not in the "drinkable" category? ;-)
<chrisccoulson> i guess tap water is drinkable ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, thanks for the lightdm upload!
<chrisccoulson> i'm tempted to drive to the supermarket and get something nice to drink though
<chrisccoulson> heh, no worries :)
<seb128> oh, you get surpermarkets still open at this time?
<seb128> everything is closed at 9pm here
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, there's a 24 hour supermarket nearby
<chrisccoulson> the problem is that my car is quite loud, and i don't want to wake all my neighbours up ;)
<seb128> lol
<BigWhale> what's the status of fglrx drivers in Oneiric?
<BigWhale> anyone knows?
<seb128> dunno
<seb128> try asking on #ubuntu-x maybe
<chrisccoulson> kenvandine, you about?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, he seems not, I pinged him before you for lightdm because I though lightdm was not in the desktop set
<seb128> he didn't reply and he's set as away for over 2 hours
<chrisccoulson> ah, ok :)
<seb128> he's probably having a good beer or something ;-)
<seb128> you should do the same!
<chrisccoulson> lol
 * seb128 gets some tap water
<seb128> I'm tempted by the beer as well now but it's quite late, I should rather aim at going to bed soon ;-)
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i should probably go to bed, but i'm not tired yet
<chrisccoulson> i think i'm past the point of being tired now, after my daughter has had 3 restless nights in a row ;)
<seb128> I bet she's sleeping now
 * Sweetshark sips on his glass of italian merlot.
<seb128> she's waiting for you to go to bed to wake up probably ;-)
<chrisccoulson> yeah, she's having a better night so far tonight
<chrisccoulson> lol
<seb128> Sweetshark, not a bad choice ;-)
<chrisccoulson> we don't even have any wine in the house :(
<chrisccoulson> i need to sort my priorities out
<seb128> chrisccoulson, you should walk away from the computer to buy food and drinks at least once a week!
<chrisccoulson> next time i go to the supermarket i will stock up on only beer, wine and coffee
<seb128> ;-)
<chrisccoulson> heh :)
<BigWhale> what do you mean walk away from the computer? what a concept!
<BigWhale> :>
<TheMuso> Its nice to walk away form the computer, I like to do so for an hour or so at least at the end of a workday, and try to keep away completely on the weekends.
<Sweetshark> I find it quite relaxing that there are no electronics allow at the spa around the corner.
 * Sweetshark reads up on the latest sabdfl vs. mmeeks exchange ....
<jasoncwarner_> Sweetshark: want to share the link?
<Sweetshark> jasoncwarner_: http://people.gnome.org/~michael/blog/2011-07-26-harmony.html (marks post is linked in it at the beginning)
<RAOF> seb128, Sweetshark:
<RAOF> seb128, Sweetshark: I'm here now.  FIGHT!
<Sweetshark> RAOF: mine, mine, mine
<seb128> RAOF, it's ok, I was looking for a sponsor to fix lightdm since I'm only have a lucid laptop with gpg key with me
<seb128> RAOF, but chrisccoulson stepped up for it
<RAOF> seb128: Cool.
<Sweetshark> RAOF: I am having issues with the mono stuff for libreoffice. on debian it depends on libmono-dev and mono-2.0-devel and uses the headers from the first and the tools (like mkbundle2) from the last. How do I resolve that on one-eye-rick?
<RAOF> It's actually embedding a mono runtime, right?
<RAOF> As in - you want to load CIL code into the libreoffice process and execute it?
<seb128> enough computer for today bye!
<RAOF> Have fun!
<Sweetshark> RAOF: yes, it is the UNO-API CIL bridge (for extensions etc.)
<RAOF> Sweetshark: If that's the case, you're after libmono-2.0-dev for the headers and mono-devel for mkbundle.
<jasoncwarner_> TheMuso RAOF robert_ancell Meeting time!
<jasoncwarner_> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2011-07-26
<jasoncwarner_> TheMuso RAOF, I think it is just us. Robert starts holiday today, bryce is off b/c of baby
<TheMuso> Right.
<TheMuso> Thus commences the meeting, broekn vte a11y edition. :) or in other words, I am on my notebook atm due to broken a11y in vte, used for gnome-terminal.
<TheMuso> My notebook hasn't been updated in over a week, so is not affected by that brokenness.
<jasoncwarner_> TheMuso, any idea when that is going to be fixed? and who does the fixing?
<TheMuso> jasoncwarner_: There is a proposed patch in upstream bugzila, but its not yet merged. I intend to try it out for myself today.
<jasoncwarner_> ok...thanks
<jasoncwarner_> anything else TheMuso ?
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF, care to update on X ?
<RAOF> Bryce is on maternity leave, so I'll be handling the bug queue again.  It's impressively small at the moment.
<RAOF> I should be able to get mesa rc3 uploaded today, with, as ever, lots of fixes for intel.
<TheMuso> jasoncwarner_: Sorry, was reading meeting notes. My ubiquity code is working now as expected, except for one or two UI issues that I'll need to ask a GTK expert about, but other than that, I only need tidy my code and propose a branch for review to the installer guys.
<RAOF> There'll be a new SNA-enabled intel driver - in a separate binary package - shortly, just as soon as I'm convinced what I'm doing is the best way of going about it.
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF: any idea what is going on with nvidia driver? and perhaps when it will get fixed?
<RAOF> jasoncwarner_: Everyone with a problem has just been fixing it by removing and reinstalling it :(.  No logs for me!
<RAOF> I don't have a good idea, no.
<RAOF> I might try installing it here on my intel laptop and seeing if I can work it out.
<RAOF> Other than that, the wayland protocol MIR is still sitting forlornly at bug #810217.  Is there a big MIR queue?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 810217 in wayland "[MIR] wayland protocol package" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/810217
<RAOF> In an ideal world I'd like that done before mesa rc3 is uploaded, but I fear I do not live in an ideal world :)
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF: ok..thanks...anything else? (going to be a quick meeting :))
<RAOF> No.  The world of X continues on its steady course.
<jasoncwarner_> ok..cool...thanks TheMuso and RAOF
<jasoncwarner_> [END  MEETING]
<RAOF> No Robert?  Boo.  I wanted to know what's kickin' in lightdm :)
<TheMuso> jasoncwarner_: Oh yeah, didrocks told me about some more a11y work done in recent unity-2d. Once I get my desktop fully functional again, I will be testing that also.
<RAOF> Hm.  Oh, yeah.  If you're flying Intel, use a DisplayPort connection, and sometimes have trouble with the monitor getting disabled when switching modes / adding a second head / removing a second head then there might be some patches for you.
<TheMuso> Hrm seems new unity-2d is not yet in Ubuntu. I'll have to pull a bzr branch and build it then I guess.
<Sweetshark> RAOF: thanks, will give it a try
 * Sweetshark of to sleep
<TheMuso> Ahh, thats better. Working terminal on my desktop again.
<TheMuso> But seems notify-osd and metacity are broken as well. Metacity will likely be fixed upstrea soon, but notify-osd... Will have to look at that one.
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-07-27
<robert_ancell> jasoncwarner_, hey
<jasoncwarner_> robert_ancell: hey
<jasoncwarner_> getting ready for holiday? long flight to EU?
<robert_ancell> jasoncwarner_, sure am.  Haven't heard of any LightDM issues?
<jasoncwarner_> I haven't heard anything yet.
<robert_ancell> jasoncwarner_, yes, paris first, then berlin, then switzerland before heading back
<RAOF> Awesome.  Sounds fun!
<TheMuso> Discovering gsettings schemas and keys from the command-line is much easier than it was with gconf.
<jbicha> kenvandine: why does gwibber depend on gir1.2-wnck-1.0 instead of gir1.2-wnck-3.0?
<kenvandine> gwibber-accounts is still gtk2
<kenvandine> and it is python
<kenvandine> so to drop the python-wnck dep
<kenvandine> i ported it to use wnck-1.0 via gir
<jbicha> oh ok, gwibber is part gtk2 and part gtk3 now, right?
<AfC> that's um ... not supported
<kenvandine> well, the gwibber client is pure gtk3
<kenvandine> but gwibber-accounts is a different executable
<kenvandine> that is much harder to port, all the service plugins include their bits of pygtk that get embedded in the accounts dialog
<kenvandine> i would love to find a volunteer to do that though :)
<kenvandine> or i'll get to it for 3.4 :)
<micahg> dist-upgrade for lightdm still a no go, the old greeter is removed, but the new one isn't installed
 * micahg thinks this is a bug in apt
<RAOF> Bah!  At what point did dkms become so frustratingly silent?  No logs, no console output, no --verbose option.
 * micahg is testing a lightdm fix
 * micahg gives up and leaves it for someone else
 * micahg guesses transitional packages are the way to go here
<micahg> wow, even transitional packages didn't work...
<RAOF> Argh.  What the dizzying dkms?
<RAOF> Ah.  When you say a parameter is optional you are in fact lying through your teeth.  Got it.
<TheMuso> lol
<RAOF> Aha.  bug #812979 is the nvidia problem.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 812979 in dkms "Kernel modules are not built when the kernel is upgraded" [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/812979
<didrocks> good morning
<didrocks> hum, spent 30 minutes fighting with lightdm
<TheMuso> didrocks: Morning.
<didrocks> hey TheMuso!
 * didrocks reboots
<didrocks> ok, works now :)
<desrt> good morning, all
<didrocks> hey desrt!
<desrt> hi didrocks
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<RAOF> Morning chrisccoulson
<didrocks> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hi RAOF, didrocks
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: btw, if you need testing of the cache fix patch, I have it reliably at every start if I don't use the magical option
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, it's definitely the same error in the error console?
<didrocks> I can check again, didn't look today
<didrocks> uno momento
<chrisccoulson> thanks
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: tree is undefined â¦folderPane.js 889
<chrisccoulson> thanks
<didrocks> yw :)
<BigWhale> Good Morning.
<Sweetshark> RAOF: hmmm, debian also has a dep on cli-common-dev (one thing it uses from there is /usr/bin/al)
 * Sweetshark tries another build
<Sweetshark> Morning all!
<seb128> hey
<oier> good morning
<oier> is anybody up for reviewing indicator-bug?
<oier> it's a python indicator which  displays bugs for a certain project in a indicator and it regularly polls Launchpad to notify the user when there are new bugs that match the defined settings
<xclaesse> The following packages have unmet dependencies:
<xclaesse>  x264 : Depends: libswscale1 (>= 4:0.7~~) but it is not going to be installed or
<xclaesse>                  libswscale-extra-1 (>= 4:0.7~~) but it is not going to be installed
<oier> I already have an advocate and I am looking for a second one
<oier> http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?upid=9151
<oier> dholbach told me that he found it very easy to review, so it should not take much time away
<oier> I would be very grateful for your help
<seb128> hey oier, will try to have it reviewed today
<seb128> it would probably work better with a bug with ubuntu-sponsors subscribed though
<seb128> not sure many people check on what is on revu otherwise
<seb128> xclaesse, what ubuntu version? what command do you run?
<xclaesse> seb128, oneiric
<xclaesse> seb128, sudo apt-get install x264
<xclaesse> seb128, did upgrade from natty to oneiric and I can't read x264 videos anymore
<oier> thanks seb128, you mean I should subscribe ubuntu-sponsors on the needes packaging bug (#811837)?
<seb128> xclaesse, there is a x264 transition it seems, should be sorted later today, wrong timing
<seb128> oier, yes, so it would show up on http://reports.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/sponsoring/
<seb128> oier, which is what people check usually
<xclaesse> seb128, ok, just wanted to be sure the issue is known :)
<xclaesse> thanks
<seb128> yw
<oier> so should I paste the revu link on the launchpad bug?
<seb128> oier, yes
<oier> ok
<oier> good to know
<seb128> oier, sorry it took a while, better to make sure it shows on the sponsoring list if you want some reviews usually
<seb128> not sure who still use REVU nowadays
<seb128> that's probably a workflow we should fix
<oier> I read on the guide that that is how you are supposed to get new packages which aren't in debian
<seb128> oier, yeah sorry about that
<seb128> different people in Ubuntu have different opinions and workflow
<seb128> I will check if REVU still has active reviewers
<chrisccoulson> hey seb128, how are you?
<seb128> but in doubt it doesn't hurt to do what you just did now
<seb128> i.e add a bug with sponsors and an url to the REVU
<seb128> so it shows up on both places
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson, I'm fine thanks, how are you?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, good thanks
<seb128> chrisccoulson, did you daughter let you sleep this night?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, she slept all the way through :)
<seb128> great! ;-)
<seb128> hey rodrigo_
<rodrigo_> morning
<seb128> rodrigo_, I've bugs for you!!!
<seb128> rodrigo_, joking, don't run away ;-)
<seb128> rodrigo_, how are you?
 * rodrigo_ runs
<jbicha> rodrigo_: howdy
<rodrigo_> seb128, I'm fine and you?
<rodrigo_> hey jbicha
<seb128> hey jbicha!
<seb128> rodrigo_, I'm great thanks
<oier> seb128, one more questions. Once my package is in universe, how do I update it when there are new ubuntu releases? do I have to upload a new version to revu again?
<geser> oier: no, just open a sponsoring request
<seb128> hey geser
<seb128> geser, do you know if REVU is still used?
<jbicha> rodrigo_: what do you think about adding gnome-tweak-tool as one of your System Settings stub launchers?
<seb128> oier, what geser said, either do a merge request or open a bug with the update and subscribe sponsors
<rodrigo_> jbicha, hmm, not sure
<geser> seb128: hi, I guess not much if at all as we try to push people to get their package into Debian (and sync later)
<rodrigo_> jbicha, but I guess we could do it
<seb128> geser, should we just move new packages to use the normal sponsoring process?
<oier> ok, but when I open a bug and subscribe sponsors I just link to where the source is. Is the usual proceedure to attach the orig.tar.gz file to the bug?
<rodrigo_> jbicha, we've already "broken" the shell, so one more is ok :)
<Sweetshark> RAOF: I have now mono-devel and libmono-2.0-dev installed, hack a call to mkbundle2 to call mkbundle, and the pkg-config call in configure to check module mono-2 instead of mono, sprinkled in some glib2 cflags here and there, but I still get an error:
<seb128> oier, the easier is to have a watch file pointing to your tarball and do a merge request on lp:ubuntu/source with the update
<rodrigo_> seb128, did the grepping for g-p-m bus service end?
<seb128> rodrigo_, "sort of", I went to bed before it was done and since I forget to start a screen I stopped it, I got it running again now though
<RAOF> Sweetshark: Hurray?
<rodrigo_> seb128, ok, let me know when it's done, I'd like to upload any needed package today, as tomorrow I'll be on vacation :)
<seb128> rodrigo_, ok
<Sweetshark> RAOF: yeah, right.
 * Sweetshark tries to get a clean build
<geser> seb128: I've no real idea about this yet. Not sure if using the normal sponsoring process will work out or if it will only clog the sponsoring queue. Part of the REVU problem is that many packagers vanish once their package is in the archive and those packages bit-rod till they get removed years later.
<RAOF> Sweetshark: You haven't posted the error message yet.  Do you want me to have a quick gander?
<seb128> RAOF, hey
<RAOF> seb128: Ho!
<seb128> RAOF, how is colord packaging going?
<RAOF> seb128: It's done; it needs only a sponsor.
<seb128> RAOF, having it in and mir-ed before ff would be nice
<seb128> RAOF, oh, where is it?
<Sweetshark> RAOF: I want to try it from a mostly clean build. hang on a sec
<seb128> RAOF, you should subscribe ubuntu-sponsors...wait you are not motu?
<RAOF> seb128: http://anonscm.debian.org/gitweb/?p=collab-maint/colord.git
<seb128> RAOF, oh, you want it in debian
<RAOF> Yah.
<RAOF> Well, and I need a reviewer before uploading to Ubuntu to match our policy anyway.
<RAOF> So they might as well also be a DD :).
<seb128> RAOF, did you do any pinging around on the debian side?
<RAOF> I've done a little, but not a great deal.
<seb128> k
<seb128> I will ping the #debian-gnome guys
<seb128> do you have an itp bug or something?
<RAOF> I find getting stuff sponsored in Debian frustrating, so there's a high activation energy :(
<seb128> yeah, that's what I don't agree with geser and others
<seb128> trying to push people to get their stuff in Debian is just pushing them in a wall that they will hit, which leads to frustrations and contributors running away
<RAOF> It depends greatly on what you're pushing, I find.
<RAOF> If there's an amenable team, then great - debian-x and pkg-cli-* are both welcoming and easy to deal with.
<seb128> I'm not going to be popular with this one but I think we should stop trying to get new softwares in universe or in the archive
<seb128> we should let people maintain their softwares in a ppa and make it easy to search in ppa from the packaging tools
<seb128> well for things like this one which are a desktop component will still need to them in though
<RAOF> I broadly agree with you.  I think we'd need make it possible to trust PPAs a little more first, though.
<seb128> RAOF, yeah, pkg-gnome is fine as well
<seb128> RAOF, well ppa combined with rating and reviews get you somewhat the "trust" level
<jbicha> seb128: the ITP is http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=633518
<ubot2> Debian bug 633518 in wnpp "ITP: colord -- system service to manage device colour profiles" [Wishlist,Open]
<RAOF> Some way of blessing âproject PPAsâ would be good.
<seb128> jbicha, thanks
<RAOF> jbicha: Thanks.  wnpp takes *ages* to come up here!
<seb128> RAOF, well then you are back at the issue of having a board needing to do review and approval work
<jbicha> it was in my Firefox history so it was easy
<geser> seb128: I agree with you, most of the packages on REVU could easily use a PPA instead. And only packages with a team who cares about them (e.g. kubuntu or ubuntu-desktop) should be added to the archive directly
<didrocks> seb128: seems your idea is more popular that you initialy thought then! :)
<seb128> didrocks, ;-)
<jbicha> people get all sorts of confused when they try to upgrade with PPAs though
<RAOF> seb128: Well, not necessarily - it's already very nearly possible with existing Launchpad infrastructure.
<RAOF> I mean, for projects hosted on Launchpad, at least.
<seb128> RAOF, I've pointed #debian-gnome to the itp and vcs, let's see if somebody picks it
<didrocks> jbicha: we need to make that easier for upstream then
<didrocks> oh, you mean, upgrade
<seb128> jbicha, why?
<didrocks> indeed
<seb128> because update-manager disable the ppas?
<didrocks> and we are not sure there is a build under the next ubuntu release pocket
<didrocks> (but ppa could maybe automatically rebuild when a new version is out?)
<seb128> jbicha, why does libcryptui needs a mir? what in main is using it?
<seb128> didrocks, we don't do rebuilds in the archive either
<didrocks> or copy :)
<RAOF> didrocks: Or update manager could check whether the PPAs have an upgrade path.
<didrocks> just makes then available
<seb128> didrocks, we clone the archive when a new serie open
<didrocks> them*
<jbicha> and then we get solutions like this one: https://lkubuntu.wordpress.com/2011/06/27/easy-way-to-remove-404-messages-on-apt-get-update/
<seb128> urg
<jbicha> seb128: seahorse depends on that library (or ought to)
<seb128> jbicha, no it doesn't
<seb128> hum
<chrisccoulson> hmmmm, i'm not sure how i can make thunderbird get focus when you click on it in the messaging menu :/
<chrisccoulson> we seem to be a little screwed by internal API limitations
<RAOF> chrisccoulson: That's it.  Time to drop thunderbird for evolution! :D
<chrisccoulson> lol
<seb128> we would win calendar integration for free!
<jbicha> seb128: hmm, let me check then
<RAOF> Thinking of MIRs - could I get the wayland protocol MIR bumped up?  I'd like to enable support in mesa in the rc3 upload, which will hopefully be soon (whenever upstream gets their git in order).
<seb128> RAOF, speaking of wayland does it still need cairo-gl?
<Sweetshark> RAOF: http://pastebin.com/2zLvuybV
<seb128> RAOF, I will give a nudge to mterry to see if he can get the wayland mir ball rolling
<RAOF> seb128: Yes and no.  The wayland server library itself never did, but the demo-compositor does.  There's now a non-cairo-gl demo compositor, so it's not as much of an issue.
<RAOF> seb128: In short - turn off cairo-gl support whenever you want to.
<seb128> ok
<seb128> RAOF, if we don't solve the nvidia issue we will have to again for oneiric
<seb128> rodrigo_,
<seb128> ./update-manager-0.152.7/DistUpgrade/utils.py:  Send a dbus signal to org.gnome.PowerManager to not suspend
<jbicha> seb128: ok, maybe it doesn't need libcryptui, the commit message & NEWS is ambiguous
<seb128> rodrigo_, that's the first match out of gnome-control-center that you didn't update it
<seb128> jbicha, well, I built the new seahorse there, uploaded and it built on the buildds
<seb128> jbicha, so I'm pretty confident it doesn't need the lib ;-)
<RAOF> seb128: Right.  At some point we'll want this to be fixed; we can only kick that can down the road for so long.
<seb128> RAOF, right, well I'm just saying
<jbicha> seb128: ok, I guess it's only seahorse-plugins that depends on it, but seahorse-plugins is in main
<rodrigo_> seb128, ok, working on it
<seb128> jbicha, isn't seahorse-plugins deprecated?
<seb128> rodrigo_, do a merge request for mvo I'm sure he will happily review it
<rodrigo_> seb128, yeah :)
<RAOF> seb128: Yeah.  We can happily kill it for now.  Sometime in the next couple of cycles we should probably schedule some work to fix it once and for all.  Like a giant ice cube!
<jbicha> seb128: well, it sort of still works, it's just not really maintained
<desrt> seb128: is it your intention to be following 3.0 or 3.2?
<seb128> RAOF, ok, I think I will turn it off early, no point to keep it annoying users if we know it's not going to be solved this cycle
<seb128> desrt, GNOME?
<desrt> seb128: is there anything else? :)
<seb128> GTK
<desrt> both.
<seb128> desrt, weird question since we are on GNOME 3.1.4 and I keep nagging you about unstable glib and gtk
<seb128> desrt, but anyway 3.1 and we are mostly uptodate
<desrt> seb128: i didn't know what gnome you're following
<desrt> just glib/gtk
<seb128> desrt, weren't you there at UDS pushing us to say 3.1 which we agreed on? ;-)
<desrt> seb128: we agree on lots of things at UDS that i discover to be less true than i hoped :)
<seb128> desrt, see versions url in the topic has well which has current oneiric versions lists
<desrt> ah.  nice.
<seb128> desrt, but yea, we follow 3.1 and got most of 3.1.4 packaged already
<rodrigo_> I get a lot of these when building with bzr bd:
<rodrigo_> perl: warning: Setting locale failed.
<rodrigo_> perl: warning: Please check that your locale settings:
<rodrigo_> 	LANGUAGE = (unset),
<rodrigo_> 	LC_ALL = (unset),
<rodrigo_> 	LC_TIME = "es_ES.utf8",
<rodrigo_> 	LC_MONETARY = "es_ES.utf8",
<rodrigo_> 	LC_MEASUREMENT = "es_ES.utf8",
<rodrigo_> 	LC_NUMERIC = "es_ES.utf8",
<rodrigo_> 	LANG = "en_US.UTF-8"
<rodrigo_>     are supported and installed on your system.
<rodrigo_> perl: warning: Falling back to the standard locale ("C").
<seb128> rodrigo_, seems like your locale is incorrectly set
<mvo> seb128, rodrigo_ what is the problem with u-m?
<desrt> seb128: i see lots of green :)
<seb128> mvo, gpm is moved to gsd so the dbus interface is renamed
<seb128> which sort of suck
<rodrigo_> mvo, it uses g-p-m's dbus interface, which is gone to g-s-d, so the bus name needs a change
<rodrigo_> mvo, I'll submit a branch in a bit
<seb128> GNOME should consider dbus interfaces as APIs and keep those stable ;-)
<desrt> seb128: we're moving away from that, in fact
<desrt> it's a royal pain in the arse, with little advantage
<desrt> killall dconf-service and be happy :)
<seb128> rodrigo_, ./gdm-3.0.4/gui/simple-greeter/gdm-greeter-panel.c:#define GPM_DBUS_NAME      "org.gnome.PowerManager"
<seb128> desrt, hum?
<seb128> desrt, well, update-manager for example talk to org.gnome.gpm to tell it to not suspend during dist-upgrade
<desrt> seb128: it's widely becoming apparent that attempting to maintain API stability on dbus interfaces is a substantial investment
<seb128> desrt, there is no "restart the service and the code will work with org.gnome.gsd being the inteface to talk to"
<seb128> desrt, well then you need libs wrapping the interface and use those
<desrt> seb128: exactly.
<desrt> seb128: as i understand it, we will see this a bit more often going forward
<seb128> desrt, which is not what we have for it session signals
<seb128> or power signals
<seb128> it->i.e
<desrt> seb128: particularly with the new GDBus binding generation stuff
<desrt> then those libraries will have stable API
<seb128> well, works for me, as long as the "public interface" is stable
<desrt> nod.
<mvo> thanks rodrigo_ and seb128
<seb128> because otherwise it sucks
<seb128> especially if you rename things like the dbus interface for screen saver inhibition
<seb128> or in this case suspend inhibition
<seb128> it means all the softwares "out there" which are often non GNOME ones break in some way
<seb128> those could be skype or vlc or mplayer or whatever
<desrt> i always get slightly nervous when i see random software poking someone else's dbus interface :)
<seb128> i.e things that don't synchronize with GNOME
<seb128> desrt, well that's what GNOME people recommend to do to inhibit the screensaver
<desrt> seb128: i know.  i don't think it's the greatest policy.
<desrt> alas.
<seb128> yeah, we should have a libdesktop wrapping around all those dbus "desktop" apis
<seb128> like session, screensaver, power, etc
<rodrigo_> yes, I guess power interface should be a freedesktop one
<desrt> seb128: libgio is supposed to be this interface, supposedly
<desrt> seems weird for screensaver and such, though
<desrt> maybe we should consider using gtk...
<rodrigo_> yes
<rodrigo_> no libdesktop :)
<desrt> i'll raise the point with matthias
<rodrigo_> or gio itself
<rodrigo_> although it seems to be too desktop-specific
<rodrigo_> so yeah, gtk makes sense
<desrt> we can implement it with gioextensions
<desrt> gtk would just be the public interface
<desrt> individual environments would be free to provide overrides
<desrt> "stop the screensaver" is not in such a different league as "give me a tray icon"
<desrt> seb128: stop screensaver, suspend... anything else you can think of that might fit well here?
<seb128> desrt, not sure, we have a bunch of "useful interfaces" like im status
<seb128> or mounting interfaces
<desrt> we have mounting stuff in gio already
<seb128> right
<seb128> so no, nothing else I can think about right now
<seb128> the most common one is "let my screen alone, I watch a movie"
<seb128> the inhibit suspend one is useful as well for things like upgrades
<desrt> https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=655398
<ubot2> Gnome bug 655398 in gtk "provide API for inhibit screensaver/suspend/etc" [Enhancement,Unconfirmed]
<desrt> we'll see how the discussion goes
<seb128> desrt, thanks
<desrt> thanks for the suggestion :)
<seb128> rodrigo_, ok, so it seems the only things using the old gpm interface are g-c-c that you just fixed, update-manager and gdm
<jbicha> seb128: seahorse has a ubuntu-desktop branch
<seb128> jbicha, yes like most of GNOME components installed by default ;-)
<jbicha> but you didn't push to it yesterday
<seb128> hum, sorry, I used it, I probably forgot to bzr push
<seb128> checking
<seb128> jbicha, done
<rodrigo_> seb128, ok, almost done with gdm, so update-manager only missing
<RAOF> Sweetshark: Bah, sorry, missed that pastebin.  Also sorry that I can't be any help; I've got no idea what's missing there :/
<davmor2> seb128: is pitti the best guy to talk about with regard a regression in managing an audio player? In Natty he fixed it so that the sansa fuse showed up and fired up banshee/shotwell however in oneiric it isn't again, or is this something yet to implement?
<seb128> better to open a bug, for one thing pitti is away for 2 weeks
<Sweetshark> RAOF: I just kicked out a huge bunch of the creepy mono patches, now it seems to build. hopefully, I will also pack (and be halfway sensible at what it packs).
<davmor2> seb128: will do
<seb128> chrisccoulson, did you need gnome-keyring sponsoring?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, libgnome-keyring needs sponsoring
<seb128> ok
<chrisccoulson> i need to package p11-kit before gnome-keyring though don't i?
<chrisccoulson> that's on my list for today :)
<seb128> indeed you need it ;-)
<seb128> great!
<chrisccoulson> woohoo, focus issue fixed in thundebird
<seb128> chrisccoulson, where is libgnome-keyring?
<chrisccoulson> turned out to be a simple error :)
<seb128> nice
<chrisccoulson> seb128, 1 second, i will host it somewhere
<jbicha> seb128: mterry was wanting someone to be a bug subscriber for the transmission mirs, would ubuntu-desktop be a good choice?
<seb128> jbicha, no, desktop-bugs rather
<seb128> that's the team we use to track desktop bugs, it avoids spamming ubuntu-desktop members ;-)
<jbicha> ok, could you do that then? :-)
<seb128> sure
<davmor2> this mornings update of lightdm seems a bit broken it isn't starting is there an ubuntu-bug hook for lightdm yet, if not what logs will be useful?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, http://people.canonical.com/~chrisccoulson/libgnome-keyring/
<chrisccoulson> nice and easy ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, ;-)
<Sweetshark> woho, "building module postprocess"
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: hey, have you heard about any bug in thunderbird which change the preferred smtp sender behind your back?
<didrocks> and a crash :/
<seb128> tb seems like a lot of fun ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: at least with me :-)
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, i haven't heard anything like that. what's the symptom?
<didrocks> I do not want to generalize :)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: well, from yesterday, the default smtp was set to gmail instead of my canonical onen
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: and I'm sure I didn't change any value
<didrocks> so, I had to set it back
<rodrigo_> mvo, a present for you -> https://code.launchpad.net/~rodrigo-moya/update-manager/use-new-power-interface/+merge/69422 :-D
 * mvo hugs rodrigo_
<rodrigo_> :D
<Sweetshark> what do you guys think: is is ok to upload libreoffice without the mono bridge package for now? for oneiric?
<Laney> does anything actually use it?
<seb128> what is the mono bridge doing?
<Laney> mono bindings to the lo api
<Laney> you can write lo plugins in c# for example
<Sweetshark> seb128: it provides UNO bindings to mono (i.e. you can write remote control LibreOffice from an mono app). It dont think anybody uses it anyway.
<seb128> well if it has no rdepends in the archive seems fine to drop for a bit
<Sweetshark> FWIW it is not even published as part of the "official" builds on libreoffice.org -- its novells own go-oo patchery ...
<seb128> yeah, drop it
<Sweetshark> seb128: ok, then I have a 3.4.1 build for oneiric ;D
<Laney> i'd suggest debian do the same
<rodrigo_> seb128, I just sent cjwatson a mail about adding gdm to the desktop packageset, I hope that's ok, right?
<seb128> sure
<rodrigo_> ok, that's why I did it before asking :)
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> Laney, hey, did you plan to upload the new tomboy to oneiric as well or should I just rebase on your debian update and upload?
<Laney> seb128: doing it now
<Laney> like, right now
<seb128> Laney, thanks!
<Laney> does bzr push send tags too?
<rodrigo_> Laney, yes
<Laney> cool, thanks
<didrocks> Laney: not if it's the only change (meaning: there is no commit since last push)
<Laney> there were 2 commits and a tag, should be fine then?
<rodrigo_> yes
<Laney> :-)
<rodrigo_> and if not you can always 'bzr commit --unchanged'
<ricotz> rodrigo_, hi :)
<ricotz> rodrigo_, by any chance did you know about this? bug 811822
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 811822 in gnome-session "gnome-session gets stuck utilizing 100% cpu time of one core" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/811822
<rodrigo_> ricotz, hmm, no, looking
<rodrigo_> hmm, no trace
<ricotz> it seems i can confirm this, both gdm gnome-session process and the user one get stuck like this for me, but it seems system related
<ricotz> i cant reproduce it on this machine
<rodrigo_> ricotz, can you try getting a strace?
<ricotz> i will try it when i am home again
<rodrigo_> ricotz, ok, thanks
<ricotz> it could be somehow related to the graphics driver :\ (happens with nvidia blob)
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, where does unity get its setting for the default e-mail client from?
<chrisccoulson> i just logged in to a guest session, and evo was the mail client in the dash
<chrisccoulson> but the default was thunderbird in the messaging menu
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: it was gconf before, unity-2d has been fixed for using the mimetypes, not sure about unity 3d, I'll have a look
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, is the 2d session only meant to have a single workspace?
<BigWhale> Uhmm... when did oneiric lost the ability to pin the window to all desktops? the right click on a titlebar menu?
<seb128> you can use alt-space
<pedro_> good morning!
<seb128> hey pedro_
<seb128> how are you?
<pedro_> salut seb128, doing good and you?
<seb128> I'm fine thanks!
<BigWhale> seb128, alt-space is a workaround... is this now a permanent change? :(
<seb128> sort of
<rodrigo_> hey pedro_
<seb128> design decision to drop the context menu yes but they are looking for a better way to do the pin and raise actions
<pedro_> hello rodrigo_, how are you?
<rodrigo_> pedro_, happy, about to leave on vacation, in a few hours :D
<rodrigo_> pedro_, you?
<seb128> rodrigo_, when do you come back?
<rodrigo_> pedro_, oh, btw, I'm not going to Berlin :(
<seb128> rodrigo_, desktop summit?
<pedro_> rodrigo_, well now i'm envy you :-P
<seb128> oh, no desktop summit?
<seb128> is pedro_ coming?
<rodrigo_> seb128, Monday 8th
<pedro_> seb128, i'm going there yeah
<seb128> great
<BigWhale> seb128, 'Move to another workspace' and 'Always on visible workspace' were very often used by me... too bad :(
<rodrigo_> seb128, I'll be back quite late on the 6th, so I could fly quite late on the 7th or the 8th, which is the last core day
<BigWhale> I hope they come up with something soon :)
<seb128> well you can use alt-space
<rodrigo_> it's bad this year there's not the warm up days there use to be :(
<seb128> there are some days and a gir hackfest after though
<rodrigo_> yes, but just going for that, when most people are gone, didn't feel like a good idea
<rodrigo_> I'll miss it though, it's the 1st time I'm missing 2 guadec's in a row :(
<rodrigo_> pedro_, you're staying for the whole week?
<rodrigo_> seb128, you?
<seb128> rodrigo_, enjoy your holidays at least
<seb128> 6 to 11 for me
<pedro_> rodrigo_, i'm leaving on thursday 11
<seb128> I'm flying back on the 11
<seb128> rodrigo_, yeah, you are right, if you come on the 8th it's not really worth it if most people leave on the 10 or 11
<seb128> well next year
<seb128> enjoy your holidays at least ;-)
<rodrigo_> yes, I hope so
<rodrigo_> also missing the guadec-es :(
<seb128> when is it?
<rodrigo_> a few days before the one in berlin
<rodrigo_> anyway, lunch time, bbl
<BigWhale> rodrigo_, any news on the eds/gir/pygobject fixes?
<cyphermox> oh evolution, how I love thee; let me count the ways.... especially when you sigtrap because of broken ui files...
<mterry> seb128, do you know much about how pot files that are taken from the translation tarball that pkgbinarymangler makes are used by Launchpad to offer as translation templates?
<mterry> seb128, (hello)
<seb128> hey mterry, now it's your turn to ask things before saying hi? ;-)
<desrt> mterry: can you mow my lawn for me?
<desrt> mterry: oh.  hi, by the way.
<seb128> mterry, not "much" I guess but I've an idea how the system works, why?
<mterry> :)
<seb128> mterry, I don't think the mangler does the pot import, it just does the po stripping from the binaries
<mterry> seb128, deja-dup has a help pot, and it's not showing up in LP for translators.  I have a couple ideas why, but don't know which makes sense
<mterry> seb128, yeah.  It also puts the pot files in its tgz.  I assumed LP got the pots from that tgz
<seb128> mterry, we blocked help templated years ago since there is no way to export help translations back
<mterry> seb128, ah...  bummer
<seb128> like launchpad knows how to export translations files
<seb128> but not how to build localized xml files
<mterry> seb128, hmm..  I bet we could do something similar that we do for .desktop files and replace the help xml with a bunch of xincludes to translated snippets.  ;)
<seb128> it was misleading users to think that they translations would be used
<seb128> where they are not, it would require manually updating the po files in the source
<seb128> since the localized xml are built at build time
<seb128> not using gettext
<mterry> right
<mterry> seb128, ah well
<kenvandine> oh, no localized help?
<seb128> mterry, well not sure if it would be possible to have translated documentation to be using the english xml and gettext
<mterry> kenvandine, only what upstream provides
<seb128> kenvandine, hey
<kenvandine> hey seb128 and mterry
<seb128> kenvandine, what I said, the localized xml are generated during the build so they use the po directory content, not langpacks
<kenvandine> do the help translations get stripped?
<mterry> seb128, yeah, but we could construct some monstrosity using xincludes to tiny files with snippets of text, but that's not a serious suggestion
<seb128> they get moved in langpacks yes
<kenvandine> ok
<seb128> mterry, well previous suggestion was to teach launchpad to build the translated xmls
<seb128> but I think it was not trivial and not on the launchpad priority list
<mterry> yeah
<highvoltage> hi!
<highvoltage> gnome-session-fallback should depend (or at least reccomend) on gnome-menus so that a user has menus when its installed
<highvoltage> what's the preferred way to fix it, can I add it and paste a debdiff? stgraber said he could sponsor it this afternoon but I thought I'd pop in and check first
<seb128> highvoltage, the session doesn't use the menus, gnome-panel should do that
<seb128> highvoltage, do a merge requests against the ubuntu-desktop vcs
<highvoltage> seb128: ok, will do
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> highvoltage, gnome-panel depends on gnome-menus
<highvoltage> odd, I wonder why it's not installed in edubuntu
<seb128> highvoltage, what desktop are you using?
<highvoltage> seb128: Edubuntu with gnome 3 fallback
<seb128> highvoltage, there was a bug with one of the .menus naming until yesterday
<seb128> did you upgrade today?
<highvoltage> seb128: I installed the gnome-menus package this morning, so it's possible I got the fix just now :)
<highvoltage> seb128: I'll try with a daily build tomorrow, I guess it will be fixed. thanks :)
<seb128> yw
<cyphermox> hrm... anyone having issues connecting to a previously-unknown wifi network requiring security?
<Sweetshark> soo, who is willing to sponsor libreoffice 1:3.4.1-3ubuntu1 once it finishes building and survives sanity checks?
 * Sweetshark is looking for victims
<jbicha> why do we ship xterm on the CD? and do we really need to show it by default since we have gnome-terminal?
<jbicha> oh I see, the .desktop is shipped so that xterm gets a pretty icon but I think it should be NoDisplay=True
<ronoc> mvo ping ?
<mvo> ronoc: hello, I'm in a meeting right now
<ronoc> mvo, no stress
<mvo> ronoc: you are curious about the restart-required property?
<cyphermox> now now, why won't gnome-keyring-daemon start on a new install?
<mvo> seb128: have you seen https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/update-manager/+bug/813468 ? do you have a opinion?
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 813468 in update-manager "Panel indicators not updated correctly after upgrade from Hardy to Lucid" [Undecided,New]
<seb128> cyphermox, bug #813755
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 813755 in gnome-keyring "gnome-keyring-daemon fails to start as it can't get capabilities" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/813755
<cyphermox> ohhh
<cyphermox> thanks :)
<ronoc> mvo, yeah just wondering when I should plan to finish that apt menu item off
<seb128> mvo, it's one of those old gnome-panels bugs which are there since warty that nobody will ever fix in the old codebase and which are fixed in GNOME3
<mvo> so WONTFIX?
<seb128> yes
<seb128> or duplicate it from one of the other bugs on gnome-panel
<BigWhale> rodrigo_, around? any news on the gir PyGObject problems?
<cyphermox> seb128: ok, so that gkd issue would be fixed once the update to 3.1.4 lands
<seb128> cyphermox, well it?
<cyphermox> the what?
<cyphermox> oh
<cyphermox> yeah, should, there is a code change in there to get the capability, and there's something else that could benefit being added (depends for setcap)
<cyphermox> chrisccoulson:  ^^
<seb128> cyphermox, well -> will, sorry typo
<rodrigo_> BigWhale, no, just filed the bug to pygobject, instead of evolution
<seb128> well, why did it break?
<cyphermox> seb128: yeah, it took me a little while to catch it :)
<rodrigo_> in fact, I didn't, doing it now
<chrisccoulson> wassup?
<BigWhale> rodrigo_, cool thanks.
<BigWhale> rodrigo_, I'll also add my code that fails to work
<rodrigo_> ok
<cyphermox> seb128: just uploaded EDS... evo will take some more time given that it won't start :)
<cyphermox> afaics evo 3.1.3 works, and now it displays emails properly
<seb128> cyphermox, ok, I've pinged mchra let's see if he replies
<seb128> great
<cyphermox> now to finish testing bluez
<seb128> didrocks, mterry: hey guys, could you give gnome-online-account some mir action this week?
<seb128> gnome-online-accounts
<didrocks> still on an universe package for the sync stuff, can add to the list if you ping me later :)
<seb128> kenvandine, could you reply to kees' comment on bug #791843?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 791843 in telepathy-indicator "[MIR] telepathy-indicator" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/791843
<seb128> didrocks, seems like bug #795089 is ready for a new review from you though they didn't ping you again?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 795089 in python-xattr "[MIR] python-xattr" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/795089
<seb128> mterry, RAOF wanted some review for bug #810217 as well if possible
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 810217 in wayland "[MIR] wayland protocol package" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/810217
<rodrigo_> ok, out for now, bbl, but just in case you're all gone, have a nice next week, I'll think about you when on vacation :)
<seb128> didrocks, can things like bug #792005 be promoted and bug closed?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 792005 in xchat-indicator "[MIR] xchat-indicator" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/792005
<seb128> rodrigo_, have fun during your holidays!
<rodrigo_> seb128, I will!
<seb128> rodrigo_, is there anything we should watch from while you are not there?
<didrocks> seb128: will have a look, just not now :)
<seb128> ok
<rodrigo_> seb128, I'll be reading my mail just in case there's something urgent, but for BigWhale, if you can watch https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=654564 that would be great
<ubot2> Gnome bug 654564 in introspection "Querying EDS address book in Python results in a segfault" [Critical,Unconfirmed]
<rodrigo_> as I said, I'll be checking mail, but just in case there's a fix coming and I miss it, please watch it
<kenvandine> seb128, will do
<seb128> rodrigo_, ok
<seb128> kenvandine, thanks
<micahg> seb128: did someone fix lightdm today?
 * micahg didn't see an upload
<seb128> micahg, is it still broken?
<lool> compiz (decor) - Warn: No default decoration found, placement will not be correct
<seb128> micahg, chrisccoulson made an upload yesterday night
<lool> wow, decorator crashing for a new window
<lool> in a loop
<micahg> seb128: no, that didn't fix it
<lool> I opened a new xterm, and the decorations appeared/disappeared in a loop
<micahg> seb128: also, adding transitional packages and breaks/replaces on the old greeters didn't help
<lool> until I moved it a bit to not be as close to other windows
<lool> now it's stopped
<micahg> seb128: appears to be a bug in apt that it's allowing the greeter being removed to fulfill the virtual recommends requirement
 * lool reboot
<micahg> oh, wait, I didn't do the transitional packages right locally, that might actually work
<seb128> micahg, I'm confused, lightdm recommends the gtk-greeter | virtual-greeter
<seb128> micahg, so the gtk greeter should be installed first if no greeter is installed
<seb128> micahg, the second issue yesterday was that the conflicts was wrong and letting a non working greeter installed which was enough to fill the recommends
<micahg> seb128: right, but the old greeter which provides the virtual package is installed
<micahg> it's being removed but apt doesn't seem to take that into account
<seb128> micahg, well the conflicts update from chrisccoulson should address that issue
<micahg> seb128: it dosn't
 * micahg is testing transitional packages ATM
<seb128> micahg, well, you mean no greeter get installed on your box?
<micahg> seb128: right
<mterry> seb128, ack for gnome-online-account and wayland
<seb128> the recommends should ensure there is at least one
<seb128> mterry, thanks
<micahg> seb128: it's a bug in apt
<seb128> micahg, what do you suggest doing then?
<micahg> transitional packages, I'm testing to make sure it works right now
<seb128> micahg, I've no seen other users complaining about lightdm working during the course of the day
<seb128> not
<micahg> are you idling in #ubuntu+1?
<seb128> which is weird if upgrades are really still broken
<seb128> no, but "broken for everybody" tend to reacht #ubuntu-desktop usually
<seb128> like barry got the issue before chrisccoulson's update yesterday
<seb128> nobody complained today
<micahg> they all saw the workaround ;)
<micahg> apt-get dist-upgrade doesn't offer a greeter with ubuntu3 if you had the old one installed
<seb128> micahg, so you get the old example greeter installed and no new one?
<micahg> no, the old one gets removed and nothing gets installed
<seb128> or is the conflicts still broken?
<seb128> ok, easy to fix then
<seb128> we should just change the recommends to a depends
 * micahg never acutally checked the diff
<seb128> I wanted to check with robert_ancell why he just recommended a greeter to be installed, I don't see a case for not having one
<seb128> well
<micahg> no, the diff last night was right
<seb128> lightdm recommends gtk-greeter | virtual-greeter
<seb128> but the issue with recommends is that apt might decide it's fine that you have none installed
<seb128> changing to a depends would ensure you always have a greeter
<seb128> which seems to happen in this particular upgrade case, apt got confused and you get no recommends
<micahg> seb128: transitional packages seem to work, want a debdiff?
<seb128> no
<seb128> but thanks
<seb128> I don't want to add binaries
<seb128> using a proper depends ought to fix that issue
<seb128> with a depends there is no way that people get no greeter
<seb128> it's a one liner
<didrocks> do you know why it's not a dep? seems weird
<seb128> no, as said I wanted to check with robert_ancell
<didrocks> agreed (sorry just backlogged)
<seb128> not sure if he wanted to take into account the case where you are local custom greeter not packaged
<seb128> but it would really be a corner case
<didrocks> seb128: LTSP maybe?
<seb128> or that
<seb128> well for now let's sort the obvious issue
<didrocks> kenvandine: seb128: xchat-indicator promoted
<seb128> didrocks, thanks
<didrocks> yw :)
<kenvandine> didrocks, thx!
<didrocks> kenvandine: add the recommends: if not done :)
<seb128> it's done
<didrocks> ok, didn't check ;)
<didrocks> and python-xattr reviewed and promoted
<didrocks> I'll have a look tomorrow at other MIRs if some updates were made without pinging me
<seb128> didrocks, thanks
<didrocks> yw (not sure what went wrong, X just restarted under my feet)
<mterry> mpt, thanks for your review of deja-dup!  I've moved it to https://live.gnome.org/DejaDup/Design/Review-2011-07 and I will mark various items as done when I fix them
<mterry> mpt, you mention right-aligned labels?  I've seen various attempts at that in GNOME 3.0 controls (right aligned, no colon, sometimes lighter text).  Is there an HIG recommendation for such control labels yet?
<didrocks> ok, enough for today, see you tomorrow! :)
<czajkowski> wondering does anyone have any thoughts on https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/empathy/+bug/807723  is it a bug or a wishlist ?
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 807723 in empathy "Empathy does not start at login by default" [Wishlist,New]
<seb128> kenvandine, ^
<czajkowski> seb128: evening
<seb128> hey czajkowski
<kenvandine> hummm
<seb128> czajkowski, well I think that picking "online" in the indicator should work after login at least
<seb128> then the connect by default, not sure, I think GNOME was discussing doing that for this cycle
<czajkowski> seb128: aye thats what I would have assumed tbh
<kenvandine> i think that does now
<seb128> would be worth reading what they decided
<czajkowski> kenvandine: ello
<kenvandine> hey czajkowski
<kenvandine> and you can add empathy to your session
<czajkowski> kenvandine: not my bug I'll have you know came up in a lug channel and I found it interesting seeing as he's been mentoning it for some time but nobody looked at it
<kenvandine> if you want it to start
<kenvandine> i think in oneiric, with tp-indicator starting... it lets us go online from the indicator
<kenvandine> without starting empathy
<BigWhale> Hm, my empathy always starts upon login and sets me online. Might be only me.
<seb128> micahg, ok, I upload with a depends instead of the recommends, if that doesn't fix it I will take your transitional package solution ;-)
<micahg> seb128: k, I still have my system to test, but I will be afk in about an hour until evening CDT, so can I ask someone to upload later if it doesn't work?
<seb128> sure
<micahg> thanks
<BigWhale> Not having restart in the system menu is a pain! *spits and curses*
<dobey> what system menu?
<chrisccoulson> i think he's referring to the new device menu
<chrisccoulson> there's no restart option ;)
<stgraber> oh, I just noticed ;) that's indeed annoying (I restart a lot more often than I shutdown or logout)
<chrisccoulson> stgraber, it's a bug. they just forgot to remove the shutdown entry
<chrisccoulson> :)
<stgraber> ;)
<dobey> what's annoying is that lightdm doesn't seem to do the shutdown magic
<dobey> so no matter what i choose, it's all just log out to me :(
<dobey> and the "are you sure you want to do that" dialogs are annoying
<dobey> YES IM SURE, I JUST CLICKED THE MENU ITEM FOR A REASON
<dobey> :)
<dobey> i wonder
<dobey> is there even one package in debian/ubuntu that does private python modularization correctly.
<czajkowski> chrisjrob: aloha
<chrisjrob> hell czajkowski
<chrisjrob> o
<chrisjrob> start with a typo :)
<czajkowski> chrisjrob: I'll convert ye all yet in that channel to asking for help on irc :)
<chrisjrob> you can try
<czajkowski> chrisjrob: well folks are helpful in here and easier than feeding you to the wolves on a mailing list ;)
<chrisjrob> thanks
<chrisjrob> kenvandine: i think czajkowski was discussing a bug i logged in empathy https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/empathy/+bug/807723
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 807723 in empathy "Empathy does not start at login by default" [Wishlist,New]
<kenvandine> chrisjrob, hey
<kenvandine> yeah?
<chrisjrob> sorry, on another screen...
<kenvandine> hi chrisjrob
<chrisjrob> i was wondering how it is that the workflow is so different between gwibber and empathy for example
<kenvandine> it isn't really
<chrisjrob> when you set up gwibber it just works
<kenvandine> true
<chrisjrob> with empathy it doesn't, you have to run it every time or add to start-up application
<kenvandine> after configuring accounts it sets to start automatically
<kenvandine> but, gwibber doesn't provide presence
<kenvandine> so starting it doesn't tell everyone you are friends with you are online
<kenvandine> and ready to chat
<kenvandine> so it is much more passive
<chrisjrob> okay, but empathy doesn''t run at all, offline or online
<kenvandine> you can choose to add it to your startup programs
<kenvandine> and it will
<chrisjrob> indeed, and it does
<chrisjrob> my problem with that is for new users
<chrisjrob> they will be completely lost
<kenvandine> indeed
<chrisjrob> it just seems wrong to me
<kenvandine> however, defaulting to starting empathy and bringing them online automatically would upset lots of people
<chrisjrob> but there's a tickbox for that in empathy
<chrisjrob> so a new user will work that out
<chrisjrob> leave it off by default
<kenvandine> right
<chrisjrob> any vaguely literate computer user who is wondering why he starts offline will find that tickbox and tick it
<chrisjrob> but empathy should at least run, once configured, at startup
<kenvandine> personally i start mine at login :)
<chrisjrob> you have a better memory than me clearly ;)
<kenvandine> that is a matter of opinion... i think a lot of people feel it is better to protect the new user
<chrisjrob> would they not be protected by starting up offline?
<kenvandine> then there is no point in starting empathy at all at login
<chrisjrob> well i disagree there
<chrisjrob> at least the buttons would all work
<hggdh> well. I rarely start empathy. If it is to stay offline, them it should not be started, just another CPU consumer
<kenvandine> one thing to note is they do work now
<chrisjrob> for example changing your status to online
<kenvandine> chrisjrob, so you can now change it to online without starting empathy
<chrisjrob> well some do - chat accounts does and chat
<chrisjrob> but not the status indicators
<chrisjrob> not in 11.04
<kenvandine> in 11.10
<chrisjrob> they are greyed out
 * kenvandine did that work :)
<chrisjrob> yay!
<chrisjrob> that would make me happy
<czajkowski> chrisjrob: see  just have to upgrade so :)
<kenvandine> so it brings you online, without starting empathy
<kenvandine> if someone IMs you, and you click on it in the indicator
<kenvandine> it opens empathy
<kenvandine> to the chat
<chrisjrob> sounds good
<kenvandine> :)
<chrisjrob> my issue was the fact that stuff seemed broken by default
<chrisjrob> thank you kenvandine
<kenvandine> yeah, it wasn't that empathy wasn't started on login
<kenvandine> it was that the indicator had no notion of telepathy unless it was running
<kenvandine> i fixed that :)
<kenvandine> no problem chrisjrob
<czajkowski> so cna the bug be then closed/
<chrisjrob> czajkowski: just doing it now
<chrisjrob> what status should i change it to? fix-released or invalid?
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, is nautilus-sendto actually maintained?
<dobey> chrisccoulson: probably not
<james_w> anyone know where org.gnome.settings-daemon.peripherals.touchpad touchpad-enabled is exposed in the UI?
<james_w> It was somehow set to false for me, but the touchpad capplet gave no indication that the touchpad was disabled
<cyphermox> james_w: don't think it is
<cyphermox> there's just "while typing"
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-07-28
<TheMuso> ?c
<TheMuso> What about gnome-tweak-tool?
<TheMuso> Is it in there?
<cyphermox> ohh, and I was running g-t-t just before, didn't think of looking
<cyphermox> nope
<TheMuso> Its a wonder the gsettings values still exist at all. :)
<TheMuso> But for those who had them set, I guess migration to keep things working the way they wanted is needed.
<TheMuso> Even if there is no GUI to change them.
<cyphermox> aye
<cyphermox> now,
 * cyphermox -> late dinner
<cyphermox> cya!
 * micahg isn't sure if the lightdm dist-upgrade brokenness is due to all the new stuff that hit the archive or the lack of transitional packages...
<didrocks> good morning
<TheMuso> Hey didrocks.
<didrocks> hey TheMuso, how are you?
<TheMuso> didrocks: Not too bad thanks, yourself?
<didrocks> TheMuso: I'm find, after having refreshed 800+ of debian packages in ubuntu :)
<TheMuso> Yeah I read about that.,
<jbicha> it doesn't look like it did too much damage though, right?
<RAOF> That's a fun bug to have.  Pitty soyuz doesn't have a staging, really ;)
<didrocks> jbicha: no, it seems fine, apart from loosing my afternoon to proove that it didn't :)
<didrocks> RAOF: the bug was not trivial, and it took me time to proof it wasn't me clicking on the wrong button
<didrocks> RAOF: fortunately, I triggered the bug from the experiment, I do not want to imagine that going to production and the first one triggering the bug at beta time :)
<RAOF> Yeah.  That could be unfun.
<xclaesse> didrocks, any idea why totem crash when opening a videa on oneiric?
<didrocks> xclaesse: do you have a stacktrace? works here
<didrocks> xclaesse: I tried various format without any issue
<xclaesse> didrocks, http://fpaste.org/pwWw/
<xclaesse> didrocks, actually crash even if not giving any video
<xclaesse> seems to be loading a python plugin
<didrocks> xclaesse: indeed, seems a python plugin, do you have the bbc plugin or youtube or anything else?
<didrocks> xclaesse: totem-plugins is installed there, but not totem-plugin-arte and totem-plugins-extra
<xclaesse> didrocks, just disabled them all in gconf-editor, still crashing
<didrocks> xclaesse: all plugins? for instance, in the totem interface, I ust have youtube enabled
<xclaesse> didrocks, ok, desinstalled totem-plugins and it works
<didrocks> xclaesse: hum, would be nice to find the guilty one
<didrocks> so, it's not because it's not enabled for you, but at loading/seeking time
<xclaesse> when loading, yes
<jbicha> xclaesse: do you have gnome-video-effects installed?
<seb128> hey
<BigWhale> good morning
<didrocks> salut seb128!
<didrocks> hey BigWhale
<seb128> lut didrocks
<seb128> how are you?
<didrocks> I'm fine, thanks :) fighting with some libunity-core linking magicâ¦
<didrocks> and you?
<seb128> I'm great thanks
<seb128> new version is out?
<didrocks> seb128: no, on current version, there is something definitively wrong
<seb128> ok
<seb128> let me know if you need a second pair of eyes on it
<didrocks> hum, I like Xorg restarting when there is too much IO freezing it
<didrocks> seb128: can you make a ldd on libunity-core and confirm that you don't see any linkage to libnux-core either?
<xclaesse> jbicha, yes gnome-video-effects is installed
<seb128> $ ldd /usr/lib/libunity-core-4.0.so.4.0.0 | grep -i libnux
<seb128> $
<seb128> didrocks, ^
<didrocks> seb128: ok, thanks!
<jbicha> xclaesse: see bug 459940, as of yesterday, g-v-e depends on frei0r
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 459940 in frei0r "Launching totem when frei0r-plugins is installed shows: Could not load classifier cascade" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/459940
<xclaesse> jbicha, interesting... thx :)
<seb128> hum
<seb128> ddebs are not updated for some days
<seb128> checking...
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson
<seb128> how are you?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, you broke nautilus-sendto! ;-)
<chrisccoulson> hi seb128, i'm good thanks
<chrisccoulson> how are you?
<chrisccoulson> oh, what broke?
<chrisccoulson> oh
<chrisccoulson> it didn't build again!
<seb128> indeed
<seb128> you forgot a build-depends it seems
<seb128> I'm fine thanks
<seb128> trying to figure why we don't have ddebs for recent uploads
<seb128> the ddebs box had a lock from the 22th with no running process
<seb128> which I think is not good to get updates ;-)
<chrisccoulson> oh, i was wondering why upgrades kept removing -dbgsym packages ;)
<seb128> well the good thing is that usually we keep a week of ddebs
<seb128> so I can probably retrieve the 22 to 28 ones
<seb128> if I figure how the thing work, usually pitti handle them
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, unity-window-decorator has crashed twice in the last minute for me
<desrt> chrisccoulson, seb128; good morning
<chrisccoulson> hi desrt, how are you?
<seb128> hey desrt, had a nice flight back?
<desrt> pretty good
<desrt> seb128: ya.  did some big gmainloop changes on the plane =)
<desrt> the ancient SIGCHLD race is dead
<desrt> seb128: with your distributor hat on, do you have a comment on https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=655424 ?
<ubot2> Gnome bug 655424 in general "Provide a graceful restart for dconf-service" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<seb128> desrt, juil. 22 10:39:17 <seb128>	desrt, what we usually do is teach to the service to do whatever is needed, like reloading, on sighup and send a sighup
<seb128> desrt, what I told you the other day :p
<desrt> but it's not reloading...
<desrt> that's the difference between this and a usual case
<seb128> I agree with vuntz with my distributor hat on yes
<desrt> the intention is that you are instructing it to *exit*
<vuntz> desrt: not reloading doesn't matter
<desrt> vuntz: ohai!
<vuntz> desrt: it's just not usual to do SIGTERM
<desrt> vuntz: it's not usual to use SIGTERM to terminate processes? :)
<vuntz> desrt: it's not usual to send SIGTERM in postinstall scripts
<desrt> vuntz: right....
<desrt> but maybe that's only because purely stateless dbus services are unusual
<vuntz> desrt: what about dconf-service monitoring its own file and exiting when it changed?
<desrt> vuntz: sounds like something that i'd have difficult doing reliably and portably
<vuntz> why?
<desrt> i could use gio, i suppose
<desrt> but that would notify me every time anything in libexecdir changed
<vuntz> desrt: err, why?
<desrt> that's how gio works
<desrt> it monitors the parent directory
<vuntz> but it won't notify you
<desrt> well
<desrt> your process wakes up
<desrt> probably relatively rare in any case, though
<desrt> reliably detecting your path is also slightly difficult.... but not too bad
<vuntz> desrt: and you avoid stupid packagers doing mistakes!
<desrt> sshd just demands that you always launch it using an absolute path :)
<vuntz> desrt: I mean, do you trust people like seb128, didrocks or me?
<desrt> why are all unreliable packagers french?
<vuntz> desrt: not true, seb128 is german
<desrt> ah.  good point.
<desrt> unless i wanted to say that seb128 is reliable...
<vuntz> he's obviously ignoring us, which proves he's not reliable
<seb128> ;-)
<desrt> well
<desrt> there is a clear solution to this problem, for me
<desrt> dconf-service will watch for and exit gracefully on sigterm, sighup and maybe some others if i'm feeling exotic
<desrt> and the french and germans can do as they like
<chrisccoulson> ok, nautilus-sendto fixed for real this time ;)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, do you have time to look at bug 816377 today? :)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 816377 in xulrunner-2.0 "Please remove and blacklist source and binaries from oneiric" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/816377
<seb128> chrisccoulson, yes, sorry I was going to yesterday before we got the autosync issue going on
<chrisccoulson> heh, no worries :)
<chrisccoulson> thanks
<seb128> yw
<seb128> ok, fixed the ddebs!
<jbicha> why is there not a buildlog for amd64 https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-power-manager/3.1.3-0ubuntu1
<seb128> question for #launchpad rather
<seb128> but it's weird indeed
<seb128> we should perhaps just retry it
<seb128> bah the ddeb index update is slow
<chrisccoulson> i would just retry that build
<chrisccoulson> perhaps someone killed it?
<chrisccoulson> done
<seb128> bah, ddeb is taking ages on yesterday with the autosync run
<didrocks> seb128: as you look at the retracers, have you seen a lot of unity-panel-service crashers? (apart from fta's one)
<seb128> didrocks, quite some yes but those are usually indicator issues
<didrocks> it seems libdbusmenu there, yeah
<seb128> didrocks, recent one for example
<seb128> bug #817352
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 817352 in unity "unity-panel-service crashed with signal 5 in _gdk_x11_display_error_event()" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/817352
<seb128> didrocks, we got a bunch of weird like that
<seb128> which seem to come from unity itself not indicators
<didrocks> hum, I don't have that one though
<didrocks> dbusmenu -> gobject -> gtk3 -> crash
<didrocks> (but don't have the updated ddebs of course ;))
<seb128> didrocks, ddebs are updated now btw
<seb128> chrisccoulson, how is the gnome-keyring update going? ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, I saw that, let's send it to launchpad then :)
<didrocks> the thing is I have to chmod 0 the panel serviceâ¦
<chrisccoulson> seb128, oh, yeah, i should get back on to that again ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, ;-)
<ronoc> mvo, ping
<ronoc> just wondering when I should complete that feature
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: "freespeak and indiv-screenlets also depend on it"
<didrocks> -> on python-gtkmozembed, right?
<ronoc> mvo, no panic, when you get a chance just let me know when the transaction interface will have that property
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, yeah, that's fixed now though
<chrisccoulson> i fixed it a couple of days ago
<chrisccoulson> they depend on python-webkit now ;)
<didrocks> nice, oh seeing your comments :)
<didrocks> so, the only border line is moon, right?
<didrocks> like, it still build-dep on it, but we can't rebuild it to fix the build-dep :)
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, yeah. i talked to RAOF and we might end up just removing that
<chrisccoulson> it doesn't stop it from being installable in any case, and we can't build it anyway
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: indeed, as it's an alternative dep
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: thanks for the detail report on the bug :)
<jbicha> gnome-sudoku depends on gir1.2-gconf-2.0 but it wasn't included on today's CD
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: all checked, removed and blacklisted
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, excellent, thanks!
<didrocks> yw :)
<chrisccoulson> woohoo, i'm 5 WI's down now \o/
<didrocks> :)
<seb128> jbicha, Depends: gconf2 (>= 2.28.1-2), python2.7 | python2.6, python (>= 2.7.1-0ubuntu2), python (<< 2.8), gnome-games-common (>= 1:3.1.4-0ubuntu1), python-gobject (>= 2.10.0), gir1.2-gtk-3.0, gir1.2-launchpad-integration-3.0, gir1.2-pango-1.0
<seb128> jbicha, sorry seems like I grabbed your vcs before you added r103
<jbicha> oh ok, I noticed that in late testing because I finally got virtualbox to work
<jbicha> I think my vbox was suffering from the dkms weirdness, so I reinstalled it to get it working
<seb128> jbicha, I will fix that
<jbicha> seb128: thank you!
<seb128> np, sorry for skipping that fix when I sponsored it ;-)
<jbicha> I believe the ubuntu-desktop branch already has that edit
<jbicha> because I checked that, didn't think that it might be different from the actual build
<seb128> no it doesn't
<jbicha> especially as there's no lp:ubuntu branch for it
<seb128> did you check your own versions you merge requested?
<jbicha> oh, it looks like I updated the control but not the control.in, so it was my fault
<seb128> indeed
<mvo> ronoc: I send the branch for glatzor for review now, its at  lp:~mvo/aptdaemon/reboot-required-property
<mvo> ronoc: then there should be a property to watch for (org.debian.apt.RebootRequired)
<seb128> mvo, happy piloting!
<mvo> seb128: yeah, in a wee bit, need to finish something else first :/
<seb128> mvo, no hurry, I just looked at the calendar and noticed it was you ;-)
<mvo> yeah, google reminded my about it too (thanks google!)
<ronoc> mvo, excellent thanks
<BigWhale> seb128, kenvandine: apparently they'll fix this... http://mail.gnome.org/archives/evolution-hackers/2011-July/msg00048.html
<kenvandine> seb128, i see what you mean with the compiz modal dialogs... i can't quit gedit because the save before closing dialog is behind gedit :)
<kenvandine> not optimal :)
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> didn't get that bug, it's just that if you have a small gedit for example and you click save the fileselector is made to fit in gedit and there is space for content
<BigWhale> kenvandine, evolution hackers decided to wake up! http://mail.gnome.org/archives/evolution-hackers/2011-July/msg00048.html :>
<kenvandine> woot
 * kenvandine reads
<kenvandine> BigWhale, sounds like good progress finally
<kenvandine> BigWhale, want me to build the package in a ppa or something with the patch and you can give it a quick test before you take off?
<seb128> kenvandine, http://git.gnome.org/browse/evolution-data-server/commit/?id=5236e19e45cbd98db4c153b1f82bb247eb660d4e
<seb128> kenvandine, if you want to backport to oneiric
<kenvandine> or that :)
<BigWhale> kenvandine, how soon will this land in ubuntu when it is fixed in upstream?
<kenvandine> i can do it now :)
<BigWhale> kenvandine, <3
<BigWhale> ppa or whatever.. I'd like to test things before I go yes
<BigWhale> things at home have gone from crazy to insane ... or vice-versa ... :>
<davmor2> hey guys I get an odd issue with oneiric, if I select suspend or hibernate from the session menu it does no issues and comes back up fine,  if however I close the lid I get and error reading:  Failed to suspend,  computer failed to suspend.  Failure was reported as Sleep has already been requested and is pending.
<davmor2> I also tried restarting and closing the lid on a fresh session same thing
<didrocks> reboot, brb
<davmor2> kenvandine: gwibber-services have been popping up messages using notify-osd however gwibber is showing only tickets from an hour ago when I restarted the session
<kenvandine> davmor2, so in the client you aren't seeing new content?
<kenvandine> is it all the streams, or just one?
<kenvandine> davmor2, i have noticed my replies stream not getting updates unless i restart gwibber
<kenvandine> at least a couple times
<davmor2> kenvandine: all stream twitter and fb,   if I quit the client and reopen it, it updates
<kenvandine> but all the others have currend data
<kenvandine> davmor2, so no new data under any of the buttons?
<davmor2> kenvandine: nope,  I'll send out a message on twitter now if you reply I screenshot it and you see give me 5
<kenvandine> davmor2, no need
<kenvandine> it is probably the same problem i am seeing
<kenvandine> mine is just limited to one stream
<davmor2> kenvandine: the other thing I notice too is the behaviour of the Home stream, it used to show everything but now it only shows replies
<kenvandine> oh... that is interesting
<chrisccoulson> oh, i was just wondering where seb128 went ;)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, do you want to review p11-kit in a bit?
<seb128> sure!
<chrisccoulson> i guess i'll need to do a MIR for that too
<kenvandine> davmor2, i'll look at that too, do you have more than one account?
<davmor2> kenvandine: twitter and fb
<seb128> sorry seems like my dsl reconnected, which I didn't notice but IRC doesn't like ip changes
<davmor2> kenvandine: one of each :)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, ok, i've just uploaded that now
<chrisccoulson> oh, i just noticed that the maintainer address is wrong ;)
<seb128> great, next run is in 2 minutes, I will get it once it's in the queue
<chrisccoulson> thanks
<chrisccoulson> there should be a lintian warning for malformed maintainer addresses in debian/control ;)
<chrisccoulson> it complained about the same problem in the changes file
<glatzor> mvo, hello
<glatzor> I just merged your reboot required branch
<glatzor> mvo, is there still a need for the unity integration?
<mvo> glatzor: \o/ thanks! ronoc is there more required beside the reboot required property
<chrisccoulson> seb128, can you reject that so i can fix the maintainer address?
<jbicha> seb128: are you sure that gobject-introspection needs a new pygobject?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, done
<chrisccoulson> seb128, thanks. will reupload again now
<seb128> chrisccoulson, do we need http://cgit.freedesktop.org/p11-glue/p11-kit/commit/?id=3bb86b72ca5882b1e5684db837c75df810f283c3 ?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, i don't think so. it looks like the resulting pkgconfig file has the correctly expanded values
<chrisccoulson> i think ${prefix} is empty isn't it?
<chrisccoulson> oh, hang on
<seb128> jbicha, not sure no, somebody mentioned it yesterday on their channel that a pygobject update was required after the invoke-rewrite merge but I didn't check
<chrisccoulson> seb128, no, i think it's fine
<chrisccoulson> teh pkgconfig file has "p11_system_conf=/etc/pkcs11/pkcs11.conf"
<seb128> ok great
<chrisccoulson> seb128, ok, that's uploaded again now
<seb128> chrisccoulson, " components orlibraries living in the same process."
<seb128> there is a space missing after "or"
<kenvandine> BigWhale, are you on amd64?
<seb128> (detail)
<chrisccoulson> heh
<chrisccoulson> that's a website bug ;)
<seb128> ;-)
<chrisccoulson> i copied it straight from there
<seb128> chrisccoulson, oh, please use .symbols, mterry will block the mir if there is none ;-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, oh, i totally forgot to add them ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, do you want to do a new revision for the fixes?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, can do
<seb128> chrisccoulson, or should I just drop that upload and you fix it with a new one?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, it's up to you. it probably doesn't make any difference either way. if you approve it, i can just upload a new revision
<seb128> ok
<seb128> let me finish the review
<seb128> chrisccoulson, you don't install the api documentation
<seb128> you should put it in the dev
<chrisccoulson> do we normally do that?
<chrisccoulson> i wasn't sure if it mattered or not
<seb128> sometimes yes
<seb128> sometimes we create a new binary
 * mterry hearts .symbols
<seb128> I would just put it in the dev ;-)
<seb128> hey mterry
<seb128> mterry, new mir work coming your way in a bit ;-)
<mterry> seb128, hello!
<mterry> darn it
<chrisccoulson> ok, i've added the symbols
<seb128> chrisccoulson, ok, trying to read mterry's mir review I think he will want make check to be run during the build
<seb128> ;-)
<mterry> :)
<mterry> if there are tests, yeah
<mterry> seb128, you should just write a bot to do my MIRs
<seb128> lol
<seb128> mterry, don't try to slack away!
<chrisccoulson> seb128, it runs already ;)
<chrisccoulson> dh_auto_test runs it
<seb128> oh, clever
<seb128> the new dh system seems nice ;-)
<chrisccoulson> heh :)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, i've got a new revision here with symbols and the documentation installed
<seb128> chrisccoulson, NEWed
<chrisccoulson> seb128, excellent, thanks
<seb128> thank you for working on it ;-)
<BigWhale> kenvandine, yes
<kenvandine> http://ubuntuone.com/p/16dh/
<kenvandine> http://ubuntuone.com/p/16dj/
<kenvandine> BigWhale, ^^
<kenvandine> those two debs should be all you need
<seb128> kenvandine, tedg: I've put some comments on the libindicate gtk3 merge request
<kenvandine> cool
<kenvandine> i am looking at that right now too
<BigWhale> kenvandine, ok, will try
<kenvandine> BigWhale, cool, thx
<kenvandine> BigWhale, let me know if it helps at all... i'll hold off uploading to oneiric
<seb128> $ evolution
<seb128> ** (evolution:1074): CRITICAL **: categories_icon_theme_hack: assertion `filename != NULL && *filename != '\0'' failed
<seb128> (evolution:1074): evolution-shell-CRITICAL **: shell_settings_pspec_for_key: assertion `schema_name != NULL' failed
<seb128> Erreur de segmentation (core dumped)
<seb128> bah
<seb128> go evo go
<seb128> it works if I run it in gdb though
<didrocks> seb128: time to switch to thunderbird? :)
<seb128> can I edit my calendar there? ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: hum, depends on which calendar your are talking about :-)
<didrocks> the one in a papersheet, yeah ;)
<seb128> ;-)
<didrocks> ok, early evening, need to see the doctor. Will check my emails later
<didrocks> see you tomorrow :)
<seb128> didrocks, see you
<kenvandine> good night didrocks
<seb128> let's see if he gets glasses ;-)
<BigWhale> kenvandine, it seems I am running into some dependency problems... let me update/upgrade
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> BigWhale, i need to drop offline for a little bit
<kenvandine> should be back on in 15m or so...
<BigWhale> ok
<kenvandine> but if i am not, drop me a mail so i know to upload or not :)
<kenvandine> bbiab
<jaytaoko> Hello
<jaytaoko> I need help with lightdm
<seb128> jaytaoko, yes?
<jaytaoko> After upgrading my system, lightdm does not show up
<jaytaoko> seb128: my screen is black
<seb128> jaytaoko, switch to a vt and install lightdm-gtk-greeter
<jaytaoko> seb128: I did that, following didrocks advice
<jaytaoko> seb128: I also installed lightdm-gtk-greeter-example
<seb128> jaytaoko, on what version of ubuntu are you?
<seb128> you shouldn't be able to install lightdm-gtk-greeter-example
<seb128> that's deprecated
<seb128> it conflicts with the new lightdm
<jaytaoko> seb128: oneiric
<seb128> jaytaoko, dpkg -l | grep lightdm?
<jaytaoko> seb128: I see liblightdm-gobject-0-0, liblightdm-gobject-1-0, lightdm, lightdm-greeter-example-gtk, lightdm-gtk-greeter
<seb128> jaytaoko, what greeter did you use before?
<seb128> jaytaoko, are those all on 0.9.2 versions?
<jaytaoko> seb128: I installed lightdm-greeter-example-gtk because lightdm.log was reporting it couldn't find example-greeter-gtk or something like that
<micahg> seb128: your fix is still not working, I'm rebasing my change on your upload now
<seb128> micahg, how so?
<seb128> micahg, what error do you get?
<micahg> seb128: apt can't resolve the dependency chain and wants to remove lightdm and the meta package requiring it
<seb128> micahg, it doesn't make any sense
<seb128> can you check with mvo?
<micahg> that's true
<seb128> why would it remove lightdm rather than install a greeter?
<micahg> but I think this is why most packages provide transitional upgrades to new binaries
<seb128> no
<seb128> transitional packages are because provides are not versioned
<seb128> mvo, there?
<ricotz> seb128, hello
<micahg> well, when mvo has a minute, I'm happy to debug, I have the system still here with lightdm 0.4.3 to test with
<seb128> hey ricotz
<ricotz> do you mind having a short look at the package structure of cogl http://people.ubuntu.com/~ricotz/clutter-cogl/
<mvo> hello seb128 and micahg
<seb128> BigWhale, is it working?
<seb128> mvo, hey
<micahg> mvo: hi
<seb128> mvo, micahg is having lightdm upgrade issues
<seb128> summary of the situations is
<BigWhale> seb128, there are some dependencies missing
<seb128> we have 0.4.3
<BigWhale>  gir1.2-ebook-1.2 depends on gir1.2-edataserver-1.2 (= 3.1.4-0ubuntu2); however:
<BigWhale>   Version of gir1.2-edataserver-1.2 on system is 3.1.4-0ubuntu1.
<BigWhale> d
<seb128> BigWhale, ken says he will just upload
<seb128> mvo, ok, so sorry got sidetracked
<seb128> 0.4.3
<seb128> lightdm: recommends lightdm-greeter and lightdm-example-gtk-greeter installed which provided it
<seb128> i.e you had 0.4.3 with lightdm and lightdm-example-gtk-greeter installed
<seb128> 0.9.2 now
<seb128> the greeter got renamed lightdm-gtk-greeter
<seb128> we made lightdm Depends on lightdm-gtk-greeter | lightdm-greeter
<seb128> (lightdm-greeter is a virtual package that all greeters provides)
<seb128> and conflicts with the old lib soname which lightdm-example-gtk-greeter depended on
<seb128> mvo, why would on a dist-upgrade apt prefer to remove lightdm than to install lightdm-gtk-greeter?
<mvo> what is the output of -o Debug::pkgProblemResolver=true and -o Debug::pkgDepCache::AutoInstall=true when this happens?
<mvo> does this happen on oneiric -> oneiric only? if so, what do I have to do to reproduce?
<micahg> oneiric-> oneiric, alpha2 to now upgrade should show it
<BigWhale> seb128, ok... I'll wait and do an upgrade
<mvo> micahg: let me try
<mvo> micahg: or can you provide me with the debug output?
<micahg> mvo: http://paste.ubuntu.com/653853/
<mvo> thanks micahg I can partly reproduce it from a older livecd
<seb128> micahg, oh, you have xubuntu-desktop which depends on lightdm-greeter-example-gtk,
<seb128> mvo, ^
<seb128> that's broken
<mvo> aha!
<seb128> xubuntu-desktop needs to be updated to depends on an existent binary
<mvo> apt is never wrong :p
<micahg> oh, wait, I know what part of my problem is, I just saw that, I can fix that part, but the new greeter provides the old binary
<micahg> mvo: ^^ wouldn't the provides work on the upgrade here
 * micahg goes to fix xubuntu-desktop
<chrisccoulson> g'ah, having no JS debugger for firefox totally sucks
<mvo> micahg: it should I think, but let me look in more detail whats going on
<seb128> micahg, mvo: one issue is that the package was real and it's a provide now and provides are not versioned
<seb128> so I'm not sure how it plays with apt
<mvo> seb128: it looks like part of the probem is that the new lightdm conflicts on liblightdm-gobject-0-0 and the old -example-gtk greeter depends on that one, so apt sees that it needs a greeter but the installed one conflicts with the new version. this is why its held back in my test vm it seems
<seb128> well, held back is fine
<seb128> can we nudge it to install the new greeter?
<mvo> hold on a sec, I try to figure out more
<seb128> ricotz, what sort of comments do you want on cogl?
<ricotz> seb128, things like the package naming
<ricotz> i uploaded the binaries too
<ricotz> so you can see the lib names
<seb128> ricotz, the naming and debs seem fine
<ricotz> the cogl symbol removal from libclutter-1.0-0 should be no harm for transitional things
<ricotz> i disabled quite some patches and moved two from clutter to cogl
<mvo> seb128: hm, I need to look more into it, sorry that I don't see a immediate solution, I'm sure I'm overlooking something
<mvo> seb128: I need to go for early dinner today, I check tomorrow morning
<seb128> mvo, no hurry, have fun, see you tomorrow
<seb128> ricotz, ok
<ricotz> brb
<BigWhale> kenvandine, kenvandine, kenvandine !
<BigWhale> dependencies failed :>
<BigWhale> gir1.2-ebook-1.2 depends on gir1.2-edataserver-1.2 (= 3.1.4-0ubuntu2); however:
<BigWhale>   Version of gir1.2-edataserver-1.2 on system is 3.1.4-0ubuntu1.
<BigWhale> I guess I'll need everything related to eds
<kenvandine> BigWhale, yeah, seb128 told me
<seb128> wb kenvandine
<kenvandine> i uploaded to oneiric, but it is still waiting to build
<kenvandine> hey seb128
<kenvandine> BigWhale, i'll get you the rest of the debs
<BigWhale> kenvandine, ok... I'll wait... :)
<seb128> you can probably dpkg -i --force-depends the one you got
<seb128> then fix with an apt-get -f install later
<BigWhale> I have to leave for an hour or so...
<BigWhale> just msg me or something
<seb128> well, just unpack the deb locally otherwise
<seb128> dpkg-deb -x gir... dir
<seb128> then copy the file over the system on
<seb128> one
<BigWhale> just the gir file is needed? really?
<BigWhale> wow
<seb128> the typelib rather which is in the gir binary
 * BigWhale slaps himself because he didn't think of force depends...
<micahg> seb128: new xubuntu-meta uploaded, sorry for the wild goose chase
<kenvandine> http://ubuntuone.com/p/16fP/
<kenvandine> BigWhale, ^^
<BigWhale> kenvandine, there were some errors.. let me check
<BigWhale>   Package libgtk-3-dev is not installed.
<BigWhale> ok nothing too bad
<seb128> re
<seb128> jbicha, there?
<jbicha> seb128: yes
<seb128> jbicha, is the ssdpd client required or is only the library required in that binary?
<seb128> looking at lp:~jbicha/ubuntu/oneiric/miniupnpc/drop-minissdpd-recommends
<seb128> seems wrong that the library and dev have a recommends to start, it should benefit only the client itself? or is the library enhenced by it?
<jbicha> it's enhanced, according to http://miniupnp.free.fr/minissdpd.html
<jbicha> "Recent versions of MiniUPnPd and MiniUPnPc are designed to take automaticaly advantage of MiniSSDPd running on the same computer."
<seb128> well, the library?
<seb128> or the client?
<seb128> or both?
<seb128> it seems wrong that the recommends is there on each binary to start
<seb128> it should either be on the client or on the library
<jbicha> yes it is weird, but maybe it enhances both?
<seb128> ok, I was asking if you knew exactly
<seb128> we should check ;-)
<seb128> thanks
<jbicha> no, all I know is from reading the dev's homepage
<didrocks> hey ;)
<seb128> didrocks, hey, so did you win glasses or not? ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, I won glasses and so, loose money :)
<didrocks> clearly it's because "I work too much" :-)
<seb128> didrocks, no, that's because you should stop looking at screens after work
<didrocks> I even had to time to go to the glasses shop to order some!
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> nice
<didrocks> seb128: ahah, they are not that close :)
<didrocks> will be handy anyway
<didrocks> seb128: btw, if you got a minute to review the libunity-2d-private-dev packages in NEW
<jbicha> seb128: I'm trying to build gnome-games with the new vala-0.14 but it gets stuck at AM_PROG_VALAC([0.13.0])
<jbicha> it looks at /usr/bin/valac and sees that it's not 0.13.0 or higher
<didrocks> jbicha: /usr/bin/valac is an alternative
<didrocks> jbicha: it should point to 0.12 I gues if both vala is installed for you
<jbicha> ok, well valac --version returns Vala 0.12.1
<didrocks> indeed :)
<didrocks> jbicha: do you have both vala installed?
<didrocks> in that case, update-alternatives --config valac
<jbicha> so it works if I uninstall the other one
<didrocks> and choose the 0.14
<didrocks> jbicha: no need, just choose it with the above command ^^
<didrocks> and then, confirm with valac --version
<didrocks> (the builder doesn't have the issue as you normally just install one vala version)
<jbicha> ok, got it
<jbicha> it's still going to cause problems though when someone tries to run a vala-0.14 app, right?
<jbicha> I don't think the developers expect users to have 2 different vala on their computer
<jbicha> blames robert_ancell for causing problems ;-)
<ricotz> the alternatives priority of vala-0.14 should be bumped a bit, e.g. from 85 to 90
<seb128> why?
<seb128> we don't want to default
<seb128> jbicha, well most softwares using vala use it at build time to compile C
<seb128> they don't use it at runtime
<seb128> so build-depends on the right version should work
<seb128> the buildds will get only that version
<jbicha> oh, I didn't know that
<ricotz> mhh, but if you install it i think it should be default
<seb128> ricotz, I think the stable serie should be default
<seb128> .1 in an unstable serie is a bit early to make it defaul
<seb128> if you like it you can set the default alternative on your system though
<ricotz> right, so the upload overrules vala-0.12 already
<ricotz> just saw you used a new package name
<jbicha> won't vala 0.14 be out by release date? Fedora switched to vala-0.13 by default
<seb128> jbicha, it should
<ricotz> jbicha, i still has some issues
<seb128> still I would prefer if we try to build a few things like shotwell with it before switching defaults
<ricotz> it*
<seb128> we got bitten in the past by switching too early
<seb128> didrocks, can do
<jbicha> ok, we're not Rawhide :-)
<seb128> no, we are not ;-)
 * kenvandine is scared to try it
<ricotz> so an upload without providing vala-dev would be better
<didrocks> seb128: thanks! :)
<seb128> didrocks, yw
<seb128> ricotz, there is no vala-dev in that upload
<ricotz> vala-0.14-dev provides vala-dev
<seb128> right, why is what you want
<seb128> it allows people who want to try use the new version as their default to do it
<seb128> why->which
<ricotz> removing this will prevent pulling it in by default for build-deps, if there is still trouble with it
<seb128> hum
<seb128> well let's see if there are some practical issues
<ricotz> people who wants to try it can explicitly choose vala-0.14-dev
<seb128> it's not going to be pulled in by anything in main since it's in universe
<ricotz> ok
<seb128> well they will get a missing build-depends if they try something build-depends on the non versioned name
<ricotz> mhh, so it could be a problem
<seb128> let's see if we get any practical issue with what we have now
<seb128> it should be mostly ok
<seb128> I'm fine changing it if needed
<ricotz> i dont recall, but since 0.13.1 there were quite some bugs
<ricotz> ok, lets see
<jbicha> seb128: do you want a new merge proposal for gnome-games then, or reuse the old one?
<kenvandine> seb128, is there a known problem with the buildds and glib?
<kenvandine> Processing triggers for libglib2.0-0 ...
<kenvandine> Unable to open directory /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/gio/modules: Error opening directory '/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/gio/modules': No such file or directory
<seb128> jbicha, old one is fine thanks
<seb128> kenvandine, not known
<jbicha> https://code.launchpad.net/~jbicha/gnome-games/gnome-games-3.1.4/+merge/69384
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> jbicha, will look at it later
<seb128> dinner time ;-)
<jbicha> sure, no hurry
<BigWhale> kenvandine, there's a change...  :>
<kenvandine> BigWhale, i guess that is something :)
<BigWhale> well.. it's a change... http://pastebin.com/ZL64X4BA
<BigWhale> just not all that good... :>
<BigWhale> but I am glad things are moving forward :)
<kenvandine> BigWhale, looking in git, that same guy had several commits after the patch i applied that all seem somewhat related
<kenvandine> annotations related to getting the client
<BigWhale> kenvandine, oh
<kenvandine> i guess i need to apply all of them :)
<BigWhale> "It compiles, ship it!"
<BigWhale> :>
<didrocks> have a good night everyone
<dobey> ugh. why doesn't Gtk.ResponseType.foo work right
<dobey> exceptions.AttributeError: type object 'GtkResponseType' has no attribute 'ok'
<dobey> oh
<dobey> because they're actually capitalized in the API, but in the .gir they are lowercase
<dobey> Gtk.STOCK_GRRRR
<jbicha> yeah, the capitalization & punctuation confuses me too
<seb128> jbicha, in fact I'm going to keep your update out for a bit
<seb128> jbicha, the new vala is in universe only for now
<seb128> jbicha, we don't need a mir review but we should probably support one vala version at the time so I'm going to delay a bit until the next meeting so we can discuss what versions we want to support and the timing to promote,demote those
<jbicha> seb128: ok, it's all robert ancell's fault with sudoku & simple-scan anyway ;-)
<seb128> indeed!
<seb128> he broke things and then ran away in holidays ;-)
<seb128> the second one will be a reason to use the new vala as well though
<seb128> especially that the new version switched to gtk3 and gsettings
<seb128> kenvandine, you need to try again ;-)
<kenvandine> seb128, will do
<kenvandine> e-d-s built fine
<seb128> kenvandine, to use autoreconf you need a build-depends on dh-autoreconf ;-)
<seb128> kenvandine, sorry I was talking about indicator-power
<kenvandine> sigh...
<seb128> "dh: unable to load addon autoreconf: Can't locate Debian/Debhelper/Sequence/autoreconf.pm in @INC (@INC contains: /etc/perl /usr/local/lib/perl/5.12.4 /usr/local/share/perl/5.12.4 /usr/lib/perl5 /usr/share/perl5 /usr/lib/perl/5.12 /usr/share/perl/5.12 /usr/local/lib/site_perl .) at (eval 23) line 2."
<kenvandine> :)
<kenvandine> that is better than the previous failure :)
<jbicha> is everyone going on holiday now?
<seb128> no
<kenvandine> BigWhale,  http://ubuntuone.com/p/16fP/
<seb128> well kenvandine soon I think
<kenvandine> same url, but an updated tarball with new debs
<kenvandine> september
<seb128> but by the time I'm off pitti and robert_ancell will be back
<seb128> kenvandine, didn't you say you wouldn't be at desktop summit because of holidays?
<seb128> I'm getting confused ;-)
<kenvandine> not strictly because of it
<seb128> jbicha, well anyway there is a turn over, we should always have some people online ;-)
<kenvandine> but they are close... didn't want to be gone that close together
<kenvandine> i am leaving beginning of sept
<seb128> kenvandine, yeah, makes sense
<seb128> good, you can cover for all the people slack^working at the summit
<seb128> ;-)
<kenvandine> yup :)
<seb128> why is evolution such a piece of crap software?
<seb128> it's only working under gdb since the update
<kenvandine> BigWhale, you also need https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/evolution-data-server/3.1.4-0ubuntu3/+build/2653940/+files/evolution-data-server-common_3.1.4-0ubuntu3_all.deb
<pedro_> seb128, time to move to thunderbird? :-P
<pedro_> seb128, i'm using it + google for calendaring, got a bit tired of evolution being broken from time to time
<kenvandine> pedro_, i want my calendars in eds though
<kenvandine> they aren't very useful if they aren't
<pedro_> kenvandine, well yeah...
<kenvandine> :/
<seb128> yeah, I should switch to tb, if I do maybe chrisccoulson will pay me a beer at UDS as well or something ;-)
<seb128> would be a double win ;-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, it depends on how many bugs you report ;)
<chrisccoulson> more bugs = less beer
<chrisccoulson> :)
<seb128> not fair!
<chrisccoulson> didrocks is already at zero beer
<pedro_> lol
<seb128> that's fine, he drinks enough :p
<chrisccoulson> heh
<seb128> mterry, hey
<mterry> seb128, hello!
<seb128> mterry, do you follow the transmission mirs and tweaks needed?
<seb128> or should that be on the team list?
<mterry> seb128, a bit.  I reviewed several of them
<seb128> like https://code.launchpad.net/~jbicha/ubuntu/oneiric/miniupnpc/drop-minissdpd-recommends/+merge/69618
<mterry> seb128, yeah, I noticed that branch today.  I saw you commented and was going to check again later for a response
<seb128> mterry, or said differently "will you sort it, or should I try to have a look to understand why a bittorent client try to bring on services"
<BigWhale> kenvandine, I probably need to restart evolution, right?
<seb128> I've not looked at it but that seems a bit much for a bittorent client
<kenvandine> BigWhale, doubt it
<kenvandine> it is just changing the annotations for the API
<jbicha> transmission doesn't ship minissdpd, that was the Debian packaging based on the original author's recommendation
<mterry> seb128, :) my understanding is that one of these new libraries supports a service like upnp, but that per-spec, upnp things all have to listen to same port.  So this daemon is a proxy for that port and listens on behalf of all clients
<mterry> seb128, not necessary, but makes such upnp support better (so it's not a race to the port)
<seb128> why does a bittorent client need to do upnp?
<kenvandine> BigWhale, these TRANSFER_NOTHING warnings look kind of like I am getting one per result of the query
<seb128> it's the goal to download things?
<mterry> seb128, that I don't know  :)
<seb128> ok
<seb128> mterry, well, will you look at it or should I put that on my todo? ;-)
<seb128> mterry, I'm just trying to make sure somebody looks at sorting it ;-)
<jbicha> because downloading torrents can have problems in nat setups which is a lot of home users
<mterry> seb128, I can grab it
<BigWhale> kenvandine, I have only one record in the contacts... :>
<BigWhale> let me see
<seb128> mterry, thanks, it's yours then
<mterry> jbicha, is it sufficient to just not ship the daemon?  how bad an experience would that give users?
<seb128> jbicha, ok, I guess I don't understand how upnp fixes that issue
<seb128> but I think such setups are "corner cases"
<seb128> i.e over what our default install target
<seb128> those users can install an upnp stack if they need it
<jbicha> upnp is supposed to magically cross through the nat firewall
<seb128> well is the lib doing that? or does it need a running service?
<jbicha> mterry: I think not shipping only creates an issue if a computer has more than 1 vino or transmission instance going
<seb128> then I'm not sure what the upnpc thing do
<jbicha> which should be discouraged anyway
<jbicha> the daemon was so that more than 1 app (or instance of that app) could use the same port
<jbicha> but neither transmission nor vino ship minissdpd, but they do ship miniupnpc
<BigWhale> kenvandine, you're right
<BigWhale> warning for each hit in the database
<kenvandine> BigWhale, so i think the next bug is annotations for the resulting record
<BigWhale> if there are no hits, get_contacts_sync() wont core dump.. So, I guess there's still an issue with copying the data
<mterry> seb128, jbicha: so that sounds like a reasonable use case (though I don't know details of magically getting around nat).  But easy enough to drop the daemon.  jbicha, could you update your branch to use Suggests instead of just dropping the Recommends?
<BigWhale> kenvandine, brb... (inlaws visiting...)
<jbicha> mterry: suggests for both the client & library, right?
<DBO> hey guys...
<DBO> why does gnome-session sometimes spam the crap out of dbus with evolution calendar crap?
<DBO> its kind of annoying
<mterry> jbicha, I guess?  It was recommends before.  Again, not sure why both need them, but it's not terribly important that Suggests are perfect
<seb128> DBO, it doesn't
<DBO> mine does
<seb128> DBO, it's likely that indicator-datetime is doing it
<seb128> DBO, talk to ted
<DBO> seb128, roger roger :)
<seb128> well, we got bugs about indicator-datetime doing it
<seb128> chrisccoulson mentioned that before I think
<seb128> not sure if he debugged it though
<chrisccoulson> i didn't have much chance
<chrisccoulson> but, from what i saw, e-calendar-factory spams the session bus with bazillions of "opened" signals
<jbicha> mterry: done
<DBO> is it a bad time to upgrade now?
<seb128> no
<DBO> dist-upgrade wants to remove ubuntu-desktop
<mterry> jbicha, is there a reason you left the recommends on the -dev package?
<jbicha> mterry: no, I just didn't look close enough, pushed again
<mterry> jbicha, merged, thanks!
<mterry> also closed out the mir for it
<seb128> kenvandine, you won this time, it build!
<kenvandine> :)
<BigWhale> kenvandine, yeah, the problem is with the result.
<kenvandine> i think that list contains references to a #EContact
<kenvandine> which must not have the right transfer or something
<seb128> reply to the list email with your current issue
<BigWhale> I also tried contacts = GLib.SList()
<kenvandine> BigWhale, yeah, that isn't the issue
<BigWhale> since the gir file has SList as an out parameter
<kenvandine> it is the contents of the list
<kenvandine> trying to access the contents of the list causes the crash
<BigWhale> is evolution now fixed or still sending out empty emails? :)
<kenvandine> i didn't know it was sending empty mails!
 * kenvandine hopes he hasn't done that to anyone :)
<BigWhale> yeah it used to, not sure now.. I switched to thunderbird in the mean time
<BigWhale> (now that's broken too... :> )
<BigWhale> kenvandine, I sent mail with an update to the evolution-hackers list... now putting kids to bed... later
<kenvandine> later!
<dobey> hrmm
<dobey> i wonder if there is a way to force loading of Gtk-2.0 with Python and gi.repository
<kenvandine> dobey, yes
<kenvandine> gi.module.gi.require_version ("Gtk", "2.0")
<kenvandine> then
<kenvandine> from gi.repository import Gtk
<dobey> ah
<kenvandine> in know... easily discoverable :)
<dobey> yeah, just ran across that in an obscure mailing list thread
<dobey> now to figure out when i should actually do that
<dobey> meh, aptdaemon.client doesn't have a simple "at_least_version(package, '1.2.3')" sort of thing :(
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-07-29
<AfC> What the ... current upgrade is going to REMOVE gnome-shell ?!?
<AfC> Hooray for not always blindly running `dist-upgrade`!
<TheMuso> AfC: There is likely a conflict with dependencies somewhere, and gnome-shell needs to be rebuilt/fixed.
<AfC> TheMuso: yeah
<AfC> TheMuso: [but thanks for confirming my suspicion!]
<TheMuso> I don't know for sure, I just guessed based on similar situations in the past.
<AfC> TheMuso: looks to be that. We'll see in a day or two. It shows up quite obviously because we don't have any Unity, Compiz, CanonicalOne, etc packages installed on our systems, so when something like this happens I get a *long* list of things to freshly install :)
<TheMuso> Right.
<RAOF> Thank god it's almost the weekend.  I've just spent far to long staring, trying to work out why the shell around âpatch -p1 < debian/sna_module_rename-stampâ isn't working.
<lifeless> RAOF: LOL
<RAOF> Yeah.  Turns out the patch-stamp isn't actually the same thing as the patch.
<RAOF> Hah.  That worked.  I can tell by the rendering corruption!
<didrocks> good morning
<RAOF> Hey didrocks.
<didrocks> hey RAOF, how are you?
<RAOF> Ok.  A bit tired.  Yay weekend!
<RAOF> Yourself?
<TheMuso> Hey didrocks.
<TheMuso> RAOF: Yeah feeling a little like that myself.
<didrocks> good evening TheMuso :)
<TheMuso> Still afternoon actually, mid to late afternoon one would call it I think.
<didrocks> RAOF: I'm fine, thanks, quite happy to see that in 30 minutes, I almost adapted OneConf to the new s-c in gtk2
<didrocks> still a bit raw, but I'm optimistic if we don't adopt the new design this cycle to put it by default :)
<RAOF> Cool!  I'd love me a bit of oneconf
<didrocks> TheMuso: heh, still some hours to go then!
<didrocks> django server part is ready :)
<TheMuso> Actually not that long, about an hour, give or take for me at least.
<didrocks> TheMuso: I noted that unity-panel-service is now crashing with a11y enabled btw
<TheMuso> didrocks: Which unity?
<didrocks> and now both unity/unity-2d are using it
<didrocks> I reported it to API, he'll look at it
<TheMuso> Ok.
<didrocks> (seems to be there for 2 weeks)
<TheMuso> So are both unity environments sharing one panel now? Interesting.
<didrocks> TheMuso: not really sharing the panel, sharing the service containing the indicator proxy :)
<TheMuso> Ah ok.
<didrocks> (and so piloting what should be drawn)
<TheMuso> Right.
<didrocks> TheMuso: also, do you know if there is soon a dbus api to know if accessibility should be enabled?
<didrocks> IIRC, that's the latest thing in a11y missing for qt, as it's in dconf right now
<TheMuso> Dbus api? No, only the gsettings stuff atm.
<TheMuso> Unless I am getting confused with somethign else.
<didrocks> no, I think you're right
<TheMuso> Oh QT. No, don't know, other than QT_ACCESSIBILITY=1
<didrocks> TheMuso: yeah, but they were waiting for some more generic stuff like a dbus call :)
<TheMuso> Right.
<didrocks> as they won't access gsettings I guess
<TheMuso> Correct.
<didrocks> TheMuso: can you ensure for oneiric that you export the variable in the session?
<TheMuso> Export it where?
<didrocks> (I guess some work on casper and g-c-c, isn't it?)
<didrocks> to the session
<jbicha> I can't even get the unity-2d launcher or panel to start now: http://fpaste.org/WJum/
<TheMuso> didrocks: Well it should probably be done with one of the pieces of the at-spi stack, such that if a user enables it through gcc, then QT_ACCESSIBILITY=1 will get set on restart. Doing it in the a11y profiles alone doesn't make sense.
<didrocks> jbicha: try to ldd the binary, seems you have a missing one
<TheMuso> It would have to be a shell script, however that does increase startup overhead.
<didrocks> TheMuso: I don't know which stack should set it, I think you have a better idea than I there, but can you ensure you will track it for oneiric?
<didrocks> do you need a workitem?
<TheMuso> didrocks: Sure, I don't think I need a work item, just got to think of the best way to do it technically.
<TheMuso> Its something I was aware of a while back, but haven't looked at, since my priorities have been slightly elsewhere recently.
<jbicha> didrocks: um, and then what? http://fpaste.org/aHwG/
<didrocks> TheMuso: sure, I just don't want that we overlook it, would be a shame to have accessibility and not enabling it :-) I'm just adding a workitem to track it. Thanks  :)
<didrocks> TheMuso: beta1 is fine?
<didrocks> jbicha: do you have latest dee-qt?
<TheMuso> didrocks: Yes thats fine thanks.
<didrocks> jbicha: and libunity-2d-private0?
<littlejerry> hello
<didrocks> hey littlejerry
<littlejerry> hello
<jbicha> didrocks: I didn't have libunity-2d-private0
<didrocks> jbicha: hum, there is maybe a missing dep then, weird
<didrocks> can you install it and try?
<jbicha> I installed it and unity-2d works
<didrocks> \o/
 * didrocks looks why the bin didn't take the deps
<jbicha> I've had some annoying appmenu bug for a while now so I don't use Unity really, gnome-shell is more stable for me
<TheMuso> +/c
<jbicha> didrocks: well, the kde-wallpaper transition means I couldn't do a normal dist-upgrade
<didrocks> jbicha: it's a dep, you should get it. Though, it didn't force for the latest version, indeeded
<didrocks> jbicha: I'll ensuring forcing with the latest version
<didrocks> (well, with the version corresponding the one in the source)
<BigWhale> Urgh
<BigWhale> Morning
<didrocks> hey BigWhale
<BigWhale> hey didrocks
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<didrocks> hey chrisccoulson!
<BigWhale> putting good in front of the morning, a common mistake
<BigWhale> :>
<chrisccoulson> hi didrocks, how are you?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: I'm fine, thanks, and you?
<chrisccoulson> i'm good thanks
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, i just read oneiric-changes - wth is "pornview"?
<BigWhale> chrisccoulson, no idea, but sounds promising!
<BigWhale> :>
<mvo> silly question, but we don't want to have the .pc/ stuff in the bzr  lp:ubuntu branches, do we?
<chrisccoulson> mvo - i always wonder the same thing ;)
<chrisccoulson> i think the autoimported branches all have them
<mvo> glade I'm not the only one :)
<mvo> bÃ¤Ã¤Ã¤
<bullgard4_> I would like reporting an error in GNOME 2 under Natty: The screen freezes with some artifacts, but I can recover by toggling to a virtual console. What package should I associate my error report to in Launchpad?
 * mvo takes a cup of tea to calm himself and not get into some rage about this
<didrocks> mvo: the autoimported apply the patch if you are in source 3 format for that package
<didrocks> and yeah, +1, it's not good :/
<mvo> progress++
<bschaefer> didrocks: Hey, just a small update on the CJK patch. He only commented on a couple minor things but those are fixed
<bschaefer> didrocks: and he hasn't posted anything else to change so I think he likes the new patch so far been a few days
<bschaefer> didrocks: sooo hopefully it will be applied soon and everything should just 'work'
<BigWhale> Is it the last Friday in July? Happy system administrator appreciation day to everyone! Buy a pizza for your sysadmin, show some love! :)
<didrocks> bschaefer: that's awesome! do not hesitate to ping me when it will be integrated in debian. Thanks again for this week, you will make a lot of people happy! :-)
<bschaefer> didrocks: haha that's good to hear, and I am hoping that will be soon!
 * didrocks crosses fingers too :)
<bullgard4_> I would like reporting an error in GNOME 2 under Natty: The screen freezes with some artifacts, but I can recover by toggling to a virtual console. What package should I associate my error report to in Launchpad?
<seb128> hey
<seb128> hum
<seb128> somebody has been visually reformating the etherpad
<mvo> didrocks: I am just looking at indictator-cpufreq and its in gtk2, for how long will this work?
<seb128> mvo, is it a system indicator or using libappindicator?
<mvo> seb128: its a python app using python-appindicator
<mvo> seb128: is this out-of-process?
<seb128> mvo, that will keep working
<seb128> yes
<mvo> great
<seb128> hey mvo btw, how are you?
<seb128> mvo, piloting today? ;-)
<seb128> mvo, there is an indicator-bug on the sponsoring queue as well, oier was very eager to get review if you have time
<mvo> yeah, busy pioloting
<mvo> (and mistyping stuff)
<didrocks> salut seb128
<seb128> lut didrocks
<seb128> mvo, do you know how close the upstart update brings us from working user session handling? ;-)
<jbicha> seb128: I had no idea the + on the versions page was a button until I read your inteview in the Dev Update
<seb128> jbicha, hey, yeah it's not very obvious...
<seb128> we should maybe have 2 urls rather
<mvo> seb128: I don't sorry, I will try to find time later on to figure it out
<mvo> what feature is this, the "+" ?
<seb128> mvo, no worry I was just curious
<jbicha> it needs more blinking text
<seb128> mvo, display extra packages
<seb128> mvo, by default it limits to the default installation
<seb128> mvo, http://people.canonical.com/~platform/desktop/versions.html
<seb128> mvo, btw we have some desktop sponsoring in the queue if you want to take some easy ones ;-)
<mvo> easy++
<mvo> aha, nice
<mvo> oh, yeah the "+" is not obvious as its not blue
<mvo> a cool feature though
<mvo> (blue to indicate its a link)
<didrocks> ahah, I guess seb128 found to who send the brasero patch review :)
<seb128> mvo, the lines with a bzr emblem are merge request, you can click on the emblem
<seb128> mvo, http://pad.ubuntu-uk.org/oneiric-desktop has a few as well
<seb128> like the gpm drop-override
<seb128> didrocks, yeah, well I will try to do some sponsoring a well, I just got lazy to try to write a CD to test that one ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: butâ¦ butâ¦ you will use an oneiric iso I guess, how can you don't feel attracted to this unique test? :-)
<seb128> ;-)
<aquarius> mvo, ping?
<mvo> aquarius: pong
<Tommeh> Bah.
<aquarius> mvo, I had a weird problem where jetty depends on default-jre-headless | java5-runtime-headless, I had jetty installed, and had neither of those headless runtimes installed. How could that happen?
<Tommeh> Back to comical fonts in gnome-shell
<Tommeh> tweak-tool isn't changing anything either :/
<mvo> aquarius: are you still on the sytem that has this problme, what does apt-get install -f -o Debug::pkgProblemResolver=true say?
<aquarius> mvo, well... I installed default-jre-headless manually. I'll try removing it again :)
<mvo> aquarius: you sure nothing else provided default-jre-headless or java5-runtime-headless ?
<mvo> ok
<mvo> seb128: I will do the three desktop reviews now
<seb128> mvo, \o/
<aquarius> mvo, done. http://paste.ubuntu.com/654325/ So as you can see, jetty depends on those packages; I don't have either of those packages; apt doesn't seem to care :)
<seb128> mvo, thanks
<mvo> aquarius: could you pastebin "aptitude show default-jre-headless java5-runtime-headless
<mvo> " please?
<mvo> seb128: any thought on the libwnck API patch?
<seb128> mvo, vuntz reviewed it upstream and seemed mostly fine with it, he's just thiking about the naming for 2 weeks
<mvo> seb128: it looks ok, but that is something that really should be upstream
<seb128> mvo, let's try to ping him once again
<seb128> vuntz, ^
<mvo> seb128: great, thanks
<seb128> if he doesn't reply let's upload it with ubuntu_ namespaced functions
<mvo> fair enough
<mvo> aquarius: I suspect something provides it, we just need to figure out what :)
<vuntz> seb128: Trevinho and I discussed the patch and agreed on naming, he'll update the patch soon
<seb128> vuntz, \o/
<seb128> vuntz, thanks
<seb128> vuntz, can we upload once the naming is fixing? ;-)
<aquarius> mvo, aaaaaah. java5-runtime-headless is provided by sun-java6-jre
<seb128> vuntz, not that we don't like you but if it takes another month it's blocking other things ;-)
<mvo> aquarius: great, mysery solved and remember â¦ apt is never wrong  ;)
<vuntz> seb128: sure
<seb128> vuntz, thanks
<vuntz> seb128: I intend to do a release after this patch anyway
<aquarius> but default-runtime-headless puts a /usr/lib/jvm/default-java symlink in place, and sun-java6-jre doesn't. So that's basically some sort of packaging bug where people are depending on something that doesn't do everything it shoudl :)
<mvo> (except for when it is of course)
<aquarius> mvo, ah, either apt or you are never wrong ;)
<seb128> mvo, it's twice in 2 days that you say that apt is never wrong and that you are right ;-)
<aquarius> mvo, cheers!
<mvo> aquarius: correct, if sun-java5 does not actually provide java5-runtime-headless (because $stuff is missing) then thats broken and it should not do that
<mvo> yw
<seb128> vuntz, do you have GNOME 3.1 on your opensuse btw? is vinagre working fine and listing other protocols that vnc?
<jbicha> seb128: vinagre 3.1.4 magically works in Rawhide, but they just built through the implicit-function warnings
<seb128> jbicha, btw seahorse-plugins seems deprecated, it didn't get any tarball since 2.32 and the gpg agent etc got moved to gnome-keyring
<seb128> jbicha, I'm still not sure why we need the new lib?
<seb128> jbicha, yeah, I'm asking vuntz about vinagre because opensuse has a toolchain similar to ours which use --as-needed as well
<seb128> which I'm wondering is the issue
<vuntz> seb128: I only have vnc, indeed
<jbicha> if we had the new lib, seahorse-plugins does have some unique capability I believe but if upstream won't bother making a release
<jbicha> then it doesn't need us spending too much time getting it to work
<seb128> jbicha, like what? they didn't have a commit since february in git
<vuntz> seb128: nautilus integration for gpg is what's left in seahorse-plugins
<seb128> vuntz, can you confirm that the the rdp and ssh .so are installed in your vinagre? just to be sure
<vuntz> seb128: yes, they're here
<seb128> ok, so same issue than us and jbicha says it works on fedora
<seb128> I've suspision it's a --as-needed thing
<seb128> vuntz, thanks for the seahorse comment
<seb128> jbicha, ^ seems like that could stay in universe
<seb128> well in any case it's on my list of priority to maintain ;-)
<jbicha> yeah, seahorse-plugins should get demoted from main
<vuntz> seb128: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=653558 already mentioned openSUSE was also affected ;-)
<jbicha> how does main demotion work?
<ubot2> Gnome bug 653558 in general "Unable to connect to RDP or SSH" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<seb128> jbicha, if nothing depends on it, it will show in component mismatch and be demoted
<seb128> vuntz, oh, right ;-)
<jbicha> I think seahorse-plugins also has a gedit plugin
<vuntz> jbicha: it wasn't ported to GNOME 3, so won't work
<jbicha> oh ok
<vuntz> iirc, only the nautilus bits still work
<seb128> I've to admit I'm annoyed by the current vinagre maintainer who just decide to let the build broken until he lands a day a refactoring ;-)
<seb128> mvo, while you are in the mood, https://code.launchpad.net/~jbicha/ubuntu/oneiric/gnome-power-manager/drop-override/+merge/69615
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> mvo, thanks for the sponsoring work! ;-)
<mvo> looking now
<seb128> mvo, did I told you before that we need to get ride of update-notifier? ;-)
<seb128> mvo, (looking to what keep synaptic on the CD still and guess what... ;-)
<seb128> well I guess switching update-notifier to do the apt-get update using aptdaemon would be easy as well
<mvo> seb128: yeah
<xclaesse> is it known that rhythmbox's window handling is totally broken under gnome-shell?
<seb128> xclaesse, not known
<seb128> well not by us at least, maybe the gnome-shell guys know about it
<xclaesse> when I click close X, window stay, but then it is not in overview
<xclaesse> seems to be caused by ubuntu patch
<xclaesse> was already like that on natty+gnome3ppa, still the same on oneiric
<xclaesse> empathy had similar issues actually
<xclaesse> but we fixed it
<xclaesse> afaik rb's window does a gtk_window_iconify()
<xclaesse> but that won't work correctly on gnome-shell
<seb128> could be a rb issue then
<seb128> it might be worth mentioning to the #rhythmbox guys
<xclaesse> it must do gtk_window_hide()
<xclaesse> gtk_widget_hide() even
<seb128> mvo, I'm lazy to checkout the update-manager vcs but can you python-aptdaemon-gtk -> python-aptdaemon.gtk3widgets
<seb128> mvo, in the control Depends
<xclaesse> seb128, I had reported it upstream a long time ago already, they said it's ubuntu's fault
<xclaesse> seb128, https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=648114
<ubot2> Gnome bug 648114 in general "Window does not always close when running gnome-shell" [Normal,Resolved: notgnome]
<xclaesse> seb128, oh actually it is in lp now: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/rhythmbox/+bug/780747
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 780747 in rhythmbox "Window does not always close when running gnome-shell" [Undecided,New]
<mvo> seb128: k
<seb128> mvo, thanks!
<seb128> xclaesse, ok, dunno about that, the patch is there to do what you want basically, not exit when closed while playing (which is what upstream does)
<seb128> didrocks added it
<seb128> xclaesse, if we drop it closing rb would exit it
<didrocks> in lucid IIRC
<xclaesse> seb128, right, I like the behaviour, the problem is the way it's done
<xclaesse> gtk_window_iconify() won't work
<xclaesse> since there is nowhere it will minimize
<seb128> didn't you say it minimize the the messaging bar at the bottom of the overview?
 * xclaesse should read ubuntu's patch and upstream code to see exactly how this works
<seb128> there is no gtk_window_iconify call in that patch
<xclaesse> seb128, I remember that was upstream before
<xclaesse> since empathy actually copied that code
<seb128> well the patch you are talking about doesn't use it
<xclaesse> seb128, is there a way to see ubuntu patch, other than apt-get source?
<xclaesse> git branch?
<seb128> xclaesse, https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/rhythmbox/ubuntu
<xclaesse> ah, ofcourse, bzr :)
<chrisccoulson> i guess the issue is that rb_shell_set_visibility calls gtk_window_iconify ;)
<xclaesse> chrisccoulson, yep
<xclaesse> just saw that
<xclaesse> that method is full of hacks
<seb128> chrisccoulson, how is the gnome-keyring update going? ;-)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, hey btw, how are you? I'm not sure if I said hi today ;-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, i'm good thanks
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i need to do the MIR ;)
<chrisccoulson> will do that this morning
<seb128> heh
<chrisccoulson> currently doing new firefox and tbird beta builds
<seb128> it's midday, the morning is over :p
<chrisccoulson> lol
<chrisccoulson> not for me ;)
<seb128> ;-)
<chrisccoulson> i need to automate this. i have so many branches to touch when i do a release, each with pretty much the same stuff in :/
<xclaesse> seb128, I'm a bit noob to packaging... I've fetched rb from bzr, now how do I edit the patch and rebuild the package?
<xclaesse> seb128, it should not use rb_shell_set_visibility() anymore, that's dead code in upstream
<xclaesse> a plain gtk_widget_hide() should work
<seb128> xclaesse, bzr get lp:~ubuntu-desktop/rhythmbox/ubuntu
<seb128> cd ubuntu
<seb128> bzr bd-do
<seb128> quilt push the_path_to_edit
<seb128> gedit the source
<seb128> quilt refresh
<seb128> quilt pop
<seb128> exit 0
<seb128> bzr bd
<seb128> basically
<xclaesse> seb128, thanks, let's try
<xclaesse> seb128, starting well... bzr: ERROR: unknown command "bd-do"
<xclaesse> seb128, any howto I could use?
<seb128> install bzr-builddeb
<seb128> xclaesse, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Bzr
<xclaesse> seb128, argh, can't build rb:  libgnome-media-profiles-dev : DÃ©pend: libgnome-media-profiles-3.0-0 (= 2.91.2-4) mais 3.0.0-0ubuntu1~build1 devra Ãªtre installÃ©
<xclaesse> I get that when doing apt-get build-dep rhythmbox
<seb128> xclaesse, what ubuntu version?
<xclaesse> seb128, oneiric
<seb128> try to sudo apt-get install libgnome-media-profiles-dev libgnome-media-profiles-3.0-0
<seb128> what does it say?
<xclaesse> 2s, running upgrade atm
<xclaesse> seb128, btw that patch leaks window
<xclaesse> g_object_get() gives a new ref afaik, so a g_object_unref() is missing
<xclaesse> not a big issue, since that window will live until rb leaves anyway
<xclaesse> seb128, The following packages have unmet dependencies:
<xclaesse>  libgnome-media-profiles-dev : Depends: libgnome-media-profiles-3.0-0 (= 2.91.2-4) but 3.0.0-0ubuntu1~build1 is to be installed
<xclaesse> seb128, that's what I get with your comment
<xclaesse> and after an apt-get update/upgrade
<seb128> hum
<seb128> try to sudo apt-get install libgnome-media-profiles-dev/oneiric libgnome-media-profiles-3.0-0/oneiric
<seb128> seems like you have a ppa version installed
<xclaesse> seb128, oh right, I've the one from gnome3 ppa on natty
<xclaesse> I did upgrade to oneiric
<seb128> it's weird, oneiric should be newer
<xclaesse> seb128, good, that fixed the issue, thanks :)
<seb128> yw
<ricotz> hi, jfyi, rb dropped the gnome-media-profiles dependency
<ricotz> seb128, hi, i made a working rb tarball lately
<seb128> great
<ricotz> perhaps it is worth looking at -- https://launchpad.net/~ricotz/+archive/staging/+files/rhythmbox_2.90.1%7Egit20110724.f8fe07a7-0ubuntu1%7E11.10%7Ericotz0.dsc
<ricotz> could be renamed to fit the current version string though
<xclaesse> argh, bzr bd failed at the end to sign the debs :(
<xclaesse> of course can't sign with maintainer's keys (:
<xclaesse> there is an option to not sign?
<xclaesse> seb128, ricotz ^
<seb128> xclaesse, it didn't fail
<seb128> xclaesse, you have your deb in build-area
<seb128> it's just the signing which failed
<geser> xclaesse: bzr bd -- -us -uc
<xclaesse> ahh, wonderful :)
<xclaesse> seb128, thx
<seb128> ricotz, one day you should really start asking for sponsoring and get your stuff in Ubuntu proper
<xclaesse> geser, guess options after -- are fwd to dpkg-buildpackage?
<seb128> ricotz, that would avoid having users getting a broken oneiric upgrade because the ppa has newer versions than oneiric
<geser> yes
<seb128> ricotz, it would also avoid having the work done a second time by somebody who will submit to the distro when you already did the work on your side
<ricotz> seb128, oh?, i didnt touch gnome-media-profiles
<ricotz> and the rhythmbox snapshot was just testing, moch said there would be a release soon
<seb128> ricotz, ok, seems it's robert_ancell, sorry for this one, that still stand for ie. your rhythmbox update
<ricotz> but currently the rb git master is broken due gcc warn-error stuff
<xclaesse> seb128, ok my modified patch works nicely, what's the best way to get it into ubuntu?
<xclaesse> and reviewed by you or didrocks of course
<xclaesse> (did not test on unity though, probably you'll have to verify that before uploading)
<xclaesse> but that should be safe, tbh
<seb128> xclaesse, attach it to the bug and subscribe ubuntu-sponsors
<seb128> ricotz, turn off Werror?
<ricotz> seb128, i know, still this needs to be fixed upstream
<xclaesse> seb128, done: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/rhythmbox/+bug/780747
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 780747 in rhythmbox "Window does not always close when running gnome-shell" [Undecided,New]
<seb128> xclaesse, thanks
<xclaesse> yw
<xclaesse> I can again drop that suff called banshee \o/
<mvo> didrocks: I guess thats right, I'm not 100% nowdays as we use the actionbar for the "do you want to add to unity" actionbar too, tremolux will know for ysure
<didrocks> mvo: indeed, let's wait for him on that then. (I don't know why you don't have the actionbar showing in the detail view without it, I can't get it in oneconf without that)
<bullgard4_> I would like reporting an error in GNOME 2 under Natty: The screen freezes with some artifacts, but I can recover by toggling to a virtual console. What package should I associate my error report to in Launchpad?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, http://hg.mozilla.org/releases/comm-beta/rev/f67f7a7027a7
<chrisccoulson> that will be in the next beta i upload (probably monday)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: excellent! I'm eager to test it :)
<chrisccoulson> cool :)
<chrisccoulson> i've already uploaded it to the thunderbird-next PPA
<chrisccoulson> although nothing for oneiric ;)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: only the oneiric one is contaminated right now :)
<ricotz> chrisccoulson, could you upload it for oneiric too then? ;)
<chrisccoulson> ricotz, i will do once upstream have actually released the new beta
<ricotz> i mean to the ppa
<chrisccoulson> ricotz, not yet. i've only uploaded it to the PPA because i can disable publishing until it's actually released
<chrisccoulson> so it's fairly pointless for me to upload the oneiric build to 2 places
<ricotz> ok, i see
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, would you be able to take a look at bug 817995? :)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 817995 in p11-kit "[MIR] p11-kit" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/817995
<ricotz> chrisccoulson, are there thunderbird packaging difference between natty and oneiric?
<ricotz> i am tempted to build it locally then
<chrisccoulson> ricotz, yeah
<chrisccoulson> there's no messaging menu integration in the natty packages
<chrisccoulson> and the oneiric packages also have some patches which we are going to be using for eds contacts integration
<chrisccoulson> i can't remember what else is different ;)
<ricotz> mhh, ok
 * mterry is reviewing jbicha's 2nd suggest-minissdpd branch now
<ricotz> chrisccoulson, hopefully my tmpfs is big enough for a thunderbird build :P
<chrisccoulson> ricotz, how big is it?
<ricotz> 6gb
<chrisccoulson> yeah, should be ok
<ricotz> good :)
<seb128> ricotz, can you open a sponsoring request for your rb update?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, if you do the gnome-keyring update just upload, don't wait on the mir
 * mterry sits down and does some MIRs
<seb128> chrisccoulson, it will dep wait until the mir is reviewed but things tend to get some actions once they are actually blocking
<chrisccoulson> seb128, ok. i'm just about ready to upload that
<seb128> \o/
<ricotz> seb128, i would need to document the changes and change the version-string
<seb128> ricotz, that's fine you can do it! ;-)
<ricotz> is a xz-tarball ok?
<seb128> better if .bz2
<seb128> we didn't try .xz yet
<ricotz> it isnt exactly this commit stated in the version, i added my patch which got committed later after the "gcc breaking"-commits
<ricotz> the ppa builder are already ok with it
<ricotz> i am only using xz since they are smaller ;)
<ricotz> chrisccoulson, :(
<ricotz> ../coreconf/config.mk:71: ../coreconf/Linux3.0.mk: No such file or directory
<ricotz> /usr/bin/make -j1: *** No rule to make target ../coreconf/Linux3.0.mk.  Stop.
<ricotz> i used the plain natty package from the ppa
<chrisccoulson> ricotz, oh, yeah
<chrisccoulson> ricotz, just copy build-tree/mozilla/security/coreconf/Linux2.6.mk to Linux3.0.mk for now
<chrisccoulson> i guess i will fix that properly at some point ;)
<ricotz> alright
<ricotz> i hope the next run will do ;)
<chrisccoulson> ricotz, oh, it's already fixed in nss: https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=661609
<seb128> kenvandine, hey
<ubot2> Mozilla bug 661609 in Build "Linux3.0.mk missing in security/coreconf for upcoming 3.0 kernel" [Normal,Resolved: fixed]
<chrisccoulson> i should probably take that patch, as it's a pain for me as well
<seb128> kenvandine, eds upstream seems to have fixed your issues in git today
<kenvandine> seb128, more?
<kenvandine> great
 * kenvandine goes to look
<seb128> kenvandine, yeah, the new issue you got yesterday
<seb128> kenvandine, http://git.gnome.org/browse/evolution-data-server/commit/?id=3326a82d03a2cb2799bae9a77e6ca20c601efdef
<jbicha> mvo: you pushed transmission 2.33 today, right? I don't see the branch as having been merged in though
<ricotz> chrisccoulson, ok, i just added "cp $(DEB_SRCDIR)/mozilla/security/coreconf/Linux2.6.mk $(DEB_SRCDIR)/mozilla/security/coreconf/Linux3.0.mk" to pre-build in rules
<mvo> jbicha: indeed, let me check
<Beret> I found a bug where if you make an application visible on all desktops and it happens to sit where a unity lens would appear, the lens goes behind the application
<Beret> anyone happen to know if that's been reported already off hand?
<seb128> Beret, hi, not that I know about
<dobey> mvo: ping
<seb128> poor mvo
<seb128> he keeps being pinged today ;-)
<mvo> hey dobey
<mvo> seb128: and a segfault in apt that makes me crzay
<mvo> I trade 5 pi(n)gs for a fix!
<seb128> lol
<seb128> mvo, easy trade for a vegetarian :p
<mvo> lol
<dobey> mvo: hey. i was looking at the atpdaemon.client module yesterday, but i don't see any way to simply check what version of a package is installed with it. is there no way to do that?
<mvo> dobey: the aptdaemon stuff is mostly about acting on the pkgs in some way, for just querying, the easiest way is "import apt; cache=apt.Cache(); cache["2vcard"].is_installed or pkg=cache["apt"]; pkg.candidate.version"
<mvo> dobey: python, right? that is what you need?
<mvo> http://apt.alioth.debian.org/python-apt-doc/index.html
<mvo> for the full API docs
<dobey> mvo: yes. but was hoping to use a single api
<mvo> dobey: ok, what information do you want to query exactly? I guess we can extend the aptdaemon.client api
<dobey> mvo: hrmm, i think there was also no way to query if a repository is already added, and whether it is enabled
<dobey> mvo: basically, i don't see any sort of query API in aptdaemon at all :)
<dobey> mvo: i guess ideally, it makes sense to me for python-apt and python-aptdaemon to just be merged :)
<cyphermox> chrisccoulson: how's your bluetooth? I saw you had enabled hci2hid in bluez, but it seems like that's failing on my system, my dongle gets switched but doesn't seem to like it
<mvo> dobey: I will discuss this with glatzor, so far the split was intentional, one API to query, one to "act"
<mvo> dobey: for what component is this?
<dobey> mvo: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-o-ubuntuone-agile-delivery-of-u1
<mvo> thx
<mvo> this is a bit lame I admit, but couldn't you just trigger the install and catch the exception that gets triggered if its already insatlled?
<dobey> mvo: so ubuntuone-installer. need to check that we're installed, before installing
<dobey> mvo: no. the design is to just launch the control panel if we're already installed. and doing the install would require user entering password N times to do that admin stuff :-/
<mvo> dobey: you could use a simulate transaction for this, but like I said, a bit lame
<dobey> mvo: i'm not disagreeing with you. i'm just doing what i have to do.
<mvo> but my suggestion for now would be python-apt as its well documented and most suitable for this
<dobey> yeah. i don't have much choice :)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, oh, i've just noticed here that the soname for libgcr-3 changed downwards in the latest gnome-keyring :/
<kenvandine> seb128, yay... ebook gir works now!  at least for my minimal example
<kenvandine> :)
<chrisccoulson> (libgcr-3.so.1 => libgcr-3.so.0)
<kenvandine> i can search for contacts and print the vcard
<kenvandine> but now BigWhale is out of town... :(
<seb128> chrisccoulson, do you have the commit that did that handy?
<seb128> kenvandine, great that it's fixed ;-)
<seb128> kenvandine, do you know if that's normal we didn't get indicators stack update this week? what about libindicate-gtk on gtk3?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, i guess it's this one - http://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-keyring/commit/configure.ac?id=b6928fd48a08f380fae02d0d2ea39a361c697825
<kenvandine> it is normal, there wasn't a milestone for this week
<kenvandine> indicator-sound is in the works
<kenvandine> indicator-session might still come
<kenvandine> and i need to look at libindicate again
<seb128> kenvandine, the a3 freeze is on monday
<seb128> kenvandine, we have a w.i for libindicate for a3, should we move it...?
<kenvandine> not yet
<kenvandine> i would like to try to get it done today
<seb128> ok
<kenvandine> i really want that in a3
<kenvandine> but i have other stuff i want done for a3 too :)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I forgot that you were on #gnome-hackers...great ;-)
<DBO> :( lightdm stopped working after upgrade
<seb128> chrisccoulson, can you just distro patch that commit out?
<seb128> DBO, do you have lightdm-gtk-greeter installed?
<DBO> checking
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, i can distro-patch that. no symbols have actually been removed
<DBO> just curious
<DBO> should I?
<seb128> DBO, yes
<DBO> odd no...
<DBO> lemme test again
<DBO> brb
<DBO> thanks seb128
<seb128> DBO, you're welcome
<seb128> DBO, you probably caught an update at the wrong time or use a mirror lagging behind
<seb128> DBO, we got it fixed yesterday
 * didrocks sees the growing MIR number to reviewâ¦ this will never ever finish?
<seb128> didrocks, speaking of which can you promote the ones mterry acked?
<didrocks> mterry: do you have the list handy?
<seb128> didrocks, there was the upnp things for torrent recently and gnome-online-account and librest today
<seb128> well at least those
<didrocks> "upnp things" isn't a package :)
<seb128> http://pad.lv/813308 and http://pad.lv/813318
<didrocks> thanks
<seb128> (copying the etherpad)
<seb128> didrocks, thank you ;-)
<didrocks> yw, doing now
<didrocks> mterry: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=633643, there seems to be a quite extensive discussion on the licence, I'm waiting on it to end then
<ubot2> Debian bug 633643 in src:libnatpmp "libnatpmp: missing license in copyright file" [Serious,Open]
<didrocks> m4n1sh: next package which new tarball packaged should fix it
<didrocks> mterry: ^^
<didrocks> sorry m4n1sh :)
<mterry> didrocks, :)
<didrocks> jbicha: care of packaging the new one?
<ricotz> chrisccoulson, 6gb werent enough :\
<chrisccoulson> ricotz, oh? that surprises me
<chrisccoulson> i know the build tree is large, but i didn't think it was that big ;)
<ricotz> i was building in a pbuilder chroot
<jbicha> didrocks: anything important in the French I should know?
<ricotz> so it might only get 5gb
<ricotz> chrisccoulson, it run out of space while building the thunderbird-dbg package ;)
<didrocks> jbicha: they relicenced in BSD, so you should change it to that licence, and rerun by mterry with it, please :)
<chrisccoulson> ricotz, oh, that doesn't surprise me
<didrocks> jbicha: basically, licencecheck -r * to ensure the licence change, and list that in debian/copyright
<didrocks> jbicha: mterry: all the other are promoted
<ricotz> seb128, i am getting to the rb package, was this patch considered for inclusion yet? -- https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/rhythmbox/+bug/780747
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 780747 in rhythmbox "Window does not always close when running gnome-shell" [Undecided,New]
<seb128> ricotz, yes, please include it in the update
<seb128> cyphermox: hey
<seb128> cyphermox: do you still plan to update libgdata?
