#ubuntu-motu 2005-04-11
<\sh> acroread is not working btw
<ogra> which one ? from multiverse ?
<\sh> the one with 2 packages
<ogra> \sh see topic ;) use malone
<\sh> jedit is also not working
<\sh> hoah...i can't file bugs for 2 distros at the time ;)
<\sh> tomorrow morning u will have your bugreports
<\sh> aehm this morning i mean...10 o'clock ;)
<ogra> \sh, about time that gentoo uses malone too ;) the you can do both in a row
<ogra> then even
<\sh> ogra: don't take my wanna have job away ;) i'd applied for the bugzilla infra monkey job ;)
<\sh> before i bashed drobbins
<ogra> yeah, time to bring some fresh wind into gentoo and exchange the bug reporting tool :)
<\sh> :)))
<\sh> so time to go to bed...
<ogra> nigh \sh
<ogra> t
<\sh> this day will be hard...tomorrow will be even harder...and in the evening php ug meeting in cologne
<ogra> ah, php, i'm just discovering python for cgi and must admit its great :)
<\sh> and on saturday...ian will move to his new flat and i have to help him :)
<\sh> ogra: hehe....i'm playing with python+pygtk+xmpppy+glade2 ;) quite interessting
<\sh> and at the same time with mono
* \sh is on SM
<ogra> hehe
<\sh> and readin dvb specs i must be crazy...so ppls...have a good night...don't push your luck :) never change a running system :) over and out
<Riddell> Reviewers wanted for abakus http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/MOTUNewPackages
<Riddell> MOTUNewPackages has two tables and I wasn't sure which to add it to, so I added to both :)
<diamond> nite all.
<koke> night
<schweeb> ruh roh
<schweeb> 2 hardlocks in a row
<schweeb> now so good
* dredg thinks he has modconf playing nice
<schweeb> cool
<schweeb> s/now/not/
<dredg> well, specifically it now automatically untars the kernel source.
<schweeb> hehe
<dredg> and it looks for ubuntu kernels (linux-source as opposed to kernel-source )
<dholbach> goooood morning
<schweeb> mornin
<tseng> anyone have a cdbs package with multiple binaries?
<jbailey> tseng: I do. =)
<ogra> hal
<schweeb> dbus
<tseng> thanks ogra
<tseng> did everyone read my mail?
<jbailey> Feh, you guys ruin all the fun.  Providing answers so easily like that.  Sheesh. =)
<ogra> heh
<schweeb> dholbach: you must have slept well, you sound pretty chipper
<schweeb> isn't it like 5am there?
<tseng> hm that doesnt answer my question much
<tseng> i guess i need to include autotools
<tseng> i thought debhelper.mk was enough to build the package
<tseng> schweeb: dholbach rocks 24/7
<schweeb> I think debhelper.mk just calls make... not sure though
<schweeb> I always just look at the source for them to figure it out
<tseng> i just blame jb	
<tseng> jbailey.
<schweeb> hehe
<dholbach> schweeb: had a terrible headache and went to bed at 22:00
<jbailey> tseng: Nah, debhelper is just the packaging run.
<schweeb> ahh
<dholbach> schweeb: woke up half an hour ago and only thought about apt-get.org and tritium's krecipes package... so here i am :-)
<jbailey> tseng: It assumes that everything you need has already been placed in debian/tmp or debian/FOO where FOO is one of the packages.
* tseng nods
<tseng> its much happier with autotools
<schweeb> dholbach: the list is about 50 entries lighter after my cleaning out earlier :)
<dholbach> schweeb: i read the wiki changes... WOW... i'm really really impressed :-)
<schweeb> hehe
<dholbach> schweeb: will have a closer look once i had a coffee :-)
<schweeb> although I heard test is being reloaded, so we may be able to regenerate a list from scratch
<schweeb> (after most of the builds are done)
<dholbach> we'll hopefully have a QA tool at some stage
<schweeb> yea, that would be hot
<tseng> qa++
<schweeb> are all the sources for that stuff publicly available from debian?
<dholbach> where i can see WHAT transitions a package is in, WHICH build logs are available, links to malone, ...
<tseng> schweeb: DFSG, dude.
<schweeb> then why don't we have packages.u.c !
<tseng> we do.
<schweeb> yea, but through that other dude :)
<tseng> so?
<tseng> his site is fine.
<schweeb> is packages.u.c was a CNAME to it, I'd be happier
<tseng> meh.
<schweeb> the other domain is hard to remember
<tseng> bookmarks.
<tseng> and to your next commend
<tseng> del.icio.us
<schweeb> my bookmarks get way too cluttered
<tseng> s/d/t
<schweeb> I'm not very good at filing bookmarks :)
<tseng> ogra: dude, this package for mono is 38219 time cleaner
<tseng> ogra: lets hope it produces a working binary :P
<schweeb> lol
<ogra> go tsen go
<tseng> the rules is like 10 lines
<tseng> and build-deps are super clean
<schweeb> how are you building it?  the Novell 2 package method, or using the standard debian package layout?
<tseng> novell
<schweeb> nice.
<Burgundavia> are we going to ship novell or debian style packages in hoary?
<ogra> Burgundavia, lets see, we wait on input from the main team
<schweeb> maybe neither :)
<Burgundavia> ahhh
<ogra> schweeb, bah
<Burgundavia> I want my blam and muine
<schweeb> well, maybe neither for 1.1.5
<tseng> they work fine
<tseng> already.
<tseng> the only thing being a bitch is beagle
<schweeb> Burgundavia: this version is for beagle
<Burgundavia> schweeb: ah
<dholbach> *ARG* why does murray break bakery's API every release
<dholbach> nobody can be THAT bored
<Burgundavia> yes they can
<schweeb> ogra: waiting for the debian mono team would be about as productive as when we had to wait for Branden for XF86 4.3 in Sid
<schweeb> when daniels had perfectly good packages for nearly the entire time :)
<ogra> i dont wait for the debian mono team :-P
<tseng> schweeb: HAHHA
<tseng> nice analogy
<schweeb> and look... still no Xorg... gooo Branden!
<tseng> BRANDEN FOR DPL
<schweeb> DPL my ass.
<tseng> LEGITIMIZE USER ABUSE
<tseng> it must be a joke
<schweeb> amayita started a frigging Branden fan club @_@
* schweeb stops bitching
<dholbach> hrm... at least i now manage to write shlibs files without looking it up before :-p
<schweeb> I thought dh_makeshlibs was the preferred way to make shlibs files?
<tseng> amaya is weird
<schweeb> indeed.
* dholbach pipes innocently
<dholbach> schweeb: well, i manage them now myself... even blindfolded ;-)
<schweeb> heh
<tseng> ogra: hm i wonder how this will affect upgraders
<tseng> ogra: about changing the mono names around
<tseng> like do they have to purge the old stuff by hand
<schweeb> yea
<schweeb> I'm wondering about the build-deps for mono stuff too
<tseng> well the build-deps will all need to change
<tseng> and be rebuilt
<schweeb> fun fun
<tseng> quite.
<schweeb> (or not)
<tseng> but
<tseng> it will come out cleaner
<tseng> look at a mono package now
<schweeb> mono-mint [!i386 !ppc] 
<schweeb> etc...
<tseng> its like mono-gac, mono-mcs, mono-common, [!x86]  mono-mint
<tseng> blah blah
<tseng> so gross
<tseng> now it could be.. mono-devel
<tseng> i would like that.
<tseng> i mean, i dont see a good reason to split up the compiler and the devel libs into their own packages
<tseng> you need both to build
<tseng> f*ck yeah make install
<tseng> passing with --with-tls=__thread
<schweeb> it built?
<tseng> mono yes, package no
<schweeb> ah
<tseng> thats about 3 steps ahead
<ogra> night guys
<tseng> bye ogra
<schweeb> night
<dholbach> sleep tight ogra
* schweeb tries to muster the energy to get something accomplished
<dholbach> now... after some *mm fun... now some apt-get.org fun ;-)
<schweeb> heh
<dholbach> tseng: still there?
<dholbach> tseng: how do i have to intepret the classification:  '' Packages below this point are only verified to have an active source repo, no guarantees on QA ''' -- BranonHale   ?
<dholbach> how did you check those?
<dholbach> ah ok... forget it... :-)
<Jerub> hi!
<schweeb> howdy, Jerub
<Jerub> I filed a but against a universe pacakge in the ubuntu tasktracker, they said to talk to you guys because you guys are the masters of the universe
<Jerub> openafs-modules-source sucks, it doesn't build against 2.6 kernels
<Jerub> its at version 1.2.13-1, when upstream is at 1.3.80
<Jerub> and needless to say, ubuntu doesn't even have a binary 2.4 kernel, so it's all just a bit of a bad situation.
<schweeb> in a few days we'll be going through and fixing all the kernel related stuff in universe
<dholbach> Jerub: does debian have a more recent openafs-modules-source?
<Jerub> dholbach: don't know. don't have an active debian machine, checking the website.
<dholbach> thanks
<Jerub> yes
<Jerub> 1.3.74-1 is in experimental
<dholbach> would it satisfy your needs?
<Jerub> 1.2.3final2-6 in stable, 1.2.13-1 in testing+unstable
<dholbach> would it work with one of our 2.6 kernel?
<schweeb> heh, stable is worthless to even mention :P
<dholbach> Jerub: if you were able to find out, we'd fix the issue in a couple of hours... packaging a more recent version would take more time
<schweeb> stable was old when I started using Debian, and that was over 2 years ago
<Jerub> schweeb: Sorry dude. I remember when people were advised not to apt-get upgrade to slink ...
<schweeb> heh
<Jerub> I'll see what I can do.
<schweeb> is slink < potato ?
<dholbach> Jerub: that would rock
<dholbach> schweeb: yes
<schweeb> I installed deb in 97, but could never get X working
<schweeb> not to mention dselect was a turnoff.
<dholbach> ha... yes
<Jerub> bugger
<Jerub> the other guy already reinstalled fedora on that box.
<dholbach> i was lynx-ing around for a nice X configuration
* ajmitch is a debian n00b
<dholbach> ajmitch: but you're a DD today :-)
<ajmitch> dholbach: sure, but I've only been using debian since 2000 ;)
<schweeb> been pretty steadily usin linux since 97, with only a couple of lulls
* ajmitch also
<ajmitch> except I started with a slackware-based distro, then mandrake
* ajmitch is quickly going OT
<schweeb> slack for a few, then RH (4.2 I think)
<ajmitch> everyone back to work!
<Jerub> I've been 100% linux since I started university in around 2000
<schweeb> lol, ajmitch
<Jerub> ahh
<Jerub> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/pkgreport.cgi?pkg=openafs-modules-source <- this doesn't look happy
<Jerub> :(
<Jerub> why is file sharing in linux so hard?
<Jerub> we're seriously considering samba.
<schweeb> isn't AFS in the kernel now?
<dholbach> /lib/modules/2.6.10-5-amd64-k8/kernel/fs/afs/kafs.ko, but *shrug*
<schweeb> that's what I thought
<schweeb> 2.6 merged in a lot of goodies
<Jerub> oh bugger.
<Jerub> now I feel silly.
<dholbach> and a lot of crack ;-)
<schweeb> yea, it's got its share of crack
* schweeb eyes reiser4
<schweeb> ;)
<dholbach> hey Treenaks
<dholbach> hey tritium
<dholbach> *argl*
<tritium> hey dholbach
<tritium> what's up?
<dholbach> fighting apt-get.org
<dholbach> but i'm fine
<tritium> oh...
<dholbach> woke up at 03:30 this morning and had an idea for krecipes package :-)
<tritium> you did?  what?
<Treenaks> dholbach: hi :)
<dholbach> hey Treenaks
<dholbach> tritium: it's a bit braindead... but you could split the libraries into a libkrecipes package and krecipes could depend on it
<dholbach> tritium: then you'd add a libkrecipes.shlibs and you'd be set
* ajmitch looks to see if there's anything left he can work on ;)
<tritium> hmm, okay.  I'll look into that.
<dholbach> tritium: it's a bit overkill, but it'd perfect :-)
<Jerub> (oh, btw, I still have no idea if kafs.ko will do what I want, I'll get back to you folks about it later.
<dholbach> Jerub: nice you're investigating
<tritium> dholbach, okay.  I will try it.  At this point, I shouldn't be trying to get it into Hoary, though, right?
<tritium> Or should I bust my butt to make the change ASAP?
<dholbach> tritium: if you fix it, i'll make sure you get your 3 reviewers
<dholbach> tritium: take your time... release is due april, 8th :-)
<tritium> dholbach, thanks :)
<tritium> Okay, I'll work it out first thing tomorrow morning.
<tritium> dholbach, any thoughts on the other packages?
<dholbach> tritium: apart from libkrecipes.{install,files,dirs} and Depends: libkrecipes (= ${Source-version}) you'll need this one: http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-sharedlibs.html#s-sharedlibs-shlibdeps
<dholbach> other packages?
<tritium> python-matplotlib, gourmet, python-rtf
<dholbach> i didnt review those as thorougly
<tritium> ok, just checking
<tritium> no lintian warnings on them :)
<dholbach> but you should push the others towards it, when they just keep on talking in the channel ;-))
<tritium> Okay, I'll do that.
<dholbach> gooood
* tritium saves notes on krecipes changes...
* Burgundavia is away: I'm busy
<tritium> ajmitch, would you please take another look at python-matplotlib for me?  If you could also review gourmet and python-rtf, I'd appreciate it greatly.
* Burgundavia is back (gone 00:27:24)
<tritium> dholbach, take care.   I'll talk to you tomorrow.
<dholbach> ok... bye tritium
* tritium waves, and wishes dholbach luck
<i3dmaster> dpkg -S /etc/inittab could not find which package this file is from. How to find out?
<dholbach> bbl
<Burgundavia> salut mark
<Burgundavia> geppy, there is currently a lack of real motus here
<Burgundavia> but if you have webspace, put it up there and then add the package to http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/MOTUNewPackages
<sabdfl> hi Burgundavia
<geppy> Burgundavia: Thanks!
<crimsun> wb sabdfl
<sabdfl> hiya
<GheRivero> res people
<Treenaks> hey ghe
<crimsun> hey :)
<crimsun> hmm, interesting.  dpkg in experimental has a logging option.
<Treenaks> logging?
<crimsun> yeah, it spat something at me when I upgraded earlier
<crimsun> the option is commented out by default
<GheRivero> logging? what kind of logging?
<crimsun> # Log status changes and actions to a file.
<Treenaks> nice!
<GheRivero> cool
<dholbach> hey koke, Burgundavia_
<crimsun> morning, dholbach
<koke> morning all!
<dholbach> hey crimsun
<koke> I can't upload yet :(
<dholbach> my head was nearly exploding, so i left again
* dredg yawns
<dredg> damn daylight savings time hurts my brain
<Treenaks> dredg: not only yours
<dredg> ould someone check out modconf for me? i have no idea if i approached it the right way...
<dredg> could*
<dredg> no rush.
<dredg> i should really stop doing things at 3am
<Treenaks> what's wrong with hotplug? :P
<dholbach> Treenaks: we need it for those kernel 2.4 folks
<Treenaks> dholbach: they still exist?
<dholbach> and it's on the doesnotbuild list
<dredg> Treenaks: right, so you want modconf removed from the archive. i concur ;)
<dholbach> Treenaks: schweeb and i will make sure they're in place before release
<Treenaks> dholbach: what? 2.4 people?
<dholbach> and DON'T argue with me, it's not my decision i don't need no 2.4 kernel
* Treenaks thinks the only valid reason to be running 2.4 is a) you're running woody or b) you're certifiably insane
<dredg> or you have a specific need for it
<Treenaks> dredg: port that need :)
<dholbach> Treenaks: tell that fabbione
<dredg> Treenaks: hmm. you do it for me. i won't pay you but i'll be grateful
<dredg> :)
<tseng> jbailey: ping.
<dholbach> hey tseng
<tseng> hi
<tseng> i need to know, if i make a cdbs package
<tseng> and put:
<tseng>  export MAKEOPTS="-j1"
<tseng> above my includes if it will actually affect the build
<tseng> i dont see cdbs setting makeopts anywhere
<tseng> so i guess it should.
<tseng> (the build breaks presumably with higher -j)
<tseng> thats funny, some guy gave me hell for using a congigure option that breaks my build, tells me to fix the bug
<tseng> so i start asking him questions about the bug, he disappeared
<crimsun> purely coincidence, I'm sure :p
<tseng> yep.
<crimsun> morning ogra
<ogra> morning
<diamond> morning.
<dholbach> hye diamond
<crimsun> morning
<dholbach> diamond: you've been fairly busy on the PriorityList yesterday... well done :-)
<diamond> dholbach: thank you -)
<encolpe> For zope and zope products packager, we have reopen #pkg-zope
<diamond> ah. i see dredg got modconf to build. kick ass.
<dholbach> python ROCKS
<dholbach> i'm amazed
<dholbach> again... :-)
<encolpe> :)
<crimsun> (and python 2.4.1 is in :)
<encolpe> dholbach: do you want to rewrite emacs in python ?
<dholbach> encolpe: not exactly
<encolpe> :)
<ogra> hey bob2 welcome in the MOTU shag :)
<bob2> hehe, hey guys
<dholbach> hey bob2
<ogra> bob2 is here becaues we are looking for #ubuntu op's
<ogra> has anyone form the MOTU a desire to do that
<bob2> well, I was going to just say hi...
<ogra> ?
<ogra> or could suggest someone from his observations
<crimsun> I've suggested tritium, because I've noticed he helps out a lot
<ogra> crimsun, good idea....
<diamond> dredg: grats on modconf
<dredg> diamond: i did it at 3am ish. it could be the greatest peice of software on crack this side of erm, thing
* diamond grins
<dredg> so tired.
<dredg> easy afternoon though. meet 2 clients, install their servers, drive home
<dredg> diamond: what's paul helping you break? :)
<diamond> dredg: lxdoom
<dredg> oh. heh. good luck with that :)
<diamond> dredg: it's got some silly 32-bit assumptions, but i think i can fix'
<diamond> 'em
<tritium> Good morning!
<diamond> lo tritium
<tritium> Hey diamond :)
<dholbach> tritium: hey michael
<tritium> dholbach, hey Daniel :)
<tritium> dholbach, did you get any sleep?
<dholbach> tritium: yeah... feel better now... hacking some python script to ease the apt-get.org pain
<dholbach> :-)
<tritium> good!
<trulux> tritium: howdy!
<tritium> hi trulux :)
<diamond> when autoconf et al work, they're wonderful. when they don't, i cry.
<crimsun> autoconf makes me cry even when it does work
* diamond grins
<tritium> dholbach, diamond did an awesome job fixing up python-gnome, which I tried unsuccessfully to fix
<dholbach> tritium: yeah... he ROCKs... saw it yesterday in the wiki mails - i'm thoroughly impressed by what a COOL team we are
<dholbach> i'm so glad.. really
<tritium> me too!
<diamond> tritium: i learnt a lot more about how autoconf works in the process (coz i had no choice ,-))
<tritium> :)
<diamond> hum. config.sub in this package (lxdoom) is well out of date (1997). is it valid to replace it with, say, /usr/share/automake-1.7/config.sub?
<crimsun> b-d on autotools-dev
<dholbach> diamond: /usr/share/misc/config.*
<diamond> dholbach: right, thanks.
<crimsun> then in the clean target of debian/rules, copy config.{guess,sub} over
<diamond> crimsun: ahh. clever. cheers.
<crimsun> np
<tritium> good morning, crimsun, ogra
<crimsun> heya tritium :)
<ogra> hi tritium
<diamond> crimsun: out of interest, why 'clean:', rather than say 'build:'?
<diamond> crimsun: i'm guessing that dpkg-buildpackage will run clean before build/binary,
<diamond> crimsun: but for just manually running the build (via ./debian/rules build), would it make sense to have it in build: instead?
<diamond> (or maybe both?)
<crimsun> I've always put it in clean because other packages have done it that way, and that's done first in pbuilder and sbuild
<diamond> crimsun: right
<dholbach> diamond: clean is always run, even if you just create the source package and upload it :-)
<dholbach> (without test building)
<diamond> is it a good idea to put that into every package? or is there a good reason not to?
<crimsun> I only b-d on autotools-dev if I see that a package FTBFS due to outdated config.{guess,sub}
<diamond> crimsun: *nod*
<crimsun> it happens on amd64, mostly
<diamond> lucky me -)
<crimsun> for amd64, sometimes you have to explicitly b-d on automake1.7
<dholbach> there was no amd64 in 2001 :-)
<dholbach> it is a good idea... the only thing that keeps us from making those changes everywhere is integration in debian
<diamond> dholbach: k
<diamond> hum. dpkg-source: cannot represent change to depcomp: dpkg-source:  new version is symlink dpkg-source:  old version is nonexistent dpkg-source: unrepresentable changes to source
<diamond> automake -a added a symlink from depcomp to /usr/share/automake-1.7/depcomp
<crimsun> hmm, use -c
<crimsun> the auto* "love" just grows and grows
<diamond> hehe, aye
<crimsun> back in a bit, need coffee
<dholbach> can some python pro tell me how the right syntax for   print "bla %s blabla %s" : a, b    is?
<dholbach> : a, b    is clearly wrong
<dholbach> i don't find the stupid syntax anywhere
<Treenaks> dholbach: print "bla %s %s" % (a, b)
<dholbach> ah... thanks Treenaks
<diamond> dholbach: print "bla %s blabla %s" % (a, b)
<diamond> too late ,-)
<doko> dholbach: I'm unsure, if your "cleanup" to wxwindows2.4 is actually needed. did you (or other MOTU's) test applications depending on wx*python, wit both wx versions installed (2.4 and 2.5)?
<dholbach> doko: i just installed each and every wx* package after my "cleanup" (not the i18n ones)
<doko> yes, but as it looks, the "cleanup" isn't needed. I'm asking, because 2.4 is directly installed into site-packages, 2.5 in a subdirectory, which is added to sys.path with a wx.pth file.
<dholbach> doko: i'll have a look and see which files overlap now
<doko> dholbach: no, they don't overlap, the question is, if they work with both versions beeing installed.
<dholbach> doko: i'll check and tell you
<doko> before that: please
<doko> mkdir .../site-packages/wx-2.4
<doko> mv wx wxPython wx-2.4/
<doko> this way, you make sure, that 2.5.3 is used by default.
<doko> to explicitely use 2.4, see wxversion.py
<dholbach> part 1 of the apt-get.org odyssee done: https://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/AptGetOrg
<dholbach> doko: i take a walk and test after that, if you don't mind - copied our conversation already
<dholbach> bbl
<diamond> weird. kdevelop built fine here, in pbuilder, but shows up as failed on the priority list
<crimsun> built fine on ppc, apparently
<diamond> ah. dependancies have now been satifisfied for amd64
<diamond> i presume it'll get auto-rebuilt at some point in the future then?
<diamond> or does the maintainer have to re-submit it?
<dholbach> re
<diamond> wb
<dholbach> doko: bittornado fails after moving wx-2.4
<sabdfl> dholbach: that's excellent work on AptGetOrg in the wiki... do those sites have email addresses so we can know that we are bringing their packages into ubuntu, and we can invite them to maintain them here directly?
<HostingGeek> someone want to answer diamond's question
<HostingGeek> i belive its a valid one
<dholbach> sabdfl: i used a python script, which i plan to spit out template mails to those guys :-)
<dholbach> sabdfl: the packages have email adresses, so i'll inform them which packages we are taking and invite them into our process
<dholbach> sabdfl: i could send you such a template mail once i have it ready, so you could add some words of praise :-)
<tritium> dholbach, I see python-matplotlib in the 2nd AptGetOrg repo on that wiki page.  If I may say so, my package is better ;)
<sabdfl> dholbach: cool!
<dholbach> tritium: sorry, in my first apt-get.org-proposal i deleted it, but since this is all script generated, forgot to remove it
<tritium> dholbach, no need to be sorry.  just shamelessly plugging my package ;)
<dholbach> sabdfl: i'll start reviewing those briefly later tonight
<dholbach> tritium: :-)
<sabdfl> tritium: pride is a strong motivator :-)
<tritium> sabdfl, :)
<dholbach> now i'll write up the motu report so you guys can still give me some clues until i send it tomorrow :-)
<ogra> "dear users, please dont run hwdb-client without having a ubuntu system, sid's hal fucks up the data completely, yours oli"
<tritium> ogra, you've had sid users using it?
<ogra> tritium, or probably some systems are broken through wrong upgrades from woody,but without my extensions the hal data is pretty boring and i cant get cpu, bios or mem data from it
<tritium> Ah, okay.
<ogra> so the data looks like this: http://hwdb.ubuntu.com/?xml=8ae1697984445e75874aaf8a65c51f53
<ogra> instead of this: http://hwdb.ubuntu.com/?xml=6a251e86ac308b43509a36af77612195
<ogra> or that: http://hwdb.ubuntu.com/?xml=c5716b611fcdec9b9cd7ef6d36017724
<tritium> I see...
<bddebian> Howdy folks
<tritium> hello bddebian
<dholbach> *PLING* i hope you recognized my repeated call for opinions and reports of the last month! :-)
<tritium> dholbach, do you have a draft posted that we can view and make comments on?
<dholbach> not yet
<dholbach> but everyone should have a few words on what pleased them, what didnt :-)
<dholbach> i just want noone to blame me tomorrow ;-)
<tritium> dholbach, there's nothing to blame you for
<dholbach> or feel left out or something
* bddebian pokes jbailey :-)
<jbailey> bddebian: Eh?
<bddebian> jbailey: Just saying Hi. ;-)
<jbailey> *lol*  Heya Barry.
<tritium> I'm getting random lock-ups with fabionne's 1.0.7167 nvidia stuff
<herve> morning/evening/wathever!
<dholbach> hey herve
<herve> dholbach! howdy how?
<bddebian> Hello herve
<bddebian> tritium: You are at Purdue?
<tritium> bddebian, yes
<bddebian> Sweet, I went there for 3 years
<dholbach> dholbach: good, writing the motu report and working on my apt-get.org processing script :-)
<dholbach> herve: ^
<tritium> bddebian, I came here for my graduate degrees, but not undergraduate
<bddebian> tritium: Well I didn't even finish my undergrad there.. :'-(
<tritium> bddebian, but you finished somewhere else?
<bddebian> tritium: University of Phoenix about 15 years later... :'-(
<herve> dholbach, you need some help?
<tritium> bddebian, that's fine.  You finished up.  Good job :)
<bddebian> Thx.  But now I'm old and it's a Business degree.. :-)
<dholbach> herve: not with my current tasks -- what somebody needs to do is review the "working on" sections and check the state of the packages there
<dholbach> the python list is still quite full
<dholbach> (afaik)
<tritium> bddebian, these are not bad things
<herve> dholbach, yes it is :-(
<dholbach> maybe some of those are finished and just need an upload
<bddebian> dholbach: Where is this list?
<bddebian> Sorry, I'm "new" :-)
<dholbach> bddebian: the python list is at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UniversePythonTransitionTODO
<dholbach> but you can view them all on http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTUTodo
<dholbach> if i know which i can *just* upload, then i'll do it later
<tritium> bddebian, where part of the country are you in now?
<bddebian> Ack, they are all amd64 problems.. :-)
<bddebian> tritium: Philly area now.  Just moved from California
<tritium> bddebian, cool
* diamond hears amd64, perks up
<bddebian> diamond: Bah, I was just commenting that a lot of the issues on MOTUTodo are amd64
<diamond> bddebian: ah right
<bddebian> Sorry to pique your interest for nothing. :-)
<dredg> man, amd64 sucks... though i'll change my mind if someone were to buy me one :)
<bddebian> Me too ;-)
<diamond> dredg: i got tired of waiting, bought me own ,-)
<dredg> diamond: yes, but you're wrong in the head
<bddebian> heh
<diamond> there is that -)
<bddebian> Actually I'll take a G5 if someone is giving stuff away..
<dredg> diamond: there is the issue of your no-eyed smileys that manage to wink...
<dredg> that scares me
<diamond> dredg: it's special.
<bddebian> heh
<tritium> bddebian, are you originally from Indiana?
<bddebian> tritium: No, Illinois
<tritium> ah, cool.  I'm an Albuquerque isotope, myself
<bddebian> Ahh
<dholbach> first draft: http://moz.gotdns.org/ubuntu/motu-report/05-03-motu-report.html  -  i know i forgot important people and important things - so if you'd like to write something about someone else, /query me and i'll add it straightaway :-)
<schweeb> wow
<schweeb> just got back from my boss's house
<schweeb> omg huge
<dholbach> and it's not half of what we did
<dholbach> i forgot the plans on MOTU shirts
<schweeb> dholbach: thanks for mentioning me first in the crew of new people :)
<jani> hello all
<diamond> hum. UniversePythonTransitionTODO. the soya mention is out of date
<diamond> soya builds fine on amd64
<dholbach> hai jani
<jani> diamond, that's good
<jani> I have just uploaded soya-doc hope it gets through
<diamond> shall i remove the soya entry from problematic?
<jani> diamond, if you have it on amd64 then sure
<jani> probably dholbach or ogra can confirm they have amd64 too I think
<diamond> jani: well, it builds fine with pbuilder here on amd64
<bddebian> Hello jani
<jani> hello bddebian
<jani> diamond, is it not apt-gettable though?
<dredg> chump hit ^X again...
<jani> :)
* dredg mocks diamond 
<bddebian> heh
<diamond> dredg: yet again, i kill xchat without meaning to. this time by clicking the close button.
<diamond> clearly i suck. -)
<dredg> ah, at least it wasn't ^W or ^X this time
<dredg> clicking the close button takes effort
<diamond> dredg: t'was ^X the last 3-4 times tho
<bddebian> haha
<jani> crimsun ping
<dredg> clearly steve, the problem is that you are a long-haired hippy.
<diamond> dredg: indeed
<dholbach> dredg, diamond: you're have a charming way of communicating with each other
<diamond> dholbach: we've known each other too long to pretend to be civil -)
<jani> dholbach, are you sending out a mout report? I'd better write mine then
<jani> MOTU report that is
<bddebian> So where are the n00b/luser/low skills tasks listed for you folks? :-)
<dholbach> jani: tomorrow ... let's say 16 utc
<dholbach> jani: http://moz.gotdns.org/ubuntu/motu-report/05-03-motu-report.html
<jani> ok I'm reading
* dredg loses the game
<diamond> bddebian: in general, https://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/MOTUtodo, and https://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/UniversePriorityList
<diamond> dredg: excellent -)
<bddebian> diamond: Well I looked at those lists but the organization is a little awkward..
<diamond> bddebian: i'm generally just going through the priority list, and having a go at fixing any that don't build on amd64
<dredg> hmm, i ponder can kudzu be relegated to "get-the-hell-out-of-the-archive" status
<dredg> :)
<schweeb> indeed
<tritium> dholbach, can you paste the URL for your draft again?  I was in the process of checking it when my computer froze up again.
<dholbach> http://moz.gotdns.org/ubuntu/motu-report/05-03-motu-report.html
<tritium> thanks
<dholbach> :-)
<tritium> :)
* diamond cringes at the number of issues in mozart
<dredg> urgh. need to get 133M of packages
* tritium thinks his laptop may be down for the count this time...
<dredg> sometimes i wonder why i run hoary :)
<dredg> that said, i could do with wiping the install and putting on a fresh hoary
<diamond> dredg: aye. the amount of extra un-wanted libs i now have installed is quite silly
<diamond> perhaps a deborphan run might be in order soon
<dholbach> deborphan --guess-all :-)
<dredg> root@malkovich:/home/niall(0)# deborphan --guess-all|wc -l
<dredg> 143
<bradb> ogra: around?
<ogra> yop
<bradb> ogra: sabdfl gave the go-ahead, you can announce MOTU Malone in all its glory.
<dredg> winner
<bradb> ogra: i.e. to ubuntu-users, etc.
<ogra> YEAH !
<bradb> :)
<dholbach> woohoo
<jani> congrats bradb!
<dholbach> yeah... good work! :-)
<diamond> woo. got yehia building.
<ogra> dholbach, so include it in the motu-report :)
<jani> hmm after dput is it elmo first or hoary-changes?
<bddebian> Damn and I thought I was lost in #d-d.  I'm gonna have to learn a whole new language if I come to the dark side eh? :-)
<jani> I uploaded 15 min ago and see othing yet
<dholbach> ogra: will do
<ogra> great :)
<dholbach> bradb: https://launchpad.ubuntu.com/malone/assigned still takes its time
<dredg> jani: you should get a mail from katie@
<jani> dredg, right away?
<bradb> dholbach: fixing it this afternoon (if it's the problem i think it is)
<jani> before elmo and build right?
<dholbach> bradb: cool
<dredg> jani: can never remember... after some mins anyway
<koke> see you all!
<koke> bye
<jani> hmm than it's gone to a black hole
<jani> I'll look why
<dredg> jani: you did use 'dput ubuntu whatever.changes' and not 'dput whatever.changes'?
<dredg> the first uploads to ubuntu
<dholbach> bradb: will the liste of people stay that way? i mean they're ... quite long :-)
<dredg> the latter uploads to debian
<jani> yes
<dredg> not that i know *cough*
<bradb> dholbach: that screen is really broken in general. i'll do some reworking of it.
<dholbach> oh cool, i'll stop bothering then :-)
<diamond> bddebian: well, the folks here are very helpful, asking gets useful answers most of the time (unless i answer ,-)
<dredg> jani: one way or another you get a mail saying accepted or rejected.
<jani> dredg, the wiki says if you are not in the keyring 'it is silently discarded'
<jani> but elmo put me in the keyring
<jani> so ...I dunno
<dredg> jani: not according to my mailbox :)
<jani> this would be my first upload so I might have done smt wrong
<dredg> if you're not in the keyring you get "PGP/GnuPG signature check failed"
<jani> dredg, what mailbox?
<jani> aha
<jani> ok I'll wait then
<bddebian> diamond: OK :-)
<dredg> hmm, dbishell builds fine here
* dredg throws it at pbuilder just to be certain
<tritium> See you all later!
<ajmitch> uh oh, bddebian is here ;)
<bddebian> mwuhahaha
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<ajmitch> I thought you were a debian diehard?
<bddebian> ajmitch: jbailey is the Emperor
<ajmitch> hehe
<herve> re
<ajmitch> and so you came to surrender your soul to the MOTU team ;)
<dholbach> herve: your opinion to  http://moz.gotdns.org/ubuntu/motu-report/05-03-motu-report.html  ? :-)
<dholbach> s/opinion/changes+additions/
<herve> give me 2 minutes
* ajmitch has to run off to work now, will talk from there
<dholbach> bye ajmitch
<jbailey> bddebian: Wha?
<herve> dholbach, I like it
<dholbach> herve: any additions? changes? something i forgot?
<bddebian> jbailey: You are trying to draw me to the dark side so you are the Emperor.. ;-P
<dredg> he's definitely something
<herve> dholbach, not to my mind
<dredg> dunno if Emperor is the right word...
<dholbach> herve: ok
<bddebian> hehe
<herve> bddebian, take the easy way ;-)
<jani> goodnight all
<dredg> dholbach: looks good.
<herve> bye jani
<dredg> night jani
<bddebian> herve: The easy way?
<herve> bddebian, easier, safer is the dark side!
<dholbach> was this all we did? :-)
<bddebian> "Fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate, hate leads to suffering".. ;-)
<herve> dholbach, size doesn't matter :-p
<herve> I'm not afraid!
<dholbach> hrm
<herve> (I'm just exhausted, really)
<dholbach> herve: i wasnt blaiming you :-)
<herve> dholbach, no really, remember ou transition lists were *huge*!
<herve> I didn't even take it personnaly
<dholbach> yes... they *were*
<dholbach> muhuhahahahaha :-)
<herve> :-)
<bddebian> Damn, don't you people have any "easy" tasks?? ;-)
<herve> sure
<diamond> bddebian: i've probably done them all ,-)
<herve> take the UniversePriority list
<herve> follow the links to build logs
<herve> and check if some were built for all archs after all
<bddebian> Well I don't have access to all archs if they don't.. :-)
<herve> hmm... study that wiki page first
<bddebian> ?
<herve> how we structured it
<herve> not the wiki syntax :-)
* bddebian sees that ajmitch 's column is blank
* bddebian hides
<herve> it means he finished all his homework :-p
<dredg> hmm
<dredg> smb4k build-deps on kdelibs4-dev and libfam-dev
<dredg> kdelibs4-dev depends on libgamin-dev
<bddebian> herve: Bah, it means you haven't given him enough to do. ;-)
<diamond> dredg: smb4k builds fine on amd64
<dredg> libgamin-dev conflicts with libfam0c102
<dredg> libfam-dev depends on libfam0c102
<dredg> my brain hurts
<bddebian> Hmm, gcc-2.95 build failures on PPC are lame
<herve> dredg, beware of not kernel panicking!
<dredg> i reckon that if i remove the build-dep on libfam-dev it should be ok
<dredg> as libgamin-dev should replace libfam-dev
<dredg> or is this assumption going to lead to tears?
<herve> hmm
<herve> is gamin compatible with fam at the api level?
<dredg> good question
<dholbach> yes
<dredg> gamin should be binary and source code compatible with FAM 2.6.8
<dredg> says google
<herve> so a recomp "does it"
<dredg> gamin should do everything that fam does
<herve> but better :-p
<dredg> dholbach: so in your professional german opinion, nuking the build-dep should bring happy? :)
<dholbach> erm i didnt follow the thread
<dholbach> and im on the phone ;-)
<dredg> bah
<dredg> ok :)
* dredg gets food
<bddebian> Is apt broken on amd64?
<herve> good night all
<dredg> nn herve
<dholbach> bye herve
<herve> bddebian, it's in main anyway, not motu's concern
<bddebian> herve: ?
<bddebian> Oh, sorry, gnight
<herve> don't pay attention
<herve> I'm already aslept :-)
<diamond> bddebian: works just fine here
<bddebian> What does he mean, not motu's concern?
<bddebian> diamond: I was just looking at the buildds
<diamond> bddebian: motu (masters of the universe) is only concerned with stuff in the universe repoisitory
<bddebian> Well I knew what MOTU was but didn't know what he meant. Thx.
<bddebian> So who tends to main?
<dholbach> #ubuntu-devel :-)
<dredg> the folk in #ubuntu-devel
<dholbach> the canonical employees
<bddebian> Ahh so devel != MOTU
<dredg> well, we hang out there :)
<bddebian> Damn, I see I have a lot of reading to do if I move to the dark side. :-)
<dredg> for the most part though, we can't upload to main. universe is not supported by ubuntu
<dredg> it's the community supported repository
<dholbach> bddebian: and we rock harder, sabdfl said so in his last mail
<dholbach> ;-p
<bddebian> So Universe is not Ubuntu?
<dholbach> bddebian: it's not on the CDs you get
<dholbach> but apt-get-table
<bddebian> Well if you rock harder, I should be here.. :-)
<dholbach> of course
<dholbach> we need you
<bddebian> You do?
<dholbach> give us your loving!
<dholbach> yeah!
<bddebian> jbailey: They don't know me do they.. ;-)
<jbailey> bddebian: Hmm?
<jbailey> bddebian: I don't usually follow this channel.
<diamond> right. yehia fixed.
<bddebian> jbailey: What channel DO you follow? ;-P
<jbailey> bddebian: As few as I can get away with.  IRC is too distracting.
<jbailey> bddebian: But usually I have the #u-devel tab in the foreground.
<bddebian> heh
<dredg> diamond: how fixed?
<dredg> diamond: did you make it a non-native package?
<bddebian> dholbach: So what do you need me for?
<diamond> dredg: yup
<Amaranth> bddebian: you work on Debian/Hurd?
<dredg> winner
<dholbach> bddebian: bug fixing, good atmosphere, heads up
<bddebian> Amaranth: I try
<bddebian> Amaranth: How did you know that?
<Amaranth> bddebian: Google Is Your Friend ;)
<bddebian> Heh
<bddebian> Amaranth: Well that was a fast background check then. ;-)
<Amaranth> i started from "<bddebian> jbailey: They don't know me do they.. ;-)", got an email address, and went to the website the email address was for
<Amaranth> good thing i picked a name that is hidden in garbage about plants
<bddebian> Oh, it picked up www.bddebian.com ??
<Amaranth> yeah
<ogra> bradb, i wrote the announcement, wanna see it before i hit the send button ?
<bradb> ogra: sure
<dredg> winner. smb4k seems to like just living on libgamin-dev
<bddebian> Hmm, amd64 machines aren't as expensive as I thought
<dredg> hmm
<dredg> Unable to get Terminal Size. The TIOCGWINSZ ioctl didn't work. The COLUMNS and LINES environment variables didn't work. The resize program didn't work. at /usr/lib/perl5/Term/ReadKey.pm line 343.
<dredg> any way to make this work when a buildd is doing the building?
<diamond> dredg: not really, the issue is that it shouldn't be doing anything with the terminal while building
<diamond> dredg: why the hell it wants to resize the terminal is beyond me
<dredg> welcome to perl
<diamond> death to perl? -)
<dredg> not today
<bddebian> Hence the Python push? :-)
<dredg> not by me
<bddebian> Sorry, I meant on the wiki and such.
<ajmitch_> hi
<ogra> hey ajmitch
<bddebian> wb ajmitch_
<tritium> hi ajmitch_
<ajmitch_> bddebian: going to UDU, I hope?
<bddebian> ajmitch_: UDU?
<dholbach> wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDownUnder
<bddebian> Heh, I wish
<bddebian> After FOSDEM, my wife will probably never let me go to a geekfest again.. :-)
<dredg> ah. it's a test for Term::Readline. it uses /dev/ptmx
<tritium> I won't be going to UDU either.
<dredg> gah
<Jerub> hah
<Jerub> looks like that's the week after linux.conf.au
* ogra rather thinks linux.conf.au is the warmup for UDU
<dredg> wee
<dredg> fix for the dbishell terminal thing in debian
<tritium> dholbach, new upstream for python-matplotlib just announced
<koke> hallo dudes!
<bddebian> Hello koke
<tritium> ajmitch, did you by chance see my request to you to review my packages?
<dholbach> tritium: wow rock
<dholbach> tritium: look at https://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/AptGetOrg
<koke> so malone is already our "official" bugtracking tool?
* tritium looks
<tritium> :)
<tritium> dholbach, I like the look of that!
<trulux> no more bugzilla?
<trulux> so, where's my Gnutella now?
* koke refers to ogra message in ubuntu-devel@
<ogra> yeah
<koke> ogra: great, I have to prepare my bug list for malone :D
<trulux> ogra: sorry, too many time studying vectors and vector equations, I've missed that part
<tritium> dholbach, thanks!
<dholbach> tritium: de rien
<ogra> trulux, i sent it 10 mins ago ;) you missed nothing ...
<trulux> ogra: ok, then damn me
* trulux damns himself
<trulux> sorry of asking
<ogra> nobody damns anybody :)
<ogra> *g*
<trulux> btw, 1) my eyes are already burnt out 2) something is wrong with firefox, white backgrounds look grey
<trulux> tritium: I need to get out of the hardcore role
<ogra> trulux, you ff isnt up to date, thats fixed 2 updates ago
<trulux> ogra: ok
<trulux> ogra: just getting the livecd so my bw sucks
<trulux> finished
<tritium> I have to go now.  I'll see you later.
<trulux> tritium: take care
<tritium> trulux, you too.  Going to the Indiana Pacers vs. Miami Heat game...
<dholbach> bye tritium - HAVE FUN!
<tritium> Thanks.  bye...
<ogra> ciao tritium
<bddebian> Later tritium
<dredg> diamond: seemingly there's a bug in Term::ReadLine::Perl
<diamond> dredg: ah
<dredg> it always ioctl()'s STDIN instead of reading the fh you create it with when you call Term::ReadKey
<diamond> hmm. ecasound is listed on the priority list, but the version there is 2.0, whereas only 2.3 is in apt
<diamond> dholbach: i see you've fixed powermanga, shall i take it off The List?
<dredg> smb4k appears to be building fine :)
<dredg> well, i386 so far
<dredg> we'll see how the others go
<diamond> dredg: amd64 was already building ok
<diamond> dholbach: ditto dict-bouvier
<dredg> smb4k_0.4.1a-1ubuntu1_20050331-2238-amd64-successful
<dredg> smb4k_0.4.1a-1ubuntu1_20050331-2239-powerpc-successful
<dredg> smb4k_0.4.1a-1ubuntu1_20050331-2239-ia64-successful
<dredg> niall wins! :)
<dredg> niall loses :(
<diamond> dredg: grats, and hah -)
<dholbach> diamond: thanks
<diamond> dholbach: np
<dredg> we'll see how dbishell gets on with that patch i yoinked from debian
<dredg> dholbach: would you mind looking over modconf? i think it's fixed but i'm not sure how good the fix is
<dholbach> dredg: i'm completely busy - is there nobody else who might have a look?
<dholbach> dredg: i mean it's important enough to even ask the kernel guys
<dredg> dholbach: i'll prod random people
<dredg> ta
<dholbach> ask at #ubuntu-devel
* dholbach 's having fun with http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/AptGetOrg
#ubuntu-motu 2005-04-12
<dredg> apt-get.org gives me the fear
<dredg> merging apt-get.org into ubuntu makes me cry. lots.
<schweeb> what's the consensus on that? is the stuff going into a seperate repos until we can QA approve each package for universe?
<dholbach> schweeb: it's going directly in universe/multiverse
<dholbach> i'm building/testing each package
<Amaranth> what does FTBFS mean?
<dholbach> fail to build from source
<diamond> Amaranth: fails to build from ... yeah
<Amaranth> ah
<koke>  $ wtf ftbfs
<koke> Gee...  I don't know what ftbfs means...
<koke> we need to patch that :P
* dredg goes poking at the ipv6 packages from apt-get.org
<dredg> er, openssh does ipv6 fine...
<diamond> koke: -)
<dredg> and urgh :( native packages
<dredg> bad bad bad
<dholbach> dredg: all over the place
<dholbach> Need to get 140Mb of source.
<dredg> for _what_?
<dholbach> not sure yet
<dholbach> debian.speedblue.org
<dholbach> ah that cross compiler stuff
<dredg> oh so very bong
<dholbach> chucked it out already
<dredg> dbishell successful :)
<diamond> dredg: grats
<bddebian> Well later folks, guess I had better go home and install Ubuntu now.. :-)
<diamond> bddebian: nite.
<dholbach> bddebian: good night
<dholbach> yeah!
<bddebian> :-)
<dholbach> he'll be bdubuntu soon ;-p
* diamond grins
<dholbach> ho... 722M    /var/cache/pbuilder/result/ - time for a cleanup
<schweeb> heh
<schweeb> nice
<schweeb> I just removed all of my Stargate Atlantis eps so i actually have somd HDD space
<schweeb> 10M     /var/cache/pbuilder/result/
<schweeb> hehe
<koke> aArgh!!! malone is bugggyyy :/ the links in the bug list are done with <td onclick="..."> ?!?!
<koke> I *NEED* to open link in tabs
<dholbach> jbailey: do you guys already know when you'll have a  ant  package round in ubuntu?
<jbailey> dholbach: I think it went in yesterday.
<dholbach> jbailey: just because i'm currently experiencing the delights of building apt-get.org on my box and some packages have the urging demand for  ant  - i leave those packages as "FTBFS (Java)", alright?
<dholbach> oh
<dholbach> but surely still needs elmo approval
<jbailey> May have been the day before.  wasabi was excited about it. =)
* ajmitch_ cries
<dholbach> alright
<ajmitch_> got to install subversion on a RHEL-alike box
<dholbach> i'll get back to those packages later
<jbailey> ajmitch_: One word: debtakeover.
<ajmitch_> I don't like RH stuff that much :)
<ajmitch_> hehe
<ajmitch_> we're considering ubuntu when a new server goes in
<Jerub> bah
<dholbach> yeah!
<Jerub> I hate ant.
<jbailey> dholbach: Are thye packages that just blindly use ant?
<Jerub> :((
<jbailey> Like assuming that package name, or what's the bug?
<jbailey> I thought that Jerry's packages were somewhat compatible with the old Debian way of doing things.
<dholbach> jbailey: i review them briefly, try to build them, some have it in the build-depends
* ajmitch_ wonders if it is safe to install the svn packages.. :)
<dholbach> jbailey: i update the pbuilder chroot to be sure
<schweeb> ajmitch_: in Ubuntu? sure
<dholbach> jbailey: forget what i said... thanks for the info
<dholbach> ah now it wants  libbatik-java
<ajmitch_> schweeb: nah, centos, a RHEL3 rebuild :(
<dholbach> hrm
<dholbach> well, i'll leave those tagged as FTBFS (Java) still
<diamond> hum. oregano is fixed in debian's next version,
<diamond> i.e., we're on oregano_0.40.0-2, they're up to -3
<diamond> is it ok to pull in their changes?
<schweeb> think you gotta ask elmo to sync it
<diamond> ee. k
<dholbach> diamond: set it on wiki/MOTUToSync so we don't forget
<dholbach> ..., please :-)
<diamond> dholbach: sure
* Riddell high fives motaboy 
* koke looking for uploader...
<dholbach> koke: which one?
<koke> d4x
<koke> it has been waiting for 3 days but I can't upload yet :(
<dredg> i'd offer but i'm not sure of upload procedure for other people
<dholbach> it's not on your site
<dholbach> dredg: go ahead
<dholbach> dredg: debuild -S (-sa if new source) -k<your mailadress>
<koke> dholbach: uploading....
<dredg> ah, excellent
<dredg> dholbach: cheers
<dholbach> dredg: http://www.amedias.org/~koke/debian/hoary/
<dredg> diamond: has a bunch of things done which i'll happily upload also
<dredg> i've reviewed some, i'd prefer if someone else took a glance at them as well though
<dholbach> *grmbl* build-depends on emacs21
<dholbach> happy downloading *again*
<dredg> dholbach: are you on dialup?
<dholbach> dredg: no, but i'm just downloading
<schweeb> emacs is huge no matter what internet you're using :)
<dholbach> didnt do anything else tonight :-)
<dredg> s/huge/wrong/
<dredg> s/internet//
<dredg> :)
<diamond> dredg: s/you're using//
<diamond> for completeness' sake -)
<schweeb> indeed
<schweeb> emacs needs to branch into its own OS :)
<diamond> schweeb: as they say, emacs would make a decent os, if only it had a good text editor
<schweeb> heh
<dholbach> elmo seems to be there
<dholbach> request your syncs... now :-)
<dholbach> ok pals, i'm off to bed
<dholbach> good night
<dredg> night
<koke> dredg: have you uploaded d4x??
<dredg> koke: sorry, yes
<dredg> distracted by something else
<koke> Subject: d4x_2.5.0rel-1ubuntu1_source.changes REJECTED
<koke> have you received that mail?
<dredg> no
<schweeb> does it detail in the message why it's rejected?
<koke> schweeb: yep
<koke> Rejected: The key (0xBCD5AD90793F6B02) used to sign d4x_2.5.0rel-1ubuntu1.dsc wasn't found in the keyring(s).
<koke> and also md5 sums don't match
<schweeb> whose key is that? yours? apparently elmo doesn't have it in the keyring yet
<koke> schweeb: I know :) but dredg has uploaded it, not me
<schweeb> and you'll have to regenerate your source if the md5sums don't match
<dredg> sorry, first upload for someone else
<schweeb> that's bad juju
<dredg> completely unsure of procedure
<koke> pub  1024D/793F6B02 2003-11-01 Jorge Bernal (Koke) <koke@sindominio.net>
<koke> it seems it's mine
<dredg> Checking Signature on .dsc
<dredg> gpg: Signature made Fri 01 Apr 2005 00:10:03 IST using DSA key ID CB6E5CF7
<schweeb> dredg: pretty sure dholbach always signs whatever I give him with his
<dredg> i signed using CB6E5CF7. that's my key
<dredg> that's the output from dput
<koke> I've tried to upload it before, but that should have been "silently ignored" or accepted
<schweeb> well, invalid key plus the md5sum mismatch probably generated the email... invalid key alone is silently ignored
<dredg> right
<dredg> lets try this again :)
<dredg> niall@malkovich:~/dev/d4x(0)$ gpg d4x_2.5.0rel-1ubuntu1.dsc
<dredg> gpg: d4x_2.5.0rel-1ubuntu1.dsc: unknown suffix
<dredg> Enter new filename: /tmp/ss
<dredg> gpg: Signature made Fri 01 Apr 2005 00:38:16 IST using DSA key ID CB6E5CF7
<ogra> dredg, never upload a package twice
<dredg> ogra: ag, yes
<ogra> dredg, you need to bump the version number
<dredg> ogra: well, it wasn't accepted?
<ogra> yep, anyway....if elmo doesnt take it away and you dont bump the version it wont work...
<dredg> ogra: right
<dredg> koke: gonna bump the version
<koke> dredg: I'm not sure if is so urgent ;)
<dredg> koke: actually, you know what
<dredg> i'm gonna hold off til tomorrow
<koke> elmo is quite away now
<dredg> i'll get elmo to nuke what's there and i'll poke dholbach for the actual howto :)
<koke> "travelling back to Leeds - offline for several hours"
<dredg> yes. he won't be back for some time
<koke> dredg: yeah, a wiki page for uploaders :)
<koke> dredg: do you know how much time??
<ogra> dredg, you normally only have to run: debsign -myour.maintainer@address.com blah_0.1.2-0ubuntu1.dsc
<dredg> koke: i'll be around for around 9am tomorrow morning (UTC+1)
<ogra> then it asks for your passphrase twice and youre done...
<dredg> elmo is in the same timezone
<dredg> ogra: ah, ok. that seems v. straightforward
<koke> dredg: if you see elmo before me, please remember him my key :P
<dredg> i'll prod him gently
<koke> :D
<koke> thanks
<dredg> was about to ask actually, you should be cleared to upload stuff at this stage
<schweeb> koke: have you prodded mako to have him send elmo the key?
<schweeb> mako's been pretty busy the last couple days, hence his lag in sending the key
<koke> schweeb: mako told me elmo already has the key
<schweeb> ah
<koke> so I'm just a step away
<koke> just after a week ;-)
<dredg> heh, took me long enough too
<dredg> it was acknowledged by elmo but didn't work. then i pinged him by mail and it started working after a day or 2
* koke sleep()
<koke> bye
<diamond> nite
<diamond> woot. glunarclock fixed.
* schweeb tries to decide how to be productive today
<crimsun> mm
<crimsun> XFce fun
<tseng> jbailey around?
<dredg> nn all
<crimsun> ni dredg
* ajmitch_ is ready to kill svn or something
<jbailey> tseng: Am now.
<tseng> hm nm
<tseng> i had to go back to the old rules file anyway
<tseng> i was trying vainly to make mono cdbs, but its too custom
<tseng> not worth it.
<jbailey> tseng: Well, if there's anything you think that could be done about it with cdbs2, lemme know.
<tseng> im realizing there is alot of debhelper that i still dont know enough about
<tseng> jbailey: basically its calling dh_gencontrol with custom args smack in the middle of a function
<tseng> jbailey: i wanted to edit that bit w/o overriding the whole thing
<jbailey> This is what you want, or this is what cdbs it doing wrong?
<tseng> thats my ideal situation
<tseng> but it sounds tricky
<jbailey> Sometime when I'm really drunk, I'll get you to explain to me why.
<tseng> k
<tseng> its doing custom version munging
<tseng> and passing it to dh_gencontrol
* diamond groans. package with function name that conflicts with glib function name
<ajmitch_> nasty
<diamond> guess how many times i have to change it, to be consistent?
<diamond> 116
<ajmitch_> > 50
<ajmitch_> ouch
<diamond> if it doesn't build now, i'm gonna be very upset
<diamond> woo. it builds. -)
<ajmitch_> yay
<ajmitch_> svn is being crap
<schweeb> hahahahhahaha
<schweeb> hahaha
<ajmitch_> works with my sid box as server,not with that other box...
<ajmitch_> schweeb?
<schweeb> go to http://planet.gnome.org and http://www.kdeplanet.org
<schweeb> then realize what date it is :)
<ajmitch_> :)
* ajmitch_ makes note to avoid slashdot more than usual
<diamond> speak of the april's fool devil.
<schweeb> heh
<ajmitch_> that was a particularly boring one
<ajmitch_> next thing you know a sarge release date will be announced..
<diamond> hah
* ajmitch_ ought to send in his DPL vote
* diamond slaps forehead
<schweeb> ajmitch_: anyone but Branden please
<diamond> c'mon freenods. at least do it right. -)
<ajmitch_> you want johnathon walther? :)
<schweeb> dunno much about  him
<schweeb> but I'm not a real fan of Branden
<schweeb> Matthew Garrett seems to be pretty good
<ajmitch_> sure, we need to vote in the ubuntu cabal ;)
<diamond> er. yes, freenode.
<ajmitch_> now if only lilo would stop spamming us all...
<zul> i think he has stopped or ill take a baseball/cricket/rounders bat to his cranium
* diamond grins
<schweeb> wow
<schweeb> lilo is a giant douche.
<schweeb> nice.
<schweeb> look at his hostmask.
<schweeb> he changed it to oftc.
<schweeb> @_@
<zul> schweeb: you learn quick ;)
<schweeb> zul: I've known about lilo for over a year now, heh
<schweeb> I think I figured out he was a moron the time I got the wall msg "attention everyone, I am eating a sandwich, it is good.  that is all"
<zul> lol
<schweeb> that was around the same time I was hanging out in #debian, and finding out mwilson is a giant douche as well
<schweeb> I hear he's calmed down lately though.
<crimsun> heh.  I put him on ignore years ago.
<zul> schweeb: never heard of him
<schweeb> zul: basically, n00bs would join #debian, thinking people are friendly. then mwilson flamed the hell out of them
<schweeb> then they quit.
<zul> heh
<schweeb> and most likely went to another distro.
<zul> #gentoo-dev is moderated so users cant talk to developers
<schweeb> well
<schweeb> it's nice having an open development process all around
<zul> so anyone without a voice or an op cant say anything
* diamond groans
<schweeb> makes the barrier to becoming a developer higher
<zul> it wasnt anything special
<zul> anyone who has a clue can become one if you pass a quix
<zul> quiz
<zul> anyways
<schweeb> ah
* crimsun chips away at MOTUXfce
<crimsun> my goal is to have all those packages fixed, uploaded, and built 12 hours after elmo began syncing
<diamond> right. 8 packages ready for review. that makes me ready for some sleep. nite folks
<crimsun> good work!
<crimsun> night
* diamond waves tiredly and disappears
<tritium> Hello...
<crimsun> hey tritium :)
<tritium> how are you, crimsun?
<crimsun> not bad, yourself?
<crimsun> ripping as fast as I can through these Xfce packages
<tritium> not bad, thanks. Just got back from Indy.
<crimsun> cool, how was it?
<tritium> It was great.  We saw the Pacers vs. Heat.  Game went to overtime, Pacers won.
<crimsun> nice
<crimsun> bbl
<tritium> see you
<tritium> hi ajmitch :)
* schweeb beats his Dell i8200 with a smelly old trout
<tritium> schweeb, what's going on with it?
<schweeb> it's pretty sweet when your trackpad moves the cursor to one corner of the screen and it gets stuck there for a minute.
<tritium> oh boy
<schweeb> oh joy
<schweeb> it just sent to the opposite corner
<tritium> heh, and here I am running Dell diagnostics on my Latitude C840
<schweeb> and now it works again
<schweeb> I'm never buying another Dell
<tritium> nor am I
<tritium> but so far, none of the hardware tests have failed.  I guess I just really hosed up my filesystem badly.
<schweeb> if I had purchasing power over our servers, I'd probably choose HP at this point... and Fujitsu or IBM (or whoever took over IBM laptops) for my laptopo
<schweeb> and workstations, of course, gotta build those :)
<schweeb> okay, bedtime
<tritium> good night
<schweeb> night
<dholbach> hey
<schweeb> you say hi, I say goodbye
<dholbach> good night schweeb then
<tritium> Hi dholbach :)
<schweeb> dholbach: hint of the day - consider looking at the date before you read any news sites
<dholbach> hey tritium
<dholbach> schweeb: oh thanks... i'll bear it in mind
<dholbach> diamond was quite busy :-)
<schweeb> and I give my final goodnight now, time for sleep for real
<dholbach> and crimsun as well :-)
<dholbach> *wave after schweeb*
<tritium> bye schweeb
<dholbach> tritium: you're still awake :_)
<dholbach> tritium: how was the match?
<tritium> dholbach, yes, running diagnostics on my disk
<tritium> dholbach, it was great.  a 3-point shot in the closing seconds took the game to overtime.
<dholbach> WOW
<tritium> How was your night?
<dholbach> very silent... :-)
<dholbach> started rebuilding apt-get.org
<dholbach> erm... building
<tritium> Wow.
<tritium> All my hardware diagnostics are passing.  I guess I really messed up my filesystem...
<tritium> maybe my little laptop can't handle all the pbuilding ;)
<dholbach> unfortunately i'm no expert for filesystems - i guess i'm just good enough at hollering
<tritium> :)
<dholbach> oh now... i understood schweeb's hint of the day :-)
<tritium> dholbach, can I take another look at your report draft?
<dholbach> hahaha.... <---isnt awake yet
<tritium> heh :)
<dholbach> moz.gotdns.org/ubuntu/motu-report
<tritium> gracias
<tritium> I'm happy with it.
* ajmitch didn't really do anything at all this month
<tritium> ajmitch, I sent you a request earlier.  I'm not sure if you saw it.
<ajmitch> yes, I saw it
<dholbach> ajmitch: oh don't beat yourself up... you know it's not true
* ajmitch had work from ~8am-6pm today :)
<tritium> ajmitch, okay.  Just checking.  I hope it's not a bother to you.
<ajmitch> dholbach: close enough, days like today are why I haven't
<dholbach> don't beat yourself up :-)
<ajmitch> tritium: I can try, perhaps tomorrow (for me)
<tritium> ajmitch, thank you very much.  I'll understand if work keeps you too busy.
<dholbach> tritium: looking at gourmet
<tritium> dholbach, wow, thanks!
<dholbach> 0ubuntu0 -> 0ubuntu1
<tritium> I will fix that...
<dholbach> it's because a possible debian -1 could supersede ours and we were able to sync theirs
<tritium> I'm not sure why I did that...I know better.
<dholbach> in control, you should drop the universe/ from what i see (section)
<tritium> ok
<dholbach> you used cdbs-edit-patch?
<tritium> no, why do you ask?
<tritium> I used simple-patchsys
<dholbach> just so
<dholbach> i saw you used cdbs and simple-patchsys
<dholbach> cdbs-edit-patch would have been easy to use
<tritium> I'm not familiar with that.
<dholbach> it's charmingly easy
<tritium> cool, I'll research it
<dholbach> if you made the rules file use simple-patchsys and cdbs
<dholbach> you just go   cdbs-edit-patch 01-patch-to-make-it-rock-again
<dholbach> and you have kind of a subshell in which you can work on the patch
<dholbach> then you go ctrl-d
<tritium> interesting
<dholbach> and the patch is done
<tritium> this is the package where upstream has a debian directory for building his own binary .debs that he releases
<tritium> I should probably split it out as ogra suggested
<dholbach> dunno how
<dholbach> remove it from the tarball?
<tritium> not exactly sure, but I was planning on talking with upstream author about it
<dholbach> yeah... it's not neat having it in, but i think integrity of the upstream release is more important
<tritium> perhaps convince him to let me provide the debian directory stuff if the package gets approved for universe
<dholbach> if they release crack, people should see that
<tritium> I'm flexible.  ogra suggested it, so I thought I'd try it
<dholbach> upstream simply shouldnt have that kind of stuff in
<dholbach> reading diff.gz is horrible
<tritium> upstream had all kinds of .ex files in debian dir that he hadn't even touched.
<dholbach> i can imagine
<Mithrandir> tritium: that's one of the reasons why having upstream provide packaging is bad.  They tend to do a bad job at it.
<dholbach> that's the best you can convince them of
<tritium> Mithrandir, I agree
<dholbach> morning Mithrandir, morning doko :-)
<Mithrandir> hi dholbach
* Mithrandir walks off for breakfast.
<ajmitch> sometimes you get lucky & have cvs/svn write access to upstream anyway
<Mithrandir> ajmitch: sometimes, you get unluck and become upstream. ;)
<dholbach> hehe
<ajmitch> unfortunately :)
<dholbach> tritium: rm debian/*.{EX,ex} :-)
<tritium> dholbach, :)
<dholbach> remove usr/sbin from dirs
<dholbach> morning d3vic3
<d3vic3> morning dholbach
<dholbach> tritium: you can just remove the stuff, you shouldnt need a patch for it (patches/debian.patch)
<tritium> dholbach, I tried that, but it doesn't work.  When the diff gets made, it ignores deleted files, and they end up back in the package again.
<dholbach> arg
<dholbach> yes
<dholbach> *shudder*
<dholbach> yes... understood
<tritium> So I tried to work around it that way.  Probably not the most elegant solution, but I didn't know what else to do.
* ajmitch kindly requested upstream to remove the debian/ dir from the tarball
<tritium> ajmitch, did it work?
<dholbach> tritium: but the program itself looks nice :-)
<ajmitch> sure
<doko> dholbach: morning
<tritium> dholbach, thanks
<dholbach> if i was more into documenting recipes... :_)
<dholbach> :-)
<tritium> recipes seem to be quite the rage on planet.debian.net
<tritium> at least for a while there
<dholbach> yeah... :-)
<tritium> well, my wife asked me to install that software, so I just decided to package them
<ajmitch> heh
* ajmitch never has that motivation for packaging :)
<dholbach> tritium: that's nice of you
<tritium> heh, thanks
<dholbach> apart from that: looks ok
<tritium> that being the version number and the section?
<dholbach> as long as upstream has debian/ in you could remove all the .ex,.EX in the patch as well
<dholbach> so people know you don't want to have anything to do with it
<tritium> that's probably a good idea, yes
<tritium> I don't want people to think I put that in there ;)
<tritium> Given the time, I think I'll fix it tomorrow.  My diagnostics just finished up (zero errors), so I'll get a few hours sleep.
<dholbach> yeah... you should get some rest :-)
<tritium> I have a meeting all morning, so I'll see you after about 10 hours if you're still around then :)
<tritium> good night everyone
<dholbach> good night
<dholbach> tritium: i think so :-)
<tritium> :)
<jani> morning
<dholbach> hey jani
<jani> do you guys see xfce4.2 in ubuntu ?
<dholbach> quite some new packages, but not all yet
<jani> hmm I wonder if they are being uploaded now
* jani go looks at hoary -changes
<jani> no they're not on the list I wonder why
<jani> I suppose it was crimsun's mail that elmo added to the package changer
<crimsun> jani: my email address is one of those that the spam filter for hoary-changes catches
<jani> crimsun mine too :)
<jani> just going to ask elmo to change mine
<jani> btw thanks, for your great work dso far
<crimsun> np
<jani> hope I'll get to help out tonight when I get home
<cowbud> ahh any info on getting in to the ubuntu security clan?
<crimsun> oh don't worry, you will, jani :)
<cowbud> now that people are awake..
<jani> crimsun ;)
<crimsun> jani: there are ~200 packages to check.
<jani> aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
<jani> rgh
<jani> cool
<crimsun> indeed
<dholbach> crimsun: don't complain... i'm building apt-get.org :-)
<dholbach> cowbud: the teams are just building, so it requires a bit of your involvement
<jani> some packages are going to multiverse?
<crimsun> dholbach: oh I'm not at all complaining
<crimsun> dholbach: :)
<dholbach> crimsun: :-)
<cowbud> dholbach: so how can I get involved I am interested..
<jani> i didn't know about exo having nonfree license
<dholbach> cowbud: if you're interested and meet people that are interested too, you can make things happen
<cowbud> I couldn't find any concrete information on helping out in that area..
<jani> cowbud, pitti is the main security guy
<dholbach> cowbud: you have to make up the information yourself - you could write your ideas and plans on the MOTUSecurity page and mail to ubuntu-devel@ to see who'd like to join you
<dholbach> cowbud: it's the very pioneer feeling :-)
<cowbud> dholbach: I was assuming there was already some sort of direction for ubuntu..
<cowbud> apparently :)
<dholbach> can you feel it? :-)
<cowbud> ohh I can
<dholbach> oh ROCK
<dholbach> :-)
<cowbud> jani: thanks for the name..
<dholbach> MOTUTeams and MOTUSecurity might be the pages you could work on
<cowbud> dholbach: cool thanks
<dholbach> we need ideas, plans and visions in the first place
<dholbach> if there is documentation or an idea things tend to happen
<dholbach> that's the magic thing about the MOTU world :-)
<dholbach> any comments on  http://moz.gotdns.org/ubuntu/motu-report/05-03-motu-report.html ? anything/anyone i forgot? will send it off in 2-3 hours
<dholbach> hey koke
<dholbach> hihi: http://www.planetarytramp.net/background.jpg
<dredg> i recognise sabdfl. who are the others?
<dholbach> elmo and mdz
<dredg> any idea which is which
<dredg> (good photo)
<dholbach> left is mdz
<dholbach> will be the new gdm background
<dredg> said dholbach on 1st April.
<dredg> not buying :)
<dholbach> said thom on #ubuntu-devel
<dredg> not convinced :)
<dholbach> dredg: start gdmflexiserver -n
<cowbud> dredg: you happen to listen to the band?
<dredg> cowbud: ?
<cowbud> dredg: where did you get your name?
<dholbach> dredg: http://www.livejournal.com/users/lifeguardasleep/ :-)
<dredg> cowbud: no idea. came up with it a couple of years ago
<dredg> dholbach: that's scary :)
<dholbach> it ROCKS, i like it :-)
<dredg> (and i note that it's an April 1st thing. i'm right, nyah :))
<dredg> dholbach: is that your blog?
<dholbach> yep
* dredg bookmarks for later reading
<dredg> :)
<tseng> its on planet.
<dholbach> dredg: it's on planet.ubuntu
<dredg> right. duh.
<dholbach> dredg: you should have jdub add yours as well
<dredg> some of my rants are not really fit for public consumption :)
<cowbud> dredg: well it is a band and they are good check them out :)
<dredg> cowbud: ok. cheers
<cowbud> :)
<siretart> hi folks!
<dholbach> hey siretart
<dholbach> how was your exam?
<siretart> dholbach: it was very well! much better than expected! :)
<dholbach> WOOHOO!
<siretart> had to party yesterday! :)
<dholbach> :-))))
<siretart> say, does anybody know if theres something wrong with the wiki? I cannot login (password wrong)
<dholbach> siretart: somebody complained already
<siretart> I'm quite sure that the password is right, since I'm using a password manager..
<siretart> ah, ok
<dholbach> the sun is shining, the wiki is broken, so... i'll be a bit out...  :-)
<siretart> ah, bugzilla seems to be fine..
<siretart> dholbach: have fun outside! *wave*
<dholbach> *wave back*
<diamond> morning
<siretart> hi diamond
<diamond> oh that's weird. the wiki decided this morning that my username/password is no longer valid.
<siretart> diamond: same here
<diamond> and before you scream 'typo', firefox remembers it for me, and it's worked fine for the previous few days, and i double checked that it had the correct passwor
<diamond> siretart: ah. so it's not just me
<siretart> dholbach saud earlier that someone else already reported it
<siretart> s/saud/said/
* diamond nods
<diamond> guh. reset my password, still can't login.
<dredg> http://planet.debian.org/
<dredg> ubuntu 0wns you. :)
<d3vic3> heheh
<koke> I have some gpg doubts, I want to delete some uids, but I have all the signatures on those uids
<koke> is there any way to "edit" the uids?
<siretart> koke: you cannot "delete" uids from your public keys. you can only revoke them
<koke> siretart: I've done gpg --edit-key and deluid some of them...
<siretart> koke: try to reimport your public key
<koke> ouch!
<siretart> koke: this works only as long you didn't publish them
<koke> dholbach: http://www.livejournal.com/users/lifeguardasleep/22249.html <-- rotfl
<zul> hehe
<schweeb> haha
<schweeb> that rocks
<ogra> yeah, we have to log in to elmos belly :)
<schweeb> who are the other 2 guys?
<ogra> mdz and sabdfl
<schweeb> mdz on the left or right?
<dholbach> right
<dholbach> ehh left
<ogra> sabdfl, is the little bird crying for food ;)
<ogra> whoops
<ogra> silly autocompletion...
* schweeb heads to work
<schweeb> bbl
<dholbach> bye schweeb
<dholbach> see you later
<bddebian> Good morning
<jbailey> ajmitch: Wow, you hacked cdbs?  You truly are insane, aren't you?
<bddebian> hehe
<bddebian> Heya Boilermaker
<bddebian> ;-)
<tritium> hey bddebian :)
<Lathiat> hmm xfce4 is uninstallable
<Lathiat> due to new versions with different package names that replaces: the old ones, hrm
<crimsun> Lathiat: it's not finished being recompiled
<Lathiat> crimsun: ah
<crimsun> jani and I are working through ~200 Xfce 4.2.1 packages
<Lathiat> crimsun: have fun with that :)
<crimsun> Lathiat: O:-)
<siretart> any news about the wiki?
<Lathiat> whats wrong with it?
<Lathiat> crimsun: if i can help by testing or something let me know :)
<siretart> Lathiat: I cannot login anymore, several others too
<crimsun> siretart: situation still the same
<siretart> :(
<Lathiat> oh
<bddebian> SNAFU?
<Lathiat> siretart: all i can say
<Lathiat> siretart: is when its working, its fixed :)
<diamond> re
<siretart> ah, wiki repaired! :)
<diamond> yeah? excellent
<bddebian> wb diamond
<diamond> lo bddebian
<diamond> did i miss anything exciting? -)
<bddebian> Nope
<crimsun> Xfce 4.2.1 core transition complete.
<diamond> crimsun: nice work
<crimsun> the 'xfce4' package should be installable in 65 minutes.
<Lathiat> woo :)
* Lathiat gives crimsun virtual beer
<Lathiat> Anyone here going to linux.conf.au ?
* ogra applauds crimsun
<crimsun> off to class.
<crimsun> bye *
<ogra> ciao
<schweeb> hahahaha
<schweeb> fleck found my blog post
<schweeb> hahaha
<siretart> bye folks!
<diamond> nite siretart
<diamond> dredg: *poke*
<dredg> diamond: *recoil*
<dredg> thanks, you're interrupting the hell that is making tomcat my bitch
<diamond> dredg: hah. you said something about reviewing my packages today
<diamond> dredg: ah. maybe i should leave you to your torment? -)
<dredg> diamond: sure. when i finish work.
<diamond> dredg: hurry up then ,-)
<dredg> make me
* diamond speeds dredg up by threatening him with not returning all of invader zim on dvd
<dredg> er
* diamond ducks
<dredg> i have your dvds her
<dredg> e
<diamond> dredg: yeah, but i still have all that data on fluff. -)
<diamond> all 32dvd's worth of it. i really should clean that out a bit
<dredg> is fluff down? or is ipv6 broken?
<diamond> dredg: ipv6 is disabled on fluff due to a bug in the 2.6.10 kernel's ipv6 support, and debian hadn't packaged 2.6.11 last time i looked
<dredg> is that the bug that hit it last week sometime?
<diamond> dredg: aye, and a while before that too
<dredg> right
* diamond pokes debian with a pokey stick
<dredg> you could always just grab a kernel src and make-kpkg it :)
<diamond> dredg: tried that, failed
<dredg> you failed, the kernel failed or make-kpkg failed?
<dredg> (implied 'which'?)
<diamond> the kernel failed
<diamond> wouldn't boot properly
<diamond> don't remember what the issue was
<diamond> i haven't build a kernel manually in a long time. that's soooo pre-proper-packages -)
<diamond> *built
<diamond> lo tritium
<tritium> hi diamond :)
* dredg collapses
<dredg> good evening boys and girls
<bddebian> Heya dredg
<dredg> hey bddebian
<dredg> diamond: your packages on bob?
<diamond> dredg: yeah
<diamond> dredg: ~diamond/public_html/packages
<dredg> great. i prefer scp to wget
<diamond> rsync+ssh>>scp>>wget -)
<Lathiat> hehe
<dredg> is bob ipv6?
<dredg> yes
<dredg> ok
<diamond> dredg: yeah, via sixxs+heanet
* dredg adds a -6 to the line
<dredg> geda-gschem looks good
<diamond> dredg: caused so. much. pain.
<diamond> dredg: i cannot stress how much.
<dredg> hey bdale
<bdale> I just hacked together a wrapper script for tuxracer to make sound work, motivated by tuxracer and esd not playing well together in hoary.  anyone care?
<dredg> bdale: not a gamer personally, but i reckon someone might appreciate it
<Lathiat> bdale: using esd or polypaudio ?
<bdale> Lathiat: I killall esd, run tuxracer, then relaunch esd wrapped with some mute and unmute calls since it makes a nasty series of tones on re-launch on the tc1100
<bdale> Lathiat: the only reason I'm touching this is that my daughter needs something to use for her talk at LCA...
<Lathiat> eww that sounds ugly :\
<dredg> that sounds positively evil
<Lathiat> bdale: yeh i figured as such :)
<Lathiat> i was about to ask
<Lathiat> heh
<bdale> ... and she'd much rather drive the gimp with a stylus than a mouse...
<dredg> diamond: yeah, your patches look like much pain :-/
<bdale> it's no big deal, just thought I'd offer up the ugly little script if anyone wants it.  fixing tuxracer to play nicely with esd would be a better general solution, I guess, but I'm not interested in learning anything about esd today.
<diamond> dredg: lucky me eh? -)
<Lathiat> bdale: ooc, see if the issue happens with polypaudio?
<Lathiat> or send it to me and i'll find out :)
<bdale> Lathiat: what the hell is that?
<dredg> bdale: proposed replacement for esd
<Lathiat> bdale: new sound server that includes an esd emulation mode
<bdale> aha
<Lathiat> it works nice
<dredg> it was problematic though, so esd has been munged back in iirc
<Lathiat> however upstream seems to have stagnated a bit
<schweeb> yes
<Lathiat> so ubuntu have reverted toesd
<schweeb> esd is back in
<Lathiat> bah dredg just said that :)
<bdale> frankly, I don't have time today.  to reproduce on this machine, all you have to do is install and run tuxracer, and it'll complain that it can't do audio because no device is available
<Lathiat> bdale: just send me the script and i'll have a look :)
<Lathiat> bdale: lathiat at bur.st
<bdale> Lathiat: sent
<Lathiat> thanks
<Lathiat> see you in two weeks :)
<dredg> diamond: uploaded
<bdale> Lathiat: not if I see you first...  ;-)
<Lathiat> bdale: ha ha :)
<diamond> dredg: woo. thanks.
<Lathiat> bdale@localhost.localdomain, nice email address there :)
<bdale> Lathiat: looking forward to it, but I've got another biz trip this coming week, so it's not next in queue yet
<Lathiat> bdale: ah
<dredg> diamond: you should get an acknowledgement mail
<Lathiat> i have to try and get an avahi release crammed out the door before LCA
<bdale> Lathiat: bone-stock hoary-rc install on an HP tc1100, the fact that it works at all...
<Lathiat> so i can jump up and down about it
<herve> evening!
<diamond> lo herve
<ogra> hi herve
<bddebian> Heya herve
<jani> hello all
<bddebian> Heya janc
<bddebian> Err jani even..
<jani> hello bddebian
<herve> hi jani
<jani> any MOTU up to reviewing NVU ?
<jani> I already did so 2 more needed, it's a NEW package
<herve> is it the same intented to package into debian?
<ogra> jani, add it to the NEW packages list for review on the wiki
<jani> herve, dunno he mailed the debian bug list already
<jani> ogra, done it already ;)
<ogra> jani, great
<jani> dredg around?
<jani> crimsun ping
<dredg> jani: hey
<jani> dredg I wanted to ask about modcon
<jani> why you don't upload it but then realized
<jani> it's NEW
<dredg> modcon?
<jani> I wanted to review it also but it needs linux-source (big download) so pass :(
<jani> modconf :)
<dredg> oh, right
<dredg> it builds
<dredg> i just refuse to upload it as is until it's been checked out
<jani> checked out?
<dredg> reviewed
<jani> aha by 3 motus
<dredg> i don't mind
<ogra> jai its not NEW
<ogra> jani even
<dredg> it's just that it's modconf - i'd like some people to verify that what i did is sane and ok
<ogra> modconf was also in warty and is in debian
<jani> ogra, apt-cache search modconf does not show it to me
<dredg> jani: that's cos it won't build
<dredg> apt-cache showsrc modconf
<jani> aha got it now
<ogra> dredg, it would be nice if Kamion or fabbionne could review it....they are most experienced
<dredg> ogra: yes, i'd prefer that. i'll annoy them when they're not as busy
<ogra> jani, its on the priority list, there are no NEW packages there ;)
<ogra> dredg, yep
<dredg> i hate april fools day.
<ogra> dredg, thanks for taking this ugly task :)
<jani> ogra, right I was confused, I thought apt-cache show shows everything
<dredg> well, i like it
<dredg> i just hate it cos of the garbage that floods sites
<ogra> jani, always use showsrc if you are in OTU mode ;)
<dredg> some of it was clever - planetkde and gnome switching places was fun
<ogra> MOTU even
<jani> ogra, noted :)
<dredg> the junk that slashdot's frontpage gets swamped with is laughable
<jani> dredg, but that's not only april 1st ;)
* jani actually likes slashdot but pokes at it
<dredg> ogra: it wasn't that bad - someone had made modconf aware of 2.6. all i did was add a bit that will automatically untar a kernel source tarball to somewhere sane and clean it up afterwards
<zul> hmm?
<ogra> ah, ok, does it really _need_ the untarred source ?
<ogra> or would it be solvable with a debconf question and leave it unconfigured for later usage....
<ogra> i really wouldnt like my system to suddenly untar 80MB or more becuse i installed modconf by accident....
<ogra> (i'm sometimes at the edge of my partitionspace..... a disk overflow is quite bad)
<dredg> this is at build time
<dredg> not install time
<ogra> ah, ok
<diamond> dredg: hum. i'm suspicious. it can't just get away with kernel-headers?
<diamond> s/kernel/linux/..
<dredg> diamond: headers don't contain makefiles
<dredg> it's voodoo perl as well btw
<Lathiat> bdale: ping
<ogra> then it sounds sane to me, as long as our build masters have no objection.....does this add afixed dependency on the kernel version ?
<dredg> ogra: no it doesn't
<diamond> dredg: ah. ick
<ogra> ah, good
<ogra> zul, anything from the kernel team about that ?
<diamond> right, nite folks
<bddebian> Gnight
<dredg> night diamond
* diamond wabes
<ogra> night
<zul> ogra: hmm?
* zul scrolls up
<ogra> zul, modconf...
<zul> what about it?
<zul> :)
<ogra> have you seen dredgs solution ? does it sound ok to you ?
<schweeb> ogra: quick bugreport on hwdb... only works w/ ESD running :)
<ogra> schweeb, thats wanted :)
<schweeb> meh
<schweeb> esd is teh sux0r
<schweeb> are you using GST to play the sounds?
* dredg goes to bed for a bit
<ogra> schweeb, i want to know if system sounds work, so i use gnome_sound_play
<zul> ogra: ill take a look if someone can point me to it
<ogra> whatever this used will also be used by the test
<schweeb> ah
<schweeb> so it either uses ESD or nothing
<ogra> dredg, where is your source package of modconf ?
<ogra> zul^
<zul> it probably wont be until i get home from work tonight though
<ogra> schweeb, yes, as your desktop sounds do :)
<ogra> zul, we just want someone with a bit kernel experience to review it....
<zul> sure no probs
<zul> brb though
<dredg> grab it from here: http://niall.evil.ie/wip/modconf/
<dredg> the ubuntu1 is my (very slight) mod
<dredg> it's just to make it build - once built it does work as expected
<zul> dredg: cool ill have a look when i get home tonight
<dredg> no worries
<dredg> ok, shattered
<dredg> can't survive on 4hrs sleep/night
* dredg beds
<Treenaks> argh, *need to report loads of X bugs*
<bdale> Lathiat: pong
* Mithrandir waves to bdale and feels bad for not having a fixed ia32-libs to give back to him
<Lathiat> bdale: sent you an email
<bdale> Lathiat: ah, thanks
<Lathiat> bdale: :)
<Lathiat> theyre rather annoying when your speakers are turned up too loud
<bdale> Lathiat: agreed
<bddebian> Sorry to ask but any of you know much about qt-x11-free?
<herve> yoohoo!
<bddebian> ?
<herve> I've just seen launchpad is officially launched!
<bddebian> Oh, cool
<Treenaks> *sigh*.. I get a new laptop, native resolution not supported by default
<Treenaks> had to hand-edit xorg.conf :(
<herve> Treenaks, bearable, mine heats too much
<Lathiat> Treenaks: what resolution?
<Treenaks> Lathiat: 1280x800 (1200x800 is supported.. see #8509)
<Treenaks> herve: hm, heat stuff works fine here
<ogra> Treenaks, nine runs fine with that res.
<Lathiat> not a dell inspiron 8600 by any chance? :)
<Treenaks> herve: but battery status seems unsupported :(
<Lathiat> s/8600/700m
<herve> I think this dell is just bad designed
<Treenaks> ogra: it /runs/ fine, it just doesn't detect it correctly, and you can't select it from the list in dpkg-reconfigure
<Lathiat> i8k module gives more acpi stuff
<herve> Treenaks, sounds like acpi table to patch
<Lathiat> on dells
<Treenaks> herve: yes :(
<Lathiat> modprobe i8k force=1
<Treenaks> it's not a dell, it's an Acer
<ogra> Treenaks, in the Monitor section ? or at the supported res. section ?
<Lathiat> ah ok
<herve> Treenaks, it's easy though, the patch is already in the ubuntu kernel
<Treenaks> ogra: both
<herve> just a magic key and a file to append to the initrd
<Treenaks> oh that
<Treenaks> but where do I find a fixed dsdt?
<herve> acpi.sf.net
<herve> see dsdt on the left
<ogra> Treenaks, oh, i have it on the resolution selection, but its missing in the second list
<herve> but you'll need to compile the asl file
<herve> intel provides a compiler for it but I can't compile it ;-)
<ogra> Treenaks, ati or nvidia ?
<herve> so I use the windows binary
<Treenaks> ogra: ati
<ogra> ouch
<Treenaks> works fine
<Treenaks> even 3d/dri works
<Treenaks> out of the box!
<herve> although it works better when the card is inside ;-)
<ogra> but your resolution doesnt ;-P
<Treenaks> (too bad my clean install now has Elmo, mdz and sabdfl on the gdm screen, but hey)
<herve> lol
<ogra> Treenaks, i know daniels is on it currently....(the widescreen stuff)
<Treenaks> ogra: oh, not the gdm login image stuff :P
<ogra> Treenaks, i know.... i refuse to log into elmos belly :) just have seen the screnshots everywhere
<Treenaks> ogra: :P
<Treenaks> but I really love widescreen
<ogra> yeah
<herve> but no ubuntu calendar this month?
<Treenaks> terminal AND BROWSER
<ogra> its cool
<ogra> herve, be patient....
<herve> I can't :-p
<Treenaks> ogra: http://www.tic-ohz.de/~fabiand/stuff/gdm/gdm-pixel_girl.tar.bz2
<Treenaks> (http://www.tic-ohz.de/~fabiand/stuff/gdm/screenshot_pixel_girl.jpg)
<ogra> Treenaks, the question is, was it worth not going to UDU ?
<Treenaks> ogra: not going to UDU is not a financial thing, it's a deadlines-at-work thing
<Treenaks> ogra: I wish it was a money thing ;)
<ogra> Treenaks, that picture is a bit older :) already seen it
<ogra> heh
<Treenaks> ogra: still, that's a belly you would like to login to :P
<ogra> yeah
<herve> I don't find her that old :-)
<Treenaks> herve: old enough :P:
* ogra wonders if elmos belly naked and with some drops of beer wouldnt even look better too *g*
<Treenaks> *shudder*
<ogra> hehe
<herve> ogra, I think you need to take some of those blue pills :-)
<ogra> lol
<bddebian> Hey, part of that picture is missing!! ;-)
<Treenaks> herve: actually, he might need to take the whole bottle at once :P
<herve> bddebian, it's free software, do it yourself :-p
<ogra> bddebian, you mean the face ? ;-P
<bddebian> ogra: Uhm, yeah, something like that.. :-)
<ogra> heh
<bddebian> Any of you know how to build qt-x11-free without firebird?
<herve> ./configure --without-firebird ?
<ogra> bddebian, probably #kubuntu-devel ?
<bddebian> Nay :-(
<ogra> (if there is such a channel)
<bddebian> ogra: OK, I'll try there, thanks
<bddebian> Ohh
<ogra> else #kubuntu , but i dont know how many devs are there
<dholbach> hellas!
<dholbach> how are you all?
<schweeb> tired
<dholbach> me too
<dholbach> had a charming thai dinner
<dholbach> with a lovely girl
<schweeb> nice
<dholbach> now some black tea and i can go on with apt-get.org ;-)
* schweeb just sent in a resume for an admin position
<dholbach> oh cool
<dholbach> where?
<schweeb> same place metallikop works
<schweeb> EDS
<dholbach> eds?
<schweeb> big data processing place
<schweeb> used to be part of GM
<dholbach> ah ok
<dholbach> did they say when you'll get answer?
<schweeb> hopefully soon
<dholbach> oh i hope all the best for you!
<schweeb> it's a pretty pimp job, supposedly
<schweeb> lots of $$$, easy
<schweeb> and a work laptop
<dholbach> oh nice
<dredg> that reminds me
<dholbach> so you won't have to move?
<schweeb> well, not right away
* dredg pokes his friend in google to see where his job application has ended up
<schweeb> it's almost an hour away, so I'll move closer eventually
<schweeb> but, hopefully, this'll give me more time to devote to Ubuntu interests
<schweeb> I'll give more details as soon as I actually get the job :)
<dredg> jbailey: what does the patch do?
<dholbach> travelling to work/studies is really a big PITA
<dredg> jbailey: i'm using lvm with sata on i386
<schweeb> about everyone but sabdfl will be jealous at how sweet it is :D
<dholbach> schweeb: be sure to tell us :-)
<jbailey> dredg: I keeps md from conflicting with evms.
* schweeb screams with glee
<jbailey> dredg: It shouldn't touch lvm at all, but I'd rather not find out after I upload. =)
<schweeb> COOLNESS
<schweeb> dholbach: "I have not yet reviewed Chris's resume, but with both Aaron's and Gordon's
<schweeb> recommendation, I am certain to interview him."
<schweeb> <3 <3 <3
<dholbach> WOWOWOWOW!!!
<jbailey> schweeb: Grats. =)
<schweeb> fastest. response. ever.
<schweeb> I'm goin out tonight to get drunk!
<dholbach> GRATULATION!
<dholbach> :-)))
<dredg> jbailey: right. i have this love of my data...
<jbailey> dredg: Bah, so picky. =)
<jbailey> dredg: The patch is a one line change that tells evms not to get in the way when building the initrd.
<dredg> jbailey: yeah, i'm a complete wanker that way
<dredg> send me the patch :)
<dredg> apply patch, rebuild initrd, boot? yes?
<jbailey> The worst that should be able to happen is that your system won't boot.  Keeping a copy of the old initrd.img should be enough for that.
<jbailey> dredg: Add step of save backup initrd, but yes.
<dredg> jbailey: niall@evil.ie
<dredg> gimme!
<jbailey> 'kay, will email it.
<dredg> don't matter
<dredg> i'll cnp
<jbailey> dredg: Cool.  It applies to /usr/share/initrd-tools/probe.d
<jbailey>  /evms
<dredg> actually i've a new kernel waiting to upgrade
* dredg upgrades that first
<dredg> i'll squirrel away a copy of the initrd
<dredg> then test your patch
<dredg> it looks utterly safe though
<jbailey> dredg: Right.  But this is still a bad time in the release cycle to find out that it's not somehow. =)
<jbailey> FWIW it boots my i386 ia32 system fine.
<jbailey> I should figure out lvm enough one day to have a test system with it.
<jbailey> Maybe when I replace the laptop.
<dredg> lvm++
<jbailey> So I've heard.  I played a bit with evms yesterday, and it looked lovely until it ate my partition table.
<herve> good night all, see you later
<dredg> i've not used evms
<jbailey> Don't use it on ppc, apparently. =)
<dredg> heh ok
<jbailey> Aside from that, it does make for a neatish way of doing volume maps, snapshots, standby partitions and all that.
<crimsun> jani: pong
<dredg> my mp3s :(
<jbailey> dredg: Eh?
<dredg> nothing :)
<jbailey> Oh good.
<dredg> worked fine
<jbailey> You /quit message reminds me of my favourite almost-Nietzsche quote:
<jbailey> "Love is a snowmobile racing across the tundra and then suddenly it flips over, pinning you underneath. At night, the ice weasels come."
<dredg> nice
<dredg> i shall quote that to my girlfriend
<bddebian> heh
<jbailey> dredg: *lol*
<jbailey> dredg: You should know that Matt Groening made it up then and attributed it to Nietzsche. =)
<dredg> hahahahaha
<dredg> brilliant
<dredg> Groening is some funny man
<jani> crimsun
<crimsun> jani: hi
<jani> I am working on th ebroken plugin packages
<jani> hi :)
<crimsun> jani: ok.
<crimsun> jani: 'xfce4' is installable now. :-)
<jani> too bad both of us have spamlike email addresses so we do not know what the other uploads
<jani> yup I installed it :)
<jani> thanks btw great and fast work, hurray!
<crimsun> ok, I'll create a new section on MOTUXfce
<jani> I tried xfld-desktop and that won't go
<jani> btw did exo not get pulled in?
<crimsun> right, I think we should rebuild meta-xfce4 and strip those two xfld* binaries
<jani> yup
<crimsun> exo should be in multiverse
<jani> but anyway the plugins do not build because of missing libgtk-dev in Bd: so I am updating those
<jani> with a script :)
<crimsun> great
<crimsun> ah, I see exo hasn't made it in yet
<crimsun> I'll go ahead and rebuild meta-xfce4 and remove the xfld* packages
<jbailey> dredg: Anyhow, thanks for the test, I'll upload it now then.
<schweeb> did anyone else notice my debacle with Fleck on planet GNOME?
<dredg> schweeb: no?
<dholbach> you're on planet gnome?
<dredg> jbailey: np
* dholbach didnt even know
<schweeb> dredg: no
<schweeb> Fleck is though :)
<schweeb> we changed planet arslinux into Fleck Planet for the day
<schweeb> and I copied an pasted one of his posts into my blog
<schweeb> and someone linked him to it
<jani> yup the xfce-XX-plugin packs start showing up on lamonts log as successful :) cool
<schweeb> he got all upset cause I plagiarised
<jani> I jsut uploaded a dozen of them
<schweeb> didn't understand it was all an April Fool's day joke
<crimsun> jani: rockin'
<schweeb> http://www.schweeb.org/blog/ and http://www.inkstain.net/fleck/
<schweeb> too bad he removed his first post after I apologized :-/
<jani> scweeb is EDS that company with that cat herding commercial? :)
<jani> than you got a tough job ahead of you
<jani> schweeb ^^
<dholbach> i think he's really funny and people that accuse him of not-blogging-about-gnome are lame :-)
<schweeb> jani: yes
<jani> nice
<schweeb> I'd be working at Chrysler though
<hsprang> hy alltogether
<crimsun> back later.
#ubuntu-motu 2005-04-13
<dholbach> good night
<crimsun> night daniel
* Mithrandir waves to dholbach 
<dholbach> bye crimsun, Mithrandir
<tseng> thats awfully early for him
<ogra> yep, he has to help a friend moving
<Burgundavia> anybody else seriously annoyed by the new "feature" of nautilus?
<dredg> no
* ogra is very happy with it
<tseng> what feature is that
<ogra> tseng, left and middlebutton behavior changed in nautilus
<tseng> if you mean closing the parent window
<tseng> it bugs the sh** out of me
<crimsun> I thought he meant the auto-closing of parent
<tseng> how do i change it back
<ogra> it has a gconf key
<ogra> see nautilus hangelog
<crimsun>   * debian/patches/02_ubuntuspatial.patch:
<crimsun>     - changes to the spatial mode. Close the folders by default while browsing.
<crimsun>       You can set "/apps/nautilus/preferences/no_ubuntu_spatial" to get the
<crimsun>       previous spatial behaviour.
<crimsun> eek, sorry about that
<tseng> why in the world would we do that
<ogra> tseng, sabdfls word ;)
<tseng> UGH
<Burgundavia> ugh
<Burgundavia> gconf key>
<Burgundavia> ?
<Burgundavia> whose idea of crazy was that? (Yes i know it was marks)
<ogra> Burgundavia, i like it...like i said :) if you dont, just switch it back
<Burgundavia> ok
<Burgundavia> -devel or just ubuntu for a discussion on it?
<tseng> it makes sense to say "just switch it" for a theme or a wallpaper
<tseng> this is a little more buh, its buried deep in gconf
<Burgundavia> tseng: http://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=8516
<Burgundavia> read that
<tseng> and, at the last second i should note
<ogra> tseng, thats not last second....
<tseng> last week?
<Burgundavia> almost last second
<ogra> wait until release day ;)
<StoneTable> working to package libapache2-mod-ldap-userdir.  we've got 1.1.4, debian has 1.1.7.  For something like this (mostly minor bug fixes, but does fix the build problem), should I just package up the newer version?
<ogra> clearlooks was pulled in 1h before preview....thats last minute
<tseng> that was also preview.
<tseng> and it also made sense
<ogra> i think the nautilus change makes a lot of sense for newbies
<tseng> i dont
<Burgundavia> i also don't
<tseng> i think windows jumping around like babies on crack, and the old one disappearing will confuse newbies silly
<Burgundavia> it makes "swimming up the tree" very difficult
<koke> w00t?!?
<koke> spatial is great!
<tseng> you need to be familiar with the old spacial behaviour before you have any fucking clue what is happening at all
<tseng> if you wanted to be friendly to people coming from windows, you would give them browser mode
<Burgundavia> now, the old spatial wasn't really that must better with it barfing screens all over the place
<tseng> well, once you realize that every window is spatial
<koke> how is the "new" mode??
<tseng> koke: its like doing shift+click
<ogra> swapped middle and leftclick
<tseng> koke: the new window opens, and the old one closes
<koke> hummm, not as bad
<crimsun> (I admit I've not used nautilus in some time)
<Burgundavia> middle clicks and gconf keys are really not discoverable
<Burgundavia> that was my major beef
<tseng> absolutely they arent.
<koke> tseng: talking about windows user, IIRC win98 default behaviour was like "old" spatial
<tseng> sabdfl: what is the rationale for this nautilus change please?
<tseng> koke: windows 95
<dredg> koke: that was windows 95
<dredg> it's now 10 years later :)
<tseng> koke: was psuedo-spatial
<tseng> in fact, it was window-per-folder, not spatial at all
<dredg> that said, i hate all file managers. none really feel comfortable to use
<tseng> spatial includes remembering windows size and position
<tseng> every window relates in a 1 to 1 with an object
<tseng> folder, file, what have you
<tseng> and it has its own properties which are persistant
<koke> oh, my mind try to remove those remembrances :)
<tseng> windows did none of those.
<tseng> i can see the threads on osnews now
<tseng> "i tried ubuntu but it sucks because windows pop up at random omglolbbq
<koke> would you find useful an options in nautilus preferences dialog to set the behaviour??
<dredg> i think you mistyped o*ne*s
<Burgundavia> I want to be an option
<Burgundavia> just not the default one
<tseng> i would find it less offensive if it had a preference
<Burgundavia> and not having it an option to turn off in the GUI means that it should never ever have been considered
<tseng> but i still dont understand it at all
<tseng> its not spatial or browser, its broken for everyone
<tseng> except ogra.
<ogra> :)
<Burgundavia> tseng: have you added your comments to 8516?
<tseng> yes
<tseng> but not at length
<tseng> since sabdfl isnt even cc'd
<tseng> and the bug is closed
<ogra> tseng, the alternative for me would be a broken shift key, since i used it a lot....
<Burgundavia> what is his email?
<Burgundavia> I will add it to the cc
<ogra> Burgundavia, he wrote to the ML
<Burgundavia> ok
<ogra> very recently
<Burgundavia> which one?
<ogra> apt-get org for example
<Burgundavia> sorry
<Burgundavia> duh
<Burgundavia> I read that as he had written something about this to an ML
<ogra> no, for the mail address :)
<Burgundavia> hmm
<Burgundavia> mark@canonical won't take in bugzilla
<tseng> he might not even be signed up
<tseng> he is not directly involved in development
<Burgundavia> he is in bugzilla
<Mithrandir> Burgundavia: just type mark and you'll get a list of choiced.
<Burgundavia> but under something else then
<Mithrandir> uhm, choices
* jani just changed dch to add ubuntu automatically
<koke> which should be the text for the preference??
<koke> "C_lose folder when opening a children" ??
<Burgundavia> close folder when opening a subfolder
<koke> previous folder??
<Burgundavia> close previous folder when opening a subfolder?
<koke> yep
<Burgundavia> that could work
<Burgundavia> is this going in asap?
<jani> goodnight all
<koke> which is exactly the gconf preference??
<koke> true == old behaviour, or true == new behaviour??
<koke> Burgundavia: only if I'm able to hack nautilus :)
<Burgundavia> ok
<Burgundavia> I would say, from a usablity perspective, that is should be unchecked
<Burgundavia> change the backend to suit that
<Burgundavia> thus checked== close parent
<Burgundavia> (the current and rather dumb default behaviour)
<Burgundavia> ogra: ping
<diamond> lo folks
<ogra> Burgundavia, pong
<Burgundavia> ogra: do you drag and drop files between folders?
<ogra> Burgundavia, mostly only from the desktop to folders
<Burgundavia> ok
<Burgundavia> just wondering
<ogra> or the other way around....
<Burgundavia> I just realized how often I do it
<Burgundavia> and how borked the new scheme is for that
<diamond_>  /msg nickserv link diamond 9639365
<diamond_> oh nice
<diamond_> very nice
* diamond_ hangs head
<diamond_> anyway.... i have a question, dredg uploaded a package for me earlier (http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/s/snacc/1.3bbn-5.1ubuntu2/),
* Amaranth ghosts
<diamond_> but it doesn't build. however, that version isn't avialable in apt,
<Burgundavia> nice password
<diamond_> when fixing the package, should i incement the version to ubuntu3?
<dredg> steve you chump :)
<dredg> yes
<diamond> dredg: right
<dredg> bump the version
<dredg> the old files from earlier are still in the archive. reuploading is bad, wrong and bad
<lamont> diamond: that _source_ isn't in the archive?
<lamont> dredg: uploading new files with the same version will just get rejected...
<diamond> lamont: ' apt-cache showsrc snacc' shows ubuntu1
<dredg> lamont: yeah, been there.
<lamont>     *  snacc_1.3bbn-5.1ubuntu2.diff.gz
<lamont>     * snacc_1.3bbn-5.1ubuntu2.dsc
<lamont>     * snacc_1.3bbn.orig.tar.gz
<lamont> that'd be ubuntu2 in the archive...
<lamont> diamond: hence your mirror is out of date, or you haven't said 'apt-get update' in a while
<diamond> lamont: right, probably the latter, so my bad
<diamond> i'll just be very quiet now -)
<lamont> heh
* koke building nautilus with new patch...
<koke> what a clean code! it's sooo easy to hack it :)
<diamond> lamont: ah. i am vindicated! t'was my mirror. they probably only sync every 6 hours or someat. 'bout time it wasn't my fault for something -)
<lamont> heh
<diamond> (at least i just did an update, and still ubuntu1)
<dredg> diamond: what mirror?
<diamond> dredg: heanet
<dredg> hmm
<dredg> esat is out of sync too
<dredg> ah
<dredg> @ERROR: max connections (15) reached - try again later
<dredg> that's in the heanet log
<StoneTable> if anyone has time, I could use a review (libapache2-mod-ldap-userdir): http://thorin.battleaxe.net/~stone/hoary/
<koke> Burgundavia: I got it!!! :D
<Burgundavia> koke: ?
<Burgundavia> the patch works?
<koke> the nautilus patch
<Burgundavia> cool
<koke> yeah, it works :D
<koke> but has a bug
<Burgundavia> now we can stop this insanity by offering the option
<Burgundavia> bug?
<koke> well, the bug was really for seb128's patch
<koke> in the new behaviour
<Burgundavia> ah
<Burgundavia> what is the bug?
<koke> if you open the parent window (Alt+Up), the current one keeps open
<Burgundavia> I see
<Burgundavia> got that too
<Burgundavia> not a major bug though
<tseng> ugh @ monodoc
<diamond> right. sleeping time. nite folks
<Vollstrecker> Hi all.
<Burgundavia> salut
<Vollstrecker> Why has libcurl3 such an old version?
<Vollstrecker> In debian sarge is 7.13.1 I have an amule pkg for sarge, and the ubuntu of my tester can't install it because of the too old version.
<ajmitch> hi all
<ajmitch> libcurl3 in hoary?
<Vollstrecker> pe7er knows what he uses. He told me.
<ajmitch> 7.13.1 would have been uploaded after the upstream version freeze
<ajmitch> it appears to be in main, not universe
<Vollstrecker> I don't know, I use only sarge.
<lamont> ajmitch: is in main
<ajmitch> yep, 7.13.0-1 has a changelog entry of 5th Feb, well after UVF
<Vollstrecker> 7.13.1 is required.
<lamont> https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=8088
<ajmitch> Vollstrecker: we can't do anything about packages in main here
<ajmitch> and I don't think there'd be much chance of a change at this late stage in the release cycle, sorry
<lamont> ajmitch: and it takes an act of god, pretty much, to change libraries in main less than a week before release
<lamont> it'll be in breezy once that opens, though... :)
<ajmitch> lamont: or sabdfl :)
<lamont> god == mdz
<Vollstrecker> I have no prob with this, but it would be nice, that ubuntu users could have easy to update cvs snaps of amule.
<lamont> the archangel == jdub
<Vollstrecker> I thought ubuntu is based on sid, how can they have older versions than in sarge?
<lamont> this late in the game, even sabdfl at least listens to mdz
<ajmitch> because ubuntu tracks sid up until upstream version freeze, and then doesn't grab any new packages automatically
<ajmitch> sarge is still unfrozen apart from base, so packages can migrate into testing
<Vollstrecker> When is your freeze?
<Vollstrecker> Or release
<ajmitch> release is in a week
<Vollstrecker> And then came new pkg's
<Vollstrecker> ?
<ajmitch> once it is reopened
<tseng> FUCK YEAH MUINE
<Burgundavia> ?
<tseng> im not sure if these packages are good enough to release
<tseng> but they work
<arzajac> Hello.  Is there anyone here?
<crimsun> sure, what's up?
<arzajac> There is a bug in sl-modem-source
<arzajac> It would be really easy to fix it and make sl-modem-modules.  Would this be possible for Hoary?
<crimsun> what's the bug?
<arzajac> http://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2005-March/006183.html
<arzajac> Basically, it makes modules for debian using kernel-headers.
<arzajac> It can be changed to linux-headers.
<crimsun> hmm
<arzajac> Is it too late for this.  Can the sl-modem-modules package be introduced?
<crimsun> there should not be a sl-modem-modules* package.
<arzajac> Why?
<crimsun> that's created by the user by compiling from sl-modem-source.
<crimsun> sl-modem-modules is replaced by sl-modem-modules-new
<arzajac> Yes, but then the user must download module-assistant and the sl-modem-source.  It would be easier to just make the modules for the user.
<crimsun> that's only done for ubuntu-maintainable ones, i.e. in 'main'
<arzajac> I am quite active on the forums.  I would assume that this represents about 35-50 per cent of all winmodems in North-America.
<arzajac> ...Judging from the amount of questions on this.  Also, this driver can be used with most AC97 codec modems,  That is significant.
<arzajac> Because Universi is not updated
<arzajac> Because Universe is not updated/maintained after release?
<crimsun> universe is frozen for Hoary when Hoary releases and unfrozen for Breezy as soon as it opens
<crimsun> I think the Depends needs to be changed, yes.
<arzajac> So modules made today would become obsolete and not be updated.  Is there any way to put the modules elsewhere?
<crimsun> kernel-image-_KVERS_ | linux-image-_KVERS_ should suffice
<arzajac> Right.  At least the packages generated would work.
<crimsun> I should have caught that last time around.
<arzajac> I should have notified you six months ago when the first complaints came in on the forums.
<crimsun> well, I was asked yesterday to modify a different field in debian/control, which I did, but I didn't check the rest
<arzajac> The lucent modem drivers were added to restriced-modules.  Any chance here?  ( I know it is late!)
<arzajac> ...That would be a new feature...
<arzajac> And the modules are useless without the daemon.
<crimsun> essentially, you're asking if we can compile an sl-modem-modules-new-$arch for every linux-image-$arch ?
<crimsun> s/arch/uname -r/g
<arzajac> They only work on 386 AFAIK.
<arzajac> It is a precompiled binary from SmartLink.
<crimsun> yes, for each arch under i386
<arzajac> Oh.  Yes.
<crimsun> hmm.  It's not my call (and I think this should be discussed in #ubuntu-kernel, too).
<arzajac> I understand.  I am willing to help in any way.  I only wish I had navigated the wiki sooner.
<arzajac> Is there any work a guy like me can do to help right now?
<crimsun> I'll go ahead and fix s/kernel/linux/g
<crimsun> but I don't feel it's wise to generate kernel modules for each arch under i386 without speaking with the rest of the kernel team
<arzajac> Okay.  Thanks.  I gotta go -  the baby's crying....
<crimsun> np.
<crimsun> hey robitaille
<robitaille> hi crimsun
<StoneTable> Anyone feel like reviewing prj2make? http://thorin.battleaxe.net/~stone/hoary/
<crimsun> oh geez, yeah, I should take a look at the ToDo
<crimsun> StoneTable: please put a link on MOTUTodo
<StoneTable> okay, will do :)
<crimsun> thanks.
<schweeb> howdy
<crimsun> howdy
<bddebian> Hello schweeb
<ajmitch> howdy
<bddebian> ajmitch!!
<ajmitch> bddebian!!!1one!
<bddebian> ajmitch:  Hey, are you gonna get a different laptop or do you still want me to send you the memory and such??
<ajmitch> I'll get a different laptop
<ajmitch> but not for quite a few months yet
<ajmitch> maybe not till the end of the year, so feel free to send the RAM :)
<bddebian> Or do you want the whole laptop?? :-)
<ajmitch> hah. that'd be nice :)
<ajmitch> what is the laptop?
<ajmitch> near-death?
<bddebian> No it's my old Dell.  650Mhz but needs a keyboard and the battery latch is broken so it falls out easily.. :-(
<ajmitch> probably similar than the cdrom latch on the current one
<ajmitch> it's a different model latitude, right?
<crimsun> Xfce 4.2.1.1 transition complete.
* crimsun breathes a sigh of relief.
<ajmitch> good work, crimsun :)
<crimsun> danke
<crimsun> jani did nearly all the plugins :)
* ajmitch might have to take a look at xfce :)
<crimsun> as simple as apt-getting xfce4 :-)
<bddebian> ajmitch: Yeah it's a CPx but the keyboard in your CPi might fit
<ajmitch> alright
<bddebian> Well there goes my Ubuntu box.. ;-P
<ajmitch> heh, I couldn't take that off you..
<ajmitch> you need something for MOTU work ;)
<bddebian> Nah, that's OK. I have another laptop waiting in the wings at work. :-)
<bddebian> Bah, you know I'm worthless.. :-)
* lamont gives back everything that was building, dep-wait, or failed, on all architectures.  enjoyh
<ajmitch> lamont: thanks :)
<lamont> ajmitch: the biggest effect it will have is to cause things you're currently working on that are down the list a ways to not get built for an hour or 12.
<ajmitch> not too much of a problem here, I think
<lamont> OTOH, out-of-date things (older version is in the archive) are built first
<schweeb> man, some people really reacted pretty strongly to the Ubuntu login prank.  I thought it was hilarious (man, I didn't think mdz was that young)
<Lathiat> yeh i thought it was pretty funny
<ajmitch> someone claiming his computer had been raped ;)
<schweeb> I got to work, started my PC up, and cracked up
<bddebian> heh
<Lathiat> so who was in it
<schweeb> and then there was the whole Fleck thing
<schweeb> I laughed for a good 3 hours straight this morning
<schweeb> Lathiat: top is elmo (ftp-master and admin), right is sabdfl (shuttleworth), left is mdz
<Lathiat> ah cool
<Lathiat> http://www.whiprush.org/2005/04/back_to_solaris.html <- haha
<Lathiat> " The other, more popular theory is that the user merely starved to death waiting for Netbeans 4 to launch on the Sun machines."
<schweeb> yea
<schweeb> I was at the bar with whip earlier
<schweeb> he was still wearing the Sun shirt
<schweeb> lol
<Lathiat> heh
* lamont tries to understand the 0-25,  25-50, 50-75, ... on UniversePriorityList
<schweeb> lamont: well, the percentages are a bit off now, since some packages have been knocked out already
<schweeb> and by a bit, I mean a lot
<lamont> yeah, but % of what?
<schweeb> the original list
<lamont> ??
<lamont> percent of the distance down the list?
<schweeb> yes
<lamont> oj
<lamont> ok even
<schweeb> they were ordered by popcon
<schweeb> and then divided by distance
<schweeb> hence making it easier to accomplish a goal of fixing the top 25% of packages according to popcon
<tseng> "
<tseng> I've added links to the corresponding directories for all hoary packages
<tseng> now.
<tseng> "
<tseng> http://higgs.djpig.de/ubuntu/www/hoary/gnome/muine
<tseng> by request :)
<crimsun> oh excellent, higgs is back
<crimsun> and taylored to ubuntu.
<tseng> yep
<tseng> we asked him to add links to build logs
<crimsun> yeah, that rocks
<tseng> indeed
<Usiu> Hi, I get compilation error 48:38: X11/extensions/scrnsaver.h: No such file or directory and I have libxext-dev instaled what's more the file doesnt contain that header...
<schweeb> libxss-dev
<Usiu> schweeb, thx
<schweeb> no problem
<Usiu> schweeb, is it ubuntu specyfic or it's as on debian ?
<schweeb> I've run into that problem before, myself :)
<schweeb> can't remember.
<schweeb> use packages.debian.org to check
<Usiu> schweeb, I moved to ubuntu but I want still to maintain unofficial debian packages.. I have a sponsor now..
<tseng> Usiu: use a pbuilder chroot with unstable
<schweeb> ^^^^
<Usiu> tseng, yes.. I always use it for building for sid/sarge
<tseng> well then
<tseng> that will verify your deps by force
<hsprang> good morning :)
<dholbach> morning
<siretart> hello world :)
<dholbach> hey siretart
<siretart> huhu dholbach
<siretart> how are things going?
<dholbach> quite good... i should be helping a friend move, but he didnt tell me his adress, so i have some more time reviewing apt-get.org untill he tells me
<siretart> :)
<dholbach> apart from that: the guys were pretty active in tackling build problems
* siretart noticing dholbach skripts for universe priority list
<siretart> :)
<dholbach> i'm really proud of everyone in #ubuntu-motu
<dholbach> :-)
<siretart> :)
<siretart> I finally managed to write my wiki page.. ;)
<dholbach> yes! :-)
<siretart> is anything missing?
<siretart> btw, is universe frozen for hoary? when does breezy start?
<dholbach> on your wiki page?
<dholbach> universe will not be frozen until hoary release
<siretart> ah, ok
<dholbach> (april, 8th)
<dholbach> gladly
<dholbach> :-)
<dholbach> i guess breezy will start right after UDU, but i'm not sure at all
<dholbach> thing will be pretty bumpy after the auto-sync, i guess
<dholbach> your wiki page looks good to me
<dholbach> you could add a list of packages you fixed
<siretart> wuuhu :)
<siretart> ah, ok, will do..
<dholbach> so everyone will know you BELONG here
<dholbach> :-)
<dholbach> as a MOTU
<siretart> btw, do you happen to know why cpp-2.95 is missing on ppc and amd64?
<dholbach> not at all
<siretart> hm
<dholbach> i guess doko will be able to tell
<siretart> shoudn't it be in main?
<siretart> I think gcc-2.95 is quite a bit outdated, but still usable...
<dholbach> i guess it's no longer supported
<siretart> hm
<dholbach> and we should start a plan of chucking it out when breezy is open
<siretart> then it would be a good candidate for main
<Mithrandir> gcc-2.95 doesn't work on amd64.
<dholbach> there are some packages hard-depending on it, so we should tackle those first
<siretart> I don't have an amd64 yet, so I have no clue about that..
<siretart> ok
<dholbach> hey jani
<jani> hey dholbach
<dholbach> jani: how's xfce coming along?
<jani> I have it installed ;)
<jani> there are still some helper apps to be built
<dholbach> ah ok
<dholbach> cool!
<dholbach> :-)
<jani> but not xfce4-core apps just things the xfce livecd guys added
<jani> I wanted to see if crimsun is around to see how we share the load :)
<doko> gcc-2.95 is in sarge/unstable to satisfy some very old build deps, i.e. 2.0 and 2.2 kernels. it shouldn't be used for anything else ...
<jani> both crimsun's and my email address is banned from hoary-changes
<jani> so we don't know what the state is (spamfilter)
<siretart> doko: ah, thanks for explanation..
<dholbach> jani: lists.ubuntu.com/archives/hoary-changes/2005-March/thread.html
<jani> dholbach I mean hoary-changes does not _receive_ from us :)
<jani> so noone sees what we upload :)
<dholbach> arg yes, ok... of course
<jani> we work under the veil of secrecy
<dholbach> jani: good one... did you upload the kernel-image i gave you? ;-)
<jani> yup
<jani> all set :)
<dholbach> rock :-)
<dholbach> i guess debian/copyright: "freeware" isn't really redistributable
<siretart> freeware is not excatly a license, I would consider that rather than intention..
<siretart> s/than/as an/
<siretart> example: one could consider sun java as freeware, because you can download it free of charge
<dholbach> i have loads of doom-levels, fortune cookies, ... stuff here, that is either not building or has funny licenses
<siretart> I think it would be best to ask the author under which terms he would allow redistribution, with pointer to bsd oder gpl license
<dholbach> yeah... i'll do that for breezy
<dholbach> atm i just look what builds and is ok
<jani> dholbach how is the pat-ge.org progressing?
<jani> apt-get
<dholbach> www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/AptGetOrg
<dholbach> i think i do quite well
<jani> whow lot's of work there
<dholbach> yup
<jani> popcon is the guide?
<dholbach> that's why i didnt help out with the build-lists
<dholbach> jani: no... not for apt-get.org
<jani> maybe there should have been a poll on ubuntu-users
<dholbach> i checked each and every source repo
<jani> there might be a lot of useless sw out there
<dholbach> _source_
<dholbach> yes
<dholbach> i weeded out the woody backports
<dholbach> and wrote a script that checked if we have the source packages already in
<dholbach> and wrote mail templates to all those guys :-)
<jani> :)
<jani> spam eh?
<dholbach> python ROCKS
<dholbach> no... didnt send them out yet
<jani> yep it sure does
<dholbach> i only wished people would use pbuilder to check their packaging
<jani> dholbach I don't (yet) ;P
<jani> I did not yet figure out how to reuse apt-cache
<jani> and want to do that before using pbuilder
<dholbach> didn't want to blame you for anything
<jani> but I have to otherwise it's too tedious and error prone
<dholbach> but your packaging is more reliable
<dholbach> :-)
<jani> I know I just admitted it
<jani> hello, I am jani and I do not use pbuilder, next ? ;)
<dholbach> jani: good to have you around... even without pbuilder :-)
<jani> ubuntu 1 point below mandrake for 6 months statistics onm distrowatch!
<jani> thanks
<jani> I have a feeling by the end of the year ubuntu will be almost synonimous to linux for many people
<dholbach> hahaha... yes! :-)
<jani> bbl
<dholbach> bye
<Treenaks> nnect, address 3
<Treenaks> uhm.. right?
* dholbach doesnt understand a single thing
<dholbach> hey koke
<dholbach> koke: NICE nautilus patch
<koke> dholbach: thanks :)
<dholbach> koke: did you ask seb128 for inclusion?
<Treenaks> I'm still of the opinion that big changes like that shouldn't be introduced during Deep Freeze
<koke> dholbach: no, yesterday when I finished, he has already leave
<koke> Treenaks: I agree
<dholbach> ah ok
<koke> I'd propose the change but defaulting to old behaviour
<dholbach> hope you don't just leave it on your harddisk
<dholbach> *ARGARGARG* 50MB NATIVE PACKAGE
<dholbach> thank god it ftbfs
<koke> dholbach: which package?!?
<dholbach> flightgear-scenery-w130n40 from  http://jeroen.coekaerts.be/debian/
<dholbach> unfortunately all those fortunes-* packages ftbfs too
<dholbach> arg... they're all native
<koke> w0w, flightgear is a huge package so the sceneries are
<koke> dholbach: where do you see that these ftbfs??
<koke> buildd logs??
<dholbach> i try
<dholbach> ALL
<koke> are they already imported?
<dholbach> no
<dholbach> that's why i'm trying :-)
<koke> hehe
<dholbach> www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/AptGetOrg
<Burgundavia> can I ask stupid question?
<sabdfl> nup
<Burgundavia> what is FTBFS
<sabdfl> fail to build from source
<Burgundavia> ah
<Burgundavia> ok
<Burgundavia> I knew it was a stupid questin
<siretart> Burgundavia: not at all, I also think it is rather an unobvious acronym..
<koke> I think I'm going to patch bsdgames ;)
<siretart> good idea :)
<koke> to add ftbfs and sabdfl to wtf :D
<siretart> ;)
<siretart> anyone here with an amd64? I think I fixed an ftbfs for amd64 (package libhdf4), but I cannot test it
<siretart> I found a patch from the debian amd64 guys claiming to fix it..
<dholbach> siretart: url?
<koke> who manages planet.ubuntu?? jdub??
<dholbach> koke: yes
<koke> he told me about a month ago "do you want to be in planet...?" and I'm not yet there  :)
<dholbach> mail him
<siretart> dholbach: http://siretart.tauware.de/ubuntu-packages/libhdf4
<siretart> upload just finished, builds on i386, so no regression
<dholbach> wow that's a patch :-)
<siretart> yeah. THAT wasn't my fault ;)
<siretart> there seems to be some scientific packages depending on that lib, I found it investigation some build failures which led me to that lib (never heard before about it)
<siretart> googling pointed me to a patch from debian-amd64 team. would be very nice if the patch would work
<dholbach> siretart: could you try to    dpkg-source -x *.dsc  on your source package?
<dholbach> i get this one: tar: Read 8192 bytes from -
<siretart> hae?! same here.. investigating..
<koke> to enable dpatch in a package, the patch-stamp goes into build or build-stamp??
<koke> I always forget that :(
<dholbach> koke: i forgot as well :-/
<koke> xD
<siretart> dholbach: the same on the original source package,
<siretart> dholbach: package seems to be extracted ok though..
<dholbach> siretart: ok
<dholbach> siretart: looks good, although the package could do with a shlibs file as well
<dholbach> oh sorry
<dholbach> seems not to be your fault (or of the package maintainer)
<ogra> morning
<dholbach> hey ogra
<siretart> huhu ogra
<koke> I have bsdgames patched :D
<dholbach> hahahahaaa :-)
<dholbach> sabdfl will like that
<dholbach> ;-)
<sabdfl> :-)
<dholbach> sabdfl: then you will receive 50 mails less each day, hm? :-)
<sabdfl> no, I'll *read* 50 mails less each day :-)
<dholbach> hehe :-)
<koke> I don't know if my key is already in the ring, dholbach do you want to upload??
<dholbach> koke: sure
<sabdfl> is there a way to use sed or vi to change all the occurrences of a string into something else in a whole bunch of files?
<koke> sabdfl: perl -pi -e 's/foo/bar/' file1 file2 ...
<koke> not sure if that works
<koke> do some tests first :D
<Treenaks> sed -i -e 's/a/b/' file1 file22
<sabdfl> ok koke :-)
<Treenaks> shuold work too
<dholbach> koke: done
<sabdfl> yay for revision control
<koke> that was my very frien for the python transition :D
<koke> grep -r "2\.3" ...
<jani> nit: both perl and sed though should add global in case something appears on the same line s/foo/bar/g
<jani> appears more than once I meant
<koke> jani: sure, I forgot the /g
<jani> do you guys think a patch to dch to know about ubuntu versioning would be in order?
<jani> cause I got my local dch modified
<jani> saves a few keystrokes and helps geratly in scripting
<jani> greatly
<ogra> jani, rather call it uch then, we still are a platform for DDs :)
<jani> well it works with plain debian versioning as well of course :)
<ogra> oh, its KI code :)
<siretart> alias uch='dch -D hoary' sounds reasonable
<ogra> s/KI/AI
<siretart> oh, with ubuntu versioning increment.. hmm i see..
<jani> not just that siretart but in generating new revision number make 2.3-1ubunut1 instead of 2.3-2 when the last is 2.3-1
<jani> ogra you lost me with KI AI :)
<dholbach> siretart: uploaded
<siretart> woohoo. lets see if it fixes some more amd64 packages :)
<ogra> jani, Artificial Intelligence :)
<jani> ah, nah just regexp stuff ;)
<ogra> jani, thats near ;)
<jani> I thought AI != BM
<jani> black magic
<ogra> vodoo
<jani> seriously ogra, do you think it'd harm anything if we had that changed, to handle our case?
<ogra> nope
<ogra> if it works like you described i dont see any harm...
<jani> ok, I'll ask the devscripts maintainer over in devel what they think
<dholbach> after building and reviewing 70 packages I get WTOOMUCHCRACK - i'm out on the flea market - see you later ;-)
<ogra> ciao dholbach, nice work :)
<ogra> enjoy the spring
<dholbach> ogra: will do :-)))))
<siretart> cu dholbach, have fun! :
<sabdfl> Treenaks, koke: you guys rock, the sed -i -e thing worked perfectly
<tseng> bye dholbach.
<jani> tseng how's mono packaging going?
<tseng> its fine
<jani> are you going for 1.1.x ?
<tseng> it works but its not cleaned up
<tseng> i dont think hoary is a great idea
<tseng> it wont go in for a few days, which would leave no time to fix stuff
<ogra> so no beagle ?
<siretart> tseng: do you think that a backport for mono 1.1 for hoary would be feasible?
<ogra> siretart, please avoid that word in here
<tseng> i think backports are bad.
<siretart> ogra: sorry
<ogra> heh
<jani> I still think it would be nice if universe remained open after hoary release for NEW packages only
<tseng> ...
<ogra> jani, we have breezy for that...
<jani> no regressions, but no need for some backports either
<jani> ogra, yes but you know how poeple are :)
<ogra> jani, there is no need at all for backports
<tseng> there will always be one piece of software that comes out after freeze
<tseng> and goes in the next release
<ogra> jani, and if i see how they are done (~ in the version number etc) i start crying
<jani> ogra, I agree that's wny such semi-closed hoary uni would make many backports unneeded
<siretart> is there some pointer to policy for hoary-updates? what goes in there for universe?
<tseng> people who want a "stable system" and "bleeding edge' are on their own
<ogra> siretart, nothing...
<tseng> and probably hitting too much pipe
<jani> it's not about bleeding-edge
<ogra> siretart, its a leftover of an idea afaik
<jani> no beagle at all vs beagle is not about bleeding edge but about having smt or not
<siretart> ogra: huh? whats hoary-updates for then?
<tseng> hoary-updates is for data loss bugs and calander updates
<jani> I don't want already existing sw in universe touched either
<ogra> jani, it is....if you cant wait 6 months tfor software to stabilize, its about bleeding edge
<jani> ogra,tseng it's not all black and white :)
<tseng> its is here :P
<ogra> siretart, it was an idea for warty....
<tseng> its in or its out
<jani> freezes do tend do categorize software in these two categories but real world is colorful
<tseng> like i said, software either makes the freeze or it doesnt
<ogra> jani, its our release plan...
<tseng> black, white
<siretart> ah, I understand, its similar to volatile.debian.org, yes?
<jani> but until we have better (with sound engineering foundation) methodolgies I guess we're stuck with it :)
<ogra> jani, and 6 months are not to long to wait for well tested stuff
<Burgundavia> night all
<ogra> night Burgundavia
<tseng> bye Burgundavia.
<jani> ogra, tseng people _will_ make backports even if we don't like it and users _will_ try those pesky repos anyway
<tseng> those users will break their upgrade path
<ogra> jani, yep, sad but true.... the bad thing is that they brak a lot...
<jani> it would be nicer if we had more endorsed aletrnatives so we avoid confusion and bugreports we have nothing to do with
<tseng> and we'll tell them why they wont do it again
<tseng> yeah dude, why dont we just package everything we can find
<jani> and so we waste our time because of them
<ogra> jani, nope, the right way is to convice the users like tseng said
<tseng> then we wont have to worry about it
<jani> convince users ;) where do you live ?
<tseng> we'll call that the "apt-get.org argument"
<jani> tseng, the plan is to package everything we can
<jani> I know about it and I am not refering to every piece of junk
<tseng> my personal plan is to make the best packages I can
<ogra> jani, we dont waste time on them....its up to the backport people to tell them how to fix it....and we get more and more users following our path through their experience
<tseng> with no regard to quantity
<jani> but tseng I would find it way nicer that if you can get beagle and mono 1.1 working in 2 weeks after the release but have a way of putting them in universe without introducing regressions since it is all NEW software it is way nicer for users
<jani> tseng, ack
<tseng> whats new software?
<jani> beagle
<tseng> mono, dbus-mono, monodoc
<jani> we dont have it yet do we?
<tseng> gtk-sharp
<tseng> i need to touch all of those
<tseng> and more.
<ogra> jani, but then we could stop making releases at all....
<tseng> then muine, f-spot blam did I make my point yet?
<tseng> none of that is NEW
<jani> tseng, I didn't know you have to touch other mono stuff
<jani> in that case I rest my case :)
<ogra> jani, if we set ourselves a deadline we have to cope with it....
<jani> ogra, I know
<jani> it's a misunderstaning
<jani> I thought beagle and mono-1.1 take a lot of time to package and test but that's all
<jani> didn't know they imply touching so many mono libraries
<tseng> ive spent hours for the last two days touching every piece
<tseng> jani: they are all currently installing in a non-standard path
<tseng> it needs to be undone is a certain order for the deptree
<jani> are you _the_ mono team ?
<tseng> there is a debian mono team
<tseng> who is seemingly too busy to do this job in the time frame id like
<jani> ok my argument wrt open for NEW only still stands, it's just that it doesn't apply to mono stuff :(
<tseng> then we'll agree to disagree
<jani> fair enough
<siretart> I'm looking for something eat, bbl!
<tseng> i dont want to be an ass, just i have different ideas on the direction of MOTU
<jani> you're not an ass I saw your hackergotchi :)
<jani> sure I understand
<tseng> which is less adding every piece of software to coddle users, and more making the stuff we do have nice.
<jani> my proposal by applying only to NEW packages is orthogonal and caters for making our stuff nice _and_ coddling users :)
<jani> however it is a 'what if' I don't care that much
<ogra> jani, its not arguable....if we freeze, we freeze for all parts of the distro...
<jani> ogra, I agree with freezing I only want to redefine the meaning of freeze ;)
<ogra> jani, we had this discussion in the last meeting
<jani> ogra, that was about uni being open to all
<jani> not just NEW packages
<jani> I wa sin that meeting
<jani> was in
<ogra> jani, in any case freeze is freeze and not arguable
<jani> OT: any way in the new gnome open dialog to enter the file path by hand?
<tseng> Ctrl+L
<jani> cool thanks!
<tseng> np.
<jani> wow it even does completion
<tseng> works in nautilus too.
<jani> I only use gnome open in firefox, I am using xfce
<tseng> ok.
<dholbach> re
<koke> hey, I know how to mobblog now :D
<koke> http://movil.amedias.org/post.php/2
<dholbach> you know what?
<koke> dholbach: post in a blog by my cell phone
<koke> actually by email
<dholbach> i never thought one could need that ;-)
<dholbach> but what i already thought about was waking my box up from my mobile :-)
<koke> dholbach: what's the policy for apt-get.org's ftbfs packages
<koke> fix the package, notify upstream, discard it,...?
<dholbach> koke: atm nothing
<dholbach> koke: because we won't have time
<dholbach> koke: but for next release, we can try to contact them and get them working in here
<dholbach> :-)
<koke> http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/l/lxdoom/1.4.4-9/lxdoom_1.4.4-9_20050327-0327-amd64-failed <-- quite strange
<koke> I guess builders will try again soon, won't they?
<koke> w0w, builders are crazy:
<koke>  /build/buildd/akregator-1.0-beta8/./configure: line 21: /dev/null: Permission denied
<koke> http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/a/akregator/1.0-beta8-2/akregator_1.0-beta8-2_20050327-0910-i386-failed
<motaboy> koke: akragato is now in kdepim 3.4
<motaboy> s/akragot/akregator
<koke> hmmm, to morgue then
<dholbach> yes
<motaboy> koke: there's an alone versions for systems with <=kde3.3
<dholbach> ok... 3 pbuilders running, i guess i can go a bit out again ;-)
<koke> motaboy: but I guess the binary akregator package from kdepim can run standalone...
<koke> dholbach: not a bad idea at all :)
<koke> time for a coffee?
<motaboy> koke: yeah.
<koke> dholbach: my firefox takes about a minute to load UniversePriorityList
<koke> should I split in two?
<dholbach> hrm
<dholbach> i think it's hard enough to keep all of the lists under control atm :-/
<dholbach> i'd rather leave it as it is
<koke> maybe a wiki is not the best option :)
<koke> and plone is very powerful but I don't like the resulting html
<siretart> koke: I already fixed lxdoom a few days ago, problem was some spurios "extern int errno;". This is http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=274929 btw
* koke going for a coffee
<dholbach> bye koke
<dholbach> alright... i'm out for a bit as well
<bddebian> Morning
<crimsun> jani: yep, I'm around
<crimsun> jani: currently debugging an xfdesktop4 bug with the root menu
<crimsun> (missing symbol)
<jani> I'm back too crimsun
<jani> I saw a bug related to the menu
<jani> I suppose that's what you're reffering too
<motaboy> I've got a question on cdbs.
<jani> I wonder why mousepad did not build
<motaboy> If I use the kde.mk rule, then dh_install is called different times for every package.
<motaboy> in this way if I had the --list-missing option, it will complain for the uninstalled files from the other package...
<motaboy> So I don't know what's the right way to look for missing files :(
<motaboy> s/had/add
<jani> sorry I know nothing about cdbs
<motaboy> jani: thanks anyway. :D
<lamont> koke: the dev/null permissions issues were part of the reason that I did the mass-giveback of hoary building/depwait/failed stuff.
<crimsun> jani: yeah, it's annoying :(  (RE: menu)
<crimsun> it's a missing "quit" symbol
<jani> do you think it got 'lost' when building on ubuntu?
<jani> when I installed from os-works it worked
<crimsun> it's possible, since xfce4 has a fairly strict build order
<crimsun> but the actual exiting is fine, since we can both quit our Xfce4 sessions
<jani> hmm can we trigger a rebuild without uploading first?just curious
<crimsun> lamont would be able to
<jani>  then we'd have to apt-get and retry
<lamont> jani: or tell me which packages to kick..
<lamont> mind you, better build-deps would solve that as well...
<jani> lamont, we're not sure it's the build deps but it could be
<crimsun> the b-d are all versioned high enough to require >= 4.2
<crimsun> so none of the older stuff is getting pulled in
<jani> right
<ogra> crimsun, you talked about the order....i think lamont means that
<lamont> jani: actually, all of xfce on i386 is either installed or uploaded, atm.
<jani> I wonder if gdm could have anythiong to do with it
<jani> lamont, right
<lamont> even on ia64. :-)
<jani> btw lamont any clue why mousepad did not build? http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/m/mousepad/0.2.0-1/
<jani> it installs the package it needs but does not find its .pc file
<jani> strange
<crimsun> jani: we don't have such a package
<jani> libxfcegui4-dev is the package and it's apparently there but libxfcegui4-1.0.pc
<crimsun> there's no .0
<jani> dpkg -L libxfcegui4-dev |grep pc
<crimsun> need to fix debian/control to b-d on the correct package iirc
<crimsun> I looked at it last night but was too tired to fix it
<lamont> note that mousepad is currently 'Needs-Build' on all 4 architectures
<jani> but Ii builds for me locally
<jani> what does needs-build mean? that it failed so far
<lamont> jani: in a clean chroot?
<jani> lamont, nope I admit
<lamont> jani: it means that the buildd's will give it another shot
<crimsun> oh, I see
<crimsun> hmm, it should build fine
<jani> but pkg-config finds that file if I do the step it chokes on manually
<lamont> Needs-Build is the state that buildds' take it _from_
<jani> but any idea why it can fail like that if it looks like(at least to me)  pkg-config should have succeeded
<crimsun> oooh, wait a sec
<crimsun> configure script is broken
<crimsun> did you say it built locally on yours?
<jani> yup
<crimsun> in pbuilder?
<jani> nope
<jani> is the check wrong?
<crimsun> chroot or on your system?
* jani has to set up pbuiilder already
<diamond> morning.
<jani> my system
<crimsun> I believe the check is wrong; it's looking for libxfcegui4-1.0 when it should be looking for libxfcegui4-3
<jani> but libxfcegui4-1.0 is the name of the .pc file
<Mithrandir> the check is correct.
<crimsun> I thought configure prints out the binary name, not the .pc file
<crimsun> gah, /me apt-gets source
<jani> yes it confised me too
<koke> hey, some days ago I fixed usbview, but I'm not sure if I used the best method
<koke> http://www.amedias.org/~koke/misc/usbview_1.0-6_to_1.0-6ubuntu1.diff
<koke> give me your opinions
<koke> http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/u/usbview/1.0-6/usbview_1.0-6_20050328-0655-powerpc-failed
<lamont> configure.in:4: your implementation of AM_INIT_AUTOMAKE comes from an
<lamont> configure.in:4: old Automake version.  You should recreate aclocal.m4
<lamont> autocrap version issue
<Mithrandir> you probably want to build-dep on automake-1.7 or something
<Mithrandir> else, you get 1.4, which is ancient.
<lamont> Mithrandir: automaken gets you 1.8, automake gets you whatever apt decides to give you, prolly 1.4
<jani> so we should add automake explicitely to the build-deps?it's not there currently is it a build-essential?
<HostingGeek> f-spot doesn't have an menu image or is it just me?
<crimsun> jani: testing a workaround for mousepad
<jani> ok
<HostingGeek> ?
<koke> HostingGeek: you mean a icon in the gnome menu??
<HostingGeek> koke: yes
<tseng> it does for me
<koke> me too
<HostingGeek> tseng: not for me... ;(
<tseng> well you're a tool
<tseng> so dunno what to tell ya.
<HostingGeek> i got that default icon for anything missing an icon
<koke> HostingGeek: which version of f-spot??
<Amaranth> HostingGeek: blam! showed up without an icon for me too until i started a new session
<Amaranth> HostingGeek: log out then back in
<koke> http://ftp.gnome.org/pub/gnome/sources/f-spot/0.0/f-spot-0.0.10.changes
<koke> we are in 0.0.12 now
<koke> the icon has been there for a long time
<Amaranth> * f-spot.desktop.in.in: add file for .desktop menu-spec support
<Amaranth> i think he is saying the entry is there but the icon for it isn't
<crimsun> jani: not sure regarding mousepad, and I'm pressed for time atm.  I'll work on the menu problem this afternoon.
<jani> ok I'll look at mousead then
<crimsun> great, thanks
<jani> same here :)
<koke> http://www.amedias.org/~koke/misc/usbview_1.0-6_to_1.0-6ubuntu1.diff <-- this looks better ??
<koke> package is at http://www.amedias.org/~koke/debian/hoary/ if anyone wants to upload
* koke needs an urgent shower
<jani> lamont can you kick xterminal please?
<jani> if kicking means trigger a new build that is :)
<herve> heya!
<dholbach> hey herve
<diamond> laters
<lamont> jani: enough people use 'kick' with enough different meanings that I really take it to mean 'go check on this package and make it try again'
<jani> I just heard dit thrown around
<lamont> would be nicer if people said give back foo, pretend foo is available, clear the dep-wait for foo, etc./
<lamont> jani: exactly.
* Mithrandir usually says "retry" or whatever.
<lamont> and the way it's being used in this channel, it means any one of the 3 things I just said
<jani> so if you do not make it explicitely when would a rebuild take place?
<Mithrandir> lamont: I think people often just see "hasn't built yet" and doesn't know whether it's dep-wait or something else.
<lamont> right
<jani> xterminal depended on libexo and failed to find it but now libexo is in
<lamont> I haven't insisted on precise terminology here, just bitched about it. :)
<lamont> jani: build depends are broken: checking for XML::Parser... configure: error: XML::Parser perl module is required for intltool
<jani> xterminal?
* jani looks again
<lamont> jani: yes
<lamont> needs an explict build-dep on libxml-parser-perl, and possibly a bug filed with debian
<lamont> if they didn't already fix that
<jani> http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/x/xterminal/0.2.4-1/xterminal_0.2.4-1_20050402-0625-i386-failed
<jani> is this the link?
<jani> oh I see other archs are ahead of i386
<jani> I'll look at fixing it
<lamont> janc: it's still needs-build on i386.  building (==failed?) on the other 3
<lamont> hrm.. python-kde3 probably needs python2.4 love
<lamont> s/janc:/jani/
<jani> aha so needs-build means it is waiting for build-deps?
<koke_shower> have to go
<lamont> jani: needs-build means that it's waiting for a free buildd
<lamont> dep-wait means that it's waiting for build-deps to be in the archive
<jani> ok thanks, and where do you see in which state is a certain package
<Riddell> did anything come of the idea to have updates to hoary?  (like point gnome and kde releases?)
<dholbach> Riddell: i'm quite sure the opinion is "release is release"
<herve> I remember something like that too
<Riddell> dholbach: I definatly mind reading some idea for an ubuntu-updates repository
<dholbach> it exists, but it was for critical stuff only IIRC
<Riddell> security of course
<dholbach> hrm
<dholbach> well, ask mdz/jdub, they will know for sure
<Riddell> hmm yes
<herve> ho good
<herve> a source package wih {arch} and .arch-ids
<herve> woohoo...
<dholbach> herve: you never saw apt-get.org-packges :-)
<herve> you're supposed to motivate me to work on this, not afraid me!
<herve> "install: cannot change owner and/or group of `debian/archway': Operation not permitted
<herve> "
<herve> it needs to install -o root -g root
<herve> am I supposed to run debuild as real root...
<dholbach> *argl*
<herve> I understand its point of view
<herve> but I thought dpkg was doing this at install time
<dholbach> enough apt-get.org for today
#ubuntu-motu 2005-04-14
<wasabi_> Well this is weird.
<wasabi_> Are uploads disabled or something or has my key been deleted? =/
<wasabi_> Rejected: java-common_0.22ubuntu1_source.changes: upload is signed by 0x08167DA250571AB7B686B1E2453679F982756FE6 but is not in the Maintainer keyring.
<wasabi_> Rejected: java-common_0.22ubuntu1.dsc: upload is signed by 0x08167DA250571AB7B686B1E2453679F982756FE6 but is not in the Maintainer keyring.
<dholbach> hmmmm
<Riddell> wasabi_: java-common is in main
<wasabi_> yeah just noticed.
<wasabi_> buh.
<wasabi_> didn't even look at it. heh.
<wasabi_> everybody please type /clear!
* Arrogance scratches his palm
<tritium> Hello, everyone.
<wasabi_> guess I'll just wait a few days.
<dholbach> 900M    /var/cache/pbuilder/result/   - guess i clean up
<tritium> Hi herve.
<herve> re
<herve> hi tritium
<dholbach> good night everybody!
<tseng> bye dholbach
<tritium> Good night, dholbach!
<herve> sleep tight!
<dholbach> :-)
<herve> Treenaks, there?
<herve> Treenaks, in case you read, keeping the orig initrd *is* important
<herve> I wondered why the battery status didn't worked and notice orig was bigger than current, althought it should not since we add data to the current initrd
<herve> good night all
<herve> ++
<Kirsch> Hello
<tritium> hi Kirsch
<Kirsch> i wanna help but it seems that creating a DEB package is hard... i'm sure its not, just a lot of reading about knowing stuff, is there a simple howto?
<tritium> Kirsch, the Debian New Maintainer's Guide is probably the first place to start.
<Kirsch> the main deb one seems REALLY detailed for what i wanna start with..
<Kirsch> I checked that.
<dopey> if  you google around, you can find a lot of step-by-step guides
<dopey> try one of those, then read over the new maintainer's guide - its a lot clearer when you have some context/understanding
<Kirsch> do u guys have any suggestions? i found something the other day, lemme show u
<Kirsch> http://linuxdevices.com/articles/AT8047723203.html
<Kirsch> is that url good?
<tritium> Kirsch, it seems like good guide, like dopey suggested starting with.
<tritium> But, again, I'd read the New Maintainer's Guide next.
<Kirsch> ok
<randabis> I can create .debs, but I just need to find something worthwhile to package and maintain...:p just about everything under the sun is taken care of already hehe
<tritium> randabis, there's stuff on the MOTUTodo
<randabis> ah good :)
* randabis need to read topics more often
* randabis is away: bbl
* randabis is back.
* randabis is away: finishing ubuntu install on laptop
* bddebian should be doing that
* randabis is back.
<kurros> 5 minutes! is that a record? :)
* bddebian fires up an Ubuntu CD for the first time...
* HostingGeek slaps a cork into randabis and bddebian mouths
<randabis> hehe
<randabis> appologies
<bddebian> Dang, and here I thought this was the nice place.. :-)
<dredg> it is
* dredg goes back to writing crazy perl to dump wordpress entries to blosxom files
<dredg> i should sleep soon
<bddebian> Well that was an easy install. :-)
<dredg> right, there are bird singing
<dredg> i think it's bed time
<bddebian> Heh
<dredg> ie. holy crap it's fucking late :(
<bddebian> hehe
<dredg> night
<dredg> :)
<bddebian> gnight
* Amaranth goes to bed
<Treenaks> shit! too late to add + test https://sourceforge.net/projects/sbs-linux/ for hoary
<Treenaks> oh wait.. that requires patching DSDTs.. nevermind
<crimsun> morning, tritium
<tritium> morning, crimsun
<tritium> You're up late.
<tritium> Hi dholbach
<dholbach> goooooood morning!
<dholbach> tritium: hey michael
<dholbach> still awake?
<tritium> yeah, for now
<tritium> how are you?
<dholbach> i'm fine... but still wait for the coffee ;-)
<tritium> :)
<tritium> I'm going to try something...be right back
<tritium> good night dholbach, crimsun
<dholbach> sleep tight :-)
<tritium> :)
<dholbach> amu_, haggai, Riddell: nice work on HelpingKubuntu - it could serve as a template for the upcoming MOTU Teams
<HostingGeek> If anyone has a min. could they rebuild gmailfs to depend on python2.4 and not 2.3 if not i'll make ANOTHER report in malone
<dholbach> there is already a report in malone?
<crimsun> HostingGeek: I'm working on that today
<crimsun> today is my catch-up-on-MOTU-stuff day
<HostingGeek> coool!
<HostingGeek> dholbach: there are to many open reports on malone
<dholbach> too many?
<dholbach> i saw 2 pages
<ogra> there are exactly 31 bugs in malone currently....
<HostingGeek> dholbach: 2 PAGES!
<dholbach> more?
<dholbach> HostingGeek: if you want to tell me how to do my job, i.e. tell me there were too many open reports, it will make me angry, can you see that?
<HostingGeek> dholbach: i am not saying there are to many open
<tseng> HostingGeek: do you know how many packages are in universe?
<dholbach> just complaining is completely out of order in an open community
<tseng> there are thousands.
<HostingGeek> i am saying there 2 pages so by the time you get to this easy to fix one it will be who knows when
<dholbach> HostingGeek: here is what you said: "<HostingGeek> dholbach: there are to many open reports on malone"
<HostingGeek> Read what i said
<ogra> and saying there are already open reports about gmailfs just isnt true
<tseng> since its an easy fix
<dholbach> and everyone will take your "to" for a "too"
<tseng> how about you send us a source package
<tseng> with said easy fix.
<dholbach> HostingGeek: please elaborate on what you wanted to say
<dholbach> HostingGeek: i'll apologize, if i misunderstood you in a hurry
<dholbach> HostingGeek: i don't want to stoke up the fire again, but you surprise me every time: if somebody thought i bitched about him, i'd do everything to show him under the wrong impression...
<HostingGeek> dholbach: sorry talking to my teacher!
<dholbach> ah yes
<Riddell> crimsun: how come python-qt still build deps on python2.3-dev?
<crimsun> it does?!
* crimsun gets source, one sec
<crimsun> oh I see.
<crimsun> We were supposed to keep python2.3 packages in addition to providing python2.4 ones
<crimsun> python-qt3 should pull in python2.4-qt3, doesn't have any python2.3 deps afaics
<Riddell> right I see
<herve> hi
<dholbach> hey herve
<Riddell> crimsun: what is needed to convert packages to python 2.4?
<crimsun> Riddell: generally just adjusting debian/{control,rules}
<crimsun> Riddell: and any supplementary files under debian/  that explicitly reference python*
<herve> this means forgettting about python2.3 versions?
<herve> Riddell, did you notice debian dropped kvim?
<Riddell> herve: nope, what did they say?
<crimsun> herve: yeah, I noticed that :(
<herve> Riddell, unmaintained crack, not worth fighting with it
<Riddell> I can empathise with that :)
<herve> crimsun, this is not really motu compliant :-)
<Riddell> herve: did you notice if they have a package for Yzis?
<dholbach> hey koke
<herve> hi koke
<Riddell> no they havn't, should add that to the helpingkubuntu list
<koke> hi all!
<ogra> hi koke
<herve> Riddell, just an ITP, 39 days ago
<Riddell> herve: got a URL?
<Riddell> ah, clever google has one
<HostingGeek> Would it be a good idea to patch update-botifier to include reps like mallarat.... and that java one?
<HostingGeek> sorry about typos...
<HostingGeek> brb
<Riddell> HostingGeek: no
<HostingGeek> why? brb
<Riddell> because they're nothing to do with ubuntu
<HostingGeek> if miss the bus answer this.....
<HostingGeek> Ahh just read
<HostingGeek> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=23550
<HostingGeek> arghhh.... i am here to stay...
<HostingGeek> Riddell: well n00bs want these packages they can't get
<herve> argh!
<dholbach> HostingGeek: anything about "<HostingGeek> dholbach: there are to many open reports on malone"?
<crimsun> welcome, AstralJava.
<AstralJava> Thanks. :)
<AstralJava> Still have a few glitches when it comes to gaim. Figured it out eventually.
<crimsun> AstralJava: besides the bounties page, I recommend you take a look at https://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/MOTU
<HostingGeek> dholbach: the fix is simple the ones in malone with high piority are not simple so by the time you get to it (because of the number of reports)....
<AstralJava> Alright, will do.
<dholbach> HostingGeek: ah i see... well since it's so easy, why don't you (as tseng suggested) provide us with a fixed source package?
<HostingGeek> dholbach: I already said that a few weeks ago
<dholbach> we have bug reports that are older than a few weeks and more important, but if you provided us with a fixed source package, it would all be easier
<HostingGeek> dholbach: i answered it a few weeks ago read your logs
<dholbach> hm?
<tseng> you "answered" what?
<HostingGeek> the reason why i wot do such thing for such a small edit
<ogra> HostingGeek, this channel is no bug reporting tool
<ogra> malone is.
<HostingGeek> ogra: i know i just wanted to see if anyone had time...
<ogra> report it in malone please
<dholbach> and please try not to complain about how we run things, please!
<HostingGeek> ogra: crimsun said he is already fixing it
<HostingGeek> why should i report something which was alreading being fixed as we speak?
<HostingGeek> its a waste of resorourses
<tseng> you are a waste of resources
<ogra> HostingGeek, your discussion is a waste of ressources
<ilmari> how does the hoary freeze affect universe?
<ogra> HostingGeek, please report bugs now and in the future in malone...not in this channel
<ogra> ilmari, it freezes too
<tseng> universe freezes for final
<HostingGeek> ogra: i do....
<ogra> ilmari, like it did in warty and will do for breezy
<ilmari> ogra: i see
<HiddenWolf> ogra: is the new bugzilla up?
<HostingGeek> ogra: you just pushed the question
<tseng> "new bugzilla"?
<ilmari> ogra: no chance of getting munin 1.2.x in, then
<ogra> HiddenWolf, didnt read my announcement ? ;) the url is in the topic :)
<HostingGeek> tseng: he means malone
<crimsun> (it's kinda insulting to call malone a new bugzilla ;)
<HostingGeek> ilmari: no
<HiddenWolf> ogra: never read topics. :)
<HostingGeek> crimsun: people call epiphany gnomezilla
<herve> didn't notice too :-)
<HiddenWolf> herve: either
<ogra> ilmari, tseng cares for mono .... if you can lend him a hand probably the chances get better ;)
<tseng> what is muinin
<ogra> ilmari, his word counts for all of mono ;) convince him...
<ilmari> munin has nothing to do with mono
<dholbach> perhaps a gamin-aware muine :-)
<tseng> yeah.
<ogra> oops, sorry, i read muine
<ilmari> it's a statistics-gathering/graphing system
<ilmari> see http://munin.sf.net/
<ogra> ilmari, libgd based
<ogra> ?
<ilmari> ogra: no, rrdtool
<dholbach> ilmari: if you prepare a source package you can advertise it on wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTUNewPackages
<tseng> have you tested the version from unstable ilmari ?
<tseng> rebuilt for ubuntu
<ilmari> tseng: yes, I'm co-maintaining it ;-)
<ogra> ilmari, hehe, rrd uses libgd ;)
<dholbach> ah ok
<tseng> great, if you can confirm that the version from unstable builds and runs on hoary
<tseng> we can sync it
<ilmari> great!
<ilmari> i'll take the version from incoming ;-)
<ilmari> (uploaded yesterday, targeted for sarge)
<tseng> ok.
<dholbach> ilmari: you can put it on wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTUToSync, so we don't forget to fetch it :-)
<ogra> ilmari, nice tool btw :)
<dholbach> (or make elmo fetch it)
* tseng uses Cacti right now
<ogra> cacti is also nice, but oversized in many environments :)
<tseng> yep
<tseng> I have a large environment :P
* ogra is a statistics freak :)
<tseng> cacti needs more frequent releases.
<dholbach> those java-folks...
<dholbach> what they call a source package
<dholbach> ... has millions of .jar files in it
<herve> ;-)
<ogra> that might be only zipped sourcecode
<dholbach> isnt
<dholbach> checked that :-)
<ogra> heh, those java-folks...
<dholbach> yeah :_)
<herve> what the... a blog without rss feed...
<ogra> herve, we call that a guestbook *g*
<dholbach> oh joy... i'll be able to write joey hess a "your package was included into ubuntu - do you want to be part of the MOTU crowd"-mail :-)
<ogra> LOL
<ogra> dholbach, please blog about te reply *grin*
<dholbach> will do
* dholbach wonders if he should add a PS: Please take this mail with a grain of salt.
<ogra> heh
<HostingGeek> OMG no! http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=18418&page=2&pp=10
<HostingGeek> I think that thread gives enough of a reason to upgrade oo.o2
<crimsun> OO.o2 is at 1.9.79.2-0ubuntu2
<crimsun> updated 1 Apr
<HostingGeek> crimsun: cool!
<HostingGeek> people using redhat packages for ubuntu how sick....
<HostingGeek> crimsun: umm some people are saying .85 is beta not .79 like in ubuntu o.0 /me checks oo.org
<herve> hi sabdfl, trulux
<HostingGeek> *g* oo.org is useless
<ilmari> ogra: I can't add munin to the MOTUToSync page, logging in fails with "'ascii' codec can't decode byte 0xc3 in position 20: ordinal not in range(128)"
<ilmari> it didn't like my non-ascii real name
<ilmari> registering went fine, but logging in fails
<ogra> hrm...
<ogra> mail webmaster@ubuntu.com and file a bug in bugzilla would be two possible things.... :-/
<ilmari> luckily bugzilla accepted my name
<ilmari> damn asciist plone!
<ilmari> ;-)
<herve> you don't even know ;-
<herve> ))
<herve> ilmari, note you're really logged in, just go back to that page
<ilmari> oh, indeed
<ilmari> well, it's still a bug
<herve> I'll file the bugreport
<herve> I've forgotten to file it for too long
<ilmari> editing doesn't work either
<ilmari> 'NoneType' object has no attribute 'fullname'
<HostingGeek> ilmari: bugzilla loves playing tricks on people yesterday some in #gnome said there reply to a report had an error.... but it still got sent in
<herve> ilmari, erm... my intuition is that you're not that logged in after all ;-)
<ilmari> I have all the edit, comment etc. buttons, and the header bar has my name and "log out"
<ilmari> i guess i'm in some sort of limbo
<herve> what page where you on?
<ilmari> http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/MOTUToSync
<herve> I can't reproduce it
<ilmari> works now
<ilmari> weird
<herve> heh, it's plone ;-)
<HostingGeek> f***ing plone!
<herve> HostingGeek, politeness...
<encolpe> whouarf
<HostingGeek> herve: don't talk ubuntu say nake pictures in it
<HostingGeek> thats not polite at all
<tseng> HostingGeek: hey dude, can you come back when you have something productive to say?
<tseng> you waste a disproportionate ammount of our time with no return.
<HostingGeek> I got something.
<tseng> ok.
<HostingGeek> A Ubuntu maintainors Guide
<HostingGeek> why should we use the debian one!?
<herve> ilmari, btw, the report was already filed
<dholbach> ....................................................................
<tseng> because it is just as applicable?
<tseng> we do use debian packages, after all.
<herve> because it does exists
<crimsun> HostingGeek: there's a reason the Debian documentation, as a base, is 100% relevant.
<HostingGeek> tseng: so what? this is ubuntu And it easy to fix up the debian maintainors guide to be 100% valid for ubuntu
<HostingGeek> crimsun: well the pbuilder part....
<tseng> HostingGeek: what parts arent valid?
<tseng> HostingGeek: we documented ubuntu changes on the wiki
<crimsun> HostingGeek: not _just_ pbuilder but the entire NM and DD documention
<tseng> its very succinct and imediately obvious
<HostingGeek> tseng: well the way it is is like: learning html to learn xhtml.... you could just learn the xhtml way in the first place
<tseng> its hardly the same at all
<dholbach> HostingGeek: what would be more approriate in this channel would be: "i fixed doc x.y to say <abc>"
<tseng> xhtml is a stricter standard
<tseng> ubuntu changes on word in the changelog
<tseng> you are back to wasting our time arguing a point you dont understand
<tseng> im very very tired of it all.
<dholbach> and it's still complaining
<HostingGeek> tseng: there are lots of diffrences.....
<tseng> no, there arent
<dholbach> HostingGeek: please write them up in a mail to ubuntu-devel@
<tseng>     * Set the target suite in debian/changelog to be 'hoary'. e.g. "dch -D hoary"
<HostingGeek> Well if i make a yelp Ubuntu Maintainors Guide will anyone review it?
<tseng>     * When working with a package which originated in Debian, use a version number derived from the Debian version number with ubuntu<revision> appended. i.e. Debian 1.0-2 becomes 1.0-2ubuntu1, followed by 1.0-2ubuntu2, etc.
<tseng> done.
<crimsun> HostingGeek: remember that Debian is our base, so we use Debian tools and documentation.  We add where appropriate.  If there are questions, #ubuntu-devel and #ubuntu-motu are present.
<dholbach> HostingGeek: you absolutely know that every contribution is appreciated
<HostingGeek> crimsun: #ubuntu-devel is not that present for me....
<dholbach> discussing if anyone will review it is insane
<crimsun> HostingGeek: (for reasons having naught to do with development)
<HostingGeek> dholbach: i know it appreciated but does any of you have that much free time
<tseng> you seem to have lots of free time
<dholbach> HostingGeek: asking if anyone will appreciate and review a bit of work in the first place is insane
<tseng> the docs team would surely be happy to work with you if you wrote something.
<dholbach> we wouldnt be MOTUs if we wouldnt have shown efforts in the first place
<HostingGeek> tseng: hmm should i rewrite or do something from scratch?
<dholbach> that's how opensource works
<tseng> you can do whatever you feel is best for ubuntu
<HostingGeek> dholbach: ohh yea... i forgot... this is not #ubuntu-docs
<tseng> wb
<ogra> hrm...i hate it...
<tseng> HostingGeek: going to ubuntu-docs and asking them to review something you havent written isnt any better
<HostingGeek> tseng: who said i am going to do something that stupid #ubuntu-docs is not #ubuntu-motu
<tseng> well, thats what you did in here.
<tseng> do you take us for a bunch of chumps, and you would be nicer in another channel?
<HostingGeek> tseng: i said i am not stupid and no other channel is #ubuntu-motu besides #ubuntu-motu
<dholbach> apt-get.org finished - i'm off
<tseng> bye dholbach
<HostingGeek> dholbach: Nice!
<HostingGeek> dholbach: cya
<herve> dholbach, you deserve it :-)
<dholbach> thanks... bye :-)
<ogra> yayfor dholbach
* herve yay!
<ogra> :)
<herve> a sudden feeling of loneliness... :-)
<HostingGeek> is jamse (elmo) the guy to talk to about the website?
<ogra> herve, he'll come back, be sure ;)
<crimsun> HostingGeek: webmaster@  is preferred
<HostingGeek> crimsun: Its to simple for an email
<crimsun> HostingGeek: nothing's too simple for an email ;)
<herve> ogra, just meant the hola I started, but yes he will miss us :-)
<ogra> heh
<HostingGeek> crimsun: is it jamse?
<crimsun> jamse is not elmo, no
<crimsun> not sure if you mean "james" or "jamse"
<HostingGeek> crimsun: james sorry
<mwh_> Hello, everybody!
<crimsun> hello
<mwh_> I would like to get involved with motu
<crimsun> great!
<mdke> btw is there a wiki for package requests?
<mdke> MOTUTodo?
<crimsun> yes, please see wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU
<mwh_> I used to build my own system with LFS, but wanted to try out the latest Gnome and did not want to start the masive recompile/configure stuff so I tried out Ubuntu
<mwh_> Now I have falled in love with Ubuntu and I want to help out
<crimsun> mwh_: excellent, there're lots of informative pages under /MOTU
<mwh_> I dont have much experience building packages for distro's though, a little I have from Stampede when that was hot
<mwh_> crimsun: Ill take a look
<mdke> can't find the right page
<mwh_> perticulary I would like to help with the mono related packages
<herve> mdke, you mean it's a NEW package?
<mdke> herve, its an idea for a new package
<mdke> hi herve btw
<crimsun> mwh_: please speak with tseng regarding mono; he's our mono dude
<mwh_> yes I saw that on the wiki
<mwh_> tseng: knock knock
<herve> mdke, the package doesn't exist yet? (hi!)
<crimsun> mwh_: you might find it helpful to interact with the folks in #debian-mono, too
<mdke> herve, no
<mwh_> crimsun: ahh good idea
<tseng> mwh_: yes?
<mdke> herve, i was thinking maybe you would have a page for suggested packages
<herve> mdke, so what are you waiting for? :-p
<mdke> herve, i don't have the time/ability
<tseng> mwh_: i prefer to talk in the channel please.
<mwh_> tseng: I would like to help on the mono-team
<mwh_> tseng: thats allright
<tseng> cool.
<herve> mdke, indeed, there is no such page
<mdke> ok
<mdke> np
<tseng> mwh_: how much are you aware?
<mwh_> tseng: mainly getting packages which depends on mono into universe
<tseng> of the mono stuff and packaging in general
<mwh_> tseng: I have hacked a bit on gtk#
<herve> mdke, what is its name? it would be best if it was in debian before
<tseng> cool.
<mdke> herve, i'm not sure if it is in debian
<mdke> herve, its pysoulseek
<mwh_> tseng: also I have built it from scratch since 0.6 or something
<mdke> there is a stable gentoo ebuild if it helps ;)
<mwh_> tseng: How is it going with maintaining it?
<tseng> its going fine
<herve> mdke, I don't think so :-)
<tseng> im working on de /usr/share/dotnet
<mwh_> tseng: hows the releations with debian-mono?
<tseng> and 1.1.6
<tseng> mwh_: pretty good
<mwh_> okay
<tseng> i am sponsored for f-spot
<herve> mdke, no trace in debian
<tseng> and good relation with muine maintainer
<mwh_> tseng: nice
<mdke> herve, no big deal
<tseng> tomboy is my own, they dont ahve it yet
<mdke> herve, its not exactly the most important prog ever
<mwh_> tseng: I did some of the code for f-spot :) i18n stuff
<tseng> cool.
<mwh_> f-spot is really nice
<mwh_> anyways I have never build a debian/ubuntu package before
<tseng> ok, good debian new maint
<tseng> and work your way through the guide.
<mwh_> I guess its not hard, I just need the information on how to get started
<tseng> actually
<tseng> http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/wiki/DeveloperResources
<tseng> everything you need is there.
<crimsun> and here and in #ubuntu-devel :)
<tseng> you can ask me specific questions
<tseng> or anyone here, yeah :P
<mwh_> okay
<mwh_> thats nice
<mwh_> So I think my first project would be to get Jump n' Bump Menu into Universe
<mwh_> A frontend for the nice little game jump n bump writte in c# and gtk#
<mwh_> tseng: so I make a package and test it .. then send it to you?
<ogra> mwh_, see: http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/MOTU
<tseng> something like that
<mwh_> ill read the docs .. :)
<ogra> :)
<tseng> great.
<mwh_> tseng: what do you think of having both mono-1.x and mono-1.1.x?
<tseng> i think that would not work
<mdke> herve, if i happen to find some time maybe i'll find out to package and try and make a test package of it
<mwh_> then when 1.2.x is out deprecate mono-1.x?
<tseng> we are moving to 1.1.x in the next release
<mwh_> tseng: why would it not work?
<tseng> because they install the same files in the same locations
<tseng> and no we arent putting stuff in prefixes and making fancy wrapper scripts.
<mwh_> okay
<mwh_> 1.1.x is also getting pretty good anyways
<tseng> is recommended by upstream for distribution
<mwh_> hope the next version after mono 1.2 will be parallel installable
<tseng> but there is not enough time for hoary
<tseng> I dont
<mwh_> why
<tseng> because if people want to use an unstable branch they can build it themselves in /usr/local
<tseng> I am going to distribute whatever works best.
<mwh_> i see the point
<tseng> which for breezy is 1.1 / 1.2
<mwh_> though it could be pretty many prefix's if one tests a lot of different mono versions
<tseng> why would there be more that 2 versions
<tseng> 1.0 is pretty well unsupported by upstream already
<mwh_> if you want to make sure your programs run on both versions
<mwh_> bugfixing both versions
<tseng>  /usr and /usr/local
<mwh_> anyways it doesnt matter that much
<tseng> nope.
<tseng> we will package exactly 1 version
<tseng> the bindings are a different story
<tseng> they parallel install and are incompatible
<mwh_> yes
<tseng> so you get libgtk-cil libgtk2.0-cil
<mwh_> so how do it look with gtk# now?
<tseng> ^
<mwh_> ah
<tseng> but i have to shower, feel free to hit the docs :P
<tseng> cya soon.
<mwh_> sure
<mwh_> ill return when I have a usefull package of jumpnbump menu
<mwh_> happy hacking guys!
<tseng> cya.
<trulux> hey herve
<trulux> bbl
<crimsun> cya
<HostingGeek> crimsun: cya
<crimsun> HostingGeek: that was for lorenzo
<HostingGeek> ok
<siretart> hi
<siretart> does anyone know what happened to the wiki? my page got deleted :(
<crimsun> siretart: known issue.
<crimsun> hopefully one of the Canonical guys will fix it quickly.
<siretart> crimsun: what happened? old backup restored? do I need to recreate it?
<crimsun> siretart: I wouldn't touch anything atm
<crimsun> siretart: and I really don't know...
<siretart> ok
<Riddell> crimsun: I can't figure out how to make python-kde3 compile, are you able to take a quick look?
<Riddell> http://dev.kubuntu.org.uk/~jr/python/
<crimsun> sure, sec
<crimsun> I had started transitioning python-kde3, but Xfce 4.2 took over
<Riddell> bah
<crimsun> ok, you only wanted me to look at the orig.tar.gz?
<Riddell> nope, at the whole thing, run debuild and it gives sip errors
<crimsun> hmm, well I see the orig.tar.gz for python-kde3 but the diff.gz for python-qt3
<crimsun> so I'm not sure what you want me to do...
<crimsun> oh, I see
<Riddell> crimsun: copied the wrong files, try now
<crimsun> ok
<crimsun> yeah, I just refreshed :)
<crimsun> Riddell: one thing you might want to look at is using separate build dirs for python 2.[34] 
<crimsun> I actually yanked Debian's newer configure.py for that purpose
<crimsun> (and modified debian/rules)
<Riddell> hmm, more tricky than I had expected this
<crimsun> hmm, yeah.  I'm not sure I'm going to be able to help with that one.
<crimsun> it doesn't build with either python2.3 or python2.4
<crimsun> one way to check for sure is to ask elmo for a sync for python-qt3
<crimsun> (sid has 3.14.1-1)
<crimsun> (3.14.1-1 has support for both python2.3 and python2.4 packages)
<crimsun> I'm not familiar with upstream development on sip, so I'm afraid that's beyond my expertise
<herve> Riddell, what's wrong with python-kde?
<herve> configure.py fails?
<crimsun> looks like it
<Riddell> herve: download it and find out :)  http://dev.kubuntu.org.uk/~jr/python/
<herve> last time I tried, it said something like "unable to create C++ code"
<herve> I thought I fubar my qt/sip environment
<crimsun> herve: / Riddell: one of the things to watch out for is the red herring: PyQt reports itself as 3.14.1, but it's only 3.11.3.  The version inconsistency comes from the newer configure.py in python-qt3
<herve> so we need to contactupstream
<crimsun> hmm, that should be fixed (d'oh!), but that won't change the error in building python-kde3
<crimsun> sip: sip/kdecore/kshortcutlist.sip:85: There is already an enum in scope with the same Python name
<herve> I had the same kind of error
<Riddell> but is that a problem with the code or a consequence of trying to make both 2.3 and 2.4 packages?
<crimsun> Riddell: the code
<crimsun> I tried building _only_ with 2.3 then only with 2.4
<crimsun> both failed
<Riddell> crimsun: but it must have compiled once upon a time?
<crimsun> according to http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/p/python-kde3/3.11.3-3/ , no
<Riddell> oh, it didn't
<Riddell> bummer
<herve> "#294079: python-kde3 is not buildable on kdelibs4 = 3.3.2"
<herve> even
<herve> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/pkgreport.cgi?pkg=python-kde3
<herve> interesting reports
<crimsun> yeah
<nictuku> hi
<nictuku> hi. I was trying to contribute  a newer version of pound, but it seems it failed to build in a few archs http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/p/pound/1.7-1/ . What should I do?
<nictuku> or else, what is actually its status?
<dholbach> is the 1.7 version the one you made?
<dholbach> you're looking at the test rebuild (you maybe noticed the /Test/ in the URL)
<dholbach> http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/p/pound/1.7-1/    <--- these are the real logs
<nictuku> hmm
<dholbach> and after some ia64-hiccup it went ok
<nictuku> no, i believe it was 1.7-2ubuntu1
<dholbach> so don't worry
<dholbach> hm
<nictuku> let me check
<dholbach> did somebody upload it?
<nictuku> www.grupomabel.com.br/ubuntu
<dholbach> so nobody has uploaded it yet
<dholbach> you can always tell if you look at this list: lists.ubuntu.com/archives/hoary-changes/2005-March/thread.html
<nictuku> oh nice
<nictuku> I'll be right back. xterm's clipboard is not transfering to firefox.
<nictuku> should ubuntu packages have major changes compared to debian ones? like, if there is a serious fork there, they can become independent and changes in debian's would be hard to track, right? what is the policy about this?
<herve> crimsun, Riddell, new debian version of python-kde3
<herve> "   * Added extra/332 so it builds with KDE 3.3.2 (Closes: #294079)"
<nictuku> I wonder if anybody had time to see my updates, or else, what happened there?
<nictuku> they were simple changes :)
<herve> nictuku, let me catch up
<nictuku> www.grupomabel.com.br/ubuntu
<nictuku> I've put its reference in MOTUTodo
<nictuku> but it's not there anymore :)
<herve> pound could build
<herve> what have you changed?
<nictuku> support to "webdav" (actually, extra 4 characters support)
<nictuku> that is needed to support subversion sites, for example
<nictuku> I'll later try to catchup with upstream version.
<nictuku> but for the next ubuntu release..
<herve> you mean you changed the upstream version, not just activated a feature missing in debian?
<nictuku> no, I've activaded a feature missing in debian
<herve> hmm...
<herve> you did not based your changes on ubuntu's version
<nictuku> yes I did
<herve> this makes change tracking harder
<nictuku> at least I believe I dod so
<dholbach> nictuku: you took 1.7-1 from ubuntu?
<nictuku> yes
<nictuku> apt-get source pound
<dholbach> then it should be 1.7-1ubuntu1
<herve> your version sais -2ubuntu1
<herve> (says)
<herve> er... diffing your version with ubuntu's one
<herve> it looks like there are changes to the upstream sources
<nictuku> yep, I changed -1 to -2. Now I notice I shouldn't have hehe.
<herve> it even looks like a new upstream release :-)
<nictuku> now I'm confused
<nictuku> I only changed debian/rules and changelog
<nictuku> that was my patch :)
<herve> nictuku, I doubt you added support to motorola architectures for just a webdav patch ;-)
<nictuku> yeah i didnt
<crimsun> herve: great, thanks.
<herve> or...
<herve> nictuku, have you played with autoconf, automake, and their friends?
<nictuku> hmm no
<dholbach> herve: must have been changes to config.{guess,sub} in the clean target of debian/rules
<herve> dholbach, yes it is
<herve> nictuku, otherwise, your changes are really just two lines altered ;-)
<nictuku> indeed, maybe one line
<herve> nictuku, but I suggest you learn dpatch
<herve> there is a nice introduction here: tseng.ath.cx/log/?p=7
<nictuku> ok
<herve> the idea is to ease your life as a maintainer
<nictuku> maybe I got warty's pound, not hoary's.
<herve> and send the patch to debian as a wishlist bug
<nictuku> to do my changes
<herve> nictuku, I think I know
<herve> what you've done
<herve> you used debchange (dch)?
<nictuku> that bug was marked as wontfix by debian. (I'm trying to talk the maint to rever that)
<nictuku> yes, I used dch
<herve> ok, I see
<herve> dch incremented the revision number
<herve> and you added ubuntu1 to it
<herve> argh! did the DD gave arguments?
<nictuku> hehe sort of. he said: "The upstream author should have  a reason to leave that feature disabled by default"
<herve> dholbach, how to validate changes if config.{guess,sub} are altered?
<herve> that's not an argument ;-)
<nictuku> truth is the impact is MINIMAL.
<herve> upstream saying "unstable crack" *is* an argument
<dholbach> i normally do   debdiff orig/bla.dsc bla.dsc | grep -E "\-\-\-"
<dholbach> so i know which files changed
<nictuku> http://www.apsis.ch/pound/pound_list/archive/2005/2005-03/1112144446000/1112202600000#1112202600000
<nictuku> this is what the upstream author replied
<nictuku> I'll see if I can patch upstream to add that feature as option file triggered, not compile time.
<dholbach> schweeb: ping
<nictuku> is there any problem using a warty system to update a package, but getting the source from hoary?
<herve> nictuku, I can't make my mind reading upstream answer
<dholbach> PLEASE STOP ME FROM KILLING!+
<dholbach> PLEASE STOP ME FROM KILLING!+
<dholbach> PLEASE STOP ME FROM KILLING!+
<dholbach> PLEASE STOP ME FROM KILLING!+
<dholbach> *ARG*
<herve> dholbach, ??
<dholbach> my apt-get.org work
<dholbach> *CRY*
<dholbach> the wiki state was reverted to april, 1st
<nictuku> my argument is: security impact is minimal. Better enable that, since it's an important feature.
<nictuku> by security, read "let {}<> chars be accepted by pound"
<dholbach> wiki.ubuntu.com/AptGetOrg
<ogra> dholbach, a lot of people complained about that
<herve> dholbach, so they restored the DB?
<herve> nictuku, upstream position is not really clear
<ogra> (saw it on #-devel and on #ubuntu)
<dholbach> this means my whole work is gone
<herve> zwiki bug?
<dholbach> 2-3 days
<ogra> nictuku, he talks about possible serious security issues with this switch on....this will in any case requite a audit from the security team
<ogra> dholbach, no local copy ?
<herve> 20 pm already? time to eat a flammekueche :-)
<dholbach> ogra: no... never thought i would have to have a local copy of the wiki
* ogra wants one too
<ogra> hmm....
<nictuku> leave this by now then. I'll see if I can patch upstream, then, by letting the user to enable that option in config file. It would be disabled by default.
<ogra> sounds good
<motaboy> dholbach: http://64.233.183.104/search?q=cache:dQLbupW1-g4J:https://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/AptGetOrg+aptgetorg&hl=en&start=1&ie=UTF-8
<motaboy> dholbach: google power
<dholbach> motaboy: this is even older
<dholbach> unfortunately
<motaboy> dholbach: :( :(
<dholbach> motaboy: but thanks for trying :-)
<herve> dholbach, in your firefox cache?
<dholbach> please somebody give me something to work on, so i will forget it
<dholbach> i can't start recompiling today
<herve> hmm
<dholbach> it would depress me too much
<herve> dholbach, another option
<dholbach> maybe i'll package a newer version of hula... hmm
<herve> anyone suscribed to the AptGetOrg page and have all the notification mails?
<dholbach> i'm subscribed to the wiki but deleted all the mails once i read them
<Amaranth> :/
<Amaranth> this is why you use gmail :P
<herve> Amaranth, trash cans exist too...
<Amaranth> wow, ~/.mozilla/firefox/<profile>/Cache sucks
<Amaranth> it's just whatever i've viewed in the last ~10 minutes
<motaboy> I'd be happy if someone of motu can review the "abakus" and the "metabar" packages on my dev site: https://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/SimoneGotti
<motaboy> dholbach: I added the man page for abakus
<dholbach> motaboy: cool
<StoneTable> Hm.  The two packages I had up for review on wiki/UniversePriorityList are no longer in the review section, not under done or can't build
<ogra> StoneTable, the wiki broke today...
