#ubuntu-desktop 2008-03-17
<dholbach> jamesh:
<huats> Morning evryone
<mvo> hey huats!
<mvo> hey MacSlow
<mvo> and seb128 of course :)
<huats> hello mvo and crevette
<huats> :)
<MacSlow> Greetings everybody!
<huats> and of course "the never quitting the chanel" : seb128
<huats> !)
<huats> morning MacSlow
<MacSlow> hey mvo, huats, seb128
<lool> seb128: Do you use f-spot from time to time?
<lool> It's often hanging when I close it; I was also surprized not to have anything happening when I plugged my camera in on my Ubuntu desktop
<lool> (I'm uploading the apport crash ATM)
<seb128> lool: yes, I use it to manage my photos
<lool> seb128: Does it come up for you when you plug your camera?
<seb128> dunno about the nautilus action not happening, I didn't look at it recently
<lool> seb128: Does it hang when you try to close it?
<seb128> there was a bug about that IIRC
<lool> Under Debian, I get a popup to import my photos, but when I chose to, nothing happens...
<lool> The new version is really superb though
<seb128> debian is likely still using gnome-volume-manager
<seb128> where we use nautilus gvfs for those actions
<lool> Ah right
<lool> NB: my camera does PTP; I don't think it can pretend to be a mass storage device
<seb128> that should make no difference to applications using libgphoto
<hggdh> do we have a problem on glib? Anyone noticed the number of g_slice_alloc SIGSEGV we have on LP?
<seb128> hggdh: not that I know, and no
<seb128> is that recent? on what components?
<hggdh> seb128: evolution, npviewer.bin, sshfs, gvsd-trash, gvfsd-sftp, nautilus, totem*, gnome-mplayer, file-roller, evince, and so on
<hggdh> at least 50 are quite new, with bug #s > 190000
<seb128> hggdh: there is 42 titles with this function on launchpad, not an issue I would say
<hggdh> seb128, there are also some invalid that were closed for lack of supporting docs...
<hggdh> but it was just a question... I started to see that on Evo, and cannot see them as an Evo issue
<seb128> hggdh: looking at some example they are different issues
<seb128> hggdh: well, I would say that's incorrect memory management bugs and they crash in the allocator
<seb128> hggdh: ask for a valgrind log as described on the wiki, that will give better indications
<hggdh> seb128 I do agree... the problem is how long it takes for one to be hit, and there is not much of a chance of one running valgrind for hours...
<seb128> hggdh: right, so not a lot we can do
<hggdh> such is life ;-)
<seb128> hggdh: until other indication I tend to thing those are application bugs
<seb128> they are usually invalid memory usage
<seb128> or using wrong free function
<hggdh> seb128 usually I would look at the smack on as appl issues, but then we have a lot of appl issues... I do not remember Gutsy as this
<hggdh> s/at the/at them as
<seb128> you mean gusty had less crashers?
<seb128> I don't think so
<hggdh> for g_slice_alloc, yes, AFAICK
<seb128> but we had update-notifier buggy and apport was not running until beta or something
<hggdh> huh, ok, forgot about that... :-(
<seb128> well, that could be glib issue, but we don't have enough informations to lead to this right now
<seb128> and I don't have every desktop app crashing every 10 minutes either
<seb128> I would have say that it could be a gio issue
<seb128> but evolution doesn't use gio yet I think
<hggdh> yep. Will keep on monitoring, just in case. I have another SIGSEGV in poll() to look at, anyways
<hggdh> seb128: just a comment -- when I started in system programming we had a mitzvah that stated a system library should never fail because of bad input. This is why I raised the issue
<seb128> hggdh: was is a bad input?
<seb128> hggdh: is doing a 3gigabytes malloc a bad input or just something your system doesn't handle correctly? ;-)
<seb128> hggdh: well, anyway those error are not bad input usually, they are things like trying to access a pointer after freeing it
<hggdh> seb128 -- yes... but, nevertheless, poll(), and g_slice_alloc(), should not die because of that. This is indeed bad input. If the system does not have 3G to give on a malloc, it should return an error, not die
<seb128> right, that was a bad example
<seb128> that's likely crashes in malloc you get
<seb128> usually the crash is not in malloc
<seb128> that's just that when you start accessing freeed memory you get corruption
<seb128> and that leads to corrupted stacktrace
<seb128> that's not because gdb shockes on malloc or another memory handling function that the crash happened due to it
<seb128> s/likely/similar to
<hggdh> yes, the price we pay for not having hardware-enforced boundary checks on memory :-( I remember a system I used to work with that had it)
<seb128> yeah, might be, but anyway that's out of the glib scope
<hggdh> I now agree ;-)
<lool> hggdh: This can happen when a new type of objects moves to slices and many apps use g_free instead of g_foo_unref() or whatever
<hggdh> lool: thank you -- I do not use them, so I did not know about that. Will check on Evo for that
<hggdh> ugh! this will take much longer than I expected, will have to restrict my search... 3916 g_free's, and 1938 g_.*_unref's (evo only, and not counting other variations...) Guess I will have to keep just at the code path that failed...
<mvo_> pitti: could you please have a quick look at http://paste.ubuntu.com/5763/ ? I would like to upload that, showed up in gutsy->hardy upgrade testing
<pitti> mvo_: to which binary does this apply?
<pitti> oh, -dev
<pitti> mvo_: sure, no problem
<seb128> pitti: if you look at the queue could you accept my gdm file-roller uploads there?
<pitti> seb128: was this discussed with Steve, is he aware of it?
 * pitti looks at the diff
<mvo_> pitti: thans
<mvo_> thanks even :)
 * pitti hugs mvo_
<pitti> seb128: gdm> ah, speedup love?
<seb128> pitti: yes
<pitti> too bad that we didn't get the improved prefetch thingy into hardy :(
<seb128> pitti: no, that was not discussed with Steve, I did work during the weekend but didn't do IRC nor did want to ping him during non work time
<pitti> seb128: did anyone else test this version?
<pitti> seb128: curious, how much login speedup does it buy you?
<pitti> f-roller accepted
<seb128> pitti: thanks
<seb128> pitti: I don't think so
<mvo_> seb128: yeah, what do we look like now with the delayed apt-check ?
<pitti> dholbach: FYI, XS-Vcs-Bzr is now called Vcs-Bzr (just saw it in your gnome-user-docs upload)
<seb128> with the current hardy and the prefetch my laptop does 19 seconds
<seb128> where it was 36 seconds before starting the changes
<mvo_> that sounds pretty good to me :)
 * mvo_ hugs seb128
<pitti> wow
<seb128> between we removed deskbar, tracker, you guys delayed jockey and apport-check and there is prefetch now
<pitti> apt-check?
 * pitti didn't delay apport yet
<dholbach> pitti: thanks for letting me know - will bear that in mind next time
<pitti> dholbach: any idea why your upload also removes .pot files?
<pitti> dholbach: like /user-guide.pot?
<pitti> well, it's the only pot file removed in fact
<pitti> dholbach: anyway, accepted
<mvo_> pitti: thats the part of update-notifier that checks for updates, its quite IO intensive
<dholbach> pitti: no idea why it should remove the .pot files
<pitti> seb128: ok, still enough time to change/fix/revert, so I'll accept it
<mvo_> we look pretty good upgrade wise in my current tests (if anyone is interessted :) main-all from gutsy->hardy works, that is something like ~5000 pkgs at the same time
<pitti> wow
<pitti> mvo_: anything significant in the /etc diff?
<pitti> mvo_: I just recently fixed some bugs which led to broken init scripts on update, etc.
<mvo_> pitti: meh, sorry, I haven't generated it for this image, its takes quite a bit to build the reference image
 * mvo_ needs to fix that
<pitti> mvo_: libgphoto2 accepted
<mvo_> great, thanks pitti!
 * mvo_ hugs pitti
<seb128> pitti: thanks
<seb128> pitti: yes, apt-check, sorry ;-)
 * pitti takes off the deputy RM hat again and goes back to bug triage
<pitti> seb128: apport crash check is done by update-notifier, I don't think that it imposes a lot of overhead
<pitti> and it's already delayed a bit
<seb128> yeah I noticed
<seb128> but it's not a lot of IOs
<seb128> right
<pitti> seb128: hm, bug 202457
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 202457 in gnome-volume-manager "Preferences option for Removeable Drives doesnt control Removeable drives" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/202457
<pitti> seb128: seems that we shuold rename this menu entry
<seb128> indeed
<pitti> I'll report it upstream, we shuoldn't have ubuntu specific strings
<seb128> right
<seb128> upstream didn't change g-v-m yet though
<pitti> (done)
<pitti> seb128: well, since GNOME did change nautils, the 2.20 upstream release is quite broken in that regard? (double mounting)
<pitti> or did they disable nautilus automounting?
<seb128> pitti: it's broken I think
<seb128> 2.22 you mean, right?
<seb128> 2.22.0 is a bit rough on the edges
<pitti> mvo_: can you please have a quick look at bug 202548? is it possible to leave postgresql-X.Y installed after upgrade, even if it is in universe?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 202548 in update-manager "Upgrade 7.10 to 8.04 should preserve previous DB data" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/202548
<pitti> "[Bug 202994] Re: Nautilus opens more pipes than a plumber"
 * pitti chuckles
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 202994 in esound "Nautilus opens more pipes than a plumber (dup-of: 183411)" [Low,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/202994
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 183411 in esound "libesd leaks pipe file descriptors" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/183411
<lool> haha
<seb128> pitti: any reason this fix didn't make to gutsy-updates by now?
<pitti> seb128: nobody followed up with any kind of testing confirmation
<seb128> ok
<pitti> three people shouting "installed that version, no problems encountered" would be enough
<pitti> I'm not that fussed about reproducing the bug and test cases, etc.
<pitti> but about "OMG the package miscompiled, and now everything is crashed"
<pitti> crashing, even
<pitti> seb128: oh, just noticed that nautilus now opens f-spot? or at least, is supposed to?
<seb128> well, we have the change in hardy for month, and it's not exactly complicated
<seb128> pitti: it's supposed
 * pitti ponders dropping g-v-m completely for hardy
<pitti> it's an almost useless daemon nowadays
<Ng> would stuff like camera photo importing still happen without it?
<seb128> Ng: <pitti> seb128: oh, just noticed that nautilus now opens f-spot? or at least, is supposed to?
<Ng> oh, yes backscroll. doh ;)
<Keybuk> pitti: really?  I thought it still did the HAL event->open program glue?
<pitti> sane and f-spot are the only two programs left in g-v-m
<pitti> Keybuk: most of it went into nautilus in 2.20 (gvfs)
<Keybuk> where has that glue moved to for other things?
<Keybuk> ahh
<pitti> nautilus doesn't handle scanners, though
<pitti> meh, this should really have been thought out much better by upstream for the final release
<seb128> pitti: upstream has limited manpower and an huge quantity of things to do there
<pitti> right, I understand
<pitti> seb128: WDYT, should we add scanners to nautilus and drop g-v-m, or keep gvm for scanners only?
<pitti> (or just ignore scanners and have people open xsane/gimp manually?)
<pitti> personally I find the xsane popup quite annoying, but that's just me maybe
<seb128> pitti: do you think the options which are not used by default are useful to some users?
<pitti> seb128: the ones for video cam, web cam, and PDA are, IMHO
<pochu> hi all
<seb128> pitti: ok, so better to keep it running
<mvo_> pitti: sure, I can add postgresql-8.2 to the removal blacklist
<pitti> mvo_: that would be great
<pitti> mvo_: postgresql-* in general maybe?
<pitti> since we'll hit the same problem with every release
<pitti> and people upgrading from dapper will upgrade 8.1 to 8.3
<mvo_> pitti: sure, that would work too, isn't poststres-* a bit too generic? how many packages do we have that look like that?
<pitti> mvo_: that would include the -client, -contrib, -plpython, etc., too
<pitti> but in order to not break your existing DBs, you need them, too
<mvo_> aha, ok
<pitti> mvo_: there might be some extensions, though, I see what you mean
<pitti> ah, but not in main
<pitti> but if they were, they should be kept, too, IMHO
<pitti> mvo_: since they should all depend on the server, removing the server version later will remove the extensions, too
<mvo_> pitti: ok, I added it to the blacklist now
<gicmo> pedro_: hey there
<pedro_> hey gicmo
<gicmo> pedro_: about https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gvfs/+bug/199301
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 199301 in gvfs "gvfs-fuse-daemon crashed with SIGSEGV in pthread_mutex_lock()" [Medium,Triaged]
<gicmo> pedro_: that is most likely not a gvfs bug
<gicmo> pedro_: its crashing inside fuse
<pedro_> gicmo: ok, will re assigned it then, thanks you
<gicmo> pedro_: wait a sec
<gicmo> pedro_: also http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=522944 like a bit like it was the same issue
<ubotu> Gnome bug 522944 in gphoto backend "gvfsd-gphoto2 crashed with SIGSEGV in pthread_mutex_lock()" [Critical,Unconfirmed]
<gicmo> any chance somebody fucked up libc or pthreads or something in ubuntu?
<gicmo> mvo_, pitti?
<pedro_> gicmo: does this works for you? bug 203041
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 203041 in nautilus "davs:// protocol is not properly supported" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/203041
<gicmo> pedro_: that is a nautilus issue
<gicmo> pedro_: see http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=522445 and dups
<ubotu> Gnome bug 522445 in GIO "connect to server error" [Normal,Resolved: duplicate]
<hggdh> by the way, seb128, evolution *is* using gio
<seb128> hggdh: to do what?
<hggdh> I do not know yet... I just saw it on a bt
<hggdh> on e-d-s
<hggdh> but I still hope it is not a direct use, searching for it
<slytherin> gicmo: dholbach told me to contact you. I was trying to fix evolution-scalix FTBFS. I created patch for configure(.in). But I am not able to solve compilation problems.
<gicmo> hey slytherin
<gicmo> FTBFS?!
<gicmo> ;-)
<dholbach> fails to build from source
<slytherin> gicmo: The version, 10.0.1.1-0ubuntu2 which was supposed to be rebuild against latest libcamel fails to build
<dholbach> bug 193764
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 193764 in evolution-scalix "evolution-scalix FTBFS with current evolution" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/193764
<dholbach> I pinged you about it as I didn't know
<dholbach> bug 198733 might be the same problem
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 198733 in evolution-scalix "evolution-scalix not installable on hardy (missing libcamel)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/198733
<slytherin> gicmo: in fact this was the first time the package was changes in hardy. The last changelog entry is from feisty.
<gicmo> ohh, hmm I have stopped using scalix myself and I am not working for them anymore so I wouldnt notice, but lets see what I can do about it
 * dholbach hugs gicmo
 * gicmo hugs dholbach ;-)
<slytherin> gicmo: I will attach my diff.gz tonight to the bug which will at least run configure script without fail and start compilation. You can take it from there. :-)
<gicmo> slytherin: thanks
<slytherin> gicmo: oops, someone has already attached patch for configure failure. I will check if it is better than me?
<gicmo> as long as it picks up the right stuff, I dont care where it is coming from ;-)
<seb128> pitti: are you fine doing approvals or should I rather wait for steve?
<lool> seb128: Hmm the totem mythtv plugin pulls a lot
<lool> seb128: libgmyth, libmysql, mysql-common...
<lool> LP #191952
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 191952 in gst-plugins-bad0.10 "Remove mysql dependency for LPIA" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/191952
<seb128> lool: I'm pondering creating a totem-plugins-universe and move things there
<lool> seb128: Good idea
<seb128> that would allow having bugs about totem not depending on python-gdata for example
<seb128> there is quite some plugins which have extra depends or are not really stable
<Amaranth> mvo: so is there any hope of getting a new snapshot in before beta? :)
<mvo> Amaranth: not really, htat is going to be very difficult. however, if we can point to a number of LP bugs that are fixed with it, the chances will raise dramatically
<huats> mvo: hello
<huats> mvo: any idea why gnome-commander has not been built in i386 ?
<Amaranth> mvo: alright, let me try to make a list here :)
<Amaranth> mvo: huge one right here http://bugs.opencompositing.org/show_bug.cgi?id=793
<ubotu> bugs.opencompositing.org bug 793 in Core "Impaired UI performance with Firefox in full screen mode (F11)" [Normal,Resolved: fixed]
<Amaranth> basically all the problems with fullscreen apps when using unredirect fullscreen windows seem to be solved
<Amaranth> and unredirect fullscreen windows works correctly when the app changes the screen resolution
<Amaranth> vuntz: it looks like a recent commit to compiz is going to break how libwnck deals with compiz window decorations
<Amaranth> the bit added to libwnck to account for window decorations when moving a window, specifically
<Amaranth> http://cgit.compiz-fusion.org/compiz/commit/?id=61f8473ed79d679f0c9dd068340b14ad964dda12
<vuntz> Amaranth: hrm
<vuntz> Amaranth: I think it's already fixed in libwnck 2.22.0, isn't it?
<Amaranth> vuntz: isn't the fix to take window decorations into account before moving?
<Amaranth> it seems like this commit to compiz will make libwnck move things too far now
<Amaranth> but i haven't tested so i might be wrong
<vuntz> Amaranth: there are two kinds of move :-)
<vuntz> either with decorations or without decorations
<vuntz> we're missing one public API for the one without decorations, though, iirc
<vuntz> and the one "with decorations" was broken and has been fixed for 2.22.0
<Amaranth> ah
<Amaranth> vuntz: don't suppose you got a chance to look at my patch for scrolling on the workspace switcher with compiz :)
<vuntz> Amaranth: not yet, but later this week
<vuntz> Amaranth: there are 4-5 libwnck patches I want to commit
<crevette> Amaranth, you should read that http://svn.gnome.org/viewvc/gdm/trunk/ChangeLog?revision=6031&view=markup
<crevette> at least the first commit :)
<Amaranth> neat but that's intrepid stuff
<crevette> I don't like the key name
<crevette> the name is harcoded, I would have preferred custoim_wm
<crevette> custom_wm, or something like thazt
<crevette> something which would have more WM agostic
<crevette> agnostic
<crevette> anyway, time to go back home, see you
<mvo> lool: I would like to upload http://paste.ubuntu.com/5786/ - is that ok with you? the "fix" works around a problem in the apt ordering code
<lapo> ciao
<mvo> Amaranth: what is up with the session plugin? another abi change?
<Amaranth> yes :/
<Amaranth> maniac redid the mechanism for getting session events
<mvo> Amaranth: ok, thanks. I noticed the load of fixes in compiz git, its pretty amazing. I will have a log at the git log but my guess is that we will have a hard time pushing more than specific patches at this point, may get easier after beta again
<lool> mvo: But how do we guarantee that people don't install nautilus 2.20 with the new glib?
<lool> well << 2.20 rather
<mvo> lool: I'm investigating currently, maybe there is a better way
<mvo> lool: its a bit of a desperate move from my side :)
<lool> mvo: Ack; if you don't find a way, let's do this
<alex-weej> is there something that can be done about CPU load drastically affecting audio performance?
<alex-weej> since the switch to PulseAudio it's gotten a lot worse
<alex-weej> but it was bad even with just ALSA
<lool> Check whether you have freq scaling
<alex-weej> stuff is underrunning like mad as i run updates
<alex-weej> lool: what is that and how do i do it?
<lool> alex-weej: Does your CPU frequency change depending on the load?
<lool> This might cause audio glitches
<alex-weej> i don't think so, it's a Pentium 4
 * lool goes to bed now &
<alex-weej> ah xorg is eating all my CPU time
<alex-weej> christ on a bike
<alex-weej> it was the new system monitor graphs eating all my time
<seb128> alex-weej: that's a known issue
<seb128> alex-weej: likely cairo being slow on your video card or driver
<alex-weej> seb128: it's more like it's saturating the server with drawing commands
<alex-weej> try resizing it as it draws and it continues servicing old drawing requests for the wrong size
<seb128> cairo performances are bad with some drivers
<alex-weej> ati here, ftr
<seb128> are you use EXA or XAA?
<alex-weej> i'm not sure to be honest, but given that the "smooth" scrolling barely works i think we should find a way to disable it for hardy release
<alex-weej> most people report that it jerks
<seb128> alex-weej: grep for EXA and XAA in you Xorg.0.log
<alex-weej> This is a pre-release version of the X server from The X.Org Foundation.
<alex-weej> uh...
<alex-weej> bug in log viewer :P
<alex-weej> XAA
<seb128> alex-weej: https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=4320
<ubotu> Freedesktop bug 4320 in Driver/Radeon "Over from xrgb8888 pictures not fast-pathed in XAA" [Normal,Assigned]
<alex-weej> Secure Connection Failed
<alex-weej> ephy/xulrunner is absolute crap since Fx 2.0 :(
<alex-weej> any idea if ephy/webkit is likely to be supported soon?
<seb128> alex-weej: not this cycle, webkit is not usuable yet
<seb128> alex-weej: you should be able to accept certificates now, no?
<alex-weej> i am really pissed off that the design of xulrunner even seems to let any of this stuff seep through
<seb128> I copied the firefox on some weeks ago so I didn't notice if that has been fixed yet or not
<alex-weej> no obvious way to do it seb
<seb128> open the website in firefox
<alex-weej> oh right... that doesn't count :P
<seb128> and copy cert8.db
<alex-weej> there are buttons to do it in Firefox on the chrome page
<seb128> yes, epiphany should do the same
<seb128> asac should know better about that
<alex-weej> speaking of this... has anyone ever expressed any interest in getting a "gnomebuntu-desktop" metapackage made up?
<asac> certs is the last important fix we need
<seb128> alex-weej: we have ubuntu-desktop
<alex-weej> asac: ah, about:config is working now i see :D
<asac> gtk
<alex-weej> seb128: ubuntu-desktop is a bit of a mish mash though, pidgin over gossip, compiz over metacity, firefox over ephy?
<alex-weej> the kubuntu guys get to have kontact, kwin, konq
<alex-weej> having a gnomebuntu metapackage at least would be useful for people wishing to use all gnome software
<alex-weej> asac: gtk?
<asac> good to know
<seb128> alex-weej: you can install gnome-desktop-environment from universe
<alex-weej> asac: ?
<calc> isn't there some new gdm gui that is supposed to be in hardy?
<calc> or did that not make it in time for this release?
 * calc installed fedora 8 yesterday in vmware and thought their gdm was nifty
<tedg> calc: It was decided early on to push it to the next release.
<calc> tedg: ah ok
<calc> tedg: i had forgotten about it until i saw the fedora gdm yesterday
<pochu> calc: in fact GNOME 2.22 ships with gdm 2.20 IIRC
<calc> pochu: ah, yea that makes sense given what i heard about gdm 2.22
<calc> pochu: aiui gdm 2.22 is a complete rewrite
<pochu> yes, http://live.gnome.org/GDM/NewDesign has the details
<alex-weej> asac: have you noticed that trying to edit properties in about:config doesn't work? i get a dialogue with no text, no window title, and just a text field, ? icon and OK and Cancel (that don't do anything when you click them)
<alex-weej> only way to get it to go away is to hit the window X
<alex-weej> (and it doesn't actually apply the setting you typed)
<seb128> slomo: did you try the new totem youtube thing?
<seb128> slomo: bug #203336 seems to be a gstreamer issue
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 203336 in gstreamer0.10 "Youtube plugin don't work" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/203336
<slomo> seb128: will test in a few minutes
<slomo> seb128: thanks
<alex-weej> is VT switching completely broken now in Hardy? last time i checked, consolekit was doing something funky that just took me straight back to my X VT
<alex-weej> but now the ctrl+alt+f-keys don't even do anything
<Amaranth> works great here
<Amaranth> it even mutes sound when you switch away from the VT where sound is playing
#ubuntu-desktop 2008-03-18
<gicmo> anybody here?
<jgamio> hi
<nxvl> is there any way to tell a .desktop file to use gkdu or kdesu depending on if it is KDE or GNOME?
<nxvl> or do i just need to install 2 .desktop files?
<dholbach> good morning
<nxvl> dholbach: guten nacht!
<dholbach> hi nxvl - hehe :)
<lool> nxvl: su-to-rootN
<lool> s/N/?
<slomo_> seb128: the youtube plugin works fine here for me... do you get the same failure?
<seb128> slomo_: did you try on hardy or debian?
<seb128> slomo_: searching for videos work correctly, ie ubuntu lists lot of those
<seb128> but playing doesn't work
<seb128> trying to play "Ubuntu @ the Library" for example
<seb128> "0:00:28.448213545 11128 0x80a2490 ERROR                totem /build/buildd/totem-2.22.0/src/backend/bacon-video-widget-gst-0.10.c:330:bvw_error_msg: uri     = http://www.youtube.com/get_video?video_id=nWIrxuF5NSo&t=OEgsToPDskJBHaSvPvJkOqOMX83tFaJT
<seb128> ** Message: Error: Could not open resource for reading.
<seb128> gstgnomevfssrc.c(841): gst_gnome_vfs_src_start (): /play/source:
<seb128> Could not open vfs file "http://www.youtube.com/get_video?video_id=nWIrxuF5NSo&t=OEgsToPDskJBHaSvPvJkOqOMX83tFaJT" for reading: Generic error (2)
<slomo_> seb128: that was on debian, i don't think there's any important difference with the used packages... hm, let me try that one :)
<seb128> "
<slomo_> yes, that one fails for me too
<seb128> I've been trying a lot of different one in the ubuntu query and most don't play due to similar errors
<slomo_> seb128: search for "badger", the first result plays for me
<seb128> slomo_: is that the eeePC gutsy one?
<seb128> same error, that seems to be random
<seb128> I get some videos to play sometime
<slomo_> no, the badger song :) www.badgerbadgerbadger.com
<seb128> trying to play the badger song one
<seb128> "** Message: Error: Element doesn't implement handling of this stream. Please file a bug.
<seb128> gstffmpegdemux.c(1372): gst_ffmpegdemux_sink_activate_push (): /play/decodebin13/ffdemux_flv1:
<seb128> failed to activate sinkpad in pull mode, push mode not implemented yet"
<slomo_> hm
<seb128> but I might not have gstreamer-plugins-bad installed
<seb128> let me check
<slomo_> yes, that's missing definitely
<slomo_> you need the flv demuxer from -bad
<seb128> shouldn't the easy codec thing be triggered?
<slomo_> no, gst-ffmpeg can demux flv too... just not in push mode (i.e. http)
<seb128> ok, it works now
<seb128> slomo_: alright, so the thing just doesn't like the ubuntu videos for some reason
<seb128> doesn't like the one from a debian query neither
<slomo_> yay, i'm playing ubuntu @ the library now
<slomo_> seems to be something broken in gnomevfs, with soup it works
<seb128> what did you change?
<seb128> ah
<slomo_> we should talk with gicmo ;)
<seb128> I doubt he's still interested in gnomevfs ;-)
<slomo_> last time i had a similar bug he listened to me... and now we can seek over http without bigger problems
<slomo_> btw, for some reason when using gnomevfs one gets a "forbidden" when trying to download the video itself, all redirects before work fine
<lool> slomo_: Missing referrer?  cookie?
<slomo_> then soup would miss it too... well, let's ask wireshark :)
<slomo_> seb128: do you keep track of http://live.gnome.org/GioPort and get patches for gio ports in ubuntu?
<seb128> slomo_: no
<seb128> slomo_: we stick to what GNOME do, they usually get things to svn
<slomo_> hm, maybe found the bug...
<slomo_> most notable difference between soup and gnomevfs is, that gnomevfs sends keepalive http requests and includes "Range: 0-" in the header... apart from that they do the same. so i guess the range makes youtube unhappy and it should work fine with gnomevfs 2.21.90 or something
<slomo_> seb128: if you still have that version around (without the http seeking patch) could you test? :)
<seb128> slomo_: ok, trying
<lool> slomo_: Not sure, but I would guess the particular range "Range: 0-" can be ommitted, no?
<seb128> slomo_: that makes it work correctly
<slomo_> seb128: thanks, would you mind filing a bug upstream? i've to leave now for an hour or something... i could do it afterwards though
<slomo_> lool: iirc gnomevfs uses this to determine if it can seek later or not
<seb128> slomo_: I'll let you do it, there is no hurry and you know what to write there ;-)
<lool> slomo_: Aha
<slomo_> lool: but then... if that Range stuff failed it should fallback to a request without Range... maybe the "forbidden" confuses it here
<slomo_> lool: or that all redirects before happily accepted the range
<slomo_> whatever, bbl :)
<lool> slomo_: Right
<DktrKranz> Has someone familiar with mono seen something similar to debian 470328 ?
<ubotu> Debian bug 470328 in beagle "beagle: FTBFS: GConfThreadHelper.cs(30,7): error CS0246: The type or namespace name `GLib' could not be found. Are you missing a using directive or an assembly reference?" [Serious,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/470328
<slomo_> DktrKranz: nope
<DktrKranz> slomo_, there's a fix in gnome 514252 but it seems incomplete.
<ubotu> Gnome bug 514252 in General "beagle evolution backend doesn't build" [Trivial,Resolved: fixed] http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=514252
<slomo_> DktrKranz: why incomplete?
<DktrKranz> it keeps FTBFS
<slomo_> did you regenerate or patch configure too (not only configure.in)?
<DktrKranz> well, probably it's because of my very poor mono knowledge
<DktrKranz> both
<slomo_> and when getting a svn checkout it fails too?
<DktrKranz> didn't tried, let's see
<DktrKranz> oh, wait a sec...
<DktrKranz> http://svn.gnome.org/viewvc/beagle/trunk/beagle/configure.in?r1=4470&r2=4469&pathrev=4470
<DktrKranz> is backslash required?
<DktrKranz> glib-sharp-2.0 >= $GTK_SHARP_REQUIRED      \
<slomo_> yes
<DktrKranz> so, I missed it
<slomo_> :)
<slomo_> seb128: btw, don't sync glib 2.16.1-2 from debian :) it breaks network-manager in a way that doesn't make much sense
<seb128> slomo_: ok, thanks, I was no planned to do soon due to freeze but good to know ;-)
<huats> moring everyone
<seb128> hey huats
<huats> hello seb128
<huats> how are you ?
<seb128> good, thanks
<seb128> how are you?
<huats> good too
<huats> :)
<huats> not very available to work on desktop stuff for a few days since I am quite working on the new ubuntu-fr website
<huats> but I try to find some little time :)
<seb128> cool
<huats> seb128: you might be able to tell me : do you have any idea why gnome-commander has been sync for powerpc and not for i386 ?
<huats> or amd64 ?
<huats> where can I find such information ?
<seb128> huats: we sync sources, not binaries
<seb128> so your question is why it didn't build on those
<huats> yeah that was my question ...
<seb128> huats: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-commander/ has informations
<seb128> hardy i386   Failed to build
<huats> I guess there is a FTBFS somewherre :)
<seb128> installability issue
<seb128> ask some buildd admin to give it a retry
<huats> ok
<DktrKranz> slomo_, backslash was the key :)
<huats> seb128: you were right, the rebuild of the sources fixes the pb...
<huats> :)
<huats> thanks
<seb128> huats: you are welcome
<_MMA_> Can we turn off "Show Weather/Temp" in Hardys Clock prefs? Because a location is not set by default, it adds a large amount of space on the left of the applet in the panel.
<_MMA_> Turn off by default that is.
<seb128> _MMA_: no
<seb128> _MMA_: that is a bug and it should be fixed rather
<seb128> _MMA_: vuntz knows about the issue
<_MMA_> It being on by default or no location set?
<seb128> adding space when no location is configured
<_MMA_> I see. Will it make Hardy?
<_MMA_> The fix?
<Amaranth> crap now i can't get rid of it
<Amaranth> i added my own location and it added the temp but it doesn't do the forecast so it's no use to me
<Amaranth> and now it won't go away :P
<seb128> _MMA_: depends on whether if somebody work on a patch for the issue
<Amaranth> ah, unchecked the boxes
<_MMA_> seb128: If the "fix" won't make Hardy, and it can be set in gconf (unchecking the options) I would think that would be a fine solution for now.
<seb128> _MMA_: we have space on this panel, I don't think it's that an important issue
<seb128> I would prefer having the feature working out of the box when adding a location
<seb128> and we go no complain so far
<_MMA_> Sure. I'll just turn it off for Ubuntu Studio till there's a proper patch.
<_MMA_> seb128: And nobody is gonna complain 'till it's released. Classic situation. And if you won't listen to people like me, we'll continue to put out  product with quirks like this.
<seb128> _MMA_: oh, that's not true, subscribe one week to the desktop bugs if you want to see if nobody complains about issues ;-)
<_MMA_> seb128: Pales in comparison to after a release. And sure, "nobody" should have been "most people".
<seb128> _MMA_: still don't agree with you, but let's not discuss on that
<_MMA_> seb128: But this will quickly go into how we work and what I feel the shortcomings of our system are. Not really something to get into here.
<seb128> _MMA_: "how we work" being?
<_MMA_> seb128: In Prague. :)
<seb128> _MMA_: you don't like having somebody in charge of packages and controlling changes we apply or not?
<_MMA_> Some things are better in person.
<_MMA_> I'll just leave it at that for now. :) We _really_ don't wanna get into it here. :)
<seb128> well, I'm not sure if I should take it as a personnal criticism, but as you want
<seb128> there is no perfect answer to most changes
<_MMA_> seb128: Sure, but others might and text just isn't best for some chats.
<seb128> that's like having tracker enabled or not, or deskbar installed
<seb128> you can't make everybody happy and you need to decide on something
<lmanul> seb128: ping?
<seb128> lmanul: hi
<lmanul> seb128: Hi !
<lmanul> Any news for mentors? Should I subscribe to something if I want to help out?
<seb128> no idea
<lmanul> seb128: Okay, I saw the list of organizations was out, but I guess if you don't know it mustn't be time yet :)
<lmanul> seb128: Thanks anyway
<seb128> I've been busy updating GNOME to 2.22 etc and didn't read those discussions
<seb128> you are welcome
<seb128> try asking dholbach tomorrow
<seb128> he might know better
<mvo> no seb128?
<mvo> does anyone here particullarly cares about evo-data-server?
<Keybuk> in what kind of sense?
<mvo> fixing a file overwrite problem, but I'm happy to do it, I had hoped that seb128 would be around
<Keybuk> it's a bit late ;)
<mvo> yeah, good point :)
<Keybuk> vuntz: why is it that sometimes, when I click the Window Selector applet, it gives me the applications from all of my viewports
<Keybuk> but then sometimes it only gives me from my current viewport
<vuntz> Keybuk: the window selector always lists all windows
<vuntz> if it doesn't, then, there's a bug
<vuntz> maybe it happens when all your apps are in the current workspace?
<vuntz> could also be some viewport weirdness
#ubuntu-desktop 2008-03-19
<Keybuk> vuntz: of course, I can't take a screenshot
<Keybuk> if I go to an empty viewport, and click it, I get all my apps
<Keybuk> if I click it again, I get only 3
<vuntz> weird
 * vuntz wonders if there's another wm using viewport
<vuntz> sawfish, maybe
<vuntz> or maybe compiz does work on my laptop now...
<Hobbsee> ubotu: part
<Hobbsee> (george is already in here, and i don't have access)
<Amaranth> George: test
<Hobbsee> !help
<George> I am ubotu, all-knowing infobot. You can browse my brain at http://ubotu.ubuntu-nl.org/factoids.cgi - Usage info: http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuBots
<Hobbsee> works
<Amaranth> Hobbsee: I could just ban George :P
<Amaranth> bug 67834
<George> Launchpad bug 67834 in kdebase "add an option to disable the system bell system-wide" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/67834
<Amaranth> then again...
<Hobbsee> Amaranth: if you like.  both do it.
<Hobbsee> Amaranth: this ubotu doesn't work with !info basket, etc, though.
<Hobbsee> although it'll tell you if something isn't in ubuntu
<Amaranth> nah, this seems to work for the only thing it ever gets used for
<Amaranth> bug 49346
<George> Launchpad bug 49346 in metacity "Gnome mistakes window closing confirmation as frozen programme. (dup-of: 29584)" [Undecided,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/49346
<George> Launchpad bug 29584 in metacity "False reports of "Window not responding" error" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/29584
<Hobbsee> George:  bug #172300
<George> Launchpad bug 172300 in linux-source-2.6.22 "Unable to boot 7.10 on abit ib9 due to ata xfermode" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/172300
<dholbach> good morning
<Amaranth> @schedule
<George> Schedule for Etc/UTC: 19 Mar 21:00: Server Team | 26 Mar 21:00: Server Team | 28 Mar 04:00: MOTU
<seb128> hey hey hey mvo gicmo
<seb128> gicmo: your nautilus-cd-burner changes work correctly ;-)
<mvo> hey seb128!
<gicmo> seb128: cool, totally strange that they left that call in there, could you attach the patch to the bug?
<seb128> gicmo: sure
<seb128> gicmo: I manage to lock nautilus apparently though
<gicmo> oh
<seb128> gicmo: does http://paste.ubuntu.com/5860/ looks like a locked situation?
<seb128> gicmo: I tried to open several folder etc on the sftp location while I was disconnect
<seb128> that didn't block nautilus which is good ;-)
<seb128> but when I reconnected it did the actions queued apparently
<seb128> DOH
<seb128> don't keep fingers on ctrl-alt to switch workspace after typing
<seb128> or don't delete a char while you are doing so rather ;-)
<gicmo> hehe
<gicmo> looks like its blockin in dbus
<seb128> anyway, after being connected again it opened several directories on which ones I clicked during the disconnect time
<seb128> and then got greyed (ie, the compiz way to tell you the app is not responding)
<lool> seb128: was happening to me all the time; I decided to add DontZap to my config when I was tired of losing my work :)
<seb128> lool: we should do that by default ;-)
<lool> I proposed that a while back!
<lool> But I was told many users kill their session in this way, especially when it's hung
<seb128> which is true
<seb128> we got quite some complain because gdm was not coming back properly after ctrl-alt-del in some cycle
<gicmo> seb128: hmm tricky
<seb128> gicmo: don't bother too much with this one, that was just in case there was something obvious there
<gicmo> k
<huats> morning everyone
<huats> :)
<crevette> heu huats
<huats> hello crevette mvo and of course seb128
<huats> :)
<mvo> hey huats
<seb128> lut huats
<pitti> kwwii: I just noticed that with the new gdm theme the "incorrect password blabla" line is partially covered by the input line; it should be somewhere else
<pitti> kwwii: is this on your radar already or shall I file a bug?
<seb128> pitti: there is several duplicates from this one already
<seb128> I'm going to kick the next user bugging gdm about it
<seb128> ;-)
<kwwii> pitti: there is already a bug on that (and I will fix it)
 * pitti shuts up
<pitti> kwwii: danke
 * pitti hugs seb128
 * seb128 hugs pitti
<kwwii> I'll have the tweaked package ready a bit later :-)
<seb128> that's annoying, they all send bugs on gdm
 * pitti currently tests pretty much everything in the live system
<seb128> pitti: how buggy is it?
<pitti> pretty good actually
<pitti> PK works again, all apps that I tested so far work
<seb128> cool
<pitti> bug 203612 is a bit nasty
<pitti> but just cosmetic, too
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 203612 in displayconfig-gtk "Screens & Graphics menu item in wrong section" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/203612
<pitti> all in all we are in a pretty good shape
<seb128> pitti: I though it had been removed from the menus?
<pitti> (this can't be right, it's too good....)
<pitti> removed entirely? why should it?
<pitti> it's my live saver to get a correct resolution, and I guess for many other people, too?
<pitti> System -> Administration is a good place for it?
<Amaranth> oh, i thought Screens&Graphics went away
<seb128> pitti:
<seb128>  displayconfig-gtk (0.3.8ubuntu1) hardy; urgency=low
<seb128>  .
<seb128>    * Disable displayconfig-gtk in menus (replaced by Screen Resolution tool)
 * pitti wonders WTH a "802.1X protected wired network" is
<pitti> asac: ^ current network-manager
<seb128> pitti: bryce argued that it's too buggy and not useful now that we have the xrandr 1.2 capplet
<Amaranth> yeah, since it's really only needed for bulletproofx
<pitti> but if X misdetects the resolution, xrand doesn't help at all
<Amaranth> the xrandr 1.2 thing doesn't work for nvidia but then again screens & graphics doesn't do the right thing for nvidia either :)
<pitti> (e. g. vmware only has 800x600 due to a bug in X.org somewhere)
<seb128> Amaranth: bryce wants to use the nvidia tool for those
<pitti> well, either way, it shouldn't be in Apps -> Other
<seb128> pitti: well, iz xorg bug
<Amaranth> yeah, nvidia-settings is better :)
<seb128> no it shouldn't
<pitti> seb128: right; but even if this particular one is fixed, we'll always have some
<pitti> "cannot fix detected screen resolution" is the top #1 complaint from the people around me why they did not install Ubuntu permanently
<pitti> granted, it got much better in hardy
<pitti> seb128: ah, and tomboy crashes
<pitti> (when trying to quit it)
<pitti> and the tracker search tool doesn't allow me to enable tracker
<seb128> pitti: you should enable it from system, preferences, indexing
<seb128> pitti: well, I'm not the one to argue with, but I really don't like this displaygtk-config
<seb128> I had bad comments about it and I think it's quite buggy
<pitti> I tend to agree
<pitti> seb128: hm, System Tools -> Hardware Testing... I don't think we want that there either ,right?
<pitti> System -> Administration, for all users?
<seb128> pitti: yeah, cr3 mailed me about that yesterday
<seb128> pitti: I'm not sure to be honest
<seb128> pitti: I'm pondering moving things back to applications, system tools
<seb128> system, preferences has too many items now
<pitti> hm, but they mostly fit well into the idea of "system administration" IMHO
<pitti> hwtest doesn't, right
<seb128> and vmware, virt, etc install items in applications, system tools
<seb128> which means you quickly get this submenu back when installing softwares anyway
<pitti> right, gnome-device-manager is, too (universe, though)
<pitti> it just looks a bit weird to have just one entry in the menu
<pitti> but *shrug*
<pitti> seb128: as long as it has been discussed, I'm fine
<pitti> just want to make sure it's not an oversight
 * pitti hugs seb128
<seb128> pitti: I didn't reply to cr3, but we will not let one item there
<seb128> either we move back things which were there
<seb128> ie, gnome-system-monitor
<seb128> or we move the hardware testing somewhere else
<seb128> not sure what is the best yet
<seb128> I'll likely put that on the desktop team meeting agenda
<pitti> oh, system monitor is a great idea
 * pitti doesn't even find that in the menu
<pitti> it's applet-only ATM?
<pitti> wow, we have a "Network Manager Editor" now
<pitti> . o O { that doesn't really belong into the main menu IMHO; would be better in right-click nm-applet menu }
<pitti> seems I'm in a nitpicking mood today
<asac> pitti: i have seen some discussion about that
<asac> but i don't have any details
<asac> will try to look it up when i have some time
<Amaranth> pitti: can you make jockey set UseCompositeWrapper for nvidia too?
 * Amaranth should really file a bug :)
<pitti> Amaranth: sure, but please file a bug and give some explanations
<pitti> Amaranth: will that cause any regressions for other hardware or performance?
<Amaranth> it might be a performance hit but it just makes the nvidia driver use something from the X server (that i'm guessing other drivers use) instead of doing stuff by itself
<Amaranth> apparently Qt apps are basically unusable with the driver we have if you don't enable this
<Amaranth> with compiz, i mean
<Keybuk> pitti: it is in the right-click NM menu, isn't it?
<pitti> Keybuk: oh, indeed it is
<pitti> so why is it repeated in the menu?
<seb128> because right click is not discoverable
<seb128> but I agree on this one, it should not be in the menu
<Keybuk> the fact that NM has both left and right click menus is, of course, a different issue
<Keybuk> (and an idiotic one)
<pitti> . o O { session startup in a fresh vmware installation is delightfully fast again! }
<pitti> asac: what is a 802.1X protected wired network? Can we change that string to something mere mortals can understand?
<asac> pitti: huh? didn't you get my answer or did i forget to hit enter? ... i currently have no idea what it is. i just rememberd that someone was happy that it worked now on NM list
<asac> where do you read that string?
<pitti> asac: ah, there; sorry
<pitti> asac: left click on nm-applet
<pitti> seb128: ah, recently you were asking me about floppy, right?
<asac> i dont see anything there right now. guess have to remove my entry from eni. will do so after a short breakfast
<pitti> seb128: it just occurred to me that in vmware I can have a fake floppy, and I indeed get that "invalid hal function signature yadayada" error when I select it in the places menu
<seb128> pitti: yes, I would like to know if those are working in nautilus now
<seb128> pitti: and using the computer location?
<seb128> pitti: that's weird because the method is available now
<pitti> seb128: there it correctly says "no media in the driver"
<pitti> s/driver/drive/
<seb128> hum
<seb128> would be interesting to try with a floppy in the drive
<seb128> to see if it gets mounted
<asac> pitti: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/802.1x ... so its authenticated wired apparently (like one could guess)
<asac> now breakfast
<Amaranth> so no one can sniff your wired connection?
<pitti> seb128: let me find/download a floppy image
<seb128> pitti: thanks
<pitti> hm, that vmware isntance does not have a floppy...
 * pitti shuts down and adds one
<slomo_> seb128: ah, please sync banshee 0.13.2+dfsg-8 from debian :) adds mtp and gnome-settings-daemon 2.22 support
<slomo_> seb128: and last-exit 5-2
<seb128> pitti: is that ok to do universe syncs now?
<pitti> seb128: sure
<pitti> seb128: ah, convenient: vmware offers me to create an empty floppy image :)
<seb128> ah, cool
<pitti> seb128: hmmm
<pitti> so I created and mformat'ed the floppy
<pitti> and mount /media/floppy works (standard fstab entry)
<pitti> but computer place still says 'no media' and places menu has that weird hal signature error
<seb128> ok, so it's still buggy
<pitti> gnome-mount -vbd /dev/fd0 works at least
<pitti> same result when I remove the fstab entry
<pitti> seb128: hm, seems to be pretty much bug 188256 for floppies
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 188256 in nautilus "empty CD-ROM Drive doesn't do anything when clicked" [Wishlist,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/188256
<seb128> pitti: right
<pitti> it's mentioned in the second-last comment
<seb128> pitti: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gvfs/+bug/197954 too
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 197954 in gvfs "Hardy: Unable to scan Floppy Drive for media changes" [Low,Triaged]
<seb128> pitti: once the floppy mounted you can browse it though?
<pitti> when I use gnome-mount -d /dev/fd0, then the Places menu gets a secodn icon "disk" with a floppy icon (in addition to "Floppy drive")
<pitti> same in the computer place
<pitti> the disk icon opens nautilus with the floppy contents
<pitti> floppy drive icon continues to be broken
<slomo_> seb128: oh, and after freeze you can merge glib and sync gvfs please ;)
<seb128> slomo_: glib is not buggy then? you told me yesterday to wait
<lapo> ciao
<slomo_> seb128: the bug was somewhere else as expected but i just wanted to be sure :) (n-m had memory corruption, causing a segfault in a glib function)
<slomo_> seb128: also all those patches are upstream now (or will later today)
<seb128> slomo_: alright
<seb128> slomo_: what patches?
<seb128> slomo_: I did send the gio nfs one upstream today
<slomo_> seb128: the nfs4 patch?
<seb128> yes
<slomo_> ok, none of the others? :)
<slomo_> i meant 80_static-mutex-aliasing-warnings.patch and 81_c99-inline-warnings.patch
<seb128> I've enough to carry zillion of changes because Josselin doesn't bother sending what he does upstream
<seb128> slomo_: no, I was going to look at the other later but if you do it that's good ;-)
<slomo_> ok ;)
<seb128> slomo_: btw did you port the single click patch for nautilus to the new version?
<slomo_> i dropped it iirc
<seb128> ok, cool
<seb128> because it's creating issues
<slomo_> seb128: how was the file called? :)
<seb128> slomo_: 05_places-sidebar_single-click.patch
<slomo_> oh, that is still applied (and didn't need porting)
<slomo_> sorry
<slomo_> what issues does it create?
<seb128> slomo_: bug #189110
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 189110 in nautilus "nautilus erroneous error message opening Samba share - can't display Samba drive" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/189110
<seb128> slomo_: and right clicking on a location to copy things for example makes it switch to the location
<slomo_> ok, thanks... will take a closer look at the patch and disable for next upload unless it's possible to fix it easily; )
<seb128> thanks
<slomo_> i hate all these patches :)
<seb128> me too
<seb128> we should really profite of alex being active to get things upstream or drop the distro changes if they are not appropriates
<slomo_> yes, just needs someone to do it... most nautilus patches were in bugzilla though
<seb128> alex doesn't use bugzilla a lot, too much things there
<seb128> better to ask him on IRC or use the nautilus list
<slomo_> yes, that's my plan
<slomo_> :)
<slomo_> seb128: apart from that he will have much less time for such things starting in 10 days (i thought you got the mail too?)
<seb128> slomo_: yes
<seb128> slomo_: that's why we should try to get changes upstream now ;-)
<slomo_> seb128: yes, later... need to get some food now and then i'll do it :P
<Amaranth> what happens in 10 days?
<seb128> Amaranth: alex goes on paternity leaves for some months
<Amaranth> ah
<Amaranth> i thought that was a couple months ago
<slomo_> seb128: any reason why you didn't commit the nfs4 patch yet? :)
<seb128> slomo_: I'm not a glib maintainer and nobody approved it yet
<slomo_> seb128: can't alex approve at least gio related things? well, someone will probably look at it and if not i'll ask mclassen later when i've all patches prepared ;)
<seb128> slomo_: alex read the gio bug mails and approve patches usually, I just don't want to bother him every 15 minutes on IRC, I'll let him deal with the bug when he wants rather, there is no hurry ;-)
<seb128> lool: did you get the cheese update uploaded?
<lool> seb128: It was incomplete
<lool> seb128: missing b-deps bumps and changelog information
<lool> seb128: I can easily complete the update in some minutes if you need it at any time
<pedro_> slomo_: hello, have you seen this bug 199496 ?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 199496 in tomboy "Tomboy.exe crashed with SIGSEGV in exit()" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/199496
<seb128> lool: I don't really need it, but would be nice to have the GNOME 2.22 version
<seb128> lool: I was just wondering because you said it would be uploaded by tuesday
<slomo_> pedro_: known gtk# or mono bug
<slomo_> pedro_: assuming it happened when exiting tomboy
<pedro_> yes same one
<slomo_> no fix known yet but it's nothing to worry about too much
<slomo_> just annoying because of apport ;)
<pedro_> hehe ok, thanks
<lool> seb128: I said we should set the deadline to tuesday, but then I backed up when I recalled about the freeze
<lool> seb128: To be clear: set the deadline, and I'll honor it :)
<lool> seb128: I've passed the info to tremolux, and he output the update over the WE, but it was slightly incomplete
<lool> Hence the back and forth
<lool> If it's too long for you, tell me, I'll finish it
<seb128> lool: next week would be nice
<lool> seb128: next Monday?
<lool> seb128: I'll pass down the target to tremolux
<lool> seb128: Feel free to escalate to me any time you want it
<slomo_> seb128: /usr/share/gnome/applications/defaults.list <--- is this a debian invention?
<lool> slomo_: Isn't this XDG stuff?
<lool> desktop-file-utils
<seb128> lool: monday is a holiday, there is no really hurry, just try to get it uploaded next week if you can, thanks ;-)
<seb128> slomo_: yes
<slomo_> lool: yes... but i mean this location, other location are XDG, right
<lool> seb128: Oh *right* \o/
<lool> holidays \o/
<slomo_> seb128: ok, not going upstream :)
<seb128> slomo_: no
<seb128> slomo_: that should be dropped from debian too if you ask me
<slomo_> seb128: why exactly?
<seb128> because it creates extra diff and should be done in a standard way
<seb128> that has been discussed on the xdg lists some weeks ago
<seb128> I'm not sure that KDE is using defaults.list anyway
<slomo_> ok, did you drop it for ubuntu?
<seb128> we never had it in ubuntu
<slomo_> heh
<seb128> that's something josselin did for debian I think
<seb128> but I never agreed with it
<seb128> and kubuntu didn't complain either so I think it's a non issue
<slomo_> yes... how are default applications for a mimetype selected in ubuntu?
<seb128> as they are upstream
<seb128> using the defaults.list but not in a gnome subdir
<slomo_> seb128: what are the other paths? i know the one in the home directory but is there a system wide too?
<seb128> /usr/share/applications/defaults.list is the standard one
<slomo_> ah, non-existing here... so it does automagic somehow? ;)
<seb128> no, josselin patched the debian gnome to look at the debian specific location
<slomo_> is there a /usr/share/applications/defaults.list in ubuntu?
<seb128> yes
<seb128> we ship it in desktop-file-utils though
<seb128> not in gnome-vfs as debian
<slomo_> ok, gives more or less the same problem though, just a different patch
<seb128> what problem?
<slomo_> these are all gnome applications... now if someone uses for example xfce he will have gnome applications as default unless he sets something different and not what xfce offers
<slomo_> (same for kde if they use it too)
<slomo_> not sure if this is important
<seb128> we go no complain from kubuntu so I guess KDE is using something else
<seb128> slomo_: there is a mail on the xdg lists stating "KDE uses InitialPreference. GNOME uses defaults.list."
<slomo_> ok
 * slomo_ isn't happy with having gnome specific things in glib... but /usr/share/gnome is even worse :)
<slomo_> seb128: 18_disable_signal_handler.patch  <--- talked with alex about this one already? :)
<seb128> slomo_: I just noticed that I forgot to drop it when I read your changelog
<seb128> slomo_: alex fixed it differently upstream, the patch can be dropped
<slomo_> seb128: thanks
<slomo_> ok, i have everything ready now to flood alex with patches :P
<seb128> ;-)
<slomo_> vuntz: ping? :)
<slomo_> vuntz: gnome-menus currently installs /etc/xdg/menus/applications.menu and similar things... ubuntu/debian already adds "gnome-" as prefix to them, what do you think about getting this upstream? :)  needs a small fix in gnome-panel too... and resolves a conflict with kde (which has a kde-applications.menu, not sure if it's called applications.menu upstream too)
<vuntz> slomo_: I've thought about this
<slomo_> vuntz: ...but? :) it looks like a small change that shouldn't cause any problems at all
<vuntz> slomo_: problem is that people who have edited their menus will lose their changes if we change the name of those files
<slomo_> oh
<slomo_> ok, that's bad then :)
<slomo_> vuntz: any ideas how to solve that better?
<seb128> slomo_: btw, ubuntu doesn't add gnome- there
<seb128> slomo_: that's another change josselin did in debian I disagreed about
<slomo_> oh, i didn't know you dropped that patch
<slomo_> why did you disagree? except what vuntz said?
<seb128> slomo_: and I think Amaranth recommended against it because it was creating issues for menu edition or something
<seb128> slomo_: because it was breaking thing and a distro specific behaviour
<seb128> slomo_: it requires to patch applications to use the right naming
<vuntz> slomo_: it's hard to fix now
<slomo_> ok, so not beautiful forever or until gnome 3.0 ;)
<vuntz> slomo_: well, I'd love to fix this
<slomo_> vuntz: ok, what about the gnome-panel-logout application patch? :)
<seb128> vuntz: btw, could you review http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=505488?
<ubotu> Gnome bug 505488 in gconf "gconfd does not unblock signals properly" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<vuntz> seb128: gconf?
<vuntz> slomo_: I'm not fond of this patch. Will be fixed properly in 2.23
<seb128> vuntz: nobody is maintaining it upstream
<slomo_> vuntz: ok, good enough for me :)
<seb128> vuntz: so I figured you might be able to review the patch and commit since that's a small one ;-)
<seb128> vuntz: I'll try kmaraas otherwise
<vuntz> seb128: I don't understand the patch
<vuntz> seb128: isn't gconfd.c only used for gconfd? What's the relation with the library?
<seb128> lool: ^
<seb128> vuntz: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gconf/+bug/188007
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 188007 in gconf "gconfd does not unblock signals properly" [Medium,Triaged]
<seb128> vuntz: there is some details there, not sure if that's useful to you though
<slomo_> isn't gconfd forked from the library?
<vuntz> slomo_: hmm. In GNOME, no
<lool> vuntz: gconfd is autospawned by the lib
<lool> vuntz: such a gconfd inherits whatever state the process had
<vuntz> slomo_: I mean, yes, but it's started by gconf-sanity-check
<lool> As it's a fork() + exec()
<vuntz> anyway, it can't harm
<seb128> vuntz: thanks!
<lool> Pff we have ugly patches in gconf
<seb128> lool: which one?
<lool> The syslog one
<lool> The other one isn't too ugly, it's just hurd cruft; can probably be merged upstream as is
<seb128> right
<soulc> cd burning software?
<seb128> soulc: hi, you want to go on #ubuntu
<soulc> want is desktop concerned with?
<seb128> getting work done
<seb128> that's not an user chan
<seb128> rather a chan to discuss work we are doing
<soulc> ah ok
<soulc> so #ubuntu will work for me huh?
<vuntz> Amaranth: http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=520726 doesn't apply here
<ubotu> Gnome bug 520726 in general "make left and up viewport moves work" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<vuntz> is there any other patch that you apply before this one?
<vuntz> ah, maybe the patch from bug 520704
<vuntz> seb128: I think you can kill 80_from_bugzilla_add_action_above.patch in libwnck
<seb128> vuntz: thanks
<vuntz> I remember thinking it should be killed a few months ago, but you might need to check why ;-)
<seb128> Amaranth: ^ confirming? ;-)
<vuntz> ok, no real important patches for libwnck
<slomo_> pedro_: hi :) want to file FF exception requests for gtk-sharp2, gnome-sharp2 and gnome-desktop-sharp2 and a main inclusion report for the latter (f-spot wants gtkhtml)? :)
<slomo_> pedro_: would get us rid of gtkhtml3.8 from main among other things
<pedro_> well if that fixed the crashes
<mvo> slomo_: http://paste.ubuntu.com/5871 <- interessting for you? (dapper->hardy)
<slomo_> pedro_: doesn't fix the crashes... but makes pitti happy and will make it more likely that people can use our gtk# for the complete hardy supported time
<lool> vuntz: Would you mind merging the hurd support patch in gconf?  http://svn.debian.org/wsvn/pkg-gnome/desktop/unstable/gconf/debian/patches/25_gconf-path-max-hurd.patch?op=file&rev=0&sc=0
<lool> Since you seem to be on a patch merging day :)
<vuntz> lool: not now (finishing some gnome-desktop bugzilla crawling and then meeting in 10 minutes)
<vuntz> lool: but you can ping me later :-)
<lool> Sure
<kwwii> mvo: what was the sytax for adding a bug number to a commit message again? (LP: #bugnumber)?
<mvo> kwwii: yeah, "LP: #number" will work
<kwwii> thanks
<kwwii> mvo: remeber all the time we spent changing the gtk theme stuff to include clearlooks and murrine? Now it is time to revert that :-)
<mvo> kwwii: meh - sounds like fun. so what is the new plan? do we go back to humanlooks?
<kwwii> mvo: yes
<mvo> hmmm
<mvo> ok
<mvo> why?
<kwwii> mvo: I guess we can just take the older version of the pacakge, or?
<mvo> kwwii: yeah, just doing that might be the easiest way
<kwwii> mvo: because someone likes it better (and there are good reasons like the scrollbars, progress bars, etc)
<mvo> heh, ok :)
<kwwii> if it was up to me we would be using darklouche or such
<kwwii> :-)
<kwwii> and now everyone knows why it is not up to me :p
<mvo> slomo_: if you don't have time to look mono overwrite issue, I'm happy to do it, just let me know
<slomo_> mvo: would be nice if you could do it
<slomo_> seb128: ok, so we only have one patch in nautilus left that is not upstream... well, after alex branched and i committed the last ready one :)
<seb128> slomo_: yeah, I've read the chan activity
<seb128> we had quite some buggy patches, what did you do with those, dropped them now?
<slomo_> yes
<slomo_> well, disabled them for now if they're still valid
<seb128> ok
<slomo_> attached the last versions to the bug and explained what needs to be done to get it into nautilus
<kwwii> btw, if someone wants to take a look at the gdm bug fix, it is in bzr and the source package is here:
<kwwii> http://sinecera.de/ubuntu-gdm-themes_0.26.dsc
<kwwii> http://sinecera.de/ubuntu-gdm-themes_0.26_source.build
<kwwii> http://sinecera.de/ubuntu-gdm-themes_0.26_source.changes
<kwwii> http://sinecera.de/ubuntu-gdm-themes_0.26.tar.gz
<slomo_> lool: what shall we do about glib now? simply ignore joss and do the XDG_DATA_DIRS hack in gnome-session? ;)
<slomo_> lool: and a separate package for the defaults of course
<lool> slomo_: Yeah; Joss just doesn't want to lose face, but you can ignore him now, he kind of admitted XDG_DATA_DIRS in g-s is the only clean way we found for now
<lool> slomo_: Perhaps glib could be generally more clever, but it would take a while to spec and implement cleverness on such stuff
<lool> slomo_: For instance, we could teach glib about where it's running in ("this is a GNOME session") and teach it to prefer .desktop files for GNOME
<lool> (I'm just listing crazy ideas; I'm not actually proposing to do this)
<lool> But if you look at it today, the glib patch is pure uglyness for something which should really be achieved with an env var
<slomo_> lool: ok, will do that then... what would you suggest for the gnome defaults? simply ship with gnome-core? :)
<slomo_> yes, i really hate the current glib patch
<lool> I don't like shipping the defaults in a particular package; it doesn't really make sense to me
<slomo_> for gnomevfs it could stay as it is now, i don't care... the defaults should just be shipped by another package
<lool> But for now, you could ship them in gnome-session as it's probably the only thing which will use that XDG dir
<lool> On the longer term, it would be doable to have a trigger (haha) generate the defaults based on sensible info; perhaps from the packages or from the existing desktop files
<slomo_> ok, noted and will do once later... and upload once glib moved to testing
<slomo_> hehe, triggers... maybe next century :)
<seb128> having the defaults.list is a lib or desktop applications sucks
<seb128> because it means changing it is not as cheap as it should be
<lool> seb128: Yeah, exactly
<nxvl> mvo: are you still working on Bug #33505 ??
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 33505 in apt "BADSIG errors using transparent http proxies" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/33505
<pochu> seb128: hey, I already have my new desktop! ;-)
<seb128> pochu: ah, good ;-)
<pochu> seb128: btw totem-plugins should depend on python-gdata, which is needed for the youtube plugin
<seb128> pochu: no it should not, that's an universe package and the youtube plugin is quite buggy
<pochu> seb128: ah, then suggest it? :)
<pochu> it WFM btw
<seb128> pochu: I think I'll split the package, move the binary to universe and add depends there
<seb128> pochu: very weird, it was broken due to the gnomevfs changes, gicmo fixed it and the patch has been uploaded to debian and ubuntu but it's blocked by the freeze
<pochu> then the plugin won't be installed by default?
<seb128> I'll revisit the choice once I've tried with the gnomevfs fix
<pochu> seb128: I don't have sound though, but that's because I don't have speakers yet ;-)
<seb128> try searching for ubuntu and play the library example
<seb128> does it work?
<pochu> Ubuntu @ The library?
<pochu> Could not open location; you might not have permission to open the file.
 * pochu wonders why...
<pochu> seb128: search for "within temptation" and watch the "Stand my ground" videoclip
<seb128> pochu: I didn't say none was working ;-)
<pochu> seb128: ah, ok :)
<seb128> pochu: but most of the ubuntu ones are broken for example
<seb128> pochu: and you need the gst-plugins-bad installed
<seb128> pochu: so it can't work out of the box
<pochu> :(
<pochu> that's a cool plugin ;)
<seb128> right
<seb128> we don't have mp3 working out of the box neither
<seb128> it's useful too ;-)
<seb128> patents suck
<seb128> but we have to do with those
<pochu> right, but at least we have the easy-codec-installation :)
<seb128> I'll have a look at the youtube plugin again after beta anyway
<pochu> great
<seb128> pochu: if you are looking at things to do you are welcome to look at all the uploads slomo did to debian and see what we can sync or merge easily
<seb128> we can likely lower the delta and sync some packages easily after beta
<slomo_> seb128: the side pane one click patch was updated... and IMHO it looks good now, didn't test it yet though
<pochu> plugins-bad is in universe btw... perhaps when the required plugin gets some work and is promoted to -good...
<slomo_> seb128: http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=355760  if you want to test... :)
<ubotu> Gnome bug 355760 in Sidebar Panel: Places "Side pane items shouldn't require a double click to open the location" [Minor,New]
<seb128> slomo_: does it fix the double click smb error and the left click action?
<seb128> right click I mean, and apparently it does
<pochu> lool, seb128: what was that upnp python module we needed a MIR for? I don't have the logs from the last week or so
<slomo_> seb128: well, it has the same behaviour as if you set nautilus to single click everywhere
<pochu> hey slomo_
<seb128> well, that's not the default so not many people notice
<seb128> pochu: I think python-coherence should be promoted, would be nice to look at that ;-)
<slomo_> pochu: if you want, merge gnomevfs :) and gstreamer stuff... and gtk-sharp2/gnome-sharp2/gnome-desktop2 (needs FF exception and the latter need MIR) :)
<seb128> slomo_: oh you didn't upload the gnome-vfs change to hardy? I though you did
<seb128> you decided to just work on debian and let other people do the ubuntu merges now? :-(
<seb128> we need to recrute new contributors ;-)
<slomo_> seb128: i'll upload gnomevfs after freeze to see if the patch is fine until then
<slomo_> seb128: and if pochu doesn't want to do that stuff i've to do it ;)
 * pochu is on holidays :)
<seb128> slomo_: you don't "have to" do anyway, but help to merge debian updates is welcome
<seb128> I'll do what I can but there is lot to do and not so many people active at the moment
<slomo_> seb128: well, i don't have to but i want to :)
<seb128> thanks ;-)
<pochu> slomo_: I can do the gstreamer merges today or tomorrow
<pochu> slomo_: we are in sync for -base, aren't we? so can't we just sync it? (I didn't look at the changes yet as I'm cathing with the mail though, so I don't know what changed ;)
<slomo_> pochu: yes, base can be synced
<slomo_> as can all the others too iirc, except core
<seb128> pochu: we have to delay syncs to after the freeze, they don't go to the queue but are directly accepted
<seb128> but feel free to make a list and ping me after beta ;-)
<gicmo> re
<pochu> seb128: sure, I'll make a list when I process sid-changes ;)
<pochu> hey ember
<lool> seb128, pochu: I'm also looking at getting python-coherence promoted for elisa
<lool> I think I told people around here to try the RB uPnP plugin; it's now quite capable
<lool> pitti: ^
<lool> pitti: In general, python-coherence would enhance the RB plugin and elisa :)
<pitti> lool: hm, sounds like a new feature to me
<pitti> lool: I explained my gut feeling in the MIR bug
<pochu> pitti: where's that bug? I see no bugs for coherence in lp
#ubuntu-desktop 2008-03-20
<dholbach> good morning
<pitti> pochu: bug 186647
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 186647 in elisa-plugins-bad "promote to main" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/186647
<lool> pitti: Okay
<huats> pochu: ping
<huats> moring everyon e:)
<huats> one :)
<lapo> hi
<slomo__> seb128: is the metacity compositor enabled by default in ubuntu (i mean, the gconf setting enabled, not metacity build with compositing support) ;)
<mvo> slomo__: it shouldn't
<mvo> if it is, then thats a bug :)
<seb128> slomo__: what mvo said
<seb128> slomo__: we use compiz by default
<mvo> compiz!
<seb128> if compiz doesn't work you likely don't want a compositor
<slomo__> ok :)
<slomo__> i just ask because i finally tried the compositor in metacity and it slows down my system :P
<mvo> compiz!
<seb128> yeah, it's not good
 * seb128 hugs mvo
<mvo> compiz!
<slomo__> :)
<seb128> ;-)
 * mvo compizeses seb128
<slomo__> might as well be caused by my graphics hardware :)
 * mvo hugs seb128
<seb128> mvo: do you have an idea of what the screenshot fail to get decoration under compiz?
<mvo> seb128: what screenshot  was that?
<seb128> mvo: applications, accessories, screenshot
<seb128> mvo: try to use it on an application dialog only
<seb128> and notice that it doesn't get the decorations
<mvo> seb128: ok, I will do that after lunch
<seb128> mvo: enjoy ;-)
<mvo> seb128: and with metacity this works?
<pedro_> morning!
<pochu> hi all
<seb128> mvo: yes
<seb128> hello pedro_, pochu
<seb128> pitti: hey
<seb128> pitti: I just figured why apport is badly translated ;-)
<pitti> hey seb128
<pitti> seb128: can we talk in 30 mins? need to run off again, sorry
<seb128> pitti: that's alright, I'll try to come with a patch meanwhile
<pitti> awesome
 * pitti hugs seb128
<seb128> and I'm going to eat something too
 * seb128 hugs pitti
<seb128> re
<seb128> pitti: ok, I've a patch for you
<seb128> === modified file 'po/Makevars'
<seb128> --- po/Makevars 2007-05-21 13:36:59 +0000
<seb128> +++ po/Makevars 2008-03-20 12:41:57 +0000
<seb128> @@ -1,2 +1,3 @@
<seb128>  top_builddir=..
<seb128>  DOMAIN=apport
<seb128> +XGETTEXT_OPTIONS=--language=python
<seb128> pitti: the cdbs magic calls intltool-update -p on apport build, which doesn't work for the python files you have since you don't use .py for the filenames
<seb128> pitti: that makes it work out of the box
<pitti> seb128: aaaah, good catch
<pitti> seb128: I thought it would do some 'file' like matching
<seb128> pitti: no it doesn't
<seb128> pitti: should I commit to bzr?
<pitti> seb128: I wonder why it works for me
<pitti> seb128: after all, I just copied the pot to de.po and translated that
<pitti> seb128: sure, please do
<seb128> pitti: you likely run the make apport.pot target?
<seb128> pitti: which uses the --language=python argument you have in the Makefile
<seb128> pitti: but "intltool-update -p" which is what cdbs does doesn't use it
<pitti> right, make -C po merge-po
<pitti> seb128: so adding that to Makevars means we can drop the argument from Makefile, right?
<seb128> yes
<pitti> seb128: right, so it doesn't actually use the po/Makefile $(DOMAIN).pot rule
<pitti> *headdesk*
<T_A_V> Ã¢Ã±Ã¥Ã¬ Ã§Ã¤Ã°Ã Ã±Ã²Ã¢Ã³Ã©Ã²Ã¥
<T_A_V> codepage utf8
<pitti> kwwii: oh, btw, I haven't forgotten about your sponsoring mail; but given the freeze I didn't treat it with urgency
<kwwii> pitti: cool, thanks :-)
<kwwii> actually, there will be another change in gdm anyway
<kwwii> so you might want to wait for that
<pitti> ok, noted
<seb128> mvo: do you have a bug about the gnome-app-install categories not being translated?
<seb128> mvo: hum, ignore the comment
 * seb128 grrrs at the language-selector just closing when there is no network
<mvo> seb128: does it? no error message?
<seb128> mvo: well, I clicked ok,it started synaptic, complained about package not being installable and I was back to the desktop
<seb128> mvo: would be nice to have a "retry" option
<seb128> I was just not connected to the wireless
<seb128> mvo: I undo the undo, what do you use to translate those categories?
<mvo> seb128: hm, I suspect its a caching problem, update-app-install data will fix it, I tink l-s should run it
<seb128> l-s?
<mvo> language-selector
<mvo> ok just be more clever
 * mvo ponders
<seb128> mvo: indeed
<lool> seb128: glib c99 breakage hits mobile packages; can I upload it nowish?
<pitti> seb128: wb
<pitti> seb128: FYI, I converted jtv's list to bug 188690
<lool> seb128: Did you see my ping?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 188690 in transmission "does not create a PO template on build" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/188690
<pitti> and grabbed a few tasks
<lool> 16:41 < lool> seb128: glib c99 breakage hits mobile packages; can I upload it  nowish?
<seb128> pitti: re
<lool> I'm pushing it to our ppa for now
<lool> We have an image due tonight
<seb128> lool: no I didn't, you can put beta freeze is still in action no?
<lool> seb128: I just changed 01_gettext-desktopfiles in Debian to allow us to sync
<seb128> s/put/but
<seb128> lool: cool
<lool> seb128: Yes, I also intend to ask for a freeze exception now
<seb128> lool: btw did you read about the pygobject issues yesterday evening?
<lool> Which one?
<lool> The one about building it?
<seb128> lool: no, http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=448173 is creating 100% cpu use for some applications
<seb128> ups
<ubotu> Gnome bug 448173 in general "use python-config to get python includes" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<lool> Suckage
<seb128> lool: http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=481569
<ubotu> Gnome bug 481569 in gtk "Calling gobject.threads_init() causes a lot of wakeups" [Normal,Resolved: fixed]
<lool> seb128: I told doko to merge support for this in hardy's python
<lool> He only did so recently
<lool> It's already in gutsy though
<lool>   * Backport new function signal.set_wakeup_fd from the trunk.
<lool>     Background: http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=481569
<lool> python2.5 (2.5.2-2ubuntu2)
<ubotu> Gnome bug 481569 in gtk "Calling gobject.threads_init() causes a lot of wakeups" [Normal,Resolved: fixed]
<lool> seb128: Is this with that python version?
<seb128> lool: yes, pygobject built to use the setwakeupfd thing has the issue
<seb128> lool: building without fix the bug
<lool> seb128: Did you revert it in pygobject or in python?
<lool> Ok
<seb128> pygobject, I dropped the configure change
<lool> seb128: It looks like a bug in pygobject indeed
<seb128> so it doesn't use the feature
<lool> I only *read* about the feature, but never tried it out; it was included in hardy only recently
<lool> I hope we can fix it, as it's really useful to save power on laptop running pygobject/gtk apps
<slomo__> hey, does someone know if ubuntu suffers from an f-spot but that makes it's extensions go wild with every update? :)
<johanbr> slomo__: I've heard something about the f-spot in Gutsy not playing nicely with extensions.
<slomo__> johanbr: i'm more interested in hardy... because the fix for that is found now and it was a big problem in debian
<johanbr> I thought the Hardy version was okay. Not sure, though.
<seb128> pitti: g-s-t unlocking still doesn't work on the CD?
<pitti> seb128: it does work for me on 20080319
<pitti> it was still broken on 18.1
<pitti> I uploaded a fix yesterday
<seb128> is there a way to verify the CD version after boot?
<seb128> the policykit config has no empty space
<seb128> empty line rather
<seb128> and I've no warning on the command line
<seb128> pitti: oh, in fact it's automatically unlocked
<seb128> pitti: I've just been confused by the button being unsensitive
<pitti> right, that's how it's currently supposed to behave
<pitti> seb128: look in /cdrom/.disk/info
<seb128> pitti: thanks
<huats> pochu: around ?
#ubuntu-desktop 2008-03-21
<prometeus> hi
<Amaranth> pitti: nvidia-glx still needs AddARGBGLXVisuals, only nvidia-glx-new works without it
<Amaranth> setting those for nvidia-glx-legacy is pretty useless as it does not support running compiz
<Amaranth> but i suppose it doesn't hurt
<huats> moring everyone
 * lool decided to throw a screen away and enable compiz  \o/
<lool> Hmm and elisa works fine from compiz too; cool
<slomo__> seb128: ah, so freeze is gone... could you please sync gst-plugins-base and python? :) i'll get gstreamer itself merged now
<seb128> slomo__: will do
<seb128> slomo__: unstable?
<slomo__> yes
<seb128> slomo__: is the gazpacho new version worth getting?
<slomo__> seb128: yes, not very important bugfixes iirc but many :)
<seb128> pitti: are you the one having the lock on syncs? ;-)
<pitti> seb128: yes, just doing a few (for elisa and postgresql)
<seb128> pitti: can you do the ones slomo requested? gst0.10-python and gst-plugins-base0.10 from unstable
 * pitti flushes
<seb128> ok
<seb128> will do then
<slomo__> seb128: do you remember my universe syncs from two days ago? :)
<pitti> seb128: ok, thanks
<seb128> slomo__: no
 * pitti -> off to do some hal work to fix suspend issues
 * seb128 hugs pitti
<pitti> (it's holiday after all :) )
<slomo__> seb128: oh... that's bad :) i only remember banshee and last-exit
<seb128> I think those were the only ones
<seb128> slomo__: I'll add gazpacho in the batch of your syncs since you did the debian update and that seems to be a good idea to get those bug fixes too ;-)
<slomo__> ok :)
<seb128> slomo__: btw do you know if somebody is working on the mono crasher on exit?
<slomo__> seb128: no, but it's known upstream
<slomo__> seb128: i'm merging gnome-vfs now btw
<slomo__> you can play your youtube videos in an hour :)
<seb128> slomo__: ah, good, thanks
<slomo__> seb128: will you ship the gvfs libarchive backend?
<slomo__> seb128: ah, you can sync gvfs too btw unless you have a patch again ;)
<seb128> slomo__: do you build using libarchive?
<seb128> slomo__: I would like to, but it's universe right now and we need MIR, etc
<slomo__> oh
<slomo__> yes i do
<seb128> I'll deal with that, but not today
<slomo__> seb128: libgnomekbd can be synced too
<seb128> slomo__: -debian/tmp/usr/share/icons
<seb128> slomo__: do you have /usr/share/icons/hicolor/48x48/apps/gkbd-indicator-plugins-capplet.png in gkbd-capplet?
<slomo__> seb128: it uses a standard icon now
<slomo__> Icon=input-keyboard
<seb128> ok, good
<seb128> syncing
<slomo__> wtf, a new gnome-audio release after 5 years
<seb128> what does gnome-audio is useful for?
<crevette> sound files ?
<slomo__> yes
<crevette> the name is misleading
<slomo__> gnome-sounds would be better
<seb128> slomo__: new gtk-doc to sync too I guess?
<slomo__> seb128: of course, i'm currently going through all my uploads :)
<seb128> ok, doing that too
<seb128> I planned to sync and merge easy things after the freeze
<seb128> I'll do gvfs and nautilus too
<seb128> anybody wanting to write a MIR for libarchive? ;-)
<crevette> slomo__, gnome-sound-theme even :)
<crevette> seb128, you'll include libarchive backend
<seb128> crevette: if somebody write the MIR for it yes ;-)
<slomo__> seb128: take nautilus from svn... there all activated patches are good ;)
<seb128> ok
<slomo__> including the sidebar thing, no idea if you want that for ubuntu... i don't like it but it's really more consistent
<slomo__> seb128: more things: mono-addins (new bugfix upstream, fixing issues with f-spot... like corrupting the plugin database on every upgrade), librsvg, db4o (new upstream but making the package dfsg clean), libidl, orbit2, schroedinger (new upstream, bugfix only)... but i guess for the new upstream versions i should get on someone else's nerves to get a freeze exception, right? ;)
<seb128> I'm fine syncing a few bug fix new versions
<slomo__> i wonder what should be done about new gtk-sharp2, gnome-sharp2 and gnome-desktop-sharp2...
<slomo__> pitti: you there? :)
<seb128> slomo__: could you change the bug-buddy libelf-dev Build-Depends to libelfg0-dev in debian?
<seb128> slomo__: so we could sync
<pitti> slomo__: yes
<slomo__> seb128: what's the difference between those two?
<slomo__> pitti: how important for you is it, to get gtkhtml3.8 out of main? :)
<seb128> slomo__: one is in main and the other one is not ;-)
<pitti> slomo__: if we can achieve it without breaking FF, would be great
<seb128> slomo__: otherwise nothing obvious, they are similar, we build bug-buddy using the other one without issue
<pitti> but not at any cost
<slomo__> pitti: without breaking FF: no... it would even mean another NEW package in main
<pitti> if switching over from 3.8 to 3.14 in gtk# will help to fix bugs there, it would be good, of course
<slomo__> seb128: ok, will do so :)
<seb128> thanks
<slomo__> pitti: well, what must be done is: get gtk# 2.12.0, gnome# 2.20 and gnome-desktop# 2.20 (NEW package, must be in main for f-spot then)... the gtkhtml bindings moved from the second to the third source package and now finally work with gtkhtml3.14 (at the cost of breaking API, rdepends are already fixed in debian)
<slomo__> pitti: one could argue they're part of gnome 2.22 though :)
<slomo__> only bad thing is, that they (because bindings for new versions) introduce many new features
<pitti> hm; I think that should get past slangasek
<slomo__> pitti: well, let's change that sentence... they are part of gnome 2.22 :)
<slomo__> pitti: slangasek has a incompatible timezone, right? well, i'll talk to him when he's there
<pitti> gtk-sharp2 | 2.10.4-2ubuntu1 |         hardy | source
<pitti> hm, that's almost the same version as we had in gutsy indeed
<slomo__> of course the new versions also fix some bugs ;)
<slomo__> seb128: i found something that speaks for libelfg0-dev... it's LGPL instead of GPL ;) not important for bug-buddy...
<seb128> ah
<seb128> pitti: btw, do you think libarchive would be alright for main?
<seb128> pitti: gvfs has a libgarchive backend now, which means you can browse iso, zip, etc from nautilus
<pitti> ah, instead of using file-roller?
<pitti> seb128: is it just a binding, or does it reimplement cpio, tar, etc? According to the (lack of) dependencies, I'm afraid it might be the latter?
<slomo__> pitti: would you need a MIR for gnome-desktop-sharp2? it mainly consistents of some parts that were in gnome-desktop2 before, one binding that had it's own source package before and two other's that are new (but of course autogenerated as all the others) :)
<pitti> slomo__: we need a 'please promote to main' bug with a small justification, but not a wiki page in this case
<slomo__> ok, that's good
<slomo__> pitti: ok :) everything required is in debian/unstable btw... and until now i saw no new bugreports ;)
<pitti> that sounds good
<pitti> slomo__: so once Steve agrees, it's just a matter of a few syncs?
<pitti> (gtk-sharp2 has ubuntu modifications ATM)
<slomo__> well, merges because of doko's documentation linking
<seb128> pitti: seems that it does reimplement those at least partially
<slomo__> and f-spot needs to be merged anyway because the packages differ much... gnome-rdp is just a sync
<seb128> pitti: it's not meant to be a replacements for other commands, the gvfs backend just allow to browse those
<slomo__> seb128: uploading bug-buddy... makes one less package on my installation, stuff already depended on libelfg0 and bug-buddy was the only reason why i had libelf1
<seb128_> re
<seb128_> <seb128> pitti: it's not meant to be a replacements for other commands, the gvfs backend just allow to browse those
<seb128_> --- Disconnected ().
<seb128_> if somebody said something for me please repeat now ;-)
<slomo__> seb128_: uploading bug-buddy... makes one less package on my installation, stuff already depended on libelfg0 and bug-buddy was the only reason why i had libelf1
<pitti> seb128_: ok, I see; I'd like to see the implementation, since if that lib is really a reimplementation (instead of calling the cpio, tar, etc. binaries), then it needs a good audit first
<pitti> cpio and tar are ancient, and people still find vulns in them
<seb128_> pitti: the source has cpio and tar directories, I'm wondering if those are not copies
<pitti> ugh, likely
<pitti> maybe it can be built with --use-external-programs or so
<slomo__> seb128: ok, please sync bug-buddy from incoming then :)
<slomo__> seb128: and my long list from above too if you don't mind :)
<slomo__> oh, that was already done
<slomo__> thanks :)
<seb128_> you are welcome
<slomo__> seb128: hm, liboil too (bugfix release, mainly fixing arm and build issues) :)
<seb128_> unstable?
<slomo__> for most of the changes we have the patches in our current package anyway
<slomo__> yes
<seb128_> synced
<seb128_> and now is lunch time
<seb128_> see you later
<slomo__> have a nice meal and thanks :)
<rambo> hello everybody
<rambo> is this the right place to put a quiestion about desktop setting?
<seb128_> pitti: do you understand what is the issue there http://launchpadlibrarian.net/12784067/buildlog_ubuntu-hardy-i386.gtk-doc_1.10-1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz?
<pitti> seb128_: ugh, no; looks like chroot weirdness
<pitti> seb128_: shall I try a give-back?
<seb128_> pitti: that should not cost a lot and is worth trying
<pitti> done
<seb128_> thank you
<seb128_> cool
<fta> seb128_, cairo 1.5.14 is out, i wanted to package it. Is is still time ? as we want 1.6, i think it's wanted..
<fta> seb128_, http://cairographics.org/news/cairo-1.5.14/
<seb128_> fta: yes, we want 1.6 anyway
<fta> 1.5.14 is a RC of 1.6
<seb128_> fta: yeah, I just meant that any 1.5.n update is alright
<fta> ok, thx
<fta> seb128_, http://www.sofaraway.org/ubuntu/debdiff/cairo_1.5.12-0ubuntu2--1.5.14-0ubuntu1.debdiff
<seb128_> fta: thanks, looking
<fta> do you need the tarball or the diff.gz ?
<fta> it's trivial, just the git patch dropped and shlibs bumped
<slomo__> what's new in cairo 1.6 compared to 1.4?
<fta> slomo__, http://cairographics.org/roadmap/
<fta> it's also mandatory for firefox 3
<seb128_> fta: no, that's ok, debdiff is enough
<Solarion> what do I use to figure out what packages are conflicting?
<Solarion> dist-upgrade to hardy beta wants to un-install ubuntu-desktop, which seems Very Wrong.
<fta> the fan of my laptop runs too often.. Is there a gnome applet to display the cpu temp ?
<seb128_> Solarion: sudo apt-get dist-upgrade -o Debug::pkgProblemResolver
<seb128_> Solarion: sudo apt-get dist-upgrade -o Debug::pkgProblemResolver=true
<Solarion> seb128_: thanks
<seb128_> Solarion: sudo apt-get dist-upgrade -o Debug::pkgProblemResolver=yes rather
<Solarion> seb128_: I did it backwards as recommended in #ubuntu+1
<seb128_> Solarion: what do you mean?
<Solarion> loos like restricted-manager and friends went away which was causing the upgrade to think ubuntu-desktop should go away too (because they conflicted)
<seb128_> fta: you can try hardware-monitor
<Solarion> seb128_: found it by apt-get installing ubuntu-desktop and seeing what wanted un-installed.
<tedg> seb128_: I have a new GPM with a couple of small patches in it.  Should I submit a LP bug?
<seb128_> Solarion: restricted manager has been renamed jockey
<seb128_> tedg: is it in your ppa?
<tedg> seb128_: Yes.
<seb128_> tedg: I'll sponsor it, don't bother
<tedg> seb128_: Cool, thanks.
<seb128_> you are welcome
<tedg> Is there a way to move a translation between packages in a reasonable way?
<Solarion> mailservers can stop sending me spam bounces that claim to be from me already.
<Solarion> ah, the nautilus-eel2 thing
<Solarion> what was the resolution to the problem?
<seb128_> Solarion: do you have something buggy, it nautilus-actions installed?
<seb128_> tedg: not really, you just want to move one string?
<Solarion> nautilus-actions is installed, yes
<seb128_> does removing it makes things better?
<tedg> seb128_: No :(  Basically I'm looking at the changing the tool tip to a menu thing, and vuntz would prefer it was done in the applet.  But all the strings are currently in libwnck.
<Solarion> no
<Solarion> nautilus: Depends: libeel2-2 (>= 2.21.90) but 2.20.0-0ubuntu1 is to be installed
<tedg> So I guess it's 6 strings.
<seb128_> tedg: are those actually translatable right now? I noticed they are not translated in french on the beta CD
<seb128_> Solarion: sudo apt-get install libeel2-2
 * tedg realizes he didn't check that :)  Just a sec.
<Solarion> seb128_: will un-install the following packages: gedit gnome-core gnome-office nautilus nautilus-cd-burner nautilus-dbg nautilus-image-converter nautilus-share ubuntu-desktop
<seb128_> Solarion: I bet on nautilus-image-converter
<seb128_> Solarion: does remove this one makes things better?
<Solarion> seb128_: no
<seb128_> we are doing that the wrong way
<seb128_> Solarion: try to "sudo apt-get install ubuntu-desktop nautilus -o Debug::pkgProblemResolver=yes" and copy the log on http://paste.ubuntu.com
<Solarion> http://paste.ubuntu.com/5973/
<tedg> Hmm, they are marked so.  And the file is in POTFILES.in.  There doesn't seem to be a string listed in the .po files though.
<tedg> Is that because it's a patch solely in the .deb?
<seb128_> slomo__: remove link-monitor-applet
<seb128_> tedg: right, they are distro specific and will be only on rosetta
<seb128_> tedg: so there is nothing you can do to do the merge
<seb128_> tedg: just mail the translators list after doing the change so they can update them there
<Solarion> seb128_: fixed.  Should I file a bug?
<seb128_> slomo__: was for Solarion not for you
<tedg> seb128_: Okay, will do.
<tedg> seb128_: Is it an issue with the French translation?  Is there something I should be looking for there?
<seb128_> Solarion: no, there is already one
<seb128_> Solarion: bug #185318
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 185318 in link-monitor-applet "link-monitor-applet dependency problems" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/185318
<seb128_> tedg: no, they just likely didn't notice the strings are don't know that they come from libwnck and where to translate them
<seb128_> tedg: well, looks like they did translate it on rosetta now ;-)
<Solarion> seb128_: kewl
<tedg> seb128_: Cool.
<seb128_> brb
<Solarion> seb128: the numbers in 'Considering <pkg1> <num1> as a solution to <pkg2> <num2>" is the number of packages depending on the package?
<seb128> Solarion: not sure, that's a score I think, the number of depends counts there but might not be the only parameter
<fta> 43-51Â°C doing not much, it's too high
<Solarion> ah
<Solarion> i should really pitch in somehow
<slomo> pitti: ok, slangasek seems to be fine with gtk# and friends... now we just need it synced, moved to main... could you care for the syncing? i'll do what else is required
<seb128> slomo: I don't think he's around, I can do the syncing
<slomo> seb128: ok, can you care for the move to main too? :)
<seb128> yes
<fta> seb128, so, is cairo ok ?
<seb128> fta: yes, I've uploaded, thanks
<fta> cool, thx
<slomo> seb128: thanks, pitti wanted a bug so here is it: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/204729
<slomo> :)
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 204729 in ubuntu "Please move gnome-desktop-sharp2 to main" [Undecided,New]
<seb128> fta: you are welcome, thank you for the update
<seb128> ted: gnome-power-manager uploaded
<seb128> slomo: what are the packages to sync now?
<slomo> seb128: gtk-sharp2, gnome-sharp2, gnome-desktop-sharp2... the latter must be moved to main (more specific the libgtkhtml3.16-cil binary package)
<seb128> slomo: that's not going to break anything using mono right now? or will you take care of rebuilding what needs to be changed?
<slomo> seb128: it won't break anything, 2 packages need a small change and rebuild to depend on the new version and that's all what is required
<slomo> these two packages being f-spot and gnome-rdp (universe)
<seb128> slomo: are you sure the changes to gtk- and gnome- to install the changelog only once and remove the symlinks on update are in debian?
<slomo> seb128: gnar, again this annoying docs linking... sorry, will merge them all 3... and tell you once you can move stuff around, etc :(
<seb128> slomo: well, gnome-desktop-sharp2 is new, is there changes to merge there?
<seb128> slomo: thanks
<slomo> well, the same docs linking change that is in gnome-sharp2
<seb128> ok
<slomo> seb128: erm, could you reject the current gnome-desktop-sharp2 upload? new one will come in a minute :/
<seb128> slomo: done
<slomo> seb128: ok, now it's ok to accept :)
<seb128> slomo: accepted
<slomo> thanks
<slomo> seb128: f-spot and gnome-rdp changed too, everything happy now i hope :)
<seb128> excellent
<seb128> slomo: thanks for your work on that
 * bhale hugs slomo 
<slomo> np :)
<seb128> hey bhale, it has been a while
<seb128> how are you?
<bhale> hi seb :)
<bhale> I am good
<bhale> too busy
<bhale> I have been flying for months
<lapo> hi
<seb128> doh, the archive is slow with beta today
<fta2_> on my laptop, control right is mapped to ISO_Level5_Shift instead of Control_R, which confuses Gnome, is that a known issue ?
<seb128> fta2: yes, not sure if that's a bug or a wanted changed
<seb128> fta2 bug #198759
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 198759 in xkeyboard-config "Right CTRL don't work" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/198759
<fta2> seb128, on my desktop, it's correct though
<seb128> you likely don't use the same keymap configuration
<fta2> France Alternative on the laptop, and France on the desktop
<seb128> right
<seb128> that an france alternative thing
<seb128> that's a france alternative thing
<crevette> 15 days without updating = 500 packages to install
#ubuntu-desktop 2008-03-22
<salty-horse> hi. is there a reason I don't see displayconfig-gtk in the application menu? (file is /usr/share/applications/displayconfig-gtk.desktop )
<pochu> salty-horse: are you in KDE?
<pochu> salty-horse: it's in Applications->Others here
<salty-horse> nope. just upgraded to hardy gnome
<salty-horse> I think it's an accidental error.. it should be in system->preferences or administration
<salty-horse> "other" is when no category exists
<salty-horse> I'll check the repos
<salty-horse> what's the meaning of this commit message? http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~displayconfig-gtk/displayconfig-gtk/ubuntu/revision/bryce%40canonical.com-20080320034502-g3q97wykkav22so9?start_revid=bryce%40canonical.com-20080320034502-g3q97wykkav22so9&file_id=displayconfiggtk.des-20070322180214-dyw3rxw0wcvy94go-1
<salty-horse> I'll ask Bryce
<salty-horse> asac, what's does the ubuntu firefox extension do?
<huats> seb128: hello
<seb128> hey huats
<Hobbsee> hi seb128, huats
<huats> hello Hobbsee
<huats> :)
<seb128> hello Hobbsee
<seb128> slomo_: around?
<slomo_> seb128: yes
<seb128> slomo_: I've noticed an issue in gnome-settings-daemon
<seb128> slomo_: the xrdb datas are not installed
<slomo_> /usr/share/gnome-settings-daemon/xrdb here
<slomo_> right, that should be /etc/gnome/xrdb
<seb128> I think the debian gnome-control-center package used to change those and install them under /etc/gnome/config
<slomo_> seb128: will move again, thanks :)
<seb128> can conffiles be moved between binaries? or does it require some postinst work?
<seb128> I think it's one of those annoying cases
<seb128> I'm not sure right now though
<slomo_> i'll try
<seb128> slomo_: http://wiki.debian.org/DpkgConffileHandling can be useful
<slomo_> i hate conffiles :)
<slomo_> seb128: yay, first time that conffiles don't cause extra work... :)
<slomo_> uploaded
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> how they didn't create extra work?
<slomo_> only change needed was the .install file
<seb128> hum
<seb128> I doubt of that
<seb128> slomo_: at least there is a package conflict, since the file moved from capplets-data to an another binary
<seb128> slomo_: and those are conffiles and might have been changed by the user, how will that be handled? will it keep the user version of conffile prompt on upgrade?
<slomo_> seb128: "Replaces: capplets-data (<< 1:2.21.5)"
<slomo_> but for the other part... i don't know :/
<seb128> need to talk to cjwatson when he'll be around
<seb128> the openssh has a changelog entry about that
<slomo_> seb128: another thing... could you move nunit to main and nunit2.2 to universe? last dependency in main is gone now but wants the new version which is supported upstream (while nunit2.2 is very old) ;)
<slomo_> seb128: ok, gst-plugins-base0.10 is uploaded now... please sync :) and move nunit stuff around ;)
<seb128> what is this nunit about?
 * seb128 looks
<seb128> dunno this package
<seb128> nunit wants to go to main apparently
<slomo_> seb128: unit testing... we have old nunit2.2 in main because mono-tools didn't build with nunit some time ago
<slomo_> seb128: that's fixed now and we should use the new version because it's supported upstream
<seb128> are those the same software?
<slomo_> yes
<slomo_> just different versions
<seb128> ok, will do the changes then
<seb128> I doubt pitti will have issues with those
<slomo_> nunit2.2 was uploaded to debian only for mono-tools btw :)
<seb128> understood ;-)
<slomo_> now monodevelop needs it too but that's in universe
<seb128> changed
<slomo_> asac: ping? :)
<slomo_> seb128: ok, so the complete gtk#2.12/gnome#2.20 transition thing is done now, everything built fine ;)
<seb128> good, that was quick and smooth ;-)
<slomo_> except that mono broke in between because we set CPPFLAGS in the build environments now and theyr build system is ugly... yes ;)
<seb128> didn't notice, I just upgraded to the new f-spot, the new libgtkhtml thing got installed correct and it's still working
<asac> slomo_: ?
<slomo_> asac: problem already solved :)
<asac> thats good news :)
<slomo_> asac: well, not good but solved... how can i get the MOZILLA_HOME for xulrunner? :)
<slomo_> asac: before one could simply get the libdir from the pkg-config file
<asac> slomo_: if you need that you are doing something wrong
<asac> you upgraded mono binding for gtkmozembed
<slomo_> asac: no idea if i do something wrong, we have a patch to export the correct MOZILLA_HOME in mono-tools and other packages since ages :)
<asac> ?
<slomo_> no, mono-tools
<asac> slomo_: what does mono-tools do?
<slomo_> i mad it build again
<slomo_> it contains a unit testing gui, documentation browser, etc
<asac> how is the documentation browser calle?
<asac> called
<asac> i remember something about that one :)
<asac> ah ... monodoc-browser
<asac> slomo_: so how is MOZILLA_HOME exported?
<slomo_> in /usr/bin/monodoc
<slomo_> just grep for MOZILLA_HOME and you see it
<asac> before xulrunner 1.9 MOZILLA_HOME was needed to set the proper -rpath
<asac> but thats not the case anymore
<slomo_> ok, so the patch is obsolete... will it hurt?
<asac> looking
<asac> slomo_: plesae drop the current _home patch and use http://paste.ubuntu.com/5999/ instead
<asac> which basically drops the complete mozilla_home business
<asac> let me know if it doesn't work
#ubuntu-desktop 2008-03-23
<vuntz> pitti: http://patches.ubuntu.com/by-release/extracted/ubuntu//g/gnome-volume-manager/2.22.1-1ubuntu2/00_disable_media_handling.patch
<crevette> salut vuntz
<vuntz> pitti: I think the patch part where it changes the default for autoprinter is wrong
<vuntz> pitti: (well, I'm just guessing)
<vuntz> crevette: yop
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-03-16
<dobey> hmm
<dobey> so how do i go about upgrading to jaunty exactly, since i don't see an obvious place to grab an ISO
<pochu> dobey: http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/
<pochu> dobey: or you can "gksu update-manager -d" or something like that
<dobey> hmm
<dobey> i don't think update-manager migrates to ext4 though?
<pochu> I don't think so
<pitti> Good morning
<seb128> hello pitti
<seb128> hey sabdfl
<sabdfl> howdy seb128, how's jaunty looking for you/
<seb128> sabdfl: I looks very good, I think it will be one of the best ubuntu versions (if not the best one) we rolled until now, pretty solid and with some cool changes
<sabdfl> seb128: 2.26 shaping up nicely from GNOME?
<seb128> yes, the 2.26 tarballs are due today and I'm pretty happy about how this cycle went
<seb128> the only concern I had was session storing still being broken but vuntz attached a patch for that on saturday, it might be a bit late for 2.26.0 but it's already in jaunty to get testing
<pitti> seb128: fixing that would be awesome
<pitti> seb128: that has been broken since gutsy or so?
<seb128> pitti: depends what you call session storing
<pitti> seb128: cleanly shutting down session programs on logout, anyway
<seb128> pitti: gnome-session closing without telling applications is since intrepid
<pitti> seb128: I gave up the hope that we'll ever get back proper session saving/restoring :)
<seb128> well the current jaunty version should be somewhat working for that too
<pitti> now, if only suspend/resume worked, then jaunty would be perfect
<seb128> some programs are known to be buggy
<pitti> seb128: I still get the daily "unexpectedly killed" question from firefox
<seb128> see upstream discussion about the real plans, which includes having session storage in gtk and letting applications handle that
<seb128> pitti: did you upgrade and restart since saturday afternoon?
<seb128> pitti: the pacakge I uploaded saturday fix the gedit and firefox cases
<seb128> ie gedit asks for saving work again
<pitti> hm, maybe not yet
<seb128> and firefox don't show the crash dialog
 * pitti upgrades
<seb128> doesn't
<pitti> I did an upgrade on Saturday
<seb128> dpkg -l | grep gnome-session?
<pitti> 2.25.92-0ubuntu3
<pitti> nothing new from apt-get
<seb128> you restarted your session twice since?
<pitti> booted this morning
<seb128> ie, you close a session which was the new gnome-session
<seb128> well, when you closed you laptop with firefox running
<seb128> that was still the old code running?
<pitti> that's entirely possible
<seb128> ok, let me know next time you close a session
<pitti> right, will do
 * pitti grabs all the sync stuff from the sponsoring queue
<pitti> seb128: seems the queue is still manageable in size, I'm doing the python 2.6 sponsorings now
<seb128> pitti: ok thanks
<pitti> seb128: I guess your GNOME packaging army will fill it up quickly again :)
<seb128> yeah, it's a bit early ;-)
<pitti> right, so let's clean it up as much as possible before :)
<Zdra> seb128: telepathy-glib FTBFS for ages now... Bigon told me it's ubuntu's fault... do you have any idea?
<seb128> Zdra: no, I didn't look at it I though bigon was looking at the telepathy stack in ubuntu, let me look
<seb128> it fails to import "locale"
<seb128> seems to be a missing build-depends or similar
<seb128> I doubt it's ubuntu's fault though
<seb128> I will talk to him when he's around
<Zdra> seb128: oh, the error changed... last time I checked it was another python module that failed
<Zdra> seb128: the package builds fine on my jaunty laptop
<seb128> did you try in pbuilder?
<Zdra> seb128: IIRC, he said it's python-minimal that's crack on ubuntu, or something like that
<seb128> ah, that's another discussion, I've read this one
<Zdra> seb128: no, my knownledge in debian packages is level -1 ;)
<seb128> he assumes that python-minimal is not installed which is a wrong assumption
<seb128> the real fix is to make the package still build when that is installed
<seb128> not to blame the ubuntu build machine because it has python-minimal and that the telepathy-glib logic is not clever enough to handle that
<seb128> hat's really a telepathy-glib bug
<seb128> it should either conflict on python-minimal if it can't build when it's there
<seb128> or the configure should be clever enough to detect that everything required is not available
<seb128> anyway I will sort that with him when he's around
<Zdra> seb128: ok, thx
<seb128> you're welcome
<Zdra> seb128: sjoerd (debian packager for tp stack) said the problem is it should depend on python2.5 instead of python2.6
<seb128> asac: could you reply to upstream questions on gnome bug #571423?
<ubottu> Gnome bug 571423 in ask dialog "grabbing the keyboard while a menu is open can lock the session" [Normal,Needinfo] http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=571423
<ember> seb128 can i update gt?
<seb128> yes and vte if you want
<ember> thanks
<seb128> and brasero
<asac> seb128: yes
<seb128> asac: good ;-)
<seb128> brb trying gnome-keyring 2.26 update
<pitti> seb128: no luck; I choose "reboot" from the system menu, and next time firefox says again it crashed
<seb128> pitti: could be that fusa is buggy too, I've been trying using gnome-session
<pitti> seb128: I do not use fusa
<seb128> what do you call system menu?
<seb128> oh
<pitti> just the system menu
<seb128> hum
<seb128> I will try later
<seb128> I did try logout
<seb128> not reboot
<seb128> maybe there is a difference
<pitti> seb128: do you want me to sponsor bug 341487, or do you want to include the patch in the regular 2.26 update?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 341487 in avant-window-navigator "'don't cover the bar' options doesn't work" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/341487
<seb128> looking
<pitti> seb128: grabbing bug 340775 if that's alright with you?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 340775 in gnome-netstatus "Please sponsor gnome-netstatus 2.26.0 to jaunty" [Undecided,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/340775
<seb128> pitti: yes
<seb128> pitti: not sure about bug #341487 if it's going to be in the 2.26 tarball you can sponsor it if you want
<pitti> seb128: the metacity one probably won't be applied upstream
<seb128> ok, you can upload then, I've no clue about it and not interest since I use compiz
<pitti> okay, will have a look
<seb128> thanks!
<seb128> ok, let me try this gnome-session thing on restart
<salty-horse> chrisccoulson, hi. can I do anything to help with my metacity bug? maybe prepare the dpkg myself? (beta freeze is coming up)
<pochu> asac: ping liferea :)
<asac> pochu: right. let me dget it again
<seb128> pitti: ok, you are right, that works only for logout
<pitti> seb128: ah, I had expected that gnome-session wise, logout and reboot would be the same
<seb128> me too
<seb128> I just didn't test those, logout was much faster for testing ;-)
<seb128> I will comment on the upstream bug
 * pitti hugs seb128
 * seb128 hugs pitti
<pitti> seb128: ok, I think I stop sponsoring now and do some work; I'll get back to it when there are some 2.26 updates in the queue
<seb128> pitti: thanks
<seb128> didrocks will be around tonight he said but not during the day
<seb128> not sure about huats
<seb128> the sponsoring rush might be for tomorrow ;-)
<davmor2> Keybuk: about to run some alt install tests to try your hardened fix :)
<Keybuk> davmor2: thanks ;)
<davmor2> Keybuk: seems okay so far doing encrypted lvm over an existing lvm install and running the encrypted lvm at 50% of the drive just to try and stress it as much as possible :)
<vuntz> pitti, seb128: there's a difference between logout and reboot???
<pitti> vuntz: I only tested reboot, I rarely (if ever) log out
<seb128> vuntz: logout ask if you want to close or save work, etc where restart acts as sudo reboot
<vuntz> seb128: hrm
 * seb128 hugs vuntz
<seb128> vuntz: dude you rock, thanks for working on that ;-)
<vuntz> bah
<vuntz> stupid code
<vuntz> indeed, reboot/shutdown are different
<vuntz> I'll fix it this afternoon
<vuntz> I'll need your help for testing, since I can't reboot my machine :-)
<seb128> vuntz: sure, I can test easily and I'm happy to push updates to jaunty too ;-)
<seb128> brb trying the gvfs update
<pitti> vuntz: happy to do testing as well
<crevette> thanks pitti for pushing vuntz' patch in bluez-gnome
<pitti> crevette: you're welcome; I tested it with my mobile, and it works well
<crevette> cool
<pitti> I also informed ubuntu-doc@ and provided a screenshot
<crevette> hopefully gnome-bluettho will be here for 9.10
<crevette> I spent my week-end doing the documentation of gnome-bluetooth
<crevette> and reporting bugs
<pitti> crevette: sorry, there wasn't a patch to be sponsored, so I just applied it
<pitti> crevette: g-bluetooth> indeed, crossing fingers
<crevette> not a problem
<pitti> bluez-gnome is an utter UI mess
<crevette> gnome-bluetooth won't that different, except it is stripped from the analyser
<crevette> I expect gnome-bluetooth to have better functionallity to connect to Audio gateway/headset, or printer
<crevette> and Input devices
 * pitti -> lunch, bbl
<seb128> pitti: enjoy
<davmor2> pitti: when you're back this afternoon I intend dedicating to the jockey err19 issue :)
<kenvandine_wk> morning rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> morning all
<seb128> hello kenvandine_wk rickspencer3
<kenvandine_wk> hey seb128
<seb128> kenvandine_wk: how busy are you today?
<kenvandine_wk> i don't think very :)
<kenvandine_wk> seb128: you got gnome bumps coming?
<seb128> kenvandine_wk: want to do some GNOME 2.26 updates?
<kenvandine_wk> of course :)
<kenvandine_wk> seb128: was planning to work on bug 339847 today... but i think it needs a little more discussion first :)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 339847 in system-config-printer "system-config-printer notification patch should auto-detect capabilities of notification daemon, so that it can get upstreamized" [Unknown,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/339847
<kenvandine_wk> seb128: and ekiga
<seb128> kenvandine_wk: http://download.gnome.org/sources/gnome-games-extra-data/2.26/gnome-games-extra-data-2.26.0.tar.gz http://download.gnome.org/sources/totem-pl-parser/2.26/totem-pl-parser-2.26.0.tar.gz http://download.gnome.org/sources/gedit-plugins/2.26/gedit-plugins-2.26.0.tar.gz
<kenvandine_wk> ok
<seb128> kenvandine_wk: you can pick any of those or work on ekiga as you want
<kenvandine_wk> i'll take them all
<seb128> ok good
<seb128> when you done let me know if you want some other ones ;-)
<kenvandine_wk> sure
<pitti> hey rickspencer3
<pitti> good morning kenvandine_wk
<rickspencer3> pitti: good morning
<kenvandine_wk> hey pitti
<pitti> hah!
<pitti> I just ordered DSL, at last
<pitti> available since today \o/
<seb128> pitti: hey!
<seb128> rock on ;-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - want me to do some updates later? you have to make the most of my time while you can, as I have no internet again in a few days ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson: let me know when you are ready to do some, I prefer to not block updates for "later" now but I'm sure we will still have some available ;-)
<chrisccoulson> yeah, no problem
<seb128> chrisccoulson: how come you will have no internet again? still fighting with this download limit?
<chrisccoulson> i terminated the contact with my ISP
<chrisccoulson> i got sick of them when I had the fault on the line - they were absolutely useless. so I'm shopping around for a new provider now
<seb128> ah ok
<chrisccoulson> hopefully will only be a few days downtime
<seb128> well, GNOME 2.26 is due this week
<seb128> then you have a month until 2.26.1 ;-)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: ISPs suck..
<chrisccoulson> they do - i've had a terrible experience with every ISP i've been with. my last one continued billing me for months after I left, and kept threatening me with court action
<salty-horse> chrisccoulson, hi. seen my message from before?
<kenvandine_wk> mvo: did you see my comment on that update script bug?
<kenvandine_wk> mvo: bug 340777
<chrisccoulson> hi salty-horse. i'm at work at the moment, so i can't do anything. you could subscribe ubuntu-main-sponsors to your bug report though
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 340777 in gnome-panel "Panel should add the messaging indicator for users upgrading" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/340777
<salty-horse> ok chrisccoulson
<mvo> kenvandine_wk: yes, thanks. I'm a bit lost currently what the problem is, but I will debug further when I'm finished with compiz
<kenvandine_wk> ok
<asac> ArneGoetje: ping
<davmor2> pitti: Afternoon dude.  I'm installing Ubuntu fresh now and I'll back up the image this time and then start attacking that jockey err19 bug :)
<pitti> davmor2: hey
<pitti> davmor2: I read some more feedback on the bug report, and it only seems to crash after the driver install is fully done already
<pitti> davmor2: I haven't found an nvidia system to experiment on yet, thoug
<pitti> davmor2: I think I need to sprinkle lots of print statements into the code to narrow down where it crashes that way :(
<pitti> davmor2: if you are a bit familiar with Python, and want to do that, please feel free,  of course :)
<pitti> or if anyone can provide me with a root ssh on an nvidia system
<davmor2> Yes pitti you get the 100% from the install bit, then bar starts to move left and right it's at that point that it crashes.
<davmor2> pitti: the latter might be possible
<pitti> maybe tseliot also has some time, I didn't talk to him
<pitti> tseliot: did you happen to notice this IOError 19 crash? can you reproduce it on your system?
<pitti> tseliot: in jockey, I mean, when installing nvidia
<davmor2> pitti: give me a bit of time to get it setup I'm having to ues alternate ubiquity is temporarily fried
<pitti> davmor2: sure, no hurry; I'm busy with something else ATM anyway :)
<tseliot> pitti: yes, I noticed the bug report but I haven't had the time to reproduce the problem here yet
<tseliot> pitti: I'll have a look at it ASAP
<pitti> tseliot: thanks; sorry, I don't have any nvidia system myself any more
<pitti> tseliot: it's utterly weird that there's no stack trace
<tseliot> pitti: definitely
<mvo> kenvandine_wk: I uploaded a new version now into my PPA for the panel adding thing, its very verbose now, so if it fails, hopefully we know this time why :)
<kenvandine_wk> ok
<kenvandine_wk> mvo will test after this meeting
<ArneGoetje> asac: pong
<crevette> it seems bluez 4.33 was released this week-end without an announcement
<tedg> pitti: So, what makes sense now for sponsoring requests?  Now that there is a packaging branch with a shared history, it seems that it should be a merge request?  I thinking specifically of indicator-applet, but asking the question more generally.
<pitti> tedg: in general, just tell the uploader where to merge from (upstream or packaging branch)
<pitti> tedg: if you find the PPA useful still, and thus you continue to maintain the packaging branch, I guess it's easier for both of us to merge from that
<pitti> tedg: If you don't need the packaging branch any more, then ignore it, and I'll merge fixes directly from upstream
<tedg> pitti: Yeah, I've been using the packaging branch and changing your fixes in.
<tedg> s/changing/merging/
<pitti> tedg: right, I meant if you merge new versions from trunk to the packaging branch yourself
<tedg> pitti: Yes, doing that too.
<tedg> So I'll make a bug, and then in the text of the bug mention the merge?
<pitti> tedg: I think you only need a merge request _or_ a sponsoring bug
<tedg> pitti: Okay, will do.  Thanks!
<pitti> tedg: easiest is probably to open a bug, say "please merge trunk", sub ubuntu-main-sponsors, done
<pitti> davmor2, tseliot: hah! I nailed the jockey crash (IOError 19)
<davmor2> pitti: cool :)
<pitti> davmor2: still need the box a little more for actually fixing it, though
<davmor2> pitti: np's
<pitti> but it's great to be able to reproduce it, I can pinpoint the issue now
<tseliot> pitti: what is it? Or when does it happen?
<pitti> tseliot: it was thrown in the garbage collector
<pitti> tseliot: I previously used
<pitti>                     open(os.path.join(driver_path, 'unbind'), 'w').write(device)
<pitti> and when closing that unnamed fd in the GC, I get this error
<pitti> I added an explicit f.close() and now get the same error with proper stack trace
<pitti> apparently that's just a quirk, and I can ignore the error
<tseliot> very well
<pitti> davmor2: hm, did you ever notice jockey's UI hang after installing the nvidia driver?
<pitti> davmor2: this always seems to happen for me when I run it through ssh -X on your machine
 * kenvandine_wk -> lunch
<davmor2> pitti: no just dies
<pitti> davmor2: I haven't tracked this down yet, but I can do so tomorrow morning if your machine is still up then
<pitti> davmor2: "die" how? I get a hung UI
<pitti> and I have to Ctrl-\ it
<pitti> davmor2: anyway, I fixed the crash now, thanks so far!
<pitti> davmor2: the hung UI still worries me, though
<pitti> but -> tomorrow, need some dinner and then I have Taekwondo
<davmor2> pitti: No probs I'll leave it up for you
<pitti> davmor2: cheers
<davmor2> pitti: do you want me to run jockey locally and see if it hangs?
<pitti> davmor2: hang on
<chrisccoulson> hi seb128 - any updates still left to do?
<davmor2> pitti: by dies I mean that err19 issue crashed jockey out so you never got to see if it hung without the error in place
<chrisccoulson> just got back from work now:)
<pitti> davmor2: oh, interesting; for me the GUI stayed around
<seb128> chrisccoulson: http://download.gnome.org/sources/totem/2.26/totem-2.26.0.tar.gz
<pitti> davmor2: anyway, please give me a second
<davmor2> np's
<chrisccoulson> thanks, i'll take care of that:)
<seb128> chrisccoulson: http://download.gnome.org/sources/gnome-icon-theme/2.25/gnome-icon-theme-2.25.92.tar.gz
<seb128> chrisccoulson: and http://download.gnome.org/sources/tracker/0.6/tracker-0.6.91.tar.gz if you want to look at this one too
<seb128> chrisccoulson: thank *you* for looking at those ;-)
<chrisccoulson> no problem:)
<pitti> davmor2: ok, please reboot the box (I can't rmmod nvidia) and try enabling nvidia
<davmor2> pitti: rebooting now
<pitti> davmor2: @dinner, back in 30
<davmor2> nps
<davmor2> pitti: installed and crashed.  I've left the crash on the box.  The Hardware Drivers initial window stays up but then it always has for as long as I can remember to display the fact that you need to restart.
<davmor2> pitti: I've not restarted the machine but can if you want
<cassidy> seb128: hey. I just asked to libnice's maintainer and it said it would be good to have 0.0.5 in Jaunty if possible
<cassidy> seb128: see http://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/nice/2009-March/000278.html
<seb128> cassidy: fine with me nothing use it right now
<cassidy> seb128: yeah, just farsight2
<seb128> cassidy: I will sync it
<cassidy> seb128: great, thanks
<crevette> cassidy: trying to get the latest release for telepathy ?
<crevette> :)
<cassidy> crevette: trying to get the best audio/video support in Jaunty actually :)
<cassidy> crevette: the TP stack is pretty up to date now. see http://people.collabora.co.uk/~cassidy/tp-versions.html
<crevette> and tp-gabble 0.7.23 is released?
<crevette> telepathy applies the mantra "release early, release often" scrictly
<cassidy> yeah, especially gabble
<cassidy> crevette: btw, .22 should be in Jaunty now
<pitti> davmor2: right, but you can't change anything in the window any more, right?
<pitti> davmor2: will look at the .crash file, hang on
<pitti> davmor2: ah, right, that was a typo of mine which I fixed in the tree, but not on your installed system
<davmor2> pitti: I can click on the other options
<pitti> davmor2: let me fix that, and clean up again
<davmor2> pitti: the remove button changes to an activate button
<pitti> davmor2: ok, so I'll disable the nvidia driver again
<pitti> and clean up all remaints
<davmor2> no probs
<pitti> davmor2: when I'm done, I'd like you to reboot, enable nvidia in jockey, check that it doesn't crash, and that the UI still works after installing, and that nvidia is correctly installed
<pitti> davmor2: ok, done
<davmor2> so full reboot after jockey has finished then yes?
<davmor2> pitti: ^
<pitti> davmor2: no, first reboot, then enable nvidia in jockoey
<pitti> davmor2: the machine is ready for reboot now
<pitti> davmor2: I disabled the nvidia driver
<davmor2> pitti: yes and after jockey has finished reboot again to ensure nvidia is correctly installed correct?
<pitti> davmor2: right
<pitti> davmor2: but before,
<pitti> davmor2: please ensure that jockey GUI isn't stuck/hang after enabling nvidia
<didrocks> Hi o/
<pitti> i. e. you should still be able to click on the other drivers and see their description
<seb128> hello didrocks
<davmor2> I've rebooted and am now installing nvidia
<seb128> didrocks: did you have a good weekend?
<pitti> davmor2: and nvidia 180 should appear as enabled
<didrocks> hello seb128 :-)
 * pitti hugs didrocks
<crevette> hey pitti, do you think it worth I asked to upgrade bluez to 4.33, a new release was out his morning with bunch of fixes
<didrocks> seb128: very nice thanks! A beautiful weather and fresh snow :)
 * didrocks hugs pitti back
<seb128> excellent ;-)
<crevette> s/I asked/to ask/
<didrocks> seb128: what about you? ;)
<seb128> didrocks: no snow and too short but nice and relaxing ;-)
<didrocks> great ;-)
<davmor2> pitti: it's back up and correct with 180 installed.  Also I dropped a screenshot on the desktop for you to show that it's not locked up and to be sure that we are both talking about the same window :)
<davmor2> no crash at all this time :)
<seb128> didrocks: want some updates to do?
<pitti> davmor2: rocking!
<pitti> davmor2: thank you so much for testing
<pitti> davmor2: so, I don't need the machine any more
<davmor2> pitti: no thank you for fixing :)
<didrocks> seb128: I'm reducing my "needs to be read" mail stack, but I can handle some in parallel :)
<pitti> davmor2: oh, another thing
<davmor2> pitti: yes
<pitti> davmor2: could you disable nvidia again, and check that it removes nvidia-180-libvdpau and nvidia-settings, too?
<pitti> davmor2: I fixed that too, but I forgot to check
<davmor2> pitti: removing now
<didrocks> seb128: did you receive my last message?
<davmor2> pitti: running alt-f2 and typing in nv the only thing showing is nvidia-detector  I'm just checking synaptic
<seb128> didrocks: no
<seb128> gnome-session didn't like my g-s-d testing
<didrocks> <didrocks> seb128: I'm reducing my "needs to be read" mail stack, but I  can handle some in parallel :)
<seb128> didrocks: http://download.gnome.org/sources/gtkmm/2.16/gtkmm-2.16.0.tar.gz http://download.gnome.org/sources/gnome-system-monitor/2.26/gnome-system-monitor-2.26.0.1.tar.gz
<pitti> davmor2: dpkg -l 'nvidia*' | grep ^ii
<seb128> I'm away for sport soon but I will be back for sponsoring and update in ~2 hours
<didrocks> seb128: ok :)
<seb128> bbl
<davmor2> pitti: bunch of modaliases and nvidia-common
<pitti> davmor2: perfect
 * kenvandine_wk installs 647 updates
<pitti> davmor2: thanks!
<davmor2> np's
 * pitti ^5s davmor2, great teamwork
<davmor2> pitti: have fun at Taekwondo
<pitti> davmor2: Kihap!
 * calc is up to ~ 1000 lines for his new debian/rules file :\
<didrocks> debhelper, cdbs rocks \o/
<chrisccoulson> quilt is so annoying sometimes!
<pitti> good night everyone
<kenvandine_wk> good night pitti
<davmor2> night pitti
<mad4cron> Hello.  I'm experiencing a problem with crontab behaving differently on Desktop 8.04.2 and Server 8.04.2.  It involves non-root user, crontab, screen, and autossh.  I've detailed it on the forums here: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1092972     Can anyone offer any advice?  Thanks.
<maxb> mad4cron: Sounds highly likely to simply be that networking isn't up yet, so it fails.
<mad4cron> cool.  i'll try to perform some checks.  thanks for the reply.
<mad4cron> maxb:  brilliant.  output from ifconfig right before screen-autossh in crontab show no IP.  Thank you!  Do you have any advice on a work around?
<mad4cron> i guess Static IP might be one (blush)
<maxb> man autossh, /Startup behaviour
<mad4cron> will do
<mad4cron> maxb:  you are the man.  and i need to rtfm.  thank you!
<dobey> doh. pitti is gone...
<dobey> as is seb
<dobey> hrmm, i wonder how to make a package install trigger an apt-get update afterward
<didrocks> seb128: not too tired from the sport? :)
<seb128> didrocks: no, there is a pile of tarballs to do I've to be full of energy for sponsoring and updates -)
<seb128> ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: the two packages are ready to get some sponsorship. I will get some rest now, but you can give me a bunch of update to proceed. I will do them tomorrow morning as a packager machine :)
<seb128> didrocks: when do you start in the morning?
<didrocks> seb128: just pv me them so that I can work early tomorrow. I will backlog
<seb128> ok
<didrocks> seb128: let's say 8-9 AM
<seb128> I will see what is not done when I go to bed
<seb128> have a good night
<didrocks> thanks, have a good night too (and don't go to bed too late :p)
<seb128> I start around 9am too so that will be alright
<seb128> didrocks: thanks (yeah, will try)
<didrocks> seb128: just give me one or two to be sure :)
<didrocks> 'night ;)
<seb128> didrocks: I will give you some in query before going to bed!
<seb128> night
<seb128> kenvandine_wk: do you want other updates to do?
<seb128> chrisccoulson: or you? ;-)
<seb128> lut huats
<chrisccoulson> hi seb128, i'm still busy with the other updates;)
<seb128> ok good
<seb128> I'm catching up on sponsoring and updates now after sport and dinner
<seb128> Laney: there is bug #343650 to sponsor if you want to help on reviewing ;-)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 343650 in gedit-plugins "Update to 2.26.0" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/343650
<Laney> seb128: wanna trade for miro? ;)
<seb128> Laney: no thanks ;-)
<Laney> BAH
<Laney> I feel responsible yet can't fix it
<Laney> what a terrible situation
<Laney> anyway I'll look at this
<seb128> Laney: hum, depends in fact, want to do the 36 remaining GNOME tarballs in exchange? ;-)
<Laney> haha
<Laney> I'll do some
<dobey> 36?
<seb128> if you want to do some updates let me know
<dobey> seb128: btw i released intltool 0.40.6 the other day
<seb128> dobey: yes, do you think it's a lot? ;-)
<dobey> i still have to release gnome-icon-theme yet though :)
<seb128> dobey: yes, I've seen thanks, it's in jaunty since this afternoon
<dobey> nice :)
 * Laney will be seeking FFe for gnome-do later
<seb128> Laney: I can have a look to that if you have a bug report
<Laney> seb128: Thanks, just waiting for upstream to release a new tarball
<seb128> ok
<Laney> bundled binary libs are no fun
<seb128> indeed
<seb128> dobey: jaunty also has icon-naming-utils 0.8.90 for a week btw
<Laney> huh, weird
<Laney> kenvandine_wk: Why are all of the plugins in the long description duplicated?
<dobey> seb128: i saw, thanks. i don't think tango-icon-theme has been updated though has it?
<seb128> dobey: no, it has been updated in debian this weekend though so I will have a look after the GNOME 2.26 rush
<dobey> seb128: great. i wonder if debian updated the copyright/license info properly
<seb128> dobey: I think they did, http://packages.qa.debian.org/t/tango-icon-theme/news/20090315T115942Z.html
<seb128> "   * Adapted `debian/copyright' to the new Public Domain licensing."
<dobey> cool
<dobey> yeah
<dobey> doh, i don't think my python-xdot packages built correctly :(
<Laney> guh
<Laney> I'm just going to remove the dupes and upload
<seb128> Laney: they were already there in the previous version?
<Laney> yeah
<Laney> can't see why though
<seb128> could be coming from debian or a typo or something
<Laney> nope
<Laney> (not Debian)
<Laney> oh well
<Laney> seb128: Done
<Laney> wanna toss me some upgrades?
<seb128> Laney: thanks!
<Laney> universe ones if you have any
<seb128> Laney: http://download.gnome.org/sources/swfdec-gnome/2.26/swfdec-gnome-2.26.0.tar.gz
<Laney> cool
<seb128> Laney: most of the updates are in main but I'm happy to upload for you if you want to do some extra ones there ;-)
<Laney> sure
<Laney> just killing time until the gnome-do guys reappear
<seb128> Laney: http://download.gnome.org/sources/gtk-engines/2.18/gtk-engines-2.18.0.tar.gz if you want to do it next
<seb128> tedg: there?
<tedg> seb128: yes.
<seb128> tedg: do you know how does those request for merging work?
<seb128> tedg: am I supposed to do anything on launchpad out of the bzr merge and upload?
<tedg> seb128: I think it all has to be done outside of LP today.
<seb128> ok
<tedg> seb128: I'm not sure though, there seems to be alot of changes going on there.
<seb128> you did some weird changes to the changelog
<tedg> seb128: https://launchpad.net/tarmac  -- I think that's supposed to help, but I haven't used it.
<tedg> What changes were weird?
<tedg> In the middle versions, or the final diff?
<seb128> I think it's the diff acting weirdly
<seb128> - -- Martin Pitt <martin.pitt@ubuntu.com>  Tue, 17 Feb 2009 11:26:38 +0100
<seb128> + -- Martin Pitt <martin.pitt@ubuntu.com>  Thu, 19 Feb 2009 16:12:01 +0100
<seb128>  
<seb128> for example
<seb128> rather than just having new revisions in the changelog it shows a mix of changes
<tedg> Hmm, that is odd.  I looked at the diffs that LP made and they looked fine.
<seb128> the diff is correct
<seb128> bzr diff -r135..144 is weird
<seb128> anyway I've other thinkgs to do that trying to understand that, the diff looks fine, sponsoring now
<seb128> hum
<seb128> tedg: where is the 0.1.2 tarball? ;-)
<tedg> seb128: https://launchpad.net/indicator-applet/+download
<seb128> tedg: you should add a watch file so they are downloaded automatically ;-)
<seb128> thanks
<tedg> I've never done that before.  How does that work?
<seb128> tedg: copy a GNOME one or man uscan
<seb128> tedg: it's basically a regexp describing where to get tarballs
<tedg> Okay, I'll look into that.  Hopefully no more releases on these packages for Jaunty.
<seb128> it lists whatever matches the regexp and get you the most recent version
<seb128> ie you bzr get && bzr-buildpackage
<seb128> and it downloads the tarball for you and start the build
<seb128> nothing to do
<seb128> tedg: you need to update the libindicate0 shlibs version
<seb128> tedg: do you want me to do that before uploading?
<tedg> seb128: Yes, please do.
<tedg> seb128: I forgot to make that part of the build.
<Laney> uh
<tedg> BTW, the next upload of the messaging indicator will have the libs better like you asked for in Berlin.  Got that straightened out too.
<seb128> tedg: better?
<Laney> Is something up with the i386 buildds?
<tedg> seb128: It's a module, but was installing versioned libraries even though it didn't use them.
<seb128> ah right
<seb128> Laney: why?
<Laney> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gedit-plugins/2.26.0-0ubuntu1/+build/906753/+files/buildlog_ubuntu-jaunty-i386.gedit-plugins_2.26.0-0ubuntu1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<Laney> seb128: check ^
<seb128> Laney:
<seb128> dpkg: error processing fontconfig-config (--configure):
<seb128>  subprocess post-installation script returned error exit status 10
<seb128> dpkg: dependency problems prevent configuration of libfontconfig1:
<seb128> Laney: give it a retry, seem so to be an install glitch
<Laney> I got it for something I uploaded to my PPA too
<Laney> let's see if swfdec fails also
<chrisccoulson> totem has failed to build with the same error
<seb128> asac: ^
<seb128> apparently asac broke fontconfig
<asac> seb128: oops.let me check
<seb128> asac: "subprocess post-installation script returned error exit status 10" on all the buildds
<seb128> asac: good time, in the middle of GNOME 2.26 uploads ...
<asac> waiting for the log
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i've nearly done the gnome-icon-theme update
<chrisccoulson> i've struggled several times to get it to build, due to one of the patches though
<chrisccoulson> 1 of the patches seems to have some hand edits to a Makefile.in, and it needed updating to get it to apply. i couldn't get it to build regardless of what i did with the patch though, so i've created an autotools.patch and just run autoreconf to update everything properly, and it seems to build ok now
<chrisccoulson> is that ok?
<seb128> chrisccoulson: yes, it's better, I need to complain to pitti tomorrow about sponsoring the edited by hand version ;-)
<chrisccoulson> thanks, i'll submit it with the properly generated patch then. it's much easier than trying to figure out how to edit Makefiles...
<seb128> indeed
<asac> as usually when you want to setup a clean chroot to test network gets bad and slow
<Laney> gah
<Laney> gnome-do guy forgot to merge my branch
<Laney> released an identical tarball as the previous release Â¬_Â¬
 * Laney does gtk-engines
<asac> i think chroot creating approaches phase 2 ;)
 * asac hands a turbo boost to debootstrap ... need to reset my AP to get rid of slowness
<asac> seb128: ok. i think i got it.
<asac> seb128: if you give me a list of failed packages i can retry them when built ;)
<seb128> asac: just ask infinity or a buildd admin to retry everything which failed when it will be fixed
<Laney> seb128: hit me with another update
<asac> seb128: we can hit retry on our own if we know the package
<Laney> asac: Is it fixed? I can retry swfdec-gnome
<seb128> asac: there is like 15 of those which failed on all arches and retries this way get the lower score possible
<asac> Laney: err .... i am doing some final tests. will upload there
<Laney> ok
<Laney> that's a package you can use to test
<seb128> asac: which means we will get GNOME 2.26 several days after the official days if we do that and buildds are busy
<asac> seb128: buildds are idle ;)
<seb128> asac: ok, so fix fontconfig and I will retry everything I uploaded
<asac> seb128: do you upload more?
<seb128> asac: I will not stop packaging GNOME 2.26 because you broke the buildds, yes I keep uploading ;-)
<dobey> seb128: are you familiar with the ways of packaging a single python file as a module? i think i did it wrong, but i copied the stuff from python-coverage which seems to be a single module too... but i don't know what i did wrong
<seb128> dobey: where is your source package? and what issue do you get?
<asac> seb128: use >= ubuntu9 then ;)
<dobey> seb128: https://edge.launchpad.net/~dobey/+archive/ppa
<dobey> seb128: the package seems to not have the module :-/
<seb128> asac: I don't like to false the requirements only to avoid buildd retries ;-)
<seb128> Laney: http://download.gnome.org/sources/zenity/2.26/zenity-2.26.0.tar.gz
<seb128> dobey: looking
<asac> seb128: ok uploaded ... installed cleanly now in fresh chroot.
<dobey> seb128: thanks much
<seb128> asac: thanks for the quick fixing
<asac> np. sorry for the hick-up.
<asac> its postinst magic i felt safe about ;) ... but then i forgot to look into what debconf module does when there is no debconf anymore ;)
<asac> seb128: i will retry gedit manually when that thing has build. will let you know when that is confirmed
<seb128> asac: ok thanks
 * asac now pays the bill and stays awake longer ;)
<XiXaQ> seb128: do you follow evolutions mailinglist? There was an interesting discussion there regarding syncevolution and genesis the last few days.
<seb128> XiXaQ: no
<XiXaQ> perhaps there is an archive on the web somewhere.
<seb128> dobey: "python setup.py build" seems to do nothing there
<seb128> XiXaQ: there is for sure but it's past midnight and I still have around 30 GNOME 2.26 tarballs on my todolist so now is not the time to look at this
<seb128> dobey:
<seb128> $ python setup.py build
<seb128> running build
<seb128> running build_py
<seb128> file coverage.py (for module coverage) not found
<XiXaQ> seb128: ok :)
<dobey> huh
<huats> seb128: hey
<seb128> lut huats
<huats> just so that you know I am taking care of anjuta and gcalctool tomorrow...
<seb128> huats: thanks
<huats> no pb
<dobey> how stupid of me!
<huats> sorry I cannot help a lot more right now...
<seb128> huats: that's ok, bad timing for GNOME 2.26 apparently, didrocks was skiing and you were not around either
<huats> yeah...
<huats> 2.26.1 will be better...
<Ampelbein> seb128: is it ok if i do seahorse-plugins update?
<huats> but anyway I will try to help out a bit...
<seb128> huats: let's see ;-)
<seb128> Ampelbein: yes
<Ampelbein> cool.
<huats> seb128: how the release is going on so far ?
<seb128> huats: that's ok, we are updates under control, do anjuta and gcalctool that's enough
<huats> ok great
<seb128> huats: it was going good until asac decide to break fontconfig which avoid anything to build tonight
<huats> hÃ©hÃ©
<asac> the night is still long :-P
<Ampelbein> seb128: bug #343968 . since seahorse-plugins has a bzr branch, i pushed the changes to my lp-codepage. should i propose the merging to the official desktop-team branch or can i leave it as it is?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 343968 in seahorse-plugins "Please sponsor version 2.26.0 in jaunty" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/343968
<dobey> seb128: thanks for pointing out my blatent stupidity :)
<seb128> Ampelbein: that's good like that, the extra lp feature doesn't bring anything useful there
<seb128> dobey: you're welcome ;-)
<seb128> Ampelbein: want to do an another update?
<Ampelbein> seb128: sure, plenty of time tonight.
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i've done gnome-icon-theme now. i won't get a chance to do tracker this evening, but i'll do it tomorrow if nobody else wants to do it first
<seb128> Ampelbein: http://download.gnome.org/sources/glade3/3.6/glade3-3.6.0.tar.gz
<seb128> chrisccoulson: there is no hurry tomorrow is fine it's yours, thanks!
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - did you have a chance to see the gnome-media changes i did?
<seb128> chrisccoulson: I've seen the mail and I will look at it later I just wanted to get the "easy updates" done first ;-)
<chrisccoulson> thanks:)
<seb128> chrisccoulson: btw you are welcome to update gnome-media to 2.26 too tomorrow if you want
<seb128> so I can review both ;-)
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i can do that. save on sponsoring effort too ;)
<huats> seb128: do you know if someone is handling the gdl udpdate ?
<seb128> huats: you? ;-)
<huats> seb128: lol
<huats> ok
<huats> Ampelbein: you are taking care of glade ?
<Ampelbein> huats: yes
<huats> ok great
<huats> Ampelbein: I need it for anjuta :)
<Ampelbein> huats: will do my very best. currently building it with pbuilder.
<huats> ok great Ampelbein
<huats> don't worry I have other stuffs to update forst
<huats> first
<Laney> hah
<Laney> seb128: I have time for one more
<seb128> Laney: http://download.gnome.org/sources/yelp/2.26/yelp-2.26.0.tar.gz
<Laney> got it
<seb128> Laney: or http://download.gnome.org/sources/gnome-menus/2.26/gnome-menus-2.26.0.tar.gz
<seb128> Laney: yelp might be slightly non trivial so maybe better gnome-menus
<seb128> Laney: yelp has a rosetta translation patch, you need to ask translation export to update the patch, copy the pos in the po directory, etc
<Laney> guh
<Laney> I know nothing about that
<seb128> right
<seb128> do gnome-menus ;-)
<Laney> ok
<Laney> maybe next time I can learn...
<seb128> well you can do it if you want
<Laney> nah, need a quick one
<seb128> the thing is that translated xml are build at build time, ie it doesn't use gettext to get translations at runtime
<vuntz> seb128: stop highlighting in my irc client by saying gnome-menus!
<Laney> need to get to bed
<seb128> vuntz: ;-)
<seb128> vuntz: stop rolling tarballs!
<dobey> speaking of rolling tarballs
<dobey> just uploaded gnome-icon-theme-2.26.0.tar.gz :)
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-03-17
<Ampelbein> seb128: i guess the build errors i just got for seahorse-plugins come from the broken fontconfig you mentioned earlier? (http://launchpadlibrarian.net/23958748/buildlog_ubuntu-jaunty-i386.seahorse-plugins_2.26.0-0ubuntu1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz)
<seb128> Ampelbein: yes
<Ampelbein> ok.
<Ampelbein> seb128: bug #343976 ready for review.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 343976 in glade-3 "Please sponsor version 3.6.0 in Jaunty" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/343976
<seb128> Ampelbein: thanks
<Ampelbein> seb128: any more updates to do?
<seb128> Ampelbein: http://download.gnome.org/sources/gnome-icon-theme/2.26/gnome-icon-theme-2.26.0.tar.gz
<Ampelbein> ok
<Laney> when are we supposed to hear about uds sponsorship?
<seb128> not yet I guess
<Laney> i thought it was today
<seb128> lists had to be made for some days ago and are reviewed now I think
<seb128> will be soon I guess
<Laney> scary
<seb128> what?
<Laney> waiting to hear
<seb128> ah ;-)
<Laney> it's like seeing if you have what you want on christmas day
<seb128> hehe
<dobey> well i finally upgraded my laptop to jaunty today
<dobey> and thankfully suspend/resume and wireless and 3d all still work
<Ampelbein> seb128: bug #343996 ready for review.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 343996 in gnome-icon-theme "Please sponsor version 2.26.0 in jaunty" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/343996
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> Ampelbein: http://download.gnome.org/sources/vino/2.26/vino-2.26.0.tar.gz if you want an another one
<Ampelbein> seb128: ok.
<Ampelbein> seb128: just one simple question about bzr. is there an easy way to build from the bzr-branch with pbuilder? for now i always copy the debian-directory to a source directory and build there, but this seems quite complicated.
<asac> Ampelbein: try bzr builddeb --merge --dont-purge ;)
<jColl> Anyone know what's going on with Hardy updates size mismatches?
<asac> bzr-builddeb package
<asac> Ampelbein: you just need to place the tarball at appropriate place
<huats> seb128: bug  344006
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 344006 in gdl "Please sponsor gdl 2.26.0 into jaunty" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/344006
<Ampelbein> asac: i tried that but then dpkg-checkbuilddeps complains that build-depends are not satisfied.
<seb128> huats: thanks
<huats> your welcome seb128
<asac> Ampelbein: install the builddepends then
<asac> Ampelbein: otherwise just build sources and then put the .dsc to pbuilder
<asac> like bzr bd --merge --builder='debuild -S'
<Ampelbein> asac: ah, ok. that's what i was looking for.
<asac> something is really slow with my network
<asac> bummer
<Ampelbein> asac: did not want to install all the build-deps myself since that's what pbuilder is there for was i thinking. thanks for the help.
<asac> Ampelbein: sudo apt-get build-dep package ;)
 * Ampelbein is banging my head to the desk. so obvious... thanks again.
<Ampelbein> seb128: bug #344000 ready for review.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 344000 in vino "Please sponsor version 2.26.0 in jaunty" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/344000
<seb128> Ampelbein: thanks
<seb128> asac: your fontconfig fix worked apparently ;-)
<asac> seb128: really?
<asac> seb128: which build succeeded?
<seb128> asac: https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-utils/2.26.0-0ubuntu1/+build/906982
<asac> argh. is launchpad slow on your side too?
<seb128> asac: no
<seb128> but I'm using edge
<asac> me too
<asac> seems my provider thinks during night they can do maintenance or something
<seb128> try to not use edge maybe then ;-)
<asac> its really slow
<asac> seb128: that did the trick i think
<asac> amazing
<asac> how can librarian be so much faster?
<asac> that must be coincident
<asac> so cool
<seb128> asac: what did you change? non-edge?
<asac> seb128: yeah
<asac> now it rocks the boat
<asac> seems i could continue to work all night now ;)
<seb128> asac: if you don't break the buildds again ;-)
<asac> haha
<asac> i usually try not to do that
 * seb128 build retry everything uploaded tonight
<asac> seb128: now that gcc is off the amd builder stuff hopefully gets moving quickly
<asac> but i386 is mostly yours now ;)
<asac> damn ... the edge boost was temporary only
<seb128> asac: amd64 still fail to build
<seb128> asac: but not on the bug now
<seb128> just arch any-all mismatch for fontconfig packages leading to uninstallability
<asac> seb128: log?
<asac> ah
<seb128> amd64 didn't catch the same published run for fontconfig
<asac> seb128: well
<seb128> publisher
<asac> amd64 doesnt even have a free slot
<asac> so when ati is done all stuff hopefully will be there
<seb128> I guess now is a good time to go to bed ;-)
<asac> yeah
<asac> seb128: did you get failures from other arches too?
<asac> they should have the same issue
<seb128> some
<asac> k
<asac> gnome-utils seems to build on armel
<seb128> https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-utils/2.26.0-0ubuntu1
<seb128> in fact only i386 worked
<asac> seb128: its building right now on armel .. isnt it?
<seb128> yes
<asac> k
<asac> its definitly compiling so stuff should be there
<asac> maybe ports is faster though
<seb128> asac: I will remember to break builds next time you have a firefox you want to get pushed to your users ;-)
<asac> seb128: do you know when publisher run is?
<seb128> asac: :03 I think
<seb128> hourly
<seb128> asac: btw what did you change in fontconfig exactly?
<seb128> asac: tried to clean all the ubuntu special rules there?
<asac> seb128: i removed obsolete conffiles
<asac> seb128: and links
<asac> seb128: and disabled debconf
<asac> also moved stuff that was in .diff.gz into a debian/patches/ patch ;)
<asac> and split that up
<asac> e.g. half of the changes where in diff.gz the rest in patches
<seb128> good to some cleaning there
<asac> seb128: do you know if you still use anymetric anywhere?
<seb128> no idea
<asac> from changelog it was just firefox that got patched to show some fonts in similar way as evince
<asac> but i dropped that anymetrics patch quite some time ago ... so i would like to remove that patch from here too
<asac> e.g. the the fontconfig part of it
<asac> but i guess you are the wrong to ask ;)
<seb128> I think it was only firefox
<asac> i think it was ian who did that
<seb128> drop it now and see if anybody complain ;-)
<seb128> yes, ian did that
<asac> yeah. i will drop it once the dust has settled
<asac> dont want to give you another any/all conflict ;)
<seb128> yeah, wait until tomorrow ;-)
<asac> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/23960611/buildlog_ubuntu-jaunty-amd64.gnome-system-monitor_2.26.0.1-0ubuntu1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<asac> doesnt look directly fontconfig related
<seb128> asac: I'm ready to bet it's fontconfig though
<seb128> asac: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/23960698/buildlog_ubuntu-jaunty-amd64.libwnck_2.26.0-0ubuntu1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<seb128> asac: those apt summaries are confusing but it's basically libcairo not installable
<asac> seb128: yes out of sync of libwnck and gtkmm and launchpad-integration? did that fail too?
<seb128> and I guess that's due to fontconfig not being installable
<seb128> asac: yes, I just retried libwnck and gtkmm
<seb128> I will go to bed now and give an another retry round in the morning
<asac> everything is published now i think
<asac> fontconfig wise
<asac> at least amd64 is finally DONE too
<seb128> good, just need for the publisher to finish running then
<asac> good night then
<pitti> Good morning
<pitti> dobey: hey
<pitti> dobey: package  install trigger apt-get update> you can't
<pitti> dobey: why would you want to do that?
<tjaalton> sigh, many gnome packages fail to install atm
<tjaalton> gnome-panel: Depends: gnome-panel-data (< 1:2.26) but 1:2.26.0-0ubuntu1 is to be installed
<tjaalton> wonder why the depends looks like that
<didrocks> morning :)
<pitti> hey didrocks
<didrocks> hey pitti o/
<tjaalton> ok, so there seems to be some problems in amd64
<tjaalton> that's why gnome-panel etc failed to build
<tjaalton> huats: hey, how's the anjuta update doing?-)
<huats> tjaalton: hey
<huats> doing well
<huats> there has been a new upstream yesterday
<huats> with new bdeps
<huats> I am waiting for all of them to be in jaunty (it will be done soon)
<huats> and then I can upload it
<tjaalton> huats: oh great, I didn't see that :)
<tjaalton> ah, so not uploaded yet.. ok
<huats> tjaalton: indeed...
<seb128> hello
 * seb128 yawns
<didrocks> hey seb128 o/
<seb128> hello didrocks
<didrocks> seb128: I think you should take a big cup of coffee :)
<seb128> didrocks: yeah, I just did
<didrocks> seb128: you have some sponsoring stuff to do when you will be really awake :)
<seb128> didrocks: yeah, looking at that now
<didrocks> I'm finishing bug-buddy in the meanwhile. Is murrine a new package?
<seb128> didrocks: no, it's gtk2-engine-murrine
<seb128> didrocks: that the theme engine used by default on ubuntu
<didrocks> didrocks: oh, ok. I'm on it once bug-buddy done :)
 * mvo takes the vte and g-t sponsoring
 * pitti hugs seb128
 * pitti hugs mvo too, Guten Morgen
 * seb128 hugs pitti mvo
<mvo> guten morgen!
 * mvo hugs seb128 and pitti and didrocks
<seb128> mvo: guten tag!
 * didrocks hugs seb128 & mvo (and pitti for the second time of the day ;))
 * seb128 hugs didrocks
<pitti> seb128: taking gimp and gnome-doc-utils
<seb128> pitti: danke
<crevette> good morning
<seb128> lut crevette
<seb128> pitti: did you clean the retracers issues? I don't see any problem right now but got emails from those
<pitti> seb128: yes
<seb128> pitti: ok thanks
 * seb128 hugs pitti
 * pitti hugs back seb128
<pitti> seb128: FYI, I now have all the pieces together -- launchpadlib backports for hardy and intrepid, firewall rules on ronne fixed, launchpadlib branch test suite succeeding
<seb128> excellent
<pitti> seb128: I think I'll do the big switch on Thursday, when we're frozen anyway
<pitti> but I need to switch all retracers at the same time
<seb128> pitti: btw for bzr sponsoring with your workflow, dch -r will change the changelog entry owner to the sponsor is that what you expect?
<pitti> seb128: taking gnome-games
<seb128> pitti: I'm on it
<pitti> seb128: ah, ok
<pitti> seb128: no, I use dch -rm for that
<pitti> -m preserves the maintainer
<seb128> pitti: I've taken gnome-games and vinagre (set those to fix commited)
<seb128> pitti: ok thanks
<pitti> seb128: I think it's more polite to keep the original sponsoree in
<seb128> yeah me too
<pitti> seb128: taking tomboy then
<seb128> I was just wondering since I've not used this workflow before and didrocks did the upgrade this way now
<seb128> pitti: danke
<pitti> seb128: for gnome-doc-tools, I just pulled his branch into the ~ubuntu-desktop one, checked diff, dch -rm, debcommit -r
<seb128> didrocks: you have been added to the ubuntu-desktop team congrats
<seb128> didrocks: you can push directly there now and ask for review ;-)
 * pitti hugs didrocks
 * seb128 hugs didrocks
<seb128> ok
<seb128> I'm looking to notify-osd now
<dobey> pitti: to avoid requiring the user run apt-get update manually. the package installs a gpg key and sources.list for a ppa for example
<seb128> the 0.9.3 broke for quite some users apparently
<pitti> seb128: ugh, how?
<seb128> the binary has been renamed to notify_osd instead of notify-osd or something
<pitti> dobey: I'm afraid packages can't do that
<pitti> dobey: and packages shouldn't ever ship an apt sources.list, too
<dobey> yes, it rather sucks
<dobey> why not?
<pitti> dobey: the intended way is that the user adds an apt source in synaptics and then it'll DTRT
<dobey> sure
<pitti> dobey: how do you use mirrors or CD sources then? this would break for people who are offline, etc.
<dobey> but requiring a user to do all that work, sucks
<dobey> uhm
<dobey> ppas are on cd sources? or mirrored?
<pitti> dobey: mvo also has a rather clever system for simplifying that even more, with a kind of apt:// URL syntax
<dobey> pitti: apt: urls only work if the package is available in a sources list. you can't use apt to install a package in your ppa if the user hasn't added the ppa
<pitti> dobey: I think that's precisely what they are designed for
<pitti> i. e. add an apt source
<pitti> dobey: mvo knows more, though, ICBW
<pitti> good morning sabdfl
<seb128> hello sabdfl
<pitti> ember: sponsoring tomboy... Trying patch debian/patches/01_dllmaps.patch at level 1 ... 0 ... 2 ... failure.
<sabdfl> hey guys. seb, 2.26 seems to have landed very smoothly!
<dobey> i don't see how. apt doesn't know where to find the package until you tell it
<sabdfl> how are you, pitti?
<pitti> sabdfl: pretty good, in the usual beta rush :) how are you?
<sabdfl> all happy in cape town
<pitti> dobey: it's not apt itself, it's a desktop-ish thing
<dobey> pitti: well, it doesnt't really matter. apt:package doesn't work if package isn't already available via apt
<pitti> mvo: ^ halp plz
<pitti> mvo: isn't that the very use case we wanted to add? make it easy to add a new apt source?
<seb128> sabdfl: indeed the day has been long yesterday but we landed almost everything and didn't have a real issue so it's good ;-)
 * mvo keeps forgeting that the vte build takes forever
<seb128> is there any way to push automatically to the vcs url which is used in the control?
 * didrocks hugs seb128 & pitti: thanks a lot both of you :)
<mvo> seb128: like using a checkout ?
<mvo> seb128: hm, brasero conflicts with nautilus-cd-burner now in bzr - is this really needed?
<seb128> mvo: they both provide the nautilus burn: location so you have duplicated buttons in nautilus, duplicated menu items, etc
<pitti> seb128: no automatic one, I'm afraid; however, you should use "bzr info" and take that one, since Vcs-Bzr: usually points to http://
<seb128> mvo: ideally the nautilus .so could be splitted and only this one conflict
<pitti> seb128: for Vcs-Bzr: that makes sense IMO, since it's a clickable link to the browser
<seb128> right
<pitti> seb128: ideally debcheckout -a would automatically set the push address to the pull address
<crevette> salut seb128
<pitti> seb128: I think that's indeed a good idea, annoys me as well; I'll make a TODO item to look into this
<mvo> seb128: if you think the conflict is appropriate I'm fine with it, it seems a bit strong if all that results is a worse UI than before :)
<seb128> mvo: no, I bzr get lp:~didrocks, review and then push to lp:~ubuntu-desktop when uploading
<pitti> ember: ignore me
<seb128> mvo: it's annoying to have to copy the url for that ;-)
<seb128> mvo: worse UI?
<seb128> pitti: thanks
<seb128> lut crevette
<mvo> seb128: I tend to use checkouts with debcommit, that saves me from the push
<crevette> sorry I was away :)
<crevette> pitti, as I know you have bluetooth devices, may I ask if you have time if you can test https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/bluez/+bug/343859 ?
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 343859 in bluez "Sponsor new upstream version (4.33) into Jaunty" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<seb128> mvo: so you checkout twice, the didrocks and ubuntu-desktops one and bzr merge and then push to upload?
<mvo> seb128: worse-ui> if the conflicts is there "just" because if both are installed the buttons are duplicated that seems a bit strong
<seb128> mvo: can we make sure that people upgrading will get nautilus-cd-burner removed? because having duplicated functions is a bit ugly
<pitti> seb128: no need to checkout oboth
<seb128> mvo: right click on an iso or open burn:
<pitti> seb128: debcheckout -a tomboy; bzr pull lp:~didrocks/tomboy/whatever
<mvo> seb128: I have a checkout usually of the ~ubuntu-desktop one, then I do a bzr merge lp:~didrocks/foo/ubuntu; bzr diff and if its good (builds, test ok) I do a debcommit (or debcommit -r). if the ~ubuntu-desktpo branch was a checkout it will push automatically
<seb128> ok, I see
<seb128> thank you guys
<mvo> seb128: aha, I see the problem now
<seb128> I usually bzr get lp:~didrocks
<seb128> review
<seb128> and bzr push lp:~ubuntu-desktop etc
<pitti> seb128: that usually works, too, just feels slightly odd :)
<mvo> can you do bzr diff with that workflow too?
<mvo> funny that three people have three (slightly) different workflows :)
<pitti> sure, bzr diff -c -1
<seb128> mvo: yes,  since he branches from ~ubuntu-desktop to do the update
<pitti> the push will fail if the branches were diverged, so that should be alright
<pitti> if it fails, you need to merge
<pitti> I made a note to fix debcheckout -a
<pitti> to automatically set the push addresss
<pitti> so that you have debcheckout -a tomboy; bzr pull otherbranch; review; dch -rm; debcommit -r; bzr push
<dobey> mvo: so can you elaborate on pitti's claims of apt-url magic?
<mvo> dobey: maybe, what was the claim?
<pitti> mvo: is that new apt-url system meant for adding apt sources, or just installing packages from existing apt sources?
<pitti> mvo: (I thought the former)
<mvo> pitti: the new one can add apt source *if* they come from app-install-data-partner(s)
<mvo> so it can add e.g. the partner repository
<pitti> mvo: ah, that was restricted for security reasons
<mvo> but it can not add anything that is not already whitelisted
<pitti> mvo: so it's not meant to work for PPAs?
<mvo> yes, security and QA
<mvo> it could work for PPAs if we add a explicit whitelist for a specific PPA
<mvo> but it does not right now
<pitti> mvo: I really don't think that packages should ship sources.list files (and try apt-get update in postinst)
<dobey> you can't do apt-get update in postinst anyway
<mvo> pitti: what package is doing that?
<dobey> because the package install already has the lock
<pitti> right, and it's entirely backwards
<mvo> dobey: you could with -o Debug::NoLocking=True, but that would be cheating
<dobey> pitti: but if packages aren't meant to install sources list files, why the hell is there an /etc/apt/sources.list.d/ ? :)
<pitti> dobey: so that programs like synaptics or admins can use it :)
<dobey> bah
<mvo> I agree with pitti, pushing stuff there from a package is not the right thing
<mvo> what use case do you have ?
<pitti> seb128: I'll do the evo-indicator merge request
<dobey> easy setup of ppas, for one
<seb128> pitti: oh, I did the upload
<pitti> oh, ok
<seb128> pitti: I didn't push to bzr for several reasons though
<seb128> 1- I don't understand why we don't have only the packaging there
<pitti> seb128: I just pulled and I have 0.1.10-0ubuntu1 in the branch
<seb128> 2- bzr-buildpackage in the ubuntu checkout doesn't work
<seb128> 3- I don't understand how this launchpad feature works
<seb128> pitti: cf what I just wrote ;-)
<mvo> dobey:  its a tricky trade off, everything can be in a PPA, including stuff that breaks the system in bad ways, if we make it too easy, people will break their system (or worse, install random stuff and break it next time they try to upgrade and blame us)
<pitti> seb128: (1) it's a branch from trunk, so with that we can directly merge fixes and new versions from trunk
<mvo> we had this in the past with external repos, this is why its currently relatively difficult
<dobey> mvo: uhm. if they're looking at something in a ppa, they're going to do that anyway
<pitti> (2) it's not set up for bzr-buildpackage AFAICS (and not really necessary, but I'm fine with having it set up)
<pitti> (3) which LP feature?
<dobey> mvo: and you can already just click on specific .deb packages in a ppa and install them with gdebi
<pitti> seb128: you wrote that you didn't push, but apparently you pushed, but didn't upload or so?
<pitti> seb128: ah, ignore me; I pulled from their PPA branch, not from ubuntu
<pitti> seb128: see https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/evolution-indicator, no upload
<pitti> seb128: (you don't mix this up with indicator-applet, do you?
<seb128> pitti: I do
<seb128> pitti: (2), how do I build from the checkout then?
<seb128> pitti: (3) the merge request page, are we supposed to edit something there?
<pitti> seb128: (2) debuild -S
<pitti> seb128: (2) nothing special really, you "just do"
<pitti> seb128: (3) no need to, if you merge and push, it'll resolve itself (it notices that you did the merge)
<seb128> pitti: debuild -S ... the checkout has autogen.sh and no configure that's not what I want, I used the upstream tarball
<pitti> ah
<seb128> maybe I'm not used to this workflow but I dislike packaging trunk and running autotools in the package build
<pitti> seb128: I think the last time I just unpacked the orig.tar.gz
<seb128> I like better using tarballs
<pitti> seb128: right, I like pre-built autostuff, too
<seb128> right, that's what I did and copied the debian directory over
<seb128> but if that's to do that why not having the debian directory only in bzr?
<pitti> seb128: we can do that (bzr-bd merge mode)
<seb128> I don't really care either way I just don't understand the current way
<seb128> it seems to be
<seb128> bzr get
<seb128> download tarball
<seb128> untar
<seb128> copy debian directory manually
<seb128> build
<seb128> which is not really efficient ;-)
<pitti> seb128: this would work:
<pitti> bzr get
<pitti> download tarball
<pitti> untar into checkout
<pitti> debuild
<pitti> but yeah, it's confusing
<pitti> if we use bd for everythign else, we should use it for this, too
<pitti> seb128: want me to change the branch accordingly?
<pitti> seb128: we'd loose the ability to merge from their packaging branch, but we can ask them to use bd, too
<pitti> or wait, maybe not
<pitti> seb128: I don't see a reason why we can't keep teh branch as it is and just add merging
<seb128> pitti: this package don't change often enough for me to be bothered do whatever is easier for dx and you
<pitti> right
<pitti> seb128: ok, I'll switch it to bd
<seb128> pitti: thanks
<seb128> want me to push my changes there?
<pitti> seb128: what did you change, just pulled the PPA branch?
<seb128> pitti: I added an shlibs update to the rules too
<pitti> sure
 * pitti writes a debian/watch for https://edge.launchpad.net/evolution-indicator/+download
<seb128> mvo: do you need help on the gnome-panel message indicator migration script?
<seb128> mvo: beta freeze is in 2 days ideally that should be landing today or tomorrow
<mvo> seb128: its a bit myserious why its not working currently
<mvo> seb128: if you could test run it and see what it prints in your xsession-errors, that would be cool
<seb128> mvo: does it has any expectation on my user config?
<mvo> seb128: not a lot, it will not add the applet if its already there and it needs a tray applet to find the position to put it onto
<mvo> thats about it
<seb128> mvo:    http://launchpadlibrarian.net/23754128/add-indicator-applet.py
<seb128> mvo: that one worked right now for my ubuntu test user account
<seb128> running python add-indicator-applet.py
<seb128> doh, that's not the current version
 * seb128 retries
<mvo> seb128: the latest is in my ppa
<seb128> mvo: let me try
<mvo> seb128: it seems something is different when run from the session for some reason, the logs from kenvandine_wk indicate it runs, but for some reason stops
<mvo> there is a exception handler in it, that seems to be not kicked too
<seb128> pitti: hum, the new indicator-applet build-depends on gir-repository which is in universe
<asac> hah
<seb128> tedg: ^
<seb128> hey asac
<asac> i saw the merge request yesterday
<asac> hey seb128; how is the catching up going?
<asac> all back in line?
<seb128> asac: yes all is good now thanks again for the quick fixing!
<asac> cool. no problem.
 * asac enjoys getting the first few 2.26 bts
<pitti> seb128: where did you push your evo-indicator changes?
<seb128> pitti:  seb128: (you don't mix this up with indicator-applet, do you?
<seb128> <seb128> pitti: I do
<seb128> pitti: I didn't touch this one, I did change indicator-applet
<pitti> aah
<pitti> seb128: ok, doing e-i now
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> pitti: did you read my gir-repository note?
<pitti> seb128: I did
<pitti> waiting for Ted
<seb128> pitti: the new libindicator didn't build due to that dunno if you need it
<seb128> ok
<asac> gir-repository sounds like something optional imo
<seb128> he added some api that other softwares might require now
<pitti> seb128: ah, perfect; bd merge mode works with such "full upstream source" branches as well
<pitti> seb128: thus we get the bd love and retain the possibility of cherrypicking fixes from trunk and merging with it \o/
<pitti> schweet
<asac> pitti: i did that for the whole nm 0.7 ... but then upstream moved to git and i had to go back to debian/ only
<asac> so full upstream sources has some risk of loosing everything ;)
<pitti> asac: well, hopefully not our upstream in this case :)
<mvo> seb128: hm, looks like I need to update my gnome-panel patch for the new version
<pitti> asac: (DX team)
<asac> heh ;)
<asac> i want git bzr
<asac> when?
<asac> ;)
<asac> oh and don't forget bzr-hg
<pitti> asac: /me 2
<seb128> mvo: the autoadding worked for me right now
<mvo> seb128: hm, cool
<mvo> seb128: with the panel from the ppa?
<seb128> mvo: yes
<seb128> mvo: on a clean config though, will test with my user in a bit
<pitti> seb128: ok, evo-indicator uploaded and pushed; it Just Works[tm] with bzr bd now
<seb128> ie I tried with my test user
<pitti> seb128: want me to fix indicator-applet branch, too?
<mvo> seb128: I uploaded a new 2.26 based one into the ppa (just fyi)
<seb128> pitti: excellent, I'm doing the notify-osd update, MacSlow just rolled a new tarball
<seb128> pitti: yes please
<seb128> mvo: cool thanks
<mvo> so all is ready once we figured out what went wrong on the install from kenvandine_wk - I will ask him for a gconf dump when is is ready again
<seb128> mvo: I had a case where it was placed at the left of the menus, took me a bit to figure that it was there
<mvo> seb128: hm, it should be more careful about this now and not do the update if it gets a "0" position
<seb128> mvo: might have been the .py on the bug which gave me that which was the old version
 * mvo nods
<pitti> seb128: ok, pushed; if you pull, you see that it's UNRELEASED, thus not uploaded yet; thus the next change shouldn't start a new changelog entry
<pitti> doesn't build without gir, though
<asac> pitti: have you tried to remove the gir bits?
<seb128> pitti: ok
<pitti> I don't know at all what that does
<seb128> that does automatically bindings using gobject introspection
<pitti> I think we should wait for tedg here
<asac> pitti: its a repository for introspection wrappers
<asac> probably for python?
<asac> oops
<seb128> notify-osd 0.9.4 is buggy
<lool> it's not yet there for python, it's for js ATM
 * seb128 sponsors bug-buggy
<lool> bug-buggy :)
<asac> lool: js?
<lool> javascript -- I didn't expect to tell that to you   ;-)
<asac> lool: i expanded that ... just wondered who uses dbus bindings with js
<seb128> didrocks: around?
<didrocks> seb128: yes
<seb128> asac: any opinion on whether we should consider webkit 1.1.n for jaunty?
<seb128> didrocks: for bug-buddy there is no need to dfsg the tarball in this new version?
<asac> seb128: do we know how the rdepends will cope with that?
<didrocks> seb128: you pointed a stable released not a vcs one. Or, I misunderstood the dfsg usage?
<asac> seb128: afaik gwibber will break. we should certainly check with upstream for our rdepends first
<seb128> didrocks: you misunderstood, that's debian redoing the tarball without google-breakpad/src/common/convert_UTF.* because of the license
<seb128> asac: no idea about rdepends that's why I ask, debian did upgrade to experimental
<seb128> asac: kov is working on it nowadays, he also did the epiphany-webkit trunk packaging as a new source
<didrocks> seb128: oh, ok. So, we have to take the tarball from another version than the direct upstream tarball
<asac> seb128: kov? glandium gone?
<seb128> didrocks: we have to take the upstream tarball, clean those and repackage
<seb128> didrocks: debian doesn't consider those files a free or there is a license issue to ship those apparently
<seb128> asac: dunno about glandium but kov is focussed on webkit upstream and in debian
<didrocks> seb128: ok, so, I will attach the new orig.tar.gz to the bug once done
<asac> interesting
<seb128> asac: he did the gtk 2.16, libsoup, libproxy, etc updates
<seb128> asac: to be able to package epiphany-webkit trunk
<didrocks> seeing what is possible to do with bzr to take it, if possible
<seb128> asac: he did also update webkit to 1.1
<asac> brave
<seb128> didrocks: ok thanks
<seb128> asac: indeed ;-)
<seb128> asac: rdepends are pretty limited so might want to consider it, though it's not the focuss right now and can wait next cycle
<seb128> asac: we would just be able to ship epiphany-webkit 2.27 in universe if we do the update
<asac> seb128: i will check with gwibber folks. they asked me a few days if we will update
<seb128> ok thanks
<asac> i think the other rdepends is just devhelp
<asac> and midory + kaze
 * mvo reboots
<huats> asac: ask them if they need python-webkit 1.1 or if we can stay to 1.0.2 for jaunty...
<didrocks> seb128: bug-buddy fixed. All packages you listed me yesterday are ready for sponsoring. gtk2-engines-murrine is waiting for jcastro's LP project creation :)
<dobey> pitti: if i want to make changes to python-distutils-extra, what branch should i develop against?
<pitti> dobey: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~python-distutils-extra-hackers/python-distutils-extra/debian ideally
<seb128> didrocks: excellent, want other updates?
<pitti> dobey: once you have fixex, I'm happy to merge them and upload to debian/ubuntu
<pitti> seb128: taking eel2 and gtk2-engines, ok?
<didrocks> seb128: with pleasure :)
<dobey> pitti: is that 'upstream'?
<pitti> dobey: yes; Sebastian Heinlein and I are upstream
<seb128> pitti: gtk2-engines has already been uploaded yesterday that seems uncoordinated update and an invalid request, you can take the other one
<dobey> pitti: ok, just wasn't sure if that or his branch was the upstream branch
<pitti> didrocks: eel2> you didn't push that into the ~ubuntu-desktop branch yet, did you?
 * seb128 looks at bug-buddy again
<didrocks> pitti: no, I wasn't allowed to push it when I did the update
<pitti> didrocks: n/p
<didrocks> pitti: I can push it now if you wish
<pitti> didrocks: don't worry, already pulling; just checking
<didrocks> pitti: oki :)
<seb128> didrocks:
<seb128> http://download.gnome.org/sources/gnome-control-center/2.26/gnome-control-center-2.26.0.tar.gz
<asac> huats: well. they need 1.0.2 ... i was about to ask whether they could make our gwibber move to 1.1 ;)
<huats> :)
<asac> actually asked
<huats> ok
<huats> let me know
<didrocks> seb128: on it :)
<huats> (python-webkit has a new release 1.1 for a few days so if they need it we can update it...)
<dobey> pitti: btw, you might want to bzr upgrade --1.6 to lp:~python-distutils-extra-hackers/python-distutils-extra/debian branch :)
<pitti> dobey: yeah, will do that the next time I touch it
<Nafallo> my window borders are gone :-/
<Nafallo> up to date jaunty
<pitti> dobey: do you happen to know how I can fix the label truncation in http://launchpadlibrarian.net/23910777/gnome-mount-bug-1.png ?
<pitti> dobey: it usually gets wrapped (I did gtk_label_set_line_wrap TRUE)
<pitti> dobey: but this seems to happen for certain specific label lengths
<dobey> pitti: hmm, no. i think it might be a bug in gtk+, perhaps from a patch?
<dobey> i'ved noticed that in intrepid also
<pitti> yeah, I guess it is
<dobey> it happens in the evolution-webcal error dialog
<pitti> dobey: ok, I file that separately then, and create a minimal test case
<dobey> and i spent a lot of time making the evolution-webcal dialogs be super awesome wrt that
<dobey> it could be an upstream change that broke it too
<dobey> wouldn't be the first time upstream gtk+ broke api/abi with my code :-/
<kenvandine_wk> mvo_: i can attach a gconf dump
 * kenvandine_wk applies his morning updates :)
<mvo_> kenvandine_wk: please do thanks
<tjaalton> seb128: I can reproduce bug 224642 on jaunty, and it's driving me nuts :)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 224642 in nautilus "desktop launcher properties window crashes" [Low,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/224642
<tjaalton> seb128: so if you have suggestions how to debug it, I'm all ears
<pitti> seb128: wb
<pitti> seb128: doing MacSlow's notify-osd update now
<pitti> seb128: and I also builddeb-ified the branch
<seb128> pitti: I had it ready but if you want ...
<pitti> seb128: oh, I didn't see updates in the branch, sorry?
<seb128> pitti: or rather I noticed some code issues and they said they would roll a new tarball, they did?
<pitti> seb128: he just told me 30 mins ago
<pitti> seb128: right, 0.9.5
<seb128> ok
<pitti> with the AC_INIT fix
<seb128> I had 0.9.4 ready
<seb128> but go for it
<seb128> it was almost no work
<pitti> okay
<pitti> right
<pitti> bzr merge trunk and changelog mainly
<pitti> and the watch file/.bzr-builddeb
<pitti> seb128: okay, verified that this fixes bug 338837
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 338837 in notify-osd "New notification does not work if icon theme is changed from Human" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/338837
<seb128> pitti: good ;-)
<seb128> pitti: thanks
<pitti> lunch o'clock
<seb128> pitti: enjoy
 * seb128 just back from lunch and wrote activity email
<asac> seb128: nautilus-cd-burner supposed to go away or just transitional?
<seb128> asac: none of those, it's a valid cd burning software just not the default one
<asac> seb128: heh. just wondered because dist-upgrade suggested to remove it now ;)
<asac> i confirmed that
<seb128> asac: right
<asac> good
<asac> byebye
<seb128> asac: that's because brasero and nautilus-cd-burner has the same options
<asac> thats ok. last time i tried i liked brasero
<seb128> asac: ie having both duplicate nautilus menu items etc
<asac> if it has the same nautlius integration now thats good
<kenvandine_wk> seb128: nautilus-cd-burner is on the deprecated list for 2.26
<kenvandine_wk> not sure if it will still be maintained :)
<seb128> bastien seems to not be 100% happy with brasero yet
<seb128> but I'm not sure if he will keep working in n-c-b or just push them to fix issues
<mvo_> kenvandine_wk: did you attach the gconf dump yet?
<mvo_> kenvandine_wk: I pushed a new version, but the changes are just cosmetic (deal with tray applet in right_stick mode)
<kenvandine_wk> no, my box has been busy updating
<kenvandine_wk> should in just a few minutes
<tedg> seb128: pitti: I think the gir bits could be dropped -- there's nothing really using them right now.
<tedg> It's kinda sad really, I thought that was more mature than it really is.
<kenvandine_wk> tedg: are the python  bindings packaged?
 * mvo_ keeps wondering why we removed the logout action from the system menu
<seb128> mvo_: because fusa is the true way ;-)
<tedg> kenvandine_wk: No, it's on the todo list.  I haven't asked eeejay what state they're in recently.
<tedg> mvo_: Basically so there isn't two ways to logout.  If FUSA isn't the answer, then we simply shouldn't have it there.
<kenvandine_wk> tedg: cool, segphault said he is impressed with it :)
<kenvandine_wk> but said the bindings aren't fully functional yet
<mvo_> tedg: its just that it break my old habit to logout using the system menu, I have that habit since the dawn of time
<mvo_> seb128: right, I know that :)
<kenvandine_wk> mvo_: change is good, mkay
<kenvandine_wk> :)
 * tedg imagines mvo_ coming out of the womb and shutting down the computer in the hospital using the system menu :)
<seb128> mvo_: remove fusa ;-)
<kenvandine_wk> our vanilla session should really have the default menus and no fusa, imho
<tedg> kenvandine_wk: Yeah, he sent me a screenshot of it working though, which was pretty cool.
<mvo_> its fun when switching between intrepid and jaunty where its on a different location. or explaning it to my e.g. my parents
 * kenvandine_wk is anxious to use it :)
<kenvandine_wk> tedg: i can package it, when they are ready
 * mvo_ looks up what "womb" means
<kenvandine_wk> mvo_: i am building something in kvm... and i have to shutdown kvm to run virtualbox and get that gconf dump
<kenvandine_wk> multiple virtualization technology fail :)
 * mvo_ shuts up and goes back to sponsoring
<mvo_> kenvandine_wk: no problem
<tedg> kenvandine_wk: That'd be great, talk with eeejay, but I think it's in a good enough place to start putting something together.
<kenvandine_wk> ok
<tedg> mvo_: On the plus side, we don't plan on moving it again :)
<kenvandine_wk> tedg: yet :)
<kenvandine_wk> eeejay: is the indicator bindings ready to be packaged?
<tedg> kenvandine_wk: It would be nice if the vanilla gnome could use the default panel.  Not sure how to do that though.  The panel config is so fubar.
<MacSlow> mvo_, just looked at the latest compiz-fusion-plugins-main
<kenvandine_wk> tedg: yeah, we would need to have a separate set of menus as well as vanilla gconf
<mvo_> MacSlow: and its not there?
<MacSlow> mvo_, /usr/share/compiz/animation.xml seems to be ok
<MacSlow> mvo_, I wonder what people did report in bug https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/notify-osd/+bug/331564
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 331564 in compiz "sometimes notification flickers when fading in" [High,New]
<kenvandine_wk> tedg: but i have a hard time calling it a vanilla session as it is now :)
<seb128> kenvandine_wk: new ekiga available if you still work on it
<kenvandine_wk> seb128: yes... i started porting the patches last night
<mvo_> MacSlow: I just checked the source, it should be there (the animation one), I double check if the one from compiz is also there, maybe they disabled animation or something?
<kenvandine_wk> so will move to 3.2
<kenvandine_wk> :)
<tedg> kenvandine_wk: That's why it's Italian-vanilla-gnome ;)
<kenvandine_wk> hehe
<kenvandine_wk> better vanilla i guess :)
<mvo_> MacSlow: I will ask in the bugreport for a gconf dump
<MacSlow> mvo_, if the animation plugin would be disabled it would not introduce any issue there. One remaining bit to check is if the fade-plugin is enabled by default
<MacSlow> mvo_, although that's not what our defaults look like
<seb128> good
<mvo_> MacSlow: I commented in the report
<mvo_> MacSlow: I can not reporduce it here, no matter what (with animation, without, with fade, without)
<MacSlow> mvo_, yeah ... there are exception rules for "title=notify-osd" in place for both so I don't know what people are running in there mentioned in the bug report
<mvo_> MacSlow: lets wait for the gconf dump
<MacSlow> mvo_, I'll commented a bit more on https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/notify-osd/+bug/331564 so NicolÃ² can better tell us what's his/her system-settings look like
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 331564 in compiz "sometimes notification flickers when fading in" [High,New]
<didrocks> seb128: g-c-c is ready but there is two missing dependencies (libgnome-window-seetings1 and capplets-data)
<seb128> didrocks: missing dependencies? those a g-c-c binaries ...
<didrocks> seb128: oupss, should review my dpkg -i, sorry ;)
<mvo_> MacSlow: the fade plugin has also a hardcoded rule !type=desktop - does notify-osd set this one?
<mvo_> MacSlow: we do enable fade by default, its used for some stuff, but animation disables (parts) of it
<MacSlow> mvo_, no that rule does not apply to notify-osd
<MacSlow> mvo_, to make sure the fade-plugin leaves notify-osd's windows alone, we just need to add the rule we added to animation to fade
<MacSlow> mvo_, I can make a patch for that and send you the file
<MacSlow> hey bothorsen
<mvo_> MacSlow: I'm on a call right now, I do it afterwards
<MacSlow> mvo_, ok np
<bothorsen> MacSlow: hey
<didrocks> seb128: g-c-c and gtk2-engine-murrine done
<seb128> didrocks: you rock ;-)
 * didrocks hugs seb128 :-)
 * seb128 hugs didrocks
<seb128> pitti: do you know where to reassign bug #342013?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 342013 in gnome-desktop "gnome keyboard shortcuts doesn't workd" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/342013
<kenvandine_wk> mvo_: gconf dump attached
<seb128> didrocks: want some other updates?
<didrocks> seb128: of course :)
<didrocks> (I am catching up my mails)
<seb128> didrocks: http://download.gnome.org/sources/gnome-themes/2.26/gnome-themes-2.26.0.tar.gz
<seb128> didrocks: http://download.gnome.org/sources/gnome-backgrounds/2.24/gnome-backgrounds-2.24.1.tar.gz ... that one is universe so you can directly upload ;-)
<ember> seb128 i can do some updates if you want
<seb128> ember: thanks for those were the 2 remaining which just arrived everything else is assigned or waiting for debian right now
<ember> ok.
<pitti> tedg: do you want to revert the git bits upstream or shall we do that in the ubuntu branch?
<tedg> pitti: ?  I'm not sure what you're asking.
<pitti> tedg: s/git/gir/, sorry
<tedg> pitti: I think do them in the Ubuntu branch.  It should be an easy thing to do.  Are you just not going to package them, or not build them too?
<pitti> tedg: we can't build them without the gir build dependency
<pitti> that's in fact the entire problem
<tedg> pitti: Oh, and what's the problem with the build dependency?  Is it not in main?
<pitti> tedg: right
<tedg> pitti: Hmm, okay, I'll fix it upstream then.  The autotools patches are too evil :)
<pitti> tedg: appreciated, thanks
<tedg> I'll see if I can't detect and make it gracefully not build.
<pitti> tedg: a configure-time check would be ideal, indeed
<pitti> seb128: 342013> handled
<seb128> pitti: thanks!
<mvo_> kenvandine_wk: if you have a snapshot of the machine, I put another gnome-panel up
<mvo_> kenvandine_wk: https://edge.launchpad.net/~mvo/+archive/ppa?field.name_filter=gnome-panel&field.status_filter=published&field.series_filter=any
<mvo_> kenvandine_wk: it deals with more configurations, maybe you can even attahc a strace to the running python process? so that we get if anything unusual happens?
<kenvandine_wk> sure
<didrocks> seb128: gnome-themes bzr branch does not use bzr merge mode, do I create a new banch and remove this one?
<seb128> didrocks: overwrite the current one
<didrocks> seb128: sorry, there is nothing in common with this branch and the packages, strange :/
<seb128> didrocks: we did push some things to bzr over a year ago as an experiment
<seb128> didrocks: that failed and we didn't use bzr
<seb128> didrocks: but the bzr stayed there
<seb128> maybe that's one of those
<seb128> just overwritte it if that's the case ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: oki, noted :)
<seb128> you can bzr push --overwritte I think
<seb128> overwrite
<seb128> brb
<ember> mvo_ thanks for vte
<kenvandine_wk> mvo_: ok... it worked this time
<kenvandine_wk> mvo_: why does it keep sleeping after the applet was added?
<mvo_> kenvandine_wk: it worked? excellent .)
<mvo_> kenvandine_wk: hm, but it did not stop? its still running?
<mvo_> kenvandine_wk: can I see your .xsession-errors file please?
<kenvandine_wk> counted to 89
<kenvandine_wk> sure
<mvo_> kenvandine_wk: if you have a snpashot of the machine state, could you run it 2-3 times just to be sure that there is no race or other craziness left please?
<mvo_> ember: thanks for doing it in the first place :)
<kenvandine_wk> mvo_: i attached the latest .xsession_errors to the bug
<kenvandine_wk> i will do it several times, yeah
<kenvandine_wk> i started tailing the .xsession-errors after i saw the applet appear, and it was at sleep 13
<kenvandine_wk> so it was added before that
<kenvandine_wk> mvo_: damn... with another test user account, it didn't fire at all again
<mvo_> kenvandine_wk: what does gconftool -g /apps/panel/need_add_indicator_applet print for that user?
<kenvandine_wk> mvo_: ok, i reverted my snapshot and it is still failing
<kenvandine_wk> i have some strace out put
<kenvandine_wk> but i don't think it is very revealing
<kenvandine_wk> after it finishes sleeping, /apps/panel/need_add_indicator_applet print is false
<mvo_> hm, that explains why its not run (it only runs when that is true). but that is not a lot of explaination :)
<kenvandine_wk> ok, i have a test user account that doesn't have that set prior to logging in
<kenvandine_wk> let me test with that one again
<kenvandine_wk> ok, sleeping
<kenvandine_wk> confirmed it isn't set while it is sleeping
 * kenvandine_wk waits for it
<kenvandine_wk> mvo_: ok, it is done sleeping and that key isn't set still
<kenvandine_wk> and it didn't get added
<kenvandine_wk> what info would be useful?
<mvo_> kenvandine_wk: anything in strace that gives me a hint wth its doing when its finished couting :)
<mvo_> kenvandine_wk: that is so odd, it should print something or fail with a exception or something, but just stoping silently is so strange
<kenvandine_wk> damn... so after logging out and back in, that key is set
<seb128> how do you run it?
<kenvandine_wk> to false
<kenvandine_wk> mvo_: i am going to eat before our meeting, will revert and capture the strace after
<kenvandine_wk> seb128: xdg/autostart
<mvo_> kenvandine_wk: thanks, sorry that its such a hassle
<kenvandine_wk> if i run the script by hand it works reliably
<seb128> ok so that's the current user
<seb128> weird
<kenvandine_wk> mvo_: no worries... just want it to work :)
<kenvandine_wk> mvo_: oh scratch that... now it doesn't run manually
<kenvandine_wk> it just sleeps
<kenvandine_wk> this will make it easier to debug :)
<kenvandine_wk> bbiab... gotta eat
<didrocks> seb128: do I push gnome-backgrounds in ~ubuntu-desktop too?
<seb128> didrocks: no, just upload, I think we will sync with debian when they update, no reason to have ubuntu diff there
<didrocks> seb128: ok. I was wondering because we didn't sync to debian during the intrepid cycle, but probably because of debian freezeâ¦
<seb128> didrocks: dunno what they did, maybe it's just that nobody watched their updates and ask for a sync
<didrocks> seb128: oki
<didrocks> seb128: I'm done with the updates, going for a walk, but you can still give me some updates and I will takle them this evening :)
<seb128> didrocks: ok, we are good right now, I would like to wait on debian for quite some things where there is no hurry and we are on sync right now (ie all the remaining *mm for example)
<seb128> didrocks: enjoy your walk
<didrocks> seb128: thanks a lot, enjoy testing :)
<ember> seb128 mind if i do sj (universe) ?
<seb128> ember: you can do it
<seb128> ember: you can also do gnome-system-tools if you want
<asac> is meeting in 30 min?
<pitti> asac: yes
<seb128> asac: correct
<ember> seb128 cool, i will have a look
<seb128> thanks
<kenvandine_wk> mvo_: i attached a patch to the issue
<kenvandine_wk> it was a typo :)
<seb128> kenvandine_wk: good work ;-)
<kenvandine_wk> no idea why the traceback wasn't making it to .xsession-errors
<mvo_> kenvandine_wk: gar
<mvo_> kenvandine_wk: thanks
<mvo_> kenvandine_wk: i was suspecting something like this, but then I even added a exception handler to be sure any errors make it to the console
<kenvandine_wk> mvo_: i just assumed anything like this would have made it to the log
<mvo_> yeah, strange, strange
 * mvo_ scratches head a bit more
<kenvandine_wk> i just tested several scenarios, all good
<mvo_> ok, cool
<kenvandine_wk> i will revert my snapshot and try again when you have a new build in your ppa... to be sure :)
<mvo_> I will do a final test with the fix and upload afterwards
<mvo_> aha, ok
<mvo_> makes sense to have one more ppa version I think, I will remove a lot of the verbosity as well
<kenvandine_wk> i also tested without a notification area
<mvo_> it should do nothing in this case (only print a error to the logs)
<kenvandine_wk> yeah
<rickspencer3> desktop team meeting in 3 minutes
<pitti> hey
 * pedro_ waves
 * kenvandine_wk is here
<rickspencer3> pedro_: hi!
<ArneGoetje> Hi all!
<asac> hi
<rickspencer3> good evening ArneGoetje
<pitti> what a refreshing discussion about units..
<seb128> hello
<bryce> heya
<rickspencer3> I think we have a quorum
<rickspencer3> seele: welcome!!
 * seele gasps
<rickspencer3> how about calc
<seele> rickspencer3: hello
<rickspencer3> okay, let's go
 * asac opens wiki page
<rickspencer3> Outstanding actions from last meeting:
<rickspencer3> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xkeyboard-config/+bug/67188
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 67188 in mactel-support ""Error activating XKB configuration." - Requires manual xorg.conf editing" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<rickspencer3> seemed like an important bug, but also really a collection of other bugs, so I unassigned it based on discussions with bryce
<rickspencer3> ACTION: calc and pitti to discuss https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/bugs/305790 - getting certain java based build depends for OO to build in the build daemons.
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 305790 in suitesparse "MIR - move to main for openoffice.org 3 build-depends" [Undecided,Fix released]
<pitti> I had a go on those, see my activity report
<rickspencer3> it looks like there was some significant pain associated with that
<rickspencer3> yes, also see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/ReleaseStatus
<pitti> I wasted some 3 hours and finally succeeded to build it with openjdk
<pitti> but it breaks the test suite
<rickspencer3> :(
<asac> that bug is quite length i lost track what is left
<pitti> I quickly consulted with doko
<asac> could we update the summary to show what is really the problem?
<pitti> and we agreed to just leave it getting built with gcj for now
<pitti> asac: jaxme and xom don't build with openjdk, just with gcj
<asac> hmm. ok
<rickspencer3> pitti: that should suffice for Karmic, right? Even if we need to rebuild for some reason?
<pitti> rickspencer3: for jaunty anyway, yes
<pitti> eventually we might want to get rid of gcj
<rickspencer3> I meant Jaunty, sorry
<pitti> but not in jaunty
<rickspencer3> ok
<pitti> rickspencer3: yes, I confirmed that both build fine with gcj
<pitti> calc worked on xom
<rickspencer3> so that should help in our bug conversation in a few minutes
<pitti> and determined that the failure on i386 is a bug in openjdk
<pitti> builds fine on amd64
<pitti> he reported it
<rickspencer3> interesting
<rickspencer3> last action from last week: ACTION: everyone hasn't already to submit a topic by eow (mandated by rickspencer3  )
<rickspencer3> I will assume that everyone did this, if not, please let me know and I'll see if I can slide you in
<rickspencer3> topic was for all hands, btw
<seb128> urg
<seb128> I didn't, what should we hand those?
 * seb128 has been swamped in GNOME 2.26
<rickspencer3> seb128: understood
<rickspencer3> I'll talk to silbs and see what we can work out
<pitti> seb128: great job with 2.26! *hug*
 * seb128 hugs pitti
<rickspencer3> seb128: no worries
<rickspencer3> moving on ...
<rickspencer3> UDS sponsorship: send rickspencer3 an email if there is someone that you feel is important to sponsor
<rickspencer3> I've already discussed this with seb128 and bryce
<asac> didnt get a mail
<rickspencer3> let's not go over that again
<rickspencer3> :)
<kenvandine_wk> hehe
<rickspencer3> I'm just saying, that I can advocate for sponsorship, so if there is someone that you think we should sponsor, send me an email by, say, end of day tomorrow
<pitti> breaking news, xom is fixed with openjdk, thanks to doko
<rickspencer3> nice!
 * calc is here btw :)
<rickspencer3> moving on to release status ...
<rickspencer3> bugs
<rickspencer3> bugs
<bratsche> eeejay: Hey, are you doing something already with kerneloops regarding the <a href...></a> stuff?
<rickspencer3> great job on the work items for Jaunty!
<pitti> rickspencer3: I have some things, when you are done with bugs
<rickspencer3> pitti: do you want to go now?
<pitti> sure
 * rickspencer3 hands mike to pitti
<pitti> so, intrusive changes
<pitti> new themes are in now, done
<pitti> asac: what's the latest word on the firefox start page patch?
<asac> pitti: the newtab page you mean?
<pitti> bryce: do you still consider updating to the new intel driver, or will we settle on the current version and backport?
<pitti> asac: yes
<asac> pitti: decision still pending. i think its getting less likely every day
<bryce> pitti: still considering
<pitti> bryce: we should get that in before beta IMHO (or not at all)
<bryce> pitti: right now it depends on a kernel change, but I talked with upstream and may be able to work around that in the driver
<pitti> bryce: is there a PPA or something we should test?
<bryce> pitti: without the fix, it doesn't build
<pitti> asac: understood; it's not the end of the world if it slips to Karmic, right?
<bryce> pitti: hopefully should have something in today
<pitti> bryce: ok, so it's still on the table
<asac> pitti: personally, i dont need it
<pitti> thanks for the heads-up
<asac> there are other forces ;)
<pitti> asac: heh :)
<pitti> and finally, new on the list, change of the default font size again
<asac> but i hope we have that under control now
<pitti> that's another change I'd call "intrusive" and needs lots of feedback
<asac> (newtab forces)
<pitti> and it should really land in beta
<seb128> pitti: right, let's do that before beta
<asac> we should get the fontsize change up well before beta and the GUI fix at best before
<pitti> from my perspective it seems that discussion is pretty much done on that?
<seb128> it's easy enough to roll to what we had if needed
<asac> but the defaultis most important
<pitti> or are there outstanding things which need input/discussion?
<asac> pitti: the default is agreed. the UI thing not so. seems to be in gtk, but i have to read more code to say how to fix the units there
<pitti> asac: so you think we shouldn't ship 13.33px and leave the UI in pt?
<asac> pitti: i think we should do both. just that we should get the default in now, as the UI will take a few days
<pitti> asac: agreed
<asac> hopefully we can fix the UI before beta too.
<asac> but i havent really found the right place yet so i cannot tell
<pitti> is someone working on that already?
<pitti> is there an LP # for this?
<asac> i started on it. if someone else wants to fix gtk i would be happy to delegate that
<seb128> please don't put a float number in the UI ;-)
<asac> pitti: no. not yet
<seb128> or at least .5 ;-)
<eeejay> hey bratsche, nope i am going to get to it this week though
<pitti> asac: "gtk" is gnome-appearance-properties"?
<pitti> rickspencer3: over to you
<asac> pitti: well. its done in the gtkfontselector i think
<asac> pitti: thats gtk
<bratsche> eeejay: Okay.. I might end up taking it from you.  I'll let you know.
<pitti> I see
<rickspencer3> can someone please either get the bug # or create a bug for that?
<asac> pitti: but i didnt find how the available size choices are assembled there
<eeejay> bratsche: no problem
<seb128> right, the font picker is a gtk widget
<eeejay> bratsche: i'll ping you before i start
<bratsche> Cool, sounds good.  Thanks.
<seb128> asac: I guess it's using pango or fontconfig to get the list...
<asac> seb128: another option would be to keep the fontselector using pt ... jus that those are no real "pt"s, but rather pts for 96 dpi (e.g. 10 will always be 13.333px in the back)
<davmor2> bryce: just to let you know I've just done an Oem install of Kubuntu and it's worked fine :)
<asac> seb128: a bit hard to not get round issues when calculating current value
<pitti> asac: according to our discussion, nobody really knows what those units mean anyway, after all
<pitti> if you fiddle with the size, you just set a number that looks good, and be done with it
<bryce> davmor2: excellent thanks; if that's in ref to a bug, please comment there (and close the bug if you filed it originally)
<asac> pitti: yeah. i think we can keep the current numbers there
<rickspencer3> where did this whole thing come from?
<pitti> a "pt for 96dpi" is utter bogus anyway, that's a pixel
<asac> pitti: just have to find a sensible way back without rounding issues.
<davmor2> bryce: np's
<bryce> rickspencer3: fallout from switching from 96 dpi override to "true dpi"
<asac> pitti: "pt for 72 dpi" is a pixel ;) (me shuts up)
<seb128> rickspencer3: feedback from the "let's use the detected dpi value and no 96 dpi"
<pitti> asac: ah, you are saying that if we configure 13.333px by default, the font selector won't show "10", but somethign ugly?
<rickspencer3> I think we should move this discussion to a lp bug asap
<seb128> rickspencer3: bug #310353
<asac> pitti: i want it to display 10
<ubottu> Error: Could not parse data returned by Launchpad: timed out (https://launchpad.net/bugs/310353/+text)
<pitti> asac: right, that would be nice
<seb128> rickspencer3: bug #310353
<asac> pitti: just a bit scared about rounding. but thats experimenting
<pitti> asac: on a 96dpi, anyway
 * seb128 kicks the bot or launchpad
<ubottu> Error: Could not parse data returned by Launchpad: timed out (https://launchpad.net/bugs/310353/+text)
<asac> pitti: yes. 10 just means "this is 10pt converted to pixel on a 96 dpi" ;)
<rickspencer3> the bug is set to wishlist
<calc> hmm shouldn't a pt be 1/72 of an inch?
<rickspencer3> why would we be working on it two days before beta lock down?
<calc> and if its not its a bug? :)
<pitti> oh no not again :)
<pitti> calc: cf half an hour in #distro
 * calc looks over there after meeting
<asac> rickspencer3: its an annoying issue. that if we can fix it would make jaunty better
<asac> rickspencer3: also non standard dpi screens become more and more common
<pitti> calc: it's an inverse subspace relative megasubpixel
<rickspencer3> we need to ensure that we are using our diminishing time on the most important things, and if it's marked as "wishlist" it suggests there are more important things to work on
 * kenvandine_wk thinks the font change is important
<seb128> rickspencer3: wishlist might not be an adapted setting there
<calc> hmm if pt doesn't work at all then i don't see the point in using real dpi to begin with (but will discuss that later)
<seb128> rickspencer3: there is case where GNOME is not usable apparently on notebooks due to that
<asac> rickspencer3: we can flip it to "high" ;)
<pitti> ok, let's move discussion to the bug
<rickspencer3> may I suggest that we set the important appropriately, and also assign it to the person who is going to fix it
<seb128> rickspencer3: that has just been rasied as a concern recently though
<seb128> rickspencer3: good idea
<pitti> it's a regression compared to intrepid
<seb128> asac: you? ;-)
<rickspencer3> then discuss the value and options in the bug itself?>
<asac> seb128: yes. do that for now. if i dont figure the font picker interactino i will ask for help though
<rickspencer3> moving on, there are a few other bugs that are supposed to be fixed by beta
<pitti> marked for jaunty beta
<rickspencer3> bug #278095
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 278095 in at-spi "MASTER crash in getenv() ... spi_atk_bridge_exit_func()" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/278095
<asac> rickspencer3: not sure why luke hasnt uploaded my fix
<asac> its handed over to him for sure
<asac> pinging him on -devel now
<rickspencer3> ok
<rickspencer3> bug #340777
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 340777 in gnome-panel "Panel should add the messaging indicator for users upgrading" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/340777
<seb128> mvo and kenvandine_wk were still debugging that today
<seb128> kenvandine_wk found an issue in the script
<seb128> if next testing round is ok we will upload tomorrow I guess
<rickspencer3> stupid testing ;)
<rickspencer3> ok, so on track, but risky
<kenvandine_wk> rickspencer3: i think it is good to go... but needs another test from a real build
<rickspencer3> not risky, really
<seb128> if that's before beta I think we are fine, it's only the applets layout
<rickspencer3> kenvandine_wk: ack
<rickspencer3> bug #337869
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 337869 in jaxme "jaxme does not build with openjdk-6" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/337869
<rickspencer3> we just discussed
<rickspencer3> and the related bug #305790
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 305790 in suitesparse "MIR - move to main for openoffice.org 3 build-depends" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/305790
<rickspencer3> as well
<pitti> rickspencer3: I think that was really for xom, not suitesparse
<pitti> and xom is fixed now
<rickspencer3> pitti: ok
<rickspencer3> It seems like we can move one to "fixed" and the other, just move it out of jaunty altogether
 * calc is on phone with doctor
<rickspencer3> Riddell has a couple of medium bugs, but he's in the Kubuntu meeting
<rickspencer3> moving on to work items ...
<rickspencer3> The only one to discuss is asac:Adobe Flash in partner repository with apturl:started
 * calc back
<rickspencer3> asac: mvo_ what's the status of this? Anything we need to know for beta?
<rickspencer3> while we're waiting for that compute ...
<asac> rickspencer3: no progress last week. me and mvo_ should find the time
<asac> asap
<asac> mvo_: ^^^
<asac> mvo_: tomorrows?
<rickspencer3> ok
<rickspencer3> moving on ...
<seb128> poor mvo
 * seb128 hugs mvo_
<rickspencer3> asac: are the new NM icons in Jaunty, ready for beta?
<seb128> everybody needs him to get things done before beta ;-)
<rickspencer3> are there any other items that anyone wants to bring up regarding getting ready for beta?
<pitti> any news wrt. new usplash theme?
<rickspencer3> Any dependencies on other teams that we should follow up on, etc... ?
<pitti> or desktop background?
<pitti> Ken said he'll be working on a new usplash theme, if we get it, but I don't know bout desktop background
<seb128> is every settled for the message indicator now?
<mvo_> asac, rickspencer3: sorry for the delay. asac and I can work on it tomorrow
<seb128> ie pidgin correctly configured by default?
<kenvandine_wk> seb128: not yet
<pitti> new indicator-applet doesn't build yet
<asac> rickspencer3: i think the icons are ready in general. some notifications might not match the spec 100%, but we will be close
<kenvandine_wk> i think we are still waiting for clarification on what should happen
<rickspencer3> pitti: I think kwwii has them close to done, and will get what he has into the beta, but they may change
<pitti> it needs to get the gnome-introspection bits removed
<seb128> pitti: build-dep on the gir thing
<rickspencer3> asac: ack, thanks
<pitti> seb128: it's not just the build dep, it needs code and autofoo changes
<seb128> urg, ok
<pitti> I'll take that up with tedg
<seb128> thanks
<rickspencer3> oookay
<seb128> are we ready otherwise for notifications? notify-osd still seems to have quite some issues and some applications are not patched yet
<rickspencer3> sounds like the MI and configuration of related apps may need some loving attention
<seb128> I would say all the dxteam stack need some consolidation work
<rickspencer3> seb128: I think they are focused on fixing crashing bugs, and getting pidgin and evo working properly with the MI for beta
<seb128> notify-osd was breaking for quite some user until today, I pushed to get an updated version today but nobody is really reactive on those bugs
<seb128> we got the updated version
<kenvandine_wk> there are a few crashers they are still working on
<seb128> (the wording was not clear)
<seb128> right
<seb128> I'm rather concerned about having lot of users saying that synchronous notifications are broken for them
<seb128> or they don't get volume indicators
<rickspencer3> seb128: are there bugs for those issues?
<seb128> or no rhythmbox artwork
<seb128> rickspencer3: yes, I know about the issue because I subscribed to the notify-osd bugs and see the comments
<kenvandine_wk> rickspencer3: there are
<seb128> I've not really investigated though
<seb128> but that doesn't give me a lot of confidence on the robustness
<seb128> I think we lag behind in testing and quality work there ... we still have time after beta for that though
<rickspencer3> seb128: yes
<kenvandine_wk> we need more people using it :)
<rickspencer3> and we may have to rally some troops to help
<seb128> right, just raising the issue early
<rickspencer3> in the meantime, davidbarth is well aware of the bugs and is focused on fixing them asap
<seb128> good
<rickspencer3> I'm confident that we will be able to help them bring those features together and really have a great system in Karmic
<rickspencer3> I think if anyone sees a worrisome bug, and is concerned that it is not getting the attention it needs, to raise the issue with me and/or davidbarth immediately
<seb128> right, my comment is rather a call for community help to test everything and make sure we triage bugs correctly and have things under control
<rickspencer3> seb128: yes
<rickspencer3> but maybe we should err on the side of raising concerned instead of waiting, as time is of the essence
<rickspencer3> otherwise ...
<rickspencer3> any other business?
<bryce> looks like we'll have -fglrx for beta
<rickspencer3> nice
<kenvandine_wk> oh?
<kenvandine_wk> awesome
<bryce> also -ati is going to be updated with 6xx/7xx support for 2D (EXA/Xv) acceleration later today.
<bryce> so ATI is in wonderful shape right now
<bryce> -intel not as much, but I have some ideas of improvements...
<asac> ATI Technologies Inc R580 ... still no compiz ;)
<pitti> bryce: pour some magic sauce into it?
<bryce> where magic sauce == kludges ;-)
<bryce> rickspencer3: over.
<rickspencer3> ok
<rickspencer3> any other business?
<rickspencer3> meeting adjourned?
<pitti> thanks everyone
<bryce> thanks
<seb128> thanks
<pitti> let's get a great beta out
<rickspencer3> thanks all
<calc> thanks
<rickspencer3> beta beta beta
<pitti> I still have the feeling that it's going to be a good one
 * kenvandine_wk does too
<bryce> pitti: I've been hearing happy anecdotal reports from people, who are finding it much more solid than Intrepi
<seb128> yeah, I think jaunty is solid and will be one of the best ubuntu version we rolled until now
<bryce> +d
<seb128> if not the best one
<pitti> now, if only suspend would work, it'd be perfect :)
 * asac reminds himself to run alpha6 suspend tests
<pitti> well, it's the x.org hang that spoils it, the test suite runs fine for me
<asac> hmm
<asac> for me things improved when i moved by from UXA to EXA for X
<pitti> no answer from upstream about that, though
<asac> but thats probably not your issue
<pitti> I'm not running UXA
<pitti> although, with the recent compiz fix, I should try it again
<kenvandine_wk> pitti: UXA is what makes compiz usable for me :)
<pitti> hm, works just fine on GMA945 for me
<kenvandine_wk> mine's a 965
<kenvandine_wk> horribly slow without UXA
<bryce> the UXA benefits/problems are not chipset specific
<bryce> near as I can tell anyway
<bryce> well, not chipset _family_ anyway
<calc> OOo hopefully will be much improved for people saving to remote filesystems as well :)
<seb128> exa and compiz is just fine on my dell630 intel 965
<pitti> calc: it's also the first time we ship 3.0; that got good grades in reviews
<calc> i only know of one real bug still and its wrt saving on webdav, the ftp issue was a pureftpd bug
<pitti> rickspencer3: 9.10 roadmap call now, right?
<rickspencer3> pitti: yes
 * didrocks back on the field, if needed :)
<seb128> didrocks: how was your walk?
<didrocks> seb128: great, thanks! It's good something to breathing some fresh air in the mountains ;)
<didrocks> s/something/sometimes
<seb128> didrocks: you live in the mountains?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks - i would love some fresh air ;)
<didrocks> seb128: my parents, yes, near Annecy. I live in Paris for work :/
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: where do you live? ;)
<seb128> didrocks: ah ok, that's what I though for Paris, I didn't get that you were not at your place today
<chrisccoulson> birmingham, uk
<chrisccoulson> there's no fresh air here
<didrocks> seb128: yes live near Metz, don't you?
<seb128> didrocks: yes
<didrocks> seb128: vacation IS vacation :p
<seb128> ;-)
<Laney> mmm birmingham
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: yeah, I can imagine :/
<chrisccoulson> i only live here because i work here
<seb128> didrocks: you can have a look to http://download.gnome.org/sources/gnome-web-photo/0.6/gnome-web-photo-0.6.tar.gz if you want since that's universe
<seb128> didrocks: but if you prefer to do something else just relax we are done with most of the updates
<didrocks> seb128: don't know this software, I will have a look :)
<seb128> didrocks: otherwise there is some desktopish universe updates in the sponsoring queue if you want to help motu there and use your uploads rights ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: I have already planned to tackle some tomorrow :)
<didrocks> (and I have to update my book in parallel ;))
<seb128> didrocks: ok, that's enough for you then, goof work ;-)
<seb128> good
<didrocks> seb128: thanks, sorry for not having been there from the beginning, but the schedule was not good. Next time!
<seb128> didrocks: that's ok you did your share ;-)
<didrocks> ^^
<seb128> didrocks: do you know how huats is doing btw?
<seb128> chrisccoulson: hey, not sure if I already asked yesterday but do you want to do the gnome-session update?
<didrocks> seb128: very busy with his company creation, lots of paper to do and so onâ¦
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i can do that
<seb128> chrisccoulson: thanks
<didrocks> seb128: but he seems fine :)
<seb128> chrisccoulson: not sure if vuntz commited the code for session storing (it's not active for sure) but there is an update patch otherwise on the GNOME bug
<seb128> didrocks: ok good
<seb128> chrisccoulson: would be nice to update the patch if it's not in the tarball ifdef-ed #0
<chrisccoulson> i'll take a look at that
<seb128> thanks
<chrisccoulson> i saw the discussions yesterday about session saving behaving differently between shutdown and logout
<chrisccoulson> what happened with that in the end?
<seb128> vuntz said he would fix it but I don't think it's done yet
<chrisccoulson> ah, ok
<chrisccoulson> i was going to say that if it gets fixed, it would be nice to make the session saving work with the FUSA too
<seb128> it does
<seb128> no?.
<seb128> I think I tried logout from fusa too and it worked
<chrisccoulson> it does for logout, but not for shutdown/reboot
<seb128> right, neither does gnome-session
<seb128> that's just that the codepath is different for those actions and vuntz didn't notice immediatly
<seb128> ie it's a TODO item on his list
<didrocks> FUSA calls gnome-session to perform actions, doesn't it?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks - for shutdown/reboot, FUSA uses consolekit
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - it's probably too late to fix in this cylce isn't it?
<seb128> urg
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: oh ok, so saving session has to be fixed twiceâ¦
<seb128> no, that should really be fixed
<seb128> it would suck to have gnome-session fixed but fusa buggy
<seb128> fusa should just use gnome-session
<didrocks> seb128: it seems the right wayâ¦
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i agree. the only issue is that gnome-session doesn't provide an API for shutting down or rebooting without popping up the session dialog
<chrisccoulson> it does for logging out, but not for shutting down or rebooting
<seb128> chrisccoulson: update-notifier manage to do it
<seb128> using xsmp I think
<chrisccoulson> update-notifier uses gdm-signal and GnomeClient
<chrisccoulson> yes
<seb128> fusa could do that too
<mvo_> MacSlow: compiz with the fade changes uploaded
<chrisccoulson> thats pretty much what FUSA used to do, but you cant integrate policykit support that way
<seb128> so we have the choice between session saving and policykit?
<chrisccoulson> if gnome-session exported a dbus method to immediately shutdown or reboot, then you'd get session saving and policykit support for free;)
<seb128> right, that is karmic material though
<chrisccoulson> definately
<seb128> I guess my choice would be to roll back your policykit change then
<seb128> we don't have so many issues to multiple users logged-in
<chrisccoulson> possibly. but session saving isn't working at the moment is it?
<seb128> but lot of vocal complains about session crashing applications rather than closing those
<seb128> what do you call session saving?
<seb128> it's working for logout
<seb128> it's likely that it will be working for restart etc before GNOME 2.26.1 too
<chrisccoulson> by session saving, i suppose i mean "not just killing the users applications"
<seb128> ie for jaunty
<seb128> right, that's working for logout since saturday in jaunty
<seb128> and that will be working for the other actions before jaunty
<seb128> ie gedit ask if you want to save your work
<seb128> firefox doesn't display the crash dialog on next login
<seb128> etc
<chrisccoulson> if it is working for 2.26.1, then i don't mind doing work to make this work with FUSA too
<seb128> ok so start working on it ;-)
<chrisccoulson> i'll take a look and see how much effort it would need. i suspect it probably isn't that much ;)
<seb128> you rock!
<chrisccoulson> :D
<mvo_> chrisccoulson: I looked over #344460 and commented (but go to bed now)
<mvo_> chrisccoulson: let me know what you think, I'm happy to sponsor it tomorrow (unless someone else is faster of course)
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-03-18
<yoophglup> i need help with desktop sharing anyone here know about it??
<pitti> Good morning
<didrocks> Guten Tag pitti
<seb128> hello
<didrocks> lut seb128
<seb128> hey didrocks
<didrocks> seb128: did you have a restful night?
<seb128> yes!
<seb128> watched a movie and had almost 8 hours sleep yesterday
<seb128> and you?
<didrocks> \o/ that's needed after a GNOME release ;)
<seb128> hey MacSlow
<seb128> didrocks: indeed!
<didrocks> yes, fine too. Thanks!
<seb128> didrocks:
<seb128> http://download.gnome.org/sources/deskbar-applet/2.26/deskbar-applet-2.26.0.tar.gz
<didrocks> seb128: I merged a contributor update of murrine. dholbach asks for an explicit FFe on bug #344154 ;)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 344154 in gtk2-engines-murrine "Please, sponsor gtk2-engines-murrine 0.90.0 into jaunty" [Undecided,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/344154
<seb128> didrocks: if you want to do another update ;-)
<seb128> pitti: ^ it's main, can you grant the exception?
<didrocks> seb128: of course. I will handle it in a couple of hours (my girlfriend wants to do some shopping first ;))
<seb128> didrocks: sure no hurry, enjoy the shopping!
<mvo> shopping!
<pitti> seb128, didrocks: any upstream changelog? does it have new features?
<mvo> seb128: do you want to do the gnome-media sponsoring (it adds a new package) or is that all discussed and agreed upon?
<didrocks> pitti: the changelog is in the changelog file, no NEWS. There are some slightely changes
<seb128> mvo, pitti: guten tag
<seb128> pitti: we had a svn snaphost and upstream rolled a tarball with a special mention for jaunty, there was a blog post on planet.gnome.org
<seb128> pitti: ie they fixed quite some bugs since and would like us to ship this stable version rather than a buggy snapshot
<seb128> mvo: I asked chrisccoulson to do those changes, as discussed at distro sprint we use the intrepid capplet and make the new one available
<seb128> mvo: you are welcome to review or sponsor or it or I can do it too today if you want, we are mostly done with 2.26 so I'm not too busy today
<didrocks> seb128: bbl, have a good morning and probably lunch too ;)
<mvo> seb128: ok, thats fine then. I have a look and upload
 * mvo hugs chrisccoulson
<seb128> mvo: thanks!
<pitti> seb128: sure, makes sense to me
<seb128> didrocks: you too
<didrocks> seb128: thanks!
<pitti> didrocks: did you test this on your box?
<chrisccoulson> :)
<didrocks> pitti: the murrine update? Before the merge, yes. After removing quilt (Khashayar changes), I only rebuilt it.
<pitti> didrocks: please test it in the current form; if it works, please go ahead
<didrocks> pitti: let me launch my jaunty's box
<seb128> pitti: I'm looking to the indicator-applet update now if you didn't yet
<pitti> seb128: no, I didn't; thanks
<pitti> yay new usplash
<mvo> hm, personally I find it a bit misleading that the package is named "gnome-volume-control" but the gnome-volume-control binary is in gnome-media and the gnome-volume-control one is called gnome-volume-control-settings - thoughts?
<mvo> other than this nitpick the update looks fine
<seb128> lut huats
<seb128> mvo: call the binary gnome-volume-control-new?
<seb128> the binary package I mean
<huats> hello everyone
<huats> sorry I got to run
<mvo> seb128: ok, g-v-c-pulse does not make sense, or does it?
<seb128> mvo: that would work too
<seb128> mvo: yeah, use that naming
<seb128> chrisccoulson: ^ opinion?
<chrisccoulson> that sounds ok. the only reason i chose the name is because the new package ships g-v-c-settings and g-v-c-applet, and upstream call it gnome-volume-control too
<chrisccoulson> which is really confusing when they also install gst-mix as gnome-volume-control
<seb128> right
<pitti> seb128: ah, saw the new indicator-applet merge request; please let me know if bzr bd DTRT for you now
<seb128> pitti: it did thanks
<pitti> seb128: if they released a new upstream tarball, it should Just Work (tm)
<pitti> cool
<seb128> pitti: not sure if launchpad did pick up the upload correctly though
<seb128> pitti: the tarball download didn't work though
<pitti> oh? worked for me on a different project yesterday
<pitti> seb128: what happened?
<mvo> thanks, I go with -pulse then
<seb128> pitti:
<seb128>   http://launchpad.net/indicator-applet/+download failed: 501 Protocol scheme 'https' is not supported (Crypt::SSLeay not installed)
<pitti> argh
<seb128> pitti: I probably need to install something but dunno which one
<pitti> seb128: I probably have that perl module installed
<pitti> libcrypt-ssleay-perl
<pitti> yes, I do
<pitti> seb128: ^ try that
<seb128> pitti: that works indeed ;-)
<seb128> pitti: anyway update built, tested, uploaded and pushed to bzr
<MacSlow> hey seb128, mvo, pitti
<crevette> good morning
<pitti> hey MacSlow
<pitti> seb128: \o/ merci
<seb128> lut crevette
<crevette> salut seb128
<chrisccoulson> mvo - i think you forgot to rename debian/gnome-volume-control.install on the gnome-media upload
<mvo> chrisccoulson: oh, bugger. thanks
<chrisccoulson> that's ok ;)
<chrisccoulson> it's just failed to build on lpia, but i haven't checked the build log yet
<mvo> chrisccoulson: thanks, fixed locally now, I do a testbuild with that now and if its all good I upload it right away
<chrisccoulson> the lpia build failure looks unrelated. i386 and ppc just finished successfully (albeit, with an empty package)
<seb128> asac: gnome bug #571423 still on your list?
<ubottu> Gnome bug 571423 in ask dialog "grabbing the keyboard while a menu is open can lock the session" [Normal,Needinfo] http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=571423
<asac> seb128: what is missing. just http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=571423#c8 ?
<asac> i will do that now
<ubottu> Gnome bug 571423 in ask dialog "grabbing the keyboard while a menu is open can lock the session" [Normal,Needinfo]
 * asac gets the test sources
<seb128> asac: the current commenter stated not having the issue with the test program but you did iirc?
<seb128> asac: the comment you point has a question
<asac> yes
<seb128> asac: "Could you duplicate the problem, and paste the output of the test program
<seb128> attached?"
<asac> seb128: yes. that qusetion i saw. wondered if there is something else ;)
<seb128> asac: if you do have the issue could you respond to that so we can get things moving again?
<seb128> asac: that's all yes
<asac> 10:05 < asac> i will do that now
<seb128> thanks ;-)
<asac> so on metacity it definitly doesnt happen  ... let me boot laptop with compiz where i had this issue initially
<pitti> I'm off for about two hours; I'm not feeling very well, and need some fresh air
<pitti> I'll do some work in the evening to compensate
<seb128> pitti: see you
<seb128> pitti: you work enough there is no need to compensate ;-)
 * seb128 hugs pitti
 * seb128 hugs mvo
<seb128> mvo: thanks for the sponsoring work!
<mvo> get well pitti
<mvo> seb128: np, doing it with bzr is really mostly fun :)
<dholbach> hiya
<seb128> hey dholbach
<seb128> dholbach: thanks for the sponsoring you are doing too
<dholbach> seb128: I tried to do the python-nautilus thing yesterday, but it FTBFS
<dholbach> seb128: something weird with gnomevfs / python-gnome*
<dholbach> seb128: I gave up in the end and just de-installed, so I could remove python2.5*
<seb128> dholbach: ok
<dholbach> maybe http://cvs.fedoraproject.org/viewvc/devel/nautilus-python/nautilus-python-0.5.1-gnome-vfs.patch?revision=1.1&view=markup ?
<seb128> do you have the build error?
<dholbach> hang on
<seb128> could be
<seb128> did you try this change?
<dholbach> no, just found it now
<seb128> is anybody really using nautilus-python?
<dholbach> no idea
<dholbach> seb128: in any case the proper fix would be a port to gvfs, but there's not much activity upstream it seems
<seb128> indeed
<seb128> I've enough things in the desktop to not spend time on nautilus-python to be honest, I don't think it's very used or useful
<dholbach> seb128: that fixed it
<dholbach> seb128: uploaded
<seb128> dholbach: danke
<dholbach> de rien
<dholbach> easy enough to do
<dholbach> seb128: gotta do something sometimes to justify my ~ubuntu-desktop membership :)
<dholbach> seb128: bzr-gtk recommends python-nautilus - that's why I had it installed
<mpt> pitti, thanks and hugs for fixing bug 343618
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 343618 in gnome-mount "New cache flush progress window misplaced and has truncated text" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/343618
<asac> mdeslaur: hji
<mdeslaur> asac: so, as I was saying
<asac> mdeslaur: so if you select 10px its the same size? and for 10pt its flipped from what we expect?
<mdeslaur> asac: yes
<mdeslaur> asac: well, not flipped
<asac> mdeslaur: so for 96dpi vs. 135dpi we would expect 2/3 of actual size ... and now its 4/3 ?
<mdeslaur> asac: I would expect "pt" fonts to be dpi-adjusted once
<mdeslaur> asac: it's 1.5 times right now
<mdeslaur> asac: I would expect it to be 1/1
<asac> mdeslaur: yeah makes sense
<asac> 40/96 ~ 0.5
<asac> mdeslaur: please say good bye to the meta discussion.
<asac> mdeslaur: if you configure fonts with 10pt they will be different on screens
<asac> if the notion in the gnome appearence dialog actually tries to do "px"
<asac> and there is a calculation bug thats a different thing ;)
<asac> and that could be the case actually
<asac> mdeslaur: so please try the pango-view command on both
<mdeslaur> asac: pango-view command?
<asac> pango-view -t "Test Text 1" --font="Sans 10pt"
<asac> mdeslaur: sorry. remove the pt
<asac> just "Sans 10"
<asac> mdeslaur: please check how that behaves
<asac> mdeslaur: its in libpango*dev
<kenvandine_wk> good morning all
<asac> hi kenvandine_wk
<kenvandine_wk> hey asac
<davmor2> pitti: do you deal with the kde port of jockey too?
<kenvandine_wk> seb128: so what's the plan for ekiga, 3.2 or 3.0.2?
<seb128> kenvandine_wk: your call I would say ;-)
<kenvandine_wk> i have the patches ported for 3.2, but the deps aren't available yet (or wasn't last night)
<kenvandine_wk> 3.2 depends on versions of opal and ptlib that haven't been released yet :)
 * kenvandine_wk checks to see if they are now
<seb128> kenvandine_wk: new opal an ptlib have been rolled since yesterday
 * kenvandine_wk isn't seeing them
<kenvandine_wk> 2.6.1 and 3.6.1
<kenvandine_wk> damn mirrors
<kenvandine_wk> ok, forced to use a different mirror and i am seeing it
 * kenvandine_wk will build those
<pitti> back; my head feels slightly better now
<mdeslaur> asac: ok, I'll drop this issue now. thanks to you and seb128 and pitti for hearing me out.
<pitti> mpt: no problem; the label wrap bug is still on my radar, working on a small test case
<pitti> davmor2: yes, I can fix grave breakages
<pitti> mdeslaur: drop?
<mdeslaur> pitti: I'll let you guys handle it as you think it should be.
<pitti> mdeslaur: I'm not entirely sure that I thoroughly understood the matter :)
<mdeslaur> pitti: well, me neither :)
<davmor2> pitti: not so much grave as graphically incorrect.  the listing in Kubuntu for Nvidia looks like this http://www.davmor2.co.uk/jock.png
<asac> mdeslaur: can you please test the pango-view commands still?
<davmor2> people might automatically install the 173 driver due to it being the highlighted one rather than the 180 which is the recommended one
<asac> mdeslaur: and tell me if "Sans 10" vs. "Sans 10px" have the same behaviour that they have in gconf=
<asac> ?
<mdeslaur> asac: okay, one sec
<mdeslaur> asac: I need to reinstall jaunty on my netbook...I'll have the results a little later
<seb128> lool: do you think you could have a look to the pango 1.24 update for debian (and ubuntu since we are in sync)?
<asac> mdeslaur: ok. no problem. let me know
<asac> mdeslaur: btw, your findings are much appreciated as i dont have a high dpi display here
<pitti> davmor2: ah, you mean that the recommended one should come first?
<pitti> davmor2: btw, does it actually work for you? Riddell mentioned the other day that it wouldn't work for him at all
<davmor2> pitti: Yes so it is the highlighted one which is correct in gnome but not kde
<pitti> davmor2: I didn't upload the recent nvidia crash fix yet, though
<pitti> ah, no, I did
<davmor2> pitti: I just installed it I was about to restart to check it :)
<pitti> davmor2: if you came that far, it can't be so bad :)
 * pitti tests it here, too
<davmor2> pitti: It's up and running here :)
<pitti> yay
<pitti> davmor2: thanks
<davmor2> pitti: how does the list get made up is it jsut random or do you set the list?
<pitti> davmor2: it's more or less random right now
<pitti> davmor2: well, 'random' in the "python dictionary key order" sense
<davmor2> pitti: Right.  Okay just seems strange that it always seems to be in number order in gnome and not in kde is all :)
<pitti> davmor2: btw, could you test something else, please?
<davmor2> Yeap
<pitti> davmor2: if you currently have a kubuntu up and running?
<davmor2> yeap
<pitti> davmor2: can you please install policykit-kde (if it's not already) and run "jockey-kde" from a Terminal, as normal user?
<pitti> davmor2: using policykit-kde should work now, and I'd like to stop it running as root entirely
<pitti> I tried it here, but under gnome it insists to use policykit-gnome
 * pitti looks forward to getting DSL soon, so that he has enough bandwidth to get KDE CDs, too
<davmor2> pitti: I it not policykit-kde that kicked in and asked for the password just then?
<pitti> davmor2: please try installing or uninstalling something
<kenvandine_wk> pitti: hehe... good :)
<chrisccoulson> what speed is your new DSL connection pitti?
<davmor2> Is even
<pitti> davmor2: in Kubuntu you should be asked for you password at program start (kdesu)
<pitti> davmor2: while in GNOME you get asked when you install/remove a driver (with policykit)
<pitti> davmor2: right now you should still see kdesu when you run it from the menu
<davmor2> pitti: Ah yes I'll try it now
<pitti> chrisccoulson: well, "new"; it's the first time DSL is available here :) will be a 6000 one
<chrisccoulson> fantastic!
<seb128> mvo: around?
<mvo> yes
<chrisccoulson> my DSL connection dropped to 580B/s last night. notice the lack of the "k" ;)
<seb128> mvo: do we have an easy way to grep the whole archive for something?
<kenvandine_wk> chrisccoulson: eek
<mvo> seb128: source or binary?
<seb128> mvo: I'm pondering splitting the gtksourceview1 python package since nothing in the default install seems to be using it
<pitti> chrisccoulson: eww; well, I'm crossing fingers that it'll actually work
<chrisccoulson> mine went really slow as soon as i told my ISP that i was leaving
<davmor2> pitti: seems to be working I'll just reboot after to double check
<pitti> seb128, mvo: I usually run that on rookery's mirror, with http://people.ubuntu.com/~pitti/scripts/for-srcarchive
<pitti> davmor2: rock, thanks
<seb128> mvo: source, in fact the problem is easier than then, I just need to go through the rdepends of python-gnome2-desktop
<davmor2> pitti: policykit-kde is installed
<seb128> I guess I could easy get the list and apt-get source everything
<seb128> mvo: do you have tools for this sort of job?
<pitti> davmor2: you should be asked for password as soon as you install/remove a driver
<mvo> seb128: no, sorry. maybe the script that pitti has helps?
<seb128> looking into that
<seb128> I'm not sure what it does exactly
<pitti> my script walks over an archive, unpacks everything, and runs a command in the source tree (such as grep)
<davmor2> pitti: yes it's working in the same way as gnome I'm just checking that the nvidia driver got removed then I'll reinstall it again
<seb128> pitti: how many years does it take? ;-)
<davmor2> pitti: Right it's removed fine I'll reinstall it now
<pitti> seb128: e. g. for-srcarchive /srv/archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu dists/jaunty/main/source/Sources.gz "grep -r foobar"
<pitti> seb128: about a day; run it in screen :)
<pitti> seb128: it's quicker for main
<seb128> I guess I will just do a for package in$ $list; apt-get source $package;  and then grep
<seb128> I just need the python-gnome2-desktop rdepends
<pitti> seb128: for a small set of packages that'll work
<pitti> seb128: you can still do that on rookery to use the mirror there
<pitti> seb128: or an apport fakechroot
<seb128> pitti: right thanks
<lool> seb128: Pango: I wish, but certainly not today and likely not this week, I'm blocking various work and need to make progress on my tasks ASAP, also I'm covering for davidm this week
<lool> seb128: I would like to though, especially since I have armel changes to do
<seb128> lool: hum ok, thanks anyway
<davmor2> pitti: That's worked fine removing and installing :)
<seb128> lool: I will see if slomo wants to do it, jaunty beta freeze is tomorrow
<pitti> davmor2: thanks, much appreciated
<pitti> davmor2: I'll change jockey-kde to use polkit-kde then
<lool> Urgh beta freeze is tomorrow already
<lool> indeed
<davmor2> pitti: pop-up for policykit appears after you have selected and hit activate
<didrocks> pitti: I reinstall a fresh jaunty box and there is no noticeable issue with murrine gtk engine.
<pitti> didrocks: nice; then let's get it in
<mdeslaur> asac: pango-view renders a 10pt font at a sane size
<mdeslaur> asac: on a 135dpi screen
<seb128> didrocks: they rolled a 0.90.1 since
<mdeslaur> asac: oh, weird, the pango-view titlebar says 96 dpi
<seb128> pitti: ^
<asac> mdeslaur: if you use "Sans 10" ?
<asac> mdeslaur: what is sane size?
<pitti> seb128: sounds like bug-fix only, compared to 90?
<seb128> pitti: yes
<asac> mdeslaur: you can use --dpi=135
<seb128> pitti: just pointing to didrocks that he might want to update to this one, doesn't hurt to get some extra bug fixing now
<pitti> indeed
<mdeslaur> asac: by default, it assumes dpi=96, so it renders "Sans 10" the same size as "Sans 13.333px"
<mdeslaur> asac: if I specify --dpi=135, than "Sans 10" is bigger, like the desktop
<didrocks> seb128: ok, I will do it
<asac> mdeslaur: ok. so to summarize. with --dpi the point size is also physically larger on higher dpi screens when using pango-view?
<asac> and px has the same physical size?
<mdeslaur> asac: yes
<mdeslaur> asac: sidenote: weird, my firefox text isn't antialiased
<asac> good. i will check. but i guess that pango-view is right and point has really the opposite effect from what we would suspect
<asac> mdeslaur: thats because you use inferior fonts ;)
<asac> mdeslaur: you shouldnt allow websites to select their fonts
<asac> mdeslaur: also we have a regression:
<asac> mdeslaur: run: sudo ln -s /etc/fonts/conf.avail/70-no-bitmaps.conf /etc/fonts/conf.d/70-no-bitmaps.conf
<mdeslaur> asac: I wish the firefox preferences panel would fit in my screen so I could change it :)
<asac> mdeslaur: lol
<asac> mdeslaur: about:config, set browser.display.use_document_fonts to 0
<asac> mdeslaur: the no-bitmaps font will be readded on next upload
<asac> s/font/link/
<asac> but i would still suggest to prevent sites from selecting their own fonts
<asac> mdeslaur: oh. you could check if all backends have the same behaviour with pango-view ... e.g. --backend=cairo
<asac> --backend=xft
<asac> there is also ft2 and x
<asac> but i guess we shouldnt look after those
<mdeslaur> asac: xft backend gives the same results
<didrocks> pitti & seb128: new revision tested and pushed
<seb128> didrocks: excellent
<asac> mdeslaur: ok. but 10px still does the right thing? with --dpi=xxx?
<seb128> didrocks: do you have still some updates on your todolist?
<asac> right thing == same physical size ;)
<mdeslaur> asac: yes
<asac> mdeslaur: yeah. a bit odd though. size doesnt change here on the same screen regardless of what i use as --dpi
<asac> but maybe its because dpi is auto detected for px
<didrocks> seb128: I have to perform deskbar-applet: I will do it in few minutes, but I can take some if you wish
<seb128> didrocks: no that's ok, enjoy the nice weather rather you are on holidays and already did a lot ;-)
<mdeslaur> asac: hmm...me either
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, what a great weather there! ;)
 * asac needs a high dpi screen
<mdeslaur> asac: borrow a netbook
<asac> mdeslaur: does a mini 9 have high dpi?
<mdeslaur> asac: and try to install jaunty on it :)
<mdeslaur> asac: let me check, wife has one
<asac> i think i will try mini 9 ... i have that and it needs to be reinstalled anyway
 * asac searches for UNR daily images
<mdeslaur> asac: UNR forces dpi to 96
<mdeslaur> asac: install standard jaunty
<asac> mdeslaur: on what level?
<mdeslaur> asac: gnome i think, but I'd have to reinstall to make sure
<asac> mdeslaur: i will figure
 * asac installs UNR regardless ;)
<mdeslaur> asac: yes, mini 9 is 135 dpi
<asac> great
<asac> so seems i have the hardware ;)
<asac> lets see if i have the time
<mdeslaur> asac: please try the standard jaunty desktop installer, just to see what my fuss is about
<mdeslaur> asac: don't install, just boot your mini 9 with it
<asac> mdeslaur: where can i download the usb image?
<mdeslaur> asac: download the iso and use the "USB Startup Disk Creator" to make a usb key
<asac> ok. i will do that after installing UNR ;)
<mdeslaur> asac: cool, thanks :)
<seb128> hate hate hate g-s-d
<seb128> "(gnome-settings-daemon:24832): GLib-GObject-WARNING **: cannot register existing type `GnomeSettingsPlugin'
<seb128> (gnome-settings-daemon:24832): GLib-CRITICAL **: g_once_init_leave: assertion `initialization_value != 0' failed
<seb128> (gnome-settings-daemon:24832): GLib-GObject-WARNING **: invalid cast from `GsdXrandrPlugin' to `<invalid>'
<seb128> "
<vuntz> seb128: two questions for you
<vuntz> seb128: if you have time after hating g-s-d :-)
<vuntz> kenvandine_wk: btw, planning to do foresight livecd/vm for 2.26.0?
<kenvandine_wk> vuntz: yup
<kenvandine_wk> vuntz: how close is it to announce?
<kenvandine_wk> i was up very late last night testing images :)
<kenvandine_wk> so i just need about an hour to refresh the latest packages and create images
<vuntz> kenvandine_wk: hrm, I'm doing some smoketesting, and then I'll work on preparing everything for the announcement
<kenvandine_wk> ok
 * kenvandine_wk runs the script :)
<seb128> vuntz: shoot
<vuntz> kenvandine_wk: but I guess this won't be before 6-7 hours (to give more time to translators for the release notes)
<vuntz> seb128: how is 2.26.0 looking for you? :-)
<seb128> vuntz: any idea what could lead to those issues? I've that after applying a patch which has not a lot to do with it since g-s-d has been fixed to build correctly with -zdefs
<kenvandine_wk> vuntz: my live images last night worked well
<seb128> vuntz: good!
<vuntz> seb128: no idea about the errors
<vuntz> my second question isn't actually just for you... It's a dumb user question: is it normal that security updates of hardy also contain version bumps?
 * vuntz saw a new glib coming with a security bugfix... and tons of other changes
<seb128> vuntz: GNOME glib or glibc? no it should not, are you sure you don't have -updates too?
<vuntz> seb128: glib, and we don't use -updates on the server
<didrocks> seb128: done, I overwrite and upgraded the repository format to latest bzr one. bug #344832
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 344832 in deskbar-applet "Please, sponsor deskbar-applet 2.26.0 into jaunty" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/344832
<vuntz> seb128: glib2.0 (2.16.6-0ubuntu1.1) hardy-security; urgency=low ... Thu, 12 Mar 2009 16:46:11 -0500
<didrocks> hey vuntz o/
<vuntz> or maybe I'm misreading the apt-listchanges output
<seb128> vuntz: what is written in the apt-listchanges log?
<seb128> vuntz: https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/hardy/+source/glib2.0/2.16.6-0ubuntu1.1
<vuntz> seb128: sure, but hardy didn't contain 2.16.6 in the first place
<vuntz> it was something like 2.16.3
<seb128> hum
<seb128> let me check
<vuntz> seb128: you uploaded 2.16.6 to hardy-proposed on Wed, 17 Sep 2008 13:54:46 +0200
<vuntz> (not that I really care, I was just surprised)
<seb128> vuntz: I'm asking for confirmation, 2.6.6 was in updates for a while but I'm not sure that's wanted or an error
<seb128> to push it to security
<seb128> vuntz: that's wanted, they do security on top of -updates
<vuntz> okay
<vuntz> sounds weird
<vuntz> but again, I don't care in my case ;-)
<vuntz> so 2.26.0 looks fine here. Good
<seb128> yes
 * vuntz goes to ask people from other distros
<seb128> vuntz: they do that to avoid having a -updates-security or having to push all the fixes twice
<seb128> slomo: hi, do you think you could do the librsvg libglade and pango updates for debian?
<seb128> slomo: we are on syncs for those and that would be nice to keep it this way ;-)
<slomo> seb128: yes, i can do them today or tomorrow i guess
<slomo> seb128: oh, for librsvg i want to wait until it's in testing (http://packages.qa.debian.org/libr/librsvg.html) blocked by gtk
<seb128> slomo: ok thanks
<lool> pulseaudio is crashing a lot for me today; E: cpulimit.c: Received request to terminate due to CPU overload.
<chrisccoulson> lool - you need a bigger CPU ;)
<lool> One would hope that a dual core 2 GHz x86-64 would be enough these days   :-/
<seb128> vuntz: any idea what could lead to gconf calls crashing in orbit when using autostart desktops?
<seb128> vuntz: we have a small script to migrate some gnome-panel configuration
<seb128> vuntz: when run using an autostart (ie letting gnome-session run it) setting a key using python gconf crashes in orbit code
<vuntz> oooh, that's nastily bad ;-)
<vuntz> no idea, sorry
<seb128> hum ok
<seb128> vuntz: and any idea why the error for this autostart don't show up in .xsession-errors?
 * kenvandine_wk -> lunch
<vuntz> seb128: nope
<seb128> vuntz: ok, another question for you, any reason gnome-session doesn't expose dbus interface for reboot, etc? ;-)
<vuntz> it does
<vuntz> doesn't it?
<vuntz> ah no
<vuntz> indeed
<seb128> just for logout
<vuntz> hrm, don't know
<seb128> ok
<mvo> seb128, kenvandine_wk: yet another new gnome-panel with add-indicator uploaded, lets hope its the final one
<mvo> kenvandine_wk: the ppa3 version was still not reliable, it turned out it crashed like this for me in my test environment http://paste.ubuntu.com/133066/
<seb128> vuntz: how does gnome-session run those .desktop?
<seb128> vuntz: it's a weird thing, the script basically does sleep(90) and some gconf call and crashes in write
<seb128> vuntz: I don't know enough about orbit, bonobo, gconf etc but it there something which could timeout there?
<seb128> vuntz: and decide to close a socket or something because the client it stucked in a sleep for over a minute?
<kenvandine_wk> mvo: i will test
<vuntz> seb128: we do egg_desktop_file_launch(), I think
<vuntz> and no idea what's going on
<seb128> ok
<seb128> that's my second tricky issue today
<vuntz> if it works fine with all other apps, then something is weird
<seb128> I guess I will never understand that one
<seb128> vuntz: it works fine without the sleep(90) there too
<seb128> and the same script works fine otherwise when ran manually
<kenvandine_wk> why do we need the sleep?
<seb128> my guess was that 90 seconds stucked would close a socket or something
<seb128> but I don't get where and why
<seb128> and doing import gconf after the sleep makes no difference
<seb128> kenvandine_wk: 90 is maybe too much, that's to avoid a race between gnome-panel and the script
<kenvandine_wk> does the panel need to be loaded to add it?
<seb128> mvo had case where the code does wrong thing when the panel is not loaded
<kenvandine_wk> interesting
<seb128> or gnome-panel gets confused
<kenvandine_wk> that is more likely :)
<kenvandine_wk> the panel is just *so robust* :)
<mvo> :)
<mvo> it showed some applets twice for me
<mvo> without the sleep
 * mvo still thinks the crash is really strange
<kenvandine_wk> mvo: why 90?
<kenvandine_wk> just to be sure the panel is done?
<mvo> I pulled it out of my back :P
<mvo> yes
<kenvandine_wk> is there anyway to query the panel for status?
<mvo> just to be sure that it does not intefere
<mvo> I don't know
 * kenvandine_wk thinks if it takes 90s for the panel to start, there are bigger issues :)
<seb128> 15 should be enough there
<kenvandine_wk> mvo: btw... it seems that even if the script fails, it still sets that key so it doesn't try again
<kenvandine_wk> i would think an actual script failure should problem not set that
 * kenvandine_wk agrees with seb128
<kenvandine_wk> and 15 might be short enough that nothing gets yanked out from under us :)
<rickspencer3> kenvandine_wk: seb128: I'm going over the dx team bugs right now ... they appear to be in reasonable shape, except for a couple of unimplemented features
<rickspencer3> thoughts?
<mvo> I don't mind what exact number to use
<kenvandine_wk> rickspencer3: what's the decision for the unimplemented features?
<kenvandine_wk> cram to get any of them in we can before beta?
<kenvandine_wk> or just wait for the dust to settle?
<mvo> I just picked 90 to be on the safe side, it should not matter much
<kenvandine_wk> mvo: ok
<rickspencer3> kenvandine_wk: they are captured as bugs right now, and are set to "high" which means they intend to fix them for the beta, so will probably be done today or tomorrow
<kenvandine_wk> rickspencer3: i would really like to get the indicator python bindings in
<kenvandine_wk> which should be doable today
<rickspencer3> kenvandine_wk: I don't see a bug for that
<kenvandine_wk> there probably isn't... they are ready
<kenvandine_wk> eeejay is getting me a tarball to package
<kenvandine_wk> i'll file a bug for packaging it
<rickspencer3> kenvandine_wk: it's very important that we have bugs for all of the remaining work, otherwise we will lose track of something and it will come back to bite us
<kenvandine_wk> yeah
<kenvandine_wk> eeejay: is there a bug for that already?
<rickspencer3> I would appreciate it very much if you would help them by creating bugs if you they missed one. They can always close it if it's not needed.
<kenvandine_wk> sure
<rickspencer3> thanks
<seb128> chrisccoulson: I'm not sure now, did you say you would work on the tracker update?
<kenvandine_wk> seb128: how do i build multiple things that depend on each other in pbuilder?
<seb128> kenvandine_wk: add an apt source which has those or use pbuilder login, copy things there, etc
<seb128> I don't use pbuilder much
<seb128> only to test new packages, it's overwork for normal updates
<kenvandine_wk> ah
<seb128> diffing the configure.in or configure.ac is enough to catch 90% of the build-depends change
<kenvandine_wk> i just want to make sure ekiga/opal/ptlib all build fine
<kenvandine_wk> gonna upload to my ppa and ask for some testing
<seb128> I like better to have an another round of fixing and upload in 10% of the cases than using pbuilder for nothing in 90%
<seb128> ppa is a good way to do testing too ;-)
<asomething> kenvandine_wk: Check out https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto#Building%20With%20Local%20Packages
<kenvandine_wk> asomething: thx
<asomething> basically it details how to create a local repository and how to add it to your pbuilder sources
<kenvandine_wk> great
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i did say i would work on the tracker update
<chrisccoulson> i got distracted last night with gnome-media and gnome-session though
<chrisccoulson> tracker is on my list for when i get home from work
<seb128> chrisccoulson: ok, I was just making sure, debian did the update and the ubuntu diff is small I think that should make it easier
<seb128> so you might want to take their update and apply the ubuntu changes on it
<chrisccoulson> yeah, that sounds easier. that's what i did last time
<ember> hey
 * mvo goes for dinner and will upload gnome-panel the ppa -0ubuntu2~ppa5 as -0ubuntu2 afterrward, my tests look all good 
<seb128> mvo: your ppa version doesn't work
<seb128> mvo: "Syntax error: end of file unexpected (expecting ")")"
<seb128> mvo: sh -c (sleep 90 && python /usr/share/gnome-panel/add-indicator-applet.py) ... I don't know this syntax
<seb128> mvo: did you mean to use ""?
<seb128> mvo: or $()?
<seb128> mvo: doh, I'm lagging one version behind apparently, enjoy your dinner ;-)
<seb128> mvo: ok, the new version is still not there, I'm away for sport and dinner now but I will try after that again
<seb128> mvo: if you decide to upload please consider the patch on bug #335242 too
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 335242 in gnome-panel "Tool tips wrongly suggest "log out" is in Ubuntu "System" menu" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/335242
<seb128> it's from ted and should be alright to ship with the update
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - did you say debian updated tracker to 0.6.91?
<kenvandine_wk> ok, i'm confused... how do you upload multiple packages to a ppa that depend on one another to build?
<pitti> kenvandine_wk: set tight build dependencies, and upload them all
<pitti> kenvandine_wk: the build of the depending ones will only start once the dependencies become available (i. e. the other packages get built and published)
<kenvandine_wk> i did... hummm
<kenvandine_wk> oh
<kenvandine_wk> it is working
<kenvandine_wk> i see
<kenvandine_wk> the red X doesn't mean the build failed :)
<kenvandine_wk> pitti: well ekiga and friends are building in my ppa
<kenvandine_wk> it is working locally for me :)
<kenvandine_wk> i still need to re-fix the lp patch for it
<asac> mvo: did you see that debian gsoc page has three aptitude project proposals?
<asac> mvo: do you think that makes generally sense? couldnt we try to redirect forces on debian side in a direction that would better match our roadmap?
<LaserJock> seb128: around? ogra said you were wanting to demote screem
<asac> ArneGoetje: i saw one thing that still makes me wonder. why do we create links for hitning-medium AND hinting-slight at the same time?
<asac> i mean in the end we use slight i guess as that comes after medium alphabetically, but still seems wrong to have medium there at all
<mvo> seb128: thanks
<mvo> asac: I don't think I can redirect a lot, but I can have a look
<asac> mvo: couldnt we add our own ideas there and hope that they attract the people instead of this aptitude thing?
<asac> mvo: or is there nothing a student could do to help apt in general?
<mvo> asac: I can think of some, I can also talk to daniel about the aptitude ones
<mvo> asac: one of the things I would love to see is the resolver available from within libapt (or as its own lib)
<asac> mvo: yeah. so maybe aptitude project could be to factor resolver into a stable API and make that available as libaptitude-resolver.so or something ;)
<mvo> asac: yeah, my thought
<didrocks> seb128: gtk2-engines-murrine: Version (0.90.2) available on remote  site: http://download.gnome.org/sources/murrine/0.90/murrine-0.90.2.tar.gz  (local version is 0.90.1)
<didrocks> who do I have to kill? ;)
<mvo> asac: I contacted daniel about it, lets see what he thinks
<asac> cool
<asac> didrocks: be happy. you still have a few hours left till freeze gets enforced
<didrocks> asac: yeah, that's what I keep telling myself ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson: yes, it has been uploaded this afternoon could still be in incoming.debian.org
<chrisccoulson> ah, that's probably why i can't find it
<pitti> Good night everyone
<seb128> LaserJock: right, that's the only thing in main using gtksourceview1 still and one of the few things using libgnomeprint*
<chrisccoulson> i'll have another look in a second
<chrisccoulson> good night pitti
<seb128> mvo: will test after dinner if you still need testing
<seb128> pitti: 'night ;-)
<LaserJock> seb128: is Edubuntu the only thing keeping it in?
<seb128> didrocks: ah ah ;-)
<seb128> LaserJock: yes
<didrocks> seb128: :-)
<LaserJock> seb128: right, I'll drop it then. We've had lots of bugs filed about it just crashing a lot
<kenvandine_wk> ok, ekiga is built in my ppa
<didrocks> seb128: new version available, btw. You can sponsor it quickly before the 3rd round :p
<seb128> kenvandine_wk: excellent!
<kenvandine_wk> anyone willing/able to test it?
<seb128> didrocks: I will eat my sandwitch first and come back ;-)
<LaserJock> seb128: we were looking to replace it but haven't found a good replacement for Jaunty. I'll take it out anyway and look for a replacement in Karmic
<seb128> LaserJock: I guess we can keep it for jaunty if you still use it
<asac> mdeslaur: seb128: what was the bugid for the px thing?
<seb128> LaserJock: that's only gtksourceview1 no big deal
<LaserJock> seb128: I don't want it either
<LaserJock> :-)
<LaserJock> it gives me a good excuse to finally kill it ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: sure, have a goodâ¦ hum dinner? :-)
<mdeslaur> asac: 310353
<seb128> didrocks: yeah, kebab that's ok ;-)
<asac> mdeslaur: great. thanks
<seb128> brb before it gets cold
<didrocks> seb128: ok, that's more than just a swanditch. Enjoy!
<kenvandine_wk> pitti: you still around?
<mvo> seb128: that would be nice (testing)
<fta> seb128, is it possible to tune the dim level somehow? i just installed UMR a6 on a brand new samsung nc10, the dim mode is really too dim
<fta> oops, he's gone
<asac> thats his trick ;)
<asac> disappearing magic - poof!
<fta> lol
<asac> 3
<asac> 2
<asac> 1
<asac> hmm... still not back
<fta> UMR doesn't have the new notifications?
<asac> fta: seems not. yes
<asac> fta: install notify-osd please
<asac> should work well
<asac> as it uses compiz by default
<fta> i need more light, it's too dim here
<seb128> re
<asac> seb128: http://paste.ubuntu.com/133198/
<seb128> asac: upload if you think that's correct
<asac> seb128: what do you think ;)
<asac> seb128: for me the "... ..." stuff worke
<asac> wasnt sure about the right syntax.
<seb128> "... ..."?
<asac> "Monospace 13.333px"
<seb128> yes that's ok
<asac> like a whitespace in the gconf-defaults
<asac> good
<asac> bomb uploaded ;)
<asac> seb128: if you get complains redirect them to me ;)
<seb128> mvo: still there?
<asac> so i understand the impact of this change a-posterioir ;)
<mvo> seb128: yes
<seb128> mvo:
<seb128> $ cat /etc/xdg/autostart/indicator-applet.desktop
<seb128> buntu[Desktop Entry]
<seb128> the "buntu" at the start of the file breaks the script
<seb128> that's the version I got from your ppa
<seb128> what version should I be testing?
 * mvo goes and hides under a rock
<seb128> ii  gnome-panel                                1:2.26.0-0ubuntu2~ppa5                  launcher and docking facility for GNOME
<seb128> mvo: also the () is not need on the sh line
<seb128> and you can use 15 as sleep value
<seb128> on slow config it takes around 10 seconds for gnome-panel to start usually
<mvo> I would rather play it safe, maybe 90 is a bit extreme
<mvo> but then its run once only, then the gconf thing kicks in
<seb128> right
<seb128> let's not discuss the sleep
<seb128> what about the typo? ;-)
 * mvo goes and hides under a rock
<seb128> lol
<mvo> fixed here now
<seb128> mvo: give me the updated .desktop if you do update it to be sure we have the same version
 * mvo checks the debdiff
<seb128> no need to wait for an another ppa update round
<seb128> so I can test that now
<mvo> seb128: please check http://people.ubuntu.com/~mvo/tmp/indicator-applet.desktop
<mvo> seb128: on the plus side, I merged the patch from ted
<seb128> mvo: looks good to me, let's try this one
 * seb128 hugs mvo
<seb128> brb
<fta> seb128, [21:11] <fta> seb128, is it possible to tune the dim level somehow? i just installed UMR a6 on a brand new samsung nc10, the dim mode is really too dim
<seb128> fta: dim? screen brightness?
<fta> yes
<seb128> laptop usually have keys for that
<seb128> no?
<fta> in battery mode, it turns almost black
<seb128> there is gconf key
<seb128> and I think the power management capplet has slides for values too
<seb128> mvo: ok, confirmed working for my normal user and my test user in xephyr
<mvo> seb128: excellent, uploading now
<seb128> mvo: rock on!
<seb128> mvo: I also tested the case where there was already an applet btw
<mvo> seb128: great, thanks. I expect that went ok too?
<seb128> yes
<mvo> seb128: I hope there is not another funny typo in the upload, but I checked the debdiff carefully
<mvo> so hopefully we are ok
<seb128> "[add-indicator-applet.py] INFO: Already has a indicator applet
<seb128> Your panel already has a indicator applet"
<mvo> s/we/I/
<seb128> mvo: you might want to remove the debug infos
<seb128> mvo: or we can let those for a while and drop before jaunty
<mvo> yeah, I think we can keep them for a big
<mvo> bit
<seb128> mvo: at least in the working cases
<seb128> right
<mvo> just to have a log in case something goes wrong
<mvo> initially it had much less debug info :) but the stupid crash made me add more and more
<seb128> ;-)
<mvo> I'm really happy that is now fixed for good
<seb128> mvo: another issue I just ran into
<seb128> I get the "do you want to reboot now" dialog at each login my test user
<seb128> yeah me too
<seb128> mvo: because I installed upgrades and didn't reboot
<mvo> is there a pending reboot required?
<mvo> aha
<seb128> mvo: clicking "reboot" close the session and that's all since my normal user is logged too
<seb128> it's a bit confusing
<mvo> hm, so hitting reboot just puts you back to gdm?
<seb128> yes
<mvo> I think I send a signal to gdm that it should reboot
 * mvo scratches head
<chrisccoulson> you need to authenticate to reboot with more than one user logged in ;)
<mvo> I use the /var/run/gdm_socket interface
<seb128> mvo: hum, I'm using gdm-new, perhaps that doesn't work there
<mvo> let me test with gdm-old
<seb128> mvo: you mean it would reboot without consideration for my other logged users normally? ;-)
<chrisccoulson> i haven't tried the new gdm much yet
<mvo> yes
<seb128> urg
<seb128> chrisccoulson: nothing worth testing, I just run it because I said I would package it and debug some issues this cycle
<seb128> there is no configuration tool
<seb128> there is no way to pick your session type that I found
<seb128> ie I wanted to start a non GNOME session to debug gnome-session today there is just no way
<chrisccoulson> yeah, those are pretty big regressions. i got as far as installing it in a VM and that was it
<seb128> there is no nice fusa, no guest session
<seb128> no gdmflexiserver in xephyr
<seb128> it's the suck for no win ;-)
<vuntz> seb128: I use xephyr to do my gnome-session testing
<mvo> seb128: gdm-old just reboots, does not care for the second user
<chrisccoulson> it sounds like it. i think i'll give it a miss on my main desktop for now then;)
<mvo> seb128: I guess that is a bug :)
<vuntz> seb128: it works fine
<seb128> vuntz: run xephyr by hand and DISPLAY= gnome-session?
<seb128> vuntz: yeah, I did that today, thanks to you who gave me the hint when I debugged the "session dialogs are not themed"
<chrisccoulson> mvo - i probably wouldn't worry about it too much, the guest user can still log out and then press reboot from GDM, and it will reboot without consideration for anyone else
<chrisccoulson> i think the old GDM just runs /sbin/shutdown doesn't it?
<seb128> well in this case we nag them to reboot
<seb128> ie auto open a dialog with a "reboot" button
<mvo> chrisccoulson: thanks, good to know
<chrisccoulson> i think that's how it works anyway ;) perhaps seb128 knows better
<seb128> right that's what it does
<seb128> I blame vuntz for the lack of dbus api in gnome-session to reboot ;-)
<mvo> multi-user-hippies :P
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i have a patch here which adds that ;)
<chrisccoulson> although not tested yet
<seb128> chrisccoulson: bugzilla it please
<chrisccoulson> i need to test it first and then i'll do that. probably easier to test in a VM so i don't keep rebooting my desktop
<seb128> right
<seb128> or replace the reboot funtion by a beep or something
<seb128> just to make sure it get called
<chrisccoulson> that's a good idea. i'll work on that whilst i'm waiting for the tracker update to appear in debian
<seb128> tedg: do you want to do the gnome-screensaver update?
<tedg> seb128: Not really :)  I can if you need me to though.
<seb128> tedg: you better focus on dx work we will manage it
<seb128> chrisccoulson: do you want to look to it?
<tedg> seb128: Great, thanks.  I'll have a messaging indicator merge here shortly.
<seb128> or you are hacking on gnome-session?
<seb128> tedg: ok, what changes?
<seb128> tedg: is there any pidgin change coming before beta?
<tedg> seb128: Fixing a bunch of bugs.  Most of them were reported under evolution-indicator, but they're MI bugs.
<seb128> ok
<chrisccoulson> i'll look at it in a bit if I get the chance, but I wouldn't stop anyone else from taking it if they wanted to, as I can't guarantee I'll get it done this evening
<seb128> didrocks: still wanting to work or enjoying your evening?
<tedg> seb128: I'm fixing a couple of little things in the plugin, bratsche is looking at the chat window popping up issue.
<seb128> ok
<tedg> Wow, only one of the MI bugs was reported...  heh, looks like I got by easy on the bug triage front there :)
<seb128> tedg: I think the indicator is not really used a lot, for one thing it's not useful and for the other the migration script has just been uploaded
<seb128> tedg: sorry about the "not useful" but I still don't see the point of this thing ;-)
<seb128> I never get anything listed there
<seb128> evolution is running so I don't need to menu to open it
<tedg> seb128: That's partially because you don't use Pidgin.  And the Evolution stuff was a little broken.
<seb128> and pidgin dialog just open so I never get anything in the applet
<seb128> tedg: I do use pidgin!
<tedg> You should use Pidgin for IRC ;)
<kenvandine_wk> hehehe
<seb128> I use an IRC client for IRC
<kenvandine_wk> tedg: you converted me :)
 * tedg hasn't found an IRC client that didn't make him angry within two minutes of using it. :)
<bratsche> tedg: Maybe that indicates something about irc itself? :)
<tedg> bratsche: Heh, I didn't say it.
<tedg> I do find it rather ironic that a bunch of Linux folks are telling all the Windows folks that they should try something new yet won't move off of IRC ;)
<bratsche> What's the best alternative?  Jabber?
<tedg> I don't know the dates, but I'd guess that IRC is actually older than Windows.
<seb128> tedg: I let xchat-gnome running on a desktop and get notification bubble when somebody talk to me
<seb128> tedg: that's all I ask for an IRC client ;-)
<kenvandine_wk> seb128: that is what i used too :)
<tedg> bratsche: I think so.  But there isn't the large chatroom network like there is for IRC.
<kenvandine_wk> MI converted me
<seb128> kenvandine_wk: because it lists all the pings in the menu?
<seb128> I find pidgin being a pretty poor user experience for IRC
<kenvandine_wk> it's more than that
<bratsche> tedg: No, but all it takes is for someone to start one.
<kenvandine_wk> i agree with that :)
<bratsche> heh.. "all it takes."
<seb128> it's an IM not an IRC client
<kenvandine_wk> the MI gives you a list of things you might need to address
<seb128> I would rather convince those guys to make xchat-gnome use the indicator ;-)
<kenvandine_wk> seb128: i resisted it for  years :)
<bratsche> But you can have Jabber channels can't you?
<asac> < dcbw1> asac: random question; you guys don't have Poulsbo X drivers packaged for 8.10 or 9.04, do you?
<kenvandine_wk> seb128: i will go back for sure if that happens :)
 * tedg nominates bratsche to start one ;)
<asac> bryce: ^^ ?
 * kenvandine_wk needs to run out... bbiab
<bratsche> woot, I've been nominated for something!
<bratsche> Later ken
<tedg> seb128: I'd like it to also.  I've had a few people tell me they're going to do it, no finished code yet though :)
<bratsche> tedg: I'm depressed that I have to hack on something called "pidgin".
<tedg> The name is pretty silly.
<tedg> Icon too for that matter.
<bratsche> I didn't really like it when it was called gaim, but when it was renamed to pidgin I thought it lost what little credibility it may have previously had. ;)
<didrocks> seb128: if there are some stuffs to do, why not :)
<bryce> asac: no
<seb128> didrocks: http://download.gnome.org/sources/gnome-screensaver/2.26/gnome-screensaver-2.26.0.tar.gz
<asac> bryce: whats that about?
<seb128> didrocks: I'm sorry to give your work during your holidays
<bryce> asac: not a matter of packaging; it's a matter of upstream not providing them
<didrocks> seb128: no problem, it's really a pleasure :)
<asac> heh. ok
<seb128> didrocks: tomorrow freeze start so you will be able to enjoy the weather and write your book ;-)
<asac> bryce: what hardware is that for=
<asac> ?
<bryce> asac: I'll spare you the pool of bitterness and misery ;-)
<mvo> didrocks: what is your book about?
<didrocks> seb128: tomorrow, I head to Lyon for the day visiting old friends :)
<asac> bryce: not even a hint? (i just got thrown tha at me ;))
<bryce> asac: it's the poulsbo graphics hardware, which iirc is...
<didrocks> mvo: it's a free book on ubuntu for beginners (under CC:BY-SA)
<asac> bryce: intel?
<bryce> asac: yep, gma 500
<asac> bryce: ok so binary?
<seb128> didrocks: good, enjoy ;-)
<didrocks> mvo: but in French ;)
<asac> bryce: thanks ;)
<didrocks> seb128: thanks!
<bryce> asac: it's the gfx chip included in the quite popular dell mini systems
<seb128> mvo: it's not the first edition, didrocks is a rock star ;-)
<asac> bryce: oh. so what do we use?
<bryce> asac: it's a weird mishmash of binary and open bits and pieces.  The stuff that provides acceleration is a proprietary kernel chunk
<didrocks> mvo: telling "rock star", seb128 is a little emphasize the reality :p
<bryce> asac: the main problem that prevents us from shipping is that it has dependencies on a forked version of libdrm
<asac> bryce: do we do that in custom images?
<bryce> asac: which we cannot easily include in ubuntu proper
<mvo> didrocks: woah, that is ubercool :)
 * mvo hugs didrocks
<bryce> asac: correct
<asac> seems dell mini is something we want to support ;)
 * didrocks hugs mvo back
<asac> bryce: ah ok. so thats all custom then that gets shipped
<asac> nice
<bryce> asac: the workaround (used in intrepid) is -vesa
<asac> heh
<chrisccoulson> didrocks - that sounds ace
<asac> bryce: that matches what he said as well: 22:12 < dcbw1> asac: and, of course, vesa doesn't have modes for the Vaio P's panel size...
<seb128> mvo: http://www.amazon.fr/Simple-comme-Ubuntu-8-10-d%C3%A9couverte/dp/2352091896
<bryce> asac: you need the sarcasm punctuation mark after "nice"  ;-)  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sarcasm_mark
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: ;)
<asac> bryce: i didnt want to get tooo political ;)
<bryce> right, vesa only supports standard panel sizes, and has trouble with HD resolutions.  :-(
<bryce> asac: people with mini's need to stick with hardy and the official builds.  Not a good idea to roll your own.
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - the gnome-session patch works ok
<seb128> chrisccoulson: excellent
<chrisccoulson> i'll attach it to bugzilla
<chrisccoulson> it's quite a small patch
<asac> bryce: interesting. i just installed the jaunty UNR image ;)
<asac> bryce: worked
<asac> daily
<bryce> asac: I bought my dad a mini 9 for xmas, so already looked into the possibilities there.  Maybe one day there'll be a properly integratable, fully open source driver, but not yet
<asac> well. but probably i didnt notice ;)
<bryce> asac: oh on a mini?
<asac> bryce: on mini 9
<bryce> mm cool
<asac> bryce: i mean even the clutter stuff worked well
<asac> wasnt really slow or something
<bryce> I know the mobile team has been working on getting -psb updated on their UNR for jaunty, so perhaps you're benefitting from their hard work
<bryce> asac: anyway, if you're really curious of the whole sordid background, buy me a beer in spain
<asac> bryce: thats a good idea ;)
<bryce> asac: but basically if we can get upstream to straighten out their libdrm requirements, and if the binary kernel drm bits can be straightened out, then maybe we can include it in ubuntu proper.
<asac> if if maybe == p < 0.3 ;)
<didrocks> seb128: there was a bzr branch abandonned in ~ted-gould (2.24.0 was not in it), do I restart from scratch?
<bryce> asac: and a bottle of wine for lool as well - he actually knows the background much better than I
<asac> bryce: heh. if he wasn't french i would think that a bottle might turn out to be counterproductive ;
<asac> )
<bryce> hehe
<seb128> tedg: ^ didrocks question about your gnome-screensaver bzr
<seb128> tedg: should we base on that or do a new ubuntu-desktop clean one?
<bryce> asac: say btw, did you ever get a chance to test out that xauth change?
<bryce> asac: turned out to be a bigger integration work than I expected (my fault really), but never did check back to see if it actually solved the original problem...
<tedg> didrocks, seb128: I believe that one was up-to-date, but it never had the whole package in it, it was just the debian directory.  So it'll have to change someday... I have no problem with today being that day.
<asac> bryce: lets try ;)
<tedg> I can move it to ubuntu-desktop or somewhere else.  I didn't realize I hadn't.
 * bryce crosses fingers
<seb128> tedg: we do that too, store the debian directory only
<tedg> seb128: Oh, I thought that wasn't "the way"
<didrocks> tedg: yes, we do that too. It's just that the latest revision in your branch is 2.23.90
<seb128> didrocks: ok, take that one, copy the current jaunty version over and commit the diff as a "update to nnnn"
<seb128> didrocks: work based on that and push to ubuntu-desktop
<didrocks> seb128: I was thinking about that
<seb128> didrocks: that makes sense?
<seb128> excellent
<asac> bryce: so firefox still starts with changed hostname
<asac> bryce: looks good
<tedg> Do you want me to change the owner?  Or just push it there?
<bryce> asac: \o/
<seb128> tedg: it might not be the way but we are ubuntu-desktop and not bzr-hackers ;-)
<seb128> tedg: ie we use it this way ;-)
<didrocks> tedg: no, don't change anything. I will push it in ~ubuntu-desktop afterwards
<asac> bryce: just change your hostname in /etc/hostname and run sudo killall nm-system-settings
<tedg> seb128: heh, that works.  ping me when it's good and I'll hide mine to decrease confusion.
<asac> bryce: you will see the hostname changed in new shells
<asac> and you can still open apps
<bryce> asac: sweet
<asac> IceTransSocketUNIXConnect: Cannot connect to non-local host hector
<asac> (firefox:11995): GnomeUI-WARNING **: While connecting to session manager:
<asac> Could not open network socket.
<asac> i get this
<asac> not sure what that means
<asac> sounds related
<bryce> yeah
<seb128> asac: changing hostname dynamically is not a good idea usually ;-)
<seb128> things get confused
<bryce> seb128: well, asac and I just eliminated one source of confusedness for that
<asac> seb128: well. thats what we are fixing ;)
<asac> seb128: now X still works after hostname change
<asac> thats a good step ;)
<asac> everything else seems to be kind of minor  ;)
<bryce> hehe, just like fixing dpi's
<seb128> asac: I'm not sure the session manager and thing wanting authentification ie polkit will handle that smoothly
<asac> seb128: we have to check that
<asac> seb128: in fedora it works i think
<asac> seb128: could you think of testcases for session manager that might break?
<seb128> asac: well those "GnomeUI-WARNING **: While connecting to session manager"
<seb128> asac: it means applications will not be registered in the session correctly I think
<asac> seb128: ah. where is the code that does that?
<asac> libgnomeui?
<asac> client side i mean
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - gnome bug 575880
<ubottu> Gnome bug 575880 in gnome-session "Should provide DBus API for shutting down (or rebooting) the machine" [Enhancement,Unconfirmed] http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=575880
<seb128> asac: yes
<seb128> chrisccoulson: thanks
<chrisccoulson> you're welcome
<chrisccoulson> i must go and get some dinner now
<rickspencer3> asac: I'm looking at bug 310353
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 310353 in libgnome "Default font size too large if using native DPI" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/310353
<rickspencer3> UI-wise, what are you planning for the "return to defaults" functionality?
<asac> rickspencer3: that part is "optional" for beta as discussed the day before
<asac> but here my current thought:
<asac> dont chanage UI ... just ensure that 10 means 13.333px
<asac> and make that happen somehow
<asac> between UI and backend
<rickspencer3> asac: sounds GREAT!
<asac> i just need to find the right place to add that fix
<seb128> asac: I drop the milestone on the task
<rickspencer3> the bug task is still targeted for the milestone
<rickspencer3> seb128: thanks
<asac> seb128: please add the rc one
<asac> seb128: its important to fix for final
<asac> at least the simple solution i suggested
<seb128> asac: there is no rc yet I've milestoned for 9.04
<seb128> chrisccoulson: tracker is available on the debian ftp now btw
<rickspencer3> seb128: asac: that was the last importance = "High" bug task for beta for the whole desktop team
<rickspencer3> so sweet!
<seb128> \o/
<asac> great.
<asac> seb128: so rm_conffile doesnt work effectively in postinst?
<seb128> asac: what do you mean? I usually use in preinst I think but it works fine
<asac> only in preinst?
<seb128> ah right
<seb128> you still need the md5sum to be there I think
<asac> seb128: yeah. i didnt want to bother about fallback case and didnt want to add a new maintainer script
<asac> but well
<asac> seb128: hmm
<asac> so if there is no md5sum things will fail?
<asac> http://wiki.debian.org/DpkgConffileHandling
<asac> thats the pattern
<seb128>         old_md5sum="`dpkg-query -W -f='${Conffiles}' $PKGNAME | sed -n -e \"\\\\' $CONFFILE '{s/ obsolete$//;s/.* //p}\"`"
<seb128> that needs to work
<seb128> not sure if that still works after install?
<asac> seb128: but if it doesnt it should fall into the else?
<asac> hmm or does set -e mean that it exits the function?
<seb128> asac: right you should either get the .bak or it cleaned
<asac> seb128: yes. but seems nothing happens for us
<asac> strange
<asac> i mena its probabl really that its not in the conf db
<seb128> asac: where is you postinst?
<seb128> your
<asac> seb128: http://paste.ubuntu.com/133255/
<asac> seb128: only the "if dpkg --compare-versions "$2" lt "2.6.0-1ubuntu11~"; then" block deals with conffiles
<asac> the other stuff is previous debconf stuff needed to be reset
<asac> that works obviously because i just rm
<seb128> hum
<seb128> asac: postinst is called with the current version as argument no?
<seb128> asac: where preinst is called with the old installed version
<seb128> no?
<asac> seb128: postinst is called with current version. yes. thats why i do lt "current~"
<asac> let me check preinst ;)
<asac> #
<asac> new-preinst install old-version
<asac> #
<asac> new-preinst upgrade old-version
<asac> yes
<asac> hmm
<asac> you are right ;)
<asac> #
<asac> postinst configure most-recently-configured-version
<asac> hmm. sounds like old version
<seb128> asac: lol
<seb128> asac:   for f in $lp332992_acient_conf_leftover; do
<seb128> asac: ^ typo "acient" "ancient"
<asac> seb128: is that a type ;)
<asac> damn
<asac> seb128: i guess i owe you a beer ;)
<seb128> cool ;-)
<seb128> lut huats
<fta> asac, enough beers for me for a few days. yesterday was St Patrick's day. oh my!
<asac> fta: ;)
<seb128> asac: can you push your libgnome changes to bzr?
<huats> hey seb128
<huats> seb128: did you received my email ?
<asac> seb128: damn. i always have in my head "seb doesnt use bzr because its too slow" :)
<asac> i can ... yes.
<seb128> asac: read the apt-get source output ;-)
<seb128> asac: we have almost every in bzr now, only the debian directory
<asac> seb128: yeah. but i dont see it because i am always sooo sure ;)
<asac> seb128: good++
<seb128> asac: bzr-buildpackages rocks so they convinced me, that makes sponsoring much easier
<seb128> it downloads the tarball, and changes round are push and pull not add and download on launchpad
<asac> seb128: yeah. its really magic
<asac> seb128: but it also caused some colleteral damage to get there ;)
<asac> but i think now is most fine
<seb128> I don't care that was before my time ;-)
<asac> seb128: so the gconf defaults are not real defaults?
<asac> seb128: they seem to get set on login or something
<asac> and then if i push "unset key" they go back to the real defaults
<seb128> asac: no
<seb128> asac: the "unset key" is a gconf-editor display bug
<asac> seb128: ah.
<seb128> try to gconftool-2 --get
<asac> seb128: so it tries to be smart and guesses the new value
<seb128> or switch to an another dir in gconf-editor and back
<asac> seb128: but unset still does unset or is that wrong even?
<asac> ok cool.
<seb128> the "at login" is not true either
<asac> i will check that
<seb128> but the gconfd daemon does pick it immediatly
<asac> seb128: yeah. thats obvious if its a real default ,)
<seb128> you need to HUP it or wait 30 seconds
<seb128> does -> doesn't
<seb128> but it does the same for schemas
<asac> seb128: you are right. i am happy
<asac> i dont mind gconf-editor bug ;)
<seb128> good
<asac> just scared that it was kind of a login hack because of that
<seb128> asac: libgnome push? I'm waiting to do the 2.26 update
<asac> seb128: ah so you want to do something
<asac> let me fast track that then
<seb128> asac: yes, I'm waiting to do an update
<didrocks> seb128: gnome-screensaver ready (bug #345107)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 345107 in gnome-screensaver "Please, sponsor gnome-screensaver 2.26.0 to jaunty" [Undecided,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/345107
<seb128> didrocks: thanks
<didrocks> seb128: y/w
<seb128> didrocks: you are deserved some relaxing now ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: thanks (free \o/)
<didrocks> kidding ;)
<didrocks> and yes, I accept to go to bed now ;)
<seb128> didrocks: you call also tease huats while he's around ;-)
<seb128> call -> can
<huats> seb128: hehe... you know he teases me a lot... but I enjoy that :)
<didrocks> seb128: I do that everyday you know :p
<asac> seb128: its flowing up
<didrocks> hehe
<seb128> didrocks: ;-)
<asac> sigh
<asac> seb128: bzr: ERROR: Cannot lock LockDir(http://bazaar.launchpad.net/%7Eubuntu-desktop/libgnome/ubuntu/.bzr/branch/lock): Transport operation not possible: http does not support mkdir()
<asac> oh
<asac> sorry
<asac> ;)
<seb128> asac: don't use http to push ;-)
<didrocks> have a good night both of you!
<seb128> didrocks: 'night
 * huats starts to wonder 
<asac> seb128: yeah. i hoped you had lp: in control and didnt look
<huats> to bring his wii the next time he sees seb128 and didrocks :)
<asac> seb128: ok its up
<asac> revision 2
<seb128> asac: got it thanks!
<didrocks> huats: that what's you are doing in reality, playing at Mario Kart, I knew it! ;)
<huats> didrocks: you have discovered...
<didrocks> ;)
<didrocks> really going to bed now. 'night :)
<seb128> didrocks: I'm sure he's training full time so he can take his wii at uds and beat you
<seb128> 'night didrocks
<huats> hehe :)
<huats> good idea !
<didrocks_> seb128: that's so unfair :)
<seb128> cassidy: the notify-osd bug is not a bug, the idea is that you don't interact with bubbles
<seb128> cassidy: they get out of the way if you need to use that corner of screen
<cassidy> seb128: really?
<cassidy> that seems really really weird to me
<cassidy> so weird that I thought it was a bug...
<seb128> cassidy: if you have a composite manager they become translucide
<cassidy> humm
<seb128> that's a bit weird if you don't have a composite manager running since they can't
<cassidy> maybe I should retry to use metacity compositing
<seb128> the experience is not really nice in non-composited case indeed
<cassidy> yeah, it's really confusing
<cassidy> it took me a while before I understood when the bubble were appearing/disappearing
<seb128> everybody should be running a composite manager nowadays ;-)
<cassidy> that seemed random first
<cassidy> seb128: are you using metacity+compositing or compiz?
<seb128> compiz
<Ampelbein> seb128: do we include gnome version 2.26.1 in jaunty or do we stick to 2.26.0? i'm asking because there are some minor issues fixed in seahorse now that 2.26.0 is released and i want to ask if it's worth implementing them as patches. see bug #341983 for example.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 341983 in seahorse "seahorse crashed with SIGSEGV in strcmp() when adding custom hkp-keyserver" [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/341983
<seb128> Ampelbein: 2.26.1
<seb128> don't backport minor changes that's not required
<Ampelbein> ok.
<Ampelbein> seb128: btw, any updates left to do for me?
<seb128> ups
<seb128> Ampelbein: http://download.gnome.org/sources/libgda/4.0/libgda-4.0.0.tar.gz
<Ampelbein> seb128: ok.
<seb128> Ampelbein: http://download.gnome.org/sources/cheese/2.26/cheese-2.26.0.tar.gz
<Ampelbein> seb128: ok. for libgda there is a svn-branch mentioned in debian/control. shouldn't we remove this reference in the ubuntu-package/change it to a bzr-branch on launchpad?
<seb128> Ampelbein: no, just do the update, we don't use bzr for this one since we will resync on debian when they do the update
<Ampelbein> ok.
<Ampelbein> seb128: out of curiosity: is there a list of packages we regularly sync from debian?
<seb128> no
<seb128> but basically whatever has no ubuntu specific changes
<seb128> the desktop applications usually have lpi changes for example so we don't sync those
<seb128> the libraries are often in sync when we can
<Ampelbein> ok, got that.
<asac_> 00:06 < asac> james_w: for me --export-upstream still doesnt work
<asac_> 00:06 < asac> thats bad
<asac_> 00:07 < asac> is that my fault?
<Ampelbein> seb128: another question (sorry to bug you that late): http://paste.ubuntu.com/133296/ is the output of configure for libgda. berkeley db, mdb and jdbc are not included. is this ok or is a build-dependency (i.e. for a java-runtime) missing?
<huats> good night everyone !
<seb128> 'night huats
<huats> Ampelbein: if you need some help with gda just say it..
<seb128> Ampelbein: compare to the current jaunty build log?
<huats> I have done some updated on that one before
<huats> so I might help you :)
<huats> seb128: don't go to bed to late ;)
<seb128> Ampelbein: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/23791198/buildlog_ubuntu-jaunty-i386.libgda4_3.99.13-0ubuntu1_FULLYBUILT.txt.gz
<Ampelbein> huats: thanks for the offer.
<seb128> huats: I'm about to go
<Ampelbein> huats: i might come back to that one.
<seb128> Ampelbein: seems normal
<seb128> Ampelbein: I would not bother doing changes right now, let's do the update first and we can think about backends to build later ;-)
<Ampelbein> seb128: ok, didn't want to make a mistake there.
<Ampelbein> seb128: bug #345132 ready for review.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 345132 in libgda4 "Please sponsor version 4.0.0 in jaunty" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/345132
<Ampelbein> now going for cheese.
<Laney> CHEESE? WHERE?
<Ampelbein> Laney: here: http://download.gnome.org/sources/cheese/2.26/cheese-2.26.0.tar.gz and here: bug #345143
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 345143 in cheese "Please sponsor version 2.26.0 in jaunty" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/345143
<Laney> I can't eat that :(
<Ampelbein> Laney: ok, then take http://www.wineandleisure.com/images/cheese.jpg
<Ampelbein> lot's of cheese for you. ;-)
<Laney> much better!
<Ampelbein> seb128: btw, why is cheese in main for hardy but in universe for intrepid and jaunty? any specific reason?
<seb128> Ampelbein: not sure, I think it was used by mobile maybe they stopped or they can use universe packages now
<Ampelbein> seb128: ok. bug #345132 and bug #345143 ready for review.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 345132 in libgda4 "Please sponsor version 4.0.0 in jaunty" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/345132
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 345143 in cheese "Please sponsor version 2.26.0 in jaunty" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/345143
<seb128> Ampelbein: libgda uploaded, looking at cheese
<seb128> Ampelbein: you can look at nautilus-cd-burner too, the current 2.25 tarball doesn't build but there is a fix in svn
<Ampelbein> seb128: ok, will do that.
<seb128> thanks
<Ampelbein> and looking at cheese's buglist i found myself some triage work to do.
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> cheese uploaded
<seb128> enough work for me today
<seb128> I will look at the new sponsoring requests tomorrow
<seb128> good night everybody
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-03-19
<ArneGoetje> asac: that should be only hinting-slight. The hinting-medium link is a leftover from Hardy which hasn't been removed properly.
<asac> ArneGoetje: hmm. so another left over ;)
<asac> ok
<asac> ArneGoetje: please upgrade to my packages in ppa
<asac> ArneGoetje: you can set the values to "auto" in font_rendering
<ArneGoetje> asac: will do later.
<calc> does Ubuntu have the fprintd support that the Gnome 2.26 release notes mentions?
 * calc has a fingerprint reader in his laptop
<johanbr> The necessary packages seem to be in Universe.
<johanbr> libpam-fprint etc...
<calc> ah ok
<calc> i didn't know if the fingerprint stuff shows up automatically in about me when that is installed or not
<johanbr> nor do I
<crevette> hello gentlemen and ladies
<seb128> hello there
<crevette> seb128, hello
<seb128> lut crevette
<crevette> there is a problem with the plugin empathy of nautilus-sendto-universe
<crevette> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nautilus-sendto-universe/+bug/344765
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 344765 in nautilus-sendto-universe "no Telepathy sending" [Undecided,New]
<crevette> how can I ask a rebuild ?
<seb128> crevette: you can't you need to reupload
<crevette> :/
<tseliot> seb128: I have written a fix for bug 339228 (which really is bug 307306)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 339228 in gnome-settings-daemon "gnome-settings-daemon and gnome-display-properties slow down xserver when external monitor added" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/339228
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 307306 in gnome-power-manager "upgrade to 2:1.2.99.2-0ubuntu1 makes session utterly slow" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/307306
<seb128> tseliot: that's not a g-s-d bug then?
<tseliot> seb128: it's a bug in gnome-desktop as it does hardware probing even for trivial events
<seb128> did you discuss that upstream?
<tseliot> and g-s-d relies on gnome-desktop
<seb128> where is the patch?
<tseliot> yes, but they don't seem extremely interested
<tseliot> here are my patches:
<tseliot> https://code.launchpad.net/~albertomilone/gnome-desktop/tseliot-fixes
<tseliot> https://code.launchpad.net/~albertomilone/gnome-control-center/tseliot-fixes
<tseliot> have a look at the latest revision
<tseliot> revisions
<seb128> what is the upstream bug number?
<tseliot> there are two of them:
<tseliot> http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=574931
<ubottu> Gnome bug 574931 in general "gnome-settings-daemon and gnome-display-properties slow down xserver when external monitor added" [Major,Unconfirmed]
<tseliot> http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=568160
<ubottu> Gnome bug 568160 in libgnome-desktop "Gnome Settings daemon causes high CPU usage with an expensive call" [Major,Unconfirmed]
<tseliot> my change involves a small change in the API (i.e. calling gnome-screen-refresh() with an additional argument) therefore I doubt that it will be accepted by upstream in this version of Gnome
<seb128> tseliot: ok, that is no go for jaunty
<seb128> that's an ABI breakage, not an addition
<seb128> it would require a soname change and to transition everything built against libgnome-desktop in jaunty
<tseliot> seb128: is there anything else that relies on gnome-desktop?
<seb128> better to add a new function doing what you want and make gnome-control-center use it
<seb128> tseliot: apt-cache rdepends libgnome-desktop-11
<seb128> tseliot: probably not on the gnome-rr api but still that's an abi breakage
<tseliot> seb128: ok, would it be ok if I modified only the static functions and add another non-static function?
<seb128> tseliot: you can modify anything which is not part of the public api
<seb128> you can add a new function doing the non expensive calls and change the code to call that one
<seb128> if you do please prefix it ubuntu_ though so we avoid having trouble with upstream because we modify their api in a non obvious way
<tseliot> seb128: yes, this is exactly what I was thinking of doing. And yes I'll use the ubuntu_ prefix as I did in some other patches of mine
<seb128> excellent, thanks for your work
<seb128> I will try to ping federico about that when he's online
<tseliot> ok
<tseliot> I'll give you my new patches soon
<seb128> could you also attach your suggested patches to bugzilla when you done with those?
<seb128> thanks
<pitti> Good moring
<seb128> hey pitti
<seb128> pitti: how do you feel today? better?
<pitti> seb128: yeah, much better
<pitti> unfortunately I had to fiddle with my internet for an entire hour
<pitti> my main network is broken, and then it took me another 20 minutes to get my 3G card workoing
<pitti> bah
<pitti> want DSL
<seb128> dsl is coming ;-)
<tseliot>  seb128: shall I attach my patches that break the API in the gnome bugzilla?
<seb128> tseliot: yes please
<davmor2> pitti: :(
<tseliot> seb128: ok, I'll tell them that if the patches that I attach look good to them and they are interested, I'll add the checks for RandR's version both at runtime and at compilation time.
<asac> seb128: in interface editor there are only 3 fonts, while we have 5 in the appearence dialog ... any clue where the others are configured?
<seb128> asac: say that again?
<asac> seb128: ;). sorry. i mean in /desktop/gnome/interface there are 3 font names
<asac> seb128: but in appearence dialog there are five ;)
<seb128> asac: ah, the title font is a wm thing and the monospace a g-t one I think
<seb128> asac: search for Sans in the gconf key names ;-)
<seb128> it should list those
<asac> seb128: monospace is in /desktop/gnome/interface
<asac> but let me search for sans and serif
<seb128> well, search in gconf-editor
<seb128> check to include the value
<seb128> and type the font name
<asac> yeah so its nautilus desktop font
<seb128> that one is the one used for the desktop icons only right
<asac> and metacity/general/title_bar_font
<asac> great
<asac> metacity/general/titlebar_font
<asac> tbird is indeed an ugly beast. have to figure why it is such a wrong font there. in thunderbird 3 all seems fine.
<asac> let me first finish this security update round for tbird ... after lunch i can hopefully deal with this
<tseliot> seb128: I managed to achieve the same effect without breaking the API. This way we don't even have to update gnome-control-center: https://code.launchpad.net/~albertomilone/gnome-desktop/tseliot-fixes
<seb128> tseliot: excellent ;-)
<asac> tseliot: set your email in your launchpad account ;)
<asac> tseliot: to match what you use in bzr ;)
<cassidy> crevette: seb128: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nautilus-sendto-universe/+bug/344765 would be good to rebuild it now Empathy 2.26 reached Jaunty
<asac> @canonical.it ?
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 344765 in nautilus-sendto-universe "no Telepathy sending" [Undecided,New]
<asac> whats that?
<tseliot> asac: I thought I set it to @canonical.com already
<asac> tseliot: seems you changed from @alice.it ... to @canonical.it ;)
<asac> both are not associated with your launchpad account
<asac> so i cannot click on your name (like i can do for Michael Vogt for instance ";))
<seb128> cassidy: yes
<tseliot> asac: @canonical.com is the default email address on launchpad. Or am I missing something?
<seb128> cassidy: somebody screwed the packaging apparently
<asac> tseliot: i dont know. only thing i know is that the emails you used for commit are not associated
<asac> with your LP account
<seb128> cassidy: the issue you shows suggest than a soname changes and the library has not be renamed
<asac> if thats transitional its ok. otherwise you can just add multiple emails
<cassidy> seb128: empathy renames his libs each time soname are changed
<tseliot> asac: no, it's a typo. It looks like I replaces @alice.it with @canonical.it instead of @canonical.com. Thanks for making me notice ;)
<seb128> cassidy: there is something weird there
<seb128> cassidy:  libempathy-gtk.so.17 => not found
<asac> tseliot: no problem.
<seb128> cassidy: that should never happen
<tseliot> asac: news on the hardy branch of n-m 0.7.1?
<seb128> cassidy: ok, nautilus-sendto-universe has no shlib depends apparently and you removed the old soname
<cassidy> so problem is in nautilus-sendto-universe pkg?
<seb128> yes
<seb128> it should depends on libempathy-gtk17
<seb128> which would assure this version stay installed even if there is a new one
<asac> tseliot: that kind of got bumped from low to medium prio for me.
<seb128> cassidy: I will fix that today
<asac> because we need it else where now
<Zdra> seb128: we can have multiple version of libempathy installed on the same time?
<asac> tseliot: so it will happen really soon
<cassidy> seb128: cool
<tseliot> asac: ah, very well :-)
<seb128> Zdra: well, if the soname change they don't conflict so yes, that's the reason we change binary names
<seb128> Zdra: do libsomething7 and libsomething8 can be installed together
<seb128> which makes easy transitions, you can keep libsomething7 installed while you rebuild things with the new version
<Zdra> seb128: ok
<asac> anyone else noticed that "paste" with middle mouse became unreliable in jaunty gnome-terminal?
<seb128> no
<asac> not really a recent regression. i always thought it was X loosing events. but currently i am thinking its gnome-terminal eating mouse events if its not yet focussed
<asac> interesting. i regularly need to press middle mouse twice or sometimes even three times to get the paste
<seb128> I don't copy things there often though
<asac> fta: ^^ do you see this?
<asac> ah right. you use xterm
<asac> too bad
<tseliot> seb128: patch submitted (just FYI): http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=568160
<ubottu> Gnome bug 568160 in libgnome-desktop "Gnome Settings daemon causes high CPU usage with an expensive call" [Major,Unconfirmed]
<seb128> tseliot: thanks
<tseliot> np
<davidbarth> pitti: ping? MacSlow is building notify-osd latest tarball as I speak
<asac> seb128: apt-get source ubiquity -> ./gui/glade/stepLanguage.glade
<asac> seb128: the title is in "single line mode" ... this seems to have a bug making the label not scaling vertically at all
<davidbarth> asac: ping? do you have new build of network-manager-gnome with the last title fixes? the last one i see (0.7.1~rc3-0ubuntu1) dates back to the 5th of March
<asac> http://ubuntu-pics.de/bild/11246/bildschirmfoto_1_o1tzqH.png
<asac> seb128: ^^
<asac> davidbarth: yes. i need to put some love into this asap. sorry for the delay.
<asac> today or tomorrow morning i will try to get this through RMs.
<pitti> davidbarth: he just told me
<pitti> davidbarth: standing by :)
<asac> so for single line mode we have:
<asac> height += PANGO_PIXELS (ascent + descent);
<asac> otherwise its height += PANGO_PIXELS (logical_rect.height);
<seb128> doh, GNOME switching to git officially for 2.27
<pitti> ugh, more pain
<pitti> seb128: and you are complaining about bzr..
<seb128> I like svn ...
<cassidy> really?? O_o
<seb128> cassidy: svn? yes
<Laney> does sending notifications work over dbus? i.e. could I monitor notification requests with dbus-monitor?
<cassidy> i can't work with it any more
<Laney> looking at bug 343261 for Banshee
<cassidy> git changed my life (in better ;)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 343261 in banshee "No notification on audio track changes" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/343261
<seb128> cassidy: over complication for no real benefit for what I do
<cassidy> I guess that depends of your uses cases
<seb128> cassidy: get a checkout, do some easy changes, push back
<cassidy> but for lot of developers that's a real benefit
<cassidy> yeah for that svn is definitely easier
<cassidy> but for us, for example, we have a branches oriented dev workflow.  git is a must have in that case
<seb128> Laney: dbus-monitor --session
<Laney> seb128: Yeah, I was just wondering if that would actually work (not on an Ubuntu box atm to test)
<seb128> cassidy: git makes that difficult for no good reason compared to bzr in such cases, but *shrug*, the git fanboys didn't bother trying to see if other dcvs work better usually
<cassidy> seb128: I'm not considering myself as a git fan boy and I'm still using bzr (for my Elisa plugin for example). I recognized that git was scaring me first but now I know how to use it, it wouldn't change it for anything else
<seb128> cassidy: but that has been trolled enough, I guess I will just use git the way I used svn
<cassidy> yeah if you do the same thing as you did with svn that's not so harder
<seb128> cassidy: you think bzr is not good enough for what you have to do? what do you miss there? just curious
<pitti> seb128: well, frankly, svn is a pain in the neck
<cassidy> seb128: I think it's generally less flexible and powerfull than git. What I miss most is the fast cloning/branching, the ability to store branches in the same repo, the remote repo, git rebase, etc
<cassidy> bzr can probably do most of these stuffs with plugins though, I didn't really investigate this area
<seb128> I guess I'm not enough of a code writer to need all those things
<pitti> svn's lack of branches, and together with that, this hideous websvn is a really major issue
<cassidy> yep, as said, that's just a matter of uses cases
<seb128> I like the viewsvn of GNOME
<seb128> but *shrug* ;-)
<pitti> cassidy: yeah, bzr has those as well (all built in, except for rebase, which is a plugin for good reason, since it's not a good idea to use it in public development)
<cassidy> that's similar than vim vs gedit. Both a good editors but one is a lot more complete and require more training
<pitti> seb128: really? I always bite into my table if I have to cherrypick a patch from svn; but maybe I just don't know some dirty tricks
<cassidy> and not everyone needs to use vim :)
<seb128> pitti: it lacks a "give the diff for this revision", you have to do it file by file which is no fun but otherwise it's nice
<pitti> the simple question "show me the diff of r1234" requires black magic with webcvs/websvn
<pitti> seb128: right, that's the thing I'm usually interested in
<seb128> yeah, agree with you it lacks this one
<seb128> anyway no point to debate on that, it's settled for GNOME
<pitti> so for popular projects I just keep a checkout and svn diff it from there (which is slightly easier, although still much harder than in bzr)
<pitti> right
<seb128> good that they stop discussing tools for ages
 * pitti shuts up
<pitti> I just don't quite understand how people can actually like git
<cassidy> actually my prefered bzr feature is the launchpad integration. So if you could convince your co-workers to support git as well that would be great :D
<cassidy> but I guess there is so political issues here :)
<pitti> cassidy: that's in fact a long-standing wishlist item
<seb128> cassidy: lp will be opensource soon so you will perhaps be able to write a patch for it ;-)
<pitti> cassidy: no, it's just a manpower thing
<pitti> cassidy: writing a bzr interface for git which is really robust is far from trivial
<pitti> seb128: bzr is open source..
<pitti> it's got nothing to do with lp
<pitti> there's tailor, but it's not robust
<pitti> i. e. if you do two git imports with tailor, the resulting branches aren't related to each other
<seb128> pitti: I think they want launchpad to do git hosting the way it does with bzr
<cassidy> I'd like real git integration, not one going through bzr
<pitti> ah, I see
<cassidy> seb128: yep
<pitti> cassidy: well, I for my part want a bzr interface for git, so that I can actually *use* it without constantly having to RTFM and think about the git complexities :)
<pitti> but I don't mind much either way
<cassidy> yeah that would be good and useful for lot of people
<pitti> seb128: would you mind pinging me on jabber? need to test the new indicator-messages
<seb128> pitti: done
<mdeslaur> asac: I've noticed Shift-Insert being unreliable in gnome-terminal since jaunty
<kenvandine_wk> pitti: want to test ekiga?
<pitti> hey kenvandine_wk
<pitti> kenvandine_wk: good day for that today, since I'm on 3G, and not on my weird ISP
<pitti> kenvandine_wk: in your PPA?
<pitti> kenvandine_wk: give me 30 mins to sponsor two more packages, then we can do that?
<pitti> kenvandine_wk: how did the config migration work for you? I think I'll dump my ekiga gconf settings before the upgrade :)
<kenvandine_wk> pitti: sure
<kenvandine_wk> pitti: it  just worked :)
<pitti> nice
<pitti> seb128: ted's two merge requests done; doing notify-osd now
<pitti> . o O { with a bzr merge and a bzr bd -S this is all too easy! }
<pitti> MacSlow: does the trunk bzr log contain all LP # references? I see two references, is that corect?
<MacSlow> pitti, yeah... right now I cannot think of a bugfix between 0.9.5 and 0.9.6 I might have overlooked
<pitti> MacSlow: ok, thanks
<seb128> pitti: thanks
<pitti> MacSlow: is it expected that tests/test-modules segfaults?
<pitti> the actual package works fine for me
<kenvandine_wk> pitti: that upgrade this morning was painful... killed my box, but i blame compiz
<asac> mdeslaur: interesting
<asac> mdeslaur: but for me its also middle click in firefox
<pitti> kenvandine_wk: killed how?
<asac> that sometimes doesnt work to close tabs
<kenvandine_wk> memory
<asac> somehow i think its at-spi ... let me disable assistive technolgoies
<kenvandine_wk> compiz was using more than 700M RSS
<kenvandine_wk> while update manager was doing a massive update
<kenvandine_wk> 3G of ram and 2G swap all pegged
<asac> i need a good wikipage about libindicate and the idea about that
<asac> mpt: ?
<kenvandine_wk> and apps started crashing
 * kenvandine_wk wonders why compiz was sucking so much memory
<mdeslaur> asac: oh, something else then
<kenvandine_wk> the fonts look great now though :)
<asac> anyone knows when the beta lock will happen?
<seb128> asac: today when slangasek wake up and find an IS person to turn the button
<seb128> asac: ie in the next hours
<kenvandine_wk> asac: the fonts look great!
<asac> kenvandine_wk: ;)
<kenvandine_wk> but pidgin's fonts look huge :)
<asac> kenvandine_wk: except in thunderbird
 * kenvandine_wk is a evo guy :)
<asac> kenvandine_wk: so ... there are a few more tweakages
<asac> kenvandine_wk: monospace fonts in terminal need to be changed
<asac> let me check pidgin
<asac> maybe we need to use a smaller document_font
<kenvandine_wk> pidgin defaults to the document font
<kenvandine_wk> oh yeah... terminal is huge too
<kenvandine_wk> but they are sharp looking :-D
<asac> kenvandine_wk: terminal font is even in a bug in gnome terminal i think
<asac> kenvandine_wk: but i will know more in a few
<MacSlow> pitti, oh no ... that should not happen
<asac> kenvandine_wk: hehe. for now set document_font to 10.666px
<Ampelbein> seb128: bug #345168 ready for review, builds fine with the svn-patch included.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 345168 in nautilus-cd-burner "Please sponsor version 2.25.3 in jaunty" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/345168
<kenvandine_wk> asac: nah... i will wait so i can test the defaults
<seb128> Ampelbein: thanks!
<pitti> kenvandine_wk: hm, diamondcard seems to work for me, but @ekiga.net not
<pitti> kenvandine_wk: I can't get the echo test (immediately disconnects)
<pitti> kenvandine_wk: and if I try to ring you, it says "user not available"
<seb128> I don't use ekiga but it seems to be buggy every time pitti tries a new version
<pitti> heh
<pitti> seb128: interestingly enough, using @diamondcard.us has never failed me
<pitti> just @ekiga.net
<MacSlow> pitti, I'm looking into the notify-osd test-suite atm
<pitti> kenvandine_wk: try to ring me?
<MacSlow> pitti, I'll get back to you once I know more ... btw... which part segfaults for you?
<kenvandine_wk> one sec
<pitti> MacSlow: http://paste.ubuntu.com/133617/
<pitti> MacSlow: hang on, trying to get a stack trace
<MacSlow> pitti, wtf ... I fixed that
<MacSlow> that can't be
 * MacSlow tears out his hair
<pitti> MacSlow: http://paste.ubuntu.com/133619/
<mpt> asac, I'm sorry, tedg and I haven't had time to write up anything about it yet
<mpt> the Empathy developers need it too
<MacSlow> pitti, do you run it on the build-server or locally?
<MacSlow> pitti, question is ... does it have a proper display or not ... the test-suite currently needs that
<MacSlow> hey mvo
<mvo> hey MacSlow
<asac> mpt: hmm ... i need to explain to moz the difference of libindicate and why supporting that in the "general" toolkit makes sense ... for background i had http://paste.ubuntu.com/133628/
<pitti> MacSlow: locally
<pitti> MacSlow: yes, it's my normal workstation, just debian/rules build and tests/test-modules
<pitti> jaunty du jour
<MacSlow> pitti, while it does not crash here it covers only 54% of the tests ... that's unacceptable and I suggest to defer notify-osd for today
<MacSlow> 's beta
<pitti> MacSlow: well, the previous versions's test crashed as well; I uploaded it already, too
<pitti> since my tests in the real system (volume control, IRC bubbles, etc.) work just fine
<MacSlow> pitti, I just cannot chase everything so fast
<pitti> MacSlow: joining dx
<MacSlow> it's such a mess
<huats> hello everyone !
<seb128> lut huats
<seb128> hey rickspencer3
<huats> hello seb128 !
<huats> ho are you ?
<seb128> huats: good, you?
<huats> seb128: good too !
<huats> it is summer here :)
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> it's sunny here too
<Laney> Lucky! We just have grey skies
<seb128> pitti: having the configure.in diffing and the symbol diff, etc as part of a standard testsuite in bzr-buildpackage would be nice
<pitti> yeah
<seb128> I always do that by hand
<seb128> diff the configure.in between version
<seb128> run my diff-symbols.py after build
<pitti> ok, time for lunch
<pitti> bbl
<seb128> and then by debdiff between installed version and new debs
<seb128> pitti: enjoy!
<seb128> tseliot: still around? was your gnome-desktop change something ready for sponsoring?
<tseliot> seb128: yep
<tseliot> seb128: I updated the bzr branch to the latest version that you uploaded
<tseliot> since the version in the ~ubuntu-core-dev wasn't up-to-date
<seb128> tseliot: can you give the bzr url again?
<tseliot> https://code.launchpad.net/~albertomilone/gnome-desktop/tseliot-fixes
<tseliot> the branch is: lp:~albertomilone/gnome-desktop/tseliot-fixes
<seb128> tseliot: thanks
<tseliot> seb128: thanks in advance for the upload :-)
<seb128> you're welcome
<seb128> tedg: hi, got a minute to discuss your pidgin changes?
<tedg> seb128: Sure.
<seb128> tedg: ok, so 2 questions
<tedg> seb128: Heh, there's only two patches ;)
<seb128> 1- wouldn't it make sense to use the prefs.xml to change the default option to show the icon? or that's not working?
<seb128> 2- did you send your other change upstream, cf patch tagging and lower delta etc discussions
<tedg> seb128: I don't see a prefs.xml in the source tree.  I think it gets built by that code.  That is what sets the defaults for that.
<seb128> tedg: cd debian/prefs.xml in the deb source
<tedg> seb128: Yes, I will, I just finished it at 2am last night.  That's a today thing :)
<seb128> cd -> cf rather
<seb128> tedg: ok, no hurry I'm just making sure we don't carry diffs for ever for no good reason ;-)
<tedg> seb128: Ah, I didn't look in the debian packaging.  Sure, that works for me, I was just only looking in the upstream codebase.
<tedg> It seems a little weird that the debian packaging does things differently than the upstream project though...
<seb128> tedg: ok, let's upload your version for now maybe and figure that later?
<tedg> seb128: Sounds good.
<seb128> tedg: how differently? we ship a config rather than patching the code
<seb128> that seems a better way to me
<seb128> redhat does that too in them rpm iirc
<tedg> seb128: They don't ship a config at all and build it on the fly.  I'm not saying it's bad, I'm just saying it's odd.
<seb128> ok
<dandre> hello,
<dandre> I am looking for a fax frontend to send faxes from my ubuntu to a hylafax server
<seb128> I've no strong opinion either way ;-)
<seb128> dandre: -> #ubuntu
<tedg> For instance if they change the defaults, or the type of a value, that's going to show up as a bug instead of something that just "goes with the flow."
<dandre> sorry
<pedro_> seb128: salut, may you please give your opinion on bug 344431?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 344431 in brasero "cd / dvd creator appears in the apps menu, not in places" [Low,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/344431
<seb128> pedro_: holla!
 * tedg is learning things he shouldn't in Pidgin's debian/lintian-override directory :)
<seb128> one minute
<seb128> tedg: ah ah
<seb128> tseliot: uploaded and pushed to the ubuntu-desktop vcs (it's stored there now, I've updated the control)
<tseliot> seb128: thanks :-)
<seb128> tedg: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/24088024/0.14-1ubuntu6.debdiff
<seb128> tedg: why did you remove the VERSION file there?
<tedg> seb128: Sorry, that was a bzr-ism.  The file got deleted and then the commit caught it.
<tedg> I forgot to clean it up.
<seb128> tedg: ok, I drop that change then
<tedg> seb128: Great, thanks.  Sorry about that.
<seb128> no problem!
<tedg> I think it's a problem in the upstream build system.  They also delete some HTML files.
<seb128_> could piding be less intuitive as an IRC client?
<seb128_> it opens a nickserv dialog saying the nickname is already registered
<seb128_> no channel list, nothing obvious on what to do or showing that IRC is connected
<seb128> seb128_: hello
<seb128> seb128_: hello
<seb128> hum
<seb128> tedg: it displays 3:23 for the message time when it's 15:23?!
<tedg> seb128: Yes, it is a translateable string.  You're just seeing it in American ;)
<seb128> why does the time need to be translated I will never understand
<seb128> it's easy french doesn't use am and pm we use 24 hours
<seb128> that should be a locale thing and just work
<tedg> seb128: Because Americans can't read 24 hour time.
<seb128> well the american locale should say you use am and pm then
<dobey> it does
<seb128> well so why do we need to translate the time string?
<tedg> Well, that seemed like extra information that doesn't seem useful.  Are you really looking at IM messages that are over 12 hours old?
<dobey> that's what LC_TIME is for
<seb128> I though there was a glibc api for that
<tedg> dobey: How do you get it from locale then?
<dobey> but there are other issues
<tedg> Please comment with ideas on bug 334036
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 334036 in indicator-applet "Timestamp in messages not consistent with desktop" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/334036
<dobey> like, i don't think there is a glibc api to actually give you a string for the time that is properly formatted for the locale
<dobey> or something
<tedg> The idea was to pull the GConf key from the clock.  But that required pulling in GConf.
<dobey> which is why there are a billion time strings in the evo translations for example
<tedg> And lots of logic to find the clock.
<seb128> that is just ridiculous, there is none of those strftime() function or something to display an hour formatted for your locale?
<dobey> strftime is like sprintf but takes time formatting options
<dobey> so strftime("%h:%m") or something (though those are definitely not the right ones
<seb128> tedg: strftime %X
<seb128> displays 15:41:23 with a french locale
<tjaalton> seb128: whoa, I already got a fix for the nfs bug :)
<tjaalton> a _proposed_ fix
<seb128> "03:41:56 PM" with an en_US one
<seb128> tjaalton: nfs or gnome fix?
<tjaalton> seb128: nfs/kernel
<dobey>        %X     Equivalent to %T .
<dobey> and %T is not in the man page...
<tedg> seb128: Is there a way to kill the seconds though?
<dobey>        %T     time; same as %H:%M:%S
<dobey> from man date
<dobey> huh
<seb128> tedg: man strftime?
<seb128>        %T     The time in 24-hour notation (%H:%M:%S). (SU)
<seb128>        %X     The preferred time representation for the current locale without
<seb128>               the date.
<seb128> on jaunty
<dobey> man stftime doesn't say that on intrepid. hrmm
<seb128> GNU                               2008-10-29                       STRFTIME(3)
<seb128> it has been updated recently
<tedg> I still don't see how to do without seconds.
<seb128> right, me neither but there must be a way ;-)
<tedg> I guess I could do %X and then compare it to one of the other cases using strcmp.
<seb128> you can use %H:%M but that will be 24 hours format
<seb128> and there is a way to query the 24h or amp,pm from libc for sure
<seb128> you could query and call with the right parameter for am,pm or 24 hours
<dobey> you could do a regex of s/:[0-9][0-9] // on the sring :)
<dobey> err
<dobey> s/foo / / rather
<tedg> Does devhelp work for anyone else?  It's not worked on Jaunty for me.
<mvo> works for me
<mvo> (devhelp)
<seb128> mvo: want to sponsor #345168? ;-)
<mvo> bug #345168
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 345168 in nautilus-cd-burner "Please sponsor version 2.25.3 in jaunty" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/345168
 * seb128 is trying to tackle the sponsoring queue before beta
<mvo> seb128: can do
<seb128> I think it's an easy one
<seb128> thanks
<mvo> kendo!
<seb128> I'm just busy with some other change and slangasek will probably trigger the freeze button soon ;-)
<asac>  \o/ ... i think i am done wiht the pre-beta-freeze rush
<asac> great that the archive was still open toda
<asac> y
<asac> now looking at gnome-terminal and thunderbird font issue to see what we can do for beta still
<fta> grr, why ooo keeps starting in fullscreen mode? it has no decoration, and i can't make it smaller (metacity)
<mvo> seb128: geh, its not in bzr
<mvo> crisis!
<seb128> mvo: you can put it there if you want ;-)
<Ampelbein> mvo: i did not know that nautilus-cd-burner was to be packaged in bzr, the debian/control file did not say so.
<seb128> Ampelbein: it's not which is what mvo complain about ;-)
<seb128> or not yet
<seb128> rather
<mvo> seb128: hm, nautilus-c-b looks ok, but I don't see it in the place menu anymore
<mvo> seb128: but right click on a iso works - is that a known issue?
<Ampelbein> mvo: yes
<seb128> mvo: yes, pedro_ pinged me about a similar bug before, forgot to look
<seb128> pedro_: ^
<seb128> mvo: we don't use n-c-b by default anyway in jaunty so
<pedro_> is on the system tools menu now bug 344431
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 344431 in brasero "cd / dvd creator appears in the apps menu, not in places" [Low,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/344431
<Ampelbein> mvo: gnome bug 573790
<ubottu> Gnome bug 573790 in general "No way to access burn:// without a blank disc" [Major,Resolved: fixed] http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=573790
<seb128> ok I think that's a confusing choice
<seb128> vuntz: ^ what do you think about this one?
<mvo> seb128: sorry, disconnected. did you say something in between?
<seb128> <seb128> ok I think that's a confusing choice
<seb128>  vuntz: ^ what do you think about this one?
<mvo> so its a choice from upstream?
<seb128> mvo: I think we should discuss adding back the item to the place menu
<seb128> mvo: <Ampelbein> mvo: gnome bug 573790
<ubottu> Gnome bug 573790 in general "No way to access burn:// without a blank disc" [Major,Resolved: fixed] http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=573790
<mvo> thanks, I will sponsor the upload then, I was not certain if it was deliberate or a error in the package
<seb128> cool
<seb128> bah, hate gnome-screensaver
<Ampelbein> mvo: thanks. gotta go now, be back later. cu.
<davmor2> pitti: did you upload/fix jockey in kubuntu to stop using sudo?
<davmor2> pitti: it's alright jockey started up before the update :)
<pitti> davmor2: yes, yesterday
<davmor2> pitti: yes jockey started up, then the updates ran, So it worked as expected after reboot
<mdeslaur> asac: openoffice also probably
<seb128> Laney: hey, are you interested by doing some desktop work today? ;-)
<pitti> davmor2: I'm glad to hear that :)
<asac> mdeslaur: me?
<asac> mdeslaur: font issues in ooo?
<Laney> seb128: Aye, what needs doing?
<mdeslaur> asac: probably the same issue as gnome-terminal and thunderbird
<asac> mdeslaur: gnome terminal has a bug in the font code
<seb128> Laney: http://download.gnome.org/sources/evolution-mapi/0.26/evolution-mapi-0.26.0.1.tar.gz is an easy update but current version is totally broken
<asac> mdeslaur: they always reset stuff to point
<asac> mdeslaur: i found that already and have to fix it
<Laney> seb128: OK I will be home in 90 mins to have a look
<seb128> Laney: and nautilus-sendto-universe uses no shlibs apparently and has been broken by some soname changes, needs a rebuild and to fix the shlibs issue
<Laney> uh, weird
<seb128> indeed
<asac> mdeslaur: tbird hopefully goes away when building with cairo and not with xft2  .. but i have to verify that. also i have to find out why (if its the case) xft behaves bad for some apps
<asac> mdeslaur: most likely its really just bad app code overwriting stuff
<asac> mdeslaur: tbird 3 is good
<mdeslaur> asac: fun fun fun :P
<seb128> Laney: that might be because there is only plugins there and the path need to be added to the shlibs option
<seb128> Laney: it shlibs are usually for bin and lib
<mdeslaur> asac: sorry for the can of worms :P
<seb128> Laney: in fact it uses DEB_DH_SHLIBDEPS_ARGS_ALL += --exclude=/usr/lib/nautilus-sendto/plugins explicitly
<seb128> Laney: that's to not have strong depends ... anyway it needs a rebuild then ;-)
<mpt> asac, I suggest not taking up the topic with Mozilla until we have API documents ready. (We tried doing that with the Empathy developers, which predictably led to a confused response.) And if asked, say that we'll have API documents ready soon.
<asac> mpt: its not my decision
<asac> mpt: the topic was opened by others
<seb128> mvo: did we have case in previous cycle where gnome-screensaver upgrade where problematic for unlocking?
<asac> mpt: and they started to implement stuff
<asac> mpt: so we _now_ need to provide input to prevent more resources getting wasted ;)
<seb128> mvo: ie 2.24 running and upgrade to 2.26 the unlock dialog will not be showed correctly ... not sure what to do about that
<mvo> seb128: we had this in the past, but I'm not sure for what versions
<mvo> seb128: we disable the screensaver during upgrades
<seb128> mvo: what do you mean?
<mvo> hm, I thought we did
<seb128> mvo: well, I did lock my screen manually after upgrade
<seb128> and had to go back to a vt stop gnome-screensaver to get back to my session
<mpt_> asac, what kind of "stuff"? libnotify stuff?
<asac> mpt_: yes. i have to tell them that libnotify alone isnt good for messaging.
<asac> mpt_: anyway. i can lead the discussion if you dont want to provide input
<asac> ;)
<asac> i will just give my ideas then. all i will achieve is tell them that we will give more info soon
<mpt_> Oh, I want to, it's just a matter of finding time :-P
<mpt_> Is there a bug report or somewhere I could post easily?
<asac> mpt_: right. i showed you my paste and you didnt saw if its completely wrong or not ;)
<mvo> seb128: do we have issues with that?
<asac> mpt_: we should channel the input through one channel. its just confusing if multiple folks post different stuff ;)
<asac> mpt_: thats why i asked and i will proxy ;)
<mpt_> fair enough
<asac> but well ... lets wait till beta freeze
<seb128> mvo: wb
<vuntz> seb128: last ping still valid?
<mvo> hrm
<mvo> network
<mvo> sucks
<seb128> vuntz: yes
<seb128> vuntz: not sure what I asked but I don't think that was an outdating question ;-)
<vuntz> seb128: the item was removed from Places, following a bug report
<seb128> vuntz: right, but do you think it's a good decision?
<vuntz> seb128: it's mentioned somewhere in the ChangeLog
<seb128> just your personnal opinion
<vuntz> seb128: I honestly don't care :-)
<seb128> I know what happened
<seb128> ok
<vuntz> I'm fine either way
<seb128> vuntz: next question, did you run into the gnome-screensaver issue I described?
<vuntz> I don't read everything
<vuntz> so I don't know the issue :-)
<seb128> vuntz: well now you have 2 items in the menu, one opening the gui and one opening the nautilus location, not very obvious
<seb128> vuntz: <seb128> mvo: did we have case in previous cycle where gnome-screensaver upgrade where problematic for unlocking?
<seb128> <seb128> mvo: ie 2.24 running and upgrade to 2.26 the unlock dialog will not be showed correctly ... not sure what to do about that
<seb128> vuntz: ie if you lock the screen without having restarted the session you can't unlock
<seb128> vuntz: I get it every time, tried several downgrade and upgrades now
<vuntz> ah
<vuntz> err
<vuntz> 2.24 to 2.26 or 2.25.2 to 2.26.0?
<seb128> 2.24 to 2.26
<seb128> distro upgrade
<seb128> I didn't try 2.25 ;-)
<vuntz> so I don't know :-)
<seb128> ie intrepid to jaunty
<seb128> ok
<mvo> seb128: we had this in the past, but I'm not sure for what versions
<mvo> seb128: I thought we disable the screensaver during upgrades, but I can not find the code for that right now, maybe it got dropped again?
<asac> good that slangasek sleeps so long ;)
<asac> archive was still open ;)
<calc> seb128: i think the screensaver issue happens on 2.25.2 -> 2.26.0 also
<calc> seb128: or something caused me to not be able to unlock, i ended up killing the running screensaver and then it let me log back in
<seb128> ^ vuntz
<seb128> I though jaunty didn't have 2.25.2
<calc> er well whatever we had directly prior to 2.26.0
 * calc looks in his log
<vuntz> seb128: well, blame gnome-screensaver people, I'd say :-)
<seb128> calc: https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-screensaver
<vuntz> but I didn't remember seeing this
<calc> i upgraded jaunty today in any case and that is when it happened
<seb128> vuntz: yeah, I'm doing that next
<vuntz> although... I'm not using a screensaver
<seb128> vuntz: maybe you restarted your session before locking screen
<vuntz> seb128: I don't lock my screen, except when travelling
<seb128> me neither
<calc> ah ok i am wrong, i think it must have happened between 2.24.0-0ubuntu4 and 5
<seb128> I noticed because I did switch to my test user and it locked screen
<mvo> poor vuntz, bombarded with questions :)
 * calc had just assumed it upgraded to 2.26 along with everything else today
<calc> hmm that is really odd the 5 is from last week?
<seb128> no I didn't upload 2.26 because of the issue
<vuntz> mvo: I'll make seb128 pay, don't worry
<seb128> heh!
<calc> ok whatever happened when i upgraded today i noticed the issue i hadn't noticed it before today
<calc> maybe something screensaver uses library-wise is the culprit?
<seb128> vuntz: I will pay, GNOME switching to git, that's like paying every day for things you didn't do
<vuntz> mvo: and he's from Alsace, so that's fine...
<mvo> haha
<mvo> git :(
 * mvo weeps
<seb128> calc: so you are saying that's an issue in the current jaunty gnome-screensaver version already?
<seb128> brb testing
 * hyperair likes git
<calc> seb128: yea
<calc> seb128: after restarting it seems to be ok though
<calc> seb128: i did not notice it happening before my upgrade today
<calc> seb128: for whatever reason i also had trouble ssh'ing at the time so i thought it might have been some sort of weird pam issue
<calc> seb128: i could login to the console (ctl-alt-f1) and also after killing the running screensaver process for the dialog (there were two processes) i could log in via screensaver
 * hyperair wonders if anyone here has debian upload privileges and is willing to sponsor my nautilus-share upload to debian (and then sync to ubuntu). this fixes bug #209136
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 209136 in nautilus-share "use system icons" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/209136
<dobey> hyperair: i don't understand that bug
<hyperair> dobey: basically nautilus-share uses very dated looking icons
<hyperair> like stock GNOME kind of thing
<hyperair> something like if you kill gnome-settings-daemon.. that kind of effect
<hyperair> dobey: the screenshots show what it _should_ be, not what it _is_
<dobey> all the gtk+ stock icons are in the tango style now
<hyperair> which is why i didn't understand it at first eitehr
<dobey> well, i don't think that the icon /should/ be what that bug report says it should be, but eh
<hyperair> dobey: okay, take a look at /usr/share/nautilus-share/pixmaps/something.png (there's only one file and i can't remember the name)
<dobey> i don't have it installed
<hyperair> dobey: what it _should_ be is gnome-fs-share
<hyperair> wait.. lemme upload it somewhere then.
<dobey> gnome-fs-share doesn't exist :)
<dobey> wel, it's a symlink to folder-remote
<dobey> i don't need to see the old icon
<dobey> if it was an old ugly icon, that's fine, it obviously needs to be changed
<dobey> i'm just saying that i don't think folder-remote is what it should be changed to, as it's not really the right metaphor
<dobey> but i don't really have a better suggestion at the moment either
<dobey> probably a folder with emblem-shared overlaid would be better
<hyperair> dobey: it originally was... stock_shared-by-me for the menu..
<hyperair> and a bigger one which is shipped in the tarball
<hyperair> for the actual properties dialog
<dobey> i don't think that's what stock_shared-by-me was
<hyperair> it is
<hyperair> the patch says so
<mpt_> eeejay, hi, is there common terminology for exposing text for accessibility purposes that isn't visible otherwise?
<hyperair> -                                "stock_shared-by-me");
<hyperair> +                                "gnome-fs-share");
<mpt_> eeejay, i.e. is it called "expose to assistive devices", or something like that?
<hyperair> that.
<dobey> oh i guess it was, but it's old style
<hyperair> originally the patch only had that, so i made a similar change to the .glade file
<dobey> hyperair: i'm not saying it didn't use that
<dobey> hyperair: if you're going to change it though, you should change it to a correct name
<dobey> not gnome-fs-share
<hyperair> what's the correct name?
<dobey> well, gnome-fs-share is a symlink to folder-remote, which is the name in the icon naming spec
<hyperair> hmm seriously?
<dobey> but it is the opposite metaphor of 'shared by me'
<hyperair> hmm yeah =\
<hyperair> but that's what the patch in 0ubuntu7 had.
<dobey> sure. sometimes people make incorrect patches, or don't research or ask people who know, what it should be :)
<hyperair> alright alright point taken
<hyperair> i should go upload -3 to mentors.debian.net now =\
<hyperair> and then send out yet another email
<hyperair> RFS email
<dobey> heh. i need to just say the hell with it, and go rip out all the 'stock' icons from gnome-icon-theme
<dobey> and force people to update stuff
<hyperair> hmm that won't do =\
<hyperair> you'll break every damn thing
<hyperair> dobey: actually there are differences between gnome-fs-share and folder-remote
<chrisccoulson> tedg - if i get a new message in pidgin, but immediately close the message window without reading it, would you expect the message to disappear from the indicator applet too?
<hyperair> it just happens that gnome-icon-theme defaults to using folder-remote
<dobey> hyperair: huh?
<dobey> differences where?
<hyperair> some icon themes make them different =\
<hyperair> i just dug though soem of my icon themes
<dobey> some icon themes are broken
<hyperair> well how sure are you that gnome-fs-share is _supposed_ to be _exactly_ the same as folder-remote?
<hyperair> is it documented anywhere?
<tedg> chrisccoulson: Hmm, yes.  Does it not?
<dobey> gnome-* icons don't exist (unless they are application icons for gnome-foo named applications)
<tedg> chrisccoulson: I don't think we're attaching anything to the conversation being destroyed.
<chrisccoulson> it doesn't. the message remains in the applet, and then it crashes pidgin when i try to read the already deleted message
<dobey> hyperair: i maintain gnome-icon-theme, tango-icon-theme, and the icon naming spec :)
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hi seb128
<seb128> chrisccoulson: don't worry about the tracker build issue
<chrisccoulson> i was going to ask about that
<tedg> chrisccoulson: Okay, have you filed a bug?  I'll fix it :)
<seb128> chrisccoulson: it's a soyuz bug they will fix it, new section not available yet
<chrisccoulson> thanks seb128:)
<seb128> you're welcome
<seb128> thanks for the update ;-)
<chrisccoulson> tedg - i think i used apport to report it a little while back, but i'll check the latest crash to make sure it's the same trace
<chrisccoulson> it's against pidgin
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - no problem ;)
<chrisccoulson> tedg - bug 340717. i don't think the trace looks that useful though
<ubottu> Bug 340717 on http://launchpad.net/bugs/340717 is private
<hyperair> dobey: ah. that adds a whole lot of weight to your words ;)
<dobey> hyperair: see the 'Author' part of the icon naming spec ;)
<hyperair> um which package?
<dobey> http://standards.freedesktop.org/icon-naming-spec/latest.html
<hyperair> dobey: so if you're maintainer of gnome-icon-theme.. what's the point of making gnome-fs-share a symlink of folder-remote?
<dobey> hyperair: compatibility for older apps that aren't updated to the new names yet
<dobey> which is why there are so many symlinks in gnome-icon-theme
<hyperair> i see
<dobey> development releases default to not enabling the symlinks though
<hyperair> hm
<dobey> but i don't think anyone ever really sees the results of that
<dobey> otherwise there'd probably be a lot more open bugs about icons
<hyperair> i see
<mpt_> eeejay, I went ahead and did <https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NotifyOSD?action=diff&rev1=105&rev2=103>. You're welcome to correct my terminology if I have it wrong.
<hyperair> Laney: the notify-osd problem is caused by gsd not notifying notify-osd upon state-change.
<Laney> how come it works for some people?
<hyperair> it does?
<hyperair> that's surprising.
<Laney> yes
<Laney> popey has them, for example
<Laney> that's how I found out they existed in the first place
<hyperair> hmmmm
<hyperair> the problem is that the bug encompasses two i should think
<hyperair> wait
<hyperair> i'm not sure
<hyperair> =\
<hyperair> we're talking about notify-osd showing the icon of the media key you just pressed right?
<hyperair> time to take a peek at gsd patches
<crevette> hey
<crevette> I remember there is some agreement on the header to set for patch to track what they do, do you have a linkn,
<Laney> hyperair: yeah
<hyperair> Laney: you're right. it should be in already
<hyperair> Laney: either way the buggy code is in notify-osd
<hyperair> sorry i meant gsd
<Laney> gsd listens for those dbus events?
<hyperair> wrong. gsd _generates_ those dbus events
<Laney> right
<hyperair> gsd is what sits between your xorg's media keys stuff and dbus
<Laney> I know
<hyperair> banshee and gang connect to gsd via dbus
<Laney> and it also is supposed to push a notification?
<hyperair> yes
<Laney> k
<hyperair> if you dget the dsc, you can look at 16_whatever.patch
<hyperair> it looks like it pushes the notification...
<hyperair> +        NULL, /* "notification-audio-play", */ /* PLAY_KEY */
<hyperair> +        NULL, /* "notification-audio-pause",*/ /* PAUSE_KEY */
<hyperair> +        "notification-audio-stop", /* STOP_KEY */
<hyperair> +        "notification-audio-previous", /* PREVIOUS_KEY */
<hyperair> +        "notification-audio-next", /* NEXT_KEY */
<hyperair> for the media keys except play/pause
<hyperair> but it doesn't handle stop/prev/next for me
<hyperair> and the thing is, if it was an icon theme issue, then you should be noticing a blank popup
<hyperair> Laney: ^
<Laney> well I just get nothing
<Laney> why don't you put some debugging traces in to see what gets called and returned?