<cyphermox> hey seb128
<cyphermox> yeah
<seb128> ok
<cyphermox> I was still waiting for the mir
<seb128> do it the other way around
<seb128> upload, it will upload to raise the mir priority ;-)
<seb128> once we have things depwaiting on it
<cyphermox> alright
<cyphermox> seems like I might have to re-do it now though, but it's no big deal
<cyphermox> (I seem to not have the directory I did my work in)
<seb128> oh, ok
<seb128> no hurry, whenever you have time
<cyphermox> ah, won't take much time. I'll start now
<jbicha> my bzr merge-upstream is broken :-(
<jbicha> maybe it's just this watch file & the upstream web server that confuses it
<chrisccoulson> seb128, http://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-keyring/commit/gcr/gcr-collection-model.h?id=7b5e4e3c1e8cf94a03f1bd21eacb53991b32f6c6
<chrisccoulson> without an soname change :(
<seb128> chrisccoulson, guess it's time for another ping to stefw ;-)
<chrisccoulson> heh
<seb128> do we use those function anywhere?
<seb128> the number of rdepends for that lib is low I think
<chrisccoulson> seb128, empathy
<chrisccoulson> not sure if it uses any of those symbols though
<chrisccoulson> i could just install it and see ;)
<seb128> yeah, please do it ;-)
<seb128> but still ping stefw about it
<ricotz> seb128, rb done
<seb128> ricotz, thanks, where? ;-)
<ricotz> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/rhythmbox/+bug/780747
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 780747 in rhythmbox "Window does not always close when running gnome-shell" [Undecided,New]
<chrisccoulson> seb128, no, it doesn't use any of those symbols
<chrisccoulson> so they're not used anywhere
<seb128> still worth mentioning to upstream ;-)
<jbicha> didrocks: I left a comment on the Debian bug, there's still 1 file under the other license
<didrocks> jbicha: ok, thanks for the head's up!
<hallyn> oneiric install did not go well, so I manually did 'apt-get install ubuntu-desktop'.  But now I can' tfind that background that cycles around space pictures.  Anyone know waht package that is in?
<Daviey> hallyn: Sounds like a release critical bug. :)
<hallyn> Daviey: I thought cjwatson had mentioned knowing about it
<Daviey> hallyn: should be in screensaver-default-images
<Daviey> /usr/share/backgrounds/space-*.jpg
<jbicha> hallyn: upstream deleted them: http://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-backgrounds/commit/?id=41c743054269a4aa20aab2862258f4bc9e41b698
<hallyn> jbicha: I'm going to cry
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, so, i'm missing something with gnome-keyring
<chrisccoulson> i get "this connection is untrusted" errors with empathy now
<seb128> bug or feature?
<seb128> is the connection really untrusted?
<cyphermox> chrisccoulson: gtalk? it seemed to be giving me a self-signed certificate today
<chrisccoulson> cyphermox, i'm getting it with everything
<chrisccoulson> it's related to the gnome-keyring update i'm testing
<chrisccoulson> mterry, libsigsegv isn't a very reassuring name for a package ;)
<cyphermox> ok
<seb128> cyphermox, kenvandine: btw gnome-online-accounts got promoted and g-c-c built with it
<cyphermox> cool
<seb128> you can build evolution, gwibber or whatever needs it with it
<cyphermox> but g-o-a requires libgdata
<cyphermox> I mean
<cyphermox> e-d-s with goa needs libgdata and liboauth :)
<seb128> ok
<kenvandine> seb128, i'll play with that
<kenvandine> thx
 * kenvandine heads out for some food, bbiab
<cyphermox> seb128: I won't be able to upload libgdata; it's in core only (has been since natty); should that be changed?
<seb128> cyphermox: did you plan by then to update libsoup or started on it as well? I'm not sure but I think you said you were doing it
<cyphermox> i didn't put it in the list
<cyphermox> but I was going to do that after, back then
<seb128> cyphermox: yes it should, can you drop an email to cjwatson? I can upload the current version for you for today
<cyphermox> ok
<cyphermox> just testing the build now; but I still had my code after all
<seb128> great
<geser> does indicator-multiload work for someone? all I see looks like the "missing icon"
<bigon> an idea about this? https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/811805
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 811805 in gdm "GDM spawn a metacity process that is not terminated when a user login" [Undecided,New]
<cyphermox> seb128: for some reason the debian-dir-only branch for libgdata always seems to think it's a native package
<seb128> cyphermox: is that a source v1 package?
<cyphermox> seb128: I can force it not to by switching to format 3.0; but I don't understand why it otherwise
<cyphermox> yeah
<seb128> source v1 only do tar.gz orig
<cyphermox> ah
<cyphermox> never thought this could be it :)
<cyphermox> thanks!
<seb128> you're welcome ;-)
<seb128> bigon, no idea no
<didrocks> TypeError: __init__() takes at least 3 arguments (3 given)
<didrocks> hum, is it python wanting to mess with me today? :)
<seb128> didrocks, well if it can't troll you on friday... ;-)
<didrocks> hum, on friday evening even? ;)
<seb128> indeed
<seb128> ;-)
<didrocks> python is mean then! :)
<davmor2> didrocks: it's not mean it's misunderstood
<seb128> didrocks, is that python or g-i?
<mterry> chrisccoulson, libsigsegv is job security
<cyphermox> mterry: so what does libsigsegv do besides misusing memory?
<cyphermox> :)
<tremolux> didrocks: heyo! can I bug you on this lively Friday evening for a quick question about your branch lp:~didrocks/software-center/fix-label-set ?
<tremolux> didrocks: I wonder if you have a specific condition that you need that change for
<mterry> cyphermox, it's all about cross-platform handling of seg faults cleanly.  If I recall, the new gawk pulls it in, oddly
<tremolux> didrocks: 'cuz it has a regression for the add-to-launcher feature
<tremolux> didrocks: lively -> lovely
<cyphermox> mterry: cool
<cyphermox> wouldn't that interfere with apport if it traps the segfaults, etc. ?
<didrocks> tremolux: yeah, for oneconf, basically, it seems I need that to not have it on the detail view
<mterry> cyphermox, I don't know; probably depends on what gawk does when it handles its own.  I don't think we get that many reports from gawk anyway.  ;)
<didrocks> (the "show/hide technical items")
<cyphermox> nah :)
<tremolux> didrocks: yeah, that should be showing there, but there must be a codepath in OneConf that shows it sounds like
<tremolux> didrocks: that *shouldn't* be showing there (jeez) :p
<didrocks> tremolux: indeed, but I can't find in softwarepane what makes that or not
<didrocks> tremolux: seems really similar to me
<didrocks> tremolux: I call that function and I'm in the same pane configuration (with the same indexes)
 * ricotz still hopes for a rhythmbox upload :P
<tremolux> didrocks: so the bug is that you are adding a panel with the oneconf view, and the "show/hide technical items" appears?
<kenvandine> damn it's hot outside!  101F...
<didrocks> tremolux: indeed, the oneconf pane is pretty similar to "available software one"
<didrocks> so there is an applist
<didrocks> and a detail view
<didrocks> the "show/hide technical items" appears in the detail_view
<tremolux> didrocks: ok, how about I run oneconf trunk and test?
<tremolux> didrocks: seems we'll need to tweak that bit of logic a bit more
<didrocks> tremolux: indeed, I have some bzr issues to commit, one secâ¦
<didrocks> grrr, not sure what happens, it really doesn't want, rebranch and replying the latest diff
<tremolux> didrocks: seems something's trying to tell you to start your weekend finally ;)
<didrocks> tremolux: I guess so :)
<didrocks> hum, bzr patch doesn't take from the other branch the renaming :/
<tremolux> didrocks: bleh
<didrocks> grrr, it really doesn't wantâ¦
<Sweetshark> jasoncwarner_: http://standardsandfreedom.net/index.php/2011/07/29/a-word-of-thanks/ <- now its official official
<owais> Hey guys, anyone knows anything about WebKitGtk DOM access? Looks functions like GetElementById etc are not introspected in the Gir files. Any Idea when this will be fixed or HOW? or should I ask in #Motu?
<didrocks> tremolux: ok, I pushed to latest trunk (recreating a new branch and having to report everything manually :/)
<didrocks> tremolux: I think we will maybe look at it on Monday, other than that, everything in OneConf is ported to the new SSO, new server side, and new s-c gtk2!
<Sweetshark> jasoncwarner_: and http://lists.oasis-open.org/archives/office/201107/msg00072.html
<cyphermox> seb128: for libgdata, I merge, you upload?
<tremolux> didrocks: nice!!  \o/
<tremolux> didrocks: I'll take a look at it today to see if I can fix up that panel problem
<didrocks> tremolux: hum, you will need some data with other computers :-)
<tremolux> didrocks: ah ah
<didrocks> tremolux: there is an easy way to fake that actually, but you need to run the server by hand in trunk, so maybe on Monday?
<tremolux> didrocks: ok, well it's not a blocker, correct? so we can take care of it next week
<didrocks> tremolux: right
<tremolux> didrocks: ok, sounds good  :)
<tremolux> didrocks: have a great weekend!
<didrocks> tremolux: thanks, you too!
 * tremolux runs for some lunch
<jcastro> heya didrocks
<jcastro> didrocks: remember how we went through all those quicklists at UDS?
<didrocks> jcastro: yeah!
<jcastro> are we keeping track of progress?
<didrocks> jcastro: there is a blueprint of that and cdbs seems to tackle some, but there is still a lot to doâ¦
<didrocks> good weekend everyone
<seb128> cyphermox: yeah, feel free to merge, I will review and upload next week (it's friday evening there and I'm calling it a week, no hurry anyway since it will be depwaiting on a mir review)
<fhd> Hi. I'm setting up a system for Ubuntu development, so I installed the latest daily build of oneiric. There is for some reason no /etc/X11/xorg.conf - how can I add more resolutions?
<charlie-tca> Hasn't been an xorg.conf for many releases now. Usually, you can create one and it will be used
<fhd> charlie-tca: Oh, never noticed. Guess it's been a while since my solution wasn't recognised correctly.
<charlie-tca> at least three releases now without one
<fhd> charlie-tca: Can I somehow dump the default/current configuration to xorg.conf so I don't break anything else?
<charlie-tca> I don't know how to do it
<charlie-tca> If you have an nvidia card, you can install the hardware drivers and it will create the xorg.conf file.
<fhd> charlie-tca: plain old intel
<charlie-tca> Otherwise, it's kind of a guessing game
<maxb> Although, you don't need to write a full xorg.conf, afaik - X still seems to autodetect bits you don't override
<charlie-tca> This might help - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/X/KernelModeSetting
<charlie-tca> It at least gives some of xorg.conf
<fhd> charlie-tca: Thanks, I'll take a look
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-07-30
<kenvandine> jasoncwarner_, i've gotten gwibber so it displays all the tiles almost instantly once the view is shown
<kenvandine> it still takes a couple seconds to open the window, which is annoying me
<kenvandine> but it is loading the cached data no so no waiting to talk to the backend on startup
<kenvandine> :)
<jasoncwarner_> i saw the tweet... :)
<jasoncwarner_> haven't tried it just yet...hit a new account creation bug today (had to rebuild my system two days ago)
<jasoncwarner_> and when I was trying to create my account using messaging menu (or whatever they are calling it now), I got a compiz bug...
<kenvandine> ugh
<kenvandine> i am going to try to squeeze in another feature or 2 tonight
<kenvandine> then upload a snapshot to oneiric before i go to bed
<jasoncwarner_> kenvandine: very cool....can't wait to play with it again! btw...isn't it friday night for you ;)
<jasoncwarner_> shouldn't you be getting some sleep!
<kenvandine> yup
<kenvandine> after feature freeze :)
<kenvandine> i'll sleep then
<jasoncwarner_> kenvandine: btw...this is the bug I'm seeing in gwibber new accounts creation
<jasoncwarner_> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gwibber/+bug/817745
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 817745 in gwibber "gwibber-accounts crashed with TypeError in __init__(): Gtk.Window.set_icon_from_file() argument 1 must be string, not None" [Undecided,New]
<kenvandine> oh... you got that too!
<kenvandine> damn... you have a left over un-managed python file...
<kenvandine> locate accounts.pyc
<kenvandine> what does that return?
<kenvandine> actually
<kenvandine> sudo rm /usr/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/gwibber/accounts.pyc
<kenvandine> that will fix it
<jasoncwarner_> ok, I just did that...but I sitll get error? do I need to update again or something?
<kenvandine> same error?
<jasoncwarner_> maybe not
<jasoncwarner_> just looked in /var/crash and this is what I saw in gwibber file
<jasoncwarner_> SourcePackage: gwibber
<jasoncwarner_> Tags:  oneiric
<jasoncwarner_> Title: gwibber-accounts crashed with ImportError in __main__: cannot import name accounts
<jasoncwarner_> Uname: Linux 3.0.0-7-generic-pae i686
<jasoncwarner_> UpgradeStatus: No upgrade log present (probably fresh install)
<kenvandine> what is the time on that file?
<kenvandine> run gwibber-accounts in a term
<kenvandine> see what the output
<jasoncwarner_> kenvandine:
<jasoncwarner_> $ gwibber-accounts
<jasoncwarner_> Traceback (most recent call last):
<jasoncwarner_>   File "/usr/bin/gwibber-accounts", line 70, in <module>
<jasoncwarner_>     from gwibber import accounts
<jasoncwarner_> ImportError: cannot import name accounts
<kenvandine> ls /usr/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/gwibber/
<kenvandine> jasoncwarner_, ^^
<jasoncwarner_> kenvandine: $ ls /usr/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/gwibber/
<jasoncwarner_> actions.pyc  gwui.pyc      lib        pidgin.pyc       util.pyc
<jasoncwarner_> client.pyc   __init__.pyc  microblog  preferences.pyc
<kenvandine> sigh
<kenvandine> ls /usr/lib/pymodules/python2.7/gwibber/
<shan> I have installed ubuntu-server-10.04 and ubuntu desktop on it.
<shan> When I get the login screen it say mode not supported.  how do I change the resolution of the login screen?
<desrt> Method "CreateItem" with signature "a{sv}(oayay)b" on interface "org.freedesktop.Secret.Collection" doesn't exist
<desrt> anyone know anything about that?
<Santo> Is there an article somewhere called "Ubuntu Software Center for new PPA creators" or something like that? Because I'm finding it confusing to figure out things like.. (1) How do I show an icon? (2) How do I designate my app a "technical item" or not? (3) How is the displayed title determined? If that article doesn't exist and someone can point me in the right direction for answering those questions, I'll gladly write the article to hel
<Santo> p other newbs like me :)
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-07-31
<RAOF> Santo: All of those things are automatically determined from the contents of your package.
<RAOF> Santo: For the packages in the archive, the icons are grabbed from the .desktop file.  For packages in PPAs, I don't think anything grabs them.  Similarly, âtechnical itemsâ are generally âthings without desktop filesâ, but I don't think that applies to PPAs, either.
<Santo> RAOF: Thanks for the reply. I'm asking specifically about PPAs... so I take it from your answer that there is no way to currently fix these issues with PPAs?
<RAOF> I believe that to be the case, yes.
 * desrt ponders why he has so many gtk packages...
<desrt> gir, gail, examples, dev, doc, .. i can grok
<desrt> dbg... ya... okay
<desrt> udeb?
<desrt> ah.  i don't want these.
<RAOF> Heh.
<ricotz> micahg, cyphermox hello :)
<ricotz> cyphermox, could you look at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libsoup2.4/+bug/818569
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 818569 in libsoup2.4 "Sync libsoup2.4 2.34.3-1 (main) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,Invalid]
<ricotz> ah nevermind, misread the version :\
<micahg> hi ricotz, thanks for following up
<ricotz> micahg, i ignored that there are already development versions ;), i added a diff to the merge proposal
<ricotz> micahg, perhaps you like to take a look at this one https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/rhythmbox/+bug/780747
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 780747 in rhythmbox "Window does not always close when running gnome-shell" [Undecided,New]
<micahg> ricotz: sorry, I can't sponsor main or the desktop packageset
<ricotz> micahg, ok
<thefinn93> I'm planning on installing gnome 3 on my natty install
<thefinn93> anything I should know?
<thefinn93> i hear it's irreversable, which is fine because i'm gonna nuke my system prior to defcon anyway
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-07-23
<RAOF> Hm. indicator-datetime-service appears to have spawned hundreds of threads and has a VIRT size of 8.5GiB. That's odd :)
<lifeless> \o/
<pitti> Good morning
<RAOF> Howdie!
<didrocks> good morning
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<didrocks> hey hey chrisccoulson, how are you?
<chrisccoulson> hi didrocks, i'm good thanks. although, i feel like i've been hit by a bus this morning (too much sun this weekend)
<chrisccoulson> how are you?
<RAOF> pitti: How hard would it be for an apport package hook to take the core file apport has collected and strip off the top couple of frames to get the real cause?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: ahah, sun, not used to it, isn't it? :)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: I'm feeling good, making the gconf -> gsettings transition in gnome-control-center for unity settings
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, yeah, this was the first dry weekend for a while, so i made the most of it and destroyed our garden ;)
<pitti> RAOF: apport actually already does that for a few well-known cases (error messages in glib and libX11)
<RAOF> pitti: Hm. Because the X server already has a mechanism to dump core on crashes, but it calls abort() rather than dying with the signal that actually caused the problem.
<pitti> RAOF: hm, we have had a patch for that for years; did that broke again?
<pitti> i. e. that it re-raises the same signal that it caught
<RAOF> pitti: Yeah, we've got that; it's always seemed a bit flaky. There appear to be a lot of X crashes that don't trigger apport.
<pitti> RAOF: so in principle, a package hook can run whatever it wants on the already existing fields, such as Stacktrace and Core dump
<RAOF> I'm hoping to use the build-in "always dump me a core" stuff and then post-process; this way, the failure mode should be "the bug has an unuseful title" rather than "the bug doesn't get filed"
<pitti> RAOF: the current unwinding logic is in apport/report.py, _gen_stacktrace_top() FYI
<pitti> but I guess that's not doing what you need ATM
<RAOF> It's probably pretty close.
<pitti> RAOF: so what is the actual problem? X.org doesn't dump core, or the core dumps are useless?
<RAOF> X.org doesn't dump core.
<pitti> but then apport won't help you
<RAOF> X.org doesn't drop core *with our patch*
<RAOF> (Sometimes!)
<RAOF> There's an upstream mechanism to get it to dump core on crashes, though.
<pitti> i. e. we should use that instead of our "re-raise" patch?
<RAOF> I'm hopingÂ¹ that will be more reliable, and then I can post-process the core we get to get the right signal out of it for the bug title.
<RAOF> Â¹: For values of "hoping" which include "am modifying some drivers to SIGSEGV to see if our existing stuff catches it and test".
<RAOF> Yeah, that's it. Use the upstream support instead of our re-raise patch.
<pitti> RAOF: does that do some manual black magic to generate a core file, or just signal-exists properly, so that the kernel writes it?
<RAOF> Signal exits properly.
<pitti> in the latter case, apport will just work, as it is a core dump handler
<pitti> *phew*
<RAOF> Yeah.
<pitti> so yes, this sounds like the proper upstream replacement for our patch
<RAOF> It calls abort(), so it'll not be obvious what signal actually killed the server.
<pitti> RAOF: the hook can set report['Title'] and/or a DuplicateSignature
<RAOF> But that will be extractable from the trace.
<pitti> RAOF: hm, that seems rather pointless -- could we perhaps patch that to re-raise the same signal it got, instead of always SIGABRT?
<pitti> that would at least be an one-line patch which also sounds upstreamable
<pitti> abort() is nothign else than raise(SIGABRT), after all
<RAOF> Hah. One line? You underestimate the convolutions X has in even its crash paths!
<RAOF> pitti: Really? I was under the impression that abort() was a bit more than that; specifically, that it'd do the requisite signal fiddling to ensure the process *actually* died as a result?
<pitti> you mean it uses the signal number to decide whether it re-installs its own signal handler!?
<pitti> that would be really bad and sick, and I can't believe it does that -- you'd get infinite recursion very easily otherwise
<pitti> RAOF: it can't ensure that
<pitti> RAOF: if you install a signal handler for SIGABRT, it'll just call that
<pitti> the only way to ensure that you die is to send SIGKILL
<pitti> a process which wants to do stuff when it dies, should register a signal handler
<RAOF> It has a generic signal handler, which then calls out to the registered handler; there's special code in the crash paths to bail if they get recursively called.
<pitti> and when it's caught, do its stuff (logging, etc.), restore the original handler, and re-raise
<pitti> restoring the original signal handler is the very first thing it ought to do to ensure it doesn't recurse
<RAOF> Yeah, that's not what X does (in any of the places where its signal handler gets funned.
<pitti> RAOF: so it does not install a signal handler for SIGABRT, and uses abort() as the signal to actually core dump, while all other signals are being caught?
<pitti> then we indeed need to fix it in the report
<RAOF> Pretty much, yes.
<pitti> (or fix the hanndler)
<pitti> it's stunning that it doesn't intercept and log SIGABRT
<RAOF> The handler is a surprising amount of effort :)
<pitti> after all, this is _the_ signal for catching assertions
<pitti> so they wouldn't do any logging for assertions
<RAOF> They don't assert
<pitti> RAOF: btw, if you want to fix this in the package hook, can you please make this conditional on the package name? there are a million symlinks to source_xorg.py also for client apps which should not do that signal name fuzzing
<pitti> like source_xterm.py
<RAOF> Yup.
<pitti> thanks
<pitti> so, good luck! please let me know if you have questions about how to do thaht
<RAOF> SIGSEGV, SIGQUIT, SIGILL, SIGFPE, SIGBUS, SIGSYS, SIGXCPU, SIGXFSZ. These are the signals X will catch for you!
<pitti> RAOF: how does the server handle assertions then? or doesn't it have any?
<RAOF> It does have some; it just dies.
<RAOF> And leaves you with whatever hardware state you happened to be in at that point.
<pitti> RAOF: hm, and as it doesn't trigger the logging code, you wouldn't ever know what the assertion actually was, I suppose?
<pitti> well, we would now with apport
<pitti> but I wonder why upstream chose to implement it in this way
<RAOF> Because X is a gigantic pile of hysterical rasins just waiting to spontaneously combust.
<pitti> this of course is a fully convincing argument :)
<Laney> morning!
<seb128> hey desktopers
<didrocks> salut seb128, hey Laney
<pitti> salut seb128, ca va didrocks
<pitti> hey Laney, how are you?
<Laney> yeah great! Spent the weekend camping + volunteering
<Laney> the sun came along for the trip, too
<didrocks> guten morgen pitti
<seb128> hey didrocks, Laney, pitti ... how are you?
<pitti> seb128: quite fine, thanks!
<didrocks> seb128: I'm fine, thanks! yourself?
<seb128> I'm good thanks!
 * didrocks scratches his head on  undefined symbol: gnome_rr_labeler_get_color_for_output got when rebuilding g-c-c
<didrocks> and not in the version in quantal, there is no static build though?
<didrocks> ah, seems bug #1011056
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1011056 in gnome-control-center "Display applet will not run (undefined symbol: gnome_rr_labeler_get_color_for_output)" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1011056
<didrocks> hum, why it's not in bzr?
 * didrocks tries to pull again
<Laney> we updated bzr to 3.5.x
<Laney> should probably revert that if we're going to stay with 3.4
<Laney> same with gsd
<didrocks> Laney: hum, we can just have another branch
<didrocks> and then merge back
<didrocks> as I'm making the changes for g-c-c and compiz gsettings
<didrocks> I prefer to not mix with 3.5.x :)
<Laney> yes
<Laney> i think it's likely we won't take those updates
<didrocks> yeah
<Laney> so i would revert the official branch to 3.4 and push 3.5 somewhere else
<Laney> crack-heaven
<didrocks> ok, so I need to bundle back all changes made as well
<didrocks> for 3.4
 * didrocks pushes to lp:~ubuntu-desktop/gnome-control-center/3.5
<Laney> i'll do same for gsd
<didrocks> go go go :)
<dupondje> Anyone around that could check https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/colord/+bug/1021374 ? Crashing at every boot :(
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 1021374 in colord "colord crashed with SIGSEGV in cd_device_register_object()" [Medium,Confirmed]
 * didrocks bzr push --overwrite to g-c-c
<Sweetshark> moin all!
<didrocks> hey Sweetshark
<Sweetshark> seb128: libreoffice 3.6.0 rc2 finished in proposed and looks good after some basic testing on i386.
<Sweetshark> didrocks: heya!
<didrocks> ok, display switched for gsettings compiz support
<seb128> Sweetshark, hey, happy monday! had a good w.e?
<didrocks> now, backgound panel :)
 * Sweetshark survived falling out of a plane at 4000m altitude on Saturday.
<seb128> dupondje, did you try to report it upstream?
<seb128> Sweetshark, you do skydiving?
<Sweetshark> seb128: ... and the best think about the rc2 package is: it also build on armhf, armel.
<seb128> Sweetshark, yeah, it built everywhere and it has been copied to quantal proper
<Sweetshark> seb128: not regulary (yet). I did a tandemjump. was much fun.
<Sweetshark> seb128: oh, its already copied? way cool!
<dupondje> seb128: no, been to lazy ... :) should do that indeed
<dupondje> but I see there is new upstream version also
<dupondje> so maby we need to test that first :)
<seb128> dupondje, try talking to RAOF when he's around, he's the closest from a colord maintainer for Ubuntu
<seb128> Sweetshark, yes ;-)
<seb128> libreoffice and webkit built everywhere and got copied
<dupondje> seb128: i'll do, he's maintainer in debian of it it seems :)
<seb128> right
<Laney> probably wouldn't
<Laney> erm... wouldn't be too hard to do a local build of it yourself to test
<dupondje> true :) this evening maby, when i'm on my quantal pc :)
<dupondje> https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=51031
<ubot2> Freedesktop bug 51031 in daemon "segfault at cd_device_register_object()" [Normal,New: ]
<chrisccoulson> hey seb128, how are you?
<Laney> didrocks: is this gsettings migration stuff landing soon? Otherwise I'd like to upload gsd with some other fixes
<seb128> chrisccoulson, hey, welcome back! I'm good thanks, how are you?
<didrocks> Laney: today (tomorrow at the latest)
<Laney> ok, leaving it then
<didrocks> Laney: as you wish for gsd, just please don't touch g-c-c :)
<Laney> the beast is yours
<Laney> versions is stuck?
<didrocks> no, can't beâ¦
<didrocks> worked at the first trial
<didrocks> no compilation errors, everything seems to behave as it should
<didrocks> for 100+ line diff, I think there is a trap somewhere :)
<seb128> Laney, seems so, I'm looking at it
<seb128> Laney, should be fixed with the next run, (going to take an hour to run)
<Laney> great, thanks
<seb128> Laney, robert_ancell messed up one edit, it was hitting an invalid number of argument exception
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, i'm not too bad thanks. although, a little sore from all the sun at the weekend
<chrisccoulson> i spent the entire weekend outside
<seb128> chrisccoulson, you finally got some summer weather as well?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, oh, did you have fun at least? ;-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, it's been quite nice for a couple of days
<chrisccoulson> oh, no fun. just tidying up the garden
<seb128> that sounds like fun :p
<chrisccoulson> i had to shred a large pile of stuff i cut down a few weeks ago, cut our grass, trim a metre off the top of our hedge and cut back a tree at the bottom of the garden
<chrisccoulson> it's been quite hectic ;)
<seb128> glad to be back to the computer today then? ;-)
<chrisccoulson> yeah
<chrisccoulson> ;)
 * didrocks prepares metacity 2.34.3 update
<babyface_> hi, anybody can have a look on this bug? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/brltty/+bug/1022927
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 1022927 in gvfs "Upgrade tests failed: obsolete files left after the upgrade" [High,Confirmed]
<seb128> babyface_, I saw it, it's on my todolist but rather low priority, it's a detail
<seb128> babyface_, does it create any pratical issue?
<babyface_> seb128, no. all the upgrade test jobs are marked unstable due to this fail, which looks very ugly  ;)
<babyface_> seb128, so it would be good to solve it asap
<seb128> babyface_, that's only a conffile leftover, since when is that an important thing? we have tons of such issues...
<babyface_> seb128, it blocks the upgrade test, which means this case fails, and the job stops, and the follow-up test can not have a chance to run.
<Laney> you should make that test non-fatal
<seb128> babyface_, well, fix your tests?
<Laney> obsolete conffiles are easy to fix, but it's really not worth stopping the world to do so
<seb128> babyface_, it's only a leftover file on upgrade, it's not a red flag stuff
<babyface_> seb128, yes, I know it's not a big deal, and I will check the test job first, and if I can improve the test job I will,  but if not,  I will have to get back to you   ;)
<seb128> babyface_, sure do, but I'm not thrilled by QA making minor issue stoppers in an unilateral way like that, we have enough to do without having to stop everything we are doing to fix bugs no users would notice
<seb128> babyface_, it's like if you decided to check manpages for typos and stopping the install on misspelt words ;-)
<seb128> babyface_, btw it would be good to let the Ubuntu community know in some way about those sort of tests when they are set up, cleaning conffiles on upgrades are easy to miss thing and I don't think we communicate strongly it's important
<babyface_> seb128, yes, hehe, I understand what you said,   we will communicate more in the future
<pitti> babyface_: that should be state "yellow", not "read", isn't it?
<babyface_> pitti, yes, it's yellow
<pitti> that's ok; a lot of them were yellow when we released precise
<pitti> for precise -> quantal we ought to aim at "green", but SRUing minor issues like this is a rather huge amount of work for relatively little benefit IMHO
 * pitti -> lunch, bbl
<babyface_> pitti, yes, I see. thanks pitti
<gema> guys, yellow or red in jenkins doesn't mean much, the fact that a bug hasn't been fixed in more than 10 days says it is not very critical
<gema> not even for us
<gema> seb128: but it needs to be fixed ^^
<gema> seb128: I am glad it is on your todo for this week
<gema> seb128: if you are unhappy with any of the tests we are running, please send us an email with the rationale and we will look into it, if it is not worth to run something or to look into it when it fails we will gladly remove the test
<gema> seb128: some of our tests may cease to be relevant with time and we need to keep up to date
<seb128> gema, hey, I'm not unhappy and I think this test is a good idea, I wish it would have been communicated to the Ubuntu teams though
<seb128> gema, out of coming with "please fix that bug asap" for a thing we didn't even know was tested
<gema> seb128: agreed
<gema> seb128: that's a problem in our process
<Laney> a good outcome of some tests would be a bug report that can just be rolled into the next release of the package
<Laney> they don't all have to stop the world
<gema> Laney: agreed
<gema> Laney: but some failures may hide other problems, so sometimes they need to be fixed for other tests to be able to pass or fail
<gema> it is not this case, though
<seb128> right, the current conffile stuff is harmless
<gema> seb128: right
<gema> seb128: but needs to be fixed
<gema> in a reasonable amount of time
<gema> seb128: how much is reasonable is up to us to agree upon
<seb128> gema, yeah, agreed, I will fix it today or tomorrow, it's just not a world stopper to put on hold stuff I'm doing atm ;-)
<gema> seb128: this is not about this bug in particular, it is about establishing a workflow that works for both of us
<gema> seb128: thanks, that sounds good :D
<seb128> gema, right, we should see about setting priorities, as pitti said conffile issues should be yellow, not red
<seb128> gema, I still think it would be good to email ubuntu-devel about those conffile tests if you start flagging them yellow so maintainer to pay attention to the topic
<gema> seb128: unfortunately the way jenkins works yellow and reds cannot be twiked based on what run
<gema> it has its own rules
<gema> seb128: so we have to figure out what's wrong on case by case basis
<gema> seb128: that's a good idea, we'll do that
<gema> seb128: we cannot flag colours, jenkins decides based on how much is failing
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> oh, ok
<gema> seb128: but we can send an email whenever that test fails
<seb128> gema, well, what I meant with "yellow" is that ideally that should block other tests to run
<seb128> it's not a blocking issue, it's a warning at most
<gema> seb128: ok
<gema> seb128: thanks for the feedback
<chrisccoulson> hmmmm, i think i'm never going to take time off work again ;)
<chrisccoulson> it's too much hassle!
<seb128> gema, yw, thanks for taking the feedback in consideration ;-)
<gema> seb128: we are all learning here
<seb128> chrisccoulson, stacked under tons of stuff to catch up on?
<gema> seb128: so anything that helps ease both sides is worth a shot
<chrisccoulson> seb128, i need to figure out how to fix https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=775143 quite quickly ;)
<ubot2> Mozilla bug 775143 in Extension Compatibility "crash in uGlobalMenu::OnOpen when activating HUD in Ubuntu with Firebug" [Critical,New: ]
<seb128> bah
<seb128> wth mozilla, why adding those grey colored scrollbar to tb!
<seb128> the background color was way better when it was subtle
<seb128> it's like they made the scrollbars the most important ui part ;-)
<chrisccoulson> i don't think that was deliberate
<chrisccoulson> it's not the case in the current nightly anyway ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, did you see that as well?
<seb128> I get the issue on precise since the recent updates
<chrisccoulson> seb128, i do if i run the current version, but not in nightly (which is what i normally run)
<seb128> ok
<seb128> let's see, maybe tb 15 will fix that :p
<mpt> didrocks, hi, got time to talk about the OneConf Web UI?
<didrocks> mpt: perfect timing, just finished a long email! :)
<mpt> didrocks, I read through the "WebUI" section of your post, but I'm not sure what the use case is
<mpt> didrocks, why would someone use a web UI and not use USC directly?
<didrocks> mpt: you are on your tablet and have ubuntu installed on it, you spot an awesome app that you just installed
<didrocks> and think "I really should have on my desktop as well"
<didrocks> you go to the web ui, login, select you desktop
<didrocks> and select install it
<didrocks> when you are back on your desktop, you have a credential/a popup telling you "you marked this app for installation, do you want it?"
<mpt> didrocks, okay, but couldn't you do all that inside USC?
<didrocks> mpt: if you are on another machine, you need to remember you wanted to install this app as well
<mpt> didrocks, at what part of the process are you being on another machine?
<didrocks> the first one, 14:49:37      didrocks | mpt: you are on your tablet and have ubuntu installed on it, you spot an awesome app that you just installed and think "I really should have on my desktop as well"
<mpt> didrocks, so by "another machine" did you mean the tablet?
<didrocks> yeah
<mpt> didrocks, so how would using a Web interface, instead of USC, help you remember?
<didrocks> mpt: just because when you are back on your desktop, you get a message/notification telling "you marked this app to be installed on your current device, install now?"
<mpt> didrocks, how does that require a Web interface?
<didrocks> how do you want to remotely mark something for installation?
<mpt> (Sorry, there's obviously something big and simple I'm missing)
<rickspencer3> didrocks, mpt I bet if you guys set up a hangout, you could talk this through in like 5 minutes
<rickspencer3> and you can make it "on air" and public too ;)
<rickspencer3> (no pressure, just a suggestion)
<mpt> rickspencer3, I am in post-prandial mode and thinking too slowly for that, probably :-)
<rickspencer3> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Postprandial
<mpt> didrocks, if your use case is you just installed something on your tablet and you want to install the same (or equivalent?) application on your PC, inside USC you'd go into "Sync Between Computers", then "N items on this computer not on 'Didier's PC'", choose the application, and click "Install There" or something like that
<didrocks> mpt: the difference is that you have to remember when you go on the destination device to install the apps and to see the diff
<didrocks> but anyway, I think I'll stop proposing oneconf related stuff. It's not like I didn't propose most of those features 3 years ago and that google play implemented them 8 months from now :)
<mpt> didrocks, you could have exactly the kind of notifications you're proposing with a local application. (They'd be easier, come to that.)
<mpt> Plus the benefit of not having to sign in.
<didrocks> mpt: what do you mean, you want software-center to have a way to mark "install that app on this device"?
<mpt> didrocks, more "install *this* app on *that* device", but yes. :-)
<mpt> Then the next time you log in on that device, you get the notification
<didrocks> mpt: I'm afraid that brings more complexity for the UI compared to a centralized location like https://apps.ubuntu.com/ what do you think?
<mpt> didrocks, what I'm suggesting would involve one more button per application in the existing UI. What you're suggesting would involve adding SSO to apps.ubuntu.com, and replicating most of the "Sync Between Computers" UI on the Web.
<didrocks> mpt: right, I agree, but that would make apps.ubuntu.com a little bit more useful than what it is ;) like seeing your different devices and what are installed on them (there is no place for that right now)
<didrocks> you only can see a diff right now
<mpt> A diff?
<didrocks> the oneconf view
<didrocks> like, I want to manage my different devices and want to see clearly what apps are installed on each of them, without getting to each one
<didrocks> or told another way
<mpt> didrocks, making apps.ubuntu.com useful is not an end in itself. If there are several other user goals for which showing your installed software on the Web is a means to that end, that would be more interesting.
<didrocks> chrome now has the support of seeing what tabs have every chrome browser on different device you install
<didrocks> it doesn't really show a diff
<mpt> sorry, I don't understand that chrome bit
<mpt> Do you mean seeing what tabs are open on each device?
<didrocks> yeah
<mpt> didrocks, ok, but is there a Web UI for that?
<didrocks> ah good, point, no, it's in the app indeed
<didrocks> but you can have a full list of every tabs in every browsers where you are connected on
<mpt> sure
<didrocks> and can add/remove them remotely
<mpt> If there are use cases for "show me everything on my other machine, not just a diff", we could add that
<didrocks> mpt: I wonder, I think it makes sense to have it, but I can't define a strong use case apart from people want to really know what they have and don't want to make it from "what do I have here +/- the diff"
<mpt> didrocks, ok, I'll do some sketches and let you see what you think
<didrocks> mpt: excellent, thanks!
<chrisccoulson> right, i'm nearly caught up now!
<chrisccoulson> just need to pop out and pick up some contact lenses
<chrisccoulson> bbiab
<ogra_> mpt, around
<ogra_> ?
<mpt> ogra_, yep
<ogra_> hey
<ogra_> i just built myself a new desktop machine with a shiny 3 monitor setup ... and noticed a usability issue
<ogra_> while i can select in the monitor applet where my unity bar shows up (which screen) i always miss the notifications when reading email on my most left monitor ... they show only on the most right screen
<ogra_> would be great if notifications were selectable like the unity launcher position for such a case
<desrt> notification-follows-mouse?
<ogra_> well, at least notifications on the screen where my launcher is or so
<desrt> (probably ~99% of the time your mouse cursor will be on the screen you're "paying attention to")
<desrt> ogra_: it's quite likely that if you have 3 monitors you'll be looking at the one that doesn't have the launcher from time to time...
<ogra_> indeed
<desrt> could also make it come on the screen that has the window with keyboard focus
 * desrt can't think of any other useful heuristics
<ogra_> well, any solution would be better than the current situation in my case :)
<seb128> ogra_, gsettings set com.canonical.notify-osd multihead-mode 'focus-follow'
 * desrt has to wonder why that is not default
 * ogra_ shakes his head ...  can'T be ... they thought of that ?!?
<ogra_> WOW !
<Laney> can we make it the default? :-)
<seb128> desrt, I think the reply is "Mirco had no time for notify-osd in recent cycles and nobody else got annoyed enough to look at that"
 * ogra_ hugs seb128 ... thats awesome 
 * seb128 hugs ogra_ back
<ogra_> and yes, we should just make it the default imho
<seb128> ogra_, desrt, Laney: hey, we should probably do that
<ogra_> ++
<ogra_> really helps on multiscreen
<Laney> rock
 * Laney hands the upload token to ogra_ :-)
 * didrocks goes out to see the dentist, will be back afterward
<seb128> didrocks, good luck!
<didrocks> seb128: thanks, I didn't need to see any dentist for the past 7 years. Julie convinced me that a check would be good at some point. Hopefully, nothing will be revealed :)
<seb128> didrocks, oh, good ;-)
<tkamppeter> pitti, hi
<Laney> Anyone fancy testing dbus 1.6? https://launchpad.net/~laney/+archive/experimental/+packages
<seb128> Laney, oh, great, did you change,fix anything over pitti's version which was breaking indicators?
<Laney> nah, that seems a bit broken indeed
<chrisccoulson> am i the only person who hates the new nautilus?
<Laney> I get messages, sound but not others like network or redshift
<bcurtiswx> when checking missing files from a build, i need a little more understanding of how to choose where to install thing.. look at http://paste.ubuntu.com/1106688/
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I hate that they replaced typeahead with that slow broken search
<seb128> bcurtiswx, hey
<bcurtiswx> hi seb128
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, that's the first thing i noticed too. i used the typeahead pretty much all the time :(
<chrisccoulson> i've never used the search before!
<seb128> bcurtiswx, you probably want to install the udisk2 backend where the udisk one was ... but it's a bit weird that it's listed as missing
<bcurtiswx> well, the rules file take care of quite a few of those
<bcurtiswx> takes*
<bcurtiswx> but i found it odd it's in the rules
<seb128> bcurtiswx, let me check gvfs
<seb128> Laney, seems like you are the 3rd person to do the dbus update to hit the indicator issue :-(
<seb128> Laney, cf https://launchpad.net/bugs/1014850
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 1014850 in dbus "Update to 1.6.0" [Wishlist,Triaged]
<seb128> Laney, you should check on version if stuff have a been with some status before starting on something to avoid dupping work
<Laney> seb128: I didn't do it from scratch
<Laney> pitti's PPA had a 1.5.x version; I got the newest upstream
<seb128> Laney, ok, you guys dropped the ubuntu patches there right?
<Laney> some of them
<Laney> brb, on a call
<jibel> mterry, now that you fixed what you broke ;) would you mind looking at bug 1009226 ?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1009226 in update-manager "Precise to Quantal: update-manager UI crashes: can't load DistUpgradeViewGtk (No module named vte)" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1009226
<mterry> jibel, yeah, I was going to look at reproducing that after we got a new dist upgrade tarball.  I think if it still is there, the trace will be a bit different, but I'll look at it for sure.  /me assigns
<seb128> bcurtiswx, yeah, that package is weird, that's because they need to install different stuff on hurd than linux so they use the rules to hack
<mterry> o, it's already assigned to a team.
<mterry> Still, will look at it
<jibel> mterry, it is still there, want a new trace ?
<mterry> jibel, I can grab it myself in a sec
<jibel> mterry, it is assigned to a team but I am not sure on which plate is update-manager and you've been pretty active on it recently, that's why I asked.
<mterry> jibel, sure, and I'm a good person for it.  :)
<mterry> jibel, how far in before you get the trace?
<jibel> mterry, right after it asks for a password
 * didrocks back with beautiful tooth :)
<mterry> jibel, hmm, didn't get it in my VM...  Maybe I have some vte package installed that's not default
<mterry> didrocks, hah nice
<mterry> hmm..  I don't seem to have anything special.  Will create fresh VM to make sure
<jibel> mterry, bah, release-upgrade version 0.162 :/ something must be wrong on my side
<mterry> oh odd
<jibel> mterry, hold on, I'll check first
<jibel> my dumb proxy must be playing me tricks again
<seb128> bcurtiswx, ok, so the fact that they use a custom rules hack rather than the .install way means dh_install -list-missing is getting confused as well
<bcurtiswx> seb128, yes i've copied the missing list and deleted the lines that were covered in the rules file and i'm left with 6
<chrisccoulson> lol
<seb128> chrisccoulson, ?
<bcurtiswx> http://paste.ubuntu.com/1106769/
<chrisccoulson> pressing ctrl+v in nautilus starts a search rather than transferring a file!
<kenvandine> chrisccoulson, ouch!
<seb128> chrisccoulson, kenvandine: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=680159
<ubot2> Gnome bug 680159 in Location Bar "ctrl-V paste the copied file's url in the location bar instead of copying the file" [Normal,Resolved: fixed]
<chrisccoulson> seb128, thanks
<seb128> I should perhaps backport the fix ;-)
<kenvandine> :)
<seb128> bcurtiswx, your gvfs update merge request from the other day miss the install of the new recent backend, I guess that's what you are fixing?
<seb128> bcurtiswx, otherwise upstream rolled a new gdl tarball if you want to work on that after gvfs, should be an easier one and better case for a library
<jibel> mterry, upgrade is in progress, it's all good. I'll let you now if there's something later during the upgrade. Sorry for the noise.
<mterry> jibel, awesome
<bcurtiswx> seb128, yes i'm fixing that, and the gdl will be next
<bcurtiswx> seb128, is there an easy way to tell where http://paste.ubuntu.com/1106769/ those go ? I've removed anything that was taken care of by the rules file and all the .la and .a files
<Laney> seb128: who would be best to contact about this issue with the indicators and global menu and new dbus?
<jbicha> can we get bug 1026066 fixed in time for Alpha 3?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1026066 in software-properties "software-properties-gtk crashed with ImportError in /usr/lib/python3/dist-packages/aptdaemon/client.py: No module named gobject" [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1026066
 * didrocks waves good evening
<seb128> jbicha, it's fixed in trunk, get mvo or pitti to do an upload tomorrow I guess?
<seb128> Laney, do you know what's the issue? dx can help but I guess they will need some background
<seb128> bcurtiswx, the recent ones to gvfs-backends, not sure about the .h but that's not new you can ignore it
<seb128> bcurtiswx, the obex one is probably an error
<Laney> I just know the symptoms. Will look some more tomorrow.
<seb128> Laney, what are the symptoms?
<bcurtiswx> the obex i caught, and the .h files just ignore?
<Laney> No global menu and most indicators don't show
<Laney> I get datetime, messages, sound
<Laney> but not e.g. nm
<seb128> Laney, is "most indicator" appindicators?
<seb128> or is any of the system indicators missing (session, messages, sound, power)
<Laney> looks like all of the system ones survived
<Laney> so just appindicators indeed
<seb128> ok
<seb128> tedg, ^
<seb128> Laney, do you get any warning or similar?
<tedg> I guess the other questions would be: is indicator-application installed?  Is indicator-application-service running?
<seb128> tedg, sorry, lack of context, the issue is "indicator-application client stop working when updating from dbus 1.4 to 1.6"
<Laney> the former yes, the latter apparently no
<Laney> 23/07 18:47:07 <@JC> both front rounded vowels
<Laney> oop
<Laney> laney@raleigh> pgrep -c indicator-application-service                                                                                      ~
<Laney> 0
<seb128> Laney, what happens if you run it by hand?
<tedg> seb128, Hmm, I bet the activation directory changed?
<Laney> was trying to avoid getting up and going to that machine :P
 * Laney does so
<seb128> tedg, if that was the case I guess other stuff would have issues
<tedg> seb128, You don't know other stuff doesn't ;-)
<seb128> tedg, the system indicators work
<seb128> hum, though those are loaded by unity-panel-service?
<tedg> seb128, They all go to default states if they can't find the service.
<tedg> Yup, they're path based initially.
<seb128> tedg, changing the services' dir would be screwed up
<seb128> not sure why the dbus guys would have done that
<seb128> or packaging error?
<Laney> (process:3861): indicator-application-service-WARNING **: Unable to get watcher name 'org.kde.StatusNotifierWatcher'
<Laney> (process:3861): libindicator-WARNING **: Name request failed.
<tedg> I'd guess packaging error.
<tedg> Hmm, do you have something else collecting that name?
<tedg> If you look in d-feet it'll give you the executable for that name.
<seb128> d-feet
<seb128> tedg, 	Session bus services dir: /usr/share/dbus-1/services
<seb128> in the build log from pitti's ppa
<seb128> so I guess that didn't change
<tedg> Ah, cool.
<tedg> Sounds like a different problem with that error.
<seb128> thouse the error from Laney is likely the issue
<bcurtiswx> seb128, pushed fixes for the .install files https://code.launchpad.net/~bcurtiswx/ubuntu/quantal/gvfs/1.13.3-0ubuntu1/+merge/116046
<seb128> bcurtiswx, thanks
<Laney> well, d-feet says that indicator-application-service has it
<Laney> but it's not running as far as I can see
<Laney> tedg: if you install dbus from https://launchpad.net/~laney/+archive/experimental/+packages you'll be able to see it yourself
<tedg> Heh, well, if dbus is reserving a name for a process that isn't running, that's a bug in DBus :-)
<tedg> (and a major one really)
<seb128> Laney, does that need a reboot?
<Laney> I rebooted after I installed it
<Laney> let me do this Debian upload and then do again
<seb128> Laney, I was mostly trying to figure out if I should reboot my box if I want to try that ;-)
<Laney> I think it's probably a reasonable idea to do so
<BigWhale> seb128, can we somehow get this patch in? https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=44336 (related: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=667959)
<ubot2> Freedesktop bug 44336 in general "missing support for cairo_region_t" [Normal,New: ]
<seb128> BigWhale, sure, can you open a launchpad bug and subscribe ubuntu-sponsors? I will make sure the right people look at it
<BigWhale> seb128, what project to report it under? gtk?
<seb128> BigWhale, what's the patch against?
<seb128> Laney, hum, that dbus works for me ...
<Laney> well I thought it did for me too
<Laney> then I noticed there was no global menu
<Laney> you have that?
<BigWhale> seb128, It seems that Gdk.
<BigWhale> Didn't look too closely into it
<seb128> BigWhale, where is the patch?
<seb128> Laney, oh, indeed
<Laney> :P
<seb128> /usr/lib/indicator-application/indicator-application-service is running though
<BigWhale> seb128, http://bugzilla-attachments.gnome.org/attachment.cgi?id=216290
<seb128> and tomboy, bluetooth, etc are showing up
<Laney> hum
<seb128> BigWhale, pygobject
<BigWhale> seb128, hmmm, there's no pygobject project in launchpad... it tells me to go on GNOME bug tracker...
<seb128> BigWhale, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pygobject/+filebug
<BigWhale> thanks :)
<BigWhale> seb128, done... https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pygobject/+bug/1028115 thanks for now! If this could get fixed, I'll be a much happier man ;)
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 1028115 in pygobject "Gdk.cairo_region_create_from_surface() raises an error in GI" [Undecided,New]
<seb128> BigWhale, yw
<_jdccdevel> Hi! My new motherboard has a bug in the video driver, what's the best way to force ubuntu 12.04 to use the vesa driver?
<seb128> Laney, do you have more than one user connected on that box?
<Laney> seb128: I'm using it over ssh and physically, but that's it
<seb128> tedg, I hit those dbus warning if I restart a client after the indicator service "		g_warning("Application already exists, re-requesting properties.");"
<seb128> that's from application_service_appstore_application_add()
<seb128> tedg, does it help to get a clue about the issue?
<tedg> seb128, It just says that it's rerequesting props?  That should be normal... well, not normal, but fine.
<tedg> seb128, Does it not work?
<seb128> yeah
<seb128> that bug is pretty weird
<seb128> the indicators show as loaded on my account but don't refresh
<seb128> and menus don't open when clicked on them
<tedg> If you look on bustle you should see a cascade of events.
<tedg> Unity -> panel-service -> app
<tedg> (note: no application-service)
<tedg> Might help debug where in the stack you're loosing the open message.
<tedg> Wait, to open the menu it should just go to panel service.
<tedg> Clicking on an item would go to the app.
<seb128> well, my other user sessions don't display appmenu nor application indicators
<seb128> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/1107088/
<seb128> that's a bustle log from that test user session restarting nm-applet and gedit and try to use the appmenu
<seb128> I've no clue how to read bustle logs though
<seb128> tedg, hum, running the unity-panel-service I get those warning
<seb128> ** (unity-panel-service:6701): WARNING **: on_indicator_menu_show() called with a NULL entry
<seb128> restarting indicator-application-service
<seb128> (unity-panel-service:6701): GLib-GIO-CRITICAL **: g_dbus_proxy_call_internal: assertion `G_IS_DBUS_PROXY (proxy)' failed
<seb128>  
<seb128> well I guess IRC debugging is not going to get anywhere, I need to figure what version,commit broke it
<tedg> Hmm, I can't download that bustle log.
<seb128> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/1107088/
<seb128> you mean?
<seb128> why not?
<tedg> It downloads but Bustle can't read it.
<tedg> Not sure why
<seb128> tedg, http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/debug
<tedg> Ah, figured it out.  Pastebin makes it a dos file \r\n
<tedg> :-/
<tedg> seb128, Seems like the application service is happily running there.
<tedg> seb128, Seems really odd that your nm-applet is updating its menu so much though...
<tedg> Like every 100ms or so.
<seb128> tedg, loading it through indicator-loader3 works fine though
<tedg> BLAME UNITY!  ;-)
<seb128> so maybe it's an unity bug
<seb128> where is njpatel?!
 * tedg is faster and has caps lock
<seb128> ;-)
<tedg> You should be able to harass thumper here soon :-)
<seb128> ** (unity-panel-service:7754): WARNING **: on_indicator_menu_show() called with a NULL entry
<seb128> those might be issues
<seb128> those are coming from libappmenu.so though
<seb128> tedg, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/1107118/ is the stacktrace
<_jdccdevel> Anyone know how to force ubuntu 12.04 to use the vesa driver?
<seb128> _jdccdevel, write an xorg.conf config for it?
<desrt> _jdccdevel: and good luck to you :)
<bryceh> _jdccdevel, yep just specify it as your driver in xorg.conf.  You'll also need to make sure the kernel isn't loading a kms driver since those don't work with vesa.  If it is, either blacklist that driver, switch it to non-modesetting mode, or use the fbdev driver instead of vesa.
<_jdccdevel> FYI: all I needed to do to get it working was set "i915.modeset=0" in my kernel boot line. VESA was loaded automatically. Thanks!
<bryceh> ah yeah, you hadn't mentioned you were using -intel.  for that, switching to non-modesetting is sufficient.
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-07-24
<bcurtiswx> kenvandine, you getting overtime? :P
<robru> just got bitten by bug 923841 on quantal. buh.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 923841 in intltool "intltool glade support doesn't work with menus" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/923841
<pitti> chrisccoulson: new nautilus> yeah, it even breaks the backspace key, which in turn breaks my patience
<desrt> pitti: surely that is a mistake...
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> bonjour didrocks
<RAOF> Hey, ho, didrocks!
<didrocks> guten morgen pitti, hey RAOF!
<RAOF> didrocks: Did you know about the âInvestigate locallyâ button on the apport popup when you've got apport-retrace installed?
<RAOF> This is my new favourite thing!
<didrocks> RAOF: I never used it, I'm still apport-unpack && gdb :)
<RAOF> (And my new least-favourite thing is crashes in X's error reporting only when built with optimisations)
<pitti> didrocks: *gasp* documentation! https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebuggingProgramCrash
<didrocks> ahah, typical joyness :)
<didrocks> pitti: wow, with screenshots!
<pitti> yeah, and by how bad they are you can see that I took them
<didrocks> ok, I install apport-retrace and make my fingers happy :)
<didrocks> done :)
<pitti> didrocks: unpack and gdb doesn't give you the debug symbols, though?
<didrocks> pitti: most of the time, I have them installed already or built on my machine with pkg-create-dbgsym
<chrisccoulson> sigh @ bug 1028266. i can't believe somebody would actually report that as a bug. do people really look for things like that?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1028266 in firefox "firefox license change not reflected in /usr/share/doc/firefox/copyright" [Low,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1028266
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, i think i'm going to struggle to like the new nautilus :(
<chrisccoulson> it also no longer displays folders before files either, which i also dislike quite a lot :/
<pitti> there's an option for that, though
<chrisccoulson> oh, i didn't realize that
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, the option doesn't work here
<chrisccoulson> the checkbox immediately unchecks itself again
<jibel> pitti, good morning
<jibel> pitti, do you know the status of bug 1026066 ?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1026066 in software-properties "software-properties-gtk crashed with ImportError in /usr/lib/python3/dist-packages/aptdaemon/client.py: No module named gobject" [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1026066
<pitti> didrocks: nice, iberia has mobile tickets, and already allow checking in
<pitti> bonjour jibel, ca va?
<pitti> jibel: it's fixed in trunk, but not yet uploaded into the distro apparently
<jibel> pitti, Ã§a va bien, et toi ?
<pitti> jibel: do you know how to trigger it? I played around with software-properties and can't reproduce it
<pitti> ooh
<pitti> I guess I hacked aptdaemon locally
<pitti> jibel: je suis bien, merci!
<didrocks> pitti: oh you can? I can't checking in personnaly
<pitti> jibel: I'll have a look at this and upload
<jibel> pitti, start update manager then click  on 'Settings...'
<pitti> jibel: I reinstalled aptdaemon now, starting software-properties-gtk is enough to trigger it
 * pitti bumps severity
<pitti> jibel: hm, both the current quantal as well as my new package FTBFS for me in the test suite; investigating
<pitti> didrocks: perhaps you leave later, and still need to wait a bit
<didrocks> pitti: I'm leaving at 7h35 from Lyon. I can book from Lyon -> Paris -> Madrid, but it's with AF
<didrocks> so I guess they don't want to ensure the connexion
<pitti> jibel: fix confirmed locally; waiting for package in my PPA to build
<seb128> hey
<didrocks> salut seb128
<didrocks> seb128: meeting report reminder day!
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<seb128> hey didrocks, pitti, ca va bien ?
<seb128> didrocks, indeed it is, thanks!
<didrocks> Ã§a va bien, et toi?
<seb128> didrocks, ca va bien!
<seb128> pitti, danke for the aptdaemon upload
<pitti> seb128: de rien; took a bit, I have some trouble with the tests
<pitti> the current version that's in the archive now fails in the tests
<seb128> oh :-(
<seb128> RAOF, hey
<seb128> RAOF, "Chris Halse Rogers has proposed merging lp:~ubuntu-desktop/lightdm/ubuntu into lp:lightdm." ... somewhat that looks wrong ;-)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, pitti: I'm pondering re-uploading nautilus 3.4 as a nautilus-3.4 source
<seb128> or nautilus-with-features
<seb128> though that's not really maintainable over time
<pitti> without the library packages then? i. e. statically linked or private libdir or so?
<pitti> yeah, I guess we'll just need to swallow it
<seb128> sometimes with GNOME it's good to let them one or two cycle to shape up things and get refactoring done
<seb128> pitti, well, the library interfaces didn't change yet, so I think we could build the lib from 3.6 and use it in 3.4
<pitti> if it's expected to get better, you could also just keep nautilus at 3.4?
<seb128> it will get better for some value of better...
<seb128> like they replaced typeahead with the dumb search and don't plan to change it back
<seb128> or they dropped the compact view which quite some people liked
<seb128> well I can make a long list of useful stuff they dropped, and I would not be surprised if they still drop a bunch
<pitti> :-(
<seb128> I think they somewhat lean toward being more a tablet UI than a desktop one
<seb128> hum
<seb128> rather than bringing back nautilus 3.4 I think we should probably get marlin in
<chrisccoulson> hey seb128
<chrisccoulson> yeah, it's a shame about the typeahead. i'm not sure i can live without that yet :(
<seb128> chrisccoulson, hey, how are you?
<seb128> their search sucks as well
<seb128> the reply from mccann was "we will depends on tracker that should make the search efficient"
<seb128> that's for some definition of efficient I guess...
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, i'm not too bad thanks
<seb128> hum, tried marlin from https://launchpad.net/~d.filoni/+archive/quantal-builds/+packages
<seb128> it's a bit like the old nautilus but doesn't feel as nice and it's lacking u1 integration for example
 * seb128 uninstall
<seb128> want my old nautilus back!
<pitti> mc!
<chrisccoulson> heh, i've not tried marlin for a while
<pitti> yeah, I really miss typeahead, too
<chrisccoulson> perhaps i should try and write my own file browser?
<pitti> almost as much as backspace
<seb128> I ctrl-L and type in the url bar as a workaround
<pitti> well, typing ahead somewhat works, but filtering the whole view instead of just jumping to the file is a bit confusing
<didrocks> what I don't like is when you copy/cut a file and try to paste it, it files the breadcrumb with the origin url
<didrocks> instead of pasting/moving the file
<pitti> ooh, that's what it does?
<seb128> didrocks, ok thanks for reminding me, I need to backport that fix
<pitti> I copied a few music files to my phone yesterday and it got completely messed up
 * seb128 does
<didrocks> seb128: ah? it's not wanted but a bug? :)
<didrocks> *phew*
<seb128> ;-)
<pitti> I got a ~ 300 pixel high breadcumb bar with very long URIs
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, I tried 3 times before ensuring that what happened
<didrocks> I was like "what?"
<pitti> *phew* indeed!
<chrisccoulson> i'm starting to feel like spatial mode was good
<chrisccoulson> ;)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: \o/
<mlankhorst> hey
<didrocks> hey mlankhorst
<mlankhorst> heya didrocks :)
<chrisccoulson> hah, https://twitter.com/Queen_UK/status/227680063334805505:)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, the queen is on twitter? srly?
<seb128> lol
<chrisccoulson> seb128, it's a parody account ;)
<chrisccoulson> i follow lots of them
<chrisccoulson> eg, https://twitter.com/Charles_HRH ;)
<seb128> I will do a fake chrisccoulson account :p
<chrisccoulson> lol
<seb128> and twitt nice things about chrome!
<seb128> ;-)
<chrisccoulson> haha!
<chrisccoulson> i'll create a fake seb128 account and tell everyone that you switched to KDE!
<seb128> that could go far :p
<mlankhorst> or Sweetshark switching to microsoft office?
<didrocks> google docs rather :)
<lotheac> any lightdm-gtk-greeter devs here?
<rickspencer3> lotheac, it seems that robert_ancell is off for the evening, sorry
<lotheac> I thought he had more to do with lightdm, not so much with the gtk greeter
<lotheac> thanks though, maybe I'll talk to him later then
<didrocks> hum, unity-greeter authentification with fingerprint is broken
<didrocks> fortunately switch back to another user + ctrl + alt + F7 still shows the GNOME screenlocker which works :)
<RAOF> seb128: Oh, bah. Sorry!
 * RAOF goes back to dinner.
<seb128> RAOF, no worry ;-)
<chrisccoulson> huzzah! i have a fix for https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=775143 :0
<ubot2> Mozilla bug 775143 in Extension Compatibility "crash in uGlobalMenu::OnOpen when activating HUD in Ubuntu with Firebug" [Critical,New: ]
<seb128> chrisccoulson, well done!
<seb128> pitti, btw did you try to debug the dbus issue with indicators? do you have any hint on how to do that?
<pitti> seb128: no and no :(
<pitti> I don't get any error, they just don't appear; but I didn't spend any time on it back then, then had to rush to UDS, and forgot about it afterwards
<pitti> everythign else worked fine
<seb128> pitti, yeah, I tried to debug a bit yesterday with Laney but it's really not obvious what could be happening
<seb128> seems to be on the unity side
<seb128> the indicator-tools loader display those fine
<pitti> it didn't even change ABI
<seb128> pitti, do you have any hint how to debug?
<seb128> dbus is crazy nowadays, too much going on to sit an watch the traffic
<pitti> seb128: I'm afraid I don't know anything about the innards of indicators, so no :(
<pitti> seb128: you could start unity/the panel on a private dbus-launch perhaps
<pitti> and then just watch this
<pitti> seb128: or use d-feet to see whether the invisible indicators are loaded and whether you can talk to theM?
<pitti> but of course it's the indicators themselves which are so utterly chatty, so perhaps the better way is to run dbus-monitor with some filters
<seb128> pitti, ok, that seems complex, I'm trying the other way around and figure when it broke ... 1.5.0 works, 1.5.6 doesn't, let's see if I can find what commit broke it
<Laney> hey
<Laney> I tried in a non-unity session and indicators work fine there
<Laney> using gnome-panel
<seb128> yeah, they work fine in the indicator loader binary as well
<Sweetshark> seb128: no meeting reminder yet?
<Sweetshark> seb128: if so, can you include the aentos guys in it?
<Laney> Sweetshark: it was sent via launchpad
<Laney> check your LP mailbox
<Sweetshark> Laney: hah!
<Laney> then fix your filters :P
<seb128> Sweetshark, what Laney said
<cyphermox> mornin
<seb128> cyphermox, hey, how are you?
<cyphermox> so-so
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, time to fix all of my e-mail filters
<chrisccoulson> i really regret accidentally erasing them during my 2 weeks off
<didrocks> server-side filtering FTW \o/
<didrocks> versionned in bzr :)
<kenvandine> xclaesse, we need tp-mission-control-5 5.13 for libaccounts fixes, right?
<xclaesse> kenvandine, which libaccounts fixes?
<xclaesse> kenvandine, it is required for the upcoming empathy release which adds IM service to online accounts
<kenvandine> alvaro said we needed bumps for webaccounts to work and i see a bug fix for libaccounts in 5.13
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> just making sure we needed to jump to 5.13
<xclaesse> yep sure
<kenvandine> cool
<xclaesse> just though you meant that libaccounts actually has a dep on MC
<kenvandine> xclaesse, when do you think we'll have that release?
<xclaesse> kenvandine, we are smoke testing it atm
<xclaesse> kenvandine, will be out today
<kenvandine> awesome
<kenvandine> thx!
<Sweetshark> http://cgit.freedesktop.org/libreoffice/core/commit/?id=18b15e48cb1fa7590620930975796a0c0dcac225 <- yay for Caolans commit messages.
<kenvandine> Sweetshark, hehe
<seb128> Sweetshark, obviously the new hardcoded number is less stupid
<Sweetshark> seb128: in a way it is: http://cgit.freedesktop.org/libreoffice/core/commit/?id=117fb70532aeae01327bfe0d828ef8a2d4793b85
<chrisccoulson> is anyone else getting display refresh issues in quantal?
<chrisccoulson> i updated yesterday, just restarted my session and i keep getting corruption all over the screen :/
<Sweetshark> the wonders of having multiple languages and runtimes in one project ...
<seb128> chrisccoulson, do you use an xorg ppa or system compositor one? what did you upgrade? when did you upgrade before?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, no xorg PPA or system compositor. i last updated at the start of my 2 weeks off
<seb128> oh, fun to figure what changed...
<chrisccoulson> yeah....
<seb128> is there any compiz or intel driver update in that run?
<bcurtiswx> mornin'
<seb128> hey bcurtiswx, how are you?
<bcurtiswx> seb128, doing OK, and you?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, i can see a unity update
<seb128> bcurtiswx, I'm good thanks
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I see what you are thinking :p
<chrisccoulson> heh
<seb128> chrisccoulson, well, those unity updates are only gsettings path migration ones from distro
<seb128> chrisccoulson, so I doubt it's it
<chrisccoulson> hmmm :/
<chrisccoulson> i'll have another look in a bit
<seb128> chrisccoulson, what version did you have before?
<seb128> I guess you already had the current upstream version
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, i already had that
<seb128> pitti, ping
<chrisccoulson> it probably doesn't help that my laptop feels like it's melting
<chrisccoulson> perhaps i'm killing it ;)
<pitti> hey seb128
<seb128> pitti, hey
<seb128> pitti, so, some git bisect later
<seb128> pitti, http://cgit.freedesktop.org/dbus/dbus/commit/?id=a940e7b1d1b6b832e2ec732a11f495240156fb31
<seb128> is the commit that breaks indicators,unity it seems
<seb128> Laney, ^ fyi
<seb128> pitti, I will try to ping Simon about it ... do you have any clue why it could,would break stuff?
<seb128> pitti, I don't know enough about dbus to say
<Laney> sounds like something unity might have to adapt to?
<seb128> yeah, I'm pinging the unity guys as well
<pitti> oh, so perhaps that needs to go into the d-bus config files for the indicators?
<pitti> err, for the services the indicators try to talk to, that is
<pitti> I'm not sure what that eavesdropping thing is
<seb128> pitti, I will figure it out, thanks
<Laney> I guess unity was relying on receiving messages intended for the normal indicator applet stuff
<Laney> because it could just see them by mistake
<kenvandine> micahg, i proposed merging my chromium-browser.precise branch, we should really get a precise-security update for chromium
<kenvandine> micahg, for now you can just download the tarball from the quantal package to go with it
<chrisccoulson> kenvandine, we should get PS to do it ;)
<kenvandine> but i'll bug alex to propose his branch of translation tools
<kenvandine> chrisccoulson, they did fix it :)
<micahg> kenvandine: ok, is the branch ready for upload?
<kenvandine> chrisccoulson, but i don't want PS uploading to precise-security :)
<kenvandine> micahg, imo yes...
<kenvandine> i can upload it if you lick
<kenvandine> like even :-D
<kenvandine> i have the tarball and all
<micahg> kenvandine: no, it needs to be built in the security PPA
<kenvandine> it's been in the ubuntu-desktop ppa for weeks now
<micahg> kenvandine: I'll upload it this week
<kenvandine> great
<micahg> kenvandine: thanks for your work on this
<kenvandine> micahg, np
<xclaesse> kenvandine, voilÃ , empathy 3.5.4.1 released with the SSO magic
<kenvandine> WOOT
<kenvandine> xclaesse, thx
<kenvandine> i just landed tp-mission-control with libaccounts enabled in the PPA
<kenvandine> i'll upload empathy there too
<kenvandine> bcurtiswx, let me get this empathy update...
<bcurtiswx> kenvandine, but...but.... okay :P
<kenvandine> :)
<chrisccoulson> kenvandine, oh, i wasn't suggesting to get PS to handle one upload. i was suggesting handing them the maintenance of browsers in the stable releases in general
<bcurtiswx> kenvandine, anything special on this update?
<kenvandine> libaccounts support
<seb128> pitti, Laney: ok, good news, reverting that commit on 1.6.4 gives a working dbus including unity, appmenu and indicators
<Laney> yay, great
<kenvandine> seb128, sorry... i completely missed that it was a3
<seb128> pitti, Laney: so we have a working workaround and know where to investigate
<seb128> kenvandine, no worry ;-)
<Laney> I'll upload that to proposed later then, and raise a bug on unity to get it fixed hopefully.
<seb128> Laney, yeah, I pinged unity people, let's see what comes out from it
<Laney> rather not be carrying the revert for too long
 * Laney assigns bug
<Laney> shall we get rid of the upstart activation patches?
<seb128> Laney, pitti: btw you guys are sure we don't need the upstart patches?
<seb128> Laney, heh, I was wondering, I don't know enough about that
<Laney> I don't /think/ so, and I saw that pitti also said that
<seb128> should we check with James?
<seb128> (Hunt)
<Laney> probably would be a good idea
<seb128> Laney, can you do that? ;-)
<seb128> Laney, thanks
<Laney> np
<pitti> seb128: yes; I grepped the entire quantal (including universe), none of the packages use this facility
<pitti> Laney: ^ FYI
<Laney> ok
<Laney> if he wants to keep them for whatever reason i'll know where to assign the porting work :P
<pitti> indeed :)
<didrocks> pitti grepped the universe, seems to have been quick :)
<pitti> it's just 10^78 atoms
<pitti> (or so)
<seb128> Laney, pitti: ok, Simon (dbus upstream) gave me some tips
<seb128> <smcv> to be compatible with both you have to call AddMatch() once with it (without errors ignored), and if that fails, try again without it
<seb128> <smcv> the patch in Bustle (a D-Bus debugging tool) does that
<seb128> so I will have a look to that
<seb128> waiting for njpatel to reply first, I don't want to waste time to workaround stuff if they can easily fix it
<Laney> ok, keep me posted
<pitti> TTFN
<pitti> seb128, didrocks: see you tomorrow, safe travels!
<pitti> didrocks: see you in Madrid already
<seb128> pitti, thanks, see you tomorrow, safe travel for you as well!
<didrocks> pitti: see you tomorrow at Madrid's gate :)
<seb128> didrocks, kenvandine, mterry, Sweetshark, tkamppeter, Laney, mlankhorst, cyphermox: the meeting time is in 10 min if you have any topic to add, please update https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2012-07-24 (if you didn't do it yet) with what you did as well, thanks
<seb128> ups
<seb128> it's 10 past meeting time rather ;-)
 * didrocks was thinking for a second that he went to a black hole :)
<seb128> well anyway if you have any topic it's the moment to speak
<seb128> didrocks, I shouldn't copy paste without checking :p
<kenvandine> hehe
<didrocks> seb128: ahah, *doh* :)
<mlankhorst> no but let me share some insight that should be generally applicable: redoing kernel api's suck. :-)
<kenvandine> i was about to ask if your clock was wrong
<seb128> just for info didrocks robert_ancell me and some others are at GUADEC starting tomorrow
<seb128> so we might be a bit less online for a week
<seb128> feel free to drop emails though if needed or if you need us to bring any topic or get things figured while we are there
<mlankhorst> oh and double suck if it's kernel api's you're touching.
<seb128> mlankhorst, why would anyone ever redo kernel apis? ;-)
<mlankhorst> it's not inside the kernel yet
<mlankhorst> oh and if you're a binary driver you probably redo several api's
 * ogra_ wonders why gnome-screensaver turns the screen into a bright grey instead of blanking it in todays images
<ogra_> is there a bug open about that ? i see it on all arm images
 * didrocks waves good evening! Have fun everyone :)
<bcurtiswx> kenvandine, can I force a 10.04 install to LTS->LTS upgrade before 12.04.1 ?
<bcurtiswx> seb128, ^^ you know either?
<bcurtiswx> or is it just command line, edit source.list.d for precise and pray?
<seb128> bcurtiswx, you can probably run software-properties-gtk, go to "release upgrade" and change the combo to not be lts only
<seb128> bcurtiswx, the combo has the bottom has a "when to notify about upgrades"
<bcurtiswx> seb128, thx
<jbicha> bcurtiswx: I believe running update-manager -d and have that box set to lts is what you want
<jbicha> I don't have any computers that old to try it myself
<seb128> Sweetshark, still there?
<desrt> seb128: see you tomorrow?
<seb128> desrt, hope so ;-)
<seb128> desrt, I should be there on time for dinner
<desrt> same, i think
 * desrt arrives 5pm
<seb128> desrt, lucky you
<seb128> desrt, you are in the same plane from Madrid that didrocks pitti and robert_ancell
<desrt> i heard about robert
<desrt> didn't know about didrocks and pitti
<seb128> Didier told me today
<seb128> well I don't complain, I got teuf and larsu on my plane
<seb128> we arrive at 19h50
<seb128> so we will be there for the pre-registration party at 21h
<bcurtiswx> sprint?
<bcurtiswx> robert_ancell due in soon?
<jasoncwarner_> chrisccoulson: still around?
<chrisccoulson> hi jasoncwarner_. yeah, i'm still around :)
<jasoncwarner_> hey chrisccoulson is there something going on with FF right now? I sent you a quick email on it, but it is really, REALLY flaky for me right now
<chrisccoulson> jasoncwarner_, oh, i think seb128 was investigating general issues with indicators / appmenu / dbus earlier
<chrisccoulson> it's most probably related
<jasoncwarner_> chrisccoulson: ah, ok...thanks.
<bcurtiswx> kenvandine, still around and not busy?
<chrisccoulson> jasoncwarner_, oh, actually, it can't be that. that was with the new version of dbus which isn't in the archive yet
<chrisccoulson> jasoncwarner_, do you have any other addons installed?
<bcurtiswx> jbicha, got a minute or two?
<jasoncwarner_> chrisccoulson: I can't actually tell you if I do b/c I can't use FF...hogs tons of resource and is generally unstable for me at th emoment so I can't really keep it open
<jasoncwarner_> I don't think I have any others
<jasoncwarner_> though
<jbicha> bcurtiswx: sure, what's up?
<bcurtiswx> jbicha, I did a build and i have new symbols generated from dpkg-gensymbols. What needs to be done with those?
<jbicha> bcurtiswx: they need to be added to the debian/*.symbols file
<bcurtiswx> jbicha, there's ones that are with the - and others (with the newer version) with the +
<jbicha> be sure to leave off the part after the hyphen, for instance 3.5.3 instead of 3.5.3-0ubuntu1
<jbicha> right, the - are deleted rows and the + are added rows, it's a diff format so you can just patch the diff to the existing symbols file
<bcurtiswx> nothing has the -0ubuntu1 but instead 3.5.4-1
<jbicha> I usually just do it manually, which probably means I do it wrong
<jbicha> your version number should be -0ubuntu1 unless it's going to Debian first
<jbicha> but in your symbols file you need to correct it to be just 3.5.4
<jbicha> Ubuntu & Debian can't both use 3.5.4-1 as a version number if those packages aren't exactly the same
<bcurtiswx> ah i see what I did
<bcurtiswx> but anything in a symbols diff can be patched after removing the -0ubuntu1 after
<jbicha> yes, you can do patch -p0 < nameofyoursymbols.diff
<Laney> you should at least skim it to make sure the changes are sane
<bcurtiswx> Laney, what would make something not-sane ?
<Laney> mistakes
<Laney> for example an undeclared compatibility break or a private symbol which accidently becomes visible
<jbicha> generally, symbol removals should get a soname bump (which I believe is the case for the library you're working on)
<bcurtiswx> jbicha, it is, seems upstream has a number .. im gonna pastebin the symbols just for questions.. one sec
<Laney> i'm just saying that you shouldn't blindly apply the patch
<Laney> usually they will be correct, but not always
<bcurtiswx> Laney, yup, and i'd like to learn what a bad section would look like so it throws red flags in my head
<bcurtiswx> http://paste.ubuntu.com/1109113
<bcurtiswx> you can ignore the 3.5.4-1 im fixing that in the changelog before i build again
<bcurtiswx> jbicha, Laney any warning signs in that one.. if not know any examples of what one may look like?
<jbicha> you need to bzr mv debian/libgdl-3-2.symbols to debian/libgdl-3-4.symbols
<jbicha> you need to change the first line of your original symbols file to libgdl-3.so.4 libgdl-3-4 #MINVER#
<bcurtiswx> jbicha, to match soname?
<jbicha> yes
<jbicha> you also need to bzr mv the *.install file to match the symbols file and update debian/control for your new library name
<jbicha> after you've done all that and run the install again you won't have as much of a diff
<jbicha> this example may help: https://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/libgweather/ubuntu/revision/38
<bcurtiswx> jbicha, thx
<jbicha> you don't have to edit debian/control manually for the pkg-gnome packages
<jbicha> you can run fakeroot debian/rules clean
<jbicha> that's mentioned at http://pkg-gnome.alioth.debian.org/packaging.html
<jbicha> most of the rest of that page is specific to the Debian svn though
<jbicha> but you do edit the debian/control.in
<bcurtiswx> jbicha, yup i saw that :) thx
<chrisccoulson> jasoncwarner_, oh, you can figure out if you have any other addons installed by reporting a bug :) (ubuntu-bug firefox)
<chrisccoulson> it will attach that, along with preferences and lots of other helpful data ;)
<jasoncwarner_> chrisccoulson: thanks...will do that. FYI...def *seems* menu related. Menus froze firefox, killed firefox, menus still there. had to hard reboot
<chrisccoulson> jasoncwarner_, does it get better if you kill hud-service before starting it?
<chrisccoulson> i'll bet money that it does ;)
<jasoncwarner_> chrisccoulson: I'll try that next time...
<chrisccoulson> thanks
<bcurtiswx> is robert_ancell usually in about now? or is he USA time ?
<jasoncwarner_> bcurtiswx: he should be travelling to GUADEC so I doubt you'll see him online anytime soon
<bcurtiswx> jasoncwarner_, thx
<jasoncwarner_> bryceh TheMuso RAOF https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2012-07-24 please update and add agenda items, if any.
<jasoncwarner_> (we never seem to have agenda items ;) )
<jbicha> robert lives in New Zealand
<bcurtiswx> jbicha, ah that time zone.. it's like 12 hours diff almost IIRC
<TheMuso> jasoncwarner_: And at least from me, I have none.
<jasoncwarner_> thanks TheMuso
<RAOF> Also none from me.
<bryceh> none here either
<bcurtiswx> anyone wants: https://code.launchpad.net/~bcurtiswx/ubuntu/quantal/gdl/3.5.4-0ubuntu1/+merge/116567
<bcurtiswx> and also: https://code.launchpad.net/~bcurtiswx/ubuntu/quantal/gvfs/1.13.3-0ubuntu1/+merge/116046
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-07-25
<TheMuso> I am starting to hate the new nautilus.
<TheMuso> I want my keyboard shortcut accessible menus back.
<kenvandine> TheMuso, yeah i thought i liked the new nautilus but have changed my mind
<TheMuso> How are people going to know that all the various menu bits that they want are available by clicking the gear icon. Intuativenot IMO.
<jbicha> TheMuso: wow I didn't realize that gear menu thing wasn't really keyboard accessible :(
<jbicha> those embedded Edit & View menus are pretty horrible too
<RAOF> Oh, wow.
<RAOF> Yes.
<RAOF> You know, there is actually a reason that menu bars exist :/
<jbicha> epiphany's is a bit better because there aren't as many options (& they can kinda follow what Chrome has done)
<RAOF> I don't think I like what they've done with the application menu, either.
<TheMuso> I originally thought the menu proxy was making things screwy, so I launched an instance of nautilus with it disabled, which made no difference.
<RAOF> Yeah, I think that single menu is what's meant to be there.
<TheMuso> Yep.
<TheMuso> But I thought the menu proxy may have blocked shortucts that may have worked to open the gear menu and submenus...
<TheMuso> shortcuts
<robru>  I actually like the new nautilus, but yeah it does need some help with the keyboard shortcuts. then again, perhaps I'm biased as my own personal application I developed to not have a menubar, only a simple toolbar and a tiny shell menu.
<TheMuso> robru: Please please please whatever you do, test with the Orca csreen reader, and check keyboard accessibility for comon functions.
<TheMuso> gah my typing sucks today.
<robru> never used orca, good call. I'll give it a shot.
<RAOF> Ooh, it looks like nautilus' type-ahead-find got better, at least.
<TheMuso> It did? Not in my experience so far.
<RAOF> Hm. Or, rather, different.
<TheMuso> IMO its worse.
<robru> I do make sure to have reasonable keyboard shortcuts though.
<RAOF> It's now a true recursive search, but you don't get the awesome behaviour of highlighting the thing that you want.
<RAOF> Urgh. Also, no backspace. That's going to trip me up *all* the time.
<TheMuso> Yep me too, I use backspace a lot to go up in the directory tree.
<RAOF> There's no longer *any* button to go up the directory tree, either.
<TheMuso> Awesome.
<bryceh> sounds like nautilus ought to be reverted
<TheMuso> bryceh: If we value our user's sanity, perhaps.
<TheMuso> Hell if we value our own sanity.
<RAOF> Oh, I guess there *is* the breadcrumb bar, which is kinda go-up-a-directory.
<chrisccoulson> hah, oh, nautilus :(
<chrisccoulson> https://twitter.com/chrisccoulson/status/227446961849122817 ;)
<TheMuso> chrisccoulson: Yeah agreed, plus the above. I can't get to menus with the keyboard, which is a show stopper. Well, not easily anyway. I can do so if I tab around a bit, and trya and work out which button in the toolbar has focus.
<chrisccoulson> TheMuso, yeah. i can normally adapt to most things, but I think i'm going to struggle to like the new version :/
<TheMuso> Looks like I'll be using the terminal for all file management now. I enjoyed using nautilus for file management.
<robru> well, yeah. Where else are you going to write perl one liners for batch renaming files? ;-)
<chrisccoulson> i hate the separation of the appmenu and the gear menu too
<chrisccoulson> although, i dislike the gear menu entirely in nautilus. it only really works if it's not full of submenus
<RAOF> Yeah.
<TheMuso> Agreed to both the above.
<TheMuso> robru: Batch renames are always terminal of course. :)
<RAOF> If you've got a couple of menu items a single menu makes sense; if you've got a significant amount of functionality in a couple of different categories exposed there, it doesn't.
<chrisccoulson> there's a reason why we disable the firefox button in firefox (because it sucks for basically the same reason as the gear menu)
<TheMuso> But nautilus is useful when one has to move large files, as one doesn't neet to keep a terminal open, and one gets a progress update for the most part.
<TheMuso> I'd love to see the design team's reaction when they see these changes.
<robru> TheMuso, I don't feel that it's design is flawed per se, it just seems to me like a few implementation bugs. better keyboard shortcuts and then boil the menus down to the more simpler essentials and it could be just fine.
<jbicha> ok, I reported https://bugzilla.gnome.org/680567 & https://bugzilla.gnome.org/680568
<TheMuso> jbicha: Thanks, the latter was one I was going to file, but I was going to do so after the break I just had. Thanks.
 * jbicha wonders what Ubuntu Online Accounts is, and finds it humorous that it's included in GNOME (empathy) but currently disabled in Ubuntu
 * RAOF is a bit sad about gnome-online-accounts
<micahg> kenvandine: it seems like the pointer isn't being restricted to the contents that it should
<micahg> kenvandine: in the 3 instances I've seen, there's junk appended past the end of where the data should stop
<kenvandine> interesting
 * micahg wonders why it would be i386 only
<kenvandine> that is what is most odd
 * micahg wonders if something isn't null terminating a string somewhere, but that should be on all archs vs just i386
<kenvandine> yeah, it is strange
<kenvandine> if you figure it out... please fix it :) if not i'll work on it more tomorrow
<micahg> unfortunately, I can't spend more time on it, I can file a bug upstream though
<kenvandine> i plan to talk to upstream tomorrow
<micahg> ah, ok, I'll leave it for you then
<kenvandine> i am also curious to see if 0.19.3 has the same problem
<kenvandine> which built before
<kenvandine> i have to finish some libaccounts stuff now though :)
<micahg> kenvandine: I've just kicked off a test build, will let you know
<kenvandine> cool
<kenvandine> thx
 * micahg looks inquisitively at --disable-Werror
<micahg> kenvandine: 0.19.3 passed
<kenvandine> good
<pitti> Good morning
<kenvandine> good morning pitti
<desrt> pitti: hey!
<desrt> pitti: you're on IB 0524, right?
<desrt> pitti: we have a bit of a bad situation.  please check your email for a full explanation.
<BigWhale> Good Morning.
<pitti> desrt: hey; yes, I am
 * pitti offlineimaps
<desrt> pitti: i appreciate any help you can give :)
<pitti> desrt: uh, will do
<desrt> thanks :)
<pitti> desrt: you can't reach him by phone?
<pitti> desrt: do you have a photo of him?
<desrt> tiffany is talking to him right now
<desrt> any messages?
<desrt> i found a picture of him
<pitti> desrt: where does he need to go? Rialta as well, or someplace else?
<desrt> rialta
<pitti> ah, that's easy then, we can just go there together
<pitti> I was going to take a taxi anyway
<desrt> you should have a picture
<desrt> ya... taxi is very cheap
<pitti> I suppose there is little chance to send him https://www.piware.de/fotos/hackergotchi.png now
<larsu> morning pitti, when do you arrive? I'm sharing a cab with seb at around 8 pm
<desrt> will do
<pitti> larsu: I'll arrive at 17:00 already, with didrocks and robert
<larsu> ah okay. Thought you might be on the same flight...
<larsu> see you there, then ;)
<pitti> desrt: got his photo and name on my mobile now, thanks
<pitti> larsu: yeah, safe travels!
<larsu> you too!
<pitti> desrt: so don't worry, we'll pick him up
<robru> hey desrt, do you have a minute, or are you too busy packing?
<desrt> robru: i'm just about to be ushered off of a plane
<robru> hahah, ok. have fun! I'll catch you later.
<desrt> looks like i'm not going to be flying out until the morning...
<desrt> pitti: thanks so much for helping out here.  i owe you one.
<pitti> desrt: no worries
<pitti> desrt: crossing fingers that you'll arrive at last!
<pitti> desrt: how long is the delay, a full day?
<desrt> well
<desrt> we were supposed to leave at 21:45
<desrt> now they tell us 8:00
<pitti> suck
 * pitti hugs desrt
<desrt> looks like we will lose our iberia flight :(
<desrt> it was booked separate
<thumper> desrt: that really sucks
<xclaesse> with today's firefox update there is a "plugin needed" banner taking half my screen :(
<xclaesse> and it can't be removed
<chrisccoulson> xclaesse, screenshot?
<xclaesse> chrisccoulson, actually restarting firefox fixed it already
<chrisccoulson> ah, ok. never mind then :)
<jasoncwarner_> chrisccoulson: remember yesterday when I said FF was causing all sorts of bad juju on my ssytem?
<jasoncwarner_> got the update today and it seemed to be better
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, that seems odd :/
<jasoncwarner_> chrisccoulson: whatever! Magic update fairies too care of my problem. Manager Jason is happy! YAY UPDATE FAIRIES!
<chrisccoulson> heh :)
<jasoncwarner_> I'll give it a thorough testing tonight by spending inordinate amount of time on youtube when I'm done with work
<mlankhorst> jasoncwarner_: during work time of course
<mlankhorst> :D
<rickspencer3> hi jasoncwarner_
<rickspencer3> anyone running Unity 3D on their pandaboards yet?
<jasoncwarner_> hey rickspencer3
<jasoncwarner_> hey mlankhorst
<rickspencer3> hey guys ;)
<rickspencer3> jasoncwarner_, shouldn't Unity 3d work fine on the pandas with the GLES patches?
<jasoncwarner_> hey rickspencer3 running 3d has to wait for gles patch to land. it would be 2d for now.
<jasoncwarner_> rickspencer3: yeah, but that patch isn't there yet.
<mlankhorst> heya
<mlankhorst> heya
<Sweetsha1k> jasoncwarner_: around?
<Sweetshark> hmmm, whoopsie. starting LibreOffice Impress once with LD_DEBUG=all => 207MB logfile
<mlankhorst> Sweetshark: loading 2 gb logfiles with kate that expand to 8gb due to conversion to wide char ;)
<desrt> pitti: hey
<desrt> pitti: everything is looking okayish, more or less.  see you tomorrow.
<RAOF> Good luck!
<desrt> thanks :)
 * desrt flies
<bcurtiswx> good morning
<bcurtiswx> everyone at GUADEC ?
<dobey> nope
<tkamppeter> pitti, hi
<blitzkrieg3> Hello all, can I get a sponsor for bug 873027?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 873027 in unity-2d "DBUS_STARTER_ADDRESS and DBUS_STARTER_BUS_TYPE aren't always unset from environment making gedit and possibly others fail to start" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/873027
<blitzkrieg3> specifically for oneiric-proposed, it's already fixed in precise
<blitzkrieg3> I have a bzr branch and it's already been reviewed by someone
<Laney> chrisccoulson: you want to?
<chrisccoulson> Laney, i'm not even sure i can upload that. i think i tried before already
<Laney> you aren't core-dev?
<chrisccoulson> heh, no, i'm not ;)
<micahg> desktop can upload unity-2d in oneiric
<Laney> indeed
<chrisccoulson> oh, so i can
<chrisccoulson> i'll take a look in a bit then
<blitzkrieg3> nice!
<blitzkrieg3> thanks chrisccoulson!
<bcurtiswx> does anyone in here use tcsh ?
<kenvandine> bcurtiswx, not me
<bcurtiswx> some change in csh has caused errors where setenv only accepts letter to start
<kenvandine> well, i was 20 years ago :)
<bcurtiswx> but in older ubuntu releases this is not the case
<bcurtiswx> so now a script we run got all screwed up :(
<kenvandine> bcurtiswx, did it break in precise or quantal
<bcurtiswx> precise
<bcurtiswx> (they were using 10.10 <hides>
<bcurtiswx> upgraded to 12.04
<cyphermox> I wonder of the guys are having fun at GUADEC..
<cyphermox> https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=680596
<ubot2> Gnome bug 680596 in general "NetworkManager cannot connect to Rialta (Guadec 2012) wifi" [Normal,Assigned]
<bcurtiswx> haha
<cyphermox> :)
<kenvandine> haha
<kenvandine> that's awesome
<kenvandine> i think i saw that danw wasn't going to guadec
<kenvandine> too bad, he could fix it there :)
<cyphermox> kenvandine: it's fixed, pretty much. just really weird ;)
<kenvandine> :-D
<Shinobi> I've installed gnome shell from the launchpad ppa, but when I login via the Gnome (as opposed to the Gnome Classic) desktop, it only goes the the fallback gnome, not the full blown gnome3. Am I missing something?
<jbicha> Shinobi: you need to have working 3D graphics, you probably don't need a PPA though to use gnome-shell
<Shinobi> anyway to check if I have the hardware I need?
<skaet> bryceh, RAOF - could one of you take a look at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/colord/+bug/1026520?  any possible ways of avoiding it?
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 1026520 in colord "colord-sane crashed with SIGSEGV in __opendirat()" [High,Confirmed]
<bryceh> skaet, hopefully RAOF can take it; I'm off on vacation for the remainder of the month
<skaet> bryceh, have a good vacation.
 * skaet hopes RAOF can look at it then too.  :)
<RAOF> skaet: Looking... looks like it's probably a bug in libsane?
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-07-26
<ceti331> can any kwin (or any other DE) use the trackpad gestures 'rotate' and 'zoom' for spinning desktop cube & displaying "Expo" respectively
<RAOF> ceti331: Not without adding code, no.
<ceti331> thanks
<ceti331> mac is nice for the amount it can do with 2 & 3 finger gestures... but those 2-finger gestures are available since i dont use them for photos
<ceti331> gestures are easier to remember than hotkeys :)
<RAOF> As I said before, utouch/libgeis is what you're looking for.
<jbicha> TheMuso: did you see http://git.gnome.org/browse/nautilus/commit/?id=55e2cdd ?
<TheMuso> jbicha: I wasn't looking closely, will take a look, thanks.
<TheMuso> jbicha: Good news, although I think visually things are still too cluttered.
<TheMuso> but anyway.
<TheMuso> Good to hear its addressed.
<jbicha> yeah, in my other bug report they said refining nautilus menus was discussed at the UX hackfest yesterday
<TheMuso> Ah ok.
<TheMuso> I can't help but wonder whether Canonical's design team will suggest that we revert, or at least improve, what is offered by upstream.
<jbicha> serious patching sounds like it'd be a headache so I'm hoping that Nautilus upstream will end up good enough
<TheMuso> Yep.
<BigWhale> Good Morning.
<tkamppeter> pitti, hi
<Sweetshark> moin everyone!
<Sweetshark> Anyone here being able to help me debug that C++11 ABI mess? Starting LibreOffice on Quantal, New Presentation, Close -> Crash. Doesnt happen on precise.
<Sweetshark> I tryed to make a sense out of LD_DEBUG=all output, but did not find anything obviously dirty injecting std::list<> symbols there.
<Sweetshark> Has anyone a good systematic proposal on how to proceed?
<s9iper1> any body knows how can we disable the guest account ???
<mlankhorst> Sweetshark: backtrace?
<mlankhorst> with the relevant registers as well :)
<pitti> tkamppeter: hello; please mail me, I am not on IRC a lot at GUADEC here
<Sweetshark> mlankhorst: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libreoffice/+bug/1027043 <- here is one
<ubot2> Sweetshark: Error: <Bugtracker.plugin.Launchpad instance at 0xa2d980c> bug 1027043 not found
<Sweetshark> mlankhorst: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libreoffice/+bug/1027043 <- here is one (now public)
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 1027043 in libreoffice "soffice.bin crashed with SIGSEGV in std::list<Link, std::allocator<Link> >::remove()" [Medium,Triaged]
<mlankhorst> oh great..
<mlankhorst> Sweetshark: attach debugger, look for any .so attached? :s
<seb128> Sweetshark, try #ubuntu-devel rather than -desktop I guess
<seb128> Sweetshark, slangasek doko etc are no on -desktop
<mlankhorst> but abi breakage, UGH!!
<Sweetshark> mlankhorst: yeah, right ;)
<Sweetshark> mlankhorst: the ABI breakage has been turned back by a tweaked new gcc version, but I assume there are still some poisonous binaries in the distro from the time that the incompatible one was in.
 * Sweetshark mumbles: If only I would be working on SUSE -- their buildservice rebuilds _all_ rdeps. thus the ABI breakage would have been detect on uploading gcc there.
<Sweetshark> :P
<dednick> seb128, ping
<seb128> dednick, hi
<dednick> seb128: hi. I'm looking into generating some thumbnails for work I'm doing in the dash. mhr3 incdicated you might be able to share some info with me on this.
<dednick> seb128: Would ideally want to use what nautilus is using, but not sure if it's accessable via a library or not.
<seb128> dednick, look to totem to see how it thumbnails videos, but it's basically "ship a thumbnailer for the format you are interested in" and register it and nautilus when call it when needed
<mlankhorst> Sweetshark: but creating an incompatible abi with gcc is just asking for trouble :/
<Sweetshark> mlankhorst: sure. I agree totally
<Sweetshark> oh lol, I won myself a blogpost by writing the most hilarious doxygen documentation back in the days: http://blogs.linux.ie/caolan/2012/07/26/core-components-of-the-core/
<Sweetshark> âspecifies a service which allows interfacing the core components of the coreâ
<Sweetshark> remember kids, no such thing will ever go unpunished.
<BigWhale> CTRL-C and CTRL-W are broken in Nautilus... if I select multiple files, CTRL-C, then open another window, and press CTRL-W it will run a search ... instead of copy files
<BigWhale> is this known?
<Laney> BigWhale: do you have the nautilus from proposed?
<Laney> 1:3.5.4-0ubuntu2
<Laney> and I assume you mean V instead of W?
<Laney> unless this is differnent in non-EN
<BigWhale> Laney, V of course ... sorrry
<BigWhale> GNOME nautilus 3.5.4
<BigWhale> oh
<seb128> mterry, hey
<kenvandine> seb128!
<seb128> kenvandine, hey ken
<mterry> seb128, good EST morning!
<seb128> kenvandine, how are you?
<kenvandine> seb128, were you working on libdbus 1.6?
<seb128> mterry, good DST afternoon
<kenvandine> good, and you?
<kenvandine> having fun?
<seb128> kenvandine, yes, having fun
<seb128> kenvandine, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/dbus/+bug/1014850 dbus
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 1014850 in dbus "Update to 1.6.4" [Wishlist,Triaged]
<seb128> kenvandine, we figured the commit that broke unity
<seb128> kenvandine, njpatel is support to have a look yesterday
<seb128> kenvandine, I pinged him earlier he said he would have a look today
<seb128> kenvandine, something is unity-panel-service seems to not like the anti eavedropping they put it
<seb128> there
<kenvandine> ok cool, we've figured out that we think that would fix a gwibber-service crash we are getting when using libaccounts
<kenvandine> since 1.4 didn't even try to be thread safe
<kenvandine> but
<kenvandine> we are probably just going to port the backend to gdbus
<seb128> mterry, did you see my comment on that unity-greeter bug?
<mterry> seb128, maybe not?  Remind me
<seb128> mterry, I commented earlier to know if you could backport the fix for the "write random 500k of data which slows down the greeter"
<seb128> mterry, good if you didn't, unping, we are looking at it with Robert here
<seb128> mterry, so just let it to us
<mterry> I don't think I'm subscribed to all unity-greeter bugs.  But that was a bug I worked on, so I should be subscribed...
<mterry> seb128, but OK!  :)
<mterry> seb128, sounds like 12.04.1 is going to rock  :)
<seb128> mterry, the bug is assigned to you
<desrt> seb128: 12.04.1 was going to be the fr_FR.UTF-8 by-default release, right?
<seb128> desrt, oui
<kenvandine> hshs
<kenvandine> haha even
<mterry> seb128, hmm, will check my filters
<seb128> mterry, just drop the if sender == seb128 then move_to_speam
<seb128> spam
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> mterry, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/precise/+source/unity-greeter/+bug/1005642 is the bug btw
<ubot2> Ubuntu bug 1005642 in unity-greeter "Garbage written to state file, causing slow UI" [High,Fix released]
<mterry> seb128, that sessioninstaller bug (bug 848605)...  were you able to reproduce?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 848605 in sessioninstaller "session-installer crashed with AlreadyCalledDeferred in callback()" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/848605
<mterry> seb128, I rolled that fix, but can't reproduce myself
<seb128> mterry, no I was not :-(
<mterry> bummer
<seb128> mterry, I guess we will just need to see if reports stop
<mterry> seb128, hahah, I just got Robert's changes to the bug
<mterry> seb128, I must have some seb filter
<seb128> mterry, !!!
<Shinobi> If I index the description fields in a series of records, can sphinx return the the primary key of ranked results?
<bcurtiswx> good morning
<bcurtiswx> that scrollback from znc is funny. Is the seb filter a requirement to join ~ubuntu-desktop?
<mterry> bcurtiswx, the seb filter is not a *requirement*, just a recommendation.  Not so much because we don't want to see his bug spam, but just because we like making him ping us
<kenvandine> mterry, if i have a bunch of packages that need MIRs, do I really need one bug per package?  I assume so...
<mterry> kenvandine, I think it's actually easier to keep track of a cohesive set of packages in one bug
<mterry> kenvandine, ideally the requested information is still examined and given per package in the description though
<kenvandine> mterry, so you won't yell at me if i use a single bug then ?
<kenvandine> yeah
<mterry> kenvandine, no, I like it.  As long as they are related.  Like one top package and all its dependencies or something
<kenvandine> so... online-accounts and unity-webapps total 29 packages :-D
<mterry> kenvandine, :(
<kenvandine> but i plan to split it up, online-accounts separate from webapps
<mterry> kenvandine, well, I'll bill that time to my +1 team cycle
<mterry> kenvandine, sure
<kenvandine> mterry, that is exactly what seb128 said :)
<mterry> kenvandine, 2 bugs sounds fine
<kenvandine> it is a pile of packages... that's what kept me busy all cycle
<kenvandine> just started landing some of the sources in quantal :)
<mterry> kenvandine, better hurry though!  This is my last week on +1.  After this, I'll whine more about doing the MIR  :)
<kenvandine> oh... crap... i won't be ready for it this week
<mterry> kenvandine, if you tell me some of the package names, I can start now while you do the paperwork
<kenvandine> maybe online-accounts
<mterry> kenvandine, no worry, I can still do them later.  Just won't be during my +1 rotation
<mterry> I might fob them off on poor didrocks or something
<kenvandine> signon, libsignon-glib and libaccounts-glib
<seb128> kenvandine, when he says "week" it's a week time, not by tomorrow
<kenvandine> is in sourceNEW now
<seb128> kenvandine, i.e end of month
<mterry> seb128, end of July!
<kenvandine> ah... i might have them all in by then :)
<mterry> seb128, oh, I guess there's Monday
<seb128> mterry, tuesday is the 31
<seb128> mterry, so it's actually almost a week of time
<mterry> seb128, you and your crazy calendars
<seb128> ;-)
<mterry> who made my calendar start on Monday?  I'm used to Sunday.  Stupid locales
<seb128> do you get your weather in Â°C as well?
<mterry> Guh, Britain
<mterry> I think I set en_GB back in the day for 24 hour time, but now the clock lets me set that directly
<mterry> This must be fascinating for #ubuntu-desktop  :)
<mterry> kenvandine, will start reviewing
<kenvandine> i know i am on the edge of my seat here
<kenvandine> mterry, thx
<kenvandine> seb128's been reviewing them for me before i uploaded them
<seb128> I do NEW review though
<seb128> not security reviews or code reviews
<kenvandine> indeed
 * mterry hugs kenvandine for the symbols file
<kenvandine> :)
<kenvandine> i tried to use symbols files for the cpp stuff too
<kenvandine> but it got to be too big of a pita
 * kenvandine hugs C
<mterry> kenvandine, yeah, I don't even bother complaining about lack of symbols files for c++
<kenvandine> i eventually whacked them
<seb128> kenvandine, ok, you got 3 sources through, only 26 left ;-)
 * kenvandine hugs seb128
<kenvandine> more coming soonish
 * seb128 hugs kenvandine back
<seb128> kenvandine, will be tomorrow for me
<kenvandine> sure
<kenvandine> it might be tomorrow for me too
<seb128> we are eod at GUADEC, will travel back from the conf place soon
<kenvandine> i need to upload a patched firefox to the PPA now
<kenvandine> racarr did what chrisccoulson suggested and wants people to test it
<seb128> ok
<chrisccoulson> heh, i started looking at that addon last night. it's not very future proof :(
<chrisccoulson> it's completely incompatible with multiple content processes, for example (and that's going to happen soon for desktop, like it is already for mobile)
<kenvandine> chrisccoulson, make sure you give that feedback to racarr
<chrisccoulson> kenvandine, yeah, i want to review a bit more first
<kenvandine> sure
<kenvandine> i'd be nice if he could fix all that stuff up sooner than later
<chrisccoulson> but it's not good that a future security update is going to require significant changes to their code to keep it working :/
<kenvandine> exactly... so would be good to address it now
<kenvandine> chrisccoulson, did you look at his patch for firefox too?
<chrisccoulson> not yet
<mterry> kenvandine, one thing I would normally mention for most of these packages is having a bug subscriber.  So I'll just do it once up front.  :)  Maybe ~ubuntu-desktop or some such
<kenvandine> ok, well we'll make sure you do before it lands in the distro :)
<kenvandine> mterry, yeah i am actually working on that now
<chrisccoulson> it won't land in the distro before i've looked at it
<kenvandine> well sort of...
<chrisccoulson> else i will just revert it again ;)
<kenvandine> i need the packages to exist before people can subscribe
<chrisccoulson> it won't land in the distro until it's been reviewed and committed upstream either
<kenvandine> but i am making a list of packages and notes on what to do with them
<kenvandine> ok
<mterry> kenvandine, have you started a MIR bug?  Else I'll make one to add notes to as I go, and you can fill in on your side too as you go
<kenvandine> i haven't yet
 * mterry makes one
<kenvandine> thx!
<mterry> kenvandine, bug 1029549
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1029549 in libsignon-glib "[MIR] online-accounts and friends" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1029549
<kenvandine> thanks!
<mterry> kenvandine, bug 1029549
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1029549 in signon "[MIR] online-accounts and friends" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1029549
<kenvandine> mterry, added a list of packages and description
<mterry> kenvandine, the upstream source is listed as http://code.google.com/p/accounts-sso/ and I see tarballs there, but no vcs?
<kenvandine> they are there
<kenvandine> in git
<kenvandine> http://code.google.com/p/accounts-sso/source/checkout
<kenvandine> multiple repos
<kenvandine> code reviews and all go there
<mterry> kenvandine, oh, when I went to browse or commits, it shows nothing
<mterry> and when I checkout, I get nothing...  Hm
<mterry> ah!
<mterry> there is a dropdown for which project
<kenvandine> right
<kenvandine> the GI patch to libsignon-glib is in a branch there pending review
<kenvandine> and the signond patch won't get merged, that is a distro specific change
<ricotz> Laney, hi, just wanted to say that gstreamer0.10-plugins-bad 0.10.22.3-2ubuntu4 "/usr/share/gstreamer-0.10/presets/GstVP8Enc.prs" conflicts with transmageddon 0.20-1
<Laney> huh, weird
<Laney> which package should have it?
<ricotz> Laney, not sure, gstreamer seems more appropriate, but obviously transmageddon already ships it ;)
<Laney> can you take care of it? I'm busy with A3 stuff atm
<ricotz> Laney, i am not a motu
<kenvandine> mterry, it's kind of weird... we are sort of the upstream for it, but intel contributes too and it is used in meego
<kenvandine> so the core bits of it all live outside of launchpad
<mterry> kenvandine, is there a reason not to use debhelper 9 instead?  You get multiarch and hardening flags for free
<kenvandine> no reason
<kenvandine> and multiarch was on my todo list anyway
<micahg> hi nessita
<nessita> hello micahg, how is it going?
<micahg> nessita: ok, how are you
<nessita> pretty good, thanks
<micahg> nessita: I have a bug (I need to update the aptitude why output, but you should still get the idea), Bug #1029552 , can you take a look?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1029552 in xubuntu-meta "Qt is pulled in unnecessarily due to software-center Recommends and ubuntu-sso-client-gtk removal" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1029552
<nessita> micahg: I'm on rotation for a couple of months to another team for helping in some specific integration issues, so I will ask someone currently working on the U1 dekstop team to look at it (very likely, dobey)
<nessita> dobey: hey there, you around?
<micahg> nessita: ah, ok, I pinged you since you created the s-c branch :)
<dobey> hi
<nessita> micahg: yeah, is absolutely ok
<nessita> dobey: any chance you could take a look at the bug micahg pointed out? perhaps is a SC issue only, and I can talk about with michael
<dobey> it's not unnecessary
<dobey> and the -qt will get pulled in anyway
<nessita> dobey: why?
<dobey> ubuntu one?
<micahg> dobey: no, it's unnecessary for Xubuntu :)
<dobey> oh
<dobey> i guess software center should Provides: ubuntu-sso-client-gui
<micahg> dobey: I thought there was going to be a new binary
<dobey> no
<micahg> software-center-sso-gtk not happening?
<dobey> there just is no more ubuntu-sso-client-gtk; s-c includes the same code renamed; and it's only useful for software-center
<dobey> micahg: it's part of the software-center binary package
<dobey> no need for a separate package there
<micahg> ah, ok, yeah, that would be fine then
<wendar> I've got an odd window resize bug (the window disappears when the user tries to resize it) in precise. I'm looking for suggestions on how to debug it.
<wendar> It reminds me of a compiz bug we resolved last year.
<nessita> dobey: want me to talk about this with michael tomorrow?
<wendar> (where the solution was to make sure the window was registered in a separate location for compiz)
<dobey> nessita: i don't think there's anything to discuss. seems xubuntu will need software-center to have a Provides: ubuntu-sso-client-gui is all; and i don't really have a significant opinion on it one way or the other in that case
<micahg> as U1 and ubuntu-sso-client are the only consumers, that shouldn't cause issues and solve our dependency chain problem
<nessita> dobey: ah, I understood sc should Provides: ussoc-gui in all the packages (not only xubuntu)
<micahg> dobey: well, it's anyone not shipping Qt and including software-center
<dobey> nessita: yes, i mean xubuntu is where this is really an issue. the packages wouldn't be specific to them
<micahg> nessita: yes, it would be everywhere
<dobey> micahg: right, just using the example as the example :)
<nessita> ok, so michael needs to change this in the sc source tree
<dobey> right, because it's a native package :-/
<micahg> well, Xubuntu is the only one it seems affected :)
<dobey> so fixing it requires a s-c release
<dobey> well i'm sure kubuntu don't care that qt is being pulled in :)
<dobey> lubuntu might care and just haven't been vocal yet
<micahg> UbuntuStudio, Mythbuntu, and Edubuntu all have Qt through other means
<dobey> right
<micahg> lubuntu and kubuntu don't ship S-C
<dobey> ah
 * micahg could just drop S-C, but would rather not
<ceti331> in kwin, is it possible to launch 'desktop cube' or 'desktop grid' from a panel-widget
<dobey> well, we could possibly just remove the Recommends: in ubuntu-sso-client package as well
<dobey> ceti331: i think you want #kde for that question? :)
<micahg> dobey: that would work as well if it's not needed
<dobey> it shouldn't break anything i don't think
<dobey> u1 stuff explicitly requires ubuntu-sso-client-qt in the control panel, and so it's already there in Ubuntu now too
<micahg> ok, that might make more sense
<dobey> or just make it a suggests
<micahg> suggests would be fine, the GUI seems tangential to the dbus service anyways
<dobey> well, a UI is required to actually register or log in. but we have explicit depends already; and can add more where necessary, if we need to
<micahg> hrm, then I guess provides does make sense since it has the gui
<micahg> and the recommends makes sense as well
<dobey> well, except the s-c gui is only used by s-c, and won't get used automatically from elsewhere
<dobey> so probably not the best
<dobey> micahg: anyway, just put my thoughts into the bug.
<micahg> dobey: ok, I'm fine with 2, if you want to switch from a s-c task to an u-sso-c task
<dobey> sounds fine to me
<micahg> dobey: can you take/fix it after alpha3?
<micahg> I'm happy to do the upload otherwise
<dobey> micahg: i'll fix it right now and upload it to q-proposed
<micahg> dobey: great, thanks
<nessita> dobey: thanks for taking care of this :-)
<dobey> sure
<dobey> and done. :)
<mterry> kenvandine, ping me as new pkgs get uploaded!
<mterry> rarrr, feed me MIRs!
<kenvandine> mterry, will do :)
 * mterry is a machine that converts MIRs into complaints about test suites
<kenvandine> mterry, we used to have to build signon with gcc 4.6, but i hadn't tried 4.7 in ages
<mterry> kenvandine, dunno, just happend to work in my chroot
<kenvandine> the tests pass in they're jenkins build but haven't been friendly in the package builds
<mterry> kenvandine, a hardcoded system path perhaps?
<kenvandine> mterry, i don't think i've tried in months
<mterry> kenvandine, well, I would accept a dep8-ified version of the tests, but I didn't see that either
<kenvandine> dep8-ified?
<dobey> kenvandine: what's passing in jenkins but failing in package builds?
<kenvandine> signon
<kenvandine> it's still in a private jenkins
<mterry> kenvandine, dep8 is the autopkgtest stuff
<mterry> kenvandine, see update-manager for example.  debian/tests
<dobey> oh, the package isn't running the tests
<Laney> ricotz: I'm just going to make gst ship only /usr/share/gstreamer-0.10/presets/GstVP8Enc.prs for now
<Laney> fighting it out with the other package doesn't seem worth it
<Laney> Three uploads for this package. Sigh. Don't kick me out.
<Laney> hmm, actually, no: that one was the point of this upload. I thought it was the other file.
<micahg> umm, it's a universe package :)
<Laney> so?
<micahg> why should the desktop team care?
<micahg> now MOTUs on the other hand :)
<Laney> ricotz brought it up in here.
<micahg> indeed
 * Laney shrugs
<micahg> just saying, you're looking out for the wrong lynch mob :)
<Laney> you read it anyway :P
<Laney> stealing the file from transmageddon then
<Laney> it has the Depends anyway
<micahg> Laney: is there a reason that package wasn't merged from Debian yet (has multiarch support there)
<Laney> which?
<micahg> -plugins-bad
<Laney> dunno
<Laney> I haven't evaluated what the changes are
<robru> bah, who broke gedit-plugins?
<micahg> robru: happens every cycle when gedit is updated without the plugins
<robru> ah.
<robru> Remind me never to update gedit again ;-)
<micahg> robru: this is quantal, right?
<robru> yeah
<robru> Got a little carried away with the dist-upgrade command
<micahg> robru: feel free to propose a merge/debian dir debdiff
<robru> I'll look in a bit. Pretty busy putting out other fires at the moment.
<micahg> robru: oh, there aren't any updates available, so that's probably why it's still broke
<robru> so, what then? somebody just needs to make the package and submit it?
<micahg> no, I mean no upstream releases
<robru> so how to fix this then? is it just a matter of recompiling the plugins against a new binary, or is there more to it? Because the gedit-plugins package says it depends on gedit < 3.5 wheras I have > 3.5 installed
<robru> was there some big API change in the gedit plugins infrastructure?
<micahg> oh, hrm, let me see
<robru> $ sudo apt-get install gedit-plugins
<robru> Reading package lists... Done
<robru> Building dependency tree
<robru> Reading state information... Done
<robru> Some packages could not be installed. This may mean that you have
<robru> requested an impossible situation or if you are using the unstable
<robru> distribution that some required packages have not yet been created
<robru> or been moved out of Incoming.
<robru> The following information may help resolve the situation:
<robru> The following packages have unmet dependencies:
<robru>  gedit-plugins : Depends: gedit (< 3.5) but 3.5.1-0ubuntu2 is to be installed
<robru> E: Unable to correct problems, you have held broken packages.
<micahg> robru: yeah, I see that now
<robru> I have a hunch that it would work just fine if it were installed, but it's just the listed dependencies on the package itself are broken. Though I'm just assuming.
<robru> Anyway, I'll poke at it later.
<micahg> robru: it builds fine, but I have no idea of the consequences of changing the dependency, maybe one of the desktoppers can comment
<Laney> http://git.gnome.org/browse/gedit/log/
<Laney> doesn't look like any API changing commits
<robru> thanks Laney
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-07-27
<tkamppeter> X experts around here?
<seb128> tkamppeter, try #ubuntu-x or talk to mlankhorst
 * mlankhorst pretends to be afk
<mlankhorst> but yeah #ubuntu-x would be better
<chrisccoulson> hey seb128, how are you?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, hey, how are you?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, not too bad thanks. how's guadec?
<seb128> good!
<mvo> no seb128 today?
<Sweetsha1k> mvo: i just dicovered the same.
<seb128> Laney, hey, there?
<Laney> seb128: Sure, but I'm rushing out in a second
<seb128> Laney, hey
<Laney> howdy
<seb128> Laney, do you think you would have time next week to look at the rhythmbox "mp3 profile quality is poor" next week?
<seb128> ups, "next week" duplication ;-)
<seb128> Laney, it might be worth trying to get fixed for the lts .1
<Laney> seb128: sure, what's the bug?
<seb128> not sure how many people do mp3 of CDs nowadays but I guess still quite some
<Laney> assign it to me if you want
<ogra_> aq:q
<seb128> Laney, ok, looking for the number, that's the one we discussed briefly with ronoc a month ago
<ogra_> bah !
<Laney> yeah I remember it
<seb128> Laney, bug #945987
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 945987 in rhythmbox "No Settings are available in "Preferred format", only preset defaults are used" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/945987
<seb128> Laney, assigned to you, thanks
<seb128> Laney, have a good w.E!
<Laney> thanks, and you!
<Laney> is it guadec-ful or is there an excursion or?
<seb128> no excursion
<seb128> GUADEC only ;-)
<Laney> hardcore
<ogra_> GUADEC isnt a drinking excursion ?
<seb128> lol
 * ogra_ always thought it was
<seb128> that's a secret!
<seb128> ogra_, but no, there is not only drinking, we spend time on the beach as well
<ogra_> oh, frying your brain with hot sun while drinking then, yeah makes sense i guess that saves some beer costs :)
<seb128> mpt, hey, are you there?
<seb128> kenvandine, mpt, mterry: hey, do you guys have opinions on rb keywords? (bug #1029964), I would like to add some for 12.04.1 to make rb easier to find in the dash
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1029964 in rhythmbox "should use keywords in its .desktop entry" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1029964
<seb128> "_Keywords=mp3;Audio;CD;MTP;Podcast;DAAP;Playlist;Ipod;" was a quick list I made, how does it look to you?
 * kenvandine thinks
<mterry> Song?
<kenvandine> Music?
<mterry> kenvandine, the title already has that "Rhythmbox Music Player"
<kenvandine> good point
<seb128> what mterry said
<kenvandine> :)
<seb128> can add Song
<kenvandine> i thought that was too obvious
<mterry> not sure anyone would use song
<kenvandine> Stream ?
<kenvandine> Radio
<mterry> i like radio
<seb128> cool
<mterry> what about "competitors"?  like services like spotify or whatever
<mterry> i guess it can't connect to them, so that would be misleading
<seb128> right, and not sure if using trademarked names could put us in trouble
<seb128> like we couldn't use twitter for broadcasting
<mterry> sound?
<mterry> no one searches for sound  :)
<mterry> aural  :)
<mterry> gramaphone
<kenvandine> haha
<mterry> seb128, seems like a good list as is
<mpt> seb128, no, I have no opinions on Rhythmbox keywords :-)
<seb128> kenvandine, mterry, mpt: thanks
<kenvandine> mpt, no opinion is an opinion :)
<kenvandine> will these keywords be indexed for unity searches too?  i assume so
<mpt> I'm trying to have opinions on fewer things, and that just doesn't make the cut
<kenvandine> :-D
<seb128> kenvandine, yeah, that's the point, find stuff in the dash
<seb128> kenvandine, it's hard to find the ipod app if you don't know it's rhythmbox for example
<mpt> However, that does remind me that we should replace USC's infantile keyword search DB with the proper .desktop entry one
<kenvandine> does anyone know of a package that requires gnome-keyring-daemon to be running for tests that i can look at?
<kenvandine> mterry, seb128, anyone? ^^
<mterry> no?
<kenvandine> i am trying to get the signon-keyring-extension tests to run in the package, but it isn't happy about starting the daemon
<seb128> kenvandine, no, pitti is a better person to ask I guess
<kenvandine> pitti, ^^
<kenvandine> mardy plans to mock it so it doesn't need the daemon, but he has other stuff he has to finish first
<bcurtiswx> kenvandine, is gwibber "dead" in quantal in favor of webapps ?
<kenvandine> sort of
<kenvandine> actually no
<kenvandine> :)
<kenvandine> miss-read
<bcurtiswx> i was wondering why i didn't see it on my quantal
<kenvandine> webapps doesn't provide background apps yet
<kenvandine> it's still there
<kenvandine> should be
<kenvandine> :)
<kenvandine> bcurtiswx, do you have the webapps PPA enabled?
<bcurtiswx> kenvandine, i did on precise, to test at least, not at the moment though
<bcurtiswx> i don't see it in it's usual indicator on quantal
<kenvandine> there is a port of gwibber that uses online-accounts
<kenvandine> which hasn't merged with trunk yet
<kenvandine> and is in the webapps ppa
<kenvandine> dunno... you should
<ogra_> seb128, poke
<seb128> ogra_, hey
<ogra_> seb128, my mgmt asked me about compiz :) i thought i should ping once again (though i guess its still blocked on the missing GLES drivers)
<ogra_> did you hear anything from upstream ?
<seb128> ogra_, things are taking time, we still hope they will land before feature freeze
<ogra_> hmm, k
<ogra_> seb128, thx
<seb128> ogra_, gsettings still didn't land and then gles will come after
<seb128> ogra_, yw
<ogra_> oh
<ogra_> i thought they were done with gsettings last week
<bcurtiswx> kenvandine, look at bug #1012698 i know it says invalid but there are a whole bunch of these
<bcurtiswx> its a private report so the bot won't catch it
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> bcurtiswx, interesting... i've gotten a very similar crash from xchat-gnome
<bcurtiswx> kenvandine, i just got the crash and found all these bug reports with similar titles and all invalidated by the bots immediately
<kenvandine> /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/gtk-3.0/modules/liboverlay-scrollbar.so
<bcurtiswx> kenvandine, yes
<bcurtiswx> seb128, kenvandine, i find this quite interesting.. https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.searchtext=crashed+with+SIGSEGV+in+cairo_region_is_empty%28%29&search=Search&field.status%3Alist=NEW&field.status%3Alist=INVALID&field.status%3Alist=CONFIRMED&field.status%3Alist=TRIAGED&field.status%3Alist=INPROGRESS&field.status%3Alist=FIXCOMMITTED&field.status%3Alist=INCOMPLETE_WITH_RESPONSE&field.status%3Alist=INCOMPLETE_WITHOUT_RESP
<bcurtiswx> ONSE&field.assignee=&field.bug_reporter=&field.omit_dupes=&field.has_patch=&field.has_no_package=
<bcurtiswx> hmm lemme bit.ly that
<bcurtiswx> seb128, kenvandine http://bit.ly/MpFz7I
<seb128> bcurtiswx, that's a lot of recent bugs
<seb128> overlay-scrollbar issue it seems
<bcurtiswx> yes
<seb128> kenvandine, ^ can you handle it
 * seb128 hugs mterry
<mterry> seb128, hello!  Why the hug?
<seb128> mterry, hey
<seb128> mterry, seeing people closing work items on friday!
<mterry> Not that I require reasons to hug me  :)
<seb128> mterry, we are almost on trend ;-)
<mterry> heh
<seb128> that might be the one putting us back on
<seb128> ;-)
<mterry> confetti rains from sky
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> mterry, how are things otherwise? ready to be back from +1 to desktop soon :-)
<mterry> seb128, yeah.  Nervous about the pile of work to finish when I come back.  :)
<seb128> hehe
<mterry> Should keep me nice and busy
<seb128> indeed
<seb128> not to mention ken's pile of mirs
<mterry> +1 is relaxing in that sense; less goal oriented
<seb128> mterry, let's see, it's my turn next to be there ;-)
<seb128> though I will probably use some of the time to help catching up on GNOME updates
<mterry> seb128, I've left plenty of FTBFS for ya
<seb128> thanks... ;-)
<mterry> purposely didn't fix as many as I could have, because I know you like them
<seb128> lol
<seb128> will have to figure a way to thank you back for that ;-)
<seb128> I might just not do some updates in exchange and let them for you!
<seb128> ok, end of day at GUADEC
<seb128> have a nice w.e for those who are not working tomorrow ;-)
<seb128> (not sure I can qualify GUADEC as "working but I will be around)
<kenvandine> wow that is a lot of bugs
<seb128> kenvandine, yeah, can you make sure it gets looked at?
<kenvandine> yeah
<seb128> thanks
<kenvandine> i added overlay-scrollbar to bug 101698, marked as high and assigned to cimi
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 101698 in silva "SNN: on installation a subject and target audience should be created" [Wishlist,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/101698
<kenvandine> i'll also nag cimi about it
<kenvandine> bug 1012698
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1012698 in overlay-scrollbar "empathy-chat crashed with SIGSEGV in cairo_region_is_empty()" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1012698
<seb128> yeah, I guess it will be for next week
<kenvandine> bcurtiswx, do you think you could go through that list and dupe all those bugs that have cairo_region_is_empty and overlay-scrollbars is in the StackTraceTop?
 * kenvandine needs food!
<bcurtiswx> kenvandine, not today, maybe next week?
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-07-28
<MCl0vin> is there someone here that can help me with 12.04 issue that i am having with my sound
<MCl0vin> when i plug in headphone in audio jack "laptop" sound will come both the laptop speakers and headphone
<pitti> kenvandine: can't you run it under dbus-launch, so that you do not depend on any outside daemon
<kelemengabor> hi pitti, got a few minutes for translations work? It is time to open Quantal translations, could you help me with that?
<robru> test test
<robru> empathy seems to be crashing on me a lot.
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-07-29
<bcurtiswx> i can not find the CURRENT accountsservice branch
<ChaoPeng> hi there
<desrt> seb128: word
<seb128> desrt, howdy
<desrt> where are you?
<seb128> desrt, gstreamer talk
<desrt> seb128: we're having a work day
<desrt> because, you know, it's sunday...
<seb128> desrt, I will be hacking downstair after that one
<seb128> desrt, like hacking on the beach then? :-)
<desrt> too cold for that :)
<seb128> :-(
<robru> Anybody else having problems with telepathy/mission-control-5 on quantal? Or is it just me?
<bcurtiswx> robru, how so?
<bcurtiswx> robru, i have to go, but there were updates to empathy recently that should have fixed any issues that I know of.
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-07-22
<pitti> Good morning
<darkxst> hey pitti
<pitti> hey darkxst, how are you?
<darkxst> quite sore, after a weekend full of caving!
<pitti> hah, but sounds fun! (unless you get lost)
<darkxst> yeh was lots of fun, and no we didnt get lost ;)
<jbicha> the hud really doesn't like having hundreds of bookmarks in Firefox
<jbicha> I'm a bit of a hoarder, I had over 3000 bookmarks
<sil2100> didrocks: hello! Are you ready for some ACKs ;) ?
<didrocks> sil2100: hey, hum, sure, but on what exactly as I published most of the things ready? :)
<didrocks> already*
<sil2100> didrocks: media finished!
<sil2100> didrocks: oh, platform doesn't need an ACK
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<didrocks> sil2100: yeah, media just finished ;)
<didrocks> salut seb128
<seb128> hey didrocks & sil2100
<sil2100> Hi seb128
<didrocks> sil2100: we still needs apps, which is the #1 for webbrowser :)
<sil2100> didrocks: I also re-ran unity powerpc, since it failed on an unit test
<didrocks> sil2100: the tests failed for unity, timeout btw
<didrocks> sil2100: I've published platform as well: one flacky test
<sil2100> didrocks: ah, so I re-ran it without no reason
<sil2100> didrocks: since I re-ran it with foo to have it green and check passed ;)
 * sil2100 didn't know anyone else was doing the stacks
<sil2100> didrocks: btw. should I also take care of mirslave in the morning? Or is it something i shouldn't touch right now?
<didrocks> sil2100: well, it should just bypass everything on platform if you rerun it and it was published :)
<didrocks> sil2100: don't touch on mir/mirslave, this is for robert_ancell :)
<didrocks> sil2100: I just tried to ensure we have everything from the week-end published for today's image
<didrocks> so kind of "exception for the rule"
<didrocks> so that we get all tests results on the phone for rickspencer3 to crack the whip :)
<sil2100> didrocks: ACK ;) http://10.97.0.1:8080/view/cu2d/view/Head/view/Media/job/cu2d-media-head-3.0publish/lastSuccessfulBuild/artifact/packaging_changes_qtubuntu-cameraplugin-fake_0.1.10+13.10.20130722-0ubuntu1.diff <- this change you requested yourself, so I guess I can publish?
<didrocks> sil2100: yeah, +1 ;)
<didrocks> sil2100: oh, webapps seems in a good shape today :)
<sil2100> didrocks: waiting on Apps, as for unity... I see we had 17 failures on the other machine, which sounds nice
<sil2100> didrocks: so maybe, just maybe, we could publish anyway?
<didrocks> sil2100: right, but the timeout on the other machines seem to tell that there is still this dbus issue
<didrocks> right?
<didrocks> and 17 is still way higher than old results which was ~9 when we last published it
<sil2100> didrocks: could be, let me poke mhr3 again, but it's a bit sad that last successful unity release was 14 days ago ;(
<didrocks> sil2100: yeah, I agree, let's check with him and then, we can decide?
<didrocks> sil2100: also maybe deciphering if the failures are false positive or not?
<sil2100> didrocks: makes sense ;)
<didrocks> you have videos btw ;)
<sil2100> Yay! Finally \o/ I wonder how the low FPS looks in the vids
<didrocks> (6 fps to keep the recording light, with diff instead of full screenshot)
 * sil2100 checks
<didrocks> sil2100: we have that for several days actually :)
<sil2100> didrocks: hooo, I just opened one of the videos and it seems to have found a real regression ;) But anyway, those vids look pretty good, not so fluid but good
<didrocks> sil2100: I think 6 fps is still good enough to see transitions and if things behave badly :)
<didrocks> and nice to catch real issues!
<darkxst> seb128, hi
<seb128> darkxst, hey
<darkxst> would it be ok to land this patch https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=701613
<ubot2`> Gnome bug 701613 in gtk "XEmbed doesn't work with frame-synced GTK/Mutter" [Critical,Unconfirmed]
<darkxst> it hasnt been committed yet, but it fixes a very annoying bug'
<seb128> hum, not before it gets commited and gets some testing
<darkxst> seb128, right, I figured that would be the case, but as it stands now, the lock screen when using lightdm/gnome-shell is completely frozen
<Laney> morning!
<seb128> darkxst, seems we still don't delay update to new versions enough... ;-)
<seb128> Laney, good morning! how are you? had a good w.e?
<Laney> seb128: yeah pretty good, mostly spent in cafes and pubs :P
<Laney> you?
<seb128> quite good, spent it mostly inside as well, it was getting really hot outside
<darkxst> I don't know if anyone else is using Xembed/gtkplug with mutter, and gnome-screensaver is unmaintained after all
<Laney> ah mine was the opposite - the hot weather has gone away a bit :(
<didrocks> sil2100: hum, publishing apps FYI
<rickspencer3> hi ivanka!
<ivanka> hi rickspencer3!
<ivanka> rickspencer3, how are you? And, are you supposed to be awake at this hour?
<sil2100> didrocks: ah, it finished? ACK, thanks :)
<rickspencer3> :)
<rickspencer3> ivanka, I decided to never sleep so that I can ask for status reports around the clock
<didrocks> sil2100: hey, what about the location stuff?
<didrocks> sil2100: didn't you have a component I preNEWed?
<rickspencer3> (actually,  I am in Europe for a little bit, so it's 10:13am here in Berlin :) )
<czajkowski> aloha
<rickspencer3> ivanka, where are you?