<ogra> StoneTable, i assume you added them the last two days
<StoneTable> yep
<StoneTable> database restored, eh?
<ogra> seems all changes got wiped...
<StoneTable> okay, thanks
<StoneTable> well, I have two up for review: http://thorin.battleaxe.net/~stone/hoary/
<StoneTable> I'm adding them back to the wiki now
<ogra> StoneTable, but monitor it ? i dont know how reliable it is to add things there currently :)
<StoneTable> yeah, I'll keep a close eye on it :)
<Treenaks> has the nautilus bug been removed yet?
<ogra> bug ? you mean the new enhancement ?
<Treenaks> ogra: the spatial-breaking bug
<ogra> the spatial enhancement feature, yes :)
<StoneTable> is that what's causing my nautilus windows to close when I open a new one?
<Treenaks> ogra: stop drinking that kool-aid.. it sucks :)
<ogra> depends which mousebutton you use
<Treenaks> ogra: the left one.. I use the middle one to close old windows
<ogra> its just flipped....
<Treenaks> ogra: it just sucks
<ogra> nah
<thoreauputic_> ogra: I made a major enhancement to nautilus: apt-get install rox ;)
<ogra> heh
<Treenaks> apt-get install nautilus-sane
<Treenaks> I'm a motu, I can upload nautilus-sane to universe\
<ogra> Treenaks, there already is a long thread in u-d@ add your opinion :)
<dholbach> ok... what do you think are the most important things that we need to do until release
<Treenaks> ogra: I know, but I don't like forum-based threads
<ogra> heh
<Treenaks> ogra: all the forum posters are idiots
<dholbach> i still have apt-get.org on my plate, and kernel-stuff with schweeb - what do YOU still see?
<ogra> Treenaks, hey
<ogra> Treenaks, CoC
<Treenaks> ogra: +generally then
<Treenaks> ogra: nah, my opinion is the one I see the most in the thread: "Make new behavior available in prefs dialog. Keep old way default."
<ogra> Treenaks, its sabdfls decision....
<ogra> Treenaks, indeed you can argue and discuss it with him, but in the end his word counts...
<ogra> ...try to convince him...not me :)
<Treenaks> ogra: I could create a derivative of ubuntu... he wants to make that easy, right? :)
<ogra> Treenaks, true, go ahead :) but i doubt its worth the work for only one package :)
<dholbach> but you could instead work on other bugs, couldnt you?
<dholbach> :-)
<Treenaks> dholbach: the nautilus thing is VERY annoying
<ogra> Treenaks, i dont think so :)
<Treenaks> dholbach: I'm really thinking of providing only a "fixed" binary on my website (aptable) and linking from the wiki + forum or something
<dholbach> Treenaks: i won't sit around gazing at it all day :-)
<Treenaks> dholbach: I use it a lot, and breakage sucks
<ogra> Treenaks, my personal folder structure is sane enough that it doesnt suck....what sucked was that i always when i had to work with other files i had to hold the shift key to get where i wanted...
<Treenaks> ogra: or middle-doubleclick..
<Treenaks> anyway, relearning sucks
<ogra> Treenaks, thats very stressy on my laptop touchpad
<Treenaks> I'll stop arguing about it. I'm still convinced al of Ubuntu will get flamed over this in a MASSIVE way
<Treenaks> by reviewers, etc.
<crimsun> I don't mind the change itself, but it belongs in Breezy, not Hoary.
<crimsun> It's too late in the schedule.
<Treenaks> crimsun: that's my #2 option, yes
<herve> re
<crimsun> re
<dholbach> crimsun: how is "xfce for hoary" going?
<crimsun> dholbach: well, it's 99% done.  Everything's transitioned and installable.  I'm chasing down an annoying undefined function issue in xfdesktop4.
<dholbach> crimsun, jani: you rock
<crimsun> dholbach: it's a shame the wiki went boom, because I had made a nice page detailing the status of all the packages.
<crimsun> yeah, jani did nearly all the plugins
<dholbach> crimsun: i'll wait for a definite answer and then go on
<crimsun> I've just uploaded (hopefully) the last meta-xfce4 with a Depends on rox-filer, so everything is go
<herve> is the wiki safe to modify now?
<dholbach> so cool you guys are working on it
<crimsun> jani and I will discuss replacing some of the artwork with Ubuntu-oriented
<dholbach> herve: i'll put everything on my local wiki until i have a "go!"
<dholbach> crimsun: you're the MOTUTeam prototype! you really are! :-)
<crimsun> dholbach: ;)
<ogra> yeah
<ogra> great work so far....
<crimsun> thanks, we have a great team here :)
<dholbach> crimsun: i'll do a MOTUTeamHowto now, i guess you guys could review it ;-)
<crimsun> hehe
<herve> I'll go read the arch doc then
<herve> see you later
<dholbach> herve: you'll be my SPOC then :-)
<herve> ?
<dholbach> single point of contact :-)
<ogra> Single Point Of Contact
<herve> ho no please
<dholbach> :-D
<herve> don't push the use of uppercase too far
<ogra> or even a nice vulcanian sience officer...selewct yourself ;)
<dholbach> ogra: i prefer herve in the not-vulcanian way :-)
<herve> this does not seem logical, ogra
<ogra> hehe
* herve checking his ears
<dholbach> i'm "off" as well
<herve> I'd rather be a single point of contact
<herve> once I know what it means ;-)
<herve> bye dholbach
<tseng> hi all
<crimsun> 'lo
<tseng> ive been talking to meebey at debian mono, he is finishing up 1.1
<tseng> i sent him a bunch of sources that I did De /usr/share/dotnet on
<crimsun> yep :)
<tseng> http://tseng2.ath.cx/~brandon/mono/
<tseng> once those are in place we can de /usr/share/dotnet all the apps
<tseng> and live happily ever after
<tseng> less maintainence overhead
<crimsun> sounds great
<tseng> hopefully for the core as well
<tseng> since it becomes a single source package
<tseng> and the related (dh_net*) tools are being split out
<Phython> dholbach: If you want retchmail you can get it at http://www.csclub.uwaterloo.ca/~ja2morri hoary universe
<dholbach> Phython: oh nice
<dholbach> Phython: will it be put into debian again?
<Phython> dholbach: Hopefully in 10 days it will be in testing
<dholbach> ROCK
<tseng> testing is open?
<dholbach> because i will put it on my router (still on debian)
<dholbach> Phython: you could put it onto wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTUNewPackages and we get it in hoary before ;-)
<Phython> tseng: WvStreams et al were removed from testing last week
<dholbach> Phython: and wvstreams4
<dholbach> :-)
<tseng> i see.
<dholbach> and retchmail already 3 months ago
<dholbach> i grew quite fond of it
<tseng> rc bug?
<Phython> tseng: yeah, problems with WvDial and usb modems
<dholbach> Phython: wvdial didnt use wvstreams4, did it?
<Phython> dholbach: it does in debian, not in Ubuntu
<dholbach> ah ok
<Phython> I didn't touch WvDial or libwvstreams3 in Ubuntu
<dholbach> Phython: what in the wv-universe do you take care of?
<Phython> actually, I think jbailey and I figured out the WvDial and libwvstreams3-base in Ubuntu is my last upload of that
<Phython> dholbach: I took care of all of it while I was at NITI, now coleSLAW does a lot of the release management
<dholbach> Phython: you're not there anymore?
<Phython> dholbach: no, I'm back at school
<dholbach> Phython: ah ok
<Phython> only 5 exams left then I am done for good
<dholbach> :-)
<dholbach> i'll keep my fingers crossed :-)
<dholbach> i have one left
<Phython> nice
<dholbach> (and my thesis) *pipes innocently*
<apokryphos> When making a .deb, is there a quick way to resolve dependencies and version numbers needed for those etc.?
<Phython> apokryphos: apt-get build-dep ?
<herve> re
<dholbach> apokryphos: i'd use pbuilder (wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto) to build it in a chrooted environment and then set ${shlibs:Depends} as build-depends
<apokryphos> When you're making the .deb from the package source, I should have said...
<apokryphos> dholbach: ok, I'll try my luck with that. Thanks.
<dholbach> apokryphos: de rien
<herve> dholbach, yeah your thesis... don't you forget about it ;-)
<dholbach> herve: please don't be a kill-joy  :-)
<herve> I'll be your worst nightmare!
<herve> muhahaha
<herve> :)
* dholbach makes a short trip to Grenoble then :-)
<herve> yeah short, you need to work afterwards :-p
<dholbach> hehe
<herve> so what is a SPOC?
* apokryphos growls at the evil Wiki 8)
<dholbach> apokryphos: don't remind me
<dholbach> herve: you're the one i'll haunt with "i can't $xyz in my arch repository" :-)
<herve> dholbach, then I'll teach you what "rtfm" means ;-)
<dholbach> herve: that is not a SPOCs job :-)
<herve> I never signed for it!
<herve> chessmate :-p
* dholbach should take a leaf out of koke's book and add  spoc  to bsd-games' wtf
<dholbach> :-)
<ogra> herve, my dictionary says: counterpart, person in charge, reference person :)
<herve> reference? er...
<ajmitch> morning all
<dholbach> i think i'm off for tonight, if anyone can bring me the lovely news that the wiki is back again WITH my work on it, please tell ogra, he'll give you my telephone number
<herve> morning ajmitch
* ogra cries....
<StoneTable> cya dholbach
<dholbach> bye StoneTable
<herve> nighty night, dholbach
<ogra> damn gnome system tools
<dholbach> bye herve :-)
<crimsun> bye dholbach
<herve> ogra, I didn't even know there're usable!
<dholbach> bye crimsun
<ajmitch> there was a wiki disaster? :(
<dholbach> ajmitch: 3 days of apt-get.org compiling
<ajmitch> eeevil
<herve> ajmitch, the current wiky is the one from April, 1st
<herve> which is sadly not a late April's fool...
<ogra> herve, they are.... except the ones with bugs....
<herve> ogra, which inclues... all? :-p
<herve> (includes)
<ogra> heh...in fact i never had probs with the time tool... but i have not the slightest idea why it kills the xscreensaver daemon if you click ok...
<herve> you can reproduce it?
<ogra> yup
<sivang> hi all
<ogra> h sivang
<herve> because the timeout counter makes it crash, maybe?
<ogra> hi even
<dholbach> bye sivan
<herve> hi sivang
<ogra> herve, hmm, why should it do that....especially only if you click ok
<herve> ogra, I don't know wether xorg or xscreensaver keeps track of that timeout
<herve> apart from running xscreensaver within strace
<herve> I have no idea
<ogra> http://www.grawert.net/xss_strace.txt
<herve> hmm... it terminates properly?
<ogra> looks like
<herve> I certainly hope it's not the timer tool sending him a SIGTERM
<ogra> if i send a sighup manually it even restarts nicely
<herve> instead of a SIGUP :-)
<herve> SIGHUP, yes
<ogra> yop
<herve> can you strace what signals the timer tool emits?
<ogra> currently doing it :)
<ogra> YERY FUNNY
<herve> I thought the xss daemon would be launched by gnome
<ogra> it is...
<herve> so you just have to make sure it get respawned
<herve> ... I can't find it
<ogra> the funny thing is, if i run sudo time-admin it doesnt get killed
<ogra> oh, it does...it gets a new PID
<herve> but respawns...
<ogra> yup
<ogra> looking at gksudo
<ogra> AHA !
<ogra> if i run it with gksudo xss doesnt restart
<herve> not even killed?
<ogra> crashed
<herve> sure it doesn't restart then :-)
<herve> ogra, have you seen http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=300962
<ogra> herve, obviously ;) the third comment is mine ;)
<herve> I haven't read :-)
<ogra> they say my patch is bad....and in the end they suggest exactly the same i did *g* obviously the didnt even read my comment
<herve> ok, read.
<herve> so gnome is preparing their own xss interface? good
<ogra> since quite a long time
<ogra> i want to join the force there after release to put my help in there andhave a nice lock dialog for breezy :)
<herve> sounds nice
<herve> wow, it's getting late
<herve> good night all!
<ogra> night herve
<ilmari> should I re-add munin to the MOTUToSync page, or will the reversion be reverted?
<ogra> ilmari, we all hope it will get reverted, else a lot of work will be lost...
#ubuntu-motu 2005-04-15
<tritium> Hi trulux.
<trulux> hey tritium
<trulux> just near to go to sleep
<tritium> Oh, okay.  Sleep tight!
<trulux> thanks :)
<tritium> :)
<trulux> nite
<tritium> Good night.
<motaboy> Nighy All! :D
<crimsun> hmm.
<crimsun> I have a sinking feeling we should have synced against experimental.
<Lathiat> whys that?
<crimsun> well, our current source is synced from os-works, which contains code that differs from "true" upstream
<crimsun> and it's going to become rather troublesome to maintain with Debian, which is something we want to avoid
<ogra> crimsun, 18 months support :)
<crimsun> yeah, that's going to be 18 months of *!$*@
<ogra> dont you trust os-works for patching critical stuff ?
<crimsun> wait, this is universe...there ain't no support!
<ogra> hmm, true...
<crimsun> trust isn't the issue, it's the divergent code bases between us and Debian
<crimsun> that's why I originally wanted to sync against experimental
<crimsun> I think I need a glib guru
<crimsun> specifically, gmodule
<ogra> seb128
<ogra> pitti is also very good in glib questions
<crimsun> excellent, thanks
<dholbach> morning
<Gangster`> morning
<schweeb> mornin dholbach
<dholbach> hey schweeb :-)
<schweeb> how's the PriorityList lookin?
<dholbach> schweeb: i asked the kernel guys again and they said: only the most recent debian kernel
<dholbach> didnt look at it much in the last days
<schweeb> alright
<schweeb> so we're gonna just go through the list with them and fix only 2.6.10 and 2.4.27 patches?
<dholbach> until the wiki was fucked earlier today i worked on wiki.ubuntu.com/AptGetOrg
<dholbach> hrmmm, don't know about them patches
<lamont> schweeb: 2.4??? that's like ancient...
<schweeb> most of the stuff that I saw needed fixing were patches
<dholbach> lamont: fabbione said: we need it
<schweeb> lamont: I heard we were supporting .27 still
<lamont> ok
* schweeb tries to remember where teh list of broken kernel stuff was
* Gangster` slaps apokryphos around a bit with a large trout
<dholbach> schweeb: i made a list of all kernel packages and which packages depend on it, we'll have a look at it
<lamont> if someone wants to see what architecures smlnj will actually bootstrap on, I'll turn the crank to get it in...
<dholbach> ... once i know, if reworking AptGetOrg was a good idea
<schweeb> alrighty
* schweeb pokes tseng
<schweeb> tseng: are we putting 1.0.6 of mono in, since 1.1.5 isn't much of a possibility?
<crimsun> woohoo!
<tseng> schweeb: no?
<crimsun> fixed xfdesktop!
<crimsun> <3 ld(1)
<schweeb> tseng: I found some 1.0.6 packages somewhere, if you're interested at all...
<tseng> im not
<tseng> ive seen a zillion different mono packages
<tseng> the ones i saw someone pushing today didnt even have full sources uploaded
<tseng> missing changes and orig.tar.gz
<tseng> not that i would be at all interested in seeing those.
* lamont gives back a bunch of universe packages
<tseng> thanks!
<lamont> tseng: it _shouldn't_ matter.  but sadly, people's idea of good build-depends isn't always there.
<lamont> so no plans to fix 2.6.9 et al, correct?
* lamont makes an early night of it.
<tseng> so this no_ubuntu_spatial crap
<tseng> i dont even have that key
<schweeb> think you have to create it
<tseng> well thats worse than unacceptable.
<dholbach> cool... http://popcon.ubuntu.com
<tseng> jesus
<tseng> how is anyone supposed to figure that out
<schweeb> indeed
<tseng> https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=8530
<tseng> i asked sabdfl in here to tell me why he came up with such an idea, but he has yet to respond.
<tseng> meh.
<Burgundavia> a major mess
<schweeb> lol, that bugreport reeks of sarcasm
<tseng> if i wrote it it would have lines of text in all caps lamenting my broken drag n' drop
<tritium> Hello.
<bddebian> Hello tritium
<tritium> Hi bddebian :)
<bddebian> Put Ubuntu on my laptop today finally. ;-)
<dholbach> bddebian: ROCK
<dholbach> :-)
<tritium> bddebian, awesome!
<bddebian> dholbach: Heh.  Well, except that I am going to send this to ajmitch soon.  But I have another one coming.. :-)
<tritium> bddebian, will we soon be calling you bdubuntu?
<bddebian> Heh..  Hard to say
<dholbach> bddebian: you could send one to me as well
<HostingGeek> bddebian: muwhahahaha
<dholbach> bddebian: i could do with a laptop
<bddebian> maybe bdMOTFU
<bddebian> dholbach: Well the other one I am getting is fairly slow.  I think it's only 300Mhz or so.  I'll check the specs though and let you know
<HostingGeek> bddebian: i have the habit of stealing nicks.... better register it before i take it :P
<bddebian> hehe
<dholbach> bddebian: it was more a joke... :-)
<dholbach> HostingGeek: very useful - but i'll behave, i won't start "contributing something useful to the channel" again
<HostingGeek> dholbach: wink wink
<tritium> dholbach, so your changes to the AptGetOrg wiki page were lost, and you had to redo them?
<HostingGeek> What they are lost?!?!?!?
<HostingGeek> Noooo!
<dholbach> HostingGeek: i am redoing atm
<bddebian> dholbach: So you don't want one? :-)
<dholbach> you send it to europe? :-)
<bddebian> D00d, I have sent equipment all over this god forsaken planet.. :-)
<tritium> bddebian, so you have extra hardware lying around, or how can you afford to do that?
<bddebian> tritium: I get a lot of machines as my company and such rolls out new ones
<tritium> bddebian, I see...sounds great.
<bdubuntu> bddebian: its your last chance
<bdubuntu> do you want this wonderful nick?
<HostingGeek> i haven't registered it yet...
<bddebian> Bahh
<dholbach> yes
<bddebian> No, I think next time I won't use a nick based on a distro.  Kinda like haveing a tattoo with your wifes name on it.. :-)
<pe7er> re: popcon -- "1387  encspot                            1     1     0     0     0 (Not in sid)" ...jeez! i'm down there! (and i'm still lurking :) greetings fellow motus, you do a marvellous job
<tritium> hi pe7er
<dholbach> thanks pe7er :-)
<dholbach> ha... i'm on 142 on universe/by_inst ;-)
<pe7er> i feel ashamed. i shouldn't talk here.
<dholbach> oh come on :-))
<pe7er> it's just that i noticed the popcon actually works and i'm participating. for real. i have a lot to learn
<dholbach> pe7er: it's cool... i learnt about http://hwdb.ubuntu.com just today :-)
<dholbach> erm
<dholbach> pe7er: it's cool... i learnt about http://popcon.ubuntu.com just today :-)
* dholbach is half-asleep :-)
<pe7er> oh, as i should be fully.
<dholbach> me too, but i was kind of upset/worried since my work of 3 days went down the drain
<pe7er> ups. no invocation of an 'act of god'?
<dholbach> and i'll have to get a move on if it shall be put into hoary
<dholbach> beg your pardon? 'act of god'? i don't understand :-)
<pe7er> it's not on my fingertips, but...
<pe7er> it's a possibility according to http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/FinalFreeze
<pe7er> (etc)
<pe7er> :)
<schweeb> losing apt-get.org work isn't enough of an act of god
<schweeb> unless, of course, it's a sign that it shouldn't be done :)
<dholbach> i think i'll have it ready again in 10h of work or something
* pe7er is reading the according thread
<dholbach> pe7er: wiki.ubuntu.com/AptGetOrg is one of the pages that suffered hardest from being reset-to-a-state-of-3-days-ago
<tritium> sorry that happened to you, dholbach :(
<pe7er> ew. disaster. have you looked in your browser cache? maybe a more up-to-date version is in your history? <--- bloody dumb guess, but maybe... there is a chance, isn't it?
<dholbach> tritium, pe7er: thanks :-)
<dholbach> pe7er: no... and the google-cache was older too
<dholbach> but now i'll keep it in my own wiki, so i'll be to blame ;-)
<dholbach> i just hope they switch to another wiki RSN
<dholbach> chances are pretty bad to get single pages re-synced, since our beloved wiki saves EVERYTHING in one big blog
<dholbach> blob
<pe7er> dholbach, about the ones under 'highly concerned about legal issues' - wolf3d, hexen2 source codes have been released afaik (i know nothing about the data) but that jaguar bios surely isn't - but a great finding, i might be able to play tempest 2000 now, finally, again :)
<dholbach> pe7er: oh... they did
<dholbach> pe7er: well then somebody else should review the licenses for code/artwork/..., since i don't want to be the one to blame if anything goes wrong with that :-)
<pe7er> don't take me for granted.
<pe7er> but i think its id policy to release sources after n time
<pe7er> if that's a tiny thing i can contribute i will do some research
<pe7er> (i'm not much of a gamer, though)
<Burgundavia> id does generally release old titles
<dholbach> does anybody of you happen to know a good 24h-masseur in dortmund, germany?
<Burgundavia> ?
<Burgundavia> sorry, wrong country and continent
<dholbach> :-)
<HostingGeek> I saw this in idea pool:
<HostingGeek> "Provide a version of totem compiled as i686, i386 performance on proprietary nvidia drivers is horrible, if this is an xv issue with the binary driver, provide a download of totem compiled against it"
<HostingGeek> You think we could provide it in universe?
<dholbach> yay for latin jazz!
<tritium> bedtime.  Goodnight!
<dholbach> tritium: only 2h in bed?
<tritium> dholbach, I can't sleep.  I'm sure you're familiar with that ;)
<dholbach> haha :-)
<tritium> Anne has a cold too, so I'm caring for her.
<dholbach> ok - that's better than taking care of stupid packages
<dholbach> i went through more than half of the list again
<dholbach> and now i think i can sleep some hours :-)
<tritium> good, I'm glad you can rest.  Good job!
<dholbach> yeah... i'll take murphy out and then we'll hop into bed again
<tritium> Sounds good :)  Sleep tight.
<dholbach> thanks... hope you rest too
<tritium> Thanks, I will.
<dholbach> :-)
<dholbach> good night
<tritium> good night
<HostingGeek> tritium: asleep yet?
<tritium> HostingGeek, no
<tritium> HostingGeek, were you going to ask me something?
<HostingGeek> tritium: still not sleeping!?
<HostingGeek> AT 2AM!
<tritium> yep
<tritium> but I'm going to bed now.  Good night.
<HostingGeek> good night
<Treenaks> anyone who needs a nice domain name: cornhol.io and sig.io are still available :)
<dholbach> hey!
<Treenaks> hi
<ogra> morning
<ajmitch> hi
* ajmitch_ wonders why xchat is so very lagged tonight
<ajmitch_> dholbach: did you manage to get back any data from the wiki death?
<jani> is there any time lag between packages succesfully compiled (as show in lamont logs) and making their way into the pool/ ?
<Mithrandir> probably, yes.
<jani> hours?
<Mithrandir> shouldn't no.
<jani> xfmedia and xterminal are the ones I am looking at
<Mithrandir> talk to lamont when he wakes up?
<jani> yup I asked generically since I see he's not around :)
<jani> thanks
<jani> bbl
<dholbach> ajmitch_: henrik just wrote me... he'll be able to recover
<dholbach> ajmitch_: but i don't know to what extent and since it will all be done manually...
<dholbach> i couldnt sleep last night, and i re-reviewed 3/4 of the list again
<dholbach> so i guess i'll finish it and i'm out of trouble for the release
<crimsun> hey guys!
<crimsun> jani: xfmedia and xterminal are both done
<crimsun> they upgraded on my machine early yesterday
<dholbach> woohoo!
<ogra> yeah
<crimsun> jani: afaik, mousepad is the _only_ package we need to look at now.  I fixed xfdesktop4 about 7 hours ago
<crimsun> jani: Oliver (from upstream) hinted that he'd like us to use a pristine (non-Xfld) background by default, so we should look into that
<crimsun> jani: (which I think is fine, since the About menu says Xfld, etc.)
<ogra> crimsun, afaik xfce uses transparent svg.... you could look at volvoguys archive
<crimsun> ogra: sure, got a url handy?
<dholbach> volvoguy.net/ubuntu
<crimsun> thanks :)
<ogra> http://www.volvoguy.net/ubuntu/
<dholbach> :-p
<crimsun> and thanks :P
<ogra> heh
<koke> hi all!
<crimsun> lo :)
<koke> hi dholbach
<crimsun> wb :)
<dholbach> :-)
<koke> hey, I'm on the planet now!! :D
<dholbach> ROCK! :-)
<koke> what do you think about http://www.amedias.org/~koke/misc/usbview_1.0-6_to_1.0-6ubuntu1.diff
<koke> any better solution??
<crimsun> automake should be invoked before autoconf as I recall
<ogra> hmm, does anybody see his hackergotchi on planet ? (i know the new ones should be there according to jdub)
<koke> juanje: hey, how are you?
<koke> ogra: mine is not there
<ogra> mine neither
<dholbach> mine neither :-)
<ogra> oh, i dont even have a recent entry....
<ogra> but i know dholbach and tseng have submitted theirs
<crimsun> nope, I don't see one.
<crimsun> koke: looks fine to me
<crimsun> (unless it's a case where simply copying config.{guess,sub} from autotools-dev in the clean target would suffice)
<crimsun> back later, work.
<koke> crimsun: http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/u/usbview/1.0-6/usbview_1.0-6_20050328-0655-powerpc-failed
<kakutsi> koke:hey
<kakutsi> I'm doing fine
<kakutsi> ;)
<whiskers> anyone have the proper configuration to utilized subfs in ubuntu
<dholbach> i'm off for now, doing the laundry *wave*
<lamont> jani: logs are pushed to people.u.c every 10 minutes, the stuff in Lists gets marked Uploaded when the package is uploaded, Installed when it gets into the accepted queue (that process runs every 5 minutes), and into pool/ every 30, unless they are NEW or BYHAND, which requires manual intervention
<crimsun> Xfce 4.2.1 is go.
<crimsun> All packages done.
<ogra> YEAH !!!!
<jani> crimsun bravo
<jani> including mousepad?
<crimsun> jani: yep, just dput
<jani> I am just settingup pbuilder
<jani> what was the pb with pkg-config?
<crimsun> missing libgtk2.0-dev :)
<jani> strange error though sayng it cannot find libxfcegui4 isn't it?
<crimsun> yeah, I think I'm going to have to look at those that one's b-d
<crimsun> err, one of the -dev's Depends
<jani> you may want to announce to ubuntu-users so some we get extra testers
<jani> since your uploads do not show up on hoary-changes
<jani> what was with the missing quit symbol?
<crimsun> ld wasn't exporting it
<crimsun> I had to pass -Wl,-E to the compiler
<jani> do you think os-works used different toolchain while building their debs?
<crimsun> I don't believe so, maybe some different LDFLAGS
<crimsun> upstream has already corrected in cvs
<crimsun> jani: http://comments.gmane.org/gmane.comp.desktop.xfce.devel.version4/5872
<crimsun> jani: great work, btw :)
<jani> look who's talking ;)
<crimsun> pfft, team effort :)
<jani> my main task was prodding you
<jani> agree
<jani> btw did you install pbuilder according to ubuntu wiki?
<jani> it doesn't work for me
<bddebian> Good morning
<crimsun> jani: hmm, it should (works for me).  Where does it break for you?
<crimsun> morn bddebian
<jani> well although I changed the mirrors it still wants to get from debian japan
<jani> is all that config stuff for nonauthenticated packages necessary?
<jani> if we only use signed ubuntu repos
<crimsun> jani: make sure you changed MIRRORSITE to http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu and left NONUSMIRRORSITE commented out in ~/.pbuilderrc
<crimsun> jani: afaik, yes, the allow-unauthenticated is necessary
<jani> do I need .pbuilderrc isn'tenough changing the one in /etc ?
<crimsun> err, /etc/pbuilderrc should be fine
<crimsun> (I just use ~/.pbuilderrc because I don't have full root access on my building machine)
<jani> same with nonusmirror commented and uncommented
<jani> I'll start from scratch again (3rd time :()
<jani> btw when not using universe it was ok with ubuntu
<jani> but only when doing the universe part it starts going in .jp
<jani> anyway I probably messed up /etc/pbuilderrc which is sympliked to /etc/pbuilder/pbuilderrc, I'll start again, thanks
<jani> also after pbuilder update I get W: /usr/bin/gpgv not found when it wants to verify the archives.And I have gnupg installed.
<crimsun> I'm pretty sure that's why you have to use allow-unauthenticated
<Mithrandir> I guess nobody minds me uploading a new mplayerplug-in with mplayer-amd64 added to the Depends line?
<Vollstrecker> pe7er: Would you test my amule cvs source pkg?
<pe7er> sure,
<Vollstrecker> Just change deb to deb-src in my repository address.
<Vollstrecker> Maybe you get this libcurl3 error, but if you download and adjust the builddep to your current version it should work.
<Vollstrecker> I forgot, it's currently uploading, so maybe wait a bit. 30 min should be more than enough.
<dholbach> re
<lamont> Rejected: acidwarp_1.0-5_i386.deb: has 1 file(s) with a time stamp too ancient (e.g. usr/share/man/man6/acidwarp.6.gz [Fri Jan  4 06:54:14 1980] ).
<lamont> someone could touch a file and reupload if they were so inclined
<crimsun> k
<crimsun> morning michael
<tritium> crimsun, Good morning, Daniel
* schweeb does the I'm getting a new job dance
<crimsun> schweeb: congrats!
<tritium> Congrtulations, schweeb!
<schweeb> not /quite/ official, but pretty much
<schweeb> it's a good gig too :)
<tritium> :)
<tritium> crimsun, would you be able to review a couple packages for me later today or this evening?
<crimsun> tritium: yep.
<tritium> Great, thank you!
<crimsun> tritium: I have class in an hour (noon EDT), but I'll check after that.
<crimsun> tritium: np :)
<tritium> No problem, in fact, I still have some work to do on them.
<tritium> New upstream, and a few changes to make.
<crimsun> k
<tritium> I appreciate it.  I'll look for you later on.
<crimsun> k
<tritium> crimsun, sorry I missed your message the other day.  I tried replying, but you were away.
<crimsun> tritium: np
<lamont> systemimager-ssh and cbmlink both lie about what binaries they build, which causes wanna-build to keep trying to build it (package sits in 'uploaded', despite actually being in the archive...)  if someone wants to fix that for breezy, that'd be way cool.
<lamont> (best way is to get the debian maintainer to fix it, of course..)
<siretart> evening, folks!
<siretart> has anyone tried to build octave2.0 with gcc-3.3?
<siretart> ok, seems to be known to upstream. they recommend the 2.1 branch for newer compilers
<siretart> please, could someone with upload privileges revisit https://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/MOTUToSync? there are some package with really could/should be brought in sync with debian
<schweeb> siretart: elmo does all syncing I believe
<siretart> schweeb: in universe?
<schweeb> yep
<schweeb> he syncs to the debian version, and then if any more fixes are necessary, it's our responsibility
<siretart> btw, elmo. I send a message to upload@.. for getting my email whitelisted, but nothing happened yet. Should I bother him about that on irc?
<siretart> schweeb: hm. I think he has better things to do than looking at the wikipage for resyncing universe :(
<ogra> schweeb, elmo is not automated yet (we're working on it *g*)
<schweeb> hehe
<siretart> ;)
<schweeb> siretart: yea, just bug him on IRC...
<ogra> so he needs a trigger (mail or irc ) with a list what to sync
<schweeb> ahh
<siretart> ah, ok
<siretart> ok. I'll do. Now I'm off for sushi :)  *wave*
<herve> good ni... er, evening!
<herve> my!
<herve> the new ifupdown in debian closes like 50 bugs!
<herve> no kidding!
<crimsun> wow.
<crimsun> excellent
<herve> what do I say?
<herve> I counted 146!!
<Treenaks> herve: 1 upload closes 146  bugs???
<herve> sure
<crimsun> tritium: ping, need url to your packages
<herve> look at the latest ifupdown in debian
<Treenaks> herve: is it a complete rewrite, or what?
<herve> crimsun, Riddell, you should check their new python-qt3
<crimsun> herve: k
<herve> Treenaks, I bet this would have been the easiest way :-)
<Treenaks> herve: oh it closes a lot of "Fixed in NMU" bugs as well
<herve> hmm, yes, after reading the changelog, they caught up many intermediary versions
<herve> but still...
<tritium> crimsun, I'm still working on them.  Sorry...
<crimsun> tritium: ok, no sweat.
<tritium> crimsun, if you're still available later this afternoon or evening, I'll ping you
<crimsun> tritium: sure thing
<tritium> thanks
<crimsun> np
<Riddell> herve: yep, new python-qt3 and kde3 are on my todo list for this eveningt
<tritium> crimsun, I am also trying to setup dput (with or without mini-dinstall on the machine with my repo).  It's turning out to be much more complicated than dupload.
<tritium> hi dholbach
<dholbach> hi! :-)
<dholbach> what's going on in MOTU-land? :-)
<Treenaks> not a lot, apparently ;)
<dholbach> so we're all set for the release? nothing to do anymore?
* Treenaks is having a "Why isn't Dutch included on the CD" mailthread with the -nl list.. *sigh*
<tritium> dholbach, I should have new packages later this evening
<dholbach> tritium: cool
<tritium> I can't get dput configured to do something similar to http://www.debian.org/doc/maint-guide/ch-upload.en.html#s-upload-private
<dholbach> hrm... only used it for uploading to upload.u.c
<tritium> do you use dupload for private repo?
<dholbach> i don't use my private repo any more :-)
<tritium> Okay.  I tried mini-dinstall on the server, but that's also a pita
<dholbach> schweeb: you're there?
<schweeb> working, but yes
<dholbach> ah ok... wouldnt want to stop you from that :-)
<schweeb> considerin goin home early
<schweeb> I'm tired as hell
<dholbach> me too
<dholbach> had a strange night
<schweeb> I was all anxious about this job thing, and didn't get much sleep
<schweeb> but I'm pretty sure I've got it now... the interview is just a formality
<dholbach> i was anxious about wiki-apt-get.org-breakage
<dholbach> same result
<dholbach> oh cool
<herve> re/hi/whatever
<herve> dholbach, you didn't read out of bed to empty your mind? :-p
<herve> is the wiki safe to edit now?
<schweeb> herve: should be
<herve> I'd prefer a "must" :-p
<dholbach> herve: on the phone, brb
<herve> a new upstream of gcompris \o/
<herve> debianized, I mean
<herve>  * Regenerate libtool and autoconf stuff again. 
<herve> seems like the solution was that simple...
<dholbach> re
<dholbach> herve: to be honest, i couldnt empty my mind :-)
<dholbach> herve: tell elmo to sync it
<herve> gcompris? I test it before
<dholbach> right
<dholbach> i'm going through UnmetDeps again
<dholbach> i think we tackled some issues already
<herve> heya jbailey !
<dholbach> did we agree what to do about dietlibc on amd64?
<jbailey> Heya Herv!
<ajmitch> hi jeff, daniel et al :)
<herve> the same to you :-)
<dholbach> hey ajmitch
<jbailey> Heya Andrew
* ajmitch had best get off to work & talk to you all from there
<herve> what's the difference? :-)
<ajmitch> I'll be "working" there ;)
<herve> haaaaaa
<herve> :-p
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<dholbach> i feel quite uncomfortable not knowing what we have still to fix :-)
<herve> I've *just* finished downloading and install build deps
<herve> gnaaa...
<jbailey> Hey - have the MOTUs frozen uploads and such yet?  Someone pointed out a really stupid bug in cdbs that I'm planning to ignore.  It would only trigger if someone were doing serious packaging work with auto-generated debian/control files so I'd really like to leave it until breezy.
<dholbach> no, no frozen uploads for universe
<crimsun> we're dputting right up until 8 Apr
<crimsun> or least I will be =)
<jbailey> Do you guys have rules or anything limiting the scope of changes?
<dholbach> not really
<dholbach> but we're busy with fixing
<crimsun> jbailey: we trust you =)
<dholbach> i think i'll do some package reviewing
<dholbach> we have some python packages in the queue still
<jbailey> crimsun: It's not a matter of your trusting me.  Just that Im' fairly certain that every package in the archive now hasn't triggered this bug.  I only need to fix it if someone's about to go on an experimental packaging rampage.
<crimsun> jbailey: if you build it, we'll try and break it =)
* ajmitch_ returns (from work)
<ajmitch_> jbailey: just how bad is the bug?
<jbailey> ajmitch: Shell escaping in control.in can eat control fields.
<jbailey> ajmitch: Which is how I can be fairly certain that it's a non issue for anything in the archive right now. =)
<herve> hi koke
<koke> hi!
<dholbac1> hey koke
<ajmitch_> curses, forgot to bring along the laptop to listen to music
<bddebian> Loser :-)
<herve> someone knows how a "libtoolized" project is updated?
<herve> run "libtoolize --force" ?
<herve> I'll try gcompris tomorrow now
<herve> good night all!
<bradb> dholbach, ogra: hey guys. any glaring problems that i should know, that you guys have discovered since starting on Malone? e.g. in your ideal world, what would be the next feature i'd add to Malone?
<dholbach> bradb: to be honest, i was fairly busy with other stuff in the last days
<bradb> ok, no worries...just making sure you guys know that if you're looking for someone to flame about Malone, i'm the guy! :P
<dholbach> bradb: does the team administration thing work or did i look in the wrong places?
<dholbach> bradb: you'll be at UDU as well, right?
<bradb> dholbach: team administration works, AFAIK
<bradb> yes, i'll be at UDU
<dholbach> rock... so we'll surely flame there ;-)
<bradb> dholbach: team administration is perhaps less interesting for MOTU though because distro tasks are wiki-mode anyway. it's useful in the case of, for example, getting notifications to a global email address, if you use or are planning on setting up such a mailing list.
<koke> bradb: https://launchpad.ubuntu.com/malone/bugs/226 plleeease :D
<dholbach> yeah, but like adding people to the MOTU crew
<crimsun> hmm.
<bradb> koke: yeah, we've gotta do something about that. there might be a solution that one of our guys came up with, but i hadn't taken the time yet to look at how well it works (or breaks), and actually integrating it into Malone.
<crimsun> I just tried to change the status of a bug on malone, and it told me "a system error occurred"
* bradb assigns 226 to himself and bumps it up to high priority
<bradb> crimsun: that bug should be fixed in the next rollout (i checked in the fix a short while ago)
<crimsun> bradb: great, thanks!
<Burgundavia> anybody else having issues with ff and the https ubuntu sites?
<koke> bradb: the links are done with <td onclick="...">
<bradb> koke: yep
<koke> bradb: just for curiosity, is there any chance to join the malone dev team??
<dholbach> yeah... assigning a bug to somebody else gives me a "A system error occurred." as well
<bradb> dholbach: any bug with an empty maintainer list (seen in the portlet on the page where the bug comments are) will cause that problem, if i guessed correctly (unfortunately i can't see the precise error message on production machines either.)
<bradb> koke: anything in particular you were wanting to work on?
<koke> random bugfixing :)
<koke> I like to send patches with my bug reports :D
<dholbach> bradb: wanted to assign 296 to tseng (brandon (hale)) :-)
<bradb> dholbach: i can't do it either :)
<bradb> i'll see if i can get stub to do another rollout today
<dholbach> rock
<bradb> koke: i can't make that call myself, but i can appreciate your interest in helping out. i'll come back to you as soon as i have an answer for you.
<koke> bradb: another request, in the search person popup, it'd be great to auto-focus the input box
<bradb> koke: is there a bug report open on that?
<koke> I don't think so
<koke> I have to do a report on a lot of little issues with malone
<koke> filing a bug for each one would be a bit painful :)
<bradb> i'll lose track of them otherwise :)
<bradb> koke: in general, it's up to you to figure out how much you want a feature. a good, clear, bug report that we both agree is a problem is likely to get fixed. a not-bug-report is unlikely to get fixed.
<bradb> e.g. there's a bug report on the clickability crack, and you /also/ mentioned that it's nagging at you. i'm looking at fixing it right now. :-)
<koke> bradb: I don't understand very well the difference between task and bug
<bradb> a bug is a problem in software
<bradb> a bug task is a bug needing to be fixed in a specific place
<bradb> so, you can draw some obvious distinction between what data each would contain, based on that.
<bradb> e.g. the title, description, summary, etc. is stored on the bug
<bradb> the assignee, priority, severity, etc. is stored on the task, because each of those are specific to the place where the bug needs to be fixed (e.g. "priority" might be High for Ubuntu, but Low for upstream)
<bradb> does that make sense?
<koke> https://launchpad.ubuntu.com/malone/bugs/194 <-- look at this
<koke> the problem is at https://launchpad.ubuntu.com/malone/products/malone : "Upstream Bugs for: Malone"
<koke> but the links point to tasks
<koke> I guess the confusion came from there
<lamont_r> dholbach: you around?
<lamont_r> or ogra
<bradb> koke: yes, I understand your confusion 100% :) i'm hoping to get rid of the word "tasks" entirely, at least as much as it bubbles up to the UI. i'll have to discuss that with sabdfl though before making any committments on what we plan to do there.
<lamont_r> gtk-*engine (marked Uploaded in ~lamont/buildLogs/Lists/hoary.all.*) are delivering gtk1 and gtk2 packages.. The gtk2 packages are delivered in a newer version by gtk2-*engine
<lamont_r> gtk-*engine should stop delivering those packages, and then it can enter the archive.
<bradb> koke: e.g. i'd like to see URLs something like /malone/products/apache/bugs/42, as a possible way of dropping /tasks from the URL
<dholbach> lamont_r: yes
<lamont_r> dholbach: just adding to your task list... mind you, I don't know that anyone uses the gtk1 packages any more... :)
<koke> bradb: I guess it would be better to have /bugs/42, at least as an alias
<dholbach> lamont_r: you're talking about all those gtk-*engine packages, right?
<lamont_r> yes
<dholbach> hrmbl
<dholbach> will have a look
<lamont_r> Rejected: gtk2-engines-mist_0.9-4_i386.deb: old version (1:2.6.2-0ubuntu2) in hoary >= new version (0.9-4) targeted at hoary.
<lamont_r> is the part you're not seeing anywhere...
<dholbach> ok
<dredg> actually... i've never understood the '1:1.0-3' style version numbers.
<dredg> what's the 1: about?
<crimsun> it's an epoch
<dredg> (hi everyone btw)
<dholbach> dredg: used for overriding
<dredg> crimsun: ah, right
<dredg> used to force, say an older package over a newer one?
* lamont_r heads off for home
* dredg bumps kismet
<dredg> should build on ia64 since diamond fixed snacc
<dholbach> good night everyone
<dredg> night dholbach
<crimsun> night dholbach
<tseng> ogra: dholbach's hackergotchi was inappropriate for planet
<dholbach> showed too much skin
<dholbach> ;-)
<tseng> yep
<dholbach> hahahaaaaha
<tseng> nice cans.
<dholbach> cans?
<tseng> slang
<tritium> good night dholbach!
<dholbach> night dredg, crimsun, tseng, tritium :-)
<tseng> bye dholbach.
<crimsun> cya
#ubuntu-motu 2005-04-16
<tritium> crimsun, may I /msg you regarding my package review?
<crimsun> tritium: sure
<tritium> thanks
<lamont-away> dholbach: note that we should not be adding epochs, since they're forever
<koke> lamont: dholbach left the channel about an hour ago
<koke> maybe two
<lamont> yeah
* koke sleeps
<whiskers> anywhere there is lots of basics here on ubuntu already....no real need for all that specialized gentoo stuff
<whiskers> i even have blender working on this hoary
<whiskers> but i don't know how to use it
<yojimbo-san> I'm packaging OpenVPN (v2, from source, there is no up-to-date Debian package) for internal usage here, and it strikes me that I should contribute this back to Universe somehow. I can't find any documentation on the wiki about what's supposed to be in a package, however - things like providing an /etc/defaults/ file (how to avoid clobbering this on an upgrade?), when to call update-rc.d (postinst?) and so on. Any pointers?
<schweeb> yojimbo-san: have you read the Debian New Maintainer's Guide and the Debian Policy Manual?
<yojimbo-san> well, I've read enough to be able to technically make  packages, but I'm not sure about the policy sorts of questions ...
<yojimbo-san> but I suppose a more in-depth read wouldn't go amiss :-)
<schweeb> the policy manual is pretty in depth
<schweeb> best experience is just looking at other packages though...
<yojimbo-san> schweeb: will that cover things about how to upgrade gracefully and so on?
<schweeb> well, in a simple package, graceful upgrades are zero work at all
<schweeb> in something like mysql or postgresql or something, you'd want to make scripts to be sure the existing database works fine
<schweeb> all of which is done via debconf scripts, or pre/post rm/inst scripts
<yojimbo-san> schweeb: thanks. In OpenVPN's example, I have to stop/start the existing server, which should be easy enough. Currently I'm shupping an /etc/defaults/openvpn file, which says "ENABLED=0" - the server needs to be manually configured initially. But I realise that I'll be clobbering this file if I upgrade, so perhaps that isn't the right thing to do. I'll do some more research :-)
<schweeb> yojimbo-san: it should end up marked as a config file, and it will ask if you want to replace with the maintainer version
<schweeb> IME
<yojimbo-san> mmm, OK, I'll have to find out how to identify config files within a package then. Possibly something in the control file, but I'm sure a proper RTFM will help :-)
<ajmitch_> hmm, I wonder what's so wrong with the package in sid?
<ajmitch_> it's only 5 days old (openvpn)
<ajmitch_> it is 1.99, which I'd assume to be a 2.0 prerelease
<schweeb> *shrug*
<ajmitch_> if he comes back, point that out - sid has rc18, rc20 was only released today ;)
<lamont> niall@evil.ie around?
* lamont sends email
<StR> hi  there.....   i'm a new ubuntu user...
<StR> i come from slackware
<StR> and I want to know if there is somehting like linuxpackages.net for ubuntu
<StR> i mean, a site where anyone can post their new packages that where not found in the rep
<schweeb> StR: apt-get.org
<dholbach> good morning!
<tritium> Good morning, dholbach :)
<dholbach> hey tritium :-)
<dholbach> StoneTable: i was just looking at libapache2-mod-ldap-userdir
<dholbach> StoneTable: did you just take the debian version and compiled it for ubuntu?
<dholbach> can somebody with an i386 do me a favor and compile  prj2make-sharp  from  http://thorin.battleaxe.net/~stone/hoary/  in a pbuilder?
<tritium> ok
<dholbach> thanks tritium
<dholbach> <--- off into the shower
<tritium> sure
<dholbach> tritium: could you tell me if it builds and installs - that's all i need to know
<tritium> dholbach, okay, still working on it
<tritium> will let you know
<dholbach> :-)
<dholbach> could you all please that have still packages listed on UniversePythonTransitionTODO in state "Being transitioned" scan your /home/-directories for packages that are ready?
<dholbach> morning doko
<dholbach> brb
<dholbach> hey azeem
<dholbach> see you guys later
<jani> ogra ping
<jani> hey dholbach
* zendog says g'night ppl, and thx!
<dholbach> hey jani :-)
<jani> I just uploaded my last python transage yesterday, only to see today that doko did the same about the same time :)
<jani> pymol
<dholbach> :-)
<azeem> jani: oh, good
<azeem> I came here to ask for that
<dholbach> i'll go through the lists today and have a look which ones are just lying around... finished
<jani> azeem, coincidence :)
<azeem> got another mail from a Ubuntu user yesterday asking me for a transition
<jani> azeem I sent you a debdiff a couple of weeks ago, must have fallen through the cracks
<doko> jani: sorry, yes, should have told you about ...
<azeem> jani: what's your email address?
<jani> doko, np :)
<jani> jani at email ro
<jani> but it is banned by hoaryt-changes spam filter
<azeem> I vaguely remember something, but I can't find a mail from you
<azeem> anyway
<azeem> doko: can I safely put python-dev in my Build-Depends and ${python:Depends} in Depends? Would that just work on Debian and Ubuntu?
<doko> azeem: yes and no. usually Debian requires a versioned dependency on python-dev (>= 2.4), if you want to assure that it builds with 2.4. yes, it's nice to have something completely independent from the default python version.
<azeem> doko: I meant source compatibility. So a simple recompile would work on Debian and Ubuntu and yield packages for the respective default python version.  Right now, I Build-Depend on python2.3-dev.
<doko> yes, that should work.
<azeem> thanks
<tseng> ogra: oh, i dont think ive mentioned this. since im working full time with no ssh access to outside, i wont be making any meetings.
<dholbach> tseng: don't you think we'll be able to make appointments you'll be able to attend?
<Gervystar> hi tseng. Any news about the mono packaging? Just in case you'll need some testing, give me a call.
<tseng> dholbach: well, im here a few hours in the evening, but we go to dinner whenever
<tseng> and alot of other people are asleep when i get home
<tseng> Gervystar: meebey (debian mono) is working out the upgrade issues
<Gervystar> tseng: fine
<dholbach> i hope we'll be able to make a time you can make to
<dholbach> i wouldn't mind getting up early
<tseng> ok we can talk about that later
<tseng> then.
<tseng> i hope meebey gets to reviewing my mad dholbach style dash of updating all the related mono packages
<dholbach> were you talking about a specific meeting?
<tseng> in general, the daytime meetings I cant do
<dholbach> erm... what do you mean? shall i help out with uploading a bunch of packages?
<tseng> no, meebey is debian mono
<tseng> he is finishing the core package
<tseng> everything else needs updated also, i sent him a slew of stuff
<dholbach> what did you mean by "i hope meebey gets to reviewing my mad dholbach style dash of updating all the related mono packages"?
<tseng> i did it like you
<tseng> a dozen packages is one sitting
<dholbach> ah ok :-)
<dholbach> <--- a bit confused by mvo's music ;-)
<tseng> hah
<tseng> bye dholbach
<dholbach> bye tseng
<dredg> right
<dredg> i dunno if anyone else got a copy of ubuntu priority list
<dredg> but diamond got a copy from henrik
<dredg> available from: http://diamond.nonado.net/misc/UniversePriorityList.moin.txt
<dholbach> you want to merge them?
<dholbach> or shall i do it?
<dredg> i'm very busy i'm afrain dholbach
<dholbach> ok
<dredg> er, substitute correct spelling where appropriate
<StoneTable> dholbach:  yes, libapache-mod-ldap-userdir was brought over from debian
<dholbach> StoneTable: and just built on a hoary box?
<StoneTable> yep
<dholbach> StoneTable: we can just sync it :-)
<dholbach> ask elmo :-)
* ajmitch waves briefly to the hard-working MOTUs
<StoneTable> okay, sweet
<dholbach> add it to MOTUToSync, so we won't forget when he's not here
<dholbach> i'll be out... having lunch with mvo - see you later
<StoneTable> cya
<spacey> is malone actively used?
<spacey> i don't see much activity, expect new bugs (open) few a day
<koke> hi motus!
<koke> what do you think about http://koke.amedias.org/2005/03/24/tintin-is-not-hig-compliant/ ??
<dredg> koke: actually i read that the other day
<dredg> i agree
<dredg> plus there are copyright issues with tintin, no?
<koke> dredg: I guess so
<koke> I'm remembering... tseng told me jimmac had done some icons for that
<koke> but they seem to were lost
<dredg> ah. pity that
<Treenaks> " MERGE ON PAIN OF DEATH " ??? sounds nice ;)
<dredg> and in the context of dotdeb stuff, highly accurate :)
<Treenaks> urggh
<dredg> :)
<bddebian> Good morning
<koke> the icons aren't in the archive :/
<koke> http://web.archive.org/web/20050405060538/http://jimmac.musichall.cz/weblog.php//Artwork/LowresTomboy.php
<dredg> tried mailing jimmac?
<dredg> --- [jimmac]  idle 00:15:30, signon: Tue Apr  5 13:51:36
<dredg> he's around
<dredg> :)
<koke> dredg: I'll try later
<koke> have to go now
<koke> I like the topic of #gimp : "Don't ask to ask, just ask" :D
<dredg> nice :)
<Treenaks> koke: and it doesnt' work, I guess
<tritium> Good morning!  :)
<bddebian> Heya tritium
<tritium> Hi bddebian
<crimsun> morning :)
<bddebian> Hello crimsun
<bddebian> bbiab
<jani> hey ogra
<ogra> hi jani
<jani> hwdb-client question
<ogra> yop
<jani> If I keep pushing the forward button
<jani> without moving the mouse from it
<jani> it does not get the click
<ogra> it doesnt take zhe click ?
<jani> only if I move the mouse from that button then back
<ogra> thats a gtk regression...
<jani> but pressing return key works
<ogra> yup
<jani> with the key I can go on
<jani> so you know about this?
<ogra> it sadly dissaperaed on my system, so i cant reproduce it anymore....but i will sort it in one or the other way before release
<ogra> yup
<jani> ok then
<ogra> its an very old gtk bug
<jani> such a fundamental thing though....
<jani> so not only pygtk?
<ogra> i guess if i dont set the focus on the button te behavior will go away, but the ease of the enter key will be lost too
<jani> I dd remove grab_focus lines and blindly played around with sensitivity(true/false) with similar results
<ogra> so currently i'm weighting out if keyboard or mouse should be preferred....i'm guessing the majority will use the mouse
<jani> og course it was my first look at pygtk code so that doesn't mean a thing :)
<ogra> i also had it in c gtk apps, so its more fundamental...
<ogra> synaptic once had this bug too (c++)
<dholbach> regexxer (c++) too
<jani> yes mouse of course...I was doing the oh so common in wondows world
<jani> next->next->next wizard stuff
<whiskers> tritium, thanks a lot for the octave example
<tritium> whiskers, you're welcome ;)
<tritium> It's very simple, but it'll get you started, and familiar with the syntax
* kain is away: phumo
<whiskers> octave is incredible....160megs of binaries to say 2 + 2 =4
<tritium> whiskers, it can do a bit more ;)
<whiskers> tritium, yes...i am sure it can...i was just making a point
<whiskers> it is like oo...hundreds of megs of binaries to write a small memo
<whiskers> this stuff is fun
<tritium> It's rather powerful, actually.
<whiskers> it reminds me of vcr's....they had hundreds of buttons that no one could figure out...and all they wanted to do was play some tapes
<whiskers> did you ever try to read a 6000 page vcr manual to figure out how to play a tape
<whiskers> these country people in Texas cannot understand any of it...it may as well have been written in a foreign language
<bddebian> PUsh in tape.  Push play..  Sheesh :-)
<whiskers> bddebian, but the play button is one of several hundred ...you will never find it
<tritium> I'm from New Mexico, just across the TX border, whiskers
<bddebian> whiskers: Bah, it just looks like a little arrow
<bddebian> Stop is a square
<bddebian> Pause i ||
<bddebian> Rewind <<
<bddebian> Fast Forward >>
<tritium> whiskers, so are you intending on using octave for your job?
<whiskers> tritium, no..i don't have a job...i am insane
<tritium> you're silly
<whiskers> tritium, well..there are just many things i don't understand
<tritium> that doesn't make you insane, though :)
<whiskers> but anyway i like it that ubuntu is the simplest of distros
<tritium> dholbach, was your time with mvo productive?
<dholbach> tritium: i'm still there :-)
<whiskers> not to be an extremist by any means....but there is something to be said for "Simplicity"
<spacey> simple in terms voor the end user you mean
<whiskers> spacey, yes
<whiskers> spacey, and not absolutely...as an extreme position...but should be part of the consideration
<spacey> yeah
<tritium> dholbach, oh :)
<lamont> dholbach: or rather all y'all
<lamont> pool/universe/s/speech-dispatcher/speech-dispatcher_0.5-2_amd64.deb:./usr/share/info/dir.old.gz
<lamont> simplest solution is to rm -f dir.old.gz (and I think dir.gz) in the build target of debian/rules.
<lamont> that's the only one in amd64 land, still crunching through the other architectures
<dholbach> ok, will do
<dholbach> gtk-engine still on my list, since seb128 told me it was gtk2-engines (in main) that needed to be fixed
<lamont> <fabbione> does anybody remember what triggered the  trying to overwrite `/usr/share/info/dir.old.gz', which is also in package texinfo problem?
<lamont> <elmo> oh, god, it's dpkg stupidity
<lamont> <elmo> dpkg install-info vs. gnu install-info
<lamont> <elmo> dpkg changed options, and it broke old automake scripts
<lamont> <elmo> easiest solution is to just rm -f the file in debian/rules build - alternately, update all the autocrap
<lamont> dholbach: ok.
<lamont> i386 universe is dir.old.gz-clean
<lamont> (note that arch:all is the last one scanned...)
<dholbach> lamont: but he wouldnt fix it for hoary, so i have to fix the universe crach temporarily
<dholbach> s/crach/crack
<lamont> ah, ok
<lamont> dholbach: and then reverse it when seb128 fixes main?
<lamont> in breezy, that is
<dholbach> yes... main and debian
<schweeb> mmm more crack
<dholbach> lamont: hrm... i can't see and /usr/share/info/dir*gz to be installed by any of the speech-dispatcher packages (dpkg -c)
<lamont> right
<lamont> just rm -f it at the end of the build target
<lamont> it's a side effect of automake and dpkg interaction
<dholbach> oh i see
<dholbach> funny
<lamont> see bugs.debian.org/214769
<dholbach> thanks
<lamont> np
<lamont> Dir.old.gz.universe:pool/universe/e/eb/eb-doc_3.3.2-4_all.deb:./usr/share/info/dir.old.gz
<lamont> dholbach: those two are all
<dholbach> lamont: thanks, will take care
<Treenaks> hmm @ dmesg: ACPI: Please implement acpi_video_bus_ROM_seq_show
<dholbach> packing my stuff - see you later
<dholbach> lamont: speech-distaster uploaded
<herve> hi
<motaboy> hi all!
<bddebian> Hello motaboy
<herve> someone knows how to use libtool?
* Treenaks points at keybuk
<herve> hi Daniel!
<dholbach> hey herv
<herve> newest gcompris doesn't compile either
<herve> goodbye it :-)
<tritium> dholbach, your fast-user-switch-applet link on MOTUNewPackages needs fixing.  Want me to do it?
<dholbach> oh... didn't notice, yeah.. thank you
<tritium> sure
<dholbach> don't know if you read it over at #ubuntu-devel:
<dholbach> <mdz> (hoary/main, that is)
<dholbach> * dholbach nods sighing deeply towards mdz
<dholbach> <mdz> dholbach: only 132 in hoary/universe
<dholbach> <mdz> dholbach: from a visual scan, they seem to be mostly Debian kernel stuff which should be removed
<dholbach> <dholbach> mdz: yes... i'll take care of that, but i hoped we were in EVEN better shape :-)
<dholbach> <mdz> dholbach: I think you're in great shape
<dholbach> <dholbach> mdz: maybe i'm looking to closely :-)
<dholbach> * mdz bows rigidly
<dholbach> <dholbach> :-)
<dholbach> that goes out to all of us
<herve> :-D
<herve> honestly, I thought the shape of universe was worst
<herve> houba !
<dholbach> :-)
<herve> dholbach, don't pay attention :-)
<encolpe> hop hop
<herve> I wanted to update the prority list page
<herve> then I wonder,
<herve> is it still useful?
<crimsun> yes
<herve> here you go!
<herve> I go, I mean :-)
<crimsun> :)
<dholbach> herve: it's building at my place
<herve> dholbach, gcompris?
<dholbach> yes
<dholbach> oh no... broke off
<herve> muhahaha!
<herve> sorry :-p
<herve> there's a justice!
<herve> gaaa
<herve> I can't find xfcalendar in the changes list
<dholbach> ;-)
<herve> but a ubuntu1 one was uploaded a built all fine
<herve> what to believe...
<thully> hi - has anyone here tried out netapplet from universe - I have a strange problem with it
<thully> it crashes on almost every logout
<tritium> thully, same thing happened to me.
<herve> sorry I don't use it
<thully> tritium: what do you suggest?  I need to be able to get on/off wi-fi
<thully> I may just leave DHCP on auto and let it timeout on boot if I'm not at a hotspot
<tritium> thully, I'm just using the Network Monitor applet these days
<thully> that would be the one that appears by default
<thully> correct?
<tritium> yes
<thully> do you use wi-fi?  if so, how do you connect/disconnect (or do you use the lazy auto-DHCP method I mentioned above)
<tritium> I have removable wireless card, so I can control when I connect/disconnect ;)
<herve> ifup/ifdown :-)
<thully> Is there much danger in setting wireless to auto-DHCP?  It will time out on boot if no APs are found, but I could just hibernate each boot...
<tritium> I don't know if tools such as laptop-net are any good, but there are a few available.
<schweeb> laptop-net is nice
<schweeb> quite nice.
<schweeb> but it's often overkill for what most people want
<tritium> that's good to konw
<motaboy> dholbach: Hi! sorry If I'm disturbing you but can you readd you comment on abakus on MOTUNewPackages wiki page? (now the man page is there) :D thanks.
<dholbach> is it gone?
<motaboy> dholbach: yes, with the wiki reset.
<dholbach> *grmbl*
<dholbach> motaboy: wrote a new one
<motaboy> dholbach: thanks!
<dholbach> de rien
* motaboy is searching for a third review... :P
<herve> lamont, ping
<lamont> herve: yo
<herve> hi
<herve> is this error supposed to happen: http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/libx/libxerces2-java/2.6.2-1/libxerces2-java_2.6.2-1_20040818-0802-amd64-failed
<lamont> yep
<lamont> well, except on i386 machines ;-)
<lamont> mind you, I wish it didn't, but I understand why it does.
<lamont> and it's apparently rather complicated and sorta pointless to fix it
<herve> nothing to fix in the package itself?
<lamont> none whatsoever
<herve> ok, thanks!
<lamont> unbuilt packages that are arch-all-only get built on i386 only, but show up in the w-b database as needs-build for all architectures until i386 gets around to it.
<lamont> by which time, it's likely that the other 3 have tried and failed
<herve> they did
<herve> I think I have a simple one to fix
<herve> if anyone want to try a quick&dirty
<herve> (it's java, better be warned ;-))
<herve> lamont, looking at http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/g/gtkam/0.1.12-2.1/gtkam_0.1.12-2.1_20050329-2325-powerpc-given-back
<herve> could you give it a push please?
<tritium> ajmitch, did you ever have a chance to review my packages?
<herve> by the way, are those xfce packages all transitioned?
<lamont> given-back==> already in needs-build
<herve> argh sorry
<herve> I forgot the whole workflow
<herve> good night all!
<dholbach> bye herve
<dholbach> sleep tight
<encolpe> ah young men are so tired...
<herve> I take it as irony :-)
<encolpe> ;)
<herve> I just go read, but shhh... :-)
* dredg yawns
<dredg> hey! :)
<bddebian> Heya dredg
<encolpe> herve: last french-translated Pratchett ?
* dredg mocks his sleeping pattern
<dredg> wow it's doomed
<herve> encolpe, former lanfeust mag :-p
<herve> okay, latest touch to the wiki
<herve> ++
<dholbach> hey koke!
<koke> hi!
<tseng> hi
<ManuelJ> hi koke
#ubuntu-motu 2005-04-17
<motaboy> night all!
<koke> night too :)
<dholbach> bye moquist
<dholbach> argl
<dholbach> bye motaboy  :-)
<dholbach> <--- too lazy
<motaboy> :D
<dholbach> *ARG* merging the UniversePriorityLists is a MAJOR pain
<dholbach> *cry*
<dholbach> ok.. i don't like it, who does it? ;-)
<dholbach> ok pals, i'm off to bed - good night
<crimsun> evening, tritium
<tritium> hello, crimsun
<tritium> be right back...
<crimsun> wb
<tritium> Thanks.
<tritium> I'm checking my aptitude logs to see what was installed today that could have blown away my custom hotplug blacklist and xorg.conf
<crimsun> xorg -10
<crimsun> don't think hotplug was updated
* crimsun greps mbox.bz2
<tritium> I thought it was supposed to check md5sum, and not update it if it was edited
<crimsun> that's what it does for me
<tritium> Yeah, strange.  MIne was completely blown away, as was my blacklist.
<tritium> crimsun, have you had a chance to review any of my packages?
<crimsun> tritium: not yet, I'm working on test-building pike7.2 on amd64
<crimsun> tritium: will look tonight
<tritium> crimsun, thanks!
<tritium> ogra, is there any way I can help with the helpfile?
<ogra> tritium, nope, i have the missing chapter in my head, but froud has the source....
<tritium> ogra, okay.  ping me if there's anything I can do
<ogra> i'll do, thanks
<Kaloz> re
<dholbach> good morning!
<dholbach> morning d3vic3
<d3vic3> morning dholbach
<Nafallo> ogra: ping?
<dholbach> Nafallo: he went to bed like 5 hours ago
<dholbach> how do you all feel towards universe at release?
<Nafallo> dholbach: ahh, oki.
<dholbach> anything you see we should fix at all costs?
<dholbach> could you please all have a look at the lists or think of stuff we need to do? i lost track of it all in the apt-get.org/kernel haze
<dholbach> i want to encourage each and everyone to make a last effort so we're in even better shape for release
<dholbach> shall i start  wiki/UniverseLastMinuteFixes ?
<dholbach> a thing we should make sure is that we get the packages in, that are lying around being ready (including NEW packages)
<dholbach> so we could at least start some reviewing action
<dholbach> http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/UniverseLastMinuteFixes
<dholbach> be back in half an hour
<koke> <dholbach> shall i start  wiki/UniverseLastMinuteFixes ? <-- great idea :D
<koke> I always have the same doubt: "half an hour" == 0.5h or 1.5h ??
<Burgundavia> half an hour = 0.5
<Mithrandir> unlike "half and an hour". :)
<Mithrandir> or one-and-a-half
<koke> thanks, IRC and mailing lists are a great english course :D
<koke> and of course documentation
<dholbach> re
<dholbach> koke: sorry... talked a bit longer to some dog owners about the latest dog-owning legislation :-)
<dholbach> koke: or better: they talked longer to me :-)
<siretart> hi folks
<dholbach> hy siretart
<dholbach> d3vic3: did the repartitioning work out?
<siretart> dholbach: in the backlog I see you asked if there where some last minute fixes for universe pending.
<dholbach> yeah or things we should focus on
<dholbach> please put all of them on UniverseLastMinuteFixes - i'll feel better then :-)
<siretart> dholbach: I really think some packages from MOTUToSync should be looked at
<dholbach> siretart: i'll talk to elmo, since i have some kernel stuff he should sync too
<siretart> but I don't have time today to ping elmo about that.. I'm at work right now
<siretart> great! :)
<dholbach> siretart: i'll now look over the kernel cruft in universe and hope he gets rid of all those as well
<siretart> ok
<dholbach> ha, www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/MorgueCandidates looks CHARMING now ;-)
<d3vic3> dholbach, yeah
<d3vic3> I just have to fix my buildd now
<dholbach> what's wrong with it?
<dholbach> now i'll review the kernel-patch-CRACK packages briefly and hopefully chuck them out as well
<d3vic3> broken
<dholbach> argl - you use pbuilder?
<koke> brb
<dholbach> hey StoneTable
<StoneTable> hey
<dholbach> ok... kernel-stuff is done
<dholbach> nobody put anything on  UniverseLastMinuteFixes ? woohoo! we're all set! we're done! YEEES! :-)
* ..[topic/#ubuntu-motu:dholbach] : Ubuntu Masters of the Universe | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/Calendar | get Python rocking again: http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UniversePythonTransitionTODO | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTUTodo | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UniverseLastMinuteFixes | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTUNewPackages | please file universe bugs in https://launchpad.ubuntu.com/distros/ubuntu/+bugs
<dholbach> who is awaiting a review and upload of packages?
<kiko> hey there
<kiko> ogra, dholbach: yo
<dholbach> hey kiko
<dholbach> kiko: i hope ogra is still fast asleep :-)
<kiko> how goes it in the universe?
<kiko> heh
<kiko> feeling the release crush :)
<dholbach> kiko: i went through my tasks but now have to get the general overview of things that are still broken
<kiko> I have a special request for you
<dholbach> fire away
<kiko> would it be possible for you to arrange the motu to produce a top-20 wishlist of features and changes to malone?
<dholbach> i'd be glad to do that in 2 days
<dholbach> koke had a couple of ideas, like middle clicking and such
<dholbach> hrmbl, he's not there atm
<kiko> that's fine, I don't want to block on these
<kiko> how does a MaloneUniverseWishList wikipage sound?
<bradb> dholbach: that's the only thing he suggested to me, so i fixed it :)
<dholbach> bradb: cool
<dholbach> kiko: super
<dholbach> i'll keep pushing the guys towards it
<kiko> dholbach, 48h a reasonable expectation?
<kiko> bradb, can you paste in a link so we can /topic it perhaps?
<bradb> kiko: the link to...?
<kiko> bradb, to a wiki page for your wishlist.
<dholbach> shall i create that page for now?
<bradb> you guys have a cert for the LP wiki?
<dholbach> didnt even know there was a LP wiki
<bradb> kiko: i assumed you wanted this page created in the LP wiki
<dholbach> is it ok to have it at wiki.ubuntu.com/MaloneUniverseWishList
<kiko> bradb, why not put it in a wiki that's convenient for them?
<dholbach> ?
<kiko> dholbach, yes, that's perfect.
<dholbach> alright
<kiko> thanks!
<dholbach> a thing i'd like is to have group-assigned tasks on my "assigned"-page as well
<dholbach> since most of the tasks will be assigned to MOTU
<dholbach> or would that be too complicated to achieve?
<kiko> dholbach, interesting
<kiko> nothing is too complicated ;)
<dholbach> hahah... even better
<kiko> put it on the wiki, we'll knock them off.
* dholbach cries desperately
* dholbach wants a working wiki
* ..[topic/#ubuntu-motu:dholbach] : Ubuntu Masters of the Universe | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/Calendar | get Python rocking again: http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UniversePythonTransitionTODO | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTUTodo | => http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UniverseLastMinuteFixes <= | => http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MaloneUniverseWishList <= | please file universe bugs in https://launchpad.ubuntu.com/distros/ubuntu/+bugs
<dholbach> kiko: done
<bradb> dholbach: thanks
<dholbach> anytime :-)
<dholbach> i'll take a nap - see you later
<kiko> thanks!
<d3vic3> ajmitch, ping
<GheRivero> res
<crimsun> hi
<crimsun> hmm, malone still goes boom when I try to assign a bug to myself
<tritium> Good morning, crimsun
<crimsun> morning, tritium
<crimsun> oh my, we have a UniverseLastMinuteFixes :-)
<tritium> checking...
<tritium> yay, I'm glad to see NewPackages on there :)
<crimsun> ok, time for SpeedReview
<tritium> Hi ogra.
<d3vic3> doko, ping
<doko> d3vic3: pong
<d3vic3> doko, hi
<d3vic3> doko: dzhandle doesn't work it python-twisted in not installed
<doko> ugh, why?
<d3vic3> but zope doen't depend on python-twisted
<d3vic3> it gives an error about shutil module not being found
<d3vic3> dpkg shows shutil.py to in be twisted, so I installed twisted and it worked
<doko> $ dlocate shutil.py
<doko> python2.4: /usr/lib/python2.4/shutil.py
<d3vic3> O.o
<d3vic3> doko, ok then, zope must depend on python2.4
<d3vic3> or something
<doko> $ dlocate python2.3/shutil.py
<doko> python2.3: /usr/lib/python2.3/shutil.py
<diamond> lo folks
<dholbach> hey diamond, oregano build failed
<dholbach> http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/o/oregano/0.40.0-3
<diamond> dholbach: *nod* working on it now
<dholbach> ok
<diamond> hum. looks like oregano want's gnome1.0 headers. wrong. bad and wrong.
<herve> --> morgue
<herve> :-p
<herve> hi diamond
<diamond> herve: hey
<diamond> wait. i'm wrong. found what i need in gnome2
<diamond> nur. i'll fix it later. now, cinema. -)
<dholbach> would anybody of you mind doing some reviews?
<herve> yes :p
<herve> no... I'll do some
<herve> but I need to get to bed early
<dholbach> herve: i didnt only talk to you, but thanks for your offer :_)
<herve> you're welcome ;)-
<dholbach> i know that mdz already told us, we were in great shape for release, but i know we can do better and we *will* be able to fix some stuff :-)
<herve> I wish I could do even better
<herve> hmm...
<herve> what's to be done precisely?
<dholbach> herve: lots of fixes have you name on already :-)
<dholbach> we have millions of lists with stuff on them
<herve> that's the point
<dholbach> we have lists of fixed packages that could be uploaded
<dholbach> we need to gather information on http://wiki.ubuntu.com/UniverseLastMinuteFixes to coordinate our last efforts
* herve dreaming of malone when we will be fixing breezy's universe...
<herve> sorry for them
<herve> but NEW packages are to be forgotten then
<ACIDnet> hey
<tritium> herve, why?
<dholbach> hey ACIDnet
<siretart> dholbach: pong
<herve> tritium, fixing existing packages or introducing new ones? what's the priority?
<dholbach> siretart: what about hping3? can the ubuntu changes be superseded by the sid package?
* siretart just bought new computer, just assembling it - therefore beeing effectly offline last few hours..
<dholbach> siretart: oh ... ok
<siretart> uhh. just a minute, gotta look
<Ben2004uk> hey
<dholbach> hey Ben2004uk
<Ben2004uk> hey
<dholbach> Ben2004uk: we have quite a lot of stuff to be done on (http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTUTodo), just grab whatever you think you can fix ;-)
<dholbach> (and on the sites linked from there)
<tritium> herve, so you're saying they should be removed from UniverseLastMinuteFixes?
<siretart> dholbach: yeah, now I remember
<dholbach> tritium, herve: don't think so, we should review and get in, what we can - some are in excellent shape
<siretart> dholbach: the new debian version does a much better job for solving the problem, which is done in the ubuntu changes
<herve> tritium, I just say I can't handle both
<siretart> dholbach: I very sure that uploading the debian source package should be enough
<dholbach> alright
<dholbach> was from sid, right?
<herve> good, lists.ubuntu.com doesn't respond... gniiiii!
<siretart> dholbach: the new debian source throws the old static list of architectures and their endianess away and uses instead /usr/include/endian.h
<dholbach> siretart: it was the sid version? i just trust your judgement on it :-)
* siretart a bit confused, I got a mail from katie for wpasupplicant and java-package, but I didn't prepare a source package, it was just resynced.. huh?
<siretart> dholbach: http://changelogs.debian.net/hping3 - version 3.a2.ds1-1 is needed (latest)
<dholbach> siretart: syncs have to "belong" to someone, you requested the syncs, so they have your name on them
<tritium> herve, well, it will also be a challenge for the packagers too
<siretart> dholbach: ah, thats a great feature! :)
<herve> tseng, ping
<siretart> dholbach: this means I was added to the whitelist, no?
<dholbach> siretart: elmo needs to know which "distribution release" it is in, so sid/sarge/...
<dholbach> seems so :-)
<siretart> dholbach: hping3 has the latest version in sid, so I think it shouldn't matter
<dholbach> yes
<siretart> argh
<siretart> sarge
<dholbach> told elmo
<herve> er... dholbach, I guess tseng already has upload right?
<dholbach> herve: not sure
<dholbach> herve: what about yours? *nag*
<dholbach> ;-)
<dholbach> nevermind me
<herve> don't remind me :-/
<herve> koke does for sure
* dholbach comforts herve 
<herve> wine case is special, leaving it
<herve> or on the opposite
<herve> who is waiting for a review?
<tritium> herve, me, for one
<crimsun> are you taking care of lxdoom et al.?
<crimsun> ^ siretart
<herve> tritium, ?
<tritium> herve, what?
<siretart> crimsun: will do. is there work to do?
<herve> tritium, state it :-)
<crimsun> siretart: that's what I'm asking.
<tritium> herve, my package review request has been posted on NewPackages since early March ;)
<siretart> crimsun: I fixed it for amd64, I check if it got uploaded yet
<herve> siretart, some package to review/upload?
<siretart> just a mom
<crimsun> nope, 1.4.4-9 still in pool
<siretart> oh, sorry, indeed: http://siretart.tauware.de/ubuntu-packages/lxdoom/
<siretart> I'll check further
<herve> tritium, it was already uploaded?
<tritium> herve, no, awaiting review
<siretart> no, just lxdoom I think
<herve> tritium, I'm not "motu enough" for such tasks
<crimsun> tritium: did you make those adjustments I suggested?
<herve> who is Corey Burger?
<tritium> crimsun, yes
<dholbach> herve: burgundavia
<tritium> herve, no problem -- thanks.
<dholbach> i think we can bend the motu-enough rules for the last 24+ hours
<crimsun> tritium: k, I'll look.
<tritium> crimsun, thanks.
<dholbach> reviews from core-helpers are good enough, but be picky :-)
<crimsun> (waiting on the machine)
<herve> which is not here... thanks dholbach
<dholbach> i'll look after matrem to close UniverseXorgBuildProblems
<herve> er...
<herve> there still were problems on it?
<tritium> crimsun, waiting on my repository server?
<dholbach> i think so
<crimsun> tritium: at that moment, yes. It's pbuilding now.
<tritium> crimsun, ok, but you can reach it okay?
<dholbach> herzi's hula-server packages are packaged superbly, it just doesnt run on my box, or i'm too dumb to get it working
<crimsun> tritium: yep
<herve> an easy one: who is Lorenzo Hernandez Garcia-Hierro?
<crimsun> trulux
<tritium> crimsun, great, thanks for your reviews.  I appreciate it -- quite a bit.
<crimsun> tritium: np
<dholbach> ah... leave the security stuff for now, i guess we're not clever enough to judge it :-)
<herve> trulux, ping
<trulux> herve: what do you want for that wimp? ;D
<crimsun> dholbach: that and it touches stuff in main, like pam
<dholbach> pitti or somebody else should look at it
<dholbach> yeah, leave it for now
<herve> trulux, er... anyway, any package to review&upload?
<dholbach> hey StoneTable
<StoneTable> howdy dholbach
<trulux> herve: libssp ones, just lemme update and upload them to pearls.tuxedo-es.org
<trulux> herve: selinux-support might be good, but these packages should get in Breezy's main
<herve> trulux, too big for me I guess :-)
<trulux> herve: libssp?
<herve> StoneTable, heya! any package to review before it's too late?
<herve> trulux, will try
<tritium> crimsun, may I query?
<crimsun> tritium: sure
<StoneTable> herve:  nope, I'm all set right now
<herve> Phython, ping
<trulux> herve: ok, lemme update them
<trulux> it will take just a little while
<herve> StoneTable, then please update MOTUTodo, thanks :-)
* herve asks for an injection of caffeine!
<StoneTable> oops, missed that one :)  I think I updated UniversePriorityList and forgot that one
* dholbach is preparing some black tea
<dholbach> StoneTable, herve: might have been the wiki fuckup
<herve> dholbach, could you prepare for two, please? :-)
<dholbach> herve: of course :-)
<herve> without water for me
<dholbach> hahaha
<StoneTable> updated :)
<herve> just swallowing the leaves :)-
<herve> StoneTable, thanks!
<StoneTable> np :)
<StoneTable> Mmmm.. tea. I just finished 64oz of tea.
<herve> StoneTable, keep the credit you deserve, move them to the "Done" section
<herve> haaa... metric system... :-p
<StoneTable> oh, okay :)  I'll learn one of these days ;)
* herve will eat toblerone as a revenge! muhahaha!
<herve> siretart, re, please check if you still have packages to be reviewed&uploaded
<siretart> herve: no, lxdoom seems to be the last one
<siretart> herve: I'm double checking it
<siretart> hm. I have a swt-motif source package here, but it seems it did not make it into the archive? (not a very important package though)
<herve> motif? sure not :-p
<siretart> ;)
<StoneTable> I do need to confirm that libapache2-mod-ldap-user got synced.  I put it on the list but I haven't talk to elmo yet
<dholbach> ha... somebody just removed UniverseXorgBuildProblems ? :-)
<dholbach> StoneTable: got synced
<herve> StoneTable, ...
<herve> dholbach, no idea who!
<dholbach> StoneTable: http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/byDate/today.html always knows
<StoneTable> dholbach:  okay, cool
<herve> argh!
<dholbach> herve: whats up?
<herve> you beat me!
<StoneTable> thanks :)
<herve> I didn't even have time to check the changes list
<dholbach> i let elmo sync them today
<herve> I'll check those bugzilla bugs meanwhile
<jbailey> ajmitch, ajmitch_: You awake yet? =)
<bddebian> heh
<herve> I have an easy one for people knowing pbuilder and have a more efficient machine than mine
<herve> hi jbailey !
<dholbach> hey sivang!
<herve> hi sivang
<jbailey> Heya herv!
<herve> ogra, ping
<herve> no, I won't review ogra's packages :-)
<ogra> herve, you wouldnt like them i guess ;)
<herve> well, in a way, I reviewed your xml :-)
<herve> ogra, just... you uploaded a new version of graveman, do you think it would have solved https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=8369 ?
<ogra> herve, i synced it from sid...
<herve> trulux, you're still with us? :-)
<trulux> herve: of course
<trulux> going to uplaod the pkgs
<herve> ogra, argh, you don't know graveman by adam nor eve...
<herve> I'll launch a pbuild of fwbuilder meanwhile
<herve> [correction]  read: I'll create a pbuilder, which will take ages... gniiiii!
<ogra> herve, i can look at it, but currently i'm doing stuff for main rather...
<herve> ogra, forget about it
<ajmitch> jbailey: just crawled out of bed :)
<herve> I don't think we can make wonders with netapplet in the following hours...
<bddebian> ajmitch: Lazy bum. ;-)
<ajmitch> it's only just after 8am :P
<herve> hey! sarge is close to below 100 rc bugs! best wishes to them
<ajmitch> herve: sarge is releasing soon, you know..
<herve> ho yes
<herve> I was yelled by customers still wanting stable on their servers, but I put sarge
<herve> I bet with them sarge will be release before the project is over
<Treenaks> ajmitch: yeah.. they've been saying that since september 2004
<Treenaks> ajmitch: uh.. 2003
<dholbach> i'll take care of malone 323
<ajmitch> Treenaks: sure, but they really really mean it this time  ;)
<herve> dholbach, url?
<herve> ajmitch, don't reply to gratuitous provocation :-)
<dholbach> ree
<dholbach> oops
<dholbach> 322
<dholbach> https://launchpad.ubuntu.com/malone/tasks/323/+edit
<dholbach> trivial change
<herve> dholbach president!
<herve> I'm just having to do the same fix to another package!
<herve> solfege, namely
<jbailey> ajmitch: Sorry, lagging from phone.
<herve> someone could fetch latest fwbuilder from debian and pbuild it?
<herve> someone with a *real* net connection and a *real* cpu I mean :-)
<ajmitch> ok :)
<bddebian> ajmitch: I have Ubuntu on your laptop now. :-)
<ajmitch> bddebian: heh ok
<herve> what the... mess have they done with links on malone??
<herve> hi GheRivero
<herve> am I supposed to reply to universe bugs in bugzilla?
<dholbach> i hope we will have them all chucked out/solved soon
<herve> one is on its way
<herve> hu... good one, you manage not to answer my question :-)
<trulux> herve: just finished the packages, wait until pearls rsyncs
<herve> great, I'm close to be done with solfese
<herve> solfege...
<GheRivero> hi! how can i suggest the inclusion of one package on motu? (or to take care of it?)
<dholbach> GheRivero: was that package already made?
<herve> dholbach, said differently, I don't have to add "Closes: #7913" in my changelog?
<dholbach> herve: it is nice to do that
<GheRivero> libnfsidmap - An nfs idmapping library, it's on Debian an i need it for NFSv4 for Ubuntu
<dholbach> GheRivero: does it exist already?
<GheRivero> in debian yes, both testing an unstable
<herve> strange it's not there then
<GheRivero> that's why i'm asking
<herve> GheRivero, you're sure about the name?
<herve> ha ok
<herve> looking into source packages is more efficient :-)
<herve> dholbach, it's a rather important package
<GheRivero> not so important at the moment
<GheRivero> since no nfsv4 support is included on hoary
<herve> I mean, it's of prioty standard for debian
<herve> ha ok
<GheRivero> that's way yes
<herve> GheRivero, you could (p)build it for hoary?
<dholbach> herve: what do you want me to do?
<jbailey> ajmitch: Sorry 'bout that.  I'm hacking together bits for breezy glibc.  Got anything you want out of the gate for selinux?
<herve> dholbach, I was about to say #u-d would know, but GheRivero told me ubuntu has no nfsv4 support
<bddebian> jbailey: Can you add sysv shm and sem for Hurd for me?? ;-)
<GheRivero> herve, give a minute...
<dholbach> ok, so i dont have to do anything?
<jbailey> bddebian: What?
<herve> GheRivero, but er... is nfs4 in hoary, anyway? :-)
<GheRivero> herve, there is no nfsv4 support but i'm working on it for hoary+1
<jbailey> herve: I think the kernel has the NFS4 bits, but I don't know how it gets the auth information.
<GheRivero> the kernel has all the stuff needed
<jbailey> herve: Since we've standardised on MIT krb5, it ought to be possible to make it happen.
<GheRivero> but not acl, nfs-utils & linux-utils
<jbailey> Ah, hm...
<herve> thanks all
<herve> GheRivero, my opinion is that it's too late for hoary :-p
<GheRivero> yes i now...
<jbailey> Right, I mean make it happen at all when I say 'make it happen' above. =)
<GheRivero> but i would like to start to work for hoary +1 as soon as possible...
<herve> GheRivero, you're welcome but it's not opened yet
<herve> anyway, why do I give my opinion on things that big...
<dholbach> HA, hula runs! ;-)
<GheRivero> herve, it pbuilds on hoary
<herve> good ping
<herve> ???
<herve> point...
<herve> I go get my pillow :-)
<herve> dholbach, or another reviewer/uploader, I have a... fun one for you :-)
<trulux> herve: finished: http://pearls.tuxedo-es.org/libssp/debian/
<trulux> enjoy ;)
<trulux> I will announce the tomorrow
<trulux> now I need to sleep
<herve> er...
<herve> me too
<herve> that's the point ;-)
<trulux> too much kernel hscking today
<trulux> good night to all
<trulux> and sweet dreams
<trulux> :D
<herve> night!
<herve> pbuild failed... yoohoo!
<dholbach> herve: fire away
<herve> I say good night too
<dholbach> erm
<herve> dholbach, http://deb.oursours.net/motu/pending (solfege)
<dholbach> herve: alright
<dholbach> will do
<herve> I let you enjoy the debdiff :-)
<dholbach> herve: thanks for your work and good night
<dholbach> :-)
<dholbach> could somebody please join me in reviewing hula-server?
<crimsun> sure, I'm finishing up tritium's repo
<dholbach> alright
<dholbach> herve's solfege uploaded
<Phython> I was pinged, any one around who did it?
<dholbach> herve has just left the building
<dholbach> erm... :-)
<dholbach> i guess he was about to ask you about your packages and inclusion for the release
<dholbach> but i can't tell
<ajmitch> jbailey: I'm not aware of glibc changes that need to be made
<dholbach> bradb: i can't mark a bug as "fixed" nor assign it to motu
<bradb> dholbach: if by "can't" you mean that an exception is raised, that bug should be fixed on Monday when stub rolls out a new version into production.
<bradb> dholbach: what's the bug URL?
<dholbach> bradb: https://launchpad.ubuntu.com/malone/tasks/323/+edit
<dholbach> bradb: and the fonts could be a bit smaller ;-)
<dholbach> but i won't complain :-)
<bradb> dholbach: there was a massive UI makeover recently which i had this much -><- to do with :)
<dholbach> ok, i see :-)
<dholbach> you're serving as proxy and get the stick for others - hmmm, doesnt seem to be fair :-)
<bradb> dholbach: and yes, i expect that bugs that have no maintainers (e.g. the maintainer list is empty in the "related people" portlet) will raise an exception trying to edit them. :/ i committed the fix already, but there's generally a lag of a few days before fixes hit production. stub said he'll do a prod rollout again after the weekend (i.e. on Monday)
<dholbach> bradb: ok, after release we'll be able to test it more thoroughly
<bradb> dholbach: /maybe/ i can swing around a prod rollout tonight, but i can't make any promises on that, to say the least
<bradb> i'll put my stub mind-control techniques to the test, if i see him around before i call it a day
<dholbach> alright... don't worry - i'll really enjoy malone, but not until the release is done :-)
<bradb> hehe, i understand, no worries :)
<dholbach> ok :-)
<dholbach> siretart: was everything alright with lxdoom? was it uploaded?
<tseng> who wants to hear a crazy story?
<dholbach> tseng: fire away
<tseng> so at work we have a huge network
<tseng> and sites in a bunch of states in the us
<tseng> at each site, on each network segment we have a linux box
<siretart> dholbach: lxdoom is still waiting for beeing uploaded, if cro
<tseng> with ethereal, for sniffing traffic (debugging)
<siretart> if crimsun didn't upload it before
<tseng> when we run the one in arizona over ssh -X
<crimsun> siretart: nope, I thought you had upload prvis
<tseng> its slow as hell in windows
<crimsun> privs^
<tseng> and on my bosses fedora box
<siretart> dholbach: I fixed the ftbfs on amd64, this was the crazy ld segfaulting
<tseng> on my ubuntu box in vmware, its fast
<tseng> its also fast on my vmware fedora
<tseng> slow on our gentoo box
<siretart> crimsun: oh, sorry for the misunderstanding, I don't have upload privileges.
<dholbach> :-)))))))
<tseng> weirdest!
<dholbach> siretart: will look - so it's ready? just upload?
<siretart> dholbach: http://siretart.tauware.de/ubuntu-packages/lxdoom/ ready for review/upload :)
<jbailey> Anyone here have a fedora core 4 system handy?
<dholbach> siretart: testbuilding
<siretart> :) - the buildlogs from the testbuild look very scary
<dholbach> builds here
<dholbach> uploading
<siretart> w00t. katie send me email :)
<dholbach> :-)))
<dholbach> just looking over UniversePriorityList
<dholbach> http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/e/echoping/5.2.0-2/ - (on powerpc) should be tackled by a dpatch with "automake --force --add-missing"-run
<dholbach> http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/Test/l/luxman <- should be easy to fix as well - replacing "xargs -0" with "xargs -r0" somewhere in debian/ should fix it (i386 only)
<dholbach> hey Burgundavia
<Burgundavia> salut
<dholbach> i take care of rafkill
<virgiln> If I want to *convert* a debian package to ubuntu, what do I need to do to it?
<virgiln> is it best to totally recompile it, etc... or can I mess with the debian package?
<dholbach> and pspresent
<dholbach> virgiln: recompiling with pbuilder (wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto) should make it easy and show potential pitfalls
<dholbach> i take care of pspresent
<virgiln> dholbach: ok, thanks
<herzi> re
<dholbach> hey herzi
<herzi> dholbach: fixing the last issue now
<dholbach> ROCK!
<herzi> and ther version number (0.1.0) is the one from configure.in
<dholbach> it already ran at my placve
<dholbach> place
<dholbach> should be the one they next release with
<dholbach> maybe ask on #hula
<herzi> the next (==first) one will be 1.0
#ubuntu-motu 2006-04-10
<sivang> raphink: can anyone toss me the link to the "the" debina shared library packaging howto? (I know there is one
<sivang>                 repeatedly referenced doc)
<raphink> hmmm
<raphink> I don't know this link sorry
<sivang> raphink: okay, thansk anyways :)
<Jobman> sivang, maybe this one http://www.netfort.gr.jp/~dancer/column/libpkg-guide/libpkg-guide.html
<ajmitch> hi
<LaserJock> hi ajmitch
<TheMuso> Hey MOTUs.
<TheMuso> I know I asked some 8 odd hours ago, but if any MOTUs would mind reviewing Malone bug #38028, that would be great. This package is to be promoted to main, and we (The accessibility team) would like to get this bug fixed before it gets promoted. Thanks in advance.
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 38028 in xcursor-themes "Latest source release of xcursor-themes FTBFS" [Normal,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/38028
<ogra> TheMuso, if you dont find someone in the MOTU crew until tomorrow, feel free to assign it to me ...
<TheMuso> ogra: Thanks.
<ogra> (its quite trivial)
<TheMuso> ogra: Yeah I know. I have attached a fix.
<ogra> exactly :)
<ogra> a great bug for a MOTU wannabee :)
<TheMuso> I dunno about a great bug, but yeah.
<TheMuso> Considering that seb128 made the last real change to it.
* TheMuso goes off and tries to find other bugs to squash.
<ogra> if you want to become a MOTU you need to prove some packaging work to the TB, its one where a wannabee can trivially easy get a checkmark for one more package ;)
<TheMuso> ogra: Yeah I know. Thats my goal.
<ogra> :)
<wasabi_> Wish I could get some more discussion about ThirdPartyApt going.
<wasabi_> Seems like nobody on u-d is really interested.
<ogra> its unlikely that it can be considered for dapper, so you have plenty of time
<bddebian> Heya folks
<TheMuso> Hey bddebian.
<ajmitch> ah, bddebian is here
* ajmitch reassigns the rest of his bugs to bddebian 
<bddebian> Heh, yeah right :-)
<bddebian> Heya TheMuso, ajmitch
<bddebian> crimsun: You up?
<TheMuso> Hey LaserJock.
<nictuku> hi all
<bddebian> Hello nictuku
<LaserJock> hi TheMuso
* ajmitch waves
<bddebian> Heya LaserJock, ajmitch
<LaserJock> hmmm, mysql is stumping me :(
<Se7h> LaserJock SQLite
<LaserJock> well, this is on OSX (I'm trying to set up a wiki)
<ajmitch> LaserJock: in what way?
<ajmitch> ah, OSX
* ajmitch can't help you there
<LaserJock> php and apache were a breeze as they are already included in OSX
<LaserJock> but I'm having issues setting up mysql. I try to make it secure and then I can't access it (so I guess it is secure) :(
<Se7h> LOL
<Se7h> sure is
<LaserJock> I have to remove it and reboot :/
<Se7h> try SQLite
<Se7h> well, for a wiki might not be the best choice..
<bddebian> Shouldn't XCONFIGDIR be /etc/X11/config ?
<Se7h> wb
<LaserJock> hmm, I think I'm starting to wrap my brain around this
<bddebian> LaserJock: Then you are doing better than me with imake/xmkmf :-(
<LaserJock> yikes I had to do a little of that for tightvnc
<LaserJock> crimsun gave me the proper things to put in debian/rules but I'm still not sure what I was doing. But it built so ...
<bddebian> Well I know what I need to fix (I think) but now dpkg-buildpackage fails
<bddebian> I think it's failing on MakeCPU()?
<ajmitch> bddebian: so you're back from wandering in the desert now? :)
<bddebian> I dunno, I seem to struggle with such simple freakin' things :-(
* ajmitch could never call the X black magic 'simple'
<zakame> hi all
<bddebian> Heya zakame :-)
<ajmitch> hello zakame
<LaserJock> muahahah,  I've got a wiki!
<zakame> hello bddebian ajmitch LaserJock :D
<zakame> hmmm malone 38009
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 38009 in resolvconf "Breezy -> Dapper transition needs proper /etc/resolvconf/run handling" [Normal,Needs info]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/38009
<Se7h> LaserJock \o/
<zakame> hey minghua
<LaserJock> doh, and only at the bottom of the page do they tell you about http://www.mamp.info/
<minghua> hi zakame and LaserJock
<LaserJock> hi minghua
<minghua> LaserJock: sorry for messing with squeak without discussing with you
<LaserJock> well, you are a MOTU you can do whatever you want ;-)
<minghua> LaserJock: I thought just touching a .desktop file won't matter much
<LaserJock> no, but I was doing a big overhaul, I'm glad you did it though
<minghua> yeah, but since I don't know anything about squeak...  anyway I didn't do much harm
<LaserJock> no harm at all
<LaserJock> I hadn't thought to look at the .desktop and in the end it was fairly important
<LaserJock> +1 from me ;-)
<LaserJock> jeeze, keybuk be feeling in need of karma. Maybe he say seb128's ;-)
<LaserJock> s/be/must be/
<LaserJock> s/say/saw/
<LaserJock> my spelling sucks tonight
<zakame> awww
<bddebian> aaaaarrrrggghhh
<zakame> wha?
<bddebian> This ivtools imake/xmkmf crap is kicking my butt :-(
<carthik> Hi I installed streamtuner, on Dapper, and it doesn't show up on the applications menu. Is this a bug? Also, it need xmms (is it a preset in the preferences) and yet it doesn't list xmms as a required package.
<LaserJock> oh my goodnes, MAMP rocks hard!
<Se7h> banned from ubuntu
<Se7h> lmao
<LaserJock> you are?
<Se7h> * Cannot join #ubuntu (You are banned).
<Se7h> i am
<tritium> Se7h: for what?
<ajmitch> probably the tor ban
<Se7h> aparently for clones or spam
<Se7h> lol
<tritium> no, ajmitch is right
<Se7h> yes
<Se7h> tor is on
<tritium> That's it
<Se7h> i didnt read ajmitch
<Se7h> why be banned for it?
<ajmitch> because too many people abuse it
<Se7h> well, ok
<carthik> Correction, the streamtuner package includes a .desktop file in /usr/share/applications - but when I installed it, I got nothing
<bddebian> Heya tritium!
<tritium> Hi bddebian :)
<ajmitch> sigh, looks like keybuk really went all out on closing bugs that were 'fix committed' - whether they should be closed or not
<bddebian> Fix Committed doesn't close them?
<bddebian> carthik: Can you post the contents of gstreamer.desktop to pastebin?
<ajmitch> bddebian: no, fix committed does *not* close them fully
<ajmitch> fix released does
<bddebian> Oh, hmm
<carthik> bddebian, it wasn't gstreamer, it was streamtuner. I forced a apt-get install --reinstall and now, suddenly the .desktop file is in /usr/share/applications/ while it wasn't the case earlier.
<bddebian> carthik: Ah, OK
<bddebian> Now it shows up?
<carthik> bddebian, yes it does
<bddebian> Great
<ajmitch> looks like that package hasn't been touched since breezy, either
<bddebian> carthik: ?
<bddebian> Err ajmitch ?
<ajmitch> bddebian: yes?
<bddebian> ajmitch: What package?
<ajmitch> streamtuner
<bddebian> ahh
<carthik> maybe if one of you could try installing it and seeing if it shows up or not - besides it is a wonderful app.
<bddebian> What, streamtuner?
<bddebian> streamtuner has no .desktop file in the source package
<carthik> bddebian?? but it does : http://packages.ubuntu.com/cgi-bin/search_contents.pl?searchmode=filelist&word=streamtuner&version=dapper&arch=i386
<LaserJock> I did a dpkg -c on streamtuner_0.99.99-5ubuntu4_i386.deb and it showed a .desktop
<ajmitch> bddebian: what you smokin?
<ajmitch> it's in data/streamtuner.desktop
<Toadstool> hi everybody
<ajmitch> hi
<carthik> bddebian, maybe you had the same issue I had where the .desktop doesn't get installed for some strange reason.
<bddebian> Heya Toadstool
<bddebian> I'm looking at the source package
<Toadstool> hi ajmitch and bddebian
<ajmitch> bddebian: want some glasses? :)
<bddebian> Oh, it's desktop.in.. Duh
<bddebian> Sometimes I hate find :)
<bddebian> ajmitch: See why I shouldn't be here :-)
<LaserJock> lol, at least you make some of us feel better ;-)
* ajmitch shouldn't be here
<Toadstool> cool, yesterday i spent about 2 hours to make a package build on amd64 when in fact there's a design flaw which prevents it to work as expected on 64bit archs... :/
<LaserJock> Toadstool: which package?
<Toadstool> supercollider
<LaserJock> lol
<bddebian> LaserJock: Gee thanks man
<Toadstool> yeah lol ;)
* Toadstool is a moron
<LaserJock> I should have put a note on that. I figured that out last month
<LaserJock> you are the 2 person after me
<LaserJock> to look at it
<Toadstool> haha
<LaserJock> bddebian: seriously, it makes me not feel so inept when I see other people struggle sometimes too :-)
<bddebian> LaserJock: Well I'm glad I'm of some use :-)
<bddebian> crimsun: That really you or just a re-connect?
<ajmitch> bddebian: aside from stealing bugs that we're working on? ;)
<bddebian> What bug did I steal?
<ajmitch> heh
<ajmitch> hardly a steal
<crimsun> bddebian: really me.
<ajmitch> more like one that I was thinking of doing, if I ever got around to it ;)
<ajmitch> hello crimsun
<LaserJock> bddebian: just think, I were gone for quite a while and you still have more karma than me :-)
* bddebian crawls back under his rock
<crimsun> lo ajmitch, LaserJock, bddebian
<ajmitch> LaserJock: he has more karma than anyone
<LaserJock> s/I/you/
<bddebian> crimsun: Heya.  Did you look anymore at ivtools.  I seem to have really jacked mine up :-(
<bddebian> ajmitch: I've only got like 5K
<LaserJock> yeah, but that is because he is on like practically every LP team there is ;-)
<ajmitch> LaserJock: there's no way we can keep up anyway
<ajmitch> time for me to retire :)
<bddebian> I am?
<bddebian> Gnight ajmitch
<bddebian> I'm not even a member according to LP
<ajmitch> huh? gnight??
<bddebian> Oh, by retire I thought you meant going to bed :)
<crimsun> bddebian: not yet, just left work
<ajmitch> bddebian: nah
<ajmitch> bddebian: I mean do something else
<bddebian> Ah
* ajmitch had better go off & instruct the ignorant masses in the ways of linux at uni
<bddebian> Heh
<ajmitch> at least I get paid for it :)
<ajmitch> bbl
<bddebian> Later ajmitch
<nictuku> bddebian, hi, do you remember when I mentioned I needed someone to test nwu?
<nictuku> if you or anyone around care to see if it's working fine.. please follow https://dev.ubuntubrasil.org/trac/nwu/wiki/DownloadNwu
<nictuku> if there are no show stoppers I'll call for testers in the server list
<bddebian> crimsun: OK, got it to build this time but now I forgot what I was looking for?? :-)
<bddebian> nictuku: I probably can't get to it tonight but I'll see if I can check it out
<nictuku> thanks
<nictuku> please report your results to yves@cetico.org
<nictuku> well good night all
<bddebian> Gnight nictuku
<bddebian> Damnit, XCONFIGDIR has GOT to be wrong
<ajmitch> well, large lab today, a whole 8 students
<bddebian> heh
<LaserJock> what class?
<ajmitch> network management
<ajmitch> a fancy title for setting up stuff on linux, eg dns, dhcp, apache :)
<Toadstool> somehow my daily job as a students' network admin, dealing with old, badly written servers configs and trying to make the whole thing work... :/
<ajmitch> heh
<Se7h> ignorant question
<Se7h> where can i check for RFP and ITP ?
<Toadstool> Se7h: http://www.debian.org/devel/wnpp/
<Se7h> ty
<Toadstool> ;)
<bddebian> Oh well, gnight folks
<phanatic> hi people
<lucas> hi
<wasabi__> So... I've got this spec on launchpad, and it's sort of something which, if implemented successfully, would require fairly good "support" from ubuntu. Is it suitable for proposing on teh technicalboardagenda, or should I wait awhile and try to drum up discussion or something?
<zakame> huhu
<Toadstool> heya zakame
<phanatic> hey zakame :)
<chillywilly> lalalala
<zakame> hello Toadstool
<zakame> hi phanatic
<zakame> malone 3442 : this would be a candidate for UVF/FF exception, no?
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 3442 in praat "hangs on startup" [Major,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/3442
<ajmitch> crap, xephyr is segfault-happy on amd64
<ajmitch> I wonder if there's a newer upstream version..
<Yagisan> G'day all
<ajmitch> good evening Yagisan
<ajmitch> how's it going?
<Yagisan> ajmitch: still restoring my box. need to get japanese input working again now, then rebuild my pbuilder setups. Noticed you are on TeamUbuntu @ FAH
<ajmitch> yeah
<ajmitch> recently joined
<ajmitch> I don't think I've passed you yet, have I? :)
<Yagisan> ajmitch: not yet, but I lost 4 days + the works units I was crunching, so I'm about to take a big dip
* ajmitch is in the top 10 of points in last 7 days for the team
<ajmitch> since I've got 2 cores here & 1 laptop going
<Yagisan> ajmitch: I just have my firewall (k7) and ltsp server (amd64) crunching.
<Yagisan> ajmitch: everything else was just too slow
<ajmitch> yeah
<ajmitch> slowest core I have running is 2GHz
<Yagisan> ajmitch: that's my fastest!
<ajmitch> I haven't revived my old athlon xp box yet
<ajmitch> my amd64 is dual-core 2.2GHz
<Yagisan> nice
<ajmitch> yeah
<ajmitch> building packages is nice & fast
<Yagisan> I wish I had the cash for a dual core box
<ajmitch> especially with the RAID 0 seutp
<ajmitch> setup
<Yagisan> how many disks ?
<ajmitch> 3
<ajmitch> just cheap 250GB 7200RPM SATA disks
<Yagisan> ajmitch: bench ?
<ajmitch> bonnie++ reports write speeds of ~100MB/sec
<ajmitch> for block I/O
<ajmitch> read speeds were similar, iirc
<Yagisan> ajmitch: about the same as mine then, but I have 1 pata, 2 sata
<ajmitch> right
<Yagisan> 8mb cache ?
<ajmitch> yeah
* ajmitch actually has 5 drives in here
<Yagisan> yep. sweet
<ajmitch> but the other 2 are 120 & 160GB PATA drives from my old box
<Yagisan> I have the space (and power supply), but sadly not the funds (yet)
<ajmitch> yeah
<Yagisan> but I'll need a 2.6.16 kernel for my last PATA interface
<ajmitch> the month over in brisbane funded this
<ajmitch> why do you need that?
<Yagisan> because I dodn't see drivers for it in .15
<ajmitch> odd
* ajmitch has a promise ATA133 controller sitting around here somewhere
<Yagisan> ajmitch: some ite chip, that works as either normal pata or fake raid
<ajmitch> ok
* ajmitch has nvidia chipset on motherboard - wouldn't trust it to do fakeraid
* Yagisan doesn't trust any fake raid
<ajmitch> software raid is more flexible
<ajmitch> so what happened to your box that you had to restore it?
<Yagisan> ajmitch: I upgraded to dapper
<ajmitch> that's usually not a problem :)
<Yagisan> ajmitch: and gconf2 didn't like it
<ajmitch> strange
* ajmitch hasn't had any bad upgrade yet
<Yagisan> it hung on install
<ajmitch> you filed bugs on it?
<Yagisan> and left the system unable to upgrade or downgrade
<ajmitch> so that dholbach can jump for joy at the sight of more bugs?
<Yagisan> ajmitch: ah no. I've had working net access for about a day now
<ajmitch> ok
<ajmitch> for this box I ended up doing a fresh install from the flight 5 disk
<Yagisan> ajmitch: your logs probally have me moaning about it on Saturday
<ajmitch> since I felt like starting afresh for the first time since pre-woody
<Yagisan> I did a fresh install from flight 6
<ajmitch> I thought I might as well have an amd64 install
<Yagisan> seem ok, but I seem to have forgotton how to turn on scim
<ajmitch> bug minghua
<Yagisan> ajmitch: so, how do you like 64bit ?
<ajmitch> it lets me use all my RAM
<ajmitch> apart from that there's little visible difference
<Yagisan> ajmitch: sure there is. no crappy flash ads :)
<ajmitch> haha yeah
<ajmitch> and I come across fun amd64 bugs
<ajmitch> still a few universe packages that just don't build or work cleanly
<Yagisan> ajmitch: yeah, I know. usually segfault on start
<ajmitch> looks like hobbsee had a hard day
<Hobbsee|BrainDea> ajmitch: i had a rotten maths assignment
<ajmitch> oh?
* Hobbsee thinks she broke more rules than she followed in this thing
<Hobbsee> and now i'm being asked questions, and i dont remember the answers lol
<ajmitch> ouch
<ajmitch> doesn't sound good :)
<Hobbsee> hehe yeah
<Hobbsee> like "where's seamonkey?"
* Mongoose is away: /_\ zzZzZZZZzz
<TheMuso> ok so thats why silc-toolkit has not gone through.
<ajmitch> yes
<TheMuso> ajmitch: I'll look at it. SOmehow thats my screw-up.
<ajmitch> because the upload is broken :)
<TheMuso> how?
<ajmitch> that's what I'm looking at
* ajmitch hopes it's a quick build
* TheMuso re-checks with manual build as well as pbuilder.
<TheMuso> I somehow think this goes beyond my fix however.
<ajmitch> yes
<ajmitch> there are some other serious issues with this one
<ajmitch> cp -R ./tutorial /usr
<ajmitch> cp: cannot create directory `/usr/tutorial': Permission denied
<ajmitch> bad bad thing
<ajmitch> 3 RC bugs in debian
<ajmitch> ok, package built
<TheMuso> Funny how you think it is a quick fix, and you don't bother to look elsewhere. :)
<ajmitch> 2 of the RC bugs being that the packages are empty ;)
<TheMuso> Ah right.
<ajmitch> I'd hope that the package was checked after build, before being uploaded
<TheMuso> In debian you mean?
<TheMuso> or ubuntu?
<Yagisan> hmm, wasn't there a patch for pbuilder to use unionfs around here somewhere
<ajmitch> TheMuso: in both
<TheMuso> yeah true that.
<Gloubiboulga> on the MOTU ML Yagisan
<TheMuso> We live and learn. :)
<ajmitch> especially in ubuntu, since that's what we're trying to fix
* ajmitch will lart bddebian about it later
<TheMuso> I don't mind saying I screwed up.
* TheMuso still assumes too much about packages he fixes.
<TheMuso> Hopefully that will change over time.
<Yagisan> Gloubiboulga: thanks. Haven't finished restoring that yet.
<ajmitch> ok, will try & rebuild this again :)
<ajmitch> at least this box is fast at building now :)
<Gloubiboulga> Yagisan, https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-motu/2006-March/000583.html :)
* TheMuso should really build this on his p4.
<TheMuso> BUt cbf.
* ajmitch waits
<ajmitch> I should NMU it in debian or something
<Yagisan> Gloubiboulga: thank you
<ajmitch> ok, built again
* ajmitch checks the binaries
<ajmitch> ok, they are there, wonderful
<TheMuso> ajmitch: WHat needed changing?
<ajmitch> renaming the .install files
<TheMuso> ah right.
<ajmitch> a proper fix will be to change control.sh as well to rename them on SONAME change
<TheMuso> Right.
<ajmitch> TheMuso: btw your fix could have been done juust by syncing the last debian package across
<ajmitch> http://packages.qa.debian.org/s/silc-toolkit/news/20060206T220503Z.html
<TheMuso> ajmitch: I wasn't sure where we stood on syncs from debian at this stage.
<ajmitch> it's not a new upstream version
<TheMuso> Right.
<Gloubiboulga> On which package should I file a bug about a keyboard issue?
<Gloubiboulga> I can't use shift keys with the be layout
<Hobbsee> oh my goodness...hehe
<ajmitch> heh
<ajmitch> multi-hobbsee
<Hobbsee> hehe
* Hobbsee goes off to ghost
<ajmitch> leaving us already?
<Hobbsee> anymore of them?
<Hobbsee> not that i know of, but we've been having trouble, and i'm wrestling with the phone
<ajmitch> we can't handle too many
<Hobbsee> hehe
* TheMuso isn't sure whether he is experiencing double vision or not.
<JohnnyMast> 1 day to wait ...
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: more tripple vision..
<TheMuso> heh
<ajmitch> Hobbsee just can't bear to be away from us :)
<Hobbsee> hehe
* Hobbsee looks for any more hobbsees, or creamier_oaks...
<Hobbsee> no, i think i got them all...
<Hobbsee> that was rather impressive though hehe - getting *that* many ghosts!
<zakame> hi all
<JohnnyMast> hi man :)
<zakame> heya JohnnyMast ! long time no see
<JohnnyMast> i wass here all the time :)
<JohnnyMast> but bussy heh
<JohnnyMast> how r u doing man ?
<ajmitch> scary, an accelerometer patch for f-spot - tile your laptop & rotate your photos :)
<zakame> here grabbing flight 6 while busiying myself with malone
<ajmitch> s/tile/tilt
<Hobbsee> hey zakame - from 1 hobbsee, instead of 3!
<zakame> Hobbsee: LOL
<JohnnyMast> flight 6 is the release version ?
<JohnnyMast> or not
<Gloubiboulga> hey zakame
<zakame> hello Gloubiboulga
<JohnnyMast> i still run flight 1 with a huge dist-upgrade :)
<Gloubiboulga> zakame, I've uploaded a new libtranslate package on REVU, could you have a look at it when you got time?
<zakame> JohnnyMast: just released last friday
<zakame> Gloubiboulga: yeah just saw it
<JohnnyMast> ave@ubuntu:~$ cat /etc/issue
<JohnnyMast> Ubuntu 6.06 "Dapper Drake" Development Branch \n \l
<JohnnyMast> rave@ubuntu:~$
<JohnnyMast> zakame yeah but will be it tomorrows version ?
<ajmitch> JohnnyMast: yes, dapper is still in development
<ajmitch> flight 6 is one of a set of prereleases
<JohnnyMast> yeah but it will be out tomorrow right
<zakame> ajmitch: are we looking forward to a flight 7, or dapper preview?
<ajmitch> ?
<JohnnyMast> release of dapper
<ajmitch> JohnnyMast: no
<TheMuso> JohnnyMast: Dapper has been delayed.
<ajmitch> even if dapper had not been delayed, the release date was april 20
<JohnnyMast> why motu was going so well on dapper
<ajmitch> now it's june 1st
<JohnnyMast> make it 16th of june :)
<JohnnyMast> my birthday
<ajmitch> zakame: not sure if another flight release will be there before beta release
<ajmitch> unlikely, with beta release in 2 weeks
<zakame> ajmitch: ooh!
<ajmitch> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DapperReleaseSchedule
<JohnnyMast> zakme can you link ne to the flight folder
<zakame> w.u.c/DapperFlight6
<JohnnyMast> ajmitch what will the release name after dapper
<ajmitch> I don't know
<TheMuso> JohnnyMast: I don't think anybody knows yet.
<Hobbsee> when does it get announced?
<ajmitch> when they feel like it
<Hobbsee> right
<zakame> hmm malone 38009 , where art thou?  I thought you thou hast fixed thyself?
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 38009 in resolvconf "Breezy -> Dapper transition needs proper /etc/resolvconf/run handling" [Normal,Needs info]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/38009
<zakame> Gloubiboulga: the Conflicts is still there
<zakame> there's also a control.save
<Gloubiboulga> yep, I forgot to remove the conflict line...
<Gloubiboulga> and the control.save too
<zakame> ok
<Gloubiboulga> my previous package was really horrible :p
<zakame> hehe I think we all go through that phase ;)
<Gloubiboulga> zakame, if you don't see other issues i can upload a cleaned package on REVU
<zakame> Gloubiboulga: nothing other than those two atm :)
<Gloubiboulga> ok
<Gloubiboulga> hmm.. I can remove dpatch from B-D too, I use simple-patchsys now
<zakame> rock
<Gloubiboulga> zakame, libtra,slate is reuploaded, waiting for the cron job
<zakame> ok
<zakame> bah, I'm an idiotwith malone 33362
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 33362 in resolvconf "Runtime directory does not exist during /etc/rcS1.d/08loopback setup" [Normal,Fix released]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/33362
<zakame> postinst creates the /var/run, only to be destroyed upon reboot :/
<zakame> s#/var/run#/var/run/resolvconf#
<ajmitch> therefore the initscript must create it iff it doesn't exist
<Toadstool> yep, another /var/run-is-on-a-tmpfs issue ;)
* TheMuso wonders how many more of those there may be in universe.
<ajmitch> lots
<Toadstool> we should ask the launchpad team to add an advanced search for that kind of bugs :D
<Toadstool> +option
<zakame> ajmitch: exactly
<zakame> Gloubiboulga: justbuilt, looks nice
<Gloubiboulga> thanks zakame
<zakame> shall I upload, or will other revu-wers concur? =)
<Gloubiboulga> I don't know, it's a bug fix :)
<Gloubiboulga> but the package is almost new with all the changes
<zakame> I'll be back later :) I'll prolly upload then
<Gloubiboulga> ls
<Gloubiboulga> arg, wrong window
<dradul> HI, I just installed esmtp-run and noticed that it is linked with openssl 0.9.7 instead of 0.9.8 as used in dapper. Although the source package is registered in Malone, there is no bug tracker! Where do I report this (in my mind) bug?
<Gloubiboulga> dradul, https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/esmtp/+bugs might be what you're looking for
<dradul> Gloubiboulga, hmmm, couldn't find it...
<dradul> Well, that's done. ;-)
<dradul> OK. Now, I need someone to confirm bug #38163 ;-)
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 38163 in esmtp "Dapper binaries are linked agains old openssl libraries." [Normal,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/38163
<kelmo_lap> hi
<ajmitch> wb again :)
<Hobbsee> ty
<Hobbsee> there arent 3, this time.  again :)
<Hobbsee> ooh, new kernel
<at1as> Anyone got a clue about making POSTFIX and CYRUS use SASLAUTHD?
<viviersf> hmmmmf i just found a weird error in the smb tools :(
<viviersf> sigh
<zakame> evening MOTUs
<phanatic> hi people
<Gloubiboulga> hey phanatic
<phanatic> hi Gloubiboulga :)
<bddebian> Morning gang
<Yagisan> G'day bddebian
<bddebian> Heya Yagisan.  How goes the battle? :-)
<Yagisan> bddebian: restoring data now. need to rebuild my pbuilder setups, and convince dapper to print (es-gsp is broke), and get scim to work (either user error, or it doesn't work out of the box)
<phanatic> hey bddebian
<bddebian> Hello phanatic
<bddebian> Heya zakame
<zakame> hello bddebian!
<carthik> The streamtuner package has a couple of "plugins" that throw errors at startup and don't work. Is this a bug worth reporting?
<bddebian> carthik: All bugs are worth reporting IMO
<carthik> oh it's been reported. sorry to disturb you guys.
<bddebian> Don't let it happen again ;-P
<carthik> bddebian, i should have checked before asking here, not "While asking here" -- my bad!
<bddebian> No worries, I'm kidding :-)
<zakame> my bad
<carthik> bddebian, can I assign that bug to the motu team?
<bddebian> carthik: Yes, if streamtuner is in Universe, which I assume it is
<carthik> bddebian, assigned to "MOTU". Thanks.
<phanatic> hi zakame :)
<zakame> hello phanatic
* zakame slaps himself silly
<Yagisan> zakame: need help >:)
<Yagisan> ;)
<zakame> Yagisan: sure, I need to get better bandwidth
<Yagisan> zakame: your talking to the wrong guy. even kiwis like ajmitch have better bandwidth then what I get here
<zakame> Yagisan: awww
<dooglus_> what do the motu-uvf team do?
<jpatrick> manage UVF exceptions I guess
<Tonio_> hello all
<bddebian> Hello Tonio_
<siretart> dholbach: how do you submit a bug with 2 attachments in the first email?
<dholbach> actions in malone now get batched up for 5 minutes
<dholbach> and then a mail is sent
<ajmitch> morning
* ..[topic/#ubuntu-motu:dholbach] : Ubuntu Masters of the Universe: Ubuntu Universe Repository Maintainers | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Documentation | We are in feature freeze now. Focus on http://tinyurl.com/nl87h and http://wiki.ubuntu.com/DhIconCacheChanges
<dholbach> hey ajmitch
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<bddebian> ajmitch: Wanna help me? :-)
<ajmitch> bddebian: with what?
<bddebian> ivtools :-)
* ajmitch rebuilt all the packages depending on libssl0.9.7 last night, will check them today & upload those that succeeded
<ajmitch> bddebian: no
<bddebian> ajmitch: Thanks honey
<cbx33> evenin all....
<bddebian> Hello cbx33
<cbx33> hi bddebian
<ogra> cbx33, wants to become a MOTU ... please point him in the right directions :)
<cbx33> way to drop me in at the deep end ogra :p
* bddebian points at the buglist :-)
<dholbach> cbx33: nice to hear that
<dholbach> anything you're interested in?
<cbx33> well, I figure I keep arsing around with little projects here and there...I should pool all my resources together into one place
<cbx33> www.silentkeystroke.co.uk
<cbx33> I do a bit of everything
<bddebian> You sound like me :-)
<cbx33> but I'm looking to hone my skills in certain areas
<dholbach> if you'Re interested in make the world turn again, you're absolutely right here :)
<cbx33> well....I'm a committed guy
<cbx33> I work hard
<cbx33> no point in doing anything otherwise
<dholbach> we're in the final phase for this release cycle so we're mostly fixing things up at the moment
<cbx33> yeh i see that
<dholbach> the list in the topic lists all the open bugs for Universe and Multiverse
<cbx33> well....I can be a genral dogsbody too if that'll help
<cbx33> if you have jobs of that type
<dholbach> does somebody have that unmet-dep-list url somehwere?
<bddebian> I was wondering where/if there was one too
<cbx33> it's gonna be a steep learning curve but that never stopped me before....
<dholbach> apt-cache -i unmet     lists a bunch of packages that are not installable
<dholbach> those mostly require just a rebuild
<dholbach> but it's testing and ... :)
<cbx33> i had to start using linux because the job i went to they'd never used it...but their web server was runing it.....so i took the plunge and reformatted my works pc with linux
<dholbach> those are easy things to get started with
<cbx33> :p
<cbx33> excellent
<dholbach> and the bugs can be easy too
<dholbach> most of them lack information like "which version is breaking for you, how does it break, ..." - so that's worthwhile too
<cbx33> ok cool
<dholbach> if you look at the wiki - we link to a couple of pages which have information on tools, things to look at, etc :)
<dholbach> but just ask
<cbx33> ok excellent - I'll check it out now
<cbx33> thanks dholbach
<dholbach> rock'n'roll
* dholbach hugs cbx33
<dholbach> it's great to have you here
<cbx33> this is the first place I've asked if they need help that they've actually responded well
<cbx33> wow thanx dholbach :p
<dholbach> :-)
<cbx33> you're probably gonna be flooded with questions :p
<dholbach> hehe
<cbx33> nah...j/k I try and sort as much as I can out by myself first :p
<dholbach> don't worry :)
<LaserJock> yeah, we all have questions ;-)
<dholbach> LaserJock: thanks for the PR for me on the forums :-p
<LaserJock> did you read it?
<dholbach> LaserJock: ogra told me about it
<LaserJock> oh :-)
<ogra> dholbach, he just told the truth :)
<cbx33> do you guys use VM's for testing stuff
<dholbach> you guys do lots of hours in here too :)
<LaserJock> I think it is good to sometimes let the users know what the devs do and how hard they work for the community
<dholbach> cbx33: i mostly use pbuilder for building stuff, but don't use VMs
<cbx33> ok
<dholbach> http://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto is GoodStuff (tm)
* Toadstool is falling asleep on his keyboard
<Toadstool> g'night
<cbx33> dholbach, yah just found that
<cbx33> dholbach, do you have a dapper base image then?  or are you using dapper as your main machine?
<cbx33> told you there'd be a few questions
<jpatrick> ToadZzZztool: night
<LaserJock> cbx33: http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/index.html might help as well
<cbx33> thanx
* cbx33 hits save conversation :p
<LaserJock> cbx33: do you have dapper installed?
<cbx33> not as yet
<LaserJock> ok, fine. I was just going to say that if you did, that Packaging Guide is included in the help
* jpatrick must get round to sending more patches to LaserJock
<cbx33> ah i see
<LaserJock> jpatrick: asap, the deadline is like today ;-)
<cbx33> so how would you recommed going
<cbx33> install dapper as base machine
<cbx33> or stick with breezy for now?
<jpatrick> LaserJock: oh dear
<LaserJock> cbx33: well I'd recommend it with a "if it causes problems don't blame me" disclaimer :-)
<LaserJock> I've been running Dapper for months without any real problems
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> see....and donl;t shout at me here...I've been waiting to get rid of fedora with earnest on my home machine
<cbx33> I'm ubuntu everywhere else
<dholbach> wooohoo
<dholbach> guys, i'm out for something to eat
<LaserJock> no shouting here, I'm typing from OSX as we speak ;-)
<dholbach> see you later
<cbx33> fedora sux
<cbx33> :p
<cbx33> i've had enough
<Gloubiboulga> bon apptit dholbach
<dholbach> merci beaucoup, monsieur Gloubiboulga
<Gloubiboulga> :)
<bddebian> Later dholbach
<cbx33> bye dholbach
<cbx33> thanx for the hep
<dholbach> de rien
<bddebian> cbx33: You can fix ivtools/mxv for me :)
<LaserJock> bddebian: that's right, catch them when they are young an innocent ;-)
<Gloubiboulga> hehe
<LaserJock> Gloubiboulga: you have up on texmaker in Debian?
<LaserJock> s/have/gave/
<Gloubiboulga> LaserJock, someone is taking care of this
<LaserJock> I know, I told them to email you ;-)
<Gloubiboulga> ok :)
<bddebian> LaserJock: :-)
<Gloubiboulga> LaserJock, bddebian has uploaded the package of the new release in dapper btw
<LaserJock> you guys think there would be any interest in a packaging book for Ubuntu?
<cbx33> bddebian, what's the deadline :p
<cbx33> LaserJock, speaking as a packaging n00b YES
<LaserJock> cbx33: even if it wasn't free. It would be cheap (just the cost of the actual printing) but not free
<Gloubiboulga> oh, a "real" book
<cbx33> LaserJock, yup
<LaserJock> Gloubiboulga: yes
<bddebian> cbx33: 30minutes :-)
<Gloubiboulga> I really like books :)
<cbx33> bddebian, seeing as I'm still on fedora at this moment
<cbx33> I don;t think I'll have the time :p
<bddebian> Heh, No problem, I'm only kidding :-)
<Gloubiboulga> LaserJock, sounds like a good idea to me
<LaserJock> hmm, cool
<LaserJock> I like the idea of a community created, published packaging book
<cbx33> very good idea
<cbx33> nn all
<cbx33> I'll be back
<cbx33> you can count on it :p
<Gloubiboulga> I'm off too... cu
<truz24> LaserJock, i woner if canonical has thought about such a book
<LaserJock> truz24: there is an Official Ubuntu book almost finished
<truz24> i see
<andrewski> greets.  i'm trying to narrow down a gaim bug.  can someone type my nick?
<LaserJock> andrewski: fine
<andrewski> LaserJock: excellent, thank you. :)
<andrewski> easiest.  bug test.  ever.
<Jobman> Hey MOTUs, someone willing to review Bug 38093?
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 38093 in enigmail-locales "unmet dep" [Normal,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/38093
<bddebian> Well, time to go drink later folks
<jaldhar> what time is minghua usually on IRC?
<LaserJock> jaldhar: hmm, hard to say. Seems like he is one a far bit in the evenings UTC-7ish :-)
<TheMuso> Hey MOTUs.
<LaserJock> hi TheMuso
<jaldhar> G0SUB: as of yesterdays update, skim has started working properly for Gujarati and Hindi atleast.  Can you check it for Bengali and any other languages you know?
<G0SUB> jaldhar: in sid?
<jaldhar> LaserJock: thanks for the info.  I'll try and catch him later
<jaldhar> G0SUB: in dapper.  I have to build an updated skim package for sid
<G0SUB> jaldhar: okay, will test ... is it fixed for SCIM too? or just SKIM?
<jaldhar> G0SUB: afaik scim was always working.  skim had problems with Indic languages
<G0SUB> well, scim-m17n was broken for some time ...
<G0SUB> may be it still is
<jaldhar> G0SUB: it still might be.  I need to talk to minghua about that.  But I got the phonetic and inscript keymaps from scim-tables-additional to work
<G0SUB> jaldhar: yeah that worked ... but suddenly it stopped working at all
<jaldhar> G0SUB: it never worked for me.  But it does now.
<G0SUB> ok
#ubuntu-motu 2006-04-11
<LaserJock> Red_Herring: a .deb really doesn't help
<LaserJock> Red_Herring: we need a source package
<Red_Herring> ugh, so i need to package it myself?
<LaserJock> Red_Herring: or wait for somebody to do it
<Red_Herring> cuz currently im running DSL on a laptop with a dead hard drive w/ no other computer around
<Red_Herring> so my development opportunities are "limited"
<LaserJock> Red_Herring: you can add it to the list of packages wanted at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/Candidates
* Red_Herring looks into it
<LaserJock> but believe me, this is a very known problem, but it is quite late in the Dapper development cycle
<Red_Herring> ugh, i guess, but its a shame...
<LaserJock> yes it is
<Red_Herring> im willing to help, but if you dont htink its worth it, w/e
<LaserJock> well, you can start know and if it gets in for  Dapper fine, if not it could go in Dapper+1
<Red_Herring> i cant start now, i lack the resources
<dolson> argh. why do we have mismatched PIDA and Gazpatcho in Dapper... :(
<dolson> I haven't been paying full attention lately... are we still opening UVF exception requests to upgrade the old unstable crap in Dapper Universe?
<LaserJock> Red_Herring: well, when you have a chance you can work on it, but I would think that somebody would package it for Dapper+1
<Red_Herring> ugh, whats it gonna be called?
<Red_Herring> any name yet?
<LaserJock> Red_Herring: but getting it on the install cd is quite a bit more difficult
<LaserJock> Red_Herring: not that I know of
<Red_Herring> true true true
<Red_Herring> can it still be added to the universe?
<LaserJock> yes
<Red_Herring> later
<Red_Herring> sweet
<LaserJock> if it has a good license (it is GPL, right?)
<LaserJock> and it gets packaged (a real source package)
<LaserJock> then it can be reviewed for inclusion in Universe
<Red_Herring> ok
<Red_Herring> ill get right on it... can i do this from a livecd of kubuntu flight 6?
<LaserJock> there isn't  an inherent reason for it to not be included, it just takes somebody to take the time to do it
<ajmitch> hi
<LaserJock> hmm, I wouldn't recommend using a livcd for development work
<Red_Herring> LaserJock: then do you have a spare laptop hard drive? :-P
<LaserJock> Red_Herring: unfortunately not
<Red_Herring> damn
<Red_Herring> anyone?
<Red_Herring> also, once i package it, do i hafta maintain it?
<LaserJock> no
<Red_Herring> phew!
<LaserJock> Universe is team maintained
<Red_Herring> ok
<LaserJock> i.e., community members (the MOTU) with upload rights take care of Universe
<Red_Herring> ah, thats good
<LaserJock> the problem is there are only ~ 30 MOTUs for ~15000 packages
<ajmitch> which means we prefer that people don't just dump packages in & run :)
<Red_Herring> ... fine
<LaserJock> Red_Herring: if you want some reading on packaging, I would suggest http://www.debian.org/doc/maint-guide/ and http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/index.html
<Red_Herring> i dont want any howtos or suggestions about packaging until i get an actual install of dapper to work with!
<Red_Herring> grr, sorry, my computer has been broken for a while now
<LaserJock> Red_Herring: well, good luck with that. I can't help you there.
<Red_Herring> ok, thanks anyway
<LaserJock> Red_Herring: you might be better off enlisting somebody else who might be interested in packaging it.
<Red_Herring> im trying that now in #easyubuntu
<chillywilly> hi
<chillywilly> can someone point me to that wireless compat wiki page?
<chillywilly> bah
<chillywilly> nevermind
<chillywilly> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/WirelessChipsets
<chillywilly> the Atheros Super G does not support WPA according to this page, right?
<chillywilly> might as well use WEP w/ MAC filtering
<chillywilly> :-/
<chillywilly> although it's pretty useless
<crimsun_> still marginally better than none at all
<kbrooks> I'm willing to sponsor a upload of the frostwire package available at http://www.frostwire.com/static/downloads.html to universe
<kbrooks> for dapper+1
<crimsun_> huh?
<crimsun_> how would you sponsor said upload?
<kbrooks> crimsun_:  i dont know how. what are the available methods?
<crimsun_> you can't "sponsor" unless you have upload privileges.
<crimsun_> does frostwire build and run correctly with gcj?
<kbrooks> crimsun_: ?
<kbrooks> crimsun_: im on breezy
<crimsun_> kbrooks: where are you confused?
<kbrooks> crimsun_: well
<kbrooks> crimsun_: i havent checked. ill install the package
<sladen> chillywilly: best thing to do is not use either WEP or MAC locking and then use real-encryption (SSH, VPN)
<LaserJock> hi tritium
<tritium> hi LaserJock
<chillywilly> sladen: yea I could do that I suppose
<chillywilly> sladen: I have openwrt on the AP/router so I can do all kinds of nifty things
<robertj> hey all, can anyone try to find out what happened to quake3 and why it never got out of revu even though the last action taken (Jan) was looking very good?
<LaserJock> robertj: it isn't in Dapper?
<robertj> not according to http://packages.ubuntu.com/cgi-bin/search_packages.pl?keywords=quake3&searchon=names&subword=1&version=all&release=all
<zakame> hi motus
<ajmitch> hi
<Kyral> meh where is bddebian when I need him?
<LaserJock> robertj: hmm, odd. It looks like it was supposed to be uploaded
<robertj> LaserJock: is there a next step?
<robertj> profit?
<LaserJock> robertj: sistpoty said he was going to upload it
<LaserJock> so maybe some poking is in order ;-)
<robertj> LaserJock: according to revu it looks like daemon@poleboy dot de was the person who was going to upload
<LaserJock> yeah, that is sistpoty, why don't you just email him and politely ask him if he has done it ;-)
<robertj> polite email sent
<LaserJock> great
<Kyral> Meh I wanna ask bddebian about the status of DHCP in HURD
<ajmitch> heh
<Lathiat> dhcp is for wimps
<Kyral> or for people whose campus only uses DHCP
<Lathiat> and for wimps
<Lathiat> :)
<Lathiat> last time i tried hurd
<Lathiat> if you hit the keyboard while it was booting
<Lathiat> it'd kernel panic
<Lathiat> did they fix that yet? :)
<Kyral> dunno
<ajmitch> probably not
<ajmitch> Kyral: last time I used the hurd dhcp was working well enough for me
<Kyral> ajmitch: ty :D
<Kyral> I'm just installing it in Qemu anyway
<ajmitch> so why ask, if you would have found out in a few minutes?
<ajmitch> afaik only bddebian & myself have been crazy enough round here to do anything with the hurd
<Kyral> ajmitch: more like a couple hours...
<Kyral> the debian ISO is downloading and my school has a bandwidth cap of 78 Kb/S
<Kyral> This should be interesting...installing Gentoo in a Qemu image
<TheMuso> eek
<TheMuso> Kyral: Hope you are running the acceleration kernel module or whatever it is. :)
<Kyral> hehe
<Kyral> I'll just nice it down to 19 :D
<Kyral> TheMuso: nope....
<LaserJock> Kyral: I ran the Gentoo livecd installer in a qemu on my iMac. Seemed pretty nice for a graphical installer
<Kyral> uhh
<Kyral> how do I setup the bridge to Eth0?
<truz24> who decides which kernel to put on the repositories?  I notice i'm running 2.6.15-20, but on kernel.org they are up to 2.6.16
<Kyral> I heard 2.6.16 breaks stuff
<Kyral> hehe, I reniced Qemu to 19
<Kyral> HOBBSEE!!
<Hobbsee> hey Kyral!
* Hobbsee is killing time, chatting from the uni :D
<Kyral> sup?
<Hobbsee> just done an assignment, stuff for the chem prac in 40 mins...
<Hobbsee> not a lot :)
<Kyral> heh
<Hobbsee> looking vaguely at my comp assignment, and screaming loudly
<Kyral> I'm playing around with KQemu
<Kyral> Reniced Qemu down to 19 :P
<Hobbsee> ooh nice!
<Hobbsee> which OS with it?
<Kyral> Right now FC5
<Kyral> I was gonna do Gentoo
<Kyral> but I dunno how to get the Bridging working
<Kyral> eventually I'll do HURD
<Hobbsee> ah ok
<Hobbsee> hehe
<Kyral> meh I hate the FC installer
<Kyral> forget it
* Hobbsee has never bothered with it
* Hobbsee couldnt even install suse, so went back.
<Kyral> you should try Arch
<Hobbsee> could do
* Hobbsee had heard the wireless was good on suse, so was looking for interesting stuff to bring back
<ajmitch> hello Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> hey ajmitch :)
<LaserJock> hi Hobbsee and ajmitch
<Hobbsee> hey LaserJock
<ajmitch> hello again LaserJock
<LaserJock> ajmitch: I already said hi?
<LaserJock> my memory must be slipping
<ajmitch> well I was was around a couple of hours ago :)
<Kyral> Holy Netsplit batman
<LaserJock> ajmitch: ah, so it wasn't that bad
<Hobbsee> hehe
<Hobbsee> StevenK: ping?
<Kyral> Man I really need to get a Dapper Qemu image up
<ajmitch> why?
<ajmitch> unless you have a really fast machine, you'd probably be very disappointed
* LaserJock was pretty disappointed with qemu on his Intel iMac :(
<Kyral> ajmitch:  I need a development enviroment on ArchLinux
<Kyral> and with the KQemu module...it speeds up
<LaserJock> hmm, funny. my rhythmbox volume slider is still upside down. do other people have that?
<Kyral> I do in Amarok
<Kyral> even in ArchLinux :P
<Kyral> but I have to hit the sack
<Kyral> night kiddos :P
<crimsun> LaserJock: is only rb affected?
<LaserJock> I think so
<LaserJock> it has been that way for a while but I haven't used rb for a while
<Hobbsee> hi again everyone!
<LaserJock> hi Hobbsee
* Hobbsee survived her chem prac :P
<LaserJock> yeah for chem!
<Hobbsee> didnt manage to poison anyone either, or get yelled at
<Hobbsee> i suspect the tutor for the prac was trying to set me up with the guy that i was working with though...
<LaserJock> lol
<Hobbsee> hehe
<LaserJock> you've got to watch out for those chemists
<LaserJock> well, as long as you didn't hurt yourself I'd say you did OK. I hate it when students cut themselves on glassware or something
<Hobbsee> haha yeah, that's true
* Hobbsee ends up cutting herself on all sorts of things - including cigarette boxes!
<Pupeno> Hello.
<Pupeno> Where is that page with information about uploading upgraded packages (for the next Ubuntu) ?
<LaserJock> Pupeno: perhaps wiki.ubuntu.com/REVU ?
<Pupeno> LaserJock: maybe.
<LaserJock> do you want how to upgrade the package or where to put it?
<Pupeno> it is an upgrade, yes.
<LaserJock> hi dholbach
<dholbach> hey LaserJock
<LaserJock> are you going to be super busy in the next day or two?
<dholbach> why you ask? :)
<LaserJock> the doc string freeze is tomorrow (probably today for you) and I almost have the Packaging Guide done
<LaserJock> but I would like somebody like you to look it over for policy violations, etc ;-)
<dholbach> write to ubuntu-devel@ that you need reviews
<LaserJock> I'll send and email asking for review to -motu and -devel but in the past I haven't gotten much response
<LaserJock> maybe -devel will be better, people seem to complain easily enough when they don't have to fix ;-)
<kelmo_lap> hi
<Toadstool> hi here
<kelmo> hi siretart
<siretart> hey kelmo
<kelmo> siretart: i have proposed a compromise for our recent discussion
<kelmo> siretart: http://rafb.net/paste/results/fwmNBF31.html
<siretart> kelmo: interesting. but, wouldn't it be more easy to rely on /sys? isn't this what sysfs is for?
<kelmo> siretart: well, i still use linux 2.4 as well
<siretart> kelmo: oh. now I begin to understand why you objected to my proposal. TBH, I expect etch to not support linux 2.4 anymore
<kelmo> siretart: proc is equally as useful, imho, in this case
<siretart> kelmo: if your detection works on 2.6 as well, I'd say lets include it in our next upload (I think the 0.4.9 release could come soon[tm] ), and close the detection bug
<kelmo> siretart: 2.4 on one machine, and that is no choice of mine really ; )
<kelmo> siretart: but as you know, i am opposed to any sort of driver "guessing", this is about the only really robust way i could think of, and quite simple too
<siretart> kelmo: I think the bug submitter would be happy with this, given that he cares at all anymore
<zakame> hi al
<Gloubiboulga> hi zakame
<kelmo> siretart: ok, i'll commit and maintain that for as long as it is useful
<zakame> hello Gloubiboulga
<siretart> kelmo: thanks.
<zakame> huhu kelmo siretart
<kelmo> hey zakame
<siretart> hi zakame
<zakame> how do I help with DhIconCacheChanges? Do I just add dh_iconcache to debian/rules then rebuild and upload?
<dholbach> zakame: yes
<zakame> ok then
<dholbach> zakame: if you want to make 100% sure that it worked, check that it really gets called in the buildlog or check for the postinst :)
<dholbach> but that should be about it
<Hobbsee> Seveas: ping
<Seveas> Hobbsee, ?
<zakame> dholbach: yes, I'd like to be 100% + 1 sure :)
<dholbach> ROCK! ON! :)
<phanatic> hi people
<Hobbsee> Seveas: any chance we can get ubugtu in #kubuntu permanently?
<zakame> :)
<zakame> heya phanatic
<Seveas> #kubuntu-devel you mean?
<Seveas> or #kubuntu too?
<phanatic> hi zakame
<Hobbsee> kubuntu as well
<Hobbsee> already in kubuntu devel
<dholbach> thanks zakame!
<zakame> dholbach: my pleasure :)
<Gloubiboulga> zakame, could you upload libtranslate between 2 dh_iconcache uploads? :)
<zakame> Gloubiboulga: oi! almost forgot that! :)
<Gloubiboulga> :)
<Gloubiboulga> with this lib fixed gnome-translate could be available for dapper
<phanatic> hey Gloubiboulga :)
<Gloubiboulga> hi phanatic, how are you?
<phanatic> oh fine, thanks. i'm having a look at the hungarian translation of debian-installer. quite messy :/
<Gloubiboulga> hehe
<phanatic> Gloubiboulga: and what about you? :)
<Gloubiboulga> well I'm fine too :)
<Gloubiboulga> I try to help Xubuntu as much as I can since a few weeks
<phanatic> are there more people, or still just a few?
<Gloubiboulga> more users, but still a few devs...
<Gloubiboulga> I hope it'll change with the rocking iso images ;)
<phanatic> i'm sure it will ;)
<zakame> Gloubiboulga: just uploaded :)
<Gloubiboulga> thanks zakame :)
<zakame> Gloubiboulga: no prob :)
<bddebian> Howdy folks
<zakame> heya bddebian!
<zakame> bddebian: I notice some of your uploads haven't hit the archive yet :/
<bddebian> zakame: Hi.  Which ones?
<zakame> hmm I remember maelstrom for one
<bddebian> I was just looking at that on the buglist :-)
<zakame> cool
<bddebian> Gah, which i810 driver bug was that person looking at yesterday? Hmm
<bddebian> Hmm, wtf
<bddebian> I don't even see my maelstrom now..
<Gloubiboulga> a .desktop bug bddebian ?
<zakame> hmmm, could it be because of distribution-not-dapper ?
<zakame> (just hit that snag myself today, with preload)
<bddebian> Gloubiboulga: Aye
<Gloubiboulga> bug 31118 maybe
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 31118 in maelstrom "Maelstrom is missing a .desktop file" [Normal,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/31118
<bddebian> zakame: Aye, I did that on a couple but I swore that one got accepted but I can find the e-mail
<bddebian> Gloubiboulga: Yes
<zakame> bddebian: iirc there are no individual accepted/rejected files, only those on dapper-changes
<zakame> hmm is packages.u.c down?
<cbx33> afternoon all
<bddebian> Hello cbx33
<cbx33> bddebian, histarted looking at the packaging docs today
<bddebian> Great
<cbx33> but afraid I got stuck
<cbx33> :p
<cbx33> it all looks ok, but i ran into problems with pbuilder
<zakame> hi cbx33
<cbx33> hi zakame
<cbx33> it was creating the debootstrap that failed
<cbx33> with vi-runtime package dependency
<cbx33> this is what I did....you guys can tell me if it's the reason it broke
<cbx33> I am running breezy....so i installed pbuilder as per instructions
<bddebian> cbx33: Did you read the Pbuilder HowTo wiki page?
<cbx33> on the wiki....changed the sources.list to be dapper, and the extracted the dapper debootstrap script from the source and plonked it into my filestructure
<cbx33> can i have a pbuilder environment with dapper on a breezy system
<Gloubiboulga> yes cbx33
<zakame> of course
<cbx33> i thought it must be
<cbx33> forgive my stupidity
<cbx33> think anyone could givem a hand getting it up and running in a mo
<cbx33> just gonna get the laptop
<bddebian> Ack, it was an unstable/dapper thing for maelstrom..
<bddebian> <-- dumbass
<zakame> bddebian: you're not alone ;-)
<bddebian> That's my 3rd one so far.. :'-(
<cbx33> ok I'm starting the pbuilder from scrath again
<cbx33> it's ok cos thi sis on another machine
<cbx33> and one which i would be using for this kinda thing anyway
<bddebian> WTF, I did it for spider too :-(
<Pupeno> Hello.
<Pupeno> I've uploaded a package to revu but it doesn't appear here http://revu.tauware.de/
* bddebian blames Emmet for that one.  His changelog entry :-)
<bddebian> Pupeno: Is your key on REVU?
<Pupeno> What might I be missing ?
* bddebian does the summon crimsun dance
<Pupeno> bddebian: it should be, it was added, some days ago (is there a deadline to upload the first package) ?
<bddebian> Pupeno: No, shouldn't be
<Hobbsee> Pupeno: how long ago did you submit the package?
<Pupeno> Hobbsee: 3 or 4 hours ago.
<Hobbsee> oh ok
<cbx33> ok guys
<cbx33> I've re-installed pbuilder
<cbx33> editited the pbuilderrrc
<cbx33> just about to edit the sources.list file to dapper
<bddebian> What person/team should we assign main bugs too?
<zakame> bddebian: awww
<bddebian> zakame: ?
<cbx33> ok sources edited
<cbx33> run the opbuilder create now?
<zakame> bddebian: maelstrom, then spider...
<bddebian> zakame: Oh :-)
<cbx33> ok...that breaks
<Gloubiboulga> cbx33, yep :)
<cbx33> shall i do what i did last time and download the debootstrap source to extract the dapper script?
<Gloubiboulga> cbx33, do you have a error message?
<bddebian> cbx33: Maybe I'm out of the loop but what do you need debootstrap for pbuilder for?
<cbx33> to biuld the environment
<cbx33> using pbuilder create
<cbx33> as in the docs
<cbx33> I'm following this tut
<cbx33> http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/index.html
<bddebian> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto?highlight=%28PbuilderHowTo%29
<cbx33> sudo pbuilder create --distribution breezy
<cbx33> that step breaks on mine
<cbx33> i'm doing it for dapper
<cbx33> for a start there is no dapper script in breezy obviously
<Yagisan> G'day all. Do we have something like debian-legal for ubuntu ? I'd like a quick check of a license template to see if it is ok as a template
<cbx33> so i downloaded the debootstrap source and copied it out
<bddebian> cbx33: Create your pbuilder with breezy first (with breezy in sources.list).  Then create it.  Than change pbuilder source.list to dapper and do an upgrade
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> going
<cbx33> w00t
* cbx33 has setup pbuilder on dapper
<Yagisan> cbx33: congrats. Now what are you going to build ?
<cbx33> hello
<cbx33> as per my tut instructions :p
<cbx33> I'll get to the bigger stuff oneday
<Yagisan> oh, we have a packaging guide ?
<cbx33> yes
<Yagisan> I never noticed.
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> got a problem :p
<cbx33> make -i distclean doesn;t have a target
<cbx33> anyone got a spare sec?
<bddebian> cbx33: Just ask :-)
<cbx33> well I'm trying to build the source package for hello
<cbx33> i ge a .changes file
<cbx33> but it's failing because it can't run the distclean.....this is bcause Makefile is not there
<cbx33> that arrives after the ./configure doesn;t it?
<azeem> that's expected
<azeem> ...if you build a source pacakge
<azeem> dpkg-buildpackage just runs debian/rules clean, which basically has nothing to do if you did not build the program before
<cbx33> yeh....so i have to build the binaries first?
<azeem> what are you trying to dO?
<cbx33> well i have the source
<azeem> ok
<cbx33> the tutorial I'm follwoing says to build the source file
<cbx33> the package
<cbx33> but it;s failing
<cbx33> after i do the source it says to do the binary one
<azeem> is it really failing, or is the error ignored?
<cbx33> it says it was ignored
<cbx33> ah don;t wory
<cbx33> I'm being stupid
<bddebian> cbx33: Welcome to the club :-)
<cbx33> no I'm not
<cbx33> where does the file get created?
<azeem> in ..
<cbx33> the src deb
<cbx33> swat i thought
<cbx33> it's not there
<cbx33> only a .changes file
<azeem> source.changes?
<cbx33> yes
<azeem> no .dsc?
<cbx33> yes
<cbx33> but that was there before
<cbx33> ah
<cbx33> i see
<cbx33> :p
* cbx33 bangs his head :p
* cbx33 goes for a binary build package
<cbx33> w00t
<cbx33> it works
<cbx33> where's the source .deb?
<Yagisan> cbx33: please don't hit enter after just one or two words. It makes a lot of vertical scrollback.
<azeem> cbx33: the source package is the set of files referenced in the source.changes
<cbx33> sorry
<bddebian> cbx33: What do you mean where is the source .deb?
<azeem> basically, .orig.tar.gz, .diff.gz, .dsc, there's no .deb for source
<bddebian> Yes, as azeem says
<cbx33> ah
<cbx33> brb
<hub> dholbach: I have a fix for a bug in main https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/abiword/+bug/38412
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 38412 in abiword ""Collaborate..." menu item doesn't do anything" [Normal,Unconfirmed] 
<hub> dholbach: I provided the debdiff, if you want/can upload
<cbx33> sorry Yagisan about the enter:p  I guess my brain buffer is very small
<cbx33> Hi LaserJock
<cbx33> working through your docs now
<Yagisan> cbx33: don't worry about it.
<cbx33> i've fixed the problem i described, by starting with a brezzy then working up to a dapper, so I'm well on the way, have created the hello pacakges using the first method
<LaserJock> cbx33: when did you start?
<cbx33> um....well...it's 16:34 now...
<cbx33> i originally started at about 7:30 this morning
<cbx33> took me 45 mins before i wrote the email to you, but i screwed up....started again this afternoon, took about 25 mins to get to the end of the first method
<LaserJock> hmm, I did a major rewrite of the "Packaging from Scratch" section about7 hours ago
<cbx33> :p
<LaserJock> it is up on doc.ubuntu.com so make sure you have refreshed your browser ;-)
<cbx33> did you get my mail....and i suppose the main question was any of it any help?
<LaserJock> I just got up to work on finishing the guide. I saw I have an email but I haven't read it yet. Doing so now
<cbx33> heheh
<cbx33> probably not that helpful now, plus, i fixed my major error in there, still want feedback on the rest of it?
<LaserJock> so you started with a breezy pbuilder and upgraded it?
<cbx33> i did now, first of all i tried just starting with a dapper one
<LaserJock> did you install the Dapper version of debootstrap?
<cbx33> no :p
<cbx33> but i did nick the script from the dapper debootstrap source
<dholbach> hub: i'll have a look
<LaserJock> you can just dpkg -i the dapper .deb
<cbx33> well, i could have :p  but i didn't know the impact so i went for the safer option - but it still broke it
<hub> dholbach: thx
<dholbach> de rien
<cbx33> dholbach, I'm getting there :p
<LaserJock> cbx33: the other thing is what distro you have in your /etc/pbuilder/apt.config/sources.list file
<cbx33> packaged up hello and it all works
<cbx33> well it was breezy...so i switched it to dapper....this is the first time
<cbx33> but now it all works fine
<LaserJock> I'll try to make the pbuilder section a bit clearer on those points. you are the second person to have that problem
<cbx33> starting off with breezy and then moving up to dapper
<cbx33> thought I was being clever LaserJock turns out I wasn't :p
<cbx33> LaserJock, could be because I am stupid :p
<LaserJock> your not the first one to mention it
<bddebian> cbx33: I have the claim on stupidity in the MOTU's so that's not allowed :-)
<LaserJock> cbx33: just wait until you want to make more than one pbuilder >:)
<LaserJock> bddebian: heck no. that imake/xmkmf stuff scares me :/
<cbx33> heheh
<cbx33> so...i watned to ask....is there a package....that someone has the old and teh fixed versions./...
<cbx33> that I could try to fix and someone could possibly give me guidence in steps....not hold my hand just some general pointers
<cbx33> bddebian, I'll fight you for the stupidity claim....:p
<bddebian> You don't stand a chance :-)
<cbx33> we'll see :p
<LaserJock> cbx33: how do you mean? for a fix or something?
<cbx33> well, I really want to do this. but i think i need some practise, my idea was to fix something someone has already fixed
<cbx33> and to talk to that person so they could gimme some pointers when i get stuck
<LaserJock> cbx33: there a merge tutorial in the "Ubuntu Packaging" chapter. it might be too much but you could give it a go
<cbx33> might be too much...what are you suggesting...I'm trying out to be a master of the universe...nothing is too much for me...
* cbx33 lowers his voice and slinks back to the laptop
<cbx33> are you talking about the xcdroast one?
<LaserJock> yes
<LaserJock> I went through quite a bit of detail on how to see the differences between packages with that
<LaserJock> and although it isn't a bug fix, it is certainly something we will be doing a lot of when Dapper+1 repos open :-)
<cbx33> ok excellent
<cbx33> I'll work through that one
<cbx33> thank you so muhc LaserJock you've been a realy help to me
<LaserJock> cbx33: that's my job (umm, volunteer work) ;-)
<Marticus> I'd like to report an issue with expert mode installation at the 'base-config new' step
<cbx33> is it fixed in dapper so that an exper install performs the visudo
<cbx33> LaserJock, the xcdroast source from debian links are broken
<cbx33> any idea on an alternative?
<Marticus> cbx33: I just installed using expert, I ended up manually running visudo
<LaserJock> crap, they shouldn't be
<cbx33> Marticus, that needs to be fixed
<Marticus> I Was just confirming it :)
<cbx33> that steered me away from ubuntu for a long time
<Marticus> my current issue with expert is that it didn't seem to ever prompt me for the type of package configuration I wanted
<cbx33> i needed to do a expert intstall for proxies originally
<Marticus> is that normal?
<LaserJock> cbx33: what links don't work?
<cbx33> you mean http ftp cdrom ?
<cbx33> the 2 set of 2
<cbx33> 2nd set of 2
<Marticus> um, either
<Marticus> I opted for installing from the net
<LaserJock> Marticus: I don't think any Ubuntu install asks for package configurations, but I could be wrong
<Marticus> so I suppose http
<cbx33> i don;t think it does either
<cbx33> I've never had it do that
<Marticus> I see
<Marticus> I had hoped to skip all the Xorg stuff
<cbx33> but the visudo is a killer
<LaserJock> Marticus: do a server install
<Marticus> but it doesn't matter at this point because 'base-config new' isn't working
<Marticus> it doesn't register that it was sent -y
<cbx33> i hated ubuntu till i figured that one out.....was a while ago now...now i love ubu more than any other distro :p
<Marticus> and the screen pauses
<Marticus> forever
<cbx33> and ever
<LaserJock> cbx33: what sudo thing?
<cbx33> I'll love you forever :p
<Marticus> heh
<cbx33> LaserJock, scroll up...in an expert install
<cbx33> the visudo step to make the user part of the wheel group isn't performed
<Marticus> in expert, it never sets up the user with sudo access
<LaserJock> yikes
<cbx33> consequently all gnome apps that need root just do nothing
<LaserJock> is there a bug report on Malone?
<cbx33> which frustrated me
<cbx33> no idea
<cbx33> want me to file one?
<Marticus> at least, I'm not sure when that is supposed to happen becase I get stuck on the base-config new (download packages) step
<cbx33> at... i see
<cbx33> LaserJock, it could be fixed....but wasn't in warty or breezy
<LaserJock> make sure to check for a bug report and report it if there isn't
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> I'll handle that
<Marticus> so I guess I need to fux around with the position of the -y flag until it works
* Marticus goes searching for its location
<LaserJock> if it is still doing that with dapper, I'm not sure about breezy
<LaserJock> you should try to verify with someone that it still happens for dapper
<cbx33> ok
<Marticus> any thoughts on the other issue?
<cbx33> sorry Marticus
<Marticus> mmkay
<cbx33> so is it the xorg that is killing ya?
<cbx33> LaserJock, any confirmation on those links
<cbx33> ?
<Marticus> not really
<LaserJock> umm, the one I tried worked. which one didn't for you?
<Marticus> base-config stops before it downloads any packages
<cbx33> I'll refresh and try again
<cbx33> Marticus, what's happeneing
<Marticus> I've moved the -y to immediately after aptitude and apt-get in the pcksel to see if it works
<cbx33> LaserJock, nope neither of those work
<cbx33> the 4 and 5th link
<Marticus> well
<Marticus> I think that may have worked
<LaserJock> ahh crap
* cbx33 calms LaserJock down
<Marticus> although I ran base-config once without the new option
<Marticus> so that may have had something to do with it now working with the new option
<cbx33> indeed it may have
<Marticus> at any rate, the process became unstable and I had to manually step through at this point
<cbx33> yes
<Marticus> I might try it once more from scratch
<cbx33> i would
<cbx33> if you get through it can you confirm the visudo problem and I'll bug report it
<Marticus> sure
<Marticus> um
<Marticus> should I tell it to install the installer stuff from the net or the cd?
<Marticus> it prompted me and I chose cdrom
<cbx33> cd
<Marticus> okay
<LaserJock> crap, crap, crap >:(
<cbx33> what's up LaserJock
<cbx33> anything I can do?
<Marticus> ubuntu ftw
<LaserJock> well snapshot.debian.net doesn't seem to carry any of the xcdroast info from before 2005
<Marticus> okay before it get's too deep into downloading, I'll restart
<LaserJock> it used to but not now
<cbx33> LaserJock, do you have them anywhere?
<Marticus> and btw this iso is from 4 days ago-ish
<cbx33> we could host them somewhere?
<cbx33> as a cache to make sure the tut never breaks
<LaserJock> cbx33: yes, but it means that I'll have to ship those files on every Ubuntu install :(
<cbx33> oh i see....you're including them with dapper
<cbx33> couldn't you get it to just ship the source and get it to create the others from teh changes when the package is installed?
<cbx33> then there would only be one source package
<LaserJock> All I'll need to include is the 2 files that don't download, which isn't a whole lot
<LaserJock> but it is still annoying
<cbx33> true
<cbx33> but then thinking what happens if they change?
<cbx33> you could do it the other way and make it unbreakable :p
<LaserJock> then I'm screwed :-(
<cbx33> of course not :p
<LaserJock> well, I'll se how much everything but the .orig.tar.gz files is
<cbx33> LaserJock, it's possible to do it the way I described isn't it?
<cbx33> just for my own piece of mind :p
<LaserJock> I need all the .diff.gz and .dsc files from all the versions I'm dealing with
<LaserJock> which might take up some space, but it might be worth it
<cbx33> i would say there is nothing worse than a tutorial that doesn't work
<LaserJock> I agree
<cbx33> people get frustrated and give up
<pef> hello
<pef> is pbuilder broken for someone ?
<cbx33> it was
<LaserJock> well, looks like I can ship everything but the .orig.tar.gz for a few hundred K
<pef> cbx33: and now it works for you ? I cannot run pbuilder create without errors at the end
<LaserJock> pef: are you creating a Dapper pbuilder?
<pef> LaserJock: yes
<cbx33> pef what's the issue?
<cbx33> is it to do with vim-runtime?
<cbx33> and a missing dependency
<pef> cbx33: just wait a minute, I don't have the machine where the problem occurs near me
<cbx33> ok
<pef> cbx33: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/11607
<pef> LaserJock: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/11607
<pef> after running the command "pbuilder create"
<cbx33> nope not had that issue
<cbx33> did you start wit ha breezy pbuilder?
<LaserJock> yikes that is weird
<cbx33> then edit to make it up to a dapper?
<LaserJock> pef: did you just dist-upgrade?
<pef> no, fresh install of pbuilder and running create command
<cbx33> very odd
<cbx33> I gtg, I'll leave it with you LaserJock :p - could you drop me a mail if you find a link to those sources, i really want to try that merging bit
<LaserJock> pef: right, but there have been a some updates to pbuilder recently, I wonder if one of those has messed something up
<cbx33> I'll file that bug report later
<LaserJock> cbx33: just a sec, I'll have it for you
<pef> cbx33: I will fill it right now :)
<cbx33> oh nice thank you
<pef> ok
<LaserJock> cbx33: http://tiber.tauware.de/~laserjock/
<cbx33> LaserJock, you're a star
<LaserJock> I'm also getting them permanently placed on doc.ubuntu.com so I can redo the links in the guide
* LaserJock avoids a broken packaging guide yet again :-)
<LaserJock> thanks for finding that cbx33
<cbx33> np thank you for the opportunity LaserJock :p
<cbx33> anytime yo uwant docs checked just ask :p
<LaserJock> are you subscribed to the ubuntu-devel or ubuntu-motu mailing lists?
<Marticus> well
<Marticus> it seems that the -y edits had no effect
<Marticus> affect
<Marticus> which I didn't think would be the case
<Marticus> or rather, I thought they would have no affect :)
<cbx33> LaserJock, not at the moment
<cbx33> think it'd be a good idea?
<crimsun> bddebian: apt-cache showsrc python-numarray|grep ^Binary
<Marticus> hrm
<Marticus> I wonder
<LaserJock> sure ;-)  I was just going to say that I was going to email those lists asking for a review
<LaserJock> cbx33: ^^
<cbx33> ah ok excellent
<cbx33> I'll join up....
<bddebian> crimsun: You keep answering me in the wrong channel.. ;-P
<Kyral> heyo bddebian
<bddebian> Heya Kyral
<bddebian> Gads I HATE packages that are just a debian dir and a tarball :-(
<azeem> bddebian: why?
<bddebian> azeem: Dunno, I just like to dig through the source for stuff :-)
<azeem> you just need to make sure to put your hacking into debian/patches before you do anything which rm -rf's the build-tree ;)
* Kyral pants
<crimsun> bddebian: that's because it's not worth cluttering -devel
<bddebian> azeem: That is assuming that there IS a debian/patches :-)
<azeem> bddebian: there should be, unless there are no patches applied at all
<bddebian> crimsun: Well I knew I couldn't see them in the archive
<bddebian> azeem: Well I've run across a few of those :-
<bddebian> )
<azeem> bddebian: cool, then you can decide on the patch system yourself ;)
<bddebian> Yeah, then get "yelled at" for deviating from Debian :-)
<azeem> there's no other way in this case
<azeem> if you need to modify the source, I mean
<bddebian> Aye
<azeem> unless you encode the patch into debian/rules ;)
<bddebian> Hmmmmm
<bddebian> ;-P
<cbx33> anyone any idea when LaserJock will be back
<cbx33> his links don;t work :S
<crimsun> probably in a few hours
<cbx33> I'll send him a mail and hope he picks it up
<crimsun> he will later
<cbx33> Marticus, did you confirm that the sudo bug is still there?
<cbx33> sudo bug has already been reported by someone else
<pef_aw> cbx33: was an extra space :) #38456
<cbx33> heheh
<cbx33> does freenode have memo facility?
<crimsun> memoserv.
<Tonio_> hello*
<cbx33> stupid me
<bddebian> Hello Tonio_
<Tonio_> hi bddebian ;)
<LaserJock> pef: you fixed pbuilder, great!
<cbx33> LaserJock, you're back
<cbx33> :p
<cbx33> get my memo?
<cbx33> oh and that bug isn't a bug...apparently it's intended behavior of sudo in expert install
<LaserJock> cbx33: umm, yeah. http://doc.ubuntu.com/files/packagingguide/
<LaserJock> cbx33: better?
<cbx33> YAY
* cbx33 gets on with the tutorial
<cbx33> thank you
<LaserJock> I've updated the xml but I don't think the html has been updated
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> do i need interdiff LaserJock ?
<Marticus> dear god!
<cbx33> of course I do
<Marticus> well, I bypassed the errors
<pef> LaserJock: bug wasn't too difficult ;)
<Marticus> by skipping "Config apt"
<LaserJock> cbx33: actually doc.ubuntu.com has been refreshed
<cbx33> excellent
<Marticus> but now it freezes the system at the point where it attempts to load x
<cbx33> oh dear
<Marticus> so I need to make it skip the xconfig process
<Marticus> somehow
<cbx33> sounds like you're having a tough time of it Marticus
<Marticus> until I can manually configure it
<Marticus> it's a new laptop
<Marticus> I have hack instructions here to get x working
<Marticus> I don't know what base-config is doing at this point
<LaserJock> cbx33: you don't need interdiff specifically. It should already be installed
<cbx33> it comes with patchutils
<cbx33> and is now installed
<Marticus> btw, shouldn't install grub do a password confirmation?
<Marticus> it might be a good idea
<LaserJock> cbx33: did you not have patchutils?
<cbx33> heheheh nope
<cbx33> actually is that specified in your tut?
<Marticus> can I tell dpkg to not configure X?
<Marticus> so I can skip it and come back?
<Marticus> otherwise it will freeze
<Marticus> because I can't apt-get install the correct drivers and finish the manual config process
<Marticus> I didn't mean this to become a support issue, I merely wanted to report here a few issues...
<Marticus> like the grub password verification
<LaserJock> cbx33: no, but it is a dependency of devscripts which is
<cbx33> not here it's not
<cbx33> culd be coz im still on breezy perhaps?
<Marticus> and the fact that I needed to step through the time clock setup twice, i.e., With GMT, US->Eastern, then Without GMT, US->Eastern, in order to get the correct local and utc times
<LaserJock> cbx33: do you have devscripts installed? I think I might have overlooked it :(
<cbx33> yes i do
<cbx33> i see a small spelling error too....near the end of the merging tutorial
<cbx33> the second paragraph from the end starrts Now you can
<cbx33> the word packages on that line is misspelled
<LaserJock> k
<LaserJock> can you run "apt-cache rdepends patchutils" for me?
<cbx33> yeh sure
<cbx33> reverse depends devscripts
<cbx33> dpatch
<cbx33> and freebsd5-buildutils
<LaserJock> but you had devscripts installed but no patchutils?
<cbx33> yes
<bddebian> Damn ace is a pig
<Marticus> sigh
<LaserJock> cbx33: ahh, patchutils is only Suggests for devscripts, not a hard Depends
<Marticus> I just need to correctly configure X so base-config will finish doing what I needs to do
<cbx33> there ya go
<cbx33> LaserJock, in the section where you talk about creating the desktop entry file
<cbx33> you don;t say where to create it
<Marticus> I think it freezes whilst trying to detect a video card
<LaserJock> cbx33: in the packaging itself or where it should be installed by the .deb?
<cbx33> in the packaging itself
<cbx33> it says
<cbx33> now in dirs add the following line
<cbx33> then below that section it has the code for the desktop entry
<cbx33> but doesn;t say where to put or what to call that file
<LaserJock> it does say (xcdroast.desktop) but you are right that it doesn't say where it should go (in debian/)
<cbx33> ah right
<LaserJock> thanks for another catch :-)
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> I'm at the end
<cbx33> just goign to try creating it
<LaserJock> Ok, I changed it to "Now we need the actual .desktop file (saved as debian/xcdroast.desktop)."
<LaserJock> good?
<cbx33> yes good
<cbx33> got antoher problem :p
<LaserJock> of course ;-)
<cbx33> hang on I'll pastebin it
<cbx33> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/11615
<Marticus> okay well
<Marticus> scratch this, I don't have the time to fix this brokenness
<cbx33> Marticus, you'll be back :p
<cbx33> it always happens that way
<Marticus> I wanted ubuntu damnit :P
<Marticus> because debian = slow
<cbx33> does it do the same in breezy?
<Marticus> I am using breezy...
<cbx33> oh
<Marticus> base-config hangs during video detection
* cbx33 apologises
<cbx33> hmmm
<cbx33> no idea on that one....
<Marticus> so I'm in single user mode at the moment
<cbx33> LaserJock, does that error ring any bells
<Marticus> trying to figure out how to skip the auto configuration of X
<LaserJock> cbx33: do you have debhelper installed?
<cbx33> nope
<cbx33> i do now though
<LaserJock> cbx33: ok, that's another one I need to add
<cbx33> ok now another problem
<cbx33> a fatal error about inseting a pgp key
<LaserJock> pastebin it
<cbx33> is this added on the debuild line?
<cbx33> next pastebin
<cbx33> oops
<cbx33> my bad
<cbx33> no not my bad
<cbx33> gnupg is installed
<LaserJock> hmm, odd
<cbx33> indeed
<LaserJock> what does "which gpg" give you?
<cbx33> /usr/bin/gpg
<LaserJock> cbx33: do you have a gpg key?
<cbx33> yes....but not on this machine.....
* cbx33 installs his gpg key
<LaserJock> maybe that is the problem
<cbx33> that might be another thing to add
<LaserJock> well, you should have one from the "Building from scratch" section (or know to use -us -uc)
<LaserJock> :-)
<Marticus> sigh
<cbx33> you mean the debhelper section
<cbx33> the one i skipped.....for doing tomorrow
<LaserJock> no, it should be in the first one
<cbx33> it's not
<cbx33> how do i move a gpg key from one machine to the other?
* cbx33 hangs his head in shame
<LaserJock> cbx33: tar up the .gnupg directory
<cbx33> heh
<cbx33> swat i thought
<cbx33> 11620 pastebin
<cbx33> i sftp'd the files over
<LaserJock> cbx33: last section of http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/basic-scratch.html
<LaserJock> cbx33: are you sure you have the email address right in the changelog? it has to be the same email address as your gpg key
<cbx33> ah checking
<cbx33> nope
<cbx33> same error about secret key not being available
<cbx33> when it is
<cbx33> rw for me
<LaserJock> hmmm, I've never had that problem before
<cbx33> my key works fien on this fc4 machine
<LaserJock> cbx33: can you try signing some file to see if it works?
<cbx33> yeh sure
<cbx33> yup signed no problem
<LaserJock> :S
<LaserJock> what the heck?
<cbx33> ok wondered if my name had to be exactly the same...but no
<cbx33> still the same issue
<LaserJock> try adding -k<keyid> to debuild -S
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> yup
<cbx33> that worked
<cbx33> might want to add that to the syncing tut
<LaserJock> well, you shouldn't need to
<cbx33> but i remember you have it added in the debhelper bit if i recall
<cbx33> and i still can't find it mention gpg keys in build from scratch
<LaserJock> lol, it in the "Building the Source Package" part
<LaserJock> cbx33: try adding something like:
<LaserJock> export DEBFULLNAME="Jordan Mantha"
<LaserJock> export DEBEMAIL="mantha@ubuntu.com"
<LaserJock> to your .bashrc
<LaserJock> and reopen your terminal
<cbx33> well it's building now
<jaldhar> cbx33: do you have multiple secret keys?
<sladen> win 108
<cbx33> jaldhar, nope
<cbx33> LaserJock, you added that bit today
<cbx33> grrr.
<LaserJock> mwuahahaha
<LaserJock> actually it was 1:00 am local time
<cbx33> grr. LaserJock i just printed it out and everything :p
<jaldhar> cbx33: you sure?  From an experiment maybe?  Because your problem sounds like what happens when you are not using your default key or it is not associated with the same id
<cbx33> so i could annotate
<cbx33> hmmm.....nope
<cbx33> only one key that i know of
<LaserJock> cbx33: well perhaps when it is released, you can buy a print copy from lulu.com. we'll see :-)
* cbx33 points at LaserJock :p
<cbx33> just you wait...
<cbx33> well it's worked
<LaserJock> cbx33: did you try adjusting your .bashrc?
<cbx33> not yet will do so now
<LaserJock> cbx33: it worked with the -k ?
<cbx33> ye
<LaserJock> ok, so debuild just can't find your key, I think that perhaps the .bashrc thing will help
<cbx33> nope
<cbx33> doesn't help
<cbx33> but I have no problem adding the -k
<LaserJock> arggh
<cbx33> infact i prefer that
<cbx33> calm down LaserJock
<LaserJock> heh, easy for you to say ;-)
<cbx33> LaserJock, anything else for me to try
<LaserJock> are you sure the name and email address of your key is the same as in the changelog?
<cbx33> I understand it all too :p
<cbx33> I will triple check
<LaserJock> and they are the same as DEBFULLNAME and DEBEMAIL?
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> dpkg is still trying to sign with pete@localhost.localdomain
<cbx33> hang on
<cbx33> ok it;s picked up my name now
<cbx33> check this pastebin entry
<cbx33> 11622
<LaserJock> cbx33: well... The name and email address are now all the same?
<cbx33> yes
<cbx33> what's the .asc file....is that hte signing?
<LaserJock> yeah
<cbx33> it shouldn't be of 0 length should it
<LaserJock> nope, not if the signing worked
<cbx33> aH
<cbx33> HANG ON
<cbx33> whoooops
<cbx33> ok if the gpg sign succeeds does the .asc file dissapear?
<LaserJock> I think so, but I'm not sure. let me check
<cbx33> ok coool
<cbx33> then it;s working...but i still have to do -k
<LaserJock> ok, well I think you have got something weird going on.
<LaserJock> I'm going to add a note about using -k<keyid> if signing doesn't automatically work
<cbx33> excellent
<cbx33> well,
<cbx33> i managed to do it LaserJock I followed your tut
<LaserJock> phew, do you feel like a Master of the Universe now? ;-)
<cbx33> getting there
<cbx33> feels good actually
<cbx33> think it's something i could really help with
<cbx33> now i need to do one on my own
<LaserJock> just wait until we start working on Dapper+1 and there will be ~1000 merges or syncs to do
<cbx33> any idea on the naming for the netxt one ?
<cbx33> :p
<cbx33> some of the kids in yuthlug had some ideas
<LaserJock> seems like Edgy something is popular
<cbx33> Farty Ferret - Crackhead Crocodile
<cbx33> were their favourites
<LaserJock> lol
<cbx33> yeh we're running a competition
<cbx33> it'll be on the podcast when we finish
<cbx33> I'll send you a link when it;s done
<LaserJock> lol, do
<cbx33> so when you submit a patch
<cbx33> of a fix
<cbx33> you submit the .diff.tgz
<cbx33> and the .dsc
<cbx33> i presume?
<cbx33> and the source.changes ?
<LaserJock> actually, you usually submit a debdiff
<LaserJock> from the current version to the fixed version
<cbx33> ah i see
<cbx33> from one .dsc to another
<LaserJock> yes
<cbx33> see i'm getting it
<cbx33> and all your changes are done in debian/
<LaserJock> MOTUs will then apply the debdiff and then upload the source.changes file
<cbx33> additions of file and stuff
<LaserJock> ideally, yes
<LaserJock> usually through the dpatch system
<cbx33> so if i get good at doing the debdiffs then after that comes the motu stage :p
<LaserJock> which I haven't had time to really cover in the guide
<cbx33> no no that's fine
<cbx33> will you soon?
<LaserJock> not sure
<cbx33> your guides are pretty excellent
<LaserJock> you need to become an Ubuntu member before you become a MOTU
<cbx33> i write a bit for linux gazette
<cbx33> http://linuxgazette.net/authors/savage.html
<cbx33> of course...and you do that by spotting and fixing bugs?
<LaserJock> yes, for at least 2 months
<LaserJock> you need to show contribution to Ubuntu
<cbx33> i see
<LaserJock> IRC, translations, bug fixes etc.
<cbx33> on average how many patches/time spent do you think you need
<LaserJock> if you work with -motu for 2 months you'll become a member no problem ;-)
<cbx33> like i have been doing?
<cbx33> heheh
<bddebian> I believe there are like 9000 bugs, then you can apply ;-P
* cbx33 faints
<LaserJock> yeah. The bar isn't very high. They want sustained (~ 2 months) and significant (you have done something to help Ubuntu) contribution
<cbx33> hehe....I've converted loads of people at work to ubuntu
* bddebian wonders if he has done either :-)
<cbx33> loadsa kids...esp in youthlug :D
<LaserJock> cbx33: that is a contribution
* cbx33 thinks probably not bddebian :p
<LaserJock> bddebian: you don't need too, you are already in the club ;-)
<cbx33> we're interviewing edubuntu on youthlug radio too :p
<cbx33> hehe
<bddebian> LaserJock: Oh yeah.. Heh :-)
<LaserJock> cbx33: are you interested in Edubuntu? I know ogra can always use more help with the packaging aspect
<cbx33> hence y I'm here LaserJock
<cbx33> ogra pointed me in here for that reason :p
<LaserJock> I'm going to try to help Edubuntu for Dapper+1
<LaserJock> mostly university science stuff (because I'm a PhD  chemistry student)
<cbx33> ah....
<cbx33> I'm a BEng acoustical engineer
<cbx33> working as an IT manager
<cbx33> in a school
<cbx33> heheh
<LaserJock> I see :-)
<cbx33> LaserJock, location?
<LaserJock> Reno, NV, USA
<cbx33> ah
<LaserJock> you are in the UK?
<cbx33> indeed i am
<cbx33> well, hopefully guys I'm here to stay
<cbx33> you should be hearing from me on a regular basis
<cbx33> :p
<LaserJock> great
<LaserJock> thanks for all the review on the Packaging Guide
<cbx33> not a problem
<cbx33> just shout if you need anything else....
<LaserJock> k
<cbx33> i suppose that's a contribution to ubuntu too eh?
<LaserJock> sure
<cbx33> tbh...you guys are the nicest community I've been to in a long long time
<LaserJock> just document it on your wiki page at wiki.ubuntu.com
<LaserJock> tbh, that is why I'm here too :-)
<cbx33> I've tried to help out with sooooo many projects...but no one offers support
<cbx33> why?
<bddebian> cbx33: Yes, they are (nice that is) :_)
<cbx33> to help out us n00bs
<LaserJock> This was the first disto that I felt I could be a part of
<LaserJock> not just a user
<cbx33> where is my wiki page?
<cbx33> or where do i create it?
<LaserJock> wiki.ubuntu.com
<LaserJock> cbx33: go to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PeteSavage and hit HomepageTemplate
<LaserJock> and document all the work you do for Ubuntu, it will come in handy later, trust me
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> what's your wiki page LaserJock
<LaserJock> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/JordanMantha but it might be a little stale
<cbx33> just founf it
<mitsuhiko> moin :-)
<mitsuhiko> whom do i have to contact for a mysql-server vs. python2.4-mysqldb problem?
<mitsuhiko> looks like a broken dependency
<LaserJock> hmm, have you checked Malone for a bug report?