<hyperair> hmm i could try
<hyperair> but actually i'm on intrepid
<hyperair> with gsd 2.24-x
<hyperair> with a backported patch of cuorse
<Laney> heh
<Laney> you should upgrade :(
<hyperair> but intel T_T
<Laney> is it that bad?
<hyperair> everything 3d except compiz flies out of the window
<hyperair> yes it's bad
<hyperair> and it only affects some people
<hyperair> it might hit only those with agp + intel
<hyperair> i'm one of those badly hit
<Laney> :(
 * Laney cuts Evolution
<Laney> it looks nice, but why does everything have to take so long?
<hyperair> ?
<hyperair> what's long?
<chrisccoulson> evolution runs like a dog on my machine
<hyperair> evolution frequently hangs on mine
<chrisccoulson> when i open it and it loads the mailbox, my machine grinds to a halt for 5 minutes
<chrisccoulson> anything that involves any sort of disk activity on my desktop basically stops it from working
<Laney> oh, mine's not that bad
<Laney> just the application itself
<chrisccoulson> mines terrible. the mouse cursor stutters and pauses for several seconds at a time and all the windows fade to gray
<Laney> 1 minute+ delay from clicking "Reply" to actually getting a window, message text takes ages to download and so on
<Laney> it seems that it queues up a load of network IO and your requests just get shoved at the end
<chrisccoulson> my desktop takes nearly a full minute to open a gnome-terminal after i launched evolution
<chrisccoulson> ah
<chrisccoulson> i have no issues with network IO - mines all disk IO related
<hyperair> Laney: gsd is not firing off the required notification stuff
<Laney> any idea why?
<chrisccoulson> yop shows i get about ~70% iowait on my dual core when doing anything that involves any sort of disk activity
<chrisccoulson> and that corresponds to my machine grinding to a halt
<Laney> :(
<chrisccoulson> yop -> top
<chrisccoulson> lol
<Laney> Thunderbird may look like arse, but at least it performs well
<hyperair> Laney: dunno. i need to figure out my own package first @_@
<Laney> hah
<hyperair> Laney: i don't know why, but the patch doesn't seem to be in my gsd, yet i'm getting the pretty volume notifications
<hyperair> damn weird.
<Laney> volume started working with a recent update for me
<seb128> chrisccoulson: run sqlite3 .db vacuum to fix that
<hyperair> Laney: it's worked for me on my ppa since the day i backported the patch.
<hyperair> aha! that's why
<hyperair> i was looking in the wrong gnome-settings-daemon directory
<hyperair> damn i feel stupid
<seb128> chrisccoulson: upstream knows about the issue, that should be fixed for 2.26.1 before jaunty
<hyperair> i should git-ify everything
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i'll try that, but i think it might be a short-term fix. i have a general issue with anything disk intensive on this machine, so i can't entirely blame evolution ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson: right but evo tend to do a lot of io after time right now, that helps a lot
<chrisccoulson> thanks, i'll give it a go
<seb128> chrisccoulson: ie my evolution was hitting disk for 1 minutes on bugmails box before doing that, after it's some seconds
<chrisccoulson> probably doesn't help that i have ~60000 unread messages;)
<seb128> right, same for my bugmail box
<seb128> they are read though
<hyperair> hmm
<hyperair> the patch is different
<seb128> but that should not make a difference ;-)
<hyperair> i'll need to backport this patch then
<seb128> what are you looking at changing?
<Laney> looking into why gsd doesn't send media key notifications
<hyperair> Laney: can you do dbus-monitor 'interface=org.freedesktop.Notifications' and then start hitting your prev/next keys
<Laney> it only has the ones for track change from Banshee
<hyperair> only huh
<hyperair> that means it's gsd'd fault
<hyperair> how about your eject key
<Laney> don't have one
<seb128> Laney: ctrl-f9
<hyperair> set it to an arbitrary shortcut
<Laney> k
<Laney> yeah that works
<Laney> seb128: Do you have any idea how I can repro this mapi crash without a server available?
<Laney> can I install something to set one up easily?
<seb128> Laney: no, just do the version update ;-)
<Laney> or should I just update and ask the reporters to test
<seb128> do that
<seb128> that's how we do for exchange bugs
<seb128> nobody around has an exchange server
<Laney> fair enough
<didrocks> hey o/ I am updating evolution-mapi FYI
<Laney> oh
<Laney> ok!
<didrocks> gnome planet is a great ressource ;)
<Laney> seb asked me earlier ;)
<Laney> but nm
<didrocks> ok, sorry, didn't see it
<didrocks> you can do it if you wish :)
<seb128> didrocks: I though you were in Lyon for the day
<Laney> nah, I only got as far as uscan
<seb128> lut didrocks
<didrocks> (it's already done by my side)
<Laney> go for it
<didrocks> hello seb128 : yes, but it's just 1h30 from Annecy :)
<Laney> I see you french guys have a national strike today
<Laney> lazy sods ;)
<didrocks> Laney: yes, I saw a lot of people on strike in Lyon :)
<didrocks> it builds and installs sucessfully. As last time, I think that nobody have an exchange server aroundâ¦ :/
<Laney> yeah, just ask reporter to test it
<didrocks> Laney: I wasn't able to test it last time because of that and just uploaded it :/
<Laney> or jelmer/andrewsomething
<Laney> they did the initial packaging; guess they tested it the
<Laney> n
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - after vacuuming, evolution opens in a few seconds ;)
<chrisccoulson> thanks!
<Laney> \o
 * hyperair has an exchange account
<seb128> chrisccoulson: you're welcome
<didrocks> Laney: jelmer asked to a friend IIRC, I asked him to do this before I sponsored it ;)
<hyperair> what's this mapi crashabout?
<Laney> I'm letting it filter and process all new mail
<Laney> to see if it gets faster after this
<Laney> hyperair: it crashes after you authenticate
<hyperair> without fail?
<Laney> sounds like it
<Laney> at least for the reporter
<Laney> nobody files bugs when it works ;)
<seb128> does gnome-sound-properties start for everybody there?
<Laney> yep
<didrocks> hyperair: I can make it available to my ppa if you wish. It fixes http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=574784
<ubottu> Gnome bug 574784 in Mail "evolution-mapi can't fetch messages" [Normal,Resolved: fixed]
<didrocks> seb128: for me, it's ok
<seb128> for me too
<hyperair> didrocks: i'm on intrepid =\
<seb128> we just got some bugs about the mixer and that one not opening now
<hyperair> Laney: what happens when you do the eject key test thing again?
<Laney> hyperair: It ejects and I see the notification
<didrocks> strange, does he use virtualbox? (no sound in it)
<hyperair> Laney: strange, you actually see that notification?
<hyperair> mine shows a big eject logo
<Laney> sure
<hyperair> traditional style
<hyperair> =\
<Laney> heh
<Laney> you crazy backporting foo'
<hyperair> looks like i've got additional problems
 * hyperair sighs
<hyperair> i have to check my notify-osd package again
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - what are your thoughts on the nautilus auto-restarting issue? upstream seem to be fairly quiet about this. i had a look at it this evening and it looks fairly difficult to fix
<hyperair> hey somebody had to do it
<seb128> chrisccoulson: I think we should set the autorestart to false if they don't fix it and let user who have a crash restartit
<seb128> it's easy enough to open a place for example
<chrisccoulson> that might be a safe compromise for now
<chrisccoulson> intrepid didn't have the Autorestart key. it relied on setting the restartstyle hint with GnomeClient to a state dependant on whether it was drawing the desktop or not
<hyperair> #$%^ why do they change the damn capabilities strings EVERY SINGLE RELEASE?!
<hyperair> damn fickle pricks
<chrisccoulson> i looked at the possibility of doing the same with eggsmclient, but it doesn't appear to have the features for this
<hyperair> every single patch has to be updated everytime there's a new release
<chrisccoulson> it seems that eggsmclient only lets you set the restartstyle hint before connecting to the session manager
<seb128> chrisccoulson: right
<seb128> that's a known limitation, the bug fix would be to add the api to allow changing dynamically that value
<chrisccoulson> yeah, that would be nice
<chrisccoulson> probably a bit too late for this cycle though?
<seb128> not sure, better to ask to vuntz
<seb128> I would not bother for jaunty and just unset the autostart I think
<vuntz> vuntz is in a meeting :-)
<seb128> vuntz: ;-)
<seb128> what notify-osd capability changed this time?
<seb128> they were supposed to have support for old and new naming in this version to make updates easier
<seb128> "    - Add compatibility checks to ease transition period for applications to
<seb128>       pick up the capability  and hint name changes. (LP: #343553)"
<hyperair> Laney: this is seriously weird. i'm getting the next icon when  ipress prev.
<hyperair> and nothing when i press next
<Laney> haha
<Laney> well that's a start, right? Â¬_Â¬
<hyperair>    uint32 0
<hyperair>    string "notification-audio-next"
<hyperair>    string "Previous"
<hyperair>    string ""
<hyperair> very interesting
<hyperair> we're probably seeing some skewed enum or something
<hyperair> aha
<hyperair> that's right
<hyperair> pressing stop gives me.... previous
<hyperair> okay, what do enums start with?
<hyperair> 0 or 1?
<hyperair> oh wait a sec
<hyperair> i've an idea
<dobey> does everyone else get some type of useful notification that updates are available in jaunty?
<seb128> dobey: define useful notification?
<dobey> seb128: i ran apt-get update, and there are a crapload of updates available, but there's no tray icon or anything. i'm having to run apt-get upgrade, or update-manager by hand to install them
<seb128> yes, that's the expected behaviour
<seb128> update-manager auto-opens once a week for normal updates now
<dobey> how am i supposed to know when updates are available?
<seb128> and once a day for security updates
<dobey> ugh
<Laney> when it auto-opens :(
<seb128> dsign team decided that user are not upgrade maniacs
<dobey> not all of them, sure
<seb128> and that once a week for standard updates will do
<seb128> you can turn the gconf key to have the old behaviour back if you want
<dobey> what gconf key?
<seb128> I think it's /apps/update-notifier/auto_launch
<hyperair> Laney: do you seriously get a notify-osd popup for eject?
<Laney> rofl
<Laney> I'm not lying to you :(
<dobey> yay
<dobey> seb128: thanks, that is much better
<hyperair> very strange..
<seb128> Laney: maybe you didn't restart something recently
<seb128> I don't
<seb128> that was working some days ago though
<Laney> well I didn't restart after today's updates
<seb128> you might still be running the old g-s-d or something
<Laney> I'll do that though now
<Laney> brb
<hyperair> Laney: could you do the dbus-monitor thing with eject?
<seb128> nothing is sent
<Laney> hyperair: It's broken now since I rebooted :)
<hyperair> loool
<hyperair> i knew it
<Laney> hahaha
<hyperair> staring down the patch showed that eject was unhandled
<hyperair> so i just couldn't imagine why you had it working
<hyperair> now the very strange thing is that the enums seem to magically start from 1.
<seb128> eject was working 2 days ago when I sponsored 2.25.92-0ubuntu2
<seb128> the previous and next actions are working fine here
<seb128> only eject is not
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - just looking at the g-s-d patch. in gsd_media_keys_notification(), there is this line:
<chrisccoulson>  if (media_key_icon[key] == NULL) return FALSE
<chrisccoulson> EJECT_KEY is false
<chrisccoulson> **NULL even
<chrisccoulson> d-oh
<seb128> right, I could swear I've seen it working though
<chrisccoulson> it did used to work
<Laney> why was it disabled?
<seb128> it was not
<seb128> they just don't have an icon for it apparently or something
 * Laney wonders what he saw earlier
<seb128> well it was working
<seb128> the code changed though
<chrisccoulson> that's right - media_key_icon[EJECT_KEY] is definately NULL
<chrisccoulson> and the function just returns because of that
<chrisccoulson> the code did change quite a bit since the last release
<seb128> chrisccoulson: well
<seb128> +static const char *media_key_icon[] = {
<Laney> woah
<seb128> NULL
<seb128> NULL
<seb128> NULL
<seb128> etc
<chrisccoulson> yep;)
<seb128> I think they used the standard icon before
<chrisccoulson> only stop, forward and back are populated
<Laney> hyperair: I, er, have next/prev notifications now
<seb128> but they changed notify-osd to use better defined icons
<seb128> and they don't have one for eject
<hyperair> Laney: makes sense. i just figured out where i missed out
<hyperair> XRANDR_KEY was taken out between 2.24 -> 2.26
<Laney> that magical restart fixed it all
<hyperair> you should havek illed gnome-settings-daemon =\
<Laney> didn't know it got an update
<Laney> know or check tbh
<seb128> they have notification-device-eject.svg
 * seb128 tries to use that in the enum now
 * Laney misses play/pause too
<seb128> right it's not in the enum either
<Laney> yeah
<chrisccoulson> there's no icon for pause
<chrisccoulson> probably why both play/pause are disabled
<chrisccoulson> would look odd seeing a notification for play but not for pause
<hyperair> chrisccoulson: actually i noticed my play/pause button triggering PLAY_KEY
<hyperair> or something
<hyperair> chrisccoulson: which means that should be a play/pause icon instead of just play
<chrisccoulson> possibly
<seb128> right
<hyperair> but yeah you should fix eject
<hyperair> it was working before the update
<hyperair> the previous patch worked with eject
<seb128> right, it's just a matter to add the icon name in the enum, easy enough
<chrisccoulson> that's good:)
<Laney> hm
<Laney> having looked at the Human icons, I feel like I'm missing out now :(
<seb128> Laney: dpkg -L notify-osd?
<Laney> seb128: There seems to be more in /usr/share/icons/Human/scalable/status/
<seb128> we don't want theme specific icons though
<chrisccoulson> Laney - i'm not using human icons, but i created symlinks in the icon theme I use so i get all the notifications in my preferred theme
<chrisccoulson> it looks really neat
<Laney> so you get the "human" icons in your regular theme?
<seb128> chrisccoulson: the notify-osd icons are in hicolor, should be used in any theme
<chrisccoulson> i get all the notifications in my regular theme rather than the ones in hicolor
<Laney> seb128: "This is a set of fallback icons for Gnome. Canonical icons are in the Human icon theme."
<Laney> from the README
<seb128> oh ok
<seb128> didn't know ;-)
<hyperair> ?
<seb128> eject is working now
<hyperair> Laney: are you sure that's right?
<Laney> sure what's right?
<hyperair> i remember i was making noise about icons being in human
<hyperair> and then they shifted it all to notify-osd instead
<Laney> there are different icons in Human
<hyperair> so now it's sitting in notify-osd =\
<hyperair> there are?
<Laney> and then some fallback ones there
<chrisccoulson> the nice ones are in Human, and the fallback ones ship with notify-osd for those of us not using Human, or a theme that ships its own icons
<hyperair> either way, you should just make your icon theme depend on human instead of symlinking =p
<hyperair> there's a Depends line somewhre at the top of the index.theme file
<hyperair> i think i'm seeing the human ones
<chrisccoulson> hyperair - i didn't symlink to human. i symlinked within the theme i use so i get the icons in my native theme;)
<chrisccoulson> http://ubuntuforums.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=105750&d=1236531402
<hyperair> aah
<hyperair> cool =p
<hyperair> chrisccoulson: what are the original icon names?
<chrisccoulson> it depends what theme you use. i just searched in the theme until i found ones that looked correct;)
<hyperair> lol
<chrisccoulson> i also did it for the indicator-applet icons too
<chrisccoulson> although the indicator applet still doesn't do very much for me :/
 * Laney installs Jaunty on his Macbook
<seb128> gnome-settings-daemon with eject action icon uploaded
<seb128> I didn't add the play one because of the lack of pause icon for now
<Laney> \o/
<Laney> erk, Jaunty live CD counts down to autologin now
<seb128> you are the second user to report that this week
<Laney> is there a bug?
<seb128> I was assuming that xorg or gdm or gnome-session was crashing for mpt and bringing it back to gdm
<seb128> ask on #ubuntu-devel maybe, I don't know
<Laney> ok
<hyperair> woo the sun is rising
<hyperair> time for me to go to bed
<seb128> 'night
<asac> seb128: what kind of abi guarantees do exist for _gtk symbols? no guarantee at all?
<hyperair> night
<asac> sleep well hyperair
<seb128> asac: what _gtk symbols?
<dobey> asac: the private _gtk symbols that are listed in some headers?
<dobey> asac: they will have to always be there for gtk+ 2.x if they are publically exposed
<hyperair> asac: thanks. by the way, what about bug #248705 ? =p
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 248705 in evolution-data-server "Evolution Exchange does not authenticate to Exchange servers with a relative path in the form action, e.g. "owaauth.dll"" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/248705
<seb128> asac:
<seb128> $ nm -D /usr/lib/libgtk-x11-2.0.so | grep _gtk
<seb128> 000e5130 T hildon_gtk_file_chooser_install_properties
<asac> seb128: those exported in headers
<seb128> asac: any example?
<asac> seb128: but for internal use:
<asac> seb128: look in gtkmodules.h
<seb128> oh, those, no guaranty
<asac> seb128: good ;)
<seb128> ie they rewrote the fileselector and that broke hildonfm which was using that for example
<asac> seb128: except the callbacks of course
<asac> i reawlly just ment tose  _gtk symbols
<asac> also wonder why we export those in headers at all
<asac> seb128: as you showed they are even not exported ;)
<seb128> in the fileselector case that was to write backends
<seb128> only libgnomeui was using that for the gnomevfs backend
<asac> seb128: so what libs are using those now?
<seb128> not sure in your case
<NetSkay> ello
<asac> seb128: i mean they are not even exported anymore in the lib
<asac> seb128: so they shouldnt be used anywhere except in gtk
<NetSkay> someone willing to help poor fellow lnx user with openVPN :D
<seb128> asac: the fileselector ones? none, they dropped all that since they have gio in glib and don't need backends now
<asac> seb128: no ... i mean those gtkmodules things
<seb128> NetSkay: -> #ubuntu
<asac> but well
<asac> i guess the answer is: they are not exported ;)
<seb128> asac: I don't know about those sorry
<seb128> or not sorry, I just don't know ;-)
<seb128> but yeah, don't use private thigns
<seb128> that's going to bite you
<asac> seb128: thats ok. i was just hacking around and thought about changing one of those, when i discovered that they are in a exported header
<asac> in code those "_gtk" things really looked like: not exported, nowhere used outside of gtk ;)
<seb128> could be used for theme engines
<asac> seb128: but even if those symbols are not even exported. sounds unlikely
<asac> only static linking could allow access to them i guess
<asac> but anyway
<asac> i will see if i can find someone in #gtk+ or sommething
<asac> maybe tim knows ;)
<seb128> asac: ask bratsche maybe
<asac> bratsche: ^^ _gtk symbols in gtkmodules.h ... why are they exported in a public header, but then not even visible in .so ?
<asac> bratsche: is it a bug that they are in a public header at all?
<asac> or is that best practice for gtk?
<bratsche> asac: Hang on, let me take a look.  Not sure if I know the answer but let me look really quick..
<asac> bratsche: just look in the header ... the _gtk symbols really look private and even are commented as such. then they are not in nm -D /...gtk-x11...
<asac> thanks
<asac> seb128: so what damage about font sizes was reported on top of terminal, thunderbird ... ?
<asac> did you get anything else?
<bratsche> asac: That does seem like it should be a bug to me as well.
<asac> bratsche: ok great.
<asac> bratsche: i just was confused when i saw the header getting exported
<bratsche> Then again, I didn't realize gtkprivate.h was an installed .h file either.  I was about to say maybe these should go there.
<seb128> asac: some users complained about pidgin I think
<asac> seb128: ok. a bit change is ok and expected. if they claim huge differences i would like to know
 * asac starts pidgin
<seb128> asac: not that I know but I will keep an eye on such reports and let you know
<asac> so widgets look good here
<asac> seb128: great.
<bratsche> asac: I'll ask Matthias or someone about this tomorrow.  Now I'm curious.
<asac> seb128: terminal turned out to be a code bug. they always converted to point base without even properly recalcuating leading to a size boost
<calc> why can't i turn on use burnproof in brasero?
<calc> its greyed out
<calc> my drive supports it
<asac_> what does evolution use to display mail body content? is that a gtk widget? or something custom?
<bratsche> gtkhtml2 or gtkhtml3 or something like that.
<bratsche> I forget the version.
<asac_> does that live outside of gtk tree?
<bratsche> Yes.
<asac_> e.g. independent project?
<asac_> ah
<asac_> lets see if there is a bzr-mirror.gnome.org thing for it
<seb128> asac_: gtkhtml3
<bratsche> If you saw srag's blog post yesterday of the new Evolution-based mail client aimed at netbooks, they're using GtkWebkit for that.
<seb128> asac_: source is gtkhtml3.14
<bratsche> But Evolution itself has been stuck on gtkhtml3 for awhile
<asac_> seb128: hmm. there is gtkhtml2 and gtkhtml
<seb128> asac_: they plan to allow webkit for rendering in the next cycle but probably not for the editor
<seb128> asac_: it's gtkhtml then
<seb128> gtkhtml2 is libgtkhtml in ubuntu
<bratsche> seb128: Not for editing?  I thought webkit supported that finally?
<seb128> asac_: speaking about webkit did you ask about webkit 1.1?
<asac_> seb128: gwibber folks dont know how to fix it
<asac_> seb128: i asked them to investigate
<asac_> so lets give them a few more day
<asac_> seems webkit would break it completely
<asac_> not sure whats the problem. maybe will try on my own if there is no progress
<seb128> bratsche: well srag said he has webkit rendering code (he did it for the the netbook software) but not for editing
<bratsche> Oh, bummer.
<bratsche> I missed that part I guess.
<asac> too bad that bzr-playground.gnome.org will probably go away when there is git
<asac> thats working so nice ;)
<seb128> bratsche:
<seb128> <mbarnes>	is that just for email display or you think you can get a working composer by then too?
<seb128> <srag>	mbarnes, only for display :-)
<seb128> <srag>	dont even think of it for composer for Evo.. its early
<seb128> bratsche: that was the after meeting from this week
<bratsche> Ah, okay.
<calc> http://people.ubuntu.com/~brian/complete-graphs/openoffice.org/plots/openoffice.org-1day-new.png
<calc> just fell off the cliff :)
<rickspencer3> check that OUT!!!!
<rickspencer3> calc: you rocked the OO bug list down to zero!
<rickspencer3> unheard of
<calc> currently my upstream bug report numbers are 88.79% 86.21% 89.16% (working on the upstream linkage tomorrow)
<seb128> how responsive is upstream to bugs for openoffice?
<seb128> got alex to fix the ctrl-l ssh... mount error in gvfs today btw
<calc> seb128: sometimes very fast other times just ignores them
<calc> seb128: cool! :)
<calc> seb128: i have to test every bug though because they get upset if i send them unverified bugs, esp since we use ooo-build
<rickspencer3> way to calc!
<rickspencer3> congrats
<calc> rickspencer3: thanks :)
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-03-20
 * mpt is amused that <http://people.ubuntu.com/~brian/complete-graphs/openoffice.org/plots/openoffice.org-1day-new.png> leaves open the possibility of the bug count going down to -5
<davmor2> mpt: yeah that'll be bugs fixed before they are discovered :D
<Laney> I see three places in a new Jaunty install where fonts are too large on my screen: nautilus, window titlebars and policykit/gksudo password prompts. Are there bugs for these?
<Laney> bug 310353 looks good
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 310353 in gnome-control-center "Default font size too large if using native DPI" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/310353
<cassidy> Zdra: crevette: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nautilus-sendto-universe/+bug/345829
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 345829 in nautilus-sendto-universe "Doesn't work with Empathy 2.26" [Undecided,New]
<cassidy> would be cool if this patch could be included in the Ubuntu package asap
<crevette> cassidy, yep, I'll do it this week-end
<crevette> thanks a lot
<crevette> actually /me is not subscribed to nautilus-sendto-universe bug :/
<cassidy> bad crevette!
<crevette> this is corrected now
<Laney> had to go back to osx :(
<Ng> hm, I'm only finding one bug which mentions this, and it's not about it and is not mentioned any further - ~/.gvfs showing up as a broken mount
<Ng> e.g. its permissions show up as d?????????
<Ng> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gvfs/+bug/225361/comments/2 refers to it, but the bug is about something else afaics
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 225361 in gvfs "~/.gvfs causes various errors" [Medium,Triaged]
<davmor2> MacSlow: Just to let you know notify-osd doesn't seem to be working on 20090320.1 live install :(
<MacSlow> davmor2, be more specific and file a bug please
<davmor2> MacSlow: I'm just checking through now but I get no notify from network and I'm checking others before I write a bug
<MacSlow> davmor2, test it like this: notify-send "bla" "fasel" -i totem
<MacSlow> davmor2, if that shows a notification it's not notify-osd that's at fault
<davmor2> MacSlow: notify-send is currently not installed.  You can install it by typing:  sudo apt-get install libnotify-bin
<MacSlow> well then do what you have been advised :)
<davmor2> MacSlow: Meh weird it's working properly now :)  Don't know what happened then
 * kenvandine_wk grumbles about  mail not getting filtered suddenly... 
<soren> gnome-settings-daemon has been crashing for me for a bit. This has re-raised a question I've been wondering for a long time: How does gnome-settings-daemon communicate to each gtk using application what theme to use, font settings, etc.?
<soren> Do they all have an inotify watch on something, do they all listen on a unix socket.. What?
<kenvandine_wk> ah... LP team name changed :)
<soren> Oh, is that perhaps what it uses CORBA for?
<thekorn> hi,
<thekorn> I'm unable to  change a keybinding in ubuntu jaunty to something like super_l+t, is this a bug?
<thekorn> or is super_l + <something> just not allowed there, because it is exclusivly used by compiz?
<dobey> pitti: you are much more familiar with distutils than i
<dobey> pitti: could you perhaps somehow know why this new command i'm writing, is getting run twice?
<pitti> dobey: hm, not without seeing the code, I'm afraid
<dobey> hrmm
<dobey> i think i might know why
<dobey> it's doing setup() in if __name__ == "__main__":
 * pitti -> off again; have a nice weekend everyone
<rickspencer3> bye pitti
<rickspencer3> have a good weekend
<dobey> later pitti
<kenvandine_wk> later pitti~
 * kenvandine_wk -> lunch
<bratsche> !
<jpds> Hey Cody.
<dobey> É
<mpt> eeejay, DnaX in #ubuntu-devel is asking about the Python bindings for indicator-applet
<kenvandine_wk> mpt: when eeejay gets me tarballs, i will get it packaged and into the ppa at least
<eeejay> kenvandine_wk: where should i upload the tarballs to?
<eeejay> kenvandine_wk: does lp support that? didn't see it
 * eeejay joins #ubuntu-devel
<kenvandine_wk> you create a release
<kenvandine_wk> i think
<kenvandine_wk> i haven't done that in ages :)
<eeejay> kenvandine_wk: bah, that means i need a separate project page
<kenvandine_wk> eeejay: that might not be the right answer :)
<kenvandine_wk> i don't really know
<kenvandine_wk> anyone else have advice?
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-03-21
<jrperpetua> hi!
<jrperpetua> can anybody help me on how to dual boot with ubuntu 8.10?
<jrperpetua> i have a problem in doing linux partition.......
<jrperpetua> i don't know what partition to make.
<jrperpetua> and what the size should be.
<thewrath> is anyone here?
<maxb> thewrath: If you have a question, just ask.
<maxb> It matters not whether there are people here. It matters whether there are people here who can answer your question.
<thewrath> i am trying to put ubunt 8.10 on my laptop
<thewrath> but only issues is the bug for wifi
<thewrath> i am trying to find that bug on launchpad and having issues tryign to find it
<thewrath> does anyone know what bug i am talking about
<thewrath> ubuntu wont connect to wireless that uses wpa2 enterprise
<thewrath> and in addition what desktop should i use 8.10 or 8.04
<thewrath> ?
<maxb> thewrath: As per the topic of this channel, "For support please join #ubuntu"
<thewrath> ty maxb
<thewrath> what version of ubuntu desktop would you recommend me using jw
<thewrath> ur professional opinion
<salty-horse> should one of these be marked as a dupe of the other? they are several manifestations of the same bug:
<salty-horse> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/metacity/+bug/332624
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 332624 in metacity "Inconsistencies when windows change their icon" [Low,Confirmed]
<salty-horse> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/metacity/+bug/342888
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 342888 in metacity "Panel no longer changes window struts when resized" [Low,Triaged]
<bromic94> was wondering how you remove the splash screen when u boot up and shutdown ubuntu?
<maxb> bromic94: Edit the /boot/grub/menu.lst to remove the kernel commandline 'splash' option
#ubuntu-desktop 2009-03-22
<salty-horse> hi. any main sponsors around?
<renergy> the fonts look now as in ubuntu! thanks a lot!
<renergy> the "cleartype" use flag in cairo did the trick
<renergy> uh, sorry - that belonged to #gentoo-desktop
<hyperair> lol
<hyperair> you know ubuntu is where you belong when you customize your <insert distro here> installation to be like ubuntu.
<renergy> hyperair: thanks for the info, but I politely disagree with you - I think I would not have found the info about the relevant use flag at #ubuntu
<hyperair> of course you wouldn't
<dobey> ubuntu doesn't have 'use flags'
<renergy> indeed :-)
<hyperair> precisely
<hyperair> but my statement comes from my time with archlinux
<renergy> ah
<hyperair> i recompiled a few parts of my system to be like ubuntu =p
<hyperair> yeah so it's rather pointless switching after all
<hyperair> in my case
<renergy> well actually it's somehow similar in my case - I switched from ubuntu to gentoo, and I'm now tuning the gentoo to look like ubuntu :)
<hyperair> hah see =p
<hyperair> well it's always worth the experience, but you might find yourself back in ubuntu someday ;)
<hyperair> that's how it was for me
<renergy> yeah that's what I'm writing - it's not pointless I would say - one get the knowledge how the system works, more with gentoo than with ubuntu
 * hyperair nods
<renergy> actually in my case it's also somehow "back to roots" - the first distro I had was slackware, back in 1997 or so - updated it by hand at that time, and rather quickly ran into what is called "dependency hell"
<hyperair> well i have this belief that the package manager is the heart of every distro. learn to package, and you'll learn more about the distro =p
<hyperair> dependency hell eh. i've never encountered that, thanks to apt and it's sudoku-solving capabilities =p
<renergy> it's now rather pleasent surprise just to watch how the gentoo (emerge, portage) is beatifully doing automagically what I have done by hands before :)
<hyperair> heh
<Ampelbein> hi seb128, had you had a chance to look at bug #346591 ?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 346591 in seahorse "unbuildable due to fix for bug 305565" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/346591
<seb128> Ampelbein: hi, no it's sunday and I've been travelling today
<Ampelbein> that's ok.
<Ampelbein> you don't have to work on sundays, just saw you online here and thought asking could not be wrong.
<seb128> yeah sure, I'm just saying I didn't look into it yet ;-)
<seb128> I'll do that this week, the archive is frozen right now and I don't want to chase people to get exception today
<Ampelbein> thats fine, i think. gnome 2.26.1 is weeks away.
<seb128> indeed
<seb128> 3 weeks
<dobey> hrmm, i wonder what the best way to do this is
<dobey> downloading a couple gigs of data in a postinst is probably not a good idea
<pochu> what is 'this'?
<dobey> installing neverwinter nights (and expansion packs) game data
<pochu> are they non-free?
<dobey> yes
<pochu> even for multiverse I guess...
<dobey> meh, the patch to the latest version is 506M for en
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-03-22
<desrt> rickspencer3: good evening
 * desrt downloads the beta
<nigelb> chrisccoulson: Another bug the desktop might want to take a look and reply.  gnome bug 613509 forwarded from bug 531491
<ubottu> Gnome bug 613509 in general "Switch "Shut Down" to "Switch Off" and "Suspend" to "Sleep"" [Trivial,Assigned] http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=613509
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 531491 in gnome-power-manager "Switch "Shut Down" to "Switch Off" and "Suspend" to "Sleep"" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/531491
<rickspencer3> desrt, hi
<TheMuso> /c/c
<pitti> Good morning
<RAOF> Good morning :)
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> bonjour didrocks
<didrocks> Guten Morgen pitti, did you have a good week-end,
<pitti> yes, it was great; went hiking on Saturday, and had a Taekwondo training camp yesterday
<pitti> my body is aching everywhere now :-P
<pitti> didrocks: how was your's?
<didrocks> pitti: excellent. Lot of walking though the town with Julie as the weather begins to be a little bit better :)
<pitti> yeah, it's finally spring time here, too (except that yesterday it was raining like mad)
<pitti> I'm off for ~ 1 hour for a doctor appointment and supermarket
<didrocks> see you pitti
<seb128> hello there!
<didrocks> hey seb128, how was your week-end?
<seb128> hello didrocks, good, what about you?
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, the weather at least enables to walk outside, it's good :)
<seb128> does it sometime stop going out?
 * seb128 goes for a walk every weekened
 * didrocks don't like to walk when it's raining
<RAOF> Whyever not? :)
<RAOF> Evening, didrocks :)
<didrocks> good evening RAOF :)
<RAOF> didrocks: Have you seen https://code.launchpad.net/~raof/netbook-remix-launcher/fix-bug-467474/+merge/21349 ?
<seb128> good evening RAOF
<RAOF> seb128: Good morning :)
<RAOF> didrocks: I know you were busy last week, so it may have slipped through.
<didrocks> RAOF: right, I wasn't subscribed to merges, looking at this now. Thanks!
<didrocks> RAOF: sweet, that should fix most of issues with OpenGL driver which doesn't support well clutter
<seb128> tseliot, hey
<tseliot> hi seb128
<seb128> tseliot, thanks for fixing this nautilus crash
<tseliot> seb128: no problem, it was affecting me too and I found it a bit annoying ;)
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> I need to check with bratsche why it was crashing though
<seb128> I'm wondering if there is a bug in gtk too
<tseliot> seb128: there is another problem now. Compiz' sync to vblank doesn't seem to work on the 2nd screen
<tseliot> seb128: yes, I was planning on asking him about that
<tseliot> I think that patch relied on another patch that he wrote to set the colourmap
<pitti> bonjour seb128! had a nice weekend?
<tseliot> hi pitti
<seb128> hey pitti
<pitti> tseliot: hey Alberto, how are you?
<seb128> pitti, yes, out of freaking out on saturday when reading my emails ;-)
<huats> morning
<pitti> seb128: yes, I'm terribly sorry about that
<seb128> pitti, what about you?
<seb128> lut huats
<tseliot> pitti: much better now, thanks. You?
<huats> hello seb128
<pitti> I prepared a fixed cdbs now, and this time I also added four test cases
<seb128> pitti, not your fault, I kept running around on friday saying we should unfreeze before friday evening
<pitti> seb128: I was hiking on Saturday, and had a Taekwondo training camp yesterday *rubbing bones*
<pitti> was great
<seb128> good ;-)
<tseliot> :-)
<pitti> seb128: well, it was my fault; should've tested it better
<pitti> but oh well, things happen
<seb128> right
<seb128> I don't blame you
<pitti> test cases FTW :)
<seb128> I'm unhappy about how much the unfreezing took after beta was announced
<pitti> it perfectly reproduces the bug now
<seb128> we would have noticed when people were still around if it didn't take them hours to flush the queue
<didrocks> seb128: we talked about that with chriscoulson and cjwatson on Saturday (about not unfreezing on Friday when it's becoming late for a part of the world), not sure that had any needful conclusion
<seb128> I told them on friday that it was a good idea
<seb128> but no point to discuss it for ages now, things have been fixed quickly thanks to people who hang around on weekend ;-)
<seb128> I understand the need for freezes but once it was clear there was no respinning but just announces to send they could have let the uploads through
<seb128> that was early in the afternoon
<seb128> it some some hours to unfeeze and then again some hours for steve to accept uploads from the queue
<baptistemm> heya good morning folks
<pitti> TheMuso: can I assign bug 528524 to you? you already seem to have started debugging it; it seems that resampling in PA/alsa is broken on ARM? might there be some platform specific code to optimize resampling?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 528524 in pulseaudio "Sound not working in all apps on dove" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/528524
<didrocks> good morning baptistemm
<baptistemm> heya didrocks
<baptistemm> is it still possible to add an apport hook to a package now?
<seb128> baptistemm, yes
<seb128> lut baptistemm
<baptistemm> I think a hook for bluez would be really valuable
<baptistemm> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~bmillemathias/apport/bluez-support/annotate/head:/source_bluez.py
<seb128> can you open a bug about this and subscribe ubuntu-sponsors?
<baptistemm> sure, I just wanted to make sure it was okay
<baptistemm> pitti, is there any way to install a package temporarly for apport hook? getfacl is not installed by default but would be useful for /dev/rfkill
<seb128> baptistemm, it's ok in any case if the change doesn't go in lucid it will go in lucid+1 so still good to have it on a bug
<pitti> baptistemm: sorry, no; you could try using ctypes and use libacl, though
<baptistemm> seb128, k, but I think it's still on-progress, I need to tweak some ouput of the commands
<pitti> seb128: but if you just want to know whether the user has the fg console, you could evaluate ck-list-sessions and/or os.access('/dev/rfkill', 'w')
<seb128> baptistemm, ^ I think that was for you
<pitti> argh, sorry, yes
<baptistemm> pitti, okay
<chrisccoulson> hello everyone
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson, how are you?
<chrisccoulson> hey pitti, yeah, i'm good thanks (a bit tired though)
<chrisccoulson> how are you?
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson
<seb128> had a good week end?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, it was ok thanks. did you have a good weekend too?
<seb128> quite ok
<seb128> too short
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i sometimes think that too ;)
<seb128> and I managed to hurt my neck at sport some days ago so my back is hurting now
<chrisccoulson> ouch, that's not good. i hope that gets better soon
<seb128> that's already a bit better, thanks
<seb128> \o/
<seb128> libgnome-keyring and gnome-keyring updates, upstream replied to my email and fixed most issues I listed as stopper this weekend
<seb128> the updates closes 5 lucid milestoned bugs
<seb128> which were all lucid milestoned bugs we had on those
<seb128> I started feeling uncomfortable with the new version in lucid
<didrocks> sweet \o/
 * didrocks will try to update the new clutter stack today
<seb128> didrocks, nice
<seb128> pitti, how does your shutdown hook works
<seb128> pitti, we receives bugs on random session softwares about it
<pitti> seb128: yes, I'm going to triage them in a bit
<seb128> pitti, thanks
<pitti> we probably should disable the hook again, it's now turning from a small bug fix into a project
<seb128> still curious to know what we should be doing about those
<pitti> seb128: it's called from /etc/init.d/sendsigs
<seb128> to be honest that seem rather buggy to me
<pitti> seb128: so, that script sends SIGTERM to all processes
<pitti> then waits 10 s
<pitti> and then SIGKILLs then
<pitti> the latter causes long shutdown times, and indicates hung processes
<pitti> seb128: basically, the script collects info for all pids which are still running after 10 s after SIGTERM
<seb128> why does it create long shutdown?
<pitti> because it waits 10 s for everythign to terminate
<seb128> nothing wait on ie g-s-d to be closed to shutdown does it?
<pitti> sendsigs does
<seb128> oh ok
<seb128> I always though that those, ie g-s-d were supposed to just go away when xorg is taken down
<pitti> the intention is to TERM first, so that processes have a chacne to clean up, save state, etc.
<pitti> seb128: yes, and usually they are
<seb128> ie that nothing would ever care about those being still running or not
<pitti> I don't get any hung process here except plymouth
<seb128> well we do receive bugs on those
<seb128> I'm not sure what we are supposed to do with those...
<seb128> did you just want to collect datas?
<pitti> seb128: actually, at this point in shutdown, there shouldn't be _any_ user processes left
<pitti> if you log out, g-session/X should tear them down
<seb128> right
<seb128> which is why I'm not sure what to do with those
<seb128> or how to debug
<pitti> seb128: yes, sabdfl asked me to add this to investigate long shutdown times
<pitti> seb128: it did uncover a legitimate problem with plymouth
<pitti> seb128: as I said, I'll disable it again now and then triage the bugs in a day or two
<seb128> ok thanks
<seb128> good enough for me
<seb128> thanks for the explanation, still interesting to know what's going on
<seb128> I'm still curious to know why some things are not taken down when the session close though
<seb128> I will read your comments on those bugs ;-)
<pitti> so, I don't know why those hang so often either
<seb128> I'm wondering if one reason could be crash at shutdown
<seb128> in which case apport would keep those up long enough for your script to list them
<pitti> matej     1428  0.0  1.0  90164  9896 ?        Ds   17:44   0:03 /usr/lib/gnome-settings-daemon/gnome-settings-daemon
<seb128> since usually the dumping crash part is taking over 10s
<chrisccoulson> seb128 / pitti - i'm slightly surprised that g-s-d is still around at shutdown
<pitti> seb128: here it's in "uninterruptible kernel sleep", and thus unkillable
<seb128> pitti, would it be in this state if it was in crash collecting state?
<pitti> seb128: that's a plausible cause
<pitti> yes, I think so
<seb128> k
<pitti> seb128: ah, I just got the FFE for policykit-desktop-privileges (bug 455694); do you have a minute to source-NEW it? (it's a really trivial package, just shipping a single .pkla)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 455694 in policykit-1 "FFE: Provide some policykit privileges by default on desktops" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/455694
<pitti> seb128: (to main, please; its basically moving out the policy from the udisks package, and adding two more privs)
<seb128> pitti, ok
<didrocks> pitti: I saw you recommited the last gdm changes to bzr branch in -ubuntu3 from Keybuk, but he did also some changes in -ubuntu2 out of tree too and that's not in bzr currently. Do you want me to finish this or it wasiignored on purpose?
<seb128> urg gdm, I need to look at gdmsetup and get that in today
<seb128> didrocks, or are you on that now?
<didrocks> seb128: I was jumping on it just once clutter is finished and tested enough
<seb128> ok thanks
<didrocks> now that I know that the issue should be around seteuid :)
<seb128> I'm still busy with other things
<seb128> ask pitti maybe
<pitti> didrocks: can you rebase the pending changes on top of  2.29.92-0ubuntu3?
<seb128> he can probably tell you quickly what you are doing wrong with seteuid
<pitti> since that was uploaded, bzr should have it, too
<pitti> yes, I'm happy to help out here
<didrocks> pitti: sure, but 2.29.92-0ubuntu2 is not into bzr
<didrocks> pitti: ok, I will ping you about the seteuid issue once clutter is finished :)
<pitti> hm, it is here, from RoberT?
<pitti> "bzr missing" says up to date
<didrocks> pitti: Keybuk didn't take the branch, it was an unreleased version
<seb128> pitti, no, bzr lacks an upload from keybuk
<pitti> seb128: ^ I thought I committed that
<seb128> pitti, you commited 0ubuntu3 not 0ubuntu2
<didrocks> pitti: you commited 2.29.92-0ubuntu3 content, not 2.29.92-0ubuntu2
<pitti> oh, I see
<seb128> pitti, there were 2 of those
<pitti> Robert's 2.29.92-0ubuntu2 is misisng
<didrocks> sorry for not explaining that well enough :)
<pitti> I just saw the 0ubuntu3 upload from Keybuk
<pitti> right, that'll need some untangling, to rebase Robert's changes on top of 2.29.92-0ubuntu3 and commit the 0ubuntu2 from Scott
<didrocks> pitti: robert's one is not ready to be uploaded (it contains my work too)
<didrocks> right
<pitti> didrocks: right, that should be 0ubuntu4 UNRELEASED now
<didrocks> exactly
<pitti> didrocks: so, wrt. your original question, it wasn't done on purpose
<didrocks> pitti: ok, I'll do it in the same round, the bzr history will be a little bit strange, but wellâ¦
<pitti> didrocks: let's not worry about it too much
<Keybuk> you should be able to cherry-pick the comment from the proper bzr branch that I committed to ;-)
<Keybuk> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/lucid/gdm/lucid/revision/198
<Keybuk> s/comment/commit/
<pitti> no, those are unmergeable
<Keybuk> I said cherry-pick, not merge
<pitti> Keybuk: getting the uploaded diffs isn't a problem
<pitti> it's retroactively fixing the history of the real bzr branch to match reality ;)
<Keybuk> bzr merge -c tag:2.29.92-0ubuntu2 lp:ubuntu/gdm
<pitti> erm, -r surely? there should be two commits?
<Keybuk> no, -c
<pitti> Keybuk: you don't change package and do dch -r/debcommit -r separately?
<Keybuk> I did, but it doesn't look like I pushed before the importer saw it
<Keybuk> so there's just one commit there
<pitti> ah, ok
<Keybuk> Revision ID: james.westby@ubuntu.com-20100311200642-douwocvebf20drrg
<Keybuk> that means "importer beat bzr push"
<pitti> ah, this guy james_w commits an awful lot of code these days!
 * pitti hugs james_w
<Keybuk> it's a huge shame that -desktop aren't using the lp:ubuntu/* branches :-(
<Keybuk> they work really well for everything else
<seb128> Keybuk, right, for some value of work well
<seb128> Keybuk, like having to wait half an hour to get your source
<hyperair> what's the status of hal in lucid?
<pitti> hyperair: we install it by default, but not started on boot; gnome-power-manager will use it if the system doesn't support XBACKLIGHT
<pitti> hyperair: it's dbus-activated now
<hyperair> pitti: i see. i wonder how that works with podsleuth..
<hyperair> hmm i think podsleuth relies on hal to do its polling or whatever
<hyperair> this is problematic.
<pitti> at some point we'll need something like shallow branches/light checkouts, to avoid downloading tons of uninteresting history
<Keybuk> you mean like "bzr checkout --lightweight"? :)
<pitti> that's slow
<pitti> well, it was a year ago, havent' tried it since then
<Keybuk> bzr branch lp:ubuntu/upstart  9.39s user 0.58s system 20% cpu 47.727 total
<Keybuk> bzr co --lightweight lp:ubuntu/upstart  0.72s user 0.20s system 2% cpu 38.880 total
<pitti> at some point we'll switch over, too, but it's not a priority right now
<seb128> it's really nice when upstream code is in bzr
<pitti> and we still need to honor Vcs-Bzr: for packages where the import fails (like cdbs or sysvinit)
<seb128> but otherwise it doesn't bring us a lot
<Keybuk> seb128: well, one obvious on-topic thing is brings you is that uploads by other people are automatically committed to your bzr repo
<Keybuk> and it brings us that everything in Ubuntu uses one set of repositories
<Keybuk> pitti: sysvinit has an lp:ubuntu/sysvinit branch
<pitti> that's karmic
<Keybuk> cdbs also looks like it has an lp:ubuntu/sysvinit branch
<pitti> it didn't import any lucid version
<pitti> similar to cdbs
<pitti> Keybuk: yes, but they are out of date
<pitti> $ time bzr get lp:ubuntu/gnome-panel
<pitti> real0m58.496s
<Keybuk> see, that's hardly "half an hour"
<Keybuk> and you only need do it once; ever after "bzr pull" will update it - even to new upstream versions
<pitti> well, that's only one side of the story; you have to push back orig.tar.gz's to the (slim) upstream on commit, and additionally upload the package
<pitti> that will get better once we have builds from branches
<Keybuk> pitti: no you don't, you only push back the diff between orig.tar.gz
<pitti> Keybuk: do you know how to get a new tarball into the pristine-tar bzr?
<Keybuk> pitti: merge-upstream
<pitti> last time I wondered about this, I got told "that doesn't work yet"
<pitti> oh, nice
<seb128> is there any clear documentation about what the workflow is supposed to be?
<Keybuk> bzr merge-upstream --version=1.0.0 ../foo-1.0.0.tar.gz
<seb128> and what commands to use while doing an update
<Keybuk> seb128: yes, plenty on the distributed development wiki pages
<seb128> Keybuk, plenty is the issue, we need something clear everybody follows, not a zillion of different ways
<Keybuk> that's precisely my point
<Keybuk> this is a single way that everyone should be following
<seb128> we fail at communicating it properly though
<didrocks> no really, when upstream has a bzr branch, we should use bzr merge-upstream --version=1.0.0 ../foo-1.0.0.tar.gz ../foo
<seb128> which leads to people not using it
<Keybuk> didrocks: it usually figures that last bit out itself
<didrocks> so, not sure about what differences are involved between the two "modes"
<didrocks> Keybuk: oh really? should have a try then :)
<seb128> the true way seems to change every second month
<Keybuk> seb128: I think yours is the only team that isn't using this
<Keybuk> and it hasn't changed design in a long time
<Keybuk> there's been plenty of UDS demos and sessions about it
<seb128> Keybuk, I'm sure you will find plenty of people not using what you described
<Keybuk> (assuming we don't count kernel for a moment)
<seb128> most people still just upload
<seb128> and don't use bzr
<Keybuk> sure, and the great thing about the UDD work is that it doesn't matter if they do!
<seb128> $ time bzr get lp:ubuntu/gdm
<seb128> \  28805KB   122KB/s | Fetching revisions:Inserting stream
<seb128> still running...
<seb128> it takes me like 30 seconds to apt-get it or get the ubuntu-desktop bzr
<Keybuk> and it takes you what, a minute to bzr get it?
<Keybuk> and you only need to bzr get once
<seb128> no
<seb128> it's running for over 5 minutes now
<seb128> and still running
<ogra> grrr
<seb128> it's already 10 times slower
 * ogra whacks gnome-terminal
<seb128> and still going
<ogra> hum ... seems it is not gnome-terminal that makes my desktop stuck with the currently focused app :/
 * ogra cant alt-tab anymore and the mouse constantly stays as text cursor
<Keybuk> even if it was 10 times slower, that'd be only 5 minutes to branch - which is hardly forever
<ogra> i cant click on anything either
<Keybuk> anyway, I give up
<Keybuk> you're clearly not interested
<Keybuk> if you don't want to use your colleague's work, that's your business ;-)
<ogra> ~/.xsession-errors shows a lot of glib messages every time i alt-tab or click on something
<Keybuk> but don't complain when the rest of us do
<Keybuk> and it causes more work for you
<pitti> well, I think we'll migrate eventually, but not in one big leap
<seb128> Keybuk, you are not being constructive there
<pitti> first, we'd loose the history from existing bzr, and second it's still too painful for some packages
<pitti> dropping vcs-bzr: one by one seems fine
<seb128> Keybuk, not respecting the vcs being used and not caring about other people workflow is not constructive
<seb128> real	6m58.771s
<pitti> but right now it is a huge regression in performance, so we don't just want to throw away an established workflow wholesale for little benefit
<seb128> to get gdm bzr there
<seb128> Keybuk, we are interested by what is making job easier
<pitti> (as I said, throwing it away piece by piece is fine)
<seb128> not harder
<Keybuk> your unique branches, in which you don't even have buildable or editable source is harder for me
<seb128> bzr bd-do and you are there
<seb128> it's not that hard
<Keybuk> using james_w's work isn't hard either
<seb128> no, but there is no reason everybody should not make efforts
<seb128> we will slightly get there and use the common workflow
<seb128> but meanwhile you can try to be nice citizen when touching something not converted yet
<Keybuk> I do generally try to
<Keybuk> but will frequently fail
<seb128> and we will frequently drop your changes :-(
<Keybuk> and I will frequently complain to your line manager when you do
<seb128> well you can, but you are the one at fail
<pitti> I still get a lot of bad merge requests against apport, too, so I feel your pain
<Keybuk> sorry, I don't agree
<seb128> debcheckout get you the right source
<Keybuk> if you upload, and find a version already there
<Keybuk> then you have no excuse for dropping changes
<Keybuk> ever
<pitti> but right now there's no way around having Vcs-Bzr: still, I'm afraid
<Keybuk> except bloody mindedness
<seb128> right, when we do it it's not on purpose
<Keybuk> yes you do
<Keybuk> every time
<pitti> drop changes> uh, did we?
<Keybuk> and you know it
<seb128> when?
<pitti> except for the gdm ubuntu2 upload which I just missed (just committed ubuntu3)
<seb128> we did merge your gdm changes in our bzr
<seb128> I don't think every time is fair
<Keybuk> debcheckout -> doesn't do lp:ubuntu/*
<seb128> we should fix that
<pitti> only if it can also validate that the branch is current
<pitti> (which sohuldn't be a problem with rmadison)
<pitti> but would be nice to have, indeed
<Laney> make it a different tool, please
<Laney> ubucheckout
<Keybuk> Laney: it's from a debian source package
<Keybuk> and is a common tool between Debian and Ubuntu
<ogra_> hulp !
<Laney> I know, and I often use it to get Debian packaging branches
<Laney> if it starts pulling from LP then it will break my workflow
<ogra_> i seem to hit a heavy glib bug where i cant get my focus out of a running app
<seb128> Laney, well it's your issue
<seb128> Laney, seems normal that on ubuntu it pulls the ubuntu source
<seb128> Laney, that's what most people working on ubuntu want usually
<Laney> it seems normal that it pulls the branch defined in the control file to me
<seb128> Laney, you should be using a flag telling to use the debian vcs if you want that
<seb128> Laney, out of the fact that we don't specify canonical bzr locations there
<seb128> we would have to change every source package for nothing
<Laney> indeed, that's why I think it should be a separate mode
<seb128> I think it should be default
<seb128> with an option to turn it off
<seb128> the default should be what makes sense on ubuntu
<pitti> and at one point we'll hopefully have the entire archive in bzr, so that we can stop worrying
<seb128> pitti, well that doesn't fix Laney's usecase to not want to ubuntu source but the debian one
<pitti> seb128: I meant we wouldn't need debcheckout any more
<Laney> debcheckout -> get from Debian, bzr get -> get from LP
<seb128> right
<Laney> that's my workflow
<seb128> bzr get what?
<Laney> whatever is appropriate
<Laney> not getting into your argument ;)
<seb128> well that's the interest of debcheckout
<seb128> to not have to specify that
<seb128> or to figure what it is
<seb128> right now that should be first the control Vcs if one
<seb128> and if there is none default to the canonical location
<Laney> and ignore it if it's not LP?
<seb128> no
<seb128> when merging with debian you should rename the Vcs if that's not the one used for Ubuntu
<seb128> or drop it
<Keybuk> or right
<Keybuk> I remember now
<Keybuk> (was just browsing my history for why I wasn't using the right gdm branch in the first place)
 * ogra_ curses
<Keybuk> quest tmp% debcheckout gdm
<Keybuk> declared bzr repository at https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/gdm/ubuntu
<Keybuk> bzr branch https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/gdm/ubuntu gdm ...
<Keybuk> bzr: ERROR: Invalid http response for https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/gdm/ubuntu/.bzr/branch-format: Unable to handle http code 405: expected 200 or 404 for full response.
<Keybuk> checkout failed (the command above returned a non-zero exit code)
<Keybuk> --
<Keybuk> I tried
<Keybuk> and when I got that, I checked whether there was an lp:ubuntu/gdm with the right version
<Keybuk> and assumed (not unreasonably) that you must have switched and forgotten to update the header
<Keybuk> and that's why I used the lp:ubuntu/gdm branch
<Keybuk> and since it was already checked out in my lucid folder, I've just used "bzr pull" ever since
<seb128> k
<seb128> we will revisit things next cycle
<seb128> but now we have other issues to work on for lucid
<chrisccoulson> on the subject of bzr....
<chrisccoulson> some of our desktop branches are out of date this morning after the breakage at the weekend
<chrisccoulson> so, people might want to remember that :-)
<pitti> *nod*
<pitti> seb128, kenvandine: I think the first vcs-bzr: that we should drop are the indicator related ones
<pitti> they already have full source in bzr, thus using lp:ubuntu/pkgname isn't any different wrt. working with the package
<seb128> pitti, right, we did that already for some
<seb128> I'm doing that on the way when doing an update and not in a hurry to get things done before freeze or end of day or whatever
<pitti> *nod*
<seb128> ie indicator-sound, ido etc are already managed this way
<seb128> it really makes sense for those with upstream in bzr
<seb128> and the sources are small enough
<pitti> seb128: do you know when gnome 2.30 freezes?
<pitti> i. e. until when we can get bug fixes in?
<seb128> pitti, "freezes"?
<seb128> one week ago
<pitti> ah, ok
<seb128> it's code frozen for a week
<seb128> you can ask for freeze breaks if required though
<pitti> ok, thanks
<ogra> help ! glib and gdk are freaking out on me, i'm 100% stuck in the first app i start after X comes up, .xsession-errors shows gobject_unref assertion errors and gdk_window_get_events errors ... i cant file a bug because i cant get focus on the browser ubuntu-bug brings up
<pitti> ogra: on arm?
<ogra> pitti, on my laptop
<ogra> it worked over the whole weekend, just started that behavior 1h ago, i rebooted several times already (after restarting X several times before)
<pitti> what changed an hour ago? dist-upgrade?
<ogra> i didnt upgrade or anything so the system is in the same state that worked the last days
<ogra> i didnt do *anything*  special ... three terminals, browser, xchat and evo were open when it started
<ogra> it seems to be a heavy issue with glib or gdk
<ogra> seems gdk windows arent recognized as windows anymore if i read the errors right
<ogra> nor does gobject_ref or _unref work
<asac_> ogra: sure you rebooted before today?
<pitti> ogra: you don't happen to have a PPA with client-side decorations still running or so?
<asac_> he is gone ;)
<didrocks> seb128: so, new clutter 1.2.x needs new clutter-gtk (ok, we had a released last week). This one use gobject-introspect and build-dep on gir1.0-gtk-2.0. But this one is an old version of gir-repository and needs a new one (2.19.5, so I assume directly from gtk source). So, if we want the new clutter version, I can split the gtk package or build without introspection
<ogra> pitti, if i bring up a terminal after boot, i cant even move it :/
<pitti> ogra: you don't happen to have a PPA with client-side decorations still running or so?
<ogra> nope
<pitti> ogra: try creating a new user or launch a guest session?
<LaserJock> didrocks: hi, how was your weekend?
<pitti> ogra: or metacity --replace
<ogra> pitti, already done, its not the WM
<pitti> ogra: (or compiz --replace if you are already running metacity)
<didrocks> LaserJock: good, thanks, with at least a spring weather now :) Yours?
<pitti> ogra: we had a fair bit of fallout over the weekend due to some mis-built nautilus/gnome-panel/etc.; you are on lucid current?
<LaserJock> didrocks: sunny and very warm this weekend in Boston
<ogra> pitti, i am, but the last time i upgraded was friday
<tseliot> pitti: the fglrx binaries still don't seem to be in the archive, can you approve them, please?
<asac_> ogra: just dist-upgrade ... just in case
<ogra> pitti, and the system behaved until today
<asac_> it cant get worse for you i figure ;)
<ogra> heh, yeah, i guess so
<pitti> tseliot: yep, looking
<tseliot> thanks
<tseliot> pitti: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/fglrx-installer/2:8.721-0ubuntu4/+build/1571790
<pitti> tseliot: so those were renamed?
<pitti> tseliot: what was the rationale for the renaming, especially that late in the cycle?
<LaserJock> didrocks: I was thinking last night, do you think it'd be possible to do some sort of UNE Hug Day before Beta 2 gets here? Would that be useful at this stage?
<tseliot> pitti: yes, to be consistent with nvidia
<pitti> tseliot: and they don't build a transitional package, so I'm a bit worried about accepting that now
<tseliot> pitti: would you like me to update a new version with the transitional packages before you approve them?
<pitti> tseliot: that'd be better I think
<pitti> tseliot: or just keep the name as it is :)
<didrocks> LaserJock: right, we discussed that with seb128 at Portland. I guess that can be the right time now that we know/handle the bugs that can be interested. I just have to finish updating the clutter stack (I hope today, but it's getting a little bit more fuzzy) as it can have some impact, first
<tseliot> pitti: that would be a bit confusing as upstream is using those names now
<ogra> hmm, the upgrade only gets me keyring, libc and init stuff
<pitti> tseliot: for packages?
<tseliot> pitti: yes, as we share the same source, and I maintain both
<pitti> tseliot: anyway, if it gets transitional packages, it's fine for me
<tseliot> ok
<LaserJock> didrocks: I noticed that netbook-launcher has something like 20 New bugs, I guess it would be good to get those all triaged
<pitti> tseliot: we also need to update jockey then, I figure
<tseliot> pitti: yes, of course, it's on my TODO list
<pitti> tseliot: ok, please let me know when you uploaded, then I'll wave them through
<didrocks> LaserJock: oh really? I tried to triage day-to-day them since I subscribed. But as I triaged at first shot more than 300 bugs, I can have miss some :)
 * pitti lunches
<didrocks> pitti: enjoy
<tseliot> pitti: uploaded
<seb128> re
<seb128> didrocks, sorry I was at lunch
<didrocks> seb128: no pb, take your time :)
<seb128> didrocks, clutter, I would keep doing what we do now
<seb128> ie don't build with introspection
<ogra> pitti, guest session works ... *whine* i dont want to lose my settings :(
<LaserJock> ogra: obviously you need a registry cleaner ;p
<didrocks> seb128: clutter-gtk is using introspection
<ogra> haha
<seb128> didrocks, optional?
<LaserJock> ogra: I'll sell you one for just $19.95
<didrocks> seb128: I don't understand what means optional in that case, it build-deps on the gir-* package and it's a flag in configure turned on
<ogra> LaserJock, i could also just say "ubuntu is so apple like now, we only support single tasking" :P
<LaserJock> lol
<ogra> oh my, the default fonts look horrible ...
<seb128> didrocks, ok, it's not clear to me, are those using gir now?
<seb128> didrocks, it do you want to turn that on?
<ogra> everything is so huge suddenly
<ogra> pitti, rm -rf .gconf helped
<didrocks> seb128: it's using gir already
<seb128> didrocks, or is that just that the requirement bump require the gtk version?
<seb128> ok so it requires a newest gir than the gir one?
<seb128> ie to build from gtk?
<seb128> didrocks, what is your opinion about that?
<didrocks> seb128: I guess the bump is just for gtk, but I don't know if "gtk gir" file has changed too. I'm not sure how you can test this
<seb128> didrocks, right, well basically it means we should build the gtk gir from gtk now
<didrocks> seb128: right, that's what I was proposing to you, I can handle this if we still want to build with introspection
<Keybuk> pitti: #udev reminds me that I saw people complaining about a ConsoleKit issue last week/over the weekend?
<Keybuk> did you see anything about that?
<ogra> argh
<ogra> didnt really work out seems its still partially there
<chrisccoulson> Keybuk - i mentioned a consolekit issue last week, and your name was mentioned there
<chrisccoulson> that might have been what you remember
<Keybuk> can you remember more about what you mentioned?
<chrisccoulson> Keybuk - a couple of times when I booted last week, consolekit was unable to determine what the active VT was
<chrisccoulson> and it was throwing out errors like this:
<chrisccoulson>  WARNING: Error waiting for native console 5 activation: Invalid argument
<ogra> ok, it got wose now ... seems alt-F4 suddenly suspends my machine
<chrisccoulson> Keybuk - that error is a result of "ioctl (console_fd, VT_WAITACTIVE, num);" failing with EINVAL
<Keybuk> right
<Keybuk> but why is consolekit using that ioctl?
<Keybuk> that's only used when you switch VT
<chrisccoulson> Keybuk - it spawns a thread for each VT, which waits for it to become active
<chrisccoulson> so it can track where the active one is
<Keybuk> ok
<Keybuk> it'll fail with -EINVAL for a short period during boot
<Keybuk> does it correctly back-off from that, and restart the thread again later?
<Keybuk> (if it goes into an infinite loop, that's not good either)
<chrisccoulson> Keybuk - no, that's probably the issue really. once it has failed, it just gives up
<Keybuk> yeah
<chrisccoulson> so, we probably need to fix consolekit then?
<Keybuk> we caused X to have the same bug
<chrisccoulson> ah, ok. that makes sense. and that explains why i can't recreate it all the time
<Keybuk> you get -EINVAL from VT_WAITACTIVE in a very specific condition
<Keybuk> the current foreground VT is in KD_GRAPHICS mode, but also VT_AUTO
<Keybuk> ie. it's been left with painted graphics ... but no process running on it
<Keybuk> since it's in graphics mode, the kernel prohibits VT switches
 * ogra wonders if Keybuk's recent changes to plymouth cause his laptop to suspend on console switching 
<Keybuk> can you guess when that condition is true?
<Keybuk> ogra: doubtful
<chrisccoulson> do you know how long it's in that condition for?
<Keybuk> chrisccoulson: however long the X server takes to start ;-)
<Keybuk> couple of seconds usually
<asac_> good news is that i was able to boot with system clock reset to 0 ... and mountall didnt loop ;)
<chrisccoulson> oh, right. that seems obvious now :)
<asac_> thanks for that!
<chrisccoulson> Keybuk - so the window is quite large then (and I think consolekit is activated after GDM starts isn't it?)
<chrisccoulson> i think gdm is the first thing to use it anyway
<ogra> asac_, btw, the workaround trick is to edit /lib/init/fstab in case it shows up again ... :)
<ogra> asac_, i meant to tell you earlier
<Keybuk> chrisccoulson: gdm activates it
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i thought so
<Keybuk> which means it's activated "before X starts or while X is starting"
<chrisccoulson> thanks
<Keybuk> ie. exactly in that window
<asac_> ogra: i really hope its fixed now ;)
<Keybuk> chrisccoulson: so, on the VT_WAITACTIVE+VT_AUTO thing ... you could kinda argue it's a kernel bug
<Keybuk> because the kernel bug should deal with that case on its own
<Keybuk> but the kernel guys will tell you that the whole VT_* stuff is a mess, and they'd rather leave it alone
<chrisccoulson> yeah, it might be easier to work around it in consolekit for now
<Keybuk> exactly
<Keybuk> "for now" isn't really appropriate here
<Keybuk> I suspect the kernel VT layer will never get fixed
<chrisccoulson> i'll open a consolekit bug anyway
<Keybuk> instead we'll just end up (in a thousand years) using wayland to manage the console, with VTE for "terminal" and switching between that and windows effortlessly
<Keybuk> right
<Keybuk> I mean consolekit will have to work around it forever
<Keybuk> as the point at which the problem goes away is the point we also wouldn't need consolekit
<Keybuk> http://lkml.indiana.edu/hypermail/linux/kernel/0907.0/00733.html
<Keybuk> ^ interesting
<chrisccoulson> thanks, i'll have a read of that later ;)
<Keybuk> our kernel appears to have VT_WAITEVENT support
<Keybuk> struct vt_event {
<Keybuk>         unsigned int event;
<Keybuk> #define VT_EVENT_SWITCH         0x0001  /* Console switch */
<Keybuk> #define VT_EVENT_BLANK          0x0002  /* Screen blank */
<Keybuk> #define VT_EVENT_UNBLANK        0x0004  /* Screen unblank */
<Keybuk> #define VT_EVENT_RESIZE         0x0008  /* Resize display */
<Keybuk> #define VT_MAX_EVENT            0x000F
<Keybuk>         unsigned int oldev;             /* Old console */
<Keybuk>         unsigned int newev;             /* New console (if changing) */
<Keybuk>         unsigned int pad[4];            /* Padding for expansion */
<Keybuk> };
<Keybuk> #define VT_WAITEVENT    0x560E  /* Wait for an event */
<Keybuk> dunno if that's any better, mind you
<pitti> ogra, Keybuk: suspend-on-VT-switch is bug 515465; I just committed the fix upstream, FYI
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 515465 in gnome-power-manager "suspends when switching VTs when lid is closed" [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/515465
<pitti> ogra: well, at least it's very probable that this is what you see as well?
<ogra> pitti, btw, back to normal here, seems it was somehow related to the USB hub in my monitor, detaching everything from the laptop made everything work again
 * ogra checks the bug
<baptistemm> can someone have a look to 534702 ? I would like to have it to be tested quickly
<pitti> ogra: fun; that should have left some traces in kern.log/dmesg?
<ogra> pitti, nothing at all
<chrisccoulson> bug 534702
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 534702 in bluez "Update bluez to 4.62" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/534702
<ogra> the only thing i saw were the ton of glib and gdk erros in ~/.xsession-errors
<chrisccoulson> baptistemm, oh, i probably can't help you there ;)
<ogra> pitti, bug is identical, lid also closed here
<pitti> ogra: ok, fine
 * ogra clicks the me too link :)
<pitti> ogra: don't worry, it'll land in lucid :) I just got it upstream
<ogra> uhm, since resetting my gconf setup the notification fonts got very very small
<baptistemm> chrisccoulson, I reported upstream for bug 532101
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 532101 in gnome-user-share ""You can receive files over Bluetooth into this folder" always visible on XDG_DOWNLOAD_DIR folder, even without a Bluetooth device" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/532101
<chrisccoulson> ogra - do people actually use that link? i thought everybody just posted comments like "+1, please fix it now else I'll go back to windows"
<chrisccoulson> baptistemm, thanks
<chrisccoulson> that's on my list of things to fix, but it's quite far down the list at the moment
<ogra> chrisccoulson, i'm annoyed be people doing that on my bugs so i usually try to be a good example and use the link :)
<chrisccoulson> baptistemm, i suspect it will turn in to some weekend hacking ;)
<chrisccoulson> ogra - yeah, i get annoyed by that too
<ogra> though in ARM land i rarely even get me-too's :)
<chrisccoulson> heh
<ogra> just move your work focus ;)
<baptistemm> chrisccoulson, yeah, some check is required like using some gnome-bluetooth API
<chrisccoulson> baptistemm, yeah, i took a look at it a couple of weekends ago
<chrisccoulson> i think i know what i need to do with it now, i just need to actually sit down and implement it
<baptistemm> I don't understand if the bug is also about the presence of the bar always and a way to discard it
<chrisccoulson> baptistemm, the complex part is that it also displays for webdav too
<baptistemm> oh true ...
<chrisccoulson> so, we need an ubuntu-specific part to hide that when apache is not installed, to match the other UI change i did
<chrisccoulson> pitti - did you see hughsie's response to https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=613509 ?
<ubottu> Gnome bug 613509 in general "Switch "Shut Down" to "Switch Off" and "Suspend" to "Sleep"" [Trivial,Assigned]
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I didn't, no
<chrisccoulson> i get the impression that we might have upset him a bit. i hope not though
 * pitti reads
<pitti> chrisccoulson: TBH, I agree to him, though
<pitti> this change completely broke translations
<chrisccoulson> yeah, me too
<pitti> until the weekend I had "Ruhe" and "Ruhezustand"
<pitti> impossible to tell which is which
<pitti> "Zustand" == "state"
<chrisccoulson> ah
<pitti> i. e. something like "suspend" and "suspend state"
<pitti> and it was really late for such string changes to happen
<chrisccoulson> yeah, that's a bit weird to see ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, the switch off change has been undone btw
<seb128> not sure if you did follow those
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - thanks. i didn't notice that yet, but i've not upgraded since we unfroze on friday
 * seb128 clears
<chrisccoulson> i should probably upgrade now really
<seb128> ups
<pitti> right, I have the old names back again
<seb128> the string was too british apparently
<ogra> hmm, was the middle click on the windowlist disabled on purpose ? i cant move apps around in it
<seb128> pitti, well suspend has not been switched back I think
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - ah, i was just about to ask that
<pitti> seb128: well, I only see the German translation, and they are fixed again
<chrisccoulson> that's what hughsie has an issue with
<seb128> pitti, we got a langpack update today
<pitti> i. e. "Ruhe" (the new and wrong name for suspend) is back to "Bereitschaft"
<pitti> seb128: perhaps it's that
<seb128> that's the design team for you
<seb128> deciding on wording changes for things nobody has issue with after freeze
<pitti> hm, we keep telling them that string changes are expensive and painful..
<seb128> which leads to extra work and discussions for no real win
<ogra> pitti, well, it wasnt *that* wrong, RB surely stops playing when you suspend :P
<seb128> right
<pitti> ogra: heh
<pitti> ogra: but "Ruhe" vs. "Ruhezustand"??
<ogra> zustand ... heh
<ogra> i like "bereitschaft"
<pitti> not that I think that the German translation was particularly clever
<seb128> rickspencer3, hey
<pitti> rickspencer3: good morning
<rickspencer3> hi seb128, pitti good morning
<pitti> seb128: (too busy for the source NEW? I'll find someone else)
<ogra> pitti, there are particular german words that cause bad pictures in my brain ... "wohnhaft" makes me think of jails :)
<seb128> rickspencer3, did you have a good weekend?
<rickspencer3> seb128, yes, quite nice
<rickspencer3> seb128, you?
<seb128> rickspencer3, quite good too though a bit short, thank you
<didrocks> hey rickspencer3
<kenvandine> good morning rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> hi didrocks
<rickspencer3> hi kenvandine
<kenvandine> dpm, i merged all those fixes from the translation team, you guys rock!
<seb128> seems kenvandine just show up to say hello to rickspencer3 ;-)
<rickspencer3> hehe
<seb128> kenvandine, we are important enough people to say hello to before rick joins right? ;-)
<rickspencer3> he's got "good morning rickspencer3" wired into a bot
<kenvandine> hehe
 * kenvandine just looked at irc
<kenvandine> seb128, you always preach about pushing updates on a friday... and we got bit :/
<seb128> I'm a bit annoyed about that yes
<kenvandine> none of us were happy late friday night :/
<seb128> I tried for most of friday to tell people to not unfreeze on friday evening especially when it was clear we were not going to respin
<seb128> ie to unfreeze early in the afternoon
<kenvandine> i could just hear you saying i told you so
<seb128> lol
<kenvandine> :)
<dpm> kenvandine, awesome, thanks Ken!
<kenvandine> dpm, no problem.. keep them coming!
<kenvandine> :)
<seb128> I think it's clearly stupid but other people seem to think it's a non issue
<dpm> sure ;)
<seb128> *shrug*
<seb128> anyway it happened after I went to bed and was fixed by time I read my email on saturday
<seb128> I'm just sorry for the people who had to spend friday night or saturday morning fixing that
<rickspencer3> kenvandine,  seb128, are you referring to "no panels" bug?
<seb128> rickspencer3, it was not only gnome-panel, also nautilus, etc
<seb128> rickspencer3, but yes
 * pitti blushes
<seb128> rickspencer3, to the "upgrade after beta1 breaks GNOME for every user letting an empty background after login"
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, yeah... it was bad :)
<seb128> pitti, we all do bugs not blaming you there
<rickspencer3> no blame to be had
<seb128> I'm unhappy about freeze handling though, I've been trying to push people to unfreeze for the whole friday afternoon to avoid that
<pitti> oh, it's not that I feel bad enough to quit and shoot myself or so :)
<pitti> sh*t happens
<pitti> and it's all good now
<rickspencer3> it was not catastrophic, and that's why we have betas and such
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, one piece of feedback that we might want to respond to is about gwibber start time
<seb128> rickspencer3, still I would like to have a discussion about unfreezing on friday evening
<pitti> it was my secret plan to ensure that everyone relaxes on that weekend instead of using computers :-P
<seb128> rickspencer3, what would be the best way to bring that for discussion?
<seb128> I tried on IRC but failed
<pitti> seb128: I can bring it up in the next release meeting
<rickspencer3> seb128, I guess that would be with the release manager
<seb128> pitti, I would appreciate than you
<seb128> thank
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, ryan and i both spent some time looking at start time this weekend
<kenvandine> it will get a little better when one of the existing desktopcouch bugs gets fixed
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, the biggest hit is desktopcouch startup time
<kenvandine> some of it is UI startup, which can be improved but not this cycle
<didrocks> seb128: rickspencer3: as told previously, we tried to discuss it with chrisccoulson and cjwatson on Saturday, but not sure that a solution or process has been decided at the end
<seb128> didrocks, I will read the IRC logs later
<didrocks> seb128: around 1 PM IIRC
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, one thing we will do now that improves it some is db size
<chrisccoulson> heh, friday night was "interesting"
<LaserJock> kenvandine: is there a particular reason gwibber uses desktopcouch over traditional config files?
<kenvandine> we now automatically compact the db, and are more efficient at storage
<kenvandine> but we are also going to be cleaning the messages db, so we don't store an infinite amount of messages
<kenvandine> LaserJock, one reason is sync, but there are quite a few nice things we get from it
<kenvandine> including events, so when new messages are inserted into the database we trigger events like notifications, indicators, etc
<kenvandine> ripped a bunch of buggy code out of gwibber :)
<tseliot> pitti: approved?
<kenvandine> LaserJock, and desktopcouch is very nice to work with
<pitti> tseliot: last time I looked it was still waiting on the amd64 build; I'll have a look soon
<tseliot> pitti: thanks
<kenvandine> if we make the db size more reasonable, it will be a bit faster... we just need dc to start faster too
<LaserJock> kenvandine: would it be possible (in the sense of being resonable) to have a non-couchdb backend?
<kenvandine> LaserJock, not without a major overhaul again... the gwibber internals depend on couch
<LaserJock> interesting
<kenvandine> we use couch for a ton of stuff, not just storage
<kenvandine> couch made gwibber considerably simpler
<LaserJock> I see
<kenvandine> since the last release, we have made our usage of couch more effecient
<kenvandine> like we found we were storing redundant data, that is fixed
<LaserJock> ah
<kenvandine> and automatic compaction
<kenvandine> db size will be considerably smaller
<LaserJock> I've noticed that the messages db is ~ 70MB for me and gwibber is using about that much RAM
<kenvandine> LaserJock, the RAM usage is relatively recent bug, it is a desktopcouch/dbus bug
<kenvandine> they are trying to figure that out
<LaserJock> it often annoys me that messaging apps are often the most resource hungry applications I run
<kenvandine> we have been profiling it very closely, the rule has been to keep the backend down to below 15M on x86 and 30M on x86_64
<kenvandine> which until about two weeks ago, maybe 3 weeks ago... the service never topped that
<kenvandine> which is a huge improvement compared to 2.0 :)
<kenvandine> which was more like 700M :)
<kenvandine> anyway, the desktopcouch guys are working on that bug
<LaserJock> yeah, hopefully that works out
<seb128> pitti, policykit-desktop-privileges accepted btw
<pitti> seb128: \o/ cheers
<kenvandine> just a call to CouchDatabase in python grows RSS footprint by 64M, before that bug it was about 400K
<seb128> np
<LaserJock> so far I've been very unimpressed with desktopcouch/couchdb but I'm willing to be a little patient for them to work stuff out
 * kenvandine has been very impressed, it makes so many things simple... it is really nice for an app developer
<LaserJock> yeah, from what I've seen of examples it looks like it's great for developers
<kenvandine> LaserJock, we just need to get implementations right
<kenvandine> which i think we are close to in gwibber
<kenvandine> it was a learning experience
<LaserJock> sure
<kenvandine> but the tweaks we have made in the past week will make it significantly more effecient
<kenvandine> my gwibber-messages db was 418M
<kenvandine> now 78M
<LaserJock> but gwibber feels like a giant "learning experience", hopefully your hard work will help it mature
<kenvandine> and when we start to purge old message data, it will get much smaller than that
<LaserJock> yeah, I noticed that there was no option to set how many messages to keep
<Ng> heh, my gwibber_messages is 211MB and my gwibber process is 729MB virt, 211MB RSS ;)
<Ng> doesn't bother me with 4GB though, and I'm sure it'll get sorted :)
<LaserJock> I've got 1GB
<LaserJock> and it's the largest single user of RAM
<LaserJock> which seems odd for a "peripheral" application
<Ng> my firefox makes it look insignificant ;)
<kenvandine> Ng, gwibber or gwibber-service?
<kenvandine> gwibber-service should be no where near 211M RSS
<Ng> kenvandine: gwibber. gwibber service is 422MB/48MB
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> whew
<pitti> tseliot: accepted
<kenvandine> that is the one we are most concerned with
<kenvandine> the client will be heavier because it has the UI stuff and webkit
<kenvandine> and hopefully people will close it :)
<Ng> yeah I never close it :D
<LaserJock> why would I close it?
<Ng> I run like 4 apps and I never close them
<kenvandine> LaserJock, you only need it open when you are looking at it :)
 * kenvandine always keeps it closed
<LaserJock> I look at it all the time
<kenvandine> i follow too many people to look at it all the time
<LaserJock> you know, what's the point of having a messaging service if you never read the messages :-)
<kenvandine> i skim it from time to time
<tseliot> pitti: thanks a lot
<Ng> I sometimes find it a little odd that -service notifies my of a reply, but the GUI doesn't show it yet
<LaserJock> the UI is so slow, I can't imagine reopening it every time
<Ng> yeah that does take a while to start
<kenvandine> LaserJock, how slow is it to start?  if the backend is running, mine is usually about 2 or 3 seconds
<kenvandine> unless firefox and evolution are grinding my laptop to a halt... then it can be a little slower
<LaserJock> I just counted 18s
<kenvandine> yikes!
<Ng> kenvandine: say, the entries I get in the message notifier when people have @'d me on identi.ca - those should be cleared when I focus gwibber because I have a Replies stream visible and I don't really want to go and click on 10 menu entries to clear them :)
<kenvandine> and the backend was running?
<LaserJock> kenvandine: I think so
<kenvandine> did you Gwibber-Quit or close?
<kenvandine> gwibber->quit in the menu quits the backend too
<kenvandine> but even with that, it i have never seen it at 18s
<LaserJock> no, just the close button
<LaserJock> gwibber-service is still running
<Ng> closing the gwibber window (leaving gwibber-service running), then picking Broadcast from the messages menu produced a 7s load time, and that was the second time I tried it, so any cache involved should have been warm
<kenvandine> i just did it 3 times, each was no more than 2s
<kenvandine> humm
<kenvandine> i wonder if it is because my db is much leaner and meaner now :)
<kenvandine> lets see how fast it is for you guys after the next release
<kiko> hi there
<LaserJock> how big is your db?
<kenvandine> mine is 78M
<kenvandine> but compacted
<LaserJock> mine is 68MB
<kenvandine> so mine just has more messages, i think your's is still going to have more overhead because of the extra data and revisions
<Ng> when will the new release land? :D
<kenvandine> Ng, i hope mid week
<Ng> groovy
<Ng> where should I file a bug about the broadcast entries in the message notification menu?
<LaserJock> kenvandine: after the initial 18s one, I get consistent 12s start times
<kenvandine> against the gwibber package
<Ng> ok, thanks
<kenvandine> LaserJock, that is way too slow
<LaserJock> it's about as fast is OO.o or FF
<LaserJock> kenvandine: after killing gwibber-service (File-> Quit) start up time is ~ 55s
<LaserJock> that's why I start it once at the beginning of the day and leav it
<kenvandine> LaserJock, what kind of hardware?
<kenvandine> it isn't that slow for me on my slow netbook :/
<LaserJock> acer aspire one
<kiko> hey
<kenvandine> does it trash your CPU when it is doing that?
<kiko> how do I mark lucid regressions?
<kiko> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-power-manager/+bug/538636
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 538636 in gnome-power-manager "gnome power manager applet not appearing consistently" [Undecided,New]
<kiko> this one is absolutely a lucid regression
<kenvandine> LaserJock, oh, that is a netbook huh?
<kenvandine> LaserJock, with SSD?
<LaserJock> kenvandine: no SSD
<LaserJock> it is a netbook
<kenvandine> ok, humm
<LaserJock> it's using a lot of CPU
<LaserJock> is beam.smp related to gwibber?
<kenvandine> that is desktopcouch
<LaserJock> that uses a lot of CPU
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> i bet the new release will fix it quite a bit
<seb128> kiko, which one?
<LaserJock> my load average was around 0.7 or so
<kenvandine> LaserJock, a couple people had beam.smp thrashing CPU at startup and it seemed to be related to they extra data we were storing
<LaserJock> but I know for sure gwibber takes a lot more time than Chromium for instance
<seb128> kiko, ignore that question, just reading log
<LaserJock> longer than OO.o I think as well
<kenvandine> LaserJock, that makes me sad... :/
<kenvandine> lets hope it gets fixed :)
<kenvandine> starting gwibber cold on my classmate is 12s
<kenvandine> so no service and no couch running
<kenvandine> but only one account configured on it
<LaserJock> kenvandine: it's not totally swamping the CPU, but there are a lot of processes all using a fair amount
<LaserJock> I have 1 twitter and 1 identi.ca account
<kenvandine> lets hope we can get yours in that ballpark :)
<LaserJock> I tried Facebook but that was just too much
<LaserJock> ok, I look forward to trying the new release and I'll let you know if that improves things
<pitti> kenvandine: is there a known bug that I have g-p-m icon twice in the panel? One is actually gdm, the other does nothing on left click and gives me a standard applet menu on right click; "about" says "notification field 2.29.92.1", (c) 2002 Red Hat
<seb128> pitti, another instance of this display bug?
<LaserJock> kenvandine: Chromium takes 6 s and OO.o takes 11s, for reference
<kenvandine> pitti, i haven't seen that... no
<seb128> pitti, there is a "known" bug happening randomly where notification area of other applets get randomly wrongly displayed
<pitti> seb128: sounds plausible
<seb128> chrisccoulson get it quite often apparently
<pitti> killall gnome-panel usually "fixes" it, but it happens randomly
<pitti> oh
<chrisccoulson> yes, i get that frequently
<pitti> I think it might have been network-manager
<chrisccoulson> pitti - that's the same bug which affects nm-applet
<chrisccoulson> yes
<pitti> (what it actually should have displayed)
<chrisccoulson> i've really got no idea how to debug this one at the moment
<seb128> chrisccoulson, pitti: do you have any opinion on screen locking in indicator-session?
<seb128> ted change it to be "start screensaver" now
<seb128> in case where screensaver doesn't automatic lock the screen
<pitti> hmm
<seb128> I'm leaning toward undoing the change for lucid
<pitti> couldn't it actually just lock the screen?
<pitti> that seems much more useful to me
<chrisccoulson> i thought it did actually just lock the screen
<seb128> it could, but they argue that if you don't autolock on screensaver you might not know your password
<seb128> and that users are using it as a "running away from the screen"
<pitti> YAFIYGI?
<seb128> not as a "lock the screen"
<seb128> pitti, what? ;-)
<pitti> "you asked for it, you got it"
<seb128> ah right
<seb128> but apparently some people don't realize what they ask for
<seb128> and then complain ;-)
<pitti> it seems much more useful to me to the majority of people who do know their password *shrug*
<chrisccoulson> but the "autolock on screensaver" doesn't affect what the indicator does, does it?
<seb128> ok, me too
<pitti> seb128: I hope those people won't be able to file bugs either
<chrisccoulson> (or did i miss something)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, it does now
<seb128> chrisccoulson, if you lock on screensaver it's "lock screen" now
<pitti> chrisccoulson: but not necessarily
<seb128> otherwise it's "start screensaver"
<pitti> ctrl+alt+L has always locked your screen regardless of the prefs, too
<seb128> tedg make indicator-session read the key
<chrisccoulson> that behaviour seems weird to me
<seb128> same here
<seb128> I was just collecting opinion before undoing the change
<seb128> I undo it on the basis it has been done after freeze btw
<chrisccoulson> the preference is specifically to control automatic locking when the screensaver activates
<pitti> right
<seb128> not just because I disagree with it
<pitti> but that's not the same
<chrisccoulson> if i select the menu item in the indicator, i want the screen to lock regardless of the preference
<seb128> same here
<pitti> ^ +1
<seb128> ok thanks pitti and chrisccoulson
<pitti> seb128: thanks for sorting this
<seb128> np
<seb128> tedg, ^ for the record we have desktop team consensus on this one
<tedg> Heh
<seb128> tedg, but feel free to register an UDS spec for handling cases where users don't want to know about their password
<tedg> seb128: Sure.
<tedg> What about the case of switching users?  I think that should match the screensaver settings still.
<tedg> It's roughly the same.
<tedg> Sorry, same as idle.
<seb128> I've no strong opinion about this one
<kiko> seb128, so what do you think?
<seb128> kiko, that I didn't read the bug because I don't work on gpm, but chrisccoulson might know better ;-)
<seb128> kiko, we have a tag for regression though
<seb128> it's potential-regression I think or something similar
<kiko> chrisccoulson, can you confirm?
<seb128> to check with the qa team or on launchpad
<pitti> kiko, seb128: "regression-potential"
<kiko> thanks pitti
<pitti> de rien
<seb128> tedg, user switch is tricky, I tend to agree usually you want the same
<chrisccoulson> kiko - your bug is not a gpm bug
<seb128> tedg, I also tend to think we should be on the secure side by default
<kiko> chrisccoulson, ah?
<chrisccoulson> its indicator-application (and also a duplicate)
<chrisccoulson> it's tedg's bug ;)
<pitti> tedg, seb128: I think we should keep locking the screen on user switching, too
<seb128> tedg, so I'm not sure, I would prefer to have some people annoyed than creating a security issues for some people
<pitti> if not for anything else, then for keeping existing behaviour
<tedg> pitti: Well, if nothing else -- it wasn't existing behavior until Thursday ;)
 * tedg fixed that bug
<pitti> heh, ok
<tedg> I think that it's roughly the same as idle.  It's the computer locking for you.
<kiko> chrisccoulson, tedg: can you guys help sort it out?
<chrisccoulson> if we make changes to the screen-locking behaviour, we should really discuss those with the security team too
<tedg> kiko: Which bug?
<chrisccoulson> kiko / tedg - bug 529052
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 529052 in indicator-application "Application Indicator causes Gnome Power fallback icon to show/hide on each refresh" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/529052
<seb128> tedg, well the behaviour was non consistant until previous week
<seb128> ie switching in gdm was different than switching in the indicator
<seb128> like "switch from"
<seb128> and directly picking a name
<tedg> I think they should be consistent now, it's because we didn't have the names in Karmic, so the name entries didn't get fixed.
<pedro_> kenvandine, hello, may you please look into bug 391912 ? I'm getting that at least 5 times per day and we're having more than 100 affected users
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 391912 in pymsn "telepathy-butterfly crashed with ParseError in parse()" [Unknown,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/391912
<baptistemm> Oh the fix is really really wanted ...
<baptistemm> pedro_,what should I do to have permissions to edit importance properties of bugs ? at least just a few set I'm interested with.
<rickspencer3> pedro_, so that bug was not targeted, milestoned, and it was set to Medium
<istaz> pedro_: we have a patch in papyon upstream that would probably fix it (the last one), if you are able to reproduce the issue could you maybe test it?
<rickspencer3> by definition kenvandine would not work on it
<rickspencer3> pedro_, I made it a release blocker and set it to beta 2
<istaz> pedro_: and if not produce a log? (the 2 or 3 lines just before the error should be enough)
<seb128> istaz, do you have the upstream bug reference?
<seb128> or git
<istaz> http://git.collabora.co.uk/?p=papyon.git;a=commit;h=e7c2298acae3b68991c8bf11e049d2ef0da20f88
<seb128> istaz, thanks
<seb128> pedro_, ^ I will upload that to lucid let me know how it works for you
<pedro_> baptistemm, you don't have those?, have a look into https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuBugControl
<pedro_> baptistemm, if you're working on an upstream project which have a project in launchpad just ping jcastro
<istaz> seb128: when is the limit date I should make a release before for lucid?
<pedro_> seb128, will do it
<baptistemm> I'm not particularly working on upstream but I'm following some yes
<seb128> istaz, depends of the changes you have
<vuntz> :w Ã©Ã©
<vuntz> gah
<seb128> hey vuntz ;-)
<pedro_> salut vuntz
<baptistemm> vuntz, : )
<vuntz> you saw my secret password!
<pitti> bonjour vuntz, comment vas-tu?
<seb128> istaz, you still have around 3 weeks to fix bugs
<seb128> istaz, but new versions the earlier the better
<istaz> vim commands as password, why didn't think of that
<seb128> since we try to lower the number of changes when we get close from stable
<seb128> ie we will only backport fixes worth it
<istaz> seb128: sure, but I still have a pile of works and branches to review :/
<istaz> ok
<vuntz> pitti: bien, j'ai pu embÃªter didrocks pendant une semaine !
 * pitti tries to make a clueful face, pretending that he understand any of that
<didrocks> vuntz: et apprendre la date de release de 2.30.0 aussi :p
<vuntz> :-)
<istaz> seb128: we are past feaure freeze already? because we have pending branch for file transfer in msn which still need some work
<seb128> istaz, yes, month after that
<seb128> I guess such changes will be for next cycle now
<istaz> guess that will be for lucid+1 then
<seb128> I would like to get the http login change in lucid though
<seb128> did that land already?
<istaz> seb128: I still need to review it but that can be done for the start of next week
<istaz> seb128: or the end of this one if you are really  in a hurry
<seb128> istaz, beta2 freeze is midweek next week
<istaz> ok
<nigelb> seb128: if a gnome bug is fixed upstream, do you prefer it to be marked fix commented on LP so you can get the patches in?
<seb128> yes
<nigelb> okay :)
<seb128> pedro_, istaz: git change uploads to lucid let's see how it goes
<seb128> pedro_, do you have contacts in your list using the messenger web client?
<istaz> thanks
<seb128> istaz, thank you!
<seb128> istaz, you might want to close https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=22552
<pedro_> seb128, awesome!, thanks
<seb128> if that's the same issue
<ubottu> Freedesktop bug 22552 in pymsn "telepathy-butterfly crashed with ParseError in parse()" [Normal,New]
<pedro_> seb128, yes i have a couple using that
<seb128> pedro_, ok, so it's probably the same bug
<pedro_> seb128, nice, will test and comment back to you guys
<seb128> pedro_, you can maybe check by asking one to change status and see if it trigger the crash
<pedro_> will do
<rickspencer3> pitti, seb128 wow, we have quite some list of release blocking bugs for Lucid!
<istaz> seb128: yep
<seb128> rickspencer3, right I was saying to pitti before the meeting on friday
<rickspencer3> 32
<istaz> seb128: didn't notice it since it was filled again pymsn
<seb128> istaz, sorry about that, it had been open a while ago
<seb128> hum, where is mvo?
<seb128> I got apt-get source ubuntu-mono doing "getting ubiquity source instead of ubuntu-mono"
<seb128> wth?
<pochu> ubiquity rewritten in mono? :-)
<seb128> lol
<seb128> no, ubuntu rewriten in mono!
<seb128> ;-)
<pitti> seb128: works fine here..
<kenvandine> haha
<seb128> pitti, here too now, but I was in the middle of an apt-get update
<kenvandine> rickspencer3's evil plan
<seb128> pitti, I get the index was in a weird state or something
<cassidy> seb128, istaz: we should probably re-assign all the pymsn lp bugs to papyon
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, ?
<seb128> cassidy, the issue for this one was the fdo bug, but right that too
<seb128> cassidy, we should perhaps do it on fdo too
<kenvandine> ubuntu re-written in mono... boycottnovell would be so excited to hear that :)
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> rickspencer3, ubuntu-mono = ubuntu in mono
<istaz> cassidy: not really needed most of these bugs are outdated and if there were still valid they were reopened against papyon
<rickspencer3> right
<seb128> rickspencer3, well name is misleading it's an icon theme
<istaz> so we would just end up with a lot of dups
<rickspencer3> the reason that Microsoft paid me to quit and work in open source
<istaz> and incomplete bugs
<cassidy> istaz, your call :)
<seb128> rickspencer3, the boycootnovell guys read clearly in your game and new it from the start!
<seb128> knew
<rickspencer3> I know
<rickspencer3> I would have gotten away with it too, if it weren't for those darn kids
<kenvandine> that was my first thought when i saw that package name... ubuntu-mono
<Keybuk> what will those boycottnovell folks do when Novell inevitably either goes under or gets bought out?  where will all their anger be redirected to?
<mdeslaur> Keybuk: boycottcanonical
<Keybuk> let's register that now, while we still can!
<mdeslaur> we should also register boycottboycottnovell :)
<Keybuk> boycottgit.com
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson: hey, do you have time to review my transmission update or should I look for another developer who isn't as tied up as you are? :)
<chrisccoulson> kklimonda, i will do that today
<chrisccoulson> sorry, i actually forgot about it ;)
<pitti> Keybuk: boycottgit.com> unnecessary; it already does quite a fabulous job of not wanting people to use it :)
<Keybuk> it's certainly making no friends with me today
<rickspencer3> seb128, pitti, pedro_ I broke out our release blockers into 3 chunks:
<rickspencer3> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Scratch/ReleaseBugs20100322
<rickspencer3> thought I'd share if it helped
<kklimonda> the boycottcanonical.com isn't that improbable - all we need is all the whiners to get some free time and they are going to launch it ;)
<rickspencer3> that's as of the last time the chron job ran
<seb128> rickspencer3, thanks
<pitti> rickspencer3: ah, it's cron'ed? using bug tags or so?
<rickspencer3> pitti, yeah, bdmurray runs the json searches
<qense> djsiegel1: Are you aware that GMail (for Apps in my case) thinks your Canonical mail address may be hoaxy?
<pitti> rickspencer3: I was about to say that large wikified bug lists don't generally work that well; e. g. the last bug is already fixed
<rickspencer3> pitti, here's one you might like: http://qa.ubuntu.com/reports/team-subscribed/canonical-desktop-team-subscribed-bug-tasks.json
<djsiegel1> qense: no I am not aware of that
<rickspencer3> every bug on every package that someone on teh desktop team is assigned to
<rickspencer3> pitti, right, but I just did it for myself to see where the problem areas seem to be
<djsiegel1> qense: but I did notice some odd behavior -- I tried sending an email from my gmail acct to my work email and it ended up in my personal inbox...
<rickspencer3> thoguht I'd share since I did the work
<qense> djsiegel1: "Warning: This message may not be from the alleged person or organisation. Beware of following any links in it or of providing the sender with any personal information." It spammed bug mail from Launchpad you commeneted.
<djsiegel1> qense: that is nuts
<pitti> rickspencer3: right, I've seen that list; it's very useful
<qense> djsiegel1: This could cause people to miss your comments
<djsiegel1> qense: I realize
<rickspencer3> pitti, without a cron job, you could never get a list like that
<djsiegel1> qense: are you interested in running paper cuts project next cycle?
<rickspencer3> well never == less than a few hours ;_
<djsiegel1> qense: slash do you have plans to attend UDS?
<pedro_> rickspencer3, thanks
<rickspencer3> also that list shows how poorly performing by DictionaryGrid filtering and sorting code is :(
<qense> djsiegel1: I have applied for sponsorship, so I do have plans, but it depends on the people giving away the sponsorship. I would be glad to help running the papercut project, but I'm not so sure whether I would have enough time. I'm already writing on a blueprint for another project, Ubuntu Wanted, and if that would get accepted I'd have to spend a lot of time on it.
<rickspencer3> seb128, pitti do you think it's feasible for us to fix all those release blockers this week?
<djsiegel1> qense: would you mind sending me a copy of your UDS sponsor application and the details of Ubuntu Wanted?
<rickspencer3> and by "us" I mean everyone but me ;)
<pitti> rickspencer3: no, I don't think so
<rickspencer3> (not what I wanted to hear, obviously)
<rickspencer3> pitti, ok, understood
<seb128> rickspencer3, it''s probably not no
<rickspencer3> seb128, pitti half?
<rickspencer3> knock it down to 10
<seb128> that should be possible yes
<pitti> right, let's try
<qense> djsiegel1: I'm not sure how much I've saved on my computer of the sponsorship application, but I will be able to send you details on Ubuntu Wanted.
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, nautilus shows my 3G modem as having a CD drive
<pitti> chrisccoulson: most of those have a fake CD-ROM to ship Windows drivers
<pitti> chrisccoulson: that's where usb-modeswitch or modem-modeswitch come into play
<chrisccoulson> pitti - ah, i didn't realise it actually faked a CD drive
<chrisccoulson> i thought it was just a standard removable USB storage device
<pitti> no, it's totally useless under Linux
<chrisccoulson> am i meant to be able to use both components at the same time?
<chrisccoulson> i can access the storage whilst i have a 3G connection
<pitti> chrisccoulson: might depend on the hardware
<chrisccoulson> my hardware seems to let me do both :)
<seb128> didrocks, btw I pushed my gtk changes
<seb128> didrocks, and uploaded
<seb128> didrocks, you might want to rebase your work
<didrocks> seb128: ok, I'm still striking at activating introspection, got a FTBFS :/
<seb128> didrocks, ok, how does it break?
<didrocks> seb128: one sec, trying something as paste the error if it still fails
<seb128> didrocks, you enable it on the shared lib build only right?
<didrocks> seb128: there are 3 girs, (I --enable-introspection=yes, shouldn't I?)
<seb128> didrocks, right, I was speaking about the build target in gtk
<seb128> gtk is build several times
<seb128> static build, directfb build
<seb128> you don't want to build gir in those cases
<didrocks> I saw that, the issue come in directfb build (but it's maybe not the issue as it can be the first)
<didrocks> ok, so, let's try to activate it only on shared lib build
<seb128> you only need to build it once
<seb128> so put it only in the shared configure options
<seb128> I'm away for ~15minutes, let me know how it goes and I will read that when I'm back
<didrocks> will do, thanks
<seb128> ok, time for a small break
<tseliot> pitti: shall I take care of the fglrx handler now (and upload whenever you're ok with it) and work on the "prevent Jockey from removing packages and just switch between alternatives instead" feature in a (future and) separate upload?
<pitti> tseliot: sounds good; the former should be a trivial change, right?
<pitti> tseliot: can you just commit that one to trunk for now?
<pitti> tseliot: there's something else I want to work on in the next days, and the change is not that urgent (since there are transitional packages)
<tseliot> pitti: yes, it's a small diff: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/399372/
<tseliot> and I would commit it in lp:~ubuntu-core-dev/jockey/ubuntu
<pitti> ok
<pitti> tseliot: I'm still not that convinced taht this shouldn't ever uninstall packages, though
<pitti> if you switch back to the free driver, you'd still keep the dkms overhead around, not even mentioning the fact that some people want to actually remove the non-free bits for political reasons
<tseliot> pitti: I see the current scenario: you can install as many drivers as you like (especially if you switch between free drivers quite often) and switch between them without having to uninstall and reinstall things every time.
<tseliot> the more you install, the more modules you will have to rebuild
<tseliot> of course ;)
<pitti> tseliot: yes, but you can do that today, too
<pitti> tseliot: the driver isn't uninstalled if you enable a different driver
<pitti> it's just unisntalled if you explicitly disable a driver
<tseliot> pitti: yes, by manually installing all of the drivers and by switching between drivers by doing the following things: 1) use update-alternatives 2) call ldconfig 3) update the initramfs 4) change your xorg.conf
<pitti> also, it's not like people would switch drivers twice a day or so -- they might do that twice a year after an upgrade
<tseliot> (not exactly easy, even if documented)
<tseliot> that's a good point too
<pitti> tseliot: no, I mean in the GUI; disable() is only called if you click "Deactivate", not if you activate a different driver version
<tseliot> pitti: I guess that worked because packages could conflict/replace/provide with each other
<pitti> correct
<tseliot> so it's really a non-issue then
<pitti> in previous releases enabling version 180 automatically removed version 96
<tseliot> right, I forgot about the logic, even though I worked on it ;)
<tseliot> and this means less work for me :-) . So I'll only commit the fglrx enablement code
<tseliot> pitti: BTW people keep contacting me asking about an ETA for fglrx support in Jockey. I'm really glad to see that Jockey has become so popular :-)
<pitti> :)
<seb128> pitti, I just cc-ed you on a gnome-menus bug
<seb128> pitti, we should probably not translate Icon=
<solidslash> hello, i've got a question - where exactly is a piece of code that would let me get rid of the little 'back history' and 'forward history' arrows in nautilus? is it in nautilus-navigation-action.c ? where exactly?
<tgpraveen12> solidslash: it would be better to ask in a channel for nautilus
<solidslash> is there one?
<ccheney`> new OOo uploads only require me to upload 4MB now instead of 186MB :) goes much faster
<Nafai> solidslash: Probably on irc.gimp.net, many gnome related dev channels are there
<solidslash> thanks
<pitti> seb128: oh, do we?
<seb128> pitti, we do translate those yes, and it leads to some bug apparently when the icon name matching a string in the software
<pitti> ccheney`: ah, thanks for the OO.o upload; I didn't see any LP refs in the changelog, does that include the pending patches? (arm FTBFS, bug 516727, etc.)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 516727 in update-manager "breaks dist-upgrade: E: Couldn't configure pre-depend openoffice.org-core for openoffice.org-filter-binfilter, probably a dependency cycle." [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/516727
<ccheney`> pitti: includes arm patch, i forgot to note, i think it fixes 516727 but not completely sure it does so without any other breakage, as the pre-depends was needed so also didn't write a closes for it in it
<ccheney`> pitti: silbs is going to see if it works ok for the office and let me know
<seb128> istaz, do you know about bug #194494
<seb128> ?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 194494 in pymsn "telepathy-butterfly crashed with NotImplementedError in _on_error()" [Unknown,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/194494
<pitti> ccheney`: thanks
<istaz> seb128: yup commented three times on it, but wasn't able to find what caused it, haven't been able to take a real look at it since logs have been provided though
<istaz> Olivier Le Thanh Duong on the bug is me
<seb128> istaz, I know who you are, sorry the question was not clear ;-)
<ccheney`> pitti: i didn't fix any other issues with this upload though to get the potential fix for the upgrade problem resolved, will be doing another upload sometime before beta 2 freeze
<seb128> istaz, I was wondering if there was any news about this issue or if the patch from jonny on https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=16945 was likely to fix the issue or is a different one
<ubottu> Freedesktop bug 16945 in papyon "telepathy-butterfly crashed with NotImplementedError in _on_error()" [Critical,New]
<seb128> rickspencer3, pitti: any opinion on bug #543356 priority, ie is that something we care about enough to put in on the lucid list?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 543356 in gnome-codec-install "Can't install gstreamer0.10-fluendo mp3 plugin from the interface" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/543356
<istaz> seb128: it's the same issue, but this is not a patch to fix the issue but to provide more debug logs to locate it
<seb128> istaz, ok, so me getting the patch in lucid might help to fix it?
<didrocks> pitti: I guess the gdm issue I get is because gconftools take its path regarding the uid and not the euid: stupid code for testing: http://paste.ubuntu.com/399443/, result with id and shutdown command: http://paste.ubuntu.com/399442/.
<pitti> seb128: hm, at first sight it seems simple to fix
<istaz> yes that's a nice idea actually
<pitti> didrocks: perhaps set both effective and real uid? seems safer anyway
<didrocks> pitti: as you can see when you'll have some time, I tried to override HOME as well, and it does nothing.
<seb128> istaz, ok, will do that, thank you
<didrocks> pitti: well, I was pondering about that, no side effect to change real uid as well?
<pitti> didrocks: no, it's generally safer to set both with setresuid()
<didrocks> pitti: ok, testing that
<pitti> didrocks: oh, btw
<didrocks> pitti: at least, it taking the right one now :) thanks!
<pitti> setenv("HOME", "/var/lib/gdm/", 1);
<didrocks> pitti: yeah?
<didrocks> pitti: it was just for testing
<pitti> didrocks: please use pwent->pw_dir instead of hardcoding
<pitti> ok
<didrocks> pitti: sure, it was just for testing if it won't take /root/â¦ as HOME
<pitti> didrocks: if nothing else helps, this is a more robust approach:
<pitti> 1. fork()
<pitti> 2. in the parent, wait()
<pitti> 3. in the child, setuid(pwent)
<pitti> this sets effective, real, file, and saved uid all at once, but can't be reversed any more
<pitti> and it avoids changing $HOME for the main program
<pitti> didrocks: otherwise you also have to save and restore $HOME
<didrocks> pitti: sure, I'm just at least trying to make work this silly program to find a good way for communicating with gdm (still have new issue now that setresuid works), but I'm crossing my finger to find a proper way
<pitti> and third, regardless of how badly the child screws up, you don't jeopardize the gdm daemon
<rickspencer3> seb128, yes, this seems like terrible attention to detail
<didrocks> pitti: sure, I will make a lot of test to not block the parent on that
<didrocks> the issue is clearly about changing user, all works with sudo -u gdm â¦ so root -> gdm makes something bad
<pitti> didrocks: oh, and you should also change the gid, of course
<seb128> time for sport and dinner
<seb128> bbl
<pitti> (first setgid, then setuid; or, without fork(), setresgid, then setresuid)
<pitti> seb128: enjoy!
<didrocks> pitti: do you think this is mandatory for gcontool call?
<seb128> pitti, thanks
<didrocks> seb128: enjoy :)
<seb128> didrocks, thanks
<pitti> didrocks: if it writes any file, yes
<didrocks> pitti: oh sure, didn't think about that
<pitti> didrocks: otherwise you'll end up with gdm:root files
<didrocks> right
<didrocks> well, still an issue, time to get some dinner for a break before retrying this
<pitti> after three hours, /me now thinks that he finally understands bug 460328
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 460328 in gnome-settings-daemon "Wrong keyboard settings when console-settings has multiple layouts" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/460328
<pitti> but fixing is for tomorrow, Taekwondo o'clock now
<pitti> have a nice evening everyone!
<highvoltage> hi! How do I do a plymouth dry-run to test a theme?
<jono> hey all
<jono> I would like to provide a means for my app to add a PPA to someone's system, is there a python API for doing this?
<qense> jono: You could see whether software-properties provides an importable implementation of the PPA adding support it is using.
<qense> aquarius: When I pressed browse in the Ubuntu One musicstore I got directed to the 7Digitial home page. Could that be related to the fact that ubuntuone-syncdaemon keeps raising Apport error messages and that Ubuntu One isn't properly working on my system?
<aquarius> qense, that's a known bug :(
<aquarius> qense, please avoid pressing browse for now...
<qense> ok, I will avoid Browse then
<qense> thanks!
<tedg> jono: There might be an apt-daemon API to do this.
<tedg> jono: You can just use the command line.
<tedg> jono: add-apt-repostory ppa:~ted/ppa
<qense> of course! I forgot.  apt-daemon is probably the best way to do so.
<jono> tedg, I know I could use subprocess, but I was hoping to avoid that :-)
<qense> It could even be that it launches the PolicyKit dialogue by itself, but I'm not sure about that.
<tedg> jono: Seems like org.debian.apt.AddRepository probably does what you want.
<qense> jono: If you're looking for a snippet, Software Centre is probably the correct place since it should be capable of activating/adding PPAs.
<jono> qense, a snippet would be awesome
<jono> I just want to make setting up python-snippets-daily a one-click affair
<qense> Maybe Quickly could help with that... Bazaar is one big Python library, after all.
<qense> aquarius: By the way, I wish you success with handling the floodgates of madness that have been opened by enabling the music store. Maybe we should plan a Bug Day for the music store in the near future?
<aquarius> qense, perhaps so, indeed. I'll see what sorts of bugs we get
<qense> ok
<qense> If you need any help with setting up such a bug day, feel free to ping me!
<tedg> jono: I think it would be interesting to provide a way to have a generic application called "megaphone" that would work with PPAs that updated regularly and announce them.  So you could have something like Marin's font of the week, and when it gets installed you get a notification of it.  Obviously it wouldn't work with security updates, but for extra things you want to get excited about.  Haven't had time to write it though :(
<aquarius> I will do, definitely :)
 * tedg needs minions.  Anyone know an aging evil dictator that I can impersonate?
<jono> tedg, indeed :)
<didrocks> \o/ GDM has been *finally* defeated! we can change a gconf key now on the server side
<kenvandine> didrocks, yay!
<rickspencer3> didrocks, congrats
<seb128> didrocks, congrats (just joined so I don't know about what :p)
<didrocks> seb128: heh thanks ;) finally defeated the gdm/gconftool mess :)
<didrocks> seb128: I'm refactoring the get/set code now and will probably finish tomorrow morning so that we can easily that different values later
<didrocks> seb128: already back from sport?
 * seb128 hugs didrocks
<seb128> didrocks, how did you fix it?
<seb128> didrocks, "already", I was away 2 hours
 * didrocks hugs seb128 back
<seb128> I didn't eat or take my shower yet though
<seb128> just passing by and checking everything is already before doing that
<didrocks> seb128: setting real uid/gid as well as effective uid/gid + home dir and --direct :) (dbus-launch spawn some processes without closing them)
<didrocks> seb128: oh ok, enjoy your dinner then :)
<seb128> didrocks, ok
<seb128> didrocks, thanks
<didrocks> ok, the get part is working after refactoring to take any value of any type. Will do the same for the set part tomorrow, time to enjoy the evening :)
 * didrocks waves goodbye
<seb128> didrocks, have fun, see you tomorrow
<didrocks> seb128: thanks, have a good night
<rickspencer3> didrocks, great job on GDM, congrats again!
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, how long did it take to get your song downloaded?
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, hard to say
<rickspencer3> it was pretty much instantaneous
<rickspencer3> I looked around for it on my hardrive and couldn't find it
<rickspencer3> then I thought to look in Library, and it was already there
<kenvandine> great
<kenvandine> :)
<kenvandine> don't expect it to always be that fast :)
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, have there been issues?
<kenvandine> well, when the download daemon was broken it took until someone kicked it manually :)
<kenvandine> but it should start pretty quickly
<rickspencer3> hehe
<kenvandine> it will depend on how many people are downloading at any given time
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, is it fixed now?
<kenvandine> yup!
<rickspencer3> makes sense
<kenvandine> it gets queued up in the cloud to download
<kenvandine> so if you are the only shopper it should be real fast
<rickspencer3> U1 music store + iPod/iPhone support = main stream product
<rickspencer3> !
<kenvandine> ~/.ubuntuone/Purchased\ from\ Ubuntu\ One/
<kenvandine> woot!
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, right, but users should drag out of RB I assume, right?
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, i know, amazing huh?
<kenvandine> they should just trust RB knows :)
<kenvandine> yeah, RB knows where they are
<rickspencer3> but I mean if you wanted to back it up outside of U1
<rickspencer3> copy it wherever you want, etc...
<rickspencer3> we tell users to drag from RB, right?
<kenvandine> yup
<rickspencer3> nice too see so much Grateful Dead in the store
<kenvandine> hehe
<kenvandine> :)
<rickspencer3> now it has credibility
 * kenvandine still doesn't picture rickspencer3 as a dead head
<rickspencer3> I have to wonder why they bother with other bands, really
<LaserJock> so how do you go from Ubuntu One/RB to iPod?
<seb128> dnd
 * kenvandine doesn't have an ipod... but i would imagine just drag the music to the ipod
<kenvandine> that is what i did on my G1
<kenvandine> LaserJock, the U1 music just syncs to RB
<kenvandine> so once it is in your library it behaves the same as any other music
<LaserJock> kenvandine: right, but I've never been able to get music from RB to iPod
<kenvandine> DRM free :)
 * kenvandine can't help there
<LaserJock> as far as I know RB is read-only for iPods
<kenvandine> oh... actually i did do that
<kenvandine> my daughter's ipod
<kenvandine> she syncs it from rb
<LaserJock> I was hoping somebody would do something simple-scan'esqe for iPods :-)
<kenvandine> she is 7... she figured it out :)
<kenvandine> i plugged it in for her the first time, that was about it
<LaserJock> hmm
<kenvandine> her's is old though
<LaserJock> I spent 2 days trying to get it to work
<kenvandine> old nano
<seb128> LaserJock, dnd to ipod works fine
<LaserJock> mine is from 2006
<seb128> LaserJock, I'm doing that for several years
<seb128> in rhythmbox
<kenvandine> i plugged it in for her and it just worked... it was nice to see that considering i installed lucid for her at the same time we gave her the old ipod :)
<seb128> rhythmbox works with pretty much all ipods
<seb128> up to the most recent nano and touch and iphones
<LaserJock> doesn't seem to work here
<LaserJock> I rarely us drag-n-drop so maybe I'm doing it wrong
<seb128> it's easy
<seb128> click on something with the left mouse button
<seb128> keep the button press
<seb128> go over where you want to drop
<seb128> stop clicking
<LaserJock> ok, did that, but it just falls back to where it was
<seb128> you can dnd a song, album, artist over the ipod device
<seb128> what do you try to dnd and where?
<TheMuso> pitti: re bug 528524 I personally don't know where to start in debugging this unfortunately, my skills with PA don't extend that far. :)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 528524 in pulseaudio "Sound not working in all apps on dove" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/528524
<seb128> you need to dnd over the ipod icon in the sidebar
<LaserJock> seb128: I was wanting to send a playlist
<LaserJock> that doesn't seem to work
<LaserJock> but I think maybe I got a song over there
<seb128> not sure if playlist copies work
<seb128> I never do that
<seb128> I usually dnd albums there
<LaserJock> I need playlists to be able to find music instead of podcasts
<LaserJock> the whole music thing is an awful mess for me
<LaserJock> I finally gave up and installed iTunes on a Windows 7 partition (yeah, that desperate)
<LaserJock> ok, so it seems I can do individual songs and albums in RB, that's something anyway
<LaserJock> I would never have guessed to try drag-n-drop
<rickspencer3> fudge
<rickspencer3> I got that Messaging Menu -> Xchat crash again
<Nafai> :(
<rickspencer3> but apport won't le me log the bug'
<rickspencer3> plymouth version was out of date :(
<Nafai> I just bought my first track via Rhythmbox!
<Nafai> And, no, I won't share which track :)
<ccheney`> rickspencer3: cc'd you on the email to stefan
<rickspencer3> thanks ccheney`
<seb128> Nafai, hey
<Nafai> Hi seb128
<seb128> Nafai, any news about those bugs you work on?
<seb128> Nafai, I don't think I've seen any update from you in 10 days now :-(
<Nafai> seb128: brb, need to reboot and then we can discuss this so I can make significant progress now that I've got a lot of stuff out of my way
<seb128> ok
<seb128> rickspencer3, any though on things like bug #533520?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 533520 in vino "Unreadable hint in Remote Desktop Preferences" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/533520
 * rickspencer3 looks
<seb128> rickspencer3, I'm not sure if we should consider it as a lucid blocker or not, it's cosmetic but is also the sort of issues users will easily notice
<rickspencer3> does not seem like a blocker, but I am looking
<seb128> rickspencer3, see screenshot in comment #2
<rickspencer3> it's a bit hard to read, but not impossible
<seb128> comment #3 rather
<rickspencer3> seems appropriately set to me
<seb128> ok, thanks
<seb128> I was just not sure how much we care about "looking good"
<rickspencer3> I would ship like this, but might be good for "top bugs"
<rickspencer3> seb128, of course we care, but hold up release? probably not
<seb128> right, that was my though
<rickspencer3> also, the fix is probably trivial enough that we could SRU it
<seb128> right we can probably easily workaround
<seb128> the proper fix would be to port the widget ot a gtkinfobar
<seb128> hey robert_ancell
<robert_ancell> seb128, hello
<seb128> robert_ancell, how are you?
<robert_ancell> seb128, good
<robert_ancell> seb128, oh, I got a friend to install UNR on his EEE (he likes it more than the standard EEE image).  He didn't have enough space left though so I played the how many packages can I remove.  Long story short, I'm planning to go into battle next cycle and convince you splitting gnome-utils is a good idea :)
<seb128> I think we have other issues to deal with that fighting to be able to remove the screenshooter
<seb128> or the log viewer
<seb128> but yeah, let's see how this discussion goes :p
<robert_ancell> bring it on!
<LaserJock> fight! fight! fight!
 * LaserJock grabs some popcorn
<robert_ancell> LaserJock, you have to wait for UDS.  Then there'll be real blood.  Got my flights booked yesterday :)
<seb128> how much disk space did he have?
<seb128> the lower ssd I could get on the dell mini was 8G
<seb128> which is twice an ubuntu standard install
<robert_ancell> seb128, afterwards 900M.  Didn't check before but it was probably about 300M
<robert_ancell> seb128, the install came down to 2.4G after removing as much as I dared
<rickspencer3> RAOF, hi
<seb128> I would argue it's a corner case
<seb128> you can't even buy a disk under 8G nowadays
<RAOF> rickspencer3: Good morning.
<robert_ancell> seb128, I would argue it's a bad user experience
<seb128> right, for how many users?
<robert_ancell> seb128, enough
<seb128> we better spend time on making the system boot faster or looks better
<seb128> than benefit higher number of users than those who don't have 5G of disk
<robert_ancell> seb128, well, I'll probably end up doing while flying somewhere.  That's what I did last time...
<seb128> I'm not sure I will let that one go in though :p
<seb128> I dislike the explosion of binaries
<robert_ancell> seb128, and you know I'll keep arguing so we'll waste more time arguing it that just doing it! ;)
<seb128> it makes apt indexer harder to deal with
<seb128> each apt-get update run slower
<seb128> package management tools slower
<robert_ancell> seb128, meh.  It's one package we're talking about... And then all the default installed packages behave sane
<seb128> gnome-media?
<seb128> gnome-applets?
<seb128> gnome-panel?
<robert_ancell> seb128, hmm
<robert_ancell> though I only consider gnome-media a good candidate there
<seb128> I just fail to see why users would care about uninstalling a tiny binary
<robert_ancell> seb128, it's not the binary, it's more the .desktop file
<seb128> they can edit the menu if they don't want them there ;-)
<robert_ancell> seb128, that's not logical
<robert_ancell> there's no logical connection between the screenshot tool and the dictionary
<robert_ancell> we expose upstream development policy to users which is bad
<seb128> there is no logic connection between cp and ls
<robert_ancell> seb128, they're power tools
<seb128> I hope you don't plan to split every binary in its own package :p
<robert_ancell> I don't think there are a lot of other cases.  It's only projects in an umbrella organisation like GNOME that mix applications into one tarball
<dyek> Hi! Can Ubuntu desktop (karmic) be setup to do xdmcp easily?
<seb128> dyek, hi, user questions go on #ubuntu but I don't think so no
<dyek> seb128: OK! Thanks!
<seb128> robert_ancell, well I sort of see your point, I just feel we have other issues to work on which would better benefit users
<seb128> robert_ancell, if you really care about that I guess just do the change that will be easier than arguing ;-)
<seb128> robert_ancell, you would make an higher number of user happy by improving gdmsetup for example than doing that during the same time though ;-)
<robert_ancell> seb128, It will make me happy :)
<Nafai> seb128: ok, back.  I admit all I've got done (visible progress) is adding some logging to notify-osd which I intend to use for debugging things like the rhythmbox issues.  Been bad especially the last few days dealing with interruptions (paperwork, contracts, dr appts and such), but I'm ready to give full attention
<seb128> Nafai, hey, no need to justify just tell me if you are not able to work on those so we can dispatch elsewhere and get them done for lucid
<robert_ancell> didrocks, oh, did anything happen about gdmsetup?
<seb128> Nafai, ok good
<Nafai> seb128: Sure thing, I'll let you know as soon as tomorrow what I anticipate
<seb128> robert_ancell, he's refactoring the changes apparently and got it working
<seb128> Nafai, thanks
<seb128> robert_ancell, writting to other users gconf config is no fun
<robert_ancell> seb128, sweet!
<seb128> I hope gsettings will fix that
<robert_ancell> seb128, yeah, I've tried and failed at that a few times...
<robert_ancell> seb128, yes, I was going to ask the same thing.  Perhaps we should raise that in case it hasn't been considered
<Nafai> seb128: which is higher priority bug #451086 or bug #497883 -- I'm guessing the former because it is a bug in an existing feature, the other is a new feature (I just need to respond to Ken's reports/feeedback)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 451086 in hundredpapercuts "Rhythmbox Notification Bubble shows wrong cover art" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/451086
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 497883 in vino "Support Application Indicators" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/497883
<seb128> Nafai, right, I think it's too late now for a new feature, ie to do the vino change
 * Nafai nods
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-03-23
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - it seems that the issue with my FN+F8 keys not working on my laptop is a BIOS issue
<chrisccoulson> and a deliberate one by dell ;)
<chrisccoulson> so, you might want to remember that if you ever consider updating your BIOS
<seb128> chrisccoulson, ok thanks
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I read the comment this afternoon saying it was a win7 thing
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, it sucks
<chrisccoulson> i suppose i'll just have to put up with the keys not working, and complain to dell
<chrisccoulson> they could have implemented the win 7 behaviour with a driver rather than screwing it up on all platforms really
<seb128> yeah
<mdeslaur> chrisccoulson: what did FN+F8 do?
<chrisccoulson> mdeslaur, it switches video modes on most laptops
<mdeslaur> chrisccoulson: ah! my thinkpad is FN+f7
<mdeslaur> chrisccoulson: that used to be implemented in hardware on your laptop?
<chrisccoulson> but dell have re-mapped that key combination in their newer BIOSes to produce the same scancodes as pressing Super+P
<mdeslaur> ugh
<mdeslaur> wth didn't they just do that with a driver
<chrisccoulson> they use the new key combination in win 7 to open a display settings dialog rather than flipping video modes
<chrisccoulson> it seems weird to change that in the BIOS though
<mdeslaur> chrisccoulson: did they break winxp/vista by doing that?
<mdeslaur> what a weird thing to do
<chrisccoulson> mdeslaur, the new behaviour is specific to win 7
<chrisccoulson> but https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/539477/comments/12 explains why it affects lucid too
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 539477 in linux "Fn+F8 key combination doesn't work on Dell E5500" [Undecided,Invalid]
<mdeslaur> chrisccoulson: ah! that makes sense
<mdeslaur> huh, interesting
<chrisccoulson> is apport attaching crash files to bug reports now?
<RAOF> chrisccoulson: I *think* so.
<chrisccoulson> RAOF - ah, i wasn't aware of that. i've been deleting them ;)
<chrisccoulson> thinking that users were attaching them manually...
<RAOF> You mean .crash files?  No, those would be manual.  But I think apport is now actually attaching the files that it's meant to be attaching :)
<chrisccoulson> RAOF - i was actually referring to the .crash files
<chrisccoulson> it seems that those are now automatically added too
<chrisccoulson> eg, bug 544687
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 544687 in gdm "gdm-simple-slave crashed with SIGSEGV in _fini()" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/544687
<RAOF> Hm.
<RAOF> I wonder why apport is attaching that?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I doubt it does or that's a bug
<seb128> that's not wanted for sure
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - it's being added to all new crash reports today
<seb128> it's a bug for pitti
<chrisccoulson> ok, i'll ping him in the morning
<chrisccoulson> (if he hasn't already seen the scrollback by then)
<RAOF> Gah.  Evolution and firefox are fighting over which process should have the highest resident size.
<pitti> Good morning
<didrocks> good morning pitti
<pitti> bonjour didrocks!
<pitti> how are you this morning?
<didrocks> pitti: I'm fine, thanks. Ready for a not so crazy day, I hope :)
<didrocks> and you?
<pitti> didrocks: still a bit tired, but alright; today I really feel my muscles :)
 * pitti feels like a 70 year old
<didrocks> due to yesterday Taekwondo?
<pitti> didrocks: no, still from Sunday's training camp
<pitti> I usually feel it most two days after
<pitti> didrocks: (sorry, I'm not ignoring you, I just was stuck a bit in mutt)
<didrocks> pitti: no pb, I'm back to gconftool's mess :)
<pitti> didrocks: are you using fork(), setgid(), setuid() now?
<didrocks> pitti: I'm trying to use Also note that modifying the environment from the child setup function may not have the intended effect, since it will get overridden by a non-NULL env argument to the g_spawn... functions.
<didrocks> oupss, wrong paste :)
<didrocks> I'm trying to use the definition of that ^ ;) (GSpawnChildSetupFunc)
<didrocks> which is a parameter from g_spawn_â¦
<didrocks> should do it, just have to find some code example
<baptistemm> hello
<didrocks> baptistemm: hey o/
<baptistemm> salut didrocks
<didrocks> pitti: ok, got it. Last thing to find is why gconftool-2 --direct -g /desktop/gnome/sound/event_sounds --config-source "xml:readwrite:/var/lib/gdm/.gconf" returns me a different value from gconftool-2 -g /desktop/gnome/sound/event_sounds even after shutting down the daemon (under the gdm user of course)
<pitti> didrocks: oh, why do you have to specify --config-source explicitly?
<didrocks> pitti: it's compulsory with --direct
<pitti> didrocks: and if you have to, why don't you have to do it with -g as well?
<pitti> didrocks: ah, I see
<baptistemm> hi pitti
<didrocks> I guess there is something in the gdm default path which could interfere
<didrocks> ahah, we user .gconf.path to include defaults
<didrocks> user*
<didrocks> use*
<didrocks> :)
<didrocks> which has a higher priority than $(HOME)/.gconf
<pitti> didrocks: that sounds like a bug?
<pitti> (the priority)
<didrocks> pitti: we put the mandatory and default in this path file. My guess is that we should rather use $(HOME)/.gconf.path.defaults and $(HOME)/.gconf.path.mandatory
<didrocks> (see /usr/share/gconf/default.path)
<pitti> didrocks: i. e. should /var/lib/gdm/.gconf.path have /var/lib/gdm/.gconf as well?
<didrocks> pitti: we can either do that, or not using .gconf.path and split the values between $(HOME)/.gconf.path.defaults and $(HOME)/.gconf.path.mandatory
<pitti> but both of those are shipped in .debs, thus they shouldn't be writable
<didrocks> pitti: right, user/sysadmin shouldn't touch them
<didrocks> pitti: so, I add at the right place /var/lib/gdm/.gconf to /var/lib/gdm/.gconf.path for you?
<mvo> ccheney: hello! any news re OOo upload to fix #516727 ?
<pitti> didrocks: "for me"? :-)
<pitti> didrocks: I'm not that familiar with gconf source configuration, you know much more about it
<didrocks> pitti: "in your opinion", that's a French bad translation :)
<pitti> didrocks: but it sounds pplausible to me
<didrocks> can do that, it's easy
<pitti> /var/lib/gdm/.gconf should override /var/lib/.gconf.defaults
<didrocks> right
<didrocks> but not the mandatory settings
<pitti> right
<didrocks> ok, it's working ;) that was the last strange remaining thing \o/
<didrocks> hey mvo
<pitti> didrocks: sweet!
<pitti> mvo: guten Morgen!
<glatzor> morning Pitti and mvo
<mvo> hey didrocks, pitti, glatzor
<pitti> glatzor: hallo!
<mvo> good morning
<glatzor> mvo, I looked at the debconf forwarding issue once again
<glatzor> mvo, see lp:~aptdaemon-developers/aptdaemon/fix-455861
<glatzor> mvo, it is possible to delay a new connection attemp by just returning True from the accept_connection method. I lowered the priority of the accept_connection callback compared to the io handlers
<mvo> glatzor: oh, cool! I check it out. I would really like to write a test-case for this, but I'm not sure how to simulate it properly
<mvo> hey seb128! have you noticed that gnome-menus FTBFS ?
<seb128> hello mvo, yes I got emails about that but I didn't look at it yet, I will do that today if you don't beat me to it
<seb128> brb session restart after daily updates
<RAOF> Good morning didrocks!
<didrocks> RAOF: good morning!
<seb128> re
<seb128> mvo, did you look at the issue yet?
<seb128> mvo, I uploaded your gtk patch yesterday btw
<mvo> seb128: I think it may be a missing b-d
<mvo> seb128: let me test-build w
<seb128> mvo, don't bother, I will have a look now, I've some experience with gir builds by now
<mvo> seb128: I have a test-version now running in pbuilder
<mvo> seb128: it may just be a missing b-d on git1.0-glib-2.0
<seb128> mvo, ok thank you!
<seb128> pitti, hey
<mvo> np, I let you know if it was it
<mvo> seb128: I only care because it shows up in red in my upgrade test output ;)
<seb128> pitti, did you made apport add .crash to bugs on purpose or is that a bug?
<seb128> mvo, oh it does?
<mvo> seb128: well, because gnome-menu is not build
<seb128> mvo, the current version is not installable?
<pitti> seb128: I saw the scrollback; I didn't, looks like a recent LP change; filed as bug 544843
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 544843 in malone "Bug reports with +storeblob now attach the raw file" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/544843
<mvo> seb128: its the fix you did with the file-overwrite
<seb128> pitti, thank you!
<pitti> de rien
<seb128> mvo, oh right
<mvo> seb128: that is in ubuntu3 but because of the ftbfs its not inthe archive yet
<seb128> mvo, ok, let me know how test build goes, I will do an upload today anyway to fix another issue
<mvo> seb128: (thanks for this btw and THANKS for the gtk patch !)
<RAOF> didrocks: How's UNE going?  From the lucid-bugs wiki page it looks like it's going ok.  I've been busy (and will likely remain busy) with other things; do you need more help with UNE?
<seb128> pitti, any objection to drop the icon translation from the cache? ie have the non translated value listed
<mvo> seb128: ok, should I just commit to bzr then and wait for this upload? or upload anyway? (either way is fine for me)
<pitti> seb128: no, not at all; I'm not even sure why we translate  it at all
<seb128> mvo, thank YOU for the patch, I just reviewed and uploaded ;-)
<seb128> pitti, ok good, I will fix that today
<seb128> mvo, commit to bzr I will do some other changes in a few minutes
<pitti> seb128: oh, thanks! (otherwise I can do it later today)
<mvo> :) tiny tiny patch, need to buy beer for upstream to accept it
<seb128> pitti, np
 * pitti currently knee-deep in g-s-d keyboard code
<seb128> pitti, good luck with that
<mvo> brave man!
<seb128> pitti, did you notice that usbmuxd + gvfs have upstream changes to fix the afc and gphoto double mount issue?
<pitti> seb128: yes, I read it yesterday
<pitti> I set the bug to "in progress" now, now high on my todo list
<seb128> pitti, ok thanks
<baptistemm> pitti, about apport API, do you know if usb_devices() fine works, because bug report (bug 544549 for instance) don't have it. Perhaps I'm not using it properly
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 544549 in bluez "test bug for apport (dup-of: 543764)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/544549
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 543764 in bluez "test apport hook for bluez" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/543764
<mvo> seb128: commited (the gnome-menus fix)
<pitti> baptistemm: this works fine here: python -c 'from apport.hookutils import *; print usb_devices()'
<baptistemm> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~bmillemathias/apport/bluez-support/annotate/head:/source_bluez.py
<pitti> baptistemm: it's just a convenience wrapper for lsusb -v
<baptistemm> ah so it doesn't attach the output automatically, I have to get the output and attach it
 * seb128 hugs mvo
<seb128> mvo, you rock, thanks!
<didrocks> RAOF: I'm annoyed by one or two bugs that we should really fix, apart from that, the remaining one are just "good to fix", but not compulsory. So, it's mainly ok. But I'm busy with other things and also triage a big flow of UNE bugs report
<seb128> RAOF, bryceh: is there an easy way to match gpu lock bugs to avoid filling duplicates?
<seb128> ie to know if the lock bug I got is the same than one of those already opened
<RAOF> seb128: It's not obvious , no.
<RAOF> seb128: Part of the problem there is that the GPU dump we *get* is often that of a freshly-reset GPU
<seb128> RAOF, also seems quite some of those are closed as false positives bugs, how do you detect if that's the case or a real issue?
<RAOF> I haven't noticed a lot of bugs closed as false-positives, but there's an *awful* lot of bugs which are basically âWhy are you presenting this error popup to me?"â
<seb128> how do gpu locks look like usually?
<seb128> basically what I did is suspend undocked and woke up docked with lid closed and external screen
<seb128> which gives no active screen
<seb128> at which point I did a switch to vt1 and back to vt7
<seb128> which actives the display usually
<seb128> and got the gdm screen
<seb128> and after login I got a gpu lock apport bug and an xorg crash bug
<seb128> I think the crash is what did send me back to gdm
<RAOF> That's probably bug #535640; we've been duplicating a lot of gpu locks against that.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 535640 in xserver-xorg-video-intel "[gm45] GPU lockup de05bf80bf83cd22541cb55f1a2ee99e (xorg crash when opening the laptop lid)" [Unknown,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/535640
<seb128> I'm not sure if the gpu lock bug is a real one and worth sending to launchpad
<seb128> the crash is bug #447159
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 447159 in xserver-xorg-video-intel "[i945gm] Xorg assert failure: X: ../../src/i830_batchbuffer.h:79: intel_batch_emit_dword: Assertion `pI830->batch_ptr != ((void *)0)' failed." [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/447159
<RAOF> Sarvatt's traced that back to a patch that we accidentally dropped in the .33 drm backport.
<seb128> ah nice, so it's likely to be fixed before lucid?
<RAOF> Yes.
<seb128> good
<seb128> did you ping any of the kernel team guys about it?
<bryceh> yeah we're getting a lot more triggerings of the X freeze apport hook than we expected
<seb128> I milestoned the crash I listed before btw
<RAOF> Yes; smb's been pinged as our backup apw
<seb128> it has over an hundred affected users
<seb128> and is still happening on lucid
<bryceh> at least, the good news is it's become tons easier for users to report these things compared with before
<seb128> bryceh, RAOF: ok thanks
<bryceh> indeed I've been wondering if we should shut off the apport hook, it's ruining our stats!  ;-)
<RAOF> bryceh: Sarvatt & I have been bashing at that today; today's graph should look much better :)
<seb128> well if you feel you collected enough bugs now you can probably turn it off
<bryceh> RAOF, I think we need to figure out ways we can put in more heuristics so things automatically dupe
<bryceh> RAOF, awesome
<seb128> also you can make extra use of bug patterns to autoduplicate things
<bryceh> seb128, yeah I think we'll discuss it at the desktop team meeting
<Sarvatt> bryceh: can't think of how, i did over 40 there and its too random
<RAOF> bryceh: Right.  That might work better with a .34 kernel, where we can guarantee that the gpu error log actually has the right state.
<bryceh> Sarvatt, RAOF: Ooh, nice drop in the curve!  http://www2.bryceharrington.org:8080/X/Reports/ubuntu-x-swat/totals-lucid-workqueue.svg
<Sarvatt> the info i needed to dupe all of those was scattered in 6 or 7 different places
<bryceh> Sarvatt, RAOF: well I'll leave it to your guys' judgment on if leaving the freeze apport hook might benefit us in gaining more interesting freeze bugs, or if at this point it just is gathering more and more dupes
<bryceh> iirc we shut this stuff off at release anyway
<RAOF> We might want to switch it off until the lid fix is back in; it seems that it requires nothing more than shutting the lid, which users do *all the time* :)
<seb128> can you bug pattern this one in some way?
<baptistemm> jcastro, ping me back when you're up, thanks :)
<seb128> baptistemm, you should just ask your question so he can reply even if you are not there
<RAOF> Possibly.  It'll be difficult to do something without false-positives.
<bryceh> seb128, I suspect if we had enough understanding to craft a bug pattern, we'd know enough to amend the apport script to not file them in the first place
<seb128> ok
<RAOF> But I guess if the other option is to turn it off entirely, then hiding some bugs in false-positive duplicates wouldn't be too bad.
<Sarvatt> oh man, opening your graph killed my system bryceh, lost a huge email I had typed up for kernel-team about drm bugs :( :(
<RAOF> bryceh: We could possibly dupe based on the contents of IPEHR=0x01800020 in i915_error_state.
<bryceh> Sarvatt, drat... sorry... hope your browser doesn't have a bug reading svg
<glatzor> mvo, uh we have to be careful. debconf 1.5.29 breaks our forwarding
<mvo> glatzor: uhh, how?
 * RAOF â run
<glatzor> mvo, it requires a read-write lock on the file based databases. which will fail for a non-root running debconf-communicate
<seb128> RAOF, have fun, see you later
<mvo> glatzor: sounds like we need to file a bug about that
<mvo> glatzor: or at least get a --no-locking switch or something
<glatzor> mvo, I was wondering why my debconf test scripts weren't working anymore on debian
<Sarvatt> bryceh: I think they are a bad idea personally for most cases, *all* 965 reports were for the same hang, most Gxx ones were as well but the remaining ones didn't have enough info to consider it a dupe even though it had the same symptoms because they filed it after rebooting a few times. the 2 arrandale ones are upstreamable though
<bryceh> Sarvatt, sorry, lost context.  "they" == svg graphs? bug patterns?
<Sarvatt> in reference to <bryceh> [05:13:12] +Sarvatt, RAOF: well I'll leave it to your guys' judgment on if leaving the freeze apport hook might benefit us in gaining more interesting freeze bugs, or if at this point it just is gathering more and more dupes
<Sarvatt> it did let us find that that patch was dropped from the kernel unknowingly though :)
<bryceh> Sarvatt, ah you are in favor of turning the freeze handler off?
 * bryceh waves to tseliot
<seb128> mvo, bug #544890
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 544890 in grub2 "conffile prompt about grub-pc on upgrade" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/544890
<seb128> mvo, not sure how,if you track those
<mvo> glatzor: I would like to add  a "rebuild_apt_xapian_index" dbus handler into aptdaemon - or would you prefer to set this to a different daemon? ie apt-x-i itself or a s-c- daemon?
<mvo> seb128: thanks, it seem to be pretty common
<tseliot> hey bryceh
<mvo> seb128: haha, that is a fun diff
<seb128> mvo, that's the one I mentioned previous week, I got it on the mini which I use as a textbox, ie I'm sure I didn't change grub there
<mvo> seb128: not sure about this one in particular, but grub conffiles
<seb128> textbox -> testbox
<mvo> seb128: ok
<pitti> bryceh, Sarvatt: do you guys happen to know if this is valid?
<pitti> (**) Option "xkb_layout" "us,de"
<pitti> i. e. having multiple layouts in /etc/default/console-setup -> udev -> X
<mvo> seb128: its odd, I do not see this one in my upgrade tests, but I suspect it might be something that d-i is doing to the file
 * pitti tries to find out whether this is an udev rule, X, or libxklavier bug
<seb128> mvo, context, I've 3 lucid installs on this machine
<seb128> mvo, ie, I'm using the "make space and install lucid" ubiquity option
<seb128> mvo, so it might do extra "detecting other oses and updating grub"
<Sarvatt> sorry pitti, I'm not sure
<Sarvatt> pitti: yep its valid
<pitti> Sarvatt: xorg-server itself doesn't seem to parse it at all
<glatzor> mvo, the post update script is not sufficient? Or do you want to replace it with a dbus call?
<pitti> Sarvatt: out of interest, how did you determine that? reading libxkbsomething?
<mvo> glatzor: I want to have a way in software-center to trigger a rebuild of the full apt-xapian-index if I notice that its outdated (apt cache and DB size do not match for example)
<pitti> Sarvatt: I'm using http://paste.ubuntu.com/399784/ for testing
<pitti> Sarvatt: (context: that's the format that the installer uses for non-latin keyboard layouts, since you always need a latin one for typing URLs, keyboard shortcuts, and the like)
<glatzor> mvo, but which user should be allowed to rebuild the cache? allow all?
<mvo> glatzor: my gut feeling is allow-admon without password
<mvo> glatzor: admin group users, we could add a throttle to minimize abuse (e.g. not more often than every 5 min).
<pitti> Sarvatt: oh, I know -- xkl_config_rec_get_from_server() just reads it from the root window property, and that seems ot be wrong:
<pitti> _XKB_RULES_NAMES(STRING) = "evdev", "pc105", "us", "", "terminate:ctrl_alt_bksp,grp:shifts_toggle"
<pitti> bryceh, Sarvatt: ^ do you know how this root prop is set?
<bryceh> pitti, sorry no not offhand
<pitti> it's still happening in an xterm session, so it's not g-s-d
<pitti> bryceh: ok, thanks
<pitti> ah, if I start raw X, it's correct
 * pitti directs blame towards gdm
<seb128> why does it always turns to be gdm being to blame? ;-)
<pitti> it's the only thing between starting X and starting xterm which could modify _XKB_RULES_NAMES :)
<seb128> right
<seb128> just pointing it's too often buggy
<pitti> tell me about it ..
<seb128> it's just supposed to take your password and open your session
<pitti> and both the backup property and the real property become wrong
<seb128> mvo, btw the gtk patch you attached has an extra buggy hook to it
<mvo> oh
<mvo> what is buggy?
<seb128> mvo, it includes the diff from an another change about single,double click
<pitti> seb128: yeah, found the culprit in gdm
<seb128> pitti, \o/
<pitti> so it is a fix in gdm and g-s-d after all..
<mvo> seb128: meh, I thought I had remove that, its part of out gtk package, i used that for the initial testing
<seb128> mvo, it was in the diff there, the patch failed to apply and I started cursing you before noticing it was just the change being listed there :p
<mvo> *lalala*
<seb128> mvo, it's all good don't worry ;-)
<mvo> I will upload a fixed diff (you talk about the upstream report, right?)
<seb128> mvo, yes
<seb128> chrisccoulson, hey
<chrisccoulson> hey seb128, how are you?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, good! what about you?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i'm good, but quite tired this morning. my daughter kept waking last night
<seb128> mvo, I suck
<seb128> mvo, it was the launchpad patch apparently I just checked
<seb128> mvo, ignore my comment ;-)
<mvo> seb128: oh, ok :)
<mvo> seb128: I will just delete it
<seb128> chrisccoulson, oh, is she not feeling well or just not wanting to sleep?
<mvo> seb128: what was the bugnumber again (sorry I suck at this)
<seb128> mvo, do nothing that has been uploaded so it's all good
<mvo> ok
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i think she just doesn't want to sleep ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I see, luck you ;-)
<seb128> lucky
<mvo> chrisccoulson: how old is she?
<glatzor> mvo, would updating the package cache be to expensive?
<chrisccoulson> mvo - she's 4 months old now
<mvo> glatzor: how do you mean? update it on every apt-get update run?
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson, good morningn
<glatzor> mvo, right. running both actions
<mvo> chrisccoulson: sweet :) and lots of sleepless nights I'm sure
<mvo> glatzor: its relatively expensive, I would prefer not to do that every time on apt-get update
<chrisccoulson> hey pitti - how are you?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I'm fine, thanks! just a bit frustrated how utterly broken our keyboard config stuff still is..
<chrisccoulson> mvo - she's actually normally quite good through the night now. we put her to bed at about 8pm and she wakes normally at around 6am
<mvo> glatzor: the use case is that a just added PPA (or other repository) has the meta-data available immediately. but for a normal apt-get update on stable that just changes a bunch of versions no re-indexing should be done
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, i was watching the bug mails yesterday
<chrisccoulson> i see you're having fun ;)
<mvo> glatzor: maybe I need to invstigate the "--update" hook in a-x-i again, that was added recently and if its not a big slowdown (it should not) then adding it on each apt-get update may be feasible
<mvo> chrisccoulson: woah, impressive
<glatzor> mvo, the bug is fixed in debconf svn.
<mvo> cool
<davmor2> Guys I have a weird issue involving gdm every third or fourth boot gdm isn't started.  This means that I have to log in and manually restart gdm from the cli and then it works fine for another 3-4 times
<chrisccoulson> it's nice to see that the usual pre-release discussions have started up on the u-d-d mailing list now
<chrisccoulson> "f Luicd ia a LTS...... Then I sgrongly urge a few exta betas and a delayed release date"
<seb128> chrisccoulson, lol
<chrisccoulson> he didn't even spell "Lucid" correctly
<bryceh> chrisccoulson, amongst other words
<chrisccoulson> heh ;)
<chrisccoulson> yeah, those aren't typos from me ;)
<bryceh> it amazes me when people recommend delaying release dates who I don't think have been at all involved with development
<chrisccoulson> indeed - especially when they don't even back up their suggestion with concrete examples of problems
<bryceh> my fingers wish to strangle
<chrisccoulson> "i think you should delay the release just for the fun of it" ;)
<bryceh> chrisccoulson, bikeshed painters
<seb128> pitti, can you quickly review gnome-menus r62 and tell me if you are ok with it?
<seb128> pitti, when you have a minute, no hurry
<pitti> re
<pitti> seb128: sorry, was off IRC, debugging gdm (fixed that part now \o/)
 * pitti looks
<pitti> seb128: looks great
<didrocks> pitti: I've made the rebase, but still not pushed for gdm, I can push a "almost working version" now to avoid you doing the same in the bzr branch
<pitti> didrocks: for now I'm working in upstream git
<didrocks> pitti: oh oki, no pb so :)
<pitti> didrocks: I want to work on g-s-d, and once the entire chain works, I'll commit to the packaging bzr
<didrocks> pitti: ok :)
<seb128> pitti, ok thanks
<kenvandine> good morning everyone, i am going to be afk this morning... might be back in time for the meeting
 * kenvandine waves
<pitti> hey kenvandine
<seb128> hey kenvandine
<mvo> I guess this does not really belongs here, but my mom was pretty confused when I upgraded her system and the buttons where all on the wrong side. I guess she is not a target user or something, just as a data point
<seb128> pitti, there?
<pitti> hi seb128
<seb128> mvo, hehe, same here
<seb128> pitti, ok, so I just told didrocks that I think it's time to drop the gdmsetup change for this cycle
<pitti> :(
<seb128> pitti, http://paste.ubuntu.com/399813/
<pitti> seb128: I thought it'd work now?
<seb128> pitti, look at the current change
<pitti> hm, I'd structure it more generically (not SetSoundEnabled(), but SetGconfValue())
<seb128> pitti, it's rather that it start looking complicated and hackish
<seb128> and it's still not working from gdm
<seb128> (but working for a test program)
<seb128> I'm wondering if we should keep spending time on that
<seb128> or declare that gconf sucks to much for that and delay to next cycle now
<pitti> we could just disable the startup sound from gdm entirely by default :-P
<seb128> I suggested that to rickspencer3 during the meeting weeks ago
<seb128> but he said "no change to the default experience"
<didrocks> the scary things are stuff like that: // --shutdown take into account the resuid/resgid and HOME whereas --get --set take the euid/egid
<didrocks> I took time to find and I guess the remaining bug in gdm we have should be related to that
<pitti> didrocks: oh, g_spawn()'s child_setup_func looks interesting, that probably saves you the explicit fork()
<pitti> didrocks: you should just use setgid() and setuid() there, FWIW
<pitti> but anyway, setting all three in setresuid() shuold work as well
<didrocks> pitti: right, at least, it was an experience that taught me that :)
<pitti> it shouldn't be the cause of the bug
<seb128> didrocks, it's weird that it works in your test program though
<pitti> didrocks: it's nt something simple like not having a correct $PATH in the daemon or so, I figure?
<didrocks> seb128: right, that's why I'm fighting since this morning on that. I really though it was a config issue somewhere or a typo
<mvo> I wonder if we could make the button layout in metacity part of the theme, that would solve the problem nicely by just changing for this one speicifc theme
<didrocks> pitti: no, the process is launched, the output ("value") is just empty, with a 0 return code
<seb128> mvo, themes don't allow to do that
 * mvo nods
<seb128> what I want to do is patch the capplet to set the key
<seb128> default being upstream one
<seb128> add a key to the .index
<didrocks> mvo: seb128: did you read: http://blogs.gnome.org/metacity/2010/03/21/theme-based-button-layouts/ on that?
<mvo> seb128: cool idea
<seb128> and make the capplet the gconf key
<pitti> didrocks: wrap it in strace -o /tmp/trace -f ?
<seb128> didrocks, oh no I didn't, when I asked upstream some weeks ago he said that was not possible to do from the theme
<pitti> didrocks: so, how do _you_ feel about how we should go forward with this, since you're doing the work? Fix up for lucid, or postpone?
<didrocks> seb128: not sure the metacity blog is syndicated to planet GNOME
<didrocks> pitti: I agree that in any case it's hackish. Of course, this will be frustrating but sometimes we should maybe be wise and avoid such solution to not make the result unstable
<pochu> didrocks: it's not. it's in news.gnome.org
<pitti> didrocks: I'm asking because I don't want to say "let's drop this" and make you feel like you wasted hours on this in vain
<seb128> didrocks, pitti: well if we can figure quickly was is wrong and land that soon it's maybe worth trying
<didrocks> pitti: as I told to seb128, I spent a lot of time on that and it's some kind of rollback, but I can accept it, even if the work feels useless
<pitti> it looks like 90% there now, after all
<seb128> but I feel we are wasting days there
<seb128> didrocks, let me have a quick other go to trying to figure what is wrong
<pitti> seb128: they were already spent, though, so it depends on how much more effort it is to make it work
<didrocks> seb128: ok, thanks :)
<seb128> pitti, the issue is that you can't know that before have it solved
<seb128> ie didrocks is fighting for that issue for almost a day now
<seb128> it could take an extra hour or an extra week
<pitti> we could give us a budget of two more hours; if it works by then, do it, if not, give up?
<seb128> ok
<seb128> didrocks, let's keep looking until meeting?
<pitti> but I think it should be didrocks's call; if he wants to work on it, why not
<seb128> and declare postponed if we don't get it to work by then?
<didrocks> seb128: sure
<seb128> pitti, right, agreed
<didrocks> pitti: I agree with seb128's suggestion
<pitti> sounds fine
 * pitti grabs some lunch, need a break from gdm/gsd ..
<seb128> pitti, enjoy
<didrocks> pitti: enjoy, gdm is pretty loved those days :)
<pitti> seb128: do you know what causes the keybaord layout indicator to be shown or hidden? is that gnome-panel? (it doesn't seem to be g-s-d)
<seb128> pitti, it's g-s-d
<seb128> pitti, it's displayed if n_layout > 1
<pitti> hm, that should be in libgnomekbd/gkbd-indicator.h
<pitti> g-s-d source does not match any "indic" (except *.po and *.ui)
<pitti> seb128: I have a suspicion, I'm testing that now
<seb128> pitti, show_hide_icon ()
<seb128> pitti, in gsd-keyboard-xkb.c
<seb128> in g-s-d
<pitti> seb128: right, but I have two layouts
<seb128>         if (g_slist_length (current_kbd_config.layouts_variants) > 1) {
<pitti> and can toggle through them with both shift keys
<seb128>                 if (icon == NULL) {
<seb128>                         xkl_debug (150, "Creating new icon\n");
<pitti> seb128: yes, I know, I have the code here
<seb128> k
<seb128> so I'm not sure to get the question ;-)
<pitti> my suspicion is that it somehow checks the gconf key later on, not the actually configured values
<seb128> you can set XKL_DEBUG=150
<pitti> seb128: my Q was if there's code related to that in gnome-panel
<seb128> to get libxklavier debug
<seb128> pitti, no
<pitti> seb128: ok, thanks
<seb128> it's purely g-s-d libgnomekbd libxklavier
<seb128> it's a notification area icon
<seb128> gnome-panel is only the container
<pitti> ah, seems it's not being called at all
<pitti> ok, that gives me something, thanks
<jcastro> baptistemm: looking for me?
<baptistemm> jcastro, yeah, hello
<baptistemm> jcastro, I wanted to grant me some power on bug report control
<baptistemm> if possible of course
<jcastro> heh, which upstream project are you with?
<jcastro> oh, you're crevette?
<baptistemm> I used to work on GNOME projects globally (I'm member of foundation, and my bz profile is https://bugzilla.gnome.org/page.cgi?id=describeuser.html&login=bmm80@free.fr) but at least I would like to have access to bluez gnome-bluetooth obex-data-server obexd
<baptistemm> jcastro, yeah, this is my previous nick, you remember me :)
<jcastro> ok you're in, only thing we ask is not to triage bugs outside your scope
 * pitti finally declares victory over gdm's and g-s-d's keyboard settings
<pitti> on a related note, how can you French guys type on a "fr" layout??
<pitti> (I used that for testing..)
<didrocks> pitti: we are just crazy, and you know it :)
<pitti> I do!
<baptistemm> jcastro, thanks a lot
<baptistemm> pitti, and we have several Fr layout :)
<ccheney> mvo: should already be in the archive now afaik
<mvo> ccheney: cool, thanks!
<pitti> didrocks: I'm done with gdm/g-s-d; seems you didn't commit anything to gdm recently?
<pitti> oh, and seb128, did you touch gdm branch recently? it sill seems to be in the same broken state as yesterday
<pitti> I'm fine to untangle it now
<pitti> but maybe you just forgot to push, so I'll wait for your reply
<seb128> pitti, no but didrocks might have
<seb128> pitti, if you do upload gdm please drop 31-unify-power-strings.patch
<pitti> okay
<seb128> pitti, ups no
<seb128> pitti, drop the shutdown change chunk
<seb128> the sleep on needs to be kept
<pitti> alright
<didrocks> pitti: right, I have fixed it, but only locally
<pitti> seb128: why not the sleep one as well?
<didrocks> (the history mess)
<pitti> didrocks: would you mind to push?
<pitti> seb128: we reverted it in the session menu as well, didn't we?
<nigelb> speaking of gpm, can one of comment on gnome bug 613509
<ubottu> Gnome bug 613509 in general "Switch "Shut Down" to "Switch Off" and "Suspend" to "Sleep"" [Trivial,Assigned] http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=613509
<nigelb> *can of you folks
<didrocks> pitti: sure, but don't upload it yet because of the sound stuff
<nigelb> gah, I give up correcting
<pitti> didrocks: no, it has Robert's pending changes as well
<pitti> didrocks: I was going to apply my keyboard fix and the string reversion (see above), and rebase the gdmsetup changes to a new UNRELEASED
<pitti> didrocks: but if you already fixed history, no need for me to do it again
<didrocks> pitti: pushed
<pitti> didrocks: hm, r226 ("readd 2.29.92-0ubuntu2 commit") just adds an empty patch header to 28_plymouth_transition.patch, but not actually any code changes?
<pitti> anyway, I'll compare with the archive version
<pitti> didrocks: thanks
<didrocks> pitti: hein? I made a diff and apply the patch. didn't check yet, let me have a look
<pitti> didrocks: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/40883554/gdm_2.29.92-0ubuntu1_2.29.92-0ubuntu2.diff.gz
<pitti> didrocks: don't worry, I'll sort it out
 * pitti doesn't want to keep you from hacking on gdmsetup :)
<didrocks> pitti: thanks. Maybe a rejection of other part, strange that the first stenza only was applied :)
<tseliot> pitti: how difficult would it be to adapt jockey to function without accessing the archives in /etc/apt/? For example, to force it to use only the archives that I provide it, e.g. via the APT_OPTIONS env. variable
<didrocks> pitti: seb128 found the issue with gdm
 * didrocks hugs seb128
 * pitti ^5s didrocks and seb128
<tseliot> pitti: too difficult?
<pitti> tseliot: hm, I'm not sure, but p-apt allows you to use a separate tree
<pitti> tseliot: but I'm not just using python-apt in jockey, and it's not just /etc/; you also need /var/lib/apt, /var/cache/apt, etc.
<pitti> tseliot: what do you want to do?
 * seb128 hugs didrocks pitti ;-)
<tseliot> pitti: (it's for oem stuff) I think it's meant to allow us to install packages from our own (local) packages pool (e.g. when we don't have an internet connection available)
<tseliot> this question comes from my manager, to be honest
<pitti> tseliot: wouldn't it be easier to just swap /etc/apt/sources.list for that time being?
<pitti> tseliot: but well, I don't mind supporting $APT_OPTIONS, but I don't think I'll have time to implement it in the next week
<pitti> tseliot: but I had expected OEM installs to have local apt sources anyway
<pitti> didrocks: would you mind if I turn the gdm branch to match the official archive again (including history), and commit Rober's and your changes into a "gdmsetup" branch?
<didrocks> pitti: sure
<seb128> waouh
 * seb128 hugs pitti for winning the keyboard battle
 * pitti bows
<tseliot> pitti: it seems that we already do as suggested but that slows down first boot quite a bit.  We'd like to cut that down to 1) set APT_OPTIONS to point exclusively at the on-disk pool 2) run jockey-text -e
<pitti> tseliot: so, it might be possible to just specify an alternative location of sources.list ($APT_SOURCES_LIST or so, and poke that into python-apt)
<tseliot> pitti: ok, I see. Thanks for your help
<Laney> did bug 353112 regress?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 353112 in pidgin-libnotify "inhibit exit if the indicator is present" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/353112
<seb128> Laney, --details?
<Laney> I'm seeing that behaviour
<Laney> pidgin quits if I close it
<seb128> close it as click in the wm button to close the buddylist?
<Laney> yes
<Laney> let me try in guest session
<seb128> I don't confirm there
<seb128> is pidgin-libnotify installed for you?
<pitti> seb128, didrocks: I fixed lp:~ubuntu-desktop/gdm/ubuntu/ ; please pull --overwrite your local branches
<pitti> seb128, didrocks: I'm pushing the gdmsetup sound related ones to a branch: lp:~ubuntu-desktop/gdm/gdmsetup-sound (push still ongoing)
<pitti> ... done
<pitti> didrocks: so please work in lp:~ubuntu-desktop/gdm/gdmsetup-sound for now, and we'll keep the "ubuntu" one for real uploads
<seb128> pitti, ok, thanks for cleaning that
<pitti> and once it's ready, we merge it back into ubuntu
<didrocks> pitti: perfect, thanks
<aquarius> seb128, https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/bugs/545158 is, i think, a rhythmbox bug (as filed by apport) which is actually being caused by the music store plugin -- but I can't see that bug to confirm or to reassign it
<ubottu> Error: Could not parse data returned by Ubuntu: list index out of range (https://launchpad.net/bugs/545158)
<seb128> aquarius, that's because it has not been retraced yet
<seb128> I'm wondering if the retracers are running
<seb128> aquarius, let me have a look
<aquarius> seb128, ah, OK. I'm more than happy for it to be reassigned to us :)
<pitti> seb128: ok, to confirm, I'm supposed to keep Suspend->Sleep and drop Shut Down->Switch Off in gdm?
<seb128> pitti, yes
<bratsche> Morning, desktop lovers!
<pitti> hey bratsche
<tjaalton> huh, can't print a pdf file on lucid, claims client-error-document-format-not-supported
<seb128> bratsche, hey
<didrocks> hey bratsche
<bratsche> How's it going?
<didrocks> bratsche: fine, fighting beside a big amount of work, but apart from that, all is ok ;) thanks. You?
<pitti> rickspencer3: any chance you could fix the cron script for https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2010-03-23/Scratch/BugList to prepend "Bug:" in front of the bug numbers?
<rickspencer3> pitti, yes, but not before the meeting
<pitti> rickspencer3: great, thanks
<rickspencer3> pitti, I can add it to the command that copies as Moin
<tseliot> pitti: as regards our discussion on uninstalling drivers when you disable them in Jockey
<tseliot> pitti: this doesn't work too well with open source drivers as you have no way to keep the proprietary driver when switching to the open one
<tseliot> because you can't install open drivers in jockey
<pitti> tseliot: sure, but why does that hurt? it doesn't take so long to install a .deb, especially not if you already have it in the apt cache?
<pitti> tseliot: I'm not entirely opposed to this, but I don't think that we should change working stuff now; we have too many other bugs to fix?
<komputes> pitti: it's actually hitting me pretty hard: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/41684650/Screenshot.png
<pitti> komputes: is that en_AU.UTF-8? :-)
<komputes> pitti: i just installed nvidia drivers and moved the drive to another computer, that is standard english yep
<jpds> komputes: Nice.
<pitti> komputes: (I was just joking about upside down text)
<komputes> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-session/+bug/544818
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 544818 in gnome-session "[Lucid Beta] gnome-session elements are displayed fliped backwards and upside down" [Undecided,New]
<jcastro> komputes: that's fantastic
<komputes> jpds: knew you'd like that fail ;)
<komputes> everyone here is litterally flipping out ;)
<tseliot> pitti: if you install Ubuntu on a usb key and you plug it in computers with different hardware (e.g. a laptop with intel, a desktop with nvidia, etc.) currently it's not very easy to switch between drivers without uninstalling them.
<chrisccoulson> komputes - that definately isn't a gnome-session bug
<komputes> "Ubuntu has done a complete design 360"
<tseliot> chrisccoulson, pitti: in his case he didn't switch between nvidia and intel correctly (he only changed the xorg.conf) and ended up with Intel using Nvidia's libGL (hence the big mess)
<komputes> chrisccoulson: no doubt, I'm about to test removing the driver as suggested by tseliot in another channel
<komputes> s/removing/disabling/
<chrisccoulson> tseliot, oh, ok ;)
<pitti> tseliot: how would you go uninstall a driver then?
<komputes> <tseliot> komputes: sudo update-alternatives --config gl_conf
<komputes> <tseliot> sudo ldconfig
<komputes> <tseliot> sudo update-initramfs -u
<komputes> <tseliot> and reboot
<komputes> or if you can see it (i.e. on the nvidia machine) use jockey to deactivate driver
<tseliot> the purpose of those steps ^^ is to disable the driver (without uninstalling it)
<komputes> pitti: ^
<ccheney> komputes: the OOo for karmic is in the ppa now
<pitti> tseliot: as I said, I think it's rather a corner case, but if you want to change it and test the hell out of it, then okay for me
<pitti> tseliot: I was just suggesting that this isn't quite at the top of the things we shuold put our attention to at this stage
<komputes> ccheney: cheers, thanks for the update
<rickspencer3> team meeting
<rickspencer3> !
<chrisccoulson> wow, that time already?
<Riddell> my favourite time of the week
<komputes> was it delated 1h?
<chrisccoulson> today has gone far too quickly
<tseliot> pitti: I know what you mean, I'll think about. meeting time now
<komputes> delayed meeting? wasn't it an hour ago?
<pitti> no, 1630 UTC
<pitti> for years now :)
<rickspencer3> ArneGoetje, bryceh, ccheney, chrisccoulson, didrocks, kenvandine, Nafai, pedro_, pitti, seb128, tkamppeter, tseliot
<seb128> there
<ArneGoetje> o/
<tseliot> o/
<rickspencer3> good morning, afternoon, evening ;)
<Nafai> o/
<didrocks> o/
 * kenvandine waves
<rickspencer3> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2010-03-23/
<rickspencer3> shall we?
<rickspencer3> let's go ...
<rickspencer3> First is actions from last meeting
<rickspencer3> this is bona fide empty, there were no actions to carry from last meeting
<rickspencer3> next is partner update
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, ?
<kenvandine> yeah
<kenvandine> sorry i didn't get to update the wiki yet
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, understood
<rickspencer3> you had more important things to do
<rickspencer3> anything to report?
<kenvandine> u1music store is in public beta now!
<kenvandine> woot
<rickspencer3> !
<tseliot> \o/
<kenvandine> please make sure to test/report bugs
<Riddell> I've found three bugs already :)
<kenvandine> Riddell, great... i found like 10 the first hour i used it a few weeks ago
<kenvandine> so that is progress :-p
<rickspencer3> :P
<rickspencer3> wfm
<kenvandine> also
<kenvandine> OLS has 3 ffe bugs out there
<kenvandine> bug 525803
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 525803 in ubuntuone-client "Feature freeze exception: ubuntuone-client devices and services tabs" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/525803
<kenvandine> which i think is supposed to land today'ish
<kenvandine> and bug 534707
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 534707 in ubuntuone-client "[Freeze Exception] ubuntuone-client: Syncdaemon needs to auto-start/connect in Lucid" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/534707
<kenvandine> and bug 526084
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 526084 in ubuntuone-client "[Freeze Exception] ubuntuone-client: Impossible to infer status of file syncing jobs" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/526084
<kenvandine> which are still in the works, i don't have status on those
<kenvandine> we should have a bug fix for libu1 today as well, i need to check on that
<kenvandine> on to DX, there is a ffe request for indicator-me
<kenvandine> to disable the status entry when gwibber isn't available/configured
<kenvandine> that is ready, just need approval
 * kenvandine doesn't have the bug handy this sec
<kenvandine> bug 520932
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 520932 in indicator-me "Status text field should be disabled if no broadcast accounts have been set up" [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/520932
<kenvandine> that is all i have
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, bug 53470 sounds like it would slow down boot?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 53470 in launchpad-foundations "Import fails, but sender doesn't get information about failed import (dup-of: 2038)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/53470
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 2038 in rosetta "Some failed uploads produce no error message" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/2038
<rickspencer3> oops
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, bug 534707 sounds like it would slow down boot?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 534707 in ubuntuone-client "[Freeze Exception] ubuntuone-client: Syncdaemon needs to auto-start/connect in Lucid" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/534707
<kenvandine> i think that is a lazy start
<seb128> don't autostart that service, especially if it still takes some solid 15s of cpu use
<pitti> I just commented on that
<kenvandine> oh?
<pitti> it should only autostart when you actually enable it, and with a solid delay
<kenvandine> yeah
<vish> seb128: hi.. regarding Bug 526560 , the option is not available now.. instead of it actually working
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 526560 in gnome-keyring "Keyrings aren't unlocked if "Automatically unlock ..." is selected" [Low,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/526560
<kenvandine> right now it seems like the only way to make it connect is u1sdtool -c
<kenvandine> in a terminal
<tkamppeter> hi
<kenvandine> which is not cool!
<seb128> vish, hi, we are in a meeting right now
<kenvandine> ok, that is all i have
<seb128> vish, let's talk on an another channel?
<vish> seb128: oh , oops sry..
<rickspencer3> seb128, pitti, kenvandine can I assume that there will be no increase to boot time and put this out of my mind?
<kenvandine> yes
<pitti> rickspencer3: you can be that I'll make sure of it :)
<rickspencer3> lol
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, anything to slow the boot will not be accepted
<pitti> s/be/bet/
<rickspencer3> fair enough
<rickspencer3> ok
<seb128> same here
<pitti> rickspencer3: as I said, I just commented on the bug with a question and a suggestion
<rickspencer3> thanks kenvandine
<seb128> I so don't want that to run on my config
<seb128> I will make sure it doesn't if you don't use it ;-)
<rickspencer3> moving on
<rickspencer3> Riddell, Kubuntu status?
<Riddell>  * Beta release successful, hugs to keybuk and pitti and ev and cjwatson and the kubuntu community for helping lots there
<Riddell>  * However it caused milestoned bug count to multiply 6 fold
<Riddell>  * Good news is all the bugs seem fixable, we're already down to < 20
<Riddell>  * most worrying is bug 448705   akonadi server doesn't start at login, solutions seem to involve changes to mysql package
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 448705 in kdepim "akonadi server doesn't start at login" [Unknown,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/448705
<Riddell>  * New logo needs deciding, I'll call a meeting of Kubuntu council and community.  Design team still owe us a "k"
<rickspencer3> Riddell, could you please define "needs deciding"?
<Riddell> rickspencer3: we came up with some options, we need to decide which to go with
<rickspencer3> Riddell, who is "we" in this case?
<pitti> Riddell: that sounds like a fun meeting; plan two hours :)
<Riddell> Kubuntu people
<Keybuk> Riddell: "k" - there you go
<rickspencer3> Riddell, sorry, I am trying to understand if you are still blocked on the design team
<Keybuk> or do you need a K ?
 * rickspencer3 kicks Keybuk under table
<Riddell> rickspencer3: we're blocked on them by needing a properly rendered "k" in the new font
<tseliot> :-D
<Keybuk> rickspencer3: the comedy only works if you know that I have the new Ubuntu font installed here
<Keybuk> so that actually looked right <g>
<Riddell> they're blocked on us deciding the logo we want
<rickspencer3> heh
<rickspencer3> comedy gold
<rickspencer3> Riddell, should I be helping or is it getting sorted?
<Riddell> rickspencer3: it's getting sorted
<rickspencer3> k
<rickspencer3> thanks Riddell
 * rickspencer3 takes K and k from Keybuk
<rickspencer3> moving on?
<rickspencer3> bryceh, are you ready for the xorg update?
 * rickspencer3 display k and K on top of monitor
<rickspencer3> hmmm
<rickspencer3> maybe in Eastern Edition
<rickspencer3> ccheney, mozilla update?
 * rickspencer3 tap tap tap
<rickspencer3> is this thing on?
<ccheney> i worked with asac on the patch and in the middle of getting the entry class rewritten
<ccheney> was pulled off of it temporarily yesterday to get OOo updated as noted in the wiki
<ccheney> but will be working on it again today
<ccheney> we debugged the crashing in epiphany to the fact that callbacks were calling the wrong old functions and to fix it required redoing one of the classes that was backported
<ccheney> OOo itself is in pretty good shape after the upload yesterday, i have two bugs still to fix and looking through the rest of the bug list to see if anything else major stands out
<ccheney> openclipart can't be synced from Debian though due to what appears to be a bug in inkscape bug 529625
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 529625 in inkscape "Sync openclipart 0.18+dfsg-9 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/529625
<ccheney> inkscape causes the build log for even the current openclipart in lucid to go forever > 10GB anyway
<ccheney> thats it for my status
<rickspencer3> so in terms of mozilla, is this epiphany thing the last thing?
<asac> rickspencer3: ccheney is working on hardy backport for epiphany
<asac> the rest is here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Specs/Lucid/FirefoxNewSupportModel/xulrunner-list
<rickspencer3> k
<asac> main for lucid is done (minus one package i think)
<asac> we are ramping up getting as many universe things done by end of week
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i think it's just packagekit now
<asac> everything that didnt happen has to go
<rickspencer3> ok
<rickspencer3> so sounds on track
<rickspencer3> this has been quite a project!
<rickspencer3> shall we move on?
<asac> heh
<rickspencer3> before I turn the mic over to pitti, I wanted to bring up UDS just super briefly
<rickspencer3> 1. you should have your flights booked
<rickspencer3> if there is ambiguity about when to show up where, ping me out of channel
<rickspencer3> 2. start thinking about blueprints
<rickspencer3> I'll work with pitti and seb128 and assembling a list
<rickspencer3> however, just think about it, focus should stay on Lucid
 * rickspencer3 hands mic to pitti
 * pitti clears throat
<pitti> so, first a look at http://people.canonical.com/~pitti/workitems/canonical-desktop-team-ubuntu-10.04-beta-2.html
<pitti> this looks fairly on track and harmless right now
<pitti> I'm a bit more concerned about our progress wrt. bugs
<pitti> we've been really great at squashing a lot of bugs last week, but the release critical ones (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/ReleaseStatus) have been around for quite a while
<pitti> so I'd like to discuss some of them in some detail in a bit
<pitti> last week, seb128 introduced https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/~canonical-desktop-team/+assignedbugs to us
<pitti> (or rather, filled it up pretty well)
<pitti> we got some done, but as another reminder, that's a good pool to take from if you run out of assigned RC bugs
<dobey> hey pitti
<pitti> in fact, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2010-03-23/Scratch/BugList has a slightly better sorted RC bug list
<pitti> par odre de mufti^W^W^W^WRick kindly asked us to try and get this down by 10 this week
<pitti> and it seems poor chrisccoulson earned half of them
<pitti> bug 512615
<chrisccoulson> yay \o/
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 512615 in firefox "fonts are incorrectly rendered due to not using system cairo" [Unknown,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/512615
<pitti> some thoughts about that
<pitti> basically, we have built firefox with external cairo for years
<pitti> is it really a trademark problem if we now just apply it to the local cairo copy in the firefox package?
<pitti> asac is going to discuss it with upstream
<asac> ack
<pitti> but I wondered whether we can "just do" it for now
<pitti> it should be a rather simple fix, and it keeps coming up
<pitti> chrisccoulson: would that work?
<asac> i dont care, just applying patches without getting approval might cause painful discussions
<asac> laterone
<chrisccoulson> i don't mind doing that if we all agree on that
<chrisccoulson> i haven't seen the patch though ;)
<asac> chrisccoulson: we can check that after meeting
<pitti> asac: but we have shipped firefox with that patch (effectively) applied for many releases already?
<asac> pitti: right. and using system-cairo was always something they disliked because they couldnt see all the patches.
<asac> but yeah
<asac> lets apply it and tell them: here is what we did ;)
<pitti> asac: right, but it woulnd't change the status quo
<pitti> and at least they can see it much better then
<chrisccoulson> we're not the only distro with this issue are we
<chrisccoulson> ?
<pitti> it'd be very strange if we would be
<asac> yeah. lets go for it. only problem i have with it, is that firefox updates system cairo regularly, so we dont really have much bake time for the rebase of this patch in security updates
<asac> chrisccoulson: can you fire up fedora and try upstream build?
<chrisccoulson> asac - yeah, will do that after the meeting
<pitti> ok, thanks
<pitti> another one I'd like to discuss is bug 532511
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 532511 in gnome-terminal "terminal settings messed up after upgrade due to forced profile change" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/532511
<asac> mozilla claimed that part of the font problems is our problem
<pitti> rickspencer3, chrisccoulson: do you know what our requirements for this are?
<pitti> certainly the new theme should be the default for new installs/new users
<pitti> but do we have requirements for upgrades?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - my understanding is that new installs / upgrades should get the new colours
<chrisccoulson> but i tried to implement it in a way which didn't override existing settings
<pitti> i. e. if we'd change it to not switch to the new theme if the user has a custom configuration, is that feasible, or would it cause trouble with sabdfl/design team/etc?
<asac> ack. i can confirm as a "custom profile" users, that i didnt get migrated to the new profile.
<rickspencer3> pitti, this is for the terminal?
<pitti> yes
<rickspencer3> I got the new profile, it was called Ambiance
<rickspencer3> and I had to switch to it
<pitti> after upgrade, you suddenly have huge text, scroll bars, and bad colors, etc.
<rickspencer3> I did not have that
<chrisccoulson> pitti - it's difficult to do though. the only key i've really switched is the one for the default profile
<chrisccoulson> and most users don't customize that
<rickspencer3> I had a pretty purple, transparent background with white text
<pitti> chrisccoulson: right, but we could stop doing that if the default profile has customizations?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i'd have to think about how we could implement that
<pitti> anyway, let's discuss implementation after meeting, but I was interested in the requirements
<pitti> right now it seems stuck
<chrisccoulson> an alternative would be for me to figure out how we could make the veraious VteTerminal bits themable
<seb128> seems we have higher issues to fix
<rickspencer3> hold it
<rickspencer3> I agree with seb128
<pitti> and this is a straight violation of the "golden rule"
<rickspencer3> let's do something easy here
<pitti> rickspencer3: I disagree
<pitti> we tramp over the user's configuration
<rickspencer3> right
<rickspencer3> which we should not do
<pitti> and I'd like to have a pretty strong reason to do so
<seb128> pitti, right, let's do not touch any upgrade
<rickspencer3> but we shouldn't get all fancy in not doing it
<rickspencer3> just install the new profile and let users switch to it if they want
<pitti> rickspencer3: that'd work for me
<seb128> +1
<chrisccoulson> rickspencer3, it wouldn't be default on new installs either then
<pitti> rickspencer3: that'd be within the requirements from Mark, etc.?
<rickspencer3> pitti, I saw no requirement concerning this
<pitti> chrisccoulson: that sounds like a SMOP, though
<seb128> chrisccoulson, how so?
<pitti> implementation -> after meeting
<seb128> ok
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - the issue is that we install the profile and set it as the default. if we don't set it as the default, then new installs won't get it either
<pitti> so, everyone's fine with "new theme on new install and upgrade only on unmodified profile"?
<seb128> yes
<seb128> well
<rickspencer3> chrisccoulson, why does that stomp on the users' current profiles and cause the ugly things in the bug report?
<seb128> I wouldn't even bother about "only on", just don't touch upgrade
<rickspencer3> my experience was nothing like described in the bug report
<pitti> next one is bug 456468 -- this seems to be an utterly hard thing to fix
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 456468 in network-manager-applet "upgrade triggers nm-applet "resource not found" ... missing icon "nm-applet-device"" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/456468
<seb128> the issue with gconf is that's it's often not easy to know if you profile is the default one or not
<seb128> pitti, I don't think we can do anything about that one without changing hardy and karmic
<pitti> and I wondered if we can get away with ignoring it?
<chrisccoulson> yes, i've no idea what to do about that bug
<ccheney> seb128: and if it is the default one, the intent, the user likes the current default or just wants whatever is default
<pitti> at that time, apt should have done all the packages, and it doesn't break ethernet at all (just wifi, probably)
<seb128> right, I did get disconnected there
<seb128> didn't
<chrisccoulson> and it shouldn't break system connections
<pitti> ok, so I'll downgrade it
<chrisccoulson> perhaps we could make nm-applet more robust this cycle though to stop it from happening again next cycle
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I did that with my lazy init change
<pitti> ok, thanks
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - does that stop this from happening?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, btw any news of getting the nm-applet changes it?
<chrisccoulson> even when the theme is updated
<seb128> chrisccoulson, yes, it uses a gtk stock icon as fallbacj when it can't load other icons
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i proposed a merge last week
<pitti> bug implementation discussion> after meeting
<pitti> rickspencer3: I'm done with release status
<chrisccoulson> i don't know if asac saw the merge request though
<dobey> pitti: please ping me after you're all done with the meeting :)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, ok, let's check with asac later
<rickspencer3> pitti, I am concerned about the number of release blockers on our list
<rickspencer3> does it seem about normal, high, low, for this part of the cycle?
<pitti> looks fairly normal to me
<rickspencer3> k
<rickspencer3> tseliot, does bug 474917 impact Lucid?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 474917 in nvidia-graphics-drivers-180 "nvidia drivers 185.xx compile into kernel 2.6.28 instead of 2.6.31 on update from jaunty to karmic" [Critical,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/474917
<seb128> rickspencer3, I think it's just because I spent time fishing issues out of launchpad and putting some on our list which we don't do usually
<seb128> I think we don't have an higher number of issues
<tseliot> rickspencer3: nope, and it should be closed
<seb128> we put perhaps less effort usually to get those milestoned
<pitti> but we have some fairly bad X regressions
<rickspencer3> tseliot, it's in progress, could you please adjust to get it off the list
<rickspencer3> pitti, yes, we will be discussing xorg in the Eastern Edition
<chrisccoulson> i've got a bad kernel regression here ;)
<pitti> rickspencer3, tseliot: this is a parsing bug; this bug was closed ages ago
<rickspencer3> tseliot, can I confirm that you working on bug 540177
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 540177 in kdebase-workspace "KDM needs plymouth transition patch" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/540177
<pitti> rickspencer3: fun, it affects bryceh's scripts as well
<pitti> those also see this bug as in progress
<tseliot> rickspencer3, pitti: ah, good to know
<rickspencer3> pitti, ack
<bryceh> hi
<tseliot> rickspencer3: sure, it's just a matter of cleaning up my patch and waiting on Keybuk to upload his fix for plymouth (which he should do today)
<rickspencer3> ok
<rickspencer3> pitti, is it feasible to focus on the release blockers list, reduce it by say 10 bugs by eow?
<pitti> that's what we should already be doing
<rickspencer3> pitti, can we set a specific goal for certain bugs thoguh?
<rickspencer3> or at least a numeric goal?
<rickspencer3> for this week?
<pitti> rickspencer3: bug 417009 should be fixed with latest OO.o, bug 460328 got fixed an hour ago, bug 474917 is invalid -- there, already 3 down :)
<Keybuk> tseliot: within the next hour I expect
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 417009 in openoffice.org "all openoffice apps die in 'com::sun::star::ucb::InteractiveAugmentedIOException' on armel in karmic" [Low,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/417009
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 460328 in gnome-settings-daemon "Wrong keyboard settings when console-settings has multiple layouts" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/460328
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 474917 in nvidia-graphics-drivers-180 "nvidia drivers 185.xx compile into kernel 2.6.28 instead of 2.6.31 on update from jaunty to karmic" [Critical,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/474917
<tseliot> Keybuk: very good
<pitti> ccheney: hm, why is 417009 still open? I thought it was applied?
<pitti> rickspencer3: down by 10 sounds fine
<rickspencer3> ok
<ccheney> pitti: it was applied but there is question as to whether the build works on arm
<rickspencer3> thanks pitti
<ccheney> pitti: once its finished actually building ncommander is going to test it and verify its good (aiui)
<pitti> ccheney: ah, so you wait with closing until it did? makes sense, thanks
<ccheney> pitti: yea the patches for that bug have been through many rounds
<rickspencer3> pl
<rickspencer3> ok, even
<rickspencer3> any toher business?
 * rickspencer3 shakes out finger
<rickspencer3> s
<rickspencer3> any other business
<rickspencer3> ?
<rickspencer3> ok
<ccheney> if we have any inkscape experts looking at it would be nice, seems to have a lot of high heat crashers, which is also blocking openclipart :)
<rickspencer3> Eastern Edition in 4.5 hours
<rickspencer3> we'll get a good run down of xorg progress then, I htink
<rickspencer3> ccheney, InkScape is crashy you say?
<rickspencer3> are you looking for a specific action, or just just informational?
<ccheney> rickspencer3: well fixing whatever is behind the failure to build openclipart is the most pressing for me, but after looking at its bug list the part about it being generally crashy is informational
<ccheney> not sure if the solution would be to revert to the older version that used to work, or not
<ccheney> some of the crasher bugs are from karmic timeframe so not sure about them
<seb128> usually the way forward is to fix the crash not to downgrade
<ccheney> yea
<seb128> did you try to fix it?
<ccheney> for unknown to me reasons most of the bugs are still marked private
<ccheney> seb128: not yet, been too busy with other work to look into it
<seb128> crashes are private until being reviewed and marked open by a triager
<rickspencer3> will this block the release?
<seb128> to avoid avoid passwords in a stacktrace going public or similar
<rickspencer3> it seems that we need to find a bug report to stand in for the fix, and get that on the blocker list, and then get it fixed
<ccheney> rickspencer3: no but users using clipart would be pretty annoyed since it is no longer installable in the archive, and we can't even rebuild the version in the archive due to the inkscape bug
<bryceh> ccheney, we should be able to get fixes without too much trouble.  What are the top 2-3 bug #'s we need fixed?
<rickspencer3> ccheney, could you drive this please ^
<ccheney> rickspencer3: ok
<rickspencer3> ACTION: ccheney to determine bugs in inkscape on critical path to building open clip art
<rickspencer3> any other business?
<bryceh> ccheney, unfortunately I've not had much time to spend on inkscape lately, but I know folks who can help
<pitti> dobey: pong (I'll take a quick break now, but will answer scrollback)
<rickspencer3> ok
<ccheney> bryceh: the issue behind bug 516771 is the one affecting openclipart
<rickspencer3> thanks all
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 516771 in openclipart "openclipart-openoffice.org cannot be installed in lucid as it wants to remove openoffice" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/516771
<rickspencer3> see you in Eastern Edition
<didrocks> thanks everyone :)
<bryceh> ccheney, *looking*
<ArneGoetje> thanks
<ccheney> bryceh: when building it shows this forever ** (inkscape:21087): WARNING **: helper-fns::helperfns_read_vector() Unable to convert ",0.8571428571428572,1,1" to number
<ccheney> bryceh: it does that with both the old version in the archive and the one to sync from debian
<bryceh> ccheney, hmm
<ccheney> bryceh: there is an even newer version upstream that isn't in debian yet, if it is change in how inkscape works that might fix it but i haven't looked at it yet
<chrisccoulson> pitti - did you see any scrollback from last night (about apport attaching crash files to bug reports)?
<chrisccoulson> i forgot to ask you this morning
<bryceh> ccheney, do you have a link to a full build log?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I saw it from scrollback, and reported an LP bug
<chrisccoulson> pitti - thanks
<ccheney> bryceh: i can regenerate one but it was 10GB when i killed it
<dobey> pitti: just wondering if we need the same level of UI freeze exception to remove UI, or if we can just get away with an e-mail notifying of the chaange
<seb128> asac: hey
<ccheney> bryceh: probably could be killed after a few MB though since the older log was only ~ 1MB iirc
<bryceh> ccheney, my bet is that there's something in the .svg files causing the warning
<seb128> asac: can your get chrisccoulson's nm-applet merge request in lucid?
<ccheney> bryceh: ok
<bryceh> ccheney, it would be helpful to have a specific svg file which generates the warning, for testing
<ccheney> bryceh: i'll generate a build and kill it as soon as that warning starts and get you the log
<bryceh> ccheney, my bet is that some of the files were generated by something other than inkscape (illustrator maybe?) and has some svg that inkscape doesn't grok very well
<bryceh> ccheney, if the issue is merely that it's generating that warning, well we can quell it if that solves the build problem
<pitti> dobey: then you'd need to subscribe to the ubuntu-doc ML; I guess a bug report and subscribing ubuntu-doc is easier
<ccheney> bryceh: ok
<bryceh> ccheney, but if the build log shows there's also a legitimate error cropping up, that'll need a stronger fix
<asac> seb128: yes. he can ping me directly too ;) (or did i ignore him on this?)
<ccheney> bryceh: ok
<asac> is that about the upgrading thing?
<asac> e.g. missing resource?
<seb128> asac: no, that one can't be fixed apparently
<ccheney> bryceh: should have a log for you in a few min
<bryceh> ccheney, ok
<seb128> asac: it's old running code and pixbuf loader having libc versions mismatch after the update
<chrisccoulson> asac - bug 460144
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 460144 in notify-osd "nm applet doesn't close notification when it is obsolete" [Low,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/460144
<asac> seb128: why are pixbuf loaders loaded that late?
<asac> shouldnt those be loaded first time an icon is loaded?
<seb128> asac: they are unloaded until needed again apparently
<asac> so i assume they get unloaded int he meantime ... why is that happening ;)
<asac> thats bad
<asac> really bad
<asac> noone should do that ;)
<seb128> lol
<asac> really. that alwaysw will call for upgrade problems ;)
<seb128> so it needs changes in the hardy and karmic versions
<seb128> if you want to fix that
<asac> yes. mvo wants to make a patch for that ;)
<seb128> asac: right, sort of, the lazy init change for lucid has fallback stock icons though
<seb128> asac: so after lucid it will display a fallback icon rather than exiting
<asac> hmm. ok that doesnt help us now ;)
<seb128> asac: right, better suggestions are welcome
<seb128> asac: otherwise we will just have to do with that error on upgrade
<seb128> downloads are done anyway so it doesn't break upgrades
<asac> network is not going down?
<seb128> only wifi
<seb128> right that's an issue
<mvo> well, it does break updates for stuff that requires network, like the mscorefonts (not sure that this is still relevant) or flashplugin-installer
<seb128> but we are out of good ideas
<seb128> would restart nm-applet work?
<seb128> ie would it reconnect?
<mvo> has someone actually looked at the code if the loaders are unloaded immediately or if there is some sort of timeout?
<seb128> I didn't
<mvo> I wonder if the idea to trigger theme changed signals at the start of the upgrade (or even periodically) would help
<mvo> the other option is restarting I guess, but that gets messy quickly
<ccheney> bryceh: the build log for the parts that worked even looks substantially different than when it was built during karmic cycle
<bryceh> ccheney, I'd be interested in seeing a comparison, that might provide some clues
<ccheney> bryceh: i'm seeing svg->png of 10524 x 16000 pixels which i can't find in the old build log
<ccheney> bryceh: i don't know enough about the package to know if it was just less verbose before or if that is a bug itself
<bryceh> yeah could be just different verbosities
<ccheney> watching a build makes it go much slower, heh
<bryceh> ccheney, heh
<ccheney> my guess is that inkscape doesn't like something about one of the svg's and gets stuck in an infinite loop
 * ccheney still waiting for it to find that file
<ccheney> it just found it :)
<davmor2> http://www.pcpro.co.uk/blogs/2010/03/23/ubuntu-10-4-beta-is-bloody-brilliant/
<ccheney> bryceh: http://people.canonical.com/~ccheney/openclipart_0.18+dfsg-8_amd64.build
<ccheney> bryceh: if i am reading the old build log right it processed it fine at that time
<ccheney> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/26713663/buildlog_ubuntu-karmic-i386.openclipart_0.18%2Bdfsg-8_FULLYBUILT.txt.gz
<bryceh> (inkscape:7011): Gdk-CRITICAL **: gdk_display_list_devices: assertion `GDK_IS_DISPLAY (display)' failed
<bryceh> heh
<bryceh> "Waaaaa where's X on this machine??"
<bryceh> ccheney, well a plentitude of warnings in there and lots that could be cleaned up better, but looks like it didn't fail anywhere
<bryceh> ccheney, btw openclipart also uses launchpad - https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/openclipart
<bryceh> ccheney, so if there are openclipart bugs in launchpad, should be pretty easy to upstream them
<ccheney> bryceh: ok well i can let it run longer, but it grew to over 10GB logfile with those messages scrolling
<ccheney> it may be that it just finds multiple files it is doing that for but i am not sure
<ccheney> i killed it at 10GB not sure how much longer it would have continued
<ccheney> bryceh: is that warning not just repeating forever? it doesn't seem to change
 * bryceh lp's #545279
<ccheney> that seems like a different issue than the never ending warning message though?
<ccheney> the log shows 4 different helper-fns::helperfns_read_vector, then all the rest after that is the same number conversion
<ccheney> i saw a number of the SP_PROP_CLIP_PATH in the file but they didn't loop infinitely
 * bryceh lp's lp #545286
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 545286 in openclipart "Unimplemented style property SP_PROP_CLIP_RULE: value: evenodd" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/545286
<Keybuk> seb128: just once, I'd like the seahorse pgp dialog to appear *on top* of my windows
<bryceh> ccheney, can you check if the build script which calls inkscape is using the -z, --without-gui flag?
<ccheney> bryceh: ok will check
<bryceh> ccheney, if not, then that should definitely be added.  That should quell the GDK_IS_DISPLAY failed warnings
<bryceh> and possibly the quark asserts too
<ccheney> bryceh: doesn't appear to
<ccheney> http://pastebin.com/Qrm2RL48
<ccheney> looks like debian builds the pngs directly in rules
<bryceh> ccheney, ew
<bryceh> ok getting called to lunch... bbiab
<didrocks> diner time, bbl
<bryceh> lp #545290
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 545290 in openclipart "Need option to not display spinner and progress data" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/545290
<ccheney> bryceh: ok
<ccheney> bryceh: not sure if those bugs are actually issues with openclipart itself or with the debian packaging of it
<ccheney> bryceh: it looks like it is from debian though
<ccheney> bryceh: oh and however this is happening it built on debian
<ccheney> but as it is a single build there is no build log unfortunately :-\
 * ccheney may try building the debian version of inkscape and see if that helps
<asac> bryceh: how bad would you feel about this? http://pastebin.com/4bLjKSsP
<jcastro> bryceh: am I reading this wrong or is your patch buglist waaaaay smaller than before?
<bryceh> jcastro, well I've been working on it, but there's still a fair ways to go
<jcastro> bryceh: are you using +patches now or your thing still?
<seb128> kenvandine, there?
<bryceh> asac, not bad at all.  Looks acceptable to me
<bryceh> jcastro, still using my own thing; I found +patches was missing a lot of my patches when I looked at it a couple weeks ago.  Haven't looked again lately
<bryceh> jcastro, how many is it showing now?  It should be 29
<bryceh> actually it should be >29.  I omit some stuff from my report (like openchrome patches)
<jcastro> which team?
<jcastro> I am looking at ~ubuntu-x-swat
<Keybuk> ah, I can't type into X again
<Keybuk> I know what this means
 * Keybuk types his passphrase
<ccheney> bryceh: the -z didn't seem to help any with the infinite loop
<seb128> Keybuk, are you sure you don't use gpg-agent?
<Keybuk> how would I know
<seb128> Keybuk, echo GPG_AGENT_INFO
<seb128> ups
<seb128> Keybuk, echo $GPG_AGENT_INFO
<Keybuk> quest scott% echo $GPG_AGENT_INFO
<Keybuk> /tmp/seahorse-zGscAV/S.gpg-agent:1349:1
<Keybuk> iz seahorse
<seb128> hum k
<bryceh> ccheney, hmm I think bug #545290 is not in the debian build script, at least I don't see anything that's producing it.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 545290 in openclipart "Need option to not display spinner and progress data" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/545290
<bryceh> ccheney, ./office/telephone/mobile_phone_01.svg seems to be the wayward file
<ccheney> bryceh: well ubuntu didn't modify openclipart from debian and not much of OOo so i think maybe its something done to the ubuntu specific changes in inkscape
<ccheney> bryceh: yea saw that it worked fine with older inkscape in karmic, but not in lucid
<bryceh> ccheney, try running inkscape --export-png=foo.png  ./office/telephone/mobile_phone_01.svg and see if you can repro it
<ccheney> yea that causes it just by itself
<bryceh> ok
<bryceh> progress :-)
<asac> bryceh: cool. i will double verify and give it to you. would be great to get this in
<bryceh> ccheney, can you email me or post me that particular .svg file?
<jcastro> bryceh: check out this wishful thinking! https://edge.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-x-swat/+patches
<bryceh> jcastro, hah, well at least all the Fix Released ones are gone
<bryceh> jcastro, that's not right though...  http://www2.bryceharrington.org:8080/X/Reports/ubuntu-x-swat/patches.html
<bryceh> jcastro, and it could omit totem ;-)
<bryceh> ccheney, anyway so looks from this like the .svg is invalid
<jcastro> ok I'll have karl look at it, thanks for the info.
<bryceh> sounds like it has coordinates or data that starts with a comma
<bryceh> ",0.8571428571428572,1,1"
<ccheney> bryceh: hmm looks like even debian version of inkscape doesn't work for me
<ccheney> bryceh: yea
<bryceh> I'm curious what the .svg even looks like
<jcastro> bryceh: at the session do you remember about how many there were?
<jcastro> bryceh: it would be nice to say "it's working! to lp guys"
<bryceh> ccheney, yeah I'm pretty sure this is not a ubuntu-specific bug.  Looks like a badly formatted svg
<bryceh> still, inkscape shouldn't generate endless warnings with such syntax
<bryceh> jcastro, not offhand
<bryceh> jcastro, I may not be a good example case though
<bryceh> jcastro, my original list was maybe a hundred items or so, down to about a third now
 * jcastro nods
<bryceh> jcastro, I just make it a regular task to get 10% of the items off the list each week... ends up taking a modest hour or two per week, and the list gradually shrinks :-)
<ccheney> bryceh: yea, i am going to do one more test with debian packages inside a debian chroot as the debian guy who built it isn't sure why it is happening in ubuntu but works for debian
<bryceh> ccheney, you could also put the busted file in the debian rules to be excluded from processing as a workaround
<mvo> pitti: do you know anything about why fglrx-modaliases is in restricted now? this causes depwait in update-manager
<pitti> mvo: hm, that was certainly not on purpose
<pitti> mvo: moved back to main
<mvo> pitti: thanks
<pitti> of course we just missed the publisher
<ccheney> bryceh: yea once i look at what really happens with debian build i will likely do that
<ccheney> bryceh: it might be a 64bit issue or something like that, not sure yet
<bryceh> possibly
<ccheney> bryceh: assuming it really does work on debian
<bryceh> or some gcc optimization unique to us
<bryceh> fwiw it's crapping on a g_strtod call
<ccheney> ok
<bryceh> you might try making a simple C test case that calls g_strtod(",0.8571428571428572,1,1") and see if the output of that differs on debian vs ubuntu
<ccheney> ok, making a sid chroot now
<bryceh> char *ptr; g_strtod(",0.8571428571428572,1,1", &ptr); if (&ptr) { g_warning("Foobar! Broken"); exit(1); }
<bryceh> something like that
<bryceh> oh I think I see why it's endlessly looping
<ccheney> bryceh: oh?
<bryceh> wait
<bryceh> nevermind, I'm wrong
<ccheney> ok
<bryceh> but it looks like something in inkscape is going, "Convert this string to a number.  Oh it's not a number, hand back the non-numerical part.  There is stuff left in the string; ok go to 1."
<bryceh> like maybe there's double commas or something
<bryceh> ccheney, if you have the .svg on hand, grep for 0.85714285 and see what characters immediately precede that
<ccheney>         <feFuncR amplitude="1" exponent="1" intercept="0" offset="0" slope="1" tableValues="0.6142857142857143,0.8571428571428572,1,1" type="table"/>
<ccheney> it seems to be that
<kenvandine> seb128, hey, what's up?
<seb128> kenvandine, hello
<kenvandine> bryceh, is there any known problems with resuming using the nvidia binary driver?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i've got no idea what's going on with bug 543932
<kenvandine> like X just not lighting up?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 543932 in gnome-session "indicator-applet-session must be running for session idle to happen" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/543932
<seb128> kenvandine, can you review the change on bug #476662, the submitter says your append change is buggy
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 476662 in empathy "Notifications use append instead of replace" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/476662
<seb128> chrisccoulson, me neither
<kenvandine> seb128, i'll look
<seb128> kenvandine, thanks
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I added a new comment to suggest the bug setting might not be adapted, it seems only kees has the issue so far
<bryceh> kenvandine, yeah being discussed on #ubuntu-x.  tseliot is handling nvidia so he's the guy to talk to about it
<kenvandine> bryceh, ok, great... thx
<bryceh> kenvandine, Sarvatt mentioned suspend/resume issues 1 out of 5 tries a bit earlier on #ubuntu-x, he might also have clue
<kenvandine> ok, my wife's laptop seems to be suffering from it
<kenvandine> looks like resume is complete, but the display never lights up
<kenvandine> was fine in karmic, she kicked me off of it for now.. so can't debug until later, she *needed* to get to facebook :)
<mvo> tedg: one of the upgrade feedback I got so far was/is that "Broadcast" does not mean anything to most people (including me). having a more meaningful word this in the applet would be nice
<tedg> mvo: You are playing with fire :)
<mvo> tedg: sorry, just passing on my feedback
<tedg> mvo: The problem is that the only thing that really means something is "Twitter" which is copyrighted.
<seb128> mvo, it's a sabdfl area you are stepping in ;-)
<mvo> tedg: weeh, ok
<seb128> mvo, just saying ;-)
<mvo> the thing is that I just read a lot of the upgrae feedback I got so far
 * seb128 hugs mvo
<mvo> and this I saw along with the button ordering and moving shutdown away from system
<seb128> mvo, please keep sharing feedback you read with us
<mvo> but other than that it seems to be working remarkable well
<mvo> (for a beta)
<seb128> mvo, the system menu change is there for like 3 cycles now
<tedg> mvo: I'm not disagreeing, I think that we just haven't found something better :(
<mvo> seb128: hardy->lucid
<seb128> mvo, do we have many hardy upgraders already?
<mvo> seb128: is part of the feedback
<mvo> seb128: not many
<seb128> mvo, I would have though those would wait for after stable
<tedg> mvo: We had "Microblogging" but that didn't really poll any better.
<mvo> tedg: I was about to suggest that, at least I (or I assume most technical users) have a clue what it means
<mvo> tedg: when I read "broadcast" first I though about abahi
<mvo> avahi
<mvo> or network broadcasts in general
<mvo> but yeah, if twitter is copyrighted than I can see that its a pain to find a good word describing it :)
<Nafai> I think about radio or tv when I think of broadcast
<seb128> yeah, I think micro-blogging was easier to understand
<tedg> mvo: Yeah, I can see that.  Is there a better translations in other languages?
<mvo> not in german I think, but broadcast is really terible to translate AFAICS in german, it means "broadcast" in the tv/radio kind of sense, noone would get a different meaning
<tedg> I wonder if we could argue in court that the name "twitter" has become generic ;)
 * mvo actually wonders how "blog" is translated, but I guess just as "blog" :)
<mvo> anyway, just wanted to mention it
<tedg> Heh, we could just break it all down.  Texting-like-thing-from-your-computer :)
 * mvo likes that
<didrocks> pitti: seb128: ok, new version of clutter (and clutter-gtk and gtk itself) uploaded in the ubuntu-desktop ppa. I'm playing with it since half an hour and don't have any pitfall. Even more, UNE is pretty fast with new clutter too :)
<seb128> didrocks, excellent!
<seb128> didrocks, good work!
<didrocks> should be built for tomorrow morning
<didrocks> seb128: thanks :)
<didrocks> seb128: I've directly uploaded pango and atk to ubuntu
<seb128> I will new those when they are built
<seb128> thanks
<didrocks> the rest is in the ppa
<didrocks> thanks
<pitti> didrocks: great!
<ccheney> bryceh: yea exactly the same problem on debian so will just work around the bug by skipping that file and see if it finishes
<bryceh> ccheney, ok
<bryceh> ccheney, probably worth filing a bug about the busted file too
<ccheney> bryceh: yea, will file a bug about the problems i find including that one
<bryceh> great
<ccheney> bryceh: rene (debian) can now reproduce the issue as well apparently
<pitti> seb128: time bzr get lp:ubuntu/gvfs -> 32 s
 * bryceh nods
<pitti> seb128: would you mind if we switch branches to lp:ubuntu/package one by one which are fast and up to date?
<pitti> seb128: (I'd drop vcs-bzr and do a commit to the old branch to delete everything and add a README "use lp:ubuntu/package, Luke")
<seb128> pitti, I was going to wait until+1 to not disrupt workflow
<seb128> and have time to discuss at uds what we do with the bzr history etc
<pitti> seb128: ok, understood
<seb128> and maybe set some updated documentation on how we use it
<seb128> but
<seb128> if you want to do some go for it
<seb128> we will call those testing ;-)
<seb128> ie gvfs I doubt many people will touch
<pitti> I touch it pretty often
<seb128> right
<pitti> seb128: I'd like to do the next upstream version update
<seb128> I meant out of you and me
<pitti> seb128: I'd commit to vetting/updating documentation for upgrading to a new upstream version
<pitti> if we switch
<seb128> ok, deal
<pitti> but I'm interested in how it goes
<seb128> I want your internet btw ;-)
<seb128> real	2m41.141s
<seb128> there
<pitti> uh
<pitti> 6 MBit here
<seb128> 1M there
<pitti> seb128: ok, let's perhaps not have too many of them for now then
 * desrt plays a fun game, but it quickly turns frustrating
<seb128> desrt, which one?
<pitti> desrt: got a new vim plugin? :-)
<seb128> pitti, well I will quickly have checkout of most GNOME sources so don't stop for me
<desrt> the copy-dpkg.deb-into-a-chroot-and-try-to-install-it game
<seb128> pitti, real	0m19.695s
<seb128> pitti, that's apt-get source
<seb128> just to compare
<pitti> seb128: ok, let's do gvfs for now; we have a lot of other packages not in bzr, so it won't make too much of a difference
<seb128> right
<seb128> I'm interested in having some testcases too
<desrt> there are some really silly dependencies -- some declared, some not
<zyga> hello
<desrt> like dpkg doesn't declare a dependency on perl, but it needs it
<seb128> perl is in base
<desrt> and you need libstdc++ to install lzma which is needed to install dpkg
<desrt> base is just assumed?
<seb128> yes
<desrt> hmm.
<desrt> i guess apt is in base too
<seb128> it's what you should always have
<pitti> seb128: ok, lp:~ubuntu-desktop/gvfs/ubuntu locked down; should be pretty obvious :)
 * desrt is trying for ultra-minimal :)
<seb128> pitti, "locked down"?
<seb128> pitti, how do you do that? just deleted it?
<seb128> pitti, which makes me think we should play cleaning old bzr
<seb128> I had a look to the ubuntu-desktop list recently
<pitti> seb128: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/%7Eubuntu-desktop/gvfs/ubuntu/revision/72
<seb128> there is lot of cruft there
<desrt> seb128: how do i find a list of 'base'?
<pitti> how do you mean?
<seb128> hehe
<pitti> seb128: I think tla actually had a "lock" thing back then :)
<desrt> <seb128> nobody can be told what base is.  they have to experience it for themselves.
<seb128> pitti, https:/code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop
<seb128> pitti, look to the list
 * pitti fixes the prefix and looks
<pitti> seb128: uh, I see what you mean
<seb128> I've to go for dinner
<seb128> desrt, sorry I don't know of hand, check on google ;-)
<desrt> seb128: i'm just going to install a pbuilder and figure it out from there :p
<seb128> or that
<seb128> bbl
<didrocks> locking is quite strict with pitti :)
<desrt> ta
<didrocks> seb128: enjoy your dinner :)
<pitti> seb128: enjoy! I'm uploading gvfs now, and uploaded usbmuxd; would appreaciate feedback how it goes with your ipod
<desrt> hmm.  pbuilder is really too much stuff.
<pitti> seb128: FYI: bzr bd -- -b Just Works (TM), using pristine-tar
<desrt> dbus, glib, gnupg.  bah.
<ccheney> bryceh: actually i misunderstood rene, it worked for him on amd64 but he didn't build it in a chroot
<ccheney> bryceh: so either something else in debian is helping him or its a kernel issue or some other weirdness
<bryceh> yeah
<ccheney> bryceh: the test printed broken
<ccheney> bryceh: the test you gave me to try
<bryceh> ccheney, *nod*
<bryceh> ccheney, did you try under debian?
<ccheney> bryceh: yea that was where i tried it
<ccheney> bryceh: and for me it didn't work under debian in a chroot either
<ccheney> it being building openclipart
<zyga> how about we make the power off switch bright-orange instead of dark-red? orange is much more visible and fits the color scheme
<ccheney> zyga: isn't it just black currently?
<zyga> I just upgraded to latest packages and the power switch is red
<ccheney> zyga: ah ok
<zyga> (power switch on the right of the top panel)
<ccheney> yea, i haven't logged out today
<zyga> I think it's better than plain white/gray that it was before but orange is more visible
 * zyga needs to reboot
<pitti> good night everyone!
<kenvandine> hey seb128... you got time for a quick package to sponsor?
<seb128> kenvandine, yes
<kenvandine> ~ubuntu-desktop/libubuntuone/ubuntu/
<kenvandine> thx!
<kenvandine> damn... rb plugin was rejected too..
<kenvandine> seb128, mind sponsoring that too? it is a simple dep fix
<kenvandine>  for none gnome users
<seb128> ok
<seb128> that's the one Riddell reported right?
<kenvandine> nope
<kenvandine> lp:~ubuntu-desktop/rhythmbox-ubuntuone-music-store/ubuntu
<kenvandine> seb128, it might be a dupe though
<seb128> yes it is ;-)
<kenvandine> yeah, /me dupes it
<kenvandine> ok, i gotta run for a bit.  bbl
<kenvandine> seb128, thx!
<seb128> kenvandine, np, see you
<didrocks> time to take a shower and some rest too :)
<didrocks> see you tomorrow!
<TheMuso> Good morning.
<bryceh> hi TheMuso
<RAOF> Good morning.
<rickspencer3> Good morning guys
<RAOF> Goood morning.
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, bryceh, RAOF, I've been too busy to update the wiki from the team meeting this morning
<rickspencer3> I suppose I can paste in the IRC log though
<rickspencer3> bryceh, are you going to go over xorg status in the Eastern Edition
<rickspencer3> ?
<bryceh> sure
<bryceh> * A few tasks have been marked off https://wiki.ubuntu.com/X/Projects  Pretty good progress for first week, but we need to see more grey
<bryceh> * I made a graph showing just "lucid bugs needing developer attention":  http://www2.bryceharrington.org:8080/X/Reports/ubuntu-x-swat/totals-lucid-workqueue.svg  Ideally this curve should be going *down* but it's going *up* instead.
<bryceh> * This means we're getting new bugs coming in faster than we are processing them.  We need to step it up a bit more.
<bryceh> * I don't have a solid feel for the rate of upstreaming and fixing going on, but I sense we may be a lagging a bit.
<bryceh> let me amend my point #2 above
<bryceh> raof and sarvat really banged on -intel bugs last night and the curve *is* going down :-)
<bryceh> so kudos due to them
<bryceh> I'm still concerned with point #3, so wanted to raise an idea
<bryceh> a lot of our new bug reports right now are coming from the X freeze handler for -intel
<bryceh> I sort of wonder if we have captured "enough" bug reports on freeze issues, that we're in a case of diminishing returns and could turn it off at this point
<rickspencer3> bryceh, nice, but I was thinking when the meeting starts in like 17 minutes :)
<bryceh> might save some manpower from marking dupes, to focus on getting bugs upstreamed
<bryceh> rickspencer3, oh did I slip the gun?
<rickspencer3> lol
<rickspencer3> a bit
<bryceh> ok good, gives me time to update the status 8-)
<rickspencer3> but I see  you are uber organized as always
<rickspencer3> RAOF, TheMuso Eastern edition is in 16 minutes, right?
<ccheney> bryceh: cool it was just that one file that was the problem :)
<TheMuso> yep
<rickspencer3> or did dst screw up my calendar?
<RAOF> rickspencer3: Yup.
<RAOF> rickspencer3: No, you're in the right timezone :)
<bryceh> ccheney, excellent
<bryceh> ccheney, it's probably some weird buggered up svg. still worth a bug report
 * ccheney will sync merge the new version from debian and verify it still works and will be done with it :)
<ccheney> bryceh: yea
<ccheney> 1 rc bug down 3 to go :)
<rickspencer3> anyone know what happened to the "don't play a sound with the gdm greeter" thing seb128 was working on?
<rickspencer3> oops
<rickspencer3> looks like it's not going too well
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, bryceh, RAOF, robert_ancell, Eastern Edition?
<bryceh> \o/
<RAOF> :)
<TheMuso> sure
<rickspencer3> I haven't had time to update the wiki page, but I pasted in the irc log:
<rickspencer3> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2010-03-23
<seb128> rickspencer3, the gdm thing didrocks has it almost done, tomorrow should be ready for lucid
<rickspencer3> seb128, oh great
<rickspencer3> the irc logs suggested that you had punted it
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, yup
<seb128> I helped didrocks to figure why his got was not working
<seb128> his *code*
<rickspencer3> seb128, I was thinking about writing a script to replace the current sound file, and supply a silent ogg with it
<seb128> ie we have been debugging that today
<rickspencer3> well ...
<seb128> not a bad idea, you could have suggested it earlier ;-)
<rickspencer3> between seb128, robert_ancell, and didrocks, Ubuntu will truly be the reservoir of GDM knowledge
<seb128> we got it working though now so it should be ok
<seb128> don't forget pitti
<rickspencer3> pitti?
<rickspencer3> I did not read the logs that far ;)
<seb128> he has been fighting gdm to get multiple keyboard layouts working half of the day today
<rickspencer3> oh yes
 * rickspencer3 kicks GDM
<TheMuso> rickspencer3: A good idea in theory the silent ogg file, but that makes packaging stuff messy.
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, it would have been just a total ugly hack
<TheMuso> rickspencer3: right
<rickspencer3> not a feature or a product
<rickspencer3> basically, I was envisioning wget + mv :)
<TheMuso> eew
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, hehe
<rickspencer3> that's how I roll
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, RAOF, robert_ancell, bryceh had a chance to look over the log?
<RAOF> Just finished.
<TheMuso> still looking...
<rickspencer3> k
<rickspencer3> take your time
<bryceh> done
 * TheMuso can't scan like you guys can
 * rickspencer3 is updating the wiki as  you read
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, right, and no rush
<TheMuso> yep understood.
<bryceh> TheMuso, I caught the tail end of the meeting when I got up this morning, so I'm cheating a bit ;-)
<robert_ancell> done
<rickspencer3> bryceh, can I ask you to paste your notes directly in teh wiki under == xorg update ==?
<bryceh> rickspencer3, ok
<rickspencer3> thanks
<TheMuso> alright I got the gist of the log.
<TheMuso> hopefully I haven't missed anything important whilst reading it.
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, I'm sure all is well
<TheMuso> ok so I'm done.
<rickspencer3> how about if I tough on some high points before turning the mic over to bruce?
<rickspencer3> uh
<rickspencer3> bryceh, ?
<TheMuso> lol
 * RAOF didn't know bryce had moved to .au ;)
<bryceh> sure
<rickspencer3> it's the influence of all you ausies
<bryceh> I like aussies :-)
<rickspencer3> ok, so music store is out
<rickspencer3> in beta
<rickspencer3> there are bugs
<robert_ancell> yay!
<robert_ancell> (not for the bugs)
<rickspencer3> OLS has the FFE exceptions
<TheMuso> The widget used for web stuff in that is using webkit correct?
<rickspencer3> they look doable
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, I dunno
<RAOF> TheMuso: Correct
<TheMuso> ok
<TheMuso> thanks RAOF.
<rickspencer3> so basically, not accessible
<rickspencer3> I think screen readers still can't traverse in there too well, right TheMuso?
<TheMuso> rickspencer3: I'll check today, but some work has gone into webkit to fix stuff recently so I'll see how we go.
<rickspencer3> that would be nice to know
<rickspencer3> thank you for looking into that
<rickspencer3> of course, the HTML is not rendered by us, so even if webkit works, no gauruntees
<rickspencer3> moving on
<rickspencer3> Kubuntu got their beta out despite last minute issues with Plymouth
<rickspencer3> lots of work to work around this
<rickspencer3> tseliot will fix or has fixed the issue for Kubuntu
<TheMuso> Yay plymouth.
<rickspencer3> (one of our release critical bugs)
<RAOF> Yeah, it's been somewhat of a problem child.
<rickspencer3> mozilla update ... looks like the Hardy epiphany backport is nearing completion
<rickspencer3> the crasher was figured out by asac, but it means ccheney has lots of recoding to do
<rickspencer3> UDS ...
<rickspencer3> you should have booked travel by now
<TheMuso> booked, will update wiki today.
<rickspencer3> if there is any ambiguity about your dates, please ping me out of the channel
<rickspencer3> thanks TheMuso
<rickspencer3> start thinking about blueprints .. but don't start on them ;)
<rickspencer3> stay focused on Lucid for now
<rickspencer3> so we also discussed specific bugs and such in release status
<rickspencer3> the top line for me is, I would like to see our release critical bugs significantly decrease this week
<rickspencer3> get them down to like 10
<rickspencer3> so if you have any assigned to you ....
<rickspencer3> please fix them
<rickspencer3> chriscoulson quit just in time
<TheMuso> heh
<rickspencer3> any questions before I turn it over to bryceh?
<TheMuso> no
<rickspencer3> RAOF?
<RAOF> No, I'm good.
<rickspencer3> ok
<rickspencer3> bryceh?
<bryceh> I've pasted in the status report into the wiki page
<bryceh> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2010-03-23
<bryceh> briefly:
<bryceh> -nouveau has some stability trouble
<bryceh> -intel we're getting lots of bug reports but seems at it's usual level of stability
<bryceh> -ati seems to be pretty good
<rickspencer3> bryceh, it seems my mini 10v has been less stable after repeated suspends and resumes
<rickspencer3> does this ring a bell?
<seb128> my laptop freezes or crash every second resume there
<seb128> i965, dell laptop
<bryceh> yes, we have been getting a lot of X freeze reports on -intel
<RAOF> If that's suspending by closing the lid, then I think we've got a good candidate to fix the crashes.
<bryceh> in fact I want to talk about that a bit more
<rickspencer3> ok
<rickspencer3> go ahead
<bryceh> regarding bug triaging work, we've got a lot of it to do.  I think we made some solid progress this last week
<bryceh> in particular, the new x freeze handler is capturing a LOT of bug reports
<bryceh> raof and sarvatt did some good hammering on that yesterday and got a lot of dupes done
<rickspencer3> bryceh, so I see you are suggesting turning attention from triaging to fixing, am I reading that right?
<bryceh> but I'm wondering if we should turn it off - we may already have more reports than we can deal with, and a lot of the new ones may just be dupes
<rickspencer3> turn off apport, make what you think are fixes, turn it on again?
<bryceh> rickspencer3, righto
<rickspencer3> bryceh, if you think it's the right thing, I say "do it"
<seb128> we will turn apport off soon for lucid anyway
<Sarvatt> rickspencer3: I've been working with apw on the fix for that and I have sent him a fix that we have requested testing on, it fixes the hangs post resume and I have pushed it along upstream
<bryceh> seb128, that's my thinking as well
<rickspencer3> Sarvatt, thanks for the update
<bryceh> I'd defer to raof and sarvatt though as they've been looking at these bugs more closely than me
<bryceh> RAOF, Sarvatt, your feelings?
<rickspencer3> Sarvatt, RAOF turn off apport for intel freezes?
<RAOF> The X freeze bugs are often low-quality, too, partially because of technical flaws and partially because it's a crash report that pops up at some time when the users' not very interested.
<Sarvatt> definite yay from me regarding turning it off
<rickspencer3> +1, +1
<RAOF> I think turning it off is a good idea.
<RAOF> +1
<bryceh> ok great, I'll make it so
<seb128> +1
<bryceh> RAOF, how are you doing with bug triaging and upstreaming?
<rickspencer3> (oh, my +1s were for Sarvatt and RAOF, I don't think my opinion matters much here ;)
<Sarvatt> sorry, was reproducing the lshw funky color problem and I narrowed it down to vga16fb being loaded causing it, haven't read all of the scrollback yet
<bryceh> Sarvatt, yeah was looking at that one last week
<bryceh> Sarvatt, do we need vga16fb loaded for any particular reason?
<RAOF> bryceh: Nouveau's well in hand, at least the bugs that we get reported.  I'm less confident with -intel, but a bit more experience will help there.
<Sarvatt> for the fallback splash screen when there is no KMS
<bryceh> RAOF, have you been sending the nouveau bug reports upstream?  How's upstream been doing at giving useful feedback?
<bryceh> Sarvatt, so maybe something should rmmod that if kms is on?
<RAOF> bryceh: They've been going upstream.  Upstream's been giving some useful feedback on the bugtracker, and some in #nouveau, but I feel the need to poke them a bit to get things looked at.
<bryceh> ok good
<bryceh> well, miles better than -nv :-)
<RAOF> One of the things I want to do today or tomorrow is to whip up a script to make mmiotracing easy, and point people at it.
<bryceh> RAOF, good
<RAOF> Now that the -17 kernel is a gogo.
<RAOF> It should be easy to automate the kind of mmiotrace upstream wants, after the user has booted into rescue mode.
<bryceh> RAOF, ok we can put that into failsafe-x or something :-)
<RAOF> Heh.
<bryceh> rickspencer3, ok done
<rickspencer3> thanks bryceh
<rickspencer3> much appreciated
<RAOF> Would we want to do that, though?  mmiotrace is a bit of a niche case :)
<bryceh> RAOF, yes
<rickspencer3> bryceh, on sum, how do you think graphics quality will compare Lucid versus Karmic?
<bryceh> rickspencer3, -intel - about the same.  -ati some performance regression.  nvidia some stability regressions
<rickspencer3> so not as good
<bryceh> that's if we shipped right now today
<rickspencer3> ah
<rickspencer3> so what about by April 29th?
<bryceh> I have high hopes the next few weeks we can get fixes in to make it improved
<rickspencer3> so you think maybe Lucid > Karmic?
<bryceh> kms has been a tough seed to digest but we're working on it
<Sarvatt> for the intel bugs, we have a few major issues at the moment. 915 through 945 mobile GPU's are hanging with a solid color after resume which I made a patch for to disable framebuffer compression and it will be in soon, DPMS off events that happen from screen blanking, closing the lid or suspend/resume are causing GPU hangs for *alot* of people and the fix for that was in 2.6.32-15 but (accidentally?) dropped in 2.6.32-16 and -17 and I've b
<Sarvatt> een pinging the kernel people about it. On ATI we've spotted a few regressions since the 2.6.33 DRM was added in -16 such as flickering on specific chipsets that need to have the default module options quirked to work right. For nouveau I've also seen a few reports where a noaccel quirk would be helpful since it results in an unusable desktop without it.
<bryceh> I'm confident by the time we release we can make Lucid an all around more solid experience
<RAOF> It would be nice if the nouveau DDX would just bail if it detects that the GPU's locked; it seems like it should be possible.
<bryceh> we've got a lot of patches on hand already.  We're also well organized and with better tools and processes than we've ever had at our disposal.  So I think we're going to rock out this next month.
<bryceh> RAOF, yeah
<bryceh> rickspencer3, over :-)
<rickspencer3> kewl
<rickspencer3> yeah, sorry, got distracted
<rickspencer3> my xchat gnome was like a christmas lights display
<rickspencer3> :(
<rickspencer3> bryceh, great job this release
<rickspencer3> nice to have a steady hand at the helm there
<rickspencer3> !
<bryceh> oh also, I should mention a lot of these bugs we're fretting about are actually kernel bugs
<bryceh> so they involve locating and shepherding in kernel patches
<Sarvatt> the *huge* majority of bugs against xserver-xorg-video-intel nouveau and ati are kernel bugs
<bryceh> sarvatt's been doing great work at this, as he mentioned
<rickspencer3> thanks Sarvatt!
<RAOF> Thinking of sponsorship to UDS... :)
<rickspencer3> what, huh?
<rickspencer3> RAOF, good point
<RAOF> Sarvatt: Are you available to come to UDS?  Has bryceh pinged you about that yet? :)
<Sarvatt> I put in a request :)
 * Sarvatt crosses fingers.
<bryceh> yeah I sent names to rick.  rickspencer3 did you pass them along whereever they need to go?
<rickspencer3> bryceh, sort of
<rickspencer3> I couldn't use the system because of the dash in my lp user name
<rickspencer3> but they fixed it today
<bryceh> btw, I've been having some fun going through the new milestone report - http://www2.bryceharrington.org:8080/X/Reports/ubuntu-x-swat/milestone-bugs.html
<bryceh> this includes both ones targeted to lucid and ones that were proposed for lucid
<bryceh> it's amazing how many nominations are proposed for lucid, but no one actually tested that the bug still exists in lucid.  *boggle*
<bryceh> I hope to have that report cleared to 0 by release
<RAOF> :)
<bryceh> one way or another ;-)
<RAOF> Hm.  Is there some way we can get users a better 2d performance testing tool than gtkperf?
<RAOF> There's that cairo-tracing work; is that easily accessible?  That would provide a more useful benchmark for people.
<bryceh> RAOF, cairo has a really good set of tests
<bryceh> yes, that's a really solid test suite
<bryceh> cworth is also keen on helping with it, if we have troubles
<RAOF> Ok.  So do we just need to advertise it more, or is it actually difficult to run?  What package is it in?
<bryceh> for 3d... well I'm contemplating writing a script to auto-close any bug that mentions "glxgears" in its description ;-)
<Sarvatt> its not packaged
<RAOF> bryceh: Can we patch in --iacknowledgethistoolisnotabenchmark again? :)
<bryceh> I recall it being really easy to run... so yeah just needs packaging I guess.  Would be sweet to have
<bryceh> RAOF, heh.  In fact I stripped out reporting the fps calculation
<bryceh> so now people have to divide in their head to get fps out of it.  Still they do this! :-/
<Sarvatt> cairo-perf-trace has a seperate git repo of benchmarks to run thats close to 1GB that you need to grab too
<bryceh> wow
<RAOF> That's a lot of data.  How many benchmarks are in there?
<Sarvatt> 19
<bryceh> maybe it'd be best to package a minimal set, targeted at average users
<RAOF> I guess it might not be that many; doesn't the test work by recording all the cairo requests & then replaying them?  That'd pull out a lot of data quickly :)
<RAOF> And possibly give the option to download more
<Sarvatt> that size i said was lzma compressed too.. :D
<bryceh> testers that need the full suite are probably more likely to want to run from git anyway
<RAOF> You might be able to collect tests into groups, too, based on what sort of performance they're testing?
<Sarvatt> you need to mess with env variables while using it anyway, its easy to build, just clone cairo git make perf and clone cairo-traces in the perf directory
<RAOF> That's already three big steps harder than gtkperf, which is what we'd like to replace :)
<bryceh> I think we put rick to sleep
<Sarvatt> there's always xrenderbenchmark - http://cgit.freedesktop.org/~aplattner/xrenderbenchmark/
<bryceh> no I think cairoperf is the right way to go
<bryceh> but set it up to kind of a minimal configuration
<RAOF> It's not synthetic, so you can be confident that it's actually measuring things people care about.
<Sarvatt> http://paste.ubuntu.com/400264/
<Sarvatt> there's the sizes on the "short" benchmarks :D
<RAOF> And those are lzma compressed?
<Sarvatt> nope, have to extract to run them
<RAOF> So they *are* compressed?
<RAOF> Or that's the uncompressed size, because you need to have extracted them to run them?
<Sarvatt> when you clone it yeah but thats the extracted sizes, 522MB for the condensed ones
<RAOF> I don't think users will mind having big sizes for their benchmark suites.  Download size is I think more of a problem.
<RAOF> crimsun: Is it possible at all to work around the crazy bad dB reporting for usb speakers?  It interacts *really* badly with the snapping to 100% that Sound Preferences does.
<crimsun> RAOF: yes, it's possible, but you'll lose hot(un)plug via udev.
<crimsun> it's documented at DebuggingSoundProblems/KarmicCaveats
<RAOF> That's a pretty bad tradeoff for usb speakers :(
<crimsun> go smack your usb speakers manufacturer
<crimsun> that said, to some degree, it can be hacked around in the usbaudio driver, but that's pretty fragile
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-03-24
<leftyfb> So has it been decided that the window control buttons are going to remain on the wrong side?
<bratsche> Check the bug report.
<bratsche> Or the flamefest on the mailing list.
<leftyfb> bratsche: I don't know the location of either of these
<bratsche> Google does.
<leftyfb> Oh, I'm sorry. I was told this would be a helpful place to get these sort of answers.
<bratsche> Sorry, I guess I should have just not answered.  I don't know anything newer than what's in those two places, and I'm not interested enough to actually follow them.
<bratsche> I guess I don't really understand why it's such a big deal, so I haven't been paying attention.
<lifeless> bratsche: :P
<lifeless> bratsche: its a big deal because its shallow and easy to think about
<lifeless> complex things noone has an opinion on
<bratsche> This is why I'm not on jono's team.  I don't know how to deal with people. :)
<lifeless> bratsche: can be taught
<Nafai> bratsche: :)
<lifeless> bratsche: I don't think you're bad at it :)
<bratsche> I don't want to learn.  I hate people. :)
 * Nafai looks forward to meeting bratsche in person
<Nafai> :)
<bratsche> haha
<lifeless> bratsche: haha LIES!
<pitti> Good morning
<igoryonya> hello, is there a way to do in gnome something similar to windows explorer extensions and where do I find that information?. I need to add some programs to context menu that will appear, when you right-click on the certain file or folder or always.
<Nafai> igoryonya: #ubuntu-app-devel might be a better channel for this question, but you'll want to look at nautilus extensions
<igoryonya> Nafai: thanx
<robert_ancell> pitti, can you have a quick look at a UI change in simple-scan (bug #543384) and see if that would be a problem
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 543384 in simple-scan "Toolbar confusing for new users" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/543384
<robert_ancell> pitti, also there's a number of grammar fixes for gbrainy that should be applied.  Will these be a big issue for a freeze break?
<pitti> robert_ancell: hey, how are you?
<robert_ancell> pitti, hey, good :)
<pitti> robert_ancell: gbrainy> is it possible to apply the grammar fixes in all the .po files as well, to avoid breaking translations?
<robert_ancell> pitti, as in take the .po changes from upstream?
<pitti> robert_ancell: ah, did they fix it there?
<pitti> (or "you"?)
<robert_ancell> pitti, yeah, the fixes are coming because gbrainy is getting a lot of testing from being in the betas.  I wanted to review all the puzzles for Lucid as the author is not a native english speaker but that got skipped when I went to OEM.  So he's basically been fixing like crazy based on feedback from Ubuntu users
<pitti> sweet :)
<pitti> robert_ancell: so, grammar fixes are alright, it'd just be nice to not just do them in the code, but also in the .po files
<pitti> (upstream, preferably; we don't want to break it for everyone else)
<robert_ancell> pitti, np, I'll just make a big patch with meld and open a bug report for the freeze request
<pitti> robert_ancell: simple-scan> replied to the bug (easier to keep discussion there)
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> bonjour didrocks
<didrocks> Guten Morgen pitti
<didrocks> pitti: Albin pinged me about bug #538680, can you have a look at it when you have some time? (he is the DD responsible of that package and a MOTU too)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 538680 in e17 "Please remove e17 from the archive" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/538680
<pitti> didrocks: sounds like ubuntu-archive should be subscribed to that one?
<pitti> didrocks: ah, it is already; seems sensible
<didrocks> pitti: right, he's just pinging me to ensure it's done by beta 2, I guess :)
<didrocks> thanks pitti :)
<pitti> de rien
<seb128> hello!
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<pitti> seb128: after fixing control-center, I don't want to hear about keyboard layouts again. EVAR! :-)
<seb128> lol
 * seb128 hugs pitti for winning the great keyboard battle
<pitti> didrocks: new p-distutils-e uploaded, with the buffering fix, FYI
<seb128> pitti, I did subscribe you to some extra gvfs automount bugs btw, hope it's ok
<didrocks> pitti: oh sweet!
<seb128> lut didrocks
<didrocks> hey seb128 ;)
<pitti> after those two, that should get me on #2 again, one more than kirkland :-P
<seb128> pitti, I understand the stack now but I'm still not sure what to look for in the logs
<pitti> seb128: absolutely; I saw them, will look at them soon
<pitti> seb128: also, automounting is my pet project, I'm happy to do those bugs
<seb128> ie I don't see what is wrong
<seb128> didrocks, sorry about gtk
<seb128> didrocks, I did the update, I rebased bzr though
<seb128> didrocks, but you might have to refresh some patches now
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, I saw, no pb, will do
<seb128> thanks
<didrocks> seb128: can you NEW atk and pango when you have a sec, please?
<seb128> yes, I was just thinking about it while writting there ;-)
<seb128> I forgot yesterday
<didrocks> no pb ;)
<seb128> didrocks, had a good night otherwise?
<didrocks> I'm finishing/testing the gdm mess and then, jump into that
<seb128> cool
<didrocks> seb128: oh yes, a needed one :)
<didrocks> seb128: and you?
<seb128> lut davidbarth
<seb128> didrocks, quite good thanks
<seb128> didrocks, I managed to get to bed a bit late but not very late ;-)
<pitti> seb128, kenvandine: I'm sorry if that sounds dumb, but my messaging indicator now has "Broadcast"; that seems to open gwibber; I've heard "twittering" and "microblogging", which seem to be the usual terms for it; but "broadcast"??
<didrocks> seb128: I had a look at precisely that this morning. But as I told "I'm off now" at 8PM and finally left at 10PM, I can't say anything on that :p
<didrocks> pitti: in French, it sounds better (it was an unexisting word before "microbloggage"). Sounds ugly :)
<seb128> pitti, we discussed that with mvo and ted yesterday too
<seb128> pitti, "twitter" is copyrighted
<seb128> we can't use it
<pitti> and microblogging?
<mvo> I got feedback like this too from upgrade tests
<seb128> that's what we used before
<mvo> broadcast is really confusing
<seb128> not sure why design decided on broadcast rather than microblogging
<seb128> I would prefer microblogging too for what is worth
<seb128> it's probably feedback to bring to sabdfl or mpt though
 * mvo is currently in the world-of-pain of bzr format incompatbilities and in a bad mood because of that
<pitti> mvo: bzr upgrade?
<mvo> pitti: webui upgrade does not work, bzr+ssh upgrade does not work, I'm trying sftp upgrae now, for each upgrade it downloads 60mb of data before it fails
<mvo> bzr+ssh fails with "backup.bzr" exists *even* if I deleted it before via nautilus (that takes 5min as well)
<pitti> yes, the webui upgrade doesn't work for me either
<pitti> but rm -r backup.bzr in lftp (or nautilus) and bzr upgrade bzr+ssh:// usually does
<pitti> hmm
<pitti> so I bought an Album from the music store, and "My downloads" says "showing 1 to 0 of 0 downloads"
<mvo> not for me, I asked in #bzr already and no luck. oh well, I will keep trying. bzr and I used to be best buddies, but this is a real dent in our relationship
 * pitti hugs mvo
<vish> mvo: hi.. could you have a look at the patch in Bug #393358 ... [, it's a small/simple patch ]
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 393358 in update-manager "Synaptic/Update manager show weird download dialogue towards end of download" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/393358
<didrocks> ok, just need to connect gdmsetup to the dbus signal and I don't want to hear this damned sound ever :)
<seb128> didrocks, :-)
<mvo> vish: sure, will do that now
<vish> thanks.
<mvo> vish: hm, its a string change, we need a UI freeze exception for it
<vish> hmm.. :s   , i should probably have pinged you earlier :(
<mvo> vish: otherwise its trivial, I can import it into the ubuntu-ui-changes branch that I created to accumulate fixes like this (so that we only need one UI freeze exception)
<mvo> vish: sorry from me too, I'm not great at triage
<vish> mvo: that would be awesome  :)   do all the accumulated fixes get UIffe at the same time or each bug needs to be dealt separate?
<mvo> vish: I think one "big" one, its not that much that I have currently, so I hope it will be ok
<vish> neat..
<pitti> seb128: did you already dist-upgrade and restart session today?
<seb128> pitti, the mini yes, not my laptop
<seb128> pitti, why?
<pitti> seb128: if you have a second, mind to connect your ipod and see what happens?
<pitti> previously you got two dialogs (gphoto and afc), right?
<seb128> pitti, oh yes, wanted to check that
<seb128> brb door bell
<seb128> re
<seb128> easier than that
<seb128> let's connect the ipod to the mini now
<seb128> pitti, right, I only get 2 instead of 3 now
<seb128> and the rhythmbox change to not consider afc devices as mtp devices reading the new udev properties works too
<seb128> sweet
<pitti> seb128: one for camera, one for music?
<pitti> ok, that's back to the old problem then
<seb128> yes
<seb128> what old problem?
<seb128> I'm not even sure it can be considered buggy
<pitti> not really buggy, just a little confusing
<seb128> it's slightly, but technically the ipod touch has the camera mtp device
<pitti> I don't have a better idea either
<pitti> same for my G1; after all, it is a camera _and_ a music player
<seb128> it just lacks the optic device
<seb128> well you do have a camero on the g1 though?
<seb128> like the iphone
<pitti> it'd be slightly nicer to merge those two dialogs into one
<seb128> the touch doesn't have the electronic part for it
<pitti> seb128: yes, I do have a camera there
<seb128> but it has the same software stack
<seb128> the photo import dialog works too
<seb128> you can only import screenshots though
<glatzor> mvo, hello
<glatzor> mvo, I just pushed debconf unittests to aptdaemon's main branch
<glatzor> mvo, my latest patch seems to catch the race conditions
<mvo> glatzor: woah, you *rock*
 * mvo hugs glatzor very hard
<mvo> glatzor: I will update the branch after lunch (need to finish some other stuff first)
<didrocks> seb128: is there a specific bug for the sound thing in gdm?
<seb128> didrocks, yes
<seb128> it's on the gdmsetup spec wait
<didrocks> I don't find it on https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-lucid-gdmsetup
<seb128> didrocks, look on the right side
<seb128> "ug #437429: No GUI to configure/disable login sound"
<didrocks> seb128: oh right, never noticed you can link blueprint and bugs
<seb128> "Bug #437429: No GUI to configure/disable login sound"
<didrocks> seb128: sweet, thanks
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 437429 in ubuntu-sounds "No GUI to configure/disable login sound" [Undecided,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/437429
<seb128> didrocks, np
<Ng> hrm, after this morning's updates rhythmbox has broken for me, and starting it (from docky in this case) has left me with a weird situation where it keeps starting and crashing and somehow starting again
<Ng> I've killed docky and it's still starting and crashing every 2s
<Ng> what on earth is restarting it?!
<Ng> oh no, this is going to be dbus, isn't it
<Ng> is there any way for me to inspect what's trying to talk to rhythmbox's dbus service?
<Ng> either that thing doggedly keeps trying, or dbus isn't sensible to back off services that don't start correctly
<Ng> it's not the indicator apple, or u1-syncdaemon
<Ng> huh, unplugging my iphone let it start up correctly
<seb128> Ng, run in a command line and see if it crashes?
<pitti> seb128: btw, are you aware of a bug about the unmount/eject/save removal menu cleanup? if not, I'll create one
<seb128> pitti, there is one about having 3 options being confused
<seb128> with a zillion comment
<pitti> ah, that sounds appropriate
<seb128> and a hundredpapercut task
<seb128> let me get you the number
<Ng> seb128: annoyingly it started just fine with -d both with the phone already plugged in, or with plugging it in after rb started, but I have a crashdump to feed to LP
<pitti> seb128: bug 453072 ?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 453072 in gvfs "Context menu for an USB pendrive shows "Unmount", "Eject" and "Safely Remove Drive"" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/453072
<seb128> pitti, yes
<pitti> seb128: heh, incidentally that was the first hit when I wanted to file a new bug; LP search is pretty good these days
<seb128> hehe
 * pitti targets to lucid and assigns
<Ng> seb128: fwiw launchpad suggested a bunch of dupes, 5 of which were opened in the last 14 hours and they all seem to relate to iphones or new ipod touches, so I'll dupe&confirm :)
<seb128> Ng, ok thanks
<seb128> Ng, can you give the bug number?
<Ng> seb128: the lowest number is bug #545077. they're mostly all still awaiting retrace, so still private
<ubottu> Error: Could not parse data returned by Launchpad: list index out of range (https://launchpad.net/bugs/545077)
 * Ng grumbles at his LP duck
<seb128> I bet they crashed again
 * seb128 looks
<seb128> indeed
 * seb128 removes lock
<seb128> lazr.restfulclient.errors.HTTPError: HTTP Error 500: Internal Server Error
<seb128> they keep crashing on that
<seb128> wououh, didrocks rocks
<seb128> didrocks, congrats on getting the gdm change in!
<didrocks> seb128: heh thanks, *finally* :)
<seb128> didrocks, can you email the translators about the string added too? or talk to dpm about emailing those
<didrocks> seb128: sure, was on my todo, just finish to launch a gtk build in the meantime (better to do other things when gtk is building) :)
<seb128> ;-)
 * seb128 grabs coffee when gtk is building usually
<seb128> speaking of which
<seb128> brb grabbing some coffee now
<didrocks> seb128: a long coffee, so :)
<seb128> lol
<didrocks> heh
<seb128> didrocks, pitti: do you use gthumb usually? do you consider 2.11 as unstable?
<pitti> seb128: I have used it once only since we upgraded 2.11 (I don't do a lot of photos these days), and it was pretty buggy
<pitti> Q-FUNK pointed out some good points yesterday
<seb128> ok, I sort of not trust him though so I would other opinion before downgrading version
<pitti> seb128: unless you object, I'd like to do the downgrade and instead fix the libgphoto unmounting
<pitti> (if it was broken)
<seb128> especially we should sync on debian first, it seems it would fix stability issues
<seb128> well I've no strong opinion either way, just that I don't trust him on such things
<pitti> seb128: we do have the latest Debian version already
<seb128> he often argue thinking his workflow is the only one which counts
<seb128> ok
<seb128> that was supposed to fix some of the crashers
<seb128> I don't know enough about the changes to judge otherwise
<didrocks> seb128: pitti: if we downgrade, we should still fix the gvfs patch for gthumb so that we can import photo
<pitti> didrocks: yes, what I said above
<pitti> 2.10 had been rock solid
<baptistemm> good morning
<seb128> 2.11 is not?
<seb128> it uses recent technologies and is maintained
<seb128> but we can probably delay getting it to next cycle
<pitti> reportedly it dropped a lot of features and has a half-written gio port
<pitti> seb128: I can play around with it a little more later today
<seb128> it's in universe
<dpm> seb128, ok, I'll take care of that (gdmsetup string), didrocks just talked to me
<seb128> I think we should let motu deal with it
<seb128> dpm, hey
<seb128> dpm, thanks!
<pitti> universe> yes, but it's sooo much better than f-spot :-P
 * pitti ducks
<seb128> lol
<seb128> you try shotwell
<dpm> no worries, thanks for the heads up guys
<seb128> that's the futur apparently ;-)
<pitti> seb128: I didn't, no; you?
<seb128> I did
<seb128> it's quite nice
<seb128> it's written in vala too
 * pitti installs
<pitti> ok, so (1) fix gvfs, (2) get lunch, (3) try shotwell, (4) check gthumb
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> gvfs is broken?
<pitti> argh, it has again this "import photos" thing?
<pitti> why can't I just point programs to "this is my photo dir"
<pitti> ah, it just thumbnails
<pitti> seb128: so, if it would use ~/.cache instead of ~/.shotwell, the import seems quite okay :)
<pitti> seb128: hm, it seems to lump them together in one big list?
<pitti> ok, seems this still isn't for me then -- I organize by directory :(
<pitti> seb128: thanks for pointing out
<pitti> seb128: gvfs> bug 481528
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 481528 in gvfs "Volumes with photo MIME type do not have a camera icon" [Low,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/481528
<seb128> Ng, the crash should be fixed with today updates
<pitti> seb128: trying to clear my +assignedbugs list, and this should be easy to fix
<seb128> Ng, it was an issue with old usmuxd
<seb128> the new one set the property required
<seb128> pitti, ah nice
<pitti> seb128: ugh, gvfs crashes with old usbmuxd?
<seb128> pitti, one list + by date using tags
<pitti> that sounds like a bug
<seb128> pitti, rhythmbox does
<seb128> pitti, it's a bug, teuf fixed it in git
<pitti> ah, good
<seb128> pitti, I was wondering why it doesn't happen there
<cassidy> seb128, you probably one tp-sofiasip 0.6.2 in Lucid; it workarounds an Empathy freeze : https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=612460
<ubottu> Gnome bug 612460 in VoIP "Empathy freezes on attempting to place a SIP call" [Critical,Resolved: notgnome]
<cassidy> s/one/want
<seb128> pitti, that's because it was happening only with the udev rules you added yesterday
<pitti> seb128: we shouldn't count on devices having udev properties; but the check looked quite robust (in gvfs)
<seb128> cassidy, thanks
<cassidy> seb128, I think it's packaged in Debian
<seb128> pitti, right, http://git.gnome.org/browse/rhythmbox/commit/?id=5a4c30a2b1c939b48eb1a8f86ebe95b052d5ad03
<pitti> seb128: ah, I see; so it crashed _because_  it was now using the correct backend? :-)
<pitti> sweet
<seb128> cassidy, ok good
<pitti> didrocks: *hug* for gdmsetup; great job!
 * pitti hugs seb128 as well
 * didrocks hugs pitti
 * seb128 hugs didrocks pitti too
 * didrocks hugs seb128 too ;)
<Ng> seb128: hrm, maybe usbmuxd was already running because my phone was plugged in all morning, but I had already updated
<Thraul> I am trying to remaster a ubuntu desktop cd for personal use. I can make small changes such as desktop background, theme etc on the boot (livecd), now how do I edit the menus and add desktop icons to the live cd?
<Ng> seb128: thanks :)
<seb128> Ng, np
<seb128> Thraul, hi, not really a question for this channel, try #ubuntu
<Thraul> ok thanks
<aquarius> pitti, ping
<seb128> hey aquarius
<pitti> aquarius: please don't ping, just ask the question
<pitti> aquarius: hello, how are you?
<aquarius> pitti, heya, wasn't sure if you were around :) You deliberately bought a WMA album despite the warning?
<pitti> aquarius: well, it said "we do not recommend", not "it's broken"; it sounded like you'd rather want to avoid trouble with codecs?
<aquarius> You have uncovered a bug by doing this, which is that the back end doesn't show you WMA files because it assumes no-one will buy them :P
<pitti> aquarius: that album was only available as WMA..
<seb128> james_w, there?
<pitti> aquarius: ah, heh :)
<seb128> james_w, I need your help on a bzr issue if you are around and have a minute to help me on this one
<aquarius> good catch :)
<pitti> aquarius: I was going to download it and convert to ogg
<pitti> I don't hate mp3 enough to go through the hassle/quality loss of reconverting them, but I convert everything else
<aquarius> pitti, unfortunately that album will remain in limbo and undownloadable until that bug is fixed :(
<aquarius> hey seb128
<pitti> aquarius: not a big deal; it's not _that_ urgent :)
<aquarius> thank you for being so considerate. Most people are not :)
<pitti> aquarius: my primary goal was to test the music store, and Katie Melua was one of the first artists I thought of (my Pink Floyd collection is already complete..)
<pitti> aquarius: happy to be testing :) the store looks great really, and nice
<pitti> ... and large choice
<pitti> aquarius: they even have "Wise Guys", a relatively small German A-Capella band
<seb128> aquarius, how is feedback looking so far for the store?
<aquarius> pitti, cool! The German store is one of the three complete stores :)
<pitti> aquarius: while I'm at whining; do you guys plan to add a progress dialog of some sort? when I click on "U1 music store", nothing happens for about 20 or 30 secs, then I finally see it
<aquarius> seb128, so far...pretty good, actually. The bugs that have come in are either largely cosmetic or they're around the inegration with logging in
<seb128> cool
<aquarius> pitti, yep. Already done in dev. When a package upload request with a UI freeze break comes through from kenvandine, you'll know why ;)
<pitti> sweet
<pitti> aquarius: jamendo etc. have a "loading song list..." or so in the standard progress bar in RB, AFAIR
<seb128> "    - Show a temporary view when loading the initial store page (LP: #530247)"
<seb128> was uploaded yesterday
<seb128> in libubuntuone
<pitti> hm, I have that
<pitti> oh, it's just a small text, I might have missed it
<aquarius> ah, no, there's two aspects to the loading stuff. one is the temporary view, which is now in; the other is a proper loading indicator, which we have mockups for but no code yet
<didrocks> seb128: thanks for the NEWING btw. New gtk uploaded in ubuntu-desktop team ppa
<seb128> didrocks, np; thanks, any reason to not upload to lucid now?
<seb128> didrocks, you want to to review the change before?
<seb128> hum
<didrocks> seb128: not sure if enabling introspection can break something, but at least having a test on clutter and clutter-gtk will be good
<seb128> how do people download tarballs with merge-upstream?
<seb128> in the old workflow I used to bzr merge lp:
<seb128> dch -
<seb128> bzr-buildpackage
<seb128> didrocks, ok
<didrocks> seb128: bzr bd -e or just running uscan
<didrocks> would be good if merge-upstream can do that for us so that we just have to point to upstream bzr branch, nothing else :)
<seb128> right
<seb128> didrocks, well bzr bd -e relies on the changelog no?
<seb128> but if you update the changelog before merging it doesn't work
<seb128> it doesn't merge if there are uncommited changes
<seb128> or you need to update changelog, commit and merge
<didrocks> seb128: oh right, uscan so
<seb128> righto
<seb128> time for lunch
<seb128> bbl
<didrocks> same here, bll :)
<didrocks> bbl*
<asac_> bryceh: http://pastebin.com/FzYXbnkW ... should i commit that anywhere before uploading?
<tjaalton> asac_: there's 1.7.6-1u1 in the works (git.d.o)
<asac_> tjaalton: can you try to apply the patch there?
<asac_> and see if it still applies cleanly?
 * asac_ would hope so
<tjaalton> asac_: if you are in a hurry you can upload it as-is, and we'll make sure it applies on top of the new version (no reason why it wouldn't). rename the patch though, "111" is available :)
<tjaalton> asac_: also, send it upstream http://wiki.x.org/wiki/Development/Documentation/SubmittingPatches
<kenvandine> good morning folks
<seb128> hey kenvandine
<asac_> tjaalton: its not ready for upstream (see changelog)
<seb128> kenvandine, I'm updating indicator-me just for information
<kenvandine> seb128, thanks for the sponsoring
<seb128> kenvandine, np
<kenvandine> cool, thx
<asac_> tjaalton: whats the problem with 250 ;)
<seb128> kenvandine, I'm switching to the ubuntu namespace too
<tjaalton> asac_: bloat! :)
<seb128> kenvandine, so make sure you down pull from the ubuntu-desktop one next time
<kenvandine> seb128, will do
<kenvandine> thx
<seb128> np
<asac_> tjaalton: i usually add stuff on top
<asac_> when using 111 it means i inject it in the middle ;)
<tjaalton> asac_: so 201
<seb128> I will update the changelog with a warning too in the old location
<seb128> to avoid errors
<asac_> tjaalton: ok. that makes more send ;)
<asac_> sense
<tjaalton> probably should just drop the numbers
<tjaalton> they are meaningless anyway
<tjaalton> but after lucid
<asac_> yeah
<asac_> ok renamed ... also using - for the word splits and added to series which i previously forgot
<asac_> will push
<tjaalton> ok
<Laney> Do you guys think it's a bug that http_proxy isn't set in the graphical session? ie when launching apps from the gnome menu or gnome-do
<pitti> Laney: it sounds like a bug; but last time I tried this, it worked for me
<pitti> (when configuring the proxy with the capplet)
<Laney> yes, I used that
<seb128> launchpad has zillion of proxy bugs listed
<Laney> I tried to look on bugzilla
<seb128> look to gnome-control-center bugs
<seb128> not sure how much our code is different from upstream there
<seb128> there is quite some changes from mvo to set system values
<Laney> I guess gnome-terminal reads from gconf to export it there, right?
<mvo> Laney: yep
<mvo> seb128: I did not touch the general mechanism, just the "write stuff out to system", so there should be no change in behavior
<Laney> mvo: Is there a bug here then?
<mvo> Laney: my understanding is that the gui apps are responsible to get the proxy via gconf (unless libproxy is used)
<mvo> Laney: stuff in the terminal is lucky because gnome-terminal sets http_proxy based on gconf
<Laney> oh, that's annoying behaviour then
<Laney> http_proxy would be a good interface
<Laney> although I guess there are corner cases with no_proxy
<seb128> mvo, oh, good to know
<mvo> wellâ¦
<mvo> I guess it could be exported session wide as http_proxy
<mvo> but that is not how its done currently
<Laney> So the reason I'm looking at this is because I noticed that docky doesn't work behind a proxy
<Laney> and that's because mono's DefaultWebProxy implementation relies on the env vars
<mvo> heh :)
<mvo> libproxy seems to be what is meant to solve the issue
<Laney> indeed
<Laney> but it's not part of gnome, and consequently isn't used very much
<Laney> is exporting the env vars to the session something that can be done in lucid?
<Laney> or does it require more discussion?
<mvo> the disadvantage is that its much less dynamic, the env would be set at session startup and set in stone
<mvo> gconf is much better in that regard
<mvo> so it would have to be "a) look at gconf and use that b) look at http_proxy env and use that"
<Laney> could it not be updated when the user edits it?
<mvo> the advantage of course is that it would make all apps suddenly work, even if they do not look at gconf
<mclasen> Laney: libsoup uses libproxy
<mvo> it would only work for newly started apps if anything, not for already running ones. so I guess its not that useful
<Laney> I would argue that working somewhat is better than working never
<Laney> at least until libproxy is widely used
<Laney> ...needs the mono bindings enabled too :)
<Laney> this non-dynamic behaviour is what broken apps experience when launched from the terminal anyway
<mvo> true, there are corner cases however. its not uncommon that http_proxy takes precedence over gconf in a app (so that user can run "http_proxy=some-proxy" gedit). those would break badly
<mvo> well, not badly, but break when dyanmically switching the proxy settings
<mvo> so my take is that its not appropriate (at this point) for lucid and needs discussion
<Laney> alright
<mvo> sorry
<Laney> there is some code in f-spot to read from gconf anyway that I can copy to docky
<mvo> cool
<mvo> if that could travel into mono itself, that would rock
<mvo> (not sure if mono can dynamically import gconf easily and deal with the case when its not there, but I guess that is possible)
<Laney> yeah I don't know how that would work
<Laney> it would need to be generalised too to have proper events
<seb128> pedro_, hey
<pedro_> hey hey seb128
<seb128> pedro_, how are you?
<pedro_> seb128, things are going good, thanks. what about you?
<mvo> hey pedro_
<pedro_> hola mvo!
<seb128> pedro_, good, thank you
<seb128> pedro_, thanks for picking those lucid bugs you assign to our team btw
<pedro_> seb128, you're welcome, i've been reviewing some on the telepathy stack, we were missing some that were filed at the pymsn product
<pedro_> i've reassigned those to papyon now
<seb128> pedro_, speaking of those, the telepathy-butterfly ones, could you check if those are crashes or just apport noise?
<seb128> we probably not need to put high for those which are just noise
<pedro_> seb128, by apport noise you mean the ones that generate a stacktrace but doesn't crash the application (empathy) ?
<pedro_> because most of them are like that, they don't crash empathy but they do generate a stacktrace
<seb128> pedro_, yes, I guess you reassign and set high due to duplicates?
<seb128> ie the number of duplicates those get
<pedro_> seb128, correct, based on number of dups and users affected
<seb128> but if those don't have visible effect that's not high since apport doesn't run on stable
<seb128> you see what I mean?
<pedro_> seb128, yes, got it
<seb128> pedro_, thanks
<seb128> pedro_, oh, other thing
<pedro_> you're welcome
<seb128> pedro_, I got the impression by reading bug emails than gedit is crashing in lucid, did you notice that too?
<seb128> would be good to upstream those of those
<pedro_> seb128, are you reading my computer screen?
<seb128> lol
<pedro_> seb128, i'm in fact looking at some gedit crashes now hahah
 * pedro_ looks around
 * seb128 hugs pedro_
 * pedro_ hugs seb128 back
<pedro_> don't spy me! :-P
<seb128> you got me, I'm spying on you
<seb128> lol
<pitti> hey pedro_, how are you?
<pedro_> pitti, hello! I'm good, thanks. how's everything going for you?
<pedro_> morning rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> good morning pedro_
<seb128> hey rickspencer3
<pedro_> is raof looking at f-spot bugs?
<pokyie> Hi All
<seb128> pedro_, not sure but he got the milestoned one assigned now, why?
<pokyie> Does anyone got this files in their machine
<rickspencer3> hi seb128
<pokyie> 1. /lib/firmware/iwlwifi-1000-1.ucode
<seb128> pedro_, he knows the f-spot code a lib
<pokyie> 2. /lib/firmware/iwlwifi-1000-2.ucode
<pedro_> seb128, ok good, just to confirm that someone is actually looking at the issue ;-)
<pedro_> thanks seb128
<nigelb> pitti: thanks (g-p-m string bug)
<baptistemm> Hi thre
<baptistemm> I would be interested to have bug 545551 fixed for lucid to be able to have some hints to triage bluez and bluetooth related bugs
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 545551 in bluez "apport hook for bluez" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/545551
<nigelb> baptistemm: I can do it :)
<nigelb> what information do you want the hook to collect?
<baptistemm> I think the hook is quite complete now
<nigelb> ah :)
<nigelb> baptistemm: the hook is supposed to be in your package I think
<nigelb> i.e. the package which its supposed to report bugs on
<pitti> baptistemm: hm, why is it an apport branch and not a bluez one?
<arand> Is there a specific change in indicator-applet/application that got rid of the tooltips? I've been looking at changelogs with little luck...
<Laney> did it ever have them?
<Laney> i thought that was a design feature
<pitti> baptistemm:
<pitti> 19
<pitti>     if command_available('rfkill'):
<pitti> 20
<pitti> command_available('rfkill list')
<pitti> baptistemm: I think you mean command_output() here :) (same for getfacl)
<baptistemm> doh
<nigelb> pitti: what it into debdiff?
<nigelb> s/what/want
<pitti> baptistemm: and you don't need to call attach_conffiles for a package in its own package hook, that's already done automatically (in general-hooks/ubuntu.py)
<arand> Laney: hmm, looking at it in karmic... you're right, maybe not.
<pitti> nigelb: stuffing it into the bluez package is trivial; I mean, if you want to (with nice changelog and dh_install and all that), as a packaging exercise, then please go ahead of course :)
<nigelb> pitti: packaging exercise was the intention :) will do :)
<pitti> nigelb: ok, then I'll review it with that in mind (i. e. point out errors and let you fix them instead of doing that myself)
<pitti> nigelb: thanks
<pitti> nigelb: (but please coordinate with baptistemm to fix above two issues first)
<nigelb> thanks for the chance ;)
<nigelb> yes
<baptistemm> pitti, fixed in my branch, thanks for the review
<nigelb> baptistemm: fixed? shall I package?
<pitti> baptistemm: otherwise this looks fine
<pitti> baptistemm: for bonus, you could do the last ui.information a bit differently
<baptistemm> nigelb, if you're interested there is bluez 4.62 waiting sponsoring as well :)
<nigelb> baptistemm: I'm not a sponsor, yet
<pitti> nigelb: ok, I subscribed to the bug now; so just attach it there, and I'll followup
<nigelb> pitti: okay :)
<nigelb> pitti: unrelated, but does apport automatically compress the logs?
<baptistemm> nigelb, If you need help for packaging (even thought I'm quite a newbie) don't hesitate to ping me
<nigelb> baptistemm: sure :)
<baptistemm> pitti, you meant I should change the wording, or something else?
<pitti> nigelb: binary ones yes, text ones not automatically
<nigelb> pitti: aha, anyway to disable it?
<pitti> baptistemm: oh, sorry; I meant to write a followup, and hten realized that it doesn't work yet
<pitti> baptistemm: there's root_command_output(), but that doesn't work as a backgroud "monitor" thing, just synchronously
<pitti> baptistemm: I was going to suggest starting the log, then asking the user to reproduce and click OK, and stoppin git
<pitti> nigelb: disable compression?
<nigelb> pitti: is it better left in? (debug log for cheese) if not, how to disable?
<pitti> nigelb: text attachments aren't compressed
<nigelb> oh, so make it .txt file, ah
<pitti> nigelb: hang on, I think we are talking past each other
<pitti> it doesn't care at all about the file name, it cares about contents
<pitti> nigelb: what does currently happen, and what do you want to happen?
<nigelb> in bug 545079, the debug log gets attaached as "HardwareInformation.log.gz" (naming mistake) is it because I gave the file name .log that it ended up as .gz?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 545079 in libgphoto2 "Cheese stopped working" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/545079
<pitti> nigelb: ah, because it has binary stuff in it
<nigelb> pitti: ah, so leave it alone?
<pitti> nigelb: which hook does that come from?
 * pitti doesn't see/have a cheese hook
<nigelb> pitti: I'm writing it
<pitti> oh, I don't have cheese installed
<pitti> seems we don't do that by default on desktop
<baptistemm> pitti, is ther a way to call an apport hook from another package, for instance gnome-bluetooth triggering bluez apport hook
<pitti> nigelb: so you should be able to force it, hang on
<didrocks> pitti: no, it's only on the netbook nowdays
<pitti> nigelb: what do you call right now for this particular field?
<nigelb> CheeseDebug
<pitti> nigelb: I mean, you are using r['HardwareInformation.log'] = command_output() or so?
<nigelb> pitti: http://pastebin.com/AyWxUhgE
<nigelb> pitti: report["CheeseDebug"] = apport.hookutils.command_output(['env', 'GST_DEBUG=*cheese*:3', 'cheese', '-v'])
<pitti> baptistemm: not easily, no; sorry
<pitti> nigelb: ah, hmm
<pitti> nigelb: you can force the non-compression of files, but not of arbitrary string values
<pitti> nigelb: so you could theoretically output it to a file and then do
<baptistemm> pitti, can a user trigger the hook by itself to sent the information to a bug number ?
<pitti> report['CheeseDebug'] = ('/tmp/mylog', False)
<pitti> nigelb: the False forces it to not get encoded/compressed
<pitti> baptistemm: yes, apport-collect -p bluez 12345
<pitti> baptistemm: (or you reassign the bug to bluez, then apport-collect 12345 will do)
<nigelb> pitti: so add a line below the previous line?
<baptistemm> apport-collect -p bluez 12345 will do the trick
<baptistemm> thanks
<pitti> nigelb: well, you have to change command_output, too; you want to use subprocess.Popen to have it output to a temporary file
<nigelb> pitti: ah, too much complication.  I'll leave it as gz ;)
<pitti> nigelb: :)
 * vish pokes nigelb to get it right ;p
<nigelb> vish: its nonessential (my belief)
<vish> nigelb: well , it makes life easier than having to download the log.. and you aernt going to be redoing this again ;)
<nigelb> vish: okay okay
 * nigelb adds to long list of things to do
 * kenvandine is really amazed how fast lucid boots in kvm
 * baptistemm is really amazed how fast lucid boots on ssd :)
<nigelb> lucid doesn't boot in vbox for me at all (with testdrive)
 * baptistemm is really amazed how fast lucid boots on kvm on ssd :)
<kenvandine> hehe
<vish> pitti: btw , Bug #542091 , for the cheese apport hook [in case you want to keep track]
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 542091 in cheese "Add apport hook for cheese" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/542091
<vish> among the long list of other things ;p
<nigelb> pitti: bluez is done! built successfully, attached debdiff
<vish> seb128: hi , did you already pull from the packagers branch for the humanity update?
 * vish just added a bug# to the changelog a few mins ago
<seb128> vish, I'm uploading right now, I can ctrl-C if required
<seb128> I've r46
<seb128> which one did you add?
<vish> seb128: right thats the one , no problems :)
<seb128> ok good
<seb128> uploaded
<vish> seb128: thanks. :)
<seb128> np
<seb128> mvo, where can the s-c categories names be translated?
<mvo> seb128: they should be in the s-c pot
<mvo> seb128: unless they come from a ".directory" file in which case that is used
<seb128> mvo, the .directories being used are the gnome-menus ones? if for accessories or graphics?
<mvo> yes
<seb128> mvo, seems buggy
<seb128> mvo, those are not showed translated there
<mvo> but they are translated?
<seb128> the gnome-menus are correctly translated though
<dpm> seb128, mvo, we've got bug 545102 about those, the categories' translations don't seem to be loaded from data/software-center.menu
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 545102 in software-center "Department names shows untranslated, albeit they're translated" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/545102
<seb128> well I guess so, those strings are the gnome-panel menus categories
<seb128> dpm, thanks
<seb128> mvo, does it work for you?
<seb128> mvo, I get the same issue in german
<chrisccoulson> pitti - do you think that bug 544139 should be added to the list of RC bugs?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 544139 in consolekit "Active VT tracking can fail at startup" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/544139
<chrisccoulson> (we should certainly try and fix it before lucid is released anyway)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: yes, I think so
<chrisccoulson> thanks, would you mind doing that for me? :-)
<nigelb> pitti: will you be sponsoring bluez hook? or want me to subscribe sponsors?
<pitti> nigelb: please do subscribe sponsors
<pitti> I'll probably get around to it soon, but no need to block on me
<nigelb> ok, thanks :)
<mvo> hm, rhythmbox having VIRT 1,5Gb is not good, is it?
<seb128> mvo, I will not reply to you as long you ignore me and my comment :p
<seb128> mvo, but no, doesn't seem correct
<mvo> seb128: sorry, I'm in a meeting
<seb128> mvo, I was just joking ;-)
 * seb128 hugs mvo
<mvo> seb128: I can check buggy translations
<seb128> mvo, did you use the music store?
<seb128> mvo, you should check buggy code, read the bug dpm indicated
<seb128> mvo, the translations are there
<mvo> I think its because of the store
<mvo> that is very impressive btw
<seb128> ;-)
<mvo> seb128, dpm: i18n issue should be fixed, thanks
<mvo> dpm: please hit^Wping me if you notice similar issues, I'm not on top of my bug lists
<seb128> mvo, you rock!
<seb128> mvo, thanks
<mvo> I wish
 * mvo hugs seb128
<seb128> pedro_, those gnome-appaerance-capplet crashes in pango are not pango bugs they are bug #274915
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 274915 in gnome-control-center "gnome-appearance-properties crashed with SIGSEGV in pango_shape()" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/274915
<dpm> mvo, thanks!
<pedro_> seb128, will review them back again, it's a bit tricky sometimes to determine where is actually crashing with those pango lines, but will have a look again and mark those as dup of that one
<pedro_> seb128, thanks for ping me ;-)
<seb128> pedro_, I'm cleaning those now
<dpm> mvo, no need to hit you, I know everyone is busy, I prefer hugging
<seb128> pedro_, just letting you know for next ones
 * dpm hugs mvo
<seb128> pedro_, there is quite some of those weird bugs on other softwares too though
<seb128> pedro_, but most have been triaged or forwarded already by now
<dpm> mvo, while you are at it, you might want to have a look at bug 545095 as well, it seems that the "Featured Applications" string is not marked for translation in s-c
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 545095 in software-center ""Featured Applications" untranslated and untranslatable" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/545095
<ccheney> i think i have a real fix for the annoying OOo won't upgrade due to running OOo problem
<pedro_> seb128, true, i've seen a few pango crashes for a couple of cycles already but those are already submitted upstream (most of them)
<pedro_> IIRC behdad fixed a bunch during the first weeks on this cycle though
<bryceh> asac, yes see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/X/GitUsage
<seb128> pedro_, ok
<vish> mvo: hi , reminding the list of SC icons > http://paste.ubuntu.com/400652/  would be great if you can update the .menu file :)
<kenvandine> dpm, think there might be any more translation related requests for gwibber?
<dpm> kenvandine, let me have a look at the existing i18n bugs, I think they had all committed fixes, IIRC...
<kenvandine> dpm, thx, i am getting close to releasing with a bunch of bug fixes
<kenvandine> would like to fix up any known i18n issues too
<seb128> time for sport and dinner, bbl
<dpm> kenvandine, there is only bug 538981 as pending IIRC. All the others I knew of were Fix Committed. I tagged them all with gwibber-i18n -> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/gwibber/+bugs?field.tag=gwibber-i18n
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 538981 in gwibber "Strings in the side panel are not translatable" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/538981
<dpm> I haven't looked at that bug yet, I'm not sure how difficult is to make those strings translatable there
<kenvandine> dpm, humm, yeah ideally we want to keep that list dynamic but that means it won't appear in gwibber.pot
<kenvandine> dpm, have you seen any other application do that?
<kenvandine> dpm, we could just wrap "name": aname.capitalize() with _()
<kenvandine> but then it still won't make it into the template
<kenvandine> dpm, can you manually add strings that need translating to the template?
<dpm> kenvandine, you could use this perhaps -> http://docs.python.org/library/gettext.html#deferred-translations
<dpm> the N_() trick
<dpm> because otherwise adding strings to the template manually will be a pain for you, I think
<kenvandine> dpm, it would be cool if we could add strings to the template in a way that they don't get over-written when you rebuild the template
<kenvandine> or i guess just a list of possible values stuck in the code somewhere :)
<dpm> kenvandine, would N_() not work for you in the same way?
<kenvandine> dpm, either way... it would be a pain to maintain, if we ever change the default values, we would need to remember to update that list
<kenvandine> dpm, yeah it would
<kenvandine> just extra code, would think there would be a way to create a static list of possible strings to translate somehow
 * kenvandine isn't an i18n guru
 * dpm just fakes it
<didrocks> this time enjoying an early evening :) see you tomorrow everyone!
<kenvandine> enjoy didrocks!
<kenvandine> dpm, if i added something like this to gwibber.pot
<didrocks> thanks kenvandine, have a nice afternoon :)
<dpm> yep, have a nice evening didrocks!
<kenvandine> msgid "Messages"
<didrocks> dpm: you too ;)
<kenvandine> msgstr "
<kenvandine> that would get removed next time we re-generate the template right?
<dpm> yeah, it would get removed
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> so in code is the lesser of the evils :)
 * kenvandine takes a stab at it
<dpm> yeah, otherwise you'd have to have a patch to modify the template at build time, I guess
<kenvandine> i really want to make sure gwibber is localized :)
 * kenvandine hugs the awesome translators
 * dpm hugs kenvandine for the rocking work in getting i18n fixes done or merged!
<dpm> kenvandine, the fixes you already did will get gwibber in top shape i18n-wise, but there might be more small issues coming up as translators keep testing the app. This is usually how things are detected: translators finish the translation, the language pack is released, and then translators detect untranslated or untranslatable strings
<dpm> anyway, need to take a break, bbl
<kenvandine> dpm, thx!
<mvo> vish: thanks, I thought that mpt was working on that
<mvo> vish: or am I misrembering
<mpt> mvo, hi, good to see you online again
<mpt> mvo, working on what?
<mvo> mpt: the new icon integration with software-center.memu. I thought you mentioned that you want to ensure it will also be in the directory files (or rather that it gets names that match the directory files)
<mpt> mvo, I don't know where to put the icons to achieve that myself. I thought kwwii was doing that
<mvo> mpt: ok, I will talk to him
<mpt> vish might be able to do the corresponding software-center.menu changes to look in the right places
<vish> mvo: mpt: we considered all options and finally named them so http://paste.ubuntu.com/400652/
<mpt> Unfortunately I'm not being given any time to do that
<mvo> mpt: ok
<vish> mpt: they just landed in Lucid and should be available
<pitti> good night everyone!
<vish> mvo: i went through the .menu file and right now all those categories use the "applications-other" icon , you can just re-name them and they should be good to go
<cjohnston> kwwii: ping
<seiflotfy> hi rickspencer3 :)
<rickspencer3> seiflotfy, 45 minutes, rigt?
<rickspencer3> I'm on a call now
<seiflotfy> yes sir
<kwwii> cjohnston: pong
<cjohnston> hey kwwii, were you sent into about a visual problem for the scrollbars that I am having?
<seiflotfy> hey guys
<robtaylor> seiflotfy: rickspencer3 : so, shall we start?
<rickspencer3> yuppers
<robtaylor> seiflotfy: oh, hi :)
<seiflotfy> hi robtaylor :)
<rickspencer3> hi robtaylor and seiflotfy
<robtaylor> seiflotfy: so, this is your meeting, what would you like to cover?
<rickspencer3> all - seiflotfy, robtaylor and I are going to spam the channel for a bit
<rickspencer3> sorry
<rickspencer3> go ahead seiflotfy
<robtaylor> rickspencer3: :)
<seiflotfy> rickspencer3, robtaylor i would like to cover the topic of semantic technologieso n the desktop
<seiflotfy> especially for lucid +1
<seiflotfy> crap my keyboard is not responsive
<seiflotfy> robtaylor is the CEO of codethnk one of the main companies behind tracker
<seiflotfy> me and kamstrup are here representing Zeitgeist
<rickspencer3> "semantic technologies"
<robtaylor> seiflotfy: ah, thanks for the intro.
<rickspencer3> this sounds rather, mmmm,
<rickspencer3> how should I say, "grand"?
<seiflotfy> well its a step lucid +1 will have to introduce
<seiflotfy> ubuntu is going a nice path by redesinging stuff to be more user friendly and enrich the user experience
<robtaylor> rickspencer3: so, I guess i should give you s shre overview of where I'm coming fron. COdethink's been doing a lot of teh core work for tracker, which is athe core data storage compoennt for Maemo6 and Meego
<seiflotfy> yet those are going to be limited by the current state of techznologies
<robtaylor> uh, sorry, high latency here
<robtaylor> rickspencer3: and of corse, as part of this work, we're very interested in increasing the adoption of the technology
<thorike> hey sei
<thorike> hey seiflotfy , robtaylor , rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> how does zeitgeist and tracker interact?
<rickspencer3> hi thorike
<rickspencer3> are they related at all?
<RainCT_netbook> Hi all
<seiflotfy> rickspencer3, yes and no
<robtaylor> rickspencer3: at the moment, there's some relation at the UI level, GAJ combines data from tracker and zeitgeist to present the timeline view
 * robtaylor has been pushing seiflotfy and kamstrup on this for a while ;)
<seiflotfy> rickspencer3, while tracker knows about ur data zeitgeist only covers how ur data is used
<seiflotfy> both can co-exist nicely
<rickspencer3> ok
<seiflotfy> as demoed in GAJ
<rickspencer3> so what specifically do envision for Ubuntu 10.10?
<robtaylor> seiflotfy: you want to go on that?
<seiflotfy> robtaylor, sure thing
<thorike> hi RainCT_netbook  :-)
 * mclasen hopes that trackers stops ruining system responsiveness by then...
<seiflotfy> rickspencer3, lets start with documents
<seiflotfy> rickspencer3, currently there is no such thing as document organizer
<seiflotfy> again we r fiddling through the hierichal filesystem
<robtaylor> mclasen: have you installed a recent 0.7 tracker? Its crawing is good enough for mobile devices ;)
<seiflotfy> tracker would allow us to browse our data using tags, authors, annotations etc
<rickspencer3> robtaylor, to be honest, I have never used a tracker like feature that wasn't either:
<rickspencer3> 1. weirdly consuming resources at inconvenient times
<rickspencer3> 2. run manually, therefore alway too out of date to be useful
<rickspencer3> has something changed there?
<robtaylor> rickspencer3: absolutely
<seiflotfy> yes alot
<seiflotfy> tracker being considered the datastore for meego and maemo says it all i guess
<seb128> robtaylor, the issue is mainly inotify no?
<rickspencer3> so what has changed?
<robtaylor> seb128: that's the main remaining issue.
<seb128> robtaylor, or did you stop index the disk and rely on softwares to push infos?
<seb128> indexing
<robtaylor> rickspencer3: so, several things here
<seb128> robtaylor, the io load handling under linux just sucks
<robtaylor> rickspencer3: the archoitecture was redesigned so there is a cetral 'semantic'; store, then miners for various data sources
<seb128> indexing will slow down your system a lot, I don't see how tracker can solve that with current linux and inotify limitations
<robtaylor> rickspencer3: of which the filesystem is one
<robtaylor> rickspencer3: we did a lot of fine grained interaction tweaking to keep the system resonsive
<robtaylor> rickspencer3: you can test it out, the tracker-team ppa has the latest version of the 0,7 system in
<rickspencer3> so that issue #1 is gone in your mind?
<seb128> robtaylor, did you stop running the indexer?
<robtaylor> rickspencer3: absolutely.
<rickspencer3> ok
<robtaylor> seb128: no, indexing is still needed to get a lot of information in, but it's secondary to the aim of tracker
<RainCT_netbook> seb128: Last time I tried it on my netbook it indexed everything I have there in a couple hours and I didn't notice it at all
<RainCT_netbook> it's definitelly better than 0.6
<robtaylor> seb128: the ideal long-term plan would be that indexing isn't needed and all software uses it as the data oraganisation systenm. but that's a loong way off. if ever..
<rickspencer3> robtaylor, so what value does it bring now?
<rickspencer3> why would users want this?
<seb128> well I fail to see how you solve the issue from tracker since the issue is mainly inotify and linux io load handing
<robtaylor> seb128: as you pointed out, the main remaining issue is kernel-level. inotify sucks in some interesting ways
<seb128> but I'm happy to be proved wrong
<seb128> I will check on 0.7
<robtaylor> seb128: basically, its all done by making sure the systemhas time to run and we keep low priority. could be made better with more kernel suport, but atm that's outside our development remot (watch this space thoiugh)
<seiflotfy> rickspencer3, let alone ubuntu is missing a proper search tool
<robtaylor> seiflotfy: one minute please
<rickspencer3> robtaylor, go ahead
<seb128> robtaylor, ok, please continue we can discuss that later
<seb128> ie technical details are interesting but not important now ;-)
<robtaylor> rickspencer3: so, what tracker brings at the architectureal level is linked data
<robtaylor> rickspencer3: the model is bsaed on  relationships between items of data
<robtaylor> rickspencer3: in practice, the means we can support such things as 'show me all emails related to this document'
 * rickspencer3 nods
<robtaylor> rickspencer3: or, combined with zeitgeist, ' show me the work i did last week with the ubuntuone team'
<rickspencer3> ok
<rickspencer3> I would like to discuss each a bit seperately first, if that is ok
<rickspencer3> so I can understand a bit where you are coming from
<thorike> robtaylor, what kind of relationships do you mean?
<robtaylor> rickspencer3: absolutely
<thorike> ok I pull back
<rickspencer3> robtaylor, how does the UI reveal this functionality in your mind?
<robtaylor> thorike: that's a big question ;)
<thorike> robtaylor, just examples for now
<thorike> I know it's a big question :-)
<rickspencer3> robtaylor, are envisioning something like places -> Search for Files
<robtaylor> rickspencer3: so, in Ui designs that are being actioned here, we have a core concept of people. so for example, you can tag face in photos in either facebook or on a device.
<rickspencer3> but it works better because the daa is indexed
<rickspencer3> ?
<robtaylor> rickspencer3: and from your contacts vuiew, go to 'pictures of this person'
<rickspencer3> hmmm
<rickspencer3> that sounds rather esoteric
<rickspencer3> does it help for when you are trying to get work done, or is the people concept only an example?
<robtaylor> rickspencer3: i'm afraid ihave to be a bit inventive here, lots I can't directly talk about ;)
<thorike> rickspencer3, well re zeitgeist and the people thing
<thorike> what we do is log the interaction with the people
<thorike> and then can tell the user
<thorike> what did you do last week with dave
<robtaylor> rickspencer3: so, in terms of getting work done, lets say you're working on a document or project. You now need to check up on some details you know you discuessed, but you can't remember when
<rickspencer3> ok
<thorike> emails, chat, synchronous tools
<rickspencer3> robtaylor, this happens to me all the time
<rickspencer3> like someone pasted me a link in IRC for a wiki page, and I can't find it
<rickspencer3> would tracker help me with that in some wya?
<seb128> :-)
<robtaylor> rickspencer3: right, so we're on this border between searching and data foraging
<rickspencer3> robtaylor, I'm just trying to understand your vision here, I'm not questioning the value of tracker
<thorike> robtaylor, as far as I know tracker doesn't really support the "when ting"? am I wrong?
<robtaylor> rickspencer3: your brain is saying, say, i know i got that link whenwe were talking about 'x'
 * rickspencer3 nod
<robtaylor> so you'd use teh global search for x, then from that search, get all the messages (email/im/irc) around whn 'x' was mentioned
<rickspencer3> ok
<rickspencer3> and then presumedly I'd see the link
<robtaylor> thinking on my feet for the ui, you could have actions from the initial results (e.g. arrowing off from the result -> messages -> get a time based view)
<rickspencer3> and not look like a total ass, as usual
<robtaylor> that's the idea
<kenvandine> seb128, can you sponsor libubuntuone again?
<rickspencer3> robtaylor, so I take it there is no UI for desktops yet then?
<kenvandine> seb128, fixed the missing dep Riddell reported
<robtaylor> by the system knowing how items are realted, it helps model how a user thinks
<robtaylor> rickspencer3: exactly
<rickspencer3> ok
<robtaylor> rickspencer3: there's the search-bar in tracker, and there's GAJ
<seb128> kenvandine, ok
<rickspencer3> ok
<rickspencer3> so a bit of UI
<robtaylor> rickspencer3: but nothing that has focused ui designs and tight-teams
<rickspencer3> ok
<rickspencer3> let us put UI aside then
<seiflotfy> hi kamstrup
<kenvandine> seb128, thx
<rickspencer3> I think we can discuss the user value without designing specific UI
<robtaylor> rickspencer3: some of Seth's ideas at the UI hackfest, and the nautilus discussions started going in this direction though
<seb128> kenvandine, yw!
<rickspencer3> so, in terms of Zeitgeist, how does that relate?
 * rickspencer3 acks the nautilus designs from hack fest
<seiflotfy> rickspencer3, not the same
<seiflotfy> while tracker runs of statis metadata
<seiflotfy> zeitgeist provides personal experience data
<seiflotfy> as in "what do i do when reading x" based on a log
<rickspencer3> so the proposal is to have desktops running two trackers all the time?
<seiflotfy> uhm its a daemon
<seiflotfy> and they are both leightweight
<seiflotfy> i have them both here
<RAOF> Good morning, ipv6 TheMuso :)
<TheMuso> RAOF: heh good morning.
<robtaylor> from my point of view, time-series data is very important for tracker. ITs the only way we'll be able to offer a lot of the functionailty we want
<robtaylor> and its forndamentel for racking
<TheMuso> RAOF: Totally unintentional on my part.
<robtaylor> *ranking
<rickspencer3> seiflotfy, ok, that's a "yes"
<rickspencer3> seiflotfy, can you tell me why a user would want zeitgeist if they are already running tracker, or visa versa?
<seiflotfy> kamstrup, wanna take over or should i?
<robtaylor> rickspencer3: so, zg is a component that deals with store what actions the user perfomed, or had happen to them
<robtaylor> rickspencer3: it can then analyse relationships between data by the time-locality of actions
<robtaylor> rickspencer3: so, stricly speaking, zg isn't anindexer in any real sense
<rickspencer3> robtaylor, that sounds exactly like Zeitgeist to me :/
<robtaylor> rickspencer3: zg = zeitgiest
<robtaylor> :)
<rickspencer3> ok
<rickspencer3> I can do that
<rickspencer3> sorry to be dense, but I'm not seeing what zg brings extra, I know I am missing something
 * robtaylor gets lazy ;)
<seiflotfy> zeitgeist logs activity
<RainCT_netbook> Yeah, Zeitgeist isn't an indexer, it's just a daemon providing logging functionallity over D-Bus (insert, get, find, relationships)
<rickspencer3> ok, so it logs actions, rather than indexes data?
<RAOF> But isn't tracker *also* meant to be (among other things) a store for such things?
<RainCT_netbook> And the information gets inserted by applications themselves, plugins or the zeitgeist-datahub daemon (which currently just copies over stuff from GtkRecentManager)
<seiflotfy> rickspencer3, zeitgeist provides contextual relationships while tracker does contentual :)
 * didrocks would like zeitgeist and tracker being officially blessed by GNOME release managers first (as the discussion for tracker as a module in GNOME is currently stuck)
<seiflotfy> didrocks, i am proposing this week
<rickspencer3> ok, so I think I understand a bit better
<didrocks> rickspencer3: don't blame yourself, this was a high point of discussion for a lot of people in GNOME ML "differences between tracker and zg is not obvious" :)
<rickspencer3> so, robtaylor if I could do 1 think to help you, what would that be?
<seiflotfy> tracker would be optimally the main storage for tags/annotations etc on the desktop
<seiflotfy> allwoing cross desktop applications to re-use these tags
<seiflotfy> zeitgeist on the other hand allows cross application exchange of activities
<rickspencer3> seiflotfy, same question for you, what would you ask me to do?
<seiflotfy> lucid + 1
<seiflotfy> some tracks
<seiflotfy> that would push the integration of both in 10.10
<seiflotfy> do u want specific use cases ?
<rickspencer3> seiflotfy, you want to ship zg and tracker by default in 10.10?
<seiflotfy> that woudl be optimal
<seiflotfy> its the only way we can catch up a bit with KDE
<rickspencer3> ok
<rickspencer3> so
<rickspencer3> I get this question all the time
<TheMuso> How would average users benefit? Sorry coming in late to this convo.
<rickspencer3> "please help my project by delivering it in Lucid"
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, hmm, covered that a bit, maybe scrollback?
<TheMuso> rickspencer3: oh ok
<seiflotfy> rickspencer3, ok
<rickspencer3> seiflotfy, so this is not something that any one person decides
<seiflotfy> i know
<seiflotfy> but we can start with natuilus
<rickspencer3> what you need to do is to demonstrate some awesome user value AND
 * TheMuso gets the benefit now
<rickspencer3> a track record of execution
<seiflotfy> why not provide "most used documents per folder"
<seiflotfy> zeitgeist covers this easily
<rickspencer3> then you could potentially influence folks
<seiflotfy> as seen in docky
<rickspencer3> I would suggest targeting a zg-based feature in universe for 10.10 that you can get some excitement about
<rickspencer3> think of the path that Gwibber took, for example
<seiflotfy> yeah
<rickspencer3> tracker seems different to me
<rickspencer3> seems to be shipping on multiple platforms, and in some ways is tried and true code
<rickspencer3> robtaylor, seiflotfy does that seem about right to both of you?
<robtaylor> rickspencer3: well, the core of tracker is tried and true. There's a lot that still needs to be done around desktop UI designs, programmer-freindly api's that sort of thing
<rickspencer3> mmmm
<robtaylor> rickspencer3: and a big question we have at the moment is how todo really great ranking for global search
<thorike> what' global search?
<robtaylor> thorike: seen an android phone?
<seiflotfy> rickspencer3, u can always get back at kamstrup for zeitgeist questions
<thorike> yep
<rickspencer3> hmmm
<seiflotfy> he is a maintainer and lead architect
<rickspencer3> so sounds like tracker features might need a bit of back time
<rickspencer3> bake time, even
<seiflotfy> rickspencer3, kamstrup is employed by canonical so u have a direct connection to him
 * kamstrup solutes rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> seiflotfy, robtaylor I think we need some UI concepts that some developers are committed to deliver ...
<rickspencer3> and bring this conversation to UDS
<robtaylor> rickspencer3: exactly
<seiflotfy> rickspencer3, we have GAJ
<seiflotfy> :)
<seiflotfy> it uses both
<seiflotfy> :)
<rickspencer3> seiflotfy, is it in universe?
<seiflotfy> lucid?
<thorike> and with the next release we'll add "related items"
<robtaylor> rickspencer3: do you know if the Canonical UX team be there?
<rickspencer3> robtaylor, yes, they will be
<seiflotfy> rickspencer3, i think it is
<rickspencer3> seiflotfy, what is the package name?
<robtaylor> rickspencer3: i think the main thing for me is to make sure 10.10 doesn't ship with the old tracker in main again ;)
<chrisccoulson> robtaylor - it won't
<rickspencer3> robtaylor, that can for sure be arranged easily
<chrisccoulson> i'm already on the case with that ;)
<robtaylor> chrisccoulson: awesome :D
<chrisccoulson> the 0.7 packaging is in good shape already
<chrisccoulson> i will upload it as soon as lucid + 1 opens
<seiflotfy> gnome-activity-journal
<seiflotfy> rickspencer3, ^
<seiflotfy> we are relasing again in a week or 2
<robtaylor> rickspencer3: and some simple low-hanging fruid i'd liek to see is getting some tracker-based vfolders in nautilus by default. e.g. 'All Videos' 'All Music'
<rickspencer3> robtaylor, interesting
<chrisccoulson> that would be awesome
<seb128> hum
<rickspencer3> this seems something that can be installed as a seperate package
<seb128> I'm wondering if we can demote tracker in lucid
<rickspencer3> from universe
<rickspencer3> and bake
<seb128> since nautilus is using it at runtime now
<robtaylor> rickspencer3: there's a little that needs to be done in nautilus, to support direct tracker querying in it's vfolder query language
<seb128> no offense to the tracker team but 0.6 is outdated anyway
<seb128> chrisccoulson, do you know?
<robtaylor> i've chatted over thatwith alexl, and he's up for is, as the tracker backing is pretty much the only supported vfolder backend for the next nautilus release
<robtaylor> seb128: yeah, i really want to see 0.6 dissapear for good
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i don't mind. i was going to upload the latest 0.6 point release at soem point, but i never got round to it
<chrisccoulson> i haven't used 0.6 for ages ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I don't think we should was efforts on this version
<seb128> let's do better in lucid+1
<chrisccoulson> yeah, lucid+1 will get 0.7/0.8
<seb128> tracker 0.6 in lucid is of little anyway for users
<rickspencer3> seb128, are you suggesting demote tracker to universe for lucid, and then do tracker .7 in main when 10.10 opens?
<robtaylor> seb128: its pretty damn aweful. I'm still pushing for the 0.8 stable series to get a Tracker *2* name. We need some signalling that is really is a completely different beast with different aims
<seb128> rickspencer3, yes
<seb128> rickspencer3, well not especially in main if nothing use it
<seb128> rickspencer3, having it in universe means it's easier for other contributors to work on it too
<rickspencer3> if we demote it to universe, could we not replace it with .7 in lucid?
<rickspencer3> or is that too aggressive?
<seb128> chrisccoulson has been looking at it
<seb128> but 0.7 had stopper issues
<chrisccoulson> rickspencer3, AFAIK, the current 0.7 branch does not handle ontology changes well, which would mean users having to manually remove their index after upgrading
<seb128> I'm not sure we should spend efforts on that now
<seb128> nothing in going to use it in lucid anyway
<chrisccoulson> which was the blocker issue for not uploading 0.7
<chrisccoulson> robtaylor can probably explain better though ;)
<rickspencer3> ok
<rickspencer3> never mind
<rickspencer3> it was just a suggestion, it's not my call anyway
<robtaylor> btw, if anyone needs a bit of an overview of the linked data structure we use at the ce core of tracker, I have a nice slide cast on my blog (http://blog.floopily.org/2010/03/01/rdf-beginners-guide-and-competition/)
<rickspencer3> robtaylor, I'll try to find the link later
<rickspencer3> j/k
<chrisccoulson> rickspencer3, i sort-of maintain 0.7 in a PPA though, with mbiebl (the debian maintainer)
<rickspencer3> ok
<chrisccoulson> rickspencer3, https://edge.launchpad.net/~tracker-team/+archive/tracker-unstable has 0.7 packages
<rickspencer3> ok
<rickspencer3> thanks
<chrisccoulson> (which i need to update with last weeks release at some point)
<robtaylor> chrisccoulson: *nod*. I'm not sure of the status on that either. It's at least scheduled to be fixed by the 0.8 series
<seiflotfy> rickspencer3, i would like to add http://seilo.geekyogre.com/uploads/2010/03/image7.png
<rickspencer3> robtaylor, seiflotfy do we need to decide anything now?
 * didrocks adds the link to "should be read when slackering tomorrow"
<seiflotfy> coudl we make this a track for lucid
<robtaylor> rickspencer3: no, not at all :)
<seiflotfy> ?
<didrocks> oupss, my boss is there :)
<rickspencer3> hehe
<robtaylor> rickspencer3: i just want to get some shared bain cells going on the possibilities ;)
<seiflotfy> i mean lucid + 1
<robtaylor> *brain
<robtaylor> rickspencer3: and make sure we have the right basis in place going forward
<robtaylor> someone might need to explain to me what a 'track' is ;)
<seiflotfy> rickspencer3, my problme with the current desktop is that it is too static
<seiflotfy> we should add a track or 2 in lucid+1
<seiflotfy> to discuss enriching new possibilities of experience
<seiflotfy> adaptive and personal experience
<seiflotfy> by static i mean everything on the desktop is based on the hierarchal filesystem
<rickspencer3> seiflotfy, my point to you is that you are empowered to realize your vision for the desktop
<rickspencer3> but you'll have to prove it with your code and prove it to the users
<seiflotfy> i get what u mean
<chrisccoulson> i think the idea of virtual folders in nautilus is awesome. i have music scattered all over my desktop (some private, and some shared with other users), and it would be cool to have all that in a single virtual folder
<TheMuso> Virtual folder for me would be pointless, I just organise things into folder proper.
<TheMuso> folders
<thorike> chrisccoulson, and with zeitgeist you would then be able to ask: what did I listen to yesterday, while I was writing on this paper
<thorike> and in general, zg will relate the music files according to how u use them
<chrisccoulson> TheMuso - but sometimes you have to have things in different folders, but don't want to care about that when you're accessing them
<thorike> so, our aim is to surprise the user with the "related items" thing, but in a positive way
<TheMuso> chrisccoulson: I can see how this is true for some.
<thorike> as in "ah yeah  that's true, these songs I like to hear together"
<robtaylor> chrisccoulson: how's your c? ;) I could do with a volunteer for that stuff :)
<seb128> robtaylor, did alex agree on virtual folders in nautilus?
<chrisccoulson> robtaylor, i like C ;)
<thorike> we are also thinking of expanding this to include recommender functionality
<robtaylor> seb128: its functionailty that's already there
<seb128> he has usually been against virtual locations to display that sort of things
<seb128> hum k
<seb128> I though the vision was that nautilus is a file manager
<thorike> rickspencer3, and in general, as compared to general semantic technologies such as tracker
<robtaylor> seb128: what he's agains it virtual file systems
<seb128> that ie music management should be done in ie rhythmbox
<robtaylor> *against is
<seb128> not in nautilus
<thorike> which try to express similarity and semantics of contents independent of users
<thorike> zg personalizes this semantics
<robtaylor> seb128: absolutely, I agree :)
<rickspencer3> guys, tbh, when I hear a term like "semantic technologies" I think of solutions looking for problems
<seb128> I think I miss the nuance there
<didrocks> so do I :)
<thorike> in that it will be capable of reflecting personal meaning of computer-represented objects, as emerging and developing from them being involved in a userâs activities and experiences.
<rickspencer3> I think it might be easier to explain zg if you could sum it up in terms that put user valuke forward
<robtaylor> seb128: possibly. have you got a unstable nautilus build to hand?
<thorike> rickspencer3, oki :-)
<thorike> when using zeitgeist you don't need to remember where / in what folder or alike you have put an item
<robtaylor> seb128: if you install the tracker0.7 package from the tracker-team ppa, you should be able to do a search in nautilus and save it as a vfolder
<thorike> it's just there, for example, in gaj
<chrisccoulson> robtaylor - oh, i've not tried that yet
<thorike> you can recognize the name instead of recalling it
<thorike> which is especially good for sporadic users
<TheMuso> I don't like that, that doesn't promote keeping organised files. :)
<didrocks> I think real and precise test cases are the best way to show the added value.
<seb128> robtaylor, not right now but I will try later for sure
<thorike> TheMuso, there is aplace for keeping files organized
<thorike> but it is known that there are filers and pilers alike
<thorike> and none is better or worse
<robtaylor> chrisccoulson: yeah. unfortunatly the ui doesn't support making an 'all video' search properly, but you can do a search for  'foobar', type Video, and hand edit the .vfolder file
<robtaylor> seb128: awesome :)
<thorike> and in particular for the "short term memory of computer"
<thorike> 1 or two days
<thorike> max
<chrisccoulson> robtaylor, i just tried searching in nautilus, and it crashes ;)
<chrisccoulson> heh
<robtaylor> chrisccoulson: doh !
<thorike> zeitgeist will make sure, you'll get back to your data
<thorike> without overhead of organizing them
<thorike> rickspencer3, does that make more sense to you like that?
<chrisccoulson> i should probably modify the tracker packages actually to build the gdb symbols too
<chrisccoulson> or rather package the symbols
<robtaylor> chrisccoulson: well, so, when i'm back in GMT we should meet up and make a plan for stabilising it and growing teh query format
<robtaylor> chrisccoulson: is that with nautilus git head?
<thorike> rickspencer3, so another use case would be empowering the open-file dialogue with zg
<chrisccoulson> robtaylor, this is with 2.29.92.1, so i'm not sure how far that is from git now
<thorike> where you'll have the "most-used with this app" items
<thorike> or recently used
<thorike> where zg is different from recently used as it captures, keeps, and exploits the old events too
<thorike> so it doesn't loose interaction memory
<thorike> which is one of the design flaws with "recent documents"
<robtaylor> chrisccoulson: thats pretty much git head, i think
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i just looked at the recent commits, and there doesn't seem to be much interesting there
<seb128> chrisccoulson, the most recent one could be
<thorike> open-file dialogue or the zeitbutton could also make use of related-items fct. of zg
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - http://git.gnome.org/browse/nautilus/commit/?id=a92a7bfcb2c7bb9f171724bc97b1c163f52c0fd7 ?
<robtaylor> thorike: i think we need projects and code for these ideas
<seb128> chrisccoulson, yes
<thorike> so what is most-related by usage (using together with the doc. displayed in the window) with the document
<seb128> chrisccoulson, not really in fact
<thorike> robtaylor, it's coming
<robtaylor> chrisccoulson: you could be hitting some issue in the magic dynamic SO loading
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I though they fixed a tracker crash but it was probably before tarball
<thorike> the related-items fct. will be out with the next release
<thorike> and we are already starting to build on it
<robtaylor> chrisccoulson: though it just worked for me, git head 1ab37214
<thorike> which will allow to capture something like working sets
<RainCT> good night guys
<thorike> which is "documents you used together working on a task"
<thorike> which often users dont keep tidy and clean within folders
<chrisccoulson> i should probably update the tracker version in the PPA really
<chrisccoulson> but that's a job for tomorrow now
<chrisccoulson> i may as well wait for tomorrows tarball ;)
<kklimonda> sorry to ask but how does it track what task is user currently working on?
<thorike> so, we relieve users from the burden to always right away copy stuff together when they finish working on something, for example, because they are interrupted by their boss and have to switch to sth else
<seb128> chrisccoulson, did you ping asac about nm-applet btw?
<seb128> asac, asac_: ^
<thorike> and afaik, this working-set notion is not supported by anything currently
<seb128> asac, asac_: can we get those nm-applet changes in lucid now?
<thorike> but often users work with several items on a task
<thorike> and task switching is known to be a heavy burden mental-load wise
<thorike> it's already difficult enough to "think-into" the task again
<thorike> the desktop should relieve users from searching the relevant items again, if they have already been used
<thorike> failure of re-finding is especially annoying people, because they know it's there
<thorike> but they cant get a hold of the stuff again
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - we mentioned it in the meeting on tuesday, but i just pinged him again
<chrisccoulson> it might have got lost during the team meeting ;)
<thorike> kklimonda, it does by analysing the usage and re-usage patterns
<thorike> and you are right there is not a UI yet
<thorike> but that will soon come
<seiflotfy> kklimonda, we implemented A Priori and we are working on also implementing Winepi and Minepi
<seiflotfy> two other algorithms
<thorike> they are basically associating the events on the documents
<thorike> and thereby also relating the documents
<kklimonda> does it mean all applications have to be aware of tracker/zg to make use of it?
<thorike> and one UI is already in trunc of zg
<kklimonda> well, to make use of the task tracking
<seiflotfy> well this part is coverd by zg
<seiflotfy> and yes they can be aware of it using dbus
<kklimonda> I'd love to see a rhythmbox and banshee ported to tracker for example - right now I've all my music rated and I can't neither change application or move it on the disk without loosing this data. So I love the idea but without putting a lot of resources into this we won't get a good results.
<thorike> well for rhythmbox for example there is or soon will be a zg data provider
<robtaylor> kklimonda: +1 from me :)
<seiflotfy> thekorn, correction its there :)
<seiflotfy> thorike, kklimonda rhytmbox dataprovider exists now
<RAOF> The Banshee dev's concern about that is whether tracker is fast enough.
<robtaylor> RAOF: *nod*
<thorike> kklimonda, yep your point is a good example of making use of tracker
<thorike> zeitgeist, after listening to you for a while and checking which songs you skipt etc
<robtaylor> RAOF: its an intersting one that. I see quite often people saying 'we put a lot of work into making our database fast, tracker couldn't possibly be fast enough'
<RAOF> Because quite a large set of Banshee features involves querying their sqlite database.
<thorike> would then also be able to design playlists according to this data and not only according to static song properties
<robtaylor> RAOF: we've got a speed test suite now, so i think that's a task for me to show them the money ;)
<RAOF> robtaylor: I don't know if tracker *is* fast enough; I don't think there's any architectural reason why it couldn't be.
<robtaylor> RAOF: tbh, I don't really know either. I'm looking forward to running the test suite when i get a chance ;)
<robtaylor> RAOF: its very much about the use cases
<RAOF> It would be quite easy to sync banshee's data with tracker, but it'd be quite a lot of work to actually replace the DB backend with tracker.
<thorike> and these playlist recommendations would also change over time
<robtaylor> RAOF: yep. I was just about to say, the real part of the story that's missing with tracker rigt now, is great developer apis for gnome
<thorike> what you liked a year ago is different from now sometimes
<robtaylor> thorike: absolutely
<thorike> but zg also allows to scope back to "last year" and tell you
<thorike> same for documents and mails, websites
<thorike> you were using on a project
<thorike> they are meaningful mostly while the project is running
<thorike> and then querying what was related to them while the project was running is important
<thorike> and is currently not supported
<thorike> e.g., you asking a year later
<kklimonda> thorike: how easy would it be to back all this data up? most users don't have a full disk backup running and zg sounds like something that shines only if it has enough data from long period.
<thorike> I have this document at hand, which I know I generated during that project
<thorike> what was related to it then
<thorike> and not with the new "noise" that has come since the project
<thorike> kklimonda, it's one sqllite DB
<thorike> so it's an easy backup
<thorike> or what do you mean?
<thorike> to bootstrap also "old data" can be imported / simulated wherever possible
<thorike> e.g., chat logs are easy
<thorike> kklimonda, and you're right,
<thorike> zg shines most, when there is a long history
<thorike> and with our design, it's not a problem to have years of data in there
<thorike> and query it efficiently
<didrocks> the concept is interesting but I still really think that for UDS, you should bring some existing and precise use cases/scenarios working (or at least some proof of concept of them) to make the added value more visual
<thorike> didrocks, that's true
<thorike> we'll try
<kklimonda> thorike: well, is it possible to for example sync the database using desktopcouch (or another service) and then, after the format, sync it back and get back on the track - how would it handle missing files or files that are missing right now but are going to be restored from backup in a moment.. same for tracker - does it remove "file" from the database completely or can it be restored if the
<kklimonda> file with the same hash shows up eventually.
<didrocks> kklimonda: I was thinking that at first, but maybe my workflow on my laptop isn't the same than the one on my netbook :)
<kklimonda> (that's how I clean my desktop for example - I move $HOME to ../BACKUP and then move back only important files like music or photos or some of the configuration I actually care about
<thorike> kklimonda, well couchdb is rather slow compared to our DB
<thorike> but synching between several of your personal DBs on devices is on our list
<thorike> it's important considering also mobile phones
<thorike> re missing files: they are shown and considered
<thorike> shown in grey so you realize they are not there
<robtaylor> ok guys.I'm afraid I need to head to sleep now!
<rickspencer3> bye robtaylor
<rickspencer3> thanks for your time!
<robtaylor> rickspencer3: seiflotfy: thanks for this. Its great to get the discussion flowing :)
<thorike> bye robtaylor
<robtaylor> rickspencer3: thanks for your time too
<robtaylor> thorike: thanks, see you on #zeitgiest ;)
<thorike> yep :-)
<thorike> kklimonda, and you have both options
<thorike> to delete files completely from database or just not showing them, aka blacklisting
<thorike> and yes, they can be restored if the file with the same hash shows up again
<thorike> zg DB keeps the activity on the items, not the items itself
<thorike> and the activity is still meaningful to oneself, even if the items are temporarily not available
<kklimonda> thorike: only name? no hash? for example if I save an attachment from email, then remove it and then get the same attachment from some site under the different name it wont show up?
<robtaylor> rickspencer3: oh, i forgot to say, take a look at this TED talk for some interesting MS stuff on linked data - http://www.ted.com/talks/gary_flake_is_pivot_a_turning_point_for_web_exploration.html
 * robtaylor really goes to sleep now ;)
<thorike> i.e. for remembering "what have I done two weeks ago"
<kklimonda> ok, that feature sounds like O_PONIES ;)
<thorike> currently people use their calendar, mailtool, filesystem and whatsoever for that (fragmented user experience)
<thorike> in zg, it's all there
<rickspencer3> ah gary flake
<rickspencer3> the one, the only, the fired
<thorike> kklimonda, same hash, it would show up
<kklimonda> thorike: oh? great
<thorike> but you're touching an important issue
<thorike> what is "the same file"
<thorike> sooner or later, we'll need some layer that will clarify this
<thorike> beyond what we have now
<thorike> documents develop and people might want to have this shown
<kklimonda> right - for example user can send a document to a friend and get it back - the content is different, the name can be different and so hash but the document is probably the same..
<kklimonda> mhm
<thorike> as in two weeks ago, a paper I was writing had some content I had later deleted
<thorike> yep, we'll tackle that
<thorike> but have not a real working solution yet
 * didrocks waves goodbye, it's late!
 * thorike waving back :-)
<kklimonda> g'night didrocks
<didrocks> kklimonda: thanks, you too ;) bye thorike!
<thorike> kklimonda, so we need to work on "document identity"
<thorike> needs versioning
<thorike> maybe
<thorike> can be found out sometimes by similarity
<thorike> content wise
<thorike> but sometimes also needs the trace
<thorike> as in copied from here to there
<thorike> then sent
<thorike> and back, again working on it
<thorike> the usual stuff you do, when working with someone on a paper or presentation
<kklimonda> right.. and the remote system may not even know about zg and all this stuff.
<thorike> sadly yes
<thorike> in case the remote system is your system you can control
<thorike> but in case not it's also by design, because, you shouldn know about others file use
<thorike> ...
<thorike> but we have teamgeist for that
<thorike> where the sharing is tracked too
<thorike> that will probably a gsoc project
<thorike> having a data provider for telepathy
<thorike> which is the protocol we use for teamgeist
<thorike> ... that's for trusted communities
<thorike> like google wave, but simpler :-)
<thorike> you want to share s.th. with someone else, e.g. you are working on a project with him/her
<thorike> you use the file and if you want your collaborator/peer
<thorike> will a) be aware immediately that you do
<thorike> and b) also have access to the file (exactly your version, which has been sent over a tube)
<thorike> it's implemented, but the group stuff is tricky
<thorike> because you don't want to harm privacy of others
<thorike> it needs to be easy, predictable, expectancy conform and all that
<thorike> and  mutually
<kklimonda> mhm
<thorike> ?
<kklimonda> right, I see :)
<thorike> I think, it's a UI issue
<thorike> it's amazingly cool to work with it
<thorike> but users might be fearing loosing control
<thorike> that has to be handled on ui level
<thorike> simple customizing, easy to understand
<kklimonda> thorike: btw, is zg something that both gnome and kde developers are interested in?
<thorike> gnome: definite yes, kde: interests many developers, but the nepomuk people claim that we should be using their ontology for events too
<kklimonda> thorike: right - the whole concept is great but a bit overwhelming especially when you add the sharing into that :)
<thorike> which doesnt realy work
<kklimonda> oh right, they have nepomuk :/
<thorike> nepomuk is nice for documents, static information
<thorike> although introducing quite some overhead
<thorike> and there is not really an event ontology as we designed in the last two months
<thorike> which is simple and thin, and does the job greatly
<thorike> as soon as we have the feeling it's stable, we'll talk back to sebastian
<thorike> there is ongoing connection and discussion, although not daily :-)
<thorike> kklimonda, how do you mean overwhelming?
<thorike> good or bad? (polarizing ;-) )
<thorike> kklimonda, and if you want to put the concept idea in one line
<thorike> it's "everybody knows, what I do, but I don't" :-)
<thorike> google, amazon, travel agencies, ...
<thorike> they all log your behavior
<thorike> and analyse it to their benefits
<kklimonda> thorike: both zg and tracker sound like something great if they get enough tracktion but both present a huge change to the way users use their computers.
<thorike> there is no similar means for that on the desktop yet
<kklimonda> thorike: maybe I feel like that because it's all fragmented and when the missing UI bigs emerge it will look clearer
<kklimonda> s/bigs/bits
<thorike> yep, well using location information was also pretty much a change and people adapted quickly
<thorike> we do the same, but with the time-dimension
<kklimonda> thorike: it sounds much more exciting that gnome-shell in my opinion :)
<thorike> kklimonda, wow thanks for the flowers
<thorike> :-)
<thorike> kklimonda, and I can see the fragmented feeling
<thorike> did you use gnome activity journal, yet?
<thorike> and the zg docky, which shows most or recently used
<thorike> that gives you a preview feeling I think
<thorike> especially with zeitgeist's next release, which will show related items
<thorike> needs integration to gaj (gnome activ. journal) though
<thorike> we're working on it
<thorike> if we get people surprised like "oh yeah cool, that's true this file which I put in another folder is really related to the doc at hand"
<thorike> that will work, if we get this "aha effect" (as we say in german) :-)
<thorike> like heureka
<kklimonda> thorike: my usage patterns sucks and I do way too much things using terminal so it doesn't work for me :/
<thorike> well, some of us do too
<thorike> so eventually we'll need to tackle that
<thorike> but that will need kernel support
<thorike> first, we need to proove it useful
<thorike> then come the diamonds :-)
<thorike> kklimonda, you usage pattern sucks? .. you mean you do everything at once? ... then you'd be our hard core test case for segmenting with the association algorithms .. apriori, etc
<kklimonda> thorike: yeah - when I don't do anything work-related I just jump from one topic to another :)
<kklimonda> it's a terrible habit I'm trying to overcome though
<thorike> well, why .. you'd be the ideal test case ... and why change if it works for you?
<thorike> :-)
<thorike> the computer should change to support that behavior better
<thorike> it's like with filers and pilers
<thorike> it's reproduced in studies again and again .. people are different
<thorike> and computers should cope with it
<thorike> and the full power of zg will even better show on devices more mobile than netbooks
<thorike> "what did I do three days ago at this bus stop (gps position)?"
<thorike> that's easy for zeitgeist
<thorike> and is not possible without events
<thorike> but even now we have enough usefullness
<thorike> my parents use gnome activity journal on their desktops
<thorike> as they have trouble with folders and remembering file names
<thorike> gaj does the job for them
<thorike> if they want to re-find what they did
<thorike> ... well it's getting late
<kklimonda> ok, I guess I'm at my limit of processing any informations :)
<thorike> was nice talking to you, kklimonda, rickspencer3
 * thorike waves good by
<thorike> kklimonda, me too :-)
<thorike> lets take it up at some other time
<thorike> meet you at #zeitgeist or #gnome-zeitgeist
<kklimonda> thorike: g'night :)
<thorike> kklimonda, you too :-)
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-03-25
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, I'm betting you know ...
<rickspencer3> if i want to use Jack to record sounds from my desktop with gtk-record-my-desktop, which package(s) do I need to install?
<TheMuso> rickspencer3: why jack?
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, I dunno
<rickspencer3> because gtk-record-my-desktop offers it as an option
<TheMuso> Does gtk-record-my-desktop use anything else?
<rickspencer3> basically, I want to make screen casts and include the sounds my desktop makes in addtion to what comes from the mic
<rickspencer3> maybe a different app will work better
<TheMuso> Right, to do so, you would pretty much have to use jack.
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, so Jack is installed, but jackd won't run
<TheMuso> What you need to do, is start jack, sit pulse on top of jack, then reroute the audio from pulse to the applicatino you are recording with.
<rickspencer3> that sounds very sucky
<TheMuso> rickspencer3: Right, how are you trying to run jackd?
<rickspencer3> sudo jackd -r
<TheMuso> rickspencer3: In one way I agree, but in another, I don't.
<rickspencer3> mmm
<rickspencer3> I guess I meant "hard" not "sucky"
<TheMuso> rickspencer3: Yeah its not easy.
<TheMuso> rickspencer3: I suggest you install qjackctl. That will allow you to start jack and suspend pulse from using the sound card.
<rickspencer3> I think that's installed
<rickspencer3> ah
<rickspencer3> can I now just run hack?
<rickspencer3> nope
<TheMuso> hack?
<rickspencer3> I meant jacl
<rickspencer3> a bit of a typo
<rickspencer3> heh
<rickspencer3> jack, in fact
<TheMuso> h ok
<TheMuso> qjackctl runs jack for you
<rickspencer3> ah
<rickspencer3> meh
<TheMuso> however, I am not personally sure as to how one sets up pulse with jack. I've never done it myself.
<TheMuso> the pavucontrol package may allow you to do it easily from a GUI.
<rickspencer3> not working at all
<TheMuso> hrm interesting.
<TheMuso> what does qjackctl give you in the log window?
<rickspencer3> rick@rick-desktop:~$ qjackctl
<rickspencer3> Suspending PulseAudio
<rickspencer3> though I since killed it
<rickspencer3> and now my sound is dead
<TheMuso> interesting. When you shut down qjackctl, pulse should have stopped suspension.
<rickspencer3> though I am not surpised by that
<TheMuso> How did you kill qjackctl?
<rickspencer3> rick@rick-desktop:~$ pulseaudio
<rickspencer3> E: pid.c: Daemon already running.
<rickspencer3> E: main.c: pa_pid_file_create() failed.
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, I used cntrl-C
<TheMuso> rickspencer3: right, which probably killed the script mid step, causing things not to exit as they probably should in order for suspend to be disabled.
<rickspencer3> yeah
<TheMuso> rickspencer3: to get pulse going again run pulseaudio -k ; pulseaudio --start
<rickspencer3> I was impatient
<TheMuso> brb
<rickspencer3> yay
<rickspencer3> worked
<TheMuso> rickspencer3: Is there a good reason why you want the sounds recorded?
<TheMuso> pitty that recordmydesktop doesn't use pulseaudio.
<rickspencer3> mmm
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, yes, I want to demonstrate how to use PyGame mixer module
<TheMuso> rickspencer3: ah ok.
<rickspencer3> hearing the sound would greatly help with this
<TheMuso> yup
<rickspencer3> TheMuso,
<rickspencer3> so it still says:
<rickspencer3> rick@rick-desktop:~$ qjackctl
<rickspencer3> Suspending PulseAudio
<TheMuso> yeah thats right. But do you get a window pop up?
<rickspencer3> yes
<rickspencer3> 20:01:23.255 Patchbay deactivated.
<rickspencer3> 20:01:23.315 Statistics reset.
<rickspencer3> 20:01:23.328 ALSA connection graph change.
<rickspencer3> 20:01:23.526 ALSA connection change.
<rickspencer3> I have only dim ideas of what any of this means
<TheMuso> rickspencer3: hrm ok, maybe it would be better to run jackd from the command-line, however a few other things need to be done first to make things work properly, and as I said, I am not sure how to set up pulse to use jack.
<rickspencer3> meh
<rickspencer3> this is probably not a good use of your time
<rickspencer3> I thought I would just run the Jack Audio Connection tool
<rickspencer3> and it would all work
<TheMuso> Not that easy unfortunately.
<rickspencer3> yeah
<TheMuso> Even if you got it running, you still need to route the audio from pulseaudio via jack to the recorder application, as well as your mic.
<rickspencer3> oh fudge
<rickspencer3> that sounds heinous
<TheMuso> Well jack was designed for advanced routing like that/pro audio use.
<rickspencer3> is there a way for me tell Pulse Audio that sound to my speakers is really an input device?
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, yeah, I understand
<rickspencer3> I'm not holding it against Jack
<rickspencer3> what I'll end up doing is using external speakers and an external mic
<TheMuso> rickspencer3: Not that I know of. If anything its probably not possible from a pulse perspective.
<TheMuso> Which is why audio re-routing has to be done, so that the audio from the app doesn't even get to the speakers.
<rickspencer3> speakers and external mic it will have to be
<rickspencer3> already wasted to much time on this
<rickspencer3> thanks TheMuso
<RAOF> TheMuso: Can't you hook up monitor sources in pulseaudio?  Wouldn't that pretty much do what rick wants?
<TheMuso> RAOF: Probably, I don't know enough about that.
<TheMuso> to comment
<RAOF> I don't think there's a UI for it, but I think it's possible.
<RAOF> Not that âpossible, as long as you're willing to code itâ is a particularly useful state. :)
<rickspencer3> RAOF, what is the basic idea there?
<RAOF> You can certainly get the output of a pulseaudio sink as an input; that's how the gnome-volume-control shows the peak information (you know, the bar that bounces with the audio).
<RAOF> I don't have anything more concrete than being pretty sure it's *technically* possible to do with pulse.
<RAOF> <handwave>You'd feed the monitor source of your soundcard's sink & your mic source into module-combine, then pipe that into whatever's doing the recording</handwave>
<RAOF> After writing all the UI to do that, of course.
<rickspencer3> that sounds like an interesting project
<rickspencer3> but probably not worth blocking on ;)
<rickspencer3> hmmm
<RAOF> Maybe I'll expose enough pulse in pulseaudio-sharp 0.3 to write that UI in a sensible language ;)
<rickspencer3> RAOF, TheMuso what would happen if I got a wire that was male on each end ...
<rickspencer3> and plugged it into the headphone jack on one end, and the microphone jack on the other end
<TheMuso> rickspencer3: You still need something to mix both the sources from your mic and the computer
<rickspencer3> oh, right
<rickspencer3> bah
<TheMuso> SO what you would have is mic && speaker output -> mixing device -> input of computer
<rickspencer3> The easy answer is obvious
<RAOF> Dubbing?
<rickspencer3> but I don't have any nice sounding speakers
<rickspencer3> probably doesn't matter though
<rickspencer3> thanks guys
<TheMuso> np
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, pavucontrol has my answer
<rickspencer3> when I am doing the sounds, I can switch on the Recording tab to use my internal stereo
<rickspencer3> I *think* that will let me choose between the mic and the sounds in real time
<rickspencer3> too bad it's radio buttons instead of check boxes :/
<rickspencer3> hmm
<TheMuso> rickspencer3: I don't think you can do what you want to do with pavucontrol, could be wrong though, never used it to control recording.
<rickspencer3> I just did it
<RAOF> You can't just add a voice over in post-processing?
<rickspencer3> RAOF, not really
<rickspencer3> it's really about programming
<TheMuso> rickspencer3: if you want only one source or the other, then I guess thats fine.
<rickspencer3> so pavucontrol lists Monitor of Internal AUdio Stereo as a selectable input device
<TheMuso> when you talk to me about recording multiple sources, then I automatically start thinking all pro and mixing etc.
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, there is no way to mix these easily?
<rickspencer3> in any case, this way is fine
<TheMuso> rickspencer3: actually, you said monitor of stereo audio device, thats what you want, you just have to get your mic playing out your spakers, which could get messy.
<TheMuso> speakers
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, right
<TheMuso> so Isuggest flicking between monitor of stereo audio and the mic
<rickspencer3> waaaay back int eh day there was a way to do that on my Mac
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, just switching between them is totally fine for my purpose
<TheMuso> ok
<rickspencer3> pavucontrol is pretty cool
<RAOF> It is.  A bit messy, ui wise, but handy when you need it.
<rickspencer3> well, now there is no way that I have time to actually make the video tonight :)
<rickspencer3> BUT
<rickspencer3> my PyGame template seems mostly done
<rickspencer3> just need to add a template desktop file and icon
<rickspencer3> didrocks implemented this notion of command inheritance, so I made the PyGame template inherit it's package command from the ubuntu-application package command
<rickspencer3> and it worked first try!
<rickspencer3> crazy
<TheMuso> cool
<rickspencer3> You know what I just realized
<rickspencer3> with pavucontrol, I have the power to play pretty much anything I want into mumble
<rickspencer3> mwuhahahahaha
<TheMuso> heh
<jono> czajkowski, up early?
<czajkowski> jono: yup
<pitti> Good morning
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> bonjour didrocks
<didrocks> hey pitti, how are you today?
<pitti> bit of a sore throat, but I'm great otherwise, thanks; how about you?
<pitti> looking forward to "release day" again? :-)
<didrocks> right :-) Nothing too fancy today. I'll try to work a little on Quickly too to be able to release it (will need FF) as my latest patches are in Launchpad finally :)
<didrocks> otherwise I'm fine, thanks
<didrocks> take care to not be ill :)
 * pitti replies to the gthumb 2.10 vs. 2.11 bug, does a few more experiments, finds more and more bugs
<pitti> argh, I so much want 2.10 back *sniff*
<pitti> didrocks: how does 2.11 work for you?
<pitti> for me it's quite dreadful :(
<didrocks> pitti: I had no crash, got some bugs but upstream told me that a new release will be there for beta1 (which hasn't been the case). Importing worked as weel (I tried when we synced, not again since). I can give it a look again today
 * didrocks likes shotwell to be honest :)
<pitti> didrocks: I tried it yesterday
<pitti> I wonder why all three popular photo managers now own your photos, differently
<didrocks> oh, I totally agree with that, that's a shame :(
<didrocks> the thing is that shotwell fit very well in a netbook screen, contrary to gthumb and f-spot
<didrocks> pitti: just so your remark on the bug report. FYI, shotwell doesn't change anything in the hierarchy if you use the "Picture" folder to have your photo. And there is an option too to avoid copying them when importing from another directory
<seb128> didrocks, 'lu
<didrocks> hey seb128, how are you?
<seb128> hey, quite good thank you! you?
<seb128> you talk about what bug report there?
<didrocks> I'm fine too, thanks :)
<seb128> you guys work on shotwell now?