<ivanka> rickspencer3, ah - makes slightly more sense than not sleeping
<ivanka> ivanka, I am in London
<sil2100> didrocks: I think everything landed, since you pre-newed indicator-location and I see it in the archive
<czajkowski> folks on saucy , has your battery indicator vanished?
<didrocks> sil2100: ah, it's not in the location stack, ok!
<seb128> czajkowski, it did for larsu who is debugging
<didrocks> sil2100: I prenewed unity-webapps-qml FYI
<didrocks> sil2100: I think you can publish webapps
<sil2100> \o/
<czajkowski> seb128: grand job I don't need to report :)
<czajkowski> I'll affect me if I find the bug
<sil2100> didrocks: publishing
<czajkowski> cheers
<sil2100> didrocks: what about the MIR stack ;)?
<didrocks> 09:42:46     didrocks | sil2100: don't touch on mir/mirslave, this is for robert_ancell :)
<sil2100> ...same for unity8? ;)
<didrocks> yep, unity8 no more manual publish until Saviq gives the green light
<sil2100> o>
<didrocks> that's why the manual publication is forced on them ;)
<seb128> pitti, salut
<seb128> pitti, is there any known issue with upower in saucy? (it seems to "hang" sometimes)
<larsu> czajkowski: seems to be a rare case of upower hanging. Killing upowerd and `killall unity-panel-service` should fix it. I've reported it as bug #1203655
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1203655 in upower (Ubuntu) "Hangs in pthread_join in libusb_exit" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1203655
<seb128> pitti, ^ that's the issue I was pinging about, I ran into it on friday as well ...
<czajkowski> larsu: lovely thanks, happened me yesterday on suspend and came back to now power icon which kinda bit me in the rear later as I didnt see I hadn't any batter left.  This morning on start up no battery.
<larsu> czajkowski: ya, same for me :)  Do you know how to reproduce it?
<czajkowski> larsu: besides suspending and hoping when I come back for no battery power :)
<larsu> czajkowski: I suspended a couple of times just now, with usb devices attached, and I couldn't reproduce it
<larsu> oh well, I'll keep an eye on it
<czajkowski> hate those kinda bugs
<czajkowski> they exist but you can't trigger tem
<czajkowski> *them
<czajkowski> this morning I've no power icon on start up which is weird
<seb128> hum, neither upower nor libusb changed for months
<czajkowski> seb128: if you can tell me how to debug it or give you any information I cna try no meetings for the next hour
<seb128> czajkowski, I don't atm, but thanks
<czajkowski> np
<seb128> czajkowski, larsu and I ran into the issue recently as well so it seems like it's "easy enough to trigger"
<seb128> not trivial, but it's likely we are going to hit it again during the week
<seb128> so if debugging is needed, let's see
<sil2100> didrocks: as for the skip-all modification I proposed - so, how would you prefer the internals to look besides creating the all.arch.ignore? Would it be better if we handled the case separately in the jenkins skip job?
<didrocks> sil2100: yeah, I think you need to write a cu2d script which is going to grab all .projects file and creates a .ignore for each of them
<didrocks> sil2100: try to make it generic so that is supports one components, multiple components, one arch, multiple arch and all :)
<sil2100> didrocks: ah, so you don't want a 'single ignore file for all projects'?
<didrocks> sil2100: yeah, that's what we discussed on Friday IIRC
<sil2100> didrocks: will work on that in a free moment then ;) Right now I'll deal with unity issues and unity-mir
<didrocks> sil2100: sounds like the right priority :)
<seb128> Laney, oh, you are piloting ... can you look at https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1059449 during your shift?
<ubot2`> Ubuntu bug 1059449 in OEM Priority Project "Set "Airplane Mode" On, Bluetooth still work properly ." [Medium,Confirmed]
<Laney> ok
<Laney> feed back that they should subscribe ubuntu-sponsors though
<seb128> Laney, k
<Laney> merci!
<seb128> Laney, thanks for looking at it ;-)
<Laney> I always end up with too many tabs while sponsoring
 * Laney gets confused
<Laney> seb128: bug #408903: no-change rebuild of libx11 to precise-proposed?
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 408903 in xserver-xorg-input-evdev (Ubuntu Raring) "Does not handle microphone mute button (KEY_MICMUTE)" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/408903
<seb128> Laney, yes
<Laney> ok
<seb128> thanks ;-)
<seb128> sorry I forgot about this one
<Laney> np, it's on the list
<Laney> it's one of those ones you open up and see the millions of tasks and comments
<Laney> scary
<pitti> seb128: bonjour (excusez-moi, j'ai Ã©tÃ© dans un meeting)
<pitti> seb128: not know to me
<pitti> seb128: we got a new libusb a few days ago, maybe that triggered it?
<seb128> pitti, hey, pas de problÃ¨me, Ã§a va bien ?
<seb128> pitti, oh, we did?
<pitti> seb128: yeah, caused some trouble in umockdev, that's how I noticed
<seb128> pitti, the most recent libusb upload was early june
<pitti> seb128: libusbx
<pitti> that's the -1.0
<seb128> oh
<pitti> libusb is ancient and should die
<seb128> right
<seb128> so yeah, that's likely that update
<seb128> upower didn't change for a while and those locks are in libusb code
<didrocks> sil2100: hey, did you get any progress on unity?
<sil2100> didrocks: working on it
<sil2100> Aaaah, you mean unity like lp:unity? :)
<didrocks> yep
<sil2100> I'm still downloading the right .otto for the compiz crash, but in the meantime I restarted the unity stack with the 2 reverts that mhr3 made
<kenvandine> fginther, did you see this yet?
<kenvandine> https://code.launchpad.net/~ken-vandine/cupstream2distro-config/click/+merge/176007
<kenvandine> fginther, there was a typo in the CI section
<fginther> kenvandine, mhm. I really need to get work on some config validation tools.
<kenvandine> hehe
<kenvandine> fginther, please let me know when the config is updated so i can tell them to stop manually merging...
<kenvandine> they worked all weekend... so i told them to just do manual merges
<desrt> hi hackers
<didrocks> sil2100: feel free to self-approve once you fixed https://code.launchpad.net/~sil2100/cupstream2distro-config/nohud_no_daily/+merge/175860
<mhr3> tedg, morning, could you take a look at https://code.launchpad.net/~mhr3/dbus-test-runner/watch-pipes-for-hup/+merge/176092 pls?
<mterry> didrocks, got any MIR time soon?  A bunch have come in
<didrocks> mterry: the MIR for Mir, right? :p
<mterry> didrocks, that's part of it, yeah
<didrocks> mterry: I'm still behind on one of them, but as I'm orchestrating those, not sure I should MIR them
<mterry> didrocks, there are non-Mir ones too
<didrocks> mterry: TBH, don't expect anything before the next 2 weeks (I'm on the IoM then)
<didrocks> and still don't have the time to do what I should do for touch
<didrocks> but if it's not urgent, that's fine, please assign :)
<tedg> mhr3, Sure, let me look
<mterry> didrocks, OK, I'll handle
<tedg> mhr3, not sure why that test is failing in Jenkins, going to rebuild to see if it was transient
<mhr3> tedg, funnily enough that branch was trying to fix those issues :P
<tedg> mhr3, Yeah :-)
<mhr3> but it's more focused on the process part of it, didn't check the service too much
<tedg> Reality is that we're using it to do process management.  Curious whether we should do something like create a custom upstart session instead.
<tedg> Upstart will always do process management better than I will :-)
<mhr3> tedg, but i find the test kinda broken, it's not doing much really, spawning a cat and a true, shouldn't something test whether there's an active dbus socket?
<seb128> Laney, what panel are you working on atm?
<Laney> background
<Laney> doing the schema thing
<seb128> Laney, ok ... you mentioned phone-app and date&time last week iirc, did you start/pick one of those?
<Laney> i'll pick datetime next
<seb128> ok
<seb128> I'm going to do some of the phone app UI work then
<tedg> mhr3, Yeah, I was more trying to check if the process died, but that'd be better for sure.
<seb128> "phone settings" rather
<Laney> seb128: I did pick phone but didn't get very far on it
<seb128> Laney, did you get blocked on something or just decide to go for something else?
<Laney> because I don't think there's any backend there or e.g. the dialpad
<Laney> I'll give you what I did if you want to build on it
<seb128> Laney, yes please, mp it maybe?
<Laney> don't think it's ready for that
<Laney> lp:~laney/ubuntu-system-settings/phone-panel
<seb128> Laney, I just want to get some of the UI work done, I'm a bit blocked on backend for the stuff that already there until we get gsettings
<seb128> Laney, ok, I'm going to pick up on this one, thanks
<Laney> I keep confusing myself on this background thing
<seb128> Laney, what's the issue?
<Laney> there's this logic about remembering which screen was changed last
<Laney> trying to express it in a decent way
<Laney> bah, I guess what I already MPed is alright for now
<seb128> Laney, yeah, don't spend too much time on details like that, we have enough to do ;-)
 * seb128 shrug
<seb128> seems like there is no easy way to get a directory size in qt
<seb128> I'm going to wait for the file-manager-app guys to add the feature and copy it or something ;-)
<seb128> Laney, what's the deal with the ";" ... are we supposed to use them in js functions? was it working without those?
<Laney> kaleo told me to use them
<seb128> ok
<tedg> mhr3, No clue why, but amd64 on raring still dislikes your branch :-/
<tedg> mhr3, At least it is recreatable now ;-)
<mhr3> tedg, same issue?
<tedg> mhr3, Yea
<mhr3> tedg, how about http://paste.ubuntu.com/5900869/ ?
<tedg> mhr3, In general I'm okay with that, but I think it'll break a bunch of people that have hardcoded :1.1 or :1.2 in their tests :-/
<tedg> mhr3, I think we'd have to check the connection in the test.
<mhr3> tedg, hmm, there might a simpler way then, don't open the connection, just try to parse the address
<mhr3> but then it feels like just fixing the test
<tedg> Yeah, not sure, but I'm pretty sure that'll break people.
<mhr3> otoh it will catch some extra stuff
<tedg> not that people should be doing it... but...
<mhr3> tedg, why would it break someone?
<tedg> mhr3, Doing the connection directly and incrementing the connection counter.
<mhr3> but after it's replaced by a simple g_dbus_is_supported_address()
<tedg> Sure, that'd be fine.
<mhr3> k, changing
<kenvandine> fginther, did you get a chance to reconfigure those click ci jobs?
<fginther> kenvandine, sorry about that
<Laney> seb128: I'm killing the semicolons :P
<seb128> Laney, ;-)
<Laney> it's style from the sdk that we don't necessarily need to follow i guess
<seb128> right
<seb128> our style is to not use those :p
<fginther> kenvandine, deployed
<kenvandine> fginther, thx
<Laney> one day
<Laney> I'll write a Column and remember to give it dimensions straight away
<bcurtiswx> who here understands the most about the sound system?
<seb128> TheMuso and diwic I guess
<bcurtiswx> TheMuso diwic, what would stop the sound system from recognizing USB audio devices (lsusb shows them)
 * didrocks waves good evening
<tedg> cyphermox, Hey, so I picked up a Huawei USB GSM modem.
<cyphermox> tedg: ok
<tedg> cyphermox, When I do "nmcli d" it shows up twice.
<cyphermox> err?
<cyphermox> twice?
<cyphermox> how?
<tedg> Like this: /huawei_0  gsm               disconnected
<tedg>  /hfp/9027E4ED59DF_38ECE482A6D9 gsm               disconnected
<cyphermox> heh
<cyphermox> nice.
<cyphermox> can you send me exact USB ID? I'll look at the code, you should only get it once
<seb128> Laney, you pushed an update for your gsetting work, is that ready to review? (I wish launchpad would do a bit better at emailing about updated, I just noticed through the CI which validated the update)
<cyphermox> tedg: not that it will really break anything ATM though if you see it twice
<Laney> seb128: yeah but I just remembered I forgot to make it ===
<Laney> shall I do that?
<tedg> cyphermox, Okay, just checking to see if I had something installed wrong.
<tedg> cyphermox, Here is the ID: Bus 002 Device 006: ID 12d1:1003 Huawei Technologies Co., Ltd. E220 HSDPA Modem / E230/E270/E870 HSDPA/HSUPA Modem
<cyphermox> it's probably not installed wrong, most likely two plugins are competing to control it because it's a modem we don't often see
<tedg> Ah, okay.
<seb128> Laney, your call, in practice I don't think it makes a difference, it's not likely we are going to have issues to value matchings and not the object types there
<Laney> ok, I'll do it if I touch there again
<seb128> Laney, btw, easy one if you feel like doing a one liner review: https://code.launchpad.net/~seb128/ubuntu-system-settings/storage-get-free-space/+merge/176170
<Laney> yep, I'll do it before I go
<Laney> dbussing atm for timedated
<seb128> ok, thanks
<popey> well delightful. latest update to saucy has made it so my laptop (x220) can only do 1024x768
<popey> hmm, its dropped to vesa i think
<popey>  3516 alan      20   0 2081m 391m  37m R 138.6  5.0   7:18.29 compiz
<popey> nice
<popey> just the man.. RAOF if you have a moment could you please look at bug 1203901 ? I'm at OSCON and my laptop has flipped to 1024x768 after the latest updates â¹
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1203901 in xorg (Ubuntu) "desktop 1024x768 vesa mode on intel" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1203901
<RAOF> popey: Commented on the bug; enjoy!
<popey> RAOF: wow.. i have had that there for ~months
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-07-23
<RAOF> popey: That option presumably got dropped in the latest kernel.
<Sarvatt> popey: you need a 3.10.0-5 kernel
<Sarvatt> or just boot the -3 one
<Sarvatt> just duped it to the main bug with -4, module option wasn't removed
<Sarvatt> optionally just removing the explicit module options you don't need because they are defaulted on works :)
<Sarvatt> semaphores=0 is a 3.8 kernel workaround for 13.04
<popey> Sarvatt: removed, much happier now, thanks
<pitti> Bonjour tout le monde !
<thumper> hi pitti
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<rickspencer3> good morning seb128
<pitti> hey rickspencer3
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<seb128> hey rickspencer3 pitti
<rickspencer3> hey pitti
<didrocks> hey seb128, rickspencer3, pitti!
<seb128> didrocks, salut ;-)
<pitti> bonjour didrocks, Ã§a va ?
<didrocks> fires from the morning are finally dealt, phew! \o/
<didrocks> pitti: better now ;) et toi?
 * didrocks shakes fist at lightdm
<pitti> didrocks: je vais bien, merci
<seb128> didrocks, what was the issue with lightdm?
<didrocks> seb128: the test image was refreshed yesterday with the lightdm version which was buggy
<seb128> oh ok
<didrocks> sil2100 tried yesterday to run manually some stacks, but he seems he didn't went to the end
<seb128> I though the fix was maybe not working
<didrocks> and so, this night, with the same image, all dailies stuck
<didrocks> because lightdm not starting
<seb128> k
<didrocks> so tests were waiting the 2H threshold before timing out
<didrocks> had to blacklist the image
<didrocks> and rerun the tests
<didrocks> but everything is now delivered :)
<seb128> great
<didrocks> (some still waiting manual publishing by sil2100)
<didrocks> seb128: I really think lightdm should have minimal tests
<didrocks> (integration tests)
<larsu> didrocks saves the day!
<didrocks> ahah, hey larsu!
<seb128> didrocks, lightdm has quite some tests, no integration ones though indeed ...
<seb128> not sure that would have caught that one
<didrocks> seb128: we clearly see that integration tests are important :)
<didrocks> well, if we can't log in automatically
<didrocks> it would have caught it :p
<seb128> yeah, I've no idea how you test that sort of thing
<didrocks> (even just putting it under dailies, that particular case would have been caught)
<seb128> e.g how you figure "log in worked fine"
 * sil2100 sees some progress so starts publishing
<didrocks> seb128: quite easily, have an autopilot in session, changing the config
<didrocks> and then restart lightdm
<didrocks> when back, mark the test as passing
<sil2100> didrocks: http://10.97.0.1:8080/view/cu2d/view/Head/view/Settings/job/cu2d-settings-head-3.0publish/lastSuccessfulBuild/artifact/packaging_changes_ubuntu-system-settings_0.1+13.10.20130723-0ubuntu1.diff <- seems ok
<seb128> how you determine if you are back?
<sil2100> ACK?
<seb128> screenshot of the background?
<didrocks> seb128: autopilot restarts in the session
<seb128> running process?
<didrocks> so you are in the session
<didrocks> (and you can as well monitor process)
<didrocks> as you told
<seb128> k
<seb128> yeah, it would be worth having
<seb128> though there is a chance it wouldn't have be enough to stop that one
<Laney> good morning!
<seb128> lightdm was working for most people
<didrocks> seb128: it would for that one, all our tests failed :p
<didrocks> so it's our main case here ;)
<seb128> you got lucky/unlucky
<seb128> it's funny that your test machine hit it so often
<didrocks> (I would be more worried about the other, the one with "typing needed"
<didrocks> seb128: "so often"?
<didrocks> it's like 100%
<seb128> it was depending on unitialized memory state
<didrocks> maybe triggered more with autologin?
<seb128> didrocks, most people didn't hit the issue in saucy
<seb128> and those who did said it was happening likely every second reboot to them
<didrocks> it's a 100% strike here, on both configs ;)
<seb128> yeah, that's why I say you are lucky (or unlucky)
<didrocks> ok, I was thinking it was something that happened only on autologin
<didrocks> sil2100: a Laney's change! Hum, let me think about it :p
<didrocks> sil2100: ok ok, +1 ;)
<sil2100> ;p
<Laney> err?!
<seb128> Laney, good morning
<Laney> hey
<Laney> how's it going?
<didrocks> Laney: hey! ;)
<seb128> good! you?
<Laney> the third storm since last night 10pm just started
<didrocks> hum, ken still didn't ask to create the think client view :p
<seb128> Laney, lucky you, we had some start of storm yesterday evening but it barely rained
<Laney> got woken up for half an hour at 5.30am :P
<czajkowski> bah no rain here :) we had a small heavy shower yesterday in the middle of chasing hens in the garden but back to dry heat again :-D
<Laney> you'll get your punishment soon enough!
<czajkowski> Laney: hush you or I'll set my hens on you
<Laney> bwaaaak
<darkxst> hey Laney, seb128, didrocks !
<seb128> hey darkxst
<didrocks> hey darkxst, czajkowski! :)
<czajkowski> ello didrocks
<Laney> hiya
<czajkowski> http://exastack.com/webcam/  Laney you can see the new hens :)
<seb128> darkxst, jbicha: that gtk upload has better having no bug, just saying ;-)
<seb128> darkxst, jbicha: the fact that you uploaded a version that failed to build on broken symbols suggest you don't even test build it
<seb128> which is pretty baffling for a gtk update
<darkxst> seb128, I tested it, but missed the symbols file in the bzr commit
<darkxst> I have a patch against empathy also, that would really like to get in for alpha2
<darkxst> https://code.launchpad.net/~darkxst/ubuntu/saucy/empathy/lp1203955
<seb128> try pinging pitti, he's patch piloting according to #ubuntu-devel
<pitti> darkxst: queueing
<pitti> FWIW, I'm patch piloting on every channel :)
<Laney> seb128: hah, I found out my shell was forcing $TZ=Europe/London so s-s was always being launched with that overridden
<Laney> it mostly works if I remove that :P
<seb128> lol
<seb128> Laney, how come your shell forces a tz? was that a custom hack of yours?
<Laney> some ancient thing in my .zshrc
<Laney> I don't even remember why
<didrocks> sil2100: did you confirm for the webcred stack?
<didrocks> sil2100: I can help you if needed :)
<didrocks> sil2100: then, QA tests failed, I think you saw that ;)
<didrocks> (fortunately, doesn't seem to have impacts on the other tests for apps and so on)
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<Laney> hi chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hi Laney, how are you?
<Laney> are you in stormland too?
<Laney> preeeeeeetty good
<Laney> you?
<chrisccoulson> Laney, sort of. it's pretty lame here - the lightning is quite far away and there hasn't really been that much
<seb128> chrisccoulson, good morning
<chrisccoulson> i was hoping for more
<didrocks> hey chrisccoulson
<Laney> aww
<Laney> we've had loads
<chrisccoulson> i've been stood at the door with my daughters all morning watching it
<seb128> chrisccoulson, how are you?
<chrisccoulson> we've had a lot of rain
<sil2100> didrocks: I saw the QA failure, I shall poketh peoplez with a bugeth
<chrisccoulson> hi seb128, i'm good thanks. although, a bit tired from my 4am start. how are you?
<seb128> chrisccoulson,  rain \o/
<chrisccoulson> hi didrocks
<didrocks> sil2100: thanks, and on webcreds? ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I'm good thanks
<sil2100> didrocks: I'm checking the webcred things and it seems to install the right stuff
<Laney> one peal of thunder at 5.30 this morning lasted for 30 seconds solid
<seb128> chrisccoulson, did you stay up all night celebrating the royal baby? ;-)
<Laney> <1s from the lightning
<didrocks> sil2100: ok, do you mind after acking it then to do a followup MP to remove the undeeded rm <>.la then?
<sil2100> It looks like -X .ble and -X.ble works the same
<sil2100> didrocks: ACK ;)
<didrocks> sil2100: and remove that extra space, just like to stay coherent!
<didrocks> sil2100: thanks!
<chrisccoulson> seb128, lol, not you as well. i'm quite tired of hearing about the lizard baby already ;)
<seb128> lol
<seb128> "the lizard baby"
<Laney> seb128 has already purchased the commemorative china
<seb128> damn, Laney found that out
<seb128> ;-)
<RAOF> chrisccoulson: May it's carapace grow hard, allowing it to devour its enemies!
<chrisccoulson> heh
<RAOF> Arse. Apostrophe!
<chrisccoulson> ooh, the rain has just picked up again
<chrisccoulson> it's amazing how many people are driving around this morning without any lights ojn
<chrisccoulson> **on
<sil2100> didrocks: should I touch MIR or still a big no no ;) ?
<didrocks> sil2100: no, until they don't ensure ABI, robert_ancell will be responsible for it
<didrocks> sil2100: so, we are a month free I guess ;)
<didrocks> (other issues on Mir, but something else to deal with :p)
<darkxst> chrisccoulson, hey, anything you can do to get mozjs17 into the archives?
<rickspencer3> nice
<rickspencer3> seb128, so, I just did a dist-upgrade
<rickspencer3> I get no wireless with the new kernel
<rickspencer3> and when I reboot, I get prompted for a password because another user is running
<seb128> is that a one time thing or is the kernel buggy on your hardware?
<rickspencer3> seb128, I rebooted 3 times, same effect each time
<rickspencer3> seb128, rebooting into the previous kernel, it works fine
<rickspencer3> seb128, the Network indicator doesn't seem to see the wireless
<seb128> rickspencer3, seems like a broken wireless driver in the kernel then ... did you try booting the previous kernel to see if that fixes it (that would confirm the problem is coming from the kernel update)
<rickspencer3> seb128, right, like I say, in the previous kernel it works fine
<rickspencer3> that's what I am using right now ;)
<seb128> ok
<seb128> you should probably ping the kernel team about it...
<rickspencer3> ok, I'll log a bug
<rickspencer3> I thought you might want to be aware, though
<rickspencer3> I don't think I have exotic hardware or anything
<mlankhorst> g'day
<sil2100> veebers: hi!
<sil2100> veebers: just in case you're still up by some quantum mechanics -> LP: #1204031
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1204031 in Autopilot "Autopilot autopilot test failures" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1204031
<didrocks> sil2100: we can relaunch unity checks now if you wish
<didrocks> sil2100: I'll let you handling that?
<sil2100> didrocks: acknowledged
<sil2100> o>
<didrocks> sil2100: you can stop the current build monitoring (or even restart the powerpc failing first ;))
<didrocks> and relaunch as it will refind the same state
<sil2100> didrocks: well, it'll be failing still... Brandon was supposed to take a look at that, but he sent me an e-mail that he couldn't find the root cause ;/
<didrocks> sil2100: ask to bregma then? :)
<sil2100> didrocks: I guess Trevinho might help as well
<didrocks> and an ETA
<sil2100> Will do
<didrocks> 2 weeks and half without being able to release unity is an issue IMHO
<sil2100> Restarting in the meantime; p
<didrocks> thanks!
<sil2100> didrocks: yes, we've been depressing ourselves about that already with Michal yesterday!
<seb128> pitti, did I do the mistake to put my hand on curl? :p
<pitti> seb128: apparently so :)
<pitti> ah, so FJKong isn't here yet
<rickspencer3> pitti, so I ran ubuntu-bug linux
<rickspencer3> and got an error that it wasn't an official package
<rickspencer3> while I appreciate focus, I would think we would want to continue to support a kernel
<rickspencer3> ;)
<pitti> rickspencer3: what does uname -r say for you?
<rickspencer3> 3.10.0-3-generic
<pitti> rickspencer3: ah, that's it; -3 is indeed not in saucy any more, that's 4
<rickspencer3> oh geez
<rickspencer3> I have 4 installed
<rickspencer3> but wireless doesn't work
<rickspencer3> that's why I wanted to report a bug
<pitti> le monde va trÃ¨s rapide dans Ubuntu :)
<rickspencer3> pitti, c'est vrais, mais, le kernel es en painne :,(
<rickspencer3> pitti, is there a work around for me?
<pitti> rickspencer3: it's probably more useful if you do this:
<pitti> rickspencer3: boot into -4
<pitti> apport-bug --save ~/linux.report linux
<pitti> rickspencer3: this will collect the data with -4 actually running
<pitti> rickspencer3: then reboot back into -3, and apport-bug ~/linux.report
<pitti> data from a working -3 might be less useful
<pitti> rickspencer3: there is a s3kr1t workaround for this "not an ubuntu pkg" check, too, but I believe the above is more useful
<rickspencer3> pitti, ok
<rickspencer3> I'll do as you suggested later today
<rickspencer3> when I have time
<rickspencer3> thanks
<pitti> rickspencer3: alors, le monde casse trÃ¨s rapide aussi :/
<rickspencer3> je pense, c'est pas necessaire
<pitti> oui, broken wifi is rather high on the OMGkittens scale
<rickspencer3> on peut bouger rapide et avec la securitÃ© ausi
<rickspencer3> however, I probably can't really write that in French ;)
<pitti> j'ai le comprends
<pitti> err, j'ai le compris
<seb128> the new kernel broke -intel video for larsu as well
 * seb128 notes to not upgrade
<rickspencer3> back ti out!
<rickspencer3> back it out!
<seb128> he gets no /dev/dri/card0 with it
<seb128> larsu, did you ping the kernel guys about the issue?
<rickspencer3> no video and no wifi
<rickspencer3> that sounds pretty critical
<pitti> WFM on arrandale, but I realize that this is getting old
 * seb128 joins #ubuntu-kernel and see larsu replying
<pitti> note that module option parsing is completely broken in -4
<larsu> seb128: talking to them right now, they suspect it's a regression that's fixed in -5
<larsu> seb128: I'm installing that right nowand trying it
<pitti> that might impact a lot of modules
<seb128> is -5 in saucy?
<larsu> seb128: still in -proposed, I'm wgetting it
<seb128> oh
<larsu> seb128: http://people.canonical.com/~apw/master-next-saucy/
<seb128> rickspencer3, you might want to try -5 as well to see if it fixes your issue
<apw> rickspencer3, do you have like 11n=off type options for your wireless, that would be an issue with -4
<rickspencer3> apw, yes
<rickspencer3> dammit
<rickspencer3> lol
<rickspencer3> apw, I will fix it
<apw> move to -5 and you should be able to have them
<apw> a parsing bug which was tickled in -4
<Laney> hmm
<Laney> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/TimeAndDate#Time_zone
<Laney> do we have a library that gives a city -> timezone mapping?
<Laney> GNOME parses the database which gives region & city -> timezone
<Laney> I think our indicator uses the geolookup webservice
<Laney> but we only have a gtk api for that already
<jpds> Laney: $ curl http://geoip.ubuntu.com/lookup
<Laney> yes
<Laney> I need a list of cities and their timezones to implement what the design asks for
<jpds> Surely that's what tzdata is all about?
<Laney> it's not a very complete list of locations, is it?
<jpds> The person in a little village in southern England, isn't going to mind picking London.
<pitti> seb128: is there a reason not to do https://code.launchpad.net/~manishsinha/ubuntu/saucy/nautilus/move-to-zeitgeist2/+merge/173099 ?
<seb128> Laney, try checking with xnox maybe what are their plan for the ootb dialog if it needs to do that
<Laney> /everyone/ in England will have to pick London
<xnox> reading.
<pitti> seb128: (I'll apply the patch to the real packaging branch etc., just checking whether we want it in general; libzg 2 is already on the images
<seb128> pitti, no reason that I know about, we already use the new version in gedit
<pitti> seb128: ack
<larsu> Laney: what does the datetime panel in indicator-datetime use?
<Laney> larsu: there's a 'completion' widget provided by libtimezonemap
<xnox> Laney: right, so we have the timezonemap with GI bindings and images to do the timezone. Look at qt ubiquity, it has some map on it? https://wiki.kubuntu.org/Kubuntu/KubuntuDocs/Installation/Timezone
<seb128> Laney, so, I'm working on the phone panel UI ... do you prefer having different small reviews (e.g one by "page") or should I just stack everything and send a bigger one to review later?
<Laney> xnox: ah, interesting
<xnox> Laney: i wonder if that is gtk widget nonetheless
<Laney> seb128: Depends - if they get too stacked it's confusing/annoying to request changes lower down
<Laney> xnox: hmm, I think that comes from d-i?
<Laney> the drop-downs that is
<xnox> Laney: the drop-downs, yes, which bit are you after? the clicky map or list of timezones?
<Laney> xnox: The list, but it's not a list of timezones - it's a list of cities
<Laney> mapping to timezones
<xnox> Laney: so the new timezonempa, ships one, i think.....
<xnox> Laney: well, we do ship /usr/share/zoneinfo
<Laney> I see a cities15000.txt
<sil2100> didrocks: ah! I forgot to ask about something yesterday
<sil2100> didrocks: it's about unity-mir
<Laney> If geoname-lookup can do this though, that might be alright TBH
<Laney> would it be bad to have to be online to do that search?
<sil2100> didrocks: currently unity-mir is depending on some funky non-trunk versions of platform-api and qtubuntu that won't get merged in yet
<sil2100> didrocks: me and Gerry been wondering if maybe we could create a new 'stack' for those, daily-building and daily-releasing to a separate PPA
<sil2100> didrocks: so that the guys could have daily builds for testing purposes
<xnox> Laney: it's ok to be online, but the idea about including cities15000 is for search to work the same with / without internet connectivity. As at the moment in the installer, if you are online you can select Beijing, but if you are offline you can only select Sanghai and some people get upset.
<sil2100> Before it gets mature enough for daily-releasing
<Laney> xnox: why's that?
<Laney> I see both in there
<seb128> Laney, right, I'm going to add some extra content before submitting, it makes review a bit harder but it avoids the stacking issue
<Laney> k
<seb128> Laney, xnox: better to not require data on a phone to be able to select your timezone
<seb128> not everyone is having datas yet, and even when you do, you might not want to do roaming when travelling
<seb128> but you are likely to want to change your timezone while travelling
<Laney> I think I will try to use the timezonemap api for this
<seb128> sounds good
<xnox> seb128: sure, the miminal set of timezoneinfo is something like ~100 entries (basically all 26 timezones +/- a few aliases)
<seb128> did you check if qt provide anything there?
<xnox> Laney: there are rumours that "Qt 5.1 withh get its own full Time Zone support directly in QDateTime"
<Laney> I looked but didn't find anything
<xnox> but i'm confused what that means.
<Laney> http://doc-snapshot.qt-project.org/qt5-stable/qtcore/qdatetime.html
<xnox> Laney: i guess you also saw http://silmor.de/qtstuff.tzone.php on parsing tzdata files directly.
<Laney> doesn't seem useful
<Laney> xnox: yes, but tzdata isn't enough
 * xnox looks at the design.
<veebers> sil2100: hey, I just chcked my messages before bed. Right I have that noted, do you mind sending out an email to the autopilot-dev ML?
<sil2100> veebers: will do! Thanks :)
<veebers> sil2100: no worries, we'll get those issues sorted quicks as :-)
<xnox> Laney: hmm... well if there are internets talk to the geolookup service libtimezonemap style, if there isn't I'd just propose a list of /usr/share/zoneinfo/zone.tab as that one is small and has all timezones. The cities15000.txt should be excellent, if we can ship it on the phone & libtimezonemap provides enough api to parse/search it sensibly.
<sil2100> didrocks: also, in the end, you think unity-mir would fit in the mir stack?
<sil2100> The final version I mean
<sil2100> didrocks: since basically it's something more like qtubuntu, but more related to mir
<sil2100> didrocks: so I was actually wondering if it should be mir, unity or platform
<sil2100> ;|
<Laney> xnox: libtimezonemap1-dev misses Depends on packages its pcfile Requires
<xnox> Laney: *sigh*. This was recently brought up as a mass-bug-file in debian, i guess I should one day teach debhelper to auto-add those.
<xnox> Laney: branch merge proposals welcome \o/ =)
<xnox> in the mean time.
<Laney> :(
<seb128> Laney, small needs fixing on your datetime mp, if you could just push a commit which does "make pot" so we get translations with it
<Laney> seb128: ok, you want those at the time?
<Laney> I thought you liked to batch them
<seb128> no, I don't, I just tend to forget myself about it :p
<seb128> ideally we would run "make pot" every time we change a string/add one
<Laney> I don't have that makefile target
<seb128> e.g if we add an UI we should include the updated template in the merge proposal
<seb128> Laney, cd po; make pot
<Laney> ah I have to do it in there
<Laney> done
<seb128> Laney, thanks, approved
<Laney> thank you!
<Laney> xnox: hmm, I can't get at the information inside
<Laney> can we make cc_timezone_location_get_property into public API?
<xnox> Laney: anything you wish. it's fairly new addition of cities15000 and nobody is actually using it properly, so i'd expect the API to be incomplete at the moment.
<Laney> I get a list of all the entries - that seems fine; it's I now need to be able to query them
<didrocks> seb128: shoudl be in the mirslave for now
<didrocks> grrr seb128 stop talking! :)
<seb128> sil2100, ^
<didrocks> sil2100: should be in the mirslave for now
<seb128> didrocks, :-P
<didrocks> sil2100: then, once stabilize, we'll see :)
<didrocks> but unity8 will dep on it for sure
<sil2100> ;D
<sil2100> Ok
<didrocks> sil2100: they should get their API merged first ;)
<didrocks> sil2100: no daily release without that I'm afraid, it should push them to stabilize :)
<sil2100> didrocks: right ;) Well, anyway, hmm
<sil2100> didrocks: one more thing - are you knowledgable in the autolanding parameters in our cu2d-config branches?
<sil2100> didrocks: since hm, to get at least autolanding working, we need custom platform-api and qtubuntu packages used ;/
<didrocks> sil2100: no, and I think we shouldn't add yet-another-ppa
<didrocks> sil2100: so really, they should merge in platform-api and qtubuntu their first shot
<sil2100> didrocks: ah, ok then
<Laney> xnox: didn't need it after all
<Laney> you expose the proper GObject properties
<Laney> I haz overwhelmingly huge list of cities
<antarus> is there a page for minimum or recommended system requirements for using Unity?
<antarus> I guess I found https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopExperienceTeam/UnityHardwareRequirements after some GOogling ;)
<asac> seb128: rebooted and now my main desktop also doesnt realize the external monitor size and i have very low resolution
<asac> you remember: my launcher had the built-in screen resolution, but after logging in i got desk with 1080p
<asac> that doesnt happen anymore :)
<seb128> asac, uname -r ?
<asac>  uname -r
<asac> 3.10.0-4-generic
<asac> bad kernel?
<seb128> asac, buggy kernel
<asac> wow
<seb128> yes
<seb128> update to -5
<asac> i dont have any updates yet
<seb128> you probably get the same "/dev/dri/card0: no such file or directory"  as larsu was getting earlier
 * asac runs apt-get update again
<seb128> asac, it was blocked in proposed I think
<seb128> but it should be unblocked
<seb128> asac, reboot and pick -3 otherwise
<asac> its not there yet
 * larsu confirms that -3 works fine
<seb128> apw, ^ is -5 still in proposed?
<asac> is there a way we can add a test for automation to check for that in future?
<seb128> asac, good question for the kernel team ;-)
<asac> i also asked on -managers
<kgunn> didrocks: is the failing ati test using a build from source? or is it using system-compositor-testing ppa ? or your daily ppa ?
<apw> seb128, it was held there yes for a2
<didrocks> kgunn: just answered on #ubuntu-mir :p
<kgunn> :)
<kgunn> ta
<didrocks> yw!
<seb128> apw, ok
<apw> seb128, it was meant to be being released cause A2 should have it anyhow, but it was delayed there for A2 before that for some hours
<seb128> Laney, kenvandine: https://code.launchpad.net/~seb128/ubuntu-system-settings/start-phone-panel/+merge/176401 ... review appreciate if you can, it's the start of the phone panel. I'm pinging because I would like to have that first part landed so I can build on it (I'm not wanting to start stacking changes on uncommited code)
<seb128> apw, ok, my understanding was that infinity unblocked it, I'm not sure why asac still don't see the update, maybe mirror delay or something
<Laney> it's still being worked
<Laney> and yes, will review now
<seb128> Laney, thanks
<asac> seb128: probably
<Laney> seb128: CallWaiting.qml refers to callDiversionSwitch instead of callWaitingSwitch
<Laney> also why start the timer in onCompleted rather than just set running: true? (was that me? :P)
<seb128> Laney, no reason, that works probably to
 * Laney nods
<seb128> let me try ;-)
<seb128> that's just a fake anyway
<seb128> that code is going away once we have an actual backend
<Laney> yeah
<Laney> still, rather have it be as right as possible
<seb128> yep
<Laney> otherwise looks good
<seb128> Laney, ok, pushed changes
<jbicha> could someone look into why notify-osd's tests fail since it's blocking gtk+3.0? it built fine locally
<seb128> jbicha, do you have a look of the issue?
<jbicha> I believe it's one of those silent autotests https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/view/Saucy/view/AutoPkgTest/job/saucy-adt-notify-osd/38/ARCH=amd64,label=adt/console
<Laney> ../test-driver: line 95: 28659 Trace/breakpoint trap (core dumped) "$@" > $log_file 2>&1 FAIL: test-modules
<seb128> could be a one time thing
<seb128> try asking jibel to retry it
<jbicha> https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/view/Saucy/view/AutoPkgTest/job/saucy-adt-notify-osd/
<seb128> so maybe a real bug...
<seb128> jbicha, I'm not going to comment on how testing that gtk upload goes, seeing that the first upload wasn't even test built apparently
<Laney> bah, this -4 kernel
<Laney> failed to initialize KVM: No such file or directory
<didrocks> sil2100: unity-notifications-impl-1
<didrocks> sil2100: isn't that a virtual package?
<didrocks> (just from memory)
<didrocks> sil2100: you will try pocking the -check job manually first I guess to get the right list of packages?
<seb128> hum
<seb128> it's already meeting time
<seb128> qengho, mlankhorst, Sweetshark, Laney, tkamppeter, attente, desrt, larsu: hey, it's meeting time
 * larsu is still in the indicator meeting...
<qengho> Howdy!
<seb128> larsu, no worry, you might be done before it's your turn
<seb128> let's get started
<mlankhorst> g'day mate
<seb128> qengho, hey
<czajkowski> hmm am I useing the smart scopes wrong/ imo when I double click on one it should open, but I have to click launch for it to actually Launch?
<qengho> - chromium-browser build-testing-security-release pipeline streamlined. Should t
<qengho> ake off a few days for releases.
<qengho> - 28.0.1500.71 should be out today.
<qengho> - Included a few tests in Cr build. Trying to add more, especially for webapps.
<qengho> - Re-started work on translations.
<desrt> meeting!!!
<qengho> EOL
<seb128> qengho, still no working menus in saucy... :-(
<seb128> qengho, when is that going to be fixed?
<qengho> seb128: #security has it.  Soon as they can, I guess.
<seb128> qengho, is #security handling saucy as well?
<seb128> there is no security pocket/difference in devel cycles
<seb128> qengho, they didn't upload the previous one to saucy
<Laney> you might want to ask them and pass it on to the sponsor queue / us for regular sponsorship if necessary
<qengho> seb128: I should be sending to the dev line, but #security has done it so far. I'll do what I need to so I can send it directly.
<seb128> qengho, thanks, let me know if you need sponsoring
<seb128> Sweetshark, hey
<Sweetshark> seb128: LO 4.1.0rc3 for saucy, 4.0.4 prepared for raring MIR, 3.6.7 ppa update for quantal, some postmortem analysis: http://skyfromme.wordpress.com/2013/07/23/libreoffice-3-6-7-on-ubuntu-547-bug-fixes-and-zero-known-well-triaged-regressions-against-version-3-6-0-on-release/. EOF
<seb128> Sweetshark, thanks
<seb128> mlankhorst,
<seb128> hey
<mlankhorst> Tracking down nouveau corruption bugs, still uncertain what is causing them. I created some fixes for old nvidia cards. lts-raring should be complete at this point, I need to bug some release admin to get it to -proposed. Updated x to 1.14.2, working xorg-integration-tests autopkgtest in my ppa.
<mlankhorst> melting from the heat
<mlankhorst> \0
<seb128> mlankhorst, thanks
<seb128> Laney, hey
<Laney> hi
<Laney> â¢ DMB: write up formal proposal to the TB to allow PPU to not have to be Ubuntu members (http://article.gmane.org/gmane.linux.ubuntu.devel.technical-board/1158)
<Laney> â¢ Release: create script to generate megablocks & put one in place for A2 (if your stuff isn't going to release, it's probably because of this)
<Laney> â¢ system-settings:
<Laney> â Create a place for system-level GSettings to be stored, similar to gsettings-desktop-schemas. lp:gsettings-ubuntu-touch-schemas. Still awaiting reviews to go to saucy.
<Laney> â Branch of u-s-s using the initial schemas in there.
<Laney> â Create non-shared schema in u-s-s for the local (state) settings to be stored.
<Laney> â Make background use this to store selected options
<Laney> â Start phone UI, stop due to lack of backends/widgets and pass it on to seb128 who doesn't mind this. :P
<Laney> â Start working on datetime panel, using timedated and libtimezonemap.
<Laney> â Reviews
<Laney> â¢ Patch piloted
<Laney> â¢ Few more fixes to livecd-rootfs/pvr-omap4 to make (a) Kubuntu work and (b) the X server start up
<Laney> â¢ Now:
<Laney> â fixing pyicu file conflict on upgrade in proposed
<Laney> â merge proposing timedate huge list of locations to prove that it works
<Laney> â making timedate panel cope with DBus activation by watching for NameOwnerChanged
<Laney> â
<seb128> Laney, oh, u-s-s is blocked on review? I said I was fine with it (a bit unsure about the namespace but otherwise it seemed ok to me)
<Laney> well I think sil2100 was going to review it to go to dailies
<seb128> oh, right
<seb128> sil2100, ^ still on your list?
<seb128> Laney, well, not hurry, it's not blocking us much (yet, especially since we have the settings having their own schemas)
<seb128> Laney, thanks
<Laney> I just realised that you can abbreviate it to GUTS
<seb128> lol
<seb128> tkamppeter, hey
<tkamppeter>  - Packaged CUPS 1.7.0rc1 and uploaded to my PPA
<tkamppeter>  - Filled application forms for US visa (got ESTA denied earlier this year)
<tkamppeter>  - GSoC mentoring
<tkamppeter>  - Bugs
<seb128> tkamppeter, thanks
<seb128> attente, hey
<attente> seb128, hey
<attente> fixed indicator-keyboard unit tests to run in an xvfb
<attente> tried to get display language switching in the language settings panel using accountsservice, still trying to get it working
<attente> will need changes in accountsservice to get user input sources for the greeter indicator
<attente> eof
<desrt> attente: do not modify accountsservice
<Laney> hahaha
<desrt> your choices here, in order of preferences:
<desrt> 1) figure out what stefw wants to do about input sources and help him do that
<desrt> 2) use a vendor extension interface
<desrt> 3) death
<desrt> 4) patching accountsservice
 * larsu advises against 3
<desrt> notice the order of choices 3 and 4
<attente> you've painted a picture for me
<seb128> attente, listen to desrt and pick 1 or 2 I guess ;-)
<desrt> ideally 1
<desrt> absolutely definitely talk to stefw before doing anything else
<seb128> attente, btw your updated mp for the language panel is on my todolist for just after this meeting, good work on that ;-)
<attente> ok
<desrt> we had a discussion about this at the freedesktop sprint and he's interested in supporting it
<attente> seb128, thanks for the thorough review
<seb128> np
<seb128> attente, thanks
<seb128> desrt, your turn
<desrt> - helped cyphermox last week fix some crashes and performance problems in the chewie network indicator service
<desrt> - secret project
<desrt> EOF
<seb128> desrt, did you manage to fix the issues in chewie?
<desrt> i fixed a couple of crashes
<desrt> but i'm not sure they were the same crashes that cyphermox was seeing (since i was unable to reproduce the same stacktrace as he had)
<desrt> but i got it to a point where it stopped crashing for me, at least
<seb128> ok
<desrt> there were also some issues where a signal was getting connected and never disconnected
<desrt> over and over
 * larsu shows necessary credentials to be authorized to know about desrt's secret project
<desrt> so new APs would dispatch to 1 watcher, then 2, then 3, ...
<desrt> growing forever, getting slower and slower
<seb128> I see
<seb128> cyphermox, working better now, or do you still have issues?
<desrt> larsu: ;)
<seb128> desrt, thanks
<seb128> larsu, your turn (done with the indicator meeting?)
<larsu> seb128: yep :)
<cyphermox> seb128: it's still majorly broken
<larsu> - gsettings-qt: expose choices, don't abort like desrt, more testing, new c++ API
<larsu> - got some minor issues after landing indicator-sound, fixed them right away
<larsu> - there's a patch to gnome-settings-daemon to use MPRIS if no program acquires the
<larsu> media keys; I made the MPRIS discovery saner and more robust, which will also benifit
<larsu> indicator-sound
<larsu> obviously, *benefit
<seb128> cyphermox, :-(
 * larsu shouldn't type while on a call
<Laney> is it your fault that i-sound now shows everything ever? :-)
<desrt> seb128: the code in chewie is .... not great
<larsu> and also: started indicator-messages branch consolidation
<cyphermox> seb128: that crash is still pretty bad, though now we just restart it so it's less crippling
<seb128> desrt, I've heard that :/
<seb128> Laney, that's mpt's fault I think :p (e.g the update respects the design)
<Laney> hrm
<Laney> well it shows lastfm twice :P
<seb128> oh, that's probably a bug with webapps
<didrocks> Laney: one isn't enough ;)
<seb128> those are not the most robust thing
<Laney> probably FF and chrome
<Laney> ium
<seb128> or that
<Laney> oh well
<seb128> larsu, done?
<larsu> Laney: gesettings get com.canonical.indicator-sound interested-media-players
<larsu> seb128: yep
<larsu> seb128: sorry, forgot eof over all the chatter
<seb128> larsu, can you fix scrollwheel over the sound indicator? it's driving me crazy to have to click the menu and grab the slider every time I want to change the sound :p
<larsu> seb128: get media key :P
 * seb128 noted the issue in the mp review but forgot after the other bugs got fixed
<larsu> seb128: I mean, of course I'll fix that
<seb128> larsu, I don't have such keys on that keyboard, maybe time to get a modern keyboard :p
<larsu> there's a bug open for it now
<seb128> larsu, thanks ;-)
<larsu> :)
<Laney> larsu: ah lastfmwwwlastfm.desktop and lastfmlastfm.desktop
<seb128> larsu, do you have interesting news on the indicator front btw (since that meeting was just before)?
<seb128> larsu, I tried some with a phone profile on the touch image, that sort of work but most widgets are missing
<larsu> seb128: ya, everything's behind and not well tested
<larsu> Laney: that would be the problem... just remove one of them (and hope noone adds it again)
<seb128> larsu, also do you have any idea how easy it is to do something similar to unity8/indicator for system settings?
<larsu> seb128: once I land unitymenumodel, it should be fairly easy.
<seb128> any eta on that?
<larsu> seb128: provided we can share qml code with unity8 easily
<larsu> seb128: a month ago?! More seriously, I'm trying to fit it into this week as well, dednick is starting to need it
<seb128> seems we might be done with system settings before getting that :p
<larsu> and you too, apparently
<seb128> well, we are moving ahead without it
<seb128> but I think network and bluetooth can be easier with it
<seb128> the other panels are mostly static
<larsu> that's okay as long as we're only doing fairly simple panels
<larsu> in those cases, I actually prefer the route we've taken
<seb128> but for things changing like detected aps or devices it would be nicer
<larsu> agreed
 * larsu puts more hours into his days
 * seb128 hugs larsu
<seb128> the heat doesn't help to be productive (at least for me)
<seb128> larsu, thanks
<seb128> my turn:
<seb128> * some easy syncs and updates
<seb128> * helped touch guys with reviews for some NEW packages and updates
<seb128> * mostly system setting work
<seb128> - some ui tweaks and bug fixes
<seb128> - got the sound panel to list sound files from disk and play preview them
<seb128> - added support for screen rotation
<seb128> - some refactoring to share custom widgets between panels
<seb128> - added new categories to the storage panel (video, music, photos, documents)
<seb128> - made the storage panel a bit smarter (replaced fixed values by real datas)
<seb128> - quite some reviews
<seb128> - started on the phone-ap panel
<seb128> </week>
<seb128> oh
<seb128> - tried to add "get the size of the xdg dirs" to the storage panel, gave up
<desrt> seb128: hm?
<seb128> it's non trivial
<desrt> size in the sense of 'disk usage'?
<seb128> need to recurse manually through the dir/subdirs
<seb128> yes
<desrt> for things like Desktop, Photos, etc?
<seb128> yes
<desrt> ya... that's time consuming
<desrt> dfaure and i invented a super-efficient way to do this for the trash folder
<seb128> oh?
<desrt> ya... at the freedesktop sprint
<desrt> it leans rather heavily on some assumptions about the way the trash folder is stored, though
<desrt> it wouldn't work for other folders, unfortunately
<seb128> ok :/
<seb128> anyway I put it on the side
<desrt> it's not easy
<desrt> because i could move some large file into ~/Documents/deeply/nested/dir/
<desrt> and you have no way to know that you need to re-spider that area
<sil2100> Laney: u-s-s?
<larsu> filesystems are just awesome
<Laney> what?
<Laney> oh
 * sil2100 is a bit confused by all the shortcuts
<sil2100> ;)
<desrt> larsu: >:|
<Laney> sil2100: the gsettings schemas
<seb128> I guess the guys doing the file manager app are eventually going to need to solve that problem and with some luck I can use what they do
<desrt> seb128: i wrote the algorithm that baobab currently uses and it's fairly efficient
<desrt> ~10times faster than what was there before
<desrt> maybe just steal it?
 * larsu loves baobab
<seb128> desrt, thanks for the pointer, I'll have a look there
<seb128> ok, a bit late for didrocks' part of the meeting
<larsu> desrt: how was it 10 times slower before?
<seb128> let's wrap the first half of the meeting
<seb128> thanks everyone
 * didrocks taps on the desk
<larsu> thanks seb128
<seb128> shame we didn't have time to ask desrt about his secret projec
<seb128> t
<desrt> larsu: i forget
<sil2100> Laney: let me check my notes and get back to you later ;)
<desrt> seb128: :)
<seb128> didrocks, you should start by that :p
<seb128> desrt, tell us!!! ;-)
<seb128> didrocks, your turn
<didrocks> hey sil2100, cyphermox, kenvandine, robru, desrt !
<didrocks> so desrtâ¦
<desrt> uh oh
<seb128> ;-)
<didrocks> your secret project? ;)
<robru> didrocks, good morning!
<didrocks> (and how guys are doing?)
 * seb128 hugs didrocks
<sil2100> o/
<desrt> #########.............................................................................................................................................####.##.............................................................................................
 * didrocks hugs seb128
<desrt> ......................................................................................................................................................................................................................##..............##.....##..###.....#
<seb128> larsu, you said you have the credential to know, do you have the decoder to read it as well? ;-)
<desrt> each character here corresponds to one page (4096-bytes-sized block) of a file called 'index.cache'
<desrt> a '.' byte is one that's not loaded into memory
<seb128> desktop caching \o/
<larsu> seb128: I do (he told me about this earlier)
<desrt> a '#' byte is one that's loaded into memory
 * kenvandine waves
<desrt> so we see about 100k of memory used here in the pagecache
<larsu> seb128: I didn't know that that was the secret
<didrocks> tsss ;)
<didrocks> ok, let's start ;)
<didrocks> https://docs.google.com/a/canonical.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AuDk72Lpx8U5dHFtUmlPOUtCRk8zR2dtaEpIbUVhMmc#gid=0
<desrt> this is a result of looking for the string "systÃ¨me" in the french locale
<desrt> and iterating over the resulting desktop files with matches
<didrocks> sil2100: it seems you are first: so unity7 release/stack cleanings and so on
<didrocks> sil2100: how did it go?
<desrt> a process that takes ~3ms on an ice-cold cache
<desrt> (and about 300Âµs on a warm cache)
<seb128> desrt, yeah for not having to read that ton of ini files every time!
<sil2100> Ooook, so
<sil2100> All seems to go well \o/
<seb128> desrt, looking forward to see that landing ;-)
<desrt> i hope to get it into gio this week :)
<didrocks> sil2100: sweet, even unity tests?
<seb128> (and on that note I shut up before didrocks goes angry)
<sil2100> Since we were finally able to fix the DBus issues, we have normal unity test runs (not red ones that timed out)
<didrocks> \o/
<didrocks> \o/
<sil2100> The number of failures is a bit over the threshold though...
<didrocks> \o/
<didrocks> sil2100: you work with bregma to get that down?
<seb128> \o/
<sil2100> But since we're WAY over the deadline, I would say we do a release (once we see if those are blockers or not)
<sil2100> And then chase the rest down with the unity guys
<didrocks> ok, so regressions are not that impactful?
<sil2100> We're still waiting on armhf build to finish
<didrocks> did we identify them?
<sil2100> They seem like that, we're still scanning them for serious regressions
<sil2100> Once we finish, we'll be releasing if all seems ok
<didrocks> sil2100: ok, excellent work! :)
<didrocks> ok, let's move to next bullets
<didrocks> seems kenvandine has done tremendous work this week, mind sharing with us?
<didrocks> free-rdp, click packagesâ¦
<kenvandine> that's it :)
<kenvandine> oh
<kenvandine> and friends-app autopilot tests on the device smoke testing is green now :)
<kenvandine> damn lock screen!
<didrocks> \o/
<sil2100> Damn you lock screen!
<didrocks> oh, on freerdp
<didrocks> kenvandine: the prepare job is yellow
<didrocks> for days btw ;)
<kenvandine> ok... i'll look
<didrocks> thanks!
<kenvandine> i just got the view setup today :)
<antarus> (is this the weekly ubuntu desktop meeting?)
<kenvandine> antarus, yes
<didrocks> kenvandine: want to note it down or you will review it again?
<didrocks> remember*
<kenvandine> i'll look now
<didrocks> thanks!
<antarus> (is there an agenda somewhere?)
<didrocks> robru: stuck on the webapps SRU land?
<didrocks> antarus: no agenda, we follow mostly https://docs.google.com/a/canonical.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AuDk72Lpx8U5dHFtUmlPOUtCRk8zR2dtaEpIbUVhMmc#gid=0
<didrocks> robru: feel free to note that you work on that btw so that you can track/update it and we can help you if needed :)
<robru> didrocks, oh, not stuck, just forgot about it :-/ was working on the unity-webapps-qml autopilot tests which took some days due to a few false starts with jenkins.
<kenvandine> didrocks, ok, i'll note it on the spreadsheet and fix it after i handle more pressing issues
<robru> also, I rewrote the entire contact syncing support in Friends because I found many inefficiencies in it. now it works with half as many resources on the phone ;-)
<didrocks> robru: do you understand how the config is working for the tests now?
<didrocks> kenvandine: sounds good! :)
<robru> didrocks, yes, I have a better understanding of the yaml format for tests.
<didrocks> waow, nice!
<didrocks> great! do not hesitate if there is any black hole still
<didrocks> robru: do you mind noting the SRU, so that you don't forget again? ;)
<robru> didrocks, nah, I will just do it today.
<didrocks> ok, great!
<robru> right now ;-)
<didrocks> robru: also, there is this stack, but I harass sil2100 with new packages
<didrocks> robru: so maybe, so that you can get upload rights, it will be great if you can review for daily release some packages
<didrocks> I'm thinking about the new settings schema package
<didrocks> it's an easy one
<robru> didrocks, yeah, i'ts never been clear to me which packages are the new ones that need review.
<didrocks> from Laney
<sil2100> \o/
<didrocks> Laney: mind helping/sending an email to robru with details?
<Laney> you have to find my secret rootkit
<didrocks> robru: I'm assigning to you line 18 if you don't mind :)
<Laney> it's a test you see
<Laney> the details are: lp:gsettings-ubuntu-touch-schemas
<didrocks> Laney: I have your password now ;)
<Laney> dunno what else to say :P
<robru> Laney, thanks, will look at it today after I finish this SRU ;-)
<sil2100> I remember I did some packaging review for that ;p
<didrocks> thanks robru, please note that on the spreadsheet (line 18 :p)
<sil2100> robru: so I'm leaving it to you then!
<didrocks> and coordinate with sil2100 maybe?
<sil2100> didrocks: will do
<didrocks> excellent!
<didrocks> cyphermox is not around, he had to leave
<didrocks> on some notes:
<didrocks> so now daily release can force rebuild some projects, even if you don't have any new commits
<didrocks> like a no change rebuild
<didrocks> (for new ABI for instance of a rdepends)
<kenvandine> yay
<didrocks> if you deploy your stack, you will see the option
<didrocks> (it's not exposed on the CLI tool as I'm unsure we should yet ;))
<didrocks> it can be set by default on a stack
<didrocks> so for instance mirslave stack deps on mir stack
<didrocks> and it's forced to rebuild everyday against last mir :)
<didrocks> also, there is a separete "SKIP_DEST_CHECK" option
<didrocks> let's say there was a manual upload to distro
<didrocks> not in the Vcs
<didrocks> you will be blocked by daily release
<didrocks> and normally, we merge that back upstream
<didrocks> (in the vcs)
<didrocks> but if you don't care about the changelog
<didrocks> and ensure that the fix is in the vcs
<didrocks> you can skip this check ;)
<didrocks> on other news, still working with the Mir team
<sil2100> Goooood!
<didrocks> we had some races that I workaround
<didrocks> and still a failure on ati where XMir doesn't start
<didrocks> so, working on that
<didrocks> + coordination with the MIR of Mir
<didrocks> (even if not enabled by default, we need it in main because xmir deps on it)
<sil2100> ;)
<didrocks> that's it for me
<sil2100> Awesome, good work!
<didrocks> because I press the "Archive" button, any questions/things to mention? :)
<sil2100> didrocks: one thing!
<didrocks> yes? :)
<sil2100> I think that we can also mark the 'Clean all new packages' already
<didrocks> sil2100: please do before I press *the* button :)
<sil2100> As done, finally - I checked all the leftovers, and saw that the merges finally got in ;p
<sil2100> didrocks: done!
<didrocks> great ;)
<didrocks> kenvandine: sil2100: robru: nice work! keep it up :)
<didrocks> thanks everyone ;)
<robru> didrocks, thanks
<sil2100> I'm still working on unity-mir, had a small pause for the unity stuff
<micahg> didrocks: I would think that ABI changes should be signed off on before world rebuilds happen (unless this is daily PPA only, not archive)
<didrocks> micahg: you are happy to help doing that :)
<didrocks> welcomed*
<didrocks> micahg: but for components that are not ABI stable, I think you will have daily work ;)
<didrocks> sil2100: between unity and unity-mir, this is your pause! :p
<micahg> didrocks: if it's in a PPA that's not heading to the archive, I think that's fine, if it's heading to the archive, I think it needs some type of signoff
<robru> didrocks, http://10.97.0.1:8080/view/cu2d/view/Head/view/WebApps/job/cu2d-webapp-head/196/console what happened here? marked unstable? is this ok or do I need to take some action on this?
<didrocks> robru: ah, I think that sil2100 published it then
<didrocks> robru: http://10.97.0.1:8080/view/cu2d/view/Head/view/WebApps/job/cu2d-webapp-head/ -> no yellow
<didrocks> robru: it's one of the issue with jenkins, publishing doesn't change stack colors
<sil2100> robru: yep, I published what I could in the morning
<robru> didrocks, ok, so it would have needed a manual publish at the time, but somebody already did so it's fine
<didrocks> hum, disconnected
<robru> sil2100, ok, thanks
<didrocks> not sure what went in
<didrocks> robru: yep, the dashboard, if we have time to work on it, should do that more clearly ;)
<sil2100> robru: I think there was a new package, which didrocks already preNEWed
<robru> didrocks, last message i see from you is "robru: it's one of the issue with jenkins, publishing doesn't change stack colors"
<didrocks> ok, sounds about what I wrote :)
<Skaag> how do calibrate the screen colors? when I open the profiles, the calibrate button is grayed out
 * didrocks waves good evening
<attente> jbicha, hey. can you try re-uploading indicator-keyboard? i made some changes that i hope fix the tests
<jbicha> attente: sure I'll take a look
<attente> thanks!
<popey> does anyone else have a battery gauge which sticks ?
<popey> my saucy laptop is telling me I have 4:40 left, and it's been saying that for hours
<popey> more annoyingly my laptop has died a couple of times because I didnt know the battery was empty
<sarnold> popey: czajkowski complained of the same problem..
<larsu> popey: there's a bug in the new libusb which causes upower to hang sometimes. bug #1203655
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1203655 in upower (Ubuntu) "Hangs in pthread_join in libusb_exit" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1203655
<larsu> popey: nobody knows how to reproduce it yet...
<czajkowski> popey: ahh that flipping bug has bitten me in the rear a few times now
<antarus> curious, is there a good method to determine which apps are using my video ram, or specifically for unity / compiz, which parts are using the video memory?
<antarus> I believe there is a top program for intel GPUs, but not for nvidia (which I am stuck with)
<lifeless> win 53
<lifeless> bah
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-07-24
<sam113101> I found a bug in the dash
<pitti> Good morning
<darkxst> jibel, gtk is failing autopkgtests in notify-osd, would you be able to have a look at that?
<darkxst> we were hoping to get this update into alpha2
<robru> didrocks, good morning! actually it seems I don't have permission to top-approve this one: https://code.launchpad.net/~robru/gsettings-ubuntu-touch-schemas/packaging/+merge/176569
<didrocks> robru: oh, that's so sad! let me approve it then :)
<didrocks> robru: only because of the smiley :p
<robru> hahah
<didrocks> done ;)
<didrocks> thanks robru!
<robru> didrocks, thanks
<didrocks> robru: once merged, you will prepare the cu2d-config?
<didrocks> (probably your tomorrow)
<robru> didrocks, oh, what needs to be done in -config?
<didrocks> robru: adding the new component
<didrocks> it's not in yet, right?
<didrocks> (for daily releases)
<robru> didrocks, hmmm, well it has no autopilot and I don't see any tests running during build... should it be daily released?
<didrocks> robru: yeah, it's a simple settings package, should be part of misc I guess
<robru> didrocks, hmmm, let me do that now, because I want you to review it before you leave today
<didrocks> ok ;)
<didrocks> robru: you will need to poke fginther for setting up the upstream merger part though
<robru> didrocks, https://code.launchpad.net/~robru/cupstream2distro-config/add-gsettings/+merge/176606 I guess this is all that's needed? I'm not sure what else needs to be done
<didrocks> robru: I think that's fine, I'm not sure if the upstream merger needs more TBHâ¦
<didrocks> robru: so, let me approve it, please check with fginther once he's online to set up the upstream merger
<didrocks> robru: and then, you can redeploy the stack to add the component to tomorrow's daily
<didrocks> sounds good?
<robru> didrocks, I don't think so... none of the other packages listed there have anything special. I think it's only when CI needs to know about autopilot that you need to do anything special.
<robru> didrocks, ok
<didrocks> robru: yeah, sounds like the case, he needs to create the CI part anyway ;)
<robru> didrocks, hmmm, how do I fix this? http://paste.ubuntu.com/5906637/
<didrocks> robru: you need to be in the team
<robru> bah!
<didrocks> Laney: can you add robru to ~system-settings-touch?
<robru> is it worth joining the team (since this isn't my usual stack) or should I just let somebody else do this?
<didrocks> robru: well, can be easier in case you need to deploy :)
<robru> ok
<jibel> good morning
<didrocks> salut jibel
<didrocks> jibel: mind doing a quick review? http://paste.ubuntu.com/5906654/
<didrocks> jibel: the corresponding change to cu2d-run is http://paste.ubuntu.com/5906657/
<jibel> Salut didrocks
<jibel> didrocks, I am not sure about the change in cu2d-run, I need to look at the code in its context
<didrocks> jibel: I've already ran it, it's just using the "head" job now for everything
<jibel> didrocks, indeed that's what I read from the pastebin but would like to check if it doesn't have any side effect since you're creating the main job in the publish section
<didrocks> jibel: http://paste.ubuntu.com/5906678/
<didrocks> the full command
<didrocks> I've moved jobname up now
<didrocks> as we are always using head
<jibel> didrocks, it is different from the patch, but LGTM :)
<jibel> didrocks, approved
<didrocks> jibel: yep, as told, I just moved the jobname up (instead of defining it twice in the if with the same name :p)
<didrocks> jibel: thanks!
<didrocks> deploying all the stacks and pushing
<larsu> Trevinho: woah, bamf support for qmlscene?!
<larsu> I thought we wanted to have a proper launcher instead of relying on qmlscene
<pitti> bienvenue Ã  les premiers langpacks pour saucy !
<pitti> hey larsu, wie gehts?
<larsu> pitti: sehr gut danke! Will sign a lease for an appartment in Berlin today :)
<larsu> pitti: wie geht's dir?
<pitti> larsu: oh, not homeless any more! :-)
<pitti> larsu: sehr gut, danke
<larsu> pitti: yeah! Now I have a home (with nothing in it :D)
<sil2100> Hi desktoppers!
<sil2100> hm, I noticed appmenu-gtk stopped building in the PPA because of the lack of gtk/ubuntumenuproxy.h
<sil2100> Did something change? Or is appmenu-gtk so deprecated that it won't build anymore?
<larsu> sil2100: it depends on a patch in gtk that got dropped
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<sil2100> seb128: morning!
<seb128> hey sil2100, larsu
<sil2100> larsu: oh, so maybe it would be wise for me to disable it from daily release then?
<seb128> sil2100, what larsu said, the source got dropped from saucy recently, we should probably stop daily building it as well
<sil2100> Right
<larsu> sil2100: yep :)
<sil2100> seb128, larsu, didrocks: https://code.launchpad.net/~sil2100/cupstream2distro-config/drop_appmenu-gtk/+merge/176615
<sil2100> If it's ok, I'll be redeploying indicators and re-running, since appmenu-gtk was blocking the release
<didrocks> hey seb128, sil2100, larsu
<didrocks> and pitti
<seb128> didrocks, lut
<sil2100> Hi! \o/
<didrocks> sil2100: before redeploying, ensure to merge to trunk ;)
<larsu> didrocks: good morning didrocks!
<larsu> woah, double-ping
<didrocks> :)
<sil2100> didrocks: I re-ran QA since a new autopilot with the AP fixes has landed after the daily-release process, so it might be green now
<seb128> didrocks, https://code.launchpad.net/~sil2100/cupstream2distro-config/drop_appmenu-gtk/+merge/176615 seems fine to me?
<larsu> sil2100: I don't even know what this does... so I'll let didrocks handle the MR
<didrocks> sil2100: ok, thanks
<seb128> didrocks, that's not covered in the faq, seems weird that it needs a new file just to drop a component?
<thomi> sil2100: if it's still broken, please let me know
<sil2100> thomi: thanks guys!
<thomi> sil2100: no worries
<thomi> one of those problems was really hard to track down :)
<didrocks> seb128: I think sil2100 wants still to have the upstream merger in
<sil2100> didrocks: we could drop it completely as well, but I thought it's not up to me if it's 'dropped' completely or not
<sil2100> ;)
<sil2100> Having autolanding is not a bad thing for now
<sil2100> didrocks: ok, merged in trunk and now redeploying \o/
<sil2100> didrocks: hmmm
<sil2100> didrocks: strange thing happened
<sil2100> didrocks: I redeployed the indicators stack for head, but it still has appmenu-gtk in it?
<didrocks> sil2100: is the strange thing linked to my modification from the morning?
<didrocks> sil2100: yeah, the jobs aren't removed
<didrocks> sil2100: it's just "unplugged"
<didrocks> so that you can still track the history
<didrocks> you need to remove it manually
<didrocks> (the prepare job itself)
<sil2100> didrocks: do I have to remove the prepare job for the check job to not notice it?
<sil2100> didrocks: maybe I need to rebuild the stack without 'foo', since it's still looking for appmenu-gtk
<didrocks> sil2100: no, you don't need to remove the prepare job, it's already unplugged
<didrocks> sil2100: so, just rebuild with foo
<didrocks> ah
<didrocks> yeah, indeed
<didrocks> you need to remove .project file
<didrocks> or rebuild the whole stack
 * sil2100 removed the .project file and re-ran
<didrocks> sil2100: so, I changed the "force publication" mecanism
<didrocks> if you use the command line tool, no change for you
<didrocks> (just ensure you have the latest cupstream2distro)
<sil2100> didrocks: I noticed that it's available on the head job as well
<didrocks> it's only available on the head job now
<sil2100> Ah
<seb128> \o/ unity landing
<didrocks> that way, we'll get "green" everywhere in the stack
<sil2100> seb128: yes, yesterday it landed ;p I mean, I forcefully landed it :<
<didrocks> no more "yellow" even if published
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<seb128> sil2100, what was the issue/how did it get unblocked?
<seb128> pitti, salut, Ã§a va bien ?
<didrocks> it's in proposed, right?
<didrocks> blocked manually by Laney I guess
<pitti> le vert, le vert pour tous le monde !
<Laney> hello
<seb128> didrocks, a2 block I guess
<pitti> seb128: oui, merci ! et toi ?
<seb128> Laney, good morning
<didrocks> seb128: oh, right, for lubuntu maybe
<pitti> Laney: good day!
<seb128> pitti, Ã§a va bien, merci ;-)
<sil2100> seb128: so, there was a lot of issues with unity, first we had the DBus saturation issue which got fixed in HUD, then we had autopilot failures, then there were otto problems with OOM (due to recordmydesktop), then we had powerpc FTBFS and finally there was a flacky unit test that fails randomly on slow armhf machines
<sil2100> phew
<sil2100> didrocks: \o/
<sil2100> didrocks: so, even when using the CLI tool, the head job will turn green then?
<didrocks> sil2100: yep
<Laney> didrocks: I don't understand what the point of passing --fail-missing to all dh commands is? Does something other than dh_install listen to it?
<seb128> didrocks,ubuntukylin rather I guess
<seb128> (they use unity)
<didrocks> Laney: no, it just prevent having an override for one line
<didrocks> seb128: ah ok
<didrocks> seb128: btw, I already preNEWed the settings package from Laney?
<Laney> seems weird and less self documenting
<seb128> didrocks, is that a question? ;-)
<didrocks> argh, brain broken
<didrocks> it was:
<didrocks> seb128: btw, *did you*â¦
<seb128> didrocks, yes
<didrocks> great, so should be there as soon as fginther setup the upstream merger
<Laney> am I supposed to merge this branch or wait for that?
<didrocks> Laney: I think it will be the right timing to check to test fginther deployement :)
<Laney> k
<sil2100> didrocks: hm, the mirslave check job seems to be hanged for ati
<sil2100> didrocks: http://10.97.0.1:8080/job/autopilot-saucy-daily_release/583/label=autopilot-ati/console
<sil2100> didrocks: it's not moving, and it blocks other AP tests
<didrocks> sil2100: indeed, it seems that the tests didn't start
<didrocks> sil2100: let me ssh
<didrocks> sil2100: well, it will block until the timeoutâ¦
<sil2100> The timeout is quite large ;)
<didrocks> sil2100: I don't remember, still 2 hours?
<didrocks> sil2100: or did we keep a higher value for your dbus issue?
<sil2100> No idea, hm, I always thought it's till 2 hours for all, but maybe it's not?
<didrocks> sil2100: so 2h is needed, see the time taken by unity testsâ¦
<didrocks> sil2100: ok, I'm powering that off
<sil2100> didrocks: ok, thanks :)
<didrocks> will retry after those tests ran
<bdrung> Sweetshark: hi. i am sorry that i just overlooked/ignored your mail regarding libreoffice 4.1.0 rc1.
<bdrung> Sweetshark: do you want to update the branch to rc4?
<bdrung> Sweetshark: do you want to merge debian-experimental-4.1?
<Sweetshark> bdrung: I updated to rc4, and have a testbuild running in https://launchpad.net/~bjoern-michaelsen/+archive/libreoffice-staging -- I will push when it succeeds.
<Sweetshark> bdrung: it already merged debian-experimental-4.1 quite recently.
<bdrung> Sweetshark: then it doesn't seem to be pushed to alioth.
<didrocks> sil2100: it seems the ati machine is screwed, no?
<didrocks> weird that we only see this on the ati machine
<sil2100> didrocks: it happened on intel today as well
<didrocks> sil2100: a race in distro? what changed?
<didrocks> it's the same snapshot than yesterday though
<sil2100> didrocks: today's unity run had a timeout on intel and ati passed - I poked jibel about that, since in case of unity I thought it's the OOM thing with recordmydesktop
<didrocks> jibel: you didn't change anything on the machines, right? ^
<sil2100> FJKong: welcome to our team!
<FJKong> #sil2108 thank you very much :)
<FJKong> sil2100, thank you
<didrocks> welcome FJKong :)
<pitti> hey FJKong, welcome to the desktop team!
<pitti> FJKong: task #1: learn French
<sil2100> :o
<pitti> salut Monsieur FJKong, bienvenue Ã  l'Ã©quipe de bureau !
 * sil2100 doesn't know French yet!
<Laney> ah but you put it in your annual objectives, yesyes? :P
<seb128> FJKong, hey, welcome on board!
<FJKong> pitti, French  sounds good, symbol of romantic.
<FJKong> thank you guys,  happy to meet you here.
<Laney> wtf
<Laney> maliit "general packaging cleanup" -> throw away everything that was there before and start again
<seb128> who did that?
<seb128> oh, rsalvati
<Laney> yes
<seb128> weird
<seb128> he's usually doing reasonable changes
<Laney> quite annoying
<seb128> rsalveti, ^ can you explain why you redid the packaging? (I guess you are sleeping, but later when you read the backlog)
<Laney> I guess it's what was in the phablet branch
<seb128> well, that's an upload to the archive, they should have rebased on the archive version
<seb128> not the other way around
<Laney> you'd think...
<Laney> that's also the packaging that's in debian ^o)
<seb128> let's wait for rsalveti
<seb128> no need to speculate about the reasons
<Laney> wasn't
<seb128> Laney, btw, I reviewed your tz merge proposal
<seb128> Laney, that list is crazy :p
<Laney> haha
<Laney> it'll only be displayed when you type something in the box
<seb128> it better does that, if you don't want to spend your day scrolling down ;-)
<Laney> will do that after reviewing the diagnostics branch again
<mhr3> seb128, continuing on yesterday's build.id, where to get that from once hybris doesn't provide it? ie where will it be on ubuntu-edge? :)
<seb128> mhr3, no I don't, I'm not even sure those details are defined yet ... check with ogra_ or rsalveti maybe they know
<mhr3> somehow i expected that answer
<seb128> ;-)
 * Laney eyes the PS Jenkins bot
<didrocks> Laney: what about it?
<Laney> there's something off in its chroot
<Laney> https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/job/ubuntu-system-settings-saucy-amd64-ci/148/console
<didrocks> Laney: ah, I thought you meant the upload in proposed
<ogra_> seb128, mhr3, well, the question is, do you want to expose android build info at all :) the ubuntu rootfs build id is in /var/log/installer/media-info in case you prefer that
<Laney> no, don't know anything about any upload
<Laney> not sure I want to :P
<mhr3> ogra_, well i just want a build id, surely once we don't have android bits we still need it
<ogra_> mhr3, well, then the ubuntu image build id is probably the best
<mhr3> ogra_, then again we want it so the individual operator variants can be distinguished, so not exactly :)
<ogra_> and that file is also compatible with i.e. debian-installer or ubiquity installations
<ogra_> well, then you need the id from the props i guess
<ogra_> btw, i wouldnt expect the edge to work differently from the nexus images we have today
<ogra_> we will have more access to the binary blobs there but i wouldnt expect the concept to change to radical here
<xnox> ogra_: mhr3: there is another file we use for oem/sku distinguishing.
<ogra_> xnox, in the cdimage generated builds ?
<mhr3> xnox, there is?
<ogra_> i dont think we did put any stamp info inside until i implemented the above one
<xnox> created by oem-config, i don't think cdimage creates it at the moment, but if/when we will have per-sku/operator builds, we will add it.
<ogra_> right
<xnox> ogra_: but using same stamp as oem-config will make it compatible between phone/desktop installs.
<ogra_> xnox, what is that stamp file ? /var/log/installer/media-info is what all tools use (i.e. apport)
 * ogra_ never heard of another one except for jenkins build stamps (shich nothing in the archive uses)
<xnox> ogra_: var/log/installer/oem-id
<ogra_> ah
<xnox> ogra_:  that's present on all OEM pre-installed ubuntu machines, I believe, or if one manually create oem install and configures it.
 * ogra_ never saw it ... even in preinstalled oem installs, do you need to preseed anything to have it created ?
<xnox> ogra_: so when ubiquity is launched in oem mode, it offers to specify oem id, it's optional field =/ and then it will be propogated to var/log/installer/oem-id. There is no other magic to it =) it's meant to denote batch/sku of machines
<ogra_> xnox, ah, that why i never saw it on arm installs
<ogra_> we never ran the preparation step there but instead started directly into the config
<xnox> ogra_: right, cause only the later "client" portion is used in pre-installed arm. The oem-id is in the "prepare" portion of it.
<seb128> Laney, did you get a reply from anyone on the CI chroot issue?
<Laney> seb128: nope, who/where is the place to ping about that?
<seb128> sil2100, ^ can you help?
<didrocks> seb128: this is the upstream merger
<didrocks> I doubt sil2100 can help
<seb128> didrocks, that's fginthers?
<didrocks> I think you need to ping fginther/alesageâ¦
<didrocks> yeah
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> that was the question "who to ping" ;-)
<sil2100> Sadly, all the upstream merger people are US based...
<sil2100> This is a bit sad I must say
<didrocks> that's why I try to avoid the CI word
<didrocks> but it seems I'm in the minority
<didrocks> anywayâ¦
<seb128> oh, I know what's the issue is
<seb128> hum, or not
<seb128> Laney, oh, I know
<seb128> Laney, you need libtimezonemap >= 0.4.0.1 or that version is only in proposed and CI doesn't use proposed
<seb128> so it fails to install the requirement
<Laney> why is it going on about python?
<seb128> I don't know, apt errors on install fail can be confusing
<Laney> didn't we make the daily releases use proposed now anyway?
<seb128>  pbuilder-satisfydepends-dummy : Depends: libtimezonemap1-dev (>= 0.4.0.1) but it is not going to be installed.
<seb128> ...
<seb128> Laney, CI != merger
<Laney> yes
<Laney> but they should use the same sources
<seb128> we have been going forth and back on that
<seb128> I didn't follow closely what was decided, they both have issues
<seb128> Laney, can you unblock libmaptimezone out of proposed?
<Laney> it wouldn't be much good if it passed here and then failed to build in the daily release PPA because of a problem in proposed
<seb128> it doesn't seem there is any reason to hold it in there, it's not a disruptive update
<seb128> Laney, there doesn't seem to be an issue with proposed, what do you mean?
<Laney> the argument against enabling proposed there
<seb128> Laney, well, alternatively, if you don't want to unblock the lib, can you lower the build-depends and list the things that you need to workaround the buggy -dev depends?
<Laney> I'd rather unblock it than do that
<Laney> but I'd rather have to do neither
<seb128> Laney, I'm not arguing in favor or anything, the CI guys are U.S based and sleeping and I don't want us to block work on them to be up and on further discussions
<Laney> still, I'll unblock
<Laney> not convinced this is the only problem though :-)
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> let's see
<seb128> I just tried in a pbuilder
<seb128> which suggests it is
<seb128> not sure why python is listed in that log though
<sil2100> didrocks: packages list refreshed!
<sil2100> didrocks: https://code.launchpad.net/~sil2100/cupstream2distro-config/add_check_to_unity8/+merge/176407
<sil2100> didrocks: it tests on jenkins, so it's ok
<sil2100> (there are some failures though)
<sil2100> Test failures
<didrocks> sil2100: ande working apparently, right? (well some tests failing, but that's up to Saviq's team of a bad interaction with unity7 loaded?)
<didrocks> and*
<didrocks> sil2100: you did ping him?
<sil2100> didrocks: will to ;) But I guess the branch is OK for approval in the meantime
<didrocks> sil2100: DONE
<sil2100> didrocks: THX :D
<seb128> Laney, CI just acked https://code.launchpad.net/~seb128/ubuntu-system-settings/sound-design-update/+merge/176645 for me
<seb128> Laney, which suggests the chroot is fine, it's just getting unhappy about the libtimezone thing
<Laney> it's in saucy now so let's see
<Laney> if it triggers itself
<seb128> you might need to change the status of the mp to retrigger a CI run
<seb128> or ping fginter/alasage
<Laney> i'll wait until it is on the mirror
<seb128> ok
 * Laney dives into FilterProxy hell
<Saviq> desrt, ping
<desrt> Saviq: hey
<Saviq> desrt, hey, I stumbled upon an issue with Gio.Settings.new_with_path
<Saviq> desrt, it seems to require trailing slash
<desrt> that's correct
<desrt> dconf and gsettings have a very strict concept of what is a pathname and what is a keyname
<desrt> and pathnames always require trailing slashes to identify them as such
<desrt> it's because in dconf you can have both /a and /a/b
<Saviq> desrt, would it make sense to error out if it doesn't?
<desrt> so /a is the key and /a/ is the path containing 'b'
<desrt> Saviq: i think so... they are two different entities
<Saviq> desrt, so yeah, new_with_path takes it in blindly
<Saviq> desrt, and then the path is simply concatenated with the key value when you set_ it
<desrt> ohhh
<desrt> ouch!
<desrt> ya.  that is a bug
<desrt> please file that
<desrt> thanks
<Saviq> desrt, which project?
<desrt> glib
<Saviq> desrt, doing
<desrt> https://bugzilla.gnome.org/enter_bug.cgi?product=glib in case you didn't find it already :)
<Saviq> desrt, https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=704802
<ubot2`> Gnome bug 704802 in gsettings "new_with_path deosn't check for trailing slash in path" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<desrt> Saviq: thanks
<seb128> Laney, easier to discuss it, what's the advange of an enum there? the enum helps to translate numbers to names right?
<seb128> discuss it *here*
<Laney> seb128: yes, readability, I'm sure your one works too
<seb128> Laney, in that case I just want to store/read the number
<seb128> well, I couldn't do index = key
<seb128> I would need to do (sort == "name") ? 1 : 0
<Laney> yep
<seb128> you think it would be easier to read?
<seb128> that's basically what my first version with the boolean do btw
<seb128> https://code.launchpad.net/~seb128/ubuntu-system-settings/storage-store-sorting/+merge/176429
<Laney> Feels that way but not sure
<Laney> yeah it's like that but more extensible
<Laney> I don't mind though - do what you think is best
<seb128> I don't foresee any other option to be added there
<seb128> ok, let's accept the boolean one then
<Laney> just responded to you asking if it was nice
<Laney> ok, in a bit though - getting this fitlering to work
<seb128> sure, thanks
<desrt> seb128, Laney: good morning guys
<seb128> desrt, hey
<seb128> how are you?
<Laney> howdy desrt
<desrt> pretty good
 * desrt has his coffee ;)
<rsalveti> Laney: seb128: the general package clean up was on top of sergio's changes, just adding vcs, fixing control, etc, not really big changes
<rsalveti> you can see the bzr log for the packaging branch
<rsalveti> also, afaik sergio tried to make this compatible with what we had before
<seb128> rsalveti, seems like that packaging branch had a packaging different from the one from the archive/Debian
<rsalveti> it's just that upstream is kind of broken at this moment
<rsalveti> is debian using 0.99 as well?
 * rsalveti checks
<seb128> updating the version usually don't need to redo debian/
<seb128> just to bump changelog and adapt depends and stuff
<rsalveti> right, but everything changed with 99
<rsalveti> drop support for gtk
<rsalveti> moving from qt4 to qt5
<rsalveti> and such
<Laney> I was trying to keep the packages the same
<Laney> I'd have helped review and sponsor any update into Debian
<rsalveti> I'm not sure you want .99 in debian at this point
<Laney> it's only in experimental as is
<rsalveti> it only works for us because we'll be pushing a touch specific keyboard
<rsalveti> even the examples, from maliit-plugins is sort of broken =\
<rsalveti> right from upstream
<rsalveti> 94 -> 99 is a major change
<Laney> so the package is going to be useless for any other consumer than touch for now?
<rsalveti> Laney: yes
<rsalveti> because that's the state of upstream
<Laney> it's not the state of what we had before in the archive though
<rsalveti> it'll be better once we push the other keyboard, which is not touch specific btw, it'll be the one we're using for touch
<rsalveti> we'll do a bit of more work on it still, we just needed a newer version because that got tons of changes we needed
<Laney> phew
<Laney> filtering works!
<seb128> Laney, well done ;-)
<Laney> the list data isn't great though
<rsalveti> hm, no qtdeclarative5-dev for ppc
<seb128> rsalveti, v8 doesn't exit on ppc
<seb128> exist
<rsalveti> argh
<seb128> rsalveti, so most of qt5 is !ppc
<ogra_> bah, so we wont have PPC phone support
<ogra_> how bad
<rsalveti> seb128: so should disable builds for ppc for packages depending on qt5 then?
<rsalveti> or just let it pending in the archive?
<seb128> rsalveti, no, they are just going to depwait
<Laney> leave it depwaiting
<seb128> rsalveti, but if it existed before (because it was e.g qt4) you need an archive admin to delete the old ppc binaries
<rsalveti> who knows, someone might want to port v8
<Laney> seb128: I'm going to reject my outstanding MPs and submit a new big one
<seb128> otherwise britney stops migration
<seb128> Laney, ok
<rsalveti> seb128: yeah, that's the case here
<rsalveti> seb128: oh, and btw, you're an archive admin :P
<seb128> rsalveti, right :p is that for maliit?
<rsalveti> seb128: yup
<seb128> does it has rdepends?
 * seb128 checks
<seb128> rsalveti, there is a nemo plugin depending on it ... is that going away or?
<rsalveti> seb128: we got a dep wait for maliit-framework and maliit-plugins
<rsalveti> as both uses qt5 now
<rsalveti> seb128: new maliit-plugins should bring a newer version of that package
<seb128> rsalveti, ok, great, let me check with cjwatson to make sure it's ok to delete the binaries and that's going to make britney happy
<rsalveti> seb128: great, thanks
<attente> rsalveti, what keyboard are you planning to switch to?
<rsalveti> attente: it's basically the one already used in the touch images, but that is part of a fork that happened on top of the previous maliit-plugins package
<rsalveti> what we'll be doing is pushing another package with just our keyboard, so we can drop the fork
<attente> ah, thanks
<pitti> seb128, didrocks: Just a FYI, please don't expect bug 1201485 to land soon
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1201485 in langpack-o-matic "Need to import translations for the unity daily builds" [Undecided,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1201485
<seb128> pitti, :-(
<seb128> pitti, why not?
<pitti> seb128, didrocks: if we need to do that entirely in langpack-o-matic, we need to replicate the entire LP logic for importing the raw tarballs
<pitti> seb128, didrocks: which is a nontrivial amount of work due to all the overrides and mapping logic
<pitti> seb128, didrocks: my iniitial reaction would have been "let's ask LP to import these tarballs itself", but I guess that's not that much faster as there is no devel crew any more
<seb128> right
<seb128> we can still check with wgrant
<seb128> but I guess waiting on launchpad is going to take forever
<pitti> but that also means that translating all these packages in LP is broken, right?
<pitti> as the updated translations or POTs never get fed into it
<seb128> right, that's what the bug is about
<seb128> the new templates are not imported
<seb128> so the list of strings is outdated
<seb128> the export/langpack is actually fine
<pitti> seb128: right, but I can't fix that on the langpack-o-matic side
<pitti> the only thing I can do theoretically is to download the raw tarballs, do the mangling/mapping logic myself, and put them into langpacks
<pitti> but that'll of course sidestep LP translations
<seb128> shrug
 * seb128 tries to think
<pitti> so the conceptually cleanest solution is actually to copy the raw translation tarballs along when copying the source/binaries
<pitti> as if it were an upload
<seb128> pitti, no trivial solution, I wonder if we should just hack around by scripting a "upload updated template to launchpad manually" meanwhile
<desrt> pitti: hey
<seb128> pitti, it sucks to have unity and indicators not correctly translated
<desrt> pitti: wanted to talk to you about this systemd version number thing.  what's your take on that?
<sil2100> jibel: what do you think? https://code.launchpad.net/~sil2100/otto/fix_1203809/+merge/176692
<pitti> seb128: I updated the bug and pinged William/Steve about it
<pitti> hey desrt
<seb128> pitti, thanks
<sil2100> Saviq: approved! Let's get the ball rolling
<pitti> desrt: my gut feeling is that adding a version API to -shim should be ok
<pitti> desrt: but it could of course lure other programs into thinking that we actually have systemd as pid 1
<desrt> ya....
<desrt> i was wondering if maybe we could get upower upstream to change their behaviour
<desrt> but really, why is upower issuing power management jobs these days?
<desrt> some legacy code is poking its interfaces or something?
<desrt> it seems pretty ridiculous that we have a app -> upower -> logind -> systemd-shim -> kernel path :/
<pitti> desrt: yes; it doesn't issue suspend request by itself, just when you ask it over its dbus interface
<Saviq> sil2100, yeah... at least half an hour for it to land, though :/
<pitti> desrt: as it has had the suspend/hibernate calls for many years, we need to transition everything to logind first before we can disable them
<pitti> desrt: but it works in principle; there is of course the new libusbx sometimes crashing/hanging upower, which causes some problems right now
<pitti> seb128: so by #u-devel this might actually be much simpler on the LP side
<seb128> pitti, just read that, great
<ritz> Sweetshark ping, sorry about https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libreoffice/+bug/628105 .
<ubot2`> Ubuntu bug 628105 in libreoffice (Ubuntu Quantal) "[Upstream] Text not black in LibreOffice" [Undecided,In progress]
<ritz> Sweetshark I will go ahead and subscribe ubuntu-sponsor to this
<Sweetshark> ritz: np
<Sweetshark> ritz: do you need this for precise or quantal?
<ritz> precise
<ritz> quantal, not so much. non -LTS
<ritz> but nice to have
<Sweetshark> ritz: Right. So there is a source package locked and loaded at: https://launchpad.net/~bjoern-michaelsen/+archive/libreoffice-oneirictest-20110718 -- It only needs the SRU redtape foo ...
<ritz> mvo hi, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDebdeltaSupport . this seems interesting
<ritz> How could I push for this out ?
<Sweetshark> ritz: while few people (some ~300) are using the libreoffice-3-5 ppa this package has been tested there (with only a different version number) for a month now
<sil2100> didrocks: can I redeploy and re-run unity8?
<didrocks> sil2100: sure
<didrocks> kenvandine: hey, btw, not sure if you published recently manually :)
<didrocks> FYI, the publisher changed slightly its logic
<didrocks> it will always retriggers all jobs
<didrocks> to have "green" instead of "yellow/red"
<didrocks> that will clear the view up
<didrocks> if you used the command line tool, nothing will change, just ensure to have latest cupstream2distro
<didrocks> if you did it directly on the webui, the "force publication" check is on the head job now, not on the publisher job anymore
<didrocks> cyphermox: as well, FYI ^
<cyphermox> cool
<kenvandine> didrocks, cool, thanks
<seb128> laney: oh, another detail ... "Time Zone" or "Time zone"?
<seb128> the second one is the style we are supposed to use, I was just unsure of "TimeZone" is considered as a word
<Laney> where?
<Laney> oh, you mean the design is wrong?
<seb128> Laney: we didn't have consistency so far but design confirmed recently we should use "sentence case" (e.g only capital for the start of the string)
<Laney> should it be Time & date then?
<seb128> I'm not sure when there is a "&"
<Laney> mpt: ^?
<Laney> fixed Time zone anyway
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> kenvandine, do you want to give a look to the cpp code from https://code.launchpad.net/~laney/ubuntu-system-settings/datetime-panel/+merge/176689 or should I just ack it?
<seb128> (we can always fix bugs later)
<Laney> what's the recommended api for the location detection bit?
<Laney> qtmobility?
<kenvandine> seb128, you can just ack it
<kenvandine> Laney, i think it's qtlocation now
<kenvandine> but i haven't used it
<Laney> ok
<Laney> not just hitting the geolookup web service then ;-)
<seb128> Laney: qtlocation indeed, backend work is almost done, see https://code.launchpad.net/~thomas-voss/platform-api/add-location-service-api-take-2/+merge/173457
<Laney> ok
<Laney> I hope it works on the desktop
<Laney> hate having to build on armhf
<seb128> yeah, me too
<seb128> laney, I still have https://code.launchpad.net/~seb128/ubuntu-system-settings/storage-store-sorting/+merge/176429 up for review if you feel like doing an easy one ;-)
<Laney> seb128: yeah, can do
<seb128> Laney: thanks
<seb128> laney: I just approved your datetime, great work ;-)
<seb128> next on my list is the language one
<seb128> review list that's it
<Laney> thanks
<Laney> seems alm still didn't land
<seb128> :-(
<Laney> sabdfl http://www.oscon.com/oscon2013/public/content/video
<seb128> laney: laggy here :/
<Laney> :(
<Laney> works quite fine for me
<kenvandine> fginther, can you look at my CI failures for https://code.launchpad.net/~ken-vandine/libpam-freerdp/bootstrap/+merge/176751
<kenvandine> the thin-client stack shouldn't be building for quantal CI and it's using some old config, nesting the debian dir
<kenvandine> we've had CI succeed before... since inlining the packaging
<fginther> kenvandine, sorry, got wormholed.
<fginther> kenvandine, I'll get to it soon
<kenvandine> fginther, thx... the branch has merged
<kenvandine> but CI failed with the merge problem
<robru> kenvandine, can you redeploy the misc stack from -config trunk? I can't do it because I'm not in ~system-settings-touch
<kenvandine> robru, i just added you
<robru> kenvandine, ah thanks
<robru> I'll deploy then
<mpt> Laney, Title Case for the top-level categories (e.g. Time & Date), Sentence case for everything lower (e.g. Time zone)
<czajkowski> mpt: boo
<mpt> You can't scare me, czajkowski, you're too far away.
<czajkowski> mpt: did you like your M&Ms
<mpt> czajkowski, you were here???
<czajkowski> I was
<czajkowski> didnt evan tel you they were from me :(
<czajkowski> mpt: there was even cake!
<mpt> Drat and tarnation
<mpt> czajkowski, they melted slightly against my screen.
<czajkowski> :o
<czajkowski> we had yummy carrot cake from Kondor  & Cook, it said Thank you - was for wgrant and stevenk
<mpt> So that's what happens when I go into a meeting room to work in peace and quiet. I miss out on carrot cake.
<czajkowski> you snooze you lose
<czajkowski> I sent M&Ms down to you
<czajkowski> and you let them melt!
<mlankhorst> O_O
<poz> hi, anyone know how to change the transparency of unity dash with out unity tweek utility or compiz config
<poz> ?
<sarnold> poz: check this out: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-bugcontrol/ubuntu-qa-tools/master/view/head:/vm-tools/uvt#L2233
<poz> thanks sarnold, i will take a look
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-07-25
<qengho> Someone on recent Saucy help me check if I'm sane.
<qengho> $ grep ^DAEMON /etc/init.d/lightdm
<qengho> $ ls -l /usr/*bin/lightdm
<robru> $ grep ^DAEMON /etc/init.d/lightdm
<robru> DAEMON=/usr/bin/lightdm
<robru> $ ls -l /usr/*bin/lightdm
<robru> -rwxr-xr-x 1 root root 176368 Jul 22 16:43 /usr/sbin/lightdm
<robru> qengho, ^
<qengho> robru: thanks.  I'm trying to figure out if that's as bogus as it looks.  I rebooted one machine, and it didn't launch a greeter until I set those to /usr/sbin .
<robru> qengho, are you saying it's not safe to reboot my current saucy system? shit
<qengho> robru: I'm still looking.  It's not perilous.  You'll recover.
<robru> check if the init script changed recently?
<qengho> robru: If I'm reading this "etckeeper" diff right, no etc change since May. Maybe the binary moved.
<qengho> I don't really trust this machine now. Could another /etc/init.d/ script start another greeter?
<qengho> on yours?
<qengho> robru: ^
<robru> qengho, not sure, how would I check that? last time I booted (7 days ago) I saw lightdm without any issue
<robru> qengho, try running 'debsums -as', will make sure that all the files on the system match the checksums from their respective packages. helps improve confidence in a system i find
<qengho> robru: Yep. Add "cruft" to your toolkit, too.
<sarnold> qengho: ooh, cruft looks useful. thanks.
<robru> interesting, running it now
<pitti> Good morning
<larsu> pitti: Guten Morgen!
<pitti> hey larsu, wie gehts?
<larsu> pitti: gut! War endlich mal frÃ¼her hier als du :P  Und dir?
<pitti> larsu: danke, ein bisschen muede; noch lange gehackt gestern :)
<jbicha> larsu: do you use the same alarm clock setting as pitti? ;)
<pitti> I don't have an alarm clock even -- my wife gets up at 5 normally, then I sleep for a bit longer and then just wake up
<larsu> jbicha: no, I don't have an alarm clock. Just happened to wake up early today
<larsu> well, technically I _do_ have an alarm clock on my phone, but I never set it :)
<jbicha> hmm, maybe it's just something about Germany then :)
<larsu> jbicha: land of the early risers!
<pitti> jbicha: well, I go to bed at 10 pm, so it's only natural that I don't sleep that long
<pitti> and it's actually quite nice in summer, you can spend the better part of the work day in the cooler hours
<TheMuso> You Europeans are lucky with your summers and sunlight well into the evening, although I guess you pay for it in Winter. :)
<RAOF> You don't need to go all the way to Europe for that :)
<TheMuso> Oh ok, wasn't sure just how things are in Tassy. :)
<didrocks> well, in Winter, it's the night starting 4:30/5PM
<larsu> didrocks: salut!
<didrocks> hey larsu! how are you?
<larsu> didrocks: very good, thanks. You?
<didrocks> larsu: I'm fine, thanks :)
<pitti> bonjour didrocks!
<didrocks> hey pitti!
<jbicha> didrocks: hey could we have someone look at the notify-osd autopkgtest failure since it's holding up gtk+3.0
<jbicha> I didn't even see enough information in the build log for me to know what exactly is failing
<pitti> yeah, "fun" wit the parallel test runner again
<pitti> but I recently learned a trick
<pitti> put VERBOSE=yes into TEST_ENVIRONMENT
<jbicha> oh and the tests seem to pass locally here
<didrocks> jbicha: I won't have the time honestly, but try with macslow? he's upstream for it
 * pitti runs it in run-adt-test
<pitti> reproduces fine
<pitti> a simple package build and 'xvfb-run --server-args="-screen 0 800x600x8" make check' reproduces it, too
<pitti> ** (./test-modules:18204): WARNING **: Error retrieving accessibility bus address: org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.ServiceUnknown: The name org.a11y.Bus was not provided by any .service files
<pitti> apparently the test suite uses fatal-criticals or so?
<jbicha> oh yeah, I forgot that autopkgtests have to be run separately, right?
<pitti> what do you mean?
<jbicha> I really don't know much about them
<pitti> jbicha: I just unpacked the package, dpkg-buildpackage -b, and run make check under xvfb
<pitti> (which is essentially what happens in n-osd's autopkgtest)
<jbicha> I did bzr bd  on lp:notify-osd without errors
<pitti> jbicha: yes, but the package doesn't run tests during buuild
<pitti> which is unfortunate
<jbicha> ^ that's what I mean
<jbicha> pitti: is it as simple as a missing dependency on at-spi2-core ?
<pitti> could be
 * pitti tries
<pitti> jbicha: hm, if I install at-spi-core "make check" hangs indefinitely
<pitti> spi2
<pitti> and under dbus-launch I get even more errors
<pitti> /bubble/can set bubble attributes: loading icon 'notification-/usr/share/icons/Human/scalable/status/notification-message-im.svg' caused error: 'Icon 'notification-/usr/share/icons/Human/scalable/status/notification-message-im.svg' not present in theme'
<pitti> ** (./test-modules:13683): WARNING **: AT-SPI: Could not obtain desktop path or name
<jibel> good morning
<sil2100> Morning!
<sil2100> seb128: morning!
<seb128> sil2100, hey, how are you?
<seb128> good morning desktopers!
<sil2100> seb128: fine, how about you? Do you have a moment for some packaging ACKs?
<seb128> sil2100, sure
<sil2100> seb128: since I'd like to publish something but didrocks is not around ;)
<seb128> no didrocks today?
<sil2100> He was here, but got disconnected and didn't appear again
<seb128> ok
<sil2100> seb128: http://10.97.0.1:8080/view/cu2d/view/Head/view/Settings/job/cu2d-settings-head-3.0publish/lastSuccessfulBuild/artifact/packaging_changes_gsettings-qt_0.0+13.10.20130725-0ubuntu1.diff <- your changes ;p
<sil2100> http://10.97.0.1:8080/view/cu2d/view/Head/view/Settings/job/cu2d-settings-head-3.0publish/lastSuccessfulBuild/artifact/packaging_changes_ubuntu-system-settings_0.1+13.10.20130725-0ubuntu1.diff <- same here ;p
<sil2100> I guess it's an ACK?
<seb128> sil2100, it sure is ;-)
<sil2100> Publishing then
<seb128> thanks!
<sil2100> seb128: now for the other... do you know if url-dispatcher and gsettings-ubuntu-touch-schemas got preNEWed?
<seb128> sil2100, what stack is that? I just got an email from didrocks, he says the tech from his provider is at his place setting up his new connection and that you can publish misc
<sil2100> Ah, it's in misc
<sil2100> Ok ;)
<sil2100> So I guess it's ok
<seb128> he has some comments but nothing blocking
<seb128> I had preNEWed the schemas one
<sil2100> seb128: and another one (the rest is still pending): webcreds http://10.97.0.1:8080/view/cu2d/view/Head/view/WebCreds/job/cu2d-webcred-head-3.0publish/lastSuccessfulBuild/artifact/packaging_changes_accounts-qml-module_0.1+13.10.20130725-0ubuntu1.diff
<seb128> I guess didrocks did the dispatcher
<seb128> sil2100, +1
<sil2100> seb128: thanks!
<sil2100> I'll wait for the rest to finish, as we were blocked by the long unity testing again, so some other stacks might also need ACKing once they're done
<sil2100> didrocks: hi!
<didrocks> hey sil2100!
<sil2100> didrocks: internet back? ;)
<didrocks> I'm on a 3G connexion
<didrocks> sil2100: not yet
<sil2100> Ah
<sil2100> didrocks: I published misc, but
<didrocks> ah great :)
<didrocks> on url_dispatcher:
<didrocks> - needs a symbol files
<didrocks> - short description of -dev and the lib are the same
<didrocks> - url-dispatcher needs to be multiarched (in a multiarch path)
<didrocks> (that's my notes ;))
<sil2100> didrocks: I hope you don't mind I published indicators a bit 'strangely'
<sil2100> didrocks: ok, will do :)
<didrocks> sil2100: what about indicators? :p
<sil2100> didrocks: since the thing was, the tests passed but build job failed (chroot problems with armhf on the PPA)
<Laney> morning
<sil2100> didrocks: so I rebuilt it and then ran the publish job manually as I was doing in the past
<didrocks> sil2100: hum, that should work
<didrocks> hey Laney
<sil2100> didrocks: but it suddenly published it normally and now the head job is still red ;p
<didrocks> sil2100: interesting
<didrocks> sil2100: I'll have a look when being on a stable connection
<sil2100> didrocks: so all is published ok just the head job is red, as I was running publish job manually - since I didn't want to force publication, just wanted to see the result
<sil2100> And I didn't want to have the check job ran
<sil2100> And I didn't want to play around with switches
<sil2100> ;)
<didrocks> sil2100: you're right ;)
<didrocks> sil2100: so don't touch anything
<didrocks> I'll have a look :)
<sil2100> didrocks: oh, and one thing I noticed
<sil2100> didrocks: I ran ./cu2d-run -P misc on the misc stack, and I see it's as if it's rebuilding everything from scratch
<sil2100> didrocks: since it's waiting on the build job again ;/
<seb128> hey didrocks Laney
<didrocks> sil2100: oh, it should skip it
<didrocks> sil2100: ok, don't touch misc/indicators, I'll have a look :)
<sil2100> ;)
<larsu> pitti: I'm hitting that upowerd hanging bug almost daily now :(  Do you know the status on that?
<pitti> larsu: I don't, no; do you have an idea how to get this? I haven't run into it here yet
<pitti> larsu: also, do you know if there's a bug report for this already?
<larsu> pitti: I only ever notice it when the machine comes back from suspend. I can't reproduce it though, it doesn't happen on every suspend.
<larsu> pitti: bug is #1203655
<larsu> pitti: I've attached a stacktrace there. Let me know if I can provide more info
<sil2100> Eh
<sil2100> A bad day for didrocks to not have internet
<sil2100> There's a problem with stack publication after yesterdays changes
<sil2100> Need to wait with publication for Didier, as the stacks unnecessarily re-run the AP testing ;/
<seb128> sil2100, well, publication of indicators and settings worked ... which one is the problem?
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<seb128> pitti, salut, ca va bien ?
<pitti> seb128: je vais bien, merci ! et toi ?
<sil2100> seb128: misc and SDK was working strange
<sil2100> seb128: I forced a publication, but this only re-ran the stack and they're in manual publication again
<sil2100> I could re-try, but I guess it's best if Didier could see what was going on
<larsu> sil2100: is this why I got emails for unapproved MRs for i-sound and i-power?
 * larsu was wondering what he should do with these
<sil2100> larsu: hm, I think those are unrelated - which MRs were those?
<Laney> Selecting previously unselected package libmaliit-plugins0.^M
<Laney> Unpacking libmaliit-plugins0 (from .../libmaliit-plugins0_0.99.0+git20130615+97e8335-0ubuntu1_amd64.deb) ...^M
<Laney> dpkg: error processing /var/cache/apt/archives/libmaliit-plugins0_0.99.0+git20130615+97e8335-0ubuntu1_amd64.deb (--unpack):^M trying to overwrite '/usr/lib/libmaliit-plugins.so.0', which is also in package maliit-framework 0.94.2-0ubuntu1b1^M
<seb128> pitti, je vais bien merci, il fait frais ;-)
 * Laney coughs
<pitti> seb128: oui, il a plu Ã  nouveau aprÃ¨s troix semaines \o/
<seb128> Laney, missing replaces?
<larsu> sil2100: this one for example: https://code.launchpad.net/~ps-jenkins/indicator-sound/latestsnapshot-12.10.2+13.10.20130725-0ubuntu1/+merge/176886
<Laney> more than likely
<larsu> sil2100: ah, it's on merged now. Nevermind then :)
 * larsu was confused because indicator-applet-developers is still on "Pending"
<Laney> why does it do an mp for that instead of just pushing it?
<seb128> larsu, that's how it has been for months? e.g https://code.launchpad.net/~ps-jenkins/indicator-session/latestsnapshot-12.10.5daily13.05.06.1-0ubuntu1/+merge/162660
<larsu> seb128: yeah, I'm very confused :)  I'm still on a just-got-the-keys-to-my-appartment high
<seb128> Laney, not sure, I guess it's safer to handle conflicts if somebody pushed to trunk in between
<seb128> larsu, oh, congrats! ;-)
<Laney> woo
<seb128> larsu, is that the nice one you were visiting on monday?
<larsu> seb128: yep :)
<seb128> nice!
<larsu> seb128: fairly close to dholbach, too. And to his office (where we're hanging out right now)
<seb128> larsu, no homeless jokes anymore for you then :p
<seb128> oh, nice
<larsu> seb128: \o/
<seb128> say hello to him from me ;-)
<Laney> I saw a post somehwere, there's quite a lot of people in that office today isn't there?
<larsu> seb128: he still doesn't quite believe you'll make it to Berlin :)
<larsu> seb128: but he's hopeful
<seb128> lol
<seb128> larsu, good to know you have a place as well, if I come and Daniel decide to kick me out, I've another place close by ;-)
<larsu> seb128: for sure!
 * seb128 hugs larsu
 * larsu hugs seb128 back
 * seb128 just got the new qtcreator
<seb128> nice to have easy access to the sdk api in the sidebar and to have click packages in there ;-)
<seb128> (a bit weird to have main UI space taken for pastebin and IRC though)
 * Laney arghs at cdbs
 * sil2100 needs didrocks
<sil2100> I *need* him
<Laney> how can I run a testsuite under xvfb-run in cdbs?
<sil2100> ;)
<Laney> sil2100: don't we all?
<seb128> sil2100, still cu2d issues?
<seb128> Laney, convert to dh9 :p
<Laney> seb128: they just converted it from dh to cdbs ... :P
<seb128> wth?
<Laney> told you, packaging rewrite
<Laney> trying to bring back one or two things that it did before
<seb128> that's ridiculous... I didn't know they changed the build system
<seb128> you should just overwrite their changes
<Laney> rewrote the copyright file and everything
<seb128> take back your packaging
<Laney> well there are some actual changes in there
<seb128> and bring back maybe their control for the new build-depends/binaries
<Laney> so it would require untangling those
<seb128> :-(
<Laney> I think I got something
<seb128> well, cdbs to dh9 should be easy
<Laney> DEB_MAKE_CHECK_TARGET := -f debian/rules run-tests
 * Laney coughs
<didrocks> (still on 3G for now)
<Laney> didrocks: moving to something new and super fast?
<didrocks> Laney: right! but for that, has to fight a little bit apparently with the infra ;)
<Laney> yeah that's usually the way
<didrocks> and no, 300Mb/s won't make me the official libroffice uploaders :p
<Laney> wow that /is/ quite fast
<didrocks> I don't think it will be a big change in day-to-day though
<Laney> I don't think my internal network at home could push such speeds :P
<didrocks> as we are more relying on the latency
<Laney> slow powerline is slow
<Laney> yeah
<didrocks> yeah, indeed
<Laney> you'll be a good iso tester
<didrocks> ahah ;)
<seb128> sil2100, ^ grab him while he's here!
<didrocks> seb128: I saw his email about the ./cu2d-run -P running tests
<didrocks> if that's the question
<didrocks> or should I worry more? ;)
<seb128> didrocks, I don't know he just wrote
<seb128>  sil2100 needs didrocks
<seb128> <sil2100> I *need* him
<seb128> Laney, I've an easy enough u-s-s review waiting if you feel like doing it ;-)
<Laney> Status: successful
<Laney> finally
<Laney> let me do a test upgrade and then upload that, then i can see about reviews
<didrocks> sil2100: I think you do run cupstream2distro with the latest rev, right?
<seb128> Laney, thanks
<didrocks> jibel: FYI, the ati machine was down this morning
<didrocks> thomi was around to restart it electrically
<didrocks> (also, we had some launchpad chroot issues, I relaunched some)
<didrocks> sil2100: it seems that misc stack was republished
<didrocks> redeployed*
<didrocks> without my changes in trunk
<jibel> didrocks, down, like yesterday or down like powered down?
<didrocks> so you don't have the parameter to force publicaiton
<didrocks> sil2100: I think that's why you see the tests running :p
<didrocks> sil2100: do you mind redeploying when adding them? :)
<didrocks> jibel: apparently, thomi told me the UI was stuck
<didrocks> jibel: I couldn't even ssh to it
<didrocks> sil2100: when redeploying a stack, always ensure if you do that from your own branch that you are in sync with trunk, please ;)
<sil2100> !
<didrocks> sil2100: I'll let you fix that? (I think media as well can be published)
<sil2100> didrocks: I didn't redeploy anything yesterday besides unity8
<didrocks> sil2100: also, did you ask someone to refresh the white list on the server?
<didrocks> hum
<didrocks> someone did redeploy miscâ¦
<didrocks> obviously
<didrocks> for the new components
<sil2100> didrocks: seb128 said that you said that I can publish misc
<sil2100> So I did
<didrocks> sil2100: yeah, but it seems the guy deploying it wasn't sync with trunk
<sil2100> geh
<didrocks> (to add the new components)
<didrocks> sil2100: mind doing that? then I think your -P should work as excepted
<jibel> didrocks, okay maybe I'll reinstall it completely too when I'll install the nvidia box
<didrocks> no build/tests step
<didrocks> just publishing
<didrocks> jibel: ok ;)
<sil2100> Let me backlog completely
<sil2100> didrocks: ok, so - I'll redeploy misc from trunk, ensuring that the two packages are added and republish
<sil2100> didrocks: SDK also suffered from the same proble IIRC
<sil2100> So maybe it wasn't redeployed after your changes?
<sil2100> geh, and now the check job failed...
<asac> pitti: you tested media player on mako/n4?
<pitti> asac: yes, but only from starting from unity; I think that's known-broken, one needs to launch it with a video as argument
<asac> pitti: hmm. can you check with ogra how to test it properly?
<pitti> asac: I read somewhere that it ought to be possible to launch it from the file lens, but I copied a video into ~/Videos and don't see it anywhere
<asac> pitti: he has no mako ... we know its really working for maguro and really broken for grouper
<asac> so from that pov our dashboard is indeed correct
<ogra_> i think we should wait for jhodapp to get up
<asac> now if i knewe that mako is really officially not working
<ogra_> the currently shipped media stack is deprecated
<ogra_> there is a new one that isnt in the archive yet
<asac> i dont care bout the future
<asac> i want to know if our mediaplayer is broken on todays image :)
<ogra_> and i dont know exactly wheer it lives ... i think there is a PPA somewhere
<asac> on mako....maguro i have on my own
<ogra_> asac, well, popey is usually my mako tester ... but he is at oscon this week
<ogra_> (we're really short on mako and manta ... dunno why)
<didrocks> sil2100: I did a script
<didrocks> sil2100: so everything should be redeployde
<sil2100> didrocks: oh, so just re-publishing now? ;)
<didrocks> sil2100: I mean, I ran a script the other day
<didrocks> so everything should be working
<asac> ogra_: order a mako please
<asac> and expense
<ogra_> will do
<asac> ogra_: if you dont do it today let me know so i can see what the official PO route would be
<asac> ogra_: you can still buy N4, right?
<ogra_> asac, it would also make sense if someone in an EU TZ could have a manta
<ogra_> (i dont owant one, though ... give it wo some other team :) )
<ogra_> yeah, you can
<pitti> well, the app doesn't even have an icon (emmpty frame) and does nothing when clicking on it, which seems to be a problem even before the media API?
<ogra_> pitti, so how did you start it ? by clicking on one of the three shipped movies ?
<pitti> ogra_: I read somewhere that one needs to copy a video to ~/Video and then find that on the dash
<ogra_> Sintel should always work i think
<pitti> ogra_: there are a gazillion dummy movies in the dash, which ones are working?
<ogra_> just go to the video lens
<ogra_> try the first movie there
<ogra_> the first three should work
<sil2100> didrocks: hmmm
<pitti> ogra_: oh, nice; wasn't aware of that
<pitti> ogra_: that does work, yes
<sil2100> didrocks: eh, I just tried to redeploy misc and got an error!
<ogra_> good
<pitti> ogra_: so it's not showing my own videos anywhere, but the MP works
<ogra_> likely an encoding problem
<ogra_> you might use a codec this medai api doesnt support
<ogra_> *media
<ogra_> lets swait for jhodapp ... he can tell us more
<ogra_> asac, so the daily tests are fine (they either use the shipped videos or something with similar codec)
<asac> ogra_: on dashboard we see maguro succeed, mako and others failing
<asac> i flile that as "its really the case" now
 * ogra_ checks the logs 
<ogra_> asac, both failing tests are UI related
<asac> ogra_: so do we measure that our apps are busted or not?
<seb128> ogra_, can I see the date of the image I'm using from somewhere on the device?
<ogra_> contol visibility and playback button states
<ogra_> seb128, /var/log/installer/media-info
<seb128> ogra_, thanks
<ogra_> like in all other ubuntu installs :)
<seb128> 20130722
<seb128> hum
<seb128> that's outdated :p
 * seb128 updates system-settings manually
<ogra_> ogra@chromebook:~$ get-touch-img-ver --current
<ogra_> 20130722
<ogra_> seb128, no, it isnt :)
<sil2100> didrocks: something's badly broken
<ogra_> that the last one that passed testing
<seb128> ogra_, let's say it doesn't have what I want to test :p
<sil2100> didrocks: I tried to force publish of media and it's running the AP tests ;/
<ogra_> seb128, use phablet-flash --pending
<sil2100> didrocks: maybe I should use jenkins UI for that?
<ogra_> ogra@chromebook:~$ get-touch-img-ver --pending
<ogra_> 20130724
<seb128> ogra_, no that's ok, I dist-upgraded, no need to reinstall, I'm just testing settings stuff
<seb128> ogra_, but thanks
<ogra_> http://paste.ubuntu.com/5910631/ ... in caase you want the get-touch-image-ver script
<seb128>  thanks
<didrocks> sil2100: ok, I'll have a look soon
 * didrocks on fiber \o/
<ogra_> didrocks, dont fall ... thats thin
<didrocks> ;)
<Sweetsha1k> bdrung: http://anonscm.debian.org/gitweb/?p=pkg-openoffice/libreoffice.git;a=shortlog;h=refs/heads/ubuntu-saucy-4.1
<mlankhorst> hm h ow do I start the onscreen keyboard manually?
<didrocks> Laney: can we have ~ubuntu-unity as part of ~system-settings-touch please?
<didrocks> Laney: that would help to deploy the changes ;)
<Laney> didrocks: ask seb128
<didrocks> seb128: ^
<Laney> how would it help?
<seb128> didrocks, hum, why is that needed? (things seem to work fine today)
<didrocks> seb128: we can't deploy the stack, like sil2100 isn't in the team
<didrocks> so when trying to "fix" the branch config, he's rejected
<sil2100> :<
<seb128> I guess I don't understand the issue or what is "deploy the stack", settings is properly configured and landing today no?
<seb128> didrocks, sorry, answer is yes, but I would like to understand what's going on as well
<seb128> ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: when you ./cu2d-update-stack -U ../stacks/head/misc.cfg
<didrocks> we bzr config every branches
<didrocks> so that lp-propose destination is "trunk"
<didrocks> otherwise, it can be that the config is incorrect
<didrocks> so, we use the deploy step command (cu2d-update-stack) to do that
<didrocks> but this config ask people to have write rights on the branch
<didrocks> so if sil2100 tries to deploy misc, he won't be able to do that writing
<seb128> settings should be in their own stack (settings), not in misc?
 * seb128 didn't even know you could bzr config branches like that
<didrocks> seb128: IIRC from the discussion from the other day we told misc
<didrocks> but that won't change the need to be able to configure it :)
<seb128> that was the schemas right?
<didrocks> yep
<seb128> ok,makes sense ... added
<didrocks> thanks!
<seb128> thanks for the context! ;-)
<didrocks> yw ;)
<didrocks> do you want that to be moved in another stack?
<didrocks> in the near future?
<seb128> no
<didrocks> ok
<seb128> the schemas still makes sense in misc
<seb128> I was confused, I though you were speaking about the settings app
<seb128> which is in settings ;-)
<didrocks> sil2100: I'm redeploying, but you should be able as well
<didrocks> ah ;)
<didrocks> yeah, the gsettings-ubuntu-touch-schemas
<seb128> right, I got it now ;-)
<Laney> are we uploading the schemas now?
<didrocks> Laney: as soon as the deploy is finished
<didrocks> and that sil2100 runs publish then
 * didrocks pulls on the archive admin machine the whitelist
<Laney> seb128: Do you think we should confirm these keys are wanted in the system schema before upuloading?
<seb128> Laney, no, we can still change the schemas later if needed
<Laney> it's some kind of API
<seb128> Laney, no need to block on it imho
<seb128> well, unused api
<seb128> but yeah, better to confirm sooner than later
<didrocks> hum, weird, it's like it can't set the configâ¦
 * didrocks tries manually
<seb128> Laney, btw testing the tz stuff on the touch image, for some reason the action doesn't work
<Laney> which action?
<seb128> Laney, I installed policykit-desktop-privileges (which is not on the touch image) but it still doesn't work, (which is not a surprise , /var/lib/polkit-1/localauthority/10-vendor.d/com.ubuntu.desktop.pkla doesn't list org.freedesktop.timedate1)
<seb128> Laney, clicking on a tz
<Laney> why does it work on the desktop?
<seb128> it doesn't?
<didrocks> sil2100: around? mind trying to publish misc now?
<Laney> does for me
<seb128> I though it did
<seb128> Laney, right, that's my point, work on the desktop and not on the touch image ... I wonder if the polkit acl are configured differently
<seb128> Laney, policykit-desktop-privileges is missing on the touch image, which I though would be the issue, but it still doesn't work
<Laney> are denials logged somewhere?
<seb128> pitti, ^ does polkit log credential issues somewhere?
<Laney> hoho
<seb128> Laney, other issue (going to be fun), the panel takes a good 3-4s to load after you click on it, I guess it's the time it takes to load the list of cities
<seb128> Laney, it's polish for later but it's long enough that we should probably display a spinner or something while it's loading
<didrocks> hum no sil2100
<didrocks> I think I'll publish misc
<Laney> I should probably delay initialising it until the first request at least
<sil2100> eh, had a phone call
<sil2100> Publishing
<sil2100> didrocks: you published already?
<didrocks> sil2100: yeah, just did
<didrocks> sil2100: it works :)
<sil2100> \o/
<didrocks> sil2100: so, now, let's try to redeploy with my fix media
<sil2100> didrocks: will you redeploy?
<didrocks> sil2100: it shouldn't run the check, right?
<sil2100> (which branch?)
<didrocks> sil2100: media is fine to publish?
<sil2100> It shouldn't, I just want it to publish ;P
<didrocks> ok
<sil2100> It was fine before
<sil2100> But check failed now
<sil2100> ;/
<didrocks> sil2100: please, try to publish it now (I repdeployed)
<pitti> seb128: you can try running it in the foreground, but polkitd isn't very verbose unfortunately
<sil2100> didrocks: ok, publishing anyway, as it's a single failure on one machine and the last run was fine
<didrocks> sil2100: ok, let's see, the check job shouldn't trigger the tests (well, one kick test with nothing done)
<sil2100> didrocks: publish made, let's see
<sil2100> didrocks: works \o/
<sil2100> didrocks: publish job blinking
<sil2100> didrocks: publishing apps as well
<Laney> seb128: calling the method manually shows that it is denied
<didrocks> sil2100: no no
<sil2100> didrocks: does it need a redeploy as well?
<didrocks> sil2100: to skip tests, I made a fix :)
<sil2100> ;)
<didrocks> sil2100: right, only misc was in the bad case because someone redeployed :p
<didrocks> (without syncing in trunk)
<didrocks> for the tests not running, it was actually a bug
<didrocks> (well, running, when they shouldn't)
<didrocks> sil2100: I'm redeploying everything, will tell you once apps ok
<seb128> Laney, how/where do you call it?
<seb128> Laney, I think those action are allowed for the default local user, that might not be the case over ssh or adb
<didrocks> sil2100: apps done, do you have others that I should prioritize?
<Laney> seb128: I made a shell script to call it and ran that from the terminal on the device to check that
<seb128> Laney, ok ... does it say why it's refused ... and did you install policykit-desktop-privileges ?
<Laney> no and yes
<mlankhorst> oh looks like onboard crashes in saucy..
<seb128> I don't get how it's working on the desktop
<Laney> also it works over ssh to the desktop
<seb128> /var/lib/polkit-1/localauthority/10-vendor.d/com.ubuntu.desktop.pkla doesn't list timedate1
<sil2100> didrocks: what about unity8? ;) Would that also be affected?
<seb128> Laney, I wonder if polkit works at all on the touch image
<seb128> pitti, ^ do you know
<didrocks> sil2100: right
<didrocks> Saviq: should we unblock unity8 now that you have some integration tests?
<seb128> Laney, but I think cjwatson is using it for click installs, so it should be working
<Saviq> didrocks, see #ubuntu-unity
<Saviq> didrocks, yes
<didrocks> Saviq: was on 3G, so dropped quite often ;)
<didrocks> Saviq: ok, next, right?
<Saviq> didrocks, yes
<didrocks> sil2100: unity8 redeployed, I'm removing the lock
<Laney> seb128: it's in /usr/share/polkit-1/actions/
<Laney> let me try allow_active yes
<seb128>                         <allow_any>auth_admin_keep</allow_any>
<seb128>                         <allow_inactive>auth_admin_keep</allow_inactive>
<seb128>                         <allow_active>auth_admin_keep</allow_active>
<seb128> I don't know how to read those
<seb128> hum
<seb128> does it mean auth is required (e.g asking a password)
<seb128> ?
<Laney> yes, but i don't know how the authorisation is provided on the desktop
<Laney> obviously doesn't ask for a password there
<seb128> right
<seb128> well /var/lib/polkit-1/localauthority/10-vendor.d/com.ubuntu.desktop.pkla has
<seb128> Action=org.gnome.clockapplet.mechanism.*;org.gnome.controlcenter.datetime.configure;org.kde.kcontrol.kcmclock.save
<seb128> I wonder if the indicator still use one of the old interfaces listed there
<Laney> u-s-s doesn't
<seb128> or is timedate should be added
<seb128> oh, right
<seb128> puzzling
<seb128> the phablet user is in the admin group
<pitti> seb128: in principle yes, but I get a "not authorized' e. g. on pkcheck --action-id org.freedesktop.upower.suspend --process $$ in ssh (as that's not a local session)
<sil2100> didrocks: \o/ Will publish further in a moment
<mlankhorst> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/onboard/+bug/1196324
<ubot2`> Ubuntu bug 1196324 in onboard (Ubuntu) "onboard crashed with SIGSEGV in PyUnicode_InternInPlace()" [Medium,Confirmed]
<mlankhorst> boo
<didrocks> sil2100: all head redeployed FYI
<didrocks> sil2100: lock on unity8 removed
<didrocks> Saviq: ^
<Saviq> didrocks, yay!
<Saviq> didrocks, can we please trigger the stack?
<didrocks> Saviq: oh, something needed from this morning since the last daily release?
<Laney> pitti: hmm, it didn't work to set allow_active=yes but allow_any did
<Saviq> didrocks, well, we never pushed to next?
<Saviq> didrocks, or did we now?
<Laney> even from terminal on the device
<pitti> Laney: loginctl show-session <session-name> shows it as active/local?
<didrocks> Saviq: we'll get that night dailies now that we have the green flag :)
<didrocks> Saviq: as everything built still in daily-build-next
<Laney> pitti: State: active
<Saviq> didrocks, yeah, but we want to push through smoke asap
<Saviq> didrocks, so we need it in next
<didrocks> Saviq: yeah, that's why I asked sil2100 to publish it ;)
<Saviq> didrocks, ah ;)
<Saviq> didrocks, didn't see that
<didrocks> Saviq: so, you will get it in a ppa publisher round I guess
<Saviq> didrocks, and it will merge back the changelog bump?
<didrocks> Saviq: right
<Saviq> didrocks, thanks
<didrocks> yw ;)
<didrocks> Saviq: and raring release redeployed as well
<didrocks> argh
<didrocks> sil2100: ^
<Saviq> didrocks, raring? ;)
<didrocks> Saviq: yeah, daily releases are used in both raring and saucy
<didrocks> (for SRUs)
<Saviq> didrocks, k
<sil2100> didrocks, Saviq: just one more moment guys, barraged by phones ;/
<didrocks> sil2100: i'm publishing unity8, don't worry
<didrocks> done
<Laney> bah I don't understand
<Laney> as far as I can see polkit should consider the phablet user an admin
<seb128> right
<seb128> it's in the admin group
<seb128> Laney, it doesn't?
<Laney> /etc/polkit-1/51-ubuntu-admin.conf
<Laney> err add a localauthority.conf.d in there
<Laney> don't know, that's my assumption from this failure
<mlankhorst> tkamppeter_: ping
<jbicha> how exactly do I run the autopkgtests?
<seb128> jbicha, http://developer.ubuntu.com/packaging/html/auto-pkg-test.html
<seb128> run-adt-test
<jbicha> Sweetsha1k: ooh, AOO and LO do their releases in the same week now?
<jbicha> cadence ftw :)
<Sweetsha1k> jbicha: <quote="Linus Torvalds">... completely unintended sideeffect ...</quote>
<Sweetsha1k> jbicha: no, really: That we release this week has been set for a long time -- why AOO considered it a wise choice to go head-to-head with us is a mistery to me ...
<jbicha> well it encourages journalists to do a AOO vs. LO comparison, not sure if that helps them much though
<sil2100> didrocks: related to url-dispatcher!
<sil2100> didrocks: since you said you want url-dispatcher in multiarch directory
<didrocks> sil2100: no, I meant, it was in a multiarch directory
<didrocks> without multiarch tags
<sil2100> Ah
<sil2100> Then it's done
<sil2100> https://code.launchpad.net/~sil2100/url-dispatcher/packaging_additions/+merge/176927
<sil2100> I thought you wanted something moar
<sil2100> ;p
<didrocks> +Multi-Arch: same
<didrocks> miss the pre-depends
<didrocks> sil2100: apart from that, the rest looks good :)
<sil2100> Ah ;)
<sil2100> didrocks: pushed
<didrocks> sil2100: approved
<Sweetshark> Heh, LibreOffice 4.1.0 downloads from the ppa: 1 for saucy, 170 for raring, 360 for precise ;)
<Sweetshark> I should switch with ricotz and only work on precise from now on ;)
<sil2100> didrocks: in some free time, could you also take a look here? https://code.launchpad.net/~sil2100/otto/fix_1203809/+merge/176692
<didrocks> sil2100: can you have a look with jibel? i'm under too many requests
<sil2100> didrocks: ok, already poked him, but he seems to be a fan of bash -e which I hate!
<didrocks> he's right
<didrocks> it's useful
<sil2100> But what's the point if you expect some command to return false to do error handling?
<sil2100> It's useful if the script is wrongly written
<didrocks> hum? you always have a good way to get that in
<didrocks> assign defaults
<didrocks> and so on
<didrocks> please check with him, I really have no time for it now and I think this merge isn't the way to fix it :/
<sil2100> geh, could someone give me rationale why?
<sil2100> I'll poke jibel about that
<sil2100> Since I see no sense in it frankly
<sil2100> jibel: ping
<sil2100> jibel: what do you use the bash -e flag for?