<mitsuhiko> there isn't a single report mentioning mysql
<mitsuhiko> and that's a bit strange :)
<mitsuhiko> i will create a new repor
<mitsuhiko> +t
<mitsuhiko> .oO(hopefully the search isn't just broken)
<mitsuhiko> ney. i'm just to stupid for the search function :)
<LaserJock> heh, it gets all of us at some point
<pygi> meebey, around? :)
<mitsuhiko> filed: https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/python-mysqldb/+bug/38494
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 38494 in python-mysqldb python2.4-mysqldb "dependency problem" [Normal,Unconfirmed] 
<dholbach> good night guys
<Se7h> hi
<ajmitch> hi
<lifeless> hi
<ajmitch> morning lifeless, how's it going?
<LaserJock> hi ajmitch
<lifeless> ajmitch: rockin'
<lifeless> ajmitch: thou ?
<ajmitch> doing alright
<ajmitch> hoping I'm not coming down with the flu :)
<Se7h> ajmitch LOL
<Se7h> fear
#ubuntu-motu 2006-04-12
<cbx33> nn all
<bddebian> Heya gang
<LaserJock> hi bddebian!
<ajmitch> hi
<bddebian> Hi LaserJock, ajmitch
<LaserJock> darn, I wish doc writing gave karma, I'm almost to 5000
<bddebian> Doh, I'd better get to work then.. ;-P
<LaserJock> you better:-)
<LaserJock> I still have 1000 to catch up to you though
<bddebian> Is LP having problems?
<LaserJock> seems to work for me
<bddebian> Hmm
<bddebian> So for this DhIconCache stuff we just need to add dh_iconcache to debian/rules and thats it?
<LaserJock> that was my reading of the email anyway
<bddebian> Hello jaldhar
<Marticus> it seems my laptop doesn't like ubuntu, or the other way around
<Marticus> it's now crashing upon downloading libmysqlclient during 'base-config new' process
<Marticus> pretty colors and stuff
<jaldhar> bddebian: belated hello.  It's hard to irc when you're trying to stop your kids from killing each other
<bddebian> jaldhar: Heh, I know that feeling :-)
<bddebian> Damn I hate this time of night
<bddebian> crimsun: You up?
<tseng> bddebian: woo
<bddebian> Heya tseng
<tseng> saw the phillies yesterday
<bddebian> tseng: I'm sorry :-)
<tseng> went by Valley Forge
<bddebian> Should we still have 1c2 packages out there?
<ajmitch> bddebian: yes
<crimsun> bddebian: yes
<ajmitch> c2 ->c2a was just a couple of symbols, not a whole new ABI
<bddebian> Hmm, why the hell does libtyvis1-dev depend libtyvis1 then instead of libtyvis1c2?
<bddebian> Stupid shlibs
<lifeless> ajmitch: if symbols are broken, it should change :)
<ajmitch> lifeless: sure, but only a select few libraries were affected
<lifeless> ajmitch: and all local builds on all users machines ?
<bddebian> Can I get away with a simple rebuild?
<ajmitch> I don't know the details - it was in the mail about the libstdc++ allocator change
<lifeless> what I'm saying is - symbol borkage is a qualitative change not a quantitative change
<ajmitch> bddebian: I don't know, you should check :)
* bddebian hugs ajmitch
<ajmitch> lifeless: yes, and doko generated a list of libraries that used those two symbols in any way
<ajmitch> http://lwn.net/Articles/162102/
<ajmitch> I trust him more than my explanations :)
<bddebian> Hmm, libwarped0-dev is b0rked too
<bddebian> Grr
<bddebian> Hmm, mpich is in main..  ajmitch, wanna fix that for me? :-)
<lifeless> ajmitch: right, so like I thought, local builds are fuck-fucked
<ajmitch> bddebian: why is it broken?
<lifeless> we gotta find better ways to manage this
<bddebian> ajmitch: Dunno, it's main so I didn't touch it
<bddebian> ajmitch: want me to take a look at it?
<ajmitch> bddebian: explain what needs fixed first
<bddebian> It's uninstallable
<ajmitch> which part?
<bddebian> bdefreese@bdubuntu1:~/devel/mpich$ sudo apt-get install mpich
<bddebian> Reading package lists... Done
<bddebian> Building dependency tree... Done
<bddebian> Package mpich is not available, but is referred to by another package.
<bddebian> This may mean that the package is missing, has been obsoleted, or
<bddebian> is only available from another source
<bddebian> E: Package mpich has no installation candidate
<ajmitch> uh
<ajmitch> that's not saying it's uninstallable
<bddebian> It's not?
<ajmitch> that says there's no mpich binary package
<bddebian> Which makes it uninstallable :-)
<ajmitch> but something else refers to it
<Toadstool> g'night motus :)
<bddebian> ajmitch: Yeah, libwarped0-dev
<ajmitch> ie, mpich itself is *not* broken
<ajmitch> fwiw, there's a much newer upstream version in debian
<ajmitch> that has correct dependencies
<bddebian> So get it :-)
<ajmitch> why are you telling me to? you're the one fixing it
<bddebian> Are you talking about tyvis or mpich?
<ajmitch> mpich
<ajmitch> or tyvis
<ajmitch> whichever you're working on
<bddebian> tyvis -> build-dep libwarped0-dev -> build-dep mpich
<ajmitch> so fix warped
<bddebian> mpich is a main package
<ajmitch> I just told you, mpich is *not* broken
<ajmitch> any more than x.org being broken because stuff still build-depends on xlibs-dev
<bddebian> WTF are you talking about?
<Lathiat> i think hes saying that
<Lathiat> libwarped0-dev should not b-d on mpich
<Lathiat> ?
<ajmitch> warped is broken, ok? I said that there's a newer version in debian with correct {build-,}depends
<ajmitch> mpich was split into binary & library packages
<bddebian> OK, so what is the mpich binary?
<ajmitch> apt-cache showsrc mpich
<ajmitch> Binary: libmpich1.0c2, libmpich1.0-dev, mpi-doc, libmpich-mpd1.0c2, libmpich-shmem1.0-dev, mpich-shmem-bin, libmpich-mpd1.0-dev, mpe-source, mpich-bin, mpich-mpd-bin, libmpich-shmem1.0c2
<bddebian> Ah, OK
<bddebian> Hmm, the newer warped would be a UVF exception
<ajmitch> yes, I said it was a new upstream
<bddebian> lamez0r
<bddebian> ajmitch: You know anything about the dh_iconcache thing?
<ajmitch> no
<bddebian> Well at least ajmitch still loves me :-)
<ajmitch> sure..
<bddebian> Hey LaserJock (Mr Science Team :-) ) You need to get the newer warped package from Debian :-)
<LaserJock> yeah, just reading your bug eail
<LaserJock> email even
<Kyral> hey bddebian (Mr. HURD) :P
<bddebian> Kyral: :-)
<LaserJock> I checked into that bug like a month ago
<Kyral> and I'm Mr.ArchLinux ATM lol
<LaserJock> bddebian: so a sync of libwarped would fix the problem?
<bddebian> LaserJock: It's a start.  Then need to try a rebuild of tyvis
<bddebian> Kyral: ArchLinux?
<Kyral> yah
<Kyral> I'm giving it a whirl until Dapper+1 opens :P
<LaserJock> bddebian: ok, I'll try to look at that after I finish the packaging guide tonight
<Kyral> ...there is a Hong Kong LoCoTeam right....
<bddebian> LaserJock: Well it would be a UVF exception :-(
<LaserJock> no problemo ;-)
<LaserJock> I would think fixing some unmet deps/FTBFS bugs would warrant a UVF exception.
<LaserJock> hmm, and I still need to fakesync gausssum :/
<crimsun> syncs are purportedly working again
<LaserJock> yeah?
<LaserJock> hmm, I wonder if old syncs are going to be proccessed
<LaserJock> mine was from Feb. I think
<LaserJock> darn it, stupid mem leak. I'm going to have to restart my computer soon
<LaserJock> I'll be so happy when I can wipe this install and start over.
<bddebian> Heh
<VoX> i could be wrong, but i think the ubuntu-artwork package for amd64 is having issues
<VoX> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/11650
<LaserJock> I just can't figure out how it take my computer less than a day to fill 756M of RAM and 486M of swap
<ajmitch> LaserJock: is that all?
<LaserJock> yeah, but I haven't done much of anything with the computer
<ajmitch> X & firefox are probably the top 2 reported users of ram
<ajmitch> -/+ buffers/cache:    3266376     780236
<LaserJock> X is taking 363M right now
<ajmitch> some of that is misreported by top
<Lathiat> run Xrestop
<LaserJock> Lathiat: do I need to install that? I don't find it
<crimsun>   xrestop |      0.3-3 | http://archive.ubuntu.com dapper/main Packages
<LaserJock> k, I'll install it in a sec. I'm dist-upgrading
<LaserJock> last night my computer ground to a halt after ~ 6 hrs of working
<ajmitch> that's bad
<LaserJock> all the RAM was used and it was swapping like crazy
* ajmitch has no swap setup for this box
<na7e> hi
<ajmitch> and my laptop runs just fine with only 1GB RAM :)
<ajmitch> hello
<ajmitch> by 'fine', I mean like this:
<ajmitch> -/+ buffers/cache:     906028     119064
<ajmitch> Swap:      1048568     499172     549396
<LaserJock> ajmitch: yeah, it started after one of the kernel upgrades in Jan. I think
<ajmitch> of course about 500MB of that is firefox
<VoX> ff is such a resource whore
<LaserJock> I'm not running anything but synaptic and a terminal at this point
<LaserJock> I was just finishing doc writing for the night last night when it started freezing up
<LaserJock> thank goodness I had just committed
<Lathiat> swapping seems to take 100% priority over everything else
<Lathiat> which is a bit of a bitch
<LaserJock> Lathiat: do I want pxm mem ?
<LaserJock> I'm guess this might be the problem:
<LaserJock> res-base Wins  GCs Fnts Pxms Misc   Pxm mem  Other   Total   PID Identifier
<LaserJock> 2200000    14   18    0 6689    9   668800K    984B 668800K  4954 sensors-applet
<LaserJock> 1800000    32  131    0  748   35    74075K      4K  74080K  4954 wnck-applet
<LaserJock> maybe I will just not run the sensors applet
<LaserJock> Lathiat: if that works, I'll owe you a drink ;-)
<Lathiat> :)
<Lathiat> what is the sensors applet?
<Lathiat> and yeh thats pixel map memory
<Lathiat> so that means the sensors applet is leaking pixmaps
<Lathiat> and is why your running out of rma
<Lathiat> :)
<LaserJock> that is just the temperature sensor applet I have
<LaserJock> Lathiat: you da man!!!
<Lathiat> :)
<bddebian> Are bitmaps OK for icon files?
<Se7h> not realy, too big
<Se7h> ..i guess
<LaserJock> are .xpm bitmaps?
<bddebian> Dunno, xboard only has .bm files afaict :-(
<bddebian> Is there a "generic" icon file in /usr/share/pixmap to use for apps that don't have icon files?
<Se7h> maybe a a black white paper
<Se7h> lol
<crimsun> that question was asked in the hoary dev cycle, and the conclusion is that there isn't one and that upstream should be pestered to include an appropriate icon
<Se7h> i wouldn't have said better
<Se7h> btw, question
<Se7h> can a package be release first for ubuntu then for debian?
<Gloubiboulga> Se7h, you mean, can we have a package in ubuntu which is not in debian?
<Gloubiboulga> hi btw
<Se7h> well, that i guess we can
<Se7h> hi
<Se7h> but imagina a package being release into ubuntu with version 0ubuntu1
<Se7h> what would be debians version ?
<Gloubiboulga> <version>-1
<Gloubiboulga> and the debian package will come in ubuntu during the merge/sync process of the next release I think
<Se7h> humm..ok
<Se7h> ty :)
<Gloubiboulga> no prob :)
<Se7h> ok that sucked real hard
<bddebian> crimsun: Ah OK, thx.  So any point in creating a .desktop file for a package with no icon?
<crimsun> bddebian: I think so, particularly if there was no correct menu entry prior
<bddebian> OK
<Se7h> i asked that about version, cus im packaging something for ubuntu that is being package to debian also, and i didn't want to upload nothing without being in debian first
<crimsun> just beware of the orig.tar.gz snags.
<Se7h> yes, thats what i thought about
<Se7h> o contacted him
<Se7h> i hadn't the time to check the diff en dsc files he sent, but i just want to compare where he's planning to install nad stuff...
<Se7h> *and
<Se7h> xish...i need to rest,. Slepd 5h and its 5.31am already
<Se7h> cya guys...later
<Gloubiboulga> good night Se7h
<bddebian> Yeah, better get my old arse to bed too gnight folks
<ajmitch> night bddebian
<bddebian> Gnight sweetpea ;-P
* Hobbsee waves to everyone
<Gloubiboulga> hi Hobbsee
<ajmitch> hi Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> guess i could ask for programming help here, hey..
<ajmitch> sure
<ajmitch> if you fix my code :)
<Hobbsee> hehe
<ajmitch> what's the problem?
<Hobbsee> http://online.mq.edu.au/pub/COMP155/assignments/ass2/assignment2.html
<Hobbsee> section A - characters are read from a file
<Hobbsee> the problem is, what should the condition on that loop be?  ideally, it should be "while there is something still in the file, do this"
<Hobbsee> i thought i'd had something similar written down, but i cant find it in my notes at all...
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: any idea?
<ajmitch> sorry, got distracted :)
<ajmitch> like while(!EOF) { ... } ?
<Hobbsee> i'm not sure
<Hobbsee> might work
<ajmitch> eww, inflicting c++ on 1st year students
<Hobbsee> hehe
<ajmitch> or you do while( (n=read(fd, buffer, 1) ) { ... }
<ajmitch> or similar
<ajmitch> though it's c++
<ajmitch> so I don't know if you get marked down for C-isms :)
<Hobbsee> hmmm...
<Hobbsee> first one doesnt seem to work, or i have the syntax wrong
<Hobbsee> the latter, i suspect
* Hobbsee looks on google
<zakame> hi all
<zakame> ToadZzZztool: ping
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: brilliant!  thanks!
<Hobbsee> ajmitch:     "while (! myfile.eof() )" is the syntax
* Hobbsee didnt have the myfile bit in there, or know where to put it
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: great, now write my raytracer for me ;)
<Hobbsee> hehe
<allee> ajmitch: was there already a talk (with doko?) about python2.3 mods in main to still support third party software that still depends on 2.3 (e.g. bug 37625 uninstallable and FTBFS)
<nomed> hi all
<nomed> one question ..
<nomed> i see there are many pkges that Suggests msttcorefonts ...
<nomed> that it doesn't seem available .. is this to consider a bug ?
<Tm_T> nope
<Tm_T> http://packages.ubuntu.com/breezy/x11/msttcorefonts
* Mongoose is away: /_\ zzZzZZZZzz
<pef> hello
<pef> what's the command to refresh KDE/gnome menu entries with files present in /usr/share/applications/ ?
<Toadstool> hi here
<zakame> hi al
<zakame> l
<Toadstool> heya zakame
<Toadstool> pong
<Toadstool> ;)
<zakame> heya Toadstool ! :)
<zakame> Toadstool: just to let you know, it would perhaps be better to set "Fix Committed" only if the updated package has hit the archive, "Fix Released" if it builds on all archs and is installed
<Toadstool> hum ok
<zakame> malone 38009 can anyone check the correctness of the latest patch?
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 38009 in resolvconf "Breezy -> Dapper transition needs proper /etc/resolvconf/run handling" [Normal,Needs info]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/38009
<ajmitch> hi
<lifeless> ho
<MrFaber> hi all
<MrFaber> The loop-aes-gui is back again :)
<MrFaber> -i+y
<MrFaber> Who can fix the loop-aes-source package? There is already a bug report and a possible solution since some monthes.
<MrFaber> I always have to use the debian sid loop-aes-source package to use it
<lifeless> bug 30230 ?
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 30230 in loop-aes-source "loop-aes module can't be created in Dapper Drake" [Normal,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/30230
<MrFaber> yes
<MrFaber> Just an update to debian sid package would fix it
<MrFaber> But I think that this isn't the main bug since some modules like nvidia or fglrx shows the same error
<lifeless> whats different in sid ?
<MrFaber> lifeless: don't know but it works in dapper :)
<MrFaber> I am no expert
<zul> heylo
<Hobbsee> hi
<dholbach> anybody want to pick up bug 32900?
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 32900 in gimp-gap "gimp-gap crashes when duplicating frame" [Normal,Fix committed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/32900
<bddebian> Heya gang
<Hobbsee> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Hello Hobbsee
<bddebian> dholbach: ping?
<dholbach> bddebian: pong
<bddebian> dholbach: The dh_iconcache thing.  All we have to do is add dh_iconcache to debian/rules install: ?
<dholbach> yes
<bddebian> OK, thx
<jaldhar> hmm haven't seen minghua around for a couple of days
<dolson> dholbach: good evening :) is it normal that dssi still isn't in dapper?
<dholbach> hey dolson
<dholbach> "normal"??
<dolson> well.. I don't know the word
<dholbach> the sync tool has just been fixed again
<dholbach> i'll remind elmo
<dholbach> just = yesterday
<dolson> oh ok cool. :) I didn't see some stuff get in yet so that's why I was wondering if it would make it, such as om
<dholbach> i just asked elmo again
<dholbach> don't worry, it will be done
<LaserJock> dholbach: do you know what the current status is of all those sync requests from long ago?
<bddebian> Heya LaserJock
<LaserJock> morning bddebian
<dholbach> LaserJock: no idea
<bddebian> Oohh, I'm a BugSquad member, thanks dholbach :-)
<dholbach> LaserJock: it might be best to do as the announce mail said
<dholbach> LaserJock: pitti has a script on people.u.c somewhere to make the job easier
<dholbach> bddebian: de rien :)
<dolson> argh. I want to cross-compile my app for Win32, but I can't seem to figure out what to do with mingw32
<LaserJock> dholbach: ah, thanks, I hadn't had a chance to read my email. I spent all day yesterday (about 16 hrs) working on the packaging guide
<dholbach> wow
<dholbach> WOW!
<LaserJock> well, I think it is done for now
<LaserJock> I pulled probably another 10hrs the day before
<LaserJock> my wife is about to kill me :-)
<dolson> you better kill her first! we need that doc!
<bddebian> hehe
<dolson> ( that was a joke. I do not advocate the killing of wives )
<azeem> oh, /me puts down the telephone again
<LaserJock> well, dholbach uploaded the semi-final version so everyone can take a gander in gnome-help or doc.ubuntu.com
<dolson> azeem: oh gee, you're in here too, huh?
* bddebian hugs azeem
<dolson> LaserJock:  I've already pointed a few people to it in gnome-help :D
<LaserJock> dolson: great
<azeem> dolson: ;)
<LaserJock> I really think that gnome-help is a hidden treasure now with the server guide and great desktop guide
<LaserJock> ok, I gotta go again. I've got to give a prospective grad student a tour around campus and the department :-)
<bddebian> Later LaserJock
<LaserJock> bbl
<dolson> a friend of mine installed Ubuntu, and he was impressed that everything worked, even his Broadcom wireless. I recommended him to try Dapper. a long time later, he messaged me from Windows, and had almost gave up on Ubuntu, but then I saw that new bcm driver and got him to blacklist it and he's happy again. that should be in that gnome-help stuff :)
<azeem> what does that have to do with gnome?
<dolson> what does making deb packages have to do with gnome?
<lifeless> dolson: I think you mean 'in the help system', not 'in the gnome-help stuff
<azeem> I probably misparsed "that gnome-help stuff"
<lifeless> dolson: after all, its relevant to kubuntu and xubuntu too
<azeem> and I didn't follow the discussion thoroughly :)
<dolson> I was saying gnome-help because that's what LaserJock said a couple minutes ago. I don't know where his doc and the desktop guide are if not in gnome-help as he said
<dolson> I'm not familiar with what packages or whathaveyou docs reside in
<lifeless> I'm not sure that gnome-help is the right place for them :)
<azeem> lifeless: well, if you decide to install the packaging guide, why not have it register in there?
<lifeless> azeem: register yes.
<dolson> AFAIK, the packaging guide is installed by default. and there is no package called gnome-help, so I don't know what he meant. but whatever he meant, is what I meant
<lifeless> be gnome-specific? no
<azeem> right
<azeem> dolson: are you sure it's installed by default?
<azeem> doesn't sound useful to regular users
<azeem> dolson: yelp provides gnome-help I think
<dolson> well I didn't choose to install it, but it's there
<dolson> if I go to System > Help > System Documentation, I get this: http://aslan.homelinux.com/dana/images/helptopics.png
<azeem> I see
<zakame> hi MOTUs!
<bddebian> Heya zakame
<zakame> hi bddebian! :D
<Marticus> well
<Marticus> I finally got the installation to finish
<Marticus> I think either the powernow daemon or the apm daemon was causing the system to crash
<truz24> File browser search needs an option added to the right click menu - "open location containing file"
<truz24> I'd do it myself if there werent' so much overhead getting the dev environment setup
<FunnyLookinHat> How soon will the new nvidia drivers (posted today) be put into Ubuntu repos?
<LaserJock> FunnyLookinHat: they went through dapper-changes already?
<hub> do they provide source code?
* hub runs
<LaserJock> lol
<FunnyLookinHat> I just saw they got posted on the nvidia ftp site.  Version 8756 for 64 and 32 bit
<hub> FunnyLookinHat: nothing for PowerPC?
<FunnyLookinHat> hub, doubtful..  :-/
<FunnyLookinHat> oh wait
<FunnyLookinHat> yes, they have for ppc
<LaserJock> hi jsgotangco
<jsgotangco> ahh its there right
* jsgotangco kicks tab completion
<zakame> lol
<LaserJock> jsgotangco: yeah, pbuilder/ vs pbuilerrc . gets me all the time as well
<hub> FunnyLookinHat: where?
<jsgotangco> ok pbuilderrc doesn't look like anything in your example, i will assume the lines in the guide are the ones i should add/edit
<FunnyLookinHat> hub, good question.  I'm searching the FTP site now.  All I read was in #nvidia "<KraMer> Hey everybody, new linux drivers (8756) are on nvidia ftp site now (download.nvidia.com).  32 and 64 bit.
<FunnyLookinHat> <KraMer> They're not listed on the nvidia web site yet."
<FunnyLookinHat> Sorry for spam.
<hub> FunnyLookinHat: they don't
<jsgotangco> LaserJock: APTCONFDIR is empty on mine
* hub continue advocating boycotting their products
<jsgotangco> nvidia? good call
<LaserJock> jsgotangco: on original one, right?
<jsgotangco> LaserJock: yup, i'm assuming the samples you have provided are to be edited on the original file
<jsgotangco> LaserJock: bear with me step by step if you got time
<LaserJock> jsgotangco: Those are the lines in the pbuilderrc file that (may or may not) need to be changed to suit the distro you want
<jsgotangco> LaserJock: OTHERMIRROR is commented too...
<LaserJock> right
<jsgotangco> LaserJock: yes but my point on this sweep is doing it with some knowledge
<LaserJock> sure
<jsgotangco> hence i am following your code snippets
<LaserJock> is it unclear what you are supposed to do with those lines?
<FunnyLookinHat> hub, ftp://download.nvidia.com/XFree86
<FunnyLookinHat> hub, I see 8756 listed under Linux-x86-64 and Linux-x86
<hub> so no PowerPC
<zakame> malone 38619
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 38619 in balsa "FTBFS: using deprecated GNOME_PARAM_POPT_TABLE" [Normal,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/38619
<hub> one more proof that this company do not care about its customers
<FunnyLookinHat> hub, nope, sorry.  I've never seen a PPC linux driver released from nVidia.  Seeing as how the market is like .00001% of nvidia users it really wouldn't make much snese
<FunnyLookinHat> *sense
<jsgotangco> LaserJock: i would say on the line before the example to make sure some parameters are filled up similar to the example below :
<FunnyLookinHat> hub, lol, you are such a minority though
<FunnyLookinHat> hub, Most PPC based computers (i.e. Macs) use ATI
<hub> FunnyLookinHat: you are wrong. PowerBook 12" and 17"
<hub> FunnyLookinHat: G5
<hub> etc
<FunnyLookinHat> hub, oh really?  wow, i had no idea.
<hub> FunnyLookinHat: btw neither does ATI
<FunnyLookinHat> hub, well we all know ATI sucks
<jsgotangco> LaserJock: i'll just pm you
<FunnyLookinHat> hub, well at least the powerbook I am going to buy in a year is intel based   ;)
<hub> FunnyLookinHat: get a real PC instead
<hub> the X1600 found on the MacBookPro isn't supported by ATI
<hub> there is NO driver
<FunnyLookinHat> hub, get a real PC?  why?  I already have several of those and I like powerbooks more  ^_^
<hub> because it is a better bargain
<LaserJock> hub: neither for my iMac :(
<FunnyLookinHat> hub, besides, with Boot Camp I will eventually be able to triple boot linux, OS X, and windows XP (for work)
<hub> LaserJock: exactly, I forgot the iMac
<LaserJock> I love this thing (and OSX) but I'd really like to dual boot dapper on it.
<FunnyLookinHat> LaserJock, I got my buddies HP laptop dual booting OS X and ubuntu  : )
<LaserJock> well, I need to go the other way around unfortunately
<FunnyLookinHat> :-/
<hub> somehow I feel that distribution should stop shipping that kind of crashware. not and easy decision, but I think it would be best for everybody to pressure the manufacturers
<na7e> Yeah, i'm probably going to buy a mac this year
<na7e> purely for the osx goodness with the ability to do .net development
<jaldhar> .oO(doesn't ubuntu let you do .net development?)
<G0SUB> jaldhar: mono
<FunnyLookinHat> but even with XGL ubuntu isn't enough eye candy for na7e
<jaldhar> G0SUB: exactly.  I started using it recently and it's really coming along.  Even winforms stuff
* jaldhar is doing his MCSD again -- don't ask
<G0SUB> jaldhar: have you tried dotGNU?
<jaldhar> G0SUB: no. not yet
<G0SUB> jaldhar: wasn't it supposed to be classified ?
<jaldhar> G0SUB: in what way?
<bddebian> MCSD.. w00t :-)
<G0SUB> jaldhar: MCSD and you
<jsgotangco> show me the money
<jsgotangco> heh
<jaldhar> unfortunately all you linux hippies aren't paying my rent
<G0SUB> jaldhar: hehe
<zakame> lol
<bddebian> jaldhar: Heh, I know that feeling too :-)
<jsgotangco> lol
<jaldhar> but I've had a little success with the "hire me and I'll help you get from windows to Linux" angle.  Pure linux jobs are still pretty rare
<G0SUB> jaldhar: but why MCSD? does it have any value now?
<G0SUB> I have no idea if firms still hire MCSDs
<G0SUB> what about RHCA, etc. ?
<jaldhar> G0SUB: not an awful lot but it gives me some structure in efforts to learn c# and I'm sure some people are impressed by it
<LaserJock> some people are impressed by any acronym ;-)
<G0SUB> LaserJock: lol
<jaldhar> G0SUB: I'm an RHCE too and that does impress people but there aren't a lot of pure linux jobs in the USA
<LaserJock> LASER  for instance ;-)
<bddebian> Yeah, I alway append WTF and BFD to my business cards ;-P
<bddebian> Err always even
<jsgotangco> lol
<G0SUB> LaserJock: Light Amplification by Stimulated Emission of Radiation
<jaldhar> people are slowly introducing it into their business but not comitting to it.
<LaserJock> G0SUB: heck yeah, now that's what I'm talking about.
<G0SUB> LaserJock: what's Jock?
<zakame> hm
<G0SUB> LaserJock: is that a contraction of Jordan?
<LaserJock> talking about certification, I finally got my Laser Safety Certification yesterday (after 4 years of using the laser and being the lab laser safety officer)
<jsgotangco> wow you get to have a laser gun?
* jsgotangco hides
<G0SUB> LaserJock: btw, do you have any idea about the personal LASIK machines?
<G0SUB> LaserJock: http://www.lasikathome.com/
<zakame> hmm Ubuntu and Laser in one
<jsgotangco> G0SUB: those look scary
<LaserJock> heh, mines bigger ;-)
<jsgotangco> is it red yellow or green? heh
<jsgotangco> or blue
<LaserJock> G0SUB: btw, jock is slang for enthusiast or very interested in, something like that
<LaserJock> jsgotangco: I can make any color between UltraViolet and Infrared
<LaserJock> right now it is mostly red and UV
* jsgotangco shows kungfu moves against LaserJock's laser
* LaserJock lasers off jsgotangco's feet, no more kungfu from you ;-)
<bddebian> hehe
<jsgotangco> those things can cut?
<LaserJock> CO2 laser cut through metal, very fast
* jsgotangco wonders why they're not used for convential warfare
<LaserJock> but my laser only burns through paper mostly
<jsgotangco> pfftt
<LaserJock> jsgotangco: friendly fire
<crimsun> Lathiat: I'll address bug #38546 tonight
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 38546 in linux-source-2.6.15 "Add hp_only quirk for pci id [1106:3059]  to via82xx ALSA driver" [Normal,In progress]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/38546
<LaserJock> jsgotangco: but I can drill holes through glass with mine :-)
<zakame> heh
<jsgotangco> yeah but i'm carbon based and definitely thicker than glass
<jsgotangco> err what kind of glass hehe
<zakame> buwahaha
<LaserJock> Fused Silica
<LaserJock> about 1in thik
<LaserJock> thick
<LaserJock> our Postdoc drilled a hole through a $500USD optic one time, grrr
<LaserJock> and later exploded our lab :(
<LaserJock> but I wasn't around then, I believe he went into Computer Science after that :-)
<jsgotangco> APT::Get::AllowUnauthenticated 1;
<jsgotangco> jsg@ubuntu:/etc$
<jsgotangco> ooppss
<zakame> gn8 all!
<zakame> er ETIME
<LaserJock> cya zakame
<zakame> thanks LaserJock :D
<FunnyLookinHat> So, nobody knows the ETA on getting nvidia 8756 drivers into repos?
<LaserJock> umm, let me put it this way. I wouldn't hold my breath
<FunnyLookinHat> LaserJock, Feature Freeze isn't going to hold it up from being past June 1, is it??
<FunnyLookinHat> oh please say no, that would be really sad.
<LaserJock> I would say proper testing, etc. would hold it up. I don't think we usually get the nvidia driver as soon as they come out
<LaserJock> you have to see how many changes were made, etc.
<FunnyLookinHat> Ahh ok.  Well it's a huge release, version 1.0, etc.  I guess I'll just cross my fingers.
<phanatic> hi people
<Gloubiboulga> hey phanatic :)
<bddebian> Hello phanatic
<phanatic> hello Gloubiboulga and bddebian :)
<perli> i've uploaded a package of gPodder, a podcast catcher to REVU. if anyone wants to have a look at it and give some feedback, I'd be happy :) http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2249
<phanatic> hi raphink
<LaserJock> raphink: hi!
<Gloubiboulga> perli, your source package has no .diff.gz, and no .orig.tar.gz
<LaserJock> yikes, does it have anything?
<Gloubiboulga> yes, a .tar.gz, with a nice debian/ dir in it :)
<crimsun> accidentally native?
<Gloubiboulga> perli, you're the author I think?
<perli> yes
<Gloubiboulga> then it'll be easy to fix this
<perli> shouldn't i have a debian directory in the original source if it can be provided by me (aka upstream)?
<Gloubiboulga> you have to use a source tarball without the debian/dir
<Gloubiboulga> perli, no
<Gloubiboulga> we usually have a debian dir in the sources when it's a debian/ubuntu specific app
<Gloubiboulga> which is not the case here
<LaserJock> perli: it is recommended to separate the debian/ directory so that it is easier to deal with in the future
<perli> so i remove the debian dir and use it only for package building?
<Gloubiboulga> perli, yep
<perli> and when i want to sync upstream source to package, do i rename it to the .orig.tar.gz name?
<Gloubiboulga> and you'll have to change your tarball name to <package>_<version>.orig.tar.gz
<perli> so i then have this <package>_<version>.orig.tar.gz, i extract it to <package>_<version>, put in the debian dir and then create the source and binary packages? or is there an easier way?
<LaserJock> once it is done, then it is easier
<Gloubiboulga> it's the way I use, except that extracted dir is names <package>-<version>
<Gloubiboulga> s/names/named
<perli> do i get the debian directory for free after the first copy because it creates a .diff ?
<Gloubiboulga> sorry, I don't understand your question... my english has some limits :/
<perli> what i mean is how do i proceed if a new upstream version (or rather update) gets in? do i have to delete everything, extract source and copy the debian directory into it? guess it's easier?
<crimsun> uupdate does that
<perli> oh :) ok.. thanks for the hint :)
<perli> will use that and your suggestions to re-upload
<perli> any other things you've found that are not correct?
<Gloubiboulga> hmm, yes
<Gloubiboulga> in debian/changelog, one entry is enough, since it'll be the first ubuntu release
<Gloubiboulga> (I suppose it's not in debian yet)
<Gloubiboulga> and the version should be 0.7+svn20060407-0ubuntu1
<perli> no, it's not in debian yet. found that the REVU thing might be the most helpful place to start ;)
<Gloubiboulga> true :)
<perli> so while i'm uploading packages to REVU, i don't have to change the version or release number?
<Gloubiboulga> and the distro is dapper :)
<perli> ok
<Gloubiboulga> nop, just keep the same version until it's uploaded
<Gloubiboulga> we use dabhelper compat=5 in dapper, so you can update the compat file and the debhelper version
<Gloubiboulga> about the copyright, you may want to use the header proposed by the FSF in your source files
<Gloubiboulga> see http://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl.html#SEC4
<perli> ok :)
<Gloubiboulga> and you'll just have to copy it in debian/copyright
<perli> lots of bureaucracy, i see =)
<Gloubiboulga> kind of, but that's important :)
<Gloubiboulga> I'm building the package
<perli> another question: is it possible to build packages for ubuntu on a debian testing/unstable release or is the best bet doing it directly in ubuntu?
<perli> i currently build the packages on a freshly installed breezy machine, but that's not my development machine
<Gloubiboulga> the best way is to build your package using pbuilder or equivalent
<Gloubiboulga> to build the .debs I mean
<Gloubiboulga> but you can do it on debian or ubuntu, it doesn't matter
<Gloubiboulga> your package builds and works fine :)
<perli> which version of debhelper should be specified?
<Gloubiboulga> I set >=5.0.0
<hub> has anyone ever tried to package freepascal?
<bddebian> hub: I did once
<hub> and?
<hub> it will need manual boostraping
<hub> as it is self-compiling
<perli> Standards-Version: 3.6.2 is okay?
<LaserJock> perli: apt-cache show debian-policy| grep Version
<LaserJock> is the current version
<bddebian> hub: Yep :-(
<bddebian> Actually maybe it's still on REVU? :-)
<perli> ok, thanks LaserJock
<hub> bddebian: oh. I don't remember to have seen it
<hub> checking again
<hub> bddebian: I don't see it there
<hub> ah yeah found it
<perli> what should the README.Debian file include?
<LaserJock> usually it should be removed
<LaserJock> unless there is something specific to Debian/Ubuntu
<perli> ok
<LaserJock> perli: you might find http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/appendix-examples.html helpful
<Gloubiboulga> LaserJock, in http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/basic-scratch.html, I think there's a tiny problem
<LaserJock> only one?
<Gloubiboulga> you set the hello package version to 2.1.1-1
<LaserJock> yeah
<LaserJock> I think it is ok, I discuss versioning later
<Gloubiboulga> why don't you use the -ubuntuX version?
<Gloubiboulga> ah ok
<Gloubiboulga> I have not read everything yet
<Gloubiboulga> no problem then ;)
<LaserJock> the reason I didn't use -ubuntuX was because there isn't one in the repos (we just have the Debian source) and I didn't want to deviate too much from the source package you get from "apt-get source hello"
<LaserJock> I sort of wish it did have an -ubuntuX version but it doesn't
<Gloubiboulga> that's a good reason
<Gloubiboulga> I should try to build a package from scratch once
<cbx33> Hi all
<cbx33> Hi LaserJock
<pef> hi cbx33
<bddebian> Hello cbx33
<cbx33> hi pef bddebian :p
<cbx33> I think i found a bug I can actually fix
<cbx33> I'm gonna try tomorrow
<cbx33> and hopefully submit my first bugfix
<Gloubiboulga> that's good news cbx33 :)
<cbx33> yeh, my question is this :p
<cbx33> i need some kinda help on workflow - i know everyone has their own way of doing things
<cbx33> I have a chroot, my normal installation and pbuilder all setup
<cbx33> so
<cbx33> how do i work it -
<cbx33> install the package in the chroot, see how it breaks then modify source, uninstall, reinstall ???
<LaserJock> hi cbx33
<cbx33> then put together a list of changes and build the debdiff?
<cbx33> Hey LaserJock d'ya get my mails....
<cbx33> I don;t have too much time tonight....but i should have some time to try out things tomorrow
<LaserJock> yes, I think so. It's been kinda hectic
<cbx33> was trying to get all the information so i can try things tomorrow
<LaserJock> yeah, so you:
<LaserJock> fix the bug (in your chroot or whatever)
<LaserJock> make patches or fixes in the downloaded source package
<LaserJock> add changelog entry
<cbx33> what happens if it's a test of installing the package?
<cbx33> like a change to the rules file etc?
<LaserJock> a build-deps problem?
<cbx33> for example
<cbx33> or just simply a change to the pre/post scripts
<LaserJock> if you know how to fix the problem just apt-get the source package, make changes, add changelog, rebuild source package (debuild -S), build .deb with pbuilder, install and test
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> i see
<cbx33> well I'll try tomorroe
<cbx33> i think there was a problem I emailed you about....ah yes i remember now.....was to do with locales and mysql
<cbx33> i'll probably have to go in a few mins
<LaserJock> oh yeah
<cbx33> but I'll be aroudn tomorrow if you someone could possibly give me a hand there
<LaserJock> I've had problems with locals in chroots
<cbx33> ok...just ignore it?
<cbx33> mysql was funny though refuesd to start.....can the chroot open up ports and run servies? - there was no mysql running on the local host machine
<Gloubiboulga> 'night
<tseng> running services in chroot can be interesting
<tseng> youll want to look for a doc on running mysql in chroot
<LaserJock> I remember now. the problem is sometimes there is a difference between the chroot locals and the locals on your computer
<cbx33> tseng, ok
<cbx33> LaserJock, I see.....easy fix?
<LaserJock> I use and alias now to get rid of the warnings: alias dchroot-dapper="LC_ALL=C dchroot -d"
<tseng> you could just install the locales in chroot for that
<cbx33> possibly include info in the docs
<LaserJock> tseng: I did
<cbx33> damn it, the package i was testing relied on mysql
<cbx33> grr
<cbx33> nevermind I'll try again tomorrow - possibly pick another easy bug fix
<cbx33> is running apache in a chroot just as difficult?
<LaserJock> I have no idea. I haven't run those types of things
<LaserJock> I've just run Gnome and X apps
<cbx33> ok
<LaserJock> heh, right now I'm running gnome-session in my chroot over ssh ;-)
<cbx33> and presumably none of your apps have relied on those :p
<cbx33> hahah
* cbx33 will see you all tomorrow
<cbx33> nn
<LaserJock> and I just started up KDE
<bddebian> Later cbx33
<LaserJock> cya cbx33
<cbx33> bye bddebian LaserJock
<pygi> meebey, around?
<pygi> who is here in charge of Monodevelop package? :)
<LaserJock> pygi: nobody is in charge of any one package. Universe is team maintained
<pygi> bah, yes, I know, I was joking, notice the ":)"
<LaserJock> ah, sorry. the :) slipped by me ;-)
<pygi> LaserJock: who can update the Universe package, if I ask for UVFe, and get it?
<LaserJock> pygi: well, any MOTU (ubuntu-dev LP team) can upload to Universe
<pygi> LaserJock: thanks
<LaserJock_away> np
* pygi asks someone kindly to package monodevelop 0.10? :)
<slomo> pygi: i care for it currently ;)
<pygi> slomo: update it preety, preety please? :) I'll ask for UVFe? :)
<slomo> pygi: and i'm waiting for debian for 0.10... should be finished this weekend :) and then i'll ask for a uvf exception, need some testers and we're all happy ;)
<slomo> pygi: could you give me your mail address so i can tell you when i have something to test?
<pygi> slomo: mario dot danic at gmail dot com
<slomo> thanks
<pygi> How much testers you need? lemme find some :)
<pygi> slomo, still alive? :)
<slomo> hm... i have 5 now... that should be enough :)
<pygi> slomo: ah, ok :)
#ubuntu-motu 2006-04-13
<ajmitch> morning
<pygi> morning ajmitch
<LaserJock> hi ajmitch
<Se7h> LaserJock quick question, when ls -l cant read the content of some dir ,does that means is corrupted?
<ajmitch> or permission denied
<Se7h> hi btw
<ajmitch> hello
<Se7h> ma bad...not the content...it just 'cant' read its info
<Se7h> ?---------  ? ?    ?            ?                ? /media/icy_more/downloads <- to be more specific
<ajmitch> interesting
<Se7h> very lol
<ajmitch> empty permissions set
<ajmitch> what's with the ? in there?
<Se7h> i dunno, some dirs there are like that, and i just hope its not curropted
<Se7h> *corrupted
<ajmitch> possibly
<ajmitch> what fs is it?
<Se7h> ext3
<crimsun> Lathiat: ping
<Se7h> no
<Se7h> fat sorry
<ajmitch> fsck it
<ajmitch> ah
<ajmitch> fat is more likely to corrupt, and it doesn't have permissions anyway
<ajmitch> check the mount options
<Se7h> its normal like the other partitions
<LaserJock> hi Se7h (belated)
<LaserJock> and I have no idea
<Se7h> ajmitch any idea?
<Se7h> besides corruption
<ajmitch> nope
<ajmitch> I rarely use fat
<Se7h> well, i do in this case cus its external, and i need to be able to access it on other machines
<crimsun> Lathiat: sorry, unping
<ajmitch> crimsun: it would have been an optimistic ping
<dholbach> good night
<crimsun> night daniel
<pygi> night dholbach
<dholbach> night guys :)
<ajmitch> night dholbach
<Se7h> motus question
<Se7h> one package depending on gtk has to have a 'libx11' build-dep ?
<LaserJock> Se7h: I don't quite understand the question?
<Se7h> one app depending on gtk2
<Se7h> on build-deps needs to have libx11 for example besides libgtk ?
<crimsun> no
<crimsun> apt-cache depends libgtk2.0-dev |grep x11 Depends: libx11-dev
<Se7h> crimsun yes i know, but some debian packager send me a source package for debian witch im packaging for ubuntu, and his had all X libs in it...
<Se7h> the doubt came
<Se7h> didn't make much sense tho
<crimsun> Se7h: then keep his version, but submit a patch to BTS for debian/control
<crimsun> those differences are best minimised in Ubuntu to avoid unnecessary deltas
<Se7h> crimsun cant i just suggest him to change that for himself? (since it hasnt been uploaded yet)
<crimsun> Se7h: certainly
<crimsun> he should know that as a Debian maintainer/developer
<Se7h> yes, when i saw his package it looked a little odd...but could be some wierd rule or something...i dunno
<bddebian> Heya Gang
<LaserJock> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Heya LaserJock
<crimsun> lo bddebian, LaserJock
<LaserJock> hiya crimsun
<Se7h> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Heya crimsun, Se7h
<crimsun> 'lo Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> hey crimsun
<Hobbsee> what am i going to do today?
<crimsun> taking over the world
<crimsun> err, take over the world
<bddebian> "they're pinky and the brain"..
<Hobbsee> ooh that could be fun
<bddebian> Hello Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> hey bddebian
<bddebian> bbiam
<zul> bddebian: thats one of my favorite cartoons of all time too bad its not on anymore
<bddebian> zul: :-)
<zul> narf!
<bddebian> hehe
<bddebian> So if desktop-file-validate just dumps back to the CL, it's OK?
<crimsun> echo $?
<bddebian> echo, echo, echo...
<bddebian> Heya slomo_
<persia> bddebian: Yes, as all good tools, desktop-file-validate is silent when successful.
<bddebian> heh
<bddebian> Hello persia
<persia> Hello bddebian.
<crimsun> bddebian: I meant that if it's 0, yes, it's ok.
<bddebian> crimsun: :-)
<Unfrgiven> LaserJock: hey dude
<Unfrgiven> hi everyone... needed a hand with packaging a kernel module. im trying to get the rules file right atm. before running make clean, i need to set the KERNELPATH environment variable to the path of the kernel headers. i tried doing a "export KERNELPATH=$(KSRC)" but $(KSRC) is empty! does anyone here know what var i should be using?
<LaserJock> Unfrgiven: hi, got your email. thanks
<Unfrgiven> LaserJock: i got yours to ubuntu-devel. so doc freeze is in force now?
<bddebian> Unfrgiven: Is it set somewhere?  A kernel source path is just going to be there I wouldn't think?
<Unfrgiven> bddebian: well i can't see where it is being set but the rules file that dh_make generated refers to $(KSRC) all over the place. so I assumed it was being set. do i just need to hardcode it?
<bddebian> Hmm, is kernel-headers a build-dep?  Maybe it sets it?
<Unfrgiven> bddebian: i set the dep to linux-headers-2.6.15-20 in control. now there is a control.modules.in which i gather is supposed to generate a control file, but i dont know how to get it to generate the file.
<Unfrgiven> bddebian: correction, i set the build-dep to linux-headers-2.6.15-20
<bddebian> Unfrgiven: I'm just grasping at straws, I don't really know :-(
<LaserJock> Unfrgiven: it is, but I can make small changes ok
<Unfrgiven> bddebian: i dont want to bug the team in ubuntu-devel, im sure they're busy enough. do you know anyone else that might know?
<bddebian> Unfrgiven: If you do "echo $KSRC" do you get anything?
<Unfrgiven> LaserJock: cool!
<Unfrgiven> bddebian: nup, tried it
<Unfrgiven> bddebian: i actually put a bunch of echos in the rules file itself. the value is empty
<bddebian> Is this fixing an existing package or a totally new package?
<Unfrgiven> bddebian: totally new
<bddebian> KSRC=/lib/modules/`uname -r`/build ?
<bddebian> That's not right
<Unfrgiven> bddebian: no, its more likely to be KSRC=/usr/src/linux-headers-$VERSION
<bddebian> though it does look like you either need to call it like:  "debian/rules build KSRC=/foo/bar" or maybe statically define it in the urles file
<Unfrgiven> bddebian: but im using dpkg-buildpackage to build the source package. so maybe i have to pass in the parameter to dpkg-buildpackage?
<bddebian> I would think that or statically define it in rules.
<Unfrgiven> bddebian: it looks like thats the way to do it.
<bddebian> Unfrgiven: Excellent
<bddebian> ajmitch:  You around?
<ajmitch> maybe
<bddebian> ajmitch: Never mind I think I figured it out.  I was looking at firestarter
<ajmitch> OK
<bddebian> Though I'm sure it's WRONG ;-P
<bddebian> Damnit, why is this dpatch not applying :-(
<bddebian> ajmitch: When doing dpatch-edit-patch, do I need to run debian/rules patch before patching?
<LaserJock> doesn't dpatch-edit-patch apply the patch before you start editing
<bddebian> I thought so but firestarter.desktop.in didn't have the 01_patch.dpatch applied which is why I think mine is failing :-(
<ajmitch> bddebian: what's in debian/patches/00list ?
<bddebian> ajmitch: Patches :-)
<bddebian> ajmitch: Sorry, couldn't resist.  You want to know the contents of the file?
<ajmitch> yes
<bddebian> 01_use_gksu
<bddebian> 03_xpm_icon
<bddebian> 05_remove_INSTALL_from_README
<bddebian> 06_dot_not_hyphen
<bddebian> 09_fix_ip_up
<bddebian> 10_dhcp_hook
<bddebian> 11_desktop_file
<ajmitch> uh
<bddebian> 11_desktop_file is the one I just made
<ajmitch> right
<ajmitch> and what is failing?
<bddebian> Mine  11_desktop..
<bddebian> applying patch 11_desktop_file to ./ ... failed.
<ajmitch> so check why it's failing :)
<ajmitch> if the others are being applied before that, they should show up
<bddebian> Oh, fixed it, that was dump
<bddebian> Err dumb even
<ajmitch> and you can play around with stuff like 'dpatch apply-all --verbose'
<ajmitch> ok
<ajmitch> what did you break?
<persia> bddebian: When I have that trouble, I usually discover that another path is modifying the file I wish to change.  In this case it is 01_use_gksu.dpatch.
<bddebian> As I said, the previous patches weren't applied.. As persia just pointed out :_)
<havoc> evening people
<havoc> long time, no see
<ajmitch> hi
<havoc> ajmitch: hiya :)
<bddebian> Hello havoc
<havoc> so, chillywilly may get his way; I think I'm going ubuntu all the way
<bddebian> w000t :-)
<havoc> at least on the non-in-production-already machines
<havoc> those will have to get switched later
<havoc> so what's the latest?
<Se7h> im sleepy
<truz24> word
<persia> bddebian: If you are in a .desktop uploading mood, I'd be more than happy to point you to more patches.  #38669 being one of the latest.
<LaserJock> hi minghua
<minghua> hi LaserJock
<bddebian> persia: That's all I have been doing lately :-)
<bddebian> Hello minghua
<minghua> hi bddebian
<havoc> so release date is coming up?
<havoc> ok, so what exactly is edubuntu?
<persia> bddebian: Well then: #32380, #32756, #38669, #36367, #33558, #33562 are all mostly ready to go, if you'd be willing :)  Any feedback would be welcome.
<bddebian> persia: OK, I won't be able to get to them tonight but I'll check them out.  Thanks!
<havoc> seems to be targeted at kids/schools
<persia> Ah, right.  My apologies: I forget about timezones.
<LaserJock> havoc: well, I think most any educational setting. I think Edubuntu Dapper+1 will have more university level apps as well
<bddebian> persia: No worries :-)
<havoc> LaserJock: I'm just curious
<havoc> not going to actually run it
<LaserJock> me too ;-)
<havoc> so what's the actual dapper release date?
<LaserJock> June 1st I think
<havoc> chillywilly: catch that?
<havoc> I've been checking out the sites and couldn't find mention of it anywhere
<chillywilly> June?!?
<LaserJock> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DapperReleaseSchedule
<chillywilly> doesn't that break the 6 month release cycle?
<LaserJock> yeah
<chillywilly> bah...
<LaserJock> it was pushed by 6 weeks
<LaserJock> that was a while ago
<chillywilly> might as well go with debian then ;) j/k!!!
* bddebian kicks chillywilly :-)
<chillywilly> hey everyone
<chillywilly> Brokeback Mountain is now on DVD
<LaserJock> hi Gloubiboulga
<Gloubiboulga> hi LaserJock
<elkbuntu> chillywilly, it does break the 6mth release, but dapper is going to have a 5yr support life rather than 18month support life. it needs to be really polished and uptodate
<chillywilly> excuses.... ;) I need my 6 month ubuntu crack fix ;)
<LaserJock> I do wish it wasn't needed, the solid 6 month release schedule seems to be a major selling point
<LaserJock> I personally don't care
<bddebian> chillywilly: Wow, thanks I'll rush out and buy that one.. ;-P
<chillywilly> bddebian: you know you will :)
<bddebian> he
<bddebian> h
<chillywilly> man I am struggling to keep my eyes open
<bddebian> Yeah I gotta get to bed myself
<chillywilly> yea the wife needs some lovin' ;)
<chillywilly> GIT-R-DONE
<bddebian> Heh, I wish.  Mine's been asleep for a few hours already :-)
<chillywilly> mine too
<chillywilly> they don't like to be woken with something stabbing them in the back now do they?
<chillywilly> ok, I am just getting bad...
<bddebian> hehe
<bddebian> I was going to say worse but I already say too much in these channels :-)
<chillywilly> haha
<havoc> chillywilly is a "poker" ;)
<chillywilly> hahahaha
<havoc> yup, bedtime
<chillywilly> peace
* chillywilly props his eye lids open with tooth picks
<Hobbsee> heh
<Hobbsee> that tends to work well!
<Hobbsee> why not just sleep now?
<ajmitch> heh
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: hey dude
<ajmitch> hi Unfrgiven
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: how r u
<ajmitch> good, how are you?
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: good good
<ajmitch> been busy?
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: not as much lately. hence im trying to get back into motu work
<ajmitch> ah right
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: been working with laserjock on the packaging guide
<ajmitch> bddebian: firestarter uses gksu now?
<ajmitch> Unfrgiven: great to hear :)
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: say you wouldnt happen to have any experience with building packages for kernel modules would you?
<ajmitch> nope
<ajmitch> never had the need
* Hobbsee waves to ajmitch 
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: bummer. ive been working on building packages for the madwifi-ng drivers. for two reasons. 1. To learn more about advanced packaging and 2. the madwifi driver in linux-restricted-modules is broken. it has a huge memory leak and brings down your machine as soon as you start copying files.
<ajmitch> hi Hobbsee
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: the madwifi-ng drivers resolve this. they're the next generation of madwifi drivers.
<ajmitch> and the madwifi-ng drivers have several other problems, afaik
<ajmitch> they were considered for dapper
<bddebian> ajmitch: yes, shouldn't it?
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: ive got it to the stage where the modules are built and installable for 386. but im trying to find out a way to build packages for other platforms in one hit.
<ajmitch> bddebian: "gksu is a frontend to su and gksudo is a frontend to sudo"
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: oh really? well they resolve the problems on my machine. so im just making packages for personal use (and for anyone else that wants to use them).
<ajmitch> bddebian: so is gksu what you really wanted?
<bddebian> ajmitch: There were two bugs filed requesting it..
<bddebian> OK, I REALLY have to go to bed now
<bddebian> ajmitch: If it's wrong, please let me know
<bddebian> Gnight folks
<ajmitch> night
<chillywilly> ajmitch:!
<ajmitch> yes?
<chillywilly> hi
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: have u had any experience with build platform specific packages then?
<chillywilly> don't act like you don't know me
<ajmitch> Unfrgiven: not sure what you mean
<chillywilly> we've been through too much to be acting like this
<ajmitch> chillywilly: hello
<chillywilly> hehe
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: what i mean is packages that are different for i386 vs amd64. different build-depends, etc.
<chillywilly> ajmitch: just to warn you I've had little sleep and am feeling a bit loopy :)
<chillywilly> lock up you wife and daughter, chillywilly is on the loose
<ajmitch> Unfrgiven: right, that is possible, but I haven't needed to do it
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: sorry id like to bug you with another question :) some packages have *.in files that are used to generate other files. e.g. control.in might be used to generate control - do you know regenerate the target file once i make a change to a *.in file?
<ajmitch> debian/rules does
<ajmitch> well
<ajmitch> it should only do it in targets not run at build time
<chillywilly> you are the packaging God
<chillywilly> all bow to ajmitch
* robotgeek bows
<ajmitch> chillywilly: your comments are not helping
* chillywilly lays prostrate in admiration
* ajmitch is leaving
<chillywilly> nooooo
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: ok thanks. ill take a look!
<robotgeek> can anyone tell me why freenx not in dapper?
<chillywilly> is it FOSS?
<LaserJock> I thought so, but perhaps not
<womble> I think it was FOSS'd *very* recently, which would mean that it missed UVF
<robotgeek> gpled, http://freenx.berlios.de/
<robotgeek> i think the server was gpled since a long time, even before the freeze
<robotgeek> Seveas has a few debs built, and i was able to build it on ppc too.
<womble> Hmm, there's no dates for initial release.  robotgeek, I'd say the reason it's not in Dapper is because (a) it's not in Debian (and there's also no noise in WNPP), and (b) Nobody has packaged in specifically for Ubuntu.
<Unfrgiven> robotgeek: I found Seveas's packages very buggy. not sure if it was a problem in freenx or the packaging itself. my problem was that I could never resume an existing session. on resume, the client would only display a black screen. if i killed the client my session would be killed too.
<LaserJock> heh, I could never even connect, ever :(
<robotgeek> Unfrgiven: apart from the session resume, everything works fine for me
<Unfrgiven> robotgeek: well the session resume is quite a vital feature of freenx. perhaps not to you but to many potential users. we can't exactly ship something so broken.
<robotgeek> Unfrgiven: true
<LaserJock> vnc4 is uninstallable so...
<Unfrgiven> robotgeek: is it perhaps just a case where seveas needs to update his/her repository with a newer (hopefully less buggy) codebase?
<jmg> hey all
<jmg> :)
<robotgeek> Unfrgiven: i'll ping Seveas (this must do it)
<Unfrgiven> Currently I'm using a tightvncserver which starts a session on startup. it does the job for me. yes its laggy but its better than nothing
<jmg> anyone got a link to the .config used for linux-image?
<Unfrgiven> jmg: check out /boot/config-<VERSION>
<jmg> Unfrgiven: thanks
<Unfrgiven> jmg: np
<Unfrgiven> robotgeek: yeah good idea.
<robotgeek> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDownUnder/BOFs/FasterNetworkedX Unfrgiven :)
<robotgeek> wiki has everything :)
<Unfrgiven> robotgeek: im not sure what im looking for here? although im intrigued by this so called Xdamage for vnc
<robotgeek> Unfrgiven: if it did not make it in, it probably is because of poor code quality :)
<Unfrgiven> robotgeek: that was for breezy. i think i actually attended that Bof too! i would think that things would've changed for the better by now. but i guess maybe not
<whiprush> whoa
<whiprush> hi Unfrgiven!!
<Unfrgiven> whiprush: woah! hey! :)
<whiprush> long time
<whiprush> how are things?
<Unfrgiven> yeah its been a while
<Unfrgiven> things are good. how r u?
<whiprush> good good.
<Unfrgiven> im always reading ur blogs on planet ubuntu. its been a while since u had a "whats new in dapper post"
<whiprush> yeah, i need to do that.
<whiprush> my blog has been busted on planet lately though
<Unfrgiven> yeah i noticed that too. i thought maybe u write xml for fun these days? ;)
<whiprush> heh no, I need to ping jeff about it
<whiprush> works on other planets but ubuntu
<whiprush> *shrug*
<Unfrgiven> whiprush: seems like dapper has more visibility atm than any previous ubuntu release!
<whiprush> yeah, it's really shaping up.
<whiprush> seems like the community continues to double in size.
<Unfrgiven> gotta say cheers to matthew garrett for putting xgl + compiz into flight4.... that move alone has grown our userbase by tons
<whiprush> yeah, there are seperate repos and stuff by community people too
<whiprush> in fact, i just listened to the novell podcast.
<whiprush> the guy was interviewing the XGL guy
<Unfrgiven> david r?
<whiprush> and one of his comments was "wow, the ubuntu guys really jumped onto this."
<whiprush> yep
<whiprush> google for "novell open audio"
<whiprush> first link
<whiprush> it's a good interview btw...
<Unfrgiven> given the fact that there is so much interest for community repos atm, should we use this as a way to push the notion of bzr repos in launchpad?
<Unfrgiven> its really a good oppurtunity to get some much needed visibility there
<whiprush> it sounds nice
<whiprush> but even on the forums, there are like 4 xgl repos.
<whiprush> kinda messy
<whiprush> wish they would have been working with something more motu friendly.
<Unfrgiven> such as?
<whiprush> well, there are a bunch of repos that are external.
<Unfrgiven> whiprush: where can i find out more about these external repos? perhaps we can get some of these other repos to use ours?
<whiprush> Unfrgiven: look in the sticky threads on the dapper forum on ubuntu forums...
<Unfrgiven> whiprush: i thought u meant we offer external repos... what i was asking is how can we get them to make their packages more MOTU friendly? perhaps we can talk to em
<whiprush> Unfrgiven: sec, chatting with family...
<Unfrgiven> whiprush: np
<Toadstool> heya MOTUs
<carthik> a belated hi, Toadstool! from a non-motu who is half-awake.
<Toadstool> hi carthik ;)
<carthik> :)
* carthik hates hanging heyas
<Seveas> Unfrgiven, that is a problem with freenx itself
<Seveas> Unfrgiven, it's supposedly solved in 0.5.0 betas but they only work on Dapper
<phanatic> hi people
<perli> hello! i've uploaded a revised package of gpodder to ubuntu's REVU - maybe someone has time to look into it? http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2250
<Hobbsee> siretart: ping?
<phanatic> perli: i'm building it right now
<armine> Hi everybody !
<phanatic> hi armine
<armine> fine ?
<siretart> Hobbsee: pong
<Hobbsee> siretart: i hear you're good on libraries - got time for a newbie packager's question?
<Hobbsee> [19:46]  <Hobbsee> libmysqlclient15's been replaced by libmysqlclient15off, and some packages, including amarok, are still calling for libmysqlclient15
<Hobbsee> [19:46]  <Hobbsee> in the shdepends, it seems
<zakame> hi all
<siretart> Hobbsee: err, what do you mean with 'calling'?
<Hobbsee> needing it to be installed/depending on it
<azeem> those need to be transitioned
<siretart> Hobbsee: if they use the shlibs mechanism, the package just needs to be rebuilt. shlibs will calculate the proper binary package dependency for you
<phanatic> hi zakame
<Hobbsee> shlibs is mentioned in the control file - i'm not sure if thats' what you mean or not.  libmysqlclient15-dev is a build dep, and i'm presuming it's trying to install libmysqlclient15 as a shlibs depend.  trouble is, there's no libmysqlclient15off-dev to change it to, so it all works nicely
* Hobbsee always seems to get confused with this sort of stuff!
<zakame> hello phanatic
<Hobbsee> siretart: if you're meaning using dh_makeshlibs, it errors out with http://pastebin.com/647584
<siretart> Hobbsee: dh_makeshlibs creates you an shlibs file. you need it only in packages which create shared libs
<Hobbsee> ah...right...
<siretart> Hobbsee: I think amarok does not state an explicit build dependency on libmysqlclient15, but has a field ${shlibs:Depends}
<siretart> Hobbsee: in this case, a mere rebuild should 'fix' it
<phanatic> perli: are you here?
<siretart> if it does state an explicit dependency on libmysqlclient15, then I think that should be fixed
<Hobbsee> siretart: it has a build dep on libmysqlclient15-dev - according to the control file
<Hobbsee> siretart: should be fixed - yes, but how?  :P
<Hobbsee> this is where my problem is!
<siretart> Hobbsee: err, are you sure the build-dep has changed? I understand that only the binary dependency needs to be fixed, because mysql-dfsg-5.0 no longer provides libmysqlclient15, butlibmysqlclient15off
<Riddell> Hobbsee: libmysqlclient15-dev hasn't changed
<Riddell> Hobbsee: so the package just needs rebuilding and it'll magically pick up the new library
<Hobbsee> right....
<perli> phanatic: yes
* Hobbsee tries to get this figured out in her head
<Hobbsee> yeah, ok, that makes sense enough
<Hobbsee> sorry for bothering you
<phanatic> perli: i'm not a motu, but i had a look at your package. may i /msg you with my comments?
<perli> phanatic: yes, that'd be nice
<Riddell> Hobbsee: libmysql had a binary incompatible name (mysql changed the name of a variable in it) so the library has to be given a new version "number" and everything that links to it has to be rebuilt
<Hobbsee> Riddell: ah ok, yep
<Riddell> Hobbsee: but the developer package needed for compiling is the same since its still the same library
* Hobbsee nods
<Riddell> there's a new version of amarok out soon so I'll make sure that gets built against the new libmysql
<Hobbsee> Riddell: oh ok, cool - the 1.4 beta3 or something?
<Hobbsee> or the 1.3.9*
<Riddell> yes, beta 3
<Riddell> 1.3.9 should already be rebuilt in ubuntu's dapper archive
<Hobbsee> Riddell: okay, and the beta2 in your repo - just wait for beta3?
<Riddell> Hobbsee: yes
<siretart> lets see if submitting bugs via email interface with many attachments works
<Unfrgiven> Seveas: ping
<Seveas> Unfrgiven, pong
<tseng> hi Unfrgiven
<Unfrgiven> tseng: hey dude
<Unfrgiven> Seveas: 0.5.0 sounds good. when are they expecting to final?
<Seveas> no ide
<Seveas> a
<Unfrgiven> Seveas: if they can resolve the session resuming issue, freenx would be a better alternative to vnc for me and hopefully many others
<Seveas> vnc does sharing, freenx not
<Unfrgiven> Seveas: i see. but with session resuming freenx should be at least close to MS remote desktop (MSRD). MSRD doesnt support sharing either
<Seveas> It's better 
<Seveas> you can even use NX to accellerate RDP
<Seveas> (only with commercial NX though)
<Unfrgiven> Seveas: thats neat! but what advantages does that really offer? RDP is already quite responsive
<Seveas> true, but NX stays responsive oveer a modem link, RDP not
<Unfrgiven> Seveas: cool!
<verwilst> nx is heaven :
<verwilst> :)
* pygi pokes slomo
<slomo_> pygi: pong
<pygi> slomo_: any advancement? :)
<slomo_> pygi: not yet... meebey told me that he will have the package ready tomorrow and some minutes later you all get a link to the package for testing ;)
* pygi yay :)
<pygi> Anyway, 0.10 has some serious problems
<slomo_> tell me about them
<slomo_> hm, best would be a mail with explainations of the problems and patches :) i have to leave in some minutes
<pygi> will do :)
<slomo_> are there critical problems and patches? ;)
<pygi> slomo_: btw. no patches exist yet :-D
<pygi> no, no critical problems
<slomo_> that's not good ;)
<pygi> It's just I am perfectionist, and that's not so good sometimes :-D
<slomo_> hehe
<slomo_> regressions from 0.8?
<Unfrgiven> i take it you guys referring to monodevelop?
<slomo_> yes
<Unfrgiven> or gstreamer?
<slomo_> MD
<Unfrgiven> im hanging out for MD 0.10 packages... mmm stetic!
<slomo_> oh another one... :) can you give me your mail address so i can tell you when there's something to test? :)
<pygi> slomo_: nah, not really a regression ... new features integrated are not tested enough
<pygi> I have a feeling it was rushed out too soon
<pygi> especially Stetic, but other parts as well
<slomo_> ok, hm... i have to try it later or tomorrow :)
<pygi> slomo_: we'll see... if it's something simple to fix, no harm in writing a patch or two :)
<slomo_> did you tell upstream about it already?
<pygi> well, the upstream knows it :)
<pygi> no worries, it'll get fixed sometime :-D
<perli> new package uploaded to REVU: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2251 - maybe a MOTU wants to have a look at it?
<pygi> you can read up some of things here
<pygi> http://pixane.net/blog/?p=47
<slomo_> pygi: oh i read that already :) the nunit problem is btw not a problem ;)
<pygi> slomo_: yes, I am aware of that :-P
<slomo_> it's just that we don't use the nunit that is shipped with mono but the real thing
<slomo_> ok :)
<pygi> slomo_: I am already running new MD, but I want a package anyway :)
<pygi> Altought I guess I'll still be coding GUI, instead of using Stetic for a while
<pygi> Habit :)
<slomo_> :)
<slomo_> i used glade for some windows in the past ;)
<pygi> I use glade just for Gnome apps which need GUI
<pygi> it was there for a long time, and I am kinda used to it
<pygi> altought I am not a gui expert :)
<pygi> I am not even gui beginner :)
<pygi> easier for me to make designer make gui, and I call it with libglade
<pygi> less work for me =P
<slomo_> hehe :)
<pygi> slomo_: well, I already have enough job as is...no need to complicate things :)
<slomo_> anyway... bbl :)
<pygi> :)
<pygi> enjoy :-P
<Unfrgiven> slomo_: yeah for sure. ankur.kotwal@gmail.com
<Unfrgiven> any word when MD is going to enable the debugger by default?
* havoc ponders running dapper at home
* havoc will pnder it more later
<phanatic> hi Gloubiboulga
<Gloubiboulga> hey phanatic
<nomed> hi all
<nomed> one question ...
<nomed> is it still possible to add new pkges in universe ?
<phanatic> nomed: i think not (only if that package is very important/useful)
<nomed> well those pkges are pinot and xapian ...
<nomed> pinot is a beagle like stuff that doesn't depends on mono ..
<nomed> xapian is an engine suitable for desktop search all in c++
<nomed> i found the really useful
<nomed> but that's a point of view :)
<phanatic> i don't think they'll be included :/
<nomed> phanatic, k thanks
<Gloubiboulga> phanatic, are you sure about this?
<Gloubiboulga> Mithrandir told me last week (or maybe the week before) that it's still possible to add new apps
<phanatic> Gloubiboulga: i heard from a MOTU (siretart i think), that no new packages can be uploaded (of course there are exceptions ;))
<Gloubiboulga> if siretart said so...
<siretart> nomed: Gloubiboulga: we are after feature freeze, so the current policy rejects new packages. but we grant exceptions to that policy if you can give convincing reasons for the exception
<nomed> siretart, yep i know that's why i had those pkges waitin there .. i had them mainly for dapper +1
<nomed> the only convincing reason i can give is that xubuntu lacks of a desktop search app ..
<nomed> pinot would be perfect ..
<nomed> it's based on a stable and well tested engine called xapian
<phanatic> nomed: i think that'd be a reason, since xubuntu is getting more powerful ;)
<nomed> but i have absolutely np if it'll not be possible to have it in universe
<siretart> nomed: I think if janimo would say that he needed that app for xubuntu, I'm sure that exception would be granted
<siretart> nomed: I've seem quite some exception like that for kubuntu, so why not for xubuntu as well
<nomed> siretart, thanks .. i'll contact janimo
<Kyral> Morning guys
<Hobbsee> hey Kyral
* Hobbsee falls asleep
<Kyral> allow me to append that with "and gals"
<Hobbsee> mmm...that too
<luks> Hi. I've uploaded a pacage to REVU, but I see that python-musicbrainz2_0.3.1-0ubuntu1_source.changes was rejected - ftp://revu.tauware.de/incoming/rejected
<luks> did I something wrong?
<siretart> luks: I'll look
<luks> thanks
<zul> so if i made a change to a bug-fix to a universe package would i upload to revu?
<siretart> luks: you wasn't added to the revu keyring. I added you to the keyring and reprocessed your package
<siretart> zul: revu is a platfor for showing your package to others, so maybe someone who has upload priviledges can easily review your package and eventually sponsor you
<luks> siretart: ah, thanks!
<zul> siretart: im pretty sure i have access to universe since im a motu already i just never uploaded anything
<phanatic> hey LaserJock
<LaserJock> hi phanatic
<Kyral> hey LJ
<LaserJock> hi Kyral
<Kyral> Checkout the Ubuntu-Users ML in a few
<LaserJock> do I have to? ;-)
<Kyral> meh :P
<Kyral> You aren
<Kyral> 't subscribed?
<LaserJock> heck no
<Kyral> damn the ' key being near the Enter key
<Kyral> I am lol
<Kyral> this is what my GMail Account is for :D
<LaserJock> I get enough crap as it is
<LaserJock> I got GMail now too
<Kyral> my GMail Account is my "Mailing List" account :D
<siretart> zul: so if you spot some bug in universe, just go on and fix it. if you want to sponsor ppl, who want to become motus, revu is the place for them to present their work
<zul> siretart: ok cool..
<phanatic> hi raphink
<raphink> hi phanatic
<Kyral> Hey raphink
<raphink> hi Kyral
<Kyral> Nice little comment about KQemu on KDE-Apps
<Kyral> You should mention that it should be renamed because most Distros already have packages named "KQemu" that are for the Kernel Module...
<raphink> mhm
<raphink> brb
<Kyral> lol at Jeff Waugh
<Kyral> 's latest blog
<Kyral> Damn the placement of the ' key!
<siretart> FYI, I just created https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SbuildLVMHowto. Commments welcome. works like a charm for me
<Kyral> someone in #uf wants to know if the new NVidia drivers will get in past the UVF
<siretart> #uf?
<Kyral> #ubuntuforums
<Kyral> sorry I was lazy :P
<siretart> Kyral: tell them that if it turns out that they fix bugs (preferably documented in malone), there are good chances that a report requesting this will result in a granted exception to uvf
<Kyral> I can tell you one bugfix right now. Incompatibilities with the recent Kernels :D
<Kyral> As in my system randomly freezing for no good reason (I know it was the Driver because when I reverted to NV all was well :P)
<Kyral> http://www.nvidia.com/object/linux_display_ia32_1.0-8756.html <-- Changelog
<siretart> Kyral: the current driver in dapper works fine with the current nvidia drivers. we cannot support random kernel/driver combinations
<Kyral> oy....
<Kyral> I should have filed a bug...
<Kyral> plus yanno enough people will be complaining for them....*shrug*
<zakame> hi MOTUs
<raphink> hi zakame
<zakame> hello raphink
<Yagisan> G'day all
<zakame> hi Yagisan
<Yagisan> so zakame, what's up ?
<zakame> trying to fix malone 38619
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 38619 in balsa "FTBFS: using deprecated GNOME_PARAM_POPT_TABLE" [Normal,In progress]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/38619
<Yagisan> ah. I'm discovering the joys of running pbuilder on a large tmpfs. Much quicker then using my raid0 array
<zakame> rocking!
<Yagisan> any recommendations for managing a local repo (excluding dak ;) ) ? I used apt-ftparchive on breezy, but I can't find it on dapper.
<LaserJock> Yagisan: it isn't in Dapper?
<uniq> yagisan: it should be in the apt-utils package.
<Yagisan> ahh, that probally explains why I didn't find it
* Yagisan was looking for a separate package :-[
<LaserJock> hi raphink and bddebian
<bddebian> Heya gang
<bddebian> Hi LaserJock
<raphink> hi LaserJock <><
<cbx33> afternoon all
<bddebian> Hello cbx33
<cbx33> hi bddebian
<LaserJock> hi cbx33
<cbx33> hi LaserJock
<cbx33> been up to much>] 
<cbx33> ?
<LaserJock> arghh, we we had a little mishap with kubuntu-docs and I'm trying to fix all the bugs in the packaging guide
<cbx33> heheh
<cbx33> did you get my last ones about chroot
<cbx33> yes i think you did :p
<LaserJock> yeah, I think so
<LaserJock> I need to collate and fix as much as I can
<cbx33> well if you want me to give it a final review tomorrow I'd be happy too
<cbx33> had much responce from the mailing list?
<LaserJock> but I wasn't sure until just a few minutes ago what the proper procedure was now that we have a doc freeze
<LaserJock> yeah, a far amount
<LaserJock> I'm happy so far
<cbx33> good good
<LaserJock> means more work of course
<cbx33> well I think it's an ace tutorial
<LaserJock> but I'd rather be busy and have a good doc
<cbx33> what more you gotta do?
<LaserJock> just fixing, mostly in the Pbuilder how to
<cbx33> ahh
<cbx33> well the offers there if you want it :p
<cbx33> bbl
<siretart> LaserJock: you include a pbuilder howto in your dev docu?
<LaserJock> yessir
<LaserJock> http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/gs-pbuilder.html
<siretart> LaserJock: I've written today this: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SbuildLVMHowto
<siretart> as alternative to pbuilder. I now officially love sbuild :)
<LaserJock> it isn't specific to LVMs though, right?
<LaserJock> siretart: does sbuild/schroot give you a clean chroot like pbuilder?
<siretart> LaserJock: no, you can run schroot on pure chroots, file (tarballs like pbuilder), or raw block devices as well
<siretart> you get best performance on lvm snapshots however, because you don't need to extract a tarball, and don't need to purge the installed build deps
<LaserJock> hmm, definately something to think about for Dapper+1
<LaserJock> I'll have to try it out
<Yagisan> perhaps a note that setting the build dir to tmpfs helps with pbuilder, for those that can't setup sbuilde and lvm
<MrFaber> hi all
<MrFaber> Who manages the wpasupplicant package?
<LaserJock> MrFaber: siretart might be one to talk to
<MrFaber> LaserJock: thanks
<MrFaber> siretart: hi, you there?
<siretart> MrFaber: yes, I'm here
<MrFaber> siretart: thanks
<MrFaber> siretart: wpasupplicant works fine but I have no clue how to start since latest updates. There ist no init.d and so on. Is there any current wiki or howto?
<MrFaber> It should work with if-preup.d but I don't know how
<MrFaber> Where can I read something how to use it and I don't know if this is ubuntu specific
<siretart> MrFaber: sure. look in /usr/share/doc/wpasupplicant/README.{Debian,modes}
<MrFaber> thx
<siretart> MrFaber: debian does it the same way. We try to not diverge it
<MrFaber> siretart: ok, but then it is debian specific?
<siretart> short story: the idea with the init script was braindead and broke in many situations. you now configure wpa in /etc/network/interfaces
<MrFaber> siretart: great, since I remove the wpa from rcs and started it in interfaces
<siretart> MrFaber: somewhat. we integrated wpasupplicant into ifupdown, which is a debian/ubuntu specific thing
<siretart> MrFaber: in future, if you have problems with a package upgrade, I suggest looking into /usr/share/doc/$package/changelog.Debian.gz. There you find the email addresses of the ppl who touched the package, along with information what they changed
<MrFaber> ok, thanks
<Yagisan> finally, my auto pbuilder + local repo is set up.
<MrFaber> siretart: sorry, just one last question, should I create  /etc/default/wpasupplicant since there is no one anymore and it is mentioned in README.Debian
<siretart> it is? oh, need to remove it from there then
<siretart> MrFaber: no, there is nothing which would read /etc/default/wpasupplicant
<siretart> MrFaber: all information has to be given in /etc/network/interfaces
<cbx33> phew |I'm back
<MrFaber> siretart: ok, thx
<cbx33> ok, I'm running breezy
<cbx33> but i want a dapper debootstrap environment
<siretart> MrFaber: you're right, near the bottom, there is an old entry still referencing that
<cbx33> the dapper debootstrap script is only in the latest debootstrap
<cbx33> can i install the dapper debootstrap on breezy? if so how?
<siretart> cbx33: download and install it with dpkg -i
<cbx33> kk
<cbx33> which package do i want
<cbx33> what are hte udeb pacakges?
<cbx33> debootstrap-udeb_0.3.3.0ubuntu2_i386.udeb
<cbx33> or
<cbx33> debootstrap_0.3.3.0ubuntu2_all.deb
<LaserJock_away> not the udeb one
<cbx33> ok
<siretart> cbx33: udeb packages are used by the installer only
<cbx33> ah i see
<cbx33> LaserJock_away, you got a sec?
<LaserJock_away> yes, quickly (I'm waiting for my wife before we go to lunch)
<cbx33> ok i have a bug i know how to fix
<cbx33> :D
<LaserJock_away> cool
<cbx33> i have downloaded the source
<cbx33> do i modify it
<cbx33> repackage it back up
<cbx33> then do a debdiff?|
<LaserJock_away> pretty much
<cbx33> but i don;t modify the orignal source|
<cbx33> ?
<LaserJock_away> no
<cbx33> or i do and the deb diff takes care of that|
<LaserJock_away> well, it depends
<cbx33> wouldi create a patch then and shove it in debian/ to be appied|
<cbx33> sorry this keyboard layout is funky, the ? is not i nthe normal place!!
<LaserJock_away> if the package uses a patch system like dpatch or  something, then you want to make a new patch in debian/patches/
<cbx33> else modify the source
<cbx33> i see
<cbx33> nope there is no patches file
<LaserJock_away> but if it doesn't use a patch system you modify stuff and then when you rebuild the package the changes go into the .diff.gz file
<cbx33> or directory
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> will so
<cbx33> do
<LaserJock_away> just use zless and/or zgrep to make sure you did what you think you did and no more or less
<Yagisan> can build-depends span multiple lines ? lintian is giving me an error on one I broke up to make it easier to read.
<LaserJock_away> on the .diff.gz that is
<cbx33> ok
<LaserJock_away> Yagisan: I don't think so. I think it needs to be all on one line
<cbx33> hmmm
<Yagisan> LaserJock_away: thanks
<uniq> how do i request sync of a package from debian? (dssi-*)
<bddebian> uniq: Ask elmo or Kamion or so
<uniq> that wouldn't be necessary to sync a pacakge to universe, would it?
<uniq> they are working on main afaik.
<bddebian> Yes unless something has changed that I don't know about
<uniq> ok. thanks.
<crimsun> slomo_: yay, gnome #332390 resolved :)
<Ubugtu> Gnome bug 332390 in gstreamer (core) "[GstQueue/GstPad]  queue pauses immediately when linked, playing musepack songs works only every second try" [Major,Resolved: fixed]  http://bugs.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=332390
<bddebian> Go crimsun go :-)
<crimsun> oh I didn't fix it, but I'm happy to reap its benefits :)
<crimsun> 'afternoon, bddebian
<bddebian> Heya crimsun :-)
<LaserJock> uniq: still here?
<LaserJock> bddebian: new sync procedure is at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DeveloperResources#syncs
<wasabi__> There a better way than popen ing gksudo to run a program as root from python?
<wasabi__> Looks like when I do so with popen, it never returns.
<wasabi__> when the program exits.
<nictuku> what do you need popen for?
<wasabi__> gksudo.
<wasabi__> And so I can wait for it to exit, and pass discrete arguments.
<nictuku> in that case I wouldn't know. Talk to kov when he's online
<nictuku> python-support should be in main :-(
<nictuku> well, when it is widely used it should be a must
<LaserJock> I suppose there has to be room for OO.org ;-)
#ubuntu-motu 2006-04-14
<Toadstool> g'night
<LaserJock> hmm, anybody actually use any irssi scripts?
* havoc does
<crimsun> the ops for #ubuntu and #kubuntu tend to
<LaserJock> makes sense, I just can't figure out what a lot of them do. I wonder if any are really useful. I'm such an IRC newb
<havoc> some are, most aren't
<havoc> the nick color and tab completion ones are prolly the most useful
<havoc> then there's custom scipts, like my SmckDown
<havoc> give it a nick mask and it does an iptables DROP on the IP
<havoc> on all new connects
<LaserJock> are there any scripts that help with finding away status of users
<LaserJock> that is the only thing I really like about Xchat
<havoc> shouldn't need a script for that
<LaserJock> right now I use /names  and /whois a lot
<LaserJock> but that is a bit clunky
<LaserJock> but maybe I just have bad IRC practices since it doesn't seem to bother other people
* havoc ignores most of those notices
<LaserJock> so how do you tell if someone is awake or not? just ping them?
<crimsun> /whois nick nick
<crimsun> read the idle field
<LaserJock> hmm, maybe it's just me then
<havoc> usually just talk to them, of they answer, they're awake
<havoc> s/of/if/
<havoc> so, just how much pain can I expect if I install dapper on my workstation right now?
* havoc will blame chillywilly no matter what
<LaserJock> havoc: well, for me dapper has been better than Breezy for months
<mx123> who know Against DRM 1.0?
<havoc> I'd think that during any form of freeze that it would be decent
<LaserJock> havoc: the only problem I have right now with Dapper is on my crappy DSL the daily dist-upgrade takes a while ;-)
<havoc> heh, that's not really a prblem with *dapper* now is it? ;)
<havoc> ack, I gotta go, bbl
<bddebian> LaserJock: Ah, OK, thx
<LaserJock> np
<bddebian> Told ya I was "out of the loop" :-)
<LaserJock> so was I until dholbach told me like yesterday
<bddebian> :-)
<crimsun> oh goodie, bddebian is back. /me reassigns more bugs to him.
<bddebian> Bah, All I do is .desktop files :-)
<LaserJock> bddebian: hehe, check out https://launchpad.net/people/motuscience/+assignedbugs
<bddebian> Yikes
<LaserJock> yeah, I gotta get cracking
<bddebian> Maybe I can knock out some of them if you'd like
<LaserJock> and after your done with those you can weed through https://launchpad.net/people/motuscience/+packagebugs
<LaserJock> ;p
<bddebian> Bah, I'll have that done by Sunday.. ;-P
<LaserJock> heh, but I've got to do them so I can close the Karma gap
<LaserJock> I did hit 5000 though yesterday
<bddebian> w00t
<LaserJock> but I noticed that Mark has got way more karma than me. I don't think I have a chance of closing that Karma gap ;-)
<bddebian> Mark?  As in sabdfl?
<LaserJock> bddebian: yeah, he's got 180000+
<bddebian> eeeks
<LaserJock> I can't imagine why,  I wonder if he gets dictator points
<crimsun> what's seb up to?
<LaserJock> lots of bug fixing I think
<crimsun> epiphany most definitely is NOT using gconfaudiosink
<bddebian> Bah, I fix the desktop icon for qgo but it segfaults..
<bddebian> Hello carthik
<carthik> hi bddebian :)
<LaserJock> crimsun: have you ever used schroot and sbuild?
<dolson> yay, got cross-compiling for win32 working again. I am happy :D
<bddebian> Ugh
<crimsun> LaserJock: yes
<LaserJock> crimsun: does it seem better than pbuilder?
<crimsun> LaserJock: "better" is in the eyes of the beholder.
<LaserJock> crimsun: in your eyes?
<crimsun> I prefer pbuilder
<crimsun> try it, decide for yourself :)
<LaserJock> yeah, siretart was recommending it (he made a sbuild+LVM howto on the wiki)
<LaserJock> I just wondered what other MOTUs though about it
<bddebian> Ugh, gotta head to the airport, later folks :-(
<LaserJock> cya bddebian
<Unfrgiven> crimsun: LaserJock: what is this alternative to pbuilder u guys are talking about?
<crimsun> cya bddebian
<crimsun> LaserJock: sbuild is particularly useful if you also have packages in Debian, since it's used there.
<LaserJock> ah
<LaserJock> I'm finding as people go through the packaging guide that setting up pbuilder seems to be a difficult spot
<LaserJock> I'm not sure if I'm just not covering it in enough detail or it is really just tough
<Unfrgiven> LaserJock: really? is settting up sbuild any easier?
<crimsun> I'm sure I'll have comments when I get to that section.
<LaserJock> Unfrgiven: that is what I'd like to know
<Unfrgiven> does ubuntu use sbuild to build packages?
<Unfrgiven> when we upload a source package, who/what builds the binary?
<LaserJock> isn't it buildd
<Unfrgiven> isnt that just the daemon that schedules the building?
<LaserJock> oh, that could be
<crimsun> yes, Ubuntu uses sbuild, too
<Unfrgiven> http://www.debonaras.org/wiki/HowTo/SetUpBuildd
<Unfrgiven> the thing im not getting about sbuild, is does it install all the build deps and then later uninstall them?
<crimsun> yes, precisely like pbuilder. However, the order it chooses alternates for build deps differs from pbuilder.
<crimsun> pbuilder chooses the first; sbuild chooses the last.
<womble> Unfrgiven: No, sbuild just installs anything that isn't already there, and then leaves it around when it's done, for efficiency's sake.
<crimsun> really?
<crimsun> color me a newb.
<Unfrgiven> if thats the case sbuild is not a good idea for building packages for a newbie
<Unfrgiven> the great thing about pbuilder is its such a minimalist environment. it almost always catches any missing build-deps!
<womble> Hell no.  sbuild is there to turn a lot of source into binaries as quickly as possible.
<womble> Yes, pbuilder is great for catching build deps.
<womble> You do not want your autobuilder catching all of your developer's fuckups, though
<LaserJock> the wiki howto is: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SbuildLVMHowto
<LaserJock> well, I just wish pbuilder was a bit easier to configure, especially when you want multiple pbuilders
<Unfrgiven> LaserJock: maybe we should write a script/tool to do it?
<womble> LaserJock: How would you make it easier?  pbuilder create --basetgz ... pbuilder build --basetgz
<crimsun> ah, I see (looking at a buildd log). It only installs what already isn't in the chroot, so it only uninstalls what it installed, but everything's cached.
<womble> crimsun: And if something breaks in it's postinst, you're stuffed.  <grin>
<LaserJock> womble: well people seem to get caught up with setting the sources.list
<LaserJock> often people set the distro to dapper but use breezy in the sources.list
<LaserJock> another one was it fails if the cdrom lines are still in the sources.list
<womble> LaserJock: WTF?  pbuilder creates it's own sources.list for the chroot out of the value for --mirror and --distribution
<LaserJock> hmm, maybe we should take that part out then
<zakame> hello
<LaserJock> womble: http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/gs-pbuilder.html is what I have now
<Unfrgiven> the reason it has its own sources.list is because people may want to write packages for dapper while themselves running a stable breezy environment.
<LaserJock> Unfrgiven: but wouldn't that be taken care of with --mirror and --othermirror if what womble is saying is correct?
<womble> Unfrgiven: Naturally.  Just like I've got about 8 different chroots for the different build environments I need for testing.
<Unfrgiven> LaserJock: quite possibly. I've never used the --mirror and --othermirror options myself so I couldn't tell you.
<LaserJock> womble: so how do you set that up?
<womble> Wow, you use /etc/pbuilderrc.  How... quaint.  I've never touched it in my life.
<Unfrgiven> does --mirror and --othermirror add deb and deb-src for both?
<zakame> lol
<womble> Why would you use deb-src in a pbuilder chroot?
<Unfrgiven> uggh sorry im getting confused with my chroot setup
<Unfrgiven> you're right.
<Unfrgiven> so you're saying that a pbuilder setup is a one-liner?
<LaserJock> Unfrgiven: but --mirror and --othermirror are set in /etc/pbuilderrc
<LaserJock> so it is redundent maybe
<Unfrgiven> LaserJock: correct and yeah it seems redundant.
<LaserJock> womble: so how do you handle multiple pbuilders?
<womble> From memory, I create a new chroot with "pbuilder create --basetgz /var/lib/chroots/<something>.tgz --mirror http://127.0.0.1:9999/ubuntu --distribution dapper"
<womble> LaserJock: I have a script called 'buildin' which works out which in /var/lib/chroots to use for the --basetgz option
<womble> womble: Buildmaster, of course, is even more intelligent, but it's also largely on crack.
<Unfrgiven> womble: talking to urself now?!?!
<Unfrgiven> womble: whats Buildmaster?
<womble> Unfrgiven: My multi-architecture-on-one-box buildd I use for work.
<Unfrgiven> womble: now that sounds neat!
<LaserJock> hmm, I guess that is what I mean about making pbuilder a bit more intuitive to use for new people
<womble> It's /var/lib/chroots currently contains i386_hoary.tgz, i386_breezy.tgz, amd64_hoary.tgz, and amd64_breezy.tgz.  It will shortly contain dapper versions, too.
<LaserJock> I've got multiple pbuilderrcs and apt.config directories
<Unfrgiven> womble: in that command, how do you specify universe & multiverse in the sources?
<LaserJock> in ~/
<LaserJock> Unfrgiven: I think you would set --othermirror perhaps
<Unfrgiven> im just going to test this out now
<womble> Unfrgiven: --othermirror "deb http://127.0.0.1:9999/ubuntu dapper universe multiverse|deb http://127.0.0.1:9999/ubuntu dapper-updates universe multiverse"
<LaserJock> hmm, so I wonder what I should do with the guide
<Unfrgiven> aight, here goes
<Unfrgiven> LaserJock: im just trying out the one liner. if it works as expected then lets update the document accordingly
<wasabi__> There a better way then popening gksu to make a python utility that needs root access?
<Unfrgiven> LaserJock: a one-liner will be easy enough for users
<LaserJock> womble: ok, so do you have to give --mirror etc with each pbuilder build or update or only for create?
<womble> Hell of a lot easier than editing pbuilderrc every time you want to change something.  And you should be pointing them at .pbuilderrc for most stuff, anyway -- about the only setting for /etc/pbuilderrc is the mirror (which should be system wide, and point at your local apt-proxy instance)
<womble> LaserJock: Hell no.  pbuilder has this great new concept called sources.lists.
<womble> AAAAAARGH
* womble hates it when his sarcasm is broken
<womble> sources.list
<Unfrgiven> is .pbuilderrc much use? pbuilder needs to be run as root. so the user will need to use /root/.pbuilderrc in which case they may as well use /etc/pbuilderrc
<LaserJock> no
<womble> Unfrgiven: It uses $HOME/.pbuilderrc
<womble> Although sudo has some strange ideas about $HOME these days, for some bong-ass reason
<Unfrgiven> yeah i realised after i hit enter... sudo preserves $HOME
<jmg> is there a way to make make-kpkg not rebuild the tree before building the .debs?
<LaserJock> womble: what do you mean about mirror should point at your local apt-proxy instance?
<LaserJock> womble: sorry for the seemingly bonehead questions
<womble> LaserJock: I mean that everybody should have a local apt-proxy instead of hammering the snot out of the main mirrors.
<Unfrgiven> i was thinking that we should have an apt-proxy setup in the appendix
<Unfrgiven> apt-proxy FTW!
<jmg> help
* LaserJock goes to look up apt-proxy
<jmg> :(
<womble> LaserJock: For instance, I've got apt-proxy on my laptop, and it's shared by the laptop itself, for all of the pbuilder chroots, and for the UMLs.
<Unfrgiven> jmg: sorry dude, im not sure the answer to your question.
<womble> It must save me GBs of traffic a month, easily.
<Unfrgiven> womble: the command didn't work! Command: sudo pbuilder create --basetgz testing.tgz --mirror http://ankur.ath.cx:9999/ubuntu --distribution dapper --othermirror "deb http://ankur.ath.cx:9999/ubuntu main restricted universe multiverse"
<Unfrgiven> Failed to fetch http://ankur.ath.cx:9999/ubuntu/dists/main/restricted/binary-i386/Packages.gz  404 Not Found
<Unfrgiven> Failed to fetch http://ankur.ath.cx:9999/ubuntu/dists/main/universe/binary-i386/Packages.gz  404 Not Found
<Unfrgiven> Failed to fetch http://ankur.ath.cx:9999/ubuntu/dists/main/multiverse/binary-i386/Packages.gz  404 Not Found
<Unfrgiven> odd...
<womble> --othermirror "deb http://ankur.ath.cx:9999/ubuntu dapper universe multiverse" FFS
<womble> I don't think Ubuntu is ever going to release "Main Marmot"
<Unfrgiven> ?!?!
<LaserJock> womble: maybe, you never know ;-)
<womble> Unfrgiven: The first argument after the URL is the name of the distribution you want to use, not a component
<Unfrgiven> err of course!
<Unfrgiven> stupid me
<Unfrgiven> it was a typo
<Unfrgiven> and while im at it, whats a marmot?
<LaserJock> ok, so the default pbuilder install for dapper has mirror set right for Ubuntu
<womble> You manually typed in the error message pbuilder gave you?
<LaserJock> so really all we need to do is set --othermirror
<Unfrgiven> womble: no, the typo was in my command. i omitted dapper. trying it again with the right values
<womble> Unfrgiven: Like most questions, that is best answered by Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marmot
<Unfrgiven> :)
<LaserJock> ok, so we can do this:
<LaserJock> 1) get proper debootstrap
<LaserJock> 2) install pbuilder
<LaserJock> 3) pbuilder create -distribution  --othermirror
<LaserJock> 4) pbuilder build *.dsc
<LaserJock> sudo pbuilder I should say
<womble> Replace 4) with buildin:
<womble> #!/bin/sh -e
<womble> dist="$1"; shift
<womble> dsc="$1"; shift
<womble> echo "Dist: $dist"
<womble> echo "Dsc: $dsc"
<womble> echo "Extras:" "$@"
<womble> BASEFILE=$(basename "$dsc" .dsc)
<womble> BASEDIR=$(dirname "$dsc")
<womble> if [ -z "$RESULTDIR" ] ; then
<womble>         RESULTDIR=$(readlink -f $BASEDIR)
<womble> fi
<womble> echo "Placing build results in $RESULTDIR"
<womble> sudo pbuilder build \
<womble>         --basetgz "/chroots/p${dist}.tgz" \
<womble>         --buildresult "${RESULTDIR}/" --debbuildopts '-i' "$@" "$dsc" 2>&1 \
<womble>         | tee ${RESULTDIR}/${BASEFILE}-`date '+%Y%m%d%H%M'`.log
<womble> CHANGES="${RESULTDIR}/${BASEFILE}_i386.changes"
<womble> #lintian $CHANGES || true
<JohnnyMast> pastebin
<JohnnyMast> one word :)
<JohnnyMast> hey LaserJock old buddy :)
<LaserJock> hi JohnnyMast
<JohnnyMast> :D
<JohnnyMast> how are you doing ?
<Unfrgiven> womble: buildin assumes that your chroots are in /chroots
<LaserJock> umm, well I'll be better when this thing is done
<womble> Unfrgiven: Symlinks are wonderful things.  As are text editors, and shell and environment variables.
<JohnnyMast> whats wrong then buddy ?
<Unfrgiven> womble: :)
<LaserJock> well, I need this to be newbie friendly
<JohnnyMast> whats this <--- then ??
<LaserJock> but if it used /var/pbuilder instead then it would better
<JohnnyMast> sorry i wasnt following the convo dear old buddy
<LaserJock> JohnnyMast: http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/index.html
<womble> LaserJock: /var/pbuilder isn't FSB compliant
<JohnnyMast> hmm pbuilder hu
<LaserJock> womble: well, that is the default
<JohnnyMast> its /var/cache/pbluider
<womble> LaserJock: What default?
<LaserJock> JohnnyMast: ah thanks.
<LaserJock> womble: /var/cache/pbuilder is the default directory
<JohnnyMast> but wait let me check
<JohnnyMast> let me double check for its root
<JohnnyMast> no wait double checking !!
<JohnnyMast> i just used locate
<JohnnyMast> it could have been an apt-crach junky stuff
<LaserJock> JohnnyMast: I did a typo in my pbuilderrc so I have one of mine in /var/pbuilder
<JohnnyMast> BUILDPLACE=/var/cache/pbuilder/build/
<LaserJock> there it is
<JohnnyMast> from pico /etc/pbuilderrc
<JohnnyMast> :) glad to help you out LaserJock
<JohnnyMast> that i still remind the motu stuff after all that time greepers :p
<LaserJock> heh
<JohnnyMast> hows it hanging here ?
<JohnnyMast> lots of hopefulls ?
<JohnnyMast> i just recently kicked out 6 ubuntu mailing lists
<JohnnyMast> it kept on spamming my ass hehe man i had like 488 emails a weekend
<JohnnyMast> LaserJock,
<JohnnyMast> do you know godfather the game ?
<LaserJock> nope
<JohnnyMast> to bad
<JohnnyMast> do you know the movie ?
<Unfrgiven> JohnnyMast: you're a gamer?
<JohnnyMast> more a developer/packer/teacher then a gamer
<JohnnyMast> but yes i like the game :)
<Unfrgiven> im very much a gamer and currently despise having to boot into windows to game
<Unfrgiven> cedega seems VERY slow for Guild Wars :(
<JohnnyMast> yeah but being not abled to boot into windows isnt a unix quest isnt it
<Unfrgiven> i seriously only use windows for two things atm. 1) VPN to work. 2) Games
<JohnnyMast> openvpn works well on unix
<JohnnyMast> but that besides
<Unfrgiven> not for Nortel VPNs
<JohnnyMast> you cant create a dual boot ?
<JohnnyMast> use a norton boot disk
<JohnnyMast> and you never will go wrong
<Unfrgiven> JohnnyMast: I do have a dual boot. but its still a PITA to have to do it
<JohnnyMast> you pointed it to the wrong partition prob
<JohnnyMast> thats 99% of the probs
<JohnnyMast> else forgive me for drinking :)
<JohnnyMast> im not sober my friend
<Unfrgiven> aight im heading off for a bit
<Unfrgiven> cya all
<LaserJock> cya Unfrgiven
<Hobbsee> Unfrgiven: try tripple boot :P
<LaserJock> Hobbsee: why stop at 3?
<Hobbsee> hard drive space
<LaserJock> a distro takes max 10GB, if you have a 120GB drive you could easily do at least 10 ;-)
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: windows tends to take a bit more than that
<Hobbsee> and i only have a 40 gb HD
<LaserJock> hhmm I suppose
<LaserJock> I'm used to dual(or more) booting linux distros
<LaserJock> I can usually get away with 5GB/each for most
<LaserJock> crimsun: you still around?
<LaserJock> crimsun: are you going to go through the whole guide?
<Kyral> yo people
<crimsun> LaserJock: hi. Yes.
<LaserJock> hi Kyral
<LaserJock> crimsun: ok, very cool.
<LaserJock> crimsun: I guess I'm going to try to redo the pbuilder section
<crimsun> ok.
<LaserJock> crimsun: do you have an estimate of how long it will take you?
<jmg> guys where do i get a login for revu?
<crimsun> LaserJock: I'm taking a break at the moment, but I'll have the rest of the dir done in 12 hrs.
<LaserJock> crimsun: ok, very cool
<LaserJock> jmg: have uploaded to revu?
<jmg> LaserJock: where do i upload to then :)
<LaserJock> jmg: ok, have you sent a signed email to keyring@revu.tauware.de to get your gpg key added?
<jmg> LaserJock: no, but i will thanks
<LaserJock> jmg: there are more detailed directions at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU
<jmg> LaserJock: Thanks
<LaserJock> np
<jmg> gack
<jmg> does evolution not support gpg?
<LaserJock> not sure, perhaps not "out of the box"
* netjoined: irc.freenode.net -> brown.freenode.net
* #ubuntu-motu  [freenode-info]  help freenode weed out clonebots, please register your IRC nick and auto-identify: http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#nicksetup
<ajmitch> afternoon
<nictuku> hello
<crimsun> 'afternoon, ajmitch
<LaserJock> hi ajmitch
<ajmitch> hi Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> hey ajmitch
* Hobbsee is only here for a min or so - going rollerblading!
<ajmitch> heh, fun
<ajmitch> don't break any bones
<Hobbsee> yep :)
<Hobbsee> i've only ever broken a finger...
<Hobbsee> and that was unrelated...
* LaserJock broke a middle finger once :/
<ajmitch> we need all MOTUs on board for the last weeks before release
<Hobbsee> hehe
<Hobbsee> yes, i broke my middle finger...
<Hobbsee> was most embarrasing...
<ajmitch> ouch
* Hobbsee isnt a MOTU though, is she?
<ajmitch> doesn't matter
<ajmitch> you still have to help
<Hobbsee> right
<Hobbsee> true
<Hobbsee> well i finished my assignment, so i probably can now...
<ajmitch> great
* ajmitch is still working on assignments & various tasks
<LaserJock> I'll be back into it as soon as this Packaging Guide is really finished
* ajmitch is going to be very very busy with the cathedral choir this week, with easter :)
<crimsun> ah, cool
<Hobbsee> hehe
<Hobbsee> good point
* Hobbsee should check if she's doing any tech stuff easter weekend as well...
* Hobbsee makes a mental note to actually TAKE HER SKATES today!
<jmg> so who wants to help me get xen 3.0.2 into universe? :)
<jmg> i have packages built
<crimsun> what sort of packages?
<jmg> dapper source and binary
<crimsun> referring to source
<jmg> i've modified the debian rules so they build 3.0.2 on dapper
<bddebian> Afternoon?  It's freakin' Midnight :-)
<jmg> crimsun: uploading to my repo now
<jmg> crimsun: http://thoughtcrime.org.nz/~cartel/ubuntu/dapper/xen3.0.2-testing+20060409
<crimsun> jmg: sec, busy in support
<jmg> source code coming soon
<LaserJock> jmg: yeah, .debs are pretty usless for us
<ajmitch> probably something that'd have to be sorted out with the kernel team, too
<jmg> LaserJock: at the moment it seems to be rolling object code in
<jmg> ajmitch: yeah thats my next trick
<jmg> ajmitch: im building a prototype kernel using ubuntu rules
<jmg> LaserJock: i need to build a source package
<LaserJock> jmg: how are you making the .debs now?
<jmg> LaserJock: dpkg-buildpackage
<bddebian> Ack, I have .desktop on the brain... :-(
* LaserJock hugs bddebian, sorry dude
<jmg> LaserJock: its rolling object code into the generated .tar.gz at the moment, comes out at 114mb :(
<ajmitch> that's a little broken
<jmg> ajmitch: no shit
<jmg> ajmitch: clean target horked
<bddebian> LaserJock: :-)
<crimsun> jmg: if there's to be any hope for it to get in, it needs to apply cleanly against our patched kernel source
<jmg> crimsun: impossible
<jmg> crimsun: xen applies to 2.6.16
<jmg> crimsun: meaning it cant get accepted as a kernel for dapper
<crimsun> jmg: are you aiming for dapper?
<ajmitch> since we're only having 1 set of kernels for dapper, not multiple patchsets or binary packages in universe
<crimsun> right.
<crimsun> if it doesn't apply against our kernel source, it's a no-go
<jmg> crimsun: however, the packages used to setup your own xen kernel surely are includable?
<ajmitch> sure, they probably are
<crimsun> as in scripts? Sure
<jmg> crimsun: the debs that i uploaded are the supporting packages for xen, and a kernel patch package
<bddebian> crimsun: Are you a main uploader?
<jmg> crimsun: just cleaning up the source tree now
<jmg> crimsun then i get to start on etch YAY
<jmg> :'(
<jmg> how do you use gpg and evolution together?
<crimsun> bddebian: nope.
<LaserJock> jmg: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/GnuPrivacyGuardHowto
<jmg> LaserJock: thx
<ajmitch> crimsun: you're not? I thought you were..
<crimsun> ajmitch: nope
<bddebian> You should be :-)
<chillywilly> HI
<chillywilly> oops, capslock :)
<bddebian> Heya chillywilly
<LaserJock> chillywilly: I just thought you were hapy to see us ;-)
<chillywilly> that too
<chillywilly> especially ajmitchie and bddebian ;)
<ajmitch> chillywilly: when are you going to help out with ubuntu?
<chillywilly> ummmm...I was going to make an unreal IRCd package some day...
<ajmitch> sure
<chillywilly> :)))
<bddebian> Yeah chillywilly, get uploading .desktop files :-)
<chillywilly> .desktop files for what?
<LaserJock> chillywilly: *everything*
<bddebian> heh
<LaserJock> if I play this right, by the time I can do some more uploads bddebian will have all my .desktop bugs fixed ;-)
<bddebian> Yep :-)
<ajmitch> LaserJock: I'm expecting that I won't have to do any more uploads for dapper
<bddebian> I guess that's all I'm good for :'-(
<ajmitch> bddebian: fixing all the dapper bugs?
<LaserJock> bddebian: it is an invaluable service
<bddebian> No, .desktop fixes
<chillywilly> I heard dapper got pushed back because it's going to be supported for 5 years...isn't that like an eternity in the FOSS world? I gues I don't get it
<ajmitch> jmg: did you make it to LCA this year?
<ajmitch> chillywilly: this was news about a month ago :)
<chillywilly> I've not been keeping up
<LaserJock> chillywilly: I think it is 3 years on desktop, 5 on server. but I could be wrong
<ajmitch> RH & suse both have comparable support cycles
<chillywilly> so sue me
<chillywilly> ok
<bddebian> We don't have automake1.6?
<chillywilly> fair enough then
<ajmitch> bddebian: no, why should we? 1.9 is current
<bddebian> Hmm, this package needs "fixed" then :)
<LaserJock> we have 1.4, 1.7, 1.8, and 1.9
<ajmitch> yep
<ajmitch> no doubt 1.7 & maybe 1.8 will get dropped
<ajmitch> 1.4->1.5 broke too much to drop 1.4 yet
<Amaranth> i think gnome needs 1.7
<ajmitch> crazy compatibility issues
<Amaranth> i'm almost positive 1.9 breaks gnome
<carthik_away> Does MOTU team have a mentor scheme, where  new wannabes can ask questions of a mentor?
<ajmitch> bddebian: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=340921
<Amaranth> something like that
<Ubugtu> Debian bug 340921 in ftp.debian.org "Subject: RM: automake1.6" [Normal,Closed] 
<Amaranth> you ask here, see if someone answers
<ajmitch> carthik_away: generally it's just working in here, not so much a 1-on-1 scheme
<ajmitch> and packages get reviewed, etc
<bddebian> Gah, it wasn't the package, I had 1.4 installed.. Duh
<carthik> thanks ajmitch
<LaserJock> how important is it to have dapper-updates as a repo in pbuilder?
<ajmitch> LaserJock: it's not, since updates should be empty still
<LaserJock> ajmitch: well, this is the packaging guide, which should cover a few years
<LaserJock> do you think it would be worth worrying about?
<ajmitch> not particularly
<LaserJock> k
<ajmitch> it *may* matter sometime in the future though
<ajmitch> depending if someone is building a package to go into dapper-updates
<LaserJock> I would think by that time they could figure out that they might want to have dapper-updates
<ajmitch> yeah
<ajmitch> it would only really be needed if someone was building for a released distro - which may happen with dapper being supported for awhile
<LaserJock_away> crimsun: I've commited your changes (plus some other fixes) so you should svn up before you send me more diffs
<crimsun> LaserJock_away: will do.
<bddebian> Ack, 2am, gnight folks
<zakame> hi
<carthik> hola, zakame
<zakame> ehlo carthik :)
<zakame> hi Hobbsee!!
<Hobbsee> zakame!!!
* Hobbsee did not break any bones
<zakame> haha
<zakame> where?
<Hobbsee> went rollerblading
<zakame> ooh!
* Hobbsee waves to ajmitch 
<ajmitch> hi
<ajmitch> no broken bones then?
<ajmitch> ah good :)
<Hobbsee> hehe
<Hobbsee> didnt even screw up my ankle - i was impressed
<jmg> anyone using vnc here? it wont connect for me in dapper
<Hobbsee> machine suddenly stopped accepting keyboard input - weird
<zakame> its turn to rollerblade
<Hobbsee> hehe
* StevenK jumps on Hobbsee.
<Hobbsee> argh!
* Hobbsee is jumped on
* Hobbsee contemplates her timetable
<zakame> thank $DEITY for libglib2.0-doc and libgnome2.0-dc
<zakame> s#dc#doc#
<zakame> there no dfsg-free last.fm player in the ubuntu archives right?
<zakame> gahh, #ubuntu -type question :/
<siretart> zakame: I tried to build the lastfm package from debian, but it immediately segfaults on dapper
<zakame> gaah iirc it b-ds on qt right?
<StevenK> zakame: quodlibet? amarok?
<StevenK> Hang on, I don't think Quod Libet stoops that low.
<crimsun> those are just clients that push stats to last.fm.
<zakame> StevenK: those are just scrobblers
<StevenK> Ah.
<crimsun> it'd be nice to have 0.19.1 in :)
<StevenK> <- doesn't get this whole last.fm thing.
<StevenK> crimsun: Ah, you're another Quod person? :-)
* StevenK is still running 0.17 on Breezy
<crimsun> StevenK: yes, from the early days back when pyflac was just a twinkling
* StevenK jumped to Quod after Amarok crashed one too many times.
<crimsun> the regexps won me
<StevenK> And before Amarok there was Rythmbox, until GStreamer sucking on SMP forced me to switch.
<zakame> quod rocks
<siretart> StevenK: last.fm streams musik as well
<zakame> StevenK: heh, I myself just tried last.fm yesterday, it was ok
<zakame> but I can't appreciate the choppy music over dialup :(
<Hobbsee> urgh, dialup
<Hobbsee> zakame: can you not get cable/adsl/whatever there?
* StevenK hugs his DSL modem.
* StevenK waits for ADSL2+ to hit Exetel.
<Hobbsee> ooh...nice...
* Hobbsee cant hug any of that stuff, as it's in another room
<StevenK> Hobbsee: 16Gb DSL2 plan for $50, it's brilliant.
<zakame> Hobbsee: not at the moment, no job :/
<Hobbsee> zakame: ah...
<Hobbsee> StevenK: sheesh!  got a link for it?
<StevenK> http://www.exetel.com.au/a_plan_pricing_adsl2.htm
<zakame> Hobbsee: still, my bandwidth's just ok for ssh-ing :D
<Hobbsee> hehe
<Hobbsee> StevenK: hmmm ok...might send that to dad.  we're on telstra bigpond cable at the moment...
<pef> hello
<pef> should I fill a bug report on debian bts to give a desktop file written for Ubuntu ?
<crimsun> upstream should have the desktop file, so everyone will benefit
<pef> that is what I thought :)
<pef> "missing desktop file" is an appropriate bug report title ?
<crimsun> [PATCH]  Add missing desktop file
<pef> don't Debian mainly uses menu files instead of desktop files ?
<crimsun> I thought you were sending this upstream?
<crimsun> "upstream" upstream
<pef> sorry
<pef> you're right :)
<pef> crimsun: are you still present ?
<kelmo_lap> hi siretart
<kelmo_lap> hi all
<siretart> hey kelmo_lap
<siretart> kelmo_lap: we've been working a bit in paralell ;)
<kelmo_lap> yes, that s why i thought we should join forces ; )
<siretart> kelmo_lap: As you probably noticed, I backported this ap-scan command
<kelmo_lap> siretart, great, that was required
<siretart> ok
<kelmo_lap> siretart, i am a bit slack, i am only really using 0.5 series . . .
<siretart> I'm currently thinking about some sort of upgrading guide
<siretart> kelmo_lap: oh, thats no problem. the interaface to ifupdown.sh is the same now
<kelmo_lap> yep, good
<kelmo_lap> siretart, that sort of documentation is needed i think
<kelmo_lap> see my last response to the list
<kelmo_lap> Felix had some good suggestions
<kelmo_lap> i think we both knew that we'd be facing a few bug reports and enquiries after such large changes ; )
<siretart> I'm currently writing an answer
<kelmo_lap> meanwhile, my brain has started to think about howto integrate a roaming daeom with the ifupdwon script we provide
<ajmitch> hi
<kelmo_lap> hi ajmitch
<siretart> sent
<siretart> kelmo_lap: btw: http://blog.zugschlus.de/archives/372-wpa_supplicant.html
<kelmo_lap> some nice feedback
<kelmo_lap> cool
<siretart> :)
<siretart> need to leave, cu later
<ajmitch> bye siretart
<siretart> kelmo: I'll be away for vac next week. could you arrange an upload of -3 to unstable then?
<kelmo> siretart: sure, i'll push for one in a day or two
<siretart> great
<kelmo> siretart: have a good break
<kelmo> i just got back from a mini-vac
<siretart> nice to hear :)
<jmg> xen-3.0.2-testing+20060904/
<jmg> er
<jmg> http://thoughtcrime.org.nz/~cartel/ubuntu/dapper/xen-3.0.2-testing+20060904
<siretart> jmg: whats that?
<siretart> xen kernel patch or userspace tools?
<jmg> http://thoughtcrime.org.nz/~cartel/ubuntu/
<jmg> http://thoughtcrime.org.nz/~cartel/ubuntu/etch-on-dapper-.jpg
<jmg> siretart: kernelpatch and tools and libs... kernel coming soon (later today)
<siretart> jmg: do you work together with hunger?
<jmg> link should be: http://thoughtcrime.org.nz/~cartel/ubuntu/dapper/xen-3.0.2-testing+20060409/
<jmg> siretart: no but i should?
<siretart> he did a lot of work on xen packages as well
<siretart> might be a good idea to avoid duplication of work
<jmg> okay
<jmg> this is all new anyway
<jmg> xen 3.0.2 changes lots of stuff
<jmg> ill catch up with hunger tomorrow
<jmg> thanks
<Yagisan> G'day all
<kelmo> hi Yagisan
<Gloubiboulga> hi Yagisan
<Hobbsee> HI Yagisan
<Hobbsee> darn capslock
* Yagisan diuscovers it is hard to type with baby on lap
<Hobbsee> hehe!
<Hobbsee> yeah, rather
<Hobbsee> or a cat on your arms, as my friend had that problem last night
<Yagisan> my little boy is lonely, so I'm introducing him to computers, but he likes to grab everything in sight
<ajmitch> Yagisan: might as well get him hacking early
<Yagisan> ajmitch: that's the plan. I had my little girl on the pc by the time shewas 6 months
<Yagisan> she's not too bad at doom now actually
* Yagisan is a bad dad, I know
<ajmitch> heh
<phanatic> hi people
<ajmitch> hi
* ajmitch is off to bed now, good night
<Yagisan> ajmitch: I need to train people to play with me here, so I may as well start young
<tseng> bye ajmitch
<Yagisan> night ajmitch
<Yagisan> there was a command that let me know which .deb a file was from, can anyone remember it ? eg if I want to know which package /usr/lib32/libSDL-1.2.so.0 is from
<Hobbsee> night ajmitch
<Hobbsee> Yagisan: dpkg -L?
<Hobbsee> maybe combined with grep?
<azeem> Yagisan: dpkg -S <file>
<azeem> Yagisan: packages.ubuntu.com has a search facility for this as well (the one at the bottom)
<Yagisan> thanks azeem, Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> ah...
<kelmo> or dlocate is also handy, and fast
<Yagisan> ahh. that was useful. now I know what I'm missing from my deps line
<Yagisan> hmm, libncurses.so.5 isn't in ia32-libs anymore ?
* Hobbsee goes and kills off more bugs, again
* StevenK waves to Yagisan
* Hobbsee waves to StevenK 
<Hobbsee> hey, if a bug is set to needinfo, and hasnt been touched by the original poster for 11 months, can i just close it, saying "reopen if this still applies"  ?
<Yagisan> G'day StevenK
<Yagisan> Hobbsee: what bug ?
<Hobbsee> bug 17107
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 17107 in kdemultimedia juk "backtrace" [Normal,Needs info]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/17107
<Yagisan> Hobbsee: yes. It's just a backtrace without any info
<Hobbsee> cool, thanks
<Yagisan> Hobbsee: no worries. btw, I have no authority here, I just try to look like I know what I'm doing. Sometimes it actually works
<Hobbsee> heeh
<Hobbsee> Yagisan: i'll hold you accountable :P
<bddebian> Howdy gang
<Yagisan> G'day bddebian
<Yagisan> Hobbsee: so, you'll increase my karma then, nice :)
<Hobbsee> hehe
<phanatic> hey bddebian
<bddebian> Hello phanatic
<StevenK> Yagisan: Boo!
<bddebian> Hm, do I do MOTUSciences's desktop files?  I don't want to steal LaserJock_away's karma :-)
<pef> :)
<pef> lot of desktop files cleanup are sciences related packages
<pef> bddebian: heya :)
<bddebian> Hello pef :-)
<pef> bddebian: just a question about submitted debdiff on bug reports: do you keep original changelog entry ?
<bddebian> pef: What do you mean by keep?
<pef> bddebian: keeping original submitter's entry, or put ourself with our name, e-mail, etc
<bddebian> pef: Oh.  It depends.  Lately if I have to change something, I'll create my own and credit the submitter.  If the patch is fine I'll usually leave the submitters entry and build with -k<mykeyaddr>
<pef> ok, that was I thought, thanks :)
<bddebian> NP
<pef> and I'm impressed by your very activity :)
<pef> s/ver/very important/
<pef> s/very/ very important/
<pef> :] 
<bddebian> pef: Bah, it's mainly simple .desktop stuff :-(  But thanks :-)_
<bddebian> Does this look like a valid Categories section:  Categories=Astronomy;GTK;Science; ?
<bddebian> Shouldn't it have Applications; somewhere in there?
<pef> bddebian: I cannot find "Application" entry in http://standards.freedesktop.org/menu-spec/menu-spec-1.0.html
<pef> but I often find it
<bddebian> Hmm
<pef> I don't understand the role of "Application" entry, because if the program isn't a library or something else not directly usable by end user, it can't by something else than an application
<bddebian> I though it was a tag for Applications -> Foo -> Bar ?
<bddebian> For example, I just installed gcx with the above entry and it's nowhere in the Applications dropdown menu
<Hobbsee> how does one go about fixing a borked dep in a package in breezy?  patch it, and assign it somewhere?
<bddebian> No clue, sorry.  Mez might know
<Hobbsee> right, thanks
<Hobbsee> unfortunately all the dev's that i know are asleep :P
<bddebian> :-)
* bddebian pokes LaserJock_away awake
<cbx33> hi all
<bddebian> Hello cbx33
<Hobbsee> hey cbx33
<cbx33> hey bddebian Hobbsee
<cbx33> gonna attempt my first bug fix later on today....
<Hobbsee> yay!
<cbx33> it's a relaly minor one, but hey, gotta start somewhere
<Hobbsee> what's it for?
<cbx33> some documentation issue
<bddebian> cbx33: Great
<Tm_T> yay!
<cbx33> bddebian, well I was trawling through all the bugs looking for ones I could actually do
<bddebian> cbx33: I know that feeling :-)
<cbx33> I found one, but it would need me to get mysql running in my chroot
<cbx33> which is proving a bugger at the mo
<bddebian> cbx33: The "No .desktop file" ones are easy too
<cbx33> so I'll leave that one till later, but there were 2 others i think I could actually do
<cbx33> YES
* bddebian knows from experience :-)
<cbx33> i seen a few of those...though most of them already have a fix
<bddebian> Ah, yes good point
<cbx33> when someone submits a debdiff, does it become fixed once someone applies that to the universe?
<Hobbsee> cbx33: hehe...i know what you mean
<Hobbsee> yes, it does
<bddebian> cbx33: ?
<cbx33> ok, swat i thought
<cbx33> in Malone
<Hobbsee> i think
<Hobbsee> i'm pretty sure it does
* cbx33 is off to have a go at driving now...going out with my dad, :D
<Hobbsee> you have to mark it as fix released though
<Hobbsee> ooh fun!
<cbx33> he reckons a few more times and I'll be ready to take my test :D
<bddebian> Driving??  Eeks
<Hobbsee> yay!
* bddebian feels ancient
<Hobbsee> bddebian: how old are you?
<cbx33> 24 and still no license
<cbx33> married....
<bddebian>  36
<cbx33> but no driving license :p
<cbx33> i seem to do things in the wrong order
<bddebian> heh
<cbx33> knowing my luck I'll get back later to fix this bug and it'll have already been fixed :S
<cbx33> then I'll have to trawl through the 9000 other bugs to find one i can actully fix
<cbx33> thing is I can program pretty well, but debugging a massive app is so difficult isn't it....even some of the smaller web based ones are tricky
<bddebian> Weird, now gcx shows up in Applications -> Other
<bddebian> cbx33: Have a go at an FTBFS if there are any
<bddebian> Usually they are just bad deps or such
<cbx33> FTBFS ?
<cbx33> ah i see
<bddebian> Apparently fv is FTBFS
<bddebian> FTBFS == Fails To Build From Source
<cbx33> i'll look at some of thsoe
<cbx33> yes i realised after you said
<Hobbsee> very true
<bddebian> So in my tiny-little mind celestia should have a .desktop for celestia-glut and celestia-gnome ?
<cbx33> bddebian, is your mind that tiny?
<bddebian> Yes. :-(
<bddebian> bbiam, gotta run to the store
<infinito> can anyone help me to get pkgs signed with gpg using pbuilder?
<pef> infinito: what about  --debsign-k option of pdbuild ?
<infinito> pef: thanks! i was always using pbuilder build to get the packages, didn't know about pdebuild
<infinito> pef: im trying with this command 'pdebuild --auto-debsign --debsign-k 3F8220A1 --debbuildopts -S' but it fails on signing
<pef> try --debbuildopts -Kxxx maybe
<infinito> got this: debsign: Can't find or can't read changes file /var/cache/pbuilder/dapper/result//laptoptemp_0.7.0-1_i386.changes!
<infinito> which command use MOTU people to build the packages?
<pef> personnaly debuild and dpkg-buildpackage, and pbuilder to ensure all build-depends are ok on a fresh dapper
<infinito> and when uploading to revu you use the files created with dpkg-buildpackage??
<pef> you must upload xx_source.changes file
<pef> using dput for example
<infinito> pef: which debuild command do you use?
<pef> infinito: have you read this ? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/Packaging/Tips
<infinito> pef: yes, but didnt realized about debuild
<infinito> but it seems easy
<infinito> thanks anyway for taking some time to answer these silly questions
<pef> np :] 
<siretart> slomo__: could you please approve schroot and sbuild?
<siretart> slomo__: I'll be on vac next week
<slomo__> siretart: i'm already looking at them currently :)
<siretart> cool :)
<infinito> can anyone review this? http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2255
<LaserJock_away> bddebian: go ahead and steal some karma, I'll try to catch up in Dapper+1 ;-)
<Gloubiboulga> hi LaserJock
<bddebian> Heya LaserJock:_)
<bddebian> Who is Phil Bull?
<slomo__> siretart: could you please approve glom? :)
<siretart> slomo__: done
<slomo__> siretart: thanks :)
<LaserJock> bddebian: they guy that did the MOTUScience .desktops. He isn't on IRC very often.
<bddebian> OK
<LaserJock> bddebian: having problems with the .desktops?
<infinito> is it possible for pkgs on REVU to get into ubuntu before dapper is released?
<bddebian> LaserJock: I can't get it into the menu without an Application category
<LaserJock> infinito: possible but it needs an Feature Freeze exception
<bddebian> Damn I hate just waiting for stuff to build.. :-(
<Se7h> lol
<Se7h> hi bddebian
<carthik> hey bddebian - any reason why a Gentoo grub bootsplash image should be in Ubuntu? (there is an easy bug for you to fix in grub-splashimages) :)
<bddebian> d00d, I can't fix main stuff
<bddebian> Heya Se7h
<infinito> has anyone time to give this a review? http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2255
<carthik> bddebian, grub-splashimages is not in main, now, it is in Universe...
<bddebian> Oh
<bddebian> infinito: This is a new upstream release?
<infinito> bddebian: yes
<Se7h> dam
<Se7h> python-pymedia is still as 'new' there
<Yagisan> anyone seen minghua around lately ?
<bddebian> Breifly yesterday/last night
<Yagisan> bddebian: know any other scim / language-pack gurus here ?
<Tonio_> hi everyone
<Yagisan> G'day Tonio_
<Gloubiboulga> salut Tonio_ :)
<Tonio_> yop Yagisan, Gloubiboulga
<bddebian> Heya Tonio_
<bddebian> Yagisan: No, sorry :-(
<bddebian> What's wrong with this line: ?  case `(ac_space=' '; set | grep ac_space) 2>&1` in
<Yagisan> brb, trying to get CJK to work "out-of-the-box". funny, it was easier when this was in universe ...
<Jhair> hi, I wanted to fill a bug against streamtuner which is in the universe. Wen trying to do this in malone the following was shown:  streamtuner does not use Malone as its bug tracker.  To report a bug about streamtuner, please use its official bug tracker.
<Jhair> where should I fill a bug against the packaged streamtuner?
<bddebian> Jhair: Are you filing under Ubuntu?
<slomo__> Jhair: https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/streamtuner/+filebug
<Jhair> BTW, I don't know where "the official bug tracker" for streamtuner resides
<Jhair> bddebian: yes ubuntu
<Jhair> https://launchpad.net/products/streamtuner/+filebug
<Jhair> slomo__: thanks I see... hmmmm
<Yagisan> hmm it seems that if I want to type in a CJK language, I must have everything in CJK. :(
<Jhair> slomo__: thanks! the bug was already filled: Bug #38001
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 38001 in streamtuner "streamtuner unable to load station-plugins" [Normal,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/38001
<cbx33> hey all
<bddebian> Hello cbx33
<Gloubiboulga> hi cbx33
<cbx33> hi bddebian Gloubiboulga
<cbx33> guys can someone help me out with a chroot locales problem
<cbx33> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/11888
<cbx33> I'm following this guide http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/appendix-chroot.html
<cbx33> at the section where is says run this to configure the locales
<cbx33> any ideas?
<Yagisan> cbx33: it's harmless. It will default to the "C" locale
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> i thought as much
<cbx33> anyway to fix it?
<cbx33> cos it's annoying :p - when you're expecting no output and you get that instead
<Yagisan> cbx33: dpkg-reconfigurelocales didn't help ?
<cbx33> no it didn;t
<Yagisan> cbx33: try locale-gen
<cbx33> ok done
<cbx33> lemme see if that makes a diff
<cbx33> nope
<cbx33> what file is it looking to creat|
<bddebian> aaaahhh Why don't I check Debian BTS first.. Grr
<Gloubiboulga> bddebian, because you love fixing bugs yourself :)
<bddebian> Gloubiboulga: Heh, good point :-)
<pygi> slomo: not yet? =P
<jmg> hi all
<ajmitch> bddebian: but I thought you just fixed & uploaded gcx?
<ajmitch> ignore that
<ajmitch> morning jmg
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<ajmitch> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Whoops, hello jmg also
<ajmitch> bddebian: ignore that statement, was in scrollback somewhere :)
<bddebian> NP :-)
<ajmitch> bddebian: fixed all the universe bugs yet?
#ubuntu-motu 2006-04-15
<bddebian> ajmitch: No, I think I'm losing the battle :'-(
<Yagisan> Morning all
<bddebian> Heya Yagisan
<Yagisan> bddebian: are you familiar with automake ?
<bddebian> Enough to be dangerous
<Yagisan> bddebian: great, I'm not. Is there a  nice easy way to regenerate Makefile.am without me having to type in every single .h file ?
<bddebian> Regenerate the Makefile.am?
<Yagisan> bddebian: yeah. what it lists and what actually exist are rather different
<bddebian> Oof.  I'm sure sure of an automated way to do that, sorry :-(
<Yagisan> bddebian: my upstream for a not-yet-in-ubuntu project moved to a mac, and I get to be the lucky guy to get it going on linux again.
<bddebian> Yagisan: Lucky you :-)
<Yagisan> bddebian: yes lucky me :(
<ajmitch> morning womble
<womble> Morning ajmitch
<womble> How are things in your part of the world?
<ajmitch> fairly good
<ajmitch> how about you?
<Lathiat> hey guys
<womble> Not too badly.  I'm at a client site for the next few weeks, doing unspeakable things to their systems.  The 2nd monitor they've given me to hook to my laptop is larger than my freaking TV
<ajmitch> bddebian: make sure you give the right name when attributing patches :)
<ajmitch> morning Lathiat
<Lathiat> ajmitch: still in nz? :)
<ajmitch> Lathiat: yes, did you expect me to have moved to .au?
<Lathiat> ajmitch: we can only hope
<ajmitch> sorry to disappoint, but I'm still in Dunedin :)
<bddebian> ajmitch: Did I give the wrong name?  I was worried about that :-)
<ajmitch> phil != phill ;)
<bddebian> Bah
<crimsun> it's ok, I was "David" for a while
<bddebian> ajmitch: Can I just add an install file to a cdbs package to install a desktop file?
<bddebian> Oh, Heya David
<ajmitch> bddebian: ?
<bddebian> ajmitch: gdpc is built with cdbs but has no install or files files, just a dirs file
<LaserJock_away> bddebian: you could just do a dh_install in debian/rules, I think
<jmg> hey all
<ajmitch> hello jmg
<jmg> anyone know how to set configure reprepro for a ubuntu repo?
<jmg> i've been doing apt repositories the wrong way all this time
<ajmitch> bddebian: in that case, just use a .install
<jmg> specifically what Suite: and Codename: i use
<ajmitch> can't say I've ever used reprepro
<bddebian> I have, it works pretty well
<jmg> bddebian: any hint?
<bddebian> jmg: What are you having a problem with?
<jmg> bddebian: how to configure it for ubuntu and for debian
<jmg> bddebian: if that is even possible
<jmg> bddebian: what values to use for Suite: and Codename:
<bddebian> Oh, hmm
<ajmitch> wonderful, a typical dunedin autumn day
* ajmitch will be back later
<jmg> Whee
<paridempath> whats up yo
<LaserJock> hi paridempath
<paridempath> what's your story laserjock
<LaserJock> what do you mean?
<havoc> I think I asked this already, but how bad can I expect things to be if I install dapper now?
<paridempath> what gets you out of bed in the morning
<jmg> is locales horked?
<LaserJock> havoc: no problems, dapper is perfect and you should put it on all your servers, now ;-)
<havoc> heh
<havoc> this would be going on my workstation
<havoc> the machine I'm using now
<LaserJock> I found it better than breezy was months ago so...
<LaserJock> but it sorta depends
<havoc> on?
<havoc> it's under a freeze now, right?
<havoc> mostly translations left?  or is there more?
<crimsun> jmg: WFM
<LaserJock> some people find some things that worked in brezzy don't work anymore, mostly old hardware issues I think
<havoc> LaserJock: ah, strange
<havoc> any examples?
<havoc> like video cards?
<havoc> or other crap?
<LaserJock> well, I'm not sure but I thought I saw some printer and video cards
* mode/#ubuntu-motu [+o theCore]  by ChanServ
<havoc> ok
<LaserJock> pretty much stuff that isn't so much Dapper's problem as having newer software
<jmg> crimsun: Wait For ME?
<crimsun> works for me.
<jmg> crimsun: im on ubuntu-minimal
<crimsun> what's broken?
<crimsun> this should probably be addressed in #ubuntu+1
<jmg> perl: warning: Falling back to the standard locale ("C").
<crimsun> jmg: that's not broken, that has always existed. Thank Perl.
<crimsun> gah, ECHANNEL
<theCore> uh? I'm an op
* mode/#ubuntu-motu [-o theCore]  by theCore
<Se7h> \o/ yay
<Unfrgiven> slomo_: hey dude
<LaserJock> hi Unfrgiven
<LaserJock> and slomo_
<Unfrgiven> hey LaserJock
<Unfrgiven> LaserJock: hows things?
<Unfrgiven> LaserJock: I saw the changes you made to the packaging guide regarding pbuilder. They look good. Just one thing, there is no description of what "<distro>
<Unfrgiven> LaserJock: "<distro>" needs to be substituted.
<Unfrgiven> LaserJock: I propose we put an informational message saying "dapper" or the next release codename once it is known.
<LaserJock> Unfrgiven: good point
<ajmitch> afternoon
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<LaserJock> hi ajmitch
<jmg> !seen hunger
<ajmitch> no bot like that in here
<Tm_T> ajmitch: but here is
<Tm_T> jmg: haven't been here in last 48 hours
<LaserJock> hmm, anybody know where the default Dapper background is for gnome?
<crimsun> crimsun@garnish:~$ dpkg -L ubuntu-artwork|grep warty
<crimsun> /usr/share/backgrounds/warty-final-ubuntu.png
<crimsun> /usr/share/backgrounds/warty-final-ws-ubuntu.png
<Tm_T> :)
* bddebian hugs crimsun
<crimsun> hi bddebian :)
<bddebian> :-)
<LaserJock> warty?
<crimsun> LaserJock: yes, warty.
<crimsun> that probably dates me, but..
<Tm_T> hehe
<LaserJock> well, it worked, so whatever
<bddebian> LaserJock: Still awake?
<LaserJock> yep\
<LaserJock> still working on the floor :-)
<bddebian> Bah, floor :-)
<bddebian> Who is Zygmunt?
<LaserJock> hmm, not sure
<LaserJock> bddebian: you know, you should get honorary MOTUScience membership for this ;-)
<LaserJock> bddebian: is Zygnmunt on a bug report?
<LaserJock> bddebian: oh zyga, I think he was around for a Hug Day
<bddebian> Oh yeah zyga, OK
<bddebian> He just says he is on a couple of these bugs so I didn't want to step on any toes :-)
<ajmitch> bddebian: rebuilt the universe for .desktop love?
* ajmitch has done a quick rebuild of packages depending on libssl0.9.7
<LaserJock> ajmitch: yeah, the key is to file a bug for everything. then he goes and does it
<ajmitch> will do the sort & upload
<ajmitch> LaserJock: ah right
<ajmitch> I knew I must be doing something wrong
<bddebian> Huh?  What'd I do wrong now?
<LaserJock> bddebian: the key to getting you to do all the work
<LaserJock> dang it, how does bddebian do it. I was within 1000 a couple days ago. now he has almost doubled me :/
<bddebian> I have no life :-)
<LaserJock> hmm, I wish I didn't ;-)
<chillywilly> yo
<bddebian> Heya chillywilly
<Hobbsee> hi
<bddebian> Hello Hobbsee
* Hobbsee wonders why she has a suspicious lack of sound on 2.6.15-20-386
<crimsun> what hardware?
<LaserJock> hi Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> hi LaserJock
<Hobbsee> crimsun: which in particular?  forgotten how to find it
<Hobbsee> give me a sec...then i'll need help :P
<ajmitch> hello
<ajmitch> LaserJock: simple reason, see the wiki
<bddebian> ?
<ajmitch> BddebianIsAGod
<bddebian> Bah
<bddebian> I gotta delete that freakin' page
<Hobbsee> hi ajmitch
<LaserJock> ajmitch: yeah, yeah. I should have know better
<LaserJock> bddebian: are you looking for other bugs in the packages?
<ajmitch> bddebian: it'll just come back
<ajmitch> how's it going, Hobbsee ?
<Hobbsee> good, got stopped at almost every single darned traffic light coming home from uni - when i was tryign to miss the schoolzones
<ajmitch> lucky :)
* ajmitch loves bzr
<bddebian> LaserJock: Yes, where feasable
<LaserJock> I wonder how well bzr would work for the doc team repo
<bddebian> OK, 1am is late enough for this old fart, I gotta work tomorrow.  Later folks
<bddebian> Gnight folks
<ajmitch> LaserJock: very well
<ajmitch> bddebian: slacker
<LaserJock> cya bddebian , thanks for all the work
<Unfrgiven> bddebian: gnite
<ajmitch> good night bddebian  :)
<bddebian> ajmitch: Yeah, no kidding :-)
<bddebian> LaserJock: NP
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: is there a GUI for bzr yet?
<ajmitch> Unfrgiven: not that I'm aware of
<ajmitch> ok, time for me to wander off & talk to someone about ubuntu :)
<Hobbsee> ooh fun
<Hobbsee> dont talk - just install the thing :P
<ajmitch> that's what I'm talking to him about
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: u at work?
<ajmitch> since it's not your normal pc
<ajmitch> bbl
<Hobbsee> yes, dotn talk - install it, then let him play - no talking required
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: the talking required was to sort out price
<Hobbsee> ah...
<Hobbsee> good price, or bad price?
<Hobbsee> and who gets the money, for that matter...
<ajmitch> good for me
<ajmitch> I would
* Hobbsee is curious now
<Hobbsee> nice - well done!
<Hobbsee> so you have the deal now, or is it still in the "deciding" phase?
<ajmitch> deciding, then the initial phase
<ajmitch> then after a couple of weeks or less, we see what happens from there
<Hobbsee> *nods*
<Hobbsee> cool
* ajmitch doesn't know much yet
<ajmitch> but it could end up consuming a bit of my time
<Hobbsee> this is good, or bad?
<Hobbsee> i guess good, if it's about ubuntu as well, so you'll be learning more of it anyway
<ajmitch> good
<ajmitch> in that I'd be employed
<Hobbsee> you can be a form of cri*msum - knowing everything and everything about a particular few areas :P
<Hobbsee> yeah, very good with that!
<ajmitch> argh, he spelt my name wrong
* ajmitch blames chillywilly 
<LaserJock> hi dholbach
<dholbach> heya LaserJock!
<ajmitch> hey dholbach!
<dholbach> good morning motu world!
<ajmitch> dholbach: fyi, I've already done a rebuild of the libssl0.9.7 depending packages, you want me to upload those that Just Work? :)
* ajmitch had done the rebuild before your mail, was just too lazy/busy to upload
<dholbach> ajmitch:sounds like a good idea
<ajmitch> I should talk to siretart about setting up sbuild
<Hobbsee> hi dholbach
<dholbach> heya Hobbsee!
<dholbach> how are you all doing?
* Hobbsee is wasting time, reading the newspaper before work :P
<LaserJock> crimsun is doing a wonderfull proofreading job on the Packaging Guide right now
<ajmitch> dholbach: I *might* get a job soon ;)
<dholbach> ajmitch:rock on!
<dholbach> ajmitch: that's great news
<ajmitch> there's potential for it, anyway
<ajmitch> ubuntu-related, too
<siretart> morning folks
<jmg> http://debian.thoughtcrime.co.nz/ubuntu/
<LaserJock> hi siretart
<siretart> dholbach: I'll be on vac this week and return this weekend
<jmg> ajmitch: you mean we'll hire you? :)
<dholbach> siretart: oh nice... so you finished all your work and can relax a bit now?
<jmg> ajmitch: or someone else?
<ajmitch> jmg: you can hire me if you want :)
<siretart> dholbach: I'd suggest that you either approve uvf requests with 2 voices, of find a vacation replacement ;)
<ajmitch> but I don't recall being contacted by your HR dept yet :)
<ajmitch> siretart: you're going away?
<siretart> dholbach: sort of. I think I worked on most of my backlog of work
<siretart> ajmitch: I'll return this weekend
<siretart> ajmitch: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SbuildLVMHowto
<ajmitch> siretart: thanks
<dholbach> siretart: nice... where are you going for VAC? :)
<siretart> dholbach: vienna :)
* ajmitch doesn't have any unallocated space on LVM at the moment
<ajmitch> siretart: I hope you enjoy it
<dholbach> siretart: I really should go there too... I didn't visit my sister yet :/
<ajmitch> siretart: what's your current thoughts on zope-zwiki?
<dholbach> siretart: but have a good time down there!
<siretart> ajmitch: then setup schroot to use a chroot on a plain subdir or a file (tarball, like pbuilder)
<siretart> ajmitch: plain subdir chroots (traditional chroots) won't give you session management, though
<ajmitch> hm, I see we're just waiting on slomo for zope-zwiki now
<ajmitch> schroot on a file will?
<siretart> ajmitch: I agree with dholbach, let's do that fast, so that we find bugs early
<siretart> ajmitch: I think so, but I never tried that
<ajmitch> ok
* ajmitch will have to try
<siretart> it is mentioned in the schroot.conf(5)
<ajmitch> it might make my mass rebuilds a bit cleaner than just processing a list through pbuilder
<LaserJock> I've got a couple general UVF/FF exception questions.
<siretart> ajmitch: I use it on lvm, because I got new harddisks. if you want to extend it for schroot-file backend, just extend the wiki page. it might interest more ppl
<LaserJock> I requested a sync for a new package before FF but it got stuck in the sync black hole, do I need a FF exception now to get it in?
<ajmitch> siretart: I've got new hard drives as well, using LVM on RAID
<siretart> ajmitch: the traditional sbuild mode is 'split' mode. that means that you have a 'normal' chroot, but use apt and dpkg from the host
<siretart> ajmitch: exactly my setup. there is nothing faster than lvm snapshots on a raid 1 :)
<Mithrandir> siretart: no, new packages in universe is fine.  https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/sounder/2006-March/005107.html
<LaserJock> dholbach: did the FF process get worked out? Do we need to do bug reports?
<ajmitch> siretart: probably not, but my main build volume is 450GB RAID0 :)
<LaserJock> so is LVM faster than non-LVM?
<dholbach> LaserJock: sorry, I don't know
<siretart> LaserJock: creating an snapshot on my machine is about 2 secs, extracting a pbuilder tarball about 20seks
<siretart> LaserJock: removing the tarball takes longer as well than removing the lvm snapshot (which works with cow techniques)
<ajmitch> LaserJock: afaik there's no current process for FF exceptions - I'd think that handling it in the same wasy as UVF would make sense
<LaserJock> hmm, I wonder if the new sync process essentially would cover that. If I make a sync request, somebody on the ubuntu-archive team has to OK it
<Lathiat> you could also use unionfs yeh?
<Lathiat> with a tmpfs
<Lathiat> also pbuilder-uml can do COW
<ajmitch> Lathiat: you can't build too much on tmpfs
<ajmitch> I'd hate to think how it'd go building firefox or oo.o
<Lathiat> thats what lots of swap is for
<Lathiat> :)
<Lathiat> or even a disk image to unionfs too :)
<Gloubiboulga> dholbach, I have a gnome-translate package (almost) ready, is ubuntu-desktop still interested in it?
<dholbach> sounds nice
<ajmitch> Lathiat: bah, I don't have any swap & I intend to keep it that way :)
<Gloubiboulga> dholbach, ok, I just have to add a man page, and I'll dput it on REVU
<dholbach> nice work - cool
* ajmitch waits very very patiently for a daily install image 
<Hobbsee> bye all!
<cbx33> hi all
<cbx33> I'm trying to edit some documentation in the form of a man page
<cbx33> there is currently a .sgml and a .8 file
<cbx33> which one do i need to edit, does the .sgml create the .8 file by converting|
<jabra> for the package nvidia-glx in dapper has it been updated yet?
<LaserJock> cbx33: yes, you can create the man page from the .sgml
<cbx33> ok...I'll edit the sgml....
<allee> cbx33: edit the .sgml file.   Have a look at the rules file. Try 'debuild clean' and the .8 file should be deleted
<cbx33> do i use the sgml2txt function there?
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> thank you
<jabra> guess it does
<allee> cbx33: docbook2x-man
<cbx33> thank you
<cbx33> w00t...
<ajmitch> great to see kubuntu rumours going round & getting completely blown out of proportion
<ajmitch> poor Riddell :)
<freeflying> ajmitch where is the rumours about kubuntu ?
<ajmitch> freeflying: various crappy 'news' sites
<ajmitch> http://www.kdedevelopers.org/node/1917 for some actual info
<KillerKiwi2005> is there a list of packages waiting for inclusion for ubuntu?
<freeflying> ajmitch got it ,thx
<ajmitch> KillerKiwi2005: what do you mean by waiting for inclusion?
<KillerKiwi2005> im looking at http://sax.berlios.de/ and wonadering if its slated to make it into ubuntu at any time
<ajmitch> packages that have been started & are being reviewed get uploaded to revu.tauware.de, so check there first
<ajmitch> otherwise we don't know if some people decide to package stuff by themselves & not tell us
<KillerKiwi2005> ajmitch: kind of stange, nothing on x config in luanchpad or wiki as far as i can tell
<Toadstool> hi here
<Gloubiboulga> Hi there
<Gloubiboulga> I have an issue when building gnome-translate with pbuilder: http://pastebin.com/650909
<Gloubiboulga> I don't really know how I can handle this, any idea?
<Unfrgiven> dholbach: ping
<Unfrgiven> slomo_: ping
<slomo_> Unfrgiven: pong
<Unfrgiven> slomo_: i take it meebey didnt upload MD 0.10?
<Unfrgiven> slomo_: to debian i meant
<slomo_> Unfrgiven: nope... upstream does insane things :) we spent most of the time to find a solution for the stetic binary they have in their tarball without any sources...
<Unfrgiven> slomo_: ugghhhh. binary? dodgy dodgy
<dholbach> Unfrgiven: pong - hey! :)
<Unfrgiven> dholbach: how r u?
<slomo_> Unfrgiven: it's not the first one :) but for the other's we have the things already packaged... well, we will package this with the binary for now and tell people in debian/copyright that the sources can be retrieved from mono svn... i think the package may be ready soon :)
<dholbach> Unfrgiven: fine thanks... how are you?
<slomo_> hi daniel :)
<dholbach> hey slomo_ :)
<Unfrgiven> dholbach: good good. ive had some time on my hands so ive been getting involved again
<dholbach> Unfrgiven: good to have you back :)
<lifeless> slomo_: thats really not good enough if its GPL licenced
<slomo_> lifeless: i know... but it's MIT licensed
<lifeless> k
<slomo_> lifeless: otherwise i would've thrown some stones at them :) (and GPLed libraries are bad anyway)
<lifeless> slomo_: they aren't 'bad' per se IMO. Just hard for some folk to use
<ajmitch> hi lifeless, slomo_
<slomo_> hi ajmitch
<lifeless> hija
<ajmitch> dholbach: so what do you say to having zope 2.9 in dapper? ;)
<ajmitch> 2.7 is getting removed from debian
<dholbach> ajmitch: please ask doko for that
<ajmitch> he'll possibly just tell me to deal with it, being universe
* ajmitch will check
<doko> ajmitch: dude, you're member of the zope team as well ;)
<Unfrgiven> slomo_: so are they going to release the source for stetic?
<ajmitch> doko: yeah, but dholbach wants me to pass everything by you :)
<dholbach> we can't possibly say "we tested it", can we?
* ajmitch has a few things to pass by debian as well
<dholbach> ajmitch: hm? I just have no clue about it and trust other people's advice
<doko> ajmitch: talk with fabio, he did want to prepare a list of packages to sync
<slomo_> Unfrgiven: it's in svn
<ajmitch> ok
<slomo_> Unfrgiven: http://svn.myrealbox.com/viewcvs/trunk/stetic
* ajmitch will try & chase up the zope-zwiki debian maintainer again also
<Unfrgiven> slomo_: cool.
<ajmitch> sigh, more code that just fails on amd64
<zakame> hi all
<infinito> has anyone a second to review this? http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2255
<Gloubiboulga> hey zakame
<nomed> hi all
<nomed> hey Gloubiboulga
<nomed> one question .. i get this W
<nomed> old-fsf-address-in-copyright-file <--
<nomed> ?
<Gloubiboulga> hi nomed
<Gloubiboulga> it's not a big issue
<Gloubiboulga> if the sources headers use an adress, just keep the same in the debian/copyright file
<zakame> hey Gloubiboulga
<Toadstool> heya zakame
<zakame> hello Toadstool
<Gloubiboulga> nomed, but you can ping upstream and propose them to update the adress ;)
<nomed> i guess it 's what i'll do :)
<zakame> nomed: just ping upstream, it's not really your problem :)
<zakame> nomed: of course, feel free to submit a patch :)
<nomed> zakame, yep
<nomed> one more question ..
<nomed> i have this libfoo11
<nomed> of course they don't really conflicts with libfoo10 ...
<nomed> but once you've installed the newer one ..
<nomed> the v 10 is not really needed ..
<nomed> should i add a conflicts entry ?
<Toadstool> nomed: I think a Replaces: is a better option but I'm not an expert ;)
<zakame> nomed: does libfoo11 obsolete the older version?
<ajmitch> hey koke
<Gloubiboulga> infinito, I can't find this package in ubuntu, is this the first release?
<koke> hi all!
<zakame> hey ajmitch koke
<ajmitch> hey zakame, how's it going/
<zakame> ajmitch: just committed a fix for malone 38619
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 38619 in balsa "FTBFS: using deprecated GNOME_PARAM_POPT_TABLE" [Major,Fix committed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/38619
<nomed> zakame, the problem is that it may be possible user has some bin .. that he wrote
<nomed> that could need those libs ..
<ajmitch> zakame: nice :)
<nomed> that's why i just added a replaces entry ..
<nomed> but in most of the cases i guess users should consider old libs obsolete
<nomed> i do not really know what to do here ..
<zakame> bbl
<ajmitch> nomed: Replaces is only meant to be used when there's some file overlap between packages
<ajmitch> nomed: also libraries are meant to be parallel installable, so you shouldn't need to have a newer lib conflict/replace the older
<ajmitch> a fun doc to read is the debian library packaging guide
<nomed> ajmitch, perfect so it's fine as it is :)
* Toadstool is going to read the debian library packaging guide...
<ugner> is it true about kubuntu?
<ajmitch> ugner: do you mean the wild & completely unsubstantiated rumours?
<ajmitch> or what 'it' do you refer to?
<ugner> ajmitch: how unsubstantiated and how rumoural can they be when the site itself is offline??
<ajmitch> www.kubuntu.org is online as usual
<ugner> ajmitch: i mean, isn't that a proof?
<ajmitch> a proof of what? :)
<ajmitch> either way, this really is off-topic for here
<infinito> Gloubiboulga: yes, its the first release for ubuntu
<Gloubiboulga> infinito, ok, then 1 changelog entry is enough :)
<Gloubiboulga> and the version should be 0.7.0-0ubuntu1
<Gloubiboulga> raphink, ping
<infinito> Gloubiboulga: oups, sorry.. i was doing .debs for downloading from my site since 0.1...
<raphink> Gloubiboulga: pong
<Gloubiboulga> raphink, hello
<raphink> hi Gloubiboulga
<Gloubiboulga> tu pourrais lancer revu-report sur laptoptemp stp ?
<raphink> ok
<raphink> atta
<Gloubiboulga> thx
<raphink> je te fais a
<raphink> c parti
<Gloubiboulga> :)
<ugner> ajmitch: where is this topic on topic?
<infinito> Gloubiboulga: i'm gonna upload right now a version with correct changelog
<Gloubiboulga> infinito, just a minute
<infinito> Gloubiboulga: ok
<Gloubiboulga> infinito, you can bump debhelper version to >=5.0.0
<infinito> Gloubiboulga: debhelper >=5.0.0 done
<raphink> Gloubiboulga: done
<Gloubiboulga> raphink, thanks :)
<infinito> Gloubiboulga: anything else i should change?
<Gloubiboulga> infinito, I check a last little thing :)
<Gloubiboulga> err, I can't dl the .deb :/
<infinito> Gloubiboulga: i can't neither... something about permissions... but i think is not my fault...
<Gloubiboulga> infinito, no, it's not your fault :)
<ugner> ajmitch: and what is to be done about that? i love ubuntu and i would like it to be so easy for me too to say they are just rumours.
<Gloubiboulga> infinito, I'm not a MOTU, so I can't advocate, and MOTUs might have more comments
<Gloubiboulga> but your package looks great imo
<infinito> Gloubiboulga: thanks
<Gloubiboulga> ah, found some other issues :/
<Gloubiboulga> infinito, you've set arch 'all', but it should be 'any' instead
<infinito> Gloubiboulga: uops
<Gloubiboulga> it's not pure python
<infinito> it's pure python code using autotools to build
<Gloubiboulga> and dh_python isn't called in the rules, so ${python:Depends} doesn't work
<infinito> Gloubiboulga: so should i add dh_python to the rules?
<cbx33> bbl guys with my FIRST BUG FIX :D
<Gloubiboulga> infinito, yes
<ugner> "a number of Kubuntu developers are complaining that Canonical is not answering their requests"
<Gloubiboulga> it's not called using the cdbs gnome class IIRC
<infinito> so just adding "dh_python" to the rules file works?
<Gloubiboulga> depends on what "just adding" means to you ;)
<Gloubiboulga> you have to call it during the binary-install rule
<Mithrandir> hub: iirc, you no longer has the hardware you used when filing https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/xkeyboard-config/+bug/21163 ?
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 21163 in xkeyboard-config xserver-xorg "can't use proper modifier with custom keymap" [Normal,Needs info] 
<infinito> Gloubiboulga: i don't have too much knowledge about rules file...
<Gloubiboulga> infinito, have you read the cdbs documentation?
<Gloubiboulga> it helps a lot :)
<Gloubiboulga> and have a look at some cdbs packages standing on REVU maybe
<Gloubiboulga> raphink's packages are good exemples :)
<Toadstool> for simple packages, cdbs is really easy to use and there's a lot of examples ;)
<infinito> Gloubiboulga: i've just added this: binary-install/laptoptemp:: dh_python -plaptoptemp
<infinito> is that enough?
<Gloubiboulga> infinito, it should be enough :)
<infinito> Gloubiboulga: great
<Gloubiboulga> infinito, a last thing, .pyc files should be removed from the package I think
<infinito> ummm
<infinito> Gloubiboulga: i'm not sure how to tell autotools not to compile the python files...
<Gloubiboulga> infinito, you can compile the files, that's not the problem
<Gloubiboulga> you just have to remove the pyc file from the package after the build
<Gloubiboulga> http://www.debian.org/doc/packaging-manuals/python-policy/ch-module_packages.html chapter 2.5
<infinito> that manual says using dh_python the pyc files should be removed automatically
<infinito> in fact, it does work, adding dh_python cleans the pyc files :)
<Gloubiboulga> nice :) I didn't know that
<infinito> just one more question...
<freeflying> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2258
<freeflying> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2259
<infinito> why with Architecture: any when building i get _i386 package instead of _all package?
<freeflying> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2261
<freeflying> looking for reviewer
<Mithrandir> because that's what arch: any means.
<infinito> Mithrandir: so if i want other architectur pkgs, what should i do?
<Mithrandir> infinito: they'll be _amd64 packages if you build on amd64, etc.
<infinito> Mithrandir: aps, ok... but no way to cross-build them on i386?
<Mithrandir> infinito: no, why would you want to?
<infinito> Mithrandir: for example, to put some .debs for users on my site (amd64, i386, ppc)
<Mithrandir> infinito: you could always try playing around with qemu or something, but I'd recommend just getting them compiled on the correct hardware.
<infinito> Mithrandir: ok, thanks for the info ;)
<infinito> does anyone know why the .orig.tar.gz has not been uploaded to revu with the other files? http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2262
<infinito> Gloubiboulga: to upload using dput the .orig.tar.gz what should i do?
<Gloubiboulga> infinito, try with the -f flag
<infinito> Gloubiboulga: ummm the .sources file doesn't include the .orig in its files section
<freeflying> infinito: debuild -S -sa
<infinito> freeflying: thank u very much ;)
<freeflying> infinito:  :)
<freeflying> infinito: maybe u can add watch file
<infinito> freeflying: ok, im gonna do it
<infinito> freeflying, Gloubiboulga: could you take a look at the pkg now please? http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2265
<freeflying> infinito: W: laptoptemp: old-fsf-address-in-copyright-file
<infinito> freeflying: where can i find the new address??
<freeflying> infinito: quote it from the latest GPL license file
<Unfrgiven> im trying to edit my apt/sources.list inside my pbuilder environment. so i use pbuilder login. but when I exit, it reverts my changes. ive forgotten how to make it save them. i think it had to do with the return code. does anyone know?
<Yagisan> Unfrgiven: I just edit them in /etc/pbuilder/apt.config/sources.list and do a sudo pbuilder create
<ajmitch> Unfrgiven: --save-after-login
<Unfrgiven> Yagisan: i haven't configured my pbuilder to use /etc/pbuilder/apt.config.
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: ah thats it. thanks!
<Yagisan> Unfrgiven: but I have an apt-cacher setup to save me downloading the debs for every box here
<Unfrgiven> Yagisan: I use apt-proxy :)
<infinito> freeflying: ok, fixed the copyright file
<freeflying> infinito: use debuild again for check
<infinito> freeflying: done and uploaded
<infinito> freeflying: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2267
<Yagisan> Unfrgiven: I tried that, but it was slower then a direct download on the p2 233 server I set it up on.
<freeflying> infinito: you need motu's review
<Gloubiboulga> dholbach, gnome-translate is on REVU
<Gloubiboulga> it was longer than expected :/
<dholbach> Gloubiboulga: nice - could you write to ubuntu-desktop@?
<infinito> so any motu has time to review this? http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2267
<Gloubiboulga> dholbach, sure, asking for a review?
<dholbach> Gloubiboulga: yeah... i'm quite busy atm, so that'd be the best place to ask for comments
<freeflying> dholbach is around , infinito you may ask him fo review
<Gloubiboulga> dholbach, ok
<dholbach> freeflying: i'm too busy, sorry.
<freeflying> dholbach: hehe  :)
<freeflying> dholbach: seems we are lack of motu's review now :)
<dholbach> freeflying: that particular bit was always problematic
<dholbach> and even more so in a time, when people are focusing on getting bugs fixed for release
<Yagisan> yep. Hopefully after release there may be some reviewers with some free time
* Yagisan wishes he had a tool that could just scan all the .c and .h files and write it's own makefile
<azeem> automake is mostly "list all .c files in SOURCES and all .h files in HEADERS"
<infinito> one question... if a pkg is accepted on universe, what should i do everytime there's a new upstream version?
<Yagisan> azeem: I know. I get to update automake files where a large portion of the source it refers to ins now gone, replaced by new source, with different names and places.
<Yagisan> azeem: I just wist I could automate this more
<Yagisan> s/wist/wish
<azeem> this sounds like a hopefully infrequent enough incident to warrant automating
<Yagisan> azeem: nope. I'm helping upstream identify, purge and rewrite non-gpl compatible code in in their project and it will take awhile. And now I'm the only linux user interested, so I get to inherit the automake stuff.
<azeem> heh :-/
<infinito> Gloubiboulga: does it look ok to you now? http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2267
<Gloubiboulga> infinito, checking, but you'll have to find a MOTU to advocate it
<infinito> Gloubiboulga: thanks :)
<ugner> is it true about kubuntu?
<azeem> "it"?
<freeflying> ugner: what's your mean
<Yagisan> ugner: don't know, don't care. Go ask the kubuntu people.
<azeem> ugner: http://www.kdedevelopers.org/node/1917
<ugner> Yagisan: what the heck do you mean? isn't this KUBUNTU? is kubuntu not ubuntu???
<jmg> whats the email address to send to revu to get an account created?
<ugner> freeflying: osnews says ubuntu is dropping kubuntu
<ajmitch> jmg: keyring@tauware.de, or ask someone like me
<tseng> "Don't believe everything you see in osnews"
<azeem> ugner: please read http://www.kdedevelopers.org/node/1917
<tseng> is a good idea.
<ajmitch> tseng: s/every/any/
<ugner> azeem: thank you
<ugner> tseng: osnews is a very interesting site
<freeflying> ugner: rumour
<ajmitch> a very very shoddy site, worse than slashdot most days
<Yagisan> ugner: what I mean is, we here, care about all of ubuntu, in universe and multiverse. We don't care for rumours. You should have gotten the hint by now, but it seems you haven't.
<ugner> freeflying: then why did they go offline?
<ajmitch> ugner: didn't I tell you before that kubuntu.org is still up & running and has always been?
<ugner> Yagisan: i thought you were implying kubuntu was not supported by ubuntu, which anoyed me, as i love kubuntu
<tseng> ugner: it may be interesting, but it is full of exagerations and rumor mongering
<ugner> ajmitch: i am talking about .de!
<tseng> ugner: any other news is just a link to another site.
<freeflying> ugner: it's just kubuntu.de not kubuntu.org
<ugner> ajmitch: wasn't that obvious??
<ugner> freeflying: yes, but kubuntu.de MATTERS
<azeem> ugner: not in here, though
<ugner> tseng: oh, i see
<ugner> tseng: then why do they take it offline?
<ajmitch> ugner: and isn't it obvious that kubuntu.de isn't canonical, and them deciding to pack up their toys doesn't imply anything at all about support?
<ajmitch> ugner: ask them
<jmg> <keyring@tauware.de>: host line2.tauware.de[213.239.249.200]  said: 550 unknown
<jmg>     user (in reply to RCPT TO command)
<jmg> broken mta :)
<ugner> azeem: do we hate kde? do the motu hate kde? why wouldn't kubuntu matter in here?
<azeem> ugner: kubuntu.de does not matter here
<Yagisan> ugner: I'm hoping this is just a language issue
<ugner> ajmitch: we are a community. we are not cannonical.
<ajmitch> ugner: you're jumping to all sorts of erroneous conclusions
<azeem> ugner: bring it up to the community council if you want, this channel is about universe maintenance
<ajmitch> jmg: sorry, keyring@tiber.tauware.de
<ugner> ajmitch: anything that's happening bad affects us
<ugner> ajmitch: i don't use kubuntu because i love cannonical
<ajmitch> jmg: but I'm just going to read the mail to get your key ID anyway
<jmg> ajmitch: i use a different key for signing
<jmg> ajmitch: that's on my build box
<ajmitch> jmg: yes, but you have to tell me the key id anyway
<jmg> ok, ill do it tomorrow...
<ugner> Yagisan: language issue? what are you refering to, more exactly? (english is not my first or second language)
<ajmitch> and that public key has to be on a keyserver
<Yagisan> ugner: we care for the *packages* in universe and multiverse. gnome, kde, xfcem windowmaker, ncurses, sdl, whatever. last time I checked kubuntu.de was not a package.
<ugner> azeem: please recommend me a better channel
<jmg> #ubuntu?
<dholbach> ugner: the discussion was about sponsoring a local kubuntu webpage... it has nothing to do with support and hating/loving anything
<dholbach> and discussing it in a channel makes no sense
<ugner> Yagisan: why, of course kubuntu.de is not a package :))
<Yagisan> ugner: #kubuntu ?
<ugner> Yagisan: now i understand why you are confused
<zakame> hi all
<dholbach> that's something that has to be discussed between the owners of the site and canonical prepresentatives
<azeem> ugner: uhm, can you please stop this discussion in here now?
<dholbach> end of story
<ajmitch> Yagisan: they've probably got enough to deal with
<tseng> canonical wont even give me an account in their data center
<freeflying> ugner: maybe #canonical :)
<tseng> so if you were to go everywhere posting tirades about canonical hating mono
<zakame> what's up?
<tseng> it would be about as silly.
<ajmitch> hey zakame
<zakame> hello ajmitch
<Yagisan> ugner: I'm not confused. I'm trying to get the point over to you, that if it isn't related to packaging, we probably can't help you.
<Yagisan> ajmitch: true
<zakame> wha'ts with prepresentatives all of a suddent ? =)
<ugner> dholbach: ok, but the language in which one showsexpresses their not being related shouldn't (necessarily) express lack of interest on the kubuntu community plus exclusive credit for cannonical. this is my point.
<ugner> shows/expresses
<ugner> Yagisan: right
<dholbach> ugner: it's nothing we all have to decide, so there's nothing to do
<dholbach> if Jane/Mark/whoever decides to give them money, that's their decision
<dholbach> kubuntu is supported, end of story
<tseng> this isnt even over money
<tseng> so knock it off.
<ugner> dholbach: it was not about money, maybe you should read their "complaint"
<dholbach> yeah, the discussion is off-topic and irrelevant here
<zakame> how long is until the next packages.u.c update?
<ugner> dholbach: where would it be relevant? what is the right channel for this?
<tseng> ugner: warning #1, please take it elsewhere
<ajmitch> zakame: dunno, is it updating still?
<ajmitch> zakame: awhile ago it stopped, I never checked if it restarted
<ugner> tseng: HELLO, this is what i AM TRYING
<ugner> tseng: please recommend me a better channel
<azeem> ugner: start in #ubuntu
<tseng> ugner: #nowhere
<azeem> ugner: just stop it in here
<freeflying> ugner: #canonical
<tseng> freeflying: uhhh
<ugner> tseng: you are not pleasant to talk to
<zakame> ajmitch: it hasn't yet, I was observing this since my uploads a few days ago
<tseng> #canonical is staff matters only.
<tseng> ugner: i am sorry to hear that, you have been asked several times
<freeflying> ugner: maybe mark the right person you wanna talk
<tseng> you can join in the frenzy on osnews if that floats your boat
<tseng> but there isnt really anything to discuss
<tseng> canonical doesnt give me an account either.
<ugner> freeflying: what makes you think you are the right person?
<tseng> its data center policy
<freeflying> ugner: me?no, it's Mark
<zakame> ugner: pray tell me, is this releated to helping shapte the Ubuntu Universe? =)
<Unfrgiven> tseng: hey hows it goin
<tseng> Unfrgiven: hi there
<Gloubiboulga> infinito, your package looks really better :)
<tseng> Unfrgiven: just moved
<zakame> Hobbsee!
<Hobbsee> zakame!
<ajmitch> hello Hobbsee
<ugner> freeflying: oh, you forgot to add "is", and i thought it as an advice, something like: "show us the right person you wanna talk to"
<Hobbsee> hi ajmitch
<Unfrgiven> tseng: moved? where to?
* Hobbsee is home from work ON TIME!
<azeem> ugner: are you involved with kubuntu.de?
<tseng> Unfrgiven: new apartment.
<zakame> Hobbsee: rocking!
<ugner> freeflying: i thought it as a retort to my "you are not pleasant to talk to"
<Unfrgiven> tseng: excellent. still in the US?
<zakame> tseng: just moved?
<ugner> azeem: not at all, but i thought that as a loss. don't you?
<azeem> ugner: also, you have been asked to move this discussion elsewere
<tseng> Unfrgiven: yeah.
<ugner> azeem: a loss for the community
<Yagisan> ugner: not at all. We still have kde
<ugner> azeem: i thought i was simply answering your question.
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: well done :)
<azeem> mea culpa
<Unfrgiven> tseng: cool. so you all settled in then? I see your net connection is up so thats the important thing(s) covered ;)
<tseng> Unfrgiven: nah im at work now
<zakame> malone 29503
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 29503 in blackbox "Blackbox fails to install if Fluxbox is also installed due to shared /usr/bin/bsetroot" [Normal,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/29503
<tseng> Unfrgiven: gotta get back.
<zakame> hmm, that probably needs justa Conflits, right?
<Unfrgiven> tseng: k cya later.
<zakame> s#flits#flicts
<ajmitch> Unfrgiven: revu login is your email address on your gpg key, which is gmail. is that ok?
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: yep, its fine with me.
<ajmitch> Unfrgiven: ok, retrieve your password to find out what it is :)
<ajmitch> marked you as reviewer, too
<ajmitch> Unfrgiven: able to login yet?
* Yagisan actually read the kubuntu.de complaint now. Wow, that sort of reminds me of how my kids sometimes act when they don't get their way. 
<Hobbsee> hehe
<infinito> any MOTU here??
<cbx33> w00t...another bugfix on the way i think
<cbx33> :D
<Yagisan> infinito: this place is full of them. Sadly they are not mind readers. Just ask your question(s).
<cbx33> Yagisan, thanks for the help earlier
<infinito> just want a review of this, if its posible: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2267
<cbx33> anyone know how to get rid of these perl warnings about locales
<zakame> they bother you?
<cbx33> yes
<Yagisan> cbx33: Me ? help ? you still have the errors. I have been ignoring them now for so long I don't even notice them
<cbx33> make it bloody difficult to read output
<cbx33> sometimes there can be 40 of them in one apt-get install
<cbx33> do you not agree?  or do you know something i don;t :p
* Yagisan is off to bed after a 37hrs of being awake. Next stop, coma city
<cbx33> nn Yagisan
<zakame> Yagisan: tc
<cbx33> take a break
<Hobbsee> hehe night Yagisan
<Yagisan> cbx33: I have kids. I'll never get a break for the next 18+ years
<zakame> hi jdthood ! =)
<jdthood> zakame: Hi there
<zakame> jdthood: can I bother you a bit with checking the latest patch malone 38009? =)
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 38009 in resolvconf "Breezy -> Dapper transition needs proper /etc/resolvconf/run handling" [Normal,Needs info]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/38009
<jdthood> Sure
* jdthood reads the discussion
* jdthood looks at "Revised version of Elias' patch"
<jdthood> zakame: The indentation doesn't look right.
<zakame> jdthood: it looks like sebastian has some vim setting that changed the indents
<jdthood> He just has a slightly unusual way of indenting comments
<jdthood> zakame: Well, it looks OK when I read it as a patch.
<ivoks> hi all
<zakame> hi ivoks
<zakame> but?
<jdthood> By making assumptions it is possible to simplify the code.  When I originally wrote resolvconf it wasn't clear whether or not /run would be introduced.
<jdthood> I mean: the patch successfully simplifies things.  Good.
<zakame> ah
* zakame was busy tracking blackbox too
<jdthood> Using /dev/shm was always a bit nauseating, but it was the best alternative and still is in Debian since Debian still lacks an early writable run directory.
<ivoks> hoho barry
<bddebian> Heya ivoks
<zakame> indeed... I've been hesitant applying it since I botched the previous one :P I'm rebuilding it on my onw machine right now
<bddebian> Hello gang
<zakame> bddebian!
<bddebian> Hi zakame :-)
<zakame> hello Seveas
<Hobbsee> hi Seveas
<jdthood> zakame: The patched postinst looks fine when I read it.
<Seveas> hi
<zakame> ok
<jdthood> zakame: My reward is that I now know how to fix resolvconf on my own system.  :)
<zakame> jdthood: w00t! =)
<freeflying> If I found bugs on malone are not really a bug  ,what shall I do ?
<bddebian> Close it
<zakame> close it, politely :D
<jdthood> zakame: It looks to me as if fixing this will fix the other bugs filed against resolvconf on launchpad.
<bddebian> Nah, close it with authoritie... ;-P
<zakame> jdthood: indeed, trying it right now on the other machine...
<freeflying> bddebian: but how to close it ?  :)
<bddebian> freeflying: Just reject it but put a "friendly" comment about why you are rejecting it :-)
* jdthood wonders whether it was really a good idea to change all the boot sequence numbers
<ivoks> freeflying: copy paste something from fortunes :)
<bddebian> ivoks: :-)
<zakame> hmm why is boson-base producing a barebones boson?
<zakame> ah, I'm stupid, that's why :P
<zakame> hi mgalvin
<mgalvin> hi zakame
<jdthood> "boson-base producing a barebones boson"!
<zakame> yes, I'm on crack :P
<bddebian> And you aren't sharing? :-)
<Se7h> LOL
<zakame> please, see DhIconCacheChanges :D
<Se7h> hey bddebian
<bddebian> Hello Se7h
<Se7h> hi all
<zakame> good excuse to look into the open bugs for each package listed there too =)
<cbx33> where do people normally post their debdiffs?
<cbx33> on their own sites and link on malone?
<zakame> normally, as malone attachments
<cbx33> i installed a package to day....a rather trivial one...on removal it wanted to take ubuntu-desktop with it...is this a bug?
<Hobbsee> which package was this?
<cbx33> one of the iputils pacakges I working on a bug for
<cbx33> it's a tiny utility
<bddebian> Ack, qgis is a pig :-(
<cbx33> doesn't need ubuntu-desktop for installation
<zachy> hi all
<bddebian> Hello zachy
<zachy> cut in the middle of a build :/
<zakame> hmm did somebody touch dh_iconcache today?
<zakame> it not longer generates the right postinst/postrm
<zakame> gn8 all!
<bddebian> Later zakame
<zakame> later bddebian :D
<OdyX> Hey all. I'm looking for someone to package (for me :D ) theora-mmx. This lib is supposed to speed up thoggen by 3-4 on supported procs. This could be great advantage for Ogg/theora/vorbis encoding.
<freeflying-ibook> OdyX: more details about this
<OdyX> freeflying-ibook: details ? Like ?
<OdyX> Branch : http://svn.xiph.org/branches/theora-mmx
<OdyX> Issues for Thoggen: http://thoggen.net/download/index.html#known-issues
<OdyX> has never been packaged (as google says)
<azeem> shouldn't this go into mainline, rather?
<azeem> why does regular theora not have those optimizations?
<OdyX> azeem: 'cause not every proc is mmx ?
<azeem> you can detect that at runtime
<OdyX> azeem: 'cause theora-mmx doesn't compile on PPC/AMD64 ?
<tseng> code can be built conditionally
<tseng> or even at runtime
<azeem> /usr/lib/libssl.so.0.9.7
<azeem> /usr/lib/i486/libssl.so.0.9.7
<azeem> /usr/lib/i586/libssl.so.0.9.7
<azeem> /usr/lib/i686/cmov/libssl.so.0.9.7
<OdyX> so what? wait for theora to include this in mainline ?
<azeem> is it going to happen?
<azeem> maybe there is a reason why it hasn't happened yet?
<OdyX> I don't know.
<OdyX> http://kubuntu.pastebin.com/651662 <- This is what xiph guys say.
<bddebian> tseng!!
<azeem> OdyX: that's not very conclusive
<OdyX> azeem: In fact, I'm only user, so I know (from what I read) that theora-mmx should speed thoggen up, but I don't know all technical background. Feel free to speak in #xiph... Sorry for not being so conclusive...
<azeem> OdyX: I mean the discussion amongst the developers in that paste are not conclusive :)
<OdyX> So what should I do ?
<azeem> I find it strange that they do not try to optimize their reference implementation
<OdyX> azeem: in fact, it's not their "work", is it ?
<azeem> everybody seems to use it, and if you want to make a good impression, it should be as fast as possible without corrupting the source base
<azeem> it's a branch in their subversion repository, right?
<OdyX> seems to be, as far as I understand...
<OdyX> and... hum.... http://svn.xiph.org/branches/theora-mmx/debian/ <- means a package should be doable (at least in Debian), hmm ?
<azeem> it's just a branch
<azeem> I guess that's the regular Debian packaging for theora
<OdyX> OK
<azeem> OdyX: I asked one of the Debian people doing theora, maybe he has a better overview on this matter
<azeem> might take a while till he responds
<OdyX> So.. theora-mmx.deb doesn't seem for tomorrow...
<azeem> OdyX: you can create one and advertise it to Ubuntu users, of course
<azeem> but I think some more strategic planning might be alright, before we duplicate the whole theora source
<OdyX> means ?
<OdyX> strategic planning ?
<azeem> well, e.g. whether the mmx patches should just get included into the libtheora package, rather than having a package on its own
<OdyX> Yeah... seems good.
<OdyX> but Ubuntu is going too fast, FLOSS projects cannot follow... :D
<cbx33> Hi LaserJock
<Tonio_> hi everyone
<bddebian> Heya Tonio_
<Tonio_> bddebian: fine ? ;)
<ohoel> is monodevelop 0.10 going to surface in dapper?
<chillywilly> bah, I just bumped the memory in the php.ini for cli PHP but it complains when I go to install a pear package...not sure what else to do
<chillywilly> it *was* set to 8MB but I bumped it to 32MB...it still thinks the memory_limit is 8MB
<chillywilly> bah, must've been broken when I tried to upgrade it
<LaserJock> hi seth
<seth> hi hi LaserJock
<trappist> I've just made a trivial patch to cdrecord that fixes some typos that have annoyed me for years in /etc/default/cdrecord.  I sent it upstream but I dunno whether to expect any results from that.  Should I also file a bug and attach the patch in malone?
<LaserJock> trappist: you could. just maybe make a note that you also sent the patch upstream (if you have something to link to that would be cool)
<trappist> aight.  I just emailed it to the author - afaict he doesn't make it easy for people to make contributions
<LaserJock> trappist: yeah, that happens. Is upstream active?
<trappist> I think so
<LaserJock> hi Kyral
<trappist> so now that I've made this bug and only ubuntu-bugs and myself are subscribed, is there an appropriate way to get it some visibility?
<LaserJock> trappist: maybe talk about it on #ubuntu-bugs
<bddebian> LaserJock: Damnit, I've got 4 more Science bugs to close but can't test them here at work :-(
<LaserJock> bddebian: can I do it for you? when will you be off work?
<bddebian> Dunno yet.  I'm setting up a machine here at work but it's a slow ass Celeron :-(
<LaserJock> bddebian: how slow?
<bddebian> Wel it's just getting "up to date" that's slow
<LaserJock> well, I forgot to start my Ubuntu box at home this morning, so all I have at the moment is a dapper chroot on a sarge box I have for data collection
<LaserJock> although it is faster than my box at home
<bddebian> LaserJock: Well I have all that at my disposal but I need a GUI to test the desktop files :-)
<LaserJock> bddebian: I have a gui in my chroot
<LaserJock> I just ssh -Y from my iMac and run gnome-session from inside the chroot
<bddebian> Scary. :-)  I tried that with Xing for Winblows but it was just too slow :-(
<LaserJock> well, on my local network at school there is basically now slow down. just like being at the box
<LaserJock> s/now/no/
<bddebian> :-)
<LaserJock> so I have ubuntu-desktop and kubuntu-desktop installed. I tried KDE the other day, worked beautifully
<bddebian> Nice
<LaserJock> expose was a little weird with a Gnome/KDE desktop on top of my OSX desktop but I get everything that I need
<ajmitch> morning
* ajmitch needs more sleep
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch, Kyral
<ajmitch> bddebian: how are you?
* Kyral finds it highly ironic that he is taking a course next semester called "Psychology of Psychoactive Drugs"
<bddebian> Fair to midland man, you?