<didrocks> seb128: bug #545871
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 545871 in gthumb "[lucid] downgrade to stable 2.10" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/545871
<seb128> hum, k
<didrocks> seb128: the discussion was brought that I'm not using gthumb nor f-spot but shotwell :)
<seb128> how is shotwell revelant to the gthumb version?
<seb128> oh ok
<seb128> shotwell is interesting but still lacks quite a lot
<didrocks> seb128: it was just a side note about the "OMG it clutters my FSH with its own format"
<seb128> lol
<didrocks> FHS*
<seb128> it does sort by tags though still?
<didrocks> seb128: right, it just do what I need, but I have very limited needs in that area :)
<seb128> I think pitti want sorting by directories
<didrocks> yes
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<didrocks> not sure if we can have this view in shotwell. I think not, will check with upstream
<pitti> let's not worry about shotwell now; MM material :)
<seb128> pitti, hey
<tjaalton> is there a way to disable the popups about low disk space? those are shown for network filesystems too..
<pitti> tjaalton: ther's a checkbox; but they shouldn't be shown for network fs, mind filing a bug about it with a "gvfs-mount -li" output?
<tjaalton> pitti: sure thing
<tjaalton> hmm, that lists only the dvd-drive
<tjaalton> these are mounted in fstab
<tjaalton> *listed
<pitti> tjaalton: ah; well, please include it anyway, plus the lines from fstab and "mount" output
<tjaalton> pitti: against gvfs?
<pitti> tjaalton: gnome-disk-utility
<seb128> pitti, did you see that bug from elmo btw?
<seb128> pitti, and the one from kees
<seb128> pitti, do you use encrypted disks on lucid?
<pitti> seb128: I saw the bugs, but didn't follow up yet
<seb128> ok
<pitti> I'm currently triaging bugs and catchin up on mail, so I should get to it in the next hour or two
<seb128> pitti, the bug from elmo has something using devicekit
<pitti> seb128: I don't use cryptsetup, just ecryptfs
<seb128> dunno what though
<seb128> or how to figure what that is
<tjaalton> pitti: filed bug 546740
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 546740 in gnome-disk-utility "popups about low disk space for NFS mounts" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/546740
<pitti> tjaalton: thanks
<pitti> tjaalton: but still, don't you have a checkbox to disable them? I do
<tjaalton> pitti: yes, but how to solve it system-wide?
<pitti> tjaalton: hm, you don't, I think; you can workaround it by removing /etc/xdg/autostart/gdu-notification-daemon.desktop (or disabling it)
<tjaalton> can't find it with gconf-editor
<tjaalton> oh, that works
<tjaalton> would be fine if it complained about your quota, though..
<pitti> heh, yes
<pitti> tjaalton: but I don't think it should touch these at all
<pitti> apps will tell you if they run out of space when saving onto them
<tjaalton> and if nautilus showed the remaining quota, not the fs data
<tjaalton> oh yes they do :)
<pitti> tjaalton: it's primarily interesting for /, since running out of space there produces tons of inexplicable effects
<tjaalton> yep
<pitti> (/home as well)
<tjaalton> disabled the notificator locally, it's enough for me
<pitti> tjaalton: it's also the bit that warns you about SMART failure, so be aware of it :0
 * pitti repairs shift key and the smiley -> :)
<tjaalton> pitti: nah, hd's are cheap and not my problem to change them ;)
<pitti> hds are, but your data on them might not
<tjaalton> the workstations are practically stateless anyway
<pitti> ah, ok
<tjaalton> nothing valuable on them
<tjaalton> pop a new one in and reinstall
<pitti> tjaalton: hey, the Linux kernel alone is some $10G, isn't it? :-)
<tjaalton> pitti: oh right, better start saving ;)
<pitti> seb128: for bug 546446, it seems we just need to add an unlink() call to g-k startup, until shortly before lucid final?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 546446 in gnome-keyring "old session keyring still on disk" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/546446
<pitti> seb128: do you want to handle that, or shall I?
<seb128> pitti, right, I would guess so
<seb128> pitti, if you could that would be great
<seb128> pitti, I've a busy list for today
<pitti> actually, I think we should overwrite it with zeros first, and then unlink
<pitti> seb128: alrighty
<seb128> pitti, danke!
<seb128> didrocks, how are the clutter updates going?
<Kambanka> Ubuntu 10.04 has the titlebar buttons on the left - what were the designers thinking? And were they thinking at all!@#$
<didrocks> seb128: i386 packages are built. Not amd64 (maybe build system waiting). If you want to give a try (no issue on my side): use the ubuntu-desktop ppa and my ppa for clutter-gtk (was too confident and didn't upload an ~ppa1 version and it FTBFS in the ubuntu-desktop ppa)
<seb128> didrocks, still waiting on feedback to go to lucid?
<seb128> didrocks, I would recommend updating today, it's getting tight
<didrocks> seb128: ok, it's a dch -r "" away so, can do it now :)
<seb128> tomorrow is friday and you know that friday is not a good day for such changes and next week is beta2 freeze so it's getting late too
<didrocks> right
<didrocks> doing it
<seb128> let me know if I can help in some way
<seb128> ok thanks
<pitti> argh, someone please shoot me -- https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gdm/+bug/421212/comments/38
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 421212 in gnome-settings-daemon "gdm ignores keyboard layout selection for variants" [High,Fix released]
<didrocks> poor pitti :/
 * didrocks hugs pitti
 * seb128 hugs pitti
<dpm> hi pitti, I've got a question on p-d-e if you've got a minute. I was talking to kelemengabor about this patch to make a string on the music store translatable -> https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~kelemeng/rhythmbox-ubuntuone-music-store/bug546749 The plugin uses p-d-e auto, and I think in the patch the setup.cfg file can be dropped. However, p-d-e gives a message that .plugin.in files are not supported, and we're not sure how to best specify how to bui
<dpm> ld the .plugin file from .plugin.in and install it. Do we have to explicitly add it to setup.py?
<pitti> dpm: indeed, p-d-e's auto module doesn't pick up *.plugin.in, since that's not a standard file format
<pitti> dpm: so you have to explicitly add it to setup.cfg, hang on
<pitti> [build_i18n]
<pitti> key_files = [('destination/dir', ['sourcedir/foo.plugin.in']), ... ]
<pitti> dpm: ^ like this
<pitti> (assuming that it's the key file format, for intltool-merge -k)
<dpm> pitti, thanks. kelemengabor used the desktop file format, I'll have to check if it's the best format. The setup.cfg file on the patch looks like:
<dpm> [build_i18n]
<dpm> domain=rhythmbox-ubuntuone-music-store
<dpm> desktop_files=[("/usr/lib/rhythmbox/plugins/umusicstore", ("umusicstore/umusicstore.rb-plugin.in",))]
<pitti> dpm: that should work
<dpm> does the domain need to be specified? or p-d-e will infer it anyway?
<dpm> p-d-e auto
<MacSlow> Nafai, hey there
<seb128> Nafai, he's on the other side of the ocean so not up yet before some hours
<MacSlow> Nafai, I'll get to your email (reply) regarding n-osd and LP: #451086 during the day. Busy still with some other stuff
<MacSlow> seb128, ah ok
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hey seb128 - how are you?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, good thank you! what about you?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, good thanks. a bit tired though
<pitti> seb128: FTR, luks usb sticks work like charm here, I followed up to kees' and elmo's reports with requests for further debug info
<seb128> pitti, thank you!
<seb128> chrisccoulson, did you work late or baby woke you up or both? ;-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - both ;)
<chrisccoulson> my daughter has got back in to the habit of waking every 2 hours during the night again ;)
<seb128> I see ;-)
<seb128> pitti, the bug from kees, I think the issue is that's it not automount as it should
<seb128> pitti, the udisks log says it's a system partition not a removable device
<seb128> pitti, that seemed what is buggy to me
<seb128> pitti, <kees>	seb128: it looks like gvfs saw the drive and didn't do anything about it.
<seb128> pitti, that's from yesterday on IRC btw
<pitti> ah, indeed
<pitti> seb128: bug updated
<seb128> pitti, danke!
<chrisccoulson> pitti - is bug 546740 really a gdu bug?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 546740 in gnome-disk-utility "popups about low disk space for NFS mounts" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/546740
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I haven't looked at it in detail, but why not?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: well, it could be udisks, if that invalidly tracks nfs mounts
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i know g-s-d handles low disk space warnings, but i'm not sure if gdu is handling those too now
<pitti> but it seemed to be a good starting point
<aquarius> seb128, is there any way we can let apport know that a crash in Rhythmbox is actually caused by the music store plugin, so you don't have to keep reassigning bugs? :)
<seb128> aquarius, yes, I was just thinking about that
<aquarius> I thought you might be. :) I can't help people who file music store bugs against Rhythmbox manually, but we could at least help apport bugs. I don't know enough about apport to know whether this is doable, though
<seb128> aquarius, we could let the hook ask if the issue is happening with rhythmbox or with the music store
<aquarius> ooh, hooks can do interactive stuff? I didn't know that.
<seb128> aquarius, or we can look at the stacktrace if the musicstore.so is there and reassign those which have it in the stacktrace too
<seb128> aquarius, try ubuntu-bug rhythmbox on lucid?
<seb128> aquarius, it's already asking questions
<seb128> we can tweak those
<aquarius> Excellent. So one more question, "The Ubuntu One Music Store is not working correctly".
<aquarius> heh. I assume that "No sound is being played" sends the bug to pulseaudio and "some audio files are not being played correctly" sends it to gstreamer? ;)
<aquarius> ah, found the apport hook
<seb128> aquarius, something around those line yes, but using the interactive audio hook
<seb128> aquarius, /usr/share/apport/package-hooks/source_rhythmbox.py
<seb128> aquarius, you are welcome to send a patch for it
<aquarius> doing so now...
<seb128> thanks
<aquarius> how do I test an apport hook without building and installing the package?
<seb128> aquarius, edit /usr/share/apport/package-hooks/source_rhythmbox.py directly?
<seb128> until you have what you want
<seb128> and then diff with the ubuntu one
 * aquarius grins. That's what I was going to do, I just thought that I was being an evil hacky person :)
<seb128> aquarius, btw could you look at bug #546244
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 546244 in rhythmbox "selecting "Jump to Playing Song" crashes program when previewing a song from Ubuntu One store" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/546244
<seb128> not sure if that's a rhythmbox bug for crashing
<seb128> or if the store should unactivate the jump to playing song in some way
<seb128> didrocks, you rocks btw if I didn't say it today ;-)
<aquarius> hrm. I think RB shouldn't *crash*. When we play a streamed song we create a library entry for it, and it'spossible that I'm creating that library entry wrong so it's unjumpable
<seb128> didrocks, the no gdm sound change works great
 * didrocks hugs seb128 (even if I don't know why ;))
<didrocks> oh sweet!
<seb128> aquarius, ok, I will upstream tht one
<seb128> aquarius, btw do you want the crashes in webkit code be reassigned to the store?
<seb128> or to webkit
<aquarius> for the moment, the store
<seb128> ok thanks
<seb128> I was going to suggests doing that too
<aquarius> if we can work around them, we will, and then assign to webkit to actually have the crasher fixed
<seb128> we don't have anybody actively working on webkit
<seb128> so I'm not sure they would get attention there
<aquarius> that's what I thought, too :)
<seb128> is anybody in your team upstreaming webkit issues?
<seb128> that would be a good idea imho
<seb128> we need to invest some energy on webkit bugs anyway, with the store + software-center using it now
<aquarius> I've had some conversations with xan, but we haven't actively upstreamed the issues yet because we haven't actually had that many -- although possibly you're now going to tell me that we've had millions but they're all assigned to Rhythmbox and I haven't noticed
<seb128> those a key components in lucid
<seb128> aquarius, no, it's rather than webkit upstream seems active and I'm for setting up good records of being good citizen and having a good relationship with them if we can
<aquarius> *nod* agreed completely.
<aquarius> hm. If we get a crash in RB, and from RB's apport hook I execlp "apport rhythmbox-ubuntuone-music-store", it'll lose the crash information, won't it?
<aquarius> but if I add_package_info("rhythmbox-ubuntuone-music-store") then it'll still be a rhythmbox bug as well as a musicstore bug. Can I tell apport "use this package *instead* of the one you think it is", rather than *as well as* the one you think it is?
<seb128> 	if report.has_key("Stacktrace") and "/usr/lib/nautilus" in report["Stacktrace"]:
<seb128> 		for words in report["Stacktrace"].split():
<seb128> 			if words.startswith("/usr/lib/nautilus"):
<seb128> 				report.add_package_info(apport.packaging.get_file_package(words))
<seb128> 				return
<seb128> aquarius, you can copy that I guess
<seb128> aquarius, well it's probably easier in your case
<seb128> aquarius, that code reassign to whatever package contain a nautilus .so listed in the stacktrace...
<seb128> aquarius, ie if it the stacktrace has /usr/lib/nautilus/ubuntuone.so it will open the bug on the source package for it
<seb128> it assumes that if a .so is listed it's responsive for the issue ;-)
<aquarius> yep, that's how I'll autodetect crashes. I'm trying to work out how I can make the report be assigned to rb-u1-music-store and *not* be assigned to rhythmbox, without just cheating by exec'ing apport again. add_package_info will add rb-u1-m-s to the report, but it'll leave rhythmbox on the bug, won't it?
<aquarius> maybe I'm misunderstanding how apport reports work
 * aquarius rtfs :)
<seb128> aquarius, I'm not sure now but I'm pretty sure it does open on the corresponding source
<aquarius> ok, so I'll just add rb-u1-m-s and that should work. nice.
<seb128> right, try to do
<seb128> report.add_package_info("rb-u1-music-store")
<seb128> return
<seb128> in the hook
<aquarius> exactly what I'm doing
<seb128> it's easy to test, see where ubuntu-bug is sending you when you open a bug
<seb128> pitti, bug #546785
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 546785 in gnome-control-center "keyboard layouts don't remain" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/546785
<seb128> :-(
<pitti> seb128: please assign to me (will look later on)
<seb128> pitti, ok
<pitti> I did some 3 hours of bug triage now, and piled up some 5 new assigned bugs; one more won't make a lot of difference :)
 * aquarius grumbles. stacktraces for webkit crashes don't mention the music store at all. Should I assume that all webkit crashes in Rhythmbox are music store crashes?
<seb128> yes
<seb128> since rhythmbox doesn't use webkit
<seb128> oh, the context sidepane does but it's not on by default
<seb128> I think most of the crashes we will get are store ones
<seb128> no offense to you
<seb128> but the store will get lot of users ;-)
 * aquarius laughs
<aquarius> yeah, you're right :)
<pitti> seb128: btw, the retracers keep crashing on the same bug; it doesn't help to just restart them, we have to figure out what's wrong with that particular bug (or unmark it for retracing for now)
<seb128> pitti, right-o, I was just thinking the same when I saw they crashed again
<pitti> seb128: bug 546785 doesn't look like a regression at least, just that gconf and gdm have a different idea of what the default layout is
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 546785 in gnome-control-center "keyboard layouts don't remain" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/546785
<seb128> pitti, oh, good, I didn't try to understand it to be honest
<pitti> seb128: I have a suspicion, but I'll ask for data to confirm
<chrisccoulson> pitti - did you figure out where the low disk space warning comes from?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I didn't look at it yet, no
<chrisccoulson> pitti - ok, no worries
<chrisccoulson> i will recognise where it comes from if i see a screenshot
<chrisccoulson> tjaalton, would you mind attaching one to your bug report?
<pitti> I'd be really surprised if it wasn't the gdu one
<tjaalton> it's the one with the checkbox
<tjaalton> are there others?
<chrisccoulson> tjaalton, that's what we're trying to make sure of
<tjaalton> chrisccoulson: I don't have the popup open anymore
<nigelb> pitti: sorry, totally forgot about changing from changelog.  will watchout in future :)
<chrisccoulson> tjaalton, no worries, i will get one to open now and show you a screenshot, and you can say if the one that you see looks similar
<aquarius> seb128, https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~sil/ubuntu/lucid/rhythmbox/add-music-store-apport-hook/+merge/22117 (is a merge request the right way to submit this?)
<tjaalton> chrisccoulson: ok
<chrisccoulson> tjaalton, does it look a bit like this: http://people.canonical.com/~chrisccoulson/Screenshot-Low%20Disk%20Space.png
<chrisccoulson> (you might not have the empty wastebasket button)
<tjaalton> chrisccoulson: yep that's the one
<chrisccoulson> tjaalton, cool, thanks
<chrisccoulson> i'll reassign to g-s-d then
<chrisccoulson> i'm surprised you see it for nfs though, g-s-d has an exclude list and i thought that nfs was on that
<chrisccoulson> i've just noticed that my laptop only has 50.3GB of space left
<tjaalton> /apps/gnome_settings_daemon/plugins/housekeeping/ignore_paths?
<chrisccoulson> tjaalton, that list is populated when you click the checkbox in the warning
<chrisccoulson> but there is an external exclude list to ensure that you never see warnings for certain types of filesystems
<chrisccoulson> s/external/internal
<tjaalton> chrisccoulson: alright
<chrisccoulson> i'll have a look at that at some point if pitti doesn't get round to it first though
<tjaalton> not urgent, since now I can add some paths to the default settings
<tjaalton> knowing where to put them
<pitti> chrisccoulson: http://people.canonical.com/~chrisccoulson/Screenshot-Low%20Disk%20Space.png -> I hope you triggerred that synthetically somehow? :-)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i did ;)
<pitti> *phew*
<chrisccoulson> the thresholds are configurable for debugging purposes
<chrisccoulson> the default threshold is < 5% AND < 2GB
<kenvandine> good morning everyone
<pitti> hey kenvandine, how are you?
<chrisccoulson> hey kenvandine
<kenvandine> pitti, good, need more coffee :)
<seb128> aquarius, sorry I was having lunch, we usually prefer bug reports associated with those but I will review that one now so need to bother
<seb128> aquarius, looks good, thank you
<pitti> chrisccoulson: oh, it's gsd? I thought these dialogs came from the gdu-notification-daemon
<chrisccoulson> pitti - these dialogs come from the housekeeping plugin in g-s-d
<pitti> ok, good to know
 * kenvandine has to run out for a appointment... be back in about an hour
<Ng> pitti: you have a Sony e-reader, right? Can we blacklist the LAUNCHER partition? :)
<kenvandine> quiet morning
<davmor2> Guys has the policy changed on notifications being clickable through?  ie if there is an action below a notification you can't click on it which I thought you could in karmic.
<didrocks> davmor2: there is bug opened on that
<davmor2> didrocks: thanks I just spotted it for the first time so thought I'd double check :)
<kenvandine> hey  didrocks
<didrocks> hey kenvandine
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - the nm-applet changes are merged now btw
<chrisccoulson> (sorry, i forgot to mention yesterday)
<pitti> Ng: I do, yes; what is a LAUNCHER partition?
<pitti> Ng: my PRS-505 doesn't have any "weird" ones, just the two card readers and the internal memory
<pitti> Ng: if your's has an useless one, please feel free to report an udisks bug
<Ng> pitti: oh. I have a PRS-300 (internal storage only) but it has a second partition which has Windows/MacOS software installers
<Ng> k
<Ng> pitti: will ubuntu-bug udisks pull in sufficient information for your needs, or is there something else I should attach?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, oh good thanks
<pitti> Ng: as long as the device is connected while you report it, it should suffice
<Ng> pitti: excellent thanks, filing now
<seb128> brb
 * Ng also idly wonders if there's any way of getting the device to appear with a cute icon instead of a Mass Storage thing ;)
<Ng> (do any eReaders get nice icons?)
<pitti> Ng: mine doesn't; we don't currently have udev rules/gvfs probers for those
<pitti> Ng: do we even have icons?
<Ng> I have no idea, I was just OCDing out loud ;)
<asac> didrocks: what was the game you mentioned  a while back?
 * kenvandine has become addicted to frozen bubble on the G1 :)
<kenvandine> for some reason i have a terrible time putting that down :)
<didrocks> asac: it was yo frankie!
<didrocks> asac: http://www.yofrankie.org/
<seb128> hum
<seb128> pitti, is there a way to tell the retracers to skip a bug?
<pitti> seb128: remove the needs-$arch-retrace tag
<seb128> pitti, right, the issue there is that lp oops when trying to access the webpage
<seb128> pitti, which I think makes the retracer crash too
<seb128> pitti, I will try to ask #launchpad
<seb128> same on edge and non-edge
<pitti> seb128: what's the bug#? I'll try as apport user
<pitti> seb128: or you add a quick hack to crash-digger to ignore that particular number :)
<seb128> pitti, ok, got it
<seb128> pitti, +edit works
<pitti> sweet
<seb128> untagged
<seb128> amd64 retracer restarting at next cron job
<seb128> let's see how it goes
<seb128> pitti, retracers restarted let's see how it goes
<pitti> seb128: merci!
<seb128> you're welcome ;-)
<dobey> what's the preferred way of asking for a package to be installed, programmatically, these days?
<dobey> rickspencer3, pitti: ^^
<rickspencer3> uh
<rickspencer3> with a depends in the deb file
<pitti> dobey: you mean from an application?
 * pitti defers to mvo
<pitti> in the past it was calling synaptics with some magic options, but that might be out of date
<dobey> pitti: yeah
<dobey> mvo: ping :)
<mvo> dobey: hey, how much control do you want ? you can just run "software-center pkgname" and it will show a screen with information, screenshot (if available) and install button
<mvo> dobey: if you want to install it from your own app, aptdaemon is a good way, it has a dbus API similar to PK
<dobey> mvo: well it's a package in universe
 * chrisccoulson wishes there was a C library for aptdaemon
<pitti> mvo: sweet!
<dobey> chrisccoulson: dbus-glib :)
<pitti> dbus-send?
<chrisccoulson> dobey - yeah, but i'd have to implement my own progressbar widget and stuff
<seb128> chrisccoulson, you want yet another api just to wrap dbus calls there?
<dobey> mvo: so i don't know how much control i 'want' (need). i just want to say "install this thing and do everything necessary to make it happen."
<seb128> chrisccoulson, oh right then
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, python-aptdaemon does a bit more than just wrapping the dbus calls
<dobey> mvo: software-center apparently just does FAIL if you ask for a package in a repo that's not enabled yet
<seb128> I though the daemon would show the progress bar etc
<mvo> dobey: sort of, if it has information about the package via app-install-data it should be able to do more
<dobey> mvo: apparently viewing a package in universe with universe disabled presents a screen showing a button to "Refresn to get the package info" which doesn't.
<mvo> *ick*
<mvo> dobey: so, what package, what use case? I can mail/paste you a example for aptdaemon, give me a minute
<dobey> at least, i presume it does something, but of course fails to get the package data
<dobey> mvo: basically, i want the minimal amount of code i can have, in my code :)
<mvo> it has code to enable universe if its not there, but only if the package in question is available in app-install-data, we could add the package in question there just for that
<dobey> mvo: i'm told to use the "standard package install process"
<dobey> mvo: so optimally if i can just subprocess.call(["something", "--enable-archive=universe", "package"]), that would be optimal i think
<mvo> dobey: aha, now I get it. sorry, I'm a bit slow today. "apturl apt:2vcard?section=universe" is what you want then
<dobey> mvo: and also a way to check that the package is installed or not, but i suppose i can do that easily enough already
<mvo> dobey: that will auto-enable universe and show some basic data, its not as nice as software-center though
<dobey> hrmm
<mvo> dobey: the goal was to make it part of s-c for lucid, but we did not quite make it in time
<mvo> dobey: check: "apt.Cache()[pkgname].isInstalled"
<mvo> dobey: but please, what package, what use-case :) ?
<dobey> bindwood
<dobey> i guess xul-extension-bindwood or something is the name now though
<mvo> aha, thanks!
<dobey> i can just run dpkg -l to check if it's installed :)
<rickspencer3> pitti, seb128, chrisccoulson:
<rickspencer3> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Scratch/ReleaseBugs20100325
<rickspencer3> Looks like our release blocker bug count has stayed about the same, but there's a different set of bugs
<rickspencer3> pitti, seb128, just pasted this for your fyi
<dobey> mvo: so apturl + dpkg, great!
<pitti> rickspencer3: ah, thanks
<dobey> mvo: i'll use those. the code's already in my head :)
<chrisccoulson> rickspencer3, thanks
<mvo> dobey: cool, let me know if there is anything more I can do/help
<pitti> rickspencer3: yes, we fixed quite a number of them, but added new ones
<rickspencer3> chrisccoulson, a gentle reminder that you seem to be the long pole in our bug burn down now
<mvo> dobey: :)
 * pitti uploading two new packages to fix 5 bugs now
<dobey> mvo: thanks, will do
<rickspencer3> pitti, sweet
<rickspencer3> !
<pitti> rickspencer3: well, not 5 _of that list_, though :)
<rickspencer3> chrisccoulson, if you did the same, you'd have no more release blockers!
<rickspencer3> pitti, ack, still 5 bugs in a day, this make me happy
<chrisccoulson> rickspencer3, i'm working on one of them at the moment ;)
<pitti> and chrisccoulson's bugs are quite a bit more complicated :)
<chrisccoulson> and one on that list has a patch
<rickspencer3> chrisccoulson:
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i seem to have drawn the short straw with some of those ;)
 * rickspencer3 whip cracking noises
<chrisccoulson> in fact, 2 on my list have a patch :-)
<seb128> rickspencer3, hey, thank you
<pitti> rickspencer3: I took bug 546446, I think I'll get to it today, too
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 546446 in gnome-keyring "old session keyring still on disk" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/546446
<rickspencer3> this is the time in cycle where you can't focus on fixing bugs because I am pestering for bug fixing status all the time
<pitti> chrisccoulson: oh, the "bad fonts in ff" isn't even on that list
<rickspencer3> pitti, cool
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i'm not sure that ones assigned to me is it?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: which should have "a patch" as well (taking from the system cairo)
<chrisccoulson> the "FF not starting" issue has a patch upstream now
<chrisccoulson> and i have a patch for the search order issue too
<pitti> chrisccoulson: right, it's asac's right now (bug 512615), but I guess he wouldn't kill us if we reassign it
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 512615 in firefox "fonts are incorrectly rendered due to not using system cairo" [Unknown,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/512615
<pitti> chrisccoulson: sweet!
<kenvandine> seb128, so what is the process you are following converting namespaces for the dx source branches?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: starting to like or loathe the ff package by now? or both? :-)
 * pitti hugs chrisccoulson
 * chrisccoulson hugs pitti
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, is bug 535263 truly a release blocker?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 535263 in gwibber "Gwibber can show duplicate accounts" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/535263
 * rickspencer3 forgot to implement pittis "Bug:" feature
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, yes... and it is done :)
<rickspencer3> kewl
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, it was a problem if you synced accounts
<seb128> kenvandine, get lp:ubuntu/<souce> and use bzr merge-upstream there
<kenvandine> if you created accounts on two boxes before they synced, you would get dupes
<chrisccoulson> kwwii - there?
<kenvandine> seb128, ah, ok... good
<seb128> kenvandine, dropping the vcs in the control too
<seb128> kenvandine, + we could add a warning to the changelog in ubuntu-desktop vcs too
<kenvandine> seb128, yeah, i was wondering if you were starting with the existing package branch
<seb128> kenvandine, no, but I'm not closed to discuss it if you think we should
<kenvandine> seb128, only downside i see to that is branches that ted uses
<kenvandine> are related to our packaging branches
<kenvandine> so he would need to rebase on the lp:ubuntu branch
<kenvandine> which is fine i think
<seb128> right, maybe check with him about this
<kenvandine> seb128, but aren't the lp:ubuntu branch getting aliased to ~ubuntu-desktop?
<kenvandine> are you just asking james_w to do that as you do it?
<seb128> should they? why?
<seb128> I don't think james_w is around recently, I've pinged him several times for a week without luck
<kenvandine> seb128, well libu1 and the rb plugin are
<kenvandine> ido too
<kenvandine> seb128, i thought you had done that :)
<seb128> I've no real clue what I'm doing there
<kenvandine> hehe :)
<seb128> I just did what seemed easier
<kenvandine> seb128, it is nice that they are getting aliased, however that is happening
<seb128> i.e getting ubuntu/<source<
<seb128> and working there
<kenvandine> so if you try to check it out from ~ubuntu-desktop you get the right branch
<seb128> you should perhaps check with didrocks or pitti they know bzr better
<kenvandine> maybe james_w is just going behind us and pointing the spb to the old Vcs branch
<kenvandine> or the other way
<didrocks> kenvandine: backlogging, one sec
<pitti> kenvandine: so, lp:ubuntu/pkg is owned by ~ubuntu-branches
<pitti> kenvandine: which will allow anyone to commit who can also upload the package
<seb128> urg
<seb128> that will cut kenvandine out
<pitti> kenvandine: btw, I moved the gvfs branch yesterday, and that's what I did with the old ~ubuntu-desktop debian/ only branch: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/%7Eubuntu-desktop/gvfs/ubuntu/revision/72
<kenvandine> we need to get those perms fixed
<pitti> as long as you can't upload a package yet, don't switch one
<pitti> but the perms need sorting out either way
<seb128> urg
<pitti> so perhaps be cautious with the migration for now
<kenvandine> half the packages i deal with i can't :/
 * kenvandine checks them as i go
<kenvandine> s/checks/will check/
<seb128> I converted indicator-me yesterday sorry kenvandine
<kenvandine> seb128, no worries
<kenvandine> i think i can commit that one :)
<seb128> cool
<kenvandine> or i could last week
<seb128> so maybe let's really delay those changes to next cycle
<kenvandine> i seem to lose more packages each week
<pitti> if not, you can always do an lp:~kenvandine/ubuntu/lucid/package/ubuntu :)
<kenvandine> pitti, true
<james_w> why do you want ken to be able to commit to the ubuntu/* branches directly if he can't upload?
<kenvandine> james_w, i should be able to upload
<pitti> james_w: the "can't upload" is a bug
<kenvandine> the perms are getting messed up
<james_w> ok
 * kenvandine hopes cjwatson can fix that soon
<james_w> well fix that then :-)
<seb128> oh james_w is there
<mvo> seb128: do you know about a auto-login problem in gdm after hardy->lucid? I heard rumors that it sometimes works, sometimes dosn't
<nigelb> anyone has thoughts on bug 484317? (if its a bug, the attached patch might fix)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 484317 in gdm "GDM allows root logins" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/484317
<seb128> he just ignores my pings I guess ;-)
<mvo> seb128: I'm not at the machine, but I an debug at the weekend
<seb128> mvo, no
<seb128> mvo, I don't see a reason why it should not work
<ronoc> pitti: hello there, I will work on that bug you submitted tmrw, will try to reproduce. sounds difficult to reproduce ?
<mvo> seb128: ok
<pitti> ronoc: well, it "just happens" here in 2/3 logins (it's again shown as muted right now)
<seb128> mvo, is the "sometimes" on the same install or it works on some boxes and not on others?
<pitti> ronoc: you can have ssh to my box if it helps (admin included if need be, or I install the packages that you need)
<pitti> ronoc: it works for you?
<mvo> seb128: on the same box, its my parents machine, there debugging skillz are not that great ;)
<ronoc> pitti - ssh might be a good thing
<pitti> ronoc: oh, and "hello"!
<seb128> mvo, what does it do when it doesn't autolog in?
<seb128> mvo, did that start recently?
<ronoc> pitti: will be in touch in the morning - in a meeting right now
<mvo> seb128: I upgraded them last weekend and they haven't got anything new since
<pitti> ronoc: https://edge.launchpad.net/%7Ecjcurran/+sshkeys -> is that ok?
<seb128> ok
<mvo> seb128: when not auto-login it just shows the normal gdm screen apparently
<seb128> weird
<mvo> seb128: but I have no clue how often that happens
<mvo> yeah
 * ccheney bbl, dropping wife at airport
<rickspencer3> bye ccheney
<seb128> mvo, could you check if there is an autologin line on the dialog in those cases?
<seb128> ie one you can click which will log you in with autologin written
<seb128> I've that once on the mini I think
<mvo> seb128: oh, interessting. I will watch out for this
<kwwii> chrisccoulson: hey
<seb128> asac, asac__: still hiding?
<pitti> ronoc: when you get a chance, try ssh ronoc@pitti.homelinux.org ; look at ~/password if you need sudo (you are in admin)
<ronoc> pitti, thx I'm in !
<pitti> ronoc: (but, note that this is my main and only workstation, so if you need to rm -rf /, please do coordinate with me before :) )
<kenvandine> hehe
<ronoc> pitti, understood
<ronoc> :)
<ronoc> better pay more attention at this meeting
<mvo> chrisccoulson: re bug #456468 -- I remember you had the .xsession-errors with the real error message (symbol clash). do you still have this and can attach it to the bugreportÃ
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 456468 in network-manager-applet "upgrade triggers nm-applet "resource not found" ... missing icon "nm-applet-device"" [Undecided,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/456468
<mvo> ?
<chrisccoulson> mvo - i'll try and find that in a bit
<chrisccoulson> kwwii - hi, i'm currently looking at bug 532511
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 532511 in gnome-terminal "terminal settings messed up after upgrade due to forced profile change" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/532511
<chrisccoulson> the addition of the extra profile to add the new theme colours is quite problematic
<kwwii> chrisccoulson: hrm, let me read the comments
<chrisccoulson> so, i'm currently working on some changes which will make it possible to control all of this from the GTK theme
<chrisccoulson> which will avoid the need for adding an extra profile
<seb128> chrisccoulson, mvo: http://paste.ubuntu.com/397262/
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - thanks
<kwwii> chrisccoulson: hrm, it seems to me that we don't want to force this change on anyone updating, only on a fresh install
<seb128> chrisccoulson, you're welcome
<didrocks> kwwii: oh aubergine "show desktop" icon, that's sweet :)
<kwwii> didrocks: hehe, you just saw it now?
<chrisccoulson> kwwii - that's the difficult bit really, which is why i'm proposing that we control it all from the GTK theme
<ronoc> seb128: what did you think of the gnome media merge :)?
<didrocks> kwwii: right ;)
<kenvandine> pitti, is there actually a bug report for the permissions bug?
<kwwii> chrisccoulson: ok, if you have something for me to add to the theme I'll happily include it
<pitti> kenvandine: I don't know
<kenvandine> pitti, it would be nice to have something to follow so i know when there is prgress :)
<kenvandine> ok
<chrisccoulson> kwwii - thanks, thats good then. i'll sort that all out in a bit
<kenvandine> i know i email cjwatson as i hit new ones
<kwwii> chrisccoulson: as long as people can still change it to the profile of their choice I am fine with putting it in the gtk theme
<seb128> ronoc, sorry I didn't get time for that yet
<chrisccoulson> yeah, users will still be able to set the colors they like
<seb128> ronoc, I will let you know when I do though
<kwwii> chrisccoulson: ok, sounds good...let me know when you are ready for it to go into the theme
<seb128> ronoc, likely next week now though
<kwwii> ronoc: does the sound menu use *-panel icons in the panel?
<ronoc> seb128: no worries - its just an one character change
<ronoc> kwwii: yep
<kwwii> ronoc: cool, I am going to remove the non -panel names from the theme then, so they don't show up in other places
<ronoc> kwwii: Okay i thought though the non panel icons were used for fall back ?
<kwwii> ronoc: right, but they are included in one of the fallbacks anyway. We only want monochrome icons to show up in the panel, nowhere else
<kwwii> ronoc: currently, if you open the sound preferences you see dark panel icons on a light bg color
<ronoc> kwwii: cool i get it
<ronoc> kwwii: sounds good.
<kwwii> ronoc: asking you was my way of saving myself time and effort testing :-)
<ronoc> kwwii: always a good thing :)
<vish> mvo: hi.. the SC sub-categories icons are scaling the icons upwards to 64px :( , werent the main categories alone supposed to use 64px?
<tgpraveen12> vish: remember that bug where totem shows very small icon for volume control in fullscreen, its back with the new mono icons.
<vish> mvo: the subcategories use too much space and they end-up requiring scrolling
<mvo> vish: mpt will know, and possible michaelforester
<vish> mvo: thanks
<vish> tgpraveen12: that will be solved soon , those icons will be removed read the scrollback above^
<dholbach> hola
<tgpraveen12> tgpraveen12: joined just now. anyways.good to know
<dholbach> does anybody else have a problem with using alt-1 in gnome-terminal, chromium and other apps?
<dholbach> it doesn't work for me, it just draws a border around the application that has the focus
<seb128> dholbach, hey, what is is supposed to do?
<dholbach> jump to the first tab
<seb128> did it start doing that recently?
<dholbach> yes
<dholbach> since today
<seb128> dholbach, did you change your config somehow?
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, I see "Move Password Storage to the Keyring" is Marked "Done"
<rickspencer3> nice!!
<dholbach> seb128: not that I know
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, :)
<dholbach> seb128: no entry to .xsession-errors either
<seb128> dholbach, using the same wm, same keyboard layout?
<dholbach> yes
<seb128> dholbach, you are sure the keyboard layout is the same?
<mpt> vish, as far as I know the icon view should use the same size icons everywhere. In v3 we'll have a single-pane department screen so the subsections won't scroll.
<seb128> can you check in the keyboard config dialog?
<seb128> dholbach, could you try with an english keyboard layout?
<dholbach> seb128: same
<dholbach> I just picked uk layout
<vish> mpt: v3 plan sounds good , but the icons at 64 px are really being a bit too much , if all are to be the same size, we can use 48px everywhere :)
<seb128> dholbach, dunno then, I know pitti did work on keyboard layout setting so that could have changed
<dholbach> ah pitti!
<seb128> but if the layout and wm didn't change I don't know
<pitti> ?
<seb128> dholbach, no, could have been a keyboard layout issue but that's not one if you still have the same layout in GNOME
<seb128> pitti, unping, I was reviewing what changed which could explain dholbach's bug
<dholbach> ah ok
<seb128> dholbach, it's happening is several softwares too?
<didrocks> dholbach: is it the ` key?
<dholbach> seb128: at least in chromium and gnome-terminal
<dholbach> let me try firefox
<dholbach> didrocks: alt-1
<dholbach> same for firefox
<didrocks> dholbach: right, but do you have ` printed on it? (and are you using metacity, not compiz?)
<dholbach> didrocks: metacity
<dholbach> didrocks: ` printed where?
<seb128> dholbach, what is on "1" on a german keyboard?
<dholbach> 1
<seb128> ie the second char
<dholbach> !
<seb128> 1!?
<seb128> "1!" I mean
<dholbach> shift+1 = !
<dholbach> on a german keyboard
<seb128> ok
<dholbach> is that what you were after? :)
<seb128> yes
<dholbach> alt gr + 1 = Â¹
<dholbach> if that's of any interest
<seb128> there is a known bug with "`"
<dholbach> ah
<didrocks> dholbach: I guess this should be related to http://git.gnome.org/browse/metacity/commit/?id=0f805bfdfb46e6739912df042f628ca9913b433c
<seb128> which does what you get
<seb128> but that's nothing new
<seb128> so it's weird it would happen out of the blue today
<seb128> if your layout or wm didn't change
<pitti> guys, what's the problem?
<didrocks> seb128: I only noticed when switching from compiz to metacity
<pitti> German layout and ` immediately makes me think of "nodeadkeys"
<dholbach> pitti: I type "alt + 1" and would expect to go to the first tab
<pitti> right
<dholbach> pitti: instead there's just a border drawn around the focused app
<seb128> didrocks, right, which is why I started by asking if his wm changed
<pitti> WFM in both US and de-nodeadkeys layouts
<didrocks> pitti: if it's related to this commit, this is the grouping windows function
<dholbach> like I'd used alt-tab
<pitti> didrocks: but 1 != `
<didrocks> that's strange, exactly the same symptom
<pitti> check with xev?
<seb128> dholbach, you are sure you were not using compiz before?
<pitti>     state 0x8, keycode 10 (keysym 0x31, 1), same_screen YES,
<pitti>     XLookupString gives 1 bytes: (31) "1"
<pitti> shoudl be that one
<dholbach> seb128: I used it AGES ago
<dholbach> seb128: and just for a few minutes :)
<seb128> ok
<seb128> try xev
<seb128> what alt-1 gives you now?
<dholbach> http://paste.ubuntu.com/401235
<pitti> WTH
<pitti> dholbach: does alt+2 work? what does that give you in xev?
<dholbach> alt-2 works
<pitti>     state 0x8, keycode 11 (keysym 0x32, 2), same_screen YES,
<pitti>     XLookupString gives 1 bytes: (32) "2"
<pitti> should be that one
<seb128> dholbach, did you assign some GNOME shortcuts recently?
<dholbach> seb128: not that I'd know
<seb128> k
<seb128> so I blame lower stack
<seb128> xorg, bios, linux
<dholbach> pitti: http://paste.ubnutu.com/401236
<dholbach> pitti: http://paste.ubuntu.com/401236
<seb128> try in a guest session maybe to see
<pitti> still fairly broken
<dholbach> seb128: works in a guest session :-(
<pitti> you don't have num lock/caps lock/scroll lock on or something?
<dholbach> no nothing
<seb128> dholbach, do you use compiz in the guest session or did you change that there?
<dholbach> hang on :)
 * dholbach goes back
<dholbach> no, no compiz
<dholbach> I use nouveau
<dholbach> not sure it works there
<vish> cassidy: re: humanity empathy icons blog .. the icons for emapathy are symlinks from user-*  :)
<rickspencer3> pitti, seb128: tseliot thinks bug #545992 should be a release blocker, but I'm not too sure, please advise
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 545992 in fglrx-installer "Can't install fglrx-kernel-source, conflict with fglrx" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/545992
<vish> cassidy: so it shouldnt break when empathy is updated.. but will keep track , thanks :)
<pitti> rickspencer3: yes, absolutely
<pitti> it also is quite obvious
<pitti> Package: fglrx
<pitti> Conflicts: fglrx-kernel-source
<seb128> dholbach, ok, so it's an user config thing
<seb128> dholbach, check you keybindings
<dholbach> seb128: I just re-set a lot of gconf keys
<seb128> +r
<pitti> rickspencer3, tseliot: that conflicts needs to be versioned
<didrocks> dholbach: just to ensure it's not the cycle group function, what do you have in gconf at /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/cycle_group ?
<dholbach> seb128: now it works again - unfortunately I don't know which of the changes fixed it :-(
<dholbach> as I had to restart the terminal to make it work
<pitti> rickspencer3: it's a 5-second fix, and causing problems on upgrades
<dholbach> either something in /apps/panel/global or /apps/metacity involving the alt key
<pitti> rickspencer3: (I followed up to the bug)
<dholbach> seb128, didrocks: thanks again
<dholbach> thanks pitti too
 * pitti hugs dholbach, I'm glad it's sane again
 * dholbach hugs  gconftool-2 --recursive-unset  :-)
 * dholbach hugs pitti too
 * didrocks has the same issue with Alt + 7 on the azerty keyboard for more than one month now, but I want to keep the default until it's fixed :/
<dobey> dpm: ping
<dpm> hey dobey
<dobey> dpm: hey. i have a question regarding the interpretation issue with _('') vs. _("") in python scripts (thigns not ending in .py)
<dobey> dpm: do you know how intltool deals with _(u"Foo") or _(unicode("Foo"))?
 * ccheney back from airport
<dpm> dobey, I think I might not know, but what do you mean by "how intltool deals"? Whether such strings would be extracted and put into the template?
<dpm> I can test that
<dobey> dpm: i mean, since we have to use "" because scripts that don't end in .py are treated as C, if doing something like u"Foo" or unicode("Foo") would break because of being treated like normal C strings
<seb128> didrocks, how busy are you now?
<LaserJock> dholbach: there should be some documentation on gconftool -R and --recursive-unset for testers/debuggers
<seb128> didrocks, now = end of week and next week
<seb128> there should be no need to unset anything this way
<LaserJock> dholbach: I have been blowing away my ~/.gconf for years, that is waaay better :-)
<didrocks> seb128: should be ok, what do you need me to do?
<seb128> why?
<dholbach> LaserJock: I only blow it away in very isolated cases :-D
<LaserJock> I do it like once a month
<LaserJock> that's a big reason why I do fresh installs all the time :(
<LaserJock> stuff gets messed up and I can't find where the magic key is to fix it
<LaserJock> with --recursive-unset I can at least narrow it down to a single app or so
<dpm> dobey, I'd think they'd break, let me see if I can test it quickly
<LaserJock>  and -R lets me know what options I've set (which is a big problem to start with)
<dobey> dpm: i'll test it real quick...
<LaserJock> I really wish we had a GUI gconf diff tool, but this at least is something
<dpm> ok
<dobey> hrmm, it seems to still get extracted
<dobey> cool
<seb128> didrocks, sorry got sidetracked
<didrocks> seb128: no pb
<seb128> didrocks, it's not that I need you to do anything but rather than I would welcome you helping on something ;-)
<didrocks> it's just too late (j/k)
 * kenvandine -> lunch
<didrocks> seb128: sure, just tell me where I can help (not sure for tonight and tomorrow, but next week sounds good) ;)
<seb128> didrocks, so your mission would be theme related
<seb128> didrocks, i.e it would be to make gnome-appearance-properties set the wm order gconf key
<seb128> didrocks, it already set keys so it should be easy to add
<seb128> I see that as
<seb128> read a new property from the theme .index
<didrocks> seb128: the button, you mean?
<seb128> which has the key order
<seb128> didrocks, yes sorry
<seb128> so I see the index have an extra key for that, g-c-c reading it and setting the gconf key with the value if there is one
<seb128> or with the default value which is what we had before lucid in other cases
<seb128> not sure that's clear
<didrocks> seb128: schweet, I was eager to have a look at that in any case, just didn't have the time yet.
<didrocks> hum, let me think
<didrocks> so, the theme will have eventually the key in the index setting the order
<didrocks> when changing the theme, if we find one, we set the gconf key to it
<didrocks> if there is no, we assume as a default to set the gconf key back to what we had in karmic?
<didrocks> none*
<dpm> dobey, ok, cool.
<chrisccoulson> yay, the terminal is nearly fixed \o/
<chrisccoulson> then i can close one of my RC bugs :)
<seb128> didrocks, correct
<seb128> chrisccoulson, rockon
<seb128> rock-on
<seb128> rather ;-)
<chrisccoulson> lol
<vish> seb128: hi , could you do an update of humanity? it fixes atleast one SC icon breakage , [icon was misspelled] and a couple of other bug fixes
<dobey> dpm: would you mind filing a bug against intltool for the treating python scripts without .py extensions as C, please? :)
<didrocks> seb128: we change it on the user level? (in ~/.gconf)? I mean, for user who want to change it and not reset it each time they change their themeâ¦
<seb128> vish, where is it?
<vish> seb128: the packagers branch
<seb128> didrocks, I don't understand this question I think
<seb128> vish, can you give me the lp: url?
<dpm> dobey, sure, np, but you only get a beer at UDS if you fix it :P
<seb128> vish, I don't have all those noted
<vish> seb128: np.. >  https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-art-pkg/humanity/release
<vish> thanks ..
<seb128> didrocks, the idea is to have the capplet set the key by theme to avoid destroying the buttons order on the other themes
<didrocks> seb128: let's say someone change the order manually with gconf-editor. If they change the theme back and forth the theme, each time, the user key will be screwd
<dobey> dpm: heh. well danilo might fix it :)
<seb128> vish, thanks
<seb128> didrocks, yes, that's a corner case though, I guess people set one theme and lot of people complain about us breaking other themes
<dpm> dobey, he won't be at UDS this time, so he doesn't qualify for the prize :)
<didrocks> seb128: I agree, let's go that way so
<seb128> didrocks, + you can set an user mandatory key if you want that
<seb128> it will take over the capplet change
<didrocks> right, so there is a way for user to override that. Perfect, will do it
<dobey> dpm: as co-maintainer, i will gladly accept by proxy any prizes he may win for fixing bugs in intltool :)
<seb128> didrocks, so, some pointers for you
<dpm> hahaha
<seb128> didrocks, you can look to /usr/share/themes/<theme>/index.theme
<seb128> didrocks, it's a gkey file, ie key=value
<seb128> didrocks, so it's easy to add one key there
<didrocks> ok, using gkeyfile from glib
<seb128> didrocks, gnome-control-center does read and parse that already though so not a lot of extra work there
<seb128> didrocks, see capplets/common/gnome-theme-info.c
<seb128> didrocks, the defines and the code there
 * didrocks opens
<didrocks> oki
<seb128> didrocks, it's basically adding a key I think
<seb128> + the code to apply it to gconf
<didrocks> yeah, should be easy :)
<seb128> which probably is already done for some other keys
 * seb128 hugs didrocks
 * didrocks hugs seb128
<seb128> didrocks, lucid users will love you
<chrisccoulson> heh, i just looked at my assigned bugs on launchpad
<didrocks> seb128: I guess so. A lot of love for few work ;)
<seb128> the gdm mute change first
<seb128> + unbreaking themes now
<seb128> not forgetting une ;-)
<didrocks> heh, I hope people will love that :)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, it does timeout by trying to load the list or something? ;-)
<chrisccoulson> not quite just yet ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, do you need some help to bounce some to the team or other people or do you think you have those under control?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, we can probably drop the gnome-user-share nautilus .so btw
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i think it looks worse than it really is ;)
<seb128> I don't think the bar is important to have
<dpm> dobey, bug 547073, enjoy!
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 547073 in intltool "Python scripts without .py extensions are treated as C files" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/547073
<dobey> dpm: gracias!
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i don't mind doing that, but i can probably work on a patch at the weekend to hide it when there's no BT hardware
<dpm> :)
<chrisccoulson> kwwii, do you maintain light-themes in bzr?
<chrisccoulson> kwwii, these are the changes to the Ambiance gtkrc which will theme the terminal to the settings we have currently:
<chrisccoulson> http://paste.ubuntu.com/401265/
<rickspencer3> pitti, bugs that are targeted to the release but NOT milestoned will still show up on your list, right?
<pitti> rickspencer3: I occasionally look at the lucid list and pick out desktop things; it'd be helpful if those could be assigned to c-d-t
<rickspencer3> pitti, these are assigned to tselliot
<rickspencer3> so the assignment is good
<pitti> ah, fine
<rickspencer3> they are targetted ,but not milestoned
<rickspencer3> wnated to confirm that this is a usefule state for you
<pitti> yes, absolutely
<pitti> it's the best state :)
<pitti> (assigned to the right person, I mean)
<tgpraveen>  /join #poppler
<kwwii> chrisccoulson: cool, thanks for that, I will add it with the next update
<chrisccoulson> kwwii, thanks :)
<LaserJock> rickspencer3, pitti: if bugs are assigned to c-d-t, can a non-c-d-t person work on them? If so, should they assign themselves?
<rickspencer3> LaserJock, yes
<pitti> LaserJock: absolutely
<rickspencer3> yes, yes
<rickspencer3> :)
<pitti> LaserJock: we use this list for "bugs we should fix, but haven't found an assignee for yet"
<pitti> straw poll: do you guys use a graphical debugger or just plain gdb? if a GUI, which one sucks less?
<Nafai> pitti: I use gud in Emacs :)
<pitti> ages ago I used ddd, but I got used to gdb; but watching expressions etc. is still fairly clumsy
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i just use plain gdb, but i'd be interested in peoples responses ;)
 * hyperair uses gdb
<hyperair> gdb in screen, split either horizontally or vertically with an editor on the next pane
<seb128> pitti, gdb but same than chrisccoulson
<seb128> pitti, you could try nemiver
<seb128> not sure how good it is though
<pitti> I'll find out
<pitti> anjuta/emacs are a bit too heavy for my taste
 * pitti installs
<hyperair> i think there was a vimgdb plugin or something...
<hyperair> and i've got deep-seated hatred for anjuta
<hyperair> that stupid thing fights against me when i'm coding
<Nafai> for those that are interested, here is a screenshot of a debugging session with gud-mode in Emacs: http://www.travishartwell.net/gud.png
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - nemiver looks quite good actually
<chrisccoulson> i'd never seen that before
<seb128> yeah
<pitti> seb128: seems fairly nice indeed
<hyperair> Nafai: that looks quite cool. i'll look into it =p
<dpm> kenvandine, you asked me for pending i18n bugs in gwibber yesterday, and we've got an Ubuntu Translations Hug Day today, so here's this one for you if you've got some time :) -> bug 538987
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 538987 in ubuntu-translations "Strings in the *mako templates are not translatable" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/538987
<Nafai> cool, let me know if you have any questions on setting it, up, etc.
<Nafai> s/it, up/it up/
<pitti> http://people.canonical.com/~pitti/tmp/nemiver.png
<pitti> seb128: ^ FYI
<pitti> $ sudo nemiver ./skdump /dev/sda
<pitti> it DTRT with that, so it's equally comfortable to call as gdb
<rickspencer3> pitti:  	[ubuntu/karmic-proposed] devicekit-disks 007-2ubuntu6 (Accepted)
<rickspencer3> sounds like another release blocker died at the tip of your spear?
<pitti> rickspencer3: not quite unfortunately
<rickspencer3> :(
<pitti> this was just a quick workaround
<rickspencer3> oh well
<pitti> to stop breaking SSDs with karmic
<rickspencer3> sorry to bring it up
<pitti> rickspencer3: I'm looking into libatasmart now, and try to find out how to properly identify those affected SSDs
<pitti> so that's a bandaid for karmic until we find a proper fix
<seb128> pitti, nice! ;-)
<vish> seb128: hi.. could you ping me once the humanity update is done, i just need to submit a merge for SC..
<seb128> vish, you can update the bzr I've it built locally and uploading now
<vish> oh , ok, thanks
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i must remember not to accidentally attach nemiver to Xorg ;)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: heh, yes
<pitti> chrisccoulson: although that'd equally fail with gdb under gnome-terminal..
<chrisccoulson> it would
<chrisccoulson> oh, it's reasonably sensible. nemiver doesn't allow you to attach it to itself
<Nafai> I used to do game development and It was always fun to try to run the debugger in the same X session as the game, because it would take over input, etc
<Nafai> I had to ssh into that same box and run gdb that way
<mpt> vish, I'd be fine with 48, but it's probably too late for that kind of change
<mpt> (sorry, forgot I had a half-written response here)
<vish> mpt: the change was done in today's update to 64 , earlier was 48
<seb128> time for sport
<seb128> bbl
<Nafai> btw, does anyone (US-based) have a recommendation for good power adapters to get for international travel?  I want to order something soon so it gets here before UDS. :)
<bryceh> Nafai, I got mine at the local AAA
<bryceh> Nafai, there are a number of "all in one" adapters, although I tend to prefer ones that are specific to the country in question since they tend to be lighter weight
 * Nafai nods
<bryceh> also they tend to fit into power bars more easily
<LaserJock> heh, I bought a all-in-one from Walmart when I went to UDS-Paris
<Nafai> LaserJock: work well?
<LaserJock> turns out it was important because the Parisian plugs where a little different than many of the other European ones, so I had to share with a lot of people
<LaserJock> i.e. my plug worked while a number of people who had European-specific adapters didn't
<LaserJock> Nafai: it is a bit clunky when you're on a power strip
<LaserJock> but I use it at home for 3-prong -> 2 prong adapter, etc. so it was worth it for me
<Nafai> cool
<LaserJock> but for juat a few bucks at Walmart I was surprised how well it worked
<Nafai> good to know
<Nafai> this will be my first time traveling internationally, so I'm excited
<rickspencer3> Nafai, you could do a lot worse than Brussles for your first trip abroad
<LaserJock> Nafai: ah, good luck
<LaserJock> UDS-Paris was my first time
<LaserJock> got pickpocketed but otherwise it was fine :-)
<LaserJock> I strongly recommend UDSes for Americans that are going abroad for the first time
<chrisccoulson> right, time for me to bath baby
<chrisccoulson> bbiab
<LaserJock> the community makes it so much easier to navigate international travel
<Nafai> indeed
<LaserJock> when I got pickpocketed I had people lend me their phones and cash to get by
<LaserJock> I would have been screwed otherwise
<LaserJock> (not that I didn't want to kiss the tarmac when I finally landed back in the US) ;-)
<Nafai> that reminds me, I need to get my phone unlocked
<kenvandine> whew... got home from running an errand at lunch to find a small angry rattle snake in the yard
<bryceh> !!
<bryceh> kenvandine, angry about the button placement change?
<mpt> vish, oh, I didn't realize that. Maybe it's not too late to revert then.
<Nafai> hmm, nemiver is quite nice
<vish> mpt: please do, all the icons were done for 48px and they are now being used in 64px, and are a bit blurry , i'm not sure if i'll have the time to redo them again :
<mpt> vish, it's not up to me. I don't have the time to dive into that code myself
<kenvandine> hehe
<vish> mvo: well , the code is just one line ;p  , i was mentioning you blessing ;)
<vish> oops mpt^
<kenvandine> bryceh, right before i got home the woman across the street came over with a box and a broom and was trying to catch it to release somewhere in the woods
<kenvandine> but she made it very angry... it was striking at everything in sight when i pulled in
<kenvandine> she is nuts :)
<bryceh> kenvandine, sounds like it
<bryceh> kenvandine, maybe *she* was made about the icon changes?  ;-)
<kenvandine> hehe
<jcastro> kenvandine: popey is seeing a bunch of crashers in gwibber if you have some time to check it out
<kenvandine> got bugs?
 * kenvandine really needs to get a release out
<jcastro> a bunch he says
<jcastro> popey: line em up!
<popey> jcastro: i haven't filed bugs because every time it crashes I go to file one and it looks like there's 10 there already!
<popey> bug 539674
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 539674 in gwibber "gwibber crashed with error in connect()" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/539674
<popey> bug 539674
<popey> bug 532460
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 532460 in gwibber "gwibber crashed with error in connect()" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/532460
<popey> bug 546730
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 546730 in gwibber "gwibber-accounts crashed with error in connect()" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/546730
<popey> and so on
<kklimonda> popey: ach, my favourite bug
<popey> :)
<popey> sorry
<kklimonda> I think I'm getting it every time I resume laptop from sleep
<popey> today I was on a 3g connection when it happened, in case that adds any kind of useful info
<tal> guys, anyone knows how to contact gnome about jobs ?
<popey> tal: does the gnome foundation employ people?
<kklimonda> tal: gnome has only one job offer atm I think - for the system administrator
<tal> yeah, thats the one
<tal> how do you talk to them about that ?
<popey> http://webapps.ubuntu.com/employment/ :)
<jcastro> tal: http://live.gnome.org/Jobs
<mvo> vish: let me know, chaning it to 48px in subcategories is not a big deal
<vish> mvo:  pls do change the subcategories
<kenvandine> popey, i am looking
<popey> thanks
<mvo> vish: ok
<vish> mvo: thanks :)
<kenvandine> popey, are you getting it on resume as well?
<popey> i havent done any resuming
<kenvandine> ok... so just on startup?
<popey> after running for a while
<popey> I can test more and file new bugs and let you know the numbers as they come up if that helps?
<kenvandine> if the traceback is the same, don't bother
<kenvandine> it's actually a desktopcouch bug
<popey> i am not qualified to answer if the traceback is the same or not
 * kenvandine will find a way to handle that better in gwibber though
<mvo> vish: but the "fontpage" will still be 64px, right?
<vish> mvo: if you can keep the front page at 64 that would be neat.
<popey> \o/ haha I just had gwibber _and_ gwibber service fail kenvandine
<popey> boot a machine, logged in, did nothing but ALT+F2, gwibber, enter
<popey> crasheroony
<kenvandine> popey, traceback please
 * popey needs to read up how to do that
<popey> got a handy url>
<popey> ?
<davmor2> popey: just ubuntu-bug it and remover the trace?
<davmor2> maybe
<kenvandine> popey, ah you got the crash dialog?
<kenvandine> excellent
<kenvandine> you can just let it file and give me the bug number
<popey> yes
<kenvandine> i'll dupe it if necessary
<popey> ok
<kenvandine> thx
<popey> two in fact :)
<mvo> vish: your branch is merged and the size change too
<vish> mvo: neat , thanks.. :)
<mvo> no worries
<popey> bug 547202 kenvandine
<ubottu> Error: Could not parse data returned by Launchpad: list index out of range (https://launchpad.net/bugs/547202)
<kenvandine> popey, gotta make it public
<popey> kenvandine: done
<kenvandine> popey, thx
<kenvandine> popey, that is a different error, thx!
<popey> kenvandine: happy to help! :)
<pitti> popey: do you have some minutes for some questions about that libatasmart bug?
<popey> pitti: sure
<pitti> popey: did you ever try this with lucid?
<popey> try a clean install? on it, no, but i have a spare machine i can do that on
<pitti> popey: so apparently it happens with dk-disks-probe-ata-smart; did you try it with smartctl -a /dev/sda?
<pitti> popey: did you try it with skdump /dev/sda? (from libatasmart-bin)
<popey> no
<pitti> popey: and finally, do you have a test machine where this happens, where I could get ssh to?
<popey> i can set one up yes
<pitti> I'm currently comparing libatasmart and smartmontools, and the ioctls that they do
<pitti> obviously I have to trigger that bug a couple of more times
<popey> what version of ubuntu would you like on it?
<pitti> popey: did you find a way to rescue the disk?
<popey> yes, dd zeroes over it
<pitti> popey: karmic or lucid beta-1, whatever works better for you
<pitti> popey: ok, good to know that it wasn't permanent damage
<popey> no, but it sure looks like it is
<popey> will let you know when its setup
<pitti> popey: many thanks, I appreciate
<pitti> until then I'll do some more local research
<pitti> popey: https://launchpad.net/~pitti/+sshkeys BTW (the second one)
<popey> pitti: hmm, its now no longer booting, which looks like a hardware issue
<popey> i have two of these machines though, one is running lucid which was upgraded from karmic and has had lots of packages removed for space
<popey> i can wipe and reinstall on that one
<pitti> popey: I don't need a clean machine in any way, FTR
<pitti> libatasmart and smartmontools build-depends, vi, and strace
<popey> ok
<kklimonda> sabdfl: wrt bug 466541 and other bugs you comment on - I've wondering whether you actuall get responses as you don't seem to be subscribed :)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 466541 in transmission "Transmission should use XDG_DATA_HOME and XDG_CACHE_HOME for non-config user files" [Unknown,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/466541
<RAOF> Morning all.
<pitti> hey RAOF, good morning
<RAOF> Yay!  Looks like vga16fb madness is getting sorted out.
<TheMuso> Good morning.
<TheMuso> RAOF: You'll be pleased to know that after a fresh daily install a few days back, nouveau is rocking my desktop's NVIDIA card nicely. Don't care so much for power management on the desktop, if it means not dealing with the hassle of installing drivers.
<TheMuso> No compiz, but I can deal with that for now.
<RAOF> Yay!
<RAOF> The xorg-edgers PPA would probably give you compiz, at the cost of maybe making your GPU freeze every now and then :)
<pitti> good night everyone!
<RAOF> Night!
<desrt> pitti: ciao.
<TheMuso> RAOF: Right, I'd rather no freezing GPU.
<seb128> re
<desrt> seb128: hi hi
<seb128> so something triggers a keyring dialog on session start now
<RAOF> TheMuso: Yeah, I can see how you'd think that :)
<seb128> can't figure what though, but it has been something uploaded today
<seb128> desrt, hey
<seb128> desrt, how are you?
<desrt> ok.
<desrt> seb128: doesn't the dialog tell what app it is?
<seb128> no
<seb128> "The login keyring did not get unlocked when you logged into your computer."
<seb128> is the string
 * didrocks waves good night, enjoy your evening/day everyone!
<seb128> 'night didrocks
<didrocks> seb128: thanks, you too! don't go to bed too late ;)
<seb128> didrocks, heh, I will try ;-)
<didrocks> :-)
<desrt> seb128: if you do a 'netstat -anp | less' when the dialog is open
<desrt> and search keyring
<desrt> and find a line like
<desrt> unix  3      [ ]         STREAM     CONNECTED     4068705  2229/gnome-keyring- /tmp/keyring-FJ5rwi/socket
<desrt> then very close to it you'll find something like
<desrt> unix  3      [ ]         STREAM     CONNECTED     4068704  20943/nm-connection
<desrt> there will be a few of those
<desrt> but it will narrow your options down
<seb128> well
<desrt> (note: the socketpair having sequential serial numbers)
<seb128> I doubt it will work
<seb128> I think keyring 2.29 uses dbus to talk to the daemon
<seb128> there is no such socket now
<desrt> o
<desrt> well that's easy then
<desrt> strace dbus and kill the keyring
<desrt> and see who gets the message about it :p
<seb128> yeah
<seb128> brb, restarting to get the dialog again
<desrt> ta.
<seb128> re
<seb128> ok, not a change from today but a change of config there
<seb128> eds needs keyring access if you have a non-open calendar
<crimsun> rickspencer3: Is your comment, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pygame/+bug/295369/comments/21 , on current Lucid?
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 295369 in pygame "pygame sound is delayed a lot" [Medium,Confirmed]
<rickspencer3> crimsun, yes
<rickspencer3> it is now "delated slightly"
<rickspencer3> rather than "delayed a lot"
<crimsun> rickspencer3: which of libsdl1.2debian-pulseaudio and libsdl1.2debian-alsa is installed?
 * ccheney thinks he fixed the OOo theme bug, running a test build now :)
<rickspencer3> crimsun,  libsdl1.2debian-pulseaudio
<crimsun> rickspencer3: which buffer value are you using?
<rickspencer3> crimsun, none that I know of
<rickspencer3> I am not setting one in python code if that's what you mean
<crimsun> rickspencer3: right, so your workaround refers to what?
<crimsun> (note that I'm referring to pygame.mixer.pre_init())
<rickspencer3> crimsun, someone in the bug mentioned a work around
<rickspencer3> something about setting the buffer
<rickspencer3> I was referring to that
<rickspencer3> sorry
<crimsun> right, the buffer is the fourth parameter to pygame.mixer.pre_init()
<crimsun> buffer size *
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, can I get you to sponsor the upload in glade-3 bzr?
 * robert_ancell is going to finally get around to doing main upload application today...
<seb128> robert_ancell, hey
<robert_ancell> seb128, hey
<seb128> robert_ancell, thank you for doing updates ;-)
<robert_ancell> seb128, oh, libwnck is sitting in bzr if you want to upload that one :)
<seb128> I can
<robert_ancell> seb128, who normally deals with gnome-user-docs?  I notice it always seems to be behind
<seb128> nobody?
<seb128> or the documentation team
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: If nobody has grabbed glade3 by the time I get through some of this email here that I need to read, I can take care of it.
<seb128> not sure if that's the one which is patched to add ubuntu documentation or not
<robert_ancell> seb128, yeah, it looks patched so I don't touch it
<seb128> you can ask mdke about it on #ubuntu-devel
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: what is the bzr branch I need to use? Not sure what source package you are referring to.
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, debcheckout glade
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: ok thanks
<ccheney> cool the patch works properly and finally OOo falls back and only lists installed themes, whee! :)
<seb128> baptistemm, bug #547238 is not a bug and a duplicate
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 547238 in indicator-applet "Regression with Rhythmbox" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/547238
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: glade uploaded.
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, thanks!
<TheMuso> np
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-03-26
<rickspencer3> RAOF, are you going to pick off that mga thing today by any chance?
<RAOF> rickspencer3: If I get through gnome-keyring-sharp, yes.  Having seen it and read the patch I just wanted to make other people feel safer about picking it up.
<RAOF> I'll need bryce to upload for me anyway :)
<rickspencer3> RAOF, make sense
<rickspencer3> thanks man
<robert_ancell> chrisccoulson, do you know where the new system-tools-backends tarballs are coming from?
<chrisccoulson> robert_ancell, ftp://anonymous@ftp.gnome.org/pub/gnome/sources/system-tools-backends/2.9
<robert_ancell> chrisccoulson, so they're given up of fdo then :)
<RAOF> Hey!  When did notify-osd messages lose their click-through magic?
<chrisccoulson> robert_ancell, yeah, i think it's because it has a different maintainer now
<chrisccoulson> RAOF, have they?
<robert_ancell> chrisccoulson, well, makes my life easier.  Updated the versions script
<chrisccoulson> robert_ancell, cool!
<RAOF> chrisccoulson: Song change coming up... let me test again :)
<chrisccoulson> RAOF - you're right
<chrisccoulson> i can't click through them either
<chrisccoulson> that sucks
<RAOF> It does somewhat defeat the purpose, yes.
 * chrisccoulson checks lucid-changes for when it might have broken
 * RAOF fires up ubuntu-bug
<RAOF> I think bug #546659 is our winner.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 546659 in nautilus "FTP connection not available/doesn't work" [Low,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/546659
<RAOF> Ahem. bug #546650
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 546650 in notify-osd "Unable to click items below notifications" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/546650
<chrisccoulson> RAOF - thanks
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, notify-osd didn't change since 9th march
<RAOF> And none of the last couple of uploads seem to contain a âbreak click throughâ message, surprisingly enough :)
<chrisccoulson> heh
<chrisccoulson> and i can't get xtrace to work :-/
<rickspencer3> RAOF, I'm wondering bug #546650 should rather be assigned to Dx team
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 546650 in notify-osd "Unable to click items below notifications" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/546650
<rickspencer3> do you mind if I reassign, or were you planning to look at it
<rickspencer3> ?
<RAOF> rickspencer3: I'd be happy for you to reassign to Dx.
<rickspencer3> RAOF, ok, I accepted it for Lucid too
<rickspencer3> RAOF, robert_ancell quick question, either of you guys see anything strange in your messaging menu?
<chrisccoulson> rickspencer3, truncated icons?
<chrisccoulson> (as a guess)
<rickspencer3> chrisccoulson, hi
<RAOF> A radiobox control for statuses?
<RAOF> That looks pretty weird.
<rickspencer3> RAOF, that's your Me Menu, actually
<rickspencer3> :)
<chrisccoulson> the icons in the messaging menu get cut off now
<RAOF> Bah!  Terminology!
<rickspencer3> jono_,  is seeing Set up Mail ...
<rickspencer3> set up chat ...
<rickspencer3> but they are already configured
<RAOF> I don't think I've restarted since that change.
<chrisccoulson> oh, i'm not seeing that
<rickspencer3> did you guys dist-upgrade recently?
<chrisccoulson> but my menu looks weird
<rickspencer3> like since kenvandine did the Dx release
<chrisccoulson> ah, not just yet
<rickspencer3> ok
<rickspencer3> here's why I hate OOo
<rickspencer3> I hardly use it, but I have to wait for calc to update
<rickspencer3> ccheney, looks like I'm getting your theme fixes
<chrisccoulson> RAOF - the notify-osd bug is a gtk regression
<chrisccoulson> i just tried LD_PRELOADing the old version
<RAOF> Ah.
<chrisccoulson> and it works again
<chrisccoulson> i will reassign
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, the babel fish?
<rickspencer3> babel fish?
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, Thats what the broadcast icon looks like to me :)
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, is that what the icon for broadcast accounts is
<rickspencer3> I thought it was a opium poppy
<robert_ancell> lol
<RAOF> Man, I love it when unexpected test successes teach you something.
<chrisccoulson> so, i wonder what changed in gtk
<RAOF> I thought that was a little bird - you know, like the twitter iconography.
<chrisccoulson> i might bisect that in the morning
<rickspencer3> chrisccoulson, you say it's been fixed?
<rickspencer3> in gtk?
<chrisccoulson> rickspencer3, it seems to be gtk which has broken it
<rickspencer3> when you say "was"
<rickspencer3> you mean ... ?
<chrisccoulson> if i run notify-osd with the previous version of gtk, then it works again
<chrisccoulson> with the current version in the archive, it doesn't work anymore
<rickspencer3> so by "was" you mean "is"?
<rickspencer3> :)
<chrisccoulson> oh, did i say "was"?
<chrisccoulson> heh
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, hey, did anyone suggest to mvo to remove eclipse from the featured apps?
<rickspencer3> I thought I did, yes
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, does our version of it still suck?
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, I think so
<rickspencer3> hmmm, maybe I never did
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, it was when I last tried it
<rickspencer3> let me log a bug
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, we should add tuxpaint too as that's a good app for kids
<rickspencer3> hmm
<rickspencer3> better not log a bug until anyone tries it
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, could you pleaseL
<rickspencer3> 1. confirm the suckiness of eclipse
<rickspencer3> 2. confirm the awesomeness of tuxpain
<rickspencer3> tuxpaint, even
<rickspencer3> and ask mvo to do the change?
<rickspencer3> a bug report maybe be appropriate, but maybe just ask him tonight
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, i'm not sure how to run xprop on a click-through notification bubble
<chrisccoulson> RAOF, any ideas? ;)
<chrisccoulson> i just get the properties of the window below...
<RAOF> There's got to be some way to pass in a pid, right?
<chrisccoulson> RAOF - you can pass the window ID, but i don't know what that is
<chrisccoulson> i'm not sure how to get it
<chrisccoulson> and it's not around for very long either
<RAOF> xwininfo -name might be what you're after.
<RAOF> I'm not sure what the name of the notify-osd windows is without source digging, but ânotify-osdâ should be a reasonable guess.
<RAOF> xwininfo will give you the ID, then you can xprop
<chrisccoulson> it seems there is a permanent offscreen window with the name "notify-osd"
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, hmm, can't even install eclipse at the moment
<rickspencer3> that's not real confidence inducing
<robert_ancell> :)_
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, not sure if you edit a lot of older glade files but I just uploaded the brand new upstream to make the vboxes stop reverting to being horizontal
<ccheney> rickspencer3: hmm i didn't upload it yet
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, I don't recall having this issue
<rickspencer3> ccheney, oh, well I'm getting a lot of new OOo
<ccheney> rickspencer3: committed it to ooo-build git though and will be uploading it once i find out from rene if he is going to upload -5 to debian in the next day
<rickspencer3> k
<ccheney> rickspencer3: hmm i think that would have been from monday's upload
<rickspencer3> prolly
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, you'd remember it if you'd had it.  Drives a lot of people insane
<rickspencer3> I guess it's been a couple of days
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, the glade guys are cool, and work so hard
<ccheney> i think i have all the OOo rc bugs fixed now, just have to the upload :)
<rickspencer3> but glade needs a lot more love
<rickspencer3> before it'll be really easy to use
<rickspencer3> a lot of people get blocked by not being able to figure it out
<rickspencer3> ccheney, nice!
<rickspencer3> ccheney, please upload asap, let's knock these bugs out
<ccheney> ok, i'll upload it as 4ubuntu2 if rene isn't going to upload -5 today
<ccheney> there are quite a few other fixes in -5 that would be easier to sync by just taking his changes
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, yeah, I'd love to have to time to help them out.  Been using it for so many years.  It's tough being a dev tool as apps get all the developer time
<ccheney> apparently debian ftp-master is broken so i'll just do a 4ubuntu2 for now and catch -5 once he can get it uploaded
 * ccheney checks current bug list for any other bugs to fix :)
<rickspencer3> simple scan .9.1.0? robert_ancell, I thought it was 1.0 time?
<rickspencer3> :)
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, yeah, as soon as people stop finding bugs with their obscure scanners
<robert_ancell> by obscure I mean scanners I don't own btw
<rickspencer3> ccheney, yeah, get some bugs closed! go go go
<rickspencer3> right, is there another definition?
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, I used it the other day, and it was a blessed relief
<rickspencer3> I want to hold it up as the standard that our software aspires to (well default install apps)
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, that's what I like to hear!
<rickspencer3> I'd like to give the whole image managment scenario the same treatment in 10.10
<rickspencer3> oops distupgrade, done rb
<rickspencer3> brb
<ccheney> oh yea i need to fix F11 bug :)
<TheMuso> rickspencer3: Yeah I have used simple-scan a few times now, and its great. No screwing with xsane settings to get what you want. :)
<rickspencer3> *sigh*
<rickspencer3> gwibber an desktopcouch immediately crashed after I started  gwibber
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, can you get a traceback?
<kenvandine> grab me a log
<rickspencer3> https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/548514
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 548514 in desktopcouch "desktopcouch-service crashed with SIGSEGV" [Undecided,New]
<rickspencer3> https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/548515
<ubottu> Error: Could not parse data returned by Ubuntu: list index out of range (https://launchpad.net/bugs/548515)
<rickspencer3> suck
<rickspencer3> https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/548515
<ubottu> Error: Could not parse data returned by Ubuntu: list index out of range (https://launchpad.net/bugs/548515)
<rickspencer3> oh well
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, ^
<rickspencer3> need anything else?
<kenvandine> the first one looks like maybe keyring related
<kenvandine> and gwibber nor desktopcouch has changed
<kenvandine> so something lower in the stack
<kenvandine> can you make bug 548515 public?
<ubottu> Error: Could not parse data returned by Launchpad: list index out of range (https://launchpad.net/bugs/548515)
<rickspencer3> I thought I did make it public
<rickspencer3> hold on
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, puplic now
<rickspencer3> lol
<rickspencer3> working too long today
<rickspencer3> I least I didn't leave out the "l"
<kenvandine> damn
<kenvandine> that one should get caught at least
<kenvandine> oh it's in gwui.py... humm
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, so it's just an uncaught exception for a service time out?
<kenvandine> well... yes
<kenvandine> but that isn't the bug :)
<kenvandine> desktopcouch crashing is the bug
<rickspencer3> that is *a* bug
<kenvandine> yeah... i know :)
<rickspencer3> desktopcouch crashing is another bug
<rickspencer3> heh
<kenvandine> desktopcouch crashing is interesting there... it is like python dumped
<rickspencer3> I asked because it seems the uncaught exception will not bother users in for reals
<kenvandine> had you rebooted?
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, yes
<rickspencer3> dist-upgrade, reboot, first thing I saw
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, after release users will not see the error
<rickspencer3> that's my point, yes
<kenvandine> they just won't see anything
<kenvandine> we need to handle that
<rickspencer3> so we should fix it, but it's not release critical or anything
<rickspencer3> we can fix it in 10.10
<kenvandine> :)
<rickspencer3> I assumed that the two bugs I logged were two apps responding to the same event
<kenvandine> i have a way to display it to the users now... :)
<TheMuso> argh! I think we have a race condition with desktop startup and at-spi.
<kenvandine> just need to wire it up
<rickspencer3> the desktopcouch one is more worisome
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, yeah.. indeed
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, that bites
<TheMuso> rickspencer3: a little. Nautilus, and panels are not accessible for me. The only apps that have accessibility are those that I start once in my session.
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, when was your last dist-upgrade?
<TheMuso> However sometimes they are accessible, hense the race.
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, yes
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, *when* :)
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, hmmm, so desktop starts up to fast now, huh?
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, like 30 minutes ago
<TheMuso> rickspencer3: Well things start up before at-spi gets a chance to plant its accessibility properties on the root window.
<kenvandine> previous one?
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, don't recall
<rickspencer3> but days
<kenvandine> ok
<rickspencer3> do you think these could be false positives?
<TheMuso> So once at-spi starts, only new apps that are started see these properties, and since, according to .xsession-errors, nautilus, gnome-panel, and some applets start before at-spi, they miss out on accessibility goodness.
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, right
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, does it fail again?
<rickspencer3> seems this needs fixing for sures
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, no ... it worked the second time
 * TheMuso is now pondering how we can fix it.
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, i hate that!
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, shall I reboot?
<TheMuso> I might have to talk to Seb or Martin.
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, nah
<kenvandine> i am sure it was some weird condition that is a pain to repro :/
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, you think?
<rickspencer3> it seems pretty consistent for me
<kenvandine> oh... it happened more than once?
<rickspencer3> let me reboot and see
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, every time I restart
<kenvandine> interesting
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, back
 * rickspencer3 runs gwibber
 * rickspencer3 drums fingers
<kenvandine> is this on your eeepc?
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, no
<rickspencer3> oh
<rickspencer3> there;s the gwibber crash
<rickspencer3> or *a* gwibber crash, anyway
<rickspencer3> notify-osd messages are coming in
<kenvandine> so gwibber-service and desktopcouch started fine
<kenvandine> but the client crashed
<rickspencer3> I guess so
<kenvandine> so lets see the crash
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, what can I get to help you look into this tomorrow?
<rickspencer3> ok
<kenvandine> just get me the log
<kenvandine> should be enough
<kenvandine>  ~/.cache/gwibber/gwibber.log
<rickspencer3> kenvandine,
<rickspencer3> 2010-03-25 18:55:03,438 - Gwibber GNOME Client - INFO - Running from the system path
<rickspencer3> 2010-03-25 18:55:28,292 - Gwibber Dispatcher - ERROR - Failed to raise client (DBusException(dbus.String(u'Did not receive a reply. Possible causes include: the remote application did not send a reply, the message bus security policy blocked the reply, the reply timeout expired, or the network connection was broken.'),),)
<rickspencer3> 2010-03-25 18:58:08,401 - Gwibber Dispatcher - ERROR - Message updated: 550630860_411542430860-4063ce6d845f566097470340186e124b-receive, failed
<rickspencer3> 2010-03-25 18:59:12,031 - Gwibber Dispatcher - INFO - Loading complete: 1 - ['Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success']
<rickspencer3> 2010-03-25 19:03:50,522 - Gwibber Dispatcher - ERROR - Failed to communicate with https://api.facebook.com/restserver.php?api_key=71b85c6d8cb5bbb9f1a3f8bbdcdd4b05&v=1.0&sig=f0e0f484d7942eadc62fe7d35cecd3f2&format=json&query=%0A++++++SELECT+id%2C+post_id%2C+time%2C+fromid%2C+text%2C+object_id+FROM+comment+WHERE+post_id+IN%0A++++++++%28SELECT+post_id+FROM+stream+WHERE+source_id+%3D+626676204%29+AND%0A++++++++fromid+%3C%3E+626676204
<rickspencer3> +ORDER+BY+time+DESC+LIMIT+1%2C100%0A++++++&session_key=d3f38185efec2c363dc3559f-626676204&method=facebook.fql.query&call_id=1269569022000
<rickspencer3> 2010-03-25 19:03:50,522 - Gwibber Dispatcher - ERROR - Failed to parse the response, error was: No JSON object could be decoded
<rickspencer3> 2010-03-25 19:03:51,912 - Gwibber Dispatcher - ERROR - <facebook:responses> Operation failed
<rickspencer3> 2010-03-25 19:04:27,588 - Gwibber Dispatcher - ERROR - Loading failed:  - Traceback (most recent call last):
<rickspencer3>   File "/usr/lib/python2.6/dist-packages/gwibber/microblog/dispatcher.py", line 327, in run
<rickspencer3>     pool.map_async(self.func, self.iterable, callback=self.callback).get(self.timeout)
<rickspencer3>   File "/usr/lib/python2.6/multiprocessing/pool.py", line 418, in get
<rickspencer3>     raise TimeoutError
<rickspencer3> TimeoutError
<rickspencer3> 2010-03-25 19:07:49,892 - Gwibber GNOME Client - INFO - Gwibber Client closed
<rickspencer3> 2010-03-25 19:08:13,750 - Gwibber Dispatcher - ERROR - Failed to communicate with https://api.facebook.com/restserver.php?api_key=71b85c6d8cb5bbb9f1a3f8bbdcdd4b05&format=json&call_id=1269569285000&viewer_id=626676204&limit=80&v=1.0&sig=a687da7898a9dbabe8b07e1ec1833a8a&session_key=d3f38185efec2c363dc3559f-626676204&method=facebook.stream.get
<rickspencer3> 2010-03-25 19:08:13,750 - Gwibber Dispatcher - ERROR - Failed to parse the response, error was: No JSON object could be decoded
<rickspencer3> 2010-03-25 19:08:13,751 - Gwibber Dispatcher - ERROR - <facebook:receive> Operation failed
<rickspencer3> 2010-03-25 19:09:18,162 - Gwibber Dispatcher - INFO - Loading complete: 2 - ['Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Failure', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success']
<rickspencer3> 2010-03-25 19:13:17,735 - Gwibber Dispatcher - ERROR - Failed to communicate with https://api.facebook.com/restserver.php?api_key=71b85c6d8cb5bbb9f1a3f8bbdcdd4b05&format=json&call_id=1269569582000&viewer_id=626676204&limit=80&v=1.0&sig=9b38081b80bc4118d4b1bd68b9fcf7b1&session_key=d3f38185efec2c363dc3559f-626676204&method=facebook.stream.get
<rickspencer3> 2010-03-25 19:13:17,738 - Gwibber Dispatcher - ERROR - Failed to parse the response, error was: No JSON object could be decoded
<rickspencer3> 2010-03-25 19:13:17,738 - Gwibber Dispatcher - ERROR - <facebook:receive> Operation failed
<rickspencer3> 2010-03-25 19:14:07,937 - Gwibber Dispatcher - INFO - Loading complete: 3 - ['Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Failure', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success']
<rickspencer3> 2010-03-25 19:18:13,747 - Gwibber Dispatcher - ERROR - Message updated: 626676204_103704822998277-4063ce6d845f566097470340186e124b-receive, failed
<rickspencer3> 2010-03-25 19:19:04,433 - Gwibber Dispatcher - INFO - Loading complete: 4 - ['Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success']
<rickspencer3> 2010-03-25 19:24:32,815 - Gwibber GNOME Client - INFO - Running from the system path
<rickspencer3> 2010-03-25 19:24:42,946 - Gwibber Service - INFO - Running from the system path
<rickspencer3> 2010-03-25 19:26:25,113 - Gwibber Dispatcher - ERROR - Failed to communicate with https://api.facebook.com/restserver.php?api_key=71b85c6d8cb5bbb9f1a3f8bbdcdd4b05&format=json&call_id=1269570369000&viewer_id=626676204&limit=80&v=1.0&sig=1094750bd2c2a89033298487787f9f39&session_key=d3f38185efec2c363dc3559f-626676204&method=facebook.stream.get
<rickspencer3> 2010-03-25 19:26:25,116 - Gwibber Dispatcher - ERROR - Failed to parse the response, error was: No JSON object could be decoded
<rickspencer3> 2010-03-25 19:26:25,116 - Gwibber Dispatcher - ERROR - <facebook:receive> Operation failed
<rickspencer3> 2010-03-25 19:26:50,664 - Gwibber Dispatcher - ERROR - Failed to communicate with https://api.facebook.com/restserver.php?api_key=71b85c6d8cb5bbb9f1a3f8bbdcdd4b05&v=1.0&sig=b9084a77e6d8f8841ccd87cc00cd2dad&format=json&query=%0A++++++SELECT+id%2C+post_id%2C+time%2C+fromid%2C+text%2C+object_id+FROM+comment+WHERE+post_id+IN%0A++++++++%28SELECT+post_id+FROM+stream+WHERE+source_id+%3D+626676204%29+AND%0A++++++++fromid+%3C%3E+626676204
<rickspencer3> +ORDER+BY+time+DESC+LIMIT+1%2C100%0A++++++&session_key=d3f38185efec2c363dc3559f-626676204&method=facebook.fql.query&call_id=1269570394000
<rickspencer3> 2010-03-25 19:26:50,664 - Gwibber Dispatcher - ERROR - Failed to parse the response, error was: No JSON object could be decoded
<rickspencer3> 2010-03-25 19:26:52,020 - Gwibber Dispatcher - ERROR - <facebook:responses> Operation failed
<rickspencer3> 2010-03-25 19:27:14,576 - Gwibber Dispatcher - INFO - Loading complete: 1 - ['Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Failure', 'Failure', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success', 'Success']
<rickspencer3> dang it!
<rickspencer3> that was supposed to be a pastbin url :/
<rickspencer3> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/401520/
 * rickspencer3 blush
<kenvandine> hehe
<LaserJock> rickspencer3: now we can all debug together :-)
<rickspencer3> yeah
<rickspencer3> and decode my social networking credentials too
<TheMuso> wooo
<TheMuso> pastebin probably would have been better...
 * rickspencer3 changes all passwords
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, yeah, it was an accident
<LaserJock> yeah ... cause I don't have enough peeps on *my* facebook to keep up, I gotta steal yours too
<TheMuso> lol
<rickspencer3> I pasted into pastebin, then selected the URL, and pasted into there thinking I was copying, then pasted into here
<LaserJock> rickspencer3: I find pastebinit is useful for that, I've had similar issues
<rickspencer3> hehe
<rickspencer3> oh well
<LaserJock> as long as seb's asleep you're probably ok
<LaserJock> ;-)
<rickspencer3> it's not like this gets logged for eternity and then searchable in google cache forever
<rickspencer3> hehe
<rickspencer3> I was wondering why I didn't get kicked
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, is it possible that i am trying to start the UI while the daemon is loading
<rickspencer3> and so GetServices() blows up because the daemon is not ready?
 * RAOF likes Do's âsend to pastebinâ action for this sort of thing.
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, that shouldn't matter
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, that is how gwibber is designed to start... the UI starts the service
<kenvandine> except in the autostart scenario
<kenvandine> but that doesn't matter either
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, but... some of my startup related bug fixes might have been after the last upload
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, it looks like all that GetServices does is dump a Python list to JSON
<kenvandine> yes
<kenvandine> but it requires the daemon to respond
<rickspencer3> right
<rickspencer3> so looking at the stack trace, it implies that the daemon is not there
<kenvandine> i wonder if the service is starting twice
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, could me starting manually confict with the autostarting?
<kenvandine> and when you hit the service, it is getting the wrong one
<kenvandine> there was a problem with that which has been fixed
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, I saw there was a related bug that was fix released
<rickspencer3> should I try again tomorrow?
<kenvandine> if the service wasn't completely up and you started the client it would fire up a second service
<rickspencer3> hmmm
<kenvandine> which would then figut for the name on dbus
<rickspencer3> I see
<rickspencer3> so the client crashes
<kenvandine> let me see if that was fixed before the last release
<kenvandine> yes
<rickspencer3> but then the service stands up
<rickspencer3> and start ripping to notify-osd
<rickspencer3> I try again, and the service is there, works
<rickspencer3> so it seems that starting manually before the autostart kicks in will be quite common
<rickspencer3> is there a way to set a "starting" flag for the daemon, and wait for it to clear before the client makes calls on it?
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, I'll see if there are updates tomorrow and poke at it some more
<kenvandine> well that should be fixed though
<rickspencer3> ok
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, i might not get a release out until the weekend
<kenvandine> but we are overdue
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, so you think the fix is uploaded but not released?
<kenvandine> i am looking
<rickspencer3> Version: 2.29.92.1-0ubuntu1
<kenvandine> yeah... the fix is in that
<kenvandine> hummm
<kenvandine> i haven't witnessed it, and been testing it daily in kvm and on the livecd
 * kenvandine boots one
<rickspencer3> bummer
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, maybe time to go to sleep, and take a fresh start tomorrow?
<rickspencer3> the solution will come to you in a dream
<rickspencer3> and you will be pissed you let me waste all your time tonight ;)
<Sarvatt> so it looks like this huge number of bugs about gnome-screensaver-gl-helper crashing with proprietary drivers are all from when it activates after installation before the person reboots. anyone know a way around that? disabling the screensaver until reboot possible?
<Sarvatt> activate proprietary graphics drivers in jockey > idle for 5 minutes > screensaver kicks in and a crash report comes up
<RAOF> Sarvatt: Well, we'll be disabling apport soon... is that entirely a false-positive?
<Sarvatt> yep doesn't actually hurt anything, theres just a large number of bugs under the last few releases about it
<RAOF> I guess the other option is to drop the nvidia & fglrx drivers entirely and just ship nouveau's 3d & radeon ;)
<Sarvatt> haha funny joke :)
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, just saw your featured IDE response. Am interested on you feedback on the mail I just sent
<rickspencer3> what huh?
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, well i can't repro in  a VM :/
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, I skipped to the top
<rickspencer3> fudge
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, i'll try again tomorrow
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, ack
<rickspencer3> maybe I can set up some debugging hooks here
<kenvandine> yeah
<kenvandine> lets do that tomorrow
<chrisccoulson> Sarvatt, I get the gnome-screensaver-gl-helper crash on my NVIDIA machine quite frequently
<chrisccoulson> (or one of them)
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, what do you want me to comment on exactly?
<rickspencer3> I thought I was agreeing with you ;)
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, oh, just you've had the experience of doing focus groups with developers etc.  You might actually know how people learn programming :)
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, I commented on the bug
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, i have run hundreds of usability studies on developers
<rickspencer3> well, hundreds?
<rickspencer3> that would be 10 per year
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, yeah, a lot more than my 0!!
<rickspencer3> okay. maybe 50, but watches 100s of developers
<rickspencer3> anyway, what was my point?
 * rickspencer3 too late ...
<robert_ancell> damn sydney people keep talking :)
<lifeless> robert_ancell: oh hai
<robert_ancell> lifeless, hey
<rickspencer3> yo sydney peeps!
<rickspencer3> g'night mates
<rickspencer3> :)
<kenvandine> good night
<ccheney> heh i love 8GB ram, plenty to disk cache the entire OOo source tree, so grep returns instantly
 * ccheney testing the F11 patch now :)
<RAOF> Mmm.  GAPI, I like the cut of your jib!
<ccheney> hmm the patch doesn't work, wtf
 * ccheney thinks he must not have the proper stuff installed or something else weird
<ccheney> the accelerator settings are there but it seems to not be using them, gah
 * ccheney thinks he found the place the real settings were hiding
<robert_ancell> didrocks, has the gdmsetup patch dropped the session selector somewhere?
<robert_ancell> pitti, can you look at bug 445123 and release it if OK.  Patch on my branch, I've tested it and it works
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 445123 in gdm "No GUI option to disable face browser" [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/445123
 * RAOF seems to have confused gnome-keyring-daemon
<pitti> Good morning
<pitti> robert_ancell: how are you?
<robert_ancell> pitti, hey, good
<robert_ancell> pitti, gtg, could you also take a look at feature freeze request for bug 548589
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 548589 in gbrainy "Merge upstream grammar fixes to Lucid" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/548589
<pitti> robert_ancell: I'll look at both
<pitti> robert_ancell: gdm> that should be relatively easy, now that we have the gconf mechanism?
<pitti> so please feel free to merge
<robert_ancell> pitti, yeah for gdm just copied the sound path - so ok to upload?
<pitti> I wish we had generalized the d-bus interface for setGconfBoolean(), setGconfString(), etc.
<pitti> repeating that code is ugly
<pitti> but sure, "good enough" for now
<robert_ancell> pitti, yeah, I didn't want to do that because I wasn't sure what information is stored in gconf and then everything would be user readable
<pitti> robert_ancell: well, it's just gdm, and you need polkit privs to read/write it anyway?
<robert_ancell> pitti, I'm hoping somehow in 10.10 we can reduce the huge pile of patches
<pitti> but nevermind for now
<pitti> let's not redesign it yet again for lucid
<pitti> robert_ancell: right, or perhaps there's a better alternative for our gdmsetup by then
<robert_ancell> pitti, well, there's all the other patches too :)
<pitti> right, but those are the most painful
<robert_ancell> pitti, see you next week!
<pitti> robert_ancell: have a good weekend!
<TheMuso> pitti: It seems we have a race condition with desktop startup. When accessibility is enabled, sometimes at-spi starts after nautilus/gnome-panel and applets get started, causing only applications loaded after/in the session to be accessible.
<TheMuso> pitti: I am pretty sure you could confirm this using accerciser with accessibility turned on.
<TheMuso> pitti: My questino is, how do we fix this? :)
<TheMuso> question even
<pitti> TheMuso: is that dg/autostart/at-spi-registryd.desktop ?
<TheMuso> pitti: yes
<pitti> TheMuso: hm, that already has X-GNOME-Autostart-Phase=Initialization
<pitti> which is as early as it can get
<TheMuso> pitti: Yes.
<pitti> everything else starts later than that
<TheMuso> Well something is not right somewhere. When at-spi loads, it adds accessibility properties to the root window. If GTK sees these properties, it loads accessibility bits. at-spi is obvisouly not ready for nautilus etc when they start, causing them to be inaccessible.
<pitti> TheMuso: ah, that's plausible -- it might set the properties later than the other apps start
<TheMuso> pitti: I'd say so.
<pitti> hm, I thought programs have to register to the GNOME session to signal that they are ready
<pitti> but I'd guess that a-s-r would only do so after setting the properties?
<pitti> TheMuso: it might be worth adding a sleep(3) after setting the properties and checking with bootchart whether the other stuff is properly delayed
<TheMuso> Very likely, yes. Haven't looked at the code myself to be sure. WIll take a look on Monday. I just noticed this race when attempting to use nautilus today.
<TheMuso> pitti: do you mean in at-spi-registryd code?
<pitti> TheMuso: yes
<TheMuso> pitti: Ok, as above, I'll lok Monday. I'm at the end of my week, but came back to try and sort this out. I'll probably need someone else to interpret the boot chart, as graphs/graphics mean little to me. :)
<TheMuso> look
<pitti> TheMuso: yes, I'm happy to interpret them for you
<TheMuso> pitti: ok thanks, will get back to you once I make the above change.
<pitti> TheMuso: enjoy your weekend then!
<TheMuso> pitti: Will do, thanks.
 * pitti goes back enjoying debugging scsi ioctls on remote machines for bug 445852
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 445852 in libatasmart "devkit-disks-probe-ata-smart causes HSM Violations on SSD, and potential hardware death" [Critical,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/445852
<RAOF> Hm.  What has possessed pulseaudio to consume 700MB of memory?
<baptistemm> Hi there
<dholbach> didrocks, pitti: I have the same alt-1 problem again, also I configured ctrl-< (convenient on a german keyboard) to fire up a terminal - this doesn't work either
<dholbach> hi baptistemm
<baptistemm> pitti, do you know bpython interpreter, that awesome
<didrocks> good morning
<didrocks> baptistemm: hey o/ what's the difference with ipython?
<didrocks> dholbach: hi, did you look at the accelerator about groupe window that I mentionned yesteday?
<baptistemm> didrocks, apt-get install it
<baptistemm> you'll see some neat features
<baptistemm> immediatly
<dholbach> didrocks: erm
<baptistemm> you have completion, you can post code to a pastebin, save the code
<dholbach> hi didrocks
<didrocks> baptistemm: ipython can do that too (not sure about copying to a pastebin), but the 2 others, right. You can also paste your code
<baptistemm> if you have time, give a try anyway
<didrocks> ok
<dholbach> didrocks: http://paste.ubuntu.com/401641 what you're looking for?
<didrocks> dholbach: yeah, not seing anything interesting there. You can maybe unset now as you've done yesterday, and redump the result to make a diff?
<dholbach> it seems to think that ">" is "\" or something
<TeTeT> asac: morning, another network-manager question: how can I build a specific git version, e.g. commit 6773cc6a639e6698d19b8b6bc91cc6bfa2a1d26e
<dholbach> didrocks: paste.ubuntu.com/401647 made alt-1, etc. work again - now I need to figure out why '>' is '\'
<dholbach> ok, fixed again - that was a mistake on my part
<didrocks> dholbach: ah?
<dholbach> didrocks: resetting /apps/metacity made alt-1 work again
<didrocks> dholbach: right, but you don't know which on is the guilty one :)
<dholbach> yeah
<didrocks> pitti: do you have still the select default session in gdmsetup?
<pitti> didrocks: hm, apparently that got lost
<didrocks> I guess robert removed it in the merge :/
<dholbach> thanks didrocks
<didrocks> ok, he didn't take the whole file, hence the issue
<seb128> hello there!
<pitti> hi seb128
<sabdfl> howdy seb128
<pitti> good morning sabdfl
<sabdfl> and to you :-)
<seb128> hey pitti sabdfl
<seb128> how are you?
<sabdfl> doing great thanks. good cloud sprint this week, and some fun stuff in prep for UDS :-)
<didrocks> hey seb128
<didrocks> good morning sabdfl
<sabdfl> howdy
<seb128> salut didrocks
<aquarius> seb128, https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/rhythmbox/+bug/538416 is about not being able to drag files between libraries in rhythmbox -- I seem to have set its importance in rhythmbox which I shouldn't have done. Sorry about that.
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 538416 in rhythmbox "Cannot move media between library locations" [Low,Confirmed]
<seb128> aquarius, hey, don't worry that's not an issue
<seb128> is the ability to do that important for the store users?
<seb128> which leads to an interesting question I have on the rhythmbox topic, do you guys hack on rhythmbox too? ie will you fix rhythmbox issues to make the store work better?
<seb128> or help upstreaming those and working on those?
<seb128> when I say "guys" it might be you only, I don't know how you team is organized and how many people work on the desktop side or on the server one
<aquarius> it would be very nice, yes. At the moment, if you want to move a song from the music store library to your ordinary library (say, because you've filled up your 2GB storage in Ubuntu One), you've got to drag the song out to a folder in Nautilus and then back into the main Music library; you can't just drag it between the two
<aquarius> working on the music store on the desktop: me and rodrigo_. Hacking on rhythmbox itself: in theory, sure. Me personally, my C isn't good enough :(
<seb128> session restart brb
<seb128> re
<seb128> sorry about that
<seb128> aquarius, I see
<aquarius> rodrigo_'s is though ;)
<seb128> right
<seb128> not sure how busy he is
<seb128> but I think it would benefit rhythmbox, our relationship with upstream and store users to improve rhythmbox there
<didrocks> seb128: I saw you spoke with robert yesterday about the gdm change, do you know if he has a branch somewhere? (he didn't push and my changes was rejected)
<aquarius> very, at the moment, but then so's everybody else :) If we hit a problem which we want fixed in the store and which needs a fix in RB, then we'll certainly look at fixing that problem in RB.
<seb128> didrocks, which ones?
<rodrigo_> seb128, yes, I wouldn't mind working on it, just that until now, we didn't have the need to fix anything in rhythmbox
<seb128> hey rodrigo_
<rodrigo_> seb128, until that bug about moving msongs from one lib to the other came
<didrocks> seb128: the face browser he uploaded 2 hours ago
<seb128> how are you?
<seb128> didrocks, I did talk with robert about it?
<seb128> didrocks, I'm very tired I think, I don't remember that at all today
<didrocks> oh, it was pitti, sorry seb128 :)
<seb128> ok
<rodrigo_> seb128, fine, and you? :-)
<didrocks> just backlogged a lot of things this morning ^^
<seb128> didrocks, ~robert-ancell/gdm/bug-445123
<seb128> says the bug
<seb128> dunno why he didn't push to gdm bzr though
<didrocks> seb128: ok, I'll integrate that he redo my changes
<seb128> didrocks, he dropped your change?
<seb128> didrocks, which one?
<didrocks> seb128: right, about the session
<seb128> rodrigo_, quite good thanks!
<seb128> didrocks, :-(
<seb128> didrocks, thanks for spotting
<didrocks> seb128: so, I've reintegrated them, pushed and get a not so nice "already uploaded version" :/
<didrocks> seb128: in fact, it was spotted in bug #548417
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 548417 in gdm "Enabling auto-login in UNE restarts into the regular desktop" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/548417
<didrocks> I launched gdmsetup and "OMG where is the option?" ;)
<seb128> lol
<seb128> I though too it looks different before
<seb128> but it's not the upload from today
<seb128> the issue was there when I tried the sound change
<didrocks> seb128: right, that version contained the merged. I didn't notice that the merge was wrong :)
<seb128> pitti, how busy are you today?
<pitti> seb128: I'm just done with debugging 445852
<pitti> (ugh, that took a while)
<pitti> seb128: need to leave for 45 mins now for a doctor appointment
<pitti> and then I need to review/update our release status; things pile up
<seb128> aquarius, rodrigo_: btw for such rhyrhtmbox issues could you open bugzilla bugs at least and try to see on #rhythmbox if they could give hints to solve the issue too
<pitti> seb128: I can probably squeeze in some stuff in the afternoon, what's up?
<seb128> pitti, hum, ok, no hurry, see you later!
<seb128> pitti, retracers
<pitti> yes, apparently they need some solid debugging
<seb128> we need that
<seb128> would be nice to have crashes showing up in launchpad
<pitti> I'll try to do that ASAP
<seb128> thanks
<pitti> we just got staging LP fixed for apport
<pitti> so I can at least run the test suite again
<pitti> and reproduce stuff there, etc.
<dholbach> hi guys
<seb128> having a rough idea if the store is stable or not would be useful
<dholbach> I have the problem of alt+1 on another machine now :)
<dholbach> hello sabdfl
<seb128> but without apport crashes being retraceds it's hard to tell
<seb128> hey dholbach
<seb128> use compiz! ;-)
<dholbach> not sure compiz is the answer to that problem ;-)
<seb128> ok, so copy your gconf config and unset things until fixing the issue
<seb128> and diff
<seb128> and figure what setting is to blame
<mvo> compiz!
<didrocks> 3 times in less than 24 hours, dholbach is a rockstar with alt + 1 :)
<dholbach> I like using tabs
<seb128> dholbach, do what you did yesterday but with copying before
<seb128> so you can diff afterwards and tell us
 * mvo uploads r666 of software-center
<didrocks> seb128: dholbach tried that this morning: http://paste.ubuntu.com/401647
<didrocks> (well, I suggested the same thing of course ;))
<seb128> didrocks, ok, you didn't figure which key does that exactly?
<seb128> could be in an another gconf subdir
<seb128> like g-s-d keybdings
<baptistemm> heya
<didrocks> seb128: he reset only what is in the diff and it fixed that (he got the same on another machine lately)
<baptistemm> To whom can I ask a decision for bug 534702
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 534702 in bluez "Update bluez to 4.62" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/534702
<seb128> didrocks, did unsetting the ctrl-alt-t thing is enough to get it working?
<didrocks> dholbach: ? ^
<seb128> could be the keybinding he's using
<dholbach> seb128: I'm using ctrl-alt-t now
<baptistemm> I would like to have it + some patches in 4.63 or 4.63 even if possible
<dholbach> I unset /apps/metacity
<dholbach> and lots of other stuff already
<didrocks> seb128: apart from that, I don't see any other key that can be relevent, weird :/
<seb128> dholbach, dunno then
<seb128> didrocks, ^
<seb128> baptistemm, try subscribing ubuntu-release
<seb128> or ask pitti
<seb128> or asac
<dholbach> http://paste.ubuntu.com/401680/
<seb128> dholbach, it's working now?
<dholbach> no
<seb128> k, I really don't know
<seb128> you seem to be the only one to get the issue
<dholbach> yeah
<seb128> think about what you changes on all your boxes
<dholbach> I changed stuff over years :)
<dholbach> but I reset a lot already
<seb128> it's happening in a guest session?
<dholbach> no
<seb128> k, so I can't really help you there
<dholbach> I hate it when stuff breaks because of "old settings that used to work before" :-(
<seb128> backup .gconf
<dholbach> yeah, I'll see what I can do
<seb128> and delete things until finding where the issue is
<dholbach> thanks a bunch everybody
<seb128> then diff and find the key
<dholbach> yep
<dholbach> is there anything other than gconf I should have a look at?
<seb128> you can put back the buggy config and try cleaning until part until you find the exact one
<seb128> well I would start by moving .gconf on the side
<seb128> and see if that fixes it
<seb128> if it does you know it comes from there
<seb128> then put the dir back and try without the desktop subdir
<seb128> and see if that fixes the issue
<seb128> etc
<dholbach> brb
<dholbach> thanks seb128
<seb128> you're welcome
<seb128> ok, another session restart, brb
<dholbach> man, it works now, after I relogged in
<baptistemm> thanks seb128
<asac> TeTeT: you need to encode the git url in the changelog version. then run ./debian/rules get-current-source
<seb128> oh, asac there
<asac> hi nse
<asac> seb128:
<seb128> hey asac
<asac> i am sure i didnt do a few things ;)
<seb128> asac: there is no chance we get that nm-applet upload in is it?
<asac> seb128: yes.
<seb128> asac: dx is harazing us about it
<seb128> asac: it's due for weeks now
<asac> ok
<seb128> asac: thanks!
<asac> TeTeT: 0.8~rc4~git.20100218t181708.fa9e9b4-0ubuntu1~nmt1  is one example
<asac> TeTeT: just use 0.8+git.....
<asac> if its after 0.8
<asac> if its before 0.8 you can just use the version from above and change the git id (fa9e9b4)
<TeTeT> asac: thanks a lot, easier than I thought!
<asac> np
<pitti> hm, no Chris Coulson today?
<seb128> pitti, dunno, he has been joining late recently though, not sure if that's because he shifted time wise, he works late in nights too or if he tries to get work done without irc...
<pitti> mvo, seb128: I wonder about bug 150702 - alt+shift-tab works fine here..
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 150702 in metacity "alt shift tab stopped navigating windows" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/150702
<mvo> pitti: work for me too, I can have a look after lunch
<seb128> pitti, works for me
<pitti> ok, that's enough for me; closing :)
<pitti> mvo, seb128: thanks
<seb128> pitti, look to the upload didrocks did 2 days ago I think I've read something about that one
<pitti> ah
<mvo> yes, it got only recently uploaded
<mvo> I think I commited it a while ago but did not upload myself
<seb128> mvo, hey, well done on categories translations, they work now
<seb128> in s-c
<mvo> seb128: sweet
<didrocks> right, it's working for me as well with mvo's changes
<mvo> cool
 * mvo goes for lunch
<pitti> bryceh, tjaalton: for bug 539473, can we drop the b-dep to utempter? Or do we need to fix the package?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 539473 in libutempter "libutempter needed as xterm build-dependency" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/539473
<seb128> hey pedro_
<pedro_> bonjour seb128!
<tgpraveen12> is there anything that i can do in this situation:- at spi crashes i click on report problem
<tgpraveen12> The problem cannot be reported:
<tgpraveen12> The program crashed on an assertion failure, but the message could not be retrieved. Apport does not support reporting these crashes.
<tgpraveen12> and the thing is that mouse accessibility hasnt been working since several days in lucid.
<pitti> chrisccoulson: good morning, how are you?
<chrisccoulson> hey pitti, i'm good thanks, but still quite tired again
<chrisccoulson> how are you?
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hey seb128
<pitti> chrisccoulson: still no sleep? I'm quite well, thanks; I'm happy that I tracked down this "libatasmart kills SSDs" bug..
<chrisccoulson> yay\o/
<chrisccoulson> thats good :-)
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i didn't get much sleep again last night
<seb128> pitti, does it affect lot of disk models on karmic?
<seb128> pitti, ie should I recommend people I know to never install karmic on a ssd?
<popey> kenvandine: does gwibber work behind a proxy?
<pitti> I can't say; the bug has 5 dupes, but quite some subscribers
<pitti> seb128: ^
<pitti> seb128: karmic-proposed has a workaround now
<seb128> ok
<pitti> seb128: it easily survives a couple of (or even 50) of those bugs, but it seems to have some long-term effect
<pitti> seb128: you can rescue the disk by dd'ing zeros over it, though
<seb128> ok
<popey> kenvandine: i think 'no' might be the answer after I just tested it
<seb128> pedro_, hey
<seb128> pedro_, could you get the debug log for this butterfly crash you get?
<pedro_> seb128, yep, as soon as i get it again i'll attach the log file to the report
<seb128> pedro_, thanks
<pedro_> seb128, my pleasure ;-)
<tjaalton> pitti: commented on the bug
<pitti> tjaalton: thanks
<tjaalton> pitti: so it's possible to revert the change, or to fix libutempter
<pitti> tseliot, Riddell: can you please give me a quick status about bug 540177? is that blocked by anything, too hard to do, or on the way for b2?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 540177 in kdebase-workspace "KDM needs plymouth transition patch" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/540177
<tseliot> pitti: I have a patch that needs some testing. I have just rebuilt kdebase-workspace
<tseliot> pitti: and, unless we want plymouth to prevent failsafe x from showing up, we need a new upload of plymouth (Keybuk will deal with it)
<pitti> tseliot: thank you
<tseliot> np
<Ng> asac: are you still mr ubufox? :)
<asac> Ng: most likely unfortunately, yes. there are a few bugs, yes.
<asac> Ng: anything particular?
<pitti> Riddell, kenvandine: can you please update https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/ReleaseStatus for Kubuntu/DX?
<kenvandine> pitti, will do
<kwwii> asac: hey, where are the network manager icons these days?
<kwwii> asac: trying to figure out the name of the bars which show up for 3g connections
<asac> kwwii: i think we dont have a dynamic 3g signal strenght experience yet. dpkg -L network-manager-gnome | grep wwan
<asac> /usr/share/icons/hicolor/22x22/apps/nm-device-wwan.png
<asac> ?
<asac> that one is probably the one
<asac> oh
<kwwii> asac: but that doesn't have the states
<asac> kwwii: yes, 3g doesnt have states atm
<asac> wasnt finished upstream for 0.8
<asac> unless we have a patch i dont remember
<asac> chrisccoulson: wanna check out?
<asac> ;)
<kwwii> asac: hrm, it seems that when you plug one in blue bars appear
<kwwii> asac: and they are not in the Humanity set, so they must come from network manager itself
<kwwii> blue bars in the panel is bad :)
<asac> hmm. can you send a screen?
<asac> i dont have a 3g modem atm
<kwwii> asac: nope, I don't have one either
<kwwii> asac: sabdfl has one and is experiencing the problem
<asac> kwwii: how does the wwan look like?
<asac> kwwii: whats our default theme atm?
<asac> is the link blue thing in firefox in our default theme?
<asac> kwwii: in code i dont see it using anything but the nm-device-wwan for 3g
<kwwii> asac: hrm, ok I will try that and see if it fixes the problem
<kwwii> asac: yes, the blue link color is a problem with any mixed dark/light theme
<kwwii> asac: so yes, it is in our defualt theme
<didrocks> seb128: I had a couple of hours and worked on the g-c-c change for button layout. Do you have a bug number handy?
<seb128> didrocks, oh nice, wait
<didrocks> I need a string freeze exception too as I enable people to revert the change automatically applied
<seb128> didrocks, you mean there?
<didrocks> seb128: if the theme provide a button layout which is different from your current selection, it applies it (as we talk yesterday), and there is a revert button if people wants to keep his configuration
<seb128> pedro_, could you try if you confirm bug #543892?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 543892 in rhythmbox "Clicking "Create Audio CD" does nothing" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/543892
<chrisccoulson> hi asac - sorry, i didn't realise anybody had tried to message me ;)
<seb128> didrocks, bug 535322 is your issue
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 535322 in gnome-control-center "no gui options to switch title bar buttons back to right side" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/535322
<didrocks> seb128: sweet! thanks :)
<chrisccoulson> asac - ok, i will look at that
<seb128> didrocks, hum, I'm not sure we want that
<pedro_> seb128, will have a look
<asac> chrisccoulson: heh. np
<seb128> didrocks, is that what is done for ie fonts too?
<didrocks> seb128: fonts is quite different: font changes aren't applied automatically, you have to select the apply button
<chrisccoulson> asac - i'm just about to build firefox locally with the cairo patch
<seb128> didrocks, k, I'm not sure I like having a question there
<chrisccoulson> hopefully it works ok :)
<didrocks> seb128: it's not a question, it's applied automatically
<seb128> didrocks, I don't get where is the new string though
<didrocks> seb128: the goal is to have that accepted upstream and they won't if we change automatically the user config. Here, we change it and there is the extra pan (like for the font) saying "the theme applied a new layout button, you can revert it"
<seb128> didrocks, hum, k, I'm not convinced about that dialog to be honest
<seb128> seems to be a question confusing users and getting in the way when changing themes
<didrocks> seb128: it's just to avoid the corner case we talked about yesterday, the "you screwed up my home baked configuration"
<didrocks> seb128: do you want to give it a try? (pitti too maybe?)
<seb128> so when do you display the question? I guess we should do it only when the current configuration is not the default one
<seb128> or the one which matches the theme which was selected
<kki> hi folks, i'm writing something on policykit for Ubuntu User and I have a short question. Will polkit-gnome-authorization appear in Lucid? It was supposed to be in beta 1: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/policykit-gnome/+bug/530829 but I couldn't find it.
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 530829 in policykit-gnome "Authorizations is old and should be hidden" [Medium,Fix released]
<seb128> ie it should be displayed if you changed gconf manually before and not if you just use the configuration dialog the normal way
<didrocks> seb128: it's only the second atm, it's when the configuration doesn't matches the theme which was selected
<pedro_> seb128, yes i can reproduce it, i'm adding the debugging log and comment on the upstream bug
<seb128> pedro_, thank you
<pitti> didrocks: try what?
<didrocks> pitti: the g-c-c changes with the layout button change (but maybe, let's finish to discuss with seb128 first about the change)
<seb128> I want other people opinion on that
<seb128> I think the dialog will add confusion to solve a corner case
<seb128> 99% of users never touch this key
<seb128> and will just want the theme to be the one they select
<seb128> not have a weird question every time they select a theme to try
<didrocks> seb128: it's only when the theme has a layout which differs to want is currently selected
<seb128> right, which means every time you switch between our theme an any other one
<didrocks> so, it's not something that happends relatively often
<didrocks> right
<seb128> well seems the basis usecase
<seb128> the first time an user will switch theme the question will be there
<seb128> since our theme is the only one setting the order
<seb128> so it's basically 99% of users who will get it
<pitti> kki: we explicitly disabled it, because it's mostly useless these days
<didrocks> it's not really a question, just an notice
<pitti> seb128, didrocks: oh, *this* kind of layout -- I was thinking too much about keyboard layouts recently
<seb128> I think the question should be there only if the user layout doesn't match the previous theme one
<didrocks> pitti: sorry that you are haunted by keyboard layout ;)
<seb128> ie if the user tweaked the key by hand to really be custom
<seb128> does it make sense to you?
<didrocks> seb128: right, make sense, I can give it a try
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> either that or don't display anything
<didrocks> (let's try, not sure how we can do that)
<seb128> that's like using the effects capplet
<seb128> if you use the ui you deal with having values set by it
<seb128> if you don't want that you can change the theme in gconf-editor
<seb128> well I would not bother
<seb128> just declare that the capplet set themes are they are designed
<seb128> if you want something else don't use the capplet
<didrocks> seb128: I'll just have a look if that can be easily done first, as the logic is almost there
<seb128> it's the same for custom gtk colors
<kki> pitti: thx, are you going to replace it by some other graphical solution?
<seb128> those will be dropped on theme change
<pitti> kki: no, there is none ATM
<didrocks> seb128: it's gconf value too?
<seb128> didrocks, not sure
<seb128> didrocks, it's in the detailled option, second tab
<didrocks> seb128: for all gconf value that are changed I saw on this window, it's 1. keep gconf value 2. propose user to take the theme one (if 2.) -> 3. propose user to revert last applied one
<didrocks> here, I have skipped the 2nd part (which wasn't natural at first in the code)
<didrocks> to have it apply from the theme selection
<seb128> didrocks, ok, I would just drop the question but it's up to you
<didrocks> I guess your proposal about looking if gconf_key != previous theme is a good idea
<seb128> I fear we get a pushback from design
<didrocks> well, gconf_key != previous theme is for 1% of people
<seb128> right
<didrocks> if we can please them easily, I give a timeline of 10 min :)
<seb128> do that if it's easy
<seb128> or drop the question
<seb128> sorry but I think there is a good chance design don't like us suggesting applying the ubuntu theme without the button order we decided on there...
<seb128> ie if you switch from human to light themes after upgrading for example you should get the new experience
<pitti> seb128: are you currently working on the retracers?
<pitti> 1000     32671  0.0  0.2  39044  8024 ?        S    00:47   0:00 www-browser https://edge.launchpad.net/+authorize-token?oauth_token=XjcGb1bh38FtZKp2kktH&allow_permission=WRITE_PRIVATE
<seb128> not a question you don't really know about
<seb128> pitti, no, I tried to subscribe the team to a bug yesterday using the script
<kki> pitti: but polkit-1 is still a part of 10.04 since you ported a few apps to it, no? Only commandline...
<seb128> pitti, and it screwed, seems to start some text web browser but without content displayed
<pitti> seb128: I guess I can kill that one?
<pitti> kki: it's been in Ubuntu since 9.10, yes
<seb128> pitti, yes
<kki> pitti: ok, thanks :)
<pitti> seb128: ah, I just saw that I have a launchpad.py bug fix shelved
<seb128> pitti, I trying to get out as I could and probably let it running
<pitti> but I coudl never test it due to staging not working
<seb128> tried
<seb128> not sure why it didn't just subscribe the team
<seb128> token outdated?
<seb128> asac, chrisccoulson: is there a bug about firefox not using startup-notification when start from the gnome-panel launcher?
<seb128> ie the busy cursor and an extra entry in the task list are displayed for a while
<chrisccoulson> i'm not sure about that
<seb128> chrisccoulson, do you get the issue too?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i do if i launch it from the panel menu, but not from the launcher that i normally use on the panel
<chrisccoulson> so i never noticed it until now
<seb128> weird
<seb128> I do get it from the default launcher there
<seb128> on 2 boxes
<seb128> it does the same if I dnd the firefox entry which is in the internet category there too
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - the launcher on my panel must be an old one
<chrisccoulson> it doesn't have StartupNotify=true in it
<seb128> k
<chrisccoulson> which is why i'd never seen it before
<seb128> that's maybe correct
<seb128> if firefox doesn't handle it
<seb128> ie the firefox one maybe shouldn't have it
<seb128> I will check for open bugs
<seb128> it's quite visible and worth fixing for lucid
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - thanks, i'll take a look at that at some point
<chrisccoulson> it might be a trivial fix to make it work properly anyway
<pitti> seb128: meh; staging isn't really "fixed", it just fails further along :(
<asac> seb128: could be that the XWindow name is wrong ... let me check
<seb128> chrisccoulson, asac: it's bug #469752
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 469752 in firefox "firefox,3.5/3.6 startup-notification bug" [Unknown,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/469752
<asac> StartupWMClass=Firefox
<asac> we should check what the window class is
<seb128> the bug has a comment saying 3.7 has the issue solved so maybe worth checking there?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, asac: ^
<seb128> can you reassing to xulrunner if that's correct?
<seb128> it seems the upstream bug has a trivial patch for it
<didrocks> ok, got it work :)
<seb128> didrocks, excellent
<didrocks> seb128: the default I set for other theme (not having the key) is menu:minimize,maximize,close (was the default on karmic, right?)
<seb128> didrocks, I think so
 * didrocks boot his VM
<asac> chrisccoulson: can you check the startup bug? e.g. if its an issue at all etc.?
<seb128> asac: it's an issue for sure and fixed in xul hg so we just have to backport changes
<asac> hmm. ok. i sent out all change requests today :)
<asac> yeah but ok
<asac> i will let chris check that
<seb128> k
<seb128> still no nm-applet upload to lucid? :-)
<tjaalton> asac: your mozilla daily builds are taking all the ppa buildd's ;)
<asac> seb128: thats scheduled for today ;)
<asac> tjaalton: no. the ppa builders are all gone
<tjaalton> asac: https://edge.launchpad.net/builders
<asac> tjaalton: we thoguth we fixed it, but seems we didnt. and cr3 was sick leave a few days
<seb128> asac: k, thanks
<asac> tjaalton: kde/landscape ... lots of other stuff is buildingt
<tjaalton> asac: I was going to suggest dropping intrepid and maybe jaunty from the releases to build on
<didrocks> seb128: ok, confirming that all is working fine now and the defualt is ok. We should maybe wait uploading the theme first which will revert the gconf key setting and add the key in the index file?
<didrocks> seb128: other, if we upload g-c-c first, if user change theme, it won't find the key in the theme file and will take the default position
 * didrocks expects a lot of "waow, they revert the order position in the theme" buzz if it's the case ;)
<seb128> didrocks, upload I would say it only affects people changing and back and will be fixed today
<didrocks> seb128: ok :)
<dholbach> I moved .gconf away now and restarted the session - alt+1 still doesn't work :)
<seb128> didrocks, kwwii will likely give on an ack for the change later on
<seb128> didrocks, kwwii will likely give on an ack for the change later on
<seb128> ups
<seb128> dholbach, weird
<seb128> dholbach, does it work using an another layout?
<dholbach> nope
<seb128> dholbach, k, so I don't know
<seb128> sorry
<dholbach> no worries
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - we're expecting a theme update today then are we?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, light-themes?
<seb128> check with kwwii
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah
<seb128> but didrocks needs a change
<seb128> so we will do an upload in any case yes
<chrisccoulson> i would like my purple terminals to return for the weekend ;)
<seb128> we can sneak your change in too
<seb128> let's wait for kwwii to reply
<seb128> we will either get an update from him or distro change both your changes to lucid
<seb128> works for you?
<chrisccoulson> yeah, that should be fine
<seb128> cool
<seb128> chrisccoulson, did you read the comments I did about xulrunner before?
<seb128> the startup notification issue and the upstream change to investigate
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, i did
<chrisccoulson> the bug should remain targetted against firefox for now though, as it uses its own local xulrunner
<seb128> oh, right
<seb128> is the assignee right?
<seb128> I don't know him
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, micahg is quite active on the mozillateam
<rickspencer3> good morning all
<rickspencer3> seb128, pitti hi
<pitti> hey rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> pitti, just in case there is any ambiguity ...
<rickspencer3> no more features for Lucid!
<rickspencer3> I won't fixed bug #445123
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 445123 in gdm "No GUI option to disable face browser" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/445123
<rickspencer3> this is not a bug, this is a feature request
<chrisccoulson> didn't a fix already get uploaded for that?
<rickspencer3> chrisccoulson, the new feature did, yes
<pitti> yes, Robert fixed it with a hip shot
<pitti> rickspencer3: you want it rolled back?
<rickspencer3> but who is going to test, translate, and document it?
<rickspencer3> and then who is going to respond to the requests to make it work differently
<rickspencer3> and what of the regressions or breakages it could introduce
<rickspencer3> pitti, I'm a bit confused, I thought we were well past visual freeze, why did the release team ok this?
<chrisccoulson> rickspencer3, you don't need to convince me that adding new features now is a bad idea ;)
<chrisccoulson> i thought exactly the same thing when i saw the comment last night that it must be  fixed in lucid
<pitti> rickspencer3: it wasn't really explicitly requested
<rickspencer3> ok
<rickspencer3> *isgh*
<rickspencer3> sorry
<rickspencer3> it seems that each release our users and the engineers ask for better quality as the single most important request
<seb128> rickspencer3, hey
<rickspencer3> hi seb128
<chrisccoulson> it's not like this feature hasn't been missing for many months already
<seb128> right I was a bit surprised
<rickspencer3> so I think we should roll this back rather than springing it on our translators, documentors, qa team, etcs...
<seb128> well
<seb128> we added the sound one 2 days ago though
<seb128> so it's going through translators anyway
<seb128> so depends how we fell about it now
<seb128> we can go either way
<seb128> + didrocks brough back the une one today
<rickspencer3> seb128, that's a good argument for rolling back that change too!
<pitti> the default session one has been there for ages
<pitti> it was just accidentaly dropped a few days back
<rickspencer3> please, for the love of all the is clean and pure ...
<rickspencer3> stop changing Lucid
<rickspencer3> :)
<seb128> pitti, I think he was suggesting that for the sound one
<pitti> eww
<seb128> rickspencer3, ok, let's do that
<seb128> so we keep what we have now?
 * pitti clings to the sound checkbox
<pitti> [ ] Embarass me
<chrisccoulson> is that the german translation? ;)
<pitti> it's my mental translation
<rickspencer3> seb128, can we propose robert_ancell's gdm patch upstream and see if we can just pick it up in 10.10 in a sync?
<didrocks> rickspencer3: the previous gdmsetup patch is in upstream bugtracker for monthâ¦
<seb128> rickspencer3, the gdmsetup one?
<seb128> it's sitting there for one cycle
<seb128> they don't seem to be interested
<rickspencer3> seb128, yes
<rickspencer3> ok
<seb128> I think they don't invision it this way
<seb128> they want those options in the normal desktop config dialogs
<seb128> i.e the sound one would be a "set system default" in the sound capplet
<rickspencer3> seb128, ack
<rickspencer3> well, we should at least offer, I suppose
<seb128> we did
<rickspencer3> but that's for after April 15th
<rickspencer3> right now ..
<seb128> well gdmsetup is waiting for comments for a cycle
<tseliot> Riddell, Keybuk: my transition patch for kdm seems to work well and, even though it doesn't have a fade effect like gdm, it makes the transition much smoother. If it passes my local tests with failsafe X and Keybuk's plymouth branch, where can I commit my patch (until a new plymouth is uploaded)? Shall I create my own branch?
<Keybuk> is there any reason not to upload it now?
<Keybuk> there's nothing in my plymouth update that you need
<Keybuk> it will work with the current plymouth
<tseliot> Keybuk: well, deactivate + quit doesn't really work well and we do that for failsafe X
<tseliot> actually it works, in the sense that plymouth exits and the splash remains on the screen leaving the vt in KD_GRAPHICS mode, therefore you can't see failsafe X
<baptistemm> asac, hi
<tseliot> Keybuk: I've just noticed this commit: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~plymouth-dev/plymouth/trunk/revision/1169
<tseliot> Keybuk: shall I call reactivate and then quit?
<bigon> http://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=26394 << I think I'm hit by that bug on lucid :/
<ubottu> Freedesktop bug 26394 in Extensions/DRI "Server sometimes crashes when closing OpenGL programs" [Critical,New]
<tseliot> bigon: in #ubuntu-x maybe?
<Keybuk> tseliot: NO!
<bigon> tseliot: thx
<Keybuk> tseliot: deactivate + quit doesn't work well for gdm either
<Keybuk> tseliot: there's no reason to delay the kdm upload for the plymouth fix for that
<tseliot> Keybuk: even if it deliberately breaks failsafe X?
<Keybuk> tseliot: why hold off uploading kdm?
<tseliot> Keybuk: my question is the answer to your question, unless there's something that I'm missing
<Keybuk> tseliot: nothing about your patch changes
<Keybuk> if you upload it today, or next week
<Keybuk> if you upload it today, and I upload plymouth next week, you don't need to upload again
<Keybuk> so why not upload today?
<tseliot> Keybuk: yes, in this sense, you're right. There's no real dependency
<pitti> seb128: FYI, amd64 retracer crashed on an outdated linux crash (couldn't find the .ddeb for old kernel); fixed in bzr trunk
<seb128> pitti, thanks
<pitti> seb128: i386 just keeps crashing with a 500 Internal Server Error, I just untag the bug
<seb128> pitti, I noticed the error in the log but couldn't browse the bug
<seb128> we should try to change that at some stage
<seb128> not being able to browse those bugs in launchpad
<seb128> ok, thank you
<pitti> seb128: in fact, I just fixed another bug in trunk which might be responsible for this (although previous Launchpad versions were much more explicit about it)
<pitti> it sometimes tried to reassign an upstream task to a new package
<pitti> but anyway, /me merges to ubuntu, updates chroots, and let them go on
<seb128> pitti, thanks a lot
<superm1> pitti, tseliot mentioned he's working on a few changes to jockey's fglrx handler, and i had mentioned to him that there are a few commits from jockey trunk that should probably be cherry picked too for bugs that they are fixing in ubuntu (and marked as such)
<pitti> superm1: I know, I'm on them
<pitti> superm1: I want to fix one more bug, then I'll do a new upload
<superm1> pitti, cool.  i'm not sure where tseliot is on the fglrx handler changes. i didn't realize more was necessary other than s/xorg-driver-fglrx/fglrx/
<tseliot> superm1, pitti: yes, there is also something more that I need to do for nvidia
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, weird
<superm1> oh, nvidia? so is the fglrx handler ok then?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i built firefox with the cairo patch, and it looks even worse now :-/
<pitti> chrisccoulson: uh.. mind putting it into a PPA? might be worth asking slangasek to test it, since he's heavily affected by this
<chrisccoulson> i'll try and figure out why it's worse first
<pitti> ok
<chrisccoulson> it's not following my font settings at all
<tseliot> superm1: no, the fglrx handler is disabled while the nvidia still has a few problems
<tseliot> nvidia should work fine in most cases
<pitti> asac: do you know who is responsible for the mozilla-daily chromium-browser builds?
<ogra> pitti, fta i think
<pitti> ogra: thanks
<pitti> fta: any chance that we could stop the intrepid daily builds? at this point of intrepid's life cycle they are just wasting buildd power, I think; also, perhaps the jaunty ones could move to weekly?
<ronoc> pitti: just going to take a closer look at this mute bug - going to log in now to your machine if taht is okay
<rodrigo_> jono, heh, facebook doesn't like you neither? :D
<jono> rodrigo_, indeed
<jono> it seems we are hated by the might book right now
<rodrigo_> jono, I guess they've added some non-working, ultra-paranoid filter
<rodrigo_> jono, were you writing about telescopes also? :)
<pitti> ronoc: sure, go ahead
<ronoc> pitti: ta
<pitti> ronoc: applet is acting up again right now, if you want to peek into my session
<pitti> ronoc: oh, wait; I need a reboot, brb
<ronoc> ok cool
<jono> rodrigo_, haha
<jono> not telescope
<jono> telescopes
<jono> I may have been penalized for "over evangelizing" if anything, Guy Kawazaki had the same issue
<asac> pitti: yes. i agree that we can drop the intrepid builds. i think fta is fine with that. the real problem is that many ppa builders were down for a while this week as cr3 was out of office :)
<rodrigo_> jono, :)
<jono> rodrigo_, I guess we are officially "The Facebook Two"
<rodrigo_> jono, maybe an oportunity to write our own, yeah :D
<fta> pitti, asac: yep, no problem to drop intrepid. i wanted to do that once it's officially EOS, which is supposed to be soon (iirc)
<kwwii> asac: the awesome bar link color is fixed in the latest theme package
<jono> rodrigo_, hehe
<fta> pitti, asac: as for jaunty, it's possible to move it to weekly assuming some minor work on drobotik
<pitti> ronoc: I rebooted, but it's fine right now; Heisenbug
<ronoc> pitti: its an odd one alright. I cannot reproduce it here
<ronoc> on my 64bit or 32bit
<tseliot> pitti, Keybuk: I've uploaded my fix for bug #540177 (just FYI)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 540177 in kdebase-workspace "KDM needs plymouth transition patch" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/540177
<asac> kwwii: sorry. so that upstream bug is a non issue?
<asac> fta: jaunty - everyting to weekly (chromium/firefox etc.9?
<asac> that would be ok i think
<asac> or two per week
 * kenvandine -> lunch
<rickspencer3> bug #477226
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 477226 in linux "Sound simultaneously on headphones and speakers - Lenovo IdeaPad u350" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/477226
<seb128> chrisccoulson, didrocks: light-themes changes uploaded
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - awesome, thanks
<chrisccoulson> so, purple terminal again later :)
 * didrocks hugs seb128
<kwwii> asac: well, I fear this bug will make some web pages look bad but until it is tested I can't really know
<kwwii> asac: by monday we will know what it breaks or doesn't
<seb128> pitti, you can assign the appindicator bug to a contractor too, ie Nafai or jsmith
<pitti> seb128: for g-p-m?
<seb128> yes
<seb128> or any bug with those changes
<Nafai> Yeah, I can look at it today
<pitti> seb128: too late, I fixed it
<Nafai> or even better :)
<asac> kwwii: so you changed link color on web as well?
<asac> i see. lets keep the pressure up upstream
<pitti> it was simple, one minute to look at the code to understand the problem, 5 s to fix the patch, three minutes testing :)
<asac> kwwii: please dont post in that bug that all is ok now
<seb128> pitti, ok
<vuntz> :l
<seb128> hey vuntz
<rickspencer3> pitti, hi, when you get a chance, could you please look at bug #477226
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 477226 in linux "Sound simultaneously on headphones and speakers - Lenovo IdeaPad u350" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/477226
<rickspencer3> make a judgement if it is really an RC bug, and if so, perhaps see if TheMuso and/or crimsun might benefit from some assistance or what not?
<crimsun> ugh, there really has to be a better way than trawling through dozens of bug attachments for codec info
<crimsun> rickspencer3: I haven't even read that bug report until now
<nigelb> crimsun: tweak the hook?
<crimsun> nigelb: well, everything that we break ought into separate attachments via the hook is actually combined in upstream's script
<crimsun> break out*
<nigelb> crimsun: ah
<crimsun> rickspencer3: that bug is fixed upstream but requires a backport of the Conexant HDA codec (sound/pci/hda/patch_conexant.c) from linux-2.6.34
<crimsun> granted, half the people in that bug report are just saying "me, too" without providing any useful machine info
<chrisccoulson> pitti - are you in the release meeting too?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: yes
<chrisccoulson> ah, ok. i won't bother you for a little while then ;)
<rickspencer3> crimsun, do you think it's feasible to fix?
<rickspencer3> if it's too risky, just "won't fix" it for Lucid and we'll provide a PPA or something
<ronoc> pitti: i don't know what to do with this bug on your machine. I checked your dependencies and all seems fine
<pitti> ronoc: do you have more than one soundcard? it might be related to that? (although neither of them is muted)
<ronoc> pitti: it appears to be a regression of a bug in libindicate/indicator-sound re image loading that was 'fixed' a week ago
<pitti> ronoc: how does it decide which icon to show?
<pitti> same thing that determines the slider position?
<pitti> since if I just touch that by a bit, it starts working correctly
<ronoc> pitti: on my desktop I have an pci outboard and the usual intel on board
<ronoc> pitti, yes the volume should set the image aswell as the slider
<pitti> ronoc: can I run this in debug mode somehow? that it's verbose about which image it picks, and why?
<ronoc> pitti, when the indicator is ready fetches the volume, mute status and device availability
<ronoc> pitti
<ronoc> pitti: of course - the best thing is to install libindicator-tools
<ronoc> apt-get source indicator-sound
<ronoc> and the depends
<ronoc> make
<ronoc> the cd to the src dir
<ronoc> unload the indicators from the panel
<ronoc> killall indicator-sound-service
<ronoc> make sure there is no service running
<ronoc> then kick off your own from the src dir ./indicator-sound-service
<ronoc> pitti: then you need to run the .so in with the loader -
 * kenvandine wishes debugging indicators was a bit simpler :/
<pitti> ronoc: (sorry, I'm lagging; still in meeting)
<ronoc> pitti: /usr/lib/libindicator/indicator-loader src/.libs/libsoundmenu.so
<ronoc> pitti, np
<pitti> ronoc: "unload the indicators from the panel"?
<ronoc> pitti: right click - 'remove from panel'
<pitti> is that "killall indicator-applet"?
<pitti> ah, ok
<ronoc> pitti: or ^ :)
<ronoc> kenvandine: tell me about it :)
<pitti> althought that gives you the nice "do you want to restart?" dialog which you can use to restart the d-bus services underneath
<ronoc> pitti: but you don't want to do that do you? you want to run it manually and monitor trace ?
<pitti> ronoc: dpeends; is the bug in the -service or in indicator-applet process?
<pitti> ronoc: ok, I guess I need to do that exercise on Monday
<ronoc> pitti: will i think its in libindicator - if you can reproduce this with the loader then it is easy to fix from my end -
<ronoc> -i +e
<pitti> ronoc: problem is, if I restart the applet manually, it always works
<pitti> it only seems to go wrong during session star
<pitti> t
<pitti> ronoc: could the problem be that the indicator starts earlier than pulseaudio is ready?
<ronoc> pitti, yeah this is the exact same as before - no the indicator can handle pulseaudio not being around when starting or flapping
<ronoc> pitti: I have 64bit lucid on my desktop now - will try to reproduce this here (10 restarts so far no sign :(
<ronoc> very annoying bug
<ronoc> pitti, basically we changed the image loading code to handle the theming problems - now image loading is done via libindicator - imagehelper
<ronoc> pitti - so this is where this bug started to appear
<pitti> ronoc: well, it's not that the image looks broken or anything -- it's just the wrong one
<ronoc> pitti: its like the volume update never gets to update the image
<chrisccoulson> pitti - the cairo patch makes the firefox fonts worse due to bug 379761
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 379761 in fontconfig "MASTER - FF 3.5 font hinting does not honour gnome-settings" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/379761
<chrisccoulson> and they aren't just a little bit worse...
<pitti> chrisccoulson: hm, how did that work with the system cairo?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: (and didn't we have two cairo patches?)
<chrisccoulson> asac thinks the issue is that it's using 2 copies of cairo (the internal one, plus the system one which gtk links to)
<asac> yeah. i am quite sure because i did some deep digging on that
<asac> however, from the feedback i got most really complain about the lcd patch
<chrisccoulson> asac - do you mean they complain about the lack of the lcd patch?
<asac> yes
<asac> well. i never mangaed to explain to them that there are two bugs
<chrisccoulson> i think they would complain even more if they saw it with the lcd patch ;)
<asac> chrisccoulson: only thing we can know is to add the patch ... wait till our dailies pick it up and ask if its good now
<asac> chrisccoulson: hah. thats bad
<asac> chrisccoulson: so there is no hinting at all? i thought i used the fontconfig default hinting
<asac> rather than the gnome-setting
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, i'm not sure it's worth even doing that. the fonts are truly horriffic on my laptop since i applied the patch
<asac> chrisccoulson: have a screen of that?
<chrisccoulson> yeah, one second
<pitti> good night everyone
<ronoc> later pitti, will try to reproduce over the w.end
<ronoc> have a good one
<seb128_> 'night pitti
<chrisccoulson> asac - http://people.canonical.com/~chrisccoulson/Screenshot-Bug%20%23379761%20in%20firefox%20%28Ubuntu%29:%20%E2%80%9CMASTER%20-%20FF%203.5%20font%20hinting%20does%20not%20honour%20gnome-settings%E2%80%9D%20-%20Mozilla%20Firefox.png
<chrisccoulson> oops
<chrisccoulson> should have shortened the link
<asac> chrisccoulson: can you fix it in fontconfig?
<chrisccoulson> i'm not sure if i know enough about fontconfig to do that yet ;)
<asac> chrisccoulson: http://paste.ubuntu.com/
<asac> chrisccoulson: use that for .fonts.conf
<asac> then restart ffox
<chrisccoulson> asac - did you mean to post a link with some content? ;)
<asac> chrisccoulson: oh
<asac> chrisccoulson: pastebin claimed its "insecure content" and refused to submit it ;)
<asac> chrisccoulson: here it is: http://paste.ubuntu.com/401941/
<asac> it starts with <?xml ...
<asac> ;)
<asac> the rest was to trick paste.ubuntu.com
<chrisccoulson> ok, just trying now
<asac> chrisccoulson: if that isnt good, try hintfull rather than slight
<chrisccoulson> asac - hintslight doesn't make much difference, but hintfull seems to make the fonts look better, but very skinny
<asac> chrisccoulson: yes so for you it seems that our default in ubuntu is wrong
<asac> i wanted to go to hintfull in general, but got pushback
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, but now is probably not a good time to change that
 * ccheney wanders off to find lunch, bbs
<chrisccoulson> asac - hintmedium seems to be a reasonable compromise
<asac> chrisccoulson: yes. problem is that depends on the font you are using and the screen. there is no golden rule unfortunately
<chrisccoulson> asac - i'm slightly confused about how all the different font components fit together (eg, fontconfig, freetype etc)
<asac> chrisccoulson: its a mess ;)
<chrisccoulson> you seem to be quite knowledgeable about fonts ;)
<asac> chrisccoulson: yes, i ended up in that trap at some point ;)
<mdeslaur> chrisccoulson: the screenshot you just pasted does not have a working lcd filtering patch
<chrisccoulson> and also why changing .fonts.conf changes firefox but not anything else ;)
<asac> chrisccoulson: right. thats becase gnome-settings win over fontconfig
<chrisccoulson> mdeslaur, i'm just about to try yours
<asac> the only solution is to make gnome frontend to configure using fonts.conf
<chrisccoulson> ah, ok, that makes more sense
<chrisccoulson> so, g-s-d is setting X properties which are picked up by gtk isn' it?
<asac> there was some effort in the past, but thats difficult
<asac> chrisccoulson: yes. but thats not optimal. problem is that different fonts have different perfect settings on different dpi
<asac> so chinese fonts often dont need same hinting as latin fonts etc.
<chrisccoulson> ah, ok
<chrisccoulson> and i assume that fontconfig is more flexible here?
<asac> one solution is to add a virtual config for fontconfig imo
<asac> that loads the xsettings at level 50
<asac> and then make cairo only obey fontconfig
<asac> in that way we could overload the xsettings for special fonts still
<asac> so e.g. /etc/fonts.d/50-x-settings.conf
<jjardon>  Hello, Could somebody take a look to this bug: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gtk-doc/+bug/526794
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 526794 in gtk-doc "Please sync gtk-doc-tools from debian stable/unstable main" [Undecided,New]
<jjardon> I have installed 1.11 in my lucid, but 1.13 seems to be available in launchpad
<jjardon> strange
<mdeslaur> jjardon: it FTBFS: E: Couldn't find package highlight
<jjardon> mdeslaur, install highlight
<jjardon> here the version is 1.13: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/lucid/+source/gtk-doc
<mdeslaur> jjardon: gtk-doc depends on highlight, and highlight is in universe, so it failed to build
<jjardon> am
<jjardon> I see the problem now, how can be this fixed? (gtk-doc is part of GNOME release)
<james_w> either highlight should be approved for main, or gtk-doc should be changed to disable highlighting again
<mdeslaur> jjardon: it's probably too late for lucid, but you could either see if gtk-doc can be built without highlight, or get highlight approved for main with a MIR
 * jjardon checkin gtk-doc code
<didrocks> time to enjoy the week-end. See you everyone :)
<jjardon> gtk-doc can be compiled without  highlight installed
<jjardon> you only need vim
<chrisccoulson> have a good weekend didrocks
<jjardon> mdeslaur, should I file a bug?
<mdeslaur> jjardon: you need to file a FFe if you want it to go in lucid
<jjardon> mdeslaur, Could you point me to some documentation to how make that?
<mdeslaur> jjardon: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess and then https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SponsorshipProcess
<jjardon> mdeslaur, thank you
<seb128> there is no need of a ffe to fix a source not building
<mdeslaur> oh, cool, I wasn't 100% sure on that point
<mdeslaur> jjardon: ^
<seb128> it's rather a rc bug to have the lucid version not building
<jjardon> seb128, sorry, Should I have to do "anything" then? ;) I already filled this bug: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gtk-doc/+bug/526794
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 526794 in gtk-doc "Please sync gtk-doc-tools from debian stable/unstable main" [Undecided,Fix released]
<jjardon> oh, seems to be fixed
<jjardon> thanks james_w ;)
<seb128> jjardon, we have the new version for weeks, it didn't build because highlight is in universe
<seb128> we either need to make it build without it
<seb128> or get highlight promoted in lucid
<jjardon> seb128, I don't have highlight in my machine and I can compile gtk-doc without problems (no extra option passed)
<seb128> so somebody needs to open a bug on the debian bts about dropping the build-depends
<jjardon> seb128, git version here, maybe the requirement was relaxed in some commit
<seb128> so we need to backport this commit
<seb128> http://packages.qa.debian.org/g/gtk-doc/news/20100114T092125Z.html
<seb128> "Enable syntax highlighting for source code."
<seb128> guess that's the reason
<jjardon> viewing configure.ac, you can enable it with a recent version of vim
<jjardon> seb128, http://git.gnome.org/browse/gtk-doc/tree/configure.ac#n99
<seb128> we either need to turn that off or see if we can get it to build without universe components
<jjardon> seb128, I tried here: if you don't have vim ot highligh instaled, you still can make ./autogen.sh && make without any problems (autotools auto disable the feature)
<seb128> right
<chrisccoulson> excellent, my gf has gone out for the evening. time for me to order some unhealthy food
<seb128> chrisccoulson, lol
<mdeslaur> lol
<mvo> *yumm*
<seb128> jjardon, the build-depends is probably no required
<seb128> mvo, it's probably not vegetarian food either :p
<mvo> french fries, very unhealty, still yummy :)
<seb128> ;-)
 * seb128 hugs mvo
 * mvo hugs seb128
<fta> could someone have a look at bug 539246?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 539246 in chromium-browser "chromium renders as a dialog under UNE" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/539246
<jjardon> have to go, thank you for your support :)
<kenvandine> my laptop is seriously about to start smoking
<kenvandine> gwibber has my CPU pegged... and trying to debug :)
<bencc> where can I report a bug in gedit?
<kenvandine> bencc, run "ubuntu-bug gedit"
<bencc> kenvandine: didn't know about that. thanks
<kenvandine> bencc, np... thanks for filing bugs!
<Nafai> hrm, gwibber doesn't seem to be posting
<Nafai> kenvandine: any logs or such I should look at?
<kenvandine>  ~/.cache/gwibber/gwibber.log
<kenvandine> Nafai, i heading out right now though... but should be around later tonight if you want me to look
<kenvandine> or file a bug
<Nafai> sure thing, thanks
<kenvandine> hopefully it will be obvious :)
<Nafai> yeah
<Nafai> kenvandine: Simple, for some reason friendfeed was selected as the only one to send messages, instead of Twitter :)
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-03-27
<kenvandine> Nafai, and friendfeed was failing to post?
<kenvandine> Nafai, pleaes file a bug about that, or a patch/branch :-D
<Nafai> Sure thing, I'll take care of that tomorrow.  Got some honey do's to take care of :)
<Nafai> Patch to this branch? https://code.launchpad.net/~gwibber-committers/gwibber/trunk
<kenvandine> yup
<kenvandine> thx Nafai!
<Nafai> np
<renud1988> anyone who would be interested in mentoring "truely system wide proxy"
<AnAnt> Hello, I think there is a problem with the latest gdm upload
<AnAnt> it doesn't respect the theme settings in /var/lib/gdm/.gconf.defaults/%gconf-tree.xml
<didrocks> AnAnt: .gconf.path has an higher priority than /var/lib/gdm/.gconf.defaults, you should check the path there (/var/lib/gdm/.gconf.defaults/.gconf.path)
<didrocks> AnAnt: gdm user changes should be rather in /var/lib/gdm/.gconf/
<AnAnt> didrocks: how ?
<didrocks> AnAnt: how what?, look at /usr/share/gconf/default.path to see what's the priority order
<AnAnt> didrocks: I mean, I am making a package that dpkg-diverts /var/lib/gdm/.gconf.defaults/%gconf-tree.xml, and installed another one instead of it, and that worked in karmic
<didrocks> AnAnt: right, but we fixed the bad behavior (~gdm/.gconf was ignored by distro changes)
<didrocks> AnAnt: so, the behavior now is the good one, see /var/lib/gdm/.gconf.defaults/.gconf.path:
<didrocks> sorry /var/lib/gdm/.gconf.path
<didrocks> AnAnt: you have $(HOME)/.gconf.defaults, then $(HOME)/.gconf and then the mandatory settings
<didrocks> AnAnt: that means if the user doesn't have anything in $(HOME)/.gconf, $(HOME)/.gconf.default should be the default
<didrocks> (it is on my machine, I still have our default for Ubuntu)
<AnAnt> ah, so what my package does is still valid, provided that there are no user overrides in /var/lib/gdm/.gconf, right ?
<didrocks> AnAnt: exactly, in fact, it's just fixing a bug where user couldn't tweak their own value without making things clutter :)
<AnAnt> thanks
<didrocks> you're welcome
<AnAnt> didrocks: worked, thanks
<didrocks> AnAnt: sweet ;)
#ubuntu-desktop 2010-03-28
<Sarvatt> ok got a weird bug some people are hitting that I need to pick some brains on. On intel hardware gnome-terminal seems to be corrupting the screen sometimes. In my case it blacks out most of the screen except for a gnome-panel and moving the mouse up to the panel brings everything back. it usually happens when i'm using pageup or pagedown in nano, and it started back in the timeframe that the CSD stuff was added. back then xchat would do it
<Sarvatt>  too when I scrolled, but that doesn't happen anymore since the CSD stuff was backed out. anyone know where to start looking? :)
<lifeless> there is an open bug
<lifeless> screen corruption
<lifeless> seems to be fixed in lucid, for me at least.
<rickspencer3> Nafai, hi
<ccheney> it seems like the next version of OOo won't be ready in time for M
 * ccheney is checking to see if his view is correct in that it won't come out until sometime after august
<ccheney> we might just have to stick with 3.2.1 :-\
<TheMuso> Good morning.
<RAOF> Gooood morning all.
<TheMuso> Hey RAOF. How was your weekend?
<RAOF> TheMuso: Pretty cruisy.
<RAOF> Preparations for moving to Tassie move inexorably onward.
<TheMuso> RAOF: nice
<RAOF> We had our first (and hopfully last, given the interest) inspection of the flat by prospective tennants.
<RAOF> And there was time for just some hanging around, too. :)
<RAOF> How 'bout yours?
<ajmitch> RAOF: you're moving south again?
<RAOF> ajmitch: Yah.  Hobart's too awesome :)
<RAOF> And Sydney's too hot and big and noisy and crazy.
<ajmitch> At least it'd be cheaper...
<TheMuso> RAOF: pretty cruisy as well.
<RAOF> ajmitch: Right.  The fact that we can buy a 3 bedroom house in an awesome location for about the same as we could buy a 2 bedroom apartment on the intersection of the Pacific Highway and Lane Cove road in the building that fell into the Lane Cove tunnel does have something to do with it :)
<RAOF> Man, who has a 2048x1536 screen attached via VGA?
<ajmitch> I would have thought you'd need DVI for that
<RAOF> I think you'd certainly *want* DVI for that; analog noise is surely starting to kick in at those frequencies.
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-03-21
<RAOF> robert_ancell: Yo yo!  I know you've got a r600+ radeon card - have you noticed rendering problems in unity recently - the title bar being mostly-invisible, only the shadows of notify-osd showing?
<robert_ancell> RAOF, sure have
<RAOF> Any idea when they started?
<robert_ancell> a week or two ago?
<RAOF> Hah.  And it's unity only, right?
<robert_ancell> I haven't tried anything else, but my guess would be yes
 * RAOF has just tried classic + compiz, and that works.
<RAOF> Right.  So, there's a problem.
<robert_ancell> the window title one is the particular one I've noticed, occurs when opening new windows, clicking the top of the screen seems to redraw it right
<TheMuso> Yay! Multi-arch breaks unity builds, due to a dbus header file being in a different place. :)
<RAOF> TheMuso: I think that's fixed with the most recent dbus upload?
<TheMuso> RAOF: Will check, but I updated this morning...
<RAOF> It was post-this-morning.
<TheMuso> Ok hasn't come through yet.
 * TheMuso updates his local mirror...
<TheMuso> Anyway, have symlinked the file for now, so things work again.
<RAOF> Ok.  Unity's doing something screwy with transparency it seems.
<RAOF> Urgh.  What's annoyingly worse is that mesa master explodes into a thousand shards.
<TheMuso> heh
<bcurtiswx> is the Ubuntu font still UbuntuBeta?
<IanLiu> I have fixed a bitesize bug, but I'm having troubles pushing it. I'm following the instructions from http://unity.ubuntu.com/getinvolved/#coding . Any tips?
<IanLiu> The command I'm executing is "bzr push lp:ian-liu88/unity-place-applications/fix-for-bug-736471"
<stgraber> you seem to be missing a ~
<stgraber> try with: bzr push lp:~ian-liu88/unity-place/applications/fix-for-bug-736471
<stgraber> or rather: bzr push lp:~ian-liu88/unity-place-applications/fix-for-bug-736471
<IanLiu> stgraber: I will try, thanks!
<IanLiu> stgraber: it worked ;-)
<IanLiu> The "Getting Involved" also mentions to "Propose a Merge". I've found the Merge proposal form, but I'm having some doubts on how to use it. Is the "Target branch" my new branch?
<RAOF> HAH!
<RAOF> robert_ancell: Would you be a dear and go to compizconfig settings managerâBlur Windows and disable âalpha blurâ?  I suspect that will resolve the graphical glitches.
<RAOF> robert_ancell: No rush, just when there's an appropriate context switch.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, hmm, blur windows appeared to be disabled
<RAOF> Oh.
<RAOF> I wonder why it is enabled here.  Have I enabled it locally, I wonder?
<RAOF> Well, that's annoying.  âunity --resetâ doesn't re-enable blur.
<micahg> robert_ancell: are you planning to arrange a release exception for webkit 1.4.0?
<robert_ancell> micahg, is it released yet?
<micahg> robert_ancell: no, but I'm told it
<micahg> s coming with GNOME 3
<robert_ancell> Yes, as soon as it's released will do the paperwork
 * micahg wanted to make sure it's on the release team's radar since it'll be a very last minute update
<micahg> which reminds me, I need to get a microrelease exception for webkit, but I'll do that later
<micahg> robert_ancell: thanks
<robert_ancell> micahg, np, it will be nice when we have the release..
<micahg> robert_ancell: indeed, unfortunately, kov couldn't commit to no ABI/API breaks, but said there were none planned
<micahg> at least webkit looks like it's taken care of, now I need to worry about getting xul-1.9.2 dropped :-/
<LLStarks> raof, is blur default now?
<RAOF> LLStarks: No, it isn't.
<LLStarks> the blur appears quite spotty under the expo
<chrisccoulson> wow, am i the first one awake in europe for a change?
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<TheMuso> chrisccoulson: Seems so.
<pitti> Good morning
<pitti> bryceh: I think we should use the last "path: error: .*" line of DKMSBuildLog.txt for this?
 * pitti sighs -- unity hasn't crashed for two weeks, and with the last update it all went horribly unstable again :/
<TheMuso> pitti: Yeah, trying to test some merged in branches with nux/unity today and have had a horror of a time.
 * TheMuso realized that he didn't try unity trunk...
 * TheMuso goes and builds.
<chrisccoulson> good morning pitti
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson
<pitti> how are you?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i'm good thanks, although a little tired. how are you?
<pitti> I'm fine, we had a nice weekend
<pitti> chrisccoulson: woke up too early again?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, my daugher woke several times during the night, and i thought that would mean she would sleep in ;)
<chrisccoulson> but she woke up at the usual time
<TheMuso> Well well well, with a branch of some a11y signal fixes for nux, we finally have a somewhat accessible launcher. :)
<TheMuso> No quicklists yet, but I can navigate the launcher with orca and hear the application names, and launch them. :)
<RAOF> Sounds like an important milestone!  Rockin!
<TheMuso> Yeah, it certainly is. I am now going to take some time tomorrow to move my primary work environment to unity.
<TheMuso> I'll just put all the most commonly used aps on the launcher, and launch everything else from a nautilus window/a terminal for now.
<RAOF> alt-f2 isn't a11ied?
<TheMuso> No, and the dash isn't yet either, tahts more work.
<TheMuso> Next cycle I'd say.
<RAOF> Eep.
<pitti> TheMuso: nice to hear about the progress there! do you think this should change the current plan of defaulting to 2d if a11y is enabled?
<pitti> ah, ok
<pitti> so seems not
<RAOF> Incidentally, how's gnome-do on the a11y front, and how can I test it?
<TheMuso> pitti: No, unless you are willing to put up with the missing bits, productivity would be severely crippled for anyone not willing to work around things.
<TheMuso> RAOF: Don't know, never tried it.
<pitti> TheMuso: right
<TheMuso> So yeah, default to GNOME for some a11y profiles.
<RAOF> It's made of custom GTK stuff, so I'm not sure whether it's inherited the default GTK a11y.
<TheMuso> RAOF: The easiest way to see if its likely to be accessible is to run accerciser, and look at the application accessibility hierarchy.
 * RAOF adds that to his todo.
<didrocks> good morning
<RAOF> OMG it's didrocks!
<didrocks> RAOF: run run ;)
<pitti> bonjour didrocks, ca va? had a nice long weekend?
<didrocks> pitti: Guten Morgen pitti. yeah, I'm fine, the week-end was nice (even if not enough snow to ski). You?
<TheMuso> pitti: And, I think I might want to switch back to the standard gtk window decorator for accessibility profiles as well, because the unity window decorator window switcher is not accessible, even though it is derived from the gtk window decorator codebase...
<TheMuso> Unless bug 724093 gets fixed soon.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 724093 in compiz "unity-window-decorator: When switching between windows, Orca does not speak the title of the focused window." [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/724093
<TheMuso> grrr another unity window decorator crash...
 * RAOF builds from nux trunk so opening the dash isn't a compiz death sentence.
<TheMuso> COmpiz 0.9 still feels raw to me.
<chrisccoulson> it does for me too
<chrisccoulson> it keeps locking up whilst i'm not at my machine
<chrisccoulson> i was going to blame RAOF because i thought X was locking up, but it's actually compiz ;)
<RAOF> I'll let you in on a secret: it's entirely possible that's the fault of the X stack ;)
<chrisccoulson> lol
<chrisccoulson> RAOF, it does start working again if I kill -9 compiz and start metacity
<RAOF> Ah.
<chrisccoulson> but often, restarting compiz will just make it crash until i reboot
<RAOF> Then I don't think that's the X stack's fault.
<RAOF> The typical âX causes compiz to lockupâ would be a pageflipping snafu where compiz is sitting around in D state waiting for the swap to complete.
<fta2> pitti, http://people.ubuntu.com/~fta/apport-kernel.png
<pitti> fta2: heh, fun -- that looks like a bug in the kernel package hook; how did you get to this?
<pitti> i. e. was it the first question?
<pitti> (and is this natty?)
<fta2> pitti, no, one of the last, if not the last
<fta2> natty
<pitti> what did you answer?
<fta2> default
<fta2> when i filed bug 736667
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 736667 in linux "P5Q-PRO kernel OOPs: NETDEV WATCHDOG: eth0 (ATL1E): transmit queue 0 timed out" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/736667
<pitti> hm, doesn't happen here :/
<duanedesign> I hade that happen to me
<pitti> fta2: do you get the same empty question with "DISPLAY= ubuntu-bug linux"? (that will use the CLI frontend)
<duanedesign> fwiw :)
<fta2> pitti, I had a valid DISPLAY at that time
<pitti> fta2: I know
<pitti> fta2: I just wonder if that's some bug in the GTK UI or in the hook
<pitti> fta2: it could also be weird characters which the dialog fails to render
<fta2> in cli, it seems ok
<pitti> fta2: can you pastebin the entire dialog?
<duanedesign> pitti: here is what i got. http://paste.ubuntu.com/583232/
<pitti> duanedesign: do you know which of the questions you got an empty dialog for?
<fta2> pitti, as i said, iirc, it was the last one, before the apport UI with the summary
<pitti> fta2: the "Testing the upstream kernel can help isolate issues.."?
<fta2> i think i saw that one
<fta2> but that was friday..
<fta2> is the retracer dead?
<rodrigo_> morning
<duanedesign> hello rodrigo_
<rodrigo_> hi duanedesign
<pitti> hey rodrigo_, bonjour seb128
<seb128> hey pitti
<seb128> how are you?
<rodrigo_> hi pitti, seb128
<pitti> seb128: I'm great, thanks! nice and sunny weekend
<seb128> same here ;-)
<seb128> hum, GNOME guys are thinking to switch their tarballs to tar.xz
<seb128> is soyuz handling the format?
<pitti> seb128: I don't know; worth checking in a PPA, I guess
<fta2> pitti, is the retracer dead? (been waiting for 2h+ for a retrace)
<pitti> fta2: possibly, let me check
<pitti> fta2: yep, will fix in a bit
<fta2> thanks
<pitti> fta2: restarted (udev failed to upgrade in the chroots)
<duanedesign> pitti: was able to reproduce the problem. Itwas after the window asking to test newer kernel versions.
<duanedesign> pitti: strange. I can not reproduce it by running:  ubuntu-bug linux
<duanedesign> it has to be triggered by a kernel issue
<chrisccoulson> pitti, swt-gtk 3.6.2 has webkit support
<pitti> chrisccoulson: wohooo!
<chrisccoulson> i'm just testing that this morning
<chrisccoulson> perhaps that's worth a FFe if i can get it to work ;)
<seb128> pitti, if you have some time and want to review https://code.launchpad.net/~vorlon/glib/multiarch/+merge/54143 that would be appreciated
<seb128> well extra eyes on that are welcome
<pitti> seb128: I don't know much about it either, I guess we should just build and test it locally?
<seb128> pitti, don't bother much that was in case you had some opinions or comment about it
<pitti> seb128: I looked at it, but nothing that jumps out on me
<seb128> ok, same here
<pitti> quite ugly, though
<seb128> I guess slangasek tested it and it doesn't break glib
<pitti> (this cries for more abstraction/automation)
<seb128> so let's go for it and see if things break
<pitti> seb128: gio modules are mainly gvfs, I take it? I. e. URLs like gphoto:// or ssh:// ?
<seb128> gvfs uri handling for gio yes and dconf
<seb128> those are the obvious ones
<pitti> seb128: want me to test it with gphoto? or are you already?
<seb128> unity has some magic has well for application running and matching but I'm not sure how to test those, they improve reliability for some cases that's not technically required
<seb128> pitti, if you want to do it feel free
<pitti> I guess that requires changes to gvfs as well, then, as it ships /usr/lib/gio bits/
<pitti> ?
<seb128> I'm about to go for lunch, I will build glib and test when I'm back
<pitti> seb128: can do in a bit (still busy with something)
<pitti> seb128: ok, sounds good; will build it in the background
<seb128> pitti, right, it seems we will need patches for everything installing a .so in that dir
<seb128> pitti, well slangasek added a fallback to read the old dir so technical that will not break
<seb128> but still
<pitti> seb128: ah, his latest changelog says "include /usr/lib/gio/modules as a fallback directory for compatibility"
<pitti> right
<seb128> do you know when that will land in Debian? seems that will add some extra delta otherwise
<pitti> so, testing then
<pitti> I don't
<pitti> I think we are trailblazing here
<seb128> ok, I will chat with steve when he's online
<pitti> but the dpkg/apt/debhelper stuff is all in (or at least in git)
<pitti> it hasn't been officially announced in Debian yet
<seb128> ok
<seb128> is anybody there on 10.10?
<pitti> 10.10, what's that?
<pitti> (SCNR)
<serious__sam> yes
<seb128> could you check if exec like in evolution-alarm-notify.desktop there?
<seb128> it's in /etc/xdg/autostart
<seb128> is the version 2.28 or 2.30 in the url?
<seb128> ok, lunch time, I will read the scrollbar when I' back
<seb128> be back in a bit
<fta2> pitti, still no retrace...
<pitti> fta2: they are running now; they have some catch-up to do since they were down over the weekend
<fta2> ok
<dobey> pitti, seb128, kenvandine, mterry: anyone care to sponsor https://code.launchpad.net/~dobey/ubuntu/natty/ubuntuone-control-panel/release-0-9-2/+merge/54081 please? :)
<seb128> dobey, can do, I'm patch pilot today
<dobey> seb128: ok great. thanks!
<mterry> seb128, you are?  sponsor https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libgda4/+bug/722079 too please!  :)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 722079 in libgda4 "When installing Anjuta in Natty Alpha libsqlite3.so is missing" [Low,Triaged]
<seb128> mterry, that one should be in the desktop set?
<seb128> hey mterry
<mterry> seb128, srsly?  main won't have anything left!
<seb128> lol
<seb128> it's a GNOME lib...
<mterry> k, will ping cjwatson
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> dobey, btw ubuntuone-client-gnome ship libubuntuone.a and .la in the g-s-d directory, would be nice to clean
<seb128> mterry, how are you btw? had a nice weekend?
<dobey> seb128: oh right. i'll look into rming those as well
<seb128> dobey, thanks
<rickspencer3> chrisccoulson, hey, around at all?
<seb128> didrocks, there is a new zg in debian if you want to sync it
<chrisccoulson> rickspencer3, yep
<seb128> hey rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> hi chrisccoulson, hi seb128
<chrisccoulson> hi :)
<rickspencer3> so, flash is really really crashy on my desktop
<rickspencer3> are other folks reporting bugs on this?
<rickspencer3> it also seems to be playing video better, though
<chrisccoulson> rickspencer3, yeah. are you on amd64 or i386?
<didrocks> seb128: if you have time/want to go for it, do not hesitate, I'll go for it over the week otherwise :)
<seb128> didrocks, well it's just a sync, I can do it ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: thanks :)
<mterry> seb128, yeah, it was fine.  I've been a little under the weather though
<rickspencer3> chrisccoulson, i386
<chrisccoulson> rickspencer3, it doesn't give you the option of submitting a crash report does it?
<rickspencer3> chrisccoulson, no
<chrisccoulson> in any case, when i saw flash crashing, the backtrace was just full of flash :(
<chrisccoulson> which means it needs to go to adobe really ;)
<rickspencer3> yeah, I figured it was all in upstream binary goo
<chrisccoulson> there's not much we can do about crashes in the flash plugin, other than hope they fix it (or point to a problem in firefox)
<kamstrup> seb128, didrocks: if you're talking zeitgeist 0.7.1 then I think that's a pretty safe bet. There are only slight tweaks in the Python client API (which we don't use) and then a very slight sql tweak to make it forward compatible with the upcoming 0.8 (which we'll prolly have for Oneiric, so forward compat is nice)
<seb128> kamstrup, ok thanks
<chrisccoulson> rickspencer3, i need to figure out why crash reporting is broken though. i guess it's the same bug that breaks it in chromium too
<rickspencer3> chrisccoulson, ok, I was checking to see if I was the only one
<chrisccoulson> rickspencer3, no, we seem to get quite a lot of reports recently
<rickspencer3> ok
<chrisccoulson> rickspencer3, it might be worth attaching gdb to the plugin-container process before it crashes though, just to make sure it is in the flash plugin
<chrisccoulson> i'm on amd64 here, so i can't do that
<tedg> seb128, You might consider backporting this to Maverick (thought it'd be in appmenu-gtk there) bug 717162
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 717162 in libdbusmenu "quodlibet UI freeze in Unity after accessing its menu" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/717162
<chrisccoulson> i get the wonders and joys of nspluginwrapper instead
<rickspencer3> chrisccoulson, sounds like a good afternoon project for me
<rickspencer3> will do
<chrisccoulson> thanks
<seb128> tedg, yeah, I doubt the indicator-appmenu is used a lot in 10.10 but seems worth backporting still
<tedg> seb128, I used it ;-)
<tedg> seb128, It'd be in use by anyone using netbook edition.
<seb128> right
 * tedg reminisces about the olden days when Ubuntu had editions
<dobey> when the web was the real web, and small furry creatures from alpha centauri were real small furry creatures from alpha centauri
<kenvandine> ugh, that is annoying... every time i open a document in LO i get an ubuntuone notification that it is uploading a .lock file
<kenvandine> and then when i quit i get it again
<kenvandine> that might be annoying enough to make me turn off syncing of my Documents dir
<seb128> not sure why syncdaemon needs to tell you it's uploading using a notification bubble to start with
<seb128> it's annoying in quite some situations
<kenvandine> yeah
<seb128> it's not because you triage things and clean a bit that you want to get notified every time you store a change
<seb128> or delete a file
<seb128> or move one
<kenvandine> i can see notifying for new shares, etc
<tedg> seb128, Because people don't trust the syncdaemon as it's been flaky.  So they associate not having trust with needing more information.
<seb128> notify-osd is not informations, it's spam ;-)
<kenvandine> hehe
<kenvandine> i guess it would spam me on every auto-save too
<tedg> On man's spam is another man's miracle meat.
<seb128> just give an obvious way to open the control panel to see what's going on
<kenvandine> yum, spam
<dobey> kenvandine: hrmm. the lock files should just be ignored
<kenvandine> dobey, well how should u1 decide what to hide?
<dobey> kenvandine: there is a blacklist in the code, to ignore certain file patterns. like vim swp files
<kenvandine> i would think .lock would be included :)
<dobey> yeah i thought it was
<kenvandine>  .~lock.MoM 2011-03-01.odt#
<kenvandine> whacky filename
<dobey> actually, it would be neat if .lock files were handled by not syncing them, and locking changes to the associated file, on the server
<kenvandine> indeed
<dobey> so that other changes don't happen elsewhere while you're editing something
<dobey> oh, well, .~lock is probably not ignored yet :)
<dobey> wonder why it has the ~
 * ari-tczew checks interesting merges available for natty.
<pitti> didrocks: hey
<pitti> didrocks: I have some time now to tackle bug 723782
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 723782 in gnome-session "Finalize gnome-session fallback detection" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/723782
<pitti> didrocks: I can backport and test that d-bus session name property now
<didrocks> pitti: oh, I should have warned you last week that with latest loicm's change, it's not needed anymore
<pitti> didrocks: you actually told me it's not necessary any more, but the bug is still open, so that's what I wanted to discuss with you now :)
<didrocks> pitti: if we keep the checks in compiz and in the helper tool in sync
<didrocks> which is the case right now :)
<didrocks> hope that we can keep it like that
<pitti> didrocks: so is it totally obsolete, or we can work around it, or would it still be useful then?
<pitti> IOW, should we just close the bug, or would having it be an enhancement?
<didrocks> pitti: I *think* we should close it and avoid adding a big regression right now. Then, testing to ensure that we don't drop the user on some corner cases in a "no panel" session is needed
<didrocks> (which means, compositor, but no panel)
<didrocks> that can be ensure by keeping the testing tool opengl tests in unity_support_tool and the test from the start in the unity plugin initialization in sync
<pitti> didrocks: i. e. with the dbus property we wouldn't need to duplicate the code and run the tests twice?
<didrocks> pitti: the tests will be run twice anyway, as it seems some people try to run unity even if it's not supported (with the "unity") command
<didrocks> pitti: so, a test rather than a crash is in order at unity startup :)
<pitti> didrocks: as long as this test gets reasonably cheap..
<pitti> didrocks: anyway, so I'll close the bug then, to get it off the radar?
<tedg> pitti, seb128, So are you guys planning on taking the upower and gpm patches here?  It doesn't make sense to take the indicator-session one without those.
<tedg> bug 578542
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 578542 in gnome-power-manager "resuming from S3 wrongly prompts for password" [Low,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/578542
<didrocks> pitti: yes, please :)
<didrocks> pitti: the tests are cheaps, it's reading in an array
<didrocks> pitti: and the array is initialized once opengl is initialized
<pitti> tedg: looking
<tedg> pitti, seb128, Some helpful discussion on them: http://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/devkit-devel/2011-March/date.html
<Amaranth> didrocks: what tests are you doing?
<didrocks> Amaranth: look at unity_support_tool
<Amaranth> didrocks: initializing GL and checking for supported extensions isn't all that cheap
<pitti> tedg: ah, "Adding an argument to Sleeping signal"?
<Amaranth> didrocks: Oh, that doesn't segfault anymore? :)
<tedg> pitti, Yup
<Amaranth> didrocks: I don't seem to have a unity_support_tool anymore, didn't nux ship that?
<pitti> tedg: will have a look and discuss with hughsie; as this changes the d-bus API, I won't apply it in Debian/Ubuntu only
<tedg> pitti, Okay, it seems like he approves on the mailing list.
<tedg> pitti, But good to double check.
<tedg> I think that it's solving it in the right way.
<tedg> Though, it seems that gss should listen for the signal not gpm.  But, that's a minor optimization :-)
<didrocks> Amaranth: /usr/lib/nux/unity_support_test
<didrocks> Amaranth: talk to jay, he told that checking the extensions wasn't more expensive once opengl is activated. I think he knows a little on opengl so that I can trust him
<seb128> tedg, seems a pitti thing, I will let him handle it
<Amaranth> didrocks: Oh, sure, checking extensions is free once opengl is initialized
<Amaranth> hrm, I seem to be stuck in a situation that makes compiz crash without triggering an apport dialog
<Amaranth> weird, and it just stopped doing that
<seb128> rodrigo_, hey
<rodrigo_> hey seb128! :)
<seb128> rodrigo_, so one frequent issue users get in nautilus is that they right click on a directory, do open with and pick an application and associate the folder mimetype with the software they used
<seb128> rodrigo_, we used the patch from https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=637264 to make less easy to run into the issue
<ubot2> Gnome bug 637264 in File and Folder Operations "The 'Remember this application for ..." option changes the default for both files and folders" [Normal,Resolved: obsolete]
 * rodrigo_ looks
<seb128> rodrigo_, that's sort of a workaround though (just toggle the default value), the issue is fixed in GNOME3 as well, cosimoc said he would welcome a 2.32 patch that hides the checkbox for directories though
<seb128> rodrigo_, do you think you could work on that?
<rodrigo_> ok
<rodrigo_> is there a LP bug for it?
<seb128> rodrigo_, bug #662194
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 662194 in nautilus "Nautilus: 'Remember this application for ..." option should be made inactive by default" [Low,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/662194
<rodrigo_> ok
<seb128> rodrigo_, I've reopened and assigned it to you
<seb128> rodrigo_, thanks
<rodrigo_> ok thanks
<seb128> rodrigo_, thank you! ;-)
<jcastro> bugs with GNOME3 from the PPA should be filed on  ... ?
<rodrigo_> jcastro, good question :)
<jcastro> aha, I knew I would stump someone
<seb128> jcastro, they should not be filed ;-)
<davmor2> jcastro: bugzilla gnome of course :D
<seb128> jcastro, there is no ppa bug tracker
<rodrigo_> so far, people have been sending mail to me directly
<jcastro> right
<seb128> jcastro, code issues should be filed upstream , packaging ones mentioned here
<jcastro> and the mailing list looks like lp build announcements
<jcastro> maybe just using the mailing list? I mean, it's there already
<jcastro> seb128: also, is there a way out for people if they decide to not use it
<mterry> jcastro, ppa-purge?
<jcastro> because from looking at the packages, if I use natty, and I want to try gnome3, and it upgrades a ton of stuff
<seb128> jcastro, what mailing list?
<jcastro> mterry: ok, I can add that to the instructions
<jcastro> seb128: gnome3-team@lists.launchpad.net
<seb128> jcastro, oh the gnome3 team one on launchpad?
<jcastro> yeah
<seb128> jcastro, yeah they can use that
<seb128> I'm not sure anyone is reading it
<seb128> or subscribed
<seb128> but seems the right location
<seb128> we can check the list every now and then
<seb128> jcastro, downgrade ... I wouldn't recommend it
<mterry> I'm subsucribed
<jcastro> mterry: I want to avoid "I tried this PPA and now my gnome is totally hosed wether it's 2.x or 3.x!"
<seb128> like GNOME3 will migrate your users datas to gsettings etc
<mterry> seb128, but it won't delete old stuff
<seb128> there is no easy roll back
<jcastro> right, so really, this isn't "try gnome3!" this is a bit of a commitment?
<seb128> no, you will just go back to the settings you had before upgrading
<jcastro> ok
<seb128> downgrade are not handled packaging wise either
<seb128> it's likely that ppa-purge will fail on conflicts etc
<seb128> like Replaces: are not made for going this way
<seb128> you can downgrade but I would said it's not something a normal user will be able to deal with
<mterry> I'm giving another global call if anyone wants to leave comments on my in-progress core-dev application.  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/mterry/CoreDev
<seb128> mterry, when is your meeting?
<mterry> seb128, haven't formally put myself in yet.  Was waiting for a few comments
<seb128> mterry, ok, I will do that tomorrow then ;-)
<mterry> sweet
<seb128> mterry, btw if you get borred and are interest it could be nice to make appmenu-gtk work on gtk3 if we can
<seb128> interested
<pitti> good night everyone! have to leave a bit early today
<desrt> pitti: cheerio
<desrt> seb128: i have a new respect
<desrt> seb128: it turns out i have fat fingers for packaging
<seb128> hey desrt, new respect for who? ;-)
<desrt> seb128: for you :)
<seb128> lol
 * desrt tried to repackage gnome-screensaver and failed spectacularly
<desrt> the ..90->..91 transition is brutal
<desrt> lots of vendor patches no longer applying, packaging broke in various other ways
<desrt> i wanted to kill bzr by the end of it :)
<desrt> you should produce (and blog?) a 'packaging for ubuntu with bzr' cheetsheet... after some googling i wasn't able to find one
<desrt> basically the tips you gave me on IRC the other day, but expanded a bit
<desrt> for example, i wasn't ever able to rediscover that command you told me that looked at the apt database to determine the bzr repository that the packaging for a specific source package was kept in and check it out with an appropriate name
<seb128> desrt, debcheckout?
<desrt> ya.  that one.
<desrt> all of the tutorials i found skipped it
<desrt> in any case, it seems like there are a lot of tricks that you know that are not easy to discover
<desrt> i had another question too: i was working in my checked out repository
<seb128> well the desktop team workflow is mainly on http://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Bzr
<desrt> and i removed a vendor patch because it was no longer required
<desrt> then i did a bzr bd
<desrt> but it complained that files were missing
<seb128> but yeah we should really try to converge with standard ubuntu practices and have things documented
<desrt> it seemed like the only way to fix that was to commit the file removal
<desrt> which i didn't want to do because i was still working
<seb128> how did you delete it?
<desrt> rm
<seb128> yeah, don't do that
<desrt> ya.  i learnt my lesson :)
<desrt> bzr is not very forgiving in this case
<seb128> usually modern packages use quilt and you just have to comment it in the series
<desrt> ya...
<desrt> that's another thing
<desrt> i need to learn to use quilt
<seb128> otherwise bzr del it and bzr revert before commiting ;-)
<desrt> i had to update some vendor patches by hand... NOT FUN
<seb128> you know about edit-patch?
<desrt> nope.
<seb128> it's from mvo
<desrt> i'll go learn about it now :)
<seb128> it's an "give me a shell where I can edit my patch and update the diff with what I do there when I exit 0"
<seb128> which abstract the patch system
<seb128> like it can be cdbs-simple-patchsys or quilt
<seb128> it will wrap the commands for you
<desrt> see?  neither edit-patch or debcheckout are mentioned in this wiki page you just gave me :)
<seb128> just give you the shell to work
<seb128> yeah, we need to update that documentation ;-)
<desrt> ahh
<desrt> this is like that other command you told me
<desrt> to extract the tarball and toss the debian/ directory in and throw me into it
<seb128> bzr bd-do ?
<desrt> yup
<seb128> right
<desrt> similar idea, i guess
<seb128> you usually want to do bzr do-do to get in the unpacked source
<seb128> then edit-patch <somepatch>
<seb128> then exit 0 twice
<desrt> i guess i can recursively use edit-patch from there
<desrt> yup
<desrt> well, i guess you might need to do several edit-patch
<seb128> right
<seb128> well I tend to exit 0 and call up bzr bd-do again
<desrt> does that record a commit when you're done?
<seb128> just to make sure I don't exit != 0 by error and trash my work
<desrt> or just leave the changes in-tree?
<seb128> that just let the changes in the checkout without commiting
<seb128> well I tend to ctrl-D
<desrt> doesn't the shell always exit 0 by default?
<desrt> or does it use the exit status of the previous command?
<seb128> and if the previous command didn't return 0 and you ctrl-D you migh just drop your changes :p
<desrt> gotcha
<seb128> it uses the exit status of the previous command
<desrt> that's ... annoying
<seb128> well in fact the unpacked dir is still in ../build-area
<seb128> so you can go back there and restore things
<desrt> including the modified debian/
<seb128> if you don't run bzr bd-do again which wipes it with a fresh unpack
<desrt> you guys need to switch to rpm :)
<desrt> ((never thought i'd say that))
<seb128> well that has nothing to do with the packaging format ;-)
<seb128> it's just a vcs workflow
<desrt> right.  of course.
<desrt> apt, dpkg, etc are much better
<seb128> the "real" ubuntu recommended way is full source checkouts
<desrt> and all the support infra for building deb is awesome
<desrt> but..... you guys do it perfectly backwards
<desrt> have the source package at the toplevel with a debian/ directory
<seb128> it's just annoying to have to checkout 10 years of history of the full source when you want to update a changelog
<desrt> rpm does it the other way.... upstream source gets unpacked into a subdir of the package dir
<desrt> seb128: so upstream source in the same bzr as the packaging, you mean?
<seb128> yes
<seb128> bzr get lp:ubuntu/gconf-editor
<seb128> or whatever source
<desrt> yes.  i suppose that would be quite annoying.
<seb128> those are autoimport for most sources
<desrt> for people like me who only work with half a dozen packages or so, it's not so bad
<seb128> but some are manually maintained source
<desrt> but for someone who is doing new software every single day... that would get annoying
<seb128> like it's very handy for things which are upstream on launchpad like dx work
<seb128> you can bzr get lp:ubuntu/indicator-something
<seb128> cd indicator-something
<desrt> oh.  that's something else i wanted to ask about
<desrt> do i have to worry about this pristine-tarball business?
<seb128> bzr merge lp:indicator-something -r 123
<seb128> and bzr bd
<seb128> no you don't
<desrt> due to the separated nature of the packaging
<desrt> just sucks the tarball from the source url...
<seb128> right
<desrt> i noticed that there is a neat little utility in there that is good at finding random source tarballs :)
<seb128> bzr bd-do will typically fetch the source from the archive if available or use the watch file
<desrt> i forget what it is called, but it started running when i was having connectivity troubles at one point
<bcurtiswx> gstreamer install failed.. http://paste.ubuntu.com/583393/
<seb128> kenvandine, ^
<seb128> kenvandine, it's your recent change it seems
<seb128> pitti, you noticed there is a new pygobject upstream tarball I guess? (just pointing in it case you didn't)
<seb128> didrocks, I can't run gconf-editor from unity, known issue?
<seb128> well, alt-f2 gconf-editor enter doesn't run anything
<seb128> rather
<didrocks> seb128: no, not a known one. Someone referenced xkill though
<didrocks> when you press enter, do you wait for the model to be synced?
<didrocks> (I mean, is the first item showing gconf-editor)
<seb128> didrocks, could be that not, it works now
<seb128> weird
<seb128> oh, come on!
<seb128> kenvandine, !!!
<seb128> where is ken?
<kenvandine> seb128, ?
 * kenvandine looks
<seb128> kenvandine, I got like 15 duplicates of that gst conflicts in my inbox nox
<seb128> now
<seb128> kenvandine, can you please fix it before every single natty user send a bug? ;-)
 * bcurtiswx runs to submit bug report!
 * bcurtiswx then runs
<kenvandine> hehe, indeed
<kenvandine> seb128, i used Breaks
<seb128> kenvandine, you screwed the version then I guess ;-)
<kenvandine> which afaik is the right thing to do...
<seb128> or the name
 * bcurtiswx was banking on control file typo
<kenvandine>  -good
<kenvandine> Breaks: gstreamer0.10-plugins-bad (<< 0.10.21-1ubuntu5)
<kenvandine>  -bad
<kenvandine> Breaks: gstreamer0.10-plugins-good (<< 0.10.28-0ubuntu2)
<dpm> seb128, re: bug 729631, it seems not to be fixed for me. Do you see the day of the week and month in French on your desktop's date & time indicator?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 729631 in indicator-datetime "Date label on the indicator is partially untranslated" [Low,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/729631
<bcurtiswx> one version too high?
<bcurtiswx> no no, nvm
<Sweetshark> pitti: could you clue me in on https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libreoffice-l10n/+bug/729727 ? I can reproduce the errors in the last two comments.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 729727 in libreoffice-l10n "[natty] Invalid liblucene2-java Conflicts in packaging" [Undecided,Fix released]
<kenvandine> looks right to me
<kenvandine> wtf!
<bcurtiswx> Sweetshark, <pitti> good night everyone! have to leave a bit early today
<seb128> dpm, it's showing "lun, 21 mars, 18:56" for me now
<Sweetshark> bcurtiswx: oh, ups! thanks for the headsup
<bcurtiswx> Sweetshark, np :)
<cdbs> dbarth: You sent me a mail?
<dpm> seb128, weird, it's "Mon, 21 de Mar, 18:56" for me, thanks for checking
<cdbs> dbarth: I replied to it, will contact you after half-an-hour here for more details. Right now I g2g
<seb128> kenvandine, not sure, check with mvo, but I usually use Replaces when there is a file replaced
<kenvandine> oh... from the docs this was one of the exact use cases it said to use Breaks for
<kenvandine> mvo, ^^
<kenvandine> and it worked installing from my local repo
<seb128> it seems to deconfigure it but not uninstall
<mterry> seb128, what's the deal with bug 739575 ?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 739575 in apr-util "Bad path in libapr-util-1.la" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/739575
<seb128> mterry, -> slangasek on #ubuntu-devel
<kenvandine> seb128, so you think i should just change those to Replaces to make sure everyone gets unbroken?
<seb128> Conflicts,Replaces
<seb128> yes
<kenvandine> both?
<seb128> yes
<kenvandine> Conflicts worked, but produced noise on upgrade
<kenvandine> ok
<seb128> Conflicts will tell it both version should not be installed together
<seb128> Replaces will make sure you don't get file conflicts
<mvo> kenvandine: sorry, was at dinner and now I leave to play some hockey, could you email me the question please?
<kenvandine> seb128, uploaded
<seb128> kenvandine, thanks
<cyphermox> does anybody have time for a review? --> https://code.launchpad.net/~mathieu-tl/gnome-media/lp737029/+merge/54072
<ari-tczew> cyphermox: short URLs in DEP3 rulez ;)
<cyphermox> ari-tczew, ah, certainly you mean the gnome one, ;)
<ari-tczew> cyphermox: headers in your patch :>
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: complaining about weird bug reports: https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/739539 ? :)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 739539 in gchildcare "Can just log in to Classic Desktop with no effexts otherwise get just empty screen with wallpaper only" [Undecided,New]
<kenvandine> hey didrocks, i have a gnome-session related question if you have a moment
<kenvandine> really about doing things in an app on SIGTERM
<didrocks> kenvandine: hum? SIGTERM is directly directed to the app
<kenvandine> if i want to do some purging of db records and a vacuum on a sqlite db on shutdown, is it safe to do that on SIGTERM
<kenvandine> like if it takes 30s one time, will it kill it hard?
<didrocks> kenvandine: if you are registered with the session
<didrocks> kenvandine: and are reactive on ping (so multi-threaded)
<didrocks> you won't be SIGKILL*ed* by gnome-session
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> what do i have to do to make sure i am registered?
<didrocks> kenvandine: do you have sm-â¦ options on --help?
<kenvandine> no
<didrocks> so you are not :)
<kenvandine> bummer
<didrocks> kenvandine: best thing is to take an easy exemple, like gedit
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> this is for gwibber, users are really starting to suffer from massive sqlite dbs
<didrocks> otherwise: http://www.google.fr/url?sa=t&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CBwQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Flive.gnome.org%2FSessionManagement%2FGnomeSession&rct=j&q=gnome-session%20sm&ei=7Z6HTbGuLYv24Qa_sfSLCQ&usg=AFQjCNEba-dg-9CvbDiiHIsUUsrobGBe5Q
<didrocks> grr, don't know why google doesn't want to copy me the inner linj :)
<kenvandine> :)
<didrocks> yeah, that should be ok :)
<didrocks> dinner time now!
<kenvandine> later
<kenvandine> thx
<didrocks> later
<didrocks> yw ;)
<dpm> hi tedg, have you had the chance to look at your schedule for your session on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuAppDeveloperWeek? I'm trying to wrap up the timetable and there are only a few slots free
<tedg> dpm, Can I get the 20 slot on 14 Apr?
<dpm> tedg, sure! If this looks ok to you, then we're set -> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuAppDeveloperWeek/Timetable
<tedg> dpm, Looks good!
<dpm> tedg, awesome, thanks tedg!
<cdbs> dpm: Wait, can I claim one slot there?
<cdbs> dpm: okay, unping, it appears others are doing the sessions I'd have done
<dpm> cdbs, if you've got a session you think it might be interesting for application developers, sure! What were you thinking of?
<cdbs> dpm: about the one of introducing PyGI
<dpm> cdbs, no worries. Is there another topic you'd like to talk about? Or perhaps pick up one of the proposed sessions?
<cdbs> dpm: No leave it, looks like I'll be busy in other work that week, would be difficult to get 1 straight hour out
<dpm> ok, no worries
<bcurtiswx> kenvandine, do you use nautilus for ssh/sftp?
<kenvandine> bcurtiswx, yes
<bcurtiswx> does that crash unity for you?
<bcurtiswx> kenvandine, ^^
<kenvandine> bcurtiswx, wow... it does
<kenvandine> i don't recall that happening before
<kenvandine> and i use it pretty regularly
<bcurtiswx> well at least i feel better it's not just me
<kenvandine> fie a bug and i'll "me too it"
<bcurtiswx> anyway i can catch that crash to put in the bug report?
<mterry_> bcurtiswx, it doesn't appear in /var/crassh?
<mterry_> crash even
<bcurtiswx> mterry, ah right, i never look there :X lemme check right now
<bcurtiswx> mterry_, nope nothing in there :-X, checked the compiz crash, was from the 16th.
<bcurtiswx> mterry_, if you use sftp/ssh from nautilus you may be able to confirm the crash.. just use sftp/ssh in nautilus and unity will crash
<bcurtiswx> specifically in my case i had to input a password
<bcurtiswx> checked the keyring crash file, nothing recent in it tho
<mterry_> bcurtiswx, i'm in a weird state, in classic gnome, right now
<mterry_> can't easily switch to unity
<bcurtiswx> mterry_, OK np :)
<bcurtiswx> kenvandine, do you have a crash file in /var/crash ?
<bcurtiswx> from unity, specifically
<mterry_> bcurtiswx, crashes you'll see there will likely be in the compiz binary, as unity is just an in-process plugin
<mterry_> unless we're talking the unity-panel-service or the unity-window-decorator
<bcurtiswx> mterry_, yup i've checked all crash files that would come close to unity/compiz and nothing recent
<mterry_> k
<kenvandine> bcurtiswx, nope... no compiz crash file
 * kenvandine waves on the way out :)
<bcurtiswx> kenvandine, k thx. enjoy your afternoon/evening
<htorque> seiflotfy: hi, zeitgeist-datahub seems to become a zombie process early in the session start (seeing this on two systems) - is this a known issue?
<seiflotfy> htorque, can u come on #zeitgeist an report that so the maintainer can catch on it
<chrisccoulson> hi jasoncwarner
<chrisccoulson> i recreated your right-click bug btw ;)
<chrisccoulson> (and there's a pretty easy reproducer for that too)
<jasoncwarner> nice
<chrisccoulson> if you open the dash and then click back in the firefox window, the context menu is always messed after that
<chrisccoulson> (until you focus another window)
<jasoncwarner> oh really? hmm
<jasoncwarner> chrisccoulson: wonder if that makes the firefox global menu disappear as well...which is something else I'm seeing but can't get to recreate...
<chrisccoulson> jasoncwarner, you mean that it stops appearing in the panel>
<chrisccoulson> ?
<jasoncwarner> chrisccoulson: yeah
<chrisccoulson> jasoncwarner, i bet that's bug 718926
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 718926 in bamf "Some apps don't integrate to appmenu after having their windows closed" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/718926
<chrisccoulson> that's pretty bad, we could do with getting somebody to look at that
<chrisccoulson> i'm not sure if it's on anyones radar
<jasoncwarner> I'll check
<jasoncwarner> chrisccoulson: lets see if we can get it on someones ;)
<jasoncwarner> chrisccoulson: care to talk to didrocks about that?
<chrisccoulson> jasoncwarner, yeah, sure
<jasoncwarner> thanks
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-03-22
<robert_ancell> RAOF, the alt-tab crash is back with a vengance
<RAOF> Poot.
<RAOF> And I've just switched out my radeon!
<RAOF> robert_ancell: Got a backtrace for me?
<robert_ancell> I had two apport traces, but they seemed to match exissting bug
<robert_ancell> existing bugs
<RAOF> Could you point me at them?
<robert_ancell> I can probably trigger it again, will an apport trace do?
<RAOF> Yeah, it'd be a fine start.
<robert_ancell> yeah, of course now it doesn't happen...
<RAOF> :)
<RAOF> Can you remember the top of the stacktrace?  Did it look like a graphics bug, or a compiz bug?
<RAOF> Or, at least, was the top frame in libGL or r600_dri.so :)
<robert_ancell> it was compiz crashing, but in a vague location
<robert_ancell> like bug 737467
<robert_ancell> I marked another as affecting me, but can't work out how to find it..
<RAOF> lol
<robert_ancell> RAOF, anyway, it seems quite frequent since the last dist-upgrade.  I'll ping you when it occurs again
 * robert_ancell -> lunch
<RAOF> If it's like 737467 it doesn't look like a driver bug.
<bcurtiswx> there's also a bug with using nautilus for sftp/ssh
<bcurtiswx> it crashes unity
<TheMuso> Oh I see why gtk/unity window decorator doesn't make a sound when the system bell is meant to be used.
<TheMuso> Its not using libcanberra.
 * TheMuso will see about cooking up a patch if he has time in the next few days.
<pitti> Good morning
<pitti> jasoncwarner: hey, how are you?
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<TheMuso> Hey folks.
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson, morning TheMuso
<tualatrix> pitti: hey, Marin, morning. :D
<pitti> hey tualatrix
<chrisccoulson> hi pitti, how are you?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I'm fine, thanks!
<pitti> chrisccoulson: how about you? still sleep deprivation?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - it's not so bad this morning ;)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: seems you are becoming a regular early bird then
<chrisccoulson> heh :)
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> bonjour didrocks
<didrocks> Guten Morgen pitti. How are you?
<duanedesign> hello didrocks
<didrocks> hey duanedesign
<chrisccoulson> hi didrocks!
<chrisccoulson> how are you?
<didrocks> good morning chrisccoulson!
<didrocks> I'm really good, thanks! And you?
<didrocks> (feel way better than last week when I was tired from Monday. Taking Friday off was really a nice option)
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, yeah, i'm good too thsnkd
<chrisccoulson> oops
<chrisccoulson> i don't know what happened there ;)
<slomo> kenvandine: the gst-plugins-bad debug and doc package is going to conflict with the good debug/doc packages too btw...
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, swt-gtk is giving me a real headache
<rodrigo_> morning
<chrisccoulson> anyone here familiar with JNI?
<pitti> ugh, last time I touched JNI was in university on an embedded java microcontroller
<chrisccoulson> heh
<chrisccoulson> i'm struggling with a crasher in the new swt-gtk. for some reason, a pointer that is passed between native functions seems to get truncated to 32bits
<chrisccoulson> and i can't work out why :(
<seb128> hello desktopers
<chrisccoulson> hi seb128
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson, how are you? up early today
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<seb128> hey pitti, how are you?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, i'm not too bad thanks
<chrisccoulson> how are you?
<pitti> seb128: btw, I noticed the pygobject .1, but currently working with the Debian guys on the dh_python2 migration
<pitti> seb128: I hope we can get that and .1 into experimental, and then just sync
<seb128> pitti, ok, I figured so, thanks
<pitti> (we have no delta left any more)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I'm fine thanks ;-)
<seb128> session restart brb
<mvo> Sweetshark: hi, did you had a chance yet to look at the following upgrade error in OOo http://paste.ubuntu.com/583704/ ? iirc we talked about it a couple of days ago. let me know if I should prepare a patch for it
<seb128> bah
<seb128> pitti, you are no fun you didn't wait for me to remind you about the reminder :p
<pitti> seb128: je suis dÃ©solÃ©!
<rodrigo_> hi seb128, pitti
<seb128> hey rodrigo_
<seb128> pitti, ;-)
<seb128> rodrigo_, how are you?
<rodrigo_> seb128, very recovered, I went quite early to sleep last night, so I'm full of energy  now :)
<seb128> excellent! ;-)
<rodrigo_> seb128, you?
<seb128> still waking up but fine otherwise ;-)
<rodrigo_> :)
<seb128> gord, njpatel: how is the fix to that devicelaunchericon crash going?
<seb128> things like bug #740016 or bug #739996 are probably the same issue
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 740016 in unity "unity crashes when connecting iPhone" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/740016
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 739996 in unity "Mounting an iso in Gmount-iso crashes unity." [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/739996
<didrocks> seb128: the status didn't change on it. Still targeted for this week
<seb128> didrocks, I noticed it didn't change that's why I'm pinging, I would like to see it targetted for today and backported to natty
<seb128> it makes unity crashing for quite some users and bug spam launchpad a bit
<njpatel> seb128, gord is working on crashers, I can ask him to look at those as priority
<seb128> njpatel, please do
<seb128> njpatel, it's spamming launchpad and hitting quite some users
<pitti> yeah, I noticed that unity is very crash-happy whenever I plug in an USB stick
<seb128> njpatel, every time you connect a device unity crash basically
<seb128> well maybe not every time but it's likely to crash
<njpatel> no stacktrace so hopefully he can reproduce it locally
<seb128> njpatel, ?
<seb128> bug #737318
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 737318 in unity "compiz crashed with SIGSEGV in DeviceLauncherIcon::UpdateVisibility()" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/737318
<njpatel> thats better
<seb128> njpatel, I've pinged about that yesterday morning already, gord said he was on it ;-)
<njpatel> why is there a merge request from someone else
<seb128> njpatel, there is also a merge request waiting for review on this bug
<seb128> njpatel, it was before gord said he would work on it...
<didrocks> seb128: I pinged as well FYI yesterday on it:)
<seb128> didrocks, thanks ;-)
<didrocks> (when I changed the milestone)
<njpatel> wtf
<njpatel> Who has been playing with my code?
<gord> seb128, there is already a community fix for it - i just need to do a proper review of the branch before merging it in because it does a lot of other stuff too
<pitti> seb128: I had that coming, I guess -- just after two weeks of stability when I install current natty on my wife's laptop, it goes mad again :)
<seb128> gord, can we get a "stop crashing" fix we can backport to natty?
<seb128> gord, natty is barely usuable due to it
<njpatel> gord, unless the community fix works somewhat like https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/713423 dont' approve it
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 713423 in unity "Unity launcher gets cluttered when having multiple partitions and/or external volumes attached" [Medium,Confirmed]
<gord> seb128, really? i didn't think it was that widespread - no crashes here
<njpatel> gord, the fix to stop the crashing is 1 line
<seb128> gord, see the right column list of duplicates on the bug
<njpatel> seb128, ^
<njpatel> DeviceLauncherSection::98 = if (icon) icon->UpdateVisibility ()
<seb128> gord, there is a lot of bugs with no stracktrace like those I pointed as well
<seb128> crashes when plugging phone or random use devices
<pitti> or on login
<pitti> (perhaps when gvfs starts up and enumerates stuff)
<seb128> njpatel, thanks, can we get that in trunk, so I can cherry pick it and then you can do extra refactoring if you want?
<pitti> or just apply it for now?
 * pitti takes the finger off the "kill seb128" button
<seb128> re
<seb128> sorry extra session restarts
<seb128> I should be done for now
<njpatel> seb128, it's in trunk now, should stop crashes, but gord needs to review the other branch to see if it provides a proper fix
<seb128> njpatel, I'm fine with stopping fixes
<njpatel> i'm not sure wtf is going on in that code
 * njpatel adds note to review
<njpatel> i need tea
<seb128> that's what is creating the retracers load and launchpad noise and confusing users
<seb128> njpatel, thanks!
<pitti> seb128: much appreciated; I'm happy to test it, too
<pitti> seb128: do you want to cherrypick it right now?
<seb128> didrocks, I'm backporting it if that's fine with you
<seb128> pitti, yes, I'm on it
 * pitti hugs seb128
 * seb128 hugs pitti
<didrocks> seb128: sure, thanks!
 * seb128 hugs didrocks
 * didrocks hugs seb128 back
<huats> morning everyone
<seb128> lut huats
<seb128> ca va ?
<huats> hello seb128 !
<huats> Ã§a va !
<huats> et toi ?
<seb128> ca va nickel
<huats> cool
<seb128> ups
<seb128> njpatel, didrocks: sorry I wrote "git commit" in my changelog entry :p
<seb128> that's what working mostly on GNOME do to you ;-)
<didrocks> autotyping :p
<seb128> didrocks, ok, in any case unity device crash cherry pick upload and unity-place-application xapian one as well
<seb128> that should cut some bug noise
<didrocks> seb128: excellent! thanks :)
<seb128> bah, robert_ancell screwed gvfs again
<seb128> having one merge-upstream source in our workflow doesn't work well
<seb128> he updating the debian dir only
<Sweetshark> pitti: ping?
<pitti> hallo Sweetshark
<seb128> mvo, hey
<mvo> hey seb128
<Sweetshark> pitti: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libreoffice-l10n/+bug/729727 <- apt-cache showpkg libreoffice-help-en-gb and dpkg-query -s libreoffice-l10n-common both look good here, what are they talking about?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 729727 in libreoffice-l10n "[natty] Invalid liblucene2-java Conflicts in packaging" [Undecided,Fix released]
<seb128> pitti, you added python-aptdaemon-gtk3 right?
<seb128> pitti, bug #725390 has quite some duplicates, seems to be a missing Replaces?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 725390 in aptdaemon "package python-aptdaemon.gtk3widgets 0.41+bzr586-0ubuntu2 failed to install/upgrade: trying to overwrite '/usr/share/pyshared/aptdaemon/gtk3widgets.py', which is also in package python-aptdaemon-gtk 0.40+bzr541-0ubuntu2" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/725390
<seb128> mvo, bug #733732
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 733732 in aptdaemon "<type 'exceptions.AttributeError'>: 'Transaction' object has no attribute 'gettest'" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/733732
<pitti> seb128: I can look at that, yes; thanks
<seb128> mvo, it's a gettest -> gettext typo, trivial to fix
<seb128> mvo, if you want to close an easy bug
<mvo> thanks!
<mvo> that is rather silly
<seb128> mvo, yw
<mvo> fixing now
 * mvo hugs seb128
 * seb128 hugs mvo
<seb128> pitti, bug #737742 seems another gi utf8-ish error
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 737742 in aptdaemon "<type 'exceptions.UnicodeDecodeError'>: 'ascii' codec can't decode byte 0xd0 in position 0: ordinal not in range(128)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/737742
<seb128> pitti, not sure if you want to look at it...
<pitti> seb128: less likely than the file overwrite one :) but opening tab to check later
<seb128> ok
<seb128> pitti, btw while you are here :p
<seb128> pitti, is bug #736393 an annotation issue?
<seb128> bug #736393
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 736393 in software-properties "software-properties-gtk crashed with AttributeError in __getattr__(): 'gi.repository.Gdk' object has no attribute 'FUNC_MOVE'" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/736393
<pitti> seb128: looks like it; queueing as well
<seb128> pitti, can I assign it to you? seems the sort of things you can handle ;-)
<seb128> pitti, thanks
<pitti> seb128: please do
<pitti> seb128: in return, I think we should just apply the patch for bug 703230; Debian guys don't seem to like it :/
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 703230 in pango1.0 ""rm: cannot remove `/usr/share/doc/libpango1.0-0': Is a directory" when updating to 1.28.3-4" [Unknown,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/703230
<pitti> but it's certainly not a downgrade issue at least for us
<seb128> pitti, oh right, I forgot about that
<seb128> pitti, well pochu said to feel free to commit a patch to the pkg-gnome svn
<seb128> I was just not sure if I should add a || true or a if [ -d ... ] rmdir
<seb128> and then I forgot
<seb128> mvo, bug #738182 has some bugs as well, not sure if that's a bug or if the code should just catch the error to avoid apport noise
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 738182 in aptdaemon "<class 'aptdaemon.lock.LockFailedError'>: Could not acquire lock on /var/lib/dpkg/lock. The lock is hold by apt-get." [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/738182
<mvo> thanks seb128
<seb128> mvo, np
<seb128> sorry for the bug pinging noise
<seb128> I'm done for now ;-)
<seb128> mvo, oh, btw the type was in 3 files from a grep run
<seb128> mvo, seems you fixed it in one only
<seb128> are the other ones copies?
<mvo> the typo?
<mvo> I did a bzr grep and found only one
<seb128> gettest
<mvo> let me try again
<mvo> symlink maybe? from python
<mvo> ?
<seb128> mvo, ok sorry yes
<seb128> the other two are in tests which symlinks to aptdaemon dir
<mvo> oki
<mvo> no worries
<mvo> btw, "bzr grep" == love
<seb128> mvo, I didn't know about it but will try ;-)
<chrisccoulson> RAOF, if you're interested, here's the compiz hang i was talking about yesterday - bug 740126 ;)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 740126 in compiz "compiz hangs randomly several times per day" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/740126
<chrisccoulson> not sure if that's an X issue or not
<chrisccoulson> i got a trace from compiz
<RAOF> chrisccoulson: Oh, boo.  That's probably pageflipping problem :(
<chrisccoulson> heh :)
<chrisccoulson> i didn't expect you to respond just now ;)
<RAOF> I am just off to bed, yes :)
<bcurtiswx> im just getting up :-\
<bcurtiswx> i'd much rather be going to bed
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: thanks for the hang backtrace!
<bcurtiswx> seb128, what tag am i supposed to add to bugs so that the versions page catches it?
<seb128> bcurtiswx, desktop-upgrade
<bcurtiswx> seb128, thx
<seb128> bcurtiswx, the "open bug" column on version has the url with the tag set
<bcurtiswx> i clicked that, actually, didn't set a tag :-\
<seb128> well it's in the url
<bcurtiswx> seb128, how quickly does telepathy get things into debian on average?
<seb128> depends
<seb128> if you need something you can ping them on #telepathy
<seb128> but usually the delay is not worth doing an ubuntu upload
<bcurtiswx> i was going to get telepathy-glib 0.14.0 ready, made the merge request but forgot it's not in debian yet (0.14.0 is the stable branch)
<bcurtiswx> well sync request, sorry
<seb128> you can try to ask on #telepathy
<seb128> do we need the new version to unblock an upgrade or fix an annoying issue?
<seb128> if not but we just want the new version we can probably just wait a bit on debian
<bcurtiswx> sjoerds on that usually, i don't want to be my usual annoying self, especially with there being no major annoying bugs, just one new bug fix but it's trivial
<seb128> you are not annoying
<seb128> well, in fact we have a diff now thanks to ogra's armel build hack
<ogra> :P
<seb128> so you can as well do the update, we can't sync
<seb128> ogra, ;-)
<ogra> :)
<rodrigo_> seb128, https://code.launchpad.net/~rodrigo-moya/ubuntu/natty/nautilus/fix-662194/+merge/54337
<rodrigo_> seb128, also sent upstream, not committed yet, but it works
<rodrigo_> seb128, so either we wait for upstream to accept it or we upload it while we wait for upstream?
<seb128> rodrigo_, getting upstream review should be easy, ping cosimoc on #nautilus
<seb128> rodrigo_, btw 2 smalls comments
<rodrigo_> yeah, doing it now
<seb128> - try to keep the bug reference in the description
<seb128> - should you set the remember option to false in the case you hide the box?
<seb128> since you restored the default to true
<seb128> not sure about the second one since I didn't check the code to see what happens when the box is not displayed
<seb128> but if it default to true it will store it?
<rodrigo_> seb128, hmm, right about setting it to TRUE, I guess it will remember it
<bcurtiswx> seb128, a diff for what?
<seb128> bcurtiswx, telepathy-glib to build without optimization on armel to workaround compiler issuers
<seb128> issues
<seb128> which debian doesn't need because their compiler settings doesn't trigger it
<seb128> we will need to keep the diff for natty
<seb128> so we can't direct sync new versions
<bcurtiswx> ah, OK.  So a bzr merge-upstream then?
<seb128> not sure if that one is maintained in bzr and using merge-upstream but an update yes
<bcurtiswx> in all honesty, i haven't worked a ton with non ~ubuntu-desktop packages.  Whats the most common way to update when something is just in lp:ubuntu/natty/<packagename>
<seb128> bcurtiswx, I would update it without vcs
<bcurtiswx> seb128, so grab upstream, copy debian directory from current, attempt build ?
<kklimonda> chrisccoulson: Firefox 4.0 will be pushed to all Ubuntu releases throught -updates?
<chrisccoulson> kklimonda, that's not the plan. although, it depends on how much longer 3.6 is supported for
<chrisccoulson> in future, we'll probably be rolling out all major updates to supported releases straight away though
<chrisccoulson> (considering that ff4.0 will be EOL 3 months after natty releases)
<chrisccoulson> so, natty will get 5.0 by the summer ;)
<kklimonda> yeah, the new release schedule is interesting ;)
<chrisccoulson> yep
<chrisccoulson> there will be a firefox-stable PPA for maverick and lucid users though
<chrisccoulson> which i'm just preparing now ;)
<kklimonda> right, I've already found it - that's why I've been asking.
<kklimonda> actually I should have click the link and read the description first
<kklimonda> I didn't know that 3.6.x is still going to be supported - in this case it makes sense not to update.
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i don't know how long 3.6 will be supported
<chrisccoulson> https://wiki.mozilla.org/Releases/Firefox_4.0
<chrisccoulson> so, basically, and minute ;)
<dobey> mvo: ping. i take it sessioninstaller is the magic bridge between packagekit api, and aptdaemon?
<jcastro> rodrigo_: is this gnome-desktop3 the meta package you were referring to before?
<mvo> dobey: yep
<mvo> dobey: it provides the PK session API on top of aptdaemon
<dobey> ok
<bcurtiswx>  http://paste.ubuntu.com/583809/ http://paste.ubuntu.com/583810/
<bcurtiswx> right one are my build-deps
<bcurtiswx> left one if the error, but i have done apt-get build-dep telepathy-glib
<bcurtiswx> and verified they are installed
<seb128> bcurtiswx, does the current natty version build?
<seb128> could be a g-i stack issue, maybe pitti has a clue about it
<cyphermox> could it be related to multi-arch in libglib? I've just been bitten by that now
<bcurtiswx> seb128, i can try the current one shortly
<seb128> could be due to slangasek uploads as well, check with him as well maybe if you can
<pitti> "The type name `GLib.TypeInterface' could not be found
<pitti> " -> that doesn't ring a bell for me :?
<pitti> I mean :(
<seb128> let's blame slangasek
<bcurtiswx> i've ping'd him in -devel.  will wait for reply
<bcurtiswx> well, lets blame me.. it seemed to pass the error point in pbuilder.. so it's probably my computer
<seb128> so unping slangasek I guess
<bcurtiswx> but there's a crapload of warnings :-\
<bcurtiswx> i'll wait for it to finish building before i unping slangasek
<cyphermox> bcurtiswx, fwiw, my build of NM worked on my computer but not on a ppa. turned out my system was using a mirror that wasn't quite up to date enough -- the upload was only four hours ago or so
<bcurtiswx> http://paste.ubuntu.com/583815/
<bcurtiswx> is that what i dread.. a soname update?
<seb128> doesn't seem to be one
<seb128> bcurtiswx, seems to just be an extra symbol
<bcurtiswx> seb128, hmm. OK, thx
<seb128> yw
<kenvandine> czajkowski, ping
<czajkowski> kenvandine: pong
<kenvandine> hey, how big was your gwibber db again?
<kenvandine> ls -lh ~/.config/gwibber/gwibber.sqlite
<czajkowski> 116M
<kenvandine> ok
<soren> holy crap. That's a lot of tweets.
<kenvandine> i am looking for someone with a huge one for testing
<kenvandine> soren, someone has a 725M one..
<kenvandine> i can't recall who though :)
<czajkowski> kenvandine: I was sure it was larger last week
<czajkowski> odd
<czajkowski> but I did have to delete twitter and re add it
<czajkowski> as it was being a royal pita
<kenvandine> i have a fix that does some nice cleanup
<kenvandine> should make it much smaler
<kenvandine> which in turns makes gwibber much more responsive
<czajkowski> kenvandine: promise promises :)
<chrisccoulson> "i am looking for someone with a huge one for testing" - a huge what? ;)
<kenvandine> haha
<kenvandine> gwibber db
<chrisccoulson> lol
<czajkowski> ever notice how ther are some dodgey comments associate with gwibber! ye've a lot to answer for kenvandine
<kenvandine> indeed
<kenvandine> popey, how about you?  ls -lh ~/.config/gwibber/gwibber.sqlite
<kenvandine> or anyone listening for that matter, if you use gwibber check the db size please
<popey> my desktop isnt powered on right now
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> i've tested my fix on a 300M db
<popey> will check in an hour or so (I am at work, house is empty)
<kenvandine> popey, great
<kenvandine> thx
<popey> i have 8 accounts on my gwibber
<popey> so expect it to be quite big
<kenvandine> my cleanup should make a huge difference
<popey> and it's a pc that started with lucid and has gone to maverick then natty
<kenvandine> great
<kenvandine> :)
<popey> is that an sqlite hoover?
<kenvandine> and some purging
<popey> yay
<popey> delete all of czajkowski's tweets
<popey> hardwire that in the script
<kenvandine> haha
<popey> :)
 * czajkowski frowns at popey 
<czajkowski> no cake for you mister next week!
<rodrigo_> jcastro, no, gnome-desktop3 is the gnome3 version of libgnome-desktop
<rodrigo_> jcastro, about the metapackage, it's been waiting on my todo list, so let me do it now
<rodrigo_> seb128, ubuntu-desktop is the metapackage for all of gnome in natty, right?
<seb128> rodrigo_, ubuntu-desktop defines what is installed by default on ubuntu
<seb128> it's built from the seeds
<rodrigo_> seb128, so, would it make sense to have a version of it in the gnome3 ppa, so that people can just upgrade that?
<seb128> it defines the content of the CD basically
<seb128> not only GNOME
<rodrigo_> ah
<seb128> why do we need that? doing dist-upgrade should just work
<seb128> it's basically the same set of binaries
<rodrigo_> seb128, it doesn't install gnome-shell
<seb128> well tell people to dist-upgrade and install gnome-shell?
<rodrigo_> jcastro, ^^
<rodrigo_> seb128, it's fine by me, just that I discussed with jcastro about having a metapackage to pull everything from the ppa
<rodrigo_> but yes, apt-get dist-upgrade should work
<seb128> seems that just sudo apt-get install gnome-shell should bring you a working gnome-shell
 * Sweetshark starts heating the room with compile entropy.
<Sweetshark> libreoffice 3.3.2 final released!
<kenvandine> seb128, i am getting build failures now...
<kenvandine> /bin/sed: can't read /usr/lib/libglib-2.0.la: No such file or directory
<kenvandine> seb128, have you seen any of those yet?
<seb128> Wrong dialog closed
<kenvandine> :)
<kenvandine> /bin/sed: can't read /usr/lib/libglib-2.0.la: No such file or directory
<seb128> kenvandine, grep libglib.la *.la
<seb128> kenvandine, grep libglib-2.0.la *.la
<kenvandine> this is building on the buildds
<seb128> in the standard lib directories
<seb128> well it should be similar to your box
<seb128> something ships a broken .la
<seb128> slangasek fixed most yesterday it seems
<seb128> kenvandine, elmo reported an issue on udev's .la though, could be it
<seb128> kenvandine, bug #740224
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 740224 in udev "libgudev-1.0.la has broken dependency_libs (hardcoded /usr/lib)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/740224
<kenvandine> thx, looking
<kenvandine> it is breaking both of my gstreamer builds
<seb128> ok, so same issue I guess, elmo was building gst as well
<kenvandine> just yelp
<seb128> well if that's gst that's likely the bug listed before
<seb128> you grepped in usr only right?
<kenvandine> usr/lib
<seb128> right
<seb128> that's why you didn't catch that one
<seb128> it's in lib
<seb128> well anyway wait for slangasek to be there or get pitti to review the patch and upload
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> thx :)
<seb128> yw
<rodrigo_> so, how are syncs from debian done? that is, is there a tool or something that does it in the archive, or do we still need to merge with ~ubuntu-desktop branches and upload?
<seb128> rodrigo_, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SyncRequestProcess
<rodrigo_> seb128, thanks!
<seb128> rodrigo_, it's basically filing a bug or pinging an archive admin to get a command saying "bring the current debian version to ubuntu" run
<rodrigo_> seb128, ok, so for gsettings-desktop-schemas, we can just sync, right?
<seb128> yes, it's on my list already
<rodrigo_> if they need merge, a merge proposal + review + upload, right?
<seb128> it just got uploaded to debian earlier today so I was waiting for it to reach the mirrors
<seb128> yes
<rodrigo_> seb128, ah, ok, I was starting to update to 2.91.92 and got hit by that, so I'll move to another package
<seb128> rodrigo_, ok thanks
<pitti> mvo: I just checked bug 736393, it's not an annotation, issue, just a simple misnaming of the constant
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 736393 in software-properties "software-properties-gtk crashed with AttributeError in __getattr__(): 'gi.repository.Gdk' object has no attribute 'FUNC_MOVE'" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/736393
<seb128> rodrigo_, dget http://incoming.debian.org/gsettings-desktop-schemas_2.91.92-1.dsc
<pitti> mvo: however, this uncovered a larger problem, the mixing of pygtk and pygi - you really should avoid that
<seb128> rodrigo_, if you need to build it locally
<rodrigo_> seb128, hmm, and can I get it and propose a branch from that?
<rodrigo_> seb128, to save you the syncing work?
<seb128> rodrigo_, not really, sync don't include a vcs they are direct copies from debian uploads to ubuntu archive
<rodrigo_> ah, ok
<seb128> rodrigo_, that's just one command to run
<seb128> i.e no work
<rodrigo_> ok
<seb128> but I'm waiting for it to be published since the syncing is done from the archive not from incoming
<rodrigo_> ok
<mvo> pitti: fair enough, looks like its just a leftover from the porting work
<pitti> mvo: argh, sorry, I totally misread that
<mvo> pitti: I did a bzr grep over it and it appears this is the only instance of this left, I can fix it now (unless you are quicker :)
<pitti> mvo: "software-properties" != "software-center"
<pitti> mvo: so, totally my fault, I'll fix it now :)
<mvo> no worries
<mvo> s-c we do next cycle
 * pitti hugs mvo
<pitti> mvo: I already wondered, "wow, they ported it already?!" :)
 * mvo hugs pitti
 * pitti grabs a cup of tea to fully wake up again then
<jcastro> kklimonda: hey I noticed upstream shutter has support for static quicklists now
<jcastro> kklimonda: in their .desktop files. Can we pull that into natty before freeze? Lack of perl bindings means we can't appindicator it so this app really needs the quicklist
<Sweetshark> pitti: I am currently compiling 3.3.2 with launchpad integration. Will you be around to sponsor that to main tomorrow?
<pitti> Sweetshark: yes,  I will
<pitti> mvo: hm, I don't even know how to reproduce this -- how do I get to this dialog?
<pitti> mvo: I played around with "Andere Software" tab, added and removed stuff, etc.
<kklimonda> jcastro: Mario (smuxi's dev) had a question about how to translate quicklist entries. I'm also not sure if it makes sense to add 10 quicklist entries - the menu looks bloated. But if those two things are solved, and if those entries are just launching shutter with some arguments, I think we have a chance to get a late FFe.  Could you add your comment to the bug 738710 wrt translations?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 738710 in shutter "Needs quicklists for Natty" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/738710
<jcastro> kklimonda: just saw the bug, didrocks any idea?
<jcastro> kklimonda: I don't think he needs so many, just 2 or 3 would be fine
<bcurtiswx> seb128, the current natty release fails at the same point as the one i'm trying to package currently. fyi
<seb128> bcurtiswx, ok, makes sense
<mvo> pitti: give it a sources.list argument, like
<seb128> jcastro, kklimonda: translations... those are strings in the .desktop so they will get in the translations list
<mvo> pitti:
<mvo> sudo ./software-properties-gtk /etc/apt/sources.list.d/ubuntu-mozilla-daily-ppa-natty.list
<pitti> mvo: ah, thanks; I just tried with --enable-ppa, found that broken (just fixing as well)
<seb128> jcastro, kklimonda: but since it's in universe no langpacks so it means it will not be translated for most user or you will have to pick upstream translation updates and distro patch those
<pitti> mvo: sudo PYTHONPATH=. ./software-properties-gtk --enable-ppa=pitti/sru-test
<pitti> mvo: now works again as well :)
<kklimonda> seb128: right, is there an existing universe package I could point the developer to where he can see how it works? I've downloaded gnome-utils but gnome-screenshot.desktop doesn't have translations (I assume they are pulled directly from Rosetta to the language packs).
<mvo> pitti:  \o/
<seb128> kklimonda, we read translations from the .mo for desktop files as well in ubuntu
<kklimonda> seb128: if there isn't any package - is translating quicklist entries the same as translating those from [Desktop Entry] ?
<seb128> kklimonda, it's the same as translating any string from the source or .desktop keys
<kklimonda> ok
<seb128> kklimonda, they will get listed in the pot, show as translatable and be in .mo which is loaded to read translations
<seb128> kklimonda, inline translations in the .desktop are used if available though
<seb128> well in any case it's not trivial to update translations in universe
<kklimonda> yes, I know
<didrocks> sorry, was on the phone
<didrocks> jcastro: if it's in a .desktop.in, it will be translated
<jcastro> didrocks: can you respond on the bug? I'm really not the best guy to explain this.
<didrocks> jcastro: yeah, I'll
<jcastro> kklimonda: I've asked design on the length of quicklists, maybe there's supposed to be an ideal amount, it feels too long to me.
<kklimonda> jcastro: yes, I'd prefer the quicklist to have two options - the two that are available in gnome-screenshot. They seem to be the most generic, and most likely to be used often. But then I'm not taking that many screenshots myself. :)
<seb128> the gnome-screenshot ones are buggy though
<seb128> need to fix that
<pitti> seb128: FYI, bug 725390 is already fixed, marking a dupe
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 725390 in aptdaemon "package python-aptdaemon.gtk3widgets 0.41+bzr586-0ubuntu2 failed to install/upgrade: trying to overwrite '/usr/share/pyshared/aptdaemon/gtk3widgets.py', which is also in package python-aptdaemon-gtk 0.40+bzr541-0ubuntu2" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/725390
<seb128> pitti, ok thanks, I didn't spot any replaces or conflicts mention in the changelog so I was not sure
<mvo> Sweetshark: hi, what branch is OOo currently build from? I would like to look at the file overwrite problem that the auto-upgrade-tester found and was wondering what branch is the right one
<nessita> hello everyone!
<rodrigo_> hi nessita
<nessita> hi rodrigo_, how are you?
<nessita> tedg: ping
<seb128> nessita, ola!
<nessita> hola seb128! ca va?
<rodrigo_> nessita, fine and you?
<nessita> pretty good, catching up after 2 weeks holidays
<seb128> nessita, ca va bien! et toi ?
<seb128> nessita, had nice holidays ?
<nessita> trÃ¨s bien
<nessita> really good ones :-)
<Sweetshark> mvo: Really OOo or LO?
<seb128> mterry, howdy
<tedg> nessita, Good morning.
<chrisccoulson> pitti - how difficult would it be for me to spin my own language packs for a PPA (with new firefox translations)
<chrisccoulson> ?
<rodrigo_> nessita, oh, where have you been?
<chrisccoulson> i wouldn't mind being able to have translations for firefox 4 in the firefox-stable PPA
<chrisccoulson> but it seems pretty difficult right now
<nessita> tedg: hi there! would you know how to set a specific icon for a messaging entry? I would like to use a custom icon for the messaging entry for Ubuntu One, different from the icon being used in the main menu. I"ve tried http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/583843/ but I had no luck
<nessita> rodrigo_: I went to PyCon USA :-)
<mvo> Sweetshark: well, OOo is still in the archive afaict so I would like to see the bug fixed. but LO may need a similar fix, probably small and easy
<rodrigo_> heh, python holidays :)
<nessita> tedg: "I had no luck" means that the messaging menu is still showing the plain "ubuntuone" icon instead of "ubuntuone-panel"
<nessita> tedg: and I have restarted my session JIC
<tedg> nessita, We currently don't support having icons on the static shortcut items.
<nessita> tedg: ok. Any workaround you can suggest?
<mterry> seb128, h
<mterry> i
<tedg> nessita, The app icon, is well, just the app icon.  I wouldn't see any issue with pushing a "-panel" on it by default, but it currently doesn't do that.
<tedg> nessita, I think it'd be a patch more than a work around.
<tedg> nessita, I need to run right now, but we can chat about it when I get back.
<seb128> mterry, hey ;-)
<nessita> tedg: I'll appreciate that, thanks!
<seb128> mterry, I saw you updated glade in the ppa
<seb128> mterry, is that a new source or a version update?
<Sweetshark> mvo: well, the openoffice.org source package only contains only transitionals, the libreoffice source package contains contents. I just noted they dont seem to be automatically imported to lp. They are vcs'ed on a shared repo with debian at http://git.debian.org/?p=pkg-openoffice/libreoffice.git and http://git.debian.org/?p=pkg-openoffice/openoffice.org.git .
<mvo> is it just me or does the dash crash currently? might be on my noveau driver only I guess
<pitti> Sweetshark, bryceh, chrisccoulson, didrocks, tremolux, Riddell, kenvandine, cyphermox, mterry, rodrigo_, seb128, tkamppeter: meeting reminder in 5 minutes
<mterry> seb128, it's a new source too.  The old one (3.8) is 'glade-3', the new one (3.10) is 'glade'
<mvo> Sweetshark: aha, interessting. I have a look then. I see "dpkg: error processing /var/cache/apt/archives/openoffice.org-dev_1%3a3.3.0-1ubuntu1_all.deb (--unpack):
<mvo>  trying to overwrite '/usr/share/doc/openoffice.org-dev', which is also in package openoffice.org-dev-doc 1:3.2.1-7ubuntu1.1"
<kenvandine> thx
<didrocks> hey
<cyphermox> pitti, ok
<mvo> Sweetshark: in the auto-upgrade tester currently, the error looks a bit odd though
<mvo> Sweetshark: I get the git repo now and have a look whats goingon
<rodrigo_> pitti, ok
<Sweetshark> mvo: thats great! thx.
<mterry> seb128, but they install the same binary 'glade'.  The libraries are intended to be parallel-installable, I believe.  It's a confusing situation (inherited from Debian)
<pitti> mvo: is bug 507836 on your or tremolux' radar? it's got an awful number of dupes
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 507836 in software-center "[master] software-center crashed with DatabaseModifiedError in _database_gen_postlist_iter()" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/507836
<mvo> pitti: its  on the radar, we just have no good strategie about it currently
<mvo> pitti: we will dig into it more
<Sweetshark> mvo: 3.3.0 is a bit old though, I havent looked much at the older packages yet. There is symlinking going on in /usr/share/doc though ...
<pitti> mvo: thanks; just wanted to ensure it's known
<Sweetshark> anyway, me is sitting down for meeting ...
<pitti> Sweetshark, bryceh, chrisccoulson, didrocks, tremolux, Riddell, kenvandine, cyphermox, mterry, rodrigo_, seb128, tkamppeter: meeting time
<rodrigo_> o/
<mterry> hi
<pitti> jasoncwarner: ^ (I know you are double-booked, but FYI)
 * kenvandine waves
<tremolux> pitti: no worries, it is indeed a blip, a gigantic green one, on our radar  ;)
<chrisccoulson> \o
<pitti> tremolux: heh
<pitti> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2011-03-22
<pitti> welcome everyone to today's meeting
<tremolux> hey everybody  !
<pitti> not that much going on on the weekly summary, I guess that means everyone is working on bugs like mad? :)
<seb128> hey pitti
<pitti> so, let's dive right in
<pitti> kenvandine: want to start us off with partner update?
<kenvandine> yup
<kenvandine> not a ton to report, happy it is mostly bug focus time
<kenvandine> DX
<kenvandine> Desktop menu layout changes bug 692194
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 692194 in unity-foundations "Desktop menu adjustments for Natty" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/692194
<kenvandine> lo-menubar has reached 0.1.0, aruiz said he thinks it should be stable now
<kenvandine> FFE for overlay scrollbars bug 730740
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 730740 in gtk+2.0 "Provide support for dynamically loading the new overlay scrollbar feature" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/730740
<kenvandine> and UbuntuOne
<kenvandine> bindwood for ff4 and ubuntuone-couch are not uploaded
<chrisccoulson> bindwood is ;)
<kenvandine> that's all i have
<pitti> ^ as for the scrollbar FFE, it hasn't been approved yet, and I don't think the release team will (I'm not that happy about it either); so this needs an explicit sabdfl "override" on the bug
<kklimonda> hey, could someone take a look at bug 736236 and see if doesn't miss anything obvious?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 736236 in mm-common "[MIR] mm-common" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/736236
<pitti> (if we should push it, that is)
<kenvandine> pitti, ok.. dbarth_ ^^
<chrisccoulson> kenvandine, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/bindwood/1.99.0-0ubuntu1
<pitti> Sweetshark, kenvandine: to confirm, lo-menubar should stay in universe for natty? or go into default install?
<kenvandine> pitti, that is the plan as i know it
<kenvandine> i would love to see it on the CD
<Sweetshark> pitti: universe, as far as i am concerned
<kenvandine> but i fear it hasn't had enough testing
<kenvandine> it does provide a much more consistent experience though
<pitti> will look at the desktop menu thing later on, haven't seen that one yet
<kenvandine> pitti, seb128 is working on that now
<pitti> ah, ok
<seb128> pitti, ted just handed it over today
<seb128> I'm on it
<pitti> so, [TOPIC] unity update -- didrocks, anything new to report?
<didrocks> hey
<didrocks> All details of last release with the usual milestone: https://launchpad.net/unity/3.0/3.6.6
<didrocks> As you can see, we got a lot bug fixes and enhancement:
<didrocks>  - drag and drop from the dash
<didrocks>  - better applications matching with kde apps
<didrocks>  - software center integration
<didrocks>  - better "search" title in places
 * pitti loves the length of the weekly bug list in the changelogs
<didrocks>  - some default keybindings and compiz refinement
<didrocks> For next week: release tomorrow or Thursday. Bug fixes mainly (with some rewrite) and multimonitor better support.
<didrocks> We need a multitouch FFe: https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/737601
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 737601 in unity "Restore MT support in Unity" [Medium,In progress]
<didrocks> to get to the same state than what we had in maverick
<pitti> didrocks: ^ will look after meeting
<didrocks> pitti: if you can have a look :)
<didrocks> thanks!
<pitti> (if it's a regression, should be easy)
<didrocks> that's basically it :)
<didrocks> new compiz upload today
<pitti> didrocks: do you know the latest word wrt. a11y?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, do you know if bug 718926 is on anyones radar? that's pretty bad, and i don't want it to get forgotten about
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 718926 in bamf "Some apps don't integrate to appmenu after having their windows closed" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/718926
<didrocks> with ABI break
<didrocks> pitti: launcher is fully a11y. Still need some investigation this week for places though
<charlie-tca> It is?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: not that I know of. I'll have a look
<chrisccoulson> thanks
<chrisccoulson> i'm not sure it's a bamf issue tbh
<charlie-tca> When did we get orca working with the launcher?
<pitti> didrocks: in our last discussion with TheMuso we ended up with starting classic gnome for the a11y profile
<pitti> didrocks: but that was already a week ago
<didrocks> charlie-tca: orca should work on the launcher
<charlie-tca> not today, it don't
<didrocks> and TheMuso confirmed this
<rodrigo_> but not on the dash/places
<pitti> there's still a handful of WIs left for a11y, anyway
<didrocks> charlie-tca: you should raise this issue with rodrigo_ and API on #ayatana then
<charlie-tca> okay
<pitti> I think it'd be fine to have the "classic on a11y" changes after beta-1, so we can still give it some two weeks to mature
<pitti> but my feeling is that we should rather do that than deliver something half-done
<pitti> visual bling isn't half as important for blind people than reliability
<didrocks> pitti: we discussed with TheMuso
<pitti> "visual" -> "workflow", as "fast searching in dash", etc.)
<didrocks> and jasoncwarner and discussed that we would take the decision just after beta
<pitti> didrocks: ok, sounds like a plan
<pitti> seems we are all in agreement then
<pitti> tremolux: do you have something about software-center? (wiki section is empty)
<tremolux> pitti: please refresh, I got it in just before the meeting
<pitti> oh, a page reload magically made the report appear :)
<tremolux> haha! yeah
<Pendulum> I'd just like to point out that not all a11y is for visual impairment
<pitti> Pendulum: yes, of course
<tremolux> I can paste a summary
<tremolux> * Unity launcher integration FFe was granted; Unity and Unity 3D implementations complete and released (many thanks didrocks and nerochiaro!!!)
<tremolux> * With all parts in place now, we've enabled the Software Center side of launcher integration with today's release (3.1.24)
<tremolux> * In the end, we decided on a somewhat scaled back version of the full design, but what we have should be quite useful for Natty and we'll make it cooler in Oneiric
<tremolux> * Lots of great bug fixes and UI improvements in last week's release 3.1.23.1 and even more in today's 3.1.24
<tremolux> * Particular focus on final UI cleanup items before freeze this week, plus revisit startup time (already dramatically improved over maverick, but see if we can get more)
<pitti> Pendulum: we were really talking about "some a11y profiles", mainly about screen readers, etc.
<tremolux> yow, that's a pretty huge summary, sorry  :P
<pitti> tremolux: seems just fine to me
<pitti> thanks
<tremolux> cool, thank you
<pitti> tremolux: is there still work needed for startup speed, or AWTY and can focus on bugs fully?
<tremolux> pitti: we can talk about it, we are well under the goal in the charts
<pitti> the WI is still open for that
<tremolux> right
<pitti> tremolux: i. e. "not met the goal", or "well under the time treshold"?
<tremolux> the reason is that, when starting up fresh off a reboot, the time is over 5 seconds on the Dell Mini reference still
<pitti> http://people.canonical.com/~mvo/software-center/mini10-startup/startup-times.png looks awesome
<tremolux> the target is under 5 seconds on the reference
<pitti> ah, so all of that is hot cache?
<tremolux> which is a slow machine
<tremolux> yeah, but even with those cold-cache approaches in the bug, we meet the goal
<tremolux> we only don't meet it in a fresh reboot, so that cold-cache techniques seem not fully sufficient
<pitti> tremolux: to me it feels like the focus should be on bug fixing now, and speed improvements should be an offside project now
<tremolux> pitti: agreed
<pitti> anyway, that's an amazing improvement!
<tremolux> pitti: I'll talk with mvo, it's really been much improved
<pitti> thanks
<tremolux> you can feel the difference, it's dramatic
<tremolux> pitti: thanks  :)
<pitti> Riddell: anything noteworthy on the Kubuntu front?
<Riddell>  * CDs in decent shape for beta, or will be once oversizing problem is fixed
<Riddell>  * switching Qt to opengles on ARM means fixes needed to packages which use opengl, mobile team to fix.  I've also been helping linary folks package kwin for opengles
<Riddell>  * Qt accessibility bridge in ppa:jr if anyone wants to test
<Riddell>  * http://goo.gl/23eui 9 bugs milestoned for beta http://goo.gl/23eui
<Riddell> I've also been learning how to package RPMs to get usb-creator into suse
<seb128> changing distro? ;-)
<Riddell> only to make it possible for suse users to try out ubuntu :)
<seb128> ;-)
<pitti> Riddell: oversizing problem> is that due to eglibc-source and friends, from today?
<Riddell> pitti: yes
<pitti> rpms> heh, nice
<pitti> Riddell: ah, that shoudl hopefully be fixed in tomorrow's dailies
<pitti> Riddell: how hard was it to package, OOI?
<Riddell> pitti: just as fiddly as .deb packages :)
<pitti> opengles> does that mean all packages which currently use OpenGL on arm need to be changed to GLES as well? or are they binary compatible in some way?
<Riddell> pitti: all qt packages do yes, they're not binary or source compatible
<Riddell> so it's potentially quite problematic
<Riddell> talking of problematic we had to work out how to get cmake support multiarch this week, I think we have a reasonable way to do it now for natty but debian are saying it's not their preferred solution
<pitti> Riddell: I meant the libgl1-mesa-glx rdepends
<pitti> Riddell: AFAIUI that was mostly a quick hack to unbreak it for now, righht?
<pitti> to add the extra search paths to cmake
<Riddell> pitti: qt bits depending on libgl1-mesa-glx do need to be changed to openGLES
<pitti> Riddell: ah, only qt, not all other ~ 400 packages?
<pitti> that sounds a bit less scary then
<Riddell> right, it's due to qt being built with gles on arm now
<pitti> Riddell: so that's mainly in mobile team's hands, right?
<Riddell> yes
<pitti> ok, good
<pitti> thank you
<pitti> X.org will be done in the eastern edition
<Riddell> the cmake change is quite a successful quick hack, I don't think it's worth us spending more time on it but I'll be in contact with debian and upstream incase they think it is
<pitti> I agree; the multiarch stuff is slowly landing in debian, so eventually they'll get to it as well, but they can take some more time to fix it properly
<pitti> I originally planned to discuss current RC bugs and WIs in the meeting, but I think I'll rather go round and discuss with people individually
<pitti> http://people.canonical.com/~platform/workitems/natty/canonical-desktop-team-ubuntu-11.04-beta-1.html looks a bit dire
<pitti> so if everyone coudl stay around for a little more, that'd be appreciated
<pitti> but I'd like to keep the official meeting short
<seb128> hum, time to run ? ;-)
<pitti> anything else which we should discuss?
<pitti> /msg seb128 let's start with you; stop slurping cocktails and fix gtk bugz!!
<Sweetshark> kenvandine, pitti: just to clarify: lo-menubar stays in universe for natty, but will be upstreamed to LO for 3.4 (hopefully, if resources allow) so it will be in main then and we can decide on if we want to dis/enable it (via configuration) still.
<pitti> oops :)
<Sweetshark> pitti: I am a concerned about bug 731556 / freedesktop bug 33915 because it seems to be Ubuntu only.
<kenvandine> Sweetshark, yeaj
<pitti> Sweetshark: that's the spirit! (regarding some heated blogosphere discussions..)
<Sweetshark> pitti: *hrhr*
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 731556 in df-libreoffice "LibreOffice erases user settings, and block the use of interface styles..." [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/731556
<ubot2> Sweetshark: Error: Could not parse XML returned by Freedesktop: The read operation timed out (http://bugzilla.freedesktop.org/xml.cgi?id=33915)
<kenvandine> Sweetshark, however i think for next cycle, until it lands in LO we should include it as a separate package
<pitti> Sweetshark: hm, that report is a bit vague about reproduction and effect?
<kenvandine> just in case that gets dropped
<kenvandine> and for testing
<Sweetshark> pitti: well, thats the fun of it. its one of those issues with possibly Java, Quickstarter, Hibernate involved. But if it is indeed Ubuntu-only and eats the user config thats indeed a serious issue.
<pitti> ok, let's end the official part then, thanks everyone!
<pitti> Sweetshark: yes, agreed -- it would just be nice to get a reproducer for it first
<pitti> chrisccoulson: for bug 727372 it seems that there's a proposed patch upstream which needs review? we are blocked on that?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 727372 in firefox "FF 4 requires both .desktop and gconf entries for url handlers" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/727372
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah
<chrisccoulson> tbh, i could just upload it. it's only a small patch
<pitti> chrisccoulson: is there a risk that upstream would do it differnently, and then we'd have a migration problem?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - no, i think the patch is right
<pitti> chrisccoulson: (although it sounds to me as if it should just drop the gconf bits?)
<chrisccoulson> although, my opinion is obviously biased, seeing as i wrote it ;)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: ok, thanks
<pitti> chrisccoulson: is there just no response upstream, or was there some pushback?
<chrisccoulson> it's blocked on reviews on another bug
<chrisccoulson> (and we already have all of the patches from that bug anyway)
<pitti> ah
<pitti> chrisccoulson: so perhaps we shuold actually go ahead with that, and then tell upstream about our experience with it in the field?
<pitti> we'll have a lot of people upgrading to beta and testing this
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i can do that
<chrisccoulson> when is the freeze?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: bug 663294 is pretty much a "nice to have" at this point, right?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 663294 in gcc-4.5 "Firefox built with gcc-4.5 is a non-starter on i386 with -pie" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/663294
<pitti> chrisccoulson: next Monday
<pitti> (roughly)
<chrisccoulson> i've got some other bits to get it in too, and i'd like to avoid doing an upload for a single change
<pitti> chrisccoulson: yes, that sounds fine
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i've not had time to reinvestigate the gcc issue yet
<pitti> chrisccoulson: this is mostly about me getting an updated view about the release blockers at this point
<pitti> chrisccoulson: the gcc one seems like low-priority, don't worry
 * tremolux will brb
<chrisccoulson> i'm fully focused on trying to get the webkit-enabled swt-gtk working atm
<chrisccoulson> we really need to get xulrunner out of main
<micahg> pitti: PIE is a security regression
<chrisccoulson> especially seeing as firefox 4 is only going to be supported for 16 weeks
<pitti> micahg: ah, we had PIE in maverick on 3.6?
 * micahg agrees with chrisccoulson on xulrunner
<pitti> chrisccoulson: *nod*; did you have any luck with it? (webkitified swt-gtk)
<micahg> pitti: yes
<pitti> micahg: ah, it sounded like a major new thing
<chrisccoulson> pitti - it builds, but i'm getting an issue where pointers are getting truncated between native interfaces, and i can't figure out what's going wrong
<chrisccoulson> in fact, it's going wrong independently of the JVM
<pitti> micahg: that bug also has a gcc task, so I wonder if that's a gcc regression or a firefox one
<chrisccoulson> and i haven't worked out what's going on at the assembler level yet
<micahg> pitti: I thought chrisccoulson narrowed the PIE issue to be a gcc regression
<pitti> micahg: so if that's a security concern, it might be less evil to build firefox with gcc-4.4 for the time being? or would that cause trouble with arm?
<micahg> s/regression/issue
<micahg> pitti: idk, I'll discuss that with the team as a possible option
<pitti> micahg: cheers
<pitti> micahg: it coudl also use 4.4 on i386 only, of cousre
<micahg> pitti: that might cause other issues :)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: bug 709216 sounds similar to the previous one -- blocked on upstream patch review? or more blockers here?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 709216 in thunderbird "clicking on a link dont open the page " [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/709216
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i think there's 2 ways to fix that
<pitti> micahg: for sure; just checking options ;)
<chrisccoulson> the first one is to backport all of the GIO support from thunderbird-3.3 + some additional patches
<chrisccoulson> or the other one is to actually make gnomevfs understand the %u placeholder
<chrisccoulson> i didn't realise that our default-applications capplet is still updating the gconf keys
<chrisccoulson> but it updates them with broken values from the Exec= line in the desktop file
<micahg> chrisccoulson: pitti keep in mind, we might be jumping to TB 3.3 a month or 2 after release
<pitti> chrisccoulson: ugh, gnomevfs?
<chrisccoulson> (broken == not understood by applications that are still using gnomevfs)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, tbird and ffox still use it, although we disabled it for ffox in ubuntu
<pitti> micahg: yeah, I thought it would be a similar drill to firefox?
<chrisccoulson> but mozilla.org builds are still using it, and those are totally broken now
<micahg> pitti: I think some of that might be discussed today at the thunderbird meeting, but not sure
<chrisccoulson> we might be jumping to firefox 5 a couple of months after release ;)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - did you see the new release schedule?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: yeah, it's crazy
<chrisccoulson> do i need to notify the TB of the changes? (the changes being that we're going to be rolling out firefox updates like we do with chromium)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: well, we already have a standing exception for ffox, so it should be okay
<chrisccoulson> cool, thanks
<chrisccoulson> the updates will obviously be less interesting than the 3.6=>4.0 update
<pitti> chrisccoulson: what would you prefer about the gvfs bug? going to tbird 3.3?
<chrisccoulson> we can't go to tbird3.3 just yet, as it's only at alpha 3
<pitti> ah, ok
<pitti> chrisccoulson: adding gnomevfs support for %u might not be that hard, do you want some help with that?
<chrisccoulson> i'll talk to upstream about what to do. they're quite concerned that this is pretty broken for new distro's (and it's likely to stay broken for tbird 3.3 too, as my GIO patches didn't make the mozilla-2.0 branch in time)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i can take a look at gnomevfs
<chrisccoulson> it should be a trivial change
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I can help you with that if you want
<chrisccoulson> easier than backporting several thousand lines of code for tbird ;)
<pitti> yes, definitively :)
<pitti> chrisccoulson, micahg: and finally, there's the 8 items on http://people.canonical.com/~platform/workitems/natty/canonical-desktop-team-ubuntu-11.04-beta-1.html#mozillateam
<pitti> so I understand chrisccoulson is working on swt-gtk
<chrisccoulson> pitti - ok, i think i've found the right part of gnome-vfs to touch
<pitti> chrisccoulson, micahg: are you much concerned about the universe stuff there?
<chrisccoulson> i'm not concerned about universe stuff atm
<pitti> e. g. libgtk2-mozembed-perl only has one rdepends (gmusicbrowser) which we probalby could just remove from the archive?
<micahg> pitti: I need to get webkit 1.2.7 uploaded, then I can look at eclipse which is one of the major things that we'd prefer not to drop
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i don't mind. i wasn't planning to spend much time on universe stuff once xulrunner is dropped from main anyway
<micahg> pitti: that's the new default music player in xubuntu
<pitti> micahg: right; was just going to say that eclipse is the only one I'd be concerned about
<pitti> the rest looks ignorable
<chrisccoulson> (ie, it will be super-low priority for me at that point) :)
 * micahg doesn't know how he missed the xul rdepend, would've tried to shoot that down...
<pitti> eww
<pitti> what's wrong with rb?
<pitti> chrisccoulson, micahg: ok, thanks much for the heads-up, and sorry for all my questions
 * pitti feels a bit better about the next release meeting then
<micahg> pitti: it's just a suggests, so it can go :)
<pitti> micahg: oh, indeed
<micahg> pitti: well exaile was the default last cycle
<micahg> pitti: rb is too heavy for xubuntu
<pitti> micahg: so we shoudl revisit the list around beta-2, and then see about "ignore" vs. "remove from archive"?
<pitti> I'd like to target them to beta-2 then
<micahg> pitti: yep, sounds good, can you edit the blueprint?
<pitti> yup
<pitti> micahg: can I hand you the eclipse one then, as you seem to work on it?
<micahg> pitti: I suppose, the only problem is it shows up on the s, then I can look at some 'll probably want to jump to TB3.3 a month ecurity team's WI list
 * micahg shakes fist at xchat
<pitti> I think I deciphered it :)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: "Automate upstream translation imports for Firefox updates into Launchpad" -> is that actually still an issue?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: this sounds like something we coudl easily postpone, too
<chrisccoulson> pitti - not at the moment, although i'm going to completely rethink how we do translations for firefox next cycle
<chrisccoulson> i think we should kill po2xpi
<pitti> chrisccoulson: ok; so let's drop that one and rethink it properly at UDS?
<chrisccoulson> firefox has a perfectly good build system for building xpi's
<chrisccoulson> and we should just pass the source code to/from launchpad if we want to use that
<chrisccoulson> and then have firefox build the xpi's using the output from launchpad (or something like that)
<chrisccoulson> we'll see ;)
<chrisccoulson> but, yes, that one is for UDS
<Sweetshark> pitti: do you need me around still? Otherwise I might go out an jog a few rounds before it is too dark ...
<pitti> micahg: libjavascript-perl doesn't even have binaries in the archive.. can I just nuke this?
<pitti> Sweetshark: that's fine, enjoy!
<pitti> chrisccoulson: that indeed sounds like a better approach
<micahg> pitti: ugh, I've been meaning to fix that for 3 cycles
<micahg> pitti: go ahead, we can always upload later/backport if we fix it
<pitti> micahg: libjdic-java is fun as well -- it build-deps on xulrunner, but doesn't binary-depend
<pitti> micahg: *nod*, it'll come back in oneiric with autosyncs; I won't blacklist it for now
<micahg> pitti: yes, I've tried to port that twice now, I'll leave that until beta 2
<pitti> micahg: or drop -- just one rdepends (paros)
<pitti> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/packageselection-desktop-n-firefox-4 updated
<micahg> pitti: that one I've promised to do, so I think I was close this last time, I'd say leave it until beta 2, if not done, we can drop
<pitti> *nod*
<pitti> rodrigo_: sorry, I think I already asked you about gnome bug 644560, but forgot: did you just forget to attach the patch there?
<ubot2> Gnome bug 644560 in Gal "Can't set an account password" [Normal,Needinfo] http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=644560
<pitti> robbiew: (for bug 717971)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 717971 in evolution "Can't provide password for account capplet although it asks me to" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/717971
<robbiew> huh...what?
<pitti> robbiew: sorry, tab fail
<pitti> rodrigo_: ^
<robbiew> whew!
<pitti> tremolux: as beta-1 comes close fast, is bug 723911 blocked by anything, or just a manpower issue? how critical is it for b1?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 723911 in software-center "deauthorize does not remove sources.list" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/723911
<tremolux> pitti: I don't think it's critical for b1 actually, so I bumped the target there
<tremolux> it's not a manpower issue, rather it's not a UI issue and so can wait for after b1 if needed
<pitti> ah, ok
<pitti> thanks
<tremolux> pitti: the main part of the fix is actually in aptdaemon, and should not be too difficult
<pitti> chrisccoulson: sorry, one last thing: I'm afraid I don't really understand bug 709125 at all; it's targetted to b1 as well
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 709125 in apturlredirector "User agent doesn't include Ubuntu in it so apt.ubuntu.com doesn't work" [Critical,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/709125
<tremolux> pitti: want to hit any remaining fixes with UI impact this week first  ;)
<pitti> tremolux: yes, that makes sense; thanks for updating the milestone
<chrisccoulson> pitti - the issue is that there is no way to add the vendor name to the user agent string now
<chrisccoulson> (and apt.ubuntu.com relies on that)
<pitti> ah
<tremolux> welcome, thanks pitti
<pitti> chrisccoulson: our previous patch for that doesn't work any more then?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - in any case, i'm glad it's gone, because it caused no end of problems with websites mis-detecting our browser
<chrisccoulson> pitti - we never used to carry a patch, but we could configure the vendor name in a preference
<chrisccoulson> and that would appear in the UA string
<pitti> chrisccoulson: ah, that's the reason why http://apt.ubuntu.com/ is empty?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, that's the reason
<pitti> chrisccoulson: so it seems to me the firefox part is pretty much "wontfix", and instead apt.u.c. should just drop the agent filter?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, that would be 1 way to do it
<chrisccoulson> this describes the UA changes btw - http://blog.mozilla.com/dwitte/2010/08/24/user-agent-string-changes-coming-in-firefox-4/
<seb128> mterry, sorry I noticed your reply only after the start of the meeting, I think we should make the new glade installable next to glade2
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I don't really understand why they do the filtering in the first place -- on other distros/windows, apturl won't exist, so it won't do them any harm?
<seb128> mterry, just mentioned it in case you are interested, I've that on my list of things to work on when I get some free time which didn't happen yet
<tremolux> pitti: btw, if there's time and you have a chance, I'd like to quickly discuss the two remaining work items in the Software Center enhancements spec
<seb128> mterry, it's likely that people will want to work on gtk3 code while they still need to maintain gtk2 things
<pitti> tremolux: please
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, we could probably just drop the check then
<pitti> chrisccoulson: is that site our's actually?
<mterry> seb128, yeah, agreed. and i believe that is upstream glade's intention too
<pitti> chrisccoulson: i. e. should I file an RT?
<chrisccoulson> in any case, it's definitely wontfix in firefox, although there's a possible fix i could add to ubufox
<chrisccoulson> i'm not sure who maintains that website
<seb128> mterry, when I checked it was mainly conflicting on things like documentation
<pitti> chrisccoulson: ok, I'll check; thanks for the heads-up!
<chrisccoulson> thanks
<seb128> mterry, we can probably easily rename those
<rodrigo_> pitti, no, it's just that I'm still working on the patch, sorry
<tremolux> pitti: ok, so one is the startup time bug, the other is a backend fix actually, so I think the spec could reasonable be re-milestoned to 11.01 from B1
 * rodrigo_ adds a comment to the bug
<chrisccoulson> pitti - what mozilla recommended was adding an extra header to packets sent to apt.ubuntu.com (using ubufox), and updating the server to detect the new header
<chrisccoulson> but i'm not sure i've got time to do that
<pitti> chrisccoulson: right
<pitti> chrisccoulson: so let's not worry about that for now
<mterry> seb128, for documentation, yes, but it also looks like now they both produce the binary pacjkage 'galde'
<tremolux> pitti: tho, I expect we may close out the startup time bug before B1, just need to talk it through with mvo
<mterry> glade even
<pitti> rodrigo_: ah, ok; the comment said "attaching a patch", so I wondered; thanks!
<rodrigo_> pitti, reload the bug page now :-)
<pitti> rodrigo_: ah, heh :)
<seb128> mterry, well binaries are easy to rename ;-)
<rodrigo_> pitti, sorry for not doing it before, you're not the 1st one to ask if I had forgotten the patch :)
<seb128> mterry, I was thinking calling the new one glade-gtl
<seb128> glade-gtk3
<mterry> heh, was trying to imagine what gtl stood for
<tremolux> pitti: (I meant retargeted to *11.04* of course .. fatfingered)
<seb128> I should perhaps raise it again on #debian-gnome
<mterry> yeah
<seb128> mterry, it stood for me hitting l instead of k and then "enter" instead of 3 on the numpad ;-)
<seb128> I need to realign my hands ;-)
<pitti> tremolux: we should just retarget that one WI to beta-2 then IMHO
<pitti> tremolux: although this WI sounds like a bigger change which is more feature-like than bug fix? or does it sound more harmful than it is really?
<pitti> tremolux: for the startup time bug, my recommendation is to close the natty task as "good enough", and add an oneiric task for possible further optimization
<tremolux> pitti: it needs to be looked it closely, if it's risky at all, we will need to defer
<pitti> tremolux: do you think you could discuss it with mvo this week, so that we have a definitive decision for b1?
<tremolux> pitti: agreed, your recommendations sound good to me; now, do I need to retarget the spec itself from b1, when adding the updated targets to the WI entries?
<tremolux> pitti: yes, I'll discuss it either today or first thing tomorrow
<pitti> tremolux: no, just add a new block "work items (ubuntu-11.04-beta-2):"
<pitti> tremolux: and move that one there then
<tremolux> pitti: ok, gotcha
<tremolux> pitti: (I just didn't know if that overrode the spec target)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: "Figure out how to provide system-wide settings in /etc in the new world" - I think we already discussed that, is that still a requirement from OEM, or can we drop taht?
<tremolux> thx pitti
<pitti> tremolux: thanks!
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I think back then you said that it might also be easy for them to supply settings in an extension?
<pitti> ronoc: hey, how are you?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i think it's a requirement from OEM. in any case, i already know how i'm going to do that, so i guess that one is "DONE"
<chrisccoulson> i'll probably ship the old /etc/firefox/pref/firefox.js in ubufox, just for compatibility
<chrisccoulson> so i just need to do some conffile magic to move it between packages
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, an extension is probably the right way. but i think we can provide a system-wide preference file in ubufox too
<pitti> chrisccoulson: so we should keep the WI? (please don't if it's a lot of effort for little benefit)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - we can keep it for now, i don't think it's much work
<dobey> is there any way to install 11.04 from a 10.10 image? like over the magical internets or something?
<pitti> dobey: update-manager -d ?
<dobey> pitti: that will try to update the in-memory instance won't it?
<pitti> dobey: well, it'll upgrade your 10.10 installation to natty, yes
<dobey> pitti: i was hoping there was some way to tell the installer to install the current development version
<dobey> i don't have an installation yet. i want to install 11.04 on my new laptop. but i was hoping i wouldn't have to download a new image to do a totally clean install of 11.04
<pitti> dobey: no, that doesn't work; you'd need ot upgrade the live image to natty, which will quickly run out of RAM
<dobey> :(
<pitti> dobey: but even if the installer had that magic option, it would need to download the entire natty CD anyway, so you can just as well download it directly
<dobey> pitti: well it would have to download the packages to install them, but it wouldn't have to download the image, stick it on a usb stick, reboot, start the installer, and then install it :)
<dobey> i'm not worried about the bandwidth, i have 50Mbit download speed. i was just hoping to avoid the time to do all that extra work
<pitti> dobey: sorry, it's not that magic yet :/
<pitti> aufs-over-http doesn't sound fun, though
<Sweetshark> for building libreoffice I am missing a symlink from /usr/lib/libgcj_bc.so.1 which exists at debian. is that a bug or a feature? reading the package description, it sounds like a bug ...
<pitti> kenvandine, seb128: in https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/packageselection-desktop-n-application-selection, do you have a clue what "[ubuntu-cli-mono-dev] Clean up deps on appindicator extensions so that we use the pure sound menu for 11.04" means?
<kenvandine> no i don't
<seb128> dunno either
<pitti> Sweetshark: symlink to what?
<seb128> well new registration thing use only dbus and mpris not libindicate
<seb128> so it was maybe to drop the libindicate use
<seb128> but I didn't work on that nor checked what was going on
<kenvandine> oh, i bet that was it
<dobey> pitti: awfs?
<Sweetshark> to libgcj.so.10 which links to so.10.0.0
<Sweetshark> ^- pitti
<dobey> pitti: pretty much every linux distro that was out there back in the day used to have a "network install" option. i don't think there needs to be any special filesystem magic to do a network install
<dobey> anyway
 * dobey downloads the image
<pitti> Sweetshark: /usr/lib/libgcj_bc.so.1 -> libgcj.so.10 ? that sounds wrong
<pitti> dobey: we do have a netinstlal
<pitti> dobey: but that's different than using the live CD
<dobey> pitti: you mean it's a different image i have to download, shove on a usb stick, and boot from?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - w00t, bug 709216 fixed \o/
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 709216 in thunderbird "clicking on a link dont open the page " [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/709216
<pitti> dobey: it's a little more complicated, I'm afraid; https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Installation/Netboot
<Sweetshark> pitti: not when reading this: http://packages.ubuntu.com/natty/libgcj-bc
<pitti> chrisccoulson: rockin'! gnome-vfs?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah :)
<dobey> pitti: that's not net install. that's boot a live image of a tftp server :)
<pitti> Sweetshark: ah, that might be a deliberate evil hack then
<pitti> Sweetshark: but I'm afraid I don't know about it at all; I suggest talking to doko about that one
<Sweetshark> pitti: k
<pitti> dobey: no, that's debian-installer (alternate like), no live system
<dobey> pitti: well either way, that wiki page is about booting off of a disk image over ethernet via tftp
<seb128> who is using gnome-vfs?!
<pitti> seb128: tbird/ffox
<seb128> wth?
<dobey> pitti: i think maybe you meant https://help.ubuntu.com/community/Installation/NetbootInstallFromInternet instead :)
<dobey> anyway, like i said bandwidth is not an issue for me
<dobey> the stupid flaps on this laptop to cover up the usb ports and the headphone jack, on the other hand, make me want to punch the designer
<chrisccoulson> pitti / seb128, well, only tbird atm
<chrisccoulson> (although, there's still a lot of stuff in universe too)
<chrisccoulson> mterry, so, your tbird issue should be "fixed" now ;)
<mterry> chrisccoulson, yaaaay!
<chrisccoulson> hopefully i haven't broken anything else ;)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: nobody will notice a broken gnomevfs at this point :)
<didrocks> (but people notice broken gio integration in unity ;))
<seb128> kenvandine, you might be interested to backport that one, http://git.gnome.org/browse/xchat-gnome/commit/?id=be95811135169b16d108448117c71dbe7386f254
<Amaranth> didrocks: btw, just setting up a GLX context and calling glGetString a couple times takes 0.1s on nvidia and 0.2s on fglrx
<Amaranth> didrocks: On whatever systems Benoit Jacob was doing his testing on for firefox, anyway
<Amaranth> didrocks: So an extra process to do those can be pretty expensive
<didrocks> Amaranth: thanks for testing. Help jay to improve the test tool then :)
<Amaranth> didrocks: But on mesa it's 0.04s so I say screw the blobs :P
<didrocks> heh :)
<chrisccoulson> pitti, did you see my earlier question about rolling my own language packs?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: sorry, must have missed it
 * pitti can't find it in scrollback
<popey> kenvandine: -rw-r--r-- 1 alan alan 472M 2011-03-22 19:18 /home/alan/.config/gwibber/gwibber.sqlite
<pitti> chrisccoulson: (back in a bit, dinner)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - sure, no problem
<dobey> hrmm
<dobey> having uninstalled applications show up in the applications place when there is no network, is annoying :-/
<bcurtiswx> back
<pitti> chrisccoulson: re -- what was your question?
<chrisccoulson> hi pitti
<chrisccoulson> i was wondering how difficult it would be to roll my own language packs for lucid and maverick with the firefox 4 translations in, for the firefox-stable PPA?
<chrisccoulson> we're currently recommending that as a sort-of semi-official way of getting firefox 4, but there are no translations for it ;)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: hm, that would mean to duplicate all the po files as well
<pitti> chrisccoulson: it's not difficult in the operational sense, but of course needs quite a lot of disk space and buildd power
<pitti> chrisccoulson: aren't we going to update ffox in lucid/maverick to 4 anyway?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - ah, ok. people can grab the xpi's themselves, but i wouldn't mind figuring out a better way
<chrisccoulson> there aren't any plans to update lucid/maverick just yet
<chrisccoulson> not whilst 3.6 is still supported
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I thought 3.6 would be discontinued now that 4 is released?
<chrisccoulson> i'm not sure when that's going to happen tbh
<pitti> chrisccoulson: so TBH I think it would be easier to just bundle all XPIs in the PPA package
<pitti> chrisccoulson: or build a firefox-l10n package with them and add a dependency
<chrisccoulson> pitti - the only issue is where i install them, as they won't be co-installable with the xpi's in the language packs
<pitti> chrisccoulson: but if you want, we can build PPA langpacks for them -- it'd just take quite some effort, including QA
<pitti> chrisccoulson: ah, same ID?
<chrisccoulson> oh, don't worry about it too much, i don't want to create extra work for people
<chrisccoulson> yeah, they have the same ID
<pitti> chrisccoulson: so as long as we are using the upstream XPIs anyway, perhaps we should split them out from teh langpacks again
<pitti> it would mean even more packages, but they would allow that kind of flexibility
<pitti> chrisccoulson: right now we could do that with a po2xpi checkout which moves the 11.04 data to 10.04, and just rebuild them
<pitti> (and ensure that they are newer, etc.)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, splitting them might make sense in the future
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i guess for the short term that i could use dpkg-divert to divert the old xpi's couldn't i? ;)
<chrisccoulson> (although, that's a bit hacky)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I think Replaces: might be a bit safer
<vish> could someone with core upload priv checkout Bug 736250 ? UI freeze coming up and all.. ;)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 736250 in cheese "Update oldish looking icons in cheese effects" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/736250
<rickspencer3> hmmm
<rickspencer3> my Date indicator thinks it's still yesterday :/
<rickspencer3> possibly because I left my 'puter on overnight?
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, sounds like a bug
<rickspencer3> well, it looked like Monday was selected in the calendar
 * chrisccoulson hits the unpause button so the world starts spinning again
<pitti> mine things I'm going to have appointments in the middle of the night
<pitti> I suppose it's again time format FAIL
<rickspencer3> I see, whatever date you last selected in teh calendar, is selected when you open it again
<rickspencer3> nm
<rickspencer3> pitti, maybe you are experiencing truly aweful dls?
<pitti> dls?
<rickspencer3> like, in Germany, the move the clocks forward 8 hours?
<pitti> ah
<rickspencer3> daylight savings ;)
<pitti> rickspencer3: no, clocks only seem to do that when I wake up in the morning :)
<rickspencer3> heh
<rickspencer3> pitti, I got your email about my work items
<rickspencer3> I am almost done one of them
<rickspencer3> and will deal with the others
<pitti> rickspencer3: that's fun, as I didn't send one :)
<pitti> (it was an IRC ping, though)
<rickspencer3> hah
<pitti> rickspencer3: awesome, thanks
<rickspencer3> IRC ping? maybe that's why I actually responded ;)
<didrocks> if this time compiz don't want to load, I'll become aubergine on my faceâ¦
<rickspencer3> hah
<rickspencer3> hey, kenvandine, when you get a moment, could you please look at bug #739923
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 739923 in gwibber "GwibberPosterVBox reports an error and does not submit" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/739923
<rickspencer3> ?
<rickspencer3> basically, it's keeping photobomb from working ...
<rickspencer3> which makes it a CRITICAL
<kenvandine> hehe
<kenvandine> wtf
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, is it working for you?
<kenvandine> i haven't tried recently, but none of that code has changed
<rickspencer3> hmmm
<kenvandine> or i don't recall it changing :)
<kenvandine> was this working recently?
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, I have not tried it in a long time
 * rickspencer3 tries from here
<rickspencer3> camerabin stopped working too :,(
<kenvandine> worked for me
<kenvandine> i used gwibber-poster
<kenvandine> which just embeds a GwibberPosterVBox
<rickspencer3> hmmm
<rickspencer3> that's all photobomb did as well
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, is the code in your samples on launchpad correct?
<kenvandine> maybe not :)
<kenvandine> haven't looked in a while
<kenvandine>  /usr/bin/gwibber-poster should be a good example though
<rickspencer3> wow, if you search for "Ubuntu Logo" in Google IMage search with safe search off ...
<rickspencer3> you get some "interesting" results
<kenvandine> haha
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, hmmm, same problem on my desktop
<rickspencer3> wait a minute
<rickspencer3> I've got that whacky gtk2 with the scrollbar patch
<rickspencer3> that's all I can think that might be different
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, so do i
<kenvandine> is your code in photobomb trunk?
<rickspencer3> yah
<rickspencer3> and photobomb is in my PPA
 * kenvandine installs desktopcouch again :)
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, hold on, let me ensure the problem is not on my end
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, it's actually throwing the error *before* I click send
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, ah!
<kenvandine> well
<rickspencer3> well well
<kenvandine> not sure why... but it is setting the content
<kenvandine> which should be fine
<kenvandine> but it appears to be setting it before the expose-event maybe?
<kenvandine> i assume the bug is in GwibberPosterVBox
<rickspencer3> let me try to work around it
<kenvandine> so the actual affect is it doesn't update the text count on that initial content
<kenvandine> but if you type after it it does
<kenvandine> and is accurate
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, I'm trying to set the content in the expose event instead
<rickspencer3> I'll let you know how it works
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> i am assuming it is my bug though
<kenvandine> humm, no... gwibber-poster handles adding that content fine
<kenvandine> ah, right
<kenvandine> gwibber-poster does that in the expose event
<kenvandine> pitti, are you still around?
<pitti> kenvandine: yes, knee-deep in debugging cups' multiarch PAM breakage
<kenvandine> hehe... ugh
<kenvandine> i'll make this quick then
<kenvandine> we've had a bunch of bugs about the gwibber db getting too big and causing terrible slow downs
<kenvandine> purging old data, ffe?
<kenvandine> it is removing data that we provide no UI to display
<pitti> kenvandine: sounds fine to me
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> this should make lots of people happy :)
<kenvandine> thx
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, well, it no longers produces an error, but it seems to be silently failing to microblog for me ;)
<rickspencer3> also, the submitted even never gets called
<rickspencer3> oh
<rickspencer3> and my Gwibber feed is 3 days old :,(
 * rickspencer3 reboots
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, just saw your test post :)
<rickspencer3> yah
<rickspencer3> good progress
<rickspencer3> it doesn't seem like my "submit" handler is getting called, though
<rickspencer3> kenvandine ^
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, should the event be "activate" rather than "submit"?
<rickspencer3> hmmm, but then it could destroy the dialog before it microblogs
<kenvandine> no
<kenvandine>     self.poster.input.connect("submit", self.on_input_activate)
<kenvandine>     self.poster.button_send.connect("clicked", self.on_button_send_clicked)
<kenvandine> is what i used
<rickspencer3> I see
<rickspencer3> I hadn't connected the button up :?
<rickspencer3> d'oh
<DrDetroit> hello
<kenvandine> :-D
<DrDetroit> I have been using Ubuntu 10.04 LTS desktop since approx july 10
<DrDetroit> I have been quite satisfied except for the last two updates
<DrDetroit> for some reason my machine has begun to run very slowly
<DrDetroit> this happens on 2.6.32-30-generic and 2.6.32-29-generic but not 2.6.32-28-generic
<DrDetroit> has anyone else experienced this issue?
<DrDetroit> I have tried to use top itop and ps aux to isolate a process that is consuming my resources but I can foind nothing out of the ordinary
<DrDetroit> Can anyone point me in the right direction to troubleshoot my problem
<pitti> DrDetroit: I suggest to hop into #ubuntu-kernel; the guys there might be more able to help you
<pitti> this indeed sounds like a serious regression
<DrDetroit> thanks pitti i am already there
<DrDetroit> hehe
<DrDetroit> Its something I dont understand
<DrDetroit> i am on 28 now and all works fine, quick and speedy
<DrDetroit> if i go to 29 or 30 it turns to mush
<DrDetroit> since the issue goes away on the 28 kernel it is hard to make the case for a hardware issue
<speakman> hi folks
<pitti> good night everyone!
 * bryceh waves
<DrDetroit> nite
<speakman> Is there any way to trace bottlenecks on the desktop system? I'm currently on a Xeon W3680, 24GB 1333MHz ECC, 2xVertex 2 120GB SSD in RAID0 and it all just feel extremely laggy!
<DrDetroit> and thank you
<DrDetroit> what kernel?
<speakman> Linux sylpheed 2.6.35-28-generic #49-Ubuntu SMP Tue Mar 1 14:39:03 UTC 2011 x86_64 GNU/Linux
<bryceh> speakman, I see lags in firefox but chromium is working fine
<speakman> bryceh: I know, I know. But this is in general. Firefox rendering sucks big time
<speakman> This lag makes Flash player suck even more btw. Sometimes render the computer useless.
<DrDetroit> i have had issues wtih my machine slowing down
<bryceh> oh you're not even on natty, nevermind :-)
<speakman> no not natty. This is a production machine. :)
<bryceh> speakman, for technical support on non-development versions of ubuntu, you might try askubuntu.com or the forums
<bryceh> speakman, or #ubuntu if you prefer IRC support
<DrDetroit> When I run 2.6.32-30-generic or 2.6.32-29-generic my machine turns to mush but not on 2.6.32-28-generic
<speakman> bryceh: thanks, but I think this is a little too much lowlevel issue for #ubuntu
<speakman> (I've got only negative experiences from such places)
<speakman> And since I'm a deveoper myself, I figure I could help trace the bottlenecks if there tools available.
<DrDetroit> i guess the kernel guys are sorta busy
<DrDetroit> no answer so far
<DrDetroit> hehe
<DrDetroit> i can wait
<james_w> DrDetroit, you are better of in #ubuntu-kernel with kernel questions
<DrDetroit> i thought I asked a kernel question
<DrDetroit> hehe
<DrDetroit> I have been having problems with my Ubuntu 10,04 LTS running extreamly slow since my last two kernel updates
<DrDetroit> My previous 2 updates were 2.6.32-30-generic and 2.6.32-29-generic both exhibited the same strange slow behaviour, but I have regressed to 2.6.32-28-generic and have had no reduction in performance.
<james_w> yeah, but kernel experts hang around on #ubuntu-kernel rather than here, so I'm suggesting you ask there instead
<DrDetroit> I have tried top itop and ps aux to try and isolate the issue, but nothing stands out as eating up[ my cpu or memeory
<DrDetroit> Can anyone point me in the right direction to troubleshoot this issue
<DrDetroit> Hehe I did ask but there has not been an answer so far
<DrDetroit> not a problem
<DrDetroit> I hate to ask too often
<DrDetroit> I will ask again in a wjhile
<DrDetroit> dont want to be a channel spammer or anything like that
<DrDetroit> james_w I did ask on ubuntu-kernel
<james_w> ok
<james_w> well, I would stick there, they are the experts
<DrDetroit> nod
<DrDetroit> just looking for someone to point me in the right direction
<DrDetroit> thank you
<jasoncwarner> TheMuso bryceh RAOF robert_ancell https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2011-03-22
<jasoncwarner> everyone ready?
<robert_ancell> yup
<jasoncwarner> morning, robert_ancell!
<RAOF> Yup.
<bryceh> heya
<jasoncwarner> morning RAOF and bryceh
<jasoncwarner> ok...seems we have enough. Jumping in
<jasoncwarner> [TOPIC] X update
<bryceh> bugs bugs bugs
<RAOF> We now have the final Xserver 1.10 in Natty.
<RAOF> There shall no longer be any mass-rebuilds of the stack.  Yay!
<bryceh> got fixes in for the vesafb issue causing so many GPU lockups
<jasoncwarner> yay!
<bryceh> we're still seeing some scattered GPU lockups for other unrelated issues, but the rate of incoming bug reports has gone *way* down
<jasoncwarner> Well, I guess there needn't be a long update for X given where we are in cycle; I think "bugs" says it all ;)
<bryceh> also I got pitti's DuplicateSignature support added to the -intel apport hook, so that is helping reduce a lot of the triaging work (thanks pitti)
<bryceh> aside from fglrx I don't think we have any other outstanding bits.  raof, anything you know of we're pending on?
<RAOF> There's the middle-button emulation thingy, but that's not really pending.
<jasoncwarner> alright...
<bryceh> yeah, think it's just down to bugs.
<RAOF> It should be bugs from here on in!
<jasoncwarner> :)
<TheMuso> hey folks
<jasoncwarner> how about [TOPIC] AOB? Anything else?
<jasoncwarner> morning TheMuso
<TheMuso> sorry was caught up in email.
<jasoncwarner> if nothing, don't forget to update the wiki with your individual updates...
<bryceh> jasoncwarner, is it worth putting details about bug fixes on there?
<jasoncwarner> sure, if you think people would be interested...
<jasoncwarner> especially if something is of note :)
<bryceh> most are fairly time consuming but seem like of limited interest, and tend to be either jargony or long winded
<bryceh> heh, hard for me to judge; they seem noteworthy to me :-)
<RAOF> I'd only do it for big bug fixes.  Like if we, some magical day, re-enable intel on i855 and 845. :)
<jasoncwarner> yeah, but...you X guys are weird :/
<jasoncwarner> cool...thanks everyone...[END MEETING]
<bryceh> thanks
<RAOF> Bah!  Stop crashing, compiz!
<bryceh> RAOF, yeah, I have been WONTFIXing those and directing reporters upstream but I feel like the bad guy every time I do...
<RAOF> My sources suggest that 855 might be fixed in the onaeiric timeframe.
<TheMuso> RAOF: Yeah I've had compiz related issues too. Still feels raw to me.
<RAOF> It seems like alt-tab is a bit of a russian roulete situation.
<TheMuso> Yeah
<bryceh> RAOF, nice, although I'll have to believe it when I see it...  I've heard that every release since Feisty ;-)
<RAOF> :)
<RAOF> BAH!  And the dash!
<RAOF> Meep!  Is the pam update *really* meant to pop up a debconf question?
<TheMuso> RAOF: Might be worth asking in -devel.
 * didrocks waves goodbye
<rickspencer3> the new desktop <-> launchpad integration seems to be working well, at least for Quickly
<lifeless> rickspencer3: cool
<lifeless> rickspencer3: do you have any sense of the usage we should expect?
<lifeless> rickspencer3: so that we can have capacity
<rickspencer3> hmmm
<rickspencer3> hard to say
<rickspencer3> I wouldn't expect it to change too much yet
<rickspencer3> in fact, maybe it might go down a bit, aiui a few apps are going to break
<lifeless> I was meaning after the release :)
<lifeless> rickspencer3: to put it in context, we do between 3 and 5 million api requests a day at the moment
<rickspencer3> woah
<rickspencer3> lifeless, well, I think it will grow over time with this new system
<lifeless> rickspencer3: partly this is api inefficiency doing thousands of round trips (which directly correlates to the performance you perceieve in API applications)
<rickspencer3> well, actually ... how many of those requests required logging in?
<lifeless> rickspencer3: this is across the middle tier, so everything authenticated and everything anonymous that was a cache miss
<rickspencer3> anyway, I found the log in code most onerous to write in PyGtk
<rickspencer3> so, with this new system, I would not be surpised to see some increase in home rolled tooling
<lifeless> yeah
<rickspencer3> lifeless, well, thanks to lp for making this so much better!
<lifeless> anyhow, if there are plans or expectations for  (for instance) all ubuntu users to sign into LP via APIs - that would likely need some warning :)
<rickspencer3> lifeless, sure, no problem
 * rickspencer3 boggles
<rickspencer3> looks like I haven't dist-upgraded here for a while, getting the new xorg stack
<lifeless> gl
<rickspencer3> :)
<rickspencer3> with RAOF and bryceh, I know I am in good hands
 * rickspencer3 whistles non-chalantly
<nagappan> Is there a way, I can right click in Unity top panel ? with our product till Ubuntu 10.10 when the app starts an icon appears in notification area, but with 11.04 we are unable to see that, maybe we need to special case to add something in notification area ?
<patrickmw> jasoncwarner: do you know who can answer nagappan's question directly? ^
<jasoncwarner> nagappan: what are you trying to achieve?
<nagappan> jasoncwarner, our product VMware Workstation, have a tray icon
<nagappan> jasoncwarner, when the VM is powered on, it appears in the notification area, this works fine till Ubuntu 10.10 and now, we could not
<nagappan> jasoncwarner, do we need to change anything to appear there ? or it will not be possible for 3rd party app ?
<jasoncwarner> nagappan: I'm guessing vmware workstation uses the systray, which will eventually be phased out. There is a small whitelist of apps that can use in Natty (skype, some java apps).
<jasoncwarner> those apps wanting to keep the same functionality should port those to be indicators.
<nagappan> patrickmw, thanks, got input from jasoncwarner :-)
<jasoncwarner> nagappan: let me know if you need anything else...here are those links... again
<jasoncwarner> http://unity.ubuntu.com/projects/appindicators/
<jasoncwarner> and http://people.canonical.com/~ted/libappindicator/current/AppIndicator.html
<patrickmw> nagappan: ok good.  I knew that it was different, but wanted to make sure you got a straight answer
<jasoncwarner> (thanks rickspencer3 for being faster at finding your bookmarks than me ;) )
<nagappan> jasoncwarner, sure, thank you very much :-) also to patrickmw
<rickspencer3> nagappan, if you already have a panel applet, it should be easy to add app indicator support
<nagappan> rickspencer3, okay
<rickspencer3> jcastro has helped some other projects with that, I think
<nagappan> rickspencer3, okay
<didrocks> bye (again ;))
<TheMuso> Yay! With nux and unity trunk, I am regularly able to browse the launcher with orca now. Quicklists are still inaccessible, and that needs to be investigated, and Orca says all icons are grayed out, which is not the case, but other than that, I can see my launcher and run apps etc.
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, sweet!
<rickspencer3> good progress, anyway
<rickspencer3> altough, tbh, I was hoping Unity would be farther along by now
<rickspencer3> but, nice that it's starting to be accessible
<TheMuso> rickspencer3: Yeah likewise, but given that unity and nux themselves have been moving targets, its great that we are at this point by now at least.
<rickspencer3> TheMuso, how do you feel about the possibility that Unity won't be 100% accessible, and users will have to use the Classic Desktop?
<rickspencer3> (obviously it's not ideal, but is it terrible?)
<TheMuso> rickspencer3: Frankly I'd rather they have a working environment, and have a play with unity if they are feeling adventurous, than forcing a half accessible desktop on them. Thsi may be slightly offset if the Alt + F2 run dialog was accessible, but without that, it makes things much more difficult.
<jcastro> nagappan: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopExperienceTeam/ApplicationIndicators
<jcastro> there are code samples and links to everything you need there
<jcastro> if you need a hand mail me at jorge@ubuntu.com and I'll get you pointed in the right direction
<jcastro> nagappan: also the unity launcher has some nice things in it now you might want to consider using: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Unity/LauncherAPI
<rickspencer3> nagappan, jcastro makes a good point, an indicator may not be exactly what you need anymore
<nagappan> jcastro, rickspencer3 that's very useful info, will share the same to our developers
<nagappan> TheMuso, I found an updated at-spi2 release, will that hit beta1 ?
<nagappan> TheMuso, also today patrickmw showed me Ubuntu Software Center have push button, but that doesn't have accessible action, so we may not be able to perform actions through a11y interface
<TheMuso> nagappan: Re at-spi2, I am half way through refreshing mgorse's gnome 2 patch, so hope to have the latest at--spi2 uploaded by the end of the day, and since at-spi2 is in universe, thats not really going to affect beta as such.
<TheMuso> nagappan: As to software center, which push button do you refer to?
<nagappan> TheMuso, cool, I'm waiting for an important gtk fix with the update, probably will start testing at-spi2 from tomorrow
<nagappan> patrickmw, can you please provide more info to TheMuso ?
<patrickmw> nagappan, TheMuso: The buttons on the main viewport.  For example, Developer Tools
<TheMuso> Hrm ok, let me have a quick look now.
<TheMuso> patrickmw: Works for me here.
<TheMuso> I.e I can tab between those buttons, and I hear their titles.
<TheMuso> Oh actions.
 * TheMuso kicks unity-window-decorator and its many focus issues. grrr
<TheMuso> patrickmw: What actions do you speak of? I am able to use Orca flat review to click on a button.
<patrickmw> TheMuso, I was having issues with click
<TheMuso> Works fine here, running orca 2.91.92.
<patrickmw> TheMuso, ack.  let me try again so I can get more info
<nagappan> TheMuso, can you try with accerciser and do a click ?
<TheMuso> nagappan: Sure, let me kill orca first.
<TheMuso> Yup, accerciser is not seeing those individual buttons.
<TheMuso> Whereas Orca can navigate through the button hierarchy without issue.
<TheMuso> When accerciser is loaded, and I mouse over a button and press Control + ?, the whole canvas is hilighted.
<TheMuso> highlighted
<TheMuso> gah typing
<TheMuso> nagappan: May be a similar issue to the gedit combo box bug in GTK.
<nagappan> TheMuso, interesting
<nagappan> TheMuso, let me verify with Ubuntu 10.10 now
<TheMuso> Ok.
<nagappan> TheMuso, issue is same with Ubuntu 10.10 as well
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-03-23
<nagappan> TheMuso, BTW, the combo box bug have been fixed by mgorse - FYI
<robert_ancell> RAOF, wow, alt-tab is super crashy now...  See bug 740648
<RAOF> robert_ancell: Yeah.  I'm back in the classic session now.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, are you using ATI or other?
<RAOF> There seem to be at least three separate crashers in alt-tab now, none of which are in the driver code.
<RAOF> ATI and intel.
<robert_ancell> why is alt-tab so flaky?  It doesn't seem like that complicated a feature
<RAOF> But the crashers are in a glib closure that's not touching the driver stack.  Apart from the one which was in free() (!).
<RAOF> I presume that someone's hooked some handlers up to alt-tab that aren't particularly tested.
<RAOF> Notably this seems to only occur when unity's loaded.
<pitti> Good morning
<chrisccoulson> good morning pitti!
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hi pitti, how are you?
<didrocks> good morning
<chrisccoulson> hi didrocks
<didrocks> hey chrisccoulson
<pitti> bonjour didrocks
<didrocks> Guten Morgen pitti
<kmanzoor> hello
<pitti> back in ~ 1 h
<kmanzoor> ping()
<jasoncwarner> hey didrocks, around at all?
<didrocks> jasoncwarner: sure
<jasoncwarner> didrocks: morning :)
<jasoncwarner> hey...pitti and I were talking about what happens with ATI if the card/driver the person has won't run and what the default experience would be...figured we could talk through it if you didn't mind...
<didrocks> jasoncwarner: shouldn't be the same than nvidia? (in theory)
<didrocks> jasoncwarner: like the testing tool is failing
<jasoncwarner> so, my question was this...what happens if someone has an a card/driver combo that doesn't work...what will happen on boot for that person?
<didrocks> so, we fallback to the classic mode
<didrocks> oh
<didrocks> this is more a Xorg thing, right?
<didrocks> I know that currently, on nvidia, it's ackward
<didrocks> black screen
<jasoncwarner> well, I would think that if they can't run unity, yes, we would fallback to classic mode...but I was wondering about order of oeprations as well as initial experience for them
<didrocks> like, you need the -96 driver for your card
<jasoncwarner> like...do we try to boot unity...compiz crashes a couple of times and then we fall back'
<didrocks> and you forced to the current
<jasoncwarner> ?
<didrocks> xorg doesn't start
<didrocks> jasoncwarner: no, that was planned, but unfortunately nobody had the time to tackle it
<didrocks> I harrass the dx team for a month to at least, with have unity_support_test --compiz
<didrocks> which exist
<didrocks> but just trigger the same test than unity itself
<didrocks> (alone)
<jasoncwarner> so perhaps it is worth talking through a scenario, just so I can get my head wrapped around it.
<jasoncwarner> 1. from talkign to people, I hear there is a nux test that will tell us if they can run compiz/unity...is that right?
<didrocks> right, now, it just tell if you can run unity
<didrocks> so it's either unity / metacity
<jasoncwarner> ok
<didrocks> it's either unity - compiz / metacity - gnome-panel
<didrocks> to be exact :)
<didrocks> jasoncwarner: TBH, first test, I think we should ensure the testing tool is working fine
<didrocks> which isn't the case
<jasoncwarner> so lets say someone has an ATI card and fglrx. It happens that this combo doesn't run unity. What happens at boot?
<didrocks> and nobody has time to finish it
<didrocks> so, the testing tool should report "can't run unity"
<didrocks> (or crash evenâ¦)
<didrocks> in that case gnome-session go on "let's fallback"
<didrocks> and the guy should have metacity and gnome-panel started
<didrocks> the thing to access that and ensure we have the exact same level
<jasoncwarner> do they get a blank screen? a flicker? or does it appear to _try_ to load something and then fall back to GDM with a message saying "select classic desktop"?
<didrocks> is that the unity test tools really test every requirement
<jasoncwarner> or does it do it automaticallY?
<didrocks> jasoncwarner: no, it's automatic
<didrocks> ok, let's me sum up
<didrocks> there are multiple case that I implemented :)
<jasoncwarner> :)
<didrocks> so stock installation:
<didrocks> let's say the the testing tool is perfect, it can detect unity/compiz/metacity
<didrocks> you log in
<didrocks> the testing tool tries unity
<didrocks> "it can't" (crash/timeout or return 1)
<didrocks> gnome-session fallback in compiz and gnome-panel
<didrocks> fallback to a different UI, gnoeme-session knows that and prompt a message (will copy the message later)
<didrocks> tghen the testing tool tries compiz (<---- this is what is missing currently)
<didrocks> "let's say it can't"
<didrocks> so, we fallback to metacity + gnome-panel
<didrocks> (no message here as the ui is exactly the same)
<didrocks> let me show you the message
<jasoncwarner> so we really have three diff combos? Unity + compiz. Compiz + gnome-panel and metacity + gnome-panel?
<didrocks> "It seems that you do not have the hardware required to run Unity. Please choose the Ubuntu Classic Desktop at the login screen and you will be using the traditional environment.
<didrocks> "
<didrocks> even more :)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - well, i sort-of have swt-gtk working locally with webkit
<didrocks> because if you install unity-2D
<chrisccoulson> but i had to hack the binary ;)
<didrocks> (which isn't on the cd by default)
<didrocks> it will try unity + compiz
<didrocks> if it can't
<didrocks> it will fallback to unity2D + metacity
<chrisccoulson> i still haven't figured out why i'm seeing this problem
<didrocks> (which is always supported)
<didrocks> jasoncwarner: no warning message in this case as we have the same ui
<jasoncwarner> ok...so (recapping myself :) )
<chrisccoulson> hi jasoncwarner
<chrisccoulson> how are you?
<jasoncwarner> hey chrisccoulson...pretty good thanks! :0
<chrisccoulson> pitti - if i replace the cltq instruction in http://paste.ubuntu.com/584176/ with 2 nop's, then swt-gtk magically works
<jasoncwarner> didrocks: if they can't run unity, try compiz + gnome. If can't run compiz, enable metacity + gnome.
<chrisccoulson> which i think proves my point. now to figure out why gcc puts it there
<jasoncwarner> if Unity2d is installed, it becomes
<jasoncwarner> try Unity3d. If not, try Unit2d and then we are done b/c that will always work
<jasoncwarner> ?
<didrocks> jasoncwarner: right, the only missing piece today is "testing compiz without unity"
<didrocks> not on gnome-session in the test tool
<jasoncwarner> and that is missing b/c we just haven't had time to finish/test it?
<jasoncwarner> so if that doesn't work/get tested, can we just default to "if not unity3d, if not unity2d, use metacity + gnome"?
<didrocks> jasoncwarner: only dx opengl guys knows what's opengl req. for unity and compiz
<didrocks> jasoncwarner: also, that requires that we are sure that all opengl req. are tested so that we don't get then a crash believing that the card support unity which isn't the case
<jasoncwarner> ok...so we'll need to check with dbarth to see about getting that looked at..
<didrocks> jasoncwarner: so testing there :)
<didrocks> jasoncwarner: yes please :-)
<jasoncwarner> about how long would the rpocess take, start to finish
<jasoncwarner> if someone had to fall all the way back?
<didrocks> jasoncwarner: the test tool has a bug that it can take 4s on some machine in the live session (I had to put the timeout for 5s)
<didrocks> jasoncwarner: on my installed machine, it takes 0.7s
<didrocks> so, in the worst case, it's 2x0.7s
<didrocks> in the live, it's more of course
<jasoncwarner> about 8-10s...ok...
<didrocks> on a live of course :)
<jasoncwarner> yeah :)
<didrocks> I tested on a netbook, can be quite embarrassing, 2x2s approx
<jasoncwarner> ok...I think I have a handle on it now...
<jasoncwarner> btw...that message you gave me earlier...where does the user see that? when they finally get into a desktop session?
<jasoncwarner> or at gdm?
<didrocks> jasoncwarner: right now, only in the desktop session
<didrocks> jasoncwarner: that's a way we can explore later for OO I guess to get those sessions/fallback integated in the DM
<jasoncwarner> I like it better that they get to a desktop rather than make them select something in gdm first time in...no worries there...thanks!
<dbarth> didrocks, jasoncwarner: which additional gl reqs do you want us to test?
<didrocks> dbarth: just that the --compiz option is wired up
<didrocks> jasoncwarner: just not really possible today with gdm unfortunately
<didrocks> dbarth: and ensuring that the tests in the unity initilization are the same than in the testing tool (not the case today)
<pitti> didrocks, jasoncwarner: I think our concern was what happens if the testing tool says "thumbs up" (e. g. the driver claims to have the capabilities), but compiz keeps crashing due to a bug
<pitti> chrisccoulson: *bowing to your assembly sk1llz*
<didrocks> pitti: well, not really differently than today if compiz is crashing because it's not supported
<jasoncwarner> pitti: yeah, good case... didrocks, what happens there?
<didrocks> jasoncwarner: ^^
<pitti> chrisccoulson: that's "convert long to quad"?, i. e. destroys the upper 32 bits?
<didrocks> meaning you will see (still needs testing, respawn is under work and don't work with latest version as announced) compiz respawning/crashing
<didrocks> but that's already the case today
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, i'm losing the upper 32 bits of the pointer, which is making it crash later on
<pitti> chrisccoulson: do you know how that got in there, i. e. from which C operation? sounds like a typecast of some way?
<pitti> didrocks: right; I think it's a corner case really, it just came up in discussion
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i'm not too sure yet, as the function is pretty much identical to all the others in that object file (and it's the only one which ends up with that cltq instruction)
<didrocks> pitti: TBH, I really want to address that in the long term. It just seems the ETOOMUCH for this cycle :)
<pitti> didrocks: no worries
<dbarth> didrocks: the --compiz is still not there?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - bug 740815 :)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 740815 in xulrunner-2.0 "[FFe] Updates to enable us to drop xulrunner from main" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/740815
<chrisccoulson> it's actually quite a bit of work :(
<chrisccoulson> i might need a bit of help with some of that
<didrocks> dbarth: it's there, but it's fake. it has the same test req. than unity
<dbarth> didrocks: ahhhhh
<didrocks> dbarth: well, basically, it's not that bad with the test that way
<didrocks> dbarth: it's just that the user has either compiz + unity or metacity + gnome-panel
<pitti> chrisccoulson: quite a long list :)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, it's longer than i thought ;)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: that's for xulrunner-2.0, not for -1.9.2, right?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - that's for both
<pitti> chrisccoulson: would it be a significant win to only get it half-done for natty? I. e. less porting work when we switch to ffox 5?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - the only issue is if we ship with it in main, we are sort-of committed to supporting it (and that would mean porting everything really, so we don't break universe)
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, is it only gwibber which keeps gnome-python-extras in main?
<chrisccoulson> it certainly looks like it
<seb128> what is gwibber using from it?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - python-gtkspell
<pitti> chrisccoulson: thanks for the analysis -- it is quite some work indeed, but it seems feasible; and it's nicely parallelizable
<pitti> chrisccoulson: g-p-e is pretty much obsolete by itself
<pitti> chrisccoulson: in oneiric, when we switch to gtk 3, we need to get rid of it anyway
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - the issue with having gnome-python-extras in main is that it keeps xulrunner in main (with python-gtkmozembed), and the only things using it are in universe
<chrisccoulson> which is the same situation i have with swt-gtk
<chrisccoulson> pitti - oh, that's cool that it is going away then :)
<seb128> if you want to get ride of it in main for natty duplicate the source
<pitti> confirmed, no other build/binary depends in main
<seb128> stop building -mozembed from g-p-e
<seb128> then add a g-p-e-universe which builds only that
<seb128> it's a small cost
<pitti> so for gwibber we'd need to build a .gir for libgtkspell, and then use that instead of the python binding
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i guess we could do that
<seb128> pitti, you can mix pygtk and gi?
<seb128> pitti, gwibber is not using gi
<pitti> seb128: depends
<pitti> you can't mix gi.repository.Gtk with pygtk
<seb128> well in any case that seems a next cycle sort of thing
<pitti> you can certainly mix e. g. gi.repository.GUdev with pygtk
<seb128> it would require building the .gir and porting gwibber
<pitti> gtkspell links with libgtk, so it might be an issue
<seb128> we better duplicate the source for natty
<rodrigo_> morning
<seb128> hey rodrigo_
<pitti> seb128: i. e. build a python-gtkspell source?
<pitti> and drop g-p-e to universe?
<seb128> pitti, what I just wrote 15 lines before
<pitti> ah, sorry
<seb128> <seb128> if you want to get ride of it in main for natty duplicate the source
<seb128> <seb128> stop building -mozembed from g-p-e
<seb128>  then add a g-p-e-universe which builds only that
<pitti> or that way around
<seb128> I've no strong preference which way it's done, as long as things needed in main are still built from the main source
<pitti> note:
<pitti> try:
<seb128> well I would go for that rather than starting porting things to gi for this cycle
<pitti>   import gtkspell
<pitti> except:
<pitti>   gtkspell = None
<pitti> so in the simplest case we could just drop the spell check :)
<pitti> (... dependency)
<seb128> we could, be still it seems we have no reason
<pitti> hmm
<seb128> there is no issue with python-gtkspell
<pitti>         self.spell = util.gtkspell.Spell(self, None)
<pitti> that's the only call to gtkspell ever in gwibber
<pitti> and self.spell is not used anywhere !?
<pitti> dpkg -L gwibber|xargs grep spell
<seb128> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gwibber/+bug/451374
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 451374 in gwibber "gwibber is not spellchecking" [Low,Fix released]
<pitti> same for grepping the entire source
<seb128> suggests that spell checking is working though
<pitti> ah, it probably attaches itself to the gtk.TextView, nevermind
<pitti> seb128: anyway, its API is tiny
<chrisccoulson> pitti - do you think you'd be able to fix that then? :)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: building a .gir should be easy
<chrisccoulson> excellent, thanks :)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: but it requires porting gwibber to gtk gi as well
<chrisccoulson> oh, that's a bit of a pain i guess ;)
<pitti> so it's not for natty, I'm afraid, we have to go with the source split
<chrisccoulson> ok, that shouldn't be too much of an issue
<pitti> chrisccoulson: it's not a separate API, it basically provides an extension of Gtk.TextView
<chrisccoulson> is Sweetshark not around today?
<seb128> the split is tiny cost
<seb128> it's not like g-p-e had weekly uploads and those would need to stay in sync
<pitti> *nod*
<pitti> seb128: I doubt that it will get a lot more releases in the first place
<pitti> upstream has certainly ceased to work on it
<seb128> right, I would really got the split in natty
<seb128> we will go gi next cycle
<seb128> seems that ported gwibber to gi now is calling for extra work and issues
<seb128> that "porting"
<pitti> gwibber is quite large, porting would be quite an issue
<pitti> and it's a lot harder to port to PyGI gtk2 than to gtk3
<pitti> gtk3 pretty much just works now, but gtk2 is still a bit of a pain
<pitti> just one week ago I committed http://git.gnome.org/browse/gtk+/commit/?h=gtk-2-24&id=6e178a69fc73b45f66fc511f7a274b8fefc2e2e7 which fixes more stuff (not even in natty yet), but we'll keep running into those
<pitti> chrisccoulson: so, I'm happy to help out with some bits
<pitti> just not today; I really need to take "off" today to catch up with bureaucracy, I need to do the brainstorm review for tech board and the performance review stuff
<pitti> chrisccoulson: for gtk-vnc and friends, do you think it's cleaner to build against ffox-dev or copy headers? the latter sounds very .. unelegant
 * pitti fixes a broken crash bug and restarts the amd64 retracer
<chrisccoulson> pitti - we can build againt firefox-dev, but other npapi plugins (eg, totem) already include their own headers
<chrisccoulson> npapi is cross-browser, so depending on firefox or xulrunner is quite a heavy dependency just to build a browser plugin
<chrisccoulson> (a plugin which will work in any browser, too)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: what happens if e. g. ffox 5 changes the API/ABI? with firefox-dev it would fail to build, with header copies it would crash; the former seems better?
<pitti> or is npapi basically stable?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - npapi is pretty stable (i don't think it's changed for a long time)
<chrisccoulson> that would break things like flash
<pitti> chrisccoulson: ok; my gut feeling is still that ffox-dev is better, if for nothing else than to avoid code copies?
<chrisccoulson> yeah, we can do
<chrisccoulson> as long as people are aware that we don't need to rebuild these plugins when we do a major firefox update
<pitti> chrisccoulson: ah, you forgot to subscribe -release, so my first few comments went into the void
<chrisccoulson> pitti - oops :/
<pitti> (no worries)
<chrisccoulson> sorry about that ;)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I'll leave the evaluation of the libreoffice tasks to Sweetshark
<pitti> chrisccoulson: libmozjs is also a stable sub-API of xulrunner? i. e. it's by and large just a splitout?
<chrisccoulson> pitti, cool, thanks
<chrisccoulson> pitti - libmozjs isn't terribly stable, which is the motivation for decoupling it from the firefox release schedule (and upstream are even going to provide release tarballs for that too)
<chrisccoulson> the official release tarballs just won't get the same frequency of updates as firefox
<chrisccoulson> ie, we'll be able to support it for a LTS without needing to upgrade it
<pitti> chrisccoulson: for icedtea, that sounds like it wouldn't need the firefox bits at all, and just globally disable the xpcom stuff (which happens now anyway?)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - mozilla bug 628723 for the libmozjs stuff
<ubot2> Mozilla bug 628723 in JavaScript Engine "Create JS 1.8.5 source release" [Normal,Assigned] http://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=628723
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, icedtea still needs the npapi headers though (but it looks like that's all it needs)
<GunnarHj> pitti: Hi Martin,
<GunnarHj> pitti: Struggling with bug 740754 and C syntax. A helping hand from you - or somebody else you suggest - would be much appreciated.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 740754 in gdm "Language selection for newly created user confusing" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/740754
<pitti> GunnarHj: can you please subscribe me? I'm afraid I won't get to it today, but I'm happy to review the bug tomorrow
<pitti> (or just ping other people, lots of folks here should be proficient with C)
<GunnarHj> pitti: Ok, just subscribed you. Maybe I ask somebody else later, as well.
<chrisccoulson> pitti - oh, turning on -Wall in swt-gtk helps a bit ;)
<chrisccoulson> webkitgtk.c: In function âJava_org_eclipse_swt_internal_webkit_WebKitGTK__1webkit_1get_1default_1sessionâ:webkitgtk.c:775:2: warning: implicit declaration of function âwebkit_get_default_sessionâ
<chrisccoulson> i should have done that  at the start ;)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: oh, might that be the reason for the invalid conversions?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, i guess so
<pitti> chrisccoulson: as C implicitly assumes an int f(int) signature?
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i think that's going to be the problem :)
<chrisccoulson> phew
<chrisccoulson> :)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: wow, that seems serious enough to always warn about, not just with -Wall..
<chrisccoulson> i almost thought i wasn't going to be able to figure that out ;)
 * pitti ^5s chrisccoulson
 * chrisccoulson ^5s pitti too
<chrisccoulson> pitti - http://paste.ubuntu.com/584212/
<chrisccoulson> fixed \o/
<pitti> awesome!
<pitti> chrisccoulson: this is the kind of error which really should just abort compilation entirely :(
<pitti> I see little point of assuming an ABI for an unknown function
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i'm surprised that it doesn't already
<pitti> the fun of C
<chrisccoulson> heh
<seb128> the buildds fail the build on implicit declaration warnings
<seb128> well they grep the build log for those and fail the build if there is some
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - the issue here is that there wouldn't have been any in the log
<chrisccoulson> (as it's built without -Wall)
<seb128> right, I was just pointing it ;-)
<chrisccoulson> well, it's not built with any warnings enabled
<chrisccoulson> that's probably a bug ;)
<Daviey> chrisccoulson, if it compiles, ship it!  That is my mantra :)
<chrisccoulson> heh :)
<GunnarHj> seb128: Hi Sebastien, do you possibly have time to help with a C syntax problem in GDM?
<seb128> GunnarHj, yes?
<seb128> mterry, hey
<mterry> seb128, hi!
<seb128> mterry, how busy are you today? ;-)
<GunnarHj> seb128: The attachment to bug 740754 explains the problem, I think.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 740754 in gdm "Language selection for newly created user confusing" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/740754
<mterry> seb128, I can become busier. I was just about to dump eclipse (it's got too much to work on for natty, I believe -- will leave brain dump in bug)
<seb128> mterry, ok, so https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/indicator-datetime/+bugs
<seb128> mterry, mtp just opened quite some bugs, especially the location dynamic list is not working great
<seb128> mterry, like it doesn't use translations, doesn't match things correctly
<seb128> bug #740870
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 740870 in indicator-datetime ""Location" auto-complete menu doesn't understand "london"" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/740870
<seb128> bug #740874
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 740874 in indicator-datetime ""Location" auto-complete menu doesn't know about San Francisco, USA" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/740874
<seb128> bug #740884
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 740884 in indicator-datetime ""Location" auto-complete menu often offers duplicate suggestions" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/740884
<seb128> mterry, etc
<mterry> seb128, yup, those look like my bugs  :)(
<seb128> mterry, karl seems to be busy enough with what is assigned to him
<kmanzoor> hello
<seb128> mterry, could you maybe try to tackle some of those today?
<seb128> mterry, just pick anything in the list you feel like doing
<seb128> mterry, the idea is to improve a bit the indicator ;-)
<mterry> seb128, yup  :)  I'm on it
<seb128> mterry, thanks
<seb128> dbarth, ^
<kmanzoor> today upgraded from 7.10 to 8.4 - it was a great experience
<mterry> seb128, what is this 'sniffles' tag?  :)
<seb128> mterry, it's a design thing I think
<seb128> you can try asking mpt
<seb128> but seems like what design guys spot when they do a review
<dbarth> seb128, mterry: cool, thanks; karl is also doing the triaging of the bug list at the same time; he's taking the string changes as a priority
<kmanzoor> is Hardy Heron still supported ? i checked this on wikipedia. On kubuntu page it said it is not spported but on the ubuntu page it is mentioned that it is still supported.  I want to install the restricted extra - meaning i want to have the adobe flash. Should i upgrade all the way to 9.10 or i can keep on running Hardy Heron ?
<mterry> kmanzoor, it is still supported on Desktop until April
<mterry> kmanzoor, server for longer
<kmanzoor> i am using desktop
<rodrigo_> hmm, just upgraded and I get 'C++ compiler cannot create executables' error on configure
<mterry> kmanzoor, but if you were to upgrade, I wouldn't recommend 9.10, you can jump right to 10.04, the new LTS
<rodrigo_> any idea if g++ is broken or something?
<mterry> kmanzoor, but this isn't the best channel anyway.  for support questions like that, try #ubuntu
<rodrigo_> 'Unrecognized option -qversion'
<kmanzoor> ok i joined #ubuntu
<rodrigo_> pitti, just got your mail about the nautilus folder view thing, so just to say that yes, I'm willing to do it :-)
<rodrigo_> pitti, I'll read it in more detail in a bit
<dbarth> seb128: pitti: i've updated the FFE request at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gtk+2.0/+bug/730740
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 730740 in gtk+2.0 "Provide support for dynamically loading the new overlay scrollbar feature" [Wishlist,Confirmed]
<chrisccoulson> pitti - ok, i think i've got all swt-gtk packages ready
<chrisccoulson> Daviey, are you able to test euca, or is it broken to the point of not being testable?
<Daviey> chrisccoulson, I think it might be possible actually... The breakage we have now is starting an instance, but i don't think swt-gtk is related to that!
<Daviey> It's the web ui... so yes... should be able to test that
<chrisccoulson> cool, thanks
<Daviey> chrisccoulson, will keep you posted, thanks.
<seb128> re
<seb128> rodrigo_, no clue about the gcc error
<cyphermox> good morning!
<seb128> hey cyphermox
<seb128> how are you?
<cyphermox> seb128, doing alright
<seb128> cyphermox, did you get any upstream comment about your gnome-media work? I noticed the merge request but I'm not sure to understand enough about it to have an opinion
<cyphermox> seb128, no I didn't yet. I should go poke somebody on gimpnet I guess
<seb128> did you file it on gnome-media or gnome-control-center?
<seb128> did that code move to g-c-c this cycle?
<cyphermox> I think so yes
<seb128> did you file it on g-c-c?
<cyphermox> seb128, the best way to understand what is going on is to start mumble without an external mic, then plug one in and try to switch the input device from gnome-volume-control, not mumble
<seb128> it's likely that nobody is reading gnome-media bugs, they do read g-c-c ones though
<cyphermox> no, you're right, I filed it against gnome-media, 2.32 or whatever
<seb128> try moving it to g-c-c
<cyphermox> seb128, yeah
<cyphermox> I'm getting a 500 now though ;)
<seb128> or ping hadess on IRC
<seb128> right, seems bgo is down since yesterday evening
<cyphermox> ah
<GunnarHj> seb128: Will be away for an hour or so. Pls submit possible questions to the bug in the meantime.
<seb128> ok, I noticed the mumble issue
<seb128> GunnarHj, sorry I had it open in a tab but I had to run for lunch
<seb128> GunnarHj, I will
<GunnarHj> seb128: No problem, see you later.
<seb128> GunnarHj, the issue is obvious in your example
<seb128> GunnarHj, *language is a pointer pointing to nothing
<seb128> GunnarHj, you need to allocate some memory and point to it
<GunnarHj> seb128: Well, nothing about C is obvious to me. ;-)  How could it work in the separate script then?
<seb128> GunnarHj, the small example segfaults there
<seb128> you might be lucky and get the pointer hitting a memory address you can use
<seb128> but that's only luck
<seb128> chrisccoulson, bug #739497 is not a g-c-c issue right?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 739497 in gnome-control-center "firefox 4.0 is not default by default" [Low,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/739497
<cyphermox> seb128, I pinged hadess, I'll see when I get a response
<seb128> ok
<seb128> GunnarHj, hey again, did you see my comments before timeouting?
<pitti> rodrigo_: ah, great, thanks!
<GunnarHj> seb128: No, I didn't.
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - the issue is that firefox is expecting to be default in gio and gconf, and we aren't setting /desktop/gnome/url-handlers/http to firefox by default anymore
<chrisccoulson> although
<chrisccoulson> that check is meant to be disabled in firefox anyway
<seb128>  GunnarHj, the small example segfaults there
<seb128>  you might be lucky and get the pointer hitting a memory address you can use
<seb128>  but that's only luck
<chrisccoulson> not sure why it's enabled
<seb128> chrisccoulson, why do we stopped setting the key?
<GunnarHj> seb128: Ok, I'll try your idea and come back. Thanks!
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I though we said we would still set both for compatibility reasons
<seb128> that's what the capplet does
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - actually, i'm wondering whether we ever did. perhaps we only see it now because the default browser check is enabled
<seb128> we did for sure
<seb128> there was a .gconf-defaults changing the default
<seb128> oh that's in gnome-vfs and got dropped
<chrisccoulson> yeah, it's now sensible-browser by default
<chrisccoulson> so, we should probably re-add that then
<seb128> right
<seb128> if you want to do it please do it
<seb128> since you own gnome-vfs now ;-)
<chrisccoulson> sure, no problem
<chrisccoulson> i'll disable the check in firefox too
<chrisccoulson> it used to always be turned off
<pitti> chrisccoulson: great work! now hoping that it'll actually work with euca :)
<pitti> smspillaz: thanks for fixing the edge snapping and the shadow spillover!
<pitti> smspillaz: --geoemtry placement works as well again
<pitti> I now lost all my compiz pet bugs!
<smspillaz> pitti: :)
<pitti> (except for the crashes :) )
<smspillaz> pitti: the crashes?
<smspillaz> pitti: there's one more which will drive you insane if you aren't careful
<pitti> got bug 740757 twice this morning after login
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 740757 in nux "compiz crashed with SIGSEGV in __libc_free()" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/740757
<smspillaz> oh, that's a nux bug
<pitti> smspillaz: we already have a workaround for the gvfs related one
<pitti> i. e. crash when plugging in a usb drive
<pitti> that was the other one which wreaked havoc
<smspillaz> pitti: open gedit, open a find window, close it, notice invisible window
<pitti> (but that was in unity)
<pitti> smspillaz: ah, indeed -- I haven't stumbled over that one at all yet (can reproduce, though)
<pitti> smspillaz: it doesn't happen with vi in the terminal :-P
<pitti> I need to run out for about two hours; friend of mine defends his diploma thesis :)
<Amaranth> pitti: actually --geometry and those other bugs are probably only fixed because we're using gtk-window-decorator again
<didrocks> Amaranth: no, we are not with laltest upload
<didrocks> pitti: ensure you have the latest version with the unity-window-decorator
<Amaranth> didrocks: Oh, you already uploaded another one?
<didrocks> Amaranth: 5 hours ago approx :)
<didrocks> smspillaz was quick to fix the issue
<Amaranth> didrocks: Ah well unless he fixed more then the bugs pitti talked about should still apply with the latest upload then since they are unity-window-decorator bugs
<didrocks> Amaranth: there are some fixes in it
<Amaranth> I reopened the bug report about it but I couldn't reopen the unity task so I dunno if it was on your radar
<didrocks> Amaranth: hum? the snap taking the shadow?
<Amaranth> yeah
<Amaranth> That would be the reason --geometry doesn't work right too
<smspillaz> Amaranth: .... --geometry works fine here
 * bcurtiswx waves to room
<bcurtiswx> kenvandine, sorry I couldn't get tp-glib out quick enough :-\
<dobey> mvo: hey. the thing that PackageKit and sessioninstaller don't handle is adding a new repository, right?
<rodrigo_> a couple of branches up for review/merge/upload: https://code.launchpad.net/~rodrigo-moya/ubuntu/natty/evolution/fix-717971/+merge/54526 and https://code.launchpad.net/~rodrigo-moya/ubuntu/natty/nautilus/fix-662194/+merge/54337 so, can someone have a look please?
<mvo> dobey: yeah, that needs the normal aptdaemon system interface
<dobey> ok
 * rodrigo_ lunch
<seb128> rodrigo_, will do
<seb128> rodrigo_, did you get cosimoc to review the nautilus one? did you fix the default value thing we discussed yesterday?
<chrisccoulson> is there any equivalent of DEB_SRCDIR from cdbs in dh7?
<cdbs> chrisccoulson: check out man dh, maybe you can modify it in the call to dh $@ ?
<ricotz> seb128, hi, i had a look at the new mutter source
<chrisccoulson> cdbs - man dh doesn't really say anything
<ricotz> seb128, is it possible to enable arm builds in the gnome3 ppa?
<cdbs> chrisccoulson: dh $@ --builddirectory=DIR is what you need?
<seb128> ricotz, not that I know about
<seb128> ricotz, the virtual ppa don't do armel I think
<cdbs> chrisccoulson: ah, got it, its --sourcedirectory=
<chrisccoulson> cdbs, i'm not sure. i can try, but if that is the equivalent of DEB_BUILDDIR, then it won't work
<chrisccoulson> oh, thanks
<cdbs> chrisccoulson: dh $@ --sourcedirectory=DIR
<kenvandine> bcurtiswx, sorry i took it over.. :)
<kenvandine> bcurtiswx, but i needed it
<ricotz> seb128, there are some "ppa like" which have this support
<ricotz> seb128, ok
<seb128> ricotz, non virtual ppas like the security team ones right
<seb128> but those have higher security constrains
<ricotz> seb128, yes
<seb128> they don't set such ppas for random team builds
<bcurtiswx> kenvandine, im guessing you didn't notice my bug report on it, sicne IIRC the bug report's still open
<ricotz> ok wasnt aware there are more types of ppas
<kenvandine> bcurtiswx, oh... no i didn't
<chrisccoulson> cdbs - thanks, that looks like what i want
<chrisccoulson> there's a reason i still use cdbs in firefox, this stuff is just so much easier there :)
<seb128> kenvandine, can you review https://code.launchpad.net/~marcelstimberg/indicator-me/translator-comments/+merge/52346 ? it's pending for some weeks
<kenvandine> seb128, yeah, it's on my todo list
<seb128> kenvandine, bug #739319 might be worth putting on your natty list, it got 3 duplicates, seems for some reason the indicator fails to get the username sometimes, could be a race on session start
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 739319 in indicator-me "unity-panel-service crashed with SIGABRT in g_simple_async_result_complete()" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/739319
<seb128> kenvandine, one easy way would be to not g_error but to return when that happens
<kenvandine> seb128, ok
<seb128> kenvandine, thanks
<GunnarHj> seb128: Tried your suggestion, but ...  I posted the latest code as a comment on bug 740754.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 740754 in gdm "Language selection for newly created user confusing" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/740754
<seb128> kenvandine, no hurry for the crash but I will assign it to you
<kenvandine> thx
<seb128> GunnarHj, no clue what is wrong, does it still crash?
<seb128> mterry, not sure if you work on that but the location completion is suboptimal
<mterry> seb128, k
<seb128> mterry, like typing "Lon" lists "KÅ«h-e SÄlon" first
<mterry> seb128, you saying you didn't want that one?  :)
<seb128> or "Pari" lists "GioÃºpari"
<seb128> mterry, ;-)
<seb128> it should perhaps matches thing that start with what you type first?
<mterry> seb128, probably
<mterry> I believe ubiquity has same issue
<mterry> except it will give london first for that particular query because of a different quirk
<seb128> mterry, is that your reply to all issues in that code? ;-)
<seb128> let's just blame it all on ev :p
<mterry> seb128, yup!   spec said "do it like ubiquity"
<GunnarHj> seb128: It depends on how you define "crash", but it freezes, and the field for typing the pw does not appear.
<seb128> GunnarHj, sorry today is a bit busy with the beta freeze being tomorrow
<seb128> GunnarHj, I don't really have time for that now but ping me again tomorrow if you didn't figure it out by then
<GunnarHj> seb128: No problem; I'll get back to either you or Martin tomorrow, then.
<seb128> nessita, hey
<nessita> seb128: hi there!
<nessita> seb128: how is it going?
<seb128> nessita, I noticed that a new sso tarball got rolled yesterday, let me know if you need sponsoring
<seb128> nessita, I'm fine thanks, what about you?
<nessita> pretty, pretty good :-)
<nessita> seb128: and yes, you're a great magician, I need a sponsorship: https://code.launchpad.net/~nataliabidart/ubuntu/natty/ubuntu-sso-client/ubuntu-sso-client-1.1.12/+merge/54531
<seb128> nessita, on it ;-)
<nessita> :-)
<seb128> nessita, well my magic trick is http://people.canonical.com/~platform/desktop/versions.html
<nessita> I know, I have to apply for upload right
<seb128> nessita, but don't tell anybody :p
 * nessita bookmarks
<rickspencer3> seb128, not sure who to mention this to, but I did a dist-upgrade yesterday ... yesterday everything was fine, but this morning I had to manual start Unity
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, it seems that Gwibber did not start for me when I started up today
<seb128> rickspencer3, did you get a .crash?
 * rickspencer3 looks
 * kenvandine waits
<seb128> rickspencer3, did you switch to french locale? it might be a strike day
<seb128> i.e things refusing to start
<seb128> ;-)
<rickspencer3> seb128, no, but I did log in as a different user last night, and in that user I use the classic desktop
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, not of that should matter
<kenvandine> ~/.cache/gwibber/gwibber.log
<seb128> rickspencer3, can you copy your .xsession-errors online?
<seb128> rickspencer3, if you are still in the session where you had the issues
<cdbs> didrocks: Hi, looks like gimp doesn't have any internal mechanism to start the new image window from the command line. So should I make a dynamic quicklist?
<rickspencer3> seb128, kenvandine bear with me, I'll get a chance to look at that soon
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, no worries
<kenvandine> :)
<didrocks> cdbs: dynamic quicklists aren't wired in unity, so not for gimp
<rickspencer3> seb128, there is a crash dump for compiz
<rickspencer3> where do .xsession-errors go?
<cdbs> didrocks: but ultimately they will be, right?
<didrocks> cdbs: not for natty though
<cdbs> didrocks: wha? Dynamic quicklists won't work in Natty ? :(
<seb128> rickspencer3, it's a file in your user dir
<seb128> rickspencer3, please ubuntu-bug -c .crash
<didrocks> cdbs: patch welcomed :)
<didrocks> if the crash is the one from this morning
<didrocks> rickspencer3: ensure the crash is the one from this morning, first, ls -l /var/crash/*compiz*crash
<cdbs> didrocks: That's a nice Canonical way to get contributors to work on stuff :) That's the 3rd time someone has said that to me
<rickspencer3> didrocks, yeah, I checked that
<didrocks> cdbs: heh, just jump in then :)
<rickspencer3> dang it:
<cdbs> didrocks: okay, then
<rickspencer3> Your computer does not have enough free memory to automatically analyze the problem and send a report to the developers.
<rickspencer3> ?
<rickspencer3> lol
<cdbs> rickspencer3: I get that frequently
<rickspencer3> not my morning
<cdbs> looks like apport hogs up a lot of memory?
 * cdbs needs more ram btw
<rickspencer3> seb128, shall I manually upload?