<sil2100> jibel: since I think that having that would mean that if any of the commands fail during execution, we have no means to trigger a reaction
<jibel> sil2100, pong
<sil2100> jibel: one way could be moving the set +e before the otto-run command
<jibel> sil2100, yes, -e exit on error, without -e it would continue on unhandled errors leading to unexpected results
<sil2100> jibel: yes, but only this one script has -e
<jibel> sil2100, it would be like ignoring all the exceptions in python
<sil2100> jibel: but what about handling those errors? Simply bailing out sometimes is not enough, as in this case
<jibel> it should be a default of bash :)
<sil2100> jibel: then what if you want to handle the case of a command failing yourself?
<sil2100> jibel: since you want to perform cleanup, for instance?
<jibel> sil2100, in that case add a trap on exit. As I said I'll have a look at this script, the only problem this -e causes for the moment is that the message telling where to download the archive from is not displayed
<sil2100> jibel: as I said, we can move the "set +e" command one line up, before the /bin/otto-run setup, as in this case we know that there are no operations besides that
<sil2100> Since anyway /bin/otto-run is the almost-last thing that gets executed
<sil2100> And show_dl_addr $CONTAINER
<sil2100> Anyway has -e disabled
<sil2100> I'll modify the merge request with this other change
<jibel> sil2100, I'd rather use a form like :  sudo -E $HOME/bin/otto-run $CONTAINER $TS_EXPORT || echo "E: otto-run exited with status $?"
<jibel> instead of disabling error checking
<sil2100> jibel: will that work?
<sil2100> hm
<sil2100> It seems to work indeed
<jibel> :)
<sil2100> jibel: looks more friendly indeed now, didn't know that feeding the status further quiets it down, I think I had a bad understanding of it
<jibel> sil2100, the logic here is to check the value of the logical expression, and echo always exit with 0. When otto fails it is equivalent to 1||0
<sil2100> jibel: sweet!
<sil2100> ;)
<jibel> sil2100, in this case we don't really care about the exit status of otto-run because we use the junit files to interpret the result not the exit status of the runner
<sil2100> Right, well, works for me as well - if you find it ok, I'll fix up my merge with thanks and let's get it in then ;)
<sil2100> jibel: pushed, with the commit message modified to the new approach - thanks!
<seb128> Laney, larsu: just as a fyi (and if you want to have a quick look for stupid errors I might have made): https://code.launchpad.net/~seb128/phone-app/ringtone-in-gsettings/+merge/176968
<larsu> seb128: will have a look later. Thanks
<Laney> seb128: you didn't describe the message sound
<Laney> </useful-contributions>
<seb128> Laney, oh, good catch ;-)
<Laney> does this imply that u-s-s will have to depend on phone-app?
<seb128> Laney, the phone settings panel is, yes...
<seb128> larsu, can we have gsettings-qt qml bindings not abort on missing schemas?
<Laney> hmm
<seb128> larsu, or an api to check if a schemas is installed?
<seb128> Laney, you think that phone-app specific settings should rather be in the shared schemas set?
<Laney> I don't know
<Laney> I see the depends becoming large
<seb128> well, it's supposed to be part of the full image
<seb128> not a standalone app
<Laney> Not sure if there's a reason, other than maybe to allow other implementations of phone apps?
<larsu> seb128: sure, but that will take a bit. Can you open a bug and assign it to me?
<seb128> that sucks a bit for desktop testing
<larsu> seb128: please :)
<seb128> larsu, sure, thanks
<seb128> Laney, my main goal there is to ensure the phone-app is robust, having the schemas with the app seemed a bit more resistant to potential issues
<seb128> Laney, I'm still not convinced I like to use something that's going to call abort() for you if there is a problem with the ringtone config, I would rather the code to just fallback to the default sound if that ever happens
<Laney> seb128: well if there's a problem then it'd be good to log it and show the user somehow too
<Laney> while not breaking stuff if we don't have to
<Laney> it probably points to something pretty badly wrong
<czajkowski> *stabs* upower! now it's not even telling me if it's charging when plugged in :(
<seb128> Laney, well, anyway it's up for review, I'm fine moving the schemas around
<seb128> czajkowski, kill it, and restart indicator-power-service?
<czajkowski> seb128: see that would have been the smarter move, I just restarted the machine instead.
<seb128> Laney, btw https://bugs.launchpad.net/phone-app/+bug/1202253/comments/1
<ubot2`> Ubuntu bug 1202253 in phone-app "the ringtone sound should be a setting and not hardcoded" [Undecided,In progress]
<seb128> Laney, I asked about the namespace/key location there ... I'm happy to change it if they think it would be better
<Laney> seb128: yep
<Laney> I don't have a good feeling about this really yet
<seb128> Laney, I don't think we are going to end up with more than system settings and phone-app using that key, at least for 13.10
<seb128> so we can move it later if needed
<seb128> the transition is easy to handle
<Laney> ok
<seb128> qengho, hey
<seb128> qengho, did you see that chromium-browser/saucy is build unhappy?
<seb128> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/145781144/buildlog_ubuntu-saucy-i386.chromium-browser_28.0.1500.71-0ubuntu1.13.10.1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<seb128> /usr/bin/ld.bfd.real: out/Release/obj.target/net/libnet.so: undefined reference to symbol 'SSL_ForceHandshake'
<seb128> weird that it worked on amd64 though
<larsu> seb128: reviewed. Good work, just a few minor issues
<larsu> seb128: let me know when you want a re-review
<seb128> larsu, thanks ... do you have a pkgconfig file for gsettings-qt?
<Laney> I think you do want an absolute path there
<Laney> it might be any random sound on the system
<larsu> seb128: yes :)
<seb128> $ dpkg -L libgsettings-qt-dev | grep config
<seb128> $
<seb128> larsu, since when?
<larsu> Laney: yeah that's what I thought... just wanted to make sure
<larsu> seb128: it's in my locally built package... let me check
<seb128> larsu, right, they had a define which hardcoded the sound dir, I dropped for a absolute path on purpose there
<Laney> it is there
<Laney> gsettings-qt.pc
<larsu> right, I have it as well
<larsu> seb128: grep pkgconfig ;)
<rickspencer3> seb128, Laney fyi ... larsu is sitting right next to me, if you need me to give him a dope slap, or a pat on the back, just let me know
<qengho> seb128: Yes, saw it yesterday. Working on it.
<seb128> $ LC_ALL=C dpkg -S gsettings-qt.pc
<seb128> dpkg-query: no path found matching pattern *gsettings-qt.pc*
<larsu> rickspencer3: pat on the back!
<seb128> qengho, great
<seb128> rickspencer3, yeah, definitively pat on the back, buy the man an icecream if you have the chance, he really deserves one ;-)
<didrocks> rickspencer3: I'll go for the dope slape if you tempt us :p
<Laney> rickspencer3: Yeah, buy him an ice cream instead :P
<rickspencer3> icecream would be called for
<Laney> rickspencer3: seb128 is the one using wrong versions of the package and blaming larsu ;-)
<rickspencer3> it's hot here
<larsu> didrocks: dude!
<rickspencer3> lol
<qengho> seb128: Though, it build elsewhere with no trouble, and now it's a linking error. I don't know what changed.
 * didrocks hugs larsu
<larsu> didrocks: :)
<didrocks> larsu: see how rickspencer3 is mean? ;)
<didrocks> it's not us |o|
<seb128> qengho, toolchain I guess :/
<rickspencer3> didrocks is remembering his first sprint in Paris, I guess?
<Laney> rickspencer3: bist du ein Berliner?
<rickspencer3> to make UNR?
<rickspencer3> Laney, yes, I am a donut
<didrocks> rickspencer3: still have scars ;)
<Laney> yum yum
<seb128> Laney, larsu: ok, I don't understand what's going on
<Laney> apt-cache policy libgsettings-qt-dev?
<seb128> Laney,
<seb128>  *** 0.0+13.10.20130717-0ubuntu1 0
<seb128>         100 /var/lib/dpkg/status
<Laney> get 25
<seb128> but I updated/upgraded this morning
<Laney> I bet it was in proposed
<seb128> Laney, well I don't get why it's not showing up for me
<Laney> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gsettings-qt/+publishinghistory
<seb128> oh ok
<Laney> but if you upgraded this morning you should have had 20 at least ...
<seb128> Laney, larsu: ok, I got the update... it has only been published today
<Laney> oh well
<seb128> yeah, not sure what was going on there
<larsu> seb128: wait, you've got the update but still no .pc file?
<Laney> I think it's fixed now
<larsu> ah okay. /me is not thinking very fast with this heat
<seb128> larsu, no, it's all good, I just don't understand why I didn't get that update or the previous one before now ... oh well, at least I got it
<Laney> cash in the ice cream promise
<larsu> seb128: glad it works now
<seb128> now to figure out how to use pkgconfig in cmake
<seb128> the lib stuff was working :p
<Laney> FindPkgConfig I think
<larsu> Laney: cmake is so awesome *sigh*
<seb128> I kind of like qmake
<seb128> at least for simple stuff
<seb128> SOURCES += source.cpp
<seb128> qmake; make
<seb128> just work (with a qt program)
<seb128> well, that line in a .pro
 * Laney gets a PKG_CHECK_MODULES 4eva tattoo across his face
<larsu> seb128: ya, that's what gsettings-qt is using :)
<Laney> actually it was quite easy to make qmake use pkgconfig too
<larsu> ya, even creating .pc files is easy
<larsu> (even though barely documented)
<Laney> but then again I liked wielding autotools for the schemas package too
 * Laney is weird
<czajkowski> Laney: yes we know :) but we keep you around all the same
<Laney> like a blind old dog
 * Laney stumbles around knocking things over
<czajkowski> Laney: it's that hair in your eyes again isn't it :)
<Laney> the fan is currently causing me trouble in that department, it's true
<rsalveti> Laney: seb128: iirc the cdbs transition was a leftover to get it built for both qt4 and qt5, but later on just qt5 was supported
<rsalveti> and updated copyright was actually adding more missing info there
<rsalveti> not breaking anything
<seb128> rsalveti, yeah, having an update changing from dh to cdbs seems un-necessary and backward ... it would be nice if you guys just pinged us next time, we can help rebasing/updating in such cases
<rsalveti> I don't see as a backward thing there, but I agree it should have kept dh instead
<rsalveti> Laney: test was disabled because it was broken in some revs, thanks for adding that back
<rsalveti> seb128: that package was a special case, which was forked which tons of changes, and upstream changed completely as well
<seb128> rsalveti, anyway just a small glitch, nothing worth arguing over for days
<seb128> rsalveti, thanks for the hard work ;-)
<rsalveti> seb128: we're getting there, getting rid of the ppa is our first priority, we'll be cleaning and improving things over time
<rsalveti> and this wasn't a critical package at all
<rsalveti> at least not at this moment, for saucy
<seb128> time for some exercice, bbl
<jbicha> mpt: https://launchpadlibrarian.net/145855565/Sound%20Menu.png from bug 1202933 :)
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1202933 in The Sound Menu "Rhythmbox widget always shows after rev. 353" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1202933
<Saviq> jdstrand, https://code.launchpad.net/~saviq/qtubuntu/respect-path/+merge/176904
<Saviq> jdstrand, https://code.launchpad.net/~saviq/qtubuntu/more-robust-desktop-parsing/+merge/176931
<jdstrand> Saviq: thanks! :)
<desrt> seb128: hey seb.  late night?
<seb128> desrt, yeah, warm summer time, I tend to fall asleep late, wake up late, work up late
<seb128> desrt, spanish way :p
<desrt> not a bad system
<desrt> although the spanish have a pretty good excuse for it
<desrt> being in the wrong timezone by 2-3 hours and all....
<seb128> getting too hot during the day? same here this week
<seb128> that as well...
 * seb128 wants 25Â°C, not 35
<desrt> http://weather.gc.ca/city/pages/on-128_metric_e.html
<desrt> it's been 22-25 for the past week or two, and forecasted again for the next week
<seb128> nice!
<desrt> gloriously so.
<desrt> larsu picked the wrong time to leave ;)
<desrt> (or maybe it got better because he left... hmmm...)
<seb128> desrt, http://www.weather.com/weather/tenday/Brno+Czech+Republic+EZXX0002
<seb128> desrt, welcome to europe
<seb128> desrt, when do you fly?
<desrt> what is this 81 degrees
 * desrt looks for a enable-sanity button
<seb128> it's in CÂ° here
<desrt> weird...
<desrt> perhaps you have a cookie that i don't
<seb128> they consider .ca as being F weirdos :p
<desrt> ah.  found it.
<seb128> or that
<desrt> okay.  that's just stupid.
<desrt> 38?
<seb128> yeah, welcome to our current weather
<desrt> looks like the rain predicted for monday will cool things off 10 degrees or so, at least
<seb128> when do you arrive?
<desrt> i think i leave here on the 30.  so, 31?
<seb128> you should be good then ;-)
 * desrt spent all day shaving yaks...
<seb128> this week sucks, then hopefully we are back to normal summer
<desrt> felt good though: http://modfarmer.wpengine.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/Shrek2.jpg
<seb128> lol
<seb128> desrt, because you need warm coats when it's 38Â°C? ;-)
<desrt> nah.... because the file monitor code in GIO is in shambles
<desrt> still is, in fact
<desrt> but slightly less so now
<seb128> desrt, you like file stuff, you should write a qml binding to get the size of a directory... ;-)
<desrt> i got onto that particular yak shave as part of my goal to make desktop files efficient.... we currently do a lot of stat() to try and guess if we had any changes...
<desrt> mostly because using file monitors from inside of glib itself was almost impossible.  that part is much better after today.
 * seb128 is pondering doing system("du DIR")
<desrt> not a bad approach, honestly
<desrt> did you look at the baobab code?
<seb128> I'm half joking
<seb128> not yet, I've been busy on other things
<desrt> i actually wrote the algorithm several times
<seb128> but I think I'm going to do the "du" thing just to get something with real datas
<seb128> with a FIXME in the code for later
<desrt> once blocking, once threaded, once async
<desrt> pbor picked the one he thought was best.  i forget which it was :)
<seb128> I don't care about dynamic update
<seb128> I just want to put a spinner there
<seb128> and replace by the value when it's done
<desrt> ah.  he went with threaded.
<seb128> so I don't need progress report
<desrt> boring :p
<seb128> boring is good ;-)
<desrt> but ya... that's what you should do then: spin up a thread and have it basically do 'du'
<desrt> that's not difficult
<seb128> right
<seb128> that's what I'm going to do, as a first approch
<desrt> you could probably beat du at its game if you used multiple threads
<desrt> do some latency hiding....
<seb128> it's by far the easiest way to get something
<desrt> colin had gotten some hilariously good results out of that kind of thing using gio asyncs
<desrt> he also caused the kernel to grind to a halt on processing requests from anything that wasn't his program.... but oh well
<desrt> pretty impressive, in any case
<seb128> I'm amazed though that this problem is not one that has been solved for ages
<seb128> I was sort of expecting that the issue was old enough that most toolkit would have a reference implementation to use by now
<seb128> it's also something fairly frequent needed...
<seb128> (would it be only by file managers)
<desrt> maybe you should ask for gio to grow such a feature
<desrt> it might make sense
<desrt> if you didn't need progress reports, it would be a pretty simple API
<desrt> maybe even could be part of GFileInfo
 * seb128 checks if there is already a wishlist about that
<seb128> none that I can found, I guess I can open one
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-07-26
<popey> hmm. i have the "battery gauge doesn't update in the panel" issue again on saucy
<popey> i suspect this is suspend/resume related
<popey> i suspeneded when i was on power, and the indicator showed it was charging. I woke the laptop up just now, off power, and it still shows charging
<pitti> Good morning
<RAOF> pitti: Uh, what! Are you up super-duper early?
<pitti> RAOF: yeah, couldn't sleep any more after my wife got up
<ricotz> chrisccoulson, hi :), i hope you like to update firefox to 23b9 while saucy still is on b4, or maybe you have it in a ppa somewhere already
<tkamppeter> mlankhorst, hi
<sil2100> didrocks: hi! I guess I can safely publish the misc stack, as the changes recommended were approved by you, right? ;)
<sil2100> didrocks: and in the case of, for instance, indicators where the build job failed because armhf failed to build of a chroot problem - should I re-run just the 'publish' job once its built or can I do it differently not to trigger the tests again?
<didrocks> sil2100: sure sure, no need to double ack if it's the changes I approved :)
<didrocks> sil2100: better rebuilding in the ppa
<didrocks> sil2100: and rerun the whole stack with "foo"
<sil2100> didrocks: ok, too bad it will trigger the check job again, but well ;)
<didrocks> sil2100: right, but at least, we know if there is a manual publicaiton in progress
<jibel> good morning
<didrocks> salut jibel
<didrocks> jibel: FYI, the jenkins node was down on ati, I restarted it
<jibel> didrocks, salut didrocks
<didrocks> sil2100: jibel: I won't have the time at all to debug anything today, there is a delivery for IoM and I need to concentrate on that
<jibel> didrocks, ah, that's probably becaue the machine has been restarted yesterday evening while debugging mir failures
<sil2100> didrocks: ACK!
<jibel> didrocks, I'll investigate why it doesn't start automatically
<jibel> as it should
<didrocks> jibel: thanks!
<sil2100> jibel: yep, I guess well be doing some more of that today as well - can I poke you around for advice ;)
<sil2100> ?
<jibel> sil2100, just poke and if I can advise I'll do :)
<chrisccoulson> good morning
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<seb128> hey didrocks chrisccoulson jibel sil2100, how is everyone?
<didrocks> hey seb128!
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, good thanks. how are you?
<jibel> Salut seb128 , I'm fine thanks, you?
<seb128> I'm good thanks
<sil2100> seb128: morning!
<larsu> seb128: happy Friday!
<seb128> larsu, hey, happy friday to you too!
 * larsu had one of those put-laptop-into-bagpack-even-though-it-was-not-suspended situations yesterday
<larsu> now I'm paranoid about it again ... it used to work so reliably :(
<lan3y> morning
<lan3y> arg
<seb128> Laney, hey
<seb128> Laney, you fall off the internet again during the night?
<Laney> just this network apparently
<seb128> k
<seb128> Laney, happy friday in any case ;-)
<Laney> yeah! that came around fast
<Laney> happy friday
<rickspencer3> hi pitti
<pitti> hey rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> pitti, I'm watching your mails about autopackging testing
<rickspencer3> do I understand correctly, that these are tests that in run in proposed?
<rickspencer3> and then packages don't get copied into the release pocket if they don't pass?
<pitti> rickspencer3: correct; we use them as a gatekeeper for what is allowed to propagate to suacy
<rickspencer3> wow, we have a lot of CI
<rickspencer3> :)
<pitti> rickspencer3: in general, yes; not just the packages themselves, also any of its rdepends
<pitti> rickspencer3: i. e. if we upload a new gtk and that breaks ubiquity's tests, gtk won't propagate
<rickspencer3> pitti, right
<seb128> (which is the case atm, it's blocked by a notify-osd test issue)
<rickspencer3> so we have gates in place at the developer level, at the team level (for Canonical developed upstreams)
<rickspencer3> then we have proposed, then we have the smoke tests
<rickspencer3> then we have phased updates
<jibel> seb128, which started failing with latest gtk+3.0 upload
<seb128> jibel, it doesn't seem so
<jibel> seb128, not latest but 3.8.2-3ubuntu1
<pitti> notify-osd is rather broken indeed; I tried some things yesterday (adding at-spi2-core dep, running under d-bus), but nothing helps; that needs someone who actually understands notify-osd
<seb128> notify-osd didn't change in years
<seb128> did those test ever work reliably?
<jibel> they did until July 8th
<seb128> jibel, https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/view/Saucy/view/AutoPkgTest/job/saucy-adt-notify-osd/ suggest it broke around jul 16
<seb128> but there was no gtk update around that date
<rickspencer3> thanks pitti
<rickspencer3> pitti, so I guess we can't run auto-pilot tests as part of autopackage?
<seb128> jibel, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gtk+3.0/+changelog
<pitti> seb128: it's complaining about not being able to connect to at-spi, so it might be somewhere else in the stack
<seb128> jibel, uploads were on the 8 and on the 23 ... tests started failing in between
<pitti> rickspencer3: we can
<pitti> rickspencer3: I even run ap tests as part of the package build now, in autopilot-gtk
<pitti> rickspencer3: apparently I was the first one to try that, but it's working quite well
<Laney> yeah #35 passed with -3ubuntuX
<rickspencer3> pitti, any reason we shouldn't run all the tests that we use for smoke tests in -proposed?
<pitti> rickspencer3: won't work for unity and other stuff that needs 3D
<pitti> rickspencer3: this can only be xvfb
<rickspencer3> ah
<pitti> rickspencer3: for 2D stuff it should work just fine
<rickspencer3> that seems like, long term, we could crack that problem
<rickspencer3> and then if we were running the tests there, our smoke tests would almost always be green
<rickspencer3> because we would be catching many more failures before even making the image
<pitti> rickspencer3: well, ideally these wouldn't even land in -proposed nowadays as we run them on the upstream side already?
<rickspencer3> pitti, right
<rickspencer3> so at each step, there is more integration
<rickspencer3> so some chance of a breakage
<rickspencer3> but at each step, 99% of the problems should be filtered out
<jibel> seb128, right, and run on the 16th has been triggered by an upload of dbus
<rickspencer3> so, from the developer to the teams trunk to -proposed to the image
<seb128> pitti, jibel, Laney: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/at-spi2-core/+changelog changed on the 16 ... maybe trying downgrading at-spi would be useful
 * seb128 is going to let that to the Ubuntu GNOME guys to debug though, no time to spend trying to debug gtk atm, too much ubuntu touch work to do
<pitti> seb128: yeah, that one sounds plausible
<seb128> pitti, there were changes around upstart session as well: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/143250524/at-spi2-core_2.9.3-1_2.9.3-1ubuntu1.diff.gz
<pitti> if notify-osd's test was fixed to use VERBOSE=yes, you could see the error (which is failing to start up at-spi)
<seb128> though that doesn't disable dbus activation or anything, so that should break
<seb128> *shouldn't*
<pitti> seb128: the autopkgtest doesn't even start a d-bus
<pitti> seb128: I tried that too, but when I run it under a session bus it hangs forever
<pitti> at that point I gave up
<seb128> hum
<seb128> jibel, http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/proposed-migration/update_excuses.html has the notify-osd test as RUNNING is that normal?
<seb128> pitti, https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/view/Saucy/view/AutoPkgTest/job/saucy-adt-notify-osd/ARCH=i386,label=adt/ ... the most recent run worked out on i386
<jibel> seb128, no it is not. looking
<pitti> yes, indeed
<pitti> seb128: I'll retry amd64 as well, just for fun
<seb128> pitti, thanks
<seb128> can I retry those myself in some way?
<pitti> seb128: if you have VPN access to the lab?
<seb128> pitti, yes
<pitti> seb128: the "private jenkins" URL in the autopkgtest fail mails point to it
<seb128> but I only used it for cu2d stuff so far
<pitti> http://10.98.0.1:8080/view/Saucy/view/AutoPkgTest/job/saucy-adt-notify-osd/
<pitti> #40 -> matrix reloaded -> do it
<seb128> pitti, ok, that shows amd64 as running atm
<pitti> seb128: yes, I kicked it
<seb128> pitti, ok, so the "rebuild matrix" button on there?
<pitti> seb128: oui
<seb128> (/me just looked on another job that is not building)
<seb128> pitti, merci!
<pitti> seb128: or "build now", but matrix is if you only want to build one arch
<pitti> seb128: you can watch it in realtime on http://10.98.0.1:8080/view/Saucy/view/AutoPkgTest/job/saucy-adt-notify-osd/ARCH=amd64,label=adt/40/console FYI
<seb128> pitti, yeah, I've it on screen
<seb128> that's using otto right?
<pitti> seb128: no
<pitti> seb128: lp:auto-package-testing
<seb128> oh ok, I though the real time log was added by didrocks/jibel with the switch to otto
<pitti> seb128: i. e. prepare-testbed and run-adt-rest, just what everybody else should be using
<pitti> seb128: but a  mere apt-get source notify-osd, build, make check reproduces it, too
<jibel> seb128, we switched daily-release testing from utah to otto, this is different from package testing in proposed which uses autopkgtest
<seb128> jibel, right, I got slightly confused by the jenkins side ;-)
<jibel> np, jenkins confuses me too :)
<seb128> nice to have real time log displayed in any case
<seb128> pitti, \o/ notify-osd # PASS:  1
<seb128> # FAIL:  0
<seb128> Finished: SUCCESS
<pitti> nice
<seb128> green we are
<seb128> so maybe it was just the missing depends on at-spi which got added yesterday
<pitti> so, something got fixed in the past two days :)
<seb128> pitti, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/notify-osd/0.9.35+13.10.20130725-0ubuntu1
<seb128> "  * Have the tests depend on at-spi2-core."
<pitti> ah, indeed
<seb128> I guess something else was pulling it in before
<pitti> seb128: but that sounds a bit wrong -- shouldn't the notify-osd binary depend on at-spi2-core instead, not just the test?
<darkxst> seb128, pitti: Hey!
<seb128> darkxst, hey
<pitti> hey darkxst
<seb128> pitti, well, at-spi is only for a11y, I'm not sure it's an hard depends to use notify-osd
<darkxst> for alpha 2, we had two crashes that seem to be related to missing indicator packages bug 1204289 and 1204290
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1204289 in network-manager-applet (Ubuntu) "nm-applet crashed with SIGSEGV" [Undecided,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1204289
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1204290 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "panel crashed with SIGSEGV in indicator_object_get_entries()" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1204290
<darkxst> ok to add dependencies to ubiquity?
<seb128> darkxst, that's not going to solve it
<darkxst> why not?
<seb128> larsu, ^ we need to teach ubiquity about new indicators, it's trying to load the old .so
<seb128> darkxst, ^
<seb128> darkxst, because that files doesn't exist anymore
<darkxst> seb128, we don't ship any indicators
<seb128> well, shipping some wouldn't help
<seb128> it tries to load a .so that doesn't exist anymore in the indicator-ng code
<seb128> (e.g the gmenu based one)
<seb128> ubiquity needs to learn the new format, same as unity-panel-service and indicator-applet
<darkxst> ok i see, figured it was ubuntu GNOME specific, but perhpas not
<seb128> likely not
<larsu> seb128: which indicators does ubiquity use? (I'm guessing at least network and sound?)
<larsu> and datetime
<larsu> and session?!
<seb128> static const char* indicators[] = {
<seb128> 	"/usr/lib/indicators3/7/libsession.so",
<seb128> 	"/usr/lib/indicators3/7/libapplication.so",
<seb128> 	"/usr/lib/indicators3/7/libsoundmenu.so",
<seb128> 	NULL
<seb128> larsu, ^
<darkxst> seb128, I didnt see any other reports from other flavours though
<seb128> larsu, they basically indicator_object_new_from_file() those
<seb128> darkxst, I guess there is not so many testers of a2
<seb128> darkxst, and ubiquity-kde might not be impacted
<seb128> darkxst, but my reading of the code is that the session menu can't work atm
<seb128> it should be missing on all ubiquity-gtk flavors
<larsu> seb128: thanks. Do you think it makes sense to have a ubuiquity profile instead of a static list in ubiquity?
<seb128> xnox, ^ opinion ?
<seb128> larsu, I would just go for the easiest, e.g hardcode the new filenames
<seb128> larsu, libindicator still work the same way? e.g you can call indicator_object_get_entries() etc on those?
<larsu> seb128: I'm leaning towards that as well, but I don't like it...
<seb128> larsu, if you want to look at the code it's lp:ubiquity src/panel/panel.c
<larsu> seb128: yes, the only thing that's different is that you need to parse the indicator file (with indicatorng, which is a subclass of indicatorobject)
<seb128> larsu, well, my understanding is that ubiquity is going to be rewritten in qml at some point
<seb128> larsu, so I wouldn't spend too much time on it making the code nice
<larsu> seb128: well but then we'll carry the hack into the qml version, because we don't have proper profiles for it
<larsu> also, we might want different menus on there
<seb128> larsu, let's see I'm all for proper installer profile, but ETOOMUCHTODO and let's get the phone profiles done first
<seb128> larsu, well your call if you want to do it the proper way
<seb128> but it's more important to land unitymenumodel
<seb128> maybe let's do the hack to unbreak it
<larsu> seb128: HAHA first time I've seen ETOOMUCHTODO :)
 * larsu loves that
<seb128> and keep a bug about doing it the proper way in some weeks when we are over the "need to land stuff to unblock other people"
<seb128> larsu, ;-)
<larsu> seb128: it's not that much work really, just many MRs (for the indicators, we only need 3 extra lines in the indicator files)
<seb128> larsu, do you want to do it (you are probably going to be the most efficient to do it since you know the libindicator changes best here)
<seb128> larsu, e.g should I assign it to you?
<larsu> seb128: yes. I'll do it today. Prepare for some code reviews :P
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> larsu, danke
<seb128> larsu, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubiquity/+bug/1204290 re-titled and assigned to you
<ubot2`> Ubuntu bug 1204290 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "ubiquity needs to be updated for the new indicators" [High,Confirmed]
<larsu> seb128: merci
<darkxst> seb128, or I guess we could just disable the panel? obviously qml not going to work with our images
<seb128> darkxst, the qml stuff is not going to happen this cycle anyway ... disabling the panel doesn't seem great, it's easy enough to fix
 * larsu wonders why we have so many implementations of the panel...
<seb128> larsu, because we didn't have profiles in indicators to start :p
<seb128> also because neither ubiquity nor lightdm run unity (and they are used in flavor that don't want those depends)
<seb128> but yeah, it's suboptimal :/
<larsu> ah right
<larsu> well, a library or something would have been cool
<larsu> oh well, too late to fix now :)
<seb128> yeah :/
<seb128> sil2100, hey, any reason the settings stack is still not published?
<darkxst> seb128, ok
<seb128> sil2100, we are going to miss today's image if it's not waved through soon, that would be annoying
<seb128> hum, no sil2100 today?
<sil2100> seb128: here
<sil2100> seb128: hmm, ah
<sil2100> I know what happened
<seb128> sil2100, we have packaging changes, it's in manual publishing for sure
<seb128> sil2100, but aren't you guys supposed to review those early so they can make it on the image of the day?
<sil2100> seb128: dealing with that, it was green in the morning, but it seems it was blocked on something then ;/
<Laney> where are the stack statuses?
<seb128> Laney, https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/view/cu2d/view/Head/
<seb128> https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/view/cu2d/view/Head/view/Settings/
<Laney> cool
<sil2100> seb128: I was reviewing and releasing what I could in the morning, seems like I did it too early
<sil2100> seb128: as these are your changes, publishing
<seb128> sil2100, thanks
<sil2100> hmm, what the heck?
<Laney> It'd be nice if all uploaders could do that
<seb128> sil2100, issue?
<seb128> sil2100, hello?
<Laney> Just got the email - I guess it's working
<sil2100> seb128: had some tool issue, but not with sttings
<sil2100> *settings
<seb128> ok, good
<seb128> sil2100, thanks
<sil2100> Settings should be published
<seb128> yeah, what Laney said
<sil2100> seb128: you think you can approve a cu2d-config branch for me?
<seb128> sil2100, let me see the diff, depends if I understand what the change is about I guess ;-)
<sil2100> https://code.launchpad.net/~sil2100/cupstream2distro-config/phone_extra_pkgs/+merge/177114 <- a missing extra pkg to install ;p
<seb128> sil2100, seems like that list  is in alphabetic order ... should you keep it this way?
<seb128> or not really
<seb128> seems it was and stuff got added in different order?
<sil2100> seb128: it doesn't have a particular order, I just added one package to the front
<sil2100> seb128: since we're usually adding it in the order the requirement pops up ;)
<seb128> ok
<seb128> sil2100, approved
<sil2100> seb128: thank you! Redeploying to unblock Phone
<sil2100> Although we're still blocked on SDK
<mhr3_> seb128, do you know how do i take non-black screenshots in s?
<seb128> mhr3_, take the phone out of your pocket, press the take a picture button?
<sil2100> ;)
<mhr3_> i know that ubuntu edge is black, but somehow i still like colors in my screenshots... i'm just oldfashioned
<seb128> mhr3_, screenshots work for me, not sure what's the issue for you
<seb128> mhr3_, do you run mir or system compositor or fancy stuff?
<mhr3_> seb128, no, all regular s
<mhr3_> seb128, no screenshots, no videocasts... aaah
<mhr3_> soon clipboard will stop working
<seb128> mhr3_, does it happen in a guest session? I had some issues after docking/undocking/changing screen layouts
<seb128> but it works atm
<mhr3_> let me check
<mhr3_> seb128, hmm, yea works in guest session
<mhr3_> seb128, the indicators don't though :)
<larsu> seb128: same issue here
<larsu> woah, sometimes logging out of the guest session drops me back into my session, not the lock scree
<seb128> not nice
<seb128> unlocked session?
<larsu> yes
<seb128> :-(
<larsu> but only about 1 i 3 times
<seb128> you should open a lightdm bug
<seb128> I saw that once yesterday but I was unsure
<seb128> robert_ancell has been doing refactoring recently, he probably broke something
<larsu> ah! It's a different issue
<larsu> sometimes logging out takes a long time, so I switch to a VT to check if my computer is still reacting
<larsu> switchig back to X drops me into my session, instead of the guest session
<seb128> yeah; logout delays are annoying
<seb128> it takes often minutes for me and I end up killing gnome-session
<larsu> still, switching to a VT as guest and switching back should put you back into the guest session, right?
<seb128> larsu, how do you "switch back"?
<seb128> larsu, typically your session is vt7 (ctrl-alt-f7), guest is f8
<seb128> larsu, there is no "X", there is one vt by user, starting at 7 for xorg, so first user 7, second 8, third 9
<seb128> Laney, "I'd rather it was a property of whatever component it will come from in the end"
<seb128> Laney, you mean I should add the property declaration to UbuntuStorageAboutPanel{} in my case?
<Laney> Yeah, rather than having it top-level
<larsu> seb128: ah okay. I meant switching back to vt7, which is n't right apparently. But still, shouldn't my session be locked?
<seb128> Laney, do you think it's fine to do backend.string ? backend.string : "fallback"?
<Laney> yes
<seb128> larsu, it should, that's an indicator-session bug if it's not locked, the indicator is supposed to call gnome-screensaver --lock between starting the guest
<seb128> larsu, bug charles I guess ;-)
<seb128> between->before
<larsu> seb128: okay, will do. Thanks for clearing this up
<seb128> larsu, yw
<seb128> Laney, ok, I'm going to drop the property, the only reason I used it was to avoid calling the get-er twice
<Laney> I'd expect the QML engine to cache it
<Laney> or at least your cpp code
<seb128> ok, the cost in any case is low enough
<seb128> my cpp code does the usual if empty or null; then; else; return value
<Laney> seems fine
<larsu> seb128: filed a bug for charles (bug #1205273)
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1205273 in Session Menu "Session is not locked when switching to guest session" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1205273
<seb128> larsu, thanks
<darkxst> seb128, how is the ibus testing going?
<seb128> darkxst, I'm fine upload the new version, jbicha was supposed to see with the unity guys for a failing test though, dunno if that happened
<darkxst> ok will chat with jbicha tomorrow then.
<seb128> ok, I will ping him later if he gets online today
<seb128> I want that one uploaded as well
<seb128> Laney, https://code.launchpad.net/~seb128/ubuntu-system-settings/about-real-update-date/+merge/177128 btw (dropping the extra property we discussed earlier)
 * seb128 lunch, brb
<Laney> seb128: I got two MPs?
<Laney> I guess you cancelled one
<seb128> Laney, yeah, I had an unwanted change in there, I clean and resubmitted
<seb128> cleaned
<Laney> ok
<sil2100> seb128: can you do the same review for another stack? https://code.launchpad.net/~sil2100/cupstream2distro-config/fix_extra_pkgs_webapp/+merge/177135 ;) ?
<seb128> sil2100, oh, done (sorry I did it and forgot to reply on IRC)
<sil2100> seb128: thank you!
<Laney> seb128: did you look into getting the last update data on desktop too?
<seb128> Laney, no, should I?
<seb128> that's a good point, I'm focussing on making those stuff work on the phone
<Laney> might be nice
<seb128> but I guess it would be nice
<Laney> I think you can get the mtime of /var/cache/apt
<Laney> or maybe /var/lib/apt/lists
<desrt> morning, peeps
<Laney> saluton desrt. feliÄa vendredo :-)
<desrt> Laney: bona homo!  vi lernis!
<desrt> estas bona lingvo, Äu ne?
<seb128> desrt, hey
<Laney> mi ne komprenas vin
<Laney> (thanks wikipedia :P)
<desrt> Laney: "dankon"
<Laney> :-)
<desrt> i'm starting to notice that esperanto is a gateway drug
<desrt> i spent a bit of time yesterday deciding whether i should learn shavian or toki pona next
<desrt> seriously....
<ogra_> do vulcan
<desrt> afaik, nobody ever speced out a vulcan language
<desrt> if you like pointy ears, there is elvish from lord of the rings, though
<ogra_> http://home.comcast.net/~markg61/vlif.htm
<desrt> oh dear lord
<ogra_> The Vulcan Language InstituteÂ® originally began in 1980 to
<ogra_> explore the languages of Vulcans on their homeworld and colonies.
<ogra_> the page looks like it hasnt been updated since
<desrt> i guarantee it's been updated more recently than 1980...
<davmor2> desrt: I think you mis-spelt espresso there, in which case it's definitely a gateway drug man ;)
<desrt> but ya... the look says 'not by much'
<desrt> davmor2: i got a pot of the real stuff brewing now :)
<desrt> davmor2: (incidentally, in my case... you're exactly correct.... i never drank coffee until a european friend convinced me to try espresso... now i drink all sorts of coffee)
<Laney> soon you'll graduate to English Breakfast
<Laney> the real real stuff
<ogra_> uuh
<desrt> english breakfast is like earl grey taken down a notch
<desrt> aint nobody got time for that
<Laney> I save the fancy stuff for special occasions
<sil2100> I need to drive home now, be back pretty soon!
<davmor2> desrt: I hope thanked them :)
<desrt> in canada, we're fancy daily :)
<Laney> just remembered there's some lapsang souchong downstairs
<desrt> davmor2: actually, he was upset
<desrt> davmor2: the slightly longer story is that he was living in canada for a couple of years and found the coffee here to be atrocious.  particularly tim hortons.
<davmor2> Laney: Truck Stop English Breakfast is full graduation :)
<desrt> he was german and he used some long-german-word for "dirty water left in the sink after you do the dishes" to describe this kind of coffee
<desrt> i told him that i didn't like coffee and he said "no wonder you don't.  coffee in this country sucks.  you need to try the real thing..."
<Laney> davmor2: yeah! The teaspoon has to stand up on its own
<desrt> so the fact that by the end of it all, i was drinking the normal coffee..... he was a bit upset
<davmor2> Laney: :)
<seb128> Laney, reviewed your datetime changed, there is a tiny details on a string and bonus point if you rebase/make pot it
<Laney> seb128: w00t, thanks
<doomlord> how hard would it be to modify 'scale' to navigate desktops. basically i want to be able to do all window/desktop navigation with *one* hotkey+cursor keys
<doomlord> eg activate 'scale', if you try to move offscreen, when walking the windows, it switches desktops. or make one hotkey toggle between expo/scale.. there are many ways it could be done
<doomlord> mac osx mission control (without window-bundles) is perfect but relies on multitouch
<tkamppeter> mlankhorst, hi
<fginther> tedg, FYI, the pbuilderhook universe hook is available to use now
<tedg> fginther, Great, thanks!
<seb128> larsu, do you know why qtcreator doesn't recognise GSettings ?
<seb128> it underlines it in red when you do GSettings {}
<larsu> seb128: oh, no clue, I don't use qtcreator. Does it give you an error message?
<seb128> "Unknown component. (M300)"
<larsu> hm, how helpful
<seb128> larsu, don't bother about it
<seb128> I will have a look
<seb128> I wanted to check if that's a known issue before spending time looking at it
<larsu> seb128: thanks. I've just started with the ubiquity work... it was a crazy day
<seb128> larsu, are there other days at Canonical? ;-)
<larsu> seb128: ya, weekends :D
<seb128> ;-)
<jbicha> hmm, that notify-osd worked today and not yesterday is rather suspicious, build 39 should have been the same as build 40
<jbicha> oh, it looks like #39 passed on i386 but not amd64; that makes a bit more sense
<Laney> https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/view/Saucy/view/AutoPkgTest/job/saucy-adt-notify-osd/39/ARCH=amd64,label=adt/
<Laney> it ran against the old version
<jbicha> it shouldn't work that way...
<larsu> darkxst: do you know how I can test ubiquity's panel? Starting it gives me a grey window over half my screen
<jbicha> seb128: for the ibus unity tests, see bug 1203106
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1203106 in unity (Ubuntu) "Rewrite ibus test for ibus 1.5" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1203106
<seb128> jbicha, good work on fixing notify-osd
<seb128> jbicha, seems like we need bschaefer to fix https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/1204210 before updating ibus then?
<ubot2`> Ubuntu bug 1204210 in unity (Ubuntu) "Refactor unity/nux to the new ibus 1.5 changes" [Medium,Triaged]
<seb128> bregma, bschaefer: hey, is ^ correct?
<seb128> tedg, ^ btw, you were watching the status
<bschaefer> seb128,yup!  I have a branch, but its getting a bit hard to be consistent
<bschaefer> seb128, well that bug can wait
<seb128> bschaefer, is that going to create user visible problems?
<bschaefer> seb128, mainly I need to fix up the tests, which once they are passing, ibus is working fine
<bschaefer> seb128, nope, the only visible problems are addressed in the moving unity tests to ibu 1.5
<seb128> bschaefer, what about the refactoring/signal? is that tests only?
<seb128> ok, great
<seb128> do you have any eta on that?
<bschaefer> seb128, it needs to be refactor and there is a big error/warning I want to comment out in nux, but it doesn't create much of a problem
<bschaefer> seb128, im hoping by today but getting someone to test it always take a bit of time
<bschaefer> as it'll fail on one machine for no reason :(
<seb128> ok
<jbicha> bschaefer: do we need to land ibus in -proposed before your merges will work?
<bschaefer> jbicha, hmm if ibus is not 1.5 with the change I make might cause them to fail on current ibus...
<bschaefer> as I've had to change lp:autopilot to not restart ibus each time we switch engines...as ibus is always on in 1.5 (which is a bit of a big change in behaviour)
<jbicha> ok, would Monday be good for uploading ibus 1.5? we could hold it in -proposed for a few days if necessary
<bschaefer> yeah, that would sounds good, but right now ibus 1.5 works well with unity
<bschaefer> jbicha, the only regression I saw is a super minor one
<jbicha> nux will need to be rebuilt against the new ibus (soname bump) so its autopkgtest will have to pass before ibus migrates out of proposed
<bschaefer> alright, which I should get that branch merged for nux soon as well
 * Laney cuts qt
<Laney> sort the model! SORT IT!
<didrocks_busy> mpt: hey!
<seb128> Laney, didn't you master sorting earlier in the week?
<seb128> Laney, oh, no, that was filtering
<didrocks_busy> mpt: so, I just somewhat build a demo for the update system panel for the phone
<didrocks_busy> mpt: I would appreciate a real mpt design if possible (with an awesome font ;))
<czajkowski> didrocks_busy: as you do in your spare time :)
<didrocks_busy> I guess we'll talk about it on the IoM
<didrocks> czajkowski: yeah, that was the part that made my buffer overflowed today :p
<mpt> jbicha, awesome. :-) Seems we need to reconsider that rule. Perhaps show only the ~3 most-recently-used players?
<czajkowski> didrocks: your reward is the weekend off!
<mpt> didrocks, will you be at the sprint?
<didrocks> czajkowski: not a full week-end as travelling!
<didrocks> mpt: yeah, I'll take some fresh air ;)
<mpt> didrocks, ok, let's look at it there
<didrocks> agreed :)
<czajkowski> didrocks: no rest for the wicked!
<didrocks> heh
<jbicha> mpt: I don't use the sound menu (or webapps) enough to really have an opinion on that
 * didrocks waves good evening and good week-end!
<jbicha> seb128: is Sunday night/Monday morning ok for ibus or do you want to discuss it more next week?
<seb128> jbicha, feel free to upload when you feel it's ready, it's going to stay in proposed until we get an unity landing next week anyway
<jbicha> and we'll need indicator-keyboard MIR'ed
<jbicha> seb128: do you still need the normal mir paperwork for pre-mir stuff?
<Laney> bah I can't make this stupid thing sort
<Laney> I'll try again on Monday
<Laney> it calls sort() but the view doesn't get updated
<seb128> jbicha, define "pre-mir" stuff?
<seb128> Laney, is that the tz list?
<Laney> yeah
<Laney> I made it fetch the data in a worker thread
<Laney> so I want it to sort as they come in
<Laney> QSortFilterProxyModel is supposed to do that but I can't get it to
<seb128> I've no experience with that
<seb128> I guess it works if you load/fill the model and then sort it?
<jbicha> seb128: for the phone stuff, y'all have done quite a few pre-new and pre-mir checks, right?
<Laney> yes that's what it does currently
<seb128> jbicha, right, they still need Mir bugs
<seb128> MIR rather
<seb128> we didn't review the keyboard indicator I think
<seb128> not for MIR for sure
<chrisccoulson> it's nearly the weekend!
<Laney> it already is :P
<Laney> stop working
<chrisccoulson> heh
<chrisccoulson> i wish it was *that* easy to stop working
<chrisccoulson> perhaps i should go and get some beer?
<sarnold> beer beer beer steak steak steak
<Laney> spoken like a desktop team member
<chrisccoulson> lol
<attente> mterry, hey
<attente> i'm wondering if you have anything to comment about https://code.launchpad.net/~attente/unity-gtk-module/unset-ubuntu-menuproxy/+merge/172624
<mterry> attente, hello
<attente> mainly re: what the right thing to do is when UBUNTU_MENUPROXY is unset
<mterry> looking
<mterry> attente, uh...  do we have instances of people being bit by an unset UBUNTU_MENUPROXY?  Or docs floating in wild that suggest unsetting it?
<mterry> attente, I've always seen "export UBUNTU_MENUPROXY=0 or UBUNTU_MENUXPROXY="
<attente> mterry, there's nothing documenting the behaviour of an unset UBUNTU_MENUPROXY right now
<mterry> attente, sure, nothing official.  But I didn't know if it was a common thing for people to do, like some website somewhere recommended it
<mterry> attente, I thought we wanted UBUNTU_MENUPROXY to die?  This would make that harder
<attente> mterry, yes, that's true
<attente> i don't think it's a common thing, but charles seems to be getting bit by it
<mterry> attente, charles?
<mterry> attente, if it's just something he's doing, maybe correct him.  But if it's something he's doing because of an omgubuntu.co.uk article, maybe we should support this
<attente> sorry, charles in #systems
<attente> mterry, ok
<mterry> attente, I'm just leery of putting ourselves in a position where we have to set UBUNTU_MENUPROXY to some dummy value for our stuff to work, rather than gracefully sunsetting the variable
<mterry> attente, but ::shrug::
<attente> mterry, ok, thanks :)
<jbicha> xnox: are you going to guadec?
<darkxst> larsu, you can run ubiquity-dm from a vt, then you will get a new X session just like at boot
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-07-27
<jbicha> ooh I figured out where notify-osd broke; when we merged gtk from Debian, libgtk-3-0 no longer depends on at-spi2-core https://launchpadlibrarian.net/144467278/gtk%2B3.0_3.8.2-0ubuntu7_3.8.2-3ubuntu1.diff.gz
<doomlord> is an option for horizontal dock at the bottom out of the question - that would make alot more sense with touchscreen laptops .. easily accessible from hands on the keyboard
<doomlord> almost like an extra row of function-keys :)
<doomlord> also would it be possible to make rightclick /mousewheel clicks on the workspace switcher icon do something useful eg rightclick = scale-all-windows , mousewheel = cycle through desktops (1 action rather than click-move-click .. i miss that from gnome-2
<jbicha> desrt: bug 1205562
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 1205562 in gdk-pixbuf (Ubuntu) "[background] wallpapers in grid are too small, take long time to load" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1205562
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-07-21
<pitti> Laney: OOI, what was "-k"?
<pitti> Laney: oh, you mean run-adt-test -k
<pitti> Good morning
<didrocks> morning
<mvo_> hey didrocks, good morning
<didrocks> hey mvo_! how was your week-end?
<mvo_> didrocks: quiet but nice otherwise
<mvo_> didrocks: and yours?
<didrocks> mvo_: was nice! went to Angers (Nord West) of France for a wedding in Julie's family
<didrocks> we took the occasion to visite on of the castle there
<mvo_> didrocks: nice! thats sounds like lots of fun
<didrocks> had to rent a car, quite a little bit of driving, but it was nice :)
<didrocks> yeah
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<seb128> hey didrocks pitti mvo_
<didrocks> morning seb128!
<pitti> bonjour seb128 et didrocks, comment allez-vous ?
<mvo_> hey seb128, good morning
<pitti> hey mvo_
<mvo_> hey pitti, guten morgen !
<seb128> pitti, Ã§a va bien, et toi ?
<seb128> bon w.e ?
<pitti> oui, bon w.e. long Ã  Dresden
<didrocks> hey pitti! I'm great, thanks, and you ?
<pitti> taking Friday off -> one gets the punishment on Monday :)
<seb128> pitti, same here ;-)
<seb128> well Dresden -> Den Haag for me
<pitti> seb128: ah, pour tourisme, ou as-tu de familie lÃ  ?
<seb128> pitti, j'ai une amie qui habite lÃ , je lui rends visite
<seb128> on a eu du beau temps, samedi il faisait 30Â°C on a fait du vÃ©lo et on s'est baignÃ©s Ã  la plage sur le chemin
<pitti> trÃ¨s bien; aimes-tu Den Haag ? Je ne le connais pas
<seb128> oui, c'est une jolie ville
<darkxst> hey seb128, didrocks, pitti
<didrocks> morning darkxst!
<seb128> darkxst, hey
<seb128> pitti, on a visitÃ© Amsterdam Ã©galement vendredi
<darkxst> didrocks, I setup tracker unit tests as autopkgtests, however quite a few of the functional tests seem broken
<pitti> seb128: ah, nous seulement avons eu un pool, mais c'Ã©tait trÃ¨s bien, il faisait 34 Â°C..
<seb128> pitti, trop chaud !
<seb128> pitti, piscine donc ?
<didrocks> darkxst: did you open/check with upstream on why they are broken? Do they run them regularly or is it an environment/setup issue?
<pitti> seb128: oui, les voisins de mes parents ont un piscin
<pitti> "une piscine"
<pitti> seb128: mais pendant les soirs et les nuits il faisait trÃ¨s bien
<darkxst> didrocks, well they are disabled by default, and there are some build system issues with them not installing properly
<seb128> pitti, ok
<pitti> seb128: so we mostly stayed inside on Saturday afternoon and had a nice walk and visited the fair on Saturday night
<darkxst> but I still need to check with upstream, sometimes hard to catch the relevant people on IRC with my timezone!
<didrocks> darkxst: argh, care sending/poking upstream about that? Seems a nice way to contribute yeah :)
<didrocks> darkxst: let's keep me posted :)
<darkxst> didrocks, will do
<RAOF> How can Unity7 *still* have stacking bugs where it draws everything underneath all the windows?
<seb128> RAOF, compiz and stacking... ;-)
<didrocks> (I won't mention the stacking issues that jibel reported on Mir though :p)
<RAOF> Stacking of applications being wrong is stupid, but understandable.
<RAOF> There's no excuse for the alt-tab switcher or dash being below other windows.
<RAOF> They don't *need* to stack!
<RAOF> They're never anything but on top!
<didrocks> RAOF: btw, I confirm on the alt-tab switcher being behind
<didrocks> I had it on Friday as well
<didrocks> not sure how to trigger it though
<seb128> RAOF, that used to be true
<RAOF> Oh, lock screen.
<seb128> RAOF, until they made the lockscreen part of unity, and had bugs where alt-tab was showing over it
<seb128> yes...
<seb128> lockscreens under X = no fun
<RAOF> Yeah, we really should just switch VT.
<RAOF> Or, you know, have a system compositor :)
<seb128> sounds like something we should do indeed ;-)
<RAOF> Is ddebs.ubuntu.com connected to the Internet via wet string? It should really push better than 90KB/sec
<Laney> hey hey
<didrocks> good morning Laney, how was your week-end?
<willcooke> morning desktopers
<didrocks> hey willcooke! good morning and welcome back :)
<willcooke> \o/
<willcooke> just getting my accounts set up etc
<didrocks> yeah, nothing really changed infrastructure-wise, so I guess you will be quickly setup :)
<willcooke> Yeah, should be easy.
<willcooke> Actually - job #1 - set up a new Chromium profile
<Laney> didrocks: yeah, very good thanks - climbing, visiting baby, climbing, bbq, board games ;-)
<Laney> you?
<Laney> hey willcooke
<willcooke> hi Laney!
<willcooke> Good to meet you
<xnox> willcooke: hello! =)
<Laney> and you :-)
<willcooke> hey xnox :D
<seb128> hey Laney willcooke xnox
<Laney> howdy seb128 xnox
<didrocks> willcooke: yeah, multiple chromium profile is a must if you don't want to become crazy in google account switching :p
<Laney> good weekends?
<xnox> willcooke: i haven't met you, but i've heard good things about you already =))))
<willcooke> seb128 Howdy!
 * Laney has no multiple profile business
<seb128> didrocks, multiple browsers
<didrocks> Laney: oh nice! I went to the north west of France for a wedding and used that opportunity to visit on of the numerous castle there
<Laney> must be missing out on some browsing utopia
<didrocks> seb128: pffff, that's weak ;)
 * seb128 uses firefox for work and chromium for !work
<Laney> I just use the multi login google stuff
<didrocks> seb128: is there any other browser than chrom*?
<willcooke> xnox, ha!  Reserve judgement ;)
 * didrocks looks at the calendar, oh not friday, sorry
<didrocks> kthxbye :)
<Laney> but then again I have no gmail and never make gdocs, soooooo
<seb128> didrocks, yeah, w3m, what else do you want to use?
<didrocks> right right :p
<seb128> but ja, not friday yet!
<Laney> I can share my custom set of scripts wrapping nc
<seb128> even if I could do with another w.e ;-)
<Laney> they are EXTREMELY extensible!
<didrocks> seb128: "ja" -> getting used to Strasbourg already? :)
<seb128> lol
<didrocks> Laney: yeahâ¦ I believe youâ¦ butâ¦ no thanks :)
<Laney> oh and they're email driven
<Laney> /nick rms
<didrocks> heh
<seb128> u-s-s is a bit crazy recently
 * seb128 starts doing some reviews
<didrocks> seb128: not sure how to understand your test plan became "green" in the email, but the color is still yellow and progress is red
<didrocks> or system app isn't system settings?
<Laney> ?!
<didrocks> and the core apps?
<didrocks> Laney: some weekly QA report
<seb128> didrocks, oh, I stopped reading those emails ... the test plan on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Process/Merges/TestPlan/ubuntu-system-settings got quite some work, thanks to brendan
<seb128> (just saw that, thanks for pointing it)
<Laney> yeah nobody acked my top quality test fix work yet, that's why ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: so, I guess it was related to u-s-s, but not reflected at all in the tabular
<seb128> could be yeah
<didrocks> system app is a confusing name anyway :p
<seb128> that testplan is crazy
 * didrocks looks
<seb128> like you have 3 pages of tests to go through
<didrocks> ahah, and they are empty sections still!
<seb128> yeah ...
<seb128> turns out settings is quite some work/doing quite some things
<czajkowski> aloha
<didrocks> morning czajkowski
<seb128> hey czajkowski, how are you?
<didrocks> seb128: unbelievable ;)
<czajkowski> well I was fine till I had to log in under my guest account to get my desktop this morning under Trusty :/
<seb128> urg
<seb128> what happened to your normal account?
<czajkowski> I don't know :(
<czajkowski> it was working last night
<seb128> what happened when you try to log in there?
<czajkowski> https://twitter.com/czajkowski/status/491135209526820864/photo/1
<willcooke> hi czajkowski
<czajkowski> is all I see when I log in
<czajkowski> willcooke: welcome back sunshine!
<czajkowski> \o/
<willcooke> czajkowski, :D  I know which side my bread is buttered
<willcooke> </english_sayings>
<willcooke> or rather, British
<czajkowski> heh
<czajkowski> seb128: https://twitter.com/czajkowski/status/491135209526820864/photo/1
<czajkowski> guest account works
<seb128> czajkowski, try running "gsettings reset org.compiz.core:/org/compiz/profiles/unity/plugins/core/ active-plugins" for your user
<czajkowski> seb128: under guest or main account ?
<seb128> czajkowski, the main one
<seb128> czajkowski, you can use nautilus to browse to /usr/bin and start things if needed
<czajkowski> ok shall go and attempt that :)
<czajkowski> cheers
<seb128> like a command line
<seb128> or try keybindings
<didrocks> (ctrl + alt + T to try to open it from command line)
<seb128> depends if u-s-d is running
<didrocks> hoping that compiz is running
<didrocks> yep
<seb128> but my guess is that the unity plugin got unloaded for some reason
<czajkowski> lemie reboot nad seee
<czajkowski> nope :(
<czajkowski> could be the day I upgrade to U I guess
 * ogra_ hands willcooke https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CEYcGPF00l0 ... for his buttered bread
<ogra_> (and welcome back !!!)
<seb128> czajkowski, can you share your .cache/upstart/gnome-session-Unity.log ?
<willcooke> ogra_, ha!  Love it
<czajkowski> seb128: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/7829147/
<ochosi> morning everyone
<seb128> hey ochosi
<ochosi> hey seb128, still enjoying your holidays or back sweating for the man?
<didrocks> morning ochosi
<seb128> ochosi, back to work, dealing with backlogs ;-)
<Laney> there's no way you would see seb128 if he was on holiday
<Laney> :P
<Laney> he'd be on the beach drinking cocktails out of a pineapple
<didrocks> and rightly so! :)
<ochosi> hehe
<didrocks> ah, the alcohol issueâ¦
<didrocks> we told we won't mention it again :p
 * ochosi wants to live where seb128 lives if they serve cocktails in pineapples there...
<seb128> lol
<seb128> didrocks, you are the one assuming that cocktails with pineapple have to include alcohol!
<didrocks> argh, caught :p
<seb128> ;-)
 * seb128 doesn't drink alcohol
<seb128> only beer, wine and schnaps
<didrocks> which isn't alcol
<didrocks> alcohol*
<didrocks> by german standards :p
<seb128> correct
<seb128> well, german or french
<seb128> depending of the day/drink ;-)
<didrocks> you speak for the french :)
<didrocks> which isn't really true ;)
<seb128> czajkowski, hum
<seb128> czajkowski, you log has the same error than https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/1345296
<seb128> "ERROR 2014-07-21 09:15:46 unity.debug.interface DebugDBusInterface.cpp:216 Unable to load entry point in libxpathselect: libxpathselect.so.1.4: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory"
<seb128> not sure why you get that
<seb128> that library is not installed by default/unity shouldn't require it to run
<seb128> Trevinho, ^ do you know about that?
<didrocks> seb128: still weird it's working on her guest session though
<seb128> yes
<didrocks> some config is triggering that requirement
<czajkowski> yup welcome to my weirdness
<czajkowski> and a odd start to a monday :)
<seb128> it's like some option/extra plugin got activated
<didrocks> right ;)
<seb128> czajkowski, did you tweak your config in any way yesterday? what did you upgrade? (dpkg.log can tell you)
<didrocks> the calls are in unity-shared/DebugDBusInterface.cpp
<czajkowski> seb128: nope nothing
<czajkowski> booted it up last night and read mail and logged off
<seb128> weird :/
<czajkowski> seb128: yup any idea how I can fix it before I leave for Germany tomorrow
<czajkowski> .c
<seb128> czajkowski, having a reply from Trevinho or bregma would be useful...
<seb128> czajkowski, you can try to unity --reset but I'm not sure that's still a thing/working
<czajkowski> cant hurt either
<seb128> czajkowski, you can probably try to move somewhere ~/.compiz .compiz-1 .config/compiz-1
<seb128> keep those maybe for debugging in case
<didrocks> seb128: reset doesn't exist anymore
<seb128> didrocks, right, what I though :-/
<didrocks> nobody changed it since I deprecated it
<seb128> didrocks, is 0replaceme working in maintscripts? i.e https://code.launchpad.net/~laney/ubuntu-system-settings/rm_conffile/+merge/227513
<didrocks> seb128: no, it doesn't, it could easily though
<seb128> Laney, ^
<didrocks> sil2100: mind if I change this in cu2d and then you deploy it? ^
<czajkowski> bah my guest account doesn't keep any histroy :/
 * didrocks can do that in few secs
<Laney> wait
<Laney> robru fixed it to do that the other day
<seb128> oh
<didrocks> yeah, I'm looking at the code and he changed that to everywhere
<didrocks> which can create issues with comments thoughâ¦
<didrocks> well, shrughâ¦
<Laney> everywhere in debian/?
<didrocks> Laney: yeah
<Laney> guess we'll see if there are problems in practice and can restrict then
<didrocks> and the function is still name as refresh_symbol_files()
<didrocks> Laney: some people used that in comments
<sil2100> didrocks: no problem ;)
<sil2100> didrocks: cupstream2distro trunk should be safe currently
<didrocks> at least, cjwatson added tests
<didrocks> sil2100: the approved approach is really risky btw
<didrocks> sil2100: you don't check the revision which is approved
<didrocks> so, if you really want to force approved version, you should check that ids used to be built and the approved rev are the same
<seb128> Laney, the update branch still has unhappy CI :-/
<Laney> which?
<seb128> https://code.launchpad.net/~laney/ubuntu-system-settings/system-update-dbus-last-updated/+merge/227322
<seb128> or is that because it needs your fix stack on top of it?
<Laney> that doesn't have the fixes merged in
<Laney> I think dbus-ap-cleanup prereqs on that one and is happy
<seb128> indeed is
<Laney> it's had three CI runs now so I'm kind of hopeful
<seb128> right
 * Laney is bisecting glib
<sil2100> didrocks: ACK, will consider that
<seb128> Laney, what did desrt do?
<Laney> https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/view/Utopic/view/AutoPkgTest/job/utopic-adt-shotwell/lastBuild/ARCH=amd64,label=adt/console
<Laney> bisect says https://git.gnome.org/browse/glib/commit/?id=49b59e5ac4428a6a99a85d699c3662f96efc4e9d
<asac> seb128: are you guys working on system image support for x86?
<seb128> asac, no, desktop has nothing to do with system images so far (out of being included in the discussions in Malta)
<seb128> that would rather be a topic for foundations / mvo
<seb128> or barry
<asac> yeah. was just curious
<asac> because of the merge
<asac> but guess system-update != system-image-update
<ochosi> hm, have any of you an idea how the soundmenu manages to forward the mouse-grab from the menuitem to the gtkscale? somehow that doesn't seem to work if i put a scale into a menuitem normally and i couldn't find any special code for that in indicator-sound
<seb128> ochosi, ido is having the special widgets
<seb128> larsu can probably help you a bit better than me there though
<larsu> ochosi: I think we have a gtk patch for that (not sure, didn't write that)
<larsu> I've been meaning to check wheter we still need it though
<ochosi> ah, that'd be interesting to know!
<ochosi> didn't realize i would have to look for that in ido :)
<larsu> ochosi: right, idorangemenuitem.c
<larsu> ochosi: ugh sorry. idorange.c is the gtkscale subclass and idoscalemenuitem.c is the menu item
<larsu> the menu item does override all kinds of events, maybe it's enough to just do that
<ochosi> humm, no 12.04 branch anymore
 * ochosi wants to implement that in gtk2
<larsu> I think it was in the sound indicator back then
<larsu> (before we did the split)
<ochosi> oh
<ochosi> do you by any chance remember whether those things changed a lot from gtk2 to gtk3?
<larsu> no, sorry
<ochosi> ok, no worries
<ochosi> i'll look around and poke you again if i feel lost :p
<larsu> the menu code in general didn't change that much iirc
<larsu> so your chances are good
<larsu> sure!
<czajkowski> seb128: think it's safe to upgrade to U given my current morning dekstop issue ?
<seb128> czajkowski, yes
<seb128> not sure U is going to solve that though
<seb128> but you can still upgrade
 * didrocks is making a temptative run outside :p
<czajkowski> could be worse this could have happened on wednesday when I need a working machine for an event at least I've a few days to fix the issue
<seb128> didrocks, good luck and enjoy!
<seb128> czajkowski, the unity guys should be online at some point and able to help you I guess
<czajkowski> seb128: nods who should  I look out for ?
<seb128> czajkowski, bregma Trevinho townsend
<czajkowski> cheers
<seb128> time for lunch here, be back in an hour
<Laney> hmm a new stable gstreamer
<rickspencer3> seb128, Laney, didrocks, etc...
<rickspencer3> does everyone remember willcooke ?>
<willcooke> o/
 * willcooke waves
<Laney> I'm too fresh and innocent
<willcooke> Laney, that won't last
<rickspencer3> lol
<Laney> actually I lived through Jason so I'm not sure that can be true :P
<willcooke> ha
<rickspencer3> Laney, et al as of today, willcooke is the engineering manager for the desktop team
<Laney> high five
<willcooke> :)
<willcooke> I'll get a 1:1 meeting with you guys set up in the next day or so
<rickspencer3> Laney, meanwhile, what do you think willcooke should focus on first?
<willcooke> I'd like to introduce myself and get a good view on what our process looks like, where our backlog is etc.
<rickspencer3> willcooke, I can say that their interim manager has not been too helpful
<willcooke> :D
<rickspencer3> the only thing I did right was find a good replacement for jasoncwarner ;)
<Laney> ha
<Laney> you helped us arrange $upcoming_trips
<rickspencer3> willcooke, did you get any time off between your last job and this one?
<willcooke> a couple of days, enough to get a round of golf in
<Laney> aaaaaaand took us for steak and I'm sure many other things that I didn't see :P
<willcooke> :)
<rickspencer3> "took us for steak"
<rickspencer3> lol
<Laney> things to focus on, I expect $upcoming_trip[1] is going to need some attention
<rickspencer3> Laney, I got you started on the Unity 8/Mir desktop preivew
<rickspencer3> that's my claim to fame desktop team wise
<Laney> haha, yes!
<rickspencer3> of course, it was all seb128's idea
<rickspencer3> byt
 * rickspencer3 shrugs
<rickspencer3> :)
<willcooke> Regarding $trip - I'll know more details for my flights etc in the next couple of days. Then I will get an itinerary together (although it sounds like that is mostly done)
<Laney> Ya, it's coming together - they're asking for people to 'own' sessions
<Laney> that kind of prep
<willcooke> Laney, could you forward me any relevant emails from the last few weeks regarding sessions etc?
<willcooke> or point me to a wiki page where everything is documented.
<willcooke> jk
<willcooke> ;p
<Laney> I just know of one document
<Laney> here you go .......
<willcooke> having all sorts of SSO issues
<willcooke> :(
<didrocks> I'm moderately wet, so, I will call my exercise a moderate success :)
<Laney> fell in the lake?
<didrocks> willcooke: yeah, as told already, happy to have you there (this rick guy was soooo awful, I'm happy he never had been an ubuntu desktop manager ever never ever :p)
<willcooke> :D
<didrocks> he always took bad decision like hiring me at the time and such :p
<didrocks> Laney: avoided the lake, and not falling this time
<willcooke> Any thoughts on who I should speak to about the mess I've got my SSO in to?  I seem to have to accounts in one.ubuntu.com which are partly tied together partly not.
<didrocks> Laney: however, the weather wasn't really great, but it could have been worse :p
<mvo__> willcooke: ohhhh, welcome! nice to see you here
<willcooke> hey mvo__ nice to see you too :)
<didrocks> willcooke: there is a channel for that, one sec
<mvo__> didrocks: wasn't that #omgssoisbroken ?
<willcooke> ha!
<didrocks> mvo__: I guess it's a double "omg" :p
<mvo__> lol
<didrocks> ok, even if the rain took care of me and I'm wet, short shower time
<Trevinho> seb128, czajkowski: that libxpathselect.so.1.4 "error", is actually a warning... Since It's not needed unless you want to run ap on it, so it should not be fatal to the unity run
<Trevinho> czajkowski: can you try to install unity-dbgsym (and maybe even compiz debug symbols) and launch from tty1 unity --advanced-debug to get a gdb backtrace?
<didrocks> ok, I was lucky to run nowâ¦ it would have been an epic fail otherwise :p
<seb128> didrocks, did you avoid the shower and got it on the way back?
 * ogra_ guesses he forgot his shampoo ... 
<didrocks> seb128: just a little bit of rain, but really nothing compared to what I see now
<didrocks> ogra_: yeah, I still didn't take your idea into account, sorry :p
<czajkowski> well that's a little annoying, upgraded to Utopic but still no desktop on main account but again guest works.
<czajkowski> Trevinho: ello shall try your suggestion now
<seb128> czajkowski, that was expected, no reason an upgrade would solve that bug
<czajkowski> seb128: I can hope can't I :)
<czajkowski> 2 days before I run a hackathon and leave for Munich :/
<seb128> czajkowski, you can, but even if that was fixed in utopic, letting the bug in trusty is not nice to other users ;-)
<seb128> czajkowski, well, I'm sure we are going to sort it out
<seb128> czajkowski, did you try moving the .compiz directories I listed earlier btw?
<czajkowski> seb128: I did nothing made a difference.
<czajkowski> just boggling how it worked last night and not today which is what is confusing
<czajkowski> another reason to never shut my laptop down
<seb128> do what Trevinho suggested I guess
<czajkowski> yup I am and working in pm now
<czajkowski> cheers don't want to spam the entire channel with my crazy machine
<seb128> czajkowski, Trevinho: please keep the channel updated as well
<seb128> there is no other discussion ongoing and I'm interested in the details
<seb128> so using the channel would be fine there
<bregma> Trevinho, would removing all the files from /etc/compizconfig/upgrades hurt in an attempt to fix czajkowski's problem?
<Trevinho> bregma: they shouldn't change anything relevant in recent times I think
<Trevinho> seb128: I'm not sure wheather I read the full story, but has that been triggered by an update?
<seb128> Trevinho, we don't know, and it's not happening in a guest session
<seb128> Trevinho, czajkowski didn't restart for a while apparently, so not sure what updates happened between working and not working
<Trevinho> mh I see
<seb128> kenvandine, hey
<kenvandine> hey seb128
<seb128> kenvandine, how are you?
<kenvandine> good, and you?
<seb128> good, thanks
<seb128> starting reviewing bacon2d
<seb128> that's duplicated in the queue and the versions are slightly different
<kenvandine> take the most recent upload :)
<seb128> is that normal?
<seb128> that drops some qmldir qmltypes
<seb128> is that normal?
<kenvandine> silly git-buildpackage
<seb128> src/imports/Bacon2D/plugins.qmltypes
<kenvandine> yeah
<kenvandine> those get created during the build
<kenvandine> src/imports shouldn't even exist
<seb128> k
<kenvandine> i had some trouble with git-buildpackage, it thought it was a debian native even with the ubuntu revision
<seb128> kenvandine, in debian/copyright
<seb128> Files: 3rdparty/qml-box-2d/Box2D/*
<seb128> the path is "box2d"
<seb128> without the "-"
<seb128> kenvandine, git-archive-all.sh is GPL3
<kenvandine> grr... i so love debian/copyright
<kenvandine> :-D
<seb128> lol
<kenvandine> that script shouldn't even be in the dist :)
<kenvandine> seb128, i'll make sure it isn't in the next one, but i'd rather not tag another release :)
<seb128> kenvandine, none of that looks like a blocker, but...
<seb128> kenvandine, I'm more annoyed at the one where the sources a LGPL2+ and the copyright states LGPL2.1 instead
<seb128> ./src/scene.h: LGPL (v2 or later)
<seb128> ./src/behavior.cpp: LGPL (v2 or later)
<seb128> ./src/animationchangeevent.h: LGPL (v2 or later)
<seb128> debian/copyright: License: LGPL-2.1
<seb128> kenvandine, you can do better than that Ken!
<kenvandine> damn... rookie mistake :)
<seb128> kenvandine, otherwise looks good for NEW
<seb128> I could approve it like that, I would prefer the LGPL mismatch to be fixed first though
<seb128> if you don't want to reroll now but get it fixed this week I can let that one through
<kenvandine> there will be another release this week for sure
 * xnox imagines seb128 cooking - scrapping the dish after using a spoonful too much of ground cumin.
<seb128> xnox, you british, don't speak about cooking!
<didrocks> seb128: want to make will sad on his first day? :p
<seb128> lol
 * xnox protects myself with a bottle of white vinegar and a tube of salt
<didrocks> (even if I deeply agree, of course!)
<seb128> kenvandine, ok, NEWed, it's because it's you!
<seb128> kenvandine, next time I might be less nice on license version mismatches though :-p
<kenvandine> seb128, i already pushed the debian/copyright fixes to the packaging branch :)
<kenvandine> i need to propose a branch for the COPYING file change and get a review, etc
<kenvandine> seb128, thx!
<willcooke> hey kenvandine
<kenvandine> yo willcooke!
<willcooke> 'sup
<kenvandine> willcooke, wb! :-D
<willcooke> thanks, very happy to be here again
<willcooke> I missed you kenvandine
<willcooke> :)
<kenvandine> you've been missed!
<kenvandine> and you're leading the best team!
<willcooke> I know, right!  These guys are amazeballs.  I'm very excited to be back
<seb128> Trevinho, bregma, did you manage to help czajkowski with her issue?
<Trevinho> seb128: still ongonoing
<seb128> k
<seb128> do you have any clue what's wrong?
<Trevinho> seb128: not yet still, as we've not able to debug
<seb128> k
<seb128> Trevinho, do you know why she gets the debug mode enabled?
<seb128> did you try turning it off to see?
<Trevinho> seb128: debug mode is enabled for everyone... unity always try to load that library...
<Trevinho> seb128: it won't just do anything if it's not there
<seb128> Trevinho, no it doesn't
<seb128> hum
<seb128> Trevinho, ignore that, I've the lib installed, it might be why I don't get the warning
<seb128> I got confused by that bug report earlier
<Trevinho> seb128: yes, but it's not something fatal... as I wrote the only reason why that was marked as an "error" is to make sure it was printed out
<seb128> k
<Trevinho> I dint do that, iirc it has beeen always there
<seb128> yeah, sorry about the confusion
<seb128> I don't have the warning here, and we got a bug report this morning similar to czajkowski's one
<seb128> which was mentioning the warning
<seb128> so I sort of matched those mentally, wrongly it seems ;-)
<Trevinho> ehe, np
<kenvandine> seb128, i've proposed the COPYING and dist fix too, so next release should fix all your findings
<seb128> kenvandine, thanks!
<czajkowski> seb128: Trevinho is being very patient
<kenvandine> seb128, can haz binNEW? :-D
<seb128> kenvandine, sure, give me a minute
<seb128> czajkowski, no doubt, Trevinho is great ;-)
<kenvandine> Trevinho rocks
 * Trevinho blueshes
<Trevinho> err, blushes
<kenvandine> :)
<Trevinho> no, I actually become blue :D
<czajkowski> me and compiz are just not going to see eye to eye today are we
<czajkowski> lemmie reboot once again, also wish my history on my guest could be on :/
<seb128> czajkowski, you can create a new user to have a persistent "guest"
<czajkowski> seb128: don't I need to be in the main account to do that
<seb128> czajkowski, right, but nautilus is working, so you can go to /user/
<seb128> /usr/bin and run unity-control-center
<seb128> or from a command line
<seb128> well, it might even work from a guest
<seb128> but I'm unsure because of apparmor rules there
<willcooke> ahhh - the wonderful conference call music
<didrocks> you missed it, I'm sure :)
<willcooke> :D
<willcooke> seb128, didrocks - presumably there is a desktop mailing list, actually ignore, of course there is - I will Google
<seb128> willcooke, https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop
<didrocks> seb128 beat me to it :)
<willcooke> :) thanks guys
 * willcooke lazy
<seb128> yw!
<czajkowski> I have a working desktop thanks to Trevinho
<Trevinho> just a workaround for now. but indeed it's some setting fault
<seb128> what was the issue?
<seb128> Trevinho, we miss an unity --reset for those case
<seb128> czajkowski, glad you got it back to working at least!
<Trevinho> seb128: mh, indeed... but we stll need to figure out what's the current problem
<seb128> Trevinho, right
<willcooke> seb128, do we have a wikipage or similar for listing things like this, like a workarounds/fixes page?
<willcooke> is that even a good idea?
<Trevinho> seb128: I'm not brave enough to test, but is gsettings reset recoursive?
<seb128> willcooke, we have askubuntu
<Trevinho> or can be?
<seb128> Trevinho, gsettings reset-recursively is
<seb128> willcooke, http://askubuntu.com/
<Trevinho> seb128: so apparently I'm also too lazy to trigger an --help :D
<Laney> yeah askubuntu tends to do quite well on google searches
<seb128> Trevinho, lol, me too, I just did "gsettings res<TAB>"
<Laney> Trevinho: why bother when you have an interactive --help right here in your IRC window :-)
<seb128> Trevinho, but I sort of remembered there was one such option
<seb128> Laney, calling me interactive?!
<Trevinho> Laney: I love to bother people, time to time :D
<Laney> wind seb128 up and watch him go!
<Trevinho> and seb128 is always a nice bot to interact with :D
<didrocks> well, you are interecting :)
<seb128> 0_o
<seb128> didrocks, not sure if you insulting me there or what :p
<seb128> int-erecting?
 * seb128 eyes didrocks
<didrocks> intera*cting
<seb128> ooh ;-)
<czajkowski> LOL
<czajkowski> such loons you lot are :)
<Laney> hahaha
<Laney> Ubuntu After Dark
<seb128> czajkowski, we are a lovely bunch, right? ;-)
<seb128> I wonder if we are going to manage to scare willcooke on his first day here
<didrocks> there is still time!
 * willcooke packs his bags
<Laney> hazing
<didrocks> ahah
<Laney> chug chug chug chug
<willcooke> \o/
<Laney> there's a tradition of dancing on tables, btw
<didrocks> oh rightâ¦
<didrocks> first team dinner
<didrocks> be prepared will!
<willcooke> haha!  I look forward to it
<didrocks> jason setup that tradition, you have to be up to the standard now :p
<willcooke> Sure thing
<willcooke> And I have to wear the chicken suit as well I expect?
<didrocks> you can add some variation of this new tradition yourself if you really wishâ¦ ;)
<willcooke> horse head masks
<willcooke> so, back on this Ask Ubuntu thing
<willcooke> So, UA is a great platform
<willcooke> especially when people are googling for errors
<willcooke> but
<willcooke> that requires, say, czajkowski to open an AU  question
<willcooke> and then one of us to answer it
<willcooke> Would it be less effort if we (i.e. me) just jotted down some quick workarounds on a wiki page (or whatever)
<willcooke> Feel free to say "thats a stupid idea" btw
<willcooke> just thinking out loud
<didrocks> I do think that have the question on askubuntu enables it to be more up to date and being care of than a wiki page which quickly deprecates IMHO
<didrocks> like, if you type "empty desktop" or "no unity launcher", you end up with: http://askubuntu.com/questions/17381/unity-doesnt-load-no-launcher-no-dash-appears
<didrocks> the second answer was the famous unity --reset
<didrocks> (up to 12.10)
<didrocks> and the first answer is the current recommended way as we don't have --reset reimplemented
<didrocks> we can improve that answer with the gsettings reset maybe though
<willcooke> ah - perfect
<willcooke> if someone tells me what to write I can update it
<didrocks> willcooke: actually, I would rather upvote the 3rd answer
<willcooke> even better
<willcooke> \o/
<didrocks> the dconf reset blablabla
<czajkowski> can I start a campaign to bring back unity --reset after today
<didrocks> czajkowski: I didn't reimplement it at the time because of a possible race
<didrocks> when we switch from gconf to gsettings
<didrocks> I guess we can have that back now with an upstart job I would say
<didrocks> to avoid that race
<czajkowski> well that settles that then, no beer for didrocks
<didrocks> :p
<didrocks> I'm not officially working on that anymore and was going to propose my help, but me ;)
<Laney> when did that migration happen?
<didrocks> meh*
<didrocks> Laney: 13.04
<didrocks> bregma: does your team have that on your list? ^
<Laney> doesn't sound like there will be a race now then
<Laney> upstart job sounds like a slightly weird way to do it
<didrocks> Laney: yeah, clearly not, also unity/compiz is way more stable
<didrocks> --reset was really a workaround
<didrocks> like "loose all your config"
<Laney> anyway it doesn't sound like we really even understand what happened this time
<didrocks> Laney: we had 2 gsettings and dconf daemon starting at the same time
<didrocks> which was creating a deadlock
<Laney> what, today's problem?
<didrocks> ask duflu as well, he has good memories of that
<didrocks> Laney: I think nobody retried
<Laney> aha, was referring to czajkowski's issue
<didrocks> I just retried I was going on holidays when they started and at 3am I was still trying to understand how to diminish the problem :p
<didrocks> ah no
<didrocks> Trevinho: what's czajkowski specific issue? any leads? ^
<didrocks> Laney: but yeah, was fun time, I remember clearly: Friday evening, closing laptop at 6pm
<didrocks> at 11pm, just before going to bed and on holidays for good "let's check emails"
<didrocks> starting the laptopâ¦ "no unity" :p
<Laney> haha
<didrocks> (it was when we still did Friday releases :p)
<Laney> and IRC was full of people panicking, right?
<didrocks> yeah
<didrocks> got this race 3 times on 4 approx
<didrocks> on boot
<didrocks> of course, we didn't get it while releasingâ¦
<willcooke> seb128, are you still working?
<willcooke> seb128, i.e. I have a question, but it can wait
<seb128> willcooke, yes
<willcooke> seb128, so rickspencer3 dropped in to conversation that we've got a point release going out on Thursday :)
<seb128> willcooke, usual rule "it's IRC, you can ask, you might get a delay reply or need to ask again later"
<willcooke> seb128, ack
<rickspencer3> *cough*
<willcooke> seb128, so what I want to know is... what do you need?
<seb128> yeah, we were discussing that a few days ago
<ogra_> more time :)
<willcooke> except that
<seb128> discussing as mentioning "weird that nothing happened from the release team yet"
<seb128> like blocking SRUs, flushing the queue, etc
<rickspencer3> seb128, slangasek pinged me Friday
<rickspencer3> so, there was a little form them ;)
<seb128> what did he say?
<seb128> willcooke, well, not sure I need much, but knowing what's the plan would be good, I sort of assumed that would happen once the release team would start looking at doing the .1
<seb128> which apparently didn't happen yet (for whatever reason)
<seb128> it's likely going to be delayed
<willcooke> seb128, kk - I will have a chat with them asap
<seb128> willcooke, k, not sure we need to push anything there
<willcooke> seb128, understood - easy does it
<seb128> I assume that if they didn't act on it it's because people are on holidays or busy with other things
<willcooke> in other news:  tooooo hot.
<seb128> we should still communicate about the delay
<willcooke> seb128, communicate to the release team, or more outwardly?
<bregma> didrocks, is there a reference bug we can use to make sure it gets on our list?
<seb128> willcooke, the "we" was Ubuntu/the release team
<willcooke> seb128, gotya
<Laney> I'm pinging in #ubuntu-release now
<willcooke> thanks Laney
 * willcooke joins #ubuntu-release
<didrocks> bregma: czajkowski will open one (there is none, just checked) to reintroduce it if she wants it so badly (but again, it's a workaround, I hope Trevinho and her can work on the actual issue to really fix it)
<czajkowski> didrocks: tis fine we'll fix it
<czajkowski> was mostly just been a long day fixing this
<didrocks> yeah, and if you got this issue, I bet some other people will have that :)
<bregma> czajkowski, do you have a cause and a fix now?  I missed anything about that here
 * bregma is recovering from attending a week-long scout jamboree
<Laney> Sounds like the point release is on track and is just fairly low key
<seb128> k
<seb128> well "on track"
<seb128> don't they flush proposed/get candidate image a week before usually?
<willcooke> yeah, sounds like it's pretty much "business as usual"
<Laney> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PointReleaseProcess
<willcooke> hrm - that business as usual remark was directed at Laney's "sounds like the point release is on track"
<willcooke> just in case
<willcooke> :)
<Laney> night!
<willcooke> l8r Laney
<Laney> cccccccccclimbing time
<willcooke> I'm going EOD as well.  Canonical folk - sorry I didnt get to speak to you all personally today, I'll get to it this week.  I'm in the office tomorrow so let me know if there is anything you need from folks there
<willcooke> I'll be travelling from about 9am to 10am tomorrow, but will be around before and after of course
<didrocks> good night Laney!
<didrocks> talk to you tomorrow willcooke, enjoy your evening :)
<attente> seb128: sorry, i forgot to check up on https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity-gtk-module/+bug/1208019, is it too late for the point release?
<seb128> attente, not sure, best is to just go ahead with the SRU, if it's not in the iso it's still going to be in the available updates
<sarnold> Trevinho: seen this one yet? :)  https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1345505
<Trevinho> sarnold: mh sort of... Not properly identified that yet though
<sarnold> Trevinho: no kidding, I'm impressed how many you've diagnosed so far with less information :)
<Trevinho> sarnold: well there are a lot of cases to handle, and at the end we figured most, but still there are some holes to cover
<sarnold> Trevinho: *nod*
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-07-22
<robert_ancell> charles, how do you do SRUs for the indicators?
<robert_ancell> just chuck stuff in debian/patches or make a new release?
<pitti> Good morning
<willcooke> morning folks
<didrocks> hey willcooke!
<didrocks> ready for day #2? ;)
<willcooke> hehe
<willcooke> kinda
<willcooke> I'm off in to London in a little while, so I wanted to get the ball rolling before I sit on the train
<willcooke> actually, I have a question for you didrocks
<didrocks> sure
<willcooke> I'm trying to work out who is in our team (pretty fundamental, right)
<willcooke> so let me send you a link
<didrocks> well, it's a good start :)
<willcooke> hey seb128, can you make me an admin on https://launchpad.net/~canonical-desktop-team
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<seb128> willcooke, sure, sorry I didn't respond because I'm not fully in work mode yet, but can do that ;-)
<willcooke> no hurry seb128
<willcooke> I'm not either - no coffee
<TheMuso> Hey willcooke.
<willcooke> howdy TheMuso - good to meet you :)
<TheMuso> You too.
<willcooke> right - off to London.  Be back online in about an hour (depending on the trains)
<Laney> yo
<seb128> hey Laney, how are you?
<Laney> hey seb128, doing good thank you
<Laney> just sat around last night and napped/watched some tv, didn't end up going climbing ;-)
<Laney> pent up energy, raaargh
<Laney> you?
<czajkowski> aloha
<Laney> hey czajkowski
<Laney> wie gehts?
<czajkowski> not just yet :) 3 hrs to flight :) time to print of name badges and check in yet
<Laney> it's a glamorous life you've got there
<seb128> Laney, I'm fine thanks, not fully awake yet ;-)
<didrocks> morning Laney, czajkowski
<seb128> czajkowski, hey, unity working today? ;-)
<Laney> seb128: still keeping up this early morning IRCing though :P
<seb128> Laney, ye
<didrocks> Laney: see, going in Lyon can change a man! :)
<seb128> Laney, yeah, there is no budging there!
<seb128> lol
<seb128> well, let's see and wait how it goes in winter ;-)
<czajkowski> seb128: eh no :( but I now have all the commands to restart various things so I can get back onto my main account and not live on guest
<czajkowski> thanks for asking :)
<seb128> but it's actually alright for summer
<didrocks> seb128: same, but with hot wine :p
<seb128> czajkowski, :-(
<seb128> didrocks, lol
<seb128> didrocks, then I'm the one with the drinking problem, right?
<didrocks> you obviously are :)
<seb128> tsss
 * didrocks retries to build a desktop docker container
<didrocks> first automated trial was a fail :)
<seb128> didrocks, enjoying docker then? :-)
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, it's quite nice :)
<didrocks> just needs to find a way to install ubuntu-desktop without any priviledge
<didrocks> ensuring that I create a passwordless sudo user and so onâ¦
<didrocks> (to have that container running what we need)
<didrocks> and ensuring that coverage works as expected, even within the container
<didrocks> willcooke: come on, The IT Crowd reference on day 2! You set the bar high :)
<willcooke> didrocks, I'm going to Gimp up an A team picture with your faces on it later and put it on my desk.
<didrocks> :)
<willcooke> nearly in to London now - on the train atm.  4G is working quite well.  I get 20 Mb down, which is more than I get on ADSL at home
<willcooke> :)
<willcooke> shutting down - bbiab
 * didrocks goes for exercising
<didrocks> seems like no rain this time :)
<seb128> didrocks, enjoy!
<willcooke> seb128, do you have a calendar entry for the weekly meeting you could invite me to?  If not I'll create one and send it round
<Laney> willcooke: It's on the Ubuntu fridge calendar
 * Laney laughs at the optimistic Agenda link there
<seb128> willcooke, there is one in the UE calendar owned by Michelle as well
<seb128> which I copied in my calendar, personally
<pitti> hey willcooke, welcome back!
<seb128> but if you prefer it handled some other way please do
<pitti> so that's the man who took my job!
<seb128> lol
<Laney> haha
<pitti> willcooke: in case that's confusing to you, ask any desktop team member over a beer :)
<willcooke|meetin> :)
<Laney> pitti for VP of Ubuntu Engineering!
<somedude> Laney: pitti who?
<seb128> Laney, forget about that, let's just appoint some dude
 * Laney looks at a photo and sees pitti in the middle of fading out
<davmor2> seb128: some dude isn't he like that pitti chap a French guy who thinks he's German?
<pitti> davmor2: mec, tu dois parler franÃ§ais ici !
<davmor2> pitti: does that make you the anti seb128 ?
<pitti> davmor2: koennte sein :)
<pitti> desrt: hey Ryan, how are you?
<desrt> pitti: hi!  pretty good
<desrt> brain recovering nicely after a week of drowning in another language
<pitti> desrt: do you see any reason to not commit the cgmanager bits to systemd-shim trunk, and making a new release? we're shipping that now in Ubuntu, and would like to ship it in Debian too
<pitti> desrt: Esperanto? :-)
<desrt> yup
<desrt> just went to a week-long event.... no english spoken there....
<pitti> desrt: trÃ¨s cool !
<desrt> so ya
<desrt> we can merge that stuff now
<desrt> i actually told hallyn that i'd be OK if you pushed it (since you have commit access)
<pitti> desrt: it's not perfect yet (old sessions don't get cleaned up sometimes), but it's workign well enough
<desrt> ya... the stop thing is hard
<pitti> desrt: ah ok, that got lost in the Chinese whispers then
<desrt> because you stop the session unit, and we don't know the cgroup path (ie: under which user)
<desrt> so we can't properly kill it
 * Sweetsha1k smirks rolling through the backlog.
<darkxst> didrocks, ping
<didrocks> darkxst: please don't use contextless ping, just ask ;)
<didrocks> (especially if you are not around to ask the next question)
<darkxst> didrocks, so have been chatting with tracker upstream, unit tests are 100% guaranteed to pass (they won't do a release with these broken)
<didrocks> darkxst: ok, so we can run them in our infra?
<darkxst> functional tests are a bit iffy, at best its like 90% that will pass
<didrocks> do we know which ones are flaky? can they be filtered out?
<darkxst> didrocks, I already hooked up unit tests, but under autopkgtest since they require install tracker to run
<didrocks> they are not really unit tests I guess then, but sounds good to me :)
<darkxst> didrocks, I know which ones are flaky right now, but seems like not properly maintained upstream
<didrocks> darkxst: they don't plan to maintain them? not sure it's a really good sign of quality for main then
<darkxst> didrocks, seems to be a case of too many tests
<didrocks> darkxst: would be a good contribution to upstream as well to try to separate reliable ones to flaky ones
<darkxst> unit tests are maintained, functional tests can lag a bit
<didrocks> and we can hook them up in autopkgtests
<darkxst> yeh though I don't quite get the distinction here, from my quick look through test cases seems to be alot of duplication between unit tests and functional tests
<didrocks> darkxst: so, if they don't want to maintain them, why not proposing to remove them upstream?
<didrocks> bad tests or unlooked tests are worse than not having tests
<darkxst> didrocks, unmaintained is probably not the right word, but a functional test failure doesn't seem to be a release blocker
<didrocks> darkxst: do we know how many tests are failing right now? (like the % on the total number?)
<didrocks> we can have a threshold in that case
<darkxst> probably 6-7 fail, 1-2 just hang and timeout
<darkxst> not too sure how many tests there are, but probably over 100
<didrocks> darkxst: ok, maybe in a first approach, let's just blacklist the inconsistant one
<didrocks> at least, if there is a big breakage, we can then detect them
<darkxst> didrocks, unit tests should catch that, in fact they already caught there first breakage on build #2 with the glib update
<didrocks> darkxst: well, it's to protect you, then, if you are fine in having something that can be broken without detection and think the unit tests are enough, good for me if you wired them up
<darkxst> didrocks, the unit tests, go well beyond unit testing from what I can see.
<didrocks> darkxst: from your descriptions, yeah, I just gave a quick look and they are clealy not unit tests :p
<didrocks> so yeah, let's ensure that's wired up and that should be enough
<darkxst> didrocks, they are https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/view/Utopic/view/AutoPkgTest/job/utopic-adt-tracker/
<didrocks> darkxst: are they? I keep seeing: # TOTAL: 0
<didrocks> but yeah, some logs shows them passing
<didrocks> however, the counter doesn't work :/
<darkxst> right, the counter on stdout is broken
 * didrocks sighs
<didrocks> and upstream would say it's not important as well?
<darkxst> didrocks, if a "unit" tests fails that is important, and it should trigger a failure regardless of the counters
<didrocks> darkxst: yeah, but it's still a sign that details don't seem to matter to upstream, which is reflecting on the global quality of the product
<didrocks> that's not a very good sign for something we have to commit to main
<darkxst> didrocks, it could also be fallout from switching to the newever glib.mk testing framework
<darkxst> tracker 1.0 branch is still actively maintained, and should be for the foreseeable future, and api/abi should be pretty stable from here on in
<didrocks> yeah, I'm more concern about other moving pieces breaking them and not being catchup
<didrocks> and the fact that the tests are in a seemly weird tests don't give the right signal
<didrocks> but again, as long as ubuntu desktop doesn't use it and you are happy in Ubuntu GNOME to take the charge of maintaining, I'm fine with it being in main
<pitti> desrt: pushed to master FYI; want to cut a release?
<pitti> desrt: or perhaps let's wait a bit until cgmanager is in Debian, perhaps we'll get some more fixes by then
<darkxst> didrocks, tests aside, it really is way ahead of where it was a year or two ago,
<darkxst> (stability wise)
<didrocks> darkxst: yeah, just fix the other issues then, and I'll +1
<desrt> pitti: i wouldn't mind getting the Stop thing working either...
<desrt> pitti: could do it by walking the cgroup tree to find the group with the matching name....
<pitti> desrt: I think this might not even be an issue of removing the cgroup, but just to invoke the cgroups' cleanup notification?
<darkxst> didrocks, sorting out the COPYING.LGPL that should be in next weeks 1.0.3
<didrocks> great :)
<desrt> pitti: from what i understand, the entire point of this cgroup exercise is to have a reliable way to kill off a group of processes when the session exits
<desrt> so ya.... implementing Stop is kinda _the_ point
<pitti> desrt: if I log out of a session, the cgroup (like session-c4.scope) goes away, but it's still in loginctl as "State=closing"
<pitti> desrt: yes, of course; but that's not even what I meant
<desrt> hallyn wanted it for another reason to do with users being able to create containers.... so he's happy now, sure.... but in theory, i think Stop is probably pretty important
<darkxst> shlibs.local looks all correct to me, I don't see anything obsolete in there, and ricotz says the rpath thing is a non-issue
<desrt> hmmm
<didrocks> darkxst: why is it a non issue? We don't accept rpath in ubuntu apart if there is some real good reasons to have it
<darkxst> ricotz, ^?
<ricotz> didrocks, i commented on the bug, which was not completely right
<didrocks> ricotz: ah fine, I'll have a look once you reassign (and the rest is ready) then
<ricotz> although there are no rpath references in the source
<ricotz> and config.rpath is created due some outdated autotools mojo
<ricotz> git master doesnt pick it up anymore
<didrocks> great, so let's wait for next release :)
<ricotz> hmm, i guess we are going with 1.0.x here
<ricotz> git master is 1.1.x though
<pitti> mterry: welcome back! had some nice vacations?
<mterry> pitti, yeah I was just camping with friends and family.  relaxing  :)
<mterry> pitti, hopefully that deja-dup upload clears the blockage
<pitti> mterry: and thanks for the deja-dup fix
<mterry> (thanks to Laney)
<pitti> mterry: oh, I was actually concerned the other way around -- glib breaking deja-dup :)
<seb128> mterry, hey ;-)
<Laney> that glib is removed anyway
<mterry> pitti, :) no thankfully just a silly warning message
<pitti> I kind of like having a working backup
<mterry> Laney, oh ok
<seb128> mterry, I +1ed your settings changes
<Laney> but yeah, it has a new warning which makes some tests sad
<Laney> so still good
<pitti> mterry: btw, I switched from rsnapshot (which I'd used for like 10 years) to duplicity a few months ago; love it!
<mterry> seb128, awesome thanks!  Now the blocker for that whole silo is the underlying config changes to livecd-rootfs
<mterry> pitti, oh really!  Neat
<pitti> mterry: camping sounds great, had nice weather?
<mterry> pitti, yeah it was actually nicely cloud-covered -- no rain, but not too much sun
<pitti> mterry: yeah, I configured deja-dup for my wife's computer a year or so ago; not quite flexible enough for me as a UI, but the duplicity backend is great
<mterry> pitti, yeah you aren't DD's target audience  ;)
<pitti> mterry: (not a critique -- if the UI was so flexible it would be too hard for most users :) )
<pitti> mterry: well, actually, the only feature I'm missing is specifying an --exclude-globbing-filelist
<mterry> pitti, mmm yes, I believe there is a feature request bug for that that I've been ignoring for the past many years
<pitti> mterry: yeah, no biggie; I like cron and CLI
<pitti> mterry: but I was quite amazed how easy and fire&forget it is, on my wife's PC
<pitti> mterry: she doesn't have quite my discipline with keeping $HOME neatly organized, and I don't want to carefully go and blacklist stuff, so DD is just great
<mterry> :)
<Laney> since we got half of gstreamer 1.4 already, I'm going to look at the rest
<Laney> happy days
<seb128> Laney, thanks
<seb128> Laney, shrug though on the people complaining about that sync
<Laney> yeah...
<Laney> it's not even a transition, just a bug
<Laney> not that anyone even investigated it yet
<seb128> no
<seb128> they claim they are too busy for that
<seb128> how constructive!
<Laney> back in the day we'd have taken all of the point releases, then we'd have found the issue sooner ;-)
<seb128> hehe
<mvo_> seb128: would https://launchpadlibrarian.net/180511188/gst-plugins-base1.0_1.4.0-1_1.4.0-1ubuntu1.diff.gz and https://launchpadlibrarian.net/180510137/gstreamer1.0_1.4.0-1_1.4.0-1ubuntu1.diff.gz be ok with you? I'm working toward makeing apt-get install ubuntu-sdk-libs-dev:$target work and the git stuff is not multiarch enabled yet
<seb128> mvo_, what do you mean by git stuff there?
<mvo_> seb128: gir stuff
<mvo_> seb128: sorry, autotyping :)
<seb128> oh
<seb128> how does it work for other libs? I can't believe none of our gobject libs are multiarched
<seb128> but having -dev depends on the gir is standard rule in Debian
<mvo_> seb128: the libs are multi-arch, this is about being able to install a cross build environment, so the -dev lib needs to be multi-arch friendly
<mvo_> seb128: sorry, I should have mentioned that in the changelog
<seb128> mvo_, well, as said you are going to have that issue with gobject based lib
<seb128> dev depends on gir is standard
<seb128> also we are in sync with debian for those packages
<seb128> those changes look lik a local hack rather than a proper solution?
<mvo_> seb128: the proper solution is to make gir1.2-* package multiarch capable
<mvo_> seb128: but I'm taking one step at a time
<mvo_> seb128: the problem is that gir has arch dependant typelibs but a single path
<mvo_> seb128: we need triplet paths
<seb128> mvo_, can you talk to slomo about getting that one step in Debian so we can stay in sync?
<mvo_> seb128: but that probably(?) means that all the loads need adjustment? i.e. perl/python etc. or is there a single loader codebase :) ? if so, I'm happy to start hacking on that
<seb128> not sure if anyone has looked at multiarching gir, did you try asking pitti?
<seb128> he knows that stack quite well since he's one of the maintainers
<pitti> I haven't looked into this
<seb128> k
<seb128> mvo_, still, changing that depends to a recommends look wrong, so -1 from me
<mvo_> pitti: do you know if there is a single loading code or if each binding implements this? the path lookup
<seb128> as said you are going to hit that issue with any lib shipping a gir
<mvo_> seb128: well, we are not shipping any other gir libs in ubuntu-sdk-libs
<pitti> mvo_: no, (hopefull) all bindings will use libgirepository, which is built by gobject-introspection
<mvo_> seb128: those are the only offenders
<seb128> and that seems a workaround, likely to create bugs and add divergence on debian
<pitti> mvo_: so only that library does the .typelib lookup and parsing
<mvo_> seb128: well, patching libgirepository and multi-arching the gir packages is also a diversion and may trigger bugs (and a even bigger one). the alternative might be to simply drop the libs from ubuntu-sdk-libs-dev
<mvo_> pitti: thanks, I check that out then
<seb128> mvo_, well, multiarching should be done in debian for those
<seb128> but otherwise +1 from dropping the depends then
<mvo_> seb128: right, I think we agree that the proper fix is gir multiarch but that is some way away
<seb128> mvo_, sorry, it's our weekly meeting time
<seb128> hey desktopers
<mvo_> ok
<seb128> it's meeting time ;-)
<seb128> qengho, Sweetshark, Laney, tkamppeter, desrt, attente, larsu, didrocks, FJKong, willcooke, hey
<willcooke> \o/
<seb128> let's start by welcoming our new manager ;-)
<seb128> willcooke, welcome on board!
<desrt> willcooke: what's up?
<willcooke> thank you very much
<larsu> welcome willcooke!
<willcooke> Hi guys, sorry I still havent got round to meeting you all 1 to 1 yet.
<willcooke> I will get that sorted as a matter of priority
<didrocks> hey!
<Sweetshark> o/
<Sweetshark> welcome willcooke!
<willcooke> thanks Sweetshark
<seb128> willcooke, did you want to say anything else before we start our usual team roundtable?
<seb128> we have a slot after the roundtable for extra discussions ;-)
<willcooke> I don't have much to say right now, other than what I've already said about 1:1 meetings with everyone.
<seb128> k, makes sense
<seb128> willcooke, thanks
<seb128> ok, let's get started then
<seb128> qengho, hey, you can start ;-)
<seb128> no qengho?
<seb128> Sweetshark, your turn then!
<Sweetshark> - ongoing: create a docker/saltstacked ubuntu tinderbox for easy deployment upstream, using http://tinderbox.libreoffice.org/MASTER/status.html and http://skyfromme.wordpress.com/2013/08/03/tb3-more-efficient-tinderboxing/
<Sweetshark> - ongoing: reenabling tests on 4.3 -- might be fixed by --disable-mergelibs
<Sweetshark> - travel coord. for Bern (LibreOffice conference) and Montevideo (CISL Avanza)
<Sweetshark> - cleaned up/merged changelogs for 4.2.4 security SRU
<Sweetshark> - waiting for 4.2.6.2 tag (today) for 14.04 SRU
<Sweetshark> - looked into bug 1170035: unfortunately a mess to solve with -l10n split out and *.desktop files having all translations in one file (which is not in an -l10n package) :/
<Sweetshark> - various bugzilla and launchpad prowling
<Sweetshark> - leading the ESC call, provided some LibreOffice 4.2 vs. 4.3 bug stats: http://nabble.documentfoundation.org/bjoern-michaelsen-canonical-com-minutes-of-ESC-call-2014-07-17-td4115852.html -- likely will blogify those ~around 4.3.0 upstream release
<Sweetshark> - trying (and mostly failing) to ignore the heat
<Sweetshark> EOF
<seb128> Sweetshark, let me know when you get some SRU ready/if you need some sponsoring
<seb128> didrocks, seems like you are not alone playing with docker ;-)
<didrocks> looking so :)
<Sweetshark> seb128: sure, will need some time riping in the PPA still
<seb128> Sweetshark, thanks
<seb128> k
<seb128> Laney, hey, your turn
<Laney> hai
<Laney> â¢ Sponsor xdg-utils for ochosi, provide advice on the sru process
<Laney> â¢ Update glib, find bugs (pcre3 in Debian breaks tests, gmutex native impl breaks shotwell)
<Laney> â Merge tracker for test fix due to new warning
<Laney> â Patch deja-dup likewise
<Sweetshark> didrocks: kepp you hand of my docker *sternlook*
<Laney> â¢ Find patch for harfbuzz/myanmar crash (#1303516), upload + SRU
<Laney> â¢ u-s-s
<Laney> â Work a lot on test fixes, seems green now
<Laney> â Fix, not optimally due to SDK bugs, bug with scrolling in sound panel
<Laney> â On jd_strand's advice, revert apparmor profile to fix sound playback
<Laney> â Increase spacing in the main grid
<Laney> â Reviews/pushback on scope creep in the schemas
<Laney> â¢ DMB: Finish zequence's mail application, flush a large set of updates to all flavour packagesets - the script hadn't been run for several months if not a year.
<Laney> â¢ Starting to look at gst 1.4 now that we got the base packages in Utopic by syncing (good done, bad not yet)
<Laney> â¢ Off Thursday + Friday this week, then GUADEC, then a trip to China(!)
<Laney> â
<seb128> Laney, enjoy the days off before the travelling ;-)
<seb128> well done on the harfbuzz patch, installer bugs are not nice
<Laney> we've already consulted the Good Beer Guide :P
<seb128> Laney, thanks!
<seb128> lol
<seb128> good thinking ;-)
<qengho> Ah, I missed the beep. I'm here.
<seb128> qengho, ok, your turn then!
<qengho> - chromium-browser 36.0.1985.125 preparation,
<qengho> -- fixing webapps patches for package,
<qengho> -- and fixing mir patches for testing.
<qengho> EOF
<seb128> qengho, what's the status for chromium 36? it has been some week where you say it's ready for upload
<seb128> is that blocked on the security team?
<qengho> That was 35. Security has it.
<seb128> not utopic though?!
<seb128> oh, well, not other series either
<seb128> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/chromium-browser
<seb128> so blocked on security? did you try to ping them? what is blocking? can we help to unblock?
<qengho> That's true, I could have found someone else to upload to U. :(
<qengho> I hear from CCC on #security that it's on his list, but I haven't harassed him.
<seb128> ok
<seb128> let's wait a ping and ping jdstrand or chrisccoulson then
<seb128> thanks
<willcooke> qengho, seb128 - let me know if you want me to take care of that
<seb128> willcooke, well, I don't know for how long it's blocked on them but it seems to be a while, that upload was ready to go a week ago already
<seb128> willcooke, if you want to check with jdstrand was is blocking that would be nice
<willcooke> seb128, ack
<qengho> Thanks.
<seb128> qengho, thanks
<seb128> willcooke, thanks as well ;-)
<willcooke> np
<seb128> tkamppeter, hey, your turn
<seb128> no tkamppeter?
<seb128> desrt, ok, your turn then
<desrt> hey
<desrt> was on vacation all of last week, and i don't remember _too_ much about the week before that
<desrt> but git log says that i landed the gmutex-natively-on-linux stuff along with the big performance improvements to GDBus for fixed-sized arrays
<desrt> i'd say that this sounds nice, but Laney already tells me otherwise ;)
<Laney> did you expect it to make working apps into non working ones? :)
<Laney> even if it turns out to be shotwell being wrong
<willcooke> :)
<desrt> after that i started taking larsu's comments about my markup parser stuff into account and did a fair bit of work for fleshing out the interface to something that we could think about landing... found a few thorns on the API meanwhile, but we talked about that today and came up with a good plan
<desrt> Laney: who knows.... maybe out there somewhere is a non-working app that now works properly, too :)
<Laney> anyways, the comments on the bug said that the speed improvements can be quite nice
<Laney> so it'll be a win in the end
<desrt> Laney: thanks for the support :)
<desrt> eof for me.
<seb128> desrt, thanks
<seb128> attente, hey, your turn
<tkamppeter> - system-config-printer: Work on driver download hanging when initiated out of the D-Bus service (used by other printer setup tools).
<tkamppeter> - Mentoring of GSoC students, midterm evaluations
<tkamppeter> - Some organizational stuff for OpenPrinting Summit.
<tkamppeter> - Bugs.
<attente> :)
<seb128> lol
<seb128> tkamppeter, thanks
<seb128> attente, your turn now then I guess ;-)
<attente> hey hey
<attente> trying to do dynamic language switching again, got it somewhat working after using an insecure apparmor policy
<attente> so working on a separate system settings service that will live on the session bus and provide read-only access to the current accountsservice user's properties
<desrt> attente: why not in something like g-s-d or so?
<attente> on the device?
<desrt> hmm.  don't we have something like this there?
<desrt> seems weird that we would have a separate daemon only for this one thing.
<desrt> let's talk later...
<seb128> yeah, we don't have a g-s-d equivalent in there
<larsu> we have indicator-* there though
<seb128> but might be a good topic for when we are together at GUADEC
<larsu> one more won't hurt!
<desrt> seb128: good call
<larsu> </sarcasm>
<desrt> larsu just got an elbow in the side for that comment.... before i saw the </sarcasm>...
<seb128> attente, I did a landing of u-g-m to utopic with the 3 branches that were ready
<larsu> desrt: I forgive you
<attente> seb128: great, thanks!
<seb128> attente, the SRU are still on my list, trying to get to those this week
<seb128> yw
<seb128> attente, anything else?
<attente> seb128, that's it from me
<seb128> ok
<seb128> attente, when do you travel?
 * Sweetshark hands out a new set of elbows to spend to everyone.
<seb128> not a topic meeting so moving on ;-)
<seb128> larsu, hey, your turn!
<larsu> hey
<larsu> I wasn't very productive last week because I didn't feel very well
<attente> seb128: friday evening, arriving sat morning
<larsu> I did manage to look over attente's branch and test it on my machine
<larsu> thanks again attente
<seb128> attente, k, safe travel!
<larsu> also talked to Company how we could have a better situation with o-s, but he says it'll be hard
<seb128> larsu, oh, I hope you are feeling better
<desrt> (btw: for those who didn't guess, i'm on CEST for the next days...)
<larsu> seb128: thanks
<seb128> desrt, next week as well
<desrt> seb128: eeveryone already knows that part, though :)
<attente> larsu, seb128, thanks :)
<larsu> I've helped desrt again with the xml reader stuff (review, api talk)
<larsu> made adwaita (and other themes) not use overlay scrollbars because they don't have the background hacks
<seb128> larsu, we should discuss o-s with willcooke, but let's not do that today, he's just starting and it's a bit out of topic for the weekly roundtable
<larsu> seb128: yep, I agree
<willcooke> kk
<larsu> and some minor things that I don't remember :)
<seb128> willcooke, basically the overlay scrollbar are quite hackish and not easy to maintain, they create work and problems
<larsu> like, dropped the gtk hacks from evince
<larsu> and lots of discussion about various things
<larsu> eof I think
<seb128> willcooke, they also only work for gtk apps
<willcooke> right
<seb128> we were wondering if we should consider dropping the feature since it's inconsistant
<larsu> and not for every gtk app....
<seb128> that was  a summary so you have some context
<seb128> let's discuss that another topic
<seb128> larsu, thanks
<seb128> ups
<seb128> "let's discuss that another time"
<seb128> rather
<seb128> didrocks, hey, your turn!
<didrocks> * Continue adding integration tests to ubuntu developer tools center. Up to 250 small tests (~40s) and 12 large tests (~640s)
<didrocks> * Some fixes and refactoring in the way we execute and run default frameworks with a full new set of tests and better large tests abstractions.
<didrocks> * Better launcher icons handling.
<didrocks> * Evaluate lxc and docker for running medium ubuntu developer tools center tests inside that destructible environment. Choose docker.
<didrocks> * Read and rampup on docker documentation and create an ubuntu-desktop compatible image (multiple quirks).
<didrocks> * Start (on-going) integrating that image to the medium tests (different surprises when doing that :p)
<didrocks> * Sync up with Stephane on China trip preparation
<didrocks> * Some sponsoring (xdg-utils on utopic) and MIR (Tracker) discussions
<didrocks> * Minor changes to http://people.canonical.com/~platform/design/ for the design team.
<didrocks> * ah, and grasp chinese visa from Lyon's consulate \o/
<didrocks> EOF
<larsu> seb128: oh I forgot: I looked into Trevinho's scrolling issues, but haven't come very far yet
<larsu> sorry didrocks :P
<seb128> larsu, k
<seb128> didrocks, the launcher handling ... you use the dbus api now?
<didrocks> seb128: no, as it won't work for our case
<didrocks> it's only for installing, with progress, and so on
<didrocks> (and tight to apt only)
<didrocks> but now, I put it in a more logical place than always latest
<didrocks> so, that workarounds the bug until Trevinho fixes it
<seb128> k
<seb128> didrocks, let us know how docker is working for you ;-)
<seb128> didrocks, thanks
<didrocks> yeah, it's "interesting" at times
<seb128> FJKong, hey! still around? wanting to share something with us this week?
 * didrocks keeps spawing containers and removing them
<FJKong> hi seb128,
<FJKong> hi willcooke and team,
<FJKong> last week, I finished new feature about sogou Input method for Kylin. some bugs reported by QA were fixed already.
<FJKong> this week I will keep on fixing bugs on that. thank you.
<seb128> FJKong, thanks
<seb128> I think it means it's my turn
<seb128> â¢ 4 days week (had friday as a vac)
<seb128> â¢ spend some time on travelling preparation still (got my visa for China, yeah!)
<seb128> â¢ quite some ubuntu-system-settings code reviews and testing
<seb128> â revert from apparmor changes that got deferred
<seb128> â conffile cleanups on upgrade
<seb128> â some tests improvements and bugfixes
<seb128> â lock screen work
<seb128> â bluetooth panel refactoring
<seb128> â¢ usual bugs/sru/sponsoring queue reviews
<seb128> â¢ some SRUs and sponsoring
<seb128>  
<seb128> that's it for this week (lot of discussions and small debugging on the side as well, as usual)
<seb128>  
<seb128> ok, anything else to discuss?
<willcooke> hi FJKong
<FJKong> willcooke: here
<willcooke> sorry - FJKong was just replying to you hello :P)
<willcooke> :)
<willcooke> I'm lagging :)
<seb128> seems like we have no other topic
<seb128> it's a wrap then
<seb128> thanks everyone!
<didrocks> yeah, see you guys! thanks :)
<Laney> thanks!
<seb128> see you at guadec for some of you
<FJKong> willcooke: :)  see you soon
<seb128> oh, maybe we should skip the next meeting (and the one after that as well?)
<seb128> not sure if I'm going to be around at the conf for the meeting
<willcooke> FJKong, indeed - really looking to it
<didrocks> yeah, and we know the quality of conf network :p
<FJKong> welcome you guys to China, Have fun
<seb128> oh, but willcooke can lead now
<seb128> willcooke, I guess you are going to be around at the meeting time next week?
<seb128> willcooke, some of us are going to be at guadec, but in case others still want to do the roundtable
<seb128> if not we can just skip the meeting
<seb128> (we might need to skip the week after that as well since a bunch of us are going to be in China then)
<Laney> desrt loves to chair :P
 * desrt moves Laney to the end of the list
<seb128> lol
<Laney> thanks boss!
<desrt> hmm
 * desrt moves Laney to the front of the list
<Laney> >:( worst boss ever
<seb128> yeah, I don't know why didrocks complains about the position
<seb128> early sucks if you forgot to prepare your notes ;-)
<seb128> can as well go at the end
<didrocks> because it's unfair, I'm in this team way before most of people here ;)
 * desrt watches seb128 wonder why didrocks likes to complain (regardless of topic) ;)
<didrocks> and I come prepared :p
<Laney> true that
<willcooke> sorry - otp - will reply asap
 * Laney gives didrocks some travel to book
<Laney> A LOT OF TRAVEL
<didrocks> Laney: ok, see you next month! :p
<seb128> desrt, lol
<desrt> seb128: takes one to know one
<seb128> willcooke, don't worry, it's about next week meeting, can be sorted any time this week
<seb128> desrt, indeed
<seb128> mvo_, could you review https://code.launchpad.net/~mterry/qtmir/packaging-fixes/+merge/226693 ? ;-)
<seb128> "Using virtual package names in Conflicts/Replaces lines for clarity and adaptability. You can just provide the virtual names rather than specific ones, and apt will figure it out."
<seb128> is that true? ;-)
<seb128> ok, calling it a day, have a nice evening everyone!
<Laney> bye!
<didrocks> you too guys!
 * didrocks goes as well with this 4 tests running successfully in my docker image :)
<didrocks> (and with 3 lines of code difference from the integration tests ;))
<didrocks> more to come tomorrow \o/
<Sweetshark> didrocks: hey, I have some more tests for you to run in _your_ docker image ;>
<didrocks> Sweetshark: ahah, don't even try :p
<didrocks> Sweetshark: I still install libroffice inside my docker image!
<didrocks> so, be happy ;)
<Sweetshark> didrocks: they are good ones. They make the room cozy by making your machine emit some heat.
<didrocks> I'm on the balconee, see, no roomâ¦ not possible :p
<Sweetshark> didrocks: if you have libreoffice installed, can you run autopkgtests on them?
<Sweetshark> didrocks: oh, global warming! its you!
<didrocks> ahah ;)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, qengho, re chromium - I wasn't sure how soon cr36 was going to be ready
<chrisccoulson> if it's going to be several days yet, then I'll upload the current version
<qengho> chrisccoulson: I think it will be ready Thuraday.
<chrisccoulson> qengho, thanks
<Laney> Sweetshark: seen https://www.gov.uk/government/news/open-document-formats-selected-to-meet-user-needs ?
<chrisccoulson> qengho, I think that 35.0.1916.153-0ubuntu1~pkg1029 (utopic) is a lower version than 35.0.1916.153-0ubuntu1.14.04.0~pkg1027 (trusty)
<czajkowski> Laney: great news
<chrisccoulson> I'll upload it for now, on the basis that it's probably worth waiting until thursday to upload cr36 to the other releases
<czajkowski> chrisccoulson: you having many crashes on utopic on chromium ?
<chrisccoulson> czajkowski, no, I only use firefox
<chrisccoulson> actually, that's a bit of a lie
<chrisccoulson> I use chrome dev too
<chrisccoulson> czajkowski, that's probably one for qengho though :)
<willcooke> @ next weeks team meeting - yes, happy to run it while you're out at guadec, and indeed for ever more.
<meetingology> willcooke: Error: "next" is not a valid command.
<Laney> laters potaters
<willcooke> l8r Laney
<Sweetshark> Laney: yes, just about when you wrote that ... ;)
<Laney> thought you might have ...
<didrocks> later guys!
<pmcgowan> geesh
<czajkowski> Trevinho: ello again, so stil running into same issue and trying to restart the session on my admin account, can still loig in fine via guest. on tty1  I've been running GSETTINGS_BACKEND command theen switching to the root account and back to restart ligh session but it's not working today, should I log in first to admin account and then do it?
<willcooke> off to catch the train home.  speak to y'all in the morning.  czajkowski let me know how you get on with that bug.
<czajkowski> wastl: oh if I coulr report the bug life would be easier :)
<czajkowski> stuid tab completion
<mvo_> lool: hi, a quick (and potentially silly) question. I'm trying to make apt-get install ubuntu-sdk-libs-dev:armhf work and ran into the issue that gir1.2-* is not multi-arch enabled so not co-installable etc. but libqt5ebkit5-dev pulls in libgstreamer-plugins-base1.0-dev which pulls in a gir1.2 lib which then breaks the multi-arch install. would the world break if I make libgstreamer-plugin-base1.0-dev a recommends of libgstreamer-plugins
<mvo_> -base1.0-dev? I assume it would because buildds do not pull in recommends(?). the alternative to make the gir a recommend of libgstreamer-plugins-base1.0-dev was not well received by seb128 so I wonder what we can do. (short of making gir multiarch and rebuilding all packages :)
<mvo_> weeh, that was long
<lool> mvo_: hey
<lool> mvo_: hold on, there is a lot at once  :-)
<mvo_> lool: yeah, take your time
<mvo_> lool: its long and complicated :)
<lool> mvo_: first, I guess making more things multiarch is always nice, so if we can fix gir for being multiarch, that'd be nice, but I suspect it's tricky or it would already be done; I guess it's something like dlopen() stuff that cant be cross-arch, or generate a C file and run it
<lool> mvo_: then, indeed, any recommends can probably be ignored for the matter of pulling the right stuff in; I guess you could apt-get install --no-install-recommends ubuntu-sdk-libs-dev:armhf, but you already know all of this
<mvo_> lool: yeah, I haven't looked at it, this is the last piece I need to fix and making gir multiarch is a big hammer for just two this one package
<lool> mvo_: last, it's worth checking if it's truly a same arch dep, or whether any gir tool would fit the bill
<mvo_> lool: unfortunately gir is arch dependent
<lool> right
<lool> mvo_: if there's a recommends, then this is probably a case of we want some pieces on the developer desktop, but it's not needed for buildds, so one approach could be to split the package
<lool> e.g. -dev-bin or something
<mvo_> lool: so I want to get it out of the dependencies of ubuntu-sdk-libs if possible without breaking too much and was wondering if you might know more about libqt5webkit5-dev
<lool> but that's usually tricky to get backwards-compatible
<lool> I know next to nothing about libqtwebkit
<lool> I suspect it pulls gst to render videos, like anyone would guess
<lool> but it seems odd that you'd need to know about the implementation
<lool> mvo_: I find the dependency of qtwebkit on gst suspicious
<lool> mvo_: the current webkit .pc files indeed references -lgstreamer in the Libs.private
<lool> mvo_: but I find it very suspicious that you'd have to know about the backend implementation and explicitely link your qtwebkit app to that
<lool> mvo_: I've unpacked the .deb, and these were the only matches
<lool> it's not even listed in Requires...
<mvo_> lool: oh, great, so we might get rid of it :-D
<lool> mvo_: I have vague memories of Libs vs Libs.private, but my brain has bitrotted there; it would seem to me that Libs.private is only for static linking?
<mvo_> lool: but it means I need to patch the .pc file probably and hope no reverse-depends break? but I can check that
<mvo_> lool: I don't remember, need to check that myself
<lool> mvo_: it's possible that we dont care about Libs.private and that the dep is bogus
<lool> mvo_: so I checked pkg-config, and Libs.private is indeed just for static linking
<lool> mvo_: if I remember Debian Policy correctly, but again .... , I dont think we require a strict dep there
<lool> I'd certainly vote for dropping the dep
<mvo_> lool: awsome, thanks a bunch for your help. I test it in a ppa and get back
<lool> mvo_: but certainly there must be experience in the desktop team on similar situations with Libs.private; I'm sure seb would know
<mvo_> lool: he shut my original proposal down to demote the gir* stuff to recommends :P so he needs to help me finding a alternative solution now ;)
<lool> hehe
<lool> mvo_: I'm sure he knows which kind of deps or whether we need one at all for Libs.private
<mvo_> lool: thanks again for your help! I will send him a mail
<Trevinho> czajkowski: set the display variable to :0
<robert_ancell> charles, how do you do SRUs for the indicators? J ust chuck stuff in debian/patches or make a new release?
<larsu> robert_ancell: we make new releases
<robert_ancell> larsu, so I should just propose to a branch?
<larsu> yep
<larsu> to the 14.04 branch
<robert_ancell> cool
<arrrghhh> hello.  just updated the ubuntu install on my father's machine, and he is complaining about gnucash and the reports not working properly.  He wants to downgrade, but I don't think it's a good idea.  Is there a way to run an older version of a package when there's a newer one in the repo's?  I tried to compile 2.4.15 for him, as he said 2.6.x is no good.  It ran for a while, but some update from Ubuntu he said removed it...
<sarnold> arrrghhh: look for 'pin' in apt_preferences manpage
<sarnold> arrrghhh: there's no gaurantee about how well the software will work out, but there's the mechanism to make it happen :)
<arrrghhh> hm
<arrrghhh> so much work for something so silly... thx
<sarnold> yeah, it isn't expected to happen often..
<arrrghhh> he has some REALLY strong feelings about how they redid their report system, and based on some bug reports others feel the same as he does... but GnuCash is saying that's how it should be, and it was actually a bug with how it was working before in 2.4 lol.
<sarnold> heh, I've been on both sides of that before.
<arrrghhh> ditto, and gnucash is not going to fix it seemingly... or even provide the old report functionality.
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-07-23
<pitti> Good morning
<pabloh> Can somebody recommend an lightweight display manager? (I've been using Qingy for a while but it's hard to get it working on some hardware)
<RAOF> lightdm? :)
<mvo> pitti: good morning! what do you reckon are the chances for https://launchpadlibrarian.net/180534575/gobject-introspection_1.40.0-2ubuntu1_1.40.0-2ubuntu2.diff.gz to go upstream into debian? it seems to work fine from my limited testing, the only issue is that the gir libs need adjusting now in their gir1.2-foo.install file (/usr/lib/girepository-1.0/* -> /usr/lib/*/girepositoriy-1.0/*)
<pitti> mvo: for debian, no problem; the hardcoded /usr/lib/girepository-1.0/ is a bit ugly for upstreaming, though
<pitti> mvo: I'll commit our changes to Debian
<mvo> pitti: hold on a sec
<pitti> mvo: err, wait
<pitti> mvo: are the typelibs actually platform dependenct?
<mvo> pitti: this will cause ftbfs for the packages that build with the new gojbect-introspection
<mvo> pitti: the fix is trivial, just updating the install path
<pitti> mvo: in any way, this requires a note to ...
<pitti> yes
<mvo> pitti: if you think thats ok, I'm all for it :)
<pitti> ... d|u-devel-announce@ at least, and a transiiton
<mvo> pitti: I don't know how platform dependent the typelibs really are, but they are different on the arches, not sure what plays a role here
<mvo> pitti: I can prepare a ppa with this change and test build of the rdepends to ensure we don't run into nasty corner cases. or do you think the gir stuff is all well behaved?
<didrocks> hey mvo, bonjour pitti!
<mvo> hey didrocks, good morning
<pitti> mvo: well, at this stage (RTM) testing can never hurt, although I'm not sure how much introspection we actually use on touch (probably very little)
<mvo> pitti: very little indeed, just 2 gstreamer libs right now iirc
<pitti> mvo: so, the announcement to the devs is the main thing to do then
<mvo> pitti: all right, let me draft something this morning.
<willcooke> morning all
<willcooke> seb128, Chromium 35 is in.  I think ChrisCoulson took care of it
<willcooke> 36 has issues
<didrocks> morning willcooke
<willcooke> hey didrocks
<willcooke> didrocks, are you UTC +1 ?
<didrocks> willcooke: yeah, just one hour in the future compared to you :)
<willcooke> so is it 8:13 for you?
<didrocks> no, it's 9:13, with dailight saving
<didrocks> daylight*
<willcooke> ahh, ok - so you're still an hour ahead of me then
<didrocks> yep
<willcooke> didrocks, the reason I ask is that I really need to catch up with you, but I don't think I'll be able to do it until say 3pm your time
<willcooke> is that ok>
<willcooke> ?
<didrocks> willcooke: that's fine, no worry! I usually go for running at lunch time :)
<willcooke> hrm, you know what didrocks - we should have continued our journey down to Oz & NZ and paid those guys a visit, since we're half way there anyway
<RAOF> willcooke: Come down to Hobart, it's lovely!
<didrocks> willcooke: ahah, that would have been a really neat idea. And you can even tell this is for team building to meet robert ancell :)
<willcooke> RAOF, didrocks  - I'll see if rickspencer3 will pay :D
<didrocks> heh
<willcooke> right - bbiab, school run
<didrocks> waow 600 on /lib, don't ask why I couldn't log in into that container
<didrocks> the base image is right though
<czajkowski> aloha
 * didrocks purges and redownload to see if the container is corrupted
<didrocks> hey czajkowski!
<didrocks> waow, the container is really corruptedâ¦
 * didrocks tries back to build it himself
<didrocks> and relaunch a remote build
<czajkowski> didrocks: gooood morning you happy chappy!
<didrocks> czajkowski: did you leave to your conference already?
<czajkowski> didrocks: yup arrived last night in Munich so at todays hackathon and lots of Ubuntu machines being used over here
<czajkowski> nice to see it being used out and about by random people
<czajkowski> that table is currently hacking mongodb ubuntu and censors for the the day
<didrocks> waow, excellent!
<czajkowski> yup will try and get this page updated during the day https://www.hackerleague.org/hackathons/munich-iot-hackathon-planning/participations but then you cna see what is built
<czajkowski> also a very useful site!
<Laney> hey hey ho ho
<willcooke> 'sup Laney
<didrocks> czajkowski: great!
<didrocks> morning Laney
<willcooke> tkamppeter, I just pimped the Open Printing  summit via G+
<willcooke> I'll see if someone who actually has some followers (popey) can re-share
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<Laney> alright
<Laney> wie gehts?
<seb128> hey didrocks Laney willcooke czajkowski
<seb128> good!
<seb128> Laney, you?
<didrocks> re seb128!
<seb128> willcooke, @chromium, ack, thanks
<seb128> didrocks, re ;-)
<willcooke> np
<seb128> willcooke, did you see my comment yesterday about eventual travelling and when that would be likely to be?
 * willcooke scrolls back
<seb128> it was in query
<seb128> just wondering if you could figure out if we had some travelling planned after the summer and when
<willcooke> seb128, didnt get it - the wifi in Blue Fin is sometimes dodgy
<willcooke> seb128, I understand there /might/ be something in October, but I will find out for certain
<willcooke> do you guys use some kind of IRC proxy?
<seb128> willcooke, thanks, would be handy if we want to e.g book holidays
<willcooke> something which is a bit more "store and forward"
<seb128> I don't
<seb128> larsu, Laney and some other do
<Laney> yeah, screen+irssi
<Laney> some people like irccloud
<larsu> screen+irssi for me as well
<larsu> on a raspi
 * willcooke checks it out
<didrocks> willcooke: I did use irssi + bip. And after some years, realized that if people want to reach me when I'm not there, emails is better :)
<didrocks> I have then only to backlog emails
<didrocks> and not emails + irc + â¦
<seb128> emails also include content usually
<seb128> not just "ping" ;-)
<didrocks> really true! :)
<Laney> 'ping' is better
<Laney> waaaaaay more ignorable :-)
<didrocks> ahah
<seb128> lol
<willcooke> ha
<didrocks> willcooke: so, I guess you're warned now, don't ping without adding context ;)
<willcooke> hehe - yeah I saw that yesterday :)
<willcooke> I have a habit of doing that :/
<tkamppeter> willcooke, thanks for pimpimg.