<bddebian> Kyral: :-)
<ajmitch> poor to average
<ajmitch> not enough sleep
<ajmitch> need good caffiene hit
<LaserJock> hi ajmitch and Kyral
<LaserJock> hmm, not much on tomorrow's TB agenda, maybe I should go for core-dev
<LaserJock> muahaha, sometimes I just crack myself up
<ajmitch> LaserJock: sure, up for a good grilling?
<ajmitch> I'm surprised that bddebian hasn't gone for core-dev yet
<LaserJock> ajmitch: maybe he's waiting until he has more Karama then seb128
<LaserJock> I don't really have any interest in being a core-dev and I don't think I'll probably ever know Ubuntu well enough to be be one.  I'm pretty comfortable where I'm at
<bddebian> ajmitch: Bah, they all hate me too :-)
<LaserJock> bddebian: what's up with this self-loathing thing? Everyone loves you and the wiki doesn't lie ;-)
<bddebian> The wiki does lie or I could actually fix some REAL bugs :-)
<LaserJock> heah man, there are going to be a lot of appreciative scientists out there that don't have to drop to a terminal to start their apps :-)
<ajmitch> LaserJock: he's always been like this
* ajmitch hopes he gets to play with new toys today
<cbx33> ajmitch, oooh what new toys?
<bddebian> The Analmaster 9000?
* bddebian runs
<ajmitch> bddebian: comments like that really aren't appreciated
<bddebian> Bah, it was a little funny
<ajmitch> hopefully a sunfire T2000
<bddebian> Nice
<ajmitch> not at all funny
<bddebian> Sorry then
<cbx33> bddebian, awww
<cbx33> i thought it was funny :p
<cbx33> a little funny
* cbx33 sits in his corner
* ajmitch must leave, bbl
<bddebian> Later ajmitch, have fun :-)
<bddebian> LaserJock: See, I can't be a core-dev, I have a "sense of humor".. :-)  (Notice the quotes)
<sladen> bddebian: I don't get it.
<infinito> has any motu two minutes to review this? http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2267
<bddebian> Shit, did someone sync a new qgis?
<bddebian> No, I'm just an idiot
<dholbach> night guys
<bddebian> Wow, qgis looks very well written
<LaserJock> how so?
<sladen> infinito: would  laptop-temp  be a better name
<bddebian> LaserJock: Just a nice crip interface
<bddebian> Err crisp even
<infinito> sladen: why?
<sladen> siretart: why is that linda error still there, I did an upload $months ago that should have got rid of it
<sladen> infinito: ah, okay the actual binary is called 'laptoptemp'
<bddebian> Later folks
<LaserJock> cya bddebian
<bddebian> LaserJock: I got qgis working but forgot to change my version so I overwrote everything.. :-(  I'll fix it up tonight :-)
<bddebian> Catch you in a few
#ubuntu-motu 2006-04-16
<bddebian> Heya gang
<crimsun> lo bddebian
<bddebian> Heya Oh Great One :-)
<zul> hey
<bddebian> Oh Hello zul :-)
<zul> hey bddebian how is it going?
<bddebian> OK, thanks, you?
<zul> good...just watching the hockey game
<bddebian> Who is Jordan Mantha?  I feel that I should know that name/nick?
<crimsun> laserjock.
<bddebian> Uh duuh
<bddebian> I'm soo bad at associating names with nicks :-(
<bddebian> crimsun: Did you ever get a chance to check out ivtools btw?  infinity keeps ignoring me. :-)
<crimsun> bddebian: haven't yet; I'm finishing an edit of Jordan's packaging guide atm
<bddebian> ah nice
<bddebian> crimsun: s'ok, infinity says he knows the fix I guess
<crimsun> bddebian: ok
* bddebian goes back to being the .desktop bitch
<rtcm> hello all
<rtcm> I'm trying to debug a system daemon which is crashing (segv) so I'd like to get a core dump file, or in someway atach gdb to it, any ideas?
<rtcm> btw, it crashes right at the start thus I can't "normally" attach gdb to it
<Amaranth> what daemon?
<Lathiat> rtcm: start it under gdb
<Lathiat> rtcm: gdb /usr/bin/blah
<Lathiat> run <arguments here>
<rtcm> Lathiat: yep doing that, nevermind my sillyness :-P
* ajmitch is drenched
<ajmitch> Lathiat: I think I'll reconsider moving to .au ;)
* bddebian gives ajmitch a big hug
<ajmitch> impressive post to launchpad-users
<ajmitch> the sole content of it is "Free CD's UBUNTO LINUX New Release Thanks"
<Lathiat> ajmitch: its wet here too :)
<ajmitch> how annoying
<bddebian> Uh oh, ajmitch is annoyed with me again :-)
<ajmitch> bddebian: me? never
<jmg> anyone know how to exclude a directory from inclusion in a source package built by dpkg-buildpackage?
<bddebian>  rm?
<ajmitch> jmg: see dpkg-buildpackage manpage
<ajmitch> specifically the -i option in the dpkg-source section
<jmg> ajmitch: thanks
<jmg> ajmitch: hmmm
<jmg> ajmitch: how do i make that directive get obeyed by dpkg-buildpackage?
<ajmitch> dpkg-buildpackage -i.bzr
<ajmitch> irc
<jmg> aha
<jmg> now how to make that happen everytime
<ajmitch> well I think that's what worked for me :)
<ajmitch> type it out everytime, or use debuild & set it in the options
<ajmitch> DEBUILD_DPKG_BUILDPACKAGE_OPTS
<ajmitch> you don't put it in the rules
<Lathiat> hrm, what does chmod +t do?
<ajmitch> Lathiat: not much these days
<ajmitch> it's the sticky bit
<ajmitch> STICKY DIRECTORIES
<ajmitch>        When  the sticky bit is set on a directory, files in that directory may be unlinked or renamed only by the directory owner as well as by root or the file owner.  Without the sticky bit, anyone able
<ajmitch>        to write to the directory can delete or rename files.  The sticky bit is commonly found on directories, such as /tmp, that are world-writable.
<ajmitch> lovely name for it
<Lathiat> ah
<Lathiat> where did you find that?
<Lathiat> oh, in the man page, its just not associated witH +t
* ajmitch really doesn't want to have to walk back to uni in this rain
* StevenK waves.
<lifeless> ajmitch: still in .au ?
<ajmitch> lifeless: no, been back in Dunedin for a month now :)
<ajmitch> hi StevenK
* StevenK sighs.
<StevenK> I was actually going okay with the 4th prac for SP2, until a gaggle of first years and their tutor moved into the lab I was using.
<ajmitch> heh
<ajmitch> sounds like the rain has stopped briefly, hopefully there's enough time for me to run back to uni
<ajmitch> more lab demonstrating fun
<StevenK> Heh
<bddebian> Where the hell is everyone?
<freeflying> bddebian: hi
<bddebian> Heya freeflying
<Se7h> aloha
<bddebian> Heya Se7h
<Se7h> hi bddebian :)
<ajmitch> ok
<bddebian> OK?
<ajmitch> yes
<Unfrgiven> does anyone know how to convert the timestamp shown in dmesg to actual time? or alternatively get the current dmesg timestamp?
<ajmitch> Unfrgiven: no, since it appears relative to system boot time
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch: really? then you would expect the first entry to be a smallish number right? what unit of measurement is it?
<ajmitch> Unfrgiven: seconds? I don't know :)
<ajmitch> dmesg only holds a set number of messages before dropping them, that's why we have /var/log/{dmesg,syslog}
<ajmitch> first entry here is [    0.000000]  Bootdata ok (command line is root=/dev/mapper/ubuntu-root ro quiet splash)
<ajmitch> might be milliseconds
* ajmitch can't recall
<Unfrgiven> ok no probs, thanks :)
<LaserJock> bddebian: ping?
<ajmitch> hi LaserJock
<bddebian> LaserJock: pong
<LaserJock> hi ajmitch
<LaserJock> bddebian: yes, probably a symlink would be fine until Debian/upstream fixes the problem
<bddebian> Well I can't get it to work :-(
<LaserJock> It wasn't too nice of upstream to hard code the directory for the help
<LaserJock> bddebian: no?
<bddebian> No, dh_link doesn't seem to like to symlink dirs
<LaserJock> ok, I gotta get to bed, I'll fix it tomorrow if you don't, ok?
<bddebian> NP
<bddebian> BTW, also if you get a sec, check out saoimage, it FTBFSs for me
<bddebian> Oh, Gnight :-)
<LaserJock_away> bddebian: ok, will do - in the morning
<dholbach> hello motu world!
<Gloubiboulga> morning dholbach
<dholbach> hi Gloubiboulga
<Unfrgiven> dholbach: hey
<ajmitch> hi dholbach
<dholbach> hey Unfrgiven, ajmitch - i see the aussies^wkiwis are still there :)
<ajmitch> dholbach, inciting trouble as always...
<Unfrgiven> dholbach: i hear that then next ubuntu conference is going to be out your way?
<dholbach> Unfrgiven: i wish i could say that - no idea, honestly
<dholbach> with the delay of the dapper relase all the planning had to be done again
<dholbach> so i'm afraid I can't even give unofficial hints
<ajmitch> doesn't surprise me
* ajmitch would really really like to know though :)
<zakame> hi all
<ajmitch> as I'm hoping it'll fall right in the 3-4 week break I have ;)
<Gloubiboulga> hey zakame :)
<zakame> hello Gloubiboulga
* ajmitch is guessing that it won't suit, however
<Unfrgiven> whiprush: dude, ur post finally worked! p.u.c is sydnicating it well now. what was the prob?
<Unfrgiven> Seveas: hey dude
<Seveas> hi
<Unfrgiven> Seveas: you had a chance to talk to lilo? :)
<Seveas> yes, I even poked him about the cloaks 
<Unfrgiven> Seveas: did he respond?
<Seveas> was at the end of a long conversation, had to leave
<Seveas> apparently it slipped his mind
<Seveas> will poke again 
<Unfrgiven> Seveas: thanks!
* Hobbsee pokes Seveas 
* Hobbsee waves to everyone
* Mongoose is away: /_\ zzZzZZZZzz
<Toadstool> hi all
<freeflying> Toadstool: hi
<Toadstool> hi freeflying
<Unfrgiven> Seveas: ping?
<Unfrgiven> Seveas: in bug 38566 on Launchpad, you said that someone is already working on packaging the madwifi-ng drivers?
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 38566 in linux-restricted-modules-2.6.15 "update to madwifi-ng" [Wishlist,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/38566
<Unfrgiven> Seveas: who is doing that? i just made packages of it myself on the weekend. perhaps i can assist the person?
<Seveas> Unfrgiven, I heard from infinity (iirc) that there are plans to distribute it in universe since several cards need it
<Seveas> Unfrgiven, and please apply the wext-19-compliance patch to your package 
<Unfrgiven> Seveas: well ive packaged it so i can upload it if need be.
<Unfrgiven> Seveas: where do i get that patch?
<Seveas> sec
<Seveas> madwifi bug 462
<Ubugtu> Madwifi bug 462 in madwifi: 802.11 stack "Current WEXT Standard Compliance" [Enhancement,New]  http://madwifi.org/ticket/462
<Unfrgiven> wext19_060402.patch (17.0 kB) - added by eaton.lists@gmail.com on 04/03/06 05:10:19. nearly complete patch, applies cleanly to r1489
<Unfrgiven> looks lik it was already applied to r1489?
<Unfrgiven> ive packaged r1497
<Seveas> it's not applied yet
<Unfrgiven> alright. ill take a look when i get home from work.
<Unfrgiven> im heading home now. cya later
<Seveas> ciao
<Seveas> I'm heading to work soon 
<MrFaber> hi all
<MrFaber> Can please someone patch checkinstall like described in bug report?
<MrFaber> And please fix loop-aes-source. It would be very sad if this bug comes in release.
<zakame> hi all
<zakame> hmm is there a bug with dh_iconcache
<zakame> ?
<dholbach> yes
<dholbach> i just did an upload
<dholbach> which bug did you spot?
<dholbach> zakame: ^
<zakame> dholbach: line 32, missing $tmp in -printf switch, or is that intentiona?
<zakame> I suddently can't make the post* stuff, find says it cant find /usr/share/icons ... was doing this with darksnow last night
<dholbach> that's for replacing, so there's /usr/share/icons/hicolor in @icon_dirs
<dholbach> that line is good
<dholbach> that there's no .post* that was a different bug
<dholbach> the check if there were subdirs was wrong in dh_iconcache - i moved it to the post*
<dholbach> that should be fine now
* zakame checks again
<dholbach> i just did the upload in ubuntu8
<dholbach> so it might take some time until it's at your end
<dholbach> i can upload the deb if you like
<dholbach> to test it
<dholbach> zakame: it's at http://daniel.holba.ch/ubuntu/
<zakame> cool! thanks =)
<dholbach> thank you for taking it seriously
<dholbach> and i'm sorry for the bug I introduced
<dholbach> but it should be better now and even clean the cache if there's nothing left
* zakame hugs dholbach :)
<dholbach> :-D
<zakame> I hope to finish half of the list before thursday
<dholbach> some might need a rebuild because of my stupidity
<dholbach> but i'll check all of them for release again
<dholbach> so just keep on going
<zakame> thanks again! =)
<adn> hi
<adn> who did I talk to last time I came about vlc? :)
<adn> Toadstool: help me! :)
<adn> G0SUB_: was it you?
<Toadstool> hi adn :)
<adn> G0SUB_: yes, it was you :)
<adn> Toadstool: well, I've built a vlc package for dapper, if someone is interested
<adn> (with less than 60M diff with Debian's version :p)
<Toadstool> adn: svn version?
<adn> last -test2 version
<adn> and I think I'll be ready to get a 0.8.5-final version as soon as it is released
<adn> (in about 2 weeks)
<adn> test2 was released around one week ago, I think
<Toadstool> adn: for new upstream versions of a package, we must follow https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-motu/2006-February/000545.html as we are in UpstreamVersionFreeze
<adn> cassidy: hello, sorry to bother you, but do you know someone called quentin baire?
<cassidy> adn: no. I should ?
<jmg> what was the keyring email for revu again?
<adn> cassidy: nono
<ajmitch> jmg: keyring@tiber.tauware.de
<adn> cassidy: it is a friend of mine who is student in a physics lab at ulb
<jmg> hi ajmitch :)
<jmg> i exported my secret key
<ajmitch> evening jmg
<adn> so I wondered if physInfo was the one :)
<cassidy> adn: no, i don't know him :)
<infinito> is it possible to remove an application from REVU?
<ajmitch> infinito: yes, ask us :)
<infinito> ajmitch: gcfilms is no longer needed on revu, as it is synced from debian
<ajmitch> ok
<ajmitch> infinito: it's in the archive section
<ajmitch> generally we don't remove completely
<Unfrgiven> infinito: hey dude
<infinito> ajmitch: sorry, i didnt realize it was in archived... anyway, that pkg was never used
<Unfrgiven> infinito: were you working on madwifi-ng pacakges?
<infinito> Unfrgiven: no, i don't
<adn> Toadstool: I don't think I'll move myself to make an exception
<adn> Toadstool: I'll see for the next version of ubuntu
<adn> well, thanks, I have to leave :)
<Unfrgiven> infinito: ok no probs :) i'll just continue on my packages then
<infinito> Unfrgiven: maybe you were thinking on infinity...
<Unfrgiven> infinito: yeah i was told infinity and i thought the name must be a typo :)
<ajmitch> hm, TB meeting in the morning
<ajmitch> I guess I could get up in time for this one
<tseng> hi ogra
<ajmitch> hi ogra
<jmg> TB?
<jmg> Team Building?
<Gloubiboulga> jmg, Technical Board
<jmg> ubuntu tech board?
<jmg> where is the meeting held?
<tseng> #ubuntu-meeting
<Gloubiboulga> on #ubuntu-meeting
<tseng> dholbach: gnome 2.14.1, *hug*
<dholbach> tseng: working on it :)
<tseng> i see :)
<zakame> hi
<Unfrgiven> what does it mean when patch says something like "hunk succeeded with fuzz"?
<Unfrgiven> does it mean that it all worked ok? or do i need to inspect the changes?
<kelmo> fuzz could be indicator of a patch gone wrong
<kelmo> check fuzzy patches, always
<Unfrgiven> check it just around the fuzz or the rest of the patch too?
<kelmo> where the fuzz is, in particular
<Unfrgiven> cool, it looks fine. the patch applied successfully. thanks
<tuxmaniac> Can someone tell me who is taking care of #6266 ticket
<Hobbsee> bug 6626?
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 6626 in rhythmbox "rhythmbox: an album added to the queue plays out of order" [Unknown,Unknown]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/6626
<tuxmaniac> no 6266
<Tm_T> Hobbsee: hi
<Hobbsee> hi Tm_T
<Tm_T> bug 6266
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 6266 in xcircuit "xcircuit version is old" [Normal,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/6266
<Hobbsee> bug 6266
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 6266 in xcircuit "xcircuit version is old" [Normal,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/6266
<Hobbsee> oops...
<tuxmaniac> yes
<Tm_T> =)
* Hobbsee isnt dyslexic - really!
<Tm_T> xcircuit?
<tuxmaniac> Ubugtu: yes
<tuxmaniac> Tm_T: yes
<Tm_T> tuxmaniac: what's that
<tuxmaniac> Tm_T: Its a Software for designing Circuits [Electronics] 
<Tm_T> aah
<Tm_T> hey!
<Tm_T> looks good
<Tm_T> why I haven't seen this before :o
<ajmitch> tuxmaniac: I'd say noone is
<tuxmaniac> ajmitch: I just wanted to confim this so that I can try to do something about it..
* ajmitch would probably be interested if it was useful :)
<Tm_T> hehe
<tuxmaniac> ajmitch: Tm_T : it is useful for Hardware Software Guys
<Tm_T> like me
* Tm_T is now doing things around AVR and little LCD display
<tuxmaniac> Tm_T: Which Software u use to flash AVR Chips?
<Tm_T> tuxmaniac: well, no success yet in Linux, so codevisionavr in windows
<tuxmaniac> :(
<Tm_T> we spent one day with one pro trying to flash in Linux... 5min with CVavr and whoo, done
<tuxmaniac> Is there no software in linux for flashing AVRs?
<tuxmaniac> I mean with proven success?
<Se7h> whats avr ?
<tuxmaniac> its a microcontroller
<tuxmaniac> Se7h: Microcontrller
<tuxmaniac> Tm_T: Did u ry avrdude
<tuxmaniac> Did you try avrdude
<Tm_T> hmm, not sure
<Tm_T> I think yes
<tuxmaniac> Tm_T: http://www.linuxjournal.com/article/7289
<Tm_T> ugh
<Tm_T> thanks
<bddebian> Heya Gang
<Yagisan> G'day bddebian
<bddebian> Howdy Yagisan
<Yagisan> bddebian: hows your day been ?
<bddebian> Yagisan: Not bad since I just woke up. :-)  You?
<Yagisan> bddebian: exhausted. I spent all day doing my work, and all the cooking, cleaning, and childminding - and it still isn't finished
<bddebian> It NEVER is :-)
* Yagisan sobs quietly
<Spec> Is it possible to get the '.changes' file from a package in the ubuntu repository?
<slomo_> Spec: no... why would you want it?
<Spec> I wanted to test this local apt repository i'm setting up for someone else
<Spec> but I need a program and a .changes file to use dput
<slomo_> create one yourself :)
<slomo_> dpkg-buildpackage or debuild creates one for you
<slomo_> (well, dpkg-genchanges to be exact)
<bddebian> OK Oh MOTU Gods, how can I symlink dirs?  dh_link doesn't seem to like it..
<crimsun> FunnyHat_Work: no, that's very much a debhelper question, which is on-topic here.
<FunnyHat_Work> crimsun, Ahh ok.  I had thought this was mainly for packaging and repository discussion.
<bddebian> Heya crimsun
<crimsun> FunnyHat_Work: it is, and that's a packaging question :)
<crimsun> bddebian: heya
<bddebian> OK, I know someone told me this already but how can I add an icon file to a package without regenerating the orig.tar.gz?
* bddebian loves talking to himself in here :-)
<azeem> bddebian: put it in the .diff.gz
<azeem> i.e. somewhere in debian/ and install it in the install: target or via dh_install (unless it doesn't set --srcdir=debian/tmp)
<FunnyHat_Work> I'm so nub  :)
<bddebian> azeem: That's what I'm trying to do but I get "unrepresentable changes to ..." problems :-(
<azeem> bddebian: you need to uuencode binary data in patches
<azeem> and thus also in .diff.gz
<bddebian> Oh ugh
* bddebian is so clueless :-(
<ivoks> anyone here? any MOTU :)
<bddebian> Yo
<ivoks> ou! :)
<dholbach> heya!
<ivoks> one quick q.
* bddebian hopes he can answer
<ivoks> i have new wifi-radar (mostly bugfixes)
<ivoks> i would like to upload it
<ivoks> but i'm not sure should i ask for UVF exception
<ivoks> or just upload
<ivoks> it is a new version, not new revision
<crimsun> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-motu/2006-February/000545.html
<ivoks> oh, thanks
<ivoks> great procedure
<ivoks> so, how are you guys?
<crimsun> ivoks: busy as always. How's the work going?
<ivoks> don't ask :(
<ivoks> i got 20kg in 4 months
<ivoks> that's 1/4 of my weight before i got job at redhat partner :)
<ivoks> from 80kg to 100kg :)
<cbx33> in malone, is a debdiff classed as a patch?  - when it says tick this box if it's a patch?
<crimsun> yes.
<crimsun> (you can apply a debdiff, so it must be a patch)
<cbx33> ok
<cbx33> LaserJock said to assign it the motureviewers then
<cbx33> not motu-reviewers
<cbx33> did i get the spelling right there?
<LaserJock> yep
<cbx33> thanks LaserJock
<cbx33> did you get my pm?
<cbx33> what do i change the status to?
<cbx33> In Progress
<cbx33> ?
<cbx33> it was Confirmed
<LaserJock> cbx33: no, I don't think I got the pm. Yeah, In Progress works
<LaserJock> crimsun: how is the packaging guide reviewing going?
<crimsun> LaserJock: I'm 50% finished with generic/packagingguide/C/basic.xml
<crimsun> that should be the bulk of it
<LaserJock> crimsun: cool
<LaserJock> yeah
<cbx33> w00t
<cbx33> first bug submitted
<LaserJock> what to go cbx33!
<cbx33> you didn't get my pm about my other bug?
<cbx33> resent
<bddebian> dpatch can work without a 00list?
<cbx33> looks like it
<Gloubiboulga> bddebian, 00list is needed I think
<cbx33> well a package I'm working on doesn't have one
<cbx33> what do i do...
<bddebian> cbx33: Neither does qgis afaict
<cbx33> i have to add a patch that modifies something a previous patch does
<cbx33> is that ok?
<Gloubiboulga> I'd modify the patch, but I'm not sure that's the good way to do this
<cbx33> what's the good way
<cbx33> :p
<cbx33> it' difficult
<cbx33> i have to apply the patch and then create a new patch from that source :S
<cbx33> you're right not good....either...this is quite a mess...
<cbx33> anyideas?
<kiko> hello sacred MOTU hackers
<kiko> I see, ignoring me
<bddebian> Hello kiko
<kiko> how's it going
<bddebian> Busy :-)
* Mithrandir tickles kiko 
<bddebian> OK, gotta take the kids to the park, later gang
<kiko> I'm looking for a motu who can give gtimelog some loving!
<kiko> normally ajmitch takes pity on me
<kiko> but today it seems that the world is busy watching iran
<Lure> can somebody remind me how to add additional repo to dapper pbuilder - OTHERMIRROR did not help
<Spec> slomo_: thanks
<Lure> solved - sudo pbuilder update --override-config
<cbx33> boo ya :p - he's back
<cbx33> when i do an apt-get remove on a package it tries to remove ubuntu-desktop I know this isn't desirable...where would the problem lie?
<Kyral> ubuntu-desktop depends on it
<Kyral> enough said
<crimsun> ubuntu-desktop is fine to remove. It eases dist-upgrades between released Ubuntu versions, though, which is why you'd want to have it installed.
<cbx33> no it doesn't
<cbx33> ah i see
<LaserJock> cbx33: there is a Technical Board meeting going on in #ubuntu-meetings if you want to take a peak at the proccess
<Kyral> in a nutshell
<cbx33> oooh yes
<Tm_T> ubuntu-desktop contains only dependencies
<cbx33> thanks LaserJock
<Kyral> the -Desktop packages exist to pull in the things installed normally with the respective variants
<Kyral> and when new things are added to the default installs, they get added to the -Desktop package
<cbx33> i see
<Kyral> you can remove the -Desktop packages fine, and the software will continue to upgrade. What purpose the -Desktop packages serve once installed is to keep a "standard" set on the computer
<cbx33> so, anyone got any advice on my little problem with a package I'm trying to fix...
<Kyral> frankly I dislike the entire concept....
<cbx33> i need to patch a patch :p
<LaserJock> Kyral: what would you do instead?
<Kyral> I use Arch now :P
<Kyral> On my laptop I keep Xubuntu-Desktop around just because I haven't removed anything that it depends on
<Kyral> On my server, well that is 4 systems in one, so it doesn't really apply
<Kyral> and it runs headless anyway, so the point is moot
<Kyral> the Server is Xen Breezy (so that means custom compiled Kernels and Xen) and otherwise is stripped down like crazy
<LaserJock> I found a bunch of qemu images for various distros, I was thinking of trying a few out
<cbx33> qemu is ok
<cbx33> LaserJock, would it be better to patch a patch, or modify the existing patch
<LaserJock> depends on the amount of changes
<LaserJock> I would guess
<cbx33> it's only one line modification
<cbx33> the change last made to port to ubunutu actualy broke the package
<LaserJock> cbx33: and it is in the realm of the patch? generally we seperate patches if they are for different purposes or different files for instance
<cbx33> it is a line which is changed in the patch
<cbx33> it was put move file locations
<LaserJock> oh, then for sure patch the patch
<cbx33> just mod the patch?
<cbx33> or create a whole patch for it?
<cbx33> if so how does that work even :p
<LaserJock> cbx33: is it a dpatch patch?
<cbx33> i don;t think so.,,,
<cbx33> it has not dpatch header
<cbx33> and no 00list
<LaserJock> k
<LaserJock> then you probably need to redo the patch
<cbx33> ok, i think I can just modify one line in the patch file
<cbx33> and rebuild
<cbx33> is that a valid method?
<LaserJock> well, it depends on if it works ;-)
<cbx33> I'm sure it will
<LaserJock> patches usually don't work too well if you edit them by hand
<cbx33> I'll try it
<bddebian> OK, folks, what have I missed? :-)
<dholbach> night guys
<LaserJock> cya dholbach
<dholbach> night LaserJock
<bddebian> dpatch is just dpatch apply-all?
<JohnnyMast> Natja ik zou je connectie eens checken :)
<Natja> JohnnyMast: huh ?
<JohnnyMast> you heared me
<Natja> well, not really
<JohnnyMast> your from the france part of belgium ?
<hub> JohnnyMast: there is no france part in belgium
<JohnnyMast> there is
<hub> france and belgium are 2 different countries
<JohnnyMast> no im talking about the france language
<JohnnyMast> wich belguim is split up in dutch and france
<Natja> do you mean french language ?
<Natja> anyway, you said "Natja I will check your connection"
<Natja> but I don't understand why
<hub> JohnnyMast: split?
<hub> you mean the fact that there is a bilinguism>
<hub> which has nothing to do with france
<hub> fortunately
<Natja> hub: exactly
<hub> leave the French were they are :-)
<JohnnyMast> lol im not talking about the ppl
<JohnnyMast> the language
<hub> france is not a language
<hub> it is a country
<JohnnyMast> frensh
<JohnnyMast> what ever
<JohnnyMast> :p
<JohnnyMast> but dutch powns belgium
<crimsun> bddebian: in what context?
<JohnnyMast> like back in the old days when we learned them how to speak dutch
<bddebian> crimsun: qgis has .dpatch files in debian/patches but doesn't run them apparently
<bddebian> crimsun: Though in includes dpatch.mk in rules
<crimsun> bddebian: hmm, are they stated in debian/patches/00list ?
<bddebian> crimsun: There was no 00list.  I just added one for my dpatch but still if I do debian/rules patch, I get nothing :-(
<crimsun> bddebian: does it include both /usr/share/cdbs/1/rules/dpatch.mk and /usr/share/dpatch/dpatch.make ?
<ajmitch> morning
<bddebian> No, just /usr/share..  It is not a cdbs package afaict
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<crimsun> oh, sorry, I just assumed it was using cdbs
<crimsun> 'morning, ajmitch
<bddebian> Can't I just do dpatch apply-all or some such?
#ubuntu-motu 2007-04-09
<Fujitsu> NewPackagesFreeze exceptions really shouldn't be happening 3 days before deep freeze.
<AstralJava> Fujitsu: Yes, this is understood. Like is said in the bug report description, we would love to see these in Feisty's universe already, but can live without (of course) if it doesn't happen. A lot of obstacles were had to overcome to make these happen, and the schedule just wasn't easier than what happened as of now. :)
<LaserJock> Fujitsu: they're just trying to avoid having to set up a 3rd party repo for Feisty
<Fujitsu> That's good, then.
* Fujitsu mostly retracts his objection.
<LaserJock> I *think* these are the last packages they need in order to do it
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: it's branding for a fairly active derivative
<crimsun> I need a big whiteboard and some dry erase markers.
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: Noted.
<LaserJock> just make sure to get a good one
<Fujitsu> crimsun: Why?
<LaserJock> mine in the lab get's so dried on we have to use some solvents to get the stuff off
<crimsun> Fujitsu: one use case here doesn't know what in the world he wants for audio in Ubuntu
<crimsun> I need to somehow find time to write a point-n'-click iface
<LaserJock> my labmate has a paper sized whiteboard and pen sized markers
<LaserJock> she uses it for almost everything
<Fujitsu> crimsun: What does this clicky interface need to do?
<crimsun> basically point people to whether pulseaudio should be used, and if so, how it should be configured
<AstralJava> I'm off to sleep now. Thanks anyone if you find time to look at the bugs, and thanks again LaserJock for checking them up on REVU!! :) G'night all!
<crimsun> someone punch me in the head
<ajmitch> we'd rather not
<_MMA_> Im hanging around answer anything.
<crimsun> apparently, every single time, I keep forgetting how difficult configuring audio can be
<LaserJock> what's difficult about it, it should "Just Work" ;-)
<crimsun> it does "just work" for me
<crimsun> on the other hand, people keep inventing new ways to break things
<Fujitsu> Heheh.
<crimsun> "here's a wrench, don't go smack yourself in the face"
<Fujitsu> Fantastic.
<LaserJock> yes, people seem equally, if not more so, able to break things than fix them
<crimsun> now don't get me wrong - I love breaking things. It's just recovering from /other/ people breaking things...
* Fujitsu installs etch in a VM.
<joejaxx> is there a list of mirrors who hold complete copies of all cd images?
<joejaxx> i know some of them are partial mirrors
<LaserJock> for Ubuntu?
<joejaxx> yes
<LaserJock> I think the launchpad lists should work
<joejaxx> hmm interesting i had not thought about that
<joejaxx> LaserJock: thanks :)
* bddebian starts breaking stuff.. he he hehe
<bddebian> Hmm, Beavis and Butthead don't translate well in text
<joejaxx> hopefully they all have the same directory structure
<joejaxx> otherwise this is going to be a pain to script
<LaserJock> bddebian: that's so 90's ;-)
<crimsun> everything under the root has the same directory structure
<crimsun> otherwise it wouldn't be called a "mirror"...
<Fujitsu> There are only about three mirrors that carry the dailies.
<joejaxx> crimsun: ok i just wanted to make sure
<DktrKranz> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/transcriber/1.5.1-2ubuntu1
<joejaxx> Fujitsu: that is alright
<DktrKranz> is it normal having a transcriber_1.5.1-2ubuntu1.tar.gz tarball?
<joejaxx> this will only be for standard releases
<crimsun> joejaxx: note that mirrors are free to place the root wherever they wish
<Fujitsu> Ah.
<ajmitch> DktrKranz: only if it was uploaded badly
<joejaxx> and maybe Herds
<joejaxx> crimsun: ah ok
<joejaxx> thanks that makes this a little easier
<DktrKranz> ajmitch, I'm going to submit a merge request for it
<DktrKranz> do I need to note it?
<ajmitch> DktrKranz: ok, why?
<joejaxx> AND launchpad shows speeds this is grat
<joejaxx> great*
<ajmitch> binary file conflict
<ajmitch> ?
<DktrKranz> it's on your rc-fixes page
<ajmitch> but what bug are you fixing, that isn't in -2ubuntu1 ?
<DktrKranz> fixed in debian
<DktrKranz> debian 403168
<ubotu> Debian bug 403168 in tendra "tendra: /usr/share/man/man1/pl.1.gz also in gnustep-base-runtime" [Normal,Closed]  http://bugs.debian.org/403168
<ajmitch> when you say that you're submitting a merge request, you mean you're putting up a debdiff to upload?
<DktrKranz> yes, i do
<ajmitch> ok
<DktrKranz> I'm going to generate a debdiff soon
<DktrKranz> I will note down such issue too
<ajmitch> the issue is noted in the changelog for -3
<sharms> Burgundavia: maybe novell doesn't make their source distribution as easily available?
<DktrKranz> ok, thanks
<ajmitch> ie, it was fixed in -3
<ajmitch> so make sure you get the .orig.tar.gz & diff.gz from debian
<Fujitsu> Is Soyuz going to like having such a change without a new upstream version number?
<ajmitch> if soyuz can't handle it, it's more broken than I thought
<crimsun> shall we have a sprint for the RC bug page?
<ajmitch> crimsun: go for it
<ajmitch> I'll try & finish adding a comments field this afternoon, shall I?
<joejaxx> grep, awk, sed, sh scripting ftw
<crimsun> ajmitch: great
<ajmitch> before too many people hit the page
<joejaxx> commadline tools are VERY powerful
<ajmitch> crimsun: sadly I can't update the data
<sharms> ajmitch: my getting involved blog entry had a bit over 5500 hits
<ajmitch> the debian box that I pull the BTS data from is down, but it shouldn't change much anyway
<ajmitch> sharms: my authtool screenshots had ~30K hits
<sharms> link?
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: Having a comments box will make things a whole lot better... Thanks for all of this :)
<sharms> my stats just come from people who click through to the comments section
<ajmitch> sharms: it was on planet, blame Burgundavia 
<ajmitch> right
<Fujitsu> sharms: It was on the front page of Digg 12 hours ago.
<sharms> so if we can get 1 kid to stop playing counterstrike and start hacking, then it is a success
* ajmitch can still re-create the rc bugs list & update just the ubuntu data
<LaserJock> yeah
<Fujitsu> Even an extra person or two would make a difference.
<Fujitsu> (although 5500 would be better :P)
<crimsun> actually, let 'em play CS. Just get 'em into universe work, too! :-)
<sharms> I found it very interesting that one of the barriers to get involved was that a lot of people have never used irc
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: would you want to try & coordinate 5500 people working?
<ajmitch> and teaching them how to do stuff?
<crimsun> I'm still waiting for the Jurassic Park interface to Ubuntu universe
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: We can have 3 packages each!
<sharms> and nobody bothers to explain IRC since to us, it is just assumed
<Fujitsu> Um, good point.
<ajmitch> sharms: did you mention the mailing lists in your post?
<sharms> ajmitch: no :(
<sharms> the crowd that reads my blog likes more instant gratification
<ajmitch> hah
<ajmitch> "This blog is just spamming to get adwords revenue!
<ajmitch> Yes, you caught me. I made $2.64 since January."
<ajmitch> nice one :)
<joejaxx> haha that is funny
<joejaxx> :P
<joejaxx> grep "<a href=\"http\:\/\/" +cdmirrors | grep "\">http<\/a>" | cut -f 2 -d \"
<joejaxx> ftw
<ajmitch> joejaxx: good thing you didn't see the steaming pile of evil that is my RC bugs page
<sharms> I am going to really try and get involved with feisty + 1.  After these next few weeks I will have a ton more time.  Right now I spend 80 hours a week working with suse 9 hacking
* joejaxx looks
<ajmitch> sharms: uh, why?
<sharms> job makes me
<ajmitch> heh
<ajmitch> lucky you ;)
<sharms> Lucky to have a job thats for sure
<sharms> basically I manage the distribution for 4000 point of sale systems
<ajmitch> certainly
<sharms> and they are all sles 9
<ajmitch> lucky to have a job that's at least linux-related, too
<sharms> yeah somehow novell tricked my employer into going with them
<joejaxx> ajmitch oh wow
<joejaxx> ajmitch: i looked at that page lol
<joejaxx> ajmitch: i want to eventually pull the speed as i can base the preference setting on that
<ajmitch> k
<ajmitch> ok everyone, get to work on RC bugs
<ajmitch> I'm off to meet parents for lunch :)
<joejaxx> :)
* ajmitch will hack on it later today
<Fujitsu> Bye ajmitch.
<joejaxx> bye ajmitch :)
<crimsun> oh, right, I nuked ~/.gnome* and ~/.gconf* . I was wondering why everything was stock.
<joejaxx> so it looks like i am going to have to manually feed in the the file
<joejaxx> to get the other values
<Fujitsu> joejaxx: Why?
<joejaxx> Fujitsu: well because i need the country too
<joejaxx> and the speed
<Fujitsu> You can use sed to get those various bits, surely?
<joejaxx> well
<joejaxx> it is not like the country is listed for everyone
<joejaxx> every one*
<Fujitsu> True.
<joejaxx> it is country, list of mirrors etc
<joejaxx> i mean i could probably have some sort of check
<Fujitsu> It'd be great if LP provided a machine-readable list.
<joejaxx> based on the <strong> tag
<joejaxx> Fujitsu: yeah like +raw
<joejaxx> <strong>Australia</strong>
<joejaxx> the countries are like that
<joejaxx> and just have it use cut -f 2 -d ">"
<joejaxx> until it reaches another <strong> tag
* joejaxx goes to script a concept
<Fujitsu> Isn't screenscraping fun?
<joejaxx> :P
<joejaxx> :)
<nrg88> will there be an ubuntu dvd release with the major DEs on it?
<nrg88> :)
<LaserJock> I think there is always a DVD release with Main on it
<LaserJock> or hmm, maybe I'm wrong
<nrg88> i don't think the whole gnome is on the kubuntu dvd for example
<nrg88> i was thinking of a dvd like suse's
<LaserJock> I didn't think there were seperate DVDs
<nrg88> well, if you insert a dvd, you can't quite select the respective DE
<LaserJock> no, but it doesn't really matter does it?
<LaserJock> at least for me it doesn't
<nrg88> who knows, maybe we should have a survey
<nrg88> it doesn't matter much for me though, i use Kubuntu, but then again, who knows... :) maybe a lot of people need it
<LaserJock> it's a known wish :-)
<nrg88> it is?
<nrg88> it's on launchpad?
<LaserJock> it's just a matter of getting people motivated to write the code and maintain it
<LaserJock> I think so, probably in some spec from a year ago :-)
<nrg88> ok then
<nrg88> LaserJock: do you use Gnome?
<nrg88> (and NO, i don't want to start a flamewar ;) )
<LaserJock> nrg88: I use a bit of evreything :-)
<LaserJock> mostly Gnome these days
<LaserJock> though I was mostly a KDE user in my Gentoo days
<crimsun> -fomglaserjock
<LaserJock> hehe
<nrg88> today i booted into Ubuntu live cd, trying to reproduce a java instalation bug, and what i observed was that Gnome in Ubuntu was way more polished than KDE :|
<LaserJock> I've even been know to run openbox and fvwm a fair amount
<Burgundavia> nrg88: for better or worse, GNOME is the primary desktop of Ubuntu
<nrg88> i see
<LaserJock> well, I don't know that Kubuntu's KDE is much less polished than other distro's KDE's
<LaserJock> I just find KDE to be less polished, in looks, etc.
<LaserJock> and of course many people will disagree with me
<nrg88> i think i'm going to download MEPIS, and give it a try
* jdong glares at LaserJock, then decides not to respond....
<jdong> nrg88: take a look at OpenSuse KDE if you want to see polished KDE....
<LaserJock> like I've always said
<nrg88> but i would like to stay *ubuntu ;)
<LaserJock> Gnome has the look-n-feel, KDE has the apps
<jdong> nrg88: then you can make a decision if it's indeed possible to polish KDE better than GNOME
<jdong> nrg88: (I'm not saying to switch to SUSE)
<nrg88> jdong: suse was the 1st linux i was experimenting with
<nrg88> 3 times
<jdong> ah, ok
<nrg88> somewhy it died on me
<nrg88> once the 8.1
<nrg88> and twice the 9.3 :D
<jdong> have you tried it recently, like 10.1/10.2?
<nrg88> i know, i was the fault
<nrg88> yep
<jdong> they have a very polished KDE desktop
<nrg88> but when i tried Breezy
<jdong> I was just pointed that out
<nrg88> (Kubuntu)
<nrg88> i fell in love with it
<jdong> not saying anything about hardware support or overall system reliability, etc....
<nrg88> yep, i saw that jdong
<jdong> just the OpenSuse KDE artwork/feel is very professional/polished
<nrg88> indeed, and i like the new Kickoff menu
<nrg88> oo
<nrg88> *too
<crimsun> speaking of artwork, FC7's...
<nrg88> and the artwork
<crimsun> now that's some /good/ artwork
<nrg88> they look "PRO"
<jdong> crimsun: +1
<nrg88> polished, and professional :)
<crimsun> the young lady who heads up that work on FC7 blogs about it, and it's incredible the consideration (which is the norm) that goes into it
<LaserJock> if only Fedora worked as well as it looked :/
<nrg88> :D
<Burgundavia> heh
<nrg88> that's why i fell in love with kubuntu, it worked
<nrg88> it didn't die on me
<Burgundavia> RH has at least 2 artists on staff
<LaserJock> I thought it looked great, then I tried to do anything with it
<nrg88> and when it died, after some time, i could fix it
<LaserJock> opensuse was the closest to looking *and* working great
<jdong> heh agreed
<jdong> but media was an awful experience for me :-/
<nrg88> i heard good things about SLED 10
<jdong> novell's strict legal interpretation...
<Burgundavia> tonyyarusso: you realize that Nvu has a dead upstream?
<LaserJock> isn't he trying to get komposer/composer/whatever it's called
<Burgundavia> probably
<nrg88> kompozer
<nrg88> it's a bugfix release for NVu
<tonyyarusso> Burgundavia: what he said
<nrg88> and a few plugins i think, i helped in the Hungarian documentation :)
<Burgundavia> daniel glazer might even release something this century
<tonyyarusso> Burgundavia: Perhaps ;)  Meanwhile supposedly this other guy is going to fix up some of the bugs that were left behind
<LaserJock> sweet, I made it through tetex-*
<LaserJock> got rid of about 1/3 of the bugs
<crimsun> ^5
<crimsun> jordan's an MOTU superstar!
<LaserJock> lol, whatever
<crimsun> I'll just bask in glow
<LaserJock> that reminds me though
<nrg88> http://files.opensuse.org/opensuse/en/a/ab/Screeny102_kickoff_menu.jpg i like the looks of that :)
<LaserJock> I need to go do a blog post
<LaserJock> nrg88: yeah, I actually tried that the other day, it's pretty slick
<LaserJock> it's not unusably slow
<Burgundavia> yay for huge applet that makes no sense
<nrg88> Burgundavia: you mean kickoff?
<LaserJock> :(
<LaserJock> I liked it
<Burgundavia> all of teh Novell stuff strikes me as stuffing too much into a single interface
<Burgundavia> plus it integrates with exactly nothing fromt he existing desktop, such as the deskbar
<LaserJock> bah, silly integration ;-)
<LaserJock> I generally dislike integration
<LaserJock> I could be convinced otherwise though
<LaserJock> seems like "integration" is usually codeword for "we're going to do things you don't want without asking you because most people might like it"
<nrg88> oh well, waiting for KDE 4.0 :)
<nrg88> i'm curious about it
<Burgundavia> personally, KDE 4, no matter how good, is going to be a publicity disaster
<Burgundavia> you cannot promise that much
<jdong> it's not going to do my dishes?
<nrg88> why you say that?
<idnar> kdishwasher
<Burgundavia> because they have promised the moon
<nrg88> :D
<Burgundavia> and they cannot possibly deliver on that
<nrg88> that surprised me too, yes
<Burgundavia> GNOME releases are boring and predictable
<jdong> :)
<jdong> which is now a feature.
<jdong> :)
<Burgundavia> surprise, that makes it easy to plan
<Burgundavia> if I was going to deploy a corporate desktop, boring and predictable are selling features
<Burgundavia> the other reason I love Ubuntu
<Burgundavia> it is terribly boring to have defined support dates, but it sure does make my life easier as a sysadmin
<LaserJock> sure, but it's hard to get all the hordes excited about blah releases :-)
<LaserJock> "Where's the bling?"
<Fujitsu> Ew, why have my GDM cursors been eaten by KDE?
<Burgundavia> you can have bling within defined dates
<sharms> LaserJock: on the MOTU interviews you should have them post a desktop screenshot.  People love that
<RAOF> Becasue openoffice-style-crystal has pulled in a bunch of KDE packages.
<LaserJock> sure, but if you have boring releases it's tough to get the average user excited, I guess
<LaserJock> sharms: I know, I know. I just takes time and bandwidth
<LaserJock> I'll probably do it in the future
<Burgundavia> LaserJock: boring schedule != boring releases
<Fujitsu> RAOF: Noted, but why does that automatically eat my cursors?
<sharms> ok I am off to cincinatti, oh for the next week
<RAOF> Fujitsu: On that, you have me, sir.  No idea. :P)
<sharms> take care
<LaserJock> Burgundavia: yes, but one of the complaints I've seen often about Gnome is boring releases
<LaserJock> not boring schdule
<LaserJock> cya sharms 
<Burgundavia> LaserJock: a lot of that is due to lack of people and lack of direction
<LaserJock> sure
<Burgundavia> blaming it on a fixed release schedule isn't really true
<LaserJock> but I guess KDE has gone out and hyped up KDE4, so maybe they'll get more people and direction to pull it off, at least reasonably
<LaserJock> Burgundavia: I never said that
<nrg88> ubuntu for example is trying to do exciting releases in with borind schedules
<LaserJock> I was talking about releases not schedules
<nrg88> do you guys read the posts on dot.kde.org ?
<nrg88> they are really working on it
<nrg88> decibel, solid, phonon...
<Burgundavia> nrg88: tell me what those really are
<RAOF> Yay, *another* sound framework :(
<Burgundavia> indeed
<Burgundavia> decible is nothing more than a wrapping for telepathy
<Burgundavia> solid is HAL and phonon is gstreamer and xine, basically
<nrg88> not exactly
* Fujitsu reinvents the wheel.
<nrg88> phonon can use gstreamer, or xine
<Burgundavia> <mjg59> KDE ABSTRACTED MY ABSTRACTION LAYER
<nrg88> but application will not need to write plugins for separate backends
<nrg88> they will only use the Phonon api
<RAOF> Which could, of course, also be achived by just using gstreamer :P
<Burgundavia> except if they need to do something more
<nrg88> and phonon does the job with any of the backends that are selected system wide
<Burgundavia> except all the major distributions have chosen gstreamer
<jdong> nrg88: are you denying that's double-abstraction?
<crimsun> yes, make my life hellish! Please $deity! I LOVE duplication of audio backends because I CAN'T GET ENOUGH!
<nrg88> jdong: i don't know what is it exaclty :D
<jdong> nrg88: well it's abstracting an abstraction :)
<jdong> nrg88: with a very convincing sounding PR.
<nrg88> crimsun: they don't duplicate any of the backends
<nrg88> they just made a common api to use them
<jdong> nrg88: sure they do. they made a new "backend"
<jdong> nrg88: so crimsun will now get decibel bugs
<RAOF> I don't see the point of having plugabble, pluggable backends.
<jdong> err phonon
<crimsun> but it's SHINY
<jdong> RAOF: I suppose that means you aren't a card-carrying member of the reiser4 fanclub? :D
<crimsun> now I'm all for abstraction, being a CS guy, but man...
<RAOF> jdong: From what I saw, reiser4 has some cool ideas (particualrly metadata as filesystem), but I don't know enough details
<Burgundavia> nrg88: basically, all the backends already exist adn all these efforts are pretty much giant duplications
<jdong> RAOF: yeah I like a lot of aspects in the design and a lot of reiser's visions on filesystems....
<jdong> RAOF: I just wish it could've been done in a cooperative way :-/
<Fujitsu> You mean, we don't need a Hardware Abstraction Layer Abstraction Layer? I'm disappointed.
<nrg88> Burgundavia: if you write a music app, you have to use A backend
<jdong> Fujitsu: halal... now we just need a K somewhere and....
<Fujitsu> Burgundavia: Said backends already exist.
<nrg88> now what happens if that backend isn't there in a distro?
<jdong> nrg88: backend already exists.
<nrg88> you write a plugin to another backend
<Burgundavia> nrg88: because every major distro ships xine and gstreamer
<crimsun> nrg88: err, that's an intractable problem
<jdong> nrg88: why not standardize on an existing backend?
<RAOF> Then the distro packages it.
<jdong> nrg88: a backend to a backend doesn't solve that problem.
<crimsun> what if my system doesn't have a sound device?
<nrg88> jdong: i don't know
<RAOF> (An existing, *pluggable* backend)
<nrg88> it should be done this way
<nrg88> one should be standardized
<jdong> nrg88: gstreamer, buddy.
<Burgundavia> oh, and windows and mac os support are rabbit holes
<crimsun> sure, I can /hope/ that the OS provides a dummy sink
<nrg88> but what happens with the other?
<crimsun> but what if it doesn't?
<jdong> crimsun: and it BETTER be audible! :D
<nrg88> if KDE would have been standardized, what would you do?
<nrg88> would you be happy?
<jdong> nrg88: if ARTS was standardized, then sure.
<jdong> nrg88: I would be content with using it.
<jdong> nrg88: but it's not.
<nrg88> arts is dead ;)
<jdong> nrg88: so KDE decides to write yet another set of backends.
<RAOF> If everyone used a single, pluggable media backend as good as gstreamer?  Totally yes!
<jdong> nrg88: that is just duplication and complexity...
<nrg88> phonon is to backends like freedesktop.org to DEs
<Burgundavia> not really
<crimsun> so everyone programs to phonon? Great!
<crimsun> ...except not everyone will program to phonon.
<jdong> nrg88: umm... what?
<crimsun> Back to square one.
<nrg88> no, kde apps will use phonon
<nrg88> most of them
<bddebian> Oohh am I missing another pissing match? :-)
<jdong> crimsun: but I wrote a backend that can use phonon or any of 5 other media frameworks....
<jdong> crimsun: so everyone should use that too...
<crimsun> jdong: great! Backport it to Warty!
<jdong> :)
<jdong> nrg88: dude, read some of the things you're typing ;-)
<jdong> :D
<nrg88> for example? 
<nrg88> :D
<jdong> <nrg88> no, kde apps will use phonon
<jdong>  most of them
<crimsun> nrg88: err, so it's strictly for kde4 apps? Why only kde4 apps?
<jdong> and that's to be compared to fd.o how?
<nrg88> crimsun: i suppose any app can use phonon
<crimsun> nrg88: right, so it'll become another backend
<nrg88> but for now i know that kde 4 apps are written to use phonon
<LaserJock> and another tex bug bites the dust
<jdong> nrg88: that sounds like yet another backend to me....
<Burgundavia> nrg88: I don't see GNOME using phonon
<nrg88> if you say phonon is another backend, is like saying freedesktop.org is another de
<jdong> nrg88: umm... that makes no sense.
<Burgundavia> nrg88: ok, lets look at the situation
<nrg88> Burgundavia: because phonon is made by kde developers
<Burgundavia> with kde4, you have app --> phonon --> gsreamer|xine
<crimsun> bddebian: yes, bring the zomgponies
<Burgundavia> with GNOME, you have app --> gstreamer
<jdong> nrg88: that sounds like a MS pitch for OpenXML....
<Burgundavia> which is harder to debug?
<nrg88> i don't know, i don't use gstreamer
<nrg88> i use xine
<nrg88> sometimes i have trouble, so i have to use vlc or mplayer
<nrg88> i need different players for that
<crimsun> and xine can use, what, oss? esd? sdl? pulse? alsa?
<nrg88> "Phonon will be the new multimedia framework for KDE4. Phonon will provide an easy way for KDE developers to use various backends, such as Xine, GStreamer and NMM."
* RAOF just wishes all those players could fix gstreamer!
<jdong> phonon should use xine with a phonon output backend.....
<nrg88> phonon is intended to use a lot of them
<Burgundavia> jdong: pipe that through gstreamer and then nmm and through pulse audio for extra giggles
<LaserJock> hmm, not to sidetrack the discussion, but isn't KDE4 a lot more than sound "stuff"?
<nrg88> if it would use just xine, why would the kde developers write it?
<crimsun> LaserJock: no, it's only sound. And ponies.
<Fujitsu> LaserJock: But it is a lot of reinventing the wheel.
<nrg88> :D
<Fujitsu> ANd ponies.
<Burgundavia> LaserJock: yes, it includes other crackish frameworks too
<Fujitsu> Hm, The Golden Ponies must be coming soon!
<Burgundavia> like solid, which promoted the mjg59 quote
<Fujitsu> So they are seriously sticking another layer on top of HAL?
<Burgundavia> yep
<jdong> yeah :(
<crimsun> now don't get me wrong, I dool drool in anticipation of KDE4, and I'm sure the KDE4 devs have their reasons for Phonon. I just quail at triaging its bugs, too.
<nrg88> Burgundavia: it doesn't include them, it can only use them
<crimsun> dool drool. Nice.
<crimsun> do drool, even
<jdong> crimsun: haha see what mentioning KDE4 is doing to you? :D
<bddebian> quail?
<RAOF> Yeah, nice little birds.  Very tasty.
<jdong> crimsun: though I don't think that sentence nearly matches what I said to Kees that one day.....
<jdong> :D
<LaserJock> Burgundavia: that's a bit harsh. Kalzium's KDE4 port is really rocking
<Burgundavia> LaserJock: yes, the app stuff looks very cool
<Burgundavia> it is this underlyuing reinvention of the wheel that scares me
<crimsun> bddebian: verb form.
<crimsun> "to lose heart or courage in difficulty or danger; shrink with fear"
<jdong> RAOF: no I think he's refering to the vice president^^
<nrg88> Burgundavia: so you suggest standardizing gstreamer for gnome, and xine for kde?
<jdong> haha, actually that description matches quite well
<Burgundavia> nrg88: no
<nrg88> that means an application would have to maintain a lot of plugins (one for xine, one for gstreamer, etc...)
<jdong> nrg88: how about everyone use gstreamer?
<jdong> ;-)
<marcin_ant> hi guys
<crimsun> to each his own. Just don't make your own my own. :-D
<nrg88> jdong: how about everyone using KDE?
<nrg88> does it sound good?
<nrg88> no it doesn't
<nrg88> :|
<jdong> nrg88: why can't KDE use gstreamer again?
<RAOF> Because it's got a "G" in it
<jdong> nrg88: gstreamer is not a GNOME stack...
<jdong> nrg88: the g in the name is totally unrelated
<marcin_ant> I'm working on some package with webapp and got a problem with lintian and php files
<nrg88> the kde devs were thinking about it
<nrg88> don't know why they didn't like the idea :|
<marcin_ant> could someone tell me how should I install php files in package without executable flag?
<nrg88> RAOF: lol :D
<marcin_ant> (they are set as executable in orig sources)
<nrg88> jdong: and tell this to the other backend's developers
<RAOF> Hey could some one send me a msn message (deflectoracc@hotmail.com)?  I want to get gaim to crash.
<jdong> RAOF: pidgin.
<jdong> kidding :)
<crimsun> marcin_ant: debian/rules. Use install -m
<marcin_ant> crimsun: hmm is there any possibility to use some dh_* magic?
<marcin_ant> crimsun: I use *.install file to select all files do I really need to use install -m?
<crimsun> no. Is dh_fixperms(1) not functioning properly?
<LaserJock> hmm, interesting bug report asking for backports of libs so they can install Debian experimental tex packages in Dapper
<crimsun> how invasive are the backports?
<minghua> LaserJock: bug number please?
<crimsun> the lib backports, that is
<LaserJock> bug #47641
<ubotu> Malone bug 47641 in tex-common "Debian TeXLive packages require additional libraries..." [Medium,Rejected]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/47641
<marcin_ant> crimsun: well no, it doesn't fix php scripts
<nrg88> jdong: why does Gnome use ESD?
<nrg88> why not only gstreamer?
<crimsun> nrg88: gnome is moving away from esound
<crimsun> toward pulseaudio, more than likely
<nrg88> but why?
<nrg88> why not gstreamer?
<nrg88> you guys said even kde should use gstreamer
<crimsun> I didn't say anything of that sort
<nrg88> [03:24]  <jdong> nrg88: why can't KDE use gstreamer again?
<crimsun> he may have said that for argument's sake
<crimsun> I don't care what KDE4 and the next GNOME version use
<Fujitsu> As far as I know, crimsun and jdong are independent entitie.
<Fujitsu> *entities
<crimsun> I end up supporting them all, which is why I'm unhappy.
<nrg88> well, i asked jdong in the 1st time :)
<Fujitsu> crimsun: Get Canonical to employ you or something.
<nrg88> [03:36]  <nrg88> jdong: why does Gnome use ESD?
<RAOF> Because gstreamer and pulseaudio try to do different things.
<RAOF> & ESD, too.
<nrg88> that means if a distro wants many multimedia apps to work on it, it has to include a lot of them
<crimsun> welcome to $most_distros
<bddebian> heh
<LaserJock> minghua | crimsun: so was I wrong to reject that bug?
<nrg88> and that means if a multimedia app wants to work on a lot of distros, it has to have a lot of plugins written, and maintained
<crimsun> LaserJock: sorry, will read now
<RAOF> nrg88: No, not really.  They can just have gstreamer, and be done with it :)
<nrg88> but why doing all these stuff, when you can write a multimedia app using simple as pie code ( take a look at the example: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phonon_(KDE) ), and a distro including phonon and ONE multimedia backend
<RAOF> Media apps shouldn't have to care about the underlying sound server (pulse, esd, jack)
<nrg88> RAOF: then why do other projects bother/
<nrg88> ?
<RAOF> Because they're stupid :P
<nrg88> pulseaudio, xine, esd, mplayer...
<nrg88> :D
<nrg88> you tell them
<RAOF> Well, mplayer exists as an ffmpeg frontend, AFAICT
<Fujitsu> We do need something unified, but there's no point writing a new one to do it.
<RAOF> pulseaudio & ESD aren't media apps.
<crimsun> nrg88: Phonon's not going to change that. It still will require some other backend.
<RAOF> And xine was around before gstreamer
<nrg88> RAOF: exactly that's what phonon is trying to do: so a multimedia app will not have to bother of the underlying sound server
<RAOF> nrg88: But they can do that right now, with gstreamer.
<zakame> good morning :)
<minghua> LaserJock: technically not wrong, although maybe we can be a little more polite
<RAOF> gstreamer has plugins for alsa, jack, pulseaudio, esd, oss, etc
<LaserJock> minghua: oops, my bad
<minghua> LaserJock: since it's an old bug
<crimsun> LaserJock: IMO, the rejection is fine
<LaserJock> minghua: I've been looking over lots of old silly bugs today. I might be getting a bit to terse
<crimsun> LaserJock: we definitely won't be adding libxaw8*
<minghua> LaserJock: your rejection message is good for a next-day rejection, an after-eight-months rejection, however...
<RAOF> nrg88: They *still* have to assume that phonon is there, so they might as well just drop phonon and use gstreamer :)
<minghua> let me add my two cents there
<LaserJock> minghua: thanks
<crimsun> err, there's nothing impolite about jordan's response
<crimsun> it's flat, sure, but nothing that even comes close to raising CoC objections
<LaserJock> well *that's* good
<LaserJock> can't be having an CoC violations ;-)
<nrg88> RAOF: then you tell the gnome devs to drop pulseaudio, and use gstreamer
<crimsun> you want impolite? Look at Ron Lee's comments on wxwidgets2.5
<RAOF> nrg88: But they're different things.
<Fujitsu> It's just ludicrous to expect us to do stuff like that, LaserJock. Your reply was fine.
<RAOF> Gstreamer doesn't do the same thing as pulseaudio
<nrg88> phonon and gstreamer are different things too...
<Fujitsu> crimsun: Where?
<RAOF> nrg88: But not really.
<nrg88> but yes :)
<Fujitsu> nrg88: Isn't phonon just an alternate interface?
* bddebian dances around the room...
<RAOF> So, as I see it:  Phonon is a way of decoding & playing media files, yes?
<nrg88> a new api
<nrg88> a unified api for the most backends
<RAOF> Let's ignore the backends for a moment, they're irrelevant.
<RAOF> Phonon is about playing music & video, yes?
<LaserJock> bddebian: what's up?
<nrg88> is about using media
<nrg88> yes
<nrg88> it't not just for playing
<RAOF> Ok.  So, this is exactly what gstreamer is about.  You even have pluggable backends.
<bddebian> LaserJock: Just "watching" :)
<nrg88> what is pulseaudio about?
<RAOF> playing and recording PCM audio, and caching small audio samples.
<nrg88> i thought gstreamer can do that too
<nrg88> the gnome sound recordes is using gstreamer
<RAOF> No.  Well, not the audio caching part.
<Kamping_Kaiser> i'm having a problem building openoffice - can i ask about that here, or just file a bug?
<RAOF> gstreamer isn't network-transparent, which is one of the features of pulseaudio
<minghua> LaserJock: I added my comment
<LaserJock> Kamping_Kaiser: I'm not sure how much help we'd be, but you can always ask
<crimsun> Fujitsu: Debian 285186 is one of the more polite ones; with a bit of Googling, one can find less polite ones responding to people's continued "please package a new version of 2.5.blah"
<ubotu> Debian bug 285186 in wxwidgets2.5 "FTBFS: powerpc" [Important,Closed]  http://bugs.debian.org/285186
<LaserJock> ok, I'm on to texlive-*
<Kamping_Kaiser> LaserJock, it fails with some error about gzip - http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/14650/ should i be filing a bug? i'm trying to rebuild with debug symbols because impress is crashing, and its hard to teach when no one can do work
<Kamping_Kaiser> and would the bug get looked at is the other thing. i dont have a great history with bugs+dapper :/
<Fujitsu> Kamping_Kaiser: I doubt (m)any of us have touched OOo.
<Kamping_Kaiser> Fujitsu, :/ any suggestions for where to go?
<nrg88> it's gettin really late :)
<nrg88> 4 am
<nrg88> :D
<nrg88> well guys, thanks for the chat, i learned a lot of interesting facts today
<joejaxx> hmm let me look
<Fujitsu> crimsun: He sounds like a really pleasant guy.
<crimsun> he certainly has strong opinions
<Fujitsu> I noticed.
<nrg88> who, me?
<LaserJock> crimsun: didn't seem *that* bad :-)
<LaserJock> nrg88: no
<Fujitsu> nrg88: Ron Lee.
<nrg88> :D
<LaserJock> ok, I really want to close Bug #67441 as "Not a bug"
<ubotu> Malone bug 67441 in texlive-base "What is added value of texlive packages vis--vis TeXLiveCD from TUG?" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/67441
<Fujitsu> LaserJock: I've wanted to do that for a while.
<Fujitsu> Please do.
<nrg88> well, goodmorning, goodafternoon, goodnight, or whatever suits you ;)
<joejaxx> :)
<joejaxx> Goodnight nrg88 
<Fujitsu> Good morning, nrg88.
<Kamping_Kaiser> later nrg88 
<nrg88> :)
<Fujitsu> Bah.
<LaserJock> Fujitsu: I'll try to do a bit better on this one
<marcin_ant> I got malformed-prompt-in-templates warning from lintian could someone tell me where could I find some additional info what is a problem here?
* minghua seems to have seen that 67441 before
<Fujitsu> What are we meant to do about things like openhackware and proll? They try to build on i386 'cause they're arch all, but expect to be built on powerpc and sparc respectively. 
<plugwash> why are they arch all if they are only buildable on one architecture?!
<Fujitsu> Because the binaries are architecture independent. They're used in qemu as firmware.
<Fujitsu> Or something like that.
<Fujitsu> But they expect to be built on the right architecture, which doesn't work with source-only uploads.
<minghua> are they useful on other arches?
* plugwash wonders if an arch-all package that only builds on some architectures is really compliant with debian policies
<Fujitsu> minghua: Yes, for qemu to emulate.
<Fujitsu> openhackware is a PPC BIOS, so is really only going to be useful on non-PPC architectures.
<minghua> so some package only useful for non-PPC arches but can only be built on PPC?
<Fujitsu> That's correct.
<Fujitsu> Potentially useful on PPC, but probably not the main use.
<minghua> I think I am stumped
<Fujitsu> Why?
<plugwash> surely the correct soloution is to fix it to build on all architectures
<minghua> try to persuade LP people to make soyuz accept binary uploads?
<minghua> :-P
<LaserJock> lol
<bddebian> Have you read the bug information?  It's not meant to build on non-PPC archs
<Fujitsu> plugwash: That's impossible, I believe.
<Fujitsu> minghua: It does, just not from mortals.
<minghua> oh.  try to pass that package through an immortal, then? :-)
<Fujitsu> Ah, I hadn't seen the latest comment.
<LaserJock> ok, Bug #67441 is now closed
<ubotu> Malone bug 67441 in texlive-base "What is added value of texlive packages vis--vis TeXLiveCD from TUG?" [Undecided,Rejected]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/67441
<Fujitsu> A month ago, and no action on infinity's part. :-/
<bddebian> w00t, go LaserJock
* Fujitsu checks LaserJock's response.
<Fujitsu> Not bad.
<LaserJock> we'll see
<LaserJock> I'm just looking forward to the flames
<Fujitsu> There might not be any.
<LaserJock> I don't know, TeX seems like a gigantic mine field
<bddebian> yep :)
<joejaxx> woohoo
<LaserJock> first I need to go talk to Norbert and see what to do with tex bugs in Ubuntu
* joejaxx 's launch mirror grepper is working
<Fujitsu> joejaxx: What's it for?
<ScottK> Anyone here have any interest in the klamav package?  There are 8 recent SIGSEGV reports (since klamav was updated).  I can't reproduce it here and don't know enough about reading the crash reports to know where to start or if they are all dupes.
<Fujitsu> LaserJock: How is his attitude towards Ubuntu
<Fujitsu> *?
<joejaxx> Fujitsu: well i am creating a script for an experimental download method that i am going to propose 
<joejaxx> Fujitsu: ever heard of metalink?
<Fujitsu> I have, yes. I know nothing about it, though.
<joejaxx> yeah i wanted to have a working concept before i went and proposed this download method
<LaserJock> Fujitsu: well, mixed, he's texlive upstream and Debian maintainer
<LaserJock> Fujitsu: he's basically the only real person triaging tex in Ubuntu
<LaserJock> which makes him not so happy
<LaserJock> but he does do quite a bit on Launchpad so he's not totally turned off
<LaserJock> my guess is he does it because he hates seeing his packages in bad shape
<Fujitsu> Better than many of them.
<joejaxx> ok it is all finished except for the country problem
<ScottK> What would I have to do to get the ability to set importance on bugs in launchpad? 
<Fujitsu> ScottK: Become a member of ubuntu-qa.
<ScottK> Thanks
* ScottK investiages that.
<LaserJock> or a MOTU
<LaserJock> ;-)
<Fujitsu> Darn.
<bddebian> Better yet :-)
<Fujitsu> kqemu is currently broken in Ubuntu because of an incompatible bochsbios. :(
* ScottK is a long way away from becoming a MOTU.  ubuntu-qa may have lower standards.
<LaserJock> ScottK: pfft, you're a super start now :-)
<LaserJock> *star
<joejaxx> :)
<bddebian> ScottK: You are doing fine
<bddebian> I wouldn't say a long way
<ScottK> OK.  
<Fujitsu> ... why is there a `Screenshot' button all through the Etch graphical installer?
<jdong> Fujitsu: I asked the same
<jdong> Fujitsu: I thought it was pretty obnoxious ;-)
<minghua> ...for making a screenshot?
<joejaxx> hmm interesting
<joejaxx> Fujitsu: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+cdmirrors-rss << they have this
<Fujitsu> minghua: In the final? A little strange.
<minghua> although I am indeed surprised that they didn't turn it off in formal releases
<joejaxx> Fujitsu: but that does not have enough information
<Fujitsu> joejaxx: That's the LP style.
<Fujitsu> minghua: Exactly.
<jdong> minghua: IMO it sounded like "OOH cool installer, n'est-ce pas? Click me, show me off to your friends!"
* ajmitch returns
<LaserJock> jdong: yep :-)
<Fujitsu> The new graphical installer /is/ pretty nice, but the screenshot button is a little stupid.
<Fujitsu> Hey ajmitch.
<jdong> Fujitsu: I didn't feel one way or another about their GUI installer
<jdong> Fujitsu: it just exposed the exact same options in the exact same way via a GUI
<jdong> IMO it's no different in usability/functionality than the ncurses one
<jdong> oh yeah... except it can do SCREENSHOTS
<Fujitsu> But it's shiny!
<joejaxx> :(
<Fujitsu> (just as shiny as the Red Hat 7.0 one!)
<jdong> Fujitsu: wake me up when it's 3D cube.
<minghua> one important point of the GUI installer is that Debian supports quite a few languages in installation now
<jdong> minghua: ah, ok, that's worthwhile
<Fujitsu> Beryl built into the installer. I like it.
<Fujitsu> minghua: That is a good thing.
<joejaxx> Fujitsu: lol that is messed up
<LaserJock> if I have 2 installers that do the same thing, I think I'd naturally go with the cooler looking one
<joejaxx> LaserJock: yeah
<ajmitch> LaserJock!
<Fujitsu> LaserJock: Probably.
<ScottK> Looks like ubuntu-qa is a shorter path.  I still wonder how I got the ability to reject other people's bugs.  That just seemed to show up one day.
<joejaxx> ok it is almost done building the rawlist
<LaserJock> my gosh, gnumeric is slick
* ajmitch should fix some packages & file UVF requests :)
<DarkTeengeek> hello
<DarkTeengeek> oh wrong nick
<LaserJock> ajmitch: yeah, even I've been busy :-)
<ajmitch> LaserJock: it doesn't take much to be busier than I am
<white> Fujitsu: debian-melbourne ... answer and tell when it suits you :)
<joejaxx> ok
<joejaxx> here is the raw list
<joejaxx> http://ubuntu.joejaxx.org/+cdmirrors-raw
<joejaxx> i generated that from launchpad
<Fujitsu> white: I've got the rest of the week off, so basically any time.
<white> Fujitsu: great, same here so write that :)
<Fujitsu> That I shall.
<joejaxx> now i have to figure out the country field issue
<ajmitch> white: the etch boozeup?
<white> :)
<Cybermatt> question how do packages built with checkinstall different from those made the hard way
* ajmitch is still on the debian-melb list :)
<white> anyone else around in melb?
<Fujitsu> I probably won't be allowed to go, of course.
<white> Fujitsu: i'll talk to your parents :)
<LaserJock> Cybermatt: well, when you do it the "hard way" you get a real source package
<Fujitsu> Cybermatt: They differ in that anybody mentioning checkinstall is likely to get destroyed within seconds.
<joejaxx> Cybermatt: checkinstall is a discouraged way of making packages
* Fujitsu energises the demolition beams.
<LaserJock> Cybermatt: checkinstall basically "fakes it"
<ajmitch> "hey Fujitsu's parents, $RANDOM_HACKER is saying it's ok to go out & get drunk over a distro release"
<Cybermatt> oh
<LaserJock> now, now
<Cybermatt> hmm
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: That'll definitely work.
<white> ajmitch: you reckon it doesn't work?
<joejaxx> Fujitsu: http://ubuntu.joejaxx.org/+cdmirrors-raw < is this grep'able for you now :P
<ajmitch> white: you could try it..
<white> what if we all catch up during the afternoon and get drunk then? (ok a bit random, but still)
<white> i mean we've waited for that a long time :)
<ajmitch> Cybermatt: checkinstall doesn't create a source package that is reproducable & rebuildable by others, so it can't go into the distro
<Cybermatt> ok lol then ill slowly start makeing them the real way
<LaserJock> you might want to take a look at the Ubuntu Packaging Guide
<LaserJock> http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/
<Cybermatt> yes i should
<Cybermatt> got  to get up early so i guess ill go now
<ajmitch> checkinstall basically tars up the result of a build - source packages specify everything necessary to do the build in a clean system
* Fujitsu notes it's probably a bit useless installing a Etch in crypto-LVM on a VM disk image that's on crypto-LVM.
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: it could get a little slow
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: Oh, it is.
<Fujitsu> But at least the installer can do it... I must work on that for Feisty+1.
<joejaxx> welcome back Hobbsee :)
<RAOF> Heya Hobbsee :)
<ajmitch> Hobbsee!
<Hobbsee> heya joejaxx, RAOF 
<Hobbsee> ajmitch!
<LaserJock> Fujitsu: forgive my ignorance, but what's the point of crypto-LVM?
<LaserJock> Hobbsee!
<Fujitsu> LaserJock: To be encrypted, of course.
<LaserJock> Fujitsu: the whole filesystem? every file?
<Hobbsee> LaserJock!
<Fujitsu> The entire filesystem.
<Fujitsu> Or if you do it on Debian, you can have the entire LVM VG encrypted.
* RAOF thinks that might be interesting to investigate for his lappy
<Fujitsu> I suppose it's possible in Ubuntu too, but would require a lot of manual hackery.
<bddebian> Damn another mentor e-mail...
<ScottK> Hobbsee: Would you have interest/time in looking at klamav bugs?  There are 8 sigsegv since it was synched and I can't reproduce it.
<Hobbsee> urgh
<Hobbsee> ScottK: not at the moment - maybe later
<LaserJock> I don't really see the point of an encrypted filesystem in general, but it sure sounds nifty
* Hobbsee doesnt really do klamav
<ScottK> OK.  No risk of you knowing less than me.
<Fujitsu> LaserJock: Do you want all of your data walking around everywhere accessible to all?
* ScottK can see the point of encypted files systems for laptops.
<RAOF> With desktops, less so, yeah.
<joejaxx> LaserJock: for security
<Fujitsu> ScottK: That's where I'm using it.
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: ask siretart about cryptroot
<joejaxx> Kamping_Kaiser: sensitive data :)
<ajmitch> he's had it setup & working for awhile
<Fujitsu> I had it working several months ago, but never got around to setting it up again. Plus it wasn't with LVM.
<Kamping_Kaiser> joejaxx, ?
<joejaxx> Kamping_Kaiser: gah
* geser puts encrypted fs on his laptop on his TODO list
<Fujitsu> I've just got my /home LV done now.
<Fujitsu> It's pretty easy to do that.
<joejaxx> Kamping_Kaiser: sorry about that <tab> completion :\
<Kamping_Kaiser> joejaxx, thought so :)
<ajmitch> Kamping_Kaiser!
<joejaxx> LaserJock: because of sensitive data
<joejaxx> Kamping_Kaiser: :P
<Kamping_Kaiser> :P
<Fujitsu> Hm, my entire system seems to be lagging now... I guess two layers of crypto (one in kqemu) and installing Debian don't go together to give low resource consumption.
<LaserJock> joejaxx: yeah, I just an't imagine needing to do that for a huge extent
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: nest the  VMs!
<joejaxx> LaserJock: i guess it depends on the level of paranoia
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: Sounds great!
<LaserJock> well, I have paranoia
<Fujitsu> I'll turn off kqemu too.
<joejaxx> LaserJock: you can have the whole drive encrypted
* RAOF likes cdparanoia :P
<LaserJock> just usually end up forgeting things and getting really screwed
<joejaxx> LaserJock: and boot from usb key/cdrom
* Fujitsu drops a rock on RAOF.
<ajmitch> joejaxx: and boot from a USB stick, if the BIOS supports it
<joejaxx> ajmitch: yeap :)
<ajmitch> sadly my laptop BIOS doesn't
<joejaxx> wow that stinks :\
<LaserJock> like the time I changed my OS X password and forgot it roughly 10 seconds latter
<joejaxx> ajmitch: what about cdrom?
<Fujitsu> I should probably organise that at some point... Much nicer.
<joejaxx> LaserJock: :\
<ajmitch> sure, but that's rather a crap way to boot
<joejaxx> ajmitch: yeah true
<joejaxx> well i guess if you carry arond a business sized cdrom
<ajmitch> usb stick is much smaller, and I carry a 2GB one on my keyring
<joejaxx> Fujitsu: yeah it is
<Fujitsu> When I was running Debian, I had the LUKS key on a USB stick which I carried around, and a little script to check for it on boot. Worked well.
<LaserJock> I guess I just don't put that much sensitive stuff on my computer
<ajmitch> LaserJock: gpg & ssh keys?
<LaserJock> I have one file for passwords, gpg, ssh
<LaserJock> but why would i need an encrypted FS for that?
* Fujitsu decides to run a performance test on the crypted /home once the install has finished.
<LaserJock> but for sure, if your work demands security it makes sense
<Fujitsu> I'd like to know just how much of a performance hit it gives...
<joejaxx> Fujitsu: i am setting up etch+encrypted+selinux
<joejaxx> :)
<LaserJock> then unplug the ethernet cable and turn off any wifi cards
<LaserJock> :-)
<ajmitch> joejaxx: it shouldn't be too much of a challenge to get that working
<Fujitsu> I've never dealt with SELinux before... How hard is it to set up on Debian?
<joejaxx> of course i forgot when i went to do yabootconfig --kernel-args "selinux=1 audit=1 enforcing=1" that the drive was encrypted lol
<joejaxx> Fujitsu: well with the default policies 7 minutes
<Fujitsu> Not bad.
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: simple enough
<nixternal> can you still chroot into encrypted partitions in case of an emergency with ease?
<ajmitch> it *ought* to be that simple on ubuntu
<Fujitsu> I wonder if cjwatson would be averse to adding an extra option to Ubiquity for doing crypto.
<LaserJock> what does selinux do?
<joejaxx> apt-get selinux-basics && patch the necessary files && `fixfiles relabel`
<LaserJock> I remember Fedora having it an it being a pain in the butt
<Fujitsu> nixternal: Yes, you just need the cryptsetup package and to know the key.
<joejaxx> oh and do not forget to do check-selinux-installation
<ajmitch> LaserJock: mandatory access control - programs run in security domains & users have specific roles
<ajmitch> LaserJock: FC2 or so? :)
<LaserJock> yeah
<nixternal> ya, it would be nice to encrypt at least my /home directory
<joejaxx> then reboot after you add the kernel args to yaboot /grub
<LaserJock> last of my RedHat/Fedora experience
<ajmitch> LaserJock: that gave selinux a bad name for a long time
<ajmitch> a strict policy, on by default, that broke the world
<LaserJock> yeah
<ajmitch> to do simple things like adding user roles you had to recompile the whole policy
<joejaxx> Fujitsu: all that takes me about 7 minutes the thing that takes the most time is the file labeling ie `fixfiles relabel`
<ajmitch> things have improved a bit :)
<LaserJock> I was like "What the heck is this selinux thing and why the heck won't my computer work?"
<nixternal> I got to see a great demo of FC7 yesterday. Their artwork is stellar, GDM and KDM logins look great, and if you have the fingerprint scanner, it will prompt you to either enter a password for your username or ask you to swipe your finger
<LaserJock> ajmitch: does it do anything for the home user?
<joejaxx> ajmitch: i did not know they included the refpolicy-targeted by default in etch
<Fujitsu> The latter is easy to do in Ubuntu too.
<nixternal> otherwise, it was the same exact GNOME and KDE (icons and color) they have used from day one
<joejaxx> i was surprised with that
<Fujitsu> LaserJock: security++
<ajmitch> LaserJock: sure
<LaserJock> hmm
<ajmitch> LaserJock: not nearly as useful as for servers
* ajmitch should probably fix up some more selinux stuff for universe in feisty
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: Isn't it getting fairly late for that?
* bddebian should probably do "something"
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: universe, simple fixes
<ajmitch> most of what we need is already there from debian
<joejaxx> yeap
<Fujitsu> Oh, good. So it's not stuff that has been blacklisted for some reason.
<ajmitch> no
<ajmitch> why do you think it's been blacklisted?
<Fujitsu> No idea.
* Fujitsu is just crazy.
<joejaxx> :P
<ajmitch> yep
* ajmitch waits *patiently* for launchpad
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: Any ETA on the comments field?
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: no. don't ask for one
<Fujitsu> I shall not, then.
<ajmitch> good
* ajmitch has had time to come home, eat lunch while talking on irc
<joejaxx> qemu powerpc emulation is broken on ubuntu
<joejaxx> :\
<ajmitch> joejaxx: fix it
<Fujitsu> joejaxx: There's a lack of BIOS... Is that all?
<joejaxx> Fujitsu: yeah i think that is the case
<joejaxx> openhackware does not have any binaries
<Fujitsu> That's the openhackware stuff I was talking about a couple of hours ago.
<joejaxx> it is just a source package in universe
<joejaxx> Fujitsu: ah i did not see that conversation
<bddebian> LaserJock: New tex bug for ya ;-P
<ScottK> bddebian: If you are looking for 'something', you could go fix the klamav sigsegv while Hobbsee is busy elsewhere...
<bddebian> Notice I said "should" do something :-)
<joejaxx> Fujitsu: i also have yet to find a way around the grub-loop-of-death on qemu-system-x86_64 with the debian-installer
<ajmitch> bddebian: ok, go & do something
* bddebian goes to play Oblivion
<ajmitch> s/something/something useful/
<joejaxx> bddebian: haha
<joejaxx> :P
<LaserJock> bddebian: I wish I knew what the heck any of that apport stuff meant
<ajmitch> something broke
<bddebian> Yeah, you and me both :-)
<LaserJock> yeah, now I just get like 4 times as many bug emails
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: What did?
<Fujitsu> Oh.
<Fujitsu> I see.
<LaserJock> and I still don't get anything out of it
<crimsun> maybe we need a class on reading traces
<LaserJock> that would be wonderful
<bddebian> YEAH
<LaserJock> I feel bad because it looks like a lot is being done
<LaserJock> but it's pretty much useless for me
<ajmitch> crimsun: reading the auguries?
<bddebian> I've felt that way with Hurd for about 4 years now LaserJock :)
<ajmitch> who wants to reply nicely to bug 104637?
<ubotu> Malone bug 104637 in pyparsing "pyparsing 1.4.5 released in dec 06" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/104637
<StevenK> ajmitch: With the reply being "Bite us, we're releasing" ?
<bddebian> hehe
<ajmitch> StevenK: that would have been my reply, hence why I was asking others...
<StevenK> ajmitch: I figured, I just wanted to see if we were thinking along the same lines. :-)
<LaserJock> I can do it if nobody wants to
<superm1> crimsun, that class would be incredibly useful :)
<LaserJock> I'm on a roll :-)
<ajmitch> LaserJock: thanks :)
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: do it as well as i did that fool of a bug about cookies
<welshbyte> LaserJock: "ajmitch told me to tell you..." :)
<StevenK> Fetched 482MB in 60s (8021kB/s)
<bddebian> hehe
<bddebian> !packagingguide
<ubotu> The packaging guide is at http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/index.html - See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/New for information on getting a package integrated into Ubuntu - Other developer resources are at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DeveloperResources - See also !backports
<LaserJock> ajmitch: done
<ajmitch> LaserJock: thank you sir
* bddebian probably scares away another mentee
<LaserJock> welshbyte: "Don't me make summon ajmitch, kthxbye"
<welshbyte> hehe
<ajmitch> hm
<ajmitch> people seem to think I'm mean & nasty
<ajmitch> that's hardly fair
<LaserJock> "What do you want, ajmitch or Hobbsee's stick of DOOM?"
<bddebian> I think you are all snuggly ;-P
<Hobbsee> hehe
<ajmitch> bddebian: yeah I'd rather be mean & nasty than have you think that...
<bddebian> heh
<ajmitch> uh oh, Hobbsee's here
* ajmitch hides
* Hobbsee pokes ajmitch a few times with the DoomStick
<ajmitch> ouch!
<ajmitch> finally, we'll have the chance to get Hobbsee in spain
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: indeed....
<LaserJock> I don't think they'll let her take the DoomStick on the plane
<ajmitch> yay
<LaserJock> mwuahaha
<ajmitch> LaserJock: careful, she'll still tickle & poke you
* Hobbsee muhahahaha's
<LaserJock> hmm
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: found that out the hard way
<bddebian> hah
* LaserJock packs his anti-tickle suit
<welshbyte> has either pysupport or pycentral become the preferred one yet?
* Hobbsee will have an evil twin, though, to help
<bddebian> Ubuntu seems to favor pycentral from what I've seen but I'm a moron
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: oh really?
<LaserJock> bddebian: well, yeah, doko wrote it
<Fujitsu> welshbyte: I believe the battle still rages, though more seem to use pysupport.
<welshbyte> ok, thanks
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: elkbuntu 
<StevenK> Linda uses pysupport because it doesn't suck as much as pycentral
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: elkbuntu is rather restrained compared to you
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: hmph
* ajmitch met elkbuntu at the last UDS, remember?
* Hobbsee contemplates not coming to uds...
<ajmitch> hah
<Hobbsee> yes, but she wasnt with me then
<bddebian> WTH is an elkbuntu?
<LaserJock> I met elkbuntu and ajmitch at the last UDS
<ajmitch> bddebian: elkbuntu is in this channel...
<bddebian> I see that
<Fujitsu> She's Hobbsee's eviler clone, of course.
<LaserJock> StevenK: how so?
* RAOF , still marking, marvels at "4x9x5 = 49"
<Hobbsee> RAOF: *grin*
<Hobbsee> RAOF: i marked some of my friend's maths papers for her yr 8 class....they had some similar...interesting...answers.
<welshbyte> obviously thought the first x was a + :)
<Fujitsu> RAOF: That's really great!
<ajmitch> "what is six times nine?"
<RAOF> 42!
<welshbyte> 42
<Fujitsu> 42, obviously.
<welshbyte> hehe
<ajmitch> how to tell you're in a room full of geeks
<LaserJock> RAOF: it's obvious, 9x5 = 45 the second 4x actually switches operation by the property of transmutation to 4+ henc 4+45=49, QED
<jdong> RAOF: haha at least you don't have kids like me giving you sarcastic responses :D
<Hobbsee> 42!!!
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: what base?
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: 13, I believe.
<ajmitch> :)
* Fujitsu checks.
<Fujitsu> ... no, that's something else.
<ajmitch> no, it is
<StevenK> LaserJock: pysupport will cope with modules installed into the "system" directories, whereas pycentral wants them under /usr/share/python-central. I think.
<ajmitch> 13x4+2
<StevenK> LaserJock: pysupport struck me as more polished, too.
<Fujitsu> So it is. I never was good with converting to strange bases at a moment's notice.
<LaserJock> StevenK: I think it's the other way around
<RAOF> I concur with LaserJock.
<RAOF> Having recently read the new debian python policy (again) while trying to deal with democracyplayer
<StevenK> Hrrrm.
* Fujitsu consults the MOTU collective on the matter of kqemu's brokenness.
* RAOF will eventually internalise the python policy
<StevenK> Maybe I am remembering wrongly.
<Fujitsu> It needs a new BIOS (it currently gets it from bochs) or some kernels panic.
<StevenK> Maybe it's because pycentral wants that damn XB-Python-Version crap in the control file
<Fujitsu> StevenK: But added control fields is FUN.
<RAOF> Policy says "please add that regardless" :)
<StevenK> The Python Policy can bite me.
<Fujitsu> RAOF: Does it? I thought that was frowned upon these days.
* ajmitch is going to head out & (hopefully) talk to someone about an ubuntu spec
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: Bye! It really is quite a small world.
<LaserJock> LDAP?
<bddebian> ajmitch: Finally read sharms? ;-P
<ajmitch> LaserJock: yeah
<LaserJock> Fujitsu: if your from the AU/NZ end of the world
<LaserJock> cool
<ajmitch> bddebian: uh what?
<ajmitch> LaserJock: yeah, chaks who came into the channel last night, doing a masters project at uni
<ajmitch> I'll see what overlap there is with current work done
* ajmitch knows his project supervisor fairly well
<ajmitch> hm
<ajmitch> I wonder where  my laptop power supply has gone to
<LaserJock> I need to get a new one for mine :(
<ajmitch> mine is hopefully around the flat somewhere
<ajmitch> either that or it's at work
<LaserJock> and my battery is pretty much toast
<LaserJock> it's about 3 years old
<ajmitch> ah, mine is a bit over a year old
<ajmitch> ok, found it :)
<ajmitch> hm, no response to the text message yet
<ajmitch> it might need to wait until some other time
<StevenK> Geeez.
<StevenK> Etch is almost out
<ajmitch> almost out?
<Fujitsu> StevenK: It is out...
<ajmitch> it was out > 12 hours ago
<StevenK> "in the hands of the SRMs" from -devel-announce
<Fujitsu> Has been for aagges.
<ajmitch> http://lists.debian.org/debian-announce/debian-announce-2007/msg00002.html
<Fujitsu> Apr 08 22:53:30 ---     aba has changed the topic to: Mission accomplished
<ajmitch> StevenK: ie, you're long overdue to start drinking
<StevenK> Debian forced me to drink long ago.
<LaserJock> any excuse ;-)
* ajmitch wonders what the person in bug 104652 would have for their sources.list
* ajmitch pokes ubotu 
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: lots of crack.
<ubotu> Malone bug 104652 in update-manager "sysvinit prevents system from an upgrade" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/104652
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: want to translate bug 104655 for me please? :)
<ubotu> Malone bug 104655 in firefox " " [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/104655
<ajmitch> my russian flatmate is out of town for a few days
<crimsun> #ubuntu-ru ?
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: heh
<Hobbsee> nope
<LaserJock> ok, my karma *better* go up after today
<crimsun> karma chaser!
<LaserJock> crimsun: hehe
<LaserJock> you know me
<LaserJock> wahoo, that's the first time I've ever seen https://launchpad.net/~laserjock/+karma be all from the same day
<welshbyte> same again tomorrow?
<LaserJock> ugg, no
<welshbyte> :)
<ajmitch> LaserJock: well done :)
<LaserJock> gotta work on other stuff tomorrow
<LaserJock> I have a department seminar to give Wednesday
<ajmitch> my karma page probably still shows stuff from last year
<LaserJock> and I still need to finish some research to start writing it
<LaserJock> ajmitch: not hardly
<ajmitch> LaserJock: I don't touch ubuntu, usually
* ajmitch wonders why his sync request didn't get through
<ajmitch> I guess LP decided that bugs I file aren't worth it
<Fujitsu> How does geser manage to do so much? He's got the most uploads, the most bug karma... He must have a few clones.
<ajmitch> he spends less time on irc
<crimsun> if I were doing golden pony awards, he'd be my pick
<crimsun> *cough*
<crimsun> Adri2000: LOCK doodle merge.
* ajmitch files a sync manually, since LP hates me
<Fujitsu> crimsun: An advanced locking system you have there.
<ajmitch> (no new upstream version for this one)
<crimsun> Fujitsu: yeah, harkens back to the wiki days
<crimsun> come to think of it, we used it for X.Org, too ;)
<ajmitch> back laterish
<Fujitsu> Bye ajmitch.
<LaserJock> crimsun: noted ;-)
<crimsun> O:-)
<Hobbsee> yeah, thought i remembered seeing that for X.Org
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: about that update-manager bug?
<crimsun> has there been an announcement about upload.ubuntu.com's host downtime?
<crimsun> or ftp service on that machine being disabled?
<StevenK> crimsun: It's the canonical sysadmins going "Release Feisty now. We dare you!"
<crimsun> must be :-)
<StevenK> crimsun: :-)
<elkbuntu> Fujitsu, if that's the case, I'm a pretty inaccurate clone
<RAOF> Hm, another gem from 1st year algebra marking: "(1/2(e^ix + e^-ix))^4=(1/2e^ix+e^-ix)^4"
<Hobbsee> RAOF: heh
<elkbuntu> haha
* RAOF wonders whether 1st years ever *read* what they write in tests.
<Hobbsee> clearly not
<RAOF> Why does audacity Suggest: liblame-dev?  Can't it link to the versioned .so like everyone else?
<LaserJock> so many questions
<nixternal> haha
<Fujitsu> RAOF: It's special, I suppose.
<Fujitsu> I love special packages.
<RAOF> Oh, well.  One ubuntu+1 support request down :)
<welshbyte> blimey, cdbs is magic
<minghua> debhelper is magic.  cdbs is _black_ magic
<minghua> :-P
* RAOF has gone trawling through some cdbs rules files.  minghua is right :)
<welshbyte> i've just packaged a project of mine using a 5 line rules file :)
<RAOF> Hey, Hobbsee, you're a Kubuntuite, right?  Is apport enabled in Kubutu?  There's someone in #ubuntu+1 trying to file a crash-report bug on last.fm
<Fujitsu> welshbyte: That's fairly long compared to some I've seen.
<RAOF> 1 line for the shebang, and a couple of cdbs includes. :)
<welshbyte> the extra lines were because it's a python project and needed a couple of patches
<LaserJock> I've seen 1 and 2 liners
<LaserJock> I've also seen like 50 liners
<LaserJock> if it plays nice they are soo easy
<Hobbsee> RAOF: yes, and i think so
<Fujitsu> My debian package has 4 non-comment lines.
<LaserJock> hmm, I suppose a gdm session segfaulting isn't a great thing
<Fujitsu> Probably not!
<LaserJock> and my test user doesn't log in
<LaserJock> excellent
<LaserJock> why in the world would that happen
<LaserJock> well, Hobbsee should like this one
<LaserJock> I can log into KDE, but not Gnome
<Hobbsee> haha
<Hobbsee> nice
<LaserJock> although it's not cool that I can log into Gnome with a fresh user
<LaserJock> *can't
<Fujitsu> LaserJock: Check the your lo is up.
<LaserJock> Fujitsu: looks good to me
<LaserJock> why would KDE work and Gnome not, grrr
<LaserJock> darn, this isn't good
<LaserJock> I wonder if I log out if I'll be able to get back in
<Fujitsu> Probably not.
<LaserJock> way uncool
* AstralJava reads his bug email folder.... thanks a million ajmitch! :)
<jussi01> LaserJock, I know you have waaay more knowledge and I havent seen some of the convo, but I had that problem... it was something about 2 xorgs or something... it was ages back and i cant really remember
<LaserJock> hmm
<imbrandon> re
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: it's telling you that you need to switch to kde
<jussi01> lol
<LaserJock> ok, well I don't know what that was all about
<LaserJock> but a restart fixed
<LaserJock> hi imbrandon 
<jussi01> hehe
<imbrandon> heya LaserJock 
<imbrandon> hrm if you set a static ip in /etc/network/interfaces you must set a gateway correct >?
<imbrandon> e.g. not just a ip/netmask
<jussi01> can i ask a random question, just if someone knows?
<imbrandon> no i dont have blue eyes.
<jussi01> lol... can someone please fix bug 102675  ??
<ubotu> Malone bug 102675 in netbase "Feisty boot hangs on "Configuring network interfaces"" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/102675
<LaserJock> imbrandon: I think you need a gateway
<LaserJock> imbrandon: I always do ip/netmask/gateway/dns
* jussi01 slaps the bug
<imbrandon> LaserJock, right
<imbrandon> thats what i thought
<Fujitsu> jussi01: That's nothing to do with us, fortunately.
<jussi01> sadly...
<jussi01> Fujitsu, who is responsible that bug ?
* ajmitch returns
<jekil> hello
<siretart> Fujitsu: ajmitch: cryptroot? - according to the tons of lp bugs about it, I'd say its pretty broken in edgy and feisty
<Fujitsu> siretart: That's what I'd have thought.
<Fujitsu> I might see what I can do for Feisty+1.
<crimsun> siretart: anything we can do in the next week to get it ready?
<ajmitch> hi siretart 
<crimsun> I see it's fairly popular
<siretart> hi Fujitsu crimsun & ajmitch 
<crimsun> hi
<siretart> crimsun: yesterday, I tried to setup a system to reproduce it, and test some patches filed in lp
<siretart> crimsun: bug #104595 is the result
<ubotu> Malone bug 104595 in mdadm "qemu image with root on lvm on md fails to boot" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/104595
<crimsun> ah
<siretart> I'd suggest to use that qemu image as a start
<ajmitch> siretart: is that with cryptroot or not?
<siretart> ajmitch: no, it has "plain" root on lvm on md
<ajmitch> I thought & hoped that lvm/md boot bugs were fixed now :(
<Fujitsu> How does md manage to be so flaky with Edgy/Feisty?
<Fujitsu> Is it upstart?
<crimsun> there appear to be a bevy of those sort of bugs
<Fujitsu> Hm.
<siretart> ajmitch: but the vg has 5 gig free, so it should be pretty straightforward to create another lv, crypt it and boot from it
<Fujitsu> Was it all OK in Dapper?
<crimsun> I know I'm experiencing just one of them (where initramfs/udev are way too fast for the SATA controller)
<Fujitsu> crimsun: Get a slower machine. Duh.
<crimsun> buy me one kthx
<siretart> Fujitsu: I persume so. dapper didn't have upstart and this async udev/devmapper/foo startup concept
<ajmitch> siretart: I thought it was just udev/initramfs/kernel racing, before upstart got its hands on the system?
<Fujitsu> You have to blame upstart for it too, ajmitch.
<ajmitch> I do?
<siretart> ajmitch: upstart broke cryptsetup with its logging. so we had funny bugs like no prompt for password at all, or password printed on screen (later)
<Fujitsu> It is a combination of upstart and the new initramfs funny stuff.
<Fujitsu> And usplash in parts.
<siretart> ajmitch: usplash causes other funny bugs: if I prompt for a password in usplash, and the user switches the vt without entering the password, you cannot switch back to enter your pw
<Fujitsu> What is the benefit of the new device-mapper initramfs stuff that causes this?
<siretart> short: the fact that cryptsetup isn't in main is very very unfurtunate. this way nobody cares about crypted filesystems
<siretart> perhaps we should make a spec for it in sevilla
<Fujitsu> I'd love to have it properly supported for Feisty+1.
<siretart> same here
<Fujitsu> Speaking of which, we should have a name for that in the next few days.
<siretart> I 'fixed' the cryptsetup/usplash part by making the cryptsetup script to terminate usplash altogether
<Fujitsu> I noticed that, and turned it back on locally.
<ajmitch> I hope we have a name soon
<Fujitsu> It was 8 days before release last time.
<ajmitch> well we're getting close
<Fujitsu> Yeah, T-10 now.
<Fujitsu> T-10... I forgot we were that close.
<ajmitch> start fixing stuff faster
* Fujitsu is no good at fixing things, unfortunately.
<siretart> I've been calling it goofy as intermediate name ;)
<siretart> err, interim
<crimsun> I'm going through the RC bug list, but upload.ubuntu.com's ftpd seems down :\
<Fujitsu> crimsun: The rest of it seems to be up.
<Fujitsu> Hm.
<crimsun> I've poked in #canonical-sysadmin, but I have no idea if that's the correct channel
<ajmitch> crimsun: oh dear
<Fujitsu> crimsun: That's the right one.
<ajmitch> what a time for infrastructure to be falling over
<Fujitsu> drescher/Soyuz is sooooo reliable.
<crimsun> must have eaten too many easter sweets
<Fujitsu> Probably so.
<imbrandon> re
<crimsun> re
<ajmitch> hi imbrandon 
<imbrandon> heya ajmitch 
<superm1> hey imbrandon 
<imbrandon> man i'm like this >< close to calling canonical and getting a ubuntu support contract
<crimsun> you totally should. And then get them to swing me a pony. :-)
<imbrandon> damn network guys here cant figure out the vlan stuff and i'm no network guru on top level stuff
<Fujitsu> imbrandon: Why?
<Fujitsu> Hah.
<imbrandon> crimsun, hehe
<imbrandon> i guess they are trying to trunk 50+ vlans to one nic
<imbrandon> and its choking
<imbrandon> heh
<ajmitch> you think canonical will be able to help there?
<Fujitsu> They will use their superpowers to increase the bandwidth.
<crimsun> I think you guys need a CCNA or CCIE
<imbrandon> probably not, other than "wtf mang?" but atlweasrte its them and not me telling them they are stupid
<imbrandon> crimsun, my words exactly
<imbrandon> we have 4+ CCNA's on staff
<Fujitsu> I think CCNP/CCIE, not CCNA.
<Fujitsu> Only minimal VLAN stuff is in CCNA.
<imbrandon> and they still want to do this on a linux box
<imbrandon> point is cisco has this down pat
<StevenK> Sigh.
<StevenK> Linux, with a good enough NIC and a nice backplane can do anything a Cisco can.
<StevenK> Give me four PCI-X Intel e1000's on a good server motherboard and Dapper. :-)
<crimsun> imbrandon: feel like flying someone from .au over? ;-)
<StevenK> Bwahaha
<StevenK> imbrandon: The number of VLANs more than likely isn't an issue.
<StevenK> imbrandon: It might be bus or network bandwidth that is.
<imbrandon> crimsun, heheh
* StevenK has his own problems at the moment.
<StevenK> Some silly Broadcom network adapter isn't being picked up the dapper modules.
<imbrandon> thats ok at home my intel nic thats 10/100/1000 works perfect in 10 or 100 but not when hoooked to a 1000 switch :) ( but i know the switch works ok with 1000 because of other boxen  on it )
<imbrandon> at home ^^
<imbrandon> it gets link and an ip in 1000, but wont recieve packets
<StevenK> Cheap gigabit switch?
<imbrandon> fun fun fun
<imbrandon> yea
<StevenK> That might have something to do with it. :_)
<imbrandon> netgear $30 100/1000 swe
<imbrandon> ;)
<imbrandon> most likely
<StevenK> Why oh why do people continue to use Netgear things and expect their network to go quickly?
<Laser_away> why not? :-)
<StevenK> Because Netgear is crap
<Fujitsu> Laser_away: Sleep!
<imbrandon> because their routers/switches are pretty like apple design ?
<Fujitsu> StevenK: Nah, they're the best.
<imbrandon> hehe
<crimsun> Fujitsu: he's busy fixing universe, yay
<StevenK> imbrandon: Apple design is crap too
<imbrandon> but it looks nice ( IMHO )
<imbrandon> lol
<crimsun> actually, I guess one can interpret StevenK's "go quickly" as "go quickly into the trash"
<StevenK> imbrandon: Okay, if looking nice is the only criteria, then don't complain about your network being crap.
<StevenK> Hrm. Crap. The PCI ID doesn't appear in the driver.
<imbrandon> StevenK, :)
<StevenK> Hrm. The thing appears to be a Tigon3.
<superm1> imbrandon, did you happen to get that other server up and running on saturday?
<imbrandon> yea the servers are up and loaded, the switch isnt in place yet though
<imbrandon> so no network
<superm1> imbrandon, k
<jussi01> crimsun, any luck with the uploads?
<Fujitsu> jussi01: It's still down.
<jussi01> :(
<nrg88> happy easter :)
<StevenK> Okay. tg3 manages to oops the machine. 
<Lure> universe freeze is on 12, right?
<Fujitsu> Lure: Right.
<Fujitsu> After that everything needs an ack from motu-uvf.
<Lure> Fujitsu: I am thinking on asking for UVFe for opensync 0.22
<Fujitsu> !info opensync feisty
<ubotu> Package opensync does not exist in feisty
<Fujitsu> UVF, or NewPackagesFreeze?
<Lure> !info libopensync feisty
<Fujitsu> Ah.
<ubotu> Package libopensync does not exist in feisty
<Fujitsu> !info libopensync0 feisty
<ubotu> libopensync0: Synchronisation framework for email/pdas/and more. In component universe, is optional. Version 0.19-1.2ubuntu1 (feisty), package size 220 kB, installed size 672 kB
<Lure> Fujitsu: more or less *sync* from here http://www.in.fh-merseburg.de/~jahn/opensync-0.21/edgy.php
<Fujitsu> There we go.
<Fujitsu> So it's a big bump.
<Lure> Fujitsu: yep, old one is more or less useless for most users
<Fujitsu> Is it broken at the moment?
<Fujitsu> Aha.
<Fujitsu> Sounds reasonable.
<siretart> more or less?
<Lure> 0.20 is the first one that had more devices working (release in opensuse 10.2)
<Lure> siretart: most edgy users use these packages
<ajmitch> iirc it was discussed a few days ago
<Lure> ajmitch: yep, Mithrandir asked why we have so old release 
<Fujitsu> Ah.
<Lure> ajmitch: I just jumped on it as I have new mobile phone and kde integration finally works in 0.22
<Fujitsu> If we have Mithrandir questioning it, sounds good.
<Lure> ;-)
* ajmitch wonders how many last minute freeze exceptions we'll get
<siretart> Lure: any reason to not have it in feisty-backports?
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: I can organise several if you want. Got a rewrite or two that some people have requested.
<siretart> ajmitch: I wish we get PPA soon
<Fujitsu> siretart: That shouldn't be long after Feisty is released.
<Lure> siretart: actually that could be fine for people interested
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: sure, go ahead 
* Fujitsu mass-files UVF exceptions using a template.
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: doesn't mean they'll get approved of course
<Lure> siretart: I would not like to issue UVFe before I get some users with other phones - I test onlz kdepim and syncml plugins, but there are many other combinations
<Lure> siretart: before we get at least evolution and some other phone plugin tested by some motu/devel it would be a tough call anyhow
* Fujitsu has an old original Zire for testing, if that works.
<nrg88> why does the adept_updater keep bugging me about "There's a new version of Kubuntu available..." and when i click Version upgrade, it fails all the time?
<siretart> Lure: sounds like a perfect reason to me to focus on other things and hope it gets updated soon after goofy opens
* Fujitsu finds a large number of people to bury the Automatix release story on Digg.
<Lure> siretart: yep, I think this is better approach that late in the schedule
<jussi01> Fujitsu, linky?
<siretart> ok. I'm off to my parents for now. cu later!
<Fujitsu> Bye siretart.
<Fujitsu> jussi01: Front page.
<ajmitch> bye siretart 
<jussi01> Fujitsu, done!
<jussi01> hi motu's can someone tell me what im missing with this error: ./bin_unix/linux_client: error while loading shared libraries: libSDL_image-1.2.so.0: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory
<Fujitsu> libsdl1.2-image
<Fujitsu> I believe.
<Fujitsu> !find libSDL_image-1.2.so.0
<jussi01> thanks
<ubotu> Package/file libsdl_image-1.2.so.0 does not exist in edgy
<minghua> $ dpkg -S /usr/lib/libSDL_image-1.2.so.0
<minghua> libsdl-image1.2: /usr/lib/libSDL_image-1.2.so.0
<minghua> close enough
<jussi01> thanks minghua 
<minghua> no problem
<ajmitch> gar, qa.debian.org still down
<crimsun> is today a bank holiday in the UK?
<ajmitch> quite likely
* elkbuntu cackles at -devel
<ajmitch> hm?
<elkbuntu> <cypher1> mjg59: but will it not then unnecessarily take up memory ?
<elkbuntu> <mjg59> If you need 9K that desperately, you may already have lost
<ajmitch> ah yes
<elkbuntu> sorry cypher1, but that is funny
* ajmitch is just trying to do some disk cleanup
<ajmitch> pbuilder apt cache had 11K packages in it
<cypher1> elkbuntu: how ?
<elkbuntu> ajmitch, a wee bit sluggish?
<cypher1> elkbuntu: :)
<ajmitch> elkbuntu: slightly
<elkbuntu> cypher1, you argued with mjg59 for a start
<ajmitch> especially as pbuilder copies the apt cache in for every package build
<elkbuntu> s/argued/argued a point/
<cypher1> elkbuntu: no to me it looks a bug
* ajmitch has has fast disks, but 5.3GB takes awhile
<cypher1> elkbuntu: it is not about 9K or more or less
<ajmitch> though /var/lib/vmware was taking about 57GB, due to having a number of VMs
<elkbuntu> cypher1, you need to choose your arguments better ;)
<cypher1> elkbuntu: its mentioned in /etc/modprobe.d/blacklist-framebuffer, but it still gets loaded..
<cypher1> elkbuntu: do you mean my words ? ;)
<elkbuntu> cypher1, the basis of the point you are trying to make. you're trying to determine the genuine need for it to be loaded right?
<cypher1> elkbuntu: yes!
<elkbuntu> argue it on the basis it might interfere with stuff (really no idea if it could, just an example) but dont argue it on the basis it takes up a teensy bit of ram
<elkbuntu> which is what i mean by choose your arguments better :
<tepsipakki> sigh, I really miss the feature from Tru64-UNIX AdvFS where you can set a fs-quota for a given fileset..
<elkbuntu> find a technical reason, not an (almost) philisophical reason
<cypher1> elkbuntu: ok!
<cypher1> elkbuntu: thanks
<elkbuntu> mjg59 is not an easy arguing opponant ;)
<cypher1> elkbuntu: yes now i have understood ;)
<elkbuntu> good luck :)
<ajmitch> hey tepsipakki 
<tepsipakki> hey ajmitch!
<tepsipakki> ajmitch: you don't have a holiday today?
<tepsipakki> in NZ
<ajmitch> yeah I do
<TheMuso> Heya ajmitch.
<tepsipakki> cool, same here
<ajmitch> almost ended though
* ajmitch has to work in the morning
<chaks> ajmitch, users are telling the synaptic problem which i have is general one :)
<chaks> in #ubuntu
<chaks> i think its a bug ???
<ajmitch> yeah, could be
<ajmitch> if you're referring to the proxy issue
<ajmitch> bug 86769
<ubotu> Malone bug 86769 in synaptic "Synaptic proxy authentication does not work" [Medium,Fix committed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/86769
<ajmitch> not sure if that made it into feisty or not - the changelog doesn't mention it
<chaks> ajmitch, sudo synaptic from terminal works
<chaks> but from menu, invoking synaptic does not!
<chaks> ???
<ajmitch> yeah, apparantly gksu is stripping out the proxy variables
<elkbuntu> that's clever
<chaks> yea
<chaks> i changed to sudo synaptic in menu
<chaks> its working now
<chaks> file a bug ? writing in the forums now
<chaks> many have this problem
<ajmitch> only for as long as your password is cached, I'd say
<TheMuso> c
<TheMuso> gah
<chaks> yet i dint think its solved
<TheMuso> not agai
<TheMuso> again
<pwuertz> hi... I built a deb package for my application... but I dont know how to add it to the gnome panel
<pwuertz> I already placed a .desktop file in /usr/share/applications
<Hobbsee> where's that maintainer mangler script, again?
<Adri2000> pwuertz: paste your .desktop file somewhere please
<Adri2000> !paste
<ubotu> pastebin is a service to post large texts so you don't flood the channel. The Ubuntu pastebin is at http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org (make sure you give us the URL for your paste - see also the #ubuntu channel topic)
<pwuertz> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/14701/
<Adri2000> pwuertz: you need Categories
<pwuertz> ok... will add some
<Adri2000> you can grep Categories /usr/share/applications/* to see what to put in it
<pwuertz> is it safe to remove the menu file, since it does not do anything? or do I need both?
<Adri2000> you can remove it
<geser> Hobbsee: now also at https://code.launchpad.net/~motu/motutools/trunk
<Hobbsee> nice
<pwuertz> Adri2000: yey... worked!
<pwuertz> thanks :)
<Adri2000> :)
<pwuertz> some other thing... is a package supposed to "killall nautilus" after installing? doesnt sound nice to me...
<pwuertz> but nautilus wont recognize new thumbnailers without restarting
* ajmitch sleeps
<imbrandon> gnight ajmitch 
* jdong gives an uneasy grin about an e-mail he received
<Hobbsee> night ajmitch 
* ajmitch wishes the weekend was a couple of days longer
<ajmitch> oh well
<jdong> One of the KTorrent devs said he was planning a new KTorrent release and was wondering when would be the latest that he could get it into Feisty....
<jdong> (!)
* ajmitch is required to work in the morning, so can't stay up & bug you all
<ajmitch> jdong: hah
<jdong> :)
<Hobbsee> jdong: hah
<Hobbsee> uh.... negative figures...
<jdong> large negative figures :)
<marcin_ant> hi all
<marcin_ant> could someone explain me if dbconfig-common can _create_ database during installation procedure?
<bddebian> Heya gang
<Lutin> hi bddebian 
<bddebian> Hi Lutin
<fernando> hi all
<Hobbsee> hi fernando 
<fernando> my ubuntu mirror have already with 172G and continuing (only x86 and amd64). Somebody know the size?
<Hobbsee> binary and source?
<fernando> only binary, without source
<Hobbsee> something big.
<fernando> heheheh
<StevenK> fernando: My i386 and amd64 mirror for Edgy and Feisty is nowhere near that.
<Fujitsu> Isn't it 13GB per architecture per release or so?
<StevenK> It's 44Gb
<Fujitsu> fernando: How are you mirroring it?
<fernando> Fujitsu: rsync
<Fujitsu> How're you grabbing just the two archs?
<StevenK> Lots of --exclude, I'm guessing
<fernando> --exclude
<Fujitsu> Looks like they're not working.
<StevenK> I'd suggest debmirror, but it well, sucks.
* fernando checking for problems
<Fujitsu> StevenK: It's not that bad...
<fernando> hummmm
<StevenK> Fujitsu: Read the source and then disagree
<fernando> nested mirror, it's not cool
<Fujitsu> Oh, I've looked at the source.
<Fujitsu> It works.
<StevenK> Fujitsu: Try and mirror edgy{,-{security,updates}} with sections main,restricted,universe,multiverse,main/debian-installer,restricted/debian-installer
<Hobbsee> why edgy?
<Fujitsu> I've not done the installer bits, but the others I do.
<fernando> StevenK: use you rsync for mirror? debmirror? apt-proxy ? ...
<StevenK> Hobbsee: Because Fiesty doesn't have -security or -updates at this point, and I'm trying to show my point.
<Hobbsee> ahhh'
<StevenK> fernando: debmirror
<StevenK> fernando: Add restricted/debian-installer and watch.
<StevenK> Um, Fujitsu: ^
<Fujitsu> StevenK: What does it do?
<StevenK> Blow up
<StevenK> It can't cope with the fact that restricted/debian-installer doesn't exist for edgy-updates
<Fujitsu> Ah.
<fernando> StevenK: i have mirrored restricted without problem
<StevenK> restricted != restricted/debian-installer
<Fujitsu> It'd be nice to be able to specify a matrix of sections and suites... I saw a mention of that somewhere.
<StevenK> They are two different sections.
<StevenK> Fujitsu: Exactly.
<Fujitsu> Debian bug #387686
<ubotu> Debian bug 387686 in debmirror "debmirror: patch to allow fine grained mirroring" [Normal,Open]  http://bugs.debian.org/387686
<fernando> I'm not fetching installer
<StevenK> Ohhhh
* Fujitsu decides to close the window, as the temperature is quickly dropping here.
<Fujitsu> StevenK: Hm?
<StevenK> I hadn't seen that bug
<Fujitsu> Ah.
<crimsun> yay, ftpd is back on upload.uc
<Hobbsee> :)
* crimsun starts punting RC bugfixes
<Hobbsee> hehe, yay!
<crimsun> Adri2000: UNLOCK doodle, uploaded
<Adri2000> :)
<Fujitsu> Nice long lock.
<StevenK> Fujitsu: ftpd on upload.u.c went walkabout
<Fujitsu> StevenK: Noted, I reported it in #launchpad an hour ago.
<StevenK> Ahh
<crimsun> (and I poked in #canonical-sysadmin 9 hours ago ;-)
<imbrandon> i watched crimsun poke in #c-s 9 hours ago
<imbrandon> :)
<Fujitsu> And I saw crimsun notify the channel that he poked the sysadmins.
<Fujitsu> I love the world exploding over Easter.
<Fujitsu> Especially just before release.
<imbrandon> Fujitsu, or just after, depending on the release
<Fujitsu> How's it particularly bad if it's just after the release?
<StevenK> Depending on the service, people can't download, for example?
<Fujitsu> I guess, but there are mirrors for that.
<crimsun> I'm guessing the problem would be that most people don't have mirror hierarchy memorised
<Fujitsu> How's that a problem?
<crimsun> well, if httpd collapses, people might know that SE, for example, has a mirror, but they might not remember the actual URL
<crimsun> s/a mirror/several mirrors/
<Fujitsu> There are numerous non-Canonical mirrors, which are linked to from LP, the release announcement, and ubuntu.com.
<crimsun> you're presuming people read instead of clicking /. links
<crimsun> ;-)
<Hobbsee> hehe
<Fujitsu> This is true.
<Fujitsu> Poor getautomatix.com.
<Fujitsu> Yay, it's still down.
<Hobbsee> hehe
<Hobbsee> keeep it down.  permanently
<ivoks> :D
<Fujitsu> Just need to keep Digging it. The site was gone very quickly after it made the front page.
<ivoks> this reminds me on days we had unsupported backports :D
<Fujitsu> Night everyone.
<crimsun> 'night
<bddebian> Gnight Fujitsu
<Fujitsu> Night crimsun, bddebian, Hobbsee.
<zul> hey
<Hobbsee> hi zul!
<zul> whats up Hobbsee?
<Hobbsee> zul: not much.  thinking about bed soonish
<zul> Hobbsee: cool Im just procastinating at work
<Hobbsee> hehe
<marcin_ant> guys I want to create set of packages let's call them: something-common, something-a, something-b
<Hobbsee> work's a great place for irc
<bddebian> heh, no shix Hobbsee :-)
<Hobbsee> :P
<marcin_ant> and something-a and *-b depends on something-common, this is webapp based on mysql
<marcin_ant> where should I put scripts that install and prepare database?
<marcin_ant> ehh am I on ignore list or something....
<ScottK> marcin_ant: Everyone here is a volunteer.  There are no paid devs in Universe, so just assume everyone is busy and don't take it personally.
<marcin_ant> ScottK: np
<geser> marcin_ant: does something-a and something-b both need the same database? if yes then do it in something-common
<marcin_ant> geser: yes they does need but I just thought that *-common packages should be pretty simple, that these packages should just install basic files
<geser> there is no such requirement, you can put there all the parts of your package set that are common
<geser> in most cases that are only files
<geser> but you can also setup a database which is needed by the other packages from your set
<ScottK> Bug #104817 is ready for UUS review if anyone is available...
<ubotu> Malone bug 104817 in pop-before-smtp "Feisty pop-before-smtp depends on Exim, not Postfix" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/104817
<crimsun> got it. LOCK 104817.
<crimsun> minor changelog clarifications applied.
<crimsun>   pop-before-smtp_1.41-1ubuntu1_source.changes: done.
<crimsun> Successfully uploaded packages.
<crimsun> UNLOCK 104817
<ScottK> crimsun: Thanks.  I'll keep an eye on it.
<ScottK> crimsun: I see the clarification you added.  Makes sense.  I'll remember that for next time (I hope)...
<crimsun> (also cbds -> cdbs)
<ScottK> Ah.  Urgh.  I actually double checked that one.  I can't type dpkg in the right order either about 80% of the time.
<crimsun> that's ok, I misspell more often than I spell correctly by far
<crimsun> thank goodness for shell history :-)
<jdong> crimsun: reminds me of update-manager --help
<jdong> :)
<jdong>   --dist-upgrade, --dist-ugprade
<jdong>                         Try to run a dist-upgrade
<crimsun> :)
<jdong> that gave me a quick laugh and then a rush of sympathy when I first saw it :D
<Q-FUNK> in bug 104681 would anybody know what Adept he is refering to?
<ubotu> Malone bug 104681 in upgrade-system "Upgrade system fails in Feisty Beta" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/104681
<geser> isn't adept synaptic for kde?
* ScottK thought it was the other way around?
<geser> synaptic is gnome
<geser> adept is kde
<ScottK> synaptic is adept for gnome.
<geser> :)
<ScottK> ;-)
<jdong> synaptiK?
<jdong> :)
<jdong> will KDE4 have a synaptic abstraction layer that allows for a number of synaptic backends?
<jdong> "Packon"
<jdong> there we do
* jdong gets on wikipedia KDE4.....
<soc> is it just me or are the kde4 packages in feisty unusable in 90%
<soc> ?
<soc> it seems that barely anything wokrs
<soc> compared to the packages from kubuntu.org this looks really bad ..
<Cybermatt> Question I'm look at the changelogs from some source packages and i
<bddebian> ...
<Cybermatt> see lines like
<Cybermatt>  -- sean finney <seanius@debian.org>  Sun, 17 Dec 2006 16:49:35 +0100
<bddebian> And?
<Cybermatt> what is that right after the timestamp
<stgraber> timezone
<Cybermatt> oh
<Cybermatt> thanks
<stgraber> no problem :)
<Cybermatt> i am  new to the whole packageing thing
<Cybermatt> :)
<soc> does someone know why there are such big differences between the feisty kde4 and the kubuntu kde4 packages
<ScottK> Q-FUNK: I changed bug 104681 to the correct package.
<ubotu> Malone bug 104681 in adept "Upgrade system fails in Feisty Beta" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/104681
<ScottK> soc: KDE4 is still under development and they are code snapshots taken at different times.
<bddebian> Cybermatt: Its the offset from UTC
<Cybermatt> so mine would b -0400
<Cybermatt> be*
<bddebian> Cybermatt: Sure :-)
<bddebian> dch -i will do it for you ;-)
<Cybermatt> ok
<Cybermatt> dch -i
<Cybermatt> in the top level source dir
<bddebian> Yes
<bddebian> Though I've heard you can run it from the /debian dir too
<Cybermatt> hmm
<Cybermatt> ok
<Cybermatt> ill get back to looking at stuff
<DarkSun88> Hi all
<Cybermatt> thanks
<Cybermatt> oh gotta go do something irst
<soc> ScottKK: They are both the third kde4 snapshot ...
<LongPointyStick> soc: none of the kde4 packages are terribly stable.
<LongPointyStick> soc: the kubuntu.org ones arent, either.
<LongPointyStick> unless you're thinking of kde 3.5.6
<jussi01> LongPointyStick, are you hobbsee in disguise?
<LongPointyStick> jussi01: yes
<jussi01> lol
<jussi01> LongPointyStick, who have you been poking?
<soc> no, i meant the kde4 packages
<LongPointyStick> jussi01: everyone
<LongPointyStick> soc: there are no stable kde4 packages
<soc> with the kubuntu packages i could start it from gdm7kdm it showed the dektop, everything quite ok
* jussi01 hides
<soc> almost all applications worked
<soc> but with feisty nothing works, except some games
<soc> i don't want stbale packages, i just wonder why there is such a difference
<LongPointyStick> soc: those packages are exactly the same
<soc> mh, weird that there are such big differences ...
<LongPointyStick> wherea re you getting teh kubuntu.org packages from?
<zul> LongPointyStick: dont you sleep?
<soc> kubuntu.org
<soc> http://kubuntu.org/announcements/kde4-3.80.3.php
<soc> deb http://kubuntu.org/packages/kde4-3.80.3/ edgy main
<LongPointyStick> zul: i'm heading there...
* LongPointyStick doubts there's any difference
<soc> mh
<soc> but beside these packaging issues (obviously) the kde4 teams does some great work ...
* soc means team
<LongPointyStick> (apart from dependancies)
<soc> what don't you like about the dependencies?
<LongPointyStick> as in, there's no differences apart from the dependancies
* LongPointyStick --> bed
<LongPointyStick> night all, night zul 
<soc> ah ok
<crimsun> night ms. pointy stick!
<LongPointyStick> :)
* LongPointyStick points crimsun a few times
<crimsun> glee
* soc sees a new kde commit digest
* soc runs ...
<soc> "In three commits, we reduced the number of libraries loaded by kdecore (in my system) from 36 to 18."
<soc> (10 of which are directly needed; 6 are indirect dependencies)
<LaserJock> good morning MOTU Land!
<keescook> mornin LaserJock 
<geser> Hi LaserJock
<Q-FUNK> how would I configure gnome NOT to start sound juicer whenever a CD is inserted?  I'd rather have it start gnome-cd, instead.
<Q-FUNK> ScottK: thanks!
<ScottK> NP
<geser> Q-FUNK: System -> Preferences -> Removable Drives and Media -> Multimedia
<Q-FUNK> oh
<Q-FUNK> DOH!
<Q-FUNK> silly me!
<Q-FUNK> geser: thanks!
<bigon> Hi,
<bigon> could someone have a look at http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=4807
<DktrKranz> bigon, I think nobody will take a look at REVU until feisty + 1
<DktrKranz> anyway, you won't have to wait too long
<ScottK> At the very least you would need a UVF exception approved and the chances of getting it are not good at this point.
<bigon> this upload only fix a crasher
<bigon> the patch is taken from upstream cvs
<Joe_CoT> i get a " secret key not available" message when i run debuilder.
<LaserJock> bigon: generally for fixes we attach a debdiff to the bug report
<DktrKranz> bigon, is it documented in Launchpad?
<Joe_CoT> any idea why / how to fix?
<DktrKranz> Joe_CoT, try with -uc -us params
<Joe_CoT> what's that do, not sign it?
<LaserJock> Joe_CoT: do you need to sign it? if not do as DktrKranz just said
<Joe_CoT> ok, thanks
<ScottK> Joe_CoT: Do you have a gnupg key that uses the address you used in debian/changelog?  If you need to sign it, you need that.
<Joe_CoT> i'm just building a pkg for myself to get the hang of it. i'll worry about signing later
<DktrKranz> you'll eventually use -kyouremail@domain.com flag
<Joe_CoT> okay, cool
<DktrKranz> but if you don't need to sign it, forget about it :)
<Joe_CoT> can you tell me how cowdancer works? The man suggests that the command "cowdancer" should wrap pbuilder, but the command's not found after i install it
<ScottK> I need some python packaging advice.  Bug #80287 looks like a Python path problem.  The system random module is getting picked up instead of the one provided by the package.  It is packaged using python-support, but installs in /usr/share/games, not /usr/share/pysupport.  Any suggestions on a simple way to proceed?
<ubotu> Malone bug 80287 in pysol "Doesn't start in feisty" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/80287
<Lutin> ScottK: can't reproduce the bug here
<ajmitch> morning
* ajmitch should update this etch box to the latest, final release :)
<ScottK> Lutin: It started for you?
<Lutin> ScottK: yep
<ScottK> Hmmm.
<Lutin> 'morning ajmitch 
<ScottK> Lutin: As you can see there are a bunch of dupes on it and I replicated it no problem.  Is there anything non-standard about your Python installation?
<Lutin> ScottK: nothing I can think of
<psusi> can anyone suggest how I could begin to debug why xtightvncserver lost its ability to render non true type fonts in edgy?
<ScottK> Lutin: I can replicate this problem at will.  I just purged pysol and re-installed and had it again.
<Lutin> ScottK: heh, weird. I just tried a purge and it keeps working
<ScottK> Arghh.  
<psusi> is there an environment variable or something you can set to get verbose debug output from X library calls?
<micahcowan> psusi, what about ltrace?
<Lutin> ScottK: and actually I can't understand why it even happens :/
<psusi> ltrace?  hrm... I'll look that up
<ScottK> OK.  Well when it happens the import statement in actions.py is trying to import from the system Python random module, but /src/random.py.  I've figured that much out, but not sure why it would be.
<PhinnFort> this is not a package request
<PhinnFort> just a notification for whoever is packaging dolphin;):
<PhinnFort> http://marrat.homelinux.org
<ScottK> Lutin: I've confirmed that if I rename the pysol provided random to a non-colliding name, the imports work.  Is there a simple way to make sure that the local directory gets looked at first in pythonpath when using python-support?
<psusi> wasn't there a switch to tell X applications to force the calls to be synchronous so you can debug easier?
<Lutin> ScottK: there is a simple that is implemented - /usr/share/games/pysol/pysol.py adds /usr/share/games/pysol/ as the first element of sys.path, thus this directory should be looked at first
<Lutin> this is why I can't understand what happens, because here it just behaves as expected
<ScottK> So I added a one liner print sys.path to see if it was being modified and pysol started.  Weird.
<psusi> damn... ltraceing libX11 makes it segv
<Lutin> ScottK: you renamed the file to random.py ?
<ScottK> No
<ScottK> What I was exploring was brute forcing the problem by changing the pysol provided random.py to pysol_randmo.py and then changing the imports.
<ScottK> I'd changed several of them when I saw your last response, so I added print sys.path to the one I was working on at the time and then instead of printing sys.path, pysol actually started.
<ScottK> I purged and tried again added the print sys.path to actions.py (which is where the first import is) and then I got the same crash after printing sys.path.
<ScottK> I can now confirm that sys.path includes /usr/share/games/pysol ahead of the system Python libraries as you had expected.
<ScottK> This, of course, makes it completely weird that the error is happening.
<Lutin> indeed
<ScottK> I have variously tried to run it with both Python 2.4 and 2.5 with identical results.
<CyberMatt> Question If i wanted to make a package that just places some docs in /usr/share/doc how would i go about that
<Lutin> ScottK: if you try sys.path.insert(0, '/usr/share/games/pysol') and then from random import constructRandom, does it fail as well ?
<Lutin> (from a python console)
* ScottK tries
<ScottK> Yes it does fail.
<Lutin> wow. *that* is definitely weird
<micahcowan> CyberMatt, you'd probably just need a source package with a debian/rules file whose binary-indep target installs those files into /usr/share/doc (and other required targets present-but-empty).
<geser> using dh_installdocs should be easier than installing them by hand
<ScottK> Lutin: But if I then print sys.path, /usr/share/games/pysol is the first dir listed as expected.
<Lutin> ScottK: :/
<Lutin> still works here (c)
* ScottK will file a Python bug and hack around it then.
<Lutin> you need someone with more knowledge in python than me, that's something I can't understand :x
<CyberMatt> i made an audio version of the ubuntu packaging guide using festival and i wanna package it bunch of mp3s
<sacater> CyberMatt: good on you!
<sacater> sorry
<sacater> remove the ?
<CyberMatt> so if 
#ubuntu-motu 2007-04-10
<ScottK> Bug #80287 has a fix ready for upload if anyone from UUS is there.  It's a hack, but it works and time is short...
<ubotu> Malone bug 80287 in pysol "Doesn't start in feisty" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/80287
<ScottK> And I did do the good citizenship bit and file a bug against Python.  See Bug #104971 for details.
<ubotu> Malone bug 104971 in python-defaults "Python path appears to be not fully searched - intermittent" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/104971
<crimsun> LOCK 80287
<shawarma> ?
<ajmitch> shawarma: crimsun is marking out his territory on bugs
<shawarma> ajmitch: Eh... ok..
* ScottK thinks it's a good idea.
<crimsun> uploaded, UNLOCK 80287
<ScottK> crimsun: Thanks.  The update for bug #104817 that you uploaded earlier today still hasn't shown up.  Is that normal for the current state of the queue?
<ubotu> Malone bug 104817 in pop-before-smtp "Feisty pop-before-smtp depends on Exim, not Postfix" [Wishlist,Fix committed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/104817
<crimsun> ScottK: I haven't received an ACCEPT for it yet. Everything (the archive) is in manual mode.
<ScottK> crimsun: Thanks.  I won't panic then.
<crimsun> I think it's a bank holiday in many EU countries, so most of the work done today is likely off the clock.
<ScottK> Thanks.  Didn't know that.
<shawarma> It's not in the US?
<ajmitch> shawarma: I don't think any archive admins are in the US
<shawarma> ajmitch: True, but isn't today a bank holiday outside Europe?
<shawarma> ajmitch: Where today is yesterday in your world.
<shawarma> ajmitch: Monday.
<ajmitch> fairly likely, but that depends on the country
<ajmitch> it is in NZ
<shawarma> ajmitch: Indeed. That's why I specifically asked about the US. :-)
<ScottK> Easter Monday is not a holiday in the US.  Our kids have it off from school, but not us adults.
<shawarma> ScottK: Hm.. Interesting.
<jdong> ScottK: we didn't get any days off for easter
<ajmitch> not even friday?
<jdong> ScottK: because we are being forced to work our butts off :)
<jdong> nope.
<jdong> not a day.
<ajmitch> suck
* ajmitch got good friday & easter monday off
* ScottK is a consultant, so the whole concept of days off is pretty meaningless.  It's about hours billed or not no matter the day.
* ajmitch is a mere coding peon
<joejaxx> how much space is required to be an archive mirror?
<ajmitch> "plenty"
<ajmitch> I can't say how much for a full archive
<shawarma> If you have to ask, you don't have enough. :-D
<shawarma> Not entirely true, but close.
* ajmitch probably has enough space, but not enough bandwidth
<dcsmith> I have a question about evolution plugins?
<dcsmith> I found an extra one redhat ships
<dcsmith> patched it so it will compile, and would like to get it in universe?
<micahcowan> If I have submitted a patch for a bug, should I tag that bug with something? (I'm not expecting to get it in for feisty)
<welshbyte> micahcowan: no you just need to subscribe the appropriate sponsor group e.g. ubuntu-universe-sponsors
<ajmitch> dcsmith: probably a good idea to look at both the packaging guide, and other evolution plugins to see how they're built
<micahcowan> welshbyte, thanks. :)
<dcsmith> ajmitch: well there's a evolution-plugins-experimental, but I can't find the maintainer on launchpad, Ideally shouldn't it go in there?
<jdong> bug 45930
<ubotu> Malone bug 45930 in joystick "jstest SEGFAULTs with usb joystick" [Medium,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/45930
<jdong> are non-critical bugs not candidate for SRU?
<jdong> moreover... "However, the version that has been released for edgy work as-is on Dapper; simply downloading that package and installing it via "dpkg -i <package.deb>" should work fine. I'd recommend suggesting that to any who would like the fix on their Dapper systems."
<jdong> is that really advice we should be giving users? ;-)
<bddebian> Heya
<Jucato> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Heya Jucato
* Jucato is 9 minutes late :P
<bddebian> heh
<jdong> Jucato: that's better than Debian
<jdong> hehe joking :)
<bddebian> doh, ouch
<jdong> ha I meant it amicably, I do love Debian and have nothing against its release cycle :)
<Jucato> 2-3 year release cylce?
<jdong> it's the best they can do given the goals that they have
<jdong> if we tried to erradicate all universe bugs before release....
<ajmitch> Hobbsee!
<Jucato> Hobbsee!!!
<nixternal> Hobbsee!!!!
<joejaxx> Hobbsee: !
<nixternal> haha
<nixternal> you got suckered by irssi
<joejaxx> :)
<nixternal> I almost did as well
<joejaxx> h<tab>! :)
<Hobbsee> ajmitch!
<Hobbsee> Jucato!
<Hobbsee> hey nixternal, joejaxx!
<nixternal> hehe
<joejaxx> :)
<Jucato> hi nixternal
<bddebian> ajmitch!!
<bddebian> nixternal!!
<bddebian> Hobbsee!!
<bddebian> joejaxx!!
<Hobbsee> hey bddebian1
<joejaxx> lol
<joejaxx> that makes us all look like a botnet
<bddebian> heh
<Jucato> or makes bddebian look like a bot :)
<joejaxx> yeah that too :P
<bddebian> Nah not a bot, just a schlub :-(
<nixternal> stop making the popups!!!
<jmg> schlub also shlub (shl.b) pronunciation or zhlub (zhl.b)
<jmg> n. Slang.
<jmg> A person regarded as clumsy, stupid, or unattractive.
<nixternal> that is me!
<Jucato> nixternal: what popups?
<nixternal> grrr
<ajmitch> ah, good to see that there's crack floating around for the development branch of compiz
<bddebian> heh
<jmg> heh
<jmg> ajmitch: url?
<ajmitch> forums, somewhere
<joejaxx> anyone here work with reprepro for local repositories?
<bddebian> I set it up once
<joejaxx> bddebian: do you know if there is a way to have to only keep the newest version of packages?
<bddebian> I thought it always overwrote with the newest? Hmm
<joejaxx> it keepest older ones for me
<joejaxx> which is bad in my case
<bddebian> Hrm
<crimsun> nice, gnome 2.18.1 trickling in
<joejaxx> :)
<ajmitch> must be about release time
<joejaxx> nice
<joejaxx> we hit almost 11k downloads on softpedia
<ajmitch> white: that sucks
<jmg> Lastlog:
<jmg> 15:17 < ajmitch> white: that sucks
<jmg> ?
<ajmitch> he'll understand
<jmg> clearly
<ajmitch> jmg: it was in reply to a mailing list post of his
<jmg> ajmitch: ok
<tonyyarusso> geser: With regards to https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/wordpress/+bug/104944, Dapper has 2.0.2 (not listed as vulnerable), but dapper-backports has 2.1.2 (the one listed by Secunia).  If you do get around to this security update, it would go to -backports, if you hadn't noticed that already.
<ubotu> Malone bug 104944 in wordpress "WordPress Post_ID Parameter SQL Injection Vulnerability" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  
<Joe_CoT> i'm getting a weird error from pbuilder. I added libopenal-dev as a builld-depend, and i keep getting a " Couldn't find package libopenal-dev" error
<tonyyarusso> Mez: You may also be interested in the above ^^
<Ademan> anyone know why kicad isn't packaged?
<micahcowan> !info kicad
<ubotu> Package kicad does not exist in edgy, edgy-backports, edgy-seveas
<micahcowan> Ademan, it's in feisty :)
<Ademan> yay!
<Ademan> 10 more days...
<micahcowan> ubotu, info kicad feisty
<ubotu> kicad: Electronic schematic and PCB design software. In component universe, is optional. Version 0.0.20060829-1 (feisty), package size 2117 kB, installed size 5808 kB
<Ademan> i've had a sudden interest in electronic engineering, and i've been reading up, and i noticed it wasn't in the repos
<Ademan> but very good, happy to hear that
<Flannel> Ademan: there are others currently in it, electric, oregano, qucs, xcircuit, etc
<Ademan> yeah, i had just heard good things about kicad
<imbrandon> moins
<RAOF> mushi mushi!
<Jucato> ano ne?
* RAOF wonders whether or not that's j
<RAOF> Japaneese.  "mushi mushi" is the limit of his :)
<Jucato> it's the traditional response to moshi moshi :)
<RAOF> :)
<micahcowan> 
<joejaxx> hello imbrandon 
<imbrandon> 
* highvoltage too
<dholbach> good morning
<RAOF> Good evening :)
<imbrandon> heya dholbach 
<dholbach> hey RAOF
<StevenK> RAOF: It's still afternoon!
* RAOF calls 5:30pm early evening.
<RAOF> Is there an ISO standard evening transition? :)
<Hobbsee> hi dholbach 
<dholbach> heya Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> :)
<RAOF> Hey Hobbsee :)
<Hobbsee> hi RAOF!
<RAOF> :)
<RAOF> Oh, that reminds me.  What do we have to do to get democracyplayer removed from the archives
<Hobbsee> file a removal request
<Hobbsee> subscribe ubuntu-archive
<RAOF> Well, if no one else wants to touch it, we probably should do that.  It's just broken, and I don't think I can fix it.
<Joe_CoT> still trying to get the hang of this. How does one make the symlink from the binary in /usr/lib to /usr/bin ? is that done in rules, or postinst, or am i just wrong? :)
<StevenK> Why are you installing user binary into /usr/lib?
<Joe_CoT> well, not directly into /usr/lib. I'm packaging the engine for World of Padman. I have it install as /usr/lib/wop/wop-engine
<StevenK> Why?
<superm1> RAOF, i haven't followed this democracy mess thats going on, but why are we still on an older version in feisty right now?  a functional deb of the newer version is available on the democracy website
<RAOF> superm1: Functional in what way?  It (1) fails to install on Feisty, and (2) Segfaults if you try anyway.
<StevenK> Yummy
<superm1> RAOF, ah indeed -  just tried it.  spoke a little too soon :)
<RAOF> I *think* the segfault may be due to trying to load the wrong libgtkembedmoz.so, but I don't really know how to fix that.
<Joe_CoT> StevenK: nvm. I took a look at the way Tremulous does it
<StevenK> RAOF: Which makes it a linking problem
<RAOF> Yeah, it's trying to use mozilla-dev (why do packages refuse to link to versioned .so files?)
<RAOF> Which no longer exists :)
<RAOF> Actually, a quick strace suggests otherwise.  Why is libpython2.5 being loaded?
<RAOF> (democracyplayer is built against python2.4, and has the appropriate shebang)
<RAOF> Oh, that's more interesting.  Why does libboost-python only exist for python2.5 ?
<RAOF> Yo, Amaranth, python god that you are.
<Hobbsee> RAOF: because it's borken.
<RAOF> Ok.  So, in summary.  Democracyplayer will only work correctly on python2.4 (without a whole lot of futzing around)
<RAOF> democracyplayer is dependent on libboost-python, which is only available for python2.5
<Hobbsee> what happens if libboost-python isnt installed?
* RAOF goes to work out how to file a removal request :(
<RAOF> An interesting question.
<Hobbsee> RAOF: file a bug, say if it has any rdpeneds or not, subscribe u-a (and u-u-s, as you're not a MOTU, last i knew)
<RAOF> Yup, still not a MOTU :)
<Hobbsee> :P
<superm1> RAOF, do you know off hand if the newer version (0.9.5) still needs to work against python 2.4?
<superm1> there is the possibility of a uvfe if it works against python 2.5 with minimal source changes
* ajmitch needs food or something
<RAOF> superm1: That's what I've tried now.
<superm1> oh okay
<RAOF> superm1: It doesn't build correctly against python2.5.  Apparently it needs a newer python-pyrex, with an additional patch against that.
<superm1> so a step ahead of me, as i was just starting to attempt to assembled a deb of 0.9.5
<RAOF> superm1: I've already tried, with 0.9.5.3.  Including the "don't use non-public DBUS api patch" :)
<superm1> didn't see that patch?
* superm1 corrects himself.  RAOF is many steps ahead :)
<RAOF> It's on trac.  That's where I got the "needs new pyrex" info.
<superm1> the only rdepend on python-pyrex is penguintv
<superm1> wonder if a uvf for it for the purpose of democracy player functionality would be possible then
<RAOF> I suppose I could *try* that.
<joejaxx> how are arches in ports.ubuntu.com proposed?
<StevenK> RAOF: I'd suggest you talk to Mithrandir about it.
<RAOF> I might just check whether a new pyrex *actually* fixes it, first.
<superm1> StevenK, before even talking to Mithrandir, make sure it actually works :
<superm1> most likely
<superm1> oh ^^ :)
<RAOF> Also, this is much more work than I was planning to spend on a package I don't even use :)
<StevenK> And RAOF beats you again. :-P
<superm1> man i'm just not on my game tonite.  must be 3 in the morning when I should have gone to bed hours ago :)
* RAOF goes and checks pacakges.debian.org for a new pyrex
<RAOF> ...and prunes some more dups of the one true bug while debian is being slow
<\sh> moins
<Hobbsee> hi \sh 
<Hobbsee> RAOF: heh.  i keep doing that
<superm1> you'd think there was some new debian release with how slow their servers were though. hehe
<joejaxx> there is
<joejaxx> we released etch on sunday lol
<superm1> joejaxx, yea i know :)
<joejaxx> :)
<joejaxx> does anyone know why amd64 is in archive.u.c and ports.u.c?
* RAOF gets out and pushes packages.debian.org to see if he can get it to start.
<superm1> RAOF, since packages.debian.org timed out, i looked here: http://packages.qa.debian.org/p/pyrex.html
<ScottK> RAOF: It's slow, but running.
<superm1> looks like 0.9.4.1 is the latest for them
<superm1> which is the same as what we have
<RAOF> Oh, and the bug references 0.9.5 :(
<RAOF> So, who thinks it's a good idea for me to try and build a new upstream-version pyrex package?
<RAOF> Oh, and add what seems to be an obviously incorrect patch to it >:-|
<superm1> worst that could happen is that you lose a few cpu cycles in a pbuilder
<RAOF> Well, and some time :P
<\sh> dear motu-uvf team, please review https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/wine/+bug/105054 and approve..will fix https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/wine/+bug/104964 and hopefully some other bugs
<ubotu> Malone bug 105054 in wine "[UVF Execption Report]  wine 0.9.34-0ubuntu1" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  
<cypher1> is 915resolution package only useful along with X ?
<RAOF> Is anyone in here familiar with python2.5's C extension API?  I'd like to fix this patch up properly.
<joejaxx> great 
* joejaxx just finished reading https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/OpenWeek-Ports
<joejaxx> hello dholbach_ 
<dholbach> hey joejaxx
<joejaxx> :)
<gnomefreak> good morning 
<joejaxx> Good Morning gnomefreak :)
<joejaxx> hmm
<gnomefreak> :)
<joejaxx> do anyone know if there is a list of packages that do not have the ubuntu# modification?
<StevenK> Yes. In the packages file.
<joejaxx> well i was actually talking about a launchpad-like-readable list
<joejaxx> but i guess i can create a little script to do it
<joejaxx> :)
* joejaxx goes to code
<StevenK> steven@liquified:~% zcat m-l/dists/edgy/main/binary-i386/Packages.gz | grep-dctrl -sPackage -FVersion -v 'ubuntu' | wc -l
<StevenK> 2243
<StevenK> A little script? It's one line!
<joejaxx> that only counts lines
<TheMuso> StevenK: What about rebuilds? :p
<joejaxx> that too lol
<joejaxx> that was my main concern
<StevenK> TheMuso: They don't have Ubuntu specific changes
<TheMuso> StevenK: I know that.
<StevenK> joejaxx: So take out the wc -l, duh
<joejaxx> StevenK: :P i know i was only being funny :P
* StevenK waits for joejaxx to say "I can't find the file m-l/dists/edgy/main/binary-i386/Packages.gz, either"
<joejaxx> hahaha
<joejaxx> maybe if i was up a couple more days
<joejaxx> StevenK: the reason i was going to script it is because it is going to be a part of a large script
<StevenK> To do what?
<joejaxx> i need to rebuild all the packages that do not have a ubuntu modification
<joejaxx> well probably just main first
<StevenK> *Why*?
<joejaxx> yeah just main
* joejaxx is going to be working on a secret port after april/may :P
<ajmitch> that's very community-oriented :P
<StevenK> Incredibly.
<StevenK> "I want your help. Oh no, I can't tell you what I'm doing or why you're helping."
<joejaxx> StevenK: haha :P
* StevenK stops helping.
<TheMuso> joejaxx: Dude, if you tell us, maybe some of us might be able to pitch in with hardware.
<TheMuso> To at least help you get going.
<joejaxx> StevenK: oh yes i will be sending out black box computers with everything unbranded 
<joejaxx> StevenK: LOL
<joejaxx> TheMuso: well i did not want to announce it yet as may is not here yet :\
<imbrandon> yaubuntu ?
<joejaxx> yaubuntu?
<imbrandon> yet-another-ubuntu
<imbrandon> :)
<TheMuso> heh
<joejaxx> ah
<joejaxx> no not another distro :P
<imbrandon> like yast, yet another system tool
<joejaxx> s/distro/derivative/g
<StevenK> If it isn't another distro, then why rebuild everything?
* TheMuso ponders how to fix a package that build-depends on itself, but didn't build in the DC because a previous binary version of that package was unavailable, with the problem existing only on one arch.
<lupine_85> new architecture?
<joejaxx> StevenK: i said port not distro :P
<StevenK> TheMuso: It needs to be manually bootstrapped.
<imbrandon> TheMuso, bootstrap ?
<TheMuso> StevenK: Um ok. What does that involve?
<imbrandon> getting an sysadmin to install it on the buildd chroot and make a package manualy to use to build the new one
<imbrandon> chicken and the egg
<TheMuso> But if there is no previous binary available for that arch, i.e no binary package, how could that possibly be done then?
<imbrandon> e.g. compile it manualy from source on the buildd chroot
<TheMuso> Right
<TheMuso> But it needs itself to compile the compiler.
* TheMuso checks to be sure.
<imbrandon> there is a binary SOMEWHERE rigth ?
<TheMuso> imbrandon: Dunno. Going to have a look.
<TheMuso> Nope. No deb for that arch since Warty, but Debian has a deb. SO I guess the admin would have to use that as a base.
<imbrandon> or a binary from upstream
<TheMuso> I guess its not worth worrying about till Feisty+1 though really.
<TheMuso> For that complex a job.
<TheMuso> Is it just me, or were UVF requests not filed for previous merge/syncs that were listed on the universe sponsors mailing list, or am I not understanding part of the UVF procedure correctly?
<geser> have you an example?
<TheMuso> geser: tripwire, transcriber, timidity to name a few.
<geser> that were only new debian revisions not new upstream versions
<TheMuso> Ah ok.
<TheMuso> So that doesn't count as upstream then... Ok.
* TheMuso tries to find where that is documented.
<StevenK> Upstream is just upstream. Debian doesn't count as upstream
<TheMuso> ok
<geser> it's only tricky with native packages (where upstream = Debian)
<TheMuso> Right.
<TheMuso> Just found the docs on the wiki in MOTU. I am wondering whether that should be stated a little more clearly.
<imbrandon> seems pretty clear to me, debian is not one that changes upstream version numbers
<imbrandon> only revisions
<TheMuso> Yeah I know tha.
<TheMuso> that
<imbrandon> :)
<TheMuso> We go into hard freeze for MOTU this week don't we?
<geser> afaik April 12th
<TheMuso> Yeah this Thursday.
* TheMuso has his mind on the move next week, so is not entirely with it. :p
<imbrandon> moving ?
<TheMuso> imbrandon: Moving house, yes.
<imbrandon> cool
<PhinnFort> ok, can someone try to install xfsprogs and run xfs_check?
<PhinnFort> just run it against any filesystem, it should fail to start
<DarkSun88> Hi
<RAOF> Why isn't dh_pycentral providing a {$python:Provides} substitution, like the manpage says it should?
<gpocentek> RAOF: ${python:Provides}, not {$python:Provides}
* RAOF reads more carefully!
<jekil> hello
<RAOF> Ok, so democracyplayer now, as long as I preload a couple of libraries, doesn't segfault.  Huzzah.
<Hobbsee> RAOF: yay!
<RAOF> Oh, did I mention that it doesn't download anything?
<Hobbsee> it did before?
<RAOF> Well, it should.
<RAOF> Otherwise it is totally useless.
<RAOF> But at least it doesn't segfault.
<Hobbsee> ahh
<Hobbsee> that's a start, at least
<RAOF> Yes.  Now, to either (1) work out how other things link to firefox, and why the database module isn't getting linked to libpython or (2) go to bed.
<RAOF> I'm going with (2)
<Hobbsee> hehe
<Hobbsee> did you update it to the latest version?
<RAOF> Yes.
<Hobbsee> right, so it'll need a UVFe
<RAOF> Only once it actually *does* something.
<RAOF> Ooooh, I probably know why the download doesn't work.
<Hobbsee> hehe
<Hobbsee> it's not bedtime yet, anyway
<RAOF> Huzzah.  It even downloads!
<RAOF> Ok, so now I need to (1) learn how to make democracyplayer's database extension module *really* link to libpython, and (2) learn how to make the Mozilla extension module link to libgtkembedmoz.so
<RAOF> Amaranth: Extension modules *should* be linked against libpython, right?
* iceman is away: shopping
<TheMuso> iceman: Please turn off away notifications.
<Hobbsee> !away 
<Hobbsee> !away | iceman 
<ubotu> Please don't use public away messages or change your nick to 'someone|away'.  We know you're away when you don't respond to messages. Also see !guidelines
<ubotu> iceman: please see above
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: Heh that is more eloquent.
<Hobbsee> :)
<iceman> I'm sorry, I just typed "/away msg" and xchat-gnome did this...
<iceman> can you prevent x-g to say I'm away on every channel?
<RAOF> Ok.  How do other programs link to gtkembedmoz?
<RAOF> Anyway, now it's *definitely* bed time.
* RAOF wonders why he's spending so much time fixing something he's not going to use :)
<RAOF> Night, all!
<AnAnt> Hello, there is a package I made (acon) which is used to display arabic on linux virtual console. That package used to work in Edgy, now it doesn't work correctly in Feisty, that is some key combinations give wrong results.
<AnAnt> can anyone help ?
<ScottK> AnAnt: It is two days before the final Feisty freeze for Universe packages.  I suggest you file a bug with all of the specifics and then ask here again.  See https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/acon/+filebug
<Hobbsee> ScottK: AnAnt or fix it yourself, as you uploaded it...
<AnAnt> Hobbsee: I tried
<Hobbsee> or give us enoough info to help...
* ScottK has enough trouble with English.  No chance of fixing something involving other alphabets.
<AnAnt> Hobbsee: well, CTRL+ALT+O used to show up a menu, now it doesn't do so
<Hobbsee> AnAnt: did the package get upgraded in feisty?
<AnAnt> Hobbsee: no, it is the same upstream
<sacater> on launchpad karma, what does 'support tracker' count as
<sacater> Q+A?
<geser> answers.launchpad.net
<sacater> i gained 1217 over night
<sacater> https://launchpad.net/~sacater/+karma
<sacater> when does answers get cashed up?
<stalker> guys, i am trying to compile my program with iconv, and ubuntu ave strange iconv package
<TheMuso> stalker: Ok whats so strange about it?
<stalker> actually, it don't define iconvctl() function in /usr/include/iconv.h
<TheMuso> Have you used apt-cache search to search for any packages relating to iconv?
<stalker> and several other #defines
<stalker> yrs, but nothing
<stalker> yes*
<TheMuso> stalker: Ok so let me get this straight. You have the header files sorted etc, yet particular defines are not present
<stalker> yes
<TheMuso> ah ok
<TheMuso> Have you checked whether the Debian package has what you need?
<TheMuso> Oh and what version of Ubuntu are you running
<stalker> 6.10, and...i'm new with debian/ubuntu, used slackware for ages
<stalker> so i kind of don;'t know for those...debian packages how to get
<TheMuso> Ok. For a start, you could use packages.debian.org to find the package you want, and download it. Then you could manually unpack it and check.
<TheMuso> There is also a chance that the package in Feisty may have what you need.
<stalker> i'll search right away
<bddebian> Heya gang
<stalker> and where i can look at feisty package for iconv?
<TheMuso> stalker: packages.ubuntu.com may have what you need, but it tends to be out of date.
<Lutin> h bddebian 
<Lutin> hi*
<ScottK> Good morning bddebian
<bddebian> Hi Lutin
<bddebian> Heya ScottK
<geser> Hi bddebian
<bddebian> Heya geser
<stalker> i even can't find package that ships /usr/include/iconv.h
<bddebian> dpkg -S ?
<stalker> it isn't iconv,libiconv...
<TheMuso> stalker: Is there a libiconv-dev package of some sort?
<TheMuso> I would think there is.
<AstralJava> I would have to recommend using dlocate.
<TheMuso> There is also apt-file.
<stalker> nope, nothing that has iconv in its name...
<jdong> libc6-dev: usr/include/iconv.h
<stalker> ooooh, libc-dev package
<AstralJava> jaska@ardbeg:~$ dlocate iconv.h
<AstralJava> libc6-dev: /usr/include/iconv.h
<AstralJava> Oh, sorry.
<jdong> jinx
<jdong> now you owe me a beer.
<bddebian> heh
<jdong> lol
<jdong> I think those were the rules when I played it last time...
<jdong> which was like 12 or 13 or something
<poningru> mmmm beer
<stalker> so, libc6-dev is not something to be changed easily
<AstralJava> You played of beer when you were an early teenager? ;)
<DarkMageZ> you have to say it @ the same time. so it does not apply
<stalker> nvm...i'll just install iconv from source with --prefix=/usr
<jdong> DarkMageZ: close enough :)
<jdong> AstralJava: yes yes, then it turn into playing for cocaine, and that other leafy thingie.....
<AstralJava> Tea?
<jdong> no, lettuce.
<AstralJava> Oh, sorry. :)
<AstralJava> I haven't played that game. :)
<jdong> only it didn't taste like lettuce at all...
<jdong> but they told me it was lettuce.
<\sh> dholbach: what do you mean with retraced apports? you mean the retrace service which is attached to the actual apport bug reports? 
<dholbach> yes
<AstralJava> Hi dholbach! 
<dholbach> hi AstralJava
<AstralJava> US artwork in place. :) How're you doing?
* Starting logfile irclogs/ubuntu-motu.log
* Starting logfile irclogs/ubuntu-motu.log
(crimsun/#ubuntu-motu) at this stage, I'd much rather just have the broken software be gone, complaints be damned
(ScottK/#ubuntu-motu) There's always the option to make a new update that "accidentally" FTBFS and then fix it later.
(Hobbsee/#ubuntu-motu) crimsun: +1 to me
<Hobbsee> s/to/from/
<ScottK> If no one is committed to do the work to fix it, then I'd say pull it too.
<geser> what about democracyplayer? should it be dropped too?
<imbrandon> geser, someone almost has that fixed iirc
* Hobbsee is of the opinion to drop any known, non-working software
<Hobbsee> (that isnt being fixed)
<geser> the current package is non-working (the dbus bug has currently collected over 60 dupes)
<Hobbsee> geser: raof's done a lot of work on it, and it's almost usable
<Hobbsee> which, hopefully, we'll be able to upload
<geser> ah, didn't know
<crimsun> geser: sadly, IMO, yes. Consider ROAF's opinion, too.
<Hobbsee> as it's clearly going to be better than the current lot
<geser> Hobbsee: do you know if he got passed the segfaults?
<imbrandon> yes'
<Hobbsee> geser: yeah, he did
<imbrandon> nap time, back in 2 or 3 hours
<crimsun> ah, Adri2000 uploaded doodle about 14 hours after I did
<crimsun> that explains why my upload was rejected (well, not really, but whatever)
<crimsun> dholbach: if you don't have any glaring objections to the complete removal of deluge-torrent, I'll file a bug
<dholbach> crimsun: no, not at all
<crimsun> ok, thanks.
<Hobbsee> crimsun: and close the rest :P
<Hobbsee> crimsun: you want me to close all the other democracyplayer bugs, or will you do that?
<Hobbsee> (seeing as they're all fixed in feisty)
<poningru> multiple bugs in bip
<Hobbsee> poningru: ?
<\sh> dholbach: using apport-retrace and installing libgcc1-dbgsym throws some errors :(
<crimsun> Hobbsee: please, if you have the time, feel free. I'm resource-starved ATM.
<poningru> Hobbsee: reporting bugs on bip right now
<Hobbsee> crimsun: great, OK
<poningru> in feisty
<dholbach> \sh: tag the bug as  needs-<arch>-retrace
<dholbach> \sh: it will get auto-retraced
<dholbach> \sh: read the mail on u-devel@ or u-devel-announce@
<\sh> dholbach: no the retrace is there, without any debug syms sadly...but I think some dbgsym packages are not ok...I'll ask pitti about it
<dholbach> ok
<Hobbsee> all...gone....
<_MMA_> Hey guys. Is there a Ubuntu-games team?
<bddebian> There is but it's pretty dead in favor of the debian games team afaik
<_MMA_> Ahh...
<_MMA_> Ill have to look into that then.
<_MMA_> thanx
<_MMA_> bddebian: Is every new package Debian gets automatically synced to Ubuntu? ie: If I get a game in Debian would I have to request that it be synced for Ubuntu?
<Hobbsee> _MMA_: you dont need to, as long as the autosyncer is on
<_MMA_> Ok.
* iceman is back (gone 03:09:46)
<iceman> grr, sorry about that
<iceman> xchat-gnome doesn't seem to understand I don't want away messages :-s
<Hobbsee> it's not activated by default...i hope
<cassidy> iceman: you should relaunch it after the modification of xchat.conf
<iceman> cassidy: yeah, messy way to do it, by the way, directly into the .conf file
<iceman> there should be a way inside the UI
<cassidy> iceman: humm, IMHO this option is evil and shouldn't exist
<iceman> then get rid of it ! But meanwhile it should be easy to de-activate it
<iceman> Each time I go away people yell at me !
<Adri2000> crimsun: sorry, I misunderstood your LOCK, I thought doodle merge was locked on me :p, so I did it and uploaded it
<xtknight> ScottK, so you know where /etc/defaults/bip is written?
<ScottK> Have a look at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CreatePackageFromSourcePackage for a start
<ScottK> Get the source package and then look in the debian dir for bip.default
<xtknight> -rw-r--r-- 1 andy andy   10 2007-04-10 11:44 bip.default
<xtknight> there we go
<xtknight> will apt-get -b do it, actually?
<ScottK> So the way we (who are not MOTU) fix bugs is make then change, build a new package, make a debdiff, attach it to the bug and then subscribe ubuntu-universe-sponsors to the bug
<xtknight> is it a problem that remove/purge do not wipe /var/run/bip and /var/log/bip ?
<xtknight> or should log files be retained
<ScottK> Log files should be retained and /var/run gets cleaned every reboot.
* ScottK doesn't think it's a problme
<ScottK> problem
<xtknight> ScottK, and what about "sudo bip" not working from the start?
<xtknight> even tho init.d will with ENABLED=1
<ScottK> That's a trickier one.
<ScottK> I think if you change the init file to use -f /etc/bip.conf it'll be fine.  Try that
<xtknight> my guess is, leave it be.  config file can be specified with bip -f
<xtknight> init file already does use /etc actually
<xtknight> nothing needs to be changed in 'init.d/bip' as it stands
<xtknight> with ENABLED=1 change:  sudo /etc/init.d/bip start
<xtknight>  * Starting bip 
<xtknight> ps ax | grep bip:  3117 ?        Ss     0:00 /usr/bin/bip -f /etc/bip.conf -s /var/lib/bip
<ScottK> Then I'd suggest making a new package and attaching the debdiff to the bug after you've tested it.
<xtknight> k i'll need some help with that one
<ScottK> Have a look at the wiki page I pointed you to above and let me know when you have questions.
<xtknight> k
<xtknight> ScottK, alright.  i have made a deb file containing the 'default' fix and a note in the changelog documenting it.  now what ?
<xtknight> it has only been compiled for i386 so far
<ScottK> Install it and see if it works
<xtknight> yup
<xtknight> does
<ScottK> Do you have a config file in ~/.bip?
<xtknight> nope ~/.bip does not exist
<ScottK> Next step is make a debdiff.
<xtknight> ahh any official docs on that?
<ScottK> if you look in the top level directory of the source package you'll find bip_someversion.dsc and bip_somversion-ubuntu1.dsc.
<xtknight> yea
<ScottK> do debdiff bip_someversion.dsc and bip_somversion-ubuntu1.dsc > filename for the patch
<ScottK> Then why don't you pastebin that and I'll see if it looks correct.
<ScottK> !pastebin
<ubotu> pastebin is a service to post large texts so you don't flood the channel. The Ubuntu pastebin is at http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org (make sure you give us the URL for your paste - see also the #ubuntu channel topic)
<xtknight> ScottK, http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/14902/
<ScottK> Looks pretty good.  You also want to add (Closes LP: #105199) to the changelog entry.  Also don't go over 80 chars in a line.
<xtknight> k
<ScottK> Now the tricky part with this bug is that we also want the security fix in the -4 version in Debian (which is why Hobbsee requested a sync).
<ScottK> If this change gets committed to -3, then the sync will fail.
<ScottK> So I think the best move (anyone out there watching feel free to correct me on this) would be for you to look at the Debian changes in -4 and add them to your fix (noting that you've done that in the changelog).
<xtknight> ScottK, what abuot that duplicate bug that he also created?
<ScottK> I already duped that to this bug.
<xtknight> k
<ScottK> xtknight: You up for getting the Debian fix in there too (It'll be a small change to the debian/rules or postinst I'm sure).
* ScottK goes to get more coffee.
<xtknight> lol ya let me make some more coffee also
<xtknight> then we'll see
<xtknight> i made the new debdiff
<xtknight> need to know what to do with this one 
<ScottK> pastebin that one too
<xtknight> ok
<xtknight> ScottK, http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/14906/
<superm1> imbrandon, are you awake?
<bddebian> Ahh, the UVFe sync requests are finally coming in!
<ScottK> xtknight: Have a look at http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/14908/.  I slightly edited you.  Looks good.  Now go get the Debian fix...
<xtknight> ScottK, looks good to me
<xtknight> where do we post this debdiff?  launchpad?
<ScottK> Yes.  You can attach it to the bug.
<xtknight> any naming conventions for debdiffs?>
<ScottK> But it'd be better to add the Debian security fix to it first.
<xtknight> ok what is this "Debian" fix? 
<ScottK> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=415855
<ubotu> Debian bug 415855 in bip "bip: [security]  IRC passwords in /etc/bip.conf world readable" [Important,Closed]  
<xtknight> ahh
<ScottK> I don't think we have time to sync the new debian version and then get your patch applied and so I think it's best you just copy their change into your source and make a new patch.
<ScottK> For names, I usually use packagename_version.patch.
<xtknight> so what should i do with the debian fix?
<ScottK> Make the same change they did to your source.
<xtknight> ok so we're applying this to the ubuntu one also
<xtknight> so apaprently i need to grab bip_0.5.3-4 ... ?
<ScottK> Stand by.
<ScottK> xtknight: I think this is the change: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/14911/
<xtknight> thing is i don't know if we're uploading a patch to 0.5.3-3 or if we're using debian's 0.5.3-4
<ScottK> Write it like you are using -3
<xtknight> ok so i'm going to modify postinst and add that
<ScottK> I got the diff from here (It's the entire debian diff for bip, not just -4) http://ftp.debian.org/debian/pool/main/b/bip/bip_0.5.3-4.diff.gz
<xtknight> and credit it to myself or someone eles?
<ScottK> Mention in the changelog that it was pulled from -4 and the debian bug number it fixed.
<xtknight> k
<xtknight> and that little patch you pasted (chmod...bip.conf) is added at the /end/ of postinst?
<ScottK> Then once you're done we'll get bddebian to upload it.
* bddebian runs
<xtknight> :O
<ScottK> xtknight: More context http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/14912/ - You figure out what's different
<ScottK> LongPointyStick: Are you there?
<xtknight> ScottK, gotcha.  where did you get that patch?
<xtknight> never mind
<ScottK> http://packages.qa.debian.org/b/bip.html and click on the diff.gz
* ScottK wants to make sure LongPointyStick is OK with superceding her sync request with the patch in the interests of time...
<xtknight> should i credit it to Arnaud Cornet for fixing it or to myself for adding it to the ubuntu?
<xtknight> i am being a bit compulsive on the questions here as i don't want to make any mistake
<ScottK> I'd credit you backported the patch from the -4 verison in Debian so it'll be clear to the person who tries to merge your fix and -4 (or whatever) in Feisty +1 what happened.
<xtknight> they should both go under this changelog entry? bip (0.5.3-3ubuntu1) feisty; urgency=low
<xtknight> or make yet another rev?
<ScottK> They should both go in the same changelog entry.
<xtknight> ScottK, let me know if this sounds good http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/14914/
<ScottK> xtknight: Looks reasonable to me.  Did you build the binary and test it?
<xtknight> woops
<xtknight> slight problem heh subprocess post-installation script returned error exit status 127
<xtknight> just a pathetic little error where i copied the '+' from the diff
<xtknight> DEFAULT=1.  /etc/bip.conf is chmod 640.  and it is owned by root:bip.  looks good.
<ScottK> OK.
<ScottK> Then make a new debdiff and attach that to the bug and let me know when you've done it.
<xtknight> one thing though.  if bip.conf was created before with different owners, this postinst script that Arnaud did does not change its permissions
<xtknight> so i dont know if an update would do anything
<xtknight> only a --purge and reinstall will make the bip.conf correct.  it doesn't fix it unless you --purge.  does the update manager --purge an old package before updating it?  if not, then this patch will not work
<ScottK> It'll be correct for new installs, but not upgrades then.
<xtknight> it only fixes it on a clean install
<xtknight> yea
<xtknight> so if people update it wont do anything
<xtknight> hmm
<xtknight> does that sound like favorable behavior?  
<ScottK> xtknight: Are you sure?
<xtknight> i'll make sure, sec
<xtknight> oh
<xtknight> hmm
<xtknight> Configuration file `/etc/bip.conf'
<xtknight>  ==> File on system created by you or by a script.
<xtknight> weird
<xtknight>  The default action is to keep your current version.
<xtknight> *** bip.conf (Y/I/N/O/D/Z) [default=N]  ? 
<xtknight> that sounds fine then.  that didnt seem to happen last time.l
<xtknight> i wonder if update manager will give people that prompt, though
<ScottK> If apt gave it, I'm pretty sure the update manager will.
<xtknight> k it's probably fine then
<ScottK> I'd so go with it and we'll bring it up when we ask to have it reviewd.
<ScottK> so/say
<xtknight> here's what i'm worried about though
<xtknight> say he has 'bip' from apt-get ubuntu.  alright it is created with root:root
<xtknight> now he (or apt) does "sudo dpkg -i bip_..." and it does NOT say the prompt
<xtknight> and it does NOT change permissions
<xtknight> only if i manually touch the file does it say the prompt.  and chances are the fil will be created by bip iteslf, and it will not prompt
<ScottK> OK.  DO this...
<ScottK> purge the package and manually make sure all the config files, the pid dir, and the logfile are gone.
<ScottK> sudo apt-get install bip
<ScottK> then install your new ubuntu1 deb
<ScottK> then check permissions.
<xtknight> ok
<xtknight> sudo rm -rf ~/.bip /var/run/bip /var/log/bip /etc/bip.conf /etc/default/bip
<xtknight> sudo dpkg --purge bip
<xtknight> sudo dpkg -i bip_0.5.3-3ubuntu1_i386.deb....... 
<xtknight> permissions are correct
<xtknight> -rw-r----- 1 root bip 4654 2007-04-10 13:37 /etc/bip.conf
<ScottK> Did you install 0.5.3-3 first?
<xtknight> ahh no
<xtknight> sec
<xtknight> alright.  installed 0.5.3-3.  permissions are wrong, root:root
<xtknight> i will now try my deb
<xtknight> permissions are still wrong.
<xtknight> therefore an update will not fix it
<xtknight> he will have to rely on clean install
<xtknight> nor will it prompt him on update if a previous 'bip' wrote to /etc/bip.conf (99% situation)
<ScottK> OK.  I don't know how to fix that then.
<ScottK> Argh.
<xtknight> it's in the postinst prolly
<ScottK> Oh, certainly.
<xtknight> if [ "$1" = "configure" -a "$2" = "" ] 
<xtknight> that is failing on a dpkg -i
<xtknight> somehow
<xtknight>  idont know what that is though
<ScottK> That's almost certainly the line that needs to be changed.
<xtknight> i'll see what it does
<xtknight> that fixes it
<xtknight> i dont see any negative consequences of commenting out that 'if' statement anyway.
<ScottK> Do it that way and we'll get someone more experienced to review it.  Don't forget to update your changelog since you are no longer exactly using the Debian patch.
<xtknight> yea
<xtknight> hrm what about the other architectures?
<ScottK> All you are uploading are source changes.  The build system will take care of all the binaries.
<ScottK> You haven't changed anything that should have an architecture specific impact.
<xtknight> ahh
<xtknight> here's the final patch, i think.  http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/14920/
<xtknight> reconfirmed that it fixed it
<ScottK> Looks good to me.
<xtknight> wiped everything, apt-get, install mine, and it fixes the permissions
<ScottK> Attach the debdiff to the bug.
<xtknight> ah the fun part
<xtknight> bug 105199
<ubotu> Malone bug 105199 in bip "does not create a home folder(~/.bip)" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/105199
<ScottK> After you attach the debdiff, subscribe (not assign) ubuntu-universe-sponsors to the bug.
<xtknight> gotcha
<xtknight> done
<xtknight> hey thanks for helping me thru this
<ScottK> We aren't done yet.
* xtknight takes deep breath
<ScottK> First, you get to do it over.  Bug #105215 got done first.
<ubotu> Malone bug 105215 in bip "Please sync bip (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,Fix released]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/105215
<ScottK> So now you have to diff against that.
<xtknight> so attach to there also?
<xtknight> oh i have to run "debdiff" again against a different package?
<ScottK> Yeah.  You also have to rebuild the source package against the updated source first.
<Adri2000> (don't forget the maintainer field)
<xtknight> k so basically i need bip_0.5.3-4, right?
<xtknight> from debian
<ScottK> Adri2000: Good point.
<ScottK> Thanks
<ScottK> xtknight: Yes.
<ScottK> Or it'll be in the Ubuntu repositories as soon as they synch
<ScottK> xtknight: Also, as Adri2000 kindly reminds me, you'll need to change the maintainer in debian/control as described here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebianMaintainerField
<xtknight> hrmm
<xtknight> change it to myself?
<ScottK> xtknight: The spec tells you.
<ScottK> xtknight: Change the current maintainer to XSBC-Original-Maintainer: and then add Ubuntu MOTU Developers <ubuntu-motu@lists.ubuntu.com> as the maintainer.
<xtknight> k i am changing this on which pkg?
<xtknight> the debdiff i already did, also?  
<ScottK> Don't worry about the one you already did.
<xtknight> k first i need to get the source of the debian -4 which i'm trying to figure out atm
<xtknight> let's see... d/l bip_0.5.3.orig.tar.gz  and then apply bip_0.5.3-4.diff.gz 
<ScottK> Get the -4 source package and modify that one to work like your -3ubuntu1 + the maintainer changes and it will be -4ubuntu1
<xtknight> how do i apply a .diff.gz?
<xtknight> to get -4 i have to get -3.orig and then apply the diff, right?
<xtknight> as per bip_0.5.3-4.diff.gz 
<xtknight>  i mean, as per http://ftp.debian.org/debian/pool/main/b/bip/
<ScottK> xtknight: I'd just add a debian source repo and get it from there.  deb-src ftp://debian.mirrors.pair.com/ testing main contrib
<xtknight> ah ok
<ScottK> Don't forget to comment it out when you are done.
<xtknight> got it
<xtknight> so change the debian status of this one
<xtknight> control file
<xtknight> first modify it with my changes, right?
<ScottK> keescook: I have a question for you about a security fix if you have a moment.  The debian fix for http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=415855 seems incomplete.  They only fix the permissions on new install.  Existing installs are left world readable.  From a security perspective, the permissions changes should be applied on upgrades to, right?
<ubotu> Debian bug 415855 in bip "bip: [security]  IRC passwords in /etc/bip.conf world readable" [Important,Closed]  
<ScottK> xtknight: Yes.  
<geser> you can also dget the .dsc file and expand the source package with dpkg-source -x .dsc file
<keescook> ScottK: normally if a perms fix is part of a package, something in the postinst should fix it up too.
<xtknight> so now
<xtknight> umm
<xtknight> grr
<xtknight> one sec *
<ScottK> OK.  The debian fix for the bug doesn't touch existing conf files and that seemed incomplete.  I take that for agreement.  Thanks.
<ScottK> keescook: ^^
<keescook> ScottK: yeah, I haven't looked specifically at the bug, but I'd tend to agree: prior installs need to be protected too.  If getting the update doesn't fix that, then it's not really fixed.  :)
<ScottK> Thanks.
<ScottK> xtknight: Yes?
<xtknight> talking to myself
<xtknight> almost got this, i think
<xtknight> i will post the debdiff for you to verify
<xtknight> so i am changing debian pkg's maintainer to ubuntu MOTU...
<xtknight> and the xsbc stuff (got that)
<ScottK> Yes
<xtknight> now since their version is bip (0.5.3-4) unstable; urgency=high
<ScottK> This is done so that people don't complain to the Debian maintainer directly about stuff from Ubuntu.
<xtknight> what should i title my changelog
<ScottK> change the target distro to feisty
<xtknight> unstable=feisty?
<xtknight> -> rather
<ScottK> You should be able to do dch -i from inside the package dir and have it automagically pretty much right.
<ScottK> Yes
<xtknight> this Debian pkg will be going back into debian?
<xtknight> or is this for feisty
<ScottK> This is for feisty
<xtknight> ahhh
<xtknight> so
<ScottK> When we are done here you get to file bugs with Debian.
<xtknight> what will happen to debian's package?  that is not for me to worry about?
<ScottK> Up to us to tell them and give them the patch.  Up to them what they do with it.
<xtknight> this sound right? "bip (0.5.3-4) feisty; urgency=high"
<ScottK> no
<enyc> hrrm Ive seen many ubuntu universe packages that do not have a -ubuntu? on the version number... but maybe they have the maintainer email address changed still...
<ScottK> 0.5.3-4ubuntu1
<xtknight> k
<xtknight> what about the urgency?
<xtknight> high i guess because of this security fix..?
<ScottK> Doesn't matter for Ubuntu
<ScottK> I'd leave it.
<xtknight> k
<xtknight> ScottK, does this look good (debdiff)? http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/14931/
<ScottK> enyc: According to the spec, the debian-maintainer change is supposed to go in ALL binary packages and source packages touched by Ubuntu, so you will correctly see debian-maintainer in binaries without ubuntu version numbers.
* ScottK looks
<crimsun> Adri2000: no sweat, it got in, which is the important part.
<enyc> ScottK: aaah... but if  the package is just put into ubuntu-universe and not "touched" (changed), the maintainer will not be changed?
<crimsun> if it's a sync, it will not be changed.
<crimsun> sync == no Ubuntu changes
<xtknight> i may have to get going pretty soon.  i will be here in probably 30 mins to an hour.  have to run to the store
<ScottK> OK
<ScottK> Almost done
<ScottK> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/14932/ has a small wordsmith.  Since you are now fixing and not borrowing someone else's patch, it's probably politer not to point at them by name.
<ScottK> Why don't you upload that.
<xtknight> true
<xtknight> k upload this one to where?
<enyc> hrrm
<ScottK> Attach it to Bug #105199
<ubotu> Malone bug 105199 in bip "does not create a home folder(~/.bip)" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/105199
<enyc> crimsun: interestin.g.. of course you might get some debian maintainer woh then realises the problem relates to something different in ubuntu's environment that doesn't apply to debian.... (even though the debian package was not changed)
<xtknight> is that all there is to it?
<ScottK> Then we start asking an actual MOTU to look at it, but basically you're done.
<xtknight> awesome
<enyc> crimsun: e.g. I discovered qpsmtpd fails to work connerctly on ubuntu (not relevant to debian) using debian-synced package (no ubuntu changes)... so debian maintainer might not want to be bothered then tooo... not sure if it actually tends to be a problem though!
<xtknight> i'm going to take off now.  thanks again
<ScottK> Bug #105199 is ready for UUS review.  crimsun are you availble?
<ubotu> Malone bug 105199 in bip "does not create a home folder(~/.bip)" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/105199
<ScottK> xtknight: You'll also want to file bugs against the package in Debian and give them the patches.
<xtknight> ok
<xtknight> made note of that.
<ScottK> And then come back and fix more.  I hope you enjoyed the experience.
<xtknight> first time is always rough
<xtknight> for each bug we have to fix it in debian also?
<ScottK> We don't have to, but the more of our stuff that gets back into Debian, the less manual work there is for us.  It's a win-win
<ScottK> Once there is a Ubuntu unique package, automatic synching stops and you have to merge stuff.  The less of that the better.