<rickspencer3> I could ubuntu-bug compiz and then attach the crash file
<kenvandine> weird, just tested a guest session and got no window decorations at all... but window management still worked fine
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, that makes sense if just the decorator crashed
<seb128> kenvandine, that's a known bug
<kenvandine> usually i only get that when compiz crashes... then nothing works
<kenvandine> seb128, ok
<seb128> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/compiz/+bug/730495
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 730495 in compiz "unity-window-decorator doesn't start on secondary X session" [High,Confirmed]
<seb128> kenvandine, ^
<kenvandine> ah
<kenvandine> seb128, man you are always so fast with the bug urls :)
<cdbs> seb128 is seb128
 * Amaranth tries to think of why that would happen
<Amaranth> The detection of other decorators and such uses properties on the X root window so that should be per-session
<seb128> kenvandine, well, the awesome bar in firefox works great ;-)
 * kenvandine must not use it right :)
<seb128> but yeah, you need so spend some time going through bugs and to had those open before to get them listed
<bcurtiswx> you'll all have to let me know if ffx4 > google, seems to still have java rendering problem
<seb128> then you only need to remember keywords from the title ;-)
<bcurtiswx> no no flash i meant
<seb128> nessita, uploaded
<nessita> seb128: awesome, thanks
<nessita> tedg: hey there, would you have some minutes to follow up in the messaging menu icon conversation from yesterday?
<tedg> nessita, Sure.
<rickspencer3> seb128, bug #741030
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 741030 in compiz "compiz crash on startup" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/741030
<nessita> tedg: so, you were saying we would need to patch something to have different icons, right?
<dobey> yes
<tedg> nessita, Yeah, we need to patch indicator-messages so that it would auto-add the "-panel" name on the icon string so that they'd get replaced by the theme if available.
<tedg> nessita, I think that makes sense to do overall.
<nessita> tedg: is that doable or is that our of the question at this point in the cycle?
<nessita> out*
<didrocks> rickspencer3: btw, there is a new compiz available since your update
<rickspencer3> natch ;)
<tedg> nessita, It's probably doable, but we'd need some freeze requests.  Should be a small patch though.
<tedg> nessita, It's probably something we should convince the desktop team is important enough to grant those requests before spending time on.  (you know how they are ;) )
<nessita> :-)
<nessita> I know they are awesome! :-D
 * nessita prepares the field
<rickspencer3> didrocks, I thought I saw a new Unity in  my change mail yesterday
<rickspencer3> is that *the* Unity for B1, or are you still planning a releast late tonight?
<tedg> seb128, kenvandine, thoughts on adding "-panel" to application icons in the messaging menu and enabling fallback support there? ^
<seb128> rickspencer3, release this night
<didrocks> rickspencer3: no, it's not. We still plan for a late release
<didrocks> rickspencer3: the new compiz is breaking the ABI of all plugins
<didrocks> rickspencer3: so, I had to reupload all plugins to rebuild with the new compiz
<kenvandine> tedg, no strong opinions
<seb128> tedg, not before beta1
<ogra_> .oO( and doesnt build on arm )
<rickspencer3> so is the Unity tonight just a rebuild, or are there new features/bugs as well?
<seb128> tedg, let's merge was is pending today and deal with crashers
<rickspencer3> didrocks ^
<nessita> seb128: I would need your input on the following: you mentioned a while ago that the control panel should have a monochromatic icon in the messaging menu. Turns out that, after some input from tedg, we realized we can't set specific icons for the messaging menu (the same, colorful icon defined in the .desktop file is used for the main menu, the launcher and the messaging entry). tedg says we could do something about it but that 
<nessita> ahead with that?
<seb128> tedg, we can do a ffe for that next week
<didrocks> rickspencer3: juste a rebuild
<didrocks> just*
<seb128> nessita, ^ what I just replied to ted
<rickspencer3> didrocks, so, theoretically, not too many bugs to fix in Unity before B1?
<tedg> seb128, Yeah, I wasn't thinking for B1, just that we'd need the FFe and whether you'd be open to it.  The patch should be small.
<didrocks> ogra_: the doesn't build on arm is because a kde dep is broken on arm
<nessita> seb128: awesome. tedg, shall I file a bug?
<seb128> rickspencer3, no, the one you got was a rebuild, they plan on rolling a new version at end of the day and didrocks will upload early tomorrow
<tedg> nessita, Yes, please.
<didrocks> ogra_: I relaunched it this morning, still broken
<seb128> nessita, yes
<ogra_> didrocks, yeah, i saw that :/
<didrocks> rickspencer3: well, the list is still opens
<rickspencer3> I see
<rickspencer3> didrocks, yeah, so new features and bugs
<ogra_> (not the rebuild attempt but the kdelibs stuff)
<didrocks> seb128: I wasn't clear enough on my explanation? :)
<didrocks> rickspencer3: right
<rickspencer3> didrocks, if there are too many bugs, can we roll back to what we got last night rather than trying to cram in lots of bug fixes at the last minute?
<rickspencer3> (for the beta, I mean)
<seb128> didrocks, <rickspencer3> so is the Unity tonight just a rebuild, or are there new features/bugs as well? -> <didrocks> rickspencer3: juste a rebuild
<seb128> didrocks, no, that wasn't clear
<didrocks> rickspencer3: we can reupload the current version, yeah, that will be a shame so
<seb128> didrocks, tonight's is a new tarball, not a rebuild right?
<didrocks> seb128: yeah
<rickspencer3> didrocks, seb128 thanks
<didrocks> rickspencer3: both nux and unity
<rickspencer3> and didrocks, right, I don't *want* to roll back, obviously
<rickspencer3> :)
<ogra_> didrocks, seems the majority of kde stuff vanished from http://qa.ubuntuwire.org/ftbfs/, should work now
<didrocks> ogra_: ok
<ogra_> and someone apparently has given it back already
<cdbs> chrisccoulson: there?
<cdbs> chrisccoulson: With your next FF upload could you kindly incorporate debdiff attached to bug #741046 ? thanks!
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 741046 in firefox "Please add unity quicklist item for 'new tab'" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/741046
<pitti> Amaranth, didrocks: ah, that's right, I don't have unity-window-decorator, but compiz-decorator and gtk-window-decorator running now
<chrisccoulson> it's not translated ;)
<didrocks> pitti: only in -0ubuntu1
<cdbs> chrisccoulson: That's a roadblock? :(
<pitti> didrocks: running dist-upgrade again then
<didrocks> pitti: I uploaded this morning -0ubuntu2 as I got a fix for u-w-d crashes. So I resetted u-w-d by default
<chrisccoulson> cdbs - at this stage, yes. and i still need to think about what to do with launcher integration
<pitti> didrocks: (too bad, it works quite well with g-w-d :) )
<didrocks> heh :)
<chrisccoulson> also, you shouldn't use "firefox" in the desktop.in file. that will break in the nightlies
<rodrigo_> seb128, yes, pinged cosimoc about the patch, he was going to review it, but bgo is down today, and yes, I fixed the default value thing and the removal of the description in the patch
<cdbs> chrisccoulson: I used it on the final one
<cdbs> chrisccoulson: I mean the -final.desktop.in
<pitti> didrocks: right, new compiz coming in now
<chrisccoulson> cdbs, yeah. it should be in all the desktop.in files really, and it shouldn't use "firefox" anywhere in those ;)
<cdbs> chrisccoulson: well, it has to
<seb128> rodrigo_, ok thanks
<chrisccoulson> cdbs, it doesn't. we run all of those files through a preprocessor to substitute the correct values in
<chrisccoulson> cdbs, have a look at the Exec= line ;)
<cdbs> chrisccoulson: yes, got it
<cdbs> @APPNAME@
<cdbs> chrisccoulson: so, after this change you'll accept the debdiff? The translations issue?
<chrisccoulson> cdbs, the translations issue really needs to be resolved. we don't get many contributors for the desktop file (it's not translated in launchpad)
<chrisccoulson> so, if we upload an untranslated version now, it will almost certainly remain untranslated for final
<chrisccoulson> (and in any case, i don't want to be doing dozens of firefox uploads to add new translations every couple of days)
<pitti> rodrigo_: thanks for fixing the evo bug! I can sponsor this
<rodrigo_> pitti, ok, thanks
<cdbs> chrisccoulson: okay, fine. I am withdrawing the debdiff. Feel free to close the bug
<cdbs> didrocks: ^
<pitti> rodrigo_: meh, bugzilla.gnome.org is down; I guess you already closed the upstream bug?
<chrisccoulson> cdbs, don't do that ;)
<rodrigo_> pitti, no, it's been down all day
<chrisccoulson> the idea is fine in principle
<seb128> pitti, can you sponsor the nautilus one as well while you are at it?
<cdbs> chrisccoulson: why?
<seb128> pitti, I'm dealing with some fixes still I want to land before freeze
<chrisccoulson> dpm - how do we get people adding translations to the firefox desktop file?
<pitti> seb128: sure, it's in the sponsoring queue? I'll look
<nessita> tedg: which project shall I file the bug in? (I'm with some delay due to concurrent conversations :-))
<cdbs> chrisccoulson: okay, then. I'll make the exec change
<chrisccoulson> thanks
<seb128> pitti, they are on top of http://people.canonical.com/~platform/desktop/versions.html
<dpm> chrisccoulson, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Translations/Wanted/FirefoxDesktop
<cdbs> chrisccoulson: And, the change has to go to all the desktop.ins?
<chrisccoulson> dpm - thanks
<dpm> np :)
<chrisccoulson> cdbs - yes please. also see dpm's link there
<tedg> nessita, indicator-messages
<pitti> seb128: I only see a nautilus SRU on http://reports.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/sponsoring/
<seb128> pitti, cf 9 lines before
<seb128> ;-)
<pitti> seb128: I looked at versions.html, but it doesn't have branches or bugs or anything!?
<rickspencer3> seb128, pitti, whoever knows GNOME programming - totally unrelated questions ... is there an API that I can use to modify the contents of the recently used files file, or should I parse and edit the XML?
<seb128> pitti, click on the bzr icons
 * rickspencer3 wants to create a book marks editor 
<pitti> ooh, there
<pitti> sorry
<seb128> pitti, np ;-)
<seb128> pitti, the issue is that those are against team vcs so they are not showing up on  the sponsoring queue
<seb128> it's another side issue of not using udd
<pitti> seb128: shall I do the others as well?
<seb128> pitti, if you want that would be great, thanks!
<pitti> seb128: ah, eog adds multitouch, I'll skip that (FFE, and previously discussed to only go in PPA)
<seb128> pitti, ok, they raised it yesterday, they had a dual binary build which added a new variant for universe
<pitti> or that
<seb128> pitti, but we agreed on either getting a ffe and patching the main binary or use a ppa for natty
<seb128> pitti, no, not "or that"
<seb128> pitti, they need the build-depends in main anyway, so they need it promoted
<pitti> ah, ok; so PPA then for natty, as before
<seb128> pitti, if they do we can as well upload was in the merge request today
<seb128> otherwise it's the ppa
<seb128> rickspencer3, http://library.gnome.org/devel/gtk/unstable/GtkRecentManager.html
<rickspencer3> thanks seb128!
<seb128> rickspencer3, yw
<didrocks> pitti: FYI, DBO just added some info on bug #737601
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 737601 in unity "Restore MT support in Unity" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/737601
<pitti> didrocks: tahnks
<didrocks> yw
<rodrigo_> pitti, ugh, seems I've removed the mail about the nautilus thing, can you please forward it?
<pitti> rodrigo_: bounced
<rodrigo_> ok thanks
<cdbs> chrisccoulson: Okay, posted question about it on ubuntu-translations, attached improved debdiff
<chrisccoulson> cdbs, excellent, thanks
 * cdbs g2g
<nessita> tedg: https://bugs.launchpad.net/indicator-messages/+bug/741068
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 741068 in indicator-messages "Please support the use of a specific icon" [Undecided,New]
<rodrigo_> pitti, ah, I didn't remove it, just evolution couldn't find it, but anyway, thanks for forwarding :)
<pitti> rodrigo_: no problem :)
<pitti> seb128: ok, all branches on versions.html handled, except eog
<seb128> pitti, thanks a lot
<pitti> np
<seb128> ok, it's mterry's fault, I knew it! ;-)
<mterry> seb128, wait what?  :)
<seb128> mterry, gnome-panel clock's broken
<seb128> mterry, seems because your backports in g-s-d changed the polkit interface
<mterry> seb128, hah
<seb128> mterry, I'm fixing it ;-)
<mterry> whoops
<mterry> seb128, thanks
<seb128> np
<chrisccoulson> ha, my daughter has just discovered that felt-tipped pins make pretty patterns on the sofa
<pitti> seb128: looking at the xulrunner transition bug, I can claim some bits (like gtk-vnc); did you want to work on the g-p-e split?
<pitti> or want me to look at that as well?
<seb128> pitti, I can do but probably not today
<chrisccoulson> pitti - hopefully i will have a libmozjs source package later
<chrisccoulson> will i need to do a MIR for that?
<pitti> seb128, chrisccoulson: if you want I can tackle this right now
<chrisccoulson> pitti - sure, feel free to take any items from there :)
<pitti> I'll move the performance review stuff to Friday, in the freeze
<pitti> chrisccoulson: ok, starting with that then
<chrisccoulson> excellent, thanks :)
<m4n1sh> pitti: check your mail. Mailed you my initial reply
<seb128> pitti, well if you want feel free
<seb128> pitti, i'm still fixing gnome-panel issues I want to land before the freeze
<pitti> seb128: yes, that's great
<pitti> seb128: just coordinating :)
<pitti> I've got spare cycles now, so checking what to work on now
<pitti> m4n1sh: wow that was fast :) looking forward to the discussion
<m4n1sh> yeah, looks possible except we need to patch gtk probably
<m4n1sh> not sure
<m4n1sh> gtk patching should be avoidable
<pitti> chrisccoulson: MIR> it's not new code, is it? just taking out the js bits from xulrunner and dropping the rest?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, it's just basically the js/src folder from firefox
<pitti> chrisccoulson: so, no MIR necessary -- in fact, it's a De-MIR :)
<Sweetshark> pitti: I just uploaded a version 3.3.2-1ubuntu1~ppa1 to my personal ppa. debian has not yet released it (although it is already tagged in SCM), and it needs one package update (which I circumvented by using LOs own version for now).
<kenvandine> seb128, can you sync tp-logger?
<seb128> kenvandine, yes
<kenvandine> thx
<kenvandine> was just uploaded this morning
<pitti> Sweetshark: (on phone, bbl)
<seb128> kenvandine, where?
<kenvandine> probably experimental
<seb128> kenvandine, there is nothing in http://packages.qa.debian.org/t/telepathy-logger.html and http://incoming.debian.org/
<seb128> kenvandine, it seems it's not uploaded yet
<kenvandine> seb128, ok, i'll check with sjoerd
<kenvandine> he told me it was
<seb128> kenvandine, pochu just tagged it in the debian git half an hour ago
<seb128> kenvandine, so I guess it will be soon
<kenvandine> ok
<seb128> kenvandine, I will sync it when it hits the upload queue
<didrocks> pitti: thanks for the FFe
<kenvandine> maybe he jumped the gun a little :)
<pochu> should be in by the next dinstall, yes
<kenvandine> thx pochu
<pochu> np
<pitti> Sweetshark: do you want me to sponsor that then?
<Sweetshark> pitti: lets see: is this critical for the ui freeze tommorrow? if not, maybe its better to wait for debian as it wont be long.
<seb128> mterry, ok, stupid question but do you see why the code in http://paste.ubuntu.com/584370/ stopped working?
<seb128> I don't get a org.gnome.SettingsDaemon.DateTimeMechanism on the system bus in d-feet
<pitti> Sweetshark: does it change UI?
<pitti> Sweetshark: tomorrow is also (by and large) beta freeze
<mterry> seb128, we might be emitting an error now?
<mterry> seb128, print out the contents of error->message
<mterry> seb128, unless you're saying it doesn't even get that far?
<mterry> seb128, it appears on demand and then goes away
<mterry> seb128, so you won't see it on d-feet unless you talked to it recently
<seb128> oh ok
<seb128> mterry, let me try that
<Sweetshark> pitti: it reenables the launchpad integration (which is adding 3 menupoints).
<seb128> mterry, thanks, now it's obvious :p
<seb128> Error: GDBus.Error:org.freedesktop.PolicyKit1.Error.Failed: Action org.gnome.settingsdaemon.datetimemechanism.settime is not registered
<seb128> so it's indeed the patch in gsd
<mterry> not registered?
<pitti> Sweetshark: as it builds for about 3 days on armel, it's "by tomorrow morning" or "not for beta"
<seb128> mterry, settime got dropped
<seb128> mterry, it's org.gnome.settingsdaemon.datetimemechanism.configure now
<mterry> seb128, oh right, all integrated into one
<seb128> mterry, I just need to figure what refers to settime still
<seb128> mterry, seems a gsd bug
<seb128> mterry, I'm back on track thanks
<mterry> np
<Sweetshark> pitti: in that case, I would say: lets see if it builds in the ppa on x86/amd64 and sponsor it then. Sounds good?
<Riddell> hello ubuntu desktop people, please pick a preferred way to get appmenu-qt support  bug 733309
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 733309 in qt4-x11 "Qt applications are not able to use the AppMenu." [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/733309
<pitti> Sweetshark: deal :)
<seb128> Riddell, hum, I vote for having qt to recommends it
<seb128> Riddell, it's the only pratical thing to do if we don't want to pull libqt in the default ubuntu installation
<seb128> since appmenu-qt depends on qt
<Riddell> ok, I can add that in the next upload
<seb128> thanks
<Riddell> seb128: should gtk recommend appmenu-gtk then?
<seb128> I'm fine doing that
<seb128> hum, though we might check with xubuntu and others
<seb128> Riddell, what happen to qt applications if appmenu-qt is installed but there is no appmenu renderer
<seb128> like if you use xfce
<Riddell> seb128: then the normal inline menu is used
<seb128> mterry, http://paste.ubuntu.com/584398/ is the fix to my issue for the record
<mterry> seb128, isn't there already a patch 34_* that does that?
<seb128> mterry, if there was I wouldn't have been tracking the bug on natty :p
<cdbs> chrisccoulson: I've modified the debdiff on the bug according to a capitalization suggestion from dpm . Just notifying you, in case you've already downloaded it
<seb128> mterry, the 34- fixed check_polkit_for_action ()
<chrisccoulson> cdbs, thanks
<chrisccoulson> maaan, i hate debian/copyright
<seb128> mterry, that's another similar issue, anyway patch fixes it confirmed, I will upload and upstream that
<cdbs> chrisccoulson: should I give dpm the go-ahead for translations? or should I do that after the upload?
<chrisccoulson> cdbs, you can do that now
<seb128> rodrigo_, hey
<rodrigo_> hi seb128
<seb128> rodrigo_, is gnome code frozen yet?
<rodrigo_> seb128, yes, I think 2.91.92 was code freeze
<rodrigo_> let me check
<seb128> ok
<mterry> seb128, awesome, thanks
<seb128> rodrigo_, I've just fixed gnome-panel clock applet can_set_time now working, it was due to g-s-d, see http://paste.ubuntu.com/584398/
<seb128> now->not
<seb128> rodrigo_, I will bugzilla the fix for now then
<rodrigo_> seb128, well, that can go in I guess
<rodrigo_> seb128, let me know the bug # when you file it please
<seb128> rodrigo_, https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=645603
<ubot2> Gnome bug 645603 in plugins "incorrect polkit action for can_set checks" [Normal,New]
<rodrigo_> seb128, ok
<pitti> python-gtkspell_2.25.3-7ubuntu2_amd64.deb
<pitti> there
<pitti> seb128: ^ so we'll also get rid of the libgnomeui-dev, libbonoboui2-dev, and other stuff :)
<seb128> pitti, great
<kamusin> folks, do you know if there is an issue with some formats of current documentation.. seems like yelp is doing something wrong with some packages (for example banshee - nautilus if you press F1)
<nessita> seb128: is your crystal ball telling you something about me needing a new sponsorship? :-)
<nessita> https://code.launchpad.net/~nataliabidart/ubuntu/natty/ubuntuone-control-panel/ubuntuone-control-panel-0.9.3/+merge/54576
<seb128> nessita, ok, I can see that, yes!
<nessita> and that would cover all UI changes to the control panel
<pitti> seb128: bah, gnome-python-extras doesn't even build any more :/
<seb128> pitti, did some apis changed?
<pitti> /home/martin/ubuntu/build-area/gnome-python-extras-2.25.3/./gtkmozembed/gtkmozembedmodule.cpp:10:32: fatal error: gtkmozembed_glue.cpp: Datei oder Verzeichnis nicht gefunden
<pitti> apparently
<pitti> or that isn't getting built any more
<seb128> why am I not surprised?
<seb128> it probably needs to be updated for a recent xulrunner
<pitti> seb128: it already has a patch from chrisccoulson for porting to xulrunner-2.0
<pitti> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/62959641/buildlog_ubuntu-natty-amd64.gnome-python-extras_2.25.3-7ubuntu1_BUILDING.txt.gz says that this was in /usr/include/xulrunner-2.0b10/gtkmozembed_glue.cpp
<pitti> chrisccoulson: ^ does that ring a bell? seems to have disappeared
<pitti> chrisccoulson: is that a packaging bug, or is it actually gone?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - heh, that will probably be a packaging bug
<chrisccoulson> pitti - where is that included from?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: gnome-python-extras python-gtkmozembed module
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I just made a comment to the bug
<chrisccoulson> thanks
<pitti> chrisccoulson: it's not that urgent, I can demote g-p-e without dropping the binary as well, but it would be cleaner
<pitti> chrisccoulson: at least the splitout is uploaded now
<chrisccoulson> thanks, that's awesome :)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I'll take gtk-vnc as well if you want, but not today any more -- time for Taekwondo
<chrisccoulson> pitti - thanks for your help :)
<chrisccoulson> i've nearly got a libmozjs package ready \o/
<pitti> cool
<pitti> chrisccoulson: will you discuss the libreoffice bit with Sweetshark?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, sure
<pitti> bah, gtk-vnc package is busted -- robert forgot bzr merge-upstream
<jcastro> pitti: we have a nice community contrubution here that we forgot about but ken assures me that it's low risk: https://bugs.launchpad.net/indicator-me/+bug/741163
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 741163 in indicator-me "Add support for Emesene2 chat client" [Undecided,New]
<jcastro> an FFe for this would be highly appreciated!
<seb128> kenvandine, mterry, tedg: I'm not sure I like this ubuntu-geoip server thing
<seb128> seems like half the issue are due to it
<seb128> pitti, he did screw gvfs the same way this week
<seb128> pitti, the new version diff was reverted by the source v3 patch
<mterry> seb128, you mean geonames (different than geoip)
<seb128> ups, yes
<seb128> mterry, I especially don't like the "don't have any translated name"
<seb128> it's just screwed
<mterry> seb128, yeah.  :(  I'm surprised that so many issues exist, since we introduced this in 10.10's installer
<mterry> Thought they'd have been shaken out
<seb128> I'm wondering if we should switch to use libgweather
<seb128> but it seems late in the cycle to do that
<kenvandine> seb128, so the issue is the result the server gives us?
<seb128> kenvandine, yes
<kenvandine> i thought we postponed using geonames?
<seb128> kenvandine, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-geonames
<seb128> kenvandine, those are the issues mterry reassigned to geonames today
<seb128> bug #729022 is the one which makes me unsure if we should switch
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 729022 in indicator-datetime "Locations in the settings are not localized" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/729022
<seb128> not sure who is maintaining geonames and how well
<kenvandine> oh
<seb128> but seems a design flaw there
<kenvandine> for populating the selector
<kenvandine> i see
<mterry> seb128, I believe the data exists, it's just a matter of grabbing it from our server.  evan dandrea wrote the code we use, and IS pushes it live
<seb128> mterry, ok, so it's not relying on launchpad that's something ;-)
<seb128> not that I don't trust the launchpad guys to get work done, but if you wait on them you might wait a bit
<mterry> seb128, I talked to ev about it earlier today, we're not sure how easy it would be to fix the translation thing
<kenvandine> hehe
<mterry> seb128, should we assign to him?
<seb128> mterry, I'm pinging him on #ubuntu-devel, not sure if he's still around
<seb128> mterry, yes please
<pitti> chrisccoulson: oh, gtk-vnc was easier than I thought, uploading :)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - cool, thanks
<pitti> oh, packagekit is already taken
<pitti> ok, gotta run now -- see you tomorrow!
 * bryceh waves bye to pitti
<Gortu> Hello everybody!
<Gortu> I have a question. I'm one of the authors of libpolo, an educational graphics library (http://code.google.com/p/libpolo/). I've read the packaging guide, but it is still unclear how to become a MOTU. Could somebody please help me out?
<tedg> In Launchpad lib how do you turn a link into an Entry?
<tedg> bryceh, ? ^
<tedg> Gortu, Well, you need to do some packaging.  Probably best to talk to the folks in #ubuntu-motu as they can help you get started.
<Gortu> thnx a lot! :D
<seb128> Gortu, hi, try #ubuntu-motu
<seb128> ups, that was mentioned before
<ari-tczew> Gortu: you don't need to be MOTU to create a Debian package for libpolo.
<Gortu> tedg and ari-tczew: I got that! Thanks. I'm working on the package, and then I'll see what comes next!
<bryceh> tedg, not sure I follow the question
<ari-tczew> Gortu: for packaging question you can look for help on #ubuntu-motu or #ubuntu-packaging
<bryceh> tedg, do you mean like if you have a link to a bug report, how to get the corresponding launchpadlib Bug object?
<tedg> bryceh, I've got an Entry that has an attribute "milestone_link" but I really want an milestone object.
<bryceh> ahh
<bryceh> tedg, just ignore the "_link" bit, and call my_entry.milestone
<bryceh> it'll automagically transmorgraphy it into a milestone object
<tedg> bryceh, Oh, okay.
<bryceh> tedg, don't forget to check for None
<tedg> bryceh, Well this is a release.  It can't not have a milestone or there's a DB error :-)
<bryceh> fair enough; I've seen enough LP weirdness that I'd put the check in anyway, but it's your script ;-)
<tedg> bryceh, Actually I'm going to propose this to be merged into ubuntu-dev-tools...
 * tedg notes to not put bryceh on the review
<bryceh> heh
<seb128> robert_ancell, hi
<pitti> hey robert_ancell
<pitti> seb128: ah, want to talk about --merge-upstream? :-)
<seb128> pitti, I had that on my list, I wanted to send an email the other day about gvfs and I forgot
<seb128> I also wanted to point bug #729150
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 729150 in libappindicator "libappindication crashes in gtkstatusicon code on update" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/729150
<seb128> there is a patch from ted that needs sponsoring, would be nice to get in beta because some indicator behaviour relies on it
<seb128> (though it's fallback only)
 * pitti unscrews gtk-vnc
<didrocks> merge-upstream? mu for lazy people ;)
<seb128> it's just that it's getting late and I will probably not build and test it before going to bed
<seb128> didrocks, you are the only lazy around it seems ;-)
<robert_ancell> seb128, pitti, hey
<pitti> robert_ancell: how are you?
<pitti> long time no see!
<robert_ancell> pitti, indeed!
<robert_ancell> must be getting near release, 'cause you guys are awake at crazy times
<pitti> hehe
<seb128> pitti, I did uncommit and push --overwrite for gvfs
<pitti> seb128: ack
<seb128> robert_ancell, ^ if you have a gvfs checkout do pull --overwrite
<seb128> robert_ancell, you screwed it by not using merge-upstream, the new version diff got reverted in the packaging by the source v3
<pitti> robert_ancell: same for gtk-vnc; I fixed the branch now
<seb128> robert_ancell, and yeah, having a few sources in different format is confusing
<robert_ancell> seb128, you always have to do a pull --overwrite?
<seb128> robert_ancell, not always, but for gvfs merge-upstream wouldn't run on your broken commit so I did uncommit, revert and did it properly
<seb128> robert_ancell, but it means the official vcs diverted from your version
<seb128> if you just pull it will get confused
<pitti> robert_ancell: same for gtk-vnc, please pull --overwrite, as I had to do the same
<robert_ancell> well, I'm certainly confused
<seb128> robert_ancell, you handled it like it was debian dir only in the vcs
<pitti> robert_ancell: about --merge-upstream or --overwrite?
<seb128> where it's full source
<robert_ancell> I'm a little worried how flaky UDD seems to be
<seb128> robert_ancell, in full source checkouts you need to bzr merge-upstream tar.gz
<robert_ancell> I always just (intend to) do a merge-upstream
<pitti> it's actually not flaky, just different
<seb128> robert_ancell, bzr merge-upstream ../gvfs... --version ...
<seb128> robert_ancell, it will commit the code update in your checkout
<seb128> robert_ancell, your commit had only a debian dir update
<pitti> (not actually commit yet, just update)
<robert_ancell> pitti, it seems very easy to confuse it - I tried to do a merge-upstream on libnotify4, and it complained there was no upstream-*oldversion* tag.  But the log showed there was
<pitti> after that you do dch, and debcommit the thing
<seb128> robert_ancell, well, not all checkout are using merge-upstream format
<pitti> robert_ancell: I think it relates that to the pristine-tar branch
<seb128> like autoimports are not
<pitti> seb128: they do
<seb128> ok, I ran into broken cases as well then
<pitti> all lp:ubuntu/pkgname branches have pristine-tar, full source, and thus --merge-upstream
<pitti> seb128: yeah, sometimes
<seb128> we had cases were we had to tag it manually to start or to convert them to work
<didrocks> seb128: sorry, was testing compiz respawn in a guest session
<seb128> but those were old dx vcs I think; so maybe not autoimports
<didrocks> seb128: we'll rediscuss the "lazy" term once you will use bzr merge-upstream 10 times a week :p
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> robert_ancell, can you handle sponsoring of bug #729150 today?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 729150 in libappindicator "libappindication crashes in gtkstatusicon code on update" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/729150
<seb128> robert_ancell, it's a patch from ted, should be ok, it's just that it's late now for me to start a gtk build
<robert_ancell> seb128, sure
<seb128> robert_ancell, thanks
<seb128> bah, I forgot about bug #703230
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 703230 in pango1.0 ""rm: cannot remove `/usr/share/doc/libpango1.0-0': Is a directory" when updating to 1.28.3-4" [Unknown,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/703230
<seb128> ^ if someone wants to pick that one today feel free
<seb128> I will do it tomorrow otherwise
<seb128> it should be a matter to add a if [ -d ... ] rmdir in the preinst
<chrisccoulson> pitti - https://launchpad.net/~chrisccoulson/+archive/xulrunner-universe-transition/+buildjob/2340284 :)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: yay you!
<chrisccoulson> pitti - xulrunner-1.9.2 should drop from main now ;)
<seb128> robert_ancell, btw, shotwell build-depends on libgnomevfs2-dev, wth? it's 2011! ;-)
<robert_ancell> seb128, yeah, one of the plugins
<pitti> chrisccoulson: sorry, gtk-vnc upload was rejected, your latest upload didn't make it into bzr; all fixed up now
<chrisccoulson> robert_ancell, the above link might be interesting to you too (for the board)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: still shepherding the python-gtkspell build on armel
<chrisccoulson> pitti - oops, sorry about that
<pitti> it failed on powerpc because apparently gtk isn't installable on ppc
<chrisccoulson> ah
<seb128> robert_ancell, you won bug #740274 as well btw, it's low priority though
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 740274 in shotwell "on Natty, resize grip overlaps zoom icon" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/740274
<pitti> bah, armel as well
<pitti> gtk fail
<chrisccoulson> these resize grips are a bit of a pain aren't they? i keep seeing windows where they overlap other UI elements
<pitti> speaking of overlapping, the unity launcher doesn't go away any more :/
<pitti> I keep running into that
<seb128> kenvandine, btw did you see my xchat-gnome ping yesterday?
<kenvandine> no
<seb128> kenvandine, http://git.gnome.org/browse/xchat-gnome/commit/?id=be95811135169b16d108448117c71dbe7386f254
<seb128> kenvandine, you could be interested to backport that one
<seb128> kenvandine, in case you get bored and want to try that, it could be nice
<kenvandine> ah
<kenvandine> cool
<kenvandine> well i did just mention i was done for the day
<kenvandine> so i am wide open to do it now :)
<seb128> RAOF, howdy
<pitti> ah, atk didn't build on armel/powerpc yet, that might explain my trouble
<seb128> pitti, do you have any opinion bug #725434
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 725434 in nvidia-graphics-drivers "something (libcairo2) causes a significant 'across the board' memory use increase with -nvidia loaded" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/725434
<RAOF> seb128: 'ello.
<seb128> pitti, see comment #15 for a summary
<seb128> RAOF, hey, how are you?
<kenvandine> sigh... compiz keeps crashing everytime i try to download that patch
<TheMuso> pitti: afaik there is not that hard a dependency on atk from gtk...
<seb128> RAOF, ^ I want to chat about that bug
<kenvandine> the nice thing is compiz restarts now :)
<seb128> kenvandine, does it? it doesn't work for didrocks or me
<kenvandine> it is for me right now
<RAOF> seb128: I'm ok.  A bit tired, really.  Time for coffee :)
<didrocks> seb128: it did some time for now, but really not reliably
<pitti> TheMuso: arch all/any desync -- see http://launchpadlibrarian.net/67121987/buildlog_ubuntu-natty-armel.python-gtkspell_2.25.3-7ubuntu2_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<kenvandine> 3 times i've tried to copy the url so i can paste it into wget
<didrocks> seb128: on some sigsegv
<kenvandine> and it goes boom
<pitti> TheMuso: it makes libgtk2.0-dev uninstallable
<seb128> didrocks, ok
<TheMuso> pitti: ah of course.
<RAOF> seb128: What do you want to know about that bug?
<didrocks> the new patch I just uploaded works way better now
<pitti> TheMuso: it has a hard dependency on the arch:all -data package
<TheMuso> right
<pitti> (I guess it wouldn't need to)
<seb128> RAOF, I guess 1- would be "do you think that's something that need to be adressed for natty"
<pitti> I rescored the builds now
<TheMuso> Worth looking into.
<seb128> RAOF, and if the reply is "yes" the second would be "what do you recommend doing"
<seb128> pitti, ^ interested by your opinion as well
<pitti> seb128: I read the summary, but I'm afraid I know too little about this stuff to have an opinion?
<seb128> pitti, well it's basically due to cairo being built with the unstable gl backend for wayland
<seb128> pitti, so one option would be to roll that out and keep wayland in a ppa for natty
<seb128> pitti, though bryceh put efforts to get it in universe and didn't seem happy about the though
<TheMuso> pitti: Actually, libatk1.0-data is interesting, as it only contains locale data, which of course is stripped out to be included in language packs.
<TheMuso> So at the end of all that, libatk1.0-data only contains doc files.
<pitti> TheMuso: so we probably could drop the dependency altogether
 * TheMuso ponders whether its worth dropping libatk1.0-data, and carrying that change in ubuntu.
<RAOF> Woah!  IRC lag!
<TheMuso> pitti: Right, I'm pondering that now.
<pitti> TheMuso: as long as we have some other delta anyway, it might
<pitti> TheMuso: but don't worry too much about it now
<TheMuso> I'm not, but certainly something to ponder in the future.
<TheMuso> I'd say that will be the last atk upload for this cycle.
<RAOF> seb128: So, it depends on how much we want the gl backend enabled.  I don't think it'd be feasible to work-around this problem for natty.
<TheMuso> Atk atm doesn't get very frequent upstrea releases.
<RAOF> seb128: As for whether we should do something about it - it's pretty obnoxious to needlessly bloat the memory size of every process that links to cairo by 5MiB (on amd64 - on i386 apparently this can be as big as 15MiB).
<RAOF> seb128: So it's âhow much do we care about the nvidia binary drivers vs. how much do we care about cairo-glâ
<seb128> RAOF, do you have any better suggestion than roll back on cairo gl and put wayland in a ppa for natty?
<walters> RAOF: 5MiB writable?
<seb128> RAOF, well my view on our numbers of nvidia users against wayland users is easy
<seb128> RAOF, but I don't want to undermine the efforts put on wayland or get in the way of other people work
<seb128> so it turns to be rather a political decision than a technical one to me now
<RAOF> seb128: Longer term this could probably be solved by having cairo dynamically load backends on use, but that's not feasible for natty.
<seb128> like the technical decision seems obvious
<pitti> I agree
<seb128> RAOF, right, I'm just suggesting rolling back on cairo-gl for natty and putting back when we open next cycle
<pitti> bryceh: as this touches you most, what do you think?
<bryceh> :-(
<RAOF> Yeah.  I think that's the most sensible solution.
<pitti> bryceh: it's a pretty big setback, I agree, but if we can't solve that :(
<RAOF> walters: 5MiB dirty.
<walters> ouch
<bryceh> pitti, it seems like throwing the baby out with the bathwater
<RAOF> More ouch is someone reported 15MiB dirty (for *gnome-terminal* )
<bryceh> for as much effort as it took to get this in, it's really disappointing.  It's going to make people think, "Oh, yeah wayland really isn't ready, I won't look at it for another 6 months"
<pitti> bryceh: that's why I'm asking -- better ideas much welcome
<RAOF> Well, we *could* ask nvidia why they're dirtying so much memory in their libGL.
<pitti> could we build two libcairo libraries, one with gl, the other without, and have wayland depend on the gl-enabled one?
<jcastro> kenvandine: test
<jcastro> kenvandine: test
<jcastro> kenvandine: test
<jcastro> (sorry guys, helping ken test)
<seb128> jcastro, you know you can test in query right?
<jcastro> he told me in here
<seb128> ok ;-)
<kenvandine> ok, that patch doesn't work
<seb128> :-(
<kenvandine> i tried in a query first
<kenvandine> i'll look at it a bit more later, i need to eat
<kenvandine> later folks...
<kenvandine> seb128, you get some rest!
<seb128> see you kenvandine
<seb128> yeah, I will in a bit
<kenvandine> we'll have fallout to deal with tomorrow :-D
<bryceh> pitti, it seems like a chicken and egg situation...  before anyone will start porting gtk and making apps work, you have to show wayland works and is packaged and ready; but we're kicking it out because there's no apps to use on it
 * kenvandine hopes not
<kenvandine> jcastro, thx for testing
<bryceh> pitti, anyway, I guess if no one else cares about wayland, just kick it out.  Some day we can look at wayland again I guess.
<pitti> bryceh: two cairo variants wouldn't work for that?
<bryceh> pitti, afaik it would
<RAOF> Can we actually make two cairo variants work?
<seb128> bryceh, it's not that no one care, it just seems the cost is higher than the benefit for natty
<bryceh> I was maintaining a forked libcairo in a ppa previously but it was a PITA to keep it up to date with libcairo changes in trunk.  I don't really want to have to do that
<RAOF> Actually, I guess we could quite easily.
<pitti> we would need a libcairo2 (without GL) and a libcairo2-gl, and update the shlibs accordingly
<pitti> $ apt-cache rdepends libcairo2|wc -l
<pitti> 1185
<seb128> well the issue is that gtk etc depends on libcairo2
<pitti> hm, that's a whole lot of package rebuilds, though :/
<seb128> that and provides are not versionned
<pitti> seb128: another trick would be libcairo2-gl depending on libcairo2, and diverting the library
<pitti> that would avoid a mass rebuild
<seb128> bryceh, well maintaining a ppa during an unstable cycle or for a stable distro is not the same work, natty will not likely got a lot of cairo uploads
<RAOF> We could throw libcairo2-gl somewhere else; it's only used for wayland at the moment.
<seb128> we will put it back when next cycle start
<pitti> RAOF: wouldn't the actual apps need it as well?
<pitti> RAOF: I can't believe that _only_ wayland would need libcairo
<pitti> bryceh: no, I don't mean a separate source package, just an additional binary
<RAOF> pitti: Yeah, but it'd be a matter of LD_LIBRARY_PATHing for binaries in a single package.
<RAOF> pitti: For natty, and then we fix it properly for O.
<seb128> right, having wayland sessions tweaking the LD_LIBRARY_PATH or doing some LD_PRELOAD should work
<pitti> seb128: i. e. libcairo-gl would install an /etc/ld.so.conf.d/00-libcairo-gl.conf ?
<pitti> (to ensure that it comes first)
<seb128> pitti, wayland would
<seb128> or libcairo-gl
<pitti> seems more robust than setting LD_LIBRARY_PATH
<seb128> either would work
<pitti> seb128: I think libcairo-gl, as it knows where it installs itself
<seb128> pitti, well, you don't want to preload the gl backend under xorg
<seb128> do you?
<pitti> seb128: well, it'd only happen if you install libcairo-gl, and then you actually might want it?
<seb128> hum, fair enough
<seb128> that would work for me
<pitti> but I'm not fussed about wayland setting LD_LIBRARY_PATH or using ld.so.conf.d
<RAOF> Yeah.  It's quite concievable that X apps might want to use cairo-gl for their own nefarious purposes.
<seb128> well the easier would be to keep in a ppa for this cycle, maintaining a stable ubuntu ppa is not a lot of work
<seb128> it's likely less work that changing cairo to double build binary and wayland to preload things
<Amaranth> RAOF: latest mesa uploads to edgers appear to have fixed my issues with sandy bridge and unity
<seb128> then to revert in a few weeks when next cycle open
<RAOF> Amaranth: Yay!  Hurray for Sarvatt!
<Amaranth> still no EGL/GLES love though :/
<Amaranth> oh, also, smspillaz, I love you
<Amaranth> unity-window-decorator doesn't break my OCD snapping anymore :)
<seb128> RAOF, bryceh: could someone mention the nvidia issue to the nvidia guys to start?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I take mozvoikko as well
<chrisccoulson> pitti - cool, thanks
<chrisccoulson> i'm not sure how well you will get on with that, as i might need to make changes to the firefox-sdk for that
<chrisccoulson> (although, i'm not too sure yet)
<chrisccoulson> i'll add bits to the SDK as and when we need them ;)
<chrisccoulson> (like pkg-config files etc)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - are you still working? ;)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I wanted to get gtk-vnc out of the way, and now at least ensure that atk builds everywhere, to unblock python-gtkspell, gnome-media, and other uploads
<RAOF> seb128: Yeah, we should do that.  bryceh - you've got more direct contact with the nvidia guys, want to do that?  Or should we ask Alberto to mention it?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: my wife's away, and I can just sleep in tomorrow :)
<chrisccoulson> heh :)
<chrisccoulson> i'm just about to test couchdb against libmozjs now
<pitti> bryceh, seb128, RAOF: so are we in agreement with the libcairo-gl multi-build solution? (and adding that new dependency to wayland)
<bryceh> RAOF, alberto works with them a bit more closely but yeah I can take care of sending a notice about it
<seb128> pitti, I'm fine with it, I think it would be easier to just have a cairo build in a ppa for natty than rewritting the packaging to drop it in a few weeks but I can understand some people prefer to keep wayland in universe
<bryceh> pitti, I think that sounds like a great compromise
<seb128> i.e I will be ok with anything that solve the issue for the default install
<RAOF> bryceh: We could probably leave it up to Alberto; it's not urgent.
<bryceh> RAOF, ok, then I'll take the action to give him the background on the issue
<Sarvatt> RAOF: that means he was hitting the amd64 tls problem
<seb128> bryceh, RAOF, pitti: thanks
<bryceh> seb128, pitti, RAOF, thanks
<RAOF> Sarvatt: Ah, ok.  Well, that should get fixed when the patches get applied upstream then pulled back into edgers, I guess.
 * Sarvatt nodw
<Sarvatt> it'll be nice not to have a 24MB usr/lib/nvidia-current/libnvidia-glcore.so.270.30 in my initrd because of cairo-gl if that gets reverted :)
<Sarvatt> (thanks cairo and plymouth)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I need to call /usr/lib/firefox-devel-4.0/sdk/bin/xpidl for that; do I get /usr/lib/firefox-devel-4.0/sdk/ from any pkg-config-ish thing?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: or shoudl I hardcode the path?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: ah, nevermind; pkg-config --variable=sdkdir firefox-plugin
<chrisccoulson> pitti - ah, yeah, that should work
<bryceh> RAOF, emailed alberto
<bryceh> RAOF, I'll let the wayland guys know too
<robert_ancell> what package provides the bluetooth indicator?
<TheMuso> gnome-bluetooth
<pitti> chrisccoulson: right, it's a lot harder than gtk-vnc, but at least there's progress ;)
<bryceh> seb128, I've sent notification to wayland and to NVIDIA (via alberto).  Can you also forward the bug to libcairo, in case it happens to be a bug in the gl implementation?
 * bryceh shuts down for some hardware futzing
<RAOF> It's not a bug in cairo-gl.
<RAOF> *Any* app which links against nvidia's libGL gets the memory usage.
<pitti> chrisccoulson: did you happen to see this before? http://paste.ubuntu.com/584545/
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I can't make head or tail of it, as all the line numbers there are totally bogus
<pitti> chrisccoulson: mozVoikko.cpp:28 is #include "mozVoikkoSpell.hxx", which is still correct; but mozVoikko.hxx:25 is "#define NOCAP   0"..
<pitti> and /usr/include/firefox-4.0/nsStringAPI.h:1058 is an assertion about sizeof(wchar_t)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: if not, I'll try to dig deeper, but maybe that's a common trap
<chrisccoulson> pitti - hmm, i've not seen that one before
<pitti> chrisccoulson: ok, thanks
<pitti> chrisccoulson: ah, bug 515872  :)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 515872 in firegpg "firegpg FTBFS: xulrunner.../nsStringAPI.h: size of array 'arg' is negative" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/515872
 * pitti shamelessly steals from Kamal's branch then
<chrisccoulson> pitti - oh, was mozvoikko using one of the xulrunner pkg-config files before?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: yes
<chrisccoulson> we define -fshort-wchar there ;)
<pitti> pkg-config --cflags libxul (and --libs)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: ah, but not in firefox-plugin.pc
<chrisccoulson> yeah, firefox-plugin (and mozilla-plugin) only really exist for finding the npapi headers
<pitti> ok, one step further, to the next failure
<pitti> at least I'm in the link stage now :)
<pitti> pkg-config --libs firefox-plugin
<pitti> ah, that's empty
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-03-24
<chrisccoulson> yeah, there's nothing to link against with a plugin
<pitti> rockin'!! built!
<chrisccoulson> excellent :)
<pitti> and works, too
<pitti> chrisccoulson: is it planned to avoid having to specify libs manually? i. e. provide a libxul-like pkgconfig in firefox-dev?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - possibly, if we need to
<pitti> anyway, uploaded
<pitti> and with that, good night!
<pitti> atk built, failed packages retried, should be happier in the morning
<didrocks> good night pitti
<rickspencer3> hey robert_ancell, RAOF how is life in tomorrow?
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, it's awesome.  Get prepared!
<robert_ancell> greatcthulu, mysterious :)
<greatcthulu> how can this nick be available?
<greatcthulu> hehe
<robert_ancell> I think it's reserved, you may be getting nightmares now for using it
<greatcthulu> or people all over the irc are going to have inexplicable nightmares tonight
 * didrocks misses the reference :)
<greatcthulu> it's my new "I'm not really working" nick
<greatcthulu> didrocks, it refers to the very pinnacle of English literature
<didrocks> greatcthulu: it's maybe better than I mess the reference then (looks like the pinnacle is ironic) :)
<didrocks> miss*
<greatcthulu> hold on
<greatcthulu> I missed an "h"
<greatcthulhu> didrocks, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Call_of_Cthulhu
<greatcthulhu> in case you need something to do while waiting to get Unity uploaded
<micahg> Narwhals keeps Cthulhu from eating ye!
<greatcthulhu> lol
<didrocks> greatcthulhu: well, still landing some code right now ;) but while nux is building, why not :)
<robert_ancell> didrocks, it's good stuff - I can bring you a book of his stories to UDS :)
<greatcthulhu> H.P. Lovecraft and P.G. Wodehouse are my 2 favorite authors
<didrocks> robert_ancell: I never really adhere to Lovecraft's writing, but why not, let's see in English ;)
<greatcthulhu> short stories of no real significance, I guess
<greatcthulhu> didrocks, it occurs to me, you should have gotten robert_ancell to make Unity release tonight, you could have slept!
<didrocks> greatcthulhu: well, I needed to sneak some fixes upstream as well, so it's not just "waiting". So, that's ok :)
<didrocks> drag to trash, expanding launcher, some tooltip not displayingâ¦ was still a productive evening :)
<greatcthulhu> when are desktop files going to start landing for Open in New Window and that kind of stuff?
<greatcthulhu> let me ask jasoncwarner
<greatcthulhu> jasoncwarner, ^ ?
<didrocks> greatcthulhu: I landed gnome-screenshot and inkscape. Updated the wiki page
<didrocks> there is a bug for our libreoffice maintainer
<greatcthulhu> it's actually kind of weirding me out to be referred to as greatcthulhu
<didrocks> rickspencer3: heh, troubled by the hilight? :)
<rickspencer3> well, it was just creepier than I thought it would be :)
<didrocks> rickspencer3: so yeah, jcastro wanted to make a small announcement to avoid the big rush
<rickspencer3> big rush of desktopfiles?
<didrocks> rickspencer3: yeah, everyone waiting to push desktop file update for every app of the universe without a clear view of what entries are really needed
<didrocks> for instance, do we want a "New window" or "New tab" for firefox?
<rickspencer3> well, time is running out!
<rickspencer3> we have like 3 weeks to make Ubuntu work
<rickspencer3> it's time to stop making changes and just fix fix fix
 * rickspencer3 whip cracking noises
<didrocks> well, it's working, but the desktop files aren't fixes, it's changes?
<rickspencer3> didrocks, that's what I'm saying
<rickspencer3> too many changes still planned
<didrocks> rickspencer3: I patched all desktop files that I could and referenced by design (inskcape, gnome-screenshot) apart from libroffice as our maintainer will do an upload for that. Then, there is the gimp but I can't add the QL for the designer use case without touching gimp's code. So out of the scope now
<rickspencer3> what about Firefox?
<rickspencer3> didrocks, that's awesome btw
<rickspencer3> and a lot of the quick lists are really cool
<didrocks> rickspencer3: I asked for Firefox, they are thinking about it (for quite some months)
<rickspencer3> gnome-screenshot with a quick list sounds cool
<didrocks> not sure about "open a new window" or "add a new time"
<rickspencer3> what?
<rickspencer3> *pffft
<rickspencer3> ok, I'll follow up
<rickspencer3> that seems easy to me
<didrocks> add a new tab*
<rickspencer3> didrocks, did you mean "add a new tab" by any chance?
<didrocks> yeah
<rickspencer3> thats totally useless
<rickspencer3> anyway, open in new window is required
<didrocks> I agree, but I'm a keyboard user, so not that most common case :)
<rickspencer3> didrocks, I'll get that squared away asap
<rickspencer3> well, if you go to a new workspace, you need to open a new window
<rickspencer3> it's obvious
<rickspencer3> I mean, don't these people use computers?
<rickspencer3> :)
<didrocks> rickspencer3: compu*what*? ;)
<rickspencer3> lol
<didrocks> rickspencer3: what we need is a short list of app and entries to add
<didrocks> that can be a quick and nice community contribution
<rickspencer3> didrocks, yeah
<didrocks> let me look at the first bug about it, one sec
<didrocks> rickspencer3: https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/676886
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 676886 in unity-design "Launcher - Add 'new document' option to Open Office, Gimp and Inkscape quicklists" [Critical,Fix released]
<rickspencer3> that's coolio, but don't they use a web browser at all?
<didrocks> the web is already old fashioned for design :-)
<rickspencer3> lol
<rickspencer3> didrocks, well, nice job on that bug
<cyphermox> didrocks, ping?
<didrocks> cyphermox: hey
<cyphermox> hey ;)
<cyphermox> I assume you use evo for email and stuff?
<didrocks> right :)
<cyphermox> are you having issues with contacts over LDAP too?
<cyphermox> just want to make sure it's not broken only for me ;)
<didrocks> cyphermox: the contact view you mean? I always had that issue
<didrocks> cyphermox: but if you look for a contact
<didrocks> in the search
<didrocks> it works
<cyphermox> ah
<cyphermox> then it must be my system
<didrocks> nux and unity uploaded \o/
<didrocks> bed time now :)
<didrocks> see you tomorrow (probably a little later than usual)
<Sweetshark> Morning, all!
<Sweetshark> pitti: This libgcj_bc stuff drives me crazy. I have reinstalled the package and have the symlink. The LO build still fails. After the (failed) build the symlink is still there. However, when I reboot, the symlink is gone. what the heck?
 * Sweetshark builds 3.3.1-1ubuntu5 to see if it ftbfs
<pitti> Good morning
<pitti> Sweetshark: what, a package file disappears after a _reboot_???
<pitti> Sweetshark: grep for the name in /etc/init and /etc/init.d ?
<Sweetshark> pitti: do we maybe have something in /etc/init that removes broken symlinks in /usr/lib?
<pitti> Sweetshark: not that I know of, and that would be utterly wrong
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> bonjour didrocks
<didrocks> Guten Morgen pitti
<Sweetshark> pitti: do you have libgcj-bc installed on your box, does dpkg -L libgcj-bc show a /usr/lib/libgcj_bc.so.1, and does that one actually exist in the fs? (just to make sure the problem is not local)
<Sweetshark> didrocks: Bonjour!
<pitti> Sweetshark: installing, hang on
<pitti> Sweetshark: I confirm the problem
<Sweetshark> pitti: yikes
<Sweetshark> I dont know if I am happy about that.
<pitti> hm, it doesn't even have a postinst
<didrocks> pitti: what do you think about this: https://code.launchpad.net/~sladen/unity-place-files/unity-place-files-lp704997/+merge/54644 ?
<didrocks> pitti: as it's just paste UI freezeâ¦ (changing the icons for the places in the launcher)
<didrocks> past*
<pitti> Sweetshark: I don't have a libgcj.so.11 either, though
<Sweetshark> pitti: well, I have a libgcj.so.10
<pitti> oh, multiarch
<pitti> Sweetshark: even if the symlink would exist, it would be wrong and point to /usr/lib/
<pitti> /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libgcj.so.11
<pitti> that's where it lives now
<pitti> Sweetshark: asking in #u-devel
<pitti> oh, hm, you aren't there
 * Sweetshark looks innocent
<Sweetshark> I am.
<pitti> chrisccoulson: huh, why does swt-gtk want to go to universe all of a sudden? doesn't gwt still need it?
<pitti> didrocks: urgh, when did you go to bed? doing package uploads at 5 am?
<rodrigo_> morning
<didrocks> pitti: well, that was the only way to make the release team happy it seems :)
<didrocks> pitti: as they were scared about having a traditional unity release on Thursday
<pitti> didrocks: well, we do accept  packages in the freeze, we just review them and want to know what's going on..
<pitti> didrocks: the MP doesn't say much, looking at the bug now
<pitti> didrocks: ah, it's making the ws switcher gray instead of purple?
<didrocks> pitti: basically, it changes the icon of the places in the icon
<pitti> go ahead, please
<pitti> that indeed looks confusing
<didrocks> and same for places
<didrocks> (new icons)
<didrocks> the one you have in the dash homescreen
<didrocks> like the "find files" "find apps"
<pitti> didrocks: oh, what changes there? they look sufficiently gray to me?
<didrocks> pitti: that's a design late requestâ¦
<pitti> didrocks: sounds fine; please upload
<didrocks> pitti: open the dash
<didrocks> pitti: find apps/find files
<didrocks> pitti: I'll just change the proposed merge to use a symlink rather
<pitti> didrocks: they have been gray for me all the time -- shoudln't they be?
 * didrocks hugs pitti fighting memory space :)
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<pitti> heh
<didrocks> pitti: they will still be gray
<seb128> hey pitti
<didrocks> pitti: it's just the asset icon changing
<seb128> didrocks, the man who never sleeps
<pitti> didrocks: we already got an extra 1.5 MB due to the new font
<didrocks> salut seb128
<didrocks> seb128: sleep is for weak :)
<seb128> didrocks, did you sleep? when I went to bed at almost 3am you were still working
<pitti> didrocks: really, you should take a looong nap in the afternoon..
<didrocks> pitti: urgh, symlink so :)
<didrocks> seb128: I slept 4 hours, yeah ;)
<pitti> seb128: unity uploads at 5 am..
<seb128> pitti, nice, I'm getting old, I crashed at 3
<didrocks> pitti: I'll probably take a break this afternoon yeah
<seb128> ;-)
<didrocks> ok, let's go to the symlink path
 * pitti feels really bad now, going to bed at 1:45..
<seb128> lol
<seb128> pitti, do we have CD space issues?
<pitti> seb128: 5 MB oversized on i386 desktop, rest should be ok
<seb128> ok
<seb128> if we drop gl from cairo we should get back a bit
<pitti> seb128: I'll do a langpack -base refresh tomorrow, that should help a bit
<seb128> since that's bringing some libegl in that we wouldn't have otherwise
<pitti> seb128: ah, nice
<seb128> that's one of the things we spotted at a3 if you remember
<pitti> seb128: I think we shoudl get that working today
<seb128> well of the differences between a2 and a3
<pitti> right
<didrocks> pitti: argh, sorry, I have to take a copy of the 2 images as unity-2d use their own copy and path of the asset. If I do a symlink, it will break them :/
<dpm> hey kamstrup, good morning, do you have a minute for a couple of questions on giraffe?
<kamstrup> dpm: sure thing
<pitti> didrocks: well, they are tiny I guess?
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, both are 5kb
<dpm> kamstrup, cool, thanks. So I noticed yesterday that the unity doc is not being generated, and I saw that it was because of this: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/584708/ happening on the last Unity-3.0.gir file from libunity3 3.6.8. I'm not too sure if that is a bug in giraffe or the .gir file?
<pitti> didrocks: 5 kB! OMG!!
 * pitti bbl
<didrocks> pitti: that's the 5 kB making the 5 Mb oversize of course :)
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<chrisccoulson> pitti - gwt should still have a build-depend on the new swt-gtk
<chrisccoulson> (note that the binary names have changed)
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hi, how are you?
<pitti> didrocks: hm, I still get my usual two unity crashes at login, but now it doesn't autorestart any more -- that was unfixed? :-(
<pitti> chrisccoulson: bit tired, but ok; I guess everyone is :)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, i'm pretty tired too. i was up late trying to make it possible to build easily against the new libmozjs
<didrocks> pitti: urgh, the autorespawn should still workâ¦ there were some cases where it wasn't working, but I tried to send a sigsegv and it worked when I tested
<chrisccoulson> i had a few autofoo and soname issues this morning
<chrisccoulson> didrocks!
<didrocks> pitti: what's your usual unity crashes at login, do you have a bug report?
<chrisccoulson> you must be tired ;)
<didrocks> hey chrisccoulson ;)
<chrisccoulson> i saw you on here at 4am :P
<pitti> didrocks: bug 739434
<pitti> didrocks: sorry, bug 740757 (same, but good stack trace)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 740757 in nux "compiz crashed with SIGSEGV in __libc_free()" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/740757
<didrocks> pitti: argh, invalidated because of the new uploads
<didrocks> oh
<chrisccoulson> pitti - can you NEW mozjs when i upload it in a few moments?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: sure
<chrisccoulson> pitti - cool, thanks
<didrocks> pitti: this one was *supposed* to be fixed (I closed a dup at least) with the amount of nux segfault fixesâ¦
<didrocks> readding to the list then
<pitti> didrocks: hm, perhaps it's a new one now; unfortunately I apport-blacklisted this compiz version, I unblacklisted it again now
<didrocks> pitti: and so, autorespawn doesn't work for you?
<pitti> didrocks: well, it did work perfectly until yesterday, and just now after dist-upgrade/reboot it didn't
<pitti> ctrl+alt+f1 DISPLAY=:0 unity FTW
<didrocks> hum hum hum
<didrocks> let me send a sigsegv here
<pitti> and I still have a weird "ghost" launcher problem, but let's discuss this later
<pitti> chrisccoulson: ah, swt-gtk is in NEW, perhaps that got it confused somehow
<pitti> weird, why is it all in NEW, the binaries shouldn't have changed
 * pitti investigates
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, possibly. nothing in main depends on the old binaries
<pitti> chrisccoulson: oh, of course -- 3.5 -> 3.6
<chrisccoulson> yeah :)
<didrocks> ok "nice", sigsegv doesn't work there
<pitti> chrisccoulson: so that would require a library transition
<chrisccoulson> pitti, oh, i forgot about them sitting in NEW. i already uploaded the rest of the packages that depend on it ;)
<njpatel> didrocks, morning :)
<chrisccoulson> i'll just need to retry all those builds once the new packages are published
<pitti> chrisccoulson: you didn't bump their build dependencies to -3.6?
<didrocks> hey njpatel
<didrocks> njpatel: long time, isn't it?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: gwt, azureus, tuxguitar, and zekr?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, so they will all have either failed or be in DEPWAIT
<njpatel> didrocks, yeah ;)
<chrisccoulson> they're all bumped to 3.6 already
<pitti> chrisccoulson: yep, depwait, should be fine
<seb128> pitti, njpatel is looking into your crash issue btw
<pitti> \o/
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, they are. so i guess all those builds will happen automatically won't they?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: right
<chrisccoulson> cool :)
 * pitti reviews
<didrocks> pitti: I'm totally puzzled, I tried in a guest session yesterday and it respawn with the new compiz :/
<didrocks> it was before
<didrocks> wasn't*
<Sweetshark> pitti: so, will you fix libgcj-bc? and what should i do with the LO build?
<chrisccoulson> Sweetshark, oh, do you have issues with that too?
<chrisccoulson> what's the actual issue, as i'm seeing linking problems and haven't had time to investigate?
<pitti> Sweetshark: I pinged slangasek/doko, no response yet; I might have a stab at it, yes; is it blocking for beta-1?
<pitti> Sweetshark: i. e. for the LO build?
<pitti> we also need to sort out the cairo issue for beta1, not sure if seb128 has some time for this?
<Sweetshark> pitti: yes, it breaks the LO build
<didrocks> pitti: so you confirm that compiz -0ubuntu3 autorespawn worked for you on sigsegv?
<pitti> didrocks: yes, that and some earlier versions, too
<njpatel> Pici, could you try with latest Unity?
<njpatel> pitti, sorry
<pitti> chrisccoulson: newed except for armel (which is currently building); I'll watch this
<didrocks> pitti: I'll give some tests then again, trying to make it respawn
<pitti> njpatel: I dist-upgraded 30 minutes ago, there's nothing newwer
<chrisccoulson> pitti - thanks. i'm just about to upload mozjs too
<Sweetshark> chrisccoulson: there is a symlink in /usr/lib that is all wrong and vanishes. we have yet triaged what does that (dpkg maybe?)
<pitti> njpatel: oh, you mean for the respawn issue or the __libc_free crash?
<njpatel> pitti, __libc_free
<chrisccoulson> Sweetshark, is that causing link erros when linking against libgcj_bc.so.1?
<pitti> njpatel: I still get a crash at exactly the same time and occasion, need to verify whether it's still the same
<chrisccoulson> that sounds like a failure i'm seeing here ;)
<seb128> pitti, I can do the libcairo work
<didrocks> seb128: are you on the new or old stack? (I mean, if you didn't update compiz yet, can you send a sigsegv when you get a change to compiz)
<pitti> chrisccoulson:
<pitti> $ dpkg -c /var/cache/apt/archives/libgcj-bc_4.5.1-1ubuntu3_amd64.deb | grep .so
<njpatel> pitti, Interesting....it seems it could be intel drivers but I'll keep poking
<pitti> lrwxrwxrwx root/root         0 2010-10-22 08:02 ./usr/lib/libgcj_bc.so.1 -> libgcj.so.11
<pitti> chrisccoulson: that's the problem -- needs to be a multiarch lib dir now
<pitti> seb128: cool, thanks
<seb128> didrocks, sorry I upgraded first thing today, I wanted to give a round of testing to the current stack, I didn't restart my session nor compiz yet though so I still have the pre update version running
<Sweetshark> chrisccoulson: It is causing dpkg-shlibsdeps failures here.
<didrocks> seb128: so sending the sigsev should work once ;)
<seb128> didrocks, yeah, trying
<seb128> didrocks, respawns on sig11
<seb128> but the new version does as well
<didrocks> !!!
<didrocks> seb128: thanks for confirming I'm not crazy :)
<seb128> didrocks, that I can't confirm ;-)
<didrocks> it doesn't respawn anymore then thoughâ¦
<seb128> it does here
<didrocks> seb128: don't even dare inferingâ¦ :-)
<seb128> I sent another sig11 after the respawn and it worked
<didrocks> hum, I'm really unsure about what happens then
<didrocks> seb128: if you use a guest session?
<seb128> I can try if you want
<didrocks> seb128: if you have time, that would be nice ;)
<seb128> didrocks, no, doesn't respawn
<didrocks> seb128: ok, let's revert to yesterday's version soâ¦ don't know what really happens with this sm_ protocoleâ¦
<dpm> kamstrup, did you see the giraffe question earlier on? ^ (just making sure it didn't get lost)
<kamstrup> dpm: oh, sorry :-) got caught up in admin work
<kamstrup> here now
<dpm> no worries
<dpm> so it was <dpm> kamstrup, cool, thanks. So I noticed yesterday that the unity doc is not being generated, and I saw that it was because of this: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/584708/ happening on the last Unity-3.0.gir file from libunity3 3.6.8. I'm not too sure if that is a bug in giraffe or the .gir file?
<rodrigo_> hmm, unity doesn't start for me with the new compiz packages
<kamstrup> dpm: right... There were no changes in libunity wrt to this, so the change must be in the GIR generated by an upgrade valac
<kamstrup> dpm: it has prolly changed how it handles void methods or something
<kamstrup> dpm: i'm on it
<dpm> kamstrup, awesome. I've now got access to the d.u.c server, so once this is fixed, I should probably be able to publish the documents on d.u.c straight away
<kamstrup> dpm: \o/
<kamstrup> dpm: byw, did you pull the latest trunk? There where some fixes to the generated C api
<kamstrup> dpm: spooky... what's the chance of this: i open gedit to check the code and the cursor starts right on the line that the exception is thrown from... o_O
<dpm> magic :)
<dpm> kamstrup, it was just waiting for you to fix it :)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - ok, mozjs is in NEW now
<dpm> kamstrup, yeah, I think I used trunk. I also sent a merge proposal, not a big change (make it easier to call giraffe from other modules), but I thought it would be best if you could have a look at it if you want
<chrisccoulson> pitti - when you approve it, are you able to add it to the mozilla packageset?
<chrisccoulson> or does someone else need to do that?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I can
<chrisccoulson> pitti - cool, thanks
<pitti> chrisccoulson: is that an upstream tarball, or did you create it yourself?
<Sweetshark> pitti: could you import libtextcat 2.2-9 from debian (we are currently at 2.2-7)? LO will build without it, but it will be bigger.
<pitti> Sweetshark: syncing
<kamstrup> dpm: I think http://paste.ubuntu.com/584727/ is the problem... there are two <callback/> within one <field/> element. I am not sure that makes sense... Pinging some vala guys about this
<chrisccoulson> pitti - it's an unofficial tarball from the mozilla guy who is doing the release (he hasn't officially released it yet). i've just included the chanegset number in case he changes it before hosting it on ftp.mozilla.org
<chrisccoulson> pitti - see the second from last comment on https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=628723
<ubot2> Mozilla bug 628723 in JavaScript Engine "Create JS 1.8.5 source release" [Normal,Assigned]
<pitti> chrisccoulson: hm, no license file in the tarball :/
<pitti> Sweetshark: done
<chrisccoulson> pitti - oh, is there even one in firefox?
<Sweetshark> pitti: thanks
<Sweetshark> pitti: could you give me a ping when the libgcj-bc issue is fixed?
<chrisccoulson> ah, yes. there is
<pitti> Sweetshark: of course
<dpm> kamstrup, yeah, I saw that as well when I was looking at it yesterday, but I wasn't sure where the problem was, or if it was a problem that the field had two callbacks. The previous gir file had the same callbacks, but they weren't inside a field.
<chrisccoulson> pitti - oh, the firefox LICENSE file just points to http://www.mozilla.org/foundation/licensing.html
<pitti> chrisccoulson: checking the copyright file; I know that GPL mandates shipping the license, not sure about MPL
<pitti> chrisccoulson: could you at least add the standard pointer to common-licenses to the GPL/LGPL bits?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - oh, did i not add those bits already?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: if you do that in bzr, I'll accept the package, but I don't want this to get lost
<pitti> License: MPL-1.1 or GPL-2 or LGPL-2.1
<pitti> and no details at all
<chrisccoulson> ah
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i missed that section. i copied it in to a section further down
<pitti> chrisccoulson: ah, there are pointers to them further down
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, for Files: js/src/assembler/moco/*
<chrisccoulson> i can add to the other sections in bzr as well though
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I think the first section should have all the blobs, and subsequent sections shoudl be fine with the single-line License:
<pitti> chrisccoulson: same for BSD -- add it to Files: js/src/jsgcchunk.cpp, and drop the copies further down
<pitti> that will make the file both easier to read and less redundant
<pitti> chrisccoulson: oh hang on, it's not the same BSD, so nevermind the "drop the copies"
<seb128> pitti, is there any way to trigger a ddebs.ubuntu.com publishing manually? or when is the next one?
<pitti> seb128: sure, I can run it
<seb128> pitti, I would like the new unity ddebs to get published so retracing work for crashes we get today
<seb128> (they are not at the moment)
<pitti> seb128: next regular one is in 1 h
<seb128> ok, I can wait an hour
<seb128> pitti, thanks
<pitti> seb128: running
<pitti> seb128: too late :)
<seb128> pitti,  you rock ;-)
<pitti> np, launching a cron job is not rocket science
<pitti> it will stomp over the hardy/karmic/lucid/maverick ones, but who cares
<pitti> seb128: actually, on macquarie this stuff is pretty fast, I think I can increase the frequency of this
<chrisccoulson> pitti - http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~mozillateam/mozjs/mozjs-trunk.head/revision/7
<pitti> ok, thanks
<pitti> chrisccoulson: accepted; it's still hard to read, but *shrug*
<seb128> pitti, I would not say no to that, we get quite some broken retracing on weekly dx updates since users jump on next versions and report bugs but the ddebs take time to get there
<chrisccoulson> pitti - thanks
<pitti> chrisccoulson: armel buildds are congested, for the rest it should build fast
<pitti> chrisccoulson: as for the package set, I guess it needs some time to trickle down the pipes, I currenlty get a KeyError
<chrisccoulson> pitti - ok, no worries
<chrisccoulson> thanks
<pitti> Added:
<pitti> mozjs
<pitti> ah, there
<pitti> chrisccoulson: you got it
<chrisccoulson> excellent, thank you :)
<xdatap> dbarth, ping
<seb128> rodrigo_, thanks for the g-s-d fix commit
<rodrigo_> seb128, you're welcome
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, do people use symbols files with C++ libraries?
<chrisccoulson> thats a bit of a pain, as the symbol name mangling seems to be arch-dependant
<seb128> chrisccoulson, some do
<seb128> check webkit for an example
<seb128> but yeah, there is lot of tweaking
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: KDE guys are IIRC. I didn't for nux because of arch-dependant symbols
<seb128> the kde guys have special utilities
<dbarth> xdatap: pong
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, yeah, i just had mozjs fail on i386 because the symbols in the symbols file are only valid on amd64 :(
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: I got that everyweek, and add armel to the danceâ¦
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: so right now, I'm with a shlibsâ¦
<didrocks> not like if nux was used elsewhere for now anyway
<xdatap> dbarth, morning. I just reproduced the bug #735393 , on the  same machine but this time with classic desktop. Still no evidence of crash on /var/crash . The pc is still up with the problem, some suggestion?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 735393 in gnome-settings-daemon "Unity: top bar theme lost" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/735393
<pitti> seb128: ddebs should be there now
<seb128> pitti, danke
<pitti> and ddeb retrieval happens every 4 hours now
<seb128> \o/
<dbarth> xdatap: checking
<dbarth> xdatap: do you have apport enabled?
<dbarth> ie /etc/default/apport or something
<xdatap> dbarth, yes, it worked for other bugs
<pitti> chrisccoulson: blergh, mozjs will FTBFS on !amd64 due to symbol files
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I'm afraid you have to pick out the diffs from the build logs, and have per-arch symbols files
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, see above comments :(
<dbarth> xdatap: it's a crasher in g-settings-daemon; did you tell apport to ignore bugs from this component last time it asked?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: ah, right
<chrisccoulson> that sucks, i didn't think about that ;)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: Riddell would know, I'm sure he felt that pain countless times
<pitti> chrisccoulson: it's kind of a regression of gcc-4.5
<chrisccoulson> pitti - can you tell that i test my stuff on amd64 ;)
<pitti> it didn't use to have different symbols on arches in the past
<pitti> chrisccoulson: hehe
<pitti> chrisccoulson: best arch ever
<xdatap> dbarth, no, never told to ignore bugs. It's a quite fresh install, I made it last monday for Xorg testing
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I guess that's the strategy right now: build, have it fail, pick out the diffs, and install pkgname.symbols.arch
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, that's a bit unfortunate. i guess what i could have done is do the first upload without a symbols file, and just get the symbols from the resulting libs
<chrisccoulson> although, that doesn't make much difference
<chrisccoulson> i still have to do 2 uploads ;)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I bumped the armel build for you, so that this one will arrive sooner
<pitti> 7 h -> 8 s :)
<xdatap> dbarth, and I just checked that gnome-settings-daemon process is still running. I can see it with ps
<chrisccoulson> pitti - excellent, thanks :)
<dbarth> xdatap: ?! that's weird
<dbarth> xdatap: when you get pin the app to the launcher, you see the panel theme disappear, not unity crasher, and g-settings-daemon still runs?!
<xdatap> dbarth, this time i'm on the classic desktop, not Unity. I was opening glxgears from shell for testing the nVidia prop. driver. Bar theme is lost while the window decoration theme is still there. So, it's not depending on unity itself imho
<xdatap> dbarth, do you want a new screenshot attached to the bug report?
<desrt> Riddell: hey
<Riddell> hi desrt
<desrt> did david get in touch with you?
<Riddell> chrisccoulson: symbols files with c++ docs are at http://pkg-kde.alioth.debian.org/symbolfiles.html
<chrisccoulson> Riddell, excellent, thanks
<Riddell> info on how to hand them
<Riddell> desrt: about https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/d-conf/+bug/716330 ?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 716330 in d-conf "Provide documentation for the QT bindings" [Low,New]
<desrt> ya
<desrt> i already have some packaging in a PPA that you might find helpful
<Riddell> desrt: I'm not sure what is has to do with me, I don't have anything to do with that package and I've never written API docs
<GunnarHj> seb128, pitti: Hi guys, hope you slept well last night despite of my C syntax problem. ;-)
<GunnarHj> Seriously, I know you both are busy these days, and it's a low priority thing; the solution to the somewhat higher priority aspect of bug 740754 proved to be simple.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 740754 in gdm "Language selection for newly created user confusing" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/740754
<GunnarHj> So, if you aren't able to just say "do xyz, and it will work", I'll be content if some of you review the linked MP while dropping the remaining issue for 11.04.
<desrt> Riddell: i was a bit confused too :)
<desrt> dbarth: hey?
<desrt> in any case: https://launchpad.net/~desrt/+archive/dconf-qt
<pitti> hello GunnarHj -- heh, didn't sleep too much, but well, thanks :)
<desrt> i think the idea was that you know how docs work in the Qt world?
<pitti> Sweetshark: are you on amd64?
<pitti> Sweetshark: http://people.canonical.com/~pitti/tmp/libgcj-bc_4.5.1-1ubuntu4_amd64.deb
<pitti> Sweetshark: http://people.canonical.com/~pitti/tmp/libgcj-common_4.5.1-1ubuntu4_all.deb
<Riddell> desrt: no, I've never done anything with Qt docs
<desrt> Riddell: cool.  disregard then, i guess :)
<pitti> Sweetshark: works here now
<Sweetshark> pitti: Im on amd64, but I am not allowed tosee that page.
<pitti> whut?
<seb128> desrt, hey
<Sweetshark> pitti: You don't have permission to access /~pitti/tmp/libgcj-bc_4.5.1-1ubuntu4_amd64.deb on this server.
<seb128> desrt, do you have any clue what the issue could be on https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gconf/+bug/741239?
<pitti> Sweetshark: sorry, fixed
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 741239 in gconf "gsettings-data-convert crashed with SIGABRT in g_settings_set_value()" [Medium,New]
<Sweetshark> pitti: thanks, Ill try it.
<desrt> seb128: that's a pretty sad stack trace :p
<seb128> desrt, http://git.gnome.org/browse/gsettings-desktop-schemas/commit/?id=70eb5100b894ff449d1a752a3eebd1bf1de9444d
<seb128> desrt, the key and convert line were added in the same commit
<dbarth> xdatap: that can help, but then i'm not the man to talk to
<seb128> desrt, I'm probably missing something obvious but I don't get how the .convert can list the line and not the schemas
<desrt> seb128: is this an assertion failure?
<seb128> desrt, and yeah, that key renamed got you a new round of haters for making binaries abort because they can't find the background key ;-)
<dbarth> xdatap: can you comment on the bug explaining that this is not unity specific
<desrt> seb128: i stand resolute!
<xdatap> dbarth, ok, thanks. I will add more info to the report. Have a good day!
<desrt> seb128: actually, i'm thinking of standing less resolute soon :)
<dbarth> xdatap: and document the test case
<seb128> desrt, ;-)
<xdatap> dbarth, yes, I will do it right now :)
<dbarth> xdatap: also the othre crashers, upload them if they are not too old
<dbarth> cool, thx
<desrt> seb128: so are you sure this abort is due to missing key name and not something else?
<seb128> desrt, no
<seb128> desrt, I'm wondering what it could be
<pitti> chrisccoulson: nice, gwt and azureus built (on !armel), and swt-gtk armel build accepted -- progress!
<chrisccoulson> excellent :)
<desrt> so it's SIGABRT, but g_log isn't in the traceback
<seb128> desrt, it is
<seb128> g_log (log_domain=0xa92a01 "GLib-GIO", log_level=G_LOG_LEVEL_ERROR, format=0xaa98e4 "Settings schema '%s' does not contain a key named '%s'")
<chrisccoulson> pitti - there is still one swt-gtk consumer that is blocked on this libgcj_bc.so issue
<dbarth> hmm, another lib that calls exit? ;)
<desrt> ohh
<seb128> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/67113162/Stacktrace.txt
<desrt> your retracing stuff is clever enough to remove the g_log lines
<desrt> that's very useful and very confusing all at the same time :)
<seb128> ;-)
<desrt> so then very clearly it's a missing key name
<desrt> i wonder if someone's stuff got out of sync
<pitti> chrisccoulson: yes, I have a fix ready, pinged doko to countersign
<desrt> like maybe the gsettings update hook didn't run
<seb128> like the glib-compile-schemas not run yet?
<desrt> ya
<chrisccoulson> pitti -excellent, thanks
<seb128> desrt, could be...
<pitti> chrisccoulson: http://people.canonical.com/~pitti/tmp/ has the two fixed debs if you want to try locally
<chrisccoulson> thanks
<desrt> seb128: sort of a bad situation.  we may never know the truth here.
<desrt> since the problem is likely to go away on its own
<seb128> desrt, yeah, I was just wondering because we got a lot of the crashes recently
<desrt> hmm.
<seb128> desrt, but other ones were obvious errors, like the key got renamed or dropped but the .convert not updated
<desrt> is there any way to manually trigger dpkg?
<desrt> seb128: see?  this is why i prefer crashes here.  it gets the problem noticed a lot faster.
<seb128> desrt, still the abort on any error is annoying ;-)
<desrt> otherwise you guys would be releasing with a dozen g_critical()s :)
<seb128> desrt, well, we got a lot of "it crashes" when it would just have meant one value wouldn't get migrated for nothing because the key is deprecated
<seb128> desrt, and those users got their migration broken
<desrt> i think the problem here is that i expected people to treat their schemas as a stable API
<desrt> at least for schemas that they expect others to use
<desrt> but i didn't really make that very clear
<GunnarHj> pitti: Besides my concern with your sleep, and to be sure, did you notice the sentences that followed? Can I set you as reviewer on the (very simple) MP?
<pitti> GunnarHj: yes, please do
<GunnarHj> pitti: done
<didrocks> pitti: seb128: compiz with working session handling uploaded. Happy crash again :)
<seb128> didrocks, \o/
<pitti> didrocks: yay you!
<chrisccoulson> huh, i'm doing an update, and my fonts all just went huge!
<pitti> chrisccoulson: there was a ttf-ubuntu upload -- regressino?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i will see what it looks like after i've restarted my session (once the upgrade has finished)
<chrisccoulson> but it looks pretty bad atm, especially in evolution
<pitti> chrisccoulson: rejecting the mozjs amd64 build, FTR
<chrisccoulson> thanks
<pitti> chrisccoulson, Sweetshark: gcc-defaults uploaded
<chrisccoulson> pitti - excellent, thanks
<rodrigo_> pitti, can you do a super fast review of my answer to http://brainstorm.ubuntu.com/idea/26335/ ? is that what you were looking for?
<pitti> rodrigo_: in type and style, yes, thanks!
<rodrigo_> pitti, ok, anything else I should add?
<pitti> rodrigo_: I just wonder if it's really that expensive to stat some 20 dir entries
<pitti> rodrigo_: (i. e. you only need to stat the ones you are displaying, not all right away)
<rodrigo_> pitti, 20 not that much, but what about 4000?
<pitti> and it could be async, i. e. the arrow could disappear or appear after half a second, while it's stat'ing?
<rodrigo_> hmm, not sure how Nautilus does the displaying, I don't it does it in chunks
<pitti> ok
<rodrigo_> pitti, yes, it could
<pitti> rodrigo_: hm, I thought it would do the thumbnailing in chunks
<rodrigo_> the thumbnailing yes, but displaying the list of folders/files, it's all in one go afaik
<rodrigo_> hmm, I can't subscribe to the idea page, can I?
<pitti> rodrigo_: I don't see an obvious way how
<rodrigo_> pitti, yes, me neither
<pitti> Sweetshark: oh, bummer; the new libtextcat introduces an automake1.7 build dependency
<pitti> Sweetshark: that's gone to universe ages ago, and I'm not keen about reintroducing such obsolete stuff; can we make it use just "automake" (1.11), like the rest of the non-ancient world?
<pitti> Sweetshark: hm, it doesn't even seem to call that; I'll take a look
<Sweetshark> dunno, I havent looked at the package too deeply since there was nothing to merge (no customizations from us). If we cant get the package we could still use the LO-internal one (making the package bigger though)
<pitti> Sweetshark: fix uploaded; except that due to an inexplicable accident with vim the changelog looks totally broken
<Sweetshark> pitti: saw that already.
<Sweetshark> pitti: the libgcj-bc wants a libgcj-common 4.5.1-1ubuntu4 ...
<pitti> Sweetshark: yes, it's also on my people page
<Sweetshark> pitti: ah, ok
<pitti> chrisccoulson: there, mozjs finished building everywhere
<pitti> (i. e. finished failing)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - thanks. i'm just sorting out the symbols files now
<fta> pitti, hi, is there a pref somewhere that i can see to point apport-retrace -g to my unpacked sources? (without having to set that in gdb every single time)
<pitti> fta: you might be able to just stuff that into ~/.gdbinit ?
<fta> -see+set
<pitti> fta: but I wasn't actually aware that you can change the source path locally
<pitti> nice
<Sweetshark> alifornische Softwarekonzern daran, dem Workstation- und Unix-Pionier sein GeschÃ¤ftsmodell Ã¼berzustÃ¼lpen.
<Sweetshark> ups
<pitti> ??
 * pitti wonders when Sweetshark will post his s3kr1t passwords :
<pitti> )
<Sweetshark> pitti: nah, thats from an article about the death of the soul of my previous employer
<Sweetshark> dpkg-shlibdeps: warning: /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libgcj_bc.so.1 has an unexpected SONAME (libgcj.so.11)
<pitti> Sweetshark: well, that's to be expected -- this symlink is an 'orrible, 'orrible hack
<pitti> erm, I mean 'ack of course
<Sweetshark> this is what i still get, but thats expected. Otherwise the build succeeds.
<Sweetshark> \o/
<chrisccoulson> i think i'm going to upgrade jo's desktop to natty today
<chrisccoulson> see if she notices
<chrisccoulson> :)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: just some minor details changing in the desktop :)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I upgraded my wife's laptop a few days ago, she actually quite liked it at first
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah. i updated her to firefox 4 already, and she didn't say anything ;)
<pitti> let's see what she says in a week, after having to endure all those crashes
<chrisccoulson> heh
<chrisccoulson> if you turn off apport, she'll never notice them ;)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I did
<pitti> Sweetshark: on http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/component-mismatches.txt, second section (source/binary demotions), do you know the fate of the four oo.o- and openthesaurus?
<pitti> Sweetshark: were they replaced with the new hyphen/mythes stuff now?
<pitti> Sweetshark: but I don't see an obvious replacement for e. g. Czech or Russian hyphenation, there's no hyphen-$LANG package for it
<Sweetshark> pitti: so, how do we go about with LO 3.3.2 now? It would be perfect to have libtextcat2.2-9 and the gcj-bc fix for it.
<pitti> Sweetshark: well, both are in natty now (not published yet, though)
<pitti> Sweetshark: perhaps you could bump the build-dep to libtextcat to >= 2.2-9 and libgcj-bc to >= 4.5.1-1ubuntu4, then we could upload right away
<pitti> Sweetshark: and then LP will properly dep-wait
<Sweetshark> pitti: if I reenable libtextcat it will automatically, but for libgcj-bc I would have to tweak.
 * pitti bumps build score of armel gcc-defaults
<pitti> Sweetshark: the alternative is to wait another hour
<pitti> Sweetshark: whatever is easier
<pitti> Sweetshark: actually I think openoffice.org-dictionaries is still current, right?
<pitti> i. e. I should seed all these packages so that they stay in main
<Sweetshark> as for the thes packages: openoffice.org-thesaurus-it hasnt been renamed just as it hasnt in debian. as it is just a suggest we would need a seed for it (just like the openthesaurus stuff), right?
<pitti> Sweetshark: right; so all of these are still current?
<pitti> Sweetshark: so for the Polish and Italish stuff, should I add back these three oo.o packages to language-selector?
<Sweetshark> pitti: -it is current. openthesaurus almost is (recently bumped to 20110119-2ubuntu1, but debian has 20110119-3).
 * Sweetshark still tries to wrap his head around the -pl packages.
<pitti> Sweetshark: I meant "current" in the sense of "used by libo instead of being an obsolete package"
<Sweetshark> hmmm, -pl looks outdated. debian has a openoffice.org-thesaurus-pl source which packs a mythes-pl binary while ours does still pack a openoffice.org-thesaurus-pl_1.5-3ubuntu1 binary.
<Sweetshark> pitti: Ill try a merge for -pl.
<pitti> Sweetshark: ok, I'll deal with openthesaurus and openoffice.org-hyphenation for now; I also need to fix language-selector harder for the mythes stuff
<pitti> and to install openoffice.org-hyphenation for the langauges that it supports
<pitti> Sweetshark: you confirm that openoffice.org-thesaurus-it is current?
<pitti> Sweetshark: i. e. we shoudl install it for italian?
<Sweetshark> pitti: tricky: there is no newer version of -it, but it doesnt yet depend on LO, but on a openoffice.org transitional
<Sweetshark> (openoffice.org-core)
<Ampelbein> chrisccoulson: your upload of gnome-vfs works around bug 709216 according to the changelog, yet I still can't open links from inside thunderbird (using chromium as browser).
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 709216 in gnome-vfs "clicking on a link dont open the page " [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/709216
<chrisccoulson> Ampelbein, what is /desktop/gnome/url-handlers/http set to?
<pitti> bryceh, RAOF: xserver-xorg-video-qxl
<pitti> ... wants to go to universe; should it be seeded, go into universe, or even added to -all?
<Ampelbein> chrisccoulson: with 'gconftool-2 -g /desktop/gnome/url-handlers/http' I get "No value set for `/desktop/gnome/url-handlers/http'"
<chrisccoulson> Ampelbein, i meant http/command
<chrisccoulson> anyway, i can see what's up. chromium uses an upper case %U
<chrisccoulson> *sigh*
<chrisccoulson> i'll add another case to gnome-vfs then
<Ampelbein> chrisccoulson: yes, chromium can open multiple URI's at once (which is what uppercase %U is for, if I understand the spec correctly)
<Sweetshark> pitti: there is a mythes-it in the debian new queue that will replace openoffice.org-thesaurus-it. but it is not yet in.
<pitti> Sweetshark: ok, we can handle that after beta then
<rodrigo_> kklimonda, ping
<Sweetshark> pitti: find openoffice.org-thesaurus-pl_1.5-4ubuntu1_source.changes on chinstrap
<pitti> Sweetshark: should I remove openoffice.org-thesaurus-it and openoffice.org-thesaurus-pl and openoffice.org-hyphenation-pl then?
<pitti> ooh
<kklimonda> rodrigo_: hey
<rodrigo_> hi kklimonda
<rodrigo_> kklimonda, how are you?
<kklimonda> rodrigo_: I've been better, but still alive :)
<rodrigo_> kklimonda, heh
<pitti> Sweetshark: upped
<rodrigo_> kklimonda, if you have some minutes to spare, I need 2 more eyes to look at a crash in test-couchdb-glib
<kklimonda> rodrigo_: sure
<rodrigo_> kklimonda, do you have 5 mins to compile git master and run the test program?
<kklimonda> yes
<rodrigo_> kklimonda, it's crashing all the time in couchdb_database_free_document_list, in the if (COUCHDB_IS_DOCUMENT ... call
<rodrigo_> kklimonda, if you can have a quick look (2 mins), maybe you can find why it's crashing there now, where it never did before
<rodrigo_> kklimonda, I've been looking at it for a few days, so I really need 2 more eyes in case I'm missing something obvious
<pitti> Sweetshark: libtextcat and gcj-bc are in the archive now, except for armel; so we could upload libo now if you want
<pitti> Sweetshark: (armel is okay, it will build late enough that these two libs will be in the archive well before)
<pitti> Sweetshark: adding mythes-pl to language-selector then
<Sweetshark> pitti: k. I will just rename the version and reenable the libtextcat dep.
<Sweetshark> pitti: the hyphen for -pl will be on chinstrap in  a minute
<pitti> oh, nice; holding back the l-s upload then
<Sweetshark> pitti: hmm, that merged without a problem. there is no "| language-support-writing-pl" in it so it can simply be synced.
<pitti> Sweetshark: actually, I wonder how many of these alternate depends we still actually need; I think we should revisit that at UDS
<Sweetshark> so status: openoffice-thesaurus-pl is on chinstrap, openoffice.org-hyphenation-pl can be sync => pl can be included. mythes-it is still in debian NEW -> disable for beta.
<pitti> Sweetshark: hyph-pl synced, thes-pl already uploaded some minutes ago
<pitti> hang on
<pitti> Sweetshark: you said hyphen-pl would be on chinstrap, but I don't see it
<pitti> argh, I'm confused, ignore me
<pitti> so, all done
 * pitti updates l-s for hyphen-pl and uploads
<pitti> Sweetshark: for coordination, do you plan to have LibO uploaded in the next 45 mins? I wonder if I have time to grab some lunch now, or later
<pitti> chrisccoulson: mozjs binNEWed on !armel, go wild
<Sweetshark> pitti: In ~1 hour. If you fetch lunch now, Ill have it ready when you return.
<chrisccoulson> pitti - excellent, thanks
<chrisccoulson> i'll upload couchdb in a minute then
<pitti> cool; /me off
<chrisccoulson> i'm just about to complete the swt-gtk transition now
<mvo> didrocks: does a patch like #741081 needs approval from the design team or anything like this? adds a unity quicklist thing
<mvo> bug #741081
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 741081 in gnome-terminal "Add 'Open a new terminal window' to unity launcher quicklist" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/741081
<chrisccoulson> pitti - ok, taking icedtea-web now
<chrisccoulson> Sweetshark, would you mind taking a look at the libreoffice bits in bug 740815 when you get a few moments?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 740815 in firefox "[FFe] Updates to enable us to drop xulrunner from main" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/740815
<didrocks> mvo: I think it should, but I don't see them scale TBH :)
<skaet> didrocks,  just spotted unity 3.6.6-0ubuntu3 produces uninstallable binaries:
<skaet>   * unity (i386)
<skaet>  - is this a known issue?
<didrocks> skaet: why unity 3.6.6-0ubuntu3 ? we should have 3.6.8 published now
<seb128> didrocks, we have 3.6.8 published for a few hours
<skaet> didrocks,  its what's showing up in the Daily CD build message this morning.   config need to be updated somewhere?
<seb128> hey skaet
<skaet> hi seb128
<ogra_> skaet, CD builds were before/during the publishing
<skaet> didrocks:  under ubuntu/daily: Uninstallable packages:
<skaet> thanks ogra_ ,  skew I guess.
<ogra_> its what i face under armel with every second build ... arch any vs arch all packages
<didrocks> skaet: yeah, the update to get compability was done this night
<didrocks> skaet: when I pined you before going to bed :)
<didrocks> so way after CD build I guess
<mterry> seb128, let's say Ubuntu/mpt would prefer some string different in a gnome program.  Do we generally distro patch that?  Send a patch upstream in the hopes they like the new wording better?  (does that ever work?)
<skaet> cool.  mystery solved.   back to my bug lists... ;)
<seb128> mterry, "depends" ;-)
<seb128> mterry, we try to argue for the case upstream yes
<mpt> mterry, in years gone by we changed a bunch of strings upstream in gnome-power-manager for example
<seb128> mterry, if they don't the "depends" is a cost benefit thing
<mterry> mpt, do you care much about https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/indicator-datetime/+bug/740856 ?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 740856 in indicator-datetime ""Authenticate" dialog has incorrect text" [Undecided,New]
<mterry> mpt, that's from gnome-settings-daemon
<mpt> mterry, I'd class that as Low importance, but at the same time I'd expect it to be accepted upstream, because "Privileges are required..." is a very obscure way of asking for your password
<mterry> Sure.  How about I'll pass it upstream, but not distro patch it to avoid losing translations?
<seb128> mterry, I would open a bug upstream for this cycle and batch it for next cycle if upstream doesn't reply
<mpt> suits me
<mterry> chrisccoulson, my thunderbird links still aren't working  :(
<chrisccoulson> mterry, which browser do you use?
<mterry> chrisccoulson, firefox
<chrisccoulson> hmmm
<chrisccoulson> mterry what is in /desktop/gnome/url-handlers/http/command?
<mterry> chrisccoulson, "firefox %u"
<chrisccoulson> oh, that should work :/
<chrisccoulson> mterry - you get the same result as before? (firefox opens a tab with the URL pointing to http://www.%u.com)
<mterry> chrisccoulson, yah
<chrisccoulson> now i'm confused ;)
<chrisccoulson> that should be working now :(
<seb128> mterry, did you upgrade your gnome-vfs?
<chrisccoulson> there is one case i know about (it needs to handle %U)
<chrisccoulson> all this effort to not break gnome-vfs ;)
<mterry> seb128, yeah
<mterry> chrisccoulson, false alarm
<chrisccoulson> heh
<chrisccoulson> what happened?
<mterry> chrisccoulson, it seems to work now.  :-/
<chrisccoulson> lol
<chrisccoulson> heisenbug
<chrisccoulson> my favourite
<mterry> chrisccoulson, I thought I had restarted thunderbird already, but apparently not
<chrisccoulson> :)
<mterry> chrisccoulson, thanks for fixing!
<seb128> you should use a decent email client
<chrisccoulson> lol
<seb128> you wouldn't have those issues ;-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - find me one ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, like the on we ship with Ubuntu? ;-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i meant "find me a decent client" ;)
<chrisccoulson> heh
<seb128> oh, I see where you are going :p
<chrisccoulson> lol
<chrisccoulson> i think thunderbird is going to be rocking with the work that m_conley is putting in ;)
<chrisccoulson> he's working on U1 contact sync now \o/
<seb128> chrisccoulson, how active is upstream at fixing issues? (out of unity integration work)?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - very active, generally
<seb128> hum, so you think we should consider it for next cycle?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - lets see how people feel closer to UDS. there are still some bits missing (calendaring being the main one), and the situation with translations for both tbird and firefox also really sucks right now
<chrisccoulson> (which is something i'm going to fix next cycle)
<seb128> we need to define our target user
<seb128> not sure if we target users who care about calendars or not
<chrisccoulson> yeah, i was just about to say the same thing
<chrisccoulson> calendar integration is definitely very nice, but i've never seen jo use it here
<seb128> the calendar desktop integration is very handy
<chrisccoulson> but she does use an e-mail client
<seb128> right but people at canonical for example to use the calendar quite a bit
<seb128> ups
<kklimonda> rodrigo_: I've tracked it to the commit a48fe0c4f7a2048011b8b0c1b6348340fd2f6650
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - yeah, i use the calendar too (which is why i use evo for work), but i'm not sure i'm the target audience ;)
<seb128> like office users likely want to know about their next meeting
<seb128> office being people at work, not ms office ;-)
<seb128> brb, another session restart
<kklimonda> rodrigo_: reverting it will fix the test, but not the couchdb_session_free_document_list function.
<kklimonda> rodrigo_: but apparently the problem has been there for a while, it also crashes on maverick
<kklimonda> I'm surprised it crashes as we register a type for CouchdbDocumentInfo
<kenvandine> seb128, the calendar integration was my wife's favorite thing about upgrading to natty
<kenvandine> she uses google calendar to keep track of all the places she needs to get the kids too, etc... so she loves having that in the panel
<kklimonda> rodrigo_:  at least the code is there, what should call it?
<seb128> kenvandine, hum, but we have that since warty?
<seb128> kenvandine, like gnome-panel has it, it's not new to natty
<kenvandine> not maverick
<kenvandine> une maverick
<seb128> oh, people use une 10.10 really? ;-)
<kenvandine> hehe
<kenvandine> she was :)
<seb128> kenvandine, but yeah, if you use a calendar it's very nice to have
<seb128> I'm just not sure what users use a calendar and what users we target
<kenvandine> right, and i think people tend to use that for more than work
<kenvandine> i think there are lots of users using google calendar for example
<seb128> especially in a world with smart phones and google giving you free online calendars
<kenvandine> exactly
<kenvandine> and evolution finally seems to work pretty well with google calendar :)
 * kenvandine is so happy he can now accept invitations in email
<seb128> does that work?
<kenvandine> yes
<seb128> I got used to copy the url in a web browser
<kenvandine> hehe :)
<seb128> I didn't try for a while
<kenvandine> i saw someone tweet about it working
<seb128> one things that sucks is that you can't click on the url
<kenvandine> so i tried, and it did
<kenvandine> no idea when it was fixed
<seb128> nice ;-)
<kenvandine> otherwise i would have never tried
<pitti> re
<seb128> pitti, wb
<pitti> meh, why does evo keep forgetting my gcal password
<Sweetshark> pitti: https://launchpad.net/~bjoern-michaelsen/+archive/libreoffice-nattytest <- there is a libreoffice version in there, l10n is on the way
<seb128> pitti, how often? in what keyring is it stored?
<pitti> seb128: every couple of weeks or so
<seb128> pitti, there was some "known bug" about password being dropped when it fails to connect to servers sometimes
<seb128> though those were usually for email accounts
<seb128> not sure if calendars have the same issue
<pitti> ah, that might fit
<seb128> who would be to blame for the unity-appmenu to open when doing a window dnd and hitting esc?
<seb128> njpatel, tedg, mterry: ^ one of you know I'm sure ;-)
<mterry> seb128, hah, fascinating
<njpatel> seb128, Sam
<seb128> does the same when using the corner grip and doing esc
<njpatel> yep, it's sending weird keycodes around
<seb128> compiz bug?
<njpatel> I'm pretty sure
<njpatel> seb128, actually
<seb128> njpatel, thanks, I will open and assign to smspillaz
<Sweetshark> pitti: I uploaded the l10n to the ppa too, but i guess that was wrong, as I didnt -sa it.
<seb128> rodrigo_, pitti: just for info I raised a bit the settings of bug #649809 so it doesn't drop off the natty list
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 649809 in gdm "the session settings manager can try starting before the login screen one exits" [Low,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/649809
<chrisccoulson> pitti - hmm, i can't see how the packagekit change will work
<chrisccoulson> it's still looking for mozilla-plugin in configure
<pitti> chrisccoulson: currently test-building
<Sweetshark> pitti: Ill copy to chinstrap a changes file with -sa
<pitti> chrisccoulson: right, just failed
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i'm wondering whether i should just ship the same set of pkg-config files in firefox-dev tbh, and make it conflict xulrunner-dev
<pitti> chrisccoulson: might indeed be easier
<chrisccoulson> it would save us having to patch stuff
<chrisccoulson> and it would be more palatable for icedtea too
<chrisccoulson> that will have to be after beta now though won't it?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: if you break existing packages, then yes; if you only ship the files in addition, then no
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i was thinking about the amount of time it takes to build on armel
 * ogra_ hugs chrisccoulson for that staement 
<chrisccoulson> heh :)
<pitti> Sweetshark: your libreoffice_3.3.2-1ubuntu1_source.changes is missing the orig.tar.gz as well
<pitti> Sweetshark: and it would be nice if you could build that with -v1:3.3.1-1ubuntu5
<pitti> Sweetshark: and the changelog with "regenerate control file" sounds a bit like being for -l10n?
<pitti> Sweetshark: l10n looks good, I'll upload that with a fixed libo
<Sweetshark> pitti: the libreoffice_3.3.2-1ubuntu1_source.changes from chinstrap? yeah, I shouldnt have uploaded that, I broke it when generating l10n. the one in the ppa should be ok thogh.
<pitti> Sweetshark: ah, ok
<Sweetshark> yes, the one in the ppa seems to be ok
<Sweetshark> pitti: and regenerate control file is also valid, as I had to regenerate for system libtextcat
<rodrigo_> kklimonda, hmm, I thought that while loop had been there for a while
<pitti> Sweetshark: both uploaded, thanks! so this should be built by the weekend on arm then
<rodrigo_> kklimonda, I guess it fails to check a GObject's type if the pointer is not a GObject-based pointer
<Sweetshark> \o/
<kklimonda> rodrigo_: well, it has been commited in may last year, but it is a commit that fails. I agree that it looks like G_TYPE_CHECK_INSTANCE_TYPE doesn't know how to handle non-GObject types.
 * Sweetshark sacrificies a few squirrels to the gods of arm.
<pitti> Sweetshark: btw, does this add a build or binary dep to nlpsolver now?
<pitti> Sweetshark: this currently wants to go back to universe
<Sweetshark> no, there isnt. it is build as an extension, so LO can strictly work without it. Its just one damn useful feature.
<Sweetshark> (which is why upstream releases it along the product).
<kklimonda> rodrigo_: btw, how much is left to be done to get gnome-shell from gnome3 ppa working? anything I could help with?
<rodrigo_> kklimonda, it's already working for me
<rodrigo_> kklimonda, isn't if for you?
<kklimonda> rodrigo_: probably I've missed doing something
<kklimonda> rodrigo_: just adding gnome3 ppa, updating, upgrading and installing gnome-shell have left me with quite a mess :)
<rodrigo_> oh, what mess?
<kklimonda> rodrigo_: no theme, applications aborting with message about linking against both gtk+2.x and gtk+3.x
<rodrigo_> kklimonda, hmm, I guess something got half updated
<rodrigo_> is that in nautilus?
<rodrigo_> about the no theme issue, you can just set it on the command line with gsettings tool
<kklimonda> rodrigo_: I can't tell right now, I've had to revert to get system in a working state once again. If you are saying that it should work, I'll try updating again this weekend and fight with any problems I have.
<rodrigo_> kklimonda, ok, let me know of anything you come up, and we'll try to fix it
<kklimonda> ok, will do
<pitti> Sweetshark: you shouldn't have spent all your squirrels on the armel god :/ http://launchpadlibrarian.net/67189461/buildlog_ubuntu-natty-amd64.libreoffice_1%3A3.3.2-1ubuntu1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<pitti> x86_64-linux-gnu-g++: /usr/lib64/libjpeg.so: No such file or directory
<pitti> yes, that wouldn't work
<rodrigo_> kklimonda, I've deprecated CouchdbDocumentInfo, as we discussed it was useless, only used in tests
<pitti> Sweetshark: it is spelled /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libjpeg.so now ..
<chrisccoulson> nice, alt key working in the firefox menu now
<pitti> chrisccoulson: ooh!
<pitti> Sweetshark: nlpsolver> hm, I woudl have at least thought that the libreoffice metapackage should pull it in?
<rodrigo_> pitti, kenvandine, seb128: can you please merge https://code.launchpad.net/~rodrigo-moya/ubuntu/natty/couchdb-glib/0_7_1_release/+merge/54721 (already uploaded, as I have permissions for that package)
<seb128> rodrigo_, ok
<rodrigo_> seb128, thanks
 * Sweetshark is in svtools already
<bcurtiswx> kenvandine, are you already working on empathy 2.34.0 ?
<rodrigo_> seb128, ditto for https://code.launchpad.net/~rodrigo-moya/ubuntu/natty/evolution-couchdb/0_5_2_release/+merge/54731 please
<bcurtiswx> kenvandine, i'll go get empathy packaged.  It's new enough and with as busy as you seem i don't think you would have gotten to that yet
<chrisccoulson> pitti - did the searchplugins in langpack-o-matic come from maverick?
<seb128> mvo, bug #741269
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 741269 in apt-clone "dpkg-repack missing dependency" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/741269
<pitti> chrisccoulson: yes, I think I extracted them from maverick's -base packages; natty's don't have them yet
<chrisccoulson> pitti - ah, ok. natty has a different set of search plugins
<chrisccoulson> it has bing ;)
<chrisccoulson> and a couple of others were dropped too
<mvo> seb128: thx!
<pitti> chrisccoulson: ah, so good time to fix them now, so that they can go into the langpacks on Sunday?
<seb128> mvo, yw ;-)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: the original data was lost apparently, so mavericks' were the most recent ones I could fine
<pitti> "find"
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, i was just having a look now
<chrisccoulson> i think next cycle we should probably merge all of this in to the firefox source (translations + searchplugins)
<micahg> +1, especially with the new planned mozilla release cycle, we don't want to be blocked on langpack updates for security fixes
<micahg> preferably sorted out before we backport a newer firefox to the stable releases
<chrisccoulson> micahg - we'll probably still ship them in language packs, but i want the firefox source to take care of building the xpi's (to replace po2xpi)
<chrisccoulson> i haven't quite figured out how it's all going to work yet ;)
<micahg> chrisccoulson: :(, I'd prefer to ship in-source if we can
<micahg> unless we're planning langpack updates every 6 weeks
<ari-tczew> could someone set as merged this branch? https://code.launchpad.net/~om26er/ubuntu/natty/metacity/metacity-fix-717216/+merge/52199
<ari-tczew> ogra_: ^^
<bcurtiswx> chrisccoulson, is the bug where firefox is always the default browser been fixed?
<chrisccoulson> bcurtiswx, it depends for what use case. there were bugs affecting multiple packages which broke that in different ways
<chrisccoulson> i've fixed the default browser check for firefox, but that's unlikely to have been your issue ;)
<bcurtiswx> chrisccoulson, im using Chromium Web Browser, and i set that as default browser but firefox still comes up as
<chrisccoulson> comes up, from where?
<chrisccoulson> in any case, that's a bug in another application or another part of the stack ;)
<bcurtiswx> chrisccoulson, OK thx :)
<bcurtiswx> and that meant to say as default browser
<mterry> tedg, what do you think of bug 735445?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 735445 in indicator-datetime "clock doesn't update on timezone change" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/735445
<bcurtiswx> seb128, kenvandine, if one of you gets a change, https://code.launchpad.net/~bcurtiswx/ubuntu/natty/empathy/empathy-2.34.0-0ubuntu1/+merge/54738
<bcurtiswx> chance*
<didrocks> Sweetshark: hey, did you have a look at bug #720716 by any chance?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 720716 in ayatana-design "Please add unity Quicklist support" [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/720716
<seb128> pitti, still around?
<pitti> hey seb128
<seb128> pitti, hello
<seb128> pitti, do you have any opinion on the libcairo gl naming and were to put the extra .h and .pc?
<seb128> pitti, I've created a libcairo2-gl with a /usr/lib/cairo-gl which has libcairo.so.*
<pitti> seb128: oh, does it need extra .h files?
<seb128> pitti, well, it doesn't "needs" it "ships" those
<pitti> seb128: if it actually changes the API, then I'd put them into libcairo-gl-dev and make that conflict with libcairo-dev
<seb128> pitti, I can i.e wayland need those function definitions
<seb128> pitti, it's extra files, no need to conflicts
<pitti> ah, so much the better
<seb128> I'm pondering adding a -dev or just stacking that in libcairo2-gl
<seb128> well I guess the extra binary would be cleaner
<pitti> seb128: would it be wrong to put the extra files into libcairo-dev?
<seb128> I was pondering doing that
<seb128> I'm not sure how much it could mislead people to think cairo is built with gl
<pitti> seb128: so I guess the cleanest woudl be a libcairo-gl-dev which depends on libcairo-dev and libcairo-gl?
<seb128> yeah
 * Sweetshark needs more cpus
<seb128> pitti, http://paste.ubuntu.com/584930/
<seb128> pitti, something around those lines I think (it's building there)
<pitti> +debian/install/main/usr/lib/cairo-gl/libcairo.so.* /usr/lib/cairo-gl
<pitti> oh, does that mean theres not even an overlap?
<pitti> seb128: so we don't even need diversions, etc?
<pitti> seb128: this looks great to me (FLAVOURS FTW)
<seb128> pitti, well I though that was the idea from yesterday?
<seb128> pitti, install the lib variant in another dir and let wayland of whather ldpreload this one?
<pitti> seb128: I naively thought both would build the same .so, just with different features
<seb128> well ldpreload, or tweak LD_LIBRARY_PATH
<pitti> ah, right
<seb128> pitti, it does
<pitti> sorry, misread
<seb128> it's the same lib with another option so another set of symbol
<seb128> dumped in another dir
<seb128> so those who want it can add the dir to their ldpath
<pitti> seb128: I thought we wanted to ship /etc/ld.so.conf.d/00-libcairo-gl.conf in libcairo-gl, as then we keep the knowledge of where the library is in one place
<pitti> and we can change this without doing corresponding changes to wayland
<pitti> but I'm not too fussed about that
<seb128> pitti, I'm fine with that, that drop is a first one with the new binary, I wanted to figure the ld hack next
<pitti> seb128: let me quickly verify this assumption
<seb128> pitti, no hurry, I've a call in 6 minutes so I will resume that after the call and dinner
<bryceh> pitti, -qxl probably should go into -video-all (it's the kvm video driver, see bug #709537)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 709537 in xserver-xorg-video-qxl "[MIR] xserver-xorg-video-qxl" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/709537
<bryceh> pitti, shall I add it to -video-all?
<pitti> bryceh: If you think it's correct to install by default, yes
<pitti> seb128: hm, got some trouble with that, need to play around with ld.so.conf.d
<seb128> ok
<bryceh> tjaalton, looks like your xorg 7.6 merge was not uploaded yet?  should I upload it at this time or must it wait until after beta?
<tjaalton> bryceh: when is the beta freeze?
<bryceh> tjaalton, think its today
<tjaalton> next week I guess
<tjaalton> oh
<tjaalton> damn, should add those to my calendar..
<bryceh> tjaalton, I pushed the -qxl addition to video-all to alioth if you'd like to take a quick look
<tjaalton> bryceh: is it in universe?
<tjaalton> -qxl that is
<tjaalton> ah, no
<bryceh> tjaalton, <pitti> bryceh, RAOF: xserver-xorg-video-qxl
<bryceh> <pitti> ... wants to go to universe; should it be seeded, go into universe, or even added to -all?
<bryceh> <bryceh> pitti, shall I add it to -video-all?
<bryceh> <pitti> bryceh: If you think it's correct to install by default, yes
<bryceh> tjaalton, (-qxl is the kvm video driver, see bug #709537)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 709537 in xserver-xorg-video-qxl "[MIR] xserver-xorg-video-qxl" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/709537
<tjaalton> local kvm/qemu uses cirrus, but this is for the remote stuf
<tjaalton> f
<tjaalton> or maybe my info is outdated
<tjaalton> in any case, I'm aware of SPICE, and it sounds cool enough to warrant the change ;)
<tjaalton> yeah I just pulled it
<tjaalton> duh
<tjaalton> scrollback failure
<tjaalton> does it actually work on other than amd64/i386 though
<tjaalton> even though it's built on armel & powerpc too
<tjaalton> bryceh: you need to use tab to indent vars.*, otherwise the build fails?
<tjaalton> since it's used by makefile
<tjaalton> hm, doesn't fail
<chrisccoulson> hi, would some non-english speakers mind adding missing translations to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Translations/Wanted/FirefoxDesktop ? :)
<chrisccoulson> pitti/seb128 perhaps ;)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: de already exists
<pitti> chrisccoulson: now, if only we had a web site which would allow you to comfortably translate .po files..
<chrisccoulson> pitti - it's for some extra items (static quicklists)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: ah, will do
<chrisccoulson> thanks :)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, can't you use strings already listed and translated in firefox?
<chrisccoulson> seb128 - i don't think there is already a "Open a New Window"
<chrisccoulson> there is "New Window" though
<chrisccoulson> i did think about using existing strings ;)
<tedg> mterry, That makes sense to me.
<tedg> mterry, (the function to signal the UpdateTime signal)
<mterry> tedg, any opinions on what the method should be called?  TriggerUpdateTime?  Or can a signal and method have same signature?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: there!
<tedg> mterry, I'd make them different just to avoid confusion.
<tedg> mterry, I don't care too much about the name, it's a private interface.
<tedg> mterry, UpdateTimeBecauseISaidSo
 * mterry adds UpdateTimeIfYaLikeButNoBigDealIfItDoesNotHappenKThxBye
<chrisccoulson> pitti - thanks :)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - bug 741964 is for you if you want to take it ;)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 741964 in plasma-scriptengine-googlegadgets "Please remove google-gadgets source and binaries from archive" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/741964
<pitti> oh! oh! removing cruft! yummy!
<chrisccoulson> heh :)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: *munch* *much* 'z gone
<chrisccoulson> pitti - thanks :) we have lots of green now - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Specs/Natty/Firefox4/XULRunner20Transition
<chrisccoulson> i like green!
<pitti> chrisccoulson: so basically just eclipse left?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: and libo and icedtea
<chrisccoulson> pitti - anything which isn't green or yellow, so there's still a few things left
<tjaalton> chrisccoulson: why not use what firefox has for ctrl+n/ctrl+t?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: gtk-vnc is fixed as well
<tjaalton> i updated fi by adding what the ffox menu had
<chrisccoulson> tjaalton, which menu? If it's the file menu, then that doesn't have the whole string does it? (it doesn't for english)
<chrisccoulson> New Window versus Open a New Window
<chrisccoulson> i'm not sure if the menu entry makes sense for other languages though. it might do :)
<tjaalton> well, i'm not sure 'open' is needed there..
<tjaalton> but, i'll add it if it is :)
<tjaalton> meh, done
<chrisccoulson> thanks :)
<pitti> njpatel, didrocks: ah, seems I indeed have a different compiz crash now (re from this morning)
<pitti> (uploading)
<didrocks> pitti: yes please :-)
<pitti> bug 741977
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 741977 in nux "compiz crashed with SIGSEGV in nux::Area::InitiateResizeLayout()" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/741977
<pitti> (not retraced yet)
<didrocks> pitti: did  you change your resolution?
<didrocks> oh no
<didrocks> forget about my question :)
<pitti> didrocks: not with restarting compiz
<didrocks> let's see once retraced
<didrocks> thanks pitti :)
<pitti> didrocks: my gsession script does call xrandr --output LVDS1 --off, though
<pitti> didrocks: made a note in the bug
<didrocks> pitti: thanks!
<njpatel> pitti, I'l pay you to stop crashing Unity :)
 * njpatel only sees stacktraces everywhere
<pitti> njpatel: I can sit down with a debugger and have a look :) (not right now, though)
<pitti> njpatel: I have two screens, though (internal disabled LVDS, external TFT, docked), so that might not be as common as most developer platforms
<njpatel> Interesting
<pitti> njpatel: the fun thing is that until a week ago this thing was rock solid
<njpatel> I'll pass it onto jason once we have a proper stack
<pitti> I didn't have a single crash in two weeks or so
<njpatel> pitti, you know the rule: Stop updating as soon as it works for you!
<pitti> njpatel: I told didrocks, but he always wanted more crack!
<njpatel> pitti, we made some changes to support multi-monitor better, so maybe this is from that
<njpatel> pitti, hah
<njpatel> He is a bad influence on us ;)
 * kenvandine should plugin a second monitor just to see how awesome this is
<didrocks> njpatel: oh!
<pitti> njpatel: I did notice that the launcher now covers the full screen height, not just the 800 pixels that my internal display has
<didrocks> njpatel: ok, no more update for you! :)
<njpatel> pitti, yeah, that would be part of the fix
<njpatel> pitti, but there were internal painting fixes too
<pitti> oh, I've been meaning to ask
<njpatel> and this looks shockingly close to that
<njpatel> didrocks, NNNNOOOOO
<njpatel> didrocks, Sorry :D
<pitti> njpatel: is it deliberate that the launcher only appears as faint ghost-like shadow when I hover over the ubuntu logo?
<didrocks> njpatel: no, you know I'm the bad leader here, always telling you guys "push more crack, more crack!" :-)
<pitti> it only seems to fully materialize when I'm in the top left corner
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, it is what designed specified
<njpatel> right
<didrocks> pitti: there is a dead triangle zone of 3x3
<pitti> it's a bit confusing, as I often just move to somewhere in that box, then down, and woosh, the launcher goes away
<njpatel> it's meant to do that
<njpatel> yes!
<njpatel> tell mark!
<didrocks> pitti: don't insult my code like that! :)
<njpatel> well, tell design!
<didrocks> njpatel: pitti: there is a bug report with a discussion
<pitti> this is one of these little things that drive you nuts
<didrocks> pitti: we proposed the "slide only" effect that you can trigger in ccsm
<pitti> well, there's one good thing about it: it greatly accelerates me getting used to the windows key
<didrocks> pitti: also, there is the fade + slide which is under debate :)
<pitti> up until a few weeks ago this key was basically virgin
<didrocks> heh ;)
<robbiew> so who wants to look at my nvidia bug! :D
<pitti> Neil wants to!
<didrocks> enough bug for today ;)
<robbiew> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nvidia-graphics-drivers/+bug/741963
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 741963 in nvidia-graphics-drivers "Cannot switch to virtual consoles (vt#)" [Undecided,New]
<pitti> he just told us he's looking for more stack traces
<didrocks> not unity, not unity \o/
<robbiew> I got video of the behaviour and everything
 * robbiew has had this bug for awhile....in Natty...distorted console image.  I was hoping the latest nvidia driver would fix it...never did :/
<robbiew> didrocks: unity looks great on this machines ;)
<robbiew> /s/machines/machine
<didrocks> pitti: bug #739567 if you want to follow the latest story (read the comments)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 739567 in ayatana-design "Launcher - Set Launcher 'Hide Animation' to 'Slide only' by default. Also introduce subtle fade in effect." [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/739567
<pitti> didrocks: thanks
<didrocks> robbiew: it's just great for great people :-)
<Sarvatt> robbiew: try booting with vesafb.sucks=1?
<robbiew> Sarvatt: seriously?
<Sarvatt> its got nothing to do with the nvidia driver, the vesafb crap for plymouth is whats messed up
<Sarvatt> yeah
<robbiew> lol..what an awesome variable
<robbiew> ok
<Sarvatt> passing an invalid module parameter (aka sucks) prevents it from loading
<didrocks> at least, they express their opinion :)
<robbiew> ah
<robbiew> lol
<didrocks> oh
<didrocks> I'm disappointed now :-)
<m4n1sh> rickspencer3: in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/10.10/DeveloperManual is there any intention to add a Launchpad manual too?
<robbiew> Sarvatt: hmm...no dice...but I may have fubar'd the grub line.../me edits grub file
 * didrocks waves goodnight
<Sarvatt> robbiew: oh, the grub screen is corrupted too? try changing the set gfxpayload=$linux_gfx_mode line to set gfxpayload=text when you boot next too
<robbiew> Sarvatt: nah...grub screen is fine
<robbiew> I'm thinking my mind is corrupted
<dobey> rodrigo__: in the couchdb-glib NEWS you put 0.7.0 as the version for the 0.7.1 release :)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: eww:
<pitti> -- natty/main amd64 deps on xulrunner-1.9.2:
<pitti> libgluezilla
<chrisccoulson> huh, i thought that was in universe?
<chrisccoulson> oh, it's not :(
<pitti> -- natty/main amd64 deps on libgluezilla:
<pitti> libmono-webbrowser0.5-cil
<pitti> only dep
<pitti> -- natty/main amd64 deps on libmono-webbrowser0.5-cil:
<pitti> libmono-cil-dev
<pitti> libmono-winforms2.0-cil
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, the dependencies seems to spread out quite a bit
<chrisccoulson> i'm not sure how to work out which parts of the mono stack are actually using it, because it all seems to go through several layers of lubraries
<chrisccoulson> libraries
<pitti> I made a note in the bug for now (and a new task)
<chrisccoulson> thanks
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, that one could be a pain
<pitti> chrisccoulson: perhaps we could just disable support for that in mono?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: hop over to #devel?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i'm not too sure. i don't know what applications are using it
<chrisccoulson> yeah, sure
<mterry> tedg, I'm piling up datetime merges.  Do you prefer many merges or lots of commits in one big merge?
<mterry> So far, I've gone for a mix
<tedg> mterry, Many merges.  It think it makes them easier to review.
<tedg> mterry, I don't care how many commits.  But I think "a merge" should be roughly "an idea"
<mterry> tedg, well, I'll fallen short of that.  I've been fitting ~3 ideas per merge  :)  but otherwise I'd have 12 merges
<mterry> I'll try to be mergy
<tedg> mterry, bzr lp-propose-merge is your friend :-)
<mterry> ooh, I don't know it
<tedg> mterry, It's not that big a deal, but if you ask I'll answer :-)
<tedg> mterry, The only issue with it is that it doesn't know default reviewers, so you always have to specify.  So like "--review indicator-applet-developers"
<tedg> Or dbusmenu-team, or whatever.
<mterry> tedg, docs claim that that will work
<tedg> mterry, Hmm, I've been bugging people about it... perhaps, my annoyance has paid off?!?!
 * mterry notes that lp-propose is an alias
 * tedg uses bzr lp-p<tab>
<seb128> go mterry go ;-)
<mterry> tedg, do I have to push somewhere first, then propose?  or does the propose push somewhere for me?
<tedg> mterry, You have to have a remembered location.  So have atleast pushed once.  But it'll update if you're not up-to-date.
<mterry> hm k
<tedg> I typically do "push, propose" but I'm trying to get to "branch, push, {work}, propose" with the idea that I should push early and often :-)
 * tedg has a-typical New Year's goals
<mterry> :)
<tedg> mterry, So this qtcreator bug has me stumped, could you look to see if you notice anything?
<tedg> mterry, Basically if you run qtcreator, click on the file menu to open it, dbusmenu_client crashes.
<mterry> tedg, I can tomorrow
<tedg> mterry, It seems to be a variant gets unref'd when we're still using it, but I can't find anything.
<tedg> mterry, Yeah, I didn't mean "right now" sorry.
<mterry> tedg, subscribe me to the bug
<tedg> mterry, Will do, thanks!
<pitti> Sweetshark: yay, i386/amd64 built, great job
<pitti> Sweetshark: want me to copy -l10n from the PPA? or do you have it on chinstrap?
<Sweetshark> oh, heh
<Sweetshark> pitti: yeah, just saw that too
<Sweetshark> l10n from the ppa would be nice.
<seb128> Sweetshark, hey
<pitti> Sweetshark: which ppa url was that again?
<pitti> hey seb128, wb
<seb128> Sweetshark, did you see the question from didrocks earlier?
<pitti> seb128: FYI, I synced pygobject from experimental, and deleted our branch (to avoid confusion)
<seb128> pitti, re
<seb128> pitti, ok, I never know what to do with those when we sync, i tend to unpack the debian source and commit if it's likely we will get diffs again
<pitti> personally I'd just use ubuntu:pygobject from now on, if we need to make further changes
<seb128> pitti, just so robert_ancell can not merge-upstream and screw it? ;-)
<pitti> lol
<pitti> seb128: more packages -> more getting used to them :)
<robert_ancell> seb128, :P
<pitti> and the rest of Ubuntu uses them as well anyway
<seb128> hey robert_ancell
<pitti> you see them all the time for sponsoring, too
<pitti> hey robert_ancell, howdy
<seb128> pitti, the issue is not getting used to them, is having an efficient workflow
<seb128> robert_ancell, did you start on the clutter update?
<Sweetshark> pitti: https://launchpad.net/~bjoern-michaelsen/+archive/libreoffice-nattytest2/+packages
<pitti> Sweetshark: ahh, I missed the "2"
<seb128> pitti, seems Sweetshark ignore comments from others than you ;-)
<Sweetshark> seb128: yes, I did see it. Sorry, I have not looked at those yet.
 * Sweetshark hugs seb128.
<seb128> Sweetshark, ok, they should have landed today since it's ui freeze now
<robert_ancell> seb128, no, didn't notice it.  Can't we just merge from Debian?
 * seb128 hugs Sweetshark
<seb128> robert_ancell, that's ok, I've it building, I just wanted to avoid duplicating work
<seb128> robert_ancell, so asking in case
<Sweetshark> gotta go.
<robert_ancell> seb128, ok, I was working on the webkit update.  But it fails building after a few hours.
<robert_ancell> seb128, aren't we in beta freeze now anyway?
<seb128> .symbols outdated?
<seb128> robert_ancell, well, it start today but they didn't pull the trigger yet it seems
<seb128> so still uploading ;-)
<robert_ancell> seb128, no, the documentation.  The debian/rules has a hack for it, and it always seems to break again
<robert_ancell> seb128, ok, excellent.  I'll mad update all the packages that Debian hasn't updated then
<seb128> robert_ancell, you are on an update rampage I see ;-)
<seb128> robert_ancell, I don't see anything interesting to update on versions though
<robert_ancell> soup, totem-pl-parser etc
<robert_ancell> it would be nice to be running the latest so there's not some bug that annoys the upstreams for the next 6 months
<seb128> well those can be updated after beta
<seb128> debian guys were talking about updating soup yesterday
<robert_ancell> it would be better to do it earlier though right?
<seb128> the earlier the better I guess
<seb128> it gives extra testing
<seb128> robert_ancell, ok, clutter is not a simple dch and build, there is a patch to update from the egl stack which I'm not sure if it's still needed and there is a symbol which got dropped, so if you want to do it please feel free to do it
<robert_ancell> seb128, ok, will do
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> robert_ancell, did you have anything you spotted that need work otherwise?
<robert_ancell> I just have a few bugs that have been assigned to me that I really need to get done for beta.  I'm going to try and get hacks for them, as the proper way has been taking too long.
<robert_ancell> Apart from that the only thing that worries me about natty is the random instability of compiz/X/unity :)
<seb128> bah, speaking about unity annoyance, I hate that it doesn't focus things when starting them sometimes
<seb128> I got firefox displayed in front but the ctrl-w went to IRC
<robert_ancell> seb128, I hate that is does - That's been annoying me for ages.  I launch 3 things, start typing in a terminal then it keeps popping them in front of me
<robert_ancell> I haven't seen the split focus issue, sounds nast
<robert_ancell> y
<chrisccoulson> seb128 / robert_ancell - yeah, i've always found that compiz does the opposite of what i want it to do, every time
<robert_ancell> and how do you guys like the dash?  I find it pretty useless to be honest
<seb128> robert_ancell, you should clean you assigned bugs list ;-)
<robert_ancell> seb128, yeah yeah :P
<seb128> yeah, I don't see the point either
<seb128> the alt-f2 dialog is nice though
<Q-FUNK> it's actually called non-compliz
<robert_ancell> I can never use alt-F2 as F2 without the Fn key turns off my wireless
<chrisccoulson> oh, that's unfortunate ;)
<robert_ancell> seb128, hey, did you see the display preferences monitor indicator thingy is fixed?  Next UDS wont be seeing it on top of everyones presentation...
<seb128> robert_ancell, you can change the binding in ccsm if you want
<seb128> robert_ancell, yeah, well done, I noticed that vuntz has decided to pick on you as the first one to have to document an api there to get commited
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> robert_ancell, I'm wondering if he's just trying to make hard for Canonical to get upstream commits ;-)
<robert_ancell> yeah, that was a bit cheeky.  I mean, I only added the _show () method which is the opposite of the current hide () method!
<robert_ancell> LOL!
<robert_ancell> It's been him all along!  It's always the one you least suspect...
<robert_ancell> I should add what I think to the bug - "is this really necessary in a library?? Why not just put it inside the preferences applet, then it doesn't need any documentation..."
<seb128> robert_ancell, so yeah, set your "run a command" in ccsm if you want
<robert_ancell> seb128, meh, I'm too lazy
<seb128> robert_ancell, the dash screen is not very useful but you can do "super" and type a command as well
<seb128> well, command or file
<robert_ancell> I like to think I represent our standard user, who can't be bothered working out how to change keybindings
<seb128> but it does match on applications and files only, not on commands as alt-f2
<seb128> robert_ancell, I like to think our standard users have a decent keyboard :p
<seb128> but if you are tech enough to not care about alt-f2 I guess the dash completion should work for you
<robert_ancell> hmm, alt-F2 just locked up X.  Awesome
<seb128> blame it on RAOF then
<rickspencer3> booo
<seb128> it's probably xorg or your driver again
<robert_ancell> I always do ;)
<robert_ancell> He always blames the kernel
<seb128> rickspencer3, howdy ;-)
<rickspencer3> wfm :)
<rickspencer3> hey seb128
<seb128> rickspencer3, btw today is ui freeze, stop requesting for extra quicklists items :p
<rickspencer3> seb128, hey, I mentioned it would need a UIFE!
<rickspencer3> cut me some slack
<robert_ancell> so RAOF, I just got a new laptop, which has a nvidia card.  Am I in for more trouble or less now?
<rickspencer3> oh well, I guess I could make my own desktop file it if doesn't get in
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, each UIFE costs a beer right?
<seb128> rickspencer3, I will bring you a middle mouse buton at the next UDS ;-)
<rickspencer3> for my netbook trackpad?
<rickspencer3> that sounds dicey
<seb128> weellll
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, I'll take that deal!
<seb128> I still think they should have a click-<modifier> for it
<rickspencer3> seb128, that would be nice, yeah
<seb128> it doesn't make sense to patch every single desktop file
<rickspencer3> oh well, I'll just make my own desktop file, I guess
<seb128> rickspencer3, you should do it the robert_ancell's way
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: Is the laptop's CPU i-based, i.e i3/i5/i7, if so it may also have an intel GPU.
<seb128> <robert_ancell> I like to think I represent our standard user, who can't be bothered working out how to change keybindings
<rickspencer3> trade it for 1 beer?
<seb128> rickspencer3, ^
<seb128> don't go with the workaround, stand for our users and get it fixed ;-)
<RAOF> robert_ancell: Depends - does it use optimus? :)
<seb128> but yeah, 1 beer would work as well
<rickspencer3> well, shipping is a feature too!
<robert_ancell> TheMuso, I think it does, so I'll probably just use the Intel driver if it is more reliable
<robert_ancell> RAOF, optimus?
<seb128> don't forget the pay beers at didrocks who stayed until 5am yesterday to push the unity update
<rickspencer3> no beers for didrocks, he loves it
<rickspencer3> j/k
<rickspencer3> :)
<seb128> ;-)
<rickspencer3> we owe didrocks more than beer!
<RAOF> robert_ancell: Switchable graphics, nvidia/intel.
<rickspencer3> RAOF, did you get a chance to look at robbiew's weird issues with not being able to switch to a VT?
<RAOF> rickspencer3: Yeah, although the video is still downloading.
<rickspencer3> he made a video? fancy
<RAOF> rickspencer3: He seems to be using an ancient kernel, so I'm not sure if that's influencing things.
<rickspencer3> really?
<RAOF> (Like, from earlyish in the Maverick development cycle)
 * rickspencer3 boggles
<robert_ancell> bug 742116 for my alt-F2 crasher
<rickspencer3> RAOF, it hardly seems worth the time to debug until he updates to the latest kernel
<rickspencer3> I mean, I'm surprised it's working at all, tbh
<seb128> robert_ancell, bug #736349 could be a bug to pick up of you get borred
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 736349 in oem-priority ""Test speakers" is silent" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/736349
<seb128> robert_ancell, it's basically the "test speakers" which only works when sound events are on
<seb128> the dialog should probably bypass that setting
<RAOF> rickspencer3: Well, he's got the newer kernel installed, so I'm not sure if it's deliberate :)
<Amaranth> seb128: you should talk to alf_ about that clutter egl patch but I know we still needed it in january and I can't image that's changed
<seb128> Amaranth, well, upstream commited http://git.gnome.org/browse/clutter/commit/?h=clutter-1.6&id=9b9c4ea6cfbcf409a3265fccb9bebcea3794acdf
<seb128> Amaranth, which conflicts with half of the patch which deleted the line between the red and green lines
<seb128> Amaranth, so I'm wondering if moving the commit fixes the same issue
<Amaranth> let me take a look
 * Amaranth waits for source downoad
<seb128> Amaranth, thanks
<pitti> good night everyone
<seb128> 'night pitti
<seb128> robert_ancell, btw don't sponser eog and evince sponsoring requests
<seb128> robert_ancell, they are being discussed as feature freeze exceptions
<Amaranth> seb128: ah, yeah, their change should be able to replace that patch
<seb128> Amaranth, the 2 chunks or only the second one?
<Amaranth> unless the command shader boilerplate macro is used somewhere else
<seb128> Amaranth, the first part still applies
<Amaranth> seb128: the whole patch should be able to be dropped assuming that's the only file they use the macro in
<seb128> robert_ancell, ^ that's about the clutter patch which as a conflicting chunk if you do the update
<seb128> Amaranth, ok thanks
<robert_ancell> seb128, oj
<robert_ancell> ok
<Amaranth> and it looks like that's the only place they use it so dropping the patch should be ok
<seb128> great
<seb128> ok, enough work for today
<seb128> 'night everybody
<pitti> bye seb128
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-03-25
<jcastro> robert_ancell: around?
<robert_ancell> jcastro, hey
<robert_ancell> pitti, can you look at bug 736349 and see if it is feasible to have sound-theme-freedesktop on the CD?  It's 1/2 a meg, but we really need it to have proper fallback sound events
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 736349 in oem-priority ""Test speakers" is silent" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/736349
<cdbs> chrisccoulson: ping
<micahg> cdbs: probably won't be around for a few more hours
<cdbs> chrisccoulson: What would you say about the FF bug having both options: Open a New Tab and Open a New Window?
<cdbs> micahg: :o
<pitti> I'll be back in some 2 hours, have an appointment
<didrocks> good morning
<duanedesign> morning didrocks
<didrocks> hey duanedesign
<rodrigo_> morning
<seb128> hey desktopers
<seb128> hey rodrigo_
<seb128> how are you?
<didrocks> hey rodrigo_, salut seb128
<seb128> hey didrocks
<rodrigo_> hi seb128, didrocks
<desrt> dbarth: good morning
<desrt> and seb and rodrigo and didrocks :)
<dbarth> desrt: hi Ryan
<didrocks> hey desrt! :)
 * desrt is on european time today
<seb128> hey desrt
<seb128> pitti, do you read the GNOME desktop-devel-list?
<dbarth> desrt: how come?
<dbarth> (the european time zone)
<desrt> dbarth: in frankfurt right now
<desrt> long connection before moving on to india
<dbarth> eh, nice trip
<desrt> ya.  i'm going to be at the release hackfest next week
<desrt> you should notice the corresponding spike in my productivity :)
<rodrigo_> hi desrt
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<rodrigo_> hi chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hi rodrigo_
 * desrt loves the n*(n-1) thing that always happens
<desrt> chrisccoulson: hi =)
<chrisccoulson> hi desrt, how are you?
<chrisccoulson> cdbs, re, adding both a "new window" and "new tab" item to the static quicklists - i'd prefer just the new window for now. it makes more sense, and i don't want to clutter up the menu
<chrisccoulson> (there will be a dynamic quicklist at some point)
<desrt> chrisccoulson: a bit sleepy, but nicely caffinated
<chrisccoulson> heh :)
<chrisccoulson> i think i need to grab some caffeine
<kklimonda> rodrigo_: hey, I did install g-s from gnome3 ppa
<kklimonda> rodrigo_: I've had to install gnome-themes-standard to get the new gnome3 theme, mutter was missing the theme too - I've had to manually change it in gconf-editor and restart g-s-d
<didrocks> seb128: do ou know if the retracers are working?
<didrocks> hey chrisccoulson
<seb128> didrocks, let me check
<chrisccoulson> hi didrocks, how are you?
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: I'm fine thanks! the rush is (hopefully) behind us now :)
<didrocks> and you?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks - yeah, i'm good thanks. looking forward to a more relaxing day ;)
<didrocks> today is launchpad and paperwork day. Some hacking if I have time! :)
<rodrigo_> kklimonda, hmm, ok, I guess we need to add a dependency there then
<kklimonda> rodrigo_: also gnome-screensaver doesn't start
<rodrigo_> kklimonda, any error message?
<kklimonda> rodrigo_: yeah, Settings schema 'org.gnome.desktop.screensaver' does not contain a key named 'power-management-delay'
<kklimonda> rodrigo_: some gnome-contorl-center applets are also missing schemas
<rodrigo_> kklimonda, I guess you need a gsettings-desktop-schemas update
<kklimonda> rodrigo_: I've cloned git repo, and power-management-delay is not there
<kklimonda> rodrigo_: also, I can't figure out how to change the icon theme
<rodrigo_> kklimonda, only via gsettings on the command line
<kklimonda> unless what I have is the right icon set, but then it's fugly ;)
<rodrigo_> kklimonda, II guess we need a g-screensaver upgrade to 2.91.92
 * rodrigo_ does it
<kklimonda> rodrigo_: also, is update of network-manager to 0.9 hard?
<rodrigo_> kklimonda, haven't tried yet, but shouldn't afaik
<kklimonda> i've tried upgrading gnome-control-center (some capplets are also crashing with missing schemas) I've noticed that it depends on n-m 0.9+ for network capplet
<kklimonda> (updating didn't help, still can't access Background capplet)
<rodrigo_> yes
<kklimonda> can I help? :)
<rodrigo_> kklimonda, with nm 0.9? yes!
<kklimonda> ok, cool
<rodrigo_> kklimonda, any help on the gnome3 ppa is more than welcome, so go ahead
<rodrigo_> kklimonda, the branches for that ppa are in https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~gnome3-team
<rodrigo_> kklimonda, I'm doing g-screensaver now, so feel free to do any other
<kklimonda> interesting, we have a really recent snapshot
<rodrigo_> well, it's missing 2.91.92
<rodrigo_> I started this week upgrading some packages, but not many, as I was busy with other stuff
<kklimonda> nah, I was talking of NetworkManager
<kklimonda> ah, we are not following the 0.9 branch
<rodrigo_> no
<rodrigo_> kklimonda, new g-screensaver uploaded, uploading g-c-c in a bit
<rodrigo_> but need to reboot 1st
<rodrigo_> brb
<aquarius> mvo, ping?
<mvo> hey aquarius
<aquarius> mvo, heya, pal! Odd software-centre problem; s-c complained about the package system being broken (old version of unity-2d) and suggested running apt-get -f install, which is fine. However, it started aptd and dpkg. I've quit s-c, but the aptd and dpkg processes are still running, eating lots of CPU, and I can't see any way of quitting them.
<aquarius> mvo, (well, I could obviously kill -9 them, but my dad couldn't, and I'm always scared of killing dpkg in case it decides to make my machine unbootable as revenge :))
<mvo> aquarius: *ick* that sounds nasty. anything in /var/log/syslog ?
<aquarius> ooh, loads of Processing transaction /org/debian/apt/transaction/c1cff228f3b6461b973cbcc90175b71e stuff (http://paste.ubuntu.com/585295/)
<mvo> aquarius: what is "ps afx" showing? is it always the same transaction id its processing? or constantly creating new ones?
<aquarius> new transaction ids
<aquarius> three processes are using all the CPU; aptd, dpkg, and update-python-m(something)
<aquarius> oh, and firefox, but that's not your fault ;)
<mvo> that sounds like its really doing lots of work, but its very odd that it keeps adding new action ids
<mvo> could you still mail me / msg me (privately if you prefer) the ps afx output?
<aquarius> mvo, http://paste.ubuntu.com/585298/
<mvo> aquarius: I'm confused now, I can't see dpkg in that list?
<aquarius> mvo, grr! it's stopped now!
<aquarius> right, fine, the universe is just trying to screw me up
<aquarius> mvo, ignore me, for now. I'll poke around.
<mvo> aquarius: heh :) there should be a log of what happend in /var/log/apt/term.log hopefully
<mvo> aquarius: did that happen when you selected to install something? i.e. did something break during the install or was the system in a inconsitent state before?
<mvo> aquarius: /var/log/apt/history.log should have some idea about this
<aquarius> broke during the removal (of unity-2d)
<aquarius> yeah. What I think was the problem was this: I selected to remove about twenty things in software centre. One of them (unity-2d) failed, and I got the "run apt-get -f install" warning. So I quit SC to run that, but quitting SC didn't stop doing all the removals. And I couldn't go in and cancel the removals, because when SC started up it says "the package system is inconsistent, do you want to fix it".
<mvo> ohhh, that makes sense
<mvo> I think we need to teach aptdaemon to stop all further transactions on error
<mvo> would you mind to file a bug about that ? against aptdaemon?
<aquarius> sure; what shoudl it say? just describe what happened to me?
<Sweetshark> didrocks: hey, sorry that i didnt even reply yesterday, but I really wanted to get the 3.3.2 release in before the beta and there was some nasty trouble because some dependencies changed in oh so interesting ways breaking the LO build. so: no, unfortunately I did not do anything about #720716.
<didrocks> Sweetshark: hey! do you think you can tackle this just post-beta?
<pitti> re
<pitti> seb128: no, I'm not sub'ed to desktop-devel
<Sweetshark> didrocks: so that would be just patching the static desktop entry, right? shouldnt be too hard then, but what about UI freeze?
<seb128> pitti, hey, wie gehts?
<didrocks> Sweetshark: I think the freeze exception will be easily granted as it doesn't impact too much the doc (last time I checked)
<didrocks> hey ivanka
<didrocks> hey pitti
<ivanka> hey didrocks
<pitti> bonjour didrocks
<pitti> cava seb128
<pitti> sorry, my appointment took a little longer today
<seb128> pitti, ok, walters just posted an SoC idea email about doing a "desktop file cache"
<seb128> pitti, I'm wondering what happening to your gnome-menus patch if that was ever upstream and maybe if you were going to reply to that email
<seb128> upstream->upstreamed
<seb128> like it's in bugzilla? was it blocked on something?
<seb128> vuntz, ^
<cdbs> Hi, as for bug #729074, is it not implemented yet? Or is it implemented but a bug is not making the quicklist come up?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 729074 in unity-2d "dynamic quicklists are not working" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/729074
<Mez> Is there now a working nvidia driver for natty?
<pitti> seb128: (@phone again -- I hate that day)
<seb128> pitti, (no worry)
<pitti> seb128: hm, I'm actually not sure, let me look
<seb128> pitti, b.g.o is down
<pitti> seb128: I think back then the status was that vuntz didn't particularly like the text cache format and preferred a binary cache or so
<pitti> seb128: argh, still?
<seb128> pitti, yeah...
<pitti> meh, for a few days now the firefox global menu bar is totally broken :/
<seb128> pitti, I think you said by then you redo the caching using gvariant when those would land
<seb128> rather than a key file
<pitti> seb128: right; I'm not so sure that will be faster, but it's worth a try
<Sweetshark> didrocks: Ill do backports today, but I will give it a try on monday.
<seb128> pitti, well in any case it seems stupid to redo the work from scratsch so I was wondering if you were going to reply on the list
<pitti> seb128: can you bounce the mail to me? (not just forward)
<seb128> pitti, I will probably at least reply with the bug number of bugzilla ever comes back running
<pitti> meh, our patch doesn't have a bug ref
<pitti> might be that this was discussed on IRC only or so
<seb128> pitti, not sure the bouncing worked, the evo way to do it is confusing
<seb128> not to mention that the canonical smtp apparently doesn't allow to "relay" the email it seems
<seb128> hum
<seb128> I think bug #742120 is multiarch path changes screwing running session
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 742120 in gnome-control-center "Square blocks where text should be" [Low,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/742120
<seb128> mvo, I guess that's not something we can easily deal and people dist-upgrading should be restarting anyway?
<mvo> seb128: indeed, however we need to make sure it does not break the upgrade itself
<pitti> seb128: hm, not really, it's destroying all the headers; I guess I'll look up the message-id in the archive
<seb128> pitti, try asking rodrigo or njpatel maybe if they can bounce it
<seb128> they probably are on d-d-l
<pitti> seb128: oh, btw
<pitti> $ cp -a /usr/lib/libcairo.* /tmp/l
<pitti> $ cat /etc/ld.so.conf.d/zz-libcairo-gl.conf
<pitti> /tmp/l
<pitti> gnome-abo 2516 martin  mem    REG                8,2  1020400 1184740 /tmp/l/libcairo.so.2.11000.2
<pitti> seb128: so tacking it to the end works
<pitti> seb128: sorry, forgot to tell you yesterdya
<pitti> seb128: (you need to run sudo ldconfig after changing the file)
<seb128> pitti, ok, I need to sit and think about it for a bit still, I'm unsure what to do know with the .pc etc
<seb128> pitti, like what path those should have
<seb128> pitti, not sure the ld hack is enough, i.e if wayland will build with that
<seb128> or we need tweaking the .pc paths etc
<seb128> it's really work over what is worth, the ppa would have been just fine for natty :-(
<pitti> seb128: for building you need a .pc with the right -L, yes; ld.so.conf.d is only for runtime searching, gcc doesn't care about it
<pitti> seb128: in particular, gcc searches for the unversioned .so
<pitti> seb128: so for building wayland you need to install the libcairo-gl-dev instead of the libcairo-dev, then there is only one .so to pick
<seb128> pitti, right, which means just installing the extra .pc in libcairo2-gl... might not work
<seb128> we might need to c,r,p the standard one and tweak the .pc files
<pitti> seb128: well, I'm sure it can be made working as well, but then you need to ensure that it searches in the lib//cairo one first
<rodrigo_> so any idea why I get this C/C++ compiler cannot create executables?
<rodrigo_> it only happens when building packages, it seems
<rodrigo_> I can compile fine stuff from git/bzr
<seb128> no
<rodrigo_> oh, no, I can't if I re-run autogen.sh :(
<chrisccoulson> pitti - what issue are you having with the firefox menu bar?
<seb128> rodrigo_, can you bounce walters' SoC email to ddl to pitti btw?
<seb128> or someone on ddl who has an email client and smtp server able to bounce properly an email
<rodrigo_> seb128, yes, sure
<pitti> hey rodrigo_ , thanks
<pitti> rodrigo_: can you look in config.log what it's complaining about?
<rodrigo_> pitti, forwarded
<pitti> rodrigo_: can you bounce instead of forward, so that all headers remain intact? (to avoid breaking the thread)?
<rodrigo_> pitti, ah, sorry
<rodrigo_> hmm, how do I bounce from evolution?
<rodrigo_> pitti, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/585320/
<rodrigo_> ah, found it
<pitti> /usr/bin/ld: cannot find -lgcc_s
<pitti> uh
<pitti> it's in /lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libgcc_s.so.1
<pitti> actually, not that one, the unversioned .so is /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/gcc/x86_64-linux-gnu/4.5/libgcc_s.so
<rodrigo_> pitti, now bounced hopefully ok, let me know if you get it correctly
<rodrigo_> $ ls /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/gcc/x86_64-linux-gnu/4.5/libgcc_s.so
<rodrigo_> ls: cannot access /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/gcc/x86_64-linux-gnu/4.5/libgcc_s.so: No such file or directory
<pitti> rodrigo_: perfect, thanks!
<pitti> rodrigo_: are you on i386?
<rodrigo_> pitti, what package does that file be,o
<rodrigo_> long to
<pitti> rodrigo_: but anyway, the file should be in the gcc-4.5 package
<rodrigo_> belong to
<pitti> still strange
<rodrigo_> hmm, ok
<rodrigo_> no, on x86_64
<rodrigo_> only have gcc-4.5-base
<rodrigo_> I guess that's it
<rodrigo_> installing gcc4.5
<pitti> hm, "gcc" depends on it
<pitti> rodrigo_: just curious how you could build stuff at all then (in git) :)
<rodrigo_> pitti, no, I couldn't
<rodrigo_> I just ran 'make' in a dir which had all built
<rodrigo_> so I thought it was built correctly
<pitti> rodrigo_ | I can compile fine stuff from git/bzr
<rodrigo_> but it built nothing
<pitti> ah :)
<rodrigo_> pitti, yeah, but see my comment after that :)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: when I start it, it all works, but after some time it's just empty
<rodrigo_> so, for some reason that gcc-4.5 got removed/not upgraded in my last upgrade
<pitti> chrisccoulson: i. .e the title works, but if I move the mouse to the panel it gets empty and no menu at all; this started a few days ago
<chrisccoulson> pitti - bug 718926
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 718926 in bamf "Some apps don't integrate to appmenu after having their windows closed" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/718926
<chrisccoulson> i guess it happens after you've minimized it at some point?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I don't even have a file menu, and I basically never minimize ffox
 * pitti tries
<chrisccoulson> for some reason, bamf sends a spurious view-closed followed by a view-opened signal sometimes when you minimize windows, and that causes the menu to get discarded
<chrisccoulson> hmmm
<pitti> chrisccoulson: no, minimizing and re-maximizing works
<chrisccoulson> pitti - oh, it only happens sometimes. i bet if you do it enough times, then it will lose the menu
<pitti> I didn't find a pattern yet
<pitti> chrisccoulson: hm, but I by and large never minimize windows
<chrisccoulson> i've seen it occasionally too, but it's basically the same issue (the menubar thinks the window has been closed)
<pitti> ffox is sitting on work space 2, maximized, all the time
<pitti> chrisccoulson: ah, ok; well, there's a branch, I'll see if that helps once it gets merged :) thanks
<chrisccoulson> pitti - the branches on the bug fix a previous issue with a similar symptom
<chrisccoulson> that's a bit confusing actually, it should probably be another bug really
<ricotz> chrisccoulson, hi, is libmozjs185-dev suppose to replace xulrunner-dev?
<chrisccoulson> ricotz, it depends what you're doing with it
<ricotz> chrisccoulson, like for gnome-shell?
<chrisccoulson> that would use libmozjs
<chrisccoulson> don't change just yet though, there's still some discussion upstream about the naming of the library
<chrisccoulson> (we currently only have couchdb using it)
<ricotz> chrisccoulson, alright, i will use xulrunner-dev
<didrocks> re
<didrocks> power breakage in a large part of Lyonâ¦
<didrocks> someone was stuck in the elevator
<pitti> uh
<pitti> didrocks: it's back now?
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, just now
<chrisccoulson> pitti - does compiz crash for you at all?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: yes, two or three times after login
<pitti> from then on, only once a day or so
<chrisccoulson> pitti - ah, ok. that's another thing which tends to break menus
<chrisccoulson> i just remembered after i had compiz crash here ;)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: ah, perhaps
<Sweetshark> I you guys want to see something awesome, you gotta run "subsequentcheck" -- the LibreOffice system tests on unity. 30 windows popping up and closing like crazy. Also triggers a pretty reliable bamfdaemon suicide.
<pitti> Sweetshark: seems command-not-found doesn't know about it yet?
<pitti> or is it only in git, not shipped?
<Sweetshark> pitti: only in git. you need a complete build for that.
<pitti> ah, pretty big obstactle then; but that sounds great!
<pitti> test suites FTW
<pitti> Sweetshark: does it have a lot of external dependencies? if not, perhaps it's worth packaging in a separate binary, then QA coudl integrate that in their daily autotests
<pitti> that would certainly be a great addition
<Sweetshark> pitti: no, not many extra deps subsequenttests are mostly just junit tests.
<Sweetshark> pitti: However, I just reenabled them on LO and they are currently still failing left and right. They will need a bit of a fixup o be useful to QA. After all you are mostly interested in regressions and not in "was broken before, is broken now".
<Sweetshark> hehe, my launcher is seriously confused now, showing every existing window at least six times.
<pitti> uh
<Sweetshark> no: exactly six times
<kklimonda> rodrigo_: I think we should sync libseed from debian experimental into gnome3 ppa?
<kklimonda> if only it built ;)
<mterry> Sweetshark, oh, duplicate launcher icons that crash unity if hovered over?  I filed a bug about that a while ago -- you have reproducable steps?
<rodrigo_> kklimonda, what is it needed for?
<Sweetshark> mterry: you wouldnt like the reproducable steps, they would start with "build libreoffice from source ..."
<mterry> Sweetshark, nm :)
<kklimonda> rodrigo_: for the newer libpeas (it's actually stuck in dep-waiting in the main archive), which is required by... I can't find the package right now, but something did depend on libpeas >= 0.7.4
<rodrigo_> kklimonda, ah, yes, eog
<kklimonda> right
<kklimonda> but I get a really weird error when building seed
<rodrigo_> which error?
<kklimonda> http://paste.ubuntu.com/585362/
<kklimonda> but there is a debian/tmp/usr/lib/libseed-gtk3.so.0
<rodrigo_> in which subpackage is it in?
<rodrigo_> I think you'll need a .symbols file
<kklimonda> dh_shlibdeps -pseed
<rodrigo_> I mean the libseed-gtk3.so, where is it? in which subpackage?
<kklimonda> right, good question - it looks like it's not actually installed in any package..
<kklimonda> lets see
<kklimonda> ok, it builds fine now - I didn't copy one .install file properly
<rodrigo_> cool
<rodrigo_> kklimonda, not sure if we want the lipeas/seed upgrade in natty, rather than the ppa
<rodrigo_> seb128, ^
<kklimonda> rodrigo_: I agree, it may be a little too late to push it to natty at this point, even if libpeas 0.7.3 in archive doesn't build... maybe we should revert it back to 0.7.2?
<kklimonda> (and push libpeas 0.7.4 to the ppa, along with seed)
<rodrigo_> kklimonda, or upgrade to 0.7.4 if it doesn't break API/ABI
<rodrigo_> if not, yes, let's put it in the ppa
<kklimonda> rodrigo_: wow, the difference between adwaita, and the old theme is huge.. are there plans to port adwaita back to gtk 2.0?
<rodrigo_> kklimonda, not that I know, it uses the new CSS-based themes afaik, so it's hard to port
<seb128> rodrigo_, is anything using libpeas or seed in natty?
<seb128> rodrigo_, seems fine to update those if the update is not likely to break things
<rodrigo_> seb128, no, just needed for eog in the gnome3 ppa
<seb128> rodrigo_, somebody should merge seed on debian then we can sync the new libpeas
<rodrigo_> seb128, ah, on natty eog and gedit at least
<seb128> ?
<rodrigo_> kklimonda, ^
<seb128> seems not since libpeas is in universe
<seb128> so eog and gedit can't be using it
<rodrigo_> oh, I guess it's a new dep on 2.91.*
<seb128> right
<seb128> they are both in universe
<seb128> somebody should merge seed on debian so we get the gtk3 binary
<seb128> then libpeas will build
<kklimonda> debian doesn't build gtk2 binaries anymore in seed package
<seb128> do we use those for anything?
<kklimonda> epiphany-browser depends on libseed0
<kklimonda> (debian has updated it to 2.91.91 in experimental, we are still shipping 2.30.6)
<rodrigo_> ok then, let's do the updates in the ppa for now, right?
<kklimonda> I'd say it's a safer bet at this time - it's not like we really need it in the archive, as most of gnome3 stuff is only in ppa
<seb128> is there anything stopping to update epiphany-browser in natty?
<kklimonda> seb128: Freeze? :)
<seb128> well we need to update libpeas to fix the depwait issue then
<seb128> well it's universe and it's not building
<kklimonda> I can download epiphany package from experimental and check what it needs
<seb128> well the easy way out otherwise is to update libpeas to still build with gtk2
<ricotz> rodrigo_, are you using the gnome3 package locally?
<rodrigo_> ricotz, which gnome3 package?
<ricotz> rodrigo_, if so could you test these https://edge.launchpad.net/~ricotz/+archive/testing/+packages
<rodrigo_> but yes, I'm using the ppa
<rodrigo_> ricotz, ok
<ricotz> rodrigo_, you might need to wailt for g-s build3
<rodrigo_> ricotz, yes
<bcurtiswx> rodrigo_, when pushing build to the GNOME3 PPA, are you building in pbuilder to test the build or locally building?
<rodrigo_> bcurtiswx: locally building and installing before pushing
<bcurtiswx> rodrigo_, OK, so i haven't looked yet, but most of your builds that fail then are from depwaits ?
<rodrigo_> bcurtiswx: well, not all, but a few of them
<rodrigo_> g-c-c from the ppa now indeed looks like it's a depwait
<bcurtiswx> rodrigo_, eog too
<bcurtiswx> ?
<rodrigo_> bcurtiswx: eog is failing because of missing libpeas >= 0.7.4
<rodrigo_> which is what we were discussing with kklimonda
<bcurtiswx> rodrigo_, cool :) thx i was j/w
<rodrigo_> bcurtiswx: feel free to fix any package btw :)
<bcurtiswx> rodrigo_, i try to if i get the time :)
<rodrigo_> I don't think I'm going to push more updates today or the w/e, since there's 2.91.93 on Monday
<seb128> rodrigo_, reminder about the g-s-d race thing in natty
<seb128> rodrigo_, natty bugs should be worked before ppa updates if possible ;-)
<rodrigo_> seb128, yes, still looking at that :)
<ricotz> seb128, could you review this https://edge.launchpad.net/~ricotz/+archive/testing/+sourcepub/1565167/+listing-archive-extra
<seb128> ricotz, review what? if it works upload, or ping the people who worked on the egl support, I've no clue about that
<ricotz> seb128, this bug is caused by the clutter backend patch again
<seb128> seems your build it working so is there any issue you want discussed there?
<seb128> is your concern that the clutter patch is wrong?
<ricotz> yeah, this patches need to be changed a lot, but it should work
<ricotz> seb128, btw i cant upload packages
<seb128> upload to the ppa for now and open a sponsoring request
<seb128> this can probably wait after the beta1 freeze end to go in natty
<ricotz> ok
<seb128> well in any case I will not likely do that today, I've to catch up on other non packaging work I delayed for some time
<ricotz> seb128, alright
<seb128> we should sort the clutter patch thing with the linaro guys though
<ricotz> seb128, this can be fixed upstream, mutter is just missing a explicit link against "gl"
<seb128> does it use it directly? in which case yeah, it seems a bug there
<ricotz> yes, it uses some symbols
<seb128> ok, so yeah you should send your patch upstream then
<ricotz> it is mentioned in to bug report
<ricotz> no this patch is not upstream worthy
<ricotz> it would be a small patch of configure.ac/in to fix this
<seb128> ricotz, right that's what I meant, get a proper patch upstream for it
<seb128> pitti, kamstrup: hey
<kamstrup> yo
 * pitti waves to seb128
<seb128> pitti, is there any known breakage in apport about the .xsession-errors info collecting code?
<seb128> pitti, kamstrup suggests it's not collecting what bug #431807 describe in current natty
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 431807 in apport "would be nice to send xsessions-errors warnings and errors" [Wishlist,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/431807
<kamstrup> pitti: i was just asking seb128 why https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/dee/+bug/742085 didn't have some .xsession-errors info attached
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 742085 in dee "compiz crashed with SIGSEGV in PlaceEntryRemote::GetResult()" [Medium,New]
<kamstrup> the regex from the apport bug would match what i needed
<seb128> kamstrup, oh it has a "XsessionErrors:" key
<seb128> but that has 3 lines and nothing from compiz or dee
<kamstrup> yeah, but way too little included there
<seb128> kamstrup, you are sure there is extra info in the .xsession-errors?
<kamstrup> i just looked at a s-i bug with ronoc and it had no relevant xsession-errors info as well
<kamstrup> and we know that crash was a sigabrt in a g_Error()
<kamstrup> so that really should have been there I guess
<pitti> kamstrup: do you have an example message which should appear? I guess that just didn't match the regexp after all
<pitti> (<unknown>:2782): libindicator-WARNING **: Shortcut Group does not have key 'Tar
<pitti> getEnvironment' falling back to deprecated use of 'OnlyShowIn' and 'NotShowIn'.
<pitti> I have a few like this ^
<seb128> doh, apport is spamming my .xsession-errors
<seb128> "/usr/share/apport/apport-gtk", line 74, in ui_present_crash
<seb128>     heading = _('Sorry, %s closed unexpectedly') % glib.markup_escape_text(desktop_entry.getName())
<seb128> UnicodeEncodeError: 'ascii' codec can't encode character u'\xe8' in position 17: ordinal not in range(128)
<kamstrup> lol
<seb128> it seems to do that in a continus way today
<pitti> seb128: fun, I see the same
<seb128> pitti, I think the .xsession-errors think is broken
<seb128> pitti, or does it just tail a few lines?
<seb128> pitti, it could be that things like that apport spam just quick any warning out of the part of the log it reads?
<pitti> seb128: no, it doesn't pre-select lines, it just matches over all of them
<seb128> ok, so that's broken
<pitti> seb128: could be
<seb128> like the apport-gtk crash from 1 minute ago has no XsessionErrors key
<seb128> pitti, hum, it worked on a C crash though
<seb128> kamstrup, well I guess it needs debugging locally with a testcase
<pitti> seb128: ok, I'll investigate this next week then
<seb128> pitti, I will try to come back with a testcase
<seb128> pitti, do you want a bug about the UnicodeEncodeError spamming thing?
<pitti> seb128: sure, easier to remember
<bcurtiswx> anyone here even have an issue when they plug in headphones to their laptop the sound doesn't switch to the headphones?
<ari-tczew> mvo: around?
<dobey> bcurtiswx: i did, until i tweaked the alsa config as described on the ubuntuforums thread about my laptop :)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - for the localised searchplugins - we want to keep the maverick ones in langpack-o-matic too don't we? (i'm just testing the natty plugins now)
<bcurtiswx> dobey, maybe it will help me?
<bcurtiswx> dobey, if i reboot it will work fine if i have my headphones plugged in when i reboot
<dobey> bcurtiswx: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1658635
<dobey> bcurtiswx: the "Fixing the Microphone" instructions there, made my headphones work right
<chrisccoulson> it's nice to get google search results that are relevant to me again :)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: do we need per-release ones/
<mvo> ari-tczew: on the phone currently
<pitti> ?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, i think so (firefox 4 and 3.6 have a different base set of plugins)
<bcurtiswx> dobey, thx
<pitti> chrisccoulson: ah, then I guess we'll need to make the paths per-release
<pitti> chrisccoulson: would you mind committing the natty ones to extra-files/searchplugins/11.04/ ?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I'll move the 10.10 ones accordingly, and update the code/test cases
<chrisccoulson> pitti - yeah, sure
<chrisccoulson> thanks :)
<pitti> seb128: what was the cairo memleak bug again?
<seb128> pitti, 725434
<pitti> seb128: merci
<seb128> pitti, de rien
<bcurtiswx> dobey, what laptop do you have perchance.  that also seemed to fix my microphone and headphone proble (thus far)
<bcurtiswx> problem*
<bcurtiswx> i have an HP DV7
<dobey> bcurtiswx: dell inspiron duo :)
<bcurtiswx> dobey, Intel sound, thats the link probably then
<dobey> probably
<Mez> is there a log for compiz somewhere that I might be able to find out what error it's crashing with now I'm on natty?
<bcurtiswx> Mez, /var/crash ?
<ricotz> seb128, how do you feel about putting network-manager-0.9 into the gnome3-ppa?
<dobey> ricotz: i'd be very hesitant right now, as it breaks compat, so some apps not yet ported will break
<seb128> ricotz, no real opinion but what dobey says, seems we should rather stay away from it
<seb128> it seems not worth the work on the issues in natty
<ricotz> dobey, i know, i dont meant right now, but it is needed by some packages already like g-c-c
<seb128> it's optionally needed
<seb128> debian experimental doesn't have it either
<seb128> pitti, when is the meeting today? now or one hour?
<dobey> well i'm just saying, it breaks API compat with the D-Bus API
<bcurtiswx> seb128, http://paste.ubuntu.com/585429/ this may be an old thing i just haven't seen yet, look familiar at all?
<dobey> so if you use some things, like ubuntu one, they will break :)
<seb128> bcurtiswx, don't run it under sudo that's wrong
<ricotz> seb128, dobey, ok
<seb128> bcurtiswx, the warning is usually when DISPLAY is not set
<bcurtiswx> seb128, hmm.. OK thx
<seb128> bcurtiswx, could be that sudo is cleaning the env
<bcurtiswx> i had someone tell me skype shows up in software-center with a reccomend to add a partner repository.. i don't see it.. do i need another package other than software-center?
<pitti> seb128: now
<kiwinote> bcurtiswx: are you on maverick or natty? It should work fine on maverick. On natty skype is not yet in the partner archives, nor is app-install-data-partner up to date.
<bcurtiswx> kiwinote, that would be it then.  Muchas Gracias
<pitti> seb128: do you think you'll have time to get bug 703230 into beta-1
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 703230 in pango1.0 ""rm: cannot remove `/usr/share/doc/libpango1.0-0': Is a directory" when updating to 1.28.3-4" [Unknown,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/703230
<pitti> ?
<seb128> pitti, yeah, it's likely a trivial fix, I was just unsure of what brings system in the broken case and how to workaround it
<seb128> pitti, like if we should only handler the empty dir case and rmdir it, or just || true the call or ...
<seb128> mvo, ^ do you have any opinion on that?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - ok, i've pushed the new searchplugins now (and i've merged in some of the localizations from http://hg.mozilla.org/l10n-central too. i didn't realise that we are shipping english plugins for pretty much everybody)
<mvo> seb128: I can have a look
<pitti> chrisccoulson: thanks; did a followup push to move the maverick ones to 10.10/, and will now sort out the test regressions
<chrisccoulson> pitti - thanks
<didrocks> mterry: bug #742429 has no dup AFAIK. do you reproduce this particularly with thunderbird?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 742429 in unity "Duplicate icons sometimes appear and hovering over them causes a crash" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/742429
<mvo> seb128: maybe I don't get it, but "ls -ld /usr/share/doc/libpango1.0-0/" is a dir for me as well
<mterry> didrocks, it happens for several apps.  I get it a lot for deja-dup when it's opening and closing during its automated test suite.  I believe I've seen it for banshee too.  Maybe others, I'll try to keep track in case there's a theme
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i notice also that mozilla ship additional (more relevant) plugins for each locale, which we also aren't doing atm
<didrocks> mterry: yeah, that will be sweet, thanks!
<chrisccoulson> i think i need to fix that, with the translations stuff too ;)
<didrocks> mterry: ok, it's time for me to do a backup and see ;)
<didrocks> mterry: oh, it doesn't match the deja-dup icon one start, isn't it?
<seb128> mvo, well that 's an upgrade issue, it's supposed to be now
<didrocks> mterry: there isn't the triangle showing there are some instances running
<seb128> mvo, it was supposed to be a symlink before, so the preinst rm the symlink so the dir can be created
<seb128> mvo, but it seems some people had a dir before upgrade already for some reason
<mvo> seb128: right, well, it odd that I haven't seen it in the upgrade tester. clearly does not affect all people
<mvo> seb128: but given how trivial the fix is I would say just add it and don't worry how people managed to get into it (might be going back and forward between versions maybe?). /var/log/apt/history.log hopefully knows
 * mvo checks the dupes
<bcurtiswx> seb128, do I need a FFE for getting empathy 2.34.0 into natty ?
<seb128> mvo, if you have an opinion on how to fix it please feel free to just upload taht ;-)
<seb128> bcurtiswx, kenvandine uploaded it yesterday?
<mvo> seb128: sure, I can do that :)
<seb128> mvo, thanks
<bcurtiswx> kenvandine, ^^?
<seb128> bcurtiswx, ups, no
<kenvandine> seb128, i didn't, was waiting for after beta 1
<seb128> I misread my email
<Q-FUNK> sorry, is anybody working on fixing the libappindicator icon caching issue?
<seb128> kenvandine, was there any reason to wait?
<seb128> Q-FUNK, no, ted is off today
<bcurtiswx> seb128, lol.. mdeslaur said on the merge req i needed a FFE
<kenvandine> no... but there wasn't a reason to try to rush it in
<kenvandine> it is tiny...
<seb128> bcurtiswx, mdeslaur is wrong
<seb128> kenvandine, ok
<Q-FUNK> seb128: ok. thanks for the info.  afaik cyphermox_ figured out the solution, but I'm not sure if it's been committed.
<seb128> kenvandine, well I would just upload today and let it in the queue
<kenvandine> ok
<seb128> Q-FUNK, what is the issue?
<bcurtiswx> i don't mean to push the issue, just a FFE question.. lol
<cyphermox_> Q-FUNK, can't say I really figured out what's wrong with the icons yet
<seb128> Q-FUNK, is that will fallback cases for those who don't use an indicator applet?
<mdeslaur> seb128: how am I wrong? :)
<seb128> mdeslaur, 1- GNOME has a standing freeze exception
<Q-FUNK> seb128: ubuntu-mono has a broken postinst that produces incorrect icon cache content
<cyphermox_> I believe the hash gets calculated wrong but I'm not quite sure why yet
<seb128> mdeslaur, 2- it's a unstable serie to the first stable version following it update
<seb128> mdeslaur, 3- bug fix updates don't need a ffe
<Q-FUNK> seb128: yup, for normal gnome without unity.
<mdeslaur> seb128: oh, didn't know about the standing exception...sorry about that
<kenvandine> pitti, fyi i am uploading dee and libunity to fix bug 742350
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 742350 in libunity "Dee and Unity GI overrides fail to import with pygobject 2.28.3-1" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/742350
<pitti> kenvandine: sounds fine, thanks
<mterry> didrocks, sorry, had a wifi disconnect, you were saying about deja-dup?
<kenvandine> the pygobject upload yesterday broke both
<didrocks> 16:24:31      didrocks | mterry: oh, it doesn't match the deja-dup icon one start, isn't it?
<mdeslaur> bcurtiswx: sorry about that, feel free to ignore me :)
<didrocks> 16:24:46      didrocks | mterry: there isn't the triangle showing there are some instances running
<Q-FUNK> cyphermox_: I thought that you mentioned that it's related to using some gtk3 alternative?
<seb128> Q-FUNK, is that using an indicator-applet or not?
<Q-FUNK> seb128: just notification area.
<bcurtiswx> mdeslaur, no prob.  just wanted to make sure things were done by the books.  didn't mean to stir up anything
<seb128> <Q-FUNK> seb128: ubuntu-mono has a broken postinst that produces incorrect icon cache content
<cyphermox_> Q-FUNK, it's what I thought, but the gtk-update-icon-cache from gtk2 also does the same
<seb128> someone should mention that to sladen
<mterry> didrocks, that's odd.  do you have it pinned?
<cyphermox_> seb128, I will
<didrocks> mterry: no, I don't, and start it from the application place (so it's the desktop file which is launched)
<Q-FUNK> seb128: e.g. nm-applet is there but displays the "broken icon" icon.
<seb128> it should be in the indicator-applet
<mterry> didrocks, so it's smart enough to know that it's running, but not smart enough to match a window?  works for me here
<Q-FUNK> seb128: we don't have any indicator applet on a basic gnome. :)
<didrocks> mterry: humâ¦ interesting, so if you click again to switch to it, it doesn't spawn a new instance for you?
<mterry> didrocks, correct
<seb128> Q-FUNK, we do since lucid
<didrocks> mterry: maybe bamfdeamon is in an incorrect state here. I'll have a look at my next reboot
<Q-FUNK> seb128: in new desktops, maybe, but that won't be automatically added to existing desktop preferences, so you cannot assume that it's gonna be there.
<seb128> Q-FUNK, we do add it on upgrade since lucid
<seb128> we don't again if someone removed it manually though
<seb128> which quite some people did when there was only indicator-messages in that
<seb128> and they prefered to have their pidgin icon on the panel rather than the indicator
<seb128> but those are broken configs
<Q-FUNK> right, so you indeed cannot assume that indicator-applet is used at all.
<seb128> well I'm not saying it's not a bug
<seb128> but it's not really a beta blocker
<Q-FUNK> agreed, it's nothing more than a visual annoyance
<seb128> it's not affecting any default install or upgrade
<seb128> we will get it fixed for natty though
<seb128> don't worry
<Q-FUNK> or well, it might, if it doesn't get fixed on time for the natty release.
<Q-FUNK> sure :)
<pitti> chrisccoulson: hm, why did some of the search plugins get dropped? i. e. es-ES (all of them)
<chrisccoulson> pitti - oh, i must have just missed that one out
<chrisccoulson> 1 second
<chrisccoulson> pitti - i dropped bn-BD and bn-ID as they didn't have any localizations in them
<pitti> chrisccoulson: fun that I exactly picked this for my test case :)
<kenvandine> pitti, libunity and dee are in the queue now... if you can move those along i would appreciate it... would like to stuff working again :)
<pitti> kenvandine: oh, I thought these have used dh_python2 all along and installed a pygobject compat symlink?
<kenvandine> no...
<pitti> kenvandine: at least that's what we discussed back then
<pitti> kenvandine: I'm sorry for breaking this then!
<kenvandine> no worries :)
<pitti> but I'm happy that we got that in
<kenvandine> yeah
<pitti> cementing pysupport will only make it worse in the future
<kenvandine> actually dee was using dh_python2 until wednesday
<kenvandine> and it wasn't working...
<kenvandine> i just changed that to match pygobject wed to get it working
<pitti> kenvandine: right, you'd need that _and_ a symlink into the pysupport dir
<kenvandine> ah
<kenvandine> libunity didn't have that either
<kenvandine> i am glad they are all on dh_python2 now though
<seb128> jibel: you already saw that dialog http://launchpadlibrarian.net/67264442/ubiquity.png before right?
<seb128> jibel: I think I mentioned it during the a3 testing and you said you had it sometimes as well
<jibel_> seb128, yes I did.
<chrisccoulson> pitti - ok, i've pushed the missing es-ES plugins too
<pitti> chrisccoulson: saw, thanks
<jibel_> seb128, I'll try to reproduce, it occurred when changing from the keyboard layout screen to the next. But I haven't found a pattern to reliably reproduce it.
<pitti> chrisccoulson: tests are happy now as well, committing the fix for the per-release dir
<chrisccoulson> brb, going to restart my router, my connection speed is abysmal today
<chrisccoulson> pitti - excellent, thanks
<seb128> jibel: seems to happen every time I do a french install there (using the custom partioner if that makes a difference)
<seb128> jibel: bug #742558 if you are interested to subscribe
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 742558 in ubiquity ""Keep default keyboard layout ..." dialog is confusing" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/742558
<jibel_> seb128, yup, it happened to me with japanese.
<seb128> mvo, danke
<seb128> pitti, bug #737799 assigned to you btw, it's the one we discussed earlier
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 737799 in apport "apport-gtk crashed with UnicodeEncodeError in ui_present_crash(): 'ascii' codec can't encode character u'\u017c' in position 5: ordinal not in range(128)" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/737799
<pitti> seb128: cheers
<ari-tczew> isn't it fixed in trunk already? ^
<seb128> doesn't seem so
<mterry> pitti, is there a list of apport-bug symptoms somewhere?  Would be nice to have a list in the man page
<seb128> mterry, hey, so today as part of my paper work day I just wrote a recommendation on your wikipage, sorry for the delay ;-)
<mterry> seb128, hot!  maybe I should actually formally put myself in the queue then
<seb128> mterry, yes please do
<pitti> mterry: just do "ubuntu-bug" :)
<seb128> we will get at least didrocks and mvo to write there before the meeting
<seb128> didrocks, mvo!!!
<mterry> pitti, magic!
<didrocks> hum hum?
<seb128> didrocks, mvo: you didn't write a recommendation for mterry application yet, what's going on with you guys? ;-)
<seb128> kenvandine, you as well :p
<mterry> didrocks, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/mterry/CoreDev
<mterry> seb128, I didn't explicitly ping them
<didrocks> mterry: did you ping me before?
<didrocks> ahah!
<mterry> wanted to get an exploration committee first  :)
<didrocks> so, time to write that this mterry guy doesn't know what he does, we should also remove his MOTU power and suchâ¦ ;-)
 * mterry hovers over the revert key in the wiki
<didrocks> mterry: so easy! :-)
<seb128> mterry, well I did for you because not a lot of people noticed your implicit pings on the channel I think ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: remove the lock!!!
<didrocks> ;)
<seb128> didrocks, done
<mterry> seb128, yar, but what if didrocks really doesn't think I'm hot stuff but is too afraid to tell it to my face, because he thinks I'll have deja-dup eat his data?
<didrocks> hum, thinking about that
<didrocks> my gf just trusts dÃ©jÃ -dup having all her life backed up by itâ¦
<didrocks> maybe not wise to write a bad comment :-)
<seb128> mterry, I'm happy I don't use deja-dup in that case :p
<seb128> speaking of which I was thinking about trying it
<mterry> didrocks, don't say stuff like that, makes me nervous that deja-dup will blow up
<didrocks> mterry: afraid that people is using your app? :-p
<seb128> mterry, be ready, we bring your software in the default install next cycle!
<kenvandine> mterry, i will... after i finish this other administrative stuff... :)
<seb128> kenvandine, don't tell me, I spent my day on administrative work
<mterry> didrocks, yeah, I'm afraid!  I never would have started deja-dup if I properly realized that I would be directly responsible for people's digital lifeboats
<didrocks> mterry: yeah, that's a huge responsability :)
<mterry> pitti, I'd like to see a 'networking' symptom
<pitti> mterry: if you can come up with some questionaire and/or automatic checks for that, that'd be great
<htorque> didrocks, i've sent opera a bug report with a link to bug 741731- hope they can fix it or provide more info, else i have to switch browsers :(
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 741731 in unity "Launcher unhides and stays unhidden when dragging elements in Opera" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/741731
<didrocks> mterry: done :)
<mterry> pitti, I don't want to do any of the work  :)
<mterry> didrocks, thanks!
<didrocks> htorque: oh thanks, for forwarding upstream. I think it's the issue, you don't get it on other drag and drop application, isn't it?
<htorque> didrocks, no, opera is the only application that makes the launcher stuck unhidden
<didrocks> htorque: yeah, they are doing something weird with dnd, I think
<seb128> htorque, just curious what is better in opera compared to other browsers?
<chrisccoulson> pitti - ok, you've got an e-mail from me now about translations ;)
<htorque> seb128, i started using it because a. it wasn't IE and b. it had mouse gesture support. i somehow stuck with it, but nowadays there's no real killer feature (imho).
<chrisccoulson> i don't like the menu button in opera ;)
<bcurtiswx> mterry, gl with the app :)
<mterry> bcurtiswx, thanks!  :)
<seb128> htorque, ok ;-)
<chrisccoulson> i thought everyone was using chrome these days anyway? ;)
<htorque> chrisccoulson, it's their version of a BFB ;) - opera has become so bloated, subconsciously i hope they don't fix that bug so i can finally let it go :P
<seb128> bug #740844
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 740844 in policykit-1-gnome ""Authenticate" window shows in launcher as "Polkit-gnome-authentication-agent-1"" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/740844
<seb128> does anybody knows why gnome-panel,libwnck pick the right title but not unity?
<seb128> the dialog has a title
<seb128> I just reassigned it to polkit but I'm unsure now if that's not rather an unity bug
<chrisccoulson> b'ah, unity losing menu's is getting really annoying now ;)
<chrisccoulson> perhaps we should schedule "killall unity-panel-service" from a cron job every half hour to fix it ;)
<mterry> seb128, it's official: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/devel-permissions/2011-March/000183.html
<seb128> mterry, \o/
<mterry> chrisccoulson, which apps?
<chrisccoulson> mterry, it just happened to gnome-terminal
<mterry> chrisccoulson, did you restart unity?
<chrisccoulson> mterry - it's bug 718926
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 718926 in bamf "Some apps don't integrate to appmenu after having their windows closed" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/718926
<mterry> chrisccoulson, (before this happened)  sometimes I find that if I restart unity, terminals have that problem.
<mterry> chrisccoulson, oh, k.  /me lookss
<pitti> chrisccoulson: will digest it in the next days, thanks!
<pitti> seb128: for coordiation, should I start slaughering langpacks, or do you think we'll get the cairo split into b1?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ChrisCoulson/CoreDevApplication ;)
<bcurtiswx> seb128, i am packaging gnome-terminal, is that like empathy where the 2.33.x is a GTK2 release only?
<chrisccoulson> i can't think of anything else to put on it yet though
<seb128> chrisccoulson, \o/
<bcurtiswx> oh cool chrisccoulson gl with that :)
<chrisccoulson> i thought i'd better start doing it :)
<seb128> bcurtiswx, no clue
<seb128> bcurtiswx, we don't want a new serie now though
<bcurtiswx> seb128, OK hmm, GNOEM3 PPA ?
<bcurtiswx> GNOME3 *
<seb128> no clue
<seb128> you can ask rodrigo, I didn't check on the ppa for a while
<seb128> the focus is rather natty for now
<bcurtiswx> seb128, i'm just taking things from the versions page... i seem to be a bad chooser
<seb128> yeah, try rather the light green ones
<seb128> brasero, gedit, etc
<bcurtiswx> darn, OK then :)
<bcurtiswx> i can push it to my code page then, that way for Natty+1 we have something to work with
<bcurtiswx> seb128, well those are all up-to-date based on the info presented
<seb128> ?
<seb128> do you try to do ppa or natty updates?
<bcurtiswx> seb128, ?
<seb128> bcurtiswx, what are you trying to do?
<bcurtiswx> anything for natty packaging wise
<bcurtiswx> seb128,  ^^
<bcurtiswx> i also have pidgin ready, but idk if thats FFE worth or not yet either
<bcurtiswx> worthy*
<seb128> bcurtiswx, yeah, pidgin would be a nice one
<seb128> bcurtiswx, sound-juicer
<seb128> bug-buggy
<bcurtiswx> bug-buddy?
<seb128> well those are in universe but outdated
<bcurtiswx> seb128, for pidgin i did a apt-get source then uupdate, since it creates a new directory how do I make that a bzr to push to my code page ?
<seb128> do a debdiff and add it to a bug
<seb128> bbl
<bcurtiswx> seb128, OK
<bcurtiswx> i have .dsc source.changes will any of those do?
<bcurtiswx> anyone? :P
<pitti> seb128: replied to the d-d list about our desktop caching approach, and also subscribed (let's see how I can keep up with the traffic)
<seb128> pitti, thanks
<seb128> pitti, traffic is low, sometimes it's one mail a week, sometimes there is a bit of discussion and it's active
<seb128> but it's not a noisy list
<pitti> so, time for dinner, fetching my wife from the train, and pub
<pitti> have a good weekend everyone!
<seb128> pitti, have fun
<seb128> dinner time there as well
<mvo> a (maybe?) somewhat silly question, but how do I implement a gobject.GInterface with python? I have a custom widget and want to implement the atk.Action interface to it, how do I teach python to register the interface/to know about it?
<dobey> mvo: just write it in C, so I won't have to rewrite it in C when I have to use it from a C library, because you write it in Python. ;)
<mvo> dobey: heh :)
<mvo> but but but â¦ I like python!
<didrocks> have a nice week-end everyone!
<patrickmw> Can some one refresh me as to what the command is to check if the machine supports Unity?
<Ampelbein> patrickmw: '/usr/lib/nux/unity_support_test -p' ?
<patrickmw> -p !
<patrickmw> thank you
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-03-26
<ixxvil> hi
<ixxvil> anyone using NAS at a home setup
<ixxvil> planning to build one
<cdbs> Anyone around who could add me to gnome3-team?
<cdbs> weekends suck :(
<cdbs> Looks like gtk3-engines needs to be copied from the old gnome3 ppa to the new ones, so that we can rebuild gnome-themes and upload gnome-themes-standard
<ricotz> cdbs, did test it? btw gnome-themes-standard is in natty
<cdbs> ricotz: I mean 2.91.* version of g-t-standard
<cdbs> the one which contains Adwaita
<cdbs> oh, its there already!
<ricotz> cdbs, yes, this is in natty
<cdbs> ricotz: But I can't find Adwaita in it, in which upstream package does it come?
<ricotz> cdbs, it is in included there
<cdbs> ricotz: oh nice!
<cdbs> blame apt-file for the mess :(
<cdbs> ricotz: BTW, is it okay to add PPA and upgrade all packages? Any known inconsistencies yet?
<kklimonda> cdbs: it will break unity
<cdbs> kklimonda: yeah, I had one breakage a few days ago, but I thought that was due to half-upgraded packages
<ricotz> cdbs, be careful doing that ;)
<cdbs> kklimonda: maybe gnome-settings-daemon is to blame for that
<kklimonda> cdbs: there was a problem with g-s-d but I think rodrigo has uploaded a newer version that works fine. But it's still not a seamless update
<cdbs> lets give it a try! :)
<kklimonda> and ppa-purge doesn't purge it successfully so you have to downgrade few package when you are done with testing g-s (did I mention you can't use old gnome and unity with it? ;))
 * cdbs had tried adding PPA and installing g-s a few days ago
<kklimonda> it's really unstable :/
<kklimonda> at least it was for me
<cdbs> well, from my previous experience, I know enough of what breaks and what doesn't, so I'll try
<cdbs> kklimonda: well, you can't load unity? I think it loads, but with a really bad theme
<cdbs> enough to open a terminal and downgrade packages
<kklimonda> cdbs: it loads, but without any theme, and with some graphical artifacts..
<kklimonda> sure, enough to downgrade package - but you can't have both g-s and unity at this time
<kklimonda> (makes it harder to compare both)
<wzssyqa> hello , I am YunQiang Su, i want to join gnome3 team, now i am maintaining several packages on debian
<wzssyqa> can you help me?
<nigelb> wzssyqa: I think you'll have better luck Monday to Friday, developers tend to take a break around weekends
<wzssyqa> nigelb: thx,
#ubuntu-desktop 2011-03-27
<slangasek> does anyone here know offhand how gtk+2.0 looks up the plugins listed in /usr/lib/gtk-2.0/2.10.0/{engines,menuproxies,printbackends} and /usr/lib/gtk-2.0/modules? I can't seem to find any references to these directories in the actual gtk libraries; is this only ever configured at runtime or something?
<slangasek> (asking because I'm trying to get a multiarch gtk+2.0 working in ppa for natty)
<slangasek> hmm, I take that back; some of this is in the lib, but not AFAICS the /usr/lib/gtk-2.0/modules bit
<vish> cdbs: your blog is not liferea friendly ! ;p
 * vish grumbles at having to actually reach the site to read blogs than just reading in liferea
<cdbs> vish: Its not anything-friendly
<cdbs> vish: I am facing a hundred issues with it, it doesn't even come up well on the planet-ubuntu homepage
<cdbs> vish: and soon I'll move to tumblr
<RAOF> DRRRGAAARGH.  Am I the only one for whom unity is a non-stop cavalcade of crash?
<chrisccoulson> RAOF, no, it's been crashing here constantly for a few days now
<chrisccoulson> (like, 4-5 times/hour)
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-03-19
<pitti> Good morning
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> bonjour didrocks, ca va?
<didrocks> pitti: guten morgen! I'm fine, thanks, and you?
<pitti> didrocks: quite fine, thanks! just got up very early
<pitti> didrocks: my brain started telling me all the things I need to do today before I get sedated and teeth operation :)
<didrocks> pitti: ah, teeth operation, round 2 today? :)
<pitti> yep, the other two wisdom teeth
<didrocks> good luck, hope it will go as smootly as the first two of them :)
 * didrocks catches up on Friday + week-end's email
<didrocks> skying was nice, but backlog when you come back is not ;)
 * RAOF wonders what "skying" is.
<pitti> didrocks: skying?
<pitti> oh, skiing?
 * pitti hopes didrocks didn't fall from the sky
<pitti> "if at first you don't succeed, then maybe skydiving isn't for you"
<didrocks> ahah :)
<RAOF> Heh.
<didrocks> yeah, skiing
<didrocks> was clearly the last possible week-end for it seeing the temperature :)
<didrocks> but weather was splendid and snow was good
<pitti> we had a marvellous spring Sunday here
<pitti> we got out the garden table and seats again, and after Badminton we just sat outside for two hours and let the sun shine on our belly
<didrocks> ah nice, temperature here should be approximatly the same, I'm pondering working from my balcoon again :)
<tjaalton> the window borders' grab area is 1pix wide after some recent update?
<pitti> yes, here too, even on 3D
<pitti> (it was never fixed on 2D, I believe)
<pitti> what happened to the resize handles / bigger area?
<tjaalton> yeah the lower right corner area is gone as well
<tjaalton> new light-themes perhaps?
<tjaalton> nope
<tjaalton> but looks like light-themes 0.1.8.30-0u3 changes got lost
<micahg> tjaalton: gtk resize grips patches reverted?
<micahg> that happened, idk if that's the cause of what you're seeing though
<tjaalton> tjaalton: where was that?
<tjaalton> ah, gtk
<tjaalton> "unity has resize borders".. doesn't look like it
<pitti> so, off to doctor stuff, see you tomorrow!
<didrocks> see you pitti, good luck :)
<xclaesse> hm, after today's update, "git pull" (over ssh) is asking for my ssh password again, what's the trick to make ssh-agent do its job ?
<Sweetshark> G'Morning all!
<didrocks> good morning Sweetshark
<Sweetshark> didrocks: since pitti is at the doctor getting rid of his wisdom, how about you uploading libreoffice-3.5.1-1ubuntu1
<Sweetshark> ?
<didrocks> Sweetshark: that can't wait for tomorrow? I'm not sure to be able to do that today, I have a lot of shutdown/restart to do while releasing -2d
<Sweetshark> didrocks: no, it was already postponed from friday and 3.5.1 fixes some nasty bugs that are spawning dupes on launchpad without end.
<Sweetshark> didrocks: besides our current LO is actually ftbfs because someone broke it with a kdelibs update
<didrocks> Sweetshark: I can do it, but only this evening I guess
<didrocks> Sweetshark: I'll have to restart my session, and the time to upload a libroffice releaseâ¦
<micahg> Sweetshark: I'm the other pilot today, but I won't be able to get to it for another 18.5 hours
<didrocks> ah, yeah, harass the patch pilot otherwise, it's done for that :)
<Sweetshark> bug 958781
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 958781 in libreoffice "kde4libs updates breaks LibreOffice build (ftbfs)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/958781
<Sweetshark> didrocks: cant you upload directly from chinstrap?
<didrocks> Sweetshark: there is not my gpg key there
<micahg> Sweetshark: if the build is going to fail, it shouldn't be uploaded, have you fixed the failure that bryceh found yet?
<Sweetshark> micahg: yes, its fixed.
<Sweetshark> didrocks, micahg: keep in mind that when you upload now and it will still take some ~6 ours to show up in the repos on the fastest platforms ...
<didrocks> still can't upload it before this evening apart if you want to handle the unity 2d release, make some gnome-control-center patch as well :p
<micahg> Sweetshark: I'm about to go to sleep, so no go here
<micahg> Sweetshark: you might be able to get bryceh to do it in ~7-9 hours
<Sweetshark> micahg: k, thanks
<seb128> hey
<seb128> is somebody here getting the gtk "highlight of menus doesn't work"?
<seb128> i.e the touchpad mouse enter bug
<tkamppeter> pitti, hi
<seb128> tkamppeter, hey, not sure he's still around, he has a dentist appointement today for his remaining wisdom teeth, not sure at what time it is though
<glatzor> hello mvo
<seb128> hey glatzor, how are you?
<glatzor> Servus seb128! Fine. How are you?
<seb128> I'm good thanks!
<mvo> hey glatzor
<Sweetshark> seb128, tkamppeter: pitti already waved off at 8:30. wish him luck.
<mpt> seb128, desrt: mvo says I should show you this curious problem: "gsettings get com.ubuntu.update-notifier auto-launch" returns false, but gconf-editor shows it as true, and update-notifier is behaving as if it is true.
<seb128> mpt, dconf-editor you mean?
<mpt> seb128, yes
<seb128> yes, known issue
<seb128> the editor doesn't understand overrides
<seb128> which is what we use to set distribution default values when they are different from upstream
<seb128> the "update-notifier is behaving as if it is true" is a bug in update-notifier
<seb128> the gsettings api will return the correct value
<mpt> seb128, thanks. To return the favor, I'm getting the "highlight of menus doesn't work" bug.
<mpt> Anything I can help you with? I know there's a bug report about it, at least
<seb128> mpt, I would welcome you install the gtk version from https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/+archive/ppa when it will be done building
<seb128> i.e in half an hour
<seb128> and let me know if that fixes the menu issue for you
<mpt> ok
<seb128> mpt, thanks
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson, how are you?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, good thanks. got some peace and quiet here today (jo and ruby are going to see family) :-)
<chrisccoulson> how are you?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I'm good thanks
<mvo> seb128: hm, but mpt is getting "gsettings get com.ubuntu.update-notifier auto-launch" false so update-notifier is behaving "correct" (for this setting). but he said he never changed/touched this setting. any ideas about this?
<seb128> mvo, "update-notifier is behaving as if it is true." he wrote?
<mpt> mvo, seb128: The behavior changed as soon as I upgraded to Pangolin.
<mpt> seb128, ah, sorry. update-notifier is behaving as if it is false.
<mpt> So maybe not a bug in update-notifier but a bug in the upgrade
<seb128> ok, it makes sense
<seb128> mpt, what about "gconftool --get /apps/update-notifier/auto_launch"
<mpt> seb128, "No value set for `/apps/update-notifier/auto_launch'"
<seb128> mpt,
<seb128> gsettings reset com.ubuntu.update-notifier auto-launch
<seb128> gsettings get com.ubuntu.update-notifier auto-launch
<mpt> seb128, "false"
<mpt> so, that's not right
<seb128> mpt, strace gsettings get com.ubuntu.update-notifier auto-launch 2>&1  | grep compiled
<seb128> mpt, can you pastebin that ?
<mpt> seb128, http://paste.ubuntu.com/890407/
<seb128> mpt, grep auto-launch /usr/share/glib-2.0/schemas/*
<mpt> seb128, http://paste.ubuntu.com/890414/
<seb128> mpt, mvo: ^ there you go, xubuntu override the key
<seb128> mpt, xubuntu-default set a different value
<chrisccoulson> that sucks
<chrisccoulson> is there not a way to do that on a per-session basis?
<mpt> seb128, that didn't happen when I installed the Xubuntu stuff in 11.10 ... only after the upgrade
<seb128> chrisccoulson, didrocks by then did something like that for gconf IIRC, not sure about gsettings
<seb128> mpt, well, maybe they were not overriding the key in 11.10 or doing it in a smarter wy
<seb128> way
<mpt> maybe
<seb128> but your issue comes from xubuntu
<mpt> I see
<didrocks> it's unfortunatly not possible with gsettings
<seb128> so talk to the xubuntu people I guess ;-)
<tkamppeter> Sweetshark, seb128, I remembered shortly after entering "pitti, hi" and went on with other stuff, but thanks anyway.
<seb128> if somebody feels like doing some GNOME 3.3.92 updates I put a few on the pad
<mdeslaur> seb128: dude, can we please get the drag corner back...I can't resize my windows!
<seb128> mdeslaur, yeah, need to talk to dx ;-)
<seb128> but I'm sure didrocks watch those issue
<mdeslaur> seb128: it's getting fixed with a theme or with compiz?
<didrocks> yeah, this one is known, not sure what regressed though (if it's the theme or compiz)
<didrocks> mdeslaur: will surely be fixed for beta2 freeze anyway (not for 2d as it's a more complicated issue) but for 3d
<mdeslaur> didrocks: ok, thanks, I'll be patient for a while longer :)
<didrocks> I don't understand, it's not on every machine, which seems to indicate that's a compiz issue
<didrocks> seb128: do you have it as well?
<seb128> didrocks, yes
<seb128> didrocks, bug #953839
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 953839 in compiz-core "[regression] Invisible resize border is now only 1px wide" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/953839
<didrocks> seb128: I guess you would have noticed if it was at last compiz release?
<didrocks> (it's part of the test we are using as wellÃ 
<didrocks> so I guess it's something else making it regressed
<mdeslaur> asac_: ^
<seb128> didrocks, no, I never resize stuff using the border
<seb128> I use the handle in the corner
<mdeslaur> yeah, I got used to using the handle too, but now that's gone
<didrocks> anyway, will get fixed this week :)
<seb128> didrocks, see dvv's comment on that bug, he points to the likely buggy commit
<seb128> didrocks, is the "wm decorator buttons shouldn't have a tooltip" on your list as well?
<didrocks> seb128: right, we discussed about it this particular morning and he told sam will look at it
<seb128> ok
<didrocks> seb128: you should upgrade :p
<seb128> didrocks, ppa?
<didrocks> (see my ubuntu-artwork upload)
<seb128> oh
<didrocks> compiz took my patch I made 2 years ago, but changed the key path and dropped my distro-patchâ¦
<seb128> I updated but I didn't restart my session
<seb128> cool
<didrocks> :)
<asac_> seb128: mdeslaur: for me the corner handle is very hard to use now ... and the borders are even worse
<mdeslaur> seb128: you'll need to rewrite 51_lock_screen_on_suspend.patch with the new gnome-settings-daemon, as the logic has changed there
<mdeslaur> seb128: FYI
<seb128> mdeslaur, oh? how?
<seb128> mdeslaur, I will check for it
<asac_> another odd thing i noticed is that the top left corner handle is not at the top left corner of the window decorations
<asac_> but rather right below the top window bar
<mdeslaur> seb128: their lock_screensaver function needs to use the old gsetting, and the upower_notify_sleep_cb function needs to use the new gsetting
<seb128> mdeslaur, ok, thanks, I will probably ping you for review before uploading to make sure I got it right ;-)
<mdeslaur> seb128: sure
<seb128> asac_, not sure to understand that description
<asac_> seb128: put the mouse pointer in the left top corner of the window border -> nothing. .. put it below the top border on the left of the window -> resize grab appears
<mdeslaur> oh, huh, I get both, top left corner, and edge between window title and window
<seb128> asac_, works for me in the corner
<seb128> same as mdeslaur, I get both
<asac_> yeah... seems sometimes one of them is hard to get
<desrt> good morning
<desrt> happy beta2 week
<seb128> hey desrt, had a good w.e? happy beta2 week!
<desrt> ya.  pretty good
<seb128> desrt, happy GNOME hard freeze week as well ;-)
<desrt> finally got my taxes done for 2010 and 2011
<seb128> mterry, hey
<mterry> seb128, hello
<seb128> mterry, we are discussing the gtk bug on #gtk+ on irc.gnome.org if you are interested
<seb128> just read your comment
<seb128> mterry, how are you btw? ;-)
<seb128> mterry, it's weird that this patch which is only dealing with menus would impact on scrollbars?
<mterry> seb128, I've been sick  :-/
<seb128> :-(
<mterry> seb128, I didn't double-confirm that the first-time scrollbar thing wasn't present in previous gtk
<mterry> seb128, maybe they worked in previous GTK and I just never noticed...
<seb128> likely, users reported the bugs as "only the first menu items shows highlighted then highlight stop working"
<seb128> which seems to suggest that it was already behaving this way
<seb128> get better!
<desrt> christ
<desrt> that's 3 major gtk issues you're tracking now
<seb128> desrt, yeah, and you made fun of me when I told you I was not happy with gtk after 3.3.18
<desrt> i still reserve the right to make fun :)
<seb128> ;-)
<desrt> seb128: so this hashtable assertion
<desrt> i think i pushed a fix for it
<seb128> desrt, when? should it be in the current version?
<desrt> over the weekend
<desrt> basically: dbusmenu drops the reference on the old 'root' menuitem before it tells me that it did
<desrt> so my weak reference to it is already invalid by the time i find out
<desrt> and i was using that reference to remove items from the hashtable
<desrt> solution: take a full reference
<seb128> ok, I see r238 in your vcs
<seb128> good ;-)
<desrt> i'm not 100% sure it solves the problem since i would have actually expected a crash in this case
<desrt> but maybe the old memory was still there or something
<seb128> ok, I will do another upload today I think with whatever you want to get tested
<seb128> we will get a round of tarball for beta2 on wednesday I guess
<desrt> that should be all
<seb128> desrt, you still aim to land xul support for wednesday?
<desrt> i've generated a bunch of work for gord to sort through at this point
<desrt> xul support is already done
<seb128> desrt, it's not merged in though
<desrt> oh
<desrt> i should m-r that then :)
<seb128> ;-)
<desrt> hopefully it doesn't make too many new crashes :p
<seb128> lol
<seb128> yeah, I might backport it, so we can notice eventual issues before beta2 freez
<desrt> i'm going to submit the request
<desrt> maybe ted will do a release today
<seb128> thanks
<desrt> tedg: hi :)
<desrt> and then i'm going to spend the day working on gnome stuff
<desrt> dconf mostly
<desrt> the #dx guys are bugging me for a fix and a release
<desrt> and i have a couple of other patches to merge as well
<tedg> desrt, Is there an app that uses GMenuModel for window menus?
<desrt> tedg: yes.  many.
<desrt> i like to test with gnotravex since it was the first
<tedg> desrt, name one :-)
<desrt> :)
 * tedg is installing this program blindly
<desrt> tedg: epiphany-browser is another
<desrt> gnome-documents, gnome-contacts
<desrt> probably boxes too, i guess
<tedg> Cool, okay.  I was able to find gnomine which has an application menu.
<tedg> But it doesn't seem to have window menus.
<desrt> ya
<desrt> window menus are quite rare
<desrt> it seems that all of the new apps are going for only having an app menu
<desrt> and, incidentally, those are all of the ones that are using the new setup
<desrt> (mostly since they need to use it to get the app menu)
<desrt> i think it will be until next cycle before we see apps using it for their traditional menubars
<desrt> there's one example, though: in the gtk source tree in examples/ we have 'bloatpad'
<desrt> and there's also 'plugman' which is a copy of bloatpad made at one point and modified to support "plugins"
<desrt> which basically dynamically add/remove menu items
<tedg> Okay
<tedg> desrt, Thanks!
 * tedg will have defeated travex here soon and will be able to work again
<desrt> i'm so confused about merge requests
<desrt> it looks like there's already an active merge request on my branch
<chrisccoulson> sooo, the quicklist patch to totem breaks mimetype registration for it ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, is there another of those "whoever did it put the new section in the middle of the .desktop"?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I wonder why they did that, it should be at the end
<chrisccoulson> seb128, oh, the patch adds it to the end. it's just that the totem build system adds the mimetypes to the end of the desktop file
<seb128> oh
<seb128> interesting
<chrisccoulson> seb128, bug 956597
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 956597 in totem "Firefox doesn't handle mms: URLs" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/956597
<desrt> seb128: the XUL stuff has been committed, merge-proposed and reviewed
<desrt> tedg: merge!!
<seb128> desrt, "it looks like there's already an active merge request on my branch" ... that's because you keep using the same vcs so you already have merge requests for it
<desrt> seb128: i'm saying that it looks like there's already an active merge request on my branch for the XUL changes, specifically
<desrt> charles reviewed and ACKed it
<seb128> desrt, oh, good
<chrisccoulson> wtf @ bug 955710?
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 955710 in firefox "tudou.com/playlist/p/a74514i120368879.html" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/955710
<chrisccoulson> can people please stop reporting crappy bugs? :)
<desrt> it appears not to contain the latest fix
<desrt> which confuses me... i thought i update existing merge requests simply by pushing to them
<seb128> desrt, you do
<desrt> so this one didn't update :)
<desrt> maybe it's because it was already 'approved' when i pushed
<desrt> and it doesn't make sense to modify something already approved
<seb128> desrt, https://code.launchpad.net/~desrt/indicator-appmenu/hud-rewrite-wip/+merge/97716
<seb128> you mean?
<desrt> yes
<seb128> it shows 238 in a blue rectangle
<desrt> it has all but my most recent fix
<seb128> at the bottom of the conversation
<seb128> and in the revisions
<seb128> desrt, it seems there to me
<seb128> desrt, it's in the diff as well
<desrt> oh.  doh.
<desrt> i was searching for the wrong string in the diff :)
<desrt> ya.  it's there
<desrt> so the flip side of that is cool, then
<desrt> i can push more changes into a merge request that's already been approved, after it's been approved :)
<seb128> desrt, that's until #systems do something like didrocks' jenkins
<desrt> sonny, let me tell you
<seb128> desrt, the unity team merge reject those with a "new revision since the mp got approved"
<desrt> in my day, we committed directly to master
<desrt> and we liked it!
<seb128> lol
<desrt> anyway.... feel free to sort that out :p
<abondis> hello
 * desrt goes to fight with vala
<abondis> is there anyway to interact with the HUD without launching unity-2d-shell ?
<desrt> abondis: why yes, there is!
<abondis> i want to use my favorite tiling manager
<abondis> but i like the idea of hud
<desrt> abondis: there is a hud-cli too, and latest versions of the hud have hud-gtk in the source
<desrt> they're not really real interfaces though -- more like debugging tools
 * didrocks waits for desrt telling "you can run unity-3d" :p
<didrocks> hey desrt ;)
<desrt> didrocks: i'd never suggest that to -anybody- ;)
<abondis> ah really ? in a ppa or in the precise repo ?
<desrt> abondis: i think hud-gtk may end up in the precise repo today or tomorrow
<desrt> i added it to the build system on a branch that'll be merged today and i think seb is planning to package it today as well
<desrt> but it's really a debug tool....
<abondis> cause i tried xmonad with unity-2d-*
<abondis> it's almost what i want
<pitti> Sweetshark: still need sponsoring?
 * desrt wonders wtf header he needs to include to get S_IFREG
<pitti> tkamppeter: hello
<desrt> lsb says sys/stat.h.  glibc disagrees.
<seb128> pitti, hey, how are you?
<pitti> seb128: feel like beaten up, but ok; merci!
<desrt> arghghg.  C99.
<seb128> pitti, are you done now? i.e got the 2 remaining ones pulled out?
<Sweetshark> pitti: yes
<pitti> seb128: yes
<Sweetshark> pitti: 3.5.1-1ubuntu1 as found on chinstrap
<seb128> pitti, ok, at least that's something ;-)
<pitti> seb128: btw, for the touchpad menu bug, I don't get that any more
<pitti> I was going to test the upstream patch, but like that it won't tell us much
<seb128> pitti, I still get it and the patch doesn't fix it
<seb128> pitti, I put the ppa in the desktop ppa already
<seb128> the patch in*
 * pitti throws hands into air about bug 955147
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 955147 in unity "[FFe, UIFe] Automatically add launchers for newly installed applications" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/955147
<desrt> pitti: at least it doesn't change the UI of the default install?
<desrt> that should give the documentation folks some breathing room compared to last time, at least
<pitti> that yes, but that's not what I'm concerned about
<pitti> I have no problem with the timing, it's the change itself that drives me nuts
<pitti> so at first we got rid of the bfb and used up a launcher space
<pitti> then we put the 12th link to the control center there, using another
<pitti> which caused it to overflow in a default install on a netbook screen
<pitti> this one will now cause it to grow beyond limit
<desrt> pitti: but how will users ever get to experience the awesome accordian effect?
<chrisccoulson> then we disable autohide on the launcher because users don't know how to reveal it after removing the bfb from the panel ;)
<desrt> we should be proud of our technologies
<pitti> someone who cannot figure out that right-clicking allows to make it sticky won't find out that right-clicking allows you to remove it again
<pitti> chrisccoulson: and that, too
 * desrt wants accordian by default on a 2560x1600 monitor.  make it happen, pitti!
<seb128> pitti, you can dnd to the bin icon
<pitti> natty was really good
<jbicha> pitti: yeah, that's a good point
<pitti> anyway, I've been through discussions like this several times
<chrisccoulson> i dislike the idea of adding icons for newly installed apps to the launcher by default
<pitti> I'd just appreciate if that anonymous "it has been found that..." had some more concrete data
<pitti> 10 minutes of user testing is not what would give you a good balance on decisions like that
<didrocks> pitti: it's an option on software-center, ask mvo/tremolux, but I'm pretty sure you can put it off
<pitti> didrocks: yes; you can put off everything
<pitti> but nevertheless, the kidn of user who doesn't know how anything in the desktop works won't find that either
<pitti> it basically turns the launcher into a really bad start menu
<didrocks> I agree
<desrt> is the dash really that bad?
<desrt> i mean.. if user's can't find stuff in the dash...
<seb128> no it's not
<desrt> maybe instead of shoving more and more things into the launcher, maybe it should be easier to find stuff in the dash?
<pitti> the bfb, the control center, and this bug is basically an outright capitulation that the dash is too hard to use by that ominous "it has been determined that..."
<desrt> maybe have the newly installed app show up in the front page of the dash as soon as you open it or something
<seb128> desrt, well, the dash has the same issue than any menu or dash like feature, how do you find an icon for something new in the middle of 100 icons
<pitti> so why don't we make that easier to discover?
<desrt> with the search string pre-filled
<pitti> seb128: so now we turn the launcher into exactly that
<desrt> indeed
<desrt> and the launcher is even harder since you have to scroll it
<seb128> I like the idea to have new stuff showing at the end of the "active" list
<desrt> you need to do a better job of training users to use the dash to search
<seb128> that's what i.e iOS do
<tremolux> didrocks, pitti, chrisccoulson: you can shut the auto-add to launcher behavior off in Software Center by unchecking "View"->"New Applications in Launcher"
<pitti> tremolux: yes, I know
<seb128> when you install something on an iOS device it adds an icon on your workspace
<desrt> my recommend: when you install a new app, the dash icon gets a pulsing blue glow or so
<desrt> and when you open it, the search field is pre-filled and the icon for the new app is there
<pitti> seb128: the iOS or android app launchers have more space than just a single vertical row
<pitti> its' much more comparable to the dash layout
<seb128> pitti, well the principle is the same, give you an obvious way to start what you installed
 * desrt contributes that piece of feedback to the bug
<seb128> but yeah, I'm not sure it should "stick" there, maybe just show after install until you run it once
<jbicha> pitti: you need to spend more time with an iPhone
<seb128> once you used it once it will show in "most recently used"
<pitti> well, the ipod nano I've seen uses a full-screen multi-page app selector
<seb128> well it collects everything installed
<pitti> but anyway, even if iOS does it exactly like proposed in bug 955147 that doesn't make it any better for me :)
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 955147 in unity "[FFe, UIFe] Automatically add launchers for newly installed applications" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/955147
<seb128> pitti, desrt: btw I think having the launcher "accordian" effect by default was a "feature", not a "bug", i.e something they wanted to show by default
<desrt> seb128: that's hilarious
<seb128> desrt, why?
<pitti> because that launcher works so much better with 30 instead of 9 icons..
<desrt> are you kidding me why?
<pitti> with 30 it entirely loses its functionality as a task switcher replacement
<desrt> ya.  what he said.
<dobey> pitti: there is no way that iOS does that
<desrt> not to mention your muscle memory goes to crap because the scrolling effect moves the icons around all the time so you have no way to get used to "this is where the firefox icon is"
<seb128> dobey, they do add everything you install on your background
<pitti> but I guess I give up; I argued about the single control center icon for over three days back in oneiric
<dobey> seb128: yes, but not the dock
<seb128> dobey, is "dock" their 4 icons at the bottom?
<dobey> seb128: and we do that already. everything is in the dash
<dobey> seb128: yes
<seb128> well maybe we should have the dash always open on the background...
<pitti> right now a default configuration already takes much more space than GNOME 2 ever did
<desrt> seb128: think of processor caches
<desrt> seb128: practically by the laws of physics, the bigger they get, the slower it is to access them
<desrt> it's really the same concept
<pitti> ok, not with the menu bars
<dobey> seb128: we should just have one big button that does whatever it is you want
<seb128> dobey, ;-)
<pitti> Sweetshark: throwing libreoffice_3.5.1-1ubuntu1_source.changes launchpadwards
<seb128> desrt, pitti: note that I didn't say stuff show "stick" on the launcher, but I like having them with maybe a special look until run once
<desrt> seb128: that's even worse, in my opinion
<seb128> then they are in "most recently used"
<seb128> I guess another option is to autostart them for you after install
<desrt> because it was there and now it's gone
<seb128> so they would be added in "recently used" for you as well :p
<desrt> which is just annoying/frustrating... "where did it go?"
<seb128> desrt, well same difference as anything else you run
<desrt> autostart after install is not a bad idea
<seb128> desrt, when you close it the icon is gone
<pitti> same argument like for killing the super-useful intellihide, I guess
<desrt> with confirmation, of course
<seb128> I will not comment on that, I hate *hide ;-)
<seb128> it makes the launcher useless
<pitti> you clearly have a too big monitor :-)
<seb128> I clearly don't see launcher progress bars or count when they are hidden
<seb128> and I've difficulties to remember what is running when it's not on screen
<seb128> so I often look to the launcher as an indicator of what is open
<seb128> but I guess different people work differently
<pitti> anyway, I understand the desire to see it all the time
<pitti> but I don't understand how autohide is any better than intellihide
<seb128> the sabdfl did a detailed post about that on the ayatana design list
<dobey> pitti: autohide is just generally annoying
<seb128> it basically comes down to "some people don't understand the intel behind intellihide and gets very confused trying to understand what happens"
<seb128> but yeah
<pitti> yes, I know
<desrt> so your user testing is telling you something quite loudly
<seb128> hard to conciliate everybody's need in one desktop :-(
<desrt> well, one of two things
<desrt> 1) the dash sucks
<desrt> 2) people really don't understand the dash at all
<pitti> desrt: hang on
<desrt> i suspect it's #2
<pitti> desrt: _some_ people don't understand it at all
<desrt> searching to launch application is a bit of a new concept
<pitti> there's demonstrably enough who do
<desrt> yes.  of course.
<tkamppeter> pitti, hi
<pitti> even my sister figured it out, and heck, you need to talk to her about computers like you talk with a dog
<desrt> but a substantial enough portion of users are getting stuck that you keep getting asked to add more stuff to the launcher
<desrt> as far as i can tell, "add more stuff to the launcher" is a way to prevent people from ever having to open the dash
<pitti> but that kills itself
<pitti> because then we'll have hordes of users who don't figure out how to make the launcher smaller, and we need a new launcher with "active tasks"
<desrt> pitti: your sister figured it out, i bet, because you told her
<desrt> it's not a hard concept to understand
<pitti> desrt: no, I didn't; in fact she didn't even warn/told me that she was upgrading to natty
<desrt> "click here".  "search"
<pitti> she told me the other day "that's a cool new thing you have there"
<desrt> ah.  okay
<pitti> of course she did not know about the WIndows key
<pitti> that's what I told her
<pitti> she opened it with the mouse
<desrt> so she's one of the lucky ones :)
<desrt> i still maintain that the user testing is showing that there is a good chunk of people who can't find stuff using the dash
<desrt> and i think the only thing that is missing there is a short explanation
<desrt> or some hints
<pitti> well, I still think that our user testing has a rather large bias towards "first-time" users
<kenvandine> my kids figured out the search stuff, without even skipping a beat
<desrt> they just need to be told "click here, start typing"
<kenvandine> but i did have to explain to them how to show the launcher
<pitti> if you keep killing long-term efficienty for first-time ease, you inevitably ruin the net sum of user happiness
<desrt> we need one of those "Welcome to Unity 98!  Would you like to take a tour?" things that pops up the first time you login :)
<desrt> everyone loves those
<pitti> yes; at that point that would make me much happier than stuff like that
<pitti> because it fixes the problem that we have -- the first five minutes, not the years after
<desrt> indeed
<didrocks> can we add a startup music as well? please please :)
<desrt> i hate those boxes, though
<desrt> because they're not the first five minutes of using unity
<desrt> they're the first five minutes after every new install :)
<desrt> although i guess that's only a problem that bothers the ultra-nerdy
<desrt> since most people are not reinstalling every few months
<desrt> fwiw, android has some awesomeness here
<pitti> and those who do reinstall every month keep their $HOME
<desrt> out of a factory install (at least on the nexus series) you have this little dude on your home screen
<Sweetshark> pitti: thanks
<desrt> and he's like "click me"
<pitti> but still, even as a nerd it's faster to click away the intro than finding where to disable all those stupid settings again
<desrt> and each time you click him, he presents a new tip -- just a sentence or two.  there are about 6 tips
<desrt> telling you how to add stuff to the home screen, how to delete things from it, etc
<desrt> and the last tip is "okay.  now delete me by dragging me to the trash"
<pitti> i. e. 'don't fill up my launcher', remove the unnecessary ones, finding how to disable the "add automatically", enable autohide, etc.
<Sweetshark> ricotz: pitti just threw 3.5.1-1ubuntu1 launchpadwards, so you have green light for backports ;)
<desrt> having an icon like that on the launcher by default would be cool
<topyli> the dash may be a bit undiscoverble, compared to gnome activities for example. you have an "Activities" label up there, and i think it's pretty obvious that that's where the action is. and once you click it, everything is pretty clear
<didrocks> s
<desrt> pitti: even better.... we should bring back the first-time dialog from the GNOME 1 days
<desrt> Are you a [x] Beginner [ ] Intermediate [ ] Advanced user?
<desrt> [x] Here only for 15 minutes of user testing
<seb128> jbicha wanted to add a launcher icon for the ubuntu user guide previous cycle
<seb128> but I guess people wouldn't like that either :p
<seb128> desrt, yeah, maybe the "small guy walking around the screen and giving you some hints" would be cool
<seb128> < your apps are there
<seb128> ^ your menus are there
<seb128> ^ your im contact are there
<seb128> <win key> type that key for accessing the dash
<desrt> the help is added by default in the gnome-shell dash
<desrt> i'm a bit surprised you guys didn't tackle this issue already
<desrt> gnome-shell and unity are similar enough....
<seb128> desrt, what issue?
<desrt> but like... sort of unlike most other desktop interfaces
<desrt> the issue of people not being used to searching for apps on their desktops
<seb128> well it's hard to "tackle"
<desrt> i think we have this phobia of first-run screens/features
<desrt> probably it's well-justified
<seb128> also one issue is that the search is,was not smart enough
<desrt> but it would go a long way to treat this issue (which clearly _is_ an issue)
<seb128> that's partially being fixed with the new keywords support
<seb128> not sure that's enough
<seb128> like people have an hard time finding stuff because they type the wrong work
<seb128> like typing "jpg" will not list eog
<seb128> or photo will not list "image viewer"
<desrt> that's tough :)
<seb128> or "picture"
<desrt> so "photo" brings up shotwell for me
<desrt> (in g-s)
<desrt> and "picture" eog
<desrt> presumably due to some keywords in the desktop file or something
<seb128> desrt, yeah, I'm trying to make up example but I suck at it
<desrt> seb128: well, it's sort of a good point, actually
<seb128> desrt, well as said we added keywords this cycle
<desrt> because "photo" and "picture" are practically the same word
<seb128> eog is one example where we did it
<desrt> and i get two completely different apps for them
<seb128> desrt, "jpg" does list anything?
<desrt> not in the shell
<seb128> neither in unity
<seb128> it's not a keyword
<desrt> i'm not sure it should be
<seb128> desrt, same, how do you get "excel"
<seb128> people have an hard time finding their stuff, they open the dash and type for what they know
<topyli> do the new keywords include stuff like "watch", "view", "edit", "write" and so on?
<seb128> i.e excel :p
<desrt> seb128: to some extent, the ability to browse is important
<seb128> topyli, Keywords=Picture;Slideshow;Graphics;
<seb128> that's the eog ones
 * desrt almost thinks that we should take the other approach
<topyli> seb128: ok, no verbs or "tasks"
<seb128> topyli, the specs doesn't define the content
<desrt> find a way to collect usage data of what people are searching for in the dash
<desrt> take the top 1000 items
<seb128> it's just a ";" separated list of "words"
<desrt> figure out what they should ideally do
<mhr3> seb128, should locate index /dev ?
<desrt> make a big list.....
<seb128> mhr3, no
<seb128> desrt, yeah, we would need a way to let people opt in to participate for providing those datas
<desrt> anyway...
<desrt> i think the problem is more fundamental than that, even
<desrt> i think it simply doesn't occur to people to click on the dash icon and type
<mhr3> seb128, yet there are people for whom it's indexed
<desrt> so who cares what the results are?  they aren't seeing them :p
<xclaesse> seb128 (dunno if it's you to tell): FYI gnome-online-accounts 3.4 has facebook support if you build with --enable-facebook. it is not (yet) enabled by default because GNOME board wants lawyer to read the terms of service first.
<seb128> xclaesse, talk to kenvandine rather
<xclaesse> kenvandine, ^
<seb128> desrt, right...
 * kenvandine reads back
<mhr3> seb128, any idea what could cause that?
<seb128> mhr3, maybe they have a symlink to /dev/something ?
<kenvandine> xclaesse, i'll look at it
<xclaesse> kenvandine, will be in next release
<seb128> mhr3, /dev is type devtmpfs  which is in the updatedb.conf PRUNEFS list here
<seb128> mhr3, maybe ask them for "mount" output to see if they have a different fs type for it or something?
<kenvandine> xclaesse, ok
<desrt> seb128: btw:  something that may interest you slightly (but nothing has changed)
<xclaesse> kenvandine, dunno what legal procedure ubuntu has for this, but I would personally love if that could be enabled in ubuntu's package :)
<desrt> seb128: it's now official that with gsettings overrides, files that come "later" have more power
<desrt> ie: 20_foo will override 10_bar
<xclaesse> kenvandine, at least now we have the 3 most popupar web services in one place
<kenvandine> xclaesse, not sure i want to enable that for the lts...
<xclaesse> (google, windows live and facebook)
<seb128> desrt, excellent, thanks
<kenvandine> :)
<desrt> seb128: also: all files should be called like nn_* now
<desrt> you have one that is not
<seb128> desrt, btw related topic that came earlier, is there a way to have "default settings by session type"?
<xclaesse> kenvandine, does ubuntu-unity use GOA?
<desrt> (again -- no changes in code -- just updated in the docs)
<desrt> seb128: yes.  there are two ways and i told them both you before
<desrt> *to you
<desrt> you didn't like either one :)
<kenvandine> xclaesse, nope, but if you login with GNOME  you get it
<tkamppeter> pitti, ping
<xclaesse> kenvandine, what does it change that it is LTS?
<desrt> seb128: one is to have different gsettings schema directories per session and use GSETTINGS_SCHEMA_DIR (and either install twice or symlink all schemas)
<desrt> at least all schemas that may have overrides...
<kenvandine> xclaesse, since it isn't enabled by default, and facebook being a web service that isn't always easy to maintain over a long period of time...
<pitti> tkamppeter: hello
<desrt> seb128: the other is using a dconf database to do the same and have a 'unity' and 'gnome-shell' dconf profile
<kenvandine> xclaesse, just a big commitment if we enable it and GNOME ends up not really supporting it down the road
<xclaesse> (gnome does not support anything 6months later anyway)
<seb128> desrt, hum, right, I don't really like either of those :p I think I will delay that to UDS, next cycle, no hurry to do it
<xclaesse> kenvandine, anyway, up to you ;)
<desrt> seb128: so an interesting option could be to make a modification to the schema compiler to deal with this
<seb128> desrt, it came because xubuntu overrides the update-notifier "auto launch" key and mpt was wondering which that key had a wrong default value for him
<xclaesse> kenvandine, what is implemented in GOA is the officially supported and documented way from facebook ;)
<tkamppeter> pitti, can you upload CUPS to Debian and Ubuntu? I have fixed a crash.
<desrt> seb128: it could look at the override files in a particular directory and source the schemas (only the ones referenced from those overrides) from another directory
<kenvandine> xclaesse, yeah, i'll think about it
<pitti> tkamppeter: please upload to ubuntu as -1bzr1 or so (don't commit that release to bzr)
<kenvandine> xclaesse, thx for pointing it out
<seb128> desrt, I like that one better ;-)
<pitti> tkamppeter: I'd like the current version to go into testing again, the previous migration was a while ago
<desrt> seb128: then you could set the GSETTINGS_SCHEMA_DIR to the location of the overrides
<desrt> and it would check there, then the normal system directory
<seb128> desrt, that's basically what we were doing for gconf
<tkamppeter> pitti, I already committed to BZR today in the morning.
<desrt> so the unity session could set GSETTINGS_SCHEMA_DIR=/usr/share/unity/gsettings-overrides or so
<desrt> then you could just do nothing for gnome-shell (ie: use pure upstream)
<seb128> desrt, I like that one ;-)
<desrt> seb128: it's interesting.  i'll think about it some more.
<seb128> desrt, I will remind you at UDS ;-)
<desrt> it would only require some rather minor tweaks in the compiler for it to work
<desrt> you could do it yourself already with a few symlinks :)
<desrt> ie: have your overrides package install the overrides files plus symlinks to the appropriate schemas in the normal system directory
<desrt> you'd just need to make sure the glib trigger updated both directories
<tkamppeter> pitti, I have also a new cups-filters package today or tomorrow (most important: bug 955553). Should I commit and ask you to put in both distros or better upload Ubuntu-only.
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 955553 in cups-filters "12.04 Beta 1: Brother MFC8680DN cannot print text file" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/955553
<desrt> i should really spend next cycle doing dconf/gsettings work :P
<seb128> ;-)
<desrt> olli has been asking us all what we want to do...
 * desrt writes that down
<seb128> desrt, pitti: btw about that s-c unity launcher bug, one option would be to have the icon in the launcher during install, so you get the "installing" with the progress bar info and then an animation moving the icon to the dash icon?
<Sweetshark> desrt: get rich or die trying?
<desrt> seb128: that's an interesting proposal.  you should write it on the bug.
<pstolowski_> hi guys, I'm trying to debug a weird problem with dash search results - when I type 'f' in the home lens, it gives 'full' and 'fuse' entries, which are useless. with help from mhr3 we already confirmed it's because locate has indexed  92 entires from my /dev, including those two
<desrt> i'd say the only negative point against that is that if you look away from the screen (or go to get some tea because it's taking a long time) then you will miss the animation
<seb128> desrt, just did
<seb128> desrt, well if you miss the animation it's not any worth that the solutions where there is no clue at all :p
<desrt> seb128: so if we mixed our two ideas...
<desrt> ie: the app animates into the dash and then the dash starts glowing
<desrt> i think that would be pretty cool
<seb128> right
<pstolowski_> I've a new install with today's daily iso, standard parition layout. One thing worth mentioning is I'm using sshfs on that box
<desrt> anyway
<desrt> i should be doing dconf work :)
<seb128> desrt, have fun!
<seb128> pstolowski_, what does "mount | grep dev" gives you?
<desrt> seb128: if you do one thing today, please get my fixed hud into the distro :p
<seb128> pstolowski_, "mount | grep "on /dev""
<seb128> desrt, hud?
<seb128> desrt, I plan to get xul support into distro ;-)
<desrt> seb128: and the hashtable assertion fix
<mpt> (Oh, it doesn't do XUL yet? I was wondering why it didn't work in Firefox...)
<seb128> desrt, right
<pstolowski_> seb128, /dev/sda1 (ext4), udev on /dev and devpts on /dev/pts
<desrt> mpt: it will still require a unity fix after this in order to fully work
<seb128> pstolowski_, that's missing the info I need
<seb128> pstolowski_, what is written after "type" for /dev
<pstolowski_> seb128, https://pastebin.canonical.com/62547/
<mpt> seb128, btw, same for me as for the other testers in bug 949414, the new package has the same bug. Let me know if I can do any more.
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 949414 in gtk+3.0 "Some GTK+3 events are not emitted when using a touchpad (but are with a mouse)" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/949414
<seb128> mpt, that's all for now but I will ping you back later if needed, thanks!
<seb128> pstolowski_, dunno then
<pstolowski_> seb128, ok, thanks. they shouldn't be indexed by locate, right?
<mpt> Hmmmm, right-clicking doesn't work any more
<seb128> pstolowski_, no, /etc/updatedb.conf has devtmpfs in the PRUNEFS= list
<seb128> pstolowski_, but maybe you get something symlinking back to / or something
<pstolowski_> seb128, I see, thanks
<xclaesse> seb128, empathy-call segfault with that message: empathy-ERROR **: Missing cluttersink
<xclaesse> seb128, and indeed gst-inspect has no cluttersink
<xclaesse> libclutter-gst is installed of course
<xclaesse> something is broken in its packaging? :/
<seb128> jbicha, ^
<seb128> ricotz, ^
<xclaesse> thanks for the redirect
<jbicha> xclaesse: what architecture are you using?
<xclaesse> 64bits
<seb128> jbicha, the build log has
<seb128> # list-missing files result:
<seb128> -./usr/lib/gstreamer-0.10/libgstclutter.la
<seb128> -./usr/lib/gstreamer-0.10/libgstclutter.so
<seb128> -./usr/lib/libclutter-gst-1.0.la
<seb128> jbicha, I guess the .so is important :p
<seb128> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/96829417/buildlog_ubuntu-precise-i386.clutter-gst_1.5.4-0ubuntu1_BUILDING.txt.gz
<jbicha> oh, maybe that explains why empathy-call didn't seem to do anything here ;)
<xclaesse> :D
<xclaesse> jbicha, btw gnome-contacts and gnome-shell should depend on empathy-call
<xclaesse> those 2 does not support old empathy-av
<xclaesse> or recommend maybe
<jbicha> yeah I think gnome-contacts should recommend empathy-call, of course then Contacts couldn't be on the CD but Contacts doesn't work too well any way
<xclaesse> afaik empathy depends on gnome-contacts nowadays
 * didrocks shows again his dh_install --fail-missing to jbicha :)
<xclaesse> jbicha, in empathy, right-click a contact -> information, that will launch gnome-contacts
<seb128> didrocks, how do you deal with stuff like .la that you don't want to install? need to do rules hack to clean those?
<jbicha> xclaesse: Contacts isn't installed by default, but Empathy will use it if it's available
<seb128> jbicha, xclaesse: I think it does install on demand if needed
<seb128> kenvandine said it tried and it was working
<didrocks> seb128: right, you have to add override_dh_install: anyway, so then, I rm; dh_install --fail-missing
<seb128> didrocks, would be call if you had a .install.override like the lintian override
<seb128> where to list stuff you don't install
<didrocks> seb128: hum, interesting way to dealing with those. you will still need to override dh_install to use --fail-missing, but we can maybe integrate that to dh8 directly with an env variable rather
<seb128> something to look at for next cycle ;-)
<seb128> i.e after release rush, at UDS or somethingh
<didrocks> seb128: right!
<ricotz> seb128, jbicha, oh this looks like a greater fallout , sorry :\
 * didrocks notes that somewhere
<xclaesse> seb128, yeah empathy will use pkgkit, but I don't know if that works on ubuntu
<seb128> xclaesse, it does
<seb128> it will use aptdaemon just fine
<xclaesse> cool :)
<didrocks> seb128: nothing against moving unity-gtk-greeter ownership to another team (people from xubuntu, lubuntu), making that team part the current lightdm upstream team part of it (to still have commit access)?
<didrocks> xubuntu/lubuntu want to hack on the code, upload pot filesâ¦
<seb128> didrocks, lightdm-gtk-greeter you mean?
<didrocks> oupss
<didrocks> yeah
<didrocks> autotypo :)
<seb128> didrocks, I've difficulties to parse what you asked for, do you want to move the ownership and give access to the lightdm team? or keep the ownership and those team to the lightdm hackers?
<didrocks> seb128: create a lightdm-gtk-greeter-hackers team, give ownership of this project/move trunk to them
<didrocks> and have lightdm-hackers part of lightdm-gtk-greeter-hackers (to still have commit access)
<seb128> didrocks, works for me
<seb128> didrocks, robert_ancell hacked the ownership change on https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/lightdm/+bug/908926
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 908926 in lightdm ""Large Font" style option does not work" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<seb128> ups, "acked" rather
<seb128> didrocks, anyway please do ;-) thanks
<didrocks> seb128: great, will do the launchpaderies* now then! (hoping I have access to change ownership)
<seb128> didrocks, if you don't let me know, I've access
<ricotz> Sweetshark, thanks, will try to get to it later
<didrocks> seb128: everything went smootly, no need! :)
<didrocks> smoothly*
<seb128> didrocks, excellent
<tkamppeter> pitti, did you see my last messages?
<dholbach> hiya
<dholbach> I had a couple of questions about lightdm before I wander off and file bugs that have already been filed, etc :)
<dholbach> how do I "enable" the unity-greeter background switcher? for some reason it doesn't seem to work for me - is there a bug about it?
<didrocks> dholbach: do you use an encrypted disk?
<dholbach> also sometimes it seems after waking up from suspend the session session doesn't come back up - I have to stop/start lightdm in the console
<dholbach> didrocks, no
<tkamppeter> pitti, please do not upload current BZR snapshot from CUPS. I have to modify it as Mike has posted an upstream fix which is different.
<pitti> tkamppeter: ack; FTR, I'm not really "here" today, I'm on a sick day
 * dholbach hugs pitti
<dholbach> pitti,  I hope you're better soon again
<dholbach> pitti, and shut down that computer!
<pitti> should be much better on Wednesday or so
<pitti> dholbach: need to do a pygobject upstream release :)
 * dholbach rolls eyes
<didrocks> dholbach: did you see that dedication? :)
<pitti> hard code freeze and tarballs due midnight today
<dholbach> didrocks, you should have asked jasoncwarner_ ;-)
<didrocks> heh, indeed :)
<desrt> seb128: hey
<seb128> desrt, hey
<desrt> seb128: if i give the 'dconf compile' capability do you still plan to use it this cycle for the guest session?
<seb128> dholbach, what background to you use? a personal image? it works only for system backgrounds
<dholbach> seb128, ah, it was a personal image
<seb128> desrt, I might yes (not at the top of my list but I don't rely much relying on the gconf->gsettings migration to have screen locking stopped)
<dholbach> nevermind then - see it's good I asked :)
<desrt> seb128: just wondering if i should bother tucking it into this dconf release
<desrt> or wait for next cycle to do the work
<seb128> desrt, it can wait next cycle I think
<seb128> desrt, too much locking is not a security issue and the current version works fine
<desrt> sure
<seb128> desrt, worth thing we can maybe sru the compile stuff
<desrt> punted
<seb128> but let's see next cycle
<desrt> cool
<desrt> i'm starting to think dconf could use some substantial refactoring in the next cycle anyway
<desrt> it's not code that i am particularly proud of :p
<desrt> it was written with too much of an eye toward efficiency
<desrt> so it does really bad things from a software engineering standpoint for some very minimal savings
<desrt> result: ugly hard-to-maintain code
<seb128> right
<dholbach> didrocks, seb128, did you hear anything about the unlock dialog not coming up after waking up from suspend?
<seb128> dholbach, no, what do you mean? it doesn't lock your screen when it should, or you need to press a key to get the dialog to display or ...?
<dholbach> I need to Ctrl-Alt-F1 stop lightdm; start lightdm
<dholbach> not every single time, but maybe every 2nd time
<seb128> dholbach, lightdm has nothing to do with locking
<dholbach> hum, well I get a black screen and a moving mouse pointer, but no unlock dialog
<seb128> dholbach, can you kill gnome-screensaver if you go on a vt? does it solve it?
<dholbach> I'll try next time
<seb128> thanks
<dholbach> thanks for the tip seb128
<seb128> but no, not knows
<seb128> dholbach, yw ;-)
<dholbach> ok
<desrt> hrmph.
<desrt> Background=/home/desrt/.cache/gnome-control-center/backgrounds/6b61801e8ab18a61264418bfaa9dca68cff4e3c89933fc5e8641dd9ae274cd6a
<desrt> looks like the accountservice background patch could use a bit more tweaking...
<desrt> even with a public image file used, this happens
<seb128> desrt, what's wrong?
<desrt> seb128: that file is not readable by lightdm
<desrt> even though the actual file i set for my background is
<seb128> desrt, right, but that's the accountservice patch
<seb128> that's *not*
<seb128> that's the file used for your background no?
<desrt> no
<seb128> i.e we cache the backport to avoid rescaling
<seb128> background
<seb128> doh
<desrt> ya.  that's the problem
<desrt> the account service should know about the original file
<desrt> but instead it gets told about the rescaled cache file in a private directory in my ~
<desrt> ie: where it can't possibly access it
<desrt> it's an .svg file -- that might be why this happens
<seb128> not svg specific I think no, there is a bug open about it
<desrt> ah.  good.
<desrt> as long as it's a known issue
<desrt> where's the bug?
<seb128> desrt, I'm not sure it's a bug, nobody took a stand on whether that's one or not so far
<seb128> desrt, I think part of it is to not leak the path and filename infos
<seb128> https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/928553
<desrt> seb128: it prevents me from seeing my public background image at the login screen
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 928553 in unity-greeter "Non-default wallpapers are not readable by Unity-Greeter" [Low,Triaged]
<desrt> seb128: this is not the same issue
<seb128> desrt, right, I guess somebody needs to come with a way to solve that without leaking infos that shouldn't go public
<desrt> again: the original image file is in a _public_ folder (/, of all places)
<desrt> it's world-readable
<seb128> desrt, it is the same issue?
<seb128> desrt, hum, we used the same bug for several similar issues in fact
<desrt> so interesting to note -- this may in fact be a bug in the control centre
<seb128> desrt, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity-greeter/+bug/918934 is your issue I guess
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 918934 in unity-greeter "Doesn't show manually added wallpapers from "Picture Folders" category (dup-of: 928553)" [Low,Confirmed]
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 928553 in unity-greeter "Non-default wallpapers are not readable by Unity-Greeter" [Low,Triaged]
<desrt> or rather some misunderstanding between the control centre and the accountservice patch
<seb128> desrt, we dupped it because I think it's basically the same bug
<desrt> seb128: i don't think so.  there's something much more complicated going on here
<seb128> but maybe they should be undupped
<desrt> gsettings has the private copy stored as the background image
<seb128> right, that's what we want
<desrt> the problem is that the accounts service assumes that the key in gsettings is appropriate for publishing to the accounts service
<seb128> the .cache 700 permission was overlooked there I think yes
<seb128> desrt, not sure what would be the right way, copy your image in /var/run/lightdm?
<seb128> store it in ~ rather than ~/.cache (though that feels wrong)
<desrt> seb128: use the original image file
<seb128> desrt, then you have to redo the scalling at every boot and loose 1 second of boot time
<desrt> if i manually set it to that it works fine
<seb128> that's the reason we got that caching to start with
<desrt> seb128: in my case that has to happen anyway since lightdm picks a different screen resolution than i have at my desktop
<desrt> and it's an SVG, so... for all we know rendering the SVG at any resolution is faster than decoding a full-screen jpeg
<seb128> hum, k
<desrt> also: it doesn't really add a second to the boot because (a) if the login screen shows then the slowest thing happening there is waiting for the user
<desrt> and (b) the background image loading happens in a thread and doesn't block the loading of the login screen
<seb128> right
<seb128> mterry, ^ what do you think?
<seb128> desrt, I guess we only need a "check if the selected image is publicly available and set the filename only in this case" to not leak private paths
<desrt> indeed
<desrt> really, the checking should be very very simple
<desrt> 1) no cache logic on the before-gsettings side of thing
<desrt> 2) only push paths into the account service if they are not in my homedir
<desrt> is the control-center caching thing upstream or us?
<desrt> because it causes some flaky behaviour...
 * mterry reads
<desrt> ie: if i set a background image and then come back into the panel i find that my image is not selected in the list
<didrocks> seb128: can you binNEW unity-2d btw? I added a -common package
<desrt> and if i select it again, i don't see the original filename but rather the checksum blob
<seb128> didrocks, looking
<seb128> desrt, 2) is wrong
<seb128> desrt, like ~/Images is public readable I think
<desrt> seb128: right.  so maybe some better logic is required.
<seb128> desrt, the caching is done by gnome-desktop I think
<desrt> seb128: like iterate paths all the way from / to the file and make sure each step is public readable
<didrocks> seb128: thanks!
<seb128> didrocks, yw!
<desrt> seb128: and written back into gsettings from gnome-settings-daemon?  i hope not :(
<seb128> desrt, hum, maybe not, didrocks knows that part better, he did it ;-)
<desrt> so there is gnome_bg_save_to_preferences but gnome-settings-daemon never calls it
<desrt> this is a job for dconf blame :)
<mterry> How would g-s-d get access to the original path instead of the cached path?
<seb128> mterry, does gsd needs to? isn't g-c-c writig to accountsservice?
<desrt> mterry: why not just have the control center be the one that pokes the account service?
<seb128> at the time you elect the image
<seb128> select
<mterry> seb128, no, g-s-d is (to handle cases where non-g-c-c apps are writing to gsettings)
<desrt> i think the first step is to make g-c-c not write the cached filename
<desrt> because that's causing problems for g-c-c itself
<mterry> There are other apps that let the user set the wallpaper
<seb128> yeah, like eog
<mterry> Firefox
<desrt> meanwhile g-s-d has its own second copy of caching logic
<desrt> so... i don't know why it would ever even do that in the first place
<desrt> guilty: 04_new_appearance_settings.patch
<desrt> or perhaps i misunderstand patch?
<desrt> s/patch/quilt/
<mterry> desrt, in g-c-c?  /me looks
<desrt> i misunderstood.  quilt stores an entire copy of the original file using the name of the patch -- that file contains the caching logic
<desrt> cc-background-panel.c
<desrt> looks like an upstream problem, really
<desrt> it looks like logic to deal with downloading background images from http urls...
<desrt> except it happens for local files too
<pitti> yay, my first GNOME tarball release
<seb128> pitti, congrats!
<didrocks> \o/ pitti
 * desrt goes insane
 * pitti AFK
<chrisccoulson> phew, just worked off some of the unhealthy food i ate at the weekend
<desrt> mterry, seb128: so interesting discovery
<desrt> ~/.config/gnome-control-center/backgrounds contains a last-edited.xml
<desrt> it has <filename> containing the cache filename
<desrt> and <source_url> containing the original filename
<jbicha> I'm totally bringing up an old conversation, but my wife yesterday tried typing "crop pictures" into the Dash yesterday which doesn't work
<mterry> desrt, hmm, so g-s-d could check that file when the gsettings changes and use the original...
<desrt> mterry: i still think we have a g-c-c bug on our hands, actually
<desrt> source_url should only be set for http:// files
<desrt> somehow it is set for local files as well in some cases
<jbicha> so I guess we'll need keyword verbs next cycle then
<seb128> jbicha, well nothing stops you to put "crop" into the keywords?
<jbicha> I told her she could fix it too but she didn't seem too interested :)
<desrt> okay.  found the issue
<desrt> the copying happens when you 'add single file'
<pitti> cjwatson, stgraber: FYI, uploading new pygobject 3.1.92 now; this needs a small test fix in ubiquity, https://code.launchpad.net/~pitti/ubiquity/indicator-soname/+merge/98230
<cjwatson> ack
<stgraber> cjwatson: are you already merging that change? (I was just about to)
<cjwatson> pitti: can we make this work both before and after somehow, at least for a while
<cjwatson> ?
<cjwatson> pitti: we're having an installer sprint at the moment and a new build-dependency for the tests would be inconvenient right at this poit
<cjwatson> *point
<stgraber> cjwatson: I guess we can store the return value to a variable, then depending on len() do the assert or not (and assign the variables properly)?
<desrt> mterry: so it looks like this happens in order to avoid the file that you add being deleted later or something
<nessita> hello all! just now I made an automatic dist-upgrade, and I noticed (too late) that unity-2d was removed. Now I'm trying to re install it, and I'm getting:
<nessita> The following packages have unmet dependencies:
<nessita>  unity-2d-panel : Depends: unity-2d-common (= 5.7.0-0ubuntu1) but it is not installable
<nessita> ...
<nessita> E: Package 'unity-2d-common' has no installation candidate
<nessita> is this known? can I workaroung somehow?
<cjwatson> stgraber: yeah, that was my thought - I could take care of that
<nessita> workaround*
<mterry> desrt, sure, makes some sense...  or moved or whatever
<stgraber> cjwatson: sure, have fun :) I'm digging into more persistent usb stick weirdness
<mterry> And the cached bg is under ~/.cache which is 0700...
<desrt> mterry: i'm going to file a bug about this upstream
<desrt> mterry: meanwhile, it's a pretty simple patch to fix it, i think
<mterry> desrt, by fix it, you mean stop caching?
<desrt> it's not a cache -- it's a straight copy
<mterry> desrt, k.  But problems-it's-causing-us aside, seems like a feature not a bug?
<tkamppeter> pitti, ping
<desrt> mterry: maybe?
<micahg> nessita: that's arch skew, it happens when amd64 builds before i386 where there are dependent arch:all packages needed
<desrt> if it's a feature, it's a rather poorly thought out one, and implemented in a buggy way, in my opinion
<mterry> fair
<desrt> because it ends up dumping the cache filename (checksum blob) into the user interface
<desrt> which is obviously wrong
<mterry> eww yeah
<cjwatson> pitti: I'd prefer something like http://paste.ubuntu.com/890906/ - OK?
<nessita> micahg: ack, thanks, so shall I just wait for the rest of the builds to finish?
<micahg> nessita: yeah
<cjwatson> pitti: if so, I'll apply to a local branch and merge
<cjwatson> pitti: ... done
<desrt> mterry: okay.  got a patch.
<desrt> https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=672405
<ubot2`> Gnome bug 672405 in Background "'source-url' set on single image files causes problems" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<mterry> desrt, neat.  want me to apply it to our package?
<desrt> i want you to test it first :)
<desrt> i tested it and it works here
<desrt> but try to duplicate the problem first:
<desrt> go into control center -> background.  click the [+].  navigate to and select a file from /usr or something
<mterry> desrt, yar sure :)
<desrt> verify that ~/.cache/ is in the account service
<desrt> apply patch, try again
<seb128> mdeslaur, there?
<mdeslaur> seb128: yeah
<seb128> mdeslaur, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/890942/
<seb128> mdeslaur, does that seems right?
<mdeslaur> seb128: no
<seb128> mdeslaur, why not?
<mdeslaur> seb128: in lock_screensaver(), we are checking "ubuntu-lock-on-suspend", but in that location (when the lid is closed), we actually want to check "lock-enabled"
<seb128> mdeslaur, right, I did undo that change
<mdeslaur> seb128: oh, wait a sec...
<seb128> mdeslaur, the patch I suggest replaces yours
<seb128> mdeslaur, hum, right that patch is wrong...
<mdeslaur> seb128: so, in upower_notify_sleep_cb, we need to check "ubuntu-lock-on-suspend", but in do_lid_closed_action, we need to check either one or the other depending on what the user setting is
<mterry> desrt, can confirm original bug and that your patch fixes it
<mdeslaur> seb128: I can look at if you want, just check it in and I'll poke at it
<seb128> mterry, desrt: i'm about to update g-c-c, I can sneak that patch in
<desrt> seb128: please do
<seb128> ok
<mdeslaur> seb128: the upstream fix is wrong anyway, since it will lock all screens even if an external monitor is plugged in I think
<desrt> seb128: i should mention that this patch has a side-effect
<seb128> mdeslaur, I'm getting very confused by all the screen locking discussion, I'm not sure what we are supposed to do and when now ;-)
<desrt> seb128: the control center adds the pictures from the cache directory to the "Pictures Folder" section
<desrt> which ... is dumb
<desrt> in any case, having it not copied to that directory means that it won't appear there
<stgraber> seb128: hey there! I'm currently working on the ubiquity code dealing with keyboard layouts. I'm setting org.gnome.libgnomekbd.keyboard layouts to an array of valid layouts (maximum 4 of them)
<desrt> but it also prevents the issue with it having appear there with a checksum blob for the filename
<stgraber> seb128: but apparently I need to kill gnome-settings-daemon for it to actually get applied, what am I missing
<desrt> stgraber: could be a g-s-d bug -- it's not properly listening for the change?
<seb128> stgraber, dunno, I've 5 people highlightning me and I didn't make any progress in the 15 updates on my list due to constant ping, I've no clue about xjb
<seb128> xkb
<mdeslaur> seb128: leave the original patch as-is, and I'll fix it for you :)
<seb128> mdeslaur, I will commit a broken version now, if you could have a look I will appreciate, I will get going on g-c-c meanwhile
<seb128> mdeslaur, just commit your update to the vcs if you want, that would be great
<mdeslaur> seb128: sure, be glad to
<seb128> mdeslaur, pushed
<stgraber> desrt: it looks like it gets confused when you set a list that doesn't contain the current layout, it doesn't switch to the first one in that case and sometimes the list in the indicator is wrong too
<dobey> apparently going outside was a very bad idea :(
<desrt> dobey: were there other humans out there? :(
<dobey> and pollen
<dobey> lots of pollen
<desrt> yuck
<mdeslaur> seb128: ok, commited untested patch update, that should be good
<seb128> mdeslaur, thanks
<mdeslaur> seb128: np
<seb128> mdeslaur, I'm not sure to understand the logic, why not just calling lock_screensaver() if the key is set?
<mdeslaur> seb128: because then lock_screensaver checks "lock-enabled" and bails out if that's not set
<seb128> mdeslaur, oh ok
<mdeslaur> seb128: if someone suspends, we want to check "ubuntu-lock-on-suspend" only
<mdeslaur> seb128: repeating the few code in upower_notify_sleep_cb isn't the most elegant way to do this, but I figure it will make the patch a lot less intrusive for future updates
<seb128> mdeslaur, right
 * didrocks waves good evening
<desrt> didrocks: goodnight
<didrocks> desrt: thanks, you too! :)
<bcurtiswx> kenvandine, indicator-messages shows new IM's as my name (not the user who left the IM) my guess is it would be reported against indicator-messages but im not sure if thats empathy causing the issue or indicator-messages
<kenvandine> hey bcurtiswx
<kenvandine> it is telepathy-indicator
<kenvandine> already reported
<bcurtiswx> kenvandine, OK, thanks. I'll make sure to look there now.
<kenvandine> bcurtiswx, it is on my todo list for today
<seb128> desrt, is that gcc patch enough to fix any of the unity greeter issues?
<desrt> seb128: no.
<desrt> seb128: it's enough only to fix the issue of setting a world-readable file
<desrt> the issue of what to do if the user sets a private background is still open for debate :)
<seb128> desrt, well that's "an" issue, so does it fix any of the issues -> yes
<seb128> desrt, thanks
<desrt> oh
<desrt> i read 'all'.  sorry :)
<seiflotfy> kenvandine: pitti seb128 got a nice bug for you
<seiflotfy> smehow i updated 30 minutes ago
<seiflotfy> and now the program i was hacking on cant run anymore
<seiflotfy> ERROR:/build/buildd/pygobject-3.1.92/gi/pygi-marshal-from-py.c:1071:_pygi_arg_to_hash_pointer: code should not be reached
<kenvandine> ugh
<seb128> seiflotfy, it's a bug for pitti, but I think he's out of the evening; maybe downgrade to be able to resume hacking until it's fixed
<seb128> seiflotfy, opening a bug with a testcase might be useful
<seiflotfy> which package should be downgraded
<seiflotfy> and why is it using pygobject 3.1
<xclaesse> seiflotfy, tbh I would assume it is upstream pygobject bug
<seiflotfy> xclaesse: i am not sure
<seiflotfy> it just worked like 30 minutes ago
<xclaesse> yeah was working for me too
<seiflotfy> oh its the version number
 * xclaesse don't remember what package got update 
<seb128> seiflotfy, what did you upgrade? python-gi
<kenvandine> seiflotfy, yeah pitti synced from debian
<seiflotfy> oh
<seb128> seiflotfy, that got updated to .92 today
<seiflotfy> yeah
<seiflotfy> where can i find the old package ?
<seb128> seiflotfy, what arch?
<seiflotfy> 386
<seb128> seiflotfy, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pygobject/3.1.1-0ubuntu1/+build/3227491
<seb128> the debs are on the left
 * desrt indulges in debfoster
<seiflotfy> thanks
<seiflotfy> :D
<seiflotfy> hi desrt :D
<desrt> seiflotfy: hey :)
 * desrt wonders if his system is still working
<seb128> desrt, not it's not and we can't read you
<desrt> wow.  working + faster.
<seb128> desrt, no, can't read you , still
<desrt> somehow apt-get autoremove was supposed to make it so i didn't need debfoster
<desrt> but it doesn't really do a great job...
<seb128> desrt, well, autoremove let you clean stuff that were installed by a package you uninstalled
<desrt> seb128: it lets me clean stuff that was installed when i installed a package that i lated removed, rather
<desrt> *later
<desrt> ie: not working for stuff that came on the CD
<seb128> desrt, that doesn't handle stuff like gedit was depending on gtk2 and is now depending on gtk3, gedit is still installed but I don't need gtk2
<desrt> yes.  that case as well.
<seb128> it's an hard problem to solve
<desrt> it just removed a huge amount of stuff -- like 1.5GB installed size
<seb128> waouh
<desrt> and i didn't even run it with -i
<desrt> that's when it gets really fun :)
<seb128> yeah, I've quite some old libs here
<seb128> like I noticed recently I had like still 3 so versions of libindicat*
<desrt> ya... the apt-get support really has some issues :/
<desrt> then there are some things on the list that are like ... uh... why?
<desrt> acpi-support really seems like it ought to be in ubuntu-standard, as an example
<mdeslaur> seb128: meh, suspend on lid close is broken for me now, and downgrading gnome-settings-daemon doesn't fix it :(
 * mdeslaur will investigate tomorrow
<seb128> mdeslaur, :-(
<mterry> cyphermox, I remember that network-indicator being part of unity-greeter got dropped for 12.04.  Was that just lack of time or were there hard technical problems?
<bryceh> jasoncwarner_, hey following up on your horizontal scrolling mouse bug - I see it's been fixed upstream now, and we have pulled that fix into ubuntu.  When you get a chance can you update to latest precise and verify that the issue is now solved?
<jasoncwarner_> bryceh: sure...will do and let you know
<Sarvatt> mdeslaur: are you using a proprietary driver?
<Sarvatt> suspend on lid close is broken with the nvidia driver, it thinks its an external screen so it doesn't suspend
<desrt> seb128: poke
<seb128> desrt, hey
<desrt> seb128: any word on having the control centre set gsettings keybindings yet?
<seb128> desrt, no, nobody seems interested by that
<desrt> hum
<seb128> or interested enough to do the work
 * desrt is interested in the work being done :)
<seb128> I tried to ping jbicha and ricotz several times about it
<desrt> maybe i can take a look now that XUL is finished
<seb128> desrt, I planned to have a look this week but beta2 freeze is thursday so it will be tight
<seb128> I count tomorrow to still be busy with GNOME 3.3.92
<desrt> it's on my list
<desrt> the g-s-d patch for reverting using gsettings for custom key bindings is ruining my day :)
<seb128> desrt, I think it might be easy, like the g-s-d revert can probably be dropped for sure
<seb128> desrt, oh, how so?
<seb128> I though g-s-d was not linked to wms, etc
<desrt> seb128: trying to build gnome-control-center out of upstream git -> crashes when it can't find the keys in the gsettings schema for g-s-d
<seb128> I though g-s-d had the multimedia keys and actions only
<seb128> ah right
<desrt> because your patch reverted them
<seb128> yeah, I hit that recently as well :p
<desrt> okay.  stepping out for the evening
<desrt> will take a look tomorrow
<desrt> good night
<seb128> desrt, so I think that an easy step would be to drop the g-s-d patch and update the g-c-c patch to drop the multimedia keys part
<seb128> i.e just keep writting the wm keys to gconf
<desrt> that would help, indeed
<seb128> better would be to change that code to write to both gsettings and gconf
<seb128> desrt, 'night
<desrt> ciao
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-03-20
<robert_ancell> jasoncwarner_, beware the dreaded rls-p-tracking tag :)
<robert_ancell> RAOF, did you have any luck with the u-g background corruption on exit issue?  If you're not working on it I'm going to have a look at that today
<RAOF> robert_ancell: I've got a bunch of things which infuriatingly *don't* work.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, do you know if anything has changed?  This all used to work
<RAOF> Did it?  At what point did it work?
<robert_ancell> last cycle (at least for me)
<robert_ancell> my current machine shows a black screen between the greeter and the session, which is I assume my driver clearing the memory where others don't
<robert_ancell> but it used to switch to the bg and then get replaced by the session
<robert_ancell> RAOF, did you try XCopyArea from the window to the root window?
<RAOF> robert_ancell: I did, yes.
<RAOF> robert_ancell: Did it work on *all* drivers last cycle?
<robert_ancell> I can't say for sure
<RAOF> Intel still works, presumably because it's acceleration architecture works in such a way that the wrong things unity-greeter was doing did the right thing.
<robert_ancell> there's a good chance it didn't
<robert_ancell> if XCopyArea doesn't work that's really odd - that should be 100% safe from the X protocol point of view afaict
<RAOF> Intel works for me.  Or, at least, worked until I started trying to fix it :)
<robert_ancell> Did you dive into the GDM code and check they're not doing anything special?  The original code was based off them
<RAOF> robert_ancell: I think my problem with XCopyArea was that I did it before the root window was exposed; thus, it disappeared.
<robert_ancell> actually you'd have to do an XCopyArea to a pixmap and set that as the root window background I supose - windows don't remember their content in X
<RAOF> Hm.  That could work.
<RAOF> Alternatively, I could unmap unity-greeter's window and then XCopyArea.  But that'd leave a flash, so not good.
<robert_ancell> The implementation was just to draw into the pixmap and set that as the background - you really *shouldn't* need to XCopyArea
<RAOF> Yeah.
<RAOF> Although, as mentioned in the bug, you should do that after you've actually *drawn* to the pixmap :)
<RAOF> Also, cairo doesn't guarantee that the pixmap contains anything sensible until you surface.flush() it.
<robert_ancell> ah
<RAOF> Doing both of these things doesn't fix it, however.
<robert_ancell> also, doesn't Cairo use Surfaces instead of Pixmaps internally?  So perhaps they have different behaviour to Pixmaps when the clients exit?
<robert_ancell> Does each driver essentially implement XRENDER themselves?
<RAOF> No; the acceleration architecture does that.
<robert_ancell> that's common code in X.org?
<robert_ancell> and then the drivers just have buffers etc
<RAOF> Which would be my guess as to why Intel works, and radeon/nouveau do not; Intel's using their own home-brewed UXA acceleration arch, radeon/nouveau are using the in-server EXA implementation.
<robert_ancell> ah
<RAOF> Where's the gdm code that does this?
 * robert_ancell hunts around
<RAOF> Looks to be in gdm-slave.c
<robert_ancell> it's probably based off gui/simple-greeter/greeter-main.c
<robert_ancell> but it may actually be using gnome-background from libgnome (?)
<robert_ancell> RAOF, yes, gnome-desktop/libgnome-desktop/gnome-bg.c
<robert_ancell> gnome_bg_set_root_pixmap_id
<robert_ancell> so it might work better if we have a separate process keeping the root window alive?
<RAOF> Maybe?
<RAOF> I thought the root window hung around, though.
<desrt> pitti wins at being german
<desrt> 1) make a claim using a numbers like 99.99995%
<desrt> 2) cite a footnote that explains why this calculation is the actual accurate value
<mterry> robert_ancell, ping about bug 880104
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 880104 in lightdm "Using pam_group results in: pam_group(lightdm:setcred): unable to set the group membership for user: operation not permitted" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/880104
<mterry> robert_ancell, it's because of the call to initgroups, which wipes the group list
<mterry> robert_ancell, I think we need something smarter like a call to getgroups, merge with existing groups, and then a call to setgroups or something like that.  I'm about to go to bed, and will deal with it tomorrow unless you're feeling frisky
<robert_ancell> mterry, ok, cheers.  I thought it might be something like that
<robert_ancell> It might be that the groups are set after authenticate but before pam_open_session.  So we just need to do it after the authenticate (i.e. once we know what user we have)
<robert_ancell> yeah, it's done in pam_setcred, so we just need to move the setgroups
<mterry> robert_ancell, you mean move initgroups to before pam_setcred?
<robert_ancell> yes
<mterry> robert_ancell, easy enough
<robert_ancell> I'm guessing that the group memberships doesn't affect any things that a root process wants to do
<robert_ancell> so the only thing we have to do last is drop privileges
<mterry> Do group memberships matter for root?
<robert_ancell> mterry, I'll work up a patch for it
<mterry> OK
<desrt> who is reponsible for gnome-language-selector?
<RAOF> Ok.  I can definitely draw *something* to the root window's backing pixmap, and it works.
<RAOF> Aha.  It *is* setting the root backing pixmap; it's just setting it to garbage.
<RAOF> Huh.  We create the pixmap, but nothing ever draws to it.
<RAOF> Vala needs a debugger â¹
<desrt> RAOF: gdb?
<RAOF> Yeah, but then you need to read vala's c output to make sense.
<desrt> compile with -g
<desrt> then you get to read vala code instead
<RAOF> Ooh, that'd be much more fun!
<RAOF> Hm.  â[+20.72s] CRITICAL: gtk_widget_draw: assertion `!widget->priv->alloc_needed' failedâ is why lightdm is drawing garbage to the root window.
<desrt> lightdm does its image loading in threads
<desrt> i wonder if it's doing more than that in the thread accidentally
<RAOF> Well, it's already successfully drawn the background.
<RAOF> This is just trying to draw the background on a different cairo context.
<RAOF> desrt: What can cause that assertion to fail?
 * desrt wonders how it happens that sometimes the amd64 builders get so far behind and other times it's the i386 ones
<desrt> RAOF: forcing a draw when a size invalidation has been scheduled
<desrt> could resolution changes be involved?
<RAOF> Well, it's drawing on a different-sized surface.
<RAOF> A framebuffer-sized pixmap, rather than whatever GTK normally thinks its drawing on.
<desrt> this is unity-greeter?
<RAOF> Yu.
<RAOF> It's (now) doing everything to set the root window's backing pixmap, except actually drawing to it :)
<desrt> why the hell is it being done this way?
<RAOF> I think because it's roughly what gnome-desktop does.
<desrt> it doesn't punt through a widget
<desrt> .draw() is not a pure vfunc, you must understand
<desrt> calling background.draw() does NOT result in calling the draw() function on the Background class
<desrt> it results in calling gtk_widget_draw() on the background instance
<desrt> which will so some stuff
<desrt> maybe calling that function will be in there somewhere
<desrt> or maybe throwing an assert
<desrt> are you trying to get the login box as part of what you are drawing?
<desrt> or only the background?
<RAOF> Only the background.
<RAOF> Yeah, I know it's calling gtk_widget_draw.
<desrt> so that draw function chains up to the GtkFixed draw
 * RAOF has been hitting the C code, as unity-greeter doesn't (by default) build with -g
<desrt> which will draw the container children -- like the login box
<RAOF> Hah.
<desrt> probably you'd rather call draw_full() directly
<desrt> that way you can skip the trip through gtk
<RAOF> Ok.  So, it's entirely the wrong thing to do, and the only reason it wasn't obvious is that (a) GTK critical assertions aren't fatal, and (b) the Intel driver accidentally used the right contents for the uninitialised pixmap.
<RAOF> Win!
<desrt> score
<desrt> time for me to go to bed, then :)
<RAOF> Sweet dreams!
<desrt> uh... you too.
<desrt> :)
<jasoncwarner_> hey robert_ancell , I mentioned to RAOF , but a black screen is better than the corruption that we are seeing, so that might be step 1. step 2 would be to fix the corruption. Step 3 is probably ??? and step 4 is our friend profit
<RAOF> jasoncwarner_: We've just hit step 2.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, \o/
<jasoncwarner_> RAOF: !!!
<RAOF> It'll now be just as fast to fix it as to remove the transition.
<RAOF> Well, at least, if my xnest testing is accurate :)
<RAOF> robert_ancell: I'm *amazed* that code works on Intel.  It's wrong in so many ways :)
<robert_ancell> RAOF, which code?
<RAOF> The code for setting the root window background pixmap.
<robert_ancell> what's the main way it's wrong?
<RAOF> It never draws to the pixmap.
<RAOF> Well, that's the *final* reason it's wrong :)
<robert_ancell> that one seems quite major
<robert_ancell> what's with the drivers allowing pixmaps with uninitialized memory?
<RAOF> Performance optimisation?
<RAOF> What's with Intel *accidentally* picking up the right pixmap? :)
<robert_ancell> so any X program can just allocate a pixmap and read from it?
<RAOF> Yeah, totally.
<robert_ancell> i.e. reading your video memory
<RAOF> Not sure about that; there may be guards on the reading.
<RAOF> Anyway, I need to go off to an appointment now.  I'll come back and prepare a unity-greeter merge.
<robert_ancell> nice
<robert_ancell> jasoncwarner_, what are these rls-p-tracking magic tags?
<didrocks> good morning
<didrocks> hey jibel
<didrocks> jibel: with the QA lab shutted down, I think that it's up again (can connect to wazn), but no vm running on it
<RAOF> Bah, Robert's gone.
<RAOF> Heh.  No mterry, etiher.
<jibel> didrocks, good morning
<jibel> didrocks, on it
<didrocks> thanks :)
<RAOF> Huh.  The latest unity-greeter's not in bzr.
<pitti> cjwatson, stgraber: you could also just get the last two values from the result, like call()[-2:]
<pitti> cjwatson: your's also looks good
<pitti> seiflotfy: right, bug report with test case appreciated
<pitti> desrt: I was actually incorrect -- that number assumed that 50% of users couldn't find it, but I failed to neglect that
<pitti> that's what you get when you write this stuff in the middle of the night :) But it didn't let me sleep, so I had to get up and off my chest
<pitti> didrocks, jasoncwarner_: I think today I'll actually take the sick day I put in yesterday (but then did not actually get to not working)
<pitti> fever, sleepless night, feeling horrible, etc.
<didrocks> pitti: oh :( take care Martin
<didrocks> (that's why you commented at 2AMâ¦ I was afraid it was due to the dentist operationâ¦)
 * didrocks hugs pitti
<pitti> didrocks: well, both -- I woke up due to fever, and then my brain didn't let me sleep again
<pitti> I didn't have any fever last time
<didrocks> for my first tooth, I had some, then none for the 3 followings, it's pretty random. take some rest and try to sleep :)
<xclaesse> hmm, ssh is asking my password again: Enter passphrase for key '/home/xclaesse/.ssh/id_rsa'
<xclaesse> that's something that breaks times to times with ubuntu updates...
<ricotz> xclaesse, might be a problem with gnome-keyring which isnt running properly
<xclaesse> ricotz, hm, ok...
<xclaesse> ricotz, something else, do you know why there are no gdm 3.2/3.4 package, not even on gnome3 ppa?
<xclaesse> is it that broken?
<ricotz> .xsession-errors might tell you something here
<xclaesse> ricotz, I see nothing related to that in .xsession-errors :(
<ricotz> yeah, unfortunately gdm 3.2+ has its problems
<tjaalton> is there a way to disable hud?
<xclaesse> ricotz, ok, thanks
<tjaalton> ok got it
<ricotz> xclaesse, the first few lines mentioning GNOME_KEYRING_CONTROL are important here
<xclaesse> ricotz, I have that: http://fpaste.org/hhvE/
<ricotz> xclaesse, if they dont refer to the same tmp folder something goes wrong
<ricotz> xclaesse, is this running the precise version or the gnome3-ppa one?
<ricotz> although this output isnt looking normal
<ricotz> but i might be mistaken
<ricotz> xclaesse, is the gpg-agent working for you?
<ricotz> seb128, hi
<seb128> hey
<ricotz> how are you?
<seb128> good thanks, how are you?
<didrocks> salut seb128, la forme?
<ricotz> seb128, fine ;)
<seb128> hey didrocks, yes! you?
<didrocks> Ã§a va ;)
<ricotz> seb128, there is a problem with your rhythmbox 2.96 upload :\
<seb128> ricotz, which one?
<seb128> didrocks, I was better before checking -changes :p
<ricotz> seb128, ubuntu1
<xclaesse> ricotz, how can I know if it works? :p
<seb128> ricotz, what problem I mean
 * xclaesse uses only ssh keys
<ricotz> seb128, oh ;), you dropped some important *.install files
<ricotz>   rhythmbox-oneiric/rhythmbox-mozilla.install
<ricotz>   rhythmbox-oneiric/rhythmbox-plugin-magnatune.install
<ricotz>   rhythmbox-oneiric/rhythmbox-plugin-visualizer.install
<ricotz>   rhythmbox-oneiric/rhythmbox-plugin-zeitgeist.install
<didrocks> seb128: what do you mean?
<seb128> ricotz, I didn't "drop" anything, I bet somebody didn't commit properly to the vcs when doing the previous update
<seb128> didrocks, I was hoping you or pitti would have tackled some of the GNOME updates, I'm not looking toward another day of tarball updates ;-)
<ricotz> seb128, no, the vcs contains these file, but the upload itself doesnt
<didrocks> seb128: I'll do some, but I told you that with the last minutes g-c-c changes, I'm not very available for this round of update :)
<seb128> ricotz, I used bzr builddeb
<didrocks> pitti is sick and won't be here
<seb128> didrocks, ok, no worry ;-)
<ricotz> seb128, hmm, anyway, could you look at https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+archive/primary/+files/rhythmbox_2.96-0ubuntu1.debian.tar.gz
<seb128> ricotz, I will get it fixed, thanks for pointing it
<ricotz> seb128, ok
<seb128> ricotz, but
<ricotz> (seb128, i just noticed it today while doing a snapshot)
<seb128> ricotz, http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/rhythmbox/ubuntu/files
<seb128> those files are not in the vcs
<seb128> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/rhythmbox/ubuntu/revision/160
<ricotz> oh :\, i see
<seb128> they were not added when pitti,dobey did the update
<seb128> they probably forgot to bzr add them
<ricotz> alright
<seb128> I take only half the blame :p
<seb128> but thanks for pointing it!
<ricotz> ;)
<BigWhale> Good Morning.
<seb128> hey BigWhale
<ricotz> xclaesse, hmm, so ubuntu or gnome3-ppa version?
<xclaesse> ricotz, oh it's the ppa one actually, that may explain it...
<ricotz> xclaesse, ok, i am running the ppa version too here, but without a problem
<ricotz> but with a gnome-shell sesssion which might matter
<xclaesse> ricotz, hm, I see there is an update of g-k in your ppa
<xclaesse> maybe that will fix it :)
<ricotz> there were just translation fixes in it
<xclaesse> ricotz, I have a gnome-shell session as well ;)
<ricotz> but of course there a newer version of the other g-k part too which arent there yet
<Sweetshark> ricotz: any unforeseeable trouble with the backports or is everything good?
<Sweetshark> pitti: no team meeting today?
<ricotz> Sweetshark, seems fine so far, there is no build ready for testing yet though -- building in ppa:ricotz/ppa
<ricotz> seb128, do you mind sponsoring http://people.ubuntu.com/~ricotz/sponsor/cheese_3.3.90-0ubuntu3_3.3.90-0ubuntu4.debdiff ?
<seb128> ricotz, can do, you didn't want to do the .92 update while you are at it? ;-)
<Sweetshark> ricotz: great. no hurry, just wanted to know if there is any trouble ;)
<ricotz> seb128, hmm, right, i just wanted to get rid of the annoying conflict ;), so i guess please upload u4 for now
<seb128> ricotz, ok
<ricotz> Sweetshark, not yet ;) lucid amd64 built :P
<ricotz> Sweetshark, the problem will be  the oneiric amd64 while the ppa builder might run out of space, natty amd64 got one which will work
<mpt> cnd, I think you broke my touchpad :-)
<mpt> (reported bug 960108)
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 960108 in xserver-xorg-input-synaptics "Right-click simulation (two-finger hold+click) no longer works on MacBook touchpad" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/960108
<tkamppeter> pitti, hi
<seb128> tkamppeter, he's unwell and not working today
<chrisccoulson_> lol, this is brilliant: https://groups.google.com/a/chromium.org/group/chromium-dev/browse_thread/thread/d30ae1c692ff53c3?pli=1
<tkamppeter> seb128, OK, so I will override Debian for the cups and cups-filters uploads to get them in for some testing before beta2.
<seb128> tkamppeter, that's fine, I guess you can sync them later once pitti uploads to Debian
<tkamppeter> seb128, thanks.
<seb128> yw
<BigWhale> Is precise switching to 3.3 kernel or we're 'stuck' with 3.2?
<didrocks> this is rather a question for #ubuntu-kernel
<jbicha> but the answer is 3.2 with some bug fixes from the newer versions
<didrocks> well, with the new maintenance model for LTS, we will get the support from newer hw for 2 years
<didrocks> but again, not something for that channel :)
<BigWhale> Thanks. You guys are all full of <3. Happy. :)
<tjaalton> uh, so disabling hud by disabling the shortcut breaks any shortcut needing alt?
<seb128> tjaalton, bug #945816
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 945816 in compiz "[regression] Changing the HUD shortcut disables all Alt-based combinations. And changing the Dash shortcut disables all Super-based shortcuts." [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/945816
<tjaalton> seb128: thank you
<seb128> tjaalton, yw
<seb128> tjaalton, what an idea to want to disable the hud :p
<tjaalton> seb128: yeah, who would've thought ;)
<tjaalton> one more reason for some to install ccsm :/
<seb128> tjaalton, we have an increasing number of bugs because people turn off stuff and hit untested configs and bugs
<tjaalton> the options must be hidden harder then :)
<seb128> tjaalton, it's making me reconsider on options, I start leaning toward the reducing them
<seb128> tjaalton, well I think we should stop supporting people trying to use unity without i.e hud or appmenu
<seb128> like either you use unity as designed or you don't like it and use something else
<seb128> hopefully unity is going enough that you use it ;-)
<tjaalton> hud is constantly getting on the way though
<seb128> still? the tapping issues for resolved in 5.6 we didn't get a lot of complains recently
<tjaalton> well it's usually my fingers not keeping up, so while it technically should work it's not always so good for me :)
<tjaalton> hard to explain
<tjaalton> btw, objections on adding intuos5 support in libwacom?
<tjaalton> i'm thinking of getting one, might replace my mouse..
<seb128> tjaalton, no idea what is untuos5 ;-)
<tjaalton> wacom
<tjaalton> with multitouch
<seb128> well, you are the maintainer, your call, I've no option on that ;-)
<tjaalton> ok, it's a new "feature" though it just adds the device definitions..
<tjaalton> needs driver support too of course, that's FFe material I guess
<seb128> do it, it's easy enough to revert if that creates really issues
<tjaalton> right
<seb128> yeah, the driver side is likely a ffe
<BigWhale> just for the record... indicator-weather is driving me crazy :>
<tjaalton> BigWhale: you're not the only one
<seb128> what's wrong with it?
<tjaalton> crashes after a few hours of use
<BigWhale> constantly crashing
<tjaalton> been like that for a year
<tjaalton> ie. from the start
<seb128> luckily it's opensource so we can fix it ;-)
<tjaalton> right
<tjaalton> i did try to look at it once but then got other stuff to work on
<BigWhale> I probably will...
<desrt> good morning
<mterry> desrt, morning!
<Sweetshark> pitti: ricotz rightfully said we should sync openclipart from debian. would you do that?
<ricotz> Sweetshark, unfortunately, pitti isnt around today
<Sweetshark> ah, meh
<ricotz> maybe didrocks likes to do it ^
<didrocks> Sweetshark: it's a sync? openclipart source package, right?
<Sweetshark> didrocks: right
<desrt> seb128: any new hud explosions since last night?
<desrt> or am i in the clear for a change? :)
<seb128> desrt, no but I just uploaded your new version today
<desrt> oh
<desrt> i thought you did that yesterday
<desrt> i'll ask you the same question tomorrow, then :)
<seb128> desrt, it slipped out due to GNOME 3.3.92 busyness ;-)
<desrt> ack.
<seb128> desrt, works fine for me in any case
 * desrt has learnt to expect exotic races when dbusmenu is involved :)
<desrt> just because it works for you doesn't mean there aren't edge cases to iron out
<seb128> desrt,  you still have some hud bugs assigned though, the DoS stuff and the stripping
<desrt> indeed
<desrt> the dbus message work as well
<desrt> most of what's left there is work in dbusmenu, though
<seb128> jbicha, hey
<didrocks> phew, the g-c-c changes are not fun with all the mirror screen, dragging bar, delayed applyâ¦ and unity-2d/3d not using the same key
<seb128> didrocks, :-(
<seb128> didrocks, do you need help?
<desrt> pitti: hey.  what's the story with the language selector panel?
<seb128> desrt, he's off sick
<desrt> ah
<didrocks> seb128: no, just taking time
<didrocks> but thanks :)
<seb128> desrt, what about the language selector?
<seb128> didrocks, yw ;-)
<desrt> seb128: when i click the icon there's a bit of a delay and then a new window opens
<seb128> desrt, right, rodrigo was supposed to improve the upstream region panel enough so we use that
<seb128> desrt, that was before rodrigo left Canonical though
<desrt> i see
<seb128> desrt, nobody had time to pick it up this cycle
<seb128> so next cycle
<desrt> fair enough
<desrt> seb128: is there any gconf user left in g-s-d after the keybindings?
<seb128> desrt, yes
<desrt> what else?
<seb128> desrt, the gsettings to gconf glue (I was pondering turning it off by default on precise though)
<desrt> ah.  right.
<seb128> like the code which replicates proxy settings etc to gconf
<desrt> it almost seems like we could abuse that code to deal with the keybindings
<seb128> desrt, it feels like stacking hacks on hacks
<desrt> i disagree....
<desrt> i was going to patch the control centre in a somewhat similar way
<desrt> for the wm keys, have a map of gsettings keys and their corresponding 'old' locations in gconf
<desrt> as a way of keeping the surface area of the patch as small as possible
<seb128> desrt, so looking at g-s-d I think those keys are only multimedia ones, so no compiz interaction, so dropping that patch should be fine if g-c-c writes to gsettings for the corresponding entries
<seb128> desrt, is that your understanding as well?
<desrt> yes
<desrt> but i took a look at g-c-c as well last night
<seb128> desrt, so we basically just need a way to make sure the g-c-c changes to wm keys land to gconf for compiz?
<desrt> the way it handles things i'm not so sure that it will be easy to cleanly separate like that
<desrt> ie: separate gconf vs. gsettings
<desrt> so i was thinking that the best way to do that patch would be a list of gsettings keys and a mapping to gconf locations
<seb128> desrt, can't we just write wm to both?
<desrt> and just do it like that
<desrt> yes.  that's the plan
<dobey> seb128: bad pitti! :)
<desrt> when it sees a write to gsettings, it will do the appropriate gconf write
<seb128> dobey, bad you to not do a merge request I guess? ;-)
<seb128> desrt, sounds good to me
<desrt> seb128: so my next logic is that we already have the migration code in g-s-d....
<desrt> seb128: if you tell me we could rip that out entirely then i think we should do it
<seb128> desrt, do you want to try dropping both patches and see if things just work?
<dobey> seb128: i did do a merge proposal for it
<desrt> seb128: i guess WM keybindings would stop working :)
<seb128> desrt, why?
<desrt> (for compiz)
<seb128> desrt, the gsettings<->gconf glue should do the replication
<desrt> it replicates keybindings?
<seb128> desrt, you don't want to know what that code does
<desrt> okay :)
<seb128> desrt, I will tell you anyway :p
<desrt> well, let me check something
<seb128> desrt, it parses all the installed .convert to get the mapping
<desrt> i have an unpatched g-c-c here
<desrt> let me try to set some keybindings and see if they land in gconf or not
<seb128> desrt, and use it to write any key listed there to gconf
<desrt> uh
<seb128> desrt, so any gsettings key in a .convert will be written to gconf
<desrt> the one-time GConf conversion files, you mean?
<seb128> desrt, yes
<desrt> oi.
<seb128> desrt, that's how it gets the mapping
<desrt> that's.... thorough
<desrt> and just a tiny bit INSANE
<seb128> lol
<seb128> I knew you would like it ;-)
<desrt> it's ballsy
<desrt> and somewhat effective
<dobey> seb128: https://code.launchpad.net/~dobey/ubuntu/precise/rhythmbox/prereleases-2-95-5/+merge/96671 and those files are in the .diff :)
<seb128> I was pondering addering a whitelist list of keys
<hallyn> GAAAH!  STOP remapping my kbd on upgrades
<desrt> good for days when you're in a "i don't want to have to write and maintain this huge list of shit" mood
<dobey> hallyn: indeed
<seb128> hallyn, we don't do that
<dobey> Alt+F4 doesn't work for me under Unity any more :(
<seb128> desrt, well I hate writting back to applications gconf tree, it's just a waste
<seb128> dobey, wfm
<desrt> seb128: ya.  that's totally stupid.
<desrt> it should only be for various 'well known values'
<desrt> things like proxy, etc
<seb128> desrt, right, what I was just saying, I was pondering building a whilelist with a dozen of keys
<desrt> seb128: do you also have gconf keybinding patches in metacity?
<dobey> seb128: in a gnome-terminal winodw, i just get ";35" printed when i press it :-/
<seb128> dobey, do you use a ppa for compiz or unity?
<dobey> no
<seb128> dobey, https://code.launchpad.net/~dobey/ubuntu/precise/rhythmbox/prereleases-2-95-5/+merge/96671 was buggy indeed, so both your fault and pitti's fault
<dobey> seb128: buggy how?
<seb128> dobey, you used the wrong vcs, so pitti had to copy stuff over by hand
<seb128> dobey, the desktop team ppa are not lp:ubuntu they are lp:~ubuntu-desktop and debian dir only
<seb128> dobey, i.e what is in the control file or what apt-get source or debcheckout tells you
<dobey> bah
<seb128> desrt, no, we just didn't update that one
<desrt> dobey: you should do what i do.  claim ignorance and get seb to do all your future uploads for you :)
<desrt> seb128: what happens for unity 2d, then?
<seb128> desrt, unity-2d is using it as well which makes things harder to use
<seb128> desrt, well, same as compiz, still using gconf
<desrt> ohhh
<desrt> no update = old version
<seb128> right
<desrt> right
<desrt> was it just the keybinding thing?
 * desrt can't imagine metacity has seen a lot of activity this cycle
<seb128> yes
<desrt> oh wow.  2.34 even.
<seb128> desrt, so another crazy idea
<dobey> desrt: even better, "the tools should handle it, or should at least inform me (as should the reviewer)"
<seb128> desrt, which might be easier than what we are speaking about here
<desrt> seb128: i like crazy ideas.  hit me.
<desrt> seb128: particularly ones that involve less patches :D
<dobey> why the hell does lp:ubuntu/foo not pull lp:~ubuntu-desktop/foo/blah in these cases?
<seb128> desrt, drop the gsd patch, drop the gcc patch, cp -r keybinding-3-2 oldkeybindings
<seb128> desrt, and ship the 3.2 panel with ShowOnlyIn=Unity
<seb128> desrt, and the new one under shell
<seb128> OnlyShowIn
<seb128> desrt, i.e ship keybinding 3.2 and 3.4 as different panels
<seb128> and tweak showin
<seb128> desrt, so we have no patching, just shipping old and new version side to side
<hallyn> seb128: wasn't blaming you personally :)  just some piece in the otherwise lovely ubuntu desktop.  cause, you know, that's what i'm using :)
<desrt> seb128: back in 15.  local 'situation' :)
<seb128> desrt, ttyl
<jbicha> seb128: happy Spring!
<kenvandine> jbicha, seems to me spring started a month ago here :)
<kenvandine> pitti, can you look at https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=668903
<ubot2`> Gnome bug 668903 in introspection "Broken marshalling on big endian architectures" [Major,Reopened]
<seb128> jbicha, hey, thanks, to you as well!
<seb128> jbicha, how are you?
<seb128> kenvandine, he's off sick today but I guess he will read feedback
<seb128> scrollback
<kenvandine> i just noticed
<jbicha> kenvandine: I thought this was summer!
<kenvandine> i wish this is what summer felt like... 80F is much better than 98F :)
<jbicha> it's been in the 80s in Wisconsin for instance
<seb128> jbicha, btw if you want to do some of the .92 updates like gnome-themes-standard, cheese, etc feel free ;-)
<desrt> seb128: back
<desrt> seb128: so basically you're saying have two copies of the panel -- one writing entirely to gconf and the other writing entirely to gsettings?
<seb128> desrt, yes
<desrt> seems like it wouldn't work
<jbicha> seb128: I'm a bit swamped with Docs Freeze & my day job is working on posscon.org which happens next week so I won't be able to do the updates as much this week :)
<desrt> because g-s-d has to read from one place or the other
<seb128> desrt, the 3.2 and 3.4 codebases
<seb128> jbicha, ok
<desrt> unless we want to have onlyshowin for the media-keys g-s-d plugin (and i don't think it works like that) :)
<seb128> desrt, oh right :-(
<desrt> seb128: okay.  here's what's involved (add any i miss): g-c-c, g-s-d, mutter, metacity, compiz
<desrt> right?
<seb128> yes
<desrt> if we followed upstream, absolutely everything would be happy except compiz?
<seb128> well, and unity-2d
<desrt> (including new metacity version)
<desrt> if we took the new metacity, unity-2d would be happy
<seb128> not sure how unity-2d keys interact with the wms one
<desrt> oh.  it has its own keys?
<seb128> that's assuming the unity-2d code doesn't use gconf
<seb128> desrt, I don't know the unity2d codebase, I can't tell
<didrocks> hey desrt, small hint, you probably should put a commit message now to https://code.launchpad.net/~desrt/unity/no-average-bg-color-gsettings/+merge/96863 and approve your branch :)
<didrocks> yeah, 2d has its own keys
<desrt> didrocks: what do they do?
<didrocks> choosing launcher placement, putting barriers sensitivity, launcher items content
<desrt> oh
<desrt> not keybindings, though
<seb128> desrt, not sure if they read any keybindings for i.e hud
<desrt> a quick grep tells me not
<didrocks> no, it's part of unity-2d as well
<seb128> ok
<desrt> so here's my insane idea:
<desrt> 1) update metacity
<desrt> 2) drop all the patches
<desrt> 3) write a compiz plugin to do gsettings->gconf migration
<kiwinote> st
<kiwinote> whoops
<jbicha> I had thought Precise was going to have compiz gsettings since there was a branch for it before oneiric was released
<desrt> jbicha: the branch wasn't really ready....
<jbicha> and of course now's way too late for that
<Riddell> hello desktop team, who is able to make a decision on bug 882014 ?
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 882014 in indicator-weather "Please consider package removal or adding developers" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/882014
<desrt> ya.  i did a couple of rounds of review... it was a complicated patch
<desrt> and it just dropped off
<seb128> desrt, I think it's too much change at this point, beta2 freeze is in 2 days
<seb128> desrt, you can try to get a ffe but that seems a crazy plan
<seb128> desrt, I would try to go for "drop the g-s-d patch and make g-c-c write to both gconf and gsettings"
<desrt> seb128: it's the metacity part that you object to, isn't it?
<seb128> desrt, that and "write a compiz plugin"
<desrt> that's trivial :)
<desrt> okay
<seb128> well, I feel like the "get g-c-c to write to both location" should be easier
<desrt> so what is your plan for the g-s-d migration patch?
<seb128> and less risky
<desrt> whitelist-only or dropped entirely/
<seb128> that's a different topic
<desrt> it's related
<desrt> because if we have something migrating keys from gsettings to gconf we could use it
<seb128> hum, I was going to email ubuntu-desktop list suggesting dropping it
<desrt> i think that's a good idea
<desrt> so then i agree with you
<desrt> i'm going to write a very very small g-c-c patch
<desrt> it will basically be a list of gsettings keys and corresponding gconf keys
<desrt> when a write happens to the gsettings key in question, it will also go to the proper gconf key
<desrt> piece of cake
<seb128> desrt, you can probably copy the gsettings-desktop-schemas wm convert for that mapping table
<desrt> sounds good
<desrt> it's all the keys in /app/metacity, right?
<seb128> should be
<seb128> but I've little experience with wms and keybindings so maybe check with didrocks
<desrt> well
<desrt> if it's in the conversion file then it's just a straight port
<desrt> gsettings-data-convert migrations are.... not clever :)
<desrt> "oh.  i see a string.  it must be a string!"
<jibel> Sweetshark, I re-ran oneiric->precise upgrade and bug 916291 is still there with LO 3.5.1-1ubuntu1
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 916291 in libreoffice "failed to upgrade from Oneiric to Precise: ERROR: Cannot determine language! - exit status 134" [Critical,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/916291
<desrt> that's about as advanced as the logic is :p
<didrocks> what are you trying to fix?
<seb128> didrocks, is /usr/share/GConf/gsettings/gsettings-desktop-schemas.convert basically what compiz needs?
<desrt> didrocks: reducing the patches on g-c-c and g-s-d
<seb128> didrocks, reduce the patch crazyness and write to gsettings as well as gconf for shell benefit
<desrt> seb128: the saddest part about this plan is that g-c-c has to keep its gconf depend
<didrocks> the mapping is actually already exposed (the metacity keys we steal)
<Sweetshark> jibel: Ok, I need an exact virtualbox image of that run then as I cannot reproduce that here.
<seb128> didrocks, /usr/share/GConf/gsettings/wm-schemas.convert I meant
<didrocks> no
<jbicha> didrocks: yeah, currently users who try to change keyboard shortcuts in GNOME Shell are met with failure, we can refer them to dconf-editor but that's a pain
<didrocks> /usr/share/gnome-control-center/keybindings/*compiz*
<seb128> didrocks, well, I was wondering if all the keys in the mapping are listed there
<didrocks> (which is a sed from metacity)
<didrocks> this is the keys that are used
<seb128> thanks
<desrt> oh.  that.
<desrt> ya.  that's going to be an issue, i think
<desrt> the control centre looks at the files in that directory
<desrt> and they're going to have gconf paths, not gsettings keys :X
<didrocks> right
<Sweetshark> jibel: What I did to try to get that error was: 1) install vanilla oneiric 2) apt-get update && apt-get upgrade 3) do-release-update -d
<Sweetshark> jibel: should I have left out 2) ?
<desrt> seb128: i start to like my idea more again :p
<desrt> unless we can get compiz not to install those files
<didrocks> if compiz doesn't install those files, it has no idea where to look though :p
<desrt> i'm confused.  those files are for the benefit of compiz or for the control centre?
<didrocks> both
<didrocks> control center to expose them
<didrocks> compiz is reading them
<didrocks> and has a giant conversion table within code
<desrt> this is really quite dreadful :)
<didrocks> but IIRC, they need to exist
<desrt> lemme check something, then
<desrt> hum
<desrt> the control centre actually doesn't seem to be bothered by then
<desrt> it just ignores them
<bcurtiswx> good morning
<didrocks> desrt: it will only expose those corresponding to the wm running
<desrt> didrocks: is this the patched or unpatched behaviour?
<desrt> because we plan to remove all the patches...
<didrocks> desrt: unpatched behavior
<didrocks> all the g-c-c patches or just the revert? :)
<desrt> i wish all :)
<didrocks> aha
<desrt> the gconf reverts, basically
<desrt> so here's what i don't get
<desrt> the new format (gsettings) keybindings files have description strings in them
<desrt> the gconf ones don't....
<desrt> where do the descriptions come from?
<didrocks> desrt: gconftool --short-docs
<desrt> huh.
<didrocks> they are matching
<desrt> fascinating use of introspection
<didrocks> see, description on keys are used :-)
<desrt> right.  so the compiz ones will be ignored
<desrt>   if (schema == NULL &&
<desrt>       keylist->schema == NULL) {
<desrt>     g_debug ("Ignored GConf keyboard shortcut '%s'", name);
<desrt> because they don't have a schema='' attribute
<desrt> that's perfect
<desrt> seb128: okay.  we do it your way.  this shouldn't be too hard at all.
<seb128> desrt, \o/
<desrt> weird... the keyboard 'item' code is like a copy of the background 'item' code
 * desrt has a strong sense of deja vu
<Sweetshark> chrisccoulson: any objections against an annoying libreoffice roomie at uds-q?
 * desrt wonders what would be higher -- the electricty consumption due to the parallel building of libreoffice (on bjÃ¶rn's laptop no less) and firefox -- or the noise complaints generated by passionate levels of dbusmenu bitching
<Sweetshark> desrt: we should combine those to use the synergy: high power noise complains ...
<didrocks> desrt: btw, did you read my message about the commit message not set and so, your wonderful branch not merged?
<desrt> didrocks: i did read it, but i didn't understand what i was supposed to do
<didrocks> desrt: go to the merge proposal page
<didrocks> desrt: see the "add a commit message"
<didrocks> be tempted by it and add one :)
<didrocks> then, on top
<didrocks> change needs review -> approved
<desrt> that was... easy
<desrt> :)
<desrt> i just had to copy-paste the commit message to ... the commit message
<desrt> perplexing :)
<didrocks> desrt: thanks! :)
<seb128> desrt, yeah, that's a stupid ui
<seb128> especially when your merge request has 1 commit
<seb128> it should automatically use the commit message as merge message for those
<seb128> ok, I'm out for some exercice
<seb128> will be back for the meeting time in case we have a meeting today ;-)
<seb128> if people feel bored the pad still has a stack of GNOME updates to claim, so feel free to pick one
<desrt> seb128: quick update
<seb128> desrt, yes?
<desrt> seb128: the way keybindings are handled in upstream gnome is very stupid presently
<desrt> metacity is installing the g-c-c keybinding description files for the schemas in gsettings-desktop-schemas
<desrt> those should be moved either to g-c-c or g-d-s
<desrt> because otherwise the new metacity is required for mutter's keybindings to be set at all -- which is just wrong, and which we don't have
<seb128> hum, it start feeling like we will have broken keybindings for shell in the lts
<desrt> i plan to fix this upstream ASAP
<seb128> ok
<seb128> that said, bbl, need to go if I want to be back for meeting time ;-)
<dobey> Reading package lists... U BÃ«
<dobey> i'm also getting that "U Be" printed a lot when doing apt-get update and apt-get upgrade stuff
<chrisccoulson> hi Sweetshark
<chrisccoulson> yeah, that's fine :)
<kenvandine> jbicha, have you looked at the clutter-gst build failures?
<jbicha> kenvandine: no, I couldn't get an ARM chroot working so there wasn't too much I could do to test besides pushing random things into Precise
<seb128> re
<seb128> didrocks, kenvandine, chrisccoulson, Sweetshark, cyphermox, mterry, agateau, Riddell: it's meeting time if somebody has a topic
<jbicha> I don't understand ARM much, that's why it would be random
<chrisccoulson> hi!
<didrocks> no topic for me
<chrisccoulson> sorry, been looking at memory leaks in firefox today :)
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson, how are you?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, not too bad thanks. how are you?
<seb128> I'm good thanks!
<Riddell> 14:02 < Riddell> hello desktop team, who is able to make a decision on bug 882014 ?
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 882014 in indicator-weather "Please consider package removal or adding developers" [Wishlist,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/882014
<seb128> Riddell, it's an universe package, motu call
<seb128> but it seems like it's not buggier than lot of universe stuff
<seb128> could be one or two bugs to solve
<chrisccoulson> and i think i agree with https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/indicator-weather/+bug/882014/comments/4
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 882014 in indicator-weather "Please consider package removal or adding developers" [Wishlist,Incomplete]
<seb128> I would rather like to see it fixed
<chrisccoulson> with it not on the default install, being a bit crashy doesn't seem like good enough justification to remove it
<seb128> right, especially that the feature is wanted
<seb128> we should look if there is an obvious bug in the code leading to those issues
<seb128> Riddell, thanks for bringing it up though
<seb128>  
<stgraber> mterry: ping
<seb128> other topics?
<kenvandine> not from me
<stgraber> oops, sorry, didn't see it was a meeting
<Riddell> I have ubuntu desktop working on an arm computer now, although only using the ubuntu server image
 * kenvandine should really go update the wiki :)
<cyphermox> well, I want to land NM 0.9.4; but need to do a FFE now
<chrisccoulson> did everyone switch to https://launchpad.net/~mozillateam/+archive/firefox-next yet? ;)
<mterry> stgraber, yo
<chrisccoulson> (well, for those who aren't using chrome)
<kenvandine> chrisccoulson, nope... i can do that
<jbicha> chrisccoulson: I'm on it, Firefox 12 is totally more awesome than 11 was :)
<chrisccoulson> excellent, thanks :)
<seb128> ok, seems there was no other topic, thanks everyone
<seb128> don't forgot to update your workitems
<seb128> chrisccoulson, you still have a gsd boot time one ;-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah :)
<jbicha> we could have jorge threaten to remove indicator-weather from the archives, hey it worked for CCSM I guess ;)
<kenvandine> hehe
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I bet it would be easier to find issues in gsd than in firefox :p
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, i'd imagine it probably would be. at least i don't need to rebuild gsd in order to run it in valgrind :)
<seb128> ;-)
<didrocks> jbicha: didn't really work for ccsm, but that's another discussion :p
<jbicha> we got 2 patches, right?
<didrocks> yeah, but none for fixing the real issue
<chrisccoulson> the real issue being that it is awful? :)
<seb128> jbicha, btw I commited your evince update to the vcs, my upload to fix the file conflict issue with the new version got rejected because the vcs was outdated ;-)
<didrocks> not, that you can on some cirumstance removing some plugin by conflicts :p
<seb128> i.e I commited the archive version and rebase my fix on it
<didrocks> Sweetshark: hey, openclipart FTBFS
<jbicha> seb128: thanks, bzr push is tough to remember some times
<didrocks> Sweetshark: I was thinking you test build it at least
<Sweetshark> didrocks: link?
<seb128> jbicha, indeed ;-)
<kenvandine> chrisccoulson, when is firefox 12 going to be released?
<chrisccoulson> kenvandine, 2 days before 12.04 is released ;)
<didrocks> Sweetshark: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/openclipart/2.0-1/+build/3303173
<didrocks> you can look at it yourself btw :)
<kenvandine> chrisccoulson thx
<Sweetshark> didrocks: no, sorry. that was out-of-order-execution because ricotz brought it up ... :/
<jbicha> we should write a script that does bzr push and then dput
<didrocks> Sweetshark: ok, can you please fix it now then?
<Sweetshark> didrocks: yes
<didrocks> 17:48:04         micahg | didrocks: FWIW, ajmitch gave me a patch, but I haven't test built it yet, was waiting to finish with something else first
<didrocks> Sweetshark: can you please check with micahg? ^
<Sweetshark> didrocks: fwiw that is not the new upload that broke, but 3.5.X breaking all openclipart packages.
<micahg> Sweetshark: since we have 3.5.x in precise, that means that the openclipart upload is broke :)
<Sweetshark> micahg: sure, sure
 * Sweetshark is fixing
<micahg> Sweetshark: I already have the patch from Debian experimental if you want to review it
<micahg> I'll attach it to a bug
<micahg> Sweetshark: Bug #960389
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 960389 in openclipart "openclipart 2.0-1 FTBFS in precise" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/960389
<Sweetshark> micahg: debdiff is looking good
<desrt> seb128: so the keybinding stuff is ... bad
<desrt> the translations of keybindings in gnome is currently completely broken
<seb128> desrt, I'm somewhat glad I went for the "stay on 3.2" code by then rather than on the "let's try to fix compiz" ;-)
<desrt> seb128: it needs to be fixed before we can release gnome 3.4
<seb128> desrt, could you keep the current code and add gsettings set calls?
<desrt> i'm shocked nobody noticed
<desrt> seb128: no... i think that's really the wrong way
<desrt> i'm going to spend the rest of today trying to make this work
<seb128> desrt, well, hard freeze was yesterday
<seb128> desrt, ok, good luck
<desrt> seb128: this is no code changes
<desrt> i just have to do a lot of translating :)
<seb128> desrt, just schemas?
<desrt> seb128: basically, here's the story:
<desrt> the keybinding description strings are in the gsettings schemas in gsettings-desktop-schemas
<desrt> so they get translated there
<desrt> unfortunately, very few people have done translations of that module
<desrt> like, not even 'fr', for example
<desrt> so -- no translations
<seb128> desrt, like no translation in the control center ui ?
<desrt> i'm going to write a scrip that collects a list of all of the strings that need to be translated and attempt to steal them from the existing translations in metacity or mutter
<desrt> seb128: correct
<seb128> desrt, and nobody noticed?!
<desrt> apparently not...
<seb128> desrt, you should tell bastien to run a french locale back :p
<desrt> i just verified it by switching my fedora install to french and opening the control centre
<desrt> only these ones are translated properly: cs.po  de.po  eo.po  es.po  gl.po  ja.po  nb.po  pt_BR.po  sl.po  sv.po  vi.pozh_CN.po
<seb128> desrt, well translators still have a week, maybe just email their list telling them to check on that component
<desrt> right
<desrt> fair enough
<seb128> desrt, 2 reasons to that
<desrt> anyway.. if that gets sorted, then it's not much problem at all
<seb128> desrt, 1- your time might be more valuable than fixing translations
<seb128> desrt, 2- translators don't like much having "similar strings" being pulled in for them ;-)
<desrt> seb128: the problem is that there are a large number of strings here -- and many of them are not visible in UI
<micahg> Sweetshark: thanks for looking
<desrt> seb128: these are not really similar strings
<desrt> they're the same string that got moved from one module to another
<seb128> desrt, translators know how to use intltool-merge to reuse those I think
<seb128> I would just drop them a note telling them to sort it
<seb128> you will probably have most team who will do it by next week
<desrt> hum
<desrt> okay.  i will try that
<desrt> i can always fill in the missing gaps later
<seb128> right
<desrt> anyway -- except for that, i think we're in good shape
<desrt> moving the xml files from metacity to g-c-c is really straight-forward
<desrt> i already have a patch for it
<seb128> good
<desrt> g-c-c will simply ignore the old gconf files once you remove your patch reverts
<desrt> so there's no worries there
<seb128> desrt, do we want that?
<desrt> yes
<seb128> desrt, I'm still unsure why they were there
<seb128> I though it was to list compiz specific bindings
<desrt> seb128: so basically those xml files are what populate the keybindings panel
<seb128> desrt, right, but are all the compiz ones in the upstream panel?
<desrt> are there compiz-specific ones?
<seb128> or will we loose actions by doing that?
<seb128> desrt, well I assume those were added because compiz had some specific ones
<desrt> i thought it just steals all the metacity ones...
<seb128> desrt, like maybe "expose" or dunno
<desrt> seb128: i assume they were added so that you can uninstall metacity and not lose your settings
<desrt> i'll be sure to double-check that
<seb128> desrt, no, I think it's not that
<seb128> desrt, we had in the past when integration was broken stuff that stopped being listed in g-c-c
<desrt> seb128: it looks like most of these are just metacity ones...
<seb128> didrocks, ^ do you remember what happens without the compiz xml to the gcc?
<didrocks> well, you have not the keys exposed anymore
<didrocks> I don't remember, but I'm pretty sure some keys were not working on compiz either
<desrt> i just did a comparison -- the list of keys compiz installs is exactly equal the list installed by metacity
<didrocks> desrt: not a surprise, it's a sed :)
<desrt> just a different name
<didrocks> in the packaging
<desrt> right -- so there is nothing compiz-specific there
<m4n1sh> didrocks: ping
<didrocks> hey m4n1sh
<m4n1sh> rolling out one more release of a-l-m
<m4n1sh> with i18n fixes
<m4n1sh> some bug fixes
<didrocks> m4n1sh: btw, did you look at bug #949849?
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 949849 in pkgbinarymangler "Should use official "Keywords" instead of X-GNOME-Keywords" [Low,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/949849
<didrocks> m4n1sh: would be nice to get it
<m4n1sh> this looks good
<m4n1sh> will fix it
<m4n1sh> didrocks: but there are UI changes which makes it as per the mockups
<m4n1sh> filing for another UIFe
<desrt> seb128: is there anything that stops you from updating metacity?
<desrt> seb128: my life would become _really_ a lot easier if you did :)
<desrt> seb128: and the lives of many many translators
<didrocks> m4n1sh: please do and keep me posted
<m4n1sh> sure
<seb128> desrt, the desire to want to stay out of any issue that could create for unity-2d and the lack of interest for it
<seb128> desrt, i.e talk to didrocks if you want to convince somebody ;-)
<desrt> didrocks: can we pretty please have the new metacity?
<didrocks> not like if we were already in a rush
<seb128> desrt, I managed to stay out of any wm work for some years and I intend to keep it this way :p
<didrocks> and every new metacity broke unity-2d in some interesting way
<didrocks> not speaking of the stack of patch we have
<Sweetshark> micahg: building with the patch now
<seb128> desrt, you should probably move the defintions to g-c-c and make g-c-c write to gsettings as well on the current codepath, anything else start to seem out of scope
<seb128> desrt, this way we wouldn't change anything but g-s keybindings change would work
<desrt> seb128: it's not that easy due to the translations, unfortunately
<seb128> desrt, we already have the translations
<desrt> seb128: and i really want to drop those g-s-d patches
<desrt> that's my main interest
<desrt> seb128: wrong gettext domain, unfortunately
<desrt> how do we deal with translations in gnome packages in ubuntu anyway?
<desrt> isn't there some launchpad stuff there that does.. something?
<seb128> desrt, launchpad has them and export
<desrt> so they're periodically synced upstream or vendor patch or what?
<seb128> desrt, dropping the gsd patch should be that hard
<RainCT> didrocks, mhr3: uploaded the new versions of zeitgeist and libzeitgeist to Debian (the first to experimental)
<seb128> desrt, that doesn't impact the wm
<desrt> so here's why i want new metacity (and the only reason, really): the translations for these strings are in there
<seb128> desrt, you "just" need to update gcc to write to gsettings for the multimedia keys and keep the gconf stuff for the wm ones
<didrocks> RainCT: thanks a lot! Will sync tomorrow :)
<mhr3> RainCT, datahub as well?
<seb128> desrt, but you already have the translations, precise is translated
<RainCT> mhr3: we have a new datahub?
<desrt> seb128: the issue is that maybe some strings changed
<RainCT> mhr3: we have a mailing list, you know? :P
<seb128> desrt, well if you don't change anything but add gsettings set call you are out of any ui change
<desrt> i think "Toggle window on all workspaces or one" is different wording than it used to be, for example
<desrt> true....
<desrt> so i could just do what i was going to do before
<desrt> but in the other direction instead
<seb128> desrt, and it allows you to drop the gsd patch
<seb128> since if you write the gsettings action keys you can drop the gsd part
<mhr3> RainCT, mailing list? you mean twitter? :P
<seb128> right
<desrt> these patches are so ugly :)
<seb128> yeah, we will drop them next cycle
<desrt> oh well -- i guess that's the bed we make for ourselves
<desrt> and now we have to lie in it
<desrt> at least for another 6 months
<seb128> right
<seb128> or another 2 months
<seb128> until we jump on q
<desrt> i have a local copy of g-c-c that i run without patches anyway
<seb128> is that called gnome3 ppa?
<desrt> no
<desrt> afaik they have the g-c-c patches?
<desrt> some of them are really necessary in order to not break the entire distro
<desrt> like the library patch
<seb128> desrt, oh, without any patch, I though you meant without the keybinding revert one
<desrt> ya... the vast majority of patches are annoying and pointless
<desrt> randomly changing the UI for no reason
<desrt> like switching the side of the images pane on the background panel
<seb128> desrt, I guess that will be fixed next cycle
<desrt> what will fix that?
 * desrt can imagine 3 possible answers to that question
<seb128> desrt, I want to make a ubuntu-control-center source
<seb128> and restore g-c-c as the upstream one
<jbicha> desrt: but putting it on the right makes it .1% better! I agree that Design should think a bit more about whether a diff with GNOME is worth it
<desrt> ah.  that's the answer i was hoping for :)
<seb128> the amonth of patching is suffisant that I think it's worth it
<desrt> you laughed at me when i suggested that at the rally :)
 * didrocks sneaks some more distro-patch to g-c-c meanwhile
<seb128> yeah, I didn't want to have to deal with that for this cycle
<seb128> didrocks, ;-)
<didrocks> phew, I wasn't thinking I would get to it that fast seeing the rate of ping I had! :)
<desrt> my g-c-c has 3 distropatches :)
<seb128> desrt, I want to also do it in a way where we can keep rebasing in a sane way
<jbicha> that would fix the keyboard shortcuts problem though, wouldn't it?
<seb128> jbicha, that wouldn't no
<seb128> but the shortcut problem will be fixed next cycle
<desrt> the revert-removal-of-datettime-mechanism will be fixed next cycle too =) =)
<seb128> desrt, yeah, one way or another
 * desrt has good feelings about that
<desrt> lennart is actually going out of his way to act friendly to help with the changes
<seb128> I'm staying out of init system discussions
<desrt> even offering some possibility for upstart backwards compatibility ideas
<seb128> I would prefer we don't change
<desrt> :)
<seb128> but not my call
<seb128> I would prefer people would let my init the way it is, it's working and I've no interest of changing it or of dealing with side effect of a migration
<seb128> ;-)
<desrt> seb128: do you write custom init scripts?
<seb128> desrt, no, but I maintain packages with init scripts
<desrt> ah.  true.
<desrt> well the good news about that is that probably upstream maintainers will start thinking about including systemd integration with their software
<seb128> desrt, and I know that any such transition has hiccups for users (counting me as an init user)
<desrt> so less of that work will fall on packagers
<desrt> seb128: so what's this a11y gsettings stuff?
<desrt> there are patches for it in g-c-c and g-s-d -- somewhere else as well?
<seb128> desrt, it's the visible bell stuff, that's handled by the wm
<seb128> those are tiny
<desrt> seb128: how do i deal with undesired source changes because automake decided to randomly rewrite some files?
<desrt> so far i've been doing it by saying dpkg-source --commit then poping the patch and removing it from the series
<seb128> desrt, what do you try to do
<desrt> seb128: debuild -S after building a binary....
<seb128> desrt, oh, I never do that
<seb128> well ideally the "clean" target brings you back the the original state
<seb128> but often that's buggy
<seb128> I tend to wipe the dir and dpkg-source -x .dsc
<seb128> to unpack
<desrt> not so good when you made changes you want to keep :)
<seb128> but nowadays I just work with debian dir in the vcs and bzr bd
<seb128> well usually I copy my updated patches back to the packaging vcs
<seb128> and when I'm happy I bzr bd --source
<seb128> in the vcs
<desrt> packaging is a dark art :)
<seb128> ;-)
<jalcine> It's possible to unlock a session in a programmatic manner, no?
<Sweetshark> micahg: k, openclipart successfully build with the debdiff from the patch.
<ajmitch> damn, I commented too late then
<desrt> ajmitch: hey.  what's up?
<chrisccoulson> wow, i can't believe how memory hungry chrome is these days - http://techsplurge.com/8147/firefox-11-vs-chrome-17-released-features-3d-page-view-chrome-bookmarks-import-extensive-tests/ ;)
<ajmitch> desrt: was just commenting on the openclipart bug about 2 minutes before sweetshark said it built
<ajmitch> & just swearing profusely at thunderbird using 3GB of RAM & making my desktop awfully slow :)
<micahg> Sweetshark: thanks
<mdeslaur> chrisccoulson: wow, that's impressive
<seb128> chrisccoulson, well, firefox 11 vs chrome 17, firefox is 6 versions behind... ;-)
<desrt> i love firefox
<desrt> and i love chrome for giving firefox the kick in the ass that it needed
<seb128> ;-)
<desrt> seb128: i HATE this patch
<chrisccoulson> seb128, you're one of these version number trolls, aren't you? :-)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, doh, you got me! ;-)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, well you have to reckon, if it's higher it has to be better
<chrisccoulson> lol
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I leart at school that 17 > 11
<seb128> learnt
<seb128> ;-)
<desrt> chrisccoulson: unfortunately, they couldn't quite get through to him on the issue of spelling
<chrisccoulson> lol
<seb128> who need writing when you got counting!
<desrt> seb128: *needs
<seb128> 16541 1351 1 61 64 616
<desrt> seb128: *you've
<seb128> 46 41 645 646
<chrisccoulson> and who needs counting when you've got 17?
<seb128> desrt, 152 :p
<seb128> (I can't believe it's only tuesday)
<desrt> ya.  seriously
<desrt> something about this week....
<seb128> desrt, just counted, 37 GNOME updates done by myself in 2 days
<seb128> I blame chrisccoulson for being busy on firefox, didrocks on unity, and pitti for loosing teeth
<desrt> seb128: 37 is a smaller number than the number of patches we have in g-c-c + g-s-d + metacity :p
 * desrt just tried to roll a new upstream metacity and apply our patches to it
<desrt> wanna guess how that went? :)
<seb128> desrt, it's a smaller number of patches than we have in g-c-c you mean?
<desrt> seb128: ya.  probably :)
<seb128> desrt, lol, I guess "not good"
<desrt> seb128: like 50% of them had conflicts
<desrt> plus we add a bunch of new gconf keys like some 'strict' mode from lamont
<seb128> desrt, that's one of the reasons I think we should stay on compiz
<desrt> i'd have to port all of those over to gsettings
<desrt> seb128: hm?
<seb128> desrt, not playing "use a GNOME component but distro patch it enough that it works for us"
<seb128> I would hate having mutter with a 35 patches stack
<seb128> so it "works for unity"
<desrt> seb128: just do the renaming trick
<desrt> metacity + clutter = mutter
<desrt> mutter + ubuntu patches = ... hm.... buck-futter?
<seb128> desrt, right, unitter
<seb128> lol
<seb128> but yeah, I just want to stop distro patching to no end stuff
<desrt> indeed
<seb128> better to just fork and rebase
<desrt> debian vendor patches are not the best form of VCS :)
<desrt> seb128: can you explain a bit of debian version numbers to me?
<desrt> what is the best practice for shipping a git version of an upstream?
<desrt> like if i wanted to make a metacity 2.34.3 package before it is released
<desrt> 2.34.3~git20120320-0ubuntu0 or something?
<seb128> desrt, yeah, that works
<seb128> usually <version>~something
<desrt> that will be "before" 2.34.3?
<seb128> there are 2 "schools"
<seb128> yes, ~ is "just before"
 * desrt sits down for a lesson
<seb128> well some people do 2.34.2+git
<desrt> the other way is to do 2.34.2+git?
<desrt> right...
 * desrt is doing .3 because that's what's in configure.ac already (due to post-release bumping)
<desrt> """The lexical comparison is a comparison of ASCII values modified so that all the letters sort earlier than all the non-letters and so that a tilde sorts before anything, even the end of a part."""
<desrt> good to know.
<seb128> desrt, dpkg --compare-versions v1 gt v2; echo $?
<seb128> desrt, is your friend
<desrt> these rules are my friend, really
<desrt> that one sentence tells you all you need to know
<desrt> i guess it's actually not true, though
<desrt> a simple ascii compare would sort 1.10 before 1.2
<desrt> ah.  next paragraph explains that :)
<seb128> desrt, I think you will have an hard time to find stuff in there not correctly laid out
<desrt> ya.   nothing says "obsessive compulsive obsession with order" like the letters 'DD'
<seb128> the Debian documentation is usually quite rigorous
<seb128> ;-)
<jbicha> desrt: looks like metacity 2.34.3 is out now
<jasoncwarner_> hey TheMuso RAOF bryceh https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2012-03-20 if anything to discuss, please put in the agenda. Otherwise, fill in your updates and we are good to go...
<TheMuso> Done.
<TheMuso> I tend to try and get it done before meeting time.
<bryceh> jasoncwarner_, heya.  my stuff's filled in.  no agenda topics.
 * Sweetshark waves at jasoncwarner_ at the other end of the world.
<jasoncwarner_> evening Sweetshark !
<jasoncwarner_> thanks bryceh
<RAOF> Evening Sweetshark :)
<desrt> jbicha: ah.  great news.
<Sweetshark> bryceh: btw, 3.5.1-1ubuntu1 is in now. even if you didnt end up with the upload, thank you very much for the help and support ;)
<Sweetshark> RAOF: hi there (must be day on the other side of the globe -- everyone there is awake ;) )
<Sweetshark> jasoncwarner_: I booked and registered UDS btw.
<bryceh> Sweetshark, sure thing, glad it got sorted
 * Sweetshark starts a armel build on a porter box
 * Sweetshark is feeling a bit sardistic towards the porter box today.
<RAOF> A LO build on the porter box?  That'll be done this time next week? :)
<micahg> RAOF: it's a panda now :)
<desrt> RAOF: ya... shouldn't take longer than 3 or 4 days.  didn't you know?
<Sweetshark> RAOF: The last time I tried that the build was interrupted by ~3 reboots. Likely someone considered the box "unresponsive" (ummm, yeah?) and applied the 3R rule of windows administration: retry, reboot, reinstall ...
<robert_ancell> RAOF, is everyone saying the greeter->session transition is now working just a coincidence?  That patch hasn't been released yet?!
<RAOF> :)
<RAOF> robert_ancell: No, I also uploaded a new unity-greeter with the patch applied.
<robert_ancell> oh, good
<RAOF> On the basis that it seemed like a good idea :)
<robert_ancell> RAOF, but not applied to lp:~ubuntu-desktop/unity-greeter/ubuntu?
<RAOF> robert_ancell: The last *two* uploads aren't in lp:~ubuntu-desktop/unity-greeter/ubuntu.
<RAOF> I'm not sure why, so I didn't touchit.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, so you made it more out of date :P
<TheMuso> VCs for packaging is not going to work unless we switch wholesale.
<RAOF> Or use the udd package branches.
 * RAOF much prefers full source branches.
<TheMuso> Yes, use the UDD branches, but nothing else.
<TheMuso> s/but/and/
<TheMuso> But of course there are those packages in debian maintained in git... and so it goes again.
<RAOF> All that they need is for quilt to die, and 3.0 (bzr) to become our standard source format :)
<TheMuso> heh
<mterry> desrt, heyo.  So how bad/difficult is having a sudo process talk to a user's session dbus?
<desrt> mterry: i wouldn't recommend it
<desrt> mterry: why do you ask?
<desrt> something to do with a screensaver?
<mterry> desrt, deja-dup sometimes will run duplicity under sudo, but ideally would pass gio URLs to it
<mterry> desrt, I can pass gvfs fuse paths, but that is always a bit buggy
<desrt> presumably it runs as root in order to gain access to some files that it wouldn't normally have access to
<mterry> right
<desrt> oh
<mterry> for restoring purposes
<desrt> and the gvfs path is presumably the destination...
<desrt> that's really tricky.
<mterry> desrt, in these cases, the source, and is restoring into non-home directories
<desrt> you could try setting the session bus environment variable on the other side of the sudo
<desrt> but that would interact badly with dconf, for example (which i assume duplicity doesn't use)
<mterry> desrt, I tried sudo -E  (preserve env) but dbus_bus_get returns NULL
<mterry> desrt, only if gio ends up using it client side
<seb128> bah, bug #929437 is annoying
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 929437 in software-center "gvfsd-http crashed with SIGSEGV in __nscd_get_mapping()" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/929437
 * desrt wonders why builders bother uninstalling packages from the pbuilder root instead of just blowing it away
<lifeless> desrt: lp-buildd, patches appreciated
<desrt> seb128: i think your glib trigger scripts are broken :/
<desrt> seb128: not very serious breakage... but with the recent changes in gio-querymodules to please automake by removing the cache file on an empty directory, we see this turning up in build logs: Unable to open directory /usr/lib/gio/modules: Error opening directory '/usr/lib/gio/modules': No such file or directory
 * micahg would think that's more related to not checking the multiarch path
<desrt> oh.  that's quite possible as well
 * desrt just assumed that it was caused by a more recent change
<micahg> /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/gio/modules
<seb128> desrt, that's only a warning
<desrt> i know
<seb128> desrt, we kept the old path listed and a || true iirc
<seb128> just for compat reason
<desrt> to cleanup leftovers just in case?
<desrt> fair enough
<seb128> but thanks for pointing it ;-)p
<seb128> ;-)
 * desrt saw it at the bottom of a failed build log and assumed it was the cause of the failure
<desrt> then i scrolled up...
<thumper> Ursinha: ping
<Ursinha> thumper, pong
<thumper> Ursinha: I was just calculating time zones wondering if you'd still be around
<thumper> Ursinha: can you see bug 953963 ?
<Ursinha> sure
<thumper> Ursinha: it is a private bug that others are being made dupes of
<thumper> Ursinha: hard to fix if I can't see it :)
<Ursinha> haha okay
<Ursinha> thumper, I subscribed you, if you feel the info there can be deleted/disclosed just make it public
<thumper> Ursinha: thanks
<Ursinha> thumper, np
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-03-21
<orionsonofneptun> hey
<orionsonofneptun> channel is dead
<bryceh> orionsonofneptun, desrt probably went to bed ;-)
<orionsonofneptun> hmm no late nighters here
<desrt> bryceh: eh?
<orionsonofneptun> try #techtalk101
<TheMuso> It is still day time for some, a work day for many, and those who work on Ubuntu in this timezone tend to be busy with things that don't require chatter on IRC. :)
<TheMuso> bryceh, RAOF, have either of you seen bug 959928? If so, can I consider it under review/taken care of? If not, who would like to be subscribed?
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 959928 in xorg-server "Driver fallback for ARM loads the vendor driver twice and gets invalidated with the error" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/959928
<TheMuso> I'd consider sponsoring, but you guys know the code better, and there is the git repo in Debian to be updated... :)
<RAOF> TheMuso: I can handle that if you're patch-piloting.
<TheMuso> I am patch piloting.
<RAOF> It looks correct to me.
<TheMuso> Ok cool.
<TheMuso> RAOF: So do you want me to do anything with that?
<RAOF> I'll handle it.
<Guest22703> cyphermox: do you have an opinion on https://code.launchpad.net/~tkluck/ubuntu/precise/gnome-shell/lp883443/+merge/98471
<cyphermox> yes.
<jbicha> ah, that's better, good evening cyphermox
<TheMuso> RAOF: Thanks.
<cyphermox> Guest72586: ah, hey
<cyphermox> so, I do have an opinion, not sure what it is yet.