<willcooke> dpm, https://plus.google.com/108554416426692294217/posts/jKQh1NmjrPo
<seb128> willcooke, do you know if the chromium update is going to go to other series than utopic as well?
<willcooke> dpm, is that something that one of the Ubuntu official accounts could re-share/tweet about?
<willcooke> seb128, hrm - good question, I don't know.  Jamie said Chris sponsored it in, so I assume that Coulson?
<willcooke> I can ask him
<willcooke> (if it is)
<seb128> it's chrisccoulson yes
<seb128> he doesn't seem to be online though
<willcooke> I'll find him...
<seb128> he might just not be up yet
<seb128> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/chromium-browser btw, for the versions/by serie
<seb128> Laney, are you reviewing the developer mode mr?
<Laney> yes
<dpm> hi willcooke, let me have a look
<ogra_> whee, thanks !
<dpm> willcooke, https://plus.google.com/100887841569748798697/posts/CRKD6jJEjyF
<willcooke> dpm, woot - thanks dude
<willcooke> there you go tkamppeter!  250k followers :)
<willcooke> yayay chrisccoulson
<willcooke> chrisccoulson, morning chap!  Sorry to pounce on you the second you log in
<chrisccoulson> hi :)
<willcooke> chrisccoulson, the sponsorship of Chromium 35 you kindly did yesterday - is that for all series or just U?
<chrisccoulson> willcooke, just for U. chad says cr36 will be ready by thursday, which I'll upload to all releases
<chrisccoulson> I didn't see the point in pushing cr35 to all releases, only to update it again a couple of days later
<willcooke> chrisccoulson, word
<Laney> bird
<willcooke> Laney, bird = word?
<Laney> so they say
<willcooke> I didn't know
<Laney> I thought everybody had heard
<willcooke> about?
<Laney> bird being the word
<willcooke> \o/
<chrisccoulson> lol
<seb128> chrisccoulson, ready on thursday, waiting to see :p
<seb128> cr35 was "ready" for like 3 weeks before it got uploaded
<chrisccoulson> hi seb128 :)
<seb128> I hope we don't keep doing the same to hit then "oh, next one is coming, let's do this one" and never upload anything
<seb128> because it's always take ages and by the time things are tested there is a new one
<seb128> chrisccoulson, hey ;-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, hmmm, cr35 was only ready last week. at least, that's when the builds ended up in https://launchpad.net/~canonical-chromium-builds/+archive/ubuntu/stage
<seb128> k
<seb128> well, it was "almost ready" for a while before that
<seb128> but if cr36 is ready this week or next, it's fine I guess
<seb128> let's see
<chrisccoulson> Yeah, hopefully
<tkamppeter> willcooke, great, still too much paper needed ...
<didrocks> remember that cr34 is really buggy
<didrocks> like the loosing tabs and so on
<didrocks> not great for a LTS
<seb128> yeah
<didrocks> losing*
<czajkowski> Trevinho: has the patience of a saint! we at least have a bug reported this time https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/1347494  still working on the back trace
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1347494 in unity (Ubuntu) "Logging in doesn't load unity desktop on admin account" [Undecided,New]
 * didrocks doesn't know why containers produced on docker hub are brokenâ¦
<didrocks> (bad permissions on directories)
<czajkowski> Trevinho: for some unknown ditty reason it seems to hate unity-dbgsyms E: Unable to locate package unity-dbgsyms
<czajkowski> are they built for utopic could that be it?
<didrocks> Sweetshark: did you get the same issue?
<didrocks> seems to be https://github.com/dotcloud/docker/issues/5892
 * didrocks reads
<Sweetshark> didrocks: havent run into that yet, but will look out now ;)
 * didrocks is trying -s=devicemapper as suggested
<Laney> czajkowski: dbgsym not dbgsyms, and you have to have enabled that repository if you didn't already https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebuggingProgramCrash#Debug_Symbol_Packages
<seb128> czajkowski, you need the ddeb source matching you normal apt sources
<Laney> whoops!
<Laney> I just reproduced the "gstreamer 1.4" leak
<Laney> ..........only I was still on 1.2.4
<didrocks> Sweetshark: yeah, so if you add users that are non root, don't use trusted builds for now, rather, build them yourself
<didrocks> Sweetshark: there is no workaround/fix apparently yet
 * didrocks followed up on the bug
<seb128> Laney, lol
<seb128> Laney, so blaming the gst update wrongly?
<seb128> Laney, how do you reproduce it?
<Laney> seb128: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/media-hub/+bug/1346821/comments/5 I did that
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1346821 in media-hub (Ubuntu) "media-hub-server uses all system's memory (sigkill send to init)" [Critical,New]
<Laney> load an album, then click the second half of the slider to make it go to the next song
<seb128> k
<seb128> did you downgrade base as well?
<seb128> or only gst?
<Laney> I didn't downgrade
<Laney> just on an old image
<willcooke> tkamppeter, you're muted at your end I think
<willcooke> tkamppeter, I heard you for a second there
<seb128> tkamppeter, do you know if canon mg6350 printers are known to have issues/not work with trusty? the printer is correctly detected/added by system-config-printer, printing makes the printer receive the job (it says so on its small lcd screen) but nothing gets out of the printer then
<seb128> it's like the job was invalid and dropped by the printer or something
<seb128> not sure how to debug, some website recommends just installing the driver from the constructor website
<didrocks> ok, going for exercising!
<czajkowski> Laney: any sweet chance you're in london this week ?
<Laney> czajkowski: nope
<Laney> come to GUADEC next week? :-)
<czajkowski> I've had 3 weeks of no tracel I'm enjoying this :p
<Laney> actually I will be changing trains @ stp to get there ...
<tkamppeter> seb128, the Canon printers have USB problems. Try the command "lpadmin -p <queue> -o usb-unidir-default=true" for the print queue.
<tkamppeter> seb128, See "USB printer does not print or prints garbage" on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebuggingPrintingProblems
<seb128> tkamppeter, thanks, that one is a wifi one, and it works with the ppd from canon
<tkamppeter> seb128, if this works out, report a bug on http://www.cups.org/str.php, post the "lsusb" output (USB product/vendor IDs) and make/model of the printer. Or edit /usr/share/cups/usb/org.cups.usb-quirks and attach the patch to your bug report.
<seb128> tkamppeter, ok, thanks
<tkamppeter> seb128, for WiFi/Network I do not have any known problems of Canons. For WiFi printing in general I had only problems with my FritzBox router, but the FritzBox support helped me and fixed the firmware bug. I am running development firmware now and the printer works. Printer is HP though.
<tkamppeter> seb128, no I remember that there are users of LiveBox routers who had problems with printers connected via IPP (independent of wired or wireless), these users have to replace the ipp://... URI by ipp14://...
<tkamppeter> s/no/now/
<willcooke> Sweetshark, just set up a 1:1 weekly - let me know if you want to move it
<willcooke> larsu, ditto
<willcooke> Laney, ditto
<Sweetshark> willcooke: should be fine if we really do this hard timeboxed as I have a weekly call (Engineering Steering Committee at LibreOffice on 16:00CEST on Thursday) right after that.
<willcooke> Sweetshark, sure, no worries.  I think once we get in to the swing of things it won't take 30 mins
<willcooke> who is at guadec next week? seb128, didrocks, Laney?  attente too?
<Laney> yes, & larsu & desrt
<willcooke> excellenrt
<willcooke> excellent
<willcooke> exercise time for me now.  bbiab
<larsu> willcooke: I'll be on a train this Friday for our 1:1 (going to GUADEC)
<willcooke> larsu, no worries, we'll catch up soon
<larsu> cool, thanks
<seb128> willcooke, oh, forgot to reply for the guadec list, but what Laney said ;-)
<seb128> kenvandine, hey, are you going to review the dual sim work from Jonas?
<kenvandine> seb128, yup
<seb128> kenvandine, great, thanks ;-)
<seb128> kenvandine, what happened to the landing from yesterday btw?
<kenvandine> merge problems then pep8 test failures
<seb128> urg
<kenvandine> i'm going to finish it up this morning
<seb128> is anyone working on fixing those?
<seb128> k
<kenvandine> it was building when i left yesterday
<kenvandine> they got fixed late
<seb128> kenvandine, should https://code.launchpad.net/~ken-vandine/ubuntu-system-settings/call_forwarding/+merge/227761 bet set as "work in progress"? CI run and I said that's all you wanted from it
<kenvandine> it's ready now
<seb128> k
<kenvandine> a review would be great :)
<seb128> is Jonas doing one?
<seb128> I can have a look as well
<kenvandine> i haven't asked
<seb128> k
<seb128> let me look first
<kenvandine> thx
<seb128> if I feel like another review is welcome I can ping him
<seb128> kenvandine, when you said 'they got fixed", you are speaking about the pep8 error? where? I didn't see a new mr?
<seb128> or is that a new commit on one of those listed?
<kenvandine> new commit
<seb128> k
<kenvandine> it's all built in the silo now
<seb128> nice
<seb128> land it!
<kenvandine> i just need to do a round of testing
<kenvandine> after my next meeting though :)
<Laney> glad that pep8 is working now
<seb128> yeah
<Laney> btw I saw some dual sim MP come in and I was suspicious that it seems to duplicate the qml for the single and dual case
<Laney> I'd think it ought to be possible to handle both in the same file
<Laney> just in case anyone reviews this
<asac> seb128: whats our gstreamre source package?
<asac> e.g. launchpad ubuntu link at best
<seb128> asac, https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/gstreamer1.0
<asac> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gstreamer1.0
<asac> ah good
<seb128> why?
<seb128> still discussing that sync?
<seb128> btw Laney said it's also happening with the old version
<asac> seb128: not sure ... just got asked how we can e better in coordinating such pieces with stakeholders before dropping them
<seb128> k
<asac> at best it causes confusion and distraction for folks that are knee deep in making gstreamer magic happening for phone
<asac> if that happens without them knowing
<seb128> yeah, that makes sense
<asac> what are your thoughts?
<seb128> I guess we could create a table of packages that need confirmation before being synced, with their owners
<seb128> but then we need to owners to be responsive and look at the pending syncs
<asac> right
<seb128> rather than being busy and ignore those
<asac> so proactive merge/sync work management
<seb128> otherwise we stay on outdated unsupported versions
<Laney> I bet Â£10,000 that list will be 'everything on the phone'
<seb128> and we loose the benefit of being close from Debian
<seb128> Laney, and I bet for quite a part of the list there are going to be no active owner
<seb128> like if libpng has a an update
<seb128> or libzlib
<seb128> or libelf
<asac> i think its an interesting topic for the distro to figure
<seb128> what we currently have works fine most of the time
<seb128> it's just a bug, we get bugs through silo landings as well
<seb128> those happen
<Laney> looks like it wasn't even a bug
<seb128> we have britney also to protect the image
<Laney> so we're actually discussing something that wasn't even a problem
<seb128> if we have tests in place to catch issues...
<Laney> which seems a bit mad
<seb128> right
<seb128> but potentially a such sync could create an issue/introduce a new bug
<Laney> a problem is that this report blinded people who then didn't even look into the problem
<seb128> but silo landing as well
<seb128> our testing is not perfect
<seb128> right
<Laney> I better go have lunch or else I'll EOD without having eaten :P
<Laney> been trying to merge -bad 1.4, speaking of gst ...
 * Laney screams
<Laney> I was in the wrong directory when building the source package so it didn't get rebuilt so the build failed again
 * Laney force afks
<seb128> urg
<seb128> enjoy!
<willcooke> Come to the Ubuntu On Air engineering update - I'm totally live dudes
<seb128> oh, indeed you are there!
<willcooke> exposing my ignorance in public
<seb128> willcooke, xdg-utils is a bunch of scripts to deal with things like "open that file", "inhibit screen locking", which tries to do do the right thing for the desktop env in use
<willcooke> thx seb128
<seb128> that was a weird question to ask
<willcooke> kicks mhall119
<seb128> indeed
<Laney> willcooke: seems like a bit of a baptism of fire...
<mvo> willcooke: ubuntu-on-air on day3? woah, what a ride for you :)
<willcooke> \o/
<seb128> Laney, nobody decided for settings on line length changes
<seb128> the document Jussi pointed to seems to be a "unity" one
<seb128> e.g trying to be standard accross our projects iirc
<seb128> I'm still undecided with the 80 chars, that feels like a too high constrains for modern width screens, though I agree it can be handy in some cases
<Laney> I guess people don't bother having code side by side any more
<Laney> whatever
<seb128> but even on my laptop screen with qtcreator and a sidebar I can easily go to 110 chars
<seb128> side by side is useful for debugging when you do old/new version, but otherwise do you use it?
<Laney> all the time
<Laney> listen
<Laney> if you want to get rid of it then just do it
<Laney> I just resent being linked to some random document
<ogra_> and your screen pnly allows 160 chars ?
<ogra_> *only
<Laney> actually it's 141
<seb128> Laney, I've no strong opinion, I just find that the 80 chars is easy to hit and does make for some extra wrapping which is less comfortable to read sometimes
<seb128> but it's not a big deal either
<ogra_> Laney, time to drop that 14" VGA monitor ... its 2014 !!
<seb128> but yeah, I'm not wanting to change unless those guideline are something documented as being our standards for all projets we work on
<seb128> ogra_, it's called a laptop
<ogra_> seb128, sure ... but 141 chars !
<seb128> my laptop does 136 chars
<seb128> we don't all have hidpi ;-)
<ogra_> my laptop does a *lot* more ... do you guys only work on tty consoles ?
<seb128> no, it's gedit or qtcreator
<Laney> vim
<seb128> but resolution is not 1900 here
<seb128> it's 1300
<ogra_> ah, old HW :)
<Laney> don't even know what it is, possibly 1280x960
<seb128> not so old, but those resolutions are better for my eyes
<seb128> if I were on 1900 I would adapt the font and hit around the same number of chars
<seb128> well, anyway, not an useful discussion
<Laney> anyway I'm aware I'm the only one who cares
<ogra_> heh, yeah
<Laney> so, fine by me if it makes everyone else sad
<didrocks> seb128: Laney: the recommendations are 120 at most actually, to have the content readable
<didrocks> intellij set 120 by default, whereas they tweak that value to 100 in Android Studio
<Laney> kay
<Laney> I checked what GNOME say and they say up to 120 too
<didrocks> yeah, seems the standard to have readable content (longer makes it hard to read)
<Laney> I want a linter to enforce this now >:)
<Laney> especially if it fails the build
 * Laney gets excited
<didrocks> Laney: it's called pep8 :p
<didrocks> oh C++, meh ;)
<Laney> pep8 says 79 btw
<didrocks> yeah, that's their default
<didrocks> you can tweak it though
<Laney> up to 100
<didrocks> (as in udtc)
<didrocks> I'm using 120 for both, but 100 can be a good start :p
<Laney> pep8 is quite clear
<didrocks> Laney: https://github.com/didrocks/ubuntu-developer-tools-center/blob/master/.pep8
<Laney> indeed you can override it
<Laney> by pep8 I mean the document
<didrocks> (I exclude the virtualenv directory, most of the standard python library fails miserably)
<seb128> ok, calling it a day
<seb128> Laney, have a nice early w.e, see you in Strasbourg
<seb128> good evening desktopers
<Laney> seb128: cheers, see you there
<Laney> have a good evening!
<seb128> thanks
 * didrocks goes as well
<didrocks> see you in Strasbourg Laney!
<Laney> bye!
<Laney> have a good two days
<didrocks> thanks ;)
<willcooke> EODing now too - toodle pip
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-07-24
<willcooke> hello all
 * willcooke yawns
<willcooke> I should make coffee *then* switch the computer on
 * willcooke goes to make coffee
<didrocks> good morning willcooke!
<didrocks> we all do the same mistake :p
<seb128> good morning desktopers!
<mvo_> willcooke: you should have someone who makes you coffee and switches the computer on for you :P I hope my kids will eventually do this for me, so far, no luck :/
<mvo_> hey seb128 and didrocks
<didrocks> hey seb128, mvo_!
<seb128> hey didrocks, mvo_, willcooke
<didrocks> mvo_: lol, they are not trained enough :)
<seb128> mvo_, what's the point of making kids of that's not for that, right?
<mvo_> didrocks: no, they are not, I guess I'm not strict enough :/
<willcooke> :D
<mvo_> seb128: exactly!
<seb128> (of->if)
<didrocks> mvo_: time to level up the game! :)
<mvo_> seb128: that was the plan: train them to do the tea making, washing, cleaning. did't work though
<seb128> waouh, you planned to let other people handle your tea?! ;-)
<didrocks> I would have never thought he would
<mvo_> lol
<mvo_> only special trusty^Wtrusted people
<mvo_> seb128: but business, I send the gobject-introspection multi-arch patch to debian now, I  think its pretty uncontroversial, pitti already acked it :) it just needs some coordination, but I may be away tomorrow/early next week so I just send it so that the diff does not get lost
<mvo_> seb128: you made me fix it proper instead of going the cheap route ;)
<TheMuso> Hey folks.
<willcooke> hi TheMuso
<seb128> mvo_, thanks for doing it the proper way ;-)
<mvo_> hey TheMuso
<seb128> hey TheMuso, long time not seen, how are you?
<TheMuso> Not too bad thanks seb128. Yourself?
<seb128> I'm good, thanks
<TheMuso> I've been around of course, just not always on this late.
<seb128> right, it's just that our tz don't overlap much
<seb128> same with robert_ancell
<TheMuso> Indeed.
<robert_ancell> who is this seb128 characetr?
<pitti> bonjour seb128 et mvo, comment allez-vous ?
<robert_ancell> willcooke, hi!
<seb128> robert_ancell, hey! what are you still doing online? ;-)
<willcooke> TheMuso, what time is it for you?  The directory said this was like 5pm?!
<didrocks> hey TheMuso, pitti, robert_ancell :)
<pitti> Ã§a va didrocks
<willcooke> robert_ancell, hi!!
<pitti> group hug!
<TheMuso> willcooke: 17:16
<didrocks> pitti: Ã§a va bien, et toi ?
<robert_ancell> seb128, was on a meeting with one of you pesky euro-timezoners
<seb128> pitti, hey!
<willcooke> TheMuso, Ahh - ok, not tooo bad then.  Sorry to spoil the end of your day :D
<seb128> robert_ancell, hehe
<TheMuso> willcooke: Its fine, I finish about 16:30 usually, so its no big deal.
<seb128> robert_ancell, that's a good reason then!
<pitti> didrocks: j'encore batts avec ddeb-retriever, sinon bien, merci :)
<willcooke> robert_ancell, I think your idea about rotating the meetings makes sense, I'll get something set up today
<didrocks> pitti: oh, ppa with ddebs <-> launchpad synchronization?
<pitti> didrocks: "bats"
<robert_ancell> willcooke, great
<pitti> didrocks: yeah, writing half of soyuz in there :/
<didrocks> waow :/
 * didrocks console pitti
<seb128> pitti, ddebs in soyuz ftw!
 * pitti ^5s seb128
<robert_ancell> seb128, larsu, so you guys can build gtk+3.0 with no problems right?
<seb128> robert_ancell, correct
<seb128> robert_ancell, not sure what is different for you :/
<seb128> did you try to throw it to a ppa to see what happens?
<robert_ancell> seb128, I didn't but I suspect it will compile fine
<robert_ancell> So annoying, I can't find anything different here
<seb128> robert_ancell, did you get anywhere trying to debug/see what goes wrong?
<robert_ancell> seb128, no. It's a child process in the tests that fails. It doesn't dump core and I didn't see any output from iot
<robert_ancell> When I run the tests manually they work fine
<seb128> :-(
<robert_ancell> very odd
<seb128> indeed
<willcooke> Heisenbug eh?
<seb128> can you hack the code of that process to make it output in a log?
<robert_ancell> seb128, yeah, that was the next plan. But it takes so long to run each time :)
<seb128> robert_ancell, do you need to start a new build each time?
<robert_ancell> seb128, yes
<seb128> urg
<seb128> robert_ancell, did you try to "debuild binary" in the builddir?
<robert_ancell> yes
<seb128> and the tests are fine then?
<robert_ancell> hmm, It just failed then. I was running debian/rules binary I think. What's the difference?
<seb128> no differenc
<seb128> but that's not a new build
<seb128> it picks up at running the target that didn't success
<seb128> e.g not clean and rebuild
<seb128> it should resume at make/make check, no?
<robert_ancell> yes, and debian/rules binary was doing that too, expect the tests were passing
<seb128> wth
<robert_ancell> yeah, I just ran 'fakeroot debian/rules binary' and they pass
<seb128> that should be under the same env that the first build
<seb128> weeeird
<willcooke> TheMuso, lost you
<TheMuso> hrm ok, will rejoin.
<TheMuso> willcooke: I'm back in.
<chrisccoulson> anyone fancy looking at https://launchpadlibrarian.net/180426228/buildlog_ubuntu-trusty-i386.firefox_32.0~a2~hg20140721r201379-0ubuntu1~umd1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz ? ;)
<chrisccoulson> the next person who speaks volunteers automatically
 * chrisccoulson trap set
<desrt> chrisccoulson: hi!  how are you today?!
<chrisccoulson> desrt, hah! :)
<desrt> chrisccoulson: you wish ;)
<chrisccoulson> desrt, I'm great thanks. At least, I am now!
<chrisccoulson> how are you?
<chrisccoulson> (and commiserations btw)
<chrisccoulson> :)
<seb128> \o/, desrt unmuted the channel, thanks
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson ;-)
<chrisccoulson> hi :)
<chrisccoulson> This is going to be a tricky one to fix, I bet. Only happens on trusty i386 and it happen, s when compiling the startup cache
<chrisccoulson> oops
<desrt> chrisccoulson: i'm good, but i have no work to do
<desrt> nobody gave me any tasks recently
<desrt> actually
<chrisccoulson> desrt, i could fix that. I have *loads* to do :)
<desrt> i just got an idea for something to work on
<desrt> chrisccoulson: sorry.  already doing something now.  :)
<chrisccoulson> desrt, if you ever fancy any browser stuff, https://bugs.launchpad.net/oxide ;)
 * didrocks will try to exercise a little bit earlier
<didrocks> and avoiding too warm temperatures
<didrocks> (already too late, but well, this refactoring wouldn't finish by itself! :p)
<seb128> didrocks, good luck then!
<didrocks> thanks :)
<seb128> didrocks, and good afternoon if I'm off when you come back
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, thanks! enjoy it :)
<seb128> I think I'm going to stop around 13, having the afternoon off today
<seb128> didrocks, thanks ;-)
<willcooke> Hi guys
<willcooke> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-maverick-rootless-x
<willcooke> :)
<willcooke> Could we resurrect that?  What's the story there?
<seb128> willcooke, why?
<willcooke> seb128, seems like a good idea, running X not as root
<seb128> the Mir guys are working on support for that in Mir iirc
<seb128> well, it didn't happen in all those years, I don't think it makes sense now
<seb128> better get Mir right and use that
<willcooke> sure, but that's $time away.  I know what you're saying though, in the long term it doesnt make sense, but if it'a both easy and quick - why not do it?
<willcooke> I fully expect you to say that it's neither easy or quick :)
<seb128> right, that's what I was going to say
<seb128> that and desktop has no Xorg maintainer left
<seb128> those competences got moved to Mir and kernel teams
<willcooke> good point
<seb128> see you tomorrow everyone (I've the afternoon as half a day off work)
<asac> seb come back plz :(
<ogra_> ... and approve my developer-mode branch for system-settings !
<willcooke> didrocks, can you take a look at that please ^^^^^^^
<didrocks> willcooke: I didn't touch the system-settings code, seb and Laney are owner because the desktop team was in charge of it
<willcooke> ah ok
<didrocks> willcooke: but bill filler team got full time resources and is the real owner
<willcooke> asac, ogra_ - what needs doing, and when?
<asac> willcooke: my question was about what i said in /msg ... ogra needs a MP review it seems (dont know details)
<ogra_> willcooke, i need approval for https://code.launchpad.net/~ogra/ubuntu-system-settings/developer-mode/+merge/227822
<willcooke> asac, ok, so we're good.
<asac> ack
<willcooke> ogra_, sounds like we need to track down someone in Bill's team
<ogra_> willcooke, right ... it is just that Laney and seb did the initial review ... i can find someone else
<willcooke> Laney, can you advise ogra_  on the best person to speak to?
<willcooke> or, ya know, just do it ;)
<ogra_> i'll fond someone ... i think Laney is traveling
<ogra_> *find
<willcooke> kk, thx ogra_
<desrt> larsu: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=732754
<ubot5> Gnome bug 732754 in gdbus "GDBusMessage: optimise (de)serialisation of fixed arrays" [Normal,Reopened]
<desrt> mhr3: hey!
<desrt> mhr3: your country is cool!
<mhr3> desrt, heh
<mhr3> desrt, so i suppose you didn't run out of things to do? :)
<desrt> certainly not
<desrt> i almost didn't sleep, in fact
<mhr3> desrt, because of the missing ac? ;)
<desrt> no.... too much interesting stuff to do
<desrt> probably will go again next year, if not sooner already...
 * desrt got invites to a bunch of similar parties in other countries
<desrt> it's in banska bystrica next year
<mhr3> but yea, if things are organized properly slovakia is very enjoyable :)
<desrt> larsu laughs at your last comment :)
<mhr3> desrt, does he have stories to tell when that wasn't the case? :)
 * larsu can laugh for himself!
<larsu> haha
<desrt> ^ he didn't actually laugh right then
<larsu> MacSlow: what does the x-canconial-switch-to-application hint on a notification do?
<MacSlow> larsu, that marks a notification to be an interactive notification... one action can be passed and can be triggered by tapping the whole notification... main use-case sms-reception notification
<larsu> MacSlow: thanks.
 * larsu is reviewing code using that right now
<MacSlow> larsu, the name of that hint should be changed... but back than that "switch to app" was the only use-case.
<willcooke> hey Sweetshark - are you good for our meeting now?  I see you didnt accept yet, maybe you can't make now?
<Sweetshark> willcooke: oh
<Sweetshark> willcooke: likely Im just using the other account ...
<willcooke> Sweetshark, we can reschedule if you like?
<Sweetshark> willcooke: no, Im fine with now.
<Sweetshark> willcooke: just trying to find the invite ;)
<desrt> Laney: this shotwell bug is a tough egg to crack :(
<desrt> Laney: i take it back.  vala bug.  :(
<desrt> it makes a _copy_ of the mutex and unlocks the copy
<desrt> that used to be OK when the only thing in there was a pointer..... one copy of the pointer is just as good as the next
<desrt> but now that we put actual state in there..... not so cool....
 * didrocks waves good evening and good bye
<willcooke> right, EODing now all.  See you tomrrow
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-07-25
<robert_ancell> desrt, around?
<pitti> Good morning
<didrocks> good morning
<didrocks> going for an early run (as will leave to strasbourg mid-day). back afterwards :)
<willcooke> morning all
<willcooke> hi seb128, did you get some downtime yesterday in the end?
<seb128> willcooke, hey, yes and I'm about to drop offline for the morning, travelling
<willcooke> cool!  Have fun
<seb128> I'm going to do the review asac wanted then
<seb128> I should be back online around lunch time
<seb128> bbl
<willcooke> I think it was ogra_ who wanted the review?
<willcooke> hi didrocks, TheMuso, Sweetsha1k, larsu, tkamppeter, Laney, FJKong, happyaron (I think that covers people who might be online ;) )
 * didrocks back from running
<didrocks> hey willcooke!
<willcooke> larsu, are you good for our meeting now, you didnt accept the invite.  We can move it to later on if you like?
<willcooke> no larsu ?
<tkamppeter> willcooke, hi
<willcooke> hi tkamppeter, got your email - will do my best to arrange it
<tkamppeter> willcooke, I posted here more because you asked for some people here some time ago. Did I miss anything?
<willcooke> well  - that was strange.
<willcooke> My laptop screen suddenly went to it's lowest brightness setting and would let me increase it
<willcooke> reboot and now it's ok
<willcooke> probably something to do with suspend-resume
<didrocks> willcooke: did you remove any vga cable?
<didrocks> trusty had that bug when you disconnect external monitor that you can't change the brightness at all anymore
<willcooke> didrocks, kinda.  I was on my docking station with external monitor
<didrocks> ah, and you undock?
<willcooke> aha that will be it
<willcooke> yeah
<didrocks> x220? trusty?
<willcooke> :D  yup
<didrocks> \o/
<didrocks> I empathize :p
<didrocks> but TBH, it's been mostly fixed for me with a kernel update a month ago
<willcooke> what's the command to find the release name?  uname and /etc/issue dont tell me
<didrocks> lsb_release -a
<willcooke> yay
<willcooke> thx
<didrocks> yw
<didrocks> so, yeah, I got it during the whole trusty dev time
<didrocks> like 70% of the time I was undocking
<didrocks> then, you have to redock
<didrocks> and undock
<didrocks> but not anymore for a month now
<didrocks> I pinged the kernel team months ago, not much reaction on the bug though :p
<willcooke> linky?
<dholbach> hey hey
<willcooke> morning dholbach
 * willcooke suspects a bug report incoming from dholbach 
<dholbach> can anyone take a look at https://code.launchpad.net/~mitya57/metacity/3.12.0/+merge/226573 please?
<dholbach> willcooke, it's not mine - I was just taking care of my patch pilot shift and it looked like the above had been sitting in the queue for a bit
<didrocks> willcooke: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/1285172
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1285172 in linux (Ubuntu) "Display brightness on internal monitor is set to minimum and can't be changed after plugin out the external monitor." [Medium,Expired]
<didrocks> willcooke: I didn't play the ping-pong game with their bot
<didrocks> (got that for a year, nothing for apart every couple of months "is the bug still valid?"
<didrocks> )
<didrocks> dholbach: hey, I guess robert is on it, he already did some initial review
<didrocks> (yesterday)
<didrocks> and he had some requests
<didrocks> dholbach: maybe set it to WIP?
<dholbach> hum... that was only changelog entry changes AFAICS
<didrocks> dholbach: yeah, he asked for adding the bug reference + some other changes in the changelog
<dholbach> ok ok...
<willcooke> didrocks, are you happy for me to mark that brightness bug as "kernel-fixed-upstream" ?
<willcooke> and then "confirmed"?
<willcooke> i.e.
<willcooke> it sounds like you've already done what they asked
<didrocks> willcooke: well, for me, it's fixed, so, it's even "fix released", but if you got it with a recent kernel, you can reopen it I guess
 * willcooke checks for updates
<willcooke> kernel 3.13 waiting to be installed
<willcooke> didrocks, which kernel image are you running? 3.13?
<didrocks> willcooke: right, I have 3.13.0-32-generic
<willcooke> kk - I'll update
<didrocks> keep me posted ;)
<willcooke> guess I'm rebooting again then..... brb
<willcooke> gottta love that ssd
<willcooke> I'm going to try docking then
<willcooke> nope
<willcooke> same problem
<didrocks> arghâ¦ so different issue than mine
<didrocks> try to open a new bug rather then
<didrocks> ubuntu-bug linux
<didrocks> to open one against the kernel
<willcooke> done
<willcooke> thanks didrocks
<didrocks> yw!
<didrocks> ok, so time for me to catch the train for Guadec
<didrocks> will work offline and ensure that my offline tests are reallyâ¦ offline :p
<willcooke> have fun dude.  Keep an eye out for happyaron - and buy him a beer for me
<didrocks> (should finish the docker tests by then)
<didrocks> sure, will do! :)
<didrocks> see you willcooke
<willcooke> l8r
<dholbach> attente, do you know if there's anything left to be done on bug 1208019?
<ubot5> bug 1208019 in Unity GTK+ module "Eclipse menus doesn't show up in Saucy" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1208019
<attente> dholbach: we need an sru with the gtk patch and this merge: https://code.launchpad.net/~attente/unity-gtk-module/1208019-2/+merge/216964
<dholbach> ok
<xnox> attente: dholbach: saucy is end of life, no more builds possible for it....
<rickspencer3> arg, everyone is at Guadec :,(
<willcooke_> :)
<willcooke_> not quite everyone
<attente> xnox: the bug is still affecting trusty
<willcooke> attente, hi!
<willcooke> attente, can you tell me the process around " we need an sru with the gtk patch and this merge: https://code.launchpad.net/~attente/unity-gtk-module/1208019-2/+merge/216964"
<willcooke> like, how does that happen?
<willcooke> do *I* need to do anything? ;)
<willcooke> (forgive my ignorance)
<attente> willcooke: hey
<attente> willcooke: someone needs to sponsor uploads of gtk and unity-gtk-module to trusty-proposed that include those changes
<willcooke> attente, so that's usually Seb?
<attente> willcooke: it doesn't have to be
<attente> and then i guess subscribe the release team on the bug
<willcooke> ah, ok.  So in summary "everything is under control"?  And it will happen in good time just following the well understood processes
<attente> willcooke: i don't think you need to do anything
<willcooke> cool
<attente> yeah, there's a verification process here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates
<willcooke> great, thank you
<seb128> good afternoon desktopers
<kenvandine> hello seb128
<willcooke> hey seb128, kenvandine
<willcooke> seb128, where you at?
<willcooke> seb128, train?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, just for you - http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/comedy/10985111/British-inventor-builds-giant-fart-machine-to-fire-at-France.html ;)
<seb128> hey kenvandine willcooke
<willcooke> chrisccoulson, \o/
<seb128> chrisccoulson, lol
<seb128> willcooke, no, I'm done travelling, just sit down with the laptop to do some hacking ;-)
<seb128> how was the day here?
<seb128> not too crazy?
 * seb128 reads irc logs
<seb128> chrisccoulson, lol, you crazy british people!
<willcooke> seb128, I sent you an email, I wonder if you'd be able to follow up with someone about a gnome-session bug
<seb128> willcooke, attente: those SRU are still on my list, but I've some backlog, I hope to get to them during GUADEC
<seb128> willcooke, yeah, just read that, I'm going to reply in a bit
<willcooke> np
<ogra_> seb128, the poor channel islands !
<seb128> ogra_, hey
<seb128> ogra_, you guys are crazy btw :p
<ogra_> cant be :)
<seb128> ogra_, I've half a day off and I got sms-ed for settings review 15 minutes I leave, while the review was waiting for like less than a day, do you know how much stuff we receive/have queued?
<seb128> that was not cool
<seb128> just saying
<seb128> kenvandine, thanks for dealing with the review btw!
<ogra_> seb128, huh ? sms ?
<attente> seb128: no worries, thanks
<seb128> ogra_, asac texted me to know if I could get online again
<kenvandine> :)
<ogra_> seb128, oh my, i didnt know about that !
<seb128> ogra_, because you needed your stuffed review *now* apparentluy
<ogra_> seb128, sorry for that, i thooought it was clear that kenvandine takes over
<ogra_> seb128, not at all
<seb128> ogra_, no worry, all good
<seb128> but it was a bit crazy still
<ogra_> seb128, i just mentioned that you guys are traveling and was looking for someone to take over ... asac totally overreacted it seems ... ken said immediately he would do it, all was fine
<seb128> k
<ogra_> i guess asac missed kens answer or some such
<seb128> don't surprise me ;-)
<Trevinho> Laney: I've moved to evolution 3.12.4, but it seems that I'm missing the date column there... Not sure why, but it happens also in a guest account
<Trevinho> nor I can order mails by date...
 * didrocks is at the hotel
<didrocks> hey seb128 ! bon voyage retour ?
<seb128> didrocks, hey
<seb128> didrocks, ouais, et toi, bon voyage ?
<asac> seb128: hey
<seb128> asac, hey
<didrocks> seb128: parfait ;)
<asac> seb128: i didnt even want to talk to you about the mp
<asac> seb128: it was about something else :P
<asac> so no, i didnt overreact :LP
<seb128> asac, sorry, I misconnected dots then
<asac> will msg you
<asac> yeah
<seb128> asac, but you didn't give context
<seb128> and that's the only thing I saw in my backlog then
<ogra_> ah ... communication breakdown :)
<seb128> yeah, likely due to the heat
<seb128> communication melted down :p
<davmor2> Trevinho: right click on subject, click on add column and add a date column
<Trevinho> davmor2: yeah, sure... That would work in general. but that doesn't either list the date column...
<davmor2> Trevinho: it's not scrolled off the page to the right has it?
<Trevinho> davmor2: nope... and it seems something more problematic than this,s ince if I right-click->sort by ->... there's no date either
<Trevinho> if I use custom order, there's date but no order by date at all
<davmor2> Trevinho: where did you get 3.12.4 from
<seb128> Trevinho, laney is off today, just as a fyi
<Trevinho> davmor2: it's in the archives... I've taken the debs from thewre
<Trevinho> seb128: ok, thanks
<larsu> willcooke: I was in a train, sorry. I had mentioned this the other day, no?
<willcooke> larsu, probably - sorry :)
<willcooke> larsu, lets catch up when you're back
<larsu> willcooke: no worries. Maybe some time next week would be good even though I'm at GUADEC, because I'll be on holidays the two weeks after that
<willcooke> larsu, ok that sounds good.  I'll email you next week and arrange a time
<willcooke> thx
<larsu> cool, thanks
<willcooke> happy weekend all.  Hope those of you at Gaudec have a blast
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-07-26
<Noskcaj> Is there any reason gnome-user-share is at version 3.0.4 instead of debian's 3.8?
<Noskcaj> There are many fixes we are missing because of this
<Noskcaj> 3.12 has just been added to debian, but it needs bluez5
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-07-27
<heracles> Hello. Does anyone have any experience with getting bridging to work in xen? I want to bridge wlan0 to xenbr0 but I can't find any instructions on how (that actually work)
#ubuntu-desktop 2015-07-20
<didrocks> good morning
<seb128> good morning desktopers!
<didrocks> re seb128
<seb128> re didrocks :-)
<seb128> Laney, there is a grumpy user on bug #1447224 having issues with the update, can you check if those are regression from the sru update?
<ubot5> bug 1447224 in totem (Ubuntu) "Regression: Unable to select audio or subtitle tracks" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1447224
<willcooke> morning
<Laney> hello
<Laney> seb128: see regression potential in the report
<didrocks> hey willcooke, Laney!
<seb128> Laney, hey, oh I see, is that an unity issue? why can't gmenu based menus be used while old style ones work?
<seb128> hey willcooke
<seb128> Laney, had a good w.e?
<Sweet5hark> moin
<Sweet5hark> TIL you can troll reddit into a few thousand blog views by bikeshedding about C++ idoms ...
<seb128> hey Sweet5hark
<didrocks> good morning Sweet5hark
<Sweet5hark> Bonjour, seb128!
<Sweet5hark> et didrocks!
<seb128> Sweet5hark, is that what you did this w.e? ;-)
<RAOF> Hm, no pitti? On holiday no doubt, the dastard!
<Sweet5hark> seb128: yes: https://skyfromme.wordpress.com/2015/07/18/blast-from-the-past-the-pimpl/
<RAOF> Also, hello seb128, didrocks, Sweet5hark and everyone!
<seb128> RAOF, he is, indeed!
<seb128> RAOF, hey
<Sweet5hark> seb128: well, and buying a new amp as my old one broke. The new amp then needed "testing".
 * RAOF is no longer on holiday :)
<didrocks> good evening RAOF ;)
<Laney> seb128: http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2015/06/05/%23ubuntu-desktop.html#t10:17
<Laney> yes, fine weekend thanks, wedding then hanging out with family
<Laney> hey didrocks!!!!!!!
<seb128> Laney, thanks for log, and I agree on the "fair enough"
<seb128> can you maybe comment on the bug still so the grumpy user doesn't become even grumpied?
<seb128> r
<Laney> haha, if only commenting will have that effect
<Laney> but yes
<Laney> thx for fixing gtk btw
<Laney> new mir seems to have knackered boot tests
<Laney> anpok: have you seen that?
<anpok> Laney: that was on thursday to friday night I think..
<anpok> i forgot to add the url-dispatcher MP to the spread sheet..
<Laney> hmm?
<anpok> url-dispatcher is another mirclient user
<Laney> anpok: will that fix the boottest failure?
<anpok> i am not sure if the rebuilt url-dispatcher is in proposed yet
<Laney> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/url-dispatcher/0.1+15.10.20150717-0ubuntu1 this is
<anpok> oh that happened already on friday
<seb128> Laney, yw for gtk, thanks to pitti for finding it through some testing infra (I think)
<seb128> Laney, the bootest thing was discussed a bit on friday yes, people were not able to reproduce and the test provide almost no detail
<seb128> unsure if they came to any conclusion
<Laney> bleh
<Laney> I just see a timeout error
<seb128> right, like the dash was not coming up
<Laney> it should attach logs really
<Laney> would file a bug if I knew which ones would be useful
<Laney> .cache/upstart/* and ...?
<anpok> would boottest attempt to uninstall older package provided by an older mir release?
<anpok> lightdm and unity-system-compositor logs .. probably
<anpok>  /var/log/lightdm/*
<anpok> i mean if it attempts to uninstall those provided by the old mir release it would remove all clients
<anpok> or libraries depending on clients..
<Laney> I don't think so
<Laney> https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/job/wily-boottest-mir/lastBuild/artifact/results/log/*view*/
<seb128> that log is weird
<seb128> the silo/mir update includes more component than those updated
<seb128> like platform-api rebuilds
<seb128> unsure if the issue is that those are missing
<Laney> it didn't update the whole transition
<Laney> just that one package I guess
<seb128> yeah
<Laney> would that break things?
<seb128> there might miss conflicts or such
<seb128> no idea
<seb128> unsure if anyone tested it out of the silo
<seb128> in partial upgrade scenarios
<Laney> lemme dig out the phone and charge it up
<seb128> I tested the mir update on friday
<seb128> but that was full silo set
<seb128> let me see if I can downgrade bits
<Laney> I was going to run the boottest locally
<Laney> assuming that is possible
<seb128> dunno if that's possible, if you figure it out let me know how, that can be useful
<seb128> bah, n7 went flat over the w.e, of course
<Laney> will need a while to charge it up too
<Laney> haven't used for ages
<Laney> seb128: anpok: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-test-cases/+bug/1476153
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1476153 in Ubuntu Test Cases "boottest runs don't export enough logs" [Undecided,New]
<seb128> Laney, thanks
<Laney> dunno if that is the right project
<anpok> seb128, Laney: can we rerun wily-boottest-mir?
<seb128> some people did on friday I think
<seb128> it's also failing for the different components involved in that transition, not only on one
<anpok> but that was before the url-dispatcher landing?
<seb128> that doesn't matter
<seb128> url-dispatcher not build rebuilt wouldn't prevent unity8 to start
<anpok> i agree because it was no problem during testing
<seb128> Laney, anpok, k, I can reproduce the issue easily
<seb128> I just downgraded unity-system-compositor
<seb128> that's not updated on https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/job/wily-boottest-mir/lastBuild/artifact/results/log/*view*/
<seb128> if you get u-s-c built with old mir and update mir u-s-c hits a a stack smash error
<Laney> nice
<Laney> some Breaks needed then I guess
<seb128> indeed
<seb128> updating u-s-c, restart lightdm and things work
<Laney> want to manually upload it to see if it fixes boottest?
<seb128> unsure
<seb128> I would prefer for the mir team to fix it as want/commit the fix at the proper place
<seb128> I mentioned it on  #ci-eng as well
<Laney> bleh, this always takes ages
<Laney> but as you wish
<seb128> also I'm unsure if mir <-> u-s-c is the issue
<seb128> or if we should only have one libmirclient<n> installed
<seb128> that needs to match the server
<seb128> Laney, well, feel free to do the change/upload if you want, I'm not going to stop you or complain ;-)
<seb128> I'm just not sure enough of what's the right change/prefer to wait a bit for mir team the ping back with what they want to be done
<Laney> ok, we can do that
<RAOF> Urgh. We've gone to some lengths to ensure multiple libmirclient should be usable in parallel :(
<chrisccoulson> ricotz, you asked about thunderbird 38.1.0 on friday - I've just opened bug 1476169
<ubot5> bug 1476169 in thunderbird (Ubuntu Vivid) "Update Thunderbird to 38.1.0" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1476169
<chrisccoulson> ricotz, also, thanks for uploading the new Firefox beta. Would you mind updating the bzr branches though? :)
<ricotz> chrisccoulson, ah nice ;)
<ricotz> chrisccoulson, I didnt bother to push changelog-only change, and those branches could use some updates e.g. update bzr-format and sync them a bit to reduce the diff
<ricotz> (so I don't want to mess with them)
<anpok> seb128: why is u-s-c not updated with wily-boottest-mir?
<anpok> hm the boottest also keeps qtmir
<anpok> ah .. ok i guess I misunderstood what boottest does..
<seb128> RAOF, well, what bit changed in a incompatible way making u-s-c not start?
<seb128> anpok, bootest seems to do "take $current_distro, install $update, check the system boots"
<seb128> so to test the mir update, it installs only mir
<anpok> seb128: the problem seems to be that with the update we load mircommon and mirplatform from both 0.14 and 0.13.3.. I believe we could resolve that by bumping the version number of the android server platofmr package.. but I am not sure if that would cover all cases. still looking where the actual failure happens
<seb128> anpok, you could use package depends/conflicts/... etc to make sure that new mir uninstall old u-s-c
<seb128> but I'm unsure the issue is specific to u-s-c
<seb128> if it's wrong to have 2 versions of mircommon/mirplatform loaded, maybe then those libs should conflict
<Laney> RAOF said it is supposed to work
<anpok> yes it ought to work .. kind of (as in we do not have an acceptance test that proves it).. the failure happens during the first client connect..
<seb128> Laney, yeah, so maybe the right fix is a mir code fix
<seb128> and not forcing u-s-c the be updated with mir
 * Laney nods
<Laney> good that it found a real bug
<seb128> :-)
<seb128> unsure what to do next
<seb128> that might not be worth holding the update, in practice it impacts only partial upgrades
 * anpok currently looks into debugging the issue.. 
<anpok> but we could also take a short cut and mark the versions conflicting..
<anpok> or even that
<seb128> right, that's probably good enough to unblock that migration, shouldn't be used as a reason to not investigate the issue though
<Sweet5hark> ugh. after trolling reddit over the weekend, now someone posted this to hacker news ...
<willcooke> Sweet5hark, dont leave us hanging :)
<Sweet5hark> willcooke: oh just my pointless bikeshedding rant on C++ coding style: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9915841
<willcooke> :)
<balloons> ack
<seb128> Laney, unsure if you are following that totem sru bug, one user claims the update make the rotation item stop working, I asked him to open a new bug report about that, it works on wily but I don't have a vivid system handy to test the SRU (can do in a vm if you want though)
<Laney> yes I am subscribed, I will try later
<Laney> http://people.canonical.com/~laney/weird-things/rotate.png works
<Laney> ignore the corruption
<seb128> Laney, good :-)
<seb128> you also get that font corruption issue then?
<seb128> it's an annoying one :-/
<Laney> seb128: seems bug #1261916
<ubot5> bug 1261916 in xserver-xorg-video-qxl (Ubuntu) "Missing letters in spice client session with KVM guest" [Critical,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1261916
<Laney> patch to disable composite something is linked there by mlankhorst
<seb128> oh ok, not the same then
<Laney> no?
<seb128> it happens sometime on my real system with the intel driver
<Laney> oh right, no I never see it there
<seb128> https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=88584
<ubot5> Freedesktop bug 88584 in Driver/intel "[ilk] Font and screen corruption in GTK+ applications" [Major,New]
<Laney> haha
<Laney> http://pkgs.fedoraproject.org/cgit/xorg-x11-drv-qxl.git/tree/0001-worst-hack-of-all-time-to-qxl-driver.patch
<seb128> hack!
 * Laney sees that charles left us :(
<willcooke> ?!
<Laney> !!! just this channel
<ubot5> Laney: I am only a bot, please don't think I'm intelligent :)
<Laney> be calm
<Laney> you too ubot5
<willcooke> heh
<willcooke> laney and ubot5 are like two little Fonzys
<davmor2> willcooke: surely that would be, "Be Coooooool"  not be calm :)
<Laney> you people are too old for me
<davmor2> willcooke: Followed by Heeeeeeeeeeeyyyyyyyyyy
<willcooke> \o/
<davmor2> you Laney 's get off my lawn
 * Laney tears it up with a mini moto
<davmor2> Laney: hahaha mini moto, now I have an image of you something like this http://www.aboutfacesentertainers.com/images/clowns/mayhem/may_g_little_bike.jpg
<ogra_> lol
<willcooke> g'night all
<mitya57> bregma, any update on https://code.launchpad.net/~mitya57/compiz/switcher-plugins-in-default/+merge/262518 review?
<Noskcaj> robert_ancell, adding a libcanberra build-dep to gnome-clocks fixes the current ftbfs. should the dep be in gnome-clocks or gsound?
<robert_ancell> Noskcaj, I'm looking at it right now and scratching my head because neither gnome-clocks or gsound appears to require a dep on it
<robert_ancell> I'm wondering if another dependency requires it and is missing the dep
<robert_ancell> aha, it is in /usr/share/vala/vapi/gsound.deps
<robert_ancell> So it should be in libgsound-dev
<robert_ancell> Though perhaps the .deps shouldn't include it
<robert_ancell> Noskcaj, yeah, looks like a bug in libgsound - I'll patch it
<Noskcaj> ok, thanks
<Noskcaj> Do we want to do the gegl transition ahead of debian?
<robert_ancell> Noskcaj, I wasn't sure. It didn't seem like too much work as long as Debian catches up and we can sync with them afterwards.
<robert_ancell> I have no idea what timeframe Debian is following on it
<robert_ancell> https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=752645
<ubot5> Gnome bug 752645 in general "Remove unnecessary Vala dependency on libcanberra" [Normal,New]
<robert_ancell> Fixed in gsound 1.0.1-0ubuntu2
<Noskcaj> robert_ancell, I assume it's just because the gimp maintainer hasn't replied. I'll see if i can find him
<ochosi> Sweet5hark: hey! is there already some sort of ETA for LO 5.0 (and then in wily)?
#ubuntu-desktop 2015-07-21
<Sweet5hark> ochosi: https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/ReleasePlan/5.0
<didrocks> good morning
<willcooke> morning
<didrocks> hey willcooke
<willcooke> hey didrocks, how's the jetlag?
<didrocks> willcooke: way better thanks! First real night, so feeling some kind of achievement \o/ :)
<didrocks> willcooke: do you achieve to get full night of sleep btw or still way too early? :)
<seb128> hey willcooke didrocks
<willcooke> didrocks, I'm sleeping on the floor in my eldest son's room.  I ordered a new mattress from Ikea yesterday :)
<didrocks> willcooke: waow! good luck (even if Ikea's mattress are quite good, small compensation ;))
<willcooke> I like to think of it as a sort of camping trip ;)
<didrocks> don't try to start a fire in the middle of the room though :p
<willcooke> haha
<willcooke> :)
<didrocks> seb128: do you know if anything changed in pygi in wily?
<didrocks> http://paste.ubuntu.com/11913125/
<seb128> didrocks, no, seems rather your PKGBUILDDIR isn't getting defined
<didrocks> seb128: hum, are you sure? It seems rather than it can't import _gi?
<seb128>   File "/Â«PKGBUILDDIRÂ»/umake/tools.py", line 24, in <module>
<seb128> that seems weird to me
<seb128> I wouldn't be surprised if the import fail was a side effect
<didrocks> can be, but in that case, it would rather fail on importing gi itself
<seb128> didrocks, robert_ancell had a similar PKGBUILDDIR definition issue in a package I newed yesterday, which he fixed with "build-depends on gnome-common, yelp-tools"
<seb128> just mentioning it in case that's useful
<seb128> but otherwise no idea, I didn't see g-i changes nor similar issues
<didrocks> vivid passed, let me try to only upgrade pygobject first
<didrocks> but yeah, I think the "from ." is screwed in some way by this
<didrocks> seems like though others have the same thing: https://launchpadlibrarian.net/209809241/buildlog_ubuntu-wily-amd64.pytango_8.1.5-1_BUILDING.txt.gz
<didrocks> seb128: it's not that one
<didrocks> if you read the log
<didrocks> I: NOTICE: Log filtering will replace 'build/ubuntu-make-95Kt5f/ubuntu-make-0.9' with 'Â«PKGBUILDDIRÂ»'
<didrocks> (build log)
<seb128> didrocks, k, I don't know then
<didrocks> seb128: can you try on your wily box to "from gi.repository import GLib, Gio"?
<didrocks> under python3
<seb128> $ python3
<seb128> Python 3.4.3+ (default, Jun  2 2015, 14:09:35)
<seb128> [GCC 4.9.2] on linux
<seb128> Type "help", "copyright", "credits" or "license" for more information.
<seb128> >>> from gi.repository import GLib, Gio
<seb128> >>>
<Laney> heeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy
<didrocks> thanks seb128
<didrocks> hey Laney
<seb128> seems like you have python3.5 in your case though
<seb128> maybe pygi is not rebuilt for that version?
<seb128> I'm on 3.4
<seb128> I didn't upgrade today, I did yesterday though
<seb128> hey Laney
<didrocks> seb128: I thought 3.5 was supposed to stay in a ppa though, I'm surprise it's 3.5 as well
<Laney> what up
<didrocks> seb128: let me try a rebuild on a ppa I guess
<didrocks> but I guess it's that
<didrocks> Laney: it's warm again here :p and you?
<seb128> today is sunny here!
<seb128> didrocks, yeah, unsure what pulls in python3.5 for you
<seb128> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/python3-defaults/3.4.3-4ubuntu1
<seb128> it was added a supported on wednesday, there
<didrocks> right, but AFAIK, that shouldn't switch it to default
<seb128> well, it's not even installed for me
<seb128> did you get it pulled in on your system?
<seb128> can you check by what?
<didrocks> I'm still on vivid
<seb128> well, https://launchpadlibrarian.net/212160353/buildlog_ubuntu-wily-amd64.ubuntu-make_0.9_BUILDING.txt.gz gets 3.5
<didrocks> yeah, I saw that
<didrocks> it installs 3.4 and 3.5
<didrocks> but it's using 3.5
<didrocks> I: pybuild base:170: python3.5 setup.py clean
<didrocks> (that's dh clean --with python3)
<seb128> the great Laney might know
<seb128> Laney, we need your wisdom :-)
<Laney> what you say
<seb128> is python3.5 supposed to be default/pulled in on wily yet?
<Laney> O_O
<Laney> let me read that email again but I thought not
<seb128> see the build log I just shared
<seb128> yeah, same
<didrocks> the email told it was supposed to stay in a ppa
<didrocks> until it's ready
<seb128> and my laptop is on wily and didn't get it installed
<didrocks> my build-deps are really standards: https://github.com/ubuntu/ubuntu-make/blob/master/debian/control#L4
<didrocks> can be python3-all depending on 3.5?
<didrocks> yeah, it's that one
<didrocks> but then, why dh is using 3.5 and not the default?
<seb128> Depends: python3 (= 3.4.3-4), python3.4
<seb128> here
<didrocks>  Depends: python3 (= 3.4.3-4ubuntu1), python3.4, python3.5
<didrocks> dpkg-deb -I python3-all_3.4.3-4ubuntu1_amd64.deb
<didrocks> I guess you don't have 3.4.3-4ubuntu1 (in proposed)
<seb128> oh
<seb128> no, who has proposed enabled? ;-)
<didrocks> the builders? :p
<seb128> right, that makes sense to prepare the migration in proposed
<seb128> but yeah, I guess it means they effectively started the transition
<seb128> and probably pygi and others need to be fixed for ubuntu-make to build
<didrocks> yeah
<didrocks> I wonder if I shouldn't do that in 2 steps
<didrocks> so, dep on 3.4 for now and change it back
<Laney> it wasn't meant to change the default
<Laney> something's calling python3.5 on purpose I guess?
<Laney> oh do you have to build for all supported versions or something?
<Laney> I don't know much about python packaging :)
<didrocks> Laney: not for now, but as a best practice, I try to ensure I'm compatible in the future in case there would be multiple versions
<didrocks> Laney: but I didn't add that magic (to use all python version) in debian/rules
<didrocks> only using dh --with python3
<Laney> well you have X-Python3-Version >= 3.4
<Laney> does that make it try to build for 3.5 too?
<seb128> moving to -devel
<didrocks> yep, saw that, thanks!
<seb128> yw!
<didrocks> Laney: seems it's only using 3.5
<didrocks> Laney: and yeah, X-Python3-Version >= 3.4 should still try distro's default I guess
<didrocks> so 3.4 in that case
<didrocks> (maybe dh_python is just stupid and take the highest available)
<Laney> I think it's on purpose
<Laney> build for all supported versions
<ochosi> hey folks
<ochosi> is larsu on holidays or something?
<Laney> yes
 * ochosi has some light-themes patch that should be looked at
<ochosi> thing is, i noticed you guys don't seem to deal properly with the gtk3 overlay scrollbars
<ochosi> they cover up portions of the window when scrolling
<seb128> ochosi, hey, yes, he's and for over a month
<ochosi> i wrote a minimal patch for xubuntu which could also be applied to ambiance/radiance, if you should so wish
<seb128> that would be nice
<seb128> is upstream having that issue?
<Laney> what?
<ochosi> nice, good for him :)
<Laney> they are overlay scrollbars, they are supposed to overlay the window
<ochosi> Laney: they should be tiny when scrolling and large when hovering
<ochosi> e.g. when using the mousewheel there are only tiny indicators of your position
<ochosi> when you move the pointer to the scrollbar-area, they fully appear
<seb128> ochosi, is that bug #1472768 ?
<ubot5> bug 1472768 in gtk+3.0 (Ubuntu) "horizontal scrollbar overlays & obsures bottom line of window" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1472768
<Laney> ok, that's more info, thanks
<ochosi> yeah, that too i guess
<ochosi> so i dunno what you wanna do there
<ochosi> i can show you the patch, you can copy/paste and test and then if you generally like it i can write a small patch for ambiance/radiance
<seb128> what is adwaita doing?
<ochosi> https://github.com/shimmerproject/Greybird/commit/1745782e1928fd28fdd44530cd7b3bf6fb3283d1
<ochosi> it's doing pretty much that ^
<ochosi> but you have to convert their scss to css
<ochosi> (which is what i did)
<Laney> larsu already themed them in a branch to do this
<seb128> note that larsu was supposed to land a theme update/bugfixes before his holiday
<seb128> but that didn't happen
<seb128> which is quite annoying
<Laney> was that ready?
<seb128> Laney, do you know why that update didn't land?
<seb128> he never handed it to you?
<ochosi> Laney: at least last time i looked he didn't have a patch for the scrollbars
<Laney> no, you kept pinging him but it didn't come ...
<Laney> he said he re-wrote the scrollbar one so it didn't cause other bugs though
<ochosi> Laney: only stuff for nautilus and floating bars etc iirc
<ochosi> oh ok
<Laney> ah wait
<ochosi> then i didnt see the branch
<Laney> w_illcooke was showing it to design, now I remember
<Laney> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~larsu/ubuntu-themes/overlay-scrollbars/revision/441
<ochosi> yeah, but he doesn't hide the trough
<ochosi> only makes it thinner
<ochosi> and not even that thin
<ochosi> still quite obstructive if you ask me
<ochosi> but anyway, that's up to you guys ;)
<seb128> john was supposed to show it to mark
<seb128> and willcooke said he was pinging John about that on friday
<seb128> willcooke, did you get any reply from him?
<Laney> ochosi: can you show a screenshot of yours?
<ochosi> Laney: sure, one sec
<ochosi> Laney: you mean with ambiance?
 * ochosi fires up the vbox
<Laney> that one you just linked
<willcooke> seb128, Laney - John didn't get a chance to speak to him so we emailed Mark yesterday with the details... still waiting...
<ochosi> Laney: well it's in no way optimized for ambiance
<Laney> sure
<Laney> I just want to understand what you're talking about
<ochosi> http://i.imgur.com/b1mtN8X.png
<ochosi> so there you see the small indicator on the right in evince to indicate the scroll position
<ochosi> when you hover the right border of the window, appprox 15-20px, depending on your actual scrollbar, the full scrollbar appears
<ochosi> so this indicator style doesn't go too well with adwaita, but it can obviously be tweaked to integrate nicely
<ochosi> larsu's implementation is at least twice as wide
<ochosi> so it may obstruct text
<ochosi> plus my implementation has a transparent trough
<ochosi> which is the most important factor for not obstructing stuff below
<ochosi> note that what looks like a scrollbar trough here is only the page background of evince
<Laney> http://people.canonical.com/~laney/weird-things/scroll.png
<Laney> that is his new one
<ochosi> oh alright
<ochosi> that's pretty much like your old overlay scrollbar
<Laney> what we have *now* is gtk's default style
<ochosi> that's fine then i guess
<Laney> yes that was the idea
<ochosi> right, then go with his, since he already made it ready
<ochosi> i just didn't see the branch and was a bit concerned for your sakes when i saw ambiance's default look :)
<Laney> hehe
<Laney> I wonder if we shouldn't just upload it since it's ready and tweak more if we need to
<ochosi> yeah
<ochosi> that's what i did
<Laney> seb128: ja/nein?
<ochosi> anyway, that's it from my side ;)
<Laney> thx for pinging!
 * ochosi heads out to enjoy some swimming
<ochosi> too hot in here...
<Laney> grey as far as the eye can see here
<ochosi> Laney: no problem! if i find more merge-worthy stuff i'll keep you posted
<Laney> http://www.bbc.co.uk/weather/ng5
<ochosi> i'm tempted to say "lucky you" cause we've been hit by one heat wave after another
<ochosi> not the typical austrian weather really
<seb128> Laney, +1, I though that uploading the current work and iteration was +1ed last week with larsu and that he would work with you before being on holidays
<seb128> but seems he dropped the ball
<seb128> I'm a bit annoyed at him, he said he would land those themes changes for like 3 weeks before being off and he didn't
<Laney> I got a bit confused
<Laney> with getting it reviewed by mark and stuff
<ochosi> fwiw, i've reviewed the code of his merges
<Laney> plus I thought there was a "general" theme update coming
<ochosi> at least that part seems fine, so you really have no worries there
<Laney> meh
<Laney> let's just push these two (nautilus and scrollbars)
<seb128> thanks
<ochosi> anyway, hf!
 * ochosi is off
<Laney> swim well!
<seb128> well, I think the Mark review is more about the new overlay scrollbars
<seb128> rather than UI details
<Laney> don't think it matters, if we need to tweak then it's change either way
<seb128> ochosi, enjoy, and thanks for bringing the discussion ... you extra changes, please merge proposed them if you can, so we can test/see the difference and maybe include them :-)
<seb128> right
<Laney> https://code.launchpad.net/~larsu/ubuntu-themes/overlay-scrollbars/+merge/265372 <- review please?
<darkxst> hey laney seb128, bug 1475949 deals with the schema changes
<ubot5> bug 1475949 in unity-settings-daemon (Ubuntu) "Port to relocated peripheral settings" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1475949
<darkxst> after that, suppose just waiting on infinity to look into the g-o-a/webkit2gtk demotions
<Laney> yeah, I'm feeling a bit "aaahhhh" at the minute, hopefully someone else can review those for you
<seb128> hey darkxst, I saw it yesterday but I didn't look at the new g-s-d and I'm not really familiar with the transition
<Laney> maybe robert_ancell?
<darkxst> seb128, I reverted a few other keys in g-s-d that were removed
<seb128> do you have a bug for the transition/explaining what changed/is being transitioned and the impact?
<seb128> Laney, k, scrollbar change reviewed/tested/approved
<darkxst> seb128, not exactly, most periphal keys moved into gsettings except the ones that are x11 specific
<darkxst> a couple were renamed, but the migration code, patches handle that
<darkxst> I can add some more info to that bug report I guess
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> I'm going to try to have a look today
<seb128> but feel free to ping robert_ancell if I don't
<seb128> he's closer from your tz, you should be able to grab him on IRC :-)
<Laney> I made http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/sponsoring/ubuntu-desktop.html exist yesterday btw
<Laney> because I was worried about missing stuff and I don't get emailed about those for some reason
<darkxst> seb128,  the only real user facing change is that touchpad disable while typing option is gone and always enabled
<TheMuso> cat .irf
<TheMuso> whoops
<willcooke> hey TheMuso!  How are you?
<Laney> muhahah, you revealed yourself!
<willcooke> :D
<Laney> https://twitter.com/stevegwestby/status/623113645589987329
<Laney> crap
<Laney> need to get down there at lunch
<willcooke> Laney, don't mess around man, go now
<seb128> Laney, useful, I glance on the main package for desktop ones every now and then but it's easier to read an already filtered one
<seb128> darkxst, k, I think it's fine to have that always enabled
<Laney> seb128: it's only desktop team as reviwer atm, not all desktop packages
<Laney> could do that probably
<willcooke> Laney, seb128 - +1 from sabdfl for the OSBs
<willcooke> \m/
<Laney> happy days
<Laney> anpok_: any news on the mir issue?
<davmor2> willcooke: One Stop Bungee?  Or a rope as it used to be called ;)
<anpok_> Laney: still a riddle what causes the stack smashing.. we forgot to bump an abi.. but that isnt causing the trouble..
<anpok_> so I assumed that platform graphics would be causing it...
<anpok_> now it seems it is mirprotobuf instead..
<anpok_> but thats very unlikely
<Laney> bleh
<seb128> Laney, anpok_technically I think we could go with forcing the u-s-c update using packaging rules and go away with it to unblock the situation, there is still a bug to fix but not one that should impact users if the upgrade is locked as one set
<anpok_> seb128: I just started my last attempt
<anpok_> .. but meanwhile - how would you force that?
<seb128> anpok_, k, let us know how it goes
<seb128> anpok_, well, having one of the mir debs to conflicts or such on the old u-s-c so updating mir force update u-s-c
<Laney> yes, probably Breaks: from libmirclientX to u-s-c (<< new-version) would be good
<willcooke> Laney, jhodapp and co have got gstreamer in good shape
<jhodapp> Laney, indeed...abeato sent an email requesting both of us review his MRs for it
<jhodapp> Laney, we need to make sure to land media-hub with the updated gst-plugins-bad or else video will break on the phone
<Laney> jhodapp: yus, I saw, if you review then I can get ready to upload
<Laney> can add a breaks, that's no worry
<jhodapp> Laney, will do, I'll do that in ~2 hours after my morning meetings wrap up
<Laney> great!
<Laney> thanks for working on it
<jhodapp> Laney, np, I'm going to suggest for our next sprint that we start working on upstreaming it too so we no longer have to maintain a distro patch for it
<Laney> oh my gawd
<Laney> that would make me joyous
<jhodapp> me too :)
<ricotz> Sweet5hark, hi, any news about the l10n requests for "am" and "gug"?
<anpok_> Laney, seb128: ok the attempt failed.. probably because of an init bug in libprotobuf itself..
<anpok_> ... what was the suggestion - a change in usc/debian/control or another change in mir/debian/control?
<Laney> anpok_: something like http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~laney/mir/breaks-old-usc/revision/2762 (untested)
<anpok_> Laney: will that work on vivid+overlay too?
<Laney> what's the version of u-s-c there?
<Laney> probably not
<Laney> you could bump the major version and use << that
<Laney> s/major/upstream/ (the bit before the +)
<anpok_> hm what about libmirserver32 breaks libmirserver31?
<Laney> does it?
<anpok_> the problem seems to be that we cannot have two versions of libmirprotobuf installed in parallel because of libprotobuf (which is the last thing I tried) .. and replacing the libmirprotobuf0 from 13.3 with 14.0 seems to cause the problem, and the reverse seemed to resolve the problem..
<willcooke> ricotz,  sweet5hark is off sick today
<ricotz> willcooke, alright, thanks
<Laney> anpok_: I think I'm confused at this point... can you maybe work with RAOF or someone to get this uploaded? He's a core-dev so ought to be able to upload stuff.
<willcooke> seb128, sorry for late notice, qengho and I are in a meeting which is likely to overrun a few mins, would you mind getting the meeting started, I have updates for Robert, Luke and Aron
<desrt> time for seb to shine...
<seb128> willcooke, sure can do
<seb128> desrt, 1 min before time according to my computer
<willcooke> thanks seb128
<seb128> #startmeeting
<meetingology> Meeting started Tue Jul 21 15:30:06 2015 UTC.  The chair is seb128. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
<seb128> ok, now seems about right
<didrocks> hey
<desrt> sorry... saw :29 and was unsure :)
<willcooke> attente (maybe out), desrt,  dgadomski, didrocks, fjkong, happyaron (out), laney, larsu (out), qengho (otp with me), seb128, sweet5hark (out), tkamppeter, themuso (out), robert_ancell (out)
<willcooke> seb128, had that in gedit ready to go ^^
<qengho> Hey hey
<seb128> k, willcooke had the rollcall ;-)
<dgadomski> hey
<seb128> willcooke, thanks, I was looking at irclog to copy a previous one
<Laney> HI!
<seb128> ok, let's the fun begin
<FJKong> hi
<seb128> #topic attente (or not?)
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: attente (or not?)
<seb128> attente, hey
<attente> hi
<attente> not much from me, re-factoring some of the menu positioning code in gtk to allow us to pass in attachment rectangles to mir
<seb128> k, he's here :-)
<seb128> what's the status of the gtk mir backend?
<seb128> I didn't look at the version in proposed/the new mir yet, but that has quite some improvements right?
<attente> it has some bug fixes, but we're still missing big things like clipboard and drag and drop
<seb128> k
<seb128> attente, thanks
<seb128> #topic desrt
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: desrt
<attente> and right now, the menus aren't positioned properly if they flood off screen, but that's in-progress
<seb128> k
<desrt> hey... helping attente a bit with the mirgtk stuff lately
<seb128> sorry I though you were done with the update
<desrt> also working on [the secret project]
<desrt> not a lot of success there...
<seb128> still the same project?
<desrt> aside, mostly bug backlog catchup
<desrt> yes
<Laney> HAHA
<seb128> k
<Laney> how very intriguing
<desrt> heh
<seb128> secret project, round 6
<desrt> there is a branch now
<desrt> but everything is segfaulting :)
<seb128> minor detail!
<desrt> gonna try to spend a couple more days this week on that
<desrt> that's all
<seb128> thanks desrt
<seb128> #topic dgadomski
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: dgadomski
<seb128> dgadomski, hey
<dgadomski> hey
<dgadomski> I've been mostly trying to drive forward the issues I mentioned last week
<dgadomski> - identified the cause of bug #1473458, reported upstream (https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=752481). I was not able to fix it fully so far, I am counting on upstream suggestions in that area.
<dgadomski> - kept working on reproducing bug #1297849, no success, but I'm going to backport some upstream commits removing dependency on shell version, which should solve it. I am going to do some tests and discuss it with cyphermox.
<dgadomski> - upstream developers identified the cause of bug #1464645 to be related to libsmbclient rather than gvfs, reported upstream bug https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=752481, although a commit backport is required to enable kerberos login instead of anonymous (https://git.gnome.org/browse/gvfs/commit/?id=a0aec32).
<dgadomski> and that's it
<seb128> dgadomski, I saw that nm/number of connection bug discuted on debian channel, did you follow the discussion there/talk with them about it?
<seb128> or is that coincidences they are talking about it as well?
<dgadomski> seb128: no, I guess it was a coincidence
<Laney> I bet smcv saw the bug come in
<seb128> k, I'm going to have a look to the logs after the meeting see if I can give you an useful pointer/info
<dgadomski> seb128: I will check the irclog about that, do you remember when was that?
<seb128> Laney, likely yes
<Laney> oh no
<Laney> it was one day before :P
<seb128> dgadomski, jul 15 on #debian-gnome
<Laney> dgadomski: there was no real discussion, just someone asking why the limit was raised
<seb128> not sure if that channel has IRC logs?
<seb128> juil. 15 12:11:27 <smcv>	mbiebl: I think it's madness to have random daemons unilaterally changing the system bus' global limits
<Laney> but the other guy didn't reply
<seb128> Laney, ^ that one?
<Laney> y
<Laney> a
<seb128> I don't have the start of the discussion
<seb128> what daemon are they talking about?
<Laney> nm
<seb128> k, so today nm already change the limit?
<seb128> or they were talking about doing that as a fix for dgadomski's mentioned issue?
<Laney> yes probably for this issue
<Laney> but any number can be too low I guess
<Laney> if you have more connections than that
<seb128> right
<seb128> let's check debian bugs report after the meeting
<seb128> dgadomski, thanks
<Laney> so retrying seems sensible
<seb128> #topic didrocks
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: didrocks
<seb128> didrocks, hey
<didrocks> hey
<didrocks> * Was on holidays until Friday. Mostly emails catchup then.
<didrocks> * Ubuntu Make:
<didrocks> - Released Ubuntu Make 0.9. More info at http://blog.didrocks.fr/post/Arduino-support-and-various-fix-in-Ubuntu-Make-0.9
<didrocks> - Fix Visual Studio Code 32 bits support + tests updates
<didrocks> - Transition from unsupported Dart Editor to Dart SDK + tests updates (still letting users able to remove old Dart Editor)
<didrocks> - Bugs and suggestions triaging + multiple pull requests review
<didrocks> * Gog customer service: followed up (issue with sdl library)
<didrocks> * Blocked some github spammer on the ubuntu organization projects (my first \o/)
<didrocks> .
<seb128> didrocks, thanks, good to have you back, I hope you had good holidays :-)
<didrocks> yeah, was excellent, thanks! :)
<seb128> #topic FJKong
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: FJKong
<seb128> FJKong, hey
<FJKong> hey
<FJKong> 1 analyze sogoupinyin panic log file reported by community user
<FJKong>   It semms problem is about libarary version
<FJKong> 2 account loginin problem, some error like:
<FJKong> Your account has been suspended. Please contact login support to re-enable it
<FJKong> no response from support team
<FJKong> 3 prepare documents for VISA for GUADEC
<FJKong> 4  research on some skin lack of statusbar image, impore stability
 * willcooke is back
<seb128> FJKong, thanks
 * Laney tells a friend
<seb128> #topic happyaron
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: happyaron
<willcooke> I got that...
<seb128> #chair willcooke
<meetingology> Current chairs: seb128 willcooke
<willcooke> 1. Update fcitx and friends
<willcooke> 2. ibus crash analysis and bug triagings
<willcooke> eof
<seb128> willcooke, feel free to take on from there
<willcooke> thx seb128
<seb128> yw!
<willcooke> #topic Laney
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Laney
<Laney> HI
<Laney> â¢ short week: off friday
<Laney> â¢ more shepherding of gstreamer and e-d-s, they should both be ready to go today or tomorrow depending on when some people manage to finish reviews. yay!
<Laney> â¢ keep an eye on autopkgtest-cloud and whack things when they need it
<Laney> â¢ new gtk point release
<Laney> â stuck in proposed due to new mir, try to help get that unblocked without a great degree of success
<Laney> â¢ gnome-screensaver crash fix (D + U), glib crash fix for same bug (going through review/fix rounds upstream)
<Laney> â¢ DMB: some applicants to look at, approve new member, poke about happyaron's packageset change
<Laney> â¢ look at poppler for gcc5/qt5.4, upload patch & send to BTS
<Laney> â¢ check/upload theme merges that larsu left for us, can haz styled scrollbars
<Laney> â¢ next:  new glib, new gtk, upload gcr/gnupg2 from ppa, push gstreamer, push eds, patch pilot (been delaying it)
<Laney> â¾
<willcooke> thx Laney
<willcooke> #topic qengho
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: qengho
<willcooke> hello again qengho
<qengho> - two sick days, Thur, Fri.
<qengho> - more ozone-mir work.  Fixing some mir API changes in Wily.
<qengho> - some Firefox support research.
<qengho> EOF
<willcooke> thx qengho
<willcooke> hope you're feeling better
<willcooke> #topic seb128
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: seb128
<qengho> Thx.
<seb128> â¢ looked at some touch bugs
<seb128> â untranslatable strings in dialer
<seb128> â dialpad keys shouldn't be translatable
<seb128> â wrong strings used in dialer (not matching design)
<seb128> â wrong icons ratio in the messaging menu
<seb128> â¢ unity-settings-daemon landing for larsu (bugfixes for touchpad toggle key & build)
<seb128> â¢ helped the mir team with proposed-migration issues
<seb128> â¢ NEW reviews for GNOME packages uploaded by robert-ancell (gnome-calendar, california, gsound, gnome-taquin, gnome-multi-writer)
<seb128> â¢ quite some bugs triage (desktop & touch)
<seb128> â¢ reviewed some theme changes
<seb128> â¢ fixed non-translatable totem menus in wily & vivid-sru
<seb128> next: look at snappy personal scope & gcc transition
<seb128> </week>
<willcooke> thx seb128
<willcooke> sweetshark is sick, so on to
<willcooke> #topic tkamppeter
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: tkamppeter
<tkamppeter> hi
<tkamppeter> I mainly studied ways how cups-browsed can observe jobs and printer creations/deletions by CUPS
<tkamppeter> For being able to better lead with which printer should be the default printer and to allow load balancing if one printer is provided by several servers.
<tkamppeter> Also worked on bugs.
<willcooke> thanks tkamppeter
<willcooke> #topic TheMuso
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: TheMuso
<willcooke> * Started working on accessibility profile settings that are best suited for the GNOME and mate flavours.
<willcooke> * Fix some small issues in the installer with regards to using Orca and the keyboard to tab around the installer, i.e labels were marked as focusable when they should not be.
<willcooke> * Fix the casper a11y code to properly apply accessibility settings for a user during install, without the need for first time startup hacks.
<willcooke> #topic robert_ancell
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: robert_ancell
<willcooke> - Fixed XMir bugs
<willcooke> - Updated xorg packages
<willcooke> - Updated GNOME packages
<willcooke> #topic any other business
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: any other business
<willcooke> Anyone got anything they want to talk about?
<willcooke> Oh, I think one thing is that we are +1 on the new overlay scrollbars
<willcooke> which you might have already picked up from irc earlier
<willcooke> any more for any more?
<seb128> we have them active in wily and uploaded a first theming version
<seb128> we can tweak more if design gives us guidance
<seb128> (well at least once larsu is back ;-)
<willcooke> cool!
<willcooke> ok, let's #endmeeting
<willcooke> #endmeeting
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Breaking your systems: GTK 3.16 - file bugs with tag "gtk316"
<meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Jul 21 15:55:00 2015 UTC.
<meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2015/ubuntu-desktop.2015-07-21-15.30.moin.txt
<didrocks> thanks
<willcooke> thank you everyonbe
<dgadomski> thanks
<seb128> thanks
<Laney> merci
 * Laney needs to go buy 4 more beer fest tix and relocate to tea shop
<Laney> that makes 17 tickets Ã Â£20
<Laney> :o
<willcooke> credit card points
<Laney> I sooooooooo love getting people to pay back money they owe
<seb128> Laney, dgadomski, k, the comment I copied earlier was a follow up to that commit http://cgit.freedesktop.org/NetworkManager/NetworkManager/commit/?id=2c299ba65c51e9c407090dc83929d692c74ee3f2
<dgadomski> seb128, Laney: I have found 2 related debian bugs: https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=781007 https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=773525 with info that they were fixed in nm 1.0.0-3
<seb128> right, that seems a discussion around that
<dgadomski> I'll take a look and see what's in the source
<seb128> dpm-afk, can you approve https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/wily/+source/totem/+imports?field.filter_status=all&field.filter_extension=pot for me ?
<seb128> dpm-afk, unping
<seb128> dpm-afk, I did it, just got confused by the UI, the "approve" was disabled not because of acl but because the domain was not configured
<seb128> good everning desktopers!
<willcooke> night all
<Noskcaj> gegl-0.3 test builds are at ppa:noskcaj/gegl if someone wans to help test
#ubuntu-desktop 2015-07-22
<didrocks> good morning
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<anpok_> seb128: ok .. AlbertA removed the libmirprotobuf0 ABI breaks from 0.14
<anpok_> with that boottest should work
<seb128> anpok_, does that resolve the usc issue?
<seb128> great :-)
<anpok_> need to fix my krillin - I bricked it yesterday with my last attempt to bump libmirprotobuf0 to 1 which went boom..
<Noskcaj> Does anyone here have the time to upload gegl 0.3?
<Noskcaj> It and the required patches to gnome-photos and gimp are in ppa:noskcaj/gegl
<Noskcaj> Debian hasn't yet uploaded this due to a lack of response from the gimp maintainer, and it would be nice to get it before FF
<willcooke> hihi
<seb128> hey willcooke
<seb128> how is u.k today?
<willcooke> so far, not bad.  Nice and warm
<willcooke> how about you?
<davmor2> seb128: warm and grey here
<Laney> heya
<seb128> not so sunny here today
<seb128> hey Laney
<Laney> anpok_: nice!
<Laney> hey seb128 willcooke davmor2
<Laney> what's up?
<Laney> yeah pretty grey here
<seb128> Noskcaj, is that new gegl a transition? is there a bug about it?
<davmor2> Laney: Ceiling, Sky, Clouds and stuff
<Laney> troposphere stratosphere mesosphere thermosphere exosphere
<seb128> *sphere
<Laney> heliosphere
<Laney> probably more spheres that i don't know about
<willcooke> don't forget heaven
<Laney> is that up????
<davmor2> ISS
<davmor2> willcooke: can't blag me the song specifically says Heaven is a place on Earth :P
<Noskcaj> seb128, yes, there's a transition. There's a debian auto-gegl tracker, and we have bugs for the new upstream release of gegl and gnome-photos from robert_ancell, but no actual transition bug
<seb128> Noskcaj, how is debian handling that transition if they don't update gegl?
<seb128> Noskcaj, can you share the bug numbers?
<Noskcaj> bug 1470282 bug 1470658
<ubot5> bug 1470282 in gegl (Ubuntu) "Update to 0.3" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1470282
<ubot5> bug 1470658 in gnome-photos (Ubuntu) "Update to 3.16" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1470658
<Noskcaj> https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=790421
<ubot5> Debian bug 790421 in src:gimp "gimp: please bump GEGL build-dependency to 0.3.0" [Wishlist,Open]
<seb128> I guess first step would be to add your work to the first bug and subscribe sponsors then?
<Noskcaj> it's in debian exp currently, waiting on a response from the gimp maintainer AFAIK
<seb128> response to what?
<seb128> is there an issue/concern with gimp?
<Noskcaj> about patching gimp to support the new gegl
<Noskcaj> It's just changing compile stuff, no real code patches
<seb128> is that patch upstream?
<Laney> renamed pcfile
<Noskcaj> I've tested gimp and gnome-photos
<Noskcaj> brb, dinner
<darkxst> hey Laney  seb128,  robert_ancell bounced me back to you guys for the u-s-d/u-c-c gsettings changes ;(
<seb128> lol
<seb128> he's not interested? or too busy? or not in agreement?
<darkxst> seb128, said he didnt understand enough about the changes
<Laney> haha
<seb128> k, same than me then :p
<seb128> it needs somebody wanting to sit down for some hours
<darkxst> I added some more details on the bug about what has changed
<Laney> i am supposed to patch pilot some time
<Laney> will look then
<darkxst> Laney, k, thanks
<seb128> somebody should hit GNOME with a "gsettings schemas are api" stick
<darkxst> seb128, at the same time, it makes no sense having mutter use schemas from g-s-d (under wayland, where the g-s-d plugin is disabled)
<seb128> darkxst, it doesn't need to, they could have let the old schemas in place untouched and created a new set of keys
<seb128> having some migration code write the new keys on first start and letting the old untouched
<seb128> and having the new code using the new keys only
<seb128> that would have let the old "api" untouched
<darkxst> seb128, the issue here is that u-s-d shares g-s-d schemas
<darkxst> seb128, how do you know the settings have been migrated?
<seb128> you write a new boolean key "settings-migrated"?
<seb128> which default to false
<darkxst> the GNOME approach was to reset everything to default setting
<seb128> and write it to true when you do the migration
<darkxst> seb128, but really this is a unique case, no other downstream, shares the g-s-d schemas
<Noskcaj> seb128, gimp is patched upstream, but i've not yet found the patch
<seb128> darkxst, it's the usual GNOME line of thinking, they do the same for GTK
<seb128> "let's change ABI, the only users of that API that we know about are things we can fix'
<seb128> oh well, I guess that's not a discussion that's going to help there
<seb128> darkxst, if Laney doesn't review it I can try to have a look this week
<seb128> but same as robert_ancell, I don't understand the details atm
<darkxst> seb128, its a little different to GTK, but yes I do agree they behave similar in that case
<darkxst> since there is absolutely no guarantee about g-s-d api's/schemas
<Noskcaj> upstream gegl patch https://git.gnome.org/browse/gimp/commit/configure.ac?id=f72c138771369575f87f272be1cb94372c220d97
<seb128> that commit is from 2013
<Noskcaj> yes
<Noskcaj> gimp hasn't had a new major release in years
<Noskcaj> and that's in master, not the 2.8 branch
<seb128> you made sure that 2.8 builds with the new gegl?
<Noskcaj> yep, that's what's in the ppa
<Noskcaj> worked fine on my pc
<seb128> k
<seb128> no gegl in the sponsoring queue?
<seb128> let me know when it's there and I can have a look
<Noskcaj> there
<Noskcaj> the ~ppa1 versions will need dropping, i won't have time to do that for a while, so just take it if you can please
<seb128> there?
<Noskcaj> there = sponsors subscribed
<seb128> k
<desrt> *yawn* good morning desktop
<seb128> hey desrt
<seb128> desrt, how are you?
<desrt> okay
<desrt> how's life in schengen?
<seb128> good
<seb128> we have some sun again since yesterday ;-)
<didrocks> morning desrt!
<desrt> it's been great here lately
<desrt> except a bit humid :)
<desrt> hihi didrocks
<didrocks> still really warm here
 * desrt is starting to get excited about vacation :)
<didrocks> will be better in a couple of hours, supposed to rain
<seb128> desrt, when/where do you go?
<desrt> i have two weeks off starting monday
<desrt> when i return, i will not be the same person
<desrt> my mind will have been warped
<desrt> two solid weeks of speaking esperanto
<seb128> :-)
<seb128> do you go to any european conf after that?
<desrt> debconf is two weeks after
<desrt> then back home
<seb128> so spending a bit over a month in europe?
<desrt> about a month
<desrt> two weeks after = "not the next week, but the one after"
<seb128> I see
<seb128> we probably see each others at debconf then ;-)
<desrt> reminds me
 * desrt has to send an email about that
<seb128> I'm still not 100% sure going but I should
<desrt> is everyone eating at the venue place?
<desrt> ie: did you take the meal option in the sign-up?
<seb128> no
<seb128> I didn't at least
<desrt> "From the main train station you can reach the youth hostel by bus within 10 minutes"
<desrt> sounds like there will be no shortage of food outside :)
<didrocks> I didn't either
<didrocks> seb128: but your room is book, isn't it?
<didrocks> booked*
<seb128> didrocks, I guess so, Michelle was supposed to do the booking no?
<seb128> I didn't check
<desrt> msm sent an email to me saying that she booked me a room
<didrocks> seb128: I don't know if she doesn't only do that for those having their travel request number
<seb128> I've a confirmation number on the gdoc
<seb128> so I guess she did
<didrocks> great :)
<desrt> attente will be here soon
<desrt> i'm going to go put on some pants
<desrt> :D
<seb128> lol
<didrocks> ;)
<desrt> there's a bit of an inside joke there.  ask attente some time about his new opinion on pants ;)
<seb128> or ask him about swimming pants
<seb128> I'm sure Laney remembers ;-)
<desrt> was there an 'accident'?
<seb128> let's say that one should be aware that some clothes become transparents when wet
<desrt> oh.  i see.
<desrt> or maybe i'd prefer not to see, in fact...
<seb128> right
<desrt> that is some seriously poor engineering on swim shorts....
<seb128> unsure if those were designed to swim
<seb128> or if attente just decided to pick that to go swimming
<desrt> no 'usability testing'
<didrocks> you are not supposed to wear pants in swimming pool, so then, bear with it! :)
 * ogra_ finds another channel to lurk
<desrt> "William is a young software engineer.  He enjoys rock climbing and swimming."
<desrt> ^ gotta have your usecases down
<attente> D:
<seb128> tedg, what makes an url type defined for url-dispatcher?
<tedg> seb128, If the package has a hook for a url-dispatcher file.
<tedg> seb128, We then parse it and put that into a cache database
<tedg> seb128, So technically, in the sqlite db, but realistically the url-dispatcher file is how you get there.
<seb128> tedg, hum, so entries in /usr/share/url-dispatcher/urls/ ?
<tedg> seb128, Yeah, for debs
<tedg> seb128, I was thinking you were asking for clicks
<seb128> tedg, I'm trying to understand bug 1477149
<ubot5> bug 1477149 in gallery-app (Ubuntu) "/usr/bin/gallery-app:url-dispatcher-bad-url" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1477149
<ogra_> for clicks you use an "app.url-dispatcher" file .... http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ogra/junk/google-plus-app/files
<seb128> tedg, which is basically appid:/// not being recogniezed
<seb128> " appid://com.ubuntu.camera/camera/current-user-version "
<tedg> seb128, appid:/// is handled internally, so in that case it is the camera not being installed.
<seb128> it's installed
<seb128> and I can start it from the dash
<tedg> seb128, click list ?
<tedg> seb128, Is it still called com.ubuntu.camera ?
<seb128> it's not a click
<seb128> that's on the snappy personal image
<tedg> Oh, then that appid won't work.
<seb128> yeah for convergence :-/
<tedg> Why is it not a click on personal?
<seb128> because snappy and clicks are not friends
<seb128> we have snaps there only
<tedg> Ah, so we need a way to launch snaps.
<tedg> Which requires a way for snaps to define applications instead of binaries.
<seb128> well, camera is not snapified yet
<seb128> it's part of the image
<seb128> but I guess you have no interest in supporting debs on the base image?
<tedg> I'm not sure how that'd really work...
<tedg> We're using those fields to look up in the Click database.
<seb128> can't we just look up for a <name>.desktop
<tedg> I think the work around that would be possible is if you had the camera register camera:/// and then gallery call that.
<tedg> Then the deb could register that URL and we could call the desktop file.
<tedg> I need to run a kid to camp, brb.
<seb128> tedg, thanks for the replies!
<ogra_> seb128, do you happen to know a way to set a kbd layout on a user level without accessing the system settings (/me just has a question on G+ from someone using a real kbd with his phone and i dont want to suggest making it writable)
<seb128> ogra_, under mir? no idea, I don't even know if that's possible...
<ogra_> heh, k
<ogra_> thanks
<seb128> greyback_ might know
<seb128> yw
<ogra_> well, for convergence it will have to be possible ... one day :)
<seb128> yeah, kenvandine is working with the mir team to get api defined for input config
<ogra_> (but i guess we'll just add keymaps to the rootfs and make the confi dir writable for that)
<greyback_> ogra_: I believe mir supports different kbd layouts, but unity8 not exporting that yet
<ogra_> ah, k
<dgadomski> cyphermox: hey, do you have a sec to talk about bug #1297849?
<ubot5> bug 1297849 in network-manager-vpnc (Ubuntu) "[SRU] Virtual private network connection fails after distribution upgrade due to outdated Network Manager configuration files" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1297849
<cyphermox> sure
<dgadomski> cyphermox: I don't know what the root cause is, but since it has be identified that it has something to do with obtaining shell version by dbus it may be some kind of a race condition
<dgadomski> upstream has removed this shell watcher implementation
<dgadomski> do you think backporting https://git.gnome.org/browse/network-manager-applet/commit/?id=4473e6a48fcfda1d87d4a4bc9f5c0589235dcfe0 makes sense?
<dgadomski> I think it will make the problem go away, but I'm not sure if it will not have any unwanted implications
<cyphermox> it looks fine, aiui we also don't autostart in the shell, but better make sure first
<dgadomski> I've done some tests with this change backported and saw no problems
<cyphermox> otherwise the other patch looked okay-ish
<cyphermox> in which release?
<dgadomski> however, I haven't been able to reproduce the problem in the first place
<cyphermox> ok
<dgadomski> in vivid
<cyphermox> ok
<dgadomski> maybe I can prepare a ppa and ask for testing in a comment
<cyphermox> bah
<cyphermox> let me just check the autostart, then we can just upload to trusty-proposed
<dgadomski> backporting to trusty is less trivial, I would need more time to merge it
<dgadomski> or we could use the other patch for trusty
<cyphermox> sorry i meant vivid :)
<dgadomski> phew :)
<dgadomski> attaching debdiff to the bug is ok?
<cyphermox> sure, but what concerns me is that I'm not sure this is gnome-shell specific
<dgadomski> cyphermox: I've analyzed comment #60 and it makes sense, for whatever reason nm-applet hangs there before it failed to obtain shell version in 5 attempts
<dgadomski> so it's either a race condition or something else, but this patch should remove that dependency
<cyphermox> dgadomski: the short patch with a notify is safest
<cyphermox> but I'm still not convinced it will actually really fix the "bugs" people are seeing
<dgadomski> cyphermox: for both vivid & trusty?
<cyphermox> vivid and utopic
<cyphermox> well, for wily too
<cyphermox> can you upload?
<dgadomski> I can only attach it to the bug (but it's already there), I don't have other upload rights
<cyphermox> ok
<cyphermox> well I already have a debdiff then
<cyphermox> I'll do the uploads now
<dgadomski> cool, thanks
 * Laney cries at moar autopkgtest failures
<cyphermox> dgadomski: uploaded to wily., utopic and trusty, but there currently is a package in -proposed for vivid.
<dgadomski> thanks
<dgadomski> so I guess it will hit vivid-proposed right after this one will be promoted to -updates, right?
<willcooke> hrm.  Just downloaded the W daily image and I can't log in.  From /var/log/lightdm/x-0-greeter.log
<willcooke> I see that unity-greeter.vala died
<willcooke> is that a red herring?
<seb128> willcooke, what happens when you try to log in?
<willcooke> seb128, it just sits there
<seb128> on the greeter?
<seb128> like after you entered your password?
<willcooke> I've just got purple salad "Ubuntu 15.10" in the cornet
<willcooke> corner
<willcooke> the login boxes etc have gone
<seb128> can you check what logs are in .cache/upstart ?
<seb128> like gnome-session-Unity.log
<willcooke> dont have that one
<seb128> weird
<willcooke> have dbus, jayatana, notify-cgmanager and unity-gtk-module
<seb128> anything in ~/.xsession-errors ?
<willcooke> $things terminated with status 127
<seb128> right, those are not an issue
<seb128> what about /var/log/*.log?
<seb128> the lightdm and greeter ones
<seb128> can you pastebin those?
<willcooke> sure
<willcooke> seb128, how's this?  http://paste.ubuntu.com/11920734/
<seb128> willcooke, it's like you entered wrong password or something
<seb128> "[+13.27s] DEBUG: Session: Failed during authentication"
<seb128> then you tried a guest session which "worked" it seems
<willcooke> seb128, guest session is the same
<seb128> not according to the log
<willcooke> lies
<willcooke> !
<willcooke> ;)
<seb128>  /var/lib/lightdm-data/guest-TYxDIn/.xsession-errors doesn't have more issues?
<seb128> or /var/lib/lightdm-data/guest-TYxDIn/.cache/upstart
<seb128> but it looks like your normal session failed on auth issues ... you are sure of your password? not keymap issue?
<Laney> password on a live session?
<willcooke> I've tired another guest session, same deal, just sits there
<willcooke> having checked /var/lib/lightdm-data/guest<whatever>
<willcooke> there is no .xsession-errors file
<willcooke> or indeed a .cache dir
 * willcooke tries a live session from usb
<seb128> Laney, who said it's a live session?
<willcooke> oh, side note - when I boot up the network notification is just a black oblong
<seb128> I assumed it was a new install
<Laney> "the W daily image"
<willcooke> yeah, install from the daily iso
<seb128> right, I assumed it was an install from the daily
<Laney> I wouldn't call that booting the daily image
<seb128> nobody said that
<seb128> he said he downloaded the daily image :p
<seb128> anyway
<seb128> willcooke, is that a liveCD or an install?
<willcooke> install
<seb128> if it's an install, was the live session working?
<willcooke> just trying a live session from usb now...
<seb128> or did you pick the installer mode?
<willcooke> I did installer
<willcooke> live session just booting....
<seb128> k
<willcooke> hrm, black screen
<willcooke> I can get to tty1
<Laney> same here
<Laney> something is fucked
<seb128> k
<seb128> I don't have a daily handy, I can download one but it's likely going to be a first thing tomorrow for me
<seb128> I wonder if that's the buggy live-build upload that bugged upstart on the phone
<seb128> there was a fix just uploaded for that
<Laney> only-ubiquity mode works
<Laney> weird
<seb128> I guess upstart buggy would only bug the user sessions
<seb128> since system is systemd
<seb128> unsure about ubiquity mode
<Laney> yeah that probably doesn't use upstart
<seb128> k, so my bet is on that
<seb128> willcooke, I would say to wait tomorrow morning
<seb128> it's likely fix commited and going to be good on next iso build
<Laney> what is worrying is that the smoke testing passed
<willcooke> sure thing, thanks
<Laney> ...
<seb128> we have a "boot to desktop" test?
<Laney> obviously not
<seb128> k, I was unsure what is in the tests you just mentioned
<seb128> but I guess "not enough"
<Laney> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-test-case-dev/ubuntu-test-cases/desktop/files/head:/testsuites/usit/
<seb128> k
<seb128> nothing about the user session indeed
<Laney> I don't know if they run on an installed system or just the image
<Laney> cyphermox: halp?
<Laney> well, actually a test that live mode works would have been enough here
<Laney> indeed I see initctl not found in .cache/upstart/dbus.log
<Laney> willcooke: if you reinstall upstart it fixes things, btw
<Laney> apt-get install --reinstall upstart
 * willcooke tries
<willcooke> yah!
<willcooke> is good
<cyphermox> hello?
<Laney> hey, how's it going? ;)
<cyphermox> not bad, you? :)
<Laney> super
<Laney> it's nearly quittin' time
<Laney> aaaaaaaaaaaanyway
<willcooke> Laney, next time you boot you daily can you see if you also get a black oblong where the "Connected to network" notification should be while in the greeter.  Might just be me
<Laney> willcooke: those happen in the greeter on the desktop for me, I think it's a driver/compositing/something thing
<Laney> maybe Robert knows
<willcooke> oki, thx
<Laney> cyphermox: I/we was wondering about the smoke tests... do they operate purely on the image or do/can they work on the resulting installed system?
<Laney> cyphermox: Today's image has a busted live session due to missing /sbin/initctl and yet smoke testing passed
<cyphermox> they do work on the installed system
<cyphermox> that's how lvm test works
<Laney> so can we add a test that checks unity comes up, or something?
<cyphermox> smoke tests are busted in general, I think they don't fail if it times out in some particular state
<cyphermox> well, provided you have one way to test that
<cyphermox> I'm thinking we should add a "desktop screenshot" thing at the end, just to be safe.
<cyphermox> (if it's not already tehre)
<Laney> I just see tests which poke around the filesystem, nothing which does anything desktoppy
<Laney> unless that is somewhere else
<cyphermox> the empty app thing
<cyphermox> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-test-case-dev/ubuntu-test-cases/desktop/files/head:/testsuites/usit/empty_startup_app/
<Laney> ah right, cool
<Laney> sooo... did that pass?
<Laney> do these even all get run?
<cyphermox> ah, wait, no
<cyphermox> the oem-config one should be failing
<cyphermox> if it was run..
<Laney> https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/view/wily/view/Smoke%20Testing/job/wily-desktop-amd64-smoke-oem/
<Laney> it ran yesterday
<Laney> ...
<cyphermox> yeah, this is special
<cyphermox> jsut a sec
<Laney> I'm going to file a bug
<Laney> are you the right person to be going to for this stuff or should it be the QA team?
<cyphermox> it runs next to nothing: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-test-case-dev/ubuntu-test-cases/desktop/view/head:/runlists/default.run
<Laney> HAHA
<cyphermox> it's not really owned by anyone
<cyphermox> I can enable moar tests and then start the smoke testing again, we'll see how things behave
<davmor2> willcooke: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RQC7dweRTKU you'll appreciate this :)
<cyphermox> Laney: tests still might need adjustin'
<Laney> probably
<willcooke> davmor2, screw you! :D
<cyphermox> ahahaha
<davmor2> willcooke: you're welcome
<Laney> cyphermox: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-test-cases/+bug/1477227
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1477227 in Ubuntu Test Cases "Desktop ISO smoke testing coverage is not very good" [Undecided,New]
<cyphermox> Laney: thanks
<cyphermox> so, about the live session now, I think there are no tests for it
<cyphermox> how do we not have an initctl?
<Laney> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/live-build/+bug/1477051
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1477051 in live-build (Ubuntu) "Phones on devel-proposed do not boot - /bin/sh: 1: /bin/sh: initctl: not found" [Critical,Confirmed]
<cyphermox> cute.
<willcooke> gnight
<Noskcaj> seb128, Where you going to upload gimp too?
<Noskcaj> *were
<seb128> Noskcaj, yeah, sorry got sidetracked
<seb128> going to be for tomorrow
<seb128> or maybe some .au/.nz/.us can sponsor it for you
<seb128> you can try asking TheMuso or robert_ancell or on #ubuntu-devel
<seb128> night
<Noskcaj> Is someone around to upload gimp from ppa:noskcaj/gegl ?
<Noskcaj> robert_ancell, Do you have time to upload gimp from ppa:noskcaj/gegl?
<robert_ancell> Noskcaj, sure
<Noskcaj> seb128 already uploaded the other 2 packages
<Noskcaj> ty
<robert_ancell> Noskcaj, thanks for doing that migration!
<Noskcaj> no problem
<Noskcaj> There's some gcc5 build issue with the new gegl, although i'm not sure if it's gegl or ilmbase at fault
<Noskcaj> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/212351937/buildlog_ubuntu-wily-amd64.gegl_0.3.0-2ubuntu2~gcc5.1_BUILDING.txt.gz
<robert_ancell> Noskcaj, why did you add the build-dep on libjson-glib-dev?
<Noskcaj> It was in the debian patch, i've not actually check if it's needed or not
<Noskcaj> Could you please drop it?
<robert_ancell> sure
<robert_ancell> Noskcaj, Uploaded as 2.8.14-1ubuntu2. I also update the changelog to be more detailed.
<Noskcaj> thanks
<Noskcaj> robert_ancell, looks like we've found out why json-glib was needed
<robert_ancell> Noskcaj, heh, I was wondering if that would happen :)
<robert_ancell> Uploads are cheap
<Noskcaj> for you, i need to pretend i never make a mistake until i can get motu
<Noskcaj> I'll have a look and find if the dep should be part of gegl
<robert_ancell> Noskcaj, yeah, it's probably in the .pc file
#ubuntu-desktop 2015-07-23
<didrocks> good morning
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<didrocks> re seb128
<seb128> re didrocks :-)
<willcooke> morning desktoppers
<seb128> hey willcooke
<TheMuso> Hey willcooke, hey folks.
<willcooke> hey TheMuso!
<seb128> hey TheMuso
<willcooke> Hrm
<willcooke> TheMuso, are we due to meet this week?
<willcooke> I think the 1:1s in my calendar have started to vanish
<willcooke> ohhhhhhhhhhhhhh
<willcooke> hehehe
<willcooke> When I created them I set them to repeat for 52 weeks by the looks of things
<didrocks> good morning willcooke
<willcooke> so I guess that means I've been here a year.
<didrocks> hey TheMuso
<willcooke> hey didrocks
<didrocks> congrats willcooke ;)
<willcooke> \o/
<willcooke> didrocks, speaking of 1:1s - can I move ours?  I have a clash.
<TheMuso> willcooke: Yes showing up here.
<willcooke> I can move it earlier or later by 30 mins
<willcooke> TheMuso, cool, I just reset it to not end...
<didrocks> willcooke: earlier is better
<willcooke> I'd better check the others
<willcooke> didrocks, done
<didrocks> great ;)
<jhenke> hi folks. The recent 8.1 release of ownCloud server does not allow owncloud-client < 1.7 to sync files. I have filed bug 1477421 about this. Would you consider backporting owncloud-client from wily to odler releases to make it work again?
<ubot5> bug 1477421 in owncloud-client (Ubuntu) "ownCloud-client < 1.7 can no longer sync with ownCloud Server 8.1 and above" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1477421
<seb128> jhenke, hey, it's not really a desktop topic, that seems like a valid reason for an update though
<willcooke> TheMuso, ready when you are
<TheMuso> willcooke: Ok, jumping into the hangout now.
<jhenke> seb128 thanks, I will ask #ubuntu-devel then
<Laney> hey hey
<didrocks> morningning Laney
<Laney> 7~hey didrocks
<Laney> 7~!!!!
<Laney> what's up?
<didrocks> and more importantly, why not 8? :)
<seb128> nice, mir boottest are ok now
<seb128> it got hit by the autopilot issues though
<seb128> that makes ubuntu-system-settings-online-accounts  fails
<Laney> nice
<Laney> I just tested that
<Laney> gonig to ack it
<seb128> Laney, great
<seb128> anpok_, ^ btw for info
<anpok_> seb128: hu?
<anpok_> usc failed..
 * anpok_ crawls back into his abi cave.
<seb128> anpok_, it seems a setup issue
<seb128> I wanted to kick a retry earlier, but connecting to the vpn from nm in wily doesn't work for me
<anpok_> seb128: usc fails now because boottest does not update the graphics driver..
<seb128> I get a "VPN connection disconnected because the VPN service has been halted"
<seb128> oh? :-(
<seb128> Laney, is vpn connection from n-m working for you in wily?
<Laney> yep
<seb128> I'm not asking didrocks since he's on vivid
<seb128> hum, k
<Laney> I use it most days
<Laney> sorry :(
<seb128> Jul 23 11:30:02 localhost nm-openvpn[20232]: MANAGEMENT: Socket bind failed on local address [AF_INET]127.0.0.1:1194: Address already in use
<seb128> Jul 23 11:30:02 localhost NetworkManager[794]: <warn> error disconnecting VPN: The name org.freedesktop.NetworkManager.openvpn was not provided by any .service files
<seb128> weird
 * didrocks was unsure what this "I'm not asking" was about
<didrocks> if you are not asking, don't ask, no need for hilighting :p
<Laney> we didn't want you to feel left out
<seb128> didrocks, it was in case you upgraded to wily since the other day :-)
<seb128> and that
<didrocks> seb128: so, ask it the other way if I upgraded then please ;)
<seb128> didrocks, do you have a wily install with vpn configured? if so does connecting from n-m works for you?
<didrocks> seb128: and now I can answer you "no" :)
<seb128> :-)
<seb128> bug #1297849
<ubot5> bug 1297849 in network-manager-vpnc (Ubuntu) "[SRU] Virtual private network connection fails after distribution upgrade due to outdated Network Manager configuration files" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1297849
<seb128> I guess that's my issue
<seb128> it was fixed yesterday
<seb128> I didn't restart my session since
<Laney> ah I went straight to wily on this laptop
<Laney> anpok_: do you need a versioned dependency?
<Laney> this mir release seems like hard work. :(
<seb128> anpok_, anything we can do to help you to get mir unblocked?
<seb128> session restart, brb
<seb128> yeah, vpn back to working
<Laney> yeahhhh, shotwell green again
<seb128> :-)
<seb128> gnome-photos retry worked as well
<seb128> shrug
<seb128> qengho, hey, is https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/job/wily-adt-chromium-browser/lastBuild/ARCH=amd64,label=adt/ known? autopkgtest from chromium are grumpy again it seems
<seb128> that blocks cups gconf and probably others in proposed
<anpok_> seb128, Laney: a better way to specify that drivers need to be replaced...
<seb128> why do they need to be replaced?
<seb128> did some other abi change?
<seb128> mvo, hey, do you know if anyone looked a bug #1470655
<ubot5> bug 1470655 in packagekit (Ubuntu) "Update to 1.0" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1470655
<seb128> how much changed between 0.8 and 1.0?
<seb128> hum
<seb128> "   * New upstream release: 1.0.0
<seb128>      - This release drops support for plugins
<seb128>      - Aptcc is now the only viable backend for Debian, other
<seb128>        backends have been removed upstream."
<seb128> Laney, what's the status of webkit/webkit2? we should keep on using webkit right?
<Laney> seb128: yeah, for now in main
<seb128> webkit2gtk is not/not going to this cycle right?
<seb128> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/zenity/3.16.3-1 is why I'm asking
<Laney> doubt it
<Laney> probably want to undo that bit
<mvo> seb128: yeah, the plugin is the big one, someone *cough* like me *cough* needs to finish  lp:~mvo/click/native-dbus  and then we can get rid of the PK plugin requirement. right now updating to 1.0 would break the click plugin
<mvo> seb128: but we don't really need much of PK in click, almost nothing, the native-dbus branch is implementing all thats needed
<seb128> mvo, k, I was asking because gnome-software is blocked in proposed since it depends on the new packagekit version
<seb128> it's not a big issue for us but eventually we want to update
<seb128> bah, gnome-online-account is currently stucked in proposed due to webkit2 as well, bug #1466290
<ubot5> bug 1466290 in gnome-online-accounts (Ubuntu) "Update to 3.16" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1466290
<Laney> darkxst has been on that
<Laney> ah yes, in that bug
<darkxst> seb128, Laney waiting on infinity to review the proposed demotions
<seb128> not jdstrand?
<seb128> he's the one assigned on the bug
<darkxst> seb128, oh oops wasnt actually subscribed to the bug so didnt see that, but infinity did say he was looking into it
<darkxst> I can remove the dejadup dep in g-c-c
<seb128> it's the other way around
<seb128> deja-dup depends on g-c-c to build a panel no?
<darkxst> seb128, I want to drop that panel
<seb128> is that up to you or mterry (the deja-dup maintainer/upstream)?
<darkxst> and hence drop libgnome-control-center, since deja-dup is the only remaining panel and its a pain maintaining the patches that allow for that
<seb128> k
<darkxst> no idea why there would be a compiz dep though?
<seb128> because it integrates with the keybindings
<seb128> and it uses the .pc to know the directory where to install the .xml
<seb128> iirc
<darkxst> can that move to u-c-c?
<seb128> yes
<seb128> I can have a look to that today
<darkxst> ok, I'm tired from a long day so out for the night, I will deal with deja-dup stuff over the weekend
<mvo> seb128: yeah, sorry, snappy madness
<seb128> darkxst, good night!
<darkxst> night!
<darkxst> left a comment on the g-o-a bug, now gone!
<xnox> Laney: why is evolution so old?
<Laney> what kind of a question is that?
<Laney> https://launchpad.net/~ci-train-ppa-service/+archive/ubuntu/landing-028/+packages
<ogra_> xnox, because it was born so early :P
<darkxst> xnox, evo is on a 12 month release cycle now, so there was no 3.14
<seb128> Laney, do you need help pushing that transition?
<seb128> like me to nag some people to do reviews/land changes?
<xnox> Laney: ah, so 16 is in the works. I somehow thought 16 bits were all landed now.
<xnox> and i had no idea there was no 3.14. thanks darkxst.
<Laney> seb128: just need to test and upload it
<xnox> it seemed like it's stuck on old series for one reason or another.
<seb128> xnox, do you need it for something?
<xnox> seb128: yes. it looks like the only client that supports XOAUTH2 authentication =) hence it's looking like i'll be switching to evolution by default.
<xnox> and xoauth2 is enforced by google for me =(
<xnox> yeap, definately switching to evolution now.
<seb128> xnox, good, maybe you can help maintaining the packages then :-)
<mdeslaur> xnox: doesn't thunderbird 38 support it also?
<mdeslaur> xnox: https://blog.mozilla.org/thunderbird/2015/06/thunderbird-38-released/
<xnox> hah, but their bug tracker is not updated. loads of developers screaming there "we must not let google dictate email standards"
<xnox> horum, checking which thungerbird i have.
<xnox> i'm on 31 =(
<seb128> when did middle click/dnd stop working?
<Laney> seb128: what is middle click/dnd?
<seb128> Laney, like in nautilus doing an icon dnd with the middle button used to open a menu asking if you want to symlink/copy it
<seb128> http://askubuntu.com/questions/23534/is-it-possible-to-drag-files-with-right-click
<Laney> oh, never seen that before, but it seems to work
<Laney> move here, copy here, link here
<seb128> k
<Laney> real mouse though
<seb128> here I can move the cursor after clicking
<seb128> k, it's limited to the trackpad nibble
<seb128> works on the touchpad
<seb128> grrr
 * Laney fixes chromium tests
<Laney> qengho: if this works please merge
<qengho> Er, okay.
<seb128> qengho, did you see my ping about that earlier?
<seb128> I didn't see a reply
<qengho> seb128: No, I didn't.
<seb128> shrug
<seb128> qengho, hey, is https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/job/wily-adt-chromium-browser/lastBuild/ARCH=amd64,label=adt/ known? autopkgtest from chromium are grumpy again it seems
<seb128>  that blocks cups gconf and probably others in proposed
<qengho> seb128: I see it in my scrollback, but didn't see a notification.
<seb128> but I guess Laney is handling it for you
<Laney> I was like oh hey
<seb128> Laney_beers++
<Laney> it looksl ike a missing dep
<Laney> then it wasn't quite just that ... :)
<seb128> haha
<seb128> qengho, is there any way we could get those tests run before upload to minimize those sort of issues in the futur?
<qengho> seb128: of course. I usually do. The last two breaks were some other package without tests. I'm interested to see what this is.
<Laney> I didn't investigate why these things changed
<Laney> 'convert' is due to not depending on the package which provides it
<qengho> seb128: no, actually, there was a problem in the tests last time. That's true.
<qengho> Laney: I thought it would be easier to see files from Jenkins, but it's so difficult that I may just remove the screenshot convert'ion one day.
<Laney> there's meant to be a way to attach artifacts
<qengho> Laney: IIRC, they used to be in the result list, but I haven't seen them in about a year.
<Laney> qengho: Ah, you changed the harness to catch more errors but some of them are innocuous
<Laney> qengho: I just added a grep -v to filter those out
<qengho> Laney: my tests still pass here. What did you grep away in Cr test?
<Laney> qengho: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/212478045/chromium-browser_43.0.2357.130-0ubuntu1.1188_43.0.2357.130-0ubuntu2.diff.gz
<Laney> qengho: Are you running with adt-run?
<Laney> adt-run chromium-browser -s -U --apt-pocket=proposed --- qemu ~/temp/reallytemp/adt-wily-amd64-cloud.img
<qengho> Laney: Thanks. I'll have Cr 44 in my PPA soon.
<Laney> instead of 'chromium-browser' you can give a .dsc or an _amd64.changes there
<Laney> the latter to avoid rebuilding if you already have it built
<qengho> Laney: thanks. I think that logic is buggy. Pipeline return value is the final item, right? I'll reverse to remove good things first, then test for error.
<Laney> qengho: Dunno what you mean, but fix as you wish as long as it works. You probably want '-qs' on the last one too to silence it.
<Laney> bye!
<willcooke> cya Laney
 * willcooke -> EOD too
<willcooke> night
 * willcooke <- Columbo
<willcooke> done
<willcooke> so long
#ubuntu-desktop 2015-07-24
<didrocks> good morning
<duflu> Morning didrocks
<didrocks> hey duflu ;)
<tjaalton> sigh, again too late for ancell
<willcooke> morning all
<didrocks> good morning willcooke
<Laney> friidididididay
<seb128> hey willcooke Laney tjaalton
<seb128> re didrocks ;-)
<tjaalton> yo
<seb128>  happy friday desktopers btw ;-)
<seb128> Laney, new mir is in ;-)
<Laney> hey
<Laney> oh wow
<Laney> did it get fixed?
<seb128> I think the mir guys asked to override the boottest at the end :-/
<seb128> the abi issue got resolved
<seb128> but you can end up without working drivers
<seb128> that didnd't get resolved afaik
<didrocks> re seb128
<didrocks> happy friday Laney!
<Laney> hey didrocks
<Laney> how's it going?
<didrocks> good good, yourself?
<Laney> it's cold today :-o
<didrocks> lucky you, I could use cold
<Laney> http://www.bbc.co.uk/weather/ng5
<didrocks> waow
<Laney> at least I won't have to water the plants for a few days ...
<willcooke> same here
<willcooke> tomorrow morning we have a yellow rain warning
<willcooke> ??
<Laney> heh
<Laney> lovely weekend for housework
<Laney> maybe I'll paint that wall
<Laney> :/
<willcooke> ha
 * Laney cries
<didrocks> thanks to a contributor PR, I just learnt about functools.partial()
<davmor2> willcooke: yellow rain, Just get the kids in off the roof and make them use the toilet like everyone else ;)
<willcooke> :D
<Laney> didrocks: we'll make you into a haskell programmer yet
<Laney> Prelude> let plustwo = (+) 2
<Laney> Prelude> plustwo 10
<Laney> 12
<didrocks> Laney: no need to tell that to a RPN calc user! :)
<Laney> I'm showing you the partially applied + function
<didrocks> that's quite nice for callbacks in particular with parameters
 * didrocks is really impressed by this PR
<seb128> Laney, it's working ;-)
<didrocks> the guy dove into the whole framework
<didrocks> without asking any question and understand some trickyness of the async view :)
<Laney> nice
<Laney> seb128: what is?
<seb128> Laney, converting didrocks to haskell
<seb128> ;-)
<Laney> it's the place to be
<Laney> so why
<Laney> just why is udisks2 still failing
<Laney> I sshed into the node and booted the actual vm image
<Laney> ubuntu@autopkgtest:~$ sudo modprobe scsi_debug
<Laney> ubuntu@autopkgtest:~$ grep scsi_debug /proc/modules
<Laney> scsi_debug 69632 0 - Live 0x00000000
<Laney> .................
<seb128> Laney, it's weird indeed, gvfs is having the same issue today on the most recent run, I tried a new one
<Laney> it was a problem yesterday that I knew about
<Laney> but should be fixed now
<seb128> Laney, retry worked for gvfs
<seb128> oh, and yeah \o/ rebuilt from yesterday worked, gvfs, upower & co migrated to wily
<seb128> we lack a +1 team nowadays, some of those were stucked since june and only a bunch of rebuilds for the new libplist were needed
<Laney> seb128: nice
<Laney> I wonder wtf went on
<darkxst> hey all
<seb128> hey darkxst
<darkxst> seb128, Laney bug 1477788 ( g-c-c changed are added in the 3.16 branch on the bug mentioned withing
<ubot5> bug 1477788 in gnome-control-center (Ubuntu) "Remove support for external panels" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1477788
<seb128> k
<darkxst> seems indicator-bluetooth still has a optional dep on g-c-c
<darkxst> it really shouldnt, but not sure if that affects things? given u-c-c will be choosen first
<seb128> right, i think it shouldn't
<darkxst> so its just the compiz dep than can probably switch over to u-c-c-dev
<seb128> what are you trying to do? demote g-c-c?
<darkxst> seb128, g-c-c binaries that are not shared
<darkxst> since I really doubt the webkit2gtk transition is going to happen this cycle
<seb128> yeah, not likely
<seb128> unsure is goa is manageable
<seb128> since that's used in empathy build-depends and some others
<seb128> but I'm letting security&co deal with if it's ok to demote binaries or such
<seb128> need to go for lunch, bbiab
<darkxst> seb128, the webkit dep in goa is not seeded anywhere (libgoa-backend from memory)
<darkxst> (binary wise, still needs webkit2gtk source in main for build of course)
<darkxst> and I am out for the night, if I can navigate the storms
<willcooke> didrocks, those remote power sockets...
<willcooke> I got RC switch working on the Pi and on Arduino
<willcooke> so good choice
<didrocks> nice!
<seb128> Laney, is doing gtk updates the pitti-systemd way now, big merge summary on top and if you scroll down you can see what actually changed!
<Laney> /o\
<seb128> Laney, unsure how to deal better with those though, but I guess it only annoys people reading -changes, which is probably not a lot of users
<willcooke> folks, I'll be in London on Monday.  Laney I think this will effect our 1:1, but we can catch up later in the day as necessary
<Laney> poor willcooke
<willcooke> it's not so bad
<willcooke> I get to ride on a train
<willcooke> Laney, anyone, can you help upload a new version of the Ubuntu font?
<Laney> I remember riding down that line in the days of WAGN :')
<Laney> umm
<willcooke> Would be nice to back-port it too
<Laney> we get new versions of the font?
 * willcooke just got one fresh from the font mines
<Laney> does it fix ââ?
<Laney> anyway, yah, can you deliver it to a bug maybe?
<willcooke> Laney, roger that
<willcooke> against desktop?
<willcooke> or just "ubuntu"
<Laney> ubuntu-font-family-sources
<willcooke> ack
<Laney> do you know what's changed?
<willcooke> mpt, do you know what the bug fix is for the Ubuntu font, per Magdalena's email?
<mpt> willcooke, yes, itâs bug 1334363
<ubot5> bug 1334363 in Ubuntu Font Family "[25 mod] Wrong characters appear in some Mac apps ([â] â [â¸], [â] â [â¹], [â] â [áº], [â] â [áº])" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1334363
<willcooke> thx mpt
<willcooke> Laney, in which case, can we use that bug?
<seb128> willcooke, enjoy London ;-)
<willcooke> seb128, thanks!
<Laney> yes
<willcooke> huzzah
<Laney> and I imagine sladen might want to do the update
<didrocks> Laney: oh, is he still doing the font update?
 * didrocks looks at launchpad
<Laney> look at that there bug
<didrocks> oh right, he seems to be quite interested in it, let's see how it goes and upload if he doesn't get a chance
<Laney> maybe we can remove the metadata change that we made back in Quantal now
<Laney> there was some fontconfig/libreoffice bug or something
<willcooke> Laney, didrocks - JohnLea said he's not doing it any more, so can he help
<willcooke> ?
<Laney> which 'he' are they?
<willcooke> Laney, sladen
<Laney> hmm
<Laney> let me just ask him :P
<willcooke> :D
<Laney> superb
 * Laney executed work avoidance tactic #1
<didrocks> Laney: #2 is then ask your coworker
<didrocks> #3 is to make a general blog post with "please help us onâ¦"
<didrocks> and #4 is to finally do the update yourself ;)
<Laney> no no
<Laney> there's a stage where you threaten to not do it at all or remove something
<Laney> "since nobody stepped up to care about Firefox, we are removing it from Ubuntu"
<Laney> <1000 volunteers appear>
<Laney> or that's the theory :P
<didrocks> how could have forgotten that crucial step! :)
<didrocks> s/volunteers/complainers/
<Laney> what really happens is that nobody notices until the release is made
<didrocks> heh
<Laney> then angry people appear
<didrocks> you can be the one, you can make the headlines!
<seb128> oh, gstreamer 1.5
<seb128> Laney rocking on this friday ;-)
<Laney> it's been an annoying two days
<Laney> glad that i could do that though
<Laney> let's see if i can kick eds out too
<seb128> :-)
<Laney> no renato
 * Laney looks at the button anyway
<seb128> Sweet5hark, btw, did you contact the DMB about libreoffice upload rights?
<willcooke> happy weekend all
 * Laney too
<Laney> will eds on monday/over the weekend
<Laney> laters!
<seb128> Laney, have a good w.e!
<seb128> have a good w.e desktopers!
#ubuntu-desktop 2016-07-25
<droid2> humm so confusing because i check gsettings/dconf i.e the linux equivalent to a windows register and don't  see anything for lightdm just gnome so kind of wondering since no gdm is installed what the /etc/gnome files are really doing or maybe there just left over from somebody forgetting to remove these when making the distro?
<qengho> Oh, right. Good morning!
<hikiko> hi
<qengho> hikiko: hi hi hi hi hi!
<hikiko> hi qengho :-)
<hikiko> how are you ?
<qengho> hikiko: take over. I'm going to lunch.
<qengho> hikiko: pretty good!
<hikiko> Enjoy :-)
<hikiko> Cool !
<qengho> hikiko: I saw some jaw-dropping scenery this weekend.
<qengho> It waas obviously photoshopped.
<qengho> Geology can not do what I saw.
 * qengho noms.
<duflu> Good morning
 * duflu wonders if there's a word for the start of the week
<duflu> Good Monding?
<duflu> Bugger. My made up word already exists with a different meaning. Such is English
<pitti> Good morning
<duflu> Morning pitti, hikiko, qengho
<hikiko> morning all :)
<thumper> o/
<duflu> Oh hi thumper
<thumper> duflu: how goes it?
<duflu> thumper: It goes Mondayish. You?
<thumper> yeah...
<thumper> drudging through some boring stuff
<thumper> happy to be avoiding the mid-cycle
<duflu> 1:38pm: Finished email and bug triage :P
<duflu> For some values of 'finished'
<thumper> :)
<thumper> duflu: what are you focused on these days?
<duflu> thumper: Mir and Xmir
<duflu> And trying not to be responsible for Unity8 bugs
<thumper> how is mir shaking out?
<duflu> thumper: Mir is OK. It moves very slowly, but the reason is test driven development. So we go 10-20 times slower than most projects, but have fewer regressions
<didrocks> good morning!
<pitti> bonjour didrocks ! bien rentrÃ¨ ?
<pitti> rentrÃ©
<didrocks> pitti: oui oui, aucun problÃ¨me particulier, et toi, comment Ã§a va ?
<pitti> didrocks: Ã§a va bien, merci -- c'Ã©tait un week-end calm chez nous
<pitti> still a bit shocked on all the attacks recently (Nice, Munich, axe attack in WÃ¼rzburg, and now Ansbach yesterday)
<didrocks> pitti: indeedâ¦
 * pitti goes for a run before it gets too warm
<Sweet5hark> moin
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<seb128> hey Sweet5hark
<seb128> how are you?
<Sweet5hark> seb128:  all fine here.
<didrocks> hey seb128, Sweet5hark
<seb128> hey didrocks!
<Sweet5hark> getting out more due to pokemon, which is a good thing.
<seb128> lol
<seb128> while avoiding being shoot, which is good as well!
<Trevinho> Morning
<didrocks> hey Trevinho
<Trevinho> didrocks: hey Didier, how is it?
<seb128> hey Trevinho, how are you?
<didrocks> Trevinho: finally back home ! feeling good, yourself ?
<Trevinho> didrocks, seb128: yeah all right ;-)
<Laney> morning!
<Laney> forgot my server was going to be restarted
<didrocks> hey Laney!
<pitti> oh, some life here -- hello Sweet5hark, seb128, Trevinho and Laney!
<Trevinho> hi pitti and Laney
<pitti> seb128: avoiding being shot, or axed, or run over by a truck, or nail-bombed (last night in Ansbach) -- there's lots of choice today!
<Laney> I feel NAKED without my precious scrollback
<pitti> </sad sarcasm>
<Laney> hey didrocks Trevinho pitti
<Laney> pitti: :(
<pitti> Laney: detached from the hive, eh?
 * Laney shivers in the corner
 * Laney got paged at 9am this morning
<Laney> seems my new schedule works
<seb128> hey Laney pitti
<seb128> pitti, yeah, news are crazy recently :-/
<Laney> hey seb128
<Laney> how are you?
<seb128> I'm good thanks!
<seb128> how are you? had a good w.e?
<Laney> yeah!
<Laney> we went to the allotment both days and did a lot of work there
<Laney> looking better now
<Laney> the hedge is about 50% smaller
 * Laney muhahaha
<Laney> and also it was sunny
<Laney> what about you?
<seb128> we went to the north of France for the w.e, didn't do much, went to a sport shop on saturday to buy some stuff, otherwise some reading & enjoying the weather
<seb128> bbq on saturday evening as well
<didrocks> oh, you went to the north? like Paris? :p
<didrocks> !revenge!
<seb128> lol
<Laney> some place nearby has something which beeps every minute
<Laney> day or night
<Laney> and has been doing so for a few days
<pitti> smoke detector?
<pitti> ... being out of battery?
<Laney> like one with low battery
<Laney> but I can't quite work out where it is
<andyrock> morning
<ricotz> Laney, pitti, haha, I've been there a few days ago ;)
 * Laney goes craaaazy
<Laney> oh
<Laney> it's alpha 2 this week
<Laney> ...
 * Sweet5hark wakes up and thinks alpha2 means something about throwing libreoffice 5.2 over the fence for him.
<Laney> that sounds like alphaish behaviour
<Laney> do it
<jbicha> Laney: so you're uploading GTK3.20 today? ;)
<Laney> that was the "..."
<Laney> creating turbulence in a milestone week doesn't seem super nice
<jbicha> yeah I assume it will break Lubuntu: bug 1597526
<ubot5> bug 1597526 in lubuntu-artwork (Ubuntu) "Update themes for GTK 3.20" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1597526
<Laney> yeah there's a bounty for that one
<Laney> they might want to use another theme in the meantime
<Laney> afaik lxde itself is still gtk2
<seb128> what's the status of xubuntu?
<Laney> their theme is ported
<seb128> great
<jbicha> seb128: initial GTK3.20 support for greybird is in the yakkety new queue :)
<seb128> what is greybird?
<Laney> theme
<jbicha> that's Xubuntu's default theme
<seb128> xfce one?
<seb128> k
<seb128> does it need to stay unapproved until gtk 3.20 is uploaded?
<jbicha> seb128: no, the greybird package works with GTK 3.18 too
<seb128> k
<jbicha> it's a good question because some themes only include support for a particular GTK3 version
<flexiondotorg> Laney, Just back from a week away. Saw that GTK 3.20 will land after Alpha 2 in your mail.
<flexiondotorg> Suits Ubuntu MATE, we'll be ready to land GTK 3.20 support just after Alpha 2.
<flexiondotorg> Initial GTK 3.20 support will be sufficient to work.
<flexiondotorg> With follow up to refine it in a few weeks.
<Laney> flexiondotorg: 'k, that's good, thx
<Laney> hope you had a fun sprint
<flexiondotorg> Laney, Very.
<pitti> seb128: I just tried to apply your polkit patch; but "pkexec whoami" in gnome-terminal still says "error response to PolicyKit daemon: GDBus.Error:org.freedesktop.PolicyKit1.Error.Failed: No session for cookie"
<pitti> seb128: did that actually work for you?
<pitti> seb128: oh, it seems it does work with polkit-gnome, just not without when authenticating in the shell with the text prompt
<pitti> ok, I got it; with yakkety's packages polkit-gnome itself fails to start with "Unable to determine the session we are in: No session for pid 2316"
<Laney> :q
<pitti> seb128: uploaded to Debian now, will sync tonight when it gets imported
<Laney> oops
<Laney> don't quit!
<pitti> no, don't quit!
<Laney> does the polkit patch fix pk-gnome?
<pitti> yes
 * Laney forgot if it was to the new_for_process () bit
<Laney> which is the thing that needs to fall back
<Laney> cool
<Sweet5hark> hah, Laney is team vi!
<qengho> Sweet5hark: in irc, I mostly give away that I'm in Job Control Clan.
<Sweet5hark> qengho: heh ;)
<flexiondotorg> Laney, Do you have a rough ETA fir landing GTK 3.20? I can try and make sure Ubuntu MATE moves in lock step.
<seb128> pitti, polkit failing to start should be fixed with that path no?
<flexiondotorg> Basically, I just need to prepare and upload ubuntu-mate-artwork package and mate-themes packages.
<flexiondotorg> mate-themes, the official upstream MATE Desktop themes, are ready.
<mterry> Laney, looking at that unity-greeter issue now, though no promises.  I've spent so long in qml land, I've forgotten how to gtk  :)
<pitti> seb128: yes, it is
<pitti> seb128: there's still something else broken, but with pk-gnome it works again
<seb128> pitti, k, good, you got me confused when you said the service was still failing to start with that error
<pitti> seb128: I got confused; it's operation without pk-gnome when it's broken
<seb128> k, makes sense
<seb128> I didn't try pkexec, sorry about that
<pitti> tedg: hey Ted, how are you?