<ScottK> xtknight: Thank you for your contribution.
<crimsun> ScottK: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/bip/+bug/105199/comments/6
<ubotu> Malone bug 105199 in bip "does not create a home folder(~/.bip)" [Medium,Needs info]  
<ScottK> crimsun: Jumped the gun.  Sorry about that.  -4 needs to get built and distributed first.
<crimsun> source is already mirrored
<Joe_CoT> hey, some packaging questions. I'm packaging from a subversion repository. What do I put as the "downloaded from" in debian/copyright?
<crimsun> crimsun@Box:~$ apt-cache madison bip |grep Sources
<crimsun>        bip |    0.5.3-4 | http://archive.ubuntu.com feisty/universe Sources
<ScottK> crimsun: That's why I had him redo the patch against -4.
<crimsun> ScottK: yes, and it still fails.
<ScottK> Ah.  I'll look at it then.
<crimsun> Joe_CoT: the SVN URI.
<Joe_CoT> and i'm supposed to do something "get-orig-source" in debian/rules if it's svn?
<Joe_CoT> i'm sort of confused by that. Am I supposed to add a get-orig-source target in rules that checks out the svn? do i have to add subversion to build-depends then?
<ScottK> crimsun: If the patch applies with patch -p1 is that sufficient?
<Joe_CoT> "badly formed line in files list file"
<Joe_CoT> from dpkg-genchanges when running pbuilder
<crimsun> ScottK: as long as it applies, yes
<ScottK> OK.  When I tried it, the revised patch for Bug #105199 applied with patch -p1.
<ubotu> Malone bug 105199 in bip "does not create a home folder(~/.bip)" [Medium,Needs info]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/105199
<ScottK> Pleas have another go at it.
<ScottK> Pleas/Please
<ajmitch> morning
<ScottK> Good morning ajmitch.
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<crimsun> 'morning
<crimsun> ScottK: clarified, applied and uploaded
<ScottK> crimsun: Thanks.
<ScottK> Seen on #ubuntu-meeting just now [16:04]  <Keybuk> is a member of the MOTU Council here?
<ScottK> crimsun: gpocentek rogered up to Keybuck's question.
<crimsun> ok
* ScottK just wanted to make sure someone was there...
<ScottK> xtknight: See https://launchpad.net/~xt-knight/+packages - Once launchpad indicates the new version has built on all architectures, mark the bug fix released.
<ScottK> xtknight: Congratulations.
<crimsun> xtknight: for reference, urgency in Ubuntu uploads is largely moot
<superm1> crimsun, or any other MOTU's, would you have a moment to look over a debdiff, its attached to bug 104965
<ubotu> Malone bug 104965 in mythtv "Need HDHomeRun fixes" [Wishlist,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/104965
<superm1> i've got binaries built for it too if anyone would be interested in trying them rather than having to build themselves
<xtknight> ScottK, cool. thanks.
<xtknight> crimsun, gotcha
<ScottK> xtknight: He also modified your changelog entries.  Have a look at that for future reference/education.
<crimsun> superm1: not for several hours, sorry. In lecture until 7 PM.
<superm1> ah okay
<xtknight> aigh
<xtknight> aight
<superm1> crimsun, are there any other freezes prior to release that i need to make sure this makes it in before?
<ScottK> xtknight: Now that you've done it once, go fix some more bugs.
<xtknight> yeah i'm dying to
<xtknight> ;- )
<xtknight> maybe tomorrow.  :P
<xtknight> got a couple of my own i'm going to try and help fix
<ScottK> xtknight: You'll want to learn about pbuilder for testing your builds.
<ScottK> xtknight: Also remember that 12 April is the Universe freeze for Feisty, so don't dawdle.
<xtknight> ah
<Joe_CoT> ScottK: speaking of universe freeze, I'm trying to get World of Padman packaged. can I get some help on a few things? :)
<ScottK> Packaged as in a NEW package?
<Joe_CoT> yeah. has that one come and gone?
<ScottK> April 12 freeze is for bug fixing.  Feature Freeze (cut off for new packages) was long ago.
<Joe_CoT> ah. alrighty then
<superm1> ScottK, would you be able to look over that debdiff then and possibly sponsor an upload?
<ScottK> But the repos should be open soon for Feisty +1, so don't stop working.
<ScottK> superm1: I'll look, but I'm not a MOTU.
<superm1> ScottK, oh :)
<Joe_CoT> ScottK: alright. do you know anything about get-orig-source rules?
* ScottK knows way less than bddebian and he routinely proclaims himself the least knowledgeable MOTU, but give it a shot.
<ScottK> What's the question?
<Joe_CoT> I'm trying to figure out how to set one up. According to the packaging guide, I need to provide a "get-orig-source" rule in debian/rules if I have to make the orig tar myself. For the engine package, I had to get it from a subversion tag. For the data package, I had to get it from their installer.
<geser> ScottK: bddebian knows more than he is ready to concede
<ScottK> geser: I know, but I'm playing along.
* bddebian doesn't know shit
<ScottK> Joe_CoT: No. I haven't had to do that before.  Sorry.  I'd look for another package with an svn type version name and see what they did.
<Joe_CoT> ok
<ScottK> bddebian: Fortunately we don't package that.
<ScottK> Joe_CoT: Remember that plaigarism is the sincerest form of flattery.
<Joe_CoT> yeah, i ripped the shell script from the tremulous package to set the environmental vars. the packages work just fine. I'm just trying to bring them up to standards
<bddebian> ScottK: :-)
<Joe_CoT> a few other things. i'm getting this from Lintian: "E: Amusement does not exist, exiting"
<bddebian> lintian -i will usually give you better info
<Joe_CoT> a ha. I should "export from subversion rather than checkout". good to know
<superm1> bddebian, you have a few moments to prod for a sponsor on a upload?
<bddebian> Sure, why not
<superm1> bug 104965
<ubotu> Malone bug 104965 in mythtv "Need HDHomeRun fixes" [Wishlist,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/104965
<bddebian> Oh gads, mythtv
<superm1> hehe
<bddebian> Is slomo aware?
<superm1> aware of what?
<superm1> of these patches?
<bddebian> Yeah
<superm1> not afaik.  keescook was planning on looking them over but wasnt sure he would be able to before freeze
<superm1> keescook was aware of all of the changes though
<superm1> bddebian, i've got binaries built too if you wanted to try them rather than having to build yourself
<bddebian> Nah I'll build it, thx
<superm1> k
<superm1> bddebian, out of curiosity, why did you ask if slomo was aware of these patches?
<bddebian> I used to deal with him on the multimedia packages
<superm1> ah
<bddebian> Wasn't sure if he is still "the man" on those? :-)
<superm1> mythtv has kinda been singled out from the rest of the multimedia packages
<bddebian> Aye
<superm1> there is a ubuntu-mythtv group now on lp
<bddebian> Scary
<superm1> and we have an irc channel and such :)
<bddebian> Damn I can't get used to the new LP look
<superm1> bddebian, i'll be back on in about 30 min once i get to my next class
<superm1> i'll touch bases with you then
<Joe_CoT> bah. i have yet to find one that actually does it correctly. the version clearly says it's a cvs version, yet there's no get-orig-source rule, and the copyright just says they got it from the website
<bddebian> superm1: np
<Joe_CoT> okay. now i'm extremely confused. I'm looking at other cvs packages like ScottK suggested, and I have yet to find one that actually includes a get-orig-source rule at the Packaging guide suggests. For "capiutils", the changelog shows it was updated to match upstream in 2007, yet the copyright hasn't changed since 2002, and it just says "The sources are from the CVS version"
<ScottK> Joe_CoT: I don't know the rules on that, but it's been my experience that just because we get cr@p from Debian, doesn't mean it's OK here.
<ScottK> Maybe somebody will come along that knows....
<Joe_CoT> lol, well i'd definately say that package is in the "cr@p" category.
<Joe_CoT> "dpkg-genchanges: error: badly formed line in files list file, line 1"
* gnomefreak never seen a "list file" before
<gnomefreak> Joe_CoT: i would start on line one of that file :)
<Joe_CoT> doesn't exist. googling, it looks like it's talking about the file "debian/file", which is created at build time.
<gnomefreak> that would be the one i guess. see whats on line one and see if it belongs to rules file or what not. if you look in build-dir maybe it will be there?
<gnomefreak> atleast most of the packages i deal with make a build-dir dir in source dir
<bddebian> Hmm, to upload or not to upload...
<geser> flip a coin
<bddebian> Well it's freakin' mythtv :-)
<ScottK> Oh just upload it.  No one really uses that anyway ;')
<bddebian> haha
<welshbyte> to upload or not to upload, that is the question. whether 'tis nobler in the mind to suffer the slings and arrows of outrageous fortune, or to take arms against a sea of bugs
<welshbyte> (apologies to mr shakespeare)
<ScottK> bddebian: You're screwed either way.  Upload and you didn't fix all the bugs.  Don't upload and you didn't fix all the bugs.  May as well go for it.
<bddebian> Already sent ;-P
<bddebian> welshbyte: :-)
<bddebian> Later gang
<xtknight> can someone help me take a look at Bug 105263 ?  
<ubotu> Malone bug 105263 in kvm "[feisty]  kvm depends of kvm-api-9 but it not exists that package" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/105263
<xtknight> so he says it depends on kvm-api-9.  this package is not available anywhere yet that i can tell.  in the changelog of kvm, it says "* Make package depend on kvm-api-X, so the kernel can provide correct API".  the kernel (that DOES have kvm enabled by default) should be Providing kvm-api-9
<ScottK> xtknight: I just commented on the bug
<xtknight> trying apt-get update/etc
<xtknight> ScottK, it still won't work with the latest updates
<xtknight>  kvm: Depends: kvm-api-9 but it is not installable
<welshbyte> the last change to that package was to specifically add that dependency.. i'm guessing it must be there for a reason (maybe the kernel provides is on its way?)
<xtknight> i am running the stock ubuntu kernel
<xtknight> yea
<xtknight> that's what i thought
#ubuntu-motu 2007-04-11
<ScottK> xtknight: So I confirmed the bug.  Please mark it fix released if you find out it's resolved.
<xtknight> k
<ScottK> xtknight: You can mark your bip bug fix released whever you feel like it.  It's built.  Congrats again.
<xtknight> ScottK, cool. it will be included in Feisty release?
<xtknight> also i submitted it to debian
<ScottK> Yes.  It is in Feisty now.
<xtknight> but i didnt see you had modified it a bit.  it didnt work with it because it 'hadnt been synced' ?
<xtknight> i sent my original fix to debian
<xtknight> so i dunno
<ScottK> xtknight: there was some trouble getting your patch to apply (which had to do with the naming, not the content) and I played with it a bit.  Technically your patch was fine.
<xtknight> ahh because the path was too long
<ScottK> Debian won't apply the patch directly, so they'll be OK>
<xtknight> yeah
<ScottK> Something like that.  I still have trouble with patch naming sometimes.
<xtknight> i figured they didnt want MOTU in their pkg status
<xtknight> but i just gave them it all anyway
<ScottK> No, they don't
<xtknight> wow didnt realize it would be that quick
<ScottK> Pretty cool, huh?  You may want to go ahead and join https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-universe-contributors/ so that if you want to package something new, you'll be able to upload entire packages for review in Feisty+1.
<xtknight> interesting
<xtknight> i got an email back from Arnaud already
<xtknight> "This should be ENABLED=1 for the user's convenience, since this is undocumented behavior."
<xtknight> >>"This is the point, because an unconfigured bip should not be started.
<xtknight> Documenting would do no harm though."
<xtknight> hmm
<xtknight> ( this is from the one i submitted to debian, i think )
<xtknight> well doesnt matter to me what Debian does to it
<xtknight> :P
<ScottK> Either fixing the docs or fixing the code is a valid solution.  Seems unlikely someone would install something they don't want to run though.
<xtknight> yea silly.  besides the default config works
<xtknight> though it should be documented
<ScottK> Gotta run.  Go find some more bugs to fix in universe...
<xtknight> sure thing
<TheMuso> danohuiginn: Do you happen to have an updated debdiff for bug 103507 yet?
<ubotu> Malone bug 103507 in om "Script 'launchomsynth' brings up two instances of om_gtk" [Undecided,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/103507
<ScottK> xtknight: Did you find a bug to work on yet?
<xtknight> ScottK, going to try and start on this one https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/slab/+bug/105333
<ubotu> Malone bug 105333 in slab "The More Applications window takes far too long to come up" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  
<ScottK> xtknight: So you're a Gnome person then?
<xtknight> ScottK, it looked like something i could debug
<ScottK> Ah.  Well another you might look at that I know needs some serious attention is a series of sigsegv on klamav.
<xtknight> ah
<xtknight> well actually i just dealt with a sigsegv the other night
<xtknight> i'd like to finish work on that bug
<ScottK> It's a recent upgrade that was required because clamav was upgraded.
<ScottK> As you like, you're a volunteer.
<xtknight> bug 104978
<ubotu> Malone bug 104978 in xrandr "[apport]  xrandr crashed with SIGSEGV in XRRGetScreenInfo()" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/104978
<xtknight> see my comments there
<xtknight> i'm not sure the next step to take relaly
<xtknight> i don't know enough about how libXext works to be modifying it
* ScottK neither.  
<Fujitsu> That's in main, so not a good one to fix.
<xtknight> ahh
<ScottK> Ah.  Good point.
<xtknight> so this is the place for universe..
<xtknight> what's the place or main?
<xtknight> -bugs?
<Fujitsu> #ubuntu-devel
<ScottK> The thing is main is already frozen.
<xtknight> ah ok
<Fujitsu> Yes, and we will be in a few hours :(
<xtknight> i'll take a look at the klamav stuff
<danohuiginn> TheMuso: just attached it
<xtknight> i dont even know how to set slab up
<TheMuso> danohuiginn: Thanks./
<xtknight> bug 96090
<ubotu> Malone bug 96090 in klamav "[apport]  klamav crashed with SIGSEGV" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/96090
<xtknight> ugh klamav doesn't even install without error on my system
<xtknight> try 'sudo apt-get install klamav' 
<xtknight> fail for anyone else?
<Fujitsu> That was fixed a couple of weeks ago.
<xtknight> pretty easy to fix (install clamav-freshclam afterwards) but odd
<Fujitsu> What error does it give?
<xtknight> well i'm fully updated
<xtknight> i'll paste bin it
<Fujitsu> Oh, that one... Isn't that one of yours, ScottK?
<xtknight> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/14975/
<xtknight> ( on $ sudo apt-get install klamav )
<Fujitsu> Somebody was working on that problem.
<xtknight> i'm not having much luck getting klamav to sigsegv
<xtknight> oooh
<xtknight> got it
<xtknight> try Upgrade and boom
<ScottK> Fujitsu: I was trying to entice people to work on it, but didn't have any sign of success.
<ScottK> Oh.  That one.  Darn, I thought it was fixed.
* ScottK was working on that one.
* ScottK reopened the relevant bug.
<ScottK> Bug #33921
<ubotu> Malone bug 33921 in clamav "Unable to install clamav-daemon" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/33921
<Fujitsu> That be the one.
<xtknight> ah
<xtknight> back to bug fixing
<xtknight> now klamav appears to have a builtin upgrade feature
<xtknight> what's that all about?
<xtknight> isn't synaptic supposed to deliver updates/is it even supposed to exist there?
<xtknight> s/synaptic/update-manager
<xtknight> hey ScottK you around/ready to fix another one?
<xtknight> bug 105341
<ubotu> Malone bug 105341 in hostap-driver "hostap-source fails to build" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/105341
<xtknight> half of the package seems to be missing
<Fujitsu> xtknight: That package should probably be removed. It's included in modern kernels.
<xtknight> yea just found that out and commented
<xtknight> off to investigate Bug 105345
<ubotu> Malone bug 105345 in restricted-manager "restricted-manager installs nVidia and ATi drivers with the wrong resolution on wide screens" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/105345
<xtknight> Fujitsu, who should i talk about regarding Bug 105341 (hostap)?  who should i tell to remove it besides just making a comment?
<ubotu> Malone bug 105341 in hostap-driver "hostap-source fails to build" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/105341
<xtknight> shouldnt be needed on any Feisty kernel so it shouldn't be in Feisty
<Fujitsu> You need to retitle it to be something like `Remove hostap-source from the archive', get a MOTU to ack it, and subscribe ubuntu-archive. The archive team will then remove it.
<jmg> what about people using hostap-source with nonstandard kernels
<jmg> eg, xen
<xtknight> hrmm
<gnomefreak> did feisty lose the nvidia 9755 for any reason?
<gnomefreak> other than to fix the geforce4 cards
<Jucato> oh wow I never noticed that O.o
<gnomefreak> Jucato: i did early this morning
<Jucato> hm... this is going to get so confusing :P
<Jucato> ah no! :)
<gnomefreak> it seems they dropped everyone to 96xx
<Jucato> gnomefreak: nvidia-glx-new
* Jucato does a victory dance
<gnomefreak> huh? thats legacy no?
<Jucato> nope
<gnomefreak> oh i see what they did :)
<gnomefreak> good move 
<Jucato> yay!
<Fujitsu> So we have nvidia-glx{,-{legacy,new}}?
<Jucato> yesh. all thanks to nvidia
<gnomefreak> thats what it seems like
<Jucato> :/
<gnomefreak> now everyone that grabbed -legacy +-100 people now need to know that :(
<Jucato> kinda...
<TheMuso> Bring on Bring on nouveau I say!
* Jucato crosses his fingers for nouveau
<Fujitsu> -100 people need to know it? Impressive.
<Fujitsu> How's that going?
<xtknight> lol
<TheMuso> heh
<gnomefreak> + or -
<Jucato> +/- 100 people :P
<gnomefreak> i just made announcment in #ubuntu+1
* TheMuso hates the fact that one has to buy video hardware with more resources than one might need these days.
<TheMuso> i.e I have an ATI radeon here with 128MB video ram, but I pretty much never use all of that.
<bddebian> Heya gang
<ScottK> Heya bddebian
<welshbyte> ello bddebian 
<bddebian> Heya ScottK, welshbyte
<Administrator> hello bddebian 
<bddebian> Hmm, hello Administrator
<Administrator> bddebian: /win la
<Administrator> bah
<Administrator> bddebian: this is joejaxx
<Administrator> :)
<bddebian> heh
<Administrator> this is a temporary client
<Administrator> my server is being ddos'd :P
<bddebian> joy
<Administrator> yeah
<Administrator> looks like they stopped
<RAOF> Ok.  So, to finish fixing democracyplayer, I need to work out how to (1) make it load the gtkembdedmoz.so from /usr/lib/firefox and (2) Make one of its extension modules link to libpython2.5.  Trouble is, I don't really have any idea how to do this, other than a wrapper which sets the LD_PATH and LD_PRELOADs libpython.  Can anyone point me towards a cleaner solution?
<xtknight> bug #?
<Fujitsu> RAOF: Yep. Remove democracyplayer :P
<RAOF> bug #81798
<ubotu> Malone bug 81798 in democracyplayer "[apport]  democracyplayer crashed with TypeError in __new__()" [High,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/81798
<xtknight> hrmm
<xtknight> RAOF, the gtkembed/python are related to the startup carsh?
<xtknight> crash*
<xtknight> i'm on the verge of falling asleep right now but i'll help as much as i can
<RAOF> Bah, sorry.  Network-manager update killed my network.
<xtknight> ya same happened here
<xtknight> <xtknight> RAOF, the gtkembed/python are related to the startup crash?
<xtknight> <xtknight> i'm on the verge of falling asleep right now but i'll help as much as i can
<RAOF> The gtkembed is the cause of the crash on startup.
<RAOF> Well, once you've fixed their use of removed DBUS api.
<RAOF> And without linking to libpython, the database extension module will fail to import (on AMD64, at least), so the database won't work.
<ScottK> Anyone in UUS up for a simple python bug fix (one liner)?  Bug #104637 is ready for upload.
<ubotu> Malone bug 104637 in pyparsing "pyparsing 1.4.5 released in dec 06" [Low,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/104637
<ScottK> Despite the title of the bug I just pulled the one fix out of the new upstream release.
<TheMuso> ScottK: I'll have a look at it.
<ScottK> TheMuso: Thanks.
<RAOF> Alternatively, what *other* packages link to/use gtkembedmoz?  I could try to work out how to do it from there?
<TheMuso> ScottK: You might want to make sure that changelog entries fit onto an 80 column line. So the lines probably shouldn't be any longer than the header/footer for the changelog entry.
<ScottK> Oops.  I usually do that.  Ugh.
<TheMuso> ScottK: Have a look at the other entries for an example.
<ScottK> Want me to do it over?
<TheMuso> Please.
<ScottK> I'll have it for you again in a moment.
<TheMuso> Sure.
<TheMuso> ScottK: actually, hold on a sec.
<ScottK> Argh.  82 characters.  Missed it by THAT much.
<TheMuso> THis package doesn't appear to have any previous patches applied to it, either in a patch system or in the .diff.gz. So since you are patching a package file, please set up a patch system and use a patch in debian/patches.
<TheMuso> The package uses cdbs, so you can use simple-patchsys.
<ScottK> OK.  What I had been told before was that if there was no existing patch system and it was a simple fix, changing the source was OK...
* ScottK has not had a lot of luck with that so far.  It'll be a learning experience.
<TheMuso> ScottK: Read up on cdbs-edit-patch
* RAOF finds simple-patchsys to be an absolute joy.
<TheMuso> RAOF: +1
<TheMuso> ScottK: Even for simple fixes, its better to use patches, as if ever the package has to be updated/merged for any reason, its one less potential conflict that is solved before the package is even unpacked.
<TheMuso> And there is also a chance that the new upstream file has changed significantly enough that the patch won't apply any more.
<TheMuso> SO having it in debian/patches allows for easy removal/addition of the patch, and any others that may be needed.
<RAOF> Also, it's nice an easy to send upstream, too.
<ScottK> The most likely scenario in this particular case is Debian gets a new upstream that already has this fix in it and we synch over it.
<ScottK> This is already fixed upstream
* RAOF just meant "in general"
* ScottK is in the midst of downloading 37 updates at the moment (including xtknight's bip update).  Back in a bit.
<xtknight> cool
<xtknight> it's in there? :P
<TheMuso> xtknight: SOunds like it.
<ScottK> xtknight: It didn't change the directory permissions because bip was running.  Looks like it need a preinst to make sure it's stopped before the upgrade.
<ScottK> But it's done now, so off to the joy's of patching systems.
<ScottK> TheMuso: It was his first bug fix he got uploaded.
<TheMuso> ScottK: They aren't all that bad. Cdbs-edit-patch makes it very easy.
<TheMuso> Thanks to pitti for that one.
<crimsun> TheMuso: are you handling 104637?
<TheMuso> crimsun: Yeah.
<crimsun> ok
<ScottK> No he's not, he's torturing me.
<ScottK> ;-)
<crimsun> good thing I asked before dput :)
<RAOF> So, anyone with ideas for how to fix the linking issues?  Or even other packages using gtkembedmoz?  Or how to find them (firefox-dev's rdepends don't have anyhthing interesting)
<TheMuso> crimsun: Whats your view on small fixes and patch systems, i.e for the bug in question?
<ScottK> I know I'm complaining BTW, but this is actually good as I'm learning stuff I need to know.
<crimsun> TheMuso: it doesn't have an existing patch management system, so I wouldn't add one (which has been the historical approach we've taken)
<xtknight> RAOF, back to business
<crimsun> TheMuso: we'd filterdiff out everything else save the relevant hunk(s) in the diff.gz, then attach that to a Debian BTS entry
<xtknight> you want to know other packages that use gtkembedmoz?  it's definitely a mozilla thing (moz)
<RAOF> Yes, that'd be nice.
<TheMuso> crimsun: Ah ok.
<RAOF> Yes, it's in /usr/lib/firefox, and the firefox-dev package.
<TheMuso> ScottK: Sorry dude, don't need to worry about it then. Just the changelog fixup is fine.
<ScottK> Well I've already got the patch made now...
<xtknight> RAOF, well i believe it's only in firefox
<xtknight> RAOF, democrplayer is based off firefox, isnt it?
<xtknight> Depends: firefox
<xtknight> for it
<RAOF> Well, kinda.
<RAOF> I don't think it's XUL, though.
<xtknight> but why is it crashing?
<RAOF> Because it's not linking to libgtkembedmoz correctly.
<xtknight> would statically compiling it be an option?
<RAOF> Running it with LD_PATH=/usr/lib/firefox democracyplayer works.
<RAOF> xtknight: Colour firefox .so only.  No static linking available, it seems.
<xtknight> add it to ld.so.conf and do ldconfig
<RAOF> xtknight: Yes, well that also works.
<xtknight> it doesnt start for me, though
<xtknight>  LD_PATH=/usr/lib/firefox democracyplayer
<xtknight> doesnt work
<jmg> there is no data
<RAOF> xtknight: Yeah, you need to patch it first.
<xtknight> well anything quick i miht be able to answer?  gotta run
<xtknight> probably be here later
<RAOF> Only how to get it to not need the ld.so.conf addition :)
<xtknight> only option is statically linking it.  otherwise it needs to be pointing to the library, i suppose.  make a script for it (a la firefox32).  democracyplayer=script, and inside do LD_PATH= ... 
<xtknight> i dont see a problem with that
<xtknight> 99% have firefox, 99% have it in that location, and democracy will start
<RAOF> Hm.  But how does *yelp* do it correctly, then?
<xtknight> hrm? yelp=?
<xtknight> ohh
<xtknight> well ltrace it; )
<xtknight> same as epiphany and other firefox apps i guess
<xtknight>     libgtkembedmoz.so => /usr/lib/firefox/libgtkembedmoz.so (0xb7613000)
<xtknight> weird
<RAOF> Indeedy do.
<xtknight> well democracy player *is* statically linked
<xtknight> oh nm
<xtknight> i was using the script
<xtknight> never mind that, it's python
<xtknight> heck
<RAOF> Hm, maybe that particular library *isn't* the problem, because ldd on its mozilla extension also shows /usr/lib/firefox/libgtk....
<ScottK> TheMuso: If I don't have /usr/share/cdbs/1/class/simple-patchsys.mk on my system, what do I need to install?
<TheMuso> ScottK: ScottK Wrong dir. Its in rules.
<ScottK> Ah.
<xtknight> RAOF, /usr/lib/python-support/democracyplayer/python2.5/democracy/...
<xtknight> whats this dir
<ScottK> Yep.  There it is.  Thanks TheMuso
<RAOF> That's the dir containing all the python extension modules.
<RAOF> Hm, failing actually knowing how to fix it properly, is a wrapper script solution acceptable?
<xtknight> sure it seems like it
<xtknight> it doesn't seem like a horrible hack to me
<xtknight> the cpu sure doesnt care...the user doesnt care either ;)
<xtknight> not sure what's at stake
<xtknight> there dont seem to be any performance or security conerns
<xtknight> make it depend on firefox so there are no missing library problems
<xtknight> yelp isnt a python program either...so maybe that's why it works
<RAOF> Maybe.
<ScottK> TheMuso: Bug #104637 is ready again...
<ubotu> Malone bug 104637 in pyparsing "pyparsing 1.4.5 released in dec 06" [Low,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/104637
<TheMuso> ScottK: Thanks.
<ScottK> TheMuso: Do you know if it's OK yet?  It's late here and I need to get to bed.
<TheMuso> ScottK: Looks good, just sanity checking the resulting deb.
<ScottK> TheMuso: I'm off to bed.  If that doesn't work out for some reason, I'd appreciate it if you'd just shorten the one line from the first patch and upload that.  Good night and thanks for the help.
<TheMuso> Sure.
<TheMuso> ScottK: Uploaded.
<ScottK> Ah.  Great.  Thanks again.
<xtknight> bug 105374
<jodas> Can anyone here help me with qtparted?
<ajmitch> impatient people
<RAOF> Also, asking questions in the wrong places.
<RAOF> Is there any better way to fix democracyplayer, other than to use a wrapper that launches it with LD_LIBRARY_PATH=/usr/lib/firefox?  I really don't know enough about the dynamic loader :)
<gpocentek> morning/evening
<ajmitch> hi gpocentek 
<crimsun> 'lo
<gpocentek> hello ajmitch, hello crimsun :)
<imbrandon> moins ajmitch crimsun gpocentek 
<imbrandon> mmmm mac and cheese for breakfast
<ajmitch> ugh
<TheMuso> lovely
<ajmitch> for an example of a demanding user: bug 105378
<ubotu> Malone bug 105378 in postfix "SASL authentication failure Ubuntu 6.10" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/105378
<ajmitch> "I consider this bug to be grave, needs a fix at least within 72 hours. Immediatly if it is really not an end user issue."
<Fujitsu> Nice, ajmitch.
<Fujitsu> `3. Follow the postfix 6.10 guide.'
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: I doubt that 'latest updates' broke it, somehow
<ajmitch> yeah
<Fujitsu> Wow, Postfix has had a few releases lately.
* ajmitch guesses some 3rd party howto found online
<ajmitch> like howtoforge.com
* Fujitsu shudders.
<ajmitch> maybe the ubuntu wiki
<Fujitsu> Even worse.
<ajmitch> hint: there have been no updates to sasl or postfix in dapper for a year
<Fujitsu> I noticed.
<Fujitsu> He does say Edgy, though.
<Fujitsu> But I don't notice any there either.
<ajmitch> right, sorry, I saw dapper further down
<crimsun> ajmitch: aww, that bug report calls for my advisor's inkwell stamp - a bull taking a crap
<crimsun> best stamp I've ever seen
<ajmitch> haha
<Fujitsu> crimsun: I want one.
<ajmitch> most likely cause - he's trying to use chrooted postfix
<Fujitsu> Probably, yes... Reject it before it spreads.
<jmg> crimsun: pics.
* jmg has seen the "complete and utter bullshit" stamp before
<RAOF> Alright!  Who'd like to look at the debdiff for bug #81798
<ubotu> Malone bug 81798 in democracyplayer "[apport]  democracyplayer crashed with TypeError in __new__()" [High,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/81798
<superm1> RAOF, you've got it all fixed up? :) :)
<RAOF> Yup.  Kinda.
<RAOF> I don't like the solution, but it works.
<superm1> nice job dude.  record time with just starting last night
<superm1> you used some LD_PRELOAD business right?
<RAOF> Actually, that's only needed for the new upstream version it seems
<RAOF> The current version only needs LD_LIBRARY_PATH :-/
<superm1> hehe
<RAOF> Also, I've been looking at this for a little bit longer than just last night.
<RAOF> :)
<nrg88> morning
<nrg88> do you guys know reportbug-ng?
<imbrandon> we know of it yes, its debian ng bug reporter
<imbrandon> why?
<nrg88> it would be excelent to extend apport to do such things
<imbrandon> tis open source , grab it and run young padiwan
<nrg88> as i've seen it, apport just collects info, and fills a new bugreport, doesn't i?
<imbrandon> :)
<nrg88> *it
<nrg88> well, it has to communicate with launchpad
<nrg88> i can't experiment with launchpad :D
<imbrandon> why ?
<nrg88> i'll get my ass kicked for creating "white" bugreports, and doing stuff just for experimenting
<RAOF> The screencast on the homepage makes it look quite a lot like it's trying to make up for the lack of the Debian BTS's web-interface
<nrg88> the apport makers and launchpad integrators know how launchpad works
<imbrandon> nrg88, there is a interface you can do that in, ask in #launchpad
<nrg88> ok
<nrg88> thanks
<nrg88> maybe it will become a feisty+1 feature :)
<Fujitsu> nrg88: staging.launchpad.net is on a database designed for stuffing around in.
<Fujitsu> nrg88: staging
<Fujitsu> *staging's DB is copied from the normal one daily, so is good to work with.
<imbrandon> heya Fujitsu 
<Fujitsu> Hi imbrandon.
<nrg88> thanks, i'll download the reportbug-ng source, and see what i can do with sub-minimal C knolege ;)
<imbrandon> its python and gtk iirc
<imbrandon> not C
<nrg88> hm, it's in QT3
<nrg88> "Some features I'm planning to implement: Porting R-NG from qt3 to qt4..."
<superm1> hey imbrandon there was some chatter earlier regarding regular 0.20-fixes updates for myth in the interim.  i'm mocking together a script that will hopefully sit on your mythbuntu server and run weekly to rebuild debs automatically from a checkout
<superm1> like between feisty and feisty+1 release for those that wanted it
<imbrandon> nice
<imbrandon> sounds like the script i'm working on for kde4 snapshots
<imbrandon> and koffice2 and konversation snapshots
<superm1> its pretty straightforward thus far, svn co, copy over the debian directory, increment versions, build source packages, clean up, and kick off the work into pbuilder
<superm1> only thing is, can gpg-agent work off this for signing them?
<imbrandon> if its an auto build you probably dont wanna sign it with your own key
<TheMuso> Where can one find out more info about staging?
<imbrandon> like the autobuilds me and seveas use we use a seperate key
<superm1> k
<imbrandon> TheMuso, there really isnt much info aobut it other than #launchpad
<superm1> but the passphrase for the key is cacheable?
<TheMuso> imbrandon: righto
<superm1> even when ran from cron jobs
<imbrandon> superm1, the auto key dosent have a passphrase since its not trusted
<superm1> ah
<imbrandon> sides you realy dont have to sign the debs at all, just build with -us -uc and sign the repo ( with like falcon )
<superm1> is it the same key that you sign the falcon repo with too then, or you just use yours for that instead?
<superm1> i guess i'm overly accustomed to signing debs now :)
<imbrandon> well since its automated you realy dont want it to be 100% "trusted" anyhow
<imbrandon> :)
<superm1> good point
<superm1> to that effect, any news with regarding to connection to the server as of yet?
<imbrandon> yea its just a matter of us getting time at work to put the new switch in , get a core drop done and power run to the new rack
<imbrandon> the servers are all ready, infact i put the last one in place tonight
<superm1> cool, vg
<Fujitsu> Which new servers are these?
<imbrandon> Fujitsu, one is for ubuntuwire.com ( the ldap server ) one is for mythbuntu that i promised them
<Fujitsu> Ah.
<imbrandon> and there is now room for a amd64 and a sparc localy
<imbrandon> :)
<RAOF> Huzzah!  More people checking AMD64 builds!
<Fujitsu> Huzzah, ability to debug AMD64 stuff!
<Fujitsu> Although I probably should get myself a new machine soon, especially with the large reduction in Athlon X2 prices recently.
<TheMuso> Fujitsu: Core2 duo doesn't appeal?
<Fujitsu> Can't say I ever really liked Intel.
<Fujitsu> Aren't that somewhat more expensive, too?
<Fujitsu> \
<TheMuso> Ah ok.
<TheMuso> Dunno. Haven't been keeping up with prices.
<RAOF> Not on the price/performance ratio, from memory.
* Fujitsu checks.
<superm1> Fujitsu, the Core2's are mighty fast from all the reviews i've been reading.  and worth their buck
<Fujitsu> Seems I should be looking at them instead, then.
<superm1> something along the lines of a 1.67 Core2 having >= performance of a 2.0 Core
<imbrandon> right now the for the price the intels are the way to go, and they are out preforming the amds
<TheMuso> The only reason why I'd get a new CPU atm is for 64-bit dev work, which I can't entirely justify. The hardware I have at present does me fine for what I do.
<imbrandon> i have some pent-d dual core 3.0 ghz boxen at home that smoke the amd64 4200+ i have upstairs
<imbrandon> i mean the intels litterly get up off the desk and run circles arround the amd's
<imbrandon> :)
<superm1> which doesn't bode well for AMD.  they're already in the dog house for me with all this ATI business....
<imbrandon> i used to be a amd fanboi , untill about 6 months ago
<superm1> what changed it for you?
<imbrandon> then i re-examined the landscape
* TheMuso has never owned an AMD CPU.
<imbrandon> superm1, pure preformance, i payed $100 for the dual core 3.0ghz pentium-d's and it littlerly smoked the hell out of the two "better" amd's i had
<TheMuso> imbrandon: The core2s are better than that CPU though aren't they?
<superm1> TheMuso, much better
<imbrandon> pent-d and core2 == about the same , both > core
<superm1> imbrandon, you sure?
<imbrandon> yes
<TheMuso> I thought core2 was less power hungry.
<superm1> thats what i heard too
<imbrandon> TheMuso, yea i'm talkin preformance
<TheMuso> Right.
<imbrandon> not power
<imbrandon> i could honestly care less about power consumption personaly
<superm1> http://www.bcchardware.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=2869&Itemid=40
<superm1> thats one that comes to mind
<imbrandon> superm1, thats quite old comparing to the 805, i have a pent-d 930 and thats the bottom now
<superm1> ah yes, that is Aug 2006
<imbrandon> but as i said anyhow "about the same" , and both are still much better than the plain "core"
<imbrandon> and TONS TONS better than the amd64s
* superm1 is getting tired.  time for bed.  night all
<imbrandon> gnight
<TheMuso> Night superm1.
<Fujitsu> Intel has some nice affordable processors, like the QX6700. The RRP of that is only AU$2,029.00.
<RAOF> Anyone feel like checking a debdiff that should fix a high importance bug with 70 duplicates?  It's attached to bug #81798
<ubotu> Malone bug 81798 in democracyplayer "[apport]  democracyplayer crashed with TypeError in __new__()" [High,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/81798
<KenSentMe> RAOF, it's a feisty bug is it
<RAOF> Yup.
<KenSentMe> I'm waiting for the backport to be fixed on edgy, i don't run feisty yet
<RAOF> It's not broken on edgy, is it?
<KenSentMe> RAOF, the backport is. At least on my system
<RAOF> It shouldn't be, it's the python2.5 transition (and the DBUS api) that breaks it.
<RAOF> KenSentMe: Hm.  Does running "LD_LIBRARY_PATH=/usr/bin/firefox democracyplayer" work?
<KenSentMe> i'll try
<jml> RAOF: is that a known bug in Python 2.4?
<jml> or DBUS or wherever?
<RAOF> No, it's not a bug in DBUS.  They were using non-public API that got deprecated, then removed
<dholbach> good morning
<RAOF> Good evening :)
<KenSentMe> RAOF, nope, doesn't work. Here is the backport along with the bug report
<KenSentMe> https://bugs.launchpad.net/edgy-backports/+bug/80237
<ubotu> Malone bug 80237 in edgy-backports "Please backport Democracy TV to Edgy" [Undecided,Fix released]  
<dholbach> hey RAOF
<jml> RAOF: segfaulting on older Python doesn't sound like a packaging bug to me.
<RAOF> jml: What segfaulting on older python?  It doesn't properly link to the firefox libs, and segfaults on whatever version of python you want to run it on.
<jml> ahh.
<RAOF> Unless you have /usr/lib/firefox in your LDPATH
<jml> "spawn subprocesses with python2.5 rather than python2.4, since
<jml> +      libboost-python will segfault with anything else"
<RAOF> Oh, that bit.
<RAOF> Yeah, libboost-python is *only* built for python2.5, but doesn't fail to import in python2.4, it just segfaults.
<jml> that sucks.
<RAOF> Oh, yes.  There's probably a bug to be filed there.
<jml> anyway, that's the first debdiff I've looked at. interesting.
<RAOF> Now, be a MOTU and upload it :)
<KenSentMe> RAOF, i want to test the debdiff in a vm, but that install hasn't been updated for a while. Sadly i don't want to take up all the bandwith here. Do i need to update other packages than the python 2.4 and 2.5 ?
<RAOF> Um, it needs firefox-dev, I'm not sure whether that's in Edgy or not.
<RAOF> I don't know if it requires anything else.
<KenSentMe> I run feisty in VMWare
<RAOF> If you run Feisty, it shouldn't require you to update anything at all.
<KenSentMe> RAOF, sorry for the nooby questions, but how do i run/use the debdiff
<RAOF> Let me grab the wiki...
<RAOF> KenSentMe: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuPackagingGuide/BuildFromDebdiff?highlight=%28debdiff%29
<KenSentMe> Ok, i'll have a look
<KenSentMe> The network here isn't all that. Installing build-essential etc. takes me more than 10 mins
<\sh> moins
<Fujitsu> Hi \sh.
<danohuiginn> I'm trying to make a python module work with python2.5
<danohuiginn> do I need to add python2.5-modulename to provides/conflicts/replaces?
<danohuiginn> or is that just if there was once a version-specific module
<Fujitsu> Are you following the new Python policy?
<danohuiginn> Fujitsu: I'm not sure. Should I be?
<Fujitsu> Definitely, otherwise the package has no chance of being accepted.
<danohuiginn> Fujitsu: it's an existing package I'm fixing
<Fujitsu> Ah.
<Fujitsu> Which?
<danohuiginn> elementtree. bug 104184
<ubotu> Malone bug 104184 in elementtree "please build elementtree for python2.5" [Undecided,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/104184
<geser> isn't either python-support or python-central adding the versioned python-modules in p/c/r?
<Fujitsu> Bah, how nice of them to make it our problem as of 15 hours ago.
<Fujitsu> There's a fixed bug on the Debian package about the policy transition, but it seems to have not been done properly.
<Fujitsu> Oh, I see that it's rather special.
<Fujitsu> That should be properly fixed for Feisty+1 (ie. the dependents should be modified)
<Fujitsu> danohuiginn: You won't need the extra Provides/Conflicts/Replaces.
<danohuiginn> thanks, Fujitsu
<Fujitsu> That'll make it a one character change, won't it? (excluding changelog/maintainer changes)
<danohuiginn> also, you think I should set the maintainer to MOTU? or as core until it's actually moved to universe?
<Fujitsu> It is in universe now.
<Fujitsu> It was moved there about 15 hours ago.
<danohuiginn> ah, OK
<KenSentMe> RAOF, i tried the debdiff and it works fine
<RAOF> Ta, thanks for the comment.
<sacater> imbrandon: on this council meeting, shall i bring irc convos of people ive helped into it?
<geser> sacater: if you have a fan base bring them to the cc meeting
<sacater> geser: well, this is more of a newbie i helped with a few file permissions
<sacater> i have 2 for a fanclub
<sacater> atm
<geser> can somebody reproduce bug #99470?
<ubotu> Malone bug 99470 in apache "I could not install apache" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/99470
<geser> it seems to kill the build of libembperl-perl on i386 and amd64
<geser> but the package builds fine in my amd64 pbuilder
<imbrandon> sacater, nah i wouldent worry about irc logs
<imbrandon> just your fan club
<imbrandon> when is the meeting ?
<sacater> erm
<sacater> 17th
<sacater> at 8
<sacater> pm
<imbrandon> CST ?
<sacater> UTC
<imbrandon> ahh ok
<sacater> you still coming
<imbrandon> i'll try may darndest, if i cant make it i'll send an email to the CC
<sacater> ?
<sacater> okies
<sacater> thanks
<Mez> how can i make it so when I upgrade It keeps a package at the version It's currently at ? 
<Mez> (I had to re-build it for jack support)
<ajmitch> man apt_preferences
<Mez> I thought you could only pin against distros with thaT?
<ajmitch> nope
<ajmitch> examples show otherwise
<ajmitch> you could do aptitude hold, but apt-get ignores those
<TheMuso> Mez: What package?
<geser> ajmitch: what abould dpkg --set-selections? does apt-get ignore them too?
<ajmitch> geser: I haven't tried
<Mez> TheMuso, libasound2-plugins
<danohuiginn> thanks for the upload, geser
<TheMuso> Mez: Oh ok
<DarkSun88> Hi all
<TheMuso> Hey DarkSun88.
<DarkSun88> TheMuso: Hi :)
<TheMuso> Ooo debian unstable is going to have tetex breakage.
<TheMuso> Which means we are likely to also get it.
<DarkMageZ> mmhmm. going to be fun.
<TheMuso> Oh yeah.
<shawarma> What sort of breakage?
<DarkMageZ> they're moving to tetex-live right?
<TheMuso> DarkSun88: SOmething like that.
<shawarma> We've already done most of that.
<TheMuso> sorry, DarkMageZ 
<Fujitsu> tetex-live? Nice hybrid.
<shawarma> Most things depending on tetex-* now depends on tetex-* | texlive-*
<Fujitsu> Is tetex going to be removed?
<shawarma> Fujitsu: Hopefully. :-)
<Fujitsu> Good, good.
<StevenK> Why?
<Fujitsu> Not too much stuff exclusively depends on it.
<shawarma> 1) It's crap 2) it's unmaintained crap 3) it's crap
<Fujitsu> tetex has been dead upstream for a while.
<shawarma> did I mention it's crap?
* StevenK hugs contex
<shawarma> contex? wtf?
<Fujitsu> contex? I've dealt with texlive, miktex, tetex, but not contex.
<StevenK> Oops, it's context
<ScottK> TheMuso: Thanks again for the patch system lesson last night.  I've also sent the patch to Debian.
<TheMuso> ScottK: Cool.
<ScottK> xtknight: Nevermind what I said last night about your bip fix not being complete.  I don't know what I was thinking.  It worked just fine.
<jekil> hello
<Hobbsee> hiya
<imbrandon> ello
<zul> has anyone noticed that the motu council meeting and the development team meeting is on at the same time?
<zul> hi by the way
<imbrandon> zul, iirc the MC meetings are cancled in favor of just MOTU meetings
<Adri2000> there is no MC meeting planned
<Adri2000> 12 Apr 20:00: MOTU | 12 Apr 20:00: Development Team | 12 Apr 21:00: Ubuntu Development Team
<Adri2000> but there is something wrong with the devel team meeting
<zul> imbrandon: cool according to the topic on #u-meeting is at the same time
<geser> didn't the dev meeting got moved to 19:00 utc?
<zul> maybe im just confused and out of date with other priorities *shrug*
<geser> argh, the tb meeting was going be one hour earlier
<AnAnt> Hello, which package is responsible for scancodes ?
<ScottK> AnAnt: Universe packages are maintained by the whole MOTU team.  What's your question.
<AnAnt> ScottK: I ran showkey -m now on both Edgy & Feisty
<AnAnt> ScottK: I found that some key combinations (for example CTRL+ALT+O) have different scan codes on Edgy & Feisty
<AnAnt> ScottK: on Edgy it gives: keycode 7 release, on Feisty it gives:
<AnAnt> keycode  66 release
<AnAnt> keycode  32 release
<AnAnt> ScottK: I wanted to know why is that 
<ScottK> What locale are you using?
<AnAnt> ScottK: en_US.UTF-8
<AnAnt> Hello, which package is responsible for scancodes ? I ran showkey -m now on both Edgy & Feisty, I found that some key combinations (for example CTRL+ALT+O) have different scan codes on Edgy & Feisty
<AnAnt> oops
<AnAnt> sorry
<ScottK> AnAnt: I think it's langpack-locales
<TheMuso> AnAnt: I would advise you to not ask/post any thing in -devel unless it is related to the feisty rc release/final release.
<StevenK> AnAnt: For Ctrl-Alt-O I get 27/15 on both Edgy and Feisty.
<TheMuso> How do you test for this kind of stuff?
<StevenK> TheMuso: showkeys
<AnAnt> TheMuso: showkey -m
<ScottK> IIRC AnAnt has a broken universe package he's hoping to fix.
<ScottK> AnAnt: ^^^  These guys know way more than I do.
<TheMuso> AnAnt: I don't know. Please keep our response in the same channel that I talked to you.
<AnAnt> TheMuso: sorry, I got mixed up
<AnAnt> ScottK: you still remember ;)
* StevenK has forgotten the name of it.
<AnAnt> StevenK: acon
<AnAnt> ok, I'll try playing with /etc/default/console-setup
<AnAnt> br
<AnAnt> brb
<AnAnt> ok, SOLVED !
<ScottK> ?
<AnAnt> changed CHARMAP="ISO-8859-1" in /etc/default/console-setup
<AnAnt> so acon is working after all !
<bddebian> Heya gang
<xtknight> hey
<xtknight> ready to triage/fix more bugs today..
<bddebian> xtknight: Nah, I don't do anything :-(
<geser> Hi bddebian
<geser> xtknight: don't believe him, he only needs good poking
<xtknight> <tunnelvision> need more coffee
<bddebian> Heya geser
<shawarma> I forget. do universe uploads "just work" right now or do I need to poke Mithrandir?
<geser> they are on manual
<geser> you need to poke an archive admin
<bddebian> Doh
<crimsun> I've just been uploading and letting them filter through at the admins' discretion
<crimsun> I'm not terribly worried, since feisty+1's due to open $soon
<bddebian> Gabby Goat?
<bddebian> :-)
<bddebian> Grumpy Gnu, boy would that be funny!
<joejaxx> bddebian: lol haha
<ScottK> Golden Gopher
* ScottK has lived in Minnesota, USA
<xtknight> grizzly gorilla
<crimsun> the land of 10k lakes. I worked for a spell in MN.
<shawarma> Gassy gerbil
<crimsun> fun times
<xtknight> lol
<joejaxx> lol
<joejaxx> Graceful Gazelle
<xtknight> too touchy feely
<xtknight> only animal i know that starts with G is gorilla though so bleh
<joejaxx> <something here> Gazelle
<joejaxx> :P
<xtknight> Growly Gazelle
<xtknight> kind of paradoxical 
<xtknight> maybe it implies that the impossible will happen
<lupine_85> Goggled Gimp ?
<joejaxx> Gallant Gazelle
<nixternal> Gentle Giraffe - but don't tell anyone that I told you
<xtknight> hah ugh
<nixternal> haha
<joejaxx> nixternal: its in the logs now :Phaha
<nixternal> it has to be an animal that can't defend itself on its own, but only with its community
<xtknight> Growly Gremlin
<joejaxx> a gazelle :)
<highvoltage> Gray Giraffe?
<nixternal> actually, a Warthog could defend itself, and depending on the type of badger it could also defend itself
<joejaxx> nixternal: but a fawn could not
<xtknight> a feisty one could
<Nafallo> lol
<joejaxx> xtknight: lol
<nixternal> joejaxx: but the fawns community could help keep it safe
<Nafallo> it's this time again :-)
* lupine_85 avoids proprietary software takeover jokes
<joejaxx> nixternal: yes
<xtknight> feisty+2=howling hyena
<geser> isn't G already used for Grumpy Groundhog?
<ScottK> OK, if you must.... hiccuping horsefly
<joejaxx> geser: yeah
<nixternal> hahaha
<nixternal> ScottK: I love it!
<nixternal> hurry up and send that mdz and sabdfl
<joejaxx> lol imagine that
<joejaxx> download the new ubuntu release: Hiccuping Horesefly
<joejaxx> Horsefly*
<ScottK> nixternal: Go ahead and send it.  Don't feel like you have to credit me.
<Nafallo> no, I DON'T want to upload to hiccuping :-)
<Nafallo> more than a bit to obscure :-P
<joejaxx> nixternal: you actually send it to them?
<lupine_85> not happy hippo ?
<bddebian> Hungry Hungry Hippo
<joejaxx> Hungry Hippos?
<lupine_85> that too :D. great game
<zul> i think hungry hippos is copyrighted
<geser> "crispy calamari" if we were at 'C'
<bddebian> I've made an executive decision and it's going to be Grumpy Gnu damnit!
<joejaxx> Lol
<joejaxx> who do you send the names to?
<tsmithe> bddebian, who put you in charge?
<xtknight>  /dev/null
<tsmithe> someone run !names
<tsmithe> i'm banned
<bddebian> tsmithe: I did :)
<xtknight> secret hack in ubuntu
<tsmithe> joejaxx, look in the link in there
<tsmithe> xtknight, hah
<bddebian> !names
<ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about names - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
<tsmithe> !name maybe
<bddebian> !name
<ubotu> Ubuntu has awesome release codenames. See http://wiki.ubuntu.com/DevelopmentCodeNames for more
<xtknight> what if feisty+2 had "Human" in it
<xtknight> scary
<tsmithe> yep :)
<bddebian> Horny Human?
<joejaxx> Hopeful Human
<xtknight> Hiccuping Human..
<joejaxx> Hopeful Humanity
<tsmithe> Human Human
<xtknight> Homeless Human
<danohuiginn> Human Horse?
<lupine_85> hairy human!
<tsmithe> and anyway, it's going to be I... I...
<bddebian> Hopeless Humans
<tsmithe> Hoary took I
<joejaxx> <quote>You send 'em, we'll consider 'em.</quote>
<joejaxx> send them where? lol
<tsmithe> to the page
<tsmithe> mailto:wiki.ubuntu.com/DevelopmentCodeNames
<tsmithe> duh!
<xtknight> Immune Iguana ? 
<Nafallo> gaah
<Nafallo> how many releases are you guys planning? :-)
* bddebian should have never brought it up :)
<xtknight> what happened to ubuntu 1.00?
<tsmithe> there is no month 00
<joejaxx> xtknight: it is based on the year and month
<tsmithe> nor did ubuntu exist in 2001
<xtknight>  ahh
<Lutin> hi there
<Lutin> I've noticed that wxgtk2.4 was still built using python2.4 instead of python2.5. do you think it's worth updating it and 5-6 packages that depends on it, or do we just let it as it is ?
<ScottK> At this point it sounds scary either way to me.
<Lutin> ScottK: heh :/
<ScottK> I'd tend to leave it if no one has complained/filed bugs.
<Lutin> that's what I'd do as well
<Hobbsee> heh, crispy calamari
<Hobbsee> i'd leave it by now, too
<Nafallo> c is a LONG way :-)
* Hobbsee could just redo the alphabet...
<Nafallo> :-)
<pygi> siretart, there is a pending discussion (AFAIK) of including libburn+cdrskin as part of cdrkit =)
<siretart> sound even better. I haven't noticed any discussion about this on debburn-devel, though
<pygi> I know :P
<pygi> ofcourse libburn+cdrskin would remain upstream to cdrkit
<pygi> me & thomas also have a pending petition to LKML for locking issue
<siretart> this has debburn-devel cc'ed, so I noticed that thread
<pygi> you'll see =)
<pygi> the petition is not there yet
<siretart> pygi: I'd strongly recommend to have some releasable libburn ready early in the feisty+1 cycle. I think we both agree that we want to ship it in the next release
<pygi> siretart, we do already have a releasable libburn? :)
<pygi> However we did agree on releasing 0.3.5 over the weekend?
<pygi> perhaps I can backport some patches from current svn, and fix the soname
<siretart> atm, I'd say no, there isn't a releasable upstream tarball. I don't have a say on you releasing 0.3.5 this weekend, I remember you promised that release weeks ago ;)
<pygi> how come there is no releaseable tarball? :P
<pygi> what did I miss? :)
<pygi> true, true =)
<pygi> siretart, but that's why I've got java bindings for libisofs & libburn :P
<siretart> the current tarballs has soname 4, and you told me that you want to change that to soname 3 in the next version
<pygi> siretart, yup, in .5
<pygi> will do that =)
<siretart> this makes it a perfect non-candidate for uploading it anywhere
<dholbach> why to 3?
<pygi> dholbach, 0.3.x
<pygi> dholbach, I guess :P
<siretart> dholbach: because the bump was an accident and not intended
<dholbach> aha
<siretart> I could change it locally though, but that would confuse ppl even harder
<pygi> dholbach, aka /me not too familiar with autotools :P
<dholbach> normally people bump the soname if interfaces break
<siretart> and pygi promised me a quick 0.3.5 release very short after the 0.3.4 release
<pygi> well, interfaces break all the time :-/
<pygi> I can promise stable api only after 1.0
<dholbach> and don't go from 4 back to 3 again because it matches the tarball version number
<dholbach> but oh well, I can live with that :)
<siretart> pygi: err, I think we do miscommunicate here
<siretart> pygi: did you change ABI/API from 0.3.4 to 0.3.5?
<pygi> siretart, exactly nothing will be changed between 0.3.4 and 0.3.5 except the soname
<siretart> and how about 0.3.3 to 0.3.4? has there been any ABI or API breakage?
<siretart> or other way round: do we need to ensure that applications need to be recompiled?
<pygi> there was 0.3.2 --> 0.3.4 ... probably some, yes
<siretart> aha, so you have no choice, and you MUST bump the soname
<pygi> nobody used that stuff anyway :P
<siretart> sorry, that's no excuse
<pygi> I know
<siretart> you're a very difficult upstream, you know?
<pygi> heh
* pygi is sorry, he's trying as much as he can
<pygi> siretart, joerg is easier? :)
<siretart> which one?
<pygi> well, the cdrecord one or any other :p
<pygi> But basically I get the point, I should be quiet =)
<siretart> being quite doesn't make things easier
<siretart> I knew that I should touch any cd-writing tools :/
<siretart> that I shouldn't touch, that is
<pygi> heh, that bad?
* pygi is off :(
<pwnguin> so my LUG had an idea and im not sure where best to bring it up. they were thinking about leaving an ubuntu disc in every dorm room before the freshmen class arrived
* jdong wonders how easy it is to hack PXE to add Ubuntu to MITNet PXE boot...
<ScottK> pwnguin: Probably #ubuntu-marketing
<pwnguin> good idea
<tsmithe> does debian sync new packages from ubuntu?
* tsmithe is going out. feel free to answer though
<tonyyarusso> tsmithe: Sometimes they take bugfixes etc back from Ubuntu, but as I understand it, they have their own new package inclusion process, which is linked to from the Ubuntu Packaging Guide or somewhere - hold on
<tsmithe> tonyyarusso, but we auto-sync from them... why can't they sync from us? maybe it would stop some of the complaints of giving back work...
<tonyyarusso> tsmithe:  I don't know why they don't - I just don't think they do.
* tonyyarusso could also be wrong
<tsmithe> it's silly if they don't
<poningru> no wai
<ScottK> They are upstream.  We are downstream.  Any Ubuntu specific package is going to have to be modified for Debian.  Sync back up wouldn't work.
<poningru> but the purity of debian will be ruined
<tsmithe> ScottK, why wouldn't it work?
<ScottK> Note that Ubuntu is upstream for a number of distros and doesn't sync from them either.
<tsmithe> what if the packager just preferred working for ubuntu, and there's not necessarily anything ubuntu-specific in it
<tsmithe> ?
<ScottK> MEPIS for one.
<ScottK> tsmithe: Debian has rules about who and how to contribute.
<tonyyarusso> tsmithe: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ContributingToDebian?highlight=%28CategoryMOTU%29
<tsmithe> yes i know they do
<ScottK> There are ways for non-DD to contribute.
<ScottK> See mentors.debian.org.
<tsmithe> i know that too
<tsmithe> it's just silly when they could do it automagically
<ScottK> Is it silly that they have an approval process for who can have access to their repositories?
<tsmithe> no
<tsmithe> is it silly we sync from debian?
<tsmithe> no
<tsmithe> cos not all DDs are Ubuntu-devs
<tsmithe> but, yes, they are upstream, indeed
<ScottK> No, but they have a lot broader concerns that Ubuntu does.  Go look at how many archs Debian supports.
<tsmithe> true, true
<tsmithe> anyhow, i'm going out now - thanks for the answers :)
<lupine_85> wow. Launchpad got ugly.
<bddebian> Yep :-)
<ScottK> Ugly and still slow.  Ugly and fast I'd be good with.
<bddebian> heh
<Nafallo> anyone know where nvu went? :-)
<Adri2000> /dev/null
<jdong> Nafallo: </nvu>
<ScottK> Nafallo: Abandoned upstream and removed from Debian - this is the why for what Adri2000 said.
<Nafallo> ah, thanks :-)
<tonyyarusso> !nvu | Nafallo, jdong, ScottK 
<ubotu> Nafallo, jdong, ScottK: nvu is a WYSIWYG and code dual-function HTML editor for easily creating web pages.  The original developer is working on a full rewrite; meanwhile, another is doing bugfixes.  It is not the Ubuntu repos for Feisty Fawn, but ping tonyyarusso to inquire about packages.  See also !html.
<jdong> :)
<tonyyarusso> There will be packages of nvu built, either under the Nvu or KompoZer names.
<Nafallo> :-)
<Nafallo> KompoZer? KDE?
<tonyyarusso> Nafallo: Nope, just a play on "Composer"
<Nafallo> :-)
<jdong>  Nafallo: no, that's for ZDE... which is an abstraction over many desktop environments....
<jdong> also known as KDE5
<Nafallo> *shrugs*
<tonyyarusso> Ahem, I am hereby making noise about bug 105614 - any ideas?
<ubotu> Malone bug 105614 in Ubuntu "[feisty]  Flash site only partially loads" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/105614
<ScottK> tonyyarusso: Don't use Flash because it's evil?
<tonyyarusso> ScottK: Not my web site.  Given the choice, I agree :)
<Nafallo> tonyyarusso: webmaster@... ;-)
<tonyyarusso> Nafallo: I can't browse the site to find a contact link if one exists...
<ScottK> tonyyarusso: Just send to webmaster@ the domain.  It should, in theory, work (RFC something or other).
<tonyyarusso> probably
<Nafallo> if it doesn't DDOS THEM!
<Nafallo> ;-)
<tonyyarusso> anyone want to check out http://www.specialized.com/ and see if it has a nice contact thingy?
<tonyyarusso> Meanwhile, someone fix my issue in Ubuntu :P
<DarkSun88> Any universe sponsor?
<dholbach> DarkSun88: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SponsorshipProcess
<ScottK> tonyyarusso: Couldn't find one.
<DarkSun88> dholbach: Thank you.
<dholbach> np
<DarkSun88> dholbach: Can you so kind to check this bug? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libphp-phplayersmenu/+bug/96376
<ubotu> Malone bug 96376 in libphp-phplayersmenu "[UNMETDEPS]  libphp-phplayersmenu has unmet dependencies" [Undecided,Confirmed]  
<dholbach> i'd prefer if you'd ask somebody else - I'm testing release candidate CDs and looking into fixing a bug
<DarkSun88> Ah ok, thanks
<Joe_CoT> get-orig-source rule for debian/rules. Anyone done it before?
<tonyyarusso> ScottK: 'k
<danohuiginn> DarkSun88: do you know that the package works OK with php5?
<DarkSun88> danohuiginn: I check the packages and are ok
<xtknight> why was this bug closed?  bug 105263
<ubotu> Malone bug 105263 in kvm "[feisty]  kvm depends of kvm-api-9 but that package is uninstallable" [Undecided,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/105263
<xtknight> the last comment doesnt even make any sense
<xtknight> never mind, guess my email hadnt been updated
<xtknight> they marked it open again
<cypherbios> hi all
<cypherbios> Someone could tell me if is the Universe in freeze right now?
<xtknight> tomorrow
<cypherbios> Is it described somewhere?
<cypherbios> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FeistyReleaseSchedule >> There is no mention here, I guess
<xtknight> not sure that's what i've heard
<xtknight> !\ ReleaseCandidate, /!\ LanguagePackTranslationDeadline 
<xtknight> i think it's the same day as that
<cypherbios> and after the RC, will universe still in freeze until the Final Release?
<Adri2000> yes
<gnomefreak> universe freeze was a while ago i thought
<Adri2000> UVF and FF yes
<Adri2000> RC freeze is tomorrow
<gnomefreak> ~1 month or so ago
<gnomefreak> yep
<gnomefreak> no
<gnomefreak> we have been frozen for rc for a week now since 6 was cancelled
<cypherbios> so nobody (with common permission) can upload anything to universe right now?
<gnomefreak> cypherbios: needs a manual push once uploaded
<xtknight> hm well i know some fixes were uploaded to universe just yesterday
<xtknight> ahh
<cypherbios> Seems I need to file a bug https://launchpad.net/~motu-uvf/+assignedbugs is it correct?
<Adri2000> cypherbios: you want a new upstream version?
* gnomefreak assumed he meant a bug fix
<cypherbios> Adri2000: is from a 0.1-RC-0ubuntu1 to 0.1-0ubuntu1
<pygi> mvo, I could use you at #duplicate-resolution at slashnet. LH needs a word with you (or any mentor for that purpose)
<Adri2000> cypher1: too late
<Adri2000> sorry, cypherbios ^
<mvo> pygi: ok - timing is not ideal, I'm in the middle of heavy testing
<mvo> pygi: slashnet.net? 
<pygi> mvo, yup
<pygi> mvo, ergh , .org
<pygi> mvo, well, I can't catch any other mentor
<giskard> hi pygi 
<pygi> giskard!!
<cypherbios> Adri2000: and if it was just a 0ubuntu1 to 0ubuntu2?
<Adri2000> not too late until tomorrow
<cypherbios> some important bug fixes have been made in this package/application that must be on universe until the final release
<geser> cypherbios: which package is it?
<cypherbios> geser: aptoncd is the package
<geser> how big is the diff?
<cypherbios> geser: since the last upload... not so much, but the fixes it incorporates and translations updates (~10 complete languages since the last upload) I consider important to ubuntu users get with the Feisty's final release
<cypherbios> geser: I'm talking with mvo right now, who will sponsor the upload if allowed
<pygi> mr_pouit, poke
<mr_pouit> pygi: yes?
<pygi> mr_pouit, I'll need you for the weekend, will you be available? We need to draft the plan of tackling the cdrecording issues
<pygi> mr_pouit, plan is to get rid of 75% of bugs by october
<mr_pouit> pygi: I think I'll ba available
<mr_pouit> be*
<pygi> mr_pouit, that's great =) We'll need to see what can be reproduced, what can't, close bugs, and write patches
<pygi> I estimate 90% of current cdrecord bugs will be closed by one package upload :)
<pygi> guess which one :P
<mr_pouit> ;p
<mr_pouit> I've done this for brasero only at the moment :] 
<pygi> you've done what? :P
<pygi> brasero supports new libburn so it has no bugs =)
<pygi> well, svn version at least :P
<mr_pouit> pygi: reproducing/forwarding bugs ^^
<pygi> ah!
<pygi> right =)
<mr_pouit> that's too late for feisty though... =)
<pygi> well, feisty+1 :)
<pygi> patience ;)
<mr_pouit> ^^
<cypherbios> geser: any chance?
<ajmitch> morning
<ScottK> Morning.
* ajmitch is sure he has a hard drive that's going to die soonish
<ScottK> Got backups?
<ajmitch> not really
<ajmitch> it takes a bit to backup a few hundred GB
<ScottK> This does not sound like the road to happiness...
<ajmitch> no
<ajmitch> true, the most important stuff is on RAID 5
<ajmitch> but that'll only survive 1 disk failing
<ajmitch> (out of 3 that I have)
<pygi> ajmitch, use libburn =)
<ajmitch> pygi: no thanks
<pygi> ehm, ...
<ScottK> ajmitch: http://ars.userfriendly.org/cartoons/?id=20070411
<ajmitch> haha
<ScottK> ajmitch: Also, the MOTU/Python team wiki says to contact you to join.  I'm interested in joining.
<ajmitch> ScottK: ok, I dub thee as a member, congrats
<ajmitch> that's it ;)
<ScottK> OK.  I guess I get to add myself to the wiki then...
<ajmitch> there's no real team
<crimsun> pfft, I'd have expected some sort of hazing at least
<ajmitch> especially as everyone works on python stuff anyway
<ajmitch> crimsun: if you want to do the honours?
* ScottK got the hazing last night from TheMuso over adding a patch system for a one line fix.
<crimsun> I don't think a non-member is supposed to do the hazing ;)
<ajmitch> crimsun: I dub thee as an honourary member, not get hazing
<ajmitch> s/not/now/
<crimsun> :)
<crimsun> let me just conjure hobbsee and her stick
<ajmitch> she's hopefully asleep
* ajmitch looks at how much a new drive (or 3) will cost
<ajmitch> nice, 500GB drives at a reasonable price
<ScottK> ajmitch: What brand?
<ajmitch> samsung
<ScottK> I always warn away from Western Digital (dunno if you get those there).  Every hard drive I've had fail in normal use was a Western Digital.
<ajmitch> yep
<ajmitch> I've probably got a small stack of dead WD drives :)
<ajmitch> last hard drive I had die (160GB) was WD
<welp> what version control system does ubuntu use?
<geser> bzr
<pygi> bzr
<pygi> :)
<welp> 'k
<Nafallo> bazaar
<Nafallo> :-)
<welp> hmm, ubuntu's weird... not keeping stats on cia
<welp> :P
<welp> do you actually keep stats anywhere?
<phanatic> welp: launchpad
<welp> hmmmmmmmmk
<welp> sacater: i expect to see you on the top contributors page one day.
<ajmitch> hm, I can probably safely remove stuff now, like the hoary chroot 
<sacater> welp: i expect you will
<ajmitch> which I used when I was running sid
<bddebian> no way man..
<sacater> welp: im going for membership first
<ScottK> When is end of support for Breezy?  There are a couple of bugs I'm waiting to close...
<welp> bddebian: no way man at what? sacater in the top contributors on launchpad? :P
<ajmitch> ScottK: a few days, I expect
* ScottK is waiting for the announcement.
<bddebian> welp: No, that was for ajmitch removing his hoary chroot 
<ajmitch> ScottK: april 13th :)
<ScottK> Of course.
<ajmitch> so Real Soon Now
<sacater> welp: i am?
<sacater> welp: link me?
<sacater> oh
<sacater> i heareby do accept this great honour etc etc
<sacater> :P
<welp> sacater: no you're nto
<crimsun> visibility is a good thing.
<sacater> hmm
<welp> *not
* ajmitch wishes he could be in the top contributors
<sacater> what where who>?
<sacater> why the link welp?
<bddebian> ajmitch: You are the top contributor honey :-)
<ajmitch> bddebian: no, I don't think I'm on that page
<crimsun> I'm not in the top contributors, and that's ok!
<welp> sacater: i'm one of todays top committers :P
<welp> sacater: take a look at the "most active authors today" section
<sacater> welp: oh, so it does pick me up then
<welp> sacater: it doesn't pick up on you as it doesn't watch ubuntu stuff
<sacater> oh
<sacater> then what was all that about top contributors?
<ajmitch> hey stratus 
<stratus> ajmitch: howdy?
<ajmitch> how's it going?
<stratus> really weird week
<welp> sacater: *sigh* https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+topcontributors
<sacater> welp: i cant see my name?
<welp> no you can't
<jmg> hey my karma got reset to 0
<welp> i never said i could
<welp> poor jmg 
<jmg> *sniff*
<zorglu_> this page doesnt seems to load on konqueror
<zorglu_> oh now it does, just take more than 30sexc
<sacater> welp: how does karma work in gentoo land?
<welp> it doesn't
<welp> :P
<sacater> oh
<sacater> ive got 1417
<sacater> or more
<sacater> methinks
<zorglu_> i read the blog of alan pope and his 'secret' is to answer a lot of question in the forum :)
<sacater> thats true
<sacater> and i d
<sacater> do*
<sacater> got 1000 karma in less than a week
<sacater> eh
<sacater> is that welp or someone else
<sacater> messing with teh welp!
<ThEmAsTeRhUgGeR> 'tis moi :o
<sacater> why change name
<sinisterguy> i'm having a problem with the python-parallel package, when i try to use it, it complains that /dev/parport0 does not exist, but when i modprobe parport, not parport device is created
<welp> sacater: because i'm totally cool and random
<sacater> im gonna get some Q+A karma
<welp> do you know what QA means?
<sacater> hmm
<Seveas> welp, Q+A isn't QA
<welp> what Q+A are you referring to?
<welp> i'm thinking of quality assurance
<bddebian> Q+A == Question and Answer
<welp> aaaah, ok
<Seveas> :)
#ubuntu-motu 2007-04-12
<k001> hi. all
<k001> i try explain my problem, sorry but my english is very bad
<k001> i'm create my first packages .deb for Ubuntu
<k001> i use $dh_make -e my-email -f ../path/to/file
<k001> modify my control, changelog, copyright and rules
<k001> after do $debuild -S
<k001> and the shell tell me this  dpkg-source -b image2html-1.2
<k001> dpkg-source: error: archivo de control debe tener al menos una parte binario del paquete
<k001> debuild: fatal error at line 1224:
<k001> dpkg-source -b image2html-1.2 failed
<Fujitsu> Can you please translate that error message?
<k001> sorry
<k001> this is a translate of google --->  control file must have at least one binary part of the package 
<bddebian> debian/control is missing a binary package section?
<k001> what seccion?
<bddebian> Package: <foo>
<k001> what section?
<bddebian> Or you aren't building one in debian/rules
<k001> this is my control http://pastebin.ca/435336
<bddebian> Yeah, that's the source package.  You need Package: image2html section
<ajmitch> put in a blank line before Package: image2html
<k001> ok
<k001> de image2html section is in line 7
<bddebian> Oh shit, I missed that entirely
<bddebian> Hmm, I thought we had image2html? But I don't see it
<k001> 7.  Package: image2html
<k001> ok is done 
<k001> but i have other error
<k001> the key gpg not found
<bddebian> Do you have a gpg key?
<k001> yes
<bddebian> Make sure your changelog entry matches
<k001> let me a second
<k001> this is my changelog image2html (1.2-1) unstable; urgency=low
<k001>   * Initial release
<k001>  -- Ivan Alfredo Zenteno Aguilar <k001.operator@gmail.com>  Wed, 11 Apr 2007 16:55:08 -0500
<bddebian> Is k001.operator@gmail.com valid for your gpg key?
<k001> yes
<k001> check in keyserv
<bddebian> Hmm
<Fujitsu> Does your key have a comment set?
<k001> http://keyserv.nic-se.se:11371/pks/lookup?op=index&search=0x815adebd
<k001> this is y key
<Fujitsu> That's the problem.
<Fujitsu> The comment has to match exactly too.
<k001> the log say 'gpg: [stdin] : clearsign failed: key secret not avalible 
<k001> debsign: gpg error occurred!  Aborting....
<k001> debuild: fatal error at line 1151:
<k001> running debsign failed
<Fujitsu> The line in the changelog needs to match one of the IDs on the key, including the comment.
<k001> how to do?
<k001> sorry 
<k001> is my first packages
<Fujitsu> `Ivan A. Zenteno Aguilar (Mi gmail) <k001.operator@gmail.com>' is what you should be using in the changelog.
<bddebian> Later folks
<k001> no, i only got  one error
<k001> the private key not found
<k001> let me a second for to paste the debian/control debian/changelog  
<k001> debian/control http://pastebin.ca/435418
<k001> sorry is changelog
<k001> this is the control :d http://pastebin.ca/435425
<k001> this is the log http://pastebin.ca/435442
<xtknight> bug 105706
<ubotu> Malone bug 105706 in Ubuntu "`GCC_4.2.0' not found (required by /usr/lib/libstdc+) libgcc_s.so.1: version `GCC_4.2.0' not found (required by /usr/lib/libstdc++.so.6)" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/105706
<xtknight> hmm darwinia isnt in repos
<TheMuso> bug bug 100021
<TheMuso> hmm ok. Ubotu suddenly died.
<xtknight> bug 100021
<ubotu> Malone bug 100021 in network-manager "[Feisty]  LTSP fails on multi-homed server due to network manager touching predefined static interfaces" [Undecided,Fix released]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/100021
<xtknight> ;
<xtknight> ;)
<TheMuso> interesting.
<TheMuso> gah I typed it wrong. :)
<k001> ok mrs. bye bye readyou tomorrow bye
<TheMuso> !test
<ubotu> Failed.
<xtknight> bug 105683
<ubotu> Malone bug 105683 in Ubuntu "Certain  eybord  eys do not wor ." [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/105683
<xtknight> lol..
<xtknight> weird
<xtknight> he was able to type K in the body but not the summary..
<xtknight> bug 105664
<ubotu> Malone bug 105664 in Ubuntu "ctrl+alt+backspace logs out, even when the logout shortcut is disabled via prefences->keyboard shortcuts" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/105664
<xtknight> ok this one is a bit silly
<xtknight> what should be done with this?  close the bug since the behavior is by design?
<bimberi> xtknight: I've rejected it - with instructions on how to disable c-a-b.
<xtknight> bimberi, and what about bug 105706 where he uses a third party game?
<ubotu> Malone bug 105706 in Ubuntu "`GCC_4.2.0' not found (required by /usr/lib/libstdc+) libgcc_s.so.1: version `GCC_4.2.0' not found (required by /usr/lib/libstdc++.so.6)" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/105706
<Fujitsu> xtknight: That should be rejected, as the game ships a strange libgcc_s.so.1
<xtknight> Fujitsu, doh, how do you close a bug?
<bimberi> yes it's not an _Ubuntu_ bug
<bimberi> xtknight: click on "Ubuntu" under "Affects"
<Fujitsu> xtknight: Click on the package name under Affects, and set it to Rejected.
<xtknight> ahhh
<xtknight> bimberi, Fujitsu: "confirmed" means that it is definitely reproducible, nothing more, nothing less, is that correct? 
<Fujitsu> xtknight: Generally, but not always.
<Joe_CoT> how much can i trust dpkg-depcheck as far as figuring out dependencies?
<jmg> it could introduce superfluous dependencies
<jmg> or miss dependencies required by some options
<jmg> the man page itself says it provides a good first approximation
<Joe_CoT> ok. how do i check what it's dependent on. For build dependencies, pbuilder makes it easy. do i need to debootstrap and run it in a chroot? is there anything that automates it like pbuilder does?
<Joe_CoT> for build-deps, all i had to do is set them in the control file, pbuilder went off and ran, and if i was missing something, it errored out. I'm hoping there's a similarly easy way to do it for dependencies
<rmjb> Hey guys
<kgoetz> doko: ping?
<kgoetz> brb - 30 min
<xtknight> i think i fixed the networkmanager thing
<xtknight> i'm not 100% sure it's not a messy hack, but it seems to fix the problem.  should i upload the hack and have someone else review it?
<ScottK> xtknight: Network manager is a Main package, not Universe, IIRC.
<ScottK> I'd attach a patch to the bug and then mention it in #ubuntu-devel.
<xtknight> ScottK, okay
<ScottK> Dunno for sure how they'll react, but you'll be more famous/infamous.
<ajmitch> ScottK: oh is that how you become famous?
<ScottK> Maybe.  Either you show up with a good fix at crunch time or you distract people at crunch time with idiocy.  Either way you are famous in that circle anyway.
<xtknight> hmm main is frozen right?
* ajmitch wants to be famous
<ajmitch> xtknight: quite
<ScottK> It's also the middle of the night in Europe were a large fraction of the core-devs live.
* ajmitch isn't exactly sure what xtknight is fixing
<ScottK> My bit of news is that I got my first package into Debian today!
<xtknight> bug 105234
<ubotu> Malone bug 105234 in network-manager "Netowrk manager says disconnected but is connected and working" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/105234
<xtknight> posted it at the last comment.  
<ajmitch> right, so you need to wait for someone who has a knowledge of NM code to look at it :)
<xtknight> ahh
<ajmitch> it's not like anyone can just look at it & see that it'll work
<xtknight> i assume people who know about NM would lurk in -devel?  still quite new to this
<ajmitch> yes
<ajmitch> and the relevant people are in europe, as ScottK said
<ajmitch> ScottK: good work on getting stuff into debian - what was it?
<ScottK> A Python package I did here on REVU first, pyyaml.
<ajmitch> ok
<ScottK> The Debian version is a little more mature, so I'll synch over what I did here for Feisty+1.  I could have never done it in Debian though if I hadn't learned a huge amount here first.
<ScottK> It helps that the Debian Python Modules Team is very open to new people.
<ajmitch> yeah
<ajmitch> not like that nasty python team here
<ScottK> There was a hazing and everything here before I was one of the gang...
<jmg> python is more important to ubuntu than it is to debian
<welshbyte> what a coincidence, my first debian package is sitting in the debian NEW queue since yesterday
<jmg> ScottK: baptism by fire
<ScottK> welshbyte: Which package?
<welshbyte> pybackpack
<ScottK> welshbyte: Cool.  Did you consider maintaining it through the Python Modules Team?
<welshbyte> um, not really, didn't think that applied to desktop apps
<ScottK> I'm not sure.
<welshbyte> i'm also the upstream for it anyway so it shouldn't be difficult for me to maintain it ;)
<ScottK> I think they are called Python Modules because Python packages was taken.
<ScottK> I was more thinking of ease of getting uploads if you are not a DD.
<ScottK> It took me about 2 minutes to get a sponsor today.
* ajmitch has some python stuff in debian as well
<ajmitch> but I'm not in their team
<welshbyte> oh i see, well i found a sponsor within a few hours and he said i just need to email him to get future uploads in so that's not a problem
<ScottK> Only a small fraction of the Python stuff in Debian is maintained by that team.  I think it's fairly new.
<ScottK> OK.  Then I guess don't sweat it.
<welshbyte> :)
* ajmitch used to have a sponsor
<ajmitch> actually I ended up with 2 or 3 regular sponsors
<ScottK> With the Python Modules team you maintain your debian dirs in their SVN so anyone who needs to can easily fix stuff, upload to mentors, and then ask for a sponsor on the team IRC channel.
<welshbyte> yay for team maintainership :)
<ScottK> It seems to work well enough here.
<welshbyte> indeed
<Fujitsu> You do have the occasional package which nobody knows anything about, unfortunately.
<ScottK> Yes, but in Debian you have packages that the maintainer no longer touches, but won't orphan.
<ScottK> No way is perfect.
<kgoetz> doko: i'll trying pinging again in about 6 hours, i wont be able to get online again before that. hope to catch you then
<superm1> any MOTUs here that could sponsor a very small debdiff?
* Hobbsee may be
<superm1> bug 93435
<ubotu> Malone bug 93435 in mythplugins "mythvideo can't pull data from imdb" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/93435
<ajmitch> hello Hobbsee 
<Hobbsee> hi ajmitch!
<Hobbsee> superm1: doen
<ScottK> I've written up a how-to for getting Python packages upstream into Debian through the Debian Python Modules Team.  I'd appreciate review/comments from those of you who know more about packaging than me (i.e. virtually everyone here) - particularly from Toadstool or doko since they are on that team too: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ContributingToDebian/PythonModulesTeam
<pwuertz> hi, I found a bug in python-scipy. I already reported it to the project and I think we found the solution... but is anyone here who could update the ubuntu package?
<Toadstool> ScottK: wow! looks really good, awesome
<ScottK> pwuertz: Yes if you are quick
<Toadstool> ScottK: you may want to add a few lines about svn-buildpackage/svn-inject
<pwuertz> ScottK: ok... give me a second
<ScottK> Toadstool: I'd have to figure it out myself first.  Feel free.
<superm1> thanks Hobbsee  :)
<welshbyte> ScottK: s/Debain/Debian/ in the title :)
<ScottK> Argh.
<Toadstool> ScottK: it's been a long time since I didn't use this but I'll do it tomorrow, too tired to think tonight :(
<ScottK> welshbyte: Fixed.
<ScottK> Toadstool: Thanks.  No rush.
<pwuertz> ScottK: this is the bug report.... in the last post there is the diff, removing a double free causing the trouble
<pwuertz> http://projects.scipy.org/scipy/scipy/ticket/392#comment:6
* Fujitsu has dealt with scipy a bit before.
* Fujitsu looks.
<pwuertz> its the python wrapper around minpack
<ScottK> Fujitsu: It's out of my league to figure that one out quickly.  What do you think?
<pwuertz> hm? just apply the patch, build, and see if my example still segfaults?
<Fujitsu> ScottK: It looks OK, I think.
<Fujitsu> I don't see where the first free is, but if it fixes the crash...
<pwuertz> thr first free is above the if condition
<Fujitsu> Ah.
<ScottK> pwuertz: I don't see we have a bug with that issue in launchpad.  Perhaps you could file one.
* Fujitsu downloads the source, applies the patch, etc.
<Fujitsu> Yeah, filing a bug is a good idea, just to keep track of it.
<pwuertz> shall I ?
<ScottK> Fujitsu: If you are up for more at the same time, Bug #66904 claims to have a simple fix.
<ubotu> Malone bug 66904 in python-scipy "cannot use plmesh from scipy.xplt in AMD64" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/66904
<Fujitsu> I'm currently trying to work out why my Internet connection just slowed down enormously, but I'll take a look in a minute.
<welshbyte> ScottK: "In Ubuntu, small changes are often allowed to the source files direct" - is that true?
<ScottK> In MOTU it is.
<Fujitsu> welshbyte: In cases where there is no existing patch system, yes.
<welshbyte> oh, ok, i thought we'd just add a patch system in debian/rules and keep the code clean
<Fujitsu> welshbyte: Our top priority is generally minimising delta from Debian.
<Fujitsu> If it's using CDBS, a patch system is generally added.
<jmg> Fujitsu: stop all those porn torrents already
<Fujitsu> But if you're using debhelper, the changes needed for a patch system are large.
<Fujitsu> @lart jmg
<jmg> i see your @lart and raise you
<jmg> !lart Fujitsu 
<ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about lart fujitsu - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
<jmg> :(
<Fujitsu> It's @lart, and only works in -offtopic.
<ScottK> The bot is broken just now I think.
<Fujitsu> Plus it's broken, yes
<ScottK> Toadstool: I also sent the link for that wiki page to stratus to look at (he asked me to write it).
<MetaBookfoziS> did they know about some md5sums broken?
<MetaBookfoziS> Sikertelen letlts: http://de.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/feisty/universe/binary-i386/Packages.bz2  Az MD5Sum nem megfelel
<MetaBookfoziS> Sikertelen letlts: http://de.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/feisty/universe/source/Sources.bz2  Az MD5Sum nem megfelel
<MetaBookfoziS> ^
<pwuertz> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/python-scipy/+bug/105757
<ubotu> Malone bug 105757 in python-scipy "segfault in python minpack binding" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  
<Fujitsu> They're not broken.
<Fujitsu> More likely your mirror is stuffed.
<Fujitsu> Thanks pwuertz.
<MetaBookfoziS> it's possible, sorry:)
<Fujitsu> Looks like the fix is good, I'll probably upload it in a minute.
<pwuertz> I thank you
<Fujitsu> Thank you for reporting it.
<MetaBookfoziS> stuffed?
<MetaBookfoziS> hacked?
<Fujitsu> MetaBookfoziS: Probably hasn't finished syncing with the main mirror yet.
<MetaBookfoziS> oh, okay
* Fujitsu waits for scipy to build.
<ScottK> Fujitsu: I confirmed Bug #105757.  Should I assign it to you/just leave it be?
<ubotu> Malone bug 105757 in python-scipy "segfault in python minpack binding" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/105757
<Fujitsu> ScottK: I just did the assigning and stuff, but it hasn't finished submitting yet...
<ScottK> OK.
<Toadstool> ScottK: oh, good to have a DD review it as well
<ScottK> Well good night everyone.  I think I've had about as much fun as I can stand for the day.
<Toadstool> g'night ScottK 
<gpocentek> good morning!
<Toadstool> hey gpocentek!
<gpocentek> hello Toadstool :)
<delmorep> so whats keeping Aptana out of the repos?
<Hobbsee> delmorep: someone's time and motivation to put it in, most likely
<delmorep> its a most impressive app... puts bluefish et al to shame ;)
<Hobbsee> feel free to package it up, put it on REVU, then keep fixing it until it reaches the high quality of ubuntu/debian packages
<delmorep> one day
<Joe_CoT> hobbsee: thanks! never heard of REVU before. Just found the wiki page
<DarkMageZ> Seveas, you around?
<tonyyarusso> Anyone familiar with flash in firefox, please look at bug 105614
<ubotu> Malone bug 105614 in firefox "[feisty]  Flash site only partially loads" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/105614
<Jucato> hm.. worksforme... :/
<tonyyarusso> Jucato: ya, I haven't found anyone else with the issue yet
<tonyyarusso> I've had some say it may be due to my video drivers (ati free)
<Jucato> hm... is that possible? O.o
<Fujitsu> Jucato: Flash does some strange things.
<Jucato> oh yeah... I forgot :)
<tonyyarusso> For the record, the problem is actually larger than Firefox.
<tonyyarusso> I have now confirmed it in Firefox, Galeon, Epiphany, and Opera.
<ajmitch> yay, proprietary code that we can't do anything about
<ajmitch> it probably merits an instant rejection
<ajmitch> I'd *guess* it could be related to a libx11-6 update
<Jucato> except that it kinda works here for me, konqueror and firefox...
<ajmitch> but without the source we can't really tell :)
<tonyyarusso> Say, as a workaround, can I disable the flash plugin in FF without removing the package?
<Joe_CoT> you could install flashgot, which won't load the flash file unless you click on it
* ajmitch shrugs
<Flannel> tonyyarusso: I'm sure there's something you can do in about:something that'll disable flash.  Might ask irc.mozilla.com#firefox
<tonyyarusso> right
<ScottK> tonyyarusso: You could install gnash. It still wouldn't work, but we wouldn't reject the bug for proprietary software.
<ScottK> Toadstool: Thanks for the svn-inject stuff.
<bimberi> tonyyarusso: Or you could buy a bike from Giant instead :P
<tonyyarusso> bimberi: I don't get a 50% discount on Giant.
<ScottK> tonyyarusso: What version of Flash do you have?
<bimberi> maybe they don't _need_ to discount :)
<tonyyarusso> ScottK: Current feisty flashplugin-nonfree
<ScottK> The site you were after earlier worked on my Dapper box with Flash 7 and FF 1.5. 
<tonyyarusso> Actually, it happens with the Gnash plugin too
<tonyyarusso> ScottK: It worked on Feisty on my box until about Sunday/Monday.  An update broke it.
<tonyyarusso> It was Flash 9 though
<bimberi> I wonder if it would happen for a windows browser in wine/VM
<jmg> url?
<bimberi> http://www.specialized.com/
<jmg> ah that site
<jmg> works on dapper
<RAOF> Works on my feisty, which is entirely without flash :)
<tonyyarusso> Works on Feisty for everyone but me
<tonyyarusso> Oh reallY?
* tonyyarusso was perhaps mistaken about the source then...
<tonyyarusso> RAOF: screenshot?
* ScottK is really going to be this time.  Good night again.
* RAOF has no net access on his Ubuntu laptop right now.
<Fujitsu> Night ScottK.
<RAOF> Sorry, no screenshot for now :)
<tonyyarusso> k
<tonyyarusso> now I'm confused
<Joe_CoT> about the REVU repo: the rules say it needs to be able to go into the universe repository. I'm packaging a game engine and a game data package; the engine can go into universe, the data can go into multiverse. is it eligible for REVU?
<DarkMageZ> Joe_CoT, which game, just out of curiousity
<Joe_CoT> DarkMageZ: World of Padman. I have both packages working, I'm just probably missing out on some of the needed policy elements
<Fujitsu> Joe_CoT: That's fine.
<Joe_CoT> ok, cool. I'll polish them up and upload them sometime over the weekend. thanks!
<DarkMageZ> Joe_CoT, once you've loaded that to revu, could you send me links? i'd like to see how that game plays.
<Joe_CoT> DarkMageZ: sure
<Joe_CoT> "Your GPG key needs to have an Elgamal secondary key in order to allow encrypting data as well as signing it." How do I tell if I have that?
<DarkMageZ> Joe_CoT, have you uploaded your key to a keyserver? what is the number of it?
<Joe_CoT> 26E9D77B
<DarkMageZ> Joe_CoT, you should be getting an encrypted email soon.
<DarkMageZ> Joe_CoT, if you have configured your mail client correctly. you'll beable to decrypt it
<DarkMageZ> which also means the encryption works with your key
<Joe_CoT> yep, it works well
<Joe_CoT> thanks for encouraging me to install FireGPG. I had forgotten about it
<Joe_CoT> okay, so that means the key is fine for revu. awesome
<DarkMageZ> Joe_CoT, if you want to play around with gpg signing emails. feel free to send stuff to my address.
<Joe_CoT> i've signed mails before. I sign my mail when I announce stuff to the LoCo Team. I just didn't know if my key was right for REVU, since they specified "ElGamal" (which i know how to implement, but not how to look for in gpg :) )
<Fujitsu> As long as you didn't explicitly create it as DSA-only, it's fine.
<Joe_CoT> ok, cool
<Joe_CoT> so now i just need to get approved and get the keyring refreshed.
<imbrandon> ello all
<RAOF> Ey imbrandon 
<ajmitch> hi imbrandon 
<imbrandon> heya RAOF and ajmitch 
* ajmitch pokes Hobbsee 
* Fujitsu wakes up.
* Hobbsee pokes ajmitch 
* Hobbsee DOOMs Fujitsu 
* Fujitsu pokes Joe_CoT to poke ajmitch.
<Fujitsu> Crap.
<ajmitch> too late
<Jucato> @lart 37 Hobbsee
<Jucato> oops :)
* Hobbsee shrugs
* Hobbsee shows Jucato a picture of mneptok
<Fujitsu> Hobbsee: Can you convince Sev^eas to allow larting in here?
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: maybe whiel in spain.
<Jucato> noooo
<Fujitsu> Heheh.
<Jucato> my eyes!
<Fujitsu> #37 is truly the worst.
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: no...having to visit my myspace page (to show that all myspace is evil) is worse
<Hobbsee> or maybe that background, with a picture of mneptok...
<Fujitsu> Is that the evil rainbow flashy seizure-inducing one?
<Hobbsee> ooh, the evil possibilities...
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: mneptok isn't so bad :)
<Hobbsee> it's a *lovely* background!
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: I think I was twitching for a day or two after seeing that 
<Hobbsee> haha
<Fujitsu> Hobbsee: I forget the URL of your MySpace page... I want to be out of it for the next couple of days.
<TheMuso> Fujitsu: lol
<AnAnt> ScottK: ping
* ajmitch found it
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: http://myspace.com/creamier_oak
* TheMuso pokes his head in.
<Fujitsu> That's the one.
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: I've seen worse backgrounds
<Fujitsu> Hey TheMuso.
<Hobbsee> hi TheMuso 
<TheMuso> AnAnt: Probably asleep.
<AnAnt> k
* Fujitsu fixes some bugs.
* TheMuso returns to packing.
<Fujitsu> @lart ServerPronto
<Fujitsu> TheMuso: When are you leaving?
<TheMuso> Fujitsu: Moving Tuesday.
<TheMuso> So will be offline from Monday probably.
<Fujitsu> And then for a few weeks afterwards, I presume.
<TheMuso> Hopefullynot. We only want to be offline for three/four days at most if possible.
<TheMuso> So lucky for me, I'll be off the for week of the Feisty release.
<TheMuso> full
<Fujitsu> A guy at work was without 'net access for 3.5 weeks due to a series of Telstra stuff-ups with connecting new lines.
<Fujitsu> So don't count on it happening quickly.
<ajmitch> Fujitsu: why does that sound so familiar?
<ajmitch> like new subdivisions being built here that *can't* run DSL to homes
<Fujitsu> Planning for the future, I see.
<ajmitch> of course
<TheMuso> Fujitsu: One plus is that we will be less than a K from the exchange.
<ajmitch> of course there was some uproar about it & suddenly telecom found that they could provision DSL to a certain person who complained
<Fujitsu> TheMuso: Sounds nice and fast.
* RAOF lives opposite his exchange
<TheMuso> Fujitsu: If DSL2+ was available, yep.
<RAOF> Where are you going, that DSL2+ isn't available?
<TheMuso> RAOF: Wentworth Falls on the mountains.
* ajmitch could probably write out each packet in binary & deliver them on paper by hand faster than DSL is here at times
<TheMuso> I hope to only be up there for a year at most.
<ajmitch> TheMuso: why are you moving?
<RAOF> Why?  Wentworth Falls is nice :)
<TheMuso> RAOF: Yeah, but I personally prefer Sydney.
<TheMuso> ajmitch: Moving because we currently rent, and parents have found place in the mountains.
<TheMuso> Which is where they have wanted to live for ages.
<TheMuso> But we eventaully are going to get a unit in Sydney.
<TheMuso> WHich is where I will live.
<ajmitch> ah right
<TheMuso> Am I reading incorrectly in -devel, or is nm being pulled?
<Fujitsu> TheMuso: Incorrect.
<TheMuso> oh ok
<Fujitsu> It's being hidden if it isn't managing anything, I believe.
<TheMuso> Just one comment from Mithrandir made me wonder.
<AnAnt> regarding this bug #105548
<ubotu> Malone bug 105548 in acon "Some key combinations don't work under Feisty" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/105548
<AnAnt> regarding this bug #105548, is there a problem that it is solved using a work around ?
<AnAnt> anyone has suggestions for better solution ?
<ajmitch> gutsy gibbon? what sort of name is *that*?
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: WHAT!?
<TheMuso> ajmitch: ??
<ajmitch> http://article.gmane.org/gmane.linux.ubuntu.devel.announce/263
<Fujitsu> Shudder.
<ajmitch> agreed
<Fujitsu> That's just... bad.
<TheMuso> stupid
<Fujitsu> I should have got that, but one of the mail servers that goes through decided to die at 12:30.
<RAOF> ajmitch: Its a monkey name.  Surely you know that all good things start with a monkey?
* Hobbsee WTF???????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????//
<ajmitch> RAOF: it's a sign that everything's being rewritten in mono
<Fujitsu> Hobbsee: Er, yeah.
* Fujitsu forks Ubuntu, with a less deranged named for the 7th release.
<TheMuso> Fujitsu: heh
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: hah
<Fujitsu> What kind of adjective is Gutsy!?
<joejaxx> haha @ Hobbsee 's second to last line
<joejaxx> LOL
<joejaxx> what about the Gazelle :(
<Hobbsee> hah.  monkey business at UDS...that'd be right
<joejaxx> Hobbsee: i hope people do not make fun
<welshbyte> Fujitsu: i was hoping it would be Gallant
<joejaxx> welshbyte: me too 
* welshbyte sighs
<joejaxx> Gallant Gazelle for me lol
<welshbyte> oh well, i'll love it just the same :)
* Hobbsee wishes for gazelle, too.  oh well
* Fujitsu thinks we should just use the number.
<joejaxx> well atleast it was not gutsy gibblets
<joejaxx> :)
<Hobbsee> The Glossy Gnu will nonetheless play a role in this next release,
<Jucato> gutsy gorilla?
<Hobbsee> because Ubuntu 7.10 will feature a new flavour - as yet unnamed - which
<Hobbsee> takes an ultra-orthodox view of licensing: no firmware, drivers,
<Hobbsee> imagery, sounds, applications, or other content which do not include
<Hobbsee> full source materials and come with full rights of modification,
<TheMuso> oooo sweet
<Hobbsee> remixing and redistribution. There should be no more conservative home,
<Hobbsee> for those who demand a super-strict interpretation of the "free" in free
<lifeless> gaseous gorilla
<Hobbsee> software. This work will be done in collaboration with the folks behind
<TheMuso> upload for general stuff on feisty's release. Nice.
<Hobbsee> Gnewsense.
<Jucato> hm... lots of pasting :)
<Hobbsee> this'll be interesting
<Jucato> Gnubuntu? :D
<Fujitsu> TheMuso: That's why the toolchain is almost prepared.
<TheMuso> Fujitsu: ah.
<Hobbsee> oh, that presumably means they're putting gnewsense into ubuntu
<joejaxx> Jucato: gNewSense
<TheMuso> As for non-free firmware etc not being present, I'd doubt this will be possible.
<Jucato> joejaxx: yeah, I was just playing around :)
<joejaxx> TheMuso: gNewSense :)
<Fujitsu> TheMuso: Gnewsense does it... It's not hard.
<TheMuso> Fujitsu: But what is missed out?
<TheMuso> I don't mean technically, I mean for users.
<Fujitsu> It'll be wireless stuff, mostly.
<TheMuso> ipw2{1,2} have non-free firmware, yet they are as common as anything.
<imbrandon> ugh
<imbrandon> gutsy
<Jucato> drivers mos probably?
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: heh, yes
<imbrandon> nasty 
<Fujitsu> imbrandon: Yeah... sabdfl's word is law, though.
<Hobbsee> so, anyone wanting to work on debian, opensuse, or another distro now?
<Fujitsu> TheMuso: Debian does it.
<Jucato> imbrandon: we're still on G, not on N? :P
<Jucato> j/k
<TheMuso> Fujitsu: DOes what? 
<imbrandon> Fujitsu, yea i was just explainign that to the co-worjker here
<TheMuso> How will my ipw2100 just work?
* Jucato goes for Hobbuntu
<Fujitsu> TheMuso: Excludes ipw2[12] 00 firmware.
<imbrandon> actualy we should have skiped g
<Fujitsu> TheMuso: It's the free variant, it's not meant to.
<Fujitsu> imbrandon: For Grump?
<Jucato> imbrandon: I thought so too
<Hobbsee> Jucato: heh
<Fujitsu> *Grumpy
<joejaxx> imbrandon: Gazekke :D
<imbrandon> Fujitsu, yea
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: I'll work on debian
<joejaxx> Gazelle*
<TheMuso> Fujitsu: Ah you mean there is a free firmware version? Ok thats different.
<TheMuso> SO what happens to LRM?
<TheMuso> Goes puff and disappears?
<joejaxx> Grumpy Groundhog is already taken :(
<TheMuso> WHat about madwifi?
<ajmitch> TheMuso: no, the mail seemed to say that the really-free version is a variant
<TheMuso> I'm trying to think from a user's point of view.
<ajmitch> not that it'll *all* disappear
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: i'm presuming that the free-only one is just a variant
<Fujitsu> `Ubuntu 7.10 will feature a new flavour...'
<imbrandon> TheMuso, it appeasrs it will be a deritive not the main
<TheMuso> Right.
* ajmitch will be back in 2 hours or so
<Fujitsu> Bye ajmitch.
<Fujitsu> I hope you recover from the name in that time.
<imbrandon> later ajmitch 
<imbrandon> it will take 6+ months to recover from this name
<TheMuso> heh
<imbrandon> i thought feisty was bad
<imbrandon> ;)
<TheMuso> Feisty is alright.
<Fujitsu> imbrandon: We have to live with it for 24 months... :(
<TheMuso> Probably because we are used to it.
<imbrandon> Fujitsu, yea
<Fujitsu> I thought Feisty was rather odd to start with, but it's sort of grown on me.
<Lathiat> hrm, gutsy hey
<Hobbsee> [16:54]  <Toma-> gibbons fling poo at each other
<Hobbsee> oh *dear*
<Jucato> roflmao
<joejaxx> unattended-installation infrastructure in Ubiquity  </quote>
<joejaxx> would this not be easier with the debian-install cd?
<joejaxx> where you just preseed everything
<dholbach> good morning
<joejaxx> Good morning dholbach :)
<TheMuso> joejaxx: Perhaps people don't have that CD, particularly in terms of ship it.
<TheMuso> I'm guessing ubiquity will just support the same preceeding system.
<joejaxx> oh ok
<TheMuso> No need to re-invent the wheel.
<joejaxx> i was justing wondering about it
<TheMuso> So was I, but it makes sense.
<dholbach> hey joejaxx
<joejaxx> because you could have the d-i installation half way started before the livecd boots up to full desktop
<joejaxx> TheMuso: yeah
<joejaxx> dholbach: it is 7 over there?
<dholbach> joejaxx: nope, 9:02
<TheMuso> joejaxx: No I don't think so.
<joejaxx> dholbach: oh
* joejaxx was thinking about the wrong country then
<welshbyte> having googled a bit i've decided gibbon's are actually kind of cute
<Hobbsee> welshbyte: pic?
<Jucato> :D
<welshbyte> http://images.google.com/images?q=gibbon take your pick :)
* Jucato is thankful they didn't go for gorilla then :D
<Jucato> yeah cute little ones :D
<Hobbsee> hehe, okay, they are kinda cute :P
<welshbyte> :)
* Jucato wonders if Ubuntu will/could start making mascots for each release, starting with a cute gibbon :)
* RAOF 'd buy one of those :)
<Fujitsu> I saw a thread on the fora about a mascot idea earlier, I think...
<Jucato> not the OS-tan idea? :/
<Fujitsu> Jucato: That's the one. Isn't it GREAT?
<Jucato> being a fan of anime, I find it great... I don't know about others :)
* Jucato looks at the "Hobbsee controversy" :D
<Hobbsee> hm?
<Jucato> "sexy lady from .au" :D
* Jucato runs and hides
<Hobbsee> ahhh
* Hobbsee beats Jucato into a pulp
<Jucato> what kind of pulp? :D
* Jucato thinks orange juice type pulp
<jussi01> Hobbsee, where did te long pointy stick of doom go?
<Hobbsee> Jucato: a jucato-flavoured pulp
<Jucato> ooh :)
<Fujitsu> Mmm... Orange juice.
* Hobbsee pokes jussi01 with the Long Pointy Stick of DOOM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  a few times
<Jucato> O.o
<jussi01> NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!
<Hobbsee> heh
<jussi01> NOT ME!!!
<Jucato> do not put "poke" and "jussi" side by side please...
<jussi01> HIM!
* Fujitsu is used to it.
<joejaxx> what about Cranberry Juice :D
<Jucato> or don't read it too fast :/
<jussi01> nice work in trademarking it Hobbsee... :P
<Hobbsee> heh
<Jucato> Fujitsu: seen the replies to Carthik's blog post on the Ubuntu-tan? :/
<Fujitsu> Ah, that's where I saw it.
* TheMuso shows everybody the few bruises on his back.
<Fujitsu> No, I haven't.
* Fujitsu looks.
* jussi01 pats TheMuso on the head, awwww
* TheMuso then points his cane at Hobbsee.
<jussi01> lol
* Hobbsee grabs the cane, and runs off with it
<TheMuso> She did it!!
<welshbyte> is it a pointy cane?
* Hobbsee so didnt
<Jucato> is that cane trademarked too? :D
<TheMuso> bah! SHe always does that.
<Hobbsee> welshbyte: no it isnt
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: poor you.
<Hobbsee> :P
<TheMuso> Ah well, I guess I'd better go again.
<welshbyte> candy cane possibly
* TheMuso is going out for his sister's birthday.
<dholbach> TheMuso: enjoy it
<TheMuso> welshbyte: Um, no I don't think so.
<Fujitsu> Hmit seems ShipIt gives contributors (not sure how that's defined) options for more CDs.
<Fujitsu> Bye,TheMuso.
<TheMuso> dholbach: Thanks.
<welshbyte> maybe they're hooking shipit up to launchpad so you can spend your karma on extra CDs ;)
<Jucato> hehe
<Jucato> well, you do use your launchpad account to login to shipit...
<Fujitsu> I'm thinking it might use karma.
<Hobbsee> RAOF: did you get democracyplayer finished?
<RAOF> Hobbsee: Yeah, the updates even hit the repos,.
* RAOF subscribes to feisty-changes RSS.
<Hobbsee> RAOF: neat :0
<RAOF> Oh, yeah.
<Jucato> neat?
<RAOF> Well, it means we don't have to remove the brick that was democracyplayer from the repos.
<Hobbsee> true
<RAOF> I should really learn to say "archives" :)
<RAOF> Hey, in return could you port the restricted manager to Kubuntu?  I'd like to be able to say "just run the restricted manager" :)
* Hobbsee cant port things
<joejaxx> ajmitch: do you have time for a conversation about ubuntu-server later?
<pwuertz_> hi, I'm using feisty, and I cant find "checkinstall" in the repository anymore... am I supposed to use a different tool for building packages?
<Fujitsu> pwuertz_: checkinstall is one of the Great Pillars of Evil.
<Fujitsu> !packagingguide
<ubotu> The packaging guide is at http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/index.html - See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/New for information on getting a package integrated into Ubuntu - Other developer resources are at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DeveloperResources - See also !backports
<jussi01> lol
<jussi01> true though
<RAOF> pwuertz_: Also, last time I tried to use it (admittedly a *long* time ago) checkinstall was just plain broken.
<Fujitsu> pwuertz_: You're on amd64?
<pwuertz_> i386
<Fujitsu> Oh, good. Must be missing on more architectures than I thought :D
<pwuertz_> the last time I used checkinstall... I had some 3rd party software... I was supposed to install it with "make install"... and I had it packed with checkinstall within a minute
<pwuertz_> clean install / uninstall, thanks to checkinstall
<Fujitsu> !checkinstall
<ubotu> checkinstall is a wrapper to "make install", useful for installing programs you compiled. It will create a .deb package, which will be listed in the APT database and can be uninstalled like other packages. See https://help.ubuntu.com/community/CheckInstall - Read the warnings at the top and bottom of that web page, and DO NOT interrupt CheckInstall while it's running!
<Fujitsu> It doesn't create proper packages.
<pwuertz_> I'm not saying checkinstall shall be used to create proper packages so they could be included in some repositories....
<Fujitsu> Oh, good. Saying that is almost unforgivable.
<pwuertz_> but I dont get the point in going though the whole package building process in order to install some random software thats not in the repository and never will be
<pwuertz_> I think doing a "make install" as root is more evil than building a package with checkinstall for yourself
<Fujitsu> But some people then distribute the packages that checkinstall creates.
<RAOF> pwuertz_: Why not do a "make install" as your user, and install the software for your user only?
<pwuertz_> its a compiler and a library
<pwuertz_> and it needs a directory in /etc
<pwuertz_> its expected to be installed in opt
<pwuertz_> and if someone wants to reinstall it / setup it on another machine... I dont want him to go through the whole patching / building process
<RAOF> Why not package it up, though.  With CDBS, it's a matter of minutes to create a really crappy pacakge.
<pwuertz_> sure... I could just take an hour for building 3 proper packages... but checkinstall would have done a better job
<siretart> so it's gusty, eh?
<siretart> gutsy, even
<Seveas> DarkMageZ, ?
<pwuertz_> you said, when doing "make install"... you can install into another directory?
* Fujitsu convinces Seveas to allow larting in here.
<pwuertz_> not in "/" ?
<Fujitsu> pwuertz_: --prefix passed to configure is your friend.
<Seveas> Fujitsu, hmm, I'd need some more acks for that
<pwuertz_> Fujitsu: but this could affect the source as well
<pwuertz_> Fujitsu: if I want to install it to some tmp directory for packaging? how is this done?
<pwuertz_> maybe there is no configure at all
<Fujitsu> pwuertz_: Oh, like that.. What kind of build system does it use?
<pwuertz_> make
<pwuertz_> I'm supposed to do a make install
<pwuertz_> as root
<DarkMageZ> Seveas, oh. i was having a problem with falcon under fesisty. something about not being able to load module falcon.conf
<pwuertz_> Fujitsu: I found DESTDIR, but this parameter seems to be ignored by the install target
<dholbach> checkinstall is no option
<pwuertz_> then tell me another option ^^
<dholbach> we can't make use of checkinstall for packaging
<pwuertz_> I never told you to use checkinstall
<dholbach> right... I never interpreted it that way
<pwuertz_> I want to use checkinstall, but It seems some guys are telling me what to do or not to do
<pwuertz_> fine... so could anyone please tell me how to "make install" into a temp directory so I can do manually what checkinstall already did for me nicely?
<dholbach> pwuertz_: what are you trying to do?
<Jucato> !compile
<ubotu> Compiling software from source? Read the tips at https://help.ubuntu.com/community/CompilingSoftware (But remember to search for pre-built !packages first: not all !repositories are enabled by default!)
<pwuertz_> I already compiled the software... please stop rtfm me and tell me how to tell "make install" to install into another directory
<highvoltage> pwuertz_: I think you need to provide more information on what you're doing. people will help you if you allow them to.
<pwuertz_> ok... I'll try again
<Fujitsu> pwuertz_: It depends on the application/
<pwuertz_> make install will install software to the root directory
<pwuertz_> i dont want that
<Fujitsu> You'll have to read the documentation or the Makefile.
<pwuertz_> i want make install install software to a temp directory so I can take the files and pack ist
<Fujitsu> Or does it use auto{make,conf}?
<Jucato> And I quote: "For example, by default the configure script installs to /usr/local. If you want to change the path, you would execute the configure script as shown below: /configure --PREFIX=/opt"
<pwuertz_> Jucato: maybe I dont have a configure
* Jucato thinks that /usr/local should be /usr though
<pwuertz_> there must be a generic way to catch the files "make install" tries to install to / so you can pack it
<Jucato> then you'll have to be more specific then. how was the Makefile made?
<Fujitsu> pwuertz_: There's no standard for Makefile behaviour!
<pwuertz_> right...
<Jucato> make install will only follow the directions in the Makefile which is usually generated by the configure script (afaik)
<pwuertz_> i know
<pwuertz_> but I also know that there is a software to overcome this problem
<imbrandon> ...
<Jucato> maybe imbrandon will have better luck :)
<pwuertz_> its called checkinstall... no matter what "make install" does... it collects the files and puts it into a package
<imbrandon> pwuertz_, sure but it dosent check deps or anything else
<pwuertz_> because you(?) took checkinstall away from me... I'll have to do that manually
<Seveas> DarkMageZ, the falcon packages are meant for dapper/edgy, not feisty. They're known not to work
<Jucato> doesn't checkinstall just install in the directories indicated by the makefile as well?
<imbrandon> Seveas, falcon 2.0 kthxbye :)
<Seveas> imbrandon, working on it
<DarkMageZ> Seveas, i rebuilt the package under feisty.
<imbrandon> hehe i know
<Seveas> implemented part of your 'i want my own metacomponents' request the other day
<Seveas> DarkMageZ, that still won't work :)
<DarkMageZ> :(
<imbrandon> Seveas, rockin
<pwuertz_> yes... and I dont need that... I dont need no deps checks... I dont need no proper package specifications.... I just want to install software by apt instead of letting some random software mess with my system!
<DarkMageZ> Seveas, what changed?
<imbrandon> pwuertz_, sure thats all and well UNTILL you try to use that deb on another machine
<Seveas> DarkMageZ, python
<pwuertz_> imbrandon: I'm not dumb... I know what I'm doing
<imbrandon> pwuertz_, we're not here to argue, if you want to use it fine, but just know it WILL break if you use the deb on a diffrent machine than what made it and 2 we wont support it in here, even if its for your machine
<imbrandon> pwuertz_, rockin, go to it then
<Seveas> no sane person will support it :)
<imbrandon> :)
<pwuertz_> I never said I want to build a supported package! all I want is a clean system
<Fujitsu> Anyway... checkinstall is in the repos except for amd64 and ia64.
<imbrandon> pwuertz_, i realize that, but what i dont realize is why we;re still talking about this
<pwuertz_> checkinstall is not in my repos anymore
<pwuertz_> (feisty)
<Fujitsu> Do you have universe enabled?
<Fujitsu> It's definitely there.
<pwuertz_> yes
<Seveas> !info checkinstall
<ubotu> checkinstall: installation tracker. In component universe, is optional. Version 1.6.0-2ubuntu1 (edgy), package size 88 kB, installed size 392 kB
<Seveas> !info checkinstall feisty
<ubotu> checkinstall: installation tracker. In component universe, is optional. Version 1.6.1-1ubuntu1 (feisty), package size 111 kB, installed size 540 kB
<imbrandon> imbrandon@aurora:~$ apt-cache madison checkinstall
<imbrandon> checkinstall | 1.6.1-1ubuntu1 | http://mirror.imbrandon.com feisty/universe Packages
<imbrandon> checkinstall | 1.6.1-1ubuntu1 | http://mirror.imbrandon.com feisty/universe Sources
<imbrandon> imbrandon@aurora:~$
<Fujitsu> checkinstall | 1.6.1-1ubuntu1 | http://mirror.pacific.net.au feisty/universe Packages
<imbrandon> sure it is
<pwuertz_> deb http://de.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ feisty main restricted universe multiverse
* siretart points to the madison-lite install on tiber
<pwuertz_>  sudo apt-get install checkinstall
<pwuertz_> E: Couldn't find package checkinstall
<siretart> checkinstall | 1.6.0-2ubuntu1 | feisty-universe | amd64
<siretart> checkinstall | 1.6.1-1ubuntu1 | feisty-universe | source, i386, powerpc
<siretart> so it FTBFS on amd64 for some reason
<Fujitsu> siretart: It FTBFS on 64-bit archs
<siretart> Fujitsu: version 1.6.0-2ubuntu1 did got built, however
<pwuertz_> ah ok sorry... now its there.... a few hours ago the repository was broken
<siretart> !info xine-lib
<ubotu> Package xine-lib does not exist in edgy, edgy-backports, edgy-seveas
<siretart> !info libxine1
<ubotu> libxine1: the xine video/media player library, binary files. In component main, is optional. Version 1.1.2+repacked1-0ubuntu3.4 (edgy), package size 3146 kB, installed size 6820 kB
<pwuertz_> someone messed with the mf5 hashes
<siretart> so the bug only reacts to binary files. interesting
<imbrandon> siretart, ?
<siretart> binary packages
<imbrandon> ahh ubotu ? not sure
<Seveas> it does
<imbrandon> !info xine-lib feisty source
<Seveas> won't work :)
<imbrandon> heh
<ubotu> Package xine-lib does not exist in feisty
<siretart> ubotu: it does exist! I know for sure ;)
<imbrandon> Seveas, maybe !srcinfo [..]  ? ( after falcon 1.99999999999beta1 ofcourse )
<siretart> anyway
<siretart> doesn anyone have news about removing binary packages with unmet deps from the feisty archive?
<DarkMageZ> Seveas, what i find odd tho. is if i install the edgy package onto feisty (oh noes). is that even tho apt has a cry about broken packages. falcon works.
<imbrandon> i'm not a fan of removing the source to said packages , just the binarys, but no , no news here
<imbrandon> DarkMageZ, there are diffrences between the python versions, it wont work as expected
<imbrandon> DarkMageZ, trust me i was the first feisty guiny pig about a week after feisty repos opened
<siretart> imbrandon: removing the source has never been discussed. only about broken binary packages
<imbrandon> siretart, coool
<jmg> falcon?
<imbrandon> brb phone
<imbrandon> jmg, a repo tool made by seveas
<minghua> ok, another word learned from codename
<imbrandon> jmg, http://seveas.imbrandon.com/dists/edgy-seveas/all/   <-- second package listed on that page, click "more"
<jmg> cool
<jmg> nice app
<Adri2000> heya
<sacater> Adri2000: hello
<geser> Hi Adri2000
<imbrandon> Seveas, you should have an "about falcon" page somewhere , so like i dont have to tell people like above :)
<imbrandon> i can point them to a real url / about blurb :)
<Fujitsu> !falcon
<ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about falcon - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
* ajmitch returns
<imbrandon> wb
<imbrandon> !gutsy
<ubotu> Gutsy Gibbon will be the next release name of Ubuntu (7.10). See https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel-announce/2007-April/000276.html
<Admiral_Chicago> \o/
<Fujitsu> imbrandon: You cruel, cruel person.
<imbrandon> lol
<Fujitsu> s/the next release name/the code name of the next release/
<ajmitch> hey thoreauputic 
<ajmitch> joejaxx: did you have something to talk about with me?
<thoreauputic> hi ajmitch  :)
<imbrandon> !no gusty is <reply> Gusty Gibbon is the code name for the next release of Ubuntu (7.10). See https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel-announce/2007-April/000276.html
<Fujitsu> Thanks imbrandon.
<ajmitch> hah
<ubotu> I'll remember that imbrandon
<ajmitch> the farting monkey release
<imbrandon> lol
<highvoltage> imbrandon: should be Gutsy, not Gusty?
<Fujitsu> imbrandon: Please fix that!
<ajmitch> s/gusty/gutsy/ please :)
<Fujitsu> What highvoltage said.
<Fujitsu> A little wrong :P
<imbrandon> arg
<ajmitch> otherwise I'll think of farting monkeys all the time ;)
<highvoltage> HAH!
<imbrandon> !forget gusty
<ubotu> I'll forget that, imbrandon
* Fujitsu watches ajmitch get blown away.
<damko> hi all
<Fujitsu> imbrandon: You made the mistake twice! Nice.
<Fujitsu> Hi damko.
<imbrandon> !no gutsy is <reply> Gutsy Gibbon is the code name for the next release of Ubuntu (7.10). See https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel-announce/2007-April/000276.html
<ubotu> I'll remember that imbrandon
<Fujitsu> That's better :)
<ajmitch> hm I see the universe freeze dates are set for gutsy already
<ajmitch> I presume we can change those if we desire
<imbrandon> huh ?
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: Where?
<ajmitch> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/GutsyReleaseSchedule
<imbrandon> i would assume so
<ajmitch> keybuk's mail to -devel
<Fujitsu> I should have guessed.
<ajmitch> s/devel/devel-announce/
<Fujitsu> What an annoying time for mekong to go down... I have none of my normal mail.
<damko> i'm trying to create a deb package. i have some bash scripts and I would like a deb package to install them on more than one machine. i read part of the debian guide for mantainers but it seems that it fixes on C sources ... and I can't understand how to go on. is there someone who wants to join this kind of "project" with me and someone ready to help?
<ajmitch> instead of the normal 'make install' calls, you copy the scripts into place
<damko> a tgz file is not enough to reach the target cause i need to make some configurations during the setup process
<damko> i would like something interactive
<ajmitch> at package install time, or at build time?
<damko> at package install time
<ajmitch> if at install time, use maintainer scripts such as postinst
<damko> ajmitch: pls consider i am a big newbie in packaging
<ajmitch> !packagingguide
<ubotu> The packaging guide is at http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/index.html - See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/New for information on getting a package integrated into Ubuntu - Other developer resources are at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DeveloperResources - See also !backports
<ajmitch> iirc the packaging guide does cover some of this stuff as well
<damko> ubotu: thanks a lot
<ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about thanks a lot - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
<ajmitch> :)
<Fujitsu> ubotu, thanks.
<ubotu> You're welcome! But keep in mind I'm just a bot ;-)
<damko> :-) it's a bot
<damko> ajmitch: thanks 4 the support
<damko> i keep on reading
<ajmitch> no problem, there are docs on the maintainer scripts on the debian wiki as well
<damko> is there none who want to join this small project ?
<imbrandon> i think most of already have enough on our plates
<imbrandon> :)
<jussi01> damko, whats the project?
<damko> jussi01: wait a sec telephone
<damko> jussi01: i want to create a deb package (my first :-) )
<damko> jussi01: are u interested ?
<jussi01> damko, yeah, but whats the deb for?
<damko> jussi01: i have some bash scripts
<damko> and some files with settings
<damko> that i want to install on more than one machine
<damko> the target are:
<damko> - install the scripts in some fixed directories (and this could be done using a tgz)
<damko> - checking dependencies
<damko> (i need some sw to be installed to run the scripts)
<jussi01> ok, so what program is all this playing with?
<damko> - running a wizard to set up the config files
<damko> jussi01: the target is not the program but the .deb
<johandc> Do i have to be a MOTU to create an SRU? - The main openafs kernel module is broken in edgy, and the current maintainer has left. There is a strong urge for an SRU, but nobody to do it. So i thought i would like to give it a shot. - But the SRU procedure seems hard to to, when i don't know how to upload stuff.
<Fujitsu> johandc: You just need to get a MOTU to do the uploads.
<johandc> Fujitsu: Okay, that sounds reasonable. So i should just create the debdiff and upload it to the bug-report... Are there a guide how to create the debdiff then?
<Fujitsu> !debdiff
<ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about debdiff - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
<Fujitsu> Hm.
<Fujitsu> You create the new source package, then run `debdiff old.dsc new.dsc'
<johandc> Allright then, i would like to upgrade from 1.4.1 to 1.4.4, so basically i can just download the official tarball and move the .debian folder from the old source package to the new one, and apply appropriate changes to the new one?
<johandc> What if there are ubuntu-specific patches on the old source pacakge?
<Fujitsu> That's not going to happen.
<Fujitsu> You need to isolate the patch that fixes it.
<johandc> Well, that is pretty impossible, since it's a problem with the kernel headers and that version of openafs that cannot compile
<Fujitsu> How?
<Fujitsu> You need to find the patch that fixes that problem.
<johandc> It has never worked with 2.6.17 and 1.4.1, so i would say that it's a pretty big regression. It's fixed in 1.4.2. But the openafs maintainer has already commented on it and says that it would be very hard to write a patch to make 1.4.1 work on edgy.
<johandc> Say, then, that this issue cannot be fixed because 1.4.1 was the version accepted for edgy, and the MOTU's don't want to change version numbers. Could it perhaps be accepted in proposed or backports?
<johandc> 1.4.1 has a security flaw as well, so i suppose there should be a patch for -security as well?
<DarkMageZ> backports should not be used to fix issues. they should be used to add features.
<johandc> I understand. But 1.4.1 probably will never work with 2.6.17 kernel headers, so i would say, making openafs actually wokring again, is a pretty neat feature :) - But yes, this is also why we discussed adding it as a SRU. Basically because 1.4.1 will not work.
<johandc> The problem now is: 1) SRU won't accept because of version bump from 1.4.1 to 1.4.4, 2) backports will not accept 1.4.4 because it's fixing the issue that 1.4.1 is not working.
<johandc> Is the _only_ solution, to create a patch that makes 1.4.1 work on the 2.6.17 kernel headers? The openafs maintainer himself has stated that this will be a hard task, so i really don't want to try that. - The general suggestion is to update to 1.4.2 or 1.4.4 (because of security flaw in 1.4.2)
<johandc> .
<imbrandon> it could be backported to make it work, but rember backports isnt on by default sooo if 
<imbrandon> there is a security flaw there needs to be a patch for 1.4.1 also in -security
<johandc> Okay, it seems like somebody with a little more experience than me, needs to suggest where to place this.
<johandc> One thing is for sure though, nobody is going to patch the security stuff and the kernel headers stuff back to version 1.4.1 - So i guess it will never be accepted for SRU, and openafs will be broken in edgy forever :(
<imbrandon> well being on backports and seeing that no one is willing to fix a securioty issue in an existing version, i'm reluctant to approve a new backport
<damko> someone knows someone involved in mantaing some deb packages like phpmyadmin or phpgroupware?
<imbrandon> damko, its a group effort by the MOTU
<damko> yes I read in apt-cache show phpmyadmin
<johandc> imbrandon, i know that bumping version numbers is discouraged when fixing issues, especially security issues; but when 1.4.1 is 100% broken anyways, it cannot break anything that isn't already broken... So maybe it could be an argument for a SRU version bump?
<imbrandon> johandc, not discouraged, just plain not done, and sru is a totaly diffrent story, you have 3 diffrent issues you are bringing up here with 3 diffrent solutions
<DarkMageZ> Fujitsu, oh. i rebuilt the patch... it oddly enough still fails :s
<imbrandon> you can backport yes, and get 1.4.4 in, but rember backports is NOT on by default so it cannot be used for security soo you also need a patch for -security , and security will ONLY accept patches for the current version
<imbrandon> so in other words you must do both, not one or the other like you seem to think
<damko> imbrandon: i would like to speak someone involved in packaging for that kind of projects
<johandc> imbrandon, okay, what about the issue that the current version 1.4.1 cannot compile against the kernel headers, how is that fixed? - Creating a patch to make 1.4.1 work, is not an option.
<imbrandon> damko, you are in the right place then, this is the home of the MOTU :)
<Fujitsu> If it were up to me, I'd say backporting 1.4.4 would be the best course of action.
<imbrandon> Fujitsu, right, thats part of the equasion
<damko> imbrandon: i have to go afk for 45 min. after i'll bother u if u will be available :-D
<Fujitsu> There's no point issuing a security fix for 1.4.1, as it doesn't build anyway.
<DarkMageZ> since openafs doesn't work at all in edgy. it's worth replacing the entire thing with a new version.
<imbrandon> if there is no binarys no
<Fujitsu> If fixing 1.4.1 is pretty much getting 1.4.4, we may as well backport it.
<DarkMageZ> you're not going to kill off any users who can't use something that doesn't work
<ajmitch> damko: yes, what about phpgroupware?
<johandc> Fujitsu: I see your points.
<allee> johandc: ah, great you look into openafs!
<ajmitch> hm too late, I guess damko is gone
* ajmitch is phpgroupware maintainer anyway
<johandc> Allee, yes, i read Bjorn's reply on #52298 and it thought, if nobody was going to do it, i might as well. Since this is very annoying, having to hand-build the modules for each kernel update.
<allee> johandc, imbrandon: go for an SRU with 1.4.4.   Everyone seriously using afs will use the backported ones.  
<Fujitsu> New upstream versions in SRUs are simply not done.
<allee> johandc: building the kernel modeles has still to be done by everyone.
<imbrandon> i'll be happy to review it and help with questions but i cannot prepare a SRU for it
<imbrandon> Fujitsu, sure they are in some cases
<imbrandon> rare, but can be
<johandc> Okay, so are we trying to get it into backports then?
<imbrandon> johandc, if you want to prepare a backport, i'll +1 it after a review
<allee> johandc: we need to talk to the kernel guys an see if they can agree to build openafs-modules-*-<flavour> too
<johandc> Okay, i'll have to read up on it, since i have never done it before :)
<allee> johandc: great, then I can have a time for fai-kernels
<johandc> allee, why? Isn't the modules build manually with module assistant? Or are you suggesting that the kernel guys could supply pre-compiled modules?
<allee> johandc: you can use the recipe I posted in the bug report.  Just adapting dch args to match the SRU requirements
<imbrandon> allee, it will need to be a -backpoprt not SRU
<allee> johandc: yes, everyone installing afs need to run module-assistant
<allee> imbrandon: oh, right.  sorry.
<johandc> Okay, i think i'm clear what to do now.
<imbrandon> johandc, https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuBackports   <--- has a section about requesting and preparing a backport
<johandc> Just one final question, are SRU always this tight? We are talking about replacing a package that is broken anyways. In fact, removing 1.4.1 from the repos will save alot of people some time realising it cannot build.
<imbrandon> johandc, basicly you make sure the version in feisty will compile with no changes in edgy and file a request
<johandc> imbrandon: Thanks a lot for the link :D
<imbrandon> johandc, yes, actualty tighter, you have to rember this will be an update for potentialy 8 million users for a STABLE release, every change it scrutinised
<imbrandon> no matter how "sane" it seems
<allee> imbrandon: honestly.  I'm pretty sure, either openafs 1.4.1* has a security bug in edgy forever, or 1.4.4 is eventually approved for SRU too.   1.4.* is used in production environment world wide.  A break in 1.4.1 -> 1.4.4 is 'almost impossible'.
<ajmitch> night all
<Fujitsu> Night ajmitch
<imbrandon> allee, i know, i'm just going by the book here for the moment
<imbrandon> :)
<imbrandon> gnight ajmitch 
<allee> imbrandon: :)
<Fujitsu> allee: 1.4.1 doesn't really exist in Edgy, does it?
<allee> night ajmitch 
<johandc> Fujitsu: openafs-modules-source 1.4.1-4 in universe
<allee> Fujitsu:   User space part of 1.4.1-4 in in edgy.  Kernel space part FTBFS. 
<Fujitsu> allee: There's no security risk if it FTBFS, surely?
<johandc> what is FTBFS?
<Fujitsu> Fails to build from source.
<johandc> Ahh :)
<allee> Fujitsu: I've not checked if the sec bug is in user or kernel space
<allee> Fujitsu: nevertheless it's a regression.  It worked in dapper
<johandc> allee, i'm just realising that we have to backport openafs-(client|dbserver|doc|fileserver|kpassw|krb5|modules-source), libopenafs-dev and libpam-openafs-kaserver for them all to be consistent. :-/
<Fujitsu> Or you could wait a week.
<Fujitsu> That's probably the better idea.
<allee> johandc: yes, but that's not more week
<allee> s/week/work/
<johandc> Okay, i'll look further and see what i'll come up with.
<allee> johandc: when you build openafs-module-sources .deb you get the others debs for free\
<allee> johandc: feel free to ping me
<johandc> Arhh, since it's the same source package.
<johandc> Thank you.
<johandc> by ping, do you mean IRC?
<DarkSun88> Hi all
<imbrandon> johandc, yes "ping" is a term used on irc often to get someones attention
<johandc> What is an UVF exception?
<Hobbsee> !uvfe
<Fujitsu> An upstream version freeze exception.
<Hobbsee> !uvf
<siretart> johandc: see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UpstreamVersionFreeze
<ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about uvfe - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
<ubotu> uvf is Upstream Version Freeze.  For an exception, see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess#head-9523bc4076ff011324d67cddc97969ec609618d6
<johandc> Thank you :D
<ivoks> heh... i tough Fujitsu is bot :)
<siretart> hey ivoks!
<johandc> Cool reply speed :D
<siretart> ivoks: long time no see, how are you doing?
<johandc> Brb.
<ivoks> siretart: yeah... i'm idling as a MOTU for some time, and will continue that for next couple of months (finishing my faculty)
<ivoks> siretart: other than that, great... you?
<siretart> ivoks: oh, I've more or less finished with faculty, now I'm working there
<ivoks> nice ;)
<ivoks> i've started my own company... :)
<saispo> (i found why...)
* Hobbsee pings laserjock manually
<StevenK> Hobbsee: Via postal address?
<Hobbsee> StevenK: unfortunately not
<damko> imbrandon: are u busy?
<damko> let's say i'm trying to package a folder with php files ... something like phpmyadmin
<damko> do I need .configure and make files to build a package?
<StevenK> No.
<damko> StevenK: i'm following the debian mantainer guide ... but it seems it was wrote for common projects with source files and so on ...
<damko> i can't find the solution ... have u any suggestions?
<StevenK> damko: Follow it through for a small project that does need compiling, like hello, because that will allow you to understand the process so you can tackle the PHP package
<damko> StevenK: do u suggest to package a small project for which already exist a package downloding it from the source?
<StevenK> damko: Yeah, download something small, delete the debian directory, and follow the debian maintainer guide.
<StevenK> damko: Then you can compare what you did with the existing package.
<damko> StevenK: thanks for the suggestion
<damko> StevenK: at the same time i'm writing a simple txt file "how to package a php project for debian" . is there a suggested place in which I should upload it to share it?
<StevenK> No idea about that, sorry.
<damko> StevenK: thanks again
<Hobbsee> ubuntu wiki, id' suggets
<damko> Hobbsee: thanks
<nixternal> MOTU meeting today correct?
<geser> nixternal: yes, 20:00 UTC
<nixternal> someone has scheduled the meeting the same time as the DevTeam Meeting
* Hobbsee grumbles.   6am
<StevenK> Which has been moved to 900UTC
<Hobbsee> iirc
<Hobbsee> ahh
<StevenK> (Devel, not us)
<Hobbsee> ah.
<StevenK> And yes, 2000UTC == 0600EST
<Hobbsee> StevenK: call it AEST, else you'll do my head in...
<Fujitsu> How unfortunate.
<Hobbsee> EST seems to refer to the US timezone
<Fujitsu> +1 Hobbsee
<StevenK> Except in /usr/share/timezones
<Hobbsee> true
<zul> you aussies are wacky
<nixternal> yup, 0900 UTC for the Dev team meeting, a little scroll up in #-meeting told me that one ;p
<Hobbsee> which is, incidently, why they changed the LP tiems to be x minutes ago
<StevenK> Hah
<StevenK> Neat. date takes any $TZ it doesn't know about as UTC.
<StevenK> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/15209/
<ScottK> But I find the X minutes ago thing really annoying as I have to then refresh the page (and wait for LP - again) to find out when something happened...
<Fujitsu> ScottK: Or hover your cursor over the time.
<ScottK> Oh.  Never tried that.
* ScottK looks
<ScottK> How about that? Another odd, but useful LP UI but that I'd have never guessed was there.
<ScottK> Fujitsu: Thans.
<Fujitsu> I only discovered that when I complained about the new display format in #launchpad soon after it appeared.
<torkel> imbrandon: the (security)fix in bug #94787 should work in both dapper and edgy. I have no way to try them though and as the version in edgy is broken anyway I don't know if it is worth the work to upload a broken version
<ubotu> Malone bug 94787 in openafs "Openafs has a security hole with enabled suid" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/94787
<torkel> sorry for missing the discussion about SRU of Openafs
<torkel> s/SRU or backporting/
<imbrandon>  torkel not a problem
<imbrandon> i'll look after work
<jekil> hello
<Hobbsee> hiya
<ScottK> Based on the discussion we had here last night (for me) on changing source versus patching, I added a bit to the MOTU FAQ on it.  I'd appreciate it if someone who actually knows what they are doing would review: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/FAQ
<StevenK> ScottK: Looks fine to me.
<ScottK> StevenK: Thanks.
<damko> i'm looking at yada (Yet Another Debianisation Aid) 
<damko> it's used to build phpmyadmin package
<damko> it seems simple and useful
<ScottK> damko: Has it been debianized?
<damko> do u know some other tool like it to suggest to me?
<damko> ScottK: yes it is
<Hobbsee> damko: it's not.  it sucks.
<Hobbsee> damko: it deserves to die, do not, under any circumstances, use it.
* ScottK stays far away from php, so that's all I have to say on the matter.
<Hobbsee> damko: use debhelper, cdbs, but not yada.
* Fujitsu agrees with ScottK.
<damko> Hobbsee: thanks
* Fujitsu has heard little about yada, and all of that has been bad.
* StevenK has used yada once.
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: yada's a bloody terrible, illogical, piece of software
<damko> Hobbsee:  which one do u suggest for php projects to be packaged?
<StevenK> I swore about it slightly less than scons.
<Hobbsee> StevenK: yeah, well.  i havent dealt in scons (much)
<Fujitsu> scons is really annoying.
<Hobbsee> damko: debhelper.  or cdbs.  either works
<Fujitsu> CDBS == good
<StevenK> Fujitsu: http://changelogs.ubuntu.com/changelogs/pool/universe/w/wengophone/wengophone_0.99+svn4511-4ubuntu4/changelog
<StevenK> Fujitsu: Note the first item. That only took six hours.
<Fujitsu> <3 scons
<damko> Hobbsee: thanks again
<TheMuso> Afaik we have hard freeze from today do we not?
<Hobbsee> something like that
<Hobbsee> you can probably get little fixes in
<sacater> the hard freeze
<sacater> yes..
<sacater> has anyone been making any progress with peoples wifi troubles
<sacater> or wireless, both are a bit problematic
<Hobbsee> sacater: a whole lot seems to be pebkac, or undistributable
<sacater> k
<sacater> theres just a lot of talk about it
<sacater> thought i might ask
* ScottK found that the drivers for my wifi card had been moved to linux-restricted-modules for Feisty - that may be getting other people too.
<sacater> ScottK: thanks, ill remmeber that
<danirus> Hi siretart, I've a question about REVU
<bddebian> Heya gang
<Jucato> hi bddebian
<sacater> bddebian: hello there
<bddebian> Hi Jucato, sacater
<Jucato> :D
<sacater> :D
<Hobbsee> sacater: yes.  all the i3945's are pebkac, i know that much
<sacater> Hobbsee: okies
<Hobbsee> ScottK: whcih card?
<Hobbsee> sacater: seeing as i've got that, it works *fine*
<Hobbsee> sacater: seems that NM is playing havoc a bit, and a lot of people are running static IP's too - which NM doesnt handle
<ScottK> Hobbsee: D-Link AirPlus DWL-G650 Wireless (rev.C) - Atheros AR5212 (rev 01) - See Bug #86742 for all the card details.
<Hobbsee> ScottK: ahhh, so that's moved to l-r-m now...
<Hobbsee> wait, wasnt that in l-r-m for edgy too?
* Hobbsee points to her other laptop, which has tthat card
<ScottK> Lovely: [10:22]  <ubotu> Error: Could not parse data returned by Malone: timed out
<Hobbsee> nice card, that
* ScottK still has a hard drive with an Edgy install for the laptop in question.
<ScottK> I can check for sure, but I have no recollection of installing l-r-m when I installed Edgy.
<ScottK> I don't think I even knew what that was at the time I did it.
<Hobbsee> should have installed by default, i would think
<ScottK> Well maybe that's it, but then it didn't install by default for Feisty.
<ScottK> (back when I installed Feisty)
<Hobbsee> right
<Hobbsee> this installed l-r-m for feisty, and upgraded correctly
<Hobbsee> but i've not tried a clean feisty install
<sacater> why dont people make a fallback system so people can go back systems
<sacater> from feisty to edgy for example
<Hobbsee> sacater: because the effort is better spent in other things
<StevenK> Because downgrades are *HARD*
<sacater> :P
<Hobbsee> sacater: and there's a limited supply of resources
<StevenK> Upgrade package a from version 1 -> 2 ; run a binary provided by a which upgrades its config in an incompatible way ; downgrade back to 1 ; run binary and boom.
<ScottK> sacater: I test on my laptop that has (relatively) easily swapped hard drives with a spare drive.
<sacater> is it me or is launchoad super-laggy
<jussi01> sacater, it always is
<sacater> launchpad*
<sacater> well seems more than normal
<Hobbsee> it is
<rrittenhouse> im experiencing that too
<sacater> oh ive shot up 4000 karma in a few days
<sacater> LD
<sacater> :D
<rrittenhouse> im still at 0 :( haha. Ive only added some comments to some bugs...afraid of messing the bug reports up or something. Not doing it right..who knows ;)
<sacater> rrittenhouse: little tip, answer questions, that gets karma right up
<xtknight> how does your karma rise ?
<rrittenhouse> it was more of a confirmation of a bug
<xtknight> ratemykarma ? :P
<sacater> xtknight: how do you mean, do you mean how the calculate it
<rrittenhouse> Like after the updates yesterday the Network Manager icon shows the interface as being down but in all reality its all working just fine.
<xtknight> sacater, yeah
<sacater> xtknight: i dont know! all i know is that questions get a lot
<rrittenhouse> Does someone have to actually assign the karma or does the system see that you answered a question...
<Hobbsee> rrittenhouse: i doubt you will
<zul> karma is overrated
<rrittenhouse> haha. Its interesting though..
<crimsun> hear hear
<ScottK> rrittenhouse: See https://launchpad.net/~bugsquad if you want to get more involved in triaging/updating bugs.
<imbrandon> and #ubuntu-bugs
<dholbach> and http://wiki.ubuntu.com/HelpingWithBugs
<rrittenhouse> I'm a member of the group on LP.. have been since OpenWeek.
<rrittenhouse> I just need to try a little harder and not be so afraid of screwing things up ;)
<bddebian> WTH is OpenWeek?
<rrittenhouse> wasnt it Ubuntu OpenWeek
* bddebian is soo out of touch lately :'-(
<rrittenhouse> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuOpenWeek
<sacater> rrittenhouse: its automatic
<rrittenhouse> sacater, ah neat.
<sacater> ScottK: im on that team  :P
<ScottK> I've updated https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ContributingToDebian/PythonModulesTeam based on the comments and contributions (thanks Toadstool) I got here and from stratus.  I'd appreciate another review if anyone has a moment.
<Hobbsee> bddebian: clearly you were sleeping.  was ages ago
<bddebian> Hobbsee: I'm just clueless :'-(
<Hobbsee> bddebian: or have just forgotten about it
* Hobbsee gives bddebian a new brain
<stratus> ScottK: oh, thanks. I'll read and reply your other message after my lunch. :-)
<ScottK> bddebian: Maybe, but some of us (me) are even more clueless.  Please go fix up my wiki page - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ContributingToDebian/PythonModulesTeam
<rrittenhouse> Yeah it was last year...thats when I triaged a bug or two and really I stopped. Im not sure if it was the complexity of Launchpad that I didnt understand or if it was the procedures that were not clear to me. Either way I needed to mess with it some more
<zul> isnt there another one coming up?
<sacater> Hobbsee: ill take a brain too pleas
<xtknight> brains are overrated
* Hobbsee mmm....brains...
* xtknight sips coffee while anxiously awaiting a response on the network manager issues
<rrittenhouse> xtknight, The issue where the icon isnt correct on startup?
<xtknight> yeah...that..
<rrittenhouse> xtknight, Got a bug # for that?
<xtknight> well it looks like n-m is totally bugged
<rrittenhouse> hmm
<xtknight> it's fighting with ifconfig,dhclient and lots of stuff
<rrittenhouse> nice, nice.
<xtknight> LP is ~down but bug# 105234
<xtknight> 13 dupes so far
<rrittenhouse> yeah i realized that it was down hmm
<rrittenhouse> ok
<rrittenhouse> thanks for the bug# ill check it out in a bit..
<xtknight> i had a prelim patch for it that fixed it for me but it looks like there are more underlying issues
<rrittenhouse> ah i see
<rrittenhouse> Did you create the patch?
<xtknight> my second patch attempt yeah.  i have only one actualyl in ubuntu currently
<rrittenhouse> back up here.. for now
<rrittenhouse> thats awesome though
<rrittenhouse> hey at least you made attempts haha
<xtknight> can't guarantee it won't shut down the universe... ;P
<rrittenhouse> rofl
* sacater goes for caffeine fluid
* sacater returns with caffeine fluid
<rrittenhouse> i need some of that
<xtknight> black coffee?
<sacater> no
<sacater> some cheap thing from LIDL
* Hobbsee hands sacater a caffeine drip
<sacater> i get lots for lets
<sacater> less*
* sacater accepts the caffeine drip thankingly
<sacater> when is there an motu meeting, a place where all motu meet up
<Nafallo> sacater: which of them? :-)
<sacater> fosdem?
<rrittenhouse> hmm wonder what they are doing to LP...
<sacater> rrittenhouse: trashing it
<rrittenhouse> haha
<xtknight> just making it slow for fun
<rrittenhouse> so wrong
<xtknight> so we can all suffer
<sacater> THE PAIN!!
<sacater> :P
<rrittenhouse> Maybe if I leave for a bit..and go make something to eat itll be back up when I return haha.
<rrittenhouse> brb
<sacater> is it possible to make irssi have 2 windows split down teh screen
<crimsun> ScottK: edited.
<sacater> so i can see 2 rooms at once
<ScottK> crimsun: Thanks.
* ScottK carefully looks...
<StevenK> sacater: Yes
<sacater> StevenK: do tell..
<sacater> please.
<StevenK>  /window new ; /window goto 5
<sacater> ok
<johandc> allee: Are you there?
<sacater> okerm
<sacater> it works
<sacater> how do i change whats in the top one?
<ScottK> crimsun: Thanks again.  Those changes definitely made the page better.
<StevenK> Switch it to and /window goto
<StevenK> s/\(it\) \(to\)/\2 \1/
<sacater> ScottK: erm nope
<sacater> ScottK: i cant control it
<ScottK> sacater: Can't control what?
<sacater> i have 2 windows, plus a highlight at the top
<sacater> im talking with thje bottom window
<sacater> how do i use the top one
* proppy hugs dholbach
<sacater> ScottK: here is a screenie http://omploader.org/file/Screenshot-143.png
* dholbach hugs proppy back
<sacater> all fixed
<sacater> just restarted irssi
<sacater> remove the changes
<johandc> !backports
<ubotu> If new updated Ubuntu packages are built for an application, then they go into Ubuntu Backports. See https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuBackports - See also !packaging
<johandc> !packaging
<ubotu> The packaging guide is at http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/index.html - See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/New for information on getting a package integrated into Ubuntu - Other developer resources are at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DeveloperResources - See also !backports
<sacater> ubuntu rules..
<superm1> Seveas, ping
<allee> johandc: hi back
<johandc> Hi
<johandc> Critical moment, i'm on my way out the door.
<johandc> I successfully built all the 1.4.4-1 packages from feisty
<allee> johandc: great!
<johandc> Did it in a clean qemu edgy environment
<johandc> But i'm experiencing some problems though
<johandc> sudo /etc/init.d/openafs-client restart does not work
<johandc> The module fails to unload correctly
<johandc> Please try if you can do the same.
<allee> johandc: mhh, does depmod -a    help?
<johandc> maybe
<allee> johandc: oh you wrote unload, not load
<johandc> But dmesg spouts alot of memory errors
<johandc> There are no problems loading the module in the first case.
<allee> johandc: which old openafs version.  I've see these unload errors too
<johandc> I can also connect to our afs server, but some issues persist.
<allee> johandc: I'll try here with my debs ...
<johandc> It seems that the connection disappears some times
<johandc> Please also try kinit, aklog and browse afs.
<johandc> When i return i can create a new bugreport about the unload errors.
<allee> johandc: I always use klog
<johandc> what's the difference?
<allee> johandc: good question ;)
<johandc> Well, i got to go.
<johandc> I'll look into the troubles a bit later this evening.
<allee> johandc: I'll be here for some more hours
<johandc> Maybe the problems is our server, and not the client.
<johandc> See you then
<allee> johandc: see you
<slytherin> dholbach: ping
<slytherin> mehulved: Once a UVF has been granted, who is responsible for uploading new version of package?
<lionel> slytherin: a MOTU
<slytherin> lionel: Actually, I had filed a UVF long ago. It was approved within a week. But no one touched it after that. I was hoping that package maintainer will upload new version.
<lionel> do you have the bug number?
<lionel> (I am not a MOTU, I can not upload)
<slytherin> lionel: 2 minutes
<slytherin> lionel: launchpad not accessible :-( The bug is in package devede
<damko> mmm i give up .... debhelper and cdbs are really a nightmare ... too complex to me
<damko> really the use of yada is deprecated ?
<damko> or isn't there any other tool suggested for a simple approach to deb packages?
<ScottK> cdbs is usually pretty simple.
<damko> ScottK: https://perso.duckcorp.org/duck/cdbs-doc/cdbs-doc.xhtml may be i'm stupid .. but ... what to say .. to difficult 4 me
<ScottK> Can you find an existing php package you can copy off of?  That's how I did my first one.
<damko> ScottK: yes done php-doc and phpmyadmin are quite clean
<damko> anyway I really can't understand how to write, in a serious way, the rules file and the others
<slytherin> lionel: bug 95153
<ubotu> Malone bug 95153 in devede "Please sync to latest version 2.12 from debian-multimedia" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/95153
<kofler> Can you add custom made Debian packages to an apt-mirror run on a LAN without setting up a separate repository?
<dholbach> slytherin: pong
<damko> kofler: ... u should find a way to add your package to the list file
<kofler> damko: Well, in this particular case, it's a patch that's trivial and wouldn't be sufficient for the community at large.
<kofler> damko: But there is another package I will seriously consider doing that for.
<kofler> damko: Although, REVU doesn't seem to be reviewed very often any more.
<slytherin> dholbach: if you are not too busy can you please take care of bug 95153? The UVF was granted long time back but looks like package maintainer is too busy to upload new version.
<ubotu> Malone bug 95153 in devede "Please sync to latest version 2.12 from debian-multimedia" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/95153
<dholbach> slytherin: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SponsorshipProcess
<dholbach> slytherin: I'm quite busy... sorry
<damko> kofler: I don't think I'm the right to discuss this topic
<slytherin> dholbach: No issues. I will check the link.
<damko> kofler: sorry
<damko> have to go
<damko> bye and thanks
<dholbach> kofler: do you want to get a patch included in Ubuntu or what are you trying to do?
<kofler> dholbach: Two separate things.
* slytherin hugs dholbach for all the nice work he does.
* dholbach hugs slytherin back
<dholbach> slytherin: thanks for all your work too
<kofler> dholbach: One package is something I will never consider submitting to Ubuntu. Put it this way, I made something use case insensitivity (by modifying the upstream source) when it currently resides using case sensitiveness.
<kofler> dholbach: The other package is something that a lot of people seem to want but no one seems to want to put the effort in. I know the process for this, so I will do that later on.
<kofler> dholbach: My question for the first package was how to add that package into the apt-mirror hosted locally without setting up a separate 'localhost' repository.
<dholbach> kofler: Ok, I see. Feel free to ping in here or on ubuntu-motu@lists.ubuntu.com if there's not enough attention on your new package
<dholbach> kofler: thought it will be rather gutsy and not feisty (we're too late in the game for NEW packages)
<kofler> dholbach: I also have a couple of packages on REVU, but I don't see a large number of them not being reviewed. I just wanted to categorically put that out there.
<kofler> gutsy is the name for feisty+1 now eh? Interesting...
<dholbach> kofler: we are working on improving the process
<dholbach> kofler: "gutsy gibbon" - Mark announced it today
<kofler> dholbach: That's always good to hear :)
<dholbach> kofler: for now, please ping either in here or on the motu mailing list for a review
<dholbach> kofler: if that doesn't help - drop me a mail and I'll take some time to review those packages
<dholbach> kofler: are you using apt-ftparchive?
<dholbach> ok, I need to leave for now - see you later in the motu meeting
<bddebian> Damnit, I was SOO hoping for Grumpy Gnu
* bddebian hides
<kofler> Does that mean that all the new packages put into REVU should be using gutsy wherever they were currently using feisty?
<bddebian> Once it opens they will need changed yes
<kofler> Darn.
<nixternal> OK, I need a sed monkey
* somerville32 wishes he had a sed monkey.
* welshbyte wonders what a sed monkey is
<sistpoty> hi folks
<somerville32> Hello
<Lin> how can I change a keymap on feisty? I couldn't find any keymap on /usr/share/keymaps/. What is setupcon? it hasn't a man page?  What happned with old linux wizardy? Im scared! 
<Lin> hi all ;-) before ;-)
<sacater> hey, i removed wacom tools from my xorg.conf, and now xserver dosnt work
<sacater> whats going on?
<_MMA_> sacater: Put it back. Same thing happened to me but I didnt look into it yet.
<sacater> upload /var/log/Xorg.0.log please
<sacater> rafb.net/paste will do
<sacater> okay wtf
<sacater> i didnt say that...
<sacater> yes you did
<sacater> gah!
<sacater> not me!
<sacater> oh yes you did!
<sacater> okay wtf is that
<sacater> sacater
<sacater> is it spaceinvadr?
<sacater> i dt
* gnomefreak wants the drugs hes on
<sacater> haha
<sacater> magical pixie dust
<sacater_> its not me
<sacater_> someone is using my irssi
<sacater_> i sweat
<sacater_> i swear*
<sacater_> grr
<sacater_> and i know who it is too
<gnomefreak> easy way to fix that
<sacater_> ?
<sacater_> tell..
<sacater> nah
<sacater> that would be telling
<gnomefreak> log off  ;)
<sacater_> i tried that
<sacater_> he is abusing screen on a mates servewr
<sacater_> server*
<sacater_> he cant do sacater_ as thats local
<spaceinvader> haha pixie dust
<sacater> ok i think i am me again
<sacater> sorry about that
<sacater> someone abused my mates server admin abilities
<sacater> and took over screen
<spaceinvader> i abused you ;p
<spaceinvader> and su sacater, screen -x isnt exactly "taking over"
<sacater> yes
<sacater> another screenie...
<sacater> its a PITA
<spaceinvader> anyway, both of you pastebin /var/log/Xorg.*.log
<sacater> very wekk
<sacater> mine is working now
<sacater> sorta
<sacater> i did startx
<sacater> and it came back, but sometimes it fails sometimes not
<sacater> ill paste though...
<spaceinvader> btw
<spaceinvader> i did that since i found you hacking
<sacater> hacking?
<sacater> what was i hacking?
<spaceinvader> rm -rf bin/
<spaceinvader> rm -rf spaceinvader/
<spaceinvader> that isnt nice
<sacater> hee hee
<sacater> well yeah..
<spaceinvader> even if you dont have the permissions, thats still intent
<sacater> no..
<sacater> can we shake up and declare 'even'
<spaceinvader> yes
<spaceinvader> maybe
* sacater shakes spaceinvader's hand
<sacater> file:///var/log/Xorg.20.log.old
* spaceinvader uses electric buzzy thing
<sacater> file:///var/log/Xorg.20.log
<sacater> file:///var/log/Xorg.2.log
<spaceinvader> erm
<sacater> file:///var/log/Xorg.1.log.old
<sacater> file:///var/log/Xorg.1.log
<spaceinvader> i dont think we can access that
<sacater> file:///var/log/Xorg.0.log.old
<sacater> file:///var/log/Xorg.0.log
<sacater> which one?
<sacater> er
<spaceinvader> all of them
<sacater> im asking
<sacater> which one do you want
<spaceinvader> file:// points to your machine...
<sacater> ok...
<sacater> ill use paste.py for that
<sacater> i know thqat
<spaceinvader> do ls -l and gimme the most recent one
<sacater> that*
<_MMA_> This is really unnecessary in the channel. 
<sacater> spaceinvader: http://rafb.net/p/N7HwS976.html
<cxd> Hello all.
<sacater> spaceinvader: that one obviously dosnt have the errors
<sacater> spaceinvader: must be an earlier one
<spaceinvader> yeah
<cxd> I want to know how to have a program included in k/ubuntu.
<_MMA_> cxd: On install or in the repos?
<cxd> the repos
<_MMA_> cxd: Can you package?
<cxd> I have never attempted to package myself, I am a newbee.
<rmjb> cxd: look here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/Candidates
<_MMA_> Would you like to learn?
<_MMA_> There ya go.
<rmjb> intro completely
<cxd> Learning is good.
<rmjb> sorry, read the intro completely
<sacater> spaceinvader: i just tried to make an xsession, and got you a lovely error report
<spaceinvader> cool
<spaceinvader> paste away
<DktrKranz> what if a package only has a version number but no revision at all? should a modified package ship -0ubuntu1 revision?
<sacater> spaceinvader: http://rafb.net/p/ZD606426.html
<sacater> spaceinvader: i did sudo startx -- :1 and the the nvidia driver logo flashed up fine, then the screen becomes greyish with black dots
<spaceinvader> thats normal
<spaceinvader> thats just x when there is nothing running on it
<rmjb> DktrKranz: that sounds about right, you mean if there's no debian version?
<cxd> ok I have looked at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/Candidates and the package I would like included in not there?
<DktrKranz> rmjb, yes
<DktrKranz> i was referring to gallimimus
<rmjb> cxd: file a bug named [needs-packaging]  <package name> and make sure it has the needs-packaging tag
<DktrKranz> version 0.1.0
<rmjb> cxd: but you should also check the debian-wnpp link on that page to see if it's in progress in debian
<rmjb> DktrKranz: in that case yes, it would be versioned <version>-0ubuntu1
<cxd> I will check the debian link first.
<DktrKranz> ok, thanks :)
<sacater> spaceinvader: so what do you think the troubles are about then?
<spaceinvader> there are none it seems
<spaceinvader> try egrep '(EE)|(WW)' /var/log/Xorg.*
<rmjb> how do I set a needs-packaging bug to wishlist? that option is not available to me on launchpad.
<sacater> erm its big
<sacater> i will paste...
<spaceinvader> k
<spaceinvader> pipe it into pypaste
<Adri2000> rmjb: ask someone who is in the qa team
<spaceinvader> egrep '(EE)|(WW)' /var/log/Xorg.* | pypaste.py -n sacater -d 'x errors'
<spaceinvader> sacater: ^
<rmjb> Adri2000: is membership to that team open so I can do it myself?
<sacater> whoa
<sacater> ok
<cxd> ok I have checked the debian links and nothing is mentioned about the package I wan't.
<Adri2000> rmjb: it's a restricted team
<cxd> want
<gnomefreak> rmjb: bug number?
<rmjb> cxd: then file the bug :)
<ScottK> rmjb: What bug?
<gnomefreak> rmjb: you have to apply for qa
<cxd> how long does this process take be realistic so I know what to expect.
<rmjb> just a general question... because we tell people to set the bug as wishlist, but they can't
<Adri2000> rmjb: s/restricted/moderated/ actually, it's how launchpad calls it
<ScottK> Ah.
<gnomefreak> rmjb: if you talk to bdmurry (atleast im fairly sure he is the one now) in #ubuntu-bugs about joining
<sacater> spaceinvader: http://rafb.net/p/i8TuRo24.html
<spaceinvader> sacater: another tip, /set awl_automode screen for a cooler looking chan list
<sacater> spaceinvader: it had better be cooler
<ScottK> rmjb: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuQA
<spaceinvader> it goes down the side
<spaceinvader> somewhat like xcha
<sacater> erm
<sacater> bad for me
<rmjb> ScottK, gnomefreak: didn't want to join qa... still working through MOTU :) just a question, the wording of the Candidates page will have to change, that's all
<ScottK> Ah.
<sacater> spaceinvader: use screen -x again, i dont mind this time
<gnomefreak> oh ok sorry
<spaceinvader> why?
<sacater> spaceinvader: youll see...
<ScottK> Joining QA is a lot easier than becoming a MOTU.
<spaceinvader> okay?
<gnomefreak> yes it is
<sacater> yes i allow it this time
<sacater> just to see what you have done
* gnomefreak cant join motu :(
<spaceinvader> sacater: i know what it looks like anyway
<rmjb> In that case i'll look at QA... something to get Ubuntu membership :)
<sacater> spaceinvader: no no, mine looks bad things are everywher
* rmjb still wants to be a MOTU some day though
<spaceinvader> erm
<spaceinvader> hit ctrl-l
<sacater> ok
<spaceinvader> ctrl-alt l
<sacater> nothing
<spaceinvader> ctrl-alt a l
<spaceinvader> or /redraw
<sacater> thats better
<spaceinvader> any better?
<sacater> no
<spaceinvader> lol
<spaceinvader> re do screen -DRR
<rmjb> cxd: got through with the needs-packaging request?
<ScottK> rmjb: It took me about a day to get accepted into bugsquad, put the requested info together (pastebin is good), and then get bdmurray to look at it and accept me into QA.
<gnomefreak> ScottK: how would i go about proving my packaging if mine go through a core devel
<spaceinvader> then it should come back normal
<sacater> ooh
<sacater> it is better
<spaceinvader> ;p
<sacater> oh
<ScottK> gnomefreak: Not sure what you mean?
<sacater> but i cant see last channels
<spaceinvader> what do you mean
<spaceinvader> is your window too small?
<sacater> i have more channels than 36
<sacater> and 36 is all that fit down the side
<cxd> no I am still reading on the packaging request.
<spaceinvader> make the window taller?
<sacater> its at full
<sacater> im gonna keep it as it was
<sacater> how do i revert back?
<gnomefreak> ScottK: the packages i package are either in my repo testing for gutsy or in main. asac takes my package and respins it if i patched it or what not
<rmjb> cxd: it helps if you look at an existing needs-packaging bug to see what is needed, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/103828 for example
<ubotu> Malone bug 103828 in Ubuntu "[needs packaging]  Simple Invoices" [Wishlist,In progress]  
<gnomefreak> ScottK: i have never put package through revu
<spaceinvader> sacater: /set awl_automode bar
<ScottK> gnomefreak: Then start with Gutsy.
<sacater> thats more like it
<gnomefreak> ill try.
<spaceinvader> k
<sacater> spaceinvader: did you review that egrep output?
<ScottK> gnomefreak: Does asac leave your name in the changelog?
<spaceinvader> sacater: yeah
<sacater> spaceinvader: good?
* sacater thinks bad
<spaceinvader> sacater: it looks like you have defined too many input devices
<ScottK> If so, it should be clear it's your work regardless of the path.
<spaceinvader> sacater: upload /etc/X11/xorg.conf
<gnomefreak> ScottK: iceape is packaged and ready for gutsy almost but i think he will be uploading it since its one less step
<gnomefreak> ScottK: not sure never looked. i know he added me as a contributor to one patch
<sacater> spaceinvader: http://rafb.net/p/k7ksfV21.html
<cxd> thank you for that.
<sacater> spaceinvader: seems fine to me
<ScottK> gnomefreak: Check and see if the packages show up in your name on your LP page?
<gnomefreak> looking
<rmjb> cxd: if you'd like to help you can convert some requests from the Candidates page to needs-packaging bugs :)
<cxd> i would love to help, but let me figure out how to file my request correctly first.
<rmjb> yeah no probs... just sayin
<spaceinvader> sacater: looking
<cxd> I want to do this correctly.
<gnomefreak> ScottK: under Package maintenance report is nothing. so i guess he has changed them. 
<rmjb> gnomefreak: what package?
<ScottK> If you continue to go through him, you might want to ask him not to.
<spaceinvader> sacater: yeah its fine
<gnomefreak> ScottK: ok
<sacater> spaceinvader: so whats going on then
<gnomefreak> well lets see what happens with iceape
<spaceinvader> perhaps you had mixed up xorg.confs
<spaceinvader> but the one you have now is fine
<gnomefreak> once i get it ready after toolchain
<sacater> spaceinvader: btw, sort out descarte's keyboard locale, i cant do pound signs
<spaceinvader> thats not that, thats utf-8
<sacater> oh
<spaceinvader> i can fix it though
<spaceinvader> just this once ;p
<sacater> spaceinvader: any other ideas what could be messing up with my xserver
<ScottK> gnomefreak: I've done everything I've done through REVU and debdiffs on bug reports in LP - https://launchpad.net/~kitterman/+packages
<gnomefreak> looking
<sacater> spaceinvader: how do i switch xservers. something = F7
<spaceinvader> ctrl-alt f7?
<spaceinvader> sacater: right, run /set term_charset UTF-8 in irssi
<spaceinvader> sacater: then detach screen
<spaceinvader> sacater: logout completley from descartes
<spaceinvader> sacater: then log back in and reattach
<salty-horse> hi. are there any plans to package the 32-bit libraries required by wine for amd64? It will really help the usability of ubuntu (even though it conflicts with the debian approach(?))
<sacater> 
<sacater> spaceinvader: oh lookee
<sacater> 
<spaceinvader> that was quick of you
<sacater> i get that for a pound sign
<sacater> spaceinvader: thank you
<spaceinvader> as a result, all theses german people's names will work too
<sacater> spaceinvader: meh, go to #welp
<cxd> ok I have filed my bug according to the template you gave.
<cxd> bug 105975
<ubotu> Malone bug 105975 in Ubuntu "[needs-packaging]  manslide" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/105975
* sistpoty is off again... cya
<rmjb> cxd: looks good, better than my packaging request :P
<cxd> I think it is actually a kde program I do not know if that makes any difference.
<cxd> I do not want to have to use a windows program if there is a linux GPL alternative out there.
<ScottK> cxd: You should consider packaging it yourself.
<ScottK> People here will help you (after the Feisty release).
<cxd> Ok but I am a newbe and I have little experience.
<rmjb> cxd: does that app have a site of it's own?
<cxd> yes I listed the url on the URL https://launchpad.net/bugs/105975
<ubotu> Malone bug 105975 in Ubuntu "[needs-packaging]  manslide" [Wishlist,Unconfirmed]  
<ScottK> cxd: That's how everyone starts.  This is a good place to do it (start).  I started working on packaging here in December and had my first package accepted into Debian yesterday.
<cxd> congratulations.
<rmjb> cxd: I meant not on kde-apps... but I guess it doesn't... the freshmeat page links to kde-apps also
<rmjb> ScottK surpassed me... because I got distracted by cedega over christmas :(
<rmjb> but I still have my mark on ubuntu... I've packaged iriverter which is in feisty :)
* ScottK is way to old to get distracted by stuff like that.
<bddebian> ScottK: Don't talk to me about old :)
<ScottK> cxd: I good way to get started learning the packaging stuff is to find bugs in LP that are tagged both bitesize and packaging.
<ScottK> bddebian: You are WAY younger than me.
<bddebian> :)
<bddebian> I just wanted to hear that.  Usually I'm the old man ;-P
<rmjb> cxd: since that's *the* side for manslide it looks good
<ScottK> I have a daughter tsmithe's age. (I think it was tsmithe).
<tsmithe> hmm?
<tsmithe> i am 15, yes
<rmjb> cxd: if you want to help you can do something easy by just converting some packaging requests from the Candidates page to needs-packaging bugs
<ScottK> Yeah.  tsmithe was the one.
<cxd> I would love to help do you have some instructions for me.
<rmjb> cxd: great! it's easy to do, just there's a lot so every contribution helps, just go through the list on the Candidates page I linked you and file an equivalent bug for it... that page was the old way of doing things
<rmjb> cxd: when you've created the bug, delete the line on the Candidates page by using the Edit link at the top
<gnomefreak> breezy support is gone right?
<Nafallo> no
<Nafallo> tomorrow :-)
<gnomefreak> lol
<Nafallo> Thu, 12 Apr 2007 22:57:53 +0200
<Nafallo> ;-)
<ajmitch> not soon enough
<Nafallo> agreed
<ajmitch> of course dapper will be around for a long long time
<Nafallo> hehe
<Nafallo> don't remind me ;-)
<ajmitch> 5 years is a lifetime in this business :)
<Nafallo> but I actually have a server on dapper :-P
* ajmitch also
<cxd> OK where do I find the Candidates page?
<cxd> rmjb where is the Candidates page so I can look at it?
<TheMuso> So do we have a meeting/
<TheMuso> Looks like there has been no change to the ajenda.
<ScottK> cxd: I think he means https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/Candidates
<cxd> thank you ScottK.
<freacky22527> cxd: also have a look to needs-packaging tagged bugs ;)
<freacky22527> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.tag=needs-packaging&start=0
<TheMuso> gah I missed it. Stupid me.
<TheMuso> never mind
<cxd> ok will someone look at this one that I have fixed is there anything else I need to to do? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/78642
<ubotu> Malone bug 78642 in Ubuntu "[needs-packaging]  kuvio for Multiverse" [Wishlist,Unconfirmed]  
<cxd> I just go down to list and change the title to [needs-packaging] 
<ScottK> cxd: If you want an easy bug fix to learn on (after the release), see this one: Bug #105567
<ubotu> Malone bug 105567 in mantis "Apparently missing mysql-client dependency" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/105567
<ScottK> cxd: Bug #78642 looks good to me.
<ubotu> Malone bug 78642 in Ubuntu "[needs-packaging]  kuvio for Multiverse" [Wishlist,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/78642
<cxd> I can see that everyone is busy getting ready for the new release.  Would it be better if I come back after the new release so you all can teach me how to help.
<ScottK> The real experts are busy with the release.  Us peons are pretty free, so I don't think there's a need to go away.
<salty-horse> hi. I noticed that the scummvm entry in gnome-app-install doesn't has the default golden square icon. After I installed it, I see the icon. How come I can see icons for other games that are not installed?
<Fujitsu> salty-horse: The script that generates the app-install data doesn't seem to be grabbing the icon properly.
<salty-horse> Fujitsu, which script exactly?
<Fujitsu> salty-horse: Not sure where it is.
<salty-horse> is it documented anywhere?
<fgcwatt> newbie question: is it ok to test and fix bugs on vmware guest?
<sacater> hey guys, was there an update that removed the bug reporter from the menu, guy here complains that there was https://answers.launchpad.net/malone/+ticket/4700
<danohuiginn> sacater: I believe so. check archives of ubuntu-devel
<danohuiginn> (email list)
<DktrKranz> sacater, it was decided to remove them
<sacater> thanks
<sacater> thats another answer for sacater :P
<welshbyte> there's no I in team ;)
<jmg> theres no U in team either, moron
<jmg> </quote>
<welshbyte> heh
<jmg> (not calling welshbyte a moron there, just completing the quote)
<jmg> (we're all friends here)
<welshbyte> no offence taken :)
<jmg> (<3 welshbyte)
<sacater> DktrKranz: quick check... will it be added after feisty has been officially released (i hope so, as there will be a ton of bugs :P)
<DktrKranz> I don't think so
<fgcwatt> I'm running ubuntu in vmware guest. Is it ok to test and fix bugs in it?
<sacater> DktrKranz: why not?
<sacater> DktrKranz: surely we need people to report bugs..
<DktrKranz> of course
<sacater> so it will be added back...
<DktrKranz> but we do *not* want to have dupes
<sacater> ah
<fgcwatt> Anyone?
<DktrKranz> since almost every bug has been reported during development
<DktrKranz> it was decited to pull it off
<jmg> DktrKranz: so we want triagers
<jmg> to find the dupes
<DktrKranz> jmg, using apport is easier
<jmg> "almost every bug"
<jmg> apport?
<DktrKranz> you have a full backtrace
<jmg> dont you know what bug triage is?
<jmg> only on crashes?
<sacater> wow this guy dosnt want much https://answers.launchpad.net/edubuntu-website/+ticket/4578
<DktrKranz> well, apport just reports crashes, if I mind well
<sacater> anyone know the answer to any of the 5 things he wants/
<sacater> ?
<fgcwatt> Any Motu's here?
<sacater> fgcwatt: of course
<ajmitch> sacater: maybe ask in #edubuntu?
<sacater> many of us are
<DktrKranz> sacater, perhaps using sabayon?
<sacater> maybe
<sacater> ill ask about
<sacater> thanks
<fgcwatt> well...can I use a vmware image to test and fix bugs with it?
<TheMuso> Morning ajmitch.
<DktrKranz> fgcwatt, of course, it's a great way to do so
<fgcwatt> great thanks.... some folks would say otherwise
<ajmitch> morning TheMuso 
<sacater> heh
<sacater> its 11:10 pm here
#ubuntu-motu 2007-04-13
<fgcwatt> DktrKranz, can I use pbuilder to test any distro regardless of kernel/distro I use? 
<danohuiginn> fgcwatt: it should work with anything debian-based [correct me if I'm wrong, people] 
<crimsun> fgcwatt: what do you mean by "test any distro"?
<fgcwatt> dapper; edgy; feisty
<Fujitsu> Any Debianish will work.
<Fujitsu> So, yes.
<Fujitsu> *Anything
<fgcwatt> ok...great
<keescook> when does universe freeze?  I've got another upload of mythtv with 3 more bugs fixed...
<TheMuso> keescook: Twas supposed to be Thursday this week, but nothing has been announced yet. So I don't know where things stand.
<ajmitch> keescook: we talked about it at the motu meeting & fixes are still ok
<ajmitch> so go for it :)
<keescook> TheMuso: yeah, same here.  :)  Okay, then I'll go ahead with the bug fix upload.  :)
<ajmitch> 08:13 < sistpoty> dholbach: so it's just regular uploading from the motu pov, right?
<ajmitch> 08:14 < dholbach> atm, yes
<ajmitch> 08:14 < sistpoty> ok
<ajmitch> 08:14 < dholbach> not sure if it's going to change in the remaining 7 days
<ajmitch> 08:14 < dholbach> I feel most of us have been quite conservative with their fixes
<keescook> ajmitch: cool
<TheMuso> ajmitch: Whos doing minutes? SOrry I couldn't make it.
<ajmitch> TheMuso: no idea, I guess I should do them tonight
<bddebian> Heya gang
<Fujitsu> Hail bddebian.
<bddebian> Hi Fujitsu
<TheMuso>  /c
<TheMuso> gah
* Hobbsee waves
<ajmitch> hello Hobbsee 
<Hobbsee> hi ajmitch :)
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: how'd the meeting go?
<ajmitch> adequate
<bddebian> Fruck, I missed another one :-(
<ajmitch> yep
* Fujitsu really didn't want to get up at 6am.
* Hobbsee neither.
* ajmitch didn't want to get up at 8am
<bddebian> Oh well I suck anyhoo
<ajmitch> bddebian, the motivational speaker
<bddebian> :)
<Fujitsu> Very nice of crosshurd to clobber my sources.list...
<ajmitch> why would you use crosshurd?
<Fujitsu> To install a Hurd system?
<ajmitch> again, why?
<Hobbsee> crosshurd?
<Fujitsu> Because I want to see what the Hurd is like at the moment, I suppose!
<bddebian> Fujitsu: Ignore ajmitch, he's a traitor ;-P
<welshbyte> hmm
* welshbyte should fix more bugs
<joejaxx> hello all
<joejaxx> bddebian: lol
<bddebian> welshbyte: Yeah, you should fix them all!
<welshbyte> ok. 2 secs...
<xtknight> please make the stars align first
<xtknight> it's more important than this lousy feisty stuff
* welshbyte delegates
<xtknight> set it to a lower NICE level
<unix_infidel> hey guys, do any of the maintainers here expect any drastic changes to the from the beta release point to the official release point?
<unix_infidel> i'm hoping i can get away with installing the beta and doing a simple dist upgrade.
<ScottK> unix_infidel: You should be able to do that.
<AnAnt> ScottK: ping
<ScottK> Yes
<AnAnt> ScottK: regarding the #105548
<ScottK> I know the question you are going to ask.
<AnAnt> ScottK: do you have a suggestion to fix it ?
<AnAnt> ScottK: really ? what is my question you thought ?
<ScottK> I thought the question was how come I said you had a work-around for the problem and not a fix.
<AnAnt> yes I do agree that it is NOT a fix
<AnAnt> a fix means that it should work with CHARSET=UTF8, right ?
<ScottK> AnAnt: I don't know what the fix is, multiple locales isn't something I know a lot about.
<AnAnt> ScottK: you  know who can help me with that ?
<ScottK> AnAnt: I would think it should work with all the supported charsets.
<ScottK> No.  Sorry.  Most of the stuff I do is server programs that don't interact with the keyboard.
<AnAnt> ScottK: ok, thanks 
<ScottK> You might look in Launchpad for similar bugs and see who has uploaded fixes...
<ScottK> Good luck.
<AnAnt> k
<AnAnt> thanks
<unix_infidel> is there a server release out for the beta as well?
<unix_infidel> or an alternate-cd release
<unix_infidel> ?
<ScottK> doko: I have a Python package related problem.  Earlier in the week I did a fix for Bug #80287 for pysol.  In the process I ran across Bug #104971.  As of today's new Python updates, the new (fixed) version of pysol crashes (and takes apport with it), but the original version of pysol works.  I'm not sure what's up.  The traceback is at paste.ubuntu-nl.org/15327/
<ubotu> Malone bug 80287 in pysol "Doesn't start in feisty" [Medium,Fix released]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/80287
<ubotu> Malone bug 104971 in python-defaults "Python path appears to be searched out of sequence - intermittent" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/104971
<enyc> unix_infidel: Im actually expecrting the RC versinon... not just beta
<enyc> unix_infidel: Beta is  http://releases.ubuntu.com/feisty/  
<unix_infidel> expercrting?
<enyc> unix_infidel: expecting
<enyc> unix_infidel: apparently RC version supposed to be yesterday
<ScottK> doko: The good news is I can no longer reproduce #104971.
<doko> ScottK: apparently you are looking for a module random, but you did rename it to pysol_random? don't know 
<unix_infidel> enyc: yesterday south africa time?
<enyc> unix_infidel: but nobody seems to have let me know where to find it   or that its late or whatever
<ScottK> doko: pysol provides it's own random.  That's the one I renamed.
<unix_infidel> well, i hope things to smoothly with this release.
<enyc> unix_infidel: well 2007/04/12  sometime  whenever thtat means ;-)
<unix_infidel> i'll download it on the 15mbit connection later.
<unix_infidel> adios.
<ScottK> doko: Any traceback I get from a Python console session now triggers apport and it produces it's own traceback.  Is that by design?
<doko> ScottK: dpkg -l python2.5 python-apport ?
<ScottK> Just a second.
<ScottK> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/15328/
<ScottK> doko ^^
<doko> ScottK: I can't reproduce that; could you ask pitti when he's online?
<ScottK-laptop> OK.  Will do.  doko, does pysol run for you?
<lifeless> ScottK-laptop: what do you mean precisely?
<lifeless> ScottK-laptop: can you pastebin a transcript ?
<doko> ScottK: $ pysol 
<doko> Traceback (most recent call last):
<doko>   File "/usr/share/games/pysol/pysol.py", line 101, in <module>
<doko>     mod = sys.modules[m] 
<doko> KeyError: 'random'
<doko> seems that the fix/patch is uncomplete
<ScottK-laptop> Yes it does, although it at least didn't crash before the python update.
<lifeless> ScottK-laptop: I mean the Any traceback I get from a Python console session now triggers apport and it produces it's own traceback.  Is that by design? thing
<ScottK-laptop> Ah.
<lifeless> I wrote the python apport hook y'see.
<ScottK-laptop> OK.
<ScottK-laptop> Give me a moment and I'll give you a pastbin of it.