<TheMuso> jbicha_: I just threw a gnome-shell sponsorship request your way, if you could have a look at it, that would be much appreciated.
<jbicha_> TheMuso: and I just deferred it to cyphermox :)
<TheMuso> jbicha_: heh ok. :)
<cyphermox> it's unclear to me that this is really needed. I certainly don't recall the network disconnected notification to be any special
<cyphermox> although if it's not disappearing there's definitely an issue
<cyphermox> jbicha_: TheMuso: I'll look at it in a minute, just trying to get a weird IP address check right
<jbicha_> I believe it disappears if you click it or something, I'm running Unity this week for Docs
<cyphermox> right, I haven't loaded up shell in a while but planned to today
<TheMuso> No hurry, I just referred to you guys during my pilot session.
<cyphermox> ok
<cyphermox> let it be on record that I truly hate manually converting ip address structs to strings ;)
<TheMuso> heh
<jalcine> lol
<orionsonofneptun> anyone here
<orionsonofneptun> hey top
<orionsonofneptun> try #techtalk101
<didrocks> good morning
<desrt> didrocks: hello!
<didrocks> desrt: hey ;) kind of late for you!
<desrt> indeed
<didrocks> still on this g-c-c/g-s-d stuff? :)
<desrt> it would be a lot easier if you'd upgrade metacity =)
<kenvandine> good morning didrocks
<didrocks> hey kenvandine ;)
<desrt> kenvandine: late, isn't it? :)
<kenvandine> desrt, don't remind me :)
<desrt> didrocks: why gtk_range_get_event_window()?
<kenvandine> hehe... mterry said "This yak is big" is a merge proposal
<didrocks> desrt: missing context :)
<desrt> didrocks: you added a vendor patch to gtk
<desrt> no explanation, no upstream bug link
<didrocks> is it really me? /me looks :)
<desrt> 075_expose_gdkwidget_for_gtkrange.patch
<desrt> From: Didier Roche <didrocks@ubuntu.com>
<desrt> Date: Fri, 8 Oct 2010 18:54:44 +0200
<didrocks> yeah, it's a patch from Cody I guess
<didrocks> oh I remember now
<didrocks> desrt: hey ;) kind of late for you!https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=631695
<ubot2`> Gnome bug 631695 in gtk "[GSEAL] no API to get event_window from GtkRange" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<didrocks> see the bug above  ^
<didrocks> there is a bug linked, which has the upstream link :p
<didrocks> I did this in the gtk2 -> gtk3 transition for hooking again ido
<didrocks> http://bugzilla-attachments.gnome.org/attachment.cgi?id=171960
<didrocks> for the git-format patch
<pitti> Good morning
<ricotz> pitti, good morning
<ricotz> pitti, i hope you are feeling better?
<pitti> slightly, thanks; the fever is gone
<pitti> still feeling a bit weak
<ricotz> sounds promising though
<ricotz> so take it easy today
<didrocks> good morning pitti
<didrocks> happy that you are feeling better, take it easy for today :)
<pitti> bonjour didrocks
<pitti> didrocks: merci :)
<didrocks> de rien :)
<rickspencer3> didrocks, I seem to recall that you had a schedule somewhere for when unity versions would land?
<rickspencer3> if so, could you please paste me a link when you get a free moment?
<didrocks> rickspencer3: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Unity/ReleaseSchedule
<didrocks> the 5.10 release is not set yet on the schedule
<didrocks> (and maybe a 5.12 depending on how 5.8 goes)
<rickspencer3> thanks didrocks
<didrocks> yw :)
<rickspencer3> didrocks, so, a release is due this week?
<rickspencer3> are you getting ample support for testing it?
<didrocks> rickspencer3: well, there are still branches that are to be delivered
<didrocks> despite some emails from Monday asking for getting things in/reviewed
<rickspencer3> so it may not make beta 2 freeze?
<didrocks> and upstream tests done
<didrocks> so I guess we can't crowdsource the testing
<rickspencer3> I think it means that we can't test it, unless we get an exception for beta 2 freeze
<didrocks> and I'm trying to get some dx people to help testing then
<didrocks> to still be on time
<didrocks> but right now, I don't get a lot of answersâ¦
<tkamppeter> pitti, hi
<pitti> hello tkamppeter
<tkamppeter> pitti, I have done Ubuntu-only uploads of cups and cups-filters yesterday, but now I need cups-filters 1.0.7 (ready on BZR) to be uploaded to Debian as on the #ghostscript channel a Debian user showed up and needs to debug a problem. 1.0.7 contains a debug mode which we need.
<pitti> tkamppeter: sure, can upload it
<tkamppeter> pitti, OK, thanks.
<rickspencer3> is anybody else finding the overlay scrollbars to be jankier than usual in 12.04 these days?
<rickspencer3> I assume it's track pad related
<pitti> sometimes I find them a bit erratic, but I can't put my finger on what exactly
<pitti> tkamppeter: uploaded, synced
<pitti> didrocks: gnome-themes-standard wasn't syncable?
<tkamppeter> pitti, thanks.
<pitti> didrocks: and gnome-system-monitor not mergeable?
<didrocks> pitti: we weren't in sync for gnome-themes-standard, so I didn't really look TBH
<pitti> ah, I expect that Debian's 3.3.92-1 shouldn't be much different from our's
<didrocks> and same for g-s-t
<didrocks> shouldn't, yeah
<didrocks> i can have a look later today
<pitti> g-s-t probaly has a lp-i patch (thus merge)
<didrocks> I tried to get the max update I could do in the morning before the pingy machine is back
<didrocks> (which is the case now)
<seb128> hey
<pitti> bonjour seb128, ca va?
<seb128> oh, a pitti!
<pitti> seb128: great work on 3.3.92!
<seb128> pitti, hey, ca va bien ! what about you ?
<seb128> pitti, didrocks: thanks for dealing with the remaining updates
<pitti> seb128: you are way off on the bug counter now :) great work
<pitti> seb128: the fever is gone, so I'm back
<seb128> pitti, great
<pitti> doing a few updates ATM
<thumper> pitti: I'm pleased you are feeling better
<seb128> pitti, bug counter: yeah, I collect some GNOME 3.3.92 extra points, though I would have happily shared some of the 40 updates I did in 2 days and the attached bugs
<seb128> collected
<seb128> well, at least it's mostly done now ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: yw ;) salut!
<seb128> lut didrocks
<pitti> seb128: yeah, sorry :/ bad infection
<pitti> seb128: my teeth are relatively fine, I guess I caught an infection during the operation or so
<pitti> I updated the pad for the things I'm working on
<seb128> pitti, nothing to be sorry about, I'm glad your fever is gone, the infection probably tamed down
 * seb128 hugs pitti
 * pitti hugs back seb128
<pitti> seb128: hm, did you remove gedit-plugins from the pad?
<pitti> or was that me, accidentally?
<seb128> pitti, yes, I saw that "Andrew Starr-Bochicchio" did it this night on -changes
<seb128> cheese as well
<pitti> hm, we have 3.2.2
<seb128> pitti, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/precise/+source/gedit-plugins/3.3.4-0ubuntu1
<pitti> err, sorry, that was eog-plugins
<seb128> ?
<pitti> nevermind me
<seb128> pitti, ok, all good, eog-plugins is still to do
<pitti> seb128: I just did that one
<seb128> gedit-plugins could also probably be done in debian and synced I think
<pitti> gedit itself isn't in experimental yet
<seb128> but well we have the current version now so we can wait as well
<seb128> pitti, oh ok, so yeah, let's wait
<pitti> I'll grab some more
<seb128> pitti, btw we can probably delete gnome-utils from the archive now
<seb128> we got the remaining standalone components yesterday
<seb128> didrocks, the zg updates are published in Debian if you want to sync them
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, I'll do that in a few, still on the morning discussion pre-unity preparation
<seb128> didrocks, no hury
<seb128> pitti, ok, I reviewed version and put a few extra side updates on the pad but I think we covered all the important updates, those are bonus
<pitti> seb128: there is the gnome-utils binary package, and g-u-common
<seb128> pitti, -common is deprecated, libgdict-common conflicts with it
<pitti> seb128: don't we need a transitional gnome-utils package for upgrades?
<seb128> pitti, do we care about the dummy gnome-utils for updates?
<seb128> ok
<seb128> I will fix gnome-utils to drop the other binaries and keep the dummy for this cycle then
<seb128> we can drop it after the lts
<pitti> seb128: I'm not sure; but if lucid doesn't have all the split out binary packages, we do
<seb128> pitti, it doesn't
<pitti> seb128: ah, it doesn't, so we need it, yes
<seb128> so yeah, let's do that
<seb128> I will drop the remaining binaries and keep the transitional one, then we can drop it when q opens
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson, how are you?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, not too bad thanks. how are you?
<didrocks> good morning chrisccoulson
<seb128> I'm good thanks
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson
<chrisccoulson> hi pitti, didrocks
<didrocks> pitti: can you have a look at bugs #921506 and bug #960498 please?
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 921506 in unity "[FFe, UIFe] HUD - The HUD does not respect launcher autohide or icon size settings" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/921506
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 960498 in activity-log-manager "[UIFe] Blacklisted special folder icons (from nautilus). Upload activity-log-manager 0.9.4" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/960498
<didrocks> they are already approved by the doc team
<pitti> didrocks: done
<didrocks> thanks pitti
<pitti> seb128: hm, do you happen to know about bug 106995 ?
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 106995 in vte "gnome-terminal unconditionally interprets mouse wheel events" [Low,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/106995
<pitti> seb128: vte3 has a patch which adds a new property for this
<pitti> but the patch doesn't do anything by itself
<seb128> pitti, no, first time I read about it sorry
<pitti> something like gnome-terminal actually needs to call the new function (set alternate scroll)
<pitti> and the bug still seems to be present
<pitti> I'm inclined to just drop the patch
<pitti> seb128: ok
<seb128> pitti, dropping the patch works for me
<pitti> it's the only remaining delta with Debian exp, I merged the rest
<Sweetshark> pitti: I am out of ideas for bug 958586. there is a "|| true" there now: http://anonscm.debian.org/gitweb/?p=pkg-openoffice/libreoffice.git;a=blob;f=libreoffice-common.postinst.in;h=e3e776da172964a26e7379da2f7895f860657787;hb=f621e552267e31081641ade7976165a89a1d9ead, but it still fails.
<seb128> drop it! ;-)
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 958586 in libreoffice "package libreoffice-common 1:3.4.4-0ubuntu1 [modified: usr/share/doc/libreoffice-common/copyright] failed to install/upgrade: ErrorMessage: Unterprozess installiertes post-installation-Skript gab den Fehlerwert 134 zurÃ¼ck (dup-of: 916291)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/958586
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 916291 in libreoffice "failed to upgrade from Oneiric to Precise: ERROR: Cannot determine language! - exit status 134" [Critical,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/916291
<Sweetshark> pitti: I not getting what in the world of dpkg actually triggers the $WHATEVER that fails there ...
<seb128> pitti, stupid retracer env question, what do I need to do to be able to run the scripts again?
<pitti> seb128: PYTHONPATH=apport  I guess
<seb128> pitti, that's not enough, I get launchpadlib.errors still missing
<pitti> seb128: dchroot into oneiric
<seb128> pitti, that did it, thanks
<pitti> Sweetshark: hm, no offhand idea right now; need to look into this further, but need to run to doctor appointment in 5 mins
<pitti> so, see you later!
<seb128> didrocks, pitti, chrisccoulson: retracers bugs with the most dups since the 03/10: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/893397/
<seb128> just a piece of info
<didrocks> thanks seb128
<seb128> the first column is the number of dups
<chrisccoulson> thanks!
<seb128> pitti, you won bug #948663
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 948663 in udisks "udisks-daemon crashed with signal 5 in g_closure_invoke()" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/948663
<seb128> pitti, (trying to get the most frequent segfault assigned)
<seb128> bryceh, RAOF: bug #943880 still get daily duplicates
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 943880 in xorg-server "Xorg crashed with SIGABRT in __libc_message() from XIDestroyDeviceProperty" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/943880
<seb128> I set back it back from incomplete to new
<Sweetshark> pitti: k, thanks.
<mpt> Is gnome-utils-common supposed to be removed by updates?
<seb128> mpt, yes
<mpt> thanks :-)
<seb128> mpt, yw
<seb128> mpt, each gnome-utils component has its own source now so the bundle "gnome-utils" is deprecated
<seb128> you will get gnome-dictionary, etc instead
<mpt> excellent
<mpt> Each split like that avoids a strange "These things will be removed as well" dialog when you try to uninstall part of the bundle in Ubuntu Software Center :-)
<seb128> hehe
<pitti> seb128: bug stats> merci
<seb128> pitti, de rien ;-)
<pitti> will look at the udisks ones
<pitti> vte3 upstream FTBFS with separate build tree, argh; /me fixes
<pitti> nice, seems we are in sync with quite a lot of gnome packages again
<seb128> indeed
<seb128> we can probably increase the syncs after precise
<seb128> some are good to sync but debian multiarched them
<seb128> or it's a bit late to multiarch libs now in precise
<pitti> is it?
<seb128> well, I leaned toward being conservative
<pitti> I thought at this point it's "catch as much as we can", as long as it's not something more complicated lice multi-arched plugin paths
<seb128> but maybe that's not needed ;-)
<seb128> like vala-0.16 could be synced I think
<pitti> we get a lot of "plz multiarch this" from canonical as well
<seb128> or gtksourceview3 got multiarched in debian
<seb128> pitti, ok, I will try to have a look to the few of those I skipped then ;-)
<pitti> didrocks: want me to grab the gnome-themes-standard update from you? I'd do it in debian and sync
<didrocks> pitti: sure, please go ahead ;)
<seb128> pitti, re themes, Debian doesn't put the a11y themes in a different binary IIRC
<pitti> ah, ok
<pitti> will update in Debian and merge then
<seb128> maybe they would be wanting to do it
<seb128> though I guess in that case they would have the standard theme depends on a11y which would still be a diff
<pitti> asking on #debian-gnome
<pitti> it would make our delta much smaller
<pitti>  gnome-accessibility-themes | 2.30.2-1 | sid     | all
<pitti> and also would fix this
<pitti> seb128: but I see nothing wrong with gnome-themes-standard recommending or depending on gnome-accessibility-themes
<seb128> pitti, right, sorry, it's the other way around for us, we just pull in -a11y
<seb128> so that would work
<xclaesse> I was wondering if ubuntu precise already has the needed stuff to run gnome-shell with software opengl?
<xclaesse> to run on qemu for example
<pitti> xclaesse: it should
<pitti> xclaesse: unity-3d runs in kvm
<pitti> xclaesse: that's the LLVM pipe renderer in mesa
<xclaesse> nice
<jibel> with latest updates, comments in desktop files are displayed in the label of desktop icons. Is it expected or a known bug ?
<jibel> for example on a live session the install icon is labeled "Install Ubuntu 12.04 LTS Install this system permanently on your hard drive"
<seb128> jibel, known bug
<jibel> seb128, bug number ?
<seb128> jibel, dunno, I saw it being discussed on #nautilus yesterday
<jibel> seb128, I'll search lp
<seb128> where upstream was part of the discussion
<jibel> thanks
<seb128> jibel, yw
<asac> seb128: didrocks: just to confirm how happy i am that i have ctrl+alt back: the keyboard I bought one week ago doesnt have a windows key at all ... fun
<seb128> asac, ;-)
<didrocks> heh ;)
<asac> http://www.cherrycorp.com/english/keyboards/Industrial/4100/index.htm
<asac> and no, i didnt even think about checking whether it had such a key
<asac> Features: "Optional âNon-Windowsâ Key Layout" ... seems i got one of those :)
<asac> while i am here ... any bustage in the archive atm? /me types dist-upgrade
<mterry> I feel like we ended up taking more of GNOME 3.4 this cycle than I thought we would
<kenvandine> good morning mterry
<kenvandine> mterry, your merge proposal, even though it is marked as a work in progress do you still want a review?
 * kenvandine loved the  comment on it..  "This yak is big" :-D
<seb128> lol
<mterry> kenvandine, sure, I think this is the solution I'll end up using.  The remaining issue is that while you will correctly not get prompted for root password, you will also not get notified about failure to restore files that need root permission (so you'll get a false positive restore, which is bad).  Working on that bit, but if you could review the branch as is, would be helpful, yeah  :)
<seb128> hey kenvandine, mterry
<kenvandine> mterry, will do
<mterry> kenvandine, if you loved my verbose comments in unity-greeter, you'll love this branch
<kenvandine> i noticed already :)
<mterry> seb128, hello!
<kenvandine> you wrote a book in there :)
<mterry> kenvandine, all for "needs_root = false"  :)
<kenvandine> hehe
<desrt> mterry: MOAR!!!
<ricotz> seb128, hi, do you like to see a gnome-session update?
<desrt> mterry: see? :)
<seb128> ricotz, hi, why?
<desrt> ricotz: great timing, btw :)
<seb128> ricotz, there was no interesting change this cycle iirc
<mterry> desrt, was that your yak impression?  :)
<desrt> mterry: in response to <mterry> I feel like we ended up taking more of GNOME 3.4 this cycle than I thought we would
<ricotz> seb128, i see, so no risky changes in you opinion then?
<desrt> just as ricotz asks for a gnome-session bump :)
<ricotz> seb128, while it is part of 3.4 ;)
<ricotz> desrt, you were about to ask this too?
<ricotz> ;)
<mterry> ah yes.  :)  I wanted to stay on 3.2.  Hell, I wouldn't have minded backsliding to 3.2!  I like known bugs
<mterry> I mean backsliding to 3.0
<desrt> mterry: there is a very long tradition of me (and others) abusing seb to take newer versions than he wanted to at the start of the cycle
<mterry> desrt, the man is too trusting
<desrt> mterry: there's no trust being violated.  he knows it will happen.  :)
<seb128> ricotz, I see no benefit either
<desrt> mterry: (you're witnessing the pushback phase)
 * mterry brings out popcorn
<seb128> lol
<desrt> seb128: come on... you were the one telling me yesterday about numbers
<desrt> 3.4 > 3.2
<desrt> "GREATER than"
<desrt> mterry: (irrefutable quasi-logic phase)
<seb128> desrt, well, that works for decent softwares
<seb128> GNOME doesn't count stability, they count bugs though
<desrt> mterry: (friendly barbs phase)
<seb128> so > means buggier ;-)
<desrt> seb128: don't you trust ricotz?
 * mterry wants GNOME to hurry up and become an actual OS so it will have LTS cycles
<desrt> i mean... has he ever done anything to hurt you?
<seb128> desrt, lol
<seb128> desrt, fix your HUD bugs instead of trolling :p
<desrt> looks like some nice bugfixes/features in here
<desrt> like a new gnome.fallback kernel commandline parameter
<ricotz> seb128, does this mean you would take a look at a debdiff?
<seb128> ricotz, file a ffe with a rational and subscribe release-team
<davmor2> desrt: isn't gnomes.fallback kernel likely to be the hurd do we really want to go there? :D
<seb128> ricotz, I don't see a point for the update, last time I looked at it there was only commits for systemd support and that introduced regressions
<seb128> it seems like work and regression potential for 0 use
<desrt> davmor2: no... i think it's so you can boot your system with gnome.fallback=1 on the commandline and get 2D
<desrt> useful of 3D will crash your machine
<desrt> *if
<desrt> seb128: you're actually right on this one, though
<ricotz> seb128, ok, i will just push it gnome3 ppa then
<desrt> there are some very very minor additions here other than the systemd stuff
<seb128> ricotz, why? what's the point?
<desrt> and obviously the systemd stuff is no benefit to us, but some risk
<ricotz> desrt, hmm
<seb128> ricotz, does anyone cares about systemd support in the GNOME3 ppa? it's not like that was the only bit missing for systemd support in Ubuntu
<seb128> I doubt mean lts users will want to switch their system to systemd
<seb128> they would to enable systemd support in a bunch of GNOME tarballs where we didn't turn it on as well
<desrt> seb128: i suspect this question will become far more interesting next cycle
<seb128> desrt, right, I'm happy to update gnome-session next cycle ;-)
<seb128> I just don't see what we have to win to do it now
 * desrt expects an early PPA with systemd in it
<desrt> (one way or the other)
<desrt> seb128: btw: can you drop 061_multiarch_module_fallback.patch in gtk?
<ricotz> seb128, alright, you made your point clear
<seb128> desrt, you got pinged by olli for meeting in case you don't read other channels
<seb128> desrt, let me check, I guess so
<seb128> ricotz, ;-)
<ricotz> seb128, this is more for good measure to have it updated and getting tested to gnome3 ppa seems reasonable
<seb128> ricotz, ok, your call
<jbicha_> I'm sure there's a dozen people that want systemd in Ubuntu
<seb128> I doubt users are really interested in it
<jbicha_> good morning
<seb128> hey jbicha_, how are you?
<seb128> desrt, read me
<seb128> desrt, ok, good, you replied ;-)
<ricotz> seb128, pushed. let the user complains come ;)
<seb128> ;-)
<ricotz> seb128, g-k seems to run fairly well too, besides xclaesse' issue
<seb128> ricotz, yeah, we decided that one was too risky weeks ago
<ricotz> i know
<ricotz> seb128, wayland can come now :P
<seb128> lol
<seb128> desrt, bug #960757, https://launchpadlibrarian.net/97677128/Stacktrace.txt ... does it seems like a gio issue or a program issue to you?
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 960757 in whoopsie-daisy "whoopsie crashed with SIGSEGV in g_object_newv()" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/960757
<desrt> this stacktrace is giving me deja vu
<desrt> i think i had that turning up in valgrind at some point
<seb128> desrt, you have a lot of deja vu recently ;-)
<desrt> but i looked at the code and decided that it couldn't possibly be a problem
<desrt> let me look again
<seb128> desrt, thanks
<desrt> so this is not the same bug
<desrt> the one i saw was a few lines down
<desrt> but it was another case of a crash inside GString as called by the default log handler
<desrt> seb128: my verdict here is memory corruption
<desrt> seb128: g_slice_alloc() is returning some bullshit
<seb128> desrt, ok, thanks for looking at it, I transmitted the comment to ev on #ubuntu-devel
<seb128> desrt, so, how is your gsd overrides stuff working
<seb128> desrt, should "gsettings set': gsettings set org.gnome.settings-daemon.plugins.xsettings  overrides "{ 'Gtk/ShellShowsAppMenu': < 1 >}"" do something?
<desrt> yes
<desrt> it should hide the menus, even if unity is not running
<desrt> then <0> should show them, even if unity _is_ running
<seb128> desrt, 0 doesn't show them under unity
<desrt> oh
<seb128> but maybe it's the appmenu-gtk stuff kicking in?
<desrt> sorry -- the gtk dbusmenu patch uses the ShellShowsMenubar property, rather
<desrt> AppMenu is only for GMenuModel apps
<seb128> desrt, same difference
<seb128> gsettings set org.gnome.settings-daemon.plugins.xsettings  overrides "{ 'Gtk/ShellShowsMenuBar': < 0 >}"
<seb128> or < 1 >
<seb128> -> no difference
<desrt> so that's worrying.
<desrt> no it's not :p
<desrt> Menubar
<desrt> not MenuBar
<seb128> desrt, doh, that works
<seb128> thanks ;-)
<desrt> no worries
<desrt> glad you're enjoying the patch =)
<seb128> ;-)
<desrt> the logic is that the property represents if the _shell_ shows the menubar
<desrt> ie: if the shell shows it, there is no need for the app to do so
<desrt> so you force the menu shown in the app by telling "the shell is not showing it"
<desrt> (0)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: around?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, yeah
<chrisccoulson> although, starting to feel like i want to hang myself ;)
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: it's just been confirmed to be in 5.6 as well, but can you try to reproduce: https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/961338
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 961338 in unity "Filters not working" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, yeah, i get that here
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: ok, thanks for confirming
<pitti> good night everyone!
<bcurtiswx> night pitti
<seb128> 'night pitti
 * didrocks waves good night
<bcurtiswx> g'night didrocks
<didrocks> bye bcurtiswx ;)
<jbicha_> seb128: is the Epiphany quicklist proposal too late for Precise?
<seb128> jbicha_, we said we wouldn't take those for universe since they can't be translated
<seb128> jbicha_, we don't have rosetta, langpacks for universe
<seb128> grrr, I can't believe it's 2012 and I can't close my docked laptop lid without having my laptop to hang
<jbicha_> seb128: that's what I thought
<jbicha_> seb128: should we disable suspend by default too? ;)
<seb128> it's docked with an external screen, it was not going to suspend
<seb128> it was "just" a xrandr call
<seb128> we should maybe disable resolution changes ;-)
<topyli> speaking of epiphany, i often am unable to select text, or maybe it ignores my mouse altogether
<topyli> i have no idea how to report this bug. "epiphany does not work" :)
<seb128> "use firefox" ;-)
<topyli> i am :)
<seb128> desrt, can you maybe help to debug bug #961442 by asking some questions?
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 961442 in unity "hud-service uses too much CPU time" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/961442
<topyli> but epiphany is pretty damn wonderful in this new incarnation of gnome
<seb128> topyli, well, I wouldn't use epiphany as my web browser in any case seeing how often webkit-gtk gets security updates
<topyli> yes it is a bit sad
<micahg>  seb128: that will be fixed soon hopefully :)
<seb128> micahg, that would be great ;-)
<dobey> micahg: it will start just releasing new major versions every few weeks too, and we'll backport them to all versions of ubuntu? :)
<topyli> heh
<topyli> sounds like a plan!
<dobey> hrmm, so epiphany does indeed not work
<dobey> why is that
<micahg> dobey: that doesn't work easily when something has a lot of reverse dependencies :)
<topyli> no idea. i suspect it's webkit
<dobey> topyli: why do you suspect that?
<jbicha_> it works here, but I'm running 3.3.92 which I just uploaded
<jbicha_> not sure if 3.3.91 stopped working or not
<dobey> jbicha_: whatever version i have installed isn't opening a window
<topyli> dobey: just because it's the content, not the chrome that's broken. i'm not going to try and claim i know anything, it's just a feeling :)
<dobey> topyli: well, rhythmbox is working fine
<topyli> it is
<dobey> and it's using the same webkit as epiphany
<topyli> i didn't know rhythmbox had something to do with webkit
<dobey> some of the extensions use it
<topyli> well, the stores and stuff
<dobey> the ubuntu one store looks fine to me
<cyphermox> desrt: hey
<cyphermox> desrt: have an opinion on https://code.launchpad.net/~tkluck/ubuntu/precise/gnome-shell/lp883443/+merge/98471 ?
<jbicha_> ooh, wow, Google services look bad, it's got the Chromium-style scrollbar & the Ubuntu overlay scrollbar
<cyphermox> seems to me like fine, but I use gnome-shell about once a month, and don't know much about the design decisions for notifications there. I'm hoping you know more about that than I do
<dobey> jbicha_: in epiphany?
<topyli> looks like epiphany works fine when you first open a page, and maybe the next one. along the way it loses touch with your pointer somehow. it's very weird
<topyli> i'm on an old macbook, dunno how the hardware affects this
<mterry> oh haha
<mterry> I thought B2 was tomorrow, but it's just the freeze.   Things make a lot more sense now
<seb128> mterry, crawl back from under your rock :p
<mterry> seb128, I was fixing unity-greeter crashes!  some thanks...  :)
<seb128> mterry, oh, I assigned you one today!
<mterry> that's the one
<seb128> mterry, you are going to blame it on me right?
<seb128> rrrrrright
<seb128> ;-)
<mterry> yeah, my branch just says "if (username == seb128) return;"
<mterry> "no more bugs from him!"
<seb128> we need to start translating variable to make those hacks harder for you americans :p
<jalcine> Is anyone willing to help me test a speech-related application? It's at https://launchpad.net/speechcontrol.
<kenvandine> seb128, valac is in NEW, can you help move it along?
<kenvandine> breaking my builds now
<broder> is anybody looking at the vte termcap handling regression?
<seb128> kenvandine, done
<kenvandine> seb128, thx
<seb128> yw
<thumper> hi seb128 :)
<jbicha_> broder: did you restart your terminal?
<thumper> start of another day
<broder> jbicha_: i opened new ones
<seb128> thumper, hey
<broder> jbicha_: do i need to kill them all off?
<jbicha_> broder: that worked for me
<broder> jbicha_: that makes sense. it looks like vte switched from shipping the termcap info in a file to shipping it embedded in the binary
<broder> at least, that's my best interpretation of the diff
<broder> much better. thanks for confirming my suspicions :)
<thumper> hi people
<thumper> I was wanting to upgrade my oneiric server
<thumper> but it has got itself into a bit of a state
<thumper> need to apt-get -f install
<thumper> but that says it is failing due to...
<thumper> unable to securely remove '/usrsrc/linux-headers...': Read-only file system
<thumper> eh?
<thumper> not sure where to go from here
<JanC> remount filesystem r/w?
<thumper> how can I easily tell how it is mounted?
<thumper> I haven't done anything different from when this last worked
<thumper> why would something suddenly become read only?
<thumper> for me /usr is part of /
<thumper> how can I tell how it is mounted? read-only or otherwise?
<JanC> maybe check dmesg/syslog for an error why it got mounted ro
<JanC> also, you better ask #ubuntu for support...
<JanC> or #ubuntu+1
<thumper> ok
<dupondje> Its a known bug that titlebar/icons are broken on Gnome3 ? :)
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-03-22
<jbicha> desrt: the gmenus in Unity are very nice \o/
<TheMuso> jbicha: What apps currently use it? I'd like to try for myself for a11y reasons.
<jbicha> TheMuso: epiphany-browser gnomine gnotravex iagno mahjongg quadrapassel
<TheMuso> Ok epiphany it is then. :)
<TheMuso> Hrm epiphany uses clutter? For what?
<jbicha> TheMuso: I don't think it needs clutter, but I heard that epiphany < 3.92 might have been broken with the latest webkit
<TheMuso> Ah haven't got a new enough indicator-appmenu yet.
 * TheMuso updates.
<TheMuso> jasoncwarner_: Where can I file a bug against the piece of code responsible for generating that bug webpage?
<jasoncwarner_> ha!
<jasoncwarner_> directly with kate, I think
<BigW> Good Morning.
<jasoncwarner_> I talked to her this morning b/c there were some without tags showing up in that list
<TheMuso> jasoncwarner_: Ok thanks, nothing quite so serious for me, just something to help me navigate that page a little better with Orca.
<jasoncwarner_> oh, fair enough!
<jasoncwarner_> are you having trouble with it?
<TheMuso> No problems at all, but if the sections like desktop et al were marked with header tags, I could use Orca's next heading/previous heading navigation commands to move between the different bug groups.
<TheMuso> Without having to go through an entire list of bugs for a particular team before getting to the next one.
<pitti> Good morning
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> bonjour didrocks
<didrocks> hey pitti, how are you?
<pitti> quite fine, thank you!
<didrocks> fever and tired definitively behind you?
<pitti> absolutely, yesterday was quite fine already
<RAOF> Hey didrocks, pitti!
<RAOF> Good moring!
<didrocks> good evening RAOF ;)
<didrocks> pitti: good :)
<dupondje> Gnome3 seems a bit broken today :(
<dupondje> Waarschuwing van vensterbeheer:Log level 8: gtk_style_context_save: assertion `GTK_IS_STYLE_CONTEXT (context)' failed
<dupondje> Waarschuwing van vensterbeheer:Log level 8: meta_color_spec_render: assertion `GTK_IS_STYLE_CONTEXT (context)' failed
<dupondje> it gets flooded :)
<rickspencer3> pitti, didrocks, RAOF good morning guys
<rickspencer3> beta2! beta2!
<rickspencer3> (freeze ;))
<pitti> hey rickspencer3
<pitti> oh, right!
<didrocks> bonjour rickspencer3!
<rickspencer3> hey didrocks
<rickspencer3> French Mafia testing going ok?
<didrocks> rickspencer3: it's under way. We already spotted some annoying more issues
<rickspencer3> didrocks, :(
<rickspencer3> well ...
<rickspencer3> :)
<didrocks> with the compiz ABI break, we need a window of at least 5 hours of build
<didrocks> so will be short!
<rickspencer3> it's good that the testing works
<didrocks> right, it's testing the testing :)
<jasoncwarner_> hey rickspencer3 didrocks and pitti...morning, Europeans.
<pitti> hey jasoncwarner_
<rickspencer3> hey jasoncwarner_
<didrocks> hey jasoncwarner_
<jasoncwarner_> hey didrocks :) going to be a good day, right? right?  :)
 * didrocks crosses fingers :)
<didrocks> jasoncwarner_: we already spotted regressions
<jasoncwarner_> I'm using the time tested and very scientific method called "THE SECRET" to will the universe to do what I want
<didrocks> so trying to keep people busy ;)
<didrocks> heh :-)
<didrocks> let's see if it works :p
<jasoncwarner_> didrocks: did all the branches land that you wanted to land? I saw the recap email and it looked like only some landed
<jasoncwarner_> didrocks: in the regressions, anything major?
<didrocks> jasoncwarner_: hum, some still worrying and which deserve a fix before pushing
<jasoncwarner_> didrocks: k...(pinging thumper)
<didrocks> jasoncwarner_: I bother it before you! :p
<didrocks> but I guess he's not around yet
<didrocks> him*
<jasoncwarner_> :)
<jasoncwarner_> yeah, I figure thumper tends to have like 10 pings right around this time....
<jasoncwarner_> and first thing in my morning ;)
<jasoncwarner_> I'm sure he hates having me in this TZ ;)
<jasoncwarner_> hey didrocks how is compiz looking? we good to go on that?
<jasoncwarner_> I know you need a new build, but are you waiting on anything there?
<didrocks> jasoncwarner_: very good, I cherry-picked some other fixes from trunk yesterday
<didrocks> jasoncwarner_: and it's a wonderful life on that side :)
<didrocks> jasoncwarner_: it's still on the staging ppa for now
<didrocks> but there is an ABI break
<didrocks> that's why we need a solid window of 5 hours of upload/build
<didrocks> times for dependencies to build
<didrocks> then publish
<didrocks> then depends buildâ¦
<didrocks> publishâ¦
<didrocks> and so on ;)
<didrocks> to not having a "zomg you broke the CD"
<RAOF> didrocks: You can't stage that in a PPA?
<RAOF> That worked pretty well for the X transition.
<didrocks> RAOF: we have that in a ppa, but there is no dbgsym package built, pkgbinarymangler isn't as well, right?
<RAOF> I'm not sure, actually.
<didrocks> RAOF: will be nice next cycle with -proposed opened
<RAOF> Not building the dbgsym packages would be annoying, and you'd obviously need a non-virtualised PPA.
<didrocks> hyperair: hey, btw, UNE doesn't exists anymore, no more need to move banshee .desktop file to /usr/share/une/applications
<didrocks> RAOF: yeah, kind of late for this cycle to change the process I would say
<hyperair> didrocks: oh okay, thanks for the notice.
<RAOF> didrocks: Yeah, perhaps.
<didrocks> hyperair: no worry ;)
<didrocks> RAOF: but definitively something on my list for next cycle (/me looks at -proposed)
<RAOF> Yeah, if -proposed is open then that's even better.
<pitti> didrocks: BTW, as we'll be frozen tomorrow, I'd appreciate if you could upload the new compiz galore to precise-proposed
<pitti> didrocks: we can accept it there, let evrything build, and move it to precise in one step, to avoid archive inconsistency for half a day again
<didrocks> pitti: to -proposed?
<pitti> didrocks: does that sound ok?
<didrocks> it's opened?
<pitti> didrocks: well, technically it's open all the time
<pitti> didrocks: but you can't accept pacakges while precise is not frozen
<didrocks> ah ok ;)
<pitti> but for beta-2 it will be, so bug 930217 doesn't hit
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 930217 in launchpad "Make proposed pocket useful for staging uploads" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/930217
<pitti> rickspencer3: ^ FYI
<didrocks> but that would mean that they will be accepted tonight?
<pitti> that'll also be a real-world test drive for that approach
<pitti> cjwatson: ^ FYI as well
<didrocks> at first (just after we are frozen)
<pitti> didrocks: ah, I thought you were planning an upload tomorrow
<pitti> didrocks: if you want to upload today, please go ahead
<pitti> earlier >> test-driving
<didrocks> pitti: well, we don't know yet :)
<didrocks> and I don't want to break if the release team isn't happy with a safer upload tomorrow
<pitti> ok
<didrocks> right now, we have regressions I would prefer we won't let them enters
<pitti> what I mean is: correct >> earlier >> test driving :)
<didrocks> we'll know more in a couple of hours
<didrocks> will keep you in touch
<pitti> cheers
<rickspencer3> thanks for the fyi pitti
<rickspencer3> also, can I say, "pretty cool"
<rickspencer3> that's a meaningful advance in our release process
 * rickspencer3 steps away
<tkamppeter_> pitti, can you upload CUPS to Debian and Ubuntu? Thanks.
<jibel> pitti, Sweetshark good morning.
<jibel> pitti, Sweetshark I added a testcase to bug 916291 . I think we can find a smaller set of packages to reproduce the problem
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 916291 in libreoffice "failed to upgrade from Oneiric to Precise: ERROR: Cannot determine language! - exit status 134" [Critical,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/916291
<jibel> but at least with this packages, the upgrade crashes systematically
<jibel> *these
<pitti> jibel: bonjour! thanks for this
<didrocks> RAOF: there has been no recent change in mesa/intel driver?
<bryceh> didrocks, last change to mesa was the 17th, which was just a dependency tweak.  -intel hasn't received a change since the 15th of Feb.
<didrocks> ok, thanks ;)
<bryceh> didrocks, mesa 8.0.2 was released yesterday and is on the docket but hasn't landed yet
<didrocks> bryceh: we are seeing a crash in the driver right now
<bryceh> which driver?
<didrocks> getting the dbgsym stacktrace
<bryceh> ah the mesa/intel driver
<didrocks> right
<didrocks> https://pastebin.canonical.com/62804/
<bryceh> didrocks, the main crash we've been seeing there is the intel_miptree_release() bug (#926379)
<didrocks> ok, it's the same :)
<bryceh> pretty much all the other mesa bugs we're tracking are random (non-crash) gunk - https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mesa?field.tag=precise&field.tags_combinator=ALL
<didrocks> bryceh: thanks for the link :)
<bryceh> didrocks, I repro'd the bug on my own hardware using an instrumented mesa, and collected debug data.  Waiting for advice from upstream, but might dig in further if I have time.
<bryceh> anyway, nite.
<didrocks> bryceh: have a good night! and thanks again ;)
<tkamppeter> pitti, hi
<pitti> hello tkamppeter
<tkamppeter> pitti, can you upload cups-filters and cups to Debian and Ubuntu? Thanks.
<pitti> yes, at it; I'm currently updating my chroots
<pitti> didrocks: I feel really bad at pinging you, but I have to: does the new unity fix the resizing area again, or is that a gtk bug?
<pitti> (bug 160311)
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 160311 in metacity "Resizing windows by grabbing window borders is difficult" [Low,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/160311
<didrocks> pitti: it fixes it
<pitti> for 3D I mean (I know it has always been broken in 2d)
<pitti> didrocks: \o/
<didrocks> pitti: you had this only if you didn't install mutter
<didrocks> which is the case rarely isn't it? :p like just in the default install ;)
<didrocks> yeah, will still be broken in 2d though
<pitti> didrocks: cheers!
<didrocks> ;)
 * didrocks goes back to this crash on startupâ¦
 * pitti hugs didrocks, merci
 * didrocks hugs pitti back
<htorque> bryceh: hi! can bug 926379 be related to those invalid writes (valgrinding compiz): http://paste.ubuntu.com/886919/ ?
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 926379 in xserver-xorg-video-intel "compiz crashed with SIGSEGV in intel_miptree_release()" [Critical,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/926379
<htorque> before opening a wishlist bug report: is the new GTK color picker just a stop gap? â http://img.xrmb2.net/images/709325.png
<htorque> (the old one looked like this: http://img.xrmb2.net/images/620480.png)
<xclaesse> ricotz, FYI the g-k update in gnome3 ppa did not fix my problem, still asking for the ssh password when I do "git pull"
<xclaesse> oh and since last update, now in gnome-shell, windows decoration is just black bar
<seb128> hey
<ricotz> xclaesse, have you tried to confirm your g-k problem with the ubuntu packages? (make sure to revert all g-k related packages)
 * pitti hugs seb128
 * seb128 hugs pitti
<didrocks> salut seb128
<ricotz> hello everyone
<seb128> pitti, happy beta2 freeze day? ;-)
<seb128> hey didrocks, ricotz
<pitti> hey ricotz, guten Morgen
<pitti> seb128: and to you!
<seb128> pitti, how are you today?
<pitti> seb128: splendid, thanks! just a bit scared about how much stuff there is still to do..
<ricotz> xclaesse, could to toggle the window-manager theme? when you are not using adwaita -- might be a graphics card driver problem if you are using a propritary one?
<seb128> pitti, don't tell me!
<ricotz> pitti, libreoffice natty amd64 build turned out well, /me added another builder to the "good" list ;)
<pitti> ricotz: yay! king it is
<xclaesse> ricotz, it's intel chipset here
<xclaesse> ricotz, changing theme does nothing
<ricotz> xclaesse, hmm, any other x related ppas active?
<xclaesse> ricotz, but I see there is a mutter update now, but that would remove gnome-shell... I guess I should wait for the update batch to be done
<ricotz> xclaesse, ah, you are still on .90?
<ricotz> better wait for .92 then
<xclaesse> gnome-shell is .90 yes
<xclaesse> ricotz, oh, I see vuntz has that same problem actually
<xclaesse> so that would be upstream
<vuntz> xclaesse: look at your ~/.xsession-errors :-)
<ricotz> on intel too?
<xclaesse> vuntz, ah, right, lots of warnings
<vuntz> ricotz: yes
<xclaesse> switching windows/workspace is also not smooth anymore
<xclaesse> maybe related
<ricotz> vuntz, didnt see it here
<ricotz> but i am on a newer mesa, i guess
<xclaesse> ricotz, gnome-shell .92 is already uploaded?
<ricotz> xclaesse, yes
<xclaesse> good
<kelemengabor> hi, could someone take a look at bug #943279? We have a brand new default VNC client without any translation templates, and that's rather ugly.
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 943279 in remmina "Remmina i18n support problems" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/943279
<chrisccoulson> good morning everyone
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson
<seb128> how are you?
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson
<seb128> kelemengabor, looking
<kelemengabor> thanks!
<chrisccoulson> hi seb128, pitti, how are you?
<pitti> chrisccoulson: I'm great, thanks
<xclaesse> pff, ppa-purge to remove gnome3 ppa wants to remove all gnome packages... :(
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I'm good thanks
<seb128> chrisccoulson, btw did you plan to look at totem for the bug you pointed the other day? if not I will put on my list for today
<chrisccoulson> seb128, i might not be able to look at it today, as i've got a new firefox release to deal with
<seb128> kelemengabor, btw thanks for all the work you put into those translation bugs
<seb128> chrisccoulson, ok, I'm taking it, beta2 freeze is in 12 hours or so
<chrisccoulson> thanks
<kelemengabor> seb128: you are welcome :)
<Sweetshark> hmmm, is porter-armel down?
 * Sweetshark wonders if he killed the littlun with a libreoffice build.
<Sweetshark> .oO(thanks aptitude for removing bzr, who needs that anyway in ubuntu development)
<xclaesse> ricotz, FYI, I reverted all packages from gnome3 ppa to the version from precise, so I have g-k 3.2.2, and git pull still asking for the password
<xclaesse> even after restarting the session
<ricotz> xclaesse, so something might be wrong with you setup
<ricotz> xclaesse, could be useful to create a separate clean user profile to test/confirm with
<ricotz> xclaesse, for me it is working fine here with ssh and gpg keys
<xclaesse> ricotz, checking gnome-session-properties, and I don't see ssh agent started there
<xclaesse> ricotz, shouldn't it include gnome-keyring something?
<seb128> xclaesse, we hide system services from the session properties dialog
<Sweetshark> pitti: can we get 3.5.1-1ubuntu1 into the distro now? all but armel succeeded building.
<Sweetshark> I am trying to look into the armel thing, but the porter box seems to be down now.
<pitti> Sweetshark: what do you mean? it is already in precise
<Sweetshark> pitti: duh
 * Sweetshark takes his meds.
<Sweetshark> ;)
<xclaesse> seb128, ah ok
<xclaesse> ricotz, ah, mutter/gnome-shell updated now, and black bar is fixed :)
<xclaesse> vuntz, ^
<pitti> tkamppeter: FTR, sid is currently broken, need to wait a bit (pcre3)
<vuntz> xclaesse: weird, I'm up-to-date and I see this; I might need to log out and log in again
<tkamppeter> pitti, what does "pcre3" mean?
<tkamppeter> pitti, should the packages be uploaded Ubuntu-only then?
<pitti> tkamppeter: Debian uploaded a bad pcre3 library yesterday, which pretty much breaks everything
<pitti> tkamppeter: a fix is already in place, but it still needs a couple of hours to land
<pitti> tkamppeter: if it's urgent, then you can do that
<tkamppeter> pitti, it simply should go before beta2 freeze.
<pitti> tkamppeter: so better upload it now
<mandel> can anyone give me a hand with lighdm, I'm not able log in with my account (mandel) and I had to install gdm to be able to use my machine, my lightdm logs are the following: http://paste.ubuntu.com/894951/
<mandel> you will see that I can log as a guest which I used to su to my account which has sudo right and install gdm
<tkamppeter> pitti, are you using a German or an English UI?
<pitti> tkamppeter: German
<tkamppeter> pitti, can you enter the command "lpstat -r" and tell me the output?
<pitti> $ lpstat -r
<pitti> scheduler is running
<tkamppeter> pitti, do you have any German translated output from CUPS command line tools?
<tkamppeter> seb128, hi
<seb128> tkamppeter, hey
<pitti> tkamppeter: I don't; ./locale/cups_de.po does not actually have any translations
<pitti> tkamppeter: well, some, but only very few
<tkamppeter> seb128, I assume that you have a French user interface. Can you run "lpstat -r" and post the output here?
<seb128> tkamppeter, "scheduler is running"
<tkamppeter> seb128, thanks.
<seb128> yw
<pitti> tkamppeter: see /usr/share/cups/locale/fr/cups_fr.po
<pitti> it seems nobody really bothered to actually translate those
<tkamppeter> pitti, seb128, it is because of bug 960496, for me (using English UI) updating of the PPDs of existing print queues works, for some other users not.
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 960496 in gutenprint "[Precise] [Regression] Cannot print on Epson CX3650" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/960496
<pitti> tkamppeter: if I add a tranlation to /usr/share/cups/locale/de/cups_de.po, I get
<pitti> $ lpstat  -r
<pitti> Steuerprogramm lÃ¤uft
<pitti> tkamppeter: i. e. the machinery is working, just all the translations are missing upstream
<pitti> tkamppeter: eek, how do PPDs depend on translated client messages? that sounds wrong
<didrocks> pitti: bug #916892, seems it can be the cause that unity doesn't show up usb keys on the launcher anymore?
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 916892 in unity-distro-priority "gnome-disk-utility crashed with SIGSEGV in gdu_device_get_object_path()" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/916892
<tkamppeter> pitti, if you look into the postinst script of cups, /var/lib/dpkg/info/cups.postinst, you see that before the PPD update is started, at first it is checked whether the scheduler is running, analysing output of "lpstat -r", during the update routine there is heavy use of CUPS command line toools.
<pitti> tkamppeter: it's running under LC_ALL=C, so that should work
<pitti> if only programs would have something like an exit code, so that callers woudln't need to grep i18n'ed output
<tkamppeter> pitti, I see now.
<tkamppeter> pitti, the PPD updating part of the cups.postinst also checks with "ehich lpstat", "which llpinfo", and "which lpadmin" whether the command line tools are present. Can it happen that they are not present when cups gets configured?
<pitti> tkamppeter: no, as cups depends on cups-client
<pitti> dpm: hey David, how are you?
<dpm> heya pitti, very well, thanks, yourself?
<pitti> dpm: quite fine, thanks!
<dpm> :)
<pitti> dpm: do you have an opinion about bug 961065 ?
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 961065 in apport "[UIFE] Alert inappropriately refers to "program version" for internal errors" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/961065
<dpm> looking...
<pitti> dpm: I want to do an apport upload today before the freeze, either with or without that change
<dpm> pitti, ok, it might be a bit of a pain to retranslate it, but I think it makes sense to do the change if it is to comply with the spec. I've commented on the bug.
<pitti> dpm: thanks
<dpm> pitti, will you send a heads up to the translators list, or do you want me to send it?
<pitti> well, if you ask me like this... :)
<pitti> but I guess I ought to do it as the uploader
<dpm> ha, wrong way of asking :)
<didrocks> pitti: bug #916892, seems it can be the cause that unity doesn't show up usb keys on the launcher anymore?
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 916892 in unity-distro-priority "gnome-disk-utility crashed with SIGSEGV in gdu_device_get_object_path()" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/916892
<pitti> hm, there is no such program like "gnome-disk-utility"
<pitti> I suppose someone tampered with the bug title
<pitti> didrocks: but yes, could be
<pitti> Title: compiz crashed with SIGSEGV in gdu_device_get_object_path()
<pitti> ah yes, that's more like it
<pitti> it's on my radar, if I ever manage to get out of the mail/backlog/archive/bug swamp of this morning
<didrocks> pitti:
<pitti> dpm: translators list is which exactly?
<didrocks> pitti: thanks :)
<dpm> pitti, ubuntu-translators at lists dot u dot c
<pitti> dpm: sent, thanks
<dpm> cool, thanks pitti
<dpm> does anyone here know the remmina upstream developer? He/she's set the translations to open in Launchpad, which is not a very good idea wrt quality
<dpm> pitti, while reading the e-mail on the translators list, I've noticed that on https://translations.launchpad.net/apport/trunk/+translations-settings you can set the import settings to "Import template files" instead of "Import template files and translations" - the latter setting is generally for new projects that need a one-off import of PO files, or for vcs imports
<pitti> dpm: sometimes I update po/de.po in the branch
<pitti> and sometimes merges change them
<pitti> so why wouldn't I let them auto-import back to LP?
<dpm> pitti, in that case, then it's fine, I was just mentioning it in case, as many projects do not make use of it and maintainers just set it thinking it's the right setting. But as you say, you do make use of it. The only thing to bear in mind is that imports take precedence over translations done in the LP web UI
<pitti> dpm: ok, thanks for having a look
<chrisccoulson> that sucks. the UDS registration form doesn't work in nightly builds of Firefox
<seb128> chrisccoulson, iz firefox bog!
<chrisccoulson> firefox doesn't have any bugs! :-P
 * mpt just encountered a very odd Firefox bug
<mpt> (bug 799400)
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 799400 in firefox "message missing when trying to upload ureadable file" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/799400
<ndec_> seb128: hi. assuming gst 1.0 get released soon, i was wondering if moving to gst 1.0 in 12.10 is something doable, or not even an option... did you think about that already?
<seb128> ndec_, hey, "lol" ;-)
<ndec_> lol ?
<ndec_> i didn't realize it was a joke!
<seb128> ndec_, we are focussed on 12.04
<ndec_> i know ...
<ndec_> so am i
<ndec_> for the OMAP part of it!
<seb128> so "if", "assuming", "maybe", "could"
<seb128> said differently no clue, it's too early to say
<seb128> gst 1.0 is not out
<seb128> UDS is not there yet
<seb128> we are focussed on 12.04 I didn't give any thinking to 12.10
<seb128> it mostly depends what upstream people do, i.e totem, rhythmbox, banshee, pitivi, etc
<seb128> it's the sort of "let's wait for gst1.0 to be out, let's wait to see how much work is porting an app, and let's see what happen"
<ndec_> thx
<seb128> yw
<seb128> ndec_, sorry but there is just too much "unknown" is that equation to have a reply and it's not the right timing in any case, we will probably discuss it at UDS
<seb128> ndec_, do you need 1.0 for anything? I guess we will have it in the archive for sure for 12.10, I can't see how much we will port though...
<ndec_> seb128: no worry. i wasn't expecting a commitment, just a thought about feasibility!
<ndec_> basically i just wanted to hear that you were not strongly opposed to the idea
<seb128> ndec_, I'm waiting for gst1.0 to be out first and to see how goes the first app porting
<seb128> ndec_, ideally I would like to move to it if it's feasable
<ndec_> yeah, we kind of need gst1.0 for ARM SoC (at least the one i care about: OMAP)
<seb128> ok, that's a good reason to push for it
<ndec_> we can get around with gst0.10.. but with 1.0 we can use upstream, and get rid of the pile of patches we have on 0.10
<seb128> ndec_, do you know what's the roadmap from the gst guys to have the stable out?
<ndec_> soon
<seb128> ok
<seb128> so yeah, starting to use it next cycle makes sense
<seb128> I'm not sure how much we can "port" in one cycle though
<BigWhale> if gst1.0 becomes stable and performance is better and xvimagesrc is ported to 1.0 then I'll switch too...
<BigWhale> with Kazam.
<BigWhale> so I'd be happy to see it in 12.10 too :)
<kelemengabor> seb128: sorry, I had to reopen bug #943279 - it's not perfect yet :(
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 943279 in remmina "Remmina i18n support problems" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/943279
<seb128> kelemengabor, are you sure?
<seb128> kelemengabor, I looked at the code, the plugins code use the "remmina" domain
<seb128> kelemengabor, there is only one GETTEXT_PACKAGE defined in the soruce
<kelemengabor> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/precise/remmina/precise/view/head:/remmina-plugins/po/CMakeLists.txt
<seb128> kelemengabor, I think upstream is buggy
<kelemengabor> is this not redefining it?
<kelemengabor> I don't speak CMakeLists though, just assuming this based on the upstream...
<seb128> kelemengabor, I don't speak CMakeLists either
<seb128> let me check
<desrt> seb128: nor should you learn :)
<seb128> hey desrt, how are you ?
<desrt> although.... i have to say... CMakeLists have a lot in common with french
<desrt> good :)
<seb128> desrt, looking to make friends today? ;-)
<desrt> seb128: by your estimation, which group should be more insulted by that statement? :)
<seb128> desrt, I think it's insulting the french!
<seb128> ;-)
<kenvandine> seb128, thx for the review!
<kenvandine> seb128, please don't forget the other one though :)
<seb128> kenvandine, hey, yw!
<seb128> kenvandine, doh, thanks for pointing it, I didn't notice there were 2 of them, I went through by email a bit quickly
<kenvandine> :)
<kenvandine> you did the second one :)
<kenvandine> https://code.launchpad.net/~ken-vandine/telepathy-indicator/lp_926072/+merge/98719
<kenvandine> after submitting that, i found that it also fixes 2 other fixes too :)
<seb128> kenvandine, I'm reading it, do you care about old C compliance or are you C99?
<kenvandine> i don't really care :)
<seb128> kenvandine, i.e you did a variable declaration after the g_return_val_if_fail()
<kenvandine> but don't mind cleaning it up
<kenvandine> ah
<seb128> I know some GNOME guys used to report bugs about those
<seb128> saying it's a c99ish
<seb128> ism
<kenvandine> yeah, i did that on purpose... i like doing that before doing anything else
<kenvandine> but i know not everyone agrees with that :)
<seb128> kenvandine, ok, approved
<kenvandine> thx!
<seb128> yw ;-)
<kenvandine> i think that makes all open bugs for tp-indicator fixed
<kenvandine> :)
<kenvandine> woot
<pitti> hey kenvandine
<seb128> \o/
<kenvandine> hey pitti
<pitti> kenvandine: FYI, new pygobject with fix for mardy is in precise
<kenvandine> great
<kenvandine> thx
<pitti> kenvandine: I'm getting the hang of doing upstream releases :)
<kenvandine> pitti, hehe... yeah it is a little different :)
<kenvandine> then you get downstreams yelling about bugs :)
<BigWhale> Can someone comfirm this: Make sure you have multiple windows opened (couple of terminals, xchat, browser) Press CTRL-ALT-UPARROW to change desktop, tap ALT to open HUD, tap ALT to close HUD, press CTRL-DOWNARROW, again tap ALT twice. Repeat couple of times, see windows jump around ...
<kelemengabor> seb128: false alarm, you are right. I just installed an upstream remmina-plugins.po as remmina.mo and its strings showed up translated
<kelemengabor> sorry
<seb128> kelemengabor, yw
<seb128> kelemengabor, I just concatenated all strings from both source in the remmina template
<seb128> kelemengabor, which should work
<kelemengabor> great :)
<kenvandine> anyone know if the gnome classic session should have a messaging menu?
<seb128> kenvandine, I think it does, jbicha let the default config be "classic Ubuntu" like
<seb128> i.e with indicators
<kenvandine> i thought so
<kenvandine> but i am not getting the messaging menu
<kenvandine> seb128, it occurred to me that we probably don't want OnlyShowIn=Unity; for tp-indicator
<kenvandine> because of gnome classic
<seb128> kenvandine, it's there for me
<seb128> in a guest session ubuntu classic
<kenvandine> ah, let me try a guest session :)
<kenvandine> ah, great
<kenvandine> it is for a guest session
<seb128> kenvandine, you want that I think
<seb128> OnlyShowIn=GNOME;Unity;
<seb128> AutostartCondition=GNOME3 unless-session gnome
<seb128> kenvandine, that's i.e what we use for the gsd mounter
<kenvandine> seb128, cool
<seb128> kenvandine, "gnome" is gnome-shell
<kenvandine> i'll check
<seb128> kenvandine, that should make it run under unity and gnome-classic
<jbicha> I really wish there were separate OnlyShowIn values for GNOME Shell & Classic since they're so different
<seb128> right
<kenvandine> there really should be
<jbicha> for instance we want Onboard to show in Classic GNOME, but GNOME Shell has a built-in onscreen keyboard
<kenvandine> anyone know what settings i should clear to get the default setup again in gnome classic?
<jbicha> & the AutostartCondition line doesn't work there because we use an autostartcondition to check if the keyboard should be on or not
<jbicha> only allowing one AutostartCondition might be a bug though...
<jbicha> kenvandine: I believe gsettings reset-recursively org.gnome.gnome-panel would work
<jbicha> but it depends on what settings you're talking about
<kenvandine> jbicha, that did it
<kenvandine> i didn't have the indicators
<Darxus> Any chance of cherry picking this patch for Precise?  https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=672358#c8  I know it's late, but I have to ask.
<ubot2`> Gnome bug 672358 in wayland "Wayland and X11 backends simultaneously enabled is broken" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<seb128> Darxus, we don't build the wayland backend so it's not a bug in Ubuntu
<seb128> Darxus, also we will ship GTK 3.4 when it's rolled out next week, so get it commited upstream this week?
<tjaalton> trying to build sound-juicer 3.3.90, but after autoreconf it complains about missing GNOME_COMMON_INIT
<seb128> tjaalton, install gnome-common
<tjaalton> seb128: thanks
<seb128> yw
<Darxus> Okay.  (I was thinking it would make rebuilding with both backends slightly easier.)
<tjaalton> seb128: can you recall if there's a gnome package with cdbs that runs autoreconf during build?
<seb128> tjaalton, 90% of GNOME
<tjaalton> oh :)
<tjaalton> I'll look for an example then
<jbicha> tjaalton: http://anonscm.debian.org/viewvc/pkg-gnome/desktop/unstable/gnome-shell/debian/rules?view=markup
<seb128> tjaalton, what's the issue?
<tjaalton> jbicha: thanks
<tjaalton> seb128: building s-j from git
<seb128> tjaalton, basically depends on dh-autoreconf
<seb128> then include the autoreconf.mk
<seb128> that's it
<tjaalton> yeah
<seb128> tjaalton, why not just packaging 3.3.90?
<tjaalton> seb128: no tarball
<tjaalton> i'm using the tag
<seb128> tjaalton, ?
<seb128> http://ftp.acc.umu.se/pub/GNOME/sources/sound-juicer/3.3/sound-juicer-3.3.90.tar.xz
<seb128> tjaalton, ^
<seb128> tjaalton, or what do you mean no tarball?
<tjaalton> http://ftp.gnome.org/pub/GNOME/sources/sound-juicer/ doesn't have it
<seb128> tjaalton, ?
<tjaalton> uh
<tjaalton> uscan didn't find it
<seb128> tjaalton, you got me very confused
<jbicha> xz
<tjaalton> sorry
<tjaalton> right, the watch file is outdated
<jbicha> silly GNOME has to keep changing things!
<chrisccoulson> woohoo - https://twitter.com/#!/mike_conley/status/182826884256628736 \o/
<chrisccoulson> native pdf rendering in firefox :)
<chrisccoulson> take that, chrome
<pitti> sweet! but .js, is that any fast, compared to poppler?
<jbicha> chrisccoulson: oh it finally landed? awesome, that's future FF14 then?
<chrisccoulson> jbicha, yeah, it is
<chrisccoulson> pitti - js is pretty fast, and it's better than adding more binary code to the tree (especially for pdf rendering, which doesn't have the greatest history for stability or security)
<chrisccoulson> and pdf.js works on all platforms ;)
<pitti> yes, absolutely
<pitti> I was just curious
<chrisccoulson> the good thing about something like pdf.js is that it doesn't widen the attack surface any further :)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, well it's still extra code dealing with pdf parsing in your browser
<seb128> so it does increase chances you get a security issue
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I like better having pdf opening in evince under apparmor ;-)
<jdstrand> \o/
<pitti> hm, I just got four clicking noises out of my speakers for the fourth time in 15 minutes
<pitti> but there's nothing that tells me what these are about
<pitti> WTH?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, it runs in content context, so it's bound by existing browser security technologies
<chrisccoulson> which is why i said that it doesn't widen the attack surface ;)
<chrisccoulson> if it ran in privileged context, then that wouldn't be true :)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, did we have any "in browser pdf viewer" before?
<seb128> I though we just called evince
<tjaalton> yeah, multidisc musicbrainz queries work in the new s-j just as planned.. ship it :)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, the adobe plugin. and chrome has its own proprietary binary plugin too
<jdstrand> chrisccoulson: well, except you are trusting the browser to get it right. apparmor helps make sure that even if the app got it wrong, things are contained
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I never understood people reading their pdf in the browser to be honest
<jbicha> seb128: you don't use apparmor for your firefox?
<chrisccoulson> jdstrand, right. but if the browser doesn't get it right, then the holes are already there :)
<jdstrand> (of course, if you browser is confined with apparmor, you are ok-- but that is not something we can turn on by default in Ubuntu)
<seb128> jbicha, ^
<jdstrand> jbicha: I absolutely do! :)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, be careful, you seem on the path to want to get ride of the desktop to only run a webbrowser ;-)
<chrisccoulson> heh
<jdstrand> chrisccoulson: 'if the browser doesn't get it right, then the holes are already there'. I don't follow-- yes there is a hole if the browser didn't get it right. I'm saying that if evince/poppler doesn't get it right, apparmor confines what an attacker can do in the default install. if the browser doesn't get it right, apparmor isn't there for the browser in the default install
<mdeslaur> I think getting rid of everything and only keeping the most insecure one is a great idea
<mdeslaur> </irony>
<seb128> hehe
<seb128> I like better having a real pdf viewer in any case, there is enough specific ui bits in there that it fits better in an application with presentation mode, continuous or by page scrolling, etc
<seb128> the "move everything in the browser" trend is just wrong ;-)
<seb128> let the browser do what it's built to do, browse the web, don't try to turn it into my desktop!
<jdstrand> I tend to agree. I used to obsess over having acroread work in the browser. now I really like the separate process
<jbicha> seb128: you could always use epiphany ;)
<jdstrand> (and by 'now' I mean for the last several years)
<seb128> jbicha, I could...but nah, I like having a good browser and firefox is pretty amazing ;-)
<jbicha> actually with it being open source, I guess other browsers will look at scooping it up
<tjaalton> seb128: does s-j fall under the gnome "FFe"? :)
<seb128> tjaalton, bug fix versions are not under ffe and we live on a git snapshot, I would say better to update to an official tarball
<pitti> we do not formally have a standing gnome FFE any more
<tjaalton> seb128: true, at least it fixes this one musicbrainz-related bug, likely more
<tjaalton> I'll check the list
<mterry> RAOF, sorry for not pushing my last unity-greeter packaging changes to bzr!  :(
<mterry> just noticed
<mpt> mvo, here's what I've come up with based on our chat about OS upgrades a couple of weeks ago: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ReleaseUpgrades#ready
<mvo> mpt: thanks, in a meeting right now, but I have a look
<jbicha> mpt: the configuration file conflict proposal might not be nice
<mpt> jbicha, alternatives welcome. :-)
<mpt> (Alternatives that don't involve showing a diff or asking people questions they don't know the answer to)
<cyphermox> mpt: jbicha: perhaps override the "reboot" in that case and make sure the user is aware that this happened to files.
<cyphermox> as in, don't just merrily go ahead and reboot into a system that possibly got broken because of using the package provided config file.
<jbicha> well how often do /etc conflicts happen and why? if it's because people have made changes to their configurations...
<mpt> In what kind of cases would a system get broken from using the config file provided with the package?
<cyphermox> jbicha: not very often.
<mpt> Yeah, we need examples
<jbicha> well it violates Debian policy, so it'd probably require a bit more discussion than just here
<cyphermox> jbicha: there is that
<cyphermox> mpt: i've seen conffile update requests for files like /etc/securetty and /etc/vsftpd.conf; not something you just want to override because it can really break a package, or access to the system
<jbicha> using /etc/*.d/ folders helps with reducing conflicts
<mterry> Daviey, heyo.  Got some time for MIRs.  So there's the python-tz one, and what else are you looking at?
<cyphermox> jbicha: back on that gnome-shell merge request you wanted me to review?
<cyphermox> looks good to you? I'm not really all that knowledgeable about that gnome-shell should be doing, I never use it ;)
<jbicha> cyphermox: is that something that should be fixed in NM?
<cyphermox> AFAICS the change seems reasonable
<cyphermox> jbicha: well, the disconnect notification was set as CRITICAL from a design bug
<cyphermox> (a bug from the design team); to make sure disconnect notifications get seen. I could change it back, but the increase in priority isn't exactly wrong
<jbicha> cyphermox: all I have to do is click the notification in gnome-shell and it goes away
<cyphermox> right, but it probably should get away by itself, especially if you get back to connected :)
<cyphermox> let me give a little fix a try, I have an idea
<jbicha> my instinct is that this isn't really a gnome-shell bug
<mterry> Daviey, oh, I see a bunch of new MIRs.  on it
<cyphermox> jbicha: I don't know. seems to me like any transient notification should indeed be transient, no matter the priority.
<jbicha> cyphermox: but is it notify-osd that's doing it wrong?
<jbicha> I forget how it works in Fedora
<cyphermox> jbicha: what would notify-osd be doing wrong?
<cyphermox> jbicha: this fails because we have a distro patch to set the prio of the disconnect notification to CRITICAL
<cyphermox> all the notifications are set to be transient though, the hint is set on each of the notifications nm-applet generates
<jbicha> I don't know, anyway if you decide the merge is good, I'll accept the patch
<cyphermox> jbicha: my feeling is that it's good; but I'd like to get the opinion of gnome-shell developers.
<cyphermox> if transient notifications aren't transient, it *should* be a bug, unless it's clearly defined that a critical urgency overrides that
<tjaalton> nice, can't get sound-juicer or gvfsd-cdda to crash anymore like on oneiric.. looks like the gvfs updates really made a difference
<mterry> Daviey, is maas going to be seeded anywhere?  in Server?
<pitti> wasn't it cluttering component-mismatches all over yesterday
<pitti> ?
<pitti> but not any more, I suppose it was unseeded, or it's dependencies fixed?
<mterry> pitti, it has a large MIR chain I'm working on
<pitti> yeah, I saw; that looked quite crazy
<pitti> and I'm fairly sure we don't want to pull in half of Haskell there
<pitti> sabdfl explicitly nacked this as approved technology
<mterry> pitti, hadn't gotten to haskell bits yet
<pitti> so I guess it needs some serious work to drop some deps
<pitti> dpm: argh, I forgot to request a full langpack export for beta-2
<pitti> dpm: I requested it now on https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/precise/+language-packs, but can we start a manual export now, so that I can build them tomorrow?
<pitti> dpm: otherwise I can forge it from the last base and current delta, but then the next delta packs will be wrong
<dpm> pitti, let me ask the lp losas. I think it shouldn't be a problem, the only issue with exports starting in the afternoon is that they are right in the middle of the database disconnect around ~9:00 UTC and they then fall, but perhaps they can postpone tomorrow's disconnect
<pitti> dpm: ah, argh; so perhaps building the tarball myself is better then
<pitti> and requesting/uploading another one after b2?
<dpm> I think we can still ask, but the other issue I can think of is that full exports take about 22 h. So it'd be ready by tomorrow 16:00 our time, which might be a little late.
<pitti> sounds OK
<dpm> ok, let me check with the LP people
<Daviey> mterry: maas is already seeded
<pitti> Daviey: ah, so it's dependencies got lighter?
<Daviey> pitti: yeah, we trimmed quite a bit.
<pitti> Daviey: *phew*, no Haskell in mainn :)
<Daviey> pitti: Well, can reintroduce it if you would like? :)
<dpm> pitti, ok, full precise langpack export running now, expecting it to be finished tomorrow at about 15:30UTC
<pitti> dpm: cheers!
<dpm> np :)
<dobey> mdeslaur: ping?
<mdeslaur> dobey: yes?
<dobey> mdeslaur: hi. i'm looking at bug #925713 from you, and trying to figure out the best way to fix it on all the platforms we have to support. It's not exactly clear to me either, how reading from ca-certificates.crt instead of a .pem with the same content is any better
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 925713 in ubuntuone-storage-protocol "CA Certificate is hardcoded" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/925713
<mdeslaur> dobey: when that CA gets compromised, we will push out a new system ca-certificates package, and we'll change certificate providers on the server
<mdeslaur> dobey: having a bunch of hard coded certificates in various packages is incredibly hard to manage
<dobey> mdeslaur: right, i understand that, but i don't think these certs are in the ca-certificates package?
<mdeslaur> dobey: on linux, use the system certs, on other platforms, use the bundled cert
<mdeslaur> dobey: they'd better be...where did the cert come from?
<dobey> godaddy, but it's got a slightly different chain than the godaddy certs in ca-certificates, i think
<mdeslaur> dobey: the certs in ca-certificates come from firefox....so I doubt godaddy is selling certs that don't work in firefox
<mdeslaur> dobey: could you give it a try?
<mdeslaur> dobey: you can still shove the cert into /etc/ssl/certs if it,s not already there
<mdeslaur> dobey: just make it use _any_ valid cert in /etc/ssl/certs, and not that specific filename
<seb128> pitti, nice apport upload!
<dobey> it might work now (in precise), but i think it might not work in older versions of ubuntu (lucid). there was an issue with the chaining, with openssl iirc
<mdeslaur> dobey: well, we don't really need to fix it in the older releases, but it would be nice to have it going forward
<mdeslaur> dobey: you can tell it to use /etc/ssl/certs/ca-certificates.crt
<mdeslaur> dobey: that is a dynamically-generated file containing all the system certs, including the one you stuck in /etc/ssl/certs yourself
<dobey> right
<dobey> mdeslaur: hrmm. ca-certificates.crt really needs a comment for each cert, telling which file it came from exactly
<dobey> mdeslaur: and it seems the .pem files we're installing aren't getting added to it. :-/
<mdeslaur> dobey: are you calling update-ca-certificates in your postinst?
<mdeslaur> when you dump stuff in there, you need to tell the system about it
<seb128> mdeslaur, isn't what triggers are for?
<dobey> mdeslaur: running it manually just now doesn't add it either
<dobey> Updating certificates in /etc/ssl/certs... 0 added, 0 removed; done.
<mdeslaur> oh, it may be handled by triggers too, I'm not sure what the best practice is there
<pitti> seb128: heh, thanks; I hope this one causes less dupes to be filed
<pitti> seb128: and it helps a bit with catching up with you, too :)
<seb128> pitti, hehe
 * seb128 hugs pitti
<dobey> seb128: well, we should still do whatever the trigger does, when we do ./setup.py install, for people that decide to install by hand, i guess; but bleh, i hate setuptools/distutils because it makes stuff like this really hard.
<mdeslaur> dobey: wait a sec, let me refresh my memory with update-ca-certificates
<dobey> not to mention every linux distro does this slightly differently :-/
<mdeslaur> yes, it's insane
<dobey> and i don't really see how packages shoving their own certs into ca-certificates.crt, and reading it instead of the .pem files directly, changes anything really. the same cert revocation concerns are still there
<micahg> mdeslaur: dobey: please read the update-ca-certificates manpage :)
<mdeslaur> micahg: no relevant info in the manpage...what specific part are you talking about?
<dobey> the part where the files are in /usr/share and there's a .conf file that lists all of them i guess
<mdeslaur> dobey: well, presumably the package won't ship it's own cert file anymore
<dobey> but there's no conf.d directory to shove others into
<dobey> mdeslaur: we have to
<mdeslaur> dobey: ok, then forget it and close the bug
<dobey> mdeslaur: ok
<micahg> mdeslaur: files get installed in /usr/share/ca-certificates/ update-ca-certificates installs to /etc/ssl/certs
<mdeslaur> micahg: yes, I know that part...but where do other packages besides ca-certificates put their certs?
<micahg> in the same dir there
<micahg> I'm not sure it's necessarily intended for other packages to ship certs, I think that's the point of having this in the first place
<dobey> well apparently java ships some certs and has some complex special thing which gets run by update-ca-certificates as wlel
<dobey> well
<dobey> hrmm. is apport retracer blocked/disalbed for amd64 bugs?
<pitti> dobey: no, it shouldn't?
 * pitti checks
<pitti> last run was 7 minutes ago
<pitti> looks quite happy
<dobey> pitti: oh, hrmm. i guess this bug is missing necessary info :-/
<pitti> which bug?
<dobey> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntuone-client-gnome/+bug/953313
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 953313 in ubuntuone-client-gnome "Ubuntu One crashes while sharing a folder from nautilius" [High,New]
<dobey> there's no StackTrace.txt attachment
<dobey> zyga: ^^ why you break apport?
<pitti> dobey: this is a ProblemType: Bug, not a crash
<pitti> there's nothing to retrace or check
<cyphermox> seb128: re bluez; I'm finding some pretty bad issues with file transfers, and skipping in audio; so I'd be in favor of not updating to 4.99 afterall
<pitti> dobey: probably best to invalidate it and ask to send a proper crash report
<zyga> dobey, huh
<zyga> dobey, sorry
<zyga> dobey, if you want I can re-try that
<dobey> zyga: do you have a file in /var/crash for that?
<zyga> dobey, let me check
<cyphermox> after discussion with upstream that management API change isn't something that would get used with the kernel we're shipping in Precise, so it kind of defeats the purpose of updating bluez anyway. since things are pretty stable and working right now, seems to me like we're okay.
<zyga> dobey, note: apport has been crashing for me all week
<dobey> apport-bug apport :)
<cyphermox> pitti: has jmleddy spoken to you about gvfs ? :/
<zyga> dobey, maybe: _usr_bin_nautilus.1000.crash
<pitti> cyphermox: yes; it's on my list of things to look into
<cyphermox> pitti: ok
<dobey> zyga: can you do "apport-collect 953313" please?
<pitti> cyphermox: i. e. we need to debug what's actually causing the problem
<zyga> sure
<dobey> i /think/ that should add everything to the existing bug
<pitti> zyga: how did apport crash?
<zyga> pitti, reporting crashes of itself, I did not investigate
<pitti> dobey: not core dumps, though; apport-collect doesn't attach anything that isn't already there, as the bug was reported through apport already
<pitti> zyga: do you have a /var/crash/*apport*?
<dobey> ah ok
<cyphermox> pitti: yes, I've been looking into it but it looks like issues with the async calls between obex and gvfs, really not trivial to debug. not quite sure how the patch he changes actually changes that behavior, but I'm way out of my understanding of this stuff
<pitti> zyga: I uploaded a new apport with a ton of fixes today, perhaps that helps
<zyga> pitti, yes, three
<zyga> pitti, but uploaded
<zyga> pitti, thanks I'll ensure to send any reports if it crashes again
<pitti> zyga: ah, do you remember the bug numbers?
<dobey> zyga: then just "ubuntu-bug /var/crash/_usr_bin_nautilus.1000.crash" please
<zyga> /usr/share/apport/apport-gtk:264: UnicodeWarning: Unicode equal comparison failed to convert both arguments to Unicode - interpreting them as being unequal
<zyga>   if widget.get_label() == _('Relaunch'):
<zyga> pitti, that's all it keeps saying now
<pitti> zyga: that's fixed
<dobey> zyga: i filed a bug about that error the other day
<zyga> dobey, in progress (the first is done now)
<pitti> zyga: as a workarund, report them through apport-cli or apport-kde
<pitti> zyga: . o O { *phew* } :)
<pitti>     apport | 1.95-0ubuntu1 |       precise | source, all
<pitti> or just dist-upgrade
 * pitti fixes valac package upgrade failure
<pitti> didrocks: OOI, did you see bug 916892 yourself?
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 916892 in unity-distro-priority "gnome-disk-utility crashed with SIGSEGV in gdu_device_get_object_path()" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/916892
<dobey> zyga: did you get the new bug filed yet?
<pitti> and why is that unity-distro-prio task "fix committed"?
<zyga> dobey, yup, sorry, got stuck
<pitti> didrocks: I can't actually reproduce it, so I guess I can just try and fix it blindly
<dobey> zyga: what's the bug #?
<seb128> cyphermox, your call
<seb128> cyphermox, are those .98->99 regressions?
<cyphermox> seb128: yeah
<cyphermox> seb128: rather not embark in that, honestly.
<zyga> dobey, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nautilus/+bug/962470
<ubot2`> zyga: Error: <Bugtracker.plugin.Launchpad instance at 0xa5ae8cc> bug 962470 not found
<zyga> haha
<zyga> nice
<zyga> this bug is private now
<dobey> oh
<dobey> yeah because it's a crash
<dobey> but why can't i see it
<seb128> dobey, because it's not retraced yet
<cyphermox> seb128: I don't think it's related to mgmt api, but I could see after the fact that there were changes in bluez to deal with permission errors in file transfers, but we also have a fix in the kernel for that, I think at this point they may be conflicting
<seb128> dobey, only retracer have initial access
<dobey> ah right
<seb128> cyphermox, ok, fair enough, as said I was mostly trying to set us in a position where it would be easier to get stable updates later on
<cyphermox> seb128: ok
<seb128> cyphermox, but if those are tight to kernel updates there is no point
<seb128> cyphermox, it's not like we can't backport bug fixes in any case ;-)
<cyphermox> seb128: I do think we're ok; we can pretty easily cherry-pick patches in general they are well made as atomic and all
<cyphermox> right
<seb128> cyphermox, thanks for looking to it in any case!
<cyphermox> I'll update the pad; already let ScottK to nak the bug
<seb128> cyphermox, thanks
<seb128> cyphermox, don't get too happy too soon, I assigned you an eds bug this week as well ;-)
<cyphermox> np :)
<seb128> cyphermox, one with a patch upstream so should be easy
<seb128> (don't take my word on it though ;-)
<cyphermox> eds and evo I've been wanting to review since last week but kept being dragged back to NM or bluez :)
 * cyphermox drops a tear for shattered hopes or a newer, bug-free bluez :)
<seb128> cyphermox, next one will be better! ;-)
<cyphermox> seb128: they all say that
<didrocks> pitti: I didn't see the crash, I know there is a bug where the device connected to launcher are not shown
<didrocks> pitti: was thinking it can be the same bug
<unit3> Hey all, I'm trying to get my desktop working using nouveau drivers, my video card is supported and it works from the 11.10 live cd... but in my install environment, running "compiz --replace" in a terminal results in the error: GLX_EXT_texture_from_pixmap is missing
<unit3> However, glxinfo shows that the texture_from_pixmap extension is present.
<unit3> so I'm not sure what Unity's problem is?
<unit3> ugg. no focus follows mouse in this failsafe mode, obviously.
<unit3> so yeah, any ideas how to get it to shape up and run, since the glx extension is there?
<unit3> I tried "unity --reset", no luck.
<dobey> pitti: ugh. apport failed for the new bug :-/
<dobey> pitti: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nautilus/+bug/962470
<ubot2`> dobey: Error: <Bugtracker.plugin.Launchpad instance at 0xa5ae8cc> bug 962470 not found
<dobey> ubot2`: be quiet
<ubot2`> Factoid 'be quiet' not found
<seb128> dobey, nautilus version 1:3.3.91-0ubuntu4 required, but 1:3.3.92-0ubuntu2 is available
<pitti> dobey: yeah, lots of updates today :/
<pitti> I'm afraid that needs a fresh crash
<seb128> dobey, the retracers don't work on outdated version, they only have the current version dbgsym
<seb128> it's not today, that was updated on tuesday
<seb128> pitti, is there any way we could block submiting based on lp versions rather than mirror versions?
<seb128> some mirrors seems to be outdated by days
<pitti> seb128: in theory yes of course, but not trivially
<pitti> seb128: we could at least use rmadison, should be a bit cheaper
<pitti> but still much harder than just querying python-apt
<dobey> or try to retrace with the newer versions of the packages
<seb128> dobey, that's what happened there :p
<seb128> dobey, the dump is for .91 and it retraced with .92 and of course signatures didn't match so gdb bailed out
<dobey> well it broke before retracing. it failed to install the packages no?
<seb128> dobey, no
<seb128> dobey, the retracer doesn't "install" the packages
<seb128> dobey, it unpack the binaries
<seb128> dobey, installation is too error prone
<seb128> dobey, the log just warns that the unpacked version is .92 but the dump is from .91, so it's likely not going to get any working gdb output
<dobey> hmm
<dobey> oh well
<dobey> and i guess apport won't write a new file in /var/crash as there's already one that's been uploaded?
<pitti> it does
<pitti> it only doesn't overwrite files which haven't been shown yet
<pitti> didrocks: hm, my USB sticks always get shwon
<pitti> didrocks: and mounted ISOs and SSH mounts don't; but they also don't cause unity to crash
<pitti> didrocks: anyway, thanks; I'll do some stack trace vs. source code analysis
<didrocks> pitti: well, it's in a separate process (the panel service one), so unity won't crash
<didrocks> pitti: but it just doesn't shsow up
<didrocks> pitti: not a big bug for the release, was thinking it was related, but no then
<pitti> didrocks: oh, panel? I thought you meant the usb icons in the launcher
<didrocks> pitti: long story, it's mounted in the panel service in fact :)
<pitti> unity::launcher::DeviceLauncherSection::OnVolumeAdded(_GVolumeMonitor*, _GVolume*,
<didrocks> but shown on the launcher
<pitti> that's part of the stack trace
<jbicha> pitti: what are you doing still here?
<pitti> so I thought it was unity that crashed
<pitti> jbicha: fixing bugs until the bitter end :)
<didrocks> pitti: hum, maybe on that one, I need to look at the code, it maybe changed since last time I touched
<didrocks> pitti: but the current state is just "nothing is shown"
<didrocks> no crash
 * pitti looks at gtimelog.. "Total work done: 12 h 37 min"; that's not too bad for a freeze day :)
<pitti> didrocks: hm, WFM
<didrocks> pitti: that's because you don't have 5.8 ;)
<pitti> didrocks: heh, right
<didrocks> ok, so not platform related 5.8 regression
<pitti> didrocks: but neitehr does that guy who reported that crash
<didrocks> right, it's a separate issue then
<didrocks> having the 3 machines on latest staging ppa to test the crash on startup makes me hard to confirm if we have a regression or not :/
<seb128> I hate makefiles
<seb128> 	TYPE="text"
<seb128> 	echo $(TYPE)
<seb128> should the echo print "text" for that?
<seb128> or am I doing something stupid?
<pitti> nope
<pitti> seb128: it's two different shells
<pitti> each line is a new shell command
<pitti> seb128: try:
<pitti> TYPE="text"; echo $$TYPE
<seb128> I hate makefiles :p
<pitti> seb128: or define TYPE not in a rule, but at the top of the file
<pitti> $(TYPE) -> make variable
<pitti> $$TYPE -> shell variable
<pitti> you can't define make variables in rules
<seb128> pitti, that's not a rules, it's an upstream Makefile
<pitti> I mean in makefile rules, not "debian/rules"
<pitti> i. e. in the actions that build a target
<seb128> TYPE="text"
<seb128> echo $TYPE
<seb128>  
<seb128> that's what is printed with $$TYPE
<seb128> oh, on the same line
<pitti> seb128: is that in a rule or are these declarations?
<pitti> echo $TYPE is not a valid make declaration
<pitti> MAKEVAR=value
<pitti>  
<pitti> mybin: mysource.c
<seb128> ok
<pitti>       # this is a rule
<pitti>      echo $(MAKEVAR)
<seb128> so let's take a concrete example
<pitti>      SHELLVAR=foo; echo $$SHELLVAR
<pitti>  
<seb128> I was trying to do that (which doesn't work)
<seb128> totem.desktop.in: totem.desktop.in.in mime-type-list.txt desktop.sh
<seb128> 	$(AM_V_GEN) cat totem.desktop.in.in | sed 's,@FULL_LIBEXECDIR@,$(FULL_LIBEXECDIR),' > $@ &&\
<seb128> 	$(AM_V_GEN) cat totem.desktop.in.in | sed 's,@MIMETYPE@,$($(SHELL) $(srcdir)/desktop.sh $(srcdir)/mime-type-list.txt $(srcdir)/uri-schemes-list.txt),' > $@
<pitti> perhaps that makes it clelarer
<seb128> the second like doesn't work
<didrocks> it's easy once you got that the declaration are only on top :)
<seb128> now I'm trying to debug why it doesn't work :p
<seb128> the MIMETYPE line doesn't work
<seb128> chrisccoulson, it's all your fault btw, that's the stupid totem mimetype bug :p
<chrisccoulson> heh, thanks :)
<seb128> the makefile was
<seb128> totem.desktop.in: totem.desktop.in.in mime-type-list.txt uri-schemes-list.txt desktop.sh
<seb128> 	$(AM_V_GEN) cat totem.desktop.in.in | sed 's,@FULL_LIBEXECDIR@,$(FULL_LIBEXECDIR),' > $@ &&\
<seb128> 	$(SHELL) $(srcdir)/desktop.sh $(srcdir)/mime-type-list.txt $(srcdir)/uri-schemes-list.txt >> $@
<seb128>  
<seb128> but with the unity list the 3rd line doesn't work
<pitti> wht is AM_V_GEN?
<seb128> we don't want to append the text
<seb128> pitti, it's a makefile stuff that make it hide output if you don't set V=1
<seb128> i.e ignore it
<pitti> seb128: try $(SHELL command), not $(SHELL) command
<pitti> $(SHELL command) expands to the output of "command"
<pitti> it's a make function
<pitti> which I think is what you might want there
<pitti> $($(SHELL) stuff) -> that might magically work, but I'm afraid I can't parse that
<seb128> pitti, I just want to put the output of "$(srcdir)/desktop.sh $(srcdir)/mime-type-list.txt $(srcdir)/uri-schemes-list.txt" there
<seb128> the original makefile.am is doing
<seb128> $(SHELL) $(srcdir)/desktop.sh $(srcdir)/mime-type-list.txt $(srcdir)/uri-schemes-list.txt >> $@
<seb128> I basically want to take what is before the >>
<seb128> and put it in a sed
<seb128> so I put it under $()
<seb128> that's basically "evaluate "sh desktop.sh ..."
<pitti> I thought $(stuff) would expand the make variable "stuff"
<pitti> $(SHELL) might expand to "/bin/sh"
<seb128> yeah, I don't practice makefile regularly
<pitti> seb128: so yes, try
<seb128> I didn't do stuff like that since my Debian NM when jorge made me rewrite a rules in pure makefile :p
<seb128> which is like ... 10 years (doh, not getting any younger)
<pitti> ... sed 's,...,$(SHELL $(srcdir)/desktop.sh $(srcdir)/mime-type-list.txt $(srcdir)/uri-schemes-list.txt)'
<pitti> or just avoid the $(SHELL) stuff altogether, you are already writing shell stuff after all
<pitti> seb128: oh, wait
<pitti> seb128: you are trying to to the shell $(), not the make $()
<pitti> seb128: now I know why I couldn't parse that :)
<pitti> seb128: simple fix should be to replace $( with $$(
<pitti> that'll use teh shell's $() , i. e. same as ``
<pitti> make is fun
<seb128> oh
<seb128> I see what you mean
<seb128> let me try
<seb128> hum
<seb128> so
<seb128> 	echo `$(SHELL) desktop.sh mime-type-list.txt uri-schemes-list.txt`
<seb128> works
<pitti> yes, using `` shoudl be a little clearer than the $$($(SHELL) dance
<pitti> it looks dangerously close to a sendmail config at that point :)
<seb128> that still doesn't work in the sed line though
<pitti> anyway, I think time to sleep for me; I can't really think coherently any more
<pitti> and in teh remaining 11 minutes I won't be able to do an upload any more
<seb128> pitti, I think I got it
<seb128> pitti, thanks for thelp!
<pitti> seb128: \o/
<seb128> the help
<seb128> I will sneak that in and call it a day as well :p
<pitti> seb128: if all else fails, write a shell script which does everything and just call that in the rule
<pitti> that's what I did wit pkgbinarymangler in the end, when the cdbs make rules becaome totally incomprehensible
<pitti> good night everyone, sleep well!
<pitti> nice fix-it day today, looking forward to tomorrow's images
<seb128> 'night pitti
 * pitti hugs seb128
 * seb128 hugs pitti back
<didrocks> good night pitti!
 * pitti hugs didrocks as well, hope you don't have to burn the midnight oil so long
<didrocks> pitti: well, we'll see :-) almost here, but anyway, won't upload before tomorrow
<pitti> didrocks: that's fine; skaet knows as well, and I'll do the pocket copying
<didrocks> so, we'll need to discuss tomorrow :)
<pitti> didrocks: so, upload to -proposed it is
<didrocks> good news \o/
 * didrocks hugs pitti
<pitti> and you can say you paved the ground for a proper staging area :)
<didrocks> heh, yeah \o/
<seb24> salut didrocks :D Ã§a bosse ?
<didrocks> seb24: un peu trop :-)
<seb24> je me doute :)
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, so the only downside of pdf.js is that it has a popout sidebar on the left hand edge of the firefox window
<chrisccoulson> right where the unity launcher is
<didrocks> chrisccoulson: still awake?
<chrisccoulson> didrocks, no, i'm fast asleep now :)
<didrocks> ;)
<chrisccoulson> this is probably better than reading pdf's in evince :)
<RAOF> chrisccoulson: What's performance like?
<chrisccoulson> RAOF, it seems to be pretty good here
<RAOF> Have you tried it on something hard, like the Pathfinder book? :)
<chrisccoulson> not yet ;)
<chrisccoulson> hmmm, they need to fix scrollwheel zooming :)
<chrisccoulson> because the pdf viewer is just all normal webcontent, ctrl+scrollwheel zooms the whole thing, including the pdf viewer chrome
<chrisccoulson> which is clearly not meant to happen
 * didrocks waves good night
<TheMuso> chrisccoulson: What program is this?
 * TheMuso exited from his IRC session earlier and just missed catching the start of the convo in backscroll.
<didrocks> or not yet ;)
<desrt> didrocks: cheerio
<didrocks> hey desrt ;)
<desrt> didrocks: i thought you were on your way out :)
<didrocks> I thought it to :)
<didrocks> I was pretty sure it was the case when I typed /quit and was going to press enter
<desrt> only to discover....
<didrocks> until I saw this little notification bubble :)
<desrt> so it's mirco's fault, you're saying
<didrocks> desrt: totally agree ;)
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-03-23
 * didrocks really goes to bed now
<didrocks> see you tomorrow guys!
<pitti> Good morning
<rickspencer3> hey bryceh looks like you had a productive patch piloting session
<pitti> GunnarHj: good morning
<bryceh> rickspencer3, yep
<pitti> hey rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> hi pitti
<pitti> wow, half of the sponsoring queue is less than two days old
<rickspencer3> and Sarvatt fixed the compiz crasher last night (my last night)
<rickspencer3> I feel like a happy boy this morning, no one burst my bubble, please :)
<pitti> rickspencer3: no beer yet, though
<rickspencer3> lol
<pitti> need to look into what's breaking farsight
<rickspencer3> I said not to burst my bubble!
<rickspencer3> :)
<pitti> SCNR
 * pitti hugs rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> pitti, in point of fact, I did not panic when I saw there were 2 problems in precice_probs
 * rickspencer3 hugs pitti
<rickspencer3> pitti,  looks like there was an unstable job with the 54 bit desktop too
<pitti> 54?
<rickspencer3> lol
<bryceh> pitti, new Intel thing.
<rickspencer3> indeed, it's our newest architecture
<bryceh> the geovexium
<rickspencer3> we found the chip in an alien crash site, thought we'd build a Ubuntu for it
<pitti> lol
<bryceh> speaking of aliens, looks like we're going to get new -fglrx and -nvidia next week.  hoping if we get those in it'll take care of some of the various bugs we're seeing with them.
<rickspencer3> hey bryceh that's good news
<rickspencer3> are those the final ones?
<bryceh> rickspencer3, final before 12.04 release
<bryceh> rickspencer3, remember we can now do opt-in updates post-release too :-)
<rickspencer3> righto
<rickspencer3> but I still recall a couple of years ago we were always getting the binary drivers really close to, or even after, release
<bryceh> yeah
<bryceh> this cycle we've at least had *functional* drivers the whole release.  helpful to all the testers
<bryceh> however the versions we have right now are relatively unstable
<bryceh> word is the new versions solve a lot of the problems users are seeing
<pitti> rickspencer3: FYI, bug 956041 is standing between here and beer, I adjusted it accordingly
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 956041 in telepathy-qt4 "Unmet dependency due to farsight being renamed to farstream" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/956041
<RAOF> bryceh: Hurray!  I wonder if the new fglrx will *really* support hybrid graphics on the laptop I have, rather than claiming to âº
<rickspencer3> pitti, sounds like someone needs to awk their way to beer?
<bryceh> RAOF, as long as it leaves us with functioning Xv I'll be happy
<RAOF> Pfft!  Who watches video, anyway!
<RAOF> No one on fglrx, at least âº
<bryceh> yeah we all know they're just using it for pr0n
<bryceh> on those internets
<RAOF> It's for their own good, having X die like that.
<bryceh> maybe it'll encourage them to get a proper 54-bit video card
<rickspencer3> lol
<RAOF> Is that the new Intel ABI they'd like us to kindly bootstrap?
<rickspencer3> hey all, so what's up with unity for beta 2? is there a release that's got to be tested and all that queued up?
<pitti> it's supposed to land today, yes
<didrocks> good morning
<pitti> bonjour didrocks
<pitti> didrocks: run!
<pitti> didrocks: rick asked about unity a minute ago!!
 * pitti hugs didrocks
 * didrocks hugs pitti
<pitti> didrocks: I hope you slept well, and didn't go to bed at 3 or so?
<didrocks> pitti: I went to bed at 2â¦
<pitti> eww
<pitti> you're up early then
<didrocks> I know, but I need to act on unity soon enough if neededâ¦
<didrocks> we had jasoncwarner_'s issue last need, I need to know the status
<rickspencer3> hey didrocks
<didrocks> bonjour rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> one day we will have a unity landing that does involved late nights
<didrocks> one day :-)
<didrocks> normally, I can resist without coffee, but not today bbiab ;)
<pitti> RAOF: do you have time to look into bug 827934?
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 827934 in colord "colord crashed with SIGABRT in raise()" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/827934
<didrocks> pitti: so basically, duflu is on some additional work, jasoncwarner_ is experiencing this bug and they got an idea
<pitti> RAOF: seems to be a common assertion failure, and reproducible in jenkins
<didrocks> but still weird, there is a compositer claimed to run before compiz starts in some caseâ¦
<RAOF> pitti: I've started looking at that.  Oooh, reproducible in Jenkins?
<pitti> RAOF: I think I saw it in some dist-upgrade failed tests, yes
<pitti> hmm, not in the current ones, though
<RAOF> Upstream has thrown their hands up about a bunch of crashes and split the sane stuff out into a separate process.
<pitti> RAOF: anyway, the assertion message is in the stack trace
<RAOF> Which can then crash with impunity.  I don't *think* this is that problem, though.
<RAOF> Yeah; it's a strange dbus problem.
<pitti> jasoncwarner_: you added rls-p-tracking to bug 870643
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 870643 in flashplugin-nonfree "package flashplugin-downloader failed to install/upgrade: wget: unable to resolve host address `archive.canonical.com'" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/870643
<pitti> jasoncwarner_: I'm not quite sure what to do there, though; it's been there for ages, and if you can't reach archive.c.c there's not much that this can do about
<pitti> I think it's correct to let package installation fail there
<jasoncwarner_> pitti: re the bug, can we close the bug then? get some resolution in the system ? I'm fine with that, though maybe a messgae would also be good
<pitti> jasoncwarner_: well, we can keep the bug open, but I don't see us guarantee to fix it
<pitti> so perhaps rls-mgr-p-tracking, or dropping the tag?
<micahg> pitti: slangasek is working on something for this I think
<jasoncwarner_> pitti: I'll remove the tag, for sure. I was more thinking, if we know that is what we are going to do with the bug, go ahead and resolve it and close it :)
<pitti> oh, bug 876298
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 876298 in update-notifier "[FFe] [MASTER] We need to better handle external payloads (Flash, msttcorefonts) not being available." [Critical,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/876298
<micahg> right :)
<pitti> so I think we can make that a dupe
<pitti> dobey: ubuntuone-client-proxy currently wants to go to universe, so I suppose we should seed it somewhere; I was just wondering if it sohldn't be a dependency of something? or do we have an installer shim which will get it on demand?
<tjaalton> did compiz defaults change recently? I use focus-follows-mouse and noticed that autoraise is now on by default
<pitti> I think autoraise had been on for a long time already; I always had to disable it as well
<tjaalton> there is autoraise and raise-on-click.. how confusing :)
<tjaalton> from dconf-editor it seems that autoraise is default false, raise-on-click default true
<tjaalton> but ccsm shows autoraise on, and resetting it always turns it on
<BigWhale> Good morning.
 * didrocks has an evil idea of a workaround
<tjaalton> does anyone know how/where the lightdm session is defined? the hw volume keys don't seem to work on the login screen, and RAOF suggested it might be a missing g-s-d plugin causing that
<seb128> hey
<bryceh> hey is for hearses
<chrisccoulson> hi seb128
<seb128> hey chrisccoulson, how are you?
<chrisccoulson> i can blame bug 956961 on seb128 ;)
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 956961 in firefox "Firefox 11.04.1 does not use the gnome-proxy-settings" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/956961
<seb128> happy beta2 friday!
<chrisccoulson> i'm good thanks
<chrisccoulson> how are you?
<seb128> I'm good thanks
<seb128> chrisccoulson, no you can't, I had to refresh my makefile knowledge thanks to you yesterday
<chrisccoulson> heh
<seb128> you own me already for this one :p
<seb128> chrisccoulson, wth? remove gsettings-desktop-schemas? it's not possible, it provides most of the desktop keys and you know how gsettings handle missing schemas right? ;-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, this is on ubuntu 11.04
<chrisccoulson> the problem is that gsettings-desktop-schemas exists, but nothing uses it
<seb128> oh
<chrisccoulson> so, firefox now thinks it can use gsettings for the proxy settings, because the schema exists
<seb128> I'm clearly not awake ;-)
<chrisccoulson> but it fails because the proxy settings are actually still in gconf :)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, we also have the same issue for background settings, but that's not a new issue in 11.04
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I'm trying to remember if g-d-s was useful for anything in 11.04
<chrisccoulson> yeah, me too
<chrisccoulson> it's not installed by default, is it?
<seb128> I don't think it was
<seb128> oh, good, I still have a natty iso on disk
 * seb128 boots it
<micahg> yes, it was I think
<micahg> a depends of mousetweaks
<micahg> from natty chroot:
<micahg> apt-cache show gsettings-desktop-schemas | grep Task
<micahg> Task: ubuntu-desktop, ubuntu-uec-live, edubuntu-desktop, edubuntu-uec-live, ubuntu-netbook
<seb128> chrisccoulson, yeah, it's installed by default for mousetweaks on natty
<seb128> micahg, thanks
<chrisccoulson> seb128, that's broken then, as gsd is using gconf still
<chrisccoulson> i guess nobody cared about that enough to notice that it doesn't work ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, well it's not really "broken", since most of your client don't try both
<seb128> chrisccoulson, i.e nothing in natty at the time was using gsettings so it was basically not hurting to have the non used gsettings keys around
<seb128> chrisccoulson, can you force the gconf codepatch on < 11.10?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, oh, i meant that mousetweaks is broken. it's changing gsettings keys that nothing else is consuming
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, possibly. but i want a way that is acceptable for upstream builds too really. i'm trying to figure out a way to detect that
<seb128> chrisccoulson, oh, could be, I'm not sure mousetweaks change "common" keys or is a standalone thing, I don't even know what moousetweaks do ;-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, mousetweaks is changing keys in the org.gnome.desktop.a11y.mouse namespace, which is consumed by g-s-d in the current version
<seb128> chrisccoulson, what g-s-d does from them? well as you probably noticed I'm totally ignorant of that stack :p
<chrisccoulson> seb128, i've no idea ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, anyway if nobody noticed mousetweaks being broken in 11.04 in a year I would vote for "don't bother"
<chrisccoulson> i just grepped the source for that namespace, and saw that gsd uses it in the mouse plugin ;)
<chrisccoulson> (but not in 11.04)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, ok, g-s-d run mousetweaks when you activated one of the mouse "tweaks" in g-c-c
<seb128> like dwell click
<seb128> or secondary click
<seb128> chrisccoulson, https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/762806
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 762806 in baltix "[regression] shipped mousetweaks (3.0) does not work with shipped control-center (2.32), needs downgrade" [Undecided,New]
<chrisccoulson> ah :)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, well anyway as said it has been there for a year, people who need mousetweaks probably worked around it or moved away from natty
<seb128> chrisccoulson, let's focus on the firefox side
<seb128> chrisccoulson, you could sru gsettings-desktop-schemas to drop the proxy keys from it ;-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, that could be one idea. and the background keys ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, wfm
<seb128> chrisccoulson, better you could downgrade mousetweaks and make firefox conflicts on gsettings-desktop-schemas :p
<seb128> though I'm not sure that would make upgrades "clean"
<chrisccoulson> that would work too, but would be more work :)
<seb128> i.e update-manager will not likely happily uninstall something
<chrisccoulson> it seems like mousetweaks is the only thing that depends on g-d-s in natty, which is nice and easy
<seb128> right
<seb128> that's the cycle where we decided to not go for GNOME3
<chrisccoulson> i'll just test this here to make sure that it works
<seb128> chrisccoulson, ok
<seb128> chrisccoulson, uninstalling g-d-s on that natty kvm doesn't seem to create any visible issue
<chrisccoulson> cool, thanks
<pitti> oh, it's a seb128! bonjour
<pitti> hey chrisccoulson
<seb128> hey pitti, wie gehts?
<pitti> seb128: gut, danke! feeling my jaw less and less
<pitti> seb128: another day, and you break 300 bugs, well done!
<seb128> pitti, you are getting closer from me again ;-)
<seb128> we might both get there for beta2 ;-)
<pitti> I don't think I can fix that many during the freeze
<chrisccoulson> hi pitti, how are you?
<pitti> quite fine, thanks!
<pitti> how about you?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, ok, that works fine here :)
<ritz_> seb128, morning
<didrocks> pitti: we are tracking a *new* issue that only 2 users are experiencing. To help debugging, can you please bump both unity build? https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/+archive/ppa/+builds?build_state=pending
 * pitti makes a magic whirl move
<didrocks> thanks pitti! ;)
<Sweetshark> today will be libreoffices best day in the new bugs reported department, i guess.
<Sweetshark> bug.freedesktop.org is out of disc space.
<Sweetshark> same for Xorg and a few more, a great day for free software.
<chrisccoulson> lol
<chrisccoulson> we need to do the same for launchpad
<pitti> lol
<didrocks> can we shut down IRC as well? :p
<seb128> didrocks, that's easy, that's called close your IRC client ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: well, I prefer the whole internet to shut down right now to not feel guilty :)
<seb128> hehe
 * ogra_ hands didrocks http://www.turnofftheinternet.com/
<chrisccoulson> "Nightly prevented this site from opening a popup window"
<chrisccoulson> ;)
<didrocks> "This is THE internet" - The IT Crowd
<didrocks> "The Internet is one fire"
<ogra_> well, then you cant shut it down ... though it would make sense anyway to send out a mass mail to everyone first
<didrocks> ok, back to crashy/puzzling issue ;)
<ogra_> so people can save their google docs ;)
<didrocks> ahah
<seb128> ok, most frequent retracers dups this week: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/896289/
<chrisccoulson> pitti, mind copying gsettings-desktop-schemas from https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-mozilla-security/+archive/ppa to natty-proposed?
<chrisccoulson> not sure if you saw the earlier scrollback :)
<seb128> vuntz, hey, did you see bugs like bug #948667
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 948667 in gnome-panel "gnome-panel crashed with SIGSEGV in gtk_widget_pop_verify_invariants()" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/948667
<seb128> vuntz, it's hitting lot of users in precise it seems
<vuntz> seb128: nope
<seb128> vuntz, ok
<dpm> hi pitti, when you've got a minute, could you please copy the 11.10 zh-hans language pack from oneiric-proposed to oneiric-updates? It's been now tested and signed off by someone from the PES team -> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Translations/LanguagePackUpdatesQA#Test_results_Ubuntu_11.10_.22Oneiric_Ocelot.22
<pitti> dpm: ah, sure
<pitti> dpm: for gnome, kde, or both?
<pitti> dpm: nevermind, it says there
<pitti> dpm: done
<dpm> pitti, cool, thanks!
<soren> Can I disable the HUD? I think the idea is great, but every darn time I switch windows, it steals the focus, because I alt-too quickly (or alt-<something> else to switch tabs in Chrome or whatever).
<soren> ER...
<soren> alt-tab too quickly.
<pitti> soren: in ccsm's unity settings you can change the key
<pitti> set it to shift+super+alt+ctrl or so :)
<soren> Or caps lock.
<soren> I never use that.
<soren> That might actually prove useful.
<pitti> soren: I swapped caps lock and esc
<pitti> (yes, that gives me away as heavy vim user :) )
<soren> pitti: I tried that several times. Never managed to make my fingers follow suit.
<pitti> it's so damn useful in vi
<soren> I can deal with switching from Danish keyboard to US ones. Takes me a minute or so, but that's it. The caps-lock<-<Esc thing... Never managed.
<pitti> soren: I can imagine; I'm just plain unable to use vim on a non-swapped keyboard
<pitti> I get lost in "broken" (shifted) keys in seconds
<soren> pitti: Oh, any idea how to do it with unity-2d?
<pitti> and then just scramble up the whole text
<pitti> soren: uh, dconf-editor I suppose
<pitti> $ gsettings list-recursively | grep hud
<pitti> hmm, no match
<tkamppeter_> pitti, hi
<soren> com.canonical.Unity2d.Launcher super-key-enable true
<soren> pitti: "grep super" :)
<pitti> soren: but that's dash, not hud
<soren> *headdesk*
<soren> right.
<pitti> grep Alt doesn't show anything either
<soren> No worries. I'll work it out.
<pitti> soren: so, smells like hardcoded
 * soren apt-get sources unity-2d
<soren> Yup.
<soren> HArdcoded.
<soren> ./shell/app/shellmanager.cpp-    d->m_altHotModifier = KeyboardModifiersMonitor::instance()->getHotModifierFor(Qt::AltModifier);
<soren> ./shell/app/shellmanager.cpp:    connect(d->m_altHotModifier, SIGNAL(tapped()), SLOT(toggleHudRequested()));
<pitti> hey tkamppeter
<soren> ./shell/app/shellmanager.cpp-    d->m_altHotModifier = KeyboardModifiersMonitor::instance()->getHotModifierFor(Qt::AltModifier);
<soren> ./shell/app/shellmanager.cpp:    connect(d->m_altHotModifier, SIGNAL(tapped()), SLOT(toggleHudRequested()));
<soren> Whoops, sorry.
<tkamppeter> pitti, I am preparing a new foomatic-filters package to fix bug 953962 and bug 960989, can I simply upload it? Will it get into beta2 or wait for after beta2? Do I have to upload it into precise-proposed? It is a small change in the upstream code.
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 953962 in foomatic-filters "Several mm left offset on Canon ir3035" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/953962
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 960989 in cups "Misplaced spaces on printout on Canon ir 3035" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/960989
<pitti> tkamppeter: you can upload any time
<pitti> tkamppeter: no -proposed necessary, it's a small package
<tkamppeter> pitti, simply into "precise"?
<pitti> tkamppeter: if you want it in b2, please ask in #ubuntu-release, and we'll review it
<pitti> tkamppeter: yes
<tkamppeter> pitti, OK, thanks.
<pitti> tkamppeter: today it's still fine to do fixes, we just want to avoid breakage
<pitti> didrocks: err...
<pitti> DeviceLauncherIcon::DeviceLauncherIcon(GVolume* volume)
<pitti>   , device_file_(g_volume_get_identifier(volume_, G_VOLUME_IDENTIFIER_KIND_UNIX_DEVICE))
<pitti>   , gdu_device_(get_device_for_device_file(device_file_))
<pitti> didrocks: I'm not quite convinced that an identifier is a valid device file
<pitti> at least not in all cases
<didrocks> pitti: ah interesting
<didrocks> will have a look after the release
<pitti> didrocks: anyway, I'll follow up to the bug
<didrocks> (surely on monday)
<pitti> better there
<didrocks> thanks!
<pitti> ah, hang on, looks like I'm wrong
<pitti> meh, it'd be nice to be able to reproduce this
<tkamppeter> pitti, foomatic-filters_4.0.15-0ubuntu1 uploaded, can you pass it through. Thanks.
<seb128> pitti, yeah, bugs would be easier if you could reproduce them all ;-)
<kamstrup> when stracing compiz metacity I am seeing truckloads of EAGAIN... is that really expected? Seems very odd
<kamstrup> is it just me?
<pitti> compiz or metacity?
<kamstrup> yep, both
<kamstrup> missing an "or" there :-)
<pitti> kamstrup: bug 917210 could be the compiz part
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 917210 in unity "compiz+unity3d generates > 50 wakeups a second on idle system" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/917210
<desrt> hello peeps
<kamstrup> pitti: I am actually on compiz trunk, which the fix should be in if I understand correctly... I am also seeing it from metacity...
<kamstrup> maybe it's not out of the ordinary
<kamstrup> just looks wrong for my uninitiated eyes
<pitti> it certainly is
<pitti> it shouldn't keep trying, but use select() properly
<kamstrup> weird thing is that I am alos seeing it from metacity
<dobey> pitti: the -proxy package is separate because it needs pyqt to work. it should be in main though.
<pitti> dobey: thanks, seeded now; how is it getting installed, if not through dependencies?
<dobey> pitti: right now, it will need to be manually installed by users who need proxy support
<dobey> will likely add it to list of things to install in ubuntuone-installer, but didn't have time to do so for b2
<kamstrup> pitti: apparently lots of EAGAIN are the norm... checked also metacity on UNE on an old Lucid box... go figure
<mterry> seb128, you HATE the lock screen :)
<seb128> mterry, indeed, hate hate hate!
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> how did you guess? ;-)
 * kenvandine enjoyed the day or two we had the unity greeter for the lock screen
<seb128> it's a ugly grey square
<seb128> it feels like win95
<seb128> robert_ancell seems to hate it as well :p
<seb128> kenvandine, context is bug #878836
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 878836 in lightdm "Unity Greeter - Use Unity Greeter to fulfil lock screen as well as login functions" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/878836
<seb128> robert_ancell got https://launchpadlibrarian.net/97835342/IMG_20120322_170218.jpg
<seb128> with https://launchpadlibrarian.net/97835133/0001-Make-gnome-screensaver-look-like-Unity-Greeter.patch which is "not so complicated" patch
<kenvandine> haha
<seb128> I'm tempted to try to push it
<seb128> the current screen is so .... URG
<kenvandine> at least it looks nicer than what we have
<seb128> or at least optional and maybe turn it on by .1 or something :p
<kenvandine> is there a way we can choose to use the greeter for a lock screen ?
<seb128> but I feel like mterry and pitti will ruin my day with reality check and "we are months after ff and uif" ;-)
<kenvandine> indeed :)
<seb128> kenvandine, not really, that doesn't work on non dkms drivers and we never solved the consolekit active session issues (i.e sound stopping on screen locking if you are in a call), nor make the greeter respect user settings for screen power on or suspend
<seb128> i.e too many issues with the vt change and different user
 * mterry is perfectly fine with this lock screen for the next 5 years of 12.04  :)
<seb128> mterry, you never lock your screen I bet :p
<kenvandine> mterry, 5 years of ugly gtk grey box?
 * desrt smacks kenvandine for suggesting that gtk is ugly
<mterry> I like function!
<kenvandine> seb128, i meant if i know the limitations and still willing to use it... it would be cool if i could set that locally
<kenvandine> desrt, i am really tired of that old gtk gray
<desrt> i have to say... as a lot of the UI in gnome-shell world gets changed from these 'ugly grey boxes' to these shiny new things....
<desrt> i miss the ugly grey rectangles
<kenvandine> i'll never miss it
<desrt> kenvandine: your particular brand of 'gtk grey' comes from cimi :)
<seb128> desrt, I guess gnome-shell still has the grey rectangles in their lock screen as well :p
<desrt> seb128: you know... i don't really know what is the story there
<kenvandine> desrt, indeed...
<desrt> seb128: supposedly gnome-shell was moving the lock screen into the WM
<seb128> desrt, story as I read it yesterday on #gnome-hackers that plan is still on but for 3.6 now
<desrt> gotcha
<desrt> it makes sense
<desrt> gnome-screensaver is stupid
<desrt> but i'll miss the rectangles :)
<seb128> ;-)
 * desrt wonders if it's possible to get a 1990s theme for gnome-shell
<seb128> desrt, kill g-s-d
<seb128> you will get it :p
<desrt> unfortunately that doesn't impact shell
<desrt> its default theme is... well, it's default theme
<desrt> which will probably happen for gtk next cycle as well, btw
<desrt> they are about >< this close to having adwaita without a theme engine
<seb128> well it's already the case on most distros
<desrt> so then they just have to import the css into gtk itself
<seb128> you just need to put adwaita in your settings.ini
<desrt> and then we have the default theme as the default theme
<seb128> as the fallback theme
<seb128> it sucks when you have 2 themes then though
<seb128> i.e if you provide a light theme
<mdeslaur> seb128: that screensaver patch would be awesome
<seb128> mdeslaur, ;-)
<seb128> mterry, see!!!
<desrt> to put numbers on it: '>< this close' is 244 lines of code (semicolons)
<seb128> desrt, well, as long as they let you use a different .css I'm fine with that ;-)
<mdeslaur> '>< this close' is only two "FIXME"s in the code :)
<desrt> ya.  of course they do.
<desrt> and in fact, they made that part easier
<desrt> the changed the 'base' css to be empty
<mdeslaur> gulp, including a multimonitor FIXME
<desrt> gtk's "real" default theme is now... very interesting
<seb128> though I still don't understand what is all this hype about dark themes
<seb128> hate those
<desrt> gnome and ubuntu have taken different roads there
<desrt> gnome's approach is less bad than ubuntu's, but still annoying
<seb128> desrt, differently bad but equaly I would say ;-)
<desrt> the only place i see a dark theme variant being useful is in fullscreen
<seb128> desrt, like GNOME put those variants for apps with content
<desrt> so like the totem controls in fullscreen mode... or the boxes controls when the VM is fullscreen
<seb128> i.e totem
<seb128> or eog
<desrt> yes.  i think that's really good
<desrt> i wish apps would only use it in fullscreen, though
<desrt> instead of just "this app will look different from the rest"
<seb128> right
<desrt> that's a very macos thing
<desrt> and it's dumb
<seb128> desrt, do you have any news about the hud icon stuff? we are beta2 frozen now but an upload today should still be ok if you get something
<kenvandine> seb128, think i should update the telepathy packages that had releases last night?
<seb128> kenvandine, if they are bug fix versions please do
<kenvandine> they are
<desrt> seb128: so the gnome designers just gave me a rather convincing story
<kenvandine> i guess worse case they sit in the queue
<desrt> seb128: the dark theme variant is used for applications that deal with visual media -- eog, totem, etc.
<desrt> apparently there is a lot of science that says that images/video should always be viewed with dark chrome around
<desrt> because lighter chrome distorts perception
<seb128> desrt, right, I read about that, I'm just not convinced by how it's done in GNOME
<seb128> desrt, like shotwell did it before and it a nicer visual way in my opinion
<desrt> seb128: i'm of a mixed mind
<desrt> (just installed and opened shotwell for the first time in a long time)
<desrt> i appreciate how the shotwell chrome better matches the rest of the apps
<desrt> but i find the transition between the dark field and the controls immediately adjacent to be a bit jarring
<seb128> desrt, well it's a taste stuff, I hate dark colors with passion
<seb128> desrt, i.e I would take a dark as a color choice for a device I buy either
<seb128> wouldn't
<seb128> like my phone, ipod, etc are colored or white
<seb128> desrt, and GNOME is pushing is far enough so I can't stand the look
<seb128> but yeah, if you have no opinion on color I guess it's ok ;-)
<desrt> seb128: ah.  i guess i disagree there.
<desrt> most things i own are black
<desrt> it's a lot easier to find black usually...
<desrt> seb128: pippin raises an interesting question on the channel, though -- would you buy a white TV?
<pitti> well, for reading lots of text, it's really not a matter of opinion
<desrt> right... there are two things that seem to be at odds with each other
<pitti> as desrt says, you want a black bg for videos/images, and black text on bright background for text
<pitti> (terminals, browsers, etc)
<desrt> black text on white seems to be a better choice (although it'll be a cold day in hell before i switch my terminals from white on black)
<desrt> and image content against black seems the better choice
<desrt> damned human eyes
<pitti> yes, it is; it's not a coincidence that books are being printed that way for centuries :)
<desrt> pitti: i think books are printed that way because it's difficult to imagine as simple of a process to do the inverse ;)
<pitti> desrt: I tried white on black on terminals for a while, but it's horrible
<seb128> pitti, no I don't
<seb128> pitti, shotwell as a subtle grey which I find much better than dark
<desrt> pitti: i use 4 different colours of terminal :)
<pitti> especially on a laptop with a less powerful tft, you get very bad contrast
<desrt> all of them use not-quite-white (#eeeeee or so) for the foreground
<pitti> seb128: well, "dark enough"
<desrt> and the backgrounds are black, red, green and blue
<desrt> (obviously rather darkened shades of each of those)
<Chipaca> hi all. dist-upgrade of precise wants to remove unity. I'm assuming this is not a new new world order, and am delaying :)
<desrt> Chipaca: apt-get upgrade first
<desrt> Chipaca: then apt-get dist-upgrade and only proceed if it makes sense :)
<desrt> usually issues like this get sorted within a few hours
<Chipaca> yarp
<seb128> desrt, I've been told to not recommend "upgrade first"
<Chipaca> which is why i'm delaying
<desrt> really?
<seb128> you miss new Recommends this way
<desrt> ah.  tricky.
<seb128> upgrade doesn't pull new recommends
<desrt> so here's a question
<seb128> and nothing else will store them
<pitti> oh $deity, new unity fixes 61 bugs -- didrocks, you'll break the 500 mark
<desrt> is there a way to apt-get install --reinstall --also-install-recommends-this-time some-package?
<pitti> (soon enough)
 * Chipaca stays with his "dist-upgrade if sane, otherwise delay" strategy of win
<desrt> without requiring the package to be in apt....
<desrt> ie: if i manually installed some .deb file and now i want to pull the recommends of that deb as well
<pitti> there used to be some --fix-policy option
<pitti> mvo: ^
<pitti> kenvandine: hey, good morning
<kenvandine> hey pitti
<pitti> kenvandine: turning http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/testing/precise_probs.html back to beer is in your hands :)
<kenvandine> ugh... again?
<pitti> kenvandine: I took the liberty to give you bug 956041
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 956041 in telepathy-qt4 "Unmet dependency due to farsight being renamed to farstream" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/956041
<pitti> kenvandine: is that just a simple rename, or did the API change, too?
<kenvandine> did they add a new depends or something?
<kenvandine> it was also a soname bump
<kenvandine> not sure if it was an API break
<kenvandine> i don't thinks o
<pitti> kenvandine: no, I suppose gst-farsight just went away
<kenvandine> but i can find out
<didrocks> pitti: you will never catch me! :)
<pitti> kenvandine: libtelepathy-farsight0 itself is uninstallable
<pitti> kenvandine: and I figure we want to eliminate farsight from precise completly?
<kenvandine> right
<pitti> kenvandine: the only reverse depenency is telepathy-qt, and that metapackage (but that's trivial)
 * kenvandine looks at telepathy-qt4
<pitti> kenvandine: thanks
<dobey> hrmm
<dobey> lots of ubuntu package imports seem to be failing with PristineTarError for gnome things now, after the switch to .xz
<seb128> good that we don't use udd :p
<dobey> :(
<dobey> you just break it :P
<seb128> the UDD guys don't need me, their stuff break by itself ;-)
<Adri2000> just out of curiosity, on a precise unity desktop, how is the clock kept synchronized given that ntp isn't installed?
<ogra_> ntpdate is installed
<ogra_> and called on ifup
<Adri2000> ifup, ok. thanks :)
<ogra_> see /etc/network/if-up.d/ntpdate
<Adri2000> right
<pitti> meh, unity-2d doesn't hide the launcher
<pitti> even when telling it to
<pitti> gnome-shell's workspaces are broken/different
<pitti> plz give me any non-unity session which works...
<seb128> pitti, gnome classic?
<pitti> ah, perhaps that one
<ogra_> lubuntu ftw !
<pitti> I now set the laucnher to always show, so that at least the windows aren't underneath it
<seb128> pitti, is that for bug testing or got fed up with unity?
<pitti> seb128: I found a reproducer for bug 916892
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 916892 in unity-distro-priority "gnome-disk-utility crashed with SIGSEGV in gdu_device_get_object_path()" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/916892
<seb128> oh, good
<pitti> seb128: but I can't properly debug this when compiz keeps crashing underneath me :0
<pitti> desrt: dear lazyweb, how do you move between different workspaces in shell, and move windows there?
<desrt> pitti: alt+ctrl+up/down
<pitti> that's what I tried
<desrt> pitti: to move windows, hold shift at the same time
<pitti> that's how it used to work in metacity, compiz, etc.
<pitti> but maybe I have some messed up settings
<desrt> pitti: perhaps you've been negatively impacted by the new keybindings changes in precise?
<desrt> i think there's something involving the windows key on unity now
<desrt> could have made its way into your gnome-shell config...
<pitti> desrt: if it was, I changed that back
<pitti> windows+shift+something else is impossible on my keyboard to do without breaking my hand
<desrt> :)
<desrt> so now you blame the designers for an obvious deficiency in the design of humans?
<desrt> time to upgrade your biology, clearly :p
<pitti> /msg desrt got a site for wetwarez?
<desrt> i'm not sure i'd like to upgrade my biology with random downloaded shit :)
<pitti> I'm sure if that were possible, there would be a scary number of people who would
<desrt> ya
<desrt> we're horrified by what the 'kids these days' are willing to put on facebook
<desrt> we don't yet know the half of it :)
<htorque> dbarth: hi! bug 908564 â the bubble is not supposed to go away after a while when hovered by the pointer?
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 908564 in notify-osd "Notification bubbles not disappearing when hovered by mouse pointer" [High,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/908564
<didrocks> ok, rebooting to -2d and that should be it for the unity release!
<didrocks> pitti: what's up? ;)
<didrocks> I bet there was a joke about "he's not back, he's not back, -2d is broken!"
<didrocks> or a "famous last wordsâ¦" :p
<pitti> I was just happy to see you back, yes :) (non-broken 2d)
<pitti> didrocks: btw, I pretty much understand the gdu crash now
<didrocks> oh? ;)
<didrocks> pitti: well, I just rebuild and retest for my conscious, as we did that with the autobuilt package for the week. But still, I prefer to know exactly how behaves what I upload (as the source is the tarball I reproduce and not just the vcs ):)
<pitti> nice race condition
<G__81> i am interested to contribute to Ubuntu specifically in development. Where do i start from
<didrocks> oh, intereting :)
<didrocks> race condition in gdu
<G__81> when i say Development i mean bug fixing too
<pitti> didrocks: why do you need to change revert_git_keyboard_gsettings.patch ?
<pitti> didrocks: did you put the new patch before that revert?
<didrocks> pitti: right, I put it before (the patch is rather at the end of the stack)
<didrocks> pitti: it's just a quilt refresh basically
<didrocks> pitti: oh maybe you know thatâ¦
<didrocks> pitti: most of the time
<didrocks> quilt push -a
<didrocks> works
<didrocks> but bzr bd fails in applying quilt patches
<pitti> yay more .ui patches :0
<pitti> right, fuzz
<didrocks> pitti: I knew you would love that ;)
<pitti> dpkg doesn't accept any fuzz
<pitti> quilt itself tolerates it
<didrocks> ah ok, it's dpkg, not the way quilt is called
<pitti> so if quit push says "fuzz 1" or so anywhere, you need to refresh
<didrocks> ok ;)
<pitti> s/quit/quilt/
<didrocks> pitti: at least, the .ui changes are contained (and done by hand)
<G__81> sorry i guess i am @ the wrong channel
<didrocks> G__81: oh sorry
<G__81> sorry for the noise
<didrocks> G__81: no, no worry
<didrocks> G__81: dholbach is the guy in charge of helping you :)
<didrocks> G__81: do you know a little bit about packaging?
<G__81> didrocks, yes i know packaging in fedora as i have been a fedora developer :)
<G__81> ;-)
<didrocks> ah ok ;) so you are already aware about the distro concepts, let me point you to the debian/ubuntu packaging guide
<seb128> G__81, http://www.ubuntu.com/community/get-involved might be a good start
<G__81> didrocks, yeah i have been contributing to few up-stream projects too and those are used by Ubuntu as well :)
<G__81> i have few questions though so that you guys could help me out
<pitti> seb128: indeed, pkexec <gui app> requires an accompanying .policy file which allows keeping $DISPLAY
<didrocks> G__81: use the link seb128 pointed :)
<didrocks> G__81: you can still ask your questions of course
<seb128> G__81, if you have question feel free to ask them ;-)
<seb128> pitti, oh ok, thanks for the explanation, well that patch was added recently when syncing with Debian, we don't need it for admin users so I just dropped it
<pitti> seb128: "adm", yes
<G__81> i read an article somewhere where it said how to fix a bug in Ubuntu. The article said, take the bug, get the source using bzr and then fix the bug and push that into bzr. Is that how it works ? My question here is when it said fix the code, does it mean the actual source or the spec file ?
<G__81> or put the other way In Ubuntu do you guys actually work on the actual sources too or is it only packaging ?
<seb128> G__81, we do both
<seb128> we fix upstream bugs and do packaging (new versions updates, etc)
<seb128> G__81, read https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/HowToFix maybe?
<G__81> seb128, so lets say there is some bug in gedit, you get the source and you fix it and push it using some bzr stuff ?
<pitti> G__81: actually, it's not sufficient to just fix it in our bzr branches, you also have to report and send it upstream
<G__81> pitti, yeah makes sense
<G__81> :)
<seb128> G__81, it's a bit more complexe, it should be, desktop package use a special workflow, you can read https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Bzr is should not be too long and have details
<seb128> G__81, but basically for i.e gedit you would do
<seb128> bzr branch lp:~ubuntu-desktop/gedit/ubuntu
<G__81> now the second question is I have a Ubuntu 11.10 64 bit and can i use that and get the packages and fix it right, you guys dont mandate that its got to be 12.04 beta right ?
<seb128> G__81, you can fix bugs in old versions, but usually it's better to work on the current version to ensure the bug is fixed at the propose place and that you don't dup work
<seb128> somebody might have already fixed the bug you look at in 12.04 beta
<G__81> seb128, infact to be frank i dont have Ubuntu yet installed :) so my plan is to install 11.10 in my system
<seb128> you are welcome to backport fixes and propose a stable update if you think the fix is worth backporting though
<seb128> G__81, ok, 12.04 beta2 is due next week maybe give it a try? it's a lts cycle and beta2 should be pretty stable
<G__81> I have been a fedora user since its inception. Its started crashing and i dont have the patience to reinstall it and get yum updates..
<seb128> 11.10 should be a safe bet so yeah, go for that ;-)
<seb128> you can always update to 12.04 in a month if you want
<G__81> seb128, hmmm...... so is it mandatory for a person to contribute in Ubuntu to have the beta or the RCs to be running ?
<seb128> G__81, no
<seb128> it just makes things easier
<seb128> i.e your patch made on 11.10 might not apply to the current version
<seb128> the code might have changed etc
<seb128> G__81, quite some people work on git though
<seb128> like they would get gedit from upstream git
<seb128> fix the bug
<G__81> ok seb128 cool. So if someone can help me to fix the first bug in terms of the process so that i get a feel of the process, it would be very helpful
<seb128> then submit a patch to ubuntu with the fix
<G__81> so you all use jhbuild or is there a PPA for eg:if i have to contribute to some gnome package ?
<seb128> G__81, read https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/devweek1201/FixingDesktopBugs
<desrt> seb128: icon fix is merge-proposed
<seb128> G__81, that's an IRC tutorial I gave where I explained how to backport a GNOME git commit to a package
<seb128> desrt, \o/
<G__81> oh ok seb128 thats cool
<G__81> seb128, cool i guess this process you mentioned there is lot simpler than jhbuild stuff. Is my understanding right ?
<seb128> G__81, it should be simple enough yes
<G__81> seb128, cool so i would first install Ubuntu and then log in back here
<G__81> seb128, in the LP, is there a Ubuntu Desktop team and can i add myself there ?
<seb128> G__81, you can subscribe to https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-desktop which is our list ... the launchpad team gives upload rights so it's not open, you need to do some work and go through sponsoring before being added
<G__81> oh i thought that once i get added to that team, i get subscribed to the email
<G__81> oh i didnt know the team there is for different purpose
<G__81> seb128, thanks for your time. I am off to start my install. Lets see how it goes and hopefully i should be back here :)
<seb128> G__81, ok, good luck, and don't worry if it's quiet over the w.e here
<G__81> ok sure seb128 thanks
<seb128> G__81, there are quite some people working on Ubuntu full time during the week here and not around on the weekends
<G__81> seb128, oh ok
<G__81> i understand
<seb128> well you will probably still find people around
<seb128> but it's less busy than during the week ;-)
<G__81> seb128, i am sure my questions would be answered by every single guy here @ least for the next few weeks as i am new bie :)
<seb128> ;-)
<G__81> ok thanks seb128 for your time.
<seb128> you're welcome!
<G__81> i would fix one bug and then subscribe myself to the ML ;-)
<seb128> desrt, your icon support works great!
<desrt> :D
<desrt> which is to say, "it works"
<desrt> :)
<seb128> yeah, I wouldn't expect less from you ;-)
<desrt> except before when... it didn't work
<seb128> you wouldn't disappoint me twice :p
<desrt> gonna sneak it in before the freeze?
<seb128> no, freeze was yesterday at 21utc
<desrt> oh
<seb128> I'm going to sneak it in now
<desrt> oh well
<desrt> oh.  i see :)
<seb128> and get pitti to ack it
<seb128> stuff still go in until monday they just need to be reviewed
 * desrt is quite fond of this rare period of time when he only has 5 hours different to europe
<desrt> i get one more hour of pitti in my days :)
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> don't get used to it
<pitti> lol
<seb128> we change time this .we
<desrt> damn
<mvo> pitti: there is still apt-get install --fix-policy , no?
<mvo> (sorry for the late reply)
<pitti> mvo: right, I just wans't sure what the exact incantation was
<pitti> thanks!
<soren> mvo: --fix-policy? What does that do=
<soren> ?
<seb128> pitti, I just uploaded an indicator-appmenu update which brings back icons updates to the hud, you could call it a feature but it's little code and it fixes a regression in the refactoring which happened after beta1, I would appreciate if you could ack it
<seb128> on that I'm out for some exercice, will be back in ~1hour deal with end of week email and backlog then be off
<mvo> soren: it installs all the missing recommends (or if you include --install-suggest all of those as well)
<dpm> pitti, I've been checking on the progress of the precise full langpack. It seems you or someone else marked it as active on https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/precise/+language-packs already. Just a quick heads up that it seemed to take about 8h instead of the usual 22h, so I'd be a bit wary as to whether the export went well
<pitti> dpm: yes, I was quite surprised that it was so fast; but it seemed complete
<pitti> in fact, it had a lot more stuff than the previous ones
<pitti> such as adding gcc-4.4
<pitti> dpm: I uploaded the new langpacks already
<dpm> pitti, ah, that's cool. Do you have the logs of the build still on the langpacks server? They are often useful to spot problems in templates in LP
<pitti> dpm: yes, precise.log
<dpm> pitti, great, I'll have a look
<dpm> hey all, could someone have a look at bug/855144
<dpm> argh, bug 855144
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 855144 in colord "Localizations are not shipped" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/855144
<dpm> it's just a matter of creating the pot file on build, either with dh_translations or with a call to intltool -p
<soren> mvo: Oh, neat.
<mvo> soren: yeah, if you add -o Debug::pkgDepCache::AutoInstall=true it also tells you what pulls in what
<pitti> good night everyone
<mpt> Wot, 2012 and launchpad-integration is still shipping by default?
<seb128> mpt, why not?
<seb128> mpt, we would all love to drop that, it's most of the diff we have over Debian for GNOME
<seb128> mpt, if you don't like it please bring up dropping it at UDS ;-)
<mpt> seb128, because it clutters up the Help menu of many applications, 1/3 of it is obsolete with Ask Ubuntu, and the other 2/3 assumes that someone opening the Help menu is a geek :-)
<seb128> mpt, translations are for geeks?
<mpt> seb128, is there a Default Apps blueprint yet?
<GridCube> good evening, while doing todays beta2  test on xubuntu installed in spanish, i noticed that the progam onboard would not launch, after reporting the bug on launchpad (#963216), it was pointed as a dupe of (#958385), wich says the problem is fixed "in trunk", what should be done to fix the problem on xubuntu b2?
<mpt> seb128, translations aren't, but translating software is
<seb128> mpt, we will not do "default apps" again, that was a disaster we said we should better stop :p
<seb128> mpt, we will turn that to "call for specific topics and discuss those"
<mpt> seb128, so in what context would it be discussed at UDS? It would take about 5 minutes
<mpt> (I hope:-)
<seb128> mpt, everybody was coming with all the reasons why they hate $apps before
<seb128> mpt, I will make room for it in a session and invite you, maybe one on lowering diff with Debian and upstream, or better handling our diffs
<mpt> seb128, good idea, thanks
<seb128> yw
<seb128> mpt, lpi -> we drop the "report a bug" at release time
<seb128> i.e we just have those for unstable cycles
<seb128> mpt, so we keep translations and get help
<desrt> interesting question
<desrt> if i 'apt-get source linux' it says
<desrt> Picking 'linux-meta' as source package instead of 'linux'
<desrt> so i have to say apt-get source linux-image-3.2.0-19-generic in order for it to say:
<desrt> Picking 'linux' as source package instead of 'linux-image-3.2.0-19-generic'
<desrt> ...which is what i asked for in the first place
<caB00T> Just wanna publicly express my enthusiasm ab swtiching to Linux slowly,
<caB00T> Those virtual desktops for example, the thing I never knew I needed so bad... :>
<seb128> caB00T, thanks, good to have nice feedback ;-)
<seb128> lol @https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nautilus/+bug/40872/comments/97
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 40872 in nautilus "Desktop icons are allowed to overlap" [Low,Confirmed]
<desrt> BOYCOTT NAUTILUS!
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, he posted the same comment on the gnome bug too
<chrisccoulson> i just saw that on twitter
<desrt> i wonder what olav will do to him :p
<seb128> I was wondering putting a CoC comment
<seb128> but it's friday and I can't be bothered ;-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, oh, you should think of a funny response instead. did you see the responses on the gnome bug?
<chrisccoulson> they've turned it in to a bit of a joke ;)
<chrisccoulson> https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=313563#c27
<seb128> chrisccoulson, no, let me look
<ubot2`> Gnome bug 313563 in Desktop "Icons can be on top of each other." [Minor,New]
<mdeslaur> hehe
<seb128> lol
<caB00T> I installed 11.10 and put Gnome onto a VirtualBox.
<caB00T> I can't seem to find drivers for my monitor (lap top, wide screen), it's an ATI Radeon, I hear there are problems with those?
<caB00T> So does problems = impossible or just a pain in the ass?
<caB00T> :)
<seb128> caB00T, the ati open source driver should work and you can install the fglrx ati binary driver
<seb128> though dunno about "in virtualbox"
<caB00T> Prolly the same, I'll try.
<caB00T> :)
<caB00T> And one more question,
<caB00T> What are those "online accounts" etc when I click on my username in the top corner?
<seb128> way to configure your online account
<seb128> like a google account
<seb128> so the im client get your gtalk configured
<caB00T> im = instant massanger?
<seb128> or the email client your gmail configured (if you use evolution, thunderbird doesn't support that feature)
<seb128> yes
<caB00T> So the idea is all Ubuntu users can communicate?
<caB00T> Interesting stuff... :)
<seb128> yeah
<seb128> well it's not ubuntu specific, internet is somewhat about communication ;-)
<caB00T> Well ofc, but you don't see it on any Windows... :)
<seb128> you can communicate via other OSes, phones, tablets, etc as well
<bcurtiswx> didrocks, congrats on the Unity release
<didrocks> bcurtiswx: thanks! Congrats to the whole dx team as well :)
 * didrocks is busy copying from -proposed to the release archive now
<bcurtiswx> absolutely!
<dobey> anyone know a good way to loop over everything in a GtkTreeModel with GI+python?
<caB00T> I went Synaptic Package Manager -> Typed in "gnome-device-manager" And then got gpe-appmanager, I mark it for install, it gives me the menu with some things and a "mark" button, I click on it, and get: "gpe-appmanager: Depends: gpe-confg but it won't be installed. Any ideas?
<seb128> caB00T, dunno but that doesn't seem like a package used or maintained you should probably not install it
<seb128>  
<seb128> ok, stupid gtk question
<seb128> how do I set a width limit to a dialog so long labels ellipsize rather than resizing the dialog?
<caB00T> I am trying to install the gnome-device-manager, I am following a book.
<caB00T> :\
<GridCube> sorry for repeating myself but:  while doing todays beta2  test on xubuntu installed in spanish, i noticed that the progam onboard would not launch, after reporting the bug on launchpad (#963216), it was pointed as a dupe of (#958385), wich says the problem is fixed "in trunk", what should be done to fix the problem on xubuntu b2?
<seb128> bug #958385
<ubot2`> Launchpad bug 958385 in onboard "Encoding mismatch when mousetweaks is missing" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/958385
<seb128> micahg, ^
<micahg> seb128: umm, did you mean that for me?
<micahg> ah, right, xubuntu :)
<seb128> micahg, I somewhat though you were the closest from xubuntu there
<seb128> but feel free to ignore that ;-)
<micahg> seb128: sorry, I was thinking back to our mousetweaks discussion 8 hours ago :)
<astraljava> seb128: onboard is in ubuntu-desktop task, too, so I'm not sure it's Xubuntu-specific. Is it?
<micahg> seb128: well, I don't think we want mousetweaks in xubuntu as it pulls in g-c-c
<seb128> astraljava, because ubuntu install moustweaks
<micahg> plus as astraljava said we don't even have onboard which is weird
<seb128> micahg, xubuntu has no onscreen keyboard?
<micahg> oh, wait, we do have onboard
<astraljava> seb128: Oh, I see.
<micahg> seb128: could we go for an onboard bug fix upload during the freeze?
<seb128> micahg, you probably can
<caB00T> Ok so I found out that the gnome-device-manager is discontinued, any equivalent you guys reccomend?
<micahg> seb128: thanks
<seb128> yw
<seb128> caB00T, what do you need?
<seb128> dinner time, bbl
<caB00T> I am swapping from Windows and using a book to help me,
<caB00T> There is suppose to be a device manager equivalent called gnome-device-manger but it's discontinued - the book is not exactly brand new, from 2009 I think.
<caB00T> So if anyone can reccomned something would be  great?
<bcurtiswx> caB00T, there is a channel devoted to support, and I would imagine they can help you better than people in here would. join #ubuntu
<caB00T> Oh, this is not a support channel? Sorry. :\
<mterry> desrt, how do gvfs daemons receive secrets like user passwords?  I assume not over dbus directly
<didrocks> ok, will check in an hour that everything is published and upgrade
<didrocks> for now, dinner time :)
<didrocks> have a good week-end everyone!
<Saviq> hey, anyone else experiencing firefox being a pain (like 5s stalled) when switching from other apps to firefox?
<dobey> Saviq: i've noticed disk i/o being a pain. only time i've had temporary ui hangs like that
<Saviq> dobey, SSD here..., nothing else shows such behavior
<Saviq> firefox just hogs the cpu for some seconds and then goes back to normal
<Saviq> private browsing is affected, so I'd assume nothing in my profile - maybe some plugin
<dobey> Saviq: does it always happen, or only when say xapian-update-index or whatever, is running, or when installing lots of packages during dist-upgrade, or while send/recv is running in evolution or thunderbird?
<Saviq> dobey, every time
<Saviq> will try with a guest account
<Saviq> hmm guest account unaffected
<bcurtiswx> have a good weekend everyone
<cyphermox> is someone looking into the vte bug or am I the volunteer for it? :)
<cyphermox> mterry: ^ just curious if you're still on libvte, there's an issue with finding the termcap file
<mterry> cyphermox, heyo
<cyphermox> mterry: hey ;) how are you ? :D
<mterry> cyphermox, I haven't done much on libvte recently, no.  But I could lend a hand if it would help
<micahg> a reboot fixed it for me
<cyphermox> ah, maybe that's all I need
<micahg> I don't think it's nice,but it's still beta :)
<cyphermox> mterry: I was only asking because you seem to be the last one who touched vte, maybe I misread
<mterry> cyphermox, probably was  :)
<micahg> would probably be good to fix for final as killing the terminal interaction in the running session isn't very friendly
<cyphermox> micahg: I was able to work around it by symlinking its -0.0 directory to -2.90
<cyphermox> I'll try rebooting, in case that's good enough here too
<cyphermox> micahg: indeed, not seen after a reboot; but I'm sure that would affect the upgrade until the system is rebooted, that's definitely suboptimal
<micahg> cyphermox: right
<cyphermox> no idea how to correctly fix this though :)
<kklimonda> hmm, is there a bug that lightdm doesn't provide any way to configure network before logging in?
<cyphermox> kklimonda: not per se. what do you want to configure exactly, I may be able to offer solutions
<cyphermox> it was discussed as a blueprint though
<kklimonda> cyphermox: users in LDAP, authentication with kerberos, $HOME on the NFS share :)
<kklimonda> and laptop with wifi
<cyphermox> kklimonda: right, that's the use case we wanted to cover.
<cyphermox> kklimonda: if you're connected over wired then it should basically magically work if it's with DHCP
<kklimonda> cyphermox: yes it does
<cyphermox> but you'll still also need wifi and such
<cyphermox> after the first login if wifi is setup then if that's all there is available it also *should* work
<cyphermox> but it doesn't cover the first login with just wifi
<kklimonda> yeah, it's unfortunate :)
<cyphermox> kklimonda: yeah, but not overly difficult to fix; if you don't care too much about hiding parts of the menu
<cyphermox> kklimonda: I assume you maybe are interested in preseeded setups?
<cyphermox> basically, "all" that is missing is that nm-applet should get started in the lightdm session; and it isn't right now
<kklimonda> cyphermox: ah, it's that simple? interesting
<cyphermox> I do think it's just that
<kklimonda> interesting, I'll give it a try
<cyphermox> but then you'll have the whole menu from nm-applet, and it will be running as lightdm so there may be missing permissions to create system-wide connections
<cyphermox> kklimonda: let me know how it goes, and/or file bugs and I'll see if we can get them fixed before release.
<kklimonda> I wonder whether the network connection configured before login is going to stay alive during and after login
<Saviq> dobey, found the offender, btw - it's the globalmenu integration, I'd assume HUD is digging through all the menus every time Firefox is activated
<Saviq> I'd say bookmarks are killing it
<cyphermox> kklimonda: supposed to if it's system-wide
<desrt> Saviq: hm?
<Saviq> desrt, every time I activate Firefox, CPU spikes and the browser is stuck for several seconds
<Saviq> disabling the globalmenu integration helps
<desrt> even without opening the hud?
<Saviq> yes
<desrt> it's true that there is a recent change to aggressively mine the firefox menus in the hud
<desrt> but it should only happening when doing a hud search
<Saviq> desrt, if I kill hud-service
<Saviq> it goes away again
<desrt> and you can freely open/close firefox with no problems?
<Saviq> desrt, no updates in queue for me
<Saviq> desrt, yes, it just stalls for several seconds
<Saviq> then works fine until I go away again
<desrt> tricky.
<desrt> i wonder if somehow the use count is leaking....
<Saviq> desrt, doesn't happen on guest account
<Saviq> desrt, so my assumption would be bookmarks
<Saviq> I have some - not a huge amount, though
<Saviq> should probably drop them anyway... not using them at all
<desrt> there is a bug to optimise this situation
<desrt> but it shouldn't happen at all when you open firefox for the first time
<desrt> so hud-service was running... this presumably means that you did some searching using the hud at some point
<Saviq> yeah sure it was a long running session
<Saviq> and hud is giving tons of results btw
<desrt> so hud internally maintains a usecount
<desrt> it should be zero when no searches are active
<jbicha> cyphermox: if nm-applet was running in the greeter, we'd want to hide "Edit Connections", right since it has all of the network passwords easily accessible there?
<desrt> i wonder if for some reason it's failing to go back to zero for you
<Saviq> desrt, let me reboot, some updates went in some time ago, didn't reboot since then
<desrt> Saviq: killall hud-service would be enough...
<desrt> when it spawns again it would be the new one
<Saviq> desrt, yeah but I've a new kernel in store etc.
<desrt> doubt it would matter
<desrt> but doesn't hurt
<Saviq> me too
 * desrt has to run off for a bit
<desrt> i'll take a peek later and see if i can reproduce what you're seeing
<desrt> ciao
<Saviq> desrt, just to follow up, new session, hud-service is already there (unity-2d here, probably invoking hud-service over DBus)
<Saviq> and issue still here
<kklimonda> ah, I'm seeing firefox and hud-service spinning out of control with unity-2d
<kklimonda> but not with unity 3d
<kklimonda> I wonder if it's related
<cyphermox> jbicha: yeah, that's why i meant the permissions may be a little annoying there
<cyphermox> but it's getting late to do this, and in fact you might want to be able to create a wifi network from lightdm, if it's a first boot (despite it being much of an edge case)
<jbicha> creating a wifi network should be fine, it's viewing existing networks with their passwords that rubs me wrong
<cyphermox> jbicha: you don't necessarily can
<cyphermox> that's the trick, lightdm permissions will be screwed when it's started in that session
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-03-24
<kklimonda> cyphermox: what permissions are we talking about?
<cyphermox> kklimonda: lightdm may not be able to create system-wide connections
<cyphermox> kklimonda: and if it can, it means someone in the login screen could read passwords of system-wide connections, potentially
<kklimonda> cyphermox: and I guess it can't really handle its connection to the user session?
<cyphermox> if it's not system-wide, no
<cyphermox> but if you're preseeding installs or dropping files on the FS after the install you can easily create wifi connections that way
<cyphermox> what I mean is if lightdm creates a local connection, it's only available for lightdm, unless the permissions are adjusted accordingly at the time the connection is created
<kklimonda> right
 * desrt wonders: should you not be able to take an ubuntu-standard install and install ubuntu-desktop and expect it to work
<G__81> hi everyone
#ubuntu-desktop 2012-03-25
<Laney> pitti: or anyone, you might like to look at bug #912789 from a desktop pov
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 912789 in libgxps "FFe: Sync libgxps 0.2.1-1 (universe) from Debian testing (main)" [Unknown,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/912789
<jbicha> Laney: it needs to be in the archives before it can get an MIR anyway though, right?
<Laney> yes, but there is not much point syncing if the evince support isn't going to happen
<Laney> unless the utility is wanted i guess
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-03-18
<TheMuso> c
<BigWhale> Good Morning everyone.
<mlankhorst> morning!
<pitti> Good morning
<BigWhale> Who do I vent to if I want to vent about Nautilus? :/
<jibel> good morning
<didrocks> salut jibel
<jibel> bonjour didrocks
 * didrocks grrr at magners
<jpds> Anyone else have problems on raring where a full-screen application, isn't really full-screen?
<didrocks> jpds: yeah, known issue, fixed in trunk, waiting for mterry to publish unity
<tjaalton> didrocks: hey, who was it again that was supposed to look into the issue where some unity/compiz settings get reset on upgrade?
<didrocks> tjaalton: I think smspillaz had an idea on what is causing it
<tjaalton> ah
<tjaalton> ok I'll ping him later
<didrocks> :)
<pitti> RAOF: are you aware of the colord autopkgtest failure? looks like colord has FTBFSed for a while
<RAOF> pitti: No, I'm not; also, I see the most recent colord in my archives?
<pitti> some CDSensor.../ cd_sensor_* unknown symbols
<pitti> https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/view/Raring/view/AutoPkgTest/job/raring-adt-colord/11/ARCH=i386,label=adt/artifact/results/log
<RAOF> Looks like it's pretending to be on kFreeBSD?
<seb128> hey desktopers
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<RAOF> pitti: Why hasn't that stopped propagation from raring-proposed to raring?
<pitti> RAOF: britney doesnt' look at autopkgtest yet
<seb128> salut pitti
<RAOF> Aha, that would be why.
<seb128> hey RAOF
<RAOF> Ok, I'll look at colord tomorrow. I've been meaning to make that autopkgtest a bit more awesome anyway.
<RAOF> pitti: Thanks!
<pitti> ah, thanks!
<Laney> hallo!
<pitti> hey Laney
<seb128> hey Laney
<Laney> hey pitti, seb128
<Laney> did you have good weekends?
<pitti> quite fine indeed, thanks! and you?
<seb128> w.e was quite ok here, weather was grey and rainy though
<Laney> not so bad, managed to get out on the bike in the gaps in the rain
<pitti> it was actually quite sunny here (but cold)
<pitti> sunny enough for ice cream, anyway (inside)
<pitti> but it's swowing again now, yay
<pitti> snowing, too
<Laney> spring starts on Wednesday, no fear ;-)
<mlankhorst> :D
 * mlankhorst sends waves of snow Laney's way
<Laney> :<
<mlankhorst> spring soon!
<mlankhorst> lets wrap up this winter
<czajkowski> morning folks
<czajkowski> would anyone be able to share any light on why I do an update on Raring, it's breaking my virtual Box so I have to kick it each time via http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/5624797/
<ogra_> czajkowski, #ubuntu-kernel perhaps ?
<czajkowski> ok cheers ogra_
<ogra_> looks like a module issue
<mitya57> let's have virtualbox broken in every release!
 * mitya57 wonders when will someone sponsor lp:~mitya57/ubuntu/precise/virtualbox/4.1.12-dfsg-2ubuntu0.3 for him
<jibel> didrocks, I filed bug 1156540 for the issue we had this morning
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1156540 in cowdancer (Ubuntu) "cowdancer deletes bind-mounted directories" [Critical,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1156540
<didrocks> jibel: merci!
<czajkowski> didrocks: any idea where to send mitya57 to so they can get their branch sponsored
<didrocks> czajkowski: sorry, do you have some context? :-) which projects?
<czajkowski> 09:52 < mitya57> let's have virtualbox broken in every release!
<czajkowski> 09:52  * mitya57 wonders when will someone sponsor lp:~mitya57/ubuntu/precise/virtualbox/4.1.12-dfsg-2ubuntu0.3 for him
<Laney> it's already in the sponsor queue
<didrocks> czajkowski: they should just follow the sponsorship process :)
<didrocks> ah, so it's already in the queue :)
<czajkowski> Laney: didrocks cheers I didn't know :)
<Laney> someone will get to it soon; four days isn't overly long to wait (unfortunately?)
<didrocks> :)
<mitya57> that's not urgent for me (at all), but the large sponsoring queue %Bis%B a problem
<mitya57> oops, that was *is* :)
<seb128> mitya57, the sponsoring queue is sort of under control
<seb128> it was close from 40 items on friday
<mlankhorst> \o/
<seb128> with a stack of "needs packaging" bugs
<pitti> robru, didrocks: oh, friends is apparently part of the daily autolanding -- how does one fix the broken autopkgtests?
<pitti> I guess I shouldn't just manually upload?
<didrocks> pitti: just propose a branch upstream :)
<didrocks> and it will be in tomorrow daily release, published if ken acks it
<pitti> didrocks: oh, is the packaging part of the upstream branch?
<didrocks> pitti: right
<pitti> urgh
<pitti> didrocks: d'accord, merci !
<didrocks> pitti: de rien :)
<didrocks> pitti: make dist doesn't dist the pakcaging
<didrocks> but I don't have the time to give the full rationale again :)
<pitti> no worries
<didrocks> pitti: python3-dbusmock is in universe, do you think it can go to main?
<pitti> didrocks: bug 1154126
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1154126 in python-dbusmock (Ubuntu) "[MIR] python-dbusmock" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1154126
<pitti> it was approved, so feel free to promote
<didrocks> excellent! :)
<didrocks> thanks pitti. Will promote once indicator-messages published
<didrocks> pitti: because it already happened more than once that prepromotion was demotedâ¦
<pitti> robru, kenvandine: https://code.launchpad.net/~pitti/friends/fix-autopkgtest/+merge/153749, s'il vous plaÃ®t
<lool> tjaalton: Hey, since recent updates xrandr detects a VGA display attached on my laptop, but nothing is connected; how could I check whether this is kernel or xorg related?
<lool> I've read dmesg, but I wasn't able to spot informtion from the i915 logs
<tjaalton> lool: it's a kernel regression, 20afbda209d708 is needed from linus
<tjaalton> boot -12, it should work
<lool> tjaalton: ok, so known/reported and being fixed already, thanks
<tjaalton> known, not fixed yet
<lool> tjaalton: is this something we could auto-test for?  I guess it's super hardware specific
<tjaalton> lool: aiui it's oly on gen4 hw, what do you have?
<tjaalton> *only
<tjaalton> yeah dunno how to autotest hw specific stuff, other than having each gen represented in some lab
<lool> tjaalton: I have super old intel
<lool> 00:02.0 VGA compatible controller: Intel Corporation Mobile 4 Series Chipset Integrated Graphics Controller (rev 07)
<lool> not sure how to find a more useful name for it
<tjaalton> yeah it's fourth generation
<lool> Intel Graphics Media Accelerator 4500MHD
<tjaalton> the kernel stable series picked up an incomplete set of patches to fix some bug, missing this commit
<lool> tjaalton: just curious, are we testing new kernel / xorg stacks against all hardware revisions in our cert lab?
<tjaalton> don't think so
<tjaalton> probably should know though :)
<lool> sounds bad not to leverage this to try to catch bugs
<lool> (even if this particular bug might not be covered because we might not have this particular class of hardware)
<didrocks> xnox: hey, do you know when steve or anyone on your team will look at the ubuntu-platform source?
<didrocks> xnox: as it's the first one, maybe would be better to get this one in first :)
<xnox> didrocks: ack. I think it will end up being me doing all the vorlon's tasks on that blueprint.
<didrocks> xnox: well, at least, you will bring consistency between MP :)
<xnox> didrocks: I did this one as "simple" trial run. Will look at others in a moment ;-)
<didrocks> xnox: I don't really have time to review them right now properly (but feel free to continue, first look, it sounds fine)
<didrocks> thanks xnox :)
<didrocks> xnox: oh, i'm a little bit pendantic about on dep per line though
<didrocks> xnox: and trailing , so that next diff doesn't have 2 lines when adding something
<xnox> didrocks: ack. ack. Not sure who is doing MIR to land it into raring though. I believe vorlon volunteered, and not sure if that got delegated yet or not.
<didrocks> also, you miss the info on debian/control
<xnox> didrocks: patches to wrap and sort are welcome!
 * xnox did run it... unless you want further tweaks to it.
<xnox> wrap-and-sort --didrocks-mode
<xnox> aliased to --pedantic
<didrocks> xnox: well, the rest sounds fine, I would appreciate if you have the time to finish this :-)
<didrocks> xnox: can wrote the comment on the MP, one sec
<didrocks> xnox: commented :)
<xnox> didrocks: thanks a lot ! will fix up.
<didrocks> xnox: thanks to you :-)
<seb128> mitya57, it's fine to use the serie name without -proposed for SRUs nowadays
<seb128> just for info
<mitya57> seb128: thanks, I forgot about that
<kenvandine> pitti, thanks!
<pitti> hey kenvandine, how are you?
<kenvandine> great
<kenvandine> and you?
<pitti> I'm getting a cold (argh), but otherwise quite well
<seb128> kenvandine, hey, had a good w.e?
<kenvandine> i did
<pitti> kenvandine: does the CI test run again automatically? I added a commit message back then and clicked on that jenkins link, but I didn't see another test run
<kenvandine> no, but the ci test did show success.  so i marked it as approved
<kenvandine> so the merger will run
<kenvandine> didrocks, do you know if we'll see an update of ubuntu-ui-toolkit for raring?
<didrocks> kenvandine: not sure, quite busy with other stuffs, why?
<didrocks> kenvandine: something to ask to cyphermox who is in charge of his stack
<kenvandine> didrocks, it includes styling changes to PageStack that i need for gwibber
<kenvandine> and i am going to file an MIR for that today :)
<kenvandine> although i haven't really looked at the packaging yet...
<kenvandine> cyphermox, ^^
<didrocks> kenvandine: btw webappsâ¦ still in manual publishing mode for days and days :/
<didrocks> despite the pings
<didrocks> (not really happy)
<kenvandine> didrocks, you mean the package split?
<didrocks> kenvandine: no, the daily release job
<kenvandine> i'm looking, i thought i manually published that already
<didrocks> thanks kenvandine
<didrocks> kenvandine: it looks wrong to me looking at it btw
<didrocks> kenvandine: the change in symbols was done manually, not automatically
<didrocks> and list a version > of the changelog one
<didrocks> it should have been 0replaceme
<didrocks> so that the daily release change for the right version
<seb128> mterry, hey, had a good w.e?
<mterry> seb128, sort of.  I was a bit sick and still am, but hopefully can work fine
<seb128> mterry, I looked at the unity/autopilot issues this morning, found out the buggy commit and Trevinho fixed the issue (it's r2222) ... can you kick a retry or unity build/daily landing?
<seb128> mterry, oh ok, get better!
<seb128> retry of*
<mterry> seb128, yup
<xnox> didrocks: default priority should be Optional, instead of extra?! Agree, disagree, keep as it is?
<didrocks> xnox: completely agree :-)
 * didrocks is always nagging seb128 about it :p
 * seb128 couldn't care less :p
<ogra_> Extoptional
<ogra_> ^^^ compromise
<seb128> time for some exercice, be back in ~1h
<xnox> didrocks: why are we purging debian/source/format ? to mix-and-match how it's build? (native and non-native)
<didrocks> xnox: hum, you don't really need, you can put it to 1.0
<didrocks> xnox: I don't really care as long as it's not 3.0 ;)
<xnox> didrocks: how / when are we going to land libhybris? as these packages depend on it....
<didrocks> xnox: ogra_ was telling it's not needed. ogra_ ?
<ogra_> huh ?
 * ogra_ cant remeber saying such a thing ... 
<didrocks> ogra_: libhybris is a runtime dep, right?
<didrocks> not build time?
<xnox> ogra_: platform-api & qtubuntu-sensors at the moment build-dep on libhybris. And both of them are compat/wrapper/provider libs around libhybris by the looks of things.
<ogra_> we need the ubuntu side of libhybris  pakckaged
<didrocks> and so if we have the ubuntu-platform api built
<xnox> (as well as other)
<ogra_> not the android side though
<ogra_> (sine thats armel and built at android image buildtime)
<ogra_> i'm not sure if rsalverti probably has plans to do it differently though
<didrocks> ogra_: the ubuntu-side is arch:any?
 * xnox is confused why those packages build-dep on libhybris though.....
<ogra_> didrocks, good question
<xnox> libhybris looks arch:any as well to me (looking at the upstream code)
<ogra_> root@localhost:/# dpkg -l|grep hybris
<ogra_> ii  libhybris                                    0.61-0phablet1                                          armhf        Allows to run bionic-based HW adaptations in glibc systems - libs
<ogra_> ii  libhybris-test                               0.61-0phablet1                                          armhf        Allows to run bionic-based HW adaptations in glibc systems - tests
<xnox> afterall android does run on i386 atoms (?!)
<ogra_> thats what i get on my phone
<xnox> from a ppa, not from raring archive though.
<ogra_> root@localhost:/# apt-cache showsrc libhybris|grep ^Arch
<ogra_> Architecture: any
<ogra_> yeah, its any atm
<ogra_> and we will roll x86 userspace if we actually make a qemu image work ...
<xnox> didrocks: are we landing _that_ daily though?
<ogra_> so it needs to be any
<xnox> (or daily landing, but actually manually merging when we want updates?!)
<didrocks> xnox: we will do as if. But I guess we'll land that daily in a ppa for raring
<didrocks> xnox: ah, you meant libhybris?
<ogra_> i'm not really sure how safe it is to land it inependently from the adnroid side
<xnox> didrocks: yeah, libhybris.
<didrocks> ogra_: would be good if one of you can dig into that
<didrocks> xnox: so, we have two choices, for things we are not upstream for:
<xnox> ogra_: you get the work-item =)
<didrocks> - either do the manual upload way
<ogra_> well, it woyld help if we discussed that in a channel where any of the devs are :P
<didrocks> - on demand release, with a merge in a branch that is our "ubuntu trunk"
 * didrocks is on 100 scopes, not really on that as a matter of urgency TBH
<mlankhorst> Laney: then suddenly it was 10Â°c here o.O
<jbicha> seb128: I guess bug 1153567 is approved then? I have the .plka we need for setting the hostname in gnome-control-center
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1153567 in ubuntu-system-service (Ubuntu) "[FFE] Use systemd-services rather than ubuntu-system-service systemdcompatibility code" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1153567
<seb128> jbicha, it's approved yes ...profiles should be in the desktop-privelege package, not in the sources
<jbicha> seb128: but this .plka is just a rewrite of the one included in gnome-control-center since we're not using the new policykit for raring
<seb128> 3.6 depends on the new polkit?
<seb128> that doesn't make sense
<seb128> the new polkit was out yet at the time?
<jbicha> yes and of course GNOME uses the latest stuff they can...
<jbicha> on the other hand I hit bug 1156074 which should block the systemd-services transition
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1156074 in xserver-xorg-video-intel (Ubuntu) "[raring] after updates, i965 driver won't load" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1156074
<seb128> jbicha, that's a kernel bug afaik
<seb128> nothing to do with systemd-services
<Laney> pitti: still here perchance?
<Laney> I notice that you never get PrepareForSuspend(false) signalled from logind after resuming and I'm wondering if that's because of the fallback pm-utils stuff
 * Laney does a little hax
<jbicha> seb128: well the problem that I saw was that I had systemd-services installed without libpam-systemd
<seb128> jbicha, would need to check with pitti, there is a second FFE about logind
<Laney> that will get seeded
<seb128> see https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/systemd/+bug/1153224
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1153224 in systemd "[FFE] Move to logind for session tracking" [Wishlist,New]
<seb128> we will either to transition to logind
<seb128> or drop it from syste
<seb128> or drop it from systemd-services
<jbicha> ok I'll just wait then unless you had somewhere you wanted me to put my g-c-c patch
<seb128> jbicha, no I didn't, thanks
<chrisccoulson> jibel, did you say that the autopkgtests are done with 1GB or 2GB of RAM?
<jibel> chrisccoulson, 2
<chrisccoulson> jibel, and there's no swap either?
<jibel> chrisccoulson, no swap
<chrisccoulson> jibel, i wonder whether the tests do hi OOM. i'm trying to figure out random failures like https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/job/raring-ppa-adt-ubuntu_mozilla_daily_ppa-firefox-trunk/ARCH=i386,label=adt/lastCompletedBuild/testReport/dom.media.tests/mochitest/test_peerConnection_bug840344_html/, but they don't happen when i run locally with 4GB
<chrisccoulson> and that test failure was followed shortly afterwards by a crash
<chrisccoulson> which is suspicious...
<chrisccoulson> jibel, in fact, at the bottom of the log:
<chrisccoulson> out of memory: 0x0000000000070800 bytes requested
<chrisccoulson> i didn't notice that before ;)
<jibel> chrisccoulson, that's what I suspect too but didn't do much investigation. I'll increase the amount of memory for firefox tests
<chrisccoulson> jibel, thanks
 * didrocks waves good evening
<jbicha> seb128: gnome-calculator 3.7.92 is out with the renamed .desktop, do you need to fix the Unity test again before I upload?
<seb128> likely yes
<seb128> mterry, cyphermox: ^
<seb128> some test is using gnome-calculator.desktop, we will need them back on gcalctool.desktop
<Laney> pitti: Hmm, so you only get the False ones in response to an org.freedesktop.systemd1.Manager JobRemoved signal but we'll never have that
<cyphermox> seb128: ok
<mterry> seb128, guh
<seb128> mterry, don't give me that guh look!
<seb128> ;-)
<mterry> cyphermox, are you doing that or shall I?
<cyphermox> mterry: I can
<cyphermox> seb128: where do these tests live? unity?
<jbicha> cyphermox: https://code.launchpad.net/~sil2100/unity/autopilot_gcalctool_rename/+merge/151063
<cyphermox> ok, just reverting that?
<jbicha> yes please
<cyphermox> jbicha: is there a bug open for that?
<seb128> cyphermox, what was just said ;-)
<cyphermox> I suck?
<cyphermox> seb128: sorry, I don't follow what you mean by that
<chrisccoulson> hi jibel, any idea why the links to the 2 test failures on https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/job/raring-ppa-adt-mozillateam_firefox_next-firefox/4/ARCH=i386,label=adt/ give a 404?
<seb128> cyphermox, sorry, walked by between dinner and dessert ;-)
<cyphermox> yeah, is fine
<seb128> cyphermox, I was just acking the "just need to revert that commit once gnome-calcultator is updated"
<cyphermox> so you mean you mentioned the bug aleady? I can't see it
<cyphermox> ok
<cyphermox> when is that going to be done?
<seb128> whenever you wants
 * cyphermox doesn't especially like that kind of X depends on Y
<cyphermox> it gets more painful with daily release
<seb128> that's a trivial .90 -> .92 GNOME update
<cyphermox> ok
<cyphermox> but we're fixing a bug; this is after feature freeze
<cyphermox> I'd just want it to be tracked for the commit too
<seb128> cyphermox, if you are ready to get the unity test updated just tell jbicha that it's ok to upload gnome-calculator
<seb128> cyphermox, it's a bit unfortunate that there was this renaming and renaming back on the .desktop unity picked for its tests
<cyphermox> is that only going to be run for unity or are other things using unity's autopilot tests, beside indicators?
<seb128> just reverting the commit mentioned before
<seb128> that was the only one
<cyphermox> ok
<jibel> chrisccoulson, there is a delay between the notification (sent by the internal server) and the results on the public instance
<chrisccoulson> jibel, ah, thanks
<jbicha> cyphermox: no we hadn't a filed a bug on the Ubuntu side for the issue
<cyphermox> jbicha: that's fine, I did
<cyphermox> mterry: wanna review? https://code.launchpad.net/~mathieu-tl/unity/revert-gcalctool/+merge/153923
<mterry> cyphermox, sue
<mterry> sure
<cyphermox> thanks
<marga> desrt, you around?  It's me with weird issues again :)
<marga> Two users are telling me their screensavers left the bus during the weekend.  I got one apport report from one of them, and apparently it's dconf related: http://paste.ubuntu.com/5626553/
<marga> With "left the bus" I mean this syslog error message: gnome-session[4387]: WARNING: Detected that screensaver has left the bus
<desrt> 'left the bus' :)
<desrt> hmm.
<desrt> i'm not sure that's a serious problem?
<marga> yeah, that's a very weird message.  It's associated with signal 7 (Bus Error)
<desrt> are you using NFS?
<desrt> or ecryptfs...
<marga> maybe :)
<desrt> sigbus in dconf code is almost always (maybe _always_) caused by the user not having a fully-functional XDG_RUNTIME_DIR
<marga> it's possible that the kerberos credentials timed out or something similar.
<desrt> since you're on precise i assume that XDG_RUNTIME_DIR is not setup properly
<marga> let me check taht.
<desrt> so that means that the user's homedir is used as a fallback
<desrt> if ~ is NFS or ecryptfs you will get bus errors from time to time
<marga> yes, at least in one case ~ is NFS
<desrt> dconf grew improved NFS support this cycle
<marga> confirmed for the other user as well.
<desrt> but only if XDG_RUNTIME_DIR is supported :(
<desrt> and i guess it doesn't help you anyway if you're stuck on precise
<marga> But we have like half our users on NFS, and we don't have all the screensavers leaving the bus
<desrt> i think 'left the bus' is my new favourite euphemism for 'failed horribly'
<marga> :)
<desrt> this issue has been known to periodically occur with NFS or ecryptfs for a while
<desrt> basically it happens when a file on the NFS server gets replaced and the clients are left looking at a stale copy
<desrt> with read() or write() you would get ESTALE
<marga> you mean the .dconf copy?
<desrt> but with mmap() you get SIGBUS
<desrt> i mean the dconf database file
<marga> ok
<desrt> are you sort of going through old dconf bugs lately and you found these?
<desrt> or did both of them just happen all of the sudden?
<marga> This happened this weekend.
<desrt> huh
<marga> 2 users in the same weekend.
<desrt> and you never saw it before?
 * desrt wonders what changed....
<marga> So for this to happen, they would need to have accessed their dconf settings from some other machine, right?
<desrt> maybe.  i'm not entirely clear on what happens here.
<marga> It might be that they haven't been running precise for long.  We just finished the migration.
<marga> Let me check that
<desrt> when a client has open file handles and it deletes or replaces the open file, it's supposed to do this weird renaming trick
<desrt> so that fixes the problem if you make the change from the same machine
<desrt> it's indeed possible that multiple logins could be the cause of this
<marga> So, one of them is a very recent precise user, the other one has been using precise for more than 6 months.
<desrt> heh
<desrt> anyway... i'm just about to head out for the night
<desrt> but we've known about this issue for a very long time
<desrt> getting an SRU to fix precise might be difficult but we could discuss what to do
<marga> Ok, I'll keep digging into this, thanks for the imput.
<marga> input
<desrt> find out about the XDG_RUNTIME_DIR variable being set (or not) on precise
<desrt> and file a bug with all the infos
<desrt> ciao
<cyphermox> jbicha: still around?
<jbicha> cyphermox: yes
<cyphermox> jbicha: did you upload gnome-calculator? I'd be approving the merge for unity tests, so that would land soonish
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-03-19
<jbicha> not yet, should I now?
<cyphermox> whenever you're ready, I'd say
<cyphermox> provided it was fine re: freeze and all o that
<jbicha> ok should be done now. The rename was a "bug fix", the only other changes were translation updates
<cyphermox> ok
<cyphermox> jbicha: the merge is up and was approved by mterry, but I'm waiting for jenkins to pick things up. that said, we can rerun tests later if they fail in daily landing
<pitti> Laney: ah, we should add the signal emission to our "fallback to pm-utils" patch indeed; mind filing a bug for it to track, with the details?
<pitti> Good morning
<RAOF> pitti: Good morning!
<pitti> hey RAOF, how are you?
<RAOF> Pretty good.
<RAOF> pitti: It appears that DEB_HOST_ARCH
<RAOF> isn't set to âlinuxâ while running the auto-pkg-tests?
<RAOF> Also, could I trouble you for a colord & colord-gtk upload to Debian?
<pitti> RAOF: autopkgtest calls "debian/rules build" AFAIK
<pitti> RAOF: i. e. you can't rely on anything dpkg-buildpackage would set for you
<pitti> that's a bit weird, but actually Debian policy says that packages need to be able to build with just that
<pitti> so you need something like
<pitti> DEB_HOST_MULTIARCH ?= $(shell dpkg-architecture -qDEB_HOST_MULTIARCH || true)
<pitti> RAOF: uploads> sure
<pitti> RAOF: toss me the .dsc or git links?
<pitti> ah, I still have a colord checkout
<RAOF> I'll do the git links.
<pitti> but maybe you want to fix the DEB_HOST_ARCH thing first?
<RAOF> Yeah.
<pitti> RAOF: seems debian/rules already does it for MULTIARCH, so you just need the same for D_HOST_ARCH
<RAOF> Indeed.
<RAOF> pitti: Ready to roll
<pitti> RAOF: ack; want to dch -r/debcommit -ar ?
<RAOF> pitti: Enjoy the debian/0.1.31-1 tag.
<pitti> RAOF: as soon as you push and push --tags :)
<RAOF> pitti: Done. Also, git+ssh://git.debian.org/git/collab-maint/colord-gtk.git
<RAOF> Now, ZoÃ« bath.
<pitti> oh, that pulled some 15 tags :)
 * pitti is always annoyed by the requirement to do git push --tags separately
 * pitti fires up sbuild
<pitti> RAOF: colord-gtk> release/tag please?
<bochecha_> pitti: about git push --tags: http://stackoverflow.com/a/2988182
<RAOF> pitti: debian/0.1.24-1
<pitti> RAOF: thanks; currently looking how to tell sbuild to enable experimental
<RAOF> pitti: Urgh. You'll need --build-dep-resolver=aptitude
<RAOF> In addition to actually having the sources in there.
<pitti> ^ that I do
<pitti> thanks!
<pitti> RAOF: push your colord-gtk release, please?
<RAOF> pitti: git thinks it's already pushed all of colord-gtk
<pitti> ah, now; apparently there's some delay somewhere in between
<pitti> would anyone know how I can get logs or other details from failed unity test cases?
<pitti> didrocks perhaps?
<didrocks> pitti: do you mean autopilot tests?
<didrocks> or something else?
<pitti> make -C obj-x86_64-linux-gnu/ check
<pitti> the debian package does check-headless, but that doesn't run the D-BUS tests (which I'm interested in)
<pitti> I'd like to see unity's output (it already does some logging) for a particular test case
<pitti> running just one test would also be helpful
<pitti> sorry for being a n00b here
<didrocks> pitti: I'm not really familiar with the check-headless tests TBH
<didrocks> I think Trevinho would be of a greater help ^
<pitti> ok, thanks
<didrocks> xnox: I will let you fix what Ricardo told and then, having a look
<didrocks> sorry pitti
<pitti> [  FAILED  ] TestGnomeSessionManager.LogoutFallbackLogind
<pitti> this is delightfully unhelpful :) I guess that can't be the end of what this test runner can do
<didrocks> xnox: you should add to the changelog "general packaging cleanup"
<didrocks> pitti: well, this is what is shown in all Unity* pieces when something failed though
<pitti> right, but there could at least be the particular assertion that failed
<pitti> anyway, I'll ask in #ubuntu-unity, thanks didrocks!
<didrocks> yw pitti
<RAOF> pitti: colord and colord-gtk got rejected for not containing source?
<pitti> urgh, sorry
<RAOF> pitti: Also, it looked like colord was going to unstable?
<pitti> hm, it seems sbuild is doing strange things
<pitti> sbuild --build-dep-resolver=aptitude -d sid colord-gtk_0.1.24-1.dsc
<pitti> that's what I ran
<pitti> apparently that's not paying attention to the debian/changelog target then, and doesn't include the source?
 * pitti builds again
<RAOF> Apparently?
<pitti> ah, -s
<pitti> oh, it's -c sid, not -d sid; bad mk-sbuild manpage!
<pitti> seems it still wants an explicit -d experimental, though
<pitti> RAOF: ok, building again, sorry!
<pitti> bbl
<RAOF> pitti: No problem
<pitti> ok, looks better now
<RAOF> pitti: Thanks, that got accepted.
<jibel> good morning
<didrocks> salut jibel
<didrocks> Ã§a va?
<pitti> bonjour jibel
<jibel> Salut pitti et didrocks
<pitti> bonjour jibel, Ã§a va ?
<jibel> pitti, Ã§a va bien et toi?
<pitti> jibel: un peu malade :(
<jibel> pitti, rien de grave j'espÃ¨re?
<pitti> jibel: seulment un rhume
<seb128> hey desktopers
<didrocks> hey seb128
<seb128> lut didrocks ;-)
<Laney> morning!
<seb128> Laney, good morning
<Laney> pitti: bug> sure - I hacked up a version which does emit the signal by delaying the return and calling send_prepare_for at the end. I'm not entirely sure if that's right though.
<seb128> pitti, @re: logind, would you prefer to delay the systemd-services use to after raring?
<pitti> seb128: your call really
<pitti> seb128: the basic functionality of timezoned etc. works fine, and I wrote autopkgtests for them
<pitti> seb128: but I understand for proper ntp handling we need desrt's shim?
<seb128> pitti, well, our side is rather ready, I just don't want to create too much issues for you
<pitti> seb128: anyway, I'm going to disable the upstart job for logind, so that one can install systemd-services without libpam-systemd and thus logind
<seb128> pitti, we do yes
<pitti> seb128: the logind FFE was finally decided (rejected), so we now have a clear path forward
<seb128> Laney, there is a new glib out, want to do the update?
<seb128> Laney, pango as well... ;-)
<Laney> my favourite!
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> Laney, thanks
<tkamppeter> Anyone in charge of GNOME Control Center here?
<seb128> tkamppeter, that would be me?
<tkamppeter> seb128, we came to the decision to let the GCC open system-config-printer instead of its own tool for printer management in Raring, as the new tool has improved but is still missing stuff, like a button for sharing printers.
<seb128> tkamppeter, who is "we"?
<tkamppeter> seb128, I think it was discussed on some desktop meeting
<seb128> tkamppeter, yeah, we discussed it last week, and we said we should discuss it after the meeting again, I was just curious if you had another discussion on the topic
<seb128> tkamppeter, so I will upload gnome-control-center to hide the icon under unity
<seb128> tkamppeter, you should probably restore 06_rename_settings_panel.patch in system-config-printer?
<Laney> ah there we go, I have systemd sending the event seemingly at the right time and indicator-datetime responding to it
<tkamppeter> seb128, to return the name from "Print Settings" to "Printers"?
<seb128> yes
<pitti> seb128, Laney: I'm pondering how to make systemd-services work without starting logind, and at the same time make it easy to enable logind for testing and preparing the migration (as that will happen in May)
<Laney> pitti: Yeah - I was thinking of holding back the packages
<pitti> seb128, Laney: my initial idea was to disable the startup condition in logind's upstart job, but WDYT about just moving the upstart job into libpam-systemd?
<Laney> but perhaps just have the PPA be what people should use to do the migration
<seb128> pitti, that would work for me
<Laney> mmm, yeah that works
<pitti> then you can install systemd-services without logind starting, but if someone installs libpam-systemd (and thus uninstall libpam-xdg-support), you'll get logind
<pitti> and we woudln't even need to revert that change in May
<tkamppeter> seb128, so tell me when the changed GCC is uploaded and after that I will re-introduce the patch in s-c-p.
<Laney> pitti: is that all you need to do to disable logind?
<Laney> like there's no dbus activation or anything weird like that
<pitti> Laney: yes; if you call loginctl it'll dbus-activate, but fail because of the missing cgroup
<pitti> Laney: if that's worrying you we can disable it further as well, but I wouldn't like to cripple it too much for just a month
<Laney> no, the scope of that seems quite limited
<Laney> I was more thinking of services dbus activating logind and then hanging forever waiting for a reply or so
<pitti> all services that we grepped for check sd_booted(), which will fail because the cgroup is not mounted
<pitti> there might be some third-party sw out there which just blindly talks to the logind D-BUS API without error checking, but I can't help that
<pitti> it'll fail without logind in a very similar way as with our "broken" logind
<Laney> yeah
 * Laney files a bug for the PrepareForFoo stuff
<pitti> Laney, seb128: FYI, I adjusted bug 1156074 for that issue, fixing now
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1156074 in systemd (Ubuntu) "installing systemd-services without libpam-systemd loses device ACLs" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1156074
<seb128> pitti, ok, thanks
<seb128> weird that I don't have that issue
<seb128> I've systemd-services installed
<pitti> seb128: with libpam-systemd?
<seb128> no
<pitti> seb128: do you have /sys/fs/cgroup/systemd/ ?
<pitti> and logind running?
<seb128> oh, sorry, I've libpam-systemd installed
<pitti> :)
<seb128> weird, I wonder how it got there
<BigWhale> Good Morning everyone ...
<seb128> I'm just using the desktop ppa
<pitti> <jedi wave>it is what you want</jedi wave>
<seb128> and I just installed systemd-services for the hostnamed, etc work
<seb128> I though the pam change didn't make it to distro?
 * seb128 is confused
<pitti> seb128: "the pam change"?
<seb128> pitti, installing libpam-systemd
<pitti> seb128: oh, you mean adjusting the seeds? no, it didn't
<pitti> I guess you uninstalled ubuntu-desktop
<seb128> I wonder why that got installed for me
<seb128> right, ubuntu-desktop is not installed
<seb128> but that should bring less new stuff, not more :p
<seb128> 2013-03-16 10:16:09 install libpam-systemd:i386 <none> 198-0ubuntu4
<Laney> aptitude why libpam-systemd
<seb128> i   systemd-services Recommande libpam-systemd
<seb128> is that wanted?
 * seb128 is confused on what bits of logind should be pulled in
<seb128> tkamppeter, oh, you need to restore https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/system-config-printer/1.3.11+20120807-0ubuntu11 as well
<seb128> tkamppeter, I'm uploading g-c-c to hide the upstream icon, please update s-c-p whenever you are ready for that
<pitti> seb128: ah, good point; I'll drop that
<seb128> pitti, danke
<seb128> pitti, on the good side I've logind installed and running and I didn't notice
<seb128> so it seems things are just working for me :p
 * seb128 hugs pitti, good work ;-)
<pitti> seb128: nice!
<tkamppeter> seb128, I will do.
<seb128> tkamppeter, thanks
<pitti> seb128: so you didn't see Lennart's face in the boot splash?
<seb128> pitti, no, but it's not april 1st yet... ;-)
<davmor2> hey seb128 quick query in the Gnome Control Center is there a reason why startup apps isn't in there?  I have an app that is set to auto start up I just kinda instinctively went there and it wasn't an option.
<seb128> davmor2, because nobody worked on "startup applications" in years and it's neither integrated nor good quality
<davmor2> seb128: ah okay, that's as good a reason as any I guess, thanks :)
<seb128> yw
<GunnarHj> seb128: Hi Seb, can you please add a Precise task to bug 1156670, so it shows up in the sponsorship queue.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1156670 in accountsservice (Ubuntu) "Cannot chose language with home on nfs export" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1156670
<seb128> GunnarHj, hey, done
<GunnarHj> seb128: Thanks!
<seb128> np ;-)
<xnox> didrocks: seb128: do we have ubuntu-wallpapers-raring yet? the contest did close on the 8th of march....
<didrocks> xnox: not sure we have winners yet
<didrocks> JohnLea_: ^ do you know?
<seb128> good question, dunno
<seb128> Trevinho, there? I would like to go back to the old indicator-session dialogs for raring (still some issues with the new one and that landed a bit late, I want to play it safe) ... is there an easy way to tell indicator-session/unity to not use the new dialog or do we need commits reverted if we want to do that?
<JohnLea_> seb128; Is there a way we can keep them in?!  We've tested the new dialogues very well, I think we have shaken out the bugs, and they got a very positive reception
<JohnLea_> seb128; if there is anything we can do to keep them In I would like to do that if at all possible.  I'll owe you lots of beer if we can! ;-)
<didrocks> JohnLea_: do you mind answering on the wallpaper question? :)
<JohnLea_> didrocks; just about to ;-)
<seb128> JohnLea_, there is a bunch of bugs, we get different dialogs in the user session and on the greeter, and we loose the fix we just got to ask password to reboot/shutdown the machine if other users are logged in
<JohnLea_> didrocks; we have the default wallpaper in don't we?
<didrocks> JohnLea_: never saw any request for that, so no :)
<didrocks> JohnLea_: didn't see as well the wallpapers for contest winners btw :)
<seb128> JohnLea_, the default wallpaper ... did it change or is that yet another hard to notice variation over the same one?
<didrocks> the default yes
<didrocks> it's already in raring
<didrocks> I think we discuss about the other ones
<JohnLea_> didrocks; ok, I'll chase the new default wallpaper right now and get back to you.  Do you know if the wallpaper competition is still being run by Iain Farrel?
<seb128> JohnLea_, default wallpaper is in this decembre
<JohnLea_> seb128; I think the new wallpaper is already in, but let me double check.  I think we did it right at the beginning of the cycle this time
<JohnLea_> seb128; ok, I thought is was
<seb128> JohnLea_, yeah, no need to check
<JohnLea_> didrocks; ^
<seb128> right, didrocks said so as well
<seb128> <didrocks> the default yes
<seb128>  it's already in raring
<seb128> so all in agreement
<seb128> remaining issues are
<JohnLea_> cool, all good
<seb128> - contest wallpapers
<seb128> - session dialogs
<didrocks> yep :)
<JohnLea_> seb128; do you know if Iain Farrel is still running the wallpaper competition?
<seb128> JohnLea_, I've no idea
<seb128> I don't even know if the competition was run this cycle
<JohnLea_> seb128; the community wallpaper competition is something that has been 100% community run for the last couple of cycles, we haven't had any direct involvement with it for a year and a half at least
<JohnLea_> seb128; humm, will need to dig and find out what is happening.  I'll email Iain and cc you
<didrocks> http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2013/01/ubuntu-13-04-wallpaper-contest-now-open
<seb128> JohnLea_, no need to Cc me, just ping us if there is an updated set of wallpapers to upload
<Laney> mterry handled the update last cycle - perhaps he can tell us where they came from
<seb128> let's check with him when he gets online
<JohnLea_> seb128; cool, will do.  I assume deadline is in 2 days
<seb128> right
<JohnLea_> seb128; so on to the shutdown dialogues...
<seb128> JohnLea_, see my query on that
 * didrocks grrr on omgubuntu to not give any link to the source
<didrocks> once more
<didrocks> and so, hard to find where it was announced :/
<didrocks> SOURCE: IAIN FARRELL
<didrocks> so, it's him
<didrocks> JohnLea_: ^
<didrocks> http://hungfu.wordpress.com/2013/01/28/raring-to-ringlead-this-cycle/
<Laney> 14/03/13 â Deliver final selection to our kind packager extraordinaire Ken VanDine. Thanks again, Ken for offering your help.
<Laney> ;-)
<didrocks> :)
<JohnLea_> seb128; so from you comment above there are two issues.  a) different dialogues in the greeter b) shutting down if other users are logged in?
<seb128> JohnLea_, c) some bugs
<JohnLea_> seb128; is there a list somewhere?
<didrocks> Laney: at least, we have dailies for the package, it's just a MP away (well withâ¦ the right images) ;-)
<seb128> JohnLea_, like the fact that opening the lock screen/shutdown dialog makes all the apps pop a dialog about unsaved work, even if you only wanted to lock the screen
<seb128> JohnLea_, @list: a minute
<JohnLea_> seb128; cool, let's get a list together, I can go through it and review and add comments, then discuss what *has* to be fixed for this to be included, and rope Trevinho into the conversation to see if he can fix any of the blockers.
<seb128> JohnLea_, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.tag=indicator-session-new-dialogs
 * JohnLea_ starts looking at bug list
 * didrocks adds one more, one sec
<JohnLea_> seb128, didrocks; I've emailed Iain asking him to ping either of you in IRC when he gets my message
<didrocks> great :)
<seb128> ok
<didrocks> done
<seb128> hey iainfarrell1
<iainfarrell1> hey
<seb128> JohnLea_, didrocks: ^
<didrocks> hey ;)
<iainfarrell> hello!
<iainfarrell> The gang's all here! :)
<seb128> hehe
<didrocks> heh, indeed!
<seb128> so yeah, people were asking if we plan to land new wallpapers from the contest
<iainfarrell> so, I sent the wallpapers package on th e14th to Ken VanDine
<seb128> uif is this week
<iainfarrell> but I've not hear anything back from him
<seb128> ok, that's the info we were missing
<iainfarrell> I can pass them on to you if you'd like
<seb128> better to use launchpad
<iainfarrell> I had it nice and early, yeah he's packaged and done the LP part in the past
<seb128> so there is public tracking and it doesn't fall into cracks when somebody drops the ball
<iainfarrell> give me a bug and I'll upload it
<iainfarrell> coo
<iainfarrell> l
<iainfarrell> noted for next time :)
<iainfarrell> he's saved me in the past, clearly :)
<didrocks> iainfarrell: just open a bug against ubuntu-wallpapers and attach them please :)
<iainfarrell> on it :)
<didrocks> thx!
<JohnLea_> hyia iainfarrell !
<iainfarrell> hey JohnLea_
<iainfarrell> didrocks: I can't seem to report a bug - have a triangle in my way :)
<iainfarrell> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu-wallpapers
<didrocks> iainfarrell: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-wallpapers
<didrocks> try the package :)
<didrocks> bug tracking isn't opened upstream
<iainfarrell> ahh, I am so out of practice, I've added you didrocks, seb128 and JohnLea_
<seb128> thanks
<iainfarrell> Compressed file is up
<didrocks> excellent, thanks iainfarrell :)
<iainfarrell> Apologies for the delay, you'd have had it last week
<didrocks> iainfarrell: no worry, and not your fault!
<iainfarrell> I'm not sure what Ken usually does to it
<iainfarrell> once I've provided it
<didrocks> iainfarrell: will take care of it :)
<iainfarrell> but there's the last few releases
<iainfarrell> you're splendid fellows!
<iainfarrell> Thanks!
<didrocks> thanks to you :)
<iainfarrell> I am, we all are etc. :D
<didrocks> heh ;)
<seb128> kenvandine, hey
<kenvandine> hey seb128
<seb128> kenvandine, how are you?
<kenvandine> good
<didrocks> hey kenvandine
<seb128> kenvandine, want to review https://code.launchpad.net/~didrocks/ubuntu-wallpapers/raring/+merge/154070 ? apparently you were send those updates ;-)
<kenvandine> seb128, sure
<seb128> kenvandine, thanks
<seb128> kenvandine, took us a while to figure what's going on
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> kenvandine, oh, and don't forget signon-ui :p
<kenvandine> sorry :)
<kenvandine> both were on my list for today :)
<seb128> no worry
<kenvandine> bug 1156979
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1156979 in unity-lens-friends (Ubuntu) "[FFe] replace gwibber-service with Friends" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1156979
<kenvandine> bug 1156941
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1156941 in qml-friends (Ubuntu) "[FFe] Provide an API for access data from Friends" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1156941
<seb128> ok, well you can thanks didrocks, by the time we tracked down the status he did the update as well
<seb128> next time would be good to use a public bug for the tracking
<seb128> kenvandine, nice!
<kenvandine> yeah
<kenvandine> he always sends me an email
<didrocks> kenvandine: wait
<didrocks> just seeing the update on the bug report
<didrocks> iainfarrell: you should have ping me on IRC :)
<didrocks> removing the additional one
<didrocks> kenvandine: additional wallpaper removed
<didrocks> (fine for reviewing now)
<kenvandine> thx
<didrocks> kenvandine: thanks for publishing friends ;)
<kenvandine> np, i checked the dashboard before i even had coffee today :)
<didrocks> \o/
<didrocks> kenvandine: sometimes, maybe you should wait coffee, when things are read :p
<didrocks> red*
<kenvandine> ok, filed FFe for ubuntu-ui-toolkit too, bug 1157191
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1157191 in ubuntu-ui-toolkit (Ubuntu) "[FFe] API updates for MainView, PageStack and Tabs " [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1157191
<kenvandine> today's going to be an MIR day too :)
<kenvandine> qtdeclarative, ubuntu-ui-toolkit and friends
<kenvandine> didrocks, i updated to the ppa and no major breakages yet :)
<kenvandine> didrocks, i am going to create a new stack for the toolkit/qt stuff
<kenvandine> how about naming it "toolkit"
<kenvandine> ?
<didrocks> kenvandine: platform? as there will be platform API in it?
<didrocks> like the ubuntu-platform-api
<didrocks> and other similar bindings?
<kenvandine> wfm
<didrocks> kenvandine: ok, so head/platform.stack :)
<kenvandine> didrocks, also is the wallpaper branch in a daily release stack?
<didrocks> feel free to boostrap it
<didrocks> kenvandine: yeah! in misc
<kenvandine> i approved it
<kenvandine> great
<didrocks> thanks kenvandine :)
<didrocks> will be tomorrow in!
<kenvandine> thank you for preparing it!
<didrocks> no worry
<kenvandine> my todo list for today has gotten shorter :)
<didrocks> was a refreshment in a world of 100 scopes :)
<didrocks> heh
<didrocks> kenvandine: ensure we do have integration tests and a job to run them please :)
<didrocks> if they need a real session
<didrocks> before we really add the stack
<kenvandine> didrocks, there are autopilot tests that do run in the build
<kenvandine> there aren't autopkgtest
<kenvandine> it tests quite a few components
<didrocks> kenvandine: oh, so they do have a fake applications and testing against it?
<kenvandine> but i haven't tried to figure out how the coverage is
<didrocks> without needing a real X session?
<didrocks> ok, please see how in a good/bad state we are :)
<didrocks> to ensure we can have dailies with a safety net ;)
<kenvandine> yeah
<didrocks> thanks!
<kenvandine> they use the component showcase demos
<kenvandine> and autopilot
<didrocks> sounds good, just poke a little bit at it, ensure it's running well in pbuilder and we are set! :)
<kenvandine> didrocks, looks like they test 17 components and confirm they object loads
<kenvandine> and they are testing all the components gwibber use :)
<kenvandine> so the only app that'll be in the archive using it :)
<didrocks> great!
<didrocks> kenvandine: you should subscribe to the MP as well to monitor that they don't push new code without tests, and so onâ¦
<didrocks> distro acceptance criterias :)
<kenvandine> ok, you assume i notice all those emails :)
<kenvandine> i'm subscribed to 100s of them already :-D
<kenvandine> didrocks, https://code.launchpad.net/~ken-vandine/cupstream2distro-config/platform-stack/+merge/154082
<didrocks> kenvandine: hem, that's what jasoncwarner_ is asking us to monitor
<didrocks> kenvandine: and I'm subscribe to all of them :)
<didrocks> it's the only way to ensure we know what's going to land
<didrocks> and that the criterias are met
<kenvandine> i usually look at the activereviews pages
<didrocks> kenvandine: on the 30 projects you are monitoring? :)
<didrocks> and what about what happened during the night?
<kenvandine> i know... not perfect, but so much gets lost in the noise in email
<kenvandine> i look at them in email too, but so much noise i can't read them all
<didrocks> kenvandine: well, I think the management is seeing us as the gateway, if we don't do the tracking well, we should raise with them we can't do it
<didrocks> weird that this wasn't raised before, I assumed everyone was looking at their stacks :)
<kenvandine> maybe i need to spend some time unsubscribing to stuff
<didrocks> kenvandine: filters ;)
<kenvandine> i do look... i just can't spend the time to read 3000 emails a day :)
<kenvandine> i have filters...
<didrocks> kenvandine: you do look at other stacks?
<didrocks> or just yours?
<kenvandine> ok, that folder has 713 emails for yesterday
<kenvandine> over time i've been subscribed to many
<didrocks> kenvandine: I have some filters working per team
<kenvandine> i guess i need to create separate filters
<didrocks> so I have subfolders for those
<didrocks> I'm still looking at what entering in all stacks
<kenvandine> they don't show up per team for me
<didrocks> but I guess I won't be able to keep up and just rely on you guys :)
<kenvandine> i guess i need to tweak procmail
<kenvandine> you can't watch all of them :)
<didrocks> kenvandine: do you have an estimate of the number of emails if you only receive those from your stack?
<kenvandine> i use the autofilter procmail rules
<didrocks> like, would it be workable?
<didrocks> kenvandine: ah, I do that manually ;)
<kenvandine> it would be workable just for my stack :)
<didrocks> (the filters for procmal)
<didrocks> I wonder how we can do that in a robust way
 * kenvandine wants gmail
<kenvandine> :-D
<kenvandine> i should plan a house keeping day and unsubscribe from lots of stuff
<didrocks> heh
<kenvandine> 713 merge emails in one day is too many :)
<kenvandine> the folder has nearly 100k of emails :)
<seb128> kenvandine, are you subscribed to the whole launchpad? ;-)
<kenvandine> maybe :)
<kenvandine> i've been subscribed to practically everything DX has ever done
<seb128> kenvandine, spring cleaning!
<kenvandine> i wonder if evolution will suck less if i do that spring cleaning :)
<kenvandine> my launchpad-bugs folder must have 500 subfolders
<kenvandine> at least
<xclaesse> seb128, any progress on purging automatically old kernels after updates?
<xclaesse> seb128, had to repair my mother's computer again
<seb128> xclaesse, not that I know about :-(
<xclaesse> out of disk space in the middle of upgrade is bad
<xclaesse> again, 5G of useless kernels
<seb128> shrugh, that issue sucks
<xclaesse> IMHO, that's totally critical and release blocker
<seb128> the upgrader shouldn't try to do the upgrade if there is not enough disk space to start with
<xclaesse> but since all linux distro release with that bug since 20 years...
<xclaesse> If I was a bash guru, I would write a cron that purge all kernels but the running one at startup
<pitti> at least they are now being marked for auto-removal
<pitti> so, "sudo apt-get --purge autoremove" will remove all but the most recent two
<seb128> pitti, it's a bit better but still doesn't help end users who click through update-manager though :-(
<pitti> yeah, it's still lacking UI integration
<xclaesse> seb128, but I have to rekon it's partly my fault to have a too small root partition... but still it's about 2G of kernel per year when you do all updates
<xclaesse> pitti, by "now" you mean raring? it doesn't work on precise at least
<pitti> yes, raring
<xclaesse> cool :)
<kenvandine> didrocks, is unity-asset-pool setup to use the merger?
<xclaesse> seb128, pitti: On my work maching, with a 300M /boot (the rest is encrypted) I got out of disk space in the middle of grub update, did not realize => system won't boot anymore
<xclaesse> that was not that easy to repair
<rickspencer3> didrocks, dash is working well for me today
<rickspencer3> I'm experiencing a very tiny bug though, not sure where to report it
<mterry> seb128, btw, the gcalctool fix landed in unity
<seb128> mterry, thanks
<seb128> mterry, the utah issue is being investigated by cjwatson and some others
<seb128> mterry, it's an username preseeding issue in the installer
<seb128> could be a bug on the Ubuntu side
<didrocks> rickspencer3: hey! great :) do you think the bug is linked to the changes?
<rickspencer3> didrocks, yeah
<rickspencer3> the search field doesn't have keyboard focus on first run
<didrocks> rickspencer3: see my email about it: open against https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity and tag it 100scopes
<didrocks> that enables to have one list to rule them all :)
<didrocks> kenvandine: yeah, it's in misc as well
<kenvandine> didrocks, saw that, but will the merger merge it?
 * rickspencer3 looks
<didrocks> kenvandine: should be :)
<kenvandine> didrocks, indeed it does seem to be... it just failed :)
<kenvandine> didrocks, did you see i updated my c2ud branch?
<rickspencer3> I love the wikipedia integration
<rickspencer3> that's sweet
<didrocks> kenvandine: let me have a look
<kenvandine> rickspencer3, it is!
<czajkowski> hyperair: ping :)
<hyperair> czajkowski: pong
<hyperair> what's up?
<jcastro> didrocks: man dude, the wikipedia thing is _nice_
<jcastro> didrocks: so over time it will learn I prefer wikipedia over say, music, and move those to the top?
<czajkowski> hyperair: free for a pm please before I break more stuff! :)
<hyperair> sure
<czajkowski> and I'm very close to firing my VM out the window!
<didrocks> jcastro: not that you prefer wikipedia, but in general, people from your country/area prefers wikipedia
<jcastro> ah ok
<didrocks> or rather even, "for this search, people prefer wikipedia" :)
<didrocks> I'm sure dinausores will have wikipedia on top :p
<desrt> pitti: how deep does your hardware testing stuff reach?
<pitti> desrt: 15.324 meters
<desrt> damn
 * desrt needs 18m
 * pitti gets a shovel
<desrt> if i have a bluetooth connection active when i suspend then my system gets into a 'bad state'
<desrt> sometimes this means that it doesn't complete suspend
<desrt> sometimes it doesn't complete resume
<pitti> desrt: right now it coveres record & replay of usbdevfs (MTP, PtP), and arbitrary sysfs and /dev/ stuff
<desrt> but if it gets that far then probably i won't be able to start new apps after resuming
<pitti> desrt: ah, it doesn't simulate actual hardware, it intercepts /dev/, /sys, ioctls. etc at the glibc level through LD_PRELOAD
<desrt> right
<desrt> so: kernel is too deep, in other words :)
<pitti> yes
<pitti> for that we'd need to simulate actual silicon
<pitti> desrt: something like a VHDL runner perhaps?
<desrt> :)
<pitti> ok, c'est l'heur de la glace
<desrt> lol
<pitti> (for purely medical reasons of course, to soothe my sore throat)
 * desrt wonders how much of his problems are caused by living life on the edge with uefi
<desrt> pitti: enjoy :)
<kenvandine> Laney, do you mind taking a look at my FFe requests?
<kenvandine> bug 1156941
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1156941 in qml-friends (Ubuntu) "[FFe] Provide an API for access data from Friends" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1156941
<kenvandine> bug 1156979
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1156979 in unity-lens-friends (Ubuntu) "[FFe] replace gwibber-service with Friends" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1156979
<kenvandine> and bug 1157191
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1157191 in ubuntu-ui-toolkit (Ubuntu) "[FFe] API updates for MainView, PageStack and Tabs " [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1157191
<kenvandine> Laney, gotta love pre-meeting spam :)
<Laney> I'll see what I can do
<Laney> how can I test friends?
<Laney> generally it'll have to be pretty solid straight away, and we've been quite hard on FFes so far as promised at UDS
<Laney> only been sabdfled once so far though ;-)
<didrocks> Laney: so far :)
<Laney> I feel one more coming ;P
<seb128> hey
<Laney> there's always a few tbh
<seb128> it's meeting time
 * Laney runs
<didrocks> hey
<seb128> Sweetshark, qengho, chrisccoulson, Laney, jasoncwarner, kenvandine, mlankhorst, cyphermox, mterry, robru, tkamppeter, attente: meeting time!
<kenvandine> Laney, it's all build in ppa:super-friends/ppa
<mlankhorst> g; day
<seb128> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Meeting/2013-03-19
<kenvandine> Laney, we really want to kill the old gwibber code :)
<seb128> let's get started
<seb128> Sweetsha1k, hey
<Sweetsha1k> seb128: ho
<kenvandine> haha... i thought Sweetsha1k said "no"
<Sweetsha1k> seb128: doing autopkgtests for LO4. not much else
<seb128> ok
<seb128> Sweetsha1k, thanks ;-)
<seb128> qengho, hey
<qengho> * Created packaging for Amazon-for-Chrome extension.  ($)
<qengho> * Analyzing a provided zipfile to make same for Firefox.  ($)
<qengho> * Added our own GoogleAPI keys to chromium-browser. Got blessing from GOOG to include in source package.
<qengho> * Integrating much of packaging suggestions from chromium-browser upstream.
<qengho>   - Direct orig tarball download instead of buggy, terrible SCM checkout.
<qengho>   - NaCl enabling?
<qengho>   - Almost all system libraries used instead of integrated.
<qengho>   - Much housecleaning in debian/rules .
<qengho> * Working with community member to get webapps applied to dev-channel dailies also!
<qengho> * Starting autopkgtest work on chromium-browser.
<qengho> EOF
<seb128> nice
<seb128> what's the amazon-for-chrome doing?
<qengho> It's something that The Management wants to include in 13.10 almost certainly.
<seb128> ok, let's see how that goes
<seb128> qengho, thanks
<seb128> chrisccoulson_, hey
<seb128> chrisccoulson_, did you defeat chromium on arm yet? ;-)
<qengho> That pit is deeper than can be fathomed.
<chrisccoulson_> seb128, yeah, the latest version is working on my pandaboard. i've got some packaging changes to make and then i'm going to stick it in a ppa
<seb128> \o/
<qengho> chrisccoulson_: is that the library version?
<seb128> hum, chrisccoulson_ seems busy, moving on
<seb128> chrisccoulson_, thanks
<seb128> Laney, hey
<Laney> howdy
<Laney> Bit of poking around upstart session jobs (looks like this will be off by default for raring so putting it on the shelf for now)
<chrisccoulson_> sorry, went to grab a glass of water ;)
<Laney> Release work
<Laney> started doing some logind porting this week including uncovering more work needed to our systemd patches
<Laney> Some GNOME updates
<Laney> seb128: I don't see a new pango1.0 in the series we're using? you mentioned it earlier
<seb128> Laney, ups, I though we updated to the current serie where we updated to the harbuzz-using serie but stayed on stable
<seb128> so ignore that
<Laney> ;-)
<seb128> Laney, did the user session FFe got nacked? :-(
<Laney> might be able to sync glib - pochu uploaded that to exp
<seb128> what is considered risky?
<Laney> it's still got bugs like looking at all the Xsession scripts
<seb128> ok, makes sense then, it's easy to opt in to work with it and we don't have real benefit/use of it yet
<seb128> Laney, thanks
<Laney> yeah, it'll be a good thing to do for S-cycle
<seb128> kenvandine, hey
<kenvandine> hey
<kenvandine> i've been focusing on getting things in order to try to finally utilize the gwibber rewrite
<kenvandine> get that landed
<kenvandine> so all of that should be in good shape and added some APIs the core apps folks needed
<seb128> going to right the release team next? ;-)
<kenvandine> playing catch up uploading bugs fixes for online accounts now
<seb128> fight*
<kenvandine> i hope not fight :)
<kenvandine> i begged Laney :)
<seb128> buy some beers to Laney :p
<kenvandine> indeed
<seb128> lol
<Laney> :P
<seb128> kenvandine, thanks ;-)
<kenvandine> i really want to kill that old buggy code
<Laney> the trappist is a good place to go in oakland you know ...
<seb128> mlankhorst, hey
<kenvandine> friends is 1000x better
<robru> kenvandine, thanks ;-)
<kenvandine> Laney, i'm there!
<mlankhorst> fixed armhf mesa 9.1, still looking into xserver race, rebased my kernel changes, random launchpad bug fixing, upstreaming a few of mesa changes, running testsuite for mesa 9.0.3 on radeon/nouveau/i915, etc.
<mlankhorst> ^D
<seb128> mlankhorst, thanks
<seb128> cyphermox said he would be out during the meeting
<seb128> he has been focussing on bluetooth this week
<seb128> looking at bluedroid and making bluez work on the phablet
<seb128> doing regular indicator daily release tracking as well
<seb128>  
<seb128> no mterry
<qengho> kenvandine: (You may have seen that I added you as another GOOG API owner of "Ubuntu" project.  If I get hit by a bus, you will be able to change settings.)
<seb128> but he was not feeling well since yesterday so he might be taking some rest
<seb128> robru, hey
<robru> seb128, hey!
<robru> * Make it easier to reply to tweets without having to remember to @mention the original tweet (friends prepends the @mention for you if you forget it)
<robru> * Automatically linkify URLs, with massive amounts of test coverage to prevent trailing punctuation from breaking the URLs.
<robru> * Fix a bug with Facebook "Stories" not being displayed properly.
<robru> * Include fake testing data in the package for the benefit of testing packages that depend on Friends.
<robru> * Implement since= for facebook, vastly reducing bandwidth usage.
<robru> * Fix a bug that prevented deleted accounts from having their old messages removed.
<robru> * Catch an unhandled exception for a harmless error condition.
<robru> * Add geotagging support to foursquare, flickr, and facebook.
<robru> * Greatly reduce the complexity of our model schema.
<robru> EOF
<seb128> Laney, I've the feeling that's another team member ready to pay you some beers to see the new stuff to land ;-)
<seb128> robru, thanks
<seb128> tkamppeter, hey
<tkamppeter> - Set up web page for OpenPrinting Summit and invited people to participate
<tkamppeter> - Set up web page for Google Summer of Code participation of the Linux Foundation (with OpenPrinting being a part of it)
<tkamppeter> - Upgraded my main PC to Raring and reported bugs, especially broken QEMU VM support
<tkamppeter> - Updated Ghostscript to version 9.07
<tkamppeter> - Updated system-config-printer to integrate in GNOME Control Center again
<tkamppeter> - CUPS 1.6.2 to land later today (got uploaded to Debian already)
<tkamppeter> - Put up new manufacturer-supplied PPDs on OpenPrinting and updated auto-downloadable packages there (Kyocera, Samsung).
<seb128> tkamppeter, thanks
<seb128> attente, hey
<attente> seb128, hi
<attente> started work on the keyboard/IM indicator
<attente> focusing on ibus first
<attente> ..
<seb128> attente, good luck with that, not a trivial topic ;-)
<seb128> attente, thanks
<seb128> desrt, hey
<attente> seb128, thanks
<desrt> hi
<desrt> oh.  it's that time again!
<seb128> desrt, it is! ;-)
<xnox> oooohhh wallpapers =)
<seb128> xnox, shiny! ;-)
<desrt> mostly this week was progress on the dconf proxy stuff
<desrt> plus some glib bugfixing/maintainership type stuff
<seb128> desrt, I saw you did a glib release, thanks ;-)
<xnox> seb128: now, I am allowed to crop the ringtail one and use it in the slideshow?
<xnox> it's too cute =)
<seb128> xnox, ;-)
<desrt> also also starting to look at improving the efficiency of converting gmenumodels into real menus (in a way that we can share for both gtk and qt)
<desrt> since the current approach is quite bad
<desrt> (fin)
<seb128> desrt, thanks
<seb128> so me:
<seb128> - some desktop updates
<seb128> - quite some sponsoring, the queue is quite high, help on that is welcome if people have time
<seb128> - blueprints reviews after vUDS
<seb128> - otherwise some bugs fixing, some SRUs
<seb128> </summary>
<seb128>  
<desrt> any info on why systemd-{services,shim} are still in universe?
<seb128> does anyone has questions/comments/topics to discuss?
<seb128> desrt, the second MIR didn't get approved yet
<seb128> sarnold is still doing the security review
<desrt> gotcha
<seb128> and there was the logind question as well
<seb128> but that got decided/delayed to next cycle
<desrt> logind is unrelated, imho
<seb128> well
<seb128> debian/pitti put logind in systemd-services
<desrt> although i see some of the systemd libs are already in main
<seb128> so installing the services is installing logind
<seb128> same binary
<desrt> oh.  interesting.
<seb128> yeah
<desrt> but it doesn't imply that we run it or use it, does it?
<seb128> so some work had to be done around that
<seb128> no
<seb128> pitti did the changes required for that
<desrt> k
 * desrt is just trying not to have his changeset slip past the release
<seb128> it will run only if you install libpam-systemd
<seb128> well in any case, waiting for sarnold to finish the review
<desrt> ok
<didrocks> seb128 forgot me :)
<seb128> thanks for asking ;-)
<seb128> other topics?
<didrocks> hey didrocks
<didrocks> hey!
<seb128> didrocks, doh
<didrocks> * prepare to get a daily release on a set of features branch
<didrocks> * some refactoring to have multiple release sets as well
<didrocks> * using those 2 new daily release features on the 100 scopes projects, having 40 components involved uploading daily in the ppa.
<didrocks> * Help on this 100 scope projects to try having something rock solid by EOW. Wider testing will be opened tomorrow.
<didrocks> * Maybe another interesting new intersection of Unity feature is coming (</teasing >)
<didrocks> * New wallpapers packaging
<didrocks> thanks didrocks
<didrocks> yw
<didrocks> ;)
<seb128> didrocks, sorry about that
<didrocks> no worry ;)
<seb128> I grepped my irclog to have the ping list
<seb128> and I apparently took one where I forgot to list you
<desrt> seb128: can you please put my nick at the start of your ping list? :)
<seb128> and used that as the list to go through :p
<didrocks> heh ;)
<desrt> (or i could spend the 2 minutes to figure out how to fix irssi)
<seb128> desrt, can do
<seb128> oh
<seb128> I forgot on my list
<seb128> helped didrocks on the new scope ppa
<seb128> ;-)
<didrocks> ;)
 * seb128 hugs didrocks
 * didrocks hugs seb128 back
<desrt> anyone know how to fix irssi to highlight if a word is said anywhere in a line, not just at the start?
<didrocks> merci :-)
<seb128> did I forget anybody else? ;-)
 * Laney casts his release team eye at "interesting ... new feature" ;-)
<attente> desrt, i have a script for that
<seb128> Laney, just read it as "more free beers"
<didrocks> Laney: you don't want to know (yet)
<didrocks> :)
<seb128> ;-)
<desrt> hello desrt
<desrt> can someone say this ^ ?
<seb128> can desrt stop that?
<desrt> great
<seb128> ;-)
<desrt> it's working now.  thanks :)
<seb128> Laney, btw I foresee a disturbance in the force around bug #1154176 :p
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1154176 in Unity "[FFE] Add payment preview for music" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1154176
<didrocks> seb128: spoiler!
<desrt> oh.  reminds me
<didrocks> spoil alert
<didrocks> ;)
<seb128> lol
<seb128> thanks everyone
<Laney> yeah comment #13 tipped me off
<seb128> let's wrap there
<desrt> i also spent some time this past week helping google sort out some dconf issues
<Laney> he even got the unlucky number
<desrt> and we have the mother of all issues on the radar, of course
<seb128> desrt, nfs?
<didrocks> Laney: you have really *no* idea how much fun I'm having :)
<desrt> XDG_RUNTIME_DIR not set on precise and google uses nfs
<desrt> -> boom
<seb128> desrt, can they just install libpam-xdg-dir ?
<Laney> didrocks: I can try to guess :-)
<desrt> marga: ^ ?
<Laney> at least we tried to save the last minute stress/rush cycle
<marga> desrt, I'm here, and that's correct.
<seb128> desrt, marga: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pam-xdg-support
<marga> Will that fix it?
<seb128> that should just work on precise afaik
<desrt> marga: did you find out of the issue was caused by concurrent access?
<seb128> marga, that will make XDG_RUNTIME_DIR defined, not sure if that's enough
<desrt> *if
<marga> desrt, I found out it was NOT caused by concurrent access.  It was caused by kerberos credentials expiring
<marga> i.e. NFS gone baby gon
<desrt> oh
<desrt> not much we can do in that case, then
<marga> trap the sigbus and not die?
<desrt> fwiw, if you use the latest dconf with full proper NFS support, there would be no chance for this to happen anymore
<desrt> but it doesn't help much on precise
<marga> So, the XDG_RUNTIME_DIR doesn't help in that case?
<desrt> nope
<Sweetsha1k> seb128: here is the resolution, why I was this short on words in the meeting: http://skyfromme.wordpress.com/2013/03/19/autopkgtests-for-adults/ <- I just didnt want to repeat myself.
<desrt> but with new dconf it would
<desrt> because the entire database gets stored in the runtime dir in that case
<desrt> so mmap is safe
<seb128> Sweetsha1k, lol, I like the title ;-)
<marga> uhm... Is it not possible to trap the SIGBUS and just not get new data instead of dying horribly?
<desrt> dealing with SIGBUS is quite difficult
<desrt> for at least three reasons
<desrt> first is that unix signals in general are extremely difficult to handle when combined with threads... you could get a SIGBUS in one thread, run the handler, then get a SIGBUS in another thread and run a concurrent handler... both of which would try to deal with the situation at the same time
<Sweetsha1k> seb128: "LibreOffice -- based on technology breaking your toolchain since 1985" -- I had to canibalize the source package as the full package would make the adt-image run out of space before even starting the tests, but when copying the package into the image.
<desrt> and because of the extremely limited number of things that it is 'safe' to call from signal handlers, you can't do locking to prevent this problem
<desrt> second reason is because after the signal handler returns, the process 'tries again' with whatever caused the SIGBUS
<desrt> so the solution need to involve mapping in a valid page (maybe zero-filled?) over the area that was invalidated by NFS disappearing
<desrt> third problem is that there is no way to register a SIGBUS handler for a particular region of memory -- you can only have one global SIGBUS handler
<marga> :-/
<desrt> so if dconf tried to solve this problem and so did something else, they'd end up stepping on each other's toes
<desrt> we thought about adding a framework to glib for dealing with these types of situations
<desrt> but decided that it wasn't worth the bother
<desrt> here's a question: what do you expect to happen if the user's homedir disappears out from under them?
<desrt> a solid answer to that question may at least give us something to work towards
<marga> uhm...
<marga> So, if the screensaver is still running, the user can enter their credentials and re-get the kerberos ticket, so that NFS comes back.
<marga> This is what happens most of the time for NFS using users, they re-enter their credentials on Monday and everything works.
<desrt> entering their password at the screensaver brings back NFS?
<marga> yes.
<desrt> some sort of pam magic is there?
<marga> right.
<desrt> very interesting
<marga> So, we only need the screensaver to stay on the bus... :)
<desrt> so new dconf takes a new approach to nfs
 * marga nods
<marga> Could we maybe backport this to precise? Or does it have many dependencies?
<desrt> but now that i think about it, it may not deal well with the nfs-temporarily-gone case
 * desrt didn't even know this was possible
<desrt> one thing is for sure: apps won't crash anymore
<seb128> marga, the new dconf requires the new glib atm
<marga> oh :-/
<seb128> not sure how much of that is needed
<seb128> or if you could make it work easily on the old glib
<desrt> probably not tonnes
<desrt> it also requires explicit setup for nfs
<marga> what do you mean by explicit setup?
<desrt> you have to configure the dconf profile to tell it to use the nfs backend for the user's database
<desrt> which i guess would not be a big problem for you
<desrt> but there would be a problem: it uses a different database format
<desrt> so the user's settings would disappear
<desrt> (ie: the existing ones from before the switch)
<marga> well... it should be possible to write a migration script, right?
<desrt> yes.  probably even fairly easy.
<desrt> i'm starting to think that maybe i should just write a new backend that automatically switches on when NFS is detected and uses the existing database file
<desrt> probably would only take a couple of days
<marga> sounds good... But I'd really just go for a simpler patch
<desrt> i don't think there's a good simple patch here
<pitti> desrt: wrt. bluetooth, that actually rings a bell
<desrt> pitti: got a bug?
<pitti> bug 698331
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 698331 in pm-utils "thinkpad T410: Bluetooth not getting disabled on suspend" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/698331
<pitti> desrt: we dropped the sleep.d quirk from pm-utils a while ago though, as it didn't seem necessary any mroe
<pitti> at least I got that bug on my machine as well, and it was fixed with a kernel update
<desrt> hum
<desrt> what kernel update?
<seb128> oh
<pitti> desrt: if you put http://people.canonical.com/~pitti/tmp/49bluetooth into /usr/lib/pm-utils/sleep.d, does it fix that?
<seb128> speaking about bluetooth
<seb128> chrisccoulson_, did you file that bug you were mentioning in London?
<seb128> chrisccoulson_, the hook that got dropped and makes bluetooth not work after suspend on the latitudes?
<seb128> pitti, not sure if it's the same issue, chrisccoulson_ was complaining about a quirck which was needed for bluetooth to work after resume on the e6410 and got dropped
<pitti> seb128: might be that or bug 715643
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 715643 in pm-utils (Ubuntu Maverick) "Bluetooth modules cause random S4 hangs" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/715643
<pitti> I did get bug 698331 on my machine, and that one was fixed in the kernel in precise
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 698331 in pm-utils "thinkpad T410: Bluetooth not getting disabled on suspend" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/698331
<seb128> well, not sure what's going on exactly
<seb128> but I can confirm that bluetooth stops working after suspend/resume on my e6410
<seb128> chrisccoulson_ knows the specific, I will wait for him to pong ;-)
<jibel> chrisccoulson_, is there any specific system requirement to run xpcshell tests multiple_geo_listeners and multiple_geo_listeners_wrap, like access to an external service? I noticed they both hang on amd64
<chrisccoulson_> hi seb128, will check the scrollback in a few minutes
<chrisccoulson_> (sorry, not been too well today)
<seb128> chrisccoulson_, (no worry, get better)
<chrisccoulson_> jibel, there shouldn't be any special requirements, particularly network access. the test suite has it's own http server for stuff like that
<chrisccoulson_> i'll check quickly though
<chrisccoulson_> jibel, is there any chance that another service has port 4444 on localhost?
<chrisccoulson_> that will make it hang
<jibel> chrisccoulson_, there is nothing on this port
 * didrocks waves good evening
<chrisccoulson_> jibel, is it reproducible? and is it happening on a test that you manually trigger?
<chrisccoulson_> i wonder whether you could modify the test script in the zip file, to add a try/catch around the test code
<chrisccoulson_> and log any exceptions
<chrisccoulson_> jibel, hmm, the reftest failures on amd64 are pretty weird. eg, https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/job/raring-ppa-adt-ubuntu_mozilla_daily_ppa-firefox-trunk/ARCH=amd64,label=adt/86/testReport/junit/layout.reftests/reftest-sanity/blank_html/
<chrisccoulson_> (you can copy the data URL's in to your browser addressbar to see the screenshots)
<jibel> chrisccoulson_, it is reproducible bu only when run automatically
<chrisccoulson_> jibel, did you see the screenshot from the reftest failure i linked? it looks like there is a proxy server in the way
<jibel> chrisccoulson_, no, I don't see any screenshot or failure, the reftest you linked "passed"
<chrisccoulson_> jibel, oh, that's weird. it showed as failing here, but it shows as passed now that i've refreshed it
<chrisccoulson_> jibel, in any case, the screenshot from the failure it was showing is http://paste.ubuntu.com/5629135/
<chrisccoulson_> i've just copied the data URL from the log
<jibel> chrisccoulson_, ah thanks, I see, there is a proxy but noproxy is not set for localhost
<jibel> chrisccoulson_, what's the command line to run only 1 test for example dom/tests/unit/test_multiple_geo_listeners.js ?
<chrisccoulson_> jibel, /usr/lib/firefox-trunk/testing/run_xpcshell_tests xpcshell/tests/dom/tests/unit/test_multiple_geo_listeners.js should do it
<jibel> chrisccoulson_, one slave has a broken proxy configuration and jenkins always selects it to run firefox-trunk amd64. I'll fix that first thing tomorrow morning, to avoid breaking things while I'm asleep :)
<chrisccoulson_> jibel, cool, thanks!
<jcastro> hey guys, for the juju gui we want to have icons, so we've decided on a scheme (icon.svg), but I need to figure things out like filesize etc. Is there a spec somewhere for svg icons for the desktop I can steal?
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-03-20
<RAOF> It's my morning for SRU queue processing. Get your pings in now if there's something particularly urgent!
<xnox> RAOF: remove usb-creator from precise-proposed =)
<RAOF> xnox: It's not _in_ precise-proposed, as far as I can tell?
<RAOF> Oh, sorry. There it is.
<RAOF> xnox: Fair call!
<xnox> RAOF: lvm2 accepts from unapproved would be nice in quantal/precise. There are $people wanting it. And if you have any questions about gcc or python uploads and feel like hovering over reject, feel free to ping me to find / add any additional info.
<RAOF> xnox: Python uploads to precise? I *was* just about to ping doko for clarification - he's uploaded two pythons with different fixes :)
<xnox> RAOF: you know why? the first one probably wasn't accepted quick enough, he made a new one, but didn't base it on top of unapproved queue, which is hard to miss.
<xnox> i was almost in the same spot with lvm2.
<RAOF> I think you mean "easy to miss", but yeah, that seems right.
<xnox> yes.
<xnox> RAOF: and i bet he will be pissed off about rebasing them =)
 * xnox should find time to rebase them.
<xnox> RAOF: i think it's fair play to accept one of them (most urgent or oldest first or whatever) and then ask to reupload/rebase the other one ;-)
<RAOF> Bah. lvm2 in quantal's confused launchpad.
<RAOF> xnox: Enjoy your new lvm2 riches.
<xnox> RAOF: Dell Poweredge and FusionIO customers should be enjoying this =) i wish i had such hardware ;-)
<xnox> RAOF: thanks a lot =)
<pitti> Good morning
<RAOF> Good morning!
<pitti> hey RAOF
<jibel> good morning
<didrocks> salut jibel
<jibel> bonjour didrocks
<jpds> Anyone know which package the "Privacy" part of System Settings is in?
<didrocks> jpds: activity-log-manager
<seb128> hey desktopers
<didrocks> salut seb128!
<Laney> morning
<pitti> hey Laney
<Laney> howdy pitti, how goes?
 * Laney got snowed on quite a lot this morning
<pitti> Laney: it finally stopped here at last \o/
<pitti> I see some birds hopping between our many crocuses in the garden
<Laney> just in time for spring :P
<pitti> about time!
 * Laney opens debian-vote, sees the number of unread emails, screams and closes it again
<seb128> chrisccoulson, http://ubuntuone.com/6AoJnKb3h5LXMHDnVBlbWJ
<seb128> chrisccoulson, just got a corruption, not sure that's still the intel issue though
<seb128> chrisccoulson, hey btw ;-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128 :(
<chrisccoulson> does it go away with sna disabled like before?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, well, I got that for the first time, it's hard to say when you get a bug once every second day
<seb128> just got this one by dnd the tab in firefox
<Sweetsha1k> seb128, pitti: ping?
<Sweetsha1k> I need some packager advice, for choosing between two evils ;)
 * pitti waves
<seb128> Sweetshark, hey
<seb128> pitti, I've been told you made progress on the langpacks update btw, thanks!
<Sweetshark> pitti, seb128: so as stated in http://skyfromme.wordpress.com/2013/03/19/autopkgtests-for-adults/ I need the build-deps for the autopkgtests to run ./configure correctly but because of debian bug 693540, I cant reuse our autogenerated ones. Im currently doublebookkeeping them, which is bad.
<ubot2> Debian bug 693540 in autopkgtest "autopkgtest: doesn't support versioned dependencies" [Normal,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/693540
<pitti> you could perhaps use some seddery?
<pitti> or, if you are feeling _really_ adventurous, try to fix the bug in autopkgtest
<pitti> but beware, looking at the code will make your eyes pop out
<pitti> it's the inimitable style of Ian Jackson's "I hate python, write perl which happens to compile as python using C64 basic identifiers"
<Sweetshark> pitti, seb128: so my idea was: since I have a package with the autopkgtest tools (called libreoffice-subsequenttestbase), I could just sed in the build-deps to that package too, which should support the full apt-syntax. And the debian/tests/control would just depend on that (as it does now) ...
<pitti> Sweetshark: that sounds fine, too
<seb128> that works for me as well
<Sweetshark> pitti, seb128: k, will go for that then.
<seb128> cool
<Sweetshark> pitti: btw is that (creating a package containing helpers for an autopkgtest) done anywhere else?
<pitti> Sweetshark: the mysql-5.5 source package builds a mysql-testsuite-5.5 binary
<pitti> but not exclusively for autopkgtest
<Sweetshark> pitti: what are the other clients? manual sanity checks of an install? or some other automated test?
<pitti> Sweetshark: manual mostly, I guess
<pitti> but we haven't really used it before
<Sweetshark> pitti: right. same for libreoffice. (well, and the tests are run during the build already).
<Sweetshark> pitti, seb128: hmm, that doesnt work as build-deps has arch-specific deps and the package is arch all
 * Sweetshark raises angry-old-man-fist at dpkg -- '... but I know what I am doing'.
<pitti> Sweetshark: is that package very big? i. e. does it cost a lot of extra mirror space to make it arch:any?
<Sweetshark> pitti: its not very big (~3MB?) -- but as it contains jar-files, Im not sure they are build in build-indep (thus the buildd on non-i386 would fail ...)
<Sweetshark> pitti: s/build-indep/build-arch/ that is ...
<Sweetshark> I could just sed out the arch-specific deps. There is a minor risk with that, but it should be alright
<bdrung> Sweetshark: shouldn't you depend on more libreoffice-* packages in autopkgtest?
<Sweetshark> bdrung: nope, doing it transitively via libreoffice-subsequentcheckbase
<mterry> didrocks, when do you think the MIRs for that scope stuff will hit?  (also, how busy are you?)
<seb128> kenvandine, hey, could you update account-plugins and webapps? the new unity-asset-pool breaks the current version and is stucked in proposed until we update those
<seb128> e.g since http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~unity-team/unity-asset-pool/trunk/revision/67
<kenvandine> seb128, yes i can!
<kenvandine> we have them queued up
<kenvandine> i just didn't want to upload until the dailies ran
<kenvandine> seb128, circle of friends MIR bug 1157732
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1157732 in unity-lens-friends (Ubuntu) "[MIR] circle of friends" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1157732
<seb128> kenvandine, thanks
<seb128> cyphermox, hey, we fixed unity test, the autopilot revert was buggy, upstream didn't revert the binary name, only the .desktop one, so half the change was buggy
<seb128> cyphermox, can you look at why the qa stack is not landing? seems and an issue with autopilot-qt
<kenvandine> seb128, done
<seb128> kenvandine, \o/
<seb128> thanks
<rickspencer3> hey seb128 ... what's the word on the street about 100 scopes?
<rickspencer3> seems to be landing ok from here
<rickspencer3> I've been running the PPA all week, seems to working fine
<seb128> rickspencer3, hey
<qengho> tkamppeter: I have a question.  Should "cups" and "cups-daemon" both provide a logrotate.d script that try to rotate  /var/log/cups/*log  ?  logrotate cron complains to me every day.
<seb128> rickspencer3, didrocks is doing the work/tracking, from what I've seen it's coming along but it's a bit bumpy, there are still some bugs and missing bits
<seb128> but it's getting there
<rickspencer3> ack
<rickspencer3> thanks seb128
<seb128> yw ;-)
<rickspencer3> personally, I find the new scopes to be an improvement
<rickspencer3> it was good in 12.10, but it seems even better in 13.04
<seb128> they will be I'm sure, it's still a bit early to say that
<seb128> for me the dash flicker a lot when I type
<seb128> it seems to keep re-arranging items
<seb128> it misses some content that was there before as well (photos, online videos, etc)
<seb128> but those are issues being worked
<seb128> so getting there ;-)
<cyphermox> seb128: so is the revert fixed now?
<seb128> cyphermox, yeah, the issue is autopilot-qt
<seb128> for that stack to land
<cyphermox> yeah I know
<cyphermox> but I also have no clue what to do with this
<cyphermox> http://10.97.0.1:8080/view/cu2d/view/Head/view/QA/job/cu2d-qa-head-1.1prepare-autopilot-qt/2/console
<cyphermox> o test report files were found. Configuration error?
<cyphermox> Build step 'Publish JUnit test result report' changed build result to FAILURE
<seb128> cyphermox, the error is in http://10.97.0.1:8080/view/cu2d/view/Head/view/QA/job/cu2d-qa-head-1.1prepare-autopilot-qt/1/console
<seb128> cyphermox, 2 was a run for "autopilot" alone
<cyphermox> ok
<cyphermox> ugh
<cyphermox> what a mess
<kenvandine> seb128, account-plugins is in NEW, i forgot there was a generic-oauth provider added
<seb128> kenvandine, will check
<seb128> kenvandine, can you look at https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1157747 ... missing replace?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1157747 in unity-asset-pool "package unity-asset-pool 0.8.24daily12.12.05-0ubuntu1 failed to install/upgrade: trying to overwrite '/usr/share/icons/hicolor/32x32/apps/facebook.png', which is also in package account-plugin-facebook 0.10bzr13.02.27-0ubuntu1" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<kenvandine> hummm... robru tested that upgrade
<kenvandine> oh... they had a replace for account-plugin-icons
<mterry> robru, poke about a deja-dup merge from last week
<kenvandine> i guess it needs to conflict with the older versions of account-plugin-*
<cyphermox> seb128: I'll have a merge request to review in a second
<seb128> cyphermox, thanks
<kenvandine> seb128, i'll prepare a branch for unity-asset-pool
<seb128> kenvandine, thanks, maybe upload directly to distro (or do a manual stack landing run)
<seb128> we want that fixed before it moves to raring
<seb128> kenvandine, I will keep the new binary in NEW meanwhile to delay the transition
<cyphermox> seb128: if you want to review: https://code.launchpad.net/~mathieu-tl/autopilot-qt/rename-source/+merge/154389
<kenvandine> seb128, so it current replaces and breaks the older account-plugin-icons
<kenvandine> but it doesn't really replace the older account-plugin-facebook
<kenvandine> so just add a breaks for those right?
<seb128> kenvandine, replaces/breaks yes, like it was done for -icons
<kenvandine> but it doesn't complete replace the others
<kenvandine> just 1 file
<didrocks> mterry: I think Friday will have a first version reviewable
<didrocks> mterry: but not complete yet
<Sweetshark> proudly presenting the regexp from hell: perl -pi -e "s#%BUILD_DEPS_ARCH_ALL%#$(strip $(shell echo '$(BUILD_DEPS), $(BUILD_DEPS_INDEP)'|sed -e 's/,/,\n    /g'|grep -v libc0.1| sed -e 's/\[[^]]*\]//g'|sort|uniq))#g" debian/control
<mterry> didrocks, just trying to balance MIRs.  Ken dropped a bunch of friends ones
<mterry> didrocks, don't suppose you have a bundle of free time?
<seb128> cyphermox, approved but I can't change the status since I'm not in the autopilot group
<didrocks> mterry: ahah, yeah, it was supposed toâ¦ :)
<seb128> kenvandine, "replaces" mean "ovewrite a file that was there"
<didrocks> mterry: TBH, you can review already the scopes
<didrocks> mterry: the packaging won't change a lot
<seb128> kenvandine, >=1 file
<didrocks> the upstream code is trivial
<kenvandine> oh... all this time i thought it meant replace package :)
<kenvandine> a package should never overwrite files!
<davidcalle> didrocks, hey, that's a mean thing to say! ;)
<seb128> kenvandine, well, when you move files between binaries (like that) it can happen depending of the unpack order of the debs
<seb128> like there*
<didrocks> davidcalle: come on, not that way!
<didrocks> davidcalle: just that you don't have system() calls or whatever :p
<seb128> kenvandine, the field is there to tell dpkg is ok, because indeed by default that's not an ok thing to do :p
<tkamppeter> qengho, no, only cups-daemon should logrotate. A bug is already reported, bug 1157758.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1157758 in cups (Ubuntu) ""cups" and "cups-daemon" both logrotate /var/log/cups/*log" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1157758
<didrocks> davidcalle: and packaging has been excellently reviewed :)
<davidcalle> didrocks, ;)
<qengho> tkamppeter: Yeah, I just made that bug report.  Thanks.
<kenvandine> didrocks, should i do a manual upload of unity-asset-pool or force a stack run?
<kenvandine> didrocks, maybe if you can give me a quick approval a stack run :)
<dobey> did something change recently to break evolution in some horrible and undiscoverable way?
<didrocks> kenvandine: sorry, what's the issue?
<kenvandine> dobey, it's been crashy as hell for a while
<didrocks> saw you MP but ping lang here
<dobey> evolution just sits trying to "refresh folder INBOX" (with IMAP) when i start it now, and it's not usable
<kenvandine> file conflicts
<didrocks> (10 pings in //)
<dobey> kenvandine: no crashiness here
<dobey> been working fine until today :(
<kenvandine> didrocks, he made it break/replace account-plugin-icons
<kenvandine> but not the other plugin packages that had icons
<didrocks> kenvandine: but account-plugins-icons in not in the daily?
<kenvandine> didrocks, i have a branch ready to fix it
<kenvandine> right
<kenvandine> unity-asset-pool is
<kenvandine> it conflicts with account-plugin-facebook
<kenvandine> etc
<didrocks> ah ok
<dobey> it's like imap is suddenly horribly broken
<kenvandine> the -icons package only contains the icons that empathy used
<dobey> but there's no new e-d-s to have broken it
<seb128> didrocks, the version we landed misses replaces and creates bug #1157747
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1157747 in unity-asset-pool (Ubuntu) "package unity-asset-pool 0.8.24daily12.12.05-0ubuntu1 failed to install/upgrade: trying to overwrite '/usr/share/icons/hicolor/32x32/apps/facebook.png', which is also in package account-plugin-facebook 0.10bzr13.02.27-0ubuntu1" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1157747
<didrocks> kenvandine: so you, coordinate with mterry but I think you should be able to rerun just a rebuild in unity-asset-pool
<didrocks> seb128: thanks for the context :)
<kenvandine> yeah, just wanted to get a quick branch approval
<mterry> didrocks, so these friends MIRs.  Do you have time to handle them, or shall I take them?
<kenvandine> mterry, didrocks: https://code.launchpad.net/~ken-vandine/unity-asset-pool/lp_1157747/+merge/154396
<didrocks> mterry: I really have no time dude, already trying to cover what I canâ¦
<kenvandine> i'll buy beer in oakland for whoever does ;)
<mterry> didrocks, alright, I'll do.  I had assumed that was the case, but it wasn't clear from your answers above
<didrocks> kenvandine: approved
<didrocks> mterry: sorry :/
<mterry> didrocks, sure, you'll steal my beer from kenvandine's branch, but won't do MIRs  ;)
<kenvandine> didrocks, thanks
<dobey> [000:004] Browser toolkit is Gtk2.
<dobey> i wonder if that's from webkit or from some plug-in
<kenvandine> i'll rerun the stack after the merger gets it
<mterry> didrocks, (no worries, just joking)
<dobey> wah and the calendar is empty too :(
<kenvandine> mterry, there beer offer was for the MIR :)
<didrocks> mterry: heh
<didrocks> kenvandine: yw
<kenvandine> mterry, so you win :)
<mterry> heh
<didrocks> kenvandine: mterry: one of you will rerun unity-asset-pool build, isn't it?
<didrocks> once merged
<kenvandine> i will
<mterry> kenvandine, guh, pkglibexecdir, not libexecdir  (not a blocker)
<kenvandine> what's that in?
<mterry> kenvandine, unity-lens-friends, when installing the daemon
<kenvandine> oh... copied from the gwibber lens :)
<kenvandine> old bug
<kenvandine> i'll fix that up :)
<mterry> kenvandine, everyone is so used to libexecdir from when debhelper had a bug that made libexecdir act like pkglibexecdir
<kenvandine> yeah
<seb128> those 2 are very confusing
<dobey> oh, hrmm. seems probably the calendar backend was hanging and blocking everything in the process perhaps :(
<seb128> and used in very confusing way in debian
<seb128> like some distro have a /usr/libexec
<seb128> which Debian/Ubuntu haven't
<desrt> what's the deal with debian anti-libexecism, anyway?
<desrt> is it about versioning?
<seb128> I don't know
<seb128> it's older than me joining Debian
<seb128> we never had a libexec afaik
<seb128> desrt, hey
 * desrt can understand having a preference for /usr/lib/libname0/blah over /usr/libexec/blah
<desrt> for parallel-installability reasons
<desrt> seb128: hi :)
<mterry> kenvandine, why do you force C collate locale in the lens?
<seb128> desrt, can you check the current comment on https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/systemd/+bug/1152187 and maybe upstream the issues pointed?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1152187 in systemd "[MIR] systemd" [Undecided,Fix released]
<kenvandine> mterry, for sorting in Dee
<desrt> seb128: like, ping lennart? :)
<kenvandine> since we sort on timestrings only, it is harmless to drop it to C
<seb128> desrt, ping lennart/file upstream bug for issues that are worth a bug
<desrt> k
<seb128> desrt, thanks ;-)
<kenvandine> mterry,  and without it there was unpredictable results :)
<mterry> kenvandine, k
<kenvandine> sigh... powerppc builds take ages
<mterry> kenvandine, you hardcode GNOME desktop env?
<mterry> kenvandine, instead of Unity?
<kenvandine> humm
<kenvandine> ah, that was also old copy paste from other lenses
<kenvandine> :)
<kenvandine> i wonder if we even need that at all anymore
<seb128> cyphermox, autopilot-qt merged, I think you can retry the qa stack
<cyphermox> yup
<cyphermox> grr, autopilot-qt is starting to annoy me a lot
<seb128> cyphermox, seems trivial to fix
<cyphermox> seb128: yes, it just should have worked the first time around
<seb128> just change the changelog version to something < 0.7daily13.03.20-0ubuntu1
<seb128> cyphermox, it should probably be UNRELEASED rather than "quantal" as well
<cyphermox> yeah
<seb128> cyphermox, I'm about to go for some exercice but if you put a MR up I can ack it before going ;-)
<cyphermox> I think the correct thing to do would rather be to bump the version up to 0.8
<seb128> cyphermox, seems fine yes
<seb128> to ensure you are newer than the ppa
<cyphermox> there's nothi9n in the ppa
<seb128> well, seeing the changelog there were several quantal uploads
<seb128> so I guess some #ps people have a ppa with that somewhere
<xnox> seb128: we are continiuing to get bugs about input going away during ubiquity installer mode only (without full desktop) due to compiz going away.
<seb128> xnox, do you have a bug report with a backtrace from compiz?
<cyphermox> yeah, but it has nothing to do with the checks our scripts do
<xnox> seb128: is it acceptable to put back metacity onto cds, to be used by ubiquity in ubiquity-only mode, and at the end of the install it will be removed thus installed systems will not have metacity (just like in quantal)
<seb128> cyphermox, you mean? I was just saying that 0.8 would help those users to get the new version
<seb128> xnox, works for me
<cyphermox> seb128: there is that too
<cyphermox> https://code.launchpad.net/~mathieu-tl/autopilot-qt/changelog/+merge/154412
<xnox> seb128: well when those machines loose input, there is no ctrl+alt+t nor ctrl+alt+f1 and the crash files are in ram. so very hard to fetch them out.
<xnox> so I'm yet to fetch a good crash/traceback/errors/logs anythings.
<seb128> xnox, just roll back to what you had for raring if it's easier, we don't plan to spend lot of efforts on compiz at this point
<seb128> cyphermox, approved
<xnox> seb128: ack. thanks a lot.
<seb128> xnox, yw!
<cyphermox> thanks. I ll rerun as soon as I see it land
<seb128> great
<seb128> I'm away for some exercice, be back in ~1h
<robru> mterry, hey. sorry about not doing that MP; been totally swamped trying to get FFE stuff done quickly.
<mterry> robru, no worries, it's not urgent, just didn't want it slipping through the cracks in case you didn't see the first notice
<robru> mterry, it's starred in my inbox ;-) I'll try and get to it today, I think I'm done FFE stuff for now (unless kenvandine finds any last minute bugs I should know about)
<kenvandine> mterry, that PPC depwait in ubuntu-ui-toolkit trickles down to a build failure for qtjsbackend
<kenvandine> Project ERROR: Couldn't detect supported v8 architecture (ppc/power). Currently supported architectures are: x64, x86 and arm
<kenvandine> so nothing we can really do about that :/
<mterry> kenvandine, then the stack needs to declare that it's not for powerpc in the Architecture line, eh?
<kenvandine> ok
<kenvandine> Architecture: any [!powerpc]
<kenvandine> something like that?
<mterry> If that's legal syntax, yes
<mterry> Not actually sure
<kenvandine> i
<kenvandine> i'll figure it out
<mterry> kenvandine, well, it says it only supports  x64, x86 and arm, so guess just listing those makes sense
<kenvandine> good point
<mterry> poor powerpc
<kenvandine> :)
<kenvandine> can anyone confirm that this is correct?
<kenvandine> -Architecture: any
<kenvandine> +Architecture: amd64 i386 armhf
<kenvandine> seb128, ^^
<Laney> seems fine
<kenvandine> great
<Laney> It might be alright/better to leave it failing to build on ppc though, as an obvious reminder that work needs to be done there
<kenvandine> Laney, it isn't just a failure though, upstream says they don't support it
<kenvandine> which means very unlikely to add support later
<Laney> oh, that's sad
<kenvandine> indeed
<robru> kenvandine, didrocks: are we doing a hangout soonish?
<didrocks> robru: yeah, when you are ready
<robru> didrocks, ok, I just need a minute, what about kenvandine ?
<kenvandine> sure
<kenvandine> i don't have a ton of time though, i need to leave in ~25m
<seb128> kenvandine, the arch list seems line (as Laney said)
<kenvandine> seb128, yeah, i've already uploaded :)
<seb128> kenvandine, still there?
<didrocks> kenvandine: thanks for publishing u-a-p :)
<seb128> kenvandine, I was going to ask about that but just saw it was published as well ;-)
<kenvandine> seb128, :)
<kenvandine> didrocks, anything i can do to get my friends stack run to stop waiting on ppc?
<kenvandine> it's holding up getting other stuff merged...
<kenvandine> i'm assuming the ppc build isn't going to happen anytime soon
<mterry> kenvandine, does qtdeclarative5-dev also not work on powerpc?
<mterry> kenvandine, ah I see you're asking about that now
<kenvandine> it depends on v8
<kenvandine> no, not that :)
<kenvandine> there are no ppc PPA builders right now
<kenvandine> so my friends stack is never going to finish building :/
<mterry> kenvandine, wait, so is qtdeclarative5-dev just a busy builder issue or the same jsbackend issue as before?
<didrocks> kenvandine: for CI? maybe talk to fginther/mmrazik
<didrocks> you mean upstream merge, right?
<didrocks> not daily release?
<kenvandine> yeah
<kenvandine> upstream, CI fails because the package depends on a version of friends that isn't published yet
<didrocks> right, so see with them, I think they can reconfigure the job to not dep on that
<kenvandine> cool
<kenvandine> fginther, can you help with that?
<fginther> didrocks, kenvandine, one moment. on the phone
<kenvandine> fginther, CI is failing for qml-friends because it depends on a version of friends that isn't published in raring yet
<kenvandine> it is published in the daily ppa though
<fginther> kenvandine, we can add the daily ppa as a build dependency
<kenvandine> fginther, please do :)
<fginther> kenvandine, Ack. will let you know when it's updated
<kenvandine> fginther, thanks!
<mterry> kenvandine, so does this mean that Ubuntu on powerpc won't have gwibber?
<kenvandine> i guess so
<kenvandine> unless we can untangle the deps
<kenvandine> so qtdeclarative doesn't need v8
<kenvandine> not sure how doable that is
<kenvandine> mterry, qml-friends has tests :)
<kenvandine> was blocked on the FFe, it'll land in raring as soon as i get this stack run unstuck :)
<mterry> kenvandine, it does?  maybe I was being blind.  Let me look again
<mterry> kenvandine, oh you mean in trunk, but not in raring?
<kenvandine> not even in trunk yet :)
<kenvandine> waiting to be merged
<kenvandine> approved... just CI is failing because of friends not being published
<mterry> kenvandine, well good, I do like tests
<kenvandine> mterry, and as soon as all these packages land i am going to shift focus for a couple days to only working on autopilot tests for gwibber :)
<mterry> kenvandine, regarding gwibber and powerpc, is that a problem?  Like, shouldn't powerpc images come with the same desktop as i386?
<mterry> Or is powerpc a "less than" architecture as far as the Desktop team is concerned
<sarnold> mterry: as I understand it, powerpc has been a "best effort" arch since 7.04: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SecurityTeam/FAQ#Architectures
<kenvandine> mterry, yeah there are a number of packages not available for ppc
<kenvandine> i wish that wasn't the case.. but it is hard to support these days
<mterry> sarnold, ah
<mterry> We probably don't need it very much these days, right?  Don't macbooks handle i386 ok now?
<kenvandine> yeah
<robru> mterry, macs have been intel-only since ~2005
<robru> mterry, so really, we're talking about 8-year-old macs being unsupported by gwibber.
<mdeslaur> I'm sure our 3d desktop works really well on 8-year old macs
<mterry> kenvandine, gir1.2-friends-0.1 should probably depend on libfriends0
<mterry> kenvandine, and this is a small nit, but I think you can pass --with gir instead of manually calling dh_girepository
<kenvandine> ah, i'm still oldschool :)
<mterry> kenvandine, and you misspelled your name in all your copyright messages for libfriends  ;)
<kenvandine> oh that's awesome!
<robru> LOL
<kenvandine> i bet that means gwibber had them misspelled too :)
<kenvandine> mterry is the only person that reads those... obviously :)
<mterry> kenvandine, yikes, there is a color "indianred" ?  seems not PC
<kenvandine> haha!
<kenvandine> yeah... yeah there is
<kenvandine> yeah... it's misspelled in the old libgwibber source too :)
<kenvandine> years of misspelling that nobody noticed :)
<mterry> kenvandine, hey, it's not really a misspelling if you typed it
<kenvandine> actually i think neil did that :)
<kenvandine> he added the first of the copyright headers to my files
<kenvandine> and i copied and pasted that into all the others
<mterry> kenvandine, why do the gtk bindings get to be in the main libfriends source, but qml-friends is relegated to second class?
<kenvandine> qml-friends need to be in main... but i don't care if the gtk bindings are in main :)
<kenvandine> oh
<kenvandine> the main... not main :)
<kenvandine> autotools vs. qmake :)
<robru> kenvandine, but I thought qml-friends wrapped libfriends? so libfriends will need to go in main, too
<kenvandine> it does
<kenvandine> yeah
<kenvandine> can't mix the build systems!
<robru> ah
<kenvandine> don't cross the streams
<robru> kenvandine, lp:friends somehow managed to mix setup.py and autotools ;-)
<kenvandine> and qml-friends wraps more than libfriends
<kenvandine> yeah... that was out of desparation :)
<kenvandine> there goes my spelling awesomeness again
<mterry> kenvandine, that explains that.  Do the libfriends tests take forever?  They seem to have stalled in my pbuilder
<bcurtiswx> please tell me he misspelled his name "keg"?
<robru> mterry, I don't remember them being too slow. could be stalled waiting for dbus-test-runner or something
<robru> bcurtiswx, VaDine
<mterry> Keg VanWine
<ogra_> cheers
<bcurtiswx> yes!
<kenvandine> hehe
<kenvandine> mterry, qml-friends uploaded to raring
<kenvandine> should be able to approve that one now
<ChrisTownsend> kenvandine: Hey, I saw the earlier conversation about unity-asset-pool and saw that you tried fixing that situation.  However, the latest package will not install and if I try to do an apt-get install unity-asset-pool, it wants to REMOVE all of those packages, not just replace the file.
<kenvandine> what version?
<ChrisTownsend> Just a sec, I'll get that.
<kenvandine> 0.8.24daily13.03.20.1-0ubuntu1
<kenvandine> shouldn't do that
<ChrisTownsend> Yep, that's it.
<kenvandine> ugh... you're right!
<kenvandine> seb128, ^^^
<ChrisTownsend> It won't let it install from Software Updater though, so at leaat that is safe.
<mterry> kenvandine, whoa yeah you weren't kidding about autools and setup.py in friends
<kenvandine> no... i wasn't :)
<kenvandine> seb128, so a dist-upgrade wants to remove all the account-plugin packages
<kenvandine> but, install unity-asset-pool wants to upgrade them
<tkamppeter> seb128, still there?
<mterry> dobey, are we going to have a new release of software-center before UI Freeze?
<tkamppeter> Anyone here in charge of the PDF viewer on Ubuntu Touch?
<dobey> mterry: yes, i'm doing one right now
<dobey> launchpad is being a pita though
<mterry> dobey, awesome.   I want my shiny new icon  ;)
<dobey> it is a much better icon than that old one was
<Robin_Watts> Hi all. I'm one of the mupdf (and ghostscript) developers. I believe you are using poppler as your pdf renderer of choice for Ubuntu touch. We'd be interested in seeing you use MuPDF instead, and would like to work with you to make that happen.
<Robin_Watts> Also, if there is something that MuPDF *doesn't* do that precludes it being considered, we'd like to know what so we can fix it! :)
<mterry> Robin_Watts, hrm.  This channel is more for the Desktop image.  You might try #ubuntu-touch?  Though I'd imagine we'd like to not diverge on such a thing
<mterry> They might bump you back here for that reason...  :-/
<Robin_Watts> mterry: we've been talking to tkamppeter about his needs for printing, and we think MuPDF would be a good fit there.
<mterry> Robin_Watts, well, try #ubuntu-touch
<Robin_Watts> It would (as I understand it) be nice to only have the one PDF renderer in the system, hence me coming here to see what the guys doing the viewer think.
<Robin_Watts> But yes, I will try on #ubuntu-touch too. Thanks!
<mterry> Robin_Watts, well, we use evince from GNOME as the Desktop viewer
<mterry> Robin_Watts, I'm guessing that since it's a GNOME package, the backend is not swappable
<kenvandine> ChrisTownsend, testing a fix now
<Robin_Watts> evince uses poppler as it's PDF backend.
<ChrisTownsend> kenvandine: Ok, cool
<mterry> Robin_Watts, but if Ubuntu is building a new PDF viewer for Touch, Desktop might inherit that viewer eventually instead of evince.  So if you can convince the Touch people it makes sense...
<ogra_> mterry, he is right, we use poppler all over the place (even kubuntu does afaik)
<mterry> I know, we're rather committed to poppler now
<Robin_Watts> I guess evince could probably have mupdf added as a backend, but I haven't looked at the code to see how hard that is.
<ogra_> though replacing it in the converged setup would mean to also replace it on the desktop
<mterry> I imagine security team would not be excited about a new PDF parser
<ogra_> yeah
<ogra_> it would definitely have to go through a deep review
<Robin_Watts> OK, thanks guys. I'll lurk here in case anyone comes up with any more thoughts etc.
<tkamppeter> mterry, Robin_Watts, evince has also the problem to print with the awkward Cairo PDF.
<tkamppeter> mterry, Robin_Watts, which invents transparency into all PDF files and slows down mobile devices and PostScript printers.
<Robin_Watts> Cairo produced PDFs are horribly overcomplicated, generally, but mupdf copes well.
<tkamppeter> mterry, Robin_Watts, this can also make someone think to replace evince.
<tkamppeter> Robin_Watts, mterry, and I hope that nay new approach of a PDF reader would pass through the PDF for printing.
<tkamppeter> Robin_Watts, if mupdf is able to flatten the Cairo bloat efficiently so that a cheap PostScript printer can print it, it would be a great RIP for any form factor of Ubuntu.
<Robin_Watts> tkamppeter: Well, mupdf can certainly render to bitmap bands, and we can then wrap those bands into images in a postscript stream easily.
<Robin_Watts> I'd like to think that most postscript printers can cope with printing simple images OK (and by banding we will avoid them being too huge for the printer)
<tkamppeter> Robin_Watts, and once on MuPDF making a PostScript driver of this form you could put the same code into GS and so also solve the PostScript printer problem on desktop distros which stay with GS.
<Robin_Watts> tkamppeter: Sure. AIUI, GS only has a problem with crap PS printers because it attempts to stay at the high level (i..e it sends text and paths and high level images), and these printers have hopelessly broken postscript.
<ritz> seb128, thanks. I did not see this message in xsession error, will start apps from terminal to note these
<tkamppeter> Robin_Watts, so I would even suggest that for sending PostScript to printers one could create a new PS output device (or an option for ps2write) that output is done in bitmap bands to have a more reliable mode for printers.
<JanC> libpoppler uses plugins to implements different formats AFAIK
<JanC> eh, Evince does
<Robin_Watts> tkamppeter: That's certainly possible. We should take this discussion back to #ghostscript though, so others can chime in. :)
<mterry> kenvandine, accounts-qml-module needs Pre-Depends: ${misc:Pre-Depends}
<kenvandine> mterry, ok
<seb128> re
<seb128> kenvandine, back, still need me?
<seb128> tkamppeter, hey
<kenvandine> seb128, nope
<kenvandine> :)
<seb128> cool
<seb128> kenvandine, how did you solve it?
<kenvandine> just using a breaks
<kenvandine> and no replaces
<kenvandine> seems t dtrt
<kenvandine> s/t/to
<seb128> doesn't make any sense
<seb128> replaces has no value in what apt does
<kenvandine> with the replaces it was trying to remove the old packages
<seb128> it just tell "it's ok to overwrite a file"
<seb128> no
<kenvandine> weird
<seb128> that sounds wrong
<kenvandine> dist-upgrade was trying to remove
<tkamppeter> seb128, it was about the PDF renderer in Ubuntu touch, so I asked you as the evince guy, but they seem not to use evince there, the discussion is now on #ubuntu-touch and it looks like that MuPDF is a good candidate to make the race.
<seb128> replaces shouldn't have any impact on the resolver
<kenvandine> install unity-asset-pool seemed to do the right thing
<seb128> kenvandine, how did you test the fix?
<kenvandine> i dropped the deb in my local archive
<kenvandine> and did a dist-upgrade
<kenvandine> worked perfectly
<kenvandine> it ordered the updates so the account plugins went first
<seb128> tkamppeter, try asking tdsgeos otherwise, he works on ubuntu touch and is upstream for poppler
<seb128> kenvandine, k, that still seems weird to me
<seb128> kenvandine, your changelog is
<seb128> "+  * debian/control
<seb128> +    - Don't use a breaks, only replaces for the account-plugin-*
<seb128> +      packages (LP: #1157747)"
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1157747 in unity-asset-pool (Ubuntu) "package unity-asset-pool 0.8.24daily12.12.05-0ubuntu1 failed to install/upgrade: trying to overwrite '/usr/share/icons/hicolor/32x32/apps/facebook.png', which is also in package account-plugin-facebook 0.10bzr13.02.27-0ubuntu1" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1157747
<kenvandine> i know
<kenvandine> i typed it wrong :)
<seb128> hum
<kenvandine> i changed it to use a breaks and no replaces
<kenvandine> i fixed it for the MP
<kenvandine> i confirmed the dist-upgrade behavior that ChrisTownsend had seen before
<tkamppeter> seb128, thanks, tsdgeos already appeared on #ghostscript.
<mterry> kenvandine, hmm, qml-friends is ftbfs due to a test failing it seems
<mterry> dobey, I downloaded software-center 5.5.6 and the categories in the left of the main pane don't render...
<mterry> hmm, maybe that's gtk 3.7
<dobey> yeah
<dobey> works here
<robru> mterry, can you point me at the build failure log? I saw one earlier that was due to missing build deps, not sure if you're seeing the same one though
<kenvandine> mterry, yeah i am looking now
<seb128> kenvandine, #ubuntu-devel please
<kenvandine> robru, it isn't the build deps
<seb128> kenvandine, btw your mr for the asset pool should use UNRELEASED and not raring ;-)
<mterry> robru, https://launchpadlibrarian.net/134763029/buildlog_ubuntu-raring-amd64.qml-friends_0.1.0bzr13.03.20-0ubuntu1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<robru> mterry, ooh, that's different
<kenvandine> seb128, i had uploaded it
<mterry> dobey, yup, downgraded to gtk/raring and it works
<kenvandine> robru, one of the failures is the features test is failing
<robru> kenvandine, remember how friends had an unhandled exception in the get_features method? I fixed that by returning an empty list there.
<kenvandine> ChrisTownsend, ping
<robru> kenvandine, so if you ask for the features of a protocol that doesn't exist, you get an empty list, stringified in json
<ChrisTownsend> kenvandine: Hey
<kenvandine> ChrisTownsend, can you get us some debug output for a dist-upgrade?
<kenvandine> apt-get dist-upgrade -oDebug::pkgProblemResolver=1
<ChrisTownsend> kenvandine: Sure, give me a sec
<kenvandine> robru, it's returning an empty list...  but the plugin is installed
<seb128> ChrisTownsend, can you join #ubuntu-devel as well? some of the people appropriate to debug that are on there
<seb128> ChrisTownsend, thanks
<robru> kenvandine, wait, you're running 'friends-dispatcher --test', right?
<ChrisTownsend> seb128: Sure
<kenvandine> yes
<seb128> ChrisTownsend, thanks
<robru> kenvandine, http://paste.ubuntu.com/5632259/
<robru> kenvandine, that's what runs in --test mode
<kenvandine> yeah, i call it with an arg of "facebook" and get an empty result back!
<ogra_> kenvandine, is that a bad thing ?
<kenvandine> robru, ah ha!  it's timing related!
<kenvandine> if i move the test_features to the end of my tests it passes
<kenvandine> the other tests of the dispatcher are all async
<kenvandine> maybe this is calling this sync method before the dispatcher is really ready?
<kenvandine> although i would expect a dbus failure
<kenvandine> not empty result
<fginther> kenvandine, job update for qml-friends is ready (finally)
<kenvandine> thx
<robru> kenvandine, oh, weird.
<kenvandine> robru, i'll have to try to fix it later... got fires to put out
<kenvandine> and i need to leave soon
<robru> ok
<rickspencer3> hi kgunn, welcome to #ubuntu-desktop :)
<kgunn> rickspencer3: hey
<rickspencer3> kgunn, I have an oldish very low powered notebook
<rickspencer3> it's getting some weird visual corruption in the transparency effects
 * rickspencer3 gets bug
<rickspencer3> kgunn, it's bug #1157987
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1157987 in unity (Ubuntu) "some transparency effects not displaying correctly" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1157987
<rickspencer3> I logged it against Unity, but maybe it should be moved to compiz?
<kgunn> rickspencer3: low powered as in low cpu? or low/no gpu ?
<rickspencer3> kgunn, low powered in every measuer :)
<rickspencer3> the gpu is IntelÂ® IGD x86/MMX/SSE2
<rickspencer3> thought you guys would want to take a look, and maybe move it to the right project if unity is incorrect
<rickspencer3> I'm very happy to help the developers if they want to try to run down the problem
<rickspencer3> (assuming the bug isn't a dupe, which it probably is because I am always late to the party ;) )
<davidcalle> seb128, ping
<seb128> davidcalle, hey
<davidcalle> seb128, so, I've removed icons from unity-scope-* trunks. Is that the correct fix, since unity-asset-pool provides them?
<seb128> rickspencer3, I guess it's a dup of https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/1154120 (nobody commented on that one either yet)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1154120 in unity "[raring] New reboot/restart dialog rendering issues" [Undecided,New]
<seb128> davidcalle, yes, thanks about that
<rickspencer3> seb128, could be, but my issue is throughout compiz
<seb128> rickspencer3, well, screenshots seem similar
<seb128> Trevinho, ^
<rickspencer3> seb128, yeah, it happens in the dash and in the alt-tab switcher too
<davidcalle> seb128, ok. Thanks for acting on unity-asset-pool to avoid blocking people adding the PPA until the next build.
<seb128> davidcalle, yw, sorry we landed that update before noticing the conflict
<seb128> rickspencer3, when did that start?
<rickspencer3> seb128, well ...
<Trevinho> seb128: mh, weird
<rickspencer3> tbh, about a couple of weeks ago :/
<seb128> rickspencer3, looks like a nux issue to me
 * rickspencer3 hides head in shame
<Trevinho> rickspencer3: since when is happening that?
<rickspencer3> it was happening to the dash for a while
<seb128> rickspencer3, it helps to have issues reported when they start, makes easier to figure what changed could create it
<rickspencer3> seb128, I know
<rickspencer3> that's why
 * rickspencer3 hides head in shame
<seb128> anyway
<davidcalle> seb128, np, you can't run every possible variants of the stack :)
<Trevinho> rickspencer3: yeah, the code handling the bg is the same... So it's "normal" that both the views are affected
<rickspencer3> I really started focusing on it when the new sweet shutdown window appeared
<rickspencer3> it became more glaring
<rickspencer3> Trevinho, if there is anything I can do to help you debug it, let me know
<Trevinho> rickspencer3: ok... I'm just thinking what would help the most
<Trevinho> rickspencer3: pressing super (i.e. the shortcut view) or switcher are affected too, right=
<Trevinho> ?
<olli> bregma ^
<rickspencer3> Trevinho, yes, the dash and the alt-tab switcher
<bschaefer> somewhat like this bug? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/1087534
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1087534 in unity "[regression] Corrupted blurred overlays" [Critical,Confirmed]
<bschaefer> at lease the non-bluring part (that texture is really messed up...)
<Trevinho> rickspencer3: mh, it is for sure an interaction issue between nux and compiz (more than unity itself), it would be helpful to go back in revisions to see what changed it...
<rickspencer3> bschaefer, that looks like my bug, but for me, I'd hardly call it Critical
<bschaefer> rickspencer3, I think it being a regression, and omer is saying its a release blocker is making it Critical ...
<rickspencer3> hmmm
<rickspencer3> well, that's not up to me, so sure
<rickspencer3> Trevinho, I'll be happy to run a ppa for you or whatever
<rickspencer3> if it will help you track it down
<rickspencer3> if you were in Seattle, I'd just give you this computer ;)
 * bschaefer is in Seattle
<rickspencer3> really?
 * rickspencer3 saves to bschaefer
<bschaefer> rickspencer3, yup, Renton to be more specific, born and raised :)
<rickspencer3> ah
<rickspencer3> bschaefer, I like in Bryant, which is east of the university district
<bschaefer> rickspencer3, if it weren't for the traffic that would be pretty close!
<rickspencer3> indeed
<rickspencer3> bschaefer, we should get some coffee sometime!
<rickspencer3> and if you want to get ahold of this computer to help Trevinho debug, let me know :)
<Trevinho> rickspencer3: (and bschaefer at this point), I think we should try to revert unity to the revision we switched to the less-expensive blur
<bschaefer> rickspencer3, that would be nice! Would be a good way to get ahold of the laptop to help Trevinho out
<rickspencer3> well, this make me feel guilty :)
<bschaefer> Trevinho, sounds good, though a lot of people complained about the less-expensive blur
 * bschaefer thinks the blur texture is getting messed up though
<rickspencer3> people don't like the less-expensive blur?
<rickspencer3> jeez
<bschaefer> haha, its not as crisp*
<rickspencer3> I figured I just had a crappy gpu in this thing
<bschaefer> looking at lease, I thought it was nice, instant opening of the dash
<Trevinho> bschaefer: it should be basically http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~unity-team/unity/trunk/revision/3083
<Trevinho> rickspencer3: can you try to revert this on your own btw http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~unity-team/unity/trunk/revision/3083
<kgunn> rickspencer3: sorry...my router decided to flip out...i wouldn't doubt if RAOF might have an instant reaction to that screen shot
<bschaefer> Trevinho, thats not to bad, do you want me to push a branch that adds that back in?
<rickspencer3> bschaefer, could I talk you into building that into a PPA that I could try?
<bschaefer> rickspencer3, sure!
<rickspencer3> that way I could "bisect" the problem a bit, right?
<rickspencer3> hey kgunn, no worries
<rickspencer3> I have a wonky router too :)
<kgunn> rickspencer3: not familiar with the blur effects...but kinda looks like xdamage no likie whatever its doing
<rickspencer3> kgunn, that's what I figured, but ...
<rickspencer3> it never crashes and Trevinho thinks it's the change to their blur effect
<rickspencer3> so, I put the bug in "unity" but sounds like it's in compiz and is a dupe anyway
<Laney> popey: have you filed a bug for the shutdown dialog wording?
<Trevinho> rickspencer3: that machine is not supporting GLES, right?
<rickspencer3> Trevinho, sorry, I don't know how to answer that
<rickspencer3> :/
<rickspencer3> I could google the gpu I guess
<Trevinho> rickspencer3: on google it doesn't seem to be the case... glxinfo |grep GL_ARB_ES2_compatibility
<rickspencer3> uh
<rickspencer3> Trevinho, the output is GL_ARB_ES2_compatibility, GL_ARB_debug_output,
<Trevinho> rickspencer3: mh, so maybe it has that extension, but it's missing others for GLES... I need to look further into it, though
<rickspencer3> ok, just let me know how I can help
<Trevinho> rickspencer3: we setup a ppa with that change reverted, then we see if that change is the guilty one
<rickspencer3> wow, nice
 * bschaefer is working on the ppa
<Trevinho> bschaefer: ah, cool ok, I was doing the same, but if you're already on I'll leave it to you
<RAOF> rickspencer3: That's a very fetching shade of pink you've got there :)
<rickspencer3> thanks bschaefer
<jono> hey all
<rickspencer3> RAOF, thank yo
<jono> running the 100 scopes PPA
<bschaefer> Trevinho, well Im missing some key thing, if you're already done then go for it :)
<jono> but getting a Unity crash when using the dash
<jono> seems to happen randomly
<jono> and no crash dialog
<jono> is there anything I can attach to a bug to help report this?
<rickspencer3> seb128, ^ ?
<rickspencer3> jono, is there anything in /var/crash ?
<seb128> jono, what rickspencer3 said
<rickspencer3> that's like the one thing I know
<rickspencer3> lol
<jono> I have unity-asset-pool.0.crash
<jono> which has today's timestamp
<rickspencer3> ding ding ding
<seb128> rickspencer3, one useful thing though ;-)
<jono> interestingly, ther eis an issue with that package install
<jono> installing
<seb128> jono, yeah, that's an upgrade issue
<seb128> not what we are looking for
<seb128> jono, can you pastebin your ~/.xsession-errors?
<popey> Laney: which bit?
<jono> seb128, see http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/5632627/ - it includes the issues I get with -f dist-upgrade and includes the xsession-errors
<seb128> jono, so, yeah, upgrades with the ppa are broken, unfortunate conflicts with archive updates and ppa divergence
<Laney> popey: er, I can't remember the wording
<seb128> jono, can you confirm that apt-get -f install complains about the file conflict still?
<popey> Laney: the wording isn't what I have a problem with, it's the buttons being the "wrong way round" and using the "wrong" icons
<Laney> how it's "Are you sure?" but it's not a yes/no question
<popey> oh
<seb128> Laney, buttons the "wrong way around"?
<Laney> didn't the order get changed in today's landing?
<popey> someone filed https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/1157927
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1157927 in unity "Shutdown dialog should have correct punctuation" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<popey> seb128: I believe shutdown should be on the right in the shutdown dialog
<seb128> Laney, right, today fixed the ordering
<popey> ok
<seb128> popey, that's the case with today's update?
<jono> seb128, it does
<Trevinho> rickspencer3: it should go into https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/+archive/unity-test soon, just waiting lp to do its work
<rickspencer3> thanks Trevinho
<popey> not updated yet seb128, will check
<Laney> popey: yeah /me hijacks that one
<seb128> jono, can you "wget https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity-asset-pool/0.8.24daily13.03.20.1-0ubuntu4/+build/4385204/+files/unity-asset-pool_0.8.24daily13.03.20.1-0ubuntu4_all.deb" and dpkg -i the deb?
<rickspencer3> just ping me when it's ready and I'll give it a whirl
<seb128> jono, and tell me if it installs fine or still raise and error?
<jono> seb128, sure, one sec
<Trevinho> rickspencer3: yeah, not sure it will build until I'm awake.. :)
<rickspencer3> Trevinho, ack, I'll keep my eye on it in that case
<jono> seb128, installs fine
<seb128> jono, \o/
<jono> seb128, thanks :-)
<seb128> jono, sudo apt-get -f install is happy?
<jono> will see if there are more crashes
<rickspencer3> seb128, do you think that was causing jono's crash?
<seb128> rickspencer3, I doubt it, but I'm still glad I fixed the ppa/archive conflicts with that upload
<rickspencer3> oh well
<jono> seb128, yep, configured everything left fine
<seb128> kenvandine, ^ btw, the update seems to work
<rickspencer3> no easy answers
<seb128> jono, thanks for confirming
<jono> seb128, np
<seb128> looking to your .xsession-errors
<rickspencer3> hey huats
<popey> seb128: yes, you're right, fixed
<seb128> jono, it's weird, your log/the fact that you have no .crash suggest it's not hitting a bug but being restarted
<popey> (correct order and shutdown highlighted by default)
<seb128> popey, good
<popey> \O/
<jono> seb128, weird
<seb128> jono, does it "crash"? or does it restart?
<seb128> e.g are you left without unity?
<seb128> or does it reload?
<jono> seb128, it restarts
<jono> it seems to crash and auto restart
<jono> although in multi monitor I noticed that restarting unity sometimes doesnt restart
<jono> cant test that here as I am only on my laptop right now
<seb128> I wonder if you run "unity" through the dash in some way
<seb128> is there any segfault listed in syslog?
<seb128> grep compiz /var/log/syslog
<jono> seb128, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/5632649/
<seb128> so, yeah, you hit segfaults
<seb128> jono, what is in /var/log/apport.log?
<jono> seb128, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/5632654/
<seb128> jono, sudo status apport?
<jono> seb128, apport start/running
<seb128> k, dunno why it doesn't catch to segfault :-(
<seb128> jono, you know how to use gdb? ;-)
<jono> seb128, nope
<jono> I know how to follow instructions :-)
<jono> although I don't have much time, I am supposed to be paying attention to a talk right now
<jono> :-)
<seb128> jono, I'm about to go, I will just list instruction, see if they make sense when you have time, otherwise ping me back again when you are up tomorrow
<seb128> - go to a vt
<jono> following now as you type
<seb128> - sudo gdb -p $(pidof compiz)
<seb128> (gdb) continue
<seb128> go back to your session
<seb128> when things freeze
<seb128> go to the vt
<seb128> and type on the gdb prompt
<seb128> "set logging on"
<seb128> "backtrace
<seb128> (without the "")
<seb128> that should give you the stacktace in a gdb.txt file
<seb128> then exit from gdb, using ctrl-D or exit
<seb128> open a bug with the file attached to it
<seb128> bonus point if you install compiz-dbgsym unity-dbgsym
<seb128> that increases the chances to have a debug stacktrace
<jono_> seb128, sorry
<jono_> I timed out
<jono_> well
<jono_> I typed the first command into a terminal and it hung my system
<seb128> lol
<jono_> can you repeat the commands?
<popey> seb128: if you have to go, I can help jono
<seb128> jono_, http://paste.ubuntu.com/5632674/
<seb128> jono_, and yeah, the first command will hang compiz until you type "continue" in gdb
<seb128> and hit enter to validate
<jono_> seb128, it says it couldnt attach to the process
<seb128> you used sudo?
<seb128> if you have several users logging in, "ps aux |grep compiz" and use gdb -p <pid> where <pid> is the pid of the compiz process for your user
<seb128> popey, yeah, I'm on my way out, please help jono if you can
<seb128> jono_, otherwise ping me tomorrow when you get online and I will help you to get the infos
<rickspencer3> popey, you were looking for drug violence and middle-aged goatees, right?
<rickspencer3> now you have your wish
<rickspencer3> zzzing
<popey> haha
<jono_> seb128, ok
<jono_> so I typed continue
<popey> and now you're back on your desktop and in your VT you have gdb running, right?
<jono_> but when I set logging on nothing happens
<jono_> popey, yep
<popey> no, you dont need to do that yet
<seb128> jono_, that's all good
<popey> you need to wait for the freeze to happen
<popey> or crash or whatever
<jono_> oh I see
<popey> then flip to the vt to capture the trace
<jono_> I will now try to trigger
<popey> which starts with turning on logging and then backtrace
<seb128> jono_, when compiz hit the segfault your session will freeze, that's when you go to the vt and do the next steps
<seb128> I see popey is on it
<seb128> so I'm calling it a day
<jono_> thank seb128, popey
<seb128> night everyone
<popey> nn
<seb128> see you tomorrow ;-)
<rickspencer3> bye seb128
<popey> or "later today" as you probably call it in Europe :D
<popey> jono_: what usually triggers the compiz blowout?
<popey> jono: does that reconnect mean you triggered it?
<jono> popey, no I had a full system hang
<jono> had to reboot
<popey> erk
<jono> unfortunately I need to run in a sec
<popey> ok. is your system up to date?
<popey> (stupid question i know)
<jono> popey, yup it is
<jono> I dist-upgraded today
<popey> humour me.. do you get package updates if you "sudo apt-get install ubuntu-desktop^" (note the caret)?
<jono> The following packages will be REMOVED:
<jono>   im-switch python-uno unity-scope-home
<jono> The following NEW packages will be installed:
<jono>   im-config language-selector-gnome python3-uno ubuntu-desktop unity-lens-shopping
<jono> popey, ^
<popey> hmm
<jono> should I intall those?
<popey> i wouldn't remove unity-scope-home
<popey> so no
<jono> yeah
<jono> gotta run
<popey> the fact that you have ubuntu-desktop missing is noteworthy
<jono> thanks, man
<popey> kk
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, hey, it's a reasonable time in .aus right?
<RAOF> And even in .nz :)
<robert_ancell> yep
<rickspencer3> oops
<rickspencer3> well, if it's reasonable for koala bears, it's reasonable for kiwis I suppose ;)
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, sorry to bug you, but are you aware of bug #1128492
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1128492 in unity-greeter (Ubuntu) "wallpaper not updating" [High,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1128492
<rickspencer3> not sure you're still the guy for that
<robert_ancell> I'm not doing a lot of work on U-G at the moment, mterry is doing it
<robert_ancell> but seb's comment sounds like a likely cause
<rickspencer3> ug, I didn't see his comment asking for data
<robru> any gvariant hackers here?
<rickspencer3> robert_ancell, so, I don't think it was what seb128 said
<rickspencer3> I'll follow up with mterry tomorrow
<robert_ancell> rickspencer3, ok
<rickspencer3> the greeter was using the old wall paper from my downloads folder
<popey> rickspencer3: you using the experimental ppa?
<popey> bug 1158021
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1158021 in unity (Ubuntu) "Launcher tooltips don't disappear when dash is open" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1158021
<popey> bug 1158025
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1158025 in Unity "Search term disappears sometimes" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1158025
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-03-21
<rickspencer3> I haven't noticed those
<rickspencer3> popey, I'm not at the 'puter with that PPA installed atm
<popey> ok np
<rickspencer3> give me 20 minutes or so, and I'll see if I'm hitting those?
<popey> thanks, just looking for confirmation that I'm not bonkers
<rickspencer3> popey, I'm sure you are not bonkers
<rickspencer3> those look like simple logic bugs
<rickspencer3> I'll try to confirm for you
<popey> ta
<bschaefer> rickspencer3, looks like Trevinho ppa is ready to use :)
<bschaefer> https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/+recipe/unity-old-blur-test
<rickspencer3> hi bschaefer
<rickspencer3> oh nice
 * rickspencer3 fetches netbook
<bschaefer> rickspencer3, hello, and I tested the branch out, and its using the old (faster) blur
<rickspencer3> bschaefer, this is the ppa, right?
<rickspencer3> ppa:3v1n0/unity-test
<bschaefer> rickspencer3, yeah should be
<rickspencer3> ok, adding it
<bschaefer> yup it is, just found the right page
<rickspencer3> hmmm
<bschaefer> not finding it?
<rickspencer3> bschaefer, so I tried dist-upgrade, but it's not offering to upgrade unity
<bschaefer> rickspencer3, did you update before hand?
<rickspencer3> yah
<rickspencer3> oh
<rickspencer3> whoops
<rickspencer3> it didn't fetch the upgrade from the ppa :)
<bschaefer> oo well that'll cause a problem :)
<rickspencer3> bschaefer, yeah, the i386 build isn't due for 2 hours :(
<rickspencer3> oh well
<rickspencer3> I'll try first thing in the morning
<bschaefer> daang, sorry didn't notice that
<rickspencer3> bschaefer, oh, no worries at all
<bschaefer> rickspencer3, well it'll be testable later on today!
<rickspencer3> bschaefer, yeah, I may give it a try later
<rickspencer3> but I need to go do my Dad stuff
<rickspencer3> :)
<bschaefer> rickspencer3, cool, hopefully it'll fix the problem
<bschaefer> rickspencer3, have fun! cya later
<rickspencer3> bschaefer, well, this will just mean we know where the bug is from, right?
<rickspencer3> someone will still need to actually fix it
 * rickspencer3 presumes
<bschaefer> rickspencer3, well Im not actually sure what Trevinho  was thinking I kind of just stepped in
<bschaefer> but it'll be useful for debugging :)
<rickspencer3> ah
<rickspencer3> yeah, I think he believes he knows the change that broke it
 * bschaefer isn't 100% what the overall problem was 
<rickspencer3> so this ppa has that change reverted
<bschaefer> yup!
<bschaefer> oo right, yeah and we can just revert that change or make it use this blur method for netbooks
<rickspencer3> something
<bschaefer> yeah
<rickspencer3> ok, I'll try later probably :)
<rickspencer3> laters!
<bschaefer> c ya!
<cyphermox> kenvandine: still around?
<cyphermox> robru: mterry: ^ ?
<kenvandine> cyphermox, sort of
<kenvandine> cyphermox, what's up?
<cyphermox> kenvandine: got bschaefer to help, thanks
<cyphermox> trying hard to not delay autopilot-qt more :/
<kenvandine> cool
<kenvandine> cyphermox, i really need autopilot-qt :)
<cyphermox> I know ;)
<kenvandine> my next todo item is to spend a couple days knocking out autopilot tests for gwibber :)
<cyphermox> cool
<cyphermox> as soon as this one commit lands I think we should be good with autopilot-qt
<kenvandine> great!
<cyphermox> it's getting late though, so perhaps I won't rerun and just wait until it starts
<kenvandine> yeah
<kenvandine> cyphermox, do you have any examples of qml apps using it?
<kenvandine> i've mostly looked at what the phone shell did
<kenvandine> but failed miserably at getting anything to run
<kenvandine> qtcreator's ubuntu-sdk plugin has a thing for adding autopilot tests to your project
<kenvandine> but that failed miserably too
<kenvandine> all failed to import stuff in autopilot-qt
 * kenvandine hopes when this lands qtcreators magic will just work :)
<Crinos512> Greetings!
<Crinos512> could some one here help me submit a "papercut" for the OneHundredPapercuts project?
<darkxst> this has been sitting in the SRU queue for nearly a month! https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell/+bug/1128804
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1128804 in mutter "Update mutter/gnome-shell to 3.6.3" [Medium,In progress]
<RAOF> darkxst: Is that urgent?
<darkxst> RAOF, messagetray crash is incredibly annoying
<darkxst> brings down the shell whenever people use empathy
<RAOF> That sounds bad :)
<darkxst> well shell still works, but the tray dies, and so does their conversation, so they restart shell
<darkxst> the fact that GNOME even bothered to release a .3, should make it high priority I guess
<RAOF> On the other hand, you'll notice that gnome-shell is only about half-way down the list, and there's no obvious priority; if you've got something that you think should be accepted quickly, you can ping the on-call SRU team member.\
<RAOF> darkxst: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates#Publishing - we're generally happy to process urgent things.
<darkxst> RAOF, so what is considered urgent?
<RAOF> darkxst: The question to ask is âDo you consider it urgent?â. If yes, give a ping. If your sense of urgency is not calibrated the same as ours, I'm sure we'll let you know gently :)
<RAOF> darkxst: Also, small things are more easily dealt with than large things. And SRU bugs where we can talk to the uploader are easier to deal with if there are any niggles.
<darkxst> sure, but I am hardly going to break out patches from a very small point release, which only fixes a few critical bugs
<RAOF> MREs are also generally easy to accept
<darkxst> RAOF, that is a MRE, although with one extra back-ported patch
<darkxst> anyway will ping bdmurray, whenever thursday starts...
<pitti> Good morning
<RAOF> Huh. I've let my self drop out of ~ubuntu-sponsors.
<darkxst> pitti, so logind not happening for R now?
<pitti> darkxst: right
<pitti> darkxst: well, it works (and I'll keep it working), but not by default
<darkxst> what is blocking it? just unity?
<pitti> darkxst: so gnome flavour might want to depend on libpam-systemd
<pitti> darkxst: please see the blueprint and http://people.canonical.com/~pitti/tmp/cgroup-sd_booted.txt, there's quite a lot of packages which need migration
<pitti> and adjustment of sd_booted(); I'll start on that upstream today
<darkxst> pitti, well I havent tested against 3.6, but 3.8 was working very well
<pitti> darkxst: I actually got my unity logind branch approved yesterday :)
<pitti> so it should go in with the next automatic landing
<RAOF> Ah. No colord sync from experimental, then.
<darkxst> pitti, so if we were to land logind enabled packages on the ppa, we wouldnt horribly break anything
<pitti> darkxst: no, I don't think so; I already have some in https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-core-dev/+archive/logind, but I didn't continue that as the FFE was declined
<pitti> darkxst: dbus and policykit-1 are the crucial ones, the others should work fine with a parallel CK as well
<darkxst> yeh I built mine off that
<darkxst> gnome-shell dies hard, if the base libs are using CK
<darkxst> https://launchpad.net/~darkxst/+archive/logind/
<darkxst> pitti, also, you were going to add a special case for gnome3 ppa bug reports to apport?
<pitti> darkxst: ah, if you could file a bug against apport with the details of what should happen with those? i. e. which PPA, which project they should be filed against, etc.
<darkxst> pitti, sure, we don't actually have a project as such, should set one up ;)
<darkxst> pitti, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/apport/+bug/1158119
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1158119 in apport "support for reporting bugs against gnome3-team ppa" [Undecided,New]
<pitti> darkxst: thanks
<pitti> darkxst: you want both crashes and bugs, right?
<pitti> (crashes until the release, that is; after that, they'll only go to errors.ubuntu.com)
<darkxst> pitti, yes
<darkxst> yeh that is fine
<didrocks> jibel: salut!
<jibel> didrocks, bonjour
<didrocks> Ã§a va?
<jibel> didrocks, Ã§a va bien et toi ?
<didrocks> Ã§a va :)
<jibel> didrocks, rien de cassÃ© ce matin ?
<didrocks> jibel: si, mais je rÃ©pareâ¦
<didrocks> jibel: par contre, j'ai l'impression qu'il y a un petit truc sur le calc du nombre de rÃ©gression
 * didrocks vÃ©rifie sa thÃ©orie
<jibel> didrocks, argh
 * jibel va se chercher du cafÃ©
<didrocks> :)
<didrocks> jibel: so, look at https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/job/cu2d-unity-head-2.2check/116/console
<jibel> didrocks, what is your theory?
<didrocks> delta+0+0+7
<didrocks> the thoery is wrong :)
<didrocks> Tests for card 'intel' failed!
<didrocks> theory*
<didrocks> if I check our limits, for unity, it's 16 failures and 6 regressions
<didrocks> however, if we look at the intel corresponding run: https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/job/ps-unity-autopilot-release-testing/label=autopilot-intel/
<didrocks> we have ("just" +2
<didrocks> and 13 failures
<didrocks> so normally, below the limit
<didrocks> knowing that rev 129, the previous one, is indeed the one used in last publication
<didrocks> so the jenkins numbers should be what we base on
<jibel> didrocks, right and I really need coffee before looking into this
<didrocks> go go! :-)
<pitti> je ne le crois pas -- il neige Ã  nouveau
<pitti> c'est printemps !
<jibel> chrisccoulson, hi, the modification of the proxy configuration on the testbed have fixed the multiple_geo_listeners tests
<jibel> chrisccoulson, also, I increased the memory and don't see and OOM error this morning
<jibel> s/and/any
<jibel> pitti, it's spring here too, and guess what ... it's raining
<didrocks> pitti: c'est le printemps ici, 8-10Â°C l'aprÃ¨s-midi, grand soleil!
<pitti> bah!
 * didrocks ran yesterday juts wearing a tee shirt
 * pitti mettre la neige Ã  ville de didrocks
<didrocks> pitti: roh! j'en ai dÃ©jÃ  eu assez cette annÃ©e :p
<didrocks> jibel: things seems to be back to normal looking at the France weather map: http://france.meteofrance.com/france/accueil?xtor=AL-1
<didrocks> rainy in your place
<didrocks> clouds in Paris
<didrocks> and sun for us \o/
<jibel> didrocks, hm, I must verify something but I *think* I found what the problem is and we are probably mixing results to calculate the stats
<didrocks> jibel: great! I'm excited that we can rerelease unity! :-)
<jibel> didrocks, confirmed, we are storing all the history files in the same directory without distinction of the type of graphics card, so the stats are computed against the last results that have been submitted
<didrocks> jibel: oh, interesting :)
<jibel> didrocks, I'm wondering how we didn't notice that before
<jibel> working on a fix
<didrocks> jibel: yeah, seems we were just "lucky" to have higher number of failures and approx. the same number of failure per config
<didrocks> thanks jibel :)
<jibel> didrocks, there is no way to guess the type of system the test ran on from the result file. I'll add a parameter to specify a path to the directory containing history files and create one per configuration. Something like $BASEDIR/archive/$STACK/$SYSTEMID/
<jibel> didrocks, where $SYSTEMID is an arbitrary string and the brand/model of the graphics card in our case
<seb128> hey desktopers
<seb128> lut jibel
<didrocks> hey jibel
<didrocks> seb128: ;)
<jibel> bonjour seb128
<didrocks> jibel: ok, sounds good to me
<jibel> morning didrocks :)
<didrocks> jibel: long time no see!
<seb128> lut didrocks ;-)
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<seb128> pitti, salut, Ã§a va bien ?
<didrocks> jibel: ok, also, we need to ensure that when we "force" the publish, we rerun head as well btw
<seb128> pitti, ton rhume ?
<pitti> seb128: je vais mieux que hier, merci
<pitti> (qu'hier ?)
<seb128> pitti, ah, tant mieux
<didrocks> jibel: because if you have QA in manual publication mode, then publish it (force mode), then run indicators
<didrocks> indicators will still pick the old "manual publishing" mode for the QA stack
<didrocks> as we didn't run head
<seb128> pitti, "que hier" is correct
<didrocks> and so the trigger to update the file didn't work
<seb128> pitti, "qu'hier" works too
<tkamppeter> pitti, hi
<jibel> didrocks, about bug 1155510, did you commit the fix ?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1155510 in Canonical Upstream To Distro "buildsource-chroot failed with lock failure on /etc/group or /etc/passwd" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1155510
<Laney> hey thar
<didrocks> jibel: oh no indeed, feel free to do it :)
<jibel> didrocks, k, I'll do it
<didrocks> thanks
<seb128> Laney, hey, how are you?
<Laney> good thank you - patch piloting later ;-)
<Laney> how are you?
<seb128> I'm good thanks
<seb128> I was going to do some NEW review and a bit of sponsoring as well
<Laney> cool, I scheduled my slot for this afternoon
<BigWhale> Good Morning everyone.
<seb128> hey BigWhale
<chrisccoulson> jibel, thanks for that. the results are looking much better now :)
<jibel> chrisccoulson, indeed, 3 failures over 44,426 tests is not bad :)
<chrisccoulson> jibel, although, i'm a bit confused about https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/job/raring-ppa-adt-ubuntu_mozilla_daily_ppa-firefox-trunk/92/ARCH=amd64,label=adt/testReport/junit/toolkit.components.search.tests/xpcshell/test_nocache_js/. i thought i'd fixed that with http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~mozillateam/firefox/firefox-trunk.head/revision/1618
<chrisccoulson> oh
<chrisccoulson> hang on, it's a different test
<chrisccoulson> test_json_cache.js vs test_nocache.js
<chrisccoulson> heh
 * chrisccoulson grabs spectacles
<jibel> didrocks, https://code.launchpad.net/~jibel/cupstream2distro/history_per_systemid/+merge/154641
<didrocks> jibel: will review in a seconde
<jibel> didrocks, I'll split the archive per arch but won't touch the existing result files for the moment
<BigWhale> When is the last date for things to get uploaded into Raring?
<Laney> depends what kind of thing
<BigWhale> bug fixes
<BigWhale> no UI changes
<Laney> still got a few weeks
<Laney> a week or so before release is a hard freeze
<BigWhale> ok I'll aim for March 28th - Final Beta Freeze
<tkamppeter> pitti, around?
<pitti> hello tkamppeter
<tkamppeter> pitti, I have a problem with Upstart.
<tkamppeter> pitti, on my laptop running Raring there are the three Upstart-controlled services avahi-daemon, cups, and cups-browsed.
<tkamppeter> pitti, starting cups requires avahi-daemon being already started and starting cups-browsed also requires avahi-daemon being already started and in addition cups already started OR run level 2, 3, 4, 5.
<tkamppeter> pitti, if I start the three services manually, first avahi-daemon and then cups and cups-browsed (in arbitrary order), the ~10 queues from my remote print server get all available locally as expected, but now the problem:
<pitti> btw, please discuss upstart problems on #ubuntu-devel; jodh and xnox hang out there, our upstart maintainers
<pitti> (well, they hang out here as well)
<tkamppeter> pitti, if I boot the machine either no queues at all or some queues (always the ones whose names are in the beginning of the alphabet, are available. To get them all available I have to manually reestart cups-browsed.
<pitti> tkamppeter: it sounds like a race condition that cups is trying to talk to avahi before it's really started?
<tkamppeter> pitti, was Upstart not your baby in the beginning?
<pitti> no, never :)
<pitti> I've been promoting systemd for like two years (which incidentally also avoids this kind of race)
<seb128> pitti likes upstart so much that's he's pushing for us to replace it for 2 years :p
<seb128> heh, got snapped there :p
<pitti> tkamppeter: I think what needs to happen there is that either avahi emits some "I am ready" upstart signal which cups waits on, or cups has to repeatedly try and talk to avahi until its ready
<pitti> jodh, xnox ^ Please correct me if I'm wrong
<tkamppeter> pitti, seb128, I would love to switch to systemd.
<pitti> well, it's not that I don't like upstart; I just don't like having three init systems in the Linux world
<tkamppeter> pitti, xnox, jodh, another thing is that avahi-discover shows all remote queues.
<ogra_> pitti, three ?
 * ogra_ thinks there are more like ten
<GunnarHj> seb128: Bug 1157188 doesn't sound nice.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1157188 in gnome-control-center (Ubuntu) "gnome-control-center crashed with SIGSEGV in g_str_hash()" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1157188
<ogra_> (and 9 of them have a sane upstream)
<tkamppeter> pitti, as CUPS does not pick up the remote queues by itself, but cups-browsed does and then passes them on to CUPS, it seems that cups-browsed starts too early, probably before avahi-daemon is ready. cups-browsed itself waits for CUPS being ready.
<seb128> ogra_, let's not start a troll today, it's not friday :p
<didrocks> jibel: how do you deal with previous results then?
<tkamppeter> xnox, jodh, ^^
<seb128> GunnarHj, hum, is that a side effect of your recent changes?
<didrocks> jibel: like the diff will fail a previous one?
<pitti> tkamppeter: yeah, or that way around
<tkamppeter> xnox, jodh, pitti, for an external daemon/app it is easy to check whether CUPS is ready, but is there a way to check whether avahidaemon is ready?
<GunnarHj> seb128: That was my thought as well, but I don't think so. Even if that patch affects the language list in user accounts, it doesn't touch the user account files directly.
<pitti> tkamppeter: usually, check if you can connect to its D-BUS interface
<seb128> GunnarHj, well, look at the stacktrace
<seb128> GunnarHj,   cc_common_language_get_initial_languages () at cc-common-language.c:634
<seb128> GunnarHj, is where the error is
<ogra_> seb128, i was practicing for tomorrow :)
<seb128> GunnarHj, "        name = 0x0"
<seb128> GunnarHj, I guess it's not guarded against null values
<seb128> GunnarHj, not sure if having name = NULL is valid there...
<tkamppeter> xnox, jodh, pitti, strange is also that if I manually start the three services on one command line, via "sudo start avahi-daemon; sudo start cups; sudo start cups-browsed" I always get the queues correctly set up. I can reproduce the problem only by booting.
<GunnarHj> seb128: You are far too fast for me. ;-)
<pitti> tkamppeter: that one starts them serially; I guess at boot they start in parallel?
<seb128> GunnarHj, the XsessionError has
<seb128> (gnome-control-center:5411): common-cc-panel-WARNING **: Error calling GetAll() when retrieving properties for /org/freedesktop/Accounts/User999: GDBus.Error:org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.UnknownMethod: No such interface `org.freedesktop.DBus.Properties' on object at path /org/freedesktop/Accounts/User999
<tkamppeter> xnox, jodh, pitti, naturally I did "sudo stop cups-browsed; sudo stop cups; sudo stop avahi-daemon" before and waited some seconds.
<pitti> tkamppeter: or perhaps the network is not up yet, etc.
<seb128> GunnarHj, ^ I guess that's part of the issue
<tkamppeter> pitti, how do I assure that?
<pitti> tkamppeter: start them in parallel?
<pitti> tkamppeter: (sudo start avahi-daemon &); (sudo start cups-browsed &)
<pitti> and try a few times
<pitti> tkamppeter: but I think you can reproduce the problem better by starting cups first, and then avahi
<pitti> err, -browsed
<seb128> GunnarHj, let me know if I can help you to debug, those are just my random thoughts from a quick look
<pitti> tkamppeter: to check whether cups-browsed picks up avahi signals after avahi starts, but cups-browsed is already running
<GunnarHj> seb128: Will do. Thanks.
<seb128> GunnarHj, yw, thanks for pointing the bug ;-)
<jibel> didrocks, i could identify which result belongs to which system in the history from the path of the test in the junit file. Then copied the previous results in history/$stack/$card
<jibel> didrocks, so when we'll deploy the patch it will compare the right results
<didrocks> jibel: ok, approving then, feel free to merge
<jibel> didrocks, cooll, thanks
<tkamppeter> pitti, both "sudo start avahi-daemon & sudo start cups & sudo start cups-browsed &" and "(sudo start avahi-daemon &); (sudo start cups &); (sudo start cups-browsed &)" leads to a correct queue list, even having cups-browsed starting before the two others.
<pitti> tkamppeter: so I guess it's somethign else then, like the network not being up yet?
<GunnarHj> seb128: /org/freedesktop/Accounts/User999 That path is a concatenation with the user id. Do you know if accountsservice works with four digits also when the user id is < 1000?
<pitti> Trevinho: OOI, does https://code.launchpad.net/~pitti/unity/logind/+merge/154029 need to be set to "approved", or is it just waiting for the automatic tests to kick in?
<xnox> tkamppeter: please increase upstart logging and send the logs in from "bad" boot ( see http://upstart.ubuntu.com/cookbook/ ). Both cups* jobs do depend on "started avahi-daemon" which should mean "avahi is fully started and operational". Clearly you say that's not the case in practice. The best way to improve things is to add a post-start in avahi-daemon job, which tries to talk to avahi (over dbus?!) and wait until it's really there.
<xnox> this will delay the "started avahi-daemon" event until it is appropriate.
<Trevinho> pitti: yeah... marking it now
<seb128> GunnarHj, the number of digits shouldn't make a difference
<seb128> GunnarHj, not sure what's the id range we use, I think we take it from /etc/login.defs
<GunnarHj> seb128: Well, it would if the correct path is /org/freedesktop/Accounts/User0999
<GunnarHj> seb128: right?
<seb128> GunnarHj, you can probably add an user with uid 999 and look over d-feet
<GunnarHj> d-feet?
<seb128> GunnarHj, my d-feet has a user123
<seb128> so I don't think it's 0 padded to 4 digits
<seb128> GunnarHj, d-feet is a nice tool to interact with dbus services
<pitti> Trevinho: thanks
<seb128> GunnarHj, you can see all the services/objects on the bus and trigger their methods, query their properties, etc
<seb128> GunnarHj, sudo apt-get install d-fett
<seb128> d-feet
<GunnarHj> seb128: Ok. It was a first theory. Will check out d-feet.
<jodh> tkamppeter: confused - you say that cups-browsed requires cups, yet also that cups requires cups-browsed for remote queues. Circular dependency? The current cups*.conf look overly complex to me too: they don't need to specify 'filesystem' at all as they already get that from 'started avahi-daemon'.
<tkamppeter> xnox, in which file do I set the debug loging mode of upstart? I did not find any hint about a central config file for it.
<jodh> tkamppeter: add '--debug' to the kernel command line to enable it for the whole boot.
<xnox> tkamppeter: just boot with --debug or --verbose kernel cmd line arg.
<tkamppeter> jodh, in Upstart terms cups-browsed needs CUPS running. CUPS works without cups-browsed (but then does not have remote queues).
<jodh> tkamppeter: so, which do you want to start first?
<tkamppeter> xnox, jodh, which are the relevant log files?
<jodh> tkamppeter: for --debug, dmesg/syslog output.
<tkamppeter> jodh, cups-browsed should be started after cups.
<jodh> tkamppeter: so, is there a reason cups-browsed cannot specify 'start on started cups'?
<tkamppeter> jodh, there was "(started cups or runlevel [2345])" before and I replaced it by "started cups" but this did not solve the problem.
<jodh> tkamppeter: why do you need the 'or runlevel' in cups.conf for the start on at all? If cups-browsed needs cups to be running, the condition should be simply 'start on started cups'. If this doesn't work, there is a problem with cups not being "ready" when it starts. But that is a problem for the cups job to solve.
<jodh> tkamppeter: ...and indeed looking at cups.conf shows some sort of hack to "wait" for the daemon to be ready. Maybe that hack is incorrect?
<pitti> jodh, tkamppeter: NB that cups.init does wait for cups to be really ready
<jodh> tkamppeter: by having *both* cups.conf and cups-browsed.conf specify 'or runlevel', a race is introduced.
<jodh> tkamppeter: if cups-browsed specifies 'start on started cups', what problem do you see?
<tkamppeter> pitti, jodh, xnox, someone of you know for what the "or runlevel ..." in the scripts for cups and cups-browsed are good for?
<tkamppeter> jodh, with "or runlevel ..." removed in the cups-browsed scriptthen I have the same problem.
<pitti> tkamppeter: no, I don't
<xnox> tkamppeter: server-like installations where there is no dbus available for example? but in that case the pre-start script should check it's events, check if it's starting on runlevel and then it should bail out if dbus is not running yet.
<xnox> (first it's should be its)
<tkamppeter> xnox, then I assume that "or runlevel ..." in cups-browsed is wrong, as cups-browsed without cups does not make sense.
<tkamppeter> xnox, but I already tested cups-browsed without "or runlevel ..." and it still shows the problem.
<xnox> tkamppeter: your conclusion is logically correct.
<xnox> tkamppeter: how does one check that avahi is really there?
<tkamppeter> xnox, I booted with --debug, which logfiles I have to look into now?
<xnox> tkamppeter: something with loads of upstart / init events logs. I think it's /var/log/boot/log or syslog or dmesg can't remember.
<tkamppeter> xnox, in cups-browsed I have done "start on started avahi-daemon". Is this not correct?
<xnox> tkamppeter: so "started avahi-daemon" will be emitted as soon as avahi-daemon forks twice, but by that time it might not yet be ready and doesn't provide "ambient networking services".
<xnox> that is, it did start but it ain't ready yet.
<jodh> xnox: dbus is installed on the server now I thought?
<xnox> tkamppeter:  thus see my recommendation about add a post-start script that waits & checks avahi to be _really_ there e.g. return a default lookup or something like that. You can test with:
<xnox> post-start script
<xnox>     sleep 10
<xnox> end script
<xnox> in the /etc/init/avahi-daemon.conf (or put that into avahi-daemon.override to keep .conf pristine)
<xnox> that way we know if avahi is the culprit here (double forking before being ready to provide remote printers)
<tkamppeter> xnox, I am trying now ...
<xnox> jodh: `seeded-in-ubuntu dbus` does tell me it's available everywhere.
<xnox> jodh: but dbus is not in ubuntu-core so one can have a working & fully functional system without dbus http://cdimages.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-core/daily/current/raring-core-amd64.manifest
<jodh> xnox: ok, that prolly explains the 'or runlevel' in dbus.conf, but not in dbus-browsed.conf.
<xnox> jodh: s/dbus/cups/
<jodh> xnox: right :
 * jodh thinks we should put more comments into such jobs to aid understanding.
<tkamppeter> xnox, jodh, pitti, I booted twice now with the "sleep 10" in the post-start of avahi-daemon, and once I got really all queues, a second time I got five queues, before I got between 0 and 3 queues.
<tkamppeter> xnox, jodh, pitti, so this gives a slight improvement.
<pitti> tkamppeter: well, what does cups-browsed expect from avahi?
<pitti> tkamppeter: you can't assume that avahi knows about all broadcast printers right after it started
<jodh> and surely devices on the network will come and go anyway?
<pitti> tkamppeter: if they send info about themselves after 30 seconds or so, then cups-browsed just has to listen to new printers popping up?
<pitti> that too
<tkamppeter> pitti, cups-browsed is listening all the time. If I create a new printer on the remote server, cups-browsed picks it up immediately.
<pitti> hm, no idea then :(
<seb128> pitti, fÃ©licitation pour ton premier commit Ã  unity ;-)
<tkamppeter> pitti, if I restart cups on the remote server, all queues appear immediately on my Raring laptop.
<pitti> seb128: merci beaucoup !
<pitti> seb128: actually, my name is in the debian changelog several times, but that was from the old days where we still actually did uploads :)
<seb128> hehe
<seb128> yeah, first "autocommit/landing" ;-)
<pitti> tkamppeter: so perhaps that means that printers don't re-announce themselves often enough? I don't know for sure how that protocol works
<pitti> seb128: oui
<pitti> thanks to Trevinho for his fast an thorough review
<pitti> I must say, this is quite a nice experience
<pitti> (with merge proposals, fast reviews, automatic tests, etc.)
<Trevinho> pitti: thanks :)
<tkamppeter> pitti, do you know who is the avahi expert here?
<pitti> tkamppeter: I don't think we have a real "expert" in the Ubuntu community; Sjoerd Simons might have an idea
<tkamppeter> pitti, how can I contact Sjoerd Simons?
<Laney> try #debian-gnome on irc.oftc.net
<pitti> yes, he (sjoerd) is online on oftc
<pitti> tkamppeter: sjoerd is also here on freenode, might be easier
<Laney> ah, seems so
<tkamppeter> pitti, in which channel(s)
<pitti> tkamppeter: /whois sjoerd doesn't say; just /query him?
<mterry> kenvandine, disabling tests to fix ftbfs! tsk tsk (qml-friends)
<kenvandine> mterry, just the one... not because it fails because of a race in starting the tests
<kenvandine> i am working on fixing it right now :)
<jodh> pitti: is 'Bug' the only apport ProblemType that will have ui set in add_info() and hence is the only interactive ProblemType?
<pitti> jodh: no, that shouldn't make a difference
<pitti> jodh: however, it is higly discouraged to ask interactive questions for crashes
<pitti> up to the point where mpt and ev will come haunt you with big and painful devices if you do it
<jodh> pitti: so a hook should only ask interactive questions "if report.get('ProblemType', '') == 'Bug' and ui:" right?
<pitti> jodh: preferably, yes; I might even enforce that in the future by not passing ui
<pitti> i. e. ui == None for Type == Crash
<jodh> pitti: right, thanks.
<jodh> pitti: so, are all non-Bug ProblemType bugs private by default, or just crashes?
<pitti> just crashes
<jodh> pitti: hmm. so the 'ideal' hook would only prompt for 'Bug' and if ui is set, should maybe auto-attach files if ProblemType == 'Crash', but what about attaching files containing potentially sensitive info for the other ProblemTypes? Are there any recommendations written down or a skeleton hook to cover all these scenarios maybe?
<mpt> pitti, "I might even..." = fixing bug 1084979?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1084979 in apport (Ubuntu) "Submitting error report asks confounding questions" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1084979
<mpt> I don't mind asking questions, pre-release. :-)
<mpt> (and I guess 'Bug' == pre-release, right?)
<rickspencer3> hi Trevinho
<rickspencer3> sorry, I went to sleep last night ;)
<rickspencer3> Trevinho, I saw your email, but wasn't 100% certain what you wanted me to do
<pitti> mpt: well, you can submit bugs post-release too, but at least those are user triggered and don't pop up automatically
<rickspencer3> seb128, thanks for getting that UG bug fixed, sorry I commented on the wrong bug report
<seb128> rickspencer3, hey, no worry, sorry it took me so long to get back to it
<mpt> pitti, sure, I was thinking only of automatically triggered ones
<rickspencer3> didrocks, I'm trying to upgrade but apt-get update says the i386 ppa for experimental-prevalidation is not found ... should I assume that it's still building?
<seb128> rickspencer3, can you pastebin the exact error?
<rickspencer3> W: Failed to fetch https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-unity/+archive/experimental-prevalidation/dists/raring/main/binary-amd64/Packages  The requested URL returned error: 404 Not Found
<rickspencer3> seb128, ^
<seb128> rickspencer3, what do you have in your sources.list?
<GunnarHj> seb128: Prepared MP to fix bug 1157188.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1157188 in gnome-control-center (Ubuntu) "gnome-control-center crashed with SIGSEGV in g_str_hash()" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1157188
<seb128> GunnarHj, I will have a look, thanks
<seb128> rickspencer3, seems to me that you have a ~ in front of "ubuntu-unity" that you shouldn't have
<seb128> rickspencer3, the correct source should be "deb http://ppa.launchpad.net/ubuntu-unity/experimental-prevalidation/ubuntu raring main"
<rickspencer3> hey seb128
<rickspencer3> ok, checking
<rickspencer3> seb128, fwiw, it was working fine for days
<seb128> rickspencer3, ok, weird, maybe a network issue then? (works fine for me, but I'm on i386 and not amd64)
<rickspencer3> seb128, I'm on i386 as well
<rickspencer3> seb128, does this look right?
<rickspencer3> https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-unity/+archive/experimental-prevalidation
<seb128> rickspencer3, the error you copied says "raring/main/binary-amd64/Packages  The requested URL returned error: 404 Not Found"
<rickspencer3> oops
<seb128> rickspencer3, notice the amd64
<rickspencer3> lol
<rickspencer3> Err https://launchpad.net raring/main i386 Packages
<rickspencer3>   The requested URL returned error: 404 Not Found
 * seb128 is really confused
<rickspencer3> W: Failed to fetch https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-unity/+archive/experimental-prevalidation/dists/raring/main/binary-i386/Packages  The requested URL returned error: 404 Not Found
<rickspencer3> seb128, my bad, I pasted the wrong error
<seb128> rickspencer3, does browsing http://ppa.launchpad.net/ubuntu-unity/experimental-prevalidation/ubuntu/dists/raring/main/binary-i386/Packages works for you?
<rickspencer3> seb128, yeah
<seb128> rickspencer3, can you "grep prevalidation /etc/apt/* -r" and copy that?
<rickspencer3> seb128, http://paste.ubuntu.com/5634180/
<seb128> rickspencer3, seems like you have the entry duplicates, a buggy version in your /etc/apt/sources.list and the correct in /etc/apt/sources.list.d/ubuntu-unity-experimental-prevalidation-raring.lis
<seb128> rickspencer3, delete the sources.list one (it has a ~ and lacks "/ubuntu" after the "prevalidation")
<seb128> rickspencer3, not sure how/when you got the buggy one, but you still have a correct one next to it so that's why it works
<rickspencer3> seb128, gotcha
<seb128> maybe you had the W: before and just didn't notice ;-)
<rickspencer3> seb128, who knows
<rickspencer3> I probably just mistyped it last week or something
 * rickspencer3 shrugs
<rickspencer3> thanks seb128
<seb128> yw ;-)
 * rickspencer3 dist-upgrades
<kenvandine> mterry, test fixed and uploaded :)
<mterry> kenvandine, awesome.  So all three qt packages don't seem to run tests, despite having them.  Do you know what the story is there?
<kenvandine> i don't
<kenvandine> but i am checking
<kenvandine> the other bug you mentioned for qtdeclarative5 has been fixed in the bzr branch of the packaging
<kenvandine> but never uploaded
<kenvandine> i am testing that now
<didrocks> rickspencer3: sorry, was doing some exercice, is everything all right now?
<rickspencer3> didrocks, all is well
<rickspencer3> I was being a dope
<rickspencer3> and seb128 helped me out :)
<didrocks> don't be so hard on yourself :)
<rickspencer3> didrocks, the dash is working well for me
<rickspencer3> jono said he was getting weird resets, though
<didrocks> rickspencer3: resets?
<rickspencer3> other than that, I hear there is some slowness here and then, but generally seems to be in good shape
<rickspencer3> didrocks, yeah, unity was just restarting for him yesterday
<rickspencer3> I suspect a configuration problem, personally
<didrocks> rickspencer3: oh, right a crash, let's see once he's online if he got a backtrace
<rickspencer3> but, what do I know?
<didrocks> rickspencer3: well, can be machine/racy thing
<didrocks> didn't get a crash
<didrocks> but let's see
<didrocks> rickspencer3: still some missing feature, will be tight to get it on time though. Let's see how it goes
<rickspencer3> didrocks, how come I'm not getting wikipedia results today?
<rickspencer3> I loved those
<rickspencer3> :)
<rickspencer3> I just seem to be getting apps, files/folder, and music
<rickspencer3> oh, there they are!
<rickspencer3> had to scroll down
<rickspencer3> and they took a while to come in
<didrocks> rickspencer3: yeah, I think the server is slow to answer
<rickspencer3> wow, there is actually a good reason to for me to use full screen mode now!
<didrocks> as they are the ones telling "starts those scopes"
<didrocks> ahah :)
<didrocks> rickspencer3: also, for testing, as we don't have recommendations yet
<didrocks> rickspencer3: we recommends all scopes
<didrocks> so ~30 python process starting the first time
<rickspencer3> uh
<didrocks> you can see what happens :)
<rickspencer3> full screen button seems to be gone?
<didrocks> rickspencer3: top left corner?
<didrocks> maximize?
<rickspencer3> didrocks, ah, there it is
<rickspencer3> nice
<jcastro> yeah I noticed that just now too didrocks
<jcastro> it does disappear sometimes
<jcastro> but I can't figure out why/how
<jcastro> and then it's there
<didrocks> jcastro: the maximize button?
<jcastro> all three buttons
<jcastro> sometimes all three just don't show up
<didrocks> interesting
<rickspencer3> didrocks, so, apps, files/folders, and music run without waiting for the server?
<didrocks> rickspencer3: yeah, they are "default scopes"
<rickspencer3> ok
<didrocks> the default ones are always giving results
<rickspencer3> good to know
<didrocks> (photos as well)
<didrocks> and soon the social one I guess
<rickspencer3> I told #ubuntu-news I'd give them a couple of paragraphs about the new dash :)
<tkamppeter> xnox, jodh, pitti, I have found the cause of the problem. There was a bug in cups-browsed. I will upload cups-filters 1.0.31 with the fix soon, but I discovered another problem: Upstart does not shut down cups-browsed cleanly. If you correctly shut it down with Ctrl+C or signal 15 all local queues are removed, but on an actual system shutdown this does not take place, either it gets shut down by "kill -9" or between the signal and the
<tkamppeter>  complete halt of the system there is not enough time to remove the queues. What should I do then.
<rickspencer3> didrocks, I don't seem to be getting photos
<rickspencer3> anything I can do to test that before logging a bug?
<rickspencer3> oops, call
<rickspencer3> bbl
<didrocks> rickspencer3: hum, updated to latest I guess, did you apt-get install --fix-policy?
<rickspencer3> didrocks, I did not run that
<rickspencer3> can I go ahead and do it now, even though I already dist-upgraded today?
<didrocks> rickspencer3: yeah, tell me what you see
<didrocks> rickspencer3: basically, it's ensuring all the recommends are installed as expected
<didrocks> so back to "distro default" in terms of recommends
<rickspencer3> didrocks, ok, it has some scopes it wants me to install
<rickspencer3> and some qt4 stuff
<rickspencer3> I can go ahead and run it after this call if you think it will help
<didrocks> rickspencer3: yep :)
<didrocks> rickspencer3: then logout/login
<rickspencer3> didrocks, ok, will do later
<didrocks> rickspencer3: keep me posted :)
 * rickspencer3 wonders why he is getting qt4 goo?
<didrocks> rickspencer3: because of the ubuntu one app?
<didrocks> maybe you uninstalled in the past some of the qt4 recommends
<rickspencer3> didrocks, yeah, I think I needed to to make the sdk work
<cyphermox> Laney: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/evolution-data-server/+bug/1158354
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1158354 in evolution-data-server "[SRU] [MRE] evolution-data-server 3.6.4" [Undecided,New]
<Laney> cyphermox: nice - and evo itself I presume?
<cyphermox> Laney: I'll file a separate bug for it
 * Laney nod
<jodh> tkamppeter: Upstart will send SIGTERM (15) to cups-browsed when it should be stopped. However, if it doesn't react in time (default 5 seconds), Upstart will send SIGKILL (9). You can change this behaviour using 'kill signal' and 'kill timeout'. See init(5) for details.
<tkamppeter> jodh, for me it is strange that cups-browsed takes more than 5 sec to shut down. If I start it on the command line and press Ctrl+C it takes less than 1 sec to remove all queues and exit.
<jodh> tkamppeter: maybe strace it?
<tkamppeter> jodh, is it possible that it does not get sent a signal to shut down and so it keeps running until the kernel kills itself and returns to the BIOS?
<jodh> tkamppeter: no.
<tkamppeter> jodh, assuming cups-browsed needs 1 sec to shut down. Is it possible that it gets the signal only 0.5 sec before the system shuts down and so cups-browsed's shut down stays incomplete (some queues not removed)?
<jodh> tkamppeter: why don't you change cups-browsed.conf's 'stop on' to 'stop on foo' or something and then 'initctl emit foo' and see how long it takes to stop.
<tkamppeter> jodh, tried this, less than a sec.
<rickspencer3> Trevinho, around?
<Trevinho> rickspencer3: yep
<rickspencer3> so I installed your ppa last night
<rickspencer3> I just dist-upgraded, but it didn't ask if I wanted to install a new unity
<Trevinho> rickspencer3: yes, I sent you a mail about it
<jodh> tkamppeter: in which case, try putting a sleep in /etc/init.d/sendsigs to rule out any interaction between the SysV side of the world.
<rickspencer3> Trevinho, well, I didn't grock what you wanted me to do
<Trevinho> rickspencer3: it's because I didn't include the ubuntu version on the package.. :(
<Trevinho> rickspencer3: so, you can download manually the packages or just wait for the new ppa rebuild
<rickspencer3> Trevinho, yeah, but I thought you said you fixed that and it rebuilt last night
<rickspencer3> ah, still rebuilding
<rickspencer3> gotcha :)
<Trevinho> rickspencer3: no, unfortunately I've not the right to force a rebuild :(
<Trevinho> rickspencer3: however it's unlikely to fix your problem, since I see it was introduced before... However I've talked with nic-doffay who was the last touching that code, and he's looking at it right now
<rickspencer3> Trevinho, ok, I'll just uninstall the ppa and wait for an update
<Trevinho> rickspencer3: fine..
<rickspencer3> just let me know if you want me to teset something
<Trevinho> rickspencer3: sure
<cyphermox> Laney: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/evolution/+bug/1158367
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1158367 in evolution "[SRU] [MRE] evolution 3.6.4" [Undecided,New]
<Laney> w00t
<kenvandine> mterry, it's silly that the tests in qtdeclarative5 are disabled... enabling them they still don't run :)
<tkamppeter> jodh, adding sleep 10 to the beginning of do_stop() in /etc/init.d/sendsigs and rebooting still shows the problem. So it looks like that /etc/init.d/sendsigs is most probably not the culprint.
<rickspencer3> hey didrocks
<didrocks> hey rickspencer3
<rickspencer3> is there a way I can verify that all the default lenses are working?
<didrocks> rickspencer3: going in every master scope
<didrocks> and make a search in them
<rickspencer3> didrocks, ok
<rickspencer3> I bet I am confused
<rickspencer3> didrocks, so if I search for Screen in the home lens
<rickspencer3> I see all the Screenshots*.pngs in files and folders
<rickspencer3> is there supposed to be a photo category there too?
<didrocks> only if you have photos with "screen" on it
<didrocks> but really, you should look at the master scopes you have
<didrocks> what was called "lens" before
<rickspencer3> didrocks, there is a Photo scope
<rickspencer3> but when I click on it is empty
<didrocks> you mean, a photo icon at the button?
<davidcalle> rickspencer3, I can answer that: Photos currently merges : Shotwell, Flickr, Facebook, Picasa.
<rickspencer3> and if I search for Screen, it's empty
<rickspencer3> davidcalle, oh
<didrocks> rickspencer3: but you don't see your local content?
<rickspencer3> so I don't think I have any of those configured ;)
<didrocks> like, do you have photos with "screen" in it?
<rickspencer3> didrocks, I do not have local contents in Shotwell
<jodh> tkamppeter: I would recommend again using strace to see what the daemon is doing. Upstart will send the SIGTERM.
<jodh> tkamppeter: ... to the daemons effectively immediately.
<rickspencer3> didrocks, yes, I have many photos in my Pictures dir that start with "Screenshot"
<didrocks> rickspencer3: it's still looking in ~/Images/ IIRC
<didrocks> right davidcalle ? ^
<didrocks> as in the previous releases
<didrocks> (at least, here it does, but not sure it's because shotwell imported them)
<davidcalle> didrocks, it never has.
<desrt> sarnold: reviewed your review :)
<didrocks> ok, so shotwell was doing the trick for me :)
<rickspencer3> didrocks, davidcalle as I say, the photos show up in Files and Folders
<rickspencer3> so it seems to be working properly
<didrocks> rickspencer3: well, expected (but another source of search, you should have both once shotwell is configured)
<desrt> sarnold: some issues you find are just because systemd has to deal with some rather ridiculous aspects of the kernel.... others are on their way to being fixed upstream... and others aren't really serious imho
<rickspencer3> davidcalle, if I configure gwibber to use facebook, I should see fb pics?
<didrocks> rickspencer3: the social lens is not fully ready yet
<davidcalle> rickspencer3, in Online Accounts, yes.
<rickspencer3> ok
<rickspencer3> sadly ... online accounts does not seem to be working for me, at least for facebook :/
<rickspencer3> seb128, kenvandine Online accounts is not letting me configure facebook
<rickspencer3> shall a log a bug?
<seb128> sure
<seb128> what is it doing exactly?