<pitti> tedg: btw, systemd 231 has a new feature which might help you -- if you prefix an Exec*= command with '+' it will run unconfined
<pitti> tedg: that's what you (perhaps) wanted for the logging stuff, right?
<pitti> tedg: although I still think it's better to use the journal than to put new log files everywhere, it's a nuisance to clean them up
<ogra_> pitti, wont that eat your ram ?
<ogra_> (if it is per app/process)
<pitti> well, you have less logging with less RAM, or need to use persistent logging
<Laney> mterry: â¥
<seb128> going for some exercice, be back in a bit over an hour
<ochosi> jbicha: hey! thanks for taking care of all the greybird packaging etc. just so you know, i'm still working on the port, i'll try to do a release very soon though (hopefully this week?)
<ochosi> jbicha: if you want or need any heads up on that or if you want to coordinate always feel free to get in touch with me here!
<jbicha> ochosi: ok, cool
<jbicha> I was impatient so I packaged the git snapshot but releases have prettier version numbers and are easier to work with
<ochosi> :)
<jbicha> ochosi: do you want me to report bugs in GTK 3.20 support now to github? I see a problem with the nautilus statusbar
<ochosi> jbicha: sure! and wow, what really? this is totally based on adwaita so i'm surprised about any gnome app bugs :) could be that you're not shipping upstream and consequently there's a visual bug?
<Laney> right, nighty night
<seb128> night
<ochosi> Sweet5hark: hey! shall i test this on gtk3.20 or is the target xenial?
<Sweet5hark> ochosi: heya!
<ochosi> also, you mention the "Radiance" theme there, isn't that Ambiance..? (dark toolbars and the like)
<Sweet5hark> target is yakkety. xenial will very much stay with the gtk2 backend until EOL.
<ochosi> k, so gtk3.20
<ochosi> and what's the expected outcome? bright toolbars in LO? bright icons with Ambiance?
<Sweet5hark> ochosi: whoopsie wrt. to radience/ambience I could never remember them right :p
<tedg> pitti: Cool, thanks. In that case it's going into an SQLite DB, so it's not throwing files everywhere.
<ochosi> also, is breeze an SVG based theme? if so, you could try to make the icons symbolic, then they would work with any theme
<ochosi> brb
<Sweet5hark> ochosi: well, I dont want to touch the icons -- they are upstreams party. The thing is, with the gtk2 backend the toolbars are light on the gtk theme, so the icon are well readable. with the gtk3 backend the toolbars have a dark background, which makes them pretty unreadable.
<Sweet5hark> FWIW, just debugging this down to a few lines in the gtk3 theme would be very helpful (as In: when I change the color in the theme here, the toolbar color changes.) Im just lacking the time for that right now, and when I have that, I might debug what the difference between the gtk2/3 backends is.
 * Sweet5hark gotta run now too ....
<ochosi> Sweet5hark: ok, so the version you're referring to is already in the snap store though, right?
<ogra_> bregma, so i spent half a workday on unity8 today (evolution and hexchat in libertine) ... since i discovered that tap to click now works on my laptop ... i had to stop eventually because my tighs started getting blisters ... the load was constantly above 1.5 and the fan didnt stop spinning
<ogra_> i couldnt see any runaway processes in top thouh
<bregma> your *what* started getting blisters?
<ogra_> upper legs
<bregma> um...
<bregma> you had your laptop on your lap?
<ogra_> indeed, it has that "lap" word in its name :)
<ogra_> anyway ... something keeps the system at a really high load all the time but i couldnt really see anything
<bregma> I understand now, second degree burns
<ogra_> yeah ... i tried being funny :P
<bregma> I don;t get that kind of load, but I do see an awful lot of active threads using htop
<ogra_> ah, i have userland threads off in htop
<pitti> Laney, seb128, tedg: just landed https://github.com/systemd/systemd/pull/3678, so the name is fixed now
<ogra_> didnt think of that
<bregma> it's certainly something to keep an eye on as we go forward with convergence on the desktop
<ogra_> well, it slowly gets into usable state for me ...
<ogra_> at least for laptop use
<ogra_> not so much for my triple head nvidia workstation sadly
<bregma> multi-monitor is still a bit further out, as proper window management and workspace support get improved
<ogra_> workspaces, a fixed NM and the high load issue and i can use it as daily driver
<ogra_> the window mgmt is good enough for me ... ii had worse stuff in my life :)
<bregma> I'm seeing more Xmir and Mir-stack CPU usage than I'd like when libertine apps are running, we'll want to keep a special eye on that because of the lifecycle
<ogra_> but unity7 really spoiled me ... i cant use any laptops without workspaces anymore :)
<bregma> agreed
<pitti> +1 :)
<bregma> multiple workspaces on multiple montors
<bregma> there can never be enough screen real estate
<pitti> bregma: OOI, is  it possible to at least change the current monitor?
<pitti> with unity8 I don't see anything on my external monitor; I suppose it just uses the internal one (but that's closed and in the dock); is there some equivalent of xrandr?
<bregma> I don;t think Uniy 8 supports that yet, but Mir does underneath
<bregma> because Ubnity 8 *is* a Mir server, it needs to be able to do that
#ubuntu-desktop 2016-07-26
<hikiko> hi
 * qengho snubs hikiko.
<duflu> Ummkay
<duflu> Good morning
<RAOF> Hey hikiko!
<hikiko> Hey duflu, RS
<hikiko> RAOF :p
<hikiko> How are you?
<qengho> Please forgive me, hikiko!
<qengho> Good morning, all.
<duflu> So errm you guys come here often?
<RAOF> I'm pretty good.
<hikiko> Lol, what ? qengho ? Good morning to you too!:-p
<qengho> hikiko: Please don't melt today.
<hikiko> Oh, I didn't scroll up enough I didn't see you snubbed
<hikiko> qengho it's not very warm today, atm we have around 27
<qengho> Wow, that's really good.
<hikiko> What's the weather in Taiwan ?
<qengho> Mid 30s today.
<RAOF> And 125% humidity?
<hikiko> Heh, similar to here (except today)
<hikiko> lol raof that describes my city
<hikiko> I guess applies to Taiwan too
<qengho> With wind, it might be tolerable.
<qengho> There is no wind.
<pitti> Good morning
<qengho> o/
<hikiko> qengho air conditioning ?
<qengho> Plenty of that. I'm hiding in a cafe.
<hikiko> Haha :-)
<qengho> I know how to say "please, another iced coffee" better than anything else.
<hikiko> How ?
 * hikiko tests qengho's Chinese 
<qengho> Something like "qing, duole yige tang bing de latte".
<qengho> Oh, and large. Add a "da" in there.
<qengho> Or yibei. Yeah, that one.
<qengho> I'm probably wrong, but they're too polite to laugh.
<hikiko> :-)
<hikiko> lol
<hikiko> Yeah that's a problem with the foreign languages
<hikiko> People are too polite to correct you
<hikiko> and you can't be sure if your sentences make sense
<hikiko> Can't tell :p
<hikiko> 30 degrees already \m/
<jbicha> hikiko: well, was he right or are you too polite to correct him too? :)
<qengho> jbicha: You know "it's all Greek to me"? For the Greek, they say it's Chinese to them.
<didrocks> good morning
<qengho> hi didrocks.
<didrocks> hey qengho!
<hikiko> jbicha, I don't speak chinese :)
<hikiko> it's chinese to me :)
<jbicha> hikiko: oops, sorry about that
<hikiko> about what?
<jbicha> I'm embarassed about confusing Asian countries
<hikiko> lol, Greece is not in asia :) well, it's too close
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<hikiko> hi seb128 :)
<seb128> hey hikiko
<pitti> bonjour didrocks et seb128 ! comment allez-vous ?
<pitti> hey hikiko and qengho!
<seb128> salut pitti, Ã§a va bien ! et toi ?
<hikiko> bonjour pitti
<seb128> looks like the systemd session is getting there ?
<pitti> seb128: yes, it is; currently preparing some changes to upstart, and landing the graphical-session.target unit in systemd itself
<pitti> seb128: and most other bits of systemd-graphical-session are in the landing CI now
<jbicha> hikiko: oh I didn't realize you were in Greece either
<pitti> except xeyes of coures!
<pitti> course
<seb128> haha
<seb128> going to miss those eyes staring at me at login ;-)
<pitti> seb128: I think it's just unity-settings-daemon and unity-gtk-module that's left
<pitti> well, landing that silo is still some work
<pitti> we should drop update-notifier from it, not sure if that's possible to do or this needs a completely new landing
<pitti> robru: ^
<didrocks> Ã§a va bien pitti, et toi ?
<hikiko> haha jbicha, no worries :)
<pitti> didrocks: je vais bien, merci !
<hikiko> pitti apprends le francais?
<seb128> pitti, why is update-notifier in there?
<pitti> hikiko: un petit peu
<pitti> seb128: it shouldn't be
<hikiko> tu parles bien je crois
<pitti> hikiko: je crois que seb128 pense diffÃ©remment :)
<didrocks> qu'est-ce qu'il y connait seb128 au franÃ§ais ? :)
<hikiko> lol
<hikiko> il est un peu francophone peut etre... peut etre il n a pas oublier son francais
<pitti> didrocks: parce qu'il est demi-allemand ? :-)
<hikiko> je ne savais pas qu'il est demi allemand... wow, so he speaks the 3 most dominent languages in eu... he must learn spanish too and then he can communicate everywhere...
<pitti> no, he must first learn Dutch :)
 * pitti hugs seb128
<didrocks> pitti: exactement ! :-)
<hikiko> :s/everywhere/everywhere in eu
<hikiko> il habite aux Pays bas (I am sure this is not written like that but ok :P)
<hikiko> ?
<didrocks> hikiko: non non, trÃ¨s proche : "Pays-Bas"
<hikiko> :D
<hikiko> il y a 16 ans ou je n ai pas eu l occasion d ecrire une phrase en francais... :D
 * seb128 hugs pitti & didrocks
<seb128> c'est l'heure du petit dÃ©jeuner, brb
 * didrocks hugs seb128 back, bon app!
<seb128> 'ci :-)
<willcooke> morning all!
<seb128> willcooke, hey! you are back ;-)
<willcooke> hi seb128, yeah afraid so
<seb128> lol
<willcooke> had a nice break though, will share some pics later
<seb128> we started wondering
<seb128> we remember that you said you had thu/fri off
<seb128> nice!
<willcooke> yeah, I forgot I'd booked Monday off
<seb128> ah, k
<willcooke> logged in to my calendar on Monday morning, thought "oh" and promptly turned the computer off again and went out :)
<seb128> lol, k
<willcooke> I had plans to drop you a Telegram, and then forgot, sorry about that
<seb128> it was not in the shared calendar
<willcooke> figured you'd work it out
<seb128> no worry
<willcooke> oh, you're right I thought I'd added it there.
<willcooke> naughty
<didrocks> hey willcooke!
<willcooke> morning didrocks
<qengho> 'sup, willcooke.
<willcooke> afternoon qengho - how goes over there?  Still good?
<qengho> willcooke: yep. got to get back home soon. I leave it alone for just a few weeks and *the whole country* goes to poop.
 * qengho sighs.
<willcooke> :D
<Laney> morning!
<seb128> hey Laney!
 * seb128 is disturbed by the fluctuations in Laney's schedule recently, saying hi one minute earlier today than yesterday, what's going on!
<seb128> Laney, how are you? had fun at climbing?
<Laney> I hope you track my exit time as much as my entrance Â¬_Â¬
<Laney> ya, I'm good
<seb128> lol
<Laney> we had a mosquito in the bedroom last night so there was some late night fun catching that
<Laney> climbing was okay but it gets hot in there
<Laney> sweaaaaaaaatyyyyyyyy
<Laney> what about you?
<pitti> hey Laney
<seb128> I played tennis from 5pm to 6:30pm, that was good
<Laney> hey pitti
<Laney> how's it going?
<seb128> otherwise a bit of work still after that, dinner and some tv, nothing fancy
<seb128> got annoyed by a mosquito as well in the living room, but we didn't get it
<seb128> at least it was not in the sleeping room so we didn't get bitten during the night!
<didrocks> morning Laney!
<Laney> evolution works though
<Laney> the sound of it moving around was VERY irritating
<seb128> I hate when they pass by the ears
<Laney> ola didrocks
<Laney> Â¿cÃ³mo estas?
<Laney> (or something)
<Laney> https://code.launchpad.net/~kaihengfeng/ubiquity/fix-usd-scaling/+merge/298284
<seb128> shrug
<seb128> really?
<Laney> lalala
<seb128>  /unsee
<seb128> but *really*
 * seb128 stares at cyphermox for approving
<pitti> Laney: going well, thanks! landing more and more user session bits
<Laney> nice work!
<Laney> will you land -pre in another PR?
<pitti> Laney: yes, I will; I added it to the Debian package for nwo
<Laney> what happened with that PropagateDependencies thing?
<pitti> so with upstart ubuntu28 and systemd 231-1 we have all the necessary infra in place
<pitti> Laney: no reply yet
<pitti> Laney: I'll bring that up at systemd.conf at the latest, I'll do a presentation about graphical systemd sessions there
<Trevinho> Morning!
<pitti> bongiorno Trevinho!
<Laney> righto
<Laney> hey Trevinho
<pitti> Laney: so ATM all the hacks are in http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/gnome-session/ubuntu/view/head:/debian/data/run-systemd-session
<pitti> Laney: so over time we can reduce this to become tasteful hopefully :) and then extend this to more sessions than just ubuntu and xubuntu
<pitti> Laney: the rest looks fairly good to me now
<pitti> wow, look at that broken indentation -- /me fixes
<seb128> hey Trevinho, how are you?
<Trevinho> seb128: hey seb, well thanks... You?
<Laney> pitti: there's nothing in this world a bit of sleeping can't solve
<pitti> :)
<pitti> naps are good!
<seb128> pitti, why do you set GNOME_DESKTOP_SESSION_ID= a second time there?
<seb128> or unset it
<seb128> Trevinho, I'm good thanks :-)
<pitti> seb128: I want to unset it after the session ends
<pitti> seb128: ... but I'm doing that wrong indeed, this needs to move down; thanks for spotting!
<seb128> pitti, yw!
<pitti> seb128: pushed
<seb128> k, makes more sense now
<seb128> thanks!
<seb128> I get the --quiet is-active call is cheap but that's happening while the session is open right?
<seb128> wouldn't it make more sense to have at least 10s there?
<seb128> or is that going to delay closing/shutdown by as much?
<pitti> seb128: yes, it will
<pitti> logout, not shutdown
<seb128> I see
<pitti> seb128: that's the bit which I want to fix first, it's really ugly
<seb128> we should probably have a bug targetted to yakkety to fix that one
<seb128> right
<pitti> seb128: I'll add a WI for, say, 16.09
<seb128> thanks
<pitti> (holidays and too much to do in August)
<seb128> I think it's fine for the unstable cycle
<Laney> that one could be something like watching the logind session on dbus like for g-k
<Laney> probably?
<seb128> but I wouldn't like the idea to have a such hack in a release
<pitti> writing a small downstream helper which listens to the signal is fairly simple, if we don't get it into systemctl proper in time
<seb128> the logind session can get you stuck though no?
<seb128> like if there are processes in its session not properly closing/exiting
<Laney> the state changes to 'closing'
<seb128> I sometime end up with indicator-session showing an user still logged in
<seb128> k
<pitti> seb128: we just need to listen to systemd's signal that the thingy unit we start goes to "stopped"
<Laney> that's how we know when to kill gnome-keyring-daemon
<Laney> or you can watch some unit on systemd's api
<pitti> conceptually we just want systemctl start --wait-until-stopped ${DESKTOP_SESSION}-session.target
<andyrock> morning all
<Trevinho> hi andrea
<Trevinho> hikiko: hey, did you see https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/unity/shadows-on-existing-pixmaps-cleanup/+merge/301099 ?
<seb128> hey andyrock, how are you today?
<andyrock> could not sleep that well
<andyrock> you seb128 ?
<seb128> I'm good thanks
<Trevinho> andyrock: too much excitement in yesteday's ride?
<seb128> oh, too warm in Italy?
<Trevinho> he lives in the top of an hill, it can't be hot :-D
<seb128> haha
<andyrock> ahaha too many thoughts
<Trevinho> (very nice place, though... with sea view)
<hikiko> yes Trevinho I think there are corner cases though if we move the func to the DecorationsManager
<Trevinho> what you mean?
<hikiko> Trevinho, I want to check something  - reviewing it
<andyrock> vabbÃ¨ guardo i singoli commit
<Trevinho> hikiko: ok... I've just moved that to the window, since it builds textures for a window. Plus i've removed some duplicated code and usde better C++ features
<hikiko> yeah, I saw you renamed some variables etc, thanks
<duflu> Trevinho: Am I imagining things or has widget scaling got better in 16.10? 16.04 and below is annoying to configure at 1080p but 16.10 looks better proportioned
<duflu> I mean 16.10 deals better with non-integer scaling values
<duflu> andyrock: You're back?
<andyrock> hey duflu
<duflu> andyrock: You were away from Ubuntu, no?
<andyrock> duflu: jejej nope :D
<duflu> Oh. I don't pay enough attention
<Laney> pitti: what was the problem with talking to the user systemd on dbus?
<pitti> Laney: "the problem"?
<Laney> the one tedg and I had
<andyrock> duflu: btw gtk scaling is still 1 or 2
<Laney> laney@nightingale> busctl --user introspect org.freedesktop.systemd1 /org/freedesktop/systemd1                                                                                                      ~
<Laney> Failed to introspect object /org/freedesktop/systemd1 of service org.freedesktop.systemd1: Process org.freedesktop.systemd1 exited with status 1
<duflu> andyrock: Yeah, but something looks better in yakkety. Maybe it's the Ubuntu titlebars only
<pitti> Laney: ah, so it wasn't systemd-shim and it wasn't cgmanager; it seems I don't remember any more,  or we never actually demystified it
<Laney> I forgot if we did
<andyrock> I actually made some experiments last w.e. to try to make it floating
<seb128> andyrock, don't waste effort on that, I think upstream made an explicit choice by making it an int and wouldn't take a patch to change that
<andyrock> i'm actually using windows 10 on my spare time because of that XD
<Trevinho> duflu: hey, well... in gtk?
<duflu> otp..
<andyrock> dell xps 15 just sucks with scaling 2
<seb128> andyrock, :-(
<andyrock> 1.75 would be perfect
 * Sweet5hark1 find awesome work by ochosi on g+.
<Sweet5hark1> ochosi: awesome, thanks that helps a lot!
<seb128> good morning Sweet5hark1
<Sweet5hark1> good morn'.
<duflu> Sorry was on the phone Trevinho
<duflu> andyrock: I've found GTK's integer staling > 1 only really works on 3K or 4K displays. 1080p is really hard but it's better in yakkety
<duflu> I guess because the widgets only have integer scaling factors, everything only looks right on integers
 * Trevinho won't ever forgive gtk for not having supported floating scaling!
<duflu> Yeah GTK is now a little too old-fashioned
<andyrock> duflu: i've a 4k display and scaling 2 does not feel ok
<andyrock> :(
<duflu> andyrock: Yeah same problem. I guess at 15" a scale of 2.0 is too big
<andyrock> yeah so would actually be not that difficult to support floating scaling
<duflu> I believe GTK still has some bitmap-based widgets that need integer scaling..?
<andyrock> Trevinho told me that is because of pixel alignment
<duflu> That's what I mean
<andyrock> but on high-dpi 1px less 1 px more is not visible at all
<Trevinho> yeah... rounding wouldn't have been a problem.... Really not a problem.
<Trevinho> nobody ever noticed the rounding we do in unity7...
<Trevinho> And indeed we still have integer-sized windows (of course)
<duflu> I think you're right... we'd be better off forcing GTK to use floats than dealing with just ints
<Trevinho> which... we might try to do
<duflu> The loss of quality isn't as bad as the gain in readability
<duflu> Maybe
<Laney> pitti: I think it probably only works under dbus user sessions
<pitti> Laney: oh! is that what you didn't have installed? very plausibly
<pitti> Laney: otherwise systemd --user uses its internal dbus socket (/run/user/1000/systemd/private)
<Laney> pitti: not on my outside system
<Laney> pitti: https://paste.debian.net/785326 <- rough first draft
<pitti> Laney: nice!
<pitti> I'd still like to get this into systemctl proper to avoid the python overhead and the dependencies, but this is better than the polling loop already
<Laney> right, it should be, but this is better for now imho
<Laney> so do what you will with it :-)
 * Laney goes away into juju land for a while
<Laney> https://yy2.staticflickr.com/5307/5629329064_28902fc8e3_z.jpg&f=1
<ogra_> jibel, FYI "initctl start indicator-network" in the terminal app gets me a properly working indicator in u8
<ogra_> oh ! and it even shows my existing  vpn setup to choose from
<seb128> Laney, your python dbus foo is strong, you should rewrite that ubiquity hack with proper code :-)
<Laney> I should add a review comment at the minimum
<seb128> yes please
<pitti> seb128: the dbus-monitor polling one? omg yes :)
<seb128> pitti, yeah :-/
<pitti> also, it's "fu" :)
<seb128> oh, right ... thanks!
<Laney> done
<Laney> I used *DISAPPROVE*
<Laney> felt better than Needs Fixing
<jibel> ogra_, on yakkety?
<jibel> ogra_, how do you install the terminal app?
<ogra_> jibel, xenial with overlay ... but i guess it works on yakkety too
<ogra_> jibel, there is a link in mhalls blog post
<ogra_> sadly AltGr still doesnt work in unity8 apps for me :(
<ogra_> (it works in libertine apps ... but there i have no keyboard repeat at all ... which is super annoying )
<bregma> ogra_, the fix for that is in the next Xmir upload
<ogra_> yay
<bregma> key repeat, I mean
<ogra_> yeah, thats what i understood
<bregma> AltGr might be in Mir 0.24  maybe
<bregma> maybe
<ogra_> bregma, btw, my high load seems to have been eds running in the libertine container ... battling with the natively running one ...
<ogra_> my fan is silent when i dont run evo
<jibel> ogra_, thanks the indicator starts with initctl
<ogra_> seems to be some race on session startup
<jibel> ogra_, I can now upload crashes without switching to unity7 ;)
<ogra_> lol
<ogra_> well, switching back to u7 i usually spend 10mins clicking away apport windows
 * ogra_ blames pitti 
<ogra_> :P
<bregma> they're like cockroaches
<ogra_> yeah
<ogra_> and every time i think i'm done a new one pops up
<bregma> *just* like cockroaches
<ogra_> :)
<ogra_> so now having the music app behave would be awesome
<ogra_> it starts but freaks out when you actually want to play someting
<ogra_> and even more funny ... *everything* i click in the indicator that opens a remote app (system settings, clock etc) actually opens the music app by default if i have it installed
<ogra_> aha ... uninstalling and re-installing it seems to have fixed that last bit
<ogra_> hmm, there must be a way to make libertine use a proper cursor
<bregma> ogra_, yes, but it's still a work in progress
<ogra_> ha,  got it ...
<ogra_> just installing dmz-cursor-theme along with light-themes and ubuntu-settings gets me the full default theme support
<ogra_> that looks a lot better :)
<ogra_> hmm, funny, installing lautfm-player gets me proper playback ... seems to be an issue in the music app itself
<jibel> bregma, I cannot start libertine on yakkety, it crahes with bug 1606556
<ubot5> bug 1606556 in libertine (Ubuntu) "/usr/bin/libertine:11:QListData::size:QList:ContainerAppsList::size:QQmlAdaptorModel::count:QQmlDelegateModel::_q_modelReset" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1606556
<happyaron> seb128: hey, ping for n-m/1.2.2, ;-)
<seb128> happyaron, hey, right I know it's on my list, just got busy and previous week was .1 etc, trying to get to it this afternoon
<happyaron> ty
<Trevinho> tedg: hey, could you please merge again https://code.launchpad.net/~ted/unity/systemd-unit with andyrock's branch?
<Trevinho> (not sure they cleanly merge right now)
<tedg> Trevinho: Ah, yeah, I can.
<Trevinho> tedg: ta
<Trevinho> tedg: also, I was thinking... using that code in the current yakkety causes the Start/Stop calls to not happen since the proxy is not connected... They get queued though... Maybe you could avoid to call start/stop if the systemd_proxy_ is not connected?
<Trevinho> tedg: at the beginning I had the idea of just provinding one of the two wrappers, depending on what is running in the session, but... It's a little to annoying, and I didn't want you to create an abstract class just for that, but... Maybe...
<tedg> Trevinho: Oh, because it's connecting to the session bus instead of the user bus right now?
<Trevinho> tedg: yes
<tedg> Trevinho: We won't have the Upstart stuff for long hopefully, so I don't think it's worth abstracting.
<Trevinho> tedg: yeah, same I thought...
<Trevinho> tedg: but currently  guess we'd get some "Timed out waiting for proxy" erros in unity logs
<Trevinho> so...
<Trevinho> tedg: is an env var available when systemd is there?
<tedg> tedg: I think checking if it's connected is fine. We can drop that too once we get migrated over if it's taking too long.
<Trevinho> ok...
<Trevinho> tedg: I mean, it might be not connected at the very start of the session... Like if starting with unity already locked (because of a crash) though
<Trevinho> but... Yeah, as you say, this is something we can get rid of
<Trevinho> or, juts check for an env var presency for both upstart and systemd wrappers
<Trevinho> tedg: also /usr/share/unity/unity-compiz-profile I'd prefer it to be in /usr/lib/unity
<Trevinho> tedg: and probably renamed unity-compiz-profile-set or -selector or... anything that explains better :-)
<tedg> K, I was avoiding changing the codebase too much, but since andyrock moved the .conf file into the build system we can move it to lib.
<Trevinho> tedg: yeah, that's nicer
<cyphermox> Laney: seb128: do you want to file a merge proposal for ubiquity, since you know how to "do it the right way"
<seb128> cyphermox, hey, going to let Laney comment on that, I don't know offhand but shouldn't be hard to write, I was just reacting to calling cmds and parsin std output this way
<Laney> Not sure why the scare quotes, but I don't particularly have time right now, sorry
<Laney> I would ask the contributor, but maybe they won't do it now it got merged
<seb128> cyphermox, I guess we can still revert and ask the submitter to do it properly
<cyphermox> seb128: I think we'll want to do the change and do another upload
<seb128> need to find a "we" then
<Laney> how can git rebase fail on a commit in the upstream branch?
<Laney> huh, weird
<pitti> Laney: wait, gbp?
<Laney> real git
<pitti> Laney: not sure what you mean, but last time I fell into trouble was when I rebased master and scribbled over/deleted the merge commit from upstream
<Laney> no merge commits here
<Laney> I think there was a force push though
 * Laney spanks ximion 
<pitti> ah, or that
<Laney> pitti: it was <rewind changes>; <apply changes from upstream>; merge failure in one of those
<Laney> I don't see how that can happen in normal circumstances
<Laney> git log master..HEAD revealed the problem though
<Laney> -> it showed one of the changes that should have been on master
<Laney> now to try and repair this without brute force
 * Laney tries git rebase -i; delete force pushed commit
<Laney> pitti: if you're on debian-devel, would be nice to reply to http://article.gmane.org/gmane.linux.debian.devel.general/210066
<pitti> Laney: I'm not, but thanks for the pointer; I'll read it RSN
<pitti> Laney: https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2016/07/msg00484.html has the Message-Id: for replying
<ximion> Laney: what? where?
<Laney> pitti: nod (I used http://mid.gmane.org/<message-id> as a lazy way to get a link) :)
<Laney> ximion: my branch has "e50f836d47ecf09ffbd3fa672542685a39461d0e Use appender more often and apply some style fixes" but master has "c638e73255030b047db317799187a15698d0dad0 Use appender more often and apply some style fixes"
<Laney> ximion: it could be that I messed it up by mistake though
<ximion> doesn't look like your fault, actually...
<ximion> something went wrong there
<Laney> without looking I would guess commit --amend and push --force
<ximion> probably, but I don't remember conciously force-pushing anything during Debconf
<ximion> anyway, the branch wasn't protected yet (= force-pushing was possible)
 * ximion fixed that a few minutes ago
<Laney> those IPAs were quite strong
<ximion> Indian Pale Ales?
<Laney> yummy
<ximion> the easiest way to fix this would propapbly be to export the patches and import them on a clean branch
<Laney> no way, git is powerful enough
<ximion> looks like I messed something up there in the past, sorry for that
<ximion> neat :)
<Laney> I did an interactive rebase and told it to delete the conflicting patch
<Laney> then there is a real conflict in getIndexFile
<Laney> "Successfully rebased and updated refs/heads/online."
<ximion> neat .)
<ximion> the next thing I will do is to clean up the statistics (to only store actually useful information), and maybe make a "components recently added" page
<Laney> ximion: so what is needed to get this merged? support Translation-gz again I guess
<ximion> yes, from last time I checked this was the only real issue
<Laney> ok
<Laney> let me do this now
<ximion> create a PR for this, then I can look over it again
<Laney> IS have fixed the firewall so I can do a full run with screenshots
<ximion> (but last time, it already looked quite good)
<Laney> I didn't check it with a non-remote mirror
<ximion> hooray!
<Laney> would be good to know I didn't break that ...
<ximion> screenshot-resizing in asgen is also less dumb now
<ximion> hehe, I really want to work on AppStream stuff, but I also really need to get other things done... ^^
<Laney> too many projects
<ximion> university, this time
<ximion> couldn't get anything else done during the Snappy sprint
<ximion> but that sprint was really successful, so that's fine :)
<hikiko> hey Trevinho and andyrock could you wait for my review in the shadow code?
<hikiko> I ve seen it's top approved already
<hikiko> and I was awaiting that review 7 months
<hikiko> is it so urgent?
<ximion> Laney: btw, I plan to do a large libappstream API break soonish - will simplify a lot of things, drop all deprecated bits and remaining functions from when Xapian was a required component
<ximion> the changes will also help maging asgen better
<Laney> what else is using libappstream?
<ximion> Discover, AppCenter, Isenkram, ...
<ximion> probably more that I don't know of
<Laney> fun
<ximion> porting should be trivial though, I will likely do that for all the packages in Debian
<Trevinho> hikiko: you can still review it, add your bit on it.
<Trevinho> hikiko: no urgency, just that I'm landing... So I want to clean the plate
<hikiko> you didn't tell me that before so I was doing other things Trevinho
<hikiko> now it's the end of my day
<hikiko> could you change the status to needs review and maybe include it in the next landing?
<hikiko> I will check it 1st thing tomorrow
<hikiko> anyway, I have to go, see you later
<Trevinho> hikiko: ok, in case there's something to fix, we can just fix in a new MP... There's no much logic change since your branch. Just optimizations
<willcooke> blimey, it's meeting time already
<qengho> "Already"
<seb128> hey
<willcooke> #startmeeting Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2016-07-26
<meetingology> Meeting started Tue Jul 26 15:30:33 2016 UTC.  The chair is willcooke. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2016-07-26 | Current topic:
<willcooke> Today has flown past
<Trevinho> hola!
<willcooke> Lots of email to catch up on
 * Trevinho agrees
<willcooke> Roll call: andyrock, attente, desrt (hols),  dgadomski, fjkong, happyaron (out), hikiko (out), laney, qengho, seb128, sweet5hark, themuso (out), tkamppeter, trevinho, robert_ancell (hols)
<FJKong> wake up
<Sweet5hark1> aye
<andyrock> hey
<Sweet5hark1> do you glow in the dark now, willcooke?
<Laney> zzz
<willcooke> Sweet5hark1, :D  I have special powers now
<willcooke> right, let's get started
<Sweet5hark1> willcooke: arrgh! will be careful then
<willcooke> #topic andyrock
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2016-07-26 | Current topic: andyrock
<andyrock> Done:
<andyrock> 1. [BUG:1605012] /usr/bin/compiz:6:__gnu_cxx::__verbose_terminate_handler:__cxxabiv1::__terminate:std::terminate:__cxxabiv1::__cxa_throw:void
<andyrock> 2. [BUG:1605010] /usr/bin/compiz:11:unity::IconTexture::SetTexture:unity::ui::UnityWindowView:::sigc::adaptor_functor:sigc::internal::slot_call4:sigc::internal::signal_emit4
<andyrock> 3. [BUG:1605231] Eject notification icon not properly scaled on high-dpi.
<andyrock> 4. [BUG:1605256] Switcher detail view does not scale properly on high dpi
<andyrock> 5. [BUG:1605180] Compiz hogging CPU when screen off
<andyrock> 6. [BUG:1506023] Unityshell sometimes is removed from active-plugins unity list
<andyrock> 7. [BUG:1606254] Super+S activates expo plugin even on a 1x1 setup
<andyrock> 8. [BUG:1606234] Actions menu is displaced on high-dpi
<andyrock> 9. [BUG:1044662] compiz crashed with signal 5 (SIGTRAP) in g_logv() from g_log() from g_settings_schema_get_value() from g_settings_schema_key_init() from g_settings_get_value()
<andyrock> In progress (almost done, just minor changes required):
<andyrock> 10. [BUG:1564375] Unity should take display scaling into account to avoid placement of desktop icons under launcher
<andyrock> 11. [BUG:1600389] Keep the screen locked if autologin is enabled
<andyrock> eof
<willcooke> just those 11 bugs then?
<andyrock> :D
<andyrock> small ones
<willcooke> thanks andyrock, good stuff :)
<willcooke> #topic attente
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2016-07-26 | Current topic: attente
<willcooke> attente, congratulations on your award!  Well deserved.
<attente> hey, not much news, just some gtk-mir patch review
<attente> re-visiting the apparmor dconf work again, old patches are pretty stale and don't really apply any more
<attente> :o
<attente> updated the java-non-latin-shortcuts ppa for xenial
<attente> (eof)
<willcooke> thanks attente
<Laney> NO
<Laney> I mean "not much news" apart from being the hero of the week
 * Laney golf clap
 * willcooke stands 
<willcooke> cheers to attente
<attente> thanks guys.. *nervous*
<willcooke> :)
 * Sweet5hark1 nods while writing his items ...
<seb128> congrats attente, well deserved with the work you are doing ;-)
<Laney> now you know the CEO is watching you closely
<seb128> gra, need to restart session, I switched user and got fonts missing again, hate intel
<willcooke> #topic dgadomski
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2016-07-26 | Current topic: dgadomski
<dgadomski> hey
<dgadomski> Unfortunately I was busy with non-desktop stuff this week, so nothing really to share this time.
<willcooke> np, thanks dgadomski
<robru> pitti: to drop a package from a landing you have to manually delete from the PPA then edit the ticket to remove mention of the package (MPs and source name)
<willcooke> #topic FJKong
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2016-07-26 | Current topic: FJKong
<FJKong> hi
<FJKong> sogou IM bug tracing as follow:
<FJKong> * when using under Gnome HiDPI (SurfacePro3) font size and position not right.
<FJKong> * tesing dependency of libapng, upgrading to latest version
<FJKong> * tracing memery leak point
<FJKong> * other strange bugs about punctuation inputing.
<FJKong> eof
<willcooke> thanks FJKong, did that phone ever arrive?
<FJKong> no...
<willcooke> :((((((
<FJKong> maybe next year
<willcooke> ha
<willcooke> I'll try again and find out why it wasn't shipped to the office
<willcooke> thanks djinni`
<FJKong> :(
<willcooke> oops sorry djinni` - ignore
<willcooke> thanks FJKong
<willcooke> #topic happyaron
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2016-07-26 | Current topic: happyaron
<willcooke> 1. libpng + apng patch for FJ's animated skin work
<willcooke> 2. trafficserver/6.2.0
<willcooke> 3. n-m/1.2.2 updated
<willcooke> 4. sogou for ubuntu phone meetings
<willcooke> #topic hikiko
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2016-07-26 | Current topic: hikiko
<willcooke> - small fixes on nux/unity blur optimisation
<willcooke> - started next snap (blender)
<willcooke> - looking at the window motion problem
<willcooke> #topic Laney
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2016-07-26 | Current topic: Laney
<Laney> sup
<Laney> â¢ Some more small tweaks to theme; re-merge with trunk, upload to PPA
<Laney> â¢ Merge nautilus in the PPA (refresh headerbar patches :/), ready for the transition
<Laney> â¢ 3.20 is delayed because of the alpha, sorry - I didn't notice it was happening until Monday
<Laney> â¢ Ask r_obert / m_terry for help with the unity-greeter issue; being worked a bit now
<Laney> â¢ systemd sprint and followup
<Laney> â some more jobs
<Laney> â pstreaming of gnome-keyring patch
<Laney> â upload a couple of bits to Ubuntu
<Laney> â Write a POC thing to wait for a job to finish instead of repeatedly polling in a sleep loop
<Laney> â¢ Now working on the new asgen, need to (1) juju-ify it, (2) deploy to staging, (3) re-implement translations and langpack support
<Laney> ð¤
<willcooke> super, thanks Laney
<willcooke> will follow up with you and s_eb128  this week on the mini sprint
<willcooke> #topic qengho
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2016-07-26 | Current topic: qengho
<qengho> Just Cr security updates this week,
<qengho> * New Chromium release. Yay, v52! Built for y. Testing.
<qengho> * Still fixing up v51.0.2704.106 for p, t, w, x. Known remaining: some SSE code path problems. Will release probably tomorrow.
<qengho> EOF
<willcooke> thanks qengho
<willcooke> so many critical security issues, so little time
<willcooke> #topic seb128
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2016-07-26 | Current topic: seb128
<qengho> :(
<seb128> â¢ systemd user-session hackfest
<seb128> â spent some time getting familiar with the tech/work
<seb128> â worked on porting the hud and update-notifier jobs
<seb128> â investigated qt theming being wrong (due to missing env variable, p_itti fixed it)
<seb128> â fixed polkit-gnome not working anymore
<seb128> â¢ spent some time talking to the people in heidelberg/reading their documents to get uptodate with the snap topics discussed there (shared content, frameworks, translations)
<seb128> â¢ didn't do bug triage for a while, so spent some cycle on that
<seb128> </week>
<willcooke> thanks seb128
<willcooke> would like to have a proper sprint debrief with you and Robert once he's back
<willcooke> i.e. next week
<seb128> +1
<willcooke> #topic Sweet5hark1
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2016-07-26 | Current topic: Sweet5hark1
<Sweet5hark1> - libreoffice 5.2.0 rc3 as snap and dpkg
<Sweet5hark1> - posted about the theme issue, kudos to ochosi who provided some excellent hints, needs to work on those now
<Sweet5hark1> - some security stuff
<Sweet5hark1> - prepared some notes for l10n on snap, seens i wasnt needed in the hangout -- so emailed them instead
<Sweet5hark1> - had some LibreOffice folks over for home hacking
<Sweet5hark1> - fixed a mail merge regression upstream
<Sweet5hark1> - upstream code review
<Sweet5hark1> EOF
<willcooke> thanks ochosi :)
<willcooke> and thanks Sweet5hark1
<Sweet5hark1> indeed: ochosi rocks!
<willcooke> #topic TheMuso
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2016-07-26 | Current topic: TheMuso
<willcooke> * Getting back to original cycle plans... Working on fixing more bugs in a11y-profile-manager, properly supporting desktop environments, still working out a solution in the installer because XDG_CURRENT_DESKTOP may not always be set.
<willcooke> * Updated Orca to latest upstream release.
<willcooke> * Working on syncing speech-dispatcher with debian so it can be purely maintained there, and shouldn't require any more merging in the future.
<willcooke> * Started working on a pulseaudio documentation package. Its available in the source, but not shipped.
<willcooke> #topic tkamppeter
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2016-07-26 | Current topic: tkamppeter
<tkamppeter> - OpenPrinting web site: Evaluated possibilities for web site improvement and partial moving of services (to ease maintainability, follow current standards, and to overcome low attention by LF sys admins):
<tkamppeter>    o Repositories to GitHub as the general standard
<tkamppeter>    o Static content to GitHub/Jekyll to make it GIT-repo- instead of GUI-interface-based
<tkamppeter>    o Mirroring of driver database to a PWG-(Printing Working Group, www.pwg.org)-supplied server
<tkamppeter>    o Replace forums by mailing lists.
<tkamppeter> - Snappy: Studied the way how to snap CUPS and asked questions on Snappy mailing list.
<tkamppeter> - Google Summer of Code 2016: Guide students through their projects
<tkamppeter> - Bugs
<willcooke> thanks tkamppeter
<willcooke> #topic Trevinho
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2016-07-26 | Current topic: Trevinho
<Trevinho> Â· Fixed various crashes from e.u.c
<Trevinho> Â· Use gsettings sync when saving settings in migration scripts
<Trevinho> Â· Reworked hikiko's shadows on shaped windows branch to be more C++ friendly and use more caching
<Trevinho> Â· Continued working in unity8 slots indicators
<Trevinho> Â· Various reviews
<Trevinho> Â· About to finalize a new juicy landing for BAMF, compiz and unity
<Trevinho>   /EOF [out Thu and Fri]
<seb128> coming ones?
<seb128> or the previous ones? (I think you swapped thursday?)
<Trevinho> coming
<seb128> k
<Trevinho> I swapped 1 day last week
<seb128> enjoy!
<Trevinho> thanks :)
<willcooke> thanks Trevinho
<willcooke> #topic AOB
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting 2016-07-26 | Current topic: AOB
<willcooke> Was off yesterday, so I'll send out a who is where email in a mo
<seb128> congrats everyone one getting a good 16.04.1 one btw!
<seb128> one->out
<willcooke> indeed, well done!
<seb128> we didn't mention it much but good stack of improvements/fixes in there
<seb128> feedback from what I read is nice
<Trevinho> :)
<seb128> hikiko, Trevinho, great work on the lowgfx, that makes vms nicer to use
<seb128> (well other improvements/fixes are nice as well but that one is quite noticable when you test something in a vm ;-)
<Trevinho> yeah, I didn't expect that it would have become so snappy
 * willcooke wonders what happened to that blog post marketing asked him to write about the release 
<Trevinho> I tend to use VMs with 3d accels, but yeah..
<Trevinho> Oh!
<Trevinho> no post?
<willcooke> I can't find it if they did
<willcooke> meh
<Trevinho> we need to spam...
<willcooke> will chase
<Laney> Trevinho: are you still looking at the black corners thing btw?
<Trevinho> Laney: I've that in my todo...
<Trevinho> but... I gave a stop on that as i wanted to focus on some stuff I'm keeping in the stash for too long, after the crashfixes..
<Laney> as you wish
<willcooke> ok, let's wrap the meeting with a picture of x_nox chasing a penguin.  http://tinyurl.com/h4uzrc7
<Laney> it's going to be in the release soon
<andyrock> ahaha
<willcooke> Laney, Trevinho please carry on once meeting is closed....
<Laney> wtf is a webp
<willcooke> #endmeeting
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks
<meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Jul 26 15:51:21 2016 UTC.
<meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2016/ubuntu-desktop.2016-07-26-15.30.moin.txt
 * qengho Zzz
<willcooke> night qengho FJKong
<andyrock> meeting over andy's day is over too
<FJKong> willcooke: tnx
<willcooke> cya andyrock
<Laney> nothing that firefox likes
<seb128> willcooke, we didn't activate upgrade suggestions yet afaik, so maybe they were waiting on that
<seb128> willcooke, I saw yesterday that j_ibel asked to delay a day to show the prompt because they wanted the test results from Dell certified machines (I think)
<willcooke> seb128, ohh, could be.  More likely they forgot, but that might work out nicely
<willcooke> oh cool, thanks seb128  - will follow up with him now
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> Ubuntu is not webp friendly
<seb128> neither firefox, eog nor gimp likes it
<seb128> had to install "webp" and use the vwebp command line tool
<Laney> chromium can do it
<seb128> thanks for the hint, didn't think about trying there
<Laney> https://github.com/aruiz/webp-pixbuf-loader
<Laney> package that
<Laney> !
<seb128> honestly, wth intel!
<seb128> gpu errors, session corrupted on closed every thrid user switch
<willcooke> snap!
<willcooke> as in snap that package
<willcooke> not the same problems as seb128
<seb128> what do we snap? ;-)
<willcooke> https://github.com/aruiz/webp-pixbuf-loader
<seb128> ah
<seb128> not a good snap example :p
<willcooke> (I know, it wont work as a snap)
<willcooke> heh
<willcooke> yeah
<seb128> well maybe with content sharing!
<seb128> though it's going to share with other snaps
<seb128> so not going to work for the deb side of your system
<willcooke> oooh
<willcooke> an idea forms
<willcooke> an unconfined snap, which you could add to your library path, which then reshares content sharing snaps
<willcooke> 2. hand wave
<willcooke> 3. PROFIT
<seb128> lol
<seb128> will "hack master" cooke
<willcooke> :DDD
<seb128> k, time for dinner and some tennis, have a nice evening desktopers, see you tomorrow!
<willcooke> cya seb128
 * willcooke offski too
<willcooke> nigth
<willcooke> night
<bschaefer> hello looking to get a patch in yakkety for libsdl1.2, not 100% sure how to go about his, but ive a debian/patch and have tested everything!
<sarnold> bschaefer: prepare a debdiff, file a bug on the source package, including a description of the tsting you've done, and subscribe sponsors
<bschaefer> sarnold, thanks!
#ubuntu-desktop 2016-07-27
<qengho> zaoshanghao
<duflu> qengho: Morning?
<pitti> robru: is it possible to remove a package from a CI train ticket again?
<pitti> tedg: ^ for update-notifier
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<qengho> 5hi
<qengho> hi
<pitti> bonjour seb128!
<pitti> hey qengho
<seb128> salut pitti, Ã§a va bien ?
<seb128> hey qengho
<pitti> seb128: oui, et toi ?
<didrocks> bonjour pitti, qengho, re seb128
<pitti> bonjour didrocks !
<Trevinho> Morning folks!
<Trevinho> Bonjour didrocks, seb128, pitti...
<didrocks> hey Trevinho
<seb128> hey Trevinho, how are you?
<seb128> pitti,  Ã§a va bien (sorry was just eating breakfast)
<Trevinho> seb128: hey, allright..
<Trevinho> Hi willcooke
<seb128> Trevinho, getting a new landing going before the w.e? ;-)
<seb128> Trevinho, do you have special plans for the long w.e?
<willcooke> morning all
<Trevinho> seb128: yeah trying to
<seb128> hey willcooke
<Trevinho> seb128: yeah going few days to the sea here...
<seb128> nice
<seb128> hope you have fun there!
<Laney> morning!
<hikiko> morning all!
<willcooke> hi hi
<duflu> Afternoon...
<seb128> hey Laney hikiko duflu
<duflu> Hey seb128
<Laney> hi seb128
<Laney> forgot to say hi back :(
<Laney> good tennis?
<seb128> yes, excellent, weather was perfect to play yesterday, not windy, not too warm/cold and I had a good feeling, did some nice serving and points
<seb128> how was your evening?
<Laney> ARGH
<Laney> that beeping is still ongoing
<Laney> evening was nice, went to the allotment and constructed some more path
<Laney> then pub quizzed it up
<seb128> ah, nice
<Laney> one of the questions was "what is the name of moe's cat in the simpsons?"
<Laney> nobody even knew that he had one
<Laney> -> good question
<seb128> I didn't know either
<Laney> https://simpsonswiki.com/wiki/File:Mr._Snookums.png
<seb128> learning every day!
<Trevinho> hikiko: hey, can you check my branch this morning?
<hikiko> sure Trevinho :)
<Trevinho> hikiko: also there was a crash on closing google chrome... I've fixed it, but there are still some warnings I'd like to avoid
<Trevinho> since we're trying to get info from an unmapped window with no winndow id
<willcooke> desktoppers - please take a few mins to help smoketest the Trusty daily ISO booting on real hardware?
<willcooke> davmor2, if you have a gap in your schedule?  ^
<qengho> willcooke: Trusty?
<Laney> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/TrustyTahr/ReleaseSchedule
<Laney> trusty
<Laney> .5 is out soon
<qengho> Ah!
<davmor2> willcooke: that is next on my schedule now that 16.04.1 and upgrades are tested
<hikiko> Trevinho, what's the point of renaming all the variables everytime? it's difficult to see the changes... btw at a first glance, I see some things that might cause problems, eg: I had the addDamage there because in mmon some shadows didn't update
<hikiko> I haven't built it yet though
<willcooke> thanks davmor2 - writing a USB stick here
<hikiko> Trevinho, honestly, why changes like replace an if with foo ? bar : foobar  are necessary? they make the diff larger without adding any real optimisation
<hikiko> it's just a matter of preference
<hikiko> and why :s/width/Width for example?
<davmor2> willcooke: I need to test server proposed too I think for the fix for d-i so I need to test that for sru verfication
<Trevinho> hikiko: we've coding style in unity... guides/cppguide.xml
<Trevinho> hikiko: adddamage is implicit there
<hikiko> I am not sure, I was looking for a bug and this fixed it, I'll check in a while
<Trevinho> hikiko: optimizations are in not rebuilding the shadows at every window movement though...
<Trevinho> hikiko: now it happens only when the size of the window changes
<hikiko> I'll check it with a real-time shadow in a while
<hikiko> ok but anyway I think it would be better if you added a comment 7 months ago to rename the vars and the diff had your optimisations only so that it was cleaner anyway, thanks a lot, I am building :)
<hikiko> now the diff has all my lines
<hikiko> :p
<Trevinho> hikiko: I did most of the changes several months ago (as you can see in the commit log), but then as you know other priorites come in, and we had to delay this
<hikiko> yeah, i kno, i am not saying about the time anyway, I mean that the diff would be cleaner if we only see the optimisations and not the renames
<Trevinho> Now I'm just trying to clean the plate with all the stuff we did and never landed, so we can hopefully SRU them if they work fine and leave unity7 in the best shape we can....
<hikiko> because now it has every single line
<Trevinho> hikiko: review commit by commit if you want... it should be easier
<hikiko> yeah, good idea
<Trevinho> hikiko: refactor is here, other commits are changes http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/unity/shadows-on-existing-pixmaps-cleanup/revision/4078
<hikiko> thanks
<Trevinho> hikiko: I've pushed a fix that was causing a warning when closing chrome...
<willcooke> desktoppers (and davmor2) - I've done a test for x86 64 and 32.  Both passed and logged on the ISO tracker.  Moar testing please though
<willcooke> ISO tracker here:  http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/milestones/308/builds
<Trevinho> hikiko: can you get that revew done in 2 hrs? Since i'd like to do this landing...
<seb128> willcooke, is there any point doing more standard intel hwd installs?
<seb128> I can do some but I don't have any "interesting" config
<seb128> like nvidia ones
<hikiko> I am trying Trevinho
<Trevinho> thanks
<willcooke> seb128, certainly no point in you testing your Inspiron :)
<willcooke> hikiko, could you try a live ISO on your NV machine?
<seb128> willcooke, lol, I can do inspiron or vm ... :-/
<hikiko> willcooke, I can but since I can't use intel and nv at the same time, could you wait a couple of hours to finish Trevinho's review?
<hikiko> because I am on intel right now
<willcooke> hikiko, of course, np
 * Laney screams at D
<Trevinho> Laney: instead of screaming... when you want to take a break, can you get ahead in reviewing the distro changes for https://requests.ci-train.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/1698 ð? So we can publish it straight forward once hikiko is done ;-)
<hikiko> Trevinho, it seems to work but I am not sure about something I'll ping you in a while
<Trevinho> hikiko: there's really no much change in terms of logic...
<Trevinho> but sure
<hikiko> well, if you want to merge it then I could check and do another mp, there aren't any crashes etc so I guess wont be a prob, just 1 thing I had a comment in PixmapTexture::Ptr
<hikiko> Make sure to modify Window::Impl::ComputeShapedShadowQuad in
<hikiko> /DecoratedWindow.cpp if you change the factor.
<hikiko> but I can't find it, if you don't change both factors it will misfunction, maybe put it back?
<hikiko> Trevinho, ^
<Trevinho> hikiko: I've defined a const value for that which is shared now
<hikiko> ok
<hikiko> I didn't find that
<Trevinho> hikiko: see SHADOW_BLUR_MARGIN_FACTOR
<hikiko> ok
<hikiko> found
<hikiko> alright
<hikiko> Trevinho, merge it since there aren't crashes, I am going to check the livecd and then come back to it, if I see anything I'll do another MP
<hikiko> thanks
<Trevinho> hikiko: fine... It used to crash before though
<Trevinho> (as it was trying to paint an invalid texture, but this is not the case anymore)
<hikiko> yes you told me, I never got that crash but I guess I was lucky
<Trevinho> hikiko: I saw it with google chome all the times...
<hikiko> sounds reasonable to crash if the tex was invalid
<hikiko> yeah you told me and I tested it I had sent you a video I think
<Trevinho> basically that was because we were setting the frame geo dirty on window that were destroyed, and trying to damage them
<Trevinho> this was causing a paint loop... and all the rest.
<hikiko> sounds like a bug, I just was lucky :)
<hikiko> thanks
 * Trevinho yeah this was the trace http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/21126640/
<seb128> grrr intel drivers, vt switch and I've no vt prompts (systemd?) and now going back to vt7 my unity dash elements have no textures&co
<seb128> ->reboot
<hikiko> seb128,
<hikiko> wait!
<hikiko> i have that too
<hikiko> you don't need a reboot
<hikiko> just kill Xorg
<hikiko> killall Xorg is fine
<seb128> does that bring back vts as well?
<seb128> but already rebooted
<hikiko> yes
<seb128> going to try next time
<seb128> k, weird
<seb128> thanks!
<hikiko> welcome :)
<seb128> but restarting X or rebooting is not much different
<seb128> need to close my session :-/
<hikiko> yeah :/
<hikiko> I think this happens when xserver receives a signal
<hikiko> but I can't recall which one
<hikiko> it usually happens to me after dist-upgrade
<andyrock> hey all
<Trevinho> Laney: available for your lovely publishing hands https://requests.ci-train.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/1698 :-)
<hikiko> willcooke: busy?
<willcooke> hikiko, back
<hikiko> welcome back willcooke
<hikiko> there's actually a problem with nouveau
<hikiko> I didn't realize that at once
<hikiko> I tested the installation process that was ok apart from a small delay and flickering at the beginning
<willcooke> hikiko, cool - so a pass from you?
<hikiko> and then the desktop
<hikiko> was idle
<willcooke> hikiko, do you have write access to this?  http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/milestones/308/builds
<hikiko> when the system went to sleep mode
<hikiko> there was a hang
<willcooke> hikiko, actually, this is the right page:  http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/milestones/308/builds/127049/testcases/1303/results
<hikiko> willcooke: the bug is in the nouveau driver
<hikiko> should I link it?
<hikiko> if the system sleeps during the installation process it will fail
<willcooke> hikiko, hmm.  It's not a failure in the sense that 14.04.5 is now broken, but yeah, log it and we can follow up with the driver guys
<hikiko> I didn't finish the installation because it's not a vm, I stopped before "writing changes to disk"
<willcooke> hikiko, you just needed to test a live session
<hikiko> willcooke: did that
<willcooke> hikiko, cool.  If you can mark it as a test passed then.  And then we can work out how to report to nouveau
<dobey> Laney, seb128: can we get https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/zeitgeist/+bug/1584849 at least into y and maybe SRUed to xenial?
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1584849 in zeitgeist (Ubuntu) "Creating a log on a non-default thread causes it to hang" [Undecided,New]
<hikiko> oh
<hikiko> willcooke:
<hikiko> I am sorry
<hikiko> I didn't mark it as passed
<hikiko> I didn't see the last line
<hikiko> can I change it?
<hikiko> found ok I changed it
<willcooke> thx
<seb128> oh come on intel
<Laney> dobey: I put it in the sponsor queue, won't have time to look immediately but I have a patch pilot shift coming up if nobody else does it before then
<dobey> Laney: ok. just saw you had done previous uploads of zeitgeeist, so thought i should ask you
<ximion> Laney: I think I exist to annoy you ^^
<ximion> (I just pushed a patch to asgen master which speeds up the generator by 4-6min (depending on how many suites/sections one processes), but that patch will almost certainly clash with your changes)
<ximion> but maybe Git can rebase, who knows ^^
<Laney> bah
<Laney> merge them?
<seb128> bah, downgraded back packages to proper xenial for the user session upstart/systemd but I still get indicators missing in the greeter when I try to switch user
<Laney> also give me some ideas about why this happens and we can be friends again https://paste.debian.net/785587/
<ximion> Laney: eh.... no memory? :P
<ximion> for that, the patch I just committed might actually help
<ximion> oh, and we can also get rid of that spawnProcess, at the expense of depending on a more recent libarchive
<Laney> it can't fork
<Laney> but I don't know why
<Laney> meh
<Laney> let me rebase and then try with the new thing
<ximion> it's a bad habit of me that when I find an issue I end up moving all pieces around a lot to make it sane
<ximion> (it usually ends up being much better than before - until I find some issue and rework that stuff again)
<Laney> I would have preferred you to merge my stuff than make me understand what changed and adapt to it
<ximion> Laney: I am actually just waiting for a PR from you, when you think it's ready
<willcooke> hmmm.  Fresh install of 16.04.1 on my Inspiron has a slight odd looking font...  http://imgur.com/a/O190P
<Laney> just take it without the PR if you know you're going to break it
<Laney> I don't mind
<ximion1> [15:42] <ximion> Laney: I am actually just waiting for a PR from you, when you think it's ready
<willcooke> bah, that screenshot sucks, this is better:  http://imgur.com/a/qUAI2
<willcooke> seb128, did you see this on your Inspiron? ^
<Laney> 27/07 14:42:25 <Laney> just take it without the PR if you know you're going to break it
<Laney> 27/07 14:42:26 <Laney> I don't mind
<willcooke> seb128, sorry, this:  http://imgur.com/a/qUAl2
<seb128> willcooke, I didn't notice but I don't have a good eye for details and tend to overlook those, let me boot it to see how it's there
<ximion1> I didn't know I would break it
<ximion1> fortunately there's no functional break, you probably just need to add overrides
<willcooke> seb128, bah, ignore.  Reboot and it's fine now
<seb128> willcooke, can you try to go the switch user and see if the greeter has all its indicators?
<seb128> willcooke, like lock screen and use the session indicator to "switch user" or open a guest and close it
<willcooke> seb128, Heisenbug
<Laney> ximion1: I mean "hmm, these changes touch that code - I'll just grab the commits and then make my refactoring"
<Laney> you can ask me if that's a good idea if you want, I'm always online in the day
<Laney> anyway
<Laney> doesn't look that bad at first glance
<bregma> hey desktoppers, I'm looking for additional testers for a unity8-desktop-session landing in https://launchpad.net/~ci-train-ppa-service/+archive/ubuntu/landing-007
<Laney> thanks for the optimisations!
<willcooke> bregma, just reinstalled my test machine to test u8 things! :)
<bregma> initial testing surfaced some incompatible apps, so more testing is better
<willcooke> bregma, I'm investigating reports that apps stopped running again
<willcooke> bregma, is that the same thing?
<seb128> willcooke, heisenbug? you mean indicators work for you?
<willcooke> bregma, oh wait - I'm testing 16.04
<bregma> willcooke, not unless they already installed that silo
<willcooke> seb128, that font bug has vanished as soon as I started to look at it
<seb128> k
<seb128> willcooke, can you still try the indicators one? ;-)
<willcooke> bregma, lemme do these 16.04 ones and I'll loop back
<willcooke> seb128, testing now
<seb128> thanks
<bregma> willcooke, sure
<willcooke> seb128, all indicators missing except a11y.
<seb128> shrug
<seb128> willcooke, thanks
<seb128> "great"
<willcooke> seb128, also super-L in guest session seems to spawn a new session leaving the old ones running
<willcooke> realted?
<willcooke> related
<seb128> urg
<seb128> no
<ximion1> Laney: it really isn't - if you want, I could even fix it up for you
<Laney> ximion1: just pushed
<ximion1> (should take less than 3min)
<Laney> going to test it, then you can have a PR
<ximion1> hehe ^^
<ximion1> great!
<Laney> then I work on Translation support
<Laney> hope it's okay to rely on http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/yakkety/main/i18n/Index
<Laney> debian doesn't have this
<Laney> although it is in InRelease
<ximion1> ...yet
<Laney> probably should just use that
<Laney> why does git pull require an email address to be set?
 * Laney slaps
<Laney> oh right, it'is trying to do a merge
<ximion1> pull can mean Git needs to do a merge, which it needs the mail address for...
<Laney> I forgot I did some hax on the box directly
<ximion1> btw, as long as it doesn't break Debian, any code in the backend is fine :)
<Laney> I want this remote stuff to work for Debian too as far as possible
<Laney> hopefully this abstract class thing means that I can put the langpack support in an ubuntu backend which inherits from the debian one
<ximion1> sitter on KDE Neon is looking at the remote stuff too
<ximion1> I wonder if it makes sense to implement a cache manager which handles this transparently for all backends
 * Laney adds a timeout and then runs
<Laney> timeout retry
<bregma> I'm trying to track down the cause of something we see in Libertine: <Fly__> For terminal and firefox I get an error when it starting : "an error occured while loading or saving configuration information for terminator. Some of your configuration settings my not work properly". When I click "details" it says "Failed to activation configuration. The name org.gnome.GConf was not provided by any service files"
<bregma> would anyone here have a suggestion as to why we see that and how to cure it?
<seb128> bug #1521116 should be an easy one for andyrock right? ;-)
<ubot5> bug 1521116 in unity (Ubuntu) "session dialog doesn't close on first "esc" use" [Low,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1521116
<Laney> bregma: Sounds like gconf isn't installed in there
<Laney> ximion: these unittest blocks
<seb128> just got annoyed again by this one and looked to see if it was already reported, seems I did that in novembre :p
<Laney> is there an easy way to mock something?
<Laney> I want to provide sample Release files to test against
<seb128> Laney, were you going to look at the landing Trevinho pingeg you about?
<Laney> later, I have a tab for it
<Laney> you can if you want though
<seb128> no it's fine ;-)
<seb128> just checking because I went over the backlog
<seb128> if it's going to be handled it's fine
<seb128> I guess we don't need to have Trevinho around after landing
<seb128> worth thing we block it in proposed until monday
<Trevinho> As you prefer
<Laney> it's blocked either way because of freeze
 * ricotz grabs Sweet5hark's 5.1.5rc2 package
<Trevinho> andyrock can handle that in case if you help him landing something if needed
<ximion> Laney: you could generate it at test-time, or place it in the test/samples directory
<seb128> oh, right, alpha
<seb128> I tend to forget about those since we stopped doing them
<seb128> doing->participating in
<Laney> ximion: the hard bit seems to be mocking a function?
<Laney> I don't want to call the real download thing
<Laney> -debian/00_remove_obsolete_plugins_in_unity_session_v1.py
<Laney> +debian/00_remove_obsolete_plugins_in_unity_session_v2.py
<Laney> haha
 * Laney stares at the 00
<seb128> lol
<ximion> Laney: hmm.... http://stackoverflow.com/questions/4800122/what-mock-object-libraries-are-there-available-for-d
<ximion> DMocks-revived is pretty dead again ^^
<Laney> yeah
<Laney> was wondering if that unittest {} stuff had something for this
<ximion> I am sure something exists for Vibe, since they will simply have to mock network operations in a web framework
<ximion> unittest blocks on their own are pretty dumb :P https://wiki.dlang.org/Unittest
<ximion> Laney: btw, instead of just asserting here, you probably want a contract instead: https://github.com/iainlane/appstream-generator/blob/master/source/utils.d#L332
<ximion> https://dlang.org/spec/contracts.html#pre_post_contracts
<Laney>  /me blinks
<Laney>                             /me
<Laney> ximion: that page says that assert is already a contract
<ximion> jup
<tedg> seb128: Laney: Could I please add uploading this patch to ZG to one of your TODO lists? bug 1584849
<ubot5> bug 1584849 in zeitgeist (Ubuntu) "Creating a log on a non-default thread causes it to hang" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1584849
<Laney> dobey already asked earlier
<ximion> but since this is input-validation, you could but it into an in {} block, if you want
<tedg> Ah, awesome.
<Laney> ximion: what's the advantage for simple asserts?
<Laney> as far as I can tell both will be ignored in release builds
<ximion> (IMHO the real useful feature is the invariant block for classes, but I didn't feel the need to use it yet ^^)
<Laney> like I'd use in {} if doing more complicated precondition checks
<Laney> but assert is going to be skipped anyway...
<Laney> that's how it seems to me anyway
<ximion> in this case, the advantage would only be syntactical
<ximion> and the documentation generator would show this constraint on the input value in the docs
<seb128> tedg, hey, what L_aney said
<Laney> ok
<Laney> I'll do it if you want
<Laney> you go do it in the places where you haven't :P
<seb128> tedg, how are you?
<seb128> tedg, btw since you are around, I'm curious but what's the status of snapping inkscape? I think you had it mostly working?
<tedg> seb128: Doing good, I dropped update-notifier and unity from the silo.
<seb128> good
<pitti> hey tedg, good morning
<tedg> seb128: Yes, but they haven't fixed the desktop bug yet :-(
<pitti> tedg: ah, you figured out how to do that?
<tedg> pitti: Yeah, looking at the hud build now.
<Laney> ximion: actually I can add an out {} there that the file exists
<tedg> Might be easier to drop hud and just put it in a dual silo.
<pitti> tedg: oh, I thought unity was needed for all the indicators to even work
<tedg> pitti: Yes, but Trevinho wanted to land it in a different silo
<pitti> ok
<robru> pitti: yes it is
<Trevinho> tedg: actually... I didn't include your branch in the landing I've ready... So feel free to readd it to your silo
<pitti> Trevinho, tedg: did you find out what caused this mysterious depwait on a newer compiz? ted's systemd branch didn't change that build dep
<Laney> ximion1: pushed it (and fix your connection!)
<tedg> pitti: Was that only on vivid? /me deleted it so can't check
<pitti> tedg: no, on all releases
<pitti> tedg: anyway, certainly simpler to land everything else first, and then another silo for the special kids
<tedg> Yeah
<seb128> tedg, what desktop bug?
<tedg> seb128: ?
<seb128> <tedg> seb128: Yes, but they haven't fixed the desktop bug yet :-(
<seb128> sorry was lagging behind
<tedg> seb128: Oh, sorry, let me find it.
<seb128> discussing on snappy channel from other issues
<seb128> tedg, was that the relocation?
<tedg> seb128: https://bugs.launchpad.net/snapcraft/+bug/1588359
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1588359 in Snapcraft "No way to add setup files at build time" [Undecided,Triaged]
<seb128> you could snap from your branch which includes the fix :p
<seb128> ah
<tedg> seb128: The being able to use desktop files with merged translations
<seb128> come on
<seb128> it's easy enough to workaround to get going
<seb128> just manually cp the one from the build to setup/gui
<seb128> and do another build
<seb128> or copy to the prime and snapcraft snap prime
<tedg> You can't do it in snapcraft, but yes.
<seb128> well, you can copy the generated version in the vcs
<seb128> in setup/gui
<tedg> Yes, also thinking you could do a CMake target: "make snap" that would do it.
<tedg> Would be nice to also not have to have all the snapcraft stuff in the root dir.
<seb128> tedg, d_idrocks (I think?) wrote recently somewhere that you can have it in a subdir, you just need to have the corresponding relative path for the source
<seb128> I didn't test that though
<seb128> tedg, also you can use .snapcraft.yaml
<tedg> Might be easier to use the . file, as I'm not sure LP will build in a subdir.
<seb128> right
<seb128> tedg, in any case let me know if I can help with something, would be cool to have inskcape in the store ;-)
<tedg> Yeah, we could put something provisional there, but was hoping to have it upstream first. Which would require using the proper desktop file.
<ximion1> Laney: is it merge-ready?
<ximion1> sorry for the connection, seems to be a bad day for my provider or the wifi connection
<Laney> ximion1: still running, didn't crash yet
<seb128> tedg, would upstream be opposed to have a .desktop checkout in setup/gui until the bug is fixed? sure that would need to be refreshed when translations change but I guess that doesn't happen so often for the Name/Comments, inkscape is there for a while and those don't move a lot
<Laney> you might as well review
<Laney> have a PR
 * ximion1 doesn't see a PR yet
 * ximion1 doesn't see the new commit either :P
<Laney> look harder!
<ximion1> a Github-internal "squash to one commit" feature would be very cool now ^^
<tedg> seb128: Probably not a huge issue, but more I something I thought was going to be fixed soon as everyone basically needs it...
<tedg> seb128: Anyway, I merged the 0.92.x branch. Let's see if it still snaps :-)
<seb128> tedg, it probably would if the snappy team was not locked down in sprint for 15days every month :p
<tedg> seb128: Yeah, I'd recommend not looking at the snappy critical bug list :-)
<ximion1> Laney: looks good! (I have a few minor nitpicks, but that's something I can quickly fix when things are merged)
<Laney> cool
<ximion1> I'll merge it as soon as you report no-failure from your side :)
<Laney> my first dlang code
<ximion1> \o/
<ximion1> btw, a thing that is starting to be a bit annyoing in D is decorator bloat - a few hours ago, I annotated a function @safe override pure immutable @nogc
<Laney> bahaha
<Laney> @itsreallygoodok
<meetingology> Laney: Error: "itsreallygoodok" is not a valid command.
 * Laney slaps meetingology 
<ximion1> :-D
<ximion1> those decorators are really neat for web-development (you can have @path("/foobar"), reminds me of Python)
<ximion1> but at least @safe should be the default
<Laney> 2016-07-27 16:05:37 - INFO: Writing metadata for yakkety/universe [armhf]
<Laney> std.process.ProcessException@../../../../src/libphobos/src/std/process.d(417): Failed to spawn new process (Cannot allocate memory)
<ximion1> Laney: run it again ^^
<ximion1> if it's a memory issue, it will use less memory on the second run
<ximion1> Laney: could you get a libarchive backport without big problems?
<Laney> it does work when run again
<Laney> is libarchive a transition?
<ximion1> Laney: no
<Laney> should be easy then
<ximion1> okay, then I can get rid of this not-so-failsafe code
<ximion1> (will need libarchive >= 3.2 then)
<Laney> cool
<Laney> I'll just re-run now, can clean when that appears
<seb128> attente, hey, can I bother you a sec about the snappy xdg-open thing
<attente> seb128: sure
<seb128> did you look at getting it working from a GNOME app?
<seb128> it works if I xdg-open URL
<seb128> but I guess we need a .desktop and a mimetype handle for the gtk side to work?
<seb128> handler
<seb128> I'm going to have a look to that, just wanted to check before starting in case you already did some work
<attente> yeah, i think you're right. desrt would know more about that though
<seb128> that's fine, I know what is needed
<seb128> just checking so I don't dup work
<attente> thanks seb128
<seb128> attente, thanks!
<seb128> willcooke, do you have a fresh 16.04.1 from those test installs?
<willcooke> seb128, yes!
<seb128> willcooke, could you try bug #1605802 when you have some free slot?
<ubot5> bug 1605802 in gnome-software (Ubuntu) "Software Center still fails to install third-party .deb packages" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1605802
<seb128> downloading chrome .deb and double click and see if it installs
 * Trevinho leaves for a while... might be back later... or... see you monday!
<willcooke> have a good break Trevinho
<willcooke> seb128, sure
<seb128> Trevinho, have a nice w.e!
<Trevinho> thanks
<seb128> willcooke, thanks
<willcooke> seb128, tested and works
<seb128> k
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> good to see it's not a regression
<seb128> or not happening for everyone
<seb128> on that note time for making dinner
<seb128> have a nice evening desktopers!
<ximion1> Laney: all good?
<Laney> ximion1: it's going to take some hours to finish
<willcooke> cheers seb128
<Laney> bye seb128
<Laney> happy dinner!
<ximion1> oh, so it's a full run then
<ximion1> did you preserve the contents cache?
<ximion1> (and run it with eatmydata, that also speeds things up, as always)
<Laney> I made a new machine for this
<Laney> firewall was only fixed in a different env
<Laney> it just saved amd64/universe without crashing
<Laney> night!
<willcooke> night Laney
<ximion1> Laney: neat!
<ximion1> I got rid of the xz/gzip calls meanwhile, so we don't spawn any external process anymore now \o/ (except for maybe gdk-pixbuf (does it still do that?), but that is avoided as much as possible)
<ximion1> good night! :)
<tedg> seb128: Here is a build, but it doesn't have menus :-/  Have to look into it more. https://code.launchpad.net/~ted/+snap/inkscape/+build/1909
<seb128> tedg, no menu or no exported ones?
<seb128> tedg, is that normal that it builds only for amd64 (my laptop is i386 still ... need to change that but I would have expected launchpad to build for different archs)
<tedg> seb128: No menus, in line or exported.
<seb128> weird
<tedg> seb128: Oh, I only built for amd64 while testing.
<seb128> I though launchpad would do the same as ppa
<tedg> seb128: I can build others, just was saving build time.
<seb128> default build for all supported archs
<tedg> seb128: It did, I unchecked them :-)
<seb128> if you build for i386 I can have a look to see if there is a gotcha I'm familiar with
<tedg> Will do
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> hey robert_ancell!
<robert_ancell> seb128, yo, still up?
<tedg> seb128: https://launchpad.net/~ted/+snap/inkscape/+build/1913
<seb128> robert_ancell, yeah, was at tennis and decided to hack a bit after that and try to catch up with you after the sprint
<seb128> tedg, thanks
<seb128> tedg, works for me including nicely integrated menus, but I tried with devmode ... do you use strict?
<seb128> hum, no, that has menus as well
<seb128> calling it a day but let's talk about that tomorrow, night there!
#ubuntu-desktop 2016-07-28
<qengho> Hi hi hi.
<hikiko> hi
 * qengho pounces on hikiko.
<qengho> Finally! I've been *so lonely*.
<hikiko> Hi qengho !
<pitti> Good morning
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<didrocks> re seb128
<seb128> re didrocks :-)
<seb128> just got my coffee and done with email backlog, can start looking at what I should put on my plate for today ;-)
<flocculant> seb128: bacon and eggs
<Laney> yoooooooooooo
<willcooke> morning all
<TheMuso> Hey Laney, willcooke.
<didrocks> hey Laney, willcooke, TheMuso
<seb128> hey Laney willcooke TheMuso
<Laney> what's up
<davmor2> Oh Laney you so street
<Laney> west side is the best side
<pitti> hey Laney!
<pitti> Ã§a va seb128
<davmor2> Laney: Wales is no the best side, It's nice don't get me wrong but not best ;)
<pitti> hello davmor2 and willcooke, how are you?
<davmor2> pitti: 'ow do chap? I'm good thanks netboot testing today my favourite \o/
<pitti> davmor2: hah, you have strange pleasures :)
<seb128> pitti, salut, Ã§a va bien ?
<pitti> seb128: oui, et toi ?
<seb128> trÃ¨s bien merci !
<davmor2> pitti: Oh sorry I seemed to be missing the <sarcasm></sarcasm> tag I do that I assume people see text from me and read it in my sarcastic tone by default ;)
<pitti> davmor2: honestly, I actually do like to test netboot -- it feels a bit magic :)
<pitti> "here's a completely blank machine which boots ubuntu out of thin air"
<pitti> well, thin air and some really thin copper lines, close enough :)
<davmor2> pitti: for me it is the time it takes that drive me to distraction other than that it is fine :)
<pitti> admittedly I usually test with a VM and use my laptop as a proxy (apt-cacher-ng), then it's really fast
<davmor2> pitti: yeah see I can't do that as I need to test that it connects to the servers each time :)
<pitti> davmor2: actually, can we automate the actual install with preseed?
<pitti> there's little reason why netboot tests can't be fully automated as an autopkgtest of d-i
<pitti> nested qemu works well enough these days
<davmor2> pitti: true but hey for now I'm it
<davmor2> willcooke: should there be a unity8 option for yakkety on netboot by the way?
<willcooke> davmor2, no
<willcooke> at least, not yet
<andyrock> morning
<willcooke> hey andyrock
<seb128> hey andyrock
<Sweet5hark1> heh, sooo, researching some stuff on precise I found I could crash the gdb that the crash reporter called, causing a new crash reporter that ... can be used to crash a gdb again and so on.
<willcooke> :)
<pitti> tedg: Trevinho included the bamf merge in a different landing (https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/bamf/0.5.3~bzr0+16.10.20160726.1-0ubuntu1), so can you please remove it from the mega-ticket?
<ximion> Laney: you want libarchive >= 3.1.9 for asgen to work
<ximion> (but that was an alpha release, so 3.2 will do :) )
<tedg> pitti: Ah, okay. We need an indicator-network fix and unity7 to land as well.
<Laney> HEISENBERGGGGGGGGGGG
 * Laney just watched the last episode
<Laney> ximion: yeh, I'm going to backport it
<pitti> Laney: ooh! I really liked Breaking Bad
 * Laney hears the archers theme tune
<Laney> pitti: yeah, me too!
<Laney> although I'm not sure if I'm on his side any more :-)
<pitti> Laney: I think that was the point :)
<Laney> indeed
<pitti> the great thing was that you cannot really pinpoint when he stops being the pity underdog/likable person and becomes the monster cartell boss
<Laney> last time I was at climbing there were 3 people with Heisenberg t-shirts at the same time
<Laney> The central theme of "Ozymandias" is contrasting the inevitable decline of all leaders and of the empires they build with their pretensions to greatness
<Laney> ha
<ximion> Laney: I will probably do the same for Debian
<ximion> the change I wanted for libarchive was in Git master for about three years - libarchive releases slowly
<ximion> Breaking Bad was awesome!
<seb128> tedg, hey, so about inkscape, menus works for me....
<tedg> seb128: Yeah, what version of snapd do you have?
<seb128> current xenial
<seb128> so 2.0.10
<seb128> you?
<tedg> Hmm, was thinking that was the issue.
<tedg> Yeah, current xenial here too.
<seb128> did you install --devmode or not?
<tedg> seb128: No, not --devmode, but you said it worked both ways for you, right?
<seb128> yes
<seb128> just curious if it works in devmode for you
<seb128> but yeah, works in devmode or confined here
<seb128> with lim or not
<seb128> do you get any error if you start if from a command line?
<seb128> or in syslog, maybe apparmor denies?
<tedg> seb128: Hmm, works in devmode
<seb128> "good"
<seb128> dpkg -l | grep snapd?
<tedg> Heh
<seb128> did you restart your machine since you upgraded?
<tedg> Yeah, restarted this morning.
<tedg> Yup it is 2.0.10
<seb128> hum
<seb128> dmesg | DEN
<seb128> ?
<seb128> it apparently tries to use gnome-vfs and get denied
<seb128> unsure if that's worth fixing, it's time to move away from gnome-vfs :p
<seb128> nothing to do with the menu though
<tedg> Sure, next release of Inkscape drops GTK2. This release is aimed to be the last there.
<seb128> k
<seb128> so, DENIES?
<seb128> in confined mode
<seb128> well if you try confined before those are probably still in the log
<seb128> andyrock, thanks for fixing that esc-clos-dialog issue :-)
<seb128> tedg, no denies then?
<andyrock> np :D
<seb128> andyrock, if somebody added that code though that was probably for a reason, are you sure it's safe to delete it?
<andyrock> pretty sure Trevinho tought it was a good idea
<andyrock> :)
<andyrock> but it's not
<andyrock> seb128: I cannot see a design reason on why doing that
<tedg> seb128: Standup, just a sec
<seb128> tedg, no worry, sorry for the nagging, I was unsure if you saw my message since I didn't mention your name
<seb128> andyrock,       SessionView: only use the Escape key event if a button is key-focused
<seb128> is the commit it was added
<seb128> so yeah, let's see what Marco says
<andyrock> seb128: he will disagree and we'll force him to approve it :D
<seb128> lol
<seb128> yeah we will!
<tedg> seb128: Do you have the dbus-user-bus stuff installed?
<tedg> seb128: I'm getting denials on /run/user/1001/bus
<tedg> Thinking it can't talk to DBus and thus export the menus.
<seb128> oh
<seb128> right, sorry
<seb128> tedg, can you apply that patch http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~apparmor-dev/apparmor/master/revision/3492 to /etc/apparmor.d/abstractions/dbus-session-strict and 'sudo invoke-rc.d apparmor reload"
<tyhicks> seb128, tedg: FYI, I included that patch in apparmor 2.10.95-4ubuntu2 (landed in yakkety)
<tedg> tyhicks: Are you planning to SRU?
<tyhicks> tedg: it is needed in xenial?
<seb128> tyhicks, thanks for that :-)
<tedg> tyhicks: Not sure, it means if you have the user bus config installed snaps don't work. The user bus stuff isn't that common, but will likely become more so depending on how systemd user sessions go.
<tyhicks> tedg: I can include it in the apparmor SRU that I'm preparing now
<tyhicks> shouldn't hurt anything
<seb128> tedg, let me know if that fixes it for you
<tedg> seb128: Yup, it does!
<tedg> tyhicks: Cool, thanks!
<seb128> tedg, great, mystery solved!
<seb128> tedg, other small issue, the Icon used in the .desktop doesn't exist, you probably want to copy the inkscape one in your setup/gui/icon.svg
<Trevinho> seb128, andyrock: I remember it was discussed at the time with John... So first escape press would have done that
<andyrock> mmm Trevinho but why? what's the point? :)
<seb128> hey Trevinho, stop doing IRC on vac days! ;-)
<Trevinho> Right...
 * Trevinho hides
<seb128> Trevinho, hope you are having a fun day at the sea ;-)
<tedg> seb128: Ah, oops
<tedg> seb128: Can I symlink that?
<seb128> tedg, good question, no idea, try and tell me :-)
<tedg> seb128: Seems to, rebuilding on LP
<seb128> cool
<tedg> seb128: Also sent a mail to inkscape-devel to get some feedback.
<seb128> tedg, great, thanks!
<Laney> night night!
<willcooke> night Laney
<willcooke> night all
#ubuntu-desktop 2016-07-29
<qengho> Howdy, y'all!
<jbicha> qengho: mornin'
<qengho> jbicha: where are you these days?
<jbicha> S of Tampa, FL
<jbicha> so, not morning here :)
<jbicha> I just didn't want you to be lonely like yesterday so I said hi this time
<sarnold> <3
<qengho> <3
<qengho> jbicha: I'm back in CFL in 5 days.
<qengho> jbicha_: I'm back in CFL in 5 days.
<jbicha> qengho: cool, that's quite a time zone shift
<qengho> jbicha: It's an entire Ï out of phase.
<jbicha> it's cool that you wouldn't have to adjust an old-school analog clock/watch for it
<hikiko> Hello
<jbicha> hi
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<willcooke> morning all
<andyrock> morning all
<Laney> hey ho
<mpt> âA new version of Ubuntu is available. Would you like to upgrade?â
 * mpt tries to click a button in the dialog, but it jumps from the center of the screen to the top left corner
 * mpt tries again, but a moment too soon, the dialog disappears altogether
<seb128> hey willcooke andyrock Laney
<seb128> mpt, did it crash? :-( was that on trusty?
<Laney> hey seb128
<Laney> how's it going?
<seb128> Laney, happy friday! how are you today? how is rainy u.k?
<seb128> going well
<pitti> morning Laney!
<seb128> glad that it's friday ;-)
<seb128> though still a busy todolist for the day
<Laney> hey pitti!
<Laney> I am crippled today
<pitti> Laney: uh, what happened? climbing?
<Laney> yeah
<Laney> it was weird though
<Laney> I was just doing a climb and then managed to ruin my neck
<Laney> and it's quite bad today
<Laney> maybe pinched a nerve or so
<pitti> urgh
 * Laney is on ibuprofen
<willcooke> :((
<pitti> .. and I just wanted to ask you whether you could fill in for me during my vac..
<Laney> did you know that ibuprofen was discovered in nottingham?
<Laney> #funfacts
<Laney> fill in in what way?
<Laney> probably not at basketball
<Laney> but in other ways, sure ;-)
<pitti> Laney: discovered just for these crazy climbers? :-)
 * seb128 steps up for taking care of that daily icecream scoop
<pitti> Laney: for keeping an eye on the autopkgtest machinery
<pitti> seb128: that's the hardest tasks of all!
<seb128> indeed!
<seb128> we didn't even manage to get ice cream once while you were here
<pitti> well, we did have the one you grabbed on Sat
<seb128> I went yesterday evening though :p
<seb128> right
<seb128> I'm glad I did ;-)
<Laney> pitti: ah yeah, sure
<flexiondotorg> o/
<Laney> the queues are looking large
<pitti> Laney: I'll be off from next Wed for 1.5 weeks
<pitti> Laney: yeah, moar KDE goodness
<seb128> Laney, I hope you are going to be better for the w.e and that it's not going to ruin your w.e plans
<pitti> Laney: they went over the Qt 5.6 and Perl humps yesterday
<pitti> Laney: I messed up the setup-testbed script which caused a bunch of failures this morning, but TTBOMK everything is running smoothly now
<pitti> Laney: other than that I renamed lcy01.rc to *.disabled to avoid getting spammed by  those mails every 6 hours
<Laney> okay
<pitti> apparently reviving lcy01 is a bigger task
<Laney> I wonder what happened to it
<pitti> the disk of the DB server had been brittle for a while already, and apparently it now died completely
<pitti> R.I.P. mysql
<pitti> seb128, Laney: I hope systemd 231-1 will land by tomorrow, then I could land gnome-session to enable systemd sessions in y; problem is, that's right before my holidays, so if anything goes seriously wrong could you revert the Exec= line back to gnome-session in case?
<mpt> seb128, it came back eventually â¦ It was an example of the mistake of letting windows appear before the window manager has launched
<Laney> pitti: Alright, let's do it
<Laney> I'm going to upload gtk today too (but block it for a bit more in proposed)
<Laney> crack day
<Laney> flexiondotorg: you ready with your theme?
<flexiondotorg> Laney, close.
<flexiondotorg> Perhaps close enough for not total breakage.
<Laney> 'k
<pitti> Laney: that's the spirit :)
<flexiondotorg> When are you planning to land GTK 3.20?
<pitti> Laney: if/once I land it, I'll mail u-devel@ with contingency options
<flexiondotorg> Ah, today.
<seb128> mpt, ah ok, that explains why it moved I was wondering
<Laney> flexiondotorg: I'll block it for a bit though, there's still some unity-greeter problems that I would like to fix beforehand
<flexiondotorg> OK, no problem.
<Laney> Just want to get a start on having things built
<pitti> seb128: actually, I see no reason to not have daily ice cream on our bike trip along the Danube, so sorry, this task isn't available :-P
<Laney> Also let everybody get their themes & stuff lined up
<flexiondotorg> WHat we have now will prevent total breakage, but some bits still need work.
<Laney> Got a while until the next milestone anyway
<seb128> Laney, do you have bug #1548425 on your list? binding api changed it seems, it might be worth checking the rdepends before letting it in
<flexiondotorg> That is for Ubuntu MATE Themes. But, I'm happy to move.
<ubot5> bug 1548425 in update-manager (Ubuntu Yakkety) "update-manager crashed with AttributeError in check_hovering(): 'tuple' object has no attribute 'get_tags'" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1548425
<flexiondotorg> I also need to upload mate-themes for 3.20. They are 100% complete.
<seb128> pitti, bah! fair enough, going to fork it and do is as well anyway :p
 * pitti ^5s seb128
 * seb128 ^5s pitti
<Laney> seb128: no, thx
<seb128> yw!
<willcooke> Laney, thanks for the suggestions to the apt issue.
<Laney> np!
<willcooke> ahh, who remembers Summer 2016?
<duflu> willcooke: Definitely me. Had two months of it in Jan-Feb. Had another month of it in USA. And will have another month starting Dec :)
<popey> willcooke: I slept through it
<duflu> Actually to be fair, summer in Oz is longer than 3 months
<willcooke> :)
<popey> willcooke: lets move to oz
<willcooke> :D
<qengho> It's full of Australians!
<qengho> (Intentionally ambiguous tone on that.)
<pitti> seb128, Laney: huh, the systemd beast landed in y! so the infra is in place now, awesome
<Laney> scary!
<pitti> I'll still wait with gnome-session until Monday though
<pitti> first, because Friday and second because new systemd upstream version, let's keep the bugs apart :)
 * pitti cleans up the ppa
<seb128> pitti, wooot
<Sweet5hark1> heya all.
<Laney> attente: if there's a mir backend refresh needed for gtk 3.20.6, let's have it please
<Laney> hey Sweet5hark1!
<Sweet5hark1> seb128: so in the gnome-calculator app (which I happily copied), how are we planning to use gtk3?
<Sweet5hark1> s/gtk3/gtk3 themes/
<Sweet5hark1> Laney: heya!
<Laney> what's up homie
<Sweet5hark1> do we want to use the theme from the host env? or not? And if we do the former, how should that work?
<seb128> hey Sweet5hark1, good afternoon to you!
<seb128> Sweet5hark1, that's a tricky one
<Sweet5hark1> Because someone tried a (now well-contained) libreoffice with gtk3 on Ubuntu Mate and surprisingly the confined LibreOffice doesnt find any Ambient-MATE theme in the container ...
<Sweet5hark1> "surprisingly"
<seb128> right
<Laney> you need a theme corresponding to the gtk version
 * Laney kills self once again
<seb128> that's the issue
<seb128> can't use the host theme
<Sweet5hark1> ah so we bundle all gtk theme that ever were in the snap?
<seb128> because you snap might bundle gtk3.20
<seb128> but xenial is 3.18
<seb128> and gtk theme are not compatibles between versions
<seb128> the plan is rather to have the theme part of the platform snap (when we get those)
<seb128> but it means if libreoffice uses the unity platform it gets ambiance even on other desktops
<Laney> things can't plug in to the platform somehow?
<seb128> things using the gnome platform would get adwaita I guess
<seb128> Laney, define "platform"?
<Laney> platform snap (when we get those)
<seb128> I guess we were typing at the same time
<seb128> did I already reply to that or is the question slighly different?
<Laney> you say the theme will be fixed
<Laney> don't see why it has to be like that
<seb128> well they are part of the runtime
<seb128> where would you ship the theme?
<Laney> somewhere that the runtime's gtk will find it
<seb128> or would you have an extra "desktop look" snap?
<Sweet5hark1> seb128: k. I think, as there isnt an immediate solution, I ask him to file a bug, so we can discuss the details (and in the meantime its a known issue that we are working on) ...
<seb128> Sweet5hark1, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/snapd/+bug/1576300
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1576300 in snapd (Ubuntu) "Has no integration with system icon themes" [Undecided,New]
<Laney> same with things like gstreamer plugins, or fonts, or debug symbols
<seb128> Laney, well issue is that the defined theme is an user gsetting
<Sweet5hark1> seb128: ah, aweseme! thanks
<seb128> no
<seb128> fonts are compatible between desktops and os versions
<seb128> which makes thing easier
<Laney> they still plug in from snaps to the system
<seb128> debug symbols have one variant
<seb128> right
<seb128> but you can't plug to the system for theme
<Laney> why not
<seb128> running gedit 3.20 with gtk 3.20 bundled on xenial would give you the 3.18 css
<seb128> which doesn't work on gtk 3.20
<Laney> i don't see why this is impossible to handle
<seb128> unsure what you mean
<Laney> if i want debug symbols for a thing in a platform snap you solve it
<Laney> it's the same as the theme
<seb128> no
<Laney> yes
<seb128> there is only 1 set of debug symbols for 1 snap
<Laney> there is one place to put themes
<seb128> it's easy to map those
<seb128> but what ships the theme?
<seb128> the dbg can be generated from the snap so it's easy
<Laney> they are in the store
<seb128> but whose' job is it to ship the theme?
<Laney> a theme author
<seb128> that would work
<seb128> so it would be user connect to install/connect the right theme
<seb128> ?
<seb128> user job to*
<Laney> or it comes preinstalled, whatever
<seb128> well it can't really
<Laney> "i am a theme for ubuntu 16.04, gnome 3.18"
<Laney> then at install time it's installed in the right place for apps using this to get it
<seb128> it can't
<seb128> like I'm installing gedit 3.24 on my xenial under unity
<seb128> it fetches ambiance 3.24 and connect it
<seb128> all good
<seb128> then you come and log into your fluxbox session on my machine
<seb128> and start gedit
<seb128> what happens?
<seb128> or xubuntu session let's say
<seb128> they have their own theme
<Laney> what happens right now?
<Laney> on debs
<seb128> themes are part of the host
<seb128> host/desktop
<Laney> how do you get them?
<seb128> they come with the desktop
<Laney> because...
<seb128> but they only support the gtk version of that serie
<Laney> someone wrote the theme and shipped it
<seb128> right
<Laney> so....
<seb128> shrug
<seb128> unsure how to explain that better
<seb128> currently we know that host system and apps are on the same gkt version for ever
<seb128> it makes easy to ship the appropriate theme
<seb128> in the new world we would need to ship all the existing themes for all the existing gtk versions
<Laney> of course
<Laney> but the themes can express which platforms they work on
<seb128> yeah, but the issue is what I described before
<Laney> that's actually what we generally do not have with deb themes
<seb128> as an Unity user I install gedit 3.24 on xenial with ambiance 3.24
<seb128> what would you expect to happen if somebody logs into a xubuntu session and start gedit on the same box
<seb128> at which point is greybird 3.24 installed
<Laney> snappy knows which themes you want and installs those for new platforms if they are available
<seb128> expect it doesn't
<seb128> themes are by user preferences
<Laney> you asked what I expect to happen
<seb128> and snappy is a system level service
<seb128> and even if my scenario snappy is used once when I install gedit
<Laney> is greybird already installed in any snap?
<seb128> no
<Laney> then how on earth can you solve this?
<Laney> conjour out of thin air which themes you might want?
<seb128> well we are designing the system
<seb128> so for the purpose of the exerice the themes are snapped
<seb128> but still I install gedit 3.24 from snappy on unity
<seb128> it's smart and gives me ambiance 3.24
<seb128> now I apt-get install xubuntu without touching snappy
<Laney> only because that is the default theme
<seb128> that's where it gets tricky
<seb128> no
<seb128> well you could say because it's the desktop I use
<seb128> I'm on xubuntu xenial and install gedit 3.24
<seb128> the software UI grabs greybird 3.24 for me and connect it
<seb128> all good
<seb128> until my sister logs into her unity session
<seb128> and see she has gedit looking like xubuntu
<seb128> or installing gedit 3.24 could pull in all the world existing gtk 3.24 themes
<andyrock> seb128: i proposed (https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=769302) a fix for https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nautilus/+bug/1564375
<ubot5> Gnome bug 769302 in Desktop "Desktop margins do not scale on high-dpi setups." [Minor,New]
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1564375 in nautilus (Ubuntu) "Unity should take display scaling into account to avoid placement of desktop icons under launcher" [Medium,In progress]
<seb128> which is the only way I could see that to work
<ogra_> lol
<seb128> andyrock, great
<andyrock> do you want me to build a debian patch for Y?
<Laney> you're saying that all themes on the system have to be installed for all platforms
<Laney> so do that
<ogra_> here is your 3GB gedit download
<seb128> yeah that's the issue
<seb128> I don't see a clean/proper solution to that
<seb128> I think we are going to loose platform visual integration
<seb128> same as on windows
<seb128> apps are going to come with their upstream look
<seb128> which is going to be the same on any OS or desktop env
<seb128> they are going to have 1 theme bundled and enforced
 * ogra_ doesnt think we'll do, but i also think it is waaaay to early to bother about that beyod not having the visuals suck
<seb128> the other "easy" option is to have each desktop providing its platform
<andyrock> seb128: maybe you missed it... :) do you want me to build a debian patch for Y (and X)?
<seb128> so gedit 3.24 would connect to the GNOME platform if you are on gnome-shell and that includes adwaita
<Laney> it's hard because you constructed a mixed deb/snap world
<Laney> which implies some kind of bridge
<seb128> or to the UNity one unity that includes ambiance
<ogra_> you need a theme interface (provided either by your classic desktop or by a theme snap) that does the right bind mounts to the right places and bends the right env vars
<seb128> Laney, I didn't "construct" that world but I'm living in it, that's basically what we have on xenial today
<seb128> I'm not saying we can't design a better solution in all snap world
<Laney> as much as we constructed the problem :)
<ogra_> seb128, i dont think it matters if it is all-snap or not
<seb128> well connecting to the right theme is easy
<seb128> ensuring the right theme is installing is less
<ogra_> the snap shouldnt need to care who provides the slot it connects its plug to
<Laney> it matters because you have to get it installed
<ogra_> well, in an all-snap env you now have seed.yaml ...
<seb128> one way would be to have each theme having its snap
<ogra_> where you can list the default snaps installed in the image
<ogra_> right
<seb128> and having upstream supporting all versions of gtk
<ogra_> or have bundles
<seb128> and playing catchup
<Laney> those things are requirements
<Laney> you need snap for theme for platform version
<Laney> then some way to keep the right ones installed
<seb128> the issue is that they might not even exist
<seb128> greybird 3.24 might not be available at the time you snap gedit 3.24
<ogra_> thats what your seed yaml is for in all-snap ... and in classic your desktop can provide it dynamically
<Laney> that's correct
<Laney> the system would need to track it
<seb128> that's solvable but not easily :-/
<seb128> need more mechanism that for fonts or dbg
<ogra_> well, your interface backend can care
<seb128> the backend can only match things that are available
<ogra_> your snap only sees the slot to plug into
<ogra_> sure
<seb128> like as said at the time gedit 3.24 comes out we might not have an ambiance 3.24 compatible css
<ogra_> so you have i.e. a gtk-themes-green snap ... that ships a tool to select bright or dark or yellowish greens ...
<ogra_> the app only connects to the slot
<ogra_> your setup happens on the backend side of the interface
<ogra_> which is either in your classic desktop or comes with the theme snap
<ogra_> your app doesnt have to care
<seb128> right
<Laney> i should hope the apps don't care at all about the theme
<seb128> we "just" need to snap each theme and figure a way to autoinstall the right snaps depending on the available environments on your mahcine
<seb128> then to connect to the right slot
<seb128> though are snaps having a mount/instance by user?
<seb128> like if seb uses gedit on Unity and robert on xubuntu on the same machine and they need to connect to different slots?
<ogra_> we have a way
<ogra_> in the all-snap world there is the seed.yaml now ... thats in your image
<ogra_> and lists what snaps have to be preinstalled
<ogra_> in the non all-snap world we have a working mechanism already (debs)
<Sweet5hark1> woha. I got a _lot_ of bang for the buck out of seb128 and Laney with that one innocent question.
<seb128> lol
<Laney> can of worms!
<seb128> ogra_, the issue not that, the issue is that the snap/slot you want to connect to depends of the active session
 * Laney hits a button
<seb128> so 2 users logged in at the same time might need the same snap connected to different themes
<ogra_> seb128, ah, not sure our design takes sessions into account yet ... but i could imagine we can add it and have a session-theme-interface that takes this into account
<seb128> yeah
<ogra_> thats actually a jamie question :)
<seb128> in any case not going to work tomorrow
<seb128> one better bundles all the themes he/she cares about today
<ogra_> i doubt anyone expects this to work tomorrow :)
<Laney> then you don't know me AT ALL
<Laney> THIS IS UNACCEPTABLE
<ogra_> what i personally expect today is to have my snaps not look like win95
<Laney> pretty sure the raleigh theme is dead these days
<ogra_> what i expect tomorrow is definitely more
<Laney> so you get adwaita :)
<Laney> which is actually nice
<ogra_> but there is still so much changing that i dont thinnk we can nail it right now
 * Laney quivers
<attente> Laney: did you already upload? i think anpok still has some patches we could refresh with, but they're not upstream yet
<Laney> attente: yes, but we can followup
<Laney> get them committed ;-)
<seb128> seems like some people are looking a gtk on mir, duflu filed some bugs today
<attente> Laney: they probably will be committed, do you want to take them as-is anyways?
<seb128> nice to see work ongoing there :-)
<attente> it's these ones: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=768138
<ubot5> Gnome bug 768138 in Backend: Mir "Update the GDK-Mir backend to fix a few problems" [Normal,New]
<Laney> attente: up to you
<Laney> ideally I would prefer cherry-picks, but you da man
<Laney> seems like you still have some outstanding questions
<Laney> ruh roh
<Laney> gtk2 fails its arch-only build
 * Laney re-merges
<Laney> the cpu usage graph in gnome-system-monitor is mesmerising in "stacked area chart" mode
<seb128> hum, I wonder if that's the first Ubuntu cycle where I might not upgrade my main machine to the unstable serie
<ochosi> seb128: hah, that's comforting to hear :)
<seb128> :-)
<seb128> hey ochosi! how are you?
<ochosi> hey :) good good
<ochosi> now that my theme has been ported to SASS and is ready for gtk3.20 i sleep much better
<ochosi> it was a bit of work, but less than i anticipated
<ochosi> i read your funny conversation on snaps and themes just now
<ochosi> this will be fun
 * ochosi should use the word "fun" less often...
<ochosi> i agree with Laney though that applications shouldn't care about themes *at all*
<ochosi> also, you can install one gtk theme and use it for multiple gtk3 versions
<ochosi> at least that should work with gtk>=3.20
<ochosi> so you keep a gtk-3.0 and a gtk-3.20 in the theme folder and the correct one gets loaded by the application
<seb128> "fun" indeed :-)
<ochosi> this could simplify your problem a bit
<seb128> right
<seb128> the issue is if you download a random theme from internet and install to ~/.theme or whatever it's going to work fine for your deb based env
<seb128> but not for your snaps
<seb128> but not a lot we can do that
<ochosi> hm, why again?
<seb128> that->there
<ochosi> (sry if i didn't understand that part when reading the history)
<ochosi> is that a permission issue?
<seb128> no
<seb128> but let's say I'm on xenial and I download winxplike for gtk 3.18 and install that in ~/.themes and make it my unity theme
<seb128> then a few months later I install gedit 3.24 snap
<seb128> how would gedit look like winxplike
<seb128> the .themes is probably not going to be compatible with the bundled gtk from the snap
<seb128> and there is no way the system can know how to download a gtk3.24 version of that theme for you
<ochosi> well
<ochosi> that's sort of what i intended to say above
<ochosi> if you have a theme that works for gtk-3.18, gtk-3.20 etc it can ship all of that in the same tarball and you can have it installed in parallel
<ochosi> so ofc if a theme doesnt support gtk3.24 then you're in a mess, but that's *always* the same
<seb128> right
<ochosi> i agree it's less easy to install gedit3.20 on xenial now
<seb128> except that currently Ubuntu is a working set
<seb128> right
<ochosi> but that's the main difference
<seb128> Ubuntu doesn't provide currently a way to install a version of apps which isn't compatible with your theme
<seb128> so it's an issue we don't have
<ochosi> yeah, but if you maintain your theme properly it will be backward compatible and work with older gtk version snaps as well
<ochosi> you just have to always be in sync with adwaita
<ochosi> THAT CAN'T BE HARD
<ochosi> :D
<seb128> :-)
<seb128> until gtk4
<seb128> or whatever :p
<ochosi> :D
<ochosi> exactly
<ochosi> that's a problem of the snap concept itself
<ochosi> a distro release is a matching set.
<ochosi> a distro release with snaps is a rag rug.
<flexiondotorg> Laney, I've added the affected MATE packages to LP: #1593048
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1593048 in ubuntu-themes (Ubuntu) "ubuntu-themes should support GTK 3.20" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1593048
<seb128> right
<flexiondotorg> I just uploaded mate-themes-3.20.10-0ubuntu1 to yakkety.
<flexiondotorg> I'll prepare a new ubuntu-mate-artwork package on Monday/Tuesday next week.
<flexiondotorg> And you backlog on themes and snaps.
<flexiondotorg> Was the point of much discussion last week.
<Sweet5hark1> seb128: common just write a dbus service that autotranslates gtk themes between versions, so that the snapped app can ask for whatever it needs</sarc>
<seb128> :-)
<willcooke> chrrrooooooooome
<willcooke> where is my RAM
<willcooke> 4 tabs open 2 GB RAM used.
<flocculant> willcooke: get more RAM :p
 * willcooke waits for s_eb128 to say something about using firefox 
<willcooke> flocculant, :)
<willcooke> I've got 6GB, that should be plenty
<seb128> right you are
<flocculant> willcooke: and while you're there - do *you* know anything about the Turn Off Secure Boot installer option - or at least know who I could ask :)
 * flocculant has never seen that and is being asked stuffs ... 
<willcooke> I don't, but this is the sort of thing davmor2 usually knows about ^
<seb128> willcooke, I've firefox open with a bunch of tabs and it uses 300M
<seb128> just saying
<willcooke> heh
<flocculant> willcooke: that was what I was thinking - but he's away :D
<seb128> flocculant, what do you want to know?
<seb128> cyphermox can probably help you
<flocculant> aah yes - good call :)
<flocculant> I've just been asked what it actually does - I'm kind of assuming it does what it says
<seb128> I guess so
<flocculant> thanks all anyway :)
<seb128> yw
<flocculant> :)
<cyphermox> flocculant: that's largely it, it does what it says
<flocculant> cyphermox: okey doke - thanks :)
<cyphermox> disabling secure boot validation in shim -- which means that the shim signature (the MS signature, which gets checked by the BIOS directly) will still be verified, but nothing past that
<cyphermox> in other words, that's something that only affects Linux if you dual-boot, and you're not touching the rest of the BIOS at all -- but it will affect any distro that uses shim
<flocculant> cyphermox: thank you for some explanation - it's an installer option I've never seen
<cyphermox> yes, it's new in xenial.
<flocculant> I guessed as much :)
<flocculant> cyphermox: I guess given I do *most* testing with vm's not something I would see
<cyphermox> unless you used an EFI-enabled VM
<cyphermox> urgh, speaking of which I need to fix my golden vm
<flocculant> :)
<flocculant> cyphermox: anyway - thanks for the explantion of that - which I will promptly forget :p
<flocculant> weekend started early ;)
<cyphermox> ah, nice :)
<flocculant> :)
<Laney> flocculant: neat
<Laney> erm
<Laney> fle
<Laney> FLE TAB
<Laney> FLEEHTOEHSATOAEHTOAHTOAEHTOAEHS
<flocculant> Laney: you could try Wimpress instead - ochosi complained about nicks, just after infinity complained about nicks :D
 * flocculant is still flocculant 
<flocculant> \o/
<Laney> #neverchange
 * Wimpress is flexiondotorg
<flocculant> :)
<Laney> YOU
<Laney> CHANGE BACK
<Wimpress> It is a group nick, so I can change back.
<Wimpress> But flocculant and I have been getting some stick.
<Laney> what's a group nick?
<Wimpress> Freenode can have multiple nicks registered to one identity.
<flocculant> Laney: you can has many nicks
 * flocculant used to have a bunch
<Laney> that's the inverse of how it sounds
<flocculant> Laney could be Streety too
<Wimpress> https://freenode.net/kb/answer/registration
<seb128> having multiple personalities? ;-)
<flocculant> seb128: can be useful ...
<Laney> if only my IRC client tab comlpeted on freenode identifier
<flocculant> seb128: especially for Wimpress
<flocculant> though infinity won't be able to find him now though
 * ochosi is Wimpressed
<flocculant> oh my
<flocculant> new word \o/
<Laney> there's still a wi<tab> collision, by the way :-)
<Laney> two letters are not enough
<Laney> just ask cjohnston
<cyphermox> Laney: I guess now I could merge your style changes in ubiquity and upload?
<Wimpress> ochosi, Sadly my teachers at school were all very pleased with themselves when they were "Wimpressed" in my school reports ;-)
<Laney> cyphermox: did I version the dependency to 3.20?
<Laney> yes
<Laney> then I'm happy if you are
<cyphermox> yes
<Laney> looks like gtk2 -4 builds
 * Laney debdiffs and uploads that
<cyphermox> how far are we with the other packages?
<Laney> [||--------------]
<cyphermox> weeee
<cyphermox> and everything needs to land together?
<Laney> just some things
<cyphermox> k
<Laney> shit rain, brb, need to rescue clothes
<jbicha> arewegtk320yet
<cyphermox> meh
<cyphermox> I just want to avoid ubiquity sitting in proposed for too long
<seb128> did somebody test ubiquity with the new gtk?
<seb128> or from backlog I guess Laney did :-)
<Laney> indeed
<Laney> cyphermox: won't be *too* long, hopefully
<cyphermox> I implicitly trust Laney with css changes
<Laney> don't
<cyphermox> maybe that's my error :)
<Laney> yes
<cyphermox> it's not like it's likely to crash ubiquity though, it will just look like crap.
<Laney> if nothing else, you should be happy with it because I don't want to have to revisit the problem
<Laney> :)
<Laney> it looked hilarious before
<Laney> the progress bars went to their default size
<flocculant> cyphermox: I will let you know for sure if it all looks completely bizarre for me :p
<flocculant> I guess Laney might want to know as well
<Laney> someone should just test the thing
<Laney> and then fix it :-)
<flocculant> Laney: I guess I'll just say it looks fine then :p
<cyphermox> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubiquity/16.10.6
<Laney> youuuuu
<Laney> ok, there's gtk2
<Laney> theme time
<Laney> don't suppose anyone wants to review that one?
 * Laney giggles
<cyphermox> what?
<attente> is there a trick to pop up the grub 2 menu on the dell xps?
<seb128> attente, have shift press after the bios and keep it this way until grub?
<attente> seb128: tried that, but no luck
<attente> just boots into my bad kernel build
<Laney> turn it off while it's booting
<Laney> then next time you get grub
<Laney> the ghetto method
<seb128> I was going to suggest that but then people say I'm using hacks :p
<Laney> :D
<Laney> i love the seb128 hacks
<Laney> they get the job done
<seb128> :-)
<seb128> attente, you can try to grub-reboot <n>
<Laney> also, custom kernel is *such* an attente thing
<Laney> bet there was some bisecting involved
<attente> lol. ok, some combination of space/esc seemed to do it
<seb128> don't mock him, that's the path to greatness
<Laney> i might bisect on monday
<Laney> to find out what made unity-greeter break
<seb128> see :-)
<Laney> in this case you can't script it to work with git bisect run though
<Laney> that is the ultimate
<seb128> yeah, that's magic
<seb128> I know p_itti got some systemd regressions figured out like that, script it and let it do its work over the w.e
<seb128> come back a day later and have the commit
<seb128> talaaa
<seb128> k; enough snap debugging for this week
<seb128> calling a week there
<seb128> have a good w.e everyone!
<Laney> night!
<Laney> me too, time to go get rained on
<Laney> bbbbbbbbbyyyyyyeeeee
<willcooke_> ditto
<willcooke_> night all
<attente> need a new adwaita-icon-theme...
<anpok> Laney: attente: will create a new version today.. have to drop one of the changes since there would be a regression with the upcoming 0.24 (unless I can still sneak in fixes into that release)
<attente> i guess we also need to remove the 'adwaita-icon-theme (>= ${gnome:Version})' Depends on libgtk-3-common
<jbicha> attente: I think that depends is ok
<attente> jbicha: i'm concerned about the version, is someone going to package the 3.20 release of a-i-t?
<jbicha> attente: yes, it's in https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/+archive/ubuntu/gtk320 if you need it now
<attente> jbicha: ah, ok. but i guess we need 3.20.6 at least. but good to know that it'll be there at some point
<jbicha> no it doesn't have to be 3.20.6, 3.20 is fine
<attente> oh, really? ok, thanks!
#ubuntu-desktop 2016-07-30
<lucas_ai> How do I start my script or service when booting up?
<lucas_ai> Is there a way to get chrome/chromium to NOT download images? Just put a box there? That way pages will load really fast :)
#ubuntu-desktop 2016-07-31
<xnox> pitti, amazing!
#ubuntu-desktop 2017-07-24
<didrocks> good morning
<duflu> Morning didrocks
<duflu> Huh? The only working call to vaCreateSurfaces is the one where we pass the parameters in the wrong order (!?)... where working means status=0 but still corruption
<duflu> Oh... macro magic to rearrange parameters
<didrocks> hey duflu, good Monday? Sounds some wayland fights ;)
<duflu> didrocks, It is Monday at least. Yes, Wayland :)
<didrocks> heh :)
<duflu> \o/ Hardware decoding under Wayland to Clutter!
<duflu> (with many hacks that now need eliminating)
<duflu> didrocks, Yes it is now a good Monday :)
<duflu> How are you?
<didrocks> duflu: I'm good, thanks! What happened so that it became a good Monday? :p
<duflu> didrocks, I finally got hardware video decoding on Wayland fixed. Only took a week
<didrocks> oh, that will be a great enhancement :)
<andyrock> good morning!
<didrocks> hey andyrock, good week-end?
<duflu> Morning andyrock
<andyrock> hey didrocks
<andyrock> hey duflu
<andyrock> good enough
<andyrock> spend the we in Bologna with my brother
<didrocks> sounds great ;)
<seb128> good morning desktopers!
<seb128> hey andyrock duflu, re didrocks
<duflu> Hi seb128
<andyrock> hey seb128
<didrocks> re seb128
<Laney> what's up
<willcooke> morning all!
<willcooke> Doing a pretty good impression of winter here today
<seb128> hey Laney, willcooke, how is u.k today?
<seb128> more automn like here
<Laney> hey seb128
<Laney> yeah quite grey, wet and windy
<flexiondotorg> Morning seb128 Laney willcooke andyrock duflu
<duflu> Hi flexiondotorg
<seb128> hey flexiondotorg
<alexarnaud> good morning all :) !
<seb128> hey alexarnaud
<alexarnaud> seb128: how are you today?
<seb128> good! you?
<alexarnaud> seb128: good :)
<infinity> seb128: Who do I complain to that since rebooting from unity to gnome-shell, I can no longer disable my touchpad?
<didrocks> infinity: could be the -synaptics vs libinput transition?
<infinity> I don't think my driver changed.
<infinity> But the mouse/keyboard options sure did.
<seb128> infinity, uninstall synaptic if it's installed
<didrocks> bug #1686081
<ubot5> bug 1686081 in xorg (Ubuntu) "If -synaptics is installed, GNOME Mouse & Touchpad Settings doesn't work" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1686081
<infinity> Hrm.  Will try and report back.
<seb128> seems didrocks is on the case, /me goes back to what he was doing
<infinity> didrocks: You win.  How very unintuitive.
<infinity> didrocks: But thanks for saving me from going insane with accidental palm drags.
<didrocks> infinity: let's say "have experience with it" :-)
<didrocks> happy that it helped!
<willcooke> didrocks, do we have a "proper" solution to that, like can we forcibly remove synaptics or something?
<infinity> didrocks: I assume there's still ongoing work to make the default theme less... Fedora?
<infinity> (All the blue is rather jarringly unUbuntu)
<willcooke> infinity, yeah we do - got a hackfest kinda thing planned for end of August
<willcooke> infinity, I made a start. kinda.  http://imgur.com/a/NjUXa
<willcooke> few things to fix there ;)
<infinity> willcooke: Cool.  I think in the interim, only a few colours need changing to make it at least kinda look right (the +/- bars in the panel, and the default lock screen colour)
<didrocks> willcooke: there is a trello card for it: https://trello.com/c/9GI3EFh2/122-bug1686081-if-synaptics-is-installed-gnome-mouse-touchpad-settings-doesnt-work, discussed about it with seb128, not trivial, but really annoying
<infinity> willcooke: Oh, and maybe the top bar slightly less absolute black. :P
<willcooke> infinity, yeah totally agree.  Thats what I was trying to fix actually.  global search and replace was a bad idea it seems.  who knew?!
<infinity> (ie: same background as our gnome-terminal)
<willcooke> didrocks, thanks!
<didrocks> infinity: I guess we all are in favor of blackless top bar (at least, with our theme :p)
<seb128> willcooke, it's the same old "need to port u-c-c to libinput" that oem wants and we are talking about for some cycles
<infinity> didrocks: I actually like the default GNOME theme, I just don't want it identical to Fedora.  And we don't use true black anywhere, so that same "purplish almost-black" that we use in the terminal background would be appropriate.
<didrocks> infinity: could be, we'll experiment (and maybe provide 2 sessions: gnome upstream one with default themes et our own "ubuntu experience"), that's still to be discussed :)
<infinity> And, of course, something orangeish to replace the blue +/- bars.
<infinity> I'm going to miss menus in my window titlenbars.
<infinity> titlebars, too.
<didrocks> (same)
<infinity> As horrible hacks go, when it finally worked how I wanted it, it was niceish.
<didrocks> what have you changed?
<didrocks> just curious, could be useful feedbacks
<didrocks> any extensions/anything?
<infinity> Basically nothing.  Literally just logged into the fresh session a few hours ago.
<infinity> I assume it migrated over some generic settings from unity (ie: it's still got my wallpaper selection), but for the most part, it looks very Fedora.
<didrocks> apart from the launcher and some icon renames, nothing is ported, the keys were still the generic one
<didrocks> so nothing to port was the net benefit :)
<infinity> Right, I didn't mean to imply there was actual migration, just that it's obvious some stuff went unchanged, like who renders the root window (nautilus?)
<infinity> Oddly enough, that's sort of comforting.  Even when your whole workflow goes to crap, having the wallpaper consistent feels like not all is lost. :P
<didrocks> ahah :)
<didrocks> that familiar feelingâ¦
<infinity> didrocks: Anyhow, I won't be shy about providing some feedback as I find things that rub me the wrong way.
<willcooke> thanks infinity, all feedback gratefully received
<infinity> didrocks: First thing I noted (other than the synaptics bug) was that Super-L wasn't bound to lock screen anymore.  That must have been a Unity special.
<didrocks> I'm sure you won't be shy ;) and yeah, please feel free :)
<willcooke> haha!  Told you so seb128 & Laney ;D  ^
<infinity> didrocks: But given that binding also works in Windows, I found it a pleasant analog.
<didrocks> yeah, their default is the old ctrl+alt+l?
<infinity> *nod*
<infinity> I think both worked for me in Unity because I got Super+L from Unity and Ctrl-Alt-L from the gnome keyboard settings.
<infinity> On relog, of course, I only had the latter.
<infinity> And since they don't seem allow binding two things to one action, I now have the former. :P
<didrocks> yeah, I never left Ctrl+Alt+l, the other one was added to compiz as a secondary action
<infinity> I use a Windows desktop for gaming, and Super-L is the shortcut there, and I dig consistency.
<infinity> But also, it's the binding that makes more sense when Super is "they key to manage overall desktop stuff".
<didrocks> willcooke: can you add it to your special list of polish that we can discuss about?
<infinity> (Though, I guess maybe GNOME people still live in a pretend world where some people's keyboards were made prior to 1997?)
<infinity> Or Happy Hackers.
<didrocks> but worskpace changes are still Ctrl+Alt + something
<infinity> Yeah.  True.  But also no analog there on other OSes, which may be why I care less. ;)
<didrocks> I remeber we had the plan for super + anything on unity, we only did half of it though
<didrocks> ;)
<willcooke> didrocks, I'll create a trello card to track
<didrocks> great ;)
<seb128> I think we should have both keybindings to lock working
<infinity> ^
<infinity> I'd agree with that.
<seb128> if we pick one we are going to piss half of the users either way
<infinity> Is there a way under the hood to make GNOME take two bindings?
<infinity> The UI sure won't let you.
<seb128> I don't think so
<seb128> which is the issue
<infinity> Ick.
<seb128> we might need to hack and special case ctrl-alt-L or something
<infinity> I guess you could just add a second binding "Alternate Desktop Lock".
<willcooke> I think I found an old patch to move the gsetting to an array
<infinity> Which calls the same thing.
<seb128> or that
<seb128> willcooke, right, that's more work/incompatible changes though
<didrocks> willcooke: the issue isn't doing it, it's more about exposing it with minimal changes in g-c-c
<willcooke> ack
<infinity> I mean, I think it would be stellar to allow an array for ANY binding, but a second binding would be a reasonable hack for this one small regression.
<infinity> And simple.
<didrocks> yeah, but as seb128 told, it means we need to change all gesttings keys from string to list of array
<didrocks> and patch every apps which are using them
<infinity> Right, that's a mess.
<infinity> Hence the other thing.
<didrocks> doesn't seem minimal, not going to work in the snap world sharing the same keys from other code
<didrocks> yeah
<seb128> but yeah, having "lock screen" and "alternative lock screen" lines wouldn't be the end of hte world
<didrocks> I guess making that one special is fine as well
<seb128> the other way would be to special case one in the shell
<seb128> which is what we did in unity it looks like
<seb128> and we never got a complain about it
<infinity> Special casing one makes it effectively invisible to the user.
<infinity> But fair play, since that's how it was before too. :P
<seb128> right
<seb128> and you could say that the documented one is the one in the settings
<infinity> (Though it did show up in the Unity help screen, I think, so only "invisible" fromthe POV of the keyboard bindings screen)
<seb128> and the other one is the compat one of people who are too used to the old keybinding
<infinity> seb128: I think one of my favourite things about having a Unity7 and Windows7 (now Win10) desktop side-by-side was that all the important bindings were effectively identical.
<infinity> Super+Num to pick from the launcher, Super+L to lock, etc.
<infinity> I suspect that wasn't an accident.
<infinity> Really, the only noticeable difference between them is that one of them can play more video games, and WINDOWS UPDATE IS STILL A FLAMING HEAP OF OH GOD HOW HAVE THEY NOT IMPROVED THIS IN TWENTY YEARS ARGH.
<infinity> Otherwise, they're hard to tell apart.
<infinity> (Seriously, the next time you're hating on the performance of dpkg and apt, go update a fresh Windows installation and get some perspective)
<infinity> Oh nice, Firefox seems to have survived the transition.  It only shows me a menu bar when I press Alt, like the upstream builds do.
<infinity> (PS: I took your survery, please don't switch the default browser, kthx)
<seb128> infinity, we wouldn't have to deal with builds on weird archs if chromium was our default :p
<infinity> I'm pretty sure I've had to fix Chromium on armhf in the past.
<seb128> right, armhf is something we need to deal with
<seb128> ppc64el or s390x not so much
<infinity> If we get no commitment from IBM on those, we'll drop them.
<infinity> I don't object to dropping things with zero upstream support, I object to the knee-jerk "it didn't build, so let's not look into it and discuss dropping it".
<infinity> Since there have been many times in the past when it was a simple 1-liner.
<infinity> Well, s390x is already dropped, so that's a red herring people keep bringing up.
<seb128> it's not "it didn't build", it's "firefox is outdated for most of the cycle and our unstable users have a version with security issues"
<infinity> But I'll talk to the POWER guys about ppc64el.
<seb128> and that has been the case for at least 3 cycles now
<seb128> it's not a one time thing
<seb128> it has been pretty much a permanent situation since xenial
<infinity> It's not a 1-time thing, but it's also different arches each time.
<ricotz> jfyi, current failures of firefox 55 https://launchpad.net/%7Emozillateam/+archive/ubuntu/firefox-next/+sourcepub/8091927/+listing-archive-extra
<seb128> so arm64 in addition of what artful currently has
<infinity> In xenial, it's currently armhf and ppc64el.  In trusty, it's arm64 and ppc64el.  Which is curious.
<ricotz> ff 56 for comparsion https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-mozilla-daily/+archive/ubuntu/ppa/+sourcepub/8099928/+listing-archive-extra
<infinity> Given identical upstream codebases, if armhf fails on one series and arm64 on another, it might be our bug, not upstream's.
<ricotz> (arm64 is happy there)
<ricotz> (some failures are rust related)
<seb128> 56 is missing cargo on ppc64el
<ricotz> seb128, I know, I hacked some packages myself
<ricotz> I think chrisccoulson is onto updating those officially
<ricotz> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/cargo/+bug/1701556
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1701556 in rustc (Ubuntu) "Backport rustc 1.17 and cargo 0.18 to 14.04/16.04 and 17.04" [Undecided,New]
<infinity> didrocks: So, plugins.  Is there anything (you know of) that will restore my ability to see several timezones in my clock applet?
 * infinity decides that maybe trying to sleep is smarter than worrying about what timezone he's in.
<infinity> Oh, I like the virtual desktop upper bound just being "one more than you're using" instead of a static number.
<seb128> infinity, you can add locations from gnome-clocks and they should be listed
<seb128> (we currently don't pre-install gnome-clocks though)
<jbicha> good morning
<seb128> hey jbicha
<infinity> seb128: Ahh.  I was going to say "That's not a command I have". :P
<infinity> seb128: Hrm.  I have them in gnome-clocks, but that doesn't change the applet drop-down in any meaningful way.
<jbicha> I proposed a gjs SRU â¦ which resulted in this email: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-release/2017-July/004163.html
<infinity> jbicha: Robie's very much a letter of the law guy.  Which isn't the worst thing ever (I'd rather that than the opposite), but yeah, probably means we need more law for him to follow.
<infinity> jbicha: FTR, if he'd passed on it, you could have poked me directly.
<seb128> infinity, right, it isn't working for me either but jbicha said that was supposed to do that iirc, I didn't have time to debug/have a look yet
<jbicha> the current status is that Robie added the GNOME microrelease exception to the SRU wiki page
<infinity> GNOME's always had an MRE, literally since we first had SRUs.
<infinity> But we may have undocumented it when we went to the new blanket statements.
<infinity> Oops.
<jbicha> yes, it was removed from the wiki but it's back now
<jbicha> so assuming there are no objections, it should be a bit smoother for GNOME SRUs now :)
<seb128> infinity, in fact it works today for me, maybe it needed a session restart after installing gnome-clocks or something... it's listed in the popup you get when clicking on the date in the top panel
<infinity> seb128: Ahh, lemme log out, I guess.
<infinity> seb128: Well, one bug down, one new one discovered.
<infinity> seb128: Seems on a fresh boot, Ctrl-Alt-T gives me terminals in a snappy and quick timeframe.  When I log out and back in (WTF?), Ctrl-Alt-T has a delay of some 10-20 seconds.
<infinity> seb128: Thought this was a 1-time weirdness last time I did a log out dance, but it just reproduced this time too.
<seb128> dunno about this one
<infinity> seb128: Have you seen that, or am I special/insane?
<infinity> I guess I'm special.
<seb128> I didn't see it
<infinity> seb128: Must be something long-running between sessions, but I kinda assumed logins would be under a systemd user session and the cgroup blown away on logout (maybe I'm wrong there)
<infinity> In fact, all keyboard shortcuts have that massive delay.  Lock screen was the same.
<infinity> Weeeeeird.
<infinity> I wonder if it's some conflict between the two gsd-keyboard sessions running.  Though, they should both be running on a fresh boot/login too.
<jbicha> if there was a cgroup that was killed on logout, maybe we wouldn't have had LP: #1610944
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1610944 in gnome-session (Ubuntu Zesty) "GNOME Online Accounts breaks if you log out (until you reboot)" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1610944
<jbicha> upstream has a different workaround as of last week but not in artful yet https://bugzilla.gnome.org/764029
<ubot5> Gnome bug 764029 in general "goa-daemon (and most other D-Bus services) not stopped when the user session goes away" [Critical,New]
<infinity> jbicha: Ahh, hrm.  Well, that is probably related to the bug I'm seeing now.
<jbicha> is one of the gsd-keyboard's from gdm3? because that would make sense since gdm3 itself runs a minimal gnome-shell session
<infinity> I find it strange that the distro that foisted systemd on us isn't using it correctly.
<infinity> jbicha: Yeah, one's gdm, and one's me.  Like I said, I'm sure they're always both running, so that's a red herring.
<infinity> jbicha: But clearly, some state is breaking on log out/in.
<jbicha> that GOA bug was a release blocker for much of Fedora 26's release cycle
<infinity> jbicha: And it's odd breakage, since I'd expect shortcut keys to either work or not work, rather than working after a 15s delay. :P
<ogra_> just add a splash screen :P
<infinity> A nice modal dialog that says "GNOME has detected you used a keybinding shortcut, we'll process your request and act on it shortly..."
<ogra_> :)
<infinity> Oh well, for now I'll reboot.  That one will surely drive me batty in short order and I'll file a bug and/or debug it myself.
<infinity> But yes, it would almost certainly "just go away" if we used a proper user session.
<infinity> Murdering all the things is a simple fix for so many bugs.
<jbicha> willcooke: wow https://imgur.com/a/NjUXa is very orange
<willcooke> jbicha, ha!  I got a bit carried away
<ogra_> we'll just ship sunglasses along with the isos
<willcooke> lol
<seb128> Laney, https://trello.com/c/9kiXF8rW/134-systemd-user-session-for-gnome-shell ... do we have no systemd user session at all in GNOME atm? how did it start under unity/would it be difficult to do the same for the GNOME session?
<seb128> I don't remember the details
<Laney> seb128: Exec=/usr/lib/gnome-session/run-systemd-session unity-session.target
<seb128> so we "just" need an equivalent target under GNOME I guess?
<Laney> dunno
<Laney> that would be the first thing to try
<Laney> I'm not sure if there would be issues or not
<seb128> do we feel like we need that for 17.10?
<seb128> I wonder if we have things that got made systemd user jobs that are not going to work anymore without that
<Laney> that was all downstream stuff, so I doubt it
<seb128> hum, k
<seb128> going to keep investigating why file sharing over bluetooth is not working then
<seb128> it looked like it could be due to that but maybe not
<seb128> thanks Laney
<Laney> there could be issues like things not being killed when you log out
<seb128> Laney, fedora has http://pkgs.fedoraproject.org/cgit/rpms/bluez.git/tree/0001-Allow-using-obexd-without-systemd-in-the-user-sessio.patch
<seb128> Laney, I don't think logout is the issue there, I think bluez just expect the user session to be there
<seb128> I guess we could use the fedora workaround
 * seb128 tries that
<Laney> seb128: that SystemdService specified unit doesn't exist
<Laney> Failed to introspect object / of service org.bluez.obex: Unit dbus-org.bluez.obex.service not found.
<Laney> https://paste.ubuntu.com/25162502/
 * mancman3 waves @ the good non ms winshit users
<seb128> Laney, you are right
<Laney> seb128: bluetooth.service has Alias=dbus-org.bluez.service
<seb128> Laney, typo you think?
<Laney> maybe?
<Laney> not sure what it's supposed to be
<Laney> but maybe it's a missing alias on obex.service?
<Laney> no, that is there
<Laney> I think the obex package should enable the unit (or create that symlink)
<seb128> hum, ctrl-R at the wrong place
<seb128> Laney, I'm a bit confused now, isn't it simply the SystemdService being wrong as your sed-ed earlier?
<seb128> or is that not enough?
<Laney> seb128: the value it had should work because obex.service has an alias for it
<Laney> but it doesn't because the unit isn't enabled by the package
<Laney> you can fix it by making a symlink
<seb128> Laney, thanks
<seb128> ricotz, hey, did you get any reply from meson upstream about the armhf issue?
<ricotz> seb128, no, I guess since doko proposed the other arm fixes, he pretty sure knows how to fix the remaining ones
<seb128> ricotz, did you ask him about it?
<ricotz> seb128, no
<seb128> ricotz, could you? ;-)
<ricotz> seb128, you are afraid? ;)
<seb128> no but you are the one that asked for that version to be synced and you seem to understand the issue
<seb128> Laney, sorry but I'm going to bother you again about that systemd thing, the right way to enable it would be to create a symlink to the service in a <service-used-by-default>.wants?
<seb128> Laney, is there a standard "service-used-by-default" we use for such cases? I tried to look for examples and failed to find some
<seb128> well https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=764678 has sockets.target.want but it's for a socket unit
<ubot5> Debian bug 764678 in debhelper "dh-systemd: Please support systemd user services" [Wishlist,Open]
<seb128> didrocks, ^ or maybe you know?