<ScottK-laptop> lifeless:  http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/15329/
<lifeless> ScottK-laptop: can you do:
<lifeless> python -c ' from random import Random as _Random
<lifeless> '
<lifeless> meh
<lifeless> python -c 'from random import Random as _Random'
<ScottK-laptop> lifeless: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/15330/
<lifeless> ScottK-laptop: ok, random is broken for your python
<ScottK-laptop> lifeless: I am an idiot tonight.
<lifeless> ScottK-laptop: regular python console errors trigger an import of the apport code; that code tries to import 'random'. This fails and this creates a new apport error, but now the half imported module is present
* ScottK-laptop was working in :/usr/share/games/pysol$ and so apport was calling the pysol version and not the system verions.
<ScottK-laptop> versioon.
<lifeless> 'version' ?
<ScottK-laptop> version
<lifeless> absolute imports will help with this
<dholbach> good morning
<ScottK-laptop> good morning.
<ScottK-laptop> lifeless: Yes.  When I try to import random and am not in a directory that has a file named random.py in it, it imports just fine.
<ScottK-laptop> lifeless: Do you want me to write a bug against the python apport hook about the imports?
<lifeless> ScottK-laptop: why? whats wrong?
<lifeless> ScottK-laptop: oh, I see. No, we support 2.4 still
* ScottK wasn't sure when you were mentioning absolute imports you were refering to pysol or the apport hook.
* ScottK is going to go make a better pysol patch.
<lifeless> oh, apport. It should use them, but when we stop supporting pythons that dont support absolute imports
<ScottK> OK.  Thanks for the help.
<ScottK> In the mean time it seems smart for applications to not reuse system module names...
<Fujitsu> Wow, I never knew Ubuntu could be so difficult to install. That was closer to Gentoo than anything.
<dholbach> Fujitsu: what do you mean?
<Fujitsu> Well, I ran into that LVM bug on the alternate CD, where it hangs for 45 minutes if you have existing partitions.
<Fujitsu> After I got past that, the base system installation failed...
<Fujitsu> So, tried again, and it sort of worked.
<Fujitsu> Then fstab wasn't written.
<Fujitsu> Then Grub didn't install.
<Fujitsu> Then it installed incorrectly.
<minghua> sounds terrible
<dholbach> grub?
<dholbach> why grub?
<minghua> but isn't alternative CD just using d-i?
<Fujitsu> What about grub?
<Fujitsu> minghua: Indeed it is.
<dholbach> oh yes, grub
<dholbach> sorry, I didn't sleep enough
<dholbach> my mind read lilo
<dholbach> nevermind me
<Fujitsu> Hahah.
<dholbach> it'd be good if you could file bugs for that
<Fujitsu> I think it might have all been related to the hangy thing, as I've never had problems with it before.
<minghua> that's the problem of having two complete different installers
<dholbach> minghua: which ones do you mean?
<minghua> stretching the testers thin so that the alternative CD didn't get tested much
<ScottK> Is it possible to get an upload for a one line fix for pysol that stops it from crashing?
<Fujitsu> Not fixing bug #105623 before release would be quite bad, I think.
<ubotu> Malone bug 105623 in devmapper "udev rules missing from udeb" [High,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/105623
<Fujitsu> ScottK: We're not frozen here.
<minghua> dholbach: the desktop CD uses a different installer as far as I know, doesn't it?
<dholbach> minghua: the alternative CD gets as much testing from ubuntu developers as the desktop CD
<ScottK> Great.  I'll go make the fix.
<dholbach> minghua: no it doesn't - ubiquity reuses as many parts of d-i as it can
<Fujitsu> ubiquity still uses d-i
<Fujitsu> Just, a really mangled d-i.
<dholbach> minghua: cjwatson put a lot of work into making it just do that
<dholbach> Fujitsu: ?
<minghua> dholbach: okay, my bad then, I don't really know ubiquity
<Fujitsu> Well, it uses d-i in parts, but then does very un-d-i stuff.
* Fujitsu rewrites /etc/fstab to match other systems.
<minghua> BTW, does ubiquity in feisty handle LVM now?
<Fujitsu> minghua: Unfortunately no.
<dholbach> Fujitsu: un-d-i stuff?
<Fujitsu> dholbach: Like, copying the filesystem over.
<minghua> Fujitsu: I see.  so not much has changed since edgy on that front, then
<Fujitsu> minghua: The partitioner is completely new, so it should be easier to add LVM, I think.
<dholbach> you can all apply as http://www.ubuntu.com/employment#UIMAIN and make it better :-)
* minghua is only involved in d-i because of translation
<minghua> no way I can apply for that job
<dholbach> maybe the new UIMAIN will make things better :)
<siretart> do we have some specilized channel for hardened ubuntu or selinux or something?
<dholbach> siretart: my first guess would be #ubuntu-security - but it does not exist
<siretart> k
<dholbach> maybe you should create it, I'm sure that pitti and keescook would join in :)
<keescook> totally.  :)
<siretart> I've started to play a bit with selinux, and wanted to discuss it a bit
<dholbach> keescook is awake! :)
* dholbach hugs keescook
<keescook> siretart: cool; it's next on my list.
<siretart> keescook: really? let's create at and invite 'important' ppl like ajmitch :)
* keescook hugs dholbach
<keescook> siretart: heheh.  well, I'll likely be busy until mid-May before I seriously have time to focus on grok'ing SELinux.  I cheated with AppArmor: one of the SuSE devs is local to me.
<siretart> ah, I see
<Fujitsu> Brb, checking that nothing explodes on a reboot.
<keescook> dholbach: ya know, I think it IS too late for me to be up.  :)
<siretart> hm. the channel #ubuntu-security does seem to exist, but is just empty
<dholbach> yeah, though we all get a bit less sleep these days
<keescook> dholbach: are you gonna bring some turntables with you to UDS?  :):)
<dholbach> keescook: good idea - I'd just have to drive there :)
<dholbach> keescook: just 2781km :)
<keescook> dholbach: hehe google says 27 hours.  ;)
<dholbach> yep
<ScottK> I've fixed pysol (again).  If anyone from UUS would please have a look, I think that the fix for Bug #106115 is ready for upload.
<ubotu> Malone bug 106115 in pysol "Missed line in correction for Bug #80287 leaves an import error" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/106115
<dholbach> keescook: I have something like http://tinyurl.com/38adf3 planned for the summer
<keescook> dholbach: ooooh, nice!  I've always wanted to see Athens.
<dholbach> it's awesome
<keescook> a friend of mine goes everyone few years; his family is from there.
<keescook> Actually, UDS will by my first time across the atlantic...
<keescook> ScottK: compiling it now...
<lifeless> keescook: erm, *cough*
<lifeless> keescook: were you not in Oslo ?
<ScottK> keescook: Thanks.
<keescook> lifeless: I wasn't, no.
<lifeless> ah
<keescook> heck, LCA was the first time I was across the pacific.  :)
<lifeless> even though I still dont believe you were there.
<dholbach> hey cassidy
<lifeless> Only your clone.
<cassidy> hi dholbach
<keescook> lifeless: I spent a good bit of time exploring Sydney, so I hard to spot.  :)
<keescook> ScottK: rockin', it loads for me; I've uploaded it.  :)
<ScottK> keescook: Thanks.  I'll mark it fix released when it hits the repos.
* ScottK triaged a few bugs while you were uploading.
<keescook> okay, g'night folks...
<dholbach> keescook: sleep tight
<lifeless> night keescook 
<Tonio_> hi
<ajmitch> hi
<ajmitch> siretart: there was #ubuntu-hardened
<Fujitsu> That has 6 random people in it.
<siretart> that's enough I think
<siretart> ;)
<geser> siretart: I've got another batch of mails from the u-u-s ml which was delayed >= one day on tauware.de
<siretart> geser: perhaps we should move them to lists.ubuntu.com then
<Fujitsu> lists.ubuntu.com isn't always a whole lot better.
<LongPointyStick> geser: dont whine to siretart, whine to StevenK and us, who are slack.
<LongPointyStick> er, me
<siretart> oh, hi Hobbsee :)
<LongPointyStick> geser: that being said though, there's a new rule in which means we shouldnt be needing to ack things
<LongPointyStick> hi siretart 
<LongPointyStick> so much
<LongPointyStick> geser: at least whine to the right people :P
<ajmitch> new rules?
<siretart> narf, rules suck
<siretart> ;)
<ajmitch> siretart: anarchy? :)
<siretart> :)
<geser> LongPointyStick: I thought you only administer the ML not the MTA
<LongPointyStick> geser: the ML was where it was being held up
<geser> LongPointyStick: ah, thanks for the explanation
<geser> I didn't think of moderation delay as it were only a small portion which was delayed
<siretart> perhaps geser wants to volunteer as additional moderator?
<Hobbsee> true
<Hobbsee> geser: after a person posts once, and is fine, they get whitelisted
<geser> you are doing a good job
<Hobbsee> geser: queue is clear
<Hobbsee> it helps greatly with the new rule
<dholbach> which mailing list are we talking about?
<geser> I didn't think of the moderation. I've only see some mail appear after the replies and wondered why (and only seen in the received headers that it lied some time on tauware)
<geser> dholbach: the ubuntu-universe-sponsors ml
<dholbach> ok
<siretart> geser: that's absolutely correct :)
<damko> hi all
<imbrandon> nixternal, how does one add a comment in a wiki page ( e.g. like <!-- blah blah --> in plain html )
<ajmitch> hey imbrandon 
<imbrandon> btw moins Fujitsu ajmitch Hobbsee siretart and anyone else lurking quietly
<imbrandon> heya :)
<imbrandon> ajmitch, you know about the wiki ? ^
<imbrandon> i'm trying to fixup my debian wiki page lol
<StevenK> imbrandon: Heja
<imbrandon> heya StevenK 
<StevenK> Debian has a wiki? Who knew
<imbrandon> http://wiki.debian.org/BrandonHoltsclaw
<minghua> I know how to do it in mediawiki, but not sure about others
<imbrandon> yup
<imbrandon> they use moinmoin afaik
<StevenK> Yup, looks like it.
<ajmitch> nope, I don't bother with modern things like wikis
<minghua> imbrandon: did you try <!-- comments --> ?
<imbrandon> minghua, haha actualy no
<imbrandon> lemme try it
<minghua> that's what mediawiki uses
<Fujitsu> Hey imbrandon.
<imbrandon> nope dosent work
* Fujitsu struggles through using irssi for the first time.
<imbrandon> Fujitsu, you use the wiki alot
<Fujitsu> imbrandon: Do I!?
<imbrandon> irssi rocks
<Fujitsu> News to me.
<imbrandon> lol
<imbrandon> gah 
<Fujitsu> Is there a way to go to the window of a particular channel without knowing the number?
<imbrandon> just rejoin it
<imbrandon> it wont make a new one
<imbrandon> like /join #blah
<minghua> imbrandon: ## comments
<Fujitsu> imbrandon: Aha! Thanks.
<imbrandon> Fujitsu, i have some scripts that show the chan name in the bar, makes it much easier to use
<Fujitsu> imbrandon: That sounds better!
<ajmitch> imbrandon: fine if you only have a few channels
* TheMuso wishes alt + p didn't mean page up.
<ajmitch> imbrandon: once you start getting > 50 or so irssi windows, it'd be a little annoying :)
<imbrandon> ajmitch, nah just makes the bar bigger
<imbrandon> i have about 40 right now
<ajmitch> exactly
<ajmitch> bigger == not good
<TheMuso> What bar?
* ajmitch just goes by numbers
<StevenK> I find I'd rather limit my channels.
* TheMuso uses alt + [1-0] ,[q-o] , and control + N/P for the rest. :)
<imbrandon> http://federation.imbrandon.com/snapshot1.png
<imbrandon> Fujitsu, ^^
<ajmitch> StevenK: I tend to leave a few /query windows open for awhile
<damko> imbrandon: 40 channels? really?
<imbrandon> damko, and thats when i cut back, normaly much more 
<imbrandon> sometimes over 100
<imbrandon> :)
<ajmitch> nice wide screen
<TheMuso> Ouch.
<ajmitch> heh, I see you've been talking with chaks
<imbrandon> ajmitch, hehe yea i love my widescreen :)
* TheMuso couldn't handle many more channels than he is in now.
<imbrandon> ajmitch, yea i pointed him to you 
* ajmitch just gets by with 2 monitors
<damko> imbrandon: how can u follow all them and work at the same time? :-O
<StevenK> damko: Easily. He doesn't work.
* StevenK ducks.
<imbrandon> damko, nick hilight ;)
<imbrandon> hahahaha
<damko> StevenK: :-D
* damko is improving his packaging skills wowowo :-D
<damko> first package half working  realized :-)
<imbrandon> Fujitsu, want me to dig out the script ? i got it from irssi.org
* ajmitch would like to have decent, working packages
<damko> ajmitch: are u on the way to learn how to create a package?
<TheMuso> damko: No, he is a MOTU, and a core dev.
<imbrandon> :)
<TheMuso> He helped me become a MOTU, even if in a small way.
<damko> ah sorry .... u know I'm new here and a quite confused too
* ajmitch just has some packages that need a bit of love
<imbrandon> i'm waiting on release, then i'm getting back to how busy i was in the edgy cycle /me is looking forward to it
<imbrandon> as far as bug/packageing
<TheMuso> imbrandon: You aren't working as much any ore? :)
<TheMuso> more even
<imbrandon> TheMuso, i did minimal core dev stuff in feisty
<TheMuso> imbrandon: ah ok.
<imbrandon> because of my new job and such, but i'm all settled in a few months now and ready to roar again
<damko> sorry for the newbie question, but are u all worker, studend or what if I can ask
* ajmitch barely touched feisty
<TheMuso> Job seeker here.
<ajmitch> code monkey
<imbrandon> damko, i work a job, and MOTU and core-dev , same with ajmitch and StevenK iirc
<imbrandon> and Hobbsee 
<imbrandon> Fujitsu, is still a student i think
<Fujitsu> imbrandon: That I am, though I'm working as well. (yes, I'd like that script)
<imbrandon> k one sec
<damko> imbrandon: so it's a hobby to be a MOTU, nothing related with the work ?
<ajmitch> heh
<Fujitsu> imbrandon: Thanks.
<imbrandon> damko, well it started as a hobby but my work actualy pays me for ubuntu work 20% of my time
<TheMuso> imbrandon: Lucky you.
<ajmitch> some of us aren't so lucky
<damko> imbrandon: good 
<imbrandon> and gives me nice things like unlimited bandwidth for some ubuntu boxen ;)
<damko> good goos
<damko> good
<ajmitch> some of us poor people eke out a living & do ubuntu in spare time
<imbrandon> hehe ajmitch howd the 2 job things pan out ? still in the works ?
<Hobbsee> hi imbrandon 
<imbrandon> heya Hobbsee 
<ajmitch> imbrandon: nothing happening yet
<damko> none of u is working / living in italy?
<imbrandon> Fujitsu, http://www.imbrandon.com/misc/default.theme
<imbrandon> put it in your ~/.irssi dir
<imbrandon> i think thats the one
<StevenK> Your theme will not pull in scripts
* ajmitch is not quite in italy
<imbrandon> err right
<imbrandon> Fujitsu, /misc/adv_windowlist.pl
<imbrandon> is the script
<imbrandon> my bad
<imbrandon> grr and since my site uses perl ....... one sec
<imbrandon> damn it
<StevenK> Downsides of mod_perl, number 453224826282
<imbrandon> Fujitsu, http://www.imbrandon.com/misc/adv_windowlist.pl.txt
<imbrandon> rename it to .pl
<imbrandon> and put it in ~/.irssi/scripts/autorun/
<imbrandon> then restart irssi
<Fujitsu> imbrandon: Thanks.
<Fujitsu> Hm, I think I need that graphical notification plugin, or I'm never going to see highlights.
<imbrandon> i dont run irssi localy so that wouldent work for me
<imbrandon> irssi sit in screen on the webserver heh
<StevenK> imbrandon: It could be made to work, but it'd suck.
<imbrandon> yea probably
<imbrandon> ugh my uptime is only 9 days this time :(
<Fujitsu_> imbrandon: that link gives a 500.
<imbrandon> ugh ok one sec
* Hobbsee isnt a core dev, imbrandon 
<Fujitsu_> Hobbsee: That's what they all say.
<imbrandon> Fujitsu_, here is the same script hosted by someone else
<imbrandon> http://labs.f0rked.com/irssi/mirrors/adv_windowlist.pl
<imbrandon> that dosent fubar on mod_perl
<Hobbsee> Fujitsuh
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu_: hm?
<geser> imbrandon: Aaron Toponce has a blog entry about irssi notifications with dbus over ssh: see http://www.pthree.org/2007/03/21/irssi-gui-notify/ and http://www.pthree.org/2007/03/22/irssi-gui-notify-the-bash-script/
<imbrandon> geser, cool i'll check it out here in a bit
<jekil> hello
<RAOF> Argh, people bitching about democracyplayer.  Pity I can't just send them this computer, it works just fine here :)
<StevenK> RAOF: You can, though.
<StevenK> :-P
<StevenK> RAOF: Would you like me to try it?
<RAOF> Oh, you're welcome too.  It might be a nice idea to get some i386 testing :)
<StevenK> <- amd64
<RAOF> :)
<StevenK> But I was planning on using my i386 VM
<crimsun> RAOF: hi, have you attempted a merge of banshee 0.12.1? if not, I'll look at it after lecture this morning (ETA 90 mins)
<RAOF> crimsun: Well, it'd be my first merge, but I can have a look at it :)
* RAOF pulls up ubuntuwiki
<crimsun> RAOF: ok. I haven't inspected it, so I don't know offhand if it's a sync or a merge.
<StevenK> RAOF: New Debian release + Ubuntu changes = Ubuntu merge
<RAOF> Probably a merge, I've been doing my best to pimp the Ubuntu version :)
<StevenK> - Any Ubuntu changes that Debian has taken
<crimsun> right, I don't /think/ 0.12.1 contains the fixes in the latest two uploads
<ajmitch> or implemented themselves in an equivalent manner
<RAOF> Oh, maybe I can slide in a fix for the "banshee doesn't handle the 'stop' mmkey":)
<imbrandon> ugh, kernel panics
<imbrandon> brb
<imbrandon> actualy this might take a bit, back after bit
<jekil> if at the moment there is a package in debian sid that there isn't in ubuntu, this package is synced with next unstable relase or i must make a package and submit to REVU
<jekil> ?
<DktrKranz> jekil, it will be imported in gutsy
<jekil> DktrKranz: ok, thanks :)
* StevenK is still trying to train his mind that feisty+1 == gutsy
<ajmitch> night
<highvoltage> night ajmitch 
* Hobbsee wonders how many bugs are open in u-u-s
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: A lot I think.
<TheMuso> Are you on the list?
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: yes.  i'm the admin.  one of
<TheMuso> Right.
* StevenK waves, being the other.
<TheMuso> I actually mean the mailing list, not the team.
<Hobbsee> yes, i am
<TheMuso> right
<TheMuso> Luca has been doing a lot lately.
<TheMuso> So who is responsible for approving any fixes for universe from now till release?
<StevenK> motu-uvf, I guess
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: didnt think we had them yet?
<RAOF> So, if I'm merging banshee 0.12.1 from debian, can I also slip in a one-line patch to add an action for the "stop" multimedia key?
<Hobbsee> RAOF: for what?
<Hobbsee> RAOF: gusty, presumably?
<RAOF> I dunno.  Feisty, I think.  crimsun suggested I look at merging banshee.
<StevenK> RAOF: You can. Adding something like that this late might get you excommunicated.
<RAOF> Yeah, thought so.  Straight merge it is.
<Hobbsee> not sure fi even the merge woudl get accepted
<Hobbsee> we're 6 days from release, the archives close RSN.
<StevenK> Yes, I agree with Hobbsee.
<StevenK> 0.12.1 is a new upstream release...
* StevenK waves the excommunication order.
<RAOF> Well, I (think) have just done the work involved.  Whether or not it gets in... eh :)
<RAOF> A new bugfix release, yes.
<StevenK> It still needs a UVF and we're six days from release...
* Hobbsee wonders if that would be a violation of the COC...
<geser> RAOF: you can add additional patches when merging but the question here is if the new version will get accepted
<StevenK> Hobbsee: More than likely. 
<RAOF> Yeah, certainly.  When crimsun re-appears I can ask him what he was thinking :)
<Hobbsee> RAOF: there are still unmet deps to do
* StevenK ought to look at an unmet deps bug
<RAOF> Hm, sleepy time.  Night all!
<ScottK> I'd like a MOTU opinion on Bug #105182. Would the best way to solve that (not in Feisty) be to create a metapackage that installs all 4 pysol related packages (e.g. pysol-kitchen-sink or something)?
<ubotu> Malone bug 105182 in pysol "installing pysol should install the related sounds & card-sets" [Wishlist,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/105182
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: Are you checking to see whether any php-based packages can work with php5?
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: i hadnt been.  i'm assumign the uploaders did
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: bah! You beat me to that one
<StevenK> Oh god are they the only unmet deps bugs left?
<Hobbsee> StevenK: seems so.  just about
<StevenK> Bah!
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: at this point, they either dont install or dont work.  *shrug*
<TheMuso> As much as I think they should be fixed, I do feel we should check.
<Hobbsee> true
<StevenK> Hobbsee: s/or/and\/or/
<Hobbsee> StevenK: also true
<TheMuso> um ok. Weird.
* TheMuso thought Hobbsee beat him to uploading achims-guestbook, yet it was accepted.
<TheMuso> for me at least.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: i'm not sure who's they're accepting - because the distro manager is doing it
<Hobbsee> so they may be accepting the later one
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: ah right
* TheMuso takes a lock on flatnuke
<TheMuso> ...don't want work duplicated, particularly at the rate Hobbsee is going.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: go for it.  i stopped for a while
<TheMuso> ah ok.
<TheMuso> ok its done already
<crimsun> StevenK: / Hobbsee: ajmitch and I approved the exception here on irc last week.
<crimsun> "the exception" being for banshee 0.12.1, which is a bugfix-only one
<Hobbsee> crimsun: right
<crimsun> hmm, I need to re-id
<crimsun> TheMuso: RE: query: ok, sounds good. Please do bounce the email to me at crimsunkg at yahoo
<TheMuso> crimsun: Thanks, will do right away.
<TheMuso> crimsun: Done.
<crimsun> TheMuso: thanks
<TheMuso> What does one generally do, if a package from Debian is a native package, i.e .tar.gz and no .orig.tar.gz, yet has debian revision numbers, as well as having upstream? debuild asks me if I want to continue, due to no orig tarball available, yet fails even if I do continue...
<StevenK> You can forcibly create an orig
<StevenK> Or you can deal with it being spuriously native.
<StevenK> Spurious is such a cool word.
<TheMuso> StevenK: I was thinking of creating an orig, but wanted to know what others did in such crazy situations.
<StevenK> TheMuso: Usually, I'll decide to not care.
<TheMuso> StevenK: heh
<TheMuso> dpkg-source: failure: tar gave error exit status 1
<TheMuso> debuild: fatal error at line 1228:
<TheMuso> dpkg-source -b tutos2-2.0.20050413 failed
<StevenK> TheMuso: I'd need to see why dpkg-source -b died
<StevenK> There isn't another error line?
<TheMuso> StevenK: Basically tar giving some weird error.
<TheMuso> But the second time, it doesn't happen.
<TheMuso> I was getting to that, when a second run worked.
<StevenK> Odd.
<TheMuso> My thought exactly.
<StevenK> Maybe your machine is cursed?
<TheMuso> Heh dunno. I have seen similar behavior on another package before though, but I didn't have to go through with updating it however.
<TheMuso> StevenK: http://www.pastebin.ca/438132
<TheMuso> Redoing it all again gave me the error.
<StevenK> #
<StevenK> tar: tutos2-2.0.20050413/debian/po/POTFILES.in: file changed as we read it
<StevenK> #
<StevenK> tar: tutos2-2.0.20050413/debian/po/cs.po: file changed as we read it
<StevenK> That's *bad*
<TheMuso> yep
<TheMuso> Thats what I thought.
<StevenK> Maybe the clean rule is backgrounding something?
<StevenK> Argh, now there's two of them!
<TheMuso> StevenK: Yet a second time, that doesn't happen.
<Hobbsee> it's probably got something to do with yada :P
<TheMuso> SO I don't think something is being backgrounded.
<StevenK> If tutos2 uses yada, then I so don't care. :-P
<TheMuso> It doesn't.
<TheMuso> But that is beside he point... The deps aren't even looked at at this point.
<StevenK> I figured.
<StevenK> TheMuso: Gimme a minute to finish up what I'm in the middle of, and I'll look at it here.
<TheMuso> StevenK: Sure.
<TheMuso> StevenK: For reference, the bug is bug 96314, applying the debdiff etc.
<ubotu> Malone bug 96314 in tutos2 "[UNMETDEPS]  tutos2 has unmet dependencies" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/96314
<StevenK> So noted.
<TheMuso> The only project that I have worked with packaging wise that has actually had deacent docs on what is required/what php vers it works with is Drupal.
<TheMuso> Everything else I've looked at has had very vague docs.
<StevenK> TheMuso: Of course, because the person that wrote it is saying "Duuuuuh, it's PHP" ? :-P
<TheMuso> StevenK: heh
<StevenK> I should be less scathing of PHP.
<StevenK> Naaaaaaaaaaah
<TheMuso> The only time I ever deal with PHP is in the context of a well maintained and supported CMS like drupal, where the devs actually know what php is/isn't capable of/flaws etc.
<StevenK> TheMuso: Right, I'm all yours. Or something...
<TheMuso> StevenK: heh
<TheMuso> I guess it would be nice to see if you can reproduce the same problem I get.
<StevenK> TheMuso: Running pdebuild, I don't see it.
<TheMuso> StevenK: I was just running debuild.
<TheMuso> To create a source package.
<TheMuso> debuild -S to be more precise.
<StevenK> pdebuild also does the same thing.
<TheMuso> Hmm ok.
<TheMuso> Let me try with that.
<StevenK> TheMuso: Try dpkg-source by hand
<TheMuso> StevenK: What args get passed to it?
<StevenK> -b <dir>
<TheMuso> dir being the top level dir of the package I presume.
<StevenK> Correct
<TheMuso> Ok, I just tried it on another machine, and it did the same.
* TheMuso wonders whether it got something to do with his Ubuntu data being nfs shared...
<TheMuso> Yep, got something to do with NFS.
<TheMuso> StevenK: Ok, problem solved.
<TheMuso> Crazy shit, but there it is.
<StevenK> Huzzah!
<greg1> hi
<TheMuso> Hi greg1.
<greg1> Hi TheMuso
<greg1> I ve read here : https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU?action=show&redirect=REVU I need to ask you to resync the  REVU uploaders
<greg1> keyring :)
<Hobbsee> greg1: sure, will do
<DarkSun88> Hi 
<Hobbsee> hi DarkSun88 
<Hobbsee> greg1: (doing now)
<DarkSun88> Hobbsee: Hi :)
<greg1> Hobbsee: thx a lot
<TheMuso> Source package at http://www.themuso.id.au/ubuntu/ardour2
<Hobbsee> greg1: waiting...waiting...
<StevenK> TheMuso: ?
<TheMuso> sorry wrong window
<TheMuso> Meant for ubuntstustudio
<Hobbsee> greg1: that's done
<greg1> Hobbsee: thx mate 
<Hobbsee> greg1: no problems :)
<\sh> now
<\sh> moins btw
<Hobbsee> hi \sh 
<\sh> Hobbsee: thx for uploading some php4 unmet deps from luca
<Hobbsee> \sh: no problem
<DarkSun88> \sh: Hi :)
<bddebian> Heya gang
<ScottK> Heya
<geser> Hi bddebian
<\sh> moins DarkSun88
<Hobbsee> bddebian: going to get rid of the rest of the u-u-s bugs today?  :)
<\sh> is konversation broken?
<StevenK> \sh: Often
* StevenK ducks
<\sh> setting status from away to away == still being away?
<Hobbsee> \sh: er, shouldnt do.  could, though
<\sh> fck..I switch back to windows ,->
<Hobbsee> :P
<StevenK> \sh: Feel free. Just so you know, mIRC is much worse.
<StevenK> :-P
<\sh> StevenK: telnet irc.freenode.net 6667 ,-)
<StevenK> Hah
<StevenK> \sh: CTCP version me :-P
<\sh> StevenK: or reactivating my kmyirc project ,-)
<ScottK> keescook: Are we going to be in trouble if we don't bump to clamav 0.90.2 before the release? -> http://lurker.clamav.net/message/20070413.012951.1d50edff.en.html
<\sh> lol
<\sh> privmsg stevenk 0x001version0x001
<Hobbsee> StevenK: heh :P
<StevenK> I should set it to mIRC 4.2 (Windows 3.0) or something
<bddebian> Hi ScottK, geser, Hobbsee
<bddebian> Hobbsee: Uhm, yeah sure :)
<Hobbsee> bddebian: go on :)
* damko wants to share his happines for his first stupid package :-D
<damko> (the first  working one)
<Hobbsee> damko: :D
<damko> Hobbsee: :-D
<damko> damko: it didn't take so much ... only 2 days .. i feel like a donkey :-))
<\sh> damko: my first package was also 2 days and 2 nights ,-)
<nixternal> heh, mine was 15 minutes ;p
<nixternal> my 2nd was 2 days, 2 nights, 2 cases of beer
<sacater> my first was 3 dyas
<sacater> days*
<Hobbsee> \sh: oh headdesk.  please reply to bug 106246
<ubotu> Malone bug 106246 in Ubuntu "amd64 install of wine with .deb not working" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/106246
<StevenK> He needs ia32-libs
<StevenK> Hobbsee, \sh: I've replied and Rejected it.
<Hobbsee> :)
<StevenK> "Install ia32-libs. Please don't blame us when you blow up your machine. kthxbye"
<\sh> well, it's not even our package ;)(
<\sh> it's scotts package from winehq
* StevenK headdesks
<\sh> reparing to replace wine 0.9.34~winehq0~ubuntu~6.10-1 (using wine_0.9.34~winehq0~ubuntu~6.10-1_i386.deb) ...
<\sh>  Unpacking replacement wine ...
<\sh>  Setting up wine (0.9.34~winehq0~ubuntu~6.10-1) ...
<\sh> this is not ours ,->
* StevenK changes his our tack to, "Bugger off with your non Ubuntu package. kthxbye"
<StevenK> s/our //
<\sh> I just closed all apport bugs for wine, because they don't help anyways...no retrace works because it's deep in enemy windows land
<\sh> talked to pitti about it...apport and wine are useless
<nixternal> \sh: if you need some wine amd64 testing let me know, I have a breakable 64bit setup here
<\sh> if something happens in the wine-preloader ok, but not when wine starts to load unfriendly dlls
<\sh> nixternal: well, right now, there are no wine packages with 32bit stuff for amd64...and they will come, when scott and I are finding a good solution to do it. because on amd64 we still need to build win64-support...which is shit right now
<nixternal> oh, that I know
<nixternal> I decided to try 64bit winshit from the uni, and my lord it was worse than trying to pull hairs from a lions ass
<\sh> actually, I think it's good to have package: wine on x86 and x86_64 with their respective arch...and wine32 or something like this for amd64 arch for using wine in 32bit mode...or so...
<nixternal> I have never used wine, well I did try it a couple of times to play some online poker, but other than that, never used it
<nixternal> back b4 the online poker java clients
* ScottK just paid for crossover and was done with it.
<nixternal> what do you use Crossover for?
* ScottK needs Office for work
<nixternal> I demoed it to a bunch of people at the uni who said they have to have MS Office
<nixternal> s/have to have/had to have/
<ScottK> All my customers use Office, so I need to deliver documents that look good in their application of choice, not mine.
* ScottK mostly works in ooo and then checks formatting in MS Office before sending.
<damko> someone knows a good sw to record the desktop in a avi file ?
* \sh tweaks ubuntu dapper server install cd with a -proposed kernel to fix some ilo2 issues...oh man...I need to document that
<\sh> vnc2swf 
<\sh> e.g.
<\sh> or another screencast software
<\sh> mirko mueller is doing those things, check planet or his blog
<damko> thanks
<damko> instanbul it's quite impossible to use on my system
<\sh> travelling home now...bbl
<danirus> Hi raphink (or siretart, sistpoty, ajmitch), I've a question about REVU
<ScottK> !question
<ubotu> Don't ask to ask a question. Just ask your question :)
<danirus> true; yesterday I upload a package to REVU with dput, but it's not there, and I didn't receive any email
<Adri2000> danirus: are you in the LP team?
<danirus> It's TclODBC
<danirus> I don't think so
<Adri2000> https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-universe-contributors
<Adri2000> you need to join this team first
<raphink> hi danirus
<danirus> I think I did it, otherwise how could dput finish without an error message?
<raphink> let me see danirus
<Hobbsee> danirus: it silently rejects
<raphink> what package is it danirus?
<Hobbsee> iirc
<danirus> TclODBC
<raphink> it's not on REVU
<raphink> are you sure you actually uploaded it there?
<raphink> are you sure you didn't try to upload it to the Ubuntu archive?
<danirus> yes, but now I remember that is silently rejected
<danirus> no, I changed the dput conf file
* somerville32 just did something really stupid.
<raphink> danirus: the fact is that yours files are not on REVU
<danirus> I change dput.cf, default_host_main = revu
<raphink> even in the rejected dir
<danirus> ok, that's enough information
<raphink> ;)
<danirus> thanks
<bluefoxicy> yay my new CPU has SVM
<bluefoxicy> $ lsmod | grep kvm
<bluefoxicy> kvm                    61148  0 
<azeem> what's the freeze status for universe WRT feisty?
<raphink> if you upload again now
<raphink> I can tell you if it gets there
<raphink> while I'm logged in ;)
<Hobbsee> azeem: it's not, at the moment
<bluefoxicy> I need to figure out how to use it later so I can test Xen out.
<raphink> danirus: 
<danirus> tell me raphink
<azeem> Hobbsee: are syncs of new upstream versions from Debian still theoretically possible, if I bribe people enough?
<raphink> danirus: if you upload again now  I can tell you if it gets there  while I'm logged in ;)
<Hobbsee> azeem: depends how big the bribes are.
<danirus> Ok, I try again
<Hobbsee> azeem: effectively, no.  and how big the diff is
<azeem> well, Mithrandir was interested in those packages
<azeem> I'll discuss whether it's possible with upstream first before I worry about feisty
<danirus> raphink: I have given -f, it said the package was already there
<raphink> tclodbc right?
<danirus> yes
<raphink> it's there
<raphink> now let's wait for the cron
<danirus> raphink, thanks for your support 
<raphink> there is something strange though danirus 
<raphink> a few strange things actually
<raphink> you have 3 files
<raphink> tclodbc_2.5-1.dsc
<raphink> tclodbc_2.5-1_source.changes
<raphink> tclodbc_2.5-1.tar.gz
<danirus> yes
<raphink> is it supposed to be a native Debian package?
<raphink> or does it have an upstream?
<danirus> no, is not a Debian package
<raphink> no I mean
<raphink> did you write the code directly for Debian/Ubuntu yourself?
<danirus> no
<raphink> or did you get that program from somewhere else?
<danirus> the mainstream is maintained in Sourceforge
<raphink> then you should have a orig.tar.gz + diff.gz
<raphink> also
<raphink> do you intend this package to get in Debian or only in Ubuntu?
<danirus> only in Ubuntu
<raphink> then the version has to be -0ubuntu1 instead of -1
<danirus> ok, I remember that, excuse me
<raphink> no problem 
<raphink> :)
<raphink> the weird thing
<raphink> is that the package was accepted
<raphink> but doesn't appear on the interface
<nixternal> hiya raphink!
<nixternal> <><
<raphink> hi nixternal
<danirus> Maybe for those mistakes
<raphink> danirus: no, these shouldn't block it
<raphink> <>< indeed nixternal
<raphink> siretart: ping
<danirus> raphink: what I did, was to create a new project in Bazaar, and uploaded the original code to an upstream branch, and the modified (for ubuntu, with debian/ dir) to a branch called ubuntu
<raphink> it seems no packages have been showing online since 3 days
<raphink> and you are not the only person impacted
<raphink> ardour2 is not showing either
<danirus> ok, thanks again
<raphink> we should see about that with siretart
<raphink> he's more likely to find where the problem is
<danirus> anyway I'll change the version and the other stuff
<raphink> I can tell you a few things to fix danirus
<raphink> danirus: 
<danirus> yes, please
<raphink> 1) in the changelog : 
<raphink> unstable -> feisty
<raphink> 2.5-1 -> 2.5-0ubuntu1
<raphink> because this program is likely to exist under version 2.5-1 in Debian one day
<raphink> (maybe you could even put it there)
<raphink> 2) in control
<raphink> are you sure the interpreters section exists?
<raphink> never seen it
<danirus> yes, I'd like to, I just try here before because I'm using Ubuntu
<danirus> me neither
<raphink> it's not mandatory, but it's better to put an additional space in front of Homepage
<raphink> to show that's it's a pseudo field within the Description field
<raphink> it's already nice to have the Homepage entry though :)
<danirus> ok
<raphink> hmmm
<raphink> own licence...
<raphink> grrrr
<raphink> in debian/rules
<raphink> ver=2.5
<raphink> pkg=tclodbc
<raphink> lib=libtclodbc$(ver).so
<danirus> yes... :-(
<raphink> this is nice 
<raphink> but it could prevent from easily upgrading
<raphink> think that you might not be the person upgrading your package
<raphink> when a next version comes
<raphink> can your package be upgraded to 2.6 or 3.0 with a simple uupdate?
<raphink> you also have no configure rule in debian/rules
<raphink> you should have a configure rule, and preferably a configure-stamp called by configure
<raphink> I don't really see a need for a CONFIGURE variable though
<raphink> especially for extanding it in build-stamp
<raphink> and ./configure should not be called in build-stamp
<raphink> in the clean rule, you can replace
<raphink> set -e; [ ! -f ./Makefile ]  || $(MAKE) distclean;
<raphink> with 
<raphink> -$(MAKE) distclean
<raphink> the - in front of the command will allow make to ignore the error if the command fails
<raphink> make has a great error management system :)
<danirus> ok, I will go with your suggestions
<raphink> hmm then
<raphink> dh_installdirs usr/lib/$(pkg) usr/lib/$(pkg)/samples usr/lib/$(pkg)/doc
<raphink> do you know what dh_installdirs is for exactly?
<danirus> I can put them in a file
<danirus> I think so
<raphink> well the first question is whether you need this
<raphink> you already install things in these dirs, using dh_install
<raphink> and dh_install creates the directories when installing the files
<danirus> ah, ok
<raphink> dh_installdirs is merely used to create directories that the program will require
<raphink> but that the package will not install otherwise
<raphink> e.g. working directories that are empty before running the program
<raphink> since you have only one binary in your package, you don't need to specify the -p option for dh_install
<raphink> to simplify your code, you could simply have a debian/install file
<raphink> that would only contain
<raphink> things like 
<raphink> pkgIndex.tcl /usr/lib/tclodbc/
<raphink> of course this is up to you :)
<raphink> I usually find it easier to update simple files like debian/install than to modify debian/rules which is make code
<raphink> :)
<danirus> it's cleaner like you said
<raphink> a few other things
<raphink> that you could report to upstream
<raphink> many files in the tarball are executable
<raphink> like the README and Makefile.in files
<raphink> while they should be 644
<raphink> did you test building in a pbuilder?
<danirus> I found them with those rights, should I change them in the upstream branch of Bazaar?
<raphink> wait
<danirus> Yes, I built the package for sarge and etch also
<raphink> do you modify the source before making the package?
<danirus> with pbuilder, well in fact with pdebuild
<danirus> I think I change something but now I don't remember what was
<raphink> if you modify the sources, you should use patches
<raphink> and end up with a orig.tar.gz which is exactly the tarball as distributed by the upstream
<raphink> and a diff.gz containing the contents in debian/, including your patches
<raphink> you can use dpatch for that for example
<raphink> another thing that worries me
<raphink> hmmm
<raphink> ah
<raphink> you don't have an install rule in debian/rules
<raphink> you do the install in binary-arch
<raphink> although there is an install rule in the Makefile.in of the upstream 
<raphink> with a DESTDIR variable
<raphink> so you could have an install rule calling
<raphink> $(MAKE) install DESTDIR=$(CURDIR)/debian/tclodbc/
<raphink> the Makefile.in from upstream looks good :)
<raphink> well well :)
<raphink> I think that's quite a bit already :)
<danirus> man, did I something good?
<raphink> yes
<raphink> your package is good
<raphink> don't get me wrong :)
<danirus> :-D
<raphink> it's even functional (many aren't)
<raphink> there's just a lot of details to fix
<raphink> some important one
<raphink> and some less important ones
<raphink> but once a package gets in the archives
<raphink> it's harder to fix it
<raphink> so better do a perfect (or almost perfect) package from the beginning
<raphink> otherwise, if this is your first package, this is a good one
<danirus> I really appreciate your suggestions
<raphink> ok
<raphink> looking forward to seeing the next version of the package
<raphink> if you see siretart around, can you tell him about the REVU issue?
<danirus> I will do these changes, nice to talk with you ;-)
<danirus> sure
<raphink> thanks
<raphink> I'm off
<raphink> bye
<danirus> Bye
<\sh> re
<so1> does someone know when the rc will be available?
<dholbach> so1: best to follow the discussions in #ubuntu-devel
<dholbach> so1: it all depends on if the kernel is going to be good
<ogra> i'm not sure we'll have an RC 
<ogra> yesterday there was a discussion to drop RC and have herd6
<ogra> (indeed thats only a naming thing :P)
<\sh> ;)
<so1> ah ok
<so1> is work being done about those bugs listed as serious/grave? or aren't they blocker?
<tonyyarusso> Who is able to change the "Importance" of a bug in Launchpad?  Also, is there a way to retroactively flag it as a security issue?
<stgraber> tonyyarusso: the QA Team
<tonyyarusso> stgraber: ah
<stgraber> Anyone who has some python knowledge can tell me how to split a variable every 150 chars to an array ? (It's for an SMS sender script :))
<shawarma> stgraber: I believe there's room for 160 characters in an SMS.
<imbrandon> re
<stgraber> yes, but there is an add at the end :) (using a web sender)
<stgraber> ad I mean
<shawarma> stgraber: Ah.
<joejaxx> win 277
<joejaxx> bah
<tonyyarusso> _277_?!?!?!?
<glick> hi
<glick> howdy
<glick> hey has anyone heard of pymedia?
<joejaxx> tonyyarusso: yeah
<glick> hey i didnt see pymedia in any of the repos
<glick> if its not there can i have it as a package?
<joejaxx> tonyyarusso: my highest one is 379 lol
<ScottK> glick: If it's not there, look in Debian to make sure they don't have it. packages.debian.org
<joejaxx> glick: if it is not in the repos check debian
<joejaxx> glick: ^
<ScottK> Also check wnpp for Debian intent to package bugs on it.
<glick> doesnt appear to be in debian 
<glick> joejaxx, its not in debian either
<doko_> siretart: lcd4linux FTBFS (you're the debian maintainer as well ;-P )
<rgl> hi
<glick> so can i package it up and submit it to motu?
<ScottK> glick: Yes.  Make a package and put it on REVU.
<glick> schweeeeeet
<Seveas> fdoving, you around?
<fdoving> Seveas: yes.
<Seveas> fdoving, your ubuntu membership will expire on may 25. There is no need to renew, since you will stay mmber because you are in the kubuntu-members team. So don't be scared by the mail you will get from launchpad about being expired :)
<fdoving> Seveas: ok. thanks for the info :)
<fdoving> why will i expire? 
<Seveas> membership of the ubuntumembers team expires after 2 years
<Seveas> with the possiblity of renewal of course, but in your case that's not needed :)
<fdoving> ok. will my ubuntu.com mail dissapear with that group-membership? 
<Seveas> no
<fdoving> ok.
<fdoving> good.
<Seveas> unless elmo made a mess ;)
<fdoving> 2 years already. time flies when we're having fun :)
<Seveas> quite
<rmjb> Hi guys, I need to get a fix in to dmraid before feisty ships
<rmjb> without the fix upgrades for those with root partitions on FakeRaid arrays break
<siretart> doko: wtf? any idea why?
<rmjb> any universe sponsors here?
<lfittl> rmjb, yep, what do you need?
<rmjb> an upload for a bug in dmraid: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/dmraid/+bug/93810
<ubotu> Malone bug 93810 in dmraid "dmraid not starting on system boot" [Undecided,In progress]  
<rmjb> lfittl: want to get it in before feisty
<lfittl> rmjb, sure, just looking through the bug report, but there should be no problem with upload
<rmjb> cool
<lfittl> rmjb, your fix is tested and works? (I don't have a dmraid setup to test)
<rmjb> tested by Tormod Volden, who submitted the patch
<lfittl> ok, if there are any problems with the upload, are you ok with working on them, or forwarding them to Tormod?
<rmjb> Yes, we've even formed an ubuntu-dmraid team in launchpad :)
<lfittl> oh, cool :)
<lfittl> hmm, your fix is already uploaded?
<lfittl> http://changelogs.ubuntu.com/changelogs/pool/universe/d/dmraid/dmraid_1.0.0.rc13-2ubuntu2/changelog
<rmjb> I only attached the debdiff
<lfittl> ok, same bug, but different fix?
<rmjb> yeah, I put the wrong bug# in the last fix :s
<lfittl> whats the correct one?
<rmjb> will that be a problem for this upload?
<lfittl> nope, just fixing it in the old changelog, then the upload is done ;)
<rmjb> this fix is for bug #93810, last fix was for bug #98846
<ubotu> Malone bug 93810 in dmraid "dmraid not starting on system boot" [Undecided,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/93810
<ubotu> Malone bug 98846 in dmraid "dmraid starts before udev in rcS.d" [Undecided,Fix released]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/98846
<lfittl> rmjb, uploaded, thanks :)
<rmjb> no, thank you lfittl
<PhinnFort> does driftnet in universe contain the wireless patches?
<PhinnFort> !info driftnet feisty
<ubotu> driftnet: Picks out and displays images from network traffic. In component universe, is extra. Version 0.1.6-7 (feisty), package size 26 kB, installed size 132 kB
<stratus> ajmitch: do you care about devscripts in ubuntu?
<ajmitch> 'for those who care about...' :)
<ajmitch> is there something wrong?
<stratus> ajmitch: lol
<stratus> ajmitch: rmadison points to Debian yet
<ajmitch> ah
<ajmitch> I doubt that can be changed before release
<ajmitch> filed a bug?
<stratus> no because I dunno if there's a way to do the same thing in Ubuntu that rmadison does
<ajmitch> I don't think there's an ubuntu equivalent either
<ajmitch> probably a wishlist bug then
<stratus> yeah, probably
<stratus> ubuntu has something like qa.d.o/madison.php? that's the point ;)
<ajmitch> no, so the bug would be about someone implementing such a thing, somehow
<damko> newbie programmer quest: i want to learn a programming language. right now I know something about bash and php. but right now I would like to program with a not-scripting language. the target is develop software with GUI and in binary format. what would u suggest to me?
<stratus> ajmitch: yes, once ubuntu has it in place somewhere in launchpad, it would be trivial change rmadison and others devscripts with related needs
<siretart> doko: hm. rc1 does build in feisty.. hmhm
<siretart> damko: why in binary format?
<doko> siretart: just noticed the build failure; lacking the time to investigate
<ajmitch> doko: just to clarify, what were you suggesting to rpereira about soc?
<doko> ajmitch: continuing in query
<siretart> ajmitch: how would you think about this update? http://paste.debian.net/25546
<damko> siretart: I would like to develop a "real" application
<ajmitch> siretart: hard to tell without any other info
<siretart> ajmitch: fixes a build failire
<siretart> damko: there are a lot "real" python gui applications
<joejaxx> ajmitch: are packages allowed to touch files in /etc/security/ ?
<siretart> joejaxx: only if they own the files there
<damko> siretart: yes I know. infact I think that python is interesting
<joejaxx> siretart: what about appending a line into a file
<siretart> ajmitch: it's an upgrade from some random cvs snapshot to a release version
<siretart> joejaxx: the debian policy is quite clear on that point. I'd suggest to read it
<ajmitch> siretart: that sounds better :)
<siretart> ajmitch: as debian maintainer, I would think it was a good idea. as UVF guy, I'm rather skeptical. hm
<damko> siretart: i would like to spend time studing something complete. I mean a really good platform on which I can build what I want with few limitations 
<ajmitch> siretart: you maintain it in debian?
<siretart> ajmitch: err, lcd4linux, yes. I took the package over from nobse
<ajmitch> ok
<ajmitch> I can trust your judgement on it then, and I'm ok with it
<ajmitch> yay, -15.25 kernel built, I might have something that'll boot now
<siretart> any other uvf guy around? ;)
<damko> what's a uvf guy? if i can ask?
<crimsun> siretart: reading.
<ajmitch> someone in the motu-uvf team
<ajmitch> who approves freeze exceptions
<damko> thanks u all guy.  i  know I bother u ;-)
<crimsun> siretart: seems acceptable to me
<siretart> crimsun: In fact, I didn't really look into why the current package FTBFS, it did in the past
<siretart> crimsun: recently, upstream released an release candidate, which I uploaded to debian. I just checked that it does build in current feisty
<crimsun> an RC is far preferable to a cvs snap
<siretart> I agree
<siretart> ok, 3 ufv ppl it's good, uploading now. thanks ajmitch & crimsun 
<crimsun> np, thank you
<rexbron> crimsun: is the universe in deepfreeze?
<siretart> ah, wait, it's rather a sync, so I'd need to file a sync request anyway. hrmpf
<crimsun> rexbron: nearly
<rexbron> crimsun: its just that the US-art packages are sitting in NEW and I was wondering who to bug to get them into the repos before the release
<crimsun> rexbron: an archive admin, but please keep in mind they're all working on Feisty RC
<rexbron> I thought so
<crimsun> I'd really not even begin to ask until after RC releases
<rexbron> k
<siretart> filed as bug #106352
<ubotu> Malone bug 106352 in lcd4linux "please sync lcd4linux_0.10.1~rc1-1 from debian/unstable" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/106352
<ajmitch> siretart: make sure you mark it as a universe package, with the changelogs :)
<ajmitch> best to give them all the info just in case, at this time of the release cycle
<siretart> oh right
<glick> damn
<glick> pymedia is trash
<glick> keeps segving
<ScottK> Given where we are in the process, I was unsure if a new clamav update would be good or bad.  On the off chance it's good, I put a 0.90.2 package together.  Bug #106357
<ubotu> Malone bug 106357 in clamav "UVFe for clamav 0.90.2" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/106357
<ScottK> I've got to run, so I went ahead and put it on revu.
<ajmitch> looks useful at least
<geser> especially as it mentions two fixed CVEs
* ajmitch has to head out for a bit as well
#ubuntu-motu 2007-04-14
<phaidros> hi, I'm trying to build my first package. giving my email in changelog, dpkg tries to sign the package. but I run into: gpg: can't connect to `/home/phaidros/.gnome2/seahorse-bRL1iN/S.gpg-agent': connect failed
<phaidros> what to do?
<phaidros> any hints?
<Fujitsu> phaidros: Agents don't work properly with debuild.
<phaidros> that would mean to stop seahorse?
<Fujitsu> You'll need to comment out use-agent in ~/.gnupg/gpg.conf
<phaidros> ok
<phaidros> hm, is that possible as env var? (using seahorse for mail and such)
<geser> phaidros: see https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/devscripts/+bug/78165 there is a workaround
<ubotu> Malone bug 78165 in devscripts "debuild fails to use seahorse-agent" [Undecided,Confirmed]  
<phaidros> thanx geser 
<geser> Fujitsu: that's only true for the seahorse agent, I've no problem with gnupg-agent, dpkg-buildpackage and signing (even within a chroot)
<Fujitsu> geser: I know that that didn't work for me almost a year ago.
<geser> seahorse agent or the gnupg-agent?
<Fujitsu> gnupg-agent
<geser> perhaps it was fixed in between, I've no problems to do signing with gnupg-agent
<phaidros> geser, Fujitsu : with that solution it works with seahorse-agent
<phaidros> thanx
<nixternal> any word on the 2.6.20-15 kernel? is it good?
<crimsun> topic of ubuntu+1 kthxbye
<nixternal> haha, thanks ;p
<TheMuso> heh love the topic.
<jdong> not as good as #ubuntuforums :D
<Kaleo> Hi everybody
<TheMuso> Hi Kaleo 
<Kaleo> I am not sure what I should do now for bug 88902
<ubotu> Malone bug 88902 in istanbul "sync to upstream to solve some bugs" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/88902
<TheMuso> Kaleo: Unfortunately, its a little late to update to a new upstream version, as we we less than a week to release.
<TheMuso> Kaleo: Oh I see. It has been approved.
<TheMuso> Since it is a sync, all you can do is wait, but I doubt that it will be synced in time for the feisty release, given how busy the core dev team are.
<bddebian> Heya gang
<TheMuso> Heya bddebian.
<Kaleo> TheMuso: it's unfortunate but thank you for having taken the time to look at it
<bddebian> Hi TheMuso
<marcin_ant> hi all
<marcin_ant> is there someone that could help me with dbconfig-common configuration?
<TheMuso> marcin_ant: Have you read through the docs?
<TheMuso> I have found them to be very useful in the past when I have had to work with that package.
<marcin_ant> TheMuso: I did but could not find answer for pretty simple question
<TheMuso> Whats your question?
<marcin_ant> TheMuso: I need to set dbname manually - and I don't know how
<TheMuso> marcin_ant: Hold on a sec. I am going to look at a package I worked on recently. I think it did it.
<marcin_ant> TheMuso: it's set to database_default (in postinst scripts) and dbconfig is trying to create it's own name that is in fact package name without '-'
<TheMuso> marcin_ant: dbc_dbname and dbc_user are the variables you want to work with I think.
<TheMuso> Thats how the package I worked on does it.
<marcin_ant> TheMuso: so if my base package is  'something' and I create package 'something-different' then dbconfig is going to create 'somethingdifferent'
<TheMuso> right
<marcin_ant> TheMuso: I know variable name
<TheMuso> marcin_ant: Otherwise, I don't know I am affraid.
<marcin_ant> TheMuso: what I need is an example where should I input this variable in scripts
<marcin_ant> TheMuso: to make dbconfig use this variable
<TheMuso> marcin_ant: Download the drupal source. There is a good example in the debian/drupal-5.1.config file.
<TheMuso> Thats the package I worked on.
<TheMuso> And I tested that package heaps when I was putting it together for an update.
<marcin_ant> TheMuso: just downloaded and now I will try to understand this - thank you
<pochu> good night folks :)
<TheMuso> marcin_ant: No problem.
<harrisony> night
<marcin_ant> TheMuso: hehe the problem is that I really don't understand this :D
<ajmitch> now if I'm lucky, I'll be able to reboot & have a working system still..
* somerville32 cheers.
<unix_infidel> hmm, i thought rc1 was supposed to be released yesterday?
<TheMuso> unix_infidel: There have meen many a kernel problem.
<unix_infidel> TheMuso: lol, i guess i'll just have to wait another week.
<ScottK> ajmitch: I was wondering if you've had a chance to consider the new clamav yet?  Bug #106357
<ubotu> Malone bug 106357 in clamav "UVFe for clamav 0.90.2" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/106357
<imbrandon> re
<imbrandon> ajmitch, no problems on reboot ?
<ajmitch> imbrandon: nah it was sweet
<ajmitch> ScottK: I looked briefly
<ScottK> Any thoughts?
<ajmitch> it looks like something we want
<ScottK> OK.  I put the package together, but I put about as much as I know about packaging into it.
<imbrandon> yea -14.something broke mine, but i am doing a fresh install now ( needed to test clean upgrades anyhow )
<ScottK> If there's stuff that needs to be cleaned up, I won'd feel bad at all if someone takes over.
<ScottK> I did look in the source and make sure the debian/patches all still made sense.
<ScottK> ajmitch: Thanks.  I'm off to bed now.
<imbrandon> i finaly got another family member off windows after they upgraded to vista for a few weeks and hated it :)
<ScottK> Good night everyone.
<imbrandon> gnight ScottK 
<tonyyarusso> yay imbrandon 
<TheMuso> imbrandon: cool
<imbrandon> cuts my "family support" down tremendously :)
<imbrandon> now i just need to get them off a few windows apps but they work fine in wine for now
<ajmitch> hehe
<imbrandon> i'm tempted to go ahead an upgrade them to feisty now, so i wont have to venture back over here in a few days and upgrade it
<imbrandon> close enough to release, and if -15 is in the archives everything should be ok
<ajmitch> yeah
<ajmitch> just update your local mirror again
<imbrandon> yea, it will run in 15 minutes ( every 2 hours ) anyhow
<imbrandon> it runs on even hours
<imbrandon> well even hours local time :)
* ajmitch disables the screensaver in etch in vmware
<ajmitch> it chews cpu cycles
<imbrandon> :)
<imbrandon> i finaly picked up 3 700mhz/256mb ram boxen from work "for testing" here at the house
<imbrandon> so i have etch on one
<ajmitch> hehe nice
<imbrandon> they were old old old old workstations from when the company started
<imbrandon> i have etch on one, gnu solaris on the other, and the third i havent loaded yet
* ajmitch wonders if he should hack today
* imbrandon votes yes
<jdong> imbrandon: Vista!
<imbrandon> i'll probably put feisty/ldap/domain controler server for here at the house on the 3rd
<jdong> oh come on!
<jdong> :)
<imbrandon> jdong, my last vista box is going away as we speak
<imbrandon> becoming feisty
<imbrandon> :)
<jdong> :)
<jdong> I will follow suit.... as soon as I (1) run out of space (2) Stop being lazy
<imbrandon> well not mine but my mom's :) basicly mine because i have to fix it when it breaks
<jdong> oh boy if that's how ownership is defined then I'm in a lot of trouble :D
<imbrandon> my dads still on XP but he will stay on XP till he dies, no converting him, been trying for years
<imbrandon> my mom dont care as long as it "just works"(tm)
<jdong> meh sometimes it's too much effort to convert that it's lose-lose :)
<imbrandon> yea
<imbrandon> ok brb rebooting the live cd
<unix_infidel> imbrandon: so why not set them up on a VM?
<unix_infidel> ubuntu as the host, xp as the guest, just in case something doesnt "just work"
* ajmitch waits for / to bre relabelled
<ajmitch> nice & slow
<jdong> VMWare 6 feels a lot faster
<jdong> if my wallet were big I'd buy a copy
<crimsun> your university has a site license.
* ajmitch just makes do with vmware server
<jdong> crimsun: whoa we do?
<jdong> nobody told me that :D
<crimsun> consulted your local vice chancellor of IT/research lately?
<jdong> no I haven't....
<jdong> "MIT has licenses for VMWare. Send an email to software@csail.mit.edu to get a license number. From the vmware screen, choose 'help->Enter Serial Number' to enter the license."
<jdong> hmm....
<lfittl> a little OT, but, does anyone know how to stop a process, and then continue it in a screen session?
<imbrandon> re
<unix_infidel> anyone know what's up with the delayed RC1?
<jdong> I think the kernel regressions are causing that, no?
<crimsun> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel-announce/2007-April/000279.html
<imbrandon> unix_infidel,makin sure the kernel actualy boots the system is a good thing
<crimsun> imbrandon: bullocks, that's icing.
<imbrandon> :)
<crimsun> I'm pleased that with the new initramfs, udev, and linux-source, I don't need to pass `break=mount` to the bootloader, though.
<imbrandon> whats break= do? havent seen that cheatcode yet
<jdong> I've heard it a few times on the forums...
<unix_infidel> imbrandon: well is this release delay documented somewhere?
<crimsun> unix_infidel: I /just/ pasted the URL.
<imbrandon> unix_infidel, yes, crimsun just gave you a link
<unix_infidel> spectacular.
<crimsun> imbrandon: drops to a busybox shell before it mounts /
<ajmitch> hello crimsun 
<crimsun> allo ajmitch 
<imbrandon> crimsun, ahh
<jdong> can you also pass in other subsystems to break?
<jdong> like break=alsa? :D
<ajmitch> crimsun: I am rather happy about that as well
<crimsun> imbrandon: in my instance, hardware was too slow for initramfs/upstart/udev
<imbrandon> ahh
<crimsun> break=jdong
<jdong> :)
<ajmitch> for me, it was a combination of the usual lvm & mdadm races with udev, kernel, devmapper
<imbrandon> LOL
<jdong> I think that's default though :D
<imbrandon> for me its fskin network manager on a remote system
<ajmitch> purge it
<imbrandon> yea i did that 2 times, i need to blacklist it in the apt conf
<guiment> will we get the feisty release candidate this weekend?
<jdong> guiment: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel-announce/2007-April/000279.html
<jdong> guiment: unknown ETA right now
<jdong> but everyone's working hard going out of their way to get things done
<crimsun> colin, kyle, and ben have been troopers
<guiment> jdong: so we don't know when the rc will be released, but as soon as it is released we know that one week later will get feisty final?
<jdong> I'm not sure how the cycle will play out; maybe others can answer that
<crimsun> guiment: I addressed this question some hours ago
<crimsun> it all depends on RC
<crimsun> stop drinking at the crack fountain
<guiment> crimsun: could you pastebin me the log? please..?
<TheMuso> cjwatson, BenC and co need a month's break for the work they do.
<joejaxx> hello all
<joejaxx> how is everyone doing?
<harrisony> good
<joejaxx> that is good
<TheMuso> Hey joejaxx.
<joejaxx> hello TheMuso 
<ajmitch> hello Hobbsee 
<Hobbsee> hi ajmitch 
<stgraber> Could any MOTU have a look at bug #85640 when he'll have a moment (easy debdiff ready (two lines) and seems working)
<ubotu> Malone bug 85640 in cryptsetup "[Feisty]  crypted root doesnt mount on start (cryptsetup)" [Medium,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/85640
<ScottK> stgraber: Care for a non-MOTU comment?
<stgraber> ScottK: Please
<ScottK> Normally you put (Closes LP: #85640) at the end of the relevant changelog entry.  I think that's the syntax.
<ScottK> Also when you want it reviewed for upload subscribe (not assign) Ubuntu-Universe-Sponsors to the bug.
<ScottK> When you do that, put the status back to confirmed.
<ScottK> You might also put in the comments what you've done to test the fix (particularly this late in the game).
<ScottK> stgraber: That's it.
<stgraber> ScottK: Ok, I'll do a quick changelog update
<ScottK> Depending on who reviews it, some of them care more than others about that.
<stgraber> (Never had any problem with that even when uploading to main, but who knows :))
<StevenK> ScottK: (LP: #xxxxx)
<ScottK> Ah.
<ScottK> stgraber:  ^^ What he said.
<stgraber> hmm, I'm going to flood the bug report :)
<ScottK> Nah.  You should look at the bug report on the borked kernel.  That was a flooded bug.
<stgraber> hehe :)
<stgraber> ok, attached, status reset to confirmed and ubuntu-universe-sponsor is subscribed
<ScottK> That should at least get it looked at.
<stgraber> Yep, I hope for those people that it'll be uploaded, but we are coming really close to the final release ... (Personally I don't use that stuff, so ...) :)
<crimsun> siretart: ping, can you confirm http://librarian.launchpad.net/7211179/bug85640.debdiff is a correct fix?
<crimsun> (I don't recall immediately who uses cryptsetup...)
<siretart> crimsun: I believe that it works, but I didn't have the chance to actually test it
<crimsun> RAOF: as an earlier explanation for banshee 0.12.1, both andrew and I have approved the exception here on irc last week
<RAOF> Ah, ok.
<RAOF> Once I actually thought about it, I did wonder :)
<crimsun> siretart: / stgraber: I'm fine with that debdiff if it fixes the issue correctly
<RAOF> crimsun: Do you still want it, or have you done it yourself?
<crimsun> RAOF: I have not done it
<crimsun> RAOF: you mentioned another fix that you wanted to merge, and as I didn't know to which you were referring, it was in my best interest to not do the merge myself
<RAOF> Ah, it was a trivial fix for bug #99817, but it's in no way important.
<ubotu> Malone bug 99817 in banshee "[feisty]  stop hotkey not working" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/99817
<crimsun> RAOF: http://librarian.launchpad.net/7297978/lp-99817.debdiff looks fine to me
<ajmitch> hm, so we have to decide on clamav 0.90.2
* ajmitch is willing to give it a +1
<ajmitch> siretart: what do you think?
<crimsun> I'm fine with a +1, too
<ajmitch> ok, I got the impression you wanted it in backports instead
* ajmitch would prefer a -volatile repository
<crimsun> well, I'm not familiar w/ upstream's release history
<lritter> hey there
<lritter> there is a release soon i heard
<ScottK> lritter: Yes.
<lritter> are you guys aware that cd burning with gnomebaker is broken for regular users? ;)
<ScottK> Do you have a bug number?
<lritter> i filed a ticket some time ago but there was no reply
<lritter> yes
<lritter> sec
<lritter> 93750
<lritter> eek
<lritter> 75753
<lritter> fix already released
<crimsun> how is clamav's release history? The changes seem a bit large for this late in the cycle, but I'm ok with it if upstream's release history is good.
<lritter> didn't check my mail
<lritter> allright :)
<crimsun> ^ ScottK 
<ScottK> crimsun: I don't know.
<ScottK> I do know that we aren't carrying any bugfix patches in debian/patches
<ScottK> They are all config issues and one doc typo.
<lritter> i suppose i just have to reboot once and then it works ;)
<ScottK> crimsun: I also wonder about the impact of http://lurker.clamav.net/message/20070413.012951.1d50edff.en.html
<ScottK> If we are stuck on an unsupported version number, that impacts us even if we SRU the important fixes.
<ScottK> As I said in the bug, I'm glad I don't have to decide.
<crimsun> hmph.
<crimsun> well, I think upstream just trumped my caution.
<ScottK> In general I think it's lower risk to take a tested bugfix release than to cherrypick when you don't have a lot of time.
<crimsun> if they're going to disable 0.90.1, I don't think we have any choice.
* ajmitch comments on the bug
<stgraber> crimsun: Looking at the comments I've received it seems to fix that issue, but as I've already said I'm not a user of that stuff myself.
<ScottK> Then I'd encourage you to expend the caution on picking over the package as I am not experienced enough to have seen all the potential landmines.
<crimsun> ScottK: 106357 updated accordingly.
<ScottK> OK.  It's on REVU.  http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=4816
<ScottK> I can put my i386 .debs online if that would be helpful?
<crimsun> working with the source now.
<kofler> How would I update a package that's in a repository? For example, I have a local repository that runs a very network specific package in /apt/network/edgy/binary-i386/
<ScottK> kofler: Download the source package, modify it, build it, and then install the .deb using dpkg.
<minghua> you probably want to change the version number as well
<kofler> No, no, I mean there's an apt-mirror on the network that has it in that location.
<kofler> I updated the package's source, rebuilt it, etc.
<kofler> Now how to I update it on the *repository*?
<ScottK> Ah.  Sorry.  Misunderstood.
<kofler> dpkg is very ugly. I prefer apt.
<ScottK> Sure, but dpkg works if it's not in a repository.
<RAOF> And apt just ends up using dpkg anyway, unless I'm mistaken.
<kofler> True, but I rather have it update on the repository so cron-apt takes care of it network-wide.
<kofler> It does, but it puts it in /var/cache/apt/archives and does other niceties.
<siretart> apt-ftparchive packages /dev/null | tee Packages | gzip -9 > Packages.gz
<siretart> perhaps with a '.' between packages and /dev/null
<kofler> /dev/null ?
<siretart> if you have an override file, use that
<kofler> I'll go read up on it though. Thanks for the command.
<siretart> nearly all (modern) archive management tools use apt-ftparchie as backend
<ScottK> Just since I could, the .debs for clamav 0.90.2 I made are here http://www.kitterman.com/clamav/ if anyone wants to test.  Just i386.  Particularly if anyone uses the milter as I don't have a way to really test it.
<kofler> Thanks a bunch siretart :)
<RAOF> Oh, that's awkward.  Launchpad's down.  crimsun, I've been (trying) to follow MOTU/Merging (that's the right guide, yes?).  Once launchpad's back up, can you give it a run over?  Or shall I throw something up on REVU?
<TheMuso> RAOF: There is stuff on the wiki about merging.
<RAOF> TheMuso: You mean, wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Merging?
<RAOF> Or the wiki.ubuntu.com/Merging MOTU school transcripts?
<RAOF> Actually, that last bit is probably not an actual MOTU school transcript :)
<crimsun> ScottK: built debs look fine here. Please update debian/changelog to reflect the UVF exception being granted, and explicitly document the fact in debian/changelog that upstream is disabling support for < 0.90.2 on 16 Apr '07
<ScottK> Will do.
<crimsun> I'm off for a nap; if no one has uploaded in 4 hours, I'll be around
<TheMuso> crimsun: I can upload it if you'd like.
<ScottK> TheMuso: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=4817 - I did not rebuild the binaries since I just touched the changelog.
<ScottK> TheMuso: If you are going to upload, I just noticed I left a ")" off my changelog entry.  Would you mind fixing it?  I can reupload?
<TheMuso> ScottK: I haven't looked yet, so if you can fix it, that would be great.
<ScottK> Fixing
<jekil> hello
<ScottK> hello
<ScottK> TheMuso: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=4818
<TheMuso> ScottK: Looking now.
<ScottK> Great.
<TheMuso> Ouch. Big tarball.
<ScottK> Yep.  Mostly virus definitions.
<TheMuso> Wow.
<ScottK> Nothing like upstream on a security important application dumping a new release on you at the last moment.
<TheMuso> Oh yeah.
<TheMuso> ScottK: So what are they doing exactly? Dropping support for the old version?
<TheMuso> And is this going to break anything else in the archive?
<ScottK> They're dropping definition support (at least in part, I'm not sure).
<TheMuso> ah just read the changelog
<ScottK> Also there are two cves this fixes.
<TheMuso> ScottK: So what was changed in the debian/ dir?
<TheMuso> Right.
<ScottK> I've tested the new debs with Klamav and Clamsmtp
<ScottK> Just the changelog
<TheMuso> Ok.
* TheMuso test builds.
<ScottK> I did look in the source and make sure that the code touched in devian/patches was unchanged.
<TheMuso> Right.
<TheMuso> Probably worth getting those patches upstream.
<ScottK> Except one doc typo they are all config stuff.  Our stuff has been sent to Debian.
<TheMuso> Right.
<TheMuso> At least it doesn't take long to build.
<ScottK> Yes.  Most of the bulk is definitions, not code.
<TheMuso> As you said.
<TheMuso> Ok, looks sane.
<ScottK> BTW, this excercise is an excellent example of why using a patch system is a very good thing.  It made it much easier for someone relatively new like me to update the package for a new upstream release in short order.
<TheMuso> Yes indeed.
<TheMuso> ScottK: Uploading now.
<TheMuso> I have acked on revu and archived.
<ScottK> Great.  Thanks.
<ScottK> I'll keep and eye on the bug.
<TheMuso> Whats the bug number? I'll attach an upload report once I receive it from soyuz.
<TheMuso> Looks like lp is back up.
<RAOF> crimsun: When you get back, I've thrown up a merged banshee 0.12.1+dfsg-2ubuntu1 onto REVU, since it doesn't seem that banshee is on merges.ubuntu.com, so I can't follow the merging stuff on the wiki.  I'm off for dinner, but I'll be back later if you need/want anything more.
<ScottK> Bug #106357
<ubotu> Malone bug 106357 in clamav "UVFe for clamav 0.90.2" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/106357
<TheMuso> ScottK: Thanks
<ScottK> RAOF: Usually for a merge you attach the debdiff for the new version to the merge request bug.
<ScottK> np
<TheMuso> Still uploading...
<ScottK> Not suprising.
<Nafallo> RAOF: banshee has the same maintainer in Debian and Ubuntu. you might want to ask slomo before :-9
<Nafallo> :-)
<RAOF> I've kinda assumed that crimsun did that before asking me.  Mightn't be a bad idea, though :)
<TheMuso> ScottK: Uploaded.
<ScottK> TheMuso: Thanks.  I think I'll go sleep now (It's roughly 6AM here).
<TheMuso> ScottK: Wow you've been up a long time.
<TheMuso> Enjoy it.
<ScottK> TheMuso: Yes, but it seemed important to get done.
<TheMuso> Yeah.
<ScottK> Bug #96090 is ready for UUS review if anyone is there.  
<ubotu> Malone bug 96090 in klamav "[apport]  klamav crashed with SIGSEGV" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/96090
<ScottK> TheMuso?
<ScottK> And I'm really going to bed now.
<TheMuso> ScottK: heh
<TheMuso> ScottK: I'm on it.
<ScottK> Thanks.
<TheMuso> ScottK: Tested I assume?
<damko> ciao!
<damko> pastebin doesn't work??
<damko> Query failure: Can't open file: 'pastebin.MYI'. (errno: 145)
<damko> is there another site like pastebin?
<TomaszD> http://wklej.org
<damko> thanks!
<TomaszD> np
<damko> for bash guru and for fun: how do u solve this problem? http://wklej.org/id/f8284bd2a1
<ajmitch> nest them
<damko> ajmitch: how ?
<ajmitch> $(expr  $(sfdisk -s $2) / 1024)
<ajmitch> or similar
<ajmitch> ` doesn't nest like $() does
<damko> ah thanks for the tip. i try
<damko> ajmitch: wow .. then it means that b=$(sfdisk -s /dev/sdb) it's equal to b=`sfdisk -s /dev/sdb`, right? very nice. it works. thanks
<cbx33> hey all any gsoc mentors around
* ajmitch is not, sorry
<ajmitch> night all
<joejaxx> Good Night ajmitch 
<Lathiat> anyone here using cacti on dapper?
<Lathiat> i've attempted to basically copy debian sids update to 0.8.6i onto 0.8.6h in dapper to fix the security issues
<Lathiat> and was hoping for some testing
<Lathiat> seems to work here
<StevenK> Lathiat: As in Debian's patch applies fine to the 0.8.6h in Dapper?
<Lathiat> it seems to
<Lathiat> hrm
<Lathiat> heh
<Lathiat> or not
<StevenK> Heh
<Lathiat> i didnt' save 00list
<Lathiat> hrm almost applies
<Lathiat> i'll fix this patch 
<Lathiat> i've had 2 of my machines hacked by this bug because i was lazy and a mates as well so i figured i might try update the packages
<StevenK> Lathiat: If it works for you and someone else, talk to pitti or keescook about it.
<Lathiat> StevenK: ya this is why i was asking if anyone wanted to test it ;)
<Lathiat> ok i got it working now
<jrib> hi, does motu want to be assigned to needs-packaging bugs?  The email to the bug list didn't mention it, but I see a few needs-packaging bugs assigned to motu
<jekil> if I submit a deb to revu now, i must set changelog to feisty or feisty+1? feisty+1 right?
<Nafallo> it has a name you know... gutsy :-)
<Nafallo> but I don't know the answer anyway :-P
<jekil> i think gutsy because now feisty are in freeze..
<jdong> Nafallo: gushy :)
<jdong> Nafallo: see #ubuntuforums topic :)
<Nafallo> I don't use forums! :-)
<jdong> Nafallo: just read the topic :)
<Nafallo> I'm lazy :-)
<jdong> || Next release Gushy Giblets!
<Nafallo> hmm. they are wrong. they should sign up on mailinglist. the TRUE informationsource ;-)
<jdong> lol
<jdong> and you get great pill deals too!
<jdong> ;-)
<Nafallo> haha
<Nafallo> my bogofilter makes me not see those :-P
<ScottK> jrib: No.  Don't assign them to MOTU.  MOTU approves new packages, but doesn't necessarily do the packaging.
<jrib> ScottK: thanks
<ScottK> TheMuso: Thanks for taking care of the klamav update.
<jekil> so, i must set  gutsy in changelog?
<pochu> jekil: yep
<jekil> pochu: thanks
<pochu> jekil: because it won't be accepted in Feisty :)
<pochu> Too late ;)
<_MMA_> Could someone close Bug #106560 for me. GIMP 2.3 isnt in the repos.
<ubotu> Malone bug 106560 in ubuntustudio-meta "ubuntustudio-graphics needs gimp-svg v2.2.x! (Doesnt work with gimp v2.3.x))" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/106560
<joejaxx> is that what the rejected status is for?
<ScottK> I got it.
<_MMA_> Thanx
<ScottK> Done. Bug #106560
<ubotu> Malone bug 106560 in ubuntustudio-meta "ubuntustudio-graphics needs gimp-svg v2.2.x! (Doesnt work with gimp v2.3.x))" [Undecided,Rejected]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/106560
<_MMA_> ScottK: Im sorry. I thought you had to be MOTU to do it. I could have handled it. :)
<_MMA_> Thanx though. :)
<ScottK> Now you know.  The only thing you can't do without being MOTU, core-dev, or ubuntu-qa is set importance.
* gnomefreak wonders if they meant 2.13 and 2.12
<_MMA_> Ahh... Gotcha.
* ScottK joined ubuntu-qa for that reason (much easier than getting MOTU).
<joejaxx> gnomefreak: maybe so
<joejaxx> gnomefreak: but ubuntustudio-meta only exists in feisty
<gnomefreak> but i am thinking its 2.2.13
<_MMA_> gnomefreak: I dint know. I use gimp-svg from the repos just fine here. :(
<gnomefreak> so im not real sure
<joejaxx> _MMA_: same here
* gnomefreak scared of gimp
<ScottK> gnomefreak: We'll find out if he replies to the bug I guess. TheGimp 2.1 was never in the Ubuntu repos, so either way, it's rejected.
<gnomefreak> true
<_MMA_> Shouldnt have been filed against "ubuntustudio-graphics" anyway. ;)
<gnomefreak> there seems to be a 2.3 in devel in gimp
<damko> bye! wish u all a good w.e.
<gnomefreak> damko: you too
<ScottK> Heh! - http://www.computerpartner.nl/article.php?news=int&id=5003 "Microsoft: Word 2007 crashes are a feature, not bug"
<xtknight> lol
<gnomefreak> lol
<xtknight> see this? http://antitrust.slated.org/www.iowaconsumercase.org/011607/3000/PX03020.pdf
<damko> :-)
<syke> hi
<ScottK> Hello
<syke> how do I request a package to be updated for feisty?
<syke> monodevelop 0.12 is what installs, but 0.13.1 is the first one that is really usable
<gnomefreak> file a bug on it.
<gnomefreak> is .13 stable?
<ScottK> syke: But Feisty gets released in roughly a week, so it's extremely unlikely a new version gets brought in.
<gnomefreak> oh he said feisty :(
<syke> 0.13 is the only monodevelop version I have used that didn't crash within 10 minutes of usage
<gnomefreak> feisty wont get anything now
<ScottK> If there are specific bugs it fixes, someone (maybe you) might extract patches to fix the current one.
<xtknight> could an updated pkg come thru the updates?
<syke> specific patches aren't really possible, I don't think
<xtknight> or only backported bugfixes to the current revision?
<syke> if updating isn't a possibility, I would really just remove the pkg
<jdong> syke: it's not going to happen in Feisty sadly....
<jdong> syke: 0.13 requires newer stetic and friends, and I've been watching it go into Debian....
<jdong> syke: 0.12 in the repos don't crash for me, and I use it regularly...
<jdong> if you want 0.13 packages I think I have some
<syke> jdong: if they're on a public URL, that would be nice
<syke> I'm working on a book, pragmatic unit testing in C#, and I'm trying to make sure the code/examples in it works in all these environments
<syke> we use a couple of screenshots of nunit-gui running in KUbuntu
<jdong> syke: uploading, http://web.mit.edu/jdong/www/md/ 
<syke> we mention monodevelop 0.13 because it adds an integrated unit test runner
<gnomefreak> why not just doa  simple build to make life easy if the book isnt ubuntu specific
<jdong> done.
<jdong> gnomefreak: heh it's not as trivial a build as we'd like it to be
<syke> yea, it's a big pain in the balls to build :(
<syke> so many dependencies
<jdong> syke: yeah but the debs I posted I've been using since 0.13.1's release... they're based off Ubuntu debs
<jdong> and should be pretty safe to use
<jdong> but the usual 3rd party unsupported package warning goes along with them ;-)
<syke> great, that's better than nothing :)
<syke> just trying to make sure the readers of the book can have a smooth experience with Linux :)
<jdong> 0.13 also adds better code completion too
<jdong> and partial class support
<jdong> for the UI editor that is
<syke> and, like I say, it doesn't crash nearly as much for me
<jdong> well I'll attempt to backport it to Feisty once Gushy Giblets or whatever opens
<syke> haw
<syke> :)
<jdong> :)
<syke> the other package I had a question about was NUnit itself; I suppose there's no chance of updating that to 2.4, is there?
<jdong> haven't looked into that
<jdong> but Feisty, it's too late to update anything at this time
<syke> I also noticed that even when the current NUnit package is installed, most configure scripts look for a mono-nunit.pc, and the current NUnit pkg only installs an nunit.pc
<syke> ok, that's too bad for monodevelop :/ I'll add a general note about making sure to have the latest versions or downlaod them separately
<jdong> slomo is the monodevelop guy around here; he will be thrilled to dicuss this with you :D
<jdong> lol
* jdong hides before he gets slapped
<syke> must be a private joke I'm missing out on :)
<DktrKranz> could you clarify me about packages inserted into REJECTED queue?
<syke> need to reboot to try this updated kernel and kdelibs, I'm having some issues with knetworkmanager that it will hopefully fix
<syke> jdong: thanks for the info! :)
<DktrKranz> recently \sh uploaded for me tutos2 package
<DktrKranz> but I noticed it was inserted into REJECTED queue: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/feisty/+queue?queue_state=4&queue_text=tutos2
<DktrKranz> is there something to do in these cases?
<ScottK> You need to ask one of the archive admins or maybe ask the MOTU that approved it to ask.
<ScottK> When that happened to me, Tollef e-mailed my why. 
<ScottK> They're possibly busy at the moment, so I'd ask the MOTU that uploaded it to ask.
<DktrKranz> will do, thanks.
<penguin42> would it be possible to get gnucash (in universe) updated to the latest release - is the right thing to put a bug in for that?
<ScottK> penguin42: Not now.
<ScottK> Not for Feisty
<penguin42> sure I realise that's too late
<penguin42> but just to get it on the radar that it needs getting done
<ScottK> Once the repositories open for the next release, it should just happen.
<penguin42> oh ok - the version in there is about 6 months old
* penguin42 has a small intermittent rendering issue on it and I guess the devs will just ask if it happens on the latest
<ScottK> Actually, there is an Ubuntu specific variant, see https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnucash so it will have to be merged.  It won't be automatic.
<ScottK> penguin42: Maybe you could work on it in a few weeks? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Merging we can always use more help.
<penguin42> ScottK: I wouldn't mind doing - but I've got about 3 or 4 geeky other projects I havn't got around to either :-(
<penguin42> what do you mean by 'ubuntu specific varient' - I suspect gnucash doesn't actually have stuff for debs in it at all
<ScottK> Right, but the Ubuntu version is modified from what we get from Debian.
<penguin42> ah ok
<ScottK> Put it on your TODO for about a month from now.
* penguin42 goes to have a dig to see where debian is up to
<penguin42> Ah Debian have the latest version packaged - I'll try building it from their package and see how it goes
<penguin42> ScottK: Is it easy to see why we have an ubuntu specific version?
<ScottK> penguin42: Yes.  Download the source package (apt-get source gnucash) and look in debian/changelog
<ScottK> It should explain the differences.
<penguin42> actually they've got the latest in etch
<ScottK> One thing to look at is is the Ubuntu version still required.  If Debian has made changes that make the Ubuntu specific stuff OBE, then it can be synched.
<ScottK> Merges have to be done manually, so they don't always get done regularly.  Remember that MOTU is all volunteer.
<penguin42> nod
<ScottK> If you have the technical ability (and it sounds like you do) there is one easy way to make sure the Ubuntu gnucash stays up to date...
<penguin42> Hmm according to the changelog there is a tiny build dependency difference (libgoffice-0-dev instead of libgoffice-1-dev)
<ScottK> Look at sid though, not etch.
<ScottK> By the time you are ready to merge it, sid will probably have changed.
<penguin42> ScottK: What I don't have is the knowledge of the ways of the packaging rules and how to package stuff properly
<ScottK> People here will help you learn that.
<penguin42> hmph - let me try the obvious thing first, I'll just have a quick look if the debian package builds and runs ok
<ScottK> That's a good one.
* ScottK expects you'll find the library is the wrong version.
<ScottK> http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/index.html is a good place to start.
<ScottK> Of course you could make the build-dep change and then it would probably build.  Look in debian/control in the source package.
<penguin42> so do you guys have any tools that keep an eye on debian version updates?
<mr_pouit> penguin42: you can use this page: http://tiber.tauware.de/~laserjock/motutodo/universe.html
<ScottK> There is also http://merges.ubuntu.com/ and http://merges.ubuntu.com/universe.html
<imbrandon> penguin42, if your wanting to make a custom list look into mdt
<imbrandon> ( mdt == multi distro tools ) made just for that
<penguin42> hmm it seems you and debian have a gentle disagreement of the naming of libgoffice-?-dev
* ScottK doesn't know why
<ScottK> penguin42: Who uses which?
<ScottK> It is not rare for Ubuntu to jump to a newer infrastructure sooner.
<ScottK> For example, Python 2.5 is the default Python in Feisty and it's not yet supported in Sid.
<penguin42> well they have a libgoffice-1-dev (0.2.1-4) and we have a libgoffice-0-dev (0.3.7-0ubuntu1)
<ScottK> Ah.  I've no idea why.
<penguin42> that one is a little nuts - the build dependency naming is the only thing that is stopping it being up to date
<penguin42> hmm is there anything to tell apt to install all the packages this dsc it needs as build dependencies
<imbrandon> sudo apt-get build-dep <package> ?
<penguin42> hmm it won't actually take it from the dsc - still it will get me what I need
<imbrandon> pbuilder-satisfydepends will get from the dsc
<imbrandon> depends on how you want to do it
<penguin42> ScottK: OK, now I'm confused - off the merges page of that package list page is one for gnucash and it shows a merge for the latest version
<ScottK> Yes, but no one ever got around to submitting it.
<ScottK> Those are drafts that someone has to actually work through.
<penguin42> ah - is it automatic?
<ScottK> Getting to the draft is automatic.
<ScottK> From there a live volunteer has to look it over and verify it.
<ScottK> It gets particularly interesting when Debian and Ubuntu has specific changes.
<ScottK> err uh conflicting changes
<penguin42> ah food calls - the build should be finished by the time I've eaten
<geser> Hi bddebian
<ScottK> Hello bddebian (you youngster).
<bddebian> Heya gang
<bddebian> Hi geser, ScottK ( :-) )
<penguin42> well the gnucash seems to run fine from the debian 2.0.5 with teh build dependency tweaked
<ScottK> penguin42: Then once the repositories open for graceful gibbon, you ought to file a merge request.
<penguin42> ScottK: How does one file a merge request?
<ScottK> penguin42: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Merging
<ScottK> penguin42: Note that this is a relatively easy thing to do that MOTU never has enough people to keep up, so it's a REALLY great way to contribute.
<penguin42> so I can see the bit about submitting a bug on it - is that it or is there something else?
<ScottK> No.  That's pretty much it.  You make sure you got the package right (check the changes, build it, test it a bit), make a debdiff, and file the merge bug with the dediff attached.  A MOTU will review/approve.  Once it's approved, you just mark it fix released after the update builds in the repositories.
<ScottK> Given what you've just done, you know most everything you need to know to start doing simple merges for gutsy.
<ScottK> In cases where we have a fix that Debian doesn't it's good to file a bug in the Debian BTS so they can get it.  The Ubuntu goal is to minimize diff with Debian.
<penguin42> nod - are the debian guys pulling stuff back into their worlds as well?
<ScottK> They don't usually come here and look.  Some will take Ubuntu patches, some won't if they are BTS.
<penguin42> if there is no diff needed - i.e. the automerge has done the right thing do I just point the bug at that?   Is there anything that can go away and check it builds on all the arches?
<ScottK> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ContributingToDebian/
<ScottK> If there is no diff, it's a sync not a merge.
<ScottK> Those are automatic up to a point and then they have to be requested.
<penguin42> there is a diff - but the automerge thing seems to have taken the diff from last time
<geser> penguin42: MoM doesn't add a correct changelog entry (listing the remaining changes) so need to edit it and then debdiff
<ScottK> Right.  MoM guesses and then you have to make sure.
* bluefoxicy meh.  Guesses nobody in Debian updated Stratagus + Invasion:  BOS, so Ubuntu has old, half-complete versions :/
<ScottK> See Debian import freeze on the schedule: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/GutsyReleaseSchedule
<penguin42> geser: Ah OK - pity really
<bluefoxicy> I blame ISV and compatibility
<ScottK> bluefoxicy: If it gets to old and Debian isn't keeping up, you can package the update and submit it to REVU.
<bluefoxicy> ScottK:  Yeah.  I'm more concerned that things like autopackage et al are hackey.. actually, autopackage works pretty well o.o  hmm
<ScottK> penguin42: Personally, I'm impressed how well the MoM does, but would be petrified of taking the human out of the loop entirely.
* bluefoxicy wants point-and-click one-stop install for third party software, regardless of distro.  Goes wandering to see if he can find it.
<geser> penguin42: sometimes it happens that a fix is included a second time because the patch file got an other name or Debian included a patch at an other line in a file
<ScottK> Also now that Etch is released, more emphasis will go into Sid.
<ScottK> bluefoxicy: Click N Run is supposed to be coming to Ubuntu 'real soon now".
<penguin42> ScottK: Nod, if you take the human out of the loop the systems might start writing their own code
<ScottK> And do it badly.
<bluefoxicy> ScottK:  that's a centralized database, like Apt2 or something.
<penguin42> it looks like the gnucash update in debian missed the freeze for feisty by about 3 days - bah!
<ScottK> Gnucash would have had to be merged in any case so wouldn't have been automatic.
<bluefoxicy> ScottK:  I want something where I can grab what I want from wherever, like Autopackage; but I'm not wholly convinced that Linux can handle backwards compatibility (try running Citrix once, if you install libxaw6 it doesn't work because libxaw6 doesn't have a symbol it needs)
* ScottK has never seen a auto packager that could get it right consistently - the box doesn't have enough data.
<penguin42> so if I come back this time next week and file the bug it should be OK?
<ScottK> No.  Wait until the gutsy repositories open.
<penguin42> when is that due?
<ScottK> I thin it's roughly April 29.
<ScottK> thin/think
<ScottK> Then if you want, after it's in gutsy you can file for a backport into Feisty.
<penguin42> but then do I have to go and gab gutsy tools and stuff?
<ScottK> Not immediately.
<penguin42> ok
<bluefoxicy> ScottK:  CITRIX needs libxaw6 (not 5, not 7); but xaw6 doesn't have all the symbols (because the idiot programmers don't understand you're supposed to upgrade the ELF major version when you break the ABI); this seems to be a pretty chronic problem, programs just eventually don't work any more because the libraries are different somewhere along the line.  Most libs seem to get ELF versioning right these days (GTK+ is a model e
<bluefoxicy> xample) but meh.
<bluefoxicy> I suspect that autopackagers like autopackage will always hit that hurdle
<penguin42> has their been any thought ever to building stuff in later distros with loose enough dependencies to still work on older ones?
<penguin42> you'd think a lot of packages would work on multiple versions 
<ScottK> Yes, but the binaries need to be built with the correct environment for that version.
<penguin42> do thehy?
<ScottK> So you don't upversion dependencies unless you need to and then you can use the backports system for stuff that qualifies.
<ScottK> penguin42: Yes.  Usually it's OK, but sometimes you get burned.
<ScottK> For your own use, it's probably OK, but for the distro as a whole, not.
<penguin42> ScottK: I was thinking just applying it to packages that are OK
<ScottK> There's no way to know.
<ScottK> Keep the source as common as you can and then build in the correct environment is the only way to do it.
<bluefoxicy> hmm
<penguin42> going in the forward direction should work shouldn't it - I mean building newer packages on feisty and then using those also in feisty+1 say
* bluefoxicy ponders an autocompat system
<ScottK> It's discussed here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MarkShuttleworth
<bluefoxicy> something that will build a thin compatibility layer around new versions of libraries
<ScottK> penguin42: Depends on if some library had removed some aspect of an API.
<bluefoxicy> nah that would be a pain
<penguin42> ScottK: But then they should bump their major version or disembowel their authors
<ScottK> Yep.  That's the theory.
* penguin42 was just looking for ways to keep the load down
<vil> imbrandon, ping
<ScottK> Work in the process and get your stuff into the Ubuntu repositories and then it's Canonical's problem.  That keeps YOUR load down.
<penguin42> so what builds the universe - is their a build farm that checks it builds on SPARC say?
<penguin42> nod - just trying to understand how the universe goes together
<ScottK> See https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/klamav/0.41-0ubuntu1 - It shows you which archs Ubuntu builds.
<ScottK> As an example.
<ScottK> Universe and Main use the same toolset for this.
<penguin42> hmm nice build system
<penguin42> right, I'll try and remember to keep an eye on it and come back in a couple of weeks and file the stuff on gnucash
<penguin42> thanks
<danohuiginn> apt-get build-dep is telling me "build dependencies could not be satisfied". How can I get it to tell me *which* build-deps are the problem?
<ScottK> danohuiginn: The error message should tell you.  Read closely.
<danohuiginn> ScottK: it doesn't seem to. http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/15654/
* ScottK lloks
<ScottK> looks
<ScottK> Ah.  It's pbuilder that will tell you which.  Try and build the package and dpkg-buildpackage will bail out and tell you which.
<ScottK> Sorry about that.
<danohuiginn> ok, thanks
<imbrandon> vil, pong
<geser> danohuiginn: I can't reproduce it here
<vil> imbrandon, again question regrarding ubuntuwire
<imbrandon> sure, shoot
<vil> there is supposed to be a problem with eclipse on sparc64, however, I don't have a way to test it
<vil> imbrandon, do you thing that you could install the latest eclipse on sparky?
<imbrandon> sparky is spark64 kernel iirc 
<imbrandon> i would much rather you do it in a chroot 
<imbrandon> than install it on the main box
<vil> imbrandon, that's fine
<imbrandon> vil, e.g. pbuilder-feisty login
<imbrandon> then install from there
<danohuiginn> geser: I got it sorted, thanks. It was tangled up in alternatives
<vil> imbrandon, I will look at what is pbuilder login good for
<imbrandon> vil, "pbuilder-feisty login" will give you a clean chroot that you can install it in, then when you "exit" it cleans it all up
<imbrandon> and sets it back to default
<vil> imbrandon, thanks again for your kind help
<imbrandon> np
<TheMuso> ScottK: You're welcome.
<grayman> is there a problem with xkbd in Feisty?
<grayman> xkb
<marseillai_> hi
<marseillai_> does anyone know where I can find a complete howto to create package from scratch using cdbs in the "ubuntu" way?
<macd> marseillai_, http://doc.gwos.org/index.php/Deb_Guide isnt a bad start
<jekil> marseillai_: is hard to find good cdbs documentation
<macd> nvm, I didnt read what you said.
<marseillai_> jekil: arf
<jussi01> marseillai_, http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/basic-cdbs.html
<damko> marseillai_: I made my first package 1 day ago and I found very useful yada to understand the mechanism to create a package. may be it's usefull also for u
<marseillai_> jekil: assuming i want to make a clean package of an application (i've allready done one this afternoon : i've patch kopete, make debdiff and a deb) but from scratch, can i find some help here to teach me how to do with cdbs/pbuilder and else ???
<jussi01> marseillai_, see the link i gave you
<marseillai_> jussi01: it's pretty.... empty .....
<jekil> marseillai_: read links above and google
<jussi01> http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/basic-scratch.html
<jussi01> also that
<mr_pouit> marseillai_: for cdbs, you can also read https://perso.duckcorp.org/duck/cdbs-doc/cdbs-doc.xhtml
<marseillai_> mr_pouit: dja lu, un peu perdu
<jussi01> marseillai_, on that first link was a link to more stuff
<marseillai_> macd: does this doc is about cdbs or debhelper : http://doc.gwos.org/index.php/Deb_Guide ? or perhaps debhelper and cdbs are the same things ?
<jekil> marseillai_: are 2 things...
<jekil> i think that you must understend well this before use it
<marseillai_> thanks jekil macd and jussi01 
#ubuntu-motu 2007-04-15
<TheMuso> c/c
<TheMuso> arg
<_Enchained> hi
<TheMuso> Hi _Enchained 
<_Enchained> I have a question with packaging with java dependencies
<_Enchained> about*
<TheMuso> I don't know a lot about packaging java apps, but fire away anyway.
<_Enchained> TheMuso: I'd like to put in binary dep (in control) "any java virtual machine"
<_Enchained> free, sun-java5 or 6 ...)
<_Enchained> I've made a package with sun-java5-bin in bin-dep
<TheMuso> _Enchained: There is probably something you can depend on to do that, but I don't know what it is without having a serious look.
<_Enchained> and there is a problem while instaling sun-java6-bin :
<TheMuso> And I don't currently have time to do that I'm affraid.
<TheMuso> Whats the problem?
<_Enchained> it removes sun-java5-bin and so, remove the software
<TheMuso> ah right
<_Enchained> DO you now I can I solve it ?
<_Enchained> how*
<TheMuso> Not without having a good look, which as I said, I'm not currently in the position to do so.
<_Enchained> ok
<RAOF> slomo: If you're available, I'd like to get your opinion on the banshee merge I'm helping crimsun with.
<aanderse> hmm
<ScottK> TheMuso: Thanks for taking care of updating the clamav/klamav bugs.
<bddebian> You two-timer! ;-P
<ScottK> What? He's actually uploading stuff for me.
<bddebian> :-)
<just> http://www.codigolibre.org/modules.php?name=Downloads&d_op=viewdownload&cid=1
<harrisony> what is the command to extract a deb package
<Hobbsee> harrisony: dpkg-source -x foo.dsc
<harrisony> err i have a deb and i wana get the get to all the files and such
<minghua> dpkg-deb
<harrisony> ahh thx
<minghua> dpkg-deb --extract and --control IIRC
* Hobbsee looks up dpkg-deb
<Hobbsee> oh, interesting
<harrisony> is there a rule in MOTU that packages must have an english version because bug 106678 has a person complaining that the package isnt in english 
<ubotu> Malone bug 106678 in gmountiso "It's in french (I think), I prefer English." [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/106678
<tuxmaniac> Any idea when RC will be out and whether this would affect the final release of Fawn?
<harrisony> tuxmaniac: the RC should of been out before as it comes out 1 week before the release
<tuxmaniac> harrisony, It has been delayed. thats what cjwatson has mailed to the devel announce list on April 12th
<harrisony> tuxmaniac: ahhh,
* jmg 's media center is working pretty well
<Hobbsee> tuxmaniac: see #ubuntu+1 topic
<tuxmaniac> Hobbsee, hallo
<tuxmaniac> Hobbsee, how are you. Long time no see?
<tuxmaniac> Hobbsee, I just got the answerfrom watson
<Hobbsee> tuxmaniac: good.  fixing bugs, etc.
<Hobbsee> yes, i saw
<welshbyte> good morning / $part_of_day
<crimsun> neat. closing one bug reopens another.
<tuxmaniac> crimsun, heh
<RAOF> crimsun: You seem a bit busy :).  Have you had time to check the banshee source package?  Shall I just (try to) file a merge bug, attaching the debdiff, or wait for you?
<crimsun> it's on revu, correct?
<RAOF> Yes.
<crimsun> please do go ahead and file a merge bug
<crimsun> I'll try and find a few moments away from being swamped by these audio bugs
<RAOF> :(
<crimsun> sorry, I'm not ignoring you, promise.
<crimsun> I've been swamped this dev cycle by alsa issues.
<stgraber> crimsun: About : bug 85640, are we going to have this patch uploaded or not ? (Just to be able to answer people asking)
<ubotu> Malone bug 85640 in cryptsetup "[Feisty]  crypted root doesnt mount on start (cryptsetup)" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/85640
<stgraber> if we don't I can still make an update afterwards or they can continue using my fixed package
<RAOF> crimsun: Oh, I'm not worried about that *at all*.  That was a "sorry you're swamped by crappy hardware bugs" :)
<stgraber> but as I can see, nobody is complaining about introduced bugs, some aren't fixed for sure but it helps for the others at least
<crimsun> stgraber: looking now, sorry for the wait.
<stgraber> no problem for me, just that we are coming really close to the release date ...
<crimsun> god, do I know.
<crimsun> but please, I'm swamped ATM.
<crimsun> stgraber: um..
<crimsun> $ apt-cache madison cryptsetup
<crimsun> cryptsetup | 2:1.0.4+svn26-1ubuntu2 | http://archive.ubuntu.com feisty/universe Packages
<crimsun> cryptsetup | 2:1.0.4+svn26-1ubuntu2 | http://archive.ubuntu.com feisty/universe Sources
<crimsun> what is there to apply?
<stgraber> :) seems someone uploaded it ?
<stgraber> Didn't receive the mail in feisty-changes
<stgraber> (the list is laggy ?)
<crimsun> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/feisty-changes/2007-April/008535.html
<siretart> stgraber: I uploaded your patch
<crimsun> right, please check $release-changes first next time, thanks.
<stgraber> ok, sorry ...
<stgraber> siretart: thank you
<crimsun> np
<siretart> I wanted to tell you yesterday, but I fell asleep :( - (I'm not feeling that well this weekend)
<crimsun> hope you feel better than I do, siretart 
<siretart> crimsun: get well soon!
<crimsun> you, too!
<siretart> I'm indeed feeling better today. oh well.
<crimsun> RAOF: I take it there was objection to the Stop mmkey addition?
<\sh> moins
<geser> Hi \sh
<\sh> hey geser
<\sh> siretart: ping wine 0.9.34 , I'll closed UVF for 0.9.34, and there will be a 0.9.35 ;)
<\sh> siretart: and no..backports is not a solution for feisty...0.9.35 will fix some serious bugs and we should try to get it in...regardless of the diffstat ;)
<\sh> .oO(a SRU is a better solution)
<\sh> DktrKranz: hey, thx for your work on php4 unmet deps
<siretart> \sh: could you perhaps name some of the serious bugs which are RC for feisty?
<DktrKranz> hi \sh, thank you for your time and patience :)
<siretart> \sh: I just need some arguments for persuading my concience
<\sh> siretart: arts crash in winecfg
<DktrKranz> I've got some of them ready, I'll send you for review once they are all done
<\sh> siretart: and one bug in xrender.c
<\sh> http://www.winehq.org/pipermail/wine-devel/2007-April/055637.html
<\sh> and more improvements in directx
<\sh> and vista support options ;)
<\sh> siretart: and as always: wine's a b*tch
<siretart> \sh: I fully agree, but since we are this close to release, we'd need pretty good arguments for an upgrade. and the changelog isn't that convincing, you know?
<siretart> it reads like half a rewrite to me
<\sh> siretart: yepp I know :(
<\sh> siretart: and sometimes I think it is a rewrite :( 
<Fujitsu> With the number of regressions they seem to be able to introduce in one release, it must be pretty close to it.
<siretart> and to be honest, I'd rather have known bugs than unknown ones
<siretart> \sh: are you the only one working on wine?
<\sh> Fujitsu: the problem of a emul^h^h^h^h^hsimul^h^h^h^h^hsoftware which tries to implement something really stupid..instead of forcing the software companies to write their software as well for linux...:(
<crimsun> the question I'd ask is: does .35 fix any current regressions from dapper or edgy?
<Fujitsu> \sh: True.
<\sh> siretart: regarding ubuntu, I'll do my best...scott is doing it on winehq side
<crimsun> correct me if I'm wrong, but winehq doesn't seem to release bugfixes only
<\sh> siretart: regarding apport bugs which are coming in when user X tries to start commercial software Y and wine fcks up...they are useless, retraced reports are useless too, without having the software and see what someone can do to reproduce
<siretart> perhaps we can talk to scott about having some 'stable release series' branch or something
<\sh> crimsun: no...they are doing the same as me
<\sh> siretart: there are no stable releases...weekly to 2-weekly releases are now the stable ones
<siretart> \sh: I fully agree. however, your arguments persuade me rather to not ship wine at all in ubuntu, you know..
<\sh> what someone needs to know: wine is not stable and never will be
<crimsun> right, so with wine and UVFe, I suppose we can't follow the standard guidelines
<\sh> siretart: oh...it wasn't my idea to package wine for ubuntu, think about breezy when sabdfl wanted to have scotts packages
<siretart> crimsun: how do you think about this: Let's trust \sh and scott's opinion on wine, and include .35, and rediscuss it for gutsy
<\sh> siretart: but wine is a vital package for all linux distros..but I would never file a main inclusion report ,)
<siretart> crimsun: we should really find some way of dealing with wine
<siretart> \sh: I strongly disagree that wine was 'vital'
<crimsun> siretart: that's acceptable by me.
<\sh> siretart: I think when we start to do a popularity contest, you will see wine in the top 50 or so ,-)
<siretart> \sh: are you familar with wine's code?
<crimsun> would be nice to discuss a new approach for it at UDS
<siretart> as in familiar enough to cherry pick patches/fixes from upstream?
<\sh> siretart: hell no...I had last time a nice debugging session with wines code, because on all ubuntu distros wine is not behaving like e.g. on gentoo or redhat
<\sh> siretart: oh for this, yes...the problem right now, releases are coming so fast, that cherry picking patches is useless
<siretart> \sh: I'm asking because for cherrypicking upstream patches/fixes, you don't need any exception at all, which would simplify the process
<slomo> RAOF: merge with the debian version? just take the debian version and throw in the multimedia keys patch, everything else is fine (and you need new libipoddevice and ipod-sharp)
<crimsun> slomo: I filed sync requests for both build-deps, which have been processed.
<\sh> siretart: you mean git diff from head and pushing them into e.g. 0.9.33 ?
<slomo> crimsun: cool
<crimsun> slomo: I'm compiling 0.12.1 now and will test it with my iPod to verify
<crimsun> (the merged 0.12.1)
<slomo> crimsun: ok... what's the delta?
<crimsun> slomo: here -> http://librarian.launchpad.net/7332922/banshee-merge.debdiff
<slomo> crimsun: looks good, thanks to you two :)
<imbrandon> moins everyone
<crimsun> slomo: thank /you/ :)
<\sh> siretart: if you see the changes in git 0.9.35 to 0.9.34...(http://www.winehq.org/?announce=latest) it's frightening me even more to cherry pick patches :(
<ajmitch> hi imbrandon 
<\sh> hey imbrandon, ajmitch
<ajmitch> hello \sh 
<imbrandon> ello ajmitch \sh
* Fujitsu awakens.
<ajmitch> "Wine's bi-weekly snapshots are exactly that - snapshots of the git repository. There's no extra care given toward a release, no regression testing done (other than the usual process of running the regression test suite), and certainly no applications checked for compatibility."
<ajmitch> so comforting
<imbrandon> he
<imbrandon> h
<\sh> ajmitch: if wine would be a stock option...."don't buy" would be my advise ,->
<imbrandon> i use wine all the time :) heheh only for WoW :)
<\sh> imbrandon: ubuntus version?
<imbrandon> yes
<\sh> wow
<\sh> I didn't even know that this works ,-)
<imbrandon> yea wow has worked in wine for a LONG time
<imbrandon> even in ubuntus version
<\sh> and far cry? ,-)
<imbrandon> havent tried that one 
<\sh> please do ;)
<imbrandon> k, i will this evening
* \sh needs a new computer with super duper high end graphics card and dual core what have you crap
<imbrandon> lol
<\sh> and more money for buying all these nice little addicting windows games
<imbrandon> i onyl have a GForce 6200 LE, bottom of the line "good cards"
<imbrandon> its was like $40 USD
<imbrandon> but it runs the one or two games i play well, so i dont mind :)
<\sh> well, I just need a computer for ircing, jabbering, and compiling software and burning cds for my GF...that's all...right now, no gaming 
* ajmitch has a geforce 6600, but plays no games
<ajmitch> all that power, just for compiz ;)
<imbrandon> hehe
<\sh> ajmitch: you're vista ,->
<ajmitch> compiz with no effects, that is
<imbrandon> lol
<\sh> Even the product of my company doesn't work with wine
<imbrandon> 6 minutes left on EXCH2003_ENT.iso ( legit ) , wonderfull
* \sh screams
<\sh> kmail is so buggy 
<\sh> even sylpheed-claws is more stable right now
<\sh> (regarding imap)
<imbrandon> yea kmails imap is shitty
<\sh> kmail doesn't even crash when IMAP is broken...
<\sh> so I can't reproduce the crashhanger
<\sh> fck
<jekil> hello
<Hobbsee> heya jekil 
<\sh> siretart: 0.9.35 fixes a scim problem http://bugs.winehq.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6547
<ubotu> Wine bug 6547 in wine-binary "wine versions newer than 0.9.22 hang" [Blocker,Resolved: fixed]  
<sacater> how often is this page updated? https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+topcontributors
<Fujitsu> sacater: Whenever the karma is, which is about every 24 hours.
<sacater> oh, well if you look at support trackers, then my support karma, i should be in there
<sacater> but im not :(
* Hobbsee wonders why people insist on asking the same question, at the same time, in multiple channels
<finalbeta> Hobbsee: Because 1+1=2
<Hobbsee> finalbeta: and 2+2 =5, for sufficiently large values of 2.
<TheMuso> Evening all.
<Hobbsee> hi TheMuso 
* TheMuso is off duty until he has moved.
<Hobbsee> awww
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: Especially since I have been doing packaging for the UbuntuStudio project, which has involved ugly hacks, which took a while to get the intended behavior.
<Hobbsee> ah
<RAOF> TheMuso: Good luck with the move, incidentally.
<TheMuso> RAOF: Thanks. We move Tuesday, and are going offline tomorrow some time.
<kofler> I hate this bug: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/meta-kde/+bug/64695 , why hasn't it been assigned to anyone yet?
<ubotu> Malone bug 64695 in meta-kde "KDE logout dialog is missing shutdown and restart options" [Undecided,Confirmed]  
<kofler> It'd be kind of nice if ubotu also reported when the bug was submitted for clarification: Bug #64695, first reported on 2006-10-08  by lcampagn
<ubotu> Malone bug 64695 in meta-kde "KDE logout dialog is missing shutdown and restart options" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/64695
<kofler> So the bug was first seen roughly around when Edgy came out it appears. I've confirmed that the Feisty Beta has the same problem.
<kofler> It's funny, I don't remember it being a problem in Edgy though.
<bddebian> Heya gang
<geser> Hi bddebian
<bddebian> Heya geser
<defendguin> michael bienia?
<Nafallo> defendguin: geser 
<defendguin> ahh
<defendguin> thanks Nafallo
<Nafallo> :-)
<geser> defendguin: How can I help you?
<defendguin> you were requesting information on a bug i submitted earlier
<defendguin> about trying to scale down a core duo processor to 800 mzk
<defendguin> mhz
<defendguin> bug 106629
<ubotu> Malone bug 106629 in Ubuntu "Centrino core duo needs to scale each core to 800 mhz instead of 1.0 GHz" [Undecided,Needs info]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/106629
<ivoks> hm...
<geser> defendguin: have you tried google to find out which cpu frequency are supported by the cpu?
<ivoks> are you sure it's capable doing that?
<defendguin> i've been reading the intel specification's document
<ivoks> Centrino isn't the name of procesor
<defendguin> sorry
<defendguin> thats what the sticker says 
<defendguin> lol
<ivoks> defendguin: could you point me on those documents?
<defendguin> sure one moment
<defendguin> http://processorfinder.intel.com/details.aspx?sSpec=SL8VR   this is my specific processor
<ivoks> tou know that not all processor have same scaling?
<defendguin> i do
<ivoks> s/tou/you/
<ivoks> there is nothing here about scaling
<defendguin> one moment
<defendguin> http://developer.intel.com/design/mobile/datashts/309221.htm
<defendguin> there is a pdf available there
<defendguin> from reading that document i could not find any set levels for the core duo processors
<defendguin> it did mention some defined levels for the core solo processors though
<ivoks> i have core duo and it can't go lower than 1GHz
<defendguin> is that something with the hardware or is that a limitation of the kernel?
<ivoks> hardware
<ivoks> it's speedstep technology, built in processor
<defendguin> right
<defendguin> i wonder why i see the battery life can be significantly greater using windows 
<ivoks> there are a lot of reasons
<ivoks> speedstep is not one of them :)
<defendguin> heh
<defendguin> ivoks: it has more to do with hard drive activity?
<ivoks> i think yes, disk is most guilty one...
<fdoving> windows might spinndown the disk more often.
<ivoks> but I never studied this in details
<ivoks> ext3 is 'nervous' FS
<defendguin> lol
<ivoks> it always does something with disk :)
<defendguin> i'd really like to give zfs a try
<ivoks> try xfs
<defendguin> xfs?
<ivoks> jer, xfs
<ivoks> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/XFS
<defendguin> yeah that was my first stop
<fdoving> xfs is nice.
<fdoving> even nice when it breaks.
<fdoving> greate recoverytools.
<fdoving> -e
<ivoks> yes
<defendguin> ext3 sucks at recovery
<ivoks> and you can enlarge it online :)
<Lathiat> speaking of filesystems
<Lathiat> EXT3-fs error (device dm-4): ext3_free_blocks_sb: bit already cleared for block 53928702
<Lathiat> Aborting journal on device dm-4.
* Lathiat grumbles
<Lathiat>  for /home on a relatively busy web/mail/shell server
<Lathiat> why does this always happen at midnight on sunday when i have work the next day!
<geser> defendguin: have you checked if the cpu is using also other power states (!= scaling)?
<geser> defendguin: cat /proc/acpi/processor/CPU1/power
<fdoving> defendguin: as for writing to the disk every 5 seconds, you can mount ext3 with the 'commit=X' where X is number of seconds between commits to the journal.
<defendguin> fdoving: what is a sensible default?
<ivoks> for xfs on ubuntu:
<ivoks> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/37435
<ubotu> Malone bug 37435 in linux-source-2.6.15 "XFS leaves garbage in file if app does write-new-then-rename without f(data)sync" [Medium,Confirmed]  
<Lathiat> awesome
<defendguin> could the ubuntu installer detect what type of computer the person is installing and suggest a file system that would be best for that persons particular needs?
<defendguin> it's a bit much for Joe user to have researched file systems and pick on that is best for him.  
<Hobbsee> ext3's the default, anyone who doesnt like that can pick what they like
<defendguin> thats not very forward thinking 
<fdoving> defendguin: 5sec is the default, decide for your self on your system. i stick with 5 on my laptop.. not for any good reason, but i either use it or suspend it, so it's never really sitting there waiting for me to do anything.
<fdoving> defendguin: ext3 is always the best for joe user.
<fdoving> users with special needs know what they need and what they want.
<fdoving> .. and how to get it.
* Nafallo agrees with fdoving 
<defendguin> well just sitting here using xchat i'm still working but not writing anything to the disk any yet the hard drive is still journaling 
<defendguin> why is increased battery life a special need?
<fdoving> nothing is commited to the journal if you don't change anything on the disk.
<Nafallo> defendguin: ehrm. have you even tried tuning ext3? :-)
<defendguin> Nafallo: no i have not
<Nafallo> there you go then
<defendguin> it was just a suggestion that when installing ubuntu the installer could make some intelligent assumptions based on your hardware and help the user 
<Nafallo> it does
<Nafallo> it uses ext3
<fdoving> with the default 5 sec commit interval.
<Nafallo> and that is normally fine when you're on AC. it still runs laptop-mode when you disconnect AC AFAIK
<Nafallo> and I think that has sane default, even though I normally tweak it for heavier savings myself :-)
<defendguin> is ntfs a journaled file system?
<Nafallo> IIRC yes
<Nafallo> atleast the one in XP
<imbrandon> wikipedia says from version 1.0 on it is
<imbrandon> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NTFS
<imbrandon> ( e.g. NT4 )
<Hobbsee> imbrandon!!!!!!!!!
<imbrandon> Hobbsee!!!oneone!!11eleventyone!!1111
<imbrandon> :)
<Hobbsee> hehe
<ivoks> defendguin: open /etc/default/acpi-support
<defendguin> k
<ivoks> defendguin: on the end is ENABLE_LAPTOP_SUPPORT
* highvoltage wishes he could get such an enthusiastic hello one day
<ivoks> defendguin: make it true
<Hobbsee> hehe
<imbrandon> heya highvoltage 
<highvoltage> howdy imbrandon 
<defendguin>  "off by default as it causes odd hangs on some machines"
<ivoks> try :)
<ivoks> works for me
<defendguin> ivoks: this wont interfere with any program like gnome power manager settings will it?
<ivoks> no
<defendguin> i remember reading this file up and down a month ago and decided against editing it for that reason
<damko> ciao!
<defendguin> geser: i guess you can close bug 106629 
<ubotu> Malone bug 106629 in Ubuntu "Centrino core duo needs to scale each core to 800 mhz instead of 1.0 GHz" [Undecided,Needs info]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/106629
<ScottK> defendguin: If you are the reporter, you can mark it rejected/fix released as appropriate.
<defendguin> ah ok
<_Enchained> hi
<_Enchained> anyone to help me with a package nedding java ?
<_Enchained> needing*
<welshbyte> _Enchained: i couldn't help you myself, but have you read the debian java policy?
<_Enchained> yes welshbyte
<damko> _Enchained: what's the difference with another package ?
<_Enchained> My problem is that the soft need java in binary dependencies
<_Enchained> In the java policy
<_Enchained> it's said :
<_Enchained> Programs must depend on java-virtual-machine and the needed runtime environment (java1-runtime and/or java2-runtime).
<_Enchained> I put java-virtual-machine and java2-runtime in dependencies
<_Enchained> but lintian reports me :
<_Enchained> virtual-package-depends-without-real-package-depends depends
<_Enchained> so I put "gcj" too and it's the same...
<damko> _Enchained: i don't know
<\sh> if someone wants to test wine 0.9.35...I'll put some test packages on archive.linux-server.org
<imbrandon> \sh, sure
<imbrandon> i cant for a few hours, but i will tonight
<\sh> give me a few , then the upload is finished :)
<imbrandon> kk
<\sh> done
<\sh> thx for your patience ;)
<\sh> some of the bugs this release will fix, you can find here: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/wine/+bug/106745
<ubotu> Malone bug 106745 in wine "[UVF Exception report]  wine 0.9.35 " [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  
* siretart hugs \sh 
<\sh> siretart: I hope you are ok with this UVF report...but diffstat is more hmmm strange ;)
<imbrandon> heya siretart 
<imbrandon> how goes it today
<\sh> siretart: btw...I'm moving to karlsruhe ... 
<\sh> siretart: completly
<siretart> \sh: based on our chat earlier today, I've approved your UVFe
<siretart> \sh: cool! :)
<\sh> siretart: thx :)
<\sh> siretart: and yes, I agree, that we need to find a new way for wine
<\sh> everyone is welcome to work on this
<siretart> \sh: my current most favorite solution would be to move the package to a PPA maintained by some ubuntu-wine team
<siretart> I'll write a spec for this for sevilla with several possible options 
<\sh> siretart: as you remember, we asked scott for doing the packages actually as well for ubuntu (the official way...)
<\sh> damn, I won't be in sevilla
<siretart> \sh: well, the package in the current form are not really suitable for ubuntu, since it makes us big pain regarding our freeze deadlines
<\sh> siretart: the plan was to have a 1.0 release for feisty
<siretart> \sh: I really appreciate your and scott's work on this. really.
<siretart> k, dinner.now. cu later
<\sh> siretart: I don't , just because wines source is a nightmare, and without the right knowledge someone can break wine much more as now
<\sh> anyways...finishing for today...tomorrow more...good nights ladies and gentlemen :)
<marcin_ant> hi all
<marcin_ant> can someone tell me how to configure scripts to _drop_ new empty database during package installation (I use dbconfig-common) ?
<kofler> How would I prevent a program from starting up at boot?
<Nafallo> sounds like a question for #ubuntu :-)
<ajmitch> morning
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<Nafallo> morning ajmitch, bddebian 
<bddebian> Heya Nafallo
<TheMuso> Hey MOTUs.
<illovae> hello =)
#ubuntu-motu 2008-04-07
<soren> So.. motu-release people: If a project is due to hit 1.0 on April 18th, would you consider granting an FFe up front for that is should I not even bother filing a request?
<TheMuso> soren: I'd consider it based on what it was.
<soren> It's rawstudio.
<TheMuso> Ok. I'll have to look it up.
 * soren wonders how an "or" turned into an "if" in his question
<TheMuso> soren: Depending on the changes, I'd likely give it the thumbs up.
<soren> TheMuso: Cool.
<null_vector> Anyone available to answer some questions about a new package and the FF
<Fujitsu> null_vector: At this stage, you should probably forget about it.
<null_vector> ]I understand that, but at what point would it be an option.  Electricsheep( currently in universe ) is going to require this package in the next version.  Trying to figure out how that's going to work.
<Fujitsu> Once Intrepid opens (probably a coupler of weeks after Hardy releases), there are no freezes...
<null_vector> alright
<pschorf> hello, all
<xtknight> we don't do anything with xsbc-original-maintainer for multiverse packages, do we?
<mok0> xtknight: yes, it's the same
<xtknight> mok0, so i need to change multiverse maintainer to ubuntu-motu also?
<xtknight> i'm having trouble uploading to my PPA also.  WARNING: This key is not certified with a trusted signature!  and i get a rejected email saying it must be signed by an ubuntero.  but i used debuild -S -sd -k with my public key ID.  the same one i uploaded to launchpad.
<mok0> xtknight: you have to sign the key
<xtknight> oops i just realized i didn't sign the CoC
<xtknight> i wonder how i even got my ppa acct then hmmm
<xtknight> weidr
<mok0> xtknight: that was opened by the admin
<pschorf> i was looking to get started with packaging, is it pretty slow before the new release?
<xtknight> lol and when i paste my asc file to sign it, launchpad says "Cannot allocate memory" :)
<mok0> ha
<mok0> pschorf: yes, nothing is happening atm with new packages
<xtknight> is there a way to wipe dput's cache saying i already uploaded it?  i need to try again
<pschorf> mok0: thanks
<xtknight> oh nm -f works
<mok0> xtknight: yes, either that or delete the .uploads file
<xtknight> success at last
<mok0> gnight ppl
<xtknight> it says that my build finished but i don't see any binaries on my ppa.  what's the deal?
<ScottK2> xtknight: What's the link?
<Hobbsee> xtknight: #launchpad for ppa support.  and wait longer.
<xtknight> ScottK2, https://launchpad.net/~xt-knight/+archive
<xtknight> ah maybe just needs time to upload to ftp i dont know.  just wondering, sometimes i get excited ;)
<ScottK2> xtknight: What Hobbsee said.
<Ward1983> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/emdebian-tools/+bug/121369
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 121369 in emdebian-tools "emdebian-tools.postinst" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<Ward1983> how can i fix that temnporarily?
<Ward1983> the suggested fix doesnt seem to work
<xtknight> Ward1983, i'm trying to reproduce it.  what should i choose at the "default cross-building architecture" screen
<Ward1983> xtknight, i chose armel
<Ward1983> xtknight, thanx in advance for taking the time to reproduce it
<xtknight> Ward1983,  ok simply installing it selecting armel on my amd64 hardy machine does not give an error
<Ward1983> maybe the 64 bit one is ok
<xtknight> so it looks like a gutsy problem only?
<Ward1983> i have a regular 32bit system (allthough i have a core2duo)
<Ward1983> xtknight, apperantly, weird
<xtknight>  i have a gutsy i386 also hold on
<Ward1983> since its ok on 64bit, is there some quick fix?
<xtknight> oh i think it's gutsy/hardy not i386/amd654
<Ward1983> lol how convenient :)
<xtknight> you have gutsy now right?
<Ward1983> well i just run gutsy
<Ward1983> yes
<Ward1983> i need emdebian-tools so i can try to get me a EABI kernel crosscompiled for my PDA :)
<xtknight> and you wanted a patch for gutsy to fix this problem ?
<Ward1983> no i just ran into the problem and came here to ask if theres a temporary fix
<Ward1983> but if youre asking if i would like it fixed, offcourse i do
<Ward1983> my apt is broken if i install it
<xtknight> ahh
<xtknight> well there is a hacky workaround
<xtknight> you can remove emdebian-tools from your debian status file
<Ward1983> and how do i do that? :)
<xtknight> of course a patch would be much better but i can't provide you with that right now, so
<Ward1983> sorry if i wasnt clear at first, im not native english
<Ward1983> hacky is ok :)
<xtknight> let's just take it to pm
<xtknight> if someone else is assigned to a package is he "obligated" to finish his work or if i have a debdiff should i simply unassign him, set it to confirmed, and subscribe motu?
<xtknight> bug 182999
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 182999 in acidrip "AcidRip Fails to properly work with x264 (includes patch)." [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/182999
<ScottK2> xtknight: How long since the other person touched it?
<xtknight> ah it's been since 18 mar 08
<ScottK2> I'd go for it.
<xtknight> k
<pschorf> aside from reading the wiki page, does any one have any tips on learning how to package?
<xtknight> pschorf, well i recommend learning how to patch packages, then at least you can learn the ins and outs of packages better before creating the whole infrastructure for one yourself.
<pschorf> xtnight, do you know any bugs that need packaging now?
<xtknight> pschorf,  like a patch that needs to be debianized?
<pschorf> right
<ScottK2> pschorf: http://daniel.holba.ch/really-fix-it/ is a good place to look.
<pschorf> ScottK2: thanks
<xtknight> ya i'm looking there, not all of them that say they have patches really have em though
<xtknight> this one looks nice  Bug 104063
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 104063 in anjuta "[apport] anjuta crashed with SIGSEGV in strlen()" [Medium,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/104063
<ScottK2> There's a column for patch attached.
<pschorf> xtnight, can i pm you after I look at it for a while?
<xtknight> sure
<TheMuso> .c
<ScottK2> Heya TheMuso.
<TheMuso> Hey ScottK2. How goes things?
<ScottK2> Not to bad.
<ScottK2> I could use another month or two to do bug fixing before the release.
<ScottK2> xtknight and pschorf: I'd suggest keeping it on channel.  Others may have suggestions and others may learn from your discussion.
<xtknight> ScottK2, ok.  will do, then
<ScottK2> It's a good general rule.
<jdong> calc: hey, would you like to save me 8000 hours and a few polar ice caps by telling me ahead of times if OOo from Hardy will build on Gutsy?
<xtknight> this guy's patch for Bug 93843 looks fine http://launchpadlibrarian.net/6861053/addwords.debdiff  but he wasn't supposed to remove Core Devs from the maintainer field was he?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 93843 in aspell-en ""Ubuntu" and "Debian" are not in the dictionary" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/93843
<xtknight> errrr never mind.  he added core devs and put pyro as XSBC
<calc> jdong: it won't out of the box, someone is working on backporting it, though i forgot who it is
<jdong> calc: ok cool :)
<calc> jdong: i'm sure with enough backporting of other things and tweaks to rules it will work
<calc> jdong: whoever does backport it, it would be good if they wait to backport the final version for hardy or at least the one that will be uploaded in the next couple days
<jdong> calc: yeah, though that kind of trial and error ain't my cup of tea :)
<calc> since it will do proper launchpad-integration so bug reports will be more useful :)
<jdong> calc: I'm not even aware that someone is backporting it :D
<jdong> calc: but yeah keep me posted on that. IMO OOo 2.4 in Gutsy would be pretty slick, once everything is settled
<calc> jdong: someone was talking to me about it a few days ago but i don't recall who it was
<pschorf> xtnight: I saw a diff file in the responses to the post, how would i go about patching with that?
<xtknight> pschorf, https://launchpad.net/bugs/104063 ?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 104063 in anjuta "[apport] anjuta crashed with SIGSEGV in strlen()" [Medium,Incomplete]
<xtknight> well lets setup your build environment
<jdong> [jdong@jdong:irclogs/FreeNode]$ grep ".*calc.*backport" *         (04-06 23:06)
 * jdong wonders if that'll work
<jdong> #ubuntu-devel.2008-04-03.log.txt:04:46 < mantiena-baltix> calc: hi, are you online ? I'm backporting OpenOffice 2.4 to Ubuntu 7.10 (Gutsy), maybe you already did this job ?
<jdong> I can't believe it. It worked.
<jdong> screw you Tracker, grep still wins!
<xtknight> pschorf, yes ok i see the diff file
<pschorf> xtnight: i apt-get'd the source for the package, how would I patch it?
<xtknight> let's build the dependencies needed to compile it.  type "sudo apt-get build-dep anjuta"
<xtknight> sorry, install the dependencies.
<pschorf> right
<pschorf> this may take a minute, I'll let you know when finished
<xtknight> k
<xtknight> pschorf, did you plan on uploading an actual patch?  in this case i'm not sure it's possible.  first we'd have to confirm whether or not it exists in Hardy.  if not, it's a lot more difficult to make a patch
<pschorf> xtnight, i had hoped to
<pschorf> if i can't apply it, I might as well practice on it anyway
<xtknight> ya i just picked it because it looked simple
<xtknight> pschorf, do you want to try and confirm it now or just get down to the dirty work and make the patch anyway?
<xtknight> it looks like he reported it on Gutsy according to his crash dump
<pschorf> let's confirm it...if its not there i might do it anyway
<pschorf> how would we do that?
<xtknight> i would read his bug report, install anjuta, and follow the steps he provided and see if it crashes for you
<xtknight> if that bug is confusing to you (it's confusing to me, i can tell you that much) then we can simply try making the patch or pick another already confirmed bug.
<pschorf> i've never used anjuta...
<xtknight> same here
<pschorf> i don't even know how to start debugging in it
<xtknight> im' trying to find another bug that looks simple
<pschorf> k
<xtknight> pschorf, what i'm doing is going down the first column of http://daniel.holba.ch/really-fix-it/
<xtknight> we should find one that's confirmed for Hardy, at least ideally, and which already has a patch available.
<pschorf> ok
<pschorf> what about bug 43785
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 43785 in evolution "Purge-Dialog not translatable" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/43785
<xtknight> pschorf, can you confirm it/
<xtknight> i mean do you have a german build
<xtknight> or german setup rather
<pschorf> no
<xtknight> how about this one... Bug 204600
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 204600 in amule "[hardy] Fix Spanish translation of aMule" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/204600
<xtknight> it is confirmed for hardy
<xtknight> and it's a simple, hard to mess up fix
<xtknight> the spanish translation is already there it's just incorrect.
<pschorf> i can work with that
<xtknight> ok.  get the source and install the dependencies
<pschorf> ok
<pschorf> got it
<xtknight> save his patch to a folder
<xtknight> fixed_spanish_translation.diff
<pschorf> ok
<xtknight> have you ever patched the source before?
<xtknight> rather have you ever patched source code before
<xtknight> with the patch command
<pschorf> no
<xtknight> alright
<xtknight> cd into the amule directory
<pschorf> i am
<xtknight> ok.  many debian packages use something called a patch system, which means you will have to put the patch in a specific format for the package to understand and apply it
<pschorf> ok
<xtknight> personally, i don't know much about patch systems.  when i tried to use one i got very frustrated.  so i will teach you my way of doing it, if that's fine.
<xtknight> i will still comply with the patch system but i won't use the patch system program for now
<pschorf> ok
<xtknight> let's go into the debian/patches folder
<xtknight> you can see different diff files and a 'series' file which describes the different patches being applied
<xtknight> the series file is just a list of all the patches in that dir.
<pschorf> ok
<xtknight> today we're lucky.  he provided a simple patch and none of the other patches modify that same translation file
<xtknight> so we can just slip it in.
<pschorf> ok
<xtknight> basiaclly, copy the .diff file to the patches folder
<xtknight> and add the filename to the series file
<pschorf> what do I append after the file name?
<pschorf> -p0 or -p1?
<xtknight> ok.  inside the patch we see it modifies po/es.po, right?
<pschorf> right
<ScottK2> RAOF: You around?
<xtknight> basically -p1, -p2, -p3 etc are for when the patch has EXTRA folders in front of the name specified.
<RAOF> ScottK2: Yeah?
<xtknight> in this case, we have no extra folders.  note how po/es.po exists right from the root of our package folder (amule)
<pschorf> ok
<xtknight> so we can use -p0
<xtknight> meaning 'ignore 0 directories', or use all directories in the patch file
<pschorf> ok
<ScottK2> RAOF: I was looking at Bug #157969 and since specto is your baby, thought I'd check with you.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 157969 in specto "Specto - lacking dependencies in Kubuntu" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/157969
<xtknight> pschorf, ok your filename in series matches the diff you placed in the patches folder?
<pschorf> xtnight: yes, i kept the given name
<xtknight> (again please note it will not always be this easy, learning a patch system is probably necessary in the future.  )
<xtknight> ours uses quilt, which was very frustrating for me so i decided to do it this way.
<RAOF> ScottK2: Yeah, I've been meaning to get to that (and apply the same in Debian).
<xtknight> the patch system being used for a package can be determined by using the "what-patch" tool.
<ScottK2> RAOF: I'll leave it to you then.
<RAOF> You're welcome to take it if you like :)
<pschorf> ok, i checked it
<ScottK2> RAOF: OK.  I'll do it.  It shouldn't take long.
<xtknight> pschorf, luckily, quilt uses the same format as diff.  we don't have to add any quilt-specific code to the diff files
<xtknight> pschorf, alright the next step is to determine what else needs to be done to make your patch
<RAOF> ScottK2: Yeah.  The debdiff looks correct.
<pschorf> ok
<xtknight> pschorf, other things might include simply housekeeping that previous people didn't do
<xtknight> like something called a maintainer field
<xtknight> pschorf, it's going to be helpful to pull up the Hardy package page for amule.  packages.ubuntu.com/hardy/amule
<xtknight> http://packages.ubuntu.com/hardy/amule
<pschorf> got it
<xtknight> pschorf, click source package amule on the right
<xtknight> this will provide information more pertinent to our job
<pschorf> i'm there
<xtknight> pschorf, you first need to determine what section it is in.  that's in red at the top.  if it's not specified, it's main.  we can see however that amule is in universe
<pschorf> right
<xtknight> pschorf, if the Maintainer is NOT Ubuntu MOTU Developers, as it must always be for a universe package, then we need to fix it.
<xtknight> pschorf, when packages are first uploaded the universe, the maintainer is something@debian.org or someone else.  but the first patch always makes it Ubuntu MOTU
<xtknight> in this case, we are fine
<xtknight> but we still have something else to do to finish your patch
<pschorf> you're just looking at the field on the right?
<xtknight> ya
<pschorf> ok
<xtknight> by the way i'm still building this package on my machine
<xtknight> it seems to be quite a big one
<pschorf> ok
<xtknight> but that's ok
<xtknight> pschorf, go to the root directory of the package (amule-2.2...)
<pschorf> i have the source for 2.1.3
<xtknight> are you on Hardy?
<pschorf> no, i'm still on gutsy
<xtknight> oooh
<pschorf> do i need to upgrade?
<xtknight> well we need to stop futzing around and just make a patch then
<xtknight> hehe
<xtknight> it doesn't matter.
<pschorf> ok
<xtknight> pschorf, you know, actually, you could make a hardy pbuilder.  do you want to do that?
<xtknight> i guess this is as useful as anything
<xtknight> when it comes to making packages
<pschorf> yeah, it would be good experience
<xtknight> alright i'm following this
<xtknight> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto
<pschorf> would i use variant=hardy
<xtknight> well you know i'm not entirely sure.  maybe someone here can suggest.  i haven't really used pbuilder that much.
<xtknight> is it possible to create a hardy pbuilder on gutsy?
<ScottK2> Yes
<ScottK2> I use the pbuilder-dist script in ubuntu-dev-tools.  It's pretty easy with that.
<xtknight> pschorf, i'll tell you what.  i have a gutsy machine too, so i will see if we can make that patch for gutsy.  i wish i could help you with pbuilder but i've never really used it.
<pschorf> ok
<ScottK2> If you get the above script you do sh pbuilder-dist hardy create and you're done.
<xtknight> ah
<pschorf> ScottK2: i got an unknown distribution error
<xtknight> same here actually
<ScottK2> The gutsy version may have been somewhat broken.
<ScottK2> I use a somewhat customized version myself.
<xtknight> i think it needs a debootstrap script for hardy
<ScottK2> Grab the source package for ubuntu-dev-tools from hardy and just copy the script from the source package.  It doesn't need to be installed.
<ScottK2> RAOF: specto is done.
<xtknight> hmmm'
<pschorf> xtnight: could you find the script?
<RAOF> ScottK2: Thanks very much.
<xtknight> pschorf, no it looks like the hardy version doesnt even use scripts
<pschorf> hmm...
<xtknight> well i dont know about that.  you'll probably want hardy for developing anyway.
<xtknight> but i am downloading the package on gutsy now to see what we can do
<xtknight> let's just get a debdiff made for now even if it's not too useful
<xtknight> at least proof of concept
<pschorf> ok
<pschorf> i had just finished adding to the series file
<xtknight> yeah.  the problem is, the patch wont work since gutsy's file is different
<xtknight> also gutsy doesnt have the problem i checked
<pschorf> ok
<pschorf> will you be on this channel tomorrow?
<xtknight> yeah
<pschorf> i need to get to bed: i have a class at 9 AM tomorrow
<xtknight> i'm a little tired for tonight as well
<ScottK2> Bah.  Sleep is for the weak.
<pschorf> but i'll install hardy and hop back on in the evening
<xtknight> do you want to install hardy?
<xtknight> ok
<pschorf> yeah
<xtknight> good deal
<pschorf> night, all
<xtknight> i just realized how much my patching practices deviate from those suggested (use a patch system, use pbuilder, etc).  oh well :p
<ScottK2> xtknight: The suggested ones are all derived from painful experiences.  You can either learn from other's pain or wait until you experience your own.
<xtknight> well pbuilder doenst look too helpful to me.  although the patch systems are something i really need to learn
<xtknight> at least for just making patches.  but i'd definitely want to test new packages in a clean pbuilder environment, etc
<ScottK2> Yes.
<xtknight> i dont really see how it's different than a chroot
<ScottK2> It's a clean minimal set each time you run it.
<ScottK2> It's better for checking missed build-deps.
<xtknight> something that always puzzles me is how to apply a patch to a file when other patches in the folder modify the same file.  because then the offsets of the latest patch get all messed up, they expect an unpatched file
<xtknight> but i didn't see evidence of how quilt made this easier.  well at least not for patches that have already been made, which is often the case for me.  i usually just package other people's wrongly made patches :)
<ScottK2> For dpatch you can use dpatch-edit-patch or for cdbs cdbs-edit-patch to edit the patch in an environment where the other patches are already applied.
<xtknight> ahhh
<ScottK2> quit has an import feature, but I'm not much of a quilt user yet.
<RAOF> I've been playing with the X server, and that uses quilt; import seems fairly nice & easy.
<ScottK2> From what little I've used quilt, I think I would like it if I used it regularly.
<xtknight> so why are there different patch systems?  there seems to be absolutely no different between quilt and dpatch
<ScottK2> As it is, I have to look up the commands and wrap my head around quilt each time I try it.
<xtknight> kind of like mercurial,cvs,svn,git,mono, and all that i guess.  but even less significant
<ScottK2> xtknight: They are different, but the need for sustaining the difference is often argued in Debian.
<RAOF> xtknight: There's actually quite a difference between quilt and dpatch/cdbs-simple-patchsys.
<lifeless> loom FTW kthxbye thatisall
 * ScottK2 lets the quilt fanboy run with it.
 * RAOF wonders whether that's *him* being described as a quilt fanboy.
<ScottK2> Yes.
<xtknight> if i were to describe the difference to somebody i'd say with dpatch you just have to add that annoying @DPATCH@ thing
<ScottK2> It's all relative.
<xtknight> when you manually hack edit it like i do
<xtknight> :P
<RAOF> lifeless: Yeah, loom + no-more-source-packages :P
<ScottK2> xtknight: Learn to love dpatch-edit-patch.
 * RAOF certainly has.
<xtknight> keep in mind i used to make debs with checkinstall
<xtknight> and then decompile them with "ar x" and edit the status files and repackage them
<xtknight> i'm that lazy
<xtknight> just my own debs of course
<ScottK2> Yeah, well, learn to do it right and just do it that way.
<ScottK2> I do sometimes ar x .debs to inspect them.
<StevenK> I've done that. But only when the situation called for it.
<ScottK2> Heya StevenK
 * StevenK waves
<ScottK2> StevenK: You coming to UDS?
<RAOF> Heya StevenK.
<StevenK> ScottK2: And Fosscamp
<ScottK2> Cool.  See you there.
<StevenK> Way cool.
 * StevenK might smuggle RAOF in some luggage
<StevenK> "Just one bag, sir?" "Yup! Let me just ..... lift it up .... Ugh" *kick*
 * RAOF is pretty svelt.
<StevenK> Heh
<StevenK> ScottK2: You'll be there for the whole week this time? :-)
<jdong> https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/firefox-3.0
<jdong> am I seeing heptuples?
<jdong> or is it firefox (ironically) playing tricks with me?
<ScottK2> StevenK: Yes.  It'd be hard to justify a two day trip to Europe.
<StevenK> Just a bit.
<xtknight> jdong, i don't see anything that odd here what do you mean?
<jdong> xtknight: at least for me, there's 7 e-mail icons next to alexander's name and e-mail
<superm1> jdong, me too
<xtknight> hm i just get <email address hidden> :)
<xtknight> lol
<jdong> superm1: so I'm not crazy?
<jdong> xtknight: log in :D
<superm1> well you are
<superm1> but that's besides the point
<jdong> :P
<jdong> superm1: for that comment, please toss gtkpod-aac in your iTouch PPA
<superm1> on gutsy?
<xtknight> hahah
<ScottK2> jdong: One per time his name is mentioned in .changes
<jdong> superm1: yeah
<xtknight> there are 7 icons yeah
<superm1> jdong, you want to join the ipod-touch team?
<superm1> you can toss it then :)
<jdong> ScottK2: good observation
<ScottK2> jdong: If my opinions on Launchpad U/I were credible, I'd suspect that was a bug.
<jdong> lol
<jdong> ScottK2: or it's a hidden feature. Maybe candy comes out if you can build a pascal triangle out of a properly formatted changelog :D
<xtknight> lol
<ScottK2> No, I've been told I have to like the new U/I better for my opinion to be credible.
<jdong> superm1: that requires work on my part though!
<ScottK2> Be definition, apparently, any thought that LP developers aren't on the right track must be ignored.
<superm1> jdong, well just take some time away from backporting firefox 3 beta 15 when it comes around
<ScottK2> Be/By
<superm1> and you'll be able to :)
<jdong> ah bug 212618
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 212618 in launchpad "Extraneous "face" icons on changelog for emails" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/212618
<Hobbsee> ooh, new exaile.
<RAOF> Hobbsee: This is exciting because?  :P
<jdong> ooh, new *banshee*
<StevenK> Hobbsee: In the archive?
<RAOF> Which is exciting because of awesomeness, yess.
<jml> ScottK2: I personally don't ignore thoughts about us not being on the right track.
<jml> except insofar as I ignore many things by virtue of them not being shoved in front of me.
<ScottK> jml: I believe you, but that's pretty much a direct quote from a senior Launchpad developer.  I got the hint.
<ScottK> jml: No.  That's wrong.  The pretty much direct quote was that unless I gave up my opinion that the pre-beta U/I was better, my opinions on LP U/I wouldn't be credible.
<jml> ScottK: why do you think the old UI was better?
<ScottK> It was simpler, faster and less confusing.
<ScottK> I still click on the package name to open the section for assigning status/importance.
<ScottK> I still don't like the new fonts.
<ScottK> Some of the recent progess is just fixing bad changes.  Like I see that once again component has made it's way back onto the main package page.
<ScottK> That's welcome, but it's just unbreaking a recent change.
<ScottK> This is not to say there aren't improvements, there are.
<ScottK> It's just way to slow and way to confusing.
<jml> yeah, it's definitely too slow.
<jdong> the text interface that ubotu uses seems to respond instantly at times.
<jdong> is it really the AJAXy complexity of the launchpad UI making it slow?
<jml> there isn't all that much AJAX, afaik.
<ScottK> When LP bug pages load as fast as Debian BTS pages, then I think it's good.
<jml> the big thing for me and others is that https from .au to .uk is inevitably slow.
<jml> too many roundtrips.
<StevenK> And the Debian BTS isn't https://
<ScottK> From my perspective as a user, they why of the slowness is irrelevant.
<ScottK> StevenK: Poor design choices by LP doesn't get them out of being annoying for being slow.
<jml> ScottK: I can understand that.
<jml> ScottK: I was explaining to jdong, not providing an excuse.
<StevenK> ScottK: I seriously doubt https:// is a poor design choice.
<jml> ScottK: back to what you were saying earlier though
<ScottK> StevenK: It's a needed design choice for some things.  Using it for everything is overkill
<StevenK> Personally, I like it being used for everything.
<StevenK> But that's me.
<ScottK> StevenK: In general, I agree.  If it was fast enough with it, I'd be happy.
<jdong> well I don't care what it uses, all I care is of the 5 hours I spent triaging backports bugs, I can say about 50% of that time was waiting on launchpad to respond
<ScottK> Yep.
<jdong> it makes working with the BTS extremely frustrating
<ScottK> Also I think it's a sign of design failure when my primary method of navigating LP is typing urls.
<jml> definitely
<jml> ScottK: have you filed bugs about specific cases?
<ScottK> jml: Nope.
<ScottK> Don't intend to either.
<jml> ScottK: why not?
<ScottK> See the earlier discussion about my opinions not being credible.
<ScottK> Since then I've neither filed nor commented on any bugs in LP.
<ScottK> It's really up to Canonical to figure it out.
<jml> ScottK: I see.
<ScottK> If it were a community oriented project I'd see it differently.
 * ScottK needs to get to bed anyway.
<ScottK> jml: It was nice chatting with you.
<jml> ScottK: likewise. g'night.
<jdong> maybe if LP were scriptable, I would complain less....
<jdong> for example, for Backports I often have to mark a bug in progress then subscribe another team.
<jdong> the LP lag between those two operations often can take as long as reading the bug report in the first place
<ScottK> jdong: You can do that via the email interface.
<ScottK> Make yourself a template and then just fire away.
<jdong> ScottK: I may start doing that.
<ScottK> jdong: As an example of the fun you can have with the email interface, Bug #204895 was filed with one mail.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 204895 in harvestman "Packages failed archive rebuild test possibly due to python-central transition" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/204895
<jdong> ScottK: yeah I just need to get my GPG agent hooked into mutt... right now I don't have passphrase caching
<ScottK> Yeah.
<ScottK> Well.  Good night.  Really this time.
<jdong> night
<wor6c> i have a java app i want to package into a deb (not necessarily for release)
<wor6c> are there any docs for this?
<wor6c> the docs seem geared towards packaging from source (assuming ur using make and configure etc.)
<RAOF> wor6c: So you're not building from source? Urgh.
<wor6c> RAOF: would it matter? this is a Java program
<wor6c> RAOF: if you wanted to know i'm looking at Hadoop
<RAOF> wor6c: It matters just as much as any other type of program.  Pacakging the binary makes it really hard to fix stuff.
<wor6c> RAOF: ok, I can get the Java .java files (source)
<warp10> Good morning
<RAOF> warp10: Good afternooooooooon.
<warp10> hey RAOF! :)
<RAOF> wor6c: Which is good, if you can build it from them.
<wor6c> RAOF: right, the end-product is jar files
<RAOF> wor6c: But the general plan is pretty much the same - you install stuff in debian/binary-pkg-name/, and call the various debhelper goodies.
<wor6c> RAOF: oh ok
<wor6c> RAOF: i will attempt following a tutorial with debhelper's
<xtknight> NOTICE: 'vinagre' packaging is maintained in the 'Svn' version control system at:
<xtknight> so apt-get source vinagre doens't give be the right base?
<RAOF> xtknight: apt-get source will get the source package as it in in the repositories; since it's being maintained in svn there may be relevant changes in there that you won't get with apt-get source.
<xtknight> which is the version that i should be patching against?
<xtknight> for hardy universe
<xtknight> or hardy main
<RAOF> Probably the source package as retrieved by apt-get source.  SVN is more commonly used by Debian, so it's probably a debian upstream vcs.
<xtknight> also another question, how does Add/Remove Programs populate a list of applications?
<RAOF> For bonus points, you can create diffs against both, and submit the svn diff to Debaian.
<xtknight> trying to fix bug 213207
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 213207 in vinagre "Vinagre appears in Add/remove applications twice as "remote desktop viewer"" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/213207
<RAOF> I believe that add/remove does some funky desktop file scanning, but I'm not sure of the details.
<xtknight> if i wanted information on that do you have any idea where i'd turn?  there doen't happen to be a blueprint on it anywhere or something?  it seems like there's no real knowledgebase on where stuff is stored or anything
<xtknight> i mean of course i could just google till i got sick, but..
<RAOF> I think #ubuntu-devel should have more details.
<xtknight> :o
<xtknight> ah ok
<xtknight> there must be some cache somewhere too, because changing the name in one desktop file makes no difference.
<\sh> moins
<LaserJock> any U-U-S admin types up?
 * Hobbsee gave it away.  muhahahaha
<LaserJock> anybody know the status of the queue? like is the number of subscribed bugs really what needs to be processed?
<Hobbsee> the ones that affect ubuntu and that are open, yes.
<LaserJock> bummer :(
<LaserJock> I was hoping that a lot were taken care of but were still in the queue
<LaserJock> hmm, "I'm not attaching any files as the package is in my PPA" for a 0ubuntu1 doesn't sound like something we want to sponsor at the moment
<LaserJock> do we have any good way of saying "not for hardy" ?
<\sh> oh damn...
<\sh> we have to be careful with all the crap in this queue
<Hobbsee> unsub anything that isn't fit for sponsoring?
<\sh> bug #195933 e.g. whoever said, "don't patch inside diff.gz, use debian/patches, even if debian package doesn't use a patch system" needs to be crucified
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 195933 in subtitleeditor "Doesn't appear in Hardy's Applications menu" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/195933
<LaserJock> Hobbsee: but how do we get it back? should we just tell people to resub after Hardy is released?
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: will they be correct after hardy release?
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: otherwise, i'd say dump as low prio, or something.
<LaserJock> Hobbsee: well, I guess an unsub with at "We're unable to sponsor this for Hardy, once Intrepid is opened up feel free to resubmit and updated package?"
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: sounds reasonable
<LaserJock> k
<dholbach> good morning
<rzr> hi dholbach
<rzr> remember this bug ? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xnetcardconfig/+bug/181494
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 181494 in xnetcardconfig "Depends on obsolete xsu package" [Undecided,In progress]
<rzr> I made a new "upstream" release that fixes many other stuff
<rzr> http://bugs.debian.org/474036
<rzr> i plan to merge it back
<dholbach> hi rzr - did you get it into the  http://wiki.ubuntu.com/SponsorshipProcess ?
<rzr> not yet
<rzr> i wanted it to go in debian 1st since i need it at work
<rzr> well have to go
<rzr> later
<raphink> hi guys
<\sh> hey raphink :)
<raphink> hi \sh
<\sh> raphink, how's life? long time no see :)
<raphink> life's good, thanks God :)
<raphink> how are you doing?
<\sh> raphink, the flue got me
<raphink> ouch
<\sh> raphink, but it's ok...new job, new opportunities...and ubuntu rollout on the 22nd of april :)
<raphink> hehe
<raphink> \sh do you happen to be familiar with hushlogins ?
<\sh> raphink, nope...what is it? any pointer? :)
<raphink> when you touch ~/.hushlogin, the user will not get motd+lastlog at login
<raphink> this works
<raphink> but
<raphink> in login.defs, you can set HUSHLOGIN_FILE to something else, /etc/hushlogins by default
<raphink> in order to control this functionnality systemwide
<raphink> in that case, you put either user names of shell names in /etc/hushlogins
<raphink> and it's supposed to deactivate the chatter at login for these users/shells
<raphink> but it doesn't work in etch or gutsy
<\sh> but hardy works?
<raphink> no idea
<raphink> I don' thave a hardy machine here
<raphink> I would like to use this feature because I use a special shell to wrap ssh and redirect some users to another machine silently
<\sh> raphink, looks like...I just tested it on my home machine
<raphink> but I don't want them to have the first motd
<raphink> \sh did you test with /etc/hushlogins or with ~/.hushlogin ?
<\sh> raphink, touch .hushlogin
<raphink> yes, that always works
<raphink> but /etc/hushlogins doesn't work
<\sh> raphink, I tried to test it with /bin/bash -> doesn't work...or my username, doesn't work
<raphink> yes
<raphink> so it seems it's broken
<\sh> oh wairt
<\sh> in /etc/login.defs /etc/hushlogins is not enabled by default it seems
<raphink> no, indeed, you have to activate it
<raphink> and restart ssh
<raphink> I did that, and it didn't work
<raphink> http://sudan.ubuntuforums.com/showthread.php?t=10084 seems to indicate that it worked in october 2004
<raphink> sorry in jan 2005
<\sh> same here
<raphink> I can't find a bug reprot about it
<\sh> hmm...much more problems.../etc/init.d/ssh restart doesn't work
<\sh> it checks first the port...and then it fails because something is already listening on port 22...which is correct..but shouldn't fail and it should be restarted..
<jimiridge> netstat -anp |grep 22
<raphink> ah
<\sh> jimiridge, it's normal behaviour when something is already listening..the problem with it: it should kick all sshd and restart the father process
<jimiridge> why is making a package so darn involving
<raphink> involving?
<jimiridge> checkinstall never works right, dh_make  doesnt work for me...
<jimiridge> like i'm using aircrack svn as a testbed
<raphink> dh_make doesn' twork? how so?
<jimiridge> i dunno i'll fix it
<jimiridge> im just saying find the pid thats taking port 22 and do a  "kill pid & /etc/init.d/ssh restart"
<jimiridge> hoping it will restart before you get dropped
<slytherin> jimiridge: Please use nicknames to address the person. Otherwise it is difficult to carry a meaningful conversation
<\sh> raphink, #ubuntu-devel
<jimiridge> slytherin, ok
<huats> morning all
<doko> pochu: afaik, no
<stani> ScottK: The latest phatch bug #210602 is fixed. I've requested the latest translations and will release Phatch 0.1.3 so it can be uploaded to Debian and Hardy.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 210602 in phatch "run in bash ends in an error" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/210602
<fbond> Is usbfs now on /dev/bus/usb, rather than /proc/bus/usb ?
<broonie> fbond: No but the information that used to be exported via /proc/bus/usb is now there.
<ScottK> stani: OK.  pochu and I know when it's released.
<Iulian> Heya
<pochu> ScottK: I don't... I need to add uscan to cron...
<zul> morning
<ScottK> pochu and stani: ... let ...  - Missed an important word there.
<ScottK> morning zul.
<ScottK> Lovely.
<ScottK> Clamav is planning a major release on the 14th.
<StevenK> Fun
<achadwick> I'd like to do something in my package's postinst that shouldn't happen as root. Is there a standard user I should run this as? nobody? (assuming I chown the files that get created as a result afterwards)
<ScottK> StevenK: First two letters are right.
<ScottK> Soname bump too.
<ScottK> Of course soname bump makes it easy to say no.
<Iulian> Fujitsu: ping - do you have one minute for a /query?
<mok0> ScottK: AFAICS python-scipy still depends on atlas3-base
<mok0> no sorry, my bad
<mok0> I was looking at an older version
<ScottK> jdong: Ping.
<Fujitsu> Iulian: Sure.
<ScottK> pochu: Are you up for doing phatch again?
<stani> ScottK: I am back here (was on my hardy box busy releasing Phatch).
<stani> ScottK: what you mean with "... let ..."
<ScottK> I still can't type.
<ScottK> stani: I meant to say let us know, which you have now done.
<stani> ok
<pochu> ScottK: I think so, looking
<ScottK> pochu: Great.  Once against I'd suggest uploading straight to Ubuntu for now.
<pochu> sure, I'll update python-apps and upload to ubuntu too
<stani> pochu: thanks
<ScottK> Great.
<Hobbsee> ScottK: so, how good is clamav
<Hobbsee> ScottK: ah yes, it found it.  good.
<ScottK> Hobbsee: Well, I asked if there was going to be another RC before the final release.  They said no.  No one tests the RC's anyway so we may as well release.
<ScottK> I'm pretty sure we don't want it.
<Hobbsee> heh
<ScottK> That and the soname bump.
 * Hobbsee was pleased to see it suceeded with a fairly new virus.
<ScottK> I'm planning to talk to jdong about getting hardy-backports ready early with the idea that we might have clamav and redepends in backport at or near release.
<stani> ScottK and pochu: Good news: I got an invitation from the libre graphics conference to give a talk about Phatch. (I hope to do it, but I have to be able to free my agenda for it. So it is not sure.)
<ScottK> stani: Congratulations.
<pochu> stani: wow, that sounds cool!
<stani> stani: It would be nice to meet up with the gimp, inkscape, ... developers.
<slytherin> ScottK: Just FYI ... I created a patch from the revision 259 for screenlets yesterday but was too tired to test it. Will do it today probably
<ScottK> slytherin: Great.
<Hobbsee> ScottK: any idea on where to start for informatoin on pulling viruses apart?
<ScottK> Hobbsee: No.  Not really.
<pochu> stani: there's no changelog in phatch, is there?
<ScottK> clamav is a magic scary black box to me.
<Hobbsee> ScottK: pity.
<ScottK> Sorry I can't help.
<Kamping_Kaiser> hi all. i have a bug open against sugar in ubuntu (cant login). is there a 'best way' to get it either fixed or removed? it seems like a pretty awquard thing to do - include it but have it unusable
<Hobbsee> np
<stani> pochu: no, not really, however there is one on the internet http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=466598 ;-)
<slytherin> Hobbsee: what kind of information do you need about anti-virus? I don't claim to be expert so I will try to answer.
<Hobbsee> slytherin: just wanted to know how to decompress it, so i can view what was inside the .exe
<Kamping_Kaiser> night all. might ask again tomorrow :)
<slytherin> Hobbsee: oh, so you have a sample virus?
<Hobbsee> slytherin: yeah.  few 'doze idiots got infected with it, and tried to send it to me.
<slytherin> Hobbsee: clamav should help you scan a particular file. But I am not sure if you can dissect a virus on your own.
<Hobbsee> slytherin: hmmm
<pochu> stani: I'm a bit unsure about this... are they bug fixes? http://pastebin.com/f7853416a
<Hobbsee> slytherin: yeah, scan came back with virus found.
<pochu> stani: I haven't looked at the real diff yet, will do so after having lunch
<Hobbsee> slytherin: (Trojan.IRCBot-1981)
<slytherin> Hobbsee: and if you are planning to install an AV on their machines then clamav or avg are good and free options.
<Hobbsee> slytherin: i don't control their machines.  They're friends.
<ScottK> superm1: Would you be able to look into what to do about https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel-discuss/2008-April/003806.html - you touched the package last.
 * Hobbsee just wanted to know more about what was in it.
<slytherin> Hobbsee: but you can always suggest then a good AV, can't you?
<Kamping_Kaiser> by the time someones sending virus's you tell them they better have backups ...
<Hobbsee> slytherin: actually,  i was going to yell at them about not clicking on links in msn that are clearly bad first, but....
<slytherin> Hobbsee: you know what is best way to spread linux in general. Stop responding to windows troubleshooting questions. :-P
<Hobbsee> i wasn't even speaking to either of them!  :P
<ScottK> I have recently been known to honestly say, "It's been so long since I used Windows, I don't remember how to do that."
<ScottK> Of course at my age that might be just a few weeks.
<slytherin> ScottK: True for me too, the first sentence not the age one. :-)
<megabyte405> hey folks - wondering if there's a variable substitution I can use to get the version of the original (upstream) package in my rules file
<TheMuso> megabyte405: You could get it from the changelog.
<TheMuso> megabyte405: as in debian/changelog.
<ScottK> With awk and sed or some such.
<TheMuso> In fcat, I've seen several packages do that.
<TheMuso> in fact
<megabyte405> oh boy, that sounds like a little hack.  I'll put that enhancement on the bug list then
<megabyte405> dholbach: I'm packaging AbiWord for sponsorship to main.  There is a compile-time dependency on libasio-dev, which is a collection of headers, currently in universe.  This is not a run-time dep.  Is this OK?
<Fujitsu> You'd have to get it promoted.
<megabyte405> even just for compile time?  What sort of process is there to do that?
<Fujitsu> Even for compiletime.
<megabyte405> ok
<slytherin> megabyte405: say !mir
<dholbach> megabyte405: let's discuss on #ubuntu-devel
<Fujitsu> It will require a MainInclusionReport, I presume. I've never done it myself, so am not sure of the details.
<megabyte405> !mir
<ubotu> mir is Main Inclusion Report - see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MainInclusionProcess for more information.
<stani> pochu: That is updated artwork. If you look at it, you see the icon is updated.
<stani> pochu: I have to switch computer (I will dissappear and come back).
<stani> pochu: I am back
<pochu> stani: I see
<stani> pochu: is updating artwork a problem?
<stani> my icon designer did his best and would have like it included.
<stani> pochu: it can not introduce any bug, it is outside programming logic just as translations
<emgent> heya
<pochu> stani: no, don't think so as phatch isn't in main and it's not documented in the Ubuntu documentation
<pochu> ScottK: ^-- does UI Freeze apply here?
<stani> pochu: scale.py had wrong credits for the icon
<ScottK> Hmm.
<ScottK> Not sure.  It's changing the icon?
<ScottK> pochu: ^^^
<pochu> ScottK: yes
<stani> ScottK: it changes some icons in http://photobatch.wikidot.com/local--files/getting-started/actions-scale.png
<stani> it does not change the main Phatch icon
<ScottK2> Hobbsee: It seems this is harmless.  What's the rule on this ^^^?
<Hobbsee> ui freeze?  unsure
<ScottK2> It seems totally unlikely to actually be a problem.  I'm not sure if there is some paperwork required though.
<ScottK2> slangasek: Are we violating any U/I freeze if we change the icon in a Universe package at this point?  ^^^
<stani> If I read https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UserInterfaceFreeze, I don't see that any of the points apply to Phatch (not installed by default, no desktop, no distribution specific, no user-visible string).
<ScottK2> I agree in principle, but want to make sure.
<ScottK2> pochu: I'd say go for it.
<sebner> heya afflux ;)
<afflux> hey sebner
<stani> ScottK: thanks
<afflux> I just opened bug 213385, which actually is a request for sponsoring multiple bugfixes for screenlets. Feel free to contact me if something is wrong or could be done better :)
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 213385 in screenlets "candidate for version 0.0.12-0ubuntu4" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/213385
<ScottK2> afflux: I think slytherin was also looking at that.  I'd suggest you coordinate on a common upload so things don't get cross threaded.
<afflux> huh, really? I subscribed the bugmail for screenlets and didn't notice anyone working on this
<afflux> *this package
<ScottK2> He mentioned it on IRC.
<ScottK2> afflux: From ~3 hourse ago:
<ScottK2> [08:46] <slytherin> ScottK: Just FYI ... I created a patch from the revision 259 for screenlets yesterday but was too tired to test it. Will do it today probably
<afflux> argh
<afflux> assigned all bugs that were fixed with 259 to me yesterday night :(
<afflux> okay
<afflux> do you think it's okay to subscribe him and ask for his input/opinion? I had a talk with the upstream dev about some changes and we coordinated better fixes for some issues.
<ScottK2> Thus I suggest some coordination.  I haven't seen a diff from him.
<ScottK2> Yes.
<ScottK2> slytherin: ^^^^
<afflux> okay, thank you!
<pochu> ScottK2, stani: uploading
<stani> pochu:great
<ploum> Hello
<ploum> could some MOTU check bug #201509 ?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 201509 in gweled "Get rid of .gweled file and follow fd.o specifications" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/201509
<ploum> thanks
<ScottK> ploum: I'd be a lot more comfortable with something like that if you didn't abandon old user preferences, but the bigger issue is how do you handle this for multi-user systems?  AFAIK your patch will only change things for the user doing the upgrade.
<ScottK> Skip that last bit.
<ploum> yep, it would be handled by gweled itself
<ScottK> Abandoning the old user preferences is not a good thing.
<ploum> Indeed but there's only one thing in it, AFAIK ;:
<ScottK> OK.  If you think it's OK to abandon them, you ought to make some case for it in the bug.
<ploum> the size of the board
<ploum> so, the only thing that will happen is that some user will see the size of the board resetted to "medium" instead of large and small
<ploum> I think adding backward compatibility code for such a little thing is too much overhead
<ScottK> As I said, explain it in the bug.
<ploum> Maybe a warning could be added to the release not
<ploum> Ok
<ploum> I do that now
<ploum> ScottK : done
<ploum> I've checked the source to be sure
<ScottK> OK.
 * ScottK doesn't know much about Gnome, so is not going to decide, but that should improve your chances.
<ploum> It's not gnome related
<ploum> (but the game uses Gtk)
<RainCT> ploum: fine then :)
<ScottK> ploum: Close enough for me to ignore it.
 * RainCT thought it saved more than one preference :P
<ploum> RainCT: in fact two : there was also the game type
<ploum> three boolean :
<ploum> width, height, gametype
<ploum> three int
<ploum> I added a boolean : music on/off
<norsetto> huats: there he is ... finished messing with main!?
<huats> :)
<slytherin> afflux: if you have already finished the necessary work then please go ahead. I haven't done any testing and not sure if will do it tonight.
<ScottK> Heya norsetto.
<RainCT> ploum: I'll have a look (and hopefully upload) it later today ;)
<norsetto> heya scottk
<ploum> RainCT: thanks :-)
<afflux> gah, I'm too slow.
<ScottK> afflux: Is your screenlets update ready for upload (i.e. you've tested it)?
<sebner> norsetto: huhu :D :D :D
<afflux> ScottK: It builds and installs fine, all the feates I'm able to test are working. There've been some crashes I've not been able to trigger, but the fixes look sane and pycentral doesn't complain when compiling the files.
<ScottK> afflux: Are you subscribed for screenlets bugs?
<afflux> yes
<norsetto> sebner: huhu to you too (wasn't that a norwegian band from the 80s ....)
<ScottK2> OK.
<warp10> hey norsetto!
<ScottK2> afflux: I'll have a look at it and upload if I can't find anything serious to complain about.
<afflux> many thanks. So no need to resubscribe u-u-s?
<norsetto> warp10: Hola master ;-)
<sebner> norsetto: dunno. I pushed the debdiff to kapil. he seems to be happy with it. As soon as why has an upstream ACK I'll upload it and you can check it :)
<sebner> *we
<norsetto> sebner: okki dokki
<sebner> fine
<ScottK> afflux: No.  Looking at it now.
<ScottK> afflux: Is it correct that screenlets b-d on itself?
<afflux> huh, didn't notice that one
<afflux> had no changes on the control file so didn't touch it
<ScottK> That's what's there.  I'd appreciate if you'd check that's actually needed.
<afflux> is checking if it builds and in installs enough?
<ScottK> I'd think so.
 * norsetto -> afk
<ScottK> afflux: Build fails without it.
<ScottK> afflux: You might mention to upstream that needing itself to build is somewhat evil.
<afflux> indeed
<ScottK> afflux: Uploaded.  Thank you for your contribution to Ubuntu.
<afflux> thank you.
<macogw> does featurefreeze mean it's too late to get upstream gsynaptics synced?
<macogw> it does speed & accel now. the one in universe doesn't.
<pochu>  boson      - core package for Boson
<pochu>  boson-dbg  - debugging symbols for boson
<pochu> yay nice descriptions!
<sebner> pochu: boson? yes? my merge?
<ScottK> macogw: It means it needs an exception.  May or may not be given.
<ScottK> macogw: wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess
 * norsetto <- afk
<RainCT> pochu: lol
<RainCT> sebner: you can file a bug about that too (in Debian) :)
<pochu> sebner: yes, but not your fault ;)
<sebner> RainCT: that's on my list ;)
<sebner> RainCT: first I'm waiting if it builds ^^
<sebner> pochu: ok then ^^
<slangasek> ScottK: the UIFreeze is so that documentation folks don't get their documentation out-of-date without them being aware of it; the chances of them being affected by Phatch are exceedingly small, so use your best judgement - though in any case, the answer should be an "ok to upload", just depends whether ubuntu-docs needs notified
<ScottK> slangasek: Thanks.
<macogw> ScottK: ok
<macogw> thanks
 * norsetto goes to test the nth rt2x00 driver
<Tonio_> I have a little question, now we are in feature freeze, can a NEW package go in ?
<Tonio_> non exisiting package I mean
<sebner> Tonio_: not likely
<sebner> Tonio_: is it *super* urgent and *important*? If no then no
<pochu> not, unless there's a very very good reason for it
<pochu> FinalFreeze is this Thursday
<Tonio_> to make it simple, my company and canonical are going partners and packaging of our opensource groupware was discussed
<Tonio_> it'as just been finished
<Tonio_> I think that can be considered a good reason ;)
<Tonio_> am I wrong ?
<ScottK> Tonio_: I think that might be reasonable.
<Tonio_> okay, so I'll have to write an exception, and eventually ping Daniel, since this is a specific context
<ScottK> slangasek: ^^^ ? Do you think someone would have time for New processing?
<ScottK> Let's get a first order answer from the RM first.
<slangasek> ScottK: sourceful NEW?
<ScottK> Yes
<slangasek> better than 0 chance, but I don't know that it's much better
<ScottK> slangasek: ^^
<ScottK> OK.
<LaserJock> Tonio_: do you have a Canonical rep for it that you could ask?
<Tonio_> LaserJock: "rep" ?
<LaserJock> contact or representitive
<ScottK> Tonio_: What do you think of an early upload to Intrepid and a quick backport?
<Tonio_> ScottK: well, politically, I think getting it in the repos would be prefered :)
<LaserJock> I did one of those to dapper-updates, but it was a pain afterwards, I wouldn't recommend going that route
<ScottK> Tonio_: OK.  Then file your FFe.
<Tonio_> ScottK: sure
<xtknight> what's the easiest way to find an old version of a package in the debian (unstable) system.  what i'm trying to do is help backport a patch from debian but i need to know what code changed in the debian version first.
<leonel> xtknight: the oldest version wil be on debian stable
<leonel> xtknight: or in debian oldstable
<xtknight> leonel, oh i mean like revisions.  for instance, wine 0.9.58.dsc vs the 0.98.58-1.dsc on unstable now
<LaserJock> well, you probably need snapshot.debian.net
<ScottK> xtknight: Keep in mind our wine package does not come from Debian's.
<xtknight> yeah i saw a wine bug that applied to ubuntu as well here: http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/bugs/rcbugs/
<zasf> hi all
<zasf> I need a little help on packaging
<zasf> I want to test newest gnome-applets
<zasf> so I downloaded it from svn
<zasf> I did a svn export and tarred it so that it is named gnome-applets_2.23.0.orig.tar.gz
<zasf> is there a particular tar command I have to use?
<zasf> when doing 'debuild -S -sa'
<ScottK> xtknight: I'd suggest talking about it with YokoZar.
<zasf> it gives
<zasf> gzip: stdin: not in gzip format
<zasf> dpkg-source: failure: gzip gave error exit status 1
<zasf> debuild: fatal error at line 1247:
<xtknight> ScottK, ok
<ScottK> He generally tracks the Debian package pretty closely even though he doesn't use it.
<xtknight> apparently wine doesn't use a patching system so the fix kind of got lumped in with everything else, 400000 lines of changes from the original
<xtknight> either that or i dont know what "diff splash" is, there's no patches folder
<james_w> zasf: tar xzf should be sufficient.
<zasf> james_w: tar czf did it, thanks
<james_w> zasf: ah, c, sorry.
<zasf> hehe :)
<pschorf> xtnight: I've got hardy installed, if you'd like to look at that patch again
<xtknight> i'm a little confused.  the original version of a package as uploaded to debian still has a .diff.gz right?  then how do i find the original .diff.gz?  i want to find what changed between the original DEBIAN version and -1
<xtknight> pschorf, ah cool. sure
<xtknight> pschorf,  bug 204600
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 204600 in amule "[hardy] Fix Spanish translation of aMule" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/204600
<pschorf> alright
<pschorf> i've still got the source
<pschorf> wait...i had an old version
<xtknight> you did "apt-get source" again for hardy though right?
<pschorf> i'll update
<xtknight> delete all traces of old source
<xtknight> at this moment it wont do us any good
<james_w> xtknight: http://snapshot.debian.net/cgi-bin/packages.cgi
<james_w> ah, sorry, type "wine" in the top search box, and then click "details" next to the wine package.
<xtknight> james_w, yeah i didn't see the original dsc
<xtknight> or is -1 the first one
<xtknight> i'm confused
<james_w> yeah, -1 is the first upload of a new upstream version.
<pschorf> xtnight: i have the new source and ran build-dep
<xtknight> so some guy just slipped in a patch with the original version?
<xtknight> argh
<xtknight> that's going to be impossible to find :p
<xtknight> pschorf, ok
<james_w> xtknight: this is an upstream patch, or a patch added by Debian?
<xtknight> james_w, not sure.  it's this http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=472650
<ubotu> Debian bug 472650 in wine "FTBFS on amd64 (missing stamp)" [Serious,Fixed]
<xtknight> which was on here.  it said ubuntu needed the patch.  http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/bugs/rcbugs/
<xtknight> the ubuntu version is 0.9.58-0ubuntu2
<xtknight> so i thought -1 was newer or something
<james_w> xtknight: ah, that doesn't know whether the bug actually affects Ubuntu
<xtknight> oh
<james_w> yes, -1 is newer.
<xtknight> -0 is the first on ubuntu?
<james_w> it's just saying that there is a bug fixed in the newer Debian version, and Ubuntu doesn't have that version.
<xtknight> pschorf, alright copy the patch to deiban/patches as we did before
<james_w> if Ubuntu uploads a new upstream before Debian it is given a -0ubuntu1 version number, so that it uses the new upstream version, but is still lower than Debian so that all the tools still work the same way.
<pschorf> xtnight, ok
<xtknight> ah
<james_w> as ScottK the Ubuntu wine package isn't based on the Debian one, so it's very unlikely that bug actually affects Ubuntu.
<xtknight> i see
<ScottK> xtknight: Since the bug was it wouldn't build on 64 bit systems, it's a safe bet if ours built on amd64, we don't have the bug.
<xtknight> yeah
<xtknight> i was wondering that
<james_w> if you wanted to find what he did though you could grab that -1 and the previous version, and then debdiff them, and use filterdiff (or just your eyes) to find the changes to debian/rules.
<xtknight> i just built it on my amd64
<xtknight> so confirmed not an issue
<ScottK> xtknight: Please leave a comment to that effect on the RC bugs page.
<xtknight> k
<pschorf> xtnight, i've edited the series file the same way we went through yesterday
<xtknight> pschorf, ok
<xtknight> pschorf, you gave the patch an appropriate name?
<xtknight> pschorf, i think the original name is good
<pschorf> i kept it as fixed_spanish_translation
<xtknight> fixed_spanish_translation.diff
<pschorf> right
<xtknight> pschorf, alright.  so we determined yesterday this was a package in Universe, but the Maintainer field was set fine
<pschorf> right
<xtknight> pschorf, the next thing we need to do is add your changes to a log
<xtknight> pschorf, go back to the amule root dir
<xtknight> pschorf, and type "dch -i"
<pschorf> ok
<pschorf> i have the changelog open
<xtknight> pschorf, so, it creates a new changelog entry for you.  at the top you can see your new revision is named -0ubuntu4
<xtknight> dch -i does the versioning for you
<pschorf> ok
<xtknight> pschorf, you should come up with a name <email>
<xtknight> the same one in your GPG key, if you have one
<pschorf> my version is 2.2.0~svn20080218
<pschorf> is that correct?
<xtknight> amule (2.2.0~svn20080218-0ubuntu4) hardy; urgency=low
<xtknight> it should be this complete thing
<pschorf> right
<xtknight> k
<xtknight> the current in hardy is 0ubuntu3 therefore you new revis 4
<xtknight> do you have a GPG key?
<pschorf> my email is incorrect, though: paul@remium12.geo.yahoo9.akadns.net
<pschorf> yes, the email on my key is pschorf2@uiuc.edu
<xtknight> gpg --list-keys
<xtknight> and match your name and email and enter it in the changelog
<pschorf> how do I change the one in the changelog?
<xtknight> you are in an editor (dch -i) right now
<pschorf> ah, it was vi
<pschorf> took me a second
<xtknight> nano for me
<xtknight> hmm
<pschorf> ok, i fixed the email
<xtknight> there's an automated way to have your name<email> put there properly every time i just cant remember
<pschorf> i think my EDITOR variable points to vim
<pschorf> i just save the changelog now?
<xtknight> did you add a description of your changes?
<xtknight> let's credit the original poster of the patch, and reference the LaunchPad(LP) bug for it
<pschorf> no...does that go where they currently have an asterisk?
<pschorf> ok
<xtknight> yes
<xtknight> by the way the maximum line length is 80 lines
<Daviey> $ which editor
<Daviey> /usr/bin/vim_sux
<xtknight> err 80 chars
<pschorf> haha
<pschorf> i assumed that was what you meant
<pschorf> Fixes bug #204600 in LP, fix posted by Festor Wailon Dacoba
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 204600 in amule "[hardy] Fix Spanish translation of aMule" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/204600
<pschorf> is that decent?
<xtknight> say something like "Fix Spanish translation bug, original patch from Festor Wailon Dacoba. (LP: #204600)"
<xtknight> you want a concise description of what is affected, the original author of the patch, and then "(LP: #xxxxxx)"
<pschorf> ok
<pschorf> now I save?
<xtknight> ya
<xtknight> ctrl+O
<xtknight> or w/e
<pschorf> ok
<xtknight> if you're using vi it's ESC :wq
<pschorf> right
<pschorf> or :x
<xtknight> ok
<xtknight> so as long as that line didnt exceed 80 chars
<xtknight> it looks like we're about done
<xtknight> with that, at laest
<pschorf> alright, what's next?
<xtknight> pschorf, now we can test your package
<xtknight> basically "fakeroot debuild -S" to build and sign with your GPG key your changes and build packages for you to test
<ScottK> Glad sabdfl posted to planet so we know he likes Ubuntu.
<ScottK> </sarcasm>
<pschorf> that was successful
<xtknight> oh already?
<xtknight> it took me like 30 mins to compile that :p
<nixternal> ScottK: gahahahahhahahaha, I just spit coffee you ass :)
<ScottK> Excellent
<emgent> heya people
<pschorf> xtnight, it only took a minute or so...is it possible something went wrong?