<rickspencer3> seb128, nothing
<seb128> rickspencer3, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-control-center-signon/+filebug
<rickspencer3> it just says "Please authorize Ubuntu to access your Facebook account"
<rickspencer3> but nothing appears in the dialog
<seb128> I can confirm there
<seb128> *here
<rickspencer3> ok
<rickspencer3> ubuntu-bugging
<seb128> "OAuth parameters missing!"
<seb128> hum
<kenvandine> oh
<kenvandine> i uploaded a fix for that this morning
<jpds> I can add a Facebook account, as of the latest updates.
<rickspencer3> this suggests our testing in this area is not quite up to snuff :/
<kenvandine> seb128, rickspencer3: ^^
<jpds> kenvandine: And look, there's a LinkedIn plugin. :P
<kenvandine> jpds, indeed
<rickspencer3> kenvandine, ack
<rickspencer3> I'll pick up the update tomorrow
<seb128> kenvandine, what package? I updated after lunch
 * rickspencer3 cancels bug report
<kenvandine> gnome-control-center-signon
<jpds> seb128: I just saw 0.1.4-0ubuntu1 come in.
<kenvandine> a mix of the version of account-plugins that was uploaded
<kenvandine> and g-c-c-s
<chrisccoulson> awesome, i've just had a 512GB SSD arrive :)
<seb128> is there any way you can avoid those version mismatch?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, do you have the laptop to put it in? ;-)
<kenvandine> seb128, well testing on a  non mix of -proposed :)
<Laney> chrisccoulson: huge!
<seb128> kenvandine, hum, I'm not using proposed afaik
<Laney> how much was that?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, not yet ;)
<kenvandine> seb128, another case of -proposed not being a perfect solution
<seb128> rickspencer3, the update is available and fixes the issue, no need to restart anything but gnome-control-center
<Laney> you can ask for manual blocks
<chrisccoulson> Laney, it was Â£365
<Laney> wasn't the issue that it doesn't consider recommends?
<seb128> rickspencer3, you can just fire up your update-manager ;-)
<Laney> it -> proposed-migration
<seb128> kenvandine, right...
<kenvandine> seb128, right, but the version of account-plugins that was in raring still worked with the version of g-c-c-s that i uploaded the other day
<kenvandine> but when the updated version in -proposed got moved to raring
<didrocks> kenvandine: seb128: daily release would help avoiding that, just saying :)
<kenvandine> it didn't work with the new g-c-c-s
<didrocks> to have the version in sync :p
<kenvandine> didrocks, yes... yes...
<kenvandine> the fix was already in g-c-c-s trunk waiting to be uploaded
<seb128> didrocks, +1
<kenvandine> we're getting there
<Laney> hum
<sil2100> cyphermox: re-ping!
<Laney> if I go into yahoo in online-accounts-preferences I get a blank window with "Cancel" and "Done", then clicking cancel segfaults it :-)
<Laney> gnome-control-center crashed with SIGSEGV in empathy_account_widget_discard_pending_changes()
<cyphermox> nice!
<seb128> Laney, that bug is assigned to kenvandine for over a month
<seb128> 1120651
<seb128> kenvandine, ^ did you ever look at it?
<kenvandine> seb128, i guess not
<kenvandine> i'll look at it today
<seb128> kenvandine, thanks
<sarnold> desrt: glad to hear some aren't serious, some are underway, and some are due to kernel sillyness :) I did base my settimeofday(2) qualms entirely on the contents of the manpages...
<kenvandine> Laney, i can't reproduce that right now... do you have the updates from today?
<Laney> yes, it was immediately after doing them
<kenvandine> so, so try adding yahoo then cancel
<Laney> right
<kenvandine> oh... you said a blank window
<Laney> I get no content in the widget where webkit should be
<kenvandine> what version of gnome-control-center-signon?
<Laney> or whatever it is
<Laney> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-control-center/+bug/1158384
<ubot2> Laney: Error: launchpad bug 1158384 not found
<Laney> oops
<Laney> (that will be the bug if/when it get retraced) I meant to paste
<Laney>   Installed: 0.1.4-0ubuntu1
<desrt> sarnold: TL;DR: RTC in non-UTC is fucked up for more reasons than any of us care to imagine and yet we have to continue to try to support it...
<desrt> sigh.
<kenvandine> the bug that kept that from loading was fixed in 0.1.4...
<Laney> maybe I have to restart something?
<kenvandine> shouldn't
<kenvandine> unless maybe signon-ui is still running
<kenvandine> kill everything with signon in the name
<kenvandine> and start g-c-c again
<Laney> laney@iota> pgrep signon-ui                                                                                                                ~
<Laney> 3019
<sarnold> desrt: does windows still expect RTC to be "local time" and update it at daylight savings time changes and all that nonsense?
<desrt> sarnold: yup :(
<sarnold> idiots.
<desrt> and FAT filesystem still stores timestamps in localtime
<Laney> kenvandine: still no good, sorry :/
<kenvandine> humm
<sarnold> desrt: wow.
<desrt> just think about what that means for running 'make' near DST transitions...
<kenvandine> Laney, do other providers work?
<desrt> "oh.  this file that was last rebuilt half an hour ago doesn't need to be rebuilt because it was rebuilt half an hour into the future..."
<Laney> let me try to add one
<sarnold> desrt: haha
<Laney> I get a login screen for Facebook
<desrt> and the kernel actually tries to _deal_ with this
<desrt> mindblowing
<desrt> anyway... it's currently totally bogus because userspace needs to update the kernel on DST transitions
<sarnold> definitely. I might have expected XP or Vista to change to UTC like any sane person would have...
<desrt> since the kernel only knows the UTC->local minute offset
<desrt> and userspace does not currently do that
<desrt> systemd plans to start doing that at some point....
 * desrt isn't sure anyone should care about such stupidity
<sarnold> desrt: I thought userspace was in charge in setting the hwclock on shutdown?
<desrt> sarnold: hahah...
<desrt> the kernel sets the hwclock itself
<desrt> under weird situations
<desrt> like if it detects that NTP is enabled
<sarnold> gah.
<seb128> kenvandine, @empathy: thanks
<sarnold> gah*2
<desrt> plus... the kernel needs to sample RTC itself and reset the system clock under some situations
<seb128> kenvandine, or maybe ping xclaesse about it to see if has an idea, seems to be in the empathy uoa side
<desrt> like resuming from suspend...
<desrt> can't really expect userspace to deal with that
<desrt> (although the more i think about it, maybe for the non-UTC case, we should)
<desrt> there's so much history of bad approaches to dealing with this that we need to remain back-compatable with, though :(
<sarnold> desrt: so, the "sealing" the kernel's idea of local-rtc-offset-from rtc.... how on earth does that work? are all the 'sealing' comments in the code (and manpages) incorrect? or ...
<desrt> sarnold: the 'sealing' refers to the fact the settimeofday() has different semantics the first time it is called from future times
<desrt> and by 'first' time i mean.... really really first
<desrt> not per-process, but per-system-boot
<kenvandine> seb128, what makes you think it is empathy?
<desrt> if you specify a timezone during this first call then the system time is warped
<sarnold> desrt: yeah -- that's what has me surprised, because it appears to be called in the "sealing" mode over and over again in that code, but .. it's been sealed. right?
<desrt> sarnold: i only saw it called once....
<seb128> kenvandine, the function name in the title :p
<kenvandine> well i think we have 2 bugs here :)
<desrt> sarnold: from main() during the setup...
<kenvandine> right now i am trying to figure out why the yahoo login doesn't load for Laney
<sarnold> desrt: hrm. I _thought_ I saw them being called multiple times. I'd have to have gotten that wrong...
<Laney> so, other accounts
<desrt> sarnold: except in the case the the RTC is in UTC
<desrt> then it gets called twice
<desrt> first time with a NULL timezone to disable the warp
<Laney> I can add a Facebook account and authorise it seemingly fine but Empathy never connects it
<desrt> then again with a non-NULL timezone to setup the system time
<Laney> it tells me it requires reauthorisation but the account manager disagrees
<kenvandine> Laney, how about windows live?
<Laney> I see this in the terminal: (gnome-control-center:30668): credentials-cc-panel-CRITICAL **: cc_credentials_account_application_switch_on_app_account_enabled: assertion `service != NULL' failed
<kenvandine> just see if it loads the screen
<Laney> that one works
<desrt> sarnold: the 'sealing' function is the reset_timezone() one
<desrt> there is exactly one call to it, from main()
<desrt> timedated calls hwclock_set_time() again, but it ought to
<desrt> hwclock_set_timezone() rather
<Laney> Salut and identi.ca also made it crash
<kenvandine> all of those work for me...
<Laney> oh no, not ideanti.ca
<Laney> that just prints a critical: (gnome-control-center:32650): account-plugin-CRITICAL **: ap_plugin_emit_finished: assertion `AP_IS_PLUGIN (self)' failed
<kenvandine> identi.ca is slow to load
<seb128> Laney, I get the service != NULL warnings as well
<seb128> but no segfault
<rickspencer3> popey, I got your "tooltips show over dash" bug just now
<rickspencer3> if you have a link I can "me too" it
<popey> ok
<Laney> hmm, if I "Cancel" on any of them while it's still loading it segfaults actually
<popey> https://launchpad.net/bugs/1158021
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1158021 in unity "Launcher tooltips don't disappear when dash is open" [Low,In progress]
<Laney> so click Flickr and immediately cancel â segfault
<popey> rickspencer3: ^
<kenvandine> Laney, can you get a stacktrace?
<Laney> yep, probs
<seb128> GLib-GObject-WARNING **: invalid uninstantiatable type `<invalid>' in cast to `ApOAuthPlugin'
<seb128> segfault
<seb128> I can confirm that
<kenvandine> ok, i got that too
<kenvandine> have to click cancel fast
<sarnold> desrt: woo. I had conflated the _time warping_ with the _set the timezone_. The timezone is maleable, the _warping_ is one-shot, and it all works out correctly in the end? :)
<kenvandine> so different bug
<desrt> yes
<kenvandine> i wonder why apport isn't firing for that
<sarnold> desrt: thank you. :)
<seb128> kenvandine, it does here
<kenvandine> great... file it :)
<desrt> systemd calls settimeofday() in main so early specifically in order to ensure that future calls to settimeofday() have no warping effects
<kenvandine> oh, i have an old crash report in /var/crash
 * kenvandine cleans up
<Laney> the first bug seems to be the ones that have both Cancel and Done buttons
<desrt> when we set the timezone again to something else, we still need to update the kernel about that change for various stupid reasons like FAT....
<desrt> it's confusing that this is handled in a file called hwclock
<sarnold> desrt: yes :)
<desrt> because it actually has nothing to do with the hwclock :(
<kenvandine> An error occurred while attempting to process this problem report:
<Laney> I'm filing that one too
<seb128> Laney, kenvandine: I've the filing it's going to be a dup of https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-control-center/+bug/1157559
<ubot2> seb128: Error: launchpad bug 1157559 not found
<Laney> ah, cool
<Laney> are the retracers working to get these?
<sarnold> desrt: thanks for the detailed comments and explanations. much appreciated. :)
<seb128> Laney, the one I pointed is retraced with some dups
<Laney> the first one had a failed retrace
<kenvandine> ok... amigadave is already working on that bug
<Laney> and the dup too
<ogra_> desrt, on ubuntu ?
<Laney> so it would be good if 1158384 could get retraced
<kenvandine> bug 1122520
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1122520 in Online Accounts: GNOME Control Center "gnome-control-center crashed with SIGSEGV in finish_with_cleanup()" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1122520
<seb128> Laney, kenvandine: hey, dup of https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-control-center/+bug/1157559
<desrt> ogra_: hm?
<ubot2> seb128: Error: launchpad bug 1157559 not found
<ogra_> desrt, wheer do you find a file called hwclock ? there is only one authoritative setting in an ubuntu/debian system thats /etc/timezone (and requires some debconf magic after changes)
<desrt> ogra_: we're discussing the MIR of systemd
<desrt> which has a source file called hwclock.c
<ogra_> ah
<ogra_> heh
<ogra_> not that we would use that :)
<desrt> well, we are using that
<ogra_> ugh, really ?
<desrt> which is what why we are discussing it
<seb128> Laney, kenvandine: set public and reassigned to gnome-control-center-signon
<desrt> yes...
<ogra_> in what context ?
<ogra_> logind ?
<desrt> we're switching to systemd to manage the system time
<seb128> ogra_, systemd-services, replacing our python ubuntu-system-services
<ogra_> err
<desrt> both for setting the timezone and the time itself
<desrt> which involves setting the hardware clock
<seb128> ogra_, those are small dbus actived C services
<ogra_> that will be fun to get right with debconf then
<seb128> ogra_, ?
<seb128> ogra_, there is no debconf in there
<Laney> seb128: thanks
<seb128> ogra_, it's not a packaging thing
<Laney> retracing failed on mine because I have logind ppa packages installed
<seb128> Laney, well, the bug I pointed has a debug/working retracing
<ogra_> seb128, the timezone is stored in debconf (and written/read from/to /etc/timezone)
<desrt> ogra_: timezone is not stored in debconf
<seb128> ogra_, ubuntu-system-services doesn't do anything with debconf, nor does the custom gnome-settings-daemon helper we use atm
<desrt> the authorative source for what is the timezone is what's in/pointed-to-by /etc/localtime
<ogra_> hmm, did that change ?
<Laney> it has a different top frame to mine though
<desrt> Debian says 'in', systemd says 'pointed-to-by'
<seb128> Laney, what's yours?
<desrt> doesn't really matter either way
<seb128> Laney, can you pastebin?
<Laney> just from the bug title
<desrt> everything just open('/etc/localtime') and reads...
<Laney> I can't get dbgsyms here because of the PPA
<seb128> Laney, the non retraced was https://launchpadlibrarian.net/134695584/Stacktrace.txt
<Laney> mine was gnome-control-center crashed with SIGSEGV in empathy_account_widget_discard_pending_changes()
<ogra_> desrt, well, as long as /etc/timezone stays autoritative i dont care
<seb128> Laney, so title should say in g_simple_async_result_complete ()
<desrt> ogra_: /etc/timezone is not authorative
<ogra_> it is for the system TZ
<desrt> it isn't and never has been
<seb128> Laney, hey, that one is 1120651
<desrt> everything on the entire system goes by what's in /etc/localtime
<Laney> yeah, with the failed retrace
<seb128> Laney, sorry we are mixing several issues there
<Laney> we are ;-)
<ogra_> desrt, well, since i started using debian it was ... when did it change ?
<kenvandine> yeah, those are separate bugs
<desrt> ogra_: i'm not sure what specifies /etc/localtime... but i think it's POSIX
<desrt> and i've never known it to be any different
<desrt> ogra_: 'strace date'
<desrt> or any other program that does anything with time, really...
<sarnold> http://www.gnu.org/software/libc/manual/html_node/TZ-Variable.html
<desrt> i love this document :)
<desrt> this syntax particularly: EST+5EDT,M4.1.0/2,M10.5.0/2
<desrt> madness
 * desrt read a lot of this while writing GTimeZone
<seb128> kenvandine, Laney: of course error.ubuntu.com doesn't have a successful retracing either :-(
<seb128> Laney, can you locally apport-retrace it?
<Laney> i'm building a nostrip version of gcc-signon
<seb128> thanks
<ogra_> desrt, well, thats only half the thing :) http://wiki.debian.org/TimeZoneChanges
<kenvandine> i can't seem to trigger the SIGSEGV in empathy_account_widget_discard_pending_changes
<seb128> what are the steps supposed to trigger it?
<Laney> Try to add e.g. a Yahoo! account, see the content doesn't load, click cancel or done there
<desrt> ogra_: do you know why it changed in etch?
<desrt> this seems pretty silly
<desrt> in any case, timedated does not maintain this other file...
<ogra_> desrt, /etc/timezone defines the symlink , if it differs and some package tool runs dpkg-reconfigure it will be set wrongly ... you need to update /etc/timezone alongside any changes
<desrt> we should probably fix the packaging not to do that...
<ogra_> i guess then a bunch of server people woould show up at your doorstep :)
 * desrt guesses server people are not changing their timezone as often as people with laptops
<ogra_> you should fix your service to use dpkg-reconfigure tzdata and use debconf preseeding
<desrt> no way :)
<seb128> Laney, kenvandine: I get the yahoo's panel content here
<desrt> that's not a 'fix'
<ogra_> since the value stored in the debconf db is authoritative usually
<desrt> the entire point of systemd is to remove distro-specific backend hacks for this sort of simple stuff
<Laney> yeah so my bug must be that it doesn't load for some reason
<Laney> #0  empathy_account_widget_discard_pending_changes (self=0x0) at empathy-account-widget.c:2204 [Error: empathy-account-widget.c was not found in source tree]
<Laney> #1  0x00007fe1985c3086 in response_cb (widget=<optimized out>, response=<optimized out>, self=0x7fe1e4bcc3b0) at empathy-accounts-plugin-widget.c:160
<ogra_> and will be applied if you cann dpkg-reconfigure tzdata
<kenvandine> seb128, me too..
<ogra_> s/cann/call/
<Laney> let me try in the guest account
<desrt> ya... this is some sort of madness
<kenvandine> in wonder if empathy is getting in the way there
<kenvandine> like if mission-control knows about the yahoo account
<ogra_> well, it is established in debian vased systems since over a decade
<kenvandine> but UOA doesn't
<ogra_> *based
<desrt> if i change the timezone using the real authorative method that the entire world agrees on (ie: setting /etc/localtime) then a distro script sets it back to some other value, i'd say the bug is in the distro script
<Laney> it's broken there too
<ogra_> and it works reliably across all form actors ... servers, desktops, embedded etc
<desrt> unless i explicitly run that distro script, and then i'd say i guess i get what i ask for
<kenvandine> ok
<desrt> either way i don't see a problem
<kenvandine> i need to step out for lunch... bbiab
<seb128> kenvandine, enjoy!
<ogra_> desrt, well, you are ignoring (and overriding) distro defaults
<ogra_> seems pretty messy to me ...
<Laney> The second bug got retraced as https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-control-center/+bug/1158401
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1158401 in gnome-control-center "gnome-control-center crashed with SIGSEGV in identity_removed_reply()" [Medium,New]
<ogra_> desrt, i guess we should kjust switch to rpms then ...
<desrt> ogra_: because of the support for RPM built-in to glibc?
<ogra_> no, because the new technology completely ignores what makes up a debian based system ...
<ogra_> and debian policy etc
<Laney> I did some retracing on https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-control-center-signon/+bug/1158384
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1158384 in gnome-control-center-signon "gnome-control-center crashed with SIGSEGV in empathy_account_widget_discard_pending_changes()" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<Laney> hopefully it's complete enough
<mterry> davidcalle, heyo.  I'm doing some pre-MIR-reviews for the new scopes
<mterry> davidcalle, as I'm going, I may see trivial things like Descriptions that could use cleaning up.  Any objection  if I just push those through?
<davidcalle> mterry, no objection at all :)
<stgraber> is it a known issue that current unity with auto-hide leaves some screen corruption (grey bar) behind where the launchers were?
<stgraber> hmm, and compiz is using quite a lot of CPU too (often getting up to 50-60%)
<stgraber> oh, found part of the problem at least, compiz isn't using hardware acceleration...
<stgraber>  /dev/dri permissions are wrong... /me suspects udev/logind, let's try cleaning up that mess
 * didrocks waves good evening
 * ogra_ desnds and excusing hug to desrt .... i just learned that i was completely wrong for the last 10 years 
<ogra_> s/desnds and/sends an/
<achiang> cyphermox: hey, any progress on the nm-applet menu bug? never followed up after you had a reproducer
<cyphermox> achiang: I ran into issues with the reproducer, there's some timing involved because I can reproduce at much below 32k runs
<kenvandine> cyphermox, how's autopilot-qt looking?
<cyphermox> kenvandine: it landed this morning
<kenvandine> WOOT!
<kenvandine> i will do my best to carve out time tomorrow to use it :)
<cyphermox> cool :)
<cyphermox> we'll need a MIR for it too, I guess
<achiang> cyphermox: dang. well is your reproducer available somewhere? maybe i could take a look too
<cyphermox> achiang: sure, I'll just push that to some junk branch
<seb128> oh man, mterry will be so drunk at the next rally
<seb128> so many MIRs and beers going with those
 * achiang assumes mterry is just drunk all the time
<cyphermox> achiang: https://code.launchpad.net/~mathieu-tl/+junk/test-indicator-update/
<cyphermox> you can play with the timings in timeout_add(), and how many updates to run all in a batch and then slower, etc.
<achiang> cyphermox: thanks
<cyphermox> achiang: I hope it's understandable, don't hesitate to ask if you don't get what I'm trying to accomplish in that script :)
<mterry> achiang, seb128: I always do a MIR with a beer in hand
<olli> that makes me wonder what the mir team is doing
<cyphermox> mterry: I like your style
<desrt> sarnold: just got your review on systemd-shim
<desrt> sarnold: i wonder if you know that the code you were reviewing is already in main
<desrt> all i did was move it to a new package
<sarnold> desrt: ha!
<sarnold> desrt: oh man. :)
<desrt> particularly the ntp hacks....
<desrt> they're already running on your system right now as gsd-datetime-mechanism
<desrt> (as root, of course)
<sarnold> desrt: I figured part of it had to be conforming to an upstream api of some sort, but .. man.
<desrt> nope.  it's conforming to debianisms.
<sarnold> well, those parts are _also_ ugly :) but I think there ought to be a clean way to express it all.
<desrt> seb128: can i browse gnome-settings-daemon packaging online somewhere?
<sarnold> please don't get me wrong, the only thing I really disliked was mv -f ...
<desrt> ah... if i add "code." to the URL i find what i need :)
<sarnold> each individual bit is pretty decent. but the interaction of all those functions feels like a pain to follow and maintain.
<desrt> sarnold: ya.... i actually simplified it a bit
<desrt> it was worse before :)
<sarnold> desrt: man. someone owes you a lot of beers. :)
<desrt> i was trying not to change too much funcitonality tho
<desrt> it looks ... uh... a bit brittle :)
<sarnold> yeah, not breaking already deployed code is different from designing something from scratch
<desrt> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/raring/gnome-settings-daemon/raring/view/head:/debian/patches/revert_git_datetime_dropping.patch#L850
<desrt> here's the code we're shipping today
<desrt> but you're right... direct-invoking mv is just plain stupid
<sarnold> desrt: nice cleanup. :)
<desrt> aside: g_strconcat() doesn't fail
<desrt> i'll reply in the bug
<desrt> i can try to clean up the NTP code a bit more if you like
<sarnold> desrt: hrm, I figured anything that allocated memory could fail :) but you're right, in the uses there, it isn't checked, so no FALSE as a result.
<desrt> sarnold: if memory allocation fails in glib programs then the entire program aborts
<desrt> g_malloc() basically has assert(ret!=NULL);
<sarnold> wow :)
<desrt> and any function that allocates memory is going via g_malloc()
<desrt> ya.... it's a policy decision that makes glib unpopular with a lot of people :)
 * desrt personally likes it
<sarnold> there's a huge class of applciations that'd be vastly improved with such a policy :) but it feels a bit draconian for system services. hehe.
<desrt> checking the return value of malloc() doesn't buy you too much when you have a kernel policy of overcomitting on allocations and OOM-killing apps when it realises that it's out of space
<sarnold> desrt: I _would_ like those funcitons cleaned up a bit, but my original enthusiasm for breaking them apart is a bit blunted knowing that it's mimicing tested-and-deployed code that we've already got.
<sarnold> desrt: true, true.
<desrt> sarnold: ACK on your catch about not checking the return value of the virtualisation detection
<desrt> sarnold: also ACK on the NTP stuff being gross, but i think i'd rather leave it alone for now
<sarnold> desrt: excellent response on the bug, thanks :)
<rickspencer3> anyone here know about in dash payments?
<rickspencer3> dobey?
<rickspencer3> I'm wondering if it will be available for anything but music purchases when 13.04 comes out
<rickspencer3> olli, kgunnAFK, is there a list of scopes that will be installed by default that I can reference?
<olli> rickspencer3, 1 sec
<rickspencer3> thanks olli
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-03-22
<robru> cyphermox, ping
<achiang> ogra_: you left us all hanging before... what were you wrong about for 10 years? :)
<pitti> Good morning
<pitti> Laney: can we / do you plan to sync glib2.0 from exp?
<mhr3> mvo, ping?
<mvo> mhr3: pong
<mhr3> mvo, hey there, how are you doing? :)
<mvo> mhr3: good, thanks! well, was sick in the last 2 days, but much better now. but overall good, thanks :)
<mvo> mhr3: and you ?
<jibel> good morning
<mhr3> mvo, eh, freezes... so crazy times :)
<mhr3> mvo, anyway, we wanted to ask about sc, we'd want to show all scopes in apps lens, what's the best/easiest way to achieve that? :)
<mvo> mhr3: haha, of course!
<mvo> mhr3: so the data-provider would need to send you this? and all scopes means all packages that provide a lens/scope (do we use the term scope?).
<mhr3> mvo, yea, basically we'd want to have it the xapian index (ideally as tagged with a separate category)
<mhr3> have it in*
<mhr3> mvo, and there's no more lenses in 13.04, everything is a scope now :)
<mvo> mhr3: ok, how is it identified? is there something (name, category, tag, whatnot) to do this?
<mvo> mhr3: aha :)
<mhr3> mvo, that's what i thought you could tell us :)
<mhr3> we can add whatever to the pkgs
<mvo> mhr3: aha, cool, so you control it entirely? give me 2 minutes to look at the code etc to familiarize myself again
<mvo> jamesh: welcome
<mhr3> mvo, sure
<mvo> jamesh: <mvo> mhr3: aha, cool, so you control it entirely? give me 2 minutes to look at the code etc to familiarize myself again
<mvo> jamesh, mhr3: it seems like the easiest option is to simply re-use the existing software-center.menu.in category for "dash search plugins"
<mvo> that is currently using unity-lens-* as a pkgname filter
<mvo> if you simply ensure that the unity-scope-* matches all your scope you should be fine
<mhr3> mvo, does that mean it's also query-able (wow is that a word?) in the db?
<mvo> mhr3: you don't want to go through the db-provider?
<mhr3> mvo, plus i hope it wouldn't be a problem to do (unity-lens-* || unity-scope-*), cause i don't think we have time to do a bunch of renames now
<mvo> mhr3: its querable directly in the DB as well, its just a bit quirky because of xapian special handling for "-"
<mhr3> there's a db-provider? what's that? :)
<mhr3> if that's some python class that we can't use that, cause we don't have python in apps lens/scope
<mvo> mhr3: the data provider, for some reason I thought you guys would use that for the category stuff too, but I re-remember that you don#t,right?
<jamesh> Looks like it would be pretty simple to put both names in the section
<mvo> mhr3: the dbus thing
<mhr3> oh, iirc we use that just for previews
<mhr3> searches are done directly in the db
<mhr3> should be faster at least... we don't really have time to change that atm
<mvo> mhr3, jamesh: indeed, give me some more minuts to draft a sample python query thing
<mvo> I think the only quirk is that replace("-", "_") is needed as xapian handles the "-" speical (which is rather anoying)
<ogra_> achiang, that debconf is authoritative
<seb128> hey desktopers
<didrocks> salut seb128
<seb128> happy friday!
<seb128> lut didrocks
<seb128> ogra_, still talking about timezones?
<ogra_> seb128, only answering pings :)
<seb128> ogra_, we should undo that "debconf is authoritative"
<mvo> mhr3, jamesh: http://paste.ubuntu.com/5636330/ <- this should work if the scopes/lenses have desktop files you can leave line 4 commented otherwise you will have to query the a-x-i as well
<seb128> that doesn't seem right for a 21st century OS
<seb128> mvo, hey, alter! wie gehts?
<mvo> hey seb128
<pitti> bonjour seb128
<ogra_> seb128, no, we dont need to ... as i said above, i was wrong for the last ten years .... slangasek explained to me that debconf should always adapt to the existing system settings (and apparently not everyone knows that)
<jamesh> mvo: currently the scopes don't have .desktop files -- there are .scope files that are kind of like .desktop files but not quite
<pitti> mvo! wie gehts?
<mvo> seb128: not too bad, was a bit sick in the last 2 days, but much better now
<mvo> hey pitti!
<seb128> pitti, salut
<pitti> RAOF: upstart does dbus service activation now? I didn't know that
<mvo> jamesh: we could extend the deskotp file extractor to read/add them, that wouldn't be too hard I think
 * pitti vous donne beaucoup de accolades
<seb128> ogra_, oh ok (I don't have "above", I close my client at night ... will read the irclogs.u.c log ;-)
<jamesh> mvo: they are in keyfile format with Name and Description, so hopefully that isn't too difficult
<mvo> jamesh: https://code.launchpad.net/~mvo/archive-index/app-install-mvo/ <- this is doing the extraction magic
<ogra_> seb128, ah, i apologized to desrt ... and achiang asked what i was referring to :) (that caused my comment above)
<seb128> pitti, what do you mean by "upstart does dbus service activation"? isn't dbus doing dbus service activation?
 * jamesh looks
<seb128> ogra_, gotcha ;-)
<mvo> jamesh: I assume the scopes have a fixed dir they go into?
<jamesh> mvo: yes
<pitti> seb128: I asked because I saw RAOF's reply on https://plus.google.com/u/0/107564545827215425270/posts/2yoaggm8Yth
<pitti> but I don't want to make so much fuss on G+ about it
<pitti> seb128: kdbus won't :)
<ogra_> well, dbus is overrated, lets do IPC
<pitti> (not that this becomes relevant anytime soon, I was just wondering)
<ogra_> sokect and the like :)
<ogra_> *sockets
<Laney> pitti: glib> yes, I've got that on my list - will look today
<Laney> hoping we didn't sneak in any divergance
<pitti> ogra_: you young guys with fancy IPC mechanisms! exchange text files!
<ogra_> pitti, you mean apps ahould just use the talk protocol  ? yeah, good idea :)
<pitti> Laney: I had a quick look at the changelog, didn't look like it; but a debian/ debdiff review is certainly in order; thanks!
<mhr3> mvo, jamesh, afaict we're talking about patching apps scope to query one extra db + modifying the query vs just modifying the query *and* changing s-c component, i think #1 is much simpler
<mvo> mhr3: yeah, just the query is certainly easiest, please check out if that is suffient if not I'm happy to help with #2
<mhr3> jamesh, could you ^, i'm fixing some other things
<mhr3> jamesh, it's all in unity-lens-applications src/unity-package-search.cc
<jamesh> mhr3: okay
<mhr3> thx
<pitti> seb128: btw, could you please install ubuntu-desktop and thus libpam-xdg-support again? that should uninstall libpam-systemd
<pitti> seb128: and then verify that everything still works? I'm still running logind only while I'm busy with fixing the upstream world for the split
<chrisccoulson> good morning
<seb128> chrisccoulson, hey, how are you? happy friday
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, i'm not too bad thanks. how are you?
<chrisccoulson> we've got snow again!
<chrisccoulson> https://twitter.com/chrisccoulson/status/315012812156055552
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I'm good
<seb128> chrisccoulson, crazy weather this year
<chrisccoulson> we have snowfall forecast for most of today and tomorrow
<mhr3> jamesh, fyi i'm pushing http://paste.ubuntu.com/5636475/ into apps lens
<mhr3> jamesh, well, the xapian define is important
<GunnarHj> seb128: Re bug 952185; actually there are two more tasks besides the openssh patch that need sponsoring: An at (ubuntu) MP and a gdm (precise) bzr branch.
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 952185 in gdm (Ubuntu Precise) "~/.pam_environment not parsed by default" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/952185
<seb128> GunnarHj, the merge requests are picked by the sponsoring queue directly
<GunnarHj> seb128: One MP. And no, since ubuntu-branches is not in the review list.
<GunnarHj> seb128: And the other branch is not an MP, since there is no branch to merge against.
<seb128> GunnarHj, shrug, that bug is a mess :-(
<seb128> GunnarHj, if there is no mp can you add a debdiff to the bug?
<GunnarHj> seb128: If only the sponsors were careful enough. ;-)
<GunnarHj> seb128: Can do that.
<seb128> GunnarHj, thanks
<popey> hmm, something squiffy with pulseaudio today. it keeps respawning after login
<ogra_> it is supposed to respawn ...
<ogra_> mor intresting would be why does it die
<popey> well indeed
<ogra_> anything in ~/.xsession-errors ?
<popey> bug 1078543
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1078543 in pulseaudio (Ubuntu Raring) "[raring] Pulse audio fails to start with error 'Failed to open module "module-esound-protocol-unix": file not found'" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1078543
<popey> getting that
<ogra_> geez, why is that loaded at all
<popey> no mention of pulse in xsession-errors
<popey> http://paste.ubuntu.com/5636659/
<ogra_> got steam installed on a 64bit machine ?
<popey> yes
<popey> hmm, killed pulse and now it loads
 * popey reboots
<popey> ogra_: aha! it respawns madly if you logout/login, not if you reboot
 * popey files bug
<Laney> arrrrrr
<seb128> Laney, not liking the winter weather or....?
<Laney> yeah, just arrived at blue fin - cold cold
<seb128> no lunch outside today then? ;-)
<Laney> definitely not :P
<Laney> pitti: ah, we still have a glib diff for python:any BD
<cyphermox_> " good" morning!
<cyphermox_> Laney, I'm ready to upload evo 3.6.4 I guess
<cyphermox_> I can' t really do a build test though; I'm on a live CD
<cyphermox_> (for raring)
<Laney> you sound supremely confident!
<Laney> porter-amd64?
<cyphermox_> you are genius
<cyphermox_> oh wait
<cyphermox_> that's going to be some hoop jumping but yes I can do it
<Laney> did your pc break or something?
<cyphermox_> yeah
<cyphermox_> BOTH.
<Laney> :/
<cyphermox_> one won' t boot, the other's SSD freezes up all the time
<cyphermox_> I got disk errors
<cyphermox_> sitting in a cafe right now, on a live cd on my laptop, waiting for the parts shop next door to open
<Laney> oh man, brutal
<pitti> Laney: ah that; damn Debian freeze :)
<seb128> pitti, sorry, forgot to reply to your ping this morning, installing ubuntu-desktop didn't bring libpam-xdg-runtime in, I guess that's only a recommend? in any case I swapped back, will let you know if I find any issue
<pitti> thanks
<seb128> pitti, btw, what was the status of langpacks? wgrant said the other day you guys sorted it out and you were going to trigger an update ... is that correct?
<mterry> didrocks, so how does the privacy control ("remote-content-search") for scopes work in the new smart scope world?
<didrocks> mterry: it will stay the same
<didrocks> mterry: and disable the smart scope service
<didrocks> so no talk to the server
<didrocks> mterry: btw, yesterday you relaunched the unity stack, but didn't publish it (it was in manual publishing mode)
<didrocks> mterry: we had a lot of tests failing during this daily release this night. I bet for a service crashing/flacky tests and seb128 reran them (still running on some arch)
<mterry> didrocks, ugh, whoops
<didrocks> mterry: do you mind publishing them (they will be in manual publishing mode still because some upstream stacks are in manual publishing)
<mterry> didrocks, I saw that he did, yeah.  ati had a lot of failures, it's usually reliable
<davidcalle> mterry, on top of that, all scopes have a RemoteContent true/false field in their .scope file. To ensure even local non-recommended scopes are blocked.
<mterry> didrocks, after they finish sure
<didrocks> mterry: thanks! also there is one compiz regression
<didrocks> one secâ¦
<didrocks> bug #1158161
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1158161 in Compiz "[regression] Unmaximized windows can't be closed, minimized, moved" [Critical,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1158161
<didrocks> mterry:  ^
<didrocks> would be good to get a fix in
<mterry> davidcalle, so if there is a RemoteContent=true field, and that preference is turned off, the scope won't be used?
<jcastro>  /msg didrocks argh this new dash.
<didrocks> mterry: sam has a fix in lp:compiz (not lp:compiz/raring)
<didrocks> jcastro: :)
<jcastro> :)
<didrocks> mterry: but the description is not encouraging
<jcastro> so this lag inbetween each character typed, is killing me
<didrocks> jcastro: yeah, there is a bug for the searching on each keystroke
<didrocks> which is doing thatâ¦
<mterry> didrocks, you mean the "such a disaster" line?  :)
<didrocks> mterry: rather "I have no idea why it does. Scary."
<mterry> didrocks, OK, who is managing the compiz/raring branch?  They should review the code
<didrocks> mterry: well, nobody since duflu is working on something else :/
<didrocks> mterry: so basically, you? (surprise surprise!) :-)
<mterry> hmm
<didrocks> mterry: sil2100 has some knowledge of compiz
<didrocks> not sure in that area of the code though
<mterry> change seems simple enough
<didrocks> yeah, we can try just confirming it's fixing it
<didrocks> and having someone playing with the decorator
<didrocks> it's reproducible 100% of times
<ritz__> cyphermox hi, sorry to bug you, does the sru request look fine ? -  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/network-manager-applet/+bug/1116317
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1116317 in network-manager-applet "Needs option to create user connections by default" [Wishlist,In progress]
<mterry> didrocks, will test myself and file MR for it when I confirm.  Then maybe you can approve for landing
<didrocks> mterry: thanks a lot
<didrocks> mterry: yep, I will just trust your words :)
<sil2100> didrocks, mterry: I checked the code, but didn't build-test it yet
 * sil2100 was lunching
<sil2100> For Sam's fix
<didrocks> thx sil2100!
<mterry> didrocks, so...  this RemoteContent field for scope files.  If the user has set privacy to ON, a RemoteContent=true scope won't be used?
<didrocks> mterry: basically, the scope will be started
<didrocks> but will look at this privacy key
<didrocks> and if it's set to ON
<didrocks> it won't look
<sil2100> I'll backport it to raring later ;p
<didrocks> also, the smart scope won't set your search on the server
<davidcalle> didrocks, that's the old way. Unity will decide to start it or not.
<didrocks> davidcalle: right, but some will still be started
<mterry> didrocks, but only those with RemoteContent=false?
<didrocks> like the music remote and photo remotes
<didrocks> right davidcalle?
<mterry> didrocks, those may look at the preference key to optionally use remote sources?
<davidcalle> didrocks, right, these ones, since they have the "always-running" dconf-key check internally.
<didrocks> yep
<didrocks> so it's a combination of both :)
<mterry> so always-running -> looks at key; RemoteContent=false -> looks at key; RemoteContent=true -> not even started if privacy on
<mterry> didrocks, davidcalle ^ ?
<didrocks> mterry: almost ;) (RemoteContent=false won't look at the key as they don't search for remote contentâ¦)
<davidcalle> mterry, remotecontent false don't need to look at the key at all. But yes.
<mterry> didrocks, davidcalle: what about a scope that looks at local as well as remote content?
<didrocks> mterry: they are separate scope
<didrocks> under the same master scope
<mterry> ah... hm
<didrocks> but separate scope
<mterry> didrocks, so MIR wise, launchpad and sshsearch scopes use python2 and thus are icky.  Would you be super sad if they weren't installed by default?
<didrocks> mterry: I think the executive decision is to install all of them by default, regardless of the technology
<didrocks> launchpad is python2 because of launchpadlib
<davidcalle> mterry, that would be unfortunate to have github without launchpad, but paramiko and liblaunchpad are the bad guys.
<didrocks> not sure about why sshsearch is
<mterry> didrocks, paramiko
<didrocks> ok paramiko :)
<mterry> MIR doesn't care *why*
<mterry> MIR's answer is port liblaunchpad (why isn't that ported yet!)
<mterry> didrocks, but you think there's an override in effect here
<didrocks> mterry: right
<davidcalle> mterry, https://bugs.launchpad.net/lazr.authentication/+bug/1007437
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1007437 in lazr.authentication "Support Python 3" [Undecided,New]
<mterry> Well, in those two cases (liblaunchpad, paramiko), other desktop stuff needs those to be ported.  So adding a couple lenses to that pile isn't the worst.  When we get serious about python3, we can consider either porting what we need or dropping these lenses
<mterry> Adding a couple lenses for now won't hurt
<didrocks> mterry: agreed
<didrocks> launchpadlib in python3 would be great as a lot of our tool are depending on that
<mterry> davidcalle, another question.  I see some questionable copy-paste code it looks like.  In musique, audacious, clementine, gmusicbrowser, and guayadeque:
<mterry>             if model.get_value(iteration, 1) == "musique":
<mterry>                 image = "file:///usr/share/icons/hicolor/scalable/apps/audacious.svg"
<mterry> This is in the preview code
<mterry> didrocks, and everything seems to depend on gir1.2-dee-1.0 but not actually use it?  not a MIR blocker, but just odd
<davidcalle> mterry, these previews haven't been ported to the new api, afaik.
<didrocks> mterry: right, we removed on some
<didrocks> mterry: not all though, but I plan to do that
<mterry> davidcalle, so that's dead, unused code right now?
<mterry> davidcalle, is porting to new preview code planned for raring?
<seb128> pitti, hey
<davidcalle> mterry, so this code is not actually used yet. It will be in a few days I hope, I've updated the maintainer on the new preview API last night (it has landed a few days ago).
<seb128> pitti, do you have special translation foo on launchpad?
<davidcalle> mterry, planned for raring.
<mterry> k
<mterry> davidcalle, thanks
<seb128> pitti, like, can you change https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/raring/+source/hud/+imports to "approved"?
<seb128> czajkowski, hey, ^
<mterry> didrocks, aha!  sshsearch says RemoteContent=false and then checks the key  ;)
<didrocks> should be RemoteContent=true
<didrocks> davidcalle: ^
<didrocks> hum
<didrocks> no, it should be false
<didrocks> but no need to check the key
<didrocks> mterry: it's extra-picky :p
<mterry> didrocks, davidcalle: well, with those concerns, MIR seems fine for this set
<didrocks> mterry: you did see the home scope code as well, right?
<didrocks> mterry: as it's the only one which is different from others
<davidcalle> mterry, that's unfortunote for the sshsearch mistake, but GREAT for the MIR, thanks! :)
<mterry> didrocks, no, it wasn't in the list of new packages.
<mterry> oh yeah it was
<didrocks> hum, sure?
<mterry> just a different list
<didrocks> mterry: right :)
<mterry> didrocks, OK, will look
<didrocks> mterry: it's a none boring one
<mterry> didrocks, yay?
<didrocks> mterry: and you know what? you can directly bother pstolowski and mhr3 for it :p
<didrocks> mterry: it's the smart scope service
<didrocks> so agregatting all data per master scope
<didrocks> agregatting the home dash
<didrocks> and sending data to the server
<didrocks> a nice playfield! :)
<rickspencer3> hey didrocks, seb128 what's the word on the street regarding new dash? looking good today?
<rickspencer3> (I haven't dist-upgraded yet today)
<didrocks> rickspencer3: if you dist-upgrade now, you will get the in dash payment as well
<didrocks> rickspencer3: some fixes, still some work to do, I hope to process a rebuild tonight and have the friends scope
<rickspencer3> didrocks, so you think dash payment will land?
<didrocks> rickspencer3: well, at least, it's now in the ppa, QA on OLS gave their +1 on their testing on it with the 100scopes
<didrocks> the merge reviews have been acked
<didrocks> so it's a question of testing
<didrocks> there are still some cases where they are unclear about
<didrocks> like if you card expire, no feedback
<didrocks> so they are trying to figure out that
<didrocks> and they need the +1 on the FFe bug from Mark
<rickspencer3> didrocks, seb128 said something about sabdfl asking for ppa testing or something first
<rickspencer3> did all that happen?
<BigWhale> Hmmm... Alt+Right Click on a window is captured by Unity and not sent to the application. Can this be disabled?
<didrocks> rickspencer3: it's just what happen?
<didrocks> see my:
<didrocks> 15:27:25      didrocks | rickspencer3: if you dist-upgrade now, you will get the in dash payment as well
<didrocks> rickspencer3: that's what I'm working on for the past few days, sees the email you were CCed :)
<didrocks> so as told in those emails
<czajkowski> seb128: you pinged?
<didrocks> we can start testing in the ppa
<didrocks> we have an easy revert path
<didrocks> in case things are not ok or mark didn't +1
<rickspencer3> didrocks, yeah, I saw that, I just didn't know if it was specifically what sabdfl asked for
<seb128> czajkowski, hey
<rickspencer3> (after a short chat with seb128 last night)
<didrocks> rickspencer3: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/1154176/comments/13
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1154176 in unity "[FFE] Add payment preview for music" [Undecided,Fix committed]
<didrocks> this is why it's in the experimental ppa
<rickspencer3> ok, I understand now
<cyphermox_> hey mterry
<seb128> rickspencer3, sorry if what I said yesterday didn't make sense/was lacking details
<rickspencer3> seb128, it's all ok
<rickspencer3> lol
<seb128> ;-)
<rickspencer3> I was just asking
<mterry> cyphermox_, hi, what's up?
<cyphermox_> heh
<mterry> didrocks, home scope c/r/p's some lenses.  It c/r's asklibreoffice, but doesn't p it.  Intentional?
<didrocks> mterry: hem, I was testing you :)
<didrocks> mterry: want to MP for it? ;)
<mterry> k
<mterry> didrocks, I'll just push
<didrocks> mterry: ok ;)
<didrocks> mterry: don't break an in-process merge though
<mterry> guh fine  :)
<mterry> didrocks, https://code.launchpad.net/~mterry/unity-scope-home/missing-p/+merge/154973
<cyphermox> ritz__: hey, yeah it looks fine, just won't be exactly that patch
<ritz__> cyphermox, thank you :)
<ritz__> cyphermox, also, lp#965895, sru filled, with the debdiff
<seb128> pitti, unping about hud template approval, got it done
<ritz__> cyphermox, TIA
<ritz__> let me know, if anything needs to fixed
<ritz__> seb128, ty :)
<ritz__> gn folks :)
<cyphermox> dah, why did he leave so quickly :(
<mterry> didrocks, seems like that privacy switch is not coded yet?  Bug 1158782 seems to think not, and I don't see RemoteContent in the home scope source
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1158782 in unity (Ubuntu) "When privacy switch is on don't query client scopes with RemoteContent=true" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1158782
<mterry> seems problematic
<didrocks> mterry: no, it's in progress :)
<didrocks> but noted
<kenvandine> didrocks, yay... i see results in the friends lens from jamesh's branch :)
<didrocks> \o/
<kenvandine> didrocks, i see you played with it a bit
<kenvandine> it's using the wrong renderer
<kenvandine> but it's something :)
<didrocks> yeah ;)
<didrocks> kenvandine: do you mind switching to the right renderer?
<kenvandine> is that a bug or something that doesn't exist anymroe?
<didrocks> if you have time
<kenvandine> sure
<didrocks> kenvandine: I don't think so
<didrocks> kenvandine: open a bug against unity
<didrocks> (upstream)
<didrocks> 100scopes
<didrocks> for tag
<kenvandine> didrocks, so it is using HORIZONTAL_TILE, you're saying you think that might just be a bug in unity right?
<didrocks> kenvandine: yeah, probably
<mdeslaur> didrocks: quick question: what creates the "unity" compiz profile when a user logs in?
<seb128> mdeslaur, your computer does
<seb128> :p
<mdeslaur> seb128: oh! that would explain it :)
<mdeslaur> hehe
<mdeslaur> seb128: do you know the answer?
<seb128> mdeslaur, the answer is "that's more complex that it should be"
<seb128> mdeslaur, there is a profile copy on first login iirc
<seb128> mdeslaur, for some reason which have to do with compiz having a backend for your storage backend
<seb128> like cpp->gconf/gsettings/ini
<seb128> mdeslaur, what are you trying to figure out?
<mdeslaur> I am trying to enforce default gsettings for unity...but creating gschema.override file only seems to affect the "Default" compiz profile
<mdeslaur> so I'm trying to figure out what exactly is creating the "unity" compiz profile
<seb128> mdeslaur, try asking on #ubuntu-unity, sil2100 probably knows the details
<mdeslaur> thanks seb128
<pitti> seb128: langpacks> yes, I'm waiting for the first LP export, then I can build them
<pitti> seb128: I can't approve imports or translations
<seb128> pitti, launchpadlibrarian.net/134834696/ubuntu-raring-translations.tar.gz
<seb128> pitti, isn't that the export?
<seb128> pitti, it's listed on https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/raring/+language-packs
<seb128> pitti, or do you need something else?
<pitti> oh, nice!
<pitti> no, that's it
<seb128> pitti, great ;-)
<pitti> seb128: it's not cron'ed yet, as the first (full) build needs some special care
<seb128> pitti, ok
<pitti> seb128: I started the build of the packages now
<seb128> pitti, danke!
<pitti> seb128: I guess I won't get to testing/uploading them before Monday, though
<seb128> we will maybe have updated translations in raring :p
<seb128> pitti, just discovered today that quite some templates are outdated in raring
<pitti> our in-laws are visiting over the weekend (they are already here), so I won't be able to steal away much for computer stuff
<seb128> pitti, no worry, you shouldn't work in the W.E! no hurry as well, can wait next week
<seb128> pitti, we need to figure how to make rosetta import the .pot from the daily build ppas, we overlooked that part with the daily landing
<seb128> pitti, I guess didrocks will talk to you about that
<pitti> oh, we don't grab the translation tarballs from that, I suppose
<pitti> bad
<didrocks> yeah, but in a call :)
<seb128> yeah, that sucks
<pitti> so we need to enable pkgbinarymangler in those PPAs, and teach LP to look at those
<seb128> and we didn't have updates langpacks to say "hold on, my translations are uptodate, how much unity is not translated"
<seb128> I just noticed today while checking something else
<seb128> pitti, seems about right
<seb128> well, not before next week in any case
<seb128> friday 5pm is not the time to start figuring that out ;-)
<seb128> no hurry as well, we did manual uploads or updated .pot meanwhile
<kenvandine> cyphermox, autopilot question
<kenvandine> 11:49:59.775 WARNING __init__:197 - Caught exception while searching for autopilot interface: 'DBusException("Could not get PID of name 'org.freedesktop.DBus': no such name",)'
<kenvandine> what do you think could be causing that?
<greyback> anyone have any idea why I have no messaging indicator in my panel?
<kenvandine> it continues to timeout while trying to find the object
<cyphermox> kenvandine: no clue
<cyphermox> kenvandine: ask mzanetti in #ubuntu-unity
<kenvandine> cyphermox, can you point me to an example of anything using it?
<cyphermox> I really only did the packaging ;)
<kenvandine> i just used qtcreator to add autopilot tests to my project :)
<cyphermox> (actually, the packaging review)
<kenvandine> ok
<cyphermox> mzanetti has a branch ready to land for autopilot-qt test examples, give me a second
<cyphermox> kenvandine: https://code.launchpad.net/~mzanetti/autopilot-qt/add-tests/+merge/153695
<cyphermox> that might be good examples
<seb128> greyback, is indicator-messages installed?
<seb128> greyback, is that a new install?
<greyback> seb128: yep, package installed. It's an upgrade, but it was missing in quantal for me too, somehow
<seb128> greyback, I think the new design makes it being hidden until you start/configure an app using it
<seb128> greyback, e.g empathy, xchat(-gnome), tb...
<greyback> seb128: I've Empathy running, I'll look into its settings.
<greyback> indicator-messages-service is running...
<seb128> greyback, larsu can probably help you
<greyback> seb128: ok thanks!
<seb128> yw
<greyback> i'm loving the new icons, they're gorgeous
<seb128> greyback, oh, random comment, empathy by itself doesn't integrate to the indicator-messages, you need telepathy-indicator
<seb128> greyback, just in case you don't have this one installed for some reason
<greyback> seb128: yep I have that too
<seb128> larsu, ^ help :p
<greyback> I'll wait for larsu :)
<larsu> greyback: hey :) Are indicator-messages-service and telepathy-indicator running?
<larsu> and do you have at least one account set up in empathy?
<greyback> larsu: yes, yes and yes
<larsu> interesting.....
<larsu> what does `gsettings get com.canonical.indicator.messages applications` give you?
<greyback> larsu: ['gwibber.desktop', 'empathy.desktop', 'thunderbird.desktop', 'redditredditcom.desktop', 'telephony-app.desktop', 'telephony-app-sms.desktop', 'telephony-app-phone.desktop', 'GMailmailgooglecom.desktop', 'xchat.desktop']
<larsu> and you don't see the messaging menu at all?
<larsu> this is weird...
<greyback> nope, sorry. I've not seen it for some time actually. In quantal too :(
<seb128> greyback, that's standard unity, not your own hacked version, right? ;-)
<larsu> seb128: lol
<greyback> seb128: it's all legit :)
<seb128> larsu, well, unity-2d hacker, you never know :p
<greyback> :D
<larsu> greyback: so I guess you've already restarted the messaging service? (if only by restarting your machine)
<seb128> greyback, I guess it's not there if you keyboard navigate left/right? (e.g not an icon issue)?
<greyback> larsu: I killed the process, I think it respawned
<larsu> yeah, that's what it does
<seb128> greyback, I mean if you you open another indicator and do left/right
<greyback> seb128: good idea. Checking, it's definitely not there
<seb128> it's not opened on the way at some point?
<seb128> k...
<greyback> uh oh, version "12.10.6+bzr340+pkg0~quantal1" looks very wrong
<greyback> for indicator-messages
<greyback> must be an old PPA breaking everything. Feck, sorry guys
<larsu> greyback: just to be sure it's not the panel's fault: install libindicator3-tools and do `/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/indicator-loader3 /usr/lib/indicators3/7/libmessaging.so`
<larsu> OH
<larsu> yeah, upgrade to a new version first, please ;)
<greyback> I'm just surprised an old quantal version wasn't replaced by raring
<seb128> greyback, buggy ppa versioning :-(
<seb128> greyback, we are on 12.10.6daily
<greyback> seb128: so I see yes.
<seb128> greyback, just sudo apt-get install indicator-messages/raring
<seb128> greyback, you might want to "dpkg -l | grep ~quantal"
<greyback> seb128: I'm doing a PPA purge too, just to be safe
<larsu> seb128: ooh, I didn't know about this syntax
<seb128> in case you have other packages in the same state
<seb128> larsu, ;-)
<greyback> seb128: that's a nice tip, thanks!
<seb128> larsu, you can use =<version> or /<serie>
<greyback> kewl
<larsu> seb128: yes, I know about =version, but then you have to know the exact version...
<larsu> awesome
 * larsu wants to install something now to try it out
<seb128> larsu, enable a quantal source and do apt-get install eog/quantal :p
<larsu> hehe
 * Laney goes away for a short while - on holiday for the next two weeks but might be around now and again. See you soon if you're not online before I go!
<seb128> Laney, oh, enjoy your holidays!
<Laney> Still around over the weekend if people are :-)
 * Laney sneakily nominates some peer reviewers then scurries off
<Laney> have a nice fortnight!
<kenvandine> didrocks, quick, easy, obvious fix https://code.launchpad.net/~ken-vandine/unity-lens-friends/libunity7-busname-fix/+merge/155011
<didrocks> kenvandine: approved :)
<didrocks> pitti: seb128: we should discuss that on Monday :)
<seb128> didrocks, +1
<didrocks> (yeah, I'm way behind because of meeting/triaging issues)
<kenvandine> didrocks, should i push that to the team branch?
<kenvandine> i assume there is no merger for that :)
<didrocks> kenvandine: yeah, there is no automerger yet
<didrocks> kenvandine: there will be in ~1h
<didrocks> :)
<kenvandine> pushed
<didrocks> sweet!
 * kenvandine goes back to figuring out autopilot tests :)
<didrocks> :)
<tkamppeter> jasoncwarner_, hi
 * didrocks waves good evening
<rickspencer3> getting facebook photos in my dash is pretty cool
<cyphermox> cool :)
<cyphermox> robru: ping?
<robru> cyphermox, oh hey... I can't remember what I wanted ;-)
<cyphermox> robru: ah, ok :)
<robru> cyphermox, it had to do with landing touch apps in raring. how's that going for you? most of my stuff is blocked on other packages that haven't landed yet
<cyphermox> I was busy with the bluetooth and a bunch of other smaller details, I was starting now
<cyphermox> are you block on anything mine?
<cyphermox> I can do them now in priority, and it can go even faster assuming you help reviewing the packaging changes?
<robru> cyphermox, can't remember now... something about autopilot, and libhud-qt-qml. you doing either of those?
<cyphermox> we did land autopilot-qt yesterday
<robru> cyphermox, oh great
<cyphermox> libhud-qt-qml might be mine too, but was blocked on ted finishing up making hud work on desktop, IIRC
<cyphermox> (checking)
<cyphermox> yup, libhud-qt is mine, BLOCKED.
<cyphermox> ted's WI is INPROGRESS
<cyphermox> hmm
<cyphermox> we should make a bot to find out the status of work items.
<robru> yeah, I emailed ted about it already, but hadn't gotten a reply
<robru> I should set my workitems to blocked ;-)
#ubuntu-desktop 2013-03-23
<BigWhale> Good Morning ...
<SuperMatt> hey guys, I'm trying the raring daily installer for today (my machine needed a reinstall for windows reasons), but it seems to hang on the second section (where you tell it you want to download updates during the install, etc)
<robru> SuperMatt, yeah, the raring installer is typically not the greatest way to install the distro. Usually it's best to use the installer of the latest stable system (quantal right now) because it is much more stable. Then once you have quantal installed you can much more reliably upgrade it to raring in-place.
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-03-17
<mterry> robert_ancell, you around?
<robert_ancell> mterry, yep
<mterry> robert_ancell, how does lightdm / logind interaction go?  I see lightdm calling Unlock, but not Activate.  Does logind track VTs or something for that?
<robert_ancell> mterry, I think so
<mterry> robert_ancell, because I'm thinking in Mir land (at least), it needs to call Activate
<robert_ancell> ok
<mterry> robert_ancell, and for safety's sake should probably just always call Activate after Unlock
<mterry> robert_ancell, because that's the semantics it wants
<mterry> robert_ancell, I tested and this dumb patch fixed session tracking with my split greeter branches: http://paste.ubuntu.com/7105848/
<mterry> though maybe it shouldn't try to Activate if Unlock failed
<robert_ancell> Shame we can't do a "UnlockAndActivate"
<robert_ancell> yeah
<mterry> for atomic usage?  Yeah
<mterry> robert_ancell, do you want a quick branch?
<robert_ancell> mterry, sure. Is this needed for 14.04?
<mterry> robert_ancell, ideally?
<robert_ancell> mterry, ok
<mterry> robert_ancell, https://code.launchpad.net/~mterry/lightdm/activate-after-unlocking/+merge/211235
<mterry> robert_ancell, I'm going to sleep soon.  So if there are trivial changes needed, please feel free to make them yourself.  Else we can catch up on it tomorrow
<robert_ancell> mterry, bye
<mterry> robert_ancell, bye!
<mterry> robert_ancell, actually, maybe that code should be part of session_set_active
<mterry> semantically.
<robert_ancell> mterry, ah, yes
<robert_ancell> I should have reviewed that closer
<mterry> robert_ancell, sorry.  Just had a falling-to-sleep realization
<robert_ancell> I think in all normal cases unlock = activate but we should fix that before something changes that
<mterry> robert_ancell, I'm not sure what we do in the autologin-in-background case.  Not sure if we ever call Unlock or not, but we do call session_set_active, and we should be clear with logind which session is active in that case
<robert_ancell> yes
<robert_ancell> brb, just testing 1.9.12
<mterry> robert_ancell, I can whip up something tomorrow
<mterry> oh whoops
<robert_ancell> mterry, ok, heading off now. I'll merge your branch in the morning :)
<mterry> robert_ancell, OK  :)  sorry for back and forth
<robert_ancell> no worries
<pitti> desrt: hey
<pitti> Good morning
<pitti> desrt: we haven't maintained jhbuild on jenkins for a while; it didn't get that much attention, and my impression was that gnome-continuous superseded it?
<darkxst> pitti, I didnt even know there was jhbuild on  jenkins, however I think it still has its place for development work
<darkxst> and it often breaks on ubuntu for various reasons
<darkxst> pitti, or just read that as I still use jhbuild, since I havent got around to working out how OSTree works for local git builds!
<darkxst> pitti, can you upload https://code.launchpad.net/~albertsmuktupavels/gnome-menus/fix-menus-in-gnome-flashback-session-real/+merge/211246 (I reviewed it, but don't actually have upload rights for gnome-menus yet)
<darkxst> err, on second thoughts seemes the new file is not installed
<darkxst> pitti, ^ fixed, can you upload?
<pitti> darkxst: ack, will do
<darkxst> pitti, thanks
 * hyperair wonders if anyone besides me sees issues with the unity lockscreen
<jibel> with latest trusty iso, when the live session starts the keyboard shortcut overlay of unity is displayed
<jibel> is it a known issue?
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<seb128> jibel, that's a feature, not a bug (it's displaying the overview on first user login so you know about the keybinding)
<seb128> I'm not sure I like the feature though, so feel free to open a bug if you don't like it either, so we have a place to discuss that on launchpad ;-)
<jibel> seb128, ah a "feature" :) I'll file a bug, thanks!
<seb128> jibel, yw
<seb128> jibel, bug #1283619 for reference
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1283619 in Unity "No "first run" tutorial for Unity/Ubuntu" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1283619
<jibel> displaying the shortcut hint doesn't really address the original proposition
<Laney> helloooooooooo!
<seb128> Laney, hey, welcome back!
<seb128> Laney, did you have a good week off?
<Laney> hey seb128
<seb128> jibel, well, apparently JohnLea approved the solution there...
<Laney> was very good thanks: riding a tandem, going to the seaside, eating lots of nice food, drinking good beer and playing board games ;-)
<jibel> seb128, do you know how to disable it because it interferes with automated tests of the installer?
<Laney> how was your week/weekend?
<seb128> jibel, create a file ~/.cache/unity/first_run.stamp
<jibel> ta
<seb128> jibel, that's what they did for lightdm guest sessions
<seb128> Laney, nice ;-)
<Laney> https://fbcdn-sphotos-b-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-prn2/t1/1187126_10101065908145328_306761324_n.jpg
<seb128> Laney, week was good, the lock screen work finally landed, they had some rounds of bugfixing since (and still some issues), vUDS happened, bugs got fixed ... pretty standard week in Ubuntu world ;-)
<Laney> oh yeah vUDS
<Laney> did much happen there?
<seb128> not that I know
<seb128> schedule was half empty
<seb128> not in client at least, seems core was better
<seb128> they are good discussions on e.g the work that need to happen around systemd
<seb128> oh
<seb128> I almost forgot
<ogra_> well, we also only had one room ... it had a session every hour though
<seb128> qt5.2 landed on friday
<ogra_> (core that is)
<Laney> oh yeah I saw some plussing about that
<seb128> hopefully this week is bugfixing only ;-)
<didrocks> ahah, don't dreamâ¦
<didrocks> there is the new scope infra transition
<didrocks> the icon theme transition
<didrocks> and 5.2 fixes to get a promotable image :p
<seb128> didrocks, I was speaking about desktop ;-)
<didrocks> yeah, on that, you should be quieter ;)
<Laney> let me see the queue
<seb128> though the scope one worries me :p
<seb128> that's likely to impact desktop in some ways?
<ogra_> heh, brits ... always after the queue
<didrocks> seb128: normally no, they are separated binaries
<didrocks> and only activated by the shell
<Laney> you wait your turn, grawert
<seb128> good
<ogra_> lol
<Laney> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/?field.searchtext=&search=Search&field.status:list=NEW&field.status:list=CONFIRMED&field.status:list=TRIAGED&field.status:list=INPROGRESS&field.status:list=INCOMPLETE_WITH_RESPONSE&field.status:list=INCOMPLETE_WITHOUT_RESPONSE&assignee_option=any&field.assignee=&field.bug_reporter=&field.bug_commenter=&field.subscriber=ubuntu-release&field.structural_subscriber=&field.component-empty-marker=1&fie ...
<Laney> ... ld.tag=&field.tags_combinator=ANY&field.status_upstream-empty-marker=1&field.has_cve.used=&field.omit_dupes.used=&field.omit_dupes=on&field.affects_me.used=&field.has_no_package.used=&field.has_patch.used=&field.has_branches.used=&field.has_branches=on&field.has_no_branches.used=&field.has_no_branches=on&field.has_blueprints.used=&field.has_blueprints=on&field.has_no_blueprints.used=&field.has_no_blueprints=on&orderby=status& ...
<Laney> ... start=0
<didrocks> however, I would appreciate some help in case some packages are getting stuck in proposed or not building
<Laney> erm
 * Laney runs
<seb128> lol
<Laney> http://is.gd/wmIkMg
<didrocks> as I had to butcher a little bit the archive :)
<Laney> you had to WHAT!
 * didrocks didn't put back his knives in the kitchen
<Sweetshark> Moin!
<seb128> didrocks, xnox did some fixing over the w.e, re-enable some packages to build on all archs, and got things true proposed
<seb128> Sweetshark, hey
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, I saw that, that's sweet :)
<didrocks> seb128: so, with the sdk fix that's in flight, normally, we should be in a way better position
<seb128> great
<seb128> Laney, if you look to ffes, can I point you to https://launchpad.net/bugs/1207812 ? ;-)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1207812 in libimobiledevice (Ubuntu) "[FFe] Update libimobiledevice to support iOS 7, fix Trust Prompt Looping" [Medium,New]
<Sweetshark> seb128: current status: autopkgtest run on my machine but not in the adt VMs - so of for some fun debugging ...
<seb128> Laney, it should be an "easy" one (like not a lot of choice, we can't really not get support for the current iOS version)
<xnox> seb128: didrocks: from archive point of view it would be amazing if dee-qt got fixed. Cause then we'd be able to drop all arch-restrictions. The current test-failure is very puzzling https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/dee-qt/3.3+14.04.20140116-0ubuntu2
<seb128> Sweetshark, "nice" ... you can try to claim its jibel's fault and see if you can get him to debug it for you ;-)
<Laney> seb128: yeah, will do soon
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> xnox, did you try asking mhr3 or tsdgeos?
<didrocks> xnox: yeah, same failures on ppc* only, weird. The thing is that dee-qt is considered as abandonned, but I'll try to get someone on it
<didrocks> like mhr3 :)
 * mhr3 hides
<didrocks> mhr3: hey hey! :)
<didrocks> good morrrrrrning ;)
<seb128> mhr3, good morning, happy monday!
<xnox> didrocks: if it's abandoned, why does our stack rely on it? e.g. dee-qt -> (hud, unity8) -> unity-action-api -> ubuntu-ui-toolkit -> (everything)
<didrocks> xnox: don't ask me, ask upstream ;)
<mhr3> who said it's abandoned?
<mhr3> seb128, fine morning to you sir! :)
<didrocks> last time I asked a fix for it. I can grep the logs
<Sweetshark> seb128: nah, its pretty sure my fault somehow. Java doesnt find one of the native LibreOffice libs for connecting to LO.
<tsdgeos> seb128: didrocks: do you guys happen to know how i can debug this? a) kdm doesn't seem to want to star unity anymore b) lightdm doesn't want to show anything on my system
<xnox> didrocks: also from the department of possibly abandoned things, you are listed as maintainer of "oneconf" and it has a very strange python3.4 failures =) do you know who I can poke to try to fix it?
<seb128> tsdgeos, is "ubuntu-session" installed?
<didrocks> xnox: barry did the python3 part, so I guess he's the most experienced with this
<didrocks> port*
<tsdgeos> seb128: i do
<Sweetshark> seb128: The "fun" is that it takes some 55 minutes to provision the VM (install all the deps etc.) -- the test itself would only take some 5 minutes after that.
<xnox> mhr3: can you glance at the test-results of the two failed builds on this page https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/dee-qt/3.3+14.04.20140116-0ubuntu2 ? a few people are very puzzled by it.
<xnox> mhr3: maybe it "all makes sense to you" =)
<seb128> tsdgeos, it was not and you do install it? or is it already installed?
<mhr3> xnox, i guess that was with 5.2?
<tsdgeos> seb128: it was installed, this was working on friday
<seb128> xnox, likely an endian issue if it's ppc only?
<tsdgeos> stopped working over the weekend
<didrocks> mhr3: it's with 5.2, right
<seb128> tsdgeos, weird, what happens when you try to log in?
<tsdgeos> seb128: kdm seems to "close itself to give way to the session"
<tsdgeos> and it stays there
<tsdgeos> no gnome-session or unity or anything running
<mhr3> is it just mp or is being weird now?
<mhr3> s/mp/me/
<mhr3> eh
<mhr3> is it just me or is lp being weird now?
<seb128> tsdgeos, do you get your background image? can you e.g right click on it (said differently, is nautilus running)
<seb128> mhr3, just you
<xnox> mhr3: seb128: powerpc is big endian, ppc64el is little endian -> thus not an endianneess issue.
<mhr3> getting timeouts, bzr pull not working :/
<tsdgeos> seb128: no, i still have kdm's background image
<xnox> mhr3: this is the first time ever where we have build-dependncies satisfiable on both of those arches, thus it never built on those before.
<seb128> tsdgeos, can you share the ~/.xsession-errors and ~/.cache/upstart/gnome-session-ubuntu.log logs?
<xnox> gnome-session or ubuntu-session? =)
<mhr3> xnox, looks like an issue in qt itself to me
<tsdgeos> seb128: http://paste.ubuntu.com/7107114/
<xnox> mhr3: right, how'd i go around making a minimal test-case to try? e.g. did Slot not generate anything at all?!
<tsdgeos> last line does actually seem like it could be a problem
<seb128> xnox, "init: No s'ha pogut obtenir la instÃ ncia gnome-session: Unknown parameter: XDG_CURRENT_DESKTOP"
<mhr3> xnox, it's failing on the new-style connect()
<mhr3> xnox, so the question only is whether it's the param for the connect that cause it, or something more fundamental
<xnox> seb128: catalan? i thought you were german.
<tsdgeos> xnox: that's my paste
<xnox> seb128: tsdgeos: i'll look into it to see where the breakage is coming from.
<xnox> tsdgeos: could you give me package version numbers you have installed? e.g. "$ dpkg -l"
<seb128> tsdgeos, right, they changed the upstart jobs on friday
<seb128> xnox, does that error make any sense to you?
<xnox> seb128: yes, I understand the error message.
<seb128> tsdgeos, likely due to https://launchpadlibrarian.net/169426095/gnome-session_3.9.90-0ubuntu11_3.9.90-0ubuntu12.diff.gz
<tsdgeos> xnox: http://paste.ubuntu.com/7107128/
<tsdgeos> seb128: looks like it
<xnox> seb128: so at the time the job was started, XDG_CURRENT_DESKTOP environment variable was not set, or available at all. (e.g. not passed in cmd-line args)
<Laney> Mirv: can qtcreator-plugin-cmake be uploaded?
<xnox> seb128: what typically on a normal machine sets that environmental variable?
<xnox> seb128: cause, if it's gnome-session itself, we have a bootstrapping problem =)
<seb128> xnox, I think gnome-session itself
<tsdgeos> seb128: so let me patch that manually back
<Mirv> Laney: yes
<Laney> Mirv: you or me? :-)
<Mirv> Laney: I don't have upload rights to that particular package, as it's not in the Qt5 set. so, you.
<seb128> xnox, later I can remind our discussion from last week on how trivial changes have potential to create issues :p
<Laney> okay
<seb128> Laney, did you hit conflict on CMakeProjectManager.pluginspec ? ;-)
<mhr3> xnox, so, yea, i could change the tests in dee-qt to not use the functor-based connect() but that's just hiding the fundamental problem, qt needs to be fixed
<seb128> Laney, if so, bug #1292615 if you want to fix it/reference from the changelog
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1292615 in qtcreator-plugin-cmake (Ubuntu) "package qtcreator-plugin-cmake (not installed) failed to install/upgrade: trying to overwrite '/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/qtcreator/plugins/QtProject/libCMakeProjectManager.so', which is also in package qtcreator 2.8.1-0ubuntu1" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1292615
<Laney> seb128: yes
<Laney> it's already fixed in trunk
<seb128> ok
<Laney> Mirv: I might s/Conflicts/Breaks/ though - would that make you scream or cry?
<Mirv> Laney: no it would not
<Laney> too many unnecessary conflicts can cause problems when upgrading
<Mirv> just thank you
<Laney> great, ok, doing
<Laney> ta
<xnox> seb128: then it can't be using that as an instance var, as it doesn't know it ahead of time.
<seb128> xnox, how come it's working for most users?
<tsdgeos> seb128: that indeed makes it work for me again
<tsdgeos> i mean "reverting that patch"
<seb128> xnox, ok, so lightdm set it, seems like kdm doesn't
<seb128> xnox, which is probably why it's working for most of us
<seb128> tsdgeos, that doesn't explain why lightdm stopped working for you, can you report a bug using ubuntu-bug lightdm?
<tsdgeos> seb128: well, maybe it never worked (or not for a long time)
<seb128> oh, you usually use kdm and tried to switch when you hit the bug?
<tsdgeos> seb128: yep
<seb128> k
<seb128> tsdgeos, so yeah, that change that was made is buggy for kdm (and probably other dms)
<tsdgeos> seb128: you want a bug for both things? (one for lightdm and one for the other change?)
<seb128> tsdgeos, yes please, gnome-session and lightdm
<tsdgeos> ok
<tsdgeos> will do
<seb128> the lightdm one please use ubuntu-bug
<seb128> so we have the logs
<seb128> thanks!
<Laney> Mirv: please to merge lp:~laney/qtcreator-plugin-cmake/release
<Laney> man, I can understand why you'd think that keyboard shortcuts popup is a bug
<Mirv> Laney: done, thanks, bzoltan is thankful too
<Laney> no worries
<didrocks> mhr3: mind workarounding the issue in dee-qt for now on?
<didrocks> mhr3: it's going to block quite some apps
<didrocks> or maybe tsdgeos knows what's the issue in qt 5.2 itself is
<mhr3> didrocks, imo that's just going to uncover the same issue further down the road
<tsdgeos> didrocks: that thing that fails in ppc?
<didrocks> tsdgeos: yeah
<tsdgeos> no idea other than "is ppc supported upstream"?
<didrocks> tsdgeos: well, you are the closest to upstream, so you should know
<didrocks> tsdgeos: but ppc64el is supported in ubuntu
<tsdgeos> didrocks: i doubt it is, let me check
<didrocks> tsdgeos: well, we should find a wayâ¦ or we shouldn't have switched to Qt then
<Laney> has there been a change to lose borders on windows or am I making things up?
<didrocks> Laney: yeah, 0px width
<Laney> didrocks: on purpose?
<didrocks> yeah
<didrocks> AFAIK
<seb128> Laney, theme update
<Laney> I see
<tsdgeos> didrocks: closest thing is https://bugreports.qt-project.org/browse/QTBUG-35218
<tsdgeos> which says "well maybe, but we don't build it"
<tsdgeos> didrocks: if you give me access to a ppc machine i can try findind out what's wrong
<seb128> Laney, https://plus.google.com/108101042776723451522/posts/KTMMrCC3mZW
<didrocks> tsdgeos: let me give you links for our porter boxes
<Laney> seb128: okay, cheers
<seb128> yw
<Laney> I think I like it after thinking "wtf it's different"
<seb128> ;-)
<Fudus> in the uds was it decided to use local menus or continue with global?
<seb128> Fudus, don't change the default so far but ask design to do user testing and revisit once we get feedback from that
<Mirv> me as new to LIM found it not necessarily obvious but no less obvious than having it outside the window at the top of the screen
<Mirv> I liked it and stuck to it then
<Laney> Trevinho: Do you think we could find a way to skip the first-run shortcut overlay for existing users?
<seb128> I wonder if we should just disable that feature
<seb128> it's goes against the "no initial wizard" decision we made by then
<Trevinho> Laney: mh, I thought about that.. I was thinking about checking if settings have been modified, but that's not something it might work 100% of times
<seb128> if we come back on that we should do a proper/useful wizard, just showing keybindings seems like useful for be could do better
<Trevinho> seb128: well, that was a design decision... As "this is the best we can have, for now".
<ogra_> hmm since the new screensaver is in my XPS13 behaves oddly ...
<Trevinho> Laney: anyway just touching ~/.cache/unity/first_run.stamp before running unity is enough
<ochosi> hey Trevinho
<seb128> ogra_, "oddly"?
<Trevinho> ochosi: hi
<Laney> Trevinho: Yeah, you have to find out how to do that when necessary
<ogra_> screen doesnt shut off when i close the lid ... and after unlocking it get the desktop for a few seconds and then a black screen with a clock in the upper right
<ogra_> wiggling the pointer gets me the desktop back then
<Laney> You could have a migration script that runs it
<Laney> s/runs/creates/
<Trevinho> Laney: I tought that, but aren't migration running on first time?
<Laney> I think so - you still need a condition to test for
<ochosi> Trevinho: i got a bugreport for the new unity decorations that i wanted to quickly ask you about. is this expected? (it obviously doesn't affect ambiance or radiance, but mixed-color themes): https://github-camo.global.ssl.fastly.net/8b0e0720c71a10a947fdcddb0ab0932aed4a2757/687474703a2f2f692e696d6775722e636f6d2f79723774544a342e706e67
<Laney> like does compiz create some cache?
<Trevinho> ochosi: oh... well we're using the same theme for both titles, so... I guess we need to fix it, to use style context... I just didn't think we needed it, but it seems we have to.
<Laney> I guess you could do any such check in unity itself though
<tsdgeos> didrocks: so we do not build ppc in the landing silos, and that's why we didn't find that problem before?
<ochosi> Trevinho: yeah, thought so. would be nice if it would just use the same color as the panel menuitems i guess
<hikiko> hello :)
<didrocks> tsdgeos: in some silos, yeah, and due to the complexity of the landing, the decisions (even if we enabled only on that silo) was to dismiss it or you guys would have been blocked for way longer
<tsdgeos> sure
<hikiko> I just added a slider in u-c-c to set the gnome's scaling-factor and I wonder if there's a way to avoid the following problem:
<seb128> hikiko, hey
<hikiko> hi seb128  :)
<hikiko> when I set the slider to a value (let's say 2)
<seb128> Laney, you have a desktop config right, does that have an audio input device integrated? ;-)
<hikiko> and then I manually change the scaling-factor from gsettings set ...
<hikiko> the slider is not updated
<hikiko> is there any mechanism
<hikiko> maybe signals etc so that I update the slider's value
<Laney> seb128: a what?!
<hikiko> when the slider changes from outside u-c-c
<hikiko> ?
<seb128> hikiko, yes, https://developer.gnome.org/gio/2.35/GSettings.html#g-settings-bind
<hikiko> thank you seb128
<seb128> yw
<Laney> You might want to do that in u-s-d though
<Laney> to update the unity value when the gtk value changes?
 * Laney dunno
<seb128> Laney, no, we decided to not bind the unity and gtk settings
<Laney> separate sliders?
<seb128> but rather have a "desktop UI scale" and an "scale applications" slider next to it
<seb128> yes
<Laney> I see
<seb128> it was not possible to bind both properly
<seb128> like if you put 1.5 scale for unity
<seb128> you might prefer 1 or 2 as GTK scale
<seb128> we can't really force it on you
<seb128> also the unity setting is by screen
<seb128> where the GTK one is not
<Laney> it makes it more obvious who to blame, I guess
<Laney> if you can't get the application slider to give you a decent result then you get to blame gtk :P
<seb128> lol, yeah
<seb128> you are going to be screwed anyway if you use a laptop with low-dpi and an external monitor which is hidpi ... and there is no way for us to know which one you prefer
<seb128> Laney, so, coming back to your desktop, do you have anything listing in settings->sound->input?
<Laney> oh I see
<seb128> Laney, I'm looking for somebody to test https://code.launchpad.net/~binli/unity-control-center/1291862/+merge/211258 ... I've only laptops and they come with an input line, so I can't test
<Laney> I didn't know what you were asking me
<seb128> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-control-center/+bug/1291862
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1291862 in gnome-control-center (Ubuntu) "[soundnua]mic volume adjust bar is gray if you open sound-nua input tab earlier than plugging micphone" [Low,Confirmed]
<Laney> I have a microphone socket on my motherboard's soundcard
<seb128> so you should get an empty list until you plug something in that socket?
<Laney> I think so, sec
<Laney> yep
<seb128> cool
<seb128> well, if you can test those changes that would be nice ;-)
<Laney> doing
<seb128> thanks
<Laney> hmm, you reverted that user login history change?
<Laney> did lightdm get a fix?
<seb128> yes, it was wrong, it was listing any sudo session
<seb128> yes
<Laney> neat
<seb128> lightdm correctly register sessions now
<Sweetshark> pitti, jibel: https://gist.github.com/bjoernmichaelsen/9597485 <- huh?
<hikiko> one more question, do you know if this: http://i.imgur.com/7Uj9x2v.png is a custom gimp widget or it has a name?
<seb128> hikiko, I don't think that's a standard GTK widget
<seb128> do you need to do that? but your 2 sliders are not linked
<seb128> e.g moving one is not going to change the other one
<jibel> Sweetshark, looking
<hikiko> no they aren't, I just thought that it would be nice if the user could lock the sliders in 1 desktop so that he can change the ui_scale and the apps scaling-factor changes accordingly
<hikiko> but ok, I don't think it's necessary
<hikiko> it was just an idea
<seb128> hikiko, yeah, you don't want to start in that direction, especially that one is by-screen and the other one is not
<hikiko> true :)
<jibel> Sweetshark, you need to prepare a test VM before running the tests. You can do it with ./bin/prepare-testbed amd64 . Did you do it and does it exist?
<jibel> Sweetshark, you should have a file called /tmp/adt/disks/pristine-trusty-amd64*.img
<Sweetshark> jibel: I did, but I rebooted. I expected this to survive reboots. Thanks! ;)
<jibel> Sweetshark, you can set another location by adding BASEDIR=<path> in ~/.adtrc . By default it is set to BASEDIR=${TMPDIR:-/tmp}/adt
<Sweetshark> jibel: ok, will consider it next time ...
<jibel> Sweetshark, I'll fix the runner to actually display the error message whne the base image doesn't exists.
<Sweetshark> jibel: that would be nice.
<Laney> seb128: it's slightly buggy
<seb128> Laney, can you comment on the mp? I already added some "would be nice to do that" items
<seb128> e.g it's not ready for this landing round
<Laney> Am doing, just testing a possible fix
<Sweetshark> jibel: now I get "Could not access KVM kernel module: Permission denied\nfailed to initialize KVM: Permission denied\n2014-03-17 12:37:30 PM: Failure: VM failed to start in 180s. Aborting!" on the ./prepare-testbed step. ... but I just see I have packages kept back (including kernel). Doing a dist-upgrade.
<jibel> Sweetshark, is your user member of the group kvm?
<Sweetshark> jibel: hmm, no.
<Sweetshark> jibel: "It worked before" :/
<Laney> there's a bug where that breaks on upgrades
<Laney> restart
<Laney> I've told hallyn about it before but he might want reminding
<Sweetshark> jibel: dist-upgrade seems to have helped
<hikiko> seb128, could you get a look at: https://code.launchpad.net/~hikiko/unity-control-center/u-c-c.apps-slider/+merge/211301 when you have a moment?
<seb128> hikiko, ok
<pitti> Sweetshark: your URL doesn't exist?
<Sweetshark> pitti: already killed, thanks to jibel for helping be out.
<pitti> Sweetshark: ah, saw backscroll now; alles klar!
<Sweetshark> pitti: (gist is like pastebin, but automatically put your stuff in git. and since you logged in anyway, its trivial to kill your snipplets, so no need for giving it a lifetime beforehand. I prefer that.)
<seb128> hikiko, reviewed, commented on the mp, I think you should get input from design though (mpt might be a good person to ask about that)
<mpt> âSup.
<seb128> mpt, https://code.launchpad.net/~hikiko/unity-control-center/u-c-c.apps-slider/+merge/211301
<mpt> Whatâs the easiest way to see what it looks like?
<seb128> mpt, http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/display.png
<mpt> Ah thanks :)
<seb128> mpt, she is adding the "App scale" slider at the bottom
<mpt> Why two scales?
<seb128> mpt, note that for more fun "UI scale" is by-screen, where "App scale" is not
<mpt> Oh dear
<seb128> mpt, because we didn't manage to conciliate both in one slider
<seb128> mpt, GTK handle only int-based scaling number and for all screens
<seb128> so basically GTK scales by 1 or 2
<seb128> Unity/qml scale with more granularity
 * desrt yawns
<seb128> and by screen
<seb128> mpt, that's the best we came with during the vUDS session
<seb128> having the "UI scale" and we suggested a toggle to scale apps that would set the GTK setting to "scale by 2"
<seb128> desrt, good morning!
<desrt> hi :)
<seb128> mpt, sorry, it's one of those ridiculous situation ... in any case if you have any suggestion we would welcome them ;-) (I would go for a checkbox for the GTK setting personally because a slider which does 1-2 is not going to be useful, and I doubt anyone wants to scale to 4)
<hikiko> haha :)
<hikiko> seb128, there are problems with the checkbox though
 * mpt crashes compiz while testing the âUI scaleâ slider
<hikiko> ?
<hikiko> the ui-scale is another slider, you need to install a package
<mpt> So, this panel has some settings that apply to all displays, and some settings that apply just to the currently selected display. They should at least be grouped into sections.
<hikiko> let me find it
<hikiko> yes mpt
<hikiko> maybe I should move the slider first of all
<mpt> hikiko, how much time do you have? :)
<hikiko> mpt I have to fix this before the release, so let's say the end of the week
<hikiko> so that we have 1 more week
<hikiko> for testing
<Laney> This is a user interface breaking change too
<mpt> yes
<Laney> So you need to coordinate with the documentation team
<Laney> (given that we're after User Interface Freeze now)
<hikiko> who should i contact Laney ?
<mpt> hikiko, ok, Iâm going to print this out and work on it this afternoon, and Iâll give you a suggested layout tomorrow morning
<hikiko> that
<hikiko> that sounds great mpt
<larsu> desrt: morning. Can you compile this (with `valac --pkg=gio-2.0 test.vala`) ? http://paste.debian.net/88150/
<seb128> mpt, thanks
<hikiko> thanks!
<Laney> hikiko: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UserInterfaceFreeze
<Laney> â https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess#UserInterfaceFreeze_Exceptions
<seb128> mpt, btw, easier one on https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity-control-center/+bug/1291608 if you have an opinion (I think the icons are a nice touch and we should keep them, but robert_ancell doesn't seem to agree)
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1291608 in unity-control-center (Ubuntu) "No user icons provided / user icons not used" [Medium,Triaged]
<desrt> larsu: this is an interface.  drop the 'override'
<mpt> seb128, I commented on that already
<seb128> mpt, oh, right, I see that
<desrt> larsu: also: you can't subclass simpleactiongroup
<hikiko> thank you Laney :) I will email the list
<seb128> mpt, your suggestion was mine, so you basically recommend 1 ;-)
<larsu> desrt: ah, thanks. Why not?
<desrt> larsu: it's private
<larsu> desrt: gapplication.c does it, no? I simply want a remoteactiongroup wrapper. Why is it so hard?
<seb128> mpt, in fact we made g-c-c and u-c-c co-installable so users can have GNOME and Unity installed on the same machine, but we can't ship the same icons in both or we would have conflicts (or duplicates if we rename) ... anyway, I'm just going to split those in their own binary and make u-c-c recommends it
<mpt> seb128, well sure, but since people are unlikely to install both at once, I donât think you need to worry about the disk space from duplication
<mpt> Oh, I see
<seb128> mpt, it's not disk space ;-)
<mpt> ok
<seb128> ideally we would move the icons to the theme or something
<seb128> or to the artwork package
<desrt> larsu: composition over inheritance :)
<larsu> desrt: still, gapplication inherits from simpleactiongroup
<desrt> no.
<desrt> it composes with it, in fact
<larsu> I mean its exportactions internal thing
<larsu> G_DEFINE_TYPE_WITH_CODE (GApplicationExportedActions, g_application_exported_actions, G_TYPE_SIMPLE_ACTION_GROUP, G_IMPLEMENT_INTERFACE (G_TYPE_REMOTE_ACTION_GROUP, g_application_exported_actions_iface_init))
<seb128> Laney, opinion on making a new binary g-c-c-faces from g-c-c source? (or different naming? or moving those images to an artwork package instead)?
<desrt> that's a wrong composition-style wrapper
<desrt> >:|
<larsu> why?
<desrt> oh wow.
<desrt> huh
<larsu> and can I do the same anyway?
<desrt> simpleactiongroup _is_ subclassable
<desrt> disregard
<desrt> it's gsimpleaction that's not
<larsu> heh, I was about to say after checking the source
<desrt> yes... you can do the same
<larsu> cool. Thanks.
<desrt> but i'll look down on you
<desrt> ...for doing the same thing as i did
 * larsu didn't know not to use 'override' for interfaces
<larsu> desrt: I pretend to be bothered by that
<Laney> seb128: does it just enumerate a directory?
<seb128> Laney, yes
<desrt> larsu: i'm bothered enough for both of us :)
<larsu> haha
<Laney> seb128: ok, seems fine then
<larsu> bbiab, getting some lunch
 * desrt justifies it with some "internal, not API, and would be nicer if we had interface delegation" and gets some coffee
<seb128> Laney, which one? adding a -faces binary to g-c-c and making u-c-c recommends it?
<Laney> yeah
<seb128> thanks
<Laney> If necessary then design could provide some to drop in instead
<seb128> larsu, waouh, you are talking to desrt before he got his coffee now?!
<seb128> Laney, right, but I'm not going to hold on that
<desrt> seb128: not his fault :)
<Laney> sure
<hikiko> mpt, the documentation freeze is on thursday (20th)
<hikiko> so, it would be nice if we submit the change before that
<hikiko> (I think that if the change is not too big, 2 days are enough)
<seb128> hikiko, don't worry about that, mpt said he would have a design recommendation by tomorrow, we can then do the change and ask for an UIFe, should be on track
<hikiko> ok! :)
<larsu> desrt, seb128: it's not?
<desrt> unless we want to add an indicator to status.ubuntu.com
<desrt> [ ] desrt has had coffee yet
<desrt> and then make people responsible to check it
<seb128> ;-)
<larsu> desrt: just change your nick :)
<Laney> Nah, we need a spreadsheet
<Laney> desrt conversation request
<larsu> desrt_nocoffeeyet
<desrt> senkafo
<seb128> interesting
<seb128> https://mail.gnome.org/archives/distributor-list/2014-March/msg00000.html
<seb128> "Evolution moving to an annual schedule"
<ogra_> desrt, hey ho
<desrt> ogra_: hi
<ogra_> desrt, i'm just looking at http://people.canonical.com/~ogra/touch-bootcharts/ubuntu-phablet-trusty-239.png... (thats a phone boot) and notice that there are plenty of short running dbus-daemon processes ... one seems to be started by dconf-service do you know why =
<ogra_> ?
<desrt> fascinating!!
<desrt> so what you describe is impossible, but possible
<ogra_> lol
<desrt> as in, there is a codepath (dbus autolaunching) that does that
<desrt> but it shouldn't happen if DBUS_SESSION_BUS_ADDRESS is set
<desrt> which it ought to be
<desrt> unless somehow this is not being set properly by upstart process launching...
<ogra_> hmm
<desrt> 'cause ya.. that's obviously kinda bogus :)
<ogra_> http://paste.ubuntu.com/7108190/
<ogra_> thats the dbus session upstart job we have
<ogra_> it even exports it via initctl to make sure its there
<desrt> maybe that's not working properly somehow?
<ogra_> hmm
<desrt> also: evil: >$HOME/.cache/upstart/dbus-session
<desrt> use XDG_RUNTIME_DIR for these sorts of files
<desrt> even better: put a symlink there called 'bus'
<desrt> this is what systemd is doing now, iirc
<ogra_> well, i dont think there are many things using that
<ogra_> except for AP tests
<desrt> there will be soon :)
<desrt> (the 'bus' symlink i mean)
<ogra_> with upstart sessions ?
<desrt> we're chatting about changing the dbus spec so that client libraries will look there
<ogra_> we wont see systemd sessions within the next two releases on the phone :)
<desrt> ya.. just saying it would make my life easier (as a client library developer) if upstart and systemd put the socket symlink in the same place
<ogra_> (init yes, user sessions not yet)
<desrt> in the future we hope not to have the environment variable at all
<ogra_> upstart doesnt do that at all ... thats a phone specific hack to give autopilot a chance to grab the session bus address when run via adb
<desrt> ah
<desrt> if it's a hack, that's cool i guess :)
<ogra_> i doubt anything on desktop makes use of it
<ogra_> (though it is available there indeed, since the hack is in a generic upstart job)
<ogra_> anyway, i dont think thats the issue
<ogra_> ogra@styx:~$ adb shell sudo -u phablet -i env|grep DBUS
<ogra_> DBUS_SESSION_BUS_ADDRESS=unix:abstract=/tmp/dbus-EPvS1kiyt2
<ogra_> i get a proper address var in the environment
<desrt> 'proper'
<desrt> typically, if set by the daemon itself, this will have contained the daemon's guid
<desrt> i wonder if that is causing problems, somehow
<desrt> mine looks like this, for example: unix:abstract=/tmp/dbus-XqaPPHcDhr,guid=f5f2bbc7473da60765f0d9325326ef0e
<ogra_> oh
<desrt> also: it's very strange that you use mktemp to create an abstract socket name....
<desrt> since mktemp operates in the filesystem namespace and abstract sockets are not
<ogra_> hmm, true
<desrt> (not suggesting that this is the problem -- but maybe there is a very small security issue here)
<ogra_> ogra@styx:~$ env|grep dbus
<ogra_> DBUS_SESSION_BUS_ADDRESS=unix:abstract=/tmp/dbus-9QLMnQyO6e
<ogra_> thats on my trusty laptop
<Laney> which uses the same job
<ogra_> so we have the same missing guid on desktop too
<ogra_> yeah
<ogra_> now i wonder how you got the guid into your env
<desrt> ogra_: so https://git.gnome.org/browse/glib/tree/gio/gdbusaddress.c#n1003
<desrt> this is likely the codepath that's causing the dbus-daemon to pop into existence
<desrt> this code is hit in two cases
<desrt> first is in the case taht DBUS_SESSION_BUS_ADDRESS is unset
<desrt> second is in the case that it has the string "autolaunch:" in it
<desrt> so i don't think that missing guid would really be a problem
<desrt> unless that causes the address to be rejected and we get a fallback or something
<ogra_> right, but the non abstract socket might
<ogra_> wasnt it so that dbus automatically set that in the past ?
<ogra_> without us having to create a file with mktemp ?
<desrt> yes
 * ogra_ vaguely remembers that starting dbus used to put the socket address into the env itself 
<desrt> i'm not exactly sure why you do it the way you do it now
 * ogra_ neither 
<ogra_> lets see what happens if i comment it :)
<desrt> well
<desrt> you need to get the session bus address one way or the other
<desrt> so that you can push it into the global environment
<desrt> fwiw, i see dbus-using processes spawn off short-lived dbus-daemon processes only if the session bus address is completely unset
<desrt> whcih, of itself, is sort of unexpected
<ogra_> yeah
<desrt> oh wait
<desrt> you don't have X
<desrt> so the autolaunch stuff tries to get the information out of X... which wouldn't work in your case
<ogra_> aha !
<desrt> but again -- it shouldn't do this if the variable is set...
<ogra_> hmm, we used to use dbus-launch in the past
<ogra_> desrt, well, the var is only exported to the upstart session ... not sure it ends up in the actual env during the startup
<ogra_> that might explain why dconf behaves like this
<desrt> ogra_: could also be a race here
<desrt> maybe the environment variable doesn't get set until after all of the initial jobs have been fired up
<ogra_> hmm
<desrt> so later-started processes get it
<desrt> but the early ones don't
<desrt> a simple reading of how that script functions would seem to strongly suggest that, in fact
<desrt> and this is part of why systemd is moving to socket-based activation of the dbus-daemon
<ogra_> we have nothing that starts on "starting dbus" only on "started dbus"
<ogra_> so th evar should be set
<desrt> because otherwise you either need to serialise the entire startup on waiting for dbus-daemon or risk these kinds of races
<desrt> ogra_: but what decides when dconf starts?
<ogra_> dunno, you tell me :)
<desrt> another process trying to use it
<ogra_> oh, wait
<desrt> unless you guys manually start it
<desrt> i have no idea...
<ogra_> that could be lightdm ...
<desrt> lightdm doesn't get on the user's session bus
<desrt> so that's unlikely
<ogra_> we dont use a greeter ... but i can imagine the process still fires it up
<desrt> oh.  this is the greeter session?
<ogra_> well, the bootchart doesnt tell whose dbus it is :)
<ogra_> we dont have a greeter session
<ogra_> we use autologin
<ogra_> but start unity-system-compositor from the usual greeter code
<desrt> ogra_: if i were you, i'd figure out a way to serialise the entire session startup on dbus
<ogra_> mterry, do you know if it could be that lightdm fires up dconf in the "greeter" on the phone ?
<ogra_> thats what we essentially do
<desrt> either take dbus-launch outside of the upstart world (ie: launch upstart from inside of dbus-launch, sort of like we did with gnome-session back in the day) or figure out a way to prevent upstart from doing __anything__ until the dbus job is fully complete
<ogra_> nearly everything starts on started dbus or on something that starts on this event
<mterry> ogra_, probably?
<mterry> ogra_, reading above real quick, I will point out that once the split happens, dbus will be started before upstart for the greeter (not true for user session though)
<ogra_> mterry, i'm trying to figure out why we have multiple dbus-daemons in http://people.canonical.com/~ogra/touch-bootcharts/ubuntu-phablet-trusty-239.png
<desrt> ogra_: could it be that 'started dbus' thinks that dbus is running once the dbus-daemon has established itself on the listener socket but before the initctl has published the variable?
<ogra_> ... after lightdm runs init ...
<mterry> ogra_, this is pre-split?  not sure
<desrt> iirc you do some strange ptrace() stuff to watch for things like daemons listening on sockets in order to know about ready conditions
<ogra_> mterry, this is from today, yes
<mterry> looks like accounts-daemon is getting autostarted
<mterry> for its own little dbus.  huh
<ogra_> yeah, there are several dbus-daemons starting and dieing
<ogra_> *dying
<desrt> content-hub-pee
<desrt> increase bootup speed by reducing washroom breaks of boot-time components?
<ogra_> http://paste.ubuntu.com/7108376/
<ogra_> thats the session dbus log
<ogra_> first line looks interesting
<tsdgeos> i guess getting lcms 2.6 on trusty is not possible?
<seb128> tsdgeos, is that a bugfix version or new serie? how much change over 2.5 (which is what we have)
<tsdgeos> seb128: "Version 2.6 is a featured release that introduces contexts, greatly improves concurrency and minimizes thread contention."
<seb128> that would need a ffe then...
<seb128> not sure how realistic that is or if anyone had a look
<seb128> tkamppeter, ^ do you know about that?
<tsdgeos> it's probably late, but without it programs using poppler and ghostscript in the same process will crash (at least okular does, not sure if/why evince doesn't)
<seb128> tsdgeos, oh, why?
<tsdgeos> seb128: because lcms has the concept of "global memory allocator" and gs sets it, and then when you unload libgs because you're not using it anymore, it's not unset :D
<tsdgeos> 2.6 has the concept of "per plugin memory allocator"
<tsdgeos> so all is nice and dandy
<seb128> hum, k
<seb128> well, I didn't evaluate it but that seems like a non trivial change for that late in the cycle
<tsdgeos> maybe evince just doesn't unload libgs once loaded
<tsdgeos> i may want to just do the same in okular
<tjaalton> new lightdm lock screen doesn't allow to switch to another user anymore
<seb128> tjaalton, it does through the session indicator, except that the unity team screwed the stacking while fixing alt-tab and dash sometime showing over the lock screen
<seb128> so the indicators currently open behind the greeter
<seb128> bschaefer, hey, are you working on fixing that ^? ;-)
<tjaalton> ahah, ok :)
<tjaalton> worth filing a bug still?
<seb128> no
<tjaalton> good
<seb128> tjaalton, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bugs?field.tag=lockscreen
<tjaalton> thanks
<bschaefer> seb128, hmm well yeah, but its been a problem for as long as nux has been around :(
<bschaefer> seb128, it was the issue with the fullscreen windows
<bschaefer> and the locker, as nux assumes all windows to be DOCK type so Fullscreen window stack above it etc etc... == annoying issue :(
<seb128> bschaefer, well, if it turns out we can't implement a secure lock screen with what we have I guess we need to go back to use gnome-screensaver :/
<bschaefer> seb128, im looking at a fix but yeah
<bschaefer> seb128, worst case, we could have fullscreen windows cause indicator issues only ... not ideal
<tkamppeter> seb128, I did not know that.
<tkamppeter> seb128, tsdgeos, but as it is needed to prevent okular from crashing we should really consider and FFE here.
<tsdgeos> tkamppeter: i can give you some pointers if you want
<seb128> tkamppeter, well, there might be another fix/workaround as well
<Laney> Not unloading the plugin is a workaround
<tsdgeos> sure i already said that
<tsdgeos> but then people complain kde uses too much memory ^_^
<tsdgeos> tkamppeter: but since it would probably need a new gs release too, i'll have to do that
<tsdgeos> one thing is updating lcms and the other gs
<Laney> It makes me nervous
<ritz_> tkamppeter, do you work with openprinting ?
<ritz_> seen from https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-maverick-common-printing-dialog
<Laney> Sweetshark: is https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/1286216 done?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1286216 in Ubuntu "[needs-packaging] [FFE] new package libreoffice-dictionaries" [Wishlist,Confirmed]
<tkamppeter> ritz_, yes, I am leading the OpenPrinting project.
<ritz_> tkamppeter, the print dialog spec are not working http://wiki.openusability.org/printing/index.php/Specification
<ritz_> 404
<ritz_> reachable from https://wiki.linuxfoundation.org/en/OpenPrinting/CommonPrintingDialog
<ritz_> I was looking at https://live.gnome.org/GnomeOS/Design/Whiteboards/Printing
<ritz_> this lack any input for auth
<ritz_> context - working on bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/959451 . was trying to see how to implement this
<Sweetshark> Laney: yes: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libreoffice-dictionaries -- closing the bug, thanks for the hint.
<ritz_> tkamppeter, inputs welcome
<Laney> ty
<ritz_> Sweetshark, hi, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libreoffice/+bug/1200277
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1200277 in libreoffice (Ubuntu) "[LibreOffice] - libreoffice-writer.desktop when drag/drop to desktop, 100% broken. " [Medium,Fix committed]
<ritz_> Sweetshark,  how easy is it to include this fix in precise, and lo ppa ?
<ritz_> Sweetshark, nm, I am daft
<Sweetshark> ritz_: its in the ppa already for 4.2 builds -- I assume the precise backport have it too. The fix is also in the libreoffice-3-5 ppa for precise and could be SRUed into precise/main.
<ritz_> Sweetshark++  thanks :)
<tkamppeter> ritz_, unfortunately, the Common Print Dialog project of OpenPrinting has died, due to lack of funding or volunteer coders. In the end I got even Canonical to fund a part which led them to hire larsu, but the other part was supposed to be carried by a German government organization, who originally wanted to fund it, but when Canonical kicked in and I wanted to get everything together, no one at the German government organization an
<tkamppeter> swered my e-mails any more, the project died due to this, I proposed the new functionality of the Common Print Dialog to the existing print dialogs, some features at least got implemented, and larsu got put on other work.
<seb128> Laney, new icons coming for uss, http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/settings.png
<seb128> just as a preview ;-)
<Laney> are they bigger?
<Laney> also, that green...
<seb128> yes
<seb128> well, green is me who picked on variant
<seb128> we are supposed to go dynamic and have all the variants used accorded to the status
<davmor2> seb128: ohhhh pretty
<seb128> Laney, http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/settingsiconsvariant.png
<seb128> I still don't like that theme :-/
<Laney> me neither
<Laney> having one thing coloured like that attracts your attention
<Laney> (going back to the first one)
<Laney> I prefer it without the frames too, but maybe that's me
<davmor2> seb128: ouch that hurt my eyes
<seb128> that's the design
<seb128> http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/settings-menu.png
<seb128> in fact it's slightly better with the bg color on the icons
<seb128> http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/settingscolor.png
<seb128> but still not great
<Laney> what's that previous one?
<seb128> the "settings-menu.png"?
<Laney> yes
<seb128> that's the design mockup
<Laney> I see
<Laney> I like https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SystemSettings?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=phone-settings.mockup.png more with respect to the colours on the battery icon
<Laney> have you tried the larger icons on the phone?
<seb128> not yet
<seb128> I was just validating the icons for tiheum
<seb128> they are in https://code.launchpad.net/~tiheum/ubuntu-themes/suru-icons/+merge/211378 now, I put a landing ask for those
<Laney> do they think the actual screenshot with the dark theme looks good?
<seb128> I'm going to play more with the settings change tomorrow and propose that
<Laney> rather than a mockup
<seb128> he said my screenshot was good
<seb128> but I think it was more validating that it matches the design
<seb128> I plan to not change the theme until they force me into doing it though :p
<Laney> mmm
<Laney> I'd like to push back on the coloured battery icon :(
<Laney> and ideally the frames until we change theme
<Laney> they look alright in the mockup but I don't like it in the light theme
<seb128> right, the frames were to try to get something close to the design to validate the icons
<Laney> did you implement a dynamic icon for battery?
<Laney> that'd be cool actually
<seb128> no
<seb128> indeed
<seb128> well they said we should have dynamic for all icons that are indicators
<Laney> it already has a plugin for the entry component so you should be able to do it
<seb128> the blue battery is going to be in the panel as well
<seb128> yeah
<seb128> I can have a look tomorrow
<Laney> bah, why
<Laney> monochrome is nice there
<seb128> it is
<seb128> I can understand red for low battery
<seb128> but the blue for charged seems pointless
<Laney> when you need to take action
<Laney> like when the session indicator turns red
<Laney> that's fine
<seb128> right
<Laney> Would be nice if these requests happen in public so that I could comment
<Laney> anyway, /me approves libimobiledevice & goes off to climb
<seb128> Laney, have a nice evening!
 * seb128 off for the evening as well
<seb128> time for sport
<tkamppeter> jasoncwarner, hi
<mterry> cyphermox, we don't allow connecting to new networks in unity-greeter, right?
<cyphermox> mterry: not that I know, no. it's lock down at that point
<mterry> cyphermox, OK thanks.  The touch config package will have to poke polkit holes
<cyphermox> possibly?
<cyphermox> I expect not much though
<cyphermox> it's working in desktop it should be almost instantly working in touch too for this
<mterry> robert_ancell, good morning!
<robert_ancell> mterry, hiya
<mterry> robert_ancell, I saw you took the branch.  I tested on my machine with split branches and all that goodness.  Works great in Mir.  Didn't seem to screw up my desktop either
<robert_ancell> yeah, running it here, seems to work well
<mterry> But I didn't run it much on desktop.  Only risk factor would be that we re-set the active session.  But that should always be in sync with VTs on desktop anyway
<mterry> I would think...
<mterry> Especially since opening a new session changes VTs
<mterry> or at least it can
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-03-18
<mterry> robert_ancell, I have another patch I'd like to squeeze into lightdm.  This time having it search XDG_DATA_DIRS for config info (to let OEM team customize image)
<mterry> robert_ancell, haven't written it yet, but wanted to run idea by you
<robert_ancell> mterry, makes sense
<mterry> robert_ancell, cool.  Will whip something by your next morning hopefully
<robert_ancell> mterry, I was thinking about that at one point - we're supposed to always use XDG_DATA_DIRS now right?
<mterry> robert_ancell, ideally
<robert_ancell> I was wondering if we should be using $XDG_CONFIG_DIRS as well - I noticed upstart uses that
<mterry> oh maybe
<GunnarHj> Thanks pitti :)
<pitti> hey GunnarHj; yw!
<hikiko> mpt, hello :)
<hikiko> it seems that marco had already proposed something better than a slider and I wasn't aware
<mpt> hikiko, really? Seems like a slider is the right control to use here. Anyway, itâs the layout thatâs the issue.
<hikiko> hello, the option mirror displays in u-c-c is for any number of displays isn't it?
<hikiko> just to get sure
<hikiko> ok found :) ignore ^
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<hikiko> hi seb128 :)
<seb128> hikiko, hey, how are you?
<hikiko> good, you? :)
<Laney> hey
<hikiko> hi
<seb128> good morning Laney ;-)
<ochosi> morning everyone
<ochosi> seb128: can i quickly ask you something wrt a FFe we're considering?
<seb128> ochosi, hey, sure
<Laney> guten morgen seb128
<ochosi> seb128: thanks! ok, so we're planning another release of light-locker (1.4.0), which introduces one feature ("late locking") and an option that could almost be considered bugfix ("enable/disable lock on suspend", right now it can't be disabled)
<ochosi> seb128: we've already done the last dev release for it and are only waiting for some translations to flow in (maybe until the end of the week). do you think there's a chance for a FFe for this?
<ochosi> seb128: (the alternative would be to backport the "disable lock on suspend" option to the 1.2 series)
<seb128> ochosi, 1.2 is the serie you have in trusty? what are the other changes in the new serie? (e.g what would you left out if you backport that only)
<ochosi> seb128: yes, 1.2 is the series currently in trusty. there are no other changes than the two i mentioned. i know the version step sounds big, but that's all we implemented meanwhile
<seb128> if there no other change the "backport to 1.2" option doesn't really make sense
<seb128> that's basically the same option than taking the new one
<ochosi> well partly we were targetting xubuntu with 1.4, and a small version step for a new feature seemed a bit odd
<seb128> I'm not in the release team but that seems fine for a ffe from where I sit
<seb128> Laney might have more of an opinion, he's in the release team ;-)
<ochosi> sure, thanks your pov :)
<Laney> it should be ok if xubuntu wants it in
<ochosi> yep, already discussed with project lead and one of our other devs to be sure
<seb128> Laney, https://code.launchpad.net/~binli/unity-control-center/1291862/+merge/211258 got updated if you want to give another round of testing
<Laney> I saw
<Laney> will do
<seb128> thanks
<ochosi> thanks for the heads-up Laney and seb128 !
<seb128> yw!
<ochosi> Laney: would it be ok if i asked you for review once the FFe is ready?
<Laney> I'll see it come in
<ochosi> (you can still say "no" then ;))
<ochosi> ok, sure
<tsdgeos> seb128: i think lightdm not starting has to do with it trying to find a self-compiled unity-greeter from back when i did some development in unity-greeter, just that i can't find the file where i changed that now :D
<seb128> tsdgeos, try looking in /etc/lightdm ?
<tsdgeos> did, couldn't find anything, will wait for mterry and ask him
<seb128> tsdgeos, look at /var/log/lightdm/lightdm.log it has the "Loading configuration from..." lines
<seb128> tsdgeos, or maybe you can share that log file?
<tsdgeos> [+4.79s] DEBUG: Session pid=1726: Running command /usr/lib/lightdm/lightdm-greeter-session /home/tsdgeos_work/unity-greeter/src/unity-greeter
<tsdgeos> see
<tsdgeos> i only need to know where that comes from :D
<seb128> can you share the log?
<tsdgeos> ah, found it
<seb128> where was it?
<tsdgeos> so i had changed greeter-session in  /etc/lightdm/lightdm.conf and created a new file under /usr/share/xgreeters/
<seb128> k, that makes sense
<seb128> so it was in /etc/lightdm :p
<tsdgeos> yeah, just the _work grep i was expecting to find was not there
<tsdgeos> so PEBKAC
<seb128> good that you resolved it in any case ;-)
<GunnarHj> Hi seb128, have a minute?
<seb128> GunnarHj, hey, sure
<GunnarHj> seb128: A proposed "What's new" page: http://people.ubuntu.com/~gunnarhj/whats-new.html
<GunnarHj> Could you please review it and let me know if the selection of items is appropriate?
<seb128> oh, thanks for working on that!
<GunnarHj> seb128: There is a small thread about it on the ubuntu-doc mailing list, starting with https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-doc/2014-March/018757.html
<GunnarHj> seb128: We try to cover the 2 years period 12.04 - 14.04.
<seb128> that list seems mostly good
<seb128> it would be good to add a bullet point about Hi-DPI monitors support
<seb128> the scaling option you listed in 2. is part of that
<seb128> but we have scaling support in GTK, libreoffice, chromium as well
<GunnarHj> seb128: In that case somebody needs to propose the wording. I simply don't know enough about it.
<seb128> not sure if the new lock screen is worth mentioning
<seb128> did we add the "disable online sources" for the dash for or after 12.04? (I don't remember)
<GunnarHj> seb128: Isn't the lock screen more a thing behind the scenes?
<seb128> if that was not in 12.04 it might be worth mentioning
<seb128> "behind the scenes" ... well, replacing the grey win95 style password box is quite user visible
<seb128> but yeah, it's not a new feature or anything like that
<GunnarHj> ok :)
<seb128> you can maybe mention work continued to improve the unity look&style
<GunnarHj> Ok, that sounds good.
<seb128> e.g rounded windows decoration, new lock screen, theme tweaks (borderless windows for example)
<GunnarHj> seb128: Anything on the list that you feel is redundant?
<seb128> GunnarHj, 6. is already included in the dash section
<GunnarHj> seb128: Yes, that's true. I'll drop that.
<seb128> you can add a (including music stores, wikipedia, <some useful/popular scopes>) to 4.1. if you feel like highlighting some
<seb128> 7. ... we already had some online integration in 12.04 no?
<qengho> Hiya. This is a weird problem. Sorry. Two keys, Up and Left, on my USB keyboard stopped working.  Not inside Linux. At all, e.g. at GRUB prompt. I plugged in a PS1 keyboard to same computer and it works. I plug the keyboard into another computer, and it works. So, my question, WTF?
<seb128> 9. I think we dropped the remote login from the default installation, so I'm not sure it should be mentioned
<seb128> qengho, usb port buggy? can you use another device (music player, key, phone) in it?
<GunnarHj> seb128: 7. I 'stole' it from "What's new 12.10".
<GunnarHj> seb128: 9. Ok, let's drop remote login.
<seb128> 7.. ok, so 12.10, I knew it was some versions old but I didn't remember the specifics ;-)
<seb128> that's all the comments I have
<GunnarHj> seb128: Thanks! What about the wording of that scaling thing?
<qengho> seb128: could be. Four wires carrying HID protocol and exactly two keys not working?  I'll test it, though.
<seb128> GunnarHj, I don't really know, "Support added for scaling Unity and the applications, which allows a better experience on Hi-DPI screens"
<qengho> Well that is thoroughly unsatisfying. Putting keyboard in original computer, different port worked.  Moving it back to the same USB port, and it works.
<seb128> GunnarHj, you can maybe find details in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Unity/Desktop/14.04/Unity7HighDPI
<seb128> qengho, weird :/
<GunnarHj> seb128: Ok, that page should give sufficient guidance. Thanks!
<qengho> So, having a PS1 plugged in, visiting a different port for a moment, some minutes of cursing, and talking to a frenchman, in aggregate, fixed it.
<seb128> GunnarHj, yw!
<seb128> qengho, could maybe be a loose wire or something, doing contact sometimes after moving it, still weird that would affect only some keys though
<hikiko> seb128, do you know if ff and libreoffice and thunderbird pay attention to text-scaling-factor or scaling-factor or who should I ask?
<seb128> hikiko, I don't know, libreoffice -> Sweetsha1k , tb -> chrisccoulson
<hikiko> Sweetsha1k, hello! could you please tell me this ^^
<Sweetsha1k> LibreOffice has its own font scaling factor see Tools->Options LibreOffice->View->User interface scaling, there is no decision yet on syncing that from Unity (by unity writing in the LibreOffice profile).
<hikiko> thanks Sweetsha1k :)
<cyphermox> Laney: what's this about modify.own on bug 1116317?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1116317 in network-manager-applet (Ubuntu Precise) "[ffe] allow option to create user connections by default" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1116317
<cyphermox> also, I didn't add DEP-3 tags because I took the patch straight from Debian, I want to avoid merging this when it comes to merging from Debian next time, which should be as soon as U opens, pretty much
<Laney> cyphermox: It's in the description
<Laney> tags let anyone that's not cyphermox see where it came from
<Laney> are they hard to merge?
<cyphermox> no ;)
<cyphermox> just a smaller diff makes my life easier ;)
<cyphermox> the modify.own explicitly should not be in the package
<cyphermox> it's custom policy for those enterprises that really want to lock down NM
<cyphermox> this just allows nm-applet to honor such configurations the right way rather than not allow you to configure the connection at all as the user, since it defaults to system-wide
<Laney> ya, I just mean that it's not checked for explicitly in the patch (compared to the old version which did)
<Laney> It sounded to me like you had to change that setting but it is actually the default
<Laney> headers could go in debian too btw if you can commit there ;-)
<Laney> if not, you should probably get that access
<GunnarHj> pitti: relaxed dependencies?
<pitti> GunnarHj: only recommend it, or perhaps better with [i386 amd64 ...] (i. e. arches where LibO is available)
<pitti> [i386 amd64 armhf powerpc]
<pitti> GunnarHj: ^ but that list ist a bit icky to maintain, and won't sync to debian
<pitti> GunnarHj: hence i was wondering why a thesaurus would need a hard dependency on LibO
<pitti> shouldn't that rather be "Enhances:" or Suggests:?
<GunnarHj> pitti: Well, it does not need anything. It's just two text files.
<pitti> GunnarHj: right, so dropping it to suggests shoudl be ok?
<pitti> GunnarHj: oh, and Architecture: should be "all", not "any"
<GunnarHj> pitti: Absolutely. Should I do it in Ubuntu only for now?
<pitti> GunnarHj: unless these have some binary stuff in there which is arch dependent?
<pitti> GunnarHj: no, I think that can go to Debian
<GunnarHj> pitti: I understand about "all". Wondered about all those different debs...
<pitti> GunnarHj: sorry, I missed that during review
<GunnarHj> pitti: Now I'm going to remember it. :)
<pitti> GunnarHj: do you want to prep an update? I'll sponsor it right away (you can just send me a pastebin, or via mail, etc.; as easy as possible)
<GunnarHj> pitti: Ok, I'll prepare it. Stand by.
<pitti> GunnarHj: thanks!
<GunnarHj> pitti: Thank *you*.
<Laney> oh neat, you got that in
<pitti> Laney: yes, we just need to appease britney a bit :)
<Laney> ya, looking at that Enhances sounds good
<GunnarHj> pitti, Laney: Just a thought... I didn't invent that recommend myself - I copied and pasted from some other mythes-*. Can it possibly be that changing from "any" to "all" is sufficient?
<pitti> GunnarHj: yes, I suppose it is
<pitti> still curious how that got through britney, as regardless of its arch that dep remains unsatisfiable on those arches
<pitti> but presumably britney special-cases that
<GunnarHj> pitti: I have no idea.
<pitti> GunnarHj: so for now, let's fix it to Arch: all
<GunnarHj> pitti: Ok.
<Laney> there's some special-casing of arch:all in britney
<Laney> so it probably works
<mterry> seb128, the new lockscreen in 14.04 doesn't work for me.  It never accepts my password.  Is that a known bug?
<seb128> mterry, no
<pitti> WFM
<seb128> mterry, do you have some weird chars that nux might not like? e.G can you type all the chars from your password in e.g the dash?
<GunnarHj> pitti: http://people.ubuntu.com/~gunnarhj/mythes-sv_new-arch.patch.txt
<mterry> seb128, yeah
<mterry> seb128, everything is on the keyboard
<mterry> i.e. no composing
<seb128> mterry, your keyboard layout is right (check the indicator)
<seb128> ?
<seb128> mterry, do you have any error in the .cache/upstart/compiz.log ?
<pitti> mterry: is your /etc/shadow root:shadow 640, or did that perhaps get changed?
<pitti> mterry: (sometimes happened to me when restoring backups)
<pitti> GunnarHj: built/uploaded to sid; I'll sync this evening or tomorrow morning
<GunnarHj> pitti: Thank you very much, Martin!
<pitti> thanks to yo
<mterry> Uh, I'd have to kill my session to double-check it, but I don't remember seeing another layout in there (I do have a second chinese layout for testing configured, so it's possible it screwed that up...)
<mterry> seb128, also, how is one supposed to switch to another user from the lockscreen?
<mterry> seb128, none of the indicators open for me
<pitti> the indicator worked for me, but it's not very discoverable
<pitti> it ought to be similar to lightdm, that'd be nicer
<seb128> mterry, using the indicators, once they fix the stacking regression issues you just described (which they added when fixed the "dash sometime open in front of the lock screen)
<seb128> pitti, similar? like listing different users
<seb128> ?
<pitti> seb128: perhaps, but at least some directly visible "switch to other user"
<pitti> like in the old screen saver
<seb128> mterry, you can probably keyboard browse it though :p
<seb128> pitti, right, that would be nice. The "list other users" is tricky because you don't want to type your password in a process owned by another user :p
<pitti> seb128: right, and you can't even (I even wonder how it does that for your own user -- there must be some setgid shadow helper involved?)
<pitti> probably unix_checkpwd
<mterry> pitti, seb128: ok, /etc/shadow is good.  Looking at compiz.log
<mterry> seb128, I don't have a compiz.log?
<seb128> mterry, sorry, it's in gnome-session-ubuntu.log
<mterry> seb128, trying to dig through the file.  We don't use gnome-screensaver anymore with this, right?  This is in-shell?
<seb128> sort of
<seb128> depends for what, the lock screen/unlocking is in unity yes
<seb128> we still use gnome-screensaver for idle tracking and starting lock
<seb128> e.g we didn't replace those part, we just changed g-s to trigger the unity lock when it was displaying it's gtk dialog before
<mterry> seb128, I don't see anything in the log
<seb128> k, dunno then :/
<seb128> note that you can change the lock screen back to gnome-screensaver in ccsm
<seb128> if you want to verify that g-s takes your password fine
<mterry> seb128, is that "None"?  (I get lightdm, unity, or none)
 * mterry sticks with LightDM, since None is apparently really None
<seb128> mterry, lightdm is g-s I think?
<mterry> seb128, no it took me right to lightdm itself
<mterry> Kinda nice
<seb128> hum
<seb128> you might be able to run XDG_CURRENT_DESKTOP=GNOME gnome-screensaver-daemon or something
<seb128> if you want to test typing your password to g-s
<seb128> but otherwise you need to find andyrock to debug unity not take your password I guess
<andyrock> actually none should allow you to use g-s
<andyrock> g-s should be smart enough to detect that unity is not locking
<seb128> andyrock, do you have any hint on how to debug password not being accepted by unity lock screen? seems to happen to mterry
<andyrock> seb128, let's start from the lightdm pam
<andyrock> maybe he's using a different module?
<mterry> andyrock, when I did None and locked screen nothing happened
<seb128> andyrock, how do you know which one is being used?
<andyrock> mterry, well i added that before Trevinho integrated unity with g-s
<seb128> it's likely that mterry tweaked his pam config, he has been working around component using it
<mterry> seb128, that's fair...  I don't remember what I would have done, but it's possible
<andyrock> we use lightdm pam config file
<seb128> andyrock, btw are you working on all those bugs tagged lockscreen? like the "lock again when coming from the greeter"?
<andyrock> yep not know
<andyrock> during the afternoon
<andyrock> *now
<andyrock> mterry, can you pastebin the content of  /etc/pam.d/lightdm ?
<mterry> andyrock, http://paste.ubuntu.com/7114270/
<andyrock> mterry, lightdm works fine?
<mterry> andyrock, seems to
<andyrock> but it fails to unlock or it says that the password is not correct?
<andyrock> mterry, ^^^
<mterry> andyrock, the lockscreen does.  It spins for a bit then says invalid password
<andyrock> that's weird... i did some tests in the last week (just on my system, not in trunk!) and it happened that nux doubled some chars
<andyrock> at the moment there is no way do debug it without building unity
<seb128> oh, it's meeting time!
<Sweetshark> Hammerzeit!
<desrt> can't touch this
<seb128> qengho, Sweetshark, mlankhorst, laney, tkamppeter, desrt, larsu, kenvandine: hey
<mlankhorst> hey
 * kenvandine waves
<seb128> I hope everybody is back to bugfixing after ff backlog and vUDS ;-)
<seb128> let's get started
<seb128> no qengho?
<seb128> Sweetshark, ok, you start I guess then ;-)
<kenvandine> "bug fixing" :)
<qengho> Bah, network flaky.
<qengho> My turn?
<Sweetshark> qengho: go
<Sweetshark> (me still collects bug refs)
<qengho> Done: direct-mode touch devices seem to work in Chromium Dev line now. Backporti
<qengho> ng it to Beta line, which should be landing at end of month.
<qengho> Done: publishing Cr 33.0.1750.152 to security now.
<qengho> To-do: gestures don't work for dependent-mode touch devices yet.
<qengho> To-do: polish Cr patches so they're accepted upstream.
<qengho> EOF
<seb128> qengho, is the version that landed recently in trusty including touch support?
<qengho> seb128: no. The diffs to that are too big.  I can't backport that far without lots of bugs.
<seb128> k
<seb128> so it's not going to be in trusty at this point I guess?
<seb128> what's the plan? get those upstream and flowing back with some update later on?
<qengho> Yes.  End of this month, 34 is promoted to Stable. That will have all.
<seb128> great, so maybe even for trusty release ;-)
<seb128> qengho, thanks
<seb128> Sweetshark, your turn this time!
<Sweetshark> k
<Sweetshark> - upstream Writer 4.2 regression sweep
<Sweetshark> -- fixed table zoom crash fdo#74854
<Sweetshark> -- found and triaged table cut-undo and insert row crashes, fixed thanks to Miklos now fdo#75898 fdo#75110
<Sweetshark> -- all confirmed, open Writer 4.2 regressions triaged now (5 regressions, 3 inherited from AOO work) => looking good in general
<Sweetshark> - looked at some old regressions (introduced in4.1 and older)
<Sweetshark> -- fixed cant shrink graphic regression (orgin: AOO again) 	fdo#47355
<Sweetshark> -- fixed broken table refs fdo#75492
<Sweetshark> - fixed autopkgtests
<Sweetshark> -- fixed local running tests first. Unfortunately, that didnt mean they also run happily in the VM.
<Sweetshark> -- fixed them there too, should be alright now -- waiting for PPA build to finisto confirm
<Sweetshark> - looked at regression count in other apps too
<Sweetshark> - Investigated options for HiDPI setting sync from Unity (vUDS session)
<Sweetshark> - bumped to upstream 4.2.3~rc1
<Sweetshark> - Ongoing: triaging "Send Document as Mail" brokeness -- bug 1217191
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1217191 in libreoffice (Ubuntu) ""Send document as Open Document Text" fails to attach doc when using Thunderbird" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1217191
<Sweetshark> - Ongoing: Hackfest Gran Canaria preparations https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Hackfest/GranCanaria2014
<Sweetshark> EOF
<Sweetshark> (well, and quite a bit of additional bibisect/triage work in writer)
<desrt> Sweetshark: how does one get invited to said hackfest? ;)
<seb128> Sweetshark, do you need sponsoring for the 4.2.3~rc1?
<seb128> Sweetshark, and yeah, I see how you guys pick your hackfest locations!
<Sweetshark> seb128: I want the autopkgtests and the mail issue still in there.
<seb128> k
<seb128> let me know when you need sponsoring
<Sweetshark> seb128: also: its an rc1 -- shouldnt be an issue, but ...
<desrt> seb128: aruiz has his name on this list... i suspect this may have something to do with it :)
<Sweetshark> desrt: there is still travel sponsoring available. just contribute to LO and ask ;) (that said: europeans have it cheaper to that location, so ...)
<seb128> Sweetshark, btw I pinged about the dmb application, bdrung is busy and he didn't want to keep blocking it so he bounced back to them to have it re-evaluated, with some luck it's going to be ok this time!
<seb128> desrt, haha
<Sweetshark> oh, speaking of which: some GSOC mentoring.
<Sweetshark> seb128: cool
<seb128> Sweetshark, thanks
<seb128> mlankhorst, hey
<mlankhorst> bugsquashing, keeping the xorg workqueue from exploding, fixing crash bug on shutdown with optimus, updating wine to 1.6.2 (needs sponsoring), upstream kernel work + testing (ati + snb optimus appears to work again :D), taking a look at all piglit crasher bugs in mesa.git.
<mlankhorst> hope that didn't get cut off :P
<Sweetshark> desrt: aruiz and the fact that a/ Las Palmas uses LibreOffice, while b/ the rest of GC uses OpenOffice still both have nothing to do with that.
<mlankhorst> but piglit has no crashers on my system now, going to look at intel and ati next.
<desrt> :)
<seb128> that didn't
<mlankhorst> ^D
<seb128> mlankhorst, I saw quite a fix segfault in the e.u.c daily reports, I guess that's what you are focussing on in the next weeks?
<mlankhorst> seb128: the most common one appears to be lack of xv support in fglrx
<mlankhorst> at least that's my guess
<mlankhorst> was getting 100 dupes of that bug :P
<seb128> k
<mlankhorst> oh speaking of which another one
<seb128> do we have people talking to amd about those?
<mlankhorst> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/fglrx-installer/+bug/1279412
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1279412 in fglrx-installer (Ubuntu) "Xorg crashed with SIGABRT in xdl_xs115_atiddxPixmapIsTypeOf()" [Critical,Triaged]
<mlankhorst> yeah i poked them
<mlankhorst> tseliot: ?
<seb128> cool
<seb128> we don't have contact at virtualbox by any chance?
<seb128> quite some reports in trusty from issues with their gl drivers
<mlankhorst> not that I know :s
<seb128> k
<seb128> mlankhorst, thanks
<seb128> laney: your turn (I wonder why my xchat tab complet 2 laneys there)
<Laney> you can't have too many laneys
<Laney> â¢ Short week due to holidays
<Laney> â¢ GNOME updates: glib webkit librsvg
<Laney> â¢ cross-building breakage with Qt 5.2; fix building
<Laney> â¢ Upload qcreator-plugin-cmake for upgrade failure
<Laney> â¢ Review many FFes
<kenvandine> because Laney is twice as cool as seb128?
 * kenvandine ducks
<seb128> kenvandine, I'm going to show you :p
<mlankhorst> less than half as cool, which is why you need 2 ;D
<kenvandine> mlankhorst, better math then me :)
<seb128> haha
<seb128> Laney: how are things looking from the FFe front to you? (and for the release)
 * seb128 is still a bit nervous about the new lock screen
<Laney> I'm just parallelised
<seb128> not sure that's going to be good enough for release
<Laney> I don't see much for desktop remaining
<Laney> cyphermox wants to make NM use user connections
<seb128> that, and there is the Ubuntu GNOME ffe for gnome-desktop 3.10 which seems risky as well
<Laney> and there's the gnome-desktop one
<seb128> right
<seb128> laney: no cool utf8 end of list char this week? ;-)
<Laney> It feels too risky, I'd probably rather they just do that on unctuous unicorn day 1
<Laney> no I was fiddling with glib until the last second :(
<seb128> yeah, that's my take too, not going to make the GNOME guys happy though
<Laney> you put one in yours though :P
<Laney> I usually use this list http://unicodeemoticons.com/cool_text_icons_and_pictures.htm
<seb128> laney: thanks (to both of you :p)
<tkamppeter> 14.10 will be unctuous unicorn?
<ritz> lol
<seb128> tkamppeter, who knows ;-)
<seb128> tkamppeter, your turn btw ;-)
<mlankhorst> pssh unicorns
<kenvandine> it's that time in the cycle where everyone has fun speculating
<tkamppeter> - Google Summer of Code 2014: Got first student applications, especially IPP-over-USB support for Linux will get done by one or two students who already did several GSoCs successfully for us.
<tkamppeter> - cups-filters: 1.0.47 and 1.0.48 with security fixes and several other bug fixes including a crasher in cups-browsed.
<tkamppeter> - ghostscript: As there was no new upstream release before FF, backported important upstream fixes to our package.
<tkamppeter> - HPLIP: 3.14.3 upstream release with many bug fixes.
<tkamppeter> - system-config-printer: Additional fix for driver auto-download.
<tkamppeter> - Bugs.
<mlankhorst> Laney: I've upgraded my bike to a draft horse btw >:D
<seb128> tkamppeter, thanks
<seb128> desrt, your turn ;-)
<tseliot> mlankhorst: sorry, I'm fighting with a different issue on my amd system
<desrt> upstream bug fixing, releases
<desrt> reviews, various bits of ubuntu bug hunting
<desrt> jhbuild hacking and cleaning up (environment handling, mostly -- fixed debian multiarch, python path issues, finally killing off ACLOCAL_PATH, gnome-common fixes, etc.)
<desrt> helped a few potential SoC students find their way
<desrt> lots of portability fixes in various projects in the past weeks
<desrt> branched glib
<desrt> going to start looking at mainloop again
<desrt> fin.
<desrt> seb128: did we start seeing less of that u-s-d crasher in the past days?
<seb128> desrt, I'm trying to check
<seb128> but I might just get back to you at the end of the meeting for that :p
<desrt> :)
<seb128> desrt, thanks
<seb128> no attente, he's on holidays until thursday
<seb128> larsu, so your turn
<larsu> k
<larsu> - finished up rhythmbox menus after design input
<larsu> - evince: added back secondary keybindings; some other smaller bug fixes related to the menubar patch
<larsu> - sound: show a red icon when muted and sound is playing, fix volume notification when allow-amplified is on, fix volume-slider-clicking issues, don't show players on greeter
<larsu> - some fixes to the theme
<larsu> - we now have lock screen profiles for indicators
<larsu> I think that's about it
<seb128> larsu, thanks
<seb128> good work on the themes and classic menus for those apps ;-)
<larsu> thanks
<desrt> seb128: yr turn!
<seb128> desrt, no, kenvandine's first :p
<desrt> oh.  right!
<kenvandine> haha :)
<larsu> desrt: ts ts ts
<kenvandine> Content hub branches are all queued up for review and pending a silo request, hopefully tomorrow.  Some of the packages including in the silo request are locked by other silos right now.
<kenvandine>  * Link instead of copy content whenever possible
<kenvandine>  * Quiet the debug output by default
<kenvandine>  * Fix for handling legacy apps as default instead of only click
<kenvandine>  * Fix for app switching on aborted transfers
<kenvandine>  
<kenvandine> Other stuff:
<kenvandine>  * Updated wallpapers for 14.04
<kenvandine>  * Precise SRU for gwibber
<kenvandine>  * Working on a POC for showing click installed wallpapers in ubuntu-system-settings
<kenvandine>  /EOF
<seb128> oh, click wallpapers
<seb128> I didn't know that's a thing :p
<kenvandine> hehe
<seb128> I saw your content-hub u-s-s merge request, but I'm unsure how to test it
<kenvandine> they want to be able to get click packages for wallpapers into the store
<seb128> I think I'm just going to approve it from review and test when it's in the silo
<kenvandine> seb128, that'll be in the silo request
<seb128> that sounds cool
<desrt> silos... trains...
<desrt> sometimes i wonder what's going on
<seb128> do they also plan to include some by default? ;-)
<kenvandine> i sure hope so!
<seb128> desrt, didrocks making us love the train (for those who didn't already before)
 * kenvandine is an american, what's a train? :-p
<didrocks> kenvandine: for Europe only :p
<desrt> canada is currently having a problem with too much wheat in silos and not enough trains
<seb128> desrt, the new CI basically give you a "silo ppa" with a build of all the things that you asked to land, makes testing on any arch much easier
<desrt> neat
<kenvandine> seb128, our silo request includes several packages that are currently locked by other silos
<kenvandine> so we're waiting on those
<seb128> kenvandine, going to be fun, like u-s-s I want to put some land request today as well
<kenvandine> we have sooooo many branches queued up
<kenvandine> gotta get it landed!
<seb128> good luck landing that ;-)
<seb128> yeah
<seb128> kenvandine, thanks
<seb128> ok, this time my turn
<seb128> â¢ quite some testing of fixes from others, helped to land those through sponsoring or CI train (eog, nautilus, gnome-icon-theme symbolic, evince, rhythmbox, glib, ubuntu-themes, indicators, ...)
<seb128> â¢ quite some bug triage to see what should be fixed for release
<seb128> â¢ hosted vUDS client-1 track
<seb128> â¢ some ubuntu-system-settings reviews
<seb128> â¢ tested new settings icon for touch, started using them in u-s-s
<seb128> â¢ desktop bugs fixing (mostly unity-control-center)
<seb128> â
<desrt> rook?
<kenvandine> â
<seb128> desrt, indeed, it's a nice move :)
<desrt> seb128: would be nice to hear about the u-c-c accounts and u-s-d gsettings things when you know
<seb128> desrt, yeah, I'm on it
<seb128> ok, any other topic?
<desrt> this was a very short and efficiently-run meeting.  congratulations everyone.
<seb128> thanks everyone!
<kenvandine> seb128 rocks! :-D
<desrt> i think in the future we should have all of our meeting without attente.
<seb128> lol
<seb128> that's mean :p
<desrt> post hoc, baby
<kenvandine> mpt, any thoughts on how click installed wallpapers should be shown in uss?  I assume not under Ubuntu Art or Custom
<seb128> desrt, https://errors.ubuntu.com/problem/3f51cd3b1862122d4df85b44bf6c30245e8e4a76 suggests there has been no recent report of the gsettings issue, but it's not that frequent/we don't have that many trusty users, so I'm going to keep watching it for a bit
<mpt> kenvandine, what is a âclick installed wallpaperâ?
<kenvandine> extra wallpapers installed from the click store
<kenvandine> so not part of a default set
<mpt> urg
<desrt> seb128: k.  thanks.
<desrt> lunch time :D
<seb128> desrt, enjoy!
<mpt> kenvandine, is it possible to delete those individually after the package is installed?
<mpt> E.g. if the package installs 20 of them, can you delete 4 of them without things blowing up?
<kenvandine> it's just code... i could make that possible :)
<kenvandine> however, i think i'd rather guide the user to remove the package...
<mpt> kenvandine, itâs just that if the answer was yes, they could go into âCustomâ, but if the answer is no, probably they need their own section.
<kenvandine> i was thinking each package could provide a "set"
<mpt> That makes sense
<mpt> with its own heading
<kenvandine> maybe collapsed by default, but you could view the set
<mpt> yep
<kenvandine> so the click package could provide metadata, including a title for their set
<kenvandine> and that would show up under some "Extras" section or something
<mpt> Or just at the top level
<mpt> Ubuntu Art, Foo, Bar, Custom
<kenvandine> i worry about noise... my kids must have like 30 of these sets installed in android
<mpt> (where Foo and Bar were installed)
<kenvandine> that's a lot of sections
<kenvandine> most of the android ones include their own UI for setting the wallpaper, but i'd rather that be done in uss
<kenvandine> in fact, that has to be done in uss... since confined apps can't change those settings
<mpt> kenvandine, even 30 isnât a long list if theyâre all collapsed by default. And if it becomes a problem we can make an âExtrasâ category with package subcategories later.
<kenvandine> mhall119, FYI ^^ specifically the bit about metadata and a title for the set
<kenvandine> mpt, ok, maybe Extras should be below custom?
<mpt> kenvandine, I donât think so, theyâre more similar to Ubuntu Art than they are to Custom
<kenvandine> ok
<mpt> And if this is going to be possible, perhaps Custom should be renamed to something more specific (not sure what yet)
<kenvandine> mpt, maybe ubuntu art and custom should be collapsable too?
<mpt> yes indeed
<mpt> good idea
<kenvandine> just not by default
<kenvandine> ok... great
<kenvandine> mpt, mind updating the designs when you have time?
<mpt> Can you report a bug for the design changes, please?
<kenvandine> sure
<mpt> thanks
<mhall119> kenvandine: how far back should I start reading?
<kenvandine> mhall119, basically we're thinking we'd have the click packages provide a title for the wallpaper "set" which would be a section title in system settings
<kenvandine> then you could browse just the wallpapers in that set
<mhall119> kenvandine: can the click package's title be used as the "set" name?
<mhall119> so "Trusty Wallpapers" in the example click I gave you would be the same of that set
<kenvandine> sure
<kenvandine> wfm
<kenvandine> mpt, bug 1294203
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1294203 in ubuntu-system-settings (Ubuntu) "[backgrounds] Provide UI for handling click installed wallpaper sets" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1294203
<kenvandine> mhall119, add your 0.02 there too :)
<mhall119> kenvandine: also, eventually we'll want a way for users to uninstall these wallpaper packages
<kenvandine> yeah
<kenvandine> so maybe that could be an action when your viewing one of those sets
<mpt> thanks
<mhall119> will these packages be shown in and installable from the Applications lens?
<kenvandine> mhall119, please comment on that bug so mpt can also think about what the UI would look like for that
<kenvandine> mhall119, no idea... i haven't thought about that yet
<kenvandine> i know it was discussed during uds...
<mpt> Even if it is the first example of the inadvisability of managing all software from an âapplication lensâ, it wonât be the lastâ¦
<trem> didrocks: ping ?
<trem> hi all
<didrocks> hey trem
<seb128> trem, hey, please state your question rather than using "ping", others might be able to help you (and didrocks might be able to decide if he has spare cycles to reply or not)
<didrocks> yeah
<didrocks> was going to tell the same thing :)
<didrocks> -> back to work
<trem> But I don't have a question, I just want to talk to didrocks ;)
<seb128> trem, take a ticket, there is a waiting queue, it's like wanting to talk to  the prime minister, those are busy people :p
<trem> ohhhhhhhhhh
<trem> I wasn't aware that didrocks has the same planning as the prime minister
<trem> ;)
<seb128> the prime minister might be less busy in fact :p
<seb128> desrt, the account change seems to work fine, tested lock/unlock/changing password for one user and another/changing login mode/changing realname
<trem> but didrocks works on desktop, is it really complex and difficult ? ;)
<desrt> party
<desrt> hopefully they sort it out upstrem as well
<seb128> yeah, I'm going to comment on there as well
<seb128> trem, there are quite some work ongoing, he's also working on ubuntu touch images
<seb128> trem, you should just write him what you want to write though ;-)
<trem> seb128: it"s not really important, I can wait
<trem> I won't bother the prime minister for such thing ;)
<seb128> trem, those behaviour are not really helpful, if you have something to say just write it, or you can wait forver
<seb128> others might be able to help you as well
<trem> seb128: I don't need help, just want to talk (in private) with didrocks
<seb128> trem, well, then don't use a channel but /query
<trem> otherwise, I agree with you (100%) that I should ask my question on the chan
<trem> seb128: a little hello before a query may be nice
<cyphermox> Laney: I think you're misunderstanding that bug, it's just allowing people to use a locked down policykit policy, not actually changing any kind of default in the desktop
<seb128> trem, yeah, you might never get to talk to him if you insist on your behaviour, anyway I tried to help but seems like you prefer your way so good luck ;-)
<Laney> cyphermox: I do
<Laney> It lets you create connections if you are denied the modify.system permission
<cyphermox> right
<cyphermox> which shouldn't happen on desktop normally
<cyphermox> don't get me wrong I'm adding the DEP-3 tags now :)
<cyphermox> I just get worried when I see "change blah", because it's not really changing anything of the standard behavior on desktop, you'd normally have the permissions you need to create connections. It's only for enterprise locked-down setups
<Laney> Who has the modify.system and modify.own privileges by default currently?
<Laney> I think it's admin/sudo & active for the former and active for the latter
<Laney> (what I was getting at with that is that AFAICS it does change behaviour for the non-admin case)
<bjf> bug 1291939 makes using dark backround terminal windows very difficult to use
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1291939 in ubuntu-themes (Ubuntu) "window borders are now missing meaning overlapping windows of the same type have no separation, and no separation from the background" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1291939
<cyphermox> Laney: in desktop, you have modify.own active by default and modify.system for sudo, but active via a polkit rule if you're in the admin or sudo group
<cyphermox> so all standard installs end up being using the modify.system action
<Laney> Until you have another user who isn't an admin
<Laney> I don't really think that's an enterprise-only case
<cyphermox> it is
<cyphermox> on a standard desktop, if you're not admin,
<cyphermox> you just will get thrown out by NM
<Laney> even after this patch?
<cyphermox> not with this patch
<Laney> That's what I was getting at
<cyphermox> the patch introduces proper behavior
<Laney> so it is a change for this use-case
<Laney> it's a /good/ change
<cyphermox> bugfix there.
<Laney> but still, something to look out for
<cyphermox> agree, but I really do want to stress that this is what NM should always have been doing, and anything else is absolutely very wrong, even if someone did rely on it before
<cyphermox> people who lock down a system and know what they are doing actually change the polkit rules
<cyphermox> anything else we can just tell people to not do that
<cyphermox> I usually like the make it easy on people, but this is really really wrong not implemented as such, and I've been getting lots of request to fix it, esp. in LTS
<Laney> It's fine to fix it, that's why I approved the request
<cyphermox> thanks :)
<cyphermox> so we're just arguing shmemantics
<Laney> but I do not agree that non-admin users is a niche or enterprise or unsupported thing, if that's what you are arguing
<cyphermox> no
<cyphermox> just that there is a right way to do it
<Laney> wifi should work for them, indeed
<cyphermox> and that the current behavior is fundamentally broken for enterprise users where we've seen this kind of lock down being done
<cyphermox> (with actual bug reports)
<cyphermox> I wholeheartedly agree about giving my kids a non-admin account ;)
<cyphermox> the bofh in me will assign a user as soon as a nick is decided for the newborn :D
<Laney> wait
<cyphermox> Laney: also, manual milestone tests?
<Laney> there's a newborn?
<cyphermox> Laney: no, there isn't
<Laney> haha
<Laney> i got excited
<cyphermox> haha not yet ;)
<Laney> http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/testcases/1436/info
<Laney> that's what I was referring to
<Laney> just a suggestion though
<cyphermox> tbh I would like to move to a bigger place first, and that's being planned, and probably soon after
<cyphermox> alright
<cyphermox> it's kind of involved for a generic post-installation test
<cyphermox> maybe more for an OEM kind of install?
<cyphermox> not that it's irrelevant, just a more likely use case there
<cyphermox> since it involves messing with polkit rules and all
<Laney> I mean a test that says "non admin users can add new wifi connections"
<Laney> right, I'm offski
<Laney> ttyl!
<seb128> laney: have fun
<seb128> mterry, your pagination branch still gives me a criss-cross merge with a conflict :/
<mterry> seb128, :-/
<seb128> mterry, the other branch is about to be merged back to trunk, that might make easier to rebase?
<mterry> seb128, yeah not sure why that is happening.  I merged in custom-pages again
<mterry> Saw and resolved the conflict
<seb128> right, it's the bzr
<seb128> I don't know :p
<ochosi> larsu: gah, you changed the icon-name from "blocking" to "blocked" here, so ubuntu-mono and other icon themes won't show the icon you're expecting: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~larsu/indicator-sound/lp1291530/revision/422
<ochosi> or can anyone on unity with the sound-indicator confirm that this actually works? (without cheating and changing the icon-name ;))
<ochosi> seb128: since you reported the bug, for some odd reason i can't seem to be able to find the spec: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/indicator-sound/+bug/1291530
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1291530 in indicator-sound (Ubuntu) "Icon doesn't turn red when sound is played while muted" [Low,Fix released]
<ochosi> it seems odd that the spec should refer to "audio-volume-muted-panel" as the icon name for the blocked state (i.e. red icon)
<ochosi> when it should be either "audio-volume-muted-blocking-panel" (as ubuntu-mono-icons suggest) or "audio-volume-muted-blocked-panel" (as larsu's patch suggests)
<robert_ancell> bregma, are there any plans for unity-greeter and hidpi?
<bschaefer> robert_ancell, for the lockscreen? Yes, im almost done with the HiDPI just the dam background is a little tricky :)
<robert_ancell> bschaefer, not the lockscreen but the greeter
<bschaefer> o the greeter...
<bschaefer> hmm, i've not looked at that ;)
<robert_ancell> bschaefer, yeah, I figured it had been forgotten about!
<robert_ancell> bschaefer, I figure we just need to increase the grid size and the font size when we cross a resolution/dpi threshold
<bschaefer> robert_ancell, :(, we weren't able to get scroll bars either....
<bregma> robert_ancell, not forgoteen, just postponed
<robert_ancell> ok
<bregma> HDPI is a feature that went form "don't do anything in 14.04" to "why isn;t everything perfect yet?" in less than 3 months
<robert_ancell> bregma, that's never happened at canonical before
<bschaefer> robert_ancell, also for hidpi we need to adjust the login user box, and Ill have to look at how the panel is done. (As I think the panel for the greeter comes up before unity?)
<robert_ancell> bschaefer, yeah, the greeter shows before unity
<bschaefer> it'll be interesting as we'll have to increase the panel + each entry as well
<bschaefer> we could also focus on the box + text + background as well
<bschaefer> robert_ancell, also the logo image is a png... im not sure how easy it would be to get an svg for that (but it doesn't look good scaled :)
<robert_ancell> bschaefer, oh yeah, xnox wanted to fix that
<bschaefer> robert_ancell, that would be sweet :)
<seb128> ochosi, spec is https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Sound#Title
<seb128> "If sound is muted and an application tried to play sound in the past five seconds, a red speaker with a cross (audio-volume-muted-panel). "
<seb128> bregma, you guys are working on bugfixing right? ;-)
<seb128> robert_ancell, hey
<robert_ancell> seb128, hello
<seb128> robert_ancell, what's wrong with the indentation in https://code.launchpad.net/~seb128/unity-control-center/users-change-inactive/+merge/211608 ?
<seb128> oh, the }
<seb128> sorry ;-)
<robert_ancell> yep
<chrisccoulson> seb128, what are you doing around so late? ;)
 * thumper found a real annoying bug last night
<thumper> not got around to filing it yet
<thumper> I have multiple users on my laptop
<thumper> switching users means typing my password in, which is expected
<thumper> but immediatly on the session starting, it locks the screen and I have to type the password again
 * seb128 slaps chrisccoulson with an old trout
<chrisccoulson> hah, thanks ;)
<seb128> :p
<bschaefer> thumper, with the new lockscreen? If so, check the list we have going here :) https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bugs?field.tag=lockscreen
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I'm working! some of us still do ubuntu uploads :p
<thumper> bschaefer: yes
<seb128> chrisccoulson, though I see you did some today as well ;-)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yeah, i thought it would make a change
<bschaefer> thumper, theres one where if you let the lockscreen lock by it self it requires two log ins... soo im guessing its the same type of bug
<thumper> bschaefer: bug 1291088
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1291088 in unity (Ubuntu) "Doesn't unlock when coming back from the greeter" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1291088
<seb128> chrisccoulson, did you fix the firefox url handling? ;-)
<bschaefer> thumper, sweet :), ill be sure to poke andyrock extra to look at that one
<chrisccoulson> seb128, weren't you writing a patch for that? i told upstream that you were!
<chrisccoulson> (j/k)
<bschaefer> thumper, if you want to post on the bug how you're reproducing it, i bet that would help andyrock
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I've one, it's a 1 liner in apturl that install a file in the directory firefox gives us for those ;-)
<bschaefer> as I think hes having problems reproducing it atm
<seb128> bschaefer, I think he fixed those by reinstalling gnome-screensaver last week
<chrisccoulson> lol
<seb128> bschaefer, his local hacked version was different from the one Trevinho got uploaded
<thumper> bschaefer: he can get in touch with me if needed, happens every time
<thumper> bschaefer: I added a comment about what I do
<bschaefer> seb128, i see, interesting
<bschaefer> thumper, awesome thanks a lot!
<andyrock> hey
<thumper> o/
<bschaefer> thumper, also hows all that cloud stuff going :)?
<andyrock> the problem is in gnome-screensaver :D
<thumper> busy busy
<bschaefer> sounds just like us :)
<thumper> andyrock: don't pass the buck
<seb128> andyrock, you better fix those issues before thumper gets angry at you!
<bschaefer> haha
<andyrock> i will
<andyrock> just need some more time :D
 * thumper hands andyrock two days
 * bschaefer just has a broken gnome-screensaver :(
<chrisccoulson> seb128, i'll fix it if you upload oxide in to the archive
<chrisccoulson> it needs a debian/copyright file
<chrisccoulson> :)
<chrisccoulson> (i was only joking about that btw)
<seb128> bschaefer, andyrock: joke aside, it would be good if you guys make some progress on unity bugs this week, nothing landing since thursday, we are pondering dropping the new lockscreen for trusty because it looks like we are going to need to make a call between that and getting regressions/bugs in unity fixed
<seb128> chrisccoulson, (lol, no way :p)
<chrisccoulson> seb128, it's only a 250MB upload
<bschaefer> seb128, we have branches! Just waiting to get them landed
<bschaefer> seb128, the indicator rendering behind is fixed as well
<Trevinho> seb128: no worries, we can fix everything... :P
<seb128> bschaefer, well, https://code.launchpad.net/unity/+activereviews ... it has 3 branches added since friday, 3 branches in 3 work days for a team of 4-5 people ...
<seb128> Trevinho: ^
<seb128> well, nothing against you guys
<seb128> but the current trend doesn't give confidence
<seb128> so it looks like we might need to drop features to give us budget for regression fixes
<seb128> bschaefer, trevinho, andyrock: you guys might be stacking fixes locally, if that's the case it would be better to have regular landing with what is available rather than stacking and then dumping
<Trevinho> seb128: there are also other things to focus on... but ok fixes will arrive
<bschaefer> seb128, yeah, the silo stuff is still a bit new to us... we can try to pump more out to land quicker
<seb128> Trevinho: sorry, nothing against you, and I know there is other work, we just need to make calls at some point, we can't do everything with the resources we have
<seb128> so if you guys focus on features/hidpi work still, we need to make on what to do with spare resources
<seb128> and for LTS that's going to be "fix the regressions"
<seb128> there are quite some bugs with lim
<bschaefer> hi-dpi work is pretty much on hold while im helping out andyrock
<seb128> some issues with the launcher as well (like the tooltips are buggy, the "pimps/'>'" signs are buggy), with keybindings/tapping
<seb128> super-<number> stopped working to focus apps (if you numbers are the top of the keyboard are behind a shift combo at least, like on the french layout)
<Trevinho> seb128: mh, weird, but that's probably due to the fact that we support Keypad numbers as well now, but it's going to be probably easy to fix
<Trevinho> seb128: anyway therea re lot of things to shape and we know, but still things are much better in general, also I hope that this cycle we won't forget the role of SRUs.
<seb128> Trevinho: yeah, it's probably easy, like most of the other stack of small issues/regressions, the issue is that if nobody start focussing on those they are still going to be there in the LTS release and we are going to be getting press on the low quality of our LTS
<seb128> we shouldn't rely on stus
<seb128> srus
<seb128> the release needs to be good, that's what gets most reviews
<seb128> it's also what most users try/upgrade to
<Trevinho> yes, but srus on release day as it used to be, should be done anyway... And it will hit most of people, allowing us to work till the last day
<seb128> Trevinho: not sure about "most of people", it's at least not going to be the first experience for lot of people
<seb128> it's still good if we fix bugs in SRUs
<seb128> but the first experience is going to be what is on the iso/coming preinstalled for lot of users
<seb128> that's usually the release iso, not the iso + surs
<seb128> srus
<Trevinho> indeed, not that I don't agree... I just hope that this time we'll get proper SRU released, and not like in the past cycle where we have backports ready and still not released
<seb128> right
<seb128> well, anyway, my point was: now is time to focus on fixing regressions and important bugs
<seb128> users are going to be fine if hidpi support is missing in some part of the dash
<seb128> they are not going to be if they bindings are not reliable
<bschaefer> seb128, agreed!
<TheMuso`> Since there are unity folks around, I've got a query. I am working on bug 1066157, and I've determined that there is a race condition of some sort, because whenever I use Orca's flat review mode, I can read the dash icons with Orca like normal. Is there a signal in the dash code somewhere that the a11y code could connect to, so it is notified of dash changes? Bearing in mind that the a11y code can only access either the result icon objects, the dash v
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1066157 in unity (Ubuntu) "dash +orca does not speak the names of application icons" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1066157
<TheMuso`> If there was a signal, I could then signal at-spi to query unity again and thereby allow dash icons to be navigable and readable with orca.
<Trevinho> TheMuso`: a signal when... happens what? :)
<TheMuso`> Trevinho: Ok I probably didn't explain that well enough. What I think is happening, is that the at-spi registry ends up having stale information with regards to the dash, such that when an Orca user is trying to navigate the dash, they do not hear what icon has focus when navigating with the keyboard. They hear the group titles, like files and folders etc, but not the results themselves.
<TheMuso`> When I mess around with a mode in Orca which allows one to read the screen from top to bottom as things are displayed, this triggers a refresh of the accessibility info in the registry for the dash, and the results are spoken when navigating with the keyboard.
<TheMuso`> I am wondering whether there is some way of the accessibility code being notified of dash updates, so it can signal the at-spi registry to update the accessibility tree WRT the dash.
<Trevinho> TheMuso`: mh, there are but related to results, not sure if there's a global one... andyrock or bschaefer might know more
<bschaefer> I sadly do not know off the top of my head :(
<andyrock> TheMuso`, for what i know dash accessibility never worked that well
<andyrock> :/
<TheMuso`> It works well enough for finding things. The text entry doesn't work I know, but that would require writing too much new code to fix at this late stage. The lenses also are not accessible, but the results at least do work. This is a regression from precise where unity 2d had working results, and as explained, if you use Orca in a particular way, the results are made available.
<TheMuso`> I did see the on_realized signal in the dash controller, but unless the accessibility code is specifically passed a pointer to the controller object, it is unable to get a pointer via any other means, and that signal may not even be what I want.
<andyrock> TheMuso`, i can take a look once the lockscreen bug list is empty
<TheMuso`> I don't mind having a look, since I know you guys have your hands full, I'm just wondering whether you guys know of anything that could help.
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-03-19
<xnox> robert_ancell: bschaefer: all layout is done using vector sources, so it's easy to generate svg out of that i believe. It's just well - getting dimention sizes of how would we want it to be rendered.
<bjf> xnox, trusty-desktop-amd64+mac.iso gives me ubi-usersetup failed with exit code 2. that's so unfriendly.
<bjf> xnox, i'm also curious how that made it past CI testing
<pitti> Good morning
<Laney> morning!
<hikiko> hello :)
<Laney> hey hikiko & pitti
<Laney> wie gehts?
<pitti> hey Laney, guten Morgen
<seb128> good morning desktopers!
<pitti> Laney: gut, danke!
<pitti> bonjour seb128 !
<seb128> hey Laney hikiko pitti, how are you?
<hikiko> hi seb128 Laney pitti :)
<hikiko> good seb128 you?
<seb128> hikiko, I'm good thanks
<pitti> seb128: ma main est un peu malade (je doit aller au mÃ©decin maintenant), mais bon
<Laney> hey seb128
<seb128> Laney, so changing to build u-s-s on all archs was not the best idea, it's blocked on i-n which is blocked on unity8 now
<Laney> prima, danke
<seb128> pitti, oh, qu'est-ce que tu as fait ?
<Laney> heh
<pitti> seb128: not sure yet; probably ganglion burst open again when I was doing pushups improperly
<Laney> I guess the goal is to unwind the stack
<seb128> Laney, I force merged back to trunk even if it's in proposed
<Laney> but there are hacks like faux packages that can be employed if necessary
<seb128> right, Colin was on it
<Laney> nod
<seb128> he forced britney into thinking unity8 is available on archs where it's not
<hikiko> seb128, we finally decided to add a checkbox quickly in u-c-c and try to implement this: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BrightnessAndDisplays#Displays until friday (but since the second change is quite big and might not be in 14.04) could you get a look at my checkbox? (here: https://code.launchpad.net/~hikiko/unity-control-center/u-c-c.checkbox-for-app-scaling/+merge/211681)?
<seb128> hikiko, I had on screen, how come it's so much code?
<seb128> hikiko, like why do you need to use gnome_rr apis, isn't that supposed to just write gsettings keys?
<hikiko> seb128, I needed to add a custom gsetting too
<seb128> why?!
<hikiko> https://code.launchpad.net/~hikiko/gsettings-ubuntu-touch-schemas/gsettings-ubuntu-touch-schemas.selected-monitor/+merge/211680
<hikiko> because I needed to store the selected monitor
<seb128> why?
<seb128> those settings are not by monitor
<hikiko> the checkbox does the following:
<hikiko> when is checked
<hikiko> it sets the scaling-factor and the text-scaling-factor to some values that when multiplied they give the ui-scale factor
<hikiko> of the selected monitor
<hikiko> so that the menus and launcher etc have the same size with the window contents
<hikiko> in the selected monitor
<seb128> so what happen when you select another monitor in the UI?
<hikiko> the new monitor's check button is checked, the new monitor's name is saved and the scaling-factor and text-scaling-factor of the desktop are set according to the ui-scale
<hikiko> next time you open u-c-c you will see the new monitor checked
<hikiko> unless if
<seb128> shrug, that seems really complicated logic, did design suggest that?
<hikiko> the scaling/text-scaling have been changed from outside u-c-c
<seb128> can you open a bug with explain the logic? that needs a ffe/uife anyway, and to me that's just too complex
<hikiko> seb128, we discussed with mpt and we found this solution: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BrightnessAndDisplays#Displays
<hikiko> but since we practically have 2 days
<hikiko> and in uds we were asked to add a checkbox just to have the feature there
<seb128> right
<hikiko> we decided to do the checkbox
<seb128> I'm fine with the checkbox
<hikiko> and then do the big change
<Laney> that has a button for using the selected display
<seb128> but not with that magic logic and new key and whatsoever
<Laney> that seems more sensible to me
<hikiko> I ve started the second design too
<hikiko> seb128, if I only had the checkbutton
<hikiko> and someone checked it for monitor N or changed it from the outside
<seb128> there is no "for monitor N"
<seb128> those settings are not by monitor
<hikiko> I know what you mean
<seb128> the checkbox is "scaling 2 on/off, for all monitors"
<hikiko> I didnt explain it well
<seb128> IRC might not be the best place
<hikiko> no the checkbox should do the following:
<seb128> please open a bug with the logic described
<hikiko> ok :)
<seb128> we need it for the ffe/uife anyway
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> shrug, why are unstable users not updating
<seb128> the top report of e.u.c daily trusty issues is still that xfdesktop4 issue that was fixing 17 days ago
<Tazmain> hi all, I am having some issue with my ubuntu-raring-minimal if I launch a vncserver and connect to it I keep getting failed to start session "gnome" logout. I have xubuntu installed though
<mitya57> larsu, charles_: Can one of you please approve https://code.launchpad.net/~mitya57/indicator-applet/unparent-label/+merge/208174? Having a hacky fix is better than having that applet totally broken.
<seb128> Laney, did you try https://code.launchpad.net/~binli/unity-control-center/1291862/+merge/211258 again?
<seb128> I'm going to put a landing with some of my fixes, I'm pondering including that or not
<seb128> Laney, also if you want to review/ack https://code.launchpad.net/~seb128/unity-control-center/users-prompt-when-needed/+merge/211596 ... it's the bug I was talking to desrt about yesterday
<Laney> oh I forgot, let me do that in a minute
<seb128> thanks
<Laney> how come g-c-c upstream doesn't have that password bug?
<Laney> it looks like it would from the code
<cking> anyone able to explain why boot is slow slowe in trusty, the desktop seems to be consuming a load more boot time if one can believe this data: http://ci.ubuntu.com/bootspeed/machine/1/amd64/
<larsu> mitya57: that's a gtk bug, no? I don't think any other container has this check
<larsu> which wouldn't make sense, gtk_widget_set_parent() unsets the old parent anyway
<larsu> ah it doesn't
<larsu> interesting... then the other containers are doing it wrong?!
<seb128> Laney, see the bugzilla I pointed in the description?
<seb128> Laney, desrt's comment on it
<seb128> Laney, I think they had it on 3.8, they refactored the code (in a buggy way in 3.10)
<Laney> ah yes
<seb128> the call I moved is before the case for them
<seb128> so it's just ignored
<mitya57> larsu: Yes, it doesn't, and fails with assertion error with the current code.
<ochosi> hey larsu
<larsu> mitya57: shouldn't entry->image have the same problem?
<seb128> cking, hum, https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/job/bootspeed-trusty-desktop-amd64-acer-veriton-01/98/artifact/11/bootchart.png has a long python process eating cpu and io for like 40 seconds
<larsu> hi ochosi
<seb128> cking, lot of "utah-done.py" running in sequence as well
<seb128> cking, seems buggy CI infra to me
<mitya57> larsu: I can do the same with entry->image, but I didn't see any problems with that.
<cking> seb128, OK, I'll report that back to CI
<cking> thanks
<mitya57> I.e. all icon-only indicators are working.
<seb128> cking, thanks
<Tazmain> hi all, I am having some issue with my ubuntu-raring-minimal if I launch a vncserver and connect to it I keep getting failed to start session "gnome" logout. I have xubuntu installed though
<ochosi> larsu: not sure you received my note from yesterday about your latest indicator-sound patch (if not, i can quickly re-summarize)
<larsu> mitya57: this makes this bug even more mysterious. I hesitate to approve a fix I don't understand
<seb128> Tazmain, hey, try #ubuntu for user questions
<larsu> ochosi: please summarize again, there were a lot of pings for me last night
<seb128> ochosi, hey, oh, did I reply to you with the spec link yesterday?
<ochosi> seb128: yup, you did :) in case i didn't thank you for it, thanks now!
<mitya57> larsu: Maybe it's indicator-appmenu's bug that the label has non-NULL parent, and for other indicators it's just not the case.
<seb128> ochosi, lol, thanks ;-)
<mitya57> larsu: In any case, there is zero harm from unparenting, as it doesn't change anything for indicators that already do it right.
<ochosi> larsu: so, you basically re-added a functionality that was in indicator-sound before, if i recall correctly, i.e. showing another icon (red speaker) when sound is muted but there is playback. that's the context.
<ochosi> larsu: the problem is, that the icon-name for "blocked" state is not part of the spec for soundmenu, and you went with "audio-volume-muted-blocked-panel"
<ochosi> larsu: so while this is not a problem in itself, it breaks existing icon-themes (incl. ubuntu-mono),  because the icon used to be called "audio-volume-muted-blocking-panel"
<ochosi> (not the small diff between "blocked" and "blocking")
<seb128> ochosi, note that the spec has a name, it uses "audio-volume-muted-panel"
<seb128> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Sound#Title
<ochosi> seb128: yeah, but that icon-name is there as a fallback in larsu's patch
<ochosi> seb128: and it's actually a bit wrong, that's the normal "muted" state. the special "red icon" is for the blocked state
<ochosi> i guess the idea in the spec was to make a difference between normal "muted" state and "muted-blocking"/"muted-blocked" state
<larsu> mitya57: we can't say it doesn't change anything, as we don't fully understand where the bug is coming from. Also, there might be more side-effects. I'll have a look in a bit
<seb128> ochosi, right, I was just commenting on your statement that the name is not part of the spec
<seb128> ochosi, we should get the spec updated to have the right name if the one used is wrong
<seb128> e.g talk to mpt about that ;-)
<ochosi> ok :)
<larsu> ochosi: I thought I just used the icon name from the old code...
<ochosi> larsu: weird... check ubuntu-mono, it has only *-blocking-*
<ochosi> and elementary-xfce (which i'm maintaining) also has always only had that icon name
<ochosi> in conclusion: are you sure it wasn't "blocking" before? (it used to work here)
<seb128> ochosi, the ubuntu-mono icon seems blue, not red?
<mitya57> larsu: Thanks a lot. FWIW, there is a link to a code that creates that label in one of the comments.
<seb128> the current icon works
<seb128> but it comes from humanity
<seb128> not ubuntu-mono
<larsu> ochosi: ah! It only has blocking, but pulls in blocked from Humanity
<larsu> and that's the one we want iirc
<seb128> larsu, ochosi: the spec says "red speaker", the blocking one is blue
<larsu> the one from ubuntu-mono is blue
<larsu> seb128: I think I'd want the blue one in red
<larsu> but we should probably ask mpt again
<Laney> seb128: I approved that sound mp
<larsu> ochosi: thanks for bringing this up. Man, our icons are a mess :-/
<seb128> larsu, right
<seb128> I was just going to say that
<seb128> with icons -> themes
<seb128> and +1 for using blocking if it's red
<seb128> because the one we are using atm doesn't match the muted icon
<seb128> which looks a bit weird
<larsu> that's what I'm thinking
<seb128> e.g x against ---
<ochosi> larsu: yeah, i know... it has taken me *ages* to get elementary-xfce (which originated from the same source as humanity obviously) into shape
<ochosi> i wouldn't mind helping you guys out with humanity, but then again it feels so useless as your new icon theme will come...
<larsu> right, that's why I've been holding off as well
<seb128> +1
<larsu> but it's always such a pain to sort things out
<seb128> we should fix obvious bugs where we spot them though
<ochosi> well in this case it's a simple fix
<seb128> somebody with icon drawing skills needs to blue->red
<ochosi> you don't even have to go the long way and "sort things out" :)
<larsu> (a) fix the icon (b) fix my patch
<seb128> (e.g not me, I've no clue how to do that :p)
<ochosi> seb128: i can do that if you want
<seb128> ochosi, that would be nice
<seb128> though why is this icon blue atm?
<seb128> mpt, do you know?
<ochosi> i guess someone designed it that way because they liked it :p
<ochosi> (not specifically because it makes sense)
<seb128> so yeah, if you want to make it red, please do
<larsu> mpt: http://i.imgur.com/CRAcGg5.png
<seb128> then we can update the indicator to use that one
<ochosi> hah, the one from humanity has a really different style
<ochosi> doesn't look very nice/consistent
<seb128> right, it looks buggy
<ochosi> ok, i'll quickly fix that for you...
<larsu> mpt: we're using the red one right now, but assume the blue one would be more correct if it were red
<larsu> mpt: do you agree?
<seb128> ochosi, thanks
<seb128> larsu, I like that program (the icon library) ;-)
<larsu> seb128: me too :)
<larsu> seb128: btw, is it packaged?
<larsu> I'm still running it from some old source version
<seb128> I don't think so (or in a ppa only), it should
<seb128> same here
<seb128> it runs fine from srcdir
<larsu> it could be a bit faster in switching icon themes :)
<ochosi> seb128: how/where do you want it?
<seb128> ochosi, merge proposal against lp:ubuntu-themes would be best if you can do that
<ochosi> and: you only need that icon once btw, it's the same in -dark and -light obviously
<ochosi> ok
<seb128> thanks!
<ochosi> that'll take a while, my connection suuuucks :)
<ochosi> (note: the icon is finished already, pulling and pushing will probably take 10x longer ;))
<ochosi> any other icons that need fixing now that i'm at it?
<seb128> not that I know
<seb128> larsu, do you know of any?
<ochosi> (you should really just merge ubuntu-mono and humanity...)
<seb128> ochosi, just curious, what did you use to fix it? inkscape?
<ochosi> seb128: yup
<ochosi> this was extremely simple, as you only need to change the color
<seb128> (yeah, we should ... but as you and larsu said, spending time on that feels pointless since we get a new theme)
<ochosi> you could theoretically edit the xml directly as well
<mitya57> ochosi: I think Humanity and ubuntu-mono have different license/copyright.
<ochosi> true, it just pains me to see the mess :D
<seb128> suru-icon-theme is the new theme for touch btw
<seb128> I hope that comes to desktop as well
<larsu> seb128: no I don't
<larsu> ochosi: thanks
<ochosi> seb128: yep, those are beautiful (kudos again, tiheum!)
<ochosi> in fact it wouldn't be too hard to port those panel/indicator icons for the desktop...
<ochosi> i mean of suru-icon-theme
<seb128> ochosi, looking through ubuntu-mono in the icon library software, I don't see any other obvious candidate for fixing
<seb128> right, it's a bit late now for this cycle though
<hikiko> seb128, https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity-control-center/+bug/1294578 here it is
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1294578 in Unity Control Center ""Match the display settings" checkbox" [Undecided,New]
<hikiko> I hope it helps...
<seb128> hikiko, thanks
<ochosi> seb128: ok
<ochosi> yeah, i understand it's late for that
<larsu> hikiko: why would I ever want to have this checkbox turned off?
<larsu> (I hope I'm not starting a discussion you guys already had earlier)
<hikiko> lol larsu
<hikiko> because those are desktop settings
<ochosi> larsu, seb128: ok, here you go: https://code.launchpad.net/~ochosi/ubuntu-themes/audio-volume-blocking/+merge/211694
<seb128> ochosi, thanks!
<ochosi> np
<larsu> hikiko: what? If I understand correctly, I'll have mismatched scaling for titlebars and window contents when the checkbox is unchecked, right?
<hikiko> the user might change them from any other program or from u-c-c when he selects larger fonts or when in multimonitor if he plugs a monitor let's say a projector and he needs to check the laptop's monitor while the projector is still plugged to see something or for any reason
<hikiko> larsu, it depends...
<hikiko> if it's unchecked because you checked something else or modified a scaling factor outside ucc yes
<larsu> what is monitoring those settings to uncheck the checkbox?
<ochosi> seb128: you have a few more broken symlinks in ubuntu-mono btw
<larsu> or do you check whether the scaling factors are the same when I arrive in the settings panel?
<hikiko> I use a gsetting for the selected-display
<ochosi> seb128: specifically in ubuntu-mono-dark/status/22/
<hikiko> when the selected-display is the current monitor
<seb128> ochosi, if you want to fix those as well feel free ;-)
<hikiko> I check if ui-scale == scaling-factor * text-scaling-factor +- error (very small rounding error)
<hikiko> if this is not the case
<hikiko> some factor was modified so I uncheck it
<ochosi> seb128: yeah, there are a few more in -light...
<hikiko> larsu, that's not the final widget
<hikiko> mpt did a much better design
<hikiko> we just decided to add something that works before 14.04 release
<hikiko> and then improve it
<hikiko> but it seems to work fine in multimonitor
<ochosi> seb128: the main problem seems to be that whoever added the new indicator-keyboard icons must've also removed the old keyboard icon (input-keyboard) from the icon-theme, leaving behind broken symlinks...
<seb128> Laney, did you mean to review/+1|-1 that 1 liner for the account panel, or did you just glance over it and prefer to let for robert_ancell?
<hikiko> I mean you see no inconsistencies like: a button is checked when settings dont match the desktop or things like that
<larsu> hikiko: I don't know. It seems overly complicated to me and I can't imagine ever wanting a different scaling factor for title bars and window contents
<larsu> hikiko: thanks for clearing it up, though
<Laney> seb128: I didn't look into it, seems fine to me but you may want to wait for desrt
<seb128> Laney, ok, thanks for testing the sound one!
<hikiko> larsu, if you have different ui-scale for each monitor since the scaling-factor and text-scaling-factor are for the whole desktop they won't always match your unity display settings
<hikiko> so the user should choose in which monitor he wants the "perfect" match
<hikiko> (same scaling)
<hikiko> that's what the checkbox does
<hikiko> if your monitors are a retina a laptop screen and a projector
<hikiko> and they all use a different ui-scale factor
<hikiko> you have to decide which monitor's ui-scale you want to have in gnome apps and set the scaling-factor and the text-scaling-factor of the whole desktop tou match that
<hikiko> sorry :) I dont know if I make it more clear or more complicated now :p
<larsu> hikiko: you totally did thanks. I understand the problem, but don't like the solution
<hikiko> me neither :)
<hikiko> we ll change it after release
<larsu> and I'm a bit surprised that gnome's scaling-factor is per desktop and not per monitor
<larsu> hikiko: I also don't like mpt's proposed solution...
<hikiko> yes :/ all scaling factors :/
<hikiko> larsu, then we can discuss it further before I submit a branch for it
<hikiko> but we need to merge the checkbox
<hikiko> to have the feature
<hikiko> as we promised
<hikiko> I mean after we test it ofc
<seb128> ochosi, do you plan to send another merge request to fix some of the symlink issues? Just wondering if I should line up your other fix for landing yet or wait for another fix to come
<Laney> hikiko: btw, it crashes when I run it http://paste.ubuntu.com/7119084/
<ochosi> seb128: yes, pushing already
<hikiko> Laney, did you install the gsetting?
<Laney> yes, look at the bt
<ochosi> seb128: is it a problem that it was done on top of the soundmenu-icon fix?
<hikiko> sec
<seb128> ochosi, no, not a problem
<seb128> ochosi, thanks
<Laney> I think that you should look into using glib functions rather than malloc/strcpy
<hikiko> yes, will fix
<hikiko> I'm replacing them right now, I forgot it :p
<ochosi> seb128: MR done
<seb128> ochosi, thanks
<ochosi> seb128: well happy to be able to give something back for all the great support and helpin out this cycle! :)
<ochosi> (guess now i have to stop looking at ubuntu-mono or i'll start fixing it...)
<seb128> ochosi, ;-)
<Laney> crap, the glib autopkgtest failed
<seb128> :-(
<jibel> Laney, fixed
<Laney> jibel: oh, env problem?
<jibel> Laney, the old rule: when it fails run it again until is passes
<Laney> O_O
<Laney> I was trying to reproduce it :P
<Laney> but, good... I suppose
<hikiko> seb128, I ll remove the code that sets the primary monitors settings from ucc
<hikiko> you are right on that
<hikiko> this should be done by unity
<jibel> Laney, apparently gdbus-threading crashed on previous run
<seb128> hikiko, unity-settings-daemon probably rather, that's what applies e.g the resolution
<Laney> jibel: yep
<hikiko> +1 seb128
<hikiko> I am removing it
<seb128> hikiko, btw I like Laney's suggestion of a button
<hikiko> the only problem is that you have 0 feedback of what is selected/not
<hikiko> not that the checkbox is the super widget
<hikiko> :p
<hikiko> the opposite
<hikiko> but at least shows something
<Laney> jibel: The ubuntu-sso-client one fixed itself too on another run
<Laney> all good fun
<jibel> Laney, yes, that's pitti-matic at work
<Laney> we should just run all tests more than once and only consider a failure if they fail every time :P
<Laney> hikiko: I guess it's not 'selected' if you have the buttons, but rather an operation which is performed
<Laney> 'run this algorithm now'
<hikiko> Laney, I ve fixed the branch, I think that if you try now it will be ok
<Laney> hikiko: yeah, it doesn't crash
<Laney> so it's totally unclear what that checkbox does
<Laney> The design has a "Scale for window contents:" header that we probably want here
<Laney> & I still prefer the button idea
<Laney> thanks for working on this btw
<hikiko> ok, it's easy to add the label, I'm not sure that the button does the same thing because the checkbox shows the selection, that's why i prefer the checkbox
<hikiko> I'll add the Scale.. label as a first step :)
<Laney> It doesn't, we're arguing that the current behaviour is complicated and confusing
<hikiko> I don't disagree on that, I know that the checkbox is not the best widget, I just think that from button and checkbox the checkbox is slightly "better" because it makes clear that only one monitor is selected and which one is this
<hikiko> bregma, Trevinho ^^ have you seen what Laney suggests? what do you think?
<seb128> hikiko, I don't think the checkbox work, for the reason I pointed on the bug
<seb128> hikiko, if I select another monitor it's going to show unchecked, but yet the scaling is still active, it's just based on computation from another screen
<hikiko> no,
<hikiko> if you select another monitor
<hikiko> the last monitor selected
<hikiko> will be used
<seb128> that's buggy
<seb128> what if I select another monitor to turn it off?
<hikiko> no, that's what we want
<seb128> or to change the resolution
<seb128> but I don't want to use scaling from that one
<hikiko> then you just wont check the button
<hikiko> it wont be checked by default
<seb128> right
<seb128> if it's not checked, it makes me thing there is no scaling active
<seb128> when there is
<Trevinho> seb128, hikiko: ihmo we should just use one single monitor-idependent "use max scaling across monitors for everything"... That is imho the easiest way to achive sacalability withouth touching things too much
<seb128> +1
<hikiko> Trevinho, seb128 could you run it?
<seb128> hikiko, let me build it
<hikiko> i think the checkbutton is doing what it should
<hikiko> you just select the monitor
<hikiko> and when you move the ui slider
<hikiko> you see the content scale too
<hikiko> when unchecked
<hikiko> you move the slider and the content doesnt scale
<hikiko> it's very simple i think
<seb128> expect that the GTK scaling is not by monitor
<seb128> so having the checkbox changing according to the selected monitor is just weird
<seb128> it also doesn't solve the conflicts with the accessibility text scaling setting
<hikiko> seb128, all these are not solved by the button either and are not solved by the current design
<hikiko> we have to plan a better approach
<Trevinho> hikiko: the fact is... +app_checkbox_activation_deactivatio doesn't need to do anything but changing the setting. As I told you this change must be done in unity itself
<hikiko> that button is just a partial solution
<hikiko> Trevinho, the 1st time yes
<Trevinho> hikiko: no, unity will do that
<hikiko> but then if you plug a projector
<seb128> hikiko, well, first thing I really dislike adding yet another gsettings key
<hikiko> ok
<Trevinho> hikiko: I mean, what UCC only have to do is to change a gsettings key, unity will handle the rest.
<Laney> The button idea is meant to be a less confusing way of doing the same thing
<hikiko> Trevinho, and next time you start ucc
<hikiko> how would you know which monitor is selected
<hikiko> to show the buttons checked or unchecked
<seb128> the checkbox doesn't convey that info properly imho
<Trevinho> hikiko: if we go for "use the max available scaling", we don't need to know anything
<hikiko> yes but this doesnt help if you have a projector and a retina and need to swap between them
<seb128> hikiko, it's not clear why changing monitor or checking the box for another monitor uncheck the one you had for the first one
<seb128> nothing says "only one monitor can be checked at time"
<seb128> or "checking that is going to uncheck oher non selected status"
<hikiko> seb128, +1 I could add labels for that
<Laney> A combo would convey it slightly better, but that's also not ideal
<seb128> hikiko, if you want to say "the setting apply to <...>" you should have a combo that let you select the monitor
<Trevinho> Why not just using a combo box for selecting wich monitor is the "target"?
<Laney> ha
<hikiko> cool
<hikiko> that's a good idea :)
<seb128> hikiko, same as the "launcher placement"
<Trevinho> yeah
<seb128> Trevinho, stop stealing my suggestions :p
<hikiko> so I ll have a combo on the right with all monitors
<Laney> I SAID IT FIRST!
<hikiko> and choose 1?
<hikiko> lol
<Trevinho> seb128: ah, I didn't read it, but it just seemed the more natural thing to me :)
<hikiko> Laney, thanks thanks :D
<seb128> Trevinho, ;-)
<hikiko> hahaha
<hikiko> ok people just a sec
<hikiko> to make sure
<hikiko> I got it right
<Trevinho> Anyway................ Going back to the thing, how it must done: we only need 2 gsettings key more, that should be in com.canonica.unity namespace (I don't want to put things that will be legacy in com.ubuntu.user-interface)
<Trevinho> 1 target monitor
<Laney> so unity does the scaling?
<hikiko> so I have a combo with the plugged monitors
<Laney> so it gets to own the key
<Trevinho> 2 text-scaling-factor... (in case user has a different scaling factor)
<hikiko> I put the key on unity
<Trevinho> unity will handle the things
<Trevinho> well, is handling them already here
<Trevinho> UCC only has to set these vales, unity will guess the rest
<hikiko> and what do i store Trevinho ?
<hikiko> scaling-factor
<hikiko> text-scaling-factor
<hikiko> selected-monitor
<hikiko> ?
<Trevinho> hikiko: scaling-factor is already stored
<Trevinho> hikiko: you (I) need to add two more keys inside com.canonical.unity gschema
<hikiko> a custom text-scaling-factor
<Trevinho> yes, that unity will then bind to the actual one... or ucc when unity is not running
<hikiko> and the 2nd is the monitor i guess
<Trevinho> but before we need to finish the unity part, the UCC Is just the last thing to do imho. hikiko i think you should get the UI ready for now, we'll change the gsetttings path once they're defined
<Trevinho> yes
<hikiko> ok Trevinho
<Trevinho> I've to go to lunch and after that I've to take my girl friend to a visit, but I hope to come back in few hours...
<hikiko> I ll leave in 30 minutes too, i have an apointment but i ll push the mp at night
<Trevinho> hikiko: ok, that's fine... I'll work till late as well
<seb128> hikiko, Trevinho: thanks for working on that ;-)
<hikiko> np seb128 and Laney thanks for the reviews/feedback too :)
<seb128> yw!
<ochosi> larsu: just to know what's going to happen next, will you rename the icon in indicator-sound or is that still pending on something?
<larsu> ochosi: yep, I'll rename it
<ochosi> larsu: ok, thanks, just good to know i don't have to push another update to our icon-theme
<Sweetshark> \o\ /o/ \o/
<Sweetshark> ./run-adt-test finished successfully after 48min (guestimate: 42 minutes to provision, 6 minutes to run the tests)
<mpt> larsu, what donât you like about the design? :)
<larsu> mpt: I don't understand why I would ever want titlebars with a different scaling than window controls
<larsu> s/window controls/window contents/
<mpt> larsu, oh, me neither. I grate my teeth whenever the window spread shows oversized title bars, for example.
<mpt> larsu, but Compiz is drawing the title bars, so they get scaled along with the rest of Unity.
<mpt> The whole thing is a snafu.
<larsu> I don't know what a snafu is
<larsu> but I'm glad you agree with me :)
<nessita> hello everyone! I'm having an issue in a canonistack slave, running precise, where when installing librsvg2-common there is a seg fault in the output:
<nessita> Processing triggers for libgdk-pixbuf2.0-0 ...
<nessita> Segmentation fault (core dumped)
<nessita> this is causing, I think, the svg library to missbehave
<nessita> seems like bug https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gdk-pixbuf/+bug/1174253 describes the issue but there is no workaround
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1174253 in gdk-pixbuf (Ubuntu) "Segfault (core dumped) during upgrade 12.10 to 13.04" [Undecided,New]
<nessita> pitti, heya! would you have any advice for what I just mentioned?
<seb128> nessita, hey
<seb128> nessita, not know, do you have a stacktrace?
<seb128> nessita, you should probably upgrade to a support release btw, e.g 13.10
<nessita> seb128, hola!
<nessita> seb128, I'm running precise in this slave
<nessita> seb128, this is the output http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/7119797/
<seb128> nessita, oh, so likely not the same issue than the one you pointed out
<nessita> no traceback, not sure how can I get onw
<nessita> seb128, the apt output matches, that's why I linked the bug...
<Laney> run /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/gdk-pixbuf-2.0/gdk-pixbuf-query-loaders manually
<nessita> Laney, trying
<seb128> nessita, does it segfault if you run "sudo /usr/lib/#MULTIARCH#/gdk-pixbuf-2.0/gdk-pixbuf-query-loaders $(find /usr/lib/#MULTIARCH#/gdk-pixbuf-2.0/2.10.0/loaders-name *.so 2> /dev/null)" by hand?
<seb128> where #MULTIARCH# is the triplet for your arch
<nessita> Laney, got the segfault, trying with gdb
<seb128> or what Laney said :p
<nessita> :-P
<Laney> install the gtk and glib debug package first
<nessita> Laney, have the package name handy? or I can look them up
<seb128> libgdk-pixbuf2.0-0-dbg
<nessita> Laney, seb128: without the debug packages http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/7119821/
<nessita> installing debug package
<seb128> libc6-dbg as well
<nessita>  E: Unable to locate package libgdk-pixbuf2.0-0-dbg
 * nessita googles
<seb128> install libc6-dbg and libglib2.0-0-dbg
<seb128> that might be enough, seeing your bt
<seb128> nessita, http://ddebs.ubuntu.com/pool/main/g/gdk-pixbuf/libgdk-pixbuf2.0-0-dbgsym_2.26.1-1_amd64.ddeb otherwise
<nessita> traceback with debug symbols: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/7119828/ (haven't installed libgdk-pixbuf2.0-0-dbg yet)
<seb128> nessita, dpkg -l | grep libglib
<nessita> ii  libglib2.0-0                                       2.37.5-1ubuntu2~precise1                      GLib library of C routines
<nessita> ii  libglib2.0-0-dbg                                   2.37.5-1ubuntu2~precise1                      Debugging symbols for the GLib libraries
<seb128> where is that coming from?
<seb128> the precise version is 2.32
<nessita> checking policy
<nessita> ough
<nessita>         500 https://private-ppa.launchpad.net/ubuntuone/scope-runner/ubuntu/ precise/main amd64 Packages
<seb128> yeah
<seb128> you got buggy stuff from the ppa...
<nessita> seb128, thanks a lot for your help
<nessita> will talk to the scope runner guys
<nessita> :-)
<seb128> nessita, yw, that's not a fix, but you are using an old unstable glib library that can't be good
<desrt> my advice: never install glib
<desrt> this software is trouble
<seb128> desrt, you get coffee!
<desrt> already got it :)
<Laney> pre-coffee trolling
<seb128> good morning then ;-)
<Laney> oh!
<nessita> seb128, what do you mean with old unstable glib?
<nessita> if precise have 2.32, I would have thought 2.37.5 was newer
<seb128> nessita, right, but odd number are unstable series
<nessita> ah, right
<seb128> nessita, look at https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/glib2.0
<seb128> nessita, saucy has 2.38, trusty 2.39
<seb128> 2.37 was the unstable leading to 2.38
<seb128> if you want that serie you should at least take 2.38 proper
<nessita> I see
<nessita> will ping the scope runner guys
<nessita> thanks!
<Laney> well, try downgrading to precise's version of libglib2.0-0 and friends and see if it works
<Laney> you can confirm it is indeed that
<nessita> Laney, makes sense, any easy way of downgrading?
<Laney> nessita: start with sudo apt-get install {libglib2.0-0/libglib2.0-common}/precise
<Laney> maybe precise-updates
<Laney> or just ppa-purge that PPA
<nessita> Laney, it worked like a charm, thanks
<Laney> nod
<nessita> now we're defining how to move forward, turns out out jenkins slaves are building scope-runner which are now running server side but need libunity7 (???)
<nessita> so we're having a lovely chat :-D
<desrt> mterry: hey... how hard would it be to get rid of nopasswdlogin?
<mterry> desrt, you mean, stop doing it on the phone?  we don't want to get ride of that I don't believe
<mterry> *rid
<desrt> mterry: here's the problem:
<desrt> the user logs in with nopasswdlogin
<desrt> then they run 'passwd'
<desrt> they have no password, so they are able to change their password now
<desrt> and now they have a password
<desrt> but they're still in this group...
<desrt> because the two ways that we've stored the idea that they have no password (as the null password hash in /etc/shadow and as the group-as-a-flag) are now out of sync
<mterry> that's not inherently a problem
<desrt> well -- they can't login anymore.  that's sort of a problem
<mterry> desrt, nopasswdlogin doesn't mean they don't have a password.  It means they are allowed to be autologged in
<desrt> doesn't it mean that the greeter doesn't prompt for the password field?
<seb128> mterry, we should probably make a-s not call passwd -d and just add them to the group then?
<mterry> desrt, eventually, once the phone's greeter is a real grown up greeter, the system settings will let them set a passwd and require a login
<mterry> seb128, we shouldn't let user change password on phone yet I don't think
<seb128> mterry, the issue is not phone specific, we are discussing it in the context of the desktop
<mterry> seb128, ah
<seb128> atm you can lock your only user out by doing what desrt said
<mterry> seb128, yeah I think that's how g-c-c does it.  Just adds to group
<seb128> use u-c-c to do "no password"
<seb128> log back in
<desrt> mterry: the control center just changes the user's password with the passwd command
<desrt> so we should not have any workarounds in control center because the user could just bypass them by using passwd directly
<seb128> mterry, it does both atm, passwd -d (upstream behaviour) + group
<mterry> desrt, even for 'autologin' mode?  Are you sure, even with ubuntu patches and such?
<seb128> desrt, mterry: we could update your a-s patch to delete the passwd -d call
<desrt> mterry: the problem is when switching -away- from autologin
<seb128> your->out
<seb128> our
<desrt> seb128: i'm not sure pam would allow the user to be logged in if they had a password...
<seb128> desrt, they do
<seb128> I set a password back through the gui
<desrt> and just being in the group is enough?
<seb128> lightdm keeps displaying me the "log in" button instead of a password entry
<seb128> yes
<desrt> huh
<desrt> so make their password into some impossibly-long-random-string so they can never change it? :)
<seb128> as you said, it doesn't even hit pam when you are in this group
<mterry> desrt, yar that group is just about logging in, has nothing to do with existence of passwd
<desrt> seb128: it always hits pam...
<seb128> well, the point is that they want their password
<seb128> otherwise you can't use polkit anymore
<desrt> unless we want also to teach polkit about nopasswdlogin
<seb128> if you have a passwd + group, you get auto login and the ability to use the admin tools
<seb128> what's the issue with not calling passwd -d and just do the group thing?
<desrt> seb128: this would not be at all clear in the current UI
 * seb128 tries on his test box again, change the combo, use passwd to add a passwd and see what happens
<seb128> how so?
<desrt> since it looks like autologin is an alternative to having a password
<desrt> ie: the idea of having a password _and_ having autologin is not well-presented in this UI
<seb128> well, nopasswd != autologin
<seb128> you are not automatically logged in with the "no password" option
<seb128> it's just that the step to log in is a click and not a password
<seb128> or hitting enter
<seb128> to be fair the "no password" is well hidden
<seb128> it's in a combo of the "change password" dialog that you get only if you unlocked the panel
<desrt> erm...
<seb128> ?
<mterry> seb128, yeah sorry I thought we were talking about an autologin context before, I may have confused issue
<seb128> mterry, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/accountsservice/+bug/815271
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 815271 in accountsservice (Ubuntu Oneiric) "Cannot login if user account does not have a password" [High,Fix released]
<seb128> mterry, is what we are talking about basically
<desrt> seb128: this UI is megaconfusing
<seb128> desrt, indeed
<desrt> it freely mixes the concepts of no password and autologin
<seb128> we should maybe just hide the "no password" in the combo :p
<desrt> well
<seb128> declare that we don't support that mode
<desrt> "log in without a password" and "auto login" i guess
<mterry> seb128, that bug is fixed, eh?  What's the proximate problem?
<seb128> mterry, I was testing other changes in trusty and hit that scenario
<seb128> - log in
<seb128> - go to user panel
<seb128> - unlock
<desrt> does lightdm let the user login _after_ the first boot with no password even if they have a password, if nopasswdlogin is true?
<desrt> i geuss the answer is yes, looking at the pam config
<seb128> - click password -> no password
<seb128> - log out
<seb128> you can log back in by clicking a button
<seb128> good so far
<seb128> go to the user panel again
<seb128> click passwd (without unlocking)
<seb128> it asks you for a passwd
<seb128> type it, validate
<seb128> log out
<seb128> you keep getting the button
<seb128> no password entry
<seb128> and you go "how the heck do I go back to a secure login"
<seb128> mterry, ^^
<seb128> that's the user visible issue
<mterry> seb128, expected behavior from a backend point of view.  I think that's just a UI issue?
<seb128> yeah
<mterry> seb128, and I don't think anyone is thrilled with that UI as it is
<seb128> desrt, yes, as long as you are in the group you can log out/in, reboot and log in, etc as many times as you want
<desrt> seb128: what if you toggle the separate 'automatic login' switch in the UI?
<seb128> mterry, yeah, could be
<desrt> i mean... maybe this actually isn't a big issue?
<desrt> i would expect that you get a polkit authentication dialog and then your autologin bit is removed
<seb128> mterry, there is also the issue than picking "no password" calls "passwd -d" which makes polkit unhappy and let you without a way to do admin changes again
<seb128> desrt, ^ that's an issue
<seb128> you can't go back to change the mode
<desrt> seb128: not if you reset your password again :)
<seb128> since you can't unlock anymore
<desrt> which you can do...
<desrt> and for normal users, it would be asking the _admin_ password, not yours
<seb128> right
<desrt> i agree that it's a bit annoying that accountsservice happily sets no-password and polkit won't allow that
<desrt> there is some sort of a mismatch there
<desrt> but it actually has nothing to do with autologin
<seb128> I'm still unsure why we need the passwd -d there?
<seb128> what does it win us?
<desrt> and nopasswdlogin is a hideously badly named group
<seb128> out of locking you out of sudo/polkit
<desrt> seb128: it makes it so that you have no password...
<seb128> what's the benefit of that?
<desrt> so you can change your passwd with passwd later, without knowing it
<seb128> hum, good point
<seb128> what happens in fedora when you do that?
<seb128> are you locked out of polkit auths as well?
<desrt> i guess it lets you set your password...
<desrt> let me check
<desrt> actually, on fedora they have removed the option :p
<seb128> from where?
<desrt> gnome-control-center
<seb128> did you unlock?
<desrt> yes
<desrt> i'm trying to modify a different user
<desrt> and i have only two choices:
<desrt> 1) set a password now (possibly to a random value)
<seb128> 2) password at next login?
<desrt> 2) the user chooses their password at next login
<seb128> hum
<seb128> what if you add a new user?
<desrt> the old dropdown is gone
<desrt> ame
<desrt> *same
<rsalveti> Laney: pushed your hybris changes (libwayland) and decreased the default alternatives priority, it shouldn't break desktop anymore
<seb128> desrt, right, part of https://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-control-center/commit/panels/user-accounts/um-password-dialog.c?id=d134890b8b8785792eda1b30793915f435729333
<desrt> maybe we should nuke the password-unset ability from accountsservice too
<desrt> since it's obviously problematic
<seb128> not sure, you might have users of the api/dbus method out there, you can't just change a public api like that
<seb128> desrt, mterry: ok, I think I'm convinced it's a corner case and not an important issue
<seb128> I suggest just moving on and not spending more time on it :p
 * desrt takes a look at our as patches
<desrt> there's still something here that's not right
<desrt> okay... i'm back to thinking that nopasswdlogin should go away
<desrt> because i just had myself autologged-in by gdm with a password set
<desrt> and i'm not in the nopasswdlogin group
<desrt> so this isn't working like we apparently think it is
<seb128> lying!
<seb128> "groups"?
<seb128> oh, autologged
<seb128> autologin != nopasswd
<desrt> desrt adm sudo dip plugdev lpadmin sambashare
<desrt> something is missing......
<desrt> so nopasswdlogin really has nothing to do with autologin because... well... i'm logged in
<seb128> " because i just had myself autologged-in by gdm with a password set
<seb128>  and i'm not in the nopasswdlogin group"
<seb128> I'm not sure I follow you
<desrt> i went into the dialog, with a password set
<desrt> and i did nothing other than flick the autologin toggle
<desrt> then i reboot the machine
<desrt> and i was automatically logged in
<desrt> despite having a password and despite _not_ being in the nopasswdlogin group
<desrt> which shows that nopasswdlogin has nothing to do with autologin
<desrt> and it really is just a redundant bit of state
<seb128> right
<desrt> so i'm back to thinking we should remove it
<seb128> but "nopasswdlogin" is different from autologin, if you read the gdm bug I pointed you at
<seb128> those users want to be able to select in between different users
<seb128> and entering the session without password
<seb128> autologin allows only 1 user to be autologged
<seb128> not 3 to be selectable, usable without password
<seb128> so nopasswdlogin is more of "share a laptop in a family"
<seb128> boot on the greeter, let you pick an user
<seb128> don't bother you with auth
<seb128> but yeah, I agree
<seb128> those are confusing notions
<desrt> seb128: forget autologin completely
<desrt> since it really is a completely separate thing
<seb128> right
<desrt> this is controlled by a keyfile in /etc
<seb128> you are the one who mentioned it
<desrt> the question now is only about if a user has a password or not
<desrt> seb128: mterry brought it into the discussion :)
<seb128> <desrt> i went into the dialog, with a password set
<seb128>  and i did nothing other than flick the autologin toggle
<seb128>  then i reboot the machine
<seb128> k
<desrt> the unix way to have no password is to have a field :: in /etc/shadow
<mterry> I did mention it  :)
<seb128> let's refocus ;-)
<desrt> and this is what i would expect to happen in your "family shares the laptop" case
<desrt> and i see no reason why this cannot be the _only_ way
<desrt> since having this separate group is massively increasing the complexity and introducing issues
<seb128> read https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=414862 for the rational
<ubot2> Gnome bug 414862 in general "Allowing passwordless connections" [Enhancement,Resolved: fixed]
 * seb128 reads it again
<qengho> Hi all. I'm looking at events coming from xinput2 for multitouch devices. The direct-mode touch screen in front of me reports RawTouch{Start,Update,End} events, Motion events, and others, but the APPL touch pad I have reports only Motion events. I expected more from the touchpad, since it says it has multitouch position "Valuators". What gives?
<seb128> desrt, https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=414862#c12
<seb128> desrt, suggest the intend from Milan was to not call passwd -d on those case
<seb128> our "no password" option is a mix of concepts it seems
<desrt> okay
<desrt> so what we really want is a new toggle on the main page of the user's dialog
<seb128> https://mail.gnome.org/archives/system-tools-list/2008-May/msg00000.html
<desrt> "require password at login screen"
<seb128> that would toggle the membership thing?
<desrt> yes
<desrt> and only that
<seb128> and we orthogonal to the no password
<seb128> right
<seb128> we->be
<Laney> rsalveti: I saw, thanks for that
<Laney> didn't you need the higher priority for touch?
<Laney> mesa was pulled there iirc
<Laney> or did you add a hook into livecd-rootfs
<desrt> maybe "require password to login locally" or something
<seb128> desrt, I'm not convinced there is enough of a need/usecase to have it next to autologin, especially it's going to be difficult to explain the difference
<desrt> since it also applies to screensaver
<desrt> but presumably not to (eg) ssh connections
<seb128> desrt, I'm starting to thing it's a power user config and shouldn't be in that tool :p
<desrt> seb128: i'd be fine with nuking it entirely =) =)
<desrt> either way, it should _definitely_ not be set from any option that is currently in accountsservice
<desrt> since it is completely unrelated to anything currently there
<desrt> maybe we want to add a new API for it though
<seb128> desrt, the initial issue/reason why mterry adding the user to nopasswdlogin was that lightdm wouldn't let an user without passwd log in it seems (from the bug description linked to the patch), but I tried and that seems fixed in trusty
<desrt> so there really is no need for that patch anymore
<desrt> and meanwhile there is already the 'power user tweak tool'
<desrt> sudo vi /etc/group :)
<desrt> also meanwhile: we should probably remove the options from the UI for having no password (as did upstream gnome)
<seb128> desrt, the main issue with dropping that patch is "what happens if users added themself to that group through the UI/by using the confusing combo"
<seb128> then upgrade to trusty
<seb128> then change their mind
<rsalveti> Laney: changed livecd-rootfs to force a higher priority when building ubuntu-touch images
<desrt> we could have a trusty upgrade script to knock everyone out of this group if they have a password set?
 * desrt shrugs
<Laney> rsalveti: rocking, that's basically both things I suggested
<desrt> upstream gnome dropped the 'disable this account' option
<seb128> desrt, some user might have put themself on purpose through vi and could be unhappy :p
<rsalveti> Laney: yup
<Laney> :)
<desrt> seb128: if they did it with vi before, they can do it again :)
<seb128> lol
<seb128> desrt, oh, but I'm being stupid
<seb128> desrt, the combo would still have "set password/set password at next login"
<desrt> seb128: and perhaps 'disable'
<seb128> I guess we could keep dropping them from the group when doing those
<seb128> shouldn't hurt anyone
<desrt> no.  we don't want to do that.
<seb128> why not?
<desrt> when the user's password is changed it doesn't mean that they want to be removed from the group
<desrt> that would be annoying
<desrt> imho we should forget that we ever did anything with this stuff and kick people out of the group on upgrade
<desrt> if they did it via the dialog then they'll have no password and can login with a null password anyway
<desrt> if they did it themselves, they can do it themselves again
<seb128> yeah...
<seb128> desrt, thanks for the chat, I think we have a plan, now I just need to make the different bits to happen ;-)
<desrt> seb128: i'm mostly happy that i don't need to do anything anymore :)
<seb128> haha
<desrt> although maybe we want to chat with upstream gnome about adding this UI
<desrt> i'll see what aday thinsk
<seb128> yeah, I'm unsure, seems like too close from autologin/likely to confuse users
<seb128> not sure there is enough of a demand/usecase
<desrt> ya
<desrt> the feature got dropped when moving from system tools to g-c-c...
<desrt> maybe that was intentional
<seb128> lot of things got dropped when moving
<seb128> like the ability to selects your groups membership is one quite some users complain about
<seb128> though that's less of an issue nowadays since less things rely on groups
<xclaesse> seb128, any particular reason why empathy is still at 3.8 and the rest of GNOME at 3.10 in 14.04 ?
<seb128> xclaesse, the rest of GNOME is not 3.10 (though we ended up updating quite some of the apps)
<seb128> xclaesse, but no particular reason, out of the fact that nobody asked for it to be updated during the cycle
<xclaesse> seb128, ok, I though everything was 3.10 already and empathy was the exception
<xnox> seb128: what about gnome-terminal 3.10? does that have the auto-reflow thing or is that post 3.10?
<seb128> xnox, I've no clue, ask Laney he's the closest of a maintainer we have for that one
<seb128> I've no interest in command lines/didn't look at g-t for years
<xclaesse> seb128, I perfectly understand to be conservative on LTS, if there are no strong reason to upgrade ;-)
<seb128> xclaesse, well, we defaulted to stay on 3.8 and then picked up "safe 3.10 updates", which ended up including apps like eog/gedit/nautilus, I've to admit I didn't look much at empathy to see what changes were in 3.10
<xclaesse> seb128, otoh, from an upstream POV, it means you're less likely to get fixes backported if needed. It is already unlikely that GNOME will backport fixes into 3.10 when 3.12 is released, and I think nobody will even care about 3.8 anymore.
<seb128> I think I did look at the git log earlier in the cycle and there were quite some telepathy changes, which I was unsure how likely those were to create issues
<Laney> We talked about gnome-terminal at the sprint
<Laney> It's that bash / vte thing, remember?
<seb128> xclaesse, right, that's going to be true even if we pick 3.10, in 1 year nobody is going to care about 3.10 anymore
<xclaesse> seb128, not sure myself what 3.10 adds tbh ;-)
<xclaesse> seb128, right, I personally think it is problem #1 of many OSS
<xclaesse> and GNOME in particular
<seb128> the issue that apps keep bumping their requirement to the latest GTK
<seb128> which means it's impossible to backport new softwares to the distros users run
<seb128> some upstream do try to stay compatible though
<seb128> like the shotwell team makes sure they run on the current Ubuntu LTS
<bjf> xnox, bug 1294721
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1294721 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "trusty-desktop-amd64+mac.iso install fails with "ubi-usersetup failed with exit code 2"" [Critical,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1294721
<seb128> it means using an 1.5 years old GTK atm
<desrt> seb128: so imho we should drop the 'no password' option from this dialog for now
<xclaesse> seb128, IMO we really should have a sync LTS cycle between major distros and upstream
<xclaesse> until we get that, we'll never have proper QA
<desrt> seb128_aync, that is
<xclaesse> unless for RHEL where they invest a lot, maybe
<seb128> xclaesse, we sort of have, RHEL7 ships with GNOME 3.8 :p
<xnox> bjf: is that with "encrypt my home directory", "full disk encryption", or *both* options enabled?
<bjf> xnox, just "encrypt my home directory"
<seb128> desrt, right
<seb128> desrt, btw can you +1 https://code.launchpad.net/~seb128/unity-control-center/users-prompt-when-needed/+merge/211596 ?
<xclaesse> seb128, oh didn't know RHEL7 is 3.8, yep so that does speak in favor of keeping 3.8 where 3.10 is not needed for ubuntu LTS indeed
<desrt> seb128: done
<seb128> desrt, thanks
<xnox> bjf: k, thanks.
<damianatorrpm> Hi all :)
<damianatorrpm> I compiled QMenuModel (https://code.launchpad.net/qmenumodel/)
<damianatorrpm> but if I try to compile the examples
<damianatorrpm> they fail that QMenuModel has no function QMenuModel::LinkSubMenu
<damianatorrpm> and that's true QMenuModel doesn't have this member anymore since 30 branches ago
<damianatorrpm> anyone working on a fix?
<seb128> dednick, larsu: ^
<dednick> seb128: hm. yeah. I dont think examples were updated in a long while
<seb128> damianatorrpm, ^
<dednick> damianatorrpm: I dont think qmenumodel is being supported anymore. We're using unitymenumodel nowadays.
<dednick> larsu: ^ ?
<seb128> om26er, hey
<om26er> seb128, hello
<seb128> om26er, could you help us with autopilot issues?
<seb128> om26er, https://code.launchpad.net/~diegosarmentero/ubuntu-system-settings/click-updates/+merge/208567 fails on the CI/device but not on desktop
<om26er> seb128, yes, sure.
<seb128> File "/usr/lib/python2.7/dist-packages/autopilot/introspection/dbus.py", line 323, in select_single
<seb128> raise StateNotFoundError(type_name, **kwargs)
<seb128> StateNotFoundError: Object not found with name '*' and properties {'objectName': 'systemUpdatesPage'}.
<seb128> om26er, I tried with the debs from jenkins, e.g http://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/job/generic-mediumtests-builder-trusty-armhf/3553/artifact/work/output/*zip*/output.zip
<seb128> running
<seb128> $ phablet-test-run ubuntu_system_settings.tests.test_system_updates.SystemUpdatesTestCases.test_show_updates
<seb128> same tests work fine on desktop
<mlankhorst> hm I upload mesa to the wrong place and I get a phoronix article ._.
<om26er> seb128, did the issue happen on your phone ?
<seb128> om26er, yes
<seb128> om26er, with the command I gave you
<seb128> running the same test on desktop works fine though
<seb128> which puzzles me, either the objectName is valid or not
<seb128> why is it behaving differently on the device?
<seb128> (the icon correspond is also on screen so not a scrolling issue)
<om26er> seb128, this fixes the issue http://paste.ubuntu.com/7120773/
<seb128> gatox_lunch, ^
<om26er> so yes, what you said
<Laney> my favourite function â¥
<damianatorrpm> ok thanks :)
<seb128> om26er, I don't really understand, is the issue that the other function doesn't work with touch devices?
<seb128> or is that a scrolling issue?
<seb128> because the icon is on screen on the n4
<om26er> seb128, I believe move_to_object is broken, if you had just click_object() that would work as well
<om26er> click_object() is a combination of move_to_object() and click()
<Laney> I didn't get separate move_to and click to work
<Laney> someone told me to use click_object()
<Laney> might as well always use scroll_to in case it goes off screen in the future - the function should handle the on-screen case fine
<om26er> probably because on touch devices there is no such thing as "move to location"
<om26er> you just tap ;)
<seb128> om26er, confirmed it works, thanks!
<seb128> gatox_lunch, ^ can you add that to your branch?
<om26er> seb128, \o/
<seb128> Laney, want to review/test https://code.launchpad.net/~diegosarmentero/ubuntu-system-settings/click-updates/+merge/208567 before I put it in a silo ?
<Laney> it should move your 'finger' to that location
<om26er> seb128, I though ChrisGagnon was already working on upgrade testing which would have covered this part with real update testing
<Laney> seb128: ok
<seb128> Laney, it's too much code for a proper review, but it has integration tests, looks fine in principle and works on the device
<om26er> Laney, technically it will drag the screen :)
<Laney> lemme finish this thing up then I'll look at it
<seb128> om26er, I'm trying to get https://code.launchpad.net/~diegosarmentero/ubuntu-system-settings/click-updates/+merge/208567 merged in
<seb128> Laney, thanks
<om26er> btw these tests fail when there is an update available, they did for me for example
<om26er> e.g. http://paste.ubuntu.com/7120829/
<Laney> I've told gatox_lunch about that before
<seb128> Laney, om26er: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~diegosarmentero/ubuntu-system-settings/click-updates/revision/646
<seb128> I told him today as well, he commited that
<seb128> which fixes it for system updates
<seb128> but there seems to still be an issue when click updates are available
<seb128> I confirmed that the commit fixes the issue the system updates case
<om26er> great!
<seb128> Laney, "undefined reference to symbol '_Znwj@@GLIBCXX_3.4'", webkit doesn't like you today :-(
<Laney> it's broken on armhf anyway
<Laney> I asked berto about it
<Laney> (see the debian buildlog)
<seb128> right
<larsu> damianatorrpm: what dednick said. qmenumodel is still in the repo, but it's not used anywhere. What do you need it for?
<seb128> larsu, dednick: if that has no rdepends we should make clean it out?
<damianatorrpm> larsu: thanks Lars. Is unitymenumodel a seperate package?
<larsu> seb128: unitymenumodel is in the same repo... but I think that's only used by unity itself?
<larsu> damianatorrpm: no, unfortunately not
<seb128> larsu, oh, ok
<larsu> maybe it should just be part of unity8 though
<dednick> larsu: i think it's used in settings as well
<larsu> ah
<dednick> unitymenumodel i mean
<larsu> I think you might be right
<larsu> at least the action part
<damianatorrpm> larsu: I want to tinker with it ;) a standalone app for gmenumodel
<damianatorrpm> or similar
<larsu> interesting
<larsu> there's an example for unitymenumodel in there as well (iirc)
<dednick> larsu: qdbusactiongroup still being used
<damianatorrpm> larsu: and I have a live cd with my own panel now based on libqt5xdg, libkwindowsystem and gsettings-qt
<damianatorrpm> larsu: a menu plugin would be nice too ^^
<damianatorrpm> larsu: still very ugly stage
<damianatorrpm> larsu: https://github.com/damianatorrpm
<larsu> neat :)
<seb128> mterry, hum
<mterry> seb128, hello!
<seb128> mterry, I don't understand https://code.launchpad.net/~mterry/ubuntu-system-settings/custom-pages/+merge/209562
<seb128> mterry, didn't that land/got merged back yesterday, http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~system-settings-touch/ubuntu-system-settings/trunk/revision/657
<seb128> mterry, why is the mp not closed? did launchpad not see the merge back for some reason? did you push on the same location a new branch?
<mterry> Looks like I merged from trunk and pushed again (not realizing it had made trunk already) -- this was part of my effort to make pagination merge clean
<seb128> mterry, lp:~mterry/ubuntu-system-settings/pagination still gives me a criss-cross ... can you just redo it on top of current trunk? seems like that's going be easier than trying to make bzr happy
<mterry> seb128, sure
<seb128> mterry, thank
<seb128> s
<seb128> mterry, I'm marking the custom-pages one merged
<mterry> seb128, I just did
<seb128> thanks
<Laney> I've got to go, will look at the click MP first thing in the morning
<Laney> have a good evening one and all
<seb128> Laney, thanks, you too!
<Laney> I noticed that webkit build failure was some terrible fat fingering on my part, trying again
<Laney> hopefully even the armhf, but I'm not expecting to get that lucky
<seb128> Laney, let's see
<mterry> seb128, omg, I did that and now there is some weird conflict in debian/changelog
<seb128> mterry, your vcs shouldn't even include debian/changelog? did you have a local dch or something?
<mterry> seb128, no debian/changelog?  It's in trunk...
<seb128> mterry, well I mean your branch should edit that file
<seb128> bzr log debian/changelog?
<mterry> seb128, right.  It has 0.1+14.04.20140318-0ubuntu1
<mterry> seb128, if you look at https://code.launchpad.net/~mterry/ubuntu-system-settings/pagination/+merge/210790
<seb128> wth
<mterry> seb128, you'll see my branch is "deleting" some merge conflict crap
<seb128> mterry, http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~system-settings-touch/ubuntu-system-settings/trunk/view/head:/debian/changelog doesn't include those
<seb128> mterry, bzr blame debian/changelog | grep >>> ?
<mterry> seb128, Â¯\_(ã)_/Â¯
<seb128> lol
<seb128> that's quite a nice smiley!
<mterry> seb128, nothing
<seb128> is '>' a special char?
<mterry> seb128, I quoted it
<seb128> let me bzr get your branch
<seb128> mterry, I don't understand what's going on ...
<seb128> mterry, I think it's your "merge from trunk" (639.4.8) which confuse it
<mterry> seb128, shall I try for a third time?
<seb128> mterry, just branch trunk, appli your diff manually, commit, push --overwrite
<seb128> drop those merge from trunk
<seb128> bzr is confused
<mterry> seb128, I thought that's what I did...  except I uncommitted and pulled
 * mterry starts fresh
<seb128> mterry, uncommit; diff > diff; revert; patch -p0 < diff
<mterry> basically
<seb128> mterry, the issue when you uncommit is that bzr keeps track for what you merged
<seb128> like you see it at the bottom of the commit log in "bzr commit"
<seb128> so it's not a clean diff
<seb128> bzr revert makes it forget
<mterry> I did make a clean diff though...
<mterry> Maybe I screwed up revert
<mterry> Regardless
<seb128> well, your branch has some knowledge of past merges
<seb128> bzr log -n0 | less -> see 639.4.8
<seb128> typically that happens if you "bzr merge; bzr uncommit" and then don't revert
<seb128> but anyway, no point discussing it for hours, revert and reapply the diff and let's see ;-)
<seb128> mterry, (sorry for the lag, wifi is acting up sometime, it doesn't disconnect me but stop transferring datas, I just notice when I try to hit the internet or notice the irc lag-o-meter)
<GunnarHj> Hi seb128!
<seb128> GunnarHj, howdy
<GunnarHj> seb128: If you start Rhythmbox in 14.04, you don't see the controls in the sound menu as in this image:
<GunnarHj> https://help.ubuntu.com/13.10/ubuntu-help/figures/unity-appmenu-intro.png
<GunnarHj> Is it a bug, or has the feature been dropped?
<seb128> GunnarHj, it's a bug, it works for me
<seb128> GunnarHj, do you have the mpris plugin enabled?
<GunnarHj> seb128: I tested with a full updated installation - hadn't installed mpris specifically, will have to check. Doug and Kevin in the docs team had the same problem.
<seb128> GunnarHj, I can confirm on my test machine which has a recent install, let me debug
<GunnarHj> seb128: Ok, thanks.
<seb128> GunnarHj, try installing rhythmbox-plugins
<mterry> seb128, I also resubmitted MP to kick it in pants.  Looks fine now
<seb128> mterry, happier now, thanks!
<GunnarHj> seb128: Will do that later. Is it a missing dependency?
<seb128> GunnarHj, yes, I'm fixing it
<seb128> it should be a recommends
<GunnarHj> seb128: Ok, recommends should be sufficient, I suppose. Thanks!
<seb128> yw!
<seb128> mterry, lp:~mterry/ubuntu-system-settings/sim-pic has the same issue
<seb128> mterry, criss-cross and conflicts :/
<seb128> mterry, can you fix that one as well?
 * mterry hulk stomps
<seb128> ;-)
<mterry> seb128, fixed
<seb128> mterry, works!
 * seb128 adds Cimi's change and test build
<seb128> mterry, thanks
<seb128> mterry, hum, are the dots off by one?
<mterry> seb128, are they?
<seb128> we get "hello (1) -> sim (not in the dots/skip) -> settings (2) ->  that's it (3)
<seb128> mterry, ^
<seb128> I would expect the "that's it" to have all the dots colored
<mterry> seb128, that looks fine?
<seb128> there is one missing, that suggest there is still a page coming?
<mterry> seb128, it does?  there are 3 dots
<mterry> seb128, you have 4 dots?
<mterry> seb128, do ls wizard/qml/Pages/
<seb128> mterry, http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/uss.png
<seb128> $ ls wizard/qml/Pages/
<seb128> 10-welcome.qml  20-wifi.qml.disabled  80-finished.qml  no-sim.qml
<seb128> 20-wifi.qml     30-location.qml       data             spinner.qml
<mterry> seb128, you should only have 3
<mterry> seb128, that looks like 3
<seb128> 10 20 30 80 ?
<mterry> seb128, 20 is disabled
<seb128> it's there twice
<seb128> is the .disabled masking the entry?
<mterry> seb128, once is the file that disables it
<mterry> seb128, yeah
<seb128> k
<seb128> weird
<seb128> ok, need to go for dinner but I'm going to try debugging it after that
<seb128> ttyl!
<mterry> seb128, to make it easier for customization to hide an existing page
<mterry> seb128, maybe actually what needs to happen is ls debian/tmp/usr/share/ubuntu/settings/wizard/qml/Pages/
<mterry> seb128, since that's where test.sh is loading from
<seb128> mterry, ok, I get 3 dots after installing the debs, so I guess when running from src something is looking in the system location, my mistake for not installing those earlier
<mterry> seb128, huh,
<mterry> k
<gtpr23789> Hi all!
<gtpr23789> Does anyone have any experience using the Ubuntu Customization Kit?
<robert_ancell> mterry, hey, can you remember the reasoning for checking the revert_to focus form http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~unity-greeter-team/unity-greeter/trunk/revision/604?start_revid=604 ? That's going to be racy right as the focus might have changed by the time you check it
<mterry> robert_ancell, fair...  the reasoning is in the comment there though right?
<robert_ancell> mterry, does it fail if revert_to is FocusParent?
<mterry> robert_ancell, fail?
<robert_ancell> Does the logic "focus on main window when any unmap occurs" not work?
<seb128> robert_ancell, hey, if you switch user from a guest, is it supposed to close the guest session on you?
<robert_ancell> seb128, no
<seb128> ok, that seems to be buggy
<robert_ancell> that does not sound like a useful feature
<seb128> right, I though that switch to your user and pick guest session was bringing you back to the open one
<seb128> but it seems to not be the case in trusty
<seb128> we were wondering if that's by design or a bug
<robert_ancell> log?
<seb128> no log (yet)
<seb128> but it doesn't close it
<seb128> in fact I did
<seb128> user -> guest (through indicator-session)
<seb128> guest -> user (through indicator session)
<seb128> that sends you to the greeter
<seb128> change to "guest" on the greeter, enter
<seb128> that seems to open a new guest
<seb128> I close that, came back to my session
<seb128> then picked guest in the indicator and it seems like that it sends me to my old guest
<seb128> though it's locked, unity locking screen bug :/
<seb128> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/1292154
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1292154 in unity (Ubuntu) "Unity ignores "disable-lock-screen" desktop key" [High,Confirmed]
<seb128> andyrock, ^
<robert_ancell> seb128, could you reproduce the greeter focus issue anymore?
<seb128> robert_ancell, I was never able to reproduce it, not even once :/
<seb128> neither on my laptop nor on the test touch laptop I've been using recently for testing
<charles> rorbert_ancell, seb128, is the "greeter focus issue" the one where you can't type your password until you've done something like click on an indicator and then back to the pw field?
<seb128> charles, yes
<seb128> charles, do you get it by any chance?
<charles> robert_ancell, seb128, I'm seeing that fairly regularly, a couple of times a week
<robert_ancell> aha, a testing victim :)
<seb128> nice!
<charles> I don't have a recipe, but just judging from the numbers I could probably be a guinnea pig
<robert_ancell> charles, do you think you could run lp:~robert-ancell/lightdm/wm-log and check /var/log/lightdm/x-*-greeter.log after it occurs?
<robert_ancell> It just has a little extra debugging
<seb128> robert_ancell, you should maybe add the call to xwininfo in there as well?
<seb128> or are the debug statement you added enough to guess the stacking?
<robert_ancell> seb128, there's not an obvious place to call it and it might affect the timing
<seb128> k
<robert_ancell> seb128, the debug statements indicate what u-g is triggering
<charles> robert_ancell: will do
<robert_ancell> I'm assuming it's being driven wrong by u-g.
<robert_ancell> charles, ta
<charles> robert_ancell: if it helps your guessing any, I've seen it very frequently right after boot.... I don't recall ever seeing it after just logging out to the greeter
<robert_ancell> charles, that seems to be the only time anyone sees it
<robert_ancell> I did around 20 boots here and no problems
<charles> robert_ancell: I'll ping you if/whenI have some news.
<robert_ancell> charles, ta
<charles> robert_ancell: I'll try to reboot a little more often :)
<charles> robert_ancell: ping
<charles> robert_ancell: I'm experiencing that greeter focus issue right now on another box and can test live if there's anything you want me to try
<charles> robert_ancell: also I have that log for you
<robert_ancell> charles, I take it you're not experiencing it right now :)
<ochosi> robert_ancell: hey! we've been seeing a weird lightdm-gtk-greeter bug recently and i was wondering whether you have a hint for me where to look
<robert_ancell> charles, your log shows some random window has got focus
<robert_ancell> charles, could you run https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity-greeter/+bug/1255558/comments/70 after it occurs next time?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1255558 in unity-greeter (Ubuntu) "Can't type my password after cold boot" [High,Triaged]
<robert_ancell> ochosi, I heave to leave in a few minutes but go ahead
<ochosi> robert_ancell: concretely, it seems that it doesn't exit gracefully and keeps running as a zombie in the session (i saw two lightdm-gtk-greeter windows in my taskbar), obviously that makes the session very wonky. problem is that we haven't found a way to consistently reproduce it. it happens almost never, but often enough that ppl notice
<ochosi> (thanks)
<robert_ancell> ochosi, I think I saw that report go past - is the greeter being launched by a script?
<robert_ancell> Because lightdm should have sent a SIGTERM to the greeter process and not launch the session until it has quit
<robert_ancell> if a script got in-between and it didn't exec the greeter then just the script would have terminated and the greeter might remain
<ochosi> robert_ancell: the greeter is being launched by lightdm, as always, we've never touched that ever
<ochosi> so it still dates back to you ;)
<robert_ancell> ochosi, that's what I feared ;?
<robert_ancell> ;)
<robert_ancell> ochosi, do you have a lightdm.log file?
<robert_ancell> ochosi, (we're not seeing this in unity-greeter)
<ochosi> robert_ancell: hm, not really because it happens almost never. it only happened to me once, and at the time i thought it was just a fluke
<ochosi> robert_ancell: and as it went away and i've never experienced it since, i felt confirmed. and then the bugreport flew in and got confirmed...
<robert_ancell> ochosi, I've got to go now, but that was my only thought off hand
<ochosi> robert_ancell: the only new thing is that we're using indicators
<robert_ancell> ochosi, the logic from lightdm is send SIGTERM, wait for process to exit then continnue
<ochosi> hence upstart
<robert_ancell> so something has broken in between that
<ochosi> ok
<ochosi> will dig further...
<ochosi> just annoying because i can't even get logs of this myself :/
<ochosi> robert_ancell: anyway, thanks!
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-03-20
<pitti> Good morning
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<Mirv> seb128: good morning, you have silos for all your desktop landings
<seb128> Mirv, hey, you are the best, thanks
<seb128> Mirv, I promise I'm going to drive them through and free back the silos ;-)
<Mirv> great :)
<Laney> morning!
<seb128> Laney, hey, how are you?
<Laney> seb128: thanks for pinging other people ;-)
<hikiko> hello :)
<seb128> Laney, yw!
<Laney> I'm good, although we got back late yesterday from playing games so a bit tired
<Laney> "40-60 minutes" LIES
<seb128> haha
<seb128> that's the time if you play
<seb128> not if you do a round in between 2 beers :p
<Laney> haha, there were no beers :P
<Laney> maybe if you don't think about your tactics at all or something
<Laney> Subject: [Build #5828630] armhf build of webkitgtk 2.3.92-1ubuntu1~ppa2 in ubuntu trusty RELEASE (canonical-arm-dev PPA)
<Laney> bah
<seb128> :-(
<seb128> that list discussion made me want to see what "diplomacy" is
<seb128> mterry said to play if you don't mind losing some friends :p
<Laney> not played that one
<Laney> http://www.shutupandsitdown.com/blog/post/review-libertalia/ it was this
<seb128> cool
<seb128> Laney, darkxst: so, thinking about that gnome-desktop ffe ... what needs the new version? g-c-c/g-s-d/gnome-shell?
<seb128> could we just package the new one as a different source in the archive (I guess it changed soname since it had abi changes) and just make those 3 use the new lib?
<seb128> I don't think we have any of those 3 that would end up with the 2 versions in process, but we should check to make sure
<seb128> so other desktop would end up only having the current one
<seb128> GNOME would have both versions installed but that should be minimal issues
<Laney> Not sure, would need darkxst to clarify
<Laney> if anything could end up loading both in the same process you'd have problems I guess
<seb128> Laney, libgnome-desktop-3-7 rdepends don't include any lib
<seb128> so we should be safe
<seb128> well anyway, it's just a suggestion as a possible solution for the GNOME remix
<Laney> I thought I saw mutter and/or libevo there
<seb128> libevo is not a real lib
<seb128> it's a collection of .so for evolution
<seb128> it has no rdepends out of evo
<seb128> mutter = gnome-shell
<seb128> that would load only the new one
<Laney> if you say so :-)
<seb128> well, there might be an issue, but if they really need the update to me it looks it could work and is work trying/investigating
<seb128> is worth*
<xnox> is there like an icon factory to query an icon from current/default gnome theme?
<xnox> glade to the rescue!
<seb128> xnox, http://iloveubuntu.net/icon-library-10-released-support-ubuntu-1304-and-ubuntu-1310
<seb128> xnox, you can just get https://launchpad.net/icon-library/trunk/lucid-release/+download/iconlibrary02052010.tar.gz untar and run from srcdir
<xnox> seb128: thanks! that helped a lot.
<xnox> seb128: https://launchpadlibrarian.net/170111173/wrong-icons.png
<seb128> xnox, still having that icon theme issue?
<xnox> seb128: yes.
<seb128> xnox, can you edit /usr/lib/python3/dist-packages/UpdateManager/UpdatesAvailable.py
<seb128> xnox, l235
<seb128> xnox, change it to         self.app_icons = Gtk.IconTheme.get_default()
<seb128> e.g add the get_default()
<seb128> then try again to see if that fixes it?
<ochosi> fwiw, i can confirm this icon-issue in xubuntu
<ochosi> it appeared a few weeks ago
<seb128> ochosi, ^
<xnox> ochosi: it's been like that forever.
<seb128> can you try that change?
<ochosi> sure, one sec
<xnox> seb128: yeap, i get everything wonderful now ! \o/
<ochosi> yup, that works
<seb128> xnox, ochosi, great, let me mp that, thanks for testing
<xnox> seb128: =))))))))))) trusty is going to be so smooth ;-)
<seb128> ;-)
<seb128> why am I fixing mvo's bugs btw? he's back soon, he should do that ;-)
<ochosi> no problem and thanks a lot for that fix seb128!
<ochosi> hehe
<xnox> seb128: don't you try punting - gtk, theming, issues, on others =))))))) it's not like it's never gtk's fault ;-)
<seb128> hehe
<seb128> xnox, https://code.launchpad.net/~seb128/update-manager/correct-icon-theme/+merge/211904
<seb128> xnox, ok, fix merged, I'm not doing an upload for it, but feel free to do it if there is nothing else pending for update-manager/you think it's worth an upload by itself
<xnox> oh right, cause i'm supposedly update-manager maintainer, ain't I.
 * xnox can't wait for mvo to come back =)
<seb128> ;-)
<GunnarHj> Hi seb128
<seb128> GunnarHj, hey
<GunnarHj> seb128: http://people.ubuntu.com/~gunnarhj/whats-new.html updated.
<GunnarHj> New wording in item 5.1 - it previously said "literally hundreds of different online sources", but we felt last night that it might not be correct.
<GunnarHj> Do you know the approximate true number?
<seb128> GunnarHj, check with mhr3
<seb128> he's working on dash/scopes
<GunnarHj> seb128: Ok, thanks.
<davidcalle> GunnarHj, seb128, it's more around 70 (if we count the various video sources that merged under the label "online videos")
<GunnarHj> davidcalle: So "dozens" is more correct than "literally hundreds" then?
<davidcalle> GunnarHj, I would say so :)
<GunnarHj> davidcalle: Ok, I think that's what I needed. Thanks!
<davidcalle> GunnarHj, np
<seb128> davidcalle, hey
<seb128> davidcalle, do you maintain the manpage scope? ;-)
<davidcalle> seb128, yeaaaah... That's a trap, right? :)
<davidcalle> seb128, oh, it's broken!
<seb128> davidcalle, not sure it's broken, but apport triggers every time you type "disk<enter>" in the dash
<seb128> which is quite annoying
<seb128> mhr3 said it's the manpages scope
<seb128> bug #1274669
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1274669 in libunity (Ubuntu) "scope-runner-dbus.py crashed with signal 5 in g_variant_new_va()" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1274669
<davidcalle> seb128, that sounds like it. Thanks for the heads-up.
<seb128> yw, would be great if that could be fixed before release ;-)
<seb128> thanks for looking at it!
<davidcalle> seb128, yep
<seb128> great
<seb128> webkit 3 - 0 Laney
<Laney> â
<Laney> that PPA needs to stop telling tales on me
<seb128> haha
<seb128> Laney, btw still planning to review the u-s-s/click branch?
<Laney> I'm doing it now
<seb128> great, thanks
<desrt> good morning
<pitti> hey desrt, how are you?
<desrt> starting my coffee intake :)
<desrt> pitti: i wanted to ask about your jenkins jhbuilding the other day ...
<desrt> i guess you stopped doing this?
<pitti> desrt: yes; I replied to you, you didn't see it?
<desrt> no...
<pitti> desrt: yes, it hasn't been maintained for a fair while; it didn't raise that much interest, it seems largely superseded by gnome-continuous
<desrt> pitti: it's also a 404 :)
<pitti> desrt: and we (as in Ubuntun desktop) haven't spent much time on GNOME recently
<desrt> i'm considering reviving it
<desrt> perhaps in an altered form
<Laney> gatox: should I be able to use your click mock service on the phone?
<gatox> Laney, no idea, i don't have a phone to test it there, and the emulator doesn't work here
<Laney> ok, doesn't work for me
<gatox> Laney, it works on the desktop
<Laney> yeah i wanted to check it on the phone
<gatox> Laney, i don't think the python app can start a process with ui in the phone, right??
<gatox> Laney, are you starting the ui manually, or the python process is doing it?
<Laney> the latter
<Laney> you have to pass that weird flag --desktop_file_hint
<Laney> but the updates panel comes up empty
<gatox> Laney, well, something in the way apps are launched in the phone can be doing something there and probably not usinng the env vars that the python process define
<Laney> gatox: ok, trying it on the desktop, can I get it to present an update?
<Laney> I just get 'software is up to date'
<gatox> Laney, running the mock service you should see 2 updates
<Laney> hmm there's a critical on the console about signond
<gatox> Laney, that is u1-creds
<Laney> right
<Laney> so i can't really test this
<gatox> Laney, well... signon actually always shows some errors, but seems to work, maybe dobey can guide you on this
<seb128> desrt, pitti: hey
<dobey> ignore the signond critical afaik
<dobey> but if you don't have a u1 account configured in online accounts, maybe it doesn't work?
<dobey> you have to use the qml system-settings to add it though, not the gtk+ control center
<Laney> I did
<Laney> seb128: can you run gvim quickly for me and see if the menus look normal?
<seb128> Laney, no they don't :p
<seb128> they have underscores and utf-8 weird chars
<ogra_> must be your weird language setting :P
<seb128> but the keybinding in menus are non standard
<ogra_> oh, wait, friday is tomorrow
<seb128> e.g ^R
<seb128> or :wq
<seb128> I can imagine unity-gtk-module having issue with that
<seb128> I wonder if we should blacklist or try to fix
<seb128> that's one for attente in any case
<Laney> ya, just checking if it was just me
<seb128> (he in .nz atm so probably eod)
<Laney> I get loads of glib criticals when running it from a terminal
<pitti> hey seb128, Ã§a va ?
<seb128> pitti, oui, et toi ?
<pitti> seb128: good as well, although my wrist is still troubling
<seb128> pitti, oh, what did you do (I think I asked earlier in the week when you said it was not ok but I'm not sure you replied/if I read the reply)
<pitti> seb128: nothing too bad (a "ganglion"), but it'll need a little operation
<seb128> oh ok :/
<seb128> good luck with that
<pitti> thanks
<seb128> when are you getting it fixed?
<seb128> do you know how long you are going to need to rest it/stop typing then?
<pitti> seb128: I don't know yet, will know more next Monday
<pitti> seb128: anyway, just sorting out travel for the client sprint, looking forward to Malta!
<seb128> yeah, same here
<seb128> I'm pondering taking some vac days to visit
<pitti> seb128: I'll arrive on Friday already (paying the weekend nights for myself), so I can hang out with you guys and explore the island
<seb128> oh
<pitti> seb128: (I'll be there officially only for teh second week)
<seb128> oh, same for me
<seb128> second week
<seb128> did you book hotel yet?
<pitti> seb128: my parents had been there, they said it's a really nice island
<pitti> seb128: no, booking flights first
<seb128> I'm going to come on friday as well then, I was looking for people who want maybe to visit ;-)
<pitti> seb128: I'll stay in the same hotel, much less trouble
<seb128> I was thinking the same
<pitti> seb128: I asked msm, we can just put that into a note in the spreadsheet, and the hotel will split the bill accordingly
<seb128> great
<seb128> want to share room for those extra days?
<seb128> (if you don't have a roomie yet)
<Laney> ah, I should have done that maybe
<Laney> oh well
<seb128> Laney, did you confirm flights yet?
<Laney> yeah
<pitti> seb128: sure; I was asking desrt as I thought you'd stay for two weeks
<pitti> seb128: desrt wanted to get back to you as he already signed up with you
<seb128> right
<pitti> it's that big dating party again :)
<seb128> there is some stories there
<pitti> Laney: you might still be able to move them?
<seb128> looks like mvo put my name
<pitti> haha
<seb128> but he didn't ask me
<Laney> haha
<Laney> I never bother to put anyone
<seb128> I'm emailing him :p
<seb128> Laney, you might end up with snorers!
<Laney> true ...
<pitti> seb128: well, so you+mvo, desrt+me perhaps?
<pitti> desrt: ^
<seb128> pitti, yeah, I was asking about those friday-saturday nights though
<Laney> there would be some fee to change it now
<seb128> pitti, I don't think desrt is coming earlier to visit
<Laney> i'll leave it
<desrt> seb128: i may :)
<desrt> if others will be there as well
<seb128> desrt, oh, I though you had booked already
<desrt> not yet
<desrt> should do that today maybe
<seb128> party!
<pitti> desrt: warning, I usually get up at 7 for some running (but I'll try to be quiet) :)
<seb128> haha
<desrt> pitti: warning: if seb is to be believed, i usually sleep on the floor
<seb128> larsu, didrocks: you guys are not coming early to take some vac/visit? :-)
<seb128> desrt, experience prove that's true!
<seb128> I should have taken photos
<seb128> ;-)
<desrt> mvo: warning: seb128 takes pictures of sleeping roommates
<didrocks> seb128: no, I will just enjoy my week-ends :p
<pitti> . o O { OMG, I'm sooo glad that this is a private channel which isn't logged into the interwebs or anything }
<desrt> (awkward silence)
<pitti> I think we just found a new NP hard problem, the "sprint roommate assignment"
<desrt> pitti: fortunately the problem distributes nicely
<larsu> seb128: I probably am
<larsu> or maybe staying late... don't know yet
 * larsu is too lazy to read scrollback
<desrt> larsu: you didn't miss much
<larsu> looks like threre was a lot going on
<larsu> I was fixing a bug in the meantime (hope you all feel bad now!)
<desrt> larsu: did you sort the rhythmbox/gtk/atk/init thing?
<larsu> I kind of came to the conclusion that it's not worth it
<larsu> we should just fix mpros
<larsu> *mrpis
<seb128> larsu, seems like some of us are going to come early (I was pondering between both but pitti is coming early so that pretty much decided it for me ;-)
<pitti> I'm honored :)
 * desrt copies pitti too
<larsu> early is better because there's another sprint before ours, right?
<desrt> plus... by encouraging seb to be there early rather than late, and this being malta, we get to enjoy seb's red head all week
<seb128> e.g coming on friday before
<seb128> spending the w.e visiting
<larsu> I will probably spend more than a weekend
<larsu> a week or so
<larsu> pitti: when are you going?
<pitti> larsu: my plan is to arrive Friday, May 23
<pitti> (asked for flights, but no answer yet)
<pitti> larsu: until Friday evening or Sat morning
<larsu> and travel around a bit on the weekend? Or just hanging out?
<desrt> sitting!
<pitti> larsu: both, I guess
<larsu> desrt: this is why I didn't ask you: I knew the answer ;)
<pitti> the neighbor island is just a quick boat trip away, and said to be marvellous
<larsu> ah cool
<pitti> and Malta itself certainly as well
<desrt> zomg
<desrt> coming on friday is basically impossible for me unless i want to pay _lots_
<larsu> come a week before then ;)
<larsu> I'm seriously considering that
<seb128> desrt, hahaha
<larsu> if my knee allows me to hike again...
<larsu> desrt: did you see chergert's autotools wrapper?
<seb128> larsu, desrt: I might be up for coming a bit earlier than friday as well
<seb128> not sure how much there is there
<seb128> like wednesday might be good enough for me
<seb128> 4-5 days, the island is small enough
<desrt> larsu: no.  i assume it is some sort of cargocult avoidance mechanism?
<larsu> desrt: err ... I don't know
<seb128> mterry, hey
<mterry> seb128, hello!
<mterry> seb128, brb
<seb128> mterry, can you look at the pagination mr/the review on it?
<Laney> haha
<seb128> !!!
<Laney> "hi, bye"
<seb128> typical mterry!
<mterry> seb128, :)  What's up?
<seb128> mterry, can you look at the pagination mr/the review on it?
<mterry> seb128, yeah was about to comment
<seb128> mterry, I've it in a silo, it looked fine to me, but Cimi seems to think you change change the condition for the enable/disable dots
<seb128> mterry, great
<Cimi> seb128, maybe I was wrong, I didn't test it
<Cimi> seb128, it should look that the first dots are filled, the remaining empty
<seb128> Cimi, see my comment on it? (or maybe wait for mterry to comment)
<mterry> Cimi, yeah, that's what the current logic does
<Cimi> sorry I need to enable mails for those merges
<seb128> Cimi, http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/uss.png
<seb128> Cimi, ignore the french and the fact that index is off by one
<seb128> that's what it looks like
<Cimi> this is fine, but the dot seems wrong
<seb128> (the index being wrong was a local issue when I took that screenshot)
<seb128> oh?
<Cimi> seb128, can you test at 18 gu?
<seb128> 18? they are currently at 1
<seb128> Cimi, mterry: well, anyway, the logic seems fine so I'm going to land that silo, we can fix dot look issues in a following merge if needed
<Cimi> loop index?
<Cimi> what kind of indexing we have :D
<darkxst> seb128, Laney Hi
<seb128> hey
<mterry> Cimi, 'index' is the index of the repeater object -- i.e. the loop for the delegate
<Cimi> I thought pagelist.index is the current page
<Cimi> so imagine current page is 3
<darkxst> so I think gnome-shell directly access the new dbus api through mutter
<Cimi> so index 0, 1, 2, 3 of the repeater are <= pagelist.index
<seb128> right
<darkxst> so its just g-c-c and g-s-d that require the gnome-desktop changes
<seb128> so they are enabled
<Cimi> yes
<seb128> so it's right ;-)
<seb128> darkxst, seems a new source/binary used by those 2 is enough?
<darkxst> I guess in theory it could work
<seb128> do you have any specific concerns about that approach?
<darkxst> seb128, no, I guess that is what happens on the ppa anyway and that seems to work
<darkxst> and its probably safer this late in the cycle
<Cimi> oh fuck
<Cimi> indeed index <= pagelist.index is like pagelist.index >= index
<Cimi> :D
<Cimi> think italian coffees are not strong enough
<Cimi> however in my defense I wrote that comment at midnight
<Cimi> I should not look into work stuff at those times :D
<seb128> darkxst, right, I just don't see the ffe being accepted and that seems an acceptable solution that should work for everyone
<seb128> Cimi, indeed ;-)
<Cimi> seb128, can you run at higher dpi?
<darkxst> seb128, yeh its getting way too  late.
<seb128> Cimi, you can do it, the debs are in https://launchpad.net/~ci-train-ppa-service/+archive/landing-018
<Laney> I'd want to see the split go away in U as soon as possible
<seb128> +1
<seb128> we can probably take on the initial approach in U
<Cimi> seb128, can you explain me this thing of the CI train?
<seb128> Cimi, people list things they want merged on https://docs.google.com/a/canonical.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AuDk72Lpx8U5dFlCc1VzeVZzWmdBZS11WERjdVc3dmc#gid=0
<seb128> Cimi, they get a ppa with the result, they validate it
<Cimi> seb128, I don't know if there was a mail about that, even if it was thunderbird kindly erased me all my messages
<seb128> then it get merged/uploaded
<Cimi> I read self service as title
<Cimi> and I thought about food
<darkxst> Laney, right, well no reason to maintain that split
<Laney> yes
<darkxst> that said, upstream are open to moving the app stuff, like thumbnailers into gtk
<darkxst> at which point gnome-desktop could be forked, since it would only tie directly to g-s-d/g-c-c etc
<darkxst> but I really need to get to bed now...
<seb128> darkxst, night
<seb128> ChrisTownsend, hey
<darkxst> night
<seb128> ChrisTownsend, do you know why compiz is not only setting a passive grab on the root window for the wheel-scroll-workspaces options?
<seb128> ChrisTownsend, (still trying to get that scrolling issues resolved for the LTS)
<seb128> desrt, pitti: I got a reply from mvo, he would like to room with me if I've nobody ... do you guy room together then?
<desrt> seb128: sounds good
<seb128> cool
<seb128> Laney, you could have picked the new pango bugfix, it has like 3 commits including a segfault fix ;-)
<Laney> didn't see it
<Laney> I can do that one in a bit, after lunch
<seb128> Laney, settings meeting in 25 min btw :p
<Laney> oh
<Laney> shit!
<seb128> lol
<seb128> no lunch for you!
<Laney> super late lunch
 * Laney eats own arm
<seb128> or quick snack between now and the meeting ;-)
<seb128> just eat in front of us in the hangout :p
<seb128> but if you do that don't eat your own arm please
<Laney> need to go out and get the veg bag and bread
 * Laney has interim tangerines
<ChrisTownsend> seb128: Hey, at this point it all boils down to a patch in X that got rejected.  With the patch, everything works as expected.  The issue even goes beyond the wheel-scroll-workspaces issue.  It also affects scrolling unfocused Gtk apps.
<seb128> ChrisTownsend, well, I was dicussing it with garnacho on #gtk+, he wrote
<seb128> <garnacho> seb128, you=compiz users, the root of the problem is compiz (and other WMs) doing passive grabs on scroll buttons, so the app sees the pointer "leave" and "enter" anytime that's triggered
<seb128> <garnacho> seb128, the combination of reparenting + scroll button grabs only seems to happen on compiz by default... and xfwm through config tweaking IIRC
<seb128> <garnacho> seb128, then why doesn't compiz only set the passive grab on the root window :)
<seb128>  
<seb128> ChrisTownsend, basically it's only an issue if you have a passive grab on the win, that shouldn't be the case on apps?
<ChrisTownsend> seb128: Hmm, I trust garnacho knows what he is talking about, but I think it's bigger than this.
<seb128> ChrisTownsend, he wrote that as well
<seb128> <garnacho> seb128, I did get to the unpleasant conclusion that the only thing we can do is calling XIQueryPointer() on XI_Enter (which is going to happen quite often for you), implementing that is still in my todo
<ChrisTownsend> seb128: Try scrolling an unfocused Gedit window.  This used to work before the original fix.  Is that really the fault of Compiz?
<seb128> ChrisTownsend, that should fix it for us, but it would still nice to avoid doing calls where not needed
<seb128> ChrisTownsend, there were other issues, I trust garnacho for knowing what he's doing/saying there
<ChrisTownsend> seb128: I can certainly look into how Compiz could set a passive grab on the root window.
<seb128> ChrisTownsend, things used to work but there were other issues (like scroll events sent back to the wrong windows and creating buggy scrolling on focus)
<seb128> ChrisTownsend, anyway, I'm just sharing the info I got
<ChrisTownsend> seb128: Right.  Ok, thanks.
<seb128> yw
<seb128> garnacho is eventually going to fix it in GTK
<seb128> but as he said, that's going to make us to more sync calls to X apis when not needed
<seb128> it would be better to only set the passive grab on those buttons where we need them
<ChrisTownsend> seb128: Ok, that's good.  I'll see what we can do on the Compiz side.  I admittedly am not very educated in this area, but I'll see what we can do.
<seb128> thanks
<ChrisTownsend> seb128: np
<seb128> charles, tedg, larsu, Laney, mpt, settings meeting?
<mpt> yep
<charles> yes
<larsu> on my way
<seb128> Laney, foooooooood
<Laney> I need to go out into the big bad cold world
<Laney> also I didn't quite catch what you said about resetting and AS and gsettings and syncing
<Laney> can you say it again in text? :-)
<Laney> hangouts man
<seb128> sorry about that, I was trying to remember that at the same time
<Laney> it wasn't very good audio quality
<seb128> they sync the launcher config from gsettings to a-s when a-s is empty
<seb128> so if you wipe out from a-s it's going to read gsettings
<Laney> O_O
<seb128> and copy that
<seb128> so basically you reset gsettings
<seb128> then wipe out a-s
<seb128> and it should do it
<Laney> that's weird, but ok
<Laney> what about the home screen config?
<Laney> will find out in a bit
 * Laney biab
<seb128> Laney, I don't know about that one
<seb128> Laney, have fun
<seb128> Laney, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-system-image/+bug/1207860 btw
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1207860 in Ubuntu system image "Need support for factory reset (needed by settings)" [Wishlist,Triaged]
<andyrock> seb128, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/1295194
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1295194 in Unity "[lockscreen] It's possible to lock a guest-session" [High,In progress]
<andyrock> i opened a new bug for that issue
<andyrock> proposed a fix too
<seb128> andyrock, thanks
<seb128> andyrock, I had one open about it no?
<andyrock> mmm nope that's about the option key
<seb128> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/1292154/comments/9
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1292154 in unity (Ubuntu) "Unity ignores "disable-lock-screen" desktop key" [High,Confirmed]
<seb128> oh, you copied the description to a new bug
<andyrock> well are two different issues
<seb128> cool
<seb128> thanks
<andyrock> yeah i'm to lazy to write
<andyrock> copy paste is faster
<andyrock> :D
<seb128> hehe
<seb128> thanks for fixing it!
<andyrock> seb128, i just got a fix for the double lockscreen when coming back from the greeter
<seb128> excellent!
<seb128> it's in gnome-screensaver?
<seb128> if so, send it for review, I'm about to go for some exercice but can review that once I'm back
<seb128> be back in ~1 hour
<andyrock> seb128, it's both unity and g-s but they are really small
<andyrock> i'll do some more tests
<andyrock> and I'll propose a fix
<Laney> cyphermox: :( do you know why I don't get nm-applet in panel any more?
<Laney> nlaney@iota> nm-applet                                                                                                                      ~
<Laney> ** (nm-applet:18661): WARNING **: Couldn't connect to accessibility bus: Failed to connect to socket /tmp/dbus-3wU79IWkFK: Connection refused
<Laney> ** (nm-applet:18661): CRITICAL **: nm_secret_agent_register: assertion 'priv->registered == FALSE' failed
<Laney> nm-applet-Message: using fallback from indicator to GtkStatusIcon
<Laney> gnome-panel that is
<cyphermox> yuck
<Laney> the secret agent thing only happened once it seems
<seb128> bregma, bschaefer: hey, so with today's unity update it seems like the indicator stacking issue is fixed, but we are back to have alt-tab showing over the lockscreen?
<seb128> bregma, bschaefer: can you guys add to your testplan to test that both work together? rather than bouncing forth and back between the issue with each landing ;-)
<seb128> mdeslaur, can you look at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gtk+3.0/+bug/1295220 ?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1295220 in gtk+3.0 (Ubuntu) "Images can't be viewed system-wide after libgtk3 update" [Undecided,New]
<seb128> mdeslaur, that seems to be your security update
<mdeslaur> seb128: hrm, sure
<seb128> mdeslaur, thanks, that's the only report so I don't think you broke the world, but in case you have some idea...
<bschaefer> seb128, how are you reproducing the alt+tab over the lockscreen? (I cant get that to happen here...)
<seb128> bschaefer, press alt, press tab, release tab but not not alt, press ctrl and L
<seb128> then you can alt-tab on the lock
<seb128> (similar steps to the one bregma had a week ago iirc)
<bschaefer> seb128, hmm let me check if that grab branch landed
<bschaefer> seb128, sorry, yes we have a fix and bregma is getting it all built (IIRC) atm: https://code.launchpad.net/~andyrock/unity/lockscreen-grab-fixes/+merge/211654
<seb128> bschaefer, oh ok, so what I said, every build go forth and back between fixing and restoring the issue, hopefully that one has all side covered ;-)
<seb128> okSb363Lucid
<seb128> bah
<sarnold> seb128: password? :)
<seb128> typed password on irc :p
<seb128> sarnold, yep, changing it
<bschaefer> seb128, sorry, yeah that grab branch was made a little late :)
 * sarnold tacks up the sign "zero days since a password was typed on irc"
<seb128> lol
<sarnold> seb128: heh at least you spotted it quickly :)
<bschaefer> seb128, i've done that before, luckly on a less populated irc :)
<bschaefer> though that would be the lockscreen there...
<sarnold> hehe, the dangers of testing lockscreen bugs? :)
<seb128> yeah, and I though I had focus because I clicked on the lock entry
<seb128> oh well
<bschaefer> seb128, :), the worse one was the xmir + tty...i typed my password in irc to many times :(
<seb128> passwd changed
<sarnold> bschaefer: haha, nice :)
<bschaefer> seb128, also, got the french layout regression fixed here for you: https://code.launchpad.net/~brandontschaefer/unity/fix-super+num-shortcut-to-keycode/+merge/211839
<bschaefer> seb128, not sure if you had a bug for it yet, I didnt see one so i made my own
<seb128> bschaefer, thanks, I saw that... I mentioned it to didrocks the other day but forgot to file a bug
<seb128> on that note, dinner time
<bschaefer> seb128, enjoy!
<seb128> thanks
<oliver_g> hi
<oliver_g> there are two changes in upcoming gedit 3.12 which I'd like to have in the Gedit version in Trusty...
<oliver_g> I suppose upgrading to Gedit 3.12 (or downgrading to 3.8) is out of question, but would it be possible to backport the changes?
<oliver_g> this is about https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=726408 (Allow plugins to set/get the search context in GeditDocument)
<ubot2> Gnome bug 726408 in search and replace "Allow plugins to set/get the search context in GeditDocument" [Enhancement,Resolved: fixed]
<oliver_g> and https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=725424 (filebrowser plugin doesn't support add_context_item/remove_context_item message any more)
<ubot2> Gnome bug 725424 in Plugins "filebrowser plugin doesn't support add_context_item/remove_context_item message any more" [Normal,Unconfirmed]
<oliver_g> in both cases the current 3.10 version lacks features that are somewhat available in 3.8 and have been fixed again in 3.12 :-/
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-03-21
<pitti> Good morning
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<Laney> hello!
<seb128> Laney, hey, happy friday!
<Laney> hey seb128 (& pitti), happy friday to you!
<Laney> nice and sunny here
<seb128> grey and windy here
<seb128> it was nice and sunny yesterday
<seb128> give it back!
<Laney> http://www.bbc.co.uk/weather/2641170
<Laney> i think you can have it in 5-6 hours :P
<seb128> lol
<seb128> http://www.meteofrance.com/previsions-meteo-france/metz/57000
<seb128> seems like we are just getting the rain :/
<Laney> mmm, bad weekends for us
<seb128> nice, robert_ancell fixed the "can't type password on the greeter" bug in unity-greeter
<Laney> great
<pitti> hey Laney, bonjour seb128
<pitti> nice & sunny here too, already 20 degrees
<seb128> pitti, hey, wie gehts? happy friday!
<pitti> what a great start of spring :)
<pitti> seb128: quite fine, thanks!
<Sweetshark> Moin!
<pitti> moin Sweetshark, frohen Fruehlingsanfang!
<seb128> pitti, lucky you
<seb128> pitti, http://www.meteofrance.com/previsions-meteo-france/metz/57000 is what we get :/
<pitti> seb128: :(
<pitti> seb128: mais il sera mieux la semaine prochaine
<seb128> pitti, oui
<Saviq> can someone please make bug #1200270 public?
<seb128> Saviq, done
<Saviq> seb128, thanks
<seb128> oh, nice
<seb128> I just hit that this morning
<seb128> or similar, a compiz segfault in libframe
<Saviq> freakin 24Â° in March...
<ogra_> yeah
<ogra_> unbelivable
<ogra_> Saviq, you guys at least had some winter  over there ...
<ogra_> we didnt ... not even below zero
<Saviq> ogra_, the New Yorkers stole all the winder
<ogra_> europe will get eaten by insects this summer
<Saviq> *winter
<mdeslaur> seb128: hrm, seems some people are having a regression, but I can't reproduce it..
<mdeslaur> seb128: http://askubuntu.com/questions/436385/segmentation-fault-when-installing-librsvg2-common-and-libgdk-pixbuf2-0
<mdeslaur> seb128: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gdk-pixbuf/+bug/1174253
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1174253 in gdk-pixbuf (Ubuntu) "Segfault (core dumped) in gdk-pixbuf on upgrade" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<seb128> mdeslaur, hum :/
<seb128> mdeslaur, nessita has the issue on a precise box some days ago, but she had a glib 2.37 from a ppa (where precise has 2.32) so we though it was due to the ppa, maybe it was not
<seb128> mdeslaur, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/7119828/ was the stacktrace she had
<seb128> mdeslaur, looking to the gtk diff it's weird that it leads to those issues :/
<mdeslaur> seb128: not sure what gtk+3.0 has to do with that stacktrace...
<seb128> mdeslaur, nothing, that's what said
<mdeslaur> the only thing I can think of is that the librsvg update triggered gdk-pixbuf in the postinst
<seb128> mdeslaur, when you say regression it implies change, but gdk-pixbuf didn't change?
<mdeslaur> nope, it didn't
<mdeslaur> but librsvg does this:  dpkg-trigger --no-await /usr/lib/#MULTIARCH#/gdk-pixbuf-2.0/*/loaders
<mdeslaur> so perhaps their gdk-pixbuf was already broken, and the update just triggered it
<seb128> yeah
<seb128> did we get many reports?
<seb128> I didn't see any out of the one I pointed you at yesterday
<mdeslaur> no, just the bug you showed me yesterday, and 3-4 people adding me-toos to the old gdk-pixbuf bug
<seb128> k
<Laney> actually
<mdeslaur> so it doesn't seem widespread
<Laney> I can get that if I install librvg2-common in a precise-chroot then upgrade librsvg2-common libglib2.0-0 to raring
<Laney> which is what the original reporter of that bug had
<seb128> oh, interesting
<seb128> the loader is in common
<mdeslaur> Laney: hrm, interesting...which resembles what nessita had too, an updated glib
<seb128> Laney, does that upgrade the lib with it?
<seb128> mdeslaur, can the lib and -common (=loader) get out of sync?
<mdeslaur> seb128: ?
<seb128> mdeslaur, what happen if you update librsvg2-common (that has the gdk-pixbuf loader)
<Laney> yes it updates the library
<seb128> mdeslaur, does that pull in the new lib?
<seb128> hum, ok, so it's not those getting out of sync :/
<seb128> I though maybe we would get the new loader with the old lib
<Laney> i can't get it within precise
<seb128> do you get it if you upgrade glib and not librsvg2-common?
<seb128> glib to raring
<seb128> e.g is that old librsvg and new glib which is the issue?
<Laney> sec, checking if it happens in a supported upgrade path
<mdeslaur> it may be just a side effect of the trigger in the librsvg postinst, and have nothing to actually do with librsvg itself
<Laney> I expect that's the case
<Laney> you can get it if you run gdk-pixbuf-query-loaders
<mdeslaur> yeah
 * mdeslaur wait impatiently for real hardware to finish installing
<Laney> bah, yeah, it happens on trusty upgrade too
<seb128> oh
<seb128> Laney, same bt?
<Laney> sec
<Laney> just upgrading glib is enough
<seb128> deeeeesssssrrttt
<seb128> Laney, btw on a similar not, https://errors.ubuntu.com/problem/51867c7babfc41c749a4ed34ba54148f534a28c1 is ranked high on trusty issue and is also a segfault on precise->trusty updates
<seb128> bug 1272977
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1272977 in gtk+3.0 (Ubuntu) "gtk-update-icon-cache segfaults in gdk_pixbuf_io_init()" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1272977
 * seb128 hates in session upgrades
<Laney> http://paste.ubuntu.com/7130341/
<seb128> seems like the dlopen fails?
<seb128> _dlerror_run
<seb128> errstring = 0x10101010000007c <error: Cannot access memory at address 0x10101010000007c>
<mdeslaur> ugh
<mdeslaur> https://launchpad.net/~webupd8team/+archive/gvfs-libmtp
<mdeslaur> that ppa installs an updated glib on precise
<seb128> it's not the only one
<mdeslaur> seb128: you're scaring me :)
<seb128> lol
<seb128> well, nessita has 2.37 from a scope testing ppa (though a private one)
<seb128> we can't do a lot to prevent ppa users to run into issues...
<seb128> we should look at the precise->trusty upgrade issue though
<mdeslaur> seb128, Laney: thanks for your help
 * mdeslaur feels better now
<seb128> mdeslaur, I didn't do much, but yw!
<Laney> at least we found a bug in trusty upgrades
<Laney> I wonder how we didn't notice it in raring
<seb128> I wonder if it's the same as the gtk-update-icon-cache one
<Laney> I don't get that
<Laney> not in this partially upgraded state anyway
<seb128> well, e.u.c suggest a lot more users get that one that the one you are getting
<seb128> it's concerning that a glib update makes gdk-pixbuf segfault though
<seb128> glib is supposed to be ABI compatible
<seb128> let's see if desrt have a clue what could be going on there
<Laney> yeah if you upgrade gdk-pixbuf it goes away
<Laney> that probably happens on upgrades
<seb128> we can avoid it, but still updating glib should make gdkpixbug segfault
<Laney> should *not* :P
<seb128> yeah, I need to stop forgetting the not :p
<seb128> on the list of frequent trusty issue as well
<seb128> software-center hitting
<seb128>  The following packages have unmet dependencies:
<seb128> steam-launcher: Depends: jockey-common but it is not going to be installed
<seb128>                 Depends: libc6 (>= 2.15) but 2.19-0ubuntu2 is to be installed
<seb128>  
<seb128> is steam-launcher something we ship/provide?
<seb128> oh
<seb128> https://apps.ubuntu.com/cat/applications/steam-launcher/
<Laney> it's not in the archive
<Laney> s-c wants me to 'Buy' it... where do those come from?
<bregma> seb128, I've been testing a bunch of lockscreen fixes in landing-006, and everything is fine on one of my test machines but another one has trouble after switching to the guest session fro the lockscreen: bschaefer could not reproduce, could I get you to also test it for me, in case I just have a messed-up test machine?
<seb128> bregma, hey, sure
<seb128> bregma, what specific issue do you have? seems to work fine me, I switched forth and back a few time between my user and a guest using the indicator, no problem (out of the "screen lock dialog is displayed for your user when coming from the greeter", which is not a new issue)
<bregma> (1) my mouse disappears when switching to the guest (I have a touchscreen, so I'm not completely hosed) and (2) when I switch back to my own session, the lockscreen comes up for the guest account (at which point I am hosed, because there is no password)
<bregma> but only on my one machine
<bregma> so I do suspect something weird on that machine
<seb128> how do you go back your session?
<bregma> I touch the menu option in the sesson menu
<seb128> but yeah, I can't even imagine how your user-session-process-unity would ask you to unlock for guest
<seb128> are you sure are on the right vt?
<seb128> tried to ctrl-alt-f7?
<bregma> the only graphics vt is vt7, and if I switch to the guest session without the lockscreen on, switching back to my session always gives me the guest session after flashing my session briefly on the screen
<seb128> it looks like lightdm or something nuked your user session and put the guest on that vt
<seb128> do you play with Mir/system compositor on that box?
<bregma> it's possibly I have a messed-up lightdm config
<seb128> well anyway, I doubt it's unity's doing
<seb128> I fail to see how unity could lead to that
<seb128> so +1 from me for publishing the silo to the archive ;-)
<bregma> agreed, thanks for conforming the problem is on my end
<seb128> yw, always happy to help landing bugfixes ;-)
<desrt> seb128, Laney, anyone: does anyone know the gcc bug that means g_return_if_fail() return types are mismatched?
<seb128> desrt, is that the one larsu mentioned? no...
<desrt> ah.  i thought one of you guys told me about it
<desrt> maybe it was larsu :)
<seb128> desrt, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gcc-4.8/+bug/1234218
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1234218 in gcc-4.8 (Ubuntu) "4.8 doesn't throw -Wreturn-type anymore for wrong returns in macros" [Undecided,New]
<seb128> desrt, that one?
<desrt> yes.  thanks.
<desrt> erm
<desrt> no upstream link
<desrt> is it possible that nobody has actually reported this issue to gcc? :)
<seb128> desrt, could be
<seb128> desrt, larsu is off today
<ritz> chrisccoulson, hi, is it possible to update to tb 24.4.0 on precise , or do I need to file an sru on this ?
<ritz> wrt https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/thunderbird/+bug/1281887
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1281887 in thunderbird (Ubuntu) "upgrade thunderbird to 24.4.0" [Undecided,New]
<ritz> seb128, could we mark this as wont fix against precise ? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/precise/+source/vino/+bug/1027086
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1027086 in vino (Ubuntu Precise) "incorrect schema setting used for authentication-methods in vino server" [Medium,In progress]
<ritz> Sweetshark, hi, wrt http://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1200277 . is there an ETA ?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1200277 in libreoffice (Ubuntu) "[LibreOffice] - libreoffice-writer.desktop when drag/drop to desktop, 100% broken. " [Medium,Fix committed]
<ritz> for precise and trusty
<Guest19431> can i install gnome3.10 in ubuntu12.04 by any means?
<seb128> ritz, why? I put it triaged/low in case somebody wants to come with a proper solution
<seb128> Guest19431, try #ubuntu for user questions, and probably not
<Guest19431> seb128, sorry i m new here
<ritz> seb128, upstream believe, the correct fix is as posted
<ritz> and to for bad inputs to generates warning.
<seb128> ritz, so why wontfix?
<ritz> seb128, difference of opinion between what is supposed to be the correct fix, and what the upstream believes is the correct fix
<seb128> ritz, k, it's not important enough for me to try to argue more over it, let's keep it as triaged/low
<ritz> seb128, fair point. this has been fixed in raring and above ( with upstream)
<ritz> leaving precise as it is
<seb128> k
<Sweetshark> ritz: for the archive: trusty in the next days. precise: if needed we can make an SRU extra for that, otherwise: when something else shows up ...
<ritz> Sweetshark, thank you :)
<Sweetshark> ritz: Do we need a precise SRU?
<ritz> Sweetshark++ seb128++
<chrisccoulson> ritz, no need to report a bug, it will get updated when i have time. it's not particularly urgent
<ritz> chrisccoulson, thanks , I will remove the ubuntu-sponsor from the subscriber
<Trevinho> seb128: hey, for unity scaling changes have you got some time to check https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/unity-control-center/applications-scaling-selector/+merge/212114 ?
<Trevinho> seb128: there are probably some strings to improve
<seb128> Trevinho, hey, not really, maybe in some hours, I've like 10 things on my todo for the day
<Trevinho> seb128: ok, np
<seb128> Trevinho, do you have a screenshot? ;-)
<Trevinho> seb128: in a sec
<seb128> Laney, ^ do you have spare cycle/want to help with that maybe? (not sure what you got on your plate to end this friday ;-)
<Trevinho> seb128: http://imgur.com/brK7lQN
<Laney> I think you should ask mpt to review the approach and strings
<Laney> Applications Scale target is surely going to need work :P
<Laney> but yeah, can look at the code in a bit
<Trevinho> Laney: yeah, consider the strings a stub
 * Trevinho can't word things .P
<Trevinho> seb128, Laney and http://i.imgur.com/X7ob0sC.png
<Trevinho> also for Use {max,min}...
<seb128> Trevinho, I don't understand what those options mean :p
<Trevinho> it's probably better to just to add Use Max available scale and... "Never scale apps"...
<Trevinho> seb128: that's why I said strings need work :D
<Laney> do you think those ones are required?
<Laney> I just imagined listing the monitors and a never one
<seb128> Trevinho, in the UI still fitting on a netbook vertical resolution?
<Trevinho> seb128: eheh, btw well. they means to use the min or max scale values acrosso monitors
<Trevinho> seb128: mh, the window is 661px...
<Trevinho> height
<seb128> Trevinho, so doesn't fit on 1024x600 which netbooks use
<Trevinho> seb128: i would loved to remove some padding above the UI scale, but I wasn't able :P
<seb128> we have lot of space on the right :p
<Trevinho> seb128: mh, I would have used that as well... but I didn't want to beak the actual way to dispose things
<Trevinho> let me see what I can do
<mpt> âUI scaleâ and âApplications Scale targetâ? Yer what?
<mpt> I donât know what âUse maximum monitor scaleâ means either :-(
<Laney> I'm not sure those are necessary
<Trevinho> mpt: well, wording must be improved absolutely.. I just left the first "dev stinrgs" there...
<Trevinho> mpt: max,min: means use for all the applications the {max,min} ui sale set per monitor
<Laney> the monitor with the largest scaling factor
<Trevinho> mpt: btw actually we should instead just add: "Use the monitor with largest scaling factor" or... "Never scale applications".
<Trevinho> don't caring about the minimum value....
<mpt> What do you mean by âUse the monitorâ? Would that move all windows to that display?
<Laney> for the "Application scaling"
<Laney> vs UI scaling
<Trevinho> mpt: no, the fact is that the UI scale, when it comes to toolkits, is not per monitor basis
<Trevinho> mpt: but a global value
<mpt> Trevinho, sure, I wrote <https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BrightnessAndDisplays#Scaling>
<mpt> so I understand that part at least :-)
<Trevinho> so, to we need the user to define what scaling to use at global level
<Trevinho> ok...
<Trevinho> :)
<mpt> So which of the three settings would âUse maximum monitor scaleâ change, and to what?
<Trevinho> ah, I didn't see the new diesngs
<Laney> that even has a two column layout
<mpt> Trevinho, I understand that this menu is a quick placeholder for 14.04
<mpt> I guess âUI scaleâ maps to ui-scale, that much is obvious :)
<Trevinho> mpt: yeah, but let me see because probably I can adjust the things to match design more...
<mpt> Laney, yeah, that was to solve the issue where we currently have three rows of stuff for the current display, followed by two rows of display-independent stuff, followed by one row of stuff for the current display, followed by one more row of display-independent stuff
<Laney> mpt: yeah, but it also solves another problem in that the UI becomes too tall for netbook-like screens if we keep growing downwards
<Laney> I'm all in favour of implementing more of that design if it's reasonable to do so in fairly short order
<Trevinho> Laney: good
<Trevinho> mpt: there's just one thing the "Scale of r menu and title bars" can't be called in that way, since it will only apply to Shell elements
<Trevinho> so to panel, decorations, launcher... but no menu
<mpt> Trevinho, the menu bar isnât a shell element??
<Trevinho> mpt: menu bar yes... but no menu content.. I mean, I know you're talking of "bars", but I don't want it to might be considered as it includes also the menu themselves
<mpt> Trevinho, I understand that it will change the size of menus that come down from the menu bar, but not context menus or popup menus etc
<mpt> Is that right?
<Trevinho> mpt: no :(
<Trevinho> mpt: the menus won't scale,
<mpt> oh crikey
<mpt> So the menu contents will be smaller/larger than the menu titles?
<Trevinho> mpt: at least, it *might* be possible to achieve... but not done yet
<Trevinho> it can happen now yes
<mpt> haha
<mpt> ok
<Trevinho> let me think...
<mpt> Itâs okay for those labels not to be exhaustive, they have what lawyers call a âpenumbraâ where you can guess what other sorts of things will be affected
<Trevinho> mpt: mh, I don't think that the gtk-text-scale factor can be applied to only one widget... Laney?
<mpt> â¦from the examples given. For example, I think the Windows equivalent of this setting refers to âmenus and dialogsâ, not needing to mention that it affects lots of other things too.
<mpt> And I left out the Launcher because I wanted to avoid confusion with the Launcherâs separate size control (though this setting does affect the Launcher too).
<Trevinho> yeah, right
<Trevinho> why not just "scale for panels"?
<mpt> Trevinho, would you be happy with âSize for menu bar and title barsâ? That doesnât claim that menu bar *menus* will change size too (though it would be nice if they did).
<Trevinho> mpt: ok, that's fine... :)
<mpt> cool
<mpt> (We donât use the term âpanelsâ anywhere in the UI or help, afaik, but we do use âmenu barâ in several areas of System Settings)
<Trevinho> mpt: btw the settings I added where considering also another fact: how to handle things when new monitors are attached...
<Trevinho> mpt: I mean, what to do: resize the APPS to default scale, or no?
<mpt> Trevinho, you mean resize apps on all displays to match the ui-scale of the newly-detected display?
<Trevinho> mpt: yes
<Trevinho> mpt: or keep things big as in the "current" dpy?
<Trevinho> (let's imagine we're on an hidpi laptop)
<mpt> Trevinho, would that also mean changing them back automatically when the display is disconnected?
<Trevinho> mpt: yes
<Trevinho> mpt: that's happening right now..
<Trevinho> mpt: err, for now the option in unity is to always apply the maximum scaling factor available in monitors to apps... But that can be falsified easily
<mpt> Trevinho, what do you mean by âfalsifiedâ?
<seb128> desrt, do you have any idea why old gdk-pixbuf would hit http://paste.ubuntu.com/7130341/ when running with a new glib (e.g precise gdk-pixbuf running with glib > 2.36 (instead of 2.32))
<Trevinho> mpt: that there's an option that can be set to false to globally use the normal scale factor instead
<mpt> Trevinho, by ânormalâ do you mean 1? Or something else?
<Trevinho> mpt: 1, or just the minimum value available across monitors
<desrt> seb128: yes.
<desrt> the old loader query program didn't use gobject
<desrt> but many of the loaders themselves did
<desrt> so gobject would get loaded and unloaded repeatedly, each time a loader was queried
<desrt> even if the query function didn't use it
<desrt> upstream gdkpixbuf links -lgobject explicitly to avoid this
<desrt> but as-needed linker flags circumvent that
<desrt> so we added an explicit g_type_ensure(G_TYPE_OBJECT) to circumvent the circumvention
<seb128> Laney, mdeslaur: ^ fyi
<mpt> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BrightnessAndDisplays?action=diff&rev2=11&rev1=10
<desrt> seb128: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=686822
<ubot2> Gnome bug 686822 in gobject "possible dlopen()/dlclose() issue with automatic g_type_init()" [Normal,Resolved: fixed]
<seb128> desrt, I'm unsure to understand why updating glib leads to a segfault there?
<desrt> fixed since late 2012... must be some very old gdk-pixbuf you have there
<mpt> Trevinho, so when itâs false, you have *scale-factor = 1. When itâs true, you have *scale-factor automatically matching the ui-scale of â¦ what? Whichever remaining display was connected last?
<seb128> desrt, it's 12.04 dude
<desrt> seb128: the difference is that new glib does g_type_init() automatically on module load
<desrt> the module was always being improperly loaded/unloaded before
<desrt> but it did no harm
<seb128> so we should backport https://bug686822.bugzilla-attachments.gnome.org/attachment.cgi?id=227203
<seb128> ?
<desrt> yes
<desrt> or stop using as-needed
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> desrt, I'm glad you replied, would have taken ages to figure out what was happening there
<desrt> seb128: it took me ages to figure it out the first time ;)
<seb128> mdeslaur, do you want to security update that, or should I just SRU it?
<seb128> Laney, or maybe you want to do the SRU? you had a chroot/test setup to reproduce it
<mdeslaur> seb128: sru it please
<Laney> yeah I can cherry-pick that easily
<Laney> do you have the bug report to hand?
<seb128> Laney, bug #1174253
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1174253 in gdk-pixbuf (Ubuntu) "Segfault (core dumped) in gdk-pixbuf on upgrade" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1174253
<Laney> ty
<desrt> i love g_type_ensure
<desrt> it's such a tricky function
<desrt> such a devious implementation
<Trevinho> mpt: oh I missed the msg, sorry. But when false it uses the scale-factor that matches the lower value across all available monitors (probably to revert and just use always 1). When true it uses the scale factor that matches the UI scale of the connected monitor that has the maximum UI scale value
<Laney> could you use the slider as per the design?
<mpt> Trevinho, but that would mean there is no setting for ânever touch the scale factor automaticallyâ, right?
<mpt> (evidence for the âboolean parameters considered harmfulâ theory)
<Laney> boolean parameters considered harmful [x]
<mpt> [_[ ON ]]
<Laney> desrt: of course we don't have g_type_ensure in precise
<Trevinho> mpt: no, but I might consider to just ignore the minimum thing, and use the default 1.0 instead
<seb128> dobey, hey, is https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/software-center/+bug/1244493 still on your list? trusty beta freeze is on monday
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1244493 in software-center (Ubuntu) "Software Center doesn't save settings on Saucy" [High,Confirmed]
<jose> hey mterry, around?
<mterry> jose, yes
<jose> mterry: mind a quick PM?
<mterry> jose, go crazy :)
<dobey> seb128: ah, sorry. been dealing with click scope issues
<seb128> dobey, no worry, I was just remind you in case you forgot about it ;-)
<jose> hey guys! anyone from the desktop team has a minute? I'd like to make an invitation on behalf of the Classroom team
<Laney> seb128: could you please do queue -Q unapproved -s precise-proposed reject 7198759 for me?
<Laney> might make you give a reason too
<Laney> which is 'laney sucks'
<seb128> is that the oldest upload?
<Laney> ya
<seb128> I prefer https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/precise/+queue?queue_state=1 to the command line
<Laney> do you use the web UI? ;-)
<seb128> yeah
<Laney> I see
<seb128> so you went for LDFLAGS += -Wl,--no-as-needed
<seb128> lgtm
<seb128> Laney, rejected, thanks for the SRU!
<Laney> yeah g_type_ensure doesn't exist in precise sadly
<Laney> ok, time to go away
<Laney> have a good weekend :-)
<seb128> Laney, thanks, you too!
<kenvandine> seb128, can you check my uss branch?
<kenvandine> bill and i have tested it in the silo
<seb128> kenvandine, yeah, -1 for it, please delete the silo
<seb128> kenvandine, (that's the penalty for trying to do a friday upload)
<seb128> kenvandine, ;-)
<kenvandine> :)
<seb128> kenvandine, ok, looks fine, I trust your testing so approved, enjoy ;-)
<kenvandine> thx seb128
<seb128> kenvandine, yw!
<seb128> kenvandine, how is the testing going? getting it green for landing?
<kenvandine> seb128, enjoy your weekend :)
<kenvandine> yeah
<seb128> kenvandine, thanks, you too
<kenvandine> only complication is coordinating landing of gallery
<kenvandine> since it's a click
<chrisccoulson> good evening!
<seb128> chrisccoulson, hey, how are you? are you still working?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, yep, i'm always still working ;)
<chrisccoulson> how are you?
<seb128> chrisccoulson, or did you IRC from your phone drinking a beer at the pub? ;-)
<chrisccoulson> lol
<seb128> chrisccoulson, I'm good thanks ;-)
<seb128> just back from dinner, drinking a glass of wine and chatting a bit on IRC before closing it and calling it a week ;-)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, are you going to be in Malta?
<chrisccoulson> seb128, i am, although i was going to join the apps week, but i'm on holiday the week prior to that so i'll be there in the second week ;)
<seb128> chrisccoulson, that's great, you can hang out with us again ;-)
<chrisccoulson> heh
<seb128> we didn't see you for a while
<chrisccoulson> i'm looking forward to having a non-US trip :)
<seb128> you should come the first week and take holidays with some of us ;-)
<chrisccoulson> heh, i've got a family holiday the week before that :)
<chrisccoulson> oh, nice, i wanted to create a https server in python, and this blog post from pitti was the first hit in google: http://www.piware.de/2011/01/creating-an-https-server-in-python/ \o/
 * chrisccoulson hugs pitti
<JanC> chrisccoulson: just remember that it's not really a _full_ SSL/TLS server  :)
<chrisccoulson> JanC, that's fine, I don't need one ;)
<JanC> as long as you're aware of that it's fine :)
<JanC> well, you and everybody else involved
<sarnold> JanC: what's missing from this cute little simple server? :)
<sarnold> I mean, I wouldn't expect e.g. SNI to work, but otherwise I'm curious where it could go wrong :)
<Trevinho> mterry: hey, do you have some time to check https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/unity-control-center/use-unity-text-scale-factor/+merge/212249 ?
<mterry> Trevinho, uh sure
<Trevinho> mterry: thanks
<mterry> Trevinho, so what's the difference between the unity key and the other?  Like, why do we have our own key?
 * mterry doesn't know history here
<Trevinho> mterry: the fact is that when we have UI scale set in unity, it will scale (if set) the user applications mixing the text-scaling factor and the ui-scale factor from gtk (see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BrightnessAndDisplays#Scaling), then at that point the gnome text scale factor might be changed....
<Trevinho> then we need a place to store the actual text scale factor that we multiply to our scaling. Also in order to get a11y settings to work.
<Trevinho> So we have our own setting now, that will be applied to the gnome text-scaling factor parameter by unity
<mterry> Trevinho, so both the GNOME text-scaling-factor and the Unity text-scale-factor are both applied?
<Trevinho> mterry: well, yes... I mean the gnome text-scaling-factor is used when scaling the UI in interrim values (i.e. you scale your UI at 1.5 or 1.75...), then if you set also the unity text-scaling-factor the gnome scaling factor will bump to the previous value * unity-text-scaling-factor
<mterry> Trevinho, this is not making it clearer to me.  Maybe I'm too Friday'd
<Trevinho> mterry: or more likely I'm explaing it not that well :)
<Trevinho> mterry: so.... In UCC we now have a UI scale parameter... This parameter right now applies only to the shell; but we're changing it to apply also to system (if user wants).
<Trevinho> mterry: to achieve that, since Gtk ui-scale-factor is only an integer, we play mixing it with the text-scaling-factor
<mterry> Trevinho, So GNOME text-scaling-factor is an integer?  But Unity text-scale-factor is a double?
<Trevinho> so if you've a UI scale set at 1.5, the gnome ui scale is 1, and the text-scale-factor 1.5... If the ui scale is 2.5, the gnome ui scsale is 2, and the text scale factor is 1.25
<Trevinho> mterry: no, gnome text-scaling-factor is a double, but gnome UI.scaling-factor is an int
<mterry> Trevinho, I'm just trying to figure out why we have our own version of GNOME's text-scaling-factor instead of using theirs
<Trevinho> mterry: we use that, but we also use that for scaling the UI in general. But if an user changed the option to see "Big text" in a11y options, then that won't work... so here's why the new setting
<Trevinho> that's also because in unity we scale things using cairo, and technically this saves us a lot of rewriting...
<mterry> Trevinho, do I need another package to test this?  One with the scheme used?  I don't see that schema on my desktop (com.canonical.Unity.Interface)
<Trevinho> mterry: yeah, I've linked the unity branch on the review
<mterry> Trevinho, I still don't fully understand, but I'll trust that you folks do  :)
<mterry> Trevinho, oh!  didn't see that
<mterry> Trevinho, I don't believe you did link it?
<Trevinho> mterry: I added it just after pinging you, so maybe you have been faster on loading the page
<mterry> Oh, I refreshed
<Trevinho> mterry: https://code.launchpad.net/+branch/~3v1n0/unity/scale-factor-binding
<mterry> Trevinho, also, why does UCC cater to non-unity environments?  I figured we forked so we didn't have to  :)
<Trevinho> mterry: yeah, in fact i wanted to ask about it... my initial commit was without checking unity env... Then I noticed that all the rest of the unity code was sitll doing it, so I was wondering it still had to be done
<Trevinho> mterry: but if i can revert the change in a sec
<Trevinho> err, ucc code I mean
<mterry> Trevinho, I don't know myself, might want to check with seb128 about that.  But if rest of code does, I'd say go along with that and a purge merge could be made later
<Trevinho> althuogh I was pretty sure it wasn't used in other envs, but... just to check
<mterry> Trevinho, OK, code looks fine, but I just want to play with it myself.  Which means building unity.  So it'll take me a while, but I'll get there
<mterry> Trevinho, unless there's urgency?
<Trevinho> mterry: well we'd like to push unity now, with that in a silo... so if you want you can just wait the silo and then trying from the ppa
<Trevinho> mterry: unity doesn't depend strictly on it, but I preferred to push them together not to break the user settings
<Trevinho> mterry: also if that would happen only for people with HIdpi scale values
<Trevinho> (i mean, the u-c-c- big text option wouldn't be considered)
<mterry> Trevinho, ok, then I'll just approve.  Looks reasonable
<Trevinho> mterry: thanks... I'll let you know when the ppa is ready
<Trevinho> or bregma ^
<mterry> Trevinho, done
<Trevinho> mterry: ta
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-03-22
<Rubytox> Hi!
#ubuntu-desktop 2014-03-23
<Fudge> attente:  are you ears on?
<Fudge> bug #1282782, was wondering if that would also in your opinion cause Orca to read the title of the active window everytime the 'alt' key is touched?
<ubot2> Launchpad bug 1282782 in compiz (Ubuntu) "Newest compiz/unity has decided that it owns my Alt key" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1282782
<attente> Fudge: not really sure tbh
<Fudge> attente:  thanks anyway mate
<Fudge> I'll keep looking
<attente> holding the alt key does show the menu bar
<attente> but i'm not really familiar with how orca works
<attente> it definitely sounds plausible though
<Fudge> :) basically if you had Orca running, push ALT a bunch of times and Orca will on each keypress read the title of the window. e.g On thunderbird just now, alt=orca saying inbox unified folders mozilla thunderbird frame then if I push it again I hear it again.
<attente> Fudge: do you know how long that bug has been happening?
<Fudge> quite a while attente , I've been on Trusty from the start, I would have to say confidently at least a few months.
<attente> Fudge: so that bug that you linked to here started around late Jan, early Feb
<attente> i mean the regression was introduced around that time
<Fudge> is it specific to jsut gnome terminal?
<attente> Fudge: no, but holding the alt key in general causes the menu bar to become visible
<attente> Fudge: sorry, it was actually introduced on Feb 14
<Fudge> ah the penny drops, so it is hidden before then is it?
<attente> Fudge: before alt had no effect on showing the menu bar due to a bug
<Fudge> how about tapping the alt, does it start to appear?
<attente> Fudge: tapping alt would cause the hud to appear
<Fudge> I have hud disabled
<attente> but i don't know why it would cause the screenreader to read the window title
<attente> hmm.
<Fudge> it could be since the bar is appearing that Orca is reading the whole thing and not just the menu focus?
<attente> Fudge: if you remember having the bug older than Feb 14-ish, i'd say it's caused by something else.. sorry :(
<Fudge> I'll ask Themuso since you've given me better understanding of it now
<attente> Fudge: good idea
<Fudge> you've still helped me so thank you mate
<attente> Fudge: Trevinho would also be helpful i think
<attente> Fudge: good luck, sorry i could help more :)
<attente> *couldn't
<Fudge> thank you attente. Trevinho  if you followed our conversation maybe you might have some ideas?
<darkxst> attente, The keygrabber moved into Unity around that time
<darkxst> prior to that key grabs were handled by gnome-settings-daemon
<attente> darkxst: yep, i just wasn't sure if that was the cause since Fudge said he had the problem for a few months now
<robert_ancell> seriously, how long does unity take to compile?
<ochosi> hey robert_ancell
<robert_ancell> ochosi, hey
<ochosi> robert_ancell: i quickly wanted to ask you about that gtk-greeter bug we're seeing where the greeter doesnt exit and appears in the session (if you have time)
<ochosi> (if you dont have time, no worries)
<robert_ancell> ochosi, sure
<robert_ancell> I have some time
<ochosi> robert_ancell: so as i said last time, i can hardly reproduce the bug and so far i've only seen it once (didn't think it would be a greeter bug back then and hence didn't save the logs)
<ochosi> any idea how to even get to reproduce this? basically the gtk-greeter still exits the same way it always did
<ochosi> so i have no idea what could go wrong there
<ochosi> the only thing that's new is support for gtk3 indicators (started via upstart and then killed, same as in unity-greeter)
<TheMuso> robert_ancell: Yeah it does take a while to compile.
<robert_ancell> ochosi, I'm kind of at a loss too without being able to reproduce and check what's running post login
<ochosi> robert_ancell: i'm wondering whether there is any kind of debug output i could add to help with this, but i guess then i'd already have to know where the problem lies..
<ochosi> robert_ancell: so i suppose there weren't any changes in lightdm that could cause this behavior?
<robert_ancell> ochosi, it's possible the signal handling got messed up and lightdm just thinks the greeter quit when it didn't?
<robert_ancell> But I'm pretty sure it wouldn't do anything until the process actually quit
<ochosi> robert_ancell: well what we added and what wasn't there previously (although that rather should fix stuff than break it) is gtk_main_quit(); in the sigterm_cb before exit (0);
#ubuntu-desktop 2015-03-16
<didrocks> good morning
<seb128> mvo_, hey, do you know what command should be used to install a click manually on a device? ;-) click install? or pkon?
<ogra_> seb128, pkcon install-local --allow-untrusted blah.click
<ogra_> no sudo ...
<seb128> ogra_, thanks
<didrocks> hum, IIRC colin was strongly against using pkcon directly
<seb128> didrocks, what instead?
<ogra_> this is what we all use nowadays :)
<didrocks> ogra_: colin +1 it?
<didrocks> seb128: looking on logs
<ogra_> and the recommended method ...
<ogra_> no idea, i didnt know he was against it ... i think he initially gave me the sequence
<larsu> morning!
<didrocks> ah, it was the other way around
<didrocks> 2013-10-22 12:36:00cjwatsondidrocks: please don't use click install (unless you're very careful with its arguments), use pkcon install-local
<didrocks> ok, so confirmed :)
<mvo_> seb128: pkcon
<mvo_> seb128: but click install --user=your-user foo.click is the same
<didrocks> (IIRC, it was when then we tweaked the help to state to use the right command)
<seb128> mvo_, thanks
<seb128> didrocks, thanks as well
<mvo_> seb128: its just the "--user=" thats added automatically in the pkcon and the nicer auth via pkexec
<didrocks> seb128: sorry for the false alarm, prefered to double check :)
<seb128> mvo_, k, usually I use qtcreator but on that project click is grumpy, not sure why (running the same command from the command line works, where it hits an unicode error from qtcreator)
<seb128> didrocks, no worry, thanks for double checking ;-)
<mvo_> ok
<Laney> goedemorgen!
<didrocks> good morning Laney
<mlankhorst> goedemorgen Laney, hoe gaat het?
<didrocks> hey mlankhorst
<larsu> morning Laney!
<didrocks> seb128: Laney: do you mind testing the privacy capplet for whoopsie enablement/disablement? (Checking that report_metrics has the right value in /etc/whoopsie now and if the whoospie job is started/enabled as you expect playing with the checkbox?)
 * didrocks can live with a double checking
<didrocks> of course, with latest whoopsie/whoopsie-preferences from Friday
<seb128> hey Laney mlankhorst
<seb128> didrocks, sure can do, let me upgrade first though
<mlankhorst> I've had a fun weekend, full of horseback riding and hacking on a arm device and bringing up xorg-server :D
<Laney> okay
<didrocks> thanks!
<Laney> mlankhorst: imagine I said some great dutch :P
<mlankhorst> hehehe
<mlankhorst> can we add the tegra as release arch for warty? :P
<mlankhorst> jetson tk1
<willcooke> morning desktopers
<larsu> happy Monday willcooke!
<mlankhorst> morning
<willcooke> normality is restored, it's raining in London
<didrocks> hey willcooke
<didrocks> phew!
<mlankhorst> still sunny here!
<seb128> willcooke, hey, how is london?
<willcooke> morning seb128 - cold and wet.  Plus I had to get up early. :(
<seb128> :-(
<Laney> the cultural and economic capital of the united kingdom
<Laney> it's a great place to live and work
<Laney> goooooooo london
<seb128> lol
<willcooke> :D
<didrocks> sounds really like Paris :)
 * seb128 thinks we should make Laney commute to London every day to work at the office
<willcooke> +1
<Laney> my old landlord did that
<Laney> he would get a 6am train every morning
<willcooke> that's crazy
<seb128> see, he's already getting used to the idea ;-)
<didrocks> and he can pair with his previous landloard
<larsu> I have the fcitx thing in the panel for a few days now
<Laney> well if I can get a train at 9am and count working there as part of the day
<Laney> also if they pay
<Laney> then sure why not
<larsu> will it go away or should I uninstall something?
<Laney> larsu: did you get the latest update?
<larsu> "latest"?
<larsu> ah, new one coming in on this dist-upgrade
<Laney> check you don't have /etc/xdg/autostart/fcitx* after that
<larsu> I don't. Thanks!
<larsu> why are indicators in there?
<Laney> you mean why is there a fcitx indicator?
<larsu> no. all other indicators are in there
<Laney> for non upstart sessions
<larsu> head -> desk
<larsu> Laney: hm, they seem to be started unconditionally now
<larsu> in unity at least
<Laney> they are shadowed by /usr/share/upstart/xdg/autostart/
<larsu> that's very un-xdg...
 * larsu should stop looking into this
<Laney> it means you can de-xdgise things if you want to upstartise them instead
<larsu> I'd rather have them d-bus activate again
<Laney> no kidding
<larsu> how will this work when we move away from upstart in the session?
<Laney> I guess it could be ported fairly as-is, have all of the indicators start after the renderer
<Laney> but it would probably be more sensible to use bus activation ...
<davmor2> Laney: The Cultural and economic capital ah you mean Birmingham it's as cultural as London and way more economic ;)
<Laney> ha
<Laney> everyone does keep going on about that new library
<Laney> (seb128 /) happyaron / attente_: Are you planning to get fcitx itself out of the default install?
<Laney> and installed via language-selector
<seb128> Laney, why/how is it on the default install?
<Laney> not sure the path that got it installed for me, let's see
<seb128> Laney, we dropped the u-s-d/u-c-c recommends on friday, that was supposed to be enough to stop pulling it in
<Laney> oh neat, maybe it worked already then?
<Laney> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily-live/pending/vivid-desktop-amd64.manifest
<Laney> ya
<Laney> nice
<Laney> seems not there
<didrocks> yeah, you should only have the libs now
<Laney> dear autoremove
<Laney> why will you not uninstall it?
 * larsu was about to ask the same
<didrocks> that's kind of weird indeed, it's never been seeded directly, right?
<didrocks> (only child package of a metapackage are not marked auto)
<Laney> I forgot how to see if it's marked auto or not
<larsu> the only way I know how to is to open syanptic :(
<didrocks> Laney: apt-mark showauto | grpe â¦
<didrocks> grep*
<larsu> neat
<didrocks> hum, it's marked auto for me, so makes sense
<didrocks> what's keeping it thenâ¦
<larsu> same for me
<didrocks> if only aptitude why workedâ¦ :p
<didrocks> apt-get remove only wants to remove fcitx
<didrocks> so, I guess it's a recommends
<Laney> aptitude would say that
<Laney> it's just telling me about a suggests
<Laney> :|
<didrocks> same
<didrocks> but it only stops at the first relationship
<didrocks> IIRC
<didrocks> so, there can be a stronger one which is hidden
<Laney> ah
<Laney> didrocks: sudo apt-get -o Apt::AutoRemove::SuggestsImportant=false autoremove
<didrocks> SuggestsImportant?
 * Laney giggles at that wanting to remove cmake and schroot
<Laney> even suggests keeps autoremove from removing packages
<didrocks> I wouldn't expect that
<didrocks> (as an user)
<didrocks> oh, indeed, it's set to true starting apt 0.8.15.3 (2012)
<didrocks> but no bug linked to the changelog about why that changes
<didrocks> sounds weird to me, and it's David K. who did the change, can't even blame mvo :)
<didrocks> Laney: FWIW, it doesn't want for me to remove cmake, but I didn't mark it auto (I guess because I played quite a lot with it, so patched, manually installedâ¦)
<Laney> ya it'll depend on how you installed stuff
<Laney> surprised nothing is keeping schroot for me
<didrocks> I would expect click or the sdk would
 * Laney coughs
<Laney> totally have those installed... :)
<didrocks> ;)
<didrocks> I guess seeing your debian usage, you can safely mark it as manual
<Laney> I try to keep most dev stuff inside the lxc container actually
<Laney> probably can remove these
<dholbach> hey
<didrocks> Laney: oh nice ;)
<dholbach> is https://code.launchpad.net/~noskcaj/gnome-menus/3.13.3/+merge/250879 something which should be uploaded?
<dholbach> also... how about https://code.launchpad.net/~happyaron/ubuntu-seeds/lp-1430893/+merge/252632?
<didrocks> dholbach: the second shouldn't, we just took extra steps to not have it installed by default :)
<didrocks> or maybe seb128 discussed it more? ^
<Laney> let me 'on hold' that one
<didrocks> sure :)
<Laney> or WIP, whatevs
<happyaron> on hold which?
<Laney> yours
<Laney> no idea about gnome-menus
<happyaron> u-s-d/u-c-c shouldn't pull in all fcitx by default, but seeding it is a must to have it default for Chinese people
<seb128> didrocks, not discussed more no
<happyaron> or they get ibus after installation
<happyaron> if users open language-selector, it will write per-user configuration of input method, that will be ibus
<happyaron> even user never touched settings about input method
<happyaron> seb128 wonders how do we proceed?
<Laney> Don't you want to have language-selector set it up right?
<happyaron> I want it to be set up just out-of-box, without hurting people of other languages
<seb128> happyaron, I don't understand enough about how the im-config/language-selector thing is used atm to answer you, but we don't want fcitx on the iso
<happyaron> seb128: why
<happyaron> relying on language-selector almost means the default isn't changed for anyone
<Laney> check-language-support is run from the installer
<happyaron> many people don't connect to internet while installation
<seb128> happyaron, because we don't want 2 IM stacks on the image
<happyaron> seb128: that might make the transition never been evaluated
<happyaron> last week we tried to see there's impact on image space, and apparently the answer is no...
<Laney> FWIW there's 'ship-live' to put it on the CD but not installed
<Laney> at least I think that's right
<happyaron> ok
<happyaron> how to get that installed (from CD) for Chinese users?
<Laney> it makes it available via apt
<happyaron> it's highly appreciated if we can make it work without using any internet connection
<Laney> not sure if that would be acceptable, still taking up space on the image in that case
<happyaron> space won't grow if we remove ibus-pinyin and its dependency
<happyaron> that used to be default for Chinese
 * Laney nods
<didrocks> I think let's have the ship-live change
<Laney> installing if needed via check-language-support feels nicer to me
<Laney> but someone would need to do the work, so... :)
<didrocks> then, happyaron needs to ensure that chinese users get it installed via check-language-support from the CD
<didrocks> and we check size
<seb128> happyaron, k, fair enough
<happyaron> ok, I'll update the MP for seeds
<happyaron> and, is check-language-support in ubiquity?
<didrocks> dpkg -S check-language-support
<didrocks> language-selector-common: /usr/bin/check-language-support
<happyaron> ok
<didrocks> Laney: if we merge the seed, do we have some build time for kicking an image? (so that we don't forget and deal with the size check today)
<Laney> ?
<didrocks> we grew ~ +3M with the libs already
<Laney> probably want to check the ubiquity side first
<didrocks> Laney: don't want to check the image size first?
<didrocks> if we discover it's resulting in an unacceptable image size growth, I guess that stops the check-language-support hacking effort
<Laney> what other option is there?
<Laney> if you want to have it installed then it has to be on there somehow
<didrocks> keeping the existing?
<happyaron> we haven't remove ibus-pinyin/libpyzy yet
<didrocks> yeah
<didrocks> that's why I want us to check the image size
<didrocks> but for that, we need an image with the change
<Laney> what I mean is
<Laney> if we want to go with fcitx then we have to do this change
<Laney> we're not going to say "too big, let's stick with ibus"
<seb128> we could on the livecd
<seb128> we don't install all langpacks there
<didrocks> well, that's what we told until now at least
<didrocks> right
<seb128> the liveCD was never meant to be a solution for all users/locales
<didrocks> and there is kylin, contrary to other locales
<seb128> well or rather there is a balance in cost/benefit
<Laney> then you just have to change language-selector and not bother with this seeding stuff
<Laney> if that's acceptable
<Laney> but you say that all chinese users must be online to get a proper IM
<didrocks> before deciding on the seeding stuff, it would be nice to have the facts, in term of size
<Laney> and then how do they type in the live session?
<happyaron> if we do ship-live, and remove ibus-pinyin, then no way to input in live session
<Laney> no, if you do ship-live then language-selector installs it
<Laney> if you *don't*, and have no internet, then out of luck indeed
<happyaron> you mean in live session, launguage-selector will install it on the fly?
<happyaron> not saying /target
<Laney> I think l-s will work there
<Laney> this all needs checking, which is an argument for getting a test image I guess :)
<happyaron> a bit confused what needs to be done... 1) ship-live 2) check-language-support, that's all I see
<happyaron> and check if these changes work for live session, right?
<didrocks> and get a test image to check both
<Laney> check that ubiquity installs the right stuff
<didrocks> (size and changes)
<Laney> the l-s changes are the ones in bug #1431337 or thereabouts
<ubot5> bug 1430893 in ubuntu-meta (Ubuntu) "duplicate for #1431337 [FFe] Install Fcitx for Chinese users" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1430893
<happyaron> shall we get that FFe approved first?
<Laney> you should be able to test that by installing an updated package in any current ubuntu desktop iso and running check-language-support -l zh_CN
<Laney> then trying an installation with internet
<Laney> don't think so, we need to know what the approach is first
<happyaron> ok
<Laney> maybe scan ubiquity's code first to see what it does with check-language-support too
<happyaron> sure
<Laney> hm
<Laney> don't you have to restart the session to start using fcitx?
<happyaron> have to restart session to switch input method framework
<happyaron> sometimes it even needs reboot, because nowadays the session shutdown might not complete
<Laney> so how useful is this stuff at all?
<Laney> you don't really restart the live session
<happyaron> should only work if people select chinese on the initial boot screen, not useful if people switch after it boots up
<Laney> in that case I don't think this approach works
<Laney> because that screen won't run check-language-support
<didrocks> was it the same with the ibus plugin?
<Laney> that's installed all the time
<Laney> so will be there at startup
<didrocks> right, but if you switch after it boots up, did it load the IM?
<didrocks> it seems that for fcitx, even if you have it installed, it wouldn't work if you switch once you entered the session
<happyaron> about ibus plugin, it will work to switch among ibus plugins if ibus is started by im-config, same applies for fcitx. but the other framework that's not started by im-config won't work in the session.
<happyaron> when the latter situation happends, (if the second started framework is) ibus it will hang, and fcitx will quit.
<Laney> maybe we do need to just seed it then
<Laney> would be good if we could have things be removed from the installed system if they're not needed
<Laney> oh, wait
<Laney> maybe you can still do something like this with the 'live' seed
<Laney> xnox: you here?
<xnox> Laney: yes.
<xnox> Laney: we can remove un-used things at the end of the install, and we can also have optional things on the cd that can be installed if needed.
<Laney> xnox: It's 'remove fcitx if not chinese' basically
<xnox> how would one install it then? it looks like fcitx is seeded everywhere hence is installed everywhere.
<Laney> I was wondering if the live seed is good for that
<Laney> + language-selector
<xnox> we autoremove ubiquity and thing that haven't got marked as manually installed during installation.... ( i think ), or we can install things on target, from the iso pool. But then live session witll not have fcitx.
<Laney> so the installer runs check-language-support which causes it to be kept on the target system
<xnox> that's all good then.
<Laney> but if you don't pick chinese then it's not kept
<Laney> sane?
<xnox> i think so.
<Laney> neat
<xnox> however installs in english and later enables chinese, should get incomplete language support prompt at some later point.
<xnox> s/however/whoever/
<Laney> ya, as normal
<Laney> the same method (pkg_depends) will do all cases
<happyaron> what about upgrades?
<xnox> happyaron: if installed, simply remains. If not installed -> incomplete language support pop-up.
<happyaron> xnox: but l-s will write current IM to per-user config silently
<happyaron> that would mean "run_im ibus" in ~/.xinputrc
 * xnox only knows about packages. I have no idea how things work w.r.t. ibus et.al.
<happyaron> :)
<Laney> if someone's user has selected ibus then you shouldn't be touching that
<xnox> happyaron: does language support gui do the right thing _today_ ? e.g. installation in english -> switch to chinese, and vice versa.
<happyaron> xnox: yes, but it does not have any idea about IM framework transition
<xnox> happyaron: well, then that's a bug on it's own, no?
<happyaron> Laney: l-s will write .xinputrc whenever its started, even if user doesn't touch IM settings
<happyaron> xnox: think so
<Laney> what are you proposing to do about that?
<happyaron> I proposed not writing per-user default if not selected by the user, but Gunnar has his rationale of doing that
<happyaron> which prevents transition actually
<happyaron> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/language-selector/+bug/1430893/comments/13
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1430893 in ubuntu-meta (Ubuntu) "[FFe] Install Fcitx for Chinese users" [Undecided,Confirmed]
 * Laney nods
<Laney> I don't think you should be changing it for exisitng users, just make it do the new thing for new configurations
<happyaron> so we don't deal with upgrades, just new installations
<Laney> If they're using iBus then they're presumably happy with it already
<Laney> or they would have switched themselves
<Laney> (is it iBus?)
<Laney> (or ibus)
<happyaron> fair enough
<happyaron> IBus
<Laney> I'm writing a comment on the bug
<happyaron> thanks
<Laney> somehow I find #1431337 an easy bug number to remember ;-)
<larsu> woah, system settings has a help/quit menu item. Don't let mpt see that
<larsu> I mean, donât let him see that
<davmor2> Laney: yeah but it's a bit elitist
<Laney> literatist
<Laney> happyaron: done
<Laney> see if that matches your understanding
<larsu> Trevinho: are we now always showing the app menu?
<happyaron> Laney: almostly, proposed locales would be zh_* though
<Laney> ok
 * Laney wonders why his pc lost dns
<davmor2> Laney: you on vivid?
<Laney> yes
<davmor2> Laney: that's why then, happens on the phone too so I would guess at the latest network-manager
<Laney> got a bug #?
<Laney> nm's actually not supposed to be doing anything on this machine
<davmor2> Laney: just trying to confirm that it isn't the new QT5.4.1 stuff before I file if there isn't one
<Laney> oh it's back
<Laney> after restarting resolvconf
<Laney> some update clobbered my /etc/resolv.conf
<Sweet5hark> moin
<happyaron> Laney: seeds updated, status changed to Needs review
<Laney> ok, thanks, let me look quickly
<Laney> happyaron: in some hours we'll be able to build a new ISO with these changes
<Laney> once "apt-cache show fcitx" says Task: ubuntu-live
<happyaron> ok
<happyaron> thanks
<Laney> dobey: any complaints if I sponsor your intltool to debian instead of vivid?
<larsu> Laney: do you think my titlebar branch is good enough for this cycle? Should we wait until we get proper spacing between the buttons? Is it to ui-freezy already?
<Laney> larsu: I'd take it as it is now, but it is definitely UI freezy
<Laney> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UserInterfaceFreeze says mail ubuntu-doc@lists.ubuntu.com
<larsu> do you think it's worth it?
<larsu> bah, 4 days ago :(
<Laney> well
<Laney> I'd just word it like "if you've taken loads of screenshots already then no worries"
<Laney> i.e. only do it if it's low effort for everyone
<larsu> makes sense
<larsu> this only affects non-default apps
<larsu> so probably there aren't many screenshots around
<larsu> I'll also propose the totem fix
<larsu> if you like it *cough*
<Laney> oh yeah, it looks quite good I think
<Trevinho> larsu: what you mean? Shouldn't it be shown?
<Trevinho> (in some cases)
<dobey> Laney: it's fine if it gets synced to vivid. i didn't do it that way because i have no debian dev perms at all (and don't really know anything about uploading to debian)
<Laney> dobey: No worries, should just be changing the target for me
<Laney> thanks
<Laney> (& the version of course)
<larsu> Trevinho: I have the feeling it is shown in too many cases
<larsu> Trevinho: not sure though. I'll investigate after lunch and let you know
<Trevinho> larsu: ok, let me know... there might be a missing flag in indicator-appmenu
<desrt> word.
<seb128> hey desrt
<seb128> had a good w.e?
<didrocks> morning desrt
<desrt> seb128, didrocks: hi
<desrt> yup
<desrt> did some cool jhbuild work :)
<seb128> stop hacking during the w.e ;-)
 * desrt has enough crap to do during the week, and this is important :p
<desrt> i have a couple of nice scripts now, though -- one creates a base system image out of my local debian/ubuntu mirror, with jhbuild installed from git, and makes a .tar of the result
<desrt> the other one extracts that .tar into a tmpfs, installs the proper sysdeps for a given module, and runs jhbuild
<desrt> debootstrap off of a local mirror is slow -- so this will help with speeding up the ~160 builds that need to be done
<Laney> darkxst: you probably want to upload gnome-online-accounts to kill facebook chat, btw
<ChrisTownsend> mlankhorst: Hey, any chance you could update your Xmir xorg-server in your PPA to supersede the version in the archive?
<mlankhorst> ChrisTownsend: what exactly?
<mlankhorst> ah k :P
<mlankhorst> right forgot about that
<ChrisTownsend> mlankhorst: Ok, sure, thanks!
<mlankhorst> ChrisTownsend: uploaded
<ChrisTownsend> mlankhorst: Thanks!
<flexiondotorg_> Is anyone else aware that the daily images don't make it to Ubiquity at the moment?
<seb128> flexiondotorg_, what's the error?
<seb128> and what image?
<flexiondotorg_> I've just test Ubuntu MATE i386 and amd64 from 15th and 16th.
<seb128> that's also probably more a topic for -devel than desktop
<flexiondotorg_> seb128, OK.
<flexiondotorg_> There is an error about pxconv not being able to set the permission of /etc/passwd- to 0600
<flexiondotorg_> I'm checking with other flavours to see if this is just in Ubuntu MATE.
<flexiondotorg_> *pwconv
<Laney> mlankhorst: Most of the time when I resume my monitors after they DPMS power off, one of them doesn't come back
<Laney> until I open "Displays" in the control centre
<Laney> he;lp
<larsu> would be great if someone could comment on the theme MRs before I propose ffes
<seb128> larsu, urls?
<larsu> seb128: bug #1425155 and bug #1376565
<ubot5> bug 1425155 in ubuntu-themes (Ubuntu) "totem 3.14's OSD looks bad in Ambiance" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1425155
<ubot5> bug 1376565 in ubuntu-themes (Ubuntu) "Utopic system log wrong design" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1376565
<seb128> larsu, danke
<seb128> larsu, approved the totem one, no doubt we should get that in, looks also a bugfix rather than an ui change to me
<Laney> what's 'rather than'?
<Laney> it can be both
<seb128> it's an ui fix
<seb128> rather than an ui feature
<seb128> e.g not a redesign/change in spirit
<Laney> UI freeze doesn't have this distinction
<seb128> I though we made the distinction there as well?
<larsu> this is UI freeze though, not UI feature freeze
<larsu> (or is it?)
<seb128> hum
<Laney> correct
<Laney> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UserInterfaceFreeze
<larsu> somebody could've made a screenshot already
<Laney> but it's fine, you just have to notify them
<seb128> from past discussions I though the documentation team didn't mind about visible "fixes"/tweaks
<larsu> one of the problems with the other MR is that window-close-symbolic is now a different icon
<Laney> I doubt they mind
<seb128> they just didn't want to have things different enough that the documentation wouldn't make sense
<Laney> but they still want notifying
<larsu> and it's also used in tabs for example
<larsu> so those look weird now
<Laney> weird how?
<larsu> too thin imo
<seb128> larsu, comment/approved them
<Laney> do you have a screenshot?
<larsu> I got used to it already, I'm just making sure whoever reviews it notices that
<seb128> brb, going to a coffee to work from there for a bit, back online when I arrive there (need an irc proxy!)
 * Laney insults seb128 now he's gone
<Laney> muhaha
<larsu> Laney: I do now: http://i.imgur.com/jZgHEc1.png
<Laney> you mean the Ã itself is too thin?
<larsu> otoh, the ones we had before look too thick in window decoration buttons
<larsu> Laney: yes
<Laney> ah
<Laney> doesn't look too bad to me
<larsu> okay good :)
<Laney> feel free to mail the docs team imho
<larsu> is one mail for both bugs ok?
<Laney> yeah I'm sure they can deal with that
<Laney> it's mainly GunnarHj afaik
<Laney> sad times, going to be on hols for beta
<Laney> bye!
<robert_ancell> mterry, seb128, So it appears that ~indic-team is not an active team. Who do you recommend we subscribe the Indic font package bug reports to? We could put ~ubuntu-desktop there but we'll just probably shrug our shoulders and point at the Debian IN team
<seb128> robert_ancell, wfm, the team subscription main goal is to have some active team listed as in charge of the package so there is an escalation path if there is an issue that needs to be sorted out
<seb128> robert_ancell, I don't expect the font to be problematic so subscription desktop works
<robert_ancell> seb128, yeah, we'll just be a placeholder until someone else takes over
<robert_ancell> yeah
<seb128> want me to do that?
<seb128> robert_ancell, oh, and no, not ~ubuntu-desktop but ~desktop-bugs
<seb128> we don't want to spam the desktop mailing list ;-)
<robert_ancell> seb128, I'm just checking if I can (I suspect not) otherwise I'll send the list of URLs to you
<robert_ancell> yeah, I can do ~ubuntu-desktop but not ~desktop-bugs it seems
<robert_ancell> seb128, I've forwarded the list via email
<seb128> shrug
<seb128> robert_ancell, you just won ~desktop-bugs admin rights, enjoy :p
<robert_ancell> ok
<robert_ancell> seb128, Didn't feel like subscribing >10 packages? ;)
<seb128> no :p
<robert_ancell> I was hoping you might have a magic script
<seb128> no :-/
<mterry> robert_ancell, sorry, wasn't paying attention to irc
<robert_ancell> mterry, np
<mterry> robert_ancell, I'm not sure.  :-/
<mterry> robert_ancell, I'm not familiar with the various localization teams
<mterry> robert_ancell, but we probably have an Indian translation group?
<robert_ancell> mterry, well, I thought ~indian-team would be that but I emailed them and they said no
<mterry> robert_ancell, well... maybe do desktop in meantime?  Even if it's a shrug, at least someone may see it
<mterry> robert_ancell, I doubt there are many bugs in these packages
<robert_ancell> mterry, I've subscribed ~desktop-bugs at seb128 s suggestion
<mterry> robert_ancell, ah, didn't read scrollback, cool
<desrt> annoying â https://bugs.launchpad.net/launchpad/+bug/638498
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 638498 in Launchpad itself "Contents files are not listed with checksums" [Low,Triaged]
<darkxst> Laney, gnome-online-accounts is in -desktop, so I can't upload it
<darkxst> Laney, bug 1432859
<ubot5> bug 1432859 in Ubuntu GNOME "remove support for facebook chat" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1432859
#ubuntu-desktop 2015-03-17
<larsu> good morning!
<happyaron> morning larsu
<larsu> hi happyaron!
<didrocks> good morning
<Laney> ahoy there
<larsu> moin Laney
<didrocks> morning Laney
<Laney> greetings larsu et didrocks
<Laney> seems quiet today
<larsu> indeed
<larsu> so, my fix to gnomed-desktop breaks nautilus
<larsu> because it handles device scale as well
<larsu> sigh
<Laney> :/
<Laney> this revert sucks
<larsu> bah. my compiled nautilus behaves differently from the one in distro
<willcooke> morning desktopers
<Laney> hey willcooke
<didrocks> morning willcooke
<Laney> how's london?
<willcooke> Cold and wet
<willcooke> \o/
<mlankhorst> hooray
<mlankhorst> not news!
<didrocks> you guys are selling your capital so well
<Laney> you can join the club
<willcooke> didrocks, can you do me a massive favour and reply-all to that email re: the issues with the store?  I won't have time today and I think it needs to be moved forwards asap
<Laney> as a parishater
<didrocks> I'll never have a similar speach for Parisâ¦ oh wait!
<didrocks> willcooke: sure, doing in a few minutes then!
<willcooke> didrocks, if you're not happy to - pas de probleme
<larsu> didrocks: every English person I've met that doesn't live in London hates London
<larsu> morning willcooke
<willcooke> I dont hate London, I just dont like the weather so much :)
<larsu> do you like it though?
<willcooke> Erm,  I like to visit
<willcooke> Dont think I could work here everyday
<willcooke> or live here
<larsu> didrocks: [rephrased] every English person I've met that doesn't live in London doesn't quite like London
<willcooke> haha!
<larsu> ;)
<didrocks> heh :)
<larsu> is noone running unitz on hidpi?
 * larsu wonders why nobody noticed our atrocious background rendering
<didrocks> larsu: maybe people having hdpi thought it was pixel art
<larsu> didrocks: I made a white test wallpaper with some black pixels in a 1Ã1 grid. It's all blurry :(
 * larsu should complain less and fix more
<Laney> does gnome get it right?
 * larsu checks
<larsu> Laney: hm, can't switch to a gnome session
<larsu>  /usr/share/xsessions/gnome.desktop exists...
<Laney> can't how?
<larsu> in lightdm
<Laney> like no option?
<larsu> ya
<larsu> ah wait, those are the wrong files
 * larsu ponders what to install
<darkxst> gnome-session
<larsu> no
<larsu> that's not enough
<darkxst> it should be, provided you have gnome-shell as well
<didrocks> larsu: do you have /usr/share/gnome-session/sessions/gnome.session?
<larsu> wow. how many of those things do we have?
<didrocks> (normally, that doesn't prevent the session to shows up in lightdm though)
<didrocks> well
<didrocks> there is the session "session"
<larsu> darkxst: that's what I meant by "it's not enough"... ;)
<didrocks> there is the gnome-session "session"
<didrocks> (I'm culpurit of the second)
<larsu> which ones are the files lightdm looks at? /usr/share/xsession/*.desktop, right?
<didrocks> yeah, if you don't have the session, that's weird
<didrocks> should be that one
<didrocks> there is a condition though
<didrocks> let me look
<larsu> why doesn't gnome-session pull in gnome-shell, for example?
<didrocks> larsu: TryExec=gnome-shell
<darkxst> it was causinga  circular dep
<didrocks> do you have the gnome-shell bin installed?
<larsu> I do now
<didrocks> ok, I guess restart lightdm
<didrocks> the TryExec is evaluated at lightdm startup IIRC
<didrocks> (and as you can see, this calls Exec=gnome-session --session=gnome)
<larsu> unity-greeter theming seems to have broken again
<larsu> didrocks: ya, working now
<larsu> didrocks: thanks
<didrocks> yw!
<didrocks> and, keep in mind that unity needs gnome-shell
<didrocks> oupss
<didrocks> gnome-session
<didrocks> so, if gnome-session was depending on gnome-shellâ¦
<larsu> it does? it wasn't installed for me
<didrocks> (first, I wrote "g-s depending on g-s")
<darkxst> didrocks, no, unity uses gnome-session-common (or -bin)
<didrocks> ah, that changed
<didrocks> ok, I guess gnome-session should recommends gnome-shell
<larsu> didrocks: I agree
<didrocks> darkxst: deps on one side, recommends on the other is fine
<Laney> why?
<didrocks> Laney: the package contains /usr/share/xsessions/gnome.desktop
<Laney> If you want shell, install shell
<didrocks> and /usr/share/gnome-session/sessions/gnome.session
<didrocks> and that's mostly it
<didrocks> so, 2 components deeply linked to gnoe-shell
<Laney> so shell should depend on it
<didrocks> gnome-shell
<larsu> Laney: to answer your question: gnome gets it wrong as well
<Laney> /o\
<didrocks> well, in that case, we can remove "gnome-shell" binary package
 * didrocks doesn't think /etc/lightdm/lightdm.conf.d/50-ubuntu.conf should be part of this
<didrocks> and that's it for this package
<xnox> Laney: on unity7 desktop which process handles the alt-f2?
<Laney> dunno
<Laney> probably unity
<didrocks> xnox: unity-lens-applications
<xnox> things launched from there lack environment that is set via user-session upstart and/or possibly gnome-session.
<xnox> didrocks: thanks.
<didrocks> xnox: enjoy my vala code :p
<xnox> didrocks: hm, i don't have that running here.
<xnox> didrocks: is it still lens in 14.04 LTS?
<didrocks> xnox: that was renamed commands.scope
<xnox>  /usr/bin/unity-scope-loader applications/applications.scope applications/scopes.scope commands.scope ?
<didrocks> but it's still the same package
<xnox> didrocks: ok, and what launches that?
<xnox> cause it's missing environment variables =(
<didrocks> xnox: dbus-activated through unity
<didrocks> IIRC
<darkxst> didrocks, 50-ubuntu.conf is in ubuntu-session also
<Laney> gegls from outer space
<xnox> didrocks: right, so i should be uploading enviromental variables into dbus.... however that is not in trusty's environemnt
<didrocks> Laney: there are 2 more easter eggs :)
<didrocks> xnox: agreed
<xnox> didrocks: what about gnome-session variables?
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<xnox> didrocks: Laney: it's funny how ctrl-alt-T, clicking gnome-terminal has the env, and alt-f2 xterm does not.
<didrocks> xnox: I think simply everything that are set to the process (so, including gnome-session variables) when you control+alt+t should be into those processes
<xnox> SSH_AGENT is in question here.
<didrocks> xnox: they got it at first, before being dbus-activated
<xnox> can anyone give me a gnome-session set variable?
<didrocks> but yeah, once it's been transitioned, I guess, that's lost
<didrocks> xnox: XDG_CURRENT_DESKTOP=Unity for instance
<didrocks> hey seb128
<didrocks> let me ensure, one sec
<xnox> didrocks: ok that one is set in alt-f2 xterm. horum.
<didrocks> xnox: one sec, it's maybe not set by it if already present
<seb128> hey didrocks ;-)
<xnox> didrocks: where is this scope thing again - apps?!