<Laney> seb128: just in /usr/lib/systemd/user/
<didrocks> depends, user services or system service?
<seb128> didrocks, systemd --user
<didrocks> system services should use dh_systemd to enable it, indeed
<Laney> it doesn't need to be in wants of anything
<didrocks> ah
<seb128> how do you call that?
<Laney> this is dbus activation
<didrocks> I don't know if dh_systemd has the support for it, I would say no
<seb128> didrocks, cf the bug I just mentioned
<seb128> it doesn't
<seb128> that's why I'm asking about the symlink ;-)
<ricotz> seb128, regarding meson, basically https://paste.debian.net/plain/977929
<didrocks> seb128: symlink is fine, it's basically what dh_systemd does (+ service start/restart) if you are in the systemd case
<seb128> ricotz, can you send that upstream? (and maybe a debdiff to Debian or us for packaging)
<didrocks> it doesn't use systemctl enable, because of systemd bootstrapping issue
<didrocks> (like, when you get to your first release with systemd, but it's not installed yet, so you don't have systemctl, and so onâ¦)
<seb128> hum
<seb128> I'm getting confused
<didrocks> if it's an user service, a symlink to the corresponding .wants to enable it is enough
<seb128> Laney, there is a obex.service already in that dir but you said the issue is that it's not enabled and would need a symlink?
<Laney> yes
<Laney> but not to wants
<seb128> to where?
<didrocks> ah, I see, Laney says it's dbus activated
<seb128> right
<Laney> the value specified in alias=
<Laney> that's what systemctl --user enable foo would do
<Laney> you have to do that manually, that's what didrocks is saying
<seb128> why do we need an alias at all here?
<seb128> things seems more complicated that they should be
<Laney> because the dbus service file is asking for that unit to be started
<seb128> why don't we just the dbus service start the right unit?
<didrocks> (I'm having the same, probably stupid question than seb)
<Laney> they expect the unit to be enabled
<Laney> that is a fair expectation
<seb128> what unit?
<didrocks> there are multiple provider?
<didrocks> (hence the alias?)
<Laney> don't know
<Laney> but it is fair enough for something to rely on a unit being enabled
<seb128> I guess I don't understand why we need an alias
<seb128> rather than having 1 unit
<seb128> and the dbus activation used that 1 unit
<seb128> using
<Laney> no idea, it wasn't any of us that developed this
<Laney> I'm telling you how to make it work with how it is set up now
<seb128> k, so you are not suggesting the design is better
<didrocks> Laney: where is dbus activation file btw which reference that alias? (just curious)
<seb128> just hitting on what to do with what upstream is providing?
<Laney> /usr/share/dbus-1/services/org.bluez.obex.service
<seb128> Laney, gotcha, sorry for being slow to get it
<Laney> I have no idea if that design is optimal or not
<seb128> Laney, thanks again!
<Laney> presumably there is a reason they did it this way
<Laney> np!
<didrocks> maybe they want a non version alias where maybe there will be versioned one
<ricotz> seb128, https://paste.debian.net/plain/977932
<didrocks> or multiple prociders
<didrocks> providers*
<seb128> jbicha, do you think you could get that patch from Rico in debian ^?
<seb128> didrocks, it's a bit difficult to get proper context on bluez bugs, they don't have proper bug tracking&such
<didrocks> do you know how this dbus activation is working, as there is no service, it seems as you get the bug it doesn't fallback to Exec=
<didrocks> correct?
<Laney> that's right
<ricotz> seb128, jbicha, note this an attempt
<didrocks> ok, so there is no point in keeping the Exec= as soon as you have SystemdService=
<didrocks> oh, or maybe dbus is smart enough to say "no systemd running, I'm ignoring SystemdService and only using Exec="
<Laney> yep
<seb128> didrocks, http://pkgs.fedoraproject.org/cgit/rpms/bluez.git/tree/0001-Allow-using-obexd-without-systemd-in-the-user-sessio.patch suggests it does
<didrocks> interesting, didn't follow those user sessions changes
<seb128> (the comment/description)
<Laney> it's for if you don't have systemd --user
<didrocks> yeah, making sense
<Laney> yeah you can see that the old file in that patch was buggy in that case
<didrocks> oh ok, so yeah, disabling it unconditionnally ofc is wrong
<didrocks> thanks for the quick tech catchup Laney, seb128 ;)
<seb128> thanks didrocks Laney ;-)
<Laney> #ubuntu-desktop Tech Talks
<didrocks> :-)
<Laney> /m/me needs a tech talk
<Laney> ffs
<Laney> and better wifi
<didrocks> not a better keyboard? :)
<Laney> or mosh or something
<didrocks> heh
<Laney> trying to work with GMainContext, threads and such
<Laney> it's confusing
<didrocks> another threading bug your are fighting against?
<Laney> same
<didrocks> argh, good luck :(
<Laney> sendto(3<socket:[2178330]>, "GET /v2/system-info HTTP/1.1\r\nHost: \r\nConnection: keep-alive\r\nUser-Agent: snapd-glib/1.16\r\n\r\n", 93, MSG_NOSIGNAL, NULL, 0) = 93
<Laney> poll([{fd=3<socket:[2178330]>, events=POLLIN}, {fd=6<anon_inode:[eventfd]>, events=POLLIN}], 2, -1
<Laney> why does that poll block?
<Laney> there should be shit coming back from snapd
<didrocks> I guess you can't mock easily the daemon-side of the API because there are other exchanges first?
<Laney> nah
<Laney> I made a minimal version that does the same thing
<Laney> works ofc
<didrocks> so, snapd doesn't answer?
<didrocks> or sounds like it doesn't
<jbicha> seb128: the Debian maintainer of meson == meson upstream maintainer
<Laney> pretty sure it does
<didrocks> hum
<Laney> but for some reason I don't get it
<seb128> jbicha, but he refuses to get fixes in Debian?
<Laney> it's all GSocket and stuff at the application level of course
 * Laney shrugs
<Laney> back in a min
<seb128> jbicha, the issue is that the meson updates are blocked in artful-proposed due to armhf autopkgtest issues, I asked rico if he could ping upstream about it and he came with that patch but I don't think he upstreamed it
<jbicha> seb128: I don't think he's really refusing, it's just the patches need to be proposed and maybe pushed a bit
<ricotz> seb128, https://github.com/mesonbuild/meson/pull/2110
<seb128> ricotz, thanks
<seb128> jbicha, seems ricotz did upstream it now, so unping
<jbicha> :)
<ricotz> as said I haven't/can't confirmed that it actually fixes it
<seb128> it's fine
<seb128> now that it's upstreamed maybe Jussi looks at it
<jbicha> ricotz: if you push it to a PPA, I can run an autopkgtest on it to test the fix
<jbicha> because autopkgtests can be run from a PPA but it needs to be run by someone with upload rights
<ricotz> jbicha, ok, should appear here https://launchpad.net/~ricotz/+archive/ubuntu/staging/+packages?field.name_filter=&field.status_filter=published&field.series_filter=artful
<ricotz> seb128, that reminds me, what happened with poppler?
<seb128> ricotz, I said I would wait for libreoffice to migrate to not makie it part of another transition
<ricotz> seb128, ok
<seb128> ricotz, or libreoffice is having failing autopkgtests now so it's not migrating (maybe it's also blocked by other things)
<jbicha> should we ignore the LO autopkgtests on i386 too (and maybe s390x?)?
<ricotz> jbicha, interesting so it would be possible to autopkgtests on libreoffice of ppa:libreoffice/libreoffice-prereleases ?
<seb128> jbicha, why?
<ricotz> java-stack kernel bug ;)
<jbicha> seb128: for the same reason we ignored build tests on i386 :(
<jbicha> ricotz: yes but neither you nor Sweetshark had upload rightsâ¦
<seb128> jbicha, is the failure due to the i386/kernel/java segfault?
<ricotz> jbicha, ok
<seb128> jbicha, s390x is green after my retry from earlier
<seb128> not on -l10n though
<seb128> but yeah, +1 to skip on i386
<seb128> who can do that? L_aney?
<jbicha> oh, now LO is stuck because of python-defaults
<seb128> bah
<ricotz> jbicha, the meson package is built
<jbicha> ricotz: autopkgtest succeeds on amd64 and armhf, only 2 arches I tried
<jbicha> https://objectstorage.prodstack4-5.canonical.com/v1/AUTH_77e2ada1e7a84929a74ba3b87153c0ac/autopkgtest-artful-ricotz-staging/artful/armhf/m/meson/20170724_155058_dbc59@/log.gz
<jbicha> https://objectstorage.prodstack4-5.canonical.com/v1/AUTH_77e2ada1e7a84929a74ba3b87153c0ac/autopkgtest-artful-ricotz-staging/artful/amd64/m/meson/20170724_154005_dbc59@/log.gz
<jbicha> we can push that update to artful but I'd prefer to wait for Jussi's review since I don't think it's very urgent
<ricotz> jbicha, ok
<ricotz> jbicha, it got merged
<jbicha> yes, could you ask him whether he'll do a Debian upload for it or if we should just upload to Ubuntu directly if we want the fix sooner?
<Laney> /run-snapctl/basic: OK
<Laney> laney@raleigh (masterâ1|â3)> echo $?                                                                                                                       ~/dev/canonical/upstream/random/snapd-glib
<Laney> 0
 * Laney dies
<Laney> the testsuite's mock was relying on the library using main contexts in a particular way that I had changed
<ricotz> jbicha, since you are in the meson channel you can read the response
<ricotz> seb128, jbicha, so basically if you want meson to be fixed asap, just push my package
<ricotz> jbicha, could you run the autopkgtest for this amd64 build https://launchpad.net/~libreoffice/+archive/ubuntu/libreoffice-prereleases/+build/13139327 ?
<jbicha> done
<jbicha> to find the results for the earlier test you can visit
<jbicha> https://objectstorage.prodstack4-5.canonical.com/v1/AUTH_77e2ada1e7a84929a74ba3b87153c0ac/autopkgtest-artful-ricotz-staging
<jbicha> look for the <name> field with the log you want to see, like
<jbicha> artful/armhf/m/meson/20170724_155058_dbc59@/log.gz
<jbicha> then add that to the end of the original URL
<jbicha> https://objectstorage.prodstack4-5.canonical.com/v1/AUTH_77e2ada1e7a84929a74ba3b87153c0ac/autopkgtest-artful-ricotz-staging/artful/armhf/m/meson/20170724_155058_dbc59@/log.gz
<jbicha> it won't be live until the test finishes, but I believe the URL should be
<jbicha> https://objectstorage.prodstack4-5.canonical.com/v1/AUTH_77e2ada1e7a84929a74ba3b87153c0ac/autopkgtest-artful-libreoffice-prereleases
<ricotz> jbicha, thanks!
<jbicha> https://objectstorage.prodstack4-5.canonical.com/v1/AUTH_77e2ada1e7a84929a74ba3b87153c0ac/autopkgtest-artful-libreoffice-libreoffice-prereleases
<jbicha> better URL ^
<jbicha> ok, trying again with all-proposed because of the python3 transition fun
<jbicha> my 2nd try probably will fail too, it was my 3rd try that used all-proposed
<ricotz> jbicha, http://autopkgtest.ubuntu.com/running#pkg-libreoffice
<willcooke> night all
#ubuntu-desktop 2017-07-25
<didrocks> good morning
<andyrock> good morning
<didrocks> hey andyrock
<duflu> Morning didrocks, andyrock
<andyrock> hey didrocks duflu
<duflu> didrocks, andyrock: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yUbQDywgOOg
<duflu> All the rocks
<didrocks> hey duflu!
<didrocks> unavailable video here
<duflu> Boo
<duflu> didrocks, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oFLyU9g50yk
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<seb128> hey andyrock duflu didrocks
<duflu> Hey seb128
<seb128> how is everyone today?
<andyrock> :D
<andyrock> hey seb128
<andyrock> I slept on a bus but ready to start :D
<duflu> Not bad
<duflu> andyrock, was it a moving bus or stationary?
<flexiondotorg> Morning Desktopers
<andyrock> moving, I travelled during the night back to home
<didrocks> re seb128, morning flexiondotorg
<andyrock> *back home
<seb128> hey flexiondotorg
<duflu> Morning flexiondotorg
<seb128> andyrock, you let Trevinho behind?
<andyrock> few days ago
<seb128> I hope your hackfest week was nice
<andyrock> I spent the we with my brother in Bologna and monday too
<andyrock> eating tortellini :D
<andyrock> we need to organize a sprint there (in Marco's country house)
<seb128> :-)
<duflu> Different Marco?
<andyrock> Marco = Trevinho
<amano> @duflu: Thanks for diving so deep in the gstreamer sinks ;)
<didrocks> speaking of sinks, am I the only one having multiple pulseaudio out sinks?
<didrocks> (like some of your local server)
<duflu> amano, No problem it was fruitful in the end. I'm now trying to make it less of a hack
<alexarnaud> Hello all :) !
<didrocks> sounds like g-s-d or something is always setting the last detected one as default for media keys
<didrocks> and it's annoying :p
<didrocks> (I didn't get that on the unity session)
<didrocks> hey alexarnaud
<alexarnaud> hey didrocks, how are you ?
<didrocks> really good, thanks! yourself?
<amano> Since VDPAU doesn't seem to be supported on wayland at all nouveau and nvidia will have to go the vaapi route as well.
<alexarnaud> didrocks: very good also :).
<flexiondotorg> alexarnaud o/
<duflu> amano, anything not directly supported by Intel engineers is likely to not work any time soon. And Intel only focuses on VAAPI
<amano> There should be some Samsung patches to make nouveau work with vaapi. This was covered on phoronix last year or even 2015.
<amano> http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=Nouveau-NVC0-Git-VA
<amano> Probably worth a look as well?
<andyrock> bt headphones now work properly in X
<andyrock> \o/
<duflu> andyrock, which distro? Generally I only hear comments if something is broken
<andyrock> I had several problems with xenial
<andyrock> few weeks ago, I stopped using them because of that
<duflu> andyrock, yes the pulseaudio update on 2017-06-30 improved things. But I think artful is much better
<amano> @duflu: https://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/mesa-dev/2015-December/103327.html
<andyrock> duflu: I guess I'll wait for 18.04 :D
<duflu> amano, thanks but I have no desire/time to look at nouveau. In my experience it's generally been too buggy. We almost gave up on it during Mir development
<duflu> Although most of that could be solved by implementing thread safety
<duflu> And X11 + Wayland probably work around that issue, somewhat unwittingly
<duflu> So maybe nouveau will be closer to perfect under Wayland like it was in X11, but not Mir
<willcooke> morning all
<Laney> guten tag
<didrocks> hey willcooke, morning Laney
<duflu> Morgen Laney, willcooke
<Laney> hey didrocks & duflu
<Laney> you good?
<seb128> hey willcooke Laney, how is u.k today?
<Laney> hey seb128
<Laney> pretty grey
 * Laney has a jumper on!
<Laney> how's nl?
<duflu> Wait, amano which sink work were you referring to?
<seb128> quite rainy
<seb128> though we have a bit of sun now
<seb128> and a bit cold as well
<amano> Your gstreamer patch prototypes. Scary stuff ;)
<amano> Tnx for that, duflu
<amano> clutterautovideosink and glimagesink?
<duflu> amano, right, yes
<duflu> Oddly enough, I only seem to have fixed vaapipostproc. If you disable VPP then the same old bugs exist (but nobody does disable it usually)
<amano> Probably a PITA to debug that
<duflu> amano, Not has difficult that problem, in theory. Because at least that code path is starting with some distorted/broken image on screen. The code path I fixed never had an image on screen before
<duflu> -has +as
<ricotz> hey desktopers
<ricotz> if a package was in main before does this mean it is easier to get into main again? this is regarding the libreoffice dependencies: orcus and lpsolve
<seb128> hey ricotz
<seb128> ricotz, yes
<seb128> things which were in main don't need a MIR
<ricotz> seb128, hi, ok
<rbasak> I seem to have lost suspend on lid close when charging. Though if I subsequently unplug it still doesn't suspend. Nothing in my Power settings. Is this expected?
<rbasak> (on Artful)
<Laney> rbasak: Check systemd inhibitors (systemd-inhibit), or see if it's gotten disabled (gnome-tweak-tool).
<Laney> It's supposed to work
<rbasak> Laney: which part is supposed to work? Is suspend supposed to be inhibited while mains power is available?
<Laney> No
<rbasak> Or are you saying that unplugging should cause an immediate suspend?
<Laney> No
<rbasak> (when lid closed)
<rbasak> I see. I'll experiment, thanks!
<Laney> Closing your lid should suspend
 * Laney preps to upload gnome-software 3.25
<Laney> probably going to block it in proposed for a little while to test it out
<Laney> debdiff gnome-software_3.25.3-1_amd64.deb gnome-software_3.25.4-1_amd64.deb
<Laney> Files in first .deb but not in second
<Laney> [ EVERYTHING ]
<Laney> -------------------------------------
<Laney> -rwxr-xr-x  root/root   /usr/bin/gnome-software
<Laney> might have messed something up /o\
<Laney> oh yeah
<Laney> I deleted the dh_install call Â¬_Â¬
<didrocks> thin package!
<Laney> slimming the ISO
<Laney> laney@artful> debdiff gnome-software_3.25.3-1_amd64.deb gnome-software_3.25.4-1test1_amd64.deb                                       ~/dev/debian/packaging/pkg-gnome/desktop/experimental/build-area
<Laney> File lists identical (after any substitutions)
<Laney> that's better
<didrocks> missed opportunity :p
<Laney> we could replace it with a shell script
<Laney> echo "use apt"
<Laney> *cough*
<Laney> echo "use snap"
<didrocks> ;)
<kenvandine> didrocks, have you ever snapped an app that uses gjs?
<didrocks> kenvandine: hum, never, only nodejs, but not gjs, anything special is needed? (I think you don't have a runtime nearby)
<kenvandine> gjs provides a GjsPrivate typelib
<kenvandine> I spent some time trying to append to GI_TYPELIB_PATH, but it looked like the launcher is eating it
<kenvandine> it was friday, so the details are now fuzzy :)
<didrocks> hehe, probably :)
<kenvandine> i am about to get back to it
<didrocks> I don't think the launcher has anything GI-related
<kenvandine> it doesn't
<didrocks> the launcher is ran prior your wrapper, correct?
<kenvandine> i think so
<didrocks> so I think your process should have GI_TYPELIB_PATH
<kenvandine> it does, but doesn't include my change
<didrocks> then, the other question is if it's working or you need another var :p
<kenvandine> i need to dig into it again, it's all fuzzy now :)
<kenvandine> just looking to see if anyone has tried this before
<seb128> kenvandine, try flexiondotorg
<seb128> otherwise probably not
<kenvandine> flexiondotorg, ^^ ever snapped an app that uses gjs?
<flexiondotorg> kenvandine Sadly not :(
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> good times :)
<flexiondotorg> When do layout land in snapd again? ;-)
<flexiondotorg> The solution to all problems, apparently.
<seb128> what is layout?
<flexiondotorg> The ability to bind mount arbitrary paths on the host file system.
<flexiondotorg> Gross over simplification.
<flexiondotorg> zyg_a is working on it I believe.
<seb128> k
<didrocks> any place it's defined in detail? like the forum?
<flexiondotorg> didrocks It was discuss at the London Snap sprint and I believe photos of whiteboard plans were posted in the forum.
<didrocks> I didn't find it on the forum
 * flexiondotorg goes looking...
<didrocks> yeah, but a simple photo doesn't really summarize the discussion without context
<flexiondotorg> didrocks precursor task discussion here https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/using-snap-update-ns-from-snap-confine-to-initialize-mount-namespaces/1266
<didrocks> flexiondotorg: ah, thanks :) the like of feature-name "layout" in the title made it heard to search for
<willcooke> desktoppers running Artful - can you see if you can create a wifi hotspot via network manager?  I can't get it to connect, tells me the password is wrong every time
<willcooke> oh, connected now at least (poor choice of font type in that box I think)
<willcooke> but yeah, the whole hotspot thing seems broken
<seb128> willcooke, what did you change?
<willcooke> it was a "capital eye" not a "lower case ell"
<willcooke> need to make that display in mono-space I think.
<seb128> ah
<willcooke> cyphermox, do you know... what's the impact of installing dnsmasq alongside networkd? Specifically, without dnsmasq the hotspot feature in network manager doesn't "work" (no ip address on the client)
<willcooke> or better still, can networkd be made to do this instead?
<jbicha> willcooke: btw, gnome-control-center 3.25.4 has a new Wi-Fi panel, you can try it out in the GNOME3 Staging PPA
<seb128> willcooke, https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2016-December/039564.html
<seb128> jbicha, that shouldn't change much to the situation if the issue is on the n-m side
<jbicha> yes
<seb128> yes it should change the situation? or not change it?
<seb128> I hope the new panel doesn't regress on features
<jbicha> it looks like it has all the features to me, but maybe a bit better designed?
<seb128> I didn't see the new ones, just discussions on #control-center
<seb128> willcooke, would be useful to have a bug with your journal log in any case
<willcooke> seb128, ack
<willcooke> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/network-manager/+bug/1678606
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1678606 in network-manager (Ubuntu) "[packaging] Missing dnsmasq-tools dependency causes wifi hotspot/network sharing feature broken" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<willcooke> Will tag on to that one
<seb128> you get the same error in your log?
<willcooke> need to read the logs
<seb128> willcooke, just open a bug using ubuntu-bug
<seb128> on network-manager
<seb128> that should include the logs
<willcooke> seb128, oki, I'll need to uninstall dnsmasq etc
<seb128> willcooke, I'm going to try on artful in a bit, I'm dual booting and currently in xenial
<seb128> I let you know how it works for me
<jbicha> yes, I can confirm both issues, missing dnsmasq and it would be nice if the password was in a mono font
<willcooke> jbicha, thx.  I'm trying to find out where that window's layout is in nm-applet, but getting nowhere... any clues? Should be easy enough to patch
<jbicha> willcooke: I don't think it's in nm-applet but in gnome-control-center
<jbicha> panels/network
<willcooke> ahhh
<willcooke> of course
<willcooke> durr
<willcooke> network-wifi.ui
<didrocks> killing g-s-d hardly was maybe a little bit too muchâ¦
<seb128> jbicha, do you plan to report those upstream maybe since you can confirm? ;-)
<cyphermox> willcooke: networkd can't do it, but there is no impact to having dnsmasq installed
<cyphermox> (well, dnsmasq-base)
<cyphermox> NM by itself won't do anything with it aside from connection sharing (if you so choose) unless the option to use it as a caching nameserver is enabled (it's not supposed to be now)
<willcooke> cyphermox, ack, thanks
<willcooke> seb128, jbicha  - I was trawling u/s bugzilla, didnt find a good match yet.  I can log upstream if required
<seb128> cyphermox, willcooke, we should make n-m recommends dnsmasq-base then?
<cyphermox> it's already supposed to
<cyphermox> *sigh*
<seb128> cyphermox, it was removed in http://launchpadlibrarian.net/279417634/network-manager_1.2.2-0ubuntu6_1.2.2-0ubuntu7.diff.gz
<cyphermox> well, it should have had it
<seb128> pitti did that when he switched to resolved
<cyphermox> yeah, that was wrong
<cyphermox> but it's not something you'd just "know", it's an obscure feature
<cyphermox> that said, it should probably be a Recommends, not a Depends
<seb128> right
<seb128> Recommends seems right
<cyphermox> we want it to ship by default, I think, but not force it to be installed if NM is
<pitti> why do you want NM to set up dnsmasq again? having two resolvers only seems to make things more complicated again?
<cyphermox> pitti: we don't
<pitti> (or use dnsmasq only)
<cyphermox> dnsmasq-base is also used for connection sharing to provide DHCP
<pitti> ah, I see
<cyphermox> that's why I said the removal change was wrong, but it's not something you could have known
<seb128> hey pitti :-) how are you? sorry for the ping, should have used a _
<pitti> indeed, sorry about that
<cyphermox> no worries
<pitti> seb128: okay-ish; apparently I caught a virus from my nephew last weekend, but it's not too bad
<pitti> how are you?
<seb128> :-(
<seb128> I'm good thanks!
<seb128> though weather is looking like automn this week
<pitti> heh yes, here too; the summer took a break
<didrocks> seb128: can you try under looking in G-S: Shell.util_translate_time_string (N_("%B %e %Y"));
<didrocks> what does this give you?
<seb128> where do I type that?
<didrocks> alt+f2
<didrocks> lg
<seb128> didrocks, r(0) = %-e %B %Y
<didrocks> ok, that's my bug then
<didrocks> I still get %B %e %Y
<didrocks> that's why the date is weird for me
<didrocks> thanks for testing! Nowâ¦ whyâ¦
<seb128> I tested on the daily iso and it's fine as well
<didrocks> I probably have something locale puzzling the shell thusâ¦
<didrocks> oh, can you just try N_("%B %e %Y") as well?
<seb128> didrocks, gettext -d gnome-shell "%B %e %Y"
<seb128> ?
<didrocks> %-e %B %Y :/
<seb128> fun
<didrocks>  don't understand why there is N_() and this call
<seb128> do you have an extension messing up things?
<didrocks> no extension
<seb128> does it do it with another user on the same system?
<didrocks> good question, let me try
<didrocks> indeed, a new user is fine
<didrocks> so, N_("%B %e %Y") is returning you the translated string format?
<didrocks> or is it Shell.util_translate_time_string() doing the work?
<didrocks> rom the gettext request, I would expect my N_() returning %-e %B %Y
<seb128> you said that gnome-calendar had the same issue for you?
<seb128> so I would say it doesn't have to do with shell
<didrocks> yep, from memory
<didrocks> same, hence the N_() check
 * didrocks looks again where this format is in gnome-calendar
<didrocks> indeed, when creating new event, I have "juillet 25" for instance
<seb128> gtk30 domain has those format string iirc
<didrocks> and so, N_("%B %e %Y") returns you the correct format in the shell? which isn't the case for me despite gettext -dâ¦
<seb128> Shell.util_translate_time_string (N_("%B %e %Y")); ?
<seb128> or ?
<didrocks> just N_("%B %e %Y")
<seb128> %B %e %Y
<didrocks> ok, I'm even more puzzled, shouldn't that be gettext?
<seb128> I don't know how that lg debug mode is working
<seb128> and if the correct translation domain is set
<seb128> or bindtextdomain or equivalents
<seb128> oh
<seb128> it's meeting time!
<didrocks> ah, could be that the Shell.(â¦) wrapper set it
<didrocks> yeah :)
<seb128> didrocks, let's continue that on a side channel or after the meeting
<didrocks> well, no, it's not, I can't read the date :p
<didrocks> yep ;)
<jbicha> o/
<seb128> #startmeeting Desktop team 2017-07-25
<meetingology> Meeting started Tue Jul 25 15:31:54 2017 UTC.  The chair is seb128. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/0T55ivzN/ubuntu-desktop-17-10-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop team 2017-07-25 Meeting | Current topic:
<seb128> Roll call: andyrock, dgadomski, didrocks, duflu (out), jbicha, jamesh (out), jibel, heber (out), kenvandine, laney, oSoMoN, seb128, tkamppeter, trevinho, robert_ancell (out)
<seb128> hope everybody is doing fine!
<Laney> seb128 is in the hot seat
<andyrock> hey hey
<seb128> Laney, indeed!
<kenvandine> o/
<seb128> ok, let's get started
<seb128> #topic andyrock
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/0T55ivzN/ubuntu-desktop-17-10-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop team 2017-07-25 Meeting | Current topic: andyrock
<seb128> andyrock, hey
<andyrock> Unity:
<andyrock> # Debugged the favorite icons migration problem with unity7 (solution not easy to implement)
<andyrock> # Reviewing Trevinho's code
<andyrock> Livepatch:
<andyrock> # Successfuly added code in the root daemon to send Server Side Events
<andyrock> # First implementation of user daemon to listen to SSEs and display notifications
<andyrock> eod
<andyrock> *w
<seb128> thanks andyrock
<seb128> #topic dgadomski
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/0T55ivzN/ubuntu-desktop-17-10-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop team 2017-07-25 Meeting | Current topic: dgadomski
<seb128> dgadomski, hey
<dgadomski> hey
<dgadomski> * discussed the way to fix bug #1699179 with the landscape team, working on implementation
<dgadomski> * debugging smbd for bug #1701073
<dgadomski> * made some progress but still working on autopkgtests for bug #1700827, tested all binaries from that package for segfaults etc.
<dgadomski> * tested binaries for bug #1704130
<ubot5> bug 1699179 in landscape-client (Ubuntu) "PackageReporter kicks in during do-release-upgrade" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1699179
<ubot5> bug 1701073 in samba (Ubuntu) "CVE-2017-2619 regression breaks symlinks to directories" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1701073
<ubot5> bug 1700827 in pcp (Ubuntu) "[MIR] pcp package" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1700827
<ubot5> bug 1704130 in papi (Ubuntu) "[MIR] papi" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1704130
<dgadomski> eof
<seb128> thanks dgadomski
<seb128> #topic didrocks
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/0T55ivzN/ubuntu-desktop-17-10-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop team 2017-07-25 Meeting | Current topic: didrocks
<seb128> didrocks, hey
<didrocks> * reviewed/discussed gdm transition with Laney
<didrocks> * started to look at the "sound above 100%" issue with local patches working here. gnome-settings-daemon, using ubuntu-settings schema and gnome-control-center UI tweak. Some patch is needed in GNOME Shell as well, but implemented right now as a hackish extension. Will get a less impactful and hacky patch in G-S before uploading (restricting this to the ubuntu* sessions)
<didrocks> * started to read some G-S extensions code and API to prepare London sprint
<didrocks> * some AA work (NEW reviews for Mate components)
<didrocks> * zeitgeist & indicator-application demotion via rhythmbox plugins, and other services. We have now mostly demoted everything we can but libunity, libappindicator (pulling dee). However, no daemon is installed.
<didrocks> * snap theming discussions with snapd upstreams to present issues and what should be done. Worked with seb listing more themes to be included by default in both desktop cloud part and GNOME platform snap. Did some build and size metrics report. However, the extra size and build time has been decided as being too much for this.
<didrocks> * fixes: amazon double icon via workaround and gnome-software unthemed (not the ubuntu one) icon debugged & fixed.
<didrocks> * 5 years old very simple patch in GNOME for evince rebased (after recent comment) and reposted, after some dust removal ofc! :)
<didrocks> .
<seb128> thanks didrocks!
<didrocks> yw ;)
<seb128> #topic duflu
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/0T55ivzN/ubuntu-desktop-17-10-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop team 2017-07-25 Meeting | Current topic: duflu
<seb128> * Video acceleration:
<seb128>   - Continued going deep in gstreamer-vaapi to fix totem+Wayland: https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1701463
<seb128>     . I decided to get ambitious and solve it properly (fix the corruption and performance simultaneously) by addressing a longstanding bug: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=740753
<seb128>     . Good news: Working proof of concept as of yesterday!
<seb128>     . Good news: Smooth and fast (and not corrupted) video in Gstreamer/totem under Wayland!
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1701463 in gstreamer-vaapi (Ubuntu) "gst-vaapi+Wayland = rendering corruption in totem (but not in gst-play-1.0)" [High,In progress]
<seb128>     . Bad news: It requires some hacks that will take more time to eliminate.
<ubot5> Gnome bug 740753 in gstreamer-vaapi "vaapisink: add support for EGL" [Enhancement,New]
<seb128>     . I will continue to try to resolve these issues but so far upstream is silent, not commenting.
<seb128>     . If I don't (or do?) make more progress on cleaning up my solution I might still PPA it regardless.
<seb128>   - In other news, an Intel engineer has proposed VA-API support to Chromium this week: https://chromium-review.googlesource.com/c/532294/
<seb128> * Noteworthy bug count deltas this week:
<seb128>   - gnome-shell (Ubuntu): 414 (May) -> 236 (July)
<seb128> * Daily bug management across gnome-shell, ubuntu-themes, bluez, pulseaudio and mir.
<seb128>   - Time consuming, but it keeps us on top of the user-facing issues.
<seb128> #topic jbicha
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/0T55ivzN/ubuntu-desktop-17-10-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop team 2017-07-25 Meeting | Current topic: jbicha
<seb128> jbicha, hey
<jbicha> â¢ Released new version of gnome-tweak-tool, renamed as Tweaks
<jbicha> â¢ Updated gtk3 to 3.22.17 and some other updates for artful
<jbicha> â¢ Packaged mozjs52 for artful new queueâ¦but gjs 3.25.4 isn't working right with it yet, some linking issue
<jbicha> â¢ Packaged tracker2 for GNOME3 Staging PPA
<jbicha> â¢ If you enable the PPA, you can also run gnome-control-center-alt to see the redesign that might land for 3.26
<jbicha> eof
<seb128> thanks jbicha
<seb128> jbicha, is that redesign likely to be complete this cycle or not?
<jbicha> uh, probably
<seb128> or asked differently, could that be risky for the LTS and something we should investigate more before deciding?
<jbicha> I'm disappointed that they still set gnome-control-center-alt to not be installed in last week's dev snapshot (overriden in PPA)
<jbicha> yes, it should be investigated more, not many eyes have looked at it yet, although it's been a WIP for a while
<seb128> k
<seb128> we should probably add that to the backlog
<jbicha> I don't think it's particularly risky for LTS, just a different layout mostly
<seb128> k
<jbicha> big benefit is g-c-c is resizable now
<seb128> thanks jbicha
<seb128> I'm going to give that a try and let you know how it works for me
<seb128> k, let's keep moving
<seb128> #topic jamesh
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/0T55ivzN/ubuntu-desktop-17-10-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop team 2017-07-25 Meeting | Current topic: jamesh
<seb128> * I posted a list of snapd/snapcraft issues that are important to the
<seb128> desktop on the Snapcraft forum
<seb128> (https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/ubuntu-desktop-team-priorities/1397/3),
<seb128> and have followed up on a few of them as people have replied.
<seb128> * For the snapd polkit auth issue, I updated my pull request based on
<seb128> review comments from chipaca.  Still not sure if they'll accept it or
<seb128> not though.
<seb128> * I wrote a patch for NetworkManager to allow toggle connectivity
<seb128> checking via D-Bus API, which will make it possible for the privacy
<seb128> control panel to disable the checks without needing to
<seb128> install/uninstall packages.  I've submitted the patches upstream in
<seb128> their bug tracker and mailing list.  When it is accepted, we can
<seb128> backport it into our packages.
<seb128> #topic heber
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/0T55ivzN/ubuntu-desktop-17-10-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop team 2017-07-25 Meeting | Current topic: heber
<seb128> heber, hey, around or should I paste the update you sent via email?
<seb128> seems I should copy it
<seb128> * Jenkins jobs for post install/upgrade have been tested. There are some improvements to do in order to get consistent results and avoid random failures, timeouts, etc.
<seb128> * Some progress on running tests on HW, I need to fix autologin in setup and make testflinger collect the artifacts.
<seb128> * Fix test Test Default Session Type which fails on Xenial.
<seb128> #topic kenvandine
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/0T55ivzN/ubuntu-desktop-17-10-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop team 2017-07-25 Meeting | Current topic: kenvandine
<seb128> kenvandine, hey
<kenvandine> * Promoted gnome-dictionary, gnome-calculator, quadrapassel, gnome-clocks, and gnome-sudoku to the stable channel.
<kenvandine> * GUADEC planning, arranged a BoF for gjs/mozjs with the upstream maintainer.
<kenvandine> * Discussing the GNOME Sharing framework with upstream, hoping to help make the solution handle content exchange for snaps
<kenvandine> * More backports to the gnome-3-24 PPA to build snaps
<kenvandine> * Worked on more snaps, gnome-maps and gnome-photos are still in process
<kenvandine> eof
<seb128> thanks kenvandine
<seb128> #topic Laney
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/0T55ivzN/ubuntu-desktop-17-10-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop team 2017-07-25 Meeting | Current topic: Laney
<seb128> Laney, hey
<Laney> yo
<Laney> â¢ Spent some time looking at the snapd-glib "hang" problem. Learned a lot about GMainContext, libraries and threads - have written a patch which passes the testsuite in snapd-glib; now need to test it in gnome-software, after...
<Laney> â¢ Nagged about a gnome-software release, got one put out, just uploaded it to experimental
<Laney> â¢ Rebased the wip/ubuntu-master branch; package merge in progress - to be uploaded today. That's gnome-software with no custom apt backend, using PK. I'll block it in proposed and we can test it for a few days.
<Laney> â¢ Just been doing a bit of el rapido debugging of a tracker build failure raised in #debian-gnome
<Laney> â¢ glib 2.53.4
<Laney> â¢ autopkgtest: linux breaking things again; run manually, file bug, blacklist - kernel team came back with a proposed fix (disabling the test...) which I'm currently doing a test run of
<Laney> â¢ last couple of gst 1.12.2 uploads
<Laney> ð¬
<seb128> thanks Laney
<seb128> #topic seb128
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/0T55ivzN/ubuntu-desktop-17-10-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop team 2017-07-25 Meeting | Current topic: seb128
<seb128> done
<seb128> â¢ tested artful daily, reported some GNOME bugs upstream (shell, gdm, software, g-c-c)
<seb128> â¢ investigated some translations issues
<seb128> â¢ debugged bluetooth/obex not working
<seb128> â¢ discussed some desktop issues (gnome-software/snap plugin hanging, .desktop migrations)
<seb128> â¢ sponsoring the new libreoffice version from Olivier
<seb128> â¢ worked with Didier on changes to the snap desktop launcher to include more themes
<seb128> â¢ synced meson for Rico and then nagged about armhf issues
<seb128> â¢ updated d-feet
<seb128> â¢ set up langpack job for artful weekly updates
<seb128> #topic tkamppeter
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/0T55ivzN/ubuntu-desktop-17-10-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop team 2017-07-25 Meeting | Current topic: tkamppeter
<seb128> tkamppeter, hey
<tkamppeter> - cups-filters: Testing of cups-browsed, especially load-balanced clustering, shutdown of remote servers, spotted some remaining crashes and fixed them, especially one which is probably the one generating all the error reports of users (will observe the error reports to see whether 1.15.0 will not appear there). Received a patch for another hang-on-cups-browsed-shutdown cause. Allow suppression of clustering via cups-browsed.conf option. R
<tkamppeter> eleased 1.15.0 with all the improvements and fixes of the last weeks.
<tkamppeter> - Google Summer of Code 2017: Student project coordination and mentoring. Filled evaluations for the second month of the two students I am the principal mentor of. All students doing good progress.
<tkamppeter> - Bugs.
<seb128> thanks tkamppeter
<seb128> #topic Trevinho
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/0T55ivzN/ubuntu-desktop-17-10-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop team 2017-07-25 Meeting | Current topic: Trevinho
<seb128> Trevinho, hey
<seb128> oh, he's out today but he looks like he didn't send his weekly update
<seb128> #topic robert_ancell
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/0T55ivzN/ubuntu-desktop-17-10-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop team 2017-07-25 Meeting | Current topic: robert_ancell
<seb128> - Working on moving gnome-software / snapd-glib SRUs.
<seb128> - Working on making Editor's Pick / Featured sections in GNOME Software display snaps better.
<seb128> - Chasing down default snap icon not working in 16.04.
<seb128> - Preparing next gnome-software SRUs.
<seb128> - Had a look into BuildStream.
<seb128> #topic aob
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/0T55ivzN/ubuntu-desktop-17-10-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop team 2017-07-25 Meeting | Current topic: aob
<seb128> any other topic?
<jbicha> no irc meeting next week for guadec?
<seb128> unsure, up to willcooke
<seb128> it's only a subset of the team going
<jbicha> ok, nothing else from me :)
<seb128> thanks for pointing it out though
<seb128> ok, it's a wrap then
<seb128> thanks everyone
<didrocks> thanks!
<seb128> #endmeeting
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/0T55ivzN/ubuntu-desktop-17-10-cycle |  Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help
<meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Jul 25 15:56:05 2017 UTC.
<meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2017/ubuntu-desktop.2017-07-25-15.31.moin.txt
<seb128> Laney, jbicha, cyphermox, opinion on https://code.launchpad.net/~seb128/ubiquity/new-gsd-binaries/+merge/327611 ?
<seb128> didrocks, ^ you as well
<Laney> seb128: looks good to me
<seb128> Laney, thanks :-)
<Laney> sry for forgetting to respond
<didrocks> answered on the MP
<seb128> no worry, thanks for having a look now
<seb128> didrocks, thanks as well!
<didrocks> yw ;)
 * didrocks noticed from the description that it's Laney who wrote the bug report :p
<Laney> on that one?
<didrocks> Laney: no, on bug #1688395 "favourites" :)
<ubot5> bug 1688395 in webbrowser-app (Ubuntu) "Remove Oxide, webbrowser-app and the Unity webapps" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1688395
<Laney> oho
<Laney> I do that on purpose
<didrocks> claiming your origins! :)
<Laney> sometimes even when copying from other places I will change the spelling
<didrocks> ahah
<didrocks> I don't think it worthes chasing this date thingâ¦ or just wait for a cleanswap of my install I will do soonâ¦
<didrocks> can't really spot anything easily
<Laney> didrocks: on that one, I don't think I checked if there were reverse dependencies yet ...
 * Laney thought when filing it that the assigned person was going to work on it
<Laney> :)
<didrocks> I'll try to poke x_nox as well before diving into it :p
<didrocks> we'll see
<Laney> <3
<Trevinho> seb128: sorry.... Damned me, I added reminder and I didn't send it. :-(
<Trevinho> Anyway... Some more woke in the x SRU and lowgfx fixes. It looks all green now. Waiting andyrock to test it for the hitting the publish button.
<willcooke> http://i.imgur.com/fTq8bGp.png
<willcooke> seb128, jbicha  ^
<andyrock> Trevinho: ops I forgot to test
<andyrock> I'll do it tomorrow morning
<andyrock> In the meanwhile...  https://usercontent.irccloud-cdn.com/file/UE9Hdiar/out-3.ogv
<andyrock> seb128 willcooke ^^^
<andyrock> I just need to change the text for the notification and then it's done
<willcooke> andyrock, neat!
<willcooke> andyrock, and does it show the notifications when something gets patched too?
<andyrock> not yeat, but it's a couple of lines of code to add the support
<willcooke> andyrock, woot!  nice work!
<andyrock> basically I'm using http signals between the two servers
<andyrock> *daemons
<andyrock> so we can signal for whatever we want
<andyrock> I talked with livepatch devs and they agreed using server side events
<andyrock> I guess I can "demo" it tomorrow
<willcooke> andyrock, awesome
<Laney> nighty night homies
<willcooke> l8r Laney
<willcooke> jbicha, when you get a sec, what do you think about this patch: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-control-center/+bug/1706421
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1706421 in gnome-control-center (Ubuntu) "Wifi hotspot password is hard to read" [Medium,Confirmed]
<willcooke> not sure if I've done it correctly
<ricotz> afaics there are some desktop-packages which need a python-nochange-rebuild: eog-plugins, gedit, gedit-plugins
<jbicha> willcooke_: do you have the time to file a GNOME bug for that?
<willcooke_> jbicha, https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=785413
<ubot5> Gnome bug 785413 in Network "WiFi-Hotspot password is hard to read with some fonts" [Normal,New]
<jbicha> thanks
<kenvandine> #!/home/ken/work/desktop/gnome/snaps/platforms/gnome-maps/parts/gnome-maps/install/usr/bin/gjs
<kenvandine> well that isn't desirable
<willcooke_> night all
#ubuntu-desktop 2017-07-26
<metalbiker> hey guys, i'm trying to decide how to file a bug for ubuntu 17.10 and i can't think of the proper way to classify this. when i check mark an option in a window for downloading a file, the "do this automatically for files like this for now on," a black 'shadows' appears quickly but disappears quickly when i do that. it's the same shape as the window and it's purely graphical.
<duflu> metalbiker, does the shadow surround the window?
<duflu> metalbiker, regardless, please just run "ubuntu-bug gnome-shell" and follow the prompts
<metalbiker> duflu: it does surround the window but only very briefly.
<metalbiker> and i'll just classify it the way you suggested.
<duflu> metalbiker, don't worry about getting the classification wrong. Any bug against gnome-shell will get noticed and updated. Otherwise log bugs against just project 'Ubuntu' and they will /hopefully/ also get reclassified
<metalbiker> duflu: ok, thank you for that information. that relieves a bunch of worry from my part because i want to be of as much help with this shakedown as possible.
<metalbiker> duflu: one more question. is it necessary to download the new daily build every day, create a new startup USB flashdrive and reinstall everything again or will everything get updated/upgraded when the daily build ISO is posted on cdimage.ubuntu.com?
<sarnold> you can probably just apt-get update && apt-get -u dist-upgrade whenever convenient for you
<sarnold> unless you want to test the installer, of couse :D
<metalbiker> sarnold: ok, cool! that saves me a bunch of time and doing everything all over again. as  you can probably tell, i'm really new at doing this daily build testing. but i wanted to jump in with both feet and get more experience with it. for myself and for my LoCo team.
<sarnold> metalbiker: excellent :) thanks!
<duflu> metalbiker, it's actually easier than that. Any Ubuntu install with an internet connection will update itself automatically
<metalbiker> sarnold: you're welcome!
<duflu> Only if you're setting up a new machine would you find using a fresh ISO faster
<metalbiker> duflu: yeah, i knew that, too, but I just wanted to make sure with this daily build testing. I've never done this before and it's exciting to be helping now.
<duflu> metalbiker, cool. Yes it is easy and you raise a good question. But the latest code comes in automatic updates, same as is on the latest ISO but smaller pieces
<metalbiker> duflu: i understand that completely. and cool, so all i've got to do is wait for the software updater to do its thing when it checks for updates and install any updates, just like i've been doing for 10 years, lol.
 * duflu wonders if it's time we uncapitalized ISO
<metalbiker> duflu: cool! after today i'll feel like i've spent a few years in college with just this small bit, but very important, knowledge and experience. lol
<metalbiker> duflu: i think we should just make it lowercase. save a keystroke! lol just like saving trees, save the keystrokes, man! lol
<duflu> I mean to be more precise, we're talking about a file format and not the original International Organization for Standardization (ISO)
<duflu> But "iso9660" is a bit awkward
<metalbiker> oh yeah, i agree. i was just trying to figure out what else it could mean and i totally forgot about iso standards. jeez, you think with my extensive background in manufacturing and college degree i'd know that. aye aye aye.
<metalbiker> yeah, usually capitalized letters is for proper names like that, in abbreviated form. just like USA and UK, and on and on.
<metalbiker> ok, i'm out for the night. thank you for the awesome feedback! you helped an undereducated veteran of Ubuntu. lol
<metalbiker> oh, i've got one more question for the night. there was a survey put out for our requested apps/snaps for 18.04LTS and I wanted to ask where should I send my answers to. It was posted on hackernews, reddit and somewhere else and i want to give my input for that.
<metalbiker> but i think it was an original post on ubuntu.com as well.
<sarnold> there was a google forms to go along with it..
<sarnold> https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLScOZggYro5S5okO8yhoGI5h2ucicBZPGGLYGOI6dINA1WSTzQ/viewform
<metalbiker> oh, ok. cool! i'll copy and paste that into firefox. thanks!
<sarnold> https://twitter.com/dustinkirkland/status/888419181103808515
<metalbiker> yeah, that's who did it.
<jamesh> Got in principle support for my network-manager connectivity patch
<didrocks> good morning
 * didrocks curses people not using the bzr branch
 * duflu feels guilty but has no idea what didrocks is referring to
<didrocks> not you :)
<seb128> oh, forgot to say hi here!
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<seb128> hey duflu, how are you? having a good day so far?
<didrocks> bug #1706524 is ready for review for those motivated (easy one ;))
<ubot5> bug 1706524 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu) "Enable switch option to set volume above 100% from media keys and gnome shell UI" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1706524
<didrocks> re seb128 :)
<seb128> re didrocks
<duflu> Morning seb128, yeah it's not bad. How goes it?
<duflu> Also, morning didrocks
<didrocks> hey hey duflu ;)
<seb128> good :-)
<didrocks> seb128: can you try super "nautilus" enter?
<didrocks> it doesn't do anything for me (clicking or enter)
<didrocks> using the dash icon works though
<seb128> didrocks, it opens nautilus for me
<seb128> or it did on first try
<seb128> now it does nothing
<didrocks> I don't remember if I opened it once already in that session TBH
<didrocks> but ok, there is something fishy at leastâ¦
<seb128> indeed
<didrocks> the dash icon works 100% of the time for me though
<didrocks> shouldn't it be the same .desktop file?
<seb128> confirmed on a new session
<seb128> it works on first try only
<didrocks> so
<didrocks> I moved this icon to the dash
<didrocks> it's another one
<didrocks> and it matches a running app
<didrocks> that's why, for the shell, that app/.desktop file is running
<didrocks> favorite-apps=[â¦, 'org.gnome.Nautilus.desktop',â¦'org.gnome.Nautilus.desktop']
<didrocks> same desktop file :/
<didrocks> but I have been able to add it twice
<didrocks> wth?
<didrocks> however
<didrocks> right-click -> details
<didrocks> it's nautilus.desktop
<didrocks> for the running one
<didrocks> so, what's saved in the favorite doesn't match what the shell think the icon is
<didrocks> why does org.gnome.Nautilus.desktop has OnlyShowIn=Unity?
<seb128> it's another of those compat entries iirc
<duflu> didrocks, Upstream Gnome don't like having desktop icons. Also nautilus-desktop is an X11 app that runs under Xwayland. I think they want to kill it off
<seb128> didrocks, http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/nautilus/ubuntu/view/head:/debian/rules#L44
<didrocks> duflu: yeah, but it doesn't explain why there is a huge mismatch between what's GNOME shell is storing and what it thinks is running
<didrocks> duflu: at least, it should be nautilus.desktop in both place
<duflu> Bugs! Yep, Gnome Shell is buggy
<duflu> But it's also nice, and is fixable
<didrocks> seb128: hum, ok, I wonder if the difference in behavior is due to DBusActivatable=true
<didrocks> and so, ask for dbus, already running as the desktop renderer, done
<didrocks> (doesn't explain the other bug on the wrong .desktop file matching, but let's focus on this first)
<didrocks> also, not respecting OnlyShowIn :p
<seb128> yeah
<seb128> could be
<didrocks> could have been
<didrocks> but no :p
 * didrocks tried to restart G-S after commenting it
<didrocks> no success
<didrocks> but yeah, there are 3 bugs: nautilus matched as different thing, GNOME Shell doesn't seem to respect OnlyShowIn for that use case and nautilus showing desktop is matched as a running app
<duflu> koza: Anything fun to talk about today?
<seb128> didrocks, it works without nautilus.desktop
<seb128> every time
<didrocks> I went the other way, NoDisplay=true on org.Nautilusâ¦ doesn't work
<didrocks> trying as well
<didrocks> you removed OnlyShowIn as well, correct?
<koza> duflu, hey, yes :)
<koza> duflu, not sure if fun but at least it has three letters starting with b ending with g ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: so, removing OnlyShowIn in org.gnome.Nautilus.desktop + removing nautilus.desktop works for me as well
<duflu> koza: big?
<seb128> didrocks, right
<duflu> beg?
<duflu> bog?
<duflu> bag?
<koza> duflu, close close but you are not there yet
<didrocks> seb128: so, we are using that icon on Unity, I guess we kept the other for other DEs, but as we migrate the favorites which are renamed from Unity to gnome-shell, we can maybe removed nautilus.desktop?
<didrocks> and let other DEs having their own migration path?
<didrocks> oh, I think I know what happens in the ungood .desktop file match
<didrocks> nautilus.desktop is "added" to the dash
<didrocks> but there is this hardcoded list of translation
<didrocks> and so nautilus.desktop -> org.gnome.Nautilus.desktop when pinned on the dash
<didrocks> (but not in memory)
<didrocks> so half-converted
<didrocks> and double org.gnome.Nautilus.desktop in gsettings
<seb128> didrocks, we should check with Trevinho in case
<seb128> I think nautilus has some special handling in unity
<seb128> for matching subwindows
<seb128> like specific drives or such
<didrocks> yeah, at least, I confirm the Unity launcher is using org.gnome.Nautilus.desktop already
<didrocks> so we *might* be fine
<didrocks> but yeah, drivesâ¦ maybe that will be the issue
<didrocks> is Trevinho back today?
<seb128> yes he should
<seb128> we can remove nautilus.desktop and the onlyshowin and see if we get reports
<didrocks> or
<didrocks> we can add in nautilus.desktop NoShowIn=gnome?
<didrocks> NotShowIn*
 * didrocks tries
<didrocks> works
<didrocks> and matches are correct
<didrocks> shouldn't we do that? It's the less impactful as long as we have unity? ^
<didrocks> so removing OnlyShowIn=Unity; in org.gnome.Nautilus.desktop (or add GNOME) and adding NotShowIn=GNOME; in nautilus.desktop
<seb128> wfm
<didrocks> do you think we add GNOME to the OnlyShowIn list? that way we don't impact other DEs for now
<seb128> but it makes us keep old compat files
<seb128> +1
<didrocks> yeah, I would be in favor of a cleanswap at some point
<didrocks> once we get it all figured out, in one shot
<seb128> before the LTS? ;-)
<didrocks> would be great, I'm afraid we won't though (and we'll still have the unity -> GNOME Shell transition)
<didrocks> so, the "removing file, removed from launcher" issue
<didrocks> anyway, let's do the nautilus fix for now
<seb128> k
<willcooke> morning
<didrocks> hey willcooke
<willcooke> how goes didrocks?
<didrocks> willcooke: good, debugged another small "polish" G-S annoying behavior :p
<willcooke> :)
<didrocks> yourself?
<willcooke> sleepy
<willcooke> :)
<willcooke> Two late nights, need to finish on time today
<didrocks> too much beer yesterday? :)
<didrocks> hehe, yeah ;)
<willcooke> too much work :p
<willcooke> Can you advise me on DEP-3 for this? https://launchpadlibrarian.net/330579842/gnome-control-center_3.24.3-0ubuntu2.debdiff
<willcooke> it looks pretty straight forward, I just full out those Origin: Bug: etc fields
<willcooke> is that all there is to it?
<didrocks> do you have a bug for it? Bug-Ubuntu: <bug-url>
<willcooke> https://bugs.launchpad.net/gnome-control-center/+bug/1706421
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1706421 in gnome-control-center (Ubuntu) "Wifi hotspot password is hard to read" [Medium,Confirmed]
<didrocks> the rest looks good
<didrocks> but remove "+checkout http://dep.debian.net/deps/dep3/ to learn about the format. Here
<didrocks> "
<didrocks> and what you don't use below :)
<willcooke> for the actual patch itself, is that the correct way to make the font MonoSpace?
<didrocks> willcooke: example of DEP-3 fresh from this morning: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~didrocks/gnome-control-center/sound-above-100/view/head:/debian/patches/70_allow_sound_above_100.patch
<didrocks> willcooke: to me, yes, I don't know if there is a more modern way, seb128? ^
<Laney> moin
<didrocks> good morning Laney
<willcooke> hi Laney
<Laney> what's up
<willcooke> your roof
<willcooke> wakka wakka  wakka
<didrocks> (sleepy, but still can make bad jokes, I seeâ¦)
<Laney> these guys said it's fine, no work to do O_O
<seb128> hey willcooke Laney
<willcooke> didrocks, dad jokes, amiright ;)
<didrocks> willcooke: not at this level yet :p
<seb128> didrocks, willcooke, the example header from Didier looks good to me, I don't know of anything missing there
<Laney> it says Forwarded but the patch isn't forwarded
<Laney> that should be Bug
<Laney> ;-)
<willcooke> and how about the actual patch itself, is that the right way to add monospace?
 * Laney (mild troll)
<seb128> or the patch should be forwarded
<Laney> not if it uses com.ubuntu.sound
<willcooke> If someone can comment here to say if adding the attributes to the .ui file is the "right" way, the I will make a diff for upstream
<kostadin> Hello unbuntu deskop team. This is my first time on this channel and first I would like to thank you all for your efforts. I recently tried a daily build of 17.10 and I have a question regarding automatic bluetooth switching. When I connected my headset the output was automatically switched, but the headset was in HSP/HFP mode. Is this a bug I should report?
<willcooke> kostadin, hi there!  Thanks for the report.  This is a known issue with some headsets, we're looking in to it at the moment.
<seb128> willcooke, the actual .ui change looks good to me
<willcooke> seb128, merci
<seb128> de rien
<Trevinho> Hi guys
<Trevinho> yes didrocks
<willcooke> morning Trevinho
<Trevinho> hi willcooke
<didrocks> Trevinho: we found a way without impacting Unity, don't worry :)
<didrocks> but another fun bug due to desktop renames without good transition strategy in the Shell
<kostadin> willcooke, thanks. Is there a launchpad bug for this? I am happy help with testting this.
<koza> kostadin, what kind of headset are you using - brand/model?
<kostadin> Plantronics BackBeat Pro 2
<koza> kostadin, I think we do not have a bug for it atm, duflu can correct me if I'm wrong, so feel free and open one
<duflu> kostadin, there might be an existing bug open but it's unclear from the above text what's happening. Please just log more details in a new bug
<koza> kostadin, could you also include syslog with bluetooth and pulseaudio debug output enabled? instructions on how to do it are here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebuggingBluetooth. In case sth will be unclear ping us.
<willcooke> koza, this sounds like the same issue we saw in Warsaw where my speaker was connecting as A2DP but your headset wasnt - you had a patch knocking about, but the upgrade to 5.46 might help? (cc duflu - will fill you in in the meeting)
<kostadin> Basically headset connects fine, audio output is switched, but HSP/HFP mode is selected by default instead of A2DP mode.
<koza> willcooke, yes I think this is the same issue
<duflu> willcooke, the release announcements are too brief to tell. Would have to search git to see if any relevant change occurred
<kostadin> koza, duflu I will open a new bug with syslog output and description. Thank you
<duflu> kostadin, oh yes that happened to me last time. However it stopped happening on subsequent reboots. Only happened the first time
 * duflu vaguely recalls a timing issue that we distro-patch and might be relevant
<duflu> (hence the bug might not exist upstream)
<duflu> P.S. Almost all Bluetooth audio bugs are the domain of pulseaudio, not bluez.
<seb128> hey Trevinho, wb!
<kostadin> duflu, I have not tested it on subsequent reboots to be honest, but I will do it and report it in the bug
<Trevinho> hi seb128
<Trevinho> thanks
<willcooke> hey Laney - I am reminded about that sound issues, where I had to touch a file to rebuild a cache or something.  Do I need to make that touch part of the rules?
<Laney> willcooke: postinst if anything, but that feels more like a hack to me
<Laney> what do you think?
<Laney> worth a libcanberra bug
<willcooke> Laney, does feel like a hack.  Will that cache ever get updated if we don't touch that file?  e.g. will it always be "broken" for people who upgrade?
<Laney> i think there's some kind of timeout in there too
<Laney> and it's only if you got a negative hit recorded in the cache
<Laney> i.e. if you tried to play it
<Laney> probably the cache check thing should look at the actual theme directory rather than /usr/share/sounds
<willcooke> didrocks, how's this look now? http://paste.ubuntu.com/25175527/
<seb128> willcooke, bonus point if you list (lp: #nnn) in the changelog to reference to the launchpad bug
<willcooke> seb128, can I edit the diff directly to add that?
<seb128> sort of
<willcooke> hmm, maybe risky, the chunks would be out
<seb128> you could, but it's going to be long
<willcooke> I'll do it properly
<seb128> so you should wrap
<seb128> and adding a new line is more tricky
<seb128> you need to change the @@ -1,3 +1,10 @@ numbers etc
<seb128> easier to redo a diff
<willcooke> ack
<andyrock> good morning!
<seb128> hey andyrock, how are you?
<didrocks> nothing more to add compared to what seb told :)
<andyrock> hey seb128
<andyrock> good good, you?
<seb128> andyrock, I'm good thanks
<seb128> ricotz, hey, you said packages needed rebuilds for the python transition?
<ricotz> seb128, hi, yes
<seb128> I can have a look, which ones did you have?
<ricotz>  <ricotz> afaics there are some desktop-packages which need a python-nochange-rebuild: eog-plugins, gedit, gedit-plugins
<seb128> ricotz, k, thanks
<seb128> ricotz, is there a transition tracker with that list?
<ricotz> seb128, liferea
<ricotz> there is a tracker, but those packages doesnt appear on it
<ricotz> http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/transitions/html/python3.6.html
<seb128> do you know why they are not listed?
<willcooke> seb128, how's this?  http://paste.ubuntu.com/25175612/
<seb128> willcooke, gold :-)
<willcooke> \o/
<duflu> BTW to anyone interested, the top shell crasher is still https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell/+bug/1505409
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1505409 in GNOME Shell "gnome-shell crashed with SIGTRAP in x_io_error() from _XIOError() from _XEventsQueued() from XPending() from gdk_check_xpending() ["Connection to xwayland lost"]" [Critical,Confirmed]
<duflu> Seems to be caused by Xwayland crashing, but errors.ubuntu.com does not catch Xwayland
<willcooke> Do you know why it's not catching them duflu?
<duflu> willcooke, Either the theory is wrong, or something to do with gnome-shell managing the Xwayland process lifecycle...?
<seb128> duflu, those XError reports are always a bit difficult, would be nice if somebody would be able to reproduce and get a proper bt
<duflu> seb128, people have. See the duplicates (almost daily) as well as errors.ubuntu.com
<seb128> and yeah, it's likely that xwayland issues land under gnome-shell buckets
<seb128> duflu, yeah, but that doesn't tell us what xerror it hits
<duflu> seb128, I think the upstream bug had a better understanding
<seb128> duflu, there isn't much in https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=776529
<ubot5> Gnome bug 776529 in general "gnome-shell crashed with signal 5 in _XIOError()" [Critical,Reopened]
<seb128> but you are right that we should try to sort that issue out
<duflu> seb128, I think the cause of the Xwayland crash, while the root of the problem, is also not interesting. Xwayland is built from xorg-server so comes with some crashes you might get from legacy Xorg. What's really important is the last comment in the upstream bug where they admit gnome-shell should be better designed to not crash when Xwayland crashes
<duflu> Anyway, I am almost done
<seb128> right, but that's a design flow we know about and not one that we are likely going to resolve before the LTS
<seb128> which is one of the reason for pushing back on the wayland session to be the default one
<duflu> seb128, yes add it to the list unfortunately
<seb128> but yeah, segfaults of Xwayland are reported against gnome-shell
<seb128> I just sent a sig11 to Xwayland
<seb128> and it indeed takes the whole session  down :-/
<duflu> seb128, backward compatibility first. At least it supports legacy apps :)
<duflu> And good night
<seb128> and legacy segfaults!
<seb128> night duflu
<duflu> Heh
<willcooke> seb128, do you know if anything got decided about dnsmasq yesterday?  I think it was agreed that the n-m packaging needs to recommend it, but did anyone sign up to do it?
<seb128> willcooke, nobody did afaik, I was going to go ahead and upload that a bit later if nobody else do it
<willcooke> seb128, oki cool, thanks
<seb128> yw
<kenvandine> mpt, did you sort out when you're going to meet us at guadec?
<mpt> kenvandine, yes, I registered to be thereon the Tuesday
<kenvandine> mpt, great!
<kenvandine> mpt, thx
<didrocks> kenvandine: can we get the session on Tuesday morning? I'm leaving at lunch time that day
<kenvandine> didrocks, for the status area/indicator discussion?
<didrocks> kenvandine: yeah, and other design-related/extensions ones
<kenvandine> ok
<didrocks> (or on Monday for most of them ;))
<didrocks> thanks!
<kenvandine> i'll talk to allan
<willcooke> Laney, re: canberra - should that bug be upstream, or in LP?@
<jbicha> seb128: I'll go ahead add the NM recommends now
<seb128> jbicha, thanks
<jbicha> Debian has dnsmasq as a Depends, but we'd rather have it as a Recommends now, right?
<jbicha> *dnsmasq-base
<jbicha> never mind, Debian doesn't recommend or depend it there
<jbicha> and never mind that, it is a recommends there
<jbicha> good morning
<willcooke> morning jbicha
<seb128> hey jbicha :-)
<didrocks> good morning jbicha
<willcooke> Laney, do you know what processor your xps has?
<mpt> andyrock, hey, I finally revised the Livepatch design. It turned out to be not that complicated (I think). <https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SoftwareUpdates?action=diff&rev2=217&rev1=211>
<andyrock> mpt let's discuss the design at the meeting
<mpt> yep
<andyrock> because it requires work on their side
<Laney> willcooke: upstream (or both)
<Laney> & i7-5500
<andyrock> hey didrocks, how much you know about golang and i18n?
<andyrock> the big question if the translations can be exported/imported to launchpad
<didrocks> andyrock: on non desktop, people are using go-i18n, but I know there is as well some gettext package which may suit more desktop env
<andyrock> kk thanks
<didrocks> another way could be to use gogtk binding which has glib support (but untested)
<andyrock> I'll check gettext
<didrocks> andyrock: the most imported one in the Go community is http://godoc.org/github.com/gosexy/gettext
<didrocks> https://github.com/gosexy/gettext/blob/master/_examples/gettext.go
<didrocks> for an example
<kenvandine> gosexy... lol
<didrocks> they used to have a lot of great pkgs ;)
 * Laney removes 9999 g_debug () calls
<Laney> hey kenvandine
<kenvandine> hey Laney
<Laney> you good?
<kenvandine> yup
<didrocks> Laney: debugging the race I guess?
<kenvandine> leaving in a few hours
<didrocks> and so, had foo, bar, bazâ¦
<kenvandine> just promoted gedit snap to stable :)
<Laney> nice
<Laney> didrocks: something like that
<Laney> G_STRLOC!
<didrocks> going deep :) but yeah, useful macro
<kenvandine> seb128, an argument in favor of gjs in the platform snap... snaps that use our content interface won't need a rebuild for security updates to gjs
<didrocks> (I would never remember the gcc syntax, thanks for #define :p)
<kenvandine> seb128, we could end up with snaps in the store that bundle gjs/mozjs
<Laney> hey
<Laney> I tried build.snapcraft.io yesterday
<kenvandine> how did that go?
<Laney> https://build.snapcraft.io/user/iainlane/gedit/59890
<Laney> can you see that?
<kenvandine> yes
<didrocks> yep
<Laney> what's up with that?
<didrocks> no idea, I saw on the forum that there was something added in launchpad recently for submodule support
<kenvandine> Submodule 'libgd' (https://github.com/iainlane/libgd) registered for path 'libgd'
<kenvandine> do you have  clone of that repo?
<didrocks> it's indeed a 404
<didrocks> https://github.com/iainlane/libgd
<kenvandine> right
<Laney> why's it trying to get it from there?
<kenvandine> not sure why
<kenvandine> oh, do you have a fork of gedit?
<kenvandine> i think the submodule is ../libgd
<kenvandine> if you fork libgd it'll work
<Laney> ffs
<kenvandine> indeed :)
<Laney> how do you even look at submodules?
<didrocks> the recent bug fixed was https://bugs.launchpad.net/launchpad-buildd/+bug/1694413
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1694413 in launchpad-buildd "Builder doesn't pull submodules" [High,Fix released]
<Laney> laney@nightingale (master|â)> git submodule status                                                                                                                                       ~/temp/gedit
<Laney> -56a19ad9b056332ef07e508f1bdb6f03c6cb2590 libgd
<didrocks> but it doesn't seem to be related
<Laney> helpful
 * Laney just presses the fork button to try it
<Laney> k building
<ogra_> is that like "k lining" ?
<didrocks> "forklining :)
<didrocks> better than inlining!
<ogra_> not as informative as outlining though
<didrocks> heh
<Laney> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/330697688/buildlog_snap_ubuntu_xenial_amd64_04b3cfb6593f404a3d6cf0bcb0f15f47-xenial_BUILDING.txt.gz
<Laney> yeah annoying
<kenvandine> Laney, https://code.launchpad.net/~ken-vandine/gedit/snap
 * Laney copied that snapcraft.yaml
<kenvandine> oh
<kenvandine> ah...
<kenvandine> the PPA maybe?
<didrocks> why did you have to use another desktop helper? /me is curious
<didrocks> (no need to copy the definition, just use after:[remote-part-name]
<kenvandine> yeah... i realized that the other day
<didrocks> I'm afraid people then just copy that :p
<kenvandine> i was basing my work on ghex :)
<kenvandine> i have a todo to go back through them and switch to the remote part
<didrocks> who did ghex that way? tsss tsss tsss :p
<didrocks> yeah
<kenvandine> seb128 :)
<didrocks> otherwise we give a bad best practice
<didrocks> retsss :)
<kenvandine> well, i also started out needing to use my fork of the desktop helper
<Laney> anyway
<kenvandine> now it's been copied to a bunch of snaps :)
<didrocks> anything I didn't merge?
<Laney> I just wanted to see if build on commit was easy to achieve
<kenvandine> nope, it's all there
<didrocks> good :)
<Laney> this is more effort than I was bargaining for :P
<kenvandine> i don't see a way to configure it to use our backports ppa
<didrocks> I don't think we can use ppa, this is what I hilighted the other day here
<Laney> how do you normally do that?
<kenvandine> ah
<didrocks> flexiondotorg told the contrary, I don't know howâ¦
<Laney> just have it available?
<kenvandine> LP lets you specify the PPA
<didrocks> yeah, LP does
<kenvandine> didrocks, you can actually... i remember now
<didrocks> not b.snapcraft.io AFAIK
<Laney> mmm
<kenvandine> you use a script in the prepare to add-apt-repository
<kenvandine> yuck
<didrocks> oh
<didrocks> yummy :)
<didrocks> but nice trick :p
<kenvandine> indeed
<kenvandine> nice way to hack the builders :)
<flexiondotorg> Yes, yukky. Use cleanbuild locally :-)
<didrocks> why? I want this broke-my-desktop ppa here! :-)
<kenvandine> didrocks, i updated all my snaps to use the remote part :)
<didrocks> \o/
<kenvandine> well that sucks... switching to the remote desktop-gtk3 part broke the workaround to cleanup all the duplicated files from the platform snap
<kenvandine> gedit went from 5.9M to 77M :(
<kenvandine> oh... wrong remote part :)
<Laney> night!
<willcooke> see ya Laney
<kenvandine> good night Laney
<kenvandine> see you tomorrow!
<Trevinho> muktupavels: hey, did you see https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=785451 ?
<ubot5> Gnome bug 785451 in general "libwnck-3.24.0 breaks pin_window for devilspie" [Normal,New]
#ubuntu-desktop 2017-07-27
<Laney> morning!
<seb128> hey Laney willcooke
<seb128> how is u.k today?
<willcooke> morning seb128
<willcooke> grey
<willcooke> how about you?
<seb128> same
<Laney> hey seb128
<Laney> broke a big stem off a plant this morning while re-potting it
<Laney> ffsssssssssss
<seb128> doh
<seb128> Laney, when do you start your journey to Manchester? ;-)
<Laney> this afternoon
<Laney> need to pack
<Laney> wonder if kenvandine made it
<duflu> koza: Would you like me to migrate your 5.46 into the git repo? I haven't set up the tarball for it yet though
<duflu> But once done, all you need to do is pull/push
<seb128> hey duflu
<duflu> Hi seb128
<seb128> duflu, you worked a bit on pulseaudio? is there a special workflow? I want to put a change up for review that remove the trust store changeset (so start, we might want to remove other ubuntu touch patches then as well)
<koza> duflu, please do, all i did was src pkg
<duflu> koza: OK will try to do that before end of today
<duflu> seb128, yes, I think, let me check before I answer properly
<duflu> seb128, yes the only special workflow is that pulseaudio for artful is kept in the 'ubuntu' branch: https://git.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-audio-dev/pulseaudio
<duflu> "Just use git" is the workflow. You should be able to generate debdiffs and debs directly from the ubuntu branch
<seb128> duflu, thanks
<duflu> seb128, a prettier history is here: https://git.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-audio-dev/pulseaudio/log/?h=ubuntu
<seb128> k
<andyrock> good morning
<duflu> Morning andyrock
<koza> seb128: you can also try to try git ubuntu (made by nacc from server team), just type snap install git-ubuntu && git ubuntu import --no-push --no-clean pulseaudio and after a while you will get a branch per each ubuntu release plus a branch for dsc files. Quite nice to see history of changes in the archives.
<seb128> koza, I was reading that wikipage, seems worth giving it a try indeed, thanks
<koza> seb128: differnt branches for patches applied and unapplied versions too!
<koza> duflu: ^^^
<duflu> Interesting. I will hold off changing processes yet again right now. It's almost different for every repo I use
<koza> :-)
<Laney> biab
<koza> makes SRUs as easy as cherry-picking a single commit
<seb128> koza, btw your bluez update, you deleted the 5.45 entry from the changelog, I guess you edited it to change the 5 in 6, but you should add a new changelog entry instead
<seb128> koza, it's no issue for the ppa version but needs to be fixed for the archive upload
<seb128> Laney, later
<koza> seb128: right, now I know. I ahve made a really quick src package just for testing purposes thus a ci-train ppa.
<seb128> hey andyrock, sorry I was in middle of other things and forgot your greetings :-)
<duflu> willcooke, here's some fun for you. Not sure about the best place to publish so... https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/clutter-gst-3.0/+bug/1701463/comments/3
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1701463 in gstreamer-vaapi (Ubuntu) "gst-vaapi+Wayland = rendering corruption in totem (but not in gst-play-1.0)" [High,In progress]
<willcooke> duflu, will take a look in a mo, just on a call (hint hint seb128)
<willcooke> oh wait
<willcooke> my bad
<seb128> willcooke, ?
<seb128> I don't have any call before this afternoon in my calendar
<andyrock> seb128: forgiven! :D
<seb128> :-)
<willcooke> duflu, is that clutter-gst for artul?
<willcooke> artful*
<duflu> willcooke, yes artful. Would you like me to try copying them for zesty?
<willcooke> duflu, no, no worries.  Artful is where it's at for me
<duflu> willcooke, crucially point-and-click video playback now works. But there are smaller lingering performance bugs to resolve later
<willcooke> duflu, that's awesome work, thank you!  I will do some testing ASAP.  And I think some social media activity is warranted here as well.  Do you have the time and/or inclination to write something as a bit more of a narrative than the wiki page?
<duflu> willcooke, today no, another day yes
<willcooke> duflu, sure, not today, or even this week, but ya know, one day
<duflu> Upstream just spoke their first few words about it minutes ago. Wonder how that will go
<duflu> I did also draft a flowchart... but ran out of paper. That will take another attempt :P
<willcooke> lol
<seb128> duflu, do you use gbp to build packages for the pulseaudio git checkout?
<duflu> seb128, I use debuild for everything. No idea what gbp is
<seb128> git-builpackages, tools to work better with packaging in git
<seb128> if you use debuild in the checkout it changes the content and you need to clean out after?
<seb128> or do you extract a debdiff that you apply to the deb?
<duflu> seb128, AFAIK no special tooling is required. That's the goal of my git layout(s), to have a tree that's always ready for packaging, however you like. A second goal is to maintail full history to upstream master
<duflu> *maintain
<duflu> It appears some existing solutions don't bother with that second part
<seb128> k
<seb128> shrug
<seb128> I'm back at doing a rm of things and starting fresh again
<seb128> I don't understand how people can work with git, it's just an usability disaster
<duflu> seb128, admittedly I find myself with a similar problem now. But it's dinner time...
<seb128> duflu, enjoy
<didrocks> hey hey!
<willcooke> hi didrocks
<Laney> hey didrocks
<Laney> where are you?
<didrocks> Laney: CDG
<didrocks> will soon board to Manchester, when do you arrive?
<Laney> like 18.30
<Laney> lucky you getting to visit CDG
<didrocks> sooooooooooo nice
<didrocks> arriving terminal 2E, bus to terminal 2F
<didrocks> and back to terminal 2E to take my flight :)
<Laney> hope the free booze is worth it
<didrocks> none!
<didrocks> it's just the plane is too big for the 2F gates
<didrocks> so, they stop it at 2E+bus
<didrocks> time for boarding! see you later guys
<didrocks> </emails> processing
<Trevinho> seb128, Laney: hey, I think https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/2841 is ready for being published, however the automated testing fails... It's because some unity8 failures which I guess we won't fix now... Can we ignore that?
<Laney> Trevinho: I guess so, but you might have to argue with the SRU team
<willcooke> Laney, for dbgsym do I need to add another repo?
<willcooke> per https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Debug%20Symbol%20Packages
<Laney> dhttps://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebuggingProgramCrash#Non-built-in_debug_symbol_packages_.28.2A-dbgsym.29
<willcooke> ta
<Trevinho> Laney: well, I think we can win that battle...
<Trevinho> given the u8 status
<Trevinho> and that i didn't cause for sure that test failure
<willcooke> Laney,  gnome-software-dbgsym : Depends: gnome-software (= 3.24.3-0ubuntu7) but 3.25.4-1ubuntu1 is to be installed
<Laney> did you add ddebs from proposed?
<willcooke> no, I blindly copied and pasted. soz
<willcooke> fixed
<Laney> cool
<willcooke> Laney, did I do this right?  http://paste.ubuntu.com/25183338/
<willcooke> if so I will attach to the bug
<Laney> yeah, that's the same as the bugs I linked
<willcooke> worth attaching to the bug?
<Laney> although the backtrace indicates you don't have snapd-glib's symbols installed :-)
<Laney> you can if you like
<willcooke> grr, sorry
<willcooke> I'll redo it and attach it
<Laney> doesn't matter so much
<Laney> but might be useful in the future
<willcooke> heh, 2nd time I try it of course it works
<darkxst> willcooke, Laney you guys heading to GUADEC?
<willcooke> darkxst, just going for one day on Monday
<darkxst> ok cool, I am in Manchester now ;)
<darkxst> finally escaped the mountains!
<darkxst> would be great to catch up with whichever desktop team members are heading over!
<jbicha> darkxst: catch up on your sleep too ;)
<jbicha> crazy time zones :(
<Laney> darkxst: later on
<willcooke> hey robert_ancell!  Which TZ are you in now?
<robert_ancell> willcooke, same as you!
<willcooke> \o/
<robert_ancell> And then I realised, hang on, it's still work hours :(
<willcooke> hah
<robert_ancell> Or can I still claim +12 timezone...
<willcooke> wfm
<willcooke> ;)
 * Laney whips robert_ancell 
<Laney> GET TO WORK!
<robert_ancell> ow
<Laney> that's how we do things over here
<willcooke> down t' pit
<Laney> we've got our country back you know
<willcooke> lol
<Laney> ffs
<Laney> I forgot to bring my drive with debian/ubuntu mirrors on
<Laney> having it while travelling was supposed to be one of the main benefits
<robert_ancell> Will GUADEC no longer be able to go to the UK anymore?
<robert_ancell> or be called GUADEANDUKC
<Laney> :-)
<Laney> I think it's been to Norway before
<Laney> and some people talked about a Norway-style arrangement if we voted to Leave, so ...
<Laney> presumably they were talking about the continued possibility of hosting GUADEC
<robert_ancell> I'm sure that's one of the main negotiation points happening right now
<robert_ancell> willcooke, did you have any more info about why the snapd featured list is ordered? Richard was asking
<Laney> -Wmisleading-indentation to the rescue
<willcooke> robert_ancell, why is it ordered from the store, or why do we want it ordered in the UI?
<robert_ancell> willcooke, the latter, but that's driven by the former
<robert_ancell> It is intended to be ordered from most important to least important right?
<willcooke> I'm not worried about it being ordered in the UI, except for.. if there are n snaps being promoted and we can only support n-1 in the UI for common screen res. (1080 say) then one of them randomly vanishes - and we want some control over which one vanishes
<willcooke> so yeah, kinda importance ordered, but not really - just that we want some level of control - if we have to lose one of them, then we can control that at the store level
<robert_ancell> So it's considered better to always truncate the latter ones rather than randomizing (thus showing them all to every user at some point)
<willcooke> interesting question, but let me ask a preceding question... can we randomise [1:n] and always trim 0 off for the featured app?
<seb128> hey robert_ancell
<robert_ancell> seb128, hello
<robert_ancell> willcooke, yes, we only provide [1:n] to g-s which it then randomizes
<robert_ancell> [0] goes to featured
<willcooke> robert_ancell, oki, cool - sec
<willcooke> robert_ancell, bear with me, I'll ping you back asap
<robert_ancell> ok
<andyrock> Trevinho: X sru works ok now
<andyrock> do I need to approve something?
<seb128> does anyone know how to push git branches on lp so you can mp changes?
<seb128> e.g I would like to propose changes to https://git.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-audio-dev/pulseaudio/log/?h=ubuntu
<seb128> I pushed to https://code.launchpad.net/~seb128/+git/pulseaudio/+ref/ubuntu but it doesn't have an option to mp the changes
<Laney> seb128: push to ~seb128/pulseaudio
<Laney> ~user/+git/... is like +junk in bzr
<seb128> Laney, thanks
<Laney> https://help.launchpad.net/Code/Git#Repository_URLs
<Laney> not that easy to understand
<Laney> k, going to train station
<Laney> not sure I'll be able to get online - ttyl if not
<didrocks> at least, you won't lose your luggage :p
<seb128> bah
<seb128> what is a " Target reference path" for a git mp in launchpad?
<seb128> didrocks, you did?
<seb128> hey didrocks btw :-)
<didrocks> seb128: well, yes, apparently, luggage stuck at CDG
<didrocks> I hope they will find it and reroute to the next flight
<didrocks> but I guess no news before tomorrow morning :/
<seb128> "fun"
<didrocks> yeahâ¦
<willcooke> night all
<andyrock> ninght all!
<seb128> night
#ubuntu-desktop 2017-07-28
<duflu> seb128, Morning. If you are still looking at pulseaudio git, beware I just made a change
<willcooke> morning
<duflu> Morning willcooke
<seb128> hey willcooke duflu
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<willcooke> Happy Friday!
<duflu> Indeed it will be if I complete today without anything starting with G
<seb128> happy friday indeed!
<willcooke> duflu, lol
<seb128> duflu, noted for pulseaudio, I started on changes but it's less trivial that I though so I need to go back to it, https://git.launchpad.net/~seb128/pulseaudio/commit/?id=60fe1e5e
<seb128> duflu, that doesn't build because the snappy patch relies on changes from the trust store changeset
<duflu> seb128, oh I am working on similar right now (decided
<duflu> to recently)
<seb128> duflu, oh ok, well feel free to take over, I doubt I'm going to have time to continue that today
<duflu> seb128, it's just for a PPA experiment so we shall see
<seb128> duflu, the android changeset can probably be dropped as well, I'm less sure about the hfp since I don't know about that topic
<duflu> seb128, yes that's the goal. We introduced a pile of Bluetooth audio changes for touch. And that makes me nervous given Debian has zero patches to upstream
<seb128> right
<willcooke> duflu, just playing with the video accel link you sent me yesterday, where do I get vaapidecodebin?  It says "no element vaapidecodebin" atm
<duflu> willcooke, ?! that should be installed with gstreamer1.0-vaapi
<willcooke> humm
<willcooke> it didnt have that installed
<willcooke> but pretty sure I installed it to test before
<willcooke> odd
<willcooke> but thanks
<duflu> willcooke, the actual file name is /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/gstreamer-1.0/libgstvaapi.so
<willcooke> thx
<willcooke> works now
<willcooke> although, no sound, but meh
<duflu> willcooke, yeah sound is the job of the "bad" and "ugly" plugin sets
<willcooke> duflu, ahhh
<willcooke> got it
<willcooke> seb128, hmmm- seeing systemd-resolved and dnsmasq using all my CPU - looks like they are fighting
<willcooke> I'll see if I can find out how to reproduce this
<willcooke> ah, could be because I manually installed it, instead of -base the other day
<seb128> willcooke, still worth reporting if that's confirmed, the packaging should prevent you to install them together if they conflict
<willcooke> ack
<Laney> hi
<willcooke> hey Laney
<amano> I wonder if Dustin Kirklands poll will lead to another default video player in Ubuntu. Totem seems highly unpopular as the Mate poll on google+ showed: https://plus.google.com/+MartinWimpress/posts/fqHnF51BbDh
<amano> It seems that Martin Wimpress would have preferred MPV instead of VLC ;)
<amano> But people are not voting that way. At least Totem isn't deemed a contender.
<duflu> amano, I'm working on fixing totem right now :) Interesting if VLC became default because I have never yet seen it do hardware decoding properly. Maybe haven't tried hard enough
<amano> I would be fine with MPV as the default. VLC would bring in all those QT dependencies that nobody is really aiming at...
<amano> The missing decorations on Wayland could be renamed a feature ;)
<amano> Let's wait and see ;)
<andyrock> morning
<willcooke> hi andyrock
 * Trevinho finally in a stable location for few days... Hello Belgrade!
<chrisccoulson> what do people not like about totem? It seems to do what I expect from a default video player, in a fairly inoffensive way
<chrisccoulson> better still, it works on high dpi screens. VLC looks fairly bad there (at least, on my zesty install)
<chrisccoulson> There's still plenty of issues for high dpi users - please don't regress things by replacing apps that currently work fine with ones that don't :)
<ricotz> hey desktopers
<ricotz> jbicha, hi, could you do your autopkgtest magic with this build https://launchpad.net/~libreoffice/+archive/ubuntu/libreoffice-prereleases/+sourcepub/8115487/+listing-archive-extra
<jbicha> ricotz: could you ask again in a couple days when https://autopkgtest.ubuntu.com/running isn't full?
<ricotz> jbicha, hmm, I see, is there a guide to run them locally in some container?
<jbicha> ricotz: maybe try https://dyn.manpages.debian.org/unstable/autopkgtest/index.html ?
<ricotz> jbicha, will look into it
<seb128> have a good w.e desktopers
<willcooke_> night seb128
<willcooke_> night all, see some of you Monday!
<andyrock> have a nice we all!
#ubuntu-desktop 2017-07-30
<jbicha> ricotz: https://objectstorage.prodstack4-5.canonical.com/v1/AUTH_77e2ada1e7a84929a74ba3b87153c0ac/autopkgtest-artful-libreoffice-libreoffice-prereleases/artful/amd64/libr/libreoffice/20170730_114728_b963c@/log.gz
<ricotz> jbicha, thanks!
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-07-23
<didrocks> good morning
<jibel> Salut didrocks
<didrocks> salut jibel, les vacances Ã©taient biens ?
<didrocks> bien*
<jibel> didrocks, bien, un peu courtes comme toujours et toi Ã§a va?
<didrocks> jibel: Ã§a va, rentrÃ© de GUADEC, les vacances dans 2 semaines :)
<duflu> Morning didrocks and jibel
 * duflu runs off again to make coffee
<didrocks> hey duflu
<oSoMoN> hello world
<duflu> Hello oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> hey duflu, had a good week-end?
<world> Hello oSoMoN
<didrocks> salut oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> salut didrocks
<duflu> oSoMoN, yeah twas nice. How about you?
<oSoMoN> week-end was nice yeah, I didn't do much except for sleeping and bbq
<oSoMoN> and started setting up an automated watering system for my vegetable garden, which is coming along nicely
<duflu> Sounds nice
 * tsimonq2 waves to everyone
<oSoMoN> everyone waves back
<didrocks> hey tsimonq2
<duflu> Hi tsimonq2
<duflu> Hi seb128
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<seb128> hey didrocks duflu
<didrocks> hey seb128
<jamesh> hi seb128
<seb128> hey jamesh
<seb128> did you all had good w.es?
<didrocks> hey jamesh
<jamesh> too much rain
<jamesh> hi didrocks
<duflu> That's true. We practically had a cyclone last night. But still a nice weekend
<duflu> with water
<duflu> And Saturday, depending on the suburb
<duflu> How are you seb128?
<oSoMoN> salut seb128
<seb128> duflu, I'm good! ready for a warm week
<seb128> when we came back yesterday it was 32.3Â°C in the flat :/
<seb128> lut oSoMoN
<Trevinho> Morning...
<oSoMoN> good morning Trevinho
<oSoMoN> seb128, does it cool down at night?
<Trevinho> oSoMoN: hi :-)
<duflu> Hi Trevinho
<seb128> oSoMoN, yes, we can't complain
<Trevinho> duflu: hey Daniel
<seb128> hey Trevinho, what are you doing up so early? ;)
<duflu> ? Where in the world is Trevinho San Diego ?
<didrocks> hey Trevinho
<Trevinho> seb128: eheh, yesterday I walked around 30km, while I slept probably 8 hrs in the weekend so yesterday I needed to sleep a bit earlier :-P
<seb128> :)
<Trevinho> duflu: ahaha, no... Nerja, Spain
<oSoMoN> nice, I was there for a holiday 5 years ago
<Trevinho> Yeah very touristy place, but I wanted to check it out...
<duflu> Something tells me too many projects/people are now on gitlab.gnome.org
<oSoMoN> it was painfully slow for me the other day, is it still the case?
<duflu> oSoMoN, yes it's been unusable for a few hours at least
<oSoMoN> :/
<duflu> Even last week I had to save my comments offline and try pasting them whenever I could get the site to respond
<willcooke> morning
<duflu> Hi willcooke
<seb128> hey willcooke, how are you? had a good trip back?
<willcooke> I'm ok, verrrrrry tired this morning
<willcooke> one week is really bad for jet lag
<oSoMoN> good morning willcooke
<duflu> willcooke, welcome to our world. One week of jet lag during the sprint + one week of jet lag after the sprint
<didrocks> morning willcooke
<didrocks> andyrock: hey, once you are around, apparently you discussed about https://github.com/micheleg/dash-to-dock/issues/747 when implementing the feature with the dash to dock people, do you have anything plan for it?
<gitlab-bot> micheleg issue 747 in dash-to-dock "Make progress bar and trough themeable" (comments: 0) [Open]
<seb128> duflu, they are discussing gitlab's slowness on #gnome-hackers (you should be there maybe, can be useful?), it's not specific to the GNOME instance and they blame it on extra JS use from gitlab
<duflu> seb128, yeah I thought it feels like it's in the web frontend. git itself still works. No need for me to join if they know already
<seb128> right, I was more suggestion that you might want to autoconnect to some GNOME channels maybe
<duflu> seb128, I already do
<seb128> ah, I see you are on #gnome-shell
<seb128> good :)
<seb128> L_aney (I think?) commented post GUADEC about that, I meant to follow up/ask
<seb128> I guess that's already sorted out :)
<Trevinho> oh, finally! https://github.com/telegramdesktop/tdesktop/commit/f68cefbdc1f5131b930c2acf3c2dc0ede07f538e
<seb128> Trevinho, well done \o/
<seb128> willcooke, ^
<willcooke> Trevinho, woot!  Thank you!
<Trevinho> :)
<andyrock> didrocks: not really
<andyrock> if required I can schedule some time for this
<didrocks> well, talk with seb128 about it I guess, but it seems it's a small thing and the communitheme guys would be glad to have that possibility for the theme
<didrocks> (nothing prevents you answering on the bug though ;))
<seb128> didrocks, andyrock, seems like the nice small quite of polish that would be nice to have but not a priority, maybe for the list post-ff?
<didrocks> sounds good to me, post-ff, before uif
<didrocks> just please answer to the communitheme guys on the bug ;)
<seb128> andyrock, ^ wfy? can you comment saying you can have a look post cosmic-ff?
<andyrock> seb128: kk
<seb128> thx
<Trevinho> uff gnome's gitlab is so slow, need more machinessss
<oSoMoN> ricotz, FYI, I pushed LO 6.0.6~rc1 to cosmic-proposed (https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libreoffice/1:6.0.6~rc1-0ubuntu1)
<ricotz> oSoMoN, nice
<oSoMoN> I know we usually wait for the proper release, but LO rebuild failures were blocking migrations (cosmic had 6.0.3), and it didn't make sense to undo changes in the packaging branch to push 6.0.5
<oSoMoN> when 6.0.6 final is out I will push it of course
<ricotz> oSoMoN, I know, I suggested to just take the rc1 ;)
<ricotz> oSoMoN, no -l10n package?
<oSoMoN> ricotz, uploading now
<ricotz> alright
<ricotz> oSoMoN, currently uploading 6.1.0~rc2, but don't expect too much
<oSoMoN> cool
<oSoMoN> ricotz, btw there's a snap for 6.1.0~rc1 in the beta channel, and 6.1.0~rc2 currently building too
<ricotz> great, I don't use snap though
<kenvandine> ricotz, i'm back from the sprint now, so I'll get vala updated in the backports PPA early this week
<ricotz> kenvandine, thanks :), libgee-0.8 seems like a candidate as well, note valac is a compiler so upload order matters
<kenvandine> indeed
<kenvandine> ok, thx
<willcooke> morning kenvandine
<kenvandine> hey willcooke
<oSoMoN> hey kenvandine
<kenvandine> :-D
<seb128> hey kenvandine, had a good trip back?
<kenvandine> hey seb128
<kenvandine> yeah
<kenvandine> getting back to the routine now :)
<seb128> hehe
<seb128> xnox, doko, no, we don't check those ftbfs pages, I didn't even know they existed out of archive rebuilds
<xnox> seb128, that's ongoing page for the current devel series release/proposed pockets as needed.
<seb128> xnox, doko, also as said, having to manually "pull" on a stack of random reports on inconsitent websites isn't a solution
<seb128> you have to keep an eye on britney migration, component mismatch, assigned bugs, rls-nn-incoming tags, ftbfses, etc etc etc
<seb128> no that doesn't work
<xnox> seb128, that one at least is part of like DMB tests for MOTU =/ =))))) and like contributing developers are pointed at those...... well documented in ubuntu development pages..... =))))))) are you even motu?! ghghghghhghghhghgh =)
<seb128> xnox, no, I'm not :p
<xnox> seb128, please ask management to deploy tracker.debian.org for ubuntu?! =)
<seb128> that would be useful
<seb128> that's something we discussed recently with the people from desktop at GUADEC
<seb128> having a dashboard would be very useful
<doko> and I usually reference that page in my test-rebuild emails
<seb128> asking people to manually keep checking a stack of random reports isn't working
<seb128> doko, right, which is why I wrote "I didn't even know they existed out of archive rebuilds"
<seb128> doko, I though that was a report of archive rebuilds, I didn't know that was an active out of those
<xnox> seb128, he mentions both.... e.g. currently outstanding & full rebuild. cause full rebuild is typically a snapshot, and outstanding is the ongoing one.....
<xnox> seb128, please read emails from doko =) instead of ignoring them Har har har ghghhghghghhghghhhghghgh
<seb128> lol
<seb128> my german is not good enough sorry :p
<doko> ohh, my emails are in denglish
<xnox> /msg doko but seb128 is german, what the?!
<seb128> xnox, anyway, to go back to your initial question, yes email notification would be useful
<doko> he keeps denying that since UDU ;p
<seb128> like we have for britney blocked migrations
<xnox> /msg doko ich kann nicht verstechen, warum kanst ehr nicht im Deutsch lessen!
<willcooke> goodnight all
<Trevinho> kenvandine: hey, can you please publish https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/3327 as per muktupavels fixes?
<Trevinho> or seb128 ^ :)
<kenvandine> Trevinho, done
<Trevinho> kenvandine: thanks
<kenvandine> Trevinho, np
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-07-24
<duflu> Morning seb128
<duflu> Morning oSoMoN. I just added some components you mentioned recently to https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/e/2PACX-1vRDHPxGBHqM6XkT_S8ggtYfD0xchKSUD_z9PopNVE3G1rU05fVSnxDGcDsEstl7gu7N-tzCU6mLUp2V/pubchart?oid=254968654&format=interactive
<didrocks> oopps, forgot to say "good morning", was already deep in packaging
<duflu> Good morning didrocks. Everyone else is still asleep, even if logged in
<didrocks> all those slackers! :-)
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<duflu> Hello oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> hey duflu
<oSoMoN> which components did you add?
<duflu> oSoMoN, thunderbird and chromium-browser
<duflu> with as much history as I could find
<oSoMoN> (I was outside overseeing workers who are drilling ventilation holes for the crawl space below the house)
<oSoMoN> duflu, cool, thanks
<oSoMoN> duflu, does the LP API expose bug number history?
<duflu> oSoMoN, I don't know. I only use the Wayback Machine :)
<duflu> It's a tricky question to answer -- what was the net opens-minus-closes on date X
<duflu> ?
<duflu> I wouldn't be surprised if LP had no such records
<oSoMoN> duflu, yeah, it doesn't as far as I know, using the wayback machine is a clever way of getting that info
<didrocks> salut oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> salut didrocks, Ã§a va?
<didrocks> Ã§a va, et toi oSoMoN ?
<oSoMoN> bien
<seb128> hey duflu
<seb128> lut oSoMoN didrocks
 * seb128 is back from morning "errands" :) I should have started earlier than 8am today, it's nice and fresh still
<duflu> Real life. Always gets in the way
<seb128> indeed
<didrocks> salut seb128
<oSoMoN> salut seb128
<Laney> yo
<didrocks> hey Laney, good long week-end?
<Laney> heeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeyy didrocks
<Laney> YEP
<Laney> nice swimming in the river / sea, good food & drinks, hot sun!
<didrocks> nice!
<didrocks> it's time for https://github.com/ubuntu/communitheme/pull/649
<gitlab-bot> ubuntu issue (Pull request) 649 in communitheme "New theme name" (comments: 1) [Open]
<Laney> ð ðð¹ðºâð
<Laney> yeahhhh
<Laney> how are you?
<didrocks> I'm fine, thanks!
<Laney> groovy
<willcooke> morning all
<didrocks> morning willcooke
<oSoMoN> good morning Laney, willcooke
<didrocks> seb128: when you have time, do you mind pre-reviewing the packaging before I upload it to cosmic? https://github.com/ubuntu/yaru
<Laney> moin willcooke oSoMoN
<Laney> what's new
<willcooke> didrocks, woot!  Getting close now
<willcooke> Laney, jetlag kicking my arse.  Wide awake at 2 = hard to wake up at 9.
<willcooke> How was your holiday?
<Laney> yeah pretty sweet
<Laney> we mainly pottered around eating, drinking and swimming in various bodies of water
<Laney> we were in totnes
<Laney> good river there for swimming in, can walk a few minutes out of the town
<willcooke> nice part of the world that
<Laney> aye
<duflu> Morning(ish) willcooke
<duflu> Morning Laney too
<willcooke> ar'noon duflu
<Trevinho> Morning
<Trevinho> Hi Laney
<didrocks> hey Trevinho
<seb128> didrocks, sure, I'm having a look to that today
<didrocks> thanks!
<duflu> Hi Trevinho
<seb128> np!
<seb128> hey Trevinho Laney
<seb128> & willcooke
<Trevinho> Hi didrocks, duflu, seb128 & willcooke
<Laney> hey Trevinho and seb128!!!
<Laney> what's going on
<duflu> I see blue sky. It's been a while
<seb128> summer is here, it's still nice in the morning but I might hunt for a place with a/c for the afternoon :/
<didrocks> already 27Â°C inside
<Laney> /o\
<seb128> didrocks, nice job on the yaru blog post!
<Laney> YYYYYYEAHHHHHHHHHH!
<Laney> cyphermox: hey, did you see that people are still reporting kbd_mode bugs?
<Laney> there was a console-setup sru to bionic which probably set them off (not that I've investigated)
<oSoMoN> Laney, would you mind approving and merging https://code.launchpad.net/~osomon/britney/hints-ubuntu-libreoffice/+merge/350721 ?
<Laney> ok
<oSoMoN> thanks
<Laney> why do we still have that problem :((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((
<oSoMoN> the kernel team spent some time trying patches but I don't think we ever got to the bottom of itâ¦
<oSoMoN> Laney, once merged, do IÂ need to do anything for the autopkgtest failure to be ignored and migration to proceed?
<Laney> nah, it happens at the next run
<seb128> Laney, speaking of hint can you update the udisks2 version on s390x?
<Laney> I thought that was going to be looked at
<Laney> done
<Laney> but I still thought that
<Laney> If not, make the next upload kill the testsuite on s390x
<Laney> please, or something like that
<seb128> good point, thx (I poked a bit at it but don't remember if I said I would do a bit more of that of the outcome is that some of the things don't make sense on s390x ... I had back that in my backlog to have a look again)
<xnox> i agree....
<seb128> I add back*
<seb128> xnox, you agree with killing the testsuite on s390x?
<xnox> yes
<seb128> great :)
<xnox> chances of people connecting usb camera to a mainframe are -1
<Laney> still
<Laney> http://autopkgtest.ubuntu.com/packages/u/udisks2/bionic/s390x
<Laney> what broke it?
<Laney> that's worth being concerned about imho
<xnox> seb128, it would be ok if it did test the dasd/zfcp/loops etc all the generic things.
<xnox> but not the usb stuff, for example.
<xnox> looking
<Laney> if things go from working to broken
<Laney> understanding why is important
<xnox> glibc broke it?! =)
<xnox> yeah looks odd / bad
<seb128> I think the main failing test is new in 2.7 and never worked
<seb128> https://github.com/storaged-project/udisks/issues/517
<gitlab-bot> storaged-project issue 517 in udisks "test_md_raid_methods fails on s390x" (comments: 2) [Open]
<seb128> that didn't exist in 2.6
<seb128> the other issues are transient/flaky tests (should be addressed too yes)
<Laney> ah nice bug
<seb128> they milestoned for 2.8 so hopefully they get back to it
<xnox> well that's just basic linux raid, i can poke things there to see what's wrong.
<xnox> in general linux raid should just work.
<seb128> that would be useful
<seb128> thx
<xnox> so possibly simply racy
<xnox> and mainframe fast, hence always racy
<Laney> ð
<andyrock> seb128: can you take a look at https://code.launchpad.net/~azzar1/software-properties/fix-lp-1770686/+merge/345437
<andyrock> it has been there approved for a while
<seb128> andyrock, hey, sure, I've a meeting in 10min so probably after that/the team meeting, but it's on my list now :)
<andyrock> kk thx :)
<didrocks> would be nice if gbp had a --split mode as bzr bd did
 * didrocks looks at the doc but didn't find an equivalent if I'm correct
<cyphermox> Laney: I did not, where do you see these bugs?
<didrocks> ok, I think I found some options to emulate it
<Laney> cyphermox: some comments on 1710637
<Laney> and p_opey reported it here
<willcooke> ding ding!
<willcooke> it's meeting time
<willcooke> #startmeeting Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-07-24
<meetingology> Meeting started Tue Jul 24 13:30:28 2018 UTC.  The chair is willcooke. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/3VYBPFaR/ubuntu-desktop-1810-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | <sarnold> I think the -t is mostly considered a feature :) | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-07-24 | Current topic:
<oSoMoN> o/
<willcooke> Roll call: andyrock, dgadomski, didrocks, duflu (out), jamesh (out), jibel/heber, kenvandine, laney, oSoMoN, seb128, tkamppeter, trevinho, robert_ancell (hols)
<didrocks> hey
<Trevinho> o/
<andyrock> o/
<Laney> _O_
<seb128> hey
<jibel> o/
<willcooke> Looks like we have enough people to start, so....
<willcooke> #topic andyrock
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/3VYBPFaR/ubuntu-desktop-1810-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | <sarnold> I think the -t is mostly considered a feature :) | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-07-24 | Current topic: an
<kenvandine> o/
<andyrock> Reviewed https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/ubuntu/+source/nautilus/+git/nautilus/+merge/349670
<andyrock> Update MP for https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-shell/issues/373 to support x11 too
<andyrock> Bug âmedia-keys: Some shortcuts should ignore auto-repeat key eventsâ:
<andyrock> MP for gnome-shell: https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-shell/merge_requests/156
<andyrock> MP for gnome-settings-daemon: https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-settings-daemon/merge_requests/34
<andyrock> MP for mutter: https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/mutter/merge_requests/169
<andyrock> Working on fix for LP: #1772831
<andyrock> Working on adding âhttp over unixâ support to libsoup. This likely requires a major reworking of the api
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1772831 in gnome-control-center (Ubuntu) "gnome-control-center does not respond after we set the resolution 320x180" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1772831
<gitlab-bot> GNOME issue 373 in gnome-shell "Some keybindings should discard auto-repeat events" (comments: 0) [Opened]
<gitlab-bot> GNOME issue (Merge request) 156 in gnome-shell "shellDBus: Add ignore_key_repeat paramater" (comments: 8) [Opened]
<gitlab-bot> GNOME issue (Merge request) 34 in gnome-settings-daemon "media-keys: Allow some key repeated events" (comments: 1) [Opened]
<gitlab-bot> GNOME issue (Merge request) 169 in mutter "keybindings: Add flag param to grab_accelerator" (comments: 8) [Opened]
<andyrock> eow
<willcooke> thanks andyrock
 * willcooke makes a note to trim the topic when the meeting is over
<willcooke> #topic dgadomski
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/3VYBPFaR/ubuntu-desktop-1810-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | <sarnold> I think the -t is mostly considered a feature :) | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-07-24 | Current topic: dg
<dgadomski> hey
<dgadomski> * bug #1782152 fixed upstream, tested & prepared debdiffs
<dgadomski> * working on bug #1721988, for some it's fixed in 18.04, but not according to my tests, will continue working on this
<ubot5> bug 1782152 in gdm3 (Ubuntu) "GDM blocks SIGUSR1 used in PAM scripts" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1782152
<ubot5> bug 1721988 in nvidia-graphics-drivers-384 (Ubuntu) "Ubuntu 17.10 full disk encryption + Nvidia drivers not booting" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1721988
<dgadomski> eof
<willcooke> thanks dgadomski
<willcooke> #topic didrocks
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/3VYBPFaR/ubuntu-desktop-1810-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | <sarnold> I think the -t is mostly considered a feature :) | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-07-24 | Current topic: di
<didrocks> Communitheme:
<didrocks>  * Finalizing communitheme rename (some fix up for upstream devs to test and iterate over it easier)
<didrocks>  * Debian packaging for cosmic
<didrocks>  * Some changes (like Shell not taking capital letters for modes)
<didrocks>  * Change repository name
<didrocks>  * Resync Travis, do some cleanups in the CI build system, adapt gtk-common-themes to it.
<didrocks>  * Converted ubuntu-settings to git and release a fix for communitheme for both cosmic and bionic (LP: #1782190). However, cosmic is stuck in proposed due to a meson bug.
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1782190 in ubuntu-settings (Ubuntu Bionic) "Set default interface font size to 11 for communitheme sessions" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1782190
<didrocks>  * Investigated the meson regresstion and opened https://github.com/mesonbuild/meson/issues/3914 (tagged as such by upstream)
<gitlab-bot> mesonbuild issue 3914 in meson "Symlinks can't be copied by install_subdir() since 0.47.0" (comments: 1) [Install Targets, Regression, Open]
<didrocks> Apport:
<didrocks>  * Some rereviews with Brian, and discussion on services. Now in bionic-proposed! (Needs testing). Should be released post .1.
<didrocks>  * Prepare with the communitheme core team the Yaru annoucement blog post.
<didrocks> GSConnect:
<didrocks>  * Spent some time trying it, found a lot of issues/warnings with current releases.
<didrocks>  * Still did a first packaging on it and started to fix some issues like harcoded path for settings not being able to be installed distro-wide.
<didrocks>  * Read github issue tracker and found that a WIP rewrite is currently being done. Talking with upstream on https://github.com/andyholmes/gnome-shell-extension-gsconnect/issues/158 who hilighted that the best route is to wait for the rewrite. Iterating with him currently on the packaging and feedback.
<gitlab-bot> andyholmes issue 158 in gnome-shell-extension-gsconnect "Inclusion by default in ubuntu" (comments: 7) [Open]
<didrocks> Misc:
<didrocks>  * Reviewed and sponsor Marco's Nautilus update.
<didrocks> .
<willcooke> nice, thanks didrocks
<oSoMoN> didrocks, cool new name
<didrocks> it is a cool name ;)
<willcooke> :D
<willcooke> #topic duflu
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/3VYBPFaR/ubuntu-desktop-1810-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | <sarnold> I think the -t is mostly considered a feature :) | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-07-24 | Current topic: du
<willcooke> * Gnome Shell performance (what changed this week):
<willcooke>   - Reduced input lag and cursor stutter! I wasn't looking for a lag problem but it's definitely improved now. Most noticeable inside apps (https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/mutter/merge_requests/168)
<willcooke>   - Wayland: Implemented proper hardware vsync (https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/mutter/merge_requests/171). Previously Wayland sessions would blindly always render at 60.00Hz regardless of how appropriate that was for the display.
<willcooke>   - More work in progress: Avoid frame skipping and artificially low frame rates:
<willcooke>     . https://gitlab.gnome.org/vanvugt/mutter/commits/super-smooth
<willcooke>     . https://gitlab.gnome.org/vanvugt/mutter/commits/super-smooth-v2
<willcooke>     . Basically done for Wayland (when combined with !171 above) but Cogl's X11 backend is proving surprisingly buggy.
<gitlab-bot> GNOME issue (Merge request) 168 in mutter "clutter: Reduce input lag and cursor stutter [performance]" (comments: 19) [Performance, Opened]
<willcooke>     . One eager user has been helping me test it and also confirms his 2010-era Intel system sees a doubling in frame rate.
<willcooke> * Daily bug management:
<gitlab-bot> GNOME issue (Merge request) 171 in mutter "Sync to the hardware refresh rate, not just 60.00Hz [performance]" (comments: 16) [5. Backend: Native, Opened]
<willcooke>   - Mostly good news - shrinking backlogs in the problem areas.
<willcooke>   - Added thunderbird and chromium-browser to the chart.
<willcooke>   - https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/e/2PACX-1vRDHPxGBHqM6XkT_S8ggtYfD0xchKSUD_z9PopNVE3G1rU05fVSnxDGcDsEstl7gu7N-tzCU6mLUp2V/pubchart?oid=254968654&format=interactive
<willcooke> #topic jamesh
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/3VYBPFaR/ubuntu-desktop-1810-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | <sarnold> I think the -t is mostly considered a feature :) | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-07-24 | Current topic: ja
<willcooke> snapd/pulseaudio:
<willcooke> * I am working on updating the "snap support" patches for Pulse Audio
<willcooke> to restrict microphone access based on the connected plugs of the
<willcooke> snap.
<willcooke> * When I had a similar problem in the past, zyga had suggested I use
<willcooke> the new interfaces REST API.  This isn't currently supported in
<willcooke> snapd-glib, so I put together a merge proposal here:
<willcooke> https://github.com/snapcore/snapd-glib/pull/40
<gitlab-bot> snapcore issue (Pull request) 40 in snapd-glib "WIP: Add support for the "interface info" mode of the /v2/interfaces API" (comments: 1) [Open]
<willcooke> * It turns out that this API doesn't currently provide a way to
<willcooke> reliably tell which interfaces are connected, so it looks like the
<willcooke> legacy "ask for data about every single connection on the system and
<willcooke> then filter client side" is the only option for now:
<willcooke> https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/should-v2-interfaces-select-connected-return-unconnected-plugs-slots/6455/2
<willcooke> * I hope to have a version of the PA patch ready for testing soon.
<willcooke> #topic jibel / heber
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/3VYBPFaR/ubuntu-desktop-1810-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | <sarnold> I think the -t is mostly considered a feature :) | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-07-24 | Current topic: ji
<jibel> - Preparing the release of 18.04.1 this thursday
<jibel>     - Troubleshooted bug 1772844 that prevented launch of preinstalled snap and installation of some other snaps (eg gedit)
<ubot5> bug 1772844 in ubuntu-meta (Ubuntu) "snapd didn't initialize all the seeded snaps" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1772844
<jibel>     - Tested EFI installation with an existing legacy installation (typical use case is the side by side installation with MS Windows)
<jibel>     - Reviewed upgrade bugs to 18.04
<jibel>     - Smoke tests of 18.04.1 with proposed enabled.
<jibel> done
<willcooke> thanks jibel
<willcooke> #topic kenvandine
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/3VYBPFaR/ubuntu-desktop-1810-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | <sarnold> I think the -t is mostly considered a feature :) | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-07-24 | Current topic: ke
<kenvandine> * Sprint last week
<kenvandine> * Decided on the name for our fork of gnome-software, it will be "snap-store".  When run on Ubuntu you'll get the full experience you would get from our current deb but when run on other distros it will be a fro
<kenvandine> ntend to just the snap store.
<kenvandine>   - The snappy team is working on adding the interfaces we need to run snap-store confined
<kenvandine> â¾
<willcooke> thanks kenvandine
<willcooke> #topic Laney
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/3VYBPFaR/ubuntu-desktop-1810-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | <sarnold> I think the -t is mostly considered a feature :) | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-07-24 | Current topic: La
<Laney> â¢ short week, was on holiday friday & monday
<Laney> â¢ mainly did some updates / reviews / sponsoring (some to SRU too)
<Laney> â¢ gtk, mutter, gnome-shell, vala
<Laney> â¢ had to fix a few issues in gtk to get it to build / test, all merged upstream
<Laney> â¢ usual git stuff, some fixes merged but also some of the updates above were done using this workflow which was nice
<Laney> â¢ Florian reviewed my gnome-shell branches; I fixed according to the comments and they got merged. systemd ð
<Laney> ð²ð²ð²
<willcooke> thanks Laney
<willcooke> #topic oSoMoN
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/3VYBPFaR/ubuntu-desktop-1810-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | <sarnold> I think the -t is mostly considered a feature :) | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-07-24 | Current topic: oS
<oSoMoN> hey
<oSoMoN> â¢ chromium
<oSoMoN>   â working on content snap for chromium-ffmpeg-extras (https://trello.com/c/iOMMKdy7/52-snap-that-provides-a-content-interface-for-chromium-ffmpeg-extras)
<oSoMoN>   â updated beta to 68.0.3440.68
<oSoMoN>   â updating dev to 69.0.3493.3
<oSoMoN> â¢ libreoffice
<oSoMoN>   â fixed https://github.com/ubuntu/gtk-communitheme/issues/350 (theming with communitytheme)
<oSoMoN>   â promoted 6.0.5.2 snap to stable channel
<oSoMoN>   â pushed 6.0.6.1 snap to the candidate channel and issued call for testing (https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/call-for-testing-libreoffice-6-0-6/6468)
<oSoMoN>   â pushed 6.1.0.1 snap to the beta channel, then updated to 6.1.0.2
<oSoMoN>   â uploaded 6.0.6~rc1 to cosmic-proposed and updated hint to ignore i386 autopkgtest failure (https://code.launchpad.net/~osomon/britney/hints-ubuntu-libreoffice/+merge/350721)
<oSoMoN> â¢ snaps
<oSoMoN>   â gnome-software: added logic to hide Updates tab when we're not on Ubuntu and exposing only the snap backend: https://gitlab.gnome.org/Community/Ubuntu/gnome-software/commit/50e0cfeb1e3529b6e5c04820ddffa64754312ac5
<oSoMoN> ð¥
<willcooke> thanks oSoMoN
<willcooke> #topic seb128
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/3VYBPFaR/ubuntu-desktop-1810-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | <sarnold> I think the -t is mostly considered a feature :) | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-07-24 | Current topic: se
<seb128> â¢ one day off (friday swap for GUADEC over the w.e)
<seb128> â¢ sponsored g-s segfault fix from andyroc_k to cosmic&bionic - https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-software/+bug/1781996
<seb128> â¢ reviewed notes from MontrÃ©al & GUADEC conference report
<seb128> â¢ some cosmic updates (gnome-keyring, alsa-plugins)
<seb128> â¢ spent some time playing with/learning the workflow of the new git packaging
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1781996 in gnome-software (Ubuntu) "/usr/bin/gnome-software:11:g_date_time_to_instant:g_date_time_to_unix:gs_plugin_refine_app:gs_plugin_loader_call_vfunc:gs_plugin_loader_run_refine_filter" [Medium,Fix released]
<seb128> â¢ verified some bonic SRUs for .1
<seb128> â¢ opened a MIR for sshfs which is a depends of gs-connect
<seb128> </week>
<willcooke> thanks seb128
<willcooke> #topic tkamppeter
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/3VYBPFaR/ubuntu-desktop-1810-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | <sarnold> I think the -t is mostly considered a feature :) | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-07-24 | Current topic: tk
<willcooke> #topic Trevinho
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/3VYBPFaR/ubuntu-desktop-1810-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | <sarnold> I think the -t is mostly considered a feature :) | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-07-24 | Current topic: Tr
<Trevinho> Â· Nautilus:
<Trevinho>   - Prepared upstream release 3.26.4:
<Trevinho>     - https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/nautilus/merge_requests/269
<Trevinho>   - Proposed to salsa 3.26.4:
<Trevinho>     https://salsa.debian.org/gnome-team/nautilus/merge_requests/2
<Trevinho>     https://salsa.debian.org/gnome-team/nautilus/merge_requests/3
<Trevinho>   - Prepared 3.26.4 (3.26.3.1 first) for Ubuntu:
<Trevinho>     cosmic, https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell/+git/gnome-shell/+ref/ubuntu/master
<Trevinho>     bionic, https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell/+git/gnome-shell/+merge/349984
<Trevinho>   - Continued fixes for bug #1767027 upstream
<Trevinho>     https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/nautilus/merge_requests/249
<ubot5> bug 1767027 in nautilus (Ubuntu Bionic) "Search current folder only in nautilus doesn't work (Ubuntu 18.04)" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1767027
<Trevinho>   - Doing debugging work to fix https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/bionic/+source/nautilus/+bug/1756826
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1756826 in nautilus (Ubuntu Bionic) "hangs when locate search provider matches a lot of files" [High,Triaged]
<gitlab-bot> GNOME issue (Merge request) 269 in nautilus "Prepare gnome-3-26 branch for 3.26.4 release" (comments: 2) [Merged]
<gitlab-bot> GNOME issue (Merge request) 2 in nautilus "Add nautilus 3.26.4 to pristine-tar" (comments: 0) [Merged]
<gitlab-bot> GNOME issue (Merge request) 3 in nautilus "Update upstream/3.26.x with 3.26.4" (comments: 0) [Merged]
<gitlab-bot> GNOME issue (Merge request) 249 in nautilus "Recursive query flags" (comments: 48) [3. Review Ready, Opened]
<Trevinho> Â· Mutter, prepared 3.28.3:
<Trevinho>   - https://salsa.debian.org/gnome-team/mutter/merge_requests/5
<Trevinho> Â· GNOME Shell, prepared 3.28.3 (with patch refreshes):
<Trevinho>   - debian, https://salsa.debian.org/gnome-team/gnome-shell/merge_requests/2
<Trevinho>   - cosmic, https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell/+git/gnome-shell/+ref/ubuntu/master
<Trevinho>   - bionic, https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell/+git/gnome-shell/+merge/349984
<Trevinho>   - Updates to https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-shell/merge_requests/8#note_267751 (now merged!)
<Trevinho> ðªð¸
<gitlab-bot> GNOME issue (Merge request) 5 in mutter "Update upstream/latest" (comments: 0) [Merged]
<gitlab-bot> GNOME issue (Merge request) 2 in gnome-shell "New upstream release 3.28.3" (comments: 0) [Merged]
<gitlab-bot> GNOME issue (Merge request) 8 in gnome-shell "Repositioned window in activities" (comments: 17) [1. Bug, Merged]
<willcooke> thanks Trevinho
<willcooke> #topic rls-bugs
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/3VYBPFaR/ubuntu-desktop-1810-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | <sarnold> I think the -t is mostly considered a feature :) | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-07-24 | Current topic: rl
<willcooke> I'm unprepared for this section, as usual
<seb128> haha
<willcooke> looking at rls-bb
<seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-bb-incoming-bug-tasks.html has 1 new bug
<seb128> which we discussed there some days ago and needs an assigne
<willcooke> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-software/+bug/1775226
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1775226 in gnome-software (Ubuntu) "Gnome Software offers installation of updates on shutdown independently from update-manager and unattended-upgrades" [High,New]
<willcooke> that one?
<seb128> yes
<kenvandine> yeah
<willcooke> kenvandine, can Robert take a look?  Would probably be quickest
<willcooke> except he's on hols
<seb128> basically rbalin_t find the trigger, clicking on "refresh" in g-s triggers offline updates
<willcooke> oh, back tomorrow
<kenvandine> willcooke, yeah... or oSoMoN
<seb128> no, he's away autoresponder said 31st no?
<seb128> still one week?
<kenvandine> he should be back tomorrow
 * willcooke checks the HR system
<seb128> ah ok, maybe I remember wrongly
<oSoMoN> I can have a look
<willcooke> (btw, emailed them about getting an ical feature.  It's on their backlog)
<willcooke> oki, thanks oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> once I'm done with chromium ffmpeg content snap
<kenvandine> oSoMoN, yeah... might be a good way to get started :)
<willcooke> assigned it
<seb128> willcooke, good news!
<seb128> oSoMoN, thx
<willcooke> (my shell has crashed, bear with me)
<seb128> willcooke, kenvandine, HR has robert off until friday included
<kenvandine> i was just checking that :)
<seb128> which matches his email autorespond
<willcooke> cc looks clear
<willcooke> anyone got any other bugs / lists of bugs to talk about?
<kenvandine> ok, oh i think he extended that and we never updated the calendar
<seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-cc-incoming-bug-tasks.html
<seb128> same 1 bug there
<willcooke> yeah
<Laney> that's probably a return TRUE in the plugin somewhere
<Laney> like the other one I added
 * Laney hints
<seb128> oSoMoN, ^
<Laney> :-)
<willcooke> :)
<willcooke> k, moving on to...
<oSoMoN> ack
<willcooke> #AOB
<willcooke> #topic AOB
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/3VYBPFaR/ubuntu-desktop-1810-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | <sarnold> I think the -t is mostly considered a feature :) | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-07-24 | Current topic: AO
<willcooke> anyone got anything to share?
<seb128> L_aney pointed out that now would be a good time to get going with updating GNOME to 3.29
<seb128> would be nice if we did it as a team effort
<kenvandine> +1
<andyrock> happy to help
<Beret> hi
<didrocks> agreed, however, unsure we have scheduled enough slots for everyone to deal with it, but let's see :)
<seb128> those who want to join please do, use IRC & version and open bugs for updates so we don't duplicate work
<Beret> does the desktop installer support RAID at all these days?
<Beret> I want to install a machine with software RAID and FDE
<willcooke> Beret, two secs..
<Beret> hah
<seb128> Beret, we are in a meeting atm
<willcooke> I thought you were going to ask in the other channel :D
<Beret> oh
<Beret> you're all in a meeting
<willcooke> nearly finished
<Beret> I was trying to save will from my ping
<Beret> take your time
<Beret> this is obviously not urgent
<Beret> my shiney NUC is awaiting its new softwrae load
<seb128> k, so yeah, let's update GNOME
<willcooke> k, so seb128 can you lead the co-ordination of the upgrade
<seb128> :)
<seb128> yes
<willcooke> woot
<willcooke> anyone got anything else?
<seb128> also good time to start using the new workflow
<willcooke> +1
<willcooke> MOAR Trello
<seb128> since we have git branches for quite some components now
<seb128> haha
<willcooke> ;)
<kenvandine> oh yeah...
<seb128> it's documented on http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-bb-tracking-bug-tasks.html
<seb128> ups
<seb128> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/git
<Laney> yes, do people feel like we have a handle on the rls tracking bugs?
<willcooke> will be nice to see if we can iron out all the git process issues
<Laney> I think it was considered fake news last time I raised this
<Laney> but...
<Laney> seems to me like there's things which sit there from week to week
<seb128> I'm happy to have another look to the current list, like I did the first time that was raised
<seb128> my gut feeling is that we have an handle on the important issues
<seb128> but we are not that good at getting some of the things that don't look important off the list
<willcooke> I think the list itself is in good shape.  The problem we have is when there is something that we don't know what to do about right away we skip it for a week.  We need to be better at assigning an owner who can look at it outside of the meeting when times is
<willcooke> time isn't as pressured
<seb128> or some of the things we keep dismissing and having to come back to
<Laney> not to pick on any one person
<Laney> but https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell/+bug/1758035
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1758035 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu Bionic) "[regression] gnome-shell crashed with SIGTRAP in g_realloc_n() from g_log_structured()" [High,Confirmed]
<Laney> this is on theh list and didn't see an update for ages
<seb128> right, it should probably be off the list
<Laney> this is what I'm raising
<Laney> if the list is things to work on
<seb128> it's one of those which we keep skipping over because that's not really one we can act on
<Laney> then it should be kept that way imho
<seb128> right & agreed
<seb128> we should probably just be more agressive to remove those
<seb128> and maybe create trello cards in backlog in exchange
<seb128> the reason we have that one (and some others) still tagged is that some team members argue it's important we keep an eye on the issue
<seb128> but yeah, rls-nn is probably the wrong way to do it
<Laney> to me the point of that list was things that were going to be worked on to a resolution
<seb128> yes
<seb128> the issue is that we believe some of the items ought to be driven to a resolution but we don't have the manpower at the time we review the list to do something about them
<seb128> so they never get properly handled / stay on the backlog
<seb128> I'm unsure what's the best way to deal with that
<willcooke> seb128, perhaps we should have a section in our managers meeting to check on the progress of things which were flagged as needing work but dont have anyone to do it
<willcooke> that's likely to use a lot of time up though, but it needs to be done
<willcooke> or, as you say, a Trello list
<Laney> everything in that list is meant to be assigned when it is put there (by us), or when we notice it at a weekly meeting
<seb128> yeah, I think my preference would be to get those that needs investigation in the trello backlog
<seb128> but it's moving from one backlog list to another one
<Laney> the issue is that the meeting is what? too rushed to consider it properly?
<seb128> so I'm unsure it's solving anything
<willcooke> Laney, yeah, feels too rushed
<seb128> also we don't have the whole team
<seb128> often assigning things to e.g robert_ancell or duflu doesn't have the outcome we want
<Laney> right
<willcooke> If part of the problem is that people need chasing more, that's easily addressed
<Laney> sort of confused to be honest why assigning work to people doesn't result in the work getting done
<Laney> but I probably don't understand properly the problem
<Laney> s/bad english/good english/
<seb128> well, that's another issue
<seb128> I discussed a bit that at GUADEC with Robert, his view was that it's difficult to keep track of things when they are not at the same place
<seb128> like he uses the trello board but doesn't keep up with launchpad
<seb128> so he said he would prefer to have those as trello cards
<kenvandine> so getting cards for those should help
<kenvandine> at least for him
<seb128> yeah
<seb128> but we can't flex for each individual preference
<Laney> facepalm
<seb128> we can also decide that people who don't deal with their assigned bugs needs to be reminded to
<seb128> anyway, that starts being a management's discussion and probably an issue we need to resolve but not here/now
<Laney> like, fix your filters so you see assigned bugs
<Laney> would be my preference
<seb128> yeah
<didrocks> (agreed)
<seb128> so going back to the topic
<seb128> I would suggest to not assign to people who didn't agree to during the meeting
<seb128> in case we don't know what to do, let's add an action item for the most-appropriate-manager to find an assignee by the next meeting
<seb128> and review those actions in the next meeting
<kenvandine> yeah
<willcooke> +1 sounds like a good step forward
<willcooke> then we at least get an owner between now and the next meeting
<seb128> Laney, let's try that + make clear cut on the items rather than skip when we don't know waht to do
<seb128> and see how it goes?
<seb128> k, I think we are done with this topic
<seb128> other topic?
<willcooke> #topic tkamppeter
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/3VYBPFaR/ubuntu-desktop-1810-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | <sarnold> I think the -t is mostly considered a feature :) | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-07-24 | Current topic: tk
<willcooke> - ippusbxd: Release of version 1.33, containing changes contributed by Google's Chrome OS printing guru David Valleau, for more robust operation and compatibility with more printer manufacturers/models.
<willcooke> - cups-browsed: Investigating crash bug on manual definition of printer clusters.
<willcooke> - Google Summer of Code 2018: Mentoring of the students on Common Print Dialog Backends and printer auto-selection by job. Especially gave ideas to the students on point where they got stuck.
<willcooke> - Upgraded main laptop to Cosmic.
<willcooke> - Bugs.
<willcooke> #topic AOB
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/3VYBPFaR/ubuntu-desktop-1810-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | <sarnold> I think the -t is mostly considered a feature :) | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-07-24 | Current topic: AO
<Laney> that would be good, but I'm still worried about activity once things are assigned
<Laney> maybe that's not my problem
<Laney> what is this quote cutting off the meeting bot :-)
<seb128> right, that's probably something we need to keep an eye on
* Laney changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/3VYBPFaR/ubuntu-desktop-1810-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-07-24 | Current topic: AOB
<seb128> that doesn't work
<seb128> the bot is going to put it back next time it changes the topic :p
<willcooke> Right, lets wrap up and see how we get on next week
<willcooke> thanks all
<willcooke> #endmeeting
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/3VYBPFaR/ubuntu-desktop-1810-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | <sarnold> I think the -t is mostly considered a feature :)
<meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Jul 24 14:09:04 2018 UTC.
<meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2018/ubuntu-desktop.2018-07-24-13.30.moin.txt
<didrocks> thx!
 * Laney holds breath
<seb128> right
<Laney> DAMN IT
<seb128> thx
<seb128> see :)
<willcooke> :D
* Laney changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/3VYBPFaR/ubuntu-desktop-1810-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help
<seb128> hehe
<Laney> sorry I'm sure it was funny :P
<willcooke> :)
<seb128> we should probably remove the other 2 quotes
<seb128> unsure how it looks like for new comers
<seb128> it's a bit weird
<willcooke> thanks for caring about this stuff Laney (bugs)
<didrocks> short titles ftw!
<Laney> Home of the No Fun Desktop Team
<Laney> ;-)
<oSoMoN> or configure the bot to override the topic during the meeting, instead of appending to it?
<seb128> lol
<Laney> np willcooke
<willcooke> speaking of no fun, Beret - you want to do software RAID?
<willcooke> ;DD
<oSoMoN> :)
<Beret> hah
<Beret> yes, I bought a machine and put two NVMe SSDs in it
<Beret> I want to do software RAID 1 and FDE
<Laney> the main reason for me to care is that it's annoying when there is no way to get things worked on other than pinging
<Beret> it doesn't look like RAID is in the desktop installer these days
 * Laney stares at the "track rls bugs" card in trello
<Laney> bbbbbrrrrbbbb
<willcooke> Beret, I think LVM used to take care of that, but haven't looked for a while.  jibel - have you looked at LVM doing software raid?