<xtknight> pschorf, one moment let me try what i told you
<xtknight> oh ditch the fakeroot
<xtknight> it didnt work for me at least
<pschorf> i had to sudo
<xtknight> hmm ok
<xtknight> yeah
<pschorf> but i have -0ubuntu4.dsc and .diff files now
<xtknight> duhh i told you the wrong thing
<xtknight>  -S makes only a signed changes files
<pschorf> do i need to pass another option?
<xtknight> well i've run into this before.  unfortunately i'm not really sure how to get it back to the original state.  what we should have run is "sudo debuild"
<ScottK2> debuild -S will sign both .dsc and .changes
<ScottK2> No.
<ScottK2> Just debuild -S should be sufficient
<xtknight> we want binary pkgs to test
<ScottK2> Ah.
<ScottK2> Then no -S
<xtknight> but -S seems to have destroyed something
<xtknight> because now "sudo debuild" wont work
<ScottK2> Shouldn't have.
<xtknight> ive had this happen twice
<pschorf> mine seems to be building
<ScottK2> Try dpkg-buildpackage -(I can't remember which option) fakeroot
<pschorf> its checking the environment
<xtknight> Patch fixed_spanish_translation does not exist
<xtknight> ...
<xtknight> make: *** [debian/stamp-patched] Error 1
<xtknight> hmm
<xtknight> well it's in debian/patches/
<xtknight> and it built before.  so not sure what's going on
<pschorf> i think mine's ok...i'm getting all of that terminal garbage i associate with building
<xtknight> ok
<xtknight> yeah i've probably messed so much up on my system :)
<pschorf> haha
<pschorf> i know the feeling
<ScottK2> xtknight: debuild doesn't necessarily leave you with a clean build tree after a binary build.
<pschorf> you said this took a half hour or so?
<xtknight> ScottK2, i tried sudo debian/rules clean
<ScottK2> Only if the clean rule is right.
<xtknight> ahhh
<ScottK2> If the clean rule was buggy during the build, it won't have gotten better
<xtknight> does that mean i need to add something to clean if i add a patch?
 * ScottK2 hands xtknight a pbuilder
<xtknight> pschorf, ya i think so
<xtknight> yeah i was about to mention that
<xtknight> why dont we try that next :p
<ScottK2> Didn't we discuss the merits of building in a clean chroot yesterday?
<pschorf> xtnight, i'm going to sign off and let it run while I walk to the CS building here on campus
<xtknight> pschorf, ok
<xtknight> ScottK2, hmm vaguely
<pschorf> be back around 2
<ScottK2> In any case what you've got now is useful for figuring out what's missing out of clean and fixing that while you're at it.
<ScottK2> You should be able to build twice in a row.
<ScottK2> If it doesn't, it's a bug in the package.
<LaserJock> who wants to run some Hug Days? :-)
<xtknight> weird.  pdebuild fialed.  can anyone tell me what the problem is? http://rafb.net/p/f9CTEK27.html
<xtknight> besides coudlnt satisfy build deps but that seems odd since i can build it on my real machine
<afflux> are packaged translations translating a string which is not translated (ie. gettext is not used for it) evil?
<afflux> err, never mind...
<Syntux> Good evening
<mohi> hi :)
<mohi> how can I add a deb pakage to my PPA in launchpad?
<xtknight> mohi, follow ppa quickstart https://help.launchpad.net/PPAQuickStart
<pschorf> xtnight, the build finished
<xtknight> pschorf, ok
<ScottK> mohi: PPA support is in #launchpad.  It's nothing to do with Ubuntu.
<pschorf> do I need to send my public key to a keyserver?
<xtknight> pschorf, for ppa? yes
<xtknight> otherwise not for what we're doing right now
<xtknight> pschorf, let's test your package
<pschorf> ok
<xtknight> well this is a little more difficult since it's a spanish translation but uhh..to be honest with you, i dont think it really needs "testing" in that way since you just changed a text file.  i dont see a potential for failure there.  but we should verify that the file was changed.
<james_w> xtknight: if you are build-depending on a virtual package then I think you need to make it "real_package | virtual_package"
<xtknight> james_w, hmm all i'm trying to do is pdebuild basically
<xtknight> pschorf, so this build will have made a dsc file and changes
<xtknight> pschorf, type "cd .." to see
<xtknight> pschorf, your new revision is labeled ubuntu4
<pschorf> right
<xtknight> pschorf, let's make a diff
<xtknight> between ubuntu3 and ubuntu4
<xtknight> the format is, "debdiff oldfile newfile > patchfile.diff"
<xtknight> we will use the .dsc files for this
<pschorf> ok
<pschorf> what would specifically?
<xtknight> pschorf, debdiff amule_2.2.0~svn20080218-0ubuntu3.dsc amule_2.2.0~svn20080218-0ubuntu4.dsc > amule_2.2.0~svn20080218-0ubuntu4.debdiff
<xtknight> pschorf, pastebin the contents of the resulting debdiff file so i can see http://rafb.net/paste/
<pschorf> http://rafb.net/p/dXfc4766.html
<xtknight> looks good to me.  i'd put (LP: #204600) on one line but that's minor
<pschorf> i'll keep that in mind
<xtknight> i wish i could tell you how to change it without recompiling the whole thing
<xtknight> i'm sure someone else here knows though
<xtknight> but anyway good job you basically made your first patch
<xtknight> if the repo managers see that as a problem then they'd tell you.  i doubt it's a problem for now
<pschorf> ok
<xtknight> i've seen far worse ;)
<pschorf> do I actually upload this, or is it a sort of proof of concept
<xtknight> we can actually upload this
<xtknight> first let's test and see if the file contains the changes we expect
<xtknight> install your debs
<pschorf> would I use the _all or the _i386 deb
<xtknight> btw i think you would do "dch -e" to edit changelog and fix it, then debuild again
<xtknight> sinec mine's screwed up i dunno
<xtknight> umm what is the full name of both files?
<xtknight> did it generate two?
<pschorf> amule-common_2.2.0~svn20080218-0ubuntu4_all.deb
<xtknight> the package "amule" is a source package, from which many binary packages may be derived
<greg-g> slangasek: question regarding bug 212017
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 212017 in evince "Evince/CUPS Could Not Print Tax Document" [Medium,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/212017
<xtknight> so yea we got amule-common which is architecture indepednent
<pschorf> there's a daemon package and to util packages also
<slangasek> greg-g: hi
<greg-g> slangasek: I changed the description to be closer to the ligature issue, not the printing issue, shall I change it back?
<xtknight> pschorf, well you need to install all the pkgs
<xtknight> pschorf, sudo dpkg -i *.deb
<slangasek> greg-g: well, let's see what cmnorton has to say - if his printing issue is only with this one form, and he's not personally interested in it but was just following up on a forum thread, it may be that it's best to use this bug to track the ligature issue
<greg-g> slangasek: good point.  I however was able to confirm the non-printing issue in Gutsy (didn't try in Hardy yet).
<pschorf> xtnight, i installed the deb files
<xtknight> i know i alread ymentioned it but this is another printing problem Bug 150187
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 150187 in poppler "[gutsy] [regression] Evince has very bad quality when printing pdf files." [Unknown,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/150187
<xtknight> might need to upgrade poppler to fix it and it might also fix bug 212017?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 212017 in evince "Evince/CUPS Could Not Print Tax Document" [Medium,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/212017
<xtknight> i dont know
<greg-g> 9since when I saw the bug report I didn't read the forum thread, just what cmnorton said)
<slangasek> greg-g: oh, is it a general problem with being unable to print, or is it just this one file?
<xtknight> pschorf, ok
<greg-g> slangasek: so far just this one file
<xtknight> pschorf, let's determine where es.po is
<xtknight> pschorf, that's the file we changed
<slangasek> greg-g: hmm. then maybe it is all the same bug - do you have acrobat reader installed?
<xtknight> pschorf, basically go thru each package, with "dpkg -L <package_name> | grep es.po"
<pschorf> could I do a locate es.po?
<pschorf> ok
<xtknight> or that, and then dpkg -S /the/file/you/find
<xtknight> but there are many es.po
<greg-g> in gutsy yes, but, unfortunately I am at work right now, with no access to my Ubuntu install
<xtknight> for every package on the system
<xtknight> it's easier to do dpkg -L amule..
<pschorf> i didn't get anything from my search
<xtknight> hmm me neither
<xtknight> i think es.po is compiled into something
<xtknight> /usr/share/locale/es/LC_MESSAGES/amule.mo
<xtknight> perhaps?
<xtknight> that's binary though
<xtknight> odd
<pschorf> right...i made the mistake of running it through cat
<xtknight> well i'm really not sure how to test this then, besides running the spanish build.  you could ask the reporter to try your debdiff.
<xtknight> pschorf, hahah
<xtknight> me too
<xtknight> i dont know why cat always does that
<xtknight> just close the console
<pschorf> yeah, i restarted it
<xtknight> pschorf, in this case since you dont know spanish (i'm assuming), you should ask the reporter of the bug to try your package.  you can make it easier for him to try your package by uploading it to PPA
<xtknight> what was it bug 204600 ?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 204600 in amule "[hardy] Fix Spanish translation of aMule" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/204600
<pschorf> ok
<xtknight> yeah
<xtknight> pschorf, well since he posted it, he basically confirmed it
<greg-g> slangasek: I need to run, feel free to ping me any ideas, my IRC stays open.
<xtknight> pschorf, so in this case, let's just upload out fix
<xtknight> our
<pschorf> ok
<xtknight> pschorf, set the bug to Confirmed and assign to No one
<pschorf> in LP?
<xtknight> yes
<xtknight> it should not be "fix committed"
<xtknight> afaik
<xtknight> there's no fix committed to ubuntu
<xtknight> just a simple mistake by the reporter
<xtknight> by setting it confirmed/no one, we are getting it ready to be uploaded by MOTU
<pschorf> I can't change the status
<xtknight> what does it say?  are you logged in?
<pschorf> nevermind, not logged in
<pschorf> ok, updated
<slangasek> greg-g: I'd be interested if you could test removing acrobat reader (when you have a chance) to see if that fixes the printing problem
<xtknight> pschorf, now we should add a comment, attaching your debdiff
<xtknight> pschorf, just say something like "this debdiff fixes the problem, thank you Festor for the patch",  and then set 'This attachment is a patch', and attach it.
<xtknight> check `email me changes` as well because you need to be able to respond and track this bug
<xtknight> if the maintainers have a question or request
<pschorf> ok
<xtknight> pschorf, now we need to subscribe ubuntu-universe-sponsors
<xtknight> to get the patch sponsored by the maintainers of the Universe section where amule is located.
<xtknight> click subscribe someone else on the left
<xtknight> and type ubuntu-universe-sponsors
<xtknight> click Add and that's it
<pschorf> got it
<xtknight> good job you just completed your first patch
<xtknight> now preferably we'd check if debian is affected as well since ubuntu often gets packages from debian.  but Emilio said "This is fixed in the upstream tarballs" so we probably dont need to
<xtknight> and that's really a whole 'nother process of submitting the bug to debian.org and everything
<pschorf> ok
<pschorf> how would I know if it's added?
<xtknight> you would get an email.  usually the maintainer posts a comment on LP
<pschorf> ok
<xtknight> he'd say "uploaded" maybe or a list of changes would appear, showing closing that this bug is closed.  and the bug is set to Fix Released if so
<xtknight> he sets it to fix released you dont have to worry aobut that.  in fact you should probably never set a bug as fix committed or released unless you know what you're doing.  i neve rhave
<xtknight> i am pretty sure 'fix committed' status was incorrect before, because although the fix was committed upstream it was not committed to ubuntu.
<pschorf> ok
<pschorf> what does upstream mean?
<xtknight> well it can mean upstream as in Debian, where ubuntu gets a lot of its packages directly from (especially universe and multiverse)
<xtknight> upstream can also mean the project itself, the sourceforge page for it
<pschorf> ok
<pschorf> if something is fixed upstream, will it necessarily propagate down to debian?
<xtknight> when emilio said upstream he probably meant the project.  they link to the project's forum page
<xtknight> yes it should propagate eventually to debian unstable
<xtknight> so in this case i dont THINK we worry about it.  it's not that critical of a bug anyway
<pschorf> right
<xtknight> to be honest with you i've only sent bugs to debian once or twice and i'm pretty unfamiliar with it.  i realy dont know how their release schedule works or anything, but it's good practice certainly if it's an important patch
<pschorf> ok
<xtknight> the easiest way is to submit the bug to the project itself
<xtknight> and then it will propagate down to debian anyway
<xtknight> sooner or later
<xtknight> if it's a critical fix, then ideally you'd let every linux distribution know.  but critical usually entails security fixes and serious vulnerabilities
<xtknight> but submitting it to the project ensures that every distro will get a snapshot of the fix
<pschorf> ok
<pschorf> so this patch would just get applied to the ubuntu deb packages?
<xtknight> for now yes
<pschorf> ok
<pschorf> what keyserver should I send my public key to?
<xtknight> pschorf, i'm not sure what you mean
<xtknight> well this debdiff file doesnt need to be signed anyway
<pschorf> ok
<xtknight> actually i dont think you even can
<xtknight> i dont know
<xtknight> i've never done it anyways, i dont see the benefit of that :P
<xtknight> i mean, it doesn't matter if somebody is impersonating you in this case, does it?  the patch is there and working, isn't it? hhe
<xtknight> and besides it's good press for you: p
<xtknight> anyway it usually within a couple months a maintainer will take a look at your patch.  maybe sooner since we're in the testing phase right now.  but if a couple months passes and it doesn't get looked at it, then you may have to lobby in here about it.  otherwise, dont bother
<xtknight> pschorf,
<pschorf> sorry, i was grabbing something
<pschorf> alright
<xtknight> generally the bottleneck is not the maintainers, anyway
<pschorf> ok
<xtknight> when it comes to getting things fixed.  there's always plenty of bugs out there
<pschorf> so just keep looking through that website for bugs, and patch like we did above?
<xtknight> sure
<xtknight> http://daniel.holba.ch/really-fix-it/
<xtknight> pschorf, by the way feel free to ask questions
<xtknight> pschorf, right now i'd focus on bugs the are confirmed in HARDY, because that's what really needs to be done now
<xtknight> if it's only in gutsy's it's going to be more cumbersome to fix ( you need a gutsy chroot ) and you need to file for a Stable Release Update, generally only done with critical fixes.
<james_w> xtknight: "anyway it usually within a couple months a maintainer will take a look at your patch." <- do you mean in Ubuntu or Debian?
<xtknight> james_w, ubuntu
<xtknight> i meant archive maintainer actually
<pschorf> sorry, my x-chat gummed up
<james_w> xtknight, pschorf: did you subscribe the sponsors?
<xtknight> james_w, yup
<james_w> ah, ok, it won't be a couple of months then, it will be a few days.
<xtknight> ok ;)
<james_w> your comment worried me as there aren't maintainers in general, and so if you don't subscribe the sponsors then the patch may never be seen.
<pschorf> ok
<pschorf> so always subscribe the sponsors?
<xtknight> after a fix is posted, yes
<xtknight> ubuntu-main-sponsors for packages in main, ubuntu-universe-sponsors otherwise
<xtknight> otherwise it's like a needle in the haystack
<pschorf> and we just get that off of the package information page?
<xtknight> pschorf, what section the package is in? yes
<xtknight> or
<pschorf> ok
<xtknight> !info amule
<xtknight> at least if ubotu had a pulse
<ubotu> amule (source: amule): client for the eD2k and Kad networks, like eMule. In component universe, is optional. Version 2.1.3-3ubuntu1 (gutsy), package size 1243 kB, installed size 3404 kB
<xtknight> "in component universe"
<pschorf> ok
<pschorf> i need to get going, i'll hop back on later tonight
<xtknight> how do i set the default name and email being used by dch, dpatch, etc
<fdoving> xtknight: environment variables.
<fdoving> I set them in ~/.bashrc
<james_w> xtknight: "man dch" explains
<xtknight> ah thx
<fdoving> export DEBFULLNAME="Your name"
<fdoving> export DEBEMAIL="some@mail.tld"
<RainCT> has someone here gweled?
<RainCT> (or can install it?)
<sebner> are there plans to remove ms-sys from the repo? Or is it already removed? https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ms-sys
<xtknight> !info audacious-plugins
<ubotu> audacious-plugins (source: audacious-plugins): Base plugins for audacious. In component universe, is optional. Version 1.3.5-3ubuntu4.1 (gutsy), package size 706 kB, installed size 1368 kB
<james_w> sebner: it's already gone according to rmadison
<xtknight> i dont understand why my pdebuild is failling. http://rafb.net/p/f9CTEK27.html
<sebner> james_w: ah ok. one merge more todo for me :D
<xtknight> shouldn't i be able to type "pdebuild" just in place of "debuild" anywhere?
<james_w> xtknight: I tried to explain, your Build-Dependencies seem to be wrong.
<xtknight> it has hapepned with another package now
<xtknight> they build fine on my real machine
<james_w> as the build-dependencies are satisfied already, and so it doesn't have a problem trying to install them.
<xtknight> ok never mind i think i need to add UNiverse support to it that's all
<YokoZar> Hmm, my upload is dying about halfway through.  dput is just returning a "killed" error
<xtknight> i'm not getting a source.changes file from pdebuild.  any ideas?
<blueyed> Is there something update-manager can do to install the correct meta package for virtualbox-ose-modules, when upgrading from Gutsy? Or should there rather be a dummy package virtualbox-ose-modules-2.6.22-14-generic in Hardy, which depends on virtualbox-ose-modules-generic? (bug 208143)
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 208143 in update-manager "incorrect dependencies handling in virtualbox-ose during upgrade" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/208143
<sebner> YokoZar: you are Scoot
<sebner> YokoZar: *Scott Richie :D
<YokoZar> sebner: yes :)
<YokoZar> sebner: this dput killed has happened twice now...should I worry about my server or is this being caused by something else?
<sebner> YokoZar: hmm. sry. dunno. Just happy to meet you ^^. Btw what was this crap news about hardy + wine 0.58. Wine 0.59 was released some days ago and no on 11th of April
<sebner> *not
<YokoZar> sebner: I've changed my mind, hardy will have 0.9.59 now iff I can fix a regression it introduced into the systray
<sebner> YokoZar: great. thanks :D
<YokoZar> sebner: right now 0.9.59 breaks a few apps I use and is worse than gutsy
<sebner> damn ^^
<YokoZar> ok even weirder dput -o is failing with the killed error...
<sebner> YokoZar: try to use it with you PPA?
<YokoZar> sebner: where I'm uploading to shouldn't matter if it's failing during a dry-run test....hmm....
<sebner> YokoZar: what crap :/
<afflux> do we use README.Ubuntu when we changed something to the debian packaging we want to note down for other packagers?
<RainCT> sebner: why do you touch estival-1.96~beta/debian/festival.init
<sebner> RainCT: because it's a remainig ubuntu change that isn't in Debian?
<RainCT> sebner: it isn't metioned in the changelog and neither does that change make sense..
<sebner> RainCT: It *is* in the changelog and it's a remaining change ..
<RainCT> sebner: ah right.. my brain is frozen again :P
<RainCT> but it still doesn't make sense
<sebner> RainCT: https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/festival/  <-- ask Jamie Strandboge ;)
<RainCT> yeh I'm searching what is IRC nick is :P
<RainCT> s/is/his
<RainCT> jdstrand: ping
<emgent> jdstrand
<sebner> hihi
<jdstrand> pong
<RainCT> jdstrand: just wanted to know what's the rationale for this: "debian/festival.init: don't complain when server set to not start"
<jdstrand> RainCT: it was just the previous behavior, and IIRC was very noisy
<jdstrand> RainCT: if you are merging the Debian package, you can drop that patch of mine
<jdstrand> RainCT: plus, by complaining that it isn't starting, it is suggesting that maybe it should be started
<jdstrand> RainCT: but it should *not* be used in all but very limited circumstances
<RainCT> jdstrand: so, should we keep this or not?
<pschorf> xtnight, you there?
<jdstrand> RainCT: which this are we talking about-- Debian doesn't ship /etc/init.d/festival anymore
<jdstrand> (it is an example file, and I prefer that)
<RainCT> jdstrand: true.. so I'll drop this. thanks
<jdstrand> RainCT: np
<sebner> RainCT: you mean I have to drop it ^^
<RainCT> sebner: yeh ^^
<sebner> RainCT: remind me tomorrow :P review something else meanwhile ^^
<RainCT> uhm.. will someone pay us each time we use "^^"? :)
<sebner> RainCT: then I would be rich :D
<RainCT> heh. well, I'm going to bed, my reviews aren't accurate that late anyways :P
<RainCT> good night all
<sebner> radamantis: gn8
<sebner> RainCT: gn8
<sebner> ^^
<xtknight> what needs to be done for something like bug 197069
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 197069 in xserver-xorg-video-amd "xserver-xorg-video-amd: wide resolutions don't work" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/197069
<null_vector> LS
<null_vector> damned screen
<emgent> hello norsetto
<norsetto> emgent: hey, where you stalking me !? :-)
<emgent> heheh :D
<null_vector> Would FTBFS on ubuntuwire be a good place to start for someone new?
<sebner> null_vector: totally news?
<xtknight> if a patch for Bug 129940 already exists for xpdf hardy, may i close the bug or is still needed to be left open for gutsy?
<sebner> *new
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 129940 in xpdf "[XPDF] possible buffer overflow and execution of arbitrary code" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/129940
<sebner> null_vector: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/GettingStarted
<crimsun> xtknight: I would not close it.
<xtknight> !info xft
<ubotu> Package xft does not exist in gutsy
<xtknight> !info libxft2
<ubotu> libxft2 (source: xft): FreeType-based font drawing library for X. In component main, is optional. Version 2.1.12-2ubuntu4 (gutsy), package size 46 kB, installed size 132 kB
<sebner> gn8 folks
<pschorf> what does a bug status of triaged mean>
<crimsun> pschorf: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/Status
<pschorf> i've just started working with patching, and i've just created a debdiff file from a diff fileee
<pschorf> would that help with bug 208629?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 208629 in f-spot "f-spot doesn't work with gnome-screensaver" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/208629
<crimsun> pschorf: yes, that would help
<pschorf> crimsun: for the last file i copied the diff file into debian/patches and updated the series file
<pschorf> is there something similar for patch files?
<crimsun> pschorf: it appears to use dpatch, so you can do similarly
<pschorf> crimsun: do i need to do anything to the patch file, or just add it to 00list?
<crimsun> pschorf: you'll need to ensure it applies in the sequence you've given it in 00list
<pschorf> crimsun: what i meant to ask is if there is a way to convert a .patch file to a .dpatch file
<crimsun> pschorf: sure, dpatch-edit-patch
<xtknight> hi pschorf
<pschorf> hey, xtnight
<xtknight> i just learned how to use dpatch-edit-patch btw
<xtknight> it actually is easier
<xtknight> for adapting things, sometimes
<crimsun> pschorf: note that that "conversion" is not strictly necessary, since any unified diff is happily attempted by dpatch.
<pschorf> i was working on bug 208629
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 208629 in f-spot "f-spot doesn't work with gnome-screensaver" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/208629
<pschorf> xtnight: i renamed the patch file and ran dpatch-edit-patch gnome_screensaver_fix.patchj
<xtknight> crimsun, a patch was attached to the bug he linked, but it changed the ChangeLog in f-spot.  the ChangeLog should not be touched, right, only the debian/changelog if the fix is being backported to hardy?
<crimsun> xtknight: "backported"?  Meaning being applied now to hardy?
<pschorf> what would i do next?
<xtknight> crimsun, sorry ya i prolly used the wrong term there.  there's a patch on the f-spot page
<xtknight> pschorf, we may want that patch to be applied AFTER a certain patch.  personally i always do mine after the last one
<crimsun> xtknight: generally, for the active development release, it's ok to touch other files during non-freezes.  However, since we're in freeze, it's best to touch as few files as possible.  As long as the change is documented in debian/changelog, I would avoid applying the hunk that touches the upstream Changelog, too.
<xtknight> ok besides the fact it's not even an official change
<xtknight> i mean the guy just kinda put it in there
<xtknight> it's not by a developer so it probably shuoldnt have even been in the official changelog
<crimsun> if that's the case, I wouldn't touch the upstream Changelog, no.
<xtknight> pschorf, type "exit 230" to abort the cmd you just did
<pschorf> ok
<pschorf> aborted
<xtknight> ok one moment
<greg-g> slangasek: re bug 212017: simply removing acroread (and acroread-escript acroread-plugins) did not allow me to print.  It goes into the print queue, sits at "processing" for a bit, then has the status of "stopped"  I can not cancel the job either, if I try I get the error "CUPS SERVER ERROR: There was an error during the CUPS operation: 'client-error-not-possible'."
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 212017 in evince "Evince/CUPS Could Not Print Tax Document" [Medium,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/212017
<slangasek> greg-g: ah, interesting :)
<xtknight> pschorf, well looking at debian/patches/00list it looks like we should insert it after importer_targetdir_selector
<xtknight> because 98 and 99 are supposed to be applied last, i guess
<xtknight> i'm not sure it really matters
<xtknight> basically we gotta get it in there without breaking other patches and without breaking this patch
<xtknight> To create a new patch, to be applied after an existing patch 90_ctrlkeyfix:
<xtknight> $ dpatch-edit-patch patch 95_newupstreamfix 90_ctrlkeyfix
<pschorf> ok
<xtknight> for example
<xtknight> what is your patch called again?
<pschorf> gnome_screensaver_fix
<xtknight> ok
<xtknight> actually fix_gnome_screensaver would be a little more consistent
<pschorf> so i would say dpatch-edit-patch patch fix_gnome_screensaver importer_targetdir_selector?
<xtknight> yeah, although i just raelized it breaks if we do that
<xtknight> let's just try this for now:    dpatch-edit-patch patch fix_gnome_screensaver
<pschorf> ok, i'm in the interactive shell again
<xtknight> k
<xtknight> now remove from the original diff file the modifications to the ChangeLog file
<xtknight> we do not want to do that
<Kamping_Kaiser> (sorry about the repost, i dont see an answer from last night) i have a bug open against sugar in ubuntu (cant login). is there a 'best way' to get it either fixed or removed? it seems like a pretty awquard thing to do - include it but have it unusable
<greg-g> slangasek: anything else I can do for now? (other than stop bugging you ;) )
<pschorf> xtnight, what should i enter in the shell?
<xtknight> pschorf, nano the_patch_name
<xtknight> remove Index:..ChangeLog from it and everything below
<xtknight> press Ctrl+K to remove a whole line
<pschorf> it said new file
<xtknight> ok exit then
<xtknight> out of nano
<pschorf> do i need to specify a path?
<xtknight> just use gedit it doesnt really matter
<xtknight> open the patch file you saved
<xtknight> the one the guy provided, basically
<pschorf> ok, i've removed the changelog stuff
<xtknight> ok
<xtknight> save it then go back to your interactive patch shell
<xtknight> note the path of the patch file you geidt'd
<xtknight> gedit'd
<pschorf> ok
<xtknight> let that be PATCH_PATH.  so now, you would do, in the shell, "patch -p0 < PATCH_PATH"
<pschorf> ok, it patched 2 files
<xtknight> now type "exit".  do not type "exit 230".  230 means we screwed up.  a regular exit of 0 means the patch will be committed to our debian/patches/ folder and 00list file.
<pschorf> ok, the dpatch file was created
<xtknight> k now add a relevant entry to the Debian changelog. ("dch -i")
<xtknight> credit the author of the patch
<pschorf> the patch was from the gnome bugzilla
<xtknight> looks like it's fro mMaxxer
<xtknight> from
<pschorf> ok
<xtknight> actually Lorenzo Milesi
<xtknight> is his realname from the changelog he put in
<xtknight> ok paste what you wrote besides the *, if you would.
<pschorf> f-spot (0.4.2-1ubuntu2) hardy; urgency=low
<pschorf>   * Fixed issues arising from using f-spot with gnome-screensaver. Thanks
<pschorf>     to Maxxer for the original patch. (LP #208629)
<pschorf>  -- Paul Schorfheide <pschorf2@uiuc.edu>  Mon, 07 Apr 2008 17:26:25 -0500
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 208629 in f-spot "f-spot doesn't work with gnome-screensaver" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/208629
<xtknight> that looks good.  you can use his real name if you think that's more proper
<xtknight> also nitpick (LP: #208629) we can add a : there
<pschorf> how would I determine that?
<xtknight> pschorf, he just mentioned it in his changelog
<xtknight> he put in his realname
<xtknight> that's the thing we just removed from the diff file
<null_vector> looking at a FTBFS for xine-plugin and wondering about the right way to fix it.  The libxine.pc adds the patch number to the version but the header is missing the patch number so dependent packages think there is a version mismatch
<xtknight> pschorf, Lorenzo Milesi is his name
<null_vector> Just change the parsing of the xine-config version number to ignore the patch number?
<pschorf> ok, fixed that
<pschorf> everything else OK?
<xtknight> and the LP thing?
<pschorf> yes
<xtknight> sounds good to me then
<xtknight> this time let's build it the right way
<xtknight> "debuild"  no -S
<xtknight> make sure maintianer field is fine
<pschorf> just sudo debuild, to confirm?
<xtknight> !info f-spot
<ubotu> f-spot (source: f-spot): personal photo management application. In component main, is optional. Version 0.4.0-0ubuntu3 (gutsy), package size 1729 kB, installed size 8924 kB
<xtknight> what's the maintainer field on f-spot?
<xtknight> we don't use sudo when you use debuild really.  at least i dont.  should work without
<pschorf> it has the ubuntu desktop team and 2 individuals
<xtknight> pschorf, this package is in main,  so is Ubuntu Core Team set as  maintainer?
<xtknight> well desktop team
<pschorf> no, just the desktop team
<xtknight> ok i think that is correct then
<pschorf> ok
<xtknight> "debuild"
<pschorf> it's building...
<pschorf> i'm going to get some dinner while this runs
<jdong> am I the only one to feel that LP expires/removes old packages from the archive way too aggressively?
<pschorf> be back shortly
<jdong> it'd be nice for a devel release to have a longer history of packages
<jdong> makes tracing down recent regressions a lot easier
<null_vector> How would you patch an aclocal.m4 seeing as it then needs to be autoreconf-ed?
<ScottK> jdong: Agreed.
<ScottK> jdong: Any chance we could set up hardy-backports early?
<jdong> ScottK: sure, go for it :)
<norsetto> g'night all
<jdong> ScottK: how is it going to relate to Intrepid? Ahead of Intrepid until uploads are accepted?
<ScottK> jdong: Clamav is releasing 0.93 with a soname bump a week before our release.
<ScottK> jdong: Yes.
<jdong> ScottK: sounds reasonable. I think I want to stuff transmission 1.10 in that way too
<ScottK> All you need is a core-dev to do source uploads .... ;-)
<jdong> ScottK: one of these days I'm gonna make an irssi plugin for a queue-ping ScottK system :D
<ScottK>  /ignore jdong
<ScottK> oops
<ScottK> ;-)
<jdong> :)
<ScottK> jdong: From a policy perspective who would we need to coordinate this with?  We're breaking the it needs to be in the development release first paradigm.  Note: We did this for Universe SRUs for Gutsy, so the ground is slightly trod already.
<jdong> ScottK: For this case, there should just be an "implicit contract" that the package is destined for Intrepid when it opens up
<ScottK> Agreed, but I wonder if we need to discuss it or just do it.
<jdong> ScottK: I'm not too concerned about this policy violation, though ultimately cjwatson would be the person to consult
<ScottK> OK.  I'd suggest we do that.
<ScottK> jdong: Do you want to discuss it with him or should I?
#ubuntu-motu 2008-04-08
<jdong> ScottK: you can do it since you have the first thing that needs it
<ScottK> K
<pschorf> xtnight, i've finished the build
<xtknight> pschorf, hey you'll have to type my name properly to highlight it :)
<pschorf> haha
<xtknight> post your debdiff though.
<pschorf> wrong "knight" :(
<xtknight> !info update-manager
<ubotu> update-manager (source: update-manager): GNOME application that manages apt updates. In component main, is optional. Version 1:0.81 (gutsy), package size 863 kB, installed size 2144 kB
<pschorf> xtknight, http://rafb.net/p/RJsS8U43.html
<xtknight> pschorf, it looks like you've got two patches in there
<xtknight> i would remove the regular .patch one
<xtknight> dpatch is the proper extension
<pschorf> oh, i forgot to delete the old file
<xtknight> you can just remove the .patch from the debdiff
<pschorf> just delete everything after its mentioned?
<xtknight> you might want to add a description after DP: in the dpatch file.  i'm not sure if we did this last time but it's a good idea
<xtknight> pschorf, delete diff -Nru /tmp/2jOmb0ofCy/f-spot-0.4.2/debian/patches/fix_gnome_screensaver.patch /tmp/N8qEZunigO/f-spot-0.4.2/debian/patches/fix_gnome_screensaver.patch
<xtknight> and everything after
<xtknight> line 45
<pschorf> the description is to be added to the 00list file?
<xtknight> nope the .dpatch file
<xtknight> +## DP: No description.
<xtknight> be careful about editing diffs though.  you can really only reliably delete entire diffs like we just did (for .patch), or edit existing lines without causing trouble.
<xtknight> i'm not even sure if editing No description is safe, but we can test it.
<pschorf> ok, i added a short description
<xtknight> ok post what you have now again
<pschorf> http://rafb.net/p/F9nqjf83.html
<jdong> ScottK: I'm gonna register the hardy-backports product on LP now
<xtknight> pschorf, that looks good to me
<xtknight> pschorf, let's test to make sure your edited debdiff applies
<ScottK> jdong: Great.
<xtknight> pschorf, first redownload an original f-spot in another folder.
<ScottK> I guess I'll get clamav ready - maybe later tonight.
<pschorf> ok, i have the source
<xtknight> pschorf, cd into it and apply your debdiff
<xtknight> patch -p0 < /path/to/debdiff
<xtknight> if you don't get any errors, you're good
<pschorf> xtknight, it worked
<xtknight> pschorf, ok then it's time to upload it.  what section is f-spot in?
<pschorf> do you mean main?
<xtknight> yea
<xtknight> pschorf, ok.  so post the patch via a comment on the LP page, status to "confirmed/no one" like last time
<xtknight> this time we will subscribe ubuntu-main-sponsors since it is a main package
<xtknight> pschorf, only change the f-spot (Ubuntu)
<xtknight> pschorf, as other people have not tested the patch yet, you may want to do this
<pschorf> i just posted it
<xtknight> ok
<xtknight> did you subsccribe them yet?
<xtknight> i think you should test first
<pschorf> ok
<xtknight> use the binary packages produced
<xtknight> first reproduce the bug
<xtknight> then install your updated binaries and see if it fixes it
<xtknight> f-spot is installed on all ubuntu installations by default
<pschorf> ok
<pschorf> i will look at it before subscribing ubuntu-universe-sponsors
<pschorf> i need to work on an MP now, though
<null_vector> Is it safe to call aclocal/autoconf in debian/rules?
<xtknight> hope he knew it's u-m-s not u-u-s
<Bruno_> is the chanlog updated after the fixes have been made in the dpatch shell?
<up_the_irons> is this an appropriate channel to ask a question about backporting a package? (i've successfully backported several packages, but this libonig2 one is giving me trouble)
<jdong> up_the_irons: what are you trying to backport, and what problems are you running into?
<ScottK> up_the_irons: jdong is Mr. Backports, so you're talking to the right guy.
<up_the_irons> jdong: the package is libonig2
<up_the_irons> ScottK: cool :)
<up_the_irons> jdong: i grabbed the source from gutsy and am trying to build it on dapper
<up_the_irons> jdong: at the very end of 'sudo dpkg-buildpackage -us -uc -rfakeroot' I get:
<up_the_irons> dh_testdir -i
<up_the_irons> dh_testdir: I have no package to build
<up_the_irons> make: *** [binary-indep] Error 1
<up_the_irons> jdong: i tried commenting the line out in debian/rules, but i get a similar error from almost every line in the 'binary-indep' target.  If I remove the whole thing, I get farther, but then other problems arise
<jdong> up_the_irons: let me take a look at the package
<up_the_irons> jdong: thanks
<jdong> but commenting out dh_testdir won't get you anywhere useful :D
<up_the_irons> yeah didn't seem to ;)
<pschorf> xtknight: can I just install my .deb packages, or do I need to get rid of f-spot first?
<jdong> up_the_irons: odd enough
<up_the_irons> hehe
<jdong> up_the_irons: the same errors show up in a test build under gutsy but the error is not fatal
<up_the_irons> odd
<jdong> up_the_irons: I'm gonna try a nasty hack (|| true) and see what happens :)
<up_the_irons> jdong: ok :)
<xtknight> pschorf, just install yours
<xtknight> pschorf, by the way it's ubuntu-main-sponsors that needs to be subscribed, not ubuntu-universe-sponsors
<xtknight> pschorf, ill be here and away a little.  lifting weights.  i need to get my butt off this seet
<xtknight> :p
<jdong> up_the_irons: yeah it definitely needs a newer debhelper than it has
<jdong> up_the_irons: this is going to be an ugly monster :)
<up_the_irons> jdong: oh man :)
<up_the_irons> jdong: so the build-deps version (for debhelper) needs to be newer?
<pschorf> xtknight, enjoy ;)
<jdong> up_the_irons: that's correct
<up_the_irons> jdong: gotcha
<jdong> up_the_irons: not like anyone pays attention to debhelper dep versions while backporting anyway ;-)
<up_the_irons> jdong: yeah true
<jdong> up_the_irons: if you work hard enough at hacking it you can probably get it to build
<jdong> up_the_irons: || true everything in binary-indep, then replace ${binary:Version} with actual version of the package in debian/control, etc
<jdong> up_the_irons: but the official, correct stance is that the package requires a newer debhelper
<up_the_irons> jdong: where do you suggest I start?  Or perhaps it would be easier just to grab the upstream source and roll my own .deb?  It's not gonna be for distribution, just for this one server i have
<jdong> up_the_irons: start with the suggestions I mentioned above
<up_the_irons> jdong: ok
<up_the_irons> jdong: what's up w/ the version btw?  I noticed that problem too, says the version was empty or something
<jdong> up_the_irons: that's what's wrong
<jdong> up_the_irons: ${source:Version} in Dapper is actually ${Source-Version}
<up_the_irons> jdong: roger
<up_the_irons> makes sense
<up_the_irons> jdong: so then is ${binary:Version} equiv to ${Binary-Version} ?
<up_the_irons> jdong: i mean the dapper version
<up_the_irons> not necessarily 'equivalent'
<jdong> up_the_irons: I'm not sure, you can try it, but I just confirmed that Source-Version generates a working package
<jdong> up_the_irons: well rather the build succeeds
<jdong> whether or not it actually works is an adventure for the brave :)
<up_the_irons> right :)
<slangasek> ${Binary-Version} is not a recognized substitution
<up_the_irons> slangasek: ok
<slangasek> and Source-Version is deprecated in favor of ${binary:Version}
<slangasek> (or ${source:Version}, depending on which semantics are more appropriate; in Ubuntu, the two are always equivalent)
<jdong> for that matter, it probably wouldn't be a bad idea to bump libonig's debhelper dep to the appropriate version to enforce this
<jdong> slangasek: do you know off the top of your head which debhelper version that'd be?
<up_the_irons> woohoo: dpkg-deb: building package `libonig2' in `../libonig2_5.9.0-0.1_i386.deb'.
<up_the_irons> worked
<slangasek> jdong: hmm? to enforce what?
<slangasek> jdong: these substitutions don't come from debhelper at all
<jdong> slangasek: oh, they don't?
<slangasek> this is dpkg-dev
<jdong> slangasek: oh. Do you think we need a versioned build-dep against it to prevent these kinds of FTBFS?
<slangasek> sorry, what kind of FTBFS was that?  I probably missed the beginning of the conversation
<jdong> slangasek: the libonig package satisfies Dapper's build-deps but FTBFSes due to requiring these substitution variables... IMO that's a packaging bug
<up_the_irons> ftbfs? :)
<jdong> slangasek: of course the package was uploaded to Feisty first so it's unlikely anyone tested building it against earlier Ubuntu releases
<slangasek> jdong: oh, well, if you care about the package being buildable on dapper, yes. :)
<slangasek> jdong: in that case, a versioned build-dep on dpkg-dev (>= 1.13.19) is appropriate
<jdong> slangasek: meh I don't feel like it... I'll add "file a bug in Debian" to the bottom of my TODO list :)
<up_the_irons> haha
<slangasek> jdong: not a very useful todo list item, Debian doesn't have any supported releases left which fail to satisfy that versioned build-dep...
<persia> jdong: There's a whole heap of packages that have that problem, likely almost everything that underwent the transition.  Are you sure you want to file a bug for this?
<jdong> persia: Cancel! Cancel!!!!!
<xtknight> pschorf, back for a second
 * persia looks forward to more sourceful backports for Dapper
<pschorf> xtnight, i installed my deb packages but I still don't have any images in the screensaver
<pschorf> xtknight*
<xtknight> pschorf, ok, then i'd report that to the bug page and not subscribe sponsors
<pschorf> ok
<null_vector> Is anyone able to help me with an autotools issue with the FTBFS in xine-plugin?
<pschorf> i may be using f-spot wrong, though
<xtknight> pschorf, hopefully other people can try it too
<pschorf> do I do anything besides select "use all photos"
<xtknight> no idea
<pschorf> ok, will report back
<up_the_irons> jdong: thanks for your help.  libonig2 seems to be working on my box.
<jdong> up_the_irons: cool
<bddebian> Heya gang
<protonchris> Hey bddebian
<bddebian> Hello protonchris
<jdong> asac: when you're bored and just feel like chatting, what are your thoughts on this PGO optimization build stuff for Mozilla?
<mophead> What is the difference between this channel and ubuntu-devel?
<pschorf> How would I read this in a diff file?  -			case "-slideshow":
<pschorf> +			case "-slideshow": case "--slideshow":
<pschorf>  				slideshow = true;
<pschorf>  				break;
<xtknight> what do you mean?
<pschorf> what would that do when executed?
<xtknight> it removes the line "case -slideshow": and adds the line that starts with a +
<RAOF> pschorf: They're changing from only accepting "-slideshow" to accepting both "-slideshow" and "--slideshow"
<pschorf> ok
<xtknight> lol dont you hate it when you do nano | less
<pschorf> haha
<prana> hello! is bug 208894 (upgrade of Mercurial to 1.0) something that would be likely to get a FFe?  Updated Debian packages are in process (see linked debian bug 474877).
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 208894 in mercurial "mercurial-1.x upgrade" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/208894
<ubotu> Debian bug 474877 in mercurial "Upgrade Mercurial to 1.0 release" [Wishlist,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/474877
<pschorf> xtknight, how do I apply a dpatch file to test it again?
<RAOF> prana: It's impossible to tell without more information than is in that bug.
<xtknight> pschorf, a dpatch file?
<xtknight> hmm
<pschorf> i think the patch file didn't run when we built it
<RAOF> prana: It's possible (but unlikely at this stage), if it fixes a whole bunch of bugs.
<prana> RAOF: i.e. full debdiff etc?
<RAOF> prana: Yeah.  Following the FFe process is good :)
<RAOF> prana: Diffstat, diff of upstream changelog, etc.
<pschorf> xtknight: the patch we created isn't in the 00list file
<prana> RAOF: http://ftp-master.debian.org/new/mercurial_1.0-1.html would perhaps summarize.
<xtknight> pschorf, you know, i just had that trouble
<ScottK> prana: If you can't be bothered to do more than summarize, why should I expend my volunteer time caring?
<xtknight> pschorf, one second :p
<xtknight> yiikes
<xtknight> i hope i didnt screw up my last few debdiffs
<xtknight> oh well
<xtknight> life happens
<jdong> whoa, mercurial went 1.0?
<pschorf> can we just type it in, or would that cause tons of trouble down the way?
<xtknight> the next question is, why on earth didn't dpatch-edit-patch add the patch to 00list??
<RAOF> prana: And the summary is a big, *big* evil set of huge, major changes.  That's likely to make anyone go "no", two days before final freeze.
<prana> ScottK: i'm new; just asking for an opinion here since it looks more complicated than simply sucking over a new debian package.
<xtknight> i think that'll be fine pschorf let me check though
<jdong> xtknight: because you don't always want it in 00list :)
<jdong> xtknight: probably a crummy answer though ;-)
<xtknight> how do i get it to add it to 00list?
<xtknight> i thought it did by default.  sily me
<jdong> xtknight: just edit 00list
<prana> ROAF: ok, that's what i thought.
<pschorf> thanks jdong...i thought the same
<prana> jdong: apparently, 2 weeks ago.
<jdong> prana: cool. I guess I haven't been in touch with that side of things for a hwile now
<xtknight> k
<ScottK> prana: It's unlikely, but if it's mostly bug fixing, not impossible.
<xtknight> pschorf, well yup add it to 00list.  ill be busy fixing my last few :D
<pschorf> xtknight, should i just add it before the 98 and 99 patches?
<xtknight> pschorf, add it as the last one actually.  i think.
<RAOF> ScottK: The debian changelog suggests that there's a whole bunch of new/changed features.
<jdong> ScottK: it looks fairly new-feature.
<RAOF> Like, a page of text at 1280x1024 of new features :)
<ScottK> Then no.
<xtknight> pschorf, do you have any previous patches where you did dpatch?  might need to fix em
<pschorf> xtknight, and then just debuild?
<pschorf> no
<xtknight> pschorf, yup
<prana> yeah, theres 485 files changed with 10k insertions and 6k deletions in a uscan diffstat.
<p> sorry, my other computer tanked
<p> this is pschorf
<prana> ok, thanks.
<p> xtknight, do i just re-run debuild -S after changing 00list?
<xtknight> p, run debuild without -S
<xtknight> we also need new binaries
<xtknight> -S only produces source changes
<p> do i need to delete the old binaries?
<xtknight> p, no they will be overwritten.  but you can for safety
<xtknight> rm *.deb that is
<pschorf2> xtknight, now the build failed when applying the patch
<xtknight> pschorf, ok
<xtknight> pschorf, remove it from 00list
<xtknight> for a second
<xtknight> then run "debian/rules clean" (maybe with sudo)  we need to do that, before we add it to 00list.  otherwise it thinks there's a patch in there.
<pschorf2> hmm,,,the build is still failing
<pschorf2> can i copy the dpatch to a fresh source download and try there?
<xtknight> yeah just nuke it
<xtknight> and start overi guess
<xtknight> copy you changelog
<xtknight> and your dpatch, 00list to a fresh source
<pschorf> xtknight, the build still failed with fresh source
<xtknight> pschorf, ok one sec
<xtknight> pschorf, do you have any idea why that may be?
<pschorf> no, the dpatch file looks fine
<xtknight> pschorf, try just building the fresh source
<xtknight> see if that even works
<pschorf> ok
<pschorf> a fresh build worked
<xtknight> well why dont you work off that and try and regenerate the .dpatch
<xtknight> dpatch-edit-patch patch PATCHNAME
<xtknight> patch -p0 < /path/to/undebianized/diff
<xtknight> exit
<xtknight> (add PATCHNAME to 00list)
<xtknight> and try again :)
<pschorf> i actually already regenerated to use with the fresh source
<xtknight> it's stil not working?
<xtknight> can i see the dpatch file?
<xtknight> pastebin
<pschorf> yeah
<xtknight> and what bug is this again?
<pschorf> http://rafb.net/p/5xflBW15.html
<pschorf> bug 208629
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 208629 in f-spot "f-spot doesn't work with gnome-screensaver" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/208629
<xtknight> i'll try it in a second.  just as soon as i get this load of audacious-plugins off my shoulders :P
<pschorf> alright
<xtknight> pschorf, as a side note you should probably put your name in the dpatch as well not just email
<xtknight> like it is in the changelog
<xtknight> but i'm going to try the patch now
<pschorf> ok
<xtknight> pschorf, so yours ended up a little different than mine.  what's the exec f-spot thing.  is that another patch?
<pschorf> i think
<xtknight> hmm i see the guy who posted it on LP conventiently omitted half of the patch
<pschorf> yeah
<xtknight> well that's not good
<pschorf> there were 2 parts in addition to the changelog stuff
<xtknight> sec
<xtknight> http://rafb.net/p/mWlYm939.html
<xtknight> that's what i came with
<xtknight> looks exactly the same
<xtknight> let me try it
<xtknight> i have a pbuilder where i can facilitate a clean build of it
<xtknight> sometimes building on your main machine can get messy
<pschorf> k
<xtknight> ya it failed
<xtknight> ok
<xtknight> it's because we need to apply it in a different order, i guess
<xtknight> generally that's what this means.  applying patch fix_gnome_screensaver to ./ ... failed.
<pschorf> ok
<xtknight> so we have to find an order where the rest of the patches dont conflict
<pschorf> ok
<xtknight> generally we do that by "dpatch-edit-patch patch fix_gnome_screensaver THELASTPATCH"
<xtknight> 99 i think.  but i think that failed for me
<xtknight> just a sec
<xtknight> pschorf, ok
<xtknight> pschorf, dpatch-edit-patch patch fix_gnome_screensaver 99_ltmain_as-needed
<xtknight> we should very often use it like that, where we pick the last patch in 00list for the end of the command
<xtknight> however this gives us some failures as we try to patch -p0... but we can fix these by hand
<pschorf> ok
<xtknight> basically based on common sense
<xtknight> so get fresh source if you haven't alrady
<pschorf> ok
<pschorf> got the source
<xtknight> ok
<xtknight> so when you're in the interactive editor, try to apply the patch again like we always do
<xtknight> you'll get errors
<xtknight> but we can fix these
<pschorf> ok
<pschorf> i got a HUNK failed error
<xtknight> pschorf, ok
<xtknight> sorry i was a little preoccupied
<xtknight> free now
<pschorf> it looks like the data its trying to change in f-spot-screensaver is different than expected
<xtknight> yea
<xtknight> let's look at the .rej file
<xtknight> these are the "rejects" :p
<xtknight> basically you can tell it's just trying to remove a dash from the command line
<pschorf> right
<xtknight> but one of the patches changed the command line from bin/sh to bin/bash so the patch no longer works!
<pschorf> ah...
<pschorf> i'm with you
<xtknight> pschorf, now since patch failed it created a mess.  delete .orig and .rej files
<pschorf> ok, removed
<xtknight> pschorf, as a matter of fact patch can leave behind .origs when patches dont *exactly* match but still work.  so you always want to make sure no .orig files are there (but also make sure you dont delete .origs if the package had them already).  this is why you always want to examine your debdiffs when you're finished with things, for unexpected changes.
<pschorf> ok
<xtknight> we are still in the interactive shell, which means it's watching what we do
<xtknight> so just apply the patch yourself
<xtknight> remove the dash in that file
<xtknight> you could also use gedit, but then you'd have to delete the ~ backup file it leaves behind as well
<pschorf> ok, file changed
<xtknight> nano tools/f-spot-screensaver
<xtknight> right?
<pschorf> right, i used vim
<xtknight> k
<xtknight> so let's "exit"
<pschorf> k
<xtknight> pschorf, make sure you put your name and email and description in the dpatch file
<xtknight> you know, there's something you should do right now to make it put your name and email always there
<xtknight> at the end of your ~/.bashrc add this
<xtknight> export DEBFULLNAME="My Name"
<xtknight> export DEBEMAIL="asdf@gmail.com"
<xtknight> and dch and dpatch will obey this. you'll still have to add description though
<xtknight> those should match your gpg key of course
<pschorf> ok
<pschorf> i've edited the dpatch and .bashrc
<xtknight> now with your new patch make sure you edited with "dch -i" also
<xtknight> to add the changelog
<xtknight> and add it to 00list!
<xtknight> at the end.  because we made our patch after 99 was applied, with that command.
<xtknight> applying patch fix_gnome_screensaver to ./ ... ok.
<xtknight> mine works
<pschorf> ok, mine's building
<xtknight> cool
<xtknight> you caught on to this pretty fast.  good job.  you learned as much as i did ever since i started doing it.  because i just learned dpatch-edit-patch today
<xtknight> i just recently started fixing bugs again
<pschorf> i spent a fair amount of time re-reading irc chat from earlier
<pschorf> but i think i've got it
<pschorf> ...for now
<xtknight> i always check my debdiffs meticulously afterwords
<xtknight> this is pretty much the foolproof method to ensure i did the right thing
<pschorf> so you just check to see that it only changed the data that you actually meant it to, and go over the changelog?
<xtknight> maybe you want to get a PPA so it's easier for people to check your patches
<xtknight> pschorf, it should change 00list, the changelog, and add the  dpatch file basically.  and the binaries should work.  if those 4 cases are met, then you're set! (at least for dpatch patch systems)
<pschorf> how do i get a PPA?
<xtknight> dont misread it either.  the dpatch file will contain diff -Nru ,etc that's not another patch that's within the dpatch.
<pschorf> ok
<xtknight> pschorf, it's free and easy read here https://help.launchpad.net/PPAQuickStart
<xtknight> have your gpg public key ready
<xtknight> when they say sign CoC that means you have to go thru a process of signing it with your GPG key, not just reading it
<xtknight> but that'll come up in the process
<pschorf> ok, i've got that up and running
<xtknight> what?
<pschorf> i added the gpg key earlier, so it was pretty painless
<pschorf> the ppa
<xtknight> already? llol
<xtknight> did you sign the CoC?
<pschorf> yeah
<xtknight> ok we'll see when we attempt to upload things then
<xtknight> setup the dput rc file?
<xtknight> dput cf
<pschorf> do i run that in the dir with the deb and debdiff files?
<xtknight> dput ppa asdf_source.changes
<xtknight> there will be a .changes file
<xtknight> you want to upload the source one not the i386 or amd64 one
<xtknight> you dont need to run debuild again if you already have your changes
<pschorf> i just have an i386 file
<xtknight> ah ok then do run "debuild -S -sd"
<xtknight> Note: If you're building an alternative version of a package already in the primary Ubuntu archive, build your source package using debuild -S -sd. If you're building an entirely new package whose orig.tar.gz is not yet in the Ubuntu primary archive, build the source package with debuild -S -sa.
<xtknight> now actually
<xtknight> umm
<xtknight> they want you to name it like ~ppa
<pschorf> ?
<xtknight> that's just the most convenient for everyone.  so edit your changelog with "dch -e" and after that you can run "debuild -S -sd".  you do not need to recompile a binary to change the package version
<xtknight> myapp_1.0.1-0ubuntu1~ppa1
<xtknight> instead of myapp_1.0.1-0ubuntu1
<pschorf> so instead of ubuntu2, i would have ubuntu2~ppa1?
<xtknight> so just add ~ppa1 to your version.  i would keep the major version increment there, because otherwise regular gets preferred over ppa1
<xtknight> yes
<xtknight> and ~ppa2 for subsequent revisions, ~ppa3, etc
<xtknight> of the same patch, at least
<pschorf> ok, now i have the ~ppa1 version
<xtknight> dput it to your ppa
<xtknight> source.changes
<pschorf> i got a no host in config error
<xtknight> go through Creating your source package at https://help.launchpad.net/PPAQuickStart
<pschorf> so should i post my new debdiff file on LP?
<xtknight> yup
<xtknight> this will be a debdiff for ubuntu2, not the ppa one
<xtknight> Bug 208629
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 208629 in f-spot "f-spot doesn't work with gnome-screensaver" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/208629
<pschorf> right
<pschorf> can i delete my old post?
<xtknight> nope but dont worry about it
<xtknight> just say the last one had no patch
<xtknight> we need to test this one anyways too
<xtknight> man f-spot's import feature is frustrating
<xtknight> i have the option to import all 40000 pictures on my HD, or nothing at all.
<pschorf> i did
<pschorf> don't worry
<xtknight> hehe
<pschorf> who do I subscribe again?
<xtknight> ubuntu-main-sponsors because f-spot is in main
<xtknight> !info f-spot
<ubotu> f-spot (source: f-spot): personal photo management application. In component main, is optional. Version 0.4.0-0ubuntu3 (gutsy), package size 1729 kB, installed size 8924 kB
<pschorf> ok
<pschorf> i think that one's finally taken care of
<xtknight> well did you tes to see if f-spot is fixed?
<xtknight> with the patch
<xtknight> er gnome-screensaver
<pschorf> yes
<xtknight> oh so this one actually works
<pschorf> yes
<xtknight> nice
<xtknight> upload it to your PPA if you want.  good practice
<pschorf> is it normal to have to edit patch files?
<xtknight> looks like it's on your ppa building right now
<xtknight> yeah
<pschorf> ok
<xtknight> very common
<xtknight> you mean adapt patch files to make them dpatch basically?
<pschorf> right
<xtknight> because people don't make them properly.  they make em before they apply all the other patch chain
<pschorf> ok
<pschorf> what time zone are you in, out of curiosity?
<xtknight> eastern. 12am here
<pschorf> ok
<xtknight> you?
<pschorf> central
<pschorf> so 11
<xtknight> when your package is done building you'll have i386 and amd64 debs.  but they'll take like 20 mins from the time of build completion till launchpad uploads them to ftp
<xtknight> so i'm going to test your packages and comment on the bug
<pschorf> k
<pschorf> i need to call it a night, still have physics homework and class again at 9 tomorrow
<xtknight> ok
<pschorf> hope it works for you too
<pschorf> night
<xtknight> later
<xtknight> for something like bug 212542 can i modify the original patch or do i have to make another patch to revert the changes done by a previous patch.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 212542 in compiz-fusion-plugins-main "Drop type=Utility from 01-animation-defaults.patch" [Undecided,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/212542
<jdong> xtknight: ah, thanks for working on that one!
<jdong> xtknight: the diff posted as comment #1 is a patch against the original patch
<jdong> xtknight: that's the way I'd recommend it done too. Just apply that patch to the debian/patches dir
<xtknight> yeah
<jdong> xtknight: though, for this case, I recommend talking to mvo about it (he's usually in #ubuntu-devel during normal hours)
<jdong> xtknight: because he's also planning to push a newer Compiz and I just talked with him 6hrs ago on including this fix for the new compiz release
<xtknight> i mean the only possible ramification would be if debian chose to somehow change the orig patch as well, and then my patch somehow wouldnt get thru because it also modified the orig patch...
<xtknight> ironically i need to talk to him about something else too
<xtknight> hehe
<jdong> xtknight: perfect timing. But since none of us can upload those changes anyway...
<jdong> xtknight: and the main sponsor queue for stuff like this usually involves poking him anyway....
<jdong> might as well cut out the middle man
<xtknight> ah ya
<nityad> Hello all, I am having trouble woth pbuilder passing a build of binary package with library dependencies. The error is dpkg-shlibdeps: failure: couldn't find library libstdc++.so.5. Can anyone point me to what the issue could be?
<xtknight> nityad, make sure you set it up for universe if that's what you need
<xtknight> nityad,  for example https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto#head-5e61fa0f52f7f2442fb20f074813bd691744460b
<xtknight> man has anyone else noticed copy/paste with xchat works about 1/3 times?
<jdong> xtknight: real men use real IRC clients
<jdong> (kidding :D)
<xtknight> lol
<xtknight> it's better than pidgin
<xtknight> :P
<jdong> of course IRC would be a better place if copy-paste didn't work at all :D
<xtknight> yeah copy-pastebin is the new copy-paste
<jdong> we can pop up an obnoxious IRC guidelines warning box whenever the user tries to paste!
<xtknight> we really need some sort of integration
 * jdong wonders how many HIG guidelines he can break in one proposal :)
<xtknight> where a user can mouseover a 'pastebin field' and then a tooltip pops up..
<xtknight> pasting completely becomes abstracted
<jdong> how about a distributed mesh network clipboard system? :D
<xtknight> bittorrent
<xtknight> lol
<xtknight> shouldn't Bug 201287 be confirmed/nobody and subscribed to ubuntu main?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 201287 in apache2 "apache2 init script support for 'status'" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/201287
<RAOF> xtknight: It's probably waiting for a FFe, right?
<xtknight> RAOF, hmm? well this is a bugfix for hardy we can still do that can't we?
 * RAOF reads that as "add the feature 'status' to the apache init script".
<xtknight> ah i see
<RAOF> Also, it's been on either ubuntu-devel or -discuss.
<xtknight> guess i'll leave that one be
<jdong> RAOF: or you can read it as BUG: status {errors out, returns incorrect result} ;-)
<nityad> xtknight, your pointer helped and pbuilder passed for the package. Thanks!
<xtknight> nityad, you're welcome
<dholbach> good morning
<no0tic> morning :)
<null_vector> morning
<dholbach> hiya no0tic and null_vector - how are you guys doing?
<null_vector> can't complain
<no0tic> everything ok :) you?
 * Fujitsu complains about universe being too big to even install everything on a quad-Xeon in a day.
<no0tic> universe is bigger than you can imagine :)
<dholbach> hehe
<dholbach> no0tic: still waking up, I hope caffeine will kick in soon
<AstralJava> Morning dholbach, all. :)
<dholbach> hiya AstralJava
<no0tic> morning AstralJava
<xtknight> what should i do with bug 110333 if the fix is in hardy already?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 110333 in autogen "missing includes in getopt.tpl" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/110333
<dholbach> xtknight: the changelog does not mention the fix, and 'caludo' mentions it'd be in 5.9.4, we have 5.9.3 is in hardy
<xtknight> dholbach, i checked the file that his diff modified, and it already has the changes
<dholbach> xtknight: ok perfect, then just say that you double checked the fix is in hardy and mark it as 'fix released'
<dholbach> xtknight: good work
<xtknight> dholbach, ok.  thx.  not worrying about gutsy then?
<dholbach> xtknight: if somebody needs the fix in gutsy, they should nominate the bug to fixed in gutsy
<xtknight> k
<dholbach> if somebody does, you can refer them to http://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates
<YokoZar> Can I ask someone to download and dput a package for me?  For some reason dput is failing on the server I have it on, and I can't upload from home.  It's 400 megs, however.
<YokoZar> dput is failling with "killed" half way through, even on a dry run
<warp10> Good morning
<no0tic> morning warp10 :)
<warp10> hey no0tic! ;)
<null_vector> Anyone mind looking over a debdiff for 68852 ?
<xtknight> bug 68852
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 68852 in findutils "Error in man page, re: -printf \ escape" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/68852
<xtknight> null_vector,  hmm  what do you mean?   i don't see a debdiff.  but anyway i can't do much.  i can only look over it since i'm not a MOTU :)
<null_vector> I mean look it over before I add it.
<xtknight> sure do you have a URL?
<Tonio_> dholbach: ping ?
<Tonio_> dholbach: hi ;)
<null_vector> http://bobbyrward.info/findutils_4.2.32-1ubuntu3.debdiff
<xtknight> null_vector, it looks just fine to me
<xtknight> so long as that fixes the issue
<null_vector> yeah that's all it is, just never used dpatch before
<xtknight> ahh
<xtknight> yes as long as it's added to 00list you're good
<null_vector> thanks
<xtknight> null_vector, and i can confirm that the patch does get applied during compile.
<null_vector> awesome
<xtknight> don't forget to subscribe ubuntu-main-sponsors
<null_vector> How do I do that exactly?
<xtknight> null_vector, press Subscribe someone else
<xtknight> !info findutils
<null_vector> doh
<ubotu> findutils (source: findutils): utilities for finding files--find, xargs, and locate. In component main, is required. Version 4.2.31-1ubuntu2.1 (gutsy), package size 247 kB, installed size 1280 kB
<xtknight> we can see that the package is in component main.  otherwise, you'd subscribe ubuntu-universe-sponsors
<null_vector> right
<null_vector> use u-u-s for multiverse or is that even in lp?
<xtknight> u-u-s for multiverse also yeah
<xtknight> every package is on lp
<xtknight> not all of them have dedicated 'projects' though.  but that's sort of another thing altogether.
<dholbach> hey ton
<dholbach> hey Tonio_ :)
<primes2h> Ciao a tutti.
<primes2h> Hello to everyone.
<primes2h> I need help from someone.
<primes2h> I open a Bug about a translation problem in Xaos (Bug @211710)
<primes2h> due to Xaos problem itself.
<no0tic> bug 211710
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 211710 in xaos "Wrong characters codification in Xaos translation." [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/211710
<primes2h> J.B. Langston (OSX mantainer of the program) provide a patch for it but he can't test it.
<primes2h> Moreover XaoS is in main so I don't know how to do.
<primes2h> I meant "J.B. Langston provided a patch"
<primes2h> May someone help me?
<primes2h> please...
<tjaalton> I've got a packaging question: I need to filter certain files from all the other binaries but one, but doing 'dh_install -Xfoo; dh_install -pbar' seems stupid (since the package is a multi-GB proprietary app). Is there a way to know which package is being worked on, so I could do 'ifeq "$(CURPKG)" "bar"' or similar?
<man-di> tjaalton: dh_install -pbar -Xfoo doesnt work?
<man-di> tjaalton: but it would probably be more easy to have debian/bar.install files
<tjaalton> man-di: dh_install -Xfoo does the trick for all the packages, but for -pfoo I don't want to do that
<tjaalton> uh, -pbar
<tjaalton> man-di: the filtering is done because there are binaries for different archtitectures (linia32, linop64, linem64t), so having a bar.install doesn't work
<man-di> tjaalton: is your package using cdbs? then you could put your install code into install/bar:: target
<man-di> tjaalton: and customize it easily
<man-di> tjaalton: its surely possible without cdbs too
<tjaalton> man-di: nope, plain debhelper
<man-di> tjaalton: then just dont use -Xfoo with -pbar
<tjaalton> man-di: exactly.. but I have to specify it after the first dh_install run, which means that -pbar is handled twice
<primes2h> Could someone help me, please?
<lool> Hey folks
<lool> I'd like to discuss handling of the mobile packages during the freeze
<lool> To sum up the situation: UME is on a quite different from hardy (the current target for a first official non-alpha/beta release of UME is hardy.1), and we're also quite late on misc stuff which remains TBD
<lool> Also, we're in the process of promoting much stuff from universe/multiverse to main/restricted; packaging still sucks in many of the packages
<Fujitsu> So we're going to have enormous amounts of mobile stuff only stabilising in -updates?
<lool> So the intent is to continue pushing as much work as possible into the mobile packages despite the freeze, that is instead of stabilizing what we have yet
<lool> Fujitsu: Yes
<lool> However, the "good" news is that hopefully this should be a self contained set of packages used only for mobile
<lool> So it shouldn't affect desktop or server users at all
<Fujitsu> Or nothing not seeded into -mobile, I hope.
<lool> Well the seeds are also an issue lalala
<lool> What might also happen is that we touch universe packages which users might care about, but only to patch them for lpia
<Fujitsu> Ew.
<Fujitsu> Ew.
<Fujitsu> Ew.
<Fujitsu> Mass SRUs == bad
<lool> Yeah, I know someone would say that
<lool> *knew
<lool> Fujitsu: It is bad
<lool> Please note however that not all the updates will go into hardy proper; we intend to use our ppa as a staging area and also as a place for stuff which we simply didn't get in a good enough shape for such updates
<Fujitsu> I'm not sure that making any PPA look more official is a good idea, but I guess it's better.
<lool> Fujitsu: Unfortunately, it's already the case
<Fujitsu> So I've seen, though it's not exactly released yet.
<lool> This is due to misc reasons, but one obvious explanation is that we have like 15 people from Intel who aren't anywhere close to MOTU, and a dozen of people from Canonical who are good but aren't MOTU either
<lool> So we have kind of a sponsoring bottleneck
<Fujitsu> Hm. Concrete numbers. I've never seen anything like that before.
<lool> This is being addressed, but it's not going to be fixed soonish
<Fujitsu> A good point.
<lool> Fujitsu: Well these are guesstimates, but I could give you hard numbers by looking at the ubuntu-mobile team
<lool> One hard number is that we're currently two core devs in the team, and no other Ubuntu uploader (no additional MOTU)
<Fujitsu> Ow.
<lool> (StevenK and myself)
<lool> This is probably reassuring to the amount of stuff we could ever try to push to hardy :)
<lool> Anyway, I wanted to give a heads up on the topic and I hope we can follow such a plan for the freeze and after the release
<Fujitsu> You could just blindly sponsor lots of things. It has happened before.
<lool> TBH, I think the packages are in such a shape that updates are highly desirable, despite the freeze
<Fujitsu> I'm not worried about -mobile stuff. I'm more worried about the result of even simple rebuilds on parts of the archive.
<Fujitsu> No-change rebuilds will cause problems.
<lool> Example of highly desirable stuff is moving midbrowser to build against xulrunner-1.9 like everybody else instead of building its internal copy of firefox lalala
<lool> Fujitsu: Ack
<Fujitsu> We had too many changes late in the cycle to be sure that things will work again.
<Fujitsu> libc6, CFLAGS/LDFLAGS changes...
<Fujitsu> gfortran (although that's fixed)
<Fujitsu> python-central...
<lool> Fujitsu: That said, it looks like something we should deal with on the hardy support time frame
<lool> I mean, would we consider for instance that foobar doesn't like the new LDFLAGS, we should really fix it in hardy in an update instead of waiting for a randome security upload to discover it
<lool> But agreed, there's risk in touching that many packages
<Fujitsu> Indeed, with the number of security updates we have to organise, I'm very concerned about how many things we'll find that break not because of our fixes, but toolchain changes... We'll see.
<lool> Naturally, I'm around if anybody has additional questions on this topic; I'll try to do my best to ensure everything runs smoothly, but suggestions and help are welcome
<Fujitsu> I guess that as long as you test well, not too much can go too horrifically wrong.
<lool> I'm worried that we don't test all use cases, but I naturally test all the uploads I'm interested in; for example for claws, I would test the hildonized version, probably not the regular version
<Fujitsu> Then I would be gravely concerned with your methodology.
<Riddell> lool: why not just continue to use the PPA?
<\sh> because it's crap...that way
<lool> Riddell: It sucks for various reasons and it's used for multiple things; also we can't really quality control it
<\sh> it's true, that we will have patches from mobile devs for universe packages, galculator or claws are two examples
<\sh> and we need more people to work on this, for porting those patches towards newer versions
<\sh> this is the problem right now..
<\sh> (regarding universe)
<\sh> and I wonder if we'll find any, without the respective knowledge...
<\sh> lool, I think you'll be in praque...if it's feasable for you and the attending motus, please raise it and try to schedule a meeting :)
<lool> I'm happy to have a meeting on the topic for sure
<\sh> lool, what about the open job opportunity on the careers page?
<lool> \sh: I think we're going slightly offtopic, but to give a quick answer I'm still looking into filing it, with some serious candidates in the pipe
<lool> BTW there is also an UMD position open
<\sh> lool, well, if you can find a packaging dude with universe ambitions working on your team...this will solve a lot of problems
<\sh> lool, (I think it's not offtopic...mobile is really a cornercase regarding universe work)
<\sh> there should be a good human interface between the ubuntu-mobile and ubuntu-universe ... regarding knowledge etc.
<lool> In general, we're looking into having more of the existing team gain MOTUship and/or coredevship if they have such interest
<lool> We fail by quite a huge margin in the UME community front
<\sh> lool, push adilson ;)
<lool> He *is* being pushed :)
<\sh> anyways...it's a heavy load for universe people to carry those patches without knowing what they do or how they work, without the right knowledge...so I think it could be vital, if you and your team can do some knowledge transfer...
<\sh> and to let universe people know who they can kick around when they have problems converting one patch from one version to another...
<lool> It's hard to grow interest for lpia if people don't own devices and the supported devices are not very common
<\sh> and they are expensive
<lool> However, I'm working in support for virtual envs
<lool> \sh: For many reasons, they are not common  ;-)
<lool> Expensive, not really at the peak of the market, not a lot of supported devices (because single arch and scalability issues) etc.
<\sh> well, this HTC is a nifty little thing...but over 1k euro..is above my budget...means, wife's killing me if I click on "buy now" @amazon ;)
<\sh> lool, raise this issue @uds praque...i think it's vital for the communication between your team and motu :)
<lool> I want to
<\sh> lool, anyways...wine is ready for wine...uploaded sunday the new rev for adding lpia arch
<\sh> s/wine/lpia/
<lool> \sh: Did you stay on top of the pas discussion?
<\sh> lool, and regarding claws, adilson wanted to push his changed patch towards claws upstream
<lool> Yes; I personally think Ubuntu shouldn't be maintaining these
<\sh> lool, the last bit of info: adam wanted to add lpia to p-a-s
<lool> Some upstreams don't show lots of interest though
<\sh> ok mee4ting now...cu later
<pochu> lool: do you want this for the mobile folks?
<pochu>    * Build a wesnoth-smallgui binary (closes: #469234)
<pochu> debian #469234
<ubotu> Debian bug 469234 in wesnoth "please provide a wesnoth-smallgui binary package" [Wishlist,Fixed] http://bugs.debian.org/469234
<pochu> lool: it allows you to play in reduced screens, such as the n810
<lool> pochu: Definitely!
<pochu> lool: ok, the rest of the changes seem reasonably so I'll test it a bit and request a sync
<\sh> back
<\sh> lool, regarding wine, there is not much to do for LPIA UI
<\sh> lool, so I think it's just as easy as adding lpia arch to p-a-s ...
<lool> Probably not indeed
<\sh> but ubuntu and debian packages are far from being the same (for ages now :))
<stani> ScottK or Pochu: I've added a patch for Bug #213653. What is the best to continue? A SPE 0.8.4.g release or apply the patch directly?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 213653 in spe "SPE.py crashed with TypeError in DrawUml()" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/213653
<pochu> stani: I think the patch is ok
<pochu> I mean, uploading the patch directly
<stani> ok
<stani> will you take care of it?
<null_vector> bug 212055
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 212055 in electricsheep "Unable to download sheep" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/212055
<pochu> stani: yes
<null_vector> should probably be wont-fix as there is no mirror and won't ever be one
<stani> pochu: thanks!
<stani> pochu: On http://packages.ubuntu.com/hardy/spe I see that spe depends on python-wxgtk2.6. Better would be like for phatch: http://packages.ubuntu.com/hardy/phatch
<stani> pochu: Shall I update the control file in PAPT?
<pochu> stani: yes
<pochu> will change that too in this upload to Ubuntu
<stani> pochu: Can I write "Recommends: wx2.8-doc | wx2.6-doc"
<pochu> stani: I'd add that to suggests instead
<POX_> pochu: why are you uploading -0ubuntu1 to Ubuntu instead of syncing with Debian?
<POX_> (vide: phatch new upstream)
<stani> pochu: but now it is "Recommends: wx2.6-doc", so why should it move from recommends to suggests?
<stani> Hi POX_
<POX_> hi
<pochu> POX_: because we are about to freeze and I didn't know how long it could take to get into Debian
<pochu> POX_: I'm requesting a sync right now
<pochu> stani: adding the alternative is fine then
<POX_> pochu: dinstall is running every 12h in Debian
<pochu> It may fit better in Suggests though, as Recommends are installed by default...
<stani> POX_: I think ScottK suggested to upload to both directly because of the freeze.
<pochu> POX_: right, but it also needed sponsoring and then requesting a sync and waiting for an archive admin to do it...
<pochu> so better to go for the safe and upload, and later sync :)
<stani> POX_: I will upload all patches for spe as 0.8.4.g to Debian, as for Ubuntu direct patches are prefered to a new upstream release.
<POX_> pochu: I think I uploaded it to Debian before you uploaded it to Ubuntu
<pochu> POX_: really? I didn't notice it then...
<pochu> anyway:
<pochu> Sync request mailed.
<pochu> emilio@saturno:~/tmp$
<POX_> pochu: I tagged it later, so maybe that's why you didn't notice
<pochu> stani: shall I add the patch to python-apps too, or will you do another bug-fix release anytime soon?
<stani> pochu: I can do a bug-fix release anytime, but patches are less work. Maybe in some hours someone else reports another bug and than I have to release every day which doesn't make also a lot of sense.
<stani> so for debian I prefer to collect all patches and do an upstream release
<pochu> stani: sure, I mean in the following days or weeks :)
<stani> pochu: but this release can never be in Hardy, right?
<stani> pochu: I planned to do one for Debian after I can not submit anymore patches for Hardy (which is 10 april?).
<pochu> stani: the FinalFreeze is April 10th yes, but after that we can still upload bug fixes with ~motu-release ACK
<stani> pochu: so to answer your question, no need to apply for debian, as I will then release SPE 0.8.4.g for debian when Hardy is released. (This bug is not critical.)
<stani> POX_: ^^^
<pochu> stani: ok, fine
<stani> POX_: I hope that is ok for you too.
<POX_> did I respond to RFS mail/ping after more than 24h?
<POX_> just release it and I will upload if everything will be ok
<stani> POX_: From now on I will mail RFS directly to you and in cc to PAPT. So I will send you a RFS for SPE 0.8.4.g on april 24. (If more serious bugs would be discovered, it will be more quickly.) As long as the bugs are minor, you can save yourself the hassle from applying the patches.
<POX_> if I'm not on VAC, no need to cc anyone (except pochu :)
<stani> POX_: ok
<sistpoty|work> hi folks
<POX_> stani: I have speciall mailbox for RFS mails (with high priority)
<stani> POX_: do i have to use a specific subject (eg with RFS in it)?
<POX_> so if you use "RFS: spe 1.1.1-1" in Subject, it will end there and will be checked once I get back from work (~18:00 or 19:00 GMT+1)
<stani> POX_: great
<stani> pochu and POX_: python-wxtools was missing as a dependency because of xrced. I have fixed in the control file of PAPT.
<POX_> stani: please document all changes in debian/changelog
<stani> POX_: what do i write instead of unstable when the release is not ready yet?
<POX_> UNRELEASED
<stani> pochu or POX_: Do I still need to mention the LP bugs a release closes in the PAPT changelog, if the bugs have closed already with patches in Ubuntu.
<POX_> if they're closed already, no need to close them again, IMO
<\sh> ROTFLBTC
<\sh> bug #213868 -> read and laugh
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 213868 in wine "Security Warning in Wine" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/213868
<stani> pochu: can you confirm that python-wxtools is added as a dependency for spe (see PAPT control file)?
<jpatrick> \sh: users - the only bug we will never solve indeed
<sistpoty|work> I guess the description of the bug should really be: make wine more safe when browsing ... oh nevermind ;)
<\sh> jpatrick, I'm wondering what I should answer..."don't browse porn" or "well, wine copies windows behaviour, it can't be better then that"? ;)
<jpatrick> \sh: "Can you please link to desired site to enabl us to try to reproduce"
<jpatrick> descrbied*
<jpatrick> damn keybaord..
<broonie> \sh: IE does actually do the sort of popup he's asking for.
<\sh> broonie, the bug is, that he thought he has a video file, which he wanted to show, but the website publisher gave him an .exe file...so imho it's layer 8 bug
<\sh> s/show/watch/
<sistpoty|work> heh, layer 8... nice one :)
<broonie> Like I say, Windows does do those warnings so if you're going to be bug for bug compatible...
<\sh> grmpf...now I understand the bug *harhar*
<\sh> he used firefox on linux..got an .exe instead of avi and voila...wine gets hands on
<\sh> and this bug is known, because we have this mime time attached...and that was something I wanted to stop, but people wanted it like that...
<\sh> linux and wine don't know anything about signed exe files...without wine reimplementing the complete security infrastructure of windows
<\sh> and that's not the intention of wine
<\sh> -EIMHO
<\sh> s/mime time/mime type/
<\sh> well, anyways there is no way to protect someone from him/herself...don't browse malicious porn sites and don't trust publishers should be always top prio on every agenda, regarding daily browser usage
<pochu> stani: python-wxtools -> uploading
<stani> pochu: thanks
<\sh> it's just like: "please prevent me via evolution/kmail/claws/ from clicking unkown attachments or pls prevent me from entereing my secure login data for paypal on phishing sites"...it's impossible to bugfix the human being
<pochu> stani: thanks for spotting it!
<stani> pochu: this is because spe now not provides anymore packages which are available in ubuntu already. So this makes this transition complete.
<broonie> \sh: I suppose it's reasonable to expect that it'd do the same thing as it would with a native executable; I don't know off-hand what Firefox does there.
<\sh> broonie, you see that it wants to use wine for the .exe file extention..it's totally obvious...
<ScottK> \sh: I do think it's reasonable for wine to give you some warning that you are about to transition from the Linux security model to the Windows one.
<\sh> ScottK, which windows security model? there is no such thing in wine afaik
<\sh> ScottK, for this, wine needs more knowledge about the ms security stuff, but that's one step beyond the firefox "run .exe with -> wine"
<elmargol> fta, are you planing to release a new miro version for hary? (I'm looking at your bzr branch atm)
<sistpoty|work> hm... I guess I would make the mime type to run a wine wrapper, which would show a popup first
<\sh> sistpoty|work, how do you determine the correct signature? you need the signature database of MS Windows
<sistpoty|work> \sh: no, it would just show a generic warning, whenever wine would be called from a mime-type
<sistpoty|work> (ideally, only if called from a browser, but I'm not too sure if mime can do that (actually I know almost nothing about mime-types))
<broonie> \sh: Relatively few things delivered this way are actually signed.
<\sh> sistpoty|work, well, depends on what firefox is useing...the mime type of wine.desktop or the binfmt we provide
<stani> pochu: would for python-wxtools not better be part of recommends (I think only a small minority uses xrced)
<\sh> sistpoty|work, changing wine.desktop is easy to call a gtk-wrapper and after that call wine
<\sh> sistpoty|work, but, then you have two dialogs: firefox -> run dlg via wine , wine-wrapper-dlg -> the real wine call
<\sh> broonie, most of the serious software vendors are using installation methods with signatures from verisign which are known by windows systems...(installshield, msi etc.)
<sistpoty|work> \sh: oh, ff displays a dialog for wine already? If so, I guess this is merely a wishlist bug, which won't get fixed soonish ;)
<pochu> stani: if I don't have python-wxtools and try to use xrced, what will happen?
<\sh> sistpoty|work, firefox asks you normally, when you click on something which is determined as run by wine, how you wanna run it, and if
<sistpoty|work> ah
<\sh> broonie, the problem with this, you can deliver to debian/ubuntu as well. Think about a malicious debian package, which is provided from untrusted source site publisher...you click on it, because _you_ trust this publisher, gedebi starts and asks you again, and you tell gedebi to install it, enter your sudo pw....and voila..your system is now known as spambot99.0
<\sh> broonie, it's really layer 8 or if you bugged by this before, I would say, it's also layer 9 (brain bug)
<ScottK> \sh: All I really meant is if wine comes into play on a Linux host, then the user ought to be aware of it.  I don't think it should appear silently.
<mok0> I am looking at the FTBFS of apt-howto. There are several problems with the package, one being that the build fails on a korean and russian language components. Is it in your opinion ok to leave those out?
<\sh> ScottK, it doesn't :) you can read the dialog box...and it asks you if you want it to run with -> <insert app here>...and yes, we should protect people from commiting suicide..
<ScottK> \sh: OK.  Just wanted to make it clear that was needed.
<stani> can you not configure firefox so that it does never executes exe with wine, but just downloads it?
 * broonie nods ScottK - it's surprising that a Windows executable will run on Linux. The "Run this app" prompt isn't so useful since it comes up all the time even when it's not so useful.
<ScottK> mok0: At this point building is better than not building.  Ideally you'd fix the problem with the languages, but in the end they may have to be sacrificed.
<\sh> stani, you can stop firefox from using the provided mime type...
<mok0> ScottK: I think so too, just checking, bein' new and all
<ScottK> broonie: I agree, but something is better than nothing.
<stani> \sh: maybe that would be good default setup for ubuntu
<\sh> stani, but this doesn't prevent people from downloading it and starting it via console or nautilus or whatever filemanager you have
<ScottK> mok0: Agreed.  It's better to check.
<stani> \sh: but at least they won't think anymore it is some video
<stani> \sh: part of the trick is that they present an executable as a video
<stani> \sh: forbidding to download any exe would probably a step too far
<mok0> ScottK: I'll upload the package and file a new bug against it, then
<\sh> stani, no..then it would never been run as wine app...wine.binfmt checks for MZ header...and mime-type checks for .exe extention...so .exe was provided..and not .avi or whatever video extention
<ScottK> Sounds quite reasonable.
<\sh> stani, that's why ff gave the wine app as runnable helper app
<stani> \sh: what is a MZ header?
<\sh> stani: it's the stub header for .exe files from microsoft since DOS 1.0 i think
<broonie> stani: Header identifying an .exe
<stani> ok
<stani> you can never prevent that a user clicks on a virus exe (if he gets it from www, usb-stick, ..) but you can prevent firefox to execute them directly
<pochu> stani: did you see my question above?
<\sh> stani, yes, don't tell firefox to drop the "run <foo> as <bar>" dialog, because "User too lazy error"
<stani> pochu: I will look into it.
<\sh> stani, you can never prevent a user from doing stupid things...never and wine will run what user tells it to run...even viruses..that's a non bug^Wfeature of wine...
<\sh> s/non/known/
<stani> \sh: I think we agree on this
<pochu> stani: if it simply shows a dialog saying "you need foo to use this plugin" we could (and should) lower every hard dependency (kiki, winpdb...) to Recommends... if it breaks, then we need to keep it as hard dependencies
<ScottK> pochu: But not two weeks before we release.
<\sh> guys, when a perl package is named: "Foo::Perl" the correct debian name of that package would be "libfoo-perl-perl" right?
<ScottK> I think so.
 * stani is looking into the xrced issue and needs a bit more time
<\sh> well, regarding the naming policy for perl module packages it is like that, even when it sounds stupid
<pochu> ScottK: not changing how upstream behaves, agreed. But if upstream code already shows the dialog, it's safe to lower it to Recommends
<pochu> although I'm ok to postpone this to Intrepid
<ScottK> pochu: At this point we should just be fixing critical stuff.
<pochu> ScottK: hmm, you're right :)
<ScottK> I don't think dropping depends to recommends qualifies.
<stani> pochu: it will fail with an import exception, so leave it like it as it is
<pochu> stani: for your next major release, making plugins optional (show a dialog if they aren't present and don't crash) would be nice
<stani> pochu: good idea
<stani> pochu: I feel this applies the most to python-wxtools because it installs a whole bunch of other stuff which is not relevant to spe.
<stani> pochu: the other plugins only install themselves
<ScottK> pochu: From reading the bug, I'm not sure I understand your objection to the alexandria upgrade?
<slytherin> Not exactly related to Ubuntu, but can anyone please tell me how does one usually proceed for creating a package from the code in svn?
<pochu> ScottK: it needs the diff.gz to have postinst/preinst/prerm, which are autogenerated by debhelper, and will FTBFS if they aren't present. Also I don't like the fact that the upstream installation script (whatever it's called for Ruby packages) installs the debian/ files
<pochu> ScottK: that may be ok and it's just me not understanding it though
<ScottK> pochu: Since they host on Launchpad their upstream build system is excessively Debian centric.
<ScottK> pochu: I read your comment as saying you didn't like the fact that postinst/preinst/prerm were present.
<ScottK> Thanks for clarifying.
<mok0> ScottK: I am puzzled. apt-howto_2.0.2-2 fails to build, yet the binary packages are in the hardy archives. How can that be?
<ScottK> Maybe the build system changed in a way that breaks it since it was built.
<mok0> ScottK: If I upload then, it means we will loose some language components that are there now
<ScottK> So maybe leave it be.
<mok0> ScottK: The package is in a state of shambles. There are outstanding bugs in Debian that are up to 2 years old
<mok0> ScottK: yeah, I think I will leave it
<ScottK> I'd suggest then that you leave it and move on.  There are plenty of other things to work on.
<ScottK> Yes
<mok0> Good
<ScottK> At this point if you have to think about what to do for more than a few minutes, move on and find something else to fix that's easier.
<pochu> stani: re PPA, sure, what about in 1 hour or so? it will be fast
<stani> perfect
<stani> pochu: haha, I didn't know you were a gstreamer gure
<stani> guru
<pochu> stani: I'm not, I'm just a stroller :)
<arvind_khadri> hi,i am interested to join MOTU,how do i go about it
<pochu> stani: i wish I was ;)
<stani> pochu: I started diving into it and wow it is so powerful. I will do great things with this.
<stani> pochu: only documentation sucks
<pochu> welcome arvind_khadri :) the /topic has a few useful links, specially Contributing... go and check them out, and ask if you any questions
<pochu> arvind_khadri: this one is likely the best: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/GettingStarted
<arvind_khadri> pochu, how do i go there?? :) am new here
<arvind_khadri> pochu, i meant to /topic
<stani> arvind_khadri: /topic is displayed on top of the chat
<arvind_khadri> pochu, hey thanks for tat
<pochu> arvind_khadri: it depends on your IRC client, but it's likely in the top of the window as stani said
<pochu> that's this channel's topic (subject?)
<stani> arvind_khadri: after reading the wiki, you probably can help a lot by fixing bugs you are able to do
<ScottK> stani: Earlier you mentioned you would be willing to look at wx related bugs.  Would Bug 213589 be something you could look into.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 213589 in drpython "drpython crashed with SIGSEGV in wxWindow::OnInternalIdle()" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/213589
<stani> ScottK: no problem, I' ll have a look
<mok0> Is there a script to get the newest version of some source package from Debian? It's a nuisance to have to go the packages webpage all the time
<ScottK> Add an unstable deb-src line to your sources.list and apt-get source?
<mok0> ScottK: I use apt-get source to fetch the newest hardy version, so wont that function be disrupted?
<ScottK> Yes.  It would.
<ScottK> The rc bugs page has the .dsc links if that's what you're working off of.
<mok0> ScottK: unless you could run apt-get with an alternate database
<ScottK> You can dget -x with that.
<mok0> ScottK: right, good idea
<Adri2000> mok0: apt-get source chooses the newest version. if you want a specific version use apt-get source <package>=<version>
<mok0> Adri2000: yes, but then I
<ScottK> I think it does, anyway.
<mok0> I'd have to look up what version I want
<Adri2000> apt-cache madison <package>
<mok0> Adri2000: Ah, cool
<stani> ScottK: There is something totally wrong with drpython. It can not open any file.
<ScottK> stani: I guess the next step would be to look to Debian to see if they have one that works better.
<stani> ScottK: I was checking upstream.
<ScottK> That's broken too?
<stani> ScottK: I know the developpers.
<ScottK> I see.
<ScottK> Great.
<stani> ScottK: I will check that now.
<ScottK> Then I guess I asked the right person to look into it.  Thanks for doing it.
<stani> ScottK: I started some years ago pyxides, which unites all python IDE developers. So we all know each other.
<ScottK> Cool.
<sistpoty|work> mok0: you can use apt-get -t<distribution>
<mok0> sistpoty|work: ... with the unstable repo defined in sources.list , I presume?
<sistpoty|work> mok0: yes (haven't tested it yet though)
<munckfish> Hi, I'm updating ps3-kboot package which is in main. I've read up on Sponsorship and Revu, I believe this would be a sponsored change. But ...
<munckfish> I'm confused as to how/where I should upload the updated source - the new orig.tar.gz 100MB, is a debdiff suitable here? Should I upload by attaching to the related LP issue?
<munckfish> This is re LP 146230
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 146230 in ps3-kboot "update ps3-kboot to 1.4.1" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/146230
<stani> ScottK: there is a newer Debian package, but it doesn't seem it will fix the bug as it looks like only improving packaging: http://packages.debian.org/changelogs/pool/main/d/drpython/drpython_165-6/changelog
<Hobbsee> cody-somerville: ping?
<cody-somerville> Hobbsee, pong
<stani> ScottK: There was a new upstream release Drpython, in which they changed the version numbering: http://sourceforge.net/forum/forum.php?forum_id=790209
<Hobbsee> cody-somerville: /query?
<cody-somerville> Hobbsee, Ack.
<stani> ScottK: I'll see if that one works.
<ScottK2> OK.
<stani> ScottK2: This one seems to work. Now I should see if I can reproduce the bug, as it is not straightforward.
<ScottK2> OK.
<stani> The problem with launchpad bugs is that upstream developers don't look there and that bugs just get dust like what happened with spe. (Unless sourceforge and launchpad are linked.)
<ScottK2> Hobbsee: It looks like the drpython package we have is totally broken.  If stani finds the new upstream makes it work, can we upgrade (please pre-ack the FFe for me)?
<ScottK2> stani: Yes.  People need to push the bugs upstream.
<Hobbsee> ScottK2: fine by me.  broken == useless
<ScottK2> Hobbsee: Thanks.
<stani> ScottK2: I noticed that the current package in Hardy forces python-wxgtk2.6, while the new one selects 2.8
<stani> ScottK2: Moreover the new release has two starters: a normal one and one specific for wx2.6
<stani> I guess that debian forces 2.6 as debian does not provide 2.8
<sistpoty|work> munckfish: I guess the easiest way is to upload to revu
<ScottK2> stani: Makes sense.  I wonder if the current one works with 2.8
<munckfish> sistpoty|work: ok, thx for the advice
<stani> ScottK: Would you prefer a patch to the current one?
<sistpoty|work> munckfish: if you've got a link for the new orig.tar.gz coming from upstream, I can put this in revu's incoming, so you'd only have to upload the diff.gz, .dsc and as last one the .changes file
<ScottK2> stani: Yes.  If there's a short path to getting the current one working, that's preferred.
<munckfish> sistpoty|work: ok, well
<munckfish> so I couldn't upload all myself?
<munckfish> sorry, I'm new to all this, just finding my feet, skin o my teeth style
<sistpoty|work> munckfish: of course you can, I just thought the 100Mb size would be a problem
<munckfish> No, I just didn't want to bung up LP unnecessarily if that wasn't the right place to upload to
<sistpoty|work> heh, k
<munckfish> though, yes, I'm sure 100MB is nothing
<sistpoty|work> apart from that it takes time to upload, size shouldn't be a problem ;)
<munckfish> sistpoty|work: I'll take a better look at Revu then, I thought it was just for brand new packages
<sistpoty|work> munckfish: basically it is, but since it was requested that you put the package somewhere, feel free to use revu for this (of course ppa would be another option)
<munckfish> ah
<munckfish> PPA, yes, although I think because it's powerpc arch I think it wouldn't work
<munckfish> that's what I heard
<sistpoty|work> well, it wouldn't build binary packages, but it should still list the source... not too sure though
<sistpoty|work> (the only thing that's needed for the archive is a source package)(
<munckfish> ok well, that's given me some options.
<munckfish> I'll check out both and pick one tonight
<munckfish> sistpoty|work: thx!
<mok0> ScottK: I finally got through tex4ht, bug 131239
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 131239 in tex4ht "sync request" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/131239
<sistpoty|work> np
<mok0> ScottK: it needs a good look by the m-r team
<sistpoty|work> mok0: did you test the package? can you give a summary of how you tested in the bug? thanks!
<mok0> sistpoty|work: I have not tested it; I need to find something to test it on.
<sistpoty|work> mok0: then please do ;)
<mok0> sistpoty|work: rrrright... :-)
<ScottK2> mok0: Looks generally desirable, but we ought to have some testing.
<sistpoty|work> heh
<mok0> sistpoty|work, ScottK, can you guys see what the bug IS?
<mok0> It just looks like a wish for a general update of the package
<mok0> But I can go & check the BTS bug numbers
<stani> ScottK: I can confirm that drpython doesn't work with 2.6, with 2.8 it opens a file but throws an IndexError and the cursor keeps in the busy state, making drpython unusable.
<ScottK2> stani: OK.  How's the new version look?
<stani> ScottK: This might be a packaging bug. drpython.py is moved from its folder to /usr/bin, while drpython expects it to be in /usr/share/drpython together with the other source file.
<stani> I guess Luca never tried to open a file on debian.
<stani> Do you want me to try to move drpython.py back to /usr/share
<stani> well with the new version everything is in the same dir as it is a zip file
<stani> I am afraid if it is packaged in the same way (drpython.py in /usr/bin) it will also not work.
<ScottK2> stani: OK.  Do you think you know enough about debian packaging to fix it?
<stani> ScottK2: I first will test if that helps, but no unfortunately I do not know enough.
<stani> about packaging
<ScottK2> stani: OK.  If you can test if it helps, then we can maybe get someone else to package it.
<mok0> ScottK: tex4ht testing complete, bug 131239
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 131239 in tex4ht "sync request" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/131239
<RainCT> heya
<mok0> sistpoty|work: ^
<ScottK2> mok0: Ack'ed
 * ScottK2 waits for qt3 to build ....
<Iulian> Hello RainCT
<mok0> ScottK: OK, I leave tex4ht for now then, hoping for another ack
<sistpoty|work> mok0: does it also produce html files?
<mok0> sistpoty|work: yes
<sistpoty|work> mok0: great!
<sistpoty|work> hm... there is s.th. weird... both texlive (main) and texlive-full (universe) seem to build a texlive binary
<sistpoty|work> erm... texlive-base (main) even
<stani> ScottK: What I suggested didn't work. The only option is to package the new version http://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php?group_id=83074.
<sistpoty|work> mok0: confirmed
<stani> ScottK: About the bug in launchpad, I think that it should be reported to the upstream developers. I am not able to reproduce it, but I wouldn't say it is fixed.
<mok0> sistpoty|work: do you want me to upload to LP an html file ?
<sistpoty|work> mok0: no, I pretty much believe you that it works ;)
<mok0> ;-) heh
<stani> ScottK: Shall I send an email to the upstream developers about this bug?
<sistpoty|work> mok0: please go ahead with it
<mok0> sistpoty|work: great, thanks
<sistpoty|work> mok0: thanks for taking care ;)
<mok0> sistpoty|work: sure thing
<mok0> sistpoty|work: u-a-a are already subscribed, so that it, yes?
<DktrKranz2> stani: any issues with drpython? I'm working on new upstream (to be pushed in experimental, due to wxwidgets2.8).
<sistpoty|work> mok0: it's already in the right form for a sync? then yes, that's it
<stani> DktrKranz2: Are you Luka?
<DktrKranz2> stani: yes
<mok0> sistpoty|work: I can add a link to the debian package, and recap in a last comment
<stani> DktrKranz2: The current version in ubuntu 165-5 is not able to open files. Not at all with wx2.6, but also not with wx2.8 throws an IndexError and keeps with a busy cursor
<sistpoty|work> mok0: I guess testing/<component> should be good enough for a source. feel free to recap, if you think it makes it more clear
<mok0> sistpoty|work: I do, otherwise they have to scan the whole discussion
<sistpoty|work> right :)
<stani> DktrKranz2: I was wondering why you were moving /usr/share/drpython to /usr/bin/drpython?
<stani> why not just a start file with "python /usr/share/drpython/drpython.py"
<mok0> sistpoty|work: I guess they have a automation script to get it going, so there is no need to paste a link there, or what?
<stani> or "python /usr/share/drpython/drpython_wx26.py" for debian?
<DktrKranz2> stani: something from the past, I suppose. I don't recall move something to usr/bin
<sistpoty|work> mok0: not too sure, but I believe so
<mok0> another one bites the dust
<mok0> :)
<stani> DktrKranz2: ok, I would propose my suggestion as otherwise it makes it more easy for when 2.6 and 2.8 both available (on experimental and ubuntu)
<DktrKranz2> stani: btw, I have new upstream almost ready, I need to check it on debian with experimental enabled and then ask my sponsor to review and upload to exp, but I think your idea is good.
<DktrKranz2> so I'll probably have something similar in next upload
<stani> DktrKranz2: I am testing if I manage the latest drpython to work with 2.6
<DktrKranz2> stani: I haven't checked deeply, but I guess you can lower required version, since there weren't intrusive changes, IIRC
<DktrKranz2> if so, I can patch it and go to unstable, but that requires more testing
<pochu> lool: wesnoth 1.4.1 is out, and Rhonda (the Debian maintainer) is working on the update, which will bring some improvements on wesnoth-tools too (a new binary added at the same time as wesnoth-smallgui). I'll for it and then request a sync.
<stani> DktrKranz2: No, I just checked. It doesn't work. Probably it would be possible, this would mean refactoring the code.
<DktrKranz2> ah, what a pity :(
<ScottK2> DktrKranz2: Since stani isn't a motu, would you please help him get a fix uploaded to Ubuntu without a new upstream (if feasible)?
<stani> ScottK2: It is not possible
<ScottK2> Ah
<stani> ScottK2: I tried several things, and it didn't work
 * mok0 wishes there was a 1-a-day group he could joint...
<mok0> s/t//
<stani> ScottK2: New upstream release is necessary. New upstream release is of 28/2/2008 and previous one is from 07/04/2007
<DktrKranz2> I guess having new upstream (if working properly) won't be too difficult
<ScottK2> OK
<stani> ScottK2: so a lot of bugs will be fixed
<stani> I hope. I know that the main developer quit the project and that someone else is working on it, but mostly fixing bugs.
<DktrKranz2> Yes, it's hard to push back patches :(
<DktrKranz2> new drpython has eight or nine, almost all suitable for upstream inclusion
<stani> DktrKranz2: Please test if you can open a file and maybe you can reproduce the bug #213589
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 213589 in drpython "drpython crashed with SIGSEGV in wxWindow::OnInternalIdle()" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/213589
<DktrKranz2> stani: I'm at work on Windows ATM, I'll check tomorrow evening since I won't be at home tonight
<stani> ScottK: Is there any other python-wxgtk bug?
<ScottK2> Not that I've noticed recently.
<DktrKranz2> stani: have you the chance to test it on debian too?
<stani> DktrKranz2: No, sorry, I don't have a debian machine (yet?)
<DktrKranz2> no problem, I have one at home, it just needs to be updated a bit
<DktrKranz2> (and I really have to push my packages on PAPT!)
<ScottK2> DktrKranz2: Yes.  Please do.
<stani> ScottK: Would it be ok to leave a comment on the launchpad bug to report it on http://sourceforge.net/tracker/?group_id=83074&atid=568238
<ScottK2> DktrKranz2: I'd prefer if you'd upload the new upstream straight to Ubuntu.
<ScottK2> stani: Yes
<stani> ScottK2: Unless POX is the uploader ;-)
<ScottK2> DktrKranz2: Hobbsee already gave an IRC ack.  I'll give you one too.  Just please respond in the bug explaining why it's a new upstream and test it first.
<ScottK2> stani: At this point I'm worried if sync's will get processed.
<ScottK2> There's no guarantee.
<sebner> RainCT: mok0: who is faster ^^
<mok0> When fixing bugs, is it ok to let the patch go in diff.gz, or should I do it properly via debian/patches, quilt etc.
<mok0> sebner: ?
<sebner> mok0: festival
 * mok0 looks
<sebner> mok0: install all build-deps of festival ;) then it's working ^^
<ScottK> mok0: Ideally you'd do it properly.  At this point if the package doesn't already have a patch system, you shouldn't feel obligated to add it for minor patches.
<DktrKranz2> ScottK: ok then. I'll do some tests on Hardy and eventually update bug report accordingly. Once ready, I'll inform you before uploading it.
<mok0> ScottK: it's a patch attached to a bug
<mok0> sebner: I tried building it in sbuild
<ScottK> mok0: OK.  Use your best judgement about adding a patch system.  We aren't as pedantic about it as Debian.  It's particularly OK not to add the patch system if you know we'll drop the change in the next release.
<DktrKranz2> stani: if you want, I can upload it to PPA soon, just to have a wider testing.
<mok0> ScottK: yeah that's my thought too
<sebner> mok0: ? I got the same error while doing debuild ... Then I did a sudo apt-get build-dep festival and it was working + pbuilder build
<sebner> mok0: but it doesn't matter. RainCT is originally on it
<stani> DktrKranz2: That would be good. Did you notice this: http://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=1903248&group_id=83074&atid=568238?
<ubotu> Sourceforge bug 1903248 "Possible Bug in 3.11.0" [Pri: 5,Open]
<mok0> sebner: of course it works when it's already installed
<mok0> sebner: because the build requires it :-)
<mok0> sebner: so, you could make it build-depends on itself, but that seems pretty dirty to me
<sebner> ^^
<DktrKranz2> stani: I'll have a look. thanks.
<sebner> mok0: RainCT already looked at it. Maybe we should wait on his opinion
<mok0> sebner: I'll put my thought in another comment
<sebner> mok0: k :)
 * DktrKranz2 leaves
<sebner> DktrKranz2: hf
<mok0> sebner: there. :-)
<ScottK> mok0: Did you ever reach any conclusion about atlas support for python-scipy (or was it numpy)?
<mok0> ScottK: no, I forgot about that one
<mok0> it was scipy AIR
<ScottK> Someone might want to look into seeing if we need to fix Debian Bug #475017
<ubotu> Debian bug 475017 in python-numpy "python-numpy: missing parentheses in /usr/share/pyshared/numpy/f2py/rules.py line 1222 (fixed upstream)" [Normal,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/475017
<ScottK> That looks like an easy one to fix.
<sebner> mok0: :) but I don't want to stop you working on my other bugs ^^
<mok0> sebner: hit me
<RainCT> sebner: still want me to sponsor festival or has mok0 already uploaded it?
<mok0> RainCT: festival has problems
<stani> DktrKranz2: You need to fix this, you have to replace c:/dpython.out to ~/.drpython/drpython.out
<sebner> RainCT: see his comments ;)
<sebner> RainCT: heya btw :)
<RainCT> mok0: which?
<ScottK> mok0: Did you really need a sync from Testing for Bug 131239 or can it be from Unstable?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 131239 in tex4ht "sync request" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/131239
<mok0> ScottK: testing, unstable has unsatisfied build-depends
<ScottK> OK.  Thanks.
<sebner> ScottK: the fix in only to change one line in rules.py? for python-numpy?
<sebner> *is
<ScottK> sebner: From reading the bug it looked like a one line fix.  I haven't looked at the code.
<mok0> sebner, looks like it, there's even a patch
<sebner> ScottK: I'll take a look at it. But should't be necessary to create/use patch for it? (patch-system)
<ScottK> No
<mok0> sebner: we just discussed it before. With such a minor change it is ok to leave it in diff.gz
<sebner> mok0: ah
<mok0> sebner: you may leave a comment in changelog to that effect
<sebner> mok0: yeah. clear ^^
<mok0> ok sebner, hit me with a bug #
<sebner> mok0: for python-numpy?
<mok0> sebner: one of the ones you've tiraged, preferrably a sync :-)
<mok0> I need one more bug for my quota
<sebner> mok0: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/~sebner  . 8 to do :P
<mok0> Ah, I get to choose! What luxury
<sebner> mok0: you can't choose if you review all of them ^^
<mok0> sebner: whoa there, I have a life
<sebner> hrhr
<ScottK> jdong and/or \sh: wine backport FTBFS on Gutsy.  I'd appreciate it if one of you could have a look.
<\sh> ScottK, buildlog? :)
<ScottK> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/13223894/buildlog_ubuntu-gutsy-amd64.wine_0.9.58-0ubuntu3%7Egutsy1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<ScottK> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/wine/0.9.58-0ubuntu3~gutsy1
<\sh> yepp
<\sh> gutsy still have libungif right?
<mok0> sebner: /me is going to stay off mailscanner :-)
<sebner> mok0: well that's a FFe ;) and ScottK dislikes it ^^
<mok0> sebner: so I see
<mok0> sebner: I think he's right.
<ScottK> Broken by design with Postfix and their dev's call it political.
<ScottK> Using published interfaces is a very basic concept and they don't get it.
<sebner> mok0: btw, if you keep reviewing my stuff you could be say something about me as a sponsor in future :)
<mok0> ScottK: should it be removed ?
<\sh> grmpf..packages.ubuntu.com is down :(
<ScottK> mok0: No.  It works well with other MTAs that provide an interface that's appropriate.
<ScottK> mok0: lamont and I have discussed making it conflict with postfix, but he wanted to discuss that with the mailscanner maintainer in Debian first.
<mok0> ScottK: I was just thinking that, but wouldn't it be an abuse of that tag?
<RainCT> mok0: http://packages.debian.org/search?searchon=contents&keywords=install.mak&mode=path&suite=stable&arch=any
<ScottK> Probably.
<RainCT> mok0: it doesn't build-depend on itself, but on libestools1.2-dev
<mok0> RainCT: ah I stand corrected
<sebner> RainCT: I already told him to install de build-deps ^^ maybe he missunderstood ^^
<sebner> *the
<mok0> RainCT: but the build-deps should be installed automatically by sbuild
<mok0> sebner: ^
<\sh> ScottK, https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/gutsy/amd64/libgif-dev/4.1.4-2 <- but it's not in the archive -> http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/main/g/giflib/+
<ScottK2> Hmmm
<\sh> damn
<\sh> two versions
<\sh> one in main
<\sh> one in universe for gutsy
<mok0> RainCT: will you fix festival then?
<\sh> and I think that fails now
<\sh> http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/universe/g/giflib/
<ScottK2> That's not good.
<\sh> that -EDAMNCRAP
<ScottK2> How to fix?
<\sh> it should find the build-dep
<ScottK2> We can get a give-back via DRU.
<ScottK2> DRU/SRU
<Hobbsee> dru?
<Hobbsee> ah
<\sh> because the package is already there
<ScottK2> Can't type
<RainCT> mok0: I'm trying if it works with pbuilder..
<ScottK2> Ah.
<Hobbsee> do you need a sru for a giveback?
<mok0> RainCT: cool
<\sh> ScottK, is it building in your pbuilder ?
<ScottK2> I did, after release.
<ScottK2> \sh: I didn't check it, jdong did.
<Hobbsee> bah.
<sebner> RainCT: mok0: I'm always test building and it worked :)
<\sh> jdong, did it build in your pbuilder?
<\sh> or sbuild?
<mbt> Does anyone know if it is possible to get gdb to log each line of code as it executes when controlling a program?  I am trying to debug an interaction between two patches in a package and I am coming up needing more help from the debugger in doing so.
<mok0> sebner: but did you use a pbuilder?
<sebner> mok0: yep
<mok0> sebner: weird
<sebner> mok0: dunno. But you can be sure that I'm test-building *everything*. Also the syncs that you are ACKing ;)
<mok0> sebner: you said something about having to install festival first
<sebner> mok0: the build-deps of festival
<sebner> mok0: for debuild
<mok0> sebner: and why should I do that? sbuild handles it
<sistpoty|work> mbt: not too sure, but you could set breakpoints and single-step then
<sebner> sistpoty|work: heya :D
<sistpoty|work> hi sebner
<sebner> mok0: good question ^^
<\sh> ScottK, it FTBFS because of the very same issue on my sbuild
<mok0> sebner: there must be a missing build-dep
<mbt> yeah, i basically need to get an overview of what's going on.  I am working with some breakpoints, but it seems that doing that changes the behavior of the app too lol
<ScottK2> \sh: I'm trying it now on my i386.
<\sh> ScottK, sbuild says it doesn't work...pls try a pbuilder ;)
<sebner> mok0: we'll se
<sebner> e
<mok0> sebner: yup
<ScottK2> \sh: I'm using pbuilder
<\sh> ScottK, good :)
<\sh> ScottK, and afaics it should work...if not we have a serious problem with our archives
<\sh> ScottK, regarding https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/giflib/ it should just work
<ScottK2> On i386 in pbuilder it found all the deps and is building
<mok0> sebner: /me grabs mindi
<\sh> ScottK, it found libungif I think
<\sh> not libgif
 * ScottK2 looks
<\sh> when pbuilder didn't fix the build-dep "or" reading from left to right...pbuilder was known to read from right to left
<sebner> mok0: :). it's just funny that cesare always adds comments but is not doing the review  ^^
<ScottK2> That part had already scrolled out of the backscroll, so I'll do it again.
<mok0> sebner: he's the big man
<mok0> :)
<\sh> ScottK, create a log file .)
<sebner> hrhr
<ScottK2> that would have been the smart thing to do.
<\sh> ScottK, sbuild does it automatically send it to my inbox ;)
<ScottK2> \sh: libgif-dev libgif4
<\sh> ScottK, check your apt cache dir for the package and move it out of the way...
<\sh> ScottK, my sbuild uses for gutsy clean archive.ubuntu.com Packages files...so it gets it directly from the server and if sbuild doesn't work...we are in trouble
<ScottK2> Yeah.
<ScottK2> Trying again
<bdmurray> Is there were I would poke somebody for sponsorship of a package update?
<\sh> ok.../me comes back a bit later...meeting
<sistpoty|work> bdmurray: either ask here, or subscribe ubuntu-universe-sponsors for universe/multiverse to a bug (or do both ;))
<ScottK2> \sh: Yep.  It's different libungif4-dev libungif4g
<sistpoty|work> (bug with a debdiff)
<ScottK2> \sh: But it's still building
<bdmurray> I've subscribed the sponsors to bug 204457 and it has a debdiff.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 204457 in bughelper "no longer respects dontlist in info files" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/204457
<bdmurray> Its the Bug Helper project that has the fix not Hardy yet.
<RainCT> mok0, sebner: builds fine with pbuilder
<mok0> RainCT: did you make any changes to it?
<RainCT> mok0: no
<mok0> weird
<RainCT> mok0: which is indeed weird is that you need to have package libestools1.2-dev installed in order to be able to debuild the package (to get the new .dsc/.diff.gz)
<RainCT> mok0: but if also seen this with some other packages before so I'm not sure if that's OK or not..
<ScottK2> It's evil, but sometimes done to build-dep on yourself.
<mok0> RainCT: it is evil
<ScottK2> screenlets is another example.
<sistpoty|work> RainCT: as long as it is in the build-deps, it's ok
<RainCT> btw, is there some page that explains what exactly "debuild -S" does?
<ScottK2> RainCT: It's dpkg-buildpackage -S + lintian + debsign
<ScottK2> Technically it's not actually +debsign because it's got it's own, different, implementation IIRC, but that's the effect.
<RainCT> new question, what does "dpkg-buildpackage -S" do? (internally, not what it is for) :P
<ScottK> Makes the source package (creates .diff.gz, .dsc, .changes, etc.).  I think there's a man page with details.
<sistpoty|work> basically it's a wrapper around dpkg-source
<sistpoty|work> running debian/rules clean beforehand
<sistpoty|work> and setting a few options
<RainCT> ScottK, sistpoty|work: Thanks :). I was just wondering if it does something strange beside "debian/rules clean" and comparing the files to the orig.tar.gz
<sistpoty|work> RainCT: none that I know of, but I'm not too good at reading perl :P
<sistpoty|work> zul: did you test the new iscsitarget yet?
<zul> sistpoty|work: no I dont have the hardware
<sistpoty|work> hm... meh
<ScottK> zul: You going to make soren test it then?
<ScottK> I thought he was Mr. Iscsi.
<zul> ScottK: if he had the hardware handy where he was at the momment then sure
<\sh> ScottK, yes...the wonder of pbuilder and reading build-deps the other way around ;)
<zul> ScottK: there shouldnt be any regressions it mostly so users can use it on hardy
<_ruben> if only i had my iscsi up and runnning yet, would've loved to lend a helping hand
<\sh> ScottK, actually we have a problem with sbuild and/or our archives for gutsy...I had this issue with a package in dapper
<RainCT> Err http://ftp.uni-muenster.de hardy/universe totem-xine 2.22.0-0ubuntu3 403 Forbidden
<zul> ScottK: besides we use open-iscsi rather then iscsitarget
<RainCT> is this "normal" or is it some problem with the mirror?
<_ruben> zul: erm .. one's an initiator and the other a target
<\sh> RainCT, do you get the package from archive.ubuntu.com?
<RainCT> \sh: haven't tried, I'm using http://ftp.uni-muenster.de as mirror
<ScottK> zul: OK.  Please find a guinea pig to test it.
<_ruben> btw .. iscsitarget doesnt require any special hardware
<\sh> RainCT, try the archive.ubuntu.com...it could be a simple out of sync right now
<RainCT> \sh: I can just get it from the website (http://archive.ubuntu.com/...), or?
<_ruben> iscsitarget is what makes your hardware special so to speak
<\sh> RainCT, yepp
<RainCT> \sh: that works, thanks
<RainCT> sebner, mok0: festival uploaded, let's see if it works :)
<\sh> RainCT, kick muenster mirror ftp admin ;)
<sebner> RainCT: hrhr. I hope. well I haven't had any problems with it. thx btw :)
<\sh> RainCT, and why the hell are you using a ost-westfalen-lippe server? ,-)
<RainCT> \sh: lol. dunno, I used that "autodetect the fastest server" thing
<\sh> RainCT, hmm? where are you now?
<RainCT> \sh: that's in System -> Administration -> Software Sources
<RainCT> iirc
<RainCT> \sh: yes, "download from: [another...]",  "choose the best server"
<mok0> hmm I just uploaded htmlgen wtf happened to it?
<mok0> Ah, it's in main :-(
<afflux> morning
<sebner> afflux: morning? damn you! :D :D :D :P
<afflux> yeah, right. My day started ~11h ago ;)
<sebner> afflux: hrhr
<sebner> mok0: any complains? I don't want to stop RainCT uploading festival
<mok0> sebner: no no
<sebner> mok0: good boy :P
<sebner> RainCT: go go go :)
<mok0> sebner: I was happy to get that stupid package off my hands ;-P
<sebner> mok0: hrhr. maybe you should remaing with syncs? ^^
<mok0> sebner: don't push your luck
<mok0> :-P
<\sh> ScottK, see #ubuntu-devel :)
<sebner> mok0: ^^. would maybe be good if you also look at my merges to be a *real* sponsor though
<mok0> sebner: Good idea
<mok0> For some reason, I end up doing merges for main
<mok0> sebner: which is less fun
<sebner> mok0: why?
<mok0> sebner: because I don't get to upload :-P
<sebner> mok0: lol. ^^ IIRC I never did a main merge yet. hmm
<\sh> RainCT, no I meant where are you living now? if it's not germany, it's strange ;)
<sebner> \sh: Catalonia alias Spain xD
<\sh> sebner, so it's very strange...;)
<sebner> \sh: btw, any progress on wine 0.59? Yesterday I talked to Scott. Means to have regressions and other crap
<\sh> sebner, yepp...I discussed this with scott...there are some things which are not ok...e.g. systray
<\sh> sebner, we have to check if it's possible to repair this again for 0.9.59..
<sebner> \sh: ah yep. What do you thing. hardcore fixing or 0.58?
<\sh> sebner, wine is not as easy as it seems...it's scott decision now, but my feeling says: if we can't fix those nasty buggers which worked before, stay with 0.9.58
<\sh> and provide 0.9.59 via backports (or any later version)
<sebner> \sh: seems to be the best then
<\sh> but that's only my feeling because I had the very same decision in the past with amarok....and amarok was main ;)
<sebner> \sh: amarok rocks ^^
<\sh> not if you had a new upstream version 2 days before final ubuntu release ;)
<sebner> \sh: btw. a stupid question. yes we have scott. but why we never took the packages from debian?
<sebner> \sh: lol. it's clear that that couldn't work ^^
<\sh> sebner, nope..during breezy Mark wanted to get scotts packages...and he wanted scott to be the one...so I was the one who catched scott packages and prepared them for breezy
<sebner> \sh: any reason for that decision?
<megabyte405> hey, is anyone here following the abiword 2.6 progress?  I'm Ryan Pavlik, the packager
<emgent> heya
<sebner> megabyte405: slangasek I think
<\sh> sebner, dunno...debians packages are very complicated regarding the packages they provide...scotts packages were easy and well known in the wine debian community (as third party)...and actually da sabdfl wanted them, he got them :) and I'm happy with this decision
<sebner> \sh: yes sure. just wanted to know :)
<megabyte405> ok - well, just wondering, in the 2.6 series libwv (our library for reading word files) stopped being included in the main source tarball (the old source tarball being a big ol' conglomeration of things).  Unfortunately, Ubuntu has libwv-1.2 (the version we need) in Universe, which won't do.
<megabyte405> We're getting an MIR ready, considering that before the code was basically just pasted into the AbiWord package and so reasonably a better solution should enjoy the same main-ness as the old solution, but I'm wondering if there's anyone familiar enough with things that we can save some time here
<\sh> megabyte405, duplicated sources we try to avoid...imho that's why it got removed from the upstream tar ball..and having abiword in main, we can't build against universe packages...
<\sh> megabyte405, most probably our core dev decided, that libwv is not a source which can be maintained for over 3 years...
<megabyte405> \sh: I'm with upstream, and so I do know that that was one of the reasons we took it out of that tarball
<pmjdebruijn> lo
<megabyte405> \sh: I'm going to imagine that since in the previous release it wasn't used (older versions being used/included) it wasn't needed by a main package, but as it's an integral part of abiword, it's being very carefully maintained
<pmjdebruijn> I'm trying to package an alternate version of troff (heirloom troff)
<mok0> ScottK: you may want to take a look at bug 156158 for scribus, which you've uploaded earlier, it has a debdiff attached
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 156158 in scribus "In Gutsy Gibbon, Url in Scribus does not launch Firefox" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/156158
<pmjdebruijn> however, /usr/bin/troff is already owned by groff-base
<pmjdebruijn> should I use debian alternatives? if so, shouldn't groff-base support it as well?
<megabyte405> DomL, the maintainer, is also the abiword maintainer, and he keeps everything running smoothly with wv
<pmjdebruijn> or should I install heirloom troff as htroff?
<\sh> megabyte405, well, main is being supported by canonical, so for every package in main, it needs a main inclusion report, and a decision made by <please ask in #ubuntu-devel who that is> who knows if libwv is good for main (means support for at least 3 years, regarding the version in hardy)
<megabyte405> \sh: yep, am aware of those things, just was curious if someone oculd offer a quick opinion
<megabyte405> will keep on going withthe MIR info and ask in #ubuntu-devel too
<\sh> megabyte405, so best is, please address it on #ubuntu-devel :) and my opinion: we have openoffice which works very well with word files ;)
<megabyte405> that's not a solution for me, however ;) - will ask on  -devel
<soren> zul: iscsitarget is the iscsi server. You can just test it with open-iscsi as the initiator.
<_ruben> thats more or less what i tried to say earlier :)
 * sistpoty|work heads home... cya
<megabyte405> perhaps a more -motu question: why is my ppa building against a newer version of cairo than I have in my installation of Hardy?
 * \sh heads home too...
<megabyte405> (as evinced by the fact I can't install the package i just built)
<\sh> megabyte405, url?
<\sh> your lp ppa page ;)
<RainCT> \sh: Ah. Near Barcelona :P
<megabyte405> https://launchpad.net/~abiryan/+archive/
<\sh> RainCT, I said before...strange ;)
<RainCT> ah sebner already answered
<mok0> byebyebye for now
<RainCT> \sh: and it isn't that strange.. Spanish mirrors suck :P
<zul> soren: ok gotcha
<\sh> megabyte405, which version of cairo?
<jdong> \sh: it built in my pbuilder
 * jdong looks
<\sh> jdong, yeah...it's a problem reading the build deps in pbuilder, still...we need to get rid of libgif-dev build-dep for gutsy
<james_w> megabyte405: cairo was uploaded about an hour ago, maybe it hasn't hit your mirror
<james_w> megabyte405: have you apt-get updated?
<megabyte405> ah, right - see discussion aobut spanish mirrors sucking
<\sh> jdong, afaiks fontforge clashed with libgif (because of some strange deps) and that's why it FTBFS on sbuild
<\sh> RainCT, well, ping <your spanish mirror> and ping <mirror of uni-muenster> ;)
<jdong> \sh: ah, that's plausible
<\sh> jdong, so changing for gutsy the libgif-dev | libungif-dev to libungif-dev | libgif-dev (or removing the libgif-dev b-d completly) solves the problem
<\sh> jdong, which means, ScottK needs to do a small source change upload to backports for wine ;)
<jdong> \sh: heh, sounds silly, but I guess reasonable. ScottK time :)
<\sh> jdong, actually it is...and it's because sbuild is resolving the build-deps and deps of the included other build-dep (primary and secondary ones) totally different then pbuilder
<\sh> jdong, the best thing to do: fixing pbuilder to the same dep resolving mechanism as sbuild, so everybody can see the same results as on our buildds
<jdong> \sh: agreed
<jdong> \sh: the aptitude pbuilder satisfier is nice for speed but that's all useless if it doesn't simulate our build env properly
<\sh> jdong, fun part, even the apt-get satisfier works the same ;)
<\sh> jdong, I sweared pbuilder many times because of that
<RainCT> \sh: atm es.archive.ubuntu.com doesn't even answer.. 25 packets transmitted, 0 received, 100% packet loss, time 24039ms lol
<\sh> RainCT, wow
<RainCT> (you've to consider my crappy connection too, but the other one works)
<RainCT> 12 packets transmitted, 12 received, 0% packet loss, time 33823ms
<\sh> RainCT, and archive.ubuntu.com directly ?
<RainCT> well this isn't really the best connection to test from.. each time I try I get a different time from ftp.uni-muenster.de
<RainCT> 9 packets transmitted, 9 received, 0% packet loss, time 20827ms   for archive.ubuntu.com
<RainCT> \sh: well, anyway, it's not only me who recommends German/French mirrors
<RainCT> \sh: if you ask in cat.ubuntuforums.org or some other LoCo place they'll probably tell you the same
<\sh> RainCT, hmm...well, yes, germany has some very good mirror servers...
<\sh> with a lot of bandwidth sponsored by hard working tax payers like me ;)
<\sh> so....now /me needs to head home ;)
<\sh> cu later
<RainCT> \sh: heh :)
<RainCT> see you
<ScottK> \sh or jdong: debdiff me and I'll upload it.
<zul> soren: easier I uploaded to my ppa and getting the guy who opened the bug to test
<norsetto> if I see another bug report on launchpad-integration I will start crying
<stani> pochu: are you there?
<pochu> stani: short of
<stani> I just did dput
<stani> it said "Not running dinstall."
<stani> is that ok?
<pochu> I think so
<stani> Also: Package includes an .orig.tar.gz file although the debian revision suggests
<stani> that it might not be required. Multiple uploads of the .orig.tar.gz may be
<stani> rejected by the upload queue management software.
<pochu> that's ok
<stani> can I track somewhere progress?
<pochu> that's because for Debian, you must not upload the .orig.tar.gz if it's already in the archive (e.g. if it's -2 instead -1)
<pochu> stani: it should already be in your PPA
<pochu> hmm, it's not there yet
<stani> but I did dput source.changes and it uploaded orig.tar.gz by itself
<pochu> stani: what command did you run?
<stani> dput /home/stani/sync/python/phatch/packaging/debian/phatch_0.1.3-0ubuntu1~ppa1_source.changes
<pochu> btw, we are off-topic here, let's move to a query
<stani> ok
<pochu> stani: have you seen my messages?
<zul> ScottK: tested and it works fine
<stani> pochu: which messages? about ppa?
<pochu> stani: yes
<pochu> stani: in a privmsg
<stani> pochu: me too
<pochu> stani: are you identified on freenode?
<pochu> err you aren't
<stani> what does that mean?
<pochu> stani: I haven't seen any message from you then :)
<pochu> stani: /msg NickServ help identify
<stani> just did that and now?
<pochu> stani: it means you aren't "logged in" and thus you can't send privmsgs
<pochu> stani: it should explain you how to identify
<norsetto> zul: bug 208281 you mean?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 208281 in iscsitarget "iscsitarget will not compile" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/208281
<pochu> stani: join #heya
<stani> wait, I log out and log in again
<zul> no0tic:
<zul> norsetto: yep
<emgent> hello people
<stani> pochu: I am back.
<norsetto> zul: isn't that a sync btw?
<norsetto> hi emgent
<zul> no its a merge
<emgent> someone can help me to write python-launchpad-bugs cookies support in anteater tool ?
<emgent> uhm..
<RainCT> emgent: what do you mean?
<norsetto> zul: and why would that be a merge?
<emgent> RainCT: i saw last jdstrand commit for solve firefox3 cookies problem
<zul> because it came from merges.ubuntu.com
<emgent> but i dont found docs for write support
<emgent> i need little help :)
<norsetto> zul: then Mom is wrong ....
<emgent> RainCT: i'd like complete it first of UDS
<norsetto> zul: looks like all our changes are now in debian, as a matter of fact your debdiff only contains the maintainer change
<emgent> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-whitehat/ubuntu-whitehat-project/uwht.dev/annotate/emgent%40emanuele-gentili.com-20080407235635-9c0rlcwmk0eu90ia?file_id=anteater.py-20080328174815-qukxnpiclv9834qw-3
<zul> norsetto: fine..
<sebner> zul: yeah. sync sync sync :D
<slangasek> nxvl: ping? (re: bug #159371)
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 159371 in sysvinit "Default MOTD for server should point to documentation URL" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/159371
<RainCT> emgent: if you have  Obj = Connector.ConnectBugList()  or  Obj = Connector.ConnectBug()  you can then do  Bug.authentication = launchpad_auth_cookie  where launchpad_auth_cookie is the path to the cookie file. Is this what you mean?
<emgent> thekorn reply to me in query :)
<emgent> thanks Rin :)
<nxvl> slangasek: pong
<slangasek> nxvl: hi, seen my latest follow-up there? can you confirm that the change I've suggested is correct?  I'd like to get this uploaded today if possible
<nxvl> slangasek: yes, i have just replied
<slangasek> ok, thanks :)
<nxvl> slangasek: i thought it should be the new md5sum and added that one
<slangasek> so you agree that the change I proposed is correct?  Shall I go ahead and upload?
<nxvl> slangasek: yes i do
<nxvl> slangasek: if you want i can change it
<slangasek> nxvl: I already have the change locally, so I can say you changed it and uploaded it anyway :)
<slangasek> oh, one other thing - since this is really the md5sum from gutsy, not hardy, perhaps we should also label it "7.10 gutsy"?
<nxvl> slangasek: :D
<slangasek> (I meant to say that already in the bug report, but failed)
<nxvl> yes
<nxvl> thats what i was thinking also
<nxvl> i don't really know how it works, but i think that too
<slangasek> I think it's just a label, but we might as well make it a useful label
<slangasek> nxvl: oh, haha, *one* more little thing - I just noticed that you put a space before the : in /etc/motd, which is incorrect in English orthography... do you mind if I change that too? :-)
<xtknight> umm i'm having issues compiling epiphany-extensions from source
<xtknight> on amd64
<xtknight> when i try it in a pbuilder, the configure keeps looping over and over, and i get this message. configure: error: Unknown gecko "libxul" specified
<slangasek> nxvl: ?
<nxvl> where?
 * nxvl look
<nxvl> oh
<nxvl> yes
<nxvl> sorry about that
<slangasek> no problem
<slangasek> I should have noticed it in an earlier revision anyway :)
<slangasek> nxvl: uploading, thanks for your contribution to Ubuntu :)
<nxvl> thanks for your sponsoring :D
<ScottK> norsetto: re launchpad-integration bugs: Just don't look.  Since (AFAIK) there's no proper documentation of Launchpad APIs, what we can do from the outside is really limited.
<RainCT> there are some examples and such on the wiki, but I don't remember where..
<xtknight> weird...getting different errors compiling epiphany-extensions depending on where i try it.  does anyone else mind trying it?
<ScottK2> norsetto: ping
<ScottK2> Nevermind
<stani> pochu: can I follow somewhere progress after I imported to launchpad?
<colinl> hello \sh :)
<yannick_1m> hi there
<colinl> \sh: there's one new launchpad bug on claws-mail that has a patch, if you want to/can take care of it :) : https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/claws-mail/+bug/213960
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 213960 in claws-mail "claws-mail crashed with SIGSEGV" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<norsetto> scottk2: hi there
<ScottK> He
<ScottK> Hey
<ScottK> I was going to ask you to ack an FFe, then I realized it was just bug fixes.
<ScottK> norsetto: Are you coming to UDS?
<norsetto> scottk okki, yes, I'm indeed
<ScottK> Then we'll get to meet finally.
<norsetto> scottk: :-)
<ScottK> We can discuss the old MOTUs like mok0.
<norsetto> scootk: oh man, he is ANCIENT ;-)
<norsetto> scottk: dinosaurs were still roaming the earth when he was born (I'll have to buy you both a budweiser then)
<ScottK2> Yes.  He's IIRC ~8 years older than we are.  I don't know if he's coming.
<slangasek> a budweiser or a budÄjovickÃ½?
<sebner> ScottK: norsetto : then show respect :P
<norsetto> slangasek: if the first is the USA version, the second ;-)
 * slangasek grins
 * ScottK2 too
 * tsmithe pokes slomo
<tsmithe> :)
<stani> pochu: are you there?
<emgent> heya blueyed
<emgent> blueyed: bug #214137
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 214137 in python-launchpad-bugs "[internal server error] while trying to file a bug" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/214137
<ScottK> YokoZar: Does iTunes work yet?
<YokoZar> ScottK: The latest version does, yeah.  It can only sync with older ipods though (which are just USB mass storage devices) - newer ipods and iphones are weirder
<emgent> with wine ?
<pschorf> i'm working on bug 209982 (creating a debdiff file) and the source for xmlstarlet doesn't have a debian/patches folder.  Can I just make one to put the patch into?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 209982 in xmlstarlet "many -N options gets dropped for command-line" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/209982
<YokoZar> emgent: yes, with Wine
<emgent> ok, thanks YokoZar :)
<pochu> stani: I'm now
<stani> pochu: good news: I managed to get a hardy ppa for phatch, but ...
<stani> pochu: unfortunately the bad news is, I don't manage to put up a gutsy ppa (or feisty or ...)
<ScottK> YokoZar: Cool.  Maybe that'll get one kid off of Windows entirely.  Her iPod is a year and a half old.
<stani> pochu: upload for gutsy gets rejected: MD5 sum of uploaded file does not match existing file in archive Files specified in DSC are broken or missing, skipping package unpack verification.
<YokoZar> ScottK: no kidding.  iTunes is what was holding my girlfriend back too.
<ScottK> Currently the PC the kids use dual boots for iTunes and they must get explicit permission to be in the "other" OS.
<stani> pochu: what I did is change the changelog from hardy to gutsy run again debuild and upload with dput
<ScottK> stani: You need to use a different version number too.
<ScottK> stani: I usually add ~$RELEASE~ppa$REVISION to my PPA uploads
<stani> version number for hardy is 0.1.3-0ubuntu1~ppa1
<ScottK> So make the next one 0.1.3-0ubuntu1~gutsy~ppa1
<stani> ok
<stani> will try again, thanks a lot
<ScottK> That'll give it a lower version number than an official backport if you do one of those
<pochu> stani: is the .orig.tar.gz the same?
<ScottK> pochu: That's the same error you get if you reuse a version number.  Guess how I know ....
<pochu> stani: i.e. are the md5sum from the .changes files matching?
<pochu> ScottK: ah, true
<pochu> stani: ^-- you need to change the version... use something like 1.1-1~feisty1, for example
<james_w> does anyone have an up-to-date Debian unstable box to hand?
<pochu> or whatever, but not the same one
<stani> ScottK: Will that give a problem when we go from the Zutsy Zallow to the Ancient Avantgarde? (just hypothecical in a far future)
<pochu> stani: then use ~7.04 :)
<ScottK> In theory
<ScottK> We do use ~gutsy/~feisty etc for official backports, so I think it's fine
<pochu> but in practice not, as by then you won't be at 1.1
<stani> pochu: ok, so the version number is ï»¿0.1.3-0ubuntu1~7.04~ppa1
<pochu> that's fine, yes
<ScottK> Is that a higher or lower version number than ~gutsy?
<stani> ScottK: I think lower
<stani> pochu: the orig.tar.gz is the same of course. Should it change?
<ScottK> That's fine.
<pochu> stani: no, it should remain the same
<pochu> bbl
<keescook> \sh: geh, I'm sorry to be catching this so late, but there may be an interaction between a security settings that stopped working early in hardy and wine.
<stani> Now I get with debuild: Undefined subroutine &Dpkg::Version::_g called at /usr/share/perl5/Dpkg/Version.pm line 204
<keescook> \sh: basically, the /proc/sys/vm/mmap_min_addr was working early in hardy when AppArmor wasn't enabled.
<keescook> \sh: I just now noticed that it isn't working (I'm getting it fixed shortly)
<keescook> \sh: wine loads most things okay, but reports warnings from the prelinker about not being able to reserve memory.
<ScottK> keescook: YokoZar will also be interested in that.
<keescook> YokoZar: oops, I had mis-remembered your nick.  I was trying Z<tab>  ;)
<YokoZar> keescook: Ahh yes we talked about that at UDS a bit
<keescook> YokoZar: yeah, I'm terribly sorry this is so late.  :(
<keescook> YokoZar: you can test it now by booting with apparmor.enabled=0 on the kernel command line.
<keescook> that will cause the default kernel security system to be used, which implements mmap_min_addr correctly.
<YokoZar> keescook: And that would allow Wine to reserve those memory areas?
<keescook> YokoZar: that will make it behave like I had intended.  To allow those regions, one just needs to change /etc/sysctl.conf's entry for mmap_min_addr
<keescook> YokoZar: however, most Wine program shouldn't need that region of memory.
<YokoZar> Yeah I think it's for DOS compatibility or something equally archaic
<keescook> so I was hoping Wine would handle it more gracefully, but I don't know that part of the codebase at all.
<keescook> yeah, exactly.
<YokoZar> I'm pretty sure Wine does it's best (those are, after all, warnings and not errors in prelink)
<keescook> when I tested just now, e.g. notepad is fine, but wine spews errors about the first meg of DOS memory
<keescook> right
<YokoZar> The one thing that might be an issue is weird copy protection, which Wine also uses prelink for
<YokoZar> But I don't know how to test those exactly
<YokoZar> And Wine only handles some of them right anyway
<keescook> I guess what I'm getting at is that once this is fixed in AppArmor, wine will always spew errors about that memory region, which might scare people.  :P
<YokoZar> True, but only when run from the terminal ;)
<keescook> hehe
<ScottK> keescook: People being scared when running wine: Bug or Feature?
<keescook> okay, cool.  I just wanted to give you a heads-up, since it was a rather late change.
<keescook> ScottK: haha, yes, good point.
<YokoZar> Wine is already scary when run from the terminal because of all the fixmes it inevitably dumps out
<keescook> heh, good point.
<stani> I solved it. Will try dput now.
<ScottK> stani: What was the problem?
<stani> ScottK: Just me messing around. I moved the files in a separate folder, cd to it and deleted the folder. The terminal got disconnected.
<ScottK> Ah
<stani> ScottK: just reopening the terminal in the right folder solved it
<stani> This time accepted! Let's see if it wants to build.
<stani> I like to change the version number of the already build package for hardy in the ppa so it also reflects the distrorelease. What would be the best way? Delete the package?
<ScottK> Yes
<blueyed> emgent: re #214317. Doesn't this happen on commit()?=
<blueyed> emgent: it's caused by a missing LP cookie.. I had to get cookies for "lp" and "edge" (only had "edge" before)
<emgent> blueyed: add comment :)
<emgent> i add lp cookie autentication in anteater with thekorn
<emgent> but he saw another problem
<stani> ScottK: Do you know what means 1010 in Pending (1010) message for PPA?
<ScottK> It means publisher hasn't run yet.  It's normal.  Just needs some patience
<stani> Just try to understand.
<ScottK> Sure.
<ScottK> The publisher pushes packages out to the archive on a periodic (Don't recall when).
<cody-somerville> I think it is the 15th of every hour IIRC
<stani> But is 1010 or 1005 a message id?
<stani> Hi cody-somerville: Congratulations with Xubuntu!
<cody-somerville> stani, Thanks :)
<stani> I am on xubuntu hardy right now ;-) (my old laptop pentium |||)
<emgent> hehe Xubuntu people r0cks
<cody-somerville> :)
<stani> ScottK: Phatch refuses to build on dapper as python-central is missing. Is there an easy work around?
<ScottK> stani: No easy one.  You need to make debian/rules with debhelper.
<ScottK> Dapper was transitional and the new python policy was only partly implemented in it.
<stani> OK, than I leave it. So python-central exists on Edgy?
<ScottK> Yes.
<ScottK> stani: You know you can do backports to and get better exposure.
<ScottK> !backports | stani
<ubotu> stani: If new updated Ubuntu packages are built for an application, then they may go into Ubuntu Backports. See https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuBackports - See also !packaging
<stani> Seems good, but I just called my PPA repositories "bleeding edge" ;-)
<stani> So it is meant for people who want the latest bugs ;-)
<ScottK> Right.
<jdong>  I call em Personal Packaging Atrocities
<jdong> because that's what I usually put in em :D
<ScottK> But if you want the Hardy package in the earlier releases, backports is a good way to do it.
<ScottK> Personally, I think they're good for testing when you know the person that's running the PPA, but I wouldn't want to just use software from random PPAs.
<stani> Yes, so we can wait some time after Hardy is released and see if not serious bugs arise.
<ScottK> Fair enough.
<stani> ScottK: I guess you don't dare to use my PPA's
<ScottK> I like to stick to the Ubuntu repos for production use.
<stani> I am just joking
<ScottK> So far skype and acrobat are my only exceptions.
<ScottK> ;-)
<stani> what do you use medibuntu?
<jdong> that's what I use...
<norsetto> oh well, g'night all
<emgent> blueyed: here?
<ScottK> stani: Since I live in a country where distribution and use of some of the stuff that medibuntu distributes is illegal, I'm unlikely to have an opinion on it.
<ScottK> Actually illegal is to strong.
<ScottK> A civil wrong is a better way to put it.
<stani> ScottK: Problem with Edgy: "Missing dependencies:                 debhelper (>= 5.0.38)                            "
<jdong> nah, illegal I think is the correct term to describe it
<jdong> if you download the right (err, wrong) things in medibuntu
<ScottK> jdong: Well I don't think you can be criminally charged, just sued in civil court, but I could be wrong.
<stani> ScottK: Can I just lower the version number. If yes, to which version for edgy?
<ScottK> stani: It's probably that for a reason.
<ScottK> You can try it.
<ScottK> stani: You might look at debian/changelog for debhelper and see if there's anything in 5.0.38 that you need.
<crimsun> yes, it's dh_python
<crimsun> kinda sad that I remember the 5.0.38 requirement from "back then"
<stani> I'll leave it. I prefer to play a bit more with gstreamer. I never got a request for Edgy.
<emgent> 7query blueyed
<jdong> are rmadison queries expensive on the servers?
<jdong> I have this basic pre-backporting script that uses a sqlite-backed cache to query the various package versions available to test if a package is backportable
<jdong> I don't wanna be an ass to the poor rmadison servers
<ajmitch> that's a fun feature of update-manager, offering to start a new sshd for me in case I royally break things :)
<jdong> it does?
<ajmitch> yeah, because I'd started it via ssh
<jdong> cool
<jdong> didn't know that
<Nafallo> it rocks :-)
<jdong> ok quick poll: Will any angry mobs form if I add a MUTILATE_BUILD_DEPS non-default parameter to prevu?
<jdong> whose functionality will sed out versions on versioned build deps, mostly aimed for people building packages personally for themselves?
<ScottK> jdong: I think adding to crack is like adding to infinity.  crack + crack = crack.
#ubuntu-motu 2008-04-09
<Nafallo> .win 81
<bddebian> Heya gang
<xtknight> i should be able to publish an update of flashplugin-nonfree on my ppa, shouldn't I?
<xtknight> or no?
<TheMuso> xtknight: You should yes.
<xtknight> TheMuso, thanks.  just fixing bug 214341
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 214341 in flashplugin-nonfree "flash plugin md5sum outdated" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/214341
<proppy> oy
<LaserJock> hmm, so do we get flashplugin-nonfree part II?
<jdong> looks like it
<jdong> how many things are incompatible this time?
<vorian> :/
<superm1> part 2?
<superm1> what happened?
<jdong> superm1: new flashplugin apparently
<superm1> with plugin included in deb by chance?
<superm1> or what is deal?
<superm1> hm i dont see anything new according to https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/flashplugin-nonfree/
<jdong> bug 214341
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 214341 in flashplugin-nonfree "flash plugin md5sum outdated" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/214341
<jdong> it's always the md5sum fun.
<jdong> we could just not check MD5sums :D
<jdong> </bad security joke>
<LaserJock> why not?
<emgent> argh
<LaserJock> it's not like Flash has the best security history or anything ;-)
<superm1> well i'd be for maybe presenting a warning
<superm1> that they don't match
<superm1> and explain what can cause that
<jdong> right
<superm1> so that people can still proceed
<jdong> making dpkg fail in postinst is probably the least elegant solution
<superm1> although i'd moreso be for Adobe to put it in the canonical partners repo
<superm1> but that's too idealistic
<jdong> superm1: yeah and the world would spin a lot better if getdeb packages were reviewed into universe...
<jdong> you utopians ;-)
<jdong> that should be triaged and set to high importance, no?
<jdong> wait xtknight has a debdiff
<xtknight> helloooo
<xtknight> :0
<xtknight> yeah it worked for me at laest
<jdong> it looks reasonable
<LaserJock> jdong: Fedora's pretty fast. I first noticed the flash thing because I had an update to install
<xtknight> we dont need an SRU do we?
<LaserJock> then I opened up my email and saw the SRU bug
<jdong> xtknight: for gutsy and friends very likely
<xtknight> if it's a new flash... flash would be completely broken for everyone, so it's sort of vital to update the md5sums for it unless you're going to change the download link
<xtknight> oh that's right gutsy uses it too
<jdong> LaserJock: we need a standing SRU, like a volatile setup
<LaserJock> jdong: well, as long as Adobe doesn't cause problems it's a pretty straightfoward deal
<LaserJock> but I think a standing SRU approval would be a good idea
<LaserJock> it's not like we're gonna do a code review
<mbt> Does anyone have any ideas on debugging a package that works properly under a debugger (gdb) but not outside of it?  I'm trying to fix a particularly troubling bug (bug 106583) and it works when under GDB, but not outside of it.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 106583 in alltray "No windows hiding with compiz" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/106583
<jdong> xtknight: I uploaded your debdiff
<jdong> thanks for jumping on that one :)
<xtknight> oh thanks
<xtknight> i'm also wondering why even bother checking the md5sum
<LaserJock> but yeah, we need to do something about bailing out of postinst
<jdong> xtknight: MITM attack. This would be a root compromise
<xtknight> well i mean people are already at risk by using closed source things *shrugs*
<jdong> xtknight: that's not quite the same thing
<mbt> xtknight, jdong: Wouldn't there be a way to do it in a manner that doesn't require the package being updated every time?  It is a bit annoying the frequency which the md5sum on flash changes.
<jdong> xtknight: there still is some "trust" if you call it that in big-names
<xtknight> we could download the latest md5sum from ubuntu
<jdong> mbt: if adobe GPG signs their flash stuff or provides a SSL/HTTPS download method
<LaserJock> mbt: we can't know the md5sums ahead of time
<xtknight> or something
<mbt> No, but what if the md5sums were checked from an https Ubuntu server with a list?
<jdong> xtknight: if we download md5sums from somewhere, then we should just always keep the package updated.
<mbt> Using curl or something?
<jdong> mbt: ^^
<xtknight> if adobe uploaded a .md5sum would that fix it?
<jdong> there would be no difference in complexity.
<jdong> xtknight: no
<jdong> xtknight: what prevents me from spoofing that?
<mbt> No, but it wouldn't require the package be rebuilt.
<xtknight> hmm
<xtknight> true
<mbt> SSL signature
<jdong> mbt: the package rebuild is probably the least of concerns
<jdong> if Adobe would provide a SSL download URL I'd be happy to remove this check.
<jdong> but that apparently is not the case
<LaserJock> I would be concerned about people getting new software without us knowing about it
<xtknight> yea
<jdong> honestly adobe+canonical partner is the BEST solution
<jdong> LaserJock: +1
<crimsun> no
<jdong> package fetchers IMO are a bad idea
<mbt> jdong: There have been times where there has been considerable lag and many duplicate bugs...
<crimsun> remove it completely from the archive
<jdong> mbt: indeed, mostly because of the painful procedure currently to get that update in
<jdong> mbt: but there's no reason why that cannot be reformed
<xtknight> https://fpdownload.macromedia.com/get/flashplayer/current/install_flash_player_9_linux.tar.gz
<xtknight> well this works
<xtknight> do you call that secure?
<jdong> xtknight: does that actually work? :)
<jdong> cool
<crimsun> no, it's not "secure"
<xtknight> but i dont see why that's any better than http
<xtknight> anyone at adobe could still upload a tainted package
<crimsun> it's not much better
<jdong> if anyone at adobe uploads a tainted package we're all screwed anyway
<jdong> </chicken little>
<xtknight> not in our current system though
<mbt> True enough, but at least it's not MITM if you verify the SSL cert, which is probably the biggest problem downloading it via HTTP.
<xtknight> ;)
<LaserJock> the problem last time was that Adobe's package broke Konqueror
<jdong> is there any attempt for canonical to work with Adobe on this?
<LaserJock> it takes us all of a couple hours to get a new package with md5sums to the archives
<jdong> I find it hard to believe we can't reach an agreement for flashplayer
<crimsun> the real solution to this is to have the browser handle it via a plugin
<LaserJock> jdong: well, we had to remove Acrobat Reader completly
<xtknight> takes longer to file an SRU for gutsy tho
<LaserJock> jdong: my guess is Adobe doesn't really care
<LaserJock> xtknight: we can fix that
<xtknight> hopefully
<jdong> xtknight: that's why I proposed a standing SRU
<xtknight> ok.  ive never even heard of that.  but i know what it is now
<crimsun> as long as we have this inane package in the archive, it will remain an issue.
<mbt> It'd be nice if Adobe were more friendly, to be sure; then it wouldn't be an issue at all, and known-good versions could be kept in the repos.  :-/
<xtknight> cant FF download from adobe anyway
<jdong> xtknight: on 32-bit
<crimsun> we already do nasty things like assume EULA acceptance
<xtknight> yea true
<LaserJock> I agree with crimsun that Flash should be done via the browser
<jdong> LaserJock: well that's the easiest solution for us but isn't htat just skirting the responsibility?
<xtknight> FF should make an official plugin wrapper or get nspluginwrapper into the tree
<xtknight> for 64bit
<LaserJock> jdong: well, not necessarily
<xtknight> then there's no use in having the package at all
<LaserJock> jdong: I bet Adobe would be much more willing to work with Mozilla than Canonical
<jdong> LaserJock: how is it not "this isn't our problem, it's the user's problem now"
<mbt> What about canonical putting resources into the free flash players?  Is that happening?  Or are there patent issues there?
<jdong> oh that's what you meant
<jdong> mbt: haha. free flash player.
<jdong> mbt: reimplementing flash from ground up is not a walk in the park
<mbt> jdong: Well, it works for some things... just not everything.
<crimsun> first, updating this package endlessly is /not/ the solution.
<LaserJock> yeah, I'm saying the actual browser that needs flash should maybe handle getting it
<jdong> mbt: complexity wise I don't think it's any less nontrivial than implementing java from ground up and look at how long that took
<jdong> crimsun: agreed....
<jdong> LaserJock: firefox already kinda does that
<jdong> LaserJock: before we castrated that ability
<Hobbsee> crimsun: throw it out instead?
<crimsun> Hobbsee: absolutely.  Make the browser handle it.
<LaserJock> yeah, but it wasn't good about plugins
<Hobbsee> does it not already?
<xtknight> FF is fine on 32bit we just need to fix the 64bit
<crimsun> Hobbsee: for some arches and browsers
<jdong> Hobbsee: ubufox disables that ability for flashplugin in particular
<Hobbsee> oh, meh, 64 bit.
<Hobbsee> jdong: tasty.
<jdong> yeah :)
<jdong> when is a feature not a feature? ;-)
<LaserJock> well, can we get ubufox to handle it?
<xtknight> what else uses flash? epiphany,etc, do they have methods of d/l'ing it?
<LaserJock> no
<jdong> I don't see how having ubufox handle it is any less evil than turning off the MD5sum check
<xtknight> we dont have to bother w/ updating the package
<xtknight> i guess
<LaserJock> btw, has anybody got a new package ready to go?
<LaserJock> :-)
<LaserJock> or did we already do it?
<crimsun> it was already uploaded.
<LaserJock> yeah, I see it now
<LaserJock> did anybody test it?
<crimsun> yes
<LaserJock> like for konqi problems
<crimsun> it works on KDE4's konqueror
<crimsun> didn't test KDE3
<LaserJock> I guess I was asking if it's been uploaded to -proposed
<LaserJock> for the gutsy horde
<ajmitch> ah, flash, everyone's friend
<LaserJock> ajmitch: oh man, in the edu world it can be particularly exciting
<LaserJock> everybody likes doing all their learning content in Flash
<LaserJock> then trying to have 30 kids run it over a LTSP server
<mbt> heh, does the new version work with libflashsupport without crashing?  :-D
<xtknight> well i dont think there's a free equiv to Flash itself
<xtknight> some free flash decoders that are half broken, not much more than this
<crimsun> mbt: not really.
<crimsun> what do you expect?  It's Flash.
<LaserJock> :-)
<mbt> Yep.
<LaserJock> I like it when flash works though
<LaserJock> as that's how I got my wife to ditch Windows
<mbt> I started using Totem for YouTube with all the ick that is flash
<jdong> mbt: that's great for the simple case of a flash video player
<mbt> Yeah, but that's about it...
<jdong> mbt: too bad flash is a pretty complete JITting language runtime.
<LaserJock> ugg, Need to get 210MB of archives.
<LaserJock> I sure wish my school didn't decide to mess with their VPN
<LaserJock> *hadn't decided
<LaserJock> they had a decent setup I could use, now they've got three different access points and none of them work
<LaserJock> anybody feeling like doing a gutsy package for flash?
<LaserJock> I can ack an SRU for it
<mbt> I don't have a gutsy build env right now, since I went and focused on Hardy... been working on Alltray lately
<xtknight> i'll try
<xtknight> !info flashplayer-nonfree gutsy
<ubotu> Package flashplayer-nonfree does not exist in gutsy
<xtknight> what's it called on gutsy?
<LaserJock> it's the same
<LaserJock> !info flashplugin-nonfree gutsy
<ubotu> flashplugin-nonfree (source: flashplugin-nonfree): Adobe Flash Player plugin installer. In component multiverse, is optional. Version 9.0.48.0.2+really0ubuntu12.2 (gutsy), package size 17 kB, installed size 156 kB (Only available for i386 amd64 lpia)
<xtknight> o plugin
<jdong> flashplugin-nonfree | 9.0.48.0.2+really0ubuntu12.2 | gutsy-updates/multiverse | source, amd64, i386
<jdong> that's the sucker.
<jdong> would it really kill us to put the true version number?
<xtknight> we do on hardy
<xtknight> not sure why not on gutsy
<jdong> right but the SRU policy by default would be bump 12.2 to 12.3
<jdong> that's why it's 12.2 right now
<jdong> that's actually 9.0.115.0
<xtknight> o
<jdong> LaserJock: ^^ your opinion on this?
<jdong> I personally would say put the real 9.0.124 version number in
<jdong> but of course set it less than Hardy by a bit
<emgent> launchpad down ?
<LaserJock> awesome we have 3 different version conventions for flashplugin-nonfree in -updates
<jdong> LaserJock: lol
<jdong> 9.0.48.0.0ubuntu11~dapper3
<jdong> 9.0.48.0.0ubuntu1~7.04.3
<jdong> 7.0.68~ubuntu3
<jdong> 9.0.115.0ubuntu5
<jdong> more than that.
<LaserJock> for goodness sakes
 * jdong looks at the feisty and dapper one
<jdong> wait...
<jdong> isn't dapper a higher version?
<LaserJock> it should be
<jdong> backports
<LaserJock> why isn't it in -updates?
<StevenK> The dapper one is higher, according to dpkg
<jdong> LaserJock: probably because when it was done, it's not accepted in -updates
<jdong> LaserJock: we used to have quite strict policy, remember?
<LaserJock> would it kill us to just use the real version?
<jdong> that's my sentiments
<jdong> let's just use the real version
<LaserJock> I think it's more confusing to users looking for the update to see that  9.0.48.0.2+really0ubuntu12.3 is really 9.0.124.0ubuntu1
<xtknight> gutsy-proposed debdiff up. Bug 214341
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 214341 in flashplugin-nonfree "flash plugin md5sum outdated" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/214341
<xtknight> tested on i386/firefox only, works fine
<xtknight> hold up my bad i uploaded the wrong gutsy one
<xtknight> nevermind we're good :)
<LaserJock> heh
<LaserJock> seems like we should make that version lower than Hardy though for some reason
<jdong> *looks*
<LaserJock> yeah, we better make it lower
<jdong> just put ~gutsy1 on it
<jdong> IMO.
<LaserJock> if we need to do any updating we'd hate to cause a downgrade when people upgrade
<LaserJock> yeah, I agree
<xtknight> 9.0.124.0ubuntu1~gutsy1?
<LaserJock> that's lower isn't it?
<jdong> yeah
<xtknight> yup
 * LaserJock forgets the magic dpkg --compare-versions incantation
<xtknight> well should i do anything or wait for someone else to look at it for final decision?
<LaserJock> I would like somebody to check konqi if we can
<LaserJock> since that was the problem last time
<chapocero> which programming language is the majority of ubuntu development done in?
<LaserJock> chapocero: depends on what you mean buy ubuntu development?
<xtknight> kernel is C, lot of UI is python
<LaserJock> I would say bash
<LaserJock> bash/Makefile
<LaserJock> :-)
<mbt> there is a lot of everything in ubuntu... c, c++, shell, lisp, python, c#...
<chapocero> ah, xtknight is the winner i think with the answer i was most looking for.. lol :P
<chapocero> thanks all
<xtknight> do i get a cookie?
<chapocero> hmm... you know i made some... but they didnt turn out so well, so i dont think you really want one
<saivann> I'm looking to see if latest flash works with konqueror
<LaserJock> chapocero: what are you trying to get at?
<xtknight> :p
<jdong> chapocero: I like mbt's answer better though...
<jdong> chapocero: it'd really help us to understand the purpose of the question
<LaserJock> jdong: I liked mine, personally ;-)
<jdong> are you interested in contributing to Ubuntu and would like to pick a language to learn?
<jdong> or just curiousity?
<chapocero> LaserJock, i used to get a little bit in to programming several years ago.. some vb and c++, but most of it was forgotten.. im just trying to get various references on ideas of where i want to pick back up from
<LaserJock> saivann: awesome
<jdong> technically LaserJock is correct.... in a cheap way.... :)
<LaserJock> jdong: dude, "ubuntu development" I'm totally right on :-)
<LaserJock> although dash/bash
<LaserJock> but still
<jdong> LaserJock: pfft I'd say that's debian/copyright :P
<jdong> *ducks*
<LaserJock> hah
<LaserJock> chapocero: boy, sky's the limit
<jdong> LaserJock: haha speaking of satire, you might get a kick out of my boredom earlier in the day: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/JohnDong/FFeRejectionForm
<jdong> (the only problem is that it'll probably be used against me some day :D)
<LaserJock> C/C++/Ruby/Python are probably some of the most common
<saivann> LaserJock : ERROR: Your architecture, \'x86_64\', is not supported by the
<saivann>        Adobe Flash Player installer.
<LaserJock> jdong: I saw that in -devel earlier
<saivann> LaserJock : I don't think that the old installer had this warning about 64 bit
<LaserJock> saivann: did it die?
<saivann> LaserJock : yes
<xtknight> huh
<LaserJock> those cheeky buggers
<jdong> AAh! regression! lock the doors! Engage protocol C-A-1-6-0!
<xtknight> lol
<superm1> so really why not at least put a warning in to let users pass by the md5 failing?
<saivann> LaserJock : --help does not give any outputs..
<LaserJock> jdong: that's CHARLIE-ALPHA-ONE-SIX-ZERO
<xtknight> saivann, yes the flash player has had the warning about 64
<chapocero> well i hope to bone up on some of the things ive forgotten and/or missed out on as far as useful programming languages before i start resuming my college career... but once i get a bit better foundation i hope to do what i can to contribute... i think im going to look in to some C or python
<superm1> it would lower the priority of these SRU sprints to get it updated across releases
<xtknight> saivann, you must run with linux32 if you use install-flash-player.  however the debian package doesnt
<LaserJock> chapocero: those would be excellent choices
<LaserJock> they can get you around a heck of a lot of code
<saivann> xtknight : Ok thanks, I will now try on a x86 hardy
<xtknight> saivann, wait were you trying the flashplugin-nonfree package or flash off adobe.com?
<saivann> xtknight : flash from adobe, of course
<xtknight> saivann, i mean "linux32 ./install-flash-player"
<xtknight> run linux32 on a 64bit machine but, you must use nspluginwrapper also
<xtknight> i think they meant for you to try the package
<jdong> yeah, the package is what we're concerned about at the moment
<jdong> don't scare us like that!
<saivann> xtknight : is /usr/lib/mozilla the good place for firefox 3.0 ?
<LaserJock> xulrunner-addons I think
<LaserJock> though it may not make a difference
<xtknight> saivann, hey sorry for this misunderstanding.
<xtknight> can you download the flashplugin-nonfree packages here https://launchpad.net/~xt-knight/+archive
<xtknight> amd64: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/13268638/flashplugin-nonfree_9.0.124.0ubuntu1%7Eppa2_amd64.deb
<jdong> LaserJock is right
<saivann> xtknight : Why not :) thanks
<jdong> though symlinks idiotproof it
<saivann> xtknight : Sorry? np here :)
<xtknight> saivann, oh yeah basically we just didn't want you using install flash because the pakcage is what we need tested.  and package makes it easier for you
<LaserJock> xtknight: I'm going to make bug #214341 a dup of bug ##173890
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 214341 in flashplugin-nonfree "flash plugin md5sum outdated" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/214341
<saivann> xtknight : I though the flash player installer was less "manual", I also think like you
<LaserJock> bah, screwed that one
<xtknight> Bug 214130 too
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 214130 in flashplugin-nonfree "flashplugin-nonfree mismatch" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/214130
<saivann> xtknight, LaserJock : Tested 4 sites with flash in Hardy with konqueror and latest flash plugin from xtknight PPA and it works flawlessly
<xtknight> saivann, nice. thanks for taking the time
<saivann> xtknight : Thanks for your instructions :)
<LaserJock> saivann: is that KDE4 konqi?
<saivann> LaserJock : no, I'll test KDE4 konqueror in 2 seconds
<LaserJock> that's ok
<LaserJock> crimsun tested it
<saivann> LaserJock : A nice :)
<saivann> Sounds like we'll not need to wait a very long time before updating flash-plugin this time!
<saivann> LaserJock xtknight : Tested two times konqueror for KDE4, does not work. Konqueror freeze when I go on youtube.com. Flash is properly detected by nsplugin but does not seem to works when surfing on flash sites
<saivann> Instead of flash content, I get grey areas
<xtknight> hmmm
<xtknight> yeah ive always gotten that a lot even with the old plugin :(
<xtknight> but it happenedin FF for me
<saivann> mmh, firefox and konqueror works flawlessly, but konqueror for KDE4 does not work yet.
<xtknight> interesting
<xtknight> saivann, do you know if KDE4 konqi works with the old flash?
<saivann> xtknight : I don't know, sorry
<xtknight> but it worked for crimsun i think
<saivann> xtknight : Maybe that I have some missing depends.. I tested this in ubuntu but not kubuntu with whole kde4 installed
<saivann> xtknight, LaserJock : Also successfully testing in Gutsy, konqueror with nsplugins works correctly with latest flash, and also firefox 2
<xtknight> saivann, i'm thinking the kde4 problem is due to nspluginwrapper or something.  maybe konq uses a different plugin folder than FF?
<xtknight> seems like that should be another bug to me, at least, if it is indeed a problem
<saivann> xtknight : Actually, it looks like konqueror and konqueror for KDE4 looks in the same Firefox folders to find flash plugin
<saivann> xtknight : It really looks like a nspluginwrapper issue to me, yes.. but I don't know where is the problem since nsplugins search in the same folders and find the same plugins
<xtknight> saivann, maybe running kde4 konq in the terminal would reveal something
<saivann> xtknight : That's a good idea
<xtknight> saivann, ive had flash go gray in FF with multiple windows open and stuff
<saivann> xtknight : old or new flash plugin?
<xtknight> old
<xtknight> probably new too
<xtknight> seems to have happened forever
<saivann> xtknight : Seriously? That's the first time that it happens to me yet
<xtknight> saivann, yeah.  i reboot FF and it works again
<xtknight> it happens when multiple instances of nsplugin start and somehow it gets all messed
<xtknight> segfaults and grays out all the flash areas
<LaserJock> ok, I'm gonna upload xtknight's package to gutsy-proposed
<xtknight> does flashplugin-nonfree even call nspluginwrapper when it installs?
<saivann> xtknight : In my case, rebooting konqueror does not help, also I got a grey windows with "nspluginwrapper" in the title
<xtknight> ah
<xtknight> ok i guess nsplugin is called.  so that should not be the problem.
<xtknight> saivann, did you find anything from the terminal output?
<saivann> xtknight : I'm still searching the good command to start konqueror, it's not konqueror-kde4..
<xtknight> maybe /usr/bin/kde4/konqueror or similar i dunno
<xtknight> possibly opt , lib..
<saivann> hehe /usr/lib/kde4/bin/konqueror
<xtknight>  /usr/lib/kde4/bin/konqueror
<xtknight> yeah
<xtknight> beat me
<saivann> ;)
<saivann> yes I get relevant outputs
<saivann> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/62600/
<LaserJock> and it's off!
<LaserJock> xtknight: good work
<xtknight> thx
<saivann> The program 'npviewer.bin' received an X Window System error.
<xtknight> saivann, run "sudo ldconfig"
<xtknight> looks like you've got other lib errors but i dont know if those are normal
<xtknight> saivann, interesting.  you might need to a file bug for konqueror-kde4<> nspluginwrapper
<xtknight> doesnt seem like the new flash caused it though
<LaserJock> Hobbsee: do you have powers to accept packages into -proposed?
<xtknight> maybe crim had 32bit thats why
<saivann> xtknight : Even after running "sudo ldconfig" and restarting konqueror, does not change anything yet
<jdong> LaserJock: I believe she went off to uni
<saivann> xtknight : That would make sense
<LaserJock> pfft
<LaserJock> school
<LaserJock> speaking of that
<LaserJock> I have a meeting with my advisor tomorrow and I'm nowhere near ready
<LaserJock> so I best be off for tonight
<saivann> xtknight : I'm installing this in hardy 32bit just to see
<xtknight> saivann, you're one of the most determined/dedicated testers i've seen :p
<saivann> xtknight : Haha, I take it as a compliment :)
<xtknight> i am obsessive in my own ways
<saivann> xtknight : ^^
<xtknight> and i probably dont test things enough :p
<xtknight> i often end up posting three times to my ppa
<StevenK> Better than that than three times to the archive :-)
<saivann> xtknight : I'm addicted to test and I love to find explanations :)
<xtknight> hehe
<saivann> :P
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: don't thin so
<saivann> xtknight : It works with 32bit!
<xtknight> cool
<saivann> xtknight : for which package should I post a bug about that, in your opinion?
<xtknight> saivann, for now leave it unassigned to any particular patch
<xtknight> i mean package
<xtknight> just ubuntu
<saivann> xtknight : Ok, thanks
<xtknight> saivann, if you want to go a step further you can get some people to confirm it
<xtknight> otherwise could just be something broken on your machine, i dunno
<xtknight> unlikely though
<saivann> xtknight : Maybe people from #ubuntu-testing?
<xtknight> i didnt even know about that channel
<saivann> xtknight.. Yes, well I think that it's not a good idea. Perhaps that I can open the bug and then ask people to reproduce?
<xtknight> saivann, well yeah that sounds good to me
<xtknight> doesnt matter who it is, can be anybody :)
<TheMuso> Anybody got an idea of whats wrong with this? http://www.themuso.id.au/ubuntu/vlc_0.8.6.release.e+x264svn20071224+faad2.6.1-0ubuntu3_20080409-1435
<saivann> xtknight : Great
<StevenK> TheMuso: Looking
<xtknight> TheMuso, i dont know im assuming youve seen this? http://ramblings.narrabilis.com/wp/vlc-build-for-rhel5/
<TheMuso> xtknight: No, looking.
<xtknight> could be gcc versions
<xtknight> one might define the function implicitly
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: you clearly did something bad in a past life.
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: Oh yeah. Just pulled a package down that built successfully last time, did a tweak within the debian dir, adding a dep to a binary package and changelog bits, and tried to rebuild.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: strange.
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: Indeed.
<RAOF> I'd be wondering two things: (1) why that's a size_t _reference_, and (2) why it's not getting implicitly upconverted to a long long int.
<StevenK> It could be a size_t deref'd pointer.
<StevenK> Why they wouldn't just pass a size_t is beyond me
<TheMuso> StevenK: As I said above, no actual code changes since last upload and that previous one worked.
<StevenK> TheMuso: Which means something in the toolchain it's using has changed
<xtknight> prolly gcc
<TheMuso> StevenK: My thought exactly.
<TheMuso> Well its a .cpp file,.
<TheMuso> xtknight: The link you posted has a solution, but it sounds hacky to me.
<xtknight> i think the people upstream should just make it work with whatever gcc ubuntu has now.  more strict casting or w/e is needed
<xtknight> g++
<xtknight> rhel5 obviously doesnt work either
<TheMuso> So... Should I do that hack? I'd rather not...
<xtknight> no idea
<RAOF> Yeah, that's a bit of a hack.  It's probably meant to be from <algorithms> or something.
<RAOF> TheMuso: Man, I'm a C++ god.  It _is_ meant to come from <algorithm>.  I suppose that they're 'using std;' at some point?
<dholbach> good morning
<bluefoxicy> I'm bored.
<RAOF> bluefoxicy: Kindly finish nv40 gallium, then.
<bluefoxicy> dholbach:  Piss of keybuk again so I can watch him spend 15 minutes demonstrating how to effectively convey his feelings with a vocabulary composed 95% of swear words :)
<TheMuso> RAOF: Haven't checked yet, am about to head into a meeting. Will check later.
<RAOF> Heh.  'You often need to do some string processing in C++.  This indicates that you've chosen the wrong language'.
<dholbach> bluefoxicy: what are you talking about? where did I piss off Keybuk?
<bluefoxicy> ROFL!
<bluefoxicy> dholbach:  oh, it was like a year and a half ago, something about openoffice.org build-deps.  I just felt like I should bring it up once in a while but never really got around to it.
<TheMuso>   /c
<bluefoxicy> anyway I'm going to sleep.  I'm even more disruptive when drowsy.
<dholbach> bluefoxicy: I never uploaded anything related to bluefoxicy
<dholbach> to openoffice
<bluefoxicy> You seem drowsy too.
<dholbach> I just got up
<warp10> Good morning
 * Hobbsee headdesks
<Hobbsee> why do the non-computer savvy people realise they're giving out viruses, but the computer-savvy people don't?
<_ruben> they're too smart to do so
<StevenK> Hah
<DarkMageZ> Hobbsee, "compter-savvy" people think they're awesome and that they'd never fall victim to it. while others will either be completely ignorant or show worry that it could be happening.
<DarkMageZ> there was a kid in my class accidentally infecting every removable hard-drive with his usb stick. he somehow didn't manage to think that he was doing it.
<Hobbsee> tasty.
<DarkMageZ> he had a virus that would make the machine shutdown when you tried to do anything that could destory it... like run command prompt. this was on hard-drives for cisco class. so no ping :'(
<\sh> ScottK, you got the fix for wine from yesterday?
<slytherin> DarkMageZ: that is an old one. I have seen that virus at least 1 year ago.
<DarkMageZ> slytherin, no anti-virus in this environment cause we should all be competent.
<slytherin> :-D
<slytherin> DarkMageZ: actually that virus specifically reboots the machine when you open command prompt. I don't remember the solution but see if running 'command' instead of 'cmd' makes a difference.
<DarkMageZ> oh, this one has other triggers like regedit and other things
<slytherin> DarkMageZ: may be it is a variant
<DarkMageZ> meh, either way. not my problem. i boot into a ubuntu live cd anyways.
<mok0> dholbach: ping
<dholbach> mok0: pong
<mok0> dholbach: hi, dholbach, I have a few troubles with 5-a-day
<dholbach> mok0: fire away
<mok0> dholbach: hang on, I need to find it first :-)
<mok0> dholbach: in files.py, you need to import os
<mok0> dholbach: otherwise it wont find os.syserr
<mok0> dholbach: sorry, it's SYS
<mok0> dholbach: sys.stderr
<dholbach> mok0: I have the fix queued up, will upload in after I've checked some other things
<dholbach> s/in/it
<mok0> dholbach: second, when I tried to register bugs yesterday, it kept on telling me to use --add on the first few bugs
<dholbach> erm.....
<mok0> dholbach: but that was what I was doing...
<dholbach> can you paste me what the command line output?
<DktrKranz2> mh... z88dk should not be available for amd64 and ia64, but it keeps building. Any clue on how to exclude it for these ports?
<mok0> dholbach: ok, 2 secs
<dholbach> mok0: gracias
<Hobbsee> RAOF: so, why is gnome-do terrified of openoffice?
<mok0> dholbach: I haven't got a bug # from today yet
<dholbach> mok0: just give it 123456 - I can remove that from bzr afterwards
<mok0> 5-a-day --add 123456 gives
<mok0> You need to use  5-a-day --add  first to add a few bug reports to your list.
<mok0> :-)
<dholbach> erm
<mok0> dholbach: Ah, I see you have an LP project for 5-a-day, so I could've reported it there
<dholbach> mok0: thanks for reporting it at all - I don't mind IRC :)
<TheMuso> RAOF: re vlc and your comment earlier, they have using namespace std, so I don't know what you were referring to.
<dholbach> mok0: did you ever successfully use 5-a-day?
<dholbach> mok0: what does    cat ~/.5-a-day   say?
<mok0> dholbach: @12:51: no
<mok0> dholbach: @12:52: mok0
<dholbach> mok0: OK, found it - fixing it
<mok0> dholbach: hey  cool
<stani> pochu: are you there?
<dholbach> mok0: I updated it with the fix: can you check http://daniel.holba.ch/temp/five-a-day_0.26_all.deb (and http://daniel.holba.ch/temp/five-a-day-applet_0.26_all.deb if you use that) and see if that fixes the problem?
<mok0> dholbach: sure, will do right away
<stani> I've added a patch to Bug #214539 which fixes it. Can someone upload it (pochu, ScottK, POX_, ...)?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 214539 in phatch "Phatch is unusable for specific themes" [Critical,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/214539
<pochu> stani: yes
<pochu> stani: I didn't know you used Launchpad for Phatch :)
<stani> pochu: thanks
<pochu> stani: you know, I know write phatch instead of patch sometimes ;)
<stani> pochu: Well spe was started before Ubuntu was born. For Phatch I decided to go for what is most friendly to my main distro (launchpad+bzr).
<stani> pochu: Haha, that is also what I like about the name: Phatch patches your photos.
<mok0> dholbach: I get an exception
<stani> pochu: BTW, the phatch repository is up and running in PPA ;-) Thanks a lot.
<RainCT> Hi
<mok0> dholbach: http://paste.ubuntu.com/6662/
<mok0> dholbach: making the directory now
<pochu> stani: cool :)
<dholbach> mok0: the directory does not exist?
<pochu> stani: uploading. POX_: I've based phatch in the Debian package, including a patch to fix themes
<mok0> dholbach: no
<dholbach> mok0: hang on then
<mok0> dholbach: I created it, and got another exception
<dholbach> yes
<pochu> stani: if you want me, I can include this patch in Debian... it's trivial to do so
<mok0> dholbach:  http://paste.ubuntu.com/6663/
<stani> pochu: ok, you can do so. But after Hardy release, I will release Phatch 0.1.4 which includes this patch. Besides Debian and Ubuntu Phatch is also available on ArchLinux. So I want them to get it too.
<stani> pochu: do you have some time to chat about the SPE PPA? (here on in #heya)
<pochu> stani: yes, but I may be a bit slow to speak... let's join there
<POX_> pochu, stani: I will be home in 4 or 5 hours
<POX_> I will upload it then
<stani> POX_: Thanks.
<POX_> (if I upload it now, it will still have to wait for dinstall)
<pochu> POX_: ok, I'm including the patch in svn
<dholbach> mok0: I uploaded a new version. could you remove the directory you created and try with the new version again?
 * dholbach hopes it works for real now, ugh
<mok0> dholbach: on your ppa?
<mok0> dholbach: ... or using the same URI's from before?
<dholbach> mok0: no on http://daniel.holba.ch/temp/
<mok0> dholbach: ok
<dholbach> gracias mok0
<mok0> dholbach: glad to be able to help!
<dholbach> I refactored the code in the last version, seems like I optimised a few safety checks away :/
<dholbach> test driven development...... one day
<mok0> dholbach: I deleted the directory .5-a-day-data, and I still get an exception
<mok0>  File "/usr/lib/python2.5/site-packages/fiveaday/files.py", line 107, in add
<mok0>     f = open(log_file(), "a")
<dholbach> erm... maybe I didn't upload the right .deb - hang on
<mok0> dholbach: it was version 0.26
<dholbach> yeah, I didn't bump the version, just rebuilt the package with new code - could be I uploaded the wrong one
<dholbach> can you download the .deb again (this time it should be the right one)
<mok0> dholbach: ok, hang on
<dholbach> sorry
<mok0> dholbach: still getting exception
<dholbach> argh
<mok0> dholbach: same as above, line 107
<dholbach> this is my line 107:
<dholbach>                        return 106 #106: bug has already been added today
<mok0> dholbach: checking...
<dholbach> I just downloaded the .deb - maybe it was proxied or something
<mok0> dholbach: I used wget
<dholbach> 591d29a5eeb9ae7b621f0026ed678631  five-a-day_0.26_all.deb
<dholbach> this is the md5sum of the .deb I downloaded myself
<mok0> dholbach: nope, that's not the one I have...
<mok0> dholbach: now I have it
<dholbach> ROCK
<mok0> dholbach: it's doing something
<dholbach> woohoo
 * dholbach hugs mok0
<mok0> {{{ dholbach }}}
<dholbach> :-)
<mok0> dholbach: ... how long is it supposed to work?
 * mok0 hopes it's not just hanging...
<dholbach> no
<dholbach> 5-a-day stores all the submitted bugs in bzr, so it'll get the branch now, then add your submitted bugs to it
<dholbach> if you run ps afxvw, you will notice that bzr is doing its thing
<mok0> dholbach: yikes  is it copying the entire bug db?
<mok0> :)
<dholbach> no :-)
 * dholbach uploads to PPA
<dholbach> thanks again mok0
<dholbach> you ROCK
<mok0> dholbach: ah, committed now. Very advanced syststem
<mok0> dholbach: you too
<dholbach> mok0: we used the same in bughelper (for the bug clues), it worked quite well :)
<mok0> dholbach: can I add yesterday's bugs?
<dholbach> sure
 * dholbach -> dogwalk
<ScottK> \sh: No.  No one gave me a debdiff for wine, AFAIK.  I know it's a simple change but may available mental bandwidth is very limited right now.
<\sh> ScottK, you need to change the build-dep of "libgif-dev|libungif-dev" to "libungif-dev" just for the gutsy backport
<ScottK> OK.
<\sh> ScottK, which means wine backport needs a small change sourceful upload
<ScottK> I can do that.