<didrocks> xnox: yeah, the unity-lens-applications package
<darkxst> XDG_CURRENT_DESKTOP is set by the DM, and passed through gnome-session I think
<didrocks> yeah, it's only set if it wasn't set beforehand
<didrocks> xnox: GNOME_DESKTOP_SESSION_ID
<didrocks> not used anymore, but set by gnome-session
<xnox> didrocks: upstart jobs set that as well, as far as i know. but let me see if i the value is different.
<xnox> no it's same.
<didrocks> weird that we reset it
<didrocks> there is really no value in doing this
<Laney> False
<xnox> didrocks: yes there is.
<xnox> didrocks: Qt looks like Windows 95 without it.
<Laney>   [ Iain Lane ]
<Laney>   * xsession-init: Set $GNOME_DESKTOP_SESSION_ID if we are launching a
<Laney>     gnome-session session. Some applications (Qt4) require this to be set to
<Laney>     any value to detect the environment in use. It was historically set by
<Laney>     gnome-session but now this is no longer the root of the session so not all
<Laney>     user processes are guaranteed to have it. (LP: #1305294)
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1305294 in upstart (Ubuntu) "QT uses incorrect theme when GNOME_DESKTOP_SESSION_ID is unset" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1305294
<xnox> didrocks: hm..... i'm failing to see how things are actually execed from the scope =(
<didrocks> waow "nice"
<xnox> didrocks: hm. i think /usr/bin/unity-scope-loader should be managed by upstart in the user session to have the right env
<xnox> it's dbus activated at the moment as it has UPSTART_JOB=dbus env variable.
<didrocks> xnox: yeah, I don't know at all about those changes (I wasn't in charge of unity when they did that change), maybe ask thorst?
<xnox> hm. or it can call into upstart dbus api and do "list-env" and then import that.
<xnox> is even the lens actually launching things? or does it simply hand over result to shell to launch stuff?!
<didrocks> xnox: it was launching things at the time, let me have a look if this changed
<xnox> AppInfo.launch_default_for_uri
<xnox> Process.spawn_async
<didrocks> yep
<xnox>  /* Activation of standard application:// uris */
 * xnox ponders if i should just strace it....
<xnox> didrocks: to many if/else blocks.... if feels like half of the code there is unreachable.
<larsu> xnox: g_desktop_app_info_launch() launches whatever's in the Exec= key or dbus-activates the application if it supports that
<larsu> no clue why the scope would do anything but call that...
<xnox> larsu: well i can type ~/bin/foobar in alt-f2 window.
<larsu> oh, this is about alt+f2
<xnox> larsu: yes.
 * larsu apologizes
<xnox> larsu: app_info_launched things seem to have the right env.
<larsu> xnox: right, but alt+f2 shouldn't use that
<xnox> larsu: didrocks: ok this is crazy ->
<xnox> Super -> "xterm" -> Enter = has SSH_AGENT
<xnox> Alt+F2 -> "xterm" -> Enter = does not
<didrocks> xnox: I guess, really ask the unity API team, not sure if it's maybe just one data missing when they changed to activated scope
<larsu> xnox: so Alt+f2 isn't passing the same env as g_desktop_app_info_launch() is
<larsu> maybe the scope guys should fix that :)
<xnox> bug #1433013
<ubot5> bug 1433013 in upstart (Ubuntu Vivid) "Super -> exec vs Alt-F2 -> exec have different environment" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1433013
<xnox> didrocks: larsu: Laney: i guess I'll experiment with launching the scope loader via initctl start, such that it has the right env.
<larsu> xnox: I assume the env is there, otherwise g_desktop_app_info_launch() wouldn't have it. I bet whatever handles alt+f2 just doesn't pass it along
<xnox> larsu: i get to differ $ cat /proc/`pgrep -f unity-scope-loader`/environ | grep -a SSH
<xnox> is empty
<larsu> xnox: it's gotta come from somewhere thoguh
<xnox> initctl list-env has it.
<xnox> larsu: ok, so changing the dbus to do Exec=start unity-scope-application, and moving the process to an upstart job works. And then xterm launched via alt-f2 works and has ssh environment.
<xnox> i'll make a patch for that, and will have to see if that gets accepted.
<larsu> xnox: shouldn't unity-scope-application inherit the environment from dbus, which is already upstart?
<xnox> jodh: http://upstart.ubuntu.com/wiki/Stanzas is not feeling good
<xnox> larsu: it does, but after dbus is execed, upstart's environment is modified, and it modifies the dbus process environment table, but that doesn't propagate to dbus' children.
<xnox> larsu: if dbus child is moved to be a direct upstart child, it will mangle said childs environ
<xnox> when people do $ initctl set-env foo=bar
 * xnox tests
<larsu> xnox: that's what org.freedesktop.DBus.UpdateActivationEnvironment is for
<xnox> larsu: is that in 14.04?
<larsu> xnox: dunno
 * xnox thought that was added only recently
<larsu> it was, but I don't know when
<larsu> but running 'start' in an Exec line sounds hacky to me
<xnox> hm. initctl set-env didn't propagate to newly execed xterm via alt-f2..... not good.
<xnox> larsu: looks like there is UpdateActivationEnvironemt....
<xnox> in trusty
<larsu> \o/
<xnox> larsu: there is no get activation environment though..... =(
<larsu> why do you need that?
<xnox> larsu: to check what it currently is.
<larsu> well yeah
<larsu> but why do you want to do that
<xnox> to trace the SSH_* variable =)
<larsu> oh, for debugging
<xnox> yeah.
<larsu> xnox: just activate some process and inspect its env ;)
<larsu> like a terminal...
<jodh> xnox: ergh. thanks, I'll report that...
<xnox> 'GDBus.Error:org.freedesktop.DBus.Error.ServiceUnknown: The name com.canonical.Unity.Scope.Dima was not provided by any .service files'
 * xnox gives up
<xnox> ok everything works, as long as initctl set-env does a call to dbus to update activation environment.
<xnox> i can do that at post in each job or patch upstart
<Laney> aha
<Laney> who knows where I can get the iso smoke testsuite scripts from?
<mvo> seb128: I'm looking into that software-center issue now, no need for dobey to duplicate work, its under control
<mvo> seb128: looks like its a server side issue
<Laney> bah
<Laney> jibel: yo
<dobey> willcooke: ^^
<Laney> if I want to change https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/view/vivid/view/Smoke%20Testing/job/vivid-desktop-amd64-smoke-default/130/ this testsuite
<willcooke> oh
<Laney> where do I get it from?
<willcooke> dobey, thanks
<didrocks> happyaron: FYI, we approximatly gained 5M thanks to the fcitx switch and removal of ibus-pinyin, so size-wise, it's cool :)
<didrocks> Laney: seb128 ^
<didrocks> (compressed size)
<Laney> gaining 5M isn't that great
<didrocks> gained in the term of "less"
<Laney> HAHA
<didrocks> Laney: I wouldn't be that enthousiast if we grew by 5M :)
<Laney> that is innovative use of english
<didrocks> Laney: yeah, I see as well always this contradiction as well with "false positive"
<mvo> willcooke: hi, happy to give you a update on the issue if you want
<didrocks> (see how seb and I use it)
<Laney> I thought you mean that it's okay because it is only 5 megs
<didrocks> no no, it's ok because the image size + some manual adjustement to compensate the seed changes is approx 5M :)
<Laney> good times
<willcooke> mvo, could you reply-all the email, keep everyone in the loop
<Laney> jibel: found it!
<Laney> 'usit' ...
<Laney> didrocks: btw this is a machine ID thing again
<Laney> did you decide to symlink the old file?
<didrocks> Laney: we didn't decide on anything to do on this. Do you have the case details leading to no machine ID file for dbus?
<didrocks> (I really think the symlink is what makes sense, just need to decide where this should be doneâ¦ I would say in the .service file)
<Laney> It'll fall back to using the systemd one
<Laney> also dbus-uuidgen --ensure will make this symlink
<mvo> willcooke: sure, just did that after I saw your mail about it
<willcooke> mvo, thank you!
<didrocks> Laney: so, what's the bug is? (if it fallbacks successfully?)
<didrocks> only the tests making the wrong assertion?
<Laney> tests look for the old path
<Laney> dunno if any software does
<didrocks> *hem* oneconf probably *hem*
<seb128> didrocks, nice!
<didrocks> I hope the "nice" was for the won megs on the iso, not my last statement :p
<didrocks>             with open('/var/lib/dbus/machine-id') as fp:
<didrocks>                 hostid = fp.read()[:-1]
<didrocks> Laney: yeah, we do have *excellent* software doing this ^
<Laney> happy symlinking ;-)
<didrocks> Laney: want me to deal with this?
<didrocks> sounds quite trivial
<Laney> if you don't mind
<Laney> although the unit is upstream
<Laney> :)
<didrocks> sure (not right now, but will do)
<didrocks> ah?
<didrocks> they use dbus-uuidgen --ensure in the unit?
<Laney> no
<Laney> that is what you'd add
<didrocks> yep
 * didrocks just need to think if we should use that or provide the symlink manually (as it's in the boot path)
<didrocks> I'll do some tests
<Laney> the upstart job and init script just ran the program
<didrocks> ok, anyway with kdbus coming, maybe doesn't worth trying to optimize this now
<didrocks> is there a bug for those failing tests?
<Laney> dunno
<Laney> I'm going to fix that part anyway
<didrocks> yeah, sounds more future-proof
<desrt> kdbus is coming?  when?
<larsu> whenever this canadian guy finishes writing support for it in some fringe library
<Laney> bregma's supporting it in nux?
<larsu> Trevinho: do you know why compiz doesn't render the background on unity? Because it doesn't handle the gradients?
<desrt> larsu: i'm still waiting for a round of lkml patch review that doesn't turn into a total bloodbath :p
<Trevinho> larsu: where?
<larsu> desrt: last I heard was that it's as good as in
<larsu> Trevinho: err, what?
<desrt> larsu: did you hear that from lennart? :)
<Trevinho> larsu: I mean, I'm not sure I understood what you mean
<larsu> desrt: maybeâ½
<larsu> Trevinho: ah sorry. Right now, nautilus renders the background wallpaper in unity. We're patching it to do that because upstream stopped
<Trevinho> larsu: ok, right...
<desrt> in any case, i'm unlikely to spend more time working on kdbus until i have an actual API to target
<larsu> Trevinho: and I'm pretty sure that compiz could render the background for us. Just wondering why it doesn't
<larsu> desrt: fair enough
<bregma> larsu, because nobody has fixed the Compiz wallpaper plugin in the last 5 years
<Trevinho> larsu: mh, I don't know exactly the reason.. I guess it was an historic deicsion as in the past every desktop had its "desktop-bg app", and thus to keep modularity
<bregma> also, Compiz does not support placing icons on the desktop and handling them as if it were a file browser
<larsu> bregma: right, nautilus can keep doing that on a transparent window
<larsu> bregma: I'm not saying we should go that route. Just wondering why we aren't
<Trevinho> yeah, in fact... can be done at app lelve...
 * larsu had to fix some hidpi issues in that code today
<larsu> and it's still badly broken
<Laney> does it support gnome's interface?
<Laney> work with solid colours and gradients and stuff?
<larsu> Laney: ya, I suspect it doesn't
 * Laney would guess it is problems like this
<bregma> we could revivie the Compiz wallpaper plugin to do the drawing, but the code has not been touched since 2009 and has not been ported to GLES
<larsu> bregma: I think fixing the remaining issue in gnome-desktop is ok for now, but we might think about that if we want more features
<larsu> or if we want more performant bg transitiosn
 * didrocks is particularly afraid by the extended combinations of transformations as well to support
<larsu> didrocks: transformations?
<didrocks> larsu: the crop/scale/extendsâ¦
<didrocks> (basically the various cases in libgnome-desktop
<larsu> didrocks: wouldn't it be awesome if we did them on graphics hardware instead of the cpu?
<larsu> same for the gradients
<didrocks> seems you want to bother this poor GPUâ¦ :)
<bregma> I lie, the COmpiz wallpaper plugin was ported to GLES (according to https://docs.google.com/a/canonical.com/spreadsheets/d/1tiCs1CLXZB386-6TtD_bJsWHeMBJRjNVr8D14VVFHcY/edit#gid=0), maybe it's worth playing with for the 15.10 timeframe
<larsu> didrocks: lol
<larsu> bregma: I want animated wallpapers!
<larsu> and FIRE
<Laney> \o/
<bregma> I want world peace and a cure for cancer
<bregma> and a second pony, the first one is too small
<larsu> how important is that related to animated wallpapers?
<Trevinho> :)
<desrt> larsu: world peace, or the pony?
 * didrocks wouldn't say a world, been there in 98â¦
<didrocks> word*
<Laney> the world was peaceful in 1998?
<didrocks> France won world cup
<didrocks> that's the only thing I remember
<didrocks> (and this is what people still refers here)
<didrocks> (sad that I hate soccer)
<desrt> world cup in taking dives, right?
<Laney> I got my first laptop!
<didrocks> desrt: pfffff
<larsu> Laney: pretty sure I've seen you with a laptop before
<didrocks> manâ¦ it's not Friday
<desrt> larsu: in 98...
<didrocks> that was obviously trolling
<larsu> desrt: </makingajoke>
<desrt> didrocks: dunno.  it's IRC.  context is easily lost.
<didrocks> or is desrt trolling larsu in faking not understanding?
<didrocks> and so, I got trolled?
<didrocks> :)
<desrt> and larsu is a nice guy.  i don't think he would troll like that outside of friday.
<Laney> wow
<Laney> was googling for the scheme that gave me it
<larsu> desrt: that was the point of the joke...
<Laney> my school's gone all out for Microsoft
<Laney> http://cambridgeppf.org/vision/3/stevens.pdf
<didrocks> Laney: planning to burn your diploma? :)
<larsu> oh wow: http://www.newyorker.com/business/currency/the-gnu-manifesto-turns-thirty
<Laney> https://www.tes.co.uk/article.aspx?storycode=306195
<Laney> What emerged during the first year of the pilot scheme was a renewed enthusiasm for learning. According to Valerie Winch, the students' form tutor, "their interest factor has quadrupled and their motivation has gone through the roof."
<Laney> \o/
<desrt> Laney: i suspect faulty calibration of interestfactorometors
<Laney> no shit
<Laney> we rapidly discovered (a) instant messaging (2) console emulators
<didrocks> meeting time!
<mlankhorst> :o
<mlankhorst> no just wait 10 minutes, need to run!
<mlankhorst> brb
<didrocks> attente_, desrt, dgadomski, happyaron, FJKong, Laney, larsu, mlankhorst, qengho, Sweet5hark1, tkamppeter: hey!
<seb128> hey :-)
<didrocks> mlankhorst: if you are not around, I'll just get to you later on
<Laney> HELLO
<Laney> I AM HERE FOR THE MEETING
<FJKong> hello
<Laney> AT THE START OF IT
<dgadomski> hey o/
<desrt> didrocks is the new boss?
<didrocks> #startmeeting
<meetingology> Meeting started Tue Mar 17 15:31:15 2015 UTC.  The chair is didrocks. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
<attente_> hi
 * didrocks notes down Laney's remark :)
 * larsu never experienced passive aggressive Laney 
<Laney> just making sure man
<larsu> :D
<Laney> got my ass handed to me last week
 * larsu remembers
<didrocks> ahah, seems seb128 was really upseting you! :)
<larsu> you should have subtly pinged seb128 in there
<didrocks> let's start
<didrocks> #topic attente_
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: attente_
<didrocks> attente_: hey!
<attente_> stop u-s-d and u-c-c from pulling in fcitx-bin on dist-upgrade, which was causing it to become default...
<attente_> i've got ibus somewhat running under mir, but it requires a lot of user intervention and the candidate window needs debugging
<seb128> Laney, nice to see you are on time for the meeting for once
<seb128> :-)
<desrt> seb128: ya.  i was surprised too.
<Laney> didrocks: take control of these guys
<didrocks> Laney: not really, I find that funny :)
<didrocks> attente_: did you put on a wiki the necessary steps for setting up ibus under mir?
<attente_> didrocks: no, i can write them up though. it is really not user friendly...
<larsu> step 1) chown some device node to get mir running
<didrocks> attente_: well, once think you made enough progress, it would probably be worthwile to write that down so that we can maybe help there in the automation
<didrocks> (just an idea)
<didrocks> attente_: anything else? (are you done?)
<attente_> didrocks: that's it
<didrocks> thanks attente_
<didrocks> #topic desrt
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: desrt
<desrt> sorry
<didrocks> hey desrt
<desrt> gotta run
<desrt> back in 10
<didrocks> #troll
<desrt> i meant 10 seconds
<desrt> anyway
<desrt> last week i did mostly cleanup of documentation stuff in preparation for the release
<desrt> wasted a lot of time trying to understand the weird hybrid of docbook/markdown that's in gtk-doc, then wrote some patches to fix things up
<desrt> and did some fixes in glib itself
<desrt> we're now at a spot where we have (almost) no warnings on building the docbook xml, so i hope to enable that by default (and throw errors when it fails) by the next release
<desrt> i also did releases yesterday
<desrt> and i've been working on my jhbuild-in-debootstrap-chroot stuff as well
<desrt> that's all
<didrocks> desrt: mind fixing systemd docbook xml as well while you are at it, seems you love that? (there are still some warnings ;))
<desrt> i don't actually enjoy this :p
<desrt> but uh... we always have problems with missing new symbols in glib documentation
<desrt> and nobody notices because they're lost in the raft of other warnings
<desrt> so we really needed to get on top of that....
 * larsu never has this problem
<desrt> naturally, larsu is #1 offender
<didrocks> yeah, would be nice to be able to stop missing symbols in documentation :)
<desrt> (...tied with everyone else)
<didrocks> nice work desrt, even if tedious!
<desrt> fin.
 * didrocks got the last word as if it was a familiar language
<didrocks> #topic dgadomski
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: dgadomski
<didrocks> dgadomski: hey, anything to share with us this week?
<dgadomski> hello guys
<dgadomski> refactoring and cleaning up patch for bug #1337873
<ubot5> bug 1337873 in ifupdown (Ubuntu) "Precise, Trusty, Utopic - ifupdown initialization problems caused by race condition" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1337873
<dgadomski> trying to get some support from upstream for kernel feature backport (bug #1104230)
<ubot5> bug 1104230 in xserver-xorg-video-intel (Ubuntu) "DisplayPort 1.2 MST support is missing in the Intel driver" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1104230
<dgadomski> verifying cyphermox's fix for bug #1386131 (waiting for actual user's preseed file to test it 'in the wild') - looks good so far
<ubot5> bug 1386131 in ubiquity (Ubuntu Trusty) "Preseeding encrypted lvm fails instead of asking for password" [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1386131
<didrocks> nice! anything needed from us?
<dgadomski> my email to the desktop mailing list about the mount options in nautilus still lacks response, seb128 was saying about providing some feedback to start a discussion
<dgadomski> I would appreciate that if possible
<didrocks> dgadomski: noting down, today he's at a sprint, but we will look at it tomorrow
<dgadomski> cool, thanks
<dgadomski> that's all from me today
<didrocks> thanks dgadomski!
<didrocks> #topic happyaron
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: happyaron
<didrocks> happyaron: hey, around?
<desrt> if willcooke was running this meeting, he'd have the notes for pasting
<desrt> just saying....
<didrocks> desrt: I got some, but none from happyaron
<didrocks> (fw by willcooke)
<desrt> if willcooke was running this meeting, he'd have made some up!
<didrocks> not sure if he got them too late
<didrocks> ahah
<didrocks> well:
<didrocks> - make fcitx installed on the live
<didrocks> - MIR for cmake-extra
<didrocks> .
<didrocks> DONE ;)
<desrt> not bad ;)
<didrocks> and all true!
<desrt> ya.  that's the impressive part :)
<didrocks> #topic FJKong
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: FJKong
<FJKong> hey
<FJKong> continue pinyin searching now need find a key value database to store result of converting, optimize speed of converting
<didrocks> FJKong: around? I don't have fake notes for you though :p
<FJKong> locate problem of bug :fcitx cpu 100% in calling of dbus
<FJKong> utuntu phone env setup and learn how to start to make a scope
<Laney> he also fixed presage to not pull more stuff into main
<didrocks> FJKong: oh, some scope hacking, enjoy :)
<didrocks> FJKong: should we be concerned about the fcitx cpu bug?
<FJKong> didrocks: I think it is cause by sogou module
<didrocks> FJKong: keep us posted,now that fcitx is installed by default, in case is triggered by $anything
<FJKong> so only in these who install sogou input method
<didrocks> ok, sounds at least located, if you need help, do not hesitate
<FJKong> didrocks: thanks
<didrocks> yw, thanks!
<didrocks> #topic Laney
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Laney
 * larsu wonders if Laney is even here
<desrt> didrocks: he went for a walk ;)
<didrocks> larsu: was going to write approx. the same :)
 * desrt watches Laney rack up the points with each passing moment
<Laney> :)
<larsu> we should all stop making the same jokes
<Laney> I was finding a cool unicode symbol
<Laney> think I've topped all others
<Laney> â¢ Package new wallpapers
<Laney> â¢ Updates gdk-pixbuf pinta gvfs empathy intltool (in Debian too)
<Laney> â¢ Stab at failing image builds
<Laney> â qtquickcontrols MIR & testsuite fixes
<Laney> â fonts-* stuff
<Laney> â test failure blocking promotion from pending to current
<Laney> â¢ Discussions about how best to do fcitx by default for zh
<Laney> â¢ Merge patch to runtime detect spam software in evo
<Laney> â¢ Poke about making sure MSN and FB chat are disabled
<Laney> â¢ FFes and fun stuff like that
<Laney> â»
<larsu> haha
<didrocks> nice unicode char :)
<didrocks> thanks for looking at the failing image builds btw, nice to get some
<desrt> as in "and those are the â»  about what i've been working on" ?
<desrt> or is there some other meaning to this word?
 * larsu mumbles something about the late 80s
<didrocks> larsu: while you are mumbling, it's your turn!
<didrocks> #topic larsu
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: larsu
<larsu> theming week again \o/
<Laney> there's also ã¶ btw
<larsu> well, at least partly: I played around a lot trying to make totem's osd look nice
<larsu> couldn't get anything good (turns out I'm not a visual designer) so I went all minimal
<larsu> also finished up the titlebar branch a bit
<Laney> what did -doc say?
<larsu> nothing yet?
<Laney> ok?
<larsu> I think my ffe exception mail is still in some moderator queue
<larsu> at least I didn't get a response
<larsu> there was also quite some discussion about headerbar styling (again) this week
<larsu> and gedit (again)
<larsu> with no result (again)
<didrocks> :(
<didrocks> larsu: on -doc, IIRC, dpm has some moderation power on the ML, maybe ping him? (I may be wrong)
<larsu> dpm: ping ^^
<dpm> didrocks, larsu, I don't think I've got admin on that list, just ubuntu-translators
<didrocks> larsu: got luck with the moderators hunting then!
<didrocks> thanks dpm :)
<dpm> sorry I couldn't help much
<desrt> larsu: could always just join the list?
<didrocks> yeah, let's try to get it moving, larsu tell us if you need help, I can look if I got some archives about who did what on that list
<didrocks> ok, let's move on
<larsu> bah sorry connection troubles
<didrocks> no worry, anything to add?
<larsu> something's wrong with this machine's wifi
<larsu> ya
<didrocks> ja*
<larsu> did some hacking on gnome-desktop because of a background issue on ubiquity
<larsu> in summary: our hidpi wallpaper situation is *bad*
<larsu> as in, we scale the image down and back up
<larsu> resulting in a blurry bg
<larsu> I also started looking into the change password dialog in u-c-c not working, but was distracted by all the previous stuff I mentioned
<seb128> larsu, wfm, I used today
<seb128> the change pwd
<larsu> seb128: oh. Not for me?!
<larsu> interesting
<seb128> works on my 2 laptops
<seb128> including ecryptfs
<seb128> so dunno, but let me know if you figure it out ;-)
<larsu> apparently it got fixed since I looked at it last week?
<larsu> whatevs. I'll have another look
<larsu> </larsu>
<didrocks> thanks larsu
<didrocks> #topic qengho
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: qengho
<didrocks> qengho: hey, how is going the chromium world?
<qengho> It's okay. Jut one item so far this week.
<qengho> - Working on chromium pixel-density strangeness. Old Gtk2 tab-bars perhaps fixed, needs testing. Off-screen pop-up windows still a mystery.
<qengho> EOF
<didrocks> oh, that was will's bug, right?
<qengho> The second part is his.
<qengho> THe first is a different one.
<didrocks> ok, interesting, seems some kind of *dpi week ;)
<didrocks> thanks qengho
<didrocks> #topic mlankhorst
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: mlankhorst
<didrocks> mlankhorst: I gave you some additional minutes, hoping you are back now!
<didrocks> (seems so from #ubuntu-devel)
<didrocks> ok, let's see if he's back again later
<didrocks> #topic tkamppeter
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: tkamppeter
<didrocks> tkamppeter: around?
<tkamppeter> Yes
<tkamppeter> - Organization of the OpenPrinting Summit 2015
<tkamppeter> - hplip: Fixed another Python3 transition bug
<tkamppeter> - Bugs
<tkamppeter> - Moving to Brazil
<didrocks> moving to Brazil? nice!
<larsu> oh cool!
<larsu> tkamppeter: where are you moving to?
<desrt> tkamppeter: if you were sick of mitte, you could have tried kreuzburg
<larsu> desrt: *kreuzberg
 * larsu teaches this guy German all the way from Schlesisches Tor
<tkamppeter> Yes, now I am in the middle of the move, the big boxes with the stuff are sent out and I will fly on Friday.
<desrt> burg... berg... it's all bahnhof to me
<larsu> desrt: you mean castle / mountain
<tkamppeter> And a lot of furniture and a car have been sold.
<Laney> not the printer collection
<didrocks> ahah :)
<Laney> dear god please not the printer collection
<larsu> tkamppeter: have a safe trip!
<didrocks> tkamppeter: good luck with the move!
<desrt> tkamppeter: safe travels :)
<tkamppeter> It goes to Belo Horizonte, third largest city of Brazil, capital of the state Minas Gerais, birth place of my wife.
<desrt> tkamppeter: lots of family there, i guess?
<tkamppeter> desrt, I had already moved from Mitte to Pankow earlier.
<desrt> tkamppeter: yuck.  no wonder you want to move to another country ;)
<desrt> outside the ring, man!!
<tkamppeter> The printer collection is partially sold, mainly very old or broken printers, and three printers are in the big box.
<larsu> desrt: don't talk down on Pankow.
<larsu> desrt: just don't.
<desrt> larsu: too close to home?
<larsu> no it's actually quite far
<larsu> but it's nice there
<larsu> my grandparents used to live there
<didrocks> let's continue best locations (it's Lyon anyway) discussion later onâ¦
<didrocks> thanks tkamppeter, and safe flight!
<didrocks> #topic seb128
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: seb128
<seb128> hey
<tkamppeter> desrt, but it was very close to the ring, so one went more to Prenzlauer Berg for shopping and not to Pankow.
<seb128> â¢ updated tbe click chroot code to handle missing upstart (was making sdk env
<seb128> creation bug)
<seb128> â¢ submitted fix for invalid gvariant ref handling in telephony-service,
<seb128> thanks larsu for pointing out the problem
<seb128> â¢ helped robert_ancell to get sort out sync/blacklist issues for some
<seb128> fonts packages
<seb128> â¢ updated uitk example gallery to use valid documentation references
<seb128> â¢ reported some issues with the developer website
<seb128> â¢ looked more at the gnome-bg hidpi issues
<seb128> â¢ ubuntu-system-settings
<tkamppeter> Yes, a lot of family in BH.
<seb128> â fixed text entries not getting the initial focus in bt pairing dialog
<seb128> (and sim forwarding)
<seb128> â¢ tried to make the phone advertize over bt as a phone rather than a computer with init scripts but that seems to not work reliably, need to maybe look at a different way to do that (config override?)
<seb128> â¢ investigated a bit bluetooth autopairing of input device (not having to confirm the 0000 number manually)
<seb128> that's it from me ;-)
<seb128> hey from London btw
<seb128> thanks didrocks for handling the meeting ;-)
<desrt> seb128: say hi to everyone there :)
 * didrocks sends some sun to seb128
<didrocks> seb128: yw!
<seb128> didrocks, oh, sun from the south of France, niiiice
<seb128> desrt, k :-)
 * desrt waits for it
<didrocks> seb128: so previsible
<seb128> :p
<didrocks> predictable*
<desrt> *shrug* http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/previsible
<didrocks> seb128: enjoy the rest of meetings there, thanks for stopping by!
<seb128> thanks!
<didrocks> #topic robert_ancell
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: robert_ancell
<didrocks> Worked on:
<didrocks> - XMir handover
<didrocks> - lightdm SRUs
<didrocks> - Indic fonts
<didrocks>  Currently working on:
<didrocks> - TPM
<didrocks> #topic TheMuso
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: TheMuso
<didrocks>  * More unity 7 dash accessibility work.
<didrocks> * Begun installer accessibility testing, to ensure no regressions.
<didrocks> #topic didrocks
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: didrocks
<didrocks> Ubuntu Make:
<didrocks> - did a minor release with user experience enhancements and bug/tests fixes (more info on https://plus.google.com/+DidierRoche/posts/EP1DNeEkknx)
<didrocks> systemd:
<didrocks> - upstream discussion on fsckd changes that were needed to be done. Posted patches with the suggestions. All but one were reviewed, waiting for some feedbacks.
<didrocks> - worked on nfs-utils/data transitions, waiting now on Steve's answer.
<didrocks> - worked on whoopsie and whoopsie-preferences systemd integration followup to fix bugs #1412719 and bugs #1431432. In vivid now. As the transition is quite complex, I would appreciate if someone could test it as well with unity control center.
<didrocks> - started to replace during pitti's vacations handling/looking at systemd-related bugs.
<ubot5> bug 1412719 in whoopsie (Ubuntu) "wait-for-state restarts whoopsie every 30sec" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1412719
<didrocks> Misc:
<ubot5> bug 1431432 in whoopsie-preferences (Ubuntu) "conffiles prompt on vivid upgrade if report_metrics is enabled" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1431432
<didrocks> - media-hub and cmake-extra MIR review/acking
<didrocks> - discussions on MIR process for components nobody doesn't really want to own and archive admin processes (with demotion and promotion of some components to "fix" tracker/grilo-plugins situations).
<didrocks> - various fcitx/image size discussions while getting it by default on the live image.
<didrocks> .
<didrocks> #topic misc
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: misc
<didrocks> any pending questions?
<didrocks> hdpi discussions that we need to have? :)
<didrocks> or input method?
<desrt> anyone know a launchpad hacker? :)
<larsu> yes, we do
<tkamppeter> Thanks and Obrigado all for the good wishes for my move!
<desrt> this is annoying: https://bugs.launchpad.net/launchpad/+bug/335161
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 335161 in Launchpad itself "PPAs should export Contents-amd64.gz files" [Low,Triaged]
<larsu> didrocks: but really, we need a sprint
<didrocks> desrt: starts with a c ;)
<desrt> sorry.  rather this one: https://bugs.launchpad.net/launchpad/+bug/638498
<didrocks> larsu: +1
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 638498 in Launchpad itself "Contents files are not listed with checksums" [Low,Triaged]
<desrt> it's making it more difficult to support 'jhbuild sysdeps --install' for ubuntu
<didrocks> desrt: hum, I think we can get some urls with it, let me check after meeting
<didrocks> the first one at least, I don't remember about the checksums
<desrt> didrocks: i know the files are online... trouble is they're not listed in the Release file
<didrocks> needs to check old CI train code
<didrocks> oh really? sounds weird
<desrt> ya...
<seb128> desrt, try asking cjwatson maybe :-)
<didrocks> yeah, that was my c* hint :)
<seb128> he moved to launchpad
<desrt> interesting
<desrt> that sounds very promising indeed :)
<Laney> I predict a bzr branch lp:launchpad in desrt's future
<seb128> lol
<didrocks> Laney: went there as well? :)
<desrt> desrt@humber:~$ bzr
<desrt> bash: bzr: command not found
<desrt> *cough*
<didrocks> desrt: if bzr is the issue, there is a cool git plugin :)
<Laney> git bzr clone!
<desrt> sounds too much like 'git bz'
<desrt> anyway... one other piece of business
<desrt> i just wanted to say that this meeting was run in an extremely excellent way
<desrt> i quite enjoyed it
<didrocks> thanks desrt :)
<larsu> I'm just happy noone was on strike
<didrocks> roh :p
<desrt> took me a second ;)
<larsu> didrocks: :P Thanks for running the meeting!
<didrocks> yw guys!
<didrocks> #endmeeting
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Welcome to the Desktop Team | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For support please join #ubuntu | Issues with GTK 3.14? Check here: http://pad.ubuntu.com/gtk-update-v
<meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Mar 17 16:19:14 2015 UTC.
<meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2015/ubuntu-desktop.2015-03-17-15.31.moin.txt
<didrocks> thanks everyone :)
<larsu> so I think we should talk about headerbars, hidpi, and fcitx now
<didrocks> oh, forgot about headbars in this "what to discuss" proposal
<didrocks> sorry about it ;)
<larsu> ;)
<didrocks> headerbars*
 * larsu prefers headbars
<Laney> ffffffframe extents
<attente_> what's to discuss about fcitx?
<larsu> Laney: sigh
<desrt> ya... we talk about them enough that saving the two extra characters may reduce RSI
<Laney> haha
<desrt> h7r
<larsu> Laney: maybe we should just byte the bullet and patch gtk to not supress the decorations
 * didrocks likes h7r
<Laney> ...
<Laney> let's have a h7r amnesty for a few weeks
<seb128> didrocks, so, I'm on a slow box but u-c-c freezes for like 15 seconds when checking the whoopsie box
<seb128> http://paste.ubuntu.com/10616144/
<seb128> " object_path=0x3e14c70 "/com/ubuntu/WhoopsiePreferences", interface_name=0xffffffffffffffff <error: Cannot access memory at address 0xffffffffffffffff>,
<seb128>     interface_name@entry=0x3df7960 "com.ubuntu.WhoopsiePreferences", method_name=0x1 <error: Cannot access memory at address 0x1>,"
<seb128> the cannot access memory looks weird to me
<didrocks> seb128: waow, everytime?
<seb128> yes
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, I'm doing some sync subprocess call
<didrocks> that's what I wanted to check
<didrocks> I don't think the memory address issue is linked to it
<seb128> k
<didrocks> but ok, you confirm that can be slow on some box
<didrocks> I'll change that logic
<larsu> why isn't this in gsettings?
<didrocks> larsu: it was some conffiles before, now it's piloting enablement/disablement of a systemd service
<didrocks> larsu: and systemd doesn't have a "start if this key is true/false"
<larsu> didrocks: maybe we should add that :)
<ogra_> +1 ... and while you are at it do the same for the android property service since we will need the same feature on phones
<seb128> didrocks, thanks
<didrocks> seb128: thank you for testing!
<seb128> yw!
<larsu> ogra_: what do we need that for?
<didrocks> larsu: I think there were some opposition for that
<ogra_> larsu, en/disabling system services when the container switches something on/off
<didrocks> like for ConditionExec=
<larsu> didrocks: color me surprised
<larsu> ogra_: ah, this way around. I thought hooking it up to gsettings
<ogra_> larsu, drivers and their managing daemons run inside the container ... the properties get set or unset by these daemons, userspace runs completely on the ubuntu side ...
<seb128> didrocks, oh, just got a segfault...
<ogra_> for upstart we have a "property-bridge" that handles this
<didrocks> seb128: if you have a traceback handyâ¦ :)
<ogra_> larsu, ah, no, no gsettings ... but the feature on the systemd side wouldnt be much different
<larsu> indeed
<desrt> so.. cjwatson already has a fix that he's testing
<didrocks> seb128: the segfault is on the backend, right?
<didrocks> seb128: that's the only part I touched
<seb128> didrocks, http://paste.ubuntu.com/10616178/
<seb128> didrocks, no, u-c-c, but it happens if you go out of the panel before the call returned I guess
<cyphermox> dgadomski: could I provide you with a preseed?
<seb128> that might not be a new bug
<seb128> didrocks, where is the enable/disable status stored?
<dgadomski> cyphermox: for testing?
<didrocks> seb128: ok, I'm pretty sure something like this already existed
<didrocks> seb128: systemd
<didrocks> seb128: there is no "intermediate storage" anymore
<didrocks> systemctl status whoopsie
<dgadomski> cyphermox: sure
<seb128> didrocks, oh, ok
<seb128> didrocks, it's fine for touch as well?
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, it also changes the upstart state
<didrocks> I don't know about the first enable/disable feedback
<didrocks> but starting/stopping can be async
<didrocks> (it wasn't before)
<didrocks> so I guess you already had trouble under upstart with this machine
<seb128> it's not freezing anymore now, go figure
<seb128> didrocks, ok, at least changing value seems to work fine
<didrocks> seb128: it should enable/disable + starts/stops
<didrocks> seb128: the other settings now changes /etc/whoopsie
<didrocks> and /etc/default/whoopsie should be removed on upgrade
<didrocks> (and transitioned)
<seb128> that one was removed yeah
<seb128> I looked in there first
<seb128> so seems to work as it should :-)
<didrocks> phew, thanks seb128 :)
<seb128> yw!
<cyphermox> dgadomski: yeah, for testing; I keep the preseed files around, it gets useful
<dgadomski> cyphermox: please attach them to any of the lp bugs if applicable
<cyphermox> ack
<desrt> oh.  one more thing i found recently that's annoying me: 'df' is messed up
<desrt> on my utopic system....  and on jessie it seems to be working fine
<didrocks> desrt: btrfs?
<desrt> it seems that the way that it works is by opening /etc/mtab and then calling stat() on each of the listed mountpoints
<desrt> then it removes duplicates, by st_dev comparison
<desrt> but (here's the stupid part) it shows the _last_ item for each st_dev
<desrt> so if you do a bind mount, it will show the bind mount destination as the mountpoint
<desrt> instead of the original one
<desrt> so i get stupid output like /srv/mirror    1442015700 351365208 1017377232  26% /home/desrt/jhbuild/jessie-amd64-itstool/srv/mirror
#ubuntu-desktop 2015-03-18
<didrocks> good morning
<darkxst> hey didrocks
<didrocks> hey darkxst
<darkxst> didrocks, curious what happens to all our MIR's now?
<didrocks> darkxst: don't have time to look retrospectively to old ones, I would say, we need the discussion that started on grilo to end up with strong resolutions first, and then, if someone has time, they can go back in time
<darkxst> didrocks, was talking more future, than resprospectively
<didrocks> darkxst: you need to find some team at canonical wanted to support the source I guess
<didrocks> darkxst: if you are concerned by this, I would say raise it to the technical board
<darkxst> didrocks, its a little concerning, some of it is due to -desktop team still holding randsom over g-s-d/g-c-c, but the rest comes from the large overlap with Ubuntu
<darkxst> and many times in the overlap case, Canonical don't want the new features that pull in the new deps, or they want to wait etc
<darkxst> (Canonical teams)
<didrocks> darkxst: yeah, nothing I can really do here, so when you get the issue and you are stuck, feel free to raise it there I guess
<darkxst> didrocks, I wasnt expecting you to fix it, but sooner or later it will have to come that that (TB)
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<didrocks> hey seb128
<seb128> TB ... not sure what they can do there?
<seb128> they can't decide that packages should be supported even if there is nobody to support those
<mlankhorst> morning
<didrocks> morning mlankhorst
<seb128> hey mlankhorst
<larsu> good morning
<darkxst> seb128, except there are teams to support them, just not Canonical teams, so either thats a technical issue that the archive structure is insufficient, or its a political issue
<darkxst> unless support is meant to mean some bespoke custom development on demand type things
<seb128> darkxst, the issue is also to know that if there is a security problem in one of those packages in 3 years there is somebody to deal with it
<seb128> darkxst, or there is no garanty that volunteers are still going to be around or wanting to resolve the issues in 3 years
<seb128> so I don't think it's a Canonical or not, just need to have a solid reference which can be trusted
<seb128> sorry, user switching screwed my session :-/
<darkxst> and what make a solid reference?
<seb128> dunno, if you were in charge, what would make you trust somebody to still be around in 3 years?
<seb128> I guess it mostly mean having a commercial backing behind
<seb128> or a group solid enough that you trust them to not vanish easily
<seb128> like Debian
<seb128> well, those are in nowhere official statements
<seb128> just my view on the issue
<darkxst> seb128, IT companys come and go like the wind
<seb128> not all
<seb128> I'm ready to bet my money that microsoft, apple and google are still there in 3 years
<darkxst> and all of the packages we have MIR'd are well maintained in Debian
<seb128> well, maybe that has to be enough
<seb128> as said I'm just doing loud thinking there, those are not official statement
<seb128> the current archive layout is suboptimal
<seb128> shame that the archive re-org was never fully done
<darkxst> seb128, sure the big boys will be around, will canonical be?
<seb128> the idea was to be able to tag packages as supported without having to rely on the main/universe split
<seb128> darkxst, not sure, but that's not really revelant to the discussion
<seb128> we are talking about how Canonical hold to its engagement to maintain those packages and deal with security issues&co
<darkxst> seb128, just saying IMO commercial backing doesnt provide a huge guarantee in itself
<seb128> if Canonical is not sure anymore the question of how they provide their support vanishes iwth it
<seb128> not sure->not there
<seb128> right
<seb128> so you argue that support should be provided only for things Canonical is ready to support itself
<seb128> and not trust anyone else, including other IT companies
<seb128> which is a fair position
<darkxst> seb128, no I argue, there needs to be a way for this to work, for the community flavours
<seb128> "this" being?
<seb128> you can't force Canonical to provide free support for things you need but Canonical has no direct interest in
<darkxst> we don't even want to do that, but the archive structure seems to dictate it
<seb128> well, there are solutions
<seb128> including finishing the archive reorg
<seb128> or moving sources to universe
<seb128> we could also duplicate sources if really needed
<seb128> like have a nautilus in main and nautilus-tracker in universe
<seb128> in practice there is no real problem so far though
<seb128> Canonical teams have been happily taking over some extra packages in those cases to try to accomodate for others
<seb128> like desktop team subscribed to tracker and grilo
<willcooke> morning desktoppers
<seb128> hey willcooke, how is grey London today?
<darkxst> seb128, yes for the couple of cases that were bought up
<didrocks> morning willcooke
<seb128> darkxst, so in practice there is no real issue?
<darkxst> seb128, if desktop team, takes all our MIR requests then no
<darkxst> you probably want gom anyway eventually (that will be next up I think)
<darkxst> next MIR
<seb128> what is gom doing?
<seb128> "GObject Data Mapper"
<seb128> k
<didrocks> seb128: it's like the django model, you write classes and it's translated into sql queries
<didrocks> seeing the number of bugs/issues that I heard about it, not sure it suits main though
<darkxst> didrocks, its quite new still
<didrocks> yeah, that's the reason why it's maybe too new to be in main
 * willcooke curses the wifi
<darkxst> didrocks, I agree its not ready, but it will need to be at some point
<didrocks> yeah, just don't feed the MIR before it is :)
<didrocks> file*
<darkxst> didrocks, have I ever filed any unreasonable MIR's? I don't think so
<didrocks> darkxst: no, but when you were telling "gom will be next up", I started to be afraid that you were referring for something like "soon"
<Laney> grr
<darkxst> didrocks, I did not say soon
<Laney> no network on resume, as usual
<Laney> restart network manager, system hangs
<Laney> #fail
<didrocks> Laney: did you try with upstart?
<didrocks> at least, to get systemd out of the loop
<Laney> that was upsstart
<didrocks> ah
<didrocks> so, on both? seems networkish managerish or rfkillish/hardwarish
<darkxst> didrocks, atleast for now, we have got though the backlog of MIR's for 3.12/14
<darkxst> grilo/plugins is planning on using gom, not sure they have switched yet though
<darkxst> (on a hard-dep basis)
<didrocks> doesn't seem yet from git master
<Laney> it will do, which will be an improvement imho
<Laney> some of the current direct interaction with sqlite is a bit shonky
<darkxst> Laney, then again some of sparql also plays up with sqlite at times
<darkxst> but it should be much easier for a higher level framework to write valid SQL you would think
 * Laney looks at didrocks 
<Laney> seems to me as if you are in https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-test-case-dev ... want to review that machine-id test fix? :)
<didrocks> Laney: pfff, I'm in as a *side effect* ;)
<didrocks> joke apart, I think the QA team should review the tests (even if this seems to be trivial), I'm happy to do it as a fallback if no-one is available though
<Laney> tried pinging this cihelp thing, no reply yet
<darkxst> Laney, I messed your comment of the gnome-contacts FFe, but guess its needs a UIFe no also
<Laney> ya
<Laney> is it worth it now?
<darkxst> the UI is largely unchanged on Unity (except the proper menu bar I added) and the change to add account dialog
<didrocks> Laney: keep me posted
<Laney> I'll just ask plars or someone
<darkxst> Laney, guess its ok to land first thing in W though
<Laney> no promoted desktop iso since march 6th sucks
<Laney> darkxst: If you want to ask for the UIFe then go for it
<Laney> if you think the benefits are worth it
<darkxst> Benefits for us, not for you guys, though larsu thinks both existing and new UI's are bad
<seb128> Laney, what's the issue with the iso?
<Laney> smoke tests are failing
<seb128> what tests/on what error?
<Laney> https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/view/vivid/view/Smoke%20Testing/ -> https://jenkins.qa.ubuntu.com/view/vivid/view/Smoke%20Testing/job/vivid-desktop-amd64-smoke-default/131/artifact/utah-35520-vivid-amd64_default.run_2015-03-18_08-03-10.yaml
<seb128> oh, it's the machine-id thing you were discussing which is the issue
<Laney> ye
<Laney> not sure why there's a test for this implementation detail
<seb128> larsu, Laney, can one of you maybe review https://code.launchpad.net/~seb128/unity-settings-daemon/non-unity-sessions-need-scaling/+merge/250153 for me? it's sitting there for a while and I think it's correct/should land for vivid since it fixes oem issues
<seb128> brb session restart
<larsu> seb128: approved. Thanks. Going to lunch now :)
<seb128> larsu, thanks!
<larsu> :)
 * Laney wonders how to get email about these MPs
<seb128> larsu, the 16/9 value thing is just copy from GNOME code, but agreed on fixing it at the right place, if possible
<seb128> but seems it's the hardware sending buggy values
<seb128> so unsure we can compute valid ones
<seb128> larsu, Laney, review on https://code.launchpad.net/~seb128/unity-settings-daemon/battery-info-key/+merge/253336 appreciated as well
<Laney> seb128: don't want to take that upstream commit to make the notification work?
<seb128> Laney, no
<seb128> Laney, I tried to use a notification, it looks weird with notify osd
<seb128> well, first the function use doesn't work under notify-osd so you still don't get a notification
<seb128> I did a custom one like we do for others but it looks weird
<seb128> like having a battery icon and 100% as text
<seb128> we could draw a progressbar like for volume
<seb128> but I'm unsure it's a good UI
<seb128> that would need proper design
<seb128> if somebody is interested to work on that feel free
<Laney> yeah it seems like a weird action
<Laney> i wonder why they want that
<larsu> seb128: too late :)
<seb128> Trevinho, attente_, hey, when you added the keygraber to compiz to handle GNOME keybindings, did you look at providing the timestamp as well?
<Trevinho> seb128: mh, attente did the internals... But I think he did
 * Trevinho checks
<seb128> no, it's an uu
<Trevinho> seb128: no, in fact...
<seb128> I'm asking because we would need to avoid focus issues
<seb128> https://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-settings-daemon/commit/?id=487a936e61766f0306772c1269e2ff437fc53a46
<Trevinho> seb128: so... where's the new API?
<seb128> Trevinho, new API?
<Trevinho> you're faster than my fingers :P
<Trevinho> seb128: that's the new api I guess... we cpouldn't use uuu before
<attente_> seb128: i don't think so
<seb128> attente_, Trevinho, is that something you could easily change?
<seb128> not sure if unity has the timestamp value handy at this point of the code
<Trevinho> seb128: is that already in vivid (the {u,g}-s-d part)?
<seb128> Trevinho, no, signatures need to match
<Trevinho> seb128: yes, compiz gives us
<seb128> so we can't land only one side
<Trevinho> seb128: I know... so we should update them all together
<seb128> I was looking at backporting that commit
<seb128> but then it complains about the mismatching signature
<seb128> so I'm asking if somebody could do the unity side
<Trevinho> seb128: we can sync with that
<Trevinho> I can prepare a branch in seconds
<seb128> Trevinho, please do
<Trevinho> seb128: sure
<seb128> :-)
<seb128> thanks
<Trevinho> seb128: ouch I hope I've not been too positive, as we've the timestamp on options, let me check further
<seb128> Trevinho, k
<Trevinho> seb128: ah, no sorry... we've it
<Trevinho> no worries
<seb128> great :-)
<Trevinho> seb128: do you have a bug for it?
<seb128> Trevinho, no, but I can open one if you want, I was just checking if I find one
<Trevinho> seb128: ok, I leave that to you with great pleasure :)
 * Trevinho really can't understand why they didn't do this from the very beginning... timestamp MUST BE THEREEEEEE (or crazyness happens)!
<Trevinho> seb128: lp# ready? :)
<seb128> Trevinho, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/1433648
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1433648 in unity (Ubuntu) "u-s-d needs timestamp to run commands" [Undecided,New]
<Trevinho> cool
<Trevinho> seb128: here it is https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/unity/gnome-keys-timestamp-api/+merge/253380
<seb128> Trevinho, thanks!
<seb128> Trevinho, I'm testing the combined changes, give it a bit to build and I can confirm if it works
<Trevinho> seb128: cool, ChrisTownsend will check the unity code meanwhile
<seb128> Trevinho, great, thanks
<tejota> How could I setup an web accessible Ubuntu desktop (VDI/DaaS sort of thing, I guees) on a VPS (say, with Digitalocean)?
<Laney> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily-live/current/
<Laney> a new current image is born
<didrocks> Laney: I hope it does boot under upstart :p (see #ubuntu-release ;))
<Laney> ha
<happyaron> Laney: just come up with a patch for language-selector's pkg_depends, how can I test whether it work in installation?
<Laney> install it in a live session and try installing
<happyaron> OK
<Laney> didn't somebody else come up with a patch already?
<happyaron> nope, :)
<Laney> bug #1431337
<ubot5> bug 1430893 in ubuntu-meta (Ubuntu) "duplicate for #1431337 [FFe] Install Fcitx for Chinese users" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1430893
<Laney> ffs
<Laney> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/200029284/fcitx-support.debdiff
<happyaron> ic, the way of modifying it is correct, but it's not pulling in the correct packages
<happyaron> didn't notice the patch though, quickly merged after it's reported
<Laney> probably give this guy credit
<happyaron> that's not a problem
<happyaron> will
<happyaron> will write him in changelog
<happyaron> 9.48MB/s getting daily-live, yay
<seb128> Trevinho, the changes work great, thanks ;-)
<seb128> bregma, hey, do you plan an unity landing in vivid soon? I would like to see https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/1433648 fixed but it needs to coordinate u-s-d and unity landings
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1433648 in unity (Ubuntu) "u-s-d needs timestamp to run commands" [Medium,In progress]
<bregma> seb128, soon, just focused on a Unity 14.04 SRU at the moment, the MP for that bug is in the review queue right now
 * bregma is keeping away from ci-train after breaking it the last time
<seb128> bregma, k, how do you want to handle the sync? do you plan to include u-s-d in the next unity silo?
<bregma> we could do it that way
<bregma> what's the u-s-d MP?
<seb128> not up yet
<seb128> I'm wondering if I should use a versionned Breaks
<seb128> and on what unity version then
<seb128> to ensure they get updated together
<bregma> hamm, we could do an upstream Unity release to keep it simple
<seb128> did you plan to bump the version for the next vivid landing?
<bregma> I can, if we release 7.3.2 upstream
<seb128> well, should I use that in my u-s-d mp then?
<bregma> yes, let's do that
<seb128> bregma, https://code.launchpad.net/~seb128/unity-settings-daemon/timestamp-for-commands/+merge/253394
<seb128> bregma, please include in your next unity update silo then ;-)
<bregma> will do
<seb128> bregma, thanks
<seb128> larsu, your gnome-desktop current patch seems to work fine, is it still creating issues with nautilus?
<seb128> or should I upload?
<seb128> I test my testcase with scale 1 and 2 and nautilus with scale 1 and 2, things look fine
<seb128> though nautilus with scale 2 has the image not properly scaled it seems but that was already the case
<larsu> seb128: works for me, but please test it again to make sure
<larsu> seb128: it propery scales it now with the new version of my patch. not for you?
<seb128> larsu, well, I built a package and test both testcase and nautilus
<seb128> larsu, is GDK_SCALE=2 nautilus supposed to render the full bg image?
<seb128> or is with scaling 2 the image supposed to go over the screen?
<larsu> no, it shouldn't go over the screen
<seb128> larsu, sorry, tried again and took screenshot, I probably got confused by the big icons
<seb128> exactly the same
 * seb128 validates larsu's fix and upload
<larsu> \o/
<seb128> larsu, thanks again for working on that!
<seb128> larsu, I commented on the upstream bug saying that the fix works for me
<larsu> seb128: just saw, thanks
<seb128> yw!
<larsu> seb128: it's not exactly the same. Should be better (try with an image where you can see the pixels)
 * larsu had a blck/white 1x1 checker pattern to test
<Laney> JohnLea_: willcooke: hi, do you plan to address #21 / #22 from https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-wallpapers/+bug/1429011 ?
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1429011 in ubuntu-wallpapers (Ubuntu) "15.04 wallpapers package" [Medium,Triaged]
<willcooke> Laney, nope, but JohnLea_ might ^^^^
<Sweet5hark> larsu: you Berlin guys certainly have too much VC flying around: http://www.deutsche-startups.de/startups-jobs/stellenangebote/tester-qualitaetsmanager-bordelle-mw/
<larsu> Sweet5hark: lol!
<willcooke> Laney, JohnLea_ - I will email Alex as well
<Laney> willcooke: ok, if you could give a size budget of 4M that would be helpful too. ;)
<willcooke> Laney, sure
<Laney> thanks
 * Laney looks out for xnox's OCD
<willcooke> :D
<xnox> Laney: is there a new wallpaper, or are you gonna kill me with off-set one?!
<willcooke> xnox, were you more concerned about the horizontal alignment, or both horizontal and vertical?
<willcooke> or was it the dots?
<xnox> willcooke: the horizon height is imho critical.
<seb128> Laney, larsu, any news of the theme/csd decoration look changes?
<xnox> willcooke: the rest are minor, knit pickings.
<xnox> willcooke: the "center horizontal fold"
<willcooke> ack
<larsu> seb128: not yet :(
<willcooke> so it needs to be, well, in the middle
<willcooke> ?
<xnox> willcooke: john lea is not the one who has assets or drew this.
<xnox> willcooke: previously i would just wonder around blue fin, until i find the right person to nudge things in photoshop and email them to me.
<willcooke> no but he's the Design person in the channel
<xnox> LOL
<willcooke> xnox, if you're in the office, then I expect Alex is as well, he's the guy who drew them
<xnox> willcooke: honestly, just find the person who drew it direct.
<seb128> Laney, larsu, I don't think we need to ask for permissions, we just need to drop them a fyi and upload
<Laney> yes we do
<xnox> willcooke: i quit canonical last year, fyi ;-)
<Laney> it didn't show up on the list though
<seb128> Laney, we do what?
<willcooke> oh! yeah!
<willcooke> xnox, yeah, I've email him
<seb128> fyi or ask for permission?
<Laney> need the fyi at least
<Laney> but it's not even on there yet
<seb128> right
<Laney> I asked pmatu something to moderate the list but it's still not there
<larsu> Laney: awaiting approval... if this is the process, it isn't good
<Laney> yeah no shit
<seb128> on what list is it moderation? documentation?
<Laney> ubuntu-doc
<seb128> k
<seb128> asking on #ubuntu-devel in case
<seb128> larsu, who would be the right person to review/ack https://code.launchpad.net/~larsu/ido/prelight-and-focus-scale/+merge/252293 ? charles ?
<larsu> Laney: are you on that list? Can you please just send an email from your account?
<larsu> that would at least get *this* thing moving
<Laney> don't know
<Laney> I think not
<seb128> larsu, can you fwd me the email you sent?
<larsu> seb128: yes, and the original reporter of the bug (ochosi)
<seb128> ochosi, can you test/review ^ ?
<larsu> Laney: why not?
<larsu> seb128: sure
<Laney> why not what?
<ochosi> hey guys
<ochosi> i'm using that same code in a panel plugin for xfce, that's how i noticed the bug :)
<ochosi> so yeah, that fix works for me there, but i can try to test it with ido too
<larsu> Laney: I asked if you can send an email and your next message was "don't know. I think not." I guess that was unrelated?
<Laney> first you asked if I was on the list. :P
<seb128> ochosi, thanks
<ochosi> anything special i need to know for testing/building that lib?
<seb128> charles, can you review https://code.launchpad.net/~larsu/ido/prelight-and-focus-scale/+merge/252293 ? should be an easy one
<larsu> ochosi: wait... if my fix to ido works for you, you must be using ido, no?
<ochosi> larsu: nope, we borrowed the scalemenuitem code for an xfce plugin
<larsu> ochosi: how else would you be affected
<larsu> ochosi: so you copied the fix?
<seb128> code copy
<larsu> well thenâ¦
<seb128> larsu, should I see any difference under unity
<seb128> or a "look the same" is good?
<ochosi> larsu: yes, this is where we use it: http://imgur.com/TXhMUsA
<larsu> seb128: it's there, but very subtle
<larsu> seb128: switch to adwaita and you'll see it
<seb128> larsu, k
<seb128> larsu, switched to adwaita, windows decoration from your branch look weird, the min/max buttons and title are white on light grey
<seb128> larsu, http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/ucc.png
<seb128> not well vertically centered as well
<seb128> but I guess in practice people don't use adwaita on unity
<larsu> seb128: woah, I thought you were still talking about the scalemenuitem branch
<larsu> seb128: how can changes to ubuntu-themes affect adwaita?
<seb128> larsu, oh sorry, not I mean the ubuntu-themes decoration changes
<seb128> oh, maybe it was there before
<seb128> I don't try adwaita often
<seb128> I've your branch applied though
<seb128> ignore that
<larsu> seb128: probably. Don't switch to adwaita to test those changes. They're for ubuntu-themes
<seb128> it doesn't seem a real world usecase
<seb128> larsu, I was switching to test ido
<seb128> but ja
<seb128> larsu, can you resend your ffe email? the moderator said he doesn't see it in the queue...
<seb128> well, not to me but to the list
 * didrocks waves good evening
<seb128> didrocks, night
<larsu> seb128: ok
<seb128> larsu, danke
 * larsu would have thought email works reliably these days
<seb128> you did get an email saying it's waiting for moderation?
<larsu> yes
<Laney> suspicious
<seb128> larsu, in fact the moderation says it probably got disgarded, sorry about that
<seb128> just resend
<Laney> haha
<seb128> the guy is around and can approve it
<larsu> done
<Laney> see, email is reliable
<Laney> it's those pesky humans
<larsu> pesky
<Laney> good word
<larsu> indeed
<larsu> Your message to ubuntu-doc awaits moderator approval
<larsu> Your message to ubuntu-doc awaits moderator approval
<larsu> let's seeâ¦
<ochosi> ok done
<seb128> ochosi, thanks
<seb128> larsu, Laney, https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/unity/gnome-keys-timestamp-api/+merge/253380 if you want another easy review ;-)
<ochosi> seb128: np, thanks to larsu for coming up with the fix :)
<seb128> hum, I don't have rights to approve https://code.launchpad.net/~larsu/overlay-scrollbar/blacklist-gnome-boxes/+merge/251566
<seb128> can somebody do that for me?
 * larsu feels out of place to do so
<Laney> hahaha
 * Laney loves the blacklist bonanza
<Laney> no rights either
<Laney> seb128: did you mean to link the usd branch instead?
<Laney> the bug's a bit light on details
<seb128> Laney, yes, sorry
<seb128> Laney, added a testcase to the bug, but it's basically "use keybinding to open an app (calc, web, email) and it goes to background"
<seb128> I noticed when testing my fix for the battery info key
<Laney> cheers
 * Laney remapped the keys to do volume actions instead, lemme change
<seb128> Laney, I mapped ctrl-alt-c to calculator to try
<seb128> larsu, please send email again, you were in autodiscard for some reason, he fixed it for good this time
<Laney> it seemed to try and put them in empty space
<Laney> stupid algorithm
<larsu> seb128: should I write a script that sends it every 10 mins?
<Laney> https://imgur.com/HIe0Mq4
<Laney> :D
<larsu> Laney: I've never understood why gnome-calculator is not a single-instance application
<larsu> *single-window, sorry
<larsu> bbiab
<Laney> I can imagine wanting to do a few different calculations at once
<Laney> maybe...
<Laney> got to go, ttyl!
<seb128> larsu, lol, sorry :(
 * willcooke -> EOD.  tata
#ubuntu-desktop 2015-03-19
<didrocks> good morning
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<seb128> lut didrocks ;-)
<didrocks> seb128: just a reminder that dgadomski raised during the team meeting about his email on the desktop ML (mount options in nautilus). I'm unsure myself about the best options, but would be nice if we can answer there
<seb128> didrocks, oh, right, thanks
<seb128> I still feel like it's too big of a topic to be realistic that we handle it downstream
<seb128> but we can at least get the discussion going
<didrocks> agreed
<dgadomski> didrocks, seb128: thanks guys, I'm aware that the scope is pretty wide, but any feedback is appreciated
<willcooke> morning desktoppers
<seb128> hey willcooke, how are you?
<seb128> back from London?
<willcooke> hey mlankhorst!  Weird thing... Chromium on the N7 looks like red and blue are swapped.  Did some Googling, I think it's an oddity in Chromium, few bug reports about the same thing on Android
<willcooke> seb128, yes!
<didrocks> hey willcooke
<mlankhorst> willcooke: that is probably a xmir bug :P
<mlankhorst> willcooke: does it happen with other opengl clients too?
 * didrocks starts to be worried about every lightdm starting asserts failing in autopkgtests
<willcooke> mlankhorst, any suggestions of something to try?
<seb128> didrocks, what asserts? lightdm doesn't start anymore in vivid?
<didrocks> seb128: from the tests, yes
<seb128> didrocks, when did that start?
<didrocks> seb128: no idea, that's the issue with autopkgtests. We can just say last time it pass was wednesday 11 march
<didrocks> if only ubiquity would let me install under kwmâ¦
<didrocks> kvm*
<seb128> is that version blocked in proposed?
 * seb128 checks
<seb128> hum, no lightdm update since the 10
<Laney> yo
<didrocks> seb128: systemd is blocked, but I doubt the change making the tests failing is in systemd
<seb128> hey Laney, wie gehts?
<didrocks> as even ubnutu5 is failing
<didrocks> hey Laney
<seb128> didrocks, what's the issue with ubiquity/kvm? is that the vesa driver thing?
<didrocks> seb128: or a ubiquity/X11 race, couldn't get any mouse under it
<didrocks> had to reboot
<didrocks> (it's installing now)
<seb128> oh ok
<didrocks> I'm installing a couple of week old image
<didrocks> that way, I will able to install, reboot, upgrade, reboot
<didrocks> if that passes, I'll try today's iso
<seb128> let me download the current daily here
<didrocks> to see at least if that impacts real users
<didrocks> seb128: there was another bug report about ddms not starting btw
<didrocks> under systemd and upstart
<seb128> how are those tests working?
<seb128> could it be "just" xorg not working under kvm?
<didrocks> seb128: well, it does work outside of autopkgtests at least
<Laney> hey seb128 et didrocks
<seb128> didrocks, are we sure?
<didrocks> however, I tried an autopkgtest image, installed ubuntu-desktop on it
<Laney> a few failures on glib's depends too
<Laney> oh noes
<didrocks> seb128: well, I am under kvm, I have a xorg session here, soâ¦ yes? :)
<seb128> bug #1433198
<ubot5> bug 1433198 in xorg-server (Ubuntu) "15.04 daily images don't reach X using VirtualBox - VESA error: Cannot read int vect" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1433198
<seb128> didrocks, k, several people mentioned ^ this week
<Laney> also desktop images failed to build
<didrocks> seb128: that can be a newer xorg-server issue
<Laney> libqt5qml5 : Depends: libdouble-conversion1 but it is not installable
<didrocks> seb128: here, I'm on a week-old image
<seb128> didrocks, yes, it is
 * Laney looks in the direction of finland
<didrocks> so, I guess the update will tell us
<seb128> Mirv !
<didrocks> (I'll try to upgrade xorg independently)
<seb128> mlankhorst, what's the status of bug 1433198?
<ubot5> bug 1433198 in xorg-server (Ubuntu) "15.04 daily images don't reach X using VirtualBox - VESA error: Cannot read int vect" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1433198
<Laney> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/double-conversion/+bug/1427677
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1427677 in double-conversion (Ubuntu) "[MIR] double-conversion" [Undecided,Fix committed]
<Laney> please to promote!
<didrocks> seb128: at least, that will explain why I can't get an autopkgtest image, where I add ubuntu-desktop on top of it to start xorg
<didrocks> lightdm logs are quite screwy though, only "starting Xorg, Xorg stopped"
<didrocks> with -d
<mlankhorst> seb128: just a sec I'll upload the fix..
<didrocks> (nothing by default)
<seb128> mlankhorst, great, thanks
<mlankhorst> got distracted by optimus
<didrocks> mlankhorst: do we have a ppa? I can at least try some autopkgtests here
<didrocks> that will answer if this is due to that quickly
<mlankhorst> [PATCH xserver] int10: Fix error check for pci_device_map_legacy
<mlankhorst> I'm confident it is..
<didrocks> mlankhorst: I'm quite stuck on some autopkgtests to unblock systemd, so if you get some binaries ready, that would help :)
<mlankhorst> didrocks: sure, I'll upload in a bit
<mlankhorst> once test build finishes
<darkxst>  hey desktopers
<seb128> hey darkxst
<darkxst> Laney or seb128 can you land my fail whale fix?
<mlankhorst> uploaded
<darkxst> bug 1385572
<ubot5> bug 1385572 in gnome-session (Ubuntu) "gnome-session not shutting down cleanly" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1385572
<seb128> Laney, double-conversion promoted
<Mirv> seb128: !
<Mirv> seb128: thanks for the promotion, I mistakenly thought it'd be automatic once MIR is approved and the dependency arrives
<seb128> Mirv, apparently you bugged the desktop iso build with your qt landing, I promoted double-conversion now, but it's annoying that things land in  buggy state
<happyaron> attente_: I wonder what's the reason of 1433831? what's the difference between unity7 and unity8 desktops?
<Mirv> seb128: well the promotion shouldn't happen before landing either?
<Laney> darkxst: ok in a bit
<mlankhorst> didrocks: uploaded to the archive, have fun :)
<seb128> Mirv, no, but I wonder why we hit the issue
<mlankhorst> bbiab
<seb128> Laney, are images built out of proposed?
<Laney> happyaron: I saw that language-selector got uploaded, does it work?
<Laney> no
<Laney> proposed doesn't check components though
<didrocks> mlankhorst: would have been great to test beforehand but ok, let's see :)
<seb128> and if not, why are things going through proposed-migration if they are not installable?
<didrocks> mlankhorst: also, I guess that means we need to have autopkgtests on xorg ;)
<Mirv> is this again train overpasses certain checks thing?
<Laney> it's because CI train ignores them
<Laney> in the archive it would have been depwait
<seb128> but train doesn't drive proposed-migration?Â§
<darkxst> Laney, thanks ;)
<seb128> Laney, so proposed-migration doesn't check that things are actually installable?
<Laney> I didn't say that
<Laney> I said that the train doesn't check component mismatches
<seb128> I didn't say you said that
<seb128> ah ok
<seb128> it's installable with universe
<seb128> ok, makes sense now
<Laney> correct
<seb128> Laney, thanks
<Laney> and the CI train lets main packages build with universe build deps
<Laney> and copies with binaries
<seb128> Mirv, so, yeah, it's because the ci train built without respect of the pockets and land built binaries
<darkxst> sounds more like a loophole, than a train
<Laney> There's an option on the PPAs to respect components
<happyaron> Laney: it works, but gunnar didn't tell me he's uploading that...
<Laney> don't know why they don't use it
<Laney> happyaron: heh
<Laney> is this enough for all cases?
<didrocks> Laney: it was enabled a year ago (we needed some fixes in launchpad first, which were done)
<didrocks> but I think they recreated new ppas
<didrocks> so probably the option wasn't enabled back
<seb128> Laney, larsu, https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-doc/2015-March/019404.html \o/
<happyaron> Laney: almost, there are some packages (fcitx-frontend-qt5) removed unexpectedly from /target, but in general it works. tried two installs, one for en locale, another zh_CN.
<seb128> Laney, can you handle the landing for larsu? you followed more than me those details I think
<Laney> ok
<Laney> happyaron: alright, good, gl with the fixes
<Laney> probably missing a dependency to that package
<happyaron> guess so, haven't looked at the details
<mitya57> Laney: if you are going to upload gnome-session, can you also look at bug 1251281?
<ubot5> bug 1251281 in gnome-session (Ubuntu Vivid) "gnome-session-flashback/Unity fails to start without hardware acceleration in cloud/remote environments (Forwarded-X/XRDP/VNC/NX/X2GO/Chromoting)" [Critical,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1251281
<larsu> seb128: \o/
<Laney> mitya57: I just went blind
<Laney> mitya57: are you up to speed on it?
<Laney> if so, you can do the uploading... :)
<didrocks> seb128: I'm skeptical about the xorg issue, I dist-upgraded an install, first with xorg, then kernel, now with everything and I'm getting to my session
<happyaron> Laney: shall I make an upload of im-config, everybody has fcitx as default now (current im-config behaviour)
<mitya57> Laney, yes it was on my todo list, of course I can do it myself
<didrocks> but let's see, I'll use adt-run -U option once xorg would have built in proposed
<seb128> didrocks, k, I don't know then
<happyaron> Laney: that would mean the FFe is completed though...
<Laney> mitya57: feel free
<seb128> didrocks, need more details I guess
<willcooke> didrocks, Need me to build some virtual machines to test anything?
<Laney> happyaron: what does the upload do?
<Laney> do you have a diff?
<happyaron> Laney: make ibus default for everyone other than zh_* locales. current behaviour is: im-config prefer fcitx over ibus, but we never seed fcitx in the live cd, so ibus is default.
<didrocks> willcooke: I don't think you will get further more than I am right now, I tend to try with the xorg fix if adt is happy again, and we'll see (already spent some hours on this)
<happyaron> Laney: a minute
<willcooke> oki, shout if I can pitch in some help
<seb128> didrocks, can you approve https://code.launchpad.net/~larsu/overlay-scrollbar/blacklist-gnome-boxes/+merge/251566 ?
<didrocks> willcooke: will do, thanks :)
<seb128> didrocks, I think you are in the right team
<seb128> I'm not
<didrocks> seb128: done
<seb128> didrocks, thanks
<didrocks> thanks larsu for this patch btw :p
<didrocks> no more transparency on boxed!
<didrocks> boxes*
<larsu> :)
<seb128> It's still over me why we can't fix those from the theme though :-/
<happyaron> Laney: https://launchpadlibrarian.net/200624463/im-config_0.27-1ubuntu8.debdiff
<Laney> happyaron: ok
 * Laney wonders why some i386 autopkgtests are having problems installing kde test deps
<happyaron> great
<willcooke> hey digitalalex :) How's the symmetry looking ;)
 * Laney eyes adt-run
<Laney> seems like it's hung unpacking libnotify4
 * didrocks eyes the archive publisher
<didrocks> I thought it was publishing every 10 minutes now
 * Laney eyes didrocks 
<didrocks> (last publishing was 25 minutes agoâ¦)
 * didrocks eyes Laney
<didrocks> :)
<seb128> ogra_ also mentioned that publisher got slower again over time I think
<seb128> read that on some other channel
<seb128> dunno what's going on with it
<didrocks> ah xorg missed the publishing windowâ¦
<seb128> :-/
<didrocks> (at least, the xorg error is the same than in the bug)
<seb128> didrocks, you get the error now? or you mean the autopkgtest one?
<didrocks> seb128: I used minicom to get into it while the systems are running
<didrocks> lightdm logs are really poor, (that's what is in the unit) and just says "lightdm failed to start"
<didrocks> so I looked at Xorg logs
<seb128> which lightdm logs?
 * didrocks didn't use minicom since 2002
<seb128> it has several logs, it's a bit confusing
<didrocks> seb128: the one showing up on systemctl status
<didrocks> so stdout, stderr + syslog forwarding
<seb128> didrocks, k, those are not the logs I guess?
<didrocks> but even running it manually with --debug doesn't help apart from "xorg stopped"
<didrocks> yeah, it doesn't print anything actually
<seb128> didrocks, /var/log/lightdm/lightdm.log and x-0.log probably have more details?
<seb128> or X-0-greeter.log
<didrocks> seb128: I'm not in it anymore, lightdm.log got what --debug had (so not really useful in that case)
<seb128> didrocks, the xorg errors/details are in x-0(-greeter).log
<didrocks> not sure about x-0.log, if it's the xorg logs, that would help I guess
<seb128> right
<seb128> it should
<didrocks> those should probably be forwarded to the journal (or rsyslog)
<seb128> not sure
<seb128> is syslog supposed to have the detailed logs from every service?
<seb128> it would make it quite impossible to read
<didrocks> it's supposed to have enough logs to know what went wrong I guess
<didrocks> like warnings and so on
<seb128> well, xorg log has the xorg log, even when there is no issue/error
<seb128> but yeah, ideally real error would be fwded to the main log by some mean
<didrocks> indeed, and that's where the issue is
<didrocks> if they just print to stdout/stderr, it's not an issue anymore with the journal
<didrocks> but let's see, I'll poke robert
<didrocks> ah, finally xorg published in proposed
 * didrocks tries
<GunnarHj> happyaron, Laney: I'm in doubt as regards the debian/rules changes in im-config at bug #1430893. If I understand it correctly, fcitx won't be installed by default unless Chinese is selected. There is still a Japanase remix which ships fcitx with the intention to make it the default IM framework. Considering that, wouldn't it be better to keep debian/rules as is in 15.04?
<ubot5> bug 1430893 in im-config (Ubuntu) "[FFe] Install Fcitx for Chinese users" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1430893
<happyaron> GunnarHj: if not doing that, all live session user will have fcitx as input method
<GunnarHj> happyaron: Aha...
<GunnarHj> happyaron: Do you have some other idea how to solve the Japanese remix issue?
<didrocks> mlankhorst: the upgrade works and fix systemd X11-related tests!
<seb128> didrocks, \o/
<didrocks> mlankhorst: I really think we should have at least one autopkgtest starting lightdm and ensuring we have a xorg server running
<didrocks> willcooke: FYI ^
<didrocks> seb128: phew!
<didrocks> ok, now overriding the failing autopkgtests as we discussed yesterday
<seb128> didrocks, I don't understand why you didn't get the xorg not starting issue in your vm though
<didrocks> seb128: I don't know as well (on the whole install)
<didrocks> probably a driver different when starting qemu myself and under adt
<didrocks> (I'm using direct rendering)
<seb128> could be
<seb128> Laney, can we get a new desktop iso built?
<seb128> Laney, with the double lib promotion and the xorg fix seems like worth starting a new build to see where we are now
<didrocks> seb128: xorg is still in proposed
<seb128> oh, ok
<Laney> is that systemd/upstart test getting fixed?
<didrocks> Laney: no, that was another one
<seb128> the machine-id one?
<didrocks> not even :p
<didrocks> so, there is the upstart reboot issue
<didrocks> that we discussed yesterday
<didrocks> and identified the cause
<didrocks> then, they wanted to override the tests
<didrocks> but as it was one of the first test failing, I wanted that we run all the other tests still
<didrocks> and that's how I discovered the lightdm/xorg issue
<Laney> nobody skipped the tests
<GunnarHj> Laney: Sorry about the l-s upload. Now I don't see the upload in the archive, neither in -proposed or -release.
<Laney> what does 'rmadison language-selector' say?
<didrocks> Laney: hence the "wanted"
 * didrocks feels now a little bit better on bug #1433728 should be the same
<ubot5> bug 1433728 in systemd (Ubuntu) "white screen after boot" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1433728
<Laney> hmm?
<didrocks> I guess there was another one, commenting as well
<GunnarHj> Laney: According to rmadison it's in vivid-proposed. (But not visible on the LP page.)
<Laney> GunnarHj: Click on View full publishing history and you can see that it's being copied atm
<GunnarHj> Laney: Done. Looks promising. :)
<Laney> Kind of surprised that this approach worked straight away. :P
<attente_> happyaron: #1433831 i guess is because unity 7 runs X, so runs /etc/X11/Xsession.d/70im-config_launch. the upstart job requires IM_CONFIG_PHASE to be set by that
<attente_> happyaron: and i guess the lack of initctl set-env in the job script is another bug that wasn't noticed because it already worked in unity 7
<Mirv> seb128: Laney: was there some final thought about the train vs. MIR:ing? I can add the check to my Qt landing process (to ping archive admins at the right point), but it of course affects any train landings that do similar thing
<Laney> Mirv: Can you find out why that flag isn't set on the PPAs?
<Mirv> Laney: oh, right so why the PPA:s allow building such things?
<Laney> Perhaps because it's weird to promote things in the archive to satisfy builds in an external repository
<Mirv> blocking on that in landing PPA:s would make some sense since landing PPA is a sort of proposed-proposed anyway
<Mirv> but then again indeed it's weird to prepromote
<Mirv> best would be if proposed could detect it even with copy-binaried packages
<Mirv> anyhow, I'll add the check to my own process doc
<Mirv> (added to https://docs.google.com/a/canonical.com/spreadsheets/d/1xXhsnTwzvm5p6gDbUrDpRPSJV9tX4SHCptC9yUYCMmE/edit#gid=1330430878 for 5.5)
<mdeslaur> charles: do I need to merge indicator-power myself, or is that handled automatically?
<mdeslaur> oh, I can't merge it
<mdeslaur> tedg: ^ ?
<Laney> GunnarHj: any problem with uploading a new version of the default wallpaper?
<Laney> xnox: want to check it?
<xnox> Laney: yo, where is it? same bug report?
<Laney> ya
<GunnarHj> Laney: No. We haven't changed the screenshots in the desktop guide yet, so just go ahead.
<Laney> ty
<xnox> damn
<xnox> i got a ticket for Election Debates with Pink News, Evan Davis and all major parties and my question got selected.
<xnox> but i can't go - as I have a meeting and a volleyball match =(
<xnox>  /o\
<Laney> miss them!
<tjaalton> does lightdm do any sort of scaling on the greeter?
<tjaalton> on vivid
<tjaalton> I've got a system with a highres panel which starts with the native resolution but the display goes blank for a second and comes back with a lower looking res, or scaled. X log doesn't show resolution changing
<xnox> Laney: i approve, both pngs look good with little artifacts and better symmetry.
<xnox> Laney: the greeter logo doesn't align, but i ponder if the greeter is at fault here, rather than the wallpaper.
<seb128> tjaalton, since yesterday u-s-d sets the scale factor on hidpi systems yes
<Laney> xnox: ok, thx
<Laney> the logo doesn't look equally spaced between rows to me
<Laney> probably because it is heavier at the bottom
<Laney> (independent of background image)
<tjaalton> seb128: ok..
<seb128> tjaalton, is that looking wrong.
<tjaalton> well it should happen earlier, it looks a bit ugly now
<tjaalton> the greeter starts first with the native resolution
<seb128> out of the transition
<tjaalton> unscaled
<seb128> does the result looks fine?
<tjaalton> result is ok-ish to me
<seb128> ok-ish only?
<tjaalton> haven't compared to another one with same dimensions but 1080p
<tjaalton> can't keep them both powered on :)
<xnox> Laney: i do think it might be a greeter problem. Cause we overlay the grid pattern at an offset from the screen edges, But we should still, imho find the centre and do calculations from there
<xnox> to the edges, sans padding.
 * xnox will play with vala later.
<tedg> mdeslaur, Oh, I put it in a silo, but I just realized I forgot about it....
<tedg> Silos need push notifications and to be a little more annoying âº
<mdeslaur> tedg: ah, thanks!
<qengho> willcooke: where are red and blue swapped in Cr on N7? Images? Text? Backgrounds? All? I can imagine something specific to Cr for the fractional pixels in drawing text.
<willcooke> qengho, hey!  Just checking, I think it's everything in Cr
<willcooke> qengho, text is, images are too
<willcooke> mlankhorst said he thought it was likely an Xmir thing
<mlankhorst> definitely :P
<mlankhorst> are you running with a compositor or without?
<willcooke> without I think
<qengho> mlankhorst: Wrong visual-class or something? I'll peek in the X layer details so I can answer questions you might have.
<mlankhorst> qengho: probably just xmir-dri2.c bugging, does it show when you run Xmir with -egl too?
 * willcooke tries
<willcooke> mlankhorst, same
<mlankhorst> interesting, I thought it would have been a bug related to dri2..
<mlankhorst> willcooke: what's the smallest testcase?
<mlankhorst> eg do i need icewm or anything?
<willcooke> mlankhorst, don't need icewm in order to see the issue, so I'd say not.
<willcooke> smallest testcase would be, install it, run it, witness the rainbow
<willcooke> (but icewm might make things a bit easier for you, if you've got a mouse)
<mlankhorst> ok I'll take a look :P
<willcooke> thanks mlankhorst
<willcooke> Cr is surprisingly fast on this N7 btw qengho
<qengho> I compiled-in support for the GOFAST register.
<qengho> Ha ha
<qengho> I'm not surprised, willcooke. The N7 is pretty good, aside from the terrible "disk".
<willcooke> :D
<seb128> bah
<seb128> Laney, thanks for the theme landing, there was another approved branch from larsu fixing issues with the new gtk, would have been nice to land it with it, but I guess for next landing now...
<tjaalton> seb128: is there a way to disable scaling the greeter? sometimes it seems to take a long time to get the greeter up, and I don't want to blame the i915 driver for nothing
<seb128> tjaalton, no
<tjaalton> ok
<seb128> tjaalton, move the u-s-d xsettings plugin away
<tjaalton> indicator menus are misplaced
<seb128> tjaalton, the change was https://code.launchpad.net/~seb128/unity-settings-daemon/non-unity-sessions-need-scaling/+merge/250153
<seb128> we might want to exclude the greeter
<seb128> the main goal was to get ubiquity/oem-setup scaling
<tjaalton> ok thanks, I'll try that
<seb128> tjaalton, can you open an unity-greeter bug about the menu thing?
<tjaalton> sure
<seb128> thanks
<tjaalton> bug 1434094
<ubot5> bug 1434094 in unity-greeter (Ubuntu) "indicator menus are misplaced when the display scaler is used" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1434094
<tjaalton> I had the old package cached, can try that on the other machine
<seb128> tjaalton, thanks, I'm going to try on my non-hdpi laptop in a bit by forcing the value from u-s-d
<tjaalton> ok it's not the scaler that's confusing my skl system but loading the background
<tjaalton> or whatever the greeter does
<tjaalton> oh well, bisect it is then
<desrt> Trevinho is going insane
<desrt> STOP MAKING MY PHONE BEEP
<Trevinho> desrt: yeah... let's go back to IRC:.... way better :D
<Trevinho> desrt: mute it :P
<Trevinho> desrt: it's your baby...
 * didrocks is happy to have mute is a while ago
<Trevinho> desrt: your going to hate it... :D
<Trevinho> desrt: but.... in few days it will calm down again
<desrt> Trevinho: my baby is all grown up
<desrt> Trevinho: ya.. no doubt
<desrt> this happened in brussels as well :)
<Trevinho> desrt: someone had to do this dirty job at some point
<desrt> i'm sort of glad there is a hard limit at 200 :p
<Trevinho> lol
<mlankhorst> updating my xmir setup, lightdm fails to log in probably because i haven't updated since systemd switch :P
<davmor2> seb128: quick question that you might be able to help with, On vivid desktop where are audio cd's mounted there is nothing in media, but if I plug in a usb device that shows in media
<seb128> davmor2, audio cds are not data, they are not really mounted in the fs meaning, what would you want to see in /media exactly?
<davmor2> seb128: I just expected to see  a folder for it in media :)
<seb128> davmor2, yeah ... but no ;-)
<seb128> NOTABUG
<seb128> we could create a folder but it would be empty since there is no file on the disk
<davmor2> seb128: I didn't think it was a bug I just figured it lived somewhere else for audio cd's :) but now it appears they don't mount as such,   learn something new everyday :)
<seb128> oh ok
<seb128> well, it's a gvfs mount on the desktop
<seb128> it's a bit like if you mount a smb share
<davmor2> seb128: ah okay thanks
<seb128> those don't have entries in the local fs
<davmor2> seb128: that makes more sense now  ta :)
<seb128> yw!
<mlankhorst> willcooke: it shows the correct colors here?
<willcooke> ?!?!
<willcooke> I'll risk an upgrade and see if that helps
<mlankhorst> xserver-xorg-core and xmir in archive are newer, need to downgrade afterwards if you do
<mlankhorst> apt-get install xserver-xorg-core=2:1.17.1-0ubuntu2+sa8 xserver-xorg-core-dbg=2:1.17.1-0ubuntu2+sa8 xserver-xorg-xmir=2:1.17.1-0ubuntu2+sa8
<mlankhorst> something like that
<willcooke> thx
<willcooke> darn - ran out of space upgrading.
<mlankhorst> :/
<mlankhorst> I don't see it happening on the desktop, could you give the spam Xmir gives on startup?
<willcooke> oops - device rebooted -> brick
<willcooke> I'll have to reflash
<willcooke> \o/
<mlankhorst> oke, bbiab then :P
<willcooke> :D
<mlankhorst> can't wait to test if I fixed my little tegra or not
<mlankhorst> tested all day on radeon + intel, almost the same thing :p
<mlankhorst> just different hw
<mlankhorst> bb
<Laney> didrocks: https://bugzilla.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=85572btw
<ubot5> Freedesktop bug 85572 in core "Call /bin/dbus-uuidgen in systemd unit file" [Enhancement,Needinfo]
<Laney> with a space
<Laney> wow
<Laney> clever bot
 * qengho afk. transit cafe->home.
<Laney> attente_: I just tried this branch https://code.launchpad.net/~attente/ubuntu-themes/1285783/+merge/227768 and it doesn't seem to fix gnome-tweak-tool for me
<Laney> has it bitrotted?
<attente_> Laney: i guess so, but gnome-tweak-tool is working for me on my machine
<attente_> Laney: gnome-tweak-tool is transparent for you without it?
<Laney> ya if I change tabs it goes transparent
<willcooke> mlankhorst, reflashed, getting segfaults when running xmir, I guess that means I installed the wrong versions of xmir etc?
<attente_> Laney: weird. it's not doing that for me
<Laney> erm!
<Laney> someone else try plz
<attente_> Laney: oh. no overlay-scrollbars here is why....
<Laney> tsk tsk
<attente_> ok... still working even with o-s...
<Laney> ...
<Laney> larsu: confirm/deny this? :)
<attente_> Laney: ok, gotta downgrade my gtk. it's at 3.15.5~20150206.r1+git0b06b1e-0ubuntu1
<Laney> haha
<Laney> would be a bit strange if that got randomly fixed though?
<attente_> Laney: strange indeed. downgrading broke it :(
<attente_> time for some bisection
<Laney> wait
<Laney> attente_: we don't have your patch ...
<attente_> Laney: the one that sets the background on gtkstack?
<Laney> or did they rework this upstream?
<attente_> i thought it went upstream
<Laney> ah wait, Company changed it
<Laney> yeah we have this
<attente_> it might be that Company's change broke it again for us
<Laney> you said it works in 3.15
<Laney> unless there was some followup
<attente_> yeah, it works with 3.15
<Laney> so probably not this change
<Laney> ho hum
<attente_> ok, i'll bisect it to find what happened
<Laney> thanks
<Laney> no big rush if you're doing other things
<willcooke> mlankhorst, ignore my last comment about segfault. Seems I've installed a version based on V.  Fixing....
<willcooke> Laney, looks like we'll be clouded out for the eclipse tomorrow morning
<larsu> Laney: I can neither confirm nor deny this
<attente_> larsu: it's ok. it's confirmed, looking into it now
<Laney> willcooke: some chance of breaks in the cloud mid-morning so some know it all on Facebook is saying
<Laney> visibility is pretty shite out there currently
<Laney> #smog
<willcooke> same here
<willcooke> I wonder if Easyjet fly from Luton the the Faroe Islands
<Laney> just fly anywhere
<Laney> as long as you're in the air at the right time
<Laney> :D
<willcooke> and going roughly north
<Laney> anywhere north ish I guess
<willcooke> Edinburgh here I come...
<didrocks> Laney: yeah, so can't go upstream
<didrocks> Laney: I guess that's fine, we'll handle the transition and remove the distro-patch once we are ok
<Laney> Maybe we should man up and fix this instead
<Laney> i.e. not patch
<larsu> Laney: 'man up'. srlsy?
<didrocks> Laney: patches welcome :)
<Laney> sigh
<didrocks> I think greeping through the archive
<didrocks> but TBH enoughtodo for now
<Laney> I have been providing patches.
<didrocks> for apps?
<didrocks> I mean: we need to grep the whole archive source
<didrocks> for the file
<didrocks> and then fix and send upstream for every app to use /etc/machine-id if the dbus-id isn't present
<Laney> sounds good
<didrocks> yeah, just for now, I'm happy that we have a fix, and then, I agree the longer term solution would be to fix the apps
<didrocks> let's see if we can get a grep of the archive tomorrow to see if it's a disaster or not
<didrocks> at least, we have an intermediate solution
<happyaron> attente_: I see systemd --user is launched, is systemd user session being used now? if so we might want to write a .service file instead
<attente_> happyaron: seb128 said we're still using upstart in the user session iirc
<didrocks> happyaron: clearly not ready for wider consumption yet
<happyaron> ok
 * didrocks waves good evening
<Laney> bye didrocks!
<didrocks> see you tomorrow Laney :)
 * willcooke -> EOD o/
<thumper> is there any way to clear the OSD notification buffer?
<thumper> thunderbird went crazy and added a bunch
<thumper> I closed thunderbird but the popups are still showing...
<robert_ancell> seb128, how are you with rebuilding ubuntu-meta? I've changed the ubuntu.vivid seed to use the new Indic font packages but ./update doesn't change anything in ubuntu-meta. Never had any trouble with it before so not sure why it's not working
<larsu> thumper: kill notify-osd. it'll get restarted next time you receive a notification
<thumper> cheers
<seb128> robert_ancell, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SeedManagement
<robert_ancell> seb128, yeah, I've read that. Not sure what I'm missing...
<seb128> " run the update script in the appropriate source package and upload it "
<seb128> did you try that?
<robert_ancell> seb128, yes, and that doesn't update it for some reason
<seb128> get the current source, it should have a script
<seb128> k, dunno then, I didn't try for ages
<seb128> you might have more luck on #ubuntu-devel
<robert_ancell> Yeah, it always just used to work magically for me.
<robert_ancell> k
#ubuntu-desktop 2015-03-20
<attente_> Laney: 4455266c5b23be8173b9c93a4cb576f768fb732d fixes gnome-tweak-tool, but i need to figure out if there's some smaller chunk of the diff that we could backport
<mitya57> darkxst: re gnome-session: can we use two upstream patches (from gnome #745707) instead of yours?
<ubot5> Gnome bug 745707 in gnome-session "gdm fails to start if gnome-session-wayland is not installed" [Normal,Resolved: fixed] http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=745707
<darkxst> mitya57, no, we don't want to display the fail whale at all on Ubuntu
<mitya57> ok
<darkxst> mitya57, I wouldnt mind displaying it on ubuntu GNOME, since it warns users when their extensions are getting disabled
<mitya57> darkxst: good idea, but probably too late for this cycle
<mitya57> darkxst: uploaded
<didrocks> good morning
<mitya57> darkxst: please do something with lp: #1236749 yourself, it doesn't have an ubuntu/gnome-session task, so won't be closed automatically
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1236749 in upstart (Ubuntu) "Gnome shell extensions disabled at every startup" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1236749
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<seb128> larsu, did you see the ping from robert on https://code.launchpad.net/~albertsmuktupavels/unity-greeter/lp1423542/+merge/250303 ?
<seb128> larsu, it goes with https://code.launchpad.net/~albertsmuktupavels/ubuntu-themes/lp1423542/+merge/250302
<seb128> to fix https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity-greeter/+bug/1423542
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1423542 in unity-greeter (Ubuntu) "regresion: buttons styled differently" [Undecided,New]
<larsu> seb128: I did not, thanks
<seb128> larsu, yw!
<seb128> thanks for reviewing ;-)
<larsu> hm, I guess I can't test  that in --test-mode?
<seb128> bah, user switching is unstable on my laptop on vivid
<seb128> got stuck into an empty console with a blinking cursor on top left
<seb128> can't switch back to anywhere
<seb128> had to reboot
<larsu> :(
<seb128> larsu, if you made extra comments after my "thanks!" I didn't see those
<didrocks> 08:31:07     larsu | hm, I guess I can't test  that in --test-mode?
<seb128> oh, no, you can't
<seb128> hum
<seb128> that being?
<larsu> annoying, why not?
<seb128> the selector, maybe not
<larsu> it's just about the session switcher button., no?
<seb128> not sure, good question
<seb128> right, sorry I was getting confused because I was testing https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity-greeter/+bug/1434094
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1434094 in unity-greeter (Ubuntu) "indicator menus are misplaced when the display scaler is used" [High,Confirmed]
<seb128> I get they are off by the scaling factor
<seb128> which you can't test in test-mode as well, no indicator there
<tjaalton> why doesn't terminals started from alt-f2 popup have all environment variables set up, like GPG_AGENT_INFO?
<seb128> larsu, well, if your user switching is reliable you don't need to close your session to test, just pick another user from indicator-session
<tjaalton> this broke after 14.04 or maybe .10
<seb128> tjaalton, try asking Trevinho or bregma maybe
<tjaalton> perhaps due to gnome-keyring owning the gpg stuff now
<larsu> seb128: right, but now I need to build the package and install it
<tjaalton> seb128: ok
<seb128> well if you start things from the dash they get the proper env
 * larsu hates that
<seb128> larsu, oh, right
<seb128> larsu, ln -s /usr/sbin/unity-greeter... :p
<tjaalton> seb128: yes
<larsu> seb128: ts ts ts
<seb128> tjaalton, so it's not a g-k issue, it's just this part of the dash not setting the env correctly it seems
<seb128> larsu, :-)
<darkxst> mitya57, thanks, just duped it on the other bug
<didrocks> well, it was working before, so something broke with the new scope architecture I guess
<larsu> seb128: oh, of course it works. I just didn't compile with --prefix=/usr
<seb128> larsu, oh ok, that's good to know
<seb128> larsu, indicators don't though right?
<larsu> no sessions in /usr/local/share...
<tjaalton> I'll file a bug on unity first
<seb128> didrocks, did that change on u7?
<didrocks> seb128: the scope architecture/activation? yeah, I guess it was either for .10 or .04
<didrocks> activation through scope loader
<seb128> but yeah I can confirm that the envs are quite different
<seb128> -SESSION=ubuntu
<seb128> -SSH_AUTH_SOCK=/run/user/1000/keyring/ssh
<seb128> -JOB=dbus
<seb128> +JOB=xsession-init
<tjaalton> what's alt-f2 thing called?
<seb128> - is dash
<seb128> + is alt-f2
<seb128> I diff a diff of strings /proc/$(pidof gedit)/environ
<seb128> -GIO_LAUNCHED_DESKTOP_FILE=/usr/share/applications/gedit.desktop
<didrocks> tjaalton: it's unity-lens-applications package
<seb128> oh
<seb128> tjaalton, didrocks, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity-lens-applications/+bug/1433013
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1433013 in upstart (Ubuntu Vivid) "Super -> exec vs Alt-F2 -> exec have different environment" [Undecided,New]
<tjaalton> ah nice
<didrocks> yeah, I discussed it some time ago with xnox, didn't know he opened a bug
<tjaalton> nice, sub'd
<willcooke> morning desktoppers
<larsu> morning willcooke!
<willcooke> o/
<seb128> hey willcooke
<didrocks> morning willcooke
<happyaron> morning willcooke
<willcooke> Laney, are you going to the release sprint in that London?  (20 April -> 24 April)
 * willcooke -> school run
<alf_> Hi all! This morning I found my .bash_history to be 0 bytes, any ideas what could have happened? (I am on (almost) latest vivid)
<seb128> alf_, run out of free disk?
<alf_> seb128: Hi! I have lot's of disk space, also no signs of disk error. It's suspicious that this happened a few days after the systemd update (although I have no proof that that's the issue).
<seb128> alf_, that would seem weird to me, in any case that's more a #ubuntu-devel topic, bash is not very desktopish ;-)
<alf_> seb128: indeed :)
<alf_> seb128: oops, I actually thought this was ubuntu-devel, sorry!
<willcooke> Solar eclipse probably.
<seb128> not in the u.k I guess, you need to be able to usually see the sun to notice the eclipse :p
<willcooke> Cosmic rays then?
<tjaalton> yeah cloudy here atm :/
<Laney> hello eclipse fans
<Laney> willcooke: not that I know of, that's some select group
<willcooke> Laney, ack
<willcooke> Laney, clouded out?
 * willcooke is watching the eclipse on iPlayer 
<Laney> no
<Laney> it is clear
<willcooke> swine!!!
<ogra_> tjaalton, no sun to dissolve the coulds :)
<Laney> i had a couple of cheeky naked eye looks
<Laney> the sun is surprisingly bright
<Laney> ...
<willcooke> Laney, you crazy.
<Laney> but it's way better than a shitty pinhole camera
<willcooke> :D
<willcooke> I'm totally going to look if there's a gap in the clouds
<Laney> \o/
<Laney> about 30 mins until the max
<seb128> Laney, don't look directly at the sun man!
<seb128> that thing is powerful ;-)
<Laney> mainly I'm amazed that it is there to be seen
<Laney> it's been a few months
<seb128> haha
<tjaalton> ogra_: actually it's been bright and sunny the past week or two, and now it changed just in time for the eclipse..
<seb128> you are not doing the best job at selling the u.k there ;-)
<Laney> someone on me twitter is taking pix of it
<Laney> https://twitter.com/NCCLols
<willcooke> BBC One coverage is pretty good
<ogra_> tjaalton, same here
<seb128> it's Laney
<ogra_> i think it is just that the sun cant dissolve the morning fog
<seb128> Laney, ok, enough playing, give us our sun back!
<ogra_> ah, right, he took the hole in the coulds with him
<Laney> our turn for a bit
<Laney> you share
<seb128> :-(
<didrocks> seb128: they stole it from us as well!
 * didrocks wonders how many people bought glasses for nothing
<Laney> wow
<Laney> you can see it in the south of france even?
<didrocks> Laney: we were supposed to see it, but you send your clouds here
<Laney> :D
<Laney> http://c.tadst.com/gfx/eclipses/20150320/path-1920.png
<ogra_> you want to distract us from the cloud issues, right ?
<ogra_> showing pretty pictures of what we cant see and such :)
<xnox> didrocks: tjaalton seb128: i believe the right solution there is for upstart's setenv dbus call, to do dbus call to org.freedesktop.DBus to UpdateActivationEnvironment.
<willcooke> Woot.  Tiny gap in the clouds opened up enough for me to see it
<seb128> grr, my desktop crashed when debugging click issues and it doesn't boot anymore
<Laney> O_O
<willcooke> seb128, https://github.com/ubuntu-snappy/rfc/blob/master/rfc-oem.md
<willcooke> seb128, fyi ^
<Laney> software problem?
<seb128> Laney, don't really know
<seb128> systemd doesn't get to the greeter
<seb128> upstart boots, I can log to my session or a command line but oom kicks in like 10 seconds after that
<seb128> and takes everything down
<seb128> recovery mode asks me for a root password which I don't have
<Laney> well that at least sounds like a bug
<Laney> init=/bin/bash to the rescue
<seb128> bah, of course it was my own stupidity
<seb128> Laney, thanks
<seb128> note for self and others, don't make "click" a shell script calling it itself, that's not good :p
<seb128> I replaced click by a wrapper supposed to call click.real which was the real click renamed
<seb128> but I forgot the .real...
<Laney> HAHA
<Laney> and that's called on startup
<seb128> yes
<Laney> well at least it wasn't hardware failure
<seb128> it's a bit suboptimal that a "side service" can take your greeter and vts down by oom like that though
<seb128> I though oom ranking would let me a command line as well to debug
<Laney> yeah welcome to the linux oom killer :(
<Laney> you should file that rescue mode bug...
<Laney> not sure what handles that
<seb128> can anyone confirm that?
<seb128> going to try on my other machine in a bit
<seb128> in case I do have a root password that I set without remembering on my machine
<Laney> look in /etc/shadow to confirm
<seb128> yeah, seems like I don't have one set
<seb128> I'm going to file that after lunch, but need to go now for some erands and food
<Laney> if it's root:!:... then that means password locked
<seb128> bbl
<Laney> hf!
<seb128> thanks!
<Laney> hmm
<Laney> who wants to confirm/deny something?
<mlankhorst> I deny all of it
<Laney> set laucher icon size to 64, search for evolution in dash, drag to launcher to make a favourite
<Laney> for me the nice icon is turned into a scaled up shit one
<Laney> mlankhorst: weren't you supposed to be leaving? :P
<Laney> NO TROLLING
<mlankhorst> give it a week
<mlankhorst> for now I'm just finding out in horror how unoptimized dri3 is... :P
<mlankhorst> unless i'm wrong it was creating a linear buffer in system memory for nouveau to pass to xorg..
<mlankhorst> I'm confident about the system memory part, less sure about linear
<darkxst> mitya57, did you upload the sru's as well for g-s bug?
<willcooke> hey mlankhorst - so silo0 for MWC has had to take a back seat for more important work, so its not working right now.  Hopefully they can fix it in the next week or so.  From the Xmir side, what needs to be done so that we don't have to install a special version?  Does it just need a revision bump or something?
<mlankhorst> willcooke: yeah
<mlankhorst> again :P
<Laney> larsu: can you confirm ^?
<Laney> it's using the svg from humanity so I'm not sure why it is not being scaled properly
<Laney> not that I know loads about icon themes
<larsu> Laney: is this about the evolution icon?
<Laney> ya
<larsu> on hidpi?
<Laney> no
<Laney> just increase the launcher icon size
 * larsu installs evolution
<Laney> I wonder why I can't get software-center to give me the 'technical items' banner on my desktop
 * Laney sees a theming error there
<larsu> Laney: the icon is only in 16, 24, and 48
<larsu> hm, 48 is set to Type=Scalable though
<larsu> so this should work
<larsu> where does unity get those from?
<larsu> gtk?
<Laney> don't know
<Laney> maybe we should ask the unity team
<larsu> Trevinho!
<Laney> oh wait
<Laney> it does show it, but the bug meant that I couldn't see it on top of my black terminal
<Laney> \o/
<larsu> lol
<Laney> how do you theme this custom widget?
<larsu> woah, it's got a weird class name
<larsu> ah, python I guess
<Laney> ya
<Laney> override that (how?) and theme that?
 * larsu wonders if gtk's css parser can even handle that
<Laney> oh neat
<Laney> you can set __gtype_name__ on the class
<larsu> :)
<larsu> that was easy
<larsu> set a css class though, that's even better ;)
<Laney> is it?
<Laney> if you say so :P
<larsu> we try to minimize widget names in css
<larsu> fugliness
<Laney> .action-bar?
<Laney> the progress bar when you install or remove something has buggy theming too
<larsu> ja, action-bar sounds good
<Laney> that's bug #1419553
<ubot5> bug 1419553 in software-center (Ubuntu) "download thermometer bar does not show fully" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1419553
<Laney> larsu: which file should I put a css rule in?
<larsu> apps/software-center.css
<Laney> k
<larsu> if that doesn't exist, create it and include it in gtk-main.css
<Laney> think the other fix is beyond me
<larsu> ok, i can have a look late
<larsu> r
<Laney> dear scour
<Laney> please to hurry up
<didrocks> Laney: heh, I share this feeling regularly :p
<seb128> I sometime replace it with /bin/true to build :-)
<Laney> in my chroots I turn off the png stuff
<Laney> this is something the theme has enabled in d/rules
<didrocks> cheating!
<Laney> /etc/pkgbinarymangler/stripfiles.conf "enable: false"
<Laney> you know it makes sense!
<seb128> bah, click's python code is not utf-8 friendly :-/
 * seb128 hates python and its unicode errors
<didrocks> it's not python3? at least, it shouldn't let you run at all
<seb128> it's python3
<seb128> it run fine, until it hits things like
<seb128>   File "/usr/lib/python3/dist-packages/magic.py", line 128, in file
<seb128>     return _file(self._magic_t, filename.encode('utf-8'))
<seb128> UnicodeEncodeError: 'utf-8' codec can't encode character '\udcc3' in position 60: surrogates not allowed
<didrocks> do you know on why filename it errors out?
<seb128> yes, names with Ã© and Ã¨
<didrocks> which*
<seb128> coming from a os.walk("<DIR>")
<didrocks> yeah, classical issue
<didrocks> (from the surrogates)
<seb128> didrocks, yeah, basically http://stackoverflow.com/questions/27366479/python-3-os-walk-file-paths-unicodeencodeerror-utf-8-codec-cant-encode-s
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, I'm always ending up into that exact stackoverflow page everytime I get it :)
<seb128> I'm still unsure what the correct fix is
<seb128> decode with 'surrogateescape'?
<didrocks> seb128: most of time, I prefer to use in os.walk a byte string
<seb128> I was pondering that yeah
<didrocks> then, I'm getting byte strings instead of unicode
<didrocks> and don't loose the info
<didrocks> lose*
<seb128> didrocks, thanks
<didrocks> yw! tell me if you need any help on this, I've spent wayyyyy to much time on unicode and python to have that not capitalized :)
<seb128> didrocks, well, if you want to fix click feel free ;-)
<seb128> but since I've a setup which hits the bug it's probably easier for me to do it
<seb128> let's see how well using byte works
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, I meant, really if you are blocked :)
<seb128> didrocks, if the os.walk() argument is a variable, you would use "bytes(variable, 'utf-8')?
<didrocks> seb128: the usual way is directly variable.encode('utf-8')
<didrocks> (this returns bytes)
<didrocks> if variable isn't bytes but strings of course
<seb128> didrocks, thanks
<didrocks> yw!
<willcooke> mlankhorst, I've apt-get install xmir on the N7 - but the executable isn't there.  Is this vivid thing, like do we need to add V as a target?
<qengho> It's probably rolled into systemd, ha ha ha, ow.
<willcooke> :D
<xnox> qengho: the other die i was shocked that systemd does not have "kill" and "killall" implementations
<willcooke> How's Evolution mail client looking these days?  Anyone use it here?
 * didrocks tries to dogfood as much as possible our default user experience
<didrocks> so, didn't touch evolution since 2011 :)
<willcooke> Is Geary the new hotness in Gtk land?
<didrocks> larsu: tried it IIRC ^
<larsu> didrocks: I installed it for the first time in ages to test its icon...
<larsu> oh, wait. Geary.
<larsu> ya, it's ok
<seb128> oh, geary
<larsu> better than evolution ui-wise, but much worse in being able to talk to actual mail servers
<larsu> which, from what I hear, is an important feature for some
<seb128> it's another app where you can see through apparently :/
<seb128> just tried
<larsu> (unless you use gmail, it's supposedly great at that)
<seb128> bah, I give up on trying to fix click, I'm just going to rename my files, that's annoying
<ChrisTownsend> willcooke: If you haven't figured it out yet, the version of xorg-server in the Vivid archive is newer than what is in mlankhorst's PPA.
<ChrisTownsend> willcooke: I really wish we could have some recipe set up to automatically keep an Xmir PPA up to date.
<willcooke> ChrisTownsend, yeah - we will need to move the xmir code back in to LP because it won't import from Github properly.  I'll ask robert_ancell to take a look (unless mlankhorst you can do that in the next week?)
<ChrisTownsend> willcooke: That would be excellent.  Thanks!
<didrocks> oh, you have some import issues from github?
<willcooke> didrocks, yeah, it's something to do with an SSL certificate, or signed code, or something
<didrocks> interesting, maybe worth bringing this to the LP team?
<willcooke> I think mlankhorst already did
<didrocks> ok, great :)
<attente_> Laney: it seems like the only reason the bug is fixed upstream is because it breaks o-s entirely
<attente_> the gnome-tweak-tool bug
<Laney> attente_: oh right, the new scrollbar stuff I guess
<Laney> how come your fix stopped working?
<attente_> no idea :(
<willcooke> Solar eclipse
<Laney> stupid sun
<Laney> let's nuke it
<didrocks> I would as well blame tides, but it's linked
<Laney> nuke those too
<willcooke> http://i.imgur.com/91sn32Q.jpg?fb
<didrocks> recurrent reference @home
<willcooke> :D
<didrocks> willcooke: only with the gesture, of course! ;)
<Laney> attente_: it works now if you put it on GtkScrolledWindow or GtkViewport ...
<Laney> is either of those sane?
<attente_> Laney: do you prefer to add it to the gnome-applications.css instead? make it tweak-tool specific?
<attente_> i don't know if the problem is visible in other apps
<Laney> doesn't seem specific to tweak tool though
<Laney> that's not a custom widget
<Laney> ask the theme master...
<attente_> ok. i'll update the mp then
<Laney> thx
<desrt> can someone remind me the url of that awesome page with the gigantic table with the latest upstream versions vs. which versions we have, etc.?
<Laney> http://people.canonical.com/~platform/desktop/versions.html
<desrt> thanks!
<Laney> hello
<desrt> hi :)
<Laney> did anyone check the gnome-terminal wrapper?
<Laney> not sure I want to upload it just before going away...
<Laney> but maybe someone could do that next week...
<Laney> or at least test it so I can do it when I get back
<didrocks> Laney: can you give back the link please?
<Laney> it's in bzr
<Laney> of gnome-terminal
<didrocks> Laney: not sure if we should sponsor it, but at least try
<didrocks> ok, putting a note
<Laney> sure you can
<Laney> it's dragged on for months now
<Laney> if it ruins everything then revert the upload if the fix is not obvious
<didrocks> Laney: ok, let's do that (but not going to upload that on a Friday :p)
<attente_> why do the csd window buttons look so weird on my machine...
<Laney> spacing
<Laney> they're also slightly larger
<attente_> who's the theme master... Â¬_Â¬
<Laney> some german guy
<willcooke> POETS day.  Got some stuff to take care off, so knocking off early.  Happy weekend y'all.  Next week we'll finalise the reviews in real 1:1s.  There will be cake.
<seb128> Laney, are you off next week?
<seb128> brb
<Laney> larsu: is https://code.launchpad.net/~attente/ubuntu-themes/1285783/+merge/227768 good?
<Laney> (changed since it got approved)
<larsu> Laney: wow, that's quite a lot of bgs we'll be setting
<larsu> but if it works, fine by me
<Laney> it's that or GtkViewport
<Laney> for the gnome-tweak-tool case
<Laney> I don't know what's more appropriate
 * Laney wants to add another rule for geary
<Laney> adding this everywhere sucks
 * Laney quite likes geary's UI
 * desrt doesn't like its flakyness with almost anything that's not gmail
 * desrt tried using it with fastmail for a while -- that wasn't so nice
<Laney> I just read some threads, didn't go very deep
<desrt> it seems to have trouble staying in sync with the remote server, even across restarts
<desrt> like its cache gets messed up
<desrt> in my case, i had a couple of messages in a folder (trash?)
<desrt> i deleted them
<desrt> and then put a bunch more in that folder (must have been trash)
<desrt> and when i restarted geary, it showed only two messages (since there were two before)
<desrt> but they were two out of the _new_ messages
<desrt> that's the point where i said "i'm not sure i want this thing to have write access to my email" and uninstalled it
<didrocks> ok, sounds like time for week-end!
<Laney> bye didrocks
<Laney> see you in a week!
<didrocks> enjoy your week-end everyone, enjoy your holidays Laney !
<desrt> didrocks: have a good one :)
<didrocks> thanks, you too ;)
<Laney> if you could fix my shutdown and suspend while i'm gone
<Laney> would be most appreciated
<Laney> ;-)
<didrocks> Laney: ok, I'll trade that with a worse bug then, like no network!
<didrocks> just for youâ¦ with love :)
<didrocks> (don't upgrade on holidays)
<Laney> oh god
<Laney> I already have that
<Laney> that's a mathieu-tl thing
 * Laney makes a (s)hit list
<didrocks> roh
 * didrocks hugs Laney, see you man!
<Laney> bye!
<Laney> may the cheese and wine treat you well
<seb128> Laney, bye
<Laney> was saying bye to didrocks
<seb128> oh
<Laney> hi seb128 :)
<seb128> hey Laney ;-)
<seb128> sorry, went offline to go to work to a caffee for a bit
<Laney> those dutch coffee shops eh
<seb128> lol
<seb128> so you are off next week?
<Laney> yep
<seb128> anything fancy in view? ;-)
<Laney> scotland
<Laney> doing some beginner ski lessons
<seb128> oh, is that only monday?
<Laney> nein, all week
<seb128> k, willcooke screwed the ue holiday calendar thing then
<Laney> hm
<Laney> i have it twice
<seb128> you are marked off for monday only on it
<Laney> once is just monday
<Laney> and the other is the whole week
<seb128> I don't have the other one
<seb128> weird
<Laney> added you to prove it :P
<seb128> "Invitation: Laney - PTO - Lun. 23 Mars 2015 "
<seb128> the one you invinted me to is only monday :p
<Laney> wtf
<Laney> Mon, 23 March â Fri, 27 March
<Laney> Calendar UE Holiday Calendar
<Laney> Created by will.cooke@canonical.com
<Laney> Who Sebastien, Will, Iain
<desrt> Laney: where ya going?
<seb128_> grr, disconnected again, that caffe place is nice but on some days their wifi is not giving ips and the open spot you get from here is not really stable :-/
<ogra_> use tethering on your phone :)
<Laney> desrt: aviemore in the highlands
<desrt> cool
<Laney> i'm excited to go on the highland main line
 * Laney enjoys long train journeys
 * desrt reads story on CBC about how inflation is at 1% year-over-year owing in large part to low gas prices
 * desrt reads comments "statistics canada doesn't know anything!  their models are a scam!  real inflation is 30-50% per year based on this one product i buy!"
<Laney> larsu: if you've got 5 minutes, i'd appreciate review on my theme branches
<Laney> could get a quick upload done before the end of the week
<seb128> back
<seb128> sorry public wifi fail
<seb128> back home now
<seb128> Laney, don't worry much about gcal weirdness, have fun in your week of vac ;-)
<Laney> nod
<Laney> there's 4 branches for ubuntu-themes that I would have uploaded
<Laney> might want to put that on your list for next week
<seb128> Laney, maybe put them in a silo now and I can test/publish on monday?
<seb128> if you have the list
<Laney> could do yeah
<seb128> thanks
<Laney> was waiting for review but that can come later
<seb128> right
<seb128> I can chase the acks before publishing
<desrt> wtf dup3
<Laney> oh also
<flexiondotorg> cyphermox, Are you abaout?
<Laney> software-center needs uploading to make one of the branches work
<Laney> m vo acked the branch
<flexiondotorg> Or about even?
<Laney> but there's a further theme issue that l arsu was going to look at
<Laney> that is all the pending stuff
<seb128> Laney, k
<seb128> I can try to move that forward as well
<Laney> https://launchpad.net/bugs/1419553
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1419553 in software-center (Ubuntu) "download thermometer bar does not show fully" [Undecided,New]
<cyphermox> flexiondotorg: hey
<flexiondotorg> cyphermox, If you have some free time could you review this please? - https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-mate-dev/ubiquity-slideshow-ubuntu/ubuntu-mate-update/+merge/253038
<cyphermox> sure
<flexiondotorg> cyphermox, Many thanks!
<flexiondotorg> cyphermox, If you have the power to build it please do. I'd really like to get this in the next beta so we can complete the QA for it.
<cyphermox> ok
<flexiondotorg> cyphermox, The is an OEM who want this work ;)
<flexiondotorg> Let's try that again. There is an OEM who wants this to work ;)
<Laney> seb128: should https://code.launchpad.net/~albertsmuktupavels/ubuntu-themes/lp1423542/+merge/250302 go in or wait for the greeter branch?
<Laney> it should just be a noop without that as far as I can see
<seb128> Laney, should go in
<Laney> ya I agree
<seb128> I emailed robert_ancell this morning about unity-greeter (that change + the hidpi menu issue)
<seb128> so I'm going to try to get u-g landed next week as well
<Laney> I wish I could "ok google, give me an authenticator code"
<Laney> ideally without having to touch my phone (i.e. when it's locked)
<Laney> ok silo 17 is the one to watch
<Laney> bye!
<rickspencer3> hey, anyone here familiar with getting legacy apps to run in XMir on a Nexus 7?
<rickspencer3> I'm trying to get Chromium to run, but am getting weird errors, though it apparantly worked fine for willcooke
<mlankhorst> <
<mlankhorst> what exactly is the error?
<rickspencer3> hi mlankhorst
<rickspencer3> phablet@ubuntu-phablet:~$ sh chromium.sh
<rickspencer3> (EE)
<rickspencer3> Fatal server error:
<rickspencer3> (EE) Failed to connect to Mir: Failed to send message to server: Broken pipe
<rickspencer3> (EE)
<rickspencer3> IceWM: Can't open display: :4. X must be running and $DISPLAY set.
<rickspencer3> [6163:6163:0320/155615:ERROR:browser_main_loop.cc(216)] Gtk: cannot open display: :4
<rickspencer3> mlankhorst, ^
<mlankhorst> what's in your chromium.sh ?
<rickspencer3> let me pastebin
<rickspencer3> mlankhorst,
<rickspencer3> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/10637190/
<rickspencer3> this is the file that willcooke gave me because he said it worked for him
<mlankhorst> does /usr/share/applications/chromium.desktop exist?
<rickspencer3> yes
<rickspencer3> let me pastebin that
<rickspencer3> mlankhorst, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/10637197/
<mlankhorst> you don't need to set MIR_SOCKET if it's the default
<rickspencer3> mlankhorst, I have no idea how this works, I just used the files as instructed ;)
<rickspencer3> mlankhorst, should I change something?
<mlankhorst> not sure, try with bash instead of sh?
<rickspencer3> really?
<mlankhorst> dno
<mlankhorst> rest looks sane
<rickspencer3> no, same thing
<rickspencer3> exact same error
<mlankhorst> what if you start xmir by hand? Xmir :99 --desktop_file_hint=/usr/share/applications/chromium.desktop
<rickspencer3> rick@rick-dell-11:~$ Xmir :99 --desktop_file_hint=/usr/share/applications/chromium.desktop
<rickspencer3> Xmir: command not found
<rickspencer3> mlankhorst, ^
<rickspencer3> weirdly, libre office works fine
<rickspencer3> mlankhorst, could the difference be because of Gtk?
<mlankhorst> rickspencer3: XMir on your phone, not on desktop :)
<rickspencer3> mlankhorst, right
<rickspencer3> on my tablet, actually, but yeah
<rickspencer3> oops
<rickspencer3> I got kicked out of my session and didn't realize :)
<mlankhorst> hehehheh
<rickspencer3> mlankhorst, exact same error, just faster :)
<rickspencer3> phablet@ubuntu-phablet:~$ Xmir :99 --desktop_file_hint=/usr/share/applications/chromium.desktop
<rickspencer3> (EE)
<rickspencer3> Fatal server error:
<rickspencer3> (EE) Failed to connect to Mir: Failed to send message to server: Broken pipe
<rickspencer3> (EE)
<mlankhorst> ls /usr/share/applications ?
<rickspencer3> mlankhorst,
<rickspencer3> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/10637269/
<rickspencer3> and ... http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/10637197/
<mlankhorst> Xmir :99 --desktop_file_hint=/usr/share/applications/webbrowser-app.desktop ?
<rickspencer3> uh
<rickspencer3> mlankhorst, ok, that sort of ran the web-browser app
<mlankhorst> no it doesn't, it just started Xmir:P
<rickspencer3> with a blck window, but it's the mobile web browser that we made
<mlankhorst> no it's not..
<rickspencer3> oh
<rickspencer3> it sure looked like it
<mlankhorst> now run DISPLAY=:99 chromium-webbrowser
<mlankhorst> with Xmir still running like that
<rickspencer3> so Xmir :99 --desktop_file_hint=/usr/share/applications/webbrowser-app.desktop
<mlankhorst> yes
<mlankhorst> looks like chromium.desktop doesn't taste right to unity for some reason..
<mlankhorst> ls -ahl /usr/share/applications/chromium.desktop ?
<rickspencer3> phablet@ubuntu-phablet:~$ DISPLAY=:99 chromium-webbrowser
<rickspencer3> -bash: chromium-webbrowser: command not found
<mlankhorst> maybe permissions are messed up
<rickspencer3> oh
<rickspencer3> let me check perms
<qengho> "chromium-browser"
<qengho> see that, rickspencer3? Misspelling.
<rickspencer3> mlankhorst, when I made qengho's fix chromium showed up inside the browser app window
<rickspencer3> mlankhorst, in terms of permissions ...
<rickspencer3> -rw-r--r-- 1 root    root     6417 Feb 20 11:05 address-book-app.desktop
<rickspencer3> -rw-rw-rw- 1 phablet phablet   642 Mar 20 15:43 chromium.desktop
<rickspencer3> so, let me try to fix that
<qengho> rickspencer3: $  DISPLAY=:99 chromium-webbrowser --user-data-dir=/tmp/something-not-shared-with-browserapp
<rickspencer3> qengho, so, I think mlankhorst might be right, that I need to change permissions for the desktop file to root
<mlankhorst> and 644 probably
 * qengho boggles.
<rickspencer3> so, it wasn't quite that
<rickspencer3> -rw-r--r-- 1 root root   642 Mar 20 15:43 chromium.desktop
<rickspencer3> seems fixed now
<rickspencer3> but still the same error
<rickspencer3> ok, I made the chromium.sh file exectuable and works now
<rickspencer3> mlankhorst, qengho ^
<qengho> Nice.
 * rickspencer3 shrugs
<mlankhorst> k :)
<rickspencer3> next stop, QtCreator ;)
<rickspencer3> keyboard stopped working :(
<mlankhorst> rickspencer3: what version of mir do you have 1.12 or a more recent snapshot?
<rickspencer3> mlankhorst, I think it's from before mwc
<mlankhorst> oh that's fine, just at some point cursors will start working too when I rebuild Xmir, once that code gets merged. :P
<rickspencer3> any idea why chromium won't take up the whole screen?
<rickspencer3> when I maximize it, it takes about 60% of the screen, leaves the rest black
<mlankhorst>  apt-cache policy xserver-xorg-xmir ?
<rickspencer3-2> hey, rickspencer3 this is you on your tablet
<mlankhorst> I think I hit that black bug before, but on an older version
<rickspencer3> mlankhorst, I think that it has to do with how big the xmir window is when the app launches or something
<rickspencer3> rickspencer3-2 boo
<rickspencer3-2> crazy, I can just run any legacy app this way
<mlankhorst> rickspencer3: it does, but I thought I fixed that
<mlankhorst>  apt-cache policy xserver-xorg-xmir ?
<rickspencer3-2> takes some adjustments to settings to make it work well :)
<mlankhorst> rickspencer3-2: yeah but what version of xmir are you using?
<rickspencer3-2> mlankhorst, sorry, got distracted, hold on
<rickspencer3> mlankhorst,  Installed: 2:1.17.1-0ubuntu2+sa8
<mlankhorst> meh weird, not sure about the 2/3rds bug then
<qengho> rickspencer3: Without maximizing, can you resize Cr window to bigger?
<rickspencer3> qengho, well, I fixed it by futzing with window before it opened
#ubuntu-desktop 2015-03-21
<mitya57> darkxst: No, I didn't. Maybe will do later today.
<darkxst> mitya57, ok, thanks
<mitya57> darkxst: uploaded to utopic and trusty
<mlankhorst> does the unity7 greeter set the display or not?
<mlankhorst> through randr, initially
#ubuntu-desktop 2016-03-21
<hikiko> hello :)
<pitti> Good morning
<pitti> infinity: FWIW, I've always asked for sending locale patches upstream, and many of them should already have Bug: links
<didrocks> good morning pitti
<pitti> bonjour didrocks, Ã§a va ?
<didrocks> pitti: bon week-end, oui, et toi ?
<pitti> didrocks: le week-end Ã©tait magnifique -- Annet et moi Ã©taions Ã  Londres, pour le concert d'Adele
<pitti> et un peu de tourisme :)
<didrocks> ah, d'oÃ¹ le rond point avec les feux rouges :)
<pitti> oui :)
<pitti> comme un arbre de NoÃ«l
<didrocks> hÃ©hÃ©
<Sweet5hark> moin!
<willcooke> morning desktoppers
<Laney> morning!
<willcooke> what up Laney
<davmor2> willcooke: so good news bad news, cyphermox is making progress good news, bad news looks like it is most of the unity graphics stack that takes out the system on upgrade :(
<willcooke> davmor2, yeah I asked hikiko to take a deeper look in to that.
<willcooke> hikiko, did you find anything out yet?
<willcooke> davmor2, I did some rudimentary debugging with Compiz on Friday and it looks like the X server is going away
<willcooke> but needs hikiko to dive in to it in more dept
<willcooke> h
<hikiko> willcooke, you mean the crash during the upgrade?
<willcooke> hikiko, yeah
<hikiko> I couldn't reproduce it could you tell me what you did exactly and in which system?
<willcooke> hrm.  It's very reproducible here. Did you see my email, all the steps are laid out there
<willcooke> Basically:  install 14.04.  upgrade to 16.04.  Crash.
<hikiko> sorry I didn't see this one ok looking at it now
<Laney> hi willcooke, how's it going?
<hikiko> oh I saw that  I have marked the email as important but I totally forgot sorry :/
<willcooke> thanks hikiko, this is a priority for now, even more than e zoom.  Until we know what's going on at least.
<hikiko> ok
<hikiko> willcooke, do you experience this bug in vbox only>
<hikiko> ?
<willcooke> hikiko, no, davmor2 has it on real hardware as well: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-release-upgrader/+bug/1555237
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1555237 in ubuntu-release-upgrader (Ubuntu) "Upgrade from 14.04.4â 16.04 dies midway taking out the session." [Critical,In progress]
<hikiko> mm ok, because here they say that it was a low memory issue: https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?id=183376
<hikiko> (similar bug)
<hikiko> and I was wondering if it's because the vm graphics memory is very low and we use it all during the upgrade
<hikiko> ok I'll look further
<willcooke> ah, interesting
<willcooke> yeah, please do some more investigation
<willcooke> I'll also boost the RAM on my VM
<davmor2> hikiko: my vm has 2Gb of memory that should be enough for an upgrade and the hdd is 20Gb, and hardware wise it is hybrid intel nvidia prime, 8Gb ram and I can't remember how much memory the gfx card has
<hikiko> davmor2 I mean the graphics memory
<hikiko> which is 128 in vbox
<hikiko> oh you said you have 8GB
<hikiko> ok ok I'll look at it, I just wanted to make sure it's not something that simple :) (too good to be true)
<davmor2> hikiko: vm has 64Mb, looking on hardware now
<davmor2> hikiko: 256Mb on hardware
<hikiko> davmor2, you tried the virtualbox too?
<hikiko> I mean
<hikiko> you only tested this in vbox?
<hikiko> or in real hardware too?
<davmor2> hikiko: both and I use kvm not vbox
<ksamak> good day everyone
<hikiko> alright, I am downloading the 14.04
<davmor2> hikiko: I check daily on vm that it is still happening and then once a week on spare hardware to ensure it is still happening there too
<davmor2> hikiko: I can run another test on hardware in a bit if you want and open up and ssh port to to it if that helps
<hikiko> I want to check if: 1- if it's possible that the program that runs during the upgrade has a bug that consumes the memory, 2- if something else tries to make use of the :0 while compiz is running
<hikiko> davmor2, I dont know if that helps I'll set up it here in a few minutes
<hikiko> but thanks :)
<Laney> Trevinho: No Unity upload I see
<Trevinho> Laney: it's in https://requests.ci-train.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/1146 but I noticed a small issue, that I've fixed, but I was waiting andyrock to check it. Then we can go. By today.
<Laney> k
<Laney> hi Trevinho and hikiko
<Trevinho> Hi, Laney, yeah ð
<Laney> wormery just arrived \o/
<pitti> Laney: does that have anything to do with worms?
<Laney> hey pitti!
<pitti> hey Laney, how are you?
<Laney> yeah, food in, compost out
<Laney> via worm digestion
<Laney> pitti: great, thanks!
<Laney> and you?
<Laney> I saw your pictures, looked like a fun weekend
<pitti> Laney: wow; is this available for the other way too?
<pitti> Laney: indeed -- the concert was absolutely amazing
<Laney> pitti: you mean compost -> food?
<pitti> and we managed to visit Greenwich Observatory/Prime Meridian, the aquarium, Camden Town, the Regent canal (I think that one), a walk through Westminster, and some nice cafÃ©s/pubs too
<pitti> Laney: yeah :)
<Laney> that's the circle of life :P
<Laney> oh wow
<Laney> packed weekend
<pitti> Laney: well, we started Friday morning already
<pitti> so Greenwich and the concert was Fri afternoon/evening
<Laney> We visited the Observatory in the summer last year
<Laney> quite a nice park it's in too
<Laney> and there was a market nearby that we visited, bit more crafty than the Borough one
 * Laney blinks
<Laney> someone just retried glib/s390x at literally the same time as me
<Sweet5hark> Laney: race conditions ftw!
<Laney> more impressed that someone else was looking at this :)
<Laney> although...
<Laney> ...has it hung again?
<Laney> ffs
<Laney> works on the autopkgtest machine of course
<GunnarHj> Laney: Saw your comment at bug #1559070. The plan is to wait with uploading ubuntu-docs again until the tranlators are done. Is there a reason to do it before?
<ubot5> bug 1559070 in Yelp "SVG icons not shown / "yelp </path/to/file.page>" fails" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1559070
<Laney> GunnarHj: So that it stops being broken
<Laney> but, up to you
<Laney> GunnarHj: willcooke is preparing some new text/screenshots for the slideshow atm FYI
<Laney> don't think there has been UIFe for that yet
<willcooke> not yet - just got the OK from design
<willcooke> still need to finish doing the screenshots
<willcooke> there is a very small change to the text on one slide
<willcooke> the one about Ubuntu Software Centre
<GunnarHj> Laney: Then I'll wait with u-c.
<Laney> 'k
<davmor2> willcooke: and accompanying screenshot which is still USC right
<willcooke> davmor2, yeah, changing the screenshot, plus a few others
<willcooke> actually, I'll just redo them all
<willcooke> so the wallpaper matches
<GunnarHj> willcooke, Laney: Suppose we should notify the translators via the mailing list when the text string is available in Rosetta. The screen shots is not a problem, since we don't include screenshots from the installer in the docs.
<willcooke> GunnarHj, sure thing - I will email the translation team once I have an MP up
<GunnarHj> willcooke: Great.
 * Sweet5hark never uploaded a libreoffice himself, but just triggered/unblocked the migration from proposed for the first time.
<Laney> THE POWER
<Sweet5hark> Laney: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_BRv9wGf5pk
<Laney> Sweet5hark: I was hoping it would be that
<Laney> hey that band is German
<Laney> who knew?
<Sweet5hark> Laney: most of that embarrassing 1990ies eurodance trash is german ...
<desrt> happy monday
<Laney> DDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDDEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTT
<desrt> what did i do now? :(
<Laney> it was a hello
<desrt> er.. i mean
<desrt> hi laney :)
<Laney> imagine me running towards you
<Laney> for a glomp
<desrt> is a glomp something good?
<desrt> it sounds like it might be painful
<Laney> in a good way
<desrt> okay.  good :)
<desrt> glomp away
<Laney> how's it going?
<desrt> okay
<desrt> chatting security 'bugs' again
<Laney> fun
<desrt> and it makes me wonder
<desrt> why can't we all just be nice to each other?
<desrt> why all of this "security" anyway?
<Laney> not that I was prepping you
<Laney> ...but...
<Laney> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/glib2.0/2.47.92-1/+build/9368499 <- this build keeps hanging
<desrt> i mean... if i put a key on something, isn't it clear that i want you to stay out?  why are we even talking about how to crack the key?
<Laney> on https://git.gnome.org/browse/glib/tree/glib/tests/642026.c this test
<Laney> and I can't make it happen on a test machineeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee whyyyyyyy
<desrt> this case looks pretty simple
<desrt> does x390 have an exotic memory architecture or something?
<Laney> would expect to be able to reproduce it if so
 * Laney checks kernel versions
<desrt> a hang points to a problem with condition variables
<desrt> which could very well be a problem with the kernel's futex implementation on x390
<desrt> our implementation of gcond is pretty straight forward
<Laney> Linux laney 4.4.0-14-generic #30-Ubuntu SMP Tue Mar 15 13:01:11 UTC 2016 s390x s390x s390x GNU/Linux
<desrt> could also be the mutexes of course...
<Laney> this works
<qengho> I think Laney is drunk with springtime.
<Laney> Kernel version: Linux z13-017 4.4.0-10-generic #25-Ubuntu SMP Wed Mar 2 14:56:49 UTC 2016 s390x
<Laney> this does not
<desrt> check if anything changed with futexs in there
<desrt> that would be my first guess
 * Laney wonders how
<desrt> git diff?
<Laney> http://kernel.ubuntu.com/git/?s=idle
<desrt> don't look at me :p
<Laney> I guess http://kernel.ubuntu.com/git/ubuntu/ubuntu-xenial.git/
<Laney> spam has stepped up on my personal account in the last week or so
<Laney> forget hosting this myself
<desrt> i keep getting a string of very similar spam messages that the filter always fails to flag
<desrt> i'm starting to wonder if the fastmail 'mark spam' button does anything at all
<desrt> sender is always Sevgisandali and it's always the same message in turkish
<Laney> yeah, I have dspam and it fails to catch duplicate things that I've already marked quite often
<dobey> willcooke: don't know if you saw, but the change to make click scope depend on packagekit has landed in xenial.
<willcooke> oki, thanks dobey
<willcooke> davmor2, per our conversation on Friday, could you add the tests for codec downloading etc to your list?>
<Laney> desrt: what does status 'reviewed' mean on bgo?
<desrt> typically "i took a look at this but i am defering to someone else's judgement... see details in what i wrote"
<Laney> https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=763617
<desrt> can be used if the person doing the review is not a committer, or if some changes were suggested but not mandated (ie: patch submitters choice about if to do it or not)
<ubot5> Gnome bug 763617 in general "giotypefuncs.c: Sort _get_type functions in the 'C' locale" [Normal,New]
 * Laney gets pinged by reproducible people about this
 * Laney giggles at "reproducible people"
<desrt> Laney: a-c_n
<Laney> ty
<Laney> that rules is indeed hilarious
<Laney> rule
 * Laney rips own brain out
<Laney> shut up about IDS
<andyrock> hey all
 * Sweet5hark serves Laney a cookie and backs up slowly.
<desrt> andyrock: good morning
<Laney> howdy andyrock
<mhall119> Laney: can I forward you an email from an upstream asking for help with their AppStream icon? I'm not entirely sure what they should be doing
<Laney> mhall119: ok
<mhall119> thanks Laney
<Laney> replied
 * Laney lunch
<pitti> Laney: do we still actually need app-install-data?
<pitti> mvo: ^
<pitti> (15 MB deb, 45 MB installed size, so nothing to sneeze at)
<pitti> ATM sessioninstaller depends on it, but I wonder why? I thought sessioninstaller would merely install an already given pacakge name
<mvo> pitti: not on the image for sure, maybe some other tools like the kde software center use it, but even if they do the data is now getting sstale, so lets remove it
<mvo> pitti: it may use it to show fancy icons
<ChrisTownsend> Hey all, I noticed unity-scope-click was removed from my system in this morning's updates for some reason.  When I try ti reinstall it, this is what I get: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/15463069/
<ChrisTownsend> Is there something special with python3-aptdaemon.pkcompat since it is trying to be removed?
<ChrisTownsend> BTW, when unity-scope-click is removed, then there is no App Scope in the Unity 8 desktop.
<willcooke> hi ChrisTownsend
<ChrisTownsend> willcooke: Hey:)
<willcooke> ChrisTownsend, yes - we're trying something to fix installing of Clicks in to the U8 session in 16.04
<willcooke> we're going to drop the python compat and replace with with PK0.8#
<willcooke> and see what breaks in U7
<willcooke> Click needs PK0.8 in order to work
<ChrisTownsend> willcooke: Ok.  I wouldn't think removing the scope that is needed to actually launch apps in Unity 8 desktop is intended though, right?
<willcooke> no, that's a strange one
<willcooke> dobey, FYI ^
<ChrisTownsend> willcooke: I'm not sure as to what actually wanted to remove it as apt was perfectly happy removing it and updating other packages and of course I just just 'Y' willy nilly:)
<dobey> ChrisTownsend: i guess it might have gotten removed if there was a aptdaemon update at the same time
<dobey> but otherwise, no, i can't tell you why it would have been removed. it probably shouldn't have
<dobey> if you don't have the apt-get summary that you pressed 'Y' to, i can't make a more educated guess either really
<ChrisTownsend> dobey: Yeah, it scrolled off unfortunately.  I have /var/log/apt/history.log, but that doesn't really reveal anything.
<dobey> right. history log just shows it getting removed i guess, and not why it got removed
<ChrisTownsend> dobey: But if I try reinstalling unity-scope-click, it wants to remove python3-aptdaemon.pkcompat.
<mikedld|w> hello guys, is Ricardo Sousa present here by any chance?
<mikedld|w> ric_s: ^ maybe it's you? :)
<ric_s> yes mikedld|w
<willcooke> ChrisTownsend, yeah, we can't have PK0.8 && the Py compat layer,  They clash on dbus namespace
<ChrisTownsend> willcooke: Ok, I see the issue.  python3-aptdaemon.pkcompat conflicts with packagekit.  And unity-scope-click depends on packagekit.
<davmor2> and I'm back on a system with a gui
<ChrisTownsend> willcooke: No idea how this would be fixed, but it's not good.
<willcooke> ChrisTownsend, well, we're dropping python3-aptdaemon.pkcompat
<willcooke> (at least, we're trying it out)
<ChrisTownsend> willcooke: Well, that's good.   Was there a recent change here that broke this though?
<willcooke> ChrisTownsend, yeah, we changed it on Friday (IKR)
<willcooke> dropped pkcompat
<willcooke> so we can see if it a) fixes click installs on the U8 session and b) see what horrors emerge in U7
<willcooke> Seb's theory is that not very much will break, and davmor2 is going to be testing that hypothesis this week
<ChrisTownsend> willcooke: Hmm, ok.  I'm just confused about how this chain of conflicts recently showed up in the archive to where unity-scope-click was removed.
<ChrisTownsend> willcooke: I mean, I'm probably one of the few who actually does stuff in the Unity 8 desktop, but it's perplexing nonetheless.
<ChrisTownsend> willcooke: And if I reinstall unity-scope-click and it removes python3-aptdaemon.pkcompat, that will be OK?
<willcooke> ChrisTownsend, it /should/ be OK.  But I'd like to know if it isnt.  Not sure why u-s-click got removed.  But we can look in to that as soon as Seb is back.
<willcooke> And yeah, it will only effect u8 session users
<ChrisTownsend> willcooke: Ok, thanks
<willcooke> ChrisTownsend, I think that particular issue will "only" affect people who already have u8 session installed on a 16.04 machine and upgrade.
<willcooke> but we'll take a look
<ChrisTownsend> willcooke: Ok.  I took the plunge to see what happens.  The Apps scope is back and I'll keep an eye out for other things.  But I admit, it's just a test machine, so some things may never be observed that a regular user might see.
<flexiondotorg> Trevinho, Not sure if this is in the queue? https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-mate-dev/compiz/ubuntu-mate-wallpaper-common/+merge/288777
<Trevinho> flexiondotorg: mh, oh... I forgot to copy that -_-
<Trevinho> flexiondotorg: next landing will be there.
<flexiondotorg> Trevinho, Thanks :-)
<Trevinho> flexiondotorg: thank you
<mhall119> aney: is everything on https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/kdocker/+bug/1558713 done the way you wanted?
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1558713 in kdocker (Ubuntu) "AppStream icon for kdocker.desktop" [Undecided,New]
<Laney> will look soon
<Laney> fixing upstream -> win
<Laney> pitti: laney@nightingale> for r in trusty xenial; do echo -n "${r}: "; GET http://ddebs.ubuntu.com/dists/${r}/main/binary-amd64/Packages | grep-dctrl -c .; done                                           ~
<Laney> trusty: 121
<Laney> xenial: 3021
<Laney> something borked with ddebs/trusty?
<pitti> Laney: urgh, obviously :/
<Laney> was looking for compiz ones
<Laney> they seem to be gone from the pool too
<Laney> seems like a bad sign
<ksamak> hikiko: hey
<ksamak> hikiko: i'm trying to modify some behavior of ezoom in compiz.
<ksamak> i'd like to have the mouse always centered inside the zoomed area
<ksamak> i can't seem to find the right maths in the code.
<ksamak> hikiko: would you have any idea about that?
<willcooke> Laney, desktoppers:  ignore the buttons on the righthand side for now, but thoughts on:  http://imgur.com/JJrJ8b3
<Trevinho> willcooke: you hacked on what precisely? tabs?
<willcooke> yeah, tabs have different colour depending on current tab or not, plus I had to faff around with the borders between the tabs because the old one which was a light colour gradient clashed with the different colour tabs and gave a 1px white border between the tabs and the menu bar
<pitti> Laney: it looks like trusty now only has the packages which have the same version in xenial
<pitti> how on earth did that happen
<Trevinho> willcooke: for terminal only, maybe it would be nice to have the same idea of firefox: so selected tab is white, others are matching the toolbar... what you think?
<willcooke> I'll start with gtk3 notebook
<willcooke> lemme get that done first :)
<Trevinho> :)
<willcooke> so gedit will have something similar (not identical because GNOME Terminal seems to do things a bit differently)
<willcooke> actually, it should be identical
<willcooke> what do you think about the thickness of the border between tabs?
<willcooke> Look ok to you:
<willcooke> ?
<Trevinho> ok as for the notebook itself, maybe the unselected color is still to be tuned imho... I can't explain how :-D, but that reminds me too much the windows95 gray :P
<Trevinho> I think that's ok.
<willcooke> oki, cool.  I'll tweak the colours and get design to take a look
<willcooke> oh I should fix those buttons on the right first
<willcooke> I hate those buttons
<willcooke> In other design related news..... http://imgur.com/JWjBRBl
<Trevinho> Mh,
<davidcalle> willcooke: that's something
<Laney> hmm
<Laney> I have no eye for this stuff
<Laney> willcooke: did you tell GunnarHj & friends that you're working on that?
<Laney> also
<Laney> I attached gdb to compiz and did a release upgrade to xenial
<Laney> https://paste.ubuntu.com/15465006/
<GunnarHj> Laney, willcooke: I heard that. :)
<Laney> compiz got multiarched in the meantime
<Laney> could that break this?
<Laney> hikiko: ^?
<Trevinho> Laney: mh it could be that
<Trevinho> Laney: however that trace seems suspcious to me... like some memory issue
<Laney> yes
<Trevinho> in fact that signature is the one used by the unity panel service iirc
<Laney> whole chunks of the system got swapped out from under the running process
<Laney> I only got one frame on the bt before gdb exited
<Trevinho> #define ENTRY_SIGNATURE "(sssusbbusbbi)"
<Trevinho> it mismatches because this is the one, but the old one was like the one in the trace
<Trevinho> but, I don't see why the file should be unloaded...
<ximion> Laney: almost done with implementing the icon-loading code in the new generator
<Trevinho> it's probably likely that removing that file causes something problematic
<Trevinho> but...
<ChrisTownsend> willcooke: dobey: I filed https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity-scope-click/+bug/1560129 for tracking the issue I saw.
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1560129 in unity-scope-click (Ubuntu) "unity-scope-click is either held back or removed depending on apt-get command" [Undecided,New]
<ximion> Laney: unfortunately, the loading and processing of the Contents file slows the thing down massively
<dobey> ChrisTownsend: well, "held back" makes sense
<dobey> ChrisTownsend: it added a new binary depends; when that happens, apt generally holds it back until you dist-upgrade to pull in the new package
<ChrisTownsend> dobey: Yeah, which is probably what most users will see.  But I'm not most users and I willy nilly say 'Y' on dist-upgrade:)
<ChrisTownsend> dobey: Well, dist-upgrade removes unity-scope-click.
<ChrisTownsend> dobey: As I tried to explain in the bug, packagekit conflicts with python3-aptdaemon.pkcompat which is already installed, so bye-bye unity-scope-click.
<dobey> ChrisTownsend: well, python3-aptdaemon.pkcompat should get removed, generally
<Laney> ximion: Thought you were making that yourself
<dobey> ChrisTownsend: it would only be an issue if both are being upgraded at the exact same time
<ChrisTownsend> dobey: As willcooke explained, not when U7 is installed.  And U8 and U7 co-existing is the norm.
<dobey> ChrisTownsend: huh?
<Laney> Trevinho: hm I removed that whole directory and it didn't break
<ximion> Laney: not yet, because I run into an henn-and-egg problem there: To process metadata, I need to know about all icons in all packages. But that information is not yet available when going through the packages, because some might be processed later in the queue. So I would need two passes at the packages, one for building the contents information and marking interesting packages, and one for actually extracting the data
<ximion> that is much slower than using the Contents file, so I focus on the traditional method now, and the "we-build-contents-file" method will be implemented later
<dobey> ChrisTownsend: this is an issue with how apt resolves dependences, and just bad timing with the update
<ximion> I also want to reach feature parity with the dep11-generator ASAP, so that's the focus at time
<ChrisTownsend> dobey: Yeah, most likely the case.  I guess everyone will just have to work through it then.
<dobey> hrmm, but aptdaemon wasn't updated
<dobey> so dist-upgrade should have pulled in packagekit, and removed python3-aptdaemon.pkcompat
<ChrisTownsend> dobey: Maybe this?
<ChrisTownsend> $ apt-cache depends ubuntu-desktop | grep python3-aptdaemon.pkcompat
<ChrisTownsend>   Recommends: python3-aptdaemon.pkcompat
<ChrisTownsend> Although it's not a specific depends, so I may be grasping at straws.
<Laney> ximion: The first pass is to look at the contents, not the data itself
<dobey> ChrisTownsend: that's just a Recommends, so it should have just been removed as a result of that
<Laney> And only has to be done once per .deb
<dobey> and as you said, if you just install unity-scope-click again after, it works; so it should have worked during the upgrade
<Laney> ximion: did you apply for that funding yet?
<dobey> ChrisTownsend: was "ubuntu-desktop" in the updates list?
<ChrisTownsend> dobey: Yeah, I really don't know why apt wanted to hold on to it.  It was happy to remove it if I manually (re)installed unity-scope-click.
<dobey> ChrisTownsend: can you attach the bit of the apt history log from the time when you ran dist-upgrade to the ubg?
<dobey> bug even
<ximion> Laney: will do that in an hour (funding)
<Laney> 'k
<ChrisTownsend> dobey: Yes, ubuntu-desktop was in the updates list.
<ChrisTownsend> dobey: Yes, I'll attach the log.
<ximion> Laney: even for the contents, we need to unpack the ar archive, and open up the data.tar.* tarball - this is much faster than in the dep11-generator, but still not very cheap
<ximion> regardless of that, the "we generate contents data" approach will come
<Laney> ximion: Doesn't it use the md5sums in control?
<Laney> I believe you that it's slower
<Laney> but in terms of development effort I would avoid doing something that you know you're going to throw away
<ximion> Laney: no - but that's something we could do, haven't thought about that at all yet - that could be a massive optimization
<Laney> especially on a rewrite
<willcooke> ChrisTownsend, dobey - I'm a bit lost I think, but just wanted to state that the *default* situation should be that in 16.04 python3-aptdaemon-pkcompat should be as it is today (i.e. installed).  Only if the user installs unity8-desktop-session-mir should PK0.8 get installed and py3-pkcompat get removed.
<Laney> ximion: you're handling this manually?
<Laney> :-o
<willcooke> s/today/last Monday
<dobey> willcooke: that is the default behavior now
<willcooke> dobey, cool!  thanks
<ximion> Laney: jup, using libarchive directly turned out to be 1.5 -2 times faster spawning dpkg
<dobey> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/15465408/ <- that's what i get if i try to install unity-scope-click right now
<ximion> dpkg itself also seems to run tar and xz, while libarchive has archive support built-in, which works well with the multithreading
<Laney> for getting the contents you don't really want to use the tar file if you can help it
<Laney> :)
<Laney> tar sucks for that
<ChrisTownsend> dobey: Yeah, I had something similar to that when installing unity-scope-click manually after it was removed.
<willcooke> Trevinho, could you follow up with hikiko on that issue about compiz crashing on upgrade. She's been looking at it today
<ChrisTownsend> dobey: I also attached the history log to the bug.
<dobey> ok
<ChrisTownsend> dobey: Thanks
<Trevinho> willcooke: I've asked also andyrock to look at it, he's playing with VMs right now
<willcooke> nice one, thanks Trevinho, andyrock. hikiko FYI ^
<dobey> ChrisTownsend: i'll take a peak, but so far all i can tell is that it will work correctly for new users of 16.04. it's only potentially an issue on upgrade if unity-scope-click is already installed. so moderately low priority
<ximion> Laney: we will still need to open the control tarball ^^ - but since that one is smaller, chances are we can process packages even faster (at time, the generator does roughly 4-5 packages per second on my machine)
<Laney> it's not the opening
<Laney> it's reading the entire huuuuuuuuuge thing to get the filenames
<Laney> looking forward to hearing how much this helps
<ChrisTownsend> dobey: Ok, thanks.  We just need to be prepared for those folks who do already have it installed and they complain that the Apps scope is gone (if they do dist-upgrade) or wonder why they still can't install clicks when we are saying they can (due to it being held back).   Not complaining, just saying:)
<dobey> ChrisTownsend: sure; this dependency might not stay there either. we added it so it can be more easily tested if packagekit being installed breaks other unity7 features
<ChrisTownsend> dobey: Ok.  Thanks again.
<ximion> Laney: I'll know that soonish - need food first. Btw, I reduced the dependencies of the generator a little, the only thing I now still want to get rid of is the gdlib for image rendering. I originally used it to avoid gdk-pixbuf and pulling in X11 stuff etc. and make the whole think more lightweight - but it turns out librsvg2 depends on gdk-pixbuf anyway, and if I want to render SVGs, there's no way around it
<dobey> sure, np :)
<ximion> Laney: so I could use gdk-pixbuf directly anyway ^^ - will do that later, when I feel motivated enough to dive into image rendering / scaling again
<ximion> (huge pain - but Cairo + librsvg2 from D is again faster than using it from Python, which in this case makes less sense, since both should only be calling C stuff)
<Trevinho> Laney: britney is running on https://requests.ci-train.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/1146 for some time, once it's done, it's good to me.
<Laney> Trevinho: ok, ta
<Laney> Trevinho: how do you see the britney thing?
<Trevinho> Laney: I can't... I only know it *should* run.
<Laney> where is it normally linked from?
 * Laney is a train newbie
<Laney> Trevinho: whatever, forget britney
<Laney> I published it
<Laney> ooooooooooh no
<Laney> fix that!
<andyrock> Trevinho willcooke hikiko I'm building unity with debug info on a vm right now
<andyrock> hopefully i can reproduce the issue
<Laney> andyrock: you should do compiz too
<Trevinho> Laney: done
<Laney> ok
<andyrock> Laney: i already did that
<andyrock> nux and compiz
<Laney> okey
<andyrock> and unity is on his way right now
<willcooke> thanks andyrock - just fwd'd you a mail with some steps to reproduce
<andyrock> thx
<andyrock> i'll also creare a couple of snapshots of the vm
<Laney> $ update-manager -d
<Laney> done
<andyrock> so i can reproduce it more than once
<Trevinho> Laney: when does it happen the crash on upgrade, generally?
<Laney> Trevinho: for me like 2 minutes after it starts installing the packages
<Trevinho> ok... So, better to do a snapshot after download is done..
<Laney> it's a bit annoying because the upgrade carries on after compiz crashes
<willcooke> turn off the screensaver too, at least to begin with
<Laney> so you don't see which package actually made it happen
<Trevinho> if anybody can save a good snapshot (close to where the issue happens), it would be nice if it's shared.
<Laney> night folks
<willcooke> see ya Laney
<davmor2> willcooke: hmmm just tried updating this box as it said there were 100+ updates and get the following http://paste.ubuntu.com/15466433/
<sarnold> davmor2: https://twitter.com/frazelledazzell/status/710643133285928962
<willcooke> erk
<davmor2> \o/
<davmor2> sarnold: thanks
<sarnold> davmor2: granted, getting that update may be difficult..
<davmor2> willcooke: so we broke spotify's archive then \o/
<willcooke> Those digest issues are only warnings though, right
<willcooke> I think the thing stopping your upgrade working davmor2 is the qt5 issue
<davmor2> willcooke: I assume so, I'll dig into what is holding it back in a second
<willcooke> dpkg: error processing archive /var/cache/apt/archives/qtdeclarative5-ubuntu-ui-extras-browser-plugin_0.23+16.04.20160321.1-0ubuntu1_amd64.deb (--unpack):
<willcooke>  trying to overwrite '/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/qt5/qml/Ubuntu/Components/Extras/Browser/libubuntu-ui-extras-browser-plugin.so', which is also in package qml-module-ubuntu-ui-extras-browser:amd64 0.23+16.04.20160321-0ubuntu1
<willcooke> maybe chrisccoulson knows? ^
<chrisccoulson> willcooke, that's above the bit that I work on
<chrisccoulson> However
<chrisccoulson> That's probably related to bug 1342031
<ubot5> bug 1342031 in webbrowser-app (Ubuntu) "Rename QML modules to follow qml-module-foo naming" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1342031
<davmor2> http://paste.ubuntu.com/15466561/
<davmor2> fun and games
<dobey> oh fun
<dobey> someone didn't breaks/conflicts right
<robert_ancell> willcooke, hi
<willcooke> what up robert_ancell
<willcooke> Have I told you how much I dislike Gtk theming lately?
<robert_ancell> willcooke, haha, so glad you voulnteered for that bus
<robert_ancell> bug
<willcooke> tbh, I think I'm going to need to call in the big guns
<willcooke> I'm going to spend another couple of days fixing up everything I can
<willcooke> and then put out a general call for help
<willcooke> otherwise they won't get done
<willcooke> I'm soooo close to having Terminal look better
<willcooke> But I'm stuck with the last tab in the notebook
<willcooke> it's got a "+" for new tab and a dropdown menu for choosing which tab you want
<willcooke> but I cannot for the life of me work out a CSS selector to let me tweak it
<willcooke> it does respond to a generic .tab selector
<willcooke> so it must be part of the notebook
<willcooke> but I can't find a way of selecting only that tab
<willcooke> perhaps I should look in the source
<robert_ancell> http://imgur.com/gallery/Q3cUg29 ?
<dobey> heh, the gnome 3.18 apps are indeed a bit annoying
<willcooke> ROFL, exactly that
<deadlock> Hello, guys. The 'xinput' command will be available in the Mir? I need to disable touchscreen and i can do it with this command, but i don't know if it will work in Unity 8.
<dobey> deadlock: no, xinput is for X input devices, so i don't think it will work under Mir
<dobey> deadlock: you want the touch screen to always be disbled no matter what? on a laptop?
<deadlock> dobey: yes. The touchscreen of my laptop is damaged. I've created a file in /usr/share/X11/xorg.conf.d/ name 99-no-touchscreen.conf with settings to ignore the touchscreen, but i'm searching a alternative method to do this in the Mir.
<deadlock> Exists a command to disable?
<dobey> deadlock: can you not disable it in the bios?
<ximion> Laney: with using the md5sums file, I can now process about 20 non-interesting package in one second
<ximion> (non-interesting == no AppStream metadata)
<deadlock> dobey: no. There is no such feature in the BIOS.
<dobey> deadlock: oh, every laptop with touchscreen that i've had, i could disable it in bios
<dobey> deadlock: if that isn't possible, maybe add the kernel module to the blacklist, for it
<deadlock> dobey: I will search about the second option. Thank you very much
<willcooke> g'night all
<willcooke> phear my l33t haxor skillz!
<willcooke> I've sort of cracked it robert_ancell!!
<willcooke> The reason I couldn't get the CSS to apply to that last box in Terminal...
<robert_ancell> \o/
<willcooke> Lemme show you...
<qengho> Not sure I'm l33t enough.
<willcooke> https://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-terminal/tree/src/terminal-notebook.c?h=gnome-3-18#n50
<willcooke> robert_ancell, ^
<willcooke> They hard coded the padding and spacing of the buttons
<willcooke> for reals.
<robert_ancell> :(
<sarnold> heh, 75% of that file is super-abstractions and then the few lines that -do- something get hard coded :)
<robert_ancell> willcooke, can it be un-hard coded?
<willcooke> Don't know enough at this point
<willcooke> but I "fixed" it
<willcooke> I fixed it good.
<willcooke> *shakes fist*
<willcooke> https://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-terminal/tree/src/terminal-window.c?h=gnome-3-18#n2751
<willcooke> I just commented out that line and got rid of the whole actions area.
<willcooke> It was a button to add a new tab and a menu to select the current tab
<willcooke> personally, I don't think it brings anything to the party
<willcooke> so I'll discuss with Laney in the morning, see if we really need it or not
<willcooke> right, time to really call it a night now..
<willcooke> ta ta
<attente> robert_ancell: hey, mind if i force push wip/ubuntu-changes? i want to revert the last four commits...
<robert_ancell> attente, sure
<attente> robert_ancell: thanks. if you didn't pull, you shouldn't have to do anything, but if you did, just reset the head back up to where origin/wip/ubuntu-changes is right now
<robert_ancell> np
#ubuntu-desktop 2016-03-22
<hikiko> Hi
<ricotz> Trevinho, hi, I assume the new bamf is not suppose to signal an "empty" BamfApplication (no desktop-file, no name) for a startup-notification
<Sweet5hark> moin
<willcooke> morning all
<willcooke> The kettle is broken.
<willcooke> This is the worst day of my life ever
<willcooke> wait
<willcooke> it's ok
<Laney> hi
<willcooke> it's just the light that tells you it's on that's broken
<willcooke> morning Laney
<willcooke> didrocks, do you know who I can speak to about: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libunity/+bug/1538471
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1538471 in libunity (Ubuntu) "scope-runner-dbus.py assert failure: *** Error in `/usr/bin/python3': free(): invalid next size (fast): 0x0000000001ca17b0 ***" [Medium,Confirmed]
<didrocks> hey willcooke! Hum, I think the api team first? I know pstolowski worked on this at the time
<willcooke> thanks didrocks
<didrocks> yw ;)
<willcooke> Laney, don't know if you saw my ramblings last night.  I tracked down a themeing problem with Terminal to some hard-coded padding and margins.  I was wondering if we could remove that actions box (which I did by simply commenting it out) or if I should change the hard coded values to match our theme requirements?  IMO just getting rid of the "actions" box altogether is the best option.
<willcooke> "All" it does is allow you to create a new tab and choose which tab you want active.
<willcooke> Things that I assume most people do with keyboard shortcuts
<Laney> Sounds dangerous to assume that
<Laney> "Ubuntu patched out the button I use all the time!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"
<willcooke> Well, it didnt exist in 14.04
<willcooke> I think it was added in 3.18
<Laney> what's the problem?
<willcooke> If I "fix" it to work with out theme, then it will be broken for everyone else
<willcooke> I'll grab some screenshots after my meeting, but basically the tab that contains the action buttons is misaligned.  It overlaps with the previous tab and is offset by a couple of pixels up and right.
<willcooke> It looks a bit messy is all
<pstolowski> willcooke, hey! i worked on libunity project, that's right, but not on this particular aspect (python bindings); jamesh did most of the python bindings stuff. we haven't touched this code for ~3 years, maybe it's related to python 3 or python-gi change
<willcooke> thanks pstolowski - I'll drop him a line see if he's got any ideas.
<pstolowski> yw
<davmor2> cyphermox: it's all your damned fault :P  on the mokutils password type "moo1234" or just the letter "a" there is an error in the password confirmation that says they don't match I think you'll find they damn well do, So I assume it only shows that error regardless and the issue is actually that it is too short
 * pitti spots the news in Brussels, argh!
<Laney> willcooke: If you really want to fix this (is it high priority?) then you can probably make those paddings configurable if you use GtkStyleContext manually
<Laney> I don't think GtkContainer exposes the border-width property in CSS
<Laney> at least not that I can tell
<Laney> pitti: indeed :(
<willcooke> Laney, Well I don't think we should ship it looking a bit off, and I dont have the skillz to fix it properly.  The most I can probably do it change the hard coded padding to work for us, or we get rid of it.  For my money, we just turn it off.  But yeah, users. ;)
<willcooke> Laney, without actions button: http://imgur.com/aSBnKBJ
<willcooke> with actions button (unfettled - I will change the padding etc in a mo and see what it looks like): http://imgur.com/CUHBcAx
<davmor2> haha willcooke only 91.9 MB of updates
<hikiko> willcooke, Laney andyrock
<hikiko> I manually dist-upraded from lts 14 to lts 16
<hikiko> and the  upgrade stopped
<hikiko> at the moment that the package ubuntu-desktop
<hikiko> was about to get installed
<Trevinho> ricotz: what you mean by empty signal?
<hikiko> I got this message: /usr/sbin/invoke-rc.d: /sbin/runlevel: not found stop/waiting
<hikiko> I wonder if some pre/post installation script crashes the desktop
<hikiko> and we get the panic
<hikiko> sorry the message is:
<hikiko>  /usr/sbin/invoke-rc.d: /sbin/runlevel: not found cron stop/waiting
<davmor2> willcooke, jibel: so good news at last the qt issue doesn't affect a default install so I assume it is because I have the sdk installed cause who would want to use the desktop to develop stuff :)
<hikiko> and libperl didn't upgrade either I see some bugs there too
<hikiko> because UUID.pm is missing
<hikiko> any ideas?
<davmor2> cyphermox: ^
<Laney> willcooke: https://paste.ubuntu.com/15471088 https://paste.ubuntu.com/15471091
<willcooke> Laney, zomg - thank you!!
 * willcooke patches
<Laney> not sure it'll work from the inspector
<willcooke> Let's see...
<ricotz> Trevinho, afaics while starting an application using a GDesktopAppInfo results in a signaled BamfApplication of BamfMatcher which has no concrete information
<Laney> but you can always edit the css
<hikiko> It seems that there are missing dependencies
<hikiko> sorry :p I accidentally pasted that :p
<ricotz> Trevinho, this is running plank which is using libbamf
<davmor2> willcooke: http://people.canonical.com/~davmor2/desktop-screenshots/for-will.png
<Trevinho> ricotz: what info is missing? If there's no desktop file, there should be no bamf application signaled
<Trevinho> Also it's marked with the starting property, thus you can filter them out if you want.
<ricotz> Trevinho, it has no desktop-file but it is a BamfApplication, and I don't want to use this new API to workaround this behaviour change ;)
<ricotz> I had no time to really debug it yet
<Trevinho> ricotz: weird. Since we only care about apps with desktop files. If you can paste a log of GDBus monitoring bamf interface or a test case would be nice
<ricotz> Trevinho, I can see an additional application "/org/ayatana/bamf/application/0x..." is created which disappears after a specific timeout (I assume those are the hardcoded 15s)
<Trevinho> ricotz: Mh, that happens when launching what?
<ricotz> Trevinho, any application (which is pinned and has a proper desktop-file) with the plank's internal starting mechanism which makes use of a GDesktopAppInfo and the GdkDisplay's default GAppLaunchContext
<ricotz> Trevinho, I will try to make a small sample application to trigger this problem
<Trevinho> ricotz: well, we use the same thing to launch apps in unity as well...
<Trevinho> And so we do when launching from the dash
<Sweet5hark> Laney: https://anonscm.debian.org/viewvc/pkg-gnome/desktop/experimental/gnome-documents/debian/changelog?r1=47555&r2=47588 <- are you aware of these gnome-documents/libreoffice interdependencies and do we need to care?
<Laney> Sweet5hark: is the problem that you can't install gnome-documents?
<willcooke> hikiko, so you think that's what is causing the Xorg crash, which is what is causing the compiz crash?
<Sweet5hark> Laney: Im still following down the rabbit hole. The issue seems that gnome-documents crashes if some libreoffice is installed, but there is no liblibreofficekitgtk.so ...
<Laney> Sweet5hark: looks like rene added that in 5.1.1-1
<hikiko> I think that it's possible that some packages update in wrong order or there are dependencies missing and some scripts that run can't find modules or sth they need and crash.
<Laney> Probably want that too
<Sweet5hark> Laney: that can easily happen for us as the *.so isnt in the commonly installed packages.
<Sweet5hark> Laney: right.
<hikiko> that UUID.pm for example that is missing from perl: there might be some install script that uses perl and need it
<hikiko> dist-upgrade crashes without x running
<Sweet5hark> Laney: I havent merged -1 yet (I usually stop doing full merges around feature freeze to prevent regressions). I take that as I should get that change cherry-picked still for us?
<hikiko> willcooke, it seems that the compiz/X crash is a consequence not the reason of the upgrade failure
<hikiko> maybe packagers can find out more on why dist-upgrade fails
 * Sweet5hark takes a look at _rene_s commits.
<ricotz> Trevinho, I guess there must be another factor to trigger it
<willcooke> hikiko, could this (invalid) bug be related?  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/sysvinit/+bug/1444502
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1444502 in sysvinit (Ubuntu) "sysv-rc uses /sbin/runlevel without depending on a package that provides it" [Undecided,Invalid]
<hikiko> I see that message too willcooke but I really don't know much about packages and dependencies, it could definitely be 1 of the missing dependencies but I don't know if that's the only bug or if this causes the crash
<hikiko> http://paste.ubuntu.com/15471226/ these are the repos I used btw, I commented out everything else
<hikiko> so the packages must be in one of those 2
<willcooke> pitti, we've got an upgrade problem going from 14.04 -> 16.04.  The upgrade crashes half way through and if you reboot the box at that point you can end up with a kernel panic.
<Sweet5hark> *urgh*
<Sweet5hark> Laney: this situation is rather ... unfortunate.
<willcooke> pitti, Laney did some debugging yesterday and we saw compiz crash because (I think) Xorg went away.  hikiko has done some more testing thigs morning
<willcooke> pitti, at seen a message about /sbin/runlevel: not found cron stop/waiting
<Laney> Sweet5hark: oh yeah?
<willcooke> pitti, I wondered if this could be a not-systemd -> systemd issue?
<hikiko> yes I saw that too
<hikiko> willcooke,
<hikiko> since the crash causes a kernel panic
<hikiko> and the message is that it cant mount the rootfs
<hikiko> it's possible that during the upgrade the initrd is not created by the kernel
<pitti> willcooke: could be if it happens in the middle of updating trusty's upstart to xenial's systemd-sysv (which contains /sbin/runlevel); but we need the full upgrade log to see what's going on
<hikiko> and then everything crashes
<hikiko> and with this bug it's not really easy to get a log
<hikiko> I mean with the fs in that state
<hikiko> dist-upgrade shows problems in packages
<hikiko> maybe we should start from there
<hikiko> solve the dependencies issues etc
<hikiko> and then try update manager again
<hikiko> and see if we still get the issue
<pitti> you sohuld have /var/log/dist-upgrade/
<hikiko> I think that some post upgrade script cant run for some reason and crashes the upgrade
<pitti> right (apparently cron)
<hikiko> yep
<pitti> and we need to see when that happens, which package crahes, and what the unpack/cofigure state of init, upstart, systemd-sysv etc. is
<pitti> and that should all be in /v/l/d-u/apt-term.log
<hikiko> let me see if I can retrieve that log otherwise I ll dist upgrade 1 more time
<hikiko> but unfortunately I can't help with packaging I don't understand much there
<Sweet5hark> Laney: a/ some versions of gnome-documents apparently crash when libreoffice is installed, but liblibreofficekitgtk.so is missing
<Sweet5hark> Laney: b/ we currently ship liblibreofficekitgtk.so in libreoffice-gtk3
<Sweet5hark> Laney: c/ but libreoffice-gtk3 is still mostly experimental, isnt installed in the default install -- its basically only there for the adventurous to test it out, not for production use. LibreOffice picks it up by default over the (stable) -gtk2 backend though. This wasnt an issue as long as the only people installing libreoffice-gtk3 were doing so knowing they are in for a ride ...
<Sweet5hark> oh, hang on. lemme see where rene moved liblibreofficekitgtk.so to ...
<ricotz> Trevinho, hmm, bamf broke its abi
<ricotz> https://paste.debian.net/plain/418005 you cant insert those new symbols you *must* append them at the end
<Laney> Sweet5hark: I guess that liblibreofficekitgtk probably uses gtk3 specific stuff
<Trevinho> ricotz: yeah... I just thought I missed that when you mentioned the abi breakage. -_-
<Sweet5hark> Laney: yes. it is.
<Laney> Sweet5hark: do you know if our version 3.18.2 is affected?
<Trevinho> ricotz: would you mind providing a quick branch for fixing it?
<ricotz> Trevinho, there are even more I guess :\
<hikiko> pitti, history log: http://paste.ubuntu.com/15471444/ term: http://paste.ubuntu.com/15471449/
<Trevinho> ricotz: no, only this one changed on lib side http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~unity-team/bamf/trunk/revision/625#lib/libbamf/bamf-view.h
<Trevinho> I actually asked andyrock not to break the abi, but I didn't notice he used the wrong pos
<Sweet5hark> Laney: Checking back with _rene_ right now. But yeah, that would be good: 3.18 isnt affected, it starts with 3.20 ...
<Laney> luckyyyyy
<davmor2> Laney: in system settings on the live desktop Display is Displays on the installed system it is called Screen Display, why is there a difference there?
<Sweet5hark> Laney: and as homework please tell me how that will work next time around when LibreOffice is in a snap :D
<davmor2> Sweet5hark: It's done with mirrors and magnets like all good magic ;)
<Sweet5hark> davmor2: fairydust!
<davmor2> Sweet5hark: but mostly misdirection
<Laney> davmor2: I would guess it is translated like that
<davmor2> Look a threeheaded Monkey, and there we go LibreOffice installed with no issues
<davmor2> Laney: ah cool thanks hadn't thought of there
<davmor2> that even
<ricotz> Trevinho, https://code.launchpad.net/~ricotz/bamf/fix-abi , I am surprised this doesnt cause more trouble for me, although it isn't the source of my original problem
<Laney> davmor2: try with LC_ALL=C.UTF-8 unity-control-center
<davmor2> Laney: no it's fine there are a bunch of changes so locale makes perfect sense
<Laney> 'k
<pitti> hikiko: hm, there's no error in that log -- is that from a subsequent do-release-upgrade, after the initial failure?
<Trevinho> ricotz: to see what could cause your issue you might check also "dbus-monitor --session --monitor "interface='org.gtk.gio.DesktopAppInfo'""
<Trevinho> ricotz: it should tell you what bamf catches
<Trevinho> together with gdbus monitor --session --dest org.ayatana.bamf
<davmor2> jibel, willcooke: FFS pending install "Installation Failed, The installer encountered an unrecoverable error. A desktop session will now be run so that you may investigate the problem or try installing again."
<jibel> davmor2, crap. grab the logs from /var/log/installer and /var/log/syslog
<davmor2> this just isn't funny anymore
<ricotz> Trevinho, thanks
<davmor2> jibel: I'm waiting for it to get into desktop mode then It'll file a bug with that info in
<jibel> davmor2, I think it's just you, you have a bad juju
<willcooke> davmor2, jibel - slangask has said they'll help, just need to log bugs so they can take a look.
<willcooke> I doubt it's something insurmountable
<willcooke> also, thanks for testing it davmor2
<jibel> right, no doubt we'll release something this week
<ricotz> Trevinho, I found the problem
<davmor2> Oh god even the terminal doesn't start on pending
<Trevinho> ricotz: what's happening?
 * davmor2 starts xterm
<ricotz> Trevinho, I was using g_desktop_app_info_new_from_keyfile to reuse the object since I am doing some further parsing, of course this results in the passed desktop-filename being empty on the launch call
<Trevinho> ricotz: ah, I see...
<ricotz> Trevinho, so g_desktop_app_info_new_from_filename sets it
<Trevinho> ricotz: however, I'm still wondering why this causes a bamfapp to be created
<ricotz> sounds like a gio API problem for me ;)
<Trevinho> ricotz: what you get when monitoring that call?
<Trevinho> I mean, on dbus, what's get called?
<Trevinho> since bamfdaemon should ignore the thing if desktop_file == NULL
<Trevinho> ah.... wait, maybe it's an empty string.
<hikiko> pitti, it seems that term.log wasn't updated in the last upgrade
<ricotz> Trevinho, https://paste.debian.net/plain/418016
<ricotz> Trevinho, it is an empty string yes
<Trevinho> I think this is wrong (old code, not mine):
<Trevinho>   matcher = bamf_matcher_get_default ();
<Trevinho>   g_variant_get_child (parameters, 0, "^&ay", &desktop_file);
<Trevinho>   g_variant_get_child (parameters, 2, "x", &pid);
<Trevinho> we should check the value actually... I'll fix it in a bit
<ricotz> Trevinho, still it shows a minor flaw in plank's source ;)
<davmor2> jibel, willcooke, cyphermox: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubiquity/+bug/1560459
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1560459 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "Using Pending iso ubiquity crashes before the first page opens" [Undecided,New]
<ricotz> Trevinho, btw not sure what happens in GDesktopAppInfo for G_KEY_FILE_DESKTOP_TYPE_LINK G_KEY_FILE_DESKTOP_TYPE_DIRECTORY
<jibel> davmor2, Mar 22 11:49:14 ubuntu ubiquity[1614]: GLib.GError: vte-pty-error: grantpt failed: Operation not permitted (1)
<jibel> did something change recently with the vte
<davmor2> jibel: might explain why the terminal app doesn't open also
<jibel> davmor2, yes same reason
<jibel> davmor2, there is new vte on 16.03
<jibel> willcooke, not a slangasek thing but for your team
<willcooke> Laney, ^ any thoughts on this vte-pty-error ^^?  Note: it's running from the pending ISO
<davmor2> jibel: http://people.canonical.com/~davmor2/desktop-screenshots/terminal-error.png who knew copy paste didn't work in xterm well where there is a will :D
<davmor2> willcooke: ^ the terminal opening error
<jibel> willcooke, I'll ask nuclearbob to force the promotion to current once there is a valid image
<jibel> willcooke, automated smoketest are currently failing due to some ssh issue
<davmor2> jibel: yeah it probably can't start the service or a terminal to test it :D
<Laney> davmor2: /usr/lib/gnome-terminal/gnome-terminal-server
<davmor2> Laney: Locale not supported
<Laney> locale; locale -a
<Laney> never mind I can see this too
<Laney> needless to say this is not a vte problem
<ricotz> Trevinho, is there an eta when the fixed bamf will hit the archive since pushing my fixes will result in builds against a broken abi
<GunnarHj> Hi Laney, since it's final beta times, I'm worrying about the seed MP:s at bug #1468027. lubuntu-desktop and kubuntu-desktop depends on/recommends fonts-droid which no longer exists in the Xenial archive.
<ubot5> bug 1468027 in lubuntu-meta (Ubuntu) "change default CJK fonts to Noto CJK" [Critical,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1468027
<davmor2> Laney: indeed
<davmor2> Laney: so what do I file that bug against
<Laney> davmor2: glibc probably, just pinged in devel
<Laney> GunnarHj: yeah the sponsoring queue looks worrying in general
<GunnarHj> Laney: Right. Isn't that going to result in problems with the beta releases?
<davmor2> Laney: le sigh, and what about the vte issue that is making cyphermox cry as ubiquity doesn't run?
<Laney> what vte issue?
<davmor2> Laney: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubiquity/+bug/1560459
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1560459 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "Using Pending iso ubiquity crashes before the first page opens" [Undecided,New]
<davmor2> Laney: it was that issue that uncovered the none starting terminal
<Laney> davmor2: don't know, if you use sudo it starts
<willcooke> ah ha!
<willcooke> Seems that GtkBox doesn't support padding unless it's in a frame
<cyphermox> Laney: yeah, it says "grantpt" which ought to mean something about granting something else.
<Laney> cyphermox: hahaha
<cyphermox> ;)
<Laney> great sentence
<cyphermox> I write good.
<cyphermox> I also write goof
<Laney> reverting vte changes nothing
<Laney> I call external factor
<cyphermox> I agree
<Trevinho> ricotz: I also have to add unity to the silo and rebuild it...
<cyphermox> Laney: I'll compare with previous images and we'll find what changed
<Laney> cyphermox: glibx
<Laney> c
<Laney> just downgraded it
<cyphermox> that alone?
<Laney> well I didn't re-upgrade vte
<Laney> but doubt that makes a difference :)
<cyphermox> I am kind of surprised it is glibc tbh
<cyphermox> but oh well ;)
<Laney> that's where grantpt comes from
<cyphermox> ah, that changes things
<cyphermox> well, I'm sure infinity knows all about it
<Laney> suggest you confirm though
<andyrock> hey all
<willcooke> hi andyrock
<Trevinho> ricotz: can you check https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/bamf/ignore-desktopless-preregistration/+merge/289792 ?
<Trevinho> andyrock: too  ^
<desrt> this is awesome
<desrt> i'm working in a cafe this morning.. the one in my building, i've often been here before
<desrt> they got a new wifi and in the ssid it says "1 hour guest"
<desrt> i connect, start using it, no captive portals, everything works.... i start wondering "hmm.. how does this 1 hour guest thing work..."
<qengho> desrt: Subtle1
<desrt> after almost an hour of using it i open the news to take a quick look and hit a captive portal page
<willcooke> mac changer time
<desrt> ... oh.. is my hour up?...
<desrt> no....
<desrt> turns out that it redirects http traffic to the captive portal page
<desrt> and lets everything else (https included) straight through
<willcooke> hahaha
<willcooke> sweet
<qengho> I work out of a cafe once a week or so. Put on trousers, pretend not to be a hermit. You know. Well, one cafe I used attached to a hospital blocked everything not part of "web" usage. I had to set my home machine to listen to port 443 for ssh. It's the only port they don't try to mess with.
<andyrock> willcooke Laney do we need to put xserver-xorg-lts-wily-dev in unity-trusty/debian as a required dependecy? i had problem building it because of it
<desrt> qengho: i moved my linode over to ssh on port 443 ages ago.  never looked back.
<desrt> this, plus socks proxy support in ssh makes for smooth surfing
<Laney> andyrock: umm I don't think so
<andyrock> k
<Laney> maybe Trevinho knows?
<Trevinho> andyrock: trusty version needs that :o?
<andyrock> yeah basically if i do apt-get build-dep unity
<andyrock> it fails
<Trevinho> andyrock: I build unity without that...
<Trevinho> andyrock: try with just sudo mk-build-deps -i
<andyrock> because it requires xservser.xorg-dev
<andyrock> ah ok
<andyrock> but build-deps should work too ;)
<Trevinho> ah... wait that might because it's trusty 14.04.04
<Trevinho> thus...
<Trevinho> it has xserver-xorg-lts-wily installed by default maybe
<Trevinho> which I don't in my trusty install
<Laney> probably something weird if you build it in an existing system
<Laney> sbuild/pbuilder would be ok with the existing ones I should think
<andyrock> nope i installed it from the last available iso
<Trevinho> that's the thing
<ricotz> Trevinho, regarding https://bugs.launchpad.net/bamf/+bug/1560486 -- the version of bamf is at 0.5.3
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1560486 in bamf (Ubuntu) "Revision 625 broke ABI compatibility" [High,In progress]
<Laney> man
<Laney> glib is still hanging
<Laney> even with a new kernel
<Trevinho> ricotz: I know, but I've to do the milestone for that... Although I'd probably just remove the upstream handling of bugs in bamf as well.
<Trevinho> ricotz: I'll migrate these once I've an upstream release though
 * Laney cries
 * Laney goes to cry into a bowl of curry
<Trevinho> curry tears...
<Trevinho> It might be a new successful recipe
<desrt> Laney: mmm
<desrt> Laney: yr makin me hungry and it's not even 10:30 yet
<ricotz> Trevinho, alright
<qengho> Anybody seen this before? "Inconsistency detected by ld.so: dl-open.c: 691: _dl_open: Assertion `_dl_debug_initialize (0, args.nsid)->r_state == RT_CONSISTENT' failed!"
<willcooke> Anyone know if I can write a CSS rule to only match a specific application?  I've made some changes to the toggle buttons for Rhythmbox and I wonder if I need to limit it to only rb, and if I do - how to do that
<willcooke> I don't see anything specific in the selector tool in the inspector for rb
<willcooke> the button has a "buildable ID" but not a name it seems
<Sweet5hark> qengho: your dynamic linker is angry? fun!
<qengho> Usually my angry linker is dynamic.
<qengho> Sweet5hark: it's some snappy hackery and probably my fault.
<Sweet5hark> qengho: thought so, but no -- I havent seen that one before ...
<willcooke> woah, that crept up quickly...
<willcooke> #startmeeting Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-03-22
<meetingology> Meeting started Tue Mar 22 15:31:17 2016 UTC.  The chair is willcooke. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-03-22 | Current topic:
<willcooke> Roll call:  andyrock, attente, desrt,  dgadomski, fjkong, happyaron, hikiko (out), laney, qengho, seb128 (hols), sweet5hark, themuso (out), tkamppeter, trevinho, robert_ancell (out)
<Sweet5hark> aye
<desrt> hi
<andyrock> hi
<Trevinho> hey hey
<FJKong> hi
<happyaron> hey
<willcooke> Let's get started then
<willcooke> #topic andyrock
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-03-22 | Current topic: andyrock
<andyrock> hey
<andyrock> i've been working on completing some branches from the past weeks
<andyrock> reviews
<andyrock> and now working on the crash
<andyrock> i managed to get a crash but gdb crashed too
<willcooke> hehe
<andyrock> i'm trying to get a core file
<andyrock> and more debug info from compiz
<andyrock> but the vm is kind of messed up
<willcooke> super, thanks andyrock.  Please make that #1 priority.  hikiko is looking as well, if you can take the lead on that bug and let hikiko know the best thing to do to help that would be good.
<andyrock> https://www.irccloud.com/pastebin/kxQlPlKR/
<willcooke> rather than duplicating effort
<andyrock> sure thing
<andyrock> looks like memory corruption
<willcooke> Let's chat again tomorrow afternoon and see what we know.  Beta is looming, so would be good to get that nailed down asap.
<willcooke> davmor2, cyphermox - FYI.  andyrock will be leading the upgrade crash investigation, so please sync with him if you need any info / have a new discovery
<andyrock> sure
<willcooke> great, thanks andyrock
<willcooke> #topic attente
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-03-22 | Current topic: attente
<attente> more gnome-software bugs, updating the appstream index on first install, as well as some other crashers
<attente> looked into the GS gapplication situation with desrt, will commit some quick fixes, but might need to do some major rewriting to properly fix
<attente> (eof)
<willcooke> good stuff, thanks attente
<willcooke> #topic desrt
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-03-22 | Current topic: desrt
<Laney> attente: are you booked for the sprint?
<desrt> the usual bugs, reviews, etc.
<willcooke> Laney, still waiting on the budget ack
<desrt> getting into time-consuming arguments with people via email who consider the ability to seed a pseudo-random number generator to be a "backdoor"
<desrt> paying more attention to gnome-software and trying to pus it towards being a more typical gtkapplication user to solve some of the problems we've been seeing
<desrt> a couple of releases will be out today
<desrt> eof
<willcooke> thanks desrt, and thanks for the input to g-s
<willcooke> #topic dgadomski
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-03-22 | Current topic: dgadomski
<dgadomski> hey, unfortunately nothing to share, took a couple of days off last week.
<dgadomski> That's it, thanks.
<willcooke> :) cheers dgadomski
<willcooke> #topic FJKong
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-03-22 | Current topic: FJKong
<FJKong> 1 Test sogou im inputing Chinese in TeXmacs.
<FJKong> if fullscreen then candidate word window will not right
<FJKong> 2 Could not login into Desktop after input password. Reported by user
<FJKong> one is caused by evnorinment problem, still other user report this bug.
<FJKong> 3 Cannot input Chinese characters into TextField in a QML application
<FJKong> needs ubuntu-sdk team guys to confirm environment not take effect
<FJKong> eof
<Laney> can I go next pls
<willcooke> thanks FJKong
<willcooke> #topic Laney
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-03-22 | Current topic: Laney
<Laney> need to run downstairs quickly /o\
<Laney> thanks
<Laney> â¢ I worked on a branch for appstream-dep11 that fixes packages not appearing in the release when they migrate out of proposed
<Laney> â¢ Looked at some FFes including ones I was pinged about
<Laney> â¢ Gave some advice on icon stuff for appstream - there are a few requests that need attention in the sponsor queue now
<Laney> â¢ Looked at some live CD bugs which both turned out to be introduced by the new glibc /o\
<Laney> â¢ Helped Gunnar with some yelp fixes & did some investigation there
<Laney> â¢ New gvfs, glib (this build hangs on s390x, not sure why, so it's stuck in xenial-proposed), gstreamer
<Laney> â¢ Gave some maybe not so helpful help with gnome-terminal theming
<Laney> á¼§
<willcooke> :) thanks Laney
<willcooke> yeah, I don't think those fixes are going to do the job.  I'm still keen on disabling that box.  Will email you more details anon
<willcooke> #topic happyaron
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-03-22 | Current topic: happyaron
<happyaron> hey
<happyaron> 1. Guest session apparmor for input methods (fcitx, mozc)
<happyaron> 2. Yet another update to zfs-linux/spl-linux
<happyaron> 3. Sponsor uploads: sdcc, ubuntukylin-theme
<happyaron> 4. In-progress: ubuntukylin-wallpapers
<happyaron> 5. Will go to Changsha on Wed for mini-sprint with NUDT
<happyaron> EOF
<willcooke> thanks happyaron
<willcooke> #topic hikiko
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-03-22 | Current topic: hikiko
<willcooke> * ezoom:
<willcooke> - fixed a bug in the translation matrices caused by the different coordinate systems we use in ezoom and unity ([-1, 1] vs pixel coordinates)
<willcooke> - working on another transformation bug
<willcooke> * "compiz crashes during update" bug:
<willcooke> - it seems that the compiz crash is the result of another dist-upgrade problem and we have to find out what crashes the upgrade to fix it.
<willcooke> EOF
<hikiko> jey
<hikiko> hey
<hikiko> I just noticed something!
<willcooke> ha, already pasted for you :)
<hikiko> http://imgur.com/a/ahswl
<hikiko> the paste of andyrock
<hikiko> shows a libc corruption
<hikiko> and my first screenshot shows
<willcooke> oki, can you follow up after the meeting has ended pls?  Sounds like progress though
<hikiko> sorry :)
<willcooke> no worries
<hikiko> ok
<willcooke> :)
<willcooke> #topic qengho
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-03-22 | Current topic: qengho
<qengho> Howdy!
<qengho> - Chromium snap still in progress. Debugging ld.so assertion crash. Help?!
<qengho> - Made another snap, to prove to myself my workflow is right. 13 users. Yay!
<qengho> - Chromium 49 uploaded. Should fix some default-browser complaints.
<qengho> EOF
<willcooke> Great, thanks qengho
<willcooke> I assume you know about #snappy on freenode?
<willcooke> that's where all the cool kids hangout
<qengho> Yep. I'm there.
<willcooke> if you don't get anywhere I can raise it in my meeting with them tomorrow, let me know
<qengho> Not that I'm a cool kid....
<willcooke> :D
<willcooke> #topic seb128
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-03-22 | Current topic: seb128
<willcooke> Being on holiday
<willcooke> - updated software-properties to not depends on unattended-upgrades,
<willcooke> some users want to uninstall it
<willcooke> - fixed nautilus sidebar code to work with the new GTK
<willcooke> - fixed rhythmbox issue where pause would display a notification
<willcooke> - some small sessioninstaller fixes (typo, missing depends)
<willcooke> - set X-Ubuntu-Use-Langpack for evolution since it's universe, should
<willcooke> restore some missing strings translations
<willcooke> - updated gnome-calendar
<willcooke> - looked at some gnome-software issues, reported bugs with debug
<willcooke> info/suggestions
<willcooke> - updated the defaults mimetype handlers list for gnome-software
<willcooke> - patch pilot shift
<willcooke> - the usual share of bug triage/reviews/meetings/etc
<willcooke> #topic Sweet5hark
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-03-22 | Current topic: Sweet5hark
<Sweet5hark> - updated xenial to 5.1.1 rc3 = final
<Sweet5hark> - allowed XUbuntu folks to have libreoffice-style-elementary as an alternative to libreoffice-style-breeze
<Sweet5hark> - backported master patch for unity menu integration (bug 1559135)
<Sweet5hark> - release notes
<Sweet5hark> - reviewed upsteam tender replies/job applicants/projects, usual calls, some review of other peoples patches
<Sweet5hark> - pushed some 40-50 refactoring/cleanup patches upstream (delta: killed some 600 LOC)
<Sweet5hark> - some snappy work (included help l10n, postgresql)
<ubot5> bug 1559135 in LibreOffice "GtkSalMenu: menu File>Templates>Manage executes action from the wrong submenu" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1559135
<Sweet5hark> - checked situation around gnome-documents - libreoffice deps, seems to be ok.
<Sweet5hark> - fixed a regression upstream (tdf#95977)
<Sweet5hark> EOF
<willcooke> thanks Sweet5hark
<willcooke> #topic TheMuso
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-03-22 | Current topic: TheMuso
<willcooke> * Testing and fixing accessibility profile manager bugs, still not in main, but can test by building custom install images, should have the last bugs sorted this week.
<willcooke> * Doing upgrade tests in a VM, and those upgrades failing in different ways, haven't tried to get logs out of the VM yet.
<willcooke> #topic tkamppeter
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-03-22 | Current topic: tkamppeter
<tkamppeter> - Google Summer of Code 2016: Communication with students and with upstream maintainers to define the projects to be done this Summer. Main project will be the integration of the lightweight PDF interpreter MuPDF in the printing stack, to replace Poppler and Ghostscript on mobile devices.
<tkamppeter> - cups-filters: Small bug fixes.
<tkamppeter> - Bugs.
<willcooke> thanks tkamppeter
<willcooke> #topic Trevinho
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-03-22 | Current topic: Trevinho
<Trevinho> Â· Improvements to BAMF startup-notification support
<Trevinho> Â· Fixes to the Gtk unity border radius patch
<Trevinho> Â· Add overlay numbers to all windowed icons in launcher
<Trevinho> Â· Fixed an HiDPI regression in lockscreen prompt view
<Trevinho> Â· Client-leader fixes for force-quit dialog
<Trevinho> Â· Working on some improvements to the hikiko's shaped windows branch
<Trevinho> Â· Decoration of panel/launcher in spread mode, some initial work
<Trevinho> Â· Reviews
<Trevinho> Â· Landed all the FFes (Launcher at the bottom, startup notifications)
<Trevinho> ...
<willcooke> thanks Trevinho
<willcooke> #topic robert_ancell
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-03-22 | Current topic: robert_ancell
<willcooke> GNOME Software
<willcooke> #topic willcooke
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-03-22 | Current topic: willcooke
<willcooke> Reviews - nearly done for the year.  Yay
<willcooke> Themes
<willcooke>  - Got Gedit mostly complete.  Just need to decided what to do with the actions bar
<willcooke>  - General notebook theme mostly compete. Need to merge what I can in from Terminal
<willcooke> s/gedit/termincal
<willcooke>  - Rhythmbox - done needs sign off from design
<willcooke> Slideshow
<willcooke>  - Got animal and making sceeenshots.  Very slight changes to the text.
<willcooke> Snappy
<willcooke>  - Many things.  All of which fun.
<willcooke> #topic any other business
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2016-03-22 | Current topic: any other business
<willcooke> Sprint!
<willcooke> The design team are having a sprint with the U8 guys at the same time and same place as us.
<willcooke> There will be a good chance to chat with them about general desktop requirements
<willcooke> Final Beta
<willcooke> ZOMG
<Laney> Yeah that's this week
<willcooke> Please prioritise install / upgrade crashers where ever you can.  I'd like to see a smooth upgrade from 14.04 -> 16.04 in time for the final beta.
<davmor2> willcooke: you say ZOMG like you can't install or upgrade to it
<Laney> like in two days this week
<willcooke> No small task, so let me know if we need more/different people - please let me know, we have the offer of help from kgunn
<Laney> like the archive is already frozen
<qengho> cking: Is there any hope of grub and zfs update?
<willcooke> well - olli said kgunn will be able to help us :P
<willcooke> So andyrock, no pressure ;)
<cking> qengho, i'm waiting for 0.6.5.6 to be tagged and I'll then get that packaged,tested and pushed out sometime this week if I can
<Laney> willcooke: I'm a bit worried about changing things like buttons in the terminal after the final beta and feature freeze and user interface freeze :/
 * kgunn crawls from under rock
<willcooke> kgunn, sorry for the spam - nothing to see here
<qengho> cking: I'm glad you're back!
<cking> me too ;-)
<willcooke> Laney, can we SRU them in later?  Which is least bad?
<Laney> Leaving it as is now?
<Laney> Is this an actual *bug*?
<willcooke> IMO, yes
<Laney> like the linked buttons theming definitely is
<willcooke> on it
<willcooke> Anyone got other business?
 * desrt looks around
 * willcooke waits for the clock to tick over on the hour 
<willcooke> #endmeeting
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Tag "gtk318" for gtk 3.18 bugs please and thanks
<meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Mar 22 16:00:01 2016 UTC.
<meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2016/ubuntu-desktop.2016-03-22-15.31.moin.txt
<willcooke> thanks all
<willcooke> hikiko, please continue re: screenshot...
<muktupavels> Trevinho: Do you plan to make libwnck 3.20 release?
<muktupavels> Trevinho: https://git.gnome.org/browse/libwnck/log/?h=wip/muktupavels/gnome-3-20
<hikiko> http://imgur.com/a/ahswl <- the first screenshot
<hikiko> I recorded the upgrade because after the crash there were no log files
<hikiko> and after libc upgrades
<hikiko> cmanager and other programs that have dependencies on libc crash
<hikiko> and in the pastebin link of andyrock
<hikiko> I noticed that there's a libc corruption too compiz can't find libc
<hikiko> so I suspect that because libc upgrade crashes and most programs depend on it they crash too
<hikiko> maybe we have to check the dependencies etc
<hikiko> of the libc package and the upgrade order
<Trevinho> muktupavels: I could, but... Do we really need to increase the gtk dependency? A part from removing deprecated calls, I mean.
<muktupavels> trevinho: GdkSeat is available starting with 3.19.5
<Trevinho> yeah, I saw that
<Trevinho> but I don't see you're using any feature of that as for now
<muktupavels> I just replaced deprecated GdkDeviceManager with GdkSeat...
<Trevinho> yeah, I see... It's just that I think it's the same thing for now. A part from muting compiler warns, there sno real gain in using the new API imho. While that lib might be needed by some legacy systems using older gtk
<Trevinho> muktupavels: I've also given a look at your compiz branches for tests (many thanks!), but I'm getting the tests hanging here... So I need to look further to what happens
<Trevinho> muktupavels: have you experienced anything like that?
<muktupavels> Trevinho: legacy apps that use older gtk will use older libwnck, no?
<muktupavels> Trevinho: building with pbuilder-dist all tests worked, but building locally I had ~30 failed tests...
<Trevinho> They could, but they also might need some feature from new one... And in the past libwnck has always been a little detached from normal gnome cycles, but I'm not saying I'm against that. It's just that we can keep things more relaxed.
<Trevinho> It all depends in what we really need to do with it
<Trevinho> muktupavels: yeah, I've been testing it in both an lxd container and locally and got the same failures. Plus the same in the silo: https://launchpad.net/~ci-train-ppa-service/+archive/ubuntu/landing-056/+build/9380558/+files/buildlog_ubuntu-xenial-amd64.compiz_1%3A0.9.12.2+16.04.20160321-0ubuntu1_BUILDING.txt.gz
<Trevinho> armhf was the only arch that worked... Weirdly.
<muktupavels> Trevinho: are tests enabled also on armhf? there is comment - # right now, xorg-gtest won't compile on arm.
<Trevinho> muktupavels: maybe not everyone, but some ran: https://launchpad.net/~ci-train-ppa-service/+archive/ubuntu/landing-056/+build/9380560/+files/buildlog_ubuntu-xenial-armhf.compiz_1%3A0.9.12.2+16.04.20160321-0ubuntu1_BUILDING.txt.gz
<GunnarHj> happyaron: Hi Aron. "regression for Chinese" - how?
<willcooke> Sweet5hark, is this the correct default theme for LO?  http://imgur.com/a0bZfZO
<Sweet5hark> willcooke: in general, yes. but you seem to have libreoffice-gtk3 installed?
<willcooke> Sweet5hark, ah, probably because I installed this machine a while ago?
<Sweet5hark> (as I see a classic menu and IIRC the toolbars in gtk2 have light background as they should)
<willcooke> Sweet5hark, is there an easy way to install the other version?
<Sweet5hark> willcooke: there was a transient dependency on libreoffice-gtk3 in early xenial, yes. It should be gone now and new installs and upgrades directly from wily/trusty should not pull in libreoffice-gtk3
<willcooke> libreoffice-gtk perhaps?
<Sweet5hark> willcooke: just "apt remove libreoffice-gtk3"
<Sweet5hark> willcooke: libreoffice-gtk should still be installed and libreoffice should use it once libreoffice-gtk3 is gone.
<willcooke> yaya!
<willcooke> thanks Sweet5hark
<Laney> ogra_: is this normal https://paste.ubuntu.com/15473751/ ?
<willcooke> Sweet5hark, ohhh much better!
<ogra_> Laney, thats a mvo/Chipaca question
<ogra_> but you perhaps rather want ubuntu-snappy-cli
<muktupavels> Trevinho: When GTK+ 3.20 will be uploaded libwnck will need rebuild to get css names working, no? And if libwnck is built against GTK+ 3.20 then it will not work with older GTK+ versions (because there will be no *_set_css_name). I fail to see how increased required version could cause problems...
<Laney> this is the thing that they want to seed
<ogra_> well, i was told (in the bug) it would just be a metapackage that pulls in -cli
<ogra_> seemingly it isnt
 * ogra_ doesnt do any snappy development on the snappy code ... thats all happeneing in some telegram group nowadays, so hard to follow)
<Laney> awesome
<ogra_> try asking Chipaca or mvo
 * Laney goes to #snappy
<Laney> ttyl
<willcooke> oops
<willcooke> I just did a bzr add *
<willcooke> when really I wanted to add only some files
<willcooke> can I undo that add * easily?
<ogra_> bzr revert ?
<willcooke> will I lose my other changes then?
<ogra_> hmm, if you didnt commit inbetween you will, yes
<ogra_> (unless you do a revert for only the added files ... i.e. file by file)
<willcooke> meh
<willcooke> it's only a dozen files or so that I need to add
<willcooke> so I think I'll just mv the dir, branch again and then move them back
<willcooke> thx ogra_
<ogra_> np
<attente> willcooke: you could try committing and then uncommitting maybe
<attente> actually.. nvm. i'm not sure if that actually undoes the add
<willcooke> yeah
<willcooke> no worries, I've just copied the files in to a new branch
<willcooke> cyphermox, MP up for slideshow.... https://code.launchpad.net/~willcooke/ubiquity-slideshow-ubuntu/ubiquity-slideshow-ubuntu/+merge/289826
 * willcooke will email the doc team now
<willcooke> s/doc/translators
<willcooke> GunnarHj, just seen your email on the doc team ML.  Did you get a master animal file?  I have an SVG here I can put somewhere useful
<cyphermox> willcooke: thanks
<cyphermox> willcooke: would you ask on #ubuntu-release if you need any freeze exception for the slideshow changes?
<willcooke> cyphermox, sure thing
<willcooke> cyphermox, moving the conversation here to save noise in release
<willcooke> I changed "Ubuntu Software Center" to "included Software center"
<willcooke> since it's not USC any more
<willcooke> but I think it *is* still "The" Ubuntu software center
<willcooke> what do you think?
<willcooke> maybe we don't need to change that at all, and then no work for translators
<cyphermox> up to you
<cyphermox> how is it showing in the Dash?
<willcooke> "Software"
<cyphermox> hrm
<cyphermox> well, the test script doesn't work for me
<willcooke> oh
<willcooke> wfm
<willcooke> maybe I missed a file
<willcooke> lemme branch my branch in to tmp and see if it works there
<willcooke> bah
<willcooke> cyphermox, fixed
<cyphermox> yeah it was just missing all the pngs
<willcooke> so before I push this again, any thoughts on that text... I'm thinking that I will change it back to Ubuntu software center
<cyphermox> well, it's just Gnome Software
<cyphermox> to me, it's up to you, either way is fine
<willcooke> I was thinking more of the concept of an Ubuntu Store
<cyphermox> it depends a lot more on how it titles itself
<cyphermox> ie. when running if it says "Software center" then we should use that
<willcooke> oh, I should change the LO icons too....
<willcooke> .. no they are the same
<willcooke> cyphermox, done: https://code.launchpad.net/~willcooke/ubiquity-slideshow-ubuntu/ubiquity-slideshow-ubuntu/+merge/289831
<willcooke> sorry for the faff
<willcooke> no no no no
<willcooke> ffs
<willcooke> cyphermox, oki, last time I think....
<willcooke> https://code.launchpad.net/~willcooke/ubiquity-slideshow-ubuntu/ubiquity-slideshow-ubuntu/+merge/289835
<willcooke> I've updated the pot files this time.
<willcooke> I suck.
<cyphermox> good to review now?
<willcooke> cyphermox, yeah.  Sorry :(
<cyphermox> willcooke: hey, I'm not complaining. I can understand starting things over again, I like being careful
<cyphermox> now the slideshow looks so tasty I want to lick it
<willcooke> \o/
<willcooke> cyphermox, do I need to do anything now to make it merge, or is that auto magic?
<cyphermox> the magic is already happening, I'm doing the merge
<willcooke> ha, nice one.  Thanks cyphermox
<cyphermox> np.
<GunnarHj> willcooke: Hi, I just saw your message to the ubuntu-translators list. Haven't seen the name "Ubuntu Software Store" anywhere else; just "Software".
<willcooke> "Software" is the app, "Ubuntu Software Store" is the entity
<GunnarHj> willcooke: Ok, that makes sense. Probably. ;)
<willcooke> :)
<willcooke> GunnarHj, do you still need that animal image?
<GunnarHj> willcooke: Yes, indeed.
<GunnarHj> willcooke: Do you have access to it?
<willcooke> Yeah, design sent me an svg to use in the slideshow (after they sent me a 300 x 300 px jpg)
<willcooke> I'll forward you the email I got...
<GunnarHj> willcooke: Excellent, thanks!
<GunnarHj> willcooke: gunnarhj@ubuntu.com
<willcooke> GunnarHj, thx
<willcooke> GunnarHj, you've got mail
<GunnarHj> willcooke: Yep, got it.
<willcooke> quittin' time.  Night all
<GunnarHj> exit
#ubuntu-desktop 2016-03-23
<ric_s> Laney, mihall119, Are you there? Can you help me answer this question?
<ric_s> https://sourceforge.net/p/xoscope/bugs/20/#2eef
<ric_s> mhall119
<sarnold> Trevinho: does 1552537 make any sense to you? two people report it on wily and xenial :/
<Trevinho> sarnold: I can't reproduce that as well...
<sarnold> Trevinho: thanks for giving it a look. I've got a feeling that it's user-induced somehow -- it almost always is :) -- but these reports never have enough to go on :(
<Trevinho> sarnold: sure, it's better to check.
<hikiko>  hi
<pitti> Good morning
<willcooke> morning all
<Laney> morning
<davmor2> Laney: guten tag
<Laney> hey davmor2
<Laney> wie gehts?
<davmor2> meh and it's too early in the morning for mehs
<davmor2> and too late in the week too
<Laney> it's all going to be A OK!
 * Sweet5hark1 lols at the npm javascript jenga breakdown.
<Laney> oh cute, I'm seeing the new slideshow
<Laney> is it me or should the gnome-software screenshot not have a bit of wallpaper on the rhs?
<Laney> the others don't
<willcooke> Laney, doh!
<willcooke> you're right
 * willcooke fires up gimp
<Laney> heh
<willcooke> Laney, have you got that screenshot link handy?
<willcooke> I can probably grep for it
<Laney> VERY!
<Laney> http://people.canonical.com/~laney/weird-things/g-s.png
<willcooke> supe
<willcooke> r
<Laney> I don't visit many other website with "weird" in the url
<willcooke> hah!
<willcooke> I tried "laney" in mine, but nothing
 * Laney is a clickbait nonclicker
<Sweet5hark1> "Ten things that Laney made me click -- see if those links will make you click too!"
<willcooke> You won't believe ten things laney doesn't click on
<Laney> number 8 made me spit out my coffee!
<willcooke> :D:D:D
<Laney> "You have just inserted a medium"
<Laney> #shitubuntusays
<willcooke> urgh
 * Laney is going to use said medium to look at the hidpi ubiquity session
<Laney> back shortly
<Laney> realised that I don't have anywhere to install the thing to though which is a tad annoying
<willcooke> can you repartition your drive?
<willcooke> borrow 10GB from swap for a few hours?
<darkxst> Laney, speaking of hidpi, plymouth upstream git now has hidpi support (but no release as yet) do we want to cherry-pick those patches?
<Laney> darkxst: I know a-nothing, talk to slangasek maybe
<Laney> have you tried it?
<darkxst> Laney, I don't have a hidpi laptop, but ricotz says it works well
<ricotz> Laney, darkxst, jfyi a package is locate here https://launchpad.net/~ricotz/+archive/ubuntu/staging/+packages?field.name_filter=&field.status_filter=published&field.series_filter=xenial
<willcooke> Laney, slideshow fix:  http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~willcooke/ubiquity-slideshow-ubuntu/ubiquity-slideshow-ubuntu/revision/735
<willcooke> Laney, will MP it
<Laney> thx
<willcooke> cyphermox, sorry (again).  Last one.  I'm fairly sure this time ;)  https://code.launchpad.net/~willcooke/ubiquity-slideshow-ubuntu/ubiquity-slideshow-ubuntu/+merge/289880
<Laney> darkxst: ricotz: Suggest you speak to slangasek, IMO it would be nice but it's not my decision
<desrt> good morning!
<willcooke> hi desrt
<davmor2> willcooke: one partially successful install from pending \o/
<davmor2> willcooke: now to see if oem kills it
<willcooke> davmor2, what changed?
<davmor2> willcooke: I think infinity fixed the locale/glibc changes he made I could be wrong though
<Laney> *I* fixed the locale problem and he fixed the vte one which was stopping ubiquity from launching
<Laney> iz gud
<Laney> what's up desrt
<willcooke> desrt, Laney - any thoughts on this one:  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libunity/+bug/1538471
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1538471 in libunity (Ubuntu) "scope-runner-dbus.py assert failure: *** Error in `/usr/bin/python3': free(): invalid next size (fast): 0x0000000001ca17b0 ***" [Medium,Confirmed]
<willcooke> jamesh thinks he's narrowed it down to gir
<davmor2> Laney: you're awesome sir remind me to slap you less ;)
<andyrock> hey all
<willcooke> hi andyrock
<andyrock> bad news we got a core file
<andyrock> but it's empty
<willcooke> ha
<willcooke> useful
<andyrock> https://www.irccloud.com/pastebin/P8dvdGBx/
<willcooke> handy
<andyrock> but this error can be releated: Fatal IO error 11 (Resource temporarily unavailable) on X server :0.
<andyrock> but still not sure if it's the cause or a result of the bug
<willcooke> andyrock, whats next to try?
<willcooke> hikiko mentioned that there were some broken packages as well?
<hikiko> yes
<andyrock> i'll try to save the core file and restore the snapshot
<andyrock> likely we get a full bt
<hikiko> andyrock, I've dist upgraded manually
<Sweet5hark1> <- out: dentist
<hikiko> and I see many problems here and there
<hikiko> I believe that if  we fix broken packages/dependencies etc
<hikiko> the session wont crash
<hikiko> I'll note down the errors
<hikiko> and send them to cyphermox
<hikiko> he might be able to make more sense
<hikiko> andyrock, I got no logs from the gui upgrade either
<andyrock> mmm
<hikiko> because the filesystem was corrupted after the crash
<hikiko> it's very improbable
<hikiko> that compiz causes this problem especially when the bug is "can't find libc"
<andyrock> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-release-upgrader/+bug/1555237/comments/10
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1555237 in ubuntu-release-upgrader (Ubuntu) "Upgrade from 14.04.4â 16.04 dies midway taking out the session." [Critical,In progress]
<andyrock> here he's able to make the session crash just upgrading few packages
<hikiko> could be helpful :)
<hikiko> andyrock,
<hikiko> tbh I don't understand how
<hikiko> it points out a problem in compiz?
<hikiko> how did he end up with these packages?
<hikiko>  insserv: warning: script 'cron' missing LSB tags and overrides
<hikiko> I got this one too for another package
<willcooke> for the record: It may indeed turn out to not be a problem in Compiz (quite likely in fact, but lets see) - however, the point here is not to rule out compiz but to narrow it down to what *is* causing the problem so that we can get it fixed.
<hikiko> (willcooke's comment)
<hikiko> that looks much more relevant
<hikiko> to the error
<hikiko> I believe that we have to fix the packages anyway
<hikiko> what I would do
<hikiko> is to dist-upgrade manually
<hikiko> and fix every broken package
<hikiko> every time it stops with an error
<hikiko> and then try the visual upgrade
<hikiko> the problem is
<hikiko> I don't know how to do the fixes at all :/
<hikiko> if someone could help on that
<hikiko> we could make sure that there aren't any upgrade blockers
<hikiko> when I perform the visual upgrade something is so broken that causes a kernel panic
<hikiko> and the error is that there's no root fs
<hikiko> without a proper fs
<hikiko> it's impossible to retrieve any other info
<hikiko> plus we ll have to fix the packages anyway
<hikiko> because we would like the user to be able to complete the dist-upgrase
<hikiko> upgrade*
<andyrock> well the kernel panic can be a result of a unity crash
<andyrock> because the unity crash can cause an X crash
<andyrock> so if you leave the upgrade in a bad moment you can get a kernel crash
<cyphermox> hikiko: things do *not* stop with an error. As the dist-upgrade gets done, compiz crashes and the session gets taken down before you can finish the upgrade, and it would continue if only there was still X to display prompts
<cyphermox> hikiko: you may use an older image to test that, or a newer one than 20160322 provided that glibc was fixed
<cyphermox> ie. glibc is a different issue that is already being fixed
<Laney> s/being//
<Laney> on the latest one anyway
<hikiko> cyphermox, which images you suggest I use?
<hikiko> when I dist upgrade, compiz doesnt crash
<cyphermox> 20160323 should be good, I think
<cyphermox> hikiko: no, it's not *just* upgrading compiz
<cyphermox> you also need to wait for the screensaver to kick in
<hikiko> so cyphermox what's the theory?
<hikiko> that the screensaver crashes the visual update?
<hikiko> and leaves the system in a weird condition?
<cyphermox> I have no idea. compiz crashes, I upgraded manually until there was just the few desktop packages left I wrote down in my comment, because I couldn't reduce it any more than that
<cyphermox> and in between I'd let the screensaver activate to try and get the system to crash again
<cyphermox> I don't know enough about X or GL or compiz to know why the screensaver would change anything for compiz
<hikiko> is it possible
<cyphermox> that's why we asked for help
<hikiko> that the screensaver
<hikiko> uses a library that is upgraded by one of those packages
<hikiko> and that's why it crashes?
<cyphermox> that's still X or desktop.
<cyphermox> have you tried upgrading things at all?
<hikiko> cyphermox,
<andyrock> cyphermox: X crashes as well here
<hikiko> if you disable the screensaver
<hikiko> you still have the issue
<hikiko> x crashes too
<cyphermox> hikiko: sure. if you prefer you may well look into that crash?
<hikiko> cyphermox, I'm looking at it but it seems to me that the crash is a consequency of the upgrade crash
<cyphermox> the upgrade does not appear to crash, what makes you think that?
<hikiko> I think pitti had the same prob with willcooke and me and saw a similar message for insserv and cron
<hikiko> cyphermox,
<hikiko> after the crash I rebooted
<cyphermox> do you have a stack trace?
<hikiko> and got a kernel panic
<hikiko> no
<hikiko> the fs was in bad state
<cyphermox> sure, but that's normal if the system freezes while you upgrade
<hikiko> my theory is that:
<cyphermox> our goal is for the system not to freeze and the X session not to die while upgrading
<hikiko> either a post installation script is doing something or something is missing and makes x crash
<hikiko> or
<hikiko> a visual program crashes and stops the upgrade
<hikiko> but I think 1 is more possible
<hikiko> because I had dist-upgrade problems
<hikiko> plus
<hikiko> compiz seems to crash because it cant find libc
<cyphermox> hikiko: we asked for help because it would be very nice if you could look into the compiz crash itself or the X crash or whatever, and see if that can be fixed -- if a postinst script tries to do things and causes a crash, it is overwhelmingly still likely to be a bug
<hikiko> if libc is missing
<hikiko> how could i fix that in compiz?
<cyphermox> hikiko: we'll always be replacing libraries from under things. that's what upgrades do, and it wouldn't be different from what upgrading from wily to xenial would do, or vivid to wily
<cyphermox> something is triggering that crash, and perhaps there is a way to avoid it
<cyphermox> as mentioned earlier, even if you disable the screensaver the whole session eventually freezes, that's verybad and if we'll need help to figure that out too
<hikiko> I agree
<hikiko> wait
<hikiko> you mean that
<hikiko> before the crash
<hikiko> you disabled the screensaver during the upgrade
<hikiko> and got a crash?
<cyphermox> I tried both things
<hikiko> sorry I didn't understand that
<cyphermox> with the screensaver, as soon as the screensaver starts, compiz crashes and I get thrown back to lightdm, and then I can't login
<hikiko> that's during the upgrade?
<hikiko> what are the steps to reproduce?
<hikiko> you start the update manager in compiz
<hikiko> then?
<cyphermox> without the screensaver (with the screensaver disabled), the upgrade seems to continue slightly longer but eventually the session *freezes*, I can't move the mouse anymore
<cyphermox> you just run 'sudo update-manager -d' in a unity session
<hikiko> that's what I do
<hikiko> but in my case
<hikiko> the screensaver doesn't seem to do anything
<hikiko> just
<hikiko> at some point
<hikiko> with or without screensaver
<hikiko> everything blacks out
<hikiko> and when I ssh
<hikiko> I see no logs and X or compiz running
<hikiko> and if I reboot
<hikiko> I get the kernel panic
<hikiko> and the message is that the fs cant be mounted
<cyphermox> we explicitly can't care about what happens after you reboot
<cyphermox> in this case, the upgrade has not completed so the system may be in any state
<Laney> davmor2: want to confirm bug #1560973 / dupe it if you already know?
<ubot5> bug 1560973 in Ubuntu "EFI booting Ubuntu image to grub removes existing boot entries" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1560973
<hikiko> cyphermox, question:
<andyrock> i'll try to run the upgrader without compiz
<andyrock> on top of metacity
<hikiko> the new lts has cron or uses the systemd cron?
<hikiko> +1 andyrock
<davmor2> Laney: I'll take a look in a second for you just need to finish off test the bit's I'm doing currently
<Laney> ja
<cyphermox> hikiko: I have no idea about cron
<cyphermox> either way the usage should be the same
<hikiko> cron stops
<hikiko> before the crash
<hikiko> I don't know if it's relevant or not
<hikiko> but I got the same message as willcooke and I think pitti got it too
<hikiko> I don't know if it's worth investigating
<Laney> muktupavels: hey, do you know if metacity is supposed to be all good with hidpi?
<Laney> trying to understand https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubiquity/+bug/1560162 (sorry for the inflammatory title)
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1560162 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "Xenial: scaling is horribly out on xps13 install session" [Undecided,New]
<muktupavels> Laney: probably not...
<Laney> seems like window placement / decoration drawing is not right
<Trevinho> Laney: can you ack https://requests.ci-train.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/1157 ?
<Trevinho> Laney: also... Hey! :)
<Laney> ok
<Laney> hi Trevinho
<Laney> how goes?
<Trevinho> quite good, you?
<Laney> lots of weird stuff going on
<Trevinho> weird?
<Laney> just bugs
<muktupavels> Laney: metacity most likly need something like this - https://git.gnome.org/browse/mutter/commit/?id=57c1078ee742d9f01e80e7fe05c88adfec4b4ac3
<muktupavels> I have not done that because I have no HiDPI display :(
<Laney> muktupavels: do they have something for window placement too?
<Laney> ubiquity has GTK_WIN_POS_CENTER_ALWAYS
<Laney> but you can see it's being positioned in the bottom right
<Laney> you can set some keys / environment variables to use 2Ã scaling
 * Laney will try on the installed system anyways, but after lunch
<Laney> probably have to look at glib/s390x too, which still hangs
<muktupavels> Laney: don't remember
<Laney> ok
<muktupavels> Laney: do you know what environment variables I should use?
<davmor2> Laney: so oddly it removed the efi entry for the first ubuntu install however it added it correctly from grub2 so now I guess I really need to test against something other than ubuntu so I'll dig out an image from somewhere
<davmor2> Laney: I assume the issue is that the files and path are the same
<davmor2> Laney: feel free to change the title of that bug to something more manageable for yourself, I just write what I see and hope it makes sense :D
<mvo> Laney: hi, sorry for the trouble with ubuntu-snappy, please just seed ubuntu-snappy-cli instead of ubuntu-snappy
<Sweet5hark1> re from the dentist (still drugged though)
<Laney> mvo: ok
<Laney> davmor2: what do you mean with 'added'?
<mvo> Laney: I just uploaded a new ubuntu-snappy that ensures its all working with ubuntu-snappy-cli
<Laney> davmor2: note I don't have anything other than xenial installed
<Trevinho> ricotz: abi-fixed bamf should be in proposed
<davmor2> Laney: so the EFI folder path and file names for Ubuntu installs are the same so it looks to me like they overwrite with the newer version installed.  However there is a new entry in Grub2 for the older install which I think is expected, I'm installing fedora now and I'll do a side by side with that as then the paths should be different
<ricotz> Trevinho, great :)
<Laney> davmor2: why is it overwriting anything if I just look at the menu and then turn the system off?
<Laney> cyphermox: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/1560973 -> grub2, or something else?
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1560973 in Ubuntu "EFI booting Ubuntu image to grub removes existing boot entries and makes system unbootable" [Undecided,New]
<davmor2> Laney: I don't know, one for the foundations team
<Laney> davmor2: yeah, just throwing it out there :P
<Trevinho> ricotz: it should also fix your issue with new starting bamf app created with no desktop file. Although as you said you should fix plank to properly show them
<Laney> you don't need to investigate that much
<Trevinho> or launchers around
<cyphermox> Laney: yeah, grub possibly, though I can't see why it would change anything on the hardware
<davmor2> Laney: no I'm just doing a side by side with another os to see if the efi entries are kept then I am assuming they will be but it is always good to know that too
<cyphermox> Laney: either it's that or it's some freak BIOS bug
<davmor2> cyphermox, Laney: grub2.  Grub doesn't support efi
<Laney> it was more 'grub2 or some other component completely?' :)
<cyphermox> ^ indeed, but nobody uses grub-not-2.
<Laney> cyphermox: yeah, I don't have any other efi installs to check against though I'm afraid
 * Laney has grub2-ified it
<cyphermox> Laney: I should be able to reproduce on my hardware.
<Laney> 'k
<cyphermox> if not, it's a BIOS issue
<Laney> good job we're friends with superm1
<cyphermox> haha yeah ;)
<cyphermox> oh, wait
<cyphermox> Laney: is that a new install?
<cyphermox> what image did you use?
<Laney> 20160323
<cyphermox> fun.
<Laney> just looking at the grub-efi menu thing
<cyphermox> could it be the install itself that confused your BIOS?
<Laney> you know the one that appears from the install
<Laney> s/install/image/
<cyphermox> wait
<Laney> before you even get to ubiquity or anything
<cyphermox> I mean, the system you used to write the image, was it a newly-installed system?
<Laney> erm
<Laney> no
<cyphermox> ok
<Laney> I just dd-ed it from my regular install
<cyphermox> ok
<cyphermox> there's a strong smell of BIOS, in any case
<davmor2> cyphermox: confirmed the initial issue if you install ubuntu along side ubuntu I'm just trying fedora23 with ubuntu alongside now to see if that behaves differently I'm hoping it does :)
<cyphermox> davmor2: what initial issue?
<davmor2> cyphermox: the efi one
<cyphermox> bug #? or are you talking about the same thing as Laney?
<davmor2> cyphermox: same one as Laney
<davmor2> man fedora takes an age to install
<cyphermox> well, it's not the same thing if you're installing two things on the same disk side by side
<hikiko> andyrock, and cyphermox I check the post inst scripts that have warnings or errors to see if i find something relevant
<andyrock> i just managed to reproduce the crash with metacity
<hikiko> i told you it cant be compiz
<hikiko> the other things i want to check is:
<hikiko> 1 libc is multi arch did we changed the dirs?
<andyrock> cyphermox hikiko i always get the crash after udev restarting
<hikiko> me too
<hikiko> and the gvfs-common
<hikiko> is the last package i see here
<hikiko> so we must probably check its scripts
<hikiko> but I have to go
<hikiko> I ll be back later to continue investigating
<hikiko> I just wanted to let you know what I am looking at
<hikiko> maybe you get some better ideas
<cyphermox> andyrock: crash with metacity> the session dies and you get back to the login screen?
<andyrock> i don't get back to loginscreen
<andyrock> but x died
<hikiko> libc looks very suspicious to me that's what I am going to check first when i come back
<cyphermox> good enough I suppose
<andyrock> https://www.irccloud.com/pastebin/AVhCBoaU/
<andyrock> cyphermox: ^^^
<cyphermox> hikiko: please show what makes you think it's libc; if that's the issue, we can deal with it by letting infinity look at it hard again
<cyphermox> andyrock: dmesg?
<hikiko> because compiz couldnt find the libc
<hikiko> i think
<hikiko> at the point of the crash
<hikiko> the new libc
<hikiko> is installed
<cyphermox> right, but what was compiz doing at the time?
<hikiko> BUT
<cyphermox> do you have a backtrace?
<hikiko> the dynamic loader
<hikiko> still looks at the old directories
<hikiko> i am going to check if it works
<hikiko> in i386
<cyphermox> please show logs for this
<hikiko> when i come back
<hikiko> andyrock,
<hikiko> do you have the log
<hikiko> cyphermox, it was andy's
<hikiko> he pasted it yesterday
<cyphermox> if it's an issue with libc's pt_chown or something, it might already have been fixed in the new image
<hikiko> cyphermox, sorry I haave to go I ll look at it tonight and ping you
<hikiko> sorry
<hikiko> +it's just a theory
<hikiko> I am not sure
<hikiko> bbl
<cyphermox> mmkay
<andyrock> cyphermox i don't have it, i already restarted the vm
<andyrock> i'll try to see if I can get a bt of Xorg
<andyrock> because it's Xorg that's crashing with or without unity/compiz
<cyphermox> well, I suppose that's good news
<Laney> mvo: Guess this wants to wait until after beta now
<Laney> but I've seeded it anyway
<mvo> Laney: thanks
<Trevinho> desrt: you here?
<andyrock> https://www.irccloud.com/pastebin/Wl0AcISq/
<andyrock> cyphermox ^^^
<andyrock> do you think it's the libc bug that has already been solved?
<Laney> pitti: any chance I/you/we can reboot 'aupkg01' to get it on the -15 kernel?
<pitti> Laney: sure
<Laney> I'm abusing it a little bit to try to reproduce this blasted glib2.0 hang
<desrt> Trevinho: at lunch.  bbiab.
<Laney> pitti: JFDI or something more?
<Laney> stop workers I guess
<pitti> Laney: if you want to be kind, pkill worker and let the current tests finish (or at least settle down a bit)
 * Laney nod
<pitti> Laney: actually, there's just two pyzmq tests running for 4/7 hours which look stuck
<pitti> Laney: so yes, stop workers, dist-upgrade, and reboot
<cyphermox> andyrock: no idea tbh
<Trevinho> desrt: ok, enjoy... Let me know when you're back
<andyrock> cyphermox: is the bug fixed in the last image?
<cyphermox> andyrock: it doesn't look that way, and it seems to me like writes should just work too
<cyphermox> andyrock: yeah, the bug I was thinking of should laready be fixed in the last image (20160323)
<GunnarHj> infinity: Hi Adam, did you notice bug #1560577? If you think my latest idea (minor script modifications) is ok, I can make a real patch. Suppose that change could be accepted in Debian as well.
<ubot5> bug 1560577 in glibc (Ubuntu) "Confusing new locale-gen behavior" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1560577
<infinity> GunnarHj: Try again with -0ubuntu2, that behaviour changed.
<GunnarHj> infinity: Aha, didn't know. Will do.
<desrt> Trevinho: back!
<Trevinho> desrt: so, i've slightly updated the MP for hiding window buttons...
<Trevinho> desrt: it's at https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/gtk/unity-maximized-headerbar-buttons-hide/+merge/288552, basically I'm checking whether the headerbar is also the toplevel's titlebar before hiding stuff...
<Trevinho> desrt: but, we can't avoid to do that if we don't want a double-title/buttons
<desrt> in the case where the headerbar contains controls maybe we could hide the title label itself?
<Trevinho> I don't think that would cause any breakage since these values are still shown.
<davmor2> cyphermox, Laney: so after an hour and 3 minute installing fedora turns out they lvm by default thankfully I haz t'interwebz to help me modify it all.  I now have ubuntu and fedora cohabiting and both entries show in uefi menu
<Laney> ok...
<Laney> what does this teach us?
<Trevinho> desrt: which kind of controls you mean?=
<davmor2> fedora's path is EFI/fedora/shim.... and ubuntu's is EFI/ubuntu/shim...
<desrt> like all the stuff that apps like gedit shove into the headerbar
<desrt> we don't want to hide this stuff
<Trevinho> desrt: in fact we don't.
<Trevinho> desrt: only the title label is hidden and the window controls (close, maximize, hide)
<desrt> ah.  i see that.
<Trevinho> desrt: I'm also tempted to force the window contls to always stay left in unity... But that might be too much :P
<desrt> looks pretty reasonable
<Trevinho> desrt: this is the same app here with the current patch in both restored and maximized state: http://imgur.com/a/VETka
<desrt> looks good indeed
<desrt> i have no further comments about the patch
<Trevinho> desrt: I was thinking also that maybe the headerbar could either hidden if empty (i.e. no custom controls, window buttons, subtitle) when maximized...
<Trevinho> But again I'm not sure whether it's too much :)
<desrt> trying to figure that out is going to be more difficult
<desrt> let's stay with this one for now
<desrt> almost all of the apps are putting something in there anyway
<desrt> so the empty case is uncommon
<Trevinho> well, not sure how it is for normal apps, but fair enough
<Trevinho> desrt: as for forcing the window buttons to always stay left, I don't do that, right? :)
<desrt> please not
<desrt> it certainly has nothing to do with the issue at hand
<Trevinho> yeah, I agree.. that would be too much :)
<Trevinho> Laney: then... Since seb is enjoying his free time, could you please sponsor https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/gtk/unity-maximized-headerbar-buttons-hide/+merge/288552 for me?
<Trevinho> I'd like to land the theme changes as well then
<Laney> tomorrow
<Trevinho> Laney: sure, no rush
<Trevinho> thanks
 * Laney weeps
<willcooke> Laney, if you have the inspector set up, you could try this simple idea for the linked buttons:
<willcooke> http://paste.ubuntu.com/15481356
<willcooke> seems the linked buttons in 3.18 are a bit buggy
<Laney> it's better, basically makes them unlinked
<Laney> buggy why?
<willcooke> the separator between the linked buttons is always there
<willcooke> you can style it
<willcooke> *except* it does respond to a border-radius
<willcooke> so I made it the same as the buttons, and then enlarged the border image a bit to make it look like they are unlinked
<willcooke> also raveit65 the MATE theme guy said they were
<willcooke> :)
<Laney> finding it hard to conjure up much sympathy :)
<Laney> trying to style a linked button to be unlinked ...
<willcooke> :)
<willcooke> fair
<willcooke> testing with the widget factory now
<willcooke> found 1 problem already
<willcooke> oh, no
<willcooke> thats not changed by this
<willcooke> cyphermox, BTW, do you think that latest change to the slideshow will get in to the beta?
<willcooke> cyphermox, low priority of course
<Trevinho> desrt: I've quickly played with the headerbar to hide it when there's nothing to show in unity... It would be something like this: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/15481404/
<Trevinho> what you think?
<cyphermox> willcooke: should already be in: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubiquity-slideshow-ubuntu/109
<willcooke> cyphermox, ah... https://code.launchpad.net/~willcooke/ubiquity-slideshow-ubuntu/ubiquity-slideshow-ubuntu/+merge/289880
<willcooke> cyphermox, this *really* is it now.
<willcooke> well, for today at least
<cyphermox> ok, so you mean one new change on top?
<willcooke> yeah
<cyphermox> that won't be in the beta ;)
<willcooke> nw
<willcooke> sorry to be a pita
<cyphermox> no problem
<cyphermox> I'll merge it in a bit, once I'm done with this keyboard magic
<willcooke> thanks cyphermox
<willcooke> in the meantime I'll carry on reading about steganography.
<willcooke> totally unrelated
<cyphermox> willcooke: aren't stegosaurii extinct? ;)
<willcooke> no, you just can't see them
<willcooke> ;D
<Laney> nn
<muktupavels> Laney: maybe this will help - https://git.gnome.org/browse/mutter/commit/src/ui/ui.c?id=d7c4f57aaebcd1e6da7a7b343765c0c4b6b81b25
<sarnold> :D
<Laney> muktupavels: will try to look tomorrow
<willcooke> Laney, think I've found a better fix... WIP
<Laney> cool
<muktupavels> Laney: with gsettings set org.gnome.desktop.interface scaling-factor 2 it works better :)
<muktupavels> Laney: https://git.gnome.org/browse/metacity/commit/?h=gnome-3-18&id=d06393b4952333883d66c2b0d570eedc19e8e7a0
<willcooke> gannin' for me tea. bbl
<davmor2> willcooke: ZOMG upgrade is only working
<davmor2> jibel: ^
<davmor2> well so far at least but I'm pretty sure it has got further than before
<davmor2> cyphermox: ^
<jibel> davmor2, you must have done something wrong
<flocculant> davmor2: still hangs for me from 14.04 to now and appears to have crashed
<davmor2> flocculant: don't ruin my optimism with your facts ;)
<davmor2> jibel: who knows
<davmor2> oh oh it just greyed out :(
<jibel> heh
<flocculant> davmor2: I did fleetingly think about doing a davmor2 - you have to be joking, no it isn't in #x-dev :p
<davmor2> oh just kicked back in
<davmor2> libreadlines obviously just takes some setting up
<flocculant> davmor2: I left mine all afternoon while off doing my real job - came back - hard reboot - booted into xenial desktop somehow - had to dpkg --configure -awholelotofthings then it's there :)
<davmor2> flocculant: lalala I can't hear you :P
<flocculant> :)
<davmor2> flocculant: it's all your fault it was installing fine till you said it wouldn't ;)
<flocculant> \o/
<flocculant> I have a use finally :p
<davmor2> jibel, willcooke: Looks like it kernel panics/locks up the system at gvfs-common
<davmor2> cyphermox: ^
<davmor2> still it got further than before \o/
<jibel> davmor2, is it in a VM?
<davmor2> jibel: it is
<davmor2> jibel: takes too long to reinstall on hardware to test there for fun :)
<jibel> davmor2, yeah, just wanted to confirm.
<davmor2> flocculant: you in vm too I assume right?
<willcooke> Laney, better fix I think:  https://pastebin.canonical.com/152650/
<cyphermox> davmor2: ack
<willcooke> Laney, for you consideration:  https://code.launchpad.net/~willcooke/ubuntu-themes/ubuntu-themes-linkedbuttons/+merge/289967
<willcooke> *your
<qengho> Man, I dislike git's "ui".
<GunnarHj> infinity: Nice improvements in the latest locale-gen. :) Still found a couple of issues, and make a new diff (attached to bug #1560577). Would appreciate if you could take a look.
<ubot5> bug 1560577 in glibc (Ubuntu) "Confusing new locale-gen behavior" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1560577
<davmor2> cyphermox: oem install is definitely not right on kvm will try on hardware now
<cyphermox> don't worry, multiple reports of oem not quite right; I'm going to have a lot to do there
<davmor2> cyphermox: by tomorrow :o
<davmor2> cyphermox, willcooke: looks like the end user slide show is missing slides not sure why as the installers is correct unless willcooke renamed them?
<davmor2> cyphermox: and then it never completes the end user install so you are left with the oem account on the system and nothing else
<willcooke> davmor2, I see the issue.. sec...
<cyphermox> davmor2: not by tomorrow
<willcooke> cyphermox, those were the sym links I was worried about
<davmor2> cyphermox: but tomorrow is the release of beta final ;)
<cyphermox> slideshow isn't release-critical
<cyphermox> and oem has fewer users than keyboards ;)
<willcooke> cyphermox, davmor2 - fixed:  https://code.launchpad.net/~willcooke/ubiquity-slideshow-ubuntu/ubiquity-slideshow-ubuntu/+merge/289974
<davmor2> willcooke: nice :)
<davmor2> 1 down
<TheMuso> willcooke: I did respond to the bug. As it is, the indicator as it was before didn't really work for the mate flavour anyway. Sure you could select a profile, but nothing would really be changed, due to the gsettings being geared to Unity only, and the hard coded profile code not containing any mate settings.
<TheMuso> The cleanest way forward is to add support for mate/GNOME flavours, which would need an FFE.
<willcooke> ack, thanks TheMuso - lets see if they can get some people to help
<willcooke> can someone tell me how I attach a branch to a bug?
<willcooke> Is it too late once I've pushed it up to LP?
<willcooke> wait, I think I see it
<willcooke> yeah, done
<TheMuso> willcooke: You're up late. :)
<willcooke> fixing bugs!
<willcooke> Doing some real work
<TheMuso> Yeah, good enough. :)
<willcooke> )
<willcooke> :)
<willcooke> right, got another fix sorted.
<willcooke> Got one for rb to run by design tomorrow
<willcooke> night all
<TheMuso> willcooke: Since you're around, I don't have anything pressing to talk about in our one on one tomorrow your time, so unless you do, I am happy to allow you some extra sleep tomorrow morning if you like. :)
<TheMuso> damn missed him.
#ubuntu-desktop 2016-03-24
<hikiko> Hi
<pitti> Good morning
<flocculant> morning pitti
<Laney> hey hey
<hikiko> hi Laney
<Laney> hey hikiko
<Laney> happy fake friday
<hikiko> hahahaha
<hikiko> happy fake friday :D
<willcooke> â« âª Hot cross buns, Hot cross buns âª â«
<willcooke> Laney, any thought on this one:  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libunity/+bug/1538471
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1538471 in libunity (Ubuntu) "scope-runner-dbus.py assert failure: *** Error in `/usr/bin/python3': free(): invalid next size (fast): 0x0000000001ca17b0 ***" [Critical,Confirmed]
<willcooke> see comment #25 from jamesh
<Laney> willcooke: I saw that, but not straight away
<willcooke> nw, thx Laney
<Laney> probably bisecting / looking at git would be helpful
<Laney> ricotz: ^? any idea?
<davmor2> willcooke: â« âª Stop! Hammertime â« âª surely that the easiest way to get someone nailed to a hot cross?
<willcooke> ooof
<willcooke> :)
<Laney> it's cool running metacity
<Laney> muktupavels: the patch helps, think we need to scale decorationsn too though so trying to port that other one
<muktupavels> Laney: port from mutter or my wip branch in metacity?
<Laney> you did it already?
<Laney> ah yeah 57c3fb46993a730f01ba8619832dde119f53c863
<Laney> what is wip about it?
<muktupavels> for 3.20, but I have made many changes so it wont apply to 3.18
<Laney> mmm, would like it on 3.18 for xenial
<muktupavels> I have not tested it on HiDPI display, only by changing scaling-factor in dconf-editor...
<Laney> I can check it
<muktupavels> it needs GTK+ 3.20
 * Laney will backport the patches
<muktupavels> Also in 3.20 metacity by default now use GTK+ theme. You will need change settings under org.gnome.metacity.theme.
<davmor2> flocculant: you about?
<davmor2> willcooke: new issue I just went to install from pendrive on hardware and I'm getting Failed to create swap space I assume because it is mounted
<davmor2> how the hell do I access a tty from the ubiquity session
<jibel> davmor2, CTRL+ALT+F1
<davmor2> jibel: that is the ubiquity session and F2-7 give you a black screen with a flashing cursor you can't type in
<ogra_> ctrl-alt-t ?
<willcooke> hikiko, hi!  Any news on that upgrade crasher this morning?
<hikiko> oh willcooke
<hikiko> I was about to ask you on that
<willcooke> that was spooky hikiko  :)
<hikiko> well so far:
<willcooke> andyrock said he was going to do some more playing last night
<hikiko> I fixed 1 post inst script of udev (andy suggested that the udev restart might be relevant) but it didnt fix it just a warning
<hikiko> but
<hikiko> I installed i386
<hikiko> and upgraded successfully
<hikiko> so I think that what I told you yesterday about libc
<hikiko> might be the problem
<hikiko> (libc went multi arch, maybe at the time we get the crash the new libc is installed but the dynamic loader has the previous libc paths)
<hikiko> so, I am now trying to test libc post-inst scripts
<hikiko> the thing is
<hikiko> if we know the libc maintainer...
<hikiko> he might be able to test that
<hikiko> much faster than me
<hikiko> because I am not so familiar
<hikiko> and I google everything
<willcooke> Laney, any ideas who could advise?  ^
<willcooke> someone who knows about libc
<hikiko> also there might be something more simple than that like they forgot to run an ldconfig or so
<hikiko> about libc packaging
<hikiko> not libc
<davmor2> willcooke, jibel: http://people.canonical.com/~davmor2/vids/video20160324_104355766.mp4
<hikiko> anyway, I am going to look at it today if we don't know who is the maintainer
<davmor2> ogra_: ubiquity session not live desktop session so that doesn't work
<willcooke> davmor2, lets see if cyphermox has any ideas when he comes online
 * willcooke has a feeling that today is going to be a long day
<davmor2> willcooke: I knew that Monday
<willcooke> :)
<willcooke> davmor2, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubiquity/+bug/1552539
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1552539 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "Ubiquity Erase Disk and Install Fails to create Swap Space" [Critical,Triaged]
<willcooke> pitti, any clues with that one? ^
<Laney> willcooke: infinity is the maintainer of glibc for us
<willcooke> thx Laney
<willcooke> hikiko,  could you ping infinity when he's on later?
<hikiko> sure willcooke :) thank you!
 * ksamak yawns
 * ksamak finished some more modifs to the zoom algo on compiz
<willcooke> davmor2, we should start collecting a list of all of these issues.  Shall we just a LP tag?  Maybe you already have a process in place?
<willcooke> jibel,  ^
<davmor2> willcooke: I'll be adding it to the iso tracker in a second just caught up on something else for a second
<jibel> willcooke, all the issues should be linked on the iso tracker
<jibel> what davmor2 said
<willcooke> ta :)
<davmor2> willcooke: http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/milestones/358/builds tag to look out for is iso-testing
<Laney> muktupavels: if you have time, could you check out wip/iainl/gnome-3-18-window-scaling please?
<Laney> I'm applying it twice somewhere, the titlebar text looks to be 4Ã
<Laney> and the button spacing too, but maybe the same problem
<muktupavels> Laney: ok, I will check
<Laney> muktupavels: feel free to push fixes to it
<Laney> thanks!
<willcooke> Sooooo
<willcooke> quick recap
<willcooke> hikiko has a theory that ldconfig isn't being called
<hikiko> 2 theories :)
<willcooke> and it looks like a change along these lines went in yesterday:
<willcooke> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/glibc
<willcooke> * Revert dropping the ldconfig wrapper, xenial still has a lot of
<willcooke>     packages that don't ship a trigger but instead call in postinst.
<willcooke>   * Add more belocs options to locale-gen to appease our installers.
<willcooke> Published on 2016-03-23
<willcooke> oh, yeah, hikiko you're right it says release in main
<hikiko> let me re-upgrade
<hikiko> if this doesn't fix it
<hikiko> we have to check if they've updated the paths to be multi-arch everywhere
<willcooke> ack
<hikiko> to see if the dynamic loader looks at the right place
<davmor2> willcooke: on a plus side netboot just passed
<willcooke> nice!
<willcooke> ship it
<desrt> hello ubus
<willcooke> how desrt
<willcooke> howdy
<willcooke> I know I'm a bad typist, but I think the batteries might be running out in this keyboard
<desrt> you use wireless?
 * desrt makes plans to set up a sniffing device
<willcooke> *shame*
<willcooke> yeah
<willcooke> it's ok though, the batteries are nearly flat so it has a range of about 3 inches at the moment ;)
<davmor2> willcooke: buy the logitech solar keyboard no batteries running out there :)
 * willcooke makes a note that davmor2 doesn't do work once its dark
<willcooke> as I always expected
<hikiko> lol
<davmor2> willcooke: I have spots and currently I'm actually using the xps13 laptop keyboard cause you know it's attached to the device and stuff
<davmor2> willcooke: unity8 session I just get a black screen once I get passed the lightdm greeter page
<willcooke> davmor2, which gfx card?
<davmor2> willcooke: intel but on prime setup
<willcooke> could be prime drivers causing it
<davmor2> willcooke: however no nvidia bits installed
<willcooke> oh
<willcooke> still could be related
<willcooke> also, sometimes on first go around it doesn't start
<davmor2> willcooke: that was going to be my test install unity8 session then try and install the nvidia binary to test the additional drivers
<willcooke> try restarting lightdm
<willcooke> only Intel is supported atm, AIUI
<davmor2> willcooke: rebooted same thing
<willcooke> so might not be much point there
<davmor2> willcooke: oh wait it's here no
<davmor2> +w
<willcooke> yeah
<willcooke> it does that
<willcooke> that's why its in universe
<willcooke> :)
<willcooke> davmor2, I would suggest you put U8 session at the bottom of the list.  It will be very good to know whats broken, but right now all I really care about is the default session
<willcooke> until that works, everything can wait
<willcooke> tea, brb
<willcooke> drinking tea, not eating tea
 * desrt wonders why there are not nfc(ish) keyboards
<desrt> for a long time i used one of these things: https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/c9/bc/bb/c9bcbb39b9b1bfe3b52c170d12350767.jpg
<desrt> there's some serious potential there
<desrt> security issues would be vastly reduced and i'm pretty sure it could be done without batteries
<muktupavels> Laney: pushed one commit, should be better, but... Ambiance theme still does not work good, at least with 3.20 it looks better. :(
<muktupavels> Laney: for gnome-3-18 branch use theme: prefix not libmetacity:
<Laney> muktupavels: ok, I copied and pasted it :P
<Laney> muktupavels: title text is still too big, button size looks right though
<muktupavels> Laney: I know, there is also problem with left, right border
<Laney> how is the text scaled?
<muktupavels> meta_frame_style_apply_scale?
<muktupavels> Oh, wait. It is not used with metacity theme...
<muktupavels> Laney: pushed fix for font size.
<Laney> divide by the scale in meta_theme_get_title_scale ?
<muktupavels> yes
<Laney> :)
 * Laney tries that
<flocculant> davmor2: generally not during day till lunchtime ish ...
<davmor2> flocculant: no worries there was already a bug about it so it is fine now :)
<Laney> muktupavels: nice!
<flocculant> I assume it was some sort of upgrade thing :p
<Laney> muktupavels: do you want this pushed to 3.18?
<davmor2> flocculant: nope there is a bug in swap formatting
<flocculant> oh right
<davmor2> willcooke: bug 1546388
<ubot5> bug 1546388 in unity-control-center (Ubuntu) "unity-control-center crashed with SIGSEGV in _cogl_check_extension()" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1546388
<muktupavels> Laney: probably, but it is not ready yet...
<davmor2> willcooke: just been bitten by that on the real hardware install
<muktupavels> Does right/left border looks good to you?
<Laney> good in what way?
<Laney> I don't see any particular problem there
<Laney> I think it's upscaling low resolution images for the window controls though
<Laney> they look blurry
<willcooke> davmor2, does it work if you relaunch it?  Is it broken all the time?
<davmor2> willcooke: all the time
<Laney> davmor2: fresh install?
<muktupavels> can you show screenshot with how it looks for you?
<davmor2> Laney: yeap amd64 bit on my Lenovo ideapad
<Laney> k, talk to tjaalton
<Laney> muktupavels: okay
<davmor2> Laney: crash triggered took me to that bug
<Laney> muktupavels: http://people.canonical.com/~laney/weird-things/metacity.png <- there's a 1px line below the title bar
<muktupavels> Laney: there is also 1px line at left sidze of title bar...
 * Laney stares
<Laney> that is hard to see
<Laney> cyphermox: what's a way to install a package to get it used for only-ubiquity mode?
<Laney> seems vt switching doesn't work
<Laney> will a usb drive work if I break=bottom?!?!
<cyphermox> yeah, it should
<cyphermox> or you could just download the package
<cyphermox> hm, maybe there is no network though ;)
<Laney> no network
<Laney> heh
<Laney> how long can dd-ing /dev/zero to a stick actually take?
 * Laney checks he didn't type /dev/sda
<ogra_> a bit late :P
<willcooke> :D
<Laney> TELL MY WIFE I LOVE HER
<ricotz> a huge and slow stick tend to take its tme
<Laney> it's only 4gb
<ogra_> Laney, really depends on the blocksize you picked
<Laney> probably just slow and crap
<Laney> 8M
<ogra_> that will surely taske 10-15min
<Laney> been like 25
<Laney> whatevs, it's still flashing
<Laney> the activity light thing on it
<ogra_> for me 4GB with bs=64M usually takes 3min on my Sd card reader
<ogra_> max 5 if i do other busy IO stuff
<ogra_> if i turn the blocksize down it takes significantly longer
<Laney> I picked 32M the other way when writing an ISO and my system went crazy
<Laney> scared now :)
<ogra_> well, depends on your ram and IO throughput
<ogra_> (hardware thing)
<Laney> yeah thought it would be good enough
<Laney> new-ish xps 13!
<ricotz> most likely your usb-stick has a problem then
<Laney> as long as it can get a metacity deb into this ubiquity session
<Laney> then it can explode into flames for all I care :)
<ricotz> Laney, btw is there way to update the thunderbolt firmware with linux on a xps 13?
<Laney> dunno
<ricotz> hmm, bios itself is, but this intel thunderbolt thing :\
<Laney> I haven't used it
<Laney> did update the bios a few times though, touchpad woes on the initial firmware
<ricotz> I see, installing windows for that seems overkill
<Laney> you can just put the exe on a stick and do it direct
<Laney> Trevinho: remind me of the gtk branches to upload please?
<Trevinho> Laney: I wanted to, but I didn't want to bother too :)
<Laney> I want to be reminded now
<Trevinho> Laney: https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/gtk/unity-maximized-headerbar-buttons-hide/+merge/288552
<Laney> need to get everything done today, on holiday for 8 days after tonight
<Laney> thx
<Laney> does that make this toolbar-mode thing work?
<Trevinho> Laney: yeah, I heard that
<Trevinho> Laney: yes :)
<Laney> ok
<Trevinho> Laney: it also needs a theme
<Laney> I have the theme
<Trevinho> Laney: it's already in ci-train
<ricotz> Laney, the thunderbolt firmware is not part of the bios afaik
<Laney> silo 067
<Trevinho> I mean, a theme change
<Laney> try it
<Trevinho> Laney: it's in https://requests.ci-train.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/1173
<Laney> nope
<Trevinho> Laney: I'm speaking of the ubuntu-themes change
<Laney> https://requests.ci-train.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/1182
<ogra_> Laney, oh, btw: pkill -USR1 ^dd$
<ogra_> (from a second terminal)
<Laney> what does that do?
<ogra_> will give you the current status
<Laney> huh
<Laney> good tip!
<hikiko> how could someone check if a mirror is updated (apt repo)?
<Trevinho> willcooke: would you like to review https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/ubuntu-themes/toolbar-mode-headerbar-gradient/+merge/288701  (here's how things would look http://imgur.com/a/VETka)?
<willcooke> Trevinho, sure, one mo
<Laney> Trevinho: it makes csd apps get a white border when not maximised?
<Trevinho> Laney: white border? No...
<willcooke> Trevinho, Laney same - white
<Trevinho> that's only using that theme?
<Trevinho> as it shouldn't change anything when not using the gtk patch
<Laney> probably a different one in the landing
<Laney> yeah
<Laney> rebuilding it without one of the mps
<willcooke> Trevinho, also - what am I looking for, the gradient should be light -> dark in which direction?
<Trevinho> willcooke: in which widget or state you mean?
<willcooke> Trevinho, when a csd headbar window is maximized
<Laney> you need the gtk patch?
<willcooke> oh
<willcooke> this one:  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gedit/+bug/1515810  ?
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1515810 in gtk+3.0 (Ubuntu) "Doesn't merge into unity panel when maximized" [High,In progress]
<Trevinho> well, the gtk patch is needed to get that effect. But without the patch you shouldn't get any breakage
<willcooke> oki, well on my fairly standard test install I'm getting white corners
<Trevinho> willcooke: when the window is maximized (rule .maximized .titlebar.header-bar.toolbar-mode:not(:backdrop)), the bg-image should use a gradient tat goes from dark to lighter
<willcooke> Maybe I'm running out of date versions then
<willcooke> I'll upgrade again
<Trevinho> willcooke: the needed gtk is not landed yet... it's what Laney has to do... So maybe we can wait his package and then you can try it later
<willcooke> works for me :)
<Laney> does it fix white corners too?
<Trevinho> Laney: corners are fixed for everything... BUt, gnome-calendar has an issue that is specific to that as well
<willcooke> I am using calendar to test
<Trevinho> Ok,  so calendar is the only one broken I know
<Trevinho> but it's something related ot its theming
<Trevinho> we discussed about that with seb few days ago. Basically if you set background-color: transparent to the gtkwindow is fine
<Trevinho> for some reason it picks a different bg color
<Trevinho> so use gtk3-demo or gtk3-widget-factory to test
<Trevinho> or any other headerbar app
<willcooke> I have a calendar theme fix for highlighting the current day, I could put that theme fix in there as well
<Trevinho> (with this change, we could probably even avoided to patch gedit and others :P)
<Trevinho> willcooke: would be nice
<willcooke> Trevinho, I will wait for the gtk fixes to land, and then I'll take a look
<Trevinho> but I've to figure out what's the best way to do
<willcooke> I'm proposing to add a calendar specific css file
<willcooke> if that makes it any easier?
<willcooke> https://code.launchpad.net/~willcooke/ubuntu-themes/ubuntu-themes-calendar-focus
<Trevinho> willcooke: the workaround for calendar corners is
<Trevinho> GcalWindow { background-color: transparent; }
<Trevinho> but I'm not happy with that, as I'd prefer to fix the root cause...
<Trevinho> for some reason it doesn't pick some of the default values
<willcooke> oki, well let me know when you decide, I can drop it in there easily
<Laney> I uploaded gtk, won't go in until after beta though
<Trevinho> Laney: thanks
<Trevinho> willcooke: I can't find anything better than that right now :(
<Laney> in a whole 10 minutes!
<willcooke> If there isnt a better alternative I will push a new version of the theme with that fix in, but not MP it
<willcooke> well, I'll push it now, so I dont forget
<willcooke> and then if we need it, it's there
<willcooke> Trevinho, sitting here if we need it:  http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~willcooke/ubuntu-themes/ubuntu-themes-calendar-focus/revision/469
<Trevinho> it won't harm in case.. I mean, if we find a better fix, they won't clash
<Trevinho> Thanks
<Laney> Trevinho: It's because it sets a background-color on the window
<Trevinho> Laney: the app itself?
<Laney> it has some css
<Trevinho> ok, i was guessing that
<Laney> no need to guess, we have the source :)
<Trevinho> .views {
<Trevinho>     /* background color of every view */
<Trevinho>     background-color: @theme_base_color;
<Trevinho>     background-image: none;
<Trevinho> }
<Trevinho> Laney: hehe, sure... I just didn't check that before
<Trevinho> Laney: so, what you'd say.. Is it better to fix that css not to include the window or we keep the workaround in themes?
<Trevinho> Laney: I'm just wondering why this won't affect adwaita though
<Trevinho> mh, it might be some other parameter
<Laney> It's really a compiz bug that it is drawing there no?
<Trevinho> Oh, no adwaita is not fine as well, I think
<Trevinho> Laney: no... It's the app that paints there
<Trevinho> App has a rgba surface, it does whatever it wants on that area. Compiz only draws a shadows underneath it.
<Laney> It's correct on gnome-shell
<Trevinho> Laney: using adwaita or ambiance?
<Laney> Adwaita
<Trevinho> ah, ok... For Adwaita is a different thing then... But it shouldn't be anything related to compiz
<Laney> Well it's wrong with both Adwaita and Ambiance under compiz
<Laney> and right with Adwaita under shell
<Laney> so...
<Trevinho> It's a different thing... With different themes also other apps are wrong with Adwaita..
<Trevinho> under unity I mean
<Trevinho> Laney: also in gtk3-demo... Increasing the border radious you can see that there are some tiny corners on top. Which I don't really know who is drawing them: http://i.imgur.com/WybfxIa.png But it's not compiz, for sure
<Trevinho> the fact that the gtk magifier shows them as well, ensures that: http://i.imgur.com/J5HvZ9D.png
<hikiko> infinity,
<hikiko> here?
<infinity> hikiko: ?
<GunnarHj> Anybody who knows who maintains this site:
<GunnarHj> https://apps.ubuntu.com/cat/applications/synaptic/
<GunnarHj> Asking because we link to that page (and a few other pages on the same site) from the web version of the desktop guide, and there seems to be an update need (versions, USC -> the new thing).
<Laney> Trevinho: umm, if not compiz then who?
<Trevinho> Laney: it's gtk the for some reason paints that... I wasn't able to figure out where and why
<Laney> #gtk+ to the rescue!
<Trevinho> it indeed does that only in compiz, probably because of our patch,... But, I'm not able to track it down
<davmor2> willcooke, cyphermox: so guys given the 5 critical bugs and the control center opening issues and you still can't upgrade, what is the plan going forward?
<davmor2> infinity: ^
<davmor2> oh and mokutils issue from additional hardware installs
<willcooke> davmor2, let's move this to -release
<muktupavels> Laney: can you test your branch with cherry-picking 3932dca006d845aa8a85d29d38dcf3f100959e32?
<Laney> muktupavels: you think this is going to fix the borders?
<muktupavels> Laney: it improves decorations for me...
<Laney> let me try it
<muktupavels> Laney: should I push your branch to gnome-3-18? I have updated commit message with commits from master branch.
<Laney> muktupavels: It didn't seem to fix the border for me anyway
<muktupavels> still 1px?
<Laney> looks the same
<muktupavels> it fixed problem that I was seeing.
<Laney> I'm running out of time so I'll upload it to xenial anyway
<Laney> way way better than it was before
<muktupavels> Laney: ok then I will push your branch now to gnome-3-18
<muktupavels> Laney: do you need your wip branch or can it be deleted?
<Laney> muktupavels: if you push it there's no need to keep it any more
<muktupavels> Laney: ok, then I will delete it.
<willcooke> Laney, thank you very much for the pygobject
<Laney> willcooke: np, also fixed the hidpi one
<willcooke> Laney, \m/
<Laney> I'm going to have to come back tomorrow morning to upload gstreamer and fix appstream
<willcooke> thanks a million laney
<Laney> umm
<Laney> willcooke: I have left two things hanging :/
<Laney> maybe you want to find someone to look at them next week
<willcooke> I can certainly try
<Laney> 1. glib2.0 hangs on s390x in its testsuite on the archive builders but I *can* *not* reproduce it
<Laney> that's a blocker to get the stable version in
<Laney> xnox is away too I'm afraid
<Laney> I synced the stable into unapproved
<Laney> so we'll get one more build on the freak chance it started to work
<Laney> but I doubt it
<willcooke> :)
<Laney> maybe someone on foundations could look
<willcooke> kk
<Laney> and the second one is that I totally failed to sponsor any appstream icons
<willcooke> Laney, is there a bug for it?
<Laney> no
<willcooke> np
<Laney> lemme open one
<willcooke> kthx
<Laney> I reckon it's not glib's problem
<Laney> it builds on debian/s390x
<Laney> probably a kernel thing
<willcooke> weird
<infinity> Laney: If it builds on debian but not ubuntu, kernel's one option, the other is -fPIE -pie
<infinity> Laney: Our s390x toolchain defaults to pieness, Debian's doesn't.
<Laney> infinity: I'm brain dumping due to going away for a week
<Laney> infinity: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/glib2.0/+bug/1561698
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1561698 in glib2.0 (Ubuntu) "Build hangs on s390x" [Undecided,New]
<ximion> Laney: the new appstream-generator generates HTML info pages too now - might be just a few weeks until I can try it in a production-like scenario
<ximion> and I should merge some of the pull-requests for the dep11-generator
<ximion> the "suite" thing looks sane for the dep11-gen, for asgen I hope it won't be necessary to implement the same thing
<Laney> ximion: nice, not here now though ;-)
<Laney> I'm going to merge them all into my branch and run a fork I think
<ximion> Laney: sounds reasonable, for the shorter term
<Laney> nod
<ximion> long-term, I will make asgen the default at Debian, because it really is a bad idea to have two implementations of the same thing, especially when all the parsers and data generators in libappstream outperform the Python stuff
<ximion> Laney: for the gettext-foo in dep11gen, I hope I can implement that in the new code easily (it's heavily Ubuntu-specific, so kind of low priority...)
<ximion> asgen will have a way to enable and disable certain featuresets depending on the needs of the project using it, so you can e.g. disable processing of .desktop files w/o metainfo files
<Laney> low priority for you maybe :)
<ximion> priority isn't zero though, I care for Ubuntu ^^
<ximion> with the feature profiles in asgen, implementing distro-specific stuff should become really easy and less controversial
<ximion> Laney: if I make it to London, we can talk about this more - maybe I'll have a fully working implementation by then, even - only screenshots stuff and result-compression is needed to get feature-parity :)
<ximion> oh, and I need to clean up the code a little, so creating a .deb package will be asier
<ximion> *easier
<Laney> ximion: yeah, will be good to see it in action
<Laney> ok, I'm off for the evening
<Laney> back quuuuuuuuuuickly tomorrow to do a couple of things, but otherwise
<Laney> tty in a week and a bit
<ximion> have fun and a nice free time :)
<ximion> I'll continue to nag hughsie and mhall119 meanwhile ^^
<Laney> good luck!
<ximion> thanks! :)
<willcooke> desktoppers - anyone who can, please help with i386 ISO tests: http://iso.qa.ubuntu.com/qatracker/milestones/358/builds/115349/testcases
#ubuntu-desktop 2016-03-25
<Fudge> willcooke:  do you ahve to do all of them?
<Fudge> I just did the amd64 twice using a screen reader manual partitioning
<Fudge> well done everyone for getting the beta out the door
<cyphermox> willcooke: I merged your slideshow fixes and uploaded.
<willcooke> thx cyphermox
<flocculant> willcooke: no holiday day today for you :)
<flocculant> or hiding the eggs
<willcooke> flocculant, just checking in before logging out :)
<sarnold> "do your hobbies"? :)
<flocculant> :)
<sarnold> odd that out of the thousands of people I see on irc all the time only -one- /quit message sticks with me..
<willcooke> heheh :)
<willcooke> flocculant, Do you see desktop beta 2 images on cdimages?  I only see server
<flocculant> willcooke: for ubuntu yep confirm that
<flocculant> of course xubuntu is perfect :p
<flocculant> willcooke: I bet you wish you'd logged out quicker now :)
<willcooke> natch
<willcooke> ha, yes
<sarnold> desktop beta2 here http://releases.ubuntu.com/16.04/
<willcooke> and no 404's on the little pictures either
<willcooke> hrmmmm
<willcooke> maybe just hasn't sync'd yet
<flocculant> willcooke: your release note points to releases.u.c - so I would assume people will try that
<flocculant> oh - then I see cdimage underneath
<willcooke> good call.  I'll poke IS and then give up for the weekend I think
<willcooke> ahh
<flocculant> willcooke: have a great weekend :)
<willcooke> thanks flocculant, you too
<willcooke> thanks for all your help
<flocculant> full of cold - will have to try hard - but I'll get there :)
<flocculant> welcome ofc
<didrocks> good give up willcooke ! :)
<willcooke> hey didrocks
<didrocks> hey ;)
<flocculant> hi didrocks
<willcooke> didrocks, are you working today?
<willcooke> (loaded question)
<didrocks> good morning flocculant :)
<didrocks> willcooke: yeah :p
<didrocks> willcooke: only Monday is off in France
<willcooke> ahh
<willcooke> in which case....
<willcooke> ;)
<willcooke> I expect you already know who to poke or what the situation is
<willcooke> but
<willcooke> cdimages seems out of sync with releases
<willcooke> and has broken (404) icons
<willcooke> the desktop images dont appear on cdimages
<willcooke> is that an IS thing?
<didrocks> willcooke: yeah, it's an IS thing
<didrocks> it's co-maintained by Colin watson
<willcooke> he'll be off toda
<willcooke> y
<willcooke> (I hope)
<willcooke> I'll drop in to the IS channel and do a hit and run
<didrocks> (I hope as well)
<didrocks> yeah
<didrocks> sounds like the best thing
<didrocks> I'm sure as well QA like jibel have tests failing due to that and will harass them :)
<jibel> didrocks, salut
<didrocks> salut jibel!
<jibel> what's up
<jibel> ?
<willcooke> morning jibel
<jibel> hey willcooke, are you working today?
<didrocks> 09:04:56    willcooke | cdimages seems out of sync with releases
<didrocks> 09:05:05    willcooke | and has broken (404) icons
<willcooke> cdimages.u.c only lists server images
<didrocks> 09:05:14    willcooke | the desktop images dont appear on cdimages
<willcooke> jibel, @ working - not supposed to me, but ya' know.
<jibel> willcooke, I don't think we ever published desktop images to cdimage for milestones, only to releases.u.c
<willcooke> ahh, that'll explain it
<didrocks> hum, didn't we? I think we did for beta2?
<didrocks> (at least, the server does)
<jibel> willcooke, hm, anyhow some archs are missing for server
<jibel> didrocks, release notes of beta2 for trusty https://wiki.ubuntu.com/TrustyTahr/ReleaseNotes?action=recall&rev=64
<jibel> it points to releases.u.c
<jibel> for desktop
<didrocks> yeah, sounds like it, weird that we have different process for servers, clouds and desktop
<didrocks> anyway, as long as the release note is up to date, I think we don't really care where the image is hosted
<willcooke> this is linked from the release notes for example:
<willcooke> http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/xubuntu/releases/16.04/release/
<didrocks> it's still a wiki page or published?
<didrocks> we can maybe change the links
<jibel> willcooke, the links are wrong for the flavours
<flocculant> didrocks: it's editable it seems
<jibel> no one checked the links apparently
<jibel> willcooke, on it
<willcooke> thank you jibel
<willcooke> I would help but it'll probably just end up with wiki clashes
<willcooke> jibel, would it help if I paste links here for you to copy?
<willcooke> e.g.
<jibel> done
<willcooke> ha
<willcooke> thanks
<willcooke> jibel, it was a late one for you yesterday too, are you swapping some hours?
<willcooke> (i.e. you should ;) )
<jibel> willcooke, don't you want drop i386 from the list of supported archs? who runs ubuntu on 32bit only machine today?
<willcooke> we talked about it a bit, decided not to yet
<jibel> willcooke, I think xnox started a discussion a while back but it never came to a conclusion
<didrocks> jibel: seb128
<didrocks> on the "who runsâ¦" :)
<jibel> willcooke, there is too much text for libreoffice compared to the rest of the changes for desktop
<jibel> it's like it's a libreoffice only release
<jibel> didrocks, pff
<jibel> he should reinstall his machine :)
<didrocks> yeah, it's been ages he has an amd64 one
<didrocks> lazy french! :-)
<willcooke> jibel, @ LO - yeah, you're right
<jibel> do not attempt to update should a big bold red warning
<jibel> upgrade*
<flocculant> jibel: I did that on the xubuntu one
<jibel> flocculant, it's wise. Users expect some level of stability from a beta and if they don't know how to recover it's a major issue
<jibel> links to release notes for flavors are wrong to, fixnig
<willcooke> jibel, I'm editing, one sec
<jibel> willcooke, while you're at it can you remove edubuntu, they won't release anything
<willcooke> jibel, ack
<willcooke> done
<jibel> fixing the links to the release notes for flavors
<flocculant> willcooke should have {{{#!wiki warning'd the upgrade warning - you get big AND red :p
<flocculant> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/XenialXerus/Beta2/Xubuntu
<willcooke> oh neat!
<willcooke> I'll do that
<willcooke> jibel, let me know once you're done editing
<jibel> willcooke, done. I cannot find an release notes for mythbuntu and ubuntu studio
<willcooke> jibel, I'll ping superm1 about mythbuntu
<flocculant> willcooke: while you're doing the big red thing - the studio notes are at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/XenialXerus/ReleaseNotes/Beta2/UbuntuStudio
<jibel> flocculant, thanks
<willcooke> thx
<flocculant> oic what they did
<flocculant> I'll talk to them about either using the same pattern as everyone else or being around on release time :)
<jibel> being around on release time is a good idea :)
<flocculant> yea for sure :p
<willcooke> done
<flocculant> they had put their note location on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/XenialXerus/Beta2 btw :)
<flocculant> willcooke: you like that do you :p
<willcooke> moar red
<jibel> I just read this page and didn't see it lol
<flocculant> willcooke: I'll pm you my address for you to send me the choccy egg :D
<willcooke> flocculant, deal
<flocculant> ha ha
<willcooke> flocculant, although doesn't a beagle in a rabbit costume deliver them?
<flocculant> daughter would get to be it first ...
<flocculant> ha ha ha
<willcooke> So we ordered some "empty plastic eggs" from Asda in our grocery delivery so we could fill them up with things for the kids
<willcooke> they were substituted
<flocculant> ...
<willcooke> for 5 Smarties easter eggs and a pack of paper cups
<willcooke> ?!?!
<flocculant> oh my
<sarnold> tel me more about the beagle :)
<willcooke> :D
<flocculant> willcooke: would you like to release the xubuntu release notes lock - need to change a bit :)
 * willcooke checks his open tabs
<flocculant> oh it's gone anyway
<willcooke> I think I might have just closed it as you asked
<flocculant> :)
 * jibel back to trying to release a phone now :)
<didrocks> jibel: sounds an easy Friday task! :) Good luck!
<jibel> didrocks, it is, especially given that almost everyone is away, lot of fun
<didrocks> yeah, I can only imagineâ¦ :/
<willcooke> alright, that's a wrap from me for today
<willcooke> telegram or email if you want anything
<didrocks> willcooke: enjoy your long week-end man!
<willcooke> thanks for all the help jibel
<willcooke> and flocculant ^
<willcooke> l8r didrocks
<flocculant> willcooke: have a good one :)
<Laney> teehee
<didrocks> good morning Laney :)
<Laney> didrocks: !!!
<Laney> what are you doing here?
<didrocks> working? :)
<didrocks> not every country is like Germany or UK :p
<Laney> unlucky
<didrocks> especially this year, seeing how many days off are on the week-end :)
<didrocks> but well, the week felt shorter, was in Paris on Wed. and Thu.
<Laney> "nice"
<Laney> did you do a talk?
<didrocks> yeah, at ubuntu-fr meetup
<didrocks> https://twitter.com/thibautR/status/712733906131427328
<didrocks> https://twitter.com/thibautR/status/712741466448257024
<Laney> VLC!
<didrocks> yep, even if systemd gives me hell with thisâ¦
 * Laney remembers
<didrocks> (still didn't work the issue out)
<Laney> let's see how fast I can package gstreamer 1.8
<Laney> start the clock at 11:10
<didrocks> hum, are you really working? :)
<Laney> off next week :(
<Laney> and seb is too
<didrocks> ah, that's why
<didrocks> good luck man :)
<Laney> got some nice ubuntu branches in git
<Laney> so it is pretty easy
<didrocks> sweet!
<Laney> git rerere
<Laney> oh MAN that is nice
<Laney> "git update-ref pristine-tar origin/pristine-tar"
<Laney> updates that branch without having to check it out
<Laney> Good Friday Learning With Laney
<didrocks> yeah, this command is useful in that case :)
<Laney> ah you need refs/heads on the local branch name
<Laney> DONE
<Laney> & appstream-dep11 updated
<Laney> I need to get all X-Ubuntu-Gettext-Domain packages
 * Laney wonders how to get that
<Laney> langpack build logs?
<Laney> got it
<Laney> bye didrocks
<Laney> happy long weekend!
<didrocks> thanks, you too Laney :)
<dobey> hmm, i can't seem to log into any IM accounts in 16.04, for empathy
<dobey> anyone around that knows much about telepathy/empathy?
<Trevinho> desrt: hey, how do I send a variant using gdbus call?
<desrt> "v" format
<Trevinho> desrt: I mean, with the command-line utility.. what's the format? Like ... .MethodName <variant_value> (which is actually is a bool in my case)
<dobey> Trevinho: can't you just type true/false there then?
<Trevinho> dobey: nope..
<Trevinho> dobey: I've to pass multiple values, which one is variant
<desrt> Trevinho: pointy brackets, ya
<Trevinho> desrt: I tried with  org.ofono.Modem.SetProperty Powered "<'True'>", but... it doesn't work (According to introspection data, you need to pass 'sv')
<desrt> that is the right type... but why quotes on True?
<desrt> just write <true>
<Trevinho> ah, ok :-D
<Trevinho> So i was using the right one since beginning, but for some reason I put those quotes
#ubuntu-desktop 2016-03-26
<madigens> Anybody here with the power to update the freetype package to 2.6.3 for xenial? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/freetype/+bug/1521299
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1521299 in freetype (Ubuntu) "Update to 2.6.3" [Wishlist,Triaged]
<madigens> 2.6.1 may contain security issues.
<ksamak> hi all
<ksamak> i guess no-one's working today, but i'll ask anyway
<ksamak> it's about compiz
<ksamak> say a plugin wanted to inquire about the value of... say the current zoom, in ezoom. would that be hard to impl?
<ksamak> cause with the zoom changes i made, it break the centering of mouse in showmouse plugin
<ksamak> Trevinho: btw, still haven't found that 0.9.12.3.tar.gz ;-)
<ksamak> also, we might wanna talk about the changes i'm proposing, when i upload the patch (soon)
<tushar> hello friends , can anyone suggest me version which best support on thinkpad p50 ?
<tushar> i installed 14.04 which was not supporting wifi and lan card and sound drivers
<binary01>  hi all, i am having trouble booting into my desktop. At first after i try to login it would just return to login screen. i read that i may be a problem with lightdm and to try gdm instead. i installed gdm and now i get a black screen on boot. does anyone know how to fix this?
<flocculant> binary01: this isn't a support channel - and is extremely quiet at the weekend - try #ubuntu :)
#ubuntu-desktop 2017-03-20
<robert_ancell> jbicha, ping
<jbicha> robert_ancell: hi
<robert_ancell> jbicha, you can reproduce bug 1672424 right? It's working fine for me here on both xenial and zesty..
<ubot5> bug 1672424 in gnome-software (Ubuntu Yakkety) "Cannot install Debian files outside of the repositories" [Critical,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1672424
<jbicha> what test file did you use?
<robert_ancell> jbicha, switcheroo-control as per the bug instructions
<jbicha> do you have the gnome3 staging ppa enabled?
<robert_ancell> jbicha, no
<jbicha> hmm
<robert_ancell> indeed
<jbicha> yes, I can still reproduce it on Ubuntu (Unity) 16.04
<jbicha> this time, I right-clicked on it in Nautilus and chose to open it with Ubuntu Software
<robert_ancell> jbicha, what version of g-s?
<robert_ancell> I tried with Nautilus - still wokrs
<robert_ancell> I'm using the .a34b091 version here
<jbicha> yes, that's the same version I'm using
<robert_ancell> amd64?
<jbicha> yes
<robert_ancell> bare metal or VM?
<jbicha> VirtualBox
<robert_ancell> I'm using QEMU, but I can't see how that would make a difference...
<jbicha> but I can reproduce it in zesty too
<robert_ancell> 3.22.6-0ubuntu2?
<jbicha> we're up to 3.22.7 now
<jbicha> and I'm using the PK-enabled version from that ubuntu-desktop PPA
<jbicha> the latest comment on bug 1581713 asks for the ability to use gnome-software without snap
<ubot5> bug 1581713 in Ubuntu GNOME "Ubuntu Software always asks for an Ubuntu Single Sign-On account when installing or removing a snap package" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1581713
<jbicha> that's sort of possible in zesty except that I have gnome-software depend on g-s-plugin-snap instead of just recommends
<robert_ancell> jbicha, yeah, uninstalling the plugin seems an appropriate solution.
<robert_ancell> Though it's just a side effect of not being able to do this properly. Still waiting on the support from the snapd side
<jbicha> except we don't have a supported way of uninstalling that plugin
<robert_ancell> i.e. graphically?
<robert_ancell> or in older releases?
<jbicha> you can't do it in zesty because I made it a hard-depends; you can't do it in earlier releases because it's included in the same binary pkg as gnome-software
<robert_ancell> Given the request is "I want to disable snaps because they're harder to install than .debs" I think the real solution is to fix the snap installing issues..
<jbicha> oh never mind, I guess they could just uninstall 'snapd' which is only a recommends
<jbicha> jhbuild run gnome-software --local-filename=switcheroo-control_1.1-0ubuntu0~zesty1_amd64.deb
<jbicha> fails too with gnome-software 3.22.7 without our patches
<robert_ancell> oh yeah, snapd is optional
<jbicha> Gs  failed to convert to GsApp: no application was created for /home/jeremy/Downloads/switcheroo-control_1.1-0ubuntu0~zesty1_amd64.deb
<jbicha> (it seems a bit extreme to switch to Debian testing because of that one snapd issue!)
<robert_ancell> RAGE QUIT!
<robert_ancell> Seems the trend is to change the error message every release :)
 * robert_ancell wishes he'd bought a faster SSD. Updates take ages...
<robert_ancell> Still works on zesty with all updates... :(
 * robert_ancell reboots
<robert_ancell> still works
<hikiko> hi
<Guest63440> Morning hikiko!
<hikiko> morning Guest63440
<RAOF> Oops.
<willcooke> morning all
<didrocks> hey willcooke
<davmor2> Morning all
<didrocks> happy monday davmor2
<Laney> AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
<didrocks> oh, a Laney
<didrocks> UK's really unitedâ¦ in time :)
<Laney> 3~/sb e
<Laney> argh
<Laney> hey didrocks!
<Laney> how's it going?
<didrocks> good good! busy week-end even if didn't do much in the end :)
<didrocks> how was yours?
<didrocks> (btw, played unlocked at the game cafe, really really cool game: https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/213460/unlock)
<didrocks> unfortunately can't replay a scenario once done
<didrocks> (card-based escape room game)
<seb128> hey willcooke Laney davmor2, how is u.k today? had a good w.e?
<davmor2> seb128, didrocks: Doing well thanks miserable weather, but I finished my Millenium Falcon Model, Now I just need to figure out where the hell I'm going to put it
<didrocks> haha, it's the hardest part :)
<Laney> didrocks: nice, not heard of that one
<Laney> hey seb128!
<Laney> was quite good, exploring in wales
<Laney> rained every day but that's expected :P
<davmor2> didrocks: have you seen the size of it
<didrocks> davmor2: ah no, how big is it?
<davmor2> didrocks: https://photos.google.com/photo/AF1QipPfwDJuQqMUxGKYJoMK5uJaFQRVhRKYnEngcUXB can you see that
<davmor2> didrocks: to give you and Idea the cushion in the background is 40cm Squared
<Sweet5hark> moin
<didrocks> hey Sweet5hark
<didrocks> davmor2: I don't have access to it
<davmor2> didrocks: https://photos.google.com/photo/AF1QipPfwDJuQqMUxGKYJoMK5uJaFQRVhRKYnEngcUXB try that
<didrocks> davmor2: nope
<davmor2> https://goo.gl/photos/ULpqxMp8Wo7QcvYY9
<davmor2> sorry paste fail
<didrocks> better :)
<didrocks> ahah, quite massive then!
<seb128> hey Sweet5hark
<davmor2> didrocks: I think the round is 70cm and with the blades it is 82cm
<willcooke> seb128, could you take a look at this one pls:  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/packagekit/+bug/1661371
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1661371 in sessioninstaller (Ubuntu) "[zesty] doesn't offer a window to install missing gstreamer codecs" [High,Confirmed]
<Sweet5hark> didrocks, seb128: bonjours!
<Sweet5hark> mondays lament: After backing up the bundled windows, setting up ubuntu, customizing everything and moving my workflow to the new machine and being really happy about it ...
<Sweet5hark> ... yesterday I played my first youtube video on it. Turns out the right internals speakder doesnt work.
 * Sweet5hark is so angry at Lenovo for letting such an obvious fail pass QA on a 1000+ EUR machine.
 * Sweet5hark is even more angry at himself for not having tested sound on delivery before setting anything up.
<seb128> willcooke, sure, I had it in my triaged bug emails box, going to have a look today or tomorrow
<willcooke> perfect, thanks seb128
 * Laney emerges from emails
<flexiondotorg> Morning desktopers
<chrisccoulson> ricotz, all the bits are in place for building firefox with our rust toolchain now, but we're blocked on https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1347483 (the build fails because it hits the network)
<ubot5> Mozilla bug 1347483 in Buildduty "blessings package should be downloaded from internal pypi and not from external one" [Normal,New]
<Sweet5hark> oh, lol: a redhat employee pimping my performance hacks on GNU make to upstream (again): http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/bug-make/2017-03/msg00038.html
<seb128> Sweet5hark, be careful or you might end up maintaining gnumake :-)
<Sweet5hark> seb128: you mean maintaining an ancient widely used codebase with way too few developers? Would be an entirely new experience to me then ...
<Sweet5hark> Laney: FWIW, preventing premature promotion of libreoffice-l10n with the last upload worked. It worked jsut a bit ... too well too.
<Laney> boop
<Laney> you mean it broke libreoffice somehow?
<Sweet5hark> Laney: nah, not really broke it. Just means that we need one extra build of -l10n this time around although it is not strictly needed. see: https://git.launchpad.net/~libreoffice/ubuntu/+source/libreoffice/commit/?id=485e71dffdaf408d17b51a8118d9bda303b914e3
<Laney> Sweet5hark: ah right, do you know about source:Upstream-Version?
<Sweet5hark> Laney: hmm. both source:Upstream-Version and binary:Version might bite you in one scenario or the other, wouldnt they? Murphy says likely the one that hurts you will come to pass anyway.
<Sweet5hark> Laney: I mean chances of upstream or packaging incompatibilities are roughly the same between libreoffice and libreoffice-l10n.
<Laney> I thought you wanted to express 'should be the same upstream version'
<Laney> keeping binary versions in sync across different package is a nightmare (so >= is better there)
<Sweet5hark> Laney: for the most part, -l10n being a separate package is artificial anyway: I mean, they are even maintained in the same repo and generated from the same source. Being able to update libreoffice without libreoffice-l10n is just a minor sideeffect, but IMHO we should not depend on that anyway: just take it as a freebie that pays back some of the pain we get for splittng these in the first place.
<Sweet5hark> Laney: but yeah: (= ${binary:Version}) had no benefits at all here, so good to kill it.
<Laney> Sweet5hark: meh, it still requires a libreoffice upload to match every l10n one
 * Laney lunch
<Sweet5hark> Laney: so: 1/ changes in libreoffice-l10n without one in libreoffice have never happened. 2/ incompatible changes on the same upstream version of LibreOffice DO happen: e.g. dis-/enable a feature with configure-flags and suddenly you have too much/too little in the -l10n (and possibly, given the funky "Help-Id" mapping of translated text in libreoffice-l10n: broken l10n even for stuff that both
<Sweet5hark> versions had).
<Sweet5hark> Laney: building l10n separately isnt an supported upstream scenario. Compatibility of -l10n when e.g. config-flags change isnt a promise that upstream ever made. IOW: we should be thankful if even "(>= ${binary:Version})" works. ;)
<Sweet5hark> (The l10n strings arent mapped to content between the two via something sane and stable like unique strings. Rather ints that are generated during the build. We should be thankful libreoffice and libreoffice-l10n agree on the generated ids so much: that was never an expectation when that code was originally written.)
<Laney> Sweet5hark: Right, so this whole approach is fragile and prone to random breakage. Got you.
<Laney> :)
<Sweet5hark> Laney: aye. Its a bit "We are doomed anyway". To be properly fixed, that would need to happen upstream, but that is a lot of work with zero enduser visible benefit, so as long as what we do now works, Id rather spend the time on other things ...
<Sweet5hark> e.g. we discussed moving to gettext for l10n upstream (because ~everyone else is, and then we would only have the troubles everyone else has). in addition to a lot of work, while it would make things more robust, it would also roughly double l10n file sizes: so enthusiasm was ... limited.
<Sweet5hark> is it ok to reuse bug 1673790 for the -0ubuntu2 upload?
<ubot5> bug 1673790 in libreoffice (Ubuntu) "bump LibreOffice to 5.3.1 on zesty and fix autpkgtest dependencies" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1673790
<jbicha> Sweet5hark: yes, could you add that bug number to your debian/changelog so it will get closed automatically when it makes it into zesty?
<Sweet5hark> jbicha: hmm, already uploaded the changes w/o a launchpad bug id (debian bug id is in there though). Would it be ok for me to close the lp bug manually this time? Otherwise I'd have to redo the whole source package dance ...
<Sweet5hark> jbicha: see https://bugs.launchpad.net/debian/+source/libreoffice/+bug/1673790/comments/3
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1673790 in libreoffice (Ubuntu) "bump LibreOffice to 5.3.1 on zesty and fix autpkgtest dependencies" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<jbicha> Sweet5hark: since we already have the original tarballs in zesty, a .debdiff would be a lot easier for you I think
<jbicha> just send a diff of the debian/ directory since what's already in zesty-proposed
<davmor2> willcooke: did your branch for slides still not make it in?
<Laney> davmor2: https://code.launchpad.net/~willcooke/ubiquity-slideshow-ubuntu/ubiquity-slideshow-ubuntu-zesty/+merge/319962
<davmor2> Laney: meh
<jbicha> Sweet5hark: actually now that I think about it some more, your way is fine; building LO and Firefox's sources for uploading take a very long time
<davmor2> Laney: any way to get that moving it would be nice to have before Thursday if possible you know with it being final beta and all that ;)
<Laney> Yes, get a reviewer to review it and then, if approved, to upload it. :)
<Laney> (#ubuntu-installer)
<jbicha> Sweet5hark: I would have used (<< 1.5.3.1-0ubuntu2~) for the breaks/replaces to better match the existing replaces but your way should be fine too
<Sweet5hark> jbicha: yep, it would only be a difference for 1:5.3.1-0ubuntu1+foo versions (IOW <=1:5.3.1-0ubuntu1 assumes there wont be a 1:5.3.1-0ubuntu1+x version with the bug, while <<1:5.3.1-0ubuntu2~ assumes those might exist).
<Sweet5hark> jbicha: and thanks for not insisting on a debdiff -- my jenkins machinery doesnt autogenerate one, so Id have to manually create one ...
<Laney> back in a bit
<Sweet5hark> jbicha: thanks for sponsoring. FWIW, I might ask for a yakkety SRU too: usually I waited for an CVE to bump versions, but for yakkety none came about, so its still stuck at 5.2.2. Id bump to 5.2.6 and add the backport of the SDK fix.
<jbicha> sounds good
<Sweet5hark> jbicha: eh, forget about backporting the SDK patch. yakkety isnt broken apparently as rene broke it after I branched off.
#ubuntu-desktop 2017-03-21
<hikiko> hi
<pitti> Good morning folks! how are things in desktop land?
<pitti> happy spring freeze and start of zesty! (or so.. âº )
 * pitti donne une accolade Ã  hikiko, seb128, et didrocks
<seb128> salut pitti, comment Ã§a va ?
<didrocks> bonjour bonjour pitti !
<hikiko> bonjour pitti :)
<hikiko> et seb128 et didrocks et al. :p
 * seb128 hugs pitti
<seb128> hey hikiko
<seb128> re didrocks
 * didrocks hugs pitti back as well
<hikiko> hi hi
<didrocks> re seb128, hey hikiko !
<pitti> Ã§a va trÃ¨s bien, merci ! j'ai couru 10 km hier, je peux senser mes jambes :)
<hikiko> gawd
 * pitti aime le printemps
<hikiko> I only swam 1km and felt dead :) (1km = 30minutes :p)
<seb128> pitti, tu t'entraines pour concurrencer Didier ?
<didrocks> (il y a encore de la marge) :p
<pitti> hikiko: well, slightly higher resistance in water :)
<pitti> no, I couldn't keep up with didrocks
<didrocks> hier, j'ai fait 15 kms, j'aime le printemps aussi :)
<pitti> see!
<seb128> pitti, c'est qu'un petit peu en plus!
<didrocks> ouais, 15, c'est facile
<seb128> :-)
<didrocks> le vendredi, c'est 24 kms ! lÃ , c'est un peu plus douloureux et il faut le week-end pour se remettre :p
 * pitti (shakes head).translate("fr")
<didrocks> pitti: are you still playing basketball regularly?
<pitti> didrocks: oui, mercredi soir
<pitti> I suck a little bit less at it by now
 * TheMuso waves to EU folks.
 * pitti waves to TheMuso, hello from the other side!
<didrocks> hey TheMuso
<didrocks> pitti: this is what I can't do (first: height, second: jump, third: stop and race suddenly) ;)
<pitti> didrocks: yeah, it's a bit taxing, but I'm happy that my knees play along
<seb128> hey TheMuso
<pitti> in fact, since I've started to do sports more regularly some 15 years ago I stopped having knee troubles
<pitti> it's like "use your body or die"..
<pitti> didrocks: but it seems yours' are much better these days too, if you can run for that long
<didrocks> pitti: yeah, it's way better than sitting all day along :)
<didrocks> pitti: correct, but I'm streching heavily as well
<didrocks> a little bit of pain sometimes, but that stands for a km
<didrocks> and nothing stopping
<Laney> morning
<seb128> hey Laney, how are you?
<Laney> hey seb128!
<Laney> GREAT
<davmor2> Morning all
<seb128> :-)
<seb128> hey davmor2
<Laney> had a good climb last night
<seb128> uk is waking up!
<seb128> nice
<Laney> feelinggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggg fine
<Laney> what about you?
<Laney> hey davmor2, Ã§a va?
<seb128> I'm good, still a bit sleepy though, working on it through coffee
<davmor2> Laney: you forgot the "And I'm" in front of your Feeling fine
<didrocks> good morning Laney, davmor2
<seb128> we are getting some sun back which feels nice after that rainy and windy few days
<willcooke> ahoy
<seb128> makes me want to go play tennis
<davmor2> Laney: good ta but don't let on I know some French ;)
<seb128> maybe tomorrow evening
<davmor2> hey didrocks
<seb128> hey willcooke, feeling better?
<davmor2> morning willcooke
<willcooke> hey seb128, better than yesterday thanks.  Still not cured, but getting there.
<didrocks> good morning willcooke
<Laney> yeah it's got cold again
<Laney> but at least sun
<Laney> hey didrocks et willcooke
<Laney> what's the news
<didrocks> doing good :)
<willcooke> davmor2, seb128 - I have this feeling that when we had mediascanner2 in Main during the big MIR push for U8 that it triggered problems in U7.  I can't be sure though.  So I'll be testing it to see, but if you could keep an eye out for any potentially related issues that would be good
<willcooke> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mediascanner2/+bug/1669546
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1669546 in mediascanner2 (Ubuntu) "[MIR] mediascanner2" [Undecided,Fix committed]
<seb128> willcooke, one thing it does is to trigger crash reports and eat resources
<seb128> while being useless in the session
<willcooke> in the U7 session right?
<seb128> yes
<willcooke> I think resources and not being useful is just something we have to live with for now, but crash reports popping up will be sucky
<davmor2> willcooke: before when it was removed the big issue was it held up access to writable media while it scanned it iirc
<willcooke> davmor2, yikes, that would suck also.  Would you mind testing that specifically?
<seb128> can't they make it start only in u8 sessions?
<willcooke> seb128, ah right, good point.  Lemme comment on the bug
<davmor2> willcooke: sure will do
<hikiko> hi handsome_feng :)
<hikiko> Laney, and didrocks and seb128 might know where you should put the links for the GPL licenses
<Laney> they probably want SystemdService= in the .service file
<Laney> hikiko: ????????????????????????????????????????
<davmor2> Yay zapus in the slideshow thanks willcooke and cyphermox
<hikiko> Laney, handsome_feng has 2 projects on github
<willcooke> davmor2, ha! Spooky, I was just looking at that right this second
<hikiko> a control center and an indicator one
<hikiko> and he has a COPYING file identical to canonical's
<willcooke> thanks cyphermox for the merge in to the slideshow
<hikiko> Laney, do you know if he should add the links for GPL in that file or create another one inside the debian/ directory?
<hikiko> and how this file would look?
<Laney> debian/copyright just has to describe the licenses in use
<Laney> the upstream part should ship COPYING files for their licenses
<didrocks> it's intesting, sounds like I'm reviewing code requested by maclin, which got asked to handsome_feng which is coming back to hikiko :)
<hikiko> haha :) yeah that broken telephone comfused us a little
<Laney> the circle of life
<hikiko> :D
<didrocks> Laney: circle of *friends* :p
<Laney> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GibiNy4d4gc
<maclin> didrocks:  ^_^
<hikiko> so, if he needs to add the links, those go to COPYING?
<didrocks> hikiko: basically, the 2 projects were missing the LGPL COPYING
<hikiko> he just has to put them there?
<hikiko> oh
<didrocks> they only had GPL
<didrocks> while some code is LGPL2
<hikiko> so he needs a 2nd copying?
<didrocks> yep
<didrocks> as there was in some other projects
<hikiko> like LGPL_COPYING?
<didrocks> COPYING.LGPL most of the time for naming
<hikiko> :)
<didrocks> but no hard requirement
<hikiko> handsome_feng, ^^^^^
<didrocks> also
<Laney> usually you can point to the /usr/share/common-licenses/ file
<Laney> it's mostly important that it is described in d/copyright
<didrocks> one of them are not listing the LGPL files in debian/copyright
<didrocks> so updating debian/copyright is needed
<hikiko> I see :)
<hikiko> handsome_feng, ^^^^
<handsome_feng> Hi, hikiko, Laney, didirocks: Thank you! :)
<Laney> but the upstream should include them for good practice anyway
<Laney> np
<hikiko> handsome_feng, just find a lgpl program and copy from there
<hikiko> to be sure that everything looks fine
<didrocks> as Laney pointed: /usr/share/common-licenses/LGPL-2
<hikiko> handsome_feng, http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~mir-team/mir/development-branch/files
<hikiko> mir has both :)
<hikiko> check the files from here and do what didrocks said :)
<howefield> 7/exit
<davmor2> willcooke: seeing no delay to access or write here
<davmor2> willcooke: just did a ps aux | grep mediascanner and it doesn't appear to be running so I'm wondering if it is a case of if you open a unity8 app in unity7 if it is triggered at that point maybe?
<willcooke> davmor2, thanks, will see what/if they comment
<sil2100> Trevinho: hey! Do you know who's maintaining unity-settings-daemon ?
<sil2100> Trevinho: I'm looking for someone to review and help land https://code.launchpad.net/~chrisccoulson/unity-settings-daemon/lp1542699/+merge/288952 <- it's been in the sponsoring queue for ages now
<davmor2> cyphermox: the issue with I'm wondering if it is to do with uefi and secureboot as I have that setup on my kvm instance. I'll try it without after and comment on the bug and I'll retry it on i386 too after.
<cyphermox> davmor2: you mean the shutdown prompt? it wouldn't have anything to do with uefi
<davmor2> cyphermox: it was a longshot but the only thing I could think of in common between xps and kvm setups
<cyphermox> kvm, not virtualbox?
<davmor2> cyphermox: always kvm
<cyphermox> because it works just fine here in qemu.
<davmor2> cyphermox: is that with or without ovmf and secureboot being enabled?
<cyphermox> both, IIRC
<cyphermox> I don't especially pay attention, but I'm pretty sure it shows up
<cyphermox> as I said, SB and UEFI make no change in that
<davmor2> cyphermox: indeed, I'm going to try i386 latter in the day too and I need to try 64bit on a different intel box after too for the other boot options
<cyphermox> the possible difference there when you use qemu/kvm is because it's really a different firmware, I suppose it could emulate hardware slightly differently. on hardware it's the same firmware and same hardware in a different mode.
<cyphermox> (and also, it it's firmware-related I can't do anything about it by the time we run the shutdown code)
<davmor2> cyphermox: on a plus side the issue I had with networking on oem mode seems to of gone away \o/ and I have a mouse in the slides \o/
<cyphermox> ah, yes
<davmor2> cyphermox: And weirdly desktop mode has the hit enter prompt still it is only in ubiquity mode that I don't have it
<davmor2> live desktop mode even
<handsome_feng> Hi, didrocks, Laney, I have update the ukui-control-center and ukui-indicaters, and the peony need to reupload, Hi, didrocks, I have update the ukui-control-center, ukui-indicators, and the peony need to reupload, could you help check it? bug: # 1664232, bug: #1664244, bug: #1664235
<ubot5> bug 1664244 in Ubuntu "[FFe] ukui-control-center" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1664244
<ubot5> bug 1664235 in Ubuntu "[FFe] peony" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1664235
<jgdx> zsombi, hey, you know why this happens? http://i.imgur.com/1fmPdvU.png
<zsombi> jgdx: what happens there?
<jgdx> zsombi, fairly standard APL (using addPageToNextColumn) and leadingActions on the ListItem there
<jgdx> on the right
<ahayzen> jgdx, you need to clip the right listview
<jgdx> ahayzen, indeed! thanks
<jgdx> zsombi, disregard that, then. :)
<zsombi> yeah, just pushing an image I cannot spot the issue :)
<didrocks> jbicha: peony looks weird to me (releasing a first version with -0ubuntu3)
<sil2100> seb128: hey! I poked Trevinho already but he doesn't seem to be around - do you know who's maintaining unity-settings-daemon right now? I saw your name in the list of contributors there
<sil2100> Ugh
<Trevinho> sil2100: oh I actually am here
<jbicha> didrocks: it was because we moved some files around and I wasn't sure if they had users for their ppa
<Trevinho> sil2100: I think seb maintains it
<didrocks> jbicha: ah ok, not a blocker, justâ¦ weird :p
<sil2100> Trevinho: \o/ could you read my question from backlog? From 3 hours ago
<sil2100> Trevinho: ah, ok, I'll wait for him to get back I guess
<jbicha> didrocks: I could upload the new peony 1.0.1 if you prefer
<Trevinho> sil2100: sure, you probably pinged me when I was not in front at the laptop and then.... I didn't read :-P
<sil2100> hah, happens to me as well sometimes ;)
<didrocks> jbicha: no, that's fine
<seb128> bah, how to brick your ubuntu install in a few steps and then spend an hour fixing it
<seb128> I tried to install some zesty packages on my xenial to try to see if I get that sessioninstaller not working issue that way, which I didn't
<seb128> downgraded back packages then, forgot libmir
<seb128> gtk things then didn't start anymore due to a protobuf version mismatch (which isn't mir requiring the version it needs?)
<jbicha> yikes
<seb128> then it went downhill, tried to switch to a vt that screwed xorg thanks to intel stack issues
<seb128> rebooted, lightdm greeter couldn't start because gtk
<seb128> of course systemd keeps trying to restart it not letting me go to a vt
<jbicha> you might want packagekit 1.1 to duplicate the sessioninstaller issue? which you probably don't want on xenial
<seb128> rebooted in rescue mode to get to a console, that asked for a root password that I don't have since I use sudo with my users
<seb128> oh well, fixed now
<seb128> jbicha, I installed that first
<seb128> works fine on xenial with it
<seb128> then tried to upgrade gstreamer, still not issue
<seb128> gtk/glib still no issue
<seb128> then I gave up and downgraded, going to be easier to try in a zesty vm instead
<seb128> jbicha, you are sure it has to do with the packagekit update?
<seb128> if so whoever did that update should debug/fix it :-)
<jbicha> I don't know what caused the bug
 * Sweet5hark is back from dentist. status: survived.
<Sweet5hark> seb128: urgh that sounds ... painful.
 * Sweet5hark whispers "use moar virt-manager".
<seb128> vms are slow
<Sweet5hark> seb128: as said: that used to be true for me, not anymore. kvm rules.
<seb128> well for me rendering is slow
<seb128> could be my laptop
<Sweet5hark> seb128: but well, if you do hardware or performance testing: meh, yeah. still needs native.
<seb128> don't get me wrong, it works fine and is good for testing
<seb128> still unity in a vm feels slugish to use
<seb128> hey there
<seb128> it's meeting time!
<seb128> #startmeeting
<meetingology> Meeting started Tue Mar 21 15:30:27 2017 UTC.  The chair is seb128. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
<seb128> Roll call: andyrock, attente, desrt,  dgadomski, fjkong, flexiondotorg, happyaron, hikiko (out), laney, qengho, seb128, sweet5hark, themuso (out), tkamppeter, trevinho, robert_ancell (out)
<flexiondotorg> o/
<Trevinho> \o
<seb128> oh Trevinho is around, didn't see you for a while! how are you?
<andyrock> o/
<seb128> hey flexiondotorg Trevinho andyrock
<seb128> k, give a minute for others to wake up and let's start
<Trevinho> seb128: I'm good, I'm always here... Just silent :-)
<Laney> hi
<Trevinho> seb128: you?
<Laney> Trevinho: you should bond with the team :(
<flexiondotorg> Hi seb128
<Trevinho> Laney: you know... I love to chat in real  life, more than in IRC..
<Trevinho> :-/
<Laney> :'(
<seb128> k, let's start!
<seb128> #topic andyrock
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: andyrock
<seb128> andyrock, hey
<andyrock> hey
<andyrock> still working on cr
<andyrock> got the gbm buffer backend working
<andyrock> I'm cleaning the code to push it in our branch
<andyrock> eof
<seb128> thanks andyrock
<seb128> #topic attente
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: attente
<seb128> attente, hey
<attente> hey, sorry
<seb128> no worry
<seb128> ready or should we go back to you at the end?
<attente> just been working on the gtk-mir backend
<attente> that's pretty much all i have to say
<seb128> k, thanks attente
<seb128> #topic desrt
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: desrt
<seb128> desrt, hey
<seb128> no desrt?
<seb128> #topic dgadomski
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: dgadomski
<seb128> dgadomski, hey
<Laney> hackfest?
<dgadomski> hey
<seb128> there is an hackfest?
<dgadomski> * I'm chasing some bluetooth (bluez) issues (reported bug #1674680, but more are coming). Can you give me any advice who can I talk to in this area?
<ubot5> bug 1674680 in bluez (Ubuntu) "Deprecated rfcomm.conf still mentioned" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1674680
<seb128> was not in will's "what's up this week" email on monday
<seb128> but maybe
<attente> oh right. it's the gtk one in london
<seb128> oh ok
<desrt> hey.  hackfest :)
<desrt> just remembered about the meeting :)
<seb128> desrt, next time summary via email please
<desrt> sorry.  i thought i'd be on IRC but i got sucked into a conversation
<seb128> no worry
<seb128> want to go now?
<desrt> sure.  not must to say, really
<seb128> dgadomski, try konrad or TheMuso
<dgadomski> thanks seb128
<seb128> yw
<dgadomski> that's it
<seb128> thanks dgadomski
<seb128> #topic desrt
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: desrt
<desrt> spending lots of time talking to smcv about the ways that dbus can be made better to support dconf-proxy style helpers
<seb128> desrt, your turn then, I hope you have fun at the hackfest :-)
<desrt> we worked out a really nice solution for that.  need to chase it up with someone on the snappy side to see if they find that to be useful as well
<seb128> great
<desrt> ya.  it's really nice.  lots of good people here :)
<seb128> excellent
<seb128> enjoy it!
<desrt> any hint for who i should talk to in snaps?
<desrt> start with mvo? :)
<seb128> what exactly do you need from the snap team?
<desrt> i just want to find out if they like this new API and/or if they have suggestions for things that would help them
<seb128> if it's dbus/proxy maybe try t_yhicks or j_dstrand
<desrt> because it dramatically simplifies the writing of services that are meant to interact with confined applications
<desrt> sure
<flexiondotorg> desrt What seb128 said :-)
<seb128> but yeah otherwise m_vo is probably a good bet
<seb128> he can redirect you to whoever is right
<desrt> anyway.  i've taken quite enough time :)
<desrt> eof.
<seb128> thanks desrt
<seb128> #topic FJKong
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: FJKong
<seb128> FJKong, hey
<FJKong> hey
<FJKong> input method can't be used on some snaps (ex: moonplayer and rssreader)
<FJKong> I take long time to reproduce it on different os version (16.04 16.10)and qt version
<FJKong> #1644781 Sushi-start fails with 16.10 upgrade, both Unity and Mate
<FJKong> verify it to test padding feature under Mate
<FJKong> eof
<seb128> thanks FJKong
<seb128> #topic flexiondotorg
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: flexiondotorg
<seb128> flexiondotorg, hey
<flexiondotorg> Hi all
<flexiondotorg> I was sick a couple of days last week and had a day off Friday.
<seb128> oh :-( hope you are better!
<flexiondotorg> Apart from that I've mostly been working on documentation, videos and examples for Electron and nodejs developers to snap their software.
<flexiondotorg> I'm presenting at the London Nodejs User Group tomorrow night.
<flexiondotorg> eof
<flexiondotorg> I am recovered :-)
<seb128> thanks flexiondotorg and good luck for the user group presentation
<flexiondotorg> ty
<seb128> #topic happyaron
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: happyaron
<seb128> happyaron, hey, there or should I copy the summary you emailed?
<seb128> guess I copy
<seb128> 1. bug #1672749: lxd assumes zfs kernel module is always available
<seb128> 2. bug #1673197: zfs root pool breakage fix
<seb128> 3. Tries to reproduce wpa_supplicant crash bug #1651799 at office lab,
<seb128> the problem is reported frequently in errors.u.c
<seb128> 4. Review and help on ubuntukylin-wallpapers for which they are doing
<ubot5> bug 1672749 in zfs-linux (Ubuntu) "Please don't assume zfs module is always loaded" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1672749
<seb128> it on their own for the first time
<ubot5> bug 1673197 in zfs-linux (Ubuntu) "Upgrading zfs-initramfs breaks booting from a zfs root" [Critical,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1673197
<ubot5> bug 1651799 in wpa (Ubuntu) "/sbin/wpa_supplicant:11:p2p_group_assoc_resp_ie:send_assoc_resp:handle_assoc:ieee802_11_mgmt:ap_mgmt_rx" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1651799
<seb128> thanks happyaron!
<seb128> #topic hikiko
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: hikiko
<seb128> * u7 - lowgfx: approved
<seb128> * chromium mir:
<seb128> working on input events:
<seb128> - creating a mir platform in ui/events/platform similar to the x11, in order to translate the mir events to ui events that can be dispatched and used by ozone.
<seb128> EOF
<seb128> #topic Laney
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Laney
<seb128> Laney, hey!
<Laney> sup
<Laney> â¢ short week, off for 2 days
<Laney> â¢ new gtk, new glib, new g-i
<Laney> â¢ debug a gjs crash with upstream (breaking libsecret tests), fix that
<Laney> â¢ fix to glib tests for new tzdata
<Laney> â¢ packaging for new default wallpaper, contest ones still pending
<Laney> â¢ fix the appstream generator cloud stuff to support dropping arches, needed now that ppc is gone in zesty - currently testing on staging
<Laney> â¢ review a britney branch for rob_ru
<Laney> â¢ review a pull-lp-source branch for dd_street
<Laney> ðï¸
<attente> thanks for gtk Laney
<Laney> mmm
<Laney> not very happy about it
<Laney> but there we go
<Laney> gtk-mir users should be pleased
<attente> yeah...
<seb128> speaking about britney, unsure who did the "your package is stucked in proposed email" thing but that might need tweaking to not email 1 day after when it's just that infra is busy
<seb128> what happened to gtk/gtk-mir which you are not fully happy about?
<attente> the s390x no-mir hack
<seb128> oh, the s390x thing
<Laney> there's a bug about fixing that
<seb128> right
<seb128> thanks Laney
<Laney> don't think anybody is working on it
<seb128> :-(
<seb128> k, let's keep moving
<seb128> qengho is out so I'm next
<seb128> #topic seb128
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: seb128
<seb128> â¢ had a day off on friday
<seb128> â¢ tested zesty daily
<seb128> â¢ reviewed new u8 ubuntu print packages for NEW
<seb128> â¢ tried to debug the zesty sessioninstaller issue on my xenial, was not a good idea, spent some time restoring a working machine then went the vm way
<seb128> â¢ usual share of discussions & bugs triaging
<seb128> </week>
<seb128> #topic Sweet5hark
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Sweet5hark
<seb128> Sweet5hark, hey
<Sweet5hark> - published LibreOffice 5.3.1/snap on amd64 in sync with upstream
<Sweet5hark> - bumped LibreOffice 5.3/zesty to 5.3.1 (thanks _jbicha for sponsoring)
<Sweet5hark> - some coordination for Perugia Hackfest (I hope to attend): https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Hackfest/Perugia2017
<Sweet5hark> - found, analysed and proposed a solution for debian bug 858199 (simple, once you figured out what went wrong), cherry-picked the debian commits to zesty as -0ubuntu2
<ubot5> Debian bug 858199 in libreoffice-dev-common "broken /usr/include/libreoffice/sal/typesizes.h symlink on !amd64" [Grave,Fixed] http://bugs.debian.org/858199
<Sweet5hark> - had to protect some upstream volunteer contributors from ranting fools shouting about their pet peeves: L3 support isnt a free lunch, esp.  not if you didnt even test betas
<Sweet5hark> - tdf#34653 mentoring/code review
<Sweet5hark> - some upstream code refactoring/cleanup for sanity
<Sweet5hark> - some more backups, rotating auth tokens, setup new machine. Found it has a dead speaker _after_ completely move my workflow on it. annoying.
<Sweet5hark> - TDF admin, some leadership
<Sweet5hark> - there is a job offer at TDF, please share with friends: https://blog.documentfoundation.org/blog/2017/03/14/development-mentor/
<Sweet5hark> - libreoffice 1:5.3.1-0ubuntu2 still running as the meeting started, so there is finally hope those will complete for zesty
<Sweet5hark> EOF
<seb128> thanks Sweet5hark
<seb128> btw you might want to put the "_" in the middle of the nicknames rather than at the start to avoid pinging people
<seb128> #topic TheMuso
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: TheMuso
<seb128> * More testing on a patch that was included in a point release upstream for at-spi2-core to prevent crashes, just missed the freeze, but should be ok to get into zesty as a patch now that I'm sure it works fine.
<seb128> * Foolowed up with Konrad about pulse and bluetootha dn bluez in Xenial, haven't heard back yet.
<seb128> * Re-familiarizing myself with various bits and pieces to try and help a bit with FTBFS where I can in coming weeks before release.
<seb128> * More ubiquity a11y debugging, not having much luck tracking down the issue I'm seeing with Orca not reading some installer pages, and then other times they work fine. Will continue to investigate.
<seb128> #topic tkamppeter
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: tkamppeter
<seb128> tkamppeter, hey
<tkamppeter> - ippusbxd: Some further testing, applied upstream bug fixes to Zesty package.
<tkamppeter> - system-config-printer: As IPP-over-USB is designed for driverless printing and conventional drivers (like HPLIP) do not necessarily work with it, made system-config-printer's UDEV-triggered queue auto-generator use driverless PPDs generated from IPP-polling the printer.
<tkamppeter> - The two changes above fix the use of IPP-over-USB printers in Ubuntu and allow driverless printing via USB, possibly enabling 100s of additional printers which did not work before under Linux (inkjets from Brother, Canon, ..., cheap lasers, ...). If you are able to print on your printer directly from a smartphone this printer probably will also work under Zesty.
<tkamppeter> - Google Summer of Code 2017: Continued on student selection and preparation.
<tkamppeter> - Bugs.
<seb128> tkamppeter, nice work on getting ipp-over-usb to work!
<seb128> thanks tkamppeter
<seb128> #topic Trevinho
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Trevinho
<Laney> nice
<seb128> hey Trevinho
 * Laney learns about printing from a smartphone too
<Laney> never thought about doing that
<Trevinho> Â· Rewritten snap-preload to use C++14 variardic template and adding some more functionalities
<Trevinho> Â· Fixed some issues of the hikiko unity lowgfx branch
<Trevinho> Â· Rewritten the lowgfx ucc panel
<Trevinho>  /eof
<seb128> Trevinho, is the ucc change up for review?
<seb128> or do you plan to land that this cycle or next?
<seb128> (rewrite probably needs a ffe)
<Trevinho> seb128: not yet as I'm doing some stuff to support changing the vars in systemd too
<Trevinho> seb128: hikiko opened a FFe bug, not sure the status of that yet... But I can wait for next in case
<seb128> k
<seb128> thanks Trevinho
<seb128> #topic robert_ancell
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: robert_ancell
<seb128> - Complete snapd-qt regression tests, fix bugs in snapd-qt
<seb128> - Chasing down gnome-software bugs
<seb128> - si
<seb128> ups
<seb128>  3.24.0 release
<seb128> - Email catching up...
<seb128> (sorry selection issue)
<seb128> #topic aob
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: aob
<Laney> si, seÃ±or
<seb128> did I forget anyone? any other topic?
<seb128> lol
<seb128> la playa!
<seb128> no topic I guess?
<seb128> zesty beta is coming
<seb128> Laney, you probably are the one atm who has the best overview of the desktop status on zesty, is there anything concerning you or things we should pick up as a team/need to sort out that you know?
<seb128> anyway can discuss that after the meeting
<seb128> let's wrap then
<seb128> thanks everyone
<seb128> #endmeeting
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | requests paired with a pink killer will be given preferential treatment
<meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Mar 21 16:02:08 2017 UTC.
<meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2017/ubuntu-desktop.2017-03-21-15.30.moin.txt
<Laney> might be that robert needs some help on https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-software/+bug/1672424
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1672424 in gnome-software (Ubuntu Yakkety) "Cannot install Debian files outside of the repositories" [Critical,Confirmed]
<Laney> and that sessioninstaller bug
<Laney> otherwise don't think so, but i didn't heavily use the 3.24 stuff
<desrt> mvo: hey.  got a second to chat about snappy and dbus (and/or tell me who i should talk to about that in more detail)?  basically, dbus will soon grow a way to create transient unix sockets meant to be used for a specific confined app in order to apply a stricter security policy to connections initiating from that socket.
<seb128> Laney, ok, thanks, I'm currently looking at sessioninstaller and I'm going to give a ping to robert_ancell about the g-s one
<Laney> cool!
<Laney> and that britney one is https://bugs.launchpad.net/britney/+bug/1671468
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1671468 in britney "email policy sends email when package is REJECTED_TEMPORARILY" [Undecided,New]
<seb128> oh, good, thanks
<seb128> I received one about glib on friday
<seb128> but it migrated over the w.e (dunno if somebody did some manual poking or if it just took over a day)
<jbicha> I probably helped nudge it through by retrying autopkgtests
<jbicha> tkamppeter: would you be interested in adding the ipp-over-usb improvements to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ZestyZapus/ReleaseNotes#Ubuntu_Desktop ?
<jbicha> Laney: could you sync gdk-pixbuf from experimental? thanks
<ricotz> *shrug* why was usr/share/vala/vapi/libnm-glib.* dropped from libnm-glib-dev.install of network-manager?
<Laney> jbicha: guess so
<Laney> ricotz: you'll probably get better results if you ask the uploader directly (don't know who that is)
<ricotz> Laney, I don't know either ;), just noticed it while yakkety has it
<ricotz> there was not changelog mentioning, so I guess it was not intentional
<Laney> ok, but you can look at the packages to find out when it happened
<ricotz> Laney, doing that currently
<Laney> thanks!
<jbicha> ricotz: yes, it looks accidental, I wonder why Debian's nm package doesn't enable the vala bindings
<jbicha> is there a bug for this issue?
<ricotz> yeah, 1.4.2-2ubuntu1 dropped it, looking at happyaron ;)
<ricotz> libnm-util-dev:amd64: /usr/share/vala/vapi/libnm-util.* still there
<ricotz> jbicha, no bug report
<jbicha> --list-missing is annoying, we should probably use --fail-missing instead
<ricotz> ack
<b4n> hi!
<b4n> compiz question: is there a way to "unload" a sharde with the newish API?  e.g. I addShaders(), and would like to remove them from the cache at some point
<b4n> as IIUC there's cacheinternally in the opengl plugin
<jbicha> hmm, nm ftbfs
<willcooke> hi all
<jbicha> willcooke: you show up for work at closing time?! ;)
<jbicha> (I'm kidding of course)
<seb128> hey willcooke
<seb128> jbicha, Laney, do you know why the gedit icon changed in zesty? is that a feature or a bug? (it looks less nice imho, I wonder if the name changed and the theme didn't get updated or something)
<jbicha> https://git.gnome.org/browse/gedit/commit/?id=176a2c7
<davmor2> cyphermox: no prompt in freesoftware mode on another laptop that doesn't have uefi :(
<seb128> jbicha, so the theme needs updating to symlink gedit->oldname?
<jbicha> seb128: yes, could you file a bug against humanity-icon-theme for that?
<seb128> jbicha, k
<Laney> this was already the case in yakkety btw
<seb128> I'm still on xenial :p
<seb128> nobody noticed or it was just decided that it was good like that?
<seb128> it looks non-centered to me in the unity launcher which is what bothers me a bit, but maybe it just takes some getting used to
<Laney> dunno
<Laney> I didn't actively decide either way
<Laney> looks fine to me, but if someone cares they can feel free to fix it after getting a UIF exception
<jbicha> nobody noticed; that was an old change
<seb128> I'm not getting an UIF for a bugfix :p
<Laney> it's about the documentation
<Laney> doesn't matter if it's a bug or not
<seb128> k, well that can wait next cycle if we decide to change it
<Laney> but also I don't care so it doesn't matter in any event :-)
<seb128> I can't be bothered doing paperwork for that
<Laney> ok
<Laney> probably they don't have a picture of the gedit icon anyway
<jbicha> without the UIF, we can do it next cycle if Design or whoever likes the humanity icon better
<seb128> yeah
<seb128> well as said the upstream one looks unbalanced in the unity launcher
<seb128> more space on the right
<seb128> but maybe it's only me
<jbicha> if you hover over the third link next to the picture at https://help.ubuntu.com/stable/ubuntu-help/ you'll see a gedit icon
<seb128> the brown background is also less modern/clean that the grey one we get with the humanity one
<seb128> yeah
<seb128> that website has the good old one :-)
<Laney> brown?
<seb128> isn't that a color?
 * seb128 checks english dict
<jbicha> oh better link: https://help.ubuntu.com/17.04/ubuntu-help/
<Laney> yes but I don't see any
<davmor2> seb128: no it's a colour
<seb128> jbicha, still the same?
<jbicha> I think you'd get approval from the docs team since it looks like the screenshots haven't been updated for a while
<Laney> anyway
<Laney> more discussion than it requires
<seb128> Laney, http://people.canonical.com/~seb128/zestyicon.png
<seb128> Laney, that's daily zesty in a vm for me, gedit is at the bottom of the launcher
<seb128> Laney, you might call that orange or green dunno?
<Laney> oh right, the one chosen by unity when it's running
<Laney> quite similar to firefox's one
<seb128> not that far, a bit less colorful though, at least it looks a bit old fashion to me while the firefox one is more happy
<seb128> but I'm more annoyed by the fact it's not centered :p
<Laney> haha
<Laney> right, you obviously have a better eye for such things than me
<Laney> I don't care one single bit about either of those things but I believe you do :-)
<jbicha> seb128: have you seen Nautilus' new very blue icon? (switch your icon theme to Adwaita)
<seb128> I usually don't, that one just bother my "things must be correctly aligned or it looks weird" :p
<seb128> grraa
<seb128> Trevinho, maaarrrcccoo
<seb128> killed compiz and it closed my session on zesty :-/
<seb128> jbicha, adwaita is not listed in u-c-c, tried to set the key to "Adwaita" but I guess it's not the right name?
<jbicha> gsettings set org.gnome.desktop.interface icon-theme 'Adwaita'
<seb128> I did that, icon is not blue
<seb128> oh well
<jbicha> it used to be that you'd have to log out of Unity for the icon theme to fully update?
<seb128> no
<seb128> but there I logged out
<seb128> well being forced out, I killed compiz and session closed
<seb128> anyway need to go for a bit, I'm going to debug sessioninstaller a bit more later
<seb128> one issue/change compared to xenial is that apt-xapian-index is not on the iso anymore it seems
<seb128> unsure why
<seb128> but it makes it hit another codepath since it uses that
<seb128> oh well that's for later, need to go for now
<seb128> have a nice evening desktopers
<Laney> night!
<flexiondotorg> Night
<willcooke> night seb128
<jbicha> seb128: apt-xapian-index is in universe as of xenial
<Laney> night from me too
<willcooke> cya Laney
<willcooke> night all
<tkamppeter> jbicha, I have added a paragraph about driverless printing to the Realease Notes now.
<jbicha> thanks! :)
<ricotz> jbicha, Laney, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/network-manager/+bug/1650972 o.O
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1650972 in network-manager (Ubuntu) "No .vapi in Zesty" [Undecided,New]
<ricotz> looks like there was a bug after all, even for quite some time
#ubuntu-desktop 2017-03-22
<ricotz> good morning desktopers
<ricotz> https://launchpad.net/~ricotz/+archive/ubuntu/staging/+sourcepub/7567774/+listing-archive-extra
<ricotz> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/network-manager/+bug/1650972
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1650972 in network-manager (Ubuntu) "No .vapi in Zesty" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<Laney> hey HEY
<davmor2> Morning all
<willcooke> o/
<seb128> hey u.k band
<b4n> andyrock, Trevinho: any news on https://code.launchpad.net/~banw/compiz/compiz.a11y-shotcuts/+merge/320091 ? :)
<davmor2> seb128: oh we are a band I hope it's a rock band
<seb128> it's up to you to decide!
<Laney> we're west country folk
<Laney> the wurzels
<davmor2> Laney: I don't even mind that as long as we aren't a rap band or a boy band
<Laney> uk garage it is
<davmor2> Laney: /me always hears UK rap like this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JAIOzM7SsMo
<davmor2> Laney: Nice cover of Zombie
 * Laney dies
<Laney> made about 10 seconds of that
<desrt> hi hackers
<davmor2> Laney: wuss that was a number 4 hit
<davmor2> Laney: it is pretty much how UK rap sounds in comparison to US rap though :)
<Laney> hi desrt
<Laney> how's the london?
<seb128> hey desrt
<davmor2> Laney: also that's still not a bad song in comparison to some I know :D
<Laney> :((((
 * Sweet5hark prefers french rap to UK rap for the most part. French rap appears like something of its own, while UK rap cant escape to appear wannabe to me.
<Sweet5hark> ^ Sentence best consumed with some spice girls rapping in the background.
<ogra_> Sweet5hark, is that because one is european and the other is brexit ?
<desrt> Laney: wet.
<desrt> seb128: hi :)
<Laney> desrt: you seem to have come during the second winter
<desrt> ya..... happy to be outside of the continent, as not to shatter my illusions about what's going on there
<willcooke> Right, that does it.  5ghz wifi access point is going in the bin.
<allison[m]> so, matrix is the hot new thing in gnomeworld
<allison[m]> time to cancel my irccloud account, apparently
<Laney> ya, everyone's around with these [m] nicks
<allison[m]> i wonder if it's possible to get rid of them....
<Laney> and if you tab complete someone else on matrix it substitutes their full name on IRC
<Laney> which looks curious :-)
<allison[m]> seems that i'm the only matrix user in this channel...
<allison[m]> the web client is substantially nicer than irccloud
<allison[m]> (to say nothing of the phone app)
<Laney> ricotz: is that nm patch forwarded?
<Laney> or is that code part of a distro delta?
<ricotz> Laney, see https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=780032
<ubot5> Gnome bug 780032 in gobject "Add missing attributes to two functions" [Normal,Resolved: fixed]
<ricotz> Laney, and I didn't forward it
<Laney> might be nice to
<Laney> and patch headers would be good in future too
<ricotz> Laney, hmm, I thought I mentioned the bug report at the top of the patch
<seb128> Laney, allison[m], what's the point of that [m]?