<willcooke> also maybe xnox knows (software raid in the desktop installer)
<seb128> https://askubuntu.com/questions/505446/how-to-install-ubuntu-14-04-with-raid-1-using-desktop-installer
<Beret> my tentative plan was to boot the server installer, setup the RAID device, then boot the desktop installer and see if I could pikc that as a target
<Beret> seb128, thanks
<Beret> interesting that the last comment on there recommends going the server route
<didrocks> well, if you don't want to do the chroot, it's indeed easier
<didrocks> however, you will have server + desktop components installed
<didrocks> and thanks god for mdadm --assemble compared to the old way of manually declaring all of this :)
<willcooke> didrocks, sounds like a good usecase for installer+1 ;)
<Beret> agreed
<didrocks> willcooke: depends on what we are asked for it. But yeah
<didrocks> automated RAID has a lot of complex use case
<Beret> though tbh, I can't imagine many people would use it
<didrocks> like here, it's doing the "let's have 2 grubs"
<Beret> I myself haven't done desktop + RAID in years
 * didrocks has only done server on RAID
<Beret> right
<willcooke> same. When I had 3 1TB drives I did it
<didrocks> for desktop, I rely on backup instead of RAID1
<willcooke> and lot data because of it
<willcooke> *lost
<Beret> I only did it in the case of a server that I turned into a desktop
<didrocks> and RAID1 < backups, before if you remove a file, it's lost
<jibel> install the desktop task (ubuntu-desktop^) not the meta package
<jibel> on top of a server installation
<didrocks> and the gain perf from it, for a desktopâ¦ ~average
<Beret> you're doing a great job of talking me out of a non-existing feature of the desktop installer
<Beret> pretty sure you get extra credit for that
<willcooke> good work team
<jibel> same I've a standard disk setup for on the desktop and a NAS with RAID that syncs my home dir for backup
<didrocks> I explain probably why it's not implemented :) Not a lot of gain going RAID for desktop :p
<willcooke> IMO, create a normal boot partition and then stick, say, /home on a software raid
<willcooke> dont boot from s/w raid
<Beret> ok
<Beret> you win
<Beret> I think I'm going to a normal fde deskopt install on the first disk, and a dedicated zpool disk on the second for containers
<Beret> and stick to my NAS backup
<didrocks> Beret: we can still discuss it if/when we do a new installer thingy, and do a + / - comparison to see if there is a real use case. Would be great to collect regular data on this though
<Beret> yeah
<didrocks> Beret: yeah, sounds like a better setup to me
<Beret> I'd be surprised if there were enough consumers of such a solution to warrant building it
<didrocks> yeah
<jibel> it's also cheaper. You can use a fast SSD on your desktop and cheap rotational drives on your NAS with lot of space for backups. Instead of several SSDs with wasted space on your desktop for the RAID array
<ricotz> oSoMoN, I have copied 6.1.0~rc2 to -prereleases ppa
<oSoMoN> ricotz, ack, thanks
<ricotz> I have some local changes which are not worth another rebuild
<seb128> andyrock, is the pr I added to https://trello.com/c/tPfrSALh/147-fix-auto-repeated-bindings-for-g-s-d-too right or is that a different work?
<andyrock> seb128: I already got this https://trello.com/c/caeUuKkH/148-media-keys-some-shortcuts-should-ignore-auto-repeat-key-events
<seb128> andyrock, are those duplicates card? if so feel free to archive 147
<andyrock> seb128: done
<seb128> thx
<andyrock> I've one card for gnome-shell and one for g-s-d
<seb128> k
<xnox> Beret, server installer + install ubuntu-desktop should work; if your nvme/machines is fancy, you may be able to setup intel matrix raid using preos/uefi screens - then i think that could work even with desktop installer.
<ricotz> are language-support-translations-* packages/references are still a thing?
 * Laney is about to push a mass update to remove the content of many of the packaging bzr repos
<Laney> DONE
<Laney> LONG LIVE BZR
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-07-25
<infinity> Someone needs to have a look at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell/+bug/1783363
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1783363 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu) "Use of activities in GNOME Shell 3.28.3 prohibits applications from being displayed" [Critical,Confirmed]
<infinity> It's pretty murderously awful.
<infinity> Trevinho: ^
<Trevinho> infinity: fixed already
<infinity> Oh?
<infinity> Trevinho: Not in the archive, it's not. :P
<Trevinho> infinity: no, i know :P
<Trevinho> https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell/+git/gnome-shell/+merge/350754
<Trevinho> let me add the bug in the changelog now though
<infinity> Man, I'd forgotten this was all in js.
<infinity> Kinda makes me regret eating.
<Trevinho> :)
<duflu> Morning Trevinho. I shouldn't be saying morning in my morning
<Trevinho> hi duflu
<Trevinho> well, still night here :)
<duflu> It was also night here just over 2 hours ago
<infinity> Trevinho: Anyhow, not going to suggest that you should work into the middle of the night or anything, but please do pass the baton on that and make sure it's uploaded "soon".  We have lots of real users of cosmic (not the least of which are half of Canonical's engineers), and that bug is amazingly awful for anyone who happens to log out in the window where they're exposed. :P
<infinity> I know I regret rebooting today. :)
<Trevinho> infinity: well, I whish I could do that, but I'm not in ~ubuntu-desktop.... thus, I can't
<infinity> (And yes, downgrading to the previous version works, at least)
<Trevinho> I should really apply for that one day :)
<infinity> Trevinho: Oh.  I can sponsor it for you, but I'm hardly in a position to actually review the mess of a diff.
<infinity> And I'm not generally keen on blind sponsorship.
<infinity> Get a +1 from someone else who also can't upload? :P
<Trevinho> infinity: well, using gbp pq import you can have a nicer diff and then compare against previous origin/ubuntu/master
<infinity> Trevinho: Oh, I didn't mean the diff was too messy to read, I meant the context is pretty much meaningless to me.
<Trevinho> ah, ok... I thought the diff of a diff thing :)
<Trevinho> well, laney will do it tomorrow morning if anyone can't do it now
<infinity> Nah, diffs of patches are something my twisted mind understands fine.
<Trevinho> duflu: if you can test that, maybe?
<duflu> Trevinho, I have no idea what you're talking about
<Trevinho> infinity: or well, just a run-and check in this case is quite enough though
<Trevinho> duflu: https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell/+git/gnome-shell/+merge/350754
<duflu> Trevinho, I feel like I know those bugs so can test it. Not so familiar with the code
<Trevinho> duflu: well, it's mostly just a refresh of the patch against the proposed changes upstream, we had some leftovers in the previous git rebase, thus the mess :)
<duflu> Trevinho, yes I can test that branch today. You can sleep
<duflu> I think I know what bugs those are
<Trevinho> duflu: ta, for thesting those patches, are you familiar with gbp?
<duflu> Not unless that's a typo
<infinity> git-buildpackage
<Trevinho> you only have to add that remote, switch to my ubuntu/master branch, gbp pq import and you're on the patches
<infinity> But in this case, since the patches are all to .js files, unless there's post-processing in the build system, you might be able to just drop them in place on a system and see the magic?
<duflu> Yeah I build gnome-shell every day. I'll just do it however I feel
<infinity> I mean, after unpacking/patching the source package with that branch.
<infinity> Anyhow, I'll go away now.  Just wanted to make sure this was being dealt with after the mild annoyance (read: furious anger) that was my afternoon. :P
<infinity> I'm calmer now. :)
<Trevinho> git remote add 3v1n0 lp:~3v1n0/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell; git fetch 3v1n0; git checkout -b 3v1n0/ubuntu/master 3v1n0/ubuntu/master; gbp pq import and then just run as you're used too
<Trevinho> duflu: ^
<duflu> Oh I can get a 3v1n0 via the git protocol now
<infinity> Trevinho: Side note, you'd be amazed how hard it is to avoid pressing a button on your keyboard even when you know that button will destroy your session and force you to log out.
<Trevinho> well you can name it also just marco if you want to type it easier :-D
<duflu> Yeah I'll get to it. Will feel better if I can clear out the email first
<Trevinho> infinity: hehe :)
<Trevinho> I'm pretty sure I know...
<duflu> Trevinho, mostly I'm impressed you got upstream to give you feedback, eventually
<Trevinho> duflu: you know... GUADEC, beers, night-swimming:.. :-D
<duflu> Trevinho, I heard a little more at lunch with James
<Trevinho> duflu: and also Florian has probably more time to dedicate to that :)
<infinity> Reminds me of when we had that "Ctrl-C in chroots murders the world" bug, but Ctrl-C is how I've cleared the shell cmdline for the last 25 years or so.  You can't re-learn that.
<Trevinho> Yeah, true...
<sarnold> infinity: ^W in firefox. every few days I lose a tab. :(
<Trevinho> however, Ctrl+W is something for example is always destroying... But I use it in the shell to delete the word, while in nano is to save or in UI to close a window...
<Trevinho> sarnold: yeah, you see what I mean then :)(
<hyperair> sarnold: every few days? i do that a few times while commenting on a github PR
<sarnold> Trevinho: yeah. the word is most definitely *gone*, no doubt about that. :) but so is everything else on the page... hehe
<duflu> Oh how convenient. That bug is in my email shortlist too
<Trevinho> yep :P
<Trevinho> duflu: however, I've not updated everything the patch completely as per upstream, just made things work for now
<duflu> Trevinho, I'm happy to see gnome-shell!8 got somewhere :)
 * duflu doesn't want to ask upstream to "hurry up" on anything because that could cause an avalanche
<duflu> Too many snow peaks to maintain
<Trevinho> yeah, things are coming, need to talk more with upstream, and be more upstream too :)
<duflu> Trevinho, both bug 1719408 and bug 1653153 share the same upstream link. Is it possible to merge them?
<ubot5> bug 1719408 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu) "Application window outside of its frame in spread mode" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1719408
<ubot5> bug 1653153 in GNOME Shell "Windows not always drawn in correct places in AO when under Wayland" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1653153
<Trevinho> yeah, indeed
<Trevinho> since one is fixed, mark 1719408 as duplicate of the other
<duflu> Trevinho, thanks too! That spew of errors from gnome-shell was driving me crazy (when building upstream code, not Ubuntu)\
<didrocks> good morning
<tsimonq2> Heya didrocks
<didrocks> hey tsimonq2
<duflu> Morning didrocks, tsimonq2
<tsimonq2> Hey duflu
<didrocks> hey duflu
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<duflu> Hi oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> hi duflu
<tsimonq2> Heya oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> hey tsimonq2
<didrocks> salut oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> salut didrocks
<duflu> didrocks, do you have the power to push this through? https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell/+git/gnome-shell/+merge/350754
<didrocks> duflu: "push this through" == pushing to the ~ubuntu-desktop master branch. Do you want an upload to cosmic as well or should we wait?
<duflu> didrocks, it's already a critical regression so my gut tells me we need to upload ASAP
<didrocks> duflu: well, cosmic is a dev branch
<duflu> Yeah but enough people are using it as their desktop to notice
<didrocks> but I can push it
<duflu> Marco worked hard on it. He was still awake when I logged in
<didrocks> if launchpad doesn't hang on my git pull :/
<didrocks> 1024 bytes/s
<duflu> Welcome to the future future future
<didrocks> still stuck, got 20.00 KiB
<didrocks> ah 36 now
 * duflu imagines dialup modem sounds
<didrocks> heh, exactly :)
<didrocks> sounds a new trend between GNOME gitlab and launchpad ;)
<didrocks> like*
<didrocks> duflu: anyway, I'll merge it and sponsor it
<didrocks> (cosmic)
<duflu> Thanks didrocks
<didrocks> yw
<seb128> good morning didrocksos duflu
<duflu> Hi seb128
<didrocks> hey seb128
<seb128> duflu, was that bug impacting every user? or is it random/config dependent?
<duflu> seb128, seems to be consistent, but only after you have an app/window open
<seb128> duflu, said differently, how come such regressions are not noticed during pre-upload testing
<duflu> Cosmic only
<seb128> our testplan seems week
<seb128> weak
<duflu> seb128, I don't know. I wasn't involved in that upload and am not familiar with the testing it received
<seb128> Trevinho, ^
<seb128> also is the issue Ubuntu specific?
<seb128> or is upstream sucking as much as we do at testing their releases?
<duflu> seb128, yes it was a bad mixture of pre-existing (good) Ubuntu patches and the new upstream release. Only affecting Ubuntu I think.
<seb128> k
<Laney> what's up
<didrocks> hey Laney
<duflu> Morning Laney
<seb128> hey Laney,how are you?
<Laney> hey seb128
<Laney> good
<oSoMoN> good morning laney
<Laney> moin oSoMoN & duflu & didrocks too
<didrocks> $ git push lp:~ubuntu-desktop/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell ubuntu/master --tags
<didrocks> Everything up-to-date
<didrocks> head is at 1d1e6b4d8727a90c139cfa80b21e6ece1c727bb0
<didrocks> https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell/+git/gnome-shell/+ref/ubuntu/master doesn't seem to have updated though
 * didrocks puzzled
<Laney> it's sometimes a bit slow
<didrocks> ok, pushed it like 5 minutes ago
<duflu> Hmm. That suggests the commit was older than HEAD
<didrocks> didn't see it updated, hence doing the explicit command to check it was fine :)
<didrocks> duflu: it's not
<seb128> it usually has a yellow "updating" note though when that's pending refresh?
<duflu> No worries. Thanks didrocks
<Laney> on this page https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell/+git/gnome-shell/, yes
<didrocks> ah, on the repo page
<didrocks> thanks Laney! Let's wait
<Laney> the browse page is instant
<didrocks> ah indeed https://git.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell/
<didrocks> ok, let's wait for launchpad to update, close automatically the MPâ¦
<duflu> Morning willcooke
<willcooke> hi duflu
<willcooke> darn jetlag is killing me this week for some reason
<didrocks> willcooke: mind having a look and maybe a PR for english typo fixes? https://github.com/ubuntu/yaru/blob/master/debian/control#L15
<willcooke> didrocks, looking
<Trevinho> Morning seb128
<seb128> hey Trevinho, how are you?
<Trevinho> Yes it was for everybody... A merge issue on JS
<Trevinho> seb128: good, yes... You?
<seb128> Trevinho, I'm good, thanks! It's a bit less hot today which is nice
<didrocks> "less", lucky you!
<didrocks> 27.7 inside already :(
<Laney> :<
<willcooke> didrocks, some very minor changes: https://github.com/ubuntu/yaru/pull/651
<gitlab-bot> ubuntu issue (Pull request) 651 in yaru "Update control" (comments: 0) [Open]
<didrocks> willcooke: thanks a lot! I need to check you didn't pass over the treshold and created lintian warnings :)
<didrocks> willcooke: so, "shaped by" is correct english?
<willcooke> yeah, wfm
<didrocks> good! no new lintian warning, let me merge and upload to cosmic
<didrocks> seb128: FYI ^
<seb128> good job!
<didrocks> and uploaded, in NEW in few minutes
<Laney> :3
<tsimonq2> Could anyone please take a look at my MP? https://code.launchpad.net/~tsimonq2/software-properties/port-away-from-kde/+merge/349592
<seb128> tsimonq2, try with foundations / bdmurray, we don't maintain software-properties
<tsimonq2> seb128: ack, thanks.
<seb128> yw!
<Laney> LET'S DO AN UPDATEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
<Laney> YEAH I LOVE UPDATES
<seb128> :)
<tsimonq2> Laney: Did somebody say... UUUUUUUUUUPPPPPPPPPPDDDDDDDDDDAAAAAAAAAATTTTTTTTTTEEEEEEEEEESSSSSSSSSS?!?
<willcooke> 16.
<willcooke> erm
<willcooke> 16.04 -> 18.04 upgrade worked.
<willcooke> Snaps installed
<willcooke> woo
<willcooke> There is a UX issue when it's installing the snaps though, it sits there for ages seemingly doing nothing, but it is installing the snaps.  jibel is seeing if that can be improved
<didrocks> willcooke: mind checking your ubuntu-report content btw?
<willcooke> didrocks, roger
<willcooke> I checked it very quickly at log in and it looked fine
<willcooke> but lemme share it
<didrocks> interested in some particular section which should have additional info as an upgrader
<willcooke> didrocks, can you remind me where the file is?
<didrocks> willcooke: should be ~/.cache/ubuntu-report/ubuntu.18.04
<jibel> didrocks, I did and it's fine
<didrocks> nice, thanks jibel!
<willcooke> https://pastebin.com/2e5wFxLH
<didrocks> good, you have latest version, as expected, with additional CPU & screen size info
<didrocks> and the "Upgrade" section is as expected :)
<didrocks> ah, you used do-release-upgrade, not the GUI? ;)
<didrocks> (and 50 minutes for the upgrade, not bad)
<willcooke> didrocks, yeah did cli and jibel did gui
<jibel> didrocks, about ubuntu-report, there is one case that generate weird reports it's netboot installation. This is the result http://paste.ubuntu.com/p/N9QZzSYSsg/
<didrocks> jibel: because of BIOS version or anything else?
<jibel> didrocks, because there is no install or upgrade section
<jibel> didrocks, it's still be interesting to know it's a fresh installation even if the data from ubiquity is not there
<didrocks> yeah, does it starts ubiquity is some weird mode with no /target/ ?
<jibel> didrocks, no netboot is d-i. Ubiquity is not involved at all
<didrocks> ah, well, that's expected then
<didrocks> remember that initial plan before I moved that to the session requested was to have everything sent by ubiquity, meaning that even those data would have never been send, it's still a thing
<jibel> yes, but it'd be nice to know it's a d-i installation
<didrocks> maybe get it added to the trello board ? Doesn't sound like a small change
<jibel> k, will do
<didrocks> thx
<ricotz> hi, are language-support-translations-* packages/references still a thing?
<Laney> ricotz: not sure what that is personally, some langpack thing?
<ricotz> Laney, e.g. https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/language-support-translations-en/+bugs?field.status:list=NEW
<Laney> still dunno what it is
<ricotz> https://code.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/language-support-translations-en
<ricotz> I guess those are some ancient metapackages?
<ricotz> https://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/trusty/language-support-translations-en/trusty/view/head:/debian/control
<Laney> if you press overview you can see that that package has been removed
<ricotz> ah I see
<Laney> so whatever it was, I guess it's not being used any more
<ricotz> libreoffice packaging still contains some references to it, so I guess those can be dropped
<Laney> yeh, probably
<didrocks> seb128: when you have time, do you mind subscribing desktop-packages to yaru-theme?
<didrocks> (or whatever is the expected "right" team)
<seb128> done
<didrocks> thx!
<seb128> np!
 * didrocks waits for binNEW before subscribing the team
<Laney> seb128: can we make versions track 3.29 somehow?
<jetsaredim> is there any way to set the dns server priority between two different network interfaces with systemd-resolved?
<seb128> Laney, sure, let me do that
<Laney> nice
<Laney> Trevinho: don't know if you have some time, but I just pushed gnome-shell 3.29.4 to debian experimental, would be nice if you could merge that into ubuntu/master
<Laney> too much delta in our package that I don't understand
<Laney> and mutter of course, but we have no ubuntu changes there :>
<Trevinho> Laney: yeah, I actually did the merge with previous version some time ago
<Trevinho> so I can take it back, but I prefer to go back a bit more into upstream code now :), so I'll do it but in next weeks
<Trevinho> [before ff]
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-07-26
<didrocks> good morning
<jibel> Good morning
<jibel> salut didrocks
<didrocks> salut jibel, Ã§a va ?
<jibel> didrocks, Ã§a va bien et toi?
<didrocks> Ã  la fraiche, Ã§a va :)
<jibel> didrocks, Ã§a va pas durer, apparemment il va faire chaud chez toi
<didrocks> ouais, "Ã  la fraiche" est relatif, j'ai ouvert Ã  6h20 et il fait encore 27.6Â°C Ã  l'intÃ©rieurâ¦
<didrocks> en plus, vu qu'on fait refaire toute la toiture, le revÃªtement en dessous est noir sur les toits terrasses
<didrocks> Ã§a ne doit pas aider
<duflu> Morning didrocks, jibel, pitti
<jibel> Morning duflu
<jibel> didrocks, I installed yaru-theme-gnome-shell but the theme of the shell didn't change, is there anything else to update?
<didrocks> hey duflu
<didrocks> jibel: yeah, you need all those changes: bug #1783571
<ubot5> bug 1783571 in yaru-theme (Ubuntu) "Set Yaru as default" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1783571
<didrocks> but for them to be done, we need the MIR to be acked
<didrocks> (I'm running all those branches locally to test them, works)
<didrocks> jibel: if you want to temper your system, just modify /usr/share/gnome-shell/modes/ubuntu.json and change to "stylesheetName": "Yaru/gnome-shell.css"
<didrocks> jibel: then, alt + f2 and "rt"
<didrocks> and for gdm: change the gdm3.css alternative manually to point to: /etc/alternatives/gdm3.css -> /usr/share/gnome-shell/theme/Yaru/gnome-shell.css
<jibel> didrocks, new theme \o/ Thanks!
<didrocks> jibel: yw! :-)
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<didrocks> salut oSoMoN, Ã§a va ?
<oSoMoN> salut didrocks, Ã§a va bien, et toi?
<didrocks> oSoMoN: chaudement, mais Ã§a va :)
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<didrocks> salut seb128
<seb128> lut didrocks
<seb128> didrocks, Trevinho, jibel, you still have cards on the bionic trello board, could you review them and move to the cosmic board/archive/wontfix as fit?
<didrocks> seb128: sure
<seb128> thx
<seb128> didrocks, the one you have in review about the volume cna probably archived since I think the new board already has a card for that
<didrocks> yeah, will have a look
<seb128> thx
<jibel> seb128, done
<duflu> Morning seb128
<duflu> Oh I was just thinking about those cards this morning
<seb128> hey duflu, how are you?
<seb128> duflu, how so? why do you still care about the old board? ;)
<duflu> seb128, I'm well. Got some artistic therapy today (https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/mutter/merge_requests/168). You?
<gitlab-bot> GNOME issue (Merge request) 168 in mutter "clutter: Disable event throttling and deferral [performance]" (comments: 27) [Performance, Opened]
<duflu> I care because the project plan never leaves my brain. It's always there even away from work
<duflu> Same goes for source code
<seb128> I'm good!
<duflu> Also, no rain today (unless you count pre-dawn)
<didrocks> now that we have Yaru, a reminder to everyone (unsure how we can do that) to whoever update GNOME Shell with styles changes that they need to take care about Yaru as well (3 way merge, we have an upstream/ directory)
<seb128> didrocks, I'm not sure what that means but I'm also not likely to be updating gnome-shell ... might be worth documenting somewhere though? (maybe debian/README.Ubuntu?)
<seb128> Laney, Trevinho, ^ you are probably the ones likely to update gnome-shell
<seb128> oSoMoN, ^ or maybe you
<seb128> (since you signed up once for that ;)
 * duflu can't quite figure out what "styles changes" in gnome-shell would be
<seb128> I guess changes to their css
<seb128> which would need to be carried over to our custom shell css
<seb128> like new widgets theming or such
<duflu> I thought of that but would think many/some CSS changes would not require downstream theme changes
<duflu> New widgets, yes
<seb128> bottom line is that having what is needed documented is useful :)
<duflu> Hopefully people would notice quickly if something looked too Adwaita
<didrocks> seb128: does people really red debian/README.Ubuntu or any wiki page when updating? :)
<didrocks> can still push some procedure, we'll see
<seb128> well, I would expect Treinvh_o or Lane_y do so if they know that something needs to be taken care of
<seb128> unless they know what you mean without needing it written down
<didrocks> it means that for any GNOME Shell theme breakage, both pacakges to be released in sync
<seb128> (I don't, but I'm neither a theme master nor likely to do the update)
<didrocks> I guess they know how to do a 3 way merge, but better to document
<seb128> it means gnome-shell needs to be updated by someone who understands css enough to know what is a "breakage" in the theme and what is not
<seb128> or understand how our theming/override are done enough
<didrocks> well, everytime you remove a class or rename one, it's a breakage
<didrocks> as easy :)
<seb128> what if they add color definition?
<didrocks> as yaru will theme that class
<seb128> or change a color?
<seb128> do we need to check if we need a color tweak on our side as well?
<didrocks> addition isn't a breakage, but still needs to be reported
<didrocks> basically, any changes they do in their sass should be reported (at least diffed against)
<seb128> also can whoever update the shell fix yaru?
<didrocks> they should MP, it's the process
<didrocks> and anyone can MP
<seb128> or do we need to go through the communitheme team?
<didrocks> I guess we could get our team having write powers
<didrocks> but still, better to MP for having a reread
<seb128> the community is active enough that it shouldn't be problematic atm
 * duflu has only ever tried fixing the sass once... https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-shell/merge_requests/90 ... I hope upstream eventually fixes that
<gitlab-bot> GNOME issue (Merge request) 90 in gnome-shell "Display full application names under their icons" (comments: 9) [Closed]
<didrocks> yeah, I don't see right now that being an issue
<didrocks> but still, having more people with commit rights to the repo would be good
<seb128> right
<didrocks> pushing release tags and such
<seb128> let's hope gnome-shell doesn't change their css too often :p
<didrocks> yeahâ¦
<duflu> Hmm, maybe we want that patch in Ubuntu
<seb128> duflu, they said https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-shell/merge_requests/58 was a better way to go
<gitlab-bot> GNOME issue (Merge request) 58 in gnome-shell "WIP: Fix long application names being truncated" (comments: 4) [Opened]
<duflu> seb128, also it got put on hold for months. Meanwhile my tiny patch works perfectly and is finished
<seb128> Trevinho, ^ do you have an opinion on that?
<Laney> oops moin
<duflu> Morning Laney
<Laney> seb128: I'm not going to be doing a theme update inside the shell I don't think
<Laney> Trevinho: It would be good not to wait weeks before getting on a new series
<Laney> we are starting to do 3.29 now
<Laney> hey duflu
<andyrock> seb128: how can I help with the 3.29 update?
<seb128> hey Laney
<duflu> 18.04 emptied
<seb128> andyrock, look on http://people.canonical.com/~platform/desktop/versions.html for something you think you could update and work on updating the packaging (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/git is worth reading for GNOME components, they mostly use that workflow now)
<seb128> Laney, well, the point is that whoever does a gnome-shell update should make sure it doesn't regress our theming or we ship something buggy to our users
<Laney> I understand
<seb128> so if it's buggy whoever is doing the update should update the theme shell css to reflect the upstream changes
<Laney> Firstly I'm not confident that I wouldn't make it more buggy by trying to do an update with poor knowledge of the procedure.
<Laney> Secondly I think the procedure itself is not ideal.
<andyrock> kk thanks
<Laney> I thought we had a line of work to try to improve this situation
<seb128> Didier is documenting it
<seb128> that should address your first point
<Laney> I know that the second one is a bit tangential
<Laney> but it exiting makes updating gnome-shell to be burdensome
<seb128> on improving the procedure itself, I think we are doing what we think is best/easier now with the new theme (using a scss derivated from the upstream one)
<seb128> (out of not having a custom theme)
<seb128> but yeah, it makes updating gnome-shell less trivial :/
<seb128> I don't have a good answer to that today
<seb128> andyrock, those in sync with Debian it makes sense to update in Debian/salsa with a merge request there
<seb128> Laney, I looked at version for unstable, took me a bit to remember what we were doing but we don't usually track unstable GNOME as a common target
<seb128> Laney, there is a light green section between yellow and green which is "New unstable version available" which lists components that are uptodate on the stable serie but have an unstable update available
<Laney> ok
<didrocks> seb128: Laney: tell me if that makes sense: https://git.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell/tree/debian/README.Ubuntu
<Laney> you have to look in the yellow section too, those are "needs merge" ones that might have a version to update for
 * duflu is guessing Trevinho is delayed now, since the all nighter on Tuesday
<duflu> Or maybe that's just normal, from what I hear about Spanish life
<seb128> Laney, if you want to track a component on 3.29 specifically (e.g gnome-shell) we usually update the line for that one, e.g https://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/ubuntu-desktop-versions/trunk/revision/1642
<Laney> didrocks: reading
<Laney> "is the source of Yaru GNOME Shell theme" is a confusing statement to me
<Laney> s/source/upstream/?
<didrocks> Laney: feel free to ammend/MP :)
<Laney> :/
<didrocks> ?
 * Laney feels trapped
<seb128> don't
<seb128> it's probably easier to direct edit/commit your changes that proxy through Didier
<Laney> I thought I was being asked for feedback now I have to go make changes myself
<didrocks> shrugh
<Laney> sorry, it's all new to me
<didrocks> not that different with what you always do for wiki pages when asking for rereadingâ¦
<didrocks> anyway
<seb128> if it's just english/wording it's probably easier to just fix
<seb128> if that's the content which is not clear that's probably worth asking
<didrocks> right
 * Laney thought that was the second case
<seb128> My understanding of that sentence is that the yaru shell theme is derivated from that directory
<Laney> it made me think that there is a directory inside gnome-shell called data/theme which contains yaru's gnome shell theme
<seb128> so any change to the master should be reflected to the copy
<seb128> right, wording can probably be improved
<didrocks> what seb128 told is correct, indeed.
<seb128> "The upstream GNOME Shell `data/theme/` directory is used as a based for our Yaru GNOME Shell theme so any change made upstream needs to be reflected in our derivated version"
<seb128> or something around those lines?
<didrocks> sounds good to me
<Laney> basis* derivative* ;-)
<Laney> yes that makes sense, thx!
<seb128> Laney, ^ sounds better to you? I'm happy to commit those changes (unless you want to de-frenglish and write an improved version, which is fine too)
<seb128> yw
<seb128> k, let me commit with your fixes
<Laney> and then the rest is three way merge these things, then update upstream/
<seb128> right
<didrocks> right
<didrocks> I prefer that we keep the upstream/ directory as it's easier to do the 3 way merge
<didrocks> rather than writing down "this is the last version we merged with", and have to download the old source pacakages in addition to the new one
<seb128> it's also nice to be able to diff the base and derivative version locally
<seb128> or to know what base has been used
<seb128> didrocks, Laney, wording tweaks commited/pushed
<Laney> thx
<Laney> well done for using git :P
<seb128> np!
<seb128> haha
<didrocks> thanks!
<seb128> I got tricked :p
<seb128> andyrock, if you want to look at some easy updates, file-roller totem totem-pl-parser gnome-calculator are probably in that category, also click on the "Open Bug..." and file a bug to record you are working on an update so we don't dup work
<seb128> (that opens a normal bug but with the tag "upgrade-software-version" which is used to list the bug is the "status" column of http://people.canonical.com/~platform/desktop/versions.html)
<Laney> I'm going to change the GNOME_STABLE_SERIES to GNOME_UNSTABLE_SERIES for a lot of things I think
<Laney> sound good?
<Laney> some of them have a regex matching stable things though
<Laney> oh right you should just delete the version bit I think
<seb128> yeah, I'm a bit unsure if we shouldn't just change the GNOME_STABLE_SERIES to 3.29 if we plan to track 3.29 for most component
<seb128> I guess there is no best/right way
<seb128> both get the job done and have some small drawbacks
<seb128> so yeah, just change the ones you want :)
<Laney> guess it's easy to revert later on
<seb128> right
<seb128> Laney, pull before commiting changes, I did a trivial commit to fix the boost version
<Laney> k
<Laney> why is totem pinned to 3.26?
 * duflu should know but cannot remember
<duflu> Laney, possibly because until recently we wanted SSDs. Now we use CSD I see no reason
<duflu> Also LIM, maybe
<duflu> Also people forget sometimes
<seb128> Laney, that's the newest?
<seb128> I don't remember :/
<Laney> yeah I think it's probably that they just didn't do a 3.28 and all the 3.26 stuff got that version
<Trevinho> Morning
<oSoMoN> good morning Trevinho
<duflu> Morning Trevinho, willcooke
<Trevinho> Hi duflu and oSoMoN
 * Trevinho noted all the gnome shell changes... 
<Trevinho> For theme I mean.
<Trevinho> seb128: nautilus on cosmic, what want to do?
<Trevinho> andyrock: most of branches, updating salsa merging the tag version and pq rebase is normally enough... I Hadded something in the wiki for that some weeks ago. But is easy.
<willcooke> ahoy duflu Trevinho
<Laney> hi Trevinho willcooke
<Laney> Trevinho: need to resolve the desktop icon situation still afaik
<andyrock> Trevinho: kk
<Trevinho> Laney: ah, right... If want me to look into the proposition for shell let me know
<Laney> probably one for seb128
<seb128> Trevinho, what do you mean nautilus on cosmic? I though Didier uploaded your update on friday?
<Trevinho> seb128: version...
<seb128> Trevinho, we stay on what we have
<Trevinho> seb128: also I've pushed a cosmic fix while bionic is waiting
<seb128> k
<Laney> being stuck on 3.26 I thought was the question
<Trevinho> Laney: yes... And answered we do :-)
<Laney> staying
<Laney> ?
<Trevinho> So it seems, no?
<Laney> dunno, I missed that discussion but ok
<Trevinho> 13:20:41 <seb-128> Trevinho, we stay on what we have
<Trevinho> Not much discussion
<Laney> yeah I saw the line but it sounds like a decision that I didn't know about
<seb128> well the situation from previous cycle didn't change
<seb128> there is some resumed interest for the desktop icon extension and Didier is going to help a bit upstream on that
<seb128> so hopefully it unblocks us
<seb128> but it's not today
<seb128> maybe still this cycle, let's see
<Laney> Trevinho just offered to help so I'm a bit confused about let's see
<Laney> but ok
<seb128> did he? when/where?
<Laney> 26/07 12:00:50 <Trevinho> Laney: ah, right... If want me to look into the proposition for shell let me know
<Laney> at least that's what that says to me
<seb128> " the proposition for shell"?
<seb128> I couldn't parse what that meant
<Laney> thought it meant an extension
<Laney> but still, we can ask...
<seb128> yeah
<seb128> Trevinho, what do you mean by "proposition for shell"?
<seb128> also Trevinho is way behind on the work he commited to do this cycle
<seb128> Trevinho, you signed up for getting us gs-connect by default, feature freeze is coming and it looks like you didn't even started looking at that so please don't commit for more work
<Laney> that is more like what I meant by asking you
<seb128> right
<seb128> I think that at this point Trevinho has overcommited himself for the cycle already, so no more things on his list :)
<seb128> and Didier is helping upstream on the desktop icons thing
<seb128> so hopefully that's on its way to resolution
<seb128> meanwhile there are enough other updates to do :)
<Laney> I'm aware
<Laney> this is one of the few that is blocked on some work happening
<seb128> also Carlos was planning to port to GTK4 this cycle
<Trevinho> seb128: I was looking at it, but I saw didier started. And you know I wish I could have avoided all this maintenance work on packaging itself, but as nobody else does it I had to do it
<seb128> but I think they might have rolled back from that plan
<seb128> Trevinho, what maintenance/packaging work?
<Trevinho> seb128: well all the mutter, shell and nautilus releases...
<seb128> you do a good maintainer for those, don't be shy :)
<seb128> what did cost you time is the month you spent on the git import script...
<seb128> not those 3 updates
<Trevinho> Naaa that was over in a week or so. But all the rest of the time has been spent in back and forth with upstream reviews, backport and such.. Context switch make me loose time also
<seb128> you are the one deciding of how you organize your time and when/how you context switch, the items you worked on had been on your list since the start of the cycle
<Laney> is there a card for the extension thing?
<Laney> would like to spy on that one ;-)
<seb128> Laney, https://trello.com/c/oD8wcMJO/97-desktop-icons-next-generation
<Laney> thx!
<seb128> yw!
<Laney> ah, proposed, I didn't look in that lane
<Laney> I was like "oh cool we can drop all this -schemas stuff" for g-s-d
<Laney> except we can't eh :(
<seb128> u-s-d still using them?
<Laney> guess so
<Laney> didn't actually check tbh
<Laney> don't see any bigger updates in the changelog at least
<seb128> andyrock, sounds like smcv is waking up to do some updates as well today and did update file-roller there, probably makes our update easier
<andyrock> seb128: yeah but not 3.29.1
<seb128> ah right
<Laney> if we decided to drop those desktop files we can probably get that syncable
<seb128> good point :)
<Laney> I'll sponsor things like that to experimental
<Laney> if you want
<seb128> Laney, is Debian doing 3.29 yet?
<seb128> andyrock, ^
<Laney> if debian is me
<Laney> then yes
<Laney> mutter and gnome-shell are in already
<Laney> and gtk
<Laney> was harassing people for a glib release
<Laney> still some kinks there to work out
<Laney> trying to do the bigger bits first
<Laney> but I'm not sure what to upload to cosmic before gnome-shell itself is ready
<seb128> well maybe g-s-d needs to go together if some of dbus api between them changed but otherwise the other components should be pretty independant
<seb128> unless systemd user session bits land and create depends with gdm/gnome-session? I didn't check what was happening on that front
<Laney> nope
<Laney> apps are probably OK, speaking of core session components
<seb128> right
<andyrock> Laney, seb128: I'm still confused. Should I try to work on salsa or not for file-roller?
<andyrock> if yes in debian unstable or experimental?
<seb128> L_aney said he would sponsor the 3.29 version to debian experimental, so probably makes sense to do the update there
<andyrock> kk
<seb128> we can drop the compat .desktop so maybe that one can even by synced in Ubuntu then
<Laney> andyrock: you need a commit like https://salsa.debian.org/gnome-team/mutter/commit/3bf7b25a4f2e2fd3cfc1c2f0f3725a86835f2573 and https://salsa.debian.org/gnome-team/mutter/commit/46dc4564dd1e41f24149089b860359f86ea5b96c to move unstable to experimental
<Laney> ignore the commit message on the last one, I messed that up ð
<Laney> ah you might want to join #debian-gnome too
<Laney> OMG RAIN
<ogra> send it over !!!
<chrisccoulson> Laney, you have rain?
<Laney> yep
<chrisccoulson> Laney, i hate you
<chrisccoulson> :P
<chrisccoulson> I hope you're dancing in it
<Laney> probably not going to last
<Laney> finished
<ogra> pfft
<Laney> all dry again now
<seb128> no rain here today and it's > 31Â°C now at my desk :/
<seb128> I'm melting and so is my laptop
<seb128> time for some gelatto, bbiab
<Laney> what blocked d-conf -> dconf last cycle?
<Laney> anybody remember?
<chrisccoulson_> Laney, according to the openweather extension, there is a thunderstorm and heavy rain outside here
<chrisccoulson_> but it's lying :(
<Laney> :(((((((((((((
<Laney> https://www.bbc.co.uk/weather/ng5
<Laney> this is looking good
<andyrock> Laney: I guess that I need to open MP in salsa right?
<andyrock> the problem is that I cannot open an MP against an existent branch
<andyrock> e.g. file-roller has no debian/experimental branch
<andyrock> how does it work in this case?
<Laney> not sure what gitlab does in this case
<Laney> maybe you could go to #debian-gnome and put it in RFS: in the topic
<willcooke> chrisccoulson, same here.  Supposed to be thunder, but it's just hot and sunny
<seb128> Laney, dconf we never sorted out the armhf autopkgtest issue (that's in the trello board still if you are interested)
<willcooke> night all
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-07-27
<didrocks> good morning
<duflu> Morning didrocks
<duflu> And nothing personal, but bbl
<didrocks> hey duflu
<didrocks> ;)
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<didrocks> and a 3rd reboot due to this extension crashing the Shell!
 * didrocks does reboot on reboot since 7am :/
<duflu> Morning oSoMoN
<jibel> duflu, hi, about bug 1691921 you theory looks right. Yesterday I couldn't open system settings because of "too many open files" so it might be related.
<ubot5> bug 1691921 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu) "gnome-shell crashed with SIGTRAP in g_wakeup_new() from g_main_context_new() from g_dbus_connection_send_message_with_reply_sync() from g_dbus_connection_call_sync_internal() from g_dbus_connection_call_sync() ["Creating pipes for GWakeup: Too many open files\n"]" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1691921
<duflu> jibel, yeah it's less likely that you'd ever hit "Too many open files" without a leak. Although that can happen
<duflu> The default limit is still 1024
<duflu> per process
<duflu> jibel, hopefully you can identify it by name in /proc/PID/fd/* ?
<jibel> duflu, it's set to 2034595 on my system, I'll have a look
<duflu> ulimit -n ?
<jibel> ah true, 1024
<jibel> duflu, 1017 gnome-shell
<jibel> 1017 = files in fd/
<duflu> jibel, right so something transient released some but it clearly bounced off the limit
<duflu> jibel, are they mostly the same name? any name?
<duflu> or type?
<jibel> duflu, they are all like  980 -> 'pipe:[8531231]
<duflu> Hmm, tricky
<duflu> jibel, I can only think of spawning external programs (in a buggy way) could cause that. Maybe an extension is running some command periodically?
<jibel> duflu, https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/WFMNPZ6Bk8/ is the output of lsof for one of the pipe id
<duflu> Or maybe it's a shell and it's meant to spawn programs ;)
<duflu> jibel, "JS\x20Hel" sounds like "JS Helper" or something?
<duflu> jibel, sounds like an extension is using https://community.algolia.com/algoliasearch-helper-js/ or such in a buggy way
<duflu> gnome-shell doesn't seem to use it
<duflu> jibel, try grepping the extensions *.js for "JS Help"
<duflu> grep -r "JS Help" /usr/share/gnome-shell/extensions/
<jibel> duflu, yes it's JS Helper https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/rrbQpW5tqk/
<duflu> jibel, yeah I think it must be an extension using that. Just grep the extensions for it
 * duflu assumes most of the other 1017 are the same
<jibel> duflu, nothing
<jibel> and nothing in locally installed extensions
<duflu> jibel, grep -ri help.js ?
<duflu> or helper.js
<jibel> duflu, still nothing
<duflu> jibel, OK then time to grep everything on disk, including binaries :)
<duflu> Damn. libmozjs-52
<duflu> jibel, I found one: package mozjs52
<duflu> which I think is used indirectly by gnome-shell
<jibel> duflu, http://paste.ubuntu.com/p/yKTgtRtJzB/ all the references to JS Helper from lsof
<jibel> definitely not specific to gnome-shell
<duflu> jibel, no that's a reverse lookup you did. That's all files in use by process "JS Helper"
<duflu> So maybe not the issue after all
<duflu> jibel, try:  lsof -c gnome-shell
<duflu> and see what most of the 1017 entries are
 * duflu is seeing too many references to a deleted file "/i915"
<duflu> so that would be mesa-related
<jibel> duflu, http://paste.ubuntu.com/p/Fqjf2Y8Tbg/
<jibel> most of the entries are pipes
<duflu> jibel, I wonder - can you match any of those NODE values to pipes in other processes?
<duflu> gnome-shell 7476 j-lallement  153w     FIFO               0,12      0t0 7855742 pipe
<duflu> gnome-shell 7476 j-lallement  154r     FIFO               0,12      0t0 7855299 pipe
<duflu> gnome-shell 7476 j-lallement  155w     FIFO               0,12      0t0 7855912 pipe
<duflu> gnome-shell 7476 j-lallement  156r     FIFO               0,12      0t0 7853797 pipe
<duflu> (the second last column)
<duflu> Possibly not. More likely they are leaked descriptors to dead pipes
<duflu> I think some basic system-monitor type shell exensions might do stuff like that. So try excluding those
<jibel> duflu, no, they only exist for process 7476 (gnome-shell)
<duflu> jibel, basically it looks like something in gnome-shell has been spawning external commands and not cleaning up. Could be a system monitor extension
<jibel> duflu, I had a system-monitor extension enabled. It's removed now and I'll monitor the number of open files to see if it fixes the situation
<duflu> Cool
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<duflu> Morning seb128
<seb128> hey duflu, how are you?
<jibel> salut seb128
<duflu> seb128, going well. How are you?
<willcooke> hi gang
<willcooke> chrisccoulson, the thunderstorms have failed to arrive. again
<didrocks> hey seb128, willcooke
<chrisccoulson> willcooke, we got a some lightning at 4am, and I got up to cover the garden furniture
<chrisccoulson> but the actual storm passed a few miles to our west and it didn't rain in the end
<duflu> Hi willcooke
<seb128> hey jibel willcooke didrocks
<seb128> we had like 3 drops yesterday evening
<seb128> didn't help to lower the temperature at all, still 27Â°C inside and 37Â°C forecasted today
<willcooke> :(
<willcooke> 24 outside here, 28 in the house!!
<seb128> lucky you!
<didrocks> 28.3Â°C inside already :(
<seb128> go work in the garden :)
<didrocks> it's already 28Â°C outside here
<Laney> yo
<seb128> hey Laney, how are you?
<didrocks> hey Laney
<Laney> hey seb128 didrocks
<Laney> good thx, travelling to debconf later today
<Laney> you?
<seb128> oh right, debconf
<seb128> safe travel!
<seb128> I'm good, waiting for the rain that should arrive tonight/tomorrow and drop the temperature
<seb128> Laney, you made version unhappy :/
<Laney> oh how?
<Laney> I ran it on my system and it worked
<seb128>   File "versions.py", line 35, in <module>
<seb128>     from ssl import CertificateError
<seb128> ImportError: cannot import name CertificateError
<Laney> meh must be some version problem on that box
<seb128> could have to do with the version on lillypilly
<Laney> precise
<Laney> WTFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF
<seb128> sorry :/
<didrocks> containers containers containers containers containers :)
<seb128> troll day right?
<duflu> Every day is troll day
 * seb128 not falling into that one today, trying to get some work done while it's not too hot to think :p
<duflu> (for trolls)
<didrocks> not a troll, just a why they exist :)
<duflu> or channeling Steve Balmer
<didrocks> ok, that part for the troll one ;)
<seb128> containers are not a justification to not update machines to a modern OS version though
<didrocks> well, as long as it's supported, from an IS standpoint, I can understandâ¦ (and it's not rare)
<seb128> yeah, well it's easy enough to
<seb128> yeah, well it's easy enough to make that script work on precise
<didrocks> yep
<seb128> containers are a big hammer for that small nail
<didrocks> right, but for a while, production was broken (which was OK for our use case)
<seb128> because we don't have a "pull, try, revert if fail" machinery
<seb128> containers don't protect you either from buggy commits
<seb128> I mean they have use but are not a megical solution
<seb128> anyway, I said no trolling :p
<Laney> 'buggy'
<didrocks> sounds like you want to troll ;) but at least testing on Laney's machine == what you deploy in production, that was my point
<seb128> I'm not saying that one was buggy
<Laney> I guess ESM changes that precise is not properly supported
<seb128> just that containers don't protect you from everything automagically
<seb128> I was not speaking about that particular commit!
<didrocks> did I say that it was magic? ;)
<Laney> haha
<seb128> tendency of the modern world
<didrocks> just highlighting that in that case, it would have prevented that issue
<didrocks> nothing more :)
<Laney> yeah then I could have run the docker script to check the actual environment it was going to be deployed in
<Laney> ;-)))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))
<seb128> yeah, it's fine if that 100 lines script requires a 1GB of disk for the container and 3G of ram to have a webengine and a datacenter to run
<didrocks> Laney: you are not even sure that -updates are installed on the machine
<seb128> energy is infinite and why would you want to be efficient
<seb128> waste for the win!
<didrocks> seb128: most of containers, if properly done aren't that big :p
<didrocks> but it requires effort to streamline it, agreed
<seb128> still more cpu and resources used that being native code on the host
<didrocks> true
<seb128> but yeah modern world is not about optmization
<Laney> CPU used by me fixing this up now
<seb128> it's about doing the less work and putting the cost on the infra
<Laney> and us talking about it
<Laney> !!!!!!
<seb128> haha
<Laney> keeping this light hearted troll friday
<seb128> :)
<Laney> seems the version on this machine isn't validating SSL certificates then
<andyrock> seb128: https://code.launchpad.net/~azzar1/ubuntu/+source/file-roller/+git/file-roller/+merge/351407
<andyrock> seb128: I'm not sure it makes sense doing this in salsa
<andyrock> debian does not ship unstable gnome releaes
<andyrock> and doing this in experimental for a non-DD takes too long
<seb128> andyrock, thx
<seb128> sorry channel for the stupid question
<seb128> but do we really need 3 mps in those cases for the 3 branches (ubuntu / pristine-tar /  upstream)?
<andyrock> i wanted to ask the same
<andyrock> Laney: Trevinho ^^^
<didrocks> I don't think there is any other way for a new release with the pristine-tar workflow
<Laney> You don't need the merge proposal itself to be able to merge something from one place to another
<didrocks> (at least, needing a way to pull/push pristine-tar & upstream)
<Laney> But you need to do it of course
<Laney> Maybe merge requests help with reminding people to do that and maybe they don't, I don't know
<seb128> well, our contributor workflow needs to be standard
<Laney> I'm not arguing with that at all
<Laney> I'm replying to your question about whether we need it
<andyrock> it would be nice if we could have multi-branches MR in launchpad
<seb128> do we have that in salsa?
<andyrock> seb128: nope
<Laney> no
<seb128> k
<seb128> so we could define that contributors mp the ubuntu (or debian) branch
<seb128> and that the reviewer needs to pull/merge pristine-tar and upstream as well
<seb128> ?
<Laney> that would work
<Laney> by the way "takes too long" I don't agree with, and certainly not in this case
<didrocks> we still need to check the content of upstream/ though? If it's an external contributor
<seb128> Laney, you can't really "disagree" with how people feel though... better to try to figure out what is making them feel like that
<seb128> andyrock, what is your main issue there?
<seb128> the fact that you can't branch to experimental in a mp?
<Laney> :/
<seb128> didrocks, I guess yes
<andyrock> didrocks: even if it's not an external contributor
<andyrock> seb128: Laney the fact that I cannot use gitlab to propse things
<didrocks> andyrock: you mean we have to double check on you? :p
<Laney> thanks for the nitpicking pickup
<didrocks> we know where you live
<Laney> but OK
<didrocks> "Italy"
<didrocks> should be easy to find you :p
<andyrock> didrocks: of course you need to check on me
<Laney> can you propose on launchpad for non-existing branches?
<Trevinho> Morning...
<andyrock> Laney: I don't think so
<didrocks> hey Trevinho
<Laney> I find it strange since I offered to sponsor this stuff
<Trevinho> didrocks: hi
<Laney> but whatever, getting updates in Debian is a battle I've been fighting for a long time
<Laney> just do it in cosmic, that's fine
<seb128> Laney, was that comment for me? sorry, I didn't mean to be negative
<seb128> hey Trevinho
<andyrock> Laney: my point is that debian never did .x[13579] releases
<Trevinho> Ciao seb128
<andyrock> ciao Trevinho
<Laney> andyrock: you can do those in experimental, that's what I've been doing this week
<seb128> andyrock, that's a non issue, Laney said he's wanting to sponsor those to experimental
<andyrock> Laney: and the other point is that doing this in experimental without being a DD is a pain
<duflu> Happy Friday Trevinho
<seb128> andyrock, well, until we branched
<duflu>  and andyrock
<duflu> and Laney
<duflu> and people I missed
<seb128> once the branch exists then it 's ok
<andyrock> hey duflu
<andyrock> seb128: indeed
<andyrock> being not able to use gitlab MR feels :/ to me
<seb128> I'm a bit lost as a reviewer there on what needs to be reviewed
<andyrock> seb128: that's another thing
<seb128> is there an easy way to check that the upstream branch that has been mp matches real upstream?
<seb128> like a command/tool to use?
<Trevinho> you too duflu
<andyrock> seb128: it's not easy to review this kind of stuff :D
<seb128> right
<duflu> Or not. It's 5pm on a Friday and two fixes I thought were finished need reworking
<Trevinho> anyway I was saying the same to Andrea, last night... Using only ubuntu and in case Laney can pull to debian experimental
<seb128> I start thinking it's more work to review/sponsor an update with this workflow that to do it themselve for the sponsors
<Trevinho> And we merge back once both on 3.30
<seb128> like I don't even know how I would go to verify that the upstream branch hasn't been tricked
<andyrock> seb128: I guess you can check the SHA https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/file-roller/commits/3.29.1
<seb128> it's less effort to just do the gbp import-orig myself
<andyrock> at least for upstream/latest
<Trevinho> seb128: git diff gnome/master
<Laney> Trevinho: why would you though if a DD (me) has said they wanted that in experimental?
<Laney> anyway I need to pack my bag, if it's easier for everyone to do it this way then feel free
<Laney> brb
<Trevinho> Laney: I meant what you can't propose (new branches), you can pull them if want
<Laney> I mean it's only easier in Launchpad because we happen to have an ubuntu/master branch, if this package was in sync it would be the same problem
<andyrock> seb128: btw to check upstream/latest just do: git checkout upstream/latest; git diff 3.29.1
<andyrock> or git diff upstream/latest 3.29.1
<seb128> does that diff the disk content?
<seb128> or would it tell you if a commit message was amended between the branches?
<Trevinho> Andyrock with .. I think
<Trevinho> seb128: you can also diff the history
<andyrock> Trevinho: works the same here
<andyrock> seb128: it would tell if I modified a file
<seb128> Trevinho, that doesn't answer my question
<Trevinho> In the mean time...
<Trevinho> https://csorianognome.wordpress.com/2018/07/27/nautilus-3-30/
<seb128> so diff is on disk content
<seb128> not logs?
<andyrock> seb128: to check if the history was properly imported just check the sha
<seb128> k
<Trevinho> seb128: git diff yes... Checks rey content. Also the unstated one though
<Trevinho> Unstaged
<andyrock> e.g. https://git.launchpad.net/~azzar1/ubuntu/+source/file-roller/commit/?id=12384cf98b64ef7a9f6970c454181fd34afedfa7 and https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/file-roller/commit/12384cf98b64ef7a9f6970c454181fd34afedfa7
<seb128> I miss the good old bzr times where reviewing was only checking the debian dir was correctly changed :p
<seb128> oh well, let's not start with those comments it's not helpful
<andyrock> seb128: as you can see the sha is the same
<seb128> andyrock, thx
<seb128> I wonder if it would be easier to ask packaging debdiffs in that context
<seb128> and let the sponsor do the gbp orig-import
<seb128> and then copy the updated debian content over
<Laney> not in any way would that be easier for me
<seb128> it's probably less work for everyone than having to deal with reviewing and merging 3 branches
<Laney> you have to check you didn't mess up your own work anyway
<seb128> well, if I do gbp import-orig myself I know I didn't meddle with the upstream content or history
<seb128> so it's less intensive work than having to check a contributor upstream line
<seb128> the one "interesting" part in the new version is the debian/ dir work, that's what is not automatically handled by the tools
<seb128> e.g patches refreshes and maybe (build-)depends
<Laney> if you import a debdiff you get no proper commits
<Laney> you get problems with transmitting data that diffs can't handle
<Laney> the contributor *and* the reviewer have to transport a patch out of git and back into it
<seb128> k, either way it's work I guess :/
<andyrock> it would be good btw do define standard ways to review this kind of stuff
<seb128> yeah
<andyrock> when I had to review Trevinho's work for nautilus I had to spend hours to understand that Marco was wrong :D
<seb128> at this point I'm also unsure it makes sense to ask contributors to help on easy updates, it feels like it's more work for the sponsor to review/merge the stuff than to do the update (that's not true if there are patches to rebase though)
<seb128> Trevinho, well done on getting mentioned on the nautilus .30 blog post :)
<Laney> I'm feeling a bit burned out by this whole exercise to be honest
<Laney> It's really draining for me to have to advocate / fight for it all the time
<seb128> yeah, sorry, I think we all feel burned in some way at this point
<seb128> I'm not sure how to fix the situation though
<seb128> the new workflow is powerful but that has a cost
<Laney> It feels like you are fighting against it constantly, and I have to counter that
<seb128> the cost is not that high for people who know the workflow/have commit access/see the advantage and are wanting to pay the cost
<seb128> but it's high for others
<Laney> Like in this case, checking the branch is not high cost really, but we're jumping around questioning the whole thing
<Laney> If the question stayed on "what is the best way to do this?"
<Laney> I could have showed you a screenshot of gitg
<seb128> k, point taken
<seb128> I'm going to step out of those discussions for the rest of the cycle
<seb128> and see how the team goes with it, taking notes on the way
<seb128> and we can do de-brief in Brussels
<seb128> one fact is that doing an update is an higher number of commands and more error prone that the old workflow at this point (need to set the origns, don't forget to push 3 branches, tags, etc), maybe it's worth it though
<seb128> maybe getting used to the system and building wrapper is going to help though
<seb128> so let's people try to get used to it
<seb128> k, on that note stepping out for early lunch, bbl
<Laney> There's some learning / skill acquisition, yes. I'm not sure it's possible to avoid that but we should and have been trying to document it and make it as smooth as we can.
<seb128> right, it's still a complex system and it shows
<seb128> e.g see andyrock's feedback as a "new contributor"
<Laney> what is the path out of this?
<seb128> maybe the solution is to write some tooling/scripts to help with part of the repetitive work though
<seb128> well, ether ^
<Laney> It's a new thing for the team. We can't avoid people having to learn how to do some new things.
<Laney> Hmm.
<seb128> or maybe the conclusion is that the workflow with the 3 branches to maintain is too complex and not worth it, at least for "easy packages" and that ubuntu-git might be a better solution
<Laney> This is getting me a bit irritated, I'm sorry, it's best I step out
<seb128> k, sorry it's irritating to you
<seb128> you see more the benefits from the system, where other see the complexity, we have probably work to do to see things from the others' perspective
<seb128> and yes we can learn, but it's still error prone and a step learning curve for new contributors which mean be fine but we should still ask ourself the question if it's not overengineered
<seb128> anyway, I'm stepping out of the discussion at this point
<seb128> sorry it's frustating to you
<Laney> No worries, maybe I really am blind to how crap it is.
<Laney> If that's the case then it should definitely *not* be me arguing.
<andyrock> my point was not to irritate or to blame anyone. From a developer point of view the all process it's easy, but not from a reviewer
<andyrock> *reviewer point of view
<andyrock> gitg helps but I still feel we can have something better
<Trevinho> Yes... And agree.
<Trevinho> However the tool itself from my side is waaaaay better. And doing things like all the backports from nautilus 3.28 to 3.26 without all the git tooling would have been just impossible (not easy anyway, but still possible and you've real tooling).
<Trevinho> I don't see why any request related how to do things or how to improve the work flow has to bring to irritation.
<Trevinho> It's normal to discuss how to do things or what would en the best behavior. Without having to stop after 2 minutes saying that this is just too hard or too bad.
<Trevinho> The time might invest now, might look like is lost, but I'm sure it will pay back in the future.
<Trevinho> So.... Let's discuss, strongly on tech aspects if the case, but no need to complaining because a new system brings to that. It's quite normal.
<juliank> Hmm, in case we have two apps with the same name, one a snap and one a deb, would it make sense to show some badge or something on the icon to differentiate those?
<ogra> hmm, i suppose apt hasnt been tested much on single-core single-thread CPUs, has it ?
<ogra> $ sudo apt update && sudo apt upgrade
<ogra> ...
<ogra> All packages are up to date.
<ogra> E: Could not get lock /var/lib/dpkg/lock - open (11: Resource temporarily unavailable)
<ogra> E: Unable to lock the administration directory (/var/lib/dpkg/), is another process using it?
<ogra> ...
<ogra> $
<ogra> i'm seeign this from time to time on an imx6ull (extremely low end ARM CPU)
<didrocks> ogra: I guess a question for mvo?
<jibel> ogra, it's usually the setup in test VMs
<ogra> if i call both commands separately it doesnt happen
<ogra> (it also happens rarely (like 1 out of 100 calls or so) ... but i never see it anywhere else)
<didrocks> maybe apt doesn't call flush() when terminating?
<didrocks> and so removal of the lock file isn't proceeded when the second command starts?
<didrocks> (pure theory)
<ogra> jibel, well, thats x86 multi-threaded ... still like 100x faster than that ARM thing :)
<ogra> (even when in single core mode)
<ogra> didrocks, my theory was that apt simply operates async now ... the CPU easily blocks on IO so the second command might kick in while the backend is still busy with the first part
<didrocks> ogra: yeah, that's also plausible
<ogra> err
<ogra> geez ...
<ogra> why am i in -desktop !
 * ogra thought he was in -devel ... damned heat !!!
<willcooke> juliank, it's on the backlog for consideration in future cycles
<willcooke> juliank, i.e. yes, I think it would make a lot of sense
<juliank> Nice, thanks willcooke
<willcooke> yw!
<jbicha> ogra: that issue also happens if you try to use apt shortly after booting because of a systemd timer checking for apt updates. If you wait several minutes, the background process finishes and the apt/dpkg locks are removed
<ogra> aha !
<ogra> jibel, thans for clearifying ... that makes sense
<ogra> *thanks even
<jbicha> it looks like the timer also runs twice per day, but I notice it mostly when I boot an Ubuntu instance I had turned off
<jbicha> seb128: hi, I saw LP: #1775329 on the sponsor queue. Do you think it's a good idea?
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1775329 in gnome-terminal (Ubuntu) "Feature request: Add a handler for CVE URLs" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1775329
<willcooke> gnight all
<seb128> jbicha, hey, no opinion on that, seems a wishlist/nice to have but maybe not worth a SRU
<seb128> would be fine to include in a stable update with other changes though
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-07-28
<lyam[m]> Anyone else having issues with renaming a file and having the progress dialog pop-up after the naming already happened so the dialog just stays there?
<lyam[m]> This is in 18.04 LTS ubuntu
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-07-29
<mtj_> hi folks, can amyone suggest a good 'network profiles manager' gui?  ...something similar-ish to MacOS' syspref's 'network' tool
<mtj_> ..im running 18.04.1,  afaict there is no such feature in a default install?
#ubuntu-desktop 2019-07-22
<jamesh> robert_ancell: looks like the packagekit-control interface PR (https://github.com/snapcore/snapd/pull/7054 ) is close to merging
<robert_ancell> jamesh, nice!
<jamesh> got signoff on the name, AppArmor rules, base declaration (require store assertion to install snaps plugging the interface)
<jamesh> the simple spread test using a core18 snap seems to work everywhere except Ubuntu 14.04, which may just be too old
<jamesh> and probably too old for us to care about anyway
<robert_ancell> jamesh, it was in main but I expect no-one's going to target 14.04 in a hurry :)
<jamesh> extended support for 14.04 doesn't extend to the desktop or snaps anyway...
<robert_ancell> then definitely not!
<pieq> duflu, hi! Sorry about https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/1822026 , I haven't got the time to check again recently and won't have time for the next 3 weeks...
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1822026 in linux (Ubuntu Eoan) "[Nvidia Quadro P1000] Live USB freezes or cannot complete install when nouveau driver is loaded (crashing in gp100/gf100 code)" [High,Triaged]
<duflu> pieq, no problem
<didrocks> good morning
<duflu> Morning didrocks
<didrocks> hey duflu
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<didrocks> hey oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> salut didrocks
<ricotz> good morning everyone
<duflu> Morning oSoMoN and ricotz
<didrocks> hey ricotz
<oSoMoN> good morning ricotz, duflu
<marcustomlinson> morning all
<didrocks> hey marcustomlinson
<oSoMoN> good morning marcustomlinson
<willcooke> morning
<oSoMoN> morning willcooke
<didrocks> hey willcooke
<duflu> Morning willcooke and marcustomlinson
<duflu> Does anyone know how to stop Chrom(ium) from stealing focus when opening links?
<RAOF> Implement focus stealing prevention in Mutter? ð
<duflu> Ha. I should have known you would answer that one first
<duflu> I guess Mutter might be to blame. Was just thinking that a Chrome update might too
<duflu> My concern is that it seems more like a feature than a bug. So if there's no toggle to turn it off then that's one argument with upstream I don't want to start
<duflu> If all the user has done recently is click a link then it's reasonable to default to switching workspace to show the browser. So I think it's a sane default for new users. Just not me
<oSoMoN> duflu, I found this, but it doesn't look like something upstream is interested in: https://gist.github.com/ajakubek/3335417
<duflu> oSoMoN, thanks yeah as I expected. Sounds like Chrome has always done it but only mutter honours it too well, while Unity didn't
<duflu> Actually, maybe Chris is right. You could argue that the Ctrl in Ctrl+Click should trigger prevention of focus stealing
<marcustomlinson> I agree with this ^
<duflu> willcooke, can you change the link to the release bugs? https://discourse.ubuntu.com/t/desktop-team-update-monday-22nd-july-2019/11846
<willcooke> duflu, what's wrong there?  I'm missing somethign
<duflu> willcooke, wrong link, wrong week
<duflu> The page for 22 July is linking to release bugs for 12 July.
<willcooke> Edited.
<willcooke> We still need to work out a better time to post the release bugs.  I should have done it on Friday
<Laney> moin from Curitiba
<oSoMoN> hey Laney
<Laney> hey oSoMoN, how's it going?
<oSoMoN> I'm good, back in Spain
<oSoMoN> you had a good trip to Brazil?
<Laney> as good as a 12h overnight flight can be :P
<Laney> but made it
<oSoMoN> good :)
<willcooke> hey Laney
<didrocks> hey hey Laney
<GunnarHj> Anybody who can shed some light on how this upload happened:
<GunnarHj> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/fonts-noto-cjk/1:20190410+repack1-1
<GunnarHj> If I understand it correctly, it was autosync'ed. But the package it replaced had "ubuntu1" appended to the version number, and I thought that should prevent the bots from doing anything. Or was there a human behind the scenes in this case after all?
<ginggs> GunnarHj: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/fonts-noto-cjk/+publishinghistory
<ginggs> Copied from debian sid in Primary Archive for Debian GNU/Linux by Gianfranco Costamagna
<GunnarHj> ginggs: Ah, that explains it. Thanks! (Not a problem - my plan was to do it manually, but apparently Gianfranco was faster.)
<ginggs> sometimes he is too fast
<Laney> hey willcooke hey didrocks
<Laney> no idea what LocutusOfBorg is doing to notice all these uploads
<ogra> wiretapping the buildd, what else
<Laney> https://tracker.debian.org/news/1047045/accepted-libblockdev-220-7deb10u1-source-into-proposed-updates-stable-new-proposed-updates/
<Laney> we should take that
<Laney> dunno if anyone has a bit of time to prep it
<Laney> see the linked bug; if you use gnome-disks (disco, not sure about other releases) to change luks passphrase your partition can get hosed
<willcooke> Laney, I logged it here:  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-disk-utility/+bug/1837437
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1837437 in gnome-disk-utility (Ubuntu) "disk content permanently lost when changing LUKS password" [Undecided,New]
<willcooke> Hope that was the right thing to do
<willcooke> I will raise it during the meeting tomorrow and find an owner
<willcooke> night all
<kenvandine> Trevinho: hey, do you have any tips on what we need to do to fix the cursor scaling issue with snaps?
#ubuntu-desktop 2019-07-23
<didrocks> good morning
<duflu> Hi didrocks
<ricotz> good morning
<duflu> Morning ricotz
<duflu> Morning for some
<didrocks> hey duflu, ricotz
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<Wimpress> o/
<oSoMoN> hey Wimpress
<duflu> Morning Wimpress and oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> hey duflu
<didrocks> salut oSoMoN, Wimpress
<oSoMoN> salut didrocks
<marcustomlinson> good morning duflu ricotz didrocks oSoMoN and Wimpress
<duflu> Hi marcustomlinson
<Fudge> do any of you guys know much about AWS, looking to put up a wokuwiki which does not use sql, so veyr simple install with ssh preferably
<marcustomlinson> Fudge: does it have to be AWS? Why not just a cheap VPS?
<willcooke> morning
<willcooke> hot one today
<Fudge> it doesnt have to be, work wants the cheapest option possible I think, singey. I could just host it at home but not sure if they will allow
<duflu> Morning willcooke
<willcooke> afternoon duflu
<oSoMoN> good morning marcustomlinson, willcooke
<Fudge> VPS would be fine but some of the prices i looked at were rediculous
<marcustomlinson> Fudge: There are many VPS options out there of course, but I've been using hostwinds.com lately and have been happy
<Fudge> ill look them up, thanks for the tip
<marcustomlinson> https://www.hostwinds.com/vps/unmanaged-linux - starts at $4.50 a month
<marcustomlinson> morning willcooke
<Fudge> nothing wrong with that price
<Fudge> marcustomlinson:  thanks very much mate
<marcustomlinson> ðð»
<Fudge> oh, Speakup didn't read that at all, is it an emogey
<Fudge> emoji
<marcustomlinson> ha, yeah a thumbs up
<oSoMoN> mpt, I'm studying fwupd to get up to speed on the APIs and what user tasks they allow, would you mind postponing that meeting to give me some more time?
<mpt> oSoMoN, yep, that would be fine, letâs talk on Thursday
<oSoMoN> mpt, perfect, thanks
<Trevinho> morning... my IRC wasn't starting as I had to update my https key on the server... -_-
<Trevinho> kenvandine: mhmh... as per cursor and scaling, not sure, as the apps should monitor X server resources to check it, although IIRC I did something on that, but can't remember details right now. I need to look at my coding archives :P
<Trevinho> iirc was related to the theming someway though too
<willcooke> hi Trevinho
<Trevinho> hi willcooke
<duflu> Morning Trevinho
<kenvandine> Trevinho: yeah, willcooke had said he thought you had some fix for that
<Trevinho> kenvandine: mh... IIRC the XCURSOR_PATH was fixing the theme, but for the size I'm not sure
<Trevinho> kenvandine: is it for any app?
<kenvandine> yeah, from what i hear
<kenvandine> i don't have a HiDPi display to test
<kenvandine> but Wimpress does
<Trevinho> kenvandine: mh, well I expect you can simulate it by just passing GDK_SCALE=2 anyways
<kenvandine> Trevinho: cool, so yeah i can do that with gnome-calculator and see the cursor doesn't scale
<kenvandine> Trevinho: any tips on what i can do there?
<Trevinho> kenvandine: mhmh, soo... Better way would be to inject some code in libgtk to see what's trying to load
<willcooke> #startmeeting Desktop Team Meeting 2019-07-23 ð»ð»ð»
<meetingology> Meeting started Tue Jul 23 13:30:40 2019 UTC.  The chair is willcooke. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/uEut6bfN/ubuntu-desktop-1910-cycle | Desktop Team Meeting 2019-07-23 ð»ð»ð» | Current topic:
<Trevinho> hi
<marcustomlinson> helloo
<willcooke> Roll call: didrocks, duflu (out), jamesh (out), jibel, kenvandine, laney (out), marcustomlinson, oSoMoN, seb128 (out), tkamppeter, trevinho, robert_ancell (out)
<oSoMoN> o/
<willcooke> My thermometer says it's 40 outside in the sun
<oSoMoN> ouch
<willcooke> Thats 104 in old money
<willcooke> Ok, let's get started with bug reviews
<marcustomlinson> ':(
<ogra> sun ? you mean oracle  ...
<willcooke> #topic BB Incoming
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/uEut6bfN/ubuntu-desktop-1910-cycle | Desktop Team Meeting 2019-07-23 ð»ð»ð» | Current topic: BB Incoming
<willcooke> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-bb-incoming-bug-tasks.html
<willcooke> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity-control-center/+bug/1741027
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1741027 in unity-settings-daemon (Ubuntu Bionic) "[SRU] Screen sharing panels abort using an non-existent vino gsettings key" [High,In progress]
<willcooke> Not one of ours strictly speaking
<willcooke> There is discussion going on, so I think will leave it alone
<willcooke> #topic DD incoming
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/uEut6bfN/ubuntu-desktop-1910-cycle | Desktop Team Meeting 2019-07-23 ð»ð»ð» | Current topic: DD incoming
<willcooke> yay no more C
<willcooke> :)
<marcustomlinson> Is that "will leave it alone" or "Will, leave it alone"
<marcustomlinson> :)
<willcooke> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-dd-incoming-bug-tasks.html
<willcooke> marcustomlinson, either, both :)
<willcooke> Ok, so for D we have:
<willcooke> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libblockdev/+bug/1837437
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1837437 in libblockdev (Ubuntu) "disk content permanently lost when changing LUKS password" [Undecided,New]
<willcooke> Laney raised this on IRC last night so I opened a bug for it
<willcooke> I think we should accept it, it's pretty dangerous.
<willcooke> We need someone to do some testing and decide if it is needed in B as well
<willcooke> Who would like to take a look in to it?
<oSoMoN> if it can be reproduced in a VM, I can do
<willcooke> oSoMoN, if you would at least have a go that would be appreciated.  If you can't get it to work, let us know and we can ask someone else
<oSoMoN> ack
<oSoMoN> I'll test this this afternoon
<willcooke> thanks
<willcooke> #topic rls-ee-incoming
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/uEut6bfN/ubuntu-desktop-1910-cycle | Desktop Team Meeting 2019-07-23 ð»ð»ð» | Current topic: rls-ee-incoming
<willcooke> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-ee-incoming-bug-tasks.html
<willcooke> Sounds like https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gconf/+bug/1551623 might go away
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1551623 in gconf (Ubuntu) "[SRU] package gconf2 3.2.6-3ubuntu6 failed to install/upgrade: dependency problems - leaving triggers unprocessed" [Critical,Triaged]
<willcooke> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/valgrind/+bug/1837068
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1837068 in valgrind (Ubuntu) "libssh armhf autopkgtest failure on valgrind unhandled instruction: 0xEBAD 0x1CCA" [High,New]
<willcooke> Seb has asked Foundations to take look
<willcooke> So I think that's it
<willcooke> I will look at the unassigned release bugs offline
<willcooke> So I propose we move to AOB
<willcooke> #topic AOB
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/uEut6bfN/ubuntu-desktop-1910-cycle | Desktop Team Meeting 2019-07-23 ð»ð»ð» | Current topic: AOB
 * willcooke looks at this notes
<willcooke> *his
<willcooke> Hiring....
<willcooke> We have a backlog of people to interview.  In order to get through the list as quickly as we can I would like to spread the load and have people do some first round interview
<willcooke> *interviews each
<willcooke> or perhaps as a small group of 1 to 3 people
<willcooke> I'll follow up on email on that this week
<didrocks> (small group sounds fine)
<didrocks> (1 isn't a group ;))
<willcooke> If you talk to yourself it is
<didrocks> haha
<willcooke> I agree with willcooke
<marcustomlinson> XD
<oSoMoN> :)
<willcooke> That's the end of my notes
<willcooke> Anyone got anything?
<willcooke> going once
<willcooke> twice
<Trevinho> rnot from me
<willcooke> #endmeeting
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/uEut6bfN/ubuntu-desktop-1910-cycle
<meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Jul 23 13:44:49 2019 UTC.
<meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2019/ubuntu-desktop.2019-07-23-13.30.moin.txt
<willcooke> ð ð¥
<willcooke> thanks all
<marcustomlinson> thanks
<didrocks> thanks (but please, no sun, no fire)
<oSoMoN> thanks
<willcooke> TFW you're waiting for your script to run and it takes you 10 mins to realise that you opened the script in gedit, didn't actually run it
<kenvandine> willcooke: that's awesome!
<oSoMoN> willcooke, that's a security feature, you're required to audit the code of that script before being allowed to run it
<oSoMoN> willcooke, Laney: bug #1837437 happens on disco, not on bionic
<ubot5> bug 1837437 in libblockdev (Ubuntu Disco) "disk content permanently lost when changing LUKS password" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1837437
<willcooke> night all, going to find somewhere cool...
<kenvandine> tjaalton: bug 1817225 is breaking the 18.04 hyperv desktop images
<ubot5> bug 1817225 in xrdp (Ubuntu) "18.04.2 breaks xrdp" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1817225
<kenvandine> it needs xorgxrdp, which fails to install during image build
<tjaalton> kenvandine: so, does a rebuild work with stock xserver?
<tjaalton> the non-hwe version
<kenvandine> tjaalton: i'm not sure how to build a non-hwe version
<tjaalton> kenvandine: rebuild xrdb, test with xserver-xorg-core, not -hwe-18.04
<tjaalton> *xrdp
<kenvandine> the image build is pulling in hwe
<kenvandine> not sure how to disable that
<kenvandine> these are livecd-rootfs image builds
<tjaalton> anyway, I'd like to avoid having another copy of xrdp
<tjaalton> that's why I'm asking
<kenvandine> tjaalton: agreed
<kenvandine> i'd happily switch to non-hwe
<kenvandine> i don't think a xrdp based desktop VM would really benefit from the hwe versions
<tjaalton> true, but it does get a newer xserver
<tjaalton> and kernel
<kenvandine> oh right, so no new kernel without it
<tjaalton> which is probably why you build point-release images :)
<kenvandine> it's mostly just to get the latest set of updates
<kenvandine> what would rebuilding xrdp do for me?
<tjaalton> so it needs stock bionic tested with a rebuilt xrdp, surely the stock image is still available?
<kenvandine> the current xrdp depends on xorgxrdp which depends on the non-hwe xserver
<kenvandine> if i rebuilt it against the hwe version that would probably work
<tjaalton> hmm maybe can't be avoided to have xrdp-hwe-18.04
<kenvandine> but i need the packages to pull from bionic-updates
<kenvandine> that's what i'm thinking
<kenvandine> we need this for the 18.04.3 release
<tjaalton> because it needs to build-depends against the hwe packages, and then the binary would depend on the hwe xserver
<kenvandine> right
<kenvandine> would that then build a xorgxrdp-hwe-18.04 binary too?
<tjaalton> and I'm basically off this week.. but maybe could push this stil
<tjaalton> l
<tjaalton> yes
<kenvandine> i'd really appreciate it :)
<kenvandine> i'm at the sprint next week
<kenvandine> and i think release day is next thursday :)
<tjaalton> indeed..
<kenvandine> thanks!
<tjaalton> kenvandine: uh, so it's xorgxrdp which needs a new source to build against hwe, but xrdp recommends 'xorgxrdp' and I'm not sure if there's a 'soft' way to fix that without having a separate source of xrdp as well
<kenvandine> tjaalton: not in bionic
<kenvandine> xorgxrdp is built from the xrdp source
<kenvandine> cosmic and later had a separate source
<tjaalton> kenvandine: ah, true
<tjaalton> kenvandine: pushed to ppa:canonical-x/x-staging, renamed all binaries built by src:xrdp
<tjaalton> now someone still needs to test it
<kenvandine> tjaalton: thanks
<kenvandine> We'll build images with that ppa
<kenvandine> tjaalton: I'll let you know how it goes tomorrow
#ubuntu-desktop 2019-07-24
<jamesh> robert_ancell: packagekit-control is merged to master, so you should be able to experiment with it once the next version of core is released on the edge channel
<jamesh> hopefully appstream-metadata goes in today
<robert_ancell> nice!
<didrocks> good morning
<duflu> Morning didrocks
<didrocks> hey duflu
<jibel> hi all
<didrocks> salut jibel
<duflu> Morning jibel
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<didrocks> salut oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> salut didrocks
<duflu> Morning oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> hey duflu
<willcooke> morning
<Trevinho> morning
<duflu> Morning willcooke and Trevinho
<willcooke> afternoon duflu
<didrocks> cking: hey! I'm wondering if we didn't get hit by a regression in zfs 0.8. (bug #1837717). I wonder if this is forcibly upstream or if we have distro patch you know of that can impact the ordering?
<ubot5> bug 1837717 in zfs-linux (Ubuntu) "[0.8 regression] zfs mount -a dataset mount ordering issues" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1837717
<cking> didrocks, we don't have many patches on zfs nowadays, so it's probably an upstream issue
<cking> i'll try and get around to this asap, but I have some high priority contract work to do first
<didrocks> cking: sure, meanwhile, I'm trying -3 from debian, just in case
<didrocks> confirming that 0.8.1-3 can reproduce the issue
<didrocks> cking: it seems to be quite close to https://github.com/zfsonlinux/zfs/issues/8833
<didrocks> and so https://github.com/zfsonlinux/zfs/pull/8878
<didrocks> if you don't have time, mind if I cherry-pick/test?
<cking> didrocks, yep, try it. does ZFS_SERIAL_MOUNT help?
<didrocks> cking: I'm looking
<didrocks> cking: can't reproduce the issue with it exported, indeed. Ok, so it seems it won't be as horrible as it sounded to be :)
<didrocks> I'll give some good testing and probably upload next week
<cking> didrocks, +1 thanks
<didrocks> yw ;)
<kenvandine> tjaalton: I built an Hyper-V image with your PPA enabled and confirmed if fixes bug 1817225
<ubot5> bug 1817225 in xrdp (Ubuntu) "18.04.2 breaks xrdp" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1817225
<kenvandine> tjaalton: can you SRU that?
<hggdh> the membership on Bugconntrol for the Canonical Desktop Team expited yesterday. Is this on purpose, or would you want it re-instated?
<jibel> hggdh, not on purpose. Can you add it back?
<jibel> please
<hggdh> jibel: on it
<hggdh> jibel: done
<jibel> hggdh, thank you
<jibel> willcooke, ^
<willcooke> ah nice one, thanks hggdh!
<willcooke> I emailed Brian, I will unemail him
<hggdh> willcooke: no need, I re-added it in.
<willcooke> yeah, just telling Brian that he doesn't need to do anything
<tjaalton> kenvandine: yep
<tjaalton> kenvandine: infinity told me this isn't rc for .3 though
<tjaalton> release critical
<kenvandine> bummer
<kenvandine> we need it to be able to release the hyper-v image :/
<tjaalton> since cloud images are dailies
<kenvandine> this isn't a usual cloud image
<tjaalton> ok, talk to him then
<kenvandine> this gets published in microsoft's hyper-v quick create gallery
<kenvandine> infinity: ^^
<kenvandine> bug 1817225 blocks the hyper-v desktop image of 18.04.3 that microsoft publishes in their gallery
<ubot5> bug 1817225 in xrdp (Ubuntu) "18.04.2 breaks xrdp" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1817225
<kenvandine> these aren't dailies like other cloud images
<tjaalton> it doesn't block the sru though, just a question of priority
<kenvandine> understood
<tjaalton> hum, i'll grab my laptop and upload it to the queue...
<kenvandine> tjaalton: thanks!
<tjaalton> kenvandine: maybe you could test another version, which only builds xorgxrdp?
<kenvandine> you mean just xorgxrdp-hwe-18.04?
<kenvandine> which depends on xrdp?
<tjaalton> kenvandine: it doesn't depend on xrdp, but provides xorgxrdp which I hope is enough to fix installing xrdp..
<tjaalton> the dep is the other way around
<kenvandine> ah
<kenvandine> ok, i can try that
<tjaalton> kenvandine: actually, you should be able to simulate it by replacing xrdp-hwe-18.04 with xrdp
<tjaalton> if you have an instance with it in disposal
<tjaalton> in/at
<tjaalton> would cut the time needed to verify this theory
<kenvandine> sure
<kenvandine> tjaalton: yes, that works
<kenvandine> with xorgxrdp-hwe-18.04 and xrdp installed
<tjaalton> kenvandine: oh cool
<tjaalton> I'll upload that version then
<tjaalton> thanks
<kenvandine> tjaalton: thank you!
<tjaalton> yw
<tjaalton> and now I'm off again ->
<infinity> kenvandine: Where/how are the hyperv images built?
<kenvandine> fginther's team builds them
<infinity> kenvandine: So, they're cloud images. :P
<kenvandine> in the past i was adhoc
<kenvandine> but we are formalizing it a bit more
<kenvandine> but they aren't quite like cloud images
<infinity> And what's put in the store is a blessed daily that all parties decide is good to go.
<kenvandine> we have to publish a version on partner-images and microsoft has to update their gallery to point to it
<kenvandine> it's not a rolling thing
<infinity> It's not part of my .3 release process.
<infinity> Yes, I know how the gallery works.
<kenvandine> yeah, but we try to give them the image as close to release as possible
<infinity> Just because we don't upload them daily doesn't mean it's not a cloud image that follows the same out-of-cadence non-rules.
<kenvandine> ok
<infinity> Anyhow, given the hwe thingee is a NEW package with an entirely new binary, I don't imagine it'll be a big deal to get it through, just that I personally don't view it as an on fire RC thing for my point release, s'all.
<oSoMoN> have a good evening/rest of the day everyone!
<willcooke> night all
#ubuntu-desktop 2019-07-25
<didrocks> good morning
<duflu> Morning didrocks
<didrocks> hey duflu
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<duflu> Hi oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> hey duflu
<marcustomlinson> morning all
<Trevinho> morning all!
<duflu> Morning marcustomlinson and Trevinho
<willcooke> morning
<willcooke> I thought it was Friday today
<duflu> Morning willcooke
<willcooke> Urgh.  28 in my office and it's only 0935
<didrocks> willcooke: 28.8 here! But all closed since 8am
<willcooke> :((((
<didrocks> 3rd days it's 39-40 max outside
<didrocks> still tomorrow and then, we are losing 10 degres on Saturday, finally
<oSoMoN> willcooke, it definitely feels like a Friday
 * didrocks can make it a Friday if you want :)
<oSoMoN> shall I prepare a SRU for bug #1837437 ?
<ubot5> bug 1837437 in libblockdev (Ubuntu Disco) "disk content permanently lost when changing LUKS password" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1837437
<willcooke> oSoMoN, ooooh, yes please.  Thank you!
<didrocks> xnox: hey, do you mind pushing your grub2 upload to the git branch? Thx!
<didrocks> cyphermox: hum, our grub zfs patch was split in multiple patches, to mirror 10_linux split, with for instance ubuntu recovery in a separate patch and so onâ¦ It's not the case anymore, was that on purpose?
<oSoMoN> willcooke, I attached a debdiff to the bug report, need someone to sponsor it
<didrocks> also, some part staged in git has been removed and push -f with the merge
<oSoMoN> I'll update the bug description to the SRU format in a moment
<didrocks> the goal with to separate the upstreamable part with the ubuntu specific things, like in 10_linux, hence the split in 6 patches, but it's all lost now :/
<xnox> didrocks999:  hmmmm yes....
<xnox> didrocks999:  let me try to find it.
<didrocks999> thx!
<xnox> didrocks:  it uses that weird thing for patches right?
<didrocks> xnox: git dpm yeah
<didrocks> (which is better than gbp IMHO)
<didrocks> having used both :p
<xnox> didrocks:  but also abandoned and not maintained anymore
<xnox> (or at least it was at one point)
 * didrocks almost generalized that to most of tools we are using :)
<markmorlino> Is this a good place to ask a gnome/gdm/greeter desktop login configuration question?
<didrocks> markmorlino: this is more a developer channel, for support, it's more #ubuntu
<markmorlino> thanks didrocks
<didrocks> yw :)
<xnox> didrocks:  git-dpm import-dsc generated 89 commits, which seems.... odd.... unless that is normal....
<didrocks> xnox: hum, I think you need git dpm apply-patch rather, but cyphermox can confirm, he's using dpm more than I do
<cyphermox> wat
<cyphermox> didrocks: the undo of the split was on purpose, yes
<cyphermox> it's easier for me to merge it that way, and we'll upstream everything (none of this is ubuntu specific)
<cyphermox> xnox: you shouldn't need import-dsc? what were you trying to do?
<didrocks> cyphermox: the patches like "recovery" and so on in 10_linux are ubuntu specific
<didrocks> cyphermox: and we lost the staged changes
<didrocks> like the awk -> shell rewrite
<didrocks> sounds like a git push -f was done
<didrocks> we did spend a long time splitting on purpose for maintainability and upstreamability, would have been good to talk before taking decision of flattening it
<didrocks> and to be able to upstream, we'll have to split it back now
<didrocks> (+ readd what was erased)
<cyphermox> didrocks: I don't think so; it'll be fine, and I'll handle this myself
<cyphermox> ie. some of it would actually be good to have in Debian anyway, modulo some very small pieces
<cyphermox> so; what part was lost?
<cyphermox> worst case, we can pick things back up from LP directly, the patches should apply cleanly if simply replaced by the old ones (ie. a rebase, I can do if necessary)
<cyphermox> grub merges are no fun, I'm doing the best I can with the number of changes upstream, in debian, and our patches
<didrocks> cyphermox: well, we plan to upstream most of it, but not the ubuntu specific part
<didrocks> which is we the split
<didrocks> the part that is lost are staged changes in the git repo
<didrocks> which was removed, because git push -f
<didrocks> (I guess)
<cyphermox> well, yeah, but I disagree with the need to split to be able to upstream things, it's irrelevant when I'll be merging things upstream myself next week (I just need a quick pause from my move)
<didrocks> we had a changelog describing the changes we introduced, which was:https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/sYWz4fBjtp/
<didrocks> 4 days of work
<didrocks> cyphermox: so, why do we have the 10_linux changes split?
<didrocks> cyphermox: I guess it's either both are split, or either both are in a single patch
<didrocks> and what about the change above? ^
<cyphermox> let's back up for a sec
<cyphermox> are the changes currently in eoan good?
<didrocks> no
<didrocks> they were only staged in the grub git repo
<didrocks> to not screw up your merge
<cyphermox> oh, you mean they were staged and not uploaded?
<cyphermox> we might have been pushing right around the same moment; because what I uploaded was exactly what was in the archive
<didrocks> cyphermox: the changes are staged in the git repo, I didn't upload them, it was in June
<didrocks> and the git repo don't have them anymore
<didrocks> (so not an upload clash, but a vcs erase)
<cyphermox> why would you stage stuff in a git master branch and not task to people about it?
<didrocks> cyphermox: we did talk about our zfs work
<cyphermox> not to me.
<didrocks> you were on the channel
<cyphermox> anyway, I think I have a copy of it here.
<didrocks> we talked about git dpm
<didrocks> and why did you git push -f without looking what you are erasing?
<didrocks> I mean, VCS are meant for this
<cyphermox> you asked about git-dpm, I had no idea what you were working on
<cyphermox> yeah, that's why we have branches
<didrocks> well, it's ready to be uploaded
<didrocks> but didn't worth an upload on itself to screw up your merge
<didrocks> we tried to be nice with you, didn't think one seconde someone would do a git push -f
<cyphermox> it wasn't clear to me that some things were staged and not uploaded, when there was something uploaded too (https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/grub2/2.02+dfsg1-12ubuntu3)
<cyphermox> I think I have a copy of the old stuff, one minute
<didrocks> why do you git push -f ?
<didrocks> ok
<didrocks> at least, we can get it back
<cyphermox> because merges are a pain and that's what I had to do
<didrocks> well, maybe using a git dpm branch, if we can't avoid git push -f, isn't the right tool?
<cyphermox> please, next time use a different branch than master/ubuntu if you're staging things somewhere to not interfere with people
<cyphermox> I'll restore code in a branch called 'didrocks' if I have it, after our team meeting
<didrocks> cyphermox: the thing was ready to upload
<didrocks> so it shouldn't be a separate branch
<didrocks> we just didn't want to add more work for your merge
<didrocks> cyphermox: so please use a VCS and don't git push -f
<cyphermox> didrocks: it *is* a vcs and I did as much as I could, and in this particular case, git push -f was the right thing to do.
<cyphermox> errors and clash happen, let's see if we can't fix things now
<didrocks> I strongly disagree that we can argue that git push -f is the right thing to do in any case
<Laney> surely git revert, if anything; push -f is just a recipe for making life difficult for others
<didrocks> but let's see if you can restore the branch and we'll spend the days to redo things
<cyphermox> why would you have to redo anything?
<didrocks> I need to recheck the changes in debian/patches, as in my branch, the content was split
<cyphermox> with the original patches I can just drop / re-apply the right ones in a rebase
<didrocks> so, I won't reapply all patches without looking at the diff
<didrocks> and ensure we revert anything from your merge
<cyphermox> this isn't complicated. I'll set you up with a 'didrocks*' branches, and then you can have a look if there's anything missing
<didrocks> thx
<oSoMoN> that's all folks, see ya all tomorrow
<hggdh> on Eoan: is it expected that the new Chromium (snap) is installed, but I get a warning stating /snap/bin is not in my path? https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/8v58VDktfB/
<hggdh> (and no request to logout/in or reboot?)
<willcooke> hggdh, I think snaps are still broken on E
<hggdh> ah
<willcooke> hggdh, there was a kernel issue and perhaps also a seeding issues
<hggdh> ok, so no need for a bug, I guess
<willcooke> they're known and fixes are en route
<willcooke> dont think so
<willcooke> thanks for noticing
<hggdh> yw. Thank you for the prompt response
<willcooke> np
<xnox> cyphermox:  trying to commit my manual upload of grub to the git-dpm repo
<tkamppeter> Laney, hi
<Laney> hello tkamppeter
<Laney> not really around reliably this week
<tkamppeter> Laney, I have solved the nm.py, see my merge request (and I have also fixed your inline remarks for the debuggability improvement part)
<Laney> ok, will look when I get a chance
<tkamppeter> Laney, could you have another look if you find some time? Thanks.
<willcooke> night all
#ubuntu-desktop 2019-07-26
<didrocks> good morning
<duflu> Morning didrocks
<jibel> hi all
<duflu> Hi jibel
<didrocks> hey duflu, salut jibel
<Gargoyle> o/
<didrocks> hey Gargoyle
<marcustomlinson> morning all
<duflu> Hi Gargoyle and marcustomlinson
<didrocks> hey marcustomlinson
<Trevinho> morning...
<didrocks> hey Trevinho
<Trevinho> hi didrocks! Affected by the big France hotness as well?
<didrocks> Trevinho: oh yeah, fortunately, should be last day today (40Â°C again, for the 5th day in a row)
<didrocks> you as well?
<duflu> Morning Trevinho
<Trevinho> didrocks: not really... Florence is the only hot city these days (but still around 40), but I'm not there now, so just pleasant 3x degrees but with nice wind
<didrocks> Trevinho: lucky you ;)
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<Wimpress> Morning o/
<didrocks> salut oSoMoN, Wimpress
<oSoMoN> hey Wimpress
<oSoMoN> salut didrocks
<jibel> duflu, can you please not close reports that have been triaged even if they are for older releases
<jibel> especially on projects you don't maintain
<jibel> I'm referring to bug 1724058
<ubot5> bug 1724058 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "installer crashed after marking / (root) for formatting" [Critical,Won't fix] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1724058
<jibel> and won't fix is inappropriate
<jibel> please just don't touch installer bugs
<willcooke> oops.  Morning all :)
<willcooke> Had a meeting at 9am and forgot to say hi
<willcooke> Good news... it's raining \o/ \o/ \o/
<willcooke> It's a mere 22 now
<oSoMoN> morning willcooke
<ogra> oSoMoN, so your wife is the daughter of a package tape manufacturer, correct ? .... (the package arrived ;) thanks a lot !)
<oSoMoN> heh :)
<oSoMoN> glad it arrived before the week-end, you never know with the Spanish post
<oSoMoN> I might have been heavy-handed with the tapeâ¦ but better safe than sorry!
<ogra> yeah ... well, i'm happy the package didnt melt on the way here :)
<willcooke> :)
 * didrocks still melting, can't wait for tomorrow
<ogra> yeah
<duflu> jibel, sorry if I trod on anyones toes there. Also not sorry that I tried to clean things up because obviously ubiquity needs help
<duflu> I feel I can't publish that graph week after week and ignore it
<duflu> Morning willcooke
<duflu> I find in every 1000 bugs I close about 2 or 3 people complain so I consider that a good percentage
<duflu> jibel, also if you want to reopen an artful-only bug then you should ideally state why, and which newer release is affected. In this case it looks like bionic
<ogra> oSoMoN, here is one for you to ponder about https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/chromium-does-not-work-with-local-mdns-avahi-name-resolution/12483
<oSoMoN> looking
<oSoMoN> ogra, as things stand, would a layout to override /etc/nsswitch.conf work?
<ogra> hmm, not sure, nsswitch.conf is a libc thing IIRC ... a layout might be ignored on that level
<ogra> (since you use libc from core)
<ogra> would be worth a test though
<oSoMoN> ogra, I'm testing on my laptop with the avahi daemon running, and `python3 -m http.server 8000`, and the chromium snap correctly resolves http://bribon.local:8000, so it seems to be working, is my test not meaningful?
<willcooke> night all
#ubuntu-desktop 2020-07-20
<callmepk> good morning
<duflu> Morning callmepk 
<callmepk> morning duflu 
<didrocks> good morning
<duflu> Hi didrocks 
<didrocks> hey duflu 
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<duflu> Hey oSoMoN 
<oSoMoN> hey duflu 
<didrocks> salut oSoMoN, Ã§a va ?
<oSoMoN> salut didrocks, Ã§a va bien, et toi?
<didrocks> Ã§a va :) week-end de peinture encore et toujours :)
<oSoMoN> courage, lâeffort vaut la peine! (dit le mec qui dÃ©teste la peinture)
<didrocks> hÃ©hÃ© :)
<didrocks> merci
<Laney> sup
 * duflu nods at Laney
<marcustomlinson> morning callmepk duflu didrocks oSoMoN seb128 Laney
<duflu> Hi marcustomlinson 
<didrocks> hey hey Laney, marcustomlinson 
<callmepk> Hey marcustomlinson didrocks oSoMoN seb128 Laney 
<luna_> morning
<didrocks> hey callmepk, morning luna_ 
<duflu> Morning luna_ 
<seb128> goood morning desktopers
<seb128> hey Laney marcustomlinson callmepk oSoMoN luna_ didrocks
<Laney> moin duflu marcustomlinson didrocks luna_ and callmepk 
<Laney> happy monday
<Laney> or something
<seb128> indeed, did you have a good weekend desktopers?
<duflu> seb128, yes though leaving the house still feels strange. I know how to do it but it's unfamiliar :)
<duflu> You, seb128?
<seb128> :-)
<seb128> w.e was nice, we enjoyed the nice weather here, did a bbq yesterday
<Laney> \o\
<Laney> yeah we got some nice weather too
<Laney> found some new lakes and went swimming there yesterday
<seb128> sounds like a nice way to enjoy summer :-)
<jamesh> I spent part of the weekend teaching myself a bit about GStreamer Editing Services in order to edit together a video of the talk I gave last week
<duflu> jamesh, isn't that effectively editing video without a GUI?
<duflu> You're keen
<jamesh> duflu: yes.  I wanted to convert a BigBlueButton recording into a single video file, but it gives me a bunch of individual assets (camera, screenshare, slides) plus metadata to combine them in a browser
<jamesh> so download the assets and use the metadata to produce an edit list
<jamesh> turned out to be a lot easier than dealing with GStreamer directly
<frederikf[m][m]> test
<oerheks> :-)
<Laney> HMM
<KGB-1> gnome-shell tags c7b9118 Marco Trevisan upstream/3.36.4 * Upstream version 3.36.4 * https://deb.li/8rpc
<KGB-1> gnome-shell upstream/3.36.x 9c8eae7 Marco Trevisan * pushed 39 commits (first 5 follow) * https://deb.li/372J2
<KGB-1> gnome-shell upstream/3.36.x 2e8ade4 Florian MÃ¼llner js/ui/calendar.js * calendar: Do less work in hasEvents() * https://deb.li/enKi
<KGB-1> gnome-shell upstream/3.36.x 9f87ffc Milan Crha (6 files in 4 dirs) * calendar-server: Improve performance by properly using ECalClientView * https://deb.li/3aFah
<KGB-1> gnome-shell upstream/3.36.x fae7ba5 Robert Mader src/st/st-label.c * Revert "st-label: Keep labels fully pre-rendered on the GPU" * https://deb.li/rrxn
<KGB-1> gnome-shell upstream/3.36.x 25a8f48 Florian MÃ¼llner js/ui/unlockDialog.js * unlockDialog: Fix scale-factor handling on multihead * https://deb.li/3fBm7
<KGB-1> gnome-shell upstream/3.36.x 2226989 Daniel ÈerbÄnescu po/ro.po * Update Romanian translation * https://deb.li/MbPU
<KGB-1> gnome-shell pristine-tar d31754c Marco Trevisan (TreviÃ±o) gnome-shell_3.36.4.orig.tar.xz.delta gnome-shell_3.36.4.orig.tar.xz.id * pristine-tar data for gnome-shell_3.36.4.orig.tar.xz * https://deb.li/i4XuF
<KGB-0> mutter signed tags 51e3a26 Marco Trevisan ubuntu/3.36.4-1ubuntu1 * mutter Debian release 3.36.4-1ubuntu1 * https://deb.li/3lFuC
<KGB-0> mutter ubuntu/master 1c78031 Marco Trevisan * pushed 51 commits (first 5 follow) * https://deb.li/92mh
<KGB-0> mutter ubuntu/master 9b349cb Jonas Ãdahl src/wayland/ meta-wayland-legacy-xdg-shell.c meta-wayland-surface.c meta-wayland-surface.h meta-wayland-xdg-shell.c * wayland/shell: Apply geometry after subsurface state application * https://deb.li/3qAqy
<KGB-0> mutter ubuntu/master 36a6235 Jonas Ãdahl src/wayland/meta-wayland-xdg-shell.c * wayland/xdg-shell: Don't use xdg_surface private to get window geometry * https://deb.li/35bQc
<KGB-0> mutter ubuntu/master 3a70ba7 Daniel van Vugt src/compositor/meta-shaped-texture.c * shaped-texture: Use the REPLACE combine function on opaque areas * https://deb.li/PbJ7
<KGB-0> mutter ubuntu/master 86d9cd1 Olivier Fourdan src/backends/meta-remote-desktop-session.c * remote-desktop: Check for screencast only when required * https://deb.li/3Jnpd
<KGB-0> mutter ubuntu/master ae8acc9 Robert Mader src/compositor/meta-surface-actor.c * surface-actor: Add culling offset for geometry scale - take 2 * https://deb.li/nBaF
<xnox> Laney: seb128: Wimpress: ubuntu desktop daily in groovy is now 624M in size. about 20% of the whole iso. As there are now a lot more nvidia drivers available.
<xnox> I don't know if we can or want to curate them.
<xnox> there is now 390 418-server 435 440-server 450 450-server
<seb128> tseliot_, ^
<xnox> also for both amd64 & i386 userspace libs
<xnox> i.e. libnvidia-compute-390
<xnox> seb128:  i think the glob is wide in the desktop seed, and i don't know if we should be like excluding -server ones, or not.
<seb128> I'm not really aware of the nvidia details so I will let Wimpress and tseliot_ reply on those
<Laney> I support the advice to talk to Alberto
<xnox> cool
<seb128> or maybe Laney if he does have an opinion
<xnox> yeah, i don't know details either, just noticed that we now have amd64 oversized marker
<tseliot_> xnox, we prefer the non -server flavours by default in ubuntu-drivers. The -server flavours are recommended for -server workloads. We provide signed modules for all of them. We will probably get more -server drivers in the future
<tseliot_> the -server drivers are "enterprise ready" drivers, and I would expect them to be used for CUDA workloads, etc. 
<Laney> tseliot_: I guess the question is if there's any reason to include those on the iso atm
<tseliot_> Laney, seb128, xnox dropping the -server flavours from the desktop image should be fine. We can revisit in the future, if we change our mind.
<Laney> ah
<Laney> xnox: go for it then
<Laney> callmepk: hey, is https://code.launchpad.net/~callmepk/livecd-rootfs/+git/livecd-rootfs/+merge/387300 supposed to be fixed for 20.04.1? if so, could you answer David's questions/concerns please?
<Laney> I'm going to upload that package so I can include your stuff in there if so
<Laney> oh man, that hyperv hacks file ððððð
<Laney> xnox: do you have something to push for ubiquity 20.04.15.1?
<KGB-1> gnome-shell signed tags f27d13d Marco Trevisan ubuntu/3.36.4-1ubuntu1 * gnome-shell Debian release 3.36.4-1ubuntu1 * https://deb.li/DZq1
<KGB-1> gnome-shell ubuntu/master 671fa1a Marco Trevisan * pushed 53 commits (first 5 follow) * https://deb.li/3RVwN
<KGB-1> gnome-shell ubuntu/master d76c219 Florian MÃ¼llner js/ui/keyboard.js * keyboard: Request a bigger size in portrait orientation * https://deb.li/kAg0
<KGB-1> gnome-shell ubuntu/master 12b31e6 Sebastian Keller js/ui/altTab.js * altTab: Remove down arrow when removing an app from switcher * https://deb.li/TJoV
<KGB-1> gnome-shell ubuntu/master afb4057 MOZGIII js/ui/dateMenu.js * dateMenu: Do not ellipsize clock * https://deb.li/i3MEg
<KGB-1> gnome-shell ubuntu/master 390431c Koki Fukuda subprojects/extensions-tool/src/command-create.c * extensions-tool: Escape '\' and '"' in json string * https://deb.li/Qciz
<KGB-1> gnome-shell ubuntu/master 96699b9 Peter Simonyi js/ui/status/ brightness.js volume.js * status: Pass scroll events to volume and brightness sliders * https://deb.li/3HMcs
<oSoMoN> ricotz, FYI: https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1651330
<ubot5> Mozilla bug 1651330 in Search "Add Ubuntu's distribution configuration to the modern search engine configuration" [N/a,New]
<oSoMoN> IÂ plan on testing this with beta builds tomorrow
<ricotz> oSoMoN, hey, thank you
<xnox> Laney: let me check.
<xnox> Laney: pushed, with tag
#ubuntu-desktop 2020-07-21
<callmepk> good morning
<callmepk> gotcha, currently we are testing its performance so sorry for not replying for a while. I will try to update it Laney 
<didrocks> good morning
<duflu> Hi callmepk and didrocks 
<callmepk> Hi didrocks and duflu 
<didrocks> hey duflu, callmepk 
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<didrocks> salut salut oSoMoN 
<oSoMoN> salut didrocks 
<duflu> Morning oSoMoN 
<oSoMoN> hey duflu 
<seb128> goood morning desktopers
<didrocks> hey seb128 
<oSoMoN> salut seb128 
<duflu> Morning seb128 
<seb128> hey didrocks, oSoMoN, duflu, how are you today?
<duflu> seb128, going average but good. You?
<didrocks> seb128: good good, thanks, and you?
<seb128> I'm alright, could do with more sleep but that's usual
<Laney> HEYYYY
<duflu> HI LANEY
<marcustomlinson> hellooo
<duflu> lo marcustomlinson 
<oSoMoN> I didn't sleep much but I feel good (for now)
<oSoMoN> let's see how the day goes
<oSoMoN> hey Laney, marcustomlinson 
<callmepk> hi oSoMoN seb128 Laney 
<oSoMoN> hey callmepk 
<didrocks> hey Laney 
<seb128> hey Laney, marcustomlinson, callmepk, how are you?
<marcustomlinson> hey duflu oSoMoN seb128
<callmepk> I am great seb128 how are you?
<callmepk> Also hi marcustomlinson 
<marcustomlinson> hey callmepk
<seb128> callmepk, I'm alright, just a bit tired
<Laney> moin duflu oSoMoN callmepk diddledan and seb128!
<Laney> well
<Laney> diddledan gets a bonus hi :>
<Laney> hi didrocks too
<didrocks> haha, I think he is used to it
<marcustomlinson> I'm marcushaslam sometimes
<Laney> I always tab complete on three letters
<Laney> UNFAIR
<didrocks> unfair I wasnât the first on your completion!
<Laney> it should do it by most recently spoke
<didrocks> yeah, thatâs how I setup weechat
<Laney> dunno how to do it on irssi
<didrocks> I donât think itâs built-in. Thatâs basically how p_itti sold me on weechat :)
<didrocks> maybe a plugin?
 * Laney gives up :p
<seb128> Trevinho, Laney, jamesh, weekly summary reminder
<seb128> tkamppeter, ^
<Trevinho> seb128: oh, thanks :), I just dismissed the dialog reminding it without doing anything :-D
<seb128> easier to dismiss than do the work right? ;-)
<Laney> thx
<diddledan> Haha. Hi, laney! Tab complete for the win ð
<tkamppeter> seb128, done
<seb128> tkamppeter, thanks
<frederikf[m][m]> "morning"
<seb128> hey frederikf[m][m], how are you?
<KGB-2> mutter signed tags d635766 Marco Trevisan ubuntu/3.36.4-0ubuntu0.20.04.1 * mutter Debian release 3.36.4-0ubuntu0.20.04.1 * https://deb.li/c7qh
<KGB-2> mutter ubuntu/focal c859cb9 Marco Trevisan * pushed 42 commits (first 5 follow) * https://deb.li/3GYwc
<KGB-2> mutter ubuntu/focal bb4bd4b Sebastian Keller src/core/meta-clipboard-manager.c * core: Free clipboard selection source on shutdown * https://deb.li/3DQLV
<KGB-2> mutter ubuntu/focal 70072c3 Sebastian Keller src/wayland/ meta-wayland-data-offer-primary-legacy.c meta-wayland-data-offer-primary.c meta-wayland-data-offer.c meta-xwayland-dnd.c * wayland: Free selection streams streams after transfer * https://deb.li/V6W1
<KGB-2> mutter ubuntu/focal b8bd397 Sebastian Keller src/wayland/meta-wayland-data-device.c * wayland/data-device: Don't create and leak unused memory on dnd * https://deb.li/3Tr8N
<KGB-2> mutter ubuntu/focal a83d83f Jonas Ãdahl src/wayland/ meta-wayland-legacy-xdg-shell.c meta-wayland-xdg-shell.c * wayland: Remove a couple of stray newlines * https://deb.li/LEkc
<KGB-2> mutter ubuntu/focal 9b349cb Jonas Ãdahl src/wayland/ meta-wayland-legacy-xdg-shell.c meta-wayland-surface.c meta-wayland-surface.h meta-wayland-xdg-shell.c * wayland/shell: Apply geometry after subsurface state application * https://deb.li/3qAqy
<KGB-2> gnome-shell signed tags e909c3a Marco Trevisan ubuntu/3.36.4-1ubuntu1_20.04.1 * gnome-shell Debian release 3.36.4-1ubuntu1~20.04.1 * https://deb.li/3wCoC
<KGB-2> gnome-shell ubuntu/focal 93970c2 Marco Trevisan * pushed 56 commits (first 5 follow) * https://deb.li/it5rG
<KGB-2> gnome-shell ubuntu/focal 390431c Koki Fukuda subprojects/extensions-tool/src/command-create.c * extensions-tool: Escape '\' and '"' in json string * https://deb.li/Qciz
<KGB-2> gnome-shell ubuntu/focal 96699b9 Peter Simonyi js/ui/status/ brightness.js volume.js * status: Pass scroll events to volume and brightness sliders * https://deb.li/3HMcs
<KGB-2> gnome-shell ubuntu/focal 7dce433 Florian MÃ¼llner (6 files in 5 dirs) * Bump version to 3.36.4 * https://deb.li/GYF
<KGB-2> gnome-shell ubuntu/focal 9c8eae7 Marco Trevisan (TreviÃ±o) (33 files in 15 dirs) * New upstream version 3.36.4 * https://deb.li/3OkO1
<KGB-2> gnome-shell ubuntu/focal 02c1f37 Marco Trevisan (TreviÃ±o) (33 files in 15 dirs) * Update upstream source from tag 'upstream/3.36.4' * https://deb.li/bNTd
<seb128> oh, it's already meeting time!
<didrocks> yeah!
<hellsworth> good morning folks
<seb128> hey Heather
<seb128> you are doing alright today?
<seb128> k, let's get started
<oSoMoN> morning hellsworth 
<seb128> #startmeeting Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2020-07-21
<meetingology> Meeting started Tue Jul 21 13:31:17 2020 UTC.  The chair is seb128. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/mxaCZTVc | GNOME 3.36 work claiming / tracking: https://trello.com/b/z29JJK3q/gnome-336 | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2020-07-21 | Current topic:
<seb128> Roll call:  didrocks, duflu (out), heather, jamesh (out), jibel (out), kenvandine, laney, marcustomlinson, oSoMoN, tkamppeter, trevinho, robert_ancell (out)
<kenvandine> \o
<Trevinho> o/
<marcustomlinson> o/
<oSoMoN> ol
<hellsworth> o\
<seb128> alright, seems like we have enough people to start!
<seb128> #topic rls-bb-bug
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/mxaCZTVc | GNOME 3.36 work claiming / tracking: https://trello.com/b/z29JJK3q/gnome-336 | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2020-07-21 | Current topic: rls-bb-bug
<seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-bb-incoming-bug-tasks.html
<seb128> one old bug there that got bounced back to me, I will handle that later
<seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-bb-tracking-bug-tasks.html
<seb128> bug #1887610	
<ubot5> bug 1887610 in OEM Priority Project "[SRU]There is no available audio entry in sound settings after execute suspend in 'Performance mode'" [Critical,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1887610
<seb128> that's being handled by Hui and I'm doing sponsoring for him, I will assign now
<seb128> and that's it
<seb128> #topic rls-ff-bug
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/mxaCZTVc | GNOME 3.36 work claiming / tracking: https://trello.com/b/z29JJK3q/gnome-336 | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2020-07-21 | Current topic: rls-ff-bug
<seb128> one pulseaudio - snap one assigned to James there
<seb128> I think we discussed it and just failed to target, I will do that
<seb128> only incoming one
<seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-ff-tracking-bug-tasks.html
<kenvandine> seb128: thanks
<seb128> the list there seems alright
<seb128> #topic rls-gg-bug
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/mxaCZTVc | GNOME 3.36 work claiming / tracking: https://trello.com/b/z29JJK3q/gnome-336 | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2020-07-21 | Current topic: rls-gg-bug
<seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-gg-incoming-bug-tasks.html
<seb128> assigned bugs so probably just need to be targetted now
<seb128> we discussed them in previous weeks
<seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-gg-tracking-bug-tasks.html
<seb128> the bugs there are assigned
<seb128> #topic update_excuses_by_team.html#desktop-packages
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/mxaCZTVc | GNOME 3.36 work claiming / tracking: https://trello.com/b/z29JJK3q/gnome-336 | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2020-07-21 | Current topic: update_excuses_by_team.html#desktop-packages
<seb128> https://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/proposed-migration/update_excuses_by_team.html#desktop-packages
<seb128> the pygobject ones seem foundations material
<seb128> libreoffice propably just needs a retry
<seb128> and firefox is building
<seb128> the list is in pretty decent shape atm :)
<seb128> #topic AOB
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/mxaCZTVc | GNOME 3.36 work claiming / tracking: https://trello.com/b/z29JJK3q/gnome-336 | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2020-07-21 | Current topic: AOB
<seb128> any other topic?
<didrocks> (surprising for that stage of the cycle, but letâs wait for FF for the list going crazy :p)
<seb128> right
<seb128> +1 rotation probably helps a bit, also we didn't do much landings and Debian cares about autopkgtest test results as well nowadays which helps
<seb128> but yeah, it's nice to see the list short :)
<marcustomlinson> good job guys :)
<seb128> oh, a reminder that focal .1 is in a few weeks, now is about time to upload your SRU for it if you still want to try to squeeze a fix on the iso
<seb128> and nag the SRU team to get things approved if needed
<Trevinho> yeah, I've to nag them indeed
<seb128> k, since it seems there is no other topic I'm wrapping on that note
<seb128> short efficient one
<seb128> thanks!
<seb128> #endmeeting
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/mxaCZTVc | GNOME 3.36 work claiming / tracking: https://trello.com/b/z29JJK3q/gnome-336
<meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Jul 21 13:44:00 2020 UTC.  
<meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2020/ubuntu-desktop.2020-07-21-13.31.moin.txt
<kenvandine> thanks all
<kenvandine> especially seb128 :)
<seb128> :-)
<marcustomlinson> thanks!
<didrocks> Thanks!
<hellsworth> marcustomlinson: would you please relaunch some autopkg tests for me: https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/6JX2m87dHC/
<marcustomlinson> sure
<hellsworth> ty
<oSoMoN> thanks
<luna_> Is there any Ubuntu Desktop Meeting today during GUADEC? Or you already had it 
<seb128> luna_, it was over an hour ago
<luna_> seb128: ah too late again will read the log 
<seb128> the hour is the same evert week :)
<seb128> you should note it down on a postit :p
<luna_> seb128: yeah or move my Google calender thing to the right time
<luna_> or maybe jose should move it in the Fridge calendar nudge hint 
<seb128> Trevinho, could you check if what the user describes in https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-control-center/+bug/1881482 makes any sense to you?
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1873298 in gnome-control-center (Ubuntu Focal) "duplicate for #1881482 No way to enroll multiple fingers for identification" [Medium,Fix committed]
<Trevinho> seb128: I've marked it as duplicated, as it's basically the same we've addressed with the SRU
<seb128> Trevinho, ah, nice, thanks
<luna_> seb128: read it now, also new Stable Firefox on the Tuesday evening next week 
<oSoMoN> luna_, RC is already building in groovy:Â https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/firefox/79.0+build1-0ubuntu1
<luna_> oSoMoN: neat 
<luna_> there will be some more RCs before stable not sure when however we will have a meeting about that in 1,5 hour
<luna_> oSoMoN: next RCs will be released on Thursday and Friday or Saturday 
<oSoMoN> ack, thanks
#ubuntu-desktop 2020-07-22
<didrocks> good morning
<callmepk> morning didrocks 
<jamesh> hi didrocks, callmepk 
<callmepk> hi jamesh 
<duflu> Hi didrocks, callmepk, jamesh 
<duflu> Surprisingly busy at Scarborough today, jamesh
<duflu> (just did lunch)
<didrocks> hey duflu, callmepk, jamesh 
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<duflu> Hi oSoMoN 
<callmepk> hi duflu oSoMoN 
<didrocks> salut oSoMoN 
<Laney> hey
<duflu> Morning Laney and seb128 
<didrocks> hey Laney 
<Laney> duflu: I hope the herbs were in abundance
<Laney> & moin & moin didrocks 
<Laney> today you got tab completed properly
<seb128> goood morning desktopers!
<seb128> hey duflu, how are you?
<Laney> hey seb128 
<seb128> hey Laney, wie gehts?
<duflu> Laney?!
<duflu> I'm well seb128, you?
<Laney> nicht schlecht
<seb128> I'm great, had an uninterrupted night and I feel less tried as a result!
<duflu> gut
<Laney> duflu: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Ccgk8PXz64
<duflu> Righto. Though there was one guy who looked worryingly too high to cross the road safely
<Laney> Not the right kind of herb
<duflu> At least he was dancing. Entertaining
 * Laney shakes head
<didrocks> Laney: proper tab completion FTW!
<Laney> UPDATE MANAGERRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR
<didrocks> â¦R?
<didrocks> (I felt one was missing)
<Laney> ah yes you're right
<Laney> UPDATE MANAGERRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR
<Laney> it's always fun when you get to work on that
 * Laney looks at marcustomlinson for agreement
<marcustomlinson> nods
<didrocks> I felt do-release-upgrade was ok, unsure of update-manager, hasnât touched it for a long time (if ever?)
<Laney> slight element of sarcasm
<Laney> ask me in a week how much :>
<didrocks> lucky you, you will be able to compare!
<seb128> Laney, I'm sure it's nothing compared to britney *g*
<seb128> Laney, speaking of britney, did you see the foundation's channel comment about the csv having 0 (I guess they were speaking about the backlog value?)
<seb128> just mentioning it in case it's something interesting, feel free to ignore me if it's not
<Laney> what csv?
<Laney> no I didn't
<seb128> Laney, https://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/proposed-migration/update_excuses.csv
<Laney> k
<Laney> I dunno who's doing what with it, guess they can contact me if they have specifics
<seb128> right, makes sense
<seb128> tseliot, hey, do you know why https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nvidia-graphics-drivers-418-server was building on ppc and isn't anymore? it's not described in the changelog but blocking migration
<tseliot> seb128, we don't have the hardware to do the testing on, so we dropped it
<seb128> tseliot, oh, I see there was a 0ubuntu1 where it's documented, thx
<tseliot> np
<Laney> Trevinho: frederikf[m][m]: https://people.canonical.com/~laney/weird-things/checkbox.png got an opinion on whether this is a yaru bug or an update-manager one (e.g. should allocate more space for the checkbox)?
<Trevinho> Laney: looks like more a gtk / u-m one to me
<Laney> ok
<Laney> it's the same with adwaita too
<Laney> will see about fixing it with this update
<Trevinho> is it using a tree model?
<Laney> dunno
<Laney> probably
<marcustomlinson> Laney: what changes are you working on in u-m by the way?
<Laney> display if there's an oem support package to install, and do the installation
<marcustomlinson> ah ok
<marcustomlinson> jolly good show
 * marcustomlinson runs away
<Laney> I think that update-notifier should be running "ubuntu-drivers list-oem --package-list /run/ubuntu-drivers-oem.autoinstall" from time to time and spawning update-manager based on that
<Laney> don't really want to run that in process, it is kinda slow
<Laney> systemd timer unit
<Laney> SOUNDS GRRRREAAAATTTTT
<didrocks> I heard some great projects are using them :)
<luna_> GUADEC has started now btw 
<luna_> afternoon
<Trevinho> yeah, in more or less two hours will open 
<luna_> Trevinho: yeah the test stream starts in 10 minutes
<oSoMoN> ricotz, FYI https://bazaar.launchpad.net/~mozillateam/firefox/firefox.groovy/revision/1414
<oSoMoN> I smoke-tested it and it looks alright, but feedback welcome, and if it appears to be fine IÂ will apply to all release branches and merge back to beta branches
<ricotz> oSoMoN, great, ack
<Trevinho> Laney: since you're in update-manager lands, I've noticed in the GNOME session it shows the debian icon as "Ubuntu base" updates icon
<Trevinho> Laney: I expect because it's using XDG_CURRENT_DESKTOP instead of os-realease?
<Laney> Trevinho: It's a GThemedIcon "distributor-logo"
<Trevinho> Laney: mh, I see... well I noticed before I got it as debian logo in a virtual machine where I had GNOME session running
<Laney> I dunno how that works
<Laney> maybe that is influenced by the current desktop
<Laney> or XDG_DATA_DIRS or something
<Laney> fml
<Laney> if you're checking for gnome-terminal being installed in a script
<Laney> don't run the script in a chroot
#ubuntu-desktop 2020-07-23
<callmepk> good morning
<jamesh> hi callmepk
<callmepk> hi jamesh 
<didrocks> good morning
<duflu> Hi didrocks, and callmepk and jamesh 
<didrocks> hey duflu 
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<didrocks> salut oSoMoN 
<marcustomlinson> top o the mornin desktoppers
 * didrocks tries to find something funny to answer, but no inspiration yet, so good marcustomlinson morning, a coffee I need
<marcustomlinson> I think the official response to that in Ireland is "and the rest of the day to you"
<marcustomlinson> but that's only about a 4.1 on the funny scale
<marcustomlinson> also, hey didrocks
<didrocks> marcustomlinson: depends on your funny scale limit, is it 5 - 10 - 20?
<oSoMoN> salut didrocks 
<didrocks> (4.1 seems insanely accurate btw :p Iâm waiting for the 2 digits precision)
<oSoMoN> mornin' marcustomlinson 
<marcustomlinson> it's a scale of 1.3 to Z
<didrocks> soâ¦ supposively, I finally have an electric meter in the new house! I should be wired to the electric circuit this afternoon \o/
<marcustomlinson> hey oSoMoN
<marcustomlinson> didrocks: https://youtu.be/j1BNcSBApOU
<didrocks> marcustomlinson: I will be in that state of mind once connected to the wired phone grid. This will take between 3 and 6 months apparently
<oSoMoN> that long?
<didrocks> â¦and, to get fiber, you need the wired phone cable, ofc, no procedure without it
<didrocks> oSoMoN: monopole orange
<didrocks> took already 3 months to instruct the deposit pieces
<oSoMoN> man, that's even worse than where IÂ live
<didrocks> just to say that everything is there
<didrocks> (and you need to take photos of *their* infrastructure
<didrocks> like the number written on the phone infrastructure, where they are located, and so on
<didrocks> (and for all that service or rather non service, you still pay 100â¬ to instruct your demand)
<oSoMoN> sigh
<didrocks> oSoMoN: is it better in spain?
<didrocks> or still a nightmare, but slightly better?
<oSoMoN> I was lucky that fiber was already in my street, but it took me 3 months to convince the phone company to wire my house
<didrocks> but no need for phone cable at least?
<oSoMoN> (and numerous phone calls)
<oSoMoN> no, in the meantime they provided a 4G router
<didrocks> Iâm looking for a 4G modem for the interim period, because you canât subscribe to a 4G box by one the operator, as the neighbours have fibers, even if the address is unknownâ¦ itâs a kind of a dead loop
<didrocks> waow, way better service than here
<oSoMoN> so, not a great experience overall, but could've been worse
<didrocks> yeah, could be in France :)
<didrocks> but really â you canât subscribe to a 4G box â and â you are not connected yet â (even by Orange) is â¦ ok, I will buy a 4G modem/router myself and a 4G phone line
<duflu> Morning oSoMoN and marcustomlinson 
<marcustomlinson> yo duflu
<callmepk> Hi duflu didrocks marcustomlinson oSoMoN 
<didrocks> hey callmepk!
<marcustomlinson> hi callmepk
<seb128> goood morning desktopers
<seb128> hey callmepk marcustomlinson oSoMoN
<callmepk> hi seb128 
<marcustomlinson> hey seb128
<Laney> |o/
<duflu>    \o|
<duflu> (o_
<didrocks999> /o/
<Laney> ~~~\o/ - - - Â¬_o/
<duflu> Very graphic
<thumper>  /o\
<oerheks> ~~~~/\~~~~~\o/~~~~~
<ricotz> oSoMoN, hey, applied the search-engine changes to ff80, seems fine so far :)
<ricotz> hello desktopers!
<Laney> moin ricotz 
<seb128> hey ricotz!
<oSoMoN> hey ricotz, thanks!
<ricotz> hey Laney seb128 oSoMoN 
<ricotz> oSoMoN, hmm, nodejs still in groovy-proposed
<oSoMoN> ricotz, yes, there are still a bunch of reverse deps that need fixing, I've been working on them on and off, need to resume that
<ricotz> oSoMoN, ah ok, thought there is just some formality missing, thanks
<oSoMoN> ricotz, https://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/proposed-migration/update_excuses.html#nodejs if you're interested in what's blocking
<Laney> what did I do wrong in a past life
<Laney> to have to be working on an autotools build system again
<ricotz> oSoMoN, oh dear
<oSoMoN> Laney, you must have been very naughty
<oSoMoN> ricotz, that list was more than twice as long at the beginning, so there's been progressâ¦
<ricotz> oSoMoN, I see
<GunnarHj> Good afternoon all!
<GunnarHj> Question to anybody who knows: Is the XDG_CURRENT_DESKOP value for respective flavor documented somewhere? I know I can find out by running live sessions, but would prefer to not do that if possible.
<guiverc> intruder alert:  http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily-live/current/ still shows 8-July-2020 as latest amd64; shouldn't this be fixed? for those of us not using web & have really dumb scripts
#ubuntu-desktop 2020-07-24
<didrocks> good morning
<duflu> Hi didrocks 
<didrocks> hey duflu 
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<didrocks> salut oSoMoN!
<duflu> Morning oSoMoN 
<oSoMoN> salut didrocks 
<oSoMoN> hey duflu 
<pieq> Salut les desktoppers !
<didrocks> hey pieq !
<pieq> The other day I was discussing with a colleague about automating "UI testing", that is, trying to replicate the same commands as the ones generated by GNOME when the user clicks on something.
<pieq> Typical use case: when a user goes into the Display Settings, (s)he can choose the screen orientation, then validate the choice and see the effect appearing.
<pieq> When user clicks "Apply", *something* happens that trigger the screen rotation.
<pieq> Can I simply replicate this with a dbus call to the right gsettings?
<pieq> In that case, I ask cause we used to test screen rotation by calling low level stuff (xrandr if I recall), and in some instances that would work, but actually going into the display settings would not
<oSoMoN> salut pieq 
<oSoMoN> invoking "gsettings set â¦" to change the value of the relevant key should be enough, no need for D-Bus there
<pieq> oSoMoN, OK, in this case gsettings might just be enough, indeed :) I'll try to think of other use cases
<marcustomlinson> morning didrocks duflu oSoMoN
<duflu> Hi marcustomlinson and pieq 
 * duflu wonders why intel_gpu_top reports an idle machine (via ssh) is constantly reading 2GB/s
<oSoMoN> hey marcustomlinson 
<oSoMoN> pieq, there might be some settings that do require D-Bus calls or invoking external binaries, you'll need to look at the gnome-control-center code to find out what to do for each setting
<oSoMoN> and if in doubt ask Robert Ancell, he's our resident expert on g-c-c
<pieq> oSoMoN, ok, thanks a lot, I'll bother him if needed.
<seb128> goood morning desktopers!
<duflu> Morning seb128 
<seb128> hey duflu, how are you? ready for the weekend?
<duflu> Going OK but frazzled. Bring on the weekend
<duflu> You, seb128?
<seb128> I'm alright, I almost slept enough this night, looking forward the weekend still though :-)
<marcustomlinson> morning seb128
<Laney> moin
<marcustomlinson> morning Laney
<duflu> Hi Laney 
<Laney> sup marcustomlinson duflu 
<seb128> hey marcustomlinson, Laney, how are you?
<Laney> moin seb128 
<Laney> i'm alright, enjoying the friiiiiiiiiiiiday feeling
<Laney> you?
<seb128> quite the same here, it's friday \o/ :-)
<didrocks> hey Laney and seb128!
<seb128> hey didrocks, happy friday! how are you?
<didrocks> I'm good, thanks! And it's Friday :) You?
<seb128> I'm alright!
<seb128> trying to figure out how to unsubscribe from a repository on github
<seb128> not that I dislike seeing Marcus and Robert active, but they are sort of spamming my inbox atm :-)
<seb128> ah
<seb128> found it!
<seb128> 'unwatch' at the top of the summary
<marcustomlinson> seb128: haha, glad you found the button :p Yeah when I joined the Flutter team, man the spam...
<marcustomlinson> found the button too ;)
<seb128> marcustomlinson, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-calculator/+bug/1884428 is making any sense to you? the screenshot on the recent comment suggests that the gnome snap isn't installed?
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1884428 in gnome-calculator (Ubuntu) "calculator won't open (error while loading shared libraries: libgtk-3.so.0: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory)" [Low,New]
<marcustomlinson> oh wow
<marcustomlinson> I have to assume this guy has been fiddling and removing stuff he thought wasnât needed
<KGB-2> orca Dmitry Shachnev 183148 * commented commit 2289d61 * https://deb.li/C7p7
<didrocks> waow, just typed test in my chrome browser and got as completion: http://10.97.0.1:8080/view/cu2d/view/Autopilot%20Release%20Testing/job/autopilot-saucy-daily_release/264/label=autopilot-intel/
<didrocks> good old times, seems like a life ago
<didrocks> (ofc the url doesnât work, but just seeing "autopilot", "saucy", "daily release"
<oerheks> good old 2013
<didrocks> yep :)
<marcustomlinson> ahh good memories, that was the release on which I joined Canonical the first time :)
<didrocks> heh :)
<Laney> https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/u/1/d/1kVcbT9COuBhpamXg_d5pw_7WlRCuCPBF_8TFjgfaNYY/edit#gid=0
<didrocks> unsure if you can see this: https://script.google.com/a/canonical.com/d/1joBv3cZIxwBxYUn4l2jE_haaI-x2xGZxmIbVH-8-lC0vvj9vTAe0odnh/edit?mid=ACjPJvF9Bsirac7OUWrBfgj5un3pKwXrjJgIxZOt9dBGUMAYd1z3Kiug0pd-2-V8vSIX2CGJaPSRh8cG1pEnumSbFAvmuhQn60iI55qFCz3pgfoeRw-ps7I0Er8S7yPrSKUNuf0Zc8tgeA&uiv=2
<didrocks> this is the interesting part of the spreadsheet :)
<Laney> can see it!
<Laney> beautiful stuff
<didrocks> heh, divided in files and so onâ¦ I wasnât that drunk on the 2nd of January at 6am :)
<didrocks> friday-nostalgia -> DONE
<Laney> â
<didrocks> I should really start using unicode symbols and make using them easier in weechat
<marcustomlinson> ðð·ð°ð'ð ðð½ð¸ð²ð¾ð³ð´?
<marcustomlinson> d: ÊÆpop ÆuÄ±É¥ÊÇÉ¯os sÉÊ ÊÄ± ÆuÄ±ÊuÄ±É¥Ê ÇuÄ±É¯ Éo puÇÄ±É¹É É puÉ ÊsÄ±× spÉo×uÊop ÊÉ¯ uo ÊÉnÉs ÆuÄ±ÊÉÉ¥ É¹ÇqÉ¯ÇÉ¯ÇÉ¹ Ä±
<didrocks> :)
<Laney> see you monday!
<marcustomlinson> Baaaaiii
#ubuntu-desktop 2020-07-25
<luna_> GNOME has a yearly meeting soon in 10-20 minutes