<Laney> I think matrix puts it on for you
<seb128> for a technical reason?
<seb128> or just to as free-advertizing for their service?
<seb128> jbicha, was enabling the packagekit backend in http://launchpadlibrarian.net/294723961/gnome-software_3.22.2+git20161108.0.a58dfc7-0ubuntu3_3.22.2+git20161108.0.a58dfc7-0ubuntu4.diff.gz voluntary? it's not documented in the changelog
<seb128> Laney, ^ you might know?
<Laney> no I don't, it wasn't anything to do with me
<Laney> is there a problem?
<seb128> yeah, I know it doesn't have to do with you, but you follow a bit what's going on so I asked in case, no worry
<seb128> that's what leads to sessioninstaller not working
<seb128> g-s owns the packagekit session bus name when pkgkit is enabled
<jbicha> seb128: the pk backend is not actually enabled in Ubuntu's gnome-software
<seb128> jbicha, build log disagrees with you
<seb128> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/294733318/buildlog_ubuntu-zesty-amd64.gnome-software_3.22.2+git20161108.0.a58dfc7-0ubuntu4_BUILDING.txt.gz
<Laney> it certainly is enabled
<seb128> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/294733318/buildlog_ubuntu-zesty-amd64.gnome-software_3.22.2+git20161108.0.a58dfc7-0ubuntu4_BUILDING.txt.gz
<Laney> it just doesn't normally cause a problem because the apt backend conflicts it out
<seb128>         PackageKit support:        yes
<Laney> seems it does actually do something though
<seb128> well since that version the deb ships /usr/share/dbus-1/services/org.freedesktop.PackageKit.service
<seb128> so at least that's one issue
<jbicha> seb128: ok, let me explicitly disable it, thanks!
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> so that was an overlook?
<seb128> in any case we should make it work
<seb128> but it's a bit late for this cycle to start on that
<Laney> make packagekit work?
<jbicha> we can either use the pk backend or the apt backend, we can't have both
<seb128> removing that .service makes code install work
<seb128> codec
<seb128> I just did a rm locally
<seb128> Laney, but we don't use packagekit so it's rather "implement that feature in the apt backend"?
<Laney> asking what you mean by 'make it work'
<seb128> or do we use the pkgkit backend for some bits like codecs?
<seb128> I don't know yet
<seb128> I just figured out that it was the issue
<seb128> I'm poking at g-s code next
<seb128> I keep you updated
<Laney> jbicha is going to turn off packagekit, so then it will stop producing the .service file
<seb128> that fixes it
<seb128> but I don't know enough about current g-s to know if packagekit is useful/used in some other way atm
<Laney> but
<Laney> it would be good to make it work so we can drop sessioninstaller next cycle
<Laney> so feel free to continue on that path
<Laney> I think you need gstraemer1.0-packagekit at least
<Laney> I should guess it's because /usr/share/dbus-1/services/sessioninstaller.service has the same Name= as /usr/share/dbus-1/services/org.freedesktop.PackageKit.service
<Laney> well done for finding it :-)
<jbicha> +1
<seb128> yeah
<jbicha> if we switch gnome-software to use pk instead of apt, g-software can handle codecs, you do not need gstreamer1.0-packagekit
<seb128> unsure what is blocking us to use the packagekit backend
<jbicha> you can try it out with https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/+archive/ubuntu/gnome-software/
<davmor2> jbicha: it can't now
<jbicha> well, right now, it's Feature Freeze :)
<seb128> not only
<seb128> one of the blockers was performances
<seb128> and I don't think that got resolved
<Laney> somebody testing it and committing to doing any work required
<Laney> it's fine and trivial to do the packaging side
<seb128> whoever wants to switch should at least properly benchmark
<Laney> but it's not acceptable to drop a shitty experience on us and then stand back
<davmor2> currently if you open a video without a codec it fails to open software center at all so I think worrying about if it can install them is a mote point
<Laney> yes we know
<seb128> davmor2, can you read the backlog?
<seb128> your comment suggest you didn't
<davmor2> seb128: no racing between machines too much
<seb128> we are being discussing solutions for that issue
<davmor2> seb128: ah cool
<seb128> davmor2, k, so please just step out of the discussion, you are commenting about things which were already raised/resolved
<davmor2> seb128: \o/
<jbicha> the g-s- fix is in the zesty unapproved queue
<jbicha> g-s-with-pk actually did a clean start faster for me than gs-with-apt but then it takes a while to fill out the Installed page for instance
<jbicha> please add concerns or comments to LP: #1643134
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1643134 in gnome-software (Ubuntu) "Switch gnome-software to use PackageKit backend" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1643134
<Laney> jbicha: I don't think it's helpful to think of it as a packaging driven change. Someone needs to own the work, figure out the problems and then drive a process of fixing them.
<Laney> The mechanical stuff is relatively trivial.
<jbicha> well I've done the testing in the bug description
<jbicha> gs-with-apt has bugs too that haven't been fixed either; switching to pk solves some of those (but at the expense of making it even less likely someone will get around to fixing those bugs in xenial)
<didrocks> I know some fedora contributors/users not really happy with the pkgkit usage on g-s
<didrocks> really bad experience, like having to refresh multiple times the package list, no feedback of upgrade happening behind the scene
<didrocks> (sometimes, you click refresh and it looks like you are done, but reclicking then retrigger a request, blocking for a good 5 minutes, and you have your package list)
<didrocks> you can have to hit the refresh 5 times
<didrocks> the issues were identified in the packagekit using from gnome-software
<didrocks> usage*
<didrocks> I did test it myself yesterday in a vm, and can confirm
<didrocks> the benefit for free is the offline update though
<jbicha> I believe we can disable gnome-software's Updates by default in 3.24 which I assume we'll do since we have update-manager
<didrocks> yes, but we would still have those refresh package list bugs
<didrocks> that are unresolved as of fedora 26 at least
<didrocks> so, proper and long time benchmarking/testing is really needed before taking any decision IMHO
<didrocks> coming from fedora fanboys and contributors themselves, I wouldn't take their concerns lightely
<jbicha> didrocks: did you test gs-with-packagekit on Ubuntu? https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/+archive/ubuntu/gnome-software/
<Laney> Essentially we should take responsibility for it after the switch
<didrocks> jbicha: I didn't, I don't work on desktop anymore, I'm just giving here some hints of the words on the street from people close to those upstreams
<seb128> jbicha, start I don't know about, it's just computation of upgrades/install and actions that we slower, part of the issues were due to aptcc from what the debian maintainers said iirc
<Laney> It's all well and good to test it, but then the next steps need to happen too
<seb128> but what Laney says
<seb128> whoever does the switch should own the transition/to get things in shape
<Laney> Fair enough you might think the apt backend is crap, but our team *has* contributed there, and we have fixed bugs even if there are others remaining
<Laney> The same will have to happen with the packagekit backend
<Laney> This piece of software requires more integratin than most
<jbicha> let's take a look again after zesty
<jbicha> installing apps doesn't feel slow to me; and if we don't even use the Updates part then slowness there won't matter except for people who intentionally enable that
<seb128> jbicha, by "update" I mean installing pending updates, which we can do from our UI
<jbicha> seb128: I don't think we want both GNOME Software and update-manager handling pending updates
<seb128> no we don't
<seb128> but the update tab is there in g-s
<seb128> so it should be usable for users who manually decide to go there and use it
<seb128> or we should remove it
<jbicha> https://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-software/commit/?id=81dbe62
<seb128> ah, ok
<seb128> I'm undecided on that
<seb128> I still think a package management UI should allow you to update installed packages, synaptic of software-center allows that as well
<jbicha> yes but it's not well-integrated yet (for instance because of phased-updates, gnome-software shows you updates that you don't see in update-manager)
<seb128> well I guess we could disable the tab
<seb128> as long as you can do "update" from a detailed view of a specific software
<Laney> what about firmware updates, snap updates (do they always happen automatically?), flatpak updates?
<seb128> good point
<jbicha> oh, you're right, it's complicated :(
<Laney> and then is it weird that there's one type of update you don't see in there (deb packages)?
<Laney> tough stuff!
<seb128> I don't think it's a big deal to have g-s listing updates and still having update-manager defaulting to be the tools to apply those
<seb128> users who just apply those don't see g-s
<seb128> those who go to g-s expect a package management tool
<jbicha> gs-with-pk only does offline upgrades now (at least for system updates) which is "interesting"
<Laney> it's all fixable
<willcooke> quttin' time.  I'm off tomorrow (going to the NEC) so back Friday.  Toodles
<jbicha> FJKong: good morning, for LP: #1644781 you'll want to look at the extra dependencies added in 3.21.91-2 but it looks like Debian missed the evince one
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1644781 in gnome-sushi (Ubuntu) "Sushi-start fails with 16.10 upgrade, both Unity and Mate" [High,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1644781
#ubuntu-desktop 2017-03-23
<FJKong> jbicha: hey, from the changelog it should fix the depdency problem I will build and test if it works
<hikiko> hi
<allison> Good morning!
<hikiko> good morning allison :)
<hikiko> new nickname?
<allison> Matrix calls me this :p
<allison> @allison:matrix.org or something?
<meetingology> allison: Error: "allison:matrix.org" is not a valid command.
<hikiko> matrix reveals your real identity... what kind of matrix is that?
<Laney> ahoy
<hikiko> hello
<davmor2> Morning all
<seb128> hey hikiko allison Laney davmor2
<seb128> allison, what's so cool about that matrix thing?
<hikiko> hi seb128 allison Laney davmor2 .*
<Laney> hey seb128 allison Laney davmor2 hikiko meetingology FJKong
<seb128> hey Laney, what's up?
<hikiko> lol @meetingology
<Laney> get it in early
<Laney> the bots are coming to rule us
<Laney> seb128: good climbing last night \m/
<seb128> if they do my work as well then fine they can rule IRC
<Laney> dunno why it turned to winter again though
<Laney> had to stop to find my gloves on the cycle home
<seb128> it's quite pleasant here, a tide cold maybe but sunny in the day and not too windy
<Laney> what about you?
<FJKong> Laney: hey yo
<seb128> I had a fun evening at tennis!
<Laney> NICE
<seb128> :-)
<seb128> hey FJKong
<Laney> hey Trevinho hey andyrock
<FJKong> seb128: hi
<seb128> italians are hidding!
<seb128> let's see if that makes come out of their corner
<seb128> +them
<Laney> anyone know about xkeyboard-config?
<Laney> Gunnar is asking to merge a new version
<Laney> don't know if that is safe or not
<Laney> tjaalton: ^- maybe?
<Laney> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xkeyboard-config/+bug/1655782
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1655782 in xkeyboard-config (Ubuntu) "[FFe] Elfdalian layout + merge with Debian 2.19-1" [Medium,In progress]
<tjaalton> sure
<tjaalton> it's fine
<tjaalton> Laney: mind checking https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xorg-server/+bug/1671799 with your release team hat on
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1671799 in xorg-server (Ubuntu) "FFe: xserver 1.19.3" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<tjaalton> ?
<Laney> tjaalton: Maybe, but it seems risky coming after final beta?
<tjaalton> not after weeks of testing
<tjaalton> and it's in stretch
<Laney> you're saying it is risk free?
<tjaalton> nothig is
<tjaalton> -ing
<tjaalton> but relatively so
<Laney> hmm
<Laney> davmor2: got some time to test that new xorg ^- maybe?
<davmor2> Laney: not before the release of final beta, unless there is going to be a respin on day of release meaning the entire series needs a retest?
<Laney> no, it's a proposed update
<davmor2> Laney: so I can hit it after I finish testing iso's then
<Laney> sure
<tjaalton> thanks
<seb128> flexiondotorg, bug #1632686 is one of the most reported zesty issues on e.u.c, you might want to have a look
<ubot5> bug 1632686 in mate-panel (Ubuntu) "/usr/bin/mate-panel:11:gdk_window_get_user_data:panel_background_prepare:panel_background_composite:panel_background_composite:panel_background_transform" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1632686
<davmor2> jibel, Laney, seb128: Huston we have a problem! https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubiquity/+bug/1675127 was asked to look at this so on the xps13 in live desktop mode I added a usb wifi dongle and it isn't connecting I'll copy the logs somewhere and see if it is reproducible
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1675127 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "ubiquity crashed with TypeError in __new__(): 'NoneType' object is not iterable" [High,Triaged]
<seb128> happyaron, ^
<davmor2> happyaron: I added my syslog to the same bug with my steps Image I'm testing is zesty final beta locatable on cdimages.ubuntu.com/daily-live/current/
<davmor2> happyaron: not sure if it is the same issue with different drivers or different issues that present the same, with no dongle through I can connect with no issues once I install the bcmwl-kernel-sources package from the onboard wifi
<happyaron> davmor2: thanks, looks like the gi stuff of nma could be biting you
<happyaron> let me check in detail a bit later (have some stuff at hand atm
<happyaron> could be the regression jbich_a mentioned a litte earlier
<davmor2> happyaron: well if you need anything from this box give me a shout
<happyaron> ty
<davmor2> happyaron: might take a while as there is no internet connection on it but I will happily follow instructions :)
<happyaron> haha
<davmor2> seb128, Laney: was the plan to have a checkbox for virtual-machines dropped in the end? Or is it hidden somewhere I haven't found yet?
<davmor2> for the low gfx mode
<andyrock> hey all
<Laney> davmor2: It wasn't/isn't finished in time, so no it's not in yet. I reckon it'll be for next cycle now.
<Laney> that should be auto detected anyway, the checkbox was to override it
<Laney> AFAIK
<davmor2> Laney: awesome thanks I was hoping that was the case :)
<davmor2> Laney: could be just didn't see it so thought I would double check it :)
<GunnarHj> Laney: Thanks for the "ok". Another thing: Bug #1675227 might be something you want to look at.
<ubot5> bug 1675227 in activity-log-manager (Ubuntu) "Can't add online account" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1675227
<Laney> One piece of work leads to another
<Laney> but no, that's not me
<seb128> GunnarHj, online accounts have nothing to do with a-l-m
<GunnarHj> Laney: I suppose you know who it is then. (Assumed you because you were the last who touched the package.)
<seb128> GunnarHj, try if https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/2608 fixes it for you?
<GunnarHj> seb128: Ah, wrong package.
<GunnarHj> seb128: Thanks. I marked my bug as a duplicate and will test it later (I'm not on zesty right now).
<seb128> GunnarHj, yw!
<Laney> a-l-m is only the security and privacy panel FWIW
<GunnarHj> Laney: Yeah, I mixed it up.
<Laney> 'k, just for info
<seb128> GunnarHj, btw wgrant replied to me yesterday saying that  he started a zesty translations export on launchpad, so we can start building langpacks in the next days
 * Laney goes for some tasty items
<GunnarHj> seb128: I started to wonder if there would be any langpacks in zesty. ;) But as regards the xenial update, I really think we should wait until after final freeze. The translators are busy with zesty now.
<seb128> GunnarHj, yeah, I still need to debug the xenial langpacks, the role account/cron job/upload works now but we only get "en" and touch langpacks generated for some reasons (and upload failed because it tries to reupload the same content as the first time it kicked in)
<GunnarHj> seb128: I see. I can't help, I'm afraid. pitti did all that stuff.
<seb128> right, don't worry I should be able to figure it out, just need to sit down and look at it some more
<GunnarHj> seb128: Ok. Btw, Laney approved bug #1655782 as an FFe. Any chance you can revisit it, or should I hope for somebody doing it on Wednesday (rbasak's queue initiative)?
<ubot5> bug 1655782 in xkeyboard-config (Ubuntu) "[FFe] Elfdalian layout + merge with Debian 2.19-1" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1655782
<seb128> GunnarHj, I can have another look, sorry I didn't see you updated/forgot about it
<GunnarHj> seb128: TIA
<bregma> hey guys I have a bug in which whole categories of applications hang on launch if gnome-session is not running (for example, under Unity 8)... this is fairly new behaviour and a ship-stopper, who here knows anything about that technology?
<flexiondotorg> hikiko Did the low graphics mode toggle, in the UI, land in 17.04?
<davmor2> flexiondotorg: no I asked earlier
<davmor2> <Laney> davmor2: It wasn't/isn't finished in time, so no it's not in yet. I reckon it'll be for next cycle now.
<flexiondotorg> davmor2 Thanks.
<davmor2> flexiondotorg: ^ Laney's response
<flexiondotorg> Cheers.
<hikiko> flexiondotorg, awaiting review
<flexiondotorg> hikiko Thanks.
<seb128> flexiondotorg, hey, did you see my bug mention earlier?
<flexiondotorg> seb128 No I missed it.
<tkamppeter> willcooke is still sick?
<Laney> tkamppeter: He said yesterday that he'd be off today
<tkamppeter> OK, thanks.
<Laney> RRRRRRRRRRIIIIIIIIIIIIiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight nighty night!
<mterry> seb128: do you know much about the user systemd service?  I can't reach it on dbus, it's dbus activation file doesn't work.  (Though it's running already it seems...  I'm confused) -- http://paste.ubuntu.com/24236229/ is output of trying to call it's dbus api
<mterry> Oh!  I'm in xenial
 * mterry tests in zesty
<mterry> That worked.  I guess xenial is just a bit busted (or at least is with the overlay enabled)
<tkamppeter> TheMuso, hi
<TheMuso> tkamppeter: I'm awawre of your bug, been busy. Will take a look today.
<tkamppeter> OK.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, how do I get activity-log-manager to get out of proposed? It's depwaiting on a s390x build - if you follow the whole chain of depwaits it gets to upstart, which doesn't have a s390x build.
<RAOF> Well, I guess you could port upstart to s390x... Or ping me with that information, and I'll release it ð
<robert_ancell> RAOF, will that need to happen for all uploads or is there a whitelist?
 * robert_ancell thought porting upstart was a little bit outside of the bug I'm fixing...
<RAOF> I'm not aware of a whitelist.
<RAOF> Another option would be to remove s390x from the architecture list?
<RAOF> I'm not sure how I feel about that.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, I think that was discussed at some point but there's too many packages
<RAOF> robert_ancell: You could also comment on the SRU bug that it's never built on s390x.
<robert_ancell> RAOF, the previous upload wasn't an SRU, but I can add that to the SRU if required
<RAOF> Oh, ok. That's why I can't see it on pending-sru :)
<RAOF> This is a zesty upload, then?
<robert_ancell> Yes
<robert_ancell> I did my update and collided with the version waiting there
<robert_ancell> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/activity-log-manager/0.9.7-0ubuntu24
<robert_ancell> And I just uploaded 0.9.7-0ubuntu25
<robert_ancell> Which will have to go through the freeze queue / wait for the freeze to end
<RAOF> Hrmph.
<robert_ancell> Problems?
<RAOF> I'm just wondering precisely what to do.
<RAOF> Also, you probably want an actual archive admin.
<RAOF> I just play on on the internet.
<RAOF> (For SRUs)
<RAOF> Also, GNOME Shell really doesn't like getting hundreds of mail notifications on resume-from-suspend :)
<robert_ancell> ok, I'll see who I can find in ~ubuntu-desktop
<robert_ancell> in ~ubuntu-devel rather
<robert_ancell> Or #ubuntu-devel even
<RAOF> #ubuntu-release is probably you're winner?
<robert_ancell> Sure, why not there too :)
<RAOF> Presumably this is brittney being obstructive...
#ubuntu-desktop 2017-03-24
<jbicha> Laney: I uploaded gtk3 with mir enabled for s390x to zesty's unapproved queue
<Trevinho> Laney: sorry, just noticed you mentioned me this morning... Please ping me again tomrorrow
<duflu> robert_ancell, help :S  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity-greeter/+bug/1675612
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1675612 in unity-greeter (Ubuntu) "zesty login screen is all black (with a cursor)" [Critical,New]
<robert_ancell> duflu, any log information?
<duflu> robert_ancell: Which log do you desire?
<robert_ancell> duflu, you can start with /var/log/lightdm.log
<duflu> Weird ubuntu-bug didn't attach that
<robert_ancell> duflu, did you file against u-g or lightdm?
<duflu> lightdm
<duflu> Although it prompted for a password and then complained about a failure. So probably that's why it could not get root-owned logs
<duflu> robert_ancell, attached. But do you want more info?
<robert_ancell> duflu, /var/log/lightdm/seat0-greeter.log
<robert_ancell> lightdm.log looks normal
<duflu> robert_ancell: Done
<robert_ancell> duflu, signal 10 is X signalling it is ready btw. Yes, it's stupid.
<duflu> And now launchpad's timing out. I can't change anything
<duflu> Usually this only happens when Europe wakes up
<robert_ancell> /usr/lib/unity-settings-daemon/unity-settings-daemon: symbol lookup error: /usr/lib/unity-settings-daemon/unity-settings-daemon: undefined symbol: gnome_settings_plugin_info_set_settings_prefix
<robert_ancell> That looks suspicious
<robert_ancell> Might be u-s-d that is broken
<robert_ancell> duflu, can you see if you can run it manually?
<duflu> robert_ancell, yes that's the problem
<duflu> $ /usr/lib/unity-settings-daemon/unity-settings-daemon
<duflu> /usr/lib/unity-settings-daemon/unity-settings-daemon: symbol lookup error: /usr/lib/unity-settings-daemon/unity-settings-daemon: undefined symbol: gnome_settings_plugin_info_set_settings_prefix
 * duflu hunts for the previous version
<robert_ancell> duflu, I suspect it's one of the GNOME deps dropping the symbol
<duflu> robert_ancell: Perhaps, but USC only changed 2 hours ago
<duflu> So that could be the trigger
<duflu> USD I mean
<robert_ancell> duflu, ah, you are right
<robert_ancell> https://code.launchpad.net/~jbicha/unity-settings-daemon/drop-updates-plugin/+merge/319275
<robert_ancell> jbicha, ^
<duflu> robert_ancell: Yeah the previous version fixes it
<jbicha> sorry, I had tested with kylin-greeter because it was pulled in when I was helping Kylin get UKUI in and I only now figured out what pkg I needed to remove to get unity-greeter back
<jbicha> robert_ancell: what's the fastest way to revert that?
<jbicha> do we have to use bileto here?
<robert_ancell> jbicha, I figure just committing directly and pushing to LP
<robert_ancell> jbicha, I'm building a package now
<robert_ancell> I dropped the line for the missing symbol, but that didn't work. So I'm reverting the whole merge
<jbicha> that's fine, maybe I'll try again next cycle
<robert_ancell> that fixed it
<jbicha> great!
<robert_ancell> 15.04.1+17.04.20170322-0ubuntu1.1
<robert_ancell> Let's hope it gets through before too many people download the other one...
<jbicha> you just need to find someone on the release team to let it though now :|
<jbicha> I'm off to bed now, thanks for fixing that
<TheMuso> Glad I haven't updated yet. :)
<TheMuso> s/upgraded/updated/
<robert_ancell> jbicha, np!
<robert_ancell> duflu, good catch
<duflu> robert_ancell: This is often an unlucky timezone for broken updates
<hikiko> Î·Î¹
<hikiko> hi
<hikiko> :p
<duflu> hikiko,   o/
<duflu> Saviq, Could you perhaps add descriptions to those major milestones? It's not clear to me what the difference between them is
<Saviq> duflu, dates, really
<duflu> Well, yeah. Different milestones on the one project tend to have different dates
<duflu> Oh they have "Expected"
<Saviq> yup, that's it
<Saviq> that's when we "close" the milestone
<duflu> 'u8c-1' expected '7 hours ago'
<Saviq> which is why I'm moving bugs that we didn't manage to close out to the next milestone(s)
<duflu> It's slightly confusing that the order is "1, z, 2"
<duflu> Is 2 what we would historically call "SRU0" ?
<Saviq> duflu, we're not gonna be SRUing it
<duflu> Saviq: Oh z+1 then?
<Saviq> well, yes, just a date
<duflu> My confusion stems from the fact that I expect milestone 2 to follow from 1. But it doesn't
<Saviq> duflu, -z is "for zesty still", -2 is "further out"
<duflu> Yeah. I would suggest name "2" with a description "zesty..." and rename the old "2" to "3" with a description "17.10..."
<duflu> Rename "z" to "2"
<willcooke> o/
<Laney> yo!
<didrocks> hey willcooke, Laney!
<Laney> hey didrocks, happy friday
<davmor2> Morning all
<Laney> jbicha: I was already checking a gtk with s390x/mir...
<Laney> How did you test build / check installability?
<Laney> hey davmor2
<Laney> how's it going?
<davmor2> willcooke: so final beta not too bad \o/ only 1 thing that definitely needs fixing which happyaron is aware of already
<davmor2> Laney: it goes good, you?
<willcooke> nice one, thanks davmor2
<Laney> acceptable
<Laney> only one tea drunk so far
<davmor2> Laney: I'm on my first coffee of the day so I'm one behind you
<Laney> happyaron: are you working on that bug?
<allison> good morning tea drinkers!!
<happyaron> Laney: yep on my list
<happyaron> (the list is short
<Laney> hey allison
 * Laney misses desrt :(
<allison> Laney: :(
<allison> Laney: where'd she go?
<Laney> maybe found an oass
<allison> oa(ss)?
<Laney> or a camltrn
 * Laney ho ho ho HO HO HO
<Sweet5hark> bonjours a tous!
<Laney> tag Sweet5hark
<Laney> how's it going
<Sweet5hark> I'll be on vacation next week. Anything missing/needing handover still? 5.2 is EOL upstream 5.3 wont have a final release next week and 5.3.1 is in zesty-proposed and in snap. So -- fingers crossed -- it should be good. If there is anything else, ping me now. ;)
<Sweet5hark> Laney: heya, last workday before a week of and the weather is sunny and beautiful. Thats ... somewhat rare ... in Hamburg. ;)
<Laney> \o\
<Laney> it's in the release not proposed
<Laney> went over after the beta
<Sweet5hark> ah, even better. didnt recheck before writing.
<Laney> you going somewhere nice?
<Sweet5hark> Laney: no. not really far. Its only a week and I wont fly away or something. But I plan to steal my parent mobile home for a few days and do a unplanned trip: to Denmark, north sea or baltic.
<Sweet5hark> s/mobile home/motorhome/
<Laney> nice
<Laney> hope you get some sun
<Sweet5hark> Ill try ;)
<Laney> https://goo.gl/maps/ARmPRTFmAfr
<jbicha> Laney: I don't have a way to test s390x
<Laney> Silos provide builds, and let you run britney
<jbicha> I was told I need to join Canonical before I can join ~ci-train-ppa-service
<jbicha> or become a Core dev I guess
<Laney> I'm sure someone would have sponsored a package for you, but as I said I was already testing the same thing
<Laney> Less haste would have let you find that out
<Laney> Quite glad that ual stuff got done
<jbicha> I hadn't seen s390x discussed here in the past few days
<jbicha> so it surprised me when I started getting LP emails 'indicator-datetime_15.10+17.04.20170309-0ubuntu1_s390x.changes (Rejected)'
<alexarnaud> morning all :P !
<Laney> night!
<willcooke> Good night all, have a hoopy one
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-03-19
<FourDollars> thunderbird-locale-zh-hant is lacking in http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/seeds/ubuntu.bionic/desktop.minimal-remove.
<didrocks> good morning
<jibel> good morning
<duflu> Morning didrocks, jibel
<duflu> Ping tjaalton?
<duflu> ping RAOF
<didrocks> hey duflu, jibel
<RAOF> Yo yo
<duflu> RAOF: This fancy new glvnd stuff... do you know how to make it not ignore LD_LIBRARY_PATH (if I build a local mesa)?
<RAOF> There's probably an environment variable you can use...
<RAOF> I don't know off hand, though.
<RAOF> grep for getenv ð
<duflu> RAOF: I've been searching the source for such things but it looks nontrivial and indirect
<duflu> Relies on json text files and such
<oSoMoN> good morning/afternoon desktoppers
<duflu> Hi oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> hey duflu
<RAOF> EGL is driven by some json in /usr/share
<tjaalton> duflu: I don't know either
<duflu> tjaalton, OK. Yeah I can't bisect Mesa till I can convince the system to use my built Mesa :P
<RAOF> No getenv calls at all?
<RAOF> Odd
<didrocks> morning oSoMoN
<duflu> RAOF: Yes, but only for config dirs, that are expected to contain text files, which contain file names, not directories
 * duflu stops complaining and starts guessing
<RAOF> Does libglx communicate the right libgl to glvnd? I think that's the flow.
<duflu> RAOF: glvnd provides the one and only /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libGLX.so.0
<duflu> And vendors provide files by different names
<tjaalton> LD_PRELOAD doesn't work?
<tjaalton> maybe harder to get gdm on it
<duflu> tjaalton, yeah I vaguely recall gdm is a problem. Remind me why? Does it clobber LD_* ?
<tjaalton> just guessing, since it should work for testing failing apps/games with 'LD_PRELOAD=libfoo app'
<tjaalton> but in this case it's gdm and/or gnome-shell that would need that
<tjaalton> or cut corners and only point i965_dri.so to the bisected build, don't think the other libs would care
<duflu> tjaalton, using just the drivers last week yielded no commit without the bug. So I'm trying with full Mesa
<tjaalton> ok
<duflu> tjaalton, OK. Wedging the dir of a local Mesa build in here works: /etc/ld.so.conf.d/x86_64-linux-gnu.conf
<oSoMoN> salut didrocks, Ã§a va?
<didrocks> oSoMoN: Ã§a va bien, bon week-end, et toi ?
<oSoMoN> didrocks, trÃ¨s bien, super week-end, la forme!
<tsimonq2> Belated morning o/
<oSoMoN> good morning tsimonq2
<tsimonq2> o/ oSoMoN
<willcooke> morning all
<Laney> hey
<didrocks> hey willcooke, Laney
<willcooke> hi didrocks, how goes?
<didrocks> willcooke: good, but getting colder again. Yourself?
<czajkowski> morning
<willcooke> didrocks, yeah cold :)  Kids & Wife had sickness bug over the weekend.  So far I've avoided it.  Washing my hands in bleach.
<willcooke> hi czajkowski
<didrocks> willcooke: urgh, good luck with avoiding getting cotaminated :p
<didrocks> morning czajkowski!
<duflu> Morning willcooke, Laney, czajkowski
<duflu> tjaalton, happy Monday: https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=105518#c10
<ubot5`> Freedesktop bug 105518 in Drivers/DRI/i965 "Framebuffer corruption (briefly) when logging into Xorg sessions ("Xorg -background none") (Intel gen9 only)" [Normal,New]
<duflu> (the bug isn't happy, the bisection is)
<duflu> Tis indeed gen9 specific
<tjaalton> duflu: cool, I'll ping ben
<jibel> is there a reference somewhere that explains why ecryptfs has been demoted in 18.04?
<xnox> jibel, well, ecryptfs-utils is still not demoted.
<xnox> jibel, opened https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ecryptfs-utils/+bug/1756840 and dropping ecryptfs-utils from d-i requirements
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1756840 in ecryptfs-utils (Ubuntu) "Buggy, under-maintained, not fit for main anymore; alternatives exist" [Undecided,New]
<Trevinho> Hi guys
<jibel> xnox, yes but it will. It's just to answer to users asking why the option has been removed from Ubuntu.
<tseliot> Laney: hey, do you know why gdm uses XWayland in bionic?
<jibel> xnox, thanks
<xnox> jibel, i was expecting "demotion" to already have happened, and some bug # already mentioned, but it was not =)
<Laney> tseliot: not sure, some g-s-d thing maybe?
<tseliot> Laney: maybe it defaults to Wayland if the system supports it. This kind of breaks systems with intel+nvidia
<Laney> it does default to wayland
<Laney> you asked about Xwayland though
<tseliot> Laney: Xwayland is all I can see on my system
<Laney> you won't "see" wayland in the same way
<tseliot> gdm        922  1.0  1.4 566324 55136 tty1     Sl+  11:18   0:00 /usr/bin/Xwayland :1024 -rootless -terminate -accessx -core -listen 4 -listen 5 -displayfd 6
<darkxst> hey desktopers!
<Laney> right
<Laney> but "what is using Xwayland" is quite a different question to "is the session a wayland session"
<tseliot> Laney: how can I change that?
<darkxst> gdm still runs wayland for gdm in bionic
<darkxst> once you login you get Xorg
<Laney> tseliot: there's an option in /etc/gdm3/custom.conf
<Laney> WaylandEnable=false or something
<darkxst> but I wouldnt suggest using that^ unless gdm doesnt start
<Laney> I'm answering the questions that are asked.
<tseliot> The thing is, gdm starts, but I don't see my username or the icons
<tseliot> it doesn't seem to work
<darkxst> tseliot, but otherwise stuff is rendered ok?
<tseliot> darkxst: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1H47ilOtqzZkRIEWSObZaCrPgjywh2xsW/view?usp=sharing
<darkxst> tseliot, that is just wrong
<tseliot> things are fine once I log in
<tseliot> yep
<tseliot> and Xwayland is still there, BTW
<darkxst> can you enable debug in /etc/gdm/custom.conf
<darkxst> and grab logs
<darkxst> yes Xwayland is still required for gdm login
<tseliot> darkxst: is there a man page that explains how to do that?
<tjaalton> just edit the file, under [debug]
<tjaalton> "Enable=true"
<darkxst> yeh its like the last line in that file
<darkxst> then gdm will log to systemd journal
<darkxst> next time you reboot
<tseliot> oh, so the correct file is /etc/gdm3/custom.conf
<darkxst> yep
<tseliot> and yes, disabling Wayland seems to work now
<tseliot> I think hybrid graphics + glvnd + the custo glx path got Xwayland confused
<darkxst> what is custo?
<tseliot> *custom
<tseliot> the intel driver must be using nvidia's libglx.so
<tseliot> for some reason
<darkxst> tseliot, I dont have a hybrid machine with nvidia, but maybe it is getting confused
<darkxst> libglvnd has had its fair share of fallout
<darkxst> but gdm should in theory failback
<tseliot> in this case both intel and nvidia support wayland
<tseliot> except they won't work together
<darkxst> gdm fallback is based on failure, not advertised support? afaik
<tseliot> yes, I suspect that there is no failure there. Then gnome-shell crashes
<tseliot> darkxst: http://paste.ubuntu.com/p/jNrQXpSmty/
<darkxst> tseliot, please file a bug, and I will take a look tomorrow
<tseliot> darkxst: against gdm?
<tseliot> or gnome-shell?
<darkxst> It probably doesnt matter, it could be either
<darkxst> subscribe me to your bug
<darkxst> its late here, so I have to go
<tseliot> ok
<oSoMoN> good morning kenvandine! got this for you: https://code.launchpad.net/~osomon/evince/snap-fix-cbr/+merge/341634
<ahasenack> seb128
<ahasenack> does anybody know if he is on holidays?
<didrocks> he is until Friday
<ahasenack> ok, thanks
<kenvandine> oSoMoN, thx!
<Laney> jbicha: did you want to merge g-c-c with debian or otherwise hold off?
<Laney> I'm merging Gunnar's region stuff now
<jbicha> you can merge if you like. I just uploaded g-c-c to bionic (without the scrollbar fix) a few minutes ago :)
<Laney> whyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy
<Laney> I don't really fancy merging though
<Laney> this makes the bzr stuff really annoying :(
<Laney> urgh
<jbicha> bzr isn't my fault â¦ ;)
<jbicha> Seb's away this week thoughâ¦ lol
<jbicha> I'm fine with us not merging this time
<jbicha> btw, https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/ubuntu/+source/gnome-desktop/+git/gnome-desktop is on git too
<jbicha> I published that after Budapest before we said we weren't really going to switch all our pkgs to git right now
<Laney> I don't mind, but some people might ignore it
<jbicha> that's fine, that particular bzr branch was mostly ignored too
<jbicha> https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/gnome-desktop/ubuntu
<jbicha> Laney: do we need a FFe for LP: #1752579 to sync brlaser from Buster?
<ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1752579 in brlaser (Ubuntu) "Needs sponsoring: Upload brlaser 4" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1752579
<Laney> jbicha: what are the changes?
<jbicha> switch to cmake, add duplex printing support. I'm just reading from https://github.com/pdewacht/brlaser/releases/tag/v4 ;)
<jbicha> version 3 was July 2014
<jbicha> the duplex thing looks pretty minimal, so the switch to cmake is the big one. Better support for more printers.
<jbicha> I don't have a printer so I'm not actually running this myself
<Laney> I don't really know what this is, but sounds like it to me - want to bounce it back to Till and ask him to fill in some FFe details including having done some testing?
<jbicha> sure
<Laney> cheers
<Laney> binary debdiff would be good to check, but maybe the sponsor can just do that
<jbicha> I closed LP: #1699216 ð¢
<ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1699216 in gnome-initial-setup (Ubuntu) "Encrypted home support" [Wishlist,Won't fix] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1699216
<oSoMoN> kenvandine, please comment on https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/evince-snap-does-not-open-comic-book-file-cbr-while-deb-does-so/4523 when you publish an update to the evince snap
<kenvandine> oSoMoN, will do
<oSoMoN> thanks
<kenvandine> oSoMoN, got a link to a cbr file i can test with?
<kenvandine> so far all i've found point to 404 errors :/
<oSoMoN> Laney, I could use your packaging expertise to detangle a dependency problem:
<oSoMoN> the server team had intended to demote tomcat8 from main, but libreoffice depends on it via libreoffice-sdbc-hsqldb -> libhsqldb1.8.0-java -> libservlet3.1-java (source:tomcat8)
<oSoMoN> libreoffice-sdbc-hsqldb itself is a recommends of libreoffice-base-drivers, which is pulled in by libreoffice-base (which is not installed by default)
<oSoMoN> I can't see an obvious way out
<Laney> oSoMoN: you have to break it somewhere
<Laney> I guess put base in universe or break the recommends from -drivers
<kenvandine> if we don't ship base by default, should be fine to send it to universe
<Laney> dunno, we might want to support it for some reason
<Laney> like we used to have evolution in main for some commercial support contracts even though that wasn't installed by default
<oSoMoN> is there a looser relationship than recommends, that would allow a package in main to optionally pull in another one in universe?
<Laney> only suggests which is more informational than anything else
<Laney> we could contact the STS guys and ask if there's any reason on their side to keep it in main
<Laney> that's what happened for evo
<oSoMoN> Laney, thanks, I'll do that
<oSoMoN> it looks like libreoffice-base doesn't have any rdepends in main, so technically that shouldn't be hard
<jbicha> btw, libreoffice-base (& libreoffice-dev) is the only actual package that holds Java in main, see my comment on LP: #1735482
<ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1735482 in openjdk-9 (Ubuntu) "OpenJDK JRE should be ported to GTK3" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1735482
<oSoMoN> jbicha, ack, thanks
<ackk> hi, does anyone have any suggestion about https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/hplip/+bug/1731417 ?
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1731417 in hplip (Ubuntu) "Installed network printer removed automatically when turned off" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<GunnarHj> Hi Laney, I have refreshed the language stuff MP, so if those changes are what you want to go in, it ought to be simple to merge now.
<Laney> hi GunnarHj, thanks, I've got it under control
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Did my email reply yesterday make sense?
<amano> Trevinjo, the regression in your nautilus crash fixes seems to be fixed now in master: https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/nautilus/merge_requests/153
<amano> Trevinho, the regression in your nautilus crash fixes seems to be fixed now in master: https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/nautilus/merge_requests/153
<Trevinho> amano: yeah, I noticed and backported to 3.26 right now
<Trevinho> amano: actually my fix wasn't causing the crash initially... Then I just did what upstream asked and that... lead to a crash xD
<amano> ð
<Trevinho> Anyway 3.26 branch has all the changes now
<flexiondotorg> willcooke: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nvidia-graphics-drivers-390/+bug/1752739
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1752739 in nvidia-graphics-drivers-390 (Ubuntu) "PRIME Synchronization doesn't work with linux-kernel 4.15." [High,Fix released]
<willcooke> flexiondotorg, ta
<flexiondotorg> willcooke: There is another bug, I'm husting for it now.
<flexiondotorg> *hunting
<willcooke> flexiondotorg, that one is fixed it says, but you think it still breaks snaps?
<flexiondotorg> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nvidia-graphics-drivers-390/+bug/1756226
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1756226 in nvidia-graphics-drivers-390 (Ubuntu) "nvidia-driver-390 fails to start GUI" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<willcooke> tseliot, hey, have you seen that 2nd bug flexiondotorg linked to yet? ^
<jbicha> GunnarHj: I understand your answer as "maybe, but it would be nice to have dh_translations handle it automatically"
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Sounds like a fair summary.
<jbicha> we can just wait for people to complain since it seems like a headache now to add extra rules for handling .desktop translation to all the meson-using packages in main
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Yeah.. But I'd recommend to think through which packages include patches which creates Ubuntu specific .desktop files. Maybe there are not so many of those, though.
<jbicha> gnome-control-center & gnome-software
<GunnarHj> jbicha: And gnome-session. But that and g-c-c we handled. What about gnome-software?
<jbicha> is "Ubuntu Software" correctly translated for you?
<GunnarHj> jbicha: I'm not on bionic now, bug last I checked that string didn't exist in LP, which made me conclude that we have switched to call it just "Software", and which made me change the docs accordingly... Please don't say that I misunderstood.
<jbicha> I guess you can add gnome-software to your to-do list ;) it's supposed to be "Ubuntu Software"
<jbicha> there is another bug where it doesn't use the Ubuntu branding in the "Ubuntu on Wayland" session
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Shit! Ok, I'll look at gnome-software. Which is the proper branch to suggest a change for?
<jbicha> the string isn't translatable (it's a bit of a hack in debian/rules). Only the English version was changed to "Ubuntu Software", all other languages are using the upstream "Software" name which is wrong
<GunnarHj> jbicha: What?? Can't we just decide that "Software" is right? :)
<jbicha> if you're submitting an actual patch, it's https://gitlab.gnome.org/Ubuntu/gnome-software
<jbicha> but packaging is at https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/gnome-software/ubuntu
<jbicha> GunnarHj: its name is "Ubuntu Software" on Ubuntu sessions, that's not my decision :)
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Right, I know who made the decision...
<jbicha> lol, ok
<alan_g> tjaalton, do you know if Mesa will still have the obsolete, broken "Mir EGL" patch when bionic ships?
<tseliot> willcooke: looking
<tseliot> willcooke: yes, I spoke with the original reporter via email. I haven't tested the multiple nvidia GPUs test case yet
<tseliot> flexiondotorg: are you using KMS for nvidia?
<flexiondotorg> I had the nvidia-driver-390 packages installed. I didn't tweak the configuration, so it was using whatever is default. They are all currently purged, so I can test what you need.
<tseliot> flexiondotorg: any chance you can get me the journalctl output after reproducing the problem?
<flexiondotorg> OK
<didrocks> andyrock: before I leave, if you address Brian's comment on https://code.launchpad.net/~azzar1/software-properties/add-canonical-livepatch/+merge/341427 (he seems to have commented), I'm happy to give another review tomorrow
<andyrock> didrocks: kk I'll do that later today
<didrocks> thanks :)
<flexiondotorg> tseliot: While I preapre the test, one other thing. the nvidia-390-drivers in the graphics/ppa currently is uninstallable.
<tjaalton> alan_g: will not
<tjaalton> alan_g: i've dropped them all from git
<tjaalton> just waiting for a new upstream rc or release..
<alan_g> tjaalton, thanks. (Our "auto detect" when building Mir is confused ATM because we have the patched headers, but it doesn't actually work.)
<alan_g> Was just wondering if it will sort itself, or we need to be cleverer.
<flexiondotorg> tseliot: I've attached some log to https://pad.lv/1756226
<ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1756226 in nvidia-graphics-drivers-390 (Ubuntu) "nvidia-driver-390 fails to start GUI" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<willcooke> hoy robert_ancell
<robert_ancell> hello
<willcooke> Right, successfully signed the Eclipse CLA despite their impossible captchas
<willcooke> and that'll do
<willcooke> night all
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-03-20
<ricotz> chrisccoulson, hi, if the rustc 1.24.1 backports are ready then please move them to rust-next ppa for ff60
<didrocks> good morning
<tsimonq2> o/
<didrocks> andyrock: it seems you didn't push your changes yet, did you?
<jibel> Salut didrocks
<duflu> Morning didrocks, tsimonq2, jibel
<duflu> , world
<tsimonq2> o/ duflu
<tsimonq2> o/ jibel
<jibel> Hi everyone
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<duflu> Morning oSoMoN
<tsimonq2> o/ oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> hey duflu, tsimonq2
<tsimonq2> Can someone please review this? https://code.launchpad.net/~tsimonq2/ubuntu-release-upgrader/port-away-from-kdesudo/+merge/341555
<tsimonq2> I'd like to have kdesudo removed sooner rather than later. :)
<willcooke> hoy
<didrocks> hey willcooke
<oSoMoN> hey willcooke, salut didrocks
<oSoMoN> latest snapd (2.32+18.04~pre5) on bionic appears broken, is it just me?
<willcooke> oSoMoN, not launching some apps?
<oSoMoN> all snaps are marked "broken" after dist-upgrading, then after a reboot they are fine again but they don't launch
<willcooke> oSoMoN, I /think/ z_yga is already on the case
<willcooke> oSoMoN, I saw them talking about it on the Canonical IRC server earlier
<didrocks> hey oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> willcooke, indeed, zyga just confirmed on #snappy
<zyga> we got multiple reports
<zyga> and I think I know what the problem might be
<zyga> checking now
<oSoMoN> thanks
<oSoMoN> zyga, if IÂ can provide info, let me know
<zyga> I'm trying to reproduce the right way now
<zyga> mvo: hey, aound?
<zyga> mvo: when are we pushing the next build of snapd to bionic
<Laney> oh oops, hi
<oSoMoN> hey Laney
<Laney> hey oSoMoN, what's the haps
<duflu> Hi willcooke, Laney, and wider world
<mvo> zyga: hello
<mvo> zyga: 2.32~pre5 hit bionic yesterday
<didrocks> hey hey Laney
<mvo> zyga: what are you looking for?
<oSoMoN> Laney, it's been raining all night and I've spotted a minor water infiltration, otherwise good
<oSoMoN> you?
<zyga> mvo: re, sorry I had to poke around and I couldn't run irc
<zyga> mvo: so, bionic is very much broken with the stable core snap now
<zyga> mvo: because of the rename of snappy-app-dev
<zyga> mvo: and because the core snap doesn't have that yet
<zyga> mvo: we run that program on the inside of the namespace and it's just not present
<zyga> mvo: and the stable core snap doesn't ship any symlinks (in either direction)
<zyga> mvo: most snaps just don't start
<Laney> oSoMoN: :(
<Laney> I'm alright yeah - first day of spring!
<oSoMoN> true!
<zyga> mvo: we should either fast track a stable core that has one more copy of snappy-app-dev
<zyga> mvo: or upload a new build to bionic that uses the conservative, pre-rename path
<Laney> hey duflu & didrocks too
<tjaalton> I'd like to update wayland to 1.15rc, because libwayland-egl got moved there from mesa
<mvo> zyga: ok, I think we need to upload a new snapd that checks both paths
<zyga> yes
<zyga> that's less disruptive
<zyga> mvo: as a simple way to reproduce
<zyga> mvo: switch to stable core
<zyga> mvo: and update 18.04 all the way
<mvo> zyga: I will fix it now
<zyga> mvo: and run non-hello world snap
<mvo> zyga: I am on bionic already
<zyga> mvo: right, my point was that you need to be on ~pre5 package
<mvo> zyga: thanks, yeah
<oSoMoN> mvo, what's the ETA for that updated snapd in bionic?
<mvo> oSoMoN: a couple of hours, publisher run + autopkgtest
<oSoMoN> mvo, cool, thanks
<mvo> oSoMoN: plus the actual fix (but that should be quick)
<oSoMoN> I think I'm going to downgrade until then, can't live without working snaps, look at what you snappy people did! :)
<oSoMoN> mvo, if you need testing when the fix is ready, let me know
<oSoMoN> anyone familiar with Chinese input methods here? https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/how-to-input-chinese-in-snap-firefox/4576
<didrocks> oSoMoN: I know bochecha is, if you want to try pinging him on gimp.net
<oSoMoN> thanks, will do
<Laney> pitti: hey there, don't suppose you could take a quick look at https://paste.debian.net/plain/1015664 please?
<Laney> armhf is all on the floor :'(
<willcooke> oSoMoN, could that sogou and confinement don't play well together.  I've replied to find out
<pitti> Laney: sure, looks fine! pushed
<Laney> pitti: thanks! hope you're well, happy springtime to you
<pitti> Laney: Paul was going to do a new Debian upload today too (but I figure having it in master is enough?)
<pitti> Laney: and to you as well! yes, I'm great, thanks! how about you?
<Laney> pitti: yeah, the runners check out the branch
<Laney> I'm preeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeetty pretty good </larry_david>
<oSoMoN> willcooke, thanks
<Laney> we're going to try a new (to us, actually it's old) Japanese restaurant later
<Laney> assuming I can book a table /o\
<pitti> Laney: good luck! classic Sushi, or something more exotic?
<Laney> pitti: sushi, ramen, ... and some things I've never heard of too! http://www.higoi.co.uk/our_menu.html
<Laney> "ippin ryori"
<Laney> didrocks is our local expert :P
<didrocks> yeah, sushi isn't really the regular Japanese food :)
<Laney> ããã°ããã¯ please
<didrocks> Laney: ahah, actually, we got some rice burgers
<didrocks> were way smaller than McDonald ones also :p
<Nafallo> salut
<Laney> didrocks: the rice is the bun or the meat?
<Laney> hey Nafallo, ca va?
<Nafallo> Laney: Ã§a va bien, et tu? :-)
<didrocks> Laney: the rice was the bun
<Laney> exciting
<Laney> Nafallo: ich bin sehr gut!
<didrocks> I wasn't as pleasantly surprised as I would have hoped
<Nafallo> underbart! :-)
<didrocks> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rice_burger#/media/File:MOS_rice_burger_(cropped).JPG
<didrocks> that was the one we got, the MOS ^
<Laney> looks worth a try
<Laney> pitti: meh, trusty doesn't have 'gpg' :(
<Laney> actually that's new in bionic
<Laney> le fail
<oSoMoN> kenvandine, where do we track firefox snap bugs, now that it's public?
<pitti> Laney: it used to be gpg-verify (or -check or so), and gnupg2, no?
<pitti> I already wondered, then I saw the package name in sid
<Laney> pitti: something like https://paste.debian.net/plain/1015670
<oSoMoN> Laney, according to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Developers application to the team should be done on the ML, but it looks like the list is more or less deprecated in favour of the hub, how do IÂ go about it?
<pitti> Laney: applied with fixing the pkg name in the commit log
<Laney> pitti: ah yeah, thanks
 * Laney turns the crank again
<tseliot> flexiondotorg: I don't see anything wrong in the logs
<jbicha> Laney: do you want a separate FFe bug for gnome-keyring & gcr or are they already covered by the GNOME 3.28 FFe?
<Laney> jbicha: any particular reason why they wouldn't be?
<jbicha> we already have gnome-keyring 3.27.4 in bionic but 3.28 added that late ssh-agent switch
<jbicha> things seem to work pretty well now
<willcooke> jibel, do you have a machine with a screen rotation sensor?
<darkxst> Laney, can you look at FFe on Bug 1754803
<ubot5`> bug 1754803 in gnome-contacts (Ubuntu) "[FFe] Disable telepathy support in gnome-contacts" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1754803
<darkxst> it doesnt really affect any official flavours but its still a core-ish GNOME app
<jibel> willcooke, no, I don't
<willcooke> jibel, np.  Heber does, I'll ask him
<Laney> darkxst: ok then
<darkxst> Laney, I will push for the changes to get made in debian ;)
<willcooke> morning heber!
<heber> hi willcooke !
<willcooke> heber, when you get a chance, could you check that screen rotation is still working properly in 18.04 on the blue Dell 2in1?
<heber> willcooke, sure!
<oSoMoN> Trevinho, would you mind reviewing https://code.launchpad.net/~osomon/libappindicator/bionic-ftbfs-fix/+merge/341729 ?
<Trevinho> oSoMoN: ok
<oSoMoN> thanks!
<oSoMoN> those are trivial fixes, I came across the build failure while investigating another issue
<Trevinho> oSoMoN: want me to do the landing too?
<oSoMoN> Trevinho, please do, I'm not familiar with the process for that
<Trevinho> k
<oSoMoN> cheers
<oSoMoN> Trevinho, do you use bileto?
<Trevinho> oSoMoN: yep
<kenvandine> oSoMoN, i guess mozilla's bugzilla
<heber> willcooke, screen rotation seems to work properly. Only I noticed that when switching from landscape to vertical, the gnome settings window is not shown properly
<willcooke> heber, oh!  How so?
<heber> willcooke, the window does not fit the screen. I will send you a screenshot
<willcooke> heber, ahh Isee
<willcooke> ok, well that's not too bad I think
<heber> willcooke, everything else looks good
<willcooke> The main thing is that rotation is working.  $OEM said that it wasn't, but my gut feeling was that it was a driver issue not a GNOME Shell issue.
<willcooke> thanks heber
<heber> willcooke, np!
<ahasenack> hi guys, got an easy way to reproduce the xorg crash. I attached swipe-of-death.mp4 to https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xorg/+bug/1753735
<ubot5`> Error: ubuntu bug 1753735 not found
<ahasenack> willcooke: that bug ^ might be under the radar because it's still private
<willcooke> ahasenack, dupe of https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libinput/+bug/1754487 perhaps?
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1751086 in libinput (Ubuntu) "duplicate for #1754487 Xorg assert failure: Xorg: ../src/evdev-mt-touchpad-tap.c:1002: tp_tap_handle_state: Assertion `tp->tap.nfingers_down > 0' failed." [High,Incomplete]
<ahasenack> yeah
<ahasenack> which was duped to another one
<willcooke> ha, oh yeah
<willcooke> ahasenack, could you comment on the upstream one?
<ahasenack> I'll add my info to #1751086
<ahasenack> which is incomplete
<ahasenack> oh man, so many tweener.js backtraces in syslog
<jbicha> re LP: #1757142 it was my understanding that fonts-liberation2 will override fonts-liberation if installed
<ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1757142 in fonts-liberation2 (Ubuntu) "[MIR] fonts-liberation2" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1757142
<jibel> Meeting time!
<didrocks> o/
<jbicha> o/
<jibel> #startmeeting Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-03-20
<meetingology> Meeting started Tue Mar 20 14:30:52 2018 UTC.  The chair is jibel. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-03-20 | Current topic:
<jibel> Roll call:  andyrock, dgadomski, didrocks, duflu (out), jbicha, jamesh (out), jibel/heber, kenvandine, laney, oSoMoN, seb128, tkamppeter, trevinho, robert_ancell (out)
<Trevinho> \o
<oSoMoN> o/
<jibel> #topic andyrock
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-03-20 | Current topic: andyrock
<andyrock> o/
<andyrock> hey hey
<jibel> just on time
<andyrock> Unity7:
<andyrock>   - Fix memory leak in UserAuthenticatorPam::AuthenticateStart.
<andyrock> Gnome-Control-Center:
<andyrock>   - Fix for (LP Bug #1754651: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-control-center/+bug/1754651)
<andyrock> Livepatch:
<andyrock>   - MP to add a "enable canonical-livepatch" switch in  software-properties-gtk
<andyrock>   - Fixing MP after reviews
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1754651 in gnome-control-center (Ubuntu) "gnome-control-center windows remains open after using the launch-panel/online-accounts/add "API"" [Medium,Fix released]
<didrocks> andyrock: it's good for a second review?
<andyrock> - Some work on the login-dialog for gnome-software
<heber> o/
<andyrock> didrocks: not yet
<didrocks> k, just ping me :)
<andyrock> I'll ping you in few seconds
<andyrock> :D
<andyrock> eow
<jibel> Thanks andyrock
<jibel> #topic dgadomski
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-03-20 | Current topic: dgadomski
<dgadomski_> hey
<dgadomski_> only 1 thing this time: submitted a merge request for bug #1749289, I'd appreciate anybody taking a look before bionic release
<ubot5`> bug 1749289 in oem-config (Ubuntu) "Installer stops after pressing Cancel on Select a language screen during OEM install" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1749289
<dgadomski_> eof
<jibel> thanks dgadomski_
<dgadomski_> thanks
<jibel> #topic didrocks
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-03-20 | Current topic: didrocks
<didrocks> Telemetry:
<didrocks>   - More discussions and tested latest changes after review in ubiquity: ttps://code.launchpad.net/~didrocks/ubiquity/intall-metrics/+merge/341229
<didrocks>   - Started the reporting tool project and add many tests to it: https://github.com/Ubuntu/ubuntu-report. Done functionnally, adding more tests and instrumentations.
<didrocks> Communitheme:
<didrocks>   - switch to bionic and rebase Shell theme on 3.27.92: https://github.com/Ubuntu/gnome-shell-communitheme/pull/77
<didrocks>   - switch gtk theme and session packages to bionic as well
<didrocks>   - general talks and monitoring
<didrocks> Misc:
<didrocks>   - filed up upstream contributions on doc for ubucon
<didrocks>   - minimal install PR reviews
<didrocks> eow
<jibel> didrocks, thanks!
<jibel> #topic duflu
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-03-20 | Current topic: duflu
<jibel> * Screen corruption when logging into Xorg sessions (https://launchpad.net/bugs/1753776)
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1753776 in mesa (Ubuntu) "Graphics corruption just before login animation to Xorg sessions (Intel gen9 GPUs only)" [Medium,Triaged]
<jibel>   - Finally bisected the problem (it's indeed a regression in Mesa 18.0.0).
<jibel>   - Notified upstream, but they think it *should work* so "we" need to investigate potential kernel fixes.
<jibel>   - I will report on kernel investigations next week :S
<jibel> * Gnome Shell performance (very little change this week, but this is the status)
<jibel>   - Affecting Xorg sessions:
<jibel>     . Switched focus to the next major CPU issue affecting Xorg sessions (https://launchpad.net/bugs/1750197).
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1750197 in mutter (Ubuntu) "App drawer animation causes heavy CPU spikes in Wayland & Xorg" [Medium,Confirmed]
<jibel>     . Clock smoothness: Still awaiting review (https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/mutter/merge_requests/26)
<jibel>   - Affecting only Wayland sessions (also no progress, no reviews, this week)
<jibel>     . Unblock rendering from behind monitor flipping: https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/mutter/merge_requests/25
<jibel>     . Simplify and clean up: https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/mutter/merge_requests/29
<jibel> * Synaptics touchpad settings missing (https://launchpad.net/bugs/1686081):
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1686081 in gtk+3.0 (Ubuntu) "If -synaptics is installed, GNOME Mouse & Touchpad Settings doesn't work" [Medium,In progress]
<jibel>   - Completed a couple of rounds of distro patches for mutter+gnome-control-center and awaiting review/sponsorship.
<jibel>   - Completed a couple of versions of fixes for a related gtk bug: https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gtk/merge_requests/65
<jibel>   - Bionic fixes released! (not including GTK but we work around that)
<jibel> * Daily bug management across gnome-shell, mutter, gdm3, ubuntu-themes, bluez, pulseaudio, dkms, wayland, totem, mpv, libinput.
<jibel>   - https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/e/2PACX-1vRDHPxGBHqM6XkT_S8ggtYfD0xchKSUD_z9PopNVE3G1rU05fVSnxDGcDsEstl7gu7N-tzCU6mLUp2V/pubchart?oid=254968654&format=interactive
<jibel> Thanks duflu
<jibel> #topic jbicha
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-03-20 | Current topic: jbicha
<jbicha> â¢ Lots of GNOME 3.28.0 packaging with darkxst
<jbicha> â¢ Completed most of the GNOME 3.28 transitions in Debian
<jbicha> â¢ Debian GNOME has converted all but a few deprecated packages to git
<jbicha> (smcv converted several this week that failed with our earlier conversion scripts)
<jbicha> â¢ Sponsored stuff like https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-control-center/1:3.28.0-0ubuntu1
<jbicha> â¢ Fixed (in Debian & Ubuntu) icon conflict issue with gnome-control-center & the old gnome-icon-theme https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-control-center/issues/3
<jbicha> â¢ Cherry-picked fix for LP: #1750702
<ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1750702 in gegl (Ubuntu) "gegl build failure on armhf" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1750702
<jbicha> â¢ Updated webkit2gtk for Debian 9.4 and blogged it
<jbicha> â¢ Dropped ulimit from deja-dup/bionic's autostart file to fix heavily reported crash with webkit2gtk 2.20 (LP: #1751460)
<ubot5`> Launchpad bug 1751460 in webkit2gtk (Ubuntu Bionic) "[regression] deja-dup-monitor crashed with SIGSEGV in Gigacage::<lambda()>::operator()" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1751460
<jbicha> â¢ Helped deal with fallout from Debian bug 892956 (bug title is opinionated ;) )
<ubot5`> Debian bug 892956 in meson "meson creates bogus pkgconfig files" [Grave,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/892956
<jbicha> ð
<ahasenack> willcooke: https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=105407 updated
<ubot5`> Freedesktop bug 105407 in libinput "Xorg assertion failure: Xorg: ../src/evdev-mt-touchpad-tap.c:1002: tp_tap_handle_state: Assertion `tp->tap.nfingers_down > 0' failed." [Normal,Resolved: worksforme]
<ahasenack> shall I reopen it?
<jibel> jbicha, ^^ is that to bring us luck for the  release or the end of your report? ;)
<jbicha> end of report :)
<jibel> jbicha, Great! Thank you
<jibel> #topic jibel/heber
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-03-20 | Current topic: jibel/heber
<jibel> - Analysis of snap crash reports in errors.u.c, discovered that snapd uses its own reporting system that does not honour the automated reporting setting and spams errors.u.c when it fails to initialize a snap and reproduced the problem with MATE and Budgie.
<jibel>   - https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/snapd-ignores-whoopsie-setting-to-upload-crash-reports/4463
<jibel>   - https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/snapd-tries-to-report-crashes-and-restarts-indefinitely/4480
<jibel> - Proposed to add more fields to the automated reports to make the reports useful.
<jibel>   - https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/add-more-information-to-automatically-generated-crash-reports/4475
<jibel> - Reviewed and merged telemetry MP
<jibel> - Bootspeed:
<jibel>   - Proposed to delay the start up of gnome-software and evolution-calendar to speed up session start up time.
<jibel>     - https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-software/+bug/1756379
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1756379 in gnome-software (Ubuntu) "Delay start of gnome-software service" [Undecided,New]
<jibel>     - https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/evolution-data-server/+bug/1756389
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1756389 in evolution-data-server (Ubuntu) "Delay startup of evolution-calendar-factory" [Undecided,New]
<jibel>   - Measured the impact of preseeding snap package on boot time of the live session and published https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/impact-of-preseeded-snap-packages-on-boot-time-of-the-live-session/4583
<jibel> - Triaged various installer and upgrade bugs.
<jibel>   - Ubuntu Bionic fails to install over nfs
<jibel> - Test screen rotation on 18.10
<jibel> - Analyse bluez tests to migrate to desktop if possible
<jibel> eow
<tamayox> Hi there
<jibel> #topic kenvandine
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-03-20 | Current topic: kenvandine
<tamayox> I'm having a problem with my USB flash drive: Everytime I pass data to it, it gets corrupted. I've tried other USB drives and the result is the same. Any ideas?
<kenvandine> * Created desktop helpers branch which builds in the LDPRELOAD of bindtextdomain and made it iterate multiple paths looking for translations.  I still need to do some testing before submitting a PR.
<kenvandine> * Fixed color emojis using the gnome-3-26-1604 platform snap running on bionic. https://bugs.launchpad.net/gnome-platform-snap/+bug/1753146
<kenvandine> * Created https://gitlab.gnome.org/Ubuntu/gnome-3-28-1804-sdk as the source for the build snap that'll be used for building GNOME 3.28 snaps
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1753146 in gnome-characters (Ubuntu Bionic) "Characters Snap doesn't have color emoji" [High,Fix released]
<tamayox> Thank you
<jibel> tamayox, we are in the middle of a meeting, can you ask again when it's over?
<kenvandine> EOF
<tamayox> jibel: Yeah, no problem
<jibel> thanks kenvandine
<jibel> #topic laney
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-03-20 | Current topic: laney
<Laney> â¢ gstreamer updates, final releases to do now
<Laney> â¢ autopkgtest - some maintenance of the github side, fix for gpg dropping off the minimal installation, re-deploy armhf with improved(?) network config, discuss resource constraints with IS
<Laney> â¢ merged Gunnar's work in g-c-c, submitted part of it upstream
<Laney> â¢ hi didrocks
<Laney> â¢ applied for gnome foundation
<Laney> â¢ updated gvfs, debugged tests a bit with a_hasenack, he is following up with upstream (thanks!)
<Laney> â¢ fixed glib2.0 autopkgtest failure, not uploaded yet
<Laney> ð¤ 
<Laney> * just made a big mess with my tea
<Laney> brbrbrb
<jibel> Laney, anything else for this meeting or you're cleaning up your mess?
<jibel> okay, we'll be back to Laney once he's done with his tea
<jibel> #topic oSoMoN
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-03-20 | Current topic: oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> hey there
<Laney> hi, i was done
<Laney> was just a post cowboy mess update
<oSoMoN> â¢ firefox
<oSoMoN>   â briefly looked into issue reported with firefox snap and Chinese IME (https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/how-to-input-chinese-in-snap-firefox/4576)
<oSoMoN> â¢ chromium
<oSoMoN>   â updated packaging documentation for Ubuntu upstream (https://chromium-review.googlesource.com/c/chromium/src/+/970464)
<oSoMoN> â¢ libreoffice
<oSoMoN>   â promoted 6.0.2 snap to the stable channel
<oSoMoN>   â created https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Process/Merges/TestPlans/libreoffice
<oSoMoN>   â backported debian fix for bug #1738821
<ubot5`> bug 1738821 in libreoffice (Ubuntu) "Appstream data points to libreoffice-common" [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1738821
<oSoMoN>   â played with a libreoffice.filebug command similar to ubuntu-bug (https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/ubuntu-bug-for-snaps/4445/4)
<oSoMoN>   â at the request of the server team that wants to demote tomcat8 to universe, started conversation with stakeholders to see if libreoffice-base can be demoted too
<oSoMoN>   â filed MIRs for fonts-liberation2 (bug #1757142) and for fonts-hosny-amiri (bug #1757148)
<ubot5`> bug 1757142 in fonts-liberation2 (Ubuntu) "[MIR] fonts-liberation2" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1757142
<ubot5`> bug 1757148 in fonts-hosny-amiri (Ubuntu) "[MIR] fonts-hosny-amiri" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1757148
<oSoMoN> â¢ snaps
<oSoMoN>   â confirmed and fixed evince snap not opening comic book files (https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/evince-snap-does-not-open-comic-book-file-cbr-while-deb-does-so/4523)
<oSoMoN> â¢ other
<oSoMoN>   â filed and fixed bug #1757121
<ubot5`> bug 1757121 in libappindicator (Ubuntu) "libappindicator FTBFS on bionic" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1757121
<oSoMoN>   â looking into bug #1757009 (per request from upstream chromium)
<ubot5`> bug 1757009 in libappindicator (Ubuntu) "libappindicator3 not multilib aware, amd64 and i386 versions conflict" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1757009
<oSoMoN> ð¦
<oSoMoN> (no tea, no mess)
<jibel> oSoMoN, anything else?
<oSoMoN> I'm done
<jibel> Good, thanks oSoMoN !
<jibel> #topic seb128
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-03-20 | Current topic: seb128
<jibel> seb is out for the week and no update
<jibel> #topic tkamppeter
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-03-20 | Current topic: tkamppeter
<jibel> - Hardware: Some testing on the HP OfficeJet Pro 8730
<jibel> - CUPS: Forwarded several crash bugs upstream. Michael Sweet is working on fixes.
<jibel> - OpenPrinting Summit 2018: Started planning schedules.
<jibel> - Google Summer of Code 2018: Checked the official proposals of the students which they have submitted to the Google system, given introduction into the exact projects to do to two students, continued mentoring Sahil Arora.
<jibel> - Bugs.
<ahasenack> willcooke: wait, that upstream bug is about wayland, not xorg?
<jibel> Thanks Till
<jibel> #topic trevinho
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-03-20 | Current topic: trevinho
<ahasenack> "Product" is set to wayland, but the assertion failure talks about Xorg
<Trevinho> Â· unity-greeter reubuild and build fixes
<Trevinho>  - https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/unity-greeter/logo-update-rebuild
<Trevinho> Â· Fixing theme changes and working on implementing Ambiance-Rw
<Trevinho> Â· Changes to the Telegram snap to propose PR upstream:
<Trevinho>   - https://github.com/telegramdesktop/tdesktop/pull/4505
<Trevinho> Â· Fixes to electron-builder snap to genrate mime db and icon caches on snap install
<Trevinho>   - https://github.com/electron-userland/electron-builder/pull/2715
<Trevinho> Â· Some unity7 debugging for a lockscreen issue
<Trevinho> Â· Booked flights and airbnb for attending GNOME performance hackfest
<Trevinho>   - https://wiki.gnome.org/Hackfests/Performance2018
<Trevinho> Â· Nautilus fixes improvements and cherry-picks to stable
<Trevinho> ð
<jibel> Thanks Trevinho
<jibel> #topic jamesh
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-03-20 | Current topic: jamesh
<jibel> I don't have any update for James
<jibel> #topic robert_ancell
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-03-20 | Current topic: robert_ancell
<jibel> - GNOME Software bugfixes
<jibel> - Backporting GNOME Software categories to 16.04 (https://gitlab.gnome.org/robert.ancell/gnome-software/tree/categories-3-20)
<jibel> - Working on Ubuntu pages for a first run wizard (https://git.gnome.org/browse/gnome-initial-setup/log/?h=wip/rancell/ubuntu-welcome)
<jibel> #topic aob
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2018-03-20 | Current topic: aob
<jibel> anyone wants the mic?
<jbicha> .
<jbicha> I was wanting to add totem to our minimal-remove list since it's common for people to want to switch it out with vlc or gnome-mpv
<jbicha> also, I'd like a decision on whether we need the Amazon webapp in the minimal Ubuntu install
<jibel> ^ anyone any opinion on jbicha's proposal ?
<jibel> willcooke, Laney didrocks and all ?
<didrocks> willcooke: I guess those are mostly for you, as you discussed the content with the product manager ^
<willcooke> otp - sec
<willcooke> +1 sounds fine to me
<willcooke> didrocks, any opinion?
<jbicha> willcooke: fine to remove both totem and the webapp?
<willcooke> -1 on webapp, sorry
<jbicha> almost â¦ ;)
<willcooke> nice try
<Laney> you already tried that one
<didrocks> willcooke: I don't know for totem, I think vlc is a strong candidate for replacement, so yeah, makes sense
<jbicha> I didn't remember getting a firm answer yet
<willcooke> caveat re: totem - I don't want to spend time on it if it will affect data collection service work
<didrocks> I guess jbicha is going to do the MP
<willcooke> kk cool
<jbicha> it takes almost no time to add it to the list
<didrocks> jbicha: think testing it with gstreamer additional codecs
<didrocks> so you need to test an install, and so on
<didrocks> (with 3rd part options)
<jbicha> hmm
<didrocks> so no, don't just update the list, have a real install :)
<jibel> jbicha, you have an answer. Anything else for this week?
<didrocks> nothing for me
<jbicha> nothing for me
<jibel> Lets wrap then. Thank you everyone and see you next meeting!
<didrocks> thanks!
<jibel> #endmeeting
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/lsBmkzPY/ubuntu-desktop-1804-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | pink killer â lots of help
<meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Mar 20 14:59:13 2018 UTC.
<meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2018/ubuntu-desktop.2018-03-20-14.30.moin.txt
<oSoMoN> thanks!
<kenvandine> thanks!
<oSoMoN> cyphermox, I suppose you're not working on bug #1081938, are you?
<ubot5`> bug 1081938 in libappindicator (Ubuntu) "Libappindicator is not multilib aware, 32bit conflicts rather than works with 64bit" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1081938
<Laney> rls bugs? :(
<oSoMoN> Laney, getting into a new habit is hardâ¦ :/
<willcooke> right, off the phone
<willcooke> Laney, can you paste the link to the bugs, and lets do it now
<Laney> ok
<Laney> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-bb-incoming-bug-tasks.html
<Laney> there's just http://launchpad.net/bugs/1756379 and http://launchpad.net/bugs/1756389
<willcooke> thanks
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1756379 in gnome-software (Ubuntu) "Delay start of gnome-software service" [Undecided,New]
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1756389 in evolution-data-server (Ubuntu) "Delay startup of evolution-calendar-factory" [Undecided,New]
<willcooke> I spoke to robert_ancell about #1756379 last night - he's +1
<Laney> the titles specify the solution which isn't ideal
<Laney> is it ok to not have calendar events for 60 seconds after you log in?
<Laney> same for software search results in the overview
<willcooke> IMO yes, 60 seconds is ok.
<willcooke> There might be an impact on the first run wizard if they try to open G-Software sooner, but I assume it will just load everything at the point when they try and launch it via the wizard
<willcooke> Per the comment on the #1756389, if jibel can propose it upstream, that makes sense - they will likely have a better view of if that's bad or not
<Laney> it's probably dbus activated actually
<Laney> but surprised that this is acceptable, but ok then
<willcooke> Laney, surprised that a 60 second delay is ok?
<Laney> yes, you get an arbitrary period where things might not work properly
<Laney> I think actually that gnome-software will get started on demand, so it might "just" be a delay
<Laney> which might make the first search slow
<willcooke> ah
<willcooke> jibel, could you test that? ^
<willcooke> Laney, if that's the case then would you be +1 on G-Software and -1 on e-c-f?
<jibel> Laney, willcooke yes but the problem is that it's a search provider and you get no package in a search until the bg service runs
<Laney> does it start the provider on demand or nto?
<Laney> not*
<jibel> I don't think it does, but I'll try
<Laney> that's probably alright-ish, depending on what actually happens in the first search
<Laney> for the evolution one I'm not happy, you can't delay starting a dbus service like that - things will timeout
<willcooke> k, then lets leave e-c-f as is, and test g-software
<Laney> I'm ok with accepting the nomination if the bug is evolution-calendar-factory makes startup slow and we try to look for another solution
<Laney> but the proposed fix, not so much
<Laney> imho anyway
<willcooke> your opinion is invaluable
<Laney> I accepted the g-s one & robert_ancell is assigned
<Laney> so that one is sorted
<jbicha> is there a systemd target so that e-c-f can just start after the system is fully loaded?
<Laney> not really
<cyphermox> oSoMoN: no, I am not
<Laney> Commented on the bug, let's take detailed discussion there
<willcooke> thanks Laney
<Laney> should we accept it for the release and if so, who should be assigned?
<oSoMoN> cyphermox, thanks for confirming
<jibel> Laney, actually it seems that gnome-software is started on demand. I'll do more test but it'd mean autostart could be completely disabled
<Laney> No it's needed for other things than the search provider
<Laney> like fwupd notifications
<willcooke> Laney, based on what you said, I think that the e-c-f one is not a release critical bug, so let's not accept it. WDYT?
<Laney> willcooke: fair enough, it's probably not a quick win
<Laney> done, thanks!
<Laney> jbicha: once we get proper systemd support you might be able to make it After=gnome-shell.service
<Laney> willcooke: oh, different topic, heard anything about default wallpaper / mascot etc?
<jbicha> mmm, what about for people that don't use gnome-shell?
<Laney> bus activation would work, you'd change gnome shell to not activate it
<Laney> not saying this is a good or nice idea, but you could :-)
<willcooke> Laney, chased last week, on track to arrive before UIF
<dupondje> gdm fractional scaling is broken/removed in 18.04?
<dupondje> hmz, seems I'm on X again :) but greeter is broken
<dupondje> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mutter/+bug/1754218 aha!
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1754218 in gdm "[regression] gdm 3.27 shows blank login screen on primary monitor when two monitors are connected on a hybrid intel/nvidia system" [Medium,Confirmed]
<dupondje> guess this can use some priority adjustment :D
<Laney> willcooke: â¥
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Do you have time to look at bug #1756982?
<ubot5`> bug 1756982 in gnome-software (Ubuntu) "Show correct app name also in non-English sessions" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1756982
<tsimonq2> Could I please get a review + upload of https://code.launchpad.net/~tsimonq2/ubuntu-release-upgrader/port-away-from-kdesudo/+merge/341555 so that kdesudo can be removed?
<oSoMoN> Trevinho, another libappindicator MR for your reviewing pleasure: https://code.launchpad.net/~osomon/libappindicator/multiarch/+merge/341750
<oSoMoN> that one hasn't been fully tested yet, because libindicator itself is not multi-arch aware
<Laney> hmm, this BT keyboard I have here works :'(
<Laney> was just going to get debug information
<Laney> actually it's quite nice to type on ...
 * Laney finds the speaker
<jbicha> kenvandine: you're getting these emails about "store upload failed for gnome-clocks" and gnome-calculator snap failed to build, right?
<Laney> ah we forgot to have a snap tutorial at the sprint
<kenvandine> jbicha, yeah
<kenvandine> jbicha, i'm pretty sure those all continue to retry
<kenvandine> but i'll check on them all
<kenvandine> jbicha, oh, actually i'm not getting those emails for those specific snaps
<kenvandine> jbicha, i got some emails, but not for gnome-clocks or gnome-calculator
<jbicha> ok, I'll forward you some
<jbicha> maybe it's because you're not a direct member of https://launchpad.net/~gnome3-team do you want me to add you there?
<kenvandine> jbicha, i figured it out
<kenvandine> i was a member, but not subscribed
<kenvandine> silly LP
<willcooke> g'night all
 * sunweaver heard that XDG_CURRENT_DESKTOP for Unity has been changed to Unity7. Is that correct?
<GunnarHj> sunweaver: It's a colon separated list.
<GunnarHj> $ echo $XDG_CURRENT_DESKTOP
<GunnarHj> Unity:Unity7:ubuntu
<GunnarHj> robert_ancell: Hi Robert, can you please take a look at bug #1756982?
<ubot5`> bug 1756982 in gnome-software (Ubuntu) "Show correct app name also in non-English sessions" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1756982
<robert_ancell> GunnarHj, huh, yeah that makes sense
<GunnarHj> robert_ancell: Guess we need something like that as long as we use that piece of software for branding.
<tsimonq2> I'm completely lost with https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1756238 - it seems to be because of a vtk update. Maybe someone with more expertise in that area can take a look... https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/175623
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1756238 in gdebi (Ubuntu) "gdebi-gtk broken in 18.04 error: unable to read filedescriptor flags" [Critical,Confirmed]
<ubot5`> Error: ubuntu bug 175623 not found
<tsimonq2> er
<tsimonq2> yeah
<jbicha> robert_ancell: can you also update debian/ubuntu-software.links for ubuntu-wayland instead of ubuntu-xorg ?
<robert_ancell> jbicha, I have no idea what that is
<jbicha> ok, let me just commit it and push then :)
<jbicha> done
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-03-21
<tsimonq2> morning o/
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<didrocks> good morning!
<oSoMoN> salut didrocks
<duflu> tjaalton, patch attached. Use it however you want... https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mesa/+bug/1753776
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1753776 in mesa (Ubuntu Bionic) "Graphics corruption just before login animation to Xorg sessions (Intel gen9 GPUs only)" [Medium,In progress]
<duflu> Morning tsimonq2, oSoMoN, didrocks
<tjaalton> duflu: thanks, I was about to just revert the commit, but this is smaller
<tjaalton> 18.0.0 should be released RSN
<duflu> Yeah, smaller patches are nicer to maintain
<dupondje> duflu: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gdm3/+bug/1754218 => ping me if you want me to debug this a bit more
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1754218 in gdm "[regression] gdm 3.27 shows blank login screen on primary monitor when two monitors are connected on a hybrid intel/nvidia system" [Medium,Confirmed]
<dupondje> quite annoying bug :D
<duflu> dupondje, "want" is a strong word. I was only trying to triage/sort it, rather than fix it
<duflu> :)
<dupondje> hehe, I,m trying to get it fixed
<dupondje> Mar 21 09:48:05 lt-jeanlouis gnome-shell[1598]: Failed to set CRTC mode 1920x1080: Invalid argument
<dupondje> meh :(
<duflu> dupondje, sounds like the eglnative backend. Try using a Xorg session instead of Wayland
 * duflu hops into a meeting
<dupondje> yep Xorg work but missing fractional scaling there :)
<duflu> dupondje, interesting, maybe ask Trevinho why
<duflu> I only have trouble with the cursor failing to scale in Xorg sessions, and only on shell elements
<Laney> ey
<willcooke> ahasenack, morning!  Could you test 1.10.3 of libinput (should be in bionic today - might need to wait for mirrors to update)?  (re: swipe of death)
<willcooke> morning Laney
<didrocks> morning Laney, willcooke, duflu
<duflu> Morning didrocks
<alexarnaud> Hello all
<willcooke> hey alexarnaud didrocks
<dupondje> duflu: https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/mutter/issues/18 seems like this one
<duflu> dupondje, I think that fix is already in mutter 3.28.0 so you might want a different bug
<duflu> Yes, bionic already has that fix
<alexarnaud> After discussing accessibility with didrocks yesterday, I would like to tell you the following things: the installer of Ubuntu 18.04 is no longer usable with a screen reader due to those two bugs:
<alexarnaud> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubiquity/+bug/1741690
<alexarnaud> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu-mate/+bug/1741507
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1741690 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "You can't enable the Orca screen reader until after you click "Try Ubuntu" on Ubuntu bionic" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1741507 in ubuntu-mate "Can't start screen reader with Ctrl+S and Alt+Super+S" [Undecided,New]
<alexarnaud> usable with a screen reader means a visual-impaired will not be able to install the next LTS
<alexarnaud> For a visual-impaired perspective it is as grave as if the screen doesn't work.
<dupondje> duflu: Inded :(
<didrocks> xnox: are you able to have a look at what changed in the ubiquity installer itself ^
<didrocks> alexarnaud: have yo utried on 17.10 as suggested?
<alexarnaud> I'll try, it's downloading.
<didrocks> that will help to know wheb that started
<didrocks> tanks!
<didrocks> thanks*
<didrocks> let's see with xnox
<duflu> dupondje, I think we might have steered into a dead end asking for a fix in gdm. Mutter is likely to blame so please also log it here: https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/mutter/issues
<dupondje> yea i'll do :)
<duflu> I assume Jonas or someone there has the hardware, since they wrote the hybrid support
<dupondje> almost every laptop has hybrid these days ... :)
<dupondje> not that exceptional
<duflu> dupondje, actually most laptops don't :)
<duflu> Hybrid GPUs makes them more expensive, heavier, more power hungry
<duflu> At least a little. So for the sake of cost and margins you will find most are not hybrid
<tjaalton> i'm glad lenovo t4x0s dropped the dgpu ages ago
<dupondje> how can I make mutter to print some debugging ? :)
<dupondje> cause damn its the hell :( connecting second screen while gdm3 is running just crashes it, and unable to recover (so hard reboot needed)
<jibel> argh, cannot unlock my encrypted usb drive :(((
<jibel> bug 1757321
<ubot5`> bug 1757321 in udisks2 (Ubuntu) "Can't mount encrypted USB drive after upgrade to bionic" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1757321
<Laney> looks like we need https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/volume-key/+bug/1754422 and then promote libblockdev-crypto2 and make udisks2 pull it in
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1754422 in volume-key (Ubuntu) "[MIR] volume-key" [Undecided,Incomplete]
<duflu> dupondje, you have to rebuild it with --enable-debug AND run it with various environment settings :P
<xnox> didrocks, sorry, it was never me that had to deal with these things.
<xnox> didrocks, it sounds to me like e.g. gnome-settings-daemon (or equivalent of thereof) is not started correctly and/or not responding to those shortcuts correctly or some such =/
<didrocks> xnox: could be, who did work on the ubiquity installer session? can be a missing g-s-d, I guess the last one to look at it was seb
<didrocks> alexarnaud: anyway, I'll keep an eye on it, seb is on holidays and we'll discuss it next week, mind tagging it as rls-bb-incoming?
<xnox> didrocks, well, i think mate has different set of "settings-daemons"
<didrocks> hum, true, unsure for mate, flexiondotorg ^
<didrocks> so, quite a coincidence that both breaks
<alexarnaud> xnox: the shortcut is broken on Mate and GNOME installer
<alexarnaud> didrocks: I assume it's not a coincidence.
<didrocks> hence my sentenceâ¦
<alexarnaud> didrocks, xnox: same bug on Ubuntu 17.10.1
<didrocks> alexarnaud: thanks for confirming! Sad that nobody reported it by then though :(
<xnox> *sigh*
<alexarnaud> right but the bug 1741690 exists since the beginning of the year
<ubot5`> bug 1741690 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "You can't enable the Orca screen reader until after you click "Try Ubuntu" on Ubuntu bionic" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1741690
<alexarnaud> didrocks: Maybe it could be great to have a test to prevent such regression. Do you know if tests exists in ubiqity ?
<didrocks> alexarnaud: there are some autopilot tests, jibel would know more. Interested in contributing?
<didrocks> alexarnaud: basically python code
<alexarnaud> didrocks: I'm interesting indeed but we're so few people involved in a11y QA and I'm not sure to have enough time to take to this in my spare time (Ubuntu helps is only in my spare time)
<jibel> didrocks, alexarnaud the shortcut isseu might be bug 1750846
<ubot5`> bug 1750846 in gnome-settings-daemon (Ubuntu Bionic) "several g-s-d services are timing out when booting a live session" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1750846
<didrocks> jibel: sounds to impact as well 17.10 though (and we didn't have that timeout issue, did we?)
<jibel> didrocks, I don't know, we had several issues with a11y in 17.10.
<jibel> didrocks, alexarnaud in 17.10 shortcuts worked but then there was bug 1719995
<ubot5`> bug 1719995 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "Screen reader does not read Ubiquity windows" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1719995
<alexarnaud> jibel: On my test VM, I'm unable to launch the screen reader on the first welcome screen.
<alexarnaud> he bug you describes is about the live session
<alexarnaud> *the
<xnox> didrocks, sounds like unit ordering, and/or bug in ubiquity-dm, as the Try Ubuntu runs before the full session is started....
<xnox> hence things might be missing....
<didrocks> I don't have the time to look at it right now, let's wait for seb to be back
<andyrock> didrocks: what you mean for "maybe with a "sendMessage = True" for the 2 first cases"
<didrocks> andyrock: you have 3 conditions here
<didrocks> you only send the message on the first 2 ones if I read it correctly
<didrocks> so, set a flag to tell later on "do the dbus call"
<dupondje> dupondje: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mutter/+bug/1757401
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1757401 in mutter (Ubuntu) "hybrid GPU: one screen stays black in mutter 3.28" [Undecided,New]
<dupondje> and https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/mutter/issues/81
<dupondje> cause hell, thats an annoying bug :)
<andyrock> mmm didrocks as you prefer
<didrocks> andyrock: it's just to have complex requests one
<didrocks> andyrock: but nothing mandatory for that one, it's a personal preference
<didrocks> as long as you fix the timeout issue, I'm fine :)
<jibel> Laney, first refresh happens 5 min after initialization of the core snap
<tjaalton> dupondje: try latest mainline kernel
<andyrock> didrocks: pushed!
<jibel> Laney, er, refresh happened 2s after I set the hold value
<jibel> https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/7M48WMzZRn/
<jibel> bad luck?
<dupondje> tjaalton: i'm running the latest (with drm-tip) :)
<tjaalton> ok
<dupondje> cause without some recent kernel my system locks up when I connct a second screen :) so its a requirement :D
<tjaalton> blacklist nouveau?
<didrocks> andyrock: excellent! Did you look at all templates content for translations?
<andyrock> for what I can see are all there
<dupondje> tjaalton: guess then I can't even use my external screen :)
<dupondje> tjaalton: and it worked fine on 17.10 ... so why would it be a kernel issue?
<tjaalton> because of a regression?
<tjaalton> does 4.13 work then?
<dupondje> 4.14 you mean?
<tjaalton> no, 4.13 from artful
<jibel> Laney, mvo there is something weird. On a live session, it seems that setting refresh.hold triggers a refresh
<Laney> jibel: hmm, how did you set that?
<jibel> mvo, Laney https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/CKmgFZ8vHV/
<Laney> just manually?
<jibel> yes
<didrocks> andyrock: on line 1553, enabled is false by default?
<didrocks> (I only see that you added token='')
<Laney> that is not good
<jibel> I tried twice and there is a refresh event immediately after setting the config option
<dupondje> tjaalton: I did already run daily kernel on artful, and there it worked :)
<Laney> hold... but in a minute...
<Laney> might want to tell mwhudson this
<didrocks> andyrock: apart from that one, all looks good to me (need some manual testing on my side)
<dupondje> so guess its some other component (mutter?) that broke it
<jibel> yup moving to #snappy
 * Laney lurks
<andyrock> kk livepatch seems broken right now... some problem with "execl"
<andyrock> not sure what's going on
<andyrock> but it's on their side
<didrocks> andyrock: ok, and on my remark for enabled=false?
<andyrock> fixed
<andyrock> I was not really able to test that change because I cannot enable livepatch anymore :D
<didrocks> andyrock: tssssss ;) at least, peer reviews are for this! :)
<didrocks> andyrock: do you have an ETA for them fixing it?
<didrocks> I wonder if I should wait for testing or not
<andyrock> nope maybe on the command line "canonical-livepatch status"
<andyrock> and check if it works
<andyrock> maybe it's just here
<andyrock> i mean it's broken just here
<didrocks> andyrock: ah, so the dbus call should work, and status would change?
<didrocks> will give it a try anyway (not right now, but later)
<andyrock> you'll get the error dialog
<didrocks> ok, at least, testing the error path this way :)
<andyrock> I guess this will need a UIFe
<didrocks> andyrock: nice work, and thanks for addressing the issue!
<didrocks> andyrock: well, depends if the FFe is acked, I can upload it
<didrocks> as UIFe is tomorrow
<didrocks> andyrock: maybe chase someone from the release team?
<andyrock> I'm the only one that cannot dismiss low-battery notification in bionic?
<andyrock> didrocks: ffe approved
<didrocks> andyrock: nice! :)
<didrocks> andyrock: I'm changing 0.96.24.25 by 0.96.24.24
<andyrock> kk
<didrocks> andyrock: hum, layout is weird
<andyrock> screenshot?
 * didrocks reruns with LANG=C
 * didrocks grr at recursive search blocking everything in nautilus
<didrocks> andyrock: https://imgur.com/a/qWpRD
<andyrock> mmm that's the wanted layout
<andyrock> looking for the mockup
<andyrock> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SoftwareUpdates
<andyrock> didrocks: ^^^
<didrocks> andyrock: mind sharing my screenshot with mpt?
<didrocks> andyrock: I think he wanted that be aligned with leftmost content
<didrocks> from this mockup
<andyrock> mpt?
<andyrock> let's see if he answers here
<didrocks> andyrock: there is also another couple of question, I just commented on the MP
<oSoMoN> popey, did you ever get an answer to https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/docs-examples-for-build-snaps/2433 ?
<didrocks> andyrock: https://code.launchpad.net/~azzar1/software-properties/add-canonical-livepatch/+merge/341427/comments/893290
<didrocks> andyrock: I think #2 will be with mpt
<didrocks> I would appreciate an answer for #3
<didrocks> quite lost
<andyrock> didrocks: there never was a design for the login dialog
<andyrock> i tried to get one but never a respose
<didrocks> ok, let's see what he will say thus
<popey> oSoMoN: hah, no
<didrocks> andyrock: and in g-c-c? I have 2 accounts setup, but unsure what to do
<andyrock> also with the theme fixes it gets better
<andyrock> just pick one
<didrocks> pick, like "click"?
<andyrock> you should get both of them in the list
<didrocks> clicking just say "use this account for mail/agenda/â¦"
<didrocks> it's not really a pickler
<andyrock> do you mind sharing a screenshot?
<andyrock> of what you get?
<andyrock> are you running on bionic?
<didrocks> yes
<didrocks> sure, let me see if I'm just not up to date and there is a g-c-c I'm missing
<andyrock> you've to pick directly from the list
<ahasenack> willcooke: updating libinput got rid of my X crash, I updated the upstream bug
<didrocks> I have the default u-o-a panel to configure/add/remove accounts
<andyrock> without opening g-c-c
<ahasenack> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libinput/+bug/1751086 can be closed then?
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1751086 in libinput (Ubuntu) "Xorg assert failure: Xorg: ../src/evdev-mt-touchpad-tap.c:1002: tp_tap_handle_state: Assertion `tp->tap.nfingers_down > 0' failed." [High,Confirmed]
<didrocks> there is a new g-c-c
<didrocks> maybe that's what I'm missing
 * didrocks upgrades
<andyrock> https://usercontent.irccloud-cdn.com/file/oIb1Q86T/image.png
<andyrock> this is what I get
<andyrock> you just need to select one of the accounts
<didrocks> andyrock: ah, you saw what I have in the picker (see my second link)
<didrocks> which is what looked weird "Sign in"
<didrocks> I think it's a missing g-c-c, in that case, it means you need a dep
<andyrock> yeah because you've no ubuntu sso configured in gnome-online-acocunts
<andyrock> so you need to sign-in before
<didrocks> hum, I have my canonical account, isn't that an ubuntu sso account?
<andyrock> do you have it configured in gnome-online-acocunts?
<didrocks> yes
<didrocks> as said in my comments
<didrocks> - once I end up in UAO, I don't really know what to do, I have 2 accounts (my personal Google one and my canonical one) which are already subscribedâ¦ Clicking on them doesn't mention livepatch or anything at all, what should I do?
<andyrock> do you mind sharing a screenshot of the online-accounts panel in g-c-c?
<didrocks> andyrock: there are my accounts, let me blur it thus first
<andyrock> didrocks: kk
<didrocks> andyrock: https://imgur.com/a/y3JdU
<andyrock> you've a google account not an ubuntu sso account
<andyrock> you should have something like that
<andyrock> https://usercontent.irccloud-cdn.com/file/PyRjGM01/image.png
<jbicha> Laney: aisleriot & almanah need to have asgen rerun against them in bionic because their screenshots were accidentally deleted from the web earlier (but they're back now)
<andyrock> it has been uploaded one month ago
<jbicha> Laney: can you handle that or do you want me to just upload no-change rebuilds for those 2 packages
<andyrock> didrocks: ^^^
<didrocks> andyrock: what has been uploaded? So, I need to remove my google account and add an SSO one?
<Laney> jbicha: ok
<andyrock> didrocks: no need to remove the google account, that for gmail (email, etc)
<andyrock> *that's
<mgedmin> google calendar integration in gnome-shell ftw
<andyrock> didrocks: the new gnome-online-accounts should be already in bionic
<didrocks> andyrock: ok, so I think something should tell "select <this>"
<didrocks> it's quite puzzling
<didrocks> (in the previous sign in dialog)
<andyrock> we can remove the "settings" button
<andyrock> you don't select from g-c-c
<andyrock> but from the list
<didrocks> yeah, removing the settings button I would say and in the "sign in", tell to create/select an ubuntu SSO account
<andyrock> or you use sign-in button to login
<didrocks> yeah, but I need to create the association in g-c-c first, correct?
<andyrock> but you still got a problem
<andyrock> didrocks: nope
<didrocks> hum, puzzled
<andyrock> didrocks: you don't have an ubuntu-sso-provider
<andyrock> can you check the gnome-online-acocunts' version?
<andyrock> ah it's still in proposed? :O
<didrocks> 3.27.92-1
<didrocks> ah
<andyrock> weird
<didrocks> so, updated bionic wasn't enough
<andyrock> yeah sorry
<didrocks> and you miss a versioned dep
<andyrock> not sure why
<andyrock> I'll fix this
<didrocks> let me get it from proposed thus
<didrocks> and retry :)
<andyrock> I'll remote the settings icon
<didrocks> yeah ;)
<didrocks> andyrock: ah, way better!
<andyrock> ok let me have lunch and I'll push the fixes
<andyrock> the problem with all this is that multiple passwords are required
<andyrock> one to login inside snapd, the other to enable livepatch
<didrocks> andyrock: ah, this is why it asked for 2 passcodes
<didrocks> ok, but then
<didrocks> the window closed
<didrocks> and I have again the "Sign in" dialog
<andyrock> didrocks: are you using a yubikey?
<didrocks> andyrock: a manual counter, but similar
<didrocks> ok, so signing in didn't change the "select account dialog"
<didrocks> and it asks me again to sign inâ¦
<andyrock> didrocks: mmm I guess you need to restart gnome-online-accounts daemon
<didrocks> I am getting this stacktrace:
<didrocks> Traceback (most recent call last):
<didrocks>   File "/usr/lib/python3/dist-packages/softwareproperties/gtk/DialogAuth.py", line 199, in _listbox_accounts_row_activated_cb
<didrocks>     self._spawn_goa_with_args('add', 'ubuntusso')
<didrocks>   File "/usr/lib/python3/dist-packages/softwareproperties/gtk/DialogAuth.py", line 138, in _spawn_goa_with_args
<didrocks>     proxy.call_sync('Activate', param, Gio.DBusCallFlags.NONE, -1, None)
<didrocks> GLib.Error: g-io-error-quark: Le dÃ©lai dâattente est dÃ©passÃ© (24)
<didrocks> ohhh
<didrocks> you're probably right
<didrocks> ok done, let's retry
<didrocks> ok, now checkbox is fine
<didrocks> and then failure
<didrocks> execl fails
<didrocks> I guess that's what you meant?
<andyrock> yeah not our fault
<andyrock> not sure it's a problem in snap
<didrocks> the stacktrace is linked to that, I guess? ^
<andyrock> or in livepatch
<didrocks> you are seeing it as well, correct?
<andyrock> the "execl fails" things right?
<andyrock> you should get an ugly error dialog
<didrocks> yes, but also a stacktrace ^
<didrocks> the one I pasted 3 minutes ago
<andyrock> yeah but it was linked to the fact gnome-online-accounts deamon was not restarted
<didrocks> that was after
<andyrock> something to fix in goa post-init
<didrocks> after a fresh restart, I still have this
<andyrock> mmm not sure
<andyrock> I'm not getting this
<andyrock> I'll check after lunch
<didrocks> sure :)
<didrocks> writing the summary on the MR
<didrocks> ok, should be summarized
<didrocks> time for a break soon for me as well :)
<andyrock> mpt: if you're here please can you take a look at this: https://code.launchpad.net/~azzar1/software-properties/add-canonical-livepatch/+merge/341427
<willcooke> Laney, have you had any problems with suspend/resume on your XPS13?
<Laney> willcooke: no not really
<Laney> I had some resume failures a few months ago but not lately
<willcooke> cool, thanks Laney
<jbicha> GunnarHj: I think I'll just let robert_ancell handle your gnome-software translations merge proposal
<GunnarHj> jbicha: I called his attention to it here yesterday, response "makes sense". Thought he would merge, but he didn't, and UI freeze is tomorrow...
<jbicha> hmm
<jbicha> could you email him then and point out the deadline. If he doesn't get to it, we can upload anyway tomorrow
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Sure, I could do that. OTOH why does it matter who merge it? Do you have any doubts about the proposal?
<jbicha> it's just that it's two parts, the d/patch part needs to be pushed to our GNOME gitlab branch also
<jbicha> he's been handling most of the gnome-software uploads lately
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Ok, I'll send him a note mentioning UI freeze.
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Sounds like there is one repository too much, btw. ;)
<jbicha> we might drop the extra one when we move our work from bzr to git next cycle
<jibel> Laney, did you reproduce bug 1750465 ?
<ubot5`> bug 1750465 in plymouth (Ubuntu Artful) "upgrade attempting to process triggers out of order (package plymouth-theme-ubuntu-text 0.9.2-3ubuntu17 failed to install/upgrade: dependency problems - leaving triggers unprocessed)" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1750465
<dupondje> tjaalton: found already the commits that broke it :) so just need to get this fixed now :)
<tjaalton> dupondje: gnome?
<dupondje> mutter
<dupondje> https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/mutter/issues/81
<tjaalton> great
<tjaalton> tseliot: maybe you hit the same bug? ^
<dupondje> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gdm3/+bug/1754218 seems to be related
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1754218 in gdm "[regression] gdm 3.27 shows blank login screen on primary monitor when two monitors are connected on a hybrid intel/nvidia system" [Medium,Confirmed]
<Trevinho> Laney: hey... can you please publish https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/3201
<Laney> Trevinho: ok
<oSoMoN> Trevinho, Laney: thanks!
<Trevinho> ta
<Laney> you should ask for better changelogs though :-)
<Trevinho> Yeah, right.. I guess bileto didn't take both lines
<oSoMoN> Laney, it's concise, it says what it does, and it links to a bug report, what would you suggest to improve it?
<oSoMoN> (indeed bileto only kept the first line of the commit message, and the comma looks out of place)
<Laney> oSoMoN: I would prefer to see a short explanation of the changes and why they fix the problem
<Laney> the actual individual commits have better messages, they just didn't end up in the debian changelog
<Laney> thanks for the fix though :P
<oSoMoN> Trevinho, Laney: so bileto automatically generates a changelog entry based on the merge request commit message ;Â if I had added a new changelog entry in my merge request would it have used it instead?
<Laney> yes
<Laney> it won't touch d/changelog if the MP touches it
<Laney> iirc anyway
<oSoMoN> cool, I'll do that next time then
<oSoMoN> Trevinho, I submitted a similar fix for libindicator: https://code.launchpad.net/~osomon/libindicator/bionic-ftbfs-fix/+merge/341772
<oSoMoN> I'll add a changelog entry
<Trevinho> oSoMoN: yeah, better use debchange if you want to show things better on debian side
<oSoMoN> Trevinho, shall I leave the changelog entry UNRELEASED ?
<Trevinho> oSoMoN: yep
<Trevinho> bileto will fix it
<Trevinho> or add bionic, as you wish
<oSoMoN> done
<oSoMoN> Trevinho, ready for review and bileto
<andyrock> didrocks: pushed!
<andyrock> didrocks: mpt is off today
<andyrock> not sure blocking on design is good at this point
<andyrock> if it's about paddings/etc we can always fix it later without UIFe
<tseliot> tjaalton: it could be that
<oSoMoN> kenvandine, hey, IÂ spent some time this morning looking into https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/evince-snap-does-not-open-comic-book-file-cbr-while-deb-does-so/4523/11 (see my comments), but I kinda stalled and didn't want to spend the day on it, any ideas?
<andyrock> willcoke: for reference this is how it looks like now https://usercontent.irccloud-cdn.com/file/bkCXxMnB/sp1.png https://usercontent.irccloud-cdn.com/file/8kivUljT/sp2.png https://usercontent.irccloud-cdn.com/file/2w6o2WjG/sp3.png
<kenvandine> oSoMoN, i looked at that too, no ideas
<GunnarHj> jbicha: There is an issue with install links in gnome-user-docs. Upstream uses 'action="install:<package>"' (which AFAIK doesn't work on Ubuntu) while the format we use is 'href="apt:<package>"'. This message on gnome-doc-list illustrates the conflict:
<GunnarHj> https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gnome-doc-list/2018-March/msg00079.html
<GunnarHj> Do you know if it's possible to make the upstream variant work on Ubuntu? Or should we propose Ubuntu conditionals?
<GunnarHj> I noticed the existence of the gnome-packagekit-session package (not installed by default). Does that package have anything to do with it?
<jbicha> gnome-packagekit-session is only a transitional package
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Then we can forget about that. :)
<jbicha> I think install: used to workâ¦
<GunnarHj> jbicha: There were no such links in 16.04.
<GunnarHj> jbicha: apt: is nice, since it works also when browsing the HTML pages (at least with FF).
<jbicha> try running xdg-open install:gnome-clocks in 14.04 (maybe even 16.04)
<jbicha> I don't have 14.04 installed here since I'm no longer SRUing to it (except very rarely)
<jbicha> doesn't work in 16.04
<GunnarHj> jbicha: I have trusty in a separate partition. Will test, and get back in a while.
<jbicha> it doesn't work in Fedora either
<jbicha> GunnarHj: come back!
<GunnarHj> jbicha:
<GunnarHj> $ lsb_release -cr
<GunnarHj> Release:	14.04
<GunnarHj> Codename:	trusty
<GunnarHj> $ xdg-open install:gnome-clocks
<GunnarHj> gvfs-open: install:gnome-clocks: error opening location: The specified location is not supported
<jbicha> it doesn't work on Fedora either
<GunnarHj> jbicha: See Mario's comment here:
<GunnarHj> https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gnome-doc-list/2018-March/msg00076.html
<jbicha> GunnarHj: there is an alternative appstream:org.gnome.clocks.desktop that works on Debian but not Ubuntu!
<GunnarHj> !!
<jbicha> apt:gnome-sushi is valid though since that paragraph is only shown on Ubuntu, right?
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Right.
<jbicha> what Andre said :)
<GunnarHj> jbicha: The problem is the other links which are shown everywhere.
<jbicha> if you want install: , I would file a gnome-software bug upstream
<GunnarHj> jbicha: How can it be an upstream thing if it works on Fedora? (Which Mario claims it does.)
<jbicha> it didn't work for me, but I'm updating my F28 nowÂ¸ give it 20 minutes
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Ok. It's the behavior when clicking such a link from yelp we are talking about, right?
<willcooke> andyrock, sorry missed that ping - yeah, looks good!
<jbicha> GunnarHj: hmm, xdg-open doesn't work but the install: links in yelp half-way work. Not sure why launching from yelp is different
<jbicha> by half-way, I mean it opens GNOME Software but can't find any results for gnome-tweaks :(
<jbicha> also, Fedora manages to figure out how to provide an install link in GNOME Software for gnome-user-share, rygel and vino but Ubuntu can't do that since there isn't appstream metadata
<jbicha> so I guess file an Ubuntu bug against gnome-software for that feature not working
<jbicha> yelp isn't working in my Debian Buster install so I can't tell whether they have the same bug
<alexarnaud> Have a nice evening. See you tomorrow.
<willcooke> dinner time, night all
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Thanks for your help to investigate!
<GunnarHj> I think I'll file a gnome-software (Ubuntu) bug, even if I'm not sure that the install: link type is the best approach for us considering that apt: works smoothly both in yelp and with FF. OTOH, I can't reasonably propose Ubuntu specific conditionals in gnome-user-docs before we have sorted out if we can make it work.
<jbicha> you can just (carefully) run sed in debian/rules to switch from install: to apt:
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Yeah, I thought of that... Maybe I'll give it a try.
<GunnarHj> jbicha: One last thing about docs links:
<GunnarHj> When building the HTML, we have for many cycles converted apt:<package> to https://apps.ubuntu.com/cat/applications/<package>. See for instance the link to install Synaptic here:
<GunnarHj> https://help.ubuntu.com/16.04/ubuntu-help/addremove-install-synaptic.html
<GunnarHj> However, apps.ubuntu.com now redirects to https://snapcraft.io/store, so those links are broken. :( My plan is to drop that conversion, and use href="apt:<package>" also on the HTML pages.
<GunnarHj> Now the question: Are you aware of any other web interface to the package archive that could be used instead of apps.ubuntu.com? (packages.ubuntu.com isn't good enough for several reaons.)
<jbicha> no
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Ok, that's what I thought. Thanks!
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-03-22
<Trevinho> duflu: hey... Could you please check again those theme changes? Feel free to abstain if don't want to go through all the code, andrea might check them too but at least please check those fixes you requested :)
<duflu> Trevinho, I'm over it so will probably abstain. Let's just get it done and then see if there are any remaining problems
<didrocks> good morning
<duflu> Morning-ish didrocks
<didrocks> hey duflu!
 * tsimonq2 waves
<jibel> good morning all
<duflu> Morning tsimonq2, jibel
<didrocks> hey jibel, tsimonq2
<tsimonq2> Yo :)
<tsimonq2> I've been busy filing these: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.tag=qt4-removal
<tsimonq2> It might be a good idea to see if there's anything besides lightdm and libreoffice that the Desktop Team wants to pay particular attention to.
<tsimonq2> I'm manually sifting through the list now and changing to removal bugs where necessary.
<tjaalton> duflu: I'll upload the new mesa rc with your patch today
<duflu> tjaalton, thanks
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
 * oSoMoN waves and dashes off to school
<tsimonq2> o/ oSoMoN
<didrocks> hey oSoMoN
<Trevinho> hey guys
<tsimonq2> o/ Trevinho
<Trevinho> I need some eyes on https://code.launchpad.net/~3v1n0/ubuntu-themes/placessidebar-ambiance-rw-inspired/+merge/341878
<Trevinho> and other themes reviews, as they should land by tonight
<tsimonq2> Hum, any reason why apps.ubuntu.com now redirects to some snap thing? It used to have some info about debs that now seems completely discarded...
<Trevinho> didrocks: maybe you can help in checking that ambiance-rw thing?
<Trevinho> Other MPs at https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/3187 and PPA soon built with latest stuff...
<didrocks> Trevinho: at first glance, it looks good to me, but I can't test it and I've already spent a lot of review time this week compared to the telemetry work I need to finish, maybe check with L_aney once around?
<Trevinho> didrocks: ok no problem, maybe just add the ppa for some random testing...
<Trevinho> didrocks: it will be updated soon
<didrocks> sure
<mpt> andyrock, done
<jibel> Laney, Hi, https://launchpadlibrarian.net/361601206/casper_1.391.debdiff
<jibel> Laney, I'll test on a image with updates but it seems to do the trick
<Laney> hi there
<Laney> jibel: I'd install it to /etc as a non package manager owned location, and isn't snapd.service.wants better or doesn't that work for some reason?
<didrocks> hey Laney
<jibel> Laney, what do you mean in /etc/ ?
<Laney> not /lib/
<Laney> yo didrocks
<Laney> how are you?
<jibel> Laney, units in /etc have to be symbolic links
<Laney> no
<Laney> it's just the local configuration directory
<jibel> ah in /etc/systemd/system, yeah, I can do that
<Laney> â¥
<jibel> 25adduser injects a unit in /lib
<Laney> I guess I didn't review that one
<duflu> Here's a fun optical illusion for those wearing glasses: open the activities overview and highlight a window (orange border). Now look at the white cross (close button in the top-right corner). Depending on the angle you view the screen, the white circle moves around the orange circle, or even escapes it when viewed at an extreme angle
<duflu> I thought it was a bug, but it's just optics
<oSoMoN> duflu, IÂ do see it, but it's quite subtle
<oSoMoN> and on my screen even at an extreme angle the white circle never escapes the orange one
<duflu> I guess you need thick-edged lenses
<oSoMoN> I'm not short-sighted enough :)
<duflu> oSoMoN, also this monitor is not in front of me. It's way off to the side
<sil2100> duflu: hey!
<duflu> sil2100, hello
<sil2100> duflu: I was looking at the xenial unapproved queue and saw a fix from you for ubuntu-themes - is that already fixed in bionic?
<sil2100> duflu: also, would be nice if the bug had SRU info in the description ;)
<sil2100> (https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-themes/+bug/1725921)
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1725921 in ubuntu-themes (Ubuntu Bionic) "[regression] Combobox menus have gray text on gray background" [High,In progress]
<duflu> sil2100, I didn't queue that :)
<duflu> sil2100, it was not meant to be queued, unless Trevinho is working on a release for it
<duflu> I think he's aiming to fix a bunch of theme issues all at once soon
<duflu> sil2100, and no, the fix for bionic has not landed yet
<duflu> But both are there
<sil2100> duflu: ok then, I'll wait for the bionic part to get released and the paperwork filled then - thanks!
<duflu> sil2100, any hint as to how it got queued?
<duflu> I know at least one bot likes to subscribe ubuntu-sponsors prematurely when a patch is attached to (some) bugs, but that doesn't seem to be the case on this one
 * duflu shrugs and goes to make dinner
<didrocks> Trevinho: also, maybe ask people to test the ppa in https://community.ubuntu.com/t/ambiance-gnome-theme-bugbears-and-what-can-be-done-about-them/1637/27?
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Hi Jeremy, gnome-software seems to be untouched since yesterday, so please...
<jbicha> ok
<jbicha> good morning
<GunnarHj> Morning!
<jbicha> didrocks: ubiquity is a pain. I don't think I'm going to make the UIF deadline
<didrocks> ok
<didrocks> I guess if you pre-warn the documentation team about landing it after UIF, they won't take screenshot from day 1
<jbicha> translations are the bigger problem
<jbicha> I'll email the lists today though, good idea
<GunnarHj> didrocks, jbicha: Yeah, currently there is nothing about the installer in the desktop guide. So it sounds to be a pure translation thing - without knowing what it is. ;)
<jbicha> GunnarHj: I'd like to get the one page of the installer to look more like https://goo.gl/DqtvZL
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Wow, that looks like a big change. But a nice one.
<GunnarHj> jbicha: A nice observation about the "Ubuntu Software" string: Rosetta makes use of the translations from xenial, so there is nothing new to translate for most languages.
<jbicha> ok, good
<Laney> don't umount /dev
<kenvandine> Laney, is that a pro-tip?
<Laney> yep
<Laney> tip of the day
<kenvandine> i bet that makes the desktop super usable
<Laney> worst thing is you can't use sudo to get it back
<Laney> /o\
<jbicha> didrocks: do you know how debian/ubiquity.templates gets updated for new gtklabels?
<jbicha> or cyphermox ^
<alexarnaud> Hello all
<alexarnaud> Do you have any idea why the bug https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1721797 is private ?
<ubot5> Error: ubuntu bug 1721797 not found
<alexarnaud> A user report us a crash about speech-dispatcher but the initial report seems private.
<alexarnaud> We would like to help to figure it out as crash of speech-dispatcher is not expected.
<didrocks> jbicha: no, you need to update it manually
<jbicha> ok
<didrocks> and then update the .pot in from there
<didrocks> s/in//
<jbicha> hmm?
<jbicha> how do I update the pot?
<didrocks> check the previous commits, I even wrote it in the commit message :)
<didrocks> as it wasn't obvious and I have to dive into the code :p
<didrocks> IIRC, it's debconf-updatepo
<jbicha> bzr is a headache for that kind of thing. I'm guessing your comment is on your original branch
<didrocks> oh right, probably subbranch
<didrocks> I'm pretty sure it's debconf-updatepo, once you modified the .template file
<jbicha> there's no real sort order to debian/ubiquity.templates is there?
<didrocks> jbicha: I just try to group with other parts that were grouped logically
<didrocks> I think just add next to where I added them
<jbicha> yeah
<willcooke> alexarnaud, there could be sensitive data in the logs.  I'm in a meeting so can't look in any depth right now, but I could subscribe you directly if you want to check it.  Or maybe jibel could take a look and make it public
<didrocks> jbicha: FYI, you will need an ubiquity member to merge your branch, I'm not one of them
<Trevinho> good Laney are you still using the theme ppa? :)
<jbicha> didrocks: yeah, that's one reason why it won't happen on time
<Laney> hey Trevinho, no but I can add it
<Laney> didrocks: want to be? :-)
<didrocks> Laney: sounds like a trap :p so pass for this time
<didrocks> maybe try it once I'm drunk ;)
<didrocks> skip*
<didrocks> (my test just passed, hence the typo ;))
<Laney> :<
<oSoMoN> didrocks, what time of the day are you usually drunk? ;)
<didrocks> almost never, that's the trick! :)
<jbicha> yay, I got ubiquity to build
<Trevinho> Laney: feel free, as you've to publish it soon anyways xD
<Laney> hmm
<Laney> I think the load of publishing bileto silos should be spread to other core-devs on the team too
<Laney> not that I mind helping most of the time
<Trevinho> Laney: yeah... I agree, you just happen to be the one I love to bother the most xD
<jbicha> I think ubiquity even works
<Trevinho> Laney: ah actually since I've to publish a g-c-c change too, the debdiff is in a bug, want me to build the src package and you can dput it into that silo?
<Trevinho> Laney: anyway a part from the theme changes themselves which have been reviewed by andyrock too, I guess there you've just to double-check that debian change we did at the sprint
<Trevinho> oh, if any of kenvandine or didrocks want to do the publishing of https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/3187 feel free
<jbicha> didrocks: can I push this? (totem adding to minimal remove list) https://paste.debian.net/1016025/
<didrocks> Trevinho: all the branches are approved/reviewed/tested?
<Trevinho> didrocks: yep
<didrocks> jbicha: have you tested it with extra codecs and ensure nothing is bringing back totem on the system?
<didrocks> Trevinho: trusting you thus!
<Trevinho> didrocks: most of them are there for a while now, and I asked already during the sprint to test, so far andyrock was using it
<jbicha> didrocks: no
<didrocks> jbicha: :( I think I already requested that last time you talked about totem
<Trevinho> didrocks: not that I'm really in love with that dark sidebar but... well design ack'ed it xD
<jbicha> didrocks: reverse-depends -c main src:totem says that nothing beside u-desktop recommends pulls it in
<Trevinho> even a community comment isn't really appreciating it
<didrocks> Trevinho: publishing, I'll let you finalize
<Trevinho> didrocks: ok thanks
<didrocks> jbicha: you shoud still give a try, I had weird surprises with real testing
<jbicha> didrocks: I don't understand why there would be a codecs problem, webkit2gtk depends on the gstreamer stuff
<didrocks> jbicha: still, better testing than being sorry
<jbicha> didrocks: is it better to push today because of UIF?
<didrocks> jbicha: I told you what I thought, it needs testing
<didrocks> so don't ask me if it's better to rush it or not
<didrocks> especially when it's nit the first time and explicitely told I didn't work on this totem removal as I didn't get time for testing. Updating the list is easyâ¦
<jbicha> hey, if I really wanted to rush, I wouldn't have asked first :(
<didrocks> I'm unsure why you ask then, knowing my answerâ¦
<didrocks> Trevinho: and done!
<Trevinho> didrocks: sweet, thanks
<juliank> Heya! I installed bionic from a daily a few days ago, and connected my Google accounts, but the calendar does not work.
 * Trevinho prepares for the haters xD
<juliank> Ideas for debugging that?
<juliank> I installed evolution to look into accounts there, and it only shows mail & contacts for the GOA adapter accounts
<Trevinho> andyrock: ^?
<oSoMoN> Trevinho, FYI, IÂ just created https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/3211 (will test it extensively before bothering you with a review request)
<Trevinho> oSoMoN: is chrome now using that, right?
<oSoMoN> Trevinho, they want to, which is why they requested multi-arch support
<Trevinho> oSoMoN: I mean I was following an issue where they pushed the code to actually doing it :)
<Trevinho> oSoMoN: anyway from my pov looks good, unfortunately I won't be able to publish that as distro changes are more for our beloved core devs :)
<oSoMoN> Trevinho, yeah sure, just wanted to keep you posted
<Trevinho> juliank: fyi, I've the same issue when testing it
<juliank> Trevinho: Awesome
<Trevinho> juliank: please open a bug, it's quite important fix I guess
<Trevinho> oSoMoN: appreciated :)
<Trevinho> Even nextcloud seems to have some troubles...
<Trevinho> https://usercontent.irccloud-cdn.com/file/cZyA4aIf/image.png
<Trevinho> A part that it says "ownCloud" in the error
<Trevinho> I've 2fa enabled there, not sure it's related..
<Trevinho> juliank: also todo lists seems to have troubles though
<juliank> Trevinho: I only looked at mail, calendar, contacts. is todo also exported to EDS?
<jbicha> juliank: did you try restarting your computer?
<juliank> heh, I tried restarting, readding, toggling on/off
<juliank> it works fine on an artful->bionic upgrade
<jbicha> didrocks: LP: #1758082 fyi
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1758082 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "[UIFe] Update ubiquity's Minimal Install page to match the spec" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1758082
<jbicha> Laney: I see you're on the ubiquity team. Do you have time today to review? ^
<Trevinho> juliank: mh, something wrong in init then
<Trevinho> juliank: todo should use google tasks I think
<Trevinho> as it gives the ability to use it
<jibel> jbicha, this is just a string change?
<juliank> Trevinho: It's integrated, but can't create lists
<jbicha> jibel: strings, converting a checkbox to radiobox, and rearranging
<juliank> or show lists
<Trevinho> juliank: me neither... is did it work in artful?
<juliank> no idea
<jibel> juliank, I can have a look
<jibel> jbicha, ^ that was for you
<juliank> I can check if it works in the bionic I upgraded from artful
<jibel> sorry juliank
<jbicha> jibel: thanks (no actual python code changes)
<juliank> oh, I don't have it booted
<jbicha> jibel: the padding looks a bit wrong to me, maybe that will be fixed later (it at least won't affect translations or ubuntu-docs)
<jibel> too many j's talking confused weechat :)
<juliank> jibel: lol
<willcooke> Laney, FYI:  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-wallpapers/+bug/1758089
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1758089 in ubuntu-wallpapers (Ubuntu) "18.04 default wallpapers" [Undecided,New]
<Laney> jbicha: hmm, I'm not sure, maybe if it's small
<Laney> would it be hard for you to re-push with the .py changes in a separate commit?
<willcooke> I'll try and diddle with the PNG a bit and see if I can make it any smaller. WDYT about making it 4k instead of 8k - should be fine?
<Laney> willcooke: thx
<jbicha> Laney: jibel is looking instead. Thanks
<jbicha> there are no .py changes, just .ui changes and the translation noise
<Laney> ok then imagine I said substantive instead of .py, you know what I was getting at
<jbicha> jibel: Laney: merge proposal updated with it split into multiple commits
<jibel> jbicha, is it ready for review or you still have some changes to do?
<jbicha> jibel: it's ready for review from my side. I don't have any planned changes to make
<jibel> good. Thanks
<Laney> willcooke: 4k doesn't reduce the size that much
<Laney> boohoo
<Laney> well it's 5M, so in percentage terms that's not bad but still big
<willcooke> bah
<willcooke> Should we use the JPG then?
<willcooke> pngcrush failed me this time
<willcooke> Maybe gimp can help, lemme try
<GunnarHj> The links on pages browsed with yelp are blue (up to 17.10 they are orange). Is that change intentional / desirable?
<willcooke> Laney, ah, Gimp docs says use JPG for things with lots of colours
<Laney> it's ok, but we have to lie and call it a .png anyway
<Laney> not sure why this is so much bigger than the artful one
<GunnarHj> jbicha: Shaun says that the broken install: links is a yelp issue. He also confirm that they don't work on Fedora either.
<GunnarHj> https://mail.gnome.org/archives/gnome-doc-list/2018-March/msg00096.html
<jbicha> GunnarHj: please file a bug against ubuntu-themes for the blue links. I confirm that the links were orange before https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-themes/16.10+18.04.20180122.1-0ubuntu1
<jbicha> didrocks: how am I supposed to test the minimal install file? edit the iso and replace the casper/ file?
<Laney> copy it somewhere you can write to
<Laney> edit the source of ubiquity to point to that :-)
<jbicha> lol ok
<Laney> or you can maybe like bind mount a file on top of it
<Laney> haven't tried that though
<jbicha> testing the installer is fun
<jibel> willcooke, not sure you can do better with a gradient so smooth and a png
<Laney> how did artful's wallpaper do it?
<jbicha> didrocks: I did the minimal totem-less install. Could you be more specific about what kind of testing you want me to do now?
<jibel> Laney, if you zoom in, the gradient is different, there are large uniform area in artful, while it's all pixelated for bionic
<jibel> it's visible in the dark pink areas
<jibel> https://imgur.com/a/crSkX
<jibel> left is A, right is B
<jibel> willcooke, I think you need a better source image
<willcooke> jibel, thanks, I'll ask design and see if they can make the gradients less, err, graduated
<alexarnaud> willcooke: OK, if you could subscribe me maybe it could be helpful.
<alexarnaud> Sorry for the late reply, I was in call with a user ^^.
<didrocks> jbicha: basically, you can boot in the live session, and replace te file before starting the install
<didrocks> before starting ubiquity*
<didrocks> jbicha: then, you proceed the install (checking additional drivers)
<didrocks> and reboot
<didrocks> check that you don't have totem or anything on your new list on the installation
<jbicha> ok, sounds simple enough
<didrocks> it really is :)
<didrocks> just takes time
<jibel> willcooke, possibly the conversion to indexed colors did this. I'm down to 2.5MB by converting to RGB and blurring the image a bit.
<jibel> and ... /me -> EOD
<jbicha> jibel: so ubiquity merge proposal tomorrow maybe?
<jibel> jbicha, surely tomorrow.
<jbicha> great, thanks
<jbicha> Trevinho: g-c-c from LP: #1757471 wasn't uploaded. Do you want me to do that?
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1757471 in gnome-control-center (Ubuntu) "Remove local theme changes" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1757471
<willcooke> g'night all
<Trevinho> jbicha: oh yes thanks
<Trevinho> jbicha: I actually wanted to include it in the ppa, but eventually I forgot
<jbicha> really nice to have lists working better. I think that was one of the big annoyances in GNOME Builder too
<acheronuk> jbicha: ubuntu minimal install keeps totem?
<jbicha> acheronuk: it does today, but I'm trying to change that :) https://code.launchpad.net/~jbicha/ubuntu-seeds/minimal-remove-totem/+merge/341921
<acheronuk> hmmm. for kubuntu, I'm not sure I want to boot vlc off. the wording of the minimal install options suggest this would happen
<acheronuk> jbicha: kubuntu also doesn't include any games
<jbicha> acheronuk: I think you could add a different label for Kubuntu then. It's a bit of a pain to update ubiquity but it's do-able :)
<jbicha> we're removing Totem for Minimal Install, in part because VLC is so popular! ;)
<jbicha> gnome-mpv is a popular choice too on GTK desktops
<acheronuk> jbicha: yep. I will look into that (or scream for help to cyphermox)
<acheronuk> I use smplayer with mpv mostly
<jbicha> (we also remove Rhythmbox in Ubuntu Desktop Minimal)
<acheronuk> yeah, I took cantata (jukebox) off for kubuntu, but would quite like to leave a basic player
<jbicha> the string might still work then? Something to think aboutâ¦
<jbicha> a media player is a basic utility in my opinion (and it's part of why it was still there until today)
<jbicha> but there's so many choices of media players and a Minimal Install is useful for people who like to choose
<acheronuk> or maybe just tweaked slightly? s/media player/extra media players/
<jbicha> acheronuk: would a PPA with my ubiquity merge proposal be useful for you to try?
<acheronuk> jbicha: yeah, that would be good. seems like it should be ok on flavours, but always best to check
<jbicha> acheronuk: https://launchpad.net/~jbicha/+archive/ubuntu/temp-ubiquity/+packages
<acheronuk> jbicha: thanks. just doing tests on something else, but I'll try to run through 2 variants of an install shortly
<kenvandine> good morning robert_ancell
<acheronuk> jbicha: KDE front end is the same as before, which I asume you intend?
<acheronuk> jbicha: oh, not unchanged. just not with the new radio box etc
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-03-23
<Trevinho> jbicha: would you mind to backport this commit https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gtk+3.0/+bug/1758224 ?
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1758224 in gtk+3.0 (Ubuntu) "Scaled gtk theme assets are ignored in HiDPI" [High,Triaged]
<Trevinho> err https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gtk/commit/e36b629c367fa11e6e544ff8b8203bcf29ec73ee
<duflu> Trevinho, thanks for the bionic theme update... I'm seeing a 1px gap between bubble menus and their arrow though. Is that new?
<Trevinho> duflu: just more visible now
<Trevinho> duflu: but it's already fixed
<duflu> Also the colour of the arrow is different to the bubble
<duflu> slightly
<Trevinho> duflu: there are two reviews if you want to check/approve them, I can land them straigth away
<duflu> Trevinho, if there are screenshots then I'll probably review them straight away :D
<duflu> Although I would also be happy if you got some sleep
<Trevinho> duflu: yeah, now that i'm done with another fix, i'm going...
<Trevinho> duflu: and fix is this one
<Trevinho> https://usercontent.irccloud-cdn.com/file/QZ2WV3hG/image.png
<didrocks> good morning
<tsimonq2> o/ didrocks
<duflu> Hi didrocks, tsimonq2
<didrocks> hey tsimonq2, duflu
<tsimonq2> o/
<willcooke> hoy
 * duflu doesn't understand but waves to willcooke
<willcooke> o/
<willcooke> right, now I'm going again.  Dr's bbiab
<didrocks> hey willcooke
<jibel> hola everyone
<duflu> Hi jibel
<didrocks> hey jibel
<jibel> Laney, jbicha re design change in ubiquity, I agree with acheronuk and tsimonq2 and won't merge until the KDE frontend is updated too.
<Laney> hi
<ShriHari> hi laney
<didrocks> oh, only the GTK frontend was updated?
<didrocks> not what I mentioned during the team meeting with jbicha
<duflu> Hi hi Laney
<Laney> jibel: ok, but I agree with jbicha that it's not introducing a regression
<Laney> and if he's not willing to do the work then I guess we don't get the change
<tsimonq2> Laney: It's a UX regression of anything.
<tsimonq2> s/of/if/
<Laney> what?
<Laney> that change is not
<tsimonq2> One frontend gets new sections and radio boxes and the other gets a terser section of text.
<Laney> It already has the previous UI
<Laney> The UI is not changing
<Laney> Therefore the UI is not regressing
<seb128> Laney, the description is
<seb128> there is a string change
<Laney> You might think it's worse than the GTK one, but it is not regressing versus what it currently has
<Laney> no?
<Laney> hey seb128
<seb128> hey Laney
<seb128> sorry, I'm half back, need to catch a train in a bit
<tsimonq2> It is a regression
<seb128> Laney, see https://launchpadlibrarian.net/361682891/kde-front-end-before.png vs https://launchpadlibrarian.net/361682873/kde-front-end-after.png
<seb128> the substring/description
<seb128> I didn't notice it at first either
<tsimonq2> Also, why only put one frontend closer to spec?
<seb128> otherwise I agree there is no reason we should force people to update the kde frontend when they change the gtk one, but in this case it makes a string used less nice
<seb128> tsimonq2, because that spec is our GTK desktop  one
<seb128> kubuntu team could have different intend
<tsimonq2> Hm. OK.
<seb128> like not being interested by minimal desktop
<tsimonq2> No, we have the option.
<seb128> also you can't force our team to take the cost of maintaining flavors
<didrocks> good morning seb128
<tsimonq2> That's fine, but why weren't we involved before release team acked?
<duflu> Hi seb128
<tsimonq2> Kubuntu was an afterthought at best.
<Laney> I think the release team said to check with Kubuntu, which is what happened, no?
<jibel> Indeed but they should both sync so a change in a flavor doesn't have a negative impact on another flavour
<tsimonq2> Laney: I interpreted your comment as an ACK, was that incorrect?
<Laney> It was ACK but check with Kubuntu, which is what happened.
<acheronuk> not volunteering here, but a brief hack at it this morning: https://i.imgur.com/8ku1e9E.png
<Laney> So you weren't afterthoughted.
<Laney> You were perithoughted
<willcooke> back
<tsimonq2> I guess I'm just personally wondering why we weren't involved before the MP was made so we could have had the opportunity to introduce the code.
<tsimonq2> I'll accept perithought. :P
<tsimonq2> s/personally //
<tsimonq2> acheronuk might work on something, but until then, I NACK on the grounds of not having a Qt equivalent there.
<Laney> Qt equivalent isn't a fair thing to ask for
<Laney> Not making the UX regress is - sorry for not noticing that straight away
<tsimonq2> Not from the Desktop Team; I understand that.
<tsimonq2> But we should still have the opportunity.
<tsimonq2> And I'd argue that it should be done in one upload.
<Laney> It can be, but there's no reason it needs to be
<tsimonq2> Kubuntu's installer regresses
<Laney> Feeling a bit circular now, sorry
<tsimonq2> I'd be surprised if the Release Team ACKs despite regressions.
<tsimonq2> No problem. I think I've made my point. :)
<acheronuk> tsimonq2: I may carry on with it later, but not 100% certain on correctness of what I have done or doing
 * didrocks feels that fixing it will take less time than this conversation TBH
<tsimonq2> Probably.
<tsimonq2> acheronuk: ACK, feel free to share your WIP and I'll be happy to peer review.
<acheronuk> ok. jibel jbicha etc, is there a particular reason this needs to be landed before the weekend? I would assume not, and Kubuntu or whoever else can have the weekend to get something sorted?
<acheronuk> that is of course unless someone else with more skill feels like kindly knocking it out quickly today
<Laney> j_bicha was trying to make UIF
<Laney> acheronuk: thx for working on the fix
<acheronuk> and UIF came into effect yesterday without this getting in I assume?
<Laney> I think notification would have been nice, even if I don't agree we should in principle block on changes on both side
<Laney> yes
<Laney> it's missed it now
<acheronuk> Laney: it would have been nice and collaborative to get a "we are working on these changes, would you like to contribute equivalents for the KDE front end?"
<acheronuk> but things do get done in a hurry at times like this
<acheronuk> I'll busy most of rest of workday, but can look more tonight
<acheronuk> *be busy
<jibel> acheronuk, nothing other that giving enough time to translators to update the strings
<acheronuk> jibel: ok. so a few extra days will no cause significant issues there? as long as it is just days
<jibel> it depends on your definition of "few" :) the translation deadline for Ubiquity is in 3 weeks. It'd be nice to leave as much time as possible to translate and verify the UI
<acheronuk> jibel: well as I said, hopefully by Monday. if it takes longer than that I would be (a) very surprised and (b) give it up as a bad job
<jibel> acheronuk, Monday is okay, thanks for working on this.
<acheronuk> ok :)
<seb128> hey didrocks duflu
<Laney> a happy ending ... ?
<seb128> tsimonq2, not implementing the same new options Ubuntu decide to give (or remove) isn't a regression but a choice
<didrocks> if I knew that would have triggered that amount of polemic, I wouldn't have implemented it in the KDE variant at first :(
<seb128> acheronuk, tsimonq2, what's the point to delay Ubuntu improvements landing just because other flavors need to catch up? Things should land when ready, not be blocked on "if we can't have our cake you are not geting yours either" reasons
<seb128> didrocks, yeah, teaching you for trying to help :)
<Laney> think we can probably draw a line now ...
<Laney> hugs to one and all
<didrocks> yeah! ;)
<acheronuk> didrocks: it's very much appreciated that you did
<Laney> going to london for the weekend
<Laney> just found out it's the oxford / cambridge boat race
<Laney> maybe i should go spectate
<didrocks> Laney: is it a thing where you sit for 3 hours to wait for all of them passing by you in likeâ¦ 10s? ;)
<Laney> #sport
<Laney> probably a huge crowd too
<didrocks> yeah
<Laney> I saw there is the oxford / cambridge goat race on the same day
<Laney> that one might be better
<seb128> I'm in Paris atm, next to gare de l'est
<seb128> they locked down one side of the station because there is a leftover box outside
<Laney> seb128: get to nord, take the eurostar, we'll hang out
<seb128> they are having the anti-bomb robot getting ready :)
<didrocks> seb128: close your hears when they will make it explode
<seb128> Laney, haha, in fact I'm going to Nord but taking the Thalys :p
<didrocks> last time at gare de Lyon (in Paris thus :p), it made a lot of noise
<seb128> didrocks, thanks, I'm in my hotel some streets away now with some luck they clear it out before I go
<didrocks> yeah, you should be fine :)
<ackk> tkamppeter, hi, is there anything more I could debug about https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/hplip/+bug/1731417 ?
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1731417 in hplip (Ubuntu) "Installed network printer removed automatically when turned off" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<jbicha> acheronuk: I suggest changing the sidebar title from "Prepare" to "Software" to better match the new page title at
<jbicha> https://launchpadlibrarian.net/361682873/kde-front-end-after.png
<acheronuk> jbicha: I was using the old vesrion in a live session to quickly test modify. if you changed that title string in your revision/template, I think it will be carried over when I apply the changes on top of yours
<acheronuk> if it doesn't, I will change it
<jbicha> yeah, GTK+ doesn't use a one-word page title like that so that's a KDE-specific change
<willcooke> Laney, jibel - just attached a "no grain" version of the wallpaper.  Now 1.6MB!!! And looks sharper IMO.
<willcooke> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubuntu-wallpapers/+bug/1758089
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1758089 in ubuntu-wallpapers (Ubuntu) "18.04 default wallpapers" [Undecided,New]
<Laney> willcooke: ta duck
<amano> didrocks, c-lobrano told me on the Ubuntu community HUB that there was a Mutter toggle to open new windows in the middle of the screen instead of the top left corner. I think that opening in the middle would be much preferable visually. Having the window in the top left by default creates a very dark area there for the Community theme with the dark headerbar and the dark topbar crammed together. And in the very top left corner
<didrocks> amano: hum, interesting, mind opening a bug against mutter as a whishlist so that I keep that in mind (and linking here)?
<didrocks> they don't open on the top left corner for me, but currently in a multiscreen env
<amano> I will open a bug for you :)
<didrocks> thx! :)
<c-lobrano> amano, didrocks it's center-new-windows under /org/gnome/mutter
<c-lobrano> it works with new windows only, I noticed that some apps stay opened in background so position does not change (like nautilus, gnome software, ...)
<didrocks> good hint :)
<jbicha> interesting, does that work ok for dual-monitors?
<jbicha> ricotz: it looks like you added the center-new-windows setting. Do you know why it's not enabled by default?
<jbicha> didrocks: I assume you saw https://code.launchpad.net/~jbicha/ubuntu-seeds/minimal-remove-totem/+merge/341921 and have just been busy?
<seb128> Thalys first class space at the train station is crap
<seb128> like internet, but port filtered, no imap/irc/vpn, welcome to soviet union
<didrocks> jbicha: no, I didn't see it, just approved it, are you handling the merge + upload?
<jbicha> I can push, yes, it doesn't need an actual ubuntu-meta deb upload, right?
<didrocks> jbicha: shouldn't, yeah
<jbicha> done
<amano_> didrocks, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mutter/+bug/1758314
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1758314 in mutter (Ubuntu) "[Whishlist] Open new windows in the middle of the screen" [Undecided,New]
<jibel> willcooke, just 10x smaller ;)
<willcooke> :)
<jibel> now if you convert to 4k and optimize a bit that should be reasonable
<willcooke> You think 4k is enough?  Should be, right?
<tkamppeter> ackk, sorry, I have overlooked that you have posted your files in the bug report. I am looking into it now.
<ackk> tkamppeter, thanks
<willcooke> jibel, uploaded a 4k version to the bug.  Only 652k now \o/
<jibel> You think 8k is common?
<jibel> it's good, artful was 607K
<Nafallo> supported for five years. the question is surely if 8k is enough by then end of 2023? ;-)
<didrocks> ackk: thx!
<jibel> supported doesn't mean it's common
<Nafallo> in 2023... :-)
<jibel> we'll SRU a new wallpaper then
<Nafallo> now, that makes sense to me indeed :-)
<jibel> and since telemetry will give us that info ....
<Nafallo> 4k is starting to become common fwiw.
<jibel> willcooke, 552K
<didrocks> amano_: thx! (still thanks, ackk though ;))
<willcooke> jibel, did you crush it some more?
<jibel> willcooke, yes with optipng
<Laney> I'd usually do all this you know
<Laney> but thanks for helping
<amano_> jbicha, I saw that the gnome-terminal package carries a debian distro patch to use the scrollbar background colour from the theme. in practice the terminal scrollbar background is always dark for me. That looks ok with the default terminal theme but it looks slightly wrong with bright themes. Can you consider dropping the patch to have a standard scrollbar with the next terminal upload?
<jbicha> jibel: have you ever tried zopfli? we use it to compress the pngs for fonts-noto-color-emoji (but it makes the build take a long time)
<jbicha> amano_: have you tried building gnome-terminal without the patch?
<jibel> jbicha, no I didn't; I'm used to this tool but I'll try
<amano_> nope, not yet
<ackk> tkamppeter, fwiw it seems that disabling bonjour on the printer might be a workaround for the issue
<ackk> although it'd be nice to be able to have it on
<mgedmin> oh is that why gnome-terminal's scroollbar has this weird 1px white border that sticks out on Adwaita?
<jbicha> amano_: ok, I believe the patch is needed for Ubuntu's default themes
<willcooke> jibel, if Laney's happy, want to add it to the bug?
<jibel> willcooke, I did
<willcooke> oh yeah
<willcooke> thanks
<jibel> We'd need a marmot for the slideshow of the installer too. Should we reuse this one or design will provide another one?
<jibel> willcooke, ^
<jibel> usually it's done on release week ...
<jibel> the earlier, the less report we'll receive telling it is not the right animal
<willcooke> jibel,  I have one
<willcooke> I'm waiting on a couple of changes and will upload
<jibel> willcooke, okay, thanks
<Trevinho> seb128: hey, we need to get this https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gtk+3.0/+bug/1758224 (see commit linked there), want me to do a debdiff or anyone else can handle it?
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1758224 in gtk+3.0 (Ubuntu) "Scaled gtk theme assets are ignored in HiDPI" [High,Triaged]
<seb128> Trevinho, hey, I saw that, I can handle it
<Trevinho> seb128: thanks, it's quite bothering... bad thing was that I noticed it, I found the issue, wrote the fix... and then... It was already fixed in the past two weeks, but I didn't git pull in the mean time -_-
<seb128> Trevinho, that happens indeed :/
<ricotz> jbicha, it was meant to not change the current behaviour and providing this option which is used by e.g. elementaryOS
<jbicha> ricotz: have you asked GNOME Design about changing the behavior?
<ricotz> jbicha, no
<jbicha> ok
<ricotz> the goal of that commit was to provide this feature for 3rd party users of libmutter ;)
<ackk> tkamppeter, attached avahi outut as requested
<jbicha> I'm asking in #gnome-design nowâ¦
<flocculant> willcooke: any more thoughts on the long time to desktop thing ?
<willcooke> flocculant, jibel has been looking at it.  There is a new release of snapd which we think might help.  jibel - did you test it yet?
<flocculant> snapd? I guess you're looking at something else then lol
<flocculant> timeout's I see on ubuntu and xubuntu are bluetooth issues
<flocculant> anyway - what do I know lol
<jibel> willcooke, the new version just allows to delay the refresh of snap packages. There is still the issue with decompressing the snaps during boot and several timeouts like bug 1750846 for gsd or bluez like flocculant reported
<ubot5> bug 1750846 in gnome-settings-daemon (Ubuntu Bionic) "several g-s-d services are timing out when booting a live session" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1750846
<flocculant> aah cool - different thing then - I was confused for a bit there :)
<flocculant> cheers jibel
<kenvandine> translated xdg-user-dirs https://imgur.com/a/8EeUK
<kenvandine> woot
<kenvandine> using the gedit snap
<Laney> nice
<Laney> what's the fix?
<seb128> back online
<kenvandine> https://github.com/ubuntu/snapcraft-desktop-helpers/pull/103
<kenvandine> Laney, that's the fix
<kenvandine> hey seb128!
<kenvandine> translated xdg-user-dirs https://imgur.com/a/8EeUK
<jbicha> seb128: just wondering, what IRC client do you use?
<Laney> kenvandine: you have permission to read those?
<kenvandine> Laney, yes
<kenvandine> we didn't in the past
<kenvandine> but we do now
<seb128> hey kenvandine
<seb128> jbicha, xchat-gnome
<seb128> jbicha, why?
<seb128> kenvandine, nice
<jbicha> seb128: LP: #1758163
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1758163 in xchat-gnome (Ubuntu) "Please remove xchat-gnome from Ubuntu (again)" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1758163
<jbicha> seb128: this is what happens when you're not around ;)
<jbicha> have you tried polari?
<seb128> jbicha, not this cycle
<seb128> I should give it another try, maybe it improved
<seb128> jbicha, that bug is a joke, "it is too much of a maintenance overhead"
<jbicha> it probably didn't change much recently
<seb128> it's not like we had lot of fixing to do on it in recent cycles
<jbicha> I thought the hexchat bug was a joke too! :|
<seb128> it feels like that has been a reaction to the xchat-gnome removal bug
<seb128> but it's a bit ridiculous to kick out a gtk3 client as "unmaintained" and putting forward a gtk2 one as an alternative solution
<jbicha> Steve said he'd reaccept xchat-gnome if someone wants to upload it and maintain it https://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2018/03/23/%23ubuntu-devel.html#t03:50
<seb128> jbicha, was it a trolling bug or do you have a real motivation to try to clear than one out, out of the stack of old unmaintained craps in universe
<mdeslaur> I filed the hexchat bug in an attempt to get someone to finally take on moving it to gtk3
<jbicha> well you heard about the xchat removal bug controversy, right? xchat-gnome is pretty similar (presumably in worse shape actually)
<seb128> I did read about this one
<seb128> anyway, I don't really care either way
<seb128> if somebody reupload xchat-gnome good
<seb128> otherwise I'm probably going to snap it and use that
<jbicha> I like the idea of Snaps for old stuff we don't want in the distro any more
<seb128> those removals are ridiculous, there are tons of packages more outdated and less useful than xchat-gnome in  universe
<seb128> why not going to try to get those out first...
<mdeslaur> well, I want xchat-gnome in the distro, which is why I've been maintaining it in the first place
<seb128> wfm
<seb128> and good that some people find hexchat good for them
<seb128> it doesn't work for me, I find the UI not easy to "read" and none of the available colors/settings make it look clean/easy to me
<seb128> while xchat-gnome is
<jbicha> I am working on removing packages from Debian (libgnome depends these days). It just takes a long time with Debian processes and "maintainers"
<mdeslaur> removing packages that still build and work is a disservice to users
<seb128> especially when they work, have users and are not depending on outdated techs we want to get out
<seb128> anyway
<seb128> don't hate on softwares just because you don't use them :)
<seb128> on that note, enough said on the topic for me
<jbicha> mdeslaur: packages that have been removed from Debian should have an Ubuntu maintainer to stay in Ubuntu
 * mgedmin tried very hard to migrate from the nice xchat-gnome to the promising polari, but in the end switched to irssi because of all the polari problems
<juliank> polari looks nice
<juliank> mgedmin: I could only setup connection to bouncer with mc-tool because both polari and empathy lacked options...
<juliank> I'm thinking about writing a GTK+3 HIG WeeChat relay client
<Laney> jbicha: any reason not to merge xdg-user-dirs?
<jbicha> Laney: I don't understand what we're doing with translations and maybe that should be pushed upstream
<jbicha> but if you want to merge, go for it
<Laney> Trevinh_o's got his fix up for sponsoring and that would be one way to get it
<Laney> thx
<Laney> seb128: do you just download https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/bionic/+source/xdg-user-dirs/+pots/xdg-user-dirs/+export and use `quilt shell' or something to copy it over?
<seb128> Laney, yeah, I download, rename the files from somethiong_LO.po to LO.po, copy over and diff -Nru old new basically
<seb128> and update LINGUAS to list the new/added locales
<seb128> jbicha, we just import the translations from launchpad
 * Laney makes tea while waiting for the tarball to arrive
<jbicha> if we upstream the translations, maybe we could just turn off translations in LP for the package and point translators to https://translationproject.org/domain/xdg-user-dirs.html
<seb128> you can argue that for any translations made on launchpad for any source
<seb128> we could yes
<seb128> but then we loose an ease-to-contribute/easier-integration point from Ubuntu
<jbicha> but most packages don't require this manual handling which slows down updates
<jbicha> maybe we could do it for Chaotic Camel
<seb128> I've no strong opinion
<seb128> upstreaming the changes is not easy since we don't speak all the languages to argue of the value/difference
<seb128> not easy to decide who between upstream and launchpad translators has the best variant and why
<seb128> but we could just decide next cycle to close those and tell translators to report bugs upstream for their improvement
<seb128> maybe send upstream new locales translations
<seb128> since we have a few of those
<Laney> seb128: does https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/jdrrkV8ysk/ look like I did it right?
<jibel> Trevinho, this fix for grey item on dark grey background introduced a regression, now I've comboboxes with light grey on light grey
<jibel> Trevinho, https://imgur.com/a/uwlL1
<jibel> biab
<Trevinho> jibel: weird but thanks... I'll add to the list
<kenvandine> Trevinho, would you mind taking a look at https://github.com/ubuntu/snapcraft-desktop-helpers/pull/103
<Trevinho> ok
<kenvandine> Trevinho, thx
<Trevinho> oh, that is now available? :-)
<kenvandine> Trevinho, yes!
<Trevinho> kenvandine: so couple of things...
<Trevinho> We should probably add support for moving the data we added in $SNAP_HOME to these locations now, no? Otherwise users might lose track of stuff from within the snap
<Trevinho> also.... [ -f ]  is it working now? Since in the past it wasn't enough to check if we had access
<Trevinho> as it was gettting false postives
<Trevinho> there's a bug somewhere about test not working properly
<Trevinho> I had to use a different check (which was... I need to look :D)
<kenvandine> i'd be interested in better ways to check :)
<Trevinho> kenvandine: in snap shell if you do `test -f /home/$USER/.config/monitors.xml && cat /home/$USER/.config/monitors.xml` it will fail for example
<Trevinho> on cat...
<Trevinho> so let me look I think I had a branch
<kenvandine> ok
<Trevinho> bug is https://bugs.launchpad.net/snappy/+bug/1748510
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1748510 in Snappy "shell's test gives false positive on readability of files" [Undecided,New]
<Trevinho> but I didn't post the workaround there mhmhmh
<Trevinho> kenvandine: I used this
<Trevinho> if (! head -c0 "$XCOMPOSEFILE" &> /dev/null); then ......
<Trevinho> that wont' actually read anything but will do an `open()`
<Trevinho> kenvandine: also... with such change what will happen is that the XDG_DATA_DIRS will be set relative to $SNAP_HOME (referring to that to $HOME) when you're inside a snap, so it's not enough... Also an user might have set those vars to somewhere that is not readable by snap
<Trevinho> So...
<Trevinho> You should go through each of them and check if we've acecess
<Trevinho> if we have you've to create the dirs that are referred inside the $SNAP_HOME.... Ie. for each XDG_DIR*  that in that file we refer to as $HOME/foobar you've to create the relative $SNAP_HOME/foobar as symlink to the actual location.
<Trevinho> because for example qt inside a snap what will try to do  is reading that file, replace $HOME with what is defined as $HOME in that context...
<Trevinho> then for dirs that instead are defined as full paths, you need to check access
<Trevinho> if those tests fail, you just create the $SNAP_HOME/$XDG_DIR_* and use that
<Trevinho> another option
<Trevinho> is to read that file...
<Trevinho> and then regenerate a new one that points to the same dirs (if possible) but considering that the $HOME is not aymore the user $HOME
<Trevinho> this has to be redone everytime we start a snap, though... or check if the file has changed since the last time we regenerated it (better).
<Trevinho> as if user changes something this won't be reflected...
<Trevinho> So... yeah, finally I think this is the best option :)
<Trevinho> sorry thinking at loud voice, but at leasts you can follow (I hope) my mental process
<kenvandine> i think so
<Trevinho> kenvandine: I think I've added better comments in the review :)=
<kenvandine> Trevinho, thanks!
<Trevinho> I hope I didn't miss something
<Laney> ffs
<Laney> gnome-keyring is going crazy on my laptop
<Laney> ok I don't have the new patches
<jbicha> Laney: I had to reboot when gnome-keyring started hogging CPU, I haven't had it again in a few days :(
<Laney> jbicha: that was with the current version?
<jbicha> yes, did you apt upgrade gnome-keyring today?
<Laney> doing it now
<Laney> but if you had it, I'm guessing this particular bug is not fixed
<Laney> but maybe rebooting will be good to me ...
<Laney> I don't have the dbgsyms to get a backtrace and now it's upgraded
<Laney> still bad
<Trevinho> damn... I've a talk to do tomorrow and still slides to write xD
<Laney> works after deleting from seahorse and re-adding
<Laney> seb128: I'm just going to upload that xdg-user-dirs thing, sorry if it's buggy - we can fix next week
 * Laney makes Trevinho happy
<Laney> Trevinho: who's the talk to?
<willcooke> happy weekend all.  Good luck Trevinho .
<willcooke> London on Monday, won't be around in the morning
<Laney> stupid yak shaving meant I didn't get bluetooth debugging info
<Laney> I originally just restarted to get pulseaudio being more verbose :(
<Laney> anyway I'm off too to watch/not watch the boat race
<Laney> laters
<didrocks> enjoy/don't enjoy Laney :)
<Trevinho> Laney: https://merge-it.net/
<seb128> Laney, sorry you missed me by a few minutes, looks fine to me
<seb128> have a nice w.e desktopers
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-03-24
<acheronuk> jbicha: FYI, I think I have the KDE ubiquity changes working at equivalence to yours. just need to work out how to make sure the extra strings I added are picked up for translation etc
<jbicha> acheronuk: great! if you look at my merge proposalâ¦ you have to manually update debian/ubiquity.templates, then
<jbicha> in a separate commit, run debconf-updatepo
<acheronuk> yeah. I saw those and figured it could well be the same. since KDE doesn't tend to use things like that, I was going to read up on what they do 1st to make sure!
<jbicha> GNOME doesn't use things like that either!
<acheronuk> jbicha: oh. right. :D
<jbicha> too bad it's not using git yet as it would make rebasing and merging separate branches a bit easier
<jbicha> Matthew wants me to add periods to the ends of the radio button description lines
<acheronuk> I added them to the new strings I did.
#ubuntu-desktop 2018-03-25
<acheronuk> jbicha: currently sitting in ER room where reliv
<acheronuk> Relative taken ill, so may not get ubiquity stuff done for tommorow. Or at least not until late tommorow
<jbicha> ok, take care
<jbicha> let's try to get it done this week at least
<acheronuk> It will be.
#ubuntu-desktop 2019-03-18
<tjaalton> duflu: src:xorg exista, don't move bugs which belong there to xorg-server ;)
<tjaalton> *exists
<tjaalton> duflu: unless you mean the server should fall back to swrast instead of going belly up. I get that
<duflu> tjaalton, *most* bug reports are really xorg-server. But yeah if I made a mistake in one of them then please correct it
<tjaalton> right
<tjaalton> the xorg crash one is actually a bug in amdgpu-pro
<tjaalton> nothing we can do on the server side, the crash happens because libgbm doesn't match the drivers
<tjaalton> I woke up with 7 email ping-pong between dell/amd/us, dunno why this happens again
<duflu> I did see one bug that looked like it came from Dell today. But couldn't confirm it did
<RAOF> duflu: Is there anything I can do to debug the âgnome-shell really, *really* hates nvidiaâ bug? It seems that it *also* leaks like a sieve when running as a Wayland compositor on nvidia (but that's a bit harder to tell because it's honestly just pretty generally broken as a wayland compositor on nvidia).
<duflu> (bug 1820323 sounds like Dell)
<ubot5> bug 1820323 in xorg-server (Ubuntu) "xorg crash" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1820323
<duflu> RAOF: That seems to be a whole class of bugs neatly grouped under https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gdm3/+bugs?field.tag=nvidia
<duflu> Last I heard Laney was going to have a look because he can reproduce one of the most popular ones
<RAOF> Nah, I'm talking https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell/+bug/1815550
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1815550 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu) "RSS grows without limit, general slowness" [High,New]
<RAOF> I mean, it's true that there are also a whole host of other bugs, but they've been there longer; gnome-shell being nearly unusable due to memory leaks is new :)
<duflu> RAOF: If you can confirm the problem goes away if you stop using nvidia-XXX then please add a bug task for that driver package. Then someone can ask Nvidia to have a look
<duflu> Although a mutter developer reproducing the problem might be more helpful in the short term
 * RAOF will see if he can get gnome-shell to display on the intel card.
<duflu> RAOF: Just turn it off the in BIOS?
<tjaalton> duflu: "xorg crash" was one
<duflu> tjaalton, I think you need to mute your phone if emails are able to wake you up :)
<tjaalton> hehe
<tjaalton> not literally
<RAOF> New bug: Xorg does not start up on the Intel card in this laptop anymore. The Xorg.0.log suggests its trying to load nouveau for some reason?
<RAOF> Also, is getting three <enter> presses per physical keypress (accompanied by a ~500ms pause in rendering) in gnome-terminal under gnome-shell-weston a thing everyone else is seeing?
<RAOF> Sorry, gnome-shell-wayland.
<cpaelzer> jibel: we got the FFe on 1819207 and the change into Debian
<cpaelzer> jibel: the only other change in Debian we want as well (an evolved version of a fix I already had tested and followed the upstream resolution)
<cpaelzer> jibel: that means we now want to do a syncpackage - should I or do you want to?
<jibel> hi cpaelzer , can you do it please?
<didrocks> good morning
<jibel> Salut didrocks , bon long week-end?
<didrocks> salut jibel, bon pas trop: gastro pour tout le monde, mais long, oui :p
<didrocks> et toi ?
<cpaelzer> jibel: I have triggered the sync
<jibel> cpaelzer, thanks
<jibel> didrocks, ah, pas de chance pour la gastro :/
<jibel> didrocks, ici c'Ã©tait calme, dÃ©collage de papier peint principalement
<didrocks> pas trop difficile Ã  dÃ©coller ?
<jibel> non, c'est du vieux truc + la dÃ©colleuse et Ã§a vient tout seul
<duflu> Morning didrocks and jibel
<jibel> Hi duflu
<tjaalton> was the terminal color palette changed recently?
<duflu> I think it might have but I haven't done a fresh install for a couple of weeks
<tjaalton> another question is where those are from, g-t defaults to 'tango' but I only find the icon-theme with that name
<tjaalton> highlights on irssi are now unreadable ("red" on "blue")
<tjaalton> oh well, 'linux' palette works best
<tjaalton> ew, nope..
<duflu> tjaalton, if you're having trouble with vim colours try set t_Co=16
<tjaalton> tango is fine, terminator just doesn't have an option to use bright colors for bold text
<tjaalton> guess tilix is the way to go then
<didrocks> hey duflu
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<duflu> Morning oSoMoN
<jibel> didrocks, https://code.launchpad.net/~jibel/livecd-rootfs/+git/fix_divert_grub_for_multilayer/+merge/364660
<oSoMoN> hey duflu
<oSoMoN> salut jibel, didrocks
<jibel> Salut oSoMoN
<jibel> Ã§a va?
<cpaelzer> jibel: complete in Disco
<jibel> cpaelzer, super! thanks
<jibel> tseliot, do you think you'll have time to review https://github.com/tseliot/ubuntu-drivers-common/pull/30 ?
<gitbot> tseliot issue (Pull request) 30 in ubuntu-drivers-common "Free only drivers" [Open]
<jibel> now that open-vm-tools with modaliases is in disco
<didrocks> salut oSoMoN
<didrocks> jibel: merged, I'm adding the lang fixes and uploading a new version in disco shortly
<oSoMoN> jibel, trÃ¨s bien, et toi?
<jibel> oSoMoN, bien bien week end calme
<jibel> didrocks, okay, thanks
<willcooke> morning all
<andyrock> morning all!
<willcooke> hi andyrock
<didrocks> jibel: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/livecd-rootfs/2.570
<didrocks> hey willcooke, andyrock
<willcooke> hi didrocks
<oSoMoN> good morning willcooke, andyrock
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<didrocks> hey seb128
<seb128> hey willcooke andyrock
<seb128> lut didrocks oSoMoN jibel
<seb128> my calendar says it's hackfest week for Lane_y :)
<tjaalton> btw, hitting the win-button "breaks" the session, but suspend/resume "fixes" that in a way, doesn't even need to enter the password
<tjaalton> on current disco after upgrade yesterday
<seb128> what did you get as upgrades on a sunday?
<tjaalton> lots
<seb128> also can you define 'breaks'?
<Laney> moin from london!
<tjaalton> can't change windows
<seb128> like session close back to gdm?
<seb128> hey Laney! happy hacking week!
<tjaalton> no, the session is up but can't do anything with it
<didrocks> Laney: hey hey londoner :)
<seb128> tjaalton, did you land a new xorg/mesa version on your machine maybe?
<didrocks> Laney: what kind of hackfest are you in?
<tjaalton> why would that change anything
<tjaalton> the driver works
<tjaalton> xserver didn't change, mesa did but that I had running before
<seb128> well, I'm just trying to think what could be special on your machine...
<seb128> can you check your dpkg.log ?
<seb128> see what updates you got
<oSoMoN> good morning Laney
<tjaalton> I think the "old" session had updates from mar 3rd, then upgraded again on 13th, 15th and 17th. yesterday I rebooted the new kernel
<seb128> k
<seb128> is that wayland or xorg session?
<tjaalton> xorg
<seb128> can you open a bug with the journal log after triggering the issue?
<tjaalton> sure
<seb128> also maybe try to disable extensiosn if you have non-default-ubuntu ones
<seb128> I didn't do post-w.e bugs backlog yet
<tjaalton> desktop grid is the only one but it fails to load
<seb128> but I didn't see any mention of such problems until friday
<tjaalton> with 3.32
<seb128> k
<seb128> maybe the journal has some error/warning that gives us an hint then
<tjaalton> although the grid itself seems to work just that the popup shows only the horizontal layout when changing between workspaces
<seb128> disable that one still, half enable doesn't sound great
<tjaalton> oh I had a shell crash
<seb128> it's not impossible it screws up things
<seb128> ah
<tjaalton> well can't unselect it from tweaks, it shows it unselected and not working
<tjaalton> tbh it's disappointing that the grid maintainer hasn't touched the extension since fixing it for 3.30
<seb128> :/
<seb128> what is more disappointing is that things in GNOME are built in a way that keeps makin
<seb128> g those incompatible/needed to be updated
<seb128> but oh well, not a lot we can do about that :/
<tjaalton> yeah and this was a big one
<tjaalton> Shell.GenericContainer was dropped
<tjaalton> anyway
<tjaalton> I'll try to remove it and reproduce
<Laney> didrocks: https://wiki.gnome.org/Hackfests/ParentalAndMetered2019
<didrocks> Laney: oh, that one! Have fun :)
<Laney> thanks :>
<tjaalton> seb128: what kind of journal log is needed?
<tjaalton> seb128: oh well, it works after purging workspace-grid
<willcooke> xnox, remember Rim and Reboot... do you remember what the cause was (why we had to have them physically power off the machine, instead of hitting enter for e.g.) and if there is a LP bug for it?  Some people have raised a Github bug (?!) and I'd like to point them a LP if there is already a bug about it
<willcooke> even if that's "this is how it works now"
<seb128> tjaalton, good :)
<seb128> tjaalton, journalctl -b 0 to a file is usually enough but you can grep -i shell for example in that case
<seb128> but if it doesn't happen without the extension then it's probably due to it...
<tjaalton> right
<duflu> Oh, morning willcooke, seb128, andyrock, Laney, others?
<seb128> hey duflu!
<clobrano> good morning all o/
<didrocks> hey clobrano
<clobrano> hi didrocks, how's it going?
<didrocks> clobrano: I'm good after some difficult days, and yourself?
<clobrano> didrocks: oh, that's bad, good that you're recovering :)  I'm good as well, but the weekend was more tiring than work week :)
<clobrano> Talking with Michele about dashtodock, he found an issue with `transparent-mode` mapping https://github.com/micheleg/dash-to-dock/issues/912
<gitbot> micheleg issue 912 in dash-to-dock "Dynamic transparency UI settings broken in v66/3.32" [Bug, Regression, Open]
<duflu> BTW, I did figure out how to open a poll (https://discourse.ubuntu.com/t/center-windows-by-default/10262/5?u=vanvugt)
<jbicha> good morning
<jbicha> duflu: thanks :)
<duflu> Morning jbicha
<duflu> Hopefully someone remembers to design that flag into gnome-control-center too
<duflu> Along with right click methods :)
<jbicha> duflu: there isn't a good place in g-c-c for Centre New Windowsâ¦
<duflu> jbicha, I know, so it's a design issue before anything else
<duflu> I know I have failed to log a bug for it. But it's also too late to matter this cycle
<seb128> hey jbicha
<jbicha> seb128: could you review https://code.launchpad.net/~khurshid-alam/unity-greeter/vala-fix-0.43/+merge/363878 ? I'm not a member of https://launchpad.net/~unity-greeter-team
<seb128> jbicha, k
<seb128> jbicha, do you know what's the status of fixing libunity for new vala?
<jbicha> I don't know. I wasn't watching libunity. We should at least land https://code.launchpad.net/~ricotz/libunity/syntax-fixes/+merge/362923
<seb128> well, we have that in a silo but it fails to build as described in the comment
<seb128> the dee mapping error
<tseliot> jibel: yes, I think I can finish the review today
<seb128> tjaalton, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libx11/+bug/1820509 ... do you think that's worth a SRU?
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1820509 in libx11 (Ubuntu) "Avoid use-after-free in _XimProtoSetIMValues() " [Undecided,New]
<tjaalton> seb128: could be, but since the keyword 'security' is mentioned it might have to go through the security pocket
<seb128> tjaalton, it has no CVE so unsure it is of interest to security, might be worth checking with them
<seb128> let me ask on their channel
<tjaalton> thx
<willcooke> hi frederik-f, I forgot to say the other day, congratulations on becoming an Ubuntu Member!!
<willcooke> \m/
<frederik-f> Thanks willcooke ! :D And hi!
<frederik-f> I hope the other Yaru Guys will do the same soon =D
<clobrano> congratulation frederik-f :), my wiki page is ready, I just need to register in the agenda :)
<xnox> willcooke, the gist of it, was that we are showing plymouth rim&reboot message, but on the wrong tty.
<xnox> willcooke, maybe we should like try to "read" enter key on the text output too...
<willcooke> good luck clobrano
<willcooke> not that you need it
<willcooke> xnox, ooh, interesting, if we could, that might be a nice option.  Shall I open a LP bug?
<xnox> willcooke, sure.
<willcooke> xnox, against Plymouth?
<clobrano> willcooke: :D thanks, but I do need testimonials, so if anyone like to drop a note, I would be really grateful https://wiki.ubuntu.com/clobrano (shameless self promotion OFF)
<willcooke> sure thin
<willcooke> g
<jibel> sil2100, do you have the power to trigger a build of https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-cdimage/+livefs/ubuntu/disco/ubuntu-canary/ ?
<sil2100> jibel: is this driven by cdimage?
<sil2100> jibel: or is it a standalone livefs build?
 * sil2100 checks
<jibel> sil2100, what do you mean?
<sil2100> Ok, I see the subproject on cdimage
<jibel> sil2100, it's a daily build that is cron'd
<sil2100> jibel: kicking a new build now
<jibel> sil2100, thanks
<jibel> sil2100, FTR it's the desktop image used to land and mature experimental features
<jibel> like multilayer filesystem for example
<sil2100> jibel: should we perhaps add it to the isotracker? I guess you could then kick the images yourself?
<jibel> sil2100, or give me access to nusakan
<sil2100> Or that, yes ;)
<xnox> willcooke, casper
<jibel> didrocks, https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-cdimage/+livefs/ubuntu/disco/ubuntu-canary/+build/159516
<jibel> \o/
<didrocks> yeah, I'm looking at the artefacts as we speak :)
<sil2100> Oh, indeed, no build-failure e-mail \o/
<jibel> sil2100, do you know if the images are built and published somewhere?
<sil2100> jibel: looking at the logs, I think ubuntu-cdimage isn't configured to do that, it probably doesn't recognize what to publish
<sil2100> http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/cd-build-logs/ubuntu/disco/daily-live-20190318.2.log
 * kenvandine is updating the disco seed for the core18 based snaps ;)
<didrocks> seb128: do you mind creating under ~ubuntu-desktop a "canary-image" ppa (so that we can include it in our canary build)
<didrocks> that would be great to test packages we want to stage a little bit, so that they end up in the experimental canary image before we upload to distro
<didrocks> (I guess it should be a non virt ppa)
<seb128> didrocks, https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/+archive/ubuntu/canary-image
<didrocks> thx! you just created it or it was already there?
<seb128> didrocks, you need a launchpad admin for the nonvirt part I think
<didrocks> because I loaded the page and I saw it :p
<seb128> I did
<didrocks> ah, so quick :)
<didrocks> thanks ;)
<seb128> np
<didrocks> I'll ask a LP admin for non virt
<didrocks> (but not very important for now)
<didrocks> sil2100: when you have a second: https://code.launchpad.net/~didrocks/ubuntu-cdimage/add-canary-ppa-to-exp-image/+merge/364673 please! ;)
<tseliot> jibel: merged. Did you get a FFE?
<seb128> ricotz, hey, could you review https://code.launchpad.net/~khurshid-alam/unity-scope-home/vala-fix/+merge/364680? I don't understand vala enough to comment...
<jibel> tseliot, Excellent, thanks! FFe 1819207
<jibel> bug 1819207
<ubot5> bug 1819207 in ubuntu-drivers-common (Ubuntu Disco) "[FFe] Add Modaliases to open-vm-tools-desktop to allow automatic installation by ubuntu-drivers" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1819207
<jibel> tseliot, +1 for the FFe
<tseliot> jibel: great, I'm going to upload then
<tseliot> jibel: uploaded
<ricotz> seb128, done
<seb128> ricotz, thanks!
<seb128> clobrano, thx for merging those icons fixes. What's the process to land an update in disco now? we need a packager from the distro side to pull what is the vcs in a source upload? (do you need to make a release/tag first?)
<clobrano> seb128: usually landing in disco was made by Laney
<seb128> clobrano, k, he's at a hackfest this week, but maybe he has time for that
<clobrano> seb128: included the tag, since I don't have a gpg key for that
<seb128> Laney, do you think you can handle an yaru upload today or tomorrow to include the icons symlinks they added for 3.32 renames
<seb128> that's blocking syncing some of the app updates
<seb128> clobrano, thx
<Laney> not really, but it's easy
<Laney> clobrano makes the changelog, git tag <the version number>
<Laney> gbp buildpackage -S a package and upload it
<Laney> git tag -s <the version number>, that is
<clobrano> Laney: I remember that something needed to be signed
<seb128> didrocks, ^ do you think you could make an upload for yaru today or tomorrow?
<clobrano> seb128, Laney  but yes I can make the changelog
<seb128> kenvandine, bug #1799614 do you know what version of snapd-glib is needed? the SRU bug is not really clear about that
<ubot5> bug 1799614 in snapd-glib (Ubuntu Cosmic) "Use new media API" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1799614
<seb128> is 1.44 enough or does the 1.47 SRU needs to go with it?
<seb128> clobrano, thx!
<Laney> clobrano: the tag, yeah
<Laney> so you push that somewhere and then clobrano can put it in the repo
<clobrano> seb128, Laney, didrocks: changelog updated https://github.com/ubuntu/yaru/commit/065dd123ba35e8a4dd9de5d96f07dd9924feafe0
<clobrano> I really need to go now, if necessary I can save some time later, otherwise see you tomorrow o/
<didrocks> seb128: tomorrow, no pb
<didrocks> want to give it a testbet before
<didrocks> clobrano: ^
<didrocks> clobrano: you miss the UIFe though?
<clobrano> didrocks There should be one opened by jaggers, maybe is to be updated, I'll check again later
<didrocks> clobrano: please check and reference it in the changelog
<seb128> didrocks, thx
<Laney> ð
<kenvandine> seb128: i really don't know
<kenvandine> seb128: i can ask robert tonight
<willcooke> nighty night all
<oSoMoN> good night all
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, Wimpress, the new "embeddable card" feature on snapcraft.io is pretty cool.
<robert_ancell> Was looking at the gimp snap there.
<robert_ancell> Wimpress, has there been any interest on upstream maintaining that snap?
<Wimpress> Yep, we're switching our blogs over to use it :-)
<Wimpress> Yes, upstream Gimp are interested.
<kenvandine> yeah, it is
<Wimpress> Just need to motivated the various community members involved.
<kenvandine> robert_ancell: what happens with the SRU'd gnome-software with an older snapd-glib?
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, which SRU?
<kenvandine>  bug #1799614
<ubot5> bug 1799614 in snapd-glib (Ubuntu Cosmic) "Use new media API" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1799614
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, what version is "older". i.e. pre 1.45?
<seb128> 1.44
<kenvandine> yeah, 1.44
<robert_ancell> they will fail to compile
<seb128> which is what cosmic currently has
<seb128> no it didn't?
<robert_ancell> seb128, do you have a buildlog link handy?
<seb128> ah
<seb128> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-software/3.30.2-0ubuntu10 you disabled it
<seb128> the bug status is confusing
<robert_ancell> seb128, oh yes, that one I disabled so the ODRS change could leapfrog the media API change.
<robert_ancell> SRUs are fun.
<seb128> it's listed on the SRU report page as to verify
<seb128> someone needs to keep not to talk to the SRU team about validating the SRU once the ODRS change is validated then
<seb128> otherwise they are going to wait on the other one to turn green which is not going to happen
<robert_ancell> seb128, didn't slangesek fix that with his reupload? (https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-software/+bug/1799614/comments/8)
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1799614 in snapd-glib (Ubuntu Cosmic) "Use new media API" [High,In progress]
<seb128> robert_ancell, no, see http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/pending-sru.html
<seb128> it might consider all revisions since the previous archive one
<robert_ancell> seb128, ah
<robert_ancell> seb128, care to confirm the ODRS change?
<seb128> I don't have a cosmic install handy
<seb128> but I need to do one to validate the e-d-s/evo SRUs
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, do you have one?
<seb128> I can do gnome-software as well then, I try to do that tomorrow
<robert_ancell> ok, thanks.
<kenvandine> thanks!
<seb128> Laney, can you add https://code.launchpad.net/~khurshid-alam/libunity/glib-2.59.3/+merge/364679 to your review backlog for when you will have cycles for it?
<seb128> robert_ancell, btw do you plan to look at backporting those gnome-software UI changes from 3.32 (like the icon/menus) or do you need a bug/trello card in the backlog?
<robert_ancell> seb128, open a trello task if you want them.
<seb128> robert_ancell, k, thanks
<robert_ancell> (assign to me)
<seb128> robert_ancell, do you think you have the free cycles to do it?
<seb128> or does that need 'resource/priority arbitration'?
<seb128> I can talk to Ken I guess :p
<robert_ancell> seb128, it's not a priority for me, but they'll be fairly easy to put into an update if you've done the FFE for them.
<seb128> k
<robert_ancell> Trevinho, what tz are you in :)
<Trevinho> robert_ancell: hey... I'm in Porgual, so basically London one :)
<Trevinho> but, well it's always relative to me :)
<robert_ancell> Trevinho, indeed! I had a Shell question but I think I worked it out myself..
<Trevinho> robert_ancell: ah, ok... let me know if you want.
#ubuntu-desktop 2019-03-19
<RAOF> Gnome shell really seems to hate the <enter> key.
<RAOF> Well, *that* is extremely strange.
<sarnold> just matrix being matrix
<sarnold> unless gnome dislikes enter *so much* that it disconnected a few hundred people when you hit it :)
<RAOF> sarnold: No; GNOME Shell spends ~4s being unresponsive at 100% CPU and leaks ~50MB RSS each time I hit <enter> in a terminal window running zsh.
<RAOF> But not in a terminal window running bash.
<sarnold> RAOF: oh *wow*
<sarnold> iirc one of those terminal emulators does something kinda gross to find the cwd to show
<RAOF> Happens in both gnome-terminal and qterminal.
<RAOF> Also, it does not appear to be the display of CWD, as the hang happens before the app is run.
<RAOF> (So, for example, `PROMPT> bash` <enter> hangs for 4s and then displays the bash prompt)
<RAOF> In both qterminal and gnome-terminal
<RAOF> Yeah, today in weird behaviours!
<JanC> GNOME shell tends to be crazy at times
<JanC> I've never seen it happen in a terminal though
<JanC> but when using F2/Run dialog, I've seen GNOME shell take several minutes to launch the command I typed...
<JanC> Alt+F2
<JanC> (and by that I mean over 5 minutes at least)
<RAOF> This is one of those times.
<RAOF> That's impressive.
 * kenvandine published the seeded snaps with core18 and gnome-3-28-1804
<kenvandine> flood gates opened :)
<duflu> Thank you Gitlab for the notification "You mentioned yourself..."
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<jibel> Good morning
<oSoMoN> salut jibel
<didrocks> good morning
<clobrano> morning all o/
<oSoMoN> salut didrocks
<oSoMoN> good morning clobrano
<didrocks> salut oSoMoN, hey clobrano!
<didrocks> clobrano: keep me posted once you have the UIFe ack and added to the changelog
<clobrano> didrocks: hey :)
<clobrano> Is there a specific format for UIFe line in the changelog?
<clobrano> Currently we have two opened
<clobrano> didrocks: this https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/yaru-theme/+bug/1820767
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1820767 in yaru-theme (Ubuntu) "UIFe for late GNOME 3.32 icon name changes" [Undecided,New]
<clobrano> didrocks: and this https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/yaru-theme/+bug/1820135
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1820135 in yaru-theme (Ubuntu) "UI freeze exception to address three icon bugs" [High,New]
<duflu> Morning oSoMoN, jibel, didrocks, clobrano
<oSoMoN> good afternoon duflu
<didrocks> clobrano:you just add to one one (LP: #1820767, #1820135)
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1820135 in yaru-theme (Ubuntu) "UI freeze exception to address three icon bugs" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1820135
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1820767 in yaru-theme (Ubuntu) "UIFe for late GNOME 3.32 icon name changes" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1820767
<didrocks> clobrano: the second one isn't an UIFe
<didrocks> clobrano:the icon one
<didrocks> clobrano: but still good to reference
<didrocks> I just retitle it
<didrocks> clobrano: so either, you have one (LP: #â¦) per line, or you have multiple combines ^
<didrocks> combined*
<clobrano> didrocks: ok, I'll do it asap
<didrocks> clobrano: I'm testing the release meanwhile :)
<didrocks> sil2100: hey! when you have a sec, gentle reminder for https://code.launchpad.net/~didrocks/ubuntu-cdimage/add-canary-ppa-to-exp-image/+merge/364673 :)
<clobrano> didrocks: thanks! Here's the PR for the changelog (just to double check that it's correct) https://github.com/ubuntu/yaru/pull/1279
<gitbot> ubuntu issue (Pull request) 1279 in yaru "Update changelog with reference to LP bugs/UIFe" [Open]
<clobrano> or that it isn't :D
<didrocks> clobrano: just add them to corresponding lines in the changelog
<clobrano> ok
<didrocks> like, I would put them on:   * New symlinks for gnome-control-center and   * Support Gnome 3.32 apps icon name changes
<didrocks> (first one  ^       then second one ^)
<didrocks> you don't need to copy the but title, just 'LP: #'
<sil2100> didrocks: ACK o/
<didrocks> thanks sil2100!
<clobrano> didrocks: I see. The first one groups more than one commit though
<didrocks> clobrano: yeah, not a biggie, just put it the first time it appears
<clobrano> alright :), sorry for the silly questions
<clobrano> :=
<clobrano> :D
<didrocks> not a silly question at all! :)
<clobrano> updated!
<didrocks> and merged, thanks clobrano!
<clobrano> yay o/
<didrocks> so, just dogfooding a little bit and waiting for the UIFe to be ACKed
<duflu> Verification looks to be done for all bugs in https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mutter/3.28.3+git20190124-0ubuntu18.04.1 ... is there something else holding it back?
<duflu> Same goes for the bionic proposed gnome-shell
<duflu> Morning willcooke
<willcooke> ahoy duflu, how goes?
<duflu> willcooke, catching up nicely. After a rough Monday I am now actually looking at real code :)
<duflu> You willcooke?
<willcooke> I'm doing alright!
<willcooke> Need to get some docs finished today and get them off my back so I can do something more interesting
<didrocks> hey willcooke
<willcooke> morning didrocks
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<willcooke> yo seb128
<duflu> didrocks, I just noticed it's a slight border around the Ubuntu Dock that's a different colour. Not the whole dock
<duflu> Morning seb128
<seb128> hey willcooke, how are you?
<seb128> lut didrocks oSoMoN
<seb128> hey clobrano
<seb128> clobrano, didrocks, what do we need an UIFe for? did the icon change or do we only add symlinks so those apps keep using the same icon than they do today?
<oSoMoN> salut seb128
<oSoMoN> good morning willcooke
<didrocks> seb128:I wouldn't have requested one personnaly, but now that you emailed the documentation team with "In any case would be nice to have the documentation team +1 there", I guess it would be better to wait for them, no?
<seb128> didrocks, ah, I though you were asking for another one
<didrocks> seb128: nope, I was referencing the bugs we were discussing about
<seb128> I'm not sure there is an active documentation team to ack it
<seb128> and it's border line bugfix
<seb128> I sent the email because the yaru team had open a "FFe"
<didrocks> well, I guess now that you requested them, let's wait for a few days
<didrocks> would be rude to upload right away IMHO
<seb128> hum, k, let me see if I can pressure people
<seb128> or I might just ninja hack the symlinks in our current version
<seb128> I want to unblock the apps update, we need those tested
<didrocks> but agreed, borderlined bugfix to me
<didrocks> if you can get someone from the doc to +1, would be great
<seb128> yeah
<seb128> kenvandine, jbicha, gnome-font-viewer snap build failed with "po/meson.build:1:5: ERROR: Can not do gettext because xgettext is not installed."
<seb128> kenvandine, jbicha, gnome-contacts with 'meson.build:51:0: ERROR: Invalid version of dependency, need 'gtk+-3.0' ['>= 3.23.1'] found '3.22.30'.'
<seb128> kenvandine, jbicha, gnome-chess with 'sed: can't read data/gnome-chess.desktop.in: No such file or directory'
<clobrano> hey seb128 :), I think we just misunderstood and thought a UIFe was necessary :/
<clobrano> morning willcooke, oSoMoN  o/
<seb128> clobrano, no worry
<seb128> jbicha, do you think you can represent the documentation team in approving bug #1820135
<ubot5> bug 1820135 in yaru-theme (Ubuntu) "UI freeze exception to address three icon bugs" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1820135
<seb128> in retrospect it was probably an error to handle is as a UIFe it's more of a bugfix
<seb128> but now that we asked it would be best to have a +1...
<willcooke> hi oSoMoN clobrano
<didrocks> seb128: clobrano: jbicha: we got +1 from sil2100
<seb128> ah, good
<Laney> moin
<duflu> Hi Laney
<didrocks> hey Laney
<seb128> hey Laney, how are you? how is the hackfest?
<Laney> hey duflu didrocks seb128
<Laney> yeah going OK, wondering how to block applications
<Laney> APPARMOR!
<seb128> haha
<didrocks> heh
<Laney> that's a hard problem tho
<seb128> :-/
<andyrock> seb128: thx for the lipepatch indicator review/upload \o/ :D
<seb128> Laney, thx for the dee review
<seb128> andyrock, yw!
<seb128> on that note, early lunch, bbiab
<andyrock> and good morning all!
<seb128> good morning andyrock :)
<willcooke> hi andyrock
<duflu> Morning andyrock
<jbicha> seb128: kenvandine: I already fixed those snap builds. I, um, use LP to do test builds
<jbicha> Laney: could you bump our gvfs/s390x autopkgtest hint? thanks
<k_alam> jbicha: Hi, do you know any way to revert this...or setting it in test env...perhaps from debian/rules or somewhere ?  https://git.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/ubuntu/+source/gtk+3.0/commit/?id=d50a2dedaad927658a9cc002fc84f05f539ac43a
<jbicha> hmm, I hope our docs maintainer is still around. Regardless we'll need to do the docs updates this week.
<jbicha> k_alam: it's a fallback, it shouldn't matter to you. I have to go now thoughâ¦
<k_alam> indicator-sound is failing to build....also see https://code.launchpad.net/~unity-team/unity/+git/unity/+merge/361372
<k_alam> In unity it works adding yaru as build-dep, but not for indicator-sound
<k_alam> ok...will talk later
<Laney> jbicha: yeah, done that
<andyrock> seb128: The fix for https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nautilus/+bug/1819757 has been merged upstream. Do you want me to prepare a MR with a distro patch or should we just wait for the nautilus 3.32.1 ?
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1819757 in nautilus (Ubuntu) "nautilus crashed with SIGSEGV in NAUTILUS_VIEW_GET_IFACE()" [High,In progress]
<seb128> andyrock, I was planning to update to 3.32.0 and cherry pick that one, if you want to do it I can review/sponsor though?
<Laney> Some guy just talked about doing that update in #debian-gnome
<seb128> saw that now
<seb128> shrug
<seb128> andyrock, maybe let's do it for Ubuntu only, let that guy play on the Debian side...
<seb128> we can merge later
<andyrock> seb128, Laney: maybe we can ask them to add that commit as distro-patch?
<seb128> I don't want to block us getting the fix on some random new contributors to figure his way around
<seb128> I can do the update in disco, don't worry
<andyrock> kk
<seb128> jbicha, shrug, gnome-characters new version includes
<seb128> +- Remove app menu following GNOME 3.32 guidelines
<seb128> that's an UIFe
<seb128> please try to respect the process and only sync bugfix updates
<willcooke> Could someone help Till with getting this moving?  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gtk+3.0/+bug/1763520
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1763520 in gtk+3.0 (Ubuntu Cosmic) "after upgrade to bionic, printing fails without explanation / logs / debuggability" [High,In progress]
<willcooke> There are debdiffs attached
<seb128> willcooke, I've it on my backlog, but it didn't seem to be that important so I was waiting for upstream to do the review work
<willcooke> thanks seb128
<willcooke> just doing the rls bugs stuff, so I figured I would raise it now
<kenvandine> jamesh: are you still around?
<cpaelzer> willcooke: seb128: Laney: didrocks: jibel: (and all I missed) I just worked with disco desktop the first time yesterday, for whatever reason it just feels faster and better - no particular change that I could identify, so I just wanted to say thanks in general
<cpaelzer> I was a "lets install KDE instead" guy in <=16.04 and use default since >=18.04 but it just made me happy using it on that new system yesterday
<seb128> cpaelzer, great, thx for the feedback, it's always nice to see happy users :)
<cpaelzer> no need for KDe anymore (for me)
<seb128> \o/
<didrocks> cpaelzer: this is always great to hear, thanks! :)
<willcooke> cpaelzer, thanks for the feedback!
<willcooke> #startmeeting Desktop Team Meeting - 2018-04-19
<meetingology> Meeting started Tue Mar 19 14:30:28 2019 UTC.  The chair is willcooke. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/RHiGQXZJ/ubuntu-desktop-1904-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Meeting - 2018-04-19 | Current topic:
<willcooke> err
<willcooke> #endmeeting
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/RHiGQXZJ/ubuntu-desktop-1904-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently
<meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Mar 19 14:30:33 2019 UTC.
<meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2019/ubuntu-desktop.2019-03-19-14.30.moin.txt
<willcooke> #startmeeting Desktop Team Meeting - 2018-03-19
<meetingology> Meeting started Tue Mar 19 14:30:37 2019 UTC.  The chair is willcooke. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/RHiGQXZJ/ubuntu-desktop-1904-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Meeting - 2018-03-19 | Current topic:
<willcooke> hi all
<andyrock> hi all
<oSoMoN> o/
<kenvandine> \o
<willcooke> Roll call: andyrock, dgadomski, didrocks, duflu (out), jbicha, jamesh (out), jibel, kenvandine, laney, oSoMoN, seb128, tkamppeter, trevinho, robert_ancell (out)
<didrocks> hey
<jibel> o/
<willcooke> Oki, let's review the new bugs....
<willcooke> Starting with B
<willcooke> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-bb-incoming-bug-tasks.html
<willcooke> 1 new one: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mutter/+bug/1740869
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1740869 in mutter (Ubuntu) "<something> is not responding window is constantly showing when debugging a program" [High,Confirmed]
<jibel> Thanks cpaelzer, it's always pleasing to receive good feedback :)
<Trevinho> wey
<willcooke> seb128, you nominated that one
<willcooke> Seems like a lot of people have it
<willcooke> so +1
<seb128> unsure it's easy to fix and really a rls bug
<seb128> but it's for sure annoying to devs
<willcooke> ah yeah, I'm too eager as always
<willcooke> it's probably not a release bug
<andyrock> +1 it's pretty bothering and sometimes it's not easy to understand what's going on
<seb128> well, I don't feel like we have a good way to keep those as importants and visible
<seb128> rls is too strong
<willcooke> yeah I agree, we don't but. We shouldn't use rls though
<seb128> but we don't have a secondary list of things to not drop
<willcooke> let's think about that later
<willcooke> I'll put it on the list for the mgr meeting
<seb128> convert to a trello card in the next cycle board?
<seb128> and rls-dd-notfixing meanwhile?
<willcooke> ah nice, that works
<willcooke> 1 sec
<willcooke> k, I will sort that out in a sec
<willcooke> moving on
<willcooke> Looking for unassigned B rls bugs: http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-bb-tracking-bug-tasks.html
<willcooke> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/modemmanager/+bug/1819615
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1819615 in modemmanager (Ubuntu Bionic) "For additional hardware support, modemmanager needs to be upgraded to 1.10 on Bionic" [High,In progress]
<willcooke> Should be Till IMO
<seb128> +1
<kenvandine> +1
<willcooke> He needs help from OEM, but he can own it
<kenvandine> he's been working on it
<kenvandine> should really be assigned
<willcooke> No new C incoming bugs
 * kenvandine assigns
<willcooke> kenvandine, I already did for the modemmanager bit
<kenvandine> actually, he's waiting for me to upload it :)
<willcooke> :)
<kenvandine> thanks
<willcooke> assign yourself :DD
<willcooke> No new C tracking unassigned bugs
<willcooke> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-dd-incoming-bug-tasks.html
<seb128> kenvandine, Till is not online but can you make sure the SRU includes the patch from https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libqmi/1.22.0-1.2 , it was a regression from 1.10 which made some modesm not work
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1 in Ubuntu Malaysia LoCo Team "Microsoft has a majority market share" [Critical,In progress]
<kenvandine> seb128: thanks
<seb128> np
<willcooke> For D incoming, we have that same "not repsonding" bug, which we've dealt with
<willcooke> and this:
<willcooke> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell/+bug/1817924
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1817924 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu) "apps launched from gnome shell do not get input focus" [High,Confirmed]
<seb128> +1 from me to nominate that one
<seb128> focus issues are annoying
<willcooke> seb128, did you recreate in the end?
<didrocks> +1 as well
<oSoMoN> +1
<jibel> +1
<willcooke> Who would like to look at that one?
<seb128> it happens but not in a consistant way
<seb128> Marco is busy with other shell work
<seb128> Maybe Daniel?
<willcooke> nod.  I will assign it, and can someone speak to him tomorrow about it.  We can reassign if needed
<willcooke> done
<seb128> I will do
<seb128> thx
<Trevinho> I can also look at it if there's not too hurry
<willcooke> Ok, on to look for unassigned dd tracking
<seb128> Trevinho, you have enough to do!
<willcooke> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/language-selector/+bug/1820758
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1820758 in language-selector (Ubuntu Disco) "Language Supportâs buttons are misaligned" [Low,Triaged]
<seb128> I take that one
<seb128> I'm currently testing the patch, but it makes sense to me
<willcooke> noice
<willcooke> thanks seb128
<willcooke> and thanks Adolfo for the patch
<willcooke> ok, that's the bugs done!
<willcooke> The proposed-migrations queue, we still didnt assign those trello cards, but it's on my list for the meeting tomorrow
<willcooke> http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/proposed-migration/update_excuses_by_team.html#desktop-packages
<willcooke> kenvandine, there's a n-m one there which Till should look at
<kenvandine> ok
<willcooke> The others, lets get those cards assigned tomorrow
<seb128> willcooke, kenvandine, that's https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/iptables/+bug/1820317 for n-m
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1820317 in iptables (Ubuntu) "The firewalld autopackage tests fail due to iptables" [High,New]
<seb128> which security team is looking at
<willcooke> ohh, cool. thanks seb128
<seb128> np
 * kenvandine ignores then
<seb128> I spent part of my friday fixing firewalld issues
<willcooke> A quick look at errors.u.c
<seb128> needed quite some tweaks and updated for linux 5
<willcooke> Plymouth is all messed up by the looks of things
<seb128> willcooke, we said we would stop doing e.u.c in the meeting
<seb128> I reviewed it before the meeting
<willcooke> great, thanks
<seb128> there was nothing worth rls tagging
<willcooke> perfect
<seb128> but to know that disco retracers were buggy
<seb128> bdmurray found the issue and is fixing it
<willcooke> \o/
<willcooke> ok, then let's move on
<willcooke> #topic AOB
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/RHiGQXZJ/ubuntu-desktop-1904-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently | Desktop Team Meeting - 2018-03-19 | Current topic: AOB
<seb128> but it means our current summary is not that useful
<jibel> o/
<willcooke> jibel, goÂ¬!
<jibel> could someone look at bug 1820840
<ubot5> bug 1820840 in livecd-rootfs (Ubuntu) "[Disco] Ubuntu Desktop fails to build - snap-tool download: failed to get details for 'core18' in 'stable/ubuntu-19.04' on 'amd64': No revision was found in the Store. " [Critical,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1820840
<seb128> kenvandine, ^
<kenvandine> me
<kenvandine> sigh... just need to open the track
<didrocks> yeah, should be trivial
<didrocks> if you have the rights to do so :)
<kenvandine> that's a good sign though!
<kenvandine> i'm sure i don't
<seb128> :)
<kenvandine> mvo: ^^
<kenvandine> can you please open stable/ubuntu-19.04 for core18 and close it?
<willcooke> we've got a meeting with him a bit, so we can ask then if needed
<willcooke> thanks for spotting it jibel
<willcooke> kenvandine - did you have a topic too?
<kenvandine> we published the core18 builds of the seeded snaps late last night :)
<kenvandine> nothing else though
<willcooke> Looks like I got the update at 0345 this morning :)
<willcooke> thanks kenvandine
<willcooke> anyone else?
<willcooke> 5..
<seb128> o/
<willcooke> seb128, go!
<seb128> just pointing out that Trevinho got his x11/hidpi/scaling work ready for testing in
<seb128> https://launchpad.net/~3v1n0/+archive/ubuntu/mutter-x11-fractional-scaling
<kenvandine> yay!
<willcooke> great work Trevinho!
<Trevinho> <3
<seb128> also if you test it, g-c-c might be confusing, sometime the monitors don't align correctly automatically
<didrocks> Trevinho: is there value to test even in non hdpi mode? Do you want feedbacks on this?
<seb128> which makes the apply button stay disabled
<Trevinho> I want to cleanup the code, open an usptream WIP MR, do some blogging too...
<willcooke> seb128, is that bug fixable before release?
<Trevinho> didrocks: yes, as for example scaling at 1.25 can be nice...
<seb128> Trevinho, yeah, let's discuss together of the timing for those
<seb128> willcooke, andyrock is having a look now
<willcooke> zm/
<Trevinho> also the PPA allows to scale way higher on normal-DPI monitors
<didrocks> Trevinho: ok, will try and keep you posted :)
<willcooke> \m/
<willcooke> you guys rule
<Trevinho> basically you have scaling at 2 always enabled no matter your resolution :P
<seb128> all the credits to Marco :)
<willcooke> @)
<willcooke> anyone got anything else?
<Trevinho> too kind, still there's stuff to do, but looks quite good from my POV
<andyrock> looks amazing <3
<willcooke> 5..
<willcooke> 4..
<willcooke> 3..
<willcooke> 2..1..end
<willcooke> #endmeeting
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/RHiGQXZJ/ubuntu-desktop-1904-cycle | Amaterasu watches over you benevolently
<meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Mar 19 14:56:59 2019 UTC.
<meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2019/ubuntu-desktop.2019-03-19-14.30.moin.txt
<seb128> thx :)
<willcooke> Thanks all!
<didrocks> thx!
<oSoMoN> thanks!
<andyrock> thx
<mvo> kenvandine: I have a look at this bug - a bit swamped in meetings right now
<seb128> mvo, no bug, just a track to open :)
<kenvandine> mvo: really just need core18 to be released to the stable/ubuntu-19.04 track then close it
<kenvandine> mvo: all arches
<seb128> didrocks, from jbicha's summary on the community hub, do you want to look at updating libosinfo? I think you poked at that component in the past and it's to unblock the new gnome-boxes which I think you care about/use :)
<didrocks> seb128:sure, I can have a look at the update
<seb128> didrocks, thx!
<didrocks> yw
<seb128> tjaalton, do you know anyone upstream you could nag about https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/xorg/xserver/issues/14 ?
<seb128> tjaalton, if not can we just include the patch from bug #1805200? we are going to hit that segfault with the scaling work Marco did (he is shipping the patched xorg in his testing ppa for now)
<ubot5> bug 1805200 in xorg-server (Ubuntu Disco) "Xorg crashes when it tries to resume a scale transformation after that Screen has been closed. Crashed in __strlen_avx2() from transform_filter_length() from ProcRRGetCrtcTransform()" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1805200
<jibel> cyphermox, xnox would one of you have time to review https://code.launchpad.net/~jibel/ubiquity/+git/ubiquity/+merge/364762 ?
<jibel> FFe is +1
<Trevinho> seb128, tjaalton: actually we can just ship https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/xorg/xserver/merge_requests/80.patch which is smaller
<Trevinho> however... I think new X has issues in handling scaling in other cases..
<seb128> Trevinho, thx
<seb128> :/
<Trevinho> like if I stop and restart gnome-shell that applies the scaling it's all black (it doesn't affect the case of restarting because of a crash)
<clobrano> didrocks: did you get into this error while testing latest Yaru? https://github.com/ubuntu/yaru/issues/1280
<gitbot> ubuntu issue 1280 in yaru "Build error when installing PNG (only when rebuild)" [Open]
<didrocks> clobrano: absolutely not, it built like a charm
<clobrano> didrocks: fiuuu
<didrocks> clobrano: but we dont' install on target
<didrocks> I guess the issue here is that you make install directly on the system
<Trevinho> but.. While I don't get this running it in a machine where i've 16.04 + disco schroot... and I run xorg from 16.04 and in there the gnome-stack from the schroot..
<clobrano> didrocks: yep, this should be a problem only for developers, but I wanted to be sure :)
<Trevinho> so there should be some other bug to look at, I'mm quite sure I wasn't facing it months ago when doing my first testing on this.
<didrocks> clobrano: yeah, not really when building the package :)
<mvo> seb128, kenvandine aha, ok
<mvo> kenvandine: is this track avaiable alreday? sorry, all meetings this afternoon so probably a bit slow/inconistent in replying
<kenvandine> not for core18 but it is for the rest of the seeded snaps
<kenvandine> the seed requires the snap have that track
<kenvandine> so it breaks iso builds
<tjaalton> seb128, Trevinho: ok, I'll merge that if it helps
<seb128> tjaalton, thx!
<clobrano> didrocks: I fixed the issue and made you reviewer, but only to have a look if this can affect the disco release, no hurry ofc
<clobrano> ^thanks
<didrocks> clobrano: let me have a quick look
<didrocks> clobrano: are all the others png/svg file changes expected?
<didrocks> or did you exchanged a svg for pngs?
<didrocks> (no, those are different iconsâ¦)
<clobrano> didrocks: the fullcolor png where missing and have been rendered, the symbolic icon (svg) is the one missing
<didrocks> clobrano: ok, as mixed in the same PR, this was confusing to me. I don't think this will break us, let me merged it :)
<didrocks> merge*
<clobrano> didrocks: great! thanks
<didrocks> yw!
<seb128> cyphermox, you could have included your change in that ubiquity upload!
<seb128> andyrock, https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-core-dev/software-properties/+git/software-properties ... one less bzr project to use :)
<andyrock> nice!
<cyphermox> seb128: sorry, what?
<willcooke> night all
<seb128> cyphermox, https://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2019/03/19/%23ubuntu-desktop.html#t15:06
<cyphermox> I had not seen that
<seb128> k, no worry
<seb128> I was unsure if you had seen it or not which is why I point it now :)
<cyphermox> when I prepared the upload the MP didn't exist
<seb128> yeah, I assumed so
<seb128> anyway, just a ping for the next upload
<seb128> :)
<seb128> we should really fix the fact that not everyone has commit access to the vcs though, technically anyone with the upload rights should be able to review/accept
<cyphermox> seb128: no objection from me to add ~ubuntu-core-dev
<xnox> seb128, jibel - please help! for the seeded snaps.... do we use "tracks" or "branches"?
<xnox> cause i want to publish stable subiquity snaps on per-series basis and i'm confused if i am supposed to use:
<xnox> $ snap publish subiquity 999 ubuntu-19.04/stable
<xnox> or
<xnox> $ snap publish subiquity 999 stable/ubuntu-19.04
<xnox> sorry snapcraft command, obviously.
<Trevinho> tjaalton: there's still an issue though in new Xorg where if you set the xrandr scaling, then you close the only client (i.e. the displays closes), then you open another client and  set the scaling again.... And bum!
<Trevinho> Black display
<Trevinho> this is for sure a regression because I'm testing this in a 18.04 and it doesn't happen
<tjaalton> Trevinho: ok, so perhaps it's best to not merge it then..
<tjaalton> Trevinho: which driver is this with?
<Trevinho> tjaalton: it's not just a driver thing, it happens in both intel and vmware here
<tjaalton> ok
<Trevinho> I can give you a repro script, give me a sec
<tjaalton> well, both use modesetting/glamor
<tjaalton> aiui
<Trevinho> tjaalton: yeah, I didn't try on things like vbox but I guess it happens the same
<tjaalton> disable kms and use fb/swrast :)
<Trevinho> tjaalton: ok I will try
<Trevinho> tjaalton: however doesn't seem related to scaling itself since...
<Trevinho> this per se works
<Trevinho> `out=$(xrandr --listmonitors -d :2| grep -o "  [A-Za-z0-1]\+$"); xterm -d :2 -e "sleep 0.1 && xrandr --output $out --scale 0.5x0.5 && sleep 2"; xterm -d :2 -e "sleep 0.1 && xrandr --output $out --scale 0.5x0.5 && sleep 5d"`
<Trevinho> well, not if you don't have that fix in... as it will crash with current xorg
<Trevinho> so the patch fixes this case at least
<tjaalton> ok, then maybe the tradeoff is worth it
<Trevinho> tjaalton: Ah!
<Trevinho> tjaalton: actually the problem is when scaling up...
<Trevinho> tjaalton: ok try this
<Trevinho> out=$(xrandr --listmonitors -d :2| grep -o "  [A-Za-z0-1]\+$"); xterm -d :2 -e "sleep 0.1 && xrandr --output $out --scale 2x2 && sleep 2"; xterm -d :2 -e "sleep 0.1; echo I will disappear soon, while running...; sleep 3 && xrandr --output $out --scale 2x2 && sleep 5d"
<Trevinho> well on a xorg running on :2 ofc
 * Trevinho opens the bug upstream... Although, as said might be something else... Since I'm quite sure it was running on cosmic
<tjaalton> cosmic had 1.20.x already
<tjaalton> so if it's a regression in .4 then it should be fairly easy to bisect
<Trevinho> tjaalton: yeah, it's just I need also to backport the crash fix... Could you have some time on this?
<tjaalton> maybe
<Trevinho> so like building cosmic with crash fix, and see if this happens there too
<tjaalton> how do you run the server on :2?
<Trevinho> tjaalton: actually I've a package with such patch which was for cosmic https://launchpad.net/~3v1n0/+archive/ubuntu/xorg-tests/+packages
<Trevinho> tjaalton: mhmh, I generally use another machine (virtual or not), and then I just `sudo Xorg :2 vt8`
<Trevinho> or smth similar
<tjaalton> ok
<tjaalton> oh right, I'm reproducing the crash?
<tjaalton> hmm can't be
<tjaalton> just running listmonitors crashes it
<tjaalton> but due to drmsetmaster fail
<tjaalton> anyway, later
<Trevinho> tjaalton: I've opened the upstream issue though https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/xorg/xserver/issues/668
<oSoMoN> kenvandine, I'm considering adding gstreamer1.0-gtk3 as a recommends of libreoffice-avmedia-backend-gstreamer to fix bug #1820062. libreoffice-avmedia-backend-gstreamer is in main, whereas gstreamer1.0-gtk3 is in universe, but its source package itself is in main (gst-plugins-good1.0). This would magically promote gstreamer1.0-gtk3 to main, right?
<ubot5> bug 1820062 in libreoffice (Ubuntu) "LibreOffice Impress embed video problem (libreoffice-gtk3)" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1820062
<tjaalton> Trevinho: oh cool
#ubuntu-desktop 2019-03-20
<Trevinho> duflu: hey, thanks for the reply... I've got it in real hardware and single monitor as in the video. andyrock too but IIRC only in a monitor...
<duflu> Trevinho, what distro and special things would I need to reproduce it?
<Trevinho> Anyways if you could try that ppa / git repo...
<Trevinho> duflu: just use the ppa I've linked you
<duflu> Ah. I just assumed that can't possibly be the problem
<Trevinho> duflu: well... I guess you can see it just using xrandr and scale things down.. So using something like scale 2x2
<duflu> Trevinho, yes that almost makes sense. I will look today
<Trevinho> Cool, thanks!
<duflu> Trevinho, actually I can probably guess...
<Trevinho> Having some sleep instead... :-)
<duflu> Trevinho, yes you sleep
<Trevinho> ehehe... Feel free to email me if you get something else in mind
<Trevinho> Night!
<duflu> Night-ish
<tjaalton> RAOF: hey, does your archive-admin powers include handling NEW?
<RAOF> tjaalton: yes!
<RAOF> You also happen to have caught me on Vanguard day.
<RAOF> What can I do you for?
<tjaalton> oh cool
<tjaalton> there's linux-signed-oem for bionic
<tjaalton> binaries in NEW
<tjaalton> also, I'm packaging stuff for intel's opencl/media stack, and intel-mediasdk is in disco NEW (also uploaded to debian but can't wait for them)
<RAOF> Hm. So, it occurs to me that accepting from binary NEW (as opposed to reviewing and accepting from source NEW) was not covered in the training I did :)
<tjaalton> ahh ok
<tjaalton> sil2100 just forgot that part yesterday
<RAOF> But I'll have a look at intel-mediasdk for you now.
<tjaalton> excellent, thank
<tjaalton> s
<RAOF> Hm. Or maybe tomorrow morning, sorry. It's EOD here.
<didrocks> good morning!
<tjaalton> RAOF: ok, no worries
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<didrocks> salut oSoMoN, Ã§a va ?
<oSoMoN> salut didrocks! trÃ¨s bien, et toi?
 * oSoMoN goes to school, bbiab
<didrocks> oSoMoN: Ã§a va :)
<duflu> Morning oSoMoN and didrocks
<duflu> Back in a bit
<jibel> Hi all
<duflu> Hi jibel
<oSoMoN> hi duflu, jibel
<willcooke> morning
<didrocks> hey willcooke, duflu
<duflu> Morning willcooke
<seb128> good morning desktopers
<oSoMoN> salut seb128, Ã§a va?
<oSoMoN> morning willcooke
<willcooke> yo yo yo
<willcooke> I thought Spring had arrived yesterday, but it's back to normal now
<willcooke> i.e. raining
<didrocks> hey seb128
<seb128> oSoMoN, bof, I think I'm next having the flu after the kid & gf
<didrocks> blue sky here, but cold
<didrocks> seb128: a never ending story :(
<oSoMoN> :/
<seb128> fever and shivering today :/
<seb128> didrocks, indeed :/
<oSoMoN> seb128, get some rest and take it easy, that's the most efficient remedy
<duflu> Morning seb128. Hopefully it stays good
<didrocks> yeah, sounds like the best strategy
<seb128> trying to
<seb128> but I'm on holidays next week and then it's almost end of the cycle
<seb128> I've things to finish this week :/
<Laney> hey
 * Laney pats seb128 
<seb128> hey Laney, how are you?
<Laney> you might actually get more good work done if you get back to health quicker though :(
<Laney> not bad thanks
<willcooke> seb128, duflu - ace hub posts re: fractional scaling, thanks!
<willcooke> seb128, go to bed
<duflu> willcooke, it doesn't feel good to point out problems. And I wish I hadn't put any contention into Seb's mind when he should be resting
<willcooke> it's good to have a discussion about it
<willcooke> and it's there for testing
<seb128> duflu, don't worry about me, I wish we had communicated better as a team about the work when it started, but it's done now
<seb128> but it's not the end of the world, let's focus on what we have now and make the best of it
<seb128> duflu, and you should go enjoy your evening :)
<duflu> It is odd that Ubuntu Chrome is so willing to cast to Chromecast etc, but Chromebooks are not
<duflu> (in guest mode at least)
<oSoMoN> seb128, I'm considering adding gstreamer1.0-gtk3 as a recommends of libreoffice-avmedia-backend-gstreamer to fix bug #1820062. libreoffice-avmedia-backend-gstreamer is in main, whereas gstreamer1.0-gtk3 is in universe, but its source package itself is in main (gst-plugins-good1.0). This would automatically promote gstreamer1.0-gtk3 to main, right? is that a reasonable approach?
<ubot5> bug 1820062 in libreoffice (Ubuntu) "LibreOffice Impress embed video problem (libreoffice-gtk3)" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1820062
<seb128> oSoMoN, yes, as soon as something starts trying to pull it in it's going to show on component mismatch
<seb128> then an archive admin just have to move the binary since that source is already approved
<seb128> oSoMoN, you probably need a FFe though if that enables a new functionality to work out of the box
<jbicha> didrocks: thanks for working on osinfo/gnome-boxes. feel free to let me know if you run into problems with it
<jbicha> good morning
<didrocks> jbicha: tests are failing, and I talked with upstream, we need both libosinfo and osinfo-db updates
<didrocks> updated*
<didrocks> hence the FFe, let's see if/when acked
<jbicha> do you know if it's safe to upgrade osinfo-db without upgrading libosinfo? (wondering for Debian and well, we sometimes do SRUs for osinfo-db)
<oSoMoN> seb128, in that case it's not a new feature, it just fixes the rendering of embedded videos in office docs
<didrocks> jbicha: this way, it would be safe, but osinfo-db contains automated preseed installation
<didrocks> which has not be tested withotu latest libosinfo
<seb128> oSoMoN, I'm never sure with those cases, you can argue that libreoffice is currently not rendering videos and that adding the recommends enable a feature that isn't there today (or said differently, playing of video hasn't been tested at all so we can't trust it's going to work without issue)
<seb128> oSoMoN, check with Laney/someone fomr ubuntu-release though
<jbicha> didrocks: ok. everytime I have asked the Debian maintainer to do a new osinfo-db release, he has done one very quickly so maybe he can take care of that part for you :)
<didrocks> jbicha: doesn't change that we need the FFe acked
<didrocks> updating isn't the pb
<jbicha> oh I guess there's already Debian bug 919492
<ubot5> Debian bug 919492 in osinfo-db "Please upgrade to last version" [Wishlist,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/919492
<jbicha> yes I understand
<oSoMoN> seb128, it could also be argued that video playback once worked in libreoffice, and it regressed at some point (not so recent)â¦ but I get your point, I'll ask around before doing anything
<seb128> oSoMoN, tg
<seb128> oSoMoN, the question is mainly, how confident are you that gstreamer1.0-gtk3 is solid and has no bug
<jbicha> kenvandine: could you follow up on https://code.launchpad.net/~buo-ren-lin/gnome-system-monitor/fix-snap/+merge/364768 ?
<oSoMoN> seb128, right, that's a good question, I don't know the code, but it's part of the "good" set of gstreamer plugins, so supposedly the quality is good enough
<seb128> oSoMoN, the FFe process is there to ensure we land new features/components early enough in the cycle to have time to get feedback and resolve potential issues
<seb128> or to make us think about how we test and the risk/benefit when we land late
<seb128> oSoMoN, anyway, you have mly opinion, I do agree it would be nice to have and I think it's should be a FFe but I'm not part of the release team so check with them :)
<willcooke> oSoMoN, can we test in the snap first?  Would that make much difference?
<oSoMoN> yeah, I should have fixed that much earlier in the cycle
<oSoMoN> willcooke, good point, let me see if the fix applies as-is to the snap
<willcooke> it might give us an easy way to get feedback
<seb128> no need of the snap
<seb128> I mean it's an apt install away
<willcooke> ohh
<willcooke> I see
<willcooke> right
<seb128> you can also ask on the community hub if you want feedback
<seb128> but I would just do the FFe, I think it's probably fine to have it accepted
<jbicha> kenvandine: my instinct is that it's intentional for gnome-system-monitor to be hidden on KDE Plasma, but I'll let you handle it
<tkamppeter> Anyone can help me on a release numbering problem? I want to use https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libqmi/1.22.0-1.2 as SRU for Bionic without any change in the source package, only build on Bionic. Which version/release number should I give to it?
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1 in Ubuntu Malaysia LoCo Team "Microsoft has a majority market share" [Critical,In progress]
<tkamppeter> The SRU bug is bug 1819615.
<ubot5> bug 1819615 in modemmanager (Ubuntu Bionic) "For additional hardware support, modemmanager needs to be upgraded to 1.10 on Bionic" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1819615
<kenvandine> jbicha: I'll need to think about that one.  I'm a little surprised upstream specifically hides it in KDE
<oSoMoN> willcooke, seb128: just adding that package to the snap fixes video playback indeed, that's a good data point
<willcooke> cool
<willcooke> morning kenvandine
<kenvandine> willcooke: good morning
<oSoMoN> good morning kenvandine
<oSoMoN> kenvandine, we talked about that a while ago but I hadn't gotten around to doing it until today: https://phabricator.services.mozilla.com/D24147
<seb128> isantop_, thx for commenting on that gnome-software bug, I didn't think about checking that they didn't have the current version :/
<kenvandine> oSoMoN: cool
<tkamppeter> Anyone could help me on my question above?
<tjaalton> tkamppeter: add ~ubuntu18.04.1
<tkamppeter> tjaalton, thanks.
<tkamppeter> kenvandine, seb128, willcooke, I have attached the new libqmi debdiff to bug 1819615. Now everything is ready for uploading the packages.
<ubot5> bug 1819615 in modemmanager (Ubuntu Bionic) "For additional hardware support, modemmanager needs to be upgraded to 1.10 on Bionic" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1819615
<willcooke> good stuf, thanks tkamppeter
<willcooke> tkamppeter, I just saw this:
<willcooke> https://discourse.ubuntu.com/t/the-road-to-disco-what-features-might-go-in-what-features-actually-hit-the-repos/9347/61?u=willcooke
<willcooke> Someone saying that wifi is suddenly broken in Disco.
<willcooke> I'll try and reproduce.
<willcooke> Could be nothing
<willcooke> oh
<willcooke> ignore
<willcooke> The thread has an edit which didnt show in my email
<willcooke> Nothing to do with n-m at all
<tkamppeter> OK, discovered the same as I clicked the link.
<tkamppeter> Seems that one gets notifications only on new posts, not on edits.
<tkamppeter> So then I know that I should not edit my weekly reports (this week I edited it three times, not knowing that this does not cause notifications).
<kenvandine> tkamppeter: thanks
<kenvandine> jibel: today's iso does have the snaps, no idea why it's so much smaller
<willcooke> interesting, thanks for checking kenvandine
<seb128> kenvandine, willcooke, https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/Qc7GZrvbMZ/
<seb128> we are missing all translations
<seb128> including libreoffice and firefox ones
 * seb128 looks at didrocks 
<seb128> :p
<willcooke> bah
<seb128> kenvandine, willcooke, that's a diff of the manifest between current and pending
<seb128> even french is missing, sabotage!
<willcooke> zut alors!
<seb128> the day where I'm sick, strange coincidence...
<didrocks> hum, interestingâ¦ the tasks doesn't work then
<didrocks> I'll handle it (but probably tomorrow, just checking quickly it's not screwed up)
<seb128> didrocks, it's only the image in pending so tomorrow is fine
<didrocks> no typo on first look: https://git.launchpad.net/livecd-rootfs/commit/?id=995f3cf9e0e09da3b9a2b192cb8b5de68c079906
<didrocks> wonder if there isn't another add_task call and that erases the first one
<didrocks> ohhh
<didrocks> no, I know
<didrocks> let me fix it
<seb128> :)
<didrocks> it's not add_task $LIVE_TASK ubuntu-desktop-minimal-default-languages ubuntu-desktop-default-languages
<seb128> didrocks coding ninja
<didrocks> it's add_task live ubuntu-desktop-minimal-default-languages ubuntu-desktop-default-languages
<didrocks> fsdiojfsdiojfsdiojfsdpofsdHorribleAPIDesign :p
<seb128> :-)
<didrocks> 2.573 uploaded, tomorrow's image will be with expected default languages :p
<oSoMoN> didrocks, au nom du peuple franÃ§ais, merci!
<didrocks> oSoMoN: lalala :)
<oSoMoN> good evening / rest of the day everyone
<tkamppeter> Can someone have a look at bug 1821052? Or do something that I get access to it?
<ubot5> Error: Launchpad bug 1821052 could not be found
<sarnold> hey tkamppeter, it's been marked private security; let me inspect the attachments to see if there's private data that needs to be scrubbed out
<sarnold> tkamppeter: should be public now
<tkamppeter> sarnold, thanks, I can access it now.
<tkamppeter> sarnold, should I not have access to private bugs of network-manager, modemmanager, ... by default, as I have access on private CUPS bugs?
<willcooke> gotta go, night all
<sarnold> tkamppeter: perhaps, I don't know much about that. I think asking in #launchpad for the privileges would be a good start
<kenvandine> tkamppeter: see me comments on libmbim and libqmi debdiffs
<tkamppeter> kenvandine, now I see what I have overlooked. Will upload new ones.
<kenvandine> tkamppeter: thanks
<tkamppeter> kenvandine, this would mean that in Disco some of the Ubuntu-specific things of Bionic got dropped?
<tkamppeter> kenvandine, fixed libqmi uploaded.
<tkamppeter> kenvandine, in libmbim the Ubuntu change is a patch which is not applicable any more in the current version. Should we keep the debdiff as current then? Or do I need to add the original changelog entry of the patch addition and in my current changelog entry the removal of the patch?
<kenvandine> make sure the changelog includes the version that's in bionic and you just include in your version that the patch has been removed
<tkamppeter> OK, I am doing so now, and change the version numbering to ~ubuntu18.04.1
<kenvandine> yeah
<kenvandine> tkamppeter: also make sure your modemmanager debdiff includes the version in bionic as well
<kenvandine> tkamppeter: basically i'm going to start with the source that's in bionic and apply your debdiff
<tkamppeter> kenvandine, modemmanager has the upstream versions of the two new libs in Build-Depends. Do you mean this?
<kenvandine> i meant in the debian/changelog
<kenvandine> tkamppeter: make sure it has 1.6.8-2ubuntu1
<tkamppeter> Will check and fix this, too.
<kenvandine> tkamppeter: thanks
<tkamppeter> kenvandine, 1.6.8-2ubuntu1 entry was already in the changelog, but I added a comment in my entry that the patch (the only Ubuntu special) got included upstream and I also change the version numbering to ~ubuntu18.04.1.
<tkamppeter> kenvandine, the libmbim debdiff I have already uploaded by the way.
<tkamppeter> kenvandine, modemmanager debdiff with new version number uploaded.
<Trevinho> Laney: when you've a sec can you publish https://bileto.ubuntu.com/#/ticket/3641
<Trevinho> or well kenvandine since you're here at this time, maybe you also can :) ^
<jbicha> kenvandine: the general idea is that KDE users would be using kde's system monitor app. On the other hand, I don't think GNOME Software respects OnlyShowIn when showing apps available to installâ¦
<jbicha> there's an argument either way, so that's why I'm happy to delegate and let someone else make the hard decisions ð
#ubuntu-desktop 2019-03-21
<didrocks> good morning
<jibel> Salut didrocks
<didrocks> salut jibel, Ã§a va ?
<jibel> didrocks, Ã§a va et toi?
<didrocks> Ã§a va
<jibel> super alors :)
<duflu> Morning didrocks and jibel
<duflu> and seb128 :)
<jibel> Hi duflu
<seb128> hey desktopers
<didrocks> hey duflu, seb128
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<didrocks> hey oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> salut didrocks, Ã§a va?
<didrocks> Ã§a va, et toi ?
<oSoMoN> bien
<duflu> Hi oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> hey duflu
<willcooke> hullo
<duflu> Hallo willcooke
<willcooke> how goes duflu?
<duflu> willcooke, as well as trying to understand xorg source code can :)
<duflu> You, willcooke?
<willcooke> ha
<willcooke> I'm ok.  Had a good meeting yesterday to talk about the developer desktop plans (per our team meeting last(?) week).  Mark seems happy with the direction
<duflu> Also am on my 3rd new desk chair in 12 months
<duflu> Hoping this one won't create new back problems like the others
<willcooke> urgh. Finding a good chair is hard.  I need a new one, but I refuse to pay 500quid for one, and Ikea don't have anything I like atm
<Laney> hey
<Laney> Trevinho: for sure
<Laney> I added that extra branch, was hoping k_alam or someone would green light it :>
<willcooke> morning Laney
<duflu> Morning Laney
<marcustomlinson> morning all
<willcooke> hi marcustomlinson
<marcustomlinson> willcooke: I recently grabbed one of these: https://www.chairoffice.co.uk/colossus-office-chair/c4bb7d7e-803b-40ad-876c-db3e3d3f489d/
<willcooke> oh, I forgot, yesterday was spring equinox. Woot!
<willcooke> marcustomlinson, I don't know if that would fit in my little office :)  Is it a good one?
<marcustomlinson> yeah really sturdy, comfy
<didrocks> hey willcooke, Laney, marcustomlinson!
<marcustomlinson> willcooke: of course if you're willing to pay double you could get https://secretlabchairs.co.uk/collections/titan-series
<marcustomlinson> alas I was not willing. haha
<willcooke> hah
<willcooke> Looks a bit too cool to me :)
<Laney> Goes with that headset you've got
<marcustomlinson> in general I found chairoffice to have good range and prices. Thorough details and ratings helps too
<Laney> hey willcooke duflu marcustomlinson
<Laney> didrocks too
<Laney> d<tab> fail
<marcustomlinson> Laney: \o
<oSoMoN> good morning willcooke, Laney, marcustomlinson
<marcustomlinson> hi didrocks! hi oSoMoN!
<didrocks> Laney: it should autocomplete both :)
<Laney> moin oSoMoN
<Laney> didrocks: ok fine, it was my fail :'(
<didrocks> Laney: don't be sooooooooooo sad!
<Laney> is it deliberate that firefox lost its titlebar?
<Laney> or did I turn it off accidentally?
<oSoMoN> Laney, https://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2019/01/firefox-66-csd-by-default
<Laney> NICE!
 * Laney fist bumps oSoMoN 
<oSoMoN> Laney, that said, I'm not seeing it on by default in my disco VM, I wonder what's up with that
<Laney> you changed the setting in the past and it's remembered that?
<Laney> I just got told to restart it after dist-upgrading and there it was
<oSoMoN> I have a "clean" VM that IÂ dist-upgrade daily, and the snapshot doesn't have a firefox profile, so it should use CSD by default
<Laney> :'(
<oSoMoN> oh well, at least it worked for you!
<Laney> oSoMoN: code reveals it only does that on wayland ...
<oSoMoN> ah, that makes sense
<oSoMoN> but the feature works on X11 too
<Laney> yeah, don't see why you'd do that
<Laney> that said I still can't get it to work
<Laney> ahh "XDG_SESSION_TYPE=wayland MOZ_GTK_TITLEBAR_DECORATION=system firefox"
<Laney> actually just the first one works
<Laney> /o\
<Trevinho> I liked the embedded bar, but it didn't work well with vivaldifox to me.... So I changed it as I couldn't really discern between focused and unfocused windows
<clobrano> oSoMoN: great that Mozilla fixed rounded corners :D
<kenvandine> tkamppeter: libmbim, libqmi and modemmanager sponsored
<tkamppeter> kenvandine, thank you very much. Now the SRU team and OEM team have to do the rest.
<willcooke> night all!
#ubuntu-desktop 2019-03-22
<willcooke> hi all
<willcooke> Happy Friday!
<marcustomlinson> morning willcooke
<duflu> Morning willcooke and marcustomlinson
<marcustomlinson> hey duflu
<jibel> Hi everyone
<Laney> hey hey
<duflu> Hi jibel and Laney
<seb128> good morning desktopers, happy friday!
<willcooke> hi seb128, how are you feeling?
<seb128> hey willcooke
<seb128> slightly better, I'm over the fever and feeling to tired to be out of bed
<seb128> it's like an annoying cold today, coughing, headache, still not great
 * marcustomlinson thinks seb128 really should not be out of bed
<seb128> yeah, i'm going to take it easy
<willcooke> rest up, dont spoil your holiday
<duflu> Morning seb128
<seb128> but I'm on holidays next week and there are stuff I want to handle or at least handover for next week
<clobrano> good morning all o/
<seb128> hey clobrano
<Laney> moin duflu seb128 willcooke marcustomlinson clobrano
<seb128> hey Laney
<Laney> duflu: did you see https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/mutter/merge_requests/502/ ?
<gitbot> GNOME issue (Merge request) 502 in mutter "Charts" [1. Feature, 5. Clutter, Opened]
<duflu> Laney, thanks. Reminds me this really should have landed a while ago: https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/mutter/merge_requests/154
<gitbot> GNOME issue (Merge request) 154 in mutter "clutter: More accurate & detailed CLUTTER_SHOW_FPS" [1. Feature, 5. Clutter, 5. Performance, Opened]
<duflu> which outputs the same info
<seb128> yet again a mp that has been sitting there waiting for reviews for cycles :/
<duflu> seb128, I have 13 of them in mutter
<seb128> yeah, I know
<seb128> and I bet you the new one L_aney pointed is going to be reviewing/landing before any of those
<duflu> That's likely. I have added another small reminder for them
<duflu> seb128, don't worry because I'm not. Plus it's almost the weekend here.
<duflu> And you should rest
<Laney> there was me thinking that he was sharing a nice thing
<Laney> turned instantly into negativity
<Laney> way to go
<seb128> ...
<duflu> Laney, it is a nice thing. Thanks. But also a reminder of one specific MR that is ready to land
<seb128> reality is that they sit on community mps and just ignore them for ages but do review/merge their things, it's not negativity to state it, no point pretending there is no issue either...
<seb128> anyway, enough on the topic, we clearly disagree on whether there is a problem there or not, that's fine
<Laney> not necessarily, just on whether it is a good thing to respond to someone sharing a nice thing they saw with a rant
<Laney> duflu: cool
<Laney> maybe grabbing feaneron directly would be helpful
<seb128> I was not replying to you
<seb128> but to Daniel's pending MP he pointed out
<Laney> k
<duflu> Laney, I don't think anyone is angry or ranting here. Delays are something we've become used to. I appreciate you pointing out that pretty MR. It is also directly related to an older one that is worth reminding upstream about, so I have now.
<Laney> OK. I think that seb128 knows that the us vs. them thing is upsetting and/or triggering for me, so I'm a bit sad to see it raised (especially when it's the resulf of me trying to share a cool thing), but fine - that's me being oversensitive.
<seb128> that's probably also me being tired, sorry about that
<seb128> but it's really getting me down how they keep ignoring could work waiting for review for ages
<seb128> and then redoing something similar or that could reuse what has been done/waiting
<Laney> :/
<Laney> you can continue the topic if you want, but if it's OK I'd rather not respond (for my own state of mind)
<seb128> yeah, sorry, I'm stopping there
<seb128> I should probably find a way to stop looking at that project because the way upstream is acting just doesn't work with me
<seb128> it's neither good for me nor for the interactions I've with the team over it
<duflu> Trevinho, OK. I now know how Xorg manages to tear even when the i915 kernel driver outlawed it years ago. It sometimes uses single buffering mode (shadow FB) and uses glamor to render the scale-down into that. Unfortunately vsync is not possible so it's the single-buffering part that would have to change
<duflu> Which is halfway to implementing TearFree
<tjaalton> duflu: mupuf is working on taht
<tjaalton> that
<duflu> tjaalton, cool. Is there code somewhere?
<duflu> I should clarify "vsync" is being used. But it's only synchronizing to the frequency and not the phase
<duflu> So your tearing appears on screen instead of during vblank where it would be invisible
<tjaalton> https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/xorg/xserver/merge_requests/24
<gitbot> xorg issue (Merge request) 24 in xserver "Modesetting: Per-CRTC framebuffers to provide 32k framebuffers to everyone (and enable Tear-free support)" [Opened]
<tjaalton> though I think this should be split and not try to get everything done in one merge
<tjaalton> looks like it's stalled
<duflu> tjaalton, thanks. Realistically I was never going to attempt solving TearFree. I may still try solving for the scaled case
<tjaalton> 10:18 < MrCooper> mupuf: FWIW, the initial TearFree support in amdgpu/radeon just disabled DRI page flipping while it was
<tjaalton>                   active, then I gradually made them work together over the course of ~2 years
<tjaalton> 10:19 < MrCooper> might be better not to aim for a perfect solution right away
<tjaalton> this was a ~week ago
<duflu> tjaalton, Thanks again. It appears I would have saved some time if they had linked the MR with the issue ID. I might remind them
<tjaalton> 19:36 < anholt> mupuf: what's the state of your modesetting rework?
<tjaalton> 20:30 < mupuf> anholt: tearfree needs work to support pageflips
<tjaalton> 20:30 < mupuf> the rest works as expected
<tjaalton> 20:31 < mupuf> every month I say: ok, will do it now! But then new bugs come in or bigger issues
<tjaalton> 20:31 < mupuf> I think I will have to take a vacation to be able to work on this :o
<tjaalton> mrcooper replied to that
<duflu> tjaalton, yeah sounds like too big a bite to attempt everything at once
<duflu> tjaalton, for scaling a simpler and faster solution would be the "scaling mode" KMS property. Unfortunately that seems to be half finished in i915, and missing on my desktop even in kernel 5.0.0
<duflu> Maarten was working on it best I can tell
<GunnarHj> Hi seb128! When I installed disco from a daily build ISO yesterday, the installer did not remove the language packs and locales for the ISO languages. Is that intentional?
<seb128> GunnarHj, hey, I think it's bug #1818890 but we didn't have an image moved to current/ since
<ubot5`> bug 1818890 in livecd-rootfs (Ubuntu Disco) "[disco] After installation, all the default languages are installed" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1818890
<seb128> GunnarHj, did you try a current/ or pending/ daily?
<GunnarHj> seb128: I tried "current".
<seb128> GunnarHj, k, so I guess it's likely that bug and the fix is pending things to land properly
<GunnarHj> seb128: Ok. It's indeed that bug you mentioned. Thanks!
<seb128> yw!
<Laney> we just break translation stuff every so often to give GunnarHj bugs to report :D
<GunnarHj> Thanks for keeping me busy, Laney. :)
<doko> how should I debug an issue, that I can login, but the desktop doesn't appear (the ubuntu screen with the five dots stays). Only shows up with the nvidia drivers, but I need those for CUDA
<GunnarHj> doko: That happened to me yesterday (without NVIDIA) after having done a fresh install of disco. Worked next time after hard reboot.
<xnox> doko, can you try $ apt remove --purge mesa-vulkan-drivers ?
<xnox> doko, i just managed to not login (keyboard & mouse lock up after gdm3) but after purging that it wored.
<xnox> doko, i also had to uninstall all the desktop snaps cause snapd claimed they were broken.
<xnox> Laney, ^
<kenvandine> seb128: i've uploaded a patch that should fix the xdg-desktop-portal autopkgtest failure in bionic
<k_alam> seb128: Hi, can you review this https://code.launchpad.net/~khurshid-alam/unity-control-center/info-panel-fix/+merge/364613
<doko> xnox, no, just updating to the nvidia drivers in -proposed was good enough
<xnox> doko, ok, cool!
<doko> Trevinho: any update on https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mutter/+bug/1793496 ?
<ubot5`> Ubuntu bug 1793496 in mutter (Ubuntu) "scaling changes when closing/re-opening the lid" [Medium,Triaged]
<Trevinho> doko: can you check if the ppa at https://discourse.ubuntu.com/t/x11-hidpi-scaling-available-for-testing-on-disco/10293 changes things for you?
<doko> Trevinho: yes, this seems to work, still keeping my scaling to 100%
<doko> is there a way to set the font size of the Top Bar?
<Trevinho> doko: good... I could probably separate the fix, as I have a branch that should fix your issue anyways... I can try to get a ppa with only that so you can test it again.
<doko> ta
<Trevinho> doko: hmgmm... not sure, you can increase all the sizes, but for that only I think you might need to tune the css
<doko> Trevinho: what would be the appropriate package for a bug report?
<Trevinho> doko: mutter
<seb128> kenvandine, good, I'm not SRU team member though so I can't help you accepting the fix
<seb128> k_alam, k
<doko> Trevinho: #1821365
<Trevinho> doko: sorry misunderstood... for the font is gnome-shell
<kenvandine> seb128: i know, just letting you know we've addressed the failure :)
<willcooke> 068066
<seb128> kenvandine, good :)
<kenvandine> willcooke: pin code? :)
<willcooke> otp :)
<willcooke> happy weekend!
<willcooke> night all
<Laney> ye byeee, see you in a week
#ubuntu-desktop 2020-03-16
<popey> robert_ancell_ where do the interface names come from in system settings -> apps? Some have full text descriptions, others like audio-playback and kvm do not.
<popey> (good morning)
<robert_ancell>  popey, they are in panels/applications/cc-snap-row.c in gnome-control-center. The descriptions were written by mpt and others in a spreadsheet. Interfaces that are new a likely to be missing descriptions.
<popey> where should a bug be filed?
<popey> because it looks a bit bad having no descriptions
<robert_ancell> snapd provides some description text, but it is not translatable and not necessarily appropriate to show in a graphical UI.
<robert_ancell> popey, against g-c-c and assign to me.
<popey> kk
<popey> will do in the morning, thanks
<robert_ancell> np
<xnox> kenvandine:  https://bugs.launchpad.net/snap-store/+bug/1867565 =)
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1867565 in snap-store "latest/stable/ubuntu-20.04 channel not open for snap-store on arm64" [Undecided,New]
<xnox> please =)
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<jibel> Morning every one
<oSoMoN> salut jibel, Ã§a va?
<pavlushka> duflu: ping
<duflu> pavlushka, pong
<duflu> Morning pavlushka, oSoMoN and jibel
<oSoMoN> hey duflu
<pavlushka> duflu: I was unable to reproduce those bugs (seems like was a one time issue), totem is launching ok :( (bad & good news)
<duflu> pavlushka, which bug(s)?
<pavlushka> duflu: 1865896 (totem) + 1866550, 1866551, 1866552
<jibel> bonjour oSoMoN, Ã§a va et toi?
<jibel> je me prÃ©pare pour faire l'Ã©cole Ã  la maison
<oSoMoN> jibel, Ã§a va, on est confinÃ©s mais avec un jardin dans une zone tranquille on nâest pas Ã  plaindre
<duflu> pavlushka, no problem, thanks. Those will all automatically close in 55 days unless there's any change to them
<jibel> oSoMoN, same here, with the difference of the usual rainy weather we cannot really enjoy the garden
<pavlushka> duflu: moin
 * pavlushka seems like he is learning and did something backwards
<duflu> Bugs are free. Make as many as you like
<duflu> Or report, not make
<didrocks> good morning
<duflu> Morning didrocks
<seb128> goood morning desktopers
<duflu> Hi seb128
<seb128> hey duflu, how are you? had a good w.e?
<oSoMoN> salut seb128
<seb128> lut oSoMoN, en forme ?
<duflu> seb128, tired and meh. I am half way through 14 days of self-imposed isolation
<oSoMoN> seb128, Ã§a va, tout le monde dort encore :) et toi?
<duflu> How are you seb128 ?
<seb128> duflu, oh, I hope you are doing well still?
<duflu> seb128, yeah I feel good, just tired
<seb128> duflu, a bit tired, I didn't sleep great this week, I managed to upset my stomach, probably too much food yesterday evening
<seb128> but good otherwise
<seb128> oSoMoN, pareil ici
<duflu> Good food at least, hopefully
<seb128> advantage of no school, no need to rush any kid to get ready :p
<didrocks> hey seb128, duflu & oSoMoN
<seb128> duflu, yeah, it was good, which is why I had too much :p
<seb128> lut didrocks, en forme ?
<didrocks> Ã§a va, oui, on a de la chance de pouvoir emmener encore Martin chez la nounou pour lâinstant :)
<oSoMoN> salut didrocks
<seb128> didrocks, veinards :-)
<didrocks> oui, on a de la chance sur le coup, mais elles peuvent Ãªtre rÃ©quisitionnÃ©es pour le personnel de santÃ©
<didrocks> donc on verra
<popey> Good morning desktoppers!
<oSoMoN> good morning popey
<didrocks> hey popey
<popey> Nice and sunny this morning in southern UK. Lovely time to be alive. Less traffic on the roads, shops full of new and interesting things to buy which aren't my usual stuff. Lovely. :)
<duflu> Morning popey
<Laney> moin
<duflu> Hi Laney
<oSoMoN> hey Laney
<seb128> hey Laney, how are you?
<Laney> hey duflu oSoMoN seb128
<Laney> yeah doing alright, had a nice weekend!
<Laney> hope you're ok too
<didrocks> hey Laney
<Wimpress> Morning desktopers o/
<duflu> Morning Wimpress
<oSoMoN> morning Wimpress
<seb128> hey Wimpress
<seb128> Trevinho, hey, how are you? had a good w.e? did you manage to get the shell stack ready on friday?
<didrocks> remember that we should upload the new Yaru in sync
<Wimpress> seb128: Yes, very well.
<Wimpress> Bought beer and wine stock this weekend ;-)
<Laney> moin didrocks Wimpress
<clobrano> good morning all 0/
<clobrano> just passed by to see if you're all ok with this crazy moment
<Laney> hey clobrano
<clobrano> Laney :]
<Laney> I'm probably on the fortunate end of the spectrum, relatively speaking, given that I worked from home already so no difficult changes for me so far
<Laney> how's it going for you?
<didrocks> hey clobrano, hoping all is well for you
<clobrano> hey didrocks, kind of. I am safe at home since about a week, but yesterday I lost a friend for this shit
<didrocks> clobrano: sorry to hear that
<clobrano> yeah, it sucks
<clobrano> everybody is discovering remote working now in Italy, which is a good thing anyway
<didrocks> indeed
<didrocks> Laney: do we need to do anything special for systemd user unit activation in postinst or so? I see some have symlinks in in .wants directory under /usr/lib/systemd/user/ but others, donât seem to have it (tried our timers for instance)
<Laney> It's supposed to work, I think dh_installsystemduser does that?
 * didrocks builds with DH_VERBOSE
<Laney> good idea
<Laney> Some of that changed in recent compat levels too, so make sure you're using 12 if you aren't already
<Laney> you probably are though :>
<didrocks> ah
<didrocks> itâs still on 11
<didrocks> ok, letâs change this
<Laney> oho
<Laney> could be relevant yet, because 12 has
<Laney>            -       dh_installsystemduser is now included in the dh standard sequence by default.
<didrocks> ack, confirming it wasnât running
<didrocks> on package build
<didrocks> let me bump that
<didrocks> ok dh_installsystemduser is now running
<didrocks> Created symlink /etc/systemd/user/timers.target.wants/zsys-user-savestate.timer â /usr/lib/systemd/user/zsys-user-savestate.timer.
<didrocks> Thanks Laney!
<Laney> w00t
<Wimpress> Hello clobrano o/
<Wimpress> clobrano didrocks Is a new Yaru release ready upstream for uploading to Focal?
<clobrano> hello Wimpress, we need to wait for latest gnome-shell because of some dependencies
<Laney> We'll do it as part of 3.36.0
 * clobrano looking for the discussion
<Laney> well, Trevinho will :>
<clobrano> https://github.com/ubuntu/yaru/pull/2058
<gitbot> ubuntu issue (Pull request) 2058 in yaru "prepare for release 20.04.3" [Closed]
<Trevinho> yeah we'll got all together, once I can understand this annoying dock infinite-loop
<Wimpress> OK, Understood. Thanks for the info everyone.
<didrocks> I have all the non Shell part tested and +1 for me
<Trevinho> .... and win :)
<oSoMoN> seb128, librsvg can be synced from debian experimental to focal, the ubuntu delta is now in debian (https://salsa.debian.org/gnome-team/librsvg/-/commit/1ca2d8e51a58e973bcc05ad22ec1599b28d5d2c6)
<Laney> oSoMoN: I will do that, thanks
<oSoMoN> cheers
<seb128> oSoMoN, Laney, thanks
<kenvandine> I took a swing at updating vte and gnome-terminal on friday
<kenvandine> ran into issues and gave up to finish other tasks before the EOW
<kenvandine> so those are back up for grabs
<oSoMoN> kenvandine, what sort of issues?
<kenvandine> lots of conflicts
<kenvandine> i worked through them for a bit but ran out of time
<kenvandine> the good news is we got gnome-3-34-1804{.-sdk} published to stable and the gnome-3-34 extension was merged into snapcraft :)
<oSoMoN> ricotz, are you looking at the xenial build failures in the firefox-next PPA, or want me to?
<ricotz> oSoMoN, it is on my list
<oSoMoN> ack, thanks
<seb128> oSoMoN, btw you pinged about librsvg earlier but you should be able to sync/upload those packages no?
<oSoMoN> seb128, maybeâ¦ I've never done a package sync myself, what does it take?
<seb128> oSoMoN, $ syncpackage <source> if you have ubuntu-dev-tools installed
<seb128> might need a -f if there is delta to override or -d experimental
<seb128> oSoMoN, feel free to try on tracker
<oSoMoN> seb128, thanks, I'll do that
<seb128> thx
<seb128> (it might not be published/available to sync yet but the tool will tell you if that's the case)
<Laney> I checked the upload permissions for librsvg before syncing it
<Laney> it is core-dev only
<oSoMoN> no regrets then :)
<seb128> kenvandine, did you need me to redo https://code.launchpad.net/~seb128/snap-store/+git/snap-store/+merge/380672 or can you just add the remote/pull the branch on the non-mirror location?
<seb128> kenvandine, also didn't you say you would add the upstream url to the description on https://launchpad.net/snap-store ?
<kenvandine> seb128: i thought you resubmitted that already?
<kenvandine> friday was a blur :)
<kenvandine> seb128: i guess you didn't submit it there.  I'll just merge it manually
<hellsworth> good morning desktopers
<kenvandine> good morning hellsworth
<hellsworth> hi ken!
<oSoMoN> hey hellsworth
<hellsworth> hi oSoMoN
<kenvandine> hellsworth: i'm up to my elbows in USN refreshes.  I'm using it as an opportunity to test the snapcraft release candidate :)
<hellsworth> oh that's great!
<kenvandine> once that's done, sergiusens will do a point release that includes gnome-3-34
<hellsworth> woo hoo!
<kenvandine> hellsworth: so if you have any snaps that could use a rebuild, test what's in candidate
<hellsworth> awesome. i do
<hellsworth> to test the extension, i am planning on going through this list - https://github.com/snapcore/snapcraft/pull/2794#issuecomment-581606327 - and doing local builds of gnome snaps with gnome-3-34
<gitbot> snapcore issue (Pull request) 2794 in snapcraft "Add gnome 3 34 extension" [Closed]
<hellsworth> it's also a new libreoffice release week
<hellsworth> so all the fun :)
<kenvandine> good times
<tkamppeter> bug 1863239 is blocking USB printing with HPLIP, should we make it an rls bug?
<ubot5> bug 1863239 in udev (Ubuntu) "/dev/bus/usb/*/* device file of HP multi-function printer assigned to "audio" group" [Critical,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1863239
<tkamppeter> Bug is probably caused by UDEV rules of some audio package.
<Laney> Did you try on a clean system?
<Laney> If it doesn't happen there, check the udev rules on your host
<oSoMoN> I'm calling it a day, good night all
<sa-ghosts> when can we expect gnome 3.36 to be in focal fossa?
<Laney> Parts are already there, but in the coming few days for the rest (e.g. Shell)
<sa-ghosts> mutter with the shell?
<sa-ghosts> or updated one part at a time
<Laney> They pretty much go together, yeah
<Laney> We're just resolving some incompatibilties with our default Shell extensions, before it can be pushed out
<sa-ghosts> good, because rn there is really no point in testing gnome and you can't report any issues (upstream) because it's out of date
<Laney> Yes thanks, we know what we have to do
<Laney> I did upload Shell 3.36 to Debian experimental today if that interests you
<sa-ghosts> no problem I will just wait for it to drop in ubuntu
<sa-ghosts> thank you for the hardwork
#ubuntu-desktop 2020-03-17
<duflu> robert_ancell_, is it true that plymouth ubuntu mods have no SCM?
<duflu> Just tars
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<duflu> Hi oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> hey duflu
<didrocks> good morning
<duflu> Hi didrocks
<didrocks> hey duflu
<seb128> goood morning desktopers!
<duflu> Hi seb128
<seb128> hey duflu, how are you?
<duflu> seb128, better rested... How are you/
<duflu> ?
<seb128> duflu, I was looking at the backlog, indeed no Vcs for the plymouth Ubuntu package
<duflu> Doesn't matter
<didrocks> salut seb128
<seb128> I'm better than yesterday, still a bit tired though
<seb128> lut didrocks, en forme ?
 * didrocks joins the "kids at home" crew
<didrocks> Ã§a va :)
<seb128> :-(
<seb128> good luck!
<didrocks> well, Julie has been kicked out from work (this week was the last week anyway), so, the challenge will be to find activities
<oSoMoN> salut seb128, didrocks
<didrocks> salut oSoMoN !
<oSoMoN> didrocks, teach your son programming in Go :)
<seb128> lut oSoMoN, comment Ã§a va ?
<oSoMoN> seb128, Ã§a va bien, et toi?
<didrocks> oSoMoN: his birth annoucement card was already in Go :)
<seb128> Ã§a va :)
<seb128> duflu, speaking of plymouth, upstream recently did https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/plymouth/plymouth/-/commit/50c619ed which I plan to land in focal since it cuts some second off botting
<seb128> duflu, Hans said he would welcome our feedback on the change
<seb128> duflu, you have good eyes for the impact of such changes so if you could test it and tell me if you believe it's a regression/change we should avoid that would be useful
<duflu> seb128, I was wondering how that worked. You either have to predict the future or delay the boot process to complete the fade-out
<duflu> seb128, I agree with the idea too. I'd already noticed the fade-out was taking a significant portion of the boot time on fast systems
<seb128> duflu, k, thanks for the input, I think I will include the commit in the next update
<Laney> goooood morning
<duflu> Morning Laney
<seb128> hey Laney, how are you today?
<Laney> hey duflu seb128
<Laney> feeling like a strict mode snap
<Laney> HAHAHAHHHHH
<seb128> :-)
<seb128> living the futur!
<Laney> (confined)
<Laney> (in case that joke wasn't obvious)
<Laney> (i thought it was funny anyway)
<Laney> how are you?
<seb128> it made me smile at least :)
<didrocks> roh
<didrocks> hey Laney
<seb128> good so far, a bit annoyed that spring finally showed up at the same time confinement started
<seb128> no tennis :(
<seb128> and having the kid around all day makes it challening to focus on work
<RikMills> speaking of plymouth, a user on kubuntuforums is getting this https://i.imgur.com/WwBIbNA.png
<RikMills> is that an issue known, or something likely specific to them
<seb128> rikMills; no known by me nor something that got recent reports, also not likely due to a recent change
<RikMills> seb128: yeah, the tennis is :( and the F1
<RikMills> seb128: that is what I figured, but wanted to check. thanks :)
<Laney> moin didrocks
<Laney> ok seriously
<Laney> what does update-manager do to defeat focus stealing prevention?
<didrocks> update-notifier set a very old timestamp IIRC
<didrocks> when launching update-manager
<didrocks> (/!\ I looked at that many years ago, my memory can be blurry)
<seb128> Laney, jamesh, weekly summary reminder
<Laney> oh yeah
<jamesh> thanks for the reminder
<seb128> np! :-)
<Laney> Trevinho: hahah I love that now a gjs patch is required
<Laney> classic Marco
<Laney> "ok, first we need to switch to BSD ..."
<Trevinho> Laney: ahahahah.... Well if you see the bug you understand why. I can't deference pinters in js :-(
<Trevinho> pointers
<Laney> /o\
<Laney> oSoMoN: sorry about this, but we just got https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/librsvg/+bug/1867766 ...
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1867766 in librsvg (Ubuntu) "Namespace prefix sodipodi on namedview is not defined" [Undecided,New]
<oSoMoN> Laney, just finished a call, I'll have a quick lunch (not going far ;)) and I'll look at that
<hellsworth> good morning desktopers
<hellsworth> hey oSoMoN would you mind launching some tests for me?
<hellsworth> https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/rrYhWqVvz9/
<didrocks> hey hellsworth
<hellsworth> hi didrocks !
<hellsworth> or kenvandine maybe you could launch the autopkgtests for me in the paste ^^ ?
<hellsworth> pretty please
<kenvandine> hellsworth: sure
<hellsworth> thanks :)
<kenvandine> hellsworth: done
<hellsworth> much appreciated
<oSoMoN> hey hellsworth, kenvandine
<oSoMoN> Ken beat me to it, IÂ was afk having lunch
<hellsworth> hi oSoMoN !
<hellsworth> oh no worries :)
<hellsworth> hope it was tasty
<oSoMoN> very tasty indeed, thanks :)
<seb128> Laney, oSoMoN, I was just poking at that before lunch, it made ubiquity autopkgtest fail (shame that librsvg wasn't in the rdepends list though)
<seb128> oSoMoN, I will let you debug if you don't mind, but let me know if you need help
<oSoMoN> seb128, ack
<Laney> seb128: probably because it's via an indirect dep through gtk I guess
<Laney> annoying
<seb128> right
<GunnarHj> Good afternoon Laney!
<GunnarHj> glib2.0 and eoan? (bug #1844853) I have verified bionic and xenial; awaiting your decision/action as regards the failing i386 test in eoan.
<ubot5> bug 1844853 in glib2.0 (Ubuntu Eoan) "IBus no longer works in Qt applications after upgrade" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1844853
<seb128> oh, meeting time!
<seb128> #startmeeting Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2020-03-17
<meetingology> Meeting started Tue Mar 17 14:31:08 2020 UTC.  The chair is seb128. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<meetingology> Available commands: action commands idea info link nick
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/mxaCZTVc | GNOME 3.36 work claiming / tracking: https://trello.com/b/z29JJK3q/gnome-336 | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2020-03-17 | Current topic:
<didrocks> hey
<Trevinho> o/
<seb128> Roll call:  didrocks, duflu (out), heather, jamesh (out), jibel, kenvandine, Laney, marcustomlinson (out), oSoMoN, tkamppeter, trevinho, robert_ancell (out)
<kenvandine> o/
<hellsworth> \o
<oSoMoN> hey ho
<seb128> I hope everyone is doing fine despite viruses, lockdowns, etc
<seb128> let's get started, IRC meetings are still a safe place :)
<seb128> #topic rls-bb-bugs
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/mxaCZTVc | GNOME 3.36 work claiming / tracking: https://trello.com/b/z29JJK3q/gnome-336 | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2020-03-17 | Current topic: rls-bb-bugs
<hellsworth> lol yes they are
<seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-bb-incoming-bug-tasks.html
<seb128> no desktop one
<seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-bb-tracking-bug-tasks.html
<seb128> bug #1855893
<ubot5> bug 1855893 in pulseaudio (Ubuntu Bionic) "Properly let PCM leave suspended state when hardware doesn't support PCM resume" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1855893
<seb128> where I got a reply from oem saying it's ok to drop the targetting
<seb128> doing that
<seb128> #topic rls-ee-bugs
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/mxaCZTVc | GNOME 3.36 work claiming / tracking: https://trello.com/b/z29JJK3q/gnome-336 | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2020-03-17 | Current topic: rls-ee-bugs
<seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-ee-incoming-bug-tasks.html
<seb128> no desktop entry
<seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-ee-tracking-bug-tasks.html
<seb128> nothing interesting there
<seb128> #topic rls-ff-bugs
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/mxaCZTVc | GNOME 3.36 work claiming / tracking: https://trello.com/b/z29JJK3q/gnome-336 | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2020-03-17 | Current topic: rls-ff-bugs
<seb128> http://reqorts.qa.ubuntu.com/reports/rls-mgr/rls-ff-incoming-bug-tasks.html
<seb128> bah, another 'interesting' round this week I guess
<seb128> bug #1862081
<ubot5> bug 1862081 in mutter (Ubuntu) "Gnome resizes framebuffer when playing fullscreen video over and over again (when using X11 fractional scaling)" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1862081
<Trevinho> seb128: yeah, i've it in my list already
<Trevinho> rls at this point
<seb128> Trevinho, k, please take assignment then
<seb128> thanks :)
<seb128> bug #1867548
<ubot5> bug 1867548 in gnome-control-center (Ubuntu) "Right Alt key is suddenly switched off after invoking Settings - Keyboard Shortcuts in Focal" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1867548
<seb128> Gunnar tagged it
<Laney> probably seems worthwhile
<seb128> yeah, I tend to agree on +1
<seb128> k, let's accept it and move on
<seb128> bug #1865563	
<ubot5> bug 1865563 in yaru-theme (Ubuntu) "password box not centered" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1865563
<seb128> that was fix commited but of course Daniel disagrees with that use of the status
<Laney> ð
<seb128> I say +1, doesn't matter much anyway since it's going to land when GNOME 3.36 lands and yaru is updated
<didrocks> yeah, the general idea is "it's done"
<didrocks> right
<seb128> bug #1865838
<ubot5> bug 1865838 in gdm3 (Ubuntu) "no error displayed on failed fingerprint authentification" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1865838
<seb128> so oem belives we should fix it and we like oem so I think we should accept it
<kenvandine> of course we like oem :)
<Trevinho> so, mine as well...
<seb128> Trevinho, thanks!
<seb128> bug #1866044
<didrocks> +1 indeed
<ubot5> bug 1866044 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu) "gnome-shell crashed with signal 5 in clutter_box_layout_allocate() when enable-animations=false" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1866044
<seb128> another one that is fix commited/waiting on 3.36 to land
<didrocks> yep
<seb128> next one is assigned to Marco, just needs to target
<seb128> bug #1807276
<ubot5> bug 1807276 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu) "Cannot open Onscreen Keyboard in Xorg" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1807276
<seb128> the bug isnt new/recent
<seb128> would be nice to debug but at this point I don't think I would rls nominate
<seb128> other opinions?
<Laney> agreed
<didrocks> +1
<seb128> thanks, let me -notfixing for now
<seb128> (time to enjoy my launchpad fix :p)
<hellsworth> i agree not fixing
<Laney> it would be good to fix osk / 2-in-1 bugs but that would have to be a specified project I think rather than rls bug fixing
<seb128> right
<seb128> bug #1867080
<ubot5> bug 1867080 in mutter (Ubuntu) "[radeon] No mouse cursor drawn in Wayland session" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1867080
<seb128> it's fixed upstream
<seb128> so let's move on
<Laney> fix the tags at least
<seb128> yeah, did that and added a comment
<kenvandine> maybe we should have a tag for 2-in-1 bugs?
<Laney> thx
<seb128> kenvandine, I wouldn't be suprised if there is already one
<seb128> will look after the meeting
<seb128> bug #1866275 we +1ed and I failed to target it looks like
<ubot5> bug 1866275 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu) "Password overlay dialogue breaks during screen lock while overlay present" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1866275
<kenvandine> we might want to do an organized round of 2-in-1 work
<seb128> doing that now
<seb128> bug #1865865  is fix commited according to Trevinho's report
<ubot5> bug 1865865 in gnome-shell-extension-ubuntu-dock (Ubuntu) "Icon spring animation starts/ends in the wrong location (near the top of the dock) " [Low,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1865865
<Laney> I've been noticing the accepted bugs not nominated, is that because you are batching it to do so later?
<Trevinho> seb128: in new release yes
<seb128> Laney, yes, seems like otherwise I fail to see timeout and such, trying new technique to just keep the action for end of meeting
<seb128> at least for nominations
<Laney> ok
<Laney> just wondering if that is why that ^ one came back
<seb128> I need to write a bot/tool to the actions :p
<seb128> anyway
<seb128> bug #1850960
<ubot5> bug 1850960 in gnome-terminal (Ubuntu) "Coming back from suspend, tabs and window are broken" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1850960
<seb128> it's on 19.10 and I didn't see that reported before
<Laney> indeed
<seb128> not rls material imho, so voting -1
<seb128> I will reply with some questions/details after the meeting
<seb128> and rls-not-fixing
<seb128> bug #1864127 I reassigned to snapd now, should have done that before
<ubot5> bug 1864127 in chromium-browser (Ubuntu) "apparmor denies ~/snap/chromium/ writes" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1864127
<seb128> bug #1866194
<ubot5> bug 1866194 in pulseaudio (Ubuntu) "After connecting an external output device (USB audio interface, Bluetooth speaker...), it shows up in the sound output options but the sound keeps being emitted from the internal laptop speaker" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1866194
<seb128> we said we would revisit
<seb128> kenvandine, thanks for commenting, I see you got a reply and it's not due to bluetooth
<seb128> but on devices connect/disconnect
<seb128> I think we should keep an eye on it but notfixing for now
<seb128> until/unless it's confirmed to be either frequent or a regression
<seb128> other opinions?
<kenvandine> i've only seen it once
<Laney> imho we should assign it to Robert (g-c-c) or Daniel (pulseaudio) for some further investigation, and they can Won't Fix the task if it is somehow hw specific
<Laney> but I've certainly seen some flakiness there myself so I believe there is probably an actual issue
<hellsworth> +1 on Laney's suggestion
<kenvandine> i'd suspect pulseaudio
<seb128> k
<seb128> done
<seb128> bug #1866616	
<ubot5> bug 1866616 in linux (Ubuntu) "[amdgpu] 2nd display stopped working" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1866616
<seb128> seems a pretty specific issue
<seb128> I would vote -1 for rls targetting
<Laney> ok, but tjaalton ^- you might want to see it
<tjaalton> adding a question..
<seb128> thanks
<seb128> bug #1866890
<ubot5> bug 1866890 in alsa-driver (Ubuntu) "audio card not detected after upgrade to 20.04 (Only Dummy Output appears)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1866890
<seb128> looks like a duplicate of bug #1860697 which is confirmed/owned by the oem team
<ubot5> bug 1860697 in linux (Ubuntu) "Sound doesn't work on Lenovo X1 Carbon 7th with 20.04" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1860697
<seb128> I'm going to mark it dup
<seb128> bug #1862028
<ubot5> bug 1862028 in ubuntukylin-meta (Ubuntu) "Focal uses the exfat fuse filesystem even though there is support in the kernel" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1862028
<seb128> there is an non answered question there
<hellsworth> should that be "even though there is no support in the kernel"?
<hellsworth> oh no
<hellsworth> it just reads weird
<seb128> :)
<Laney> it's on our list because of what
<Laney> udisks2?
<seb128> k, so that previous bug, we never installed that package by default
<seb128> yeah, probably should be invalid there
<Laney> indeed
<seb128> k, doing that and moving on
<seb128> one shell one assigned to Trevinho
<seb128> need targetting though
<seb128> bug #1864274
<ubot5> bug 1864274 in mesa (Ubuntu) "crunchy pixels" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1864274
<hellsworth> there's a workaround
<seb128> ^ tjaalton should that be accepted for focal nomination?
<seb128> k, while he comes back to me on that, moving
<Laney> I've got to move in a minute to be in the right place for a call
<seb128> bug #1865221 we discussed and I forgot to tag edit, doing now
<ubot5> bug 1865221 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu) "Workspace switcher scaling up and down depending on the number of active workspaces" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1865221
<tjaalton> seb128: yes
<seb128> Laney, k, no problem
<seb128> tjaalton, thanks
<Laney> pretty sure we said last week we would notfix those three bugs
<Laney> biab!
<seb128> yeah, I was going to say
<seb128> I probably failing to finish my queued task
<seb128> I need to better handle those meetings with a stack of action
<seb128> ok
<seb128> that should be for bugs then
<seb128> #topic update_excuses_by_team.html#desktop-packages
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/mxaCZTVc | GNOME 3.36 work claiming / tracking: https://trello.com/b/z29JJK3q/gnome-336 | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2020-03-17 | Current topic: update_excuses_by_team.html#desktop-packages
<seb128> https://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/proposed-migration/update_excuses_by_team.html#desktop-packages
<seb128> the world is blocked behind icu
<hellsworth> thats the truth of it
<seb128> icu seems to get there, but still need at least webkit2gtk, php7.4 and ruby resolved
<seb128> webkit2gtk being ours
<seb128> I will poke at that today
<seb128> other things on proposed migration
<seb128> libnotify/0.7.9-1ubuntu1: i386 (log, history)
<seb128> that one needs to be investigated
<seb128> gcr fails to build due to a test failing (but works on Debian, unsure what the difference is)
<seb128>    libgphoto2/2.5.24-1: i386 (log, history)
<seb128> the test does a build which fails since i386 went away, need to look at fixing cross building
<seb128> pygobject/ubiquity is the librsvg issue mentioned earlier and oSoMoN is looking at it
<seb128> I will card those on trello ^
<oSoMoN> and IÂ have a fix in the works
<seb128> if anyone want to help please feel free to add yourself to a card
<seb128> oSoMoN, great
<seb128> #topic AOB
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/mxaCZTVc | GNOME 3.36 work claiming / tracking: https://trello.com/b/z29JJK3q/gnome-336 | Desktop Team Weekly Meeting - 2020-03-17 | Current topic: AOB
<seb128> ohter topics?
<hellsworth> none from me
<kenvandine> nope
<seb128> seems not
<seb128> sorry for the long meeting and thanks for sticking up and participating in the bugs review!
<seb128> #endmeeting
* meetingology changed the topic of #ubuntu-desktop to: Home of the Desktop Team, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam | For help or questions, try #ubuntu | Work (read-only for non-developers): https://trello.com/b/mxaCZTVc | GNOME 3.36 work claiming / tracking: https://trello.com/b/z29JJK3q/gnome-336
<meetingology> Meeting ended Tue Mar 17 15:19:23 2020 UTC.
<meetingology> Minutes:        http://ubottu.com/meetingology/logs/ubuntu-desktop/2020/ubuntu-desktop.2020-03-17-14.31.moin.txt
<hellsworth> thanks seb128 !
<oSoMoN> thanks all
<Laney> thanks!
<Laney> turns out the call was just me and xnox in the end
<Laney> but we had a great time
<oSoMoN> core devs: IÂ would welcome a review (and sponsorship) for https://code.launchpad.net/~osomon/ubuntu-themes/scavenge-preserve-namespaces/+merge/380776
<seb128> oSoMoN, looking
<oSoMoN> please note that lp:ubuntu-themes isn't up-to-date with the contents of the archive, it's missing https://launchpadlibrarian.net/451540523/ubuntu-themes_19.04-0ubuntu1_19.04-0ubuntu2.diff.gz, I've asked vorlon to fix this (on #ubuntu-devel) but he hasn't responded yet
<seb128> ack
<Laney> I think he's off today
<oSoMoN> so my MR will probably need to be trivially rebased on top of that
<Laney> you might want to bzr import-dsc that
<Laney> (or whatever it's called)
<seb128> patch -p1 < :p
<Laney> /ban seb128
<oSoMoN> old school!
<seb128> 0_o
<Laney> wasn't joking though, often Foundations people ignore any vcs that is set so he likely doesn't even have a commit to push
<oSoMoN> yeah, likely
<seb128> there is a value still pinging them and asking them to merge their change
<Laney> yes, that happened
<Laney> (#ubuntu-devel)
<seb128> right
<Laney> so...
<seb128> but then if we merge we end up cleaning behind them
<seb128> and things never change
<seb128> it's just frustrating
<oSoMoN> right, but if he's off today we don't want to block on him, do we?
<seb128> oSoMoN, I start by rebasing/uploading the fix
<oSoMoN> cheers
<seb128> well, the Vcs is already outdated
<seb128> so it can be outdated by another revision
<seb128> if he hasn't replied/done it tomorrow I will end up sorting it out myself
<seb128> kenvandine, https://gitlab.gnome.org/Community/Ubuntu/gnome-software is that really the right place? most recent commit is a year old it says
<seb128> kenvandine, or is the branch to use 'snap-store'? would be nice to maybe change the default or refer to this one (I came from the launchpad project)
<kenvandine> branch is snap-store
<kenvandine> good idea, i'll change the default
<seb128> thx
<kenvandine> seb128: done
<seb128> thanks
<kenvandine> seb128: but... it was ubuntu-master which was rebased 3 weeks ago
<kenvandine> but... the history looks funky
<kenvandine> you know why :)
<seb128> shrug :)
<seb128> kenvandine, https://gitlab.gnome.org/Community/Ubuntu/gnome-software/-/merge_requests/15
<seb128> kenvandine, if that helps to get those translations merged? ;)
<kenvandine> that would help :)
<seb128> kenvandine, well, it's there now, just click the pretty button :p
<kenvandine> seb128: my only concern is what does that do to our rebasing
<seb128> kenvandine, you mean?
<kenvandine> conflicts merging from upstream
<seb128> kenvandine, do you have a better solution?
<kenvandine> no :)
<seb128> we will need to resolve conflicts
<seb128> the other option is to not translate any of our downstream strings
<seb128> that isn't great to say the least
<kenvandine> indeed
<kenvandine> that's not an option
<kenvandine> i wonder if i can do some magic in the snap build
<seb128> I don't really see how
<seb128> the translations export from launchpad takes a while
<seb128> it's not a download, it emails you an url when the export is ready
<kenvandine> maybe we add that download as a blob in snap/local/ and extract that
<kenvandine> so then updating that blob is a manual step
<seb128> kenvandine, wfm if that's what you prefer ...
<seb128> kenvandine, I can email you a launchpad tarball if you want, but you can also get the files from my git branch
<kenvandine> let me chat with robert
<seb128> k
<kenvandine> email me the tarball
<kenvandine> good test case
<seb128> tjaalton, do you know where I can find a drm-tip or 5.6-rc kernel ppa/deb for focal?
<tjaalton> seb128: mainline ppa
<tjaalton> http://kernel.ubuntu.com/~kernel-ppa/mainline/
<seb128> tjaalton, thanks
<seb128> tjaalton, I've a flicker on plymouth with my xps13 and according to plymouth's upstream it's an i915 problem, fastset/boot is failing
<seb128> still happening with rc5, I will report upstream
<kenvandine> seb128: something like https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/yF8YmRQvfm/
<seb128> kenvandine, looks fine to me yes
<kenvandine> seems simple enough :)
<tjaalton> seb128: ok
<kenvandine> seb128: /root/parts/snap-store/src/po/fr.po exists
<kenvandine> ........................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................... done.
<kenvandine> seb128: if i send you a locally built snap, can you test it ?
<kenvandine> seb128: https://gitlab.gnome.org/Community/Ubuntu/gnome-software/-/merge_requests/16
<kenvandine> I'd appreciate help testing gtk-common-themes from candidate
<kenvandine> good morning robert_ancell_
<hellsworth> o/ robert_ancell !
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, hi
<robert_ancell> I don't know why but if I don't restart IRC in the after a disconnect it wont let me talk...
<seb128> kenvandine, yes, I can test a snap if you give me
<robert_ancell> hellsworth, hello!
<seb128> hey robert_ancell
<kenvandine> seb128: cool, i'll send it
<robert_ancell> So every time someone pings me I inevitably have to restart...
<kenvandine> seb128: can i send via telegram?
<seb128> robert_ancell, maybe your client fails to register again to nickserv avec disconnect?
<seb128> kenvandine, sure
<kenvandine> robert_ancell: https://bugs.launchpad.net/snap-store/+bug/1867153
<hellsworth> maybe your login to freenode is timing out
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1867153 in snap-store "Snap does not appear in Ubuntu Software categories" [Undecided,New]
<kenvandine> the theory is the sections API is only giving us 50 results
<robert_ancell> I get a "you've been banned/quieted on this channel" error. Thanks IRC.
<kenvandine> and the game in question is after 50
<kenvandine> robert_ancell: wasn't there talk about pagination?
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, for snaps? It was punted to phase 2 of the new API I think.
<kenvandine> :(
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, been asking for pagination for a long time :)
<robert_ancell> hellsworth, yeah, I think it gets confused when I put my laptop to sleep and times out.
<kenvandine> it's sad we still don't have it
<kenvandine> robert_ancell: so i'm correct that it's snapd limiting the results?
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, I'll just confirm
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, weird, the 'snap find' for the education category shows it, but the call to get that category from snapd doesn't.
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, but in short, it's almost certainly not in the top N (50?)
<kenvandine> i do get it the education category in snap-store
<kenvandine> robert_ancell: i found issues with categories in snap-store
<kenvandine> that's my next topic :)
<robert_ancell> curl --unix-socket /run/snapd.socket http://localhost/v2/find?category=education doesn't show it for me
<robert_ancell> snapd is returning the top 100 in each category.
<robert_ancell> 'snap find' shows the top 50
<kenvandine> snap-store is only showing 36 results in education
<kenvandine> oh
<kenvandine> no
<kenvandine> it's 50
<kenvandine> exactly 50
<kenvandine> and selflessheroes is in that
<robert_ancell> oh whoops. It's section=education, not category=education. It's showing there now.
<robert_ancell> (in education, not games)
<kenvandine> in snap-store games is showing a lot more than 100
<robert_ancell> And it's returning 50.
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, I guess it's also showing debs?
<robert_ancell> Because snapd is only returning 50 results.
<kenvandine> ah it is
<kenvandine> so that was my next issue
<kenvandine> snap-store is now duplicating categories
<kenvandine> like we have "Education" and "Education and Science"
<kenvandine> and we have two "Games" categories
<kenvandine> i hacked desktop-categories to not populate to confirm
<kenvandine> robert_ancell: should we do something to merge categories?
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, the snap categories assume the XDG categories aren't there.
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, so if we need both we need to add some merging.
<robert_ancell> The old method merged the snap categories into XDG ones. So do we now want to do the reverse or go back to the old behaviour?
<kenvandine> no
<kenvandine> we should favor the ones from snapd
<kenvandine> question is, how do we disable the XDG ones?
<kenvandine> i added a return TRUE in desktop-categories to hack around it
<kenvandine> seb128: snap sent
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, we need to disable the desktop-categories plugin.
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, That's a core plugin, so it's built by default. But you could drop the .so from the package, or makes the snap plugin replace it or patch it to disable itself.
<kenvandine> i think appstream and snap plugins depend on it
<kenvandine> right?
<kenvandine> snap works without desktop-categories
<kenvandine> but it doesn't show debs when you browse categories :/
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, the only rule in the code is gs_plugin_add_rule (plugin, GS_PLUGIN_RULE_RUN_AFTER, "desktop-categories") for the snap plugin
<robert_ancell> So nothing else explicitly requires it
<kenvandine> robert_ancell: what do you think about https://gitlab.gnome.org/Community/Ubuntu/gnome-software/-/merge_requests/16
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, I was just looking at the LP MR :)
<kenvandine> i figured this would be easier to maintain than merging them in git
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, makes sense to me if we consider the LP ones to be better.
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, we should make a plugin or something if we want to do that for a number of packages.
<kenvandine> yeah
<kenvandine> robert_ancell: to work around the duplicate categories issue, how does this look https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/RpBM8t3JNj/
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, I would expect that to work.
<kenvandine> it does :)
<kenvandine> but feels hacky
<robert_ancell> It is!
<robert_ancell> Just don't ship the .so if that's the intention.
<kenvandine> dropping the .so is worse
<robert_ancell> We might risk future breakage as it's not considered an optional plugin.
<kenvandine> then we don't get any debs when browsing categories
<kenvandine> i don't know why though
<kenvandine> dropping the .so i get exactly 50 results in Games
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, oh, that's done in gs_plugin_add_category_apps
<robert_ancell> Yeah, so you need half of the plugin...
<kenvandine> ah
<kenvandine> that's why :)
<robert_ancell> And gs_plugin_add_category_apps should probably be modified to map XDG categories to snap ones.
<kenvandine> robert_ancell: can you do that?
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, *sigh* :)
<kenvandine> :)
<kenvandine> much easier for you :)
<robert_ancell> Easy for you to say :P
<kenvandine> indeed :)
<robert_ancell> File a bug and assign it to me.
<kenvandine> will do
<kenvandine> i'd think that mapping is going to be fragile
<kenvandine> as we don't have a stable list of categories
<kenvandine> it is... but might not be
<robert_ancell> Yeah, it will need to be modified if the snap categories change.
<kenvandine> i thought there was code for that before
<kenvandine> but i guess that was the other way around
<kenvandine> i'm going to push my hack with a comment for now
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, hang on
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, modifying plugins/core/gs-desktop-common.c:gs_desktop_get_data (void) is probably a better hack.
<robert_ancell> i.e. to return an empty array.
<robert_ancell> Because other code does access that list.
<kenvandine> robert_ancell: bug 1867833
<ubot5> bug 1867833 in snap-store "Map XDG categories to snap categories" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1867833
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, do you want to target that to focal?
<kenvandine> ideally
<kenvandine> but actually, i'm more eager to getting the snap-store-3-36 branch to stop crashing :)
<kenvandine> i haven't had a chance to debug that
<kenvandine> maybe you can look into that?
<kenvandine> last i tried it, in frankfurt, that was crashing from a local build.  Not just when run as a snap
<kenvandine> so i'm guessing something was missed in the rebase?
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, what's the current crash? I thought we'd resolved or those?
<kenvandine> it crashes when opening the installed tab pretty reliably
<robert_ancell> I'll have a look.
<kenvandine> and it also crashed for me just searching
<robert_ancell> I think I wasn't getting the issue in Frankfurt.
<kenvandine> it seems random
<robert_ancell> ugh.
<kenvandine> you might have to use it for a few minutes
<kenvandine> robert_ancell: the empty array idea doesn't work
<kenvandine> i only get snap results
<robert_ancell> oh well, back to the hack :/
<kenvandine> yup ;)
<seb128> kenvandine, the snap you sent me is correctly translated, thanks!
<kenvandine> seb128: woot
 * kenvandine merges
<seb128> :-)
<popey> robert_ancell dunno if you saw, i filed a bug as requested https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-control-center/+bug/1867598
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1867598 in gnome-control-center (Ubuntu) "Inconsistency in naming of "Permissions & Access"" [Low,Triaged]
<robert_ancell> popey, yep, will look into that.
<popey> ta
<robert_ancell> popey, were there any in particular or just "all the things"
<popey> eh?
<popey> well, i only looked at a couple of snaps
<robert_ancell> popey, I mean were there particular (common) interfaces that needed good descriptions or you just noticed there's lots that don't have them now.
<popey> the latter
<popey> i dont know when the last time it was looked at
<popey> and i know the security team have added more since then
<robert_ancell> It's been a while :)
<popey> so some kind of diff somewhere but dunno where
<robert_ancell> I was asking in case we need to prioritize which ones need text, but I think I'll just tackle this as a "fix them all equally"
<robert_ancell> I think this is a case to re-raise that snapd needs to provide better text.
#ubuntu-desktop 2020-03-18
<seb128> goood morning desktopers
<duflu> Hi seb128
<seb128> hey duflu, how are you?
<seb128> lut did
<seb128> lut didrocks
<didrocks> good morning
<didrocks> salut seb128
<duflu> seb128, wrestling with getting some basic groceries while in isolation. People have cleared the shelves. But otherwise I am good. You?
<seb128> I'm good, it's my turn to watch the kid today so I expect that to be another challenging one
<didrocks> good luck with that seb128
<seb128> thanks!
<didrocks> hey duflu
<didrocks> duflu: wait for a week to do shopping, this is what we decided here
<seb128> we did online shopping but there was no slot to receive things before 10 days, so we will need to go out to buy food in between
<duflu> Well in theory Australia produces much more than it consumes. So this should resolve over time
<duflu> Same here... you fill the cart and then find no available delivery slots to check out
<didrocks> seb128: yeah, we are use to use walk drive, and same, impossible to order
<jibel> I decided to ration my kids. With 3kg of pasta and 2kg of rice left, with 50g a day per person we can last a month.
<jibel> j/k
<duflu> Also good morning didrocks and jibel
<didrocks> and on Sunday, a little bit of cheese on top
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<duflu> Hi oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> hey duflu
<didrocks> salut oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> salut didrocks
<duflu> seb128, is there someone/somewhere I should coordinate with to ensure my "patches worth having" email is included in a release?
<duflu> I can't see recent updates in the relevant launchpad git
<Laney> morning
<duflu> Morning Laney
<duflu> Speaking of which, I am now using mozjs68 and upstream gjs master. It's very nice
<didrocks> morning Laney
<oSoMoN> morning Laney
<seb128> duflu, the patches are on my list, will discuss with Trevinho once 3.36 is uploaded
<duflu> Yeah I figured a working 3.36 should come first
<duflu> Although if it was a big active job then both could happen at once and save multiple uploads
<ackk> hi, in Focal Gnome I don't see the volume slider anymore in the top-right menu. is that a bug or a deliberate change?
<jibel> is github down?
<didrocks> a lot of sites donât work for me anymore as well
<jibel> please everyone stop watching netflix so we can work ;)
<duflu> Maybe too many people are contributing to open source
<GunnarHj> Anybody who knows if today's daily build failed or is just delayed?
<duflu> ackk, I think someone already reported that issue. Do you have working volume controls in Settings?
<ackk> duflu, yes
<duflu> ackk, it may be related to bug 1865169. If not then please report a new bug by 'ubuntu-bug gnome-shell'
<ubot5> bug 1865169 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu) "volume and light not working in Gnome Shell 3.35" [Low,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1865169
<ackk> duflu, seems to be the same issue
<duflu> Good, I think?
<jibel> GunnarHj, the livefs built 1h ago, but no cd yet
<GunnarHj> jibel: Aha, thanks! Just some patience needed, then.
<ackk> duflu, to be clear, it's not exactly the same issue for me, I don't see the slider at all (the bug mentions them being 0)
<jibel> dns outage apparently
<duflu> ackk, yes please run 'ubuntu-bug gnome-shell' to open a new bug
<duflu> And good night to all..
<ackk> duflu, ok
<ackk> thanks
<ackk> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell/+bug/1867905 FTR
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1867905 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu) "Sound output volume controls not showing in menu" [Undecided,New]
<GunnarHj> Hi tjaalton, do you have time to look at the SRUs at bug #1844853? We think that the remaining autopkgtest failures can be disregarded and that they are ready to migrate to -updates.
<ubot5> bug 1844853 in glib2.0 (Ubuntu Eoan) "IBus no longer works in Qt applications after upgrade" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1844853
<tjaalton> GunnarHj: not right now
<GunnarHj> tjaalton: Ok. No urgency really.
<Trevinho> seb128: hey, yeah as per duflu parches I'd like another reiteretion, maybe we can discuss them more deeply.
<Trevinho> Laney, a part your geneneric approach to patches, that I mostly agree with, do you have any specific thought on them?
<Laney> Not really, you can decide on that
<Laney> If we want to just start piling up distro patches, well, whatever, I'm not arguing on that basis any more
<Laney> Trevinho: Firstly I'd rather see a 3.36 stack landing though ;-)
<Trevinho> as well, I finally finished the dock with some more bugs fixed
<jibel> GunnarHj, daily build available http://cdimage.ubuntu.com/daily-live/pending/
<GunnarHj> jibel: Thanks for letting me know. :)
<Laney> Trevinho: and speaking of distro patches, the current list in gnome-shell makes be a bit sad, I think there are quite a few that could be poked along next cycle
<Laney> also there are some copy + paste errors there!
<devyl> hello @all
<devyl> i'm testing 20.04 on a old toughbook cf-19 (mk2) with wayland default desktop. my touchscreen is a bit off... how can i calibrate it on wayland?
<hellsworth> good morning desktopers
<oSoMoN> good morning hellsworth
<didrocks> hey hellsworth
<hellsworth> hi didrocks how are you doing?
<didrocks> fine, thanks, you?
<hellsworth> i'm alright :)
<Laney> sorry for the stupid question, but how am I supposed to handle the gdk-pixbuf loader cache in a snap?
<Laney> it's not really a desktop app, just happens to use gdk-pixbuf for some stuff
<Laney> feel like I could generate this at build time
<ogra> Laney, override prime
<ogra> Laney, similar to https://github.com/ogra1/ubuntu-core-desktop-snap/blob/master/snap/snapcraft.yaml#L617
<Laney> ogra: ah, let me try that, thanks, the environment trick is useful too
<sarnold> apparently gnome 3.36 and nvidia drivers don't get along great, https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/mutter/issues/1128
<gitbot> GNOME issue 1128 in mutter "Screen turns off after Gnome update" [Opened]
<hellsworth> kenvandine: would you please launch these autopkgtests? https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/s9p48mQpF3/
<kenvandine> hellsworth: done
<hellsworth> thanks!
#ubuntu-desktop 2020-03-19
<kenvandine> jamesh: hey
<kenvandine> i'm definately getting portals for file open and save as dialogs
<jamesh> okay
<jamesh> but not for launching URLs/files?
<kenvandine> running the portals with --verbose I can see the output
<kenvandine> nope
<kenvandine> never hits the portal daemons
<kenvandine> are you running the portal packages from the archive?
<kenvandine> or maybe something newer that you've been hacking on?
<jamesh> fwiw, I don't think there is any verbose output for the OpenURI actions
<kenvandine> oh
<kenvandine> maybe that's why :)
<kenvandine> but...
<jamesh> I was testing focal's xdg-desktop-portal
<kenvandine> in firefox's stdout i see the attempts to exec /snap/bin/evince
<jamesh> ah.
<jamesh> it can see /var/lib/snapd/desktop/applications
<kenvandine> and it should... right?
<jamesh> even with GTK_USE_PORTAL=1 set, it will prefer locally available handlers
<kenvandine> portal-test does the right thing
<jamesh> browser-support grants access to /var/lib/snapd/desktop/applications, but probably shouldn't.  I've mentioned it to jdstrand a few times
<jamesh> it can't do anything useful with that data, and  it is an information leak
<jamesh> try opening a file with a mime type not covered by any of your snap applications
<jamesh> I didn't have the libreoffice snap installed, so it was the .deb libreoffice snap that was being launched when I tried to open .docx files
<kenvandine> jamesh: if i remove all my pdf handling snaps it works
<kenvandine> i had 7 snaps installed that claim to handle pdf :)
<jamesh> I guess removing that apparmor rule from browser-support is a priority now
<kenvandine> if i open the drop down to select a different handler it now shows no apps
<kenvandine> that UI should be provided by portals?
<jamesh> My guess is that it was added in a reactive "browsers seem to be trying to access this path, so lets allow it" way, rather than because they need it
<kenvandine> can you raise that with jdstrand again?
<jamesh> yeah
<jamesh> Do you mean the Firefox UI that asks if you want to open or save, or the portal one after asking you which app to launch?
<kenvandine> which app to launch
<kenvandine> it defaults to "system handler"
<jamesh> We can't offer application choice in the Firefox UI, because the sandboxed application can't know what's available
<kenvandine> portal-test gives me the portal's selector
<jamesh> the "System Handler" part is normal (although a bit ugly)
<kenvandine> i guess that uses a different API?
<jamesh> that's coming from Firefox itself, special casing for portal support
<jamesh> https://dxr.mozilla.org/mozilla-central/source/toolkit/system/gnome/nsGIOService.cpp#58
<jibel> good morning all
<jamesh> morning jibel
<jibel> hi jamesh, how are you?
<duflu> Hi jibel
<duflu> and jamesh
<jibel> hi duflu
<jamesh> It's interesting times.  They just announced a travel ban for all non citizens or residents entering the country from tomorrow here
<jibel> confined at home with the kids is interesting too
<jamesh> My mother has brought forward her travel home by a week (she's been working in the UK for the last month or so)
<seb128> gooood morning desktopers
<duflu> Hi seb128. How goes?
<seb128> duflu, doing fine with the current context! you?
<duflu> Heh, yes, same. Though I miss the outside world. Will get back to it on Sunday
<didrocks> good morning
<duflu> Hi didrocks
<seb128> lut didrocks, comment Ã§a va ?
<didrocks> hey duflu
<didrocks> salut seb128. Ã§a va, et toi ?
<seb128> Ã§a va aussi
<seb128> :-)
<duflu> seb128, I haven't forgotten about your email. Just wanted to make sure everything else in progress isn't waiting on me before I try learning a new project/codebase
<seb128> duflu, k, thanks, also it sounds like you are wanting to make some free cycle to poke at that so that's good news :)
<duflu> same for most days really - finish what I started before starting anything new
<seb128> duflu, btw, I've emailed Hans about my flicker, turned out to be an i915 bug, I reported upstream as https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/drm/intel/issues/1476 (mentioned as a follow up/in case you are curious still about the issue)
<gitbot> drm issue 1476 in intel "i915 fastset failing on XPS 13 7390" [Community, Feature: Display/Other, Platform: Kbl, Opened]
<duflu> seb128, is that flicker or the corruption?
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<duflu> which might also have flickered
<duflu> Hi oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> hey duflu
<seb128> lut duflu
<oSoMoN> salut seb128
<seb128> duflu, that's the plymouth flicker and the logo shifting is a side effect of the modeset according to Hans, I didn't report the session video corruption yet since I'm trying on 5.6-rc and didn't hit the bug there yet
<duflu> On that note I had the idea of switching to radeon or nouveau briefly to try and prove my big flicker issue is i915
<seb128> ups
<didrocks> salut oSoMoN !
<seb128> lut oSoMoN I meant, comment Ã§a va ?
<oSoMoN> salut didrocks
<oSoMoN> seb128, bien, et toi? :)
<seb128> Ã§a va :-)
<jamesh> oSoMoN: I had some ideas about how you could move forward with https://bugs.launchpad.net/snapd/+bug/1863625, but it turned into a (temporary) dead end
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1863625 in snapd "Need an xdg-email wrapper, similar to the xdg-open one" [Medium,Triaged]
<seb128> duflu, we seem to disagree on using "fix commited" for GNOME bugs which have a fix commited upstream :-(
<seb128> duflu, can I convince to not change those back to triaged? it makes bugs lists more difficult to browse then, since from the list you can't tell that the bug is being handled/doesn't need more than waiting for the next update to land in Ubuntu
<tjaalton> oSoMoN: hi, would you be willing to consider linking libnssckbi.so in firefox/thunderbird to /usr/lib/<arch>/pkcs11/p11-kit-trust.so in order to fix bug 1647285?
<ubot5> bug 1647285 in ca-certificates (Ubuntu) "SSL trust not system-wide" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1647285
<seb128> duflu, your status is might be theoritically correct but at an efficiency cost on handling of bugs and I think it doesn't benefit anyone, neither us nor our users if we waste more time than needed on launchpad
<duflu> seb128, my concern is that users don't understand "Fix committed" and then ask why the bug still isn't fixed. Also Marco and I have been using the 'fixed-upstream' tag for that for a while, so might you consider that?
<seb128> duflu, tags are not visible from the bug lists so they don't solve my problem
<seb128> when I review e.g gnome shell bugs I just have a stack of Triaged ones and I can't tell appart which ones need work and which ones don't
<seb128> where "need work" means debugging/fixing work, e.g are not already in the process of being fixed by just updating
<duflu> I feel it's something we shouldn't do, but I understand your concern. Also, most are not in the state you want: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.tag=fixed-upstream
<duflu> seb128, advanced search has a tick box 'Show bugs that are resolved upstream'. I wonder if that works?
<seb128> that somewhat works
<seb128> it's not able to tell if it's fixed in the same component
<duflu> Yeah but it's only 21 bugs to fix
<seb128> so gets confused if it has several upstream watches and one closed and one open
<duflu> up
<duflu> That's a fair point
<seb128> anyway, I made my point
<seb128> there are other ways to find those bugs
<seb128> it's just that fix commited is what messages the more clearly from bugs lists that an issue is handled, you can even don't list those
<seb128> but yeah, it comes to the price of confusing a bit some users sometime
<seb128> (though I usually do add a comment saying it has been fixed upstream and the fix will land with the next update when I change the status)
<duflu> People are already confused. I forgot I wanted to give a lightning talk about all things in Launchpad that mislead people
<duflu> Like they can't tell when a bug is closed and carry on with it
<didrocks> same in every bug tracking system, people keep commenting on closed bugs on github for instance
<didrocks> It was the same on Track
<didrocks> I donât think we can aim at avoiding that
<duflu> Sure you can, just better UI/web design
<duflu> seb128, I think if there was a packaging branch with a fix committed early then we'd both agree on the status. I think the main issue really is that there hasn't been (like https://git.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-desktop/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell). If we declare Fix Committed when something is just fixed upstream then there may be an indefinite lag and no guarantee of it reaching distro even within one cycle or ever
<duflu> So Fix Committed creates false expectation even for those who know what it means
<didrocks> well, if itâs fixed upstream in a version like 3.36.0 and we have 3.35.91, we know weâll switch to the released version
<didrocks> released as "stable"
<duflu> That's a good case for an exception
<didrocks> and so, that it will reach the distro this cycle
<oSoMoN> jamesh, ack, thanks, that's useful even if not applicable right now
<duflu> OK, I will update 3.35.9x bugs to Fix Committed, seb128
<jamesh> oSoMoN: yeah.  If we're not doing any "snap userd" specific work, it's not clear it's worth reimplementing a tool like that
<duflu> Done, seb128
<oSoMoN> tjaalton, looking into this
<tjaalton> oSoMoN: great, thanks
<Laney> moin
<oSoMoN> hey Laney
<didrocks> hey Laney
<seb128> duflu, thanks!
<seb128> duflu, and yeah, I don't suggest using "fix commited" for random projects on launchpad which might not see a new version for years, I use it as a special rule for GNOME mostly
<seb128> hey tjaalton, Laney, how are you?
<duflu> seb128, also beware we are in the territory of 3.36.1 fixes, which are committed upstream :)
<seb128> duflu, that's fine, we do plan to get .1 in focal :)
<tjaalton> seb128: howdy, doing great
<Laney> moin oSoMoN didrocks seb128
<Laney> yeah not too bad I guess!
<Laney> you?
<seb128> doing good here!
<didrocks> doing fine
<pieq> duflu, hi! Saw your comment on https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pulseaudio/+bug/1866194
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1866194 in pulseaudio (Ubuntu) "[Zoom USB audio on Dell Inspiron 7370] shows up in the sound output options but the sound keeps being emitted from the internal laptop speaker" [High,New]
<seb128> today is my "work day" :)
<pieq> duflu, the thing is I can trigger this with two very different sound interfaces: a USB microphone and a BT headset
<seb128> not my try-to-strech-to-get-work-done-while-watching-kid day
<pieq> duflu, so in my case I'm not sure if this is specific to a sound peripheral... maybe more to the device itself (and its internal component)
<duflu> pieq, yeah I think you're right. I periodically see similar issues on different devices, but not with every peripheral
<duflu> So different bugs
<pieq> argh.... I don't know how to tackle this
<pieq> a colleague was saying that basically when the issue is fixed for one person, it brings a regression for someone else...
<duflu> pieq, upstream is responsive and helpful: https://gitlab.freedesktop.org/groups/pulseaudio/-/issues
<pieq> duflu, ha? I'll check it out then
<duflu> In fact I should have directed you there already. I forgot
<pieq> but maybe we should consider some test cases to make sure newer versions of PA don't break things on existing models
<oSoMoN> tjaalton, you wrote in comment #22Â that nss should have everything in focal, yet /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/nss/libnssckbi.so is not a symlink to p11-kit-trust.so
<pieq> duflu, no worries. I'm very bad at going upstream myself... I'll check this out later
<tjaalton> oSoMoN: that's fine
<oSoMoN> tjaalton, (I know this is independent from the situation in firefox and tbird, because they ship their own copy of nss)
<duflu> pieq, if you look hard enough this kind of bug never went away, but also never occurs on many machines
<seb128> pieq, the bug you mentioned, is that new or did it exist for you in e.g bionic?
<pieq> duflu, that's the problem... it's here enough to be annoying to a big enough fraction of the users, but it's not spread enough that it's easy to trigger/debug/fix
<oSoMoN> tjaalton, so how is this going to work for other apps using the system-wide copy of nss?
<pieq> seb128, it's new. I had 19.04 and 19.10 previously on this laptop
<duflu> pieq, anyway upstream knows the right questions and commands to try
<tjaalton> oSoMoN: I'm referring to comment #6 which mentioned that at least 3.30 would be needed
<pieq> seb128, worked well enough, and when I put 20.04 daily, this bug appeared
<seb128> pieq, that's the sort of information that would be useful to include in the report
<seb128> pieq, when did you start testing focal?
<pieq> seb128, argh I thought I mentioned it, but I didn't. I'll update the bug description
<duflu> This is why I keep a growing list of ISOs, so you can bisect when it's unclear what package is the issue
<pieq> seb128, shortly before I open this bug
<duflu> I think Debian is automating that kind of thing?
<pieq> seb128, I was tricked by jibel who told me everything was fine
<pieq> on 20.04 daily
<pieq> ;)
<oSoMoN> tjaalton, but my understanding of comment #4 is that the symlink is needed nonetheless
<seb128> k, so after we updated pulseaudio, which doesn't make easier to knowif that's pulseaudio or something else in focal
<pieq> seb128, this laptop has been certified. I could check the OEM image (bionic) but I don't think it's very useful since it didn't happen on 19.04/19.10
<tjaalton> oSoMoN: ok, I'll leave that open then. but it doesn't concern ffox/tbird :)
<duflu> on that note... why is "disco" still listed in launchpad? https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-shell
<duflu> It hit EOL in January
<oSoMoN> tjaalton, IÂ know, IÂ was just trying to understand the bigger picture. Doing that symlink in firefox and thunderbird sounds okay to me, but I'll ask the security team for their opinion, as I probably don't understand all the implications
<tjaalton> oSoMoN: sure thing
<tjaalton> oSoMoN: my understanding is that this doesn't *have* to be implemented everything in one go
<tjaalton> the biggest impact would be gained from fixing these apps I think
<seb128> duflu, because whoever is supposed to handle that didn't finish the work to decomission it properly
<seb128> duflu, can you mention it/ask on #ubuntu-release ?
<seb128> a reminder that it's not done might be useful
<Laney> there's no need, it's known / in progress
<duflu> ok
<Laney> I saw Steve talking about it yesterday actually
<seb128> thx Laney
<Laney> there was some actual reason why it couldn't be done straight away
<seb128> I've no idea about the process and what is involved
<Laney> me neither beyond https://wiki.ubuntu.com/EndOfLifeProcess
<seb128> I would have expected that to be a simple flag to switch
<Laney> would be good to share that knowledge / work imho
<seb128> indeed
<oSoMoN> tjaalton, an alternative would be building firefox/thunderbird against the system-wide libnss, but firefox currently requires 3.50, which isn't yet in focal, and IÂ suspect they bump that requirement often, so that wouldn't really work with our distribution model
<tjaalton> oSoMoN: yeah, I don't think that's worth it
<Laney> duflu: Fancy updating the debian/changelog in https://salsa.debian.org/3v1n0-guest/mutter/-/tree/ubuntu/master and https://salsa.debian.org/3v1n0-guest/gnome-shell/-/tree/ubuntu/master to list the bugs that would be closed by these uploads?
<duflu> Laney, do I have perms for that?
<Laney> duflu: you can push it anywhere, or give me a 'git am'-able patch even, I don't mind :-)
<duflu> Laney, OK I'll try to get that done before making dinner...
<Laney> that's great, thanks
<duflu> Ugh, don't mix remotes from the wrong project
<duflu> Laney, I would be editing older changelog entries, you understand?
<duflu> Not the top one
<Laney> duflu: That won't cause the bugs to be closed
<duflu> Hmm, they were closed in older entries
<Laney> I suggest describing it in the latest entry, as 'this upload to Ubuntu contains the fixes from ... which will close ...'
<duflu> Yes, caveat being that they are Ubuntu bugs and the first Ubuntu entry
<duflu> Laney, 1/2: https://salsa.debian.org/3v1n0-guest/gnome-shell/-/merge_requests/1
<duflu> or https://salsa.debian.org/3v1n0-guest/gnome-shell/-/merge_requests/1.patch
<seb128> Trevinho, Laney, duflu, bug #1867345 just as a FYI/consideration when updating the packaging now or later (we can also rls-ff-incoming and discuss in meeting if that makes more sense)
<ubot5> bug 1867345 in gnome-shell (Ubuntu) "Do not ship "Extensions" application with gnome-shell" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1867345
<duflu> I have no opinion on that, any more
<Laney> sounds worth doing
<Laney> in Debian too probably though
<duflu> Laney, 2/2: https://salsa.debian.org/3v1n0-guest/mutter/-/merge_requests/1
<duflu> which is https://salsa.debian.org/3v1n0-guest/mutter/-/merge_requests/1.patch
<duflu> Laney, I'm done so good night(?)
<Laney> thanks and see you!
<duflu> Oh wait
<duflu> Those were the fixes already upstreamed not including patches. I guess Marco already documented any patches
<duflu> ?
<Laney> yes but without LP references if there are any
<duflu> Argh
<duflu> OK try again...
<duflu> In a minute
<Laney> you can amend his lines to include those
<duflu> I will
<duflu> Laney, done
<duflu> one line changed
<Laney> great, thanks, I'll look in a bit
<popey> kenvandine any plan to add pop theme to gtk-common-themes? i see no issues for it
<ricotz> hey desktoppers :)
<popey> Good day!
<jdstrand> jamesh, kenvandine: I may have misunderstood before that the access to /var/lib/snapd/desktop/applications was just noise. based on backscroll I understand that not to be the case
<oSoMoN> hey ricotz, how are you?
<kenvandine> popey: no current plan.  i'm not particularly opposed but i do want to limit the size
<kenvandine> pretty soon we should have the automated theme installation
<popey> "soon"?
<kenvandine> last i heard we might have something usable in may
<kenvandine> right after 20.04 releases
<kenvandine> 20.04 was the goal, but we couldn't get it in time for feature freeze
<kenvandine> so decided right after 20.04 was ok
<jdstrand> kenvandine: is there a bug for this firefox issue?
<kenvandine> jdstrand: bug 1868051
<ubot5> bug 1868051 in snapd "browser-support[allow-sandbox=true] should not grant access to /var/lib/snapd/desktop/applications" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1868051
<ricotz> oSoMoN, hey, I am fine (still) ;), and you?
<oSoMoN> ricotz, yeah, I'm good, thanks
<kenvandine> ogra: anything to chat about today?
<ogra> not really, i played with the platform snap but have nothing working yet
<kenvandine> ok
<hellsworth> good morning desktopers
<kenvandine> hellsworth: good morning
<hellsworth> hi kenvandine ! how are you today?
<kenvandine> my yard is turning yellow... hellsworth, do you know why?
<hellsworth> umm because it's so warm there?
<hellsworth> you know, i went for a 30 min walk yesterday and got a solid sunburn. and today it is going to snow!
<hellsworth> maybe later i'll go get some snow to put on my sunburn :)
<hellsworth> hey kenvandine so maybe we want to just forget about updating gtk in the build snap until gnome-3-36. i wasn't thinking of the test effort that would be needed and now that you pointed it out, i think it's not worth it.
<kenvandine> hellsworth: pollen!
<kenvandine> it's everywhere now
<hellsworth> welcome to spring i guess!
<hellsworth> ugh and the daycare will close at noon, not for coronavirus but for the blizzard warning
<hellsworth> oSoMoN: heads up i'm going to ask you to upload a new LO to dev as soon as it builds and put the artifacts in a google drive for you. all autopkgtests have passed my build in the ppa.
<hellsworth> ricotz: FYI ^^
<hellsworth> this is 6.4.2
<oSoMoN> hellsworth, sure thing
<ricotz> hellsworth, hi, I noticed, so the autopkgtests passed?
<hellsworth> yes all of them
<ricotz> hellsworth, great
<hellsworth> https://objectstorage.prodstack4-5.canonical.com/v1/AUTH_77e2ada1e7a84929a74ba3b87153c0ac/autopkgtest-focal-hellsworth-libreoffice/?format=plain
<hellsworth> (if you want to have a look)
<ricotz> I am fine if you say so :)
<hellsworth> :D
<ricotz> hellsworth, I assume there is no difference from your ppa package apart from the final changelog version?
<hellsworth> correct
<ricotz> hellsworth, could you push the git branch?
<hellsworth> yep doing that now
<ricotz> thx
<seb128> Trevinho, Laney, so what's the status of 3.36?
<Laney> I'm uploading bits to a silo now
<Trevinho> seb128: I'm fixing now a change we need for theming gdm
<Trevinho> then we should be good
<Trevinho> need to change something in yaru too though
<seb128> k
<seb128> Laney, Trevinho, thanks
<Laney> Trevinho: what change to what project?
<Laney> and need?
<Laney> and what need*
<Trevinho> Laney: shell and yaru
<Laney> :/
<Laney> is this another distro patch?
<Trevinho> Laney: no, need to change one actually, I hope to remove another so I'm trying to figure another approach
<Laney> means 20.04.3 in the silo isn't 20.04.3 right?
<Trevinho> Laney: no, I noticed late...
<Laney> k, so I guess not today then
<Trevinho> Laney: if you wait a second I rebuild the silo
<Trevinho> and push without that yaru
<Trevinho> I knew I had to use ~wip there too -_-
<Laney> use 3983
<Laney> the silo was already dead because you burned the version for mutter
<Laney> now that one is dead too because of yaru
<Trevinho> Laney: ok, well in such cases I just abandon and rebuild and re-upload (or copy if in time)
<Laney> right
<Laney> I was fetching the things out and re-uploading them
<Trevinho> Laney: I wa looking at the changelog changes you pushed to salsa, and it's weird... Since i was sure I had pushed last night a version with bugs fixed as well, while it seems I forgot, but I had done the same alredy :(
<Trevinho> anyways...
<Laney> I got Daniel to do that so we could know it was right ;-)
<Laney> oh well
<Trevinho> ah damn it.... I didn't push indeed https://gitlab.gnome.org/Teams/Design/os-mockups
<Trevinho> ouch
<Trevinho> https://paste.ubuntu.com/p/h3RyWk3GJS/
<Trevinho> so yeah, was right :D
<Laney> Probably going to copy Fedora for Shell and do https://src.fedoraproject.org/rpms/gnome-shell/c/2563211c08a75a21842793a6e3879c93a335e6b0?branch=master
<hellsworth> oSoMoN: I've shared a google drive folder with you that contains all of the LO 6.4.2 build artifacts for focal. when you get a chance, please upload the necessary pieces to proposed.
<oSoMoN> hellsworth, will do shortly
<hellsworth> oSoMoN: thanks
<bigon> RAOF: hey, I'm preparing a few changes for colord, is it that fine for you if I'm pushing them git and then uploading it to debian?
<oSoMoN> hellsworth, looking at the debdiff, in debian/rules, is this intentional?
<oSoMoN> -USE_GIT_TARBALLS=n
<oSoMoN> +USE_GIT_TARBALLS=y
<hellsworth> no
<hellsworth>  i fixed that locally (changed it back to n) and am rebuilding with debuild -S -sd
<hellsworth> sorry
<oSoMoN> hellsworth, also, it would be interesting to generate the *source.changes file using the -v switch to include all the changelog entries since the last version in focal
<hellsworth> is that -v flag to debuild?
<oSoMoN> IIRC, yes
<oSoMoN> that's dpkg-genchanges -v, and IÂ think debuild dispatches it correctly to dpkg-genchanges
<hellsworth> ok thanks. i started a debuild -S -sd -v locally
<oSoMoN> cheers
<tkamppeter> Is there a way to make bug 1863239 an rls bug for focal?
<ubot5> bug 1863239 in libmtp (Ubuntu) "/dev/bus/usb/*/* device file of HP multi-function printer assigned to "audio" group" [Critical,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1863239
<tkamppeter> It makes most HP printers not printing when on USB.
<bigon> https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=954013 << an idea for this?
<ubot5> Debian bug 954013 in evince "evince: Opening external URL failed: blocked by AppArmor: Failed to execute child process /bin/sh" [Normal,Open]
<hellsworth> oSoMoN: seems that -v in debuild is for version and causes debuild -S -sd -v to fail
<hellsworth> -v is version also to dpkg-genchanges
<hellsworth> retrying with jsut debuild -S -sd
<oSoMoN> hellsworth, yeah, you need to explicitly specify a version
<oSoMoN> see the man page for dpkg-genchanges
<hellsworth> hmm ok thanks
<ricotz> hellsworth, I noticed an issue :\
<hellsworth> tell me
<ricotz> it is an unwanted debian change
<ricotz> regarding boost and mdds
<hellsworth> i didn't see any problem with building or running libreoffice...
<ricotz> hellsworth, I might lead to mdds being demoted to universe
<hellsworth> oh perhaps this is bad because debian is now using an internal mdds and we need to use the mdds that's in main
<hellsworth> right
<hellsworth> ok
<hellsworth> good catch
<ricotz> hellsworth, I can push the required change
<hellsworth> sure ricotz please do
<hellsworth> and thanks
<ricotz> hellsworth, done
<hellsworth> thanks
<hellsworth> i'm going to err on the side of caution and build this in my ppa and rerun autopkgtests before requesting it to be uploaded to proposed
<hellsworth> unless ricotz you think that's unwarranted
<hellsworth> I will at least build a ~ppa2 in hellsworth:libreoffice and install/test
<ricotz> hellsworth, yeah, do that
<oSoMoN> good night all
<jdstrand> bigon: add this to the evince profile: /bin/{b,d}ash ixr,
<jdstrand> bigon: actually, /bin/{,ba,da}sh ixr,
<robert_ancell> popey, https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/snap-interface-metadata-i-e-descriptions/16077 in case you didn't see it.
<robert_ancell> Do desktop snaps need both the pulseaudio and audio-playback interfaces connected? I noticed audacity has both, which looks confusing in settings.
<jdstrand> robert_ancell: no, pulseaudio is deprecated
<robert_ancell> jdstrand, ah, good.
<jdstrand> robert_ancell: it doesn't auto-connect any more (with new enough snapd)
<jdstrand> robert_ancell: unless we grandfathered the snap
<robert_ancell> jdstrand, so it would probably make sense to add it to the blacklist in the UI?
<jdstrand> robert_ancell: we grandfathered snaps that only plugged pulseaudio so as not to break them and force a flag day to move to audio-playback
<jdstrand> robert_ancell: considering the number of grandfathered snaps, it probably makes sense to only show pulseaudio if audio-playback is not preset
<jdstrand> present*
<robert_ancell> jdstrand, ok.
<robert_ancell> Thanks!
<jdstrand> np
<robert_ancell> jdstrand, is there an easy way to work out which interfaces are deprecated?
<jdstrand> robert_ancell: that won't fix the situation where a grandfathered snap decided to add audio-playback but not remove pulseaudio, in which case both show. if someone wanted to remove audio capabilities from the snap, they'd have to both be shown, but yes, to your point, it is a bit weird having both (but that is what the snap actually has)
<robert_ancell> jdstrand, oh, so if you disable audio-playback but have pulseaudio connected then you'll get sound? In that case we'll have to show both.
<jdstrand> robert_ancell: I'm not sure if it is worth adding a 'deprecated' label in a strategic location or not. that might help the ui...
<jdstrand> robert_ancell: yes
<robert_ancell> jdstrand, I was asking specifically so I know the list of interfaces that need labels, and not waste time on deprecated ones. But more metadata is always useful.
<jdstrand> robert_ancell: but if a snap plugged both, you could, conceivably, only show audio-playback if pulseaudio is disconnected. the more we chat, the more the 'deprecated' label might make sense :)
<jdstrand> but I'll leave that up to you :)
<robert_ancell> I think I'll propose a deprecated label PR, because that seems an easy add.
<jdstrand> robert_ancell: for more context, pulseaudio actually grants playback and record on (iirc) < disco
<jdstrand> not that you need to necessarily express that
<jdstrand> robert_ancell: as for working out which interfaces are deprecated: no. this is the only one atm and we didn't add anything for querying what is deprecated
<robert_ancell> oh, I thought there were more.
<robert_ancell> There's been some that have been removed, right?
<jdstrand> robert_ancell: well, now that you mention it, I might have used that term in a google doc, but this is the only one like pulseaudio where it moved from auto-connected to manual connected
<jdstrand> robert_ancell: you might be thinking of a spreadsheet that talked about the interfaces?
<robert_ancell> jdstrand, yeah, that's what I've been looking at, but it's out of date and I was wondering if there was a better source of information.
<jdstrand> robert_ancell: no interfaces have been removed. pulseaudio went from auto to manual connect, and network-status was totally rewritten. everything else has just been modified in normal maintenance-y ways
<robert_ancell> ok
<robert_ancell> jdstrand, Do you want to add some new labels to that spreadsheet? I asked for edit access from mpt but haven't got it yet.
<jdstrand> robert_ancell: right, so in terms of that doc, sure, the unity8 interfaces could be considered deprecated for your ui (they are still alive in the store reviews and snapd though)
<jdstrand> robert_ancell: I can review that spreadsheet again, sure
<robert_ancell> jdstrand, ta
<robert_ancell> jdstrand, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-control-center/+bug/1867598 lists the interfaces we don't have labels for.
<ubot5> Ubuntu bug 1867598 in gnome-control-center (Ubuntu) "Inconsistency in naming of "Permissions & Access"" [High,Triaged]
<jdstrand> robert_ancell: Snap interfaces GUI descriptions?
<robert_ancell> jdstrand, yep
<jdstrand> robert_ancell: I have only comment access to the spreadsheet myself. perhaps the way to go is you obtain the edit access, add the missing things from your forum post, then I come in and add comments
<robert_ancell> jdstrand, ok, I'll let you know when I get that.
<robert_ancell> Thanks again.
<jdstrand> thanks
<jdstrand> robert_ancell: I don't think anyone has capacity to implement what I suggested in the forum topic in the next several weeks, so the spreadsheet is as good a place as any to coordinate until such time
<jdstrand> it might still make sense after, I'll let mpt decide on that :)
<RAOF> bigon: absolutely! colord is in the Debian group for a reason ð.
<ricotz> hellsworth, please enable -proposed in your PPA
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, did you make the snap-store-3-36 branch intentionally? Upstream still hasn't made a 3.36 branch so just snap-store is still 3.36
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, is the snap-store-packagekit branch now obsolete?
<kenvandine> yes it is
<kenvandine> you made the snap-store-3-36 branch in frankfurt
#ubuntu-desktop 2020-03-20
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, now I'm confused - what version is the snap-store branch supposed to be on?
<kenvandine> robert_ancell: snap-store branch is 3.34.x
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, can you force push your branch to snap-store? I stuffed it up and rebased that one.
<kenvandine> Sure
<kenvandine> the goal is to stabilize what's on snap-store-3-36 and then push that to snap-store, but not until it doesn't crash :)
<kenvandine> robert_ancell: i force pushed the snap-stsore branch
<robert_ancell> kenvandine, thanks. Should be all good now. snap-store-3-36 is rebased.
<kenvandine> thanks
<oSoMoN> good morning desktoppers
<duflu> Morning oSoMoN
<oSoMoN> hey duflu
<sa-ghosts> any news on the Xorg crash in 20.04 ?
<duflu> sa-ghosts, please tell us the bug ID, or create one by running 'ubuntu-bug xorg'
<sa-ghosts> it's already reported
<duflu> sa-ghosts, yes there are thousands of them, so which one do you mean?
<duflu> Any more details?
<sa-ghosts> yup, can't login to xorg session
<duflu> Again there are plenty of those
<sa-ghosts> I have to use wayland (in VM)
<duflu> sa-ghosts, I think I can guess based on your comments so far. Let me see
<sa-ghosts> give me 5 min I will give you a link
<duflu> sa-ghosts, sounds like maybe bug 1864644
<ubot5> bug 1864644 in systemd (Ubuntu Focal) "I get logged out immediately after login to an X session (QXL Xorg driver on kernel 5.4)" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1864644
<duflu> If you would like updates for any bug you can subscribe to each one
<sa-ghosts> bug 1796437
<ubot5> bug 1745345 in xorg-server (Ubuntu) "duplicate for #1796437 Xorg assert failure: Xorg: /usr/include/xorg/privates.h:122: dixGetPrivateAddr: Assertion `key->initialized' failed." [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1745345
<didrocks> good morning
<duflu> sa-ghosts, looks like there's no news, and nobody working on it :(
<duflu> Morning didrocks
<jibel> morning all
<duflu> Morning jibel
<tjaalton> sa-ghosts: is this with vbox?
<didrocks> hey duflu, jibel
<duflu> sa-ghosts, meet the Ubuntu Xorg maintainer :)
<tjaalton> though it sounds like the systemd fixes would be needed
<tjaalton> the assert is just misleading
<oSoMoN> salut didrocks, jibel
<didrocks> oSoMoN: salut. Ã§a va ?
<duflu> tjaalton, the original bug isn't a VM though. You're saying most cases of it would be?
<duflu> Ah yes. Three of the duplicates are VMs
<tjaalton> it's possible to hit the race with native hw
<tjaalton> though seems uncommon these days
<duflu> Because virtual hardware is faster at something?
<tjaalton> probably
<duflu> I remember that used to be true for Windows VMs, when I used them many years ago. VMs actually did some things faster
<tjaalton> they have less hw to probe, so the boot process is quicker?
<duflu> Even same hardware, just less laggy than the silicon implementations in some areas
<tjaalton> Laney: any hope to get systemd fixes for 1864644 in focal, or a ppa maybe?
<duflu> I meant bug 1745345
<ubot5> bug 1745345 in xorg-server (Ubuntu) "Xorg assert failure: Xorg: /usr/include/xorg/privates.h:122: dixGetPrivateAddr: Assertion `key->initialized' failed." [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1745345
<tjaalton> yes, and this should fix that
<oSoMoN> didrocks, bien, et toi?
<didrocks> oSoMoN: Ã§a va :)
<ricotz> good morning desktopers!
<oSoMoN> good morning ricotz
<ricotz> oSoMoN, hey
<jamesh> morning
<oSoMoN> hey jamesh
<ricotz> could someone approve vala 0.40.19 which sits in the bionic/queue?
<didrocks> hey ricotz, jamesh
<bigon> 21:33 < jdstrand> bigon: actually, /bin/{,ba,da}sh ixr, << the thing is that ubuntu has the same profile, so I'm surprised you don't have that too
<ricotz> didrocks, hi
<seb128> good morning desktopers!
<oSoMoN> salut seb128, Ã§a va?
<seb128> oSoMoN, lut, ouais! et toi en forme ?
<oSoMoN> seb128, la forme :)
<duflu> Morning seb128
<duflu> seb128, I am trying to switch to any non-spinner theme for comparison but just get a black screen. What am I missing?
<duflu> Oh the black screen was partly a successful boot to the wrong VT
<duflu> Still no useful plymouth theme
<duflu> seb128, nevermind. Just force reinstalling plymouth-theme-ubuntu-logo fixed it up.
<duflu> Meaning there's something missing from the spinner uninstall process
<seb128> duflu, hey. Ok, I will look at that problem, probably the alternative didn't get restored properly or something
<duflu> Yes I saw a message about that during the reinstall
<Laney> hey ho
<Laney> tjaalton: foundations (probably rbalin_t) are handling that one
<tjaalton> Laney: ok, I'll poke him
<oSoMoN> good morning Laney
<duflu> Hi Laney
<didrocks> hey hey Laney
<Laney> hey oSoMoN duflu didrocks!
<rbalint> tjaalton, Laney i'm waiting for ubuntu-release approval for LP: #1867972
<ubot5> Launchpad bug 1867972 in systemd (Ubuntu) "[FFe] Please accept systemd 245.2-1ubuntu1 to Focal" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1867972
<rbalint> to bring the fix in
<rbalint> Laney, vorlon handled the ffe, but he is sleeping now, could you maybe give the green light?
<tjaalton> rbalint: nice :)
<rbalint> Laney, also please do highlight me, so i can see what is going on when i connect to the bouncer
<Laney> rbalint: I'd rather not as Steve will have done a review that I've not done yet --- but you could upload a final build to a silo and then ask the approving release team member (vorlon) to hit 'publish' for you at the same time.
<rbalint> Laney, ok, that helps a bit with the publishing speed indeed
<rbalint> Laney, also is there an autopkgtest that checks packages installed on zfs as root?
<rbalint> Laney, arch users experienced issues with zfs and systemd 245 https://github.com/systemd/systemd/issues/15070
<gitbot> systemd issue 15070 in systemd "[Arch Linux | systemd 245-1 & 245-2 | ZFS on root] System no longer boots - "Caught <ABRT>, dumped core as pid / Freezing execution"" [Needs-Reporter-Feedback â, Regression â ï¸, Open]
<rbalint> Laney, i've tested systemd 245 with zfs as root manually, but i'd prefer not hittins similar issues later either
<Laney> rbalint: Not sure, would be something zfs-ish if anything
<Laney> Maybe didrocks or jibel could help you
<jibel> rbalint, comments in the report says they have the same issue with etx4, so unrelated to zfs
<rbalint> jibel, true, i'm still wondering if we could have a test with zfs
<Laney> http://appstream.staging.ubuntu.com/ now with 100% snaps
<jphilips> hi all. i'm part xubuntu team and wanted to coordinate a joint marketing and bug hunting session for all the flavors. I'm bringing together all my thoughts of it in the google doc below, which all are welcome to comment and contribute to.
<jphilips> https://docs.google.com/document/d/1r-EiIhfTILuAleEixu1dhLZTOKFah7WyfRE2CVMHFag/edit#
<popey> welcome jphilips :)
<jphilips> jibel: popey left you should be informed of this as the QA lead ^^^
<jphilips> felt* you
<jibel> jphilips, thank you, I'll read your doc.
<jdstrand> bigon: Ubuntu has the same issue and just hasn't fixed it yet
<seb128> Laney, great, nice job :-)
<jphilips> does anyone know how to set this up, so we can bridge between the irc and telgram channels for the bug hunting session - https://github.com/42wim/matterbridge
<ahasenack> hi, anybody else had the mouse buttons stop working today?
<ahasenack> whenever I click, the cursor just moves a few pixels to the right
<ahasenack> tap-to-click (touchpad) still works
<ahasenack> but no middle or right click with that
<tjaalton> any idea why the nextcloud client uses wrong theming with the dock icon? it shows the colored icon when it should be b/w
<tjaalton> and now with latest updates looks streched, so even uglier :)
<tjaalton> oh, it's behind a config toggle
<bigon> jdstrand: oh ok
<hellsworth> good morning desktopers
<oSoMoN> hey hellsworth
<hellsworth> hi oSoMoN , it will be a bit on the new LO release. need to test the new ppa pkg. so maybe monday
<oSoMoN> hellsworth, no worries, just ping me with the source package whenever it's ready
<hellsworth> will do
<Eickmeyer> Hi all! I've got some very pressing issues in ubiquity that need to be taken care of. At first I had bug 1851346 back in December, but now bug 1868191 has popped up and they're both related to the manual package selection for Ubuntu Studio.
<ubot5> bug 1851346 in ubiquity (Ubuntu Focal) "Ubuntu Studio 19.10 Installer Causes Wanted Programs to be Removed" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1851346
<ubot5> bug 1868191 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "Unchecking all optional media apps, install fails" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1868191
<Eickmeyer> I see two solutions for this: 1) we fix the problem (preferable) or 2) we disable the package selection altogether.
<Eickmeyer> Either way, I don't want these bugs landing in an LTS, and I don't have the know-how to fix them.
<Eickmeyer> #ubuntu-devel has been largely unresponsive on this front.
<ogra> hmm ... has anyone seen the display flip upside down on the splash screen before ? i had two boots in qemu today where that happened (spinner gone, logo upside down at the top of the screen)
<seb128> ogra, never saw that
<seb128> Eickmeyer, try pinged bdmurray maybe? ubiquity is maintained by foundations
<seb128> Eickmeyer, I doubt we are the resources here atm to deal with those issues
<Eickmeyer> seb128: Just tried it, we'll see what happens. I've been referred here in the past for ubiquity issues.
<oSoMoN> ogra, IÂ seem to remember duflu mentioned something like that in Frankfurt
<seb128> Eickmeyer, foundations owns it even if they are trying to tell people they are not, also we do look at issue in the frontend but images building and packages handling is their something they look at usually
<Eickmeyer> seb128: So, basically, they need to start owning stuff they own. :)
<seb128> Eickmeyer, bdmurray's reply seems positive on that front :)
<Eickmeyer> seb128: Thanks, it does seem to be that way. :)
<ogra> well, i sadly cant reproduce it reliably now
<tjaalton> uh, anyone got a bt headset to work with focal?
<tjaalton> getting audio to it seems quite hard
<tjaalton> system sounds yes, but everything else goes to the speakers
<tjaalton> including the sound test
<seb128> tjaalton, is that similar to bug #1866194 ?
<ubot5> bug 1866194 in pulseaudio (Ubuntu) "[Zoom USB audio on Dell Inspiron 7370] shows up in the sound output options but the sound keeps being emitted from the internal laptop speaker" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1866194
<tjaalton> seb128: sure does, thanks
<Laney> oh that got unassigned, how lovely
<tjaalton> I can poke hwang4 about it, if he has some ideas
<seb128> tjaalton, would be nice to report upstream if you can
<tjaalton> seb128: yeah, I'll do that next week
<seb128> thx
<tjaalton> I've had this with eoan too, but I don't usually use a bt headset, so kinda forgot about it
<tjaalton> there was a trick that changing the output profile made it work, or something
<tjaalton> now that doesn't help either
<oSoMoN> good night and good week-end all
#ubuntu-desktop 2020-03-21
<nael_n> Hi guys, a few weeks ago, following the decision to ship gnome-software as a snap app rather than an APT package, and ship gnome-{calculator,logs,characters} as APT packages rather than snap apps, regularly updating my 20.04 system left me with two versions of those applications, in other words two Calculator, two Logs, two Characters: the snap
<nael_n> version and the APT version. This is still the case, and we are past UserInterfaceFreeze. Is it normal? lotuspsychje in #ubuntu+1 reports that a fresh install of 20.04 only features the APT versions of those applications.
<nael_n> Also, I still don't have the Snap Store, and still have the APT gnome-software, is it normal? Am I supposed to do something else that the regular apt update/full-upgrade to keep my 20.04 system up-to-date?
<nael_n> I'm asking here because they're all GNOME applications, hopefully I'm in the right channel