<ScottK> Do I want .58 again or try with .59?
<\sh> ScottK, we had this problem before, you remember? it was because fontforge was clashing with libgif (for I don't know what reason)
<ScottK> I do vaguely remember.
<ScottK> I was hoping you and Scott had solved it somehow.
<\sh> ScottK, i missed the wine .59 upload..so I would say go with what scott uploaded yesterday :)
<ScottK> K
<jdong> ScottK: let's look at .59 for wine
<\sh> oh man...I have such a horrible setup for a server now....
<jdong> ScottK: would it hurt anything to flip to the b-d in universe then backport?
<ScottK> jdong: We want to prefer libgif for the future, so I think that would be wrong.
<\sh> jdong, yes it will hurt
<jdong> I see
<\sh> jdong, libungif is gone since hardy
<\sh> jdong, so we need to go with libgif
<\sh> jdong, but for gutsy it's different
<jdong> ok let's do a sourceful backport of .59 though
<ScottK> jdong: Just give it a spin and make sure it works.  I'll do a sourceful backport.
<ScottK> I'm leaving town tomorrow AM, so it needs to be today.
<\sh> jdong, just wait until this evening...I have to reintroduce the lpia changes
<jdong> cool! ScottK is telling me to play Starcraft.... IMMEDIATELY....
<ScottK> Sounds like a useful stress test case.
<ScottK> jdong: YokoZar said iTunes works on .59 too.
<jdong> :)
<\sh> anyways.../me goes back to 7TB serevr
<zul> jdong: slacker..
<jdong> zul: between studying for a number theory test and playing starcraft, which would YOU choose ;-)
<jdong> too bad I have to study waiting for it to compile
<zul> jdong: well being the geek that I am obviously the number theory ;)
<mok0> when builds are done in the build queue, how long before they appear in the archive?
<Hobbsee> depends on how far through the publisher it is, but between 30 mins and an hour, iirc.
 * persia thinks it is between 42 and 99 minutes
 * cody-somerville doesn't think persia is being facetious either.
<persia> Nope.  The difference between my guess and Hobbsee's is that I think there is a delay cycle between the thing that copies from built to accepted before the publisher runs, although there could have been internal improvements since I last asked lots of questions (October).
<persia> s/before/and/
<Hobbsee> evening mdomsch
<mdomsch> good day Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> persia: there have been improvements, and i don't think it's just for ppa
<mdomsch> see my blog this morning - I was hanging out with some ubuntu/canonical folks last night
<Hobbsee> mdomsch: ready for hardy freeze?
<mdomsch> Hobbsee, I trust superm1 has it under control :-)
 * persia defers to Hobbsee, who pays more attention to these things, but suspects that 43 minutes is still a likely minimum
<Hobbsee> ah yes, that's right.
<Hobbsee> persia: i'm no soyuz expert.  It was too frustrating.
<persia> heh
<Hobbsee> persia: Fujitsu is the resident expert.
<Hobbsee> mdomsch: where is your blog?
<persia> mok0: There's your pointer :)
<Hobbsee> oh, found it.
<cpro1> guys, for PRIMARY archive, everything built by :03 will be in the archive by :55
 * mdomsch ribs rtg for not having sent patches sooner, but hey
<Hobbsee> cpro1: ahh, thanks.
<persia> cpro1: 52 minutes?  Is there ever a case when it happens in less time?
<mok0> persia: thanks :-)
<cpro1> for PPAs everything built by :00, :20, :40 will be in the archive within 2 minutes.
 * persia calculates that as 52 minutes to 111 minutes
<Mez> \sh ping
<\sh> Mez, yepp
<Mez> \sh, you were the sponsor for php5-xdebug ?
<\sh> Mez, yepp
<\sh> Mez, if you hit by the "different path names for config" bug
<\sh> Mez, please kick php uploader ,->
<Mez> \sh .... ooh, havent spotted that bug yet... got a link?
 * Mez is actually working on the debian package
<cprov> persia, correct.
<\sh> Mez, no...php5 on i386 has -lfs suffix for module dir, and amd64 not
<persia> cprov: Any chance of the PPA speedup happening for the main archive in the June release, or is the volume just too high?
<Mez> I was just reading through the ubuntu's package code and was wondering if the guy who wrote it supplied painkillers for the headache (and wondered why you didnt just suggest a lintian override for the config.guess and config.sub thing - as client isnt built!)
<Mez> \sh, the code for php5-xdebug shouldnt hit that, as I beleive it uses the proper api placement from php-config5 ?
<slytherin> persia: long time no see.
<persia> slytherin: Just quiet :)
<slytherin> :-)
<\sh> Mez, yeah, php-config5 provides different dir names actually...so having the config file for php I had to do a terrible workaround ;)
<cprov> persia: zero chance, primary archive publication is more complex than PPAs, sorry. We are struggling to keep it hourly 100 % of the time.
<Mez> \sh, hehe... yeah, may be terrible, but it works
<persia> cprov: Understood.  Thanks :)
<cprov> post 2.0 (en of July), maybe ;)
<Mez> \sh, I will however, point you to an issue with the package that WILL cause problems (as the maintainer of XDebug told me
<Mez> \sh, CFLAGS = -02 will cause problems, it needs to be set to -00
<Mez> \sh, can cause a segfaiult
<Mez> From email: I checked this, and it seems -O2 is used in non-debug mode. Please do
<Mez> not do that, as there's some optimization that mess up things and cause
<Mez> a segfault.
<\sh> Mez, not here.
<Mez> \sh, actually I'll quickly fix that in the ubuntu package.
<\sh> Mez, I have it running on amd64 and i386
<Mez> \sh, that may be so. But you have to respect the person who created it when they say it can cause a segfault
<\sh> Mez, sure...does he know how to create this situation?
<Mez> one sec
<Mez> <Derick> no, not anymore
<Mez> <Derick> it could be a specific GCC issue
<Mez> <Derick> I couldn't find *what* it was either
<\sh> grmpf
<Mez> yeah, I know
<\sh> it would be good to know which gcc he was using (gcc 4.2 or 4.3) and actually he should fix it,-)
<\sh> well, anyways, please do as you wish :) if -O0 is better then -O2 let's change it
<persia> Might be a symbol-not-found issue if it compares code to stacktraces.  It might lose track if the line of code under consideration was optimised away (or at least that is one of the things that causes me to interrupt when manually chasing stacktraces).
<ScottK> Hobbsee: I think this is the blog mdomsch was referring to http://direct2dell.com/members/Matt_5F00_Domsch.aspx
<Hobbsee> ScottK: thanks.  i said i found it, though
<ScottK> Ah.  Missed that.  Sorry.
<Hobbsee> jp
<Hobbsee> * np
 * sebner is of the opinion that \sh should consider writing better changelog entries :P
<\sh> hmm?
<\sh> sebner, or better "hae?" :)
<sebner> \sh: better changelog entries :)
<\sh> sebner, example?
<sebner> \sh: https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/athcool  <-- "- Added zlib1g-dev to build-deps
<sebner> " But *why* ;)
<\sh> sebner, it's written there
<\sh>  * Patched Makefile to link against zlib (added -lz)
<\sh> and for zlib you need what in b-d? :)
<\sh> and it's damn old
<mok0> I need a hard-core MOTU to take a look at bug 110613
<sebner> \sh: mÃ¶hh. Nevermind then ^^ but debianfixed the -lz issue without adding zlib
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 110613 in svn-buildpackage "patch: empty files in files list, add missing "-p" to mkdir" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/110613
<\sh> sebner, no...they just uploaded a new upstream version
<sebner> \sh: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=450447
<ubotu> Debian bug 450447 in athcool "athcool: FTBFS: undefined reference to `gzopen'" [Serious,Fixed]
<\sh> sebner, yes...seriously...I compiled the package before and most probably it ftbfs because of the missing build-dep
<\sh> these days...
<sebner> \sh: I did a rebuild without problems (of the debian package)
<\sh> sebner, the .11-1 version?
<\sh> sebner,  in feisty? :)
<sebner> \sh: ^^ hardy. I'll make a sync. new version is a 1bugfix-release
<sebner> \sh: .12-2
<sebner> Ã¤h
<sebner> .12-1
<\sh> sebner, yeah...the old version is sitting in ubuntu since feisty :)
<\sh> sebner, and I uploaded it during feisty :)
<sebner> \sh: I know as you can see ^^
<sebner> \sh: do you remember on which platform it FTBFS? Otherwise I will make a sync request as it seems that the build-dep isn't necessary anymore
<\sh> sebner, imho it was just libz missing in feisty for some reason...and no...it could be i386 or amd64...it's long time ago
<\sh> sebner, if it works now...sync and done :)
<sebner> \sh: hmm no. wired. Another problem ^^  Depend on pciutils-dev (>= 1:2.2.10) we have 2.2.4. What's the way in such a case?
<\sh> sebner, check if 2.2.4 is enough for the new version.
<\sh> sebner, well, buildwise and also running
<sebner> kk. thx
<sebner> \sh: btw. wine landed. wuhu :)
<\sh> sebner, well, yes...but without the last cahnges in .58-0ubuntu3 ...:(
<\sh> so I have to readd them tonight
<sebner> \sh: did he forget it?
<\sh> sebner, looks like...
<sebner> damn it
<\sh> sebner, just a few lpia adds
<sebner> \sh: hmm we need the new dependency. So I suppose extracting the fix?
<\sh> sebner, what fix then? it's new upstream...
<sebner> \sh: argh. I already said that new upstream is a *1* bugfix release. "fix freeze problem on SiS741 series chipsets"
<\sh> ah
<\sh> then I wonder why they need a new pciutils...
<\sh> and why it's not working with our version in main?
<sebner> \sh: * Depend on pciutils-dev (>= 1:2.2.10) and pkg-config, and use
<sebner>      "pkg-config --libs libpci" to build statically with the correct
<sebner>      libraries.
<sebner> \sh: http://pastebin.com/m6dbb6341
<\sh> sebner, yes...:) but I wonder, what the fix in the source was, if not using new pciutils or something which relates more on pciutils
<\sh> s/on/to/
<sebner> \sh: maybe because of that. http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=445016
<ubotu> Debian bug 445016 in athcool "athcool: Does not start due to missing libpci.so.2" [Grave,Fixed]
<\sh> sebner, ok...can you extract the fix of upstream for this freeze problem?
<sebner> \sh: I'll try it :)
<sebner> \sh: diff -ruN should be enough? if yes I have to change 1 line. I love such things ^^
<\sh> sebner, pastebin pls
<sebner> \sh: http://pastebin.com/m75690d57
<sebner> \sh: but ignore the changelog ^^ was just testing something
<\sh> sebner, aehm...no the source change :)
<\sh> not the package change
<sebner> \sh: see athcool-0.3.12/chips.h
<\sh> aj
<sebner> ^^
 * \sh 's blind
<SpookyET> hi
<SpookyET> I'm having trouble creating a deb package. dpkg-source: error: source package has two conflicting values - bcwipe-1.7 and bcwipe. I've checked. I see bcwipe-1.7 everywhere.
<sebner> \sh: do I have green lights?
<azeem> SpookyET: 16:47 < azeem> changelog has bcwipe and control has bcwipe-1.7
<\sh> sebner, create a debdiff against the version in hardy (.11-1ubuntu1) and push it to LP and subscribe..I'll upload when I'm at home
<sebner> \sh: fine :) just with the fix our don't we ignore the cosmetic fixes. e.g lintian warning ...
<\sh> sebner, I'll tend to fix the make clean stuff more like this: [ ! -e Makefile ] || $(MAKE) clean something like this ;)
<SpookyET> azeem. I removed from Source and Package. Now it builds into an error.
<sebner> \sh: never saw that before ;) But yes. include all fixes?
<bddebian> Heya gang
<sebner> heya bddebian
<\sh> sebner, it says: test if Makefile does not exists, but when it's there execute $(MAKE) clean :)
<bddebian> Hello sebner, \sh
<\sh> hey bddebian
<sebner> \sh: I know. I'm just wondering why -e and not -f
<\sh> -e is enough imho...need to test if -f fails when it's a symlink ;)
<\sh> sebner, which should fail, if Makefile is a symlink to something else...because of the existence of -h ;)
<sebner> \sh: well I hope you'll upload it though I'm using -f ^^
<\sh> sebner, no..I don't care :)
<\sh> sebner, if you want, just fix http://lintian.debian.org/reports/tags/debian-rules-ignores-make-clean-error.html :)
<sebner> \sh: ehm. what do we were talking about in past xD
 * \sh heads home now...
<\sh> cu later
<ScottK> dholbach: I see we are not going to agree on Envy.  I'm not going to ack it, but I also sent a comment to the bug just now saying I don't want to stop other motu-release people from approving it if they think it should go in.
<dholbach> ScottK: thanks - I realised that others were abstaining from the discussion
<dholbach> ScottK: how is the motu release team doing otherwise?
<ScottK> Seems fine.
<ScottK> I think we could use the extra 2 months that Dapper got for bug fixing.
<ScottK> A lot of things seemed to come late.
<dholbach> ScottK: I guess that makes sense - sounds like good feedback for the "release cycle" session at uds
<ScottK> Personally the late arrival of python-central sucked a lot of my time away from what I wanted to be working on.
<dholbach> with late arrival you mean the bugs that were fixed late?
<ScottK> dholbach: Specifically Bug 204895
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 204895 in harvestman "Packages failed archive rebuild test possibly due to python-central transition" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/204895
<dholbach> ScottK: right - there's also a bunch of "interesting" upgrade behaviour bugs - ask mvo
<LaserJock> ScottK: gfortran was the one for me
<LaserJock> little as I do, that took a lot of my available time
<emgent> heya people
<ScottK> dholbach: I've seen.
<dholbach> to me it seems like we're in much better shape than we were 2 months before dapper release though
<ScottK> I wasn't involved in development then, so I've no basis for comparison.
<ScottK> Getting setools unforked was another time sump I hadn't planned on.
<LaserJock> dholbach: perhaps, I have a bit more of an uneasy feeling, but yeah, there was a lot of "umm, this isn't gonna make it" with dapper
<ScottK> kde3 seems rock solid this time around.
<LaserJock> yeah?
 * LaserJock confesses to running Fedora KDE3 at the moment
<sebner> LaserJock: damn you :P
 * ScottK has enougn trouble keeping one Linux distro straight in his head.
<ScottK> Intrepid should get a little sporting since Debian has started to freeze up for Lenny.
<SpookyET> Firefox is so slow in Ubuntu. It stinks. I have to make a package.
<SpookyET> I don't get why it's split up into xulrunner and a few other things
<LaserJock> because more than Firefox can use xulrunner
<SpookyET> My firefox build for arch linux is 7 times faster
<LaserJock> good for you
<SpookyET> I want to do the same for Ubuntu
<SpookyET> debs are proving difficult
<LaserJock> SpookyET: then discuss it with the Mozilla Team
<SpookyET> LaserJock: I'm not going to wait on somebody else
<LaserJock> umm, but you're waiting on people in here?
<SpookyET> no
<LaserJock> I'm saying you can get firefox-specific help from the Mozilla Team
<SpookyET> I'm learning how to make debs.
<LaserJock> ok
<SpookyET> I've been spoiled by pacman simplicity
<SpookyET> Debian package management and creation is quite messy.
<SpookyET> Is pbuilder like ABS/ports/portage?
<LaserJock> no
<LaserJock> pbuilder is a .deb builder that uses a clean chroot environment
<LaserJock> i.e. you give it a source package and it spits out a .deb
<\sh> sebner, can you give me the bug number for athcool?
<SpookyET> pbuilder create seem to be retrieving a lot of packages.
<LaserJock> SpookyET: yeah, it's creating a minimal Ubuntu chroot environment
<freeflying> can I upload new package now? any exception need? thanks
<LaserJock> freeflying: what kind of package?
<LaserJock> i.e. what do you mean by "new"?
<freeflying> LaserJock: a gui tool for PostgreSQL
<sebner> \sh: I have to upload first. just wondering if I should make a new one or attach at *any* open athcool bug report
<freeflying> LaserJock: never been in Debian/Ubuntu
<LaserJock> freeflying: uh yeah, you need a Feature Freeze exception for that
<ScottK> freeflying: No.  You need an exception and it's stunningly unlikely you'd get one.
<freeflying> heh
<\sh> sebner, create a new one...
<\sh> sebner, I don't see one which mentions the problem
<\sh> sebner, in LP that is
<sebner> \sh: k.
<sebner> \sh: bug #214670
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 214670 in athcool "Fix a freeze on SiS741 series chipsets and various stuff" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/214670
<ScottK> freeflying: Wait a few weeks and be first in line for Intrepid
<\sh> sebner, thx ...
<\sh> sebner, test building and uploading...thx
<sebner> \sh: np. I testbuilded and tested it. Running.  But I can't test the fix though
<\sh> sebner, well, I added the bugno for LP to your changelog (without changing your tagline :))
<sebner> ah ok. sry and thx ^^
<\sh> bah...233 â¬ more to pay for electricity...I have to stop fan in my bathroom
<\sh> sebner, it was on i386 the ftbfs (amd64 is not in the arch list ;))
<sebner> \sh: ah. ok then ^^
<sebner> \sh: maybe also a candidate for a SRU?
<\sh> sebner, then you need to do it down to feisty
<\sh> sebner, please ask someone from the sru team...
<\sh> sebner, did you get the accepted mail from athcool?
<\sh> ah no...there it is
 * ScottK gives YokoZar a smack for \sh
<\sh> hmm?
<ScottK> Your wine upload that added the lpia stuff back in he forgot.
<\sh> ScottK, well, I'll give yokozar a bzr training ;)
<ScottK> That'll teach him to forget something
<sebner> \sh: well the good thing is that I can reuse my debdiff. I'm just curious if it's a candidate
<\sh> sebner, well, you need to provide at least new version numbers...and you have to remove all debian/ dir changes :)
<\sh> sebner, just the code fix is important for SRU ..
<sebner> \sh: what debian/dir changes? the package is the same since feisty!?
<SpookyET> Building debs is a bitch. You've got tools upon tools upon tools.
<\sh> sebner, updating standards version, debian/rules etc. :)
<\sh> SpookyET, you never used rpm and .spec files...
<sebner> \sh: Sry I don't understand. just different versions numbers yes but the debdiff should be the same
<DaveMorris> how do you add/remove new content to a config file when packages are installed, anyone got an example?
<SpookyET> No, I have not. I've used pacman and one simple PKBUILD file.
<Spec> \sh: have too.
<\sh> sebner, no.. the change to debian/rules is not going into SRU, the improved copyright notice doesn't go in, and the standards version change doesn't go into an SRU :)
<\sh> sebner, so only a new changelog entry and the source fix in chips.h is important :)
<\sh> SpookyET, pacman? the suse packman?
<SpookyET> no, Arch Linux
<SpookyET> It's grandma easy. A simple PKGBUILD file and one command: makepkg
<SpookyET> 99% of the time with no arguments.
<\sh> damn...I can't use "cool" anymore and now I need to be careful to use .spec , too ;)
<sebner> \sh: ahh now I understand. Ok thx :)
<Spec> \sh: =P
<\sh> sebner, and now for the fun of it, we have one version in 2 releases (feisty/gutsy) so you need to adjust the ubuntu rev to something else then just -1ubuntu2 ,-)
<Spec> \sh: i don't log/read mentions of "spec" 'cause it's always "did you read the damned spec?!" or "check the spec sheet on it!"
<ScottK> Some MOTU (or hopeful) that cares about nexiuz ought to have a look at https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-motu/2008-April/003575.html
<jdong> Dear Firefox default URL handler:
<jdong> burn in freaking hell.
<\sh> SpookyET, well, ports makefiles are easy too...and gentoo ebuilds are also easy...but cobalt pkg files are complicated...it's a tar.gz file, with an rpm inside which you have to create and another installation makefile in the tar.gz...
<\sh> oh no not again nexuiz
<jdong> ScottK: that's a backports bug
<ScottK> Ah.
<jeromeg> ScottK: i think is wrong, everything is fine for me on both gutsy and hardy
<jdong> ScottK: nexuiz 2.4 is sitting all in NEW
<ScottK> OK.
<\sh> why that?
<jeromeg> ah ok :)
 * ScottK didn't look into it, just wanted to make sure...
<jdong> ScottK: and in my defense that's a soyuz bug.... old versions should NOT be expired this ridiculously quickly
<ScottK>  .. someone did
<jdong> ;-)
<SpookyET> \sh: well yeah. I would say that pacman is the BEST package manager. Similar to apt, but cleaner
<\sh> jdong, bah :)
<ScottK> jdong: Did you file said bug?
<jdong> ScottK: on my TODO list
<ScottK> jdong: You may be using the wrong DE.  Konqueror handles different file types VERY well from my perspective.
<\sh> jdong, it's released dude
<\sh> 2008-03-23
<\sh> jdong, and it's in the archives
<jdong> ScottK: no it's a firefox transitioning bug in GNOME's url handler
<jdong> \sh: https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/gutsy/+source/nexuiz/2.4-1~gutsy1
<james_w> DaveMorris: what are you trying to achieve?
<ScottK> jdong: OK.  I think that reinforces my point.
<\sh> jdong, the backport...this guy is writing to -motu ml..and this means: hardy ;)
<jdong> \sh: I am not sure what he meant
<jdong> he didn't explicitly say Hardy, did he?
 * jdong looks again
<jdong> \sh: but nonetheless it is a backport bug I saw this morning
<jdong> /usr/lib/firefox-3.0b4/firefox "%s"
<DaveMorris> In http://www.mythtv.org/wiki/index.php/MythStreams a couple of files need updating
<jdong> ScottK: ^^ hardcoded 3.0b4
<POX_> are backports for ubuntu generated automatically or someone has to build them and upload?
<jdong> POX_: both
<jdong> POX_: usually generated automatically
<ScottK> Ah
<POX_> someone backported griffith and it's broken
<ScottK> POX_: To which release?
<POX_> 0.9.6-2~gutsy1
<ScottK> What needs to be done to fix it?
<POX_> rebuild probaby
<POX_> .deb doesn't contain all files
<ScottK> Odd.  It was a no change backport from Hardy.
<jdong> deb doesn't contain all files?
<POX_> symlink in /usr/bin is not there, size doesn't match, ...
<POX_> just try to install it
<jdong> I amI am.
<jeromeg> jdong: waht do you think of the pidgin 2.4.x backport ?
<POX_> dpkg should complain and refuse to install it
<jdong> jeromeg: is that a newer one than the last one I looked at?
<sebner> \sh: ^^. we'll see ^^
<james_w> DaveMorris: why can't you just ship the updated versions in the package?
<jeromeg> jdong: yes, 2.3.x has been updated in gutsy
<jeromeg> jdong: there is 2.4.x now
<jdong> jeromeg: then I haven't had a chance to look yet
<jdong> apt-get update
<jdong> dammit
<jeromeg> ok
<\sh> sebner, don't we have another powersaving software in main?
<sebner> \sh: hmm dunno. why?
<sebner> \sh: you mean because this one is outdated?
<\sh> sebner, right :)
<DaveMorris> james_w: because I think they change depending on what other mythtv plugins are installed
<sebner> \sh: I'll fire up synaptic :P
<\sh> sebner, there are two bugs still open...one is about a wrapper script (whishlisted it now) and the other one is about "athcool is not working with suspend/resume)
<jdong> root@jdong:/# which griffith
<jdong> /usr/bin/griffith
<jdong> POX_: the package installed perfectly fine
<sebner> \sh: I see
<james_w> DaveMorris: well, the package that uses these files is taking the wrong approach really, it should allow plugins to drop a file in a directory to register.
<jdong>   Installed: 0.9.6-2~gutsy1
<\sh> sebner, powersaved e.g.
<\sh> but it's also universe
<james_w> DaveMorris: you could insert the text if it is not already present, but that's pretty hairy.
<DaveMorris> ok, I'll have a look when I get home since I need to leave now
<DaveMorris> thanks for the advice
<POX_> jdong: please paste `md5sum griffith_0.9.6-2~gutsy1_all.deb` output
<jeromeg> POX_, jdong : griffith seems to work fine for me, a bunch of gtk errors in the terminal but nothing to worry about
<sebner> \sh: hmm. same features as athcool?
<jeromeg> POX_: 5b67d65a44c4c56be6107b3e70e23e26  griffith_0.9.6-2~gutsy1_all.deb
<sebner> \sh: kpowersave xD
<\sh> sebner, actually I don't need any power saving tool...mostly because I need all the cpu speed for compiz and compiling ;)
<jdong> yeah it runs fine from a pbuilder
<jdong> fetched from archive.ubuntu.com
<POX_> ok, so it's mirror's problem (http://na.mirror.garr.it)
<sebner> \sh: and for nexuiz :P
<POX_> or users
<\sh> sebner, follow #ubuntu-devel pls :)
<jeromeg> jdong: i think the tracker backport should be acked
<jeromeg> jdong: there does not seem to be problems for most people, and it really solves a lot of issues
<jdong> jeromeg: agreed. pochu's e-mail came after my backport process day
<jdong> jeromeg: I have it slated for Friday
<jeromeg> jdong: great
<sebner> \sh: don't even *think* about the possibility to remove it from the repo after my update!!! :P
<\sh> sebner, *eg* :)
<jeromeg> jdong: scribes should be fine too, i've been using the backported package since the 20 of january without any issues
<jeromeg> i guess i never tested a backport that much :)
<sebner> \sh: deal. we remove it for intrepid :P
<\sh> sebner, yepp...we should get rid of old crap which doesn't work anymore on modern systems
<jeromeg> diner time
<jeromeg> bye all
<SpookyET> I've made my first deb. That was freaking complicated compared to pacman packages.
<ScottK> SpookyET: FYI, whining about how awful Debian packaging is does not encourage people to volunteer their time to help you.
<ScottK> \sh: What's you definition of modern?
<sebner> \sh: fine :)
<ScottK> you/your
<\sh> ScottK, well, I think everything which was invented 2007-02-02 ;)
<\sh> insert "after"
<ScottK> Yeah.  I've got a circu 2001 laptop that runs Hardy reasonably well.  Actually far better than Gutsy because acpi was broken for it in 2.6.22.
<ScottK> circu/circa
<\sh> ScottK, serious...when we have a working piece of software for a delicate area like powersaving, I would rely more on something in main, then a piece of software which last upstream version was released in 2005
<ScottK> Well when that laptop was on Gutsy I was using gkrellem because it worked.
<ScottK> The modern stuff didn't
<ScottK> It's a balance thing.
<\sh> ScottK, but compare the new upstream releases between your gkrellm and athcool e.g. I mean, we have to be careful about what software can do to our users hardware (I'll remember this damn discussion about laptop-mode of ubuntu grills laptop hd just because nobody understand the s.m.a.r.t. manufacture data ) :=
<ScottK> Right. I agree about being careful, but one of the nice things about Linux is that you can, in fact, continue to use older hardware.  Let's not throw that away.
<\sh> ScottK, no...but we should deal with software, which is rotten and stinks, and doesn't get cleaned up from debian archives in time for intrepid :)
<ScottK> Agreed.
<\sh> ScottK, which means, old kernel modules (via module-assistant or whatever), which are not updated for new kernel releases etc.pp.
<ScottK> Right
<JontheEchidna> Could the REVU admins re-sync the REVU uploaders keyring?
<RainCT> JontheEchidna: sure, one moment :)
<JontheEchidna> RainCT: Thanks :)
<RainCT> JontheEchidna: what's your Launchpad ID? (knowing it I can sync your key first)
<JontheEchidna> echidnaman
<RainCT> JontheEchidna: ok, done
<JontheEchidna> thanks
<RainCT> no problem :)
<JontheEchidna> So how do I upload a package to REVU?
<RainCT> !revu
<ubotu> REVU is a web-based tool to give people who have worked on Ubuntu packages a chance to "put their packages out there" for other people to look at and comment on in a structured manner. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU
<RainCT> isn't it explained there?
<JontheEchidna> maybe I missed it...
<JontheEchidna> Oh, the dput stuff
<RainCT> yes
<mok0> Why is hardy's devscripts package so far behind?
<RainCT> mok0: because you haven't merged it :)
<ScottK> mok0: You might look if linitian needs updating while you're at it.
<RainCT> ScottK: there's a new version too
 * ScottK has no time for anything but displayconfig hacking right now, so feel free to go for it.
<RainCT> ScottK: it can probably be synced, but does it need a FFe?
<ScottK> \sh, jdong, or YokoZar: I'll be unable to upload probably for a week after today, so if you want wine backported, please debdiff me.
<ScottK> RainCT: It's in Main
<RainCT> hm, true ^^
<RainCT> btw, if a sync is requested today does it need a big-freeze-exception, or not, or does this depend on the archive guy who looks at it?
<ScottK> Exception process is different in Main.
 * ScottK would suggest ping slangasek (just did) and see how he feels about it.
<RainCT> this last question was for universe
<ScottK> What package?
<slangasek> chumbawumba?
<ScottK> Sorry.  Thought we were still talking lintian
<ScottK> slangasek: The question was would it be desireable to update lintian at this point.
<RainCT> ScottK: any package in general. as when someone looks the next time at some sync there's probably already big freeze
<slangasek> ScottK: are there enough new goodies in 1.23.46 to justify it?
<ScottK> Use your judgement as I can't tell you when someone looks next
<ScottK> slangasek: I like it for "Warn if the .diff.gz contains changes while the package uses a patch system."
<ScottK> It's a long list though.
<slangasek> ScottK: then I'm amenable
<ScottK> slangasek: Thanks.
<geser> doesn't it also contain better checks for bashism?
<ScottK> RainCT: Would you be up for checking if the new lintian builds/runs here?
<ScottK> geser: It's a long list
<ScottK> I think it does
<geser> :)
<ScottK> Someone please look into it.
 * RainCT wonders why he has linda 0.3.26ubuntu2 when in debian there's 0.3.24 -.-
 * ScottK goes back to comitting atrocities on kde-guidance.
<RainCT> ScottK: sure, one moment
<ScottK> RainCT: Linda's been removed IIRC
<geser> yes, linda is gone
<DktrKranz> stani, I tried drpython on Hardy and I can open files normally. Is there a specific procedure to trigger the issue^
<geser> Debian bug #469039
<ubotu> Debian bug 469039 in ftp.debian.org "RM: linda -- RoM; deprecated" [Serious,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/469039
<RainCT> oh. it had some nix checks, though
<ScottK> The theory is they're all in Lintian.  Practice is often different than theory.
<RainCT> will, I'll file bugs in lintian then :P
<LaserJock> james_w: so it looks to be a MOTU problem (in regard to the ubuntu-bugsquad thread)
<LaserJock> or at least ubuntu-dev
<LaserJock> not sure what other Core Devs do
<RainCT> ScottK: new lintian builds fine, installing it now
<james_w> LaserJock: sorry, what is the MOTU problem?
<LaserJock> james_w: requiring debdiffs
<LaserJock> james_w: you didn't find any triaging wiki page that said to ask for a debdiff?
<james_w> LaserJock: yes, however there is some good reasoning behind it.
<james_w> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/Responses#head-bca0f1c95c38399375e738b3f5ddd894f44f1b4f
<james_w> however, we don't really have anything better to answer with right now.
<LaserJock> interesting
<LaserJock> that at least isn't making it mandatory, just saying it's got better chances
<LaserJock> although I think that's more or less how it goes
<LaserJock> I don't think we've ever closed a bug because it didn't have a debdiff
<ScottK> I think it's like asking for a new package review for something from a bzr branch.  You can do it, but the number of potential reviewers goes down.
<james_w> there are a few problems that are combining to make this worse than it should be, so I'd like to get input from everyone to get and idea of what the process should look like, and then we can move towards it.
<LaserJock> well, I think having people who don't know what there doing not touch bug reports would be a good idea
<LaserJock> i.e. if you don't know just leave it alone
<james_w> LaserJock: do you have an example?
<LaserJock> the status flippers
<LaserJock> or Importance flippers actually
<james_w> well you need to be in bugcontrol to change Importance, so they have shown a certain level of understanding.
<LaserJock> uhh... yeah
<james_w> but yes, that should be the rule, I agree.
<LaserJock> that would be the problem, IMO
<LaserJock> bugcontrol is darn near meaningless
<james_w> I don't think that's true.
<LaserJock> k, I'd love to be wrong
<LaserJock> I just see a lot of bugmails that indicate that the person doing the work doesn't know anything about the bug or the software
<RainCT> bug 214752
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 214752 in lintian "Please sync lintian 1.23.46 (main) from Debian unstable (main)." [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/214752
<james_w> you could say that a MOTU uploading a debdiff knows little about the bug or the software, and has more potential to damage Ubuntu as a whole.
<LaserJock> I agree
<james_w> However I am sure there are cases where people in bugcontrol overstep their mark.
<LaserJock> wholeheartedly
<LaserJock> I'd so a whole lot of bugcontrol is busy work
<LaserJock> some of which is necessary
<james_w> that's why I think it would be good to have more ways for people triaging reports to escalate them to people that may understand development better.
<LaserJock> but I think we can maybe get everything more efficient
<james_w> however there are obviously issues with that, for instance the lack of developer time, so we need to move there slowly.
<james_w> LaserJock: I'd agree with that.
<LaserJock> we need a cohesive strategy that includes both bug triaging and developers
<james_w> agreed
<LaserJock> my feeling is that the two have kinda "gone their separate ways"
<james_w> I'm going to spend a few days soliciting feedback from that thread on the issue, and then see if we need to make any development process changes at the time.
<LaserJock> we need to really have a look at our processes and policies
<james_w> another thing that is a problem at the moment is that there is no good way to represent all of the states that a patch in launchpad can be in.
<LaserJock> strip them down to what is needed
<LaserJock> and get the documentation together
<james_w> so the two communities need to decide on a structure, and then (with the help of launchpad) implement that and stick to it.
<cbx33> LaserJock, !!!
<LaserJock> as there's just too much for a lot of people to keep track of right now
<cbx33> yo yo yo dude
<LaserJock> hi Pete
<james_w> LaserJock: yes, I agree.
<LaserJock> fundamentally though, we gotta have MOTUs on the same page
<LaserJock> which I believe is a real issue
<james_w> LaserJock: apart from patches, is there any other area that you would like to see bugcontrol and -motu converge in?
<LaserJock> we certainly need to agree on tags, statuses, and Importance
<LaserJock> triagers need to know how to most effectively get things to developers
<mok0> ScottK, RainCT, I will merge devscripts then
<LaserJock> and developers need to help the triagers know what they want
<mok0> ScottK, RainCT, and take a look at lintian afterwards
<james_w> LaserJock: great, thanks, we can look at those at some point then.
<LaserJock> perhaps what we need is this
<LaserJock> a list of every develper process
<LaserJock> that describes what the developer, a contributor, and a triager should be doing
<james_w> that would be great.
<LaserJock> then we can build good processes and policies to match
<LaserJock> and make sure that we're on the same page
<james_w> yeah, it definitely sounds like UDS material.
<james_w> post-hardy at least :-)
<james_w> are you going?
<LaserJock> no, sadly I was hoping to defend my dissertation around that time
<james_w> ah, good luck with that.
<LaserJock> I would encourage though, that UDS discussion only be a part of the solution
<james_w> It won't all be done at UDS anyway, so there will be plenty of opportunity for input.
<LaserJock> we need buy-in and feedback from everybody, not just the people at UDS
<james_w> LaserJock: I agree totally
<james_w> it's just a great opportunity for discussion of this sort of thing.
<LaserJock> sure
<LaserJock> I've just had enough "Oh, but we decided that at UDS" experiences to be wary
<james_w> sure
<SpookyET> Where can I find the xulrunner deb generation files?
<LaserJock> I'm also thinking we should maybe ditch as much Universe/Main diff as we can in our processes
<james_w> I imagine in this case what would be discussed would not be the specifics, but the way in which each side wants to know what they should be doing, and the boundaries that they can expect.
<james_w> LaserJock: that sounds sensible
<LaserJock> we've done a pretty good job of that so far, but there's probably more to do
<james_w> isn't the proposal to drop the distinction in the archive still hanging around?
<LaserJock> yeah
<LaserJock> and certianly it would be a good idea to have matching policies for if that ever happens
<james_w> yes, the confusion would be endless if not.
<SpookyET> Where can I find the firefox 3 deb creation files? are the "debian" folders shared anywhere?
<LaserJock> SpookyET: did you get the source package?
<SpookyET> I have the firefox source, but where can I find the "debian" folder that ubuntu created. I want to modify some things
<LaserJock> if you got the Ubuntu source package the debian directory is in the unpacke source
<LaserJock> *unpacked
<LaserJock> SpookyET: you might want to look at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MozillaTeam/Build/Apt or https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MozillaTeam/Build/Bzr
<LaserJock> except those are kinda old
<sebner> RainCT: around?
<sebner> heya afflux :)
<afflux> hi sebner ;)
<RainCT> sebner: pong
<stani> LaserJock: Thanks for your help yesterday. My PPA is running fine now.
<LaserJock> stani: awesome
<stani> Laserjock: I could go back to feisty. As you guessed installation did not work for all distroreleases the same way.
<LaserJock> stani: yeah, that would've been my guess
<sebner> RainCT: debian folks appreciate my boson .desktop fix patch and are very happy about it ;)
<RainCT> sebner: great :)
<sebner> RainCT: ^^
<yosch> ogra_cmpc: ping
<RAOF> Hobbsee: Terrified?  In what way?
<RAOF> Hobbsee: If you don't remember the context, that was "why is gnome-do terrified of openoffice"?
<SpookyET> I hate open office
<mario_limonciell> why do we still have gnome-bluetooth's obex server available?
<RainCT> good night
<mario_limonciell> it seems counter productive to include it still
<mario_limonciell> since the support is native to bluez now
<mok0> ScottK: ping!
<ScottK> Pong
<mok0> ScottK: I have a suggestion to a fix to pykdeextensions
<mok0> bug 138189
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 138189 in pykdeextensions "application tries to dlopen /usr/lib/libpython2.5.so (only found in the -dev package) " [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/138189
<ScottK> mok0: That'd be cool.
<mok0> ScottK: I will leave it to you, since you've dealt with it's impacts
<ScottK> mok0: I think we've got it worked around for now (packages needing it depending on python-dev), so it needs to be fixed, but I think it can wait.
<ScottK> mok0: Did you test that and see if it works?
<mok0> ScottK: no, I haven't
<ScottK> I'm not sure, but I think I tried that.
<mok0> ScottK: I was hoping you would do it :-)
<ScottK> Not for a while.  I'm leaving town in the AM for a week.
<mok0> ScottK: ok, I'll try it tomorrow, then
<mok0> ScottK: can you suggest a good way to test it?
<ScottK> mok0: Debian needs the fix too, so if it works, push the fix there.
<mok0> ScottK: ok
<ScottK> mok0: Make your own version of kde-guidance that doens't have the python-dev dependency
<ScottK> mok0: Install that and remove python-dev
<ScottK> mok0: If you can run displayconfig then, you have a winner.
<mok0> ScottK: got it
<YokoZar> Approximately how many hours do I have to make an upload before freeze rejects it and I have to ask someone else to do it for me?  I'm debating doing some work now or later this evening.
<Fujitsu> You can upload once the freeze is in place. It'll just get stuck in a queue.
<yosch> hi guys, I got an update for ttf-ubuntu-title (the font to used for Ubuntu branding in the LoCos and other things) http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=ttf-ubuntu-title
<yosch> seb128 told me you'd help me out
<yosch> what the process to follow from here?
<mok0> motu-release ppl, please check out bug 195772
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 195772 in matplotlib "please upgrade python-matplotlib to version later than 0.90.1" [Undecided,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/195772
#ubuntu-motu 2008-04-10
<ScottK> mok0: Ack'ed by me.
<jdong> You can't use `macro parameter character #' in horizontal mode.
<jdong> haha. for some reason that LaTeX error hit my funny bone
<jdong> it sounds so absurdly phrased
<ScottK> Would a motu who has a minute please do a no change upload of cyrus-sasl2-heimdal.  It won't work if it doesn't have the exact same version/revision as cyrus-sasl2
<nxvl> ScottK: can i do it?
<bddebian> Heya gang
<ScottK> nxvl: You could prepare a debdiff, but it's just got a changelog entry, so it's fairly pointless.
<ScottK> bddebian: If you have a minute (and you're the most recent motu to talk in the channel) would you please do a no change upload of cyrus-sasl2-heimdal.  It won't work if it doesn't have the exact same version/revision as cyrus-sasl2
<bddebian> From Debian?
<ScottK> No, from ours.
<ScottK> Just bump the revision to match cyrus-sasl2
<ScottK> bddebian:
<ScottK> ^^
<bddebian> Ohhh
<ScottK> Thanks
<bddebian> Uhm, aren't they both already -18ubuntu1 ?
<ScottK> No.  ubuntu2 just got uploaded.
<ScottK> bddebian: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/hardy/+source/cyrus-sasl2/2.1.22.dfsg1-18ubuntu2
<bddebian> Ah, OK
<LaserJock> hi all
<ScottK> Hi
<LaserJock> can I get somebody to look at doing the SRU for flashplugin-nonfree for dapper and Feisty?
<ScottK> bddebian: Thanks. My youngest brother is getting married on Saturday and we're flying out early tomorrow, so I'm kind of out of bandwidth in my brain just now.
<bddebian> Heya LaserJock
<ScottK> LaserJock: nxvl was looking for something to do.  He'd need sponsoring though
<LaserJock> ScottK: btw, thanks for approving the matplotlib FFe, I use it in my research
<Hobbsee> ScottK: i agree with you, w.r.t envy and the # of updates.
<Hobbsee> cant 'believe i didn't think o fit before
<Hobbsee> RAOF: it won't open any oo.o (writer, and calc, at least), document.
<LaserJock> RAOF: what won't?
<LaserJock> grr, that was for Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: gnome-do
<secretlondon> Is anyone around who could help me sanity check my solution to a bug?
<secretlondon> it's on audacity and is bug #193593
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 193593 in audacity "Audacity effects missing" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/193593
<bddebian> ScottK: Uploaded btw
<ScottK> bddebian: Thanks.
<ScottK> Hobbsee: Another thought I have is that approving that FFe (Envy) is money in the bank for the least FOSS oriented video card maker.  I don't like encouraging them.
<Hobbsee> well, i see the point of the video card.s
<Hobbsee> but its' like granting a uvfe for cheese in gutsy or the easycryt stuff - there's a package every week, afair
<ScottK> Yeah.  I think he was blogging about even more updates today.
<ScottK> Hobbsee: Would you please ack/approve the matplotlib FFe - LaserJock wants it.
<Hobbsee> ScottK: do i need to view the bug first?
<ScottK> Wouldn't hurt
 * ScottK gets the bug
<ScottK> Hobbsee: Bug 195772
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 195772 in matplotlib "please upgrade python-matplotlib to version later than 0.90.1" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/195772
<cody-somerville> :)
<xtknight> lol ouch bug 214898
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 214898 in ubuntu "latest batch of updates deleted all user docs, pics, music and vids?" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/214898
<secretlondon> eek
<xtknight> hmm
<xtknight> is it safe to ask for someone's whole /var/log directory in a tar.gz?
<RAOF> Hobbsee: Hm... works here (with non-trunk crazy-devel build).
<xtknight> i dont suppose any personal info could be in there?
<cody-somerville> xtknight, I wouldn't be so sure of that.
<RAOF> Hobbsee: ...and works with the Universe version, too.  What are you actually trying to do, again? :)
<xtknight> i'd love to help this poor guy i just dont know how
<Hobbsee> RAOF: ctrl+space, type in name.
<RAOF> Hobbsee: As in: ctrl+space name_of_document, or ctrl+space openoffice.org writer?
<RAOF> Hobbsee: Because either one WorksForMe(tm)
<Hobbsee> RAOF: the former.
<RAOF> Hobbsee: Is this because name_of_document isn't coming up as an item?  It needs to be somewhere fairly specific to be indexed, IIRC.
<Hobbsee> it's coming up as an item. it's in ~
<RAOF> Hm.
<RAOF> What does it do when you press enter?  It brings up a nautilus window showing ~, I bet.
<Hobbsee> no, it does nothing
<RAOF> Hobbsee: Can you take a screenshot?  Urgh!  What's in the second pane of Do?
 * StevenK kicks printers
 * secretlondon *hates* soundtouch
<StevenK> RAOF: I wonder if Noveau won't corrupt the off-screen 2D buffer if X is restarted and the blob isn't unloaded.
<TheMuso> RAOF: Re vlc from yesterday, I didn't quite understand what you were getting at. The macro/variable that were were talking about, and somethign to do with it being from algorithm. Algorithm is included, and they also have 'using namespace std;'
<AnAnt> Hello, is it appropriate to use dh_icons in an icon theme package ?
<jdong> ScottK: ack completely forgot to tell you, sourceful backport of wine .59 is fine
 * jdong hugs tomboy for that one
<ScottK> jdong: Debdiff me in about the next 10 minutes or wait a week.
<jdong> ScottK: rofl
<ScottK> Not kidding
<jdong> ScottK: mmmkay I'll try speed crackporting!
<jdong> I like that term :)
<ScottK> Actually it's a little longer because my 16 year old is using the laptop to load her iPod.
<jdong> tell her to take longer! break libgpod!
<ScottK> I confess it's on Windows.  iTunes is the one thing they are still allowed to use it for.
<StevenK> Ewww!
<jdong> gasp :D
<StevenK> Bad ScottK
<ScottK> I have high hopes that'll change.
<ScottK> It's not like I use it.
<StevenK> ScottK: Try again with Hardy, I
<StevenK> ScottK: Try again with Hardy, I'd suggest
<ScottK> I will.
<ScottK> Just haven't had time.
<jdong> yeah Apple tries very hard to be a prick to the rest of the the world with their devices :)
 * jdong waits for wine to debdiff
<jdong> ScottK: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/13309179/debdiff
<ScottK> jdong: Thanks.
<jdong> ScottK: thank *you* :)
<jdong> guys I just impulsively ordered a N800
<jdong> will I be happy with that purchase? :)
<nxvl> ScottK: did you sleep sometimes?
 * nxvl is starting to think that ScottK is an IA bot
<nxvl> :P
<StevenK> jdong: Only if you don't want a keyboard or GPS
<ScottK> Yes.
<jdong> nxvl: is it that you are starting to think that makes ScottK an AI bot?
<nxvl> jdong: hes always here
<jdong> StevenK: (1) I think I can live without a keyboard , compared to dishing out for the $400 one (2) too bad a GPS can't navigate MIT buildings. Because that's what I really need a GPS for
<jdong> "proceed to.. next hallway... and... veer left... through the second door"
<jdong> "checking route for traffic..." :D
<ScottK> Three cheers for bulletproof X.
<RAOF> TheMuso: Oh, right.  So the most obvious possibility is excluded.  Sorry, I don't have anything more :/
<RAOF> StevenK: nouveau won't start X if the blob's kernel module isn't unloaded.  I can, however, unload the blob's kernel module then start X with nouveau just fine.
<dholbach> good morning
<cody-somerville> Morning dholbach
<dholbach> hiya cody-somerville
<cody-somerville> :)
<RAOF> Heya dholbach, cody-somerville.
<ScottK> jdong: Uploaded.  Thank you for your contribution to Ubuntu ;-)
<RAOF> Let's gett this greeting snowball rolling!
<jdong> ScottK: why thank you ;-)
<xtknight> what's the "diff splash" patch system
<RAOF> xtknight: Reference?
<xtknight> RAOF, what-patch
<xtknight> on source pakage elinks
<jdong> oh oh! I know! One clucks in defiance and the other...
<jdong> or is that the wrong punchline?
<RAOF> Hm.  Probably just inline patching in the diff.gz.
<xtknight> i see a debian/patches/ folder with .diff files
<xtknight> but i'm not sure what to use to "push" them all so i can make a new one
<dholbach> hi RAOF
<RAOF> xtknight: What's in debian/rules?  That'd be a fallback herustic :)
<xtknight> yeah except im clueless at reading rules but here it is http://rafb.net/p/lwIYmE66.html
<xtknight> it just looks like an unmanaged patch system
<xtknight> sleezy. tell me why would someone even take the time to write something like that when they could use dpatch?
 * xtknight must be missing something, but it wouldn't be a first time
<RAOF> xtknight: Because they didn't know about dpatch?  Because they thought they could do it easier?  I mean, dpatch requires a whole lot of effort :)
<xtknight> it does?
<xtknight> alright i guess i must have it much easier then... my dpatch-edit-patch seems to work graet for me, maybe they have to do something a lot harder :o
<jdong> xtknight: but you have to include a .make, and add 2 dependencies to debian/rules targets.....
<jdong> xtknight: all of which time could be spent writing a recursive scheme patchsystem!
<RAOF> Yeah, I was being silly.
<ScottK> Because they made the package before dpatch-edit-patch was written?
<xtknight> hehe
<jdong> pfft dpatch-edit-patch always existed. It's just a story made up to scare the little ones.
<jdong> like Redhat 7.
<StevenK> RAOF: Ah, that wasn't really the question.
<StevenK> jdong: RedHat 7.0, even
<jdong> StevenK: silly me, how could I forget the big-Oh at the end?
<jdong> (that's what she *cough* nvm)
<warp10> Good morning
<jdong> rule #3 of #ubuntu-motu: When someone comes in to say good morning, it's probably bedtime.
<RAOF> StevenK: What was the question? :)
<AnAnt> Hello, is it appropriate to use dh_icons for an icon themes package ?
<StevenK> RAOF: So, with the blob, if I restart X without unloading it, it looks fine, except the 2d off-screen buffer is stuffed, and things like Xv don't show the real content.
<RAOF> StevenK: That's cool!
<StevenK> It so isn't.
<RAOF> Yeah, fair crack of the whip.
<RAOF> Well, there's always the 'try nouveau' approach.
<StevenK> Which means no WoW, I suspect :-)
<RAOF> Not necessarily!
<RAOF> Although, if you'd like fast, not-horribly-glitchy rendering, yes :(.
<StevenK> Yay for 3D driver programming by guesswork
<RAOF> Oh, that's software mesa I'm talking about :)
<RAOF> WoW dies with a shader error with the nv4x gallium driver :)
<StevenK> Heh
<RAOF> But this might actually be an old mesa bug, rather than a problem with nouveau per se.
<RAOF> And it's not actually 3d driver programming by guesswork; they pretty much know how the thing works.  Yay renouveau!
<StevenK> RAOF: Which bit is taking time, then?
<xtknight> http://packages.ubuntu.com/source/hardy/elinks
<xtknight> um this should be Core Devs not MOTU Devs for Maintainer right?
<xtknight> !info elinks
<RAOF> StevenK: Developer time, apparently.  There aren't actually that many devs working on nouveau who understand gallium (which is apparently really hard without an intimate knowledge of 3d hardware).
<\sh> moins
<AnAnt> !info elinks
<ubotu> elinks (source: elinks): advanced text-mode WWW browser. In component main, is optional. Version 0.11.1-1.5ubuntu1 (gutsy), package size 611 kB, installed size 3340 kB
<\sh> could be that it was in universe before it was promoted to main
<\sh> oh no...
<freeflying> dholbach: #203571
<dholbach> freeflying: hello.... how can I help you?
<freeflying> dholbach: did u sponsor this upload? I consider re-opening it, the bug reporter hasn't provide a patch
<dholbach> freeflying: is it about the 0.5.23? if so, I'm in touch with Arne abou it
<dholbach> I sponsored 0.4.23-1ubuntu2 (see comment 9)
<freeflying> dholbach: yes, the package is not nice :)
<dholbach> freeflying: it'd be better to mention that on the bug report
<dholbach> I'll subscribe to it
<freeflying> dholbach: the bug reporter amend file in  upstream directly
<dholbach> freeflying: better to mention that on the bug report - I merely sponsored it, but have no means of checking if the result is actually OK - I trust Arne to figure it out
<freeflying> dholbach: as to this bug itself, we'd discuss with arne firstly, xfonts-wqy is in main too, and xfonts-wqy provide the bitmap fonts
<dholbach> freeflying: can you let Arne know what the problem is - once you figure out the solution together, I can help to get it sponsored
<freeflying> dholbach: arne is familiar with it, and I will discuss with him this weekend, or sometime tomorrow :), I prefer to sync 0.5.23 from sid firstly
<dholbach> freeflying: thanks for working on it - once you've come to a decision together, I can see it gets done
<freeflying> dholbach: u r welcome, and I re-open this bug
<Fujitsu> Um.
<Fujitsu> Wow.
<Fujitsu> Why is Wine autorunning Windows executables that are got from Firefox?
<Fujitsu> No questions asked?
<Amaranth> Gotta copy Windows, you know.
<wolfger> you should be able to tell Firefox not to open those things automatically.
<mok0> Zzzz
<mok0> If anybody from FFE team is online, please give 2nd ack for bug 195772
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 195772 in matplotlib "please upgrade python-matplotlib to version later than 0.90.1" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/195772
<\sh> Fujitsu, firefox does ask questions, and it doesn't ask if you told ff to not ask questions anymore while opening apps
<\sh> Fujitsu, this is normal, and a layer 8 problem :)=
<\sh> wolfger, it's a user problem...user too lazy error
<Iulian> Heya
 * Hobbsee finally gets home
<Hobbsee> RAOF: so, it's playing nice now.  NFI why.
 * mok0 pokes Hobbsee with a stick for beating him at yesterdays 5-a-day stats
<Hobbsee> haha
<Hobbsee> mok0: you should do firefox today.
<mok0> Hobbsee: eeek
<mok0> Hobbsee: what do you have in mind?
<Hobbsee> mok0: dunno.  i'm sure i'll find something.  mvo wants help, too
<AnAnt> Hello, is it appropriate to use dh_icons for an icon themes package ?
<jroes> sorry to bother you guys with this, but does anyone know what package contains the std c library manpages?  I need to be able to e.g. man {send,recv,printf,..whatever}
<slytherin> jroes: I guess it is manpages-dev
<jroes> awesome!
<jroes> that's probably why I never found it :)
<jroes> thanks slytherin
<RainCT> Hey
<james_w> hi RainCT
<mok0> So, from today, we need mr team ack for EVERYTHING, yes?
<\sh> from the 11th on, yes
<\sh> imho the 10th is still free ;)
<mok0> Ah ;-)
<Hobbsee> ScottK: shot down envyng some more.
<slytherin> \sh: free as in free speech or free beer. :-P
<\sh> hmm?
<\sh> slytherin, free as in "buildds are not in manual mode" ,-)
<Hobbsee> ScottK: i really can't justify a package that gets an upload at least once a week being put into a stable archive, no matter the time of the cycle that we're in...
<Hobbsee> perhaps the month of march 2 - april 2 was especially busy, but it's certainly setting precedent.
<superm1> Hobbsee, getting an upload once a week?  What a reyou referring to on that?
<Hobbsee> superm1: envyng
<Hobbsee> superm1: like i said, in the previous line :)
<superm1> the package itself?
<Hobbsee> perhaps it's not all ng, but.
<Ng> hey what did I do
<Ng> oh, envy-ng ;)
 * Hobbsee just checked the number of blog posts on planet ubuntu about it that definetly had a release, rather than just thanking people for help, and got 5 between march2 and april 2
<Hobbsee> Ng: yes, that.  although some people want tickets to get resolved, if you're in that frame of mind...
<Hobbsee> Ng: unless you want to be put in the repository?
<superm1> Hobbsee, as per my understanding there won't be any changes necessary for Hardy once it's in?
<Hobbsee> superm1: why?
<superm1> all the newer drivers come from a PPA
<superm1> the package itself just grabs stuff from the PPA in a niceish fashion
<Ng> Hobbsee: I have zero interest in envy, I threw all my evil hardware away ages ago ;)
<Hobbsee> Ng: i've only dealt with evil wifi before, so i agree with you
 * Hobbsee managed to sell the evil card to dad.
<Hobbsee> (yay for marvell)
<jeromeg> Hobbsee: that's not nice :)
<jeromeg> lu mais ne l'Ã©tant pas pour moi je sollicite votre aide sur ce sujet
<jeromeg> Actuellement mon systÃ¨me dÃ©marre mais est bloquÃ© environ 5 minutes pendant la sÃ©quence du boot.
<jeromeg> Je ne sais pas comment y remÃ©dier.
<Hobbsee> jeromeg: he's a 'doze user.
<Hobbsee> jeromeg: ich nicht sprecke french.
<slytherin> I kept my dad away from windows right form start to avoid troubleshooting headache
<Hobbsee> slytherin: he started there, so...
<Hobbsee> maybe one day.  but i dobut it
<cprov> Hobbsee: oh right, in that case 'he deserved it' :)
<jeromeg> sorry buggy mouse breaking everything
<Hobbsee> cprov: exactly :)
<Hobbsee> cprov: funny thing is, it's somewhat patchy on 'doze too.
<Hobbsee> it actually behaves better on a stable version of ubuntu, if you don't use the netgear drivers for it
<cprov> then, it can be only justified by his bad karma ;)
<tseliot> Hobbsee: envyng won't need to be updated once a week. If there are bugs (reported by users) I'll fix them. That's all
<Hobbsee> tseliot: oh, you are here.
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: question for you.
<murrayc_> protonchris: ping
<protonchris> murrayc_: What's up?
<murrayc_> protonchris: I just did yet another glom tarball release, in case you feel like packaging it.
<protonchris> murrayc_: does it fix any nasty bugs?
<murrayc_> protonchris: At least one crash.
<murrayc_> protonchris: And it should make apport work with glom again, so we can more easily solve future crashes.
<RainCT> dholbach: ping
<dholbach> RainCT: pong
<RainCT> dholbach: uhm.. nevermind. wanted to ask you something but just found it out myself :)
<dholbach> ok super :)
<protonchris> murrayc_: I'll take a look tomorrow, but I suspect that we will need to wait until after the hardy release.
<murrayc_> protonchris: That would be fine. I just hope it doesn't have to wait for hardy+1.
<sebner> mok0: aroune?
<sebner> *around
<emgent> heya
<emgent> heya dendrobates
<dendrobates> emgent: hi
<emgent> cody-somerville: i fixed and tested bug #190020 in gutsy Xubuntu box, work fine.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 190020 in xfce4-panel "Stack-based buffer overflow" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/190020
<mok0> sebner: yo!
<sebner> mok0: what about the libmail-listdetector-perl? Just too slowly before final freeze started?
<mok0> sebner: bug no. ?
 * mok0 wants an url to click :-)
<mok0> Zzzzz
<sebner> mok0: bug #212512
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 212512 in libmail-listdetector-perl "Please sync libmail-listdetector-perl 1.01+dfsg-3 from Debian(Unstable)" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/212512
<mok0> sebner: you don't have 2 acks for this
<sebner> mok0: ehm. Because of final freeze? because this is a pure sync
<mok0> sebner: last comment is ScottK asking for testing
<sebner> mok0: true but you subscribed motu-release where it shouldn't be necessary (if it was before final freeze)
<mok0> sebner: Since you put the changelog there, I assumed it was because you were looking for ACKs
<sebner> mok0: wth? Also for *normal* syncs you should post the changelog xD and if you can see it's not a new upstream version
<mok0> sebner: I am sorry if I messed it up
<mok0> sebner: I can see it's mostly packaging that has been modified
<sebner> mok0: hmm np :P It's just that I have to satisfy Scottie now ^^
<mok0> sebner: ... and he is travelling for a week.
<mok0> sebner: perhaps you can get someone else from m-r to take a look, I don't dare touch it as long as they're subscribed :-)
<sebner> mok0: ^^. however. we are in final freeze so I suppose I have to provide additional infos?
<sebner> mok0: you make your like pretty easy ^^
<sebner> *life
<mok0> sebner: I was told the freeze is from 11.
<sebner> mok0: then ACK ACK ACK ACK ACK
<mok0> sebner: I don't dare touch it as long as m-r is subscribed
<mok0> sebner: perhaps some older MOTU :-D
<sebner> mok0: it's your fault that they are subscribed. don't forget ^^
<mok0> sebner: I know,
<mok0> sebner: I'll make it up to you
<sebner> mok0: hrhr. I don't care :P but I'll take care ...
<mok0> sebner: I think uploads can be done as before, but now m-r have to approve _everything_
<mok0> sebner: do you have others?
<sebner> mok0: 1 sync + 1 merge. both not that important
<mok0> sebner: they solve bugs + no new features?
<sebner> mok0: for the sync no to the first. for the merge maybe yes to the first. both no to the last xD
<mok0> sebner, then the sync will have to wait
<\sh> Mez, ping
<Mez> \sh - uh-oh, what've I done now
<\sh> Mez, did you eventually changed something in debian/rules for php-xdebug?
<mok0> sebner: the merge will be useful
<Mez> I should have.
<\sh> e.g. install to binary-indep target?
<sebner> mok0: what's the habit for the sync now? Setting to invalid or something like this?
<\sh> Mez, not the -O0 change ;(
<Mez> \sh, nope - the -00 was the only thing I changed on the upload
<\sh> damn....then I was the one who messed up ;)
<mok0> sebner: hmm, good question. Just leave it for now, when intrepid comes along you can set it to invalid with a comment
<\sh> but I was sure I fixed it earlier :(
<\sh> of course I fixed in in ubuntu2...and wtf it was gone now
<\sh> anyways
<mok0> sebner: but the merge is useful if it solves bugs; it will save us the work later
<mok0> sebner: are you able to test that mail lib perl thing?
<LaserJock> Hobbsee: still around?
<mok0> sebner, what's the no. of your merge?
<sebner> mok0: dunno. but definitely not today. I'll leave soon. learning for school :(
<Mez> \sh : http://rafb.net/p/kNP6sW69.html <-- diff between the rules from ubuntu3 and ubuntu4
<mok0> sebner: if you can test it, there's a good chance it will make it is my guess
<\sh> Mez, na...it's not your fault :) I was sure I fixed the bug in ubuntu2 ...
<Mez> \sh *hands you cookie*
<Mez> no worries
 * Mez waits for ubuntu5 :@P
<\sh> Mez, just uploaded...
<sebner> mok0: as I said I don't care because there are cosmetic changes and today I really have to time for it. Merge is here bug #212766 . Though we need debwait since a dependency have to be synced before ^^ But already ACKed
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 212766 in rrootage "Merge rrootage 0.23a-7 from Debian(Unstable)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/212766
<\sh> damn...I wanted to go home already
<Mez> \sh to be fair, I should have spotted that myself
<mok0> sebner: cool, I'm on it
<\sh> Mez, fun part...I'lll run sbuild with -A on amd64...so I don't get it directly...I need to change that
<sebner> mok0: thx
<Mez> \sh, I didnt run a build seeing as it was a 1 char change ;0
<Mez> I should have - eh ?
<mok0> sebner: there, it's on my list
<\sh> Mez, always :)
<sebner> mok0: fine :)
<\sh> anyways..rushing home
<emgent> :D
<pochu> why, oh why did I touch aMule?
<pochu> please remind me not to upload it in the Intrepid cycle :)
<pochu> jdong: where's the best place to make a call for testing in the forums?
<LaserJock> there's a subforum for that
<LaserJock> http://ubuntuforums.org/forumdisplay.php?f=307
<pochu> oh, neat
<pochu> thanks LaserJock
<pochu> LaserJock: do I need any special status to post there? because I have none :)
<LaserJock> I don't *think* you do, but I haven't tried it
<fta> RainCT, adblock-plus 0.7.5.4 is out upstream, will you update it ?
<pochu> argh
<pochu> now the tray icon doesn't work with today's tarballs
<RainCT> fta: yes, thanks for letting me know
<fta> RainCT, cool, thanks
<fta> RainCT, please use the bzr branch
<Sveinung> Hello. It is possible to build dbus-java using openjdk. That means it can be moved to main, right? See https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/dbus-java/+bug/204704 (if I have done somthing wrong I would appresiate if you told me. I am quite new to Ubuntu)
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 204704 in dbus-java "dbus-java should work with IcedTea" [Undecided,New]
<asomething> Hey! I've got a question. If I've got a new package I'd like to get into Ubuntu ready, should I upload to REVU now or wait until the Intrepid archives open? It's obviously too late for Hardy...
<james_w> asomething: you could upload now, but it probably wouldn't be looked at until intrepid opens anyway, so it wouldn't make much difference.
<asomething> ya, i figure folks are a bit busy about now =)
<zorglu_> q. i heard that canonical had a 'program' to help company package their software for ubuntu, anybody got the name of this program ? and who i can talk to to get more info about it ?
<siretart> lol: "So Bruce Schneier is the Chuck Norris of crypto?" - Seen on http://brainstorm.ubuntu.com/idea/6739/
<asomething> ï»¿zorglu_: you might want to look here: http://www.canonical.com/services/packaging
<zorglu_> asomething: thanks
<james_w> zorglu_: also there is http://www.canonical.com/partners/
<james_w> siretart: did you see the Bruce Schneier quotes, in the same vein as the Chuck Norris ones?
<siretart> just looking and laughing at them :)
<zorglu_> james_w: ok looking
 * jdong sets his first high-priority bug in ubuntu....
<zorglu_> asomething: services packaging webpage doesnt give any prize. should i assume it is free of charge ? should i ask somebody else?
<asomething> ï»¿zorglu_: I really don't know. Any ï»¿canonical employees around?
<RainCT> zorglu_: It's paid, I saw the prices somewhere on the site some time ago, but I can't find them now anymore :S
<zorglu_> RainCT: ok thanks. so it will have to wait until i get funding :)
<slangasek> jdong: whee, nice bug, with completely symbol-less backtraces... :)
<jdong> slangasek: yeah I know it's not pretty but it's important :(
<slangasek> to be fair, hardy is the first release to even /have/ flashplugin-nonfree for amd64...
<jdong> slangasek: I'm gonna try the stupid approach and blindly rebuild it against the new xulrunner and see if that does anything :D
<slangasek> eh, or maybe it was in gutsy (?)
<jdong> slangasek: yeah it was in gutsy but not working well
<jdong> slangasek: it worked GREAT up until the upload of FF3.0b5
 * RainCT is wondering if that that Ubuntu Certified Professional thing good for anything
<jdong> slangasek: it'd be a shame to lose it again
<slangasek> jdong: I actually haven't noticed it not working yet
<zorglu_> jdong: 3b5 is known to be very unstable
<slangasek> this isn't a crash of firefox though
<jdong> slangasek: no it's just a crash of the npviewer.bin that shows up in dmesg and blanks all flash applets
<jdong> slangasek: it has not happened for me yet since my rebuild
<slangasek> oh goody
<jdong> I hope I don't jinx that
<jdong> slangasek: looks promising so far, I posted a rebuilt deb so hopefully our testers can try to prove me wrong
<slangasek> jdong: is there any sort of reproducible test case?
<jdong> slangasek: just repeatedly go back and forth between a flash and a non flash page
<jdong> slangasek: i.e. youtube's homepage and google's homepage
<jdong> slangasek: once in a while you will see the flash controls go grey and dmesg shows npviewer.bin crashed
<jdong> apport also whines
<slangasek> ok
<jdong> it is somewhat of a heisenbug though :)
<slangasek> yeah, how many times should I have to switch back and forth on average?
<jdong> slangasek: often times it's immediate crash and burn for me
<xtknight> when's the exact daedline for freeze?
<xtknight> time?
<slangasek> I'm not seeing that
<jdong> slangasek: the day I confirmed the bug it was literally every flash page did it.
<slangasek> xtknight: two hours ago? :)
<jdong> slangasek: well you're special then :)
<xtknight> ah
<RainCT> xtknight: it's already frozen
<RainCT> bah slangasek is faster ;)
<LaserJock> xtknight: do you want to do SRUs for flash on dapper of feisty?
<xtknight> LaserJock, dapper and edgy use flash 7 dont they?  but feisty yaeh
<xtknight> if i can get a VM running
<xtknight> LaserJock, we just came across another slight flash plugin problem
<xtknight> Bug 213827
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 213827 in flashplugin-nonfree "typo in prerm file avoids package remove" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/213827
<xtknight> i have a debdiff ready for this, not sure what i should do about it
<xtknight> it is not serious, i dont think it prevents the package from being removed
<xtknight> well he says it does, i dunno
<LaserJock> I gotta run for a few hours
<LaserJock> if you get a feisty package ready and tested that'd be cool
<xtknight> ok
<LaserJock> I don't know what to say about the prerm thing
<xtknight> posted a debdiff about that already on the page
<LaserJock> it looks fairly harmless (though we should fix it) but the reporter says it causes the removal to fail
<xtknight> im going to see if that's true
<LaserJock> can you test that and the feisty package?
<xtknight> yeah
<LaserJock> alright awesome
<LaserJock> bbl
<megabyte405> Hey - all the packages I upload to my PPA are getting built for hardy, but I don't see where that is configured or an option.  How can I, for example, upload to Gutsy or Feisty?
<xtknight> megabyte405, you have to build the packages on a gutsy or feisty system
<xtknight> and then uploading the resulting source_changes
<megabyte405> xtknight: ah, great, thanks.  Looks like it's time to download some install discs :)
<xtknight> megabyte405, ya right now i'm about to build a feisty package so im geting the feisty VM appliance and using virtualbox/vmware
<megabyte405> yep, I basically survive as a dev on VMware :)
<xtknight> megabyte405, well these only work w/ vmware: http://isv-image.ubuntu.com/vmware/
<megabyte405> Hardy is really really snappy on vmware
<xtknight> as a host or guest?
<xtknight> i always thought ubuntu was a bit slow as a guest, but it's great as a host
<xtknight> another option is a feisty pbuilder but i never found out how to generate source_changes with pdebuild
<megabyte405> as a guest
<blueyed> megabyte405, xtknight: I think you only need to change the "pocket" in debian/changelog..
<xtknight> blueyed, ah maybe, if the pkg is exactly the same other than the version?
<blueyed> xtknight: I think he wants to backport packages from hardy to e.g. gutsy? Source doesn't matter really here, AFAICS
<xtknight> blueyed, ah it could if dependencies varied.  but you're prolly right it would prolly work
<xtknight> would certainly be a good thing to "try"
<xtknight> i mean if the hardy source used new deps that gutsy doesnt have
 * xtknight is a paranoid
 * xtknight is paranoid even
<blueyed> xtknight: sure.. but then it would fail also when building on the target system itself.. but I guess that's what you've meant.
<xtknight> yeah it would fail on gutsy but work on hardy :p
<blueyed> megabyte405: if you want to build-test it on the target distribution, you can use pbuilder for this..
<blueyed> megabyte405: this allows you to easily build packages for e.g. Dapper on a Hardy system. See http://wiki.ubuntu.com
<xtknight> blueyed, do you know how to get a source_changes from pdebuild?  pdebuild -S doesnt do it
<blueyed> xtknight: why not just "debuild -S"?
<xtknight> blueyed, you can use that with pbuilder?
<xtknight> i dont know how to get into the pbuilder "shell" then
<xtknight> i'd use debuild -S on my regular machine for hardy.  say i wanted to do debuild -S under a feisty pbuilder..
<blueyed> xtknight: no, just in the source directory. You want that for uploading, right? So testbuild it using "pdebuild" and then create the changes file using "debuild -S".
<xtknight> i guess what i need is a feisty chroot not a feisty pbuilder *shrugs*
<blueyed> xtknight: you can use "debuild" to create source_changes files for any other release.. it does not need to compile etc, so it just works.
<xtknight> bluefoxicy,  hmm you mean i can run debuild on my hardy machine and make a source_changes for feisty?  how does this work?
<xtknight> sorry.  blueyed ^
<geser> xtknight: sure
<xtknight> just change the release in debian/changelog?
<blueyed> xtknight: yes. Why shouldn't it work. You only need to change the pocket/upload-target in debian/changelog.
<xtknight> is that what you meant?
<geser> yes
<blueyed> xtknight: pdebuild is for binaries, which you don't need for source_changes.
<xtknight> ah
<xtknight> what does debuild -S -sd vs -S -sa do?
<xtknight> i didnt see it in the manual
<xtknight> diff between sd/sa
<blueyed> see man dpkg-buildpackage. (-sa is source included)
<xtknight> and you cant make source_changes and binaries at once or can you?
<blueyed> -sd is without orig sources (-sa includes them). The default is probably depending on the version.
<xtknight> so "sd" is a lighter option , because PPA QuickStart suggests using that for packages already in the archive
<xtknight> and i didnt know why
<xtknight> because it only needs the diff
<blueyed> yes, makes sense, but is not required in most cases (because it appears to be default, AFAIK)
<blueyed> Tried "-S -B" for both?
<xtknight> nah cant do that
<xtknight> i guess "debuild && debuild -S" works :)
<blueyed> yes. or rather pdebuild && debuild -S, that's the most common workflow probably (at least mine)
<jcastro> nxvl: please schedule your merging session in a free slot: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuOpenWeek
<mario_limonciell> syncing something NEW from debian this late in the game, still would need an FFe, correct?
<sebner> mario_limonciell: even a normal sync require a FFe now
<mario_limonciell> okay
<slangasek> "FFe" refers to features
<slangasek> but yes, new packages fall under the feature freeze
<mario_limonciell> that's what i thought, but wanted to make sure
<sebner> heya mok0
<sebner> sladen: ff = feature freeze = final freeze now ^^
<sebner> slangasek: see above xD
<sebner> sladen: sry
<slangasek> hmm, then I guess I should pick a different name than "final freeze". :)
<sebner> nvm
<Seveas> slangasek, 'rf' 'release freeze'
<LaserJock> arggg, my swap died again
<LaserJock> why does that always happen when I have to leave in a hurry and I'm trying to hibernate
<nxvl> jcastro: done
<mok0> sebner: ping
<sebner> mok0: what are you complaints :P
<sebner> mok0: as I said. we have to wait until bulletml is synced ^^
<mok0> sebner, I get a FTBFS for rrootage
<mok0> sebner: ah,
<sebner> mok0: ^^
<mok0> sebner: how's that progressing
<sebner> mok0: hm?
<mok0> bulletml
<sebner> what about it?
<mok0> When can I expect it?
<sebner> ask the mighty archive admins ^^. it got ACKed 1-2 days ago
<mok0> sebner: can't rrootage compile with 0.0.6-2?
<sebner> mok0: haven't test. but you can upload it. DEBWAIT is the magic word
<sebner> mok0: or it FTBFS and we can request a give bck
<sebner> *back
<mok0> sebner: right. I just like to verify that things build
<sebner> mok0: I did a testbuild :D
<mok0> sebner: did you build it with the updated bulletml ?
<sebner> mok0: pbuilder login + debian package. Hmm would be good to remember if it really worked but I think yes. I'll try again tomorrow to be 100% sure
<mok0> sebner: thx
<sebner> mok0: np
<dgrt> The current version of package of centerim does not support yahoo protocols... and it is not clear who is maintaining it... does anyone know if someone is working on updating it to the latest version of centerim?
<RainCT> good night
<mok0> goodnight RainCT
<LaserJock> dgrt: my guess would be no as we are in the Final Freeze for 8.04
<sebner> gn8 folks
<mok0> LaserJock: does the final freeze mean an end to syncs even if they fix bugs?
<mok0> Just checked centerim, and it looks like the last Sid update closes 7 BTS bugs + 1 CVE
<crimsun> mok0: no, just much more stringent.
<crimsun> (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FinalFreeze)
<mok0> Hmm. :-)
<jdong> mok0: yeah, I just looked at it too, it seems to be a very reasonable low-intrusive update
<mok0> Acts of God?
<LaserJock> mok0: there are basically *always* exceptions, the question is what is the bar for acceptance
<slangasek> oh geez, please don't refer people to that page, it's had no input from the release team :)
<crimsun> if the CVE issue(s) is(are) major, then I'm sure an exception is considerable.
<mok0> http://cve.mitre.org/cgi-bin/cvename.cgi?name=CVE-2008-1467
<ubotu> ** DISPUTED **  CenterIM 4.22.3 and earlier allows user-assisted remote attackers to execute arbitrary commands via shell metacharacters in a URI, related to "received URLs in the message window."  NOTE: this issue has been disputed due to the user-assisted nature, since the URL must be selected and launched by the victim. (http://cve.mitre.org/cgi-bin/cvename.cgi?name=CVE-2008-1467)
<jdong> heh
<crimsun> well, better to err on the side of caution IMO.
<LaserJock> that's a nice little cve output from ubotu
<jdong> since when waas user clicking a URL excuse to dispute a vulnerability?
<crimsun> I dispute these Flash CVEs!
<LaserJock> jdong: doh, you have to *run* the trojan horse, that's not a vulnerability :-)
<jdong> I disput e all Firefox CVEs
<jdong> they require user assisted opening of Firefox.
<mok0> jdong: yeah, you have to start the program
<mok0> :-D
<jdong> :)
<crimsun> slangasek: what's a better reference?
<LaserJock> crimsun: my guess would be his email
<slangasek> crimsun: currently none, I'm afraid
<jdong> my guess would be "THOU SHALT NOT PASS!"
<slangasek> well, or the email, yes :)
<crimsun> would be nice to update HardyReleaseSchedule thusly, then.
<jdong> or the FinalFreeze document to reflect actuality
<mok0> dgrt: Looks like the feeling here is that it might be worth filing a please-sync bug for centerIM
<slangasek> crimsun: feel free to update the wiki page to point at the email, with my permission?
<crimsun> slangasek: the FinalFreeze page?
<slangasek> crimsun: I meant HardyReleaseSchedule
<crimsun> slangasek: sure
<Fujitsu> mok0: As you might have noticed, I already fixed that CVE, though we probably want the other fixes.
<mok0> Fujitsu: yes I just saw it
<mok0> Fujitsu: you may want to do the merge yourself perhaps
<emgent> Fujitsu: do you know if securitymeeting logs is avaiable?
<Fujitsu> mok0: I don't really have a lot of time at the moment, but I could try.
<Fujitsu> emgent: I believe they are. It'll be under SecurityTeam/Meetings somewhere, I suspect.
<emgent> nope, there isnt :|
<emgent> Only old logs
<Fujitsu> /MeetingLogs/Security
<emgent> ok found it
<emgent> http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2008/04/10/%23ubuntu-meeting.html
#ubuntu-motu 2008-04-11
<dgrt> mok0: thanks! I will.
<slangasek> TheMuso, Hobbsee: ping
<slangasek> TheMuso, Hobbsee: bug #214083, fwiw
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 214083 in opensync "[FFe request] Please sync opensync_0.22-2 from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/214083
<TheMuso> slangasek: Isn't that main?
<slangasek> TheMuso: the plugins are in universe and need updated at the same time
<TheMuso> slangasek: Oh right, will attend to that, as I want to see this in. :)
<slangasek> ok :)
<xtknight> LaserJock, the feisty-proposed flash debdiff is up at bug 173890
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 173890 in flashplugin-nonfree "flashplugin-nonfree fails to install due to md5sum mismatch" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/173890
<superm1> LaserJock, i talked to the adobe rep at LF today, he wasn't aware of the issue with the naming scheme, and said he'd poke around to get it fixed
<superm1> so we may have a better situation in the future
<LaserJock> superm1: awesome thanks
<bddebian> Heya gang
<RAOF> bddebian heya!
<bddebian> Hi RAOF
<RAOF> (Why doesn't heya tab autocomplete? :))
<RAOF> nv4x gallium now does reflections properly!  neverball isn't evilly slow!
<bddebian> heh
<RAOF> Although it doesn't seem to want to quit :)
<ajmitch> RAOF: but can it play WoW in wine? :)
<lifeless> RAOF: how did mandalon and mantuu go?
<RAOF> lifeless: It turns out that lvl 70 mages kick the pants of lvl 19 mobs.  Who'd've thought?
<RAOF> But there didn't seem to be _that_ much XP gained.  Mantuu is now 17.3
<ajmitch> let me guess, a deadmines run?
<RAOF> SFK
<StevenK> If you play with a much higher level character in a group, your XP is hamstrung
<lifeless> StevenK: its a net win done well
<lifeless> RAOF: how long was the run? 20 minutes or so ?
<RAOF> lifeless: maybe 1/2 an hour?
<nalioth> anybody got a couple of minutes to help oil my rusty brainz?
 * StevenK did a deadmines run with two other 70s about a week ago
<lifeless> RAOF: do you have an xp/hour figure?
<RAOF> lifeless: I think it was somewher around 13K/hr
<lifeless> RAOF: so, 1 level / hour.
<lifeless> RAOF: that can be increased with practice :P
<RAOF> ajmitch: Nope; WoW still dies in st_program_stringify (which I should check against that intel mesa bug; it may well be that gallium hasn't had the fix applied).
<lifeless> StevenK: three 70's?
<StevenK> A rogue stealthed in, and killed all the bosses aside from VC himself, and then a 70 pally ran through the instance trying to drag every mob up to VC so we could try and kill everything at once.
<lifeless> StevenK: rotfl
<StevenK> It was great fun.
<lifeless> StevenK: I *can't* do that on my mage; level one arcane explosion kills the mobs too quickly
<ajmitch> or a paladin tankign all of a scarlet monastery wing?
<StevenK> I've not seen that -- that would be cool.
<ajmitch> RAOF: a shame, it'll be good to start replacing the binary blob
<lifeless> ajmitch: meh, a clothy can do all of SM nonstop
<StevenK> Aside from the fact that Scarlet Monastery sucks to get to
<ajmitch> StevenK: having a trinket that heals on each block is useful there
<ajmitch> lifeless: in 1 pull?
<lifeless> figurine of the colossus
<lifeless> ajmitch: if you mean 'without dropping out of combat' yes
 * StevenK plays a 'lock, still wearing cloth and no shield
<lifeless> ajmitch: walk and ae nostop
<StevenK> Well, I have a shield, it's called a Felguard.
<lifeless> ajmitch: frost nova every time its up
<ajmitch> ah, by the time I get home from work, the new badge vendor should be open
<StevenK> Mmmmm, the Isle
<StevenK> Dath finally hit phase 3 last night.
<ajmitch> khaz is at 97% for the vendor
<RAOF> lifeless: On the plus side, Mantuu is coated in delicious blue
<lifeless> RAOF: I'm jealous
<StevenK> ajmitch: Which phase is that? If you know what you're fighting for, I can figure it out
<lifeless> RAOF: also, lvl 18 :P
 * StevenK replaced one of his greens last night.
<StevenK> One more green and I'll be blue and purples only
<ajmitch> StevenK: midway through phase 3
<RAOF> lifeless: We picked up an 2h blue axe you would have loved.  Sadly, BoP.
<lifeless> RAOF: ah well, we will get to sfk in a coulple of weeks I think
<ajmitch> 1 more purple trinket, and I'll have a full set of epic gear for dps
<lifeless> I have 21 badges on my priest I think; need moar
<StevenK> ajmitch: Ahhhhh, you're a bit a head of us. Dath was 4% into phase 3 when I went to bed last night
<lifeless> cool
 * ajmitch has 190 badges saved
<lifeless> jubei has the badge vendor already
 * StevenK has 14, and is due in Karazhan tonight, so that should give another 5
<StevenK> (Depending which opera event we get)
<RAOF>  /topic Welcome to #ubuntu-WoW
<ajmitch> well, technically we've got the vendor, just not selling anything :)
<StevenK> #ubuntu-wow actually exists, too
 * slangasek stares
<DarkMageZ> i didn't know there was a native linux binary for wow.
<lifeless> StevenK: you aren't downing curator yet ?
<RAOF> DarkMageZ: There isn't.  Wine runs it nicely though.  (On a laptop that isn't totally borked, like mine)
<StevenK> lifeless: Our group needs better gear for Curator
<DarkMageZ> ah, heathens the lot of you :P
<bddebian> heh
<bddebian> Yeah at least NWN runs natively on linux ;-P
<RAOF> bddebian: Is that "natively", like the Eve client?
<DarkMageZ> ut2k4 as well =D
<RAOF> (Which embeds an old and crap cedega into it's installer)
<bddebian> No, there was a Linux client and server
<bddebian> Had to buy the windows CD to get the CD-key though :-(
<nalioth> i used to have a pbuilder set up (still do) for breezy and dapper.  can anyone help me remember how to run this setup with breezy-base.tgz and dapper-base.tgz files in my pbuilder directory?
<StevenK> nalioth: You can pass a --base-tgz argument
<nalioth> StevenK: ah, excellent :)  thanks
<YokoZar> nalioth: for some reason my pbuilder scripts broke when I upgraded to Hardy
<YokoZar> nalioth: I'd recommend starting from scratch with the new pbuilderrc given on the wiki
<nalioth> YokoZar: i seem to have it working ( but i do things the longhanded way )
<emgent> good night people
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: am now
<Hobbsee> slangasek: looks to be doen
<LaserJock> Hobbsee: you pinged me for something yesterday
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: yeah.  what do you think would happen if all, or almost all, restrictions about paperwork applied for intrepid?
<ajmitch> the people would revolt?
<Hobbsee> would they? i thoguth they'd be pleased.
<LaserJock> Hobbsee: what to you mean?
<LaserJock> we through out all the "paperwork"?
<LaserJock> *throw
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: and put an emphasis on thinking before uploads
<Hobbsee> for MOTU's
<LaserJock> well, hmmm
<LaserJock> that sounds pretty chaotic
<LaserJock> I was thinking more like streamlining
<Hobbsee> how so?
<LaserJock> so that we have useful paperwork, helpful paperwork
<LaserJock> well, in general I think throwing out all the rules is just swinging the pendulum (sp?) to the other side
<LaserJock> a nice balance would be good
<TheMuso> Wow. This is the first time I've seen code in a package to check copyright stuff...
<ajmitch> but the suggestion wasn't raised to throw out everything?
<LaserJock> ajmitch: Hobbsee just suggested it :-)
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: i suggested it as a starting point - for MOTU's, anyway
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: I'd withdraw from MOTU in a heartbeat. We still need some paperwork.
<LaserJock> firstly, I think maybe we're obsessing too much "paperwork" and "beaurocracy"
<LaserJock> I'm very guilty of that
<LaserJock> in fact, we really don't have all that much
<LaserJock> some policies could use some tweaks
<StevenK> TheMuso: ... You would?
<LaserJock> for instance, I'd like to make it possible for MOTU SRU to approve bug-fix microreleases
<TheMuso> StevenK: If there was no paperwork involved for some MOTU related stuff, yeah I'd certainly think about it.
<LaserJock> I think MOTU Release has done a good job of keeping things sane
<LaserJock> so I don't think we need to do a lot there
<LaserJock> Hobbsee: do you agree?
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: how much do you trust all MOTUs? :)
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: i don't think it's helpful that i'm getting told off by core canonical people, for asking them why they didn't do the required procedures, because i'm creating work for them, and they're just trying to get their job done.
<LaserJock> ajmitch: I assume that's her poing ;-)
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: it varies.
<LaserJock> *point
<LaserJock> Hobbsee: which procedures specifically are troublesome?
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: actually having to file a uvfes, i think
<Hobbsee> particularly for native packages, where the rules later changed.
<LaserJock> ah
<LaserJock> I agree
<Hobbsee> they just want to upload and do their job, rather than fiddle with teh paperwork, because they're good enough that they're going to get it right anyway.
<LaserJock> we can tweak that though fairly easily
<ajmitch> LaserJock: by exempting core developers, or certain people?
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: motu release certainly isn't looking - or even if they are, there's no real way that we can raise it with people when they're not following policy
<ajmitch> or delegating all responsibility for certain packages?
<LaserJock> ajmitch: perhaps for a time
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: if you exempt canonical, core devs, and trusted (older) MOTU's, then taht would work quite well.  But, you couldn't then say that there was no canonical/community split, and the people who don't fall into the trusted category woudln't be happy.
<LaserJock> we can say that for native packages whether a UVFe is needed is up to the descretion of the developer
<LaserJock> for non-native it's pretty obvious and you avoid having to do UVFes for trivial changes
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: in practice, we know there's a split
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: between which?
<ajmitch> canonical & community practices
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: certain canonical people will tell you until they're black and blue that there is none, and get pissed off that you're saying there is.
<Hobbsee> so exacerbating that may not be so helpful.
<LaserJock> well, we can make it workable
<ajmitch> but I'm good at annoying people anyway
<LaserJock> even if it's "ping a MOTU Release member and get an IRC ok first"
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: sure, but then they discredit you publically.
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: which often doesnt' help for getting other stuff done
<ajmitch> no big deal
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: it is when the discussions suddenly die.
<Hobbsee> but, meh.  I'd prefer not to deal in rants about how i can't effectively contribute to MOTU, again.
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: is it worth making that split worse, seeing as our non-canonical people are likely to be a larger group than the canonicalites?
<LaserJock> sure you can
<LaserJock> we don't have to make the split worse
<LaserJock> I don't see how I'm saying that at all
<LaserJock> I'm saying we can have a pretty laid-back and flexible policy that still provides guidlines
<LaserJock> Canonical people can be held to the exact same standard as everybody else
<LaserJock> and I don't think they expect less really
<Hobbsee> does that actually happen in practice?
<LaserJock> mostly yes
<ajmitch> I'd say it mostly does
<ajmitch> not that I've been watching closely in recent months :)
<LaserJock> we have a few instances each release of Canonical people "sneaking" things in last minute to get a spec done or things like that
<LaserJock> but we can handle that fine
<StevenK> But since the discussion was had privately, it didn't happen?
<StevenK> (I'm guessing)
<LaserJock> StevenK: regarding what?
<StevenK> LaserJock: Never mind
<LaserJock> I don't think anybody has said that Canonical people should be treated any differently
<LaserJock> mostly what happens is people are either unaware of the policies or disgree on the interpretation
<LaserJock> *that* we can fix I think
<LaserJock> I've certainly noticed that Main tends to be more flexible than Universe
<slangasek> Hobbsee: yep, thanks though :)
<LaserJock> which is pretty weird
<Hobbsee> slangasek: y/w
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: why are they unaware?  Are the decisions not on the ML enough?
<LaserJock> well, honestly people are just used to uploading stuff
<LaserJock> they know what they're working on and that it's good to go
 * TheMuso beats the csound package into submission, since the person who requested its syncing didn't check that it built...
<TheMuso> ...or, who acked it.
<LaserJock> so I was thinking of doing like a developer cheat sheet
<LaserJock> with like a checklist to make sure everybody is following the same or similar steps
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: tasty.  And people wonder why i don't trust all MOTU's.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: transient, or "no way this could have built in ubuntu, under any circumstances"?
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: It wouldn't have built, and likely not have even built in sid, but I haven't checked yet.
<LaserJock> a problem I see is that we kind of have to have an agreed upon standard before we can really say "heah, you need to ..."
<TheMuso> This copyright code I mentioned earlier found a discrepancy in the copyright data, and flagged it, hense the FTBFs.
<slangasek> TheMuso: it did build in sid, fwiw
<TheMuso> slangasek: Very interesting.
<LaserJock> Hobbsee: I think a lot of the problems you are facing is that your fighting a subjective/non-existant standard
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: because what's written in the wiki isn't a standard.
<LaserJock> the question should not be "what should you have done?" but rather "did you do what everybody knows you should do" write?
<Hobbsee> its' just suggestions.  or something.
<LaserJock> no, I don't think that's really it
<LaserJock> though some of it
<LaserJock> I don't know what's on most of the wiki pages right now
<LaserJock> like I said yesterday, I often spend more time finding and reading policy wiki pages than I do doing the work
<Hobbsee> sounds like the people at UDS need to do a great wiki rework again.
<LaserJock> well
<ajmitch> the neverending story
<LaserJock> I'm not sure that just endlessly "redoing" the wiki is what we need
<LaserJock> hence why I was thinking of a cheatsheet
<nixternal> to noisey in here
<LaserJock> nixternal: go to bed vista lover
<nixternal> I am trying to
<nixternal> I have a long drive to Michigan in the morning...not looking forward to that
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: cheatsheets would be a good idea.
<ajmitch> nixternal: just dream of vista on the way
<nixternal> I dream of you!
<ajmitch> isn't that sweet?
 * ajmitch finds a bucket
<nixternal> it sure is
<nixternal> hahahaha
<LaserJock> I personally think a lot of the policy wiki pages could be simplifies or clarified
<nixternal> clarified yes
<LaserJock> I read and reread the SRU page like 4 times yesterday to figure it out
<nixternal> LaserJock: if you work up something I will help you tackle the wiki changes
<LaserJock> and I'm on MOTU SRU!
<nixternal> haha
 * ajmitch would need to study for a week before doing any uploads
<LaserJock> exactly
<TheMuso> Right, csound dealt with.
<LaserJock> I want packaging to be the bottleneck for Ubuntu Developement
<LaserJock> and that's what contributors are having a hard time with
<LaserJock> that creating a package is just the beginning
<LaserJock> so we need short, clear, and flexible policy pages
<LaserJock> and not a bunch of them
<LaserJock> and then have a cheatsheet page, a single page, that is all a dev needs once they've read the policy pages
<slangasek> what does "flexible" mean here?
<LaserJock> well
<slangasek> i.e., how does "flexible" differ from "ignorable by people who think they know better but really don't, to the detriment of the archive"?
<LaserJock> I was thinking about times when we make sort of insane policy "rulings" because that's what the wiki page says
<LaserJock> *I* think it differs because I wouldn't say ignorable
<LaserJock> but rather things like letting developers get IRC approval or doing more case-by-case judgements
<LaserJock> I think a lot of things can be at the descretion of the developer
<LaserJock> otherwise what's the point of being a developer?
<LaserJock> the definition of MOTU/Core Dev is "we trust you to do day-to-day work in Universe/Main"
<LaserJock> am I wrong?
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: do *you* trust all the MOTU's to do day-to-day work in universe?
<slangasek> all of the above is rather abstract, and I'm not sure what pages we're talking about that have led to insane policy rulings
<LaserJock> honestly, no, not at the moment all of them
<LaserJock> slangasek: the diffstat thing cjwatson was talking about yesterday?
<LaserJock> slangasek: not allowing any new upstream releases in -updates?
<slangasek> hrm
<slangasek> well, the latter of those is a point of ongoing discussion in the archive team anyway
<LaserJock> yeah
<slangasek> but part of the trouble is that, once you say that /one/ package is allowed new upstream releases in -updates, it's very difficult to know where to draw the line
<LaserJock> yeah
<LaserJock> but that's where I think you can rely on the discretion of the developer for most cases
<LaserJock> and the relavent oversight teams in others
<LaserJock> but if we are honestly looking at what's best for the archive/users
<slangasek> well, we do need to have clear guidelines for the archive team saying when we're supposed to push the button or not, and I don't think those guidelines are ever going to say "a MOTU vouched for it, so rubber stamp it"
<slangasek> (wrt to -updates, that is)
<LaserJock> why not?
<LaserJock> not that I really disagree
<LaserJock> but we used to just upload to -updates directly
<slangasek> because not all MOTUs will necessarily be familiar with the guidelines for what's *supposed* to go into an SRU?
<slangasek> well, ok
<LaserJock> why not though?
<slangasek> why wouldn't they be familiar with the guidelines?
<LaserJock> is it really that hard to figure out what is SRU worthy?
<LaserJock> that too
<slangasek> because SRUs arguably don't fall under "day-to-day work"
<RAOF> Because it's not necessary for "day to day" Universe activity?
<LaserJock> I agree
<LaserJock> and that's why I do think we need an "oversight" team there
<slangasek> ok
<slangasek> in that case, the failure was merely that the archive admin you tagged wasn't familiar with the oversight process and wasn't comfortable sticking his neck out :)
<LaserJock> well, as being a member of the oversight team, I feel a little confined
<LaserJock> I can't just look at an update and say "yeah, that's SRU worthy"
<LaserJock> if I have things like "it can't be a new upstream release, it has to be fixed in the development release already, etc."
<LaserJock> sometimes those are just not practical
<LaserJock> and are more harm than good
<LaserJock> so that's sort of what I'm thinking in terms of "flexible"
<slangasek> ok
<LaserJock> it could be that this is fairly specific to SRUs though
<LaserJock> and not a general thing with "oversight" teams
<LaserJock> I feel like as a MOTU SRU member *I'm* not being trusted
<LaserJock> which I guess may or may not be true
<LaserJock> but I'd hope if I wasn't trustworthy somebody would say something so I could step down
<LaserJock> because *I* don't want to harm Ubuntu or the archive
<slangasek> FWIW, it's my view that the flashplugin-nonfree SRU is one that should never have flown if it were a package in main or universe because there's really no assurance that it's not including random unrelated changes that would constitute regressions
<LaserJock> sure
<slangasek> but obviously you don't have many choices when it's a closed-source app; which we're having to contend with as well for the Canonical partner archive
<LaserJock> I did the best I could, I had multiple people test the package for regressions on multiple browsers
<slangasek> "not being trusted"> in seb128's case, that's probably not an inaccurate description, because he's been outside the SRU process so he doesn't know the decisions that have been made /institutionally/ wrt trusting people
<LaserJock> but I'm slightly concerned because, for instance, I had that update in Fedora within a couple hours, and people notice that kind of stuff
<slangasek> but I don't think it's a criticism of you /personally/
<LaserJock> and the only real roadblock for us was getting it actually *into* the archives
<LaserJock> right, and I know that. seb128 probably didn't even know I was in MOTU SRU
<LaserJock> so I'm not holding that against anybody, for sure
<slangasek> so should I file a wishlist bug against LP asking for the MOTU SRU team to have access to moderate the *-updates unapproved queues? :)
<LaserJock> I think that's in the works already
<slangasek> oh.  should I ask you for a bug number so I can +1 it? :)
<slangasek> or do you think the right answer is that MOTU should be able to upload directly to -updates again?
<LaserJock> I don't know if there's a bug for it, there is a blueprint I belive
<LaserJock> no
<LaserJock> that worked in the beginning
<LaserJock> but after the dapper Xorg incident everybody got paranoid
<LaserJock> and now that Universe is turned on by default we need higher standards
<LaserJock> such that I don't think uploading to -updates should be called "day-to-day" work
<slangasek> hmm, did I mean *-proposed or *-updates, probably not a good think for me to not be able to keep those two straight :-P
<slangasek> s/think/thing/
<LaserJock> to be honest, flash worked pretty darn well
<LaserJock> once we got it into -proposed
<LaserJock> we got the required 2 "works for me"s and pitti moved it to -updates promptly
<LaserJock> really nice
<LaserJock> I do have an issue with treating -proposed so carefully
<LaserJock> the whole point of having it is to test stuff out
 * slangasek nods
<LaserJock> I would think it would be as "experimental" as the development release
<LaserJock> and users should have about the same level of expectation of breakage
<LaserJock> so I don't think archive admins should really need to do much other than perhaps make sure the versioning is sane
<slangasek> well, IMHO if there are objective guidelines that we agree should be applied to SRUs, as a best-available heuristic for blocking broken updates and making sure the process is *scalable* by not eating up all the time of the handful of trusted MOTU/core devs involved with this stuff, those objective tests should be applied before -proposed rather than after
<LaserJock> but to go through "MOTU ack", "MOTU SRU ack", "Archive Admin ack" just to get into -proposed seems a tad much
<LaserJock> well, we've gone back and forth on that
<LaserJock> whether the careful analysis should be done before -proposed or before -updates
<LaserJock> I would think though that if the MOTU treated the upload as one would any other upload as far as testing, etc.
<LaserJock> and that MOTU SRU acks it, it should be fairly safe to go into -proposed
<LaserJock> would you agree?
<slangasek> LaserJock: so you view it as a question of allowing better parallelization of the work effort by having it in -proposed as early as possible for testing?
<LaserJock> well
<slangasek> I was looking at it from the other side, that having users test packages that can never pass the SRU guidelines is time wasted, but I can see it both ways
<LaserJock> if we have a testing repo but we have to do all the testing beforehand, what's the point?
<LaserJock> no, they *should* pass SRU guidelines
<slangasek> oh, ok then
<slangasek> those are what I meant by "objective tests"
<LaserJock> but I think by the time it's uploaded it should be there
<LaserJock> so archive admin's shouldn't need to do anything but accept the upload
<slangasek> as opposed to user testing, which is entirely subjective but we depend on to catch things that we can't automate
<slangasek> oh, I agree; is that not what happens today, aside from the flash case?
<LaserJock> well, I'm honestly not sure
<LaserJock> I would think that's mostly how it goes
<LaserJock> I personally test that every package I upload/sponsor builds and installs
<LaserJock> and for SRUs specific testing to make sure the bug is indeed fixed and there are no obvious regressions
<LaserJock> that's my minimum "objective tests"
<LaserJock> is that sane?
<LaserJock> do we need more than that for SRUs?
<slangasek> does "no obvious regressions" mean runtime tests?  no requirements that the changes to the source be minimally intrusive?
<LaserJock> if I'm preparing an SRU I do runtime tests
<LaserJock> if I'm sponsoring one I might not do the runtime tests if I'm confident the sponsoree did them
<LaserJock> and the minimally intrusive I think is a MOTU SRU judgement
<LaserJock> but if I want an SRU to go through I'll do that
<LaserJock> :-)
<slangasek> so you think it shouldn't be a requirement for all SRUs?
<LaserJock> which one?
<slangasek> that the changes be minimal
<LaserJock> I think it should
<slangasek> ok
<LaserJock> but what constitutes "minimal" is the discretion of the SRU team
<slangasek> then I think we're pretty much on the same page :)
<slangasek> well, ok; I understand "minimal" to imply "doesn't contain extraneous changes"
<LaserJock> sure
<slangasek> btw, where did we chase everyone else off to? :)
 * TheMuso is here but is busy doing other things.
<LaserJock> but from my view the only reasons for an "oversight" team are 1) to make sure the upload is SRU worthy 2) make sure the changes are minimal
 * Hobbsee is drowning her sorrows in lots of drink.
<LaserJock> so obviously MOTUs *should* be making minimal changes but MOTU SRU is there to make sure that's the case
<slangasek> Hobbsee: are LaserJock and I one of the sorrows?
<LaserJock> I hope not
<Hobbsee> slangasek: no, not at the moment, at least.
<slangasek> well if I'm to be drowned, I guess I'd prefer it to be in drink
<LaserJock> so really, I expect MOTUs to basically make sure SRUs are good and MOTU SRU is around for Quality Assurance
<Hobbsee> hehe
<LaserJock> making sure that MOTUs are correctly applying these "objective tests" and know what is SRU worthy
<LaserJock> in any case, the only thing I'm having issues right now with SRU is upstream microreleases
<LaserJock> from a "oversight" team perspective
<LaserJock> most of the SRU applications have been good
<LaserJock> slangasek: do you know if the archive admins agree?
<LaserJock> if we're causing problems for the archive admins I certainly want to know about it
 * Fujitsu just read all the scrollback. Wow, there's a lot of it.
<LaserJock> Fujitsu: sorry
<Fujitsu> 'tis a most interesting discussion.
<LaserJock> now that I've been thinking about stuff for a while
<Fujitsu> And brought to light one of the strangest differences between main and universe I've seen lately: pinging slangasek on IRC vs. filing a bug and waiting for motu-release acks, for freeze exceptions.
<LaserJock> I'm thinking a lot of the issues are basically MOTU consistency
<slangasek> LaserJock: I don't know, the person to ask that particular question is probably pitti :)
<LaserJock> we need to reliably expect that from MOTU to MOTU that we get similar results
<slangasek> but I haven't /heard/ him complain
<LaserJock> slangasek: good
<LaserJock> he complained about the last SRU policy we had and we redid it
<LaserJock> so that was nice to get feedback from the archive admins
<slangasek> Fujitsu: you mean the pings today from people asking me to look at the unapproved queue?
<Fujitsu> LaserJock: Or was that two or three policies ago?
<LaserJock> maybe two
<LaserJock> seems like it was fairly recently
<Fujitsu> slangasek: I've seen a few `OK to upload <somepastebinurl>' today.
<slangasek> (not actually something I'm in favor of, I don't particularly enjoy having my day be interrupt-driven :-P)
<LaserJock> but the policy is kinda a blur
<TheMuso> slangasek: heh just say file a bug. :)
<LaserJock> slangasek: if it was a team rather than just you would it help?
<slangasek> Fujitsu: right... IIRC, the universe policy says pinging motu-release on IRC is ok as well?
<LaserJock> well, I honestly think there is often disconnect between what the wiki page says and what happens
<LaserJock> and it depends on which team member you ask
<slangasek> LaserJock: technically it is a team already, I still have the problem of being the one who can't pass the buck, which everyone else also knows :)
<LaserJock> slangasek: you also hang out here. You're the only archive admin to do so
<slangasek> but, I made a point in the u-d-a emails to also tell people "if it's sane, just upload it instead of asking first", which I think has improved things this time around vs. last cycle
<LaserJock> which I appreciate tremendously, btw
<Fujitsu> I remember being very surprised to see an archive admin in these parts near the end of last cycle. It is, as LaserJock says, very good.
<LaserJock> I try not to bug you too much though, I don't want to scare you away :-)
<slangasek> heh
<slangasek> hasn't been an issue so far :)
<Hobbsee> it's got something to do with the shackles.
<Fujitsu> slangasek: Hm, looks like IRC pings are OK as well.
<Hobbsee> (to the channels)
<Fujitsu> So we have a less frozen freeze for FinalFreeze.
<LaserJock> I do find that bug reports are not very great for release approvals
<LaserJock> I think we need to minimize "queue hopping"
<slangasek> Fujitsu: "less frozen" because IRC pings are allowed?
<Fujitsu> slangasek: Yes. FFes couldn't be granted except by bugs and waiting.
<slangasek> oh
<slangasek> well, hmm; I guess I've assumed that if there are new features, the FFe proces still applies
<slangasek> ICBW
<LaserJock> hmm
<LaserJock> it would be cool if we could have a Universe unaccepted queue
<slangasek> and others may not have read the motu-release announcement that way
<slangasek> LaserJock: yes, yes it would
<slangasek> :)
<Fujitsu> LaserJock: It's coming.
<Fujitsu> LP 1.2.4
<LaserJock> and we could do a "upload then ask"
<LaserJock> Fujitsu: "to be started" in 1.2.4 as far as I know ;-)
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: don't dream about it.  it's infuriating.
<slangasek> could do that already - you just need an archive admin to do the button pushing
<LaserJock> Hobbsee: it's happening, just how fast is the question
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: it sends you back to the new queue, after you accept from unapproved, so then you have to click back, and wait for another page load.
<Fujitsu> LaserJock: So targets are targets for when to start? How smart of the LP people. So they don't keep missing deadlines.
<Fujitsu> LaserJock: It's not the question. `Not very'
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: and after doing it a few times in a row, let me tell you, it is quite frustrating.
<LaserJock> sure, but in general we're getting there
<Hobbsee> unfortunately, not annoying enough for me to have written a greasemonkey thing to fix it.
<LaserJock> anyway, what I was gonna say was then we could have MOTU Release handle it
<LaserJock> so we could do an "upload then ask" kind of thing
<LaserJock> rather than "file bug and wait"
<LaserJock> without making more work for slangasek, et al.
<LaserJock> I really dislike having bugs having to go through multiple queues
 * slangasek nods
<LaserJock> it's confusing to everybody and you end up waiting a lot 'cause everybody is busy
<dholbach> good morning
<slangasek> well, at least the current freeze process makes it possible to distribute the workload among ubuntu-archive
 * slangasek waves to dholbach 
<LaserJock> I've had a few instances of "oh, I didn't know it had to be in *that* queue, I've been waiting for a couple weeks"
<slangasek> instead of requiring ubuntu-release to do all the unapproved processing for universe, or such
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: how would you do diffs, etc?  afaik, launchpad doesn't do diffs-against-previous yet?
<LaserJock> Hobbsee: well, I wouldn't
<Fujitsu> It is meant to do so RSN, though it was targetted to several months ago initially.
<dholbach> hi slangasek
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: right
<LaserJock> I mean, the whole idea is "if you're sure upload, if not file the bug"
<Fujitsu> LaserJock: It would help if our all our queues didn't involve horrible abuses of Malone.
<Fujitsu> s/our //
<LaserJock> Fujitsu: so very true
<LaserJock> honestly, what we really need is to not use a bug tracker for non-bugs :-)
<Fujitsu> (aka. bug #179857)
<LaserJock> maybe something like an task tracker that can be linked to bug reports
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: ahhh, i see.
<Fujitsu> It's not just us that need sponsorship (and other process) tracking. I'm sure there's a way LP could help.
<LaserJock> well, I would honestly like to sit down and work out all our tasks as developers
<LaserJock> and figure out how the "should" be done
<LaserJock> and thing figure out what we need from LP, uploaders, policies, triagers, etc. to do it
<LaserJock> *then
<LaserJock> it can be quite a muddled mess, for me at least
<LaserJock> I think a cheatsheet would be good though
<LaserJock> I think consistency is more an issue than our actual policies a lot of times
<warp10> Good morning
<Fujitsu> Some of our current processes are very wrong because of LP. Like backports. Backports should be handled by setting the pocket of a release targetting to backports, not filing a bug against <release>-backports. Security tasks should be handled with a security pocket target release (and approvable by a different team to -updates). It's a mess.
<LaserJock> *I* have to remember that darn "close from changelog" bit, I can't for the life of me get that habit
<LaserJock> Fujitsu: yeah
<LaserJock> patch handling as well
<awmcclain> If I'm creating a new ubuntu package (or really, repackaging a debian package for ubuntu), are there guidelines for installation? Installing into /etc/foo, etc?
<LaserJock> we keep running into issues there
<LaserJock> awmcclain: as long as it conforms to the Debian Policy it should be pretty much good
<Hobbsee> slangasek: got any ideas for a really good, stiff drink?
<Fujitsu> Oh yeah, and not having to track the status of every CVE in every release in two places would be nice.
<slangasek> Hobbsee: 12-year Glenfiddich on the rocks? :)
<Hobbsee> slangasek: hmmm.  i do have to go to work, too
<slangasek> oh, well, perhaps that puts an upper limit on "stiff"
<LaserJock> I was gonna say
<StevenK> To 'nothing'
<LaserJock> isn't that sort of an oxymoron?
<Hobbsee> heh
<Hobbsee> well, people have been known to turn up to work rather tipsy.
<awmcclain> LaserJock: One thing I'm confused about is where to install the binary and the sample conf files. I understand that the active conf files should live in /etc, but what about the other things? Are there any standards?
<Fujitsu> awmcclain: Why are you repackaging a Debian package?
<slangasek> awmcclain: sample conf files -> /usr/share/doc/<package>/examples; as opposed to templates for config files that are used by the maintainer scripts, which should be in /usr/share/<package> instead; covered by Debian policy
<awmcclain> Fujitsu: Becuase perlbal 1.70's debian packaging has the wrong dependencies so I'm updating the package. I'm also not thrilled with where it's installed.
<awmcclain> slangasek: Ah, thank you. I couldn't find it in the policy manual.
<Fujitsu> Why not just change the dependencies?
<Fujitsu> Rather than changing other things?
<Fujitsu> Minimal diff is good. Anything else gets people annoyed.
<slangasek> awmcclain: Policy 12.6; the keyword is "examples" rather than "samples", so. :)
<awmcclain> fujitsu: It's for my own use, thank you. And I already have the blessings of the perlbal list.
<slangasek> what is perlbal? I don't see any Debian package of that name.
<awmcclain> slangasek: Ah! I see. I wasn't considering it "documentation". That makes more sense.
<Fujitsu> Ah, so you're not making an Ubuntu package, but a Debian-style package for your own use?
<awmcclain> slangasek: Exactly! Perlbal is the perl-based load balancer used by LiveJournal, Pownce, among many others. It has abysmal package support -- just an old /debian folder from a year ago checked into svn
<slangasek> ah, heh
<awmcclain> Fujitsu: Correct! This is not official.
<awmcclain> Fujitsu: (I wouldn't be so presumptuous). :)
<awmcclain> Fujitsu: Part of the feeling I got from the existing installation was that the directories it installed to weren't quite the same as ubuntu standards, hence my questions here.
<Fujitsu> I see. That makes more sense.
<awmcclain> I'm trying to get a feel if there are things you do "differently" on ubuntu rather than debian
<awmcclain> Plus, I want to learn more about building packages
<awmcclain> I've already had to build a lighttpd 1.5.0 package for myself before it was (or is it) included in heron
<Fujitsu> We take the vast majority of packages from Debian.
<Fujitsu> So we can't really do much differently without having to package 20000 things ourselves.
<awmcclain> Another question... since this is a very "unnofficial" build, it'd be more appropriate to version as 1.70-1 rather than 1.70-1ubuntu1, correct?
<Fujitsu> -0, even
<awmcclain> Ah.
<awmcclain> Ok.
<Fujitsu> -1 would be for the first Debian version.
<awmcclain> Even better. ;)
<awmcclain> Ah, since there isn't one.... gotcah
<awmcclain> Are examples only installed by the foo-doc package?
<awmcclain> I'm confused by the grouping of examples under "documentation"
<awmcclain> slangasek: And just to be clear, "templates" (/usr/shar/<package>) would refer to a file that you would use to _create_ a conf file in /etc, perhaps during installation?
<slangasek> awmcclain: yes, exactly
<slangasek> awmcclain: as far as "foo-doc", not every source package creates a separate binary package for the documentation
<awmcclain> slangasek: My existing template has a split for -doc.
<slangasek> ok
<slangasek> you're not obligated to put the examples in the -doc package if that's not where you think they belong
<awmcclain> slangasek: And I'm not finding anything in the policy manual about _location_ of the binary file for a daemon (i really apologize if i'm missing it). I know packages like lighttpd and apache install in /usr/sbin/, is that correct?
<\sh> moins
<slangasek> awmcclain: Debian policy refers to the FHS for this; a copy of the FHS is included in the debian-policy package
<awmcclain> slangasek: Ah! That's why i couldn't find it in my distro. Thank you!
<awmcclain> Thank you all very much for the help.
<LaserJock> alright, I gotta head to bed
<LaserJock> slangasek: thanks so much for the discussion this evening, it's been helpful
<slangasek> LaserJock: my pleasure; g'night :)
<Fujitsu> Any motu-release people around to let me upload http://pastebin.com/f1d819686?
<TheMuso> anybody seen this error before? http://launchpadlibrarian.net/13350746/buildlog_ubuntu-hardy-i386.csound_1%3A5.08.0.dfsg2-1ubuntu1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<TheMuso> Fujitsu: looking
<Fujitsu> TheMuso: You're missing a Package or Architecture line in debian/control.
<Fujitsu> TheMuso: Thanks.
<TheMuso> Fujitsu: Right thanks. Will have to track that one down.
<dholbach> can somebody of the motu release team ACK http://launchpadlibrarian.net/13334232/glipper_1.0-1ubuntu1.debdiff ?
<dholbach> (bug 193256)
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 193256 in glipper "glipper background is not transparent" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/193256
<TheMuso> Fujitsu: Why does this need MOTU release?
<Fujitsu> TheMuso: FinalFreeze is in effect, isn't it?
<TheMuso> Fujitsu: Hang on, let me read the mail again... *sigh*
<slangasek> wait, what?  missing Package or Architecture line, how the heck did this package build in Debian?
<Fujitsu> slangasek: Presumably it didn't.
<slangasek> but it did
<TheMuso> More to the point, how did I get it built locally?
<superm1> someone uploaded prebuilt binaries perhaps in debian?
<TheMuso> superm1: But it would FTBFs on other arches in that case.
<Fujitsu> TheMuso: Does it regenerate control automagically?
<superm1> unless they had a whole slew of arches locally to add to .changes :)
<slangasek> superm1: on amd64, hppa, i386, and mipsel?:)
<superm1> yeah probably fairly unlikely...
<TheMuso> Fujitsu: in that case, go for the security update.
<Fujitsu> TheMuso: Thanks.
<TheMuso> Fujitsu: re control, checking.
<TheMuso> hrm. The only reason why things might bork is for one package, there is no space between Architecture: and any...
<TheMuso> I'm going to have to play with this in a PPA... But thats for later.
<Fujitsu> Hm. I forget if that's legal.
<TheMuso> dholbach: looking
<dholbach> TheMuso: thanks
<Fujitsu> slangasek: Oh Debian god, does one need a space after the colon in a control file?
<TheMuso> dholbach: go for it.
<\sh> Fujitsu, after I read the dak source of parsing control and dsc files...I think it needs a \s ;)
<\sh> add _changes files to that list too
<Fujitsu> I'd hope they all used a similar parser.
<\sh> Fujitsu, I think dak source is reference implementation and I trust elmo on this ;)
<Fujitsu> As do I.
<Fujitsu> The question now is why it didn't build on the buildds, but did build everywhere else.
<slangasek> heh, I've certainly never tried creating a debian/control without a space after the :
<\sh> Fujitsu, which package?
<Fujitsu> sbuild uses the dpkg-* inside the chroot, doesn't it?
<slangasek> it's "pseudo-rfc822", which implies a space :)
<Fujitsu> \sh: TheMuso's csound
 * TheMuso will look at it later, with trying a PPA upload or two to get it resolved.
<\sh> whatever alternate means
<Fujitsu> \sh: In which context? The error message?
<\sh> Fujitsu, yepp
<Fujitsu> It means that they don't follow the sequence Package-Architecture-Package-Architecture-Package-[...]
<TheMuso> Anyway, I've uploaded it to my PPA and will see what eventuates with the space where it should be.
<TheMuso> And on that note, I'm outa here for a while.
<agentsoul> Hello, I'm working with hardy, unfortunenatly it comes with an old unuseable (the numerical integration isn't working) version of qtiplot 0.9.3 rc2. The stable and fixed version 0.9.4 is released but only available as source. What is the right way and who is to ask to let the new version slip into hardy? I will write another short msg why this upgrade is needed.
<murrayc> agentsoul: You need to file a bug in launchpad, at least.
<awmcclain> Say the ubuntu package I'm building has a perl module requirement (for building). Could I use a package from http://debian.pkgs.cpan.org/?
<agentsoul> First I could build 0.9.4 by my own but for sure I'm not the only one using the program. the problem is that the version coming with hardy is unuseable. I don't write that to emphasis my question. Numerical integration is a basic operation in a plot program. It's a little bit like if you can't change colors in GIMP or steer a car only left and not right. It's an essential function. Most of the users can not work with that version or wors
<agentsoul> they will get wrong calculations and don't even realize.
<agentsoul> murrayc: there is a bugreport in launchpad
<agentsoul> murrayc: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/qtiplot/+bug/199234
<james_w> awmcclain: the package needs to be in Ubuntu if you want to build against it.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 199234 in qtiplot "[Hardy] Integration produces nonsense results" [Undecided,New]
<awmcclain> james_w: What if it's just a private ubuntu package, not-to-be-included in the universal repository?
<james_w> awmcclain: then you can do whatever you like :-)
<awmcclain> james_w: Ok, is the format for apt sources.list the same for a debian apt repo? Do I need to download the package and bundle it into my own repository?
<james_w> I don't know how they provide their packages. I would recommend downloading it
<awmcclain> james_w: Ok. Thank you@
<beasty_> morning
<agentsoul> murrayc: Is there anything else I can do?
<beasty_> hmm
<beasty_> i'm trying to rebuild a package with 'pbuilder' but it gives other depends than i used in my control file
<beasty_> any clue for this ?
<james_w> agentsoul: you would need to apply for a freeze exception to get it in at this point.
<james_w> beasty_: sorry, can you explain what you mean?
<agentsoul> james_w: who or where do I have to explain the problem to ask for such an exception?
<james_w> agentsoul: you can find some information at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess
<james_w> basically you file a bug with the reasoning and subscribe "motu-release".
<agentsoul> james_w: I chekced the subscribers of the bugreport MOTU Science is notified. Should I subscribe motu-release anyhow.
<james_w> agentsoul: have you filed a new bug?
 * Fujitsu appears at the mention of motuscience.
<agentsoul> james_w: no, but the old report ( https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/qtiplot/+bug/199234 ) describes the problem, I think.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 199234 in qtiplot "[Hardy] Integration produces nonsense results" [Undecided,New]
<james_w> agentsoul: yes, but the process requires a new bug report, as your problem will still exist, even if the fix is not accepted in to Hardy.
<agentsoul> james_w: OK I will write a new bug report and add motu-release and try to follow the steps of the FreezeExceptionProcess howto from the wiki.
<mvo> hey! I would like to upload compiz 0.7.4 into the archive (I got a FFE for this). the configuration utilities are in universe for this, do I need a seperate FFE from the motu FFE team for this?
<james_w> mvo: I think you would, yes.
<Amaranth> d'oh
<james_w> I haven't seen any of them around to confirm though.
<Amaranth> mvo: does ccsm 0.7.2 break when used with libcompizconfig 0.7.4?
<mvo> I don't think so, but I need to test
<Amaranth> You could just put in a Breaks too :)
<mvo> I think its just python-compizconfig (very few changes), ccsm and simple-ccsm (both hvae mostly fixes)
<Amaranth> I know ccsm had a bit of churn
<Fujitsu> IMO you should file universe-style FFes for each.
<Amaranth> Crap, that's another day without a new compiz :/
<colinl> hi, I'm trying to use my PPA and am having "State: Chroot problem" on every try... anything I should do to fix it?
<Fujitsu> colinl: First upload?
<colinl> yes
<Fujitsu> (also, #launchpad is better)
<Fujitsu> colinl: You uploaded less than 13 minutes ago?
<colinl> ah, sorry
<colinl> Fujitsu: yes
<Fujitsu> colinl: Wait until 40 past this hour.
<Fujitsu> Then retry it.
<Fujitsu> It will work.
<colinl> Fujitsu: ah, ok, thanks. this is a server-side problem?
<Fujitsu> Correct.
<colinl> OK, great, thanks :)
<Fujitsu> All CHROOTWAITs are server problems.
<colinl> ok :)
<james_w> motu has been around since the start of Ubuntu hasn't it?
<stani> pochu, POX_, ScottK: Nautilus extensions have changed in Hardy and Debian Unstable. Therefore I am preparing a patch for Phatch which is compatible both with Nautilus 2.22 and previous versions. (There was a post on the PAPT mailing list about it.) I hope it can still be included, otherwise nautilus-integration for Phatch is broken.
<beasty_> is there a way to get the list off depends generated by a .deb file ?
<dholbach> james_w: no, not entirely - I have #ubuntu-motu logs from since Thu Feb 17 12:22:12 2005 - it was a few weeks before that a group of ~5 community developers had formed - afair ogra came up with the MOTU name
<stani> colinl: This is normal. Just patience.
<dholbach> james_w: in any case it's been around for almost all the time of ubuntu :)
<james_w> dholbach: thanks.
<dholbach> it's a shame nobody wrote the "History of MOTU" book yet
<james_w> beasty_: "dpkg -I .deb" should list them.
<beasty_> ok
<beasty_> i just applied some stuff on 'python-pexpect'
<colinl> stani: yes, seen that. it works now :)
<beasty_> and added it to my local repository
<beasty_> how can i force apt-get to use the local repository ?
<colinl> beasty_: the easiest way it to bump the version in your patched package's debian/changelog
<colinl> *is
<beasty_> hmm
<beasty_> just added my changes to changelog
<beasty_> rebuild it
<beasty_> and it's installed now
<\sh> hey Czessi
<Czessi> morning \sh :)
<\sh> Czessi, send me the ammount of â¬ you need for pre-finance the LT flat :)
<ogra> dholbach, james_w, the name came from mdz as a joke during the mataro confernce (where als MOTU was founded and the first process for becoming a MOTU was defined)
<ogra> s/als/also/
<Czessi> \sh: in week 17 i'll write a mail will further informations (flat, booth passes and much more)
<\sh> Czessi, rock :) I finally got my holiday approved....
<Czessi> \sh: kool, is carine coming too?
<\sh> Czessi, hopefully..we don't know yet, she was actually for 4 weeks in cameroon now...so I don't know if she gets holidays in may..
<Czessi> \sh: ok. i've rent the holliday flat for 7 people wirth an option for 10 people + 2 who can sleep in my flat.
<\sh> Czessi, this should be more then enough :)
<\sh> Czessi, at least, imho we need 3 places for the beer crates ;)
<Czessi> \sh: 3 places for the beer crates?
<\sh> Czessi, joking
<Czessi> <= english dau ;)
<Czessi> \sh: cold beer and some snacks are i available in the flat ... like the last year
<\sh> When Carine is not coming, I'm trying to bring some camroonian food...or when she's actually coming, then I'll try to convince her, to cook some cameroonian food, eventually we can do this when we have a barbequeue or something like that...this time, I'll stay until the end of LT
<Czessi> no bbq is planned, maybe we can have a bbq in the backyard from the flat
<\sh> Czessi, let's plan one then :)
<Czessi> yes, i'll ask the renter and when not, i'll search a bbq place
<\sh> Czessi, we need sponsors ;)
<YokoZar> What are you two plotting?
<\sh> YokoZar, LinuxTag :)
<\sh> YokoZar, food drink and a lot of ubuntu love  ;)
<Czessi> \sh: yes, but i don't know where we can get a sponsor
<\sh> Czessi, public call on planet, forums, etc.?
<\sh> Czessi, you still have the paypal account?
<\sh> for kubuntu-de?
<crimsun> and most importantly, a method of accepting contributions.
<\sh> good point
<\sh> and a place where we can make the sponsors public
<Czessi> \sh: yes, we have a paypal account for kubuntu-de but my blog is only in german at this time
<\sh> Czessi, well, I'll can help with that :)
<\sh> s/\'ll//
<Czessi> \sh: http://www.kubuntu-de.org/pinnwand
<\sh> or s/can// whatever
<\sh> crimsun, are you going to UDS @Praque this year?
<YokoZar> launchpad really should have a "not incomplete" bug filter
<persia> MOTU Meeting in #ubuntu-meeting in 5 minutes
<jdong> oh! oh! SCREW YOU TOO, Firefox!
<jdong> you don't see ME closing down randomly whenever you need to tell me something!
<tseliot> ï»¿jdong: talking to firefox again? ;)
<mok0> jdong: I can't even start FF
<mok0> jdong: I get a dialog box that says it's already running
<dholbach> regarding Mootbog usage: how do I end the vote afterwards?
<mok0> jdong: (but not responding)
<jdong> mok0: ouchies
<dholbach> ok, got it, was [ENDVOTE]
<mok0> jdong: it tells me to restart my computer! I refuse
<mok0> jdong: I already have problems getting my graphics going using the newest kernels :-(
<mok0> hardy is in pretty bad shape right now
<stani> james_w or ember: are you there? I have some questions about python-nautilus 0.5.
<jdong> mok0: that's rough... :(, Hardy seems to be going well for me on my two laptops though I'll only find out for sure tonight when I formally upgrade my primary lappy to Hardy
<james_w> stani: yeah, I'm around, I don't know much about it though. Was I the last one to upload?
<stani> james_w: pochu told me you did -ubuntu2 which is the latest.
<james_w> stani: yeah
<stani> james_w: python-nautilus 0.5 creates the folder ï»¿/usr/lib/nautilus/extensions-2.0/python
<stani> james_w: but in order to make a python extension to work you have to put in the non existing ï»¿/usr/lib/nautilus/extensions-1.0/python folder
<stani> james_w: nautilus 2.22 switched to the 2.0 extension api
<james_w> ah, it still supports the 1.0 API?
<stani> james_w: I think there must be a typo. It works with nautilus 2.22 (so I guess it works with the 2.0 api), but the location it requires is of the 1.0 api, not the 2.0 api
<stani> james_w: I would think that all references to ï»¿/usr/lib/nautilus/extensions-1.0/python are a typo and should be replaced by ï»¿/usr/lib/nautilus/extensions-2.0/python
<james_w> I don't understand the problem, sorry, python-nautilus doesn't work?
<stani> it works if I place the extensions (= python scripts) in ï»¿/usr/lib/nautilus/extensions-1.0/python, but it doesn't work when I place them in ï»¿/usr/lib/nautilus/extensions-2.0/python
<stani> james_w: python-nautilus 0.4 creates ï»¿/usr/lib/nautilus/extensions-1.0/python, but python-nautilus 0.5 creates ï»¿/usr/lib/nautilus/extensions-2.0/python
<james_w> 0.5 moved to the new nautilus API.
<james_w> if you place them in the 1.0 directory with nautilus 2.22 they work?
<stani> indeed so why do scripts need to be in a deprecated path?
<stani> yes than they work
<stani> but this path does not exist, a user has to create it himself
<james_w> I don't know, does it require that the script be changed to the new API?
<nixternal> see you all on sunday! have a great weekend everyone!
<dholbach> nixternal: you too
<stani> I would think that all references to ï»¿/usr/lib/nautilus/extensions-1.0/python should be replaced with ï»¿/usr/lib/nautilus/extensions-2.0/python inside python-nautilus 0.5
<stani> so that when I install my scripts in the 2.0 path it does work
<stani> for example my application checks during installation which path exist (1.0 or 2.0) in order to install python extensions.
<stani> now it detects 2.0 and not 1.0 which is correct
<stani> it installs the extensions in 2.0 which does not work
<james_w> stani: you're right:   nautilus_python_load_dir(module, NAUTILUS_LIBDIR "/nautilus/extensions-1.0/python");
<stani> right now my setup.py copies the extensions to 1.0 anyway which is an ugly hack
<stani> james_w: so this is a bug right? (otherwise all python extensions in 2.0 will not work on Hardy)
<james_w> correct.
<james_w> however, should we be supporting a transition?
<james_w> phatch seems to be the only user of python-nautilus in the archive, so we can fix that.
<james_w> but do we want to support users who have installed other extensions?
<stani> well for user installed extensions it is not a problem
<stani> they are installed in ~/.nautilus/python-extensions
<stani> so they will continue working
<james_w> yes, but users can install them system-wide as well.
<siretart> persia: perhaps here so we don't interrupt dholbach
<persia> siretart: Sure, although I'm interested in the results of that.
<stani> but on a clear Hardy install there is no ï»¿/usr/lib/nautilus/extensions-1.0 or ï»¿/usr/lib/nautilus/extensions-1.0/python
<persia> Essentially, lots of people complained about code-monkeys and nobody defended it.  I reverted it.  Do you think it needs more discussion?
<stani> but only ï»¿/usr/lib/nautilus/extensions-2.0/python
<siretart> persia: it was not only the name 'code monkey', I feel on the mailing list the objection was that there seems to be a trend to use 'silly' names like 'code monkeys'
<stani> james_w: so if users install it systemwide why would they start creating system directories themselves?
<stani> james_w: or do you mean for system upgrades?
<persia> siretart: True.  I think the best defense against that trend is vigilance.
<james_w> stani: yes, this path existed in previous releases
<stani> james_w: in that case provide at least a symlink
<stani> symlink ï»¿/usr/lib/nautilus/extensions-2.0/python to ï»¿/usr/lib/nautilus/extensions-1.0/python
<stani> otherwise you force applications to copy files incorrectly
<stani> during setup
<james_w> that's not great, it's quite a lot of code in the postinst.
<stani> james_w: is it not possible to load from both 1.0 and 2.0?
<james_w> stani: yes, it probably is, I'm asking if it should be done.
<james_w> the other question is whether loading from both is guaranteed to work, as there has been an API change it may mean some things from the old location will not work any more.
<stani> james_w: I thought Hardy is a LTS so why would you force the 1.0 which is deprecated from nautilus 2.22
<stani> and why would python-nautilus create ï»¿/usr/lib/nautilus/extensions-2.0/python if it is totally not functional
<james_w> the latter was my mistake, I didn't test it with a system wide install
<bddebian> Heya gang
<james_w> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Hi james_w
<stani> james_w: I would vote for migrating the path to 2.0 (I think the chance for system wide python-nautilus extensions are small.)
<stani> james_w: but it is your choice
<stani> james_w: I just want to know what you will do with it as it has consequences for Phatch.
<james_w> stani: could you provide a patch to python-nautilus?
<stani> james_w: also by keeping the 1.0 path nautilus may try load incompatible extensions
<stani> james_w: unfortunately I only know python and do not have a lot of packaging experience
<LarstiQ> stani!
<stani> james_w: I can try as it just is a find replace, but someone should review it
<LarstiQ> stani: is your copacabana (if I got that right) proxy still available somewhere?
<james_w> LarstiQ!
<LarstiQ> james_w! :)
<james_w> LarstiQ: how are you?
<stani> LarstiQ: yes, at my home ;-)
<james_w> stani: sure, I can review it. I can do it myself, I'm just doing 3 other things at the moment.
<LarstiQ> james_w: okish. Currently looking for help on bug 120834
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 120834 in mesa "intel gm965 freezes with 3d applications" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/120834
<LarstiQ> stani: I'd love to come to Utrecht again if that is necessary ;)
<stani> LarstiQ: haha, I live now in Amsterdam
<LarstiQ> stani: doh! What happened to the boerderij?
<stani> I was there temporarily as an artist residency
<james_w> LarstiQ: ugh, nice bug.
<stani> I only stayed there for three months
<LarstiQ> stani: ah, I didn't catch on to that. I enjoyed the python-nl meeting there anyway :)
<stani> yes, it was fun. Are you a motu?
<LarstiQ> stani: nope
<afflux> james_w: just curious, what's the issue with the nautilus extension?
<afflux> I missed the start
<james_w> afflux: I messed up the last upload somewhat
<james_w> recent versions of nautilus use 2.0 extensions, I changed the python directory name, but not the code, which is confusing.
<afflux> ah, okay
<james_w> the question is whether we should transition the old location to the new one, or support both, or just not bother.
<afflux> james_w: IIRC nautilus doesn't even look at the old location but only considers $(pkg-config --variable=extensiondir libnautilus-extension). I patched nautilus-actions lately to change the install directory to the pkg-config thing.
<james_w> so, just having no transition would be ok?
<afflux> I'm not a motu and not really a dev, but I think we should change the directory in the source and the packaging and check if it works. Maybe check what part of the api changed and whether we need to reflect those changes too.
<stani> afflux: now nautilus looks for python extensions in the old 1.0 path
<james_w> afflux: neither am I :-)
<afflux> that doesn't sound very sane to me :) I think it rather causes confusion when a user sees multiple extension directories, especially since the old path is obsolete since the new release (2.20? 2.22? not sure).
<james_w> afflux: I'm not sure how API changes would affect python though.
<persia> Bah.  Anyone who can read code and test is entitled to an opinion :)
<afflux> james_w: I think maybe the extension code itself needs to be updated
<stani> well I got a mail from debian that I needed to update phatch otherwise it wouldn't work with nautilus 2.22
<james_w> afflux: it does that:  nautilus_python_load_dir(module, NAUTILUS_LIBDIR "/nautilus/extensions-1.0/python");
<stani> so I was quite surprised to find out that on Hardy it did work with nautilus2.22
<james_w> which is wrong for the new API
<stani> and which may load incompatible scripts (based on the 1.0 api)
<afflux> yes
<afflux> james_w: well, I think it should have another #define like NAUTILUS_EXTENSIONDIR which should be set by the configure script, guessed by the pkg-config command, but that sounds like a quite big upstream code change.
<afflux> oh wait.
<afflux> it's already defined, it's NAUTILUS_EXTENSION_DIR.
<afflux> or, is it? there's something in configure.in.
<stani> so than you would expect ï»¿NAUTILUS_EXTENSION_DIR "/python"
<afflux> yes
<stani> which will refer to the 2.0 path
<dholbach> persia: thanks for doing the minutes
<pochu> err, I thought the meeting was in about 6 hours or so :(
<persia> pochu: Nope.  12:00 this week.  Just ended.  Next week is 20:00.
<pochu> anyway, it was so long I'd have missed half of it due to lunch...
 * pochu waits for persia to send the minutes :)
<persia> pochu: It will be 15-20 hours.  You might want to read the logs, if you want to know today.
<pochu> persia: ok, thanks
<afflux> stani: it should, but it configure currently does not export the variable to config.h
<stani> afflux: That's a pitty.
<Hobbsee> debian bug 473999
<ubotu> Debian bug 473999 in bip "bip: bugs in the configuration file validation" [Normal,Fixed] http://bugs.debian.org/473999
<stani> afflux and james_w: so what can we do about it?
<afflux> stani: we could patch this away ;)
<stani> afflux: great, can you do that?
<afflux> looking
<stani> pochu: I have sent you a part of the motu meeting
<stani> pochu: by email
<james_w> stani: I spoke to seb, and he said that we should just do the easy thing.
<afflux> which means?
<james_w> just load from the new directory
<stani> ï»¿so that requires a patch
<afflux> okay, I'm looking at it now
<stani> afflux: great, is it ok I file a bug on launchpad so I can follow progress?
<afflux> I think so
<mok0> Hobbsee: ping
<Hobbsee> mok0: pong
<mok0> Hobbsee: I need you to ack a fix I have of libpythonize0
<Hobbsee> ScottK: permission to upload bip? (memory fix, config change fix)
<mok0> Hobbsee: ScottK is away
<Hobbsee> mok0: i know.  i need to test this first.
<mok0> Hobbsee: I talked to ScottK about the fix before he left town
<Hobbsee> oh, he's out of town
 * Hobbsee could, theoretically, ack her own bug, then approve her own upload
<mok0> Hobbsee: yes, and he will be away for a week
<mok0> Hobbsee: you have time now?
<mok0> Hobbsee: look at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2008/04/09/%23ubuntu-motu.html around 22:25
<stani> afflux: Please use this bug report for your patch: Bug #215714
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 215714 in nautilus-python "The path for python extensions should be reflect the 2.0 api" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/215714
<afflux> wah, what the
<afflux> my firefox just diappeared, session recover does not work o.o
<stani> afflux: did you recover already ;-)
<afflux> stani: commented on the bug
<stani> afflux: do you think you can make this in Hardy?
<afflux> stani: I'm checking some things, if everything works the patch should be ready in the next few hours ;)
<Hobbsee> mok0: i'm hoping to head to bed soon
<mok0> Hobbsee: It'll only take a minute
<stani> afflux: great, so I than I can test it with Phatch and if it works upload a patch for Phatch
<mok0> Hobbsee: I tested the fix like ScottK suggested and it works
<afflux> stani: in the meantime, what changes were needed for phath? Only path stuff or code logic, too?
<stani> pochu: ^^^ (could you upload then phatch to ubuntu, not necessary for debian)
<jdong> may I get MOTU release permission to upload a nosrcchange rebuild for bug 212855?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 212855 in nspluginwrapper "npviewer.bin crashed with SIGSEGV in g_type_check_instance_cast()" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/212855
<mok0> Hobbsee: as you can see from the discussion in Bug #138189 the problem has been around for a while
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 138189 in pykdeextensions "application tries to dlopen /usr/lib/libpython2.5.so (only found in the -dev package) " [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/138189
<stani> afflux: I am the author of phatch, so don't worry about it. I am in fact ready already as I expected python-nautilus to work from the 2.0 path.
<mok0> Hobbsee: I would like you to ack it and I can upload
<afflux> I'll read the changes to the api, because the package may need further adjustments for this
<jdong> mok0: hey! I supplied a bugno first! ;-)
<pochu> stani: now, or when python-nautilus is fixed?
<stani> afflux: then I run into this problem, and I thought it would be better to solve it at the root
<mok0> jdong: ubotu fears me
<stani> pochu: when python-nautilus is fixed
<stani> pochu: just that you know it will happen (did you get my email?)
<stani> afflux: are you a motu?
<afflux> no
<afflux> bugcontrol only ;)
<stani> afflux: do you know someone to upload it?
<afflux> no, I tend to subscribe ubuntu-universe-sponsors and wait ;)
<afflux> or motu-release if in FFe
<pochu> stani: the meeting logs? yes, but I'm reading them in #ubuntu-meeting, as I was in the channel
<stani> ok
<pochu> stani: does phatch need a patch? or is a no-changes-upload enough (as you said it autodetects the extensions path)
<james_w> afflux: I have a sponsor for it if you get the FFe
<stani> pochu: in the current version it does not. but I have here a patch ready in which it does. The patch is not necessary if the patch of afflux does not get through. As I expect that his patch will be accepted, I can upload the patch for phatch already as it is backwards compatible.
<stani> pochu: can you help with the FFe of python-nautilus?
<jdong> can we call this a SuperFreeze? It sounds cool :)
<jdong> oh oh! Freeze 2.0!
<mok0> jdong: the next will be carbonization
<stani> jdong: the freeze of automatix on april 1rst was already Freeze 3.0
 * Hobbsee gives stani the boot
<jdong> Hobbsee: now that you twitched, do you handle Universe freeze exceptions too? :)
<Hobbsee> jdong: depends what time it is, how hard they are, and whether i feel like giving a damn or not :)
<jdong> Hobbsee: bug 212855, trivial (no source change rebuild), high impact on flash for all amd64 users
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 212855 in nspluginwrapper "npviewer.bin crashed with SIGSEGV in g_type_check_instance_cast()" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/212855
<jdong> regression from bet
<jdong> a
<Hobbsee> jdong: please do it.
<Hobbsee> jdong: and there are too many johns on that bug.
<jdong> Hobbsee: thanks :D
<Hobbsee> jdong: if you're quick, i'll even send it thru teh queue
<jdong> Hobbsee: push push push!
<afflux> stani: updating the pbuilder and doing some testing now, I think I did the important changes
 * Hobbsee hits the big green button, and gets an oops.  What an anticlimax.
<stani> afflux: great!
<jdong> Hobbsee: lovely :)
<pochu> james_w, stani: no FFe needed, that's a bug fix AFAICS. We would need motu-release approval though... could you file a bug report with a debdiff attached and the rationale? I think we will get approval for it
<pochu> jdong: lol at SuperFreeze :-)
<pochu> afflux: ^-- the FFe stuff was for you rather than james_w...
<jdong> whee my N800 arrived! Just have to go pick it up at the front desk
<stani> afflux: could you do a test: install phatch and move manually the phatch extensions from ï»¿ï»¿/usr/lib/nautilus/extensions-1.0/python to ï»¿ï»¿/usr/lib/nautilus/extensions-2.0/python, restart nautilus and see if it works if you right click on a jpeg file
<afflux> stani: will do that in a minute
<stani> afflux: great
<afflux> pochu: alright, but isn't that still a FinalFreezeexception?
<pochu> ah, I was thinking on FeatureFreezeException...
<afflux> that's what I did first, too ;)
<sommer> sweet
<sommer> woops wrong console
<afflux> anyone familiar with autoconf/automake/autowhatever packages? I had to change a configure.in script, and I don't know what I need to do additionally to make this build cleanly in the pbuilder
<afflux> I changed the configure.in in a cdbs simple-patchsys patch
<Laney> afflux: AFAIK, you need to run autoconf
<afflux> and get the changes in the patch too?
<afflux> or in a seperate patch?
<mok0> ScottK: you there?
<azeem> slangasek: I'll try to deal with the rest of opensync tonight, am travelling now (I tried to port opensync-plugin-google-calendar to python-4suite-xml, but to no avail so far); thanks for dealing with it so far
<geser> afflux: how big are the changes you did?
<afflux> geser: added one AC_DEFINE_UNQUOTED line
<geser> afflux: if the changes are small I usually patch configure and configure.in (in case someone wants to run autoreconf)
<afflux> the build fails without
<afflux> err, I mean the build fails without running autoreconf
<geser> I'd propose to run autoreconf and put the changes from configure into a new patch (so you don't need rerun autoreconf during build)
<afflux> so, I need to cdbs-edit-patch, do my changes, exit, cdbs-edit-patch a higher number, run autoreconf save those patches, correct?
<geser> yes, so you have your changes and the changes from autoreconf into seperate files and can easily recreate it if configure changes in future (and the configure patch doesn't apply anymore)
<afflux> ah, okay
<geser> the alternative would be to run autoreconf during build (but it's not liked by all people)
<slangasek> azeem: oh, well, I'm already working on merging some of the plugins myself :)
<crimsun> \sh: no.
<emgent> hi crimsun
<crimsun> hi emgent
<RainCT> siretart: ping
<afflux> I've an upstream configure.in script using a AM_CHECK_PYTHON_HEADERS macro. However, my automake installation can't find it. What do I need to make aclocal add this?
<siretart> RainCT: pong
<RainCT> siretart: InternalError: could not connect to server: No such file or directory
<RainCT> Is the server running locally and accepting connections on Unix domain socket "/var/run/postgresql/.s.PGSQL.5432"?
<RainCT> siretart: any idea how to fix this?
<siretart> sorry, no.
<nityad> Is packages.ubuntu.com down?
<RainCT> nityad: seems so
<afflux> upstream forgot to export the m4 directory in it's release tarballs, but I need it for fixing a bug. is it okay to just check it out from the svn and add it to my patch?
<james_w> afflux: is this for python-nautilus?
<afflux> yes
<james_w> is the problem fixed upstream?
<afflux> you mean the problem I'm fixing at the moment? No, not yet.
<afflux> I'll forward this bug when I checked whether my patch is valid
<afflux> but I can't without adding the directory ;)
<james_w> for the package I think you should just change that line in the source.
<james_w> when you report the bug upstream you can point them to the configure part, or provide the whole patch there if you like.
<afflux> james_w: you mean hardcode the new extension dir?
<james_w> this is turning in to a very invasive change for a one-line problem.
<james_w> afflux: yes
<afflux> okay
<james_w> you can write a note in the changelog that it is not the right way to fix it, but that it will so for hardy
<afflux> okay
<RainCT> siretart: got it working, had to change the port in the config file for 8.3 to the same one 8.2 was using
<afflux> stani, james_w: added a debdiff to bug 215714, subscribed motu-release.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 215714 in nautilus-python "The path for python extensions should be reflect the 2.0 api" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/215714
<afflux> stani, james_w: checked the "better" fix with non-hardcoded paths and it's working, *if* I add some files from their SVN repo. I'll forward this patch to them tomorrow. Good night :)
<rzr> is http://packages.ubuntu.com down ?
<stani> afflux: thanks
<smagoun> is there a way to make dh_installchangelogs (called via debhelper.mk) *exclude* debian/changelog from a package? I have a source package that generates a number of binary packages, one for each of my customers. I don't want the source pkg's changelog in the binary packages since it has proprietary info in it.
<slangasek> I think you can have a debian/${binary-package}.changelog that dh_installchangelogs will install instead
<slangasek> every binary package is supposed to have a changelog, though, and that's the purpose of dh_installchangelogs, so there's no way to tell it not to do its job
<smagoun> slangasek: thanks. The docs for CDBS implied that you can install stuff in addition to the debian/changelog rather than instead of it, haven't tried it though. I'll give it a shot.
<slangasek> smagoun: hmm, docs for debhelper are what you really want here; and it's a generic feature of debhelper that if there's a debian/<package>.<file>, it will use that in preference to debian/<file>
<smagoun> slangasek: that worked, thanks! (but now I have to maintain a changelog for each binary package which is not what I want - should be easy to create a dummy CL with dpkg-parsechangelog+dch)
<slangasek> smagoun: right, that sounds like it would work :)
<sistpoty> hi folks
* sistpoty changed the topic of #ubuntu-motu to: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU | Want to get involved with the MOTUs? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing | We're in FinalFreeze, see https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel-announce/2008-April/000418.html and http://wiki.ubuntu.com/FeatureFreeze | please check rc bug fixes in debian not having entered ubuntu yet: http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/bugs/rcbugs/
<mok0> sistpoty: ping
<sistpoty> mok0: pong
<mok0> sistpoty: I need a 2nd ack on bug 195772
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 195772 in matplotlib "please upgrade python-matplotlib to version later than 0.90.1" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/195772
 * sistpoty looks
* sistpoty changed the topic of #ubuntu-motu to: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU | Want to get involved with the MOTUs? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing | We're in FinalFreeze, see https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel-announce/2008-April/000418.html and http://wiki.ubuntu.com/FinalFreeze and https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FeatureFreeze | please check rc bug fixes in debian not having entered ubuntu yet: http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/bugs/rcbugs/
<awmcclain> Hi all. I'm building an Ubuntu package for perlbal (initially not for distribution to universal or anything). It currently requires libio-aio-perl, which is no longer (or never was) in the Ubuntu repository. Is it better to 1) massage my sources.list to download libio-aio-perl from http://debian.pkgs.cpan.org/, or 2) Download the perl module myself and build the ubuntu debian package for libio-aio-perl myself?
<sistpoty> awmcclain: is it in debian/unstable already? if so, then I using that (or rather a rebuild) would seem like the best choice
<awmcclain> sistpoty: Ah, good point. Is there a doc for using the debian repos as a source for ubuntu somewhere?
<sistpoty> awmcclain: no, and actually you shouldn't use them (it's not guaranteed that these are binary compatible)... so you'll really only want to grab the source and do a local rebuild
<awmcclain> sistpoty: Great. That was my hunch but I wanted to make sure I wasn't making more work for myself.
<awmcclain> Thank you!
<sistpoty> np
<sistpoty> awmcclain: side note: for perl packages, it should indeed be safe right now to use debian packages on hardy (perl doesn't get compiled)... however this might change in a few days, as soon as the new perl version enters unstable
<awmcclain> (I'm also targeting for gutsy, so I appreciate the warning)
<sistpoty> mok0: do you have a diff of the debian directory available somewhere? (pastebin is ok for me)
<sistpoty> asac: just looking at bug 213827.. imo you could have just ack'd that as FF liason for motu-release ;)
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 213827 in flashplugin-nonfree "typo in prerm file breaks failed-upgrade processing" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/213827
<asac> sistpoty: yes i considered this but wasn't sure
<mok0> sispoty: just came back... let me find that diff
<mok0> sispoty: the diff is huge
<mok0> sistpoty: ... or did you only want debian/ ?
<sistpoty> sistpoty: only debian actually
<sistpoty> erm.. mok0: even
<mok0> http://pastebin.com/f7694b212
<sistpoty> asac: funny, I get an assertion error with FF3 (while upgrading while trying to look at mok0's diff)
<sebner> mok0: please upload rrootage :)
<mok0> sebner: you got that bullet thing uploaded?
<sebner> mok0: debwait ;)
<sebner> mok0: I testbuilded it. all is fine
<mok0> sebner: I gotta get acks first
<sebner> sistpoty: ping
<sistpoty> sebner: pong
<sebner> sistpoty: please ACK. bug #212766 . hi btw :)
<mok0> sebner: sispoty is looking at another package for me
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 212766 in rrootage "Merge rrootage 0.23a-7 from Debian(Unstable)" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/212766
<sebner> mok0: he has multitasking abilities :P
<sistpoty> mok0: just looked over it (now with the ugpraded FF3...) looks like debian/changelog doesn't really match the diff. also I guess I really would like Fujitsu to give an ACK/REJ instead of me
<mok0> sistpoty: ok, I'll ask him
<sistpoty> mok0: thanks... I'll subscribe him to the bug
<asac> sistpoty: while upgrading? was xul replaced underneath?
<sistpoty> asac: need to check the logs, but I guess that may well be
<sistpoty> asac: nope, doesn't look like it from /var/log/dpkg.log: 2008-04-03 22:36:22 install libxul-common <keine> 1.8.1.13+nobinonly-0ubuntu1
<sistpoty> (first match to /xul)
<asac> sistpoty: what kind of assertion? "just" glib?
<asac> only assertion? or just crash?
<asac> flash definitly dumps glib assertions
<sistpoty> asac: assertion shown in window... give me a sec, I have a screenshot
<sistpoty> (I don't have flash installed :P)
<asac> ah
<sistpoty> asac: http://www.potyra.de/ff3.assert.errror.png
<sistpoty> (but it's gone now after the upgrade :))
<asac> could you reproduce before?
<asac> what did you do to get that?
<sistpoty> asac: no, it only happened *during* the upgrade, so no...
<sistpoty> asac: well, I did an apt-get update && apt-get dist-upgrade... so I assume that FF3 opened some files on demand, which might have not been there during the upgrade
<sistpoty> (so I wouldn't give that too much priority actually)
<asac> strange anyway
<asac> maybe cairo update
<asac> butunlikely
<sistpoty> sebner: ack'd
<sebner> sistpoty: thx :D
<sebner> sistpoty: previous version: - Add libboost-dev to build-depends (fixes FTBFS)
<sistpoty> sebner: previous version doesn't mean, that it still applies to the current version
<sebner> sistpoty: that's clear. just wanted to answer your question ^^
<sistpoty> sebner: heh, but also the question is really: why was this needed in the first place (as in where did ubuntu diverge from debian) that much... but it's really just a side-note ;)
<sebner> sistpoty: fix was introduced because of this. http://pastebin.com/m5b87f1ed
<sebner> sistpoty: I'm a dork -.-
<sistpoty> heh
<xtknight> so we're frozen and there's a fix for Bug 215027.  what do i do?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 215027 in jockey "jockey-gtk crashed with AttributeError: 'tuple' object has no attribute 'getSections'" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/215027
<slangasek> azeem: fyi, libopensync-plugin-google-calendar doesn't build out-of-the-box for me, because the configure script in the source package isn't up-to-date wrt the automake macros
<sebner> sistpoty: It's a sync. Debian solved the problem in another way. Added libboost-dev as a dependency for libbulletml-dev.
<xtknight> !info jockey hardy
<ubotu> Package jockey does not exist in hardy
<xtknight> !info jockey-gtk hardy
<ubotu> jockey-gtk (source: jockey): GNOME user interface and desktop integration for driver management. In component main, is optional. Version 0.3.3-0ubuntu7 (hardy), package size 6 kB, installed size 96 kB
<azeem> slangasek: weird, the PPA I uploaded this week built fine AFAICT
<sistpoty> xtknight: you'll need an ack from ubuntu-release (maybe slangasek might want to take a look :P)(
<xtknight> ah joy "0-
<slangasek> azeem: oh, this is a merge against 0.22-4 rather than 0.22-5, is that the difference?
<xtknight> :)
<xtknight> critical fix imo, hardware drivers dialog is broken for everybody
<azeem> slangasek: there's a problem with python at runtime
<slangasek> sistpoty: unless it needs a feature freeze exception, no, I want core-dev to use their best judgement, upload, and let it be reviewed in the queue ;)
<slangasek> azeem: python-xml? :)
<azeem> depending on how you handled the merge
<azeem> doko's diff wasn't enough
<slangasek> oh?
<sebner> sistpoty: I'll change it to a sync. ACK is still valid, right :)
<xtknight> sistpoty, i should subscribe ubuntu-main-sponsors or someone else?
<crimsun> jdong: / sistpoty: RE: 185634, have you guys reviewed the code?
<slangasek> azeem: if you have a package that works better, I'll happily take it
<azeem> unfortunately, not
<azeem> been hacking on it for a couple of days now
<sistpoty> xtknight: yes, please (and/or asking in #ubuntu-devel)
<xtknight> sistpoty, never mind i found instructions on FreezeExceptionProcess.  sorry for bothering you
<slangasek> azeem: ah, drat.  I was just looking at the 0.22-5 changelog and wondering if I should just take that one...
<azeem> slangasek: oh, I haven't looked at 0.19-2ubuntu3
<azeem> yet
<azeem> doko only told me about -2ubuntu2
<slangasek> ah
<azeem> lemme try that
<slangasek> well, MoM didn't know about -2ubuntu3 either at the time I started my merge :-P
<sistpoty> crimsun: no... I don't have much clue about kernel stuff
<slangasek> I may be better off wiping this dir and starting over (or letting you get it) :)
<crimsun> sistpoty: that's not kernel stuff, really.
<crimsun> sistpoty: it's really no different from any other firmware loader source package we have, like the midisport stuff
<sistpoty> crimsun: I guess that falls under "kernel-stuff" for me :P
<crimsun> (so yes, while it involves the kernel and udev, it's pretty much still MOTU)
<azeem> oh, so python-xml isn't totall gone afterall?
<slangasek> azeem: for all intents and purposes it's supposed to be
<slangasek> azeem: in practice it may not actually be /gone/ yet...
<azeem> well, did the cop-out thing in 2ubuntu3
<azeem> +doko
<sebner> mok0: I unsubscribed you. It's a sync now ^^
<sistpoty> crimsun: still, it seems to be caused by changes in the kernel (or rather kernel package), right?
<slangasek> oh
<azeem> i.e. frobbed sys.path
<azeem> that might sensible enough for enough
<slangasek> oh grr, libopensync-plugin-kdepim was 1ubuntu1 when it should've been 1build1
 * slangasek shakes fist
<sistpoty> sebner: how do I actually play it (just testing the current version in ubuntu)... I can't seem to pass the intro screen :/
<crimsun> sistpoty: not that I can tell.
<sistpoty> crimsun: I'm asking because of https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/185634/comments/3
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 185634 in ubuntu-meta "uvcvideo: iSight firmware loading does not work" [Medium,Confirmed]
<sebner> sistpoty: choose a level and press "z"
<crimsun> sistpoty: the kernel driver absorbing diffs and being renamed is not the culprit.  The culprit is combined /proc/bus/usb deprecation and udev rule silliness.
<sistpoty> sebner: ok, thanks... that game sucks actually... I'm constantly loosing :O
<slangasek> azeem: ok, and libopensync-plugin-sunbird wants to rename to -iceowl... :)  Do you have a package for this in your ppa that does the Ubuntu-ish thing?
<sebner> sistpoty: xD. yeah not that exciting but hey there's still xmoto :P
<crimsun> sistpoty: if I were doing a more thorough review, I would tidy up the udev rule to be conditional.
<azeem> slangasek: hrm, no :-/
<crimsun> sistpoty: aside from that, it's really up to MOTU-R.  :-)
<sistpoty> crimsun: that's much more than I'd have known for instance... what would you do? give an ack for this?
<slangasek> azeem: ok, I'll chase that up, but not today :)
<sistpoty> sebner: bah... xmoto... I want a game I can easily win :P
<azeem> slangasek: maybe it's better to drop that package, because it doesn't work with latest sunbird (they changed file format)
<azeem> it used to be .ics or so, now it's some nightmare
<sebner> sistpoty: you're just lazy. xD
<sistpoty> heh
<slangasek> azeem: drop it from both Debian and Ubuntu, or just Ubuntu for hardy?
<crimsun> sistpoty: no.  I'd ask for the udev rule to be updated (e.g., checking for ACTION!="add" then short-circuiting, etc.)
<azeem> slangasek: for hardy; I need to investigate for Debian; maybe it can be renamed to -plugin-file-ics, or so :)
<azeem> this is second hand konwledge though
<slangasek> azeem: haha, ok.  Would you mind filing a bug against it in LP with the rationale, and pointing me at it (or subscribing ubuntu-archive), so I have something to point at when people ask where it's gone?
<azeem> (astronut fried his calendar by pointing that plugin to the new locations/file)
<sistpoty> crimsun: ok, thanks (still have no clue, but I'll just cite you :P)
<slangasek> sweet
<crimsun> sistpoty: np
<azeem> slangasek: ok, the plugin didn't get ported to 0.3x now anyway and looks like a dead-end
<jdong> bug 185634
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 185634 in ubuntu-meta "uvcvideo: iSight firmware loading does not work" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/185634
<azeem> bug 215981
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 215981 in libopensync-plugin-sunbird "Package should get removed or renamed" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/215981
<azeem> slangasek: ^^
<sebner> gn8 folks :)
<slangasek> azeem: thanks
<YokoZar> Forgive me if this sounds like a really stupid question, but why is BLAH="what" echo $BLAH    giving me no output on the terminal?
<slangasek> because structured like that, what you're saying is "run the 'echo $BLAH' command with BLAH set to "what" in its environment"
<slangasek> so $BLAH gets evaluated, passed as an argument to the 'echo' command, and BLAH=what is set in the environment
<Fujitsu> sistpoty: You mean I did the last upload to hardy? I don't believe I've ever uploaded matplotlib to unstable.
<tjaalton> any motu-release members available? I've got a couple of vdr-plugin merges to fix FTBFS, debdiffs: http://users.tkk.fi/~tjaalton/dpkg/ {console,osdserver}.debdiff
<YokoZar> slangasek: I guess I was expecting it to do the same thing as export BLAH="what" and then typing echo $BLAH on a new line (which does output what)
<tjaalton> vdr-plugin-xinelibout fails to build on 64bit even though it uses -fPIC.. don't know what's going on there
<slangasek> YokoZar: yes, it's not unreasonable to /expect/ that, but that's not what it does, for the reason explained. :)
<sistpoty> Fujitsu: damn, yes. I've been intrigued by the diff
<sistpoty> tjaalton: http://users.tkk.fi/~tjaalton/dpkg/osdserver.debdiff looks sane, ACK for this one
<sistpoty> tjaalton: http://users.tkk.fi/~tjaalton/dpkg/console.debdiff looks a little bit whacky in regards to rules?
<sistpoty> tjaalton: the other change to console.debdiff look sane though. please go ahead with this as you deem fit
<sistpoty> tjaalton: the hutcc.* also for discussion?
<sistpoty> (01_hutcc.* even)
<tjaalton> sistpoty: heh, no, those are just leftovers
<sistpoty> heh, k
<sistpoty> tjaalton: ok, then please go ahead
<tjaalton> sistpoty: -console switched to cdbs as the other plugins did, so that's why the diff looks odd
<sistpoty> tjaalton: ah, didn't see this
<sistpoty> k, /me needs to go to bed now... gn8 everyone
<RainCT> good night
#ubuntu-motu 2008-04-12
<azeem> slangasek: I think the google-calendar issue is a bug in python-4suite-xml rather, I've reassigned the Debian bug.  Not sure what to do about it for hardy though
<Fujitsu> Any motu-release people around?
<slangasek> azeem: ok, I'll take a peek at this sometime over the weekend
<azeem> easiest would be to apply doko's one line patch to 0.22-4
<azeem> 0.22-5 is botched
<xtknight> hmm FTBFS for tex4ht ( Build-Depends-Indep dependency for tex4ht cannot be satisfied because no available versions of package java-gcj-compat-dev can satisfy version requirements ) + bug 216027
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 216027 in tex4ht "[hardy] unmet dependency blocking upgrade of tex4ht" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/216027
<xtknight> what do we do if a whole package is broken like this, after the freeze?
<slangasek> 1) we swear at whoever it was who asked for that package to be synced
<xtknight> :p
<slangasek> oh wait, maybe we don't do that
<slangasek> we can, however, twist doko's arm and demand that he fix it :)
<slangasek> oh, no
<slangasek> doko requested it originally, but the latest sync was someone else reopening the sync bug instead of filing their own
<slangasek> hmm, and mok0's not here to have his arm twisted. :)
<slangasek> ... or, on reflection, this is entirely my fault because it was meant to be synced from testing instead of from unstable, which means I grabbed the wrong version, hooray!
 * xtknight sports a puzzled look on his face
<slangasek> bug #131239
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 131239 in tex4ht "sync request" [Wishlist,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/131239
<xtknight> oh well.  sync happens.
<slangasek> :)
<slangasek> well, I think this is fixable just by relaxing the build-dependency
<slangasek> (doesn't ensure that the package from unstable is usable, but we have to take our chances there :/)
<xtknight> so it's too late to grab the testing version or too unfeasible at this stage?
<slangasek> it's too late to do it as a sync, because hardy already has a higher version number
<slangasek> so it'd have to be an epoch (meaning Debian and Ubuntu would never sync again), or a faked version number (meaning Ubuntu couldn't sync again until the next upstream version)
<slangasek> I'm going to try the trivial fix
<slangasek> if it doesn't work, do you want to punch me to get me to try the less trivial fix? :)
<xtknight> "debian and ubuntu would never sync again" sounds like the universe is ripping apart at the seams
<slangasek> heh
<azeem> there's probably a secret "invent bogus reasons to bump epoch in Debian, so we can sync again" agency somewhere
<Fujitsu> I had to add an epoch to an Ubuntu package once, but the Debian maintainer emailed me shortly afterwards saying he'd add it to his next Debian upload to make it less painful.
<Fujitsu> (in this case it was due to a naming conflict with an Ubuntu-specific package)
<xtknight> compiles just fine if you make the java deps >= 1.0.77 (note, compiles fine)
<slangasek> yep, that's the trivial fix I'm currently attempting
<xtknight> and it runs although i haven't put any tex files through it
<xtknight> how would a newer version of tex4ht but the same old version of tex4ht-common get in the archive?  aren't things synced by using source?  if so how did one binary package get built just fine on the build farm?
<xtknight> i mean both come from tex4ht source package
<slangasek> xtknight: because the -common package is arch: all, which means it only gets built once for all archs; so every other architecture, whose buildd isn't supposed to build the arch: all packages, gets the updated tex4ht package without tex4ht-common
<xtknight> ah
<xtknight> it seems as though it should automatically file a launchpad bug if a build fails, or notify somebody.  maybe that somebody just hasn't noticed
<awmcclain> Is there a good channel for asking non-basic debhelper questions?
<xtknight> here or #debian i think
<awmcclain> Ok. I'm trying to fix up an existing (poorly maintained) package for ubuntu. In the <package>.install file, it has lines like "usr/bin/perlbal     /usr/sbin". Is that first line referring to the directory that gets built in the debian folder? i.e. debian/<package>/usr/sbin ?
<slangasek> yes
<awmcclain> Which dh_* creates those build directories (and the files within)? dh_installdirs?
<slangasek> dh_install is what processes .install files
<awmcclain> Right, but how does "debian/<package>/usr/bin" get created in the first place? Doesn't dh_install go from your build directories (debian/<package>/usr/bin/perlbal) to your system directories (/usr/sbin)?
<awmcclain> I guess that's why I'm confused... it seems like the line "usr/bin/perlbal /usr/sbin" is referencing a file IN the build directories, but at the same time, dh_install CREATES those files. Seems circular to me.
<slangasek> no, dh_install copies files from <wherever> to debian/<package>/<specified directory>
<slangasek> dh_install has a manpage that's supposed to explain this :)
<awmcclain> It does, and I've read it, but I'm confused about this specific line
<awmcclain> ohhh
<awmcclain> i'm guessing
<awmcclain> that
<awmcclain> the makefile in the PARENT of debian
<awmcclain> is creating a usr/bin/ directory
<slangasek> as part of the install target, normally, yes
<awmcclain> ahh, i misphrased my first question, which is what got me confused
<awmcclain> ok
<awmcclain> ok
<awmcclain> Last question. I've looked through the debian policy manual and the maintainers guide, I know that template conf files should go in /usr/share/<package>. Is there a standard place to put them in my build package? Can I just make a defaults/ directory as a sibling to debian/ and install it with perlball.install, or is there a special debhelper for that (like for docs)?
<awmcclain> Or would it make more sense to place them within my debian/ folder?
<slangasek> it's customary to limit oneself to the debian/ directory within the source package
<awmcclain> Makes sense. And then i could just use "debian/perbal.conf.default /usr/share/perlbal" in my .install file.
<awmcclain> Or "debian/defaults/perlbal.conf.default /usr/share/perlbal"
<slangasek> indeed
<awmcclain> Ok. Thank you very much.
<slangasek> n/p
<bddebian> Heya gang
 * slangasek waves
<bddebian> Hello slangasek
<blueyed> Hi
 * blueyed is buffled that we have b2evolution in Ubuntu? I remember having asked for it some time ago and somehow it must have been in there already.. totally outdated.
<blueyed> There's the current stable release in Debian now. So it should get either synced or removed. (I'm part of upstream)
<slangasek> blueyed: please file a bug against the ubuntu package requesting removal, and subscribe ubuntu-archive
<blueyed> slangasek: I would rather like to request a sync/upload. Found already typos in the german templates. Or is removal the only option?
<slangasek> we're in hard freeze
<slangasek> you can request a sync through motu-release, but I guess they'll probably say no?
<blueyed> ok, better this way anyway. People should not be stuck at this version for up to 5 years.. :D
<blueyed> slangasek: status of the bug? new?
<slangasek> blueyed: "confirmed,medium"
<Fujitsu> TheMuso: Shouldn't vlc only recommend the pulse plugin?
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: ping
<Fujitsu> Hobbsee: Can you poke things through UNAPPROVED, please?
<Fujitsu> If LP works now, that is.
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: no.  i tried that last night.  They broke it again.
<Fujitsu> So I saw.
<Hobbsee> hmm, i'll try it again, i asked cprov to tell me when he'd fixed it, though
<emgent> heya
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: nah, it's still broken.
<Fujitsu> Hobbsee: Lovely.
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: i hope for a cherry pick.  I'm going to get really annoyed if they don't fix it before the next rollout.
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: then again, if they don't fix it before the next rollout, we'll know they didn't actually test the new bits in the rollout.
<Fujitsu> But having no universe archive admins pre-release is *fun*.
<Fujitsu> We have no usable archive admins outside very western Europe now, do we?
<Hobbsee> mm, correct.
<Fujitsu> Hm, and the US, actually.
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: yeah, that's why i tried for him.
<superm1> RAOF, you here?
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: pong
<TheMuso> Fujitsu: Did you read the bug in the changelog?
<Fujitsu> TheMuso: I did not.
<Fujitsu> TheMuso: Recommends are installed by default, and we're going to get hordes of people complaining that they can no longer get rid of PA>
<AnAnt> Hello, how can I create a source.changes file for a source package ?
<hyperair> join #ubuntu-devel
<hyperair> whoops forgot the /
<xtknight> AnAnt, run debuild -S
<hyperair> eheheh hi xtknight
<xtknight> :)
<hyperair> so
<AnAnt> xtknight: should I unpack the source package ?
<xtknight> AnAnt, yes where did the source package come from ?  a tarball or debian?
<AnAnt> xtknight: I got dsc + diff.gz + orig tarball
<hyperair> about Bug #201462 and Bug #186938
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 201462 in gksu "nautilus-gksu stopped working in hardy" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/201462
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 186938 in nautilus-wallpaper "nautilus-wallpaper not working in hardy heron after update to nautilus-2.21.6" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/186938
<xtknight> AnAnt, dpkg-source -x *.dsc
<AnAnt> I downloaded them
<AnAnt> ok thaks
<xtknight> AnAnt, cd resultingdir ; debuild -S
<hyperair> i should submit a featurefreeeze exception eh?
<xtknight> hyperair, yup that would be mandatory to provide the info there.  i dont know if it's featurefreeze, because it's not a new feature.
<xtknight> well i dont know for sure
<xtknight> never filed one myself
<hyperair> @_@
<hyperair> alright
<hyperair> i haven't either
<hyperair> what's diffstat?
<hyperair> i've never heard of it
<xtknight> dunno
<AnAnt> xtknight: thanks
<xtknight> hyperair, i think this is what you want https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess#head-4bba384c89c09d141f4e2cc06816d0405593db5c
<xtknight> you basically edit the bug's description with the info requested there
<hyperair> thanks
<xtknight> hyperair, the only thing is, what you posted on those bugs were not debdiffs, not sure what they are
<hyperair> whooooops?
<hyperair> i did debdiff somedeb someotherdeb > bla.debdiff
<hyperair> it isn't?
<xtknight> ah you have to use the dsc files
<xtknight> debdiff somedeb-ubuntu0.dsc somedeb-ubuntu1.dsc > bla.debdiff
<hyperair> when i did that it complained that it wanted debs
<hyperair> ><
<xtknight> you already got it on your ppa so you should have all you need
<hyperair> eh?
<hyperair> yeah i have both dscs on my comp
<xtknight> i mean all you need to generate the debdiffs
<hyperair> it says...
<hyperair> debdiff: fatal error at line 262:
<hyperair> Need exactly two deb files or changes files to compare
<xtknight> uhhh dunno.  make a new folder like orig, download original dsc to there and then do it
<DarkMageZ> anyone remember the command that'll download the whole source package including .orig.tar.gz & diff.gz & .dsc just by pointing it at the .dsc?
<lifeless> apt-get source ?
<xtknight> doesnt seem possible
<hyperair> nevermind i think i managed it
<hyperair> =D
<xtknight> well it's 5am here... sweet dreams
<xtknight> :o
<DarkMageZ> lifeless, nope :(. i ment the one that'll pull the source package from "*something* https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/hardy/+source/libvisual-plugins/0.4.0.dfsg.1-2/+files/libvisual-plugins_0.4.0.dfsg.1-2.dsc"
<hyperair> gdnight then xtknight. thanks for the help
<DarkMageZ> i know apt-get source libvisual-plugins would work in this case, but if i was pulling from debian or an older version of ubuntu.
<hyperair> i don't think it's very hard to just download three packages
<hyperair> =\
<hyperair> i mean three files
<hyperair> orig.tar.gz, diff.gz, and dsc
<hyperair> just three
<DarkMageZ> hyperair, when you're downloading 30 or so, cause you're doing something big. then it's important. it's a shame i can't remember what the command for that tool is.
<hyperair> i remember reading something like that recently
<hyperair> hmmmm
<hyperair> try searching in the ubuntu packaging guide
<hyperair> somewhere in ubuntu wiki
<hyperair> could be there
<DarkMageZ> hyperair, ah. yes it was in there. thanks.
<hyperair> dget
<hyperair> the program is dget
<DarkMageZ> they've really modernised the packaging guide since i last saw it. nice.
<hyperair> hahah
<hyperair> that's true
<hyperair> say, have you filed a featurefreeze exception request before?
<hyperair> i'm not very sure how
<hyperair> =\
<hyperair> should i modify an existing bug to add the required info, or should i file a new bug?
<DktrKranz> motu-release guys, is it OK to upload bug 194190? FFe granted already.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 194190 in cacti "Please sync cacti 0.8.7b-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/194190
<Fujitsu> Please please please sync it. Though I'm not motu-release.
<emgent> heya
<DktrKranz> Fujitsu, that would be a merge, though, but I guess we want it in since it has several fixes, especially security-related.
<DktrKranz> (and an annoying bug during postinst)
<Fujitsu> Yep.
<Fujitsu> Better to fix them before release than after.
<DktrKranz> Yes, it would be a SRU candidate too
<DktrKranz> so, let's fix here :)
<Fujitsu> SRU+security == ewww
<chewit> hi, i need help creating a deb file from source
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: retroactive ack for bip, thanks.
<sebner> DktrKranz: buon giorno :)
<DktrKranz> heya sebner! :)
<elmargol> How do I sign my source?
<elmargol> i create a new package using dpkg-buildpackage -S -sa -rfakeroot
<azeem> slangasek: hah, I got some 4suite people to fix the goog-cal plugin to work with python-4suite-xml
<geser> elmargol: then dpkg-buildpackage should sign it (or at least try to), but you can also use debsign on the _source.changes file
<elmargol> Oh the problem is somewhere else.. somehow the result files of pbuilder arent signed anymore :(
<elmargol> + the source is not in my results folder
<crimsun> sigh.  people using Debian's sysv-rc 2.86.ds1-5x and expecting things to work in Ubuntu.
<sebner> DktrKranz: willing to review something? *once again* ^^
<DktrKranz> sebner, if you have ACK from motu-release, sure
<sebner> DktrKranz: I have :)
<elmargol> someone knows why I dont hate a orig.tar.gz gile in my results folder?
<sebner> DktrKranz: debdiff is really small though ^^ bug #216277
<DktrKranz> sebner, ok, point me to some bug numbers, I need do so some housekeeping, but I'll look at them later
<sebner> damn ubotu
<sebner> DktrKranz: thx :)
<sebner> DktrKranz: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/python-numpy/+bug/216277
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 216277 in python-numpy "missing parentheses in /usr/share/pyshared/numpy/f2py/rules.py" [Undecided,New]
<sebner> ubotu: good boy :)
<ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about good boy :) - try searching on http://ubotu.ubuntu-nl.org/factoids.cgi
<sebner> xD
<DktrKranz> is a bad boy, then
<DktrKranz> boy, or bot, it depends
<sebner> DktrKranz: nvm. I like (crazy) bots :D
<geser> Hobbsee: what info are needed to get an ACK for a sync request right now?
<elmargol> I have a package on my ppa wich depends a package on my ppa... dow do I include this?
<Hobbsee> elmargol: ppa questions in #launchpad
<Hobbsee> it's not on topic for here
<elmargol> thx
<mok0_> elmargol: I don't think you have to do anything
<protonchris> During the final freeze how many motu-release acks do I need before I subscribe u-u-s?
<mok0_> protonchris: still 2 acks
<protonchris> mok0_: thanks.
<LaserJock> morning all
<mok0_> Hey LaserJock
<protonchris> Hey LaserJock
<apachelogger> siretart: please take a look at my debdiff for bug #176332
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 176332 in amarok "amarok does not work with pulseaudio [hardy]" [Critical,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/176332
<Mirv> would someone have time to sponsor the compizconfig-settings-manager which got broken for Finnish as the 0.7.4 got uploaded? bug 216211 - .dsc from my PPA and debdiff attached
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 216211 in compizconfig-settings-manager "ccsm Finnish translation broken again" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/216211
<Mirv> it does nothing besides fixing the PO/fi.po file
<mok0_> Mirv: you need to get 2 acks from motu-release first
<sebner> mok0_: 1
<crimsun> just one ack.  I'm pretty we enacted that change way back in the first MC.
<crimsun> pretty sure, even
<DktrKranz> ScottK (or someone from motu-release), is it OK to proceed with bug 194190?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 194190 in cacti "Please sync cacti 0.8.7b-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/194190
<afflux> anyone from ubuntu-desktop available for ACKing bug 215714 ?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 215714 in nautilus-python "The path for python extensions should be reflect the 2.0 api" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/215714
<siretart> apachelogger: that one is a dupe of a xine-lib bug. test package is available, up to now only one tester has reported back
<apachelogger> siretart: is the test package in the archives?
<siretart> apachelogger: in the motumedia PPA
<apachelogger> siretart: gonna test it
<siretart> thanks
<apachelogger> but if you used the same patch it should work without problems ;-)
<siretart> I'm currently on a local lug event, I'll look a bit later at it
<apachelogger> siretart: k
<RainCT> which command reads debian/manpages, dh_installman or dh_installmanpages?
<LaserJock> dh_installman is the one you want
<LaserJock> reall man dh_installmanpages
<LaserJock> *read
<RainCT> LaserJock: thanks
<Mirv> mok0_: ok.
<Mirv> mok0_: oh, actually I thought on some motu-release mailing list, but there's no such. so where exactly I should get the ack from?
<Mirv> just here asking from some in the motu release team to put some "ack" in the bug report?
<Mirv> (a post says either file a bug report (already done) or ask on irc...)
<pochu> Mirv: did you subscribe the team to the bug report?
<Mirv> pochu: yep.
<Mirv> bug 216211
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 216211 in compizconfig-settings-manager "ccsm Finnish translation broken again" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/216211
<pochu> that should be enough then... you could also ask someone here, although I don't promise you they'll be around ;)
<Mirv> ok, I'll wait until Mon or Tue. hopefully people have time to handle these (everyone's quite busy anyway, whether paid of volunteer..)
<RainCT> another stupid question.. does using $(CURDIR) or not using it make any difference (ie, might it FTBFS somewhere without it)?
<LaserJock> not sure about a FTBFS
<LaserJock> actually, yeah it could do that
<LaserJock> if it was trying to cp or something a file that no long exists where it thinks it does
<zasf> I'm trying to build this package wich recentrly switched from configure to autogen.sh
<zasf> do I need to change control file?
<zasf> how?
<RainCT> LaserJock: ok, thanks again
<LaserJock> zasf: usually autogen.sh just creates a .configure
<zasf> hem.. you see, I'm not that expert
<zasf> pbuilder complains that
<zasf> chmod: cannot access `/tmp/buildd/gnome-applets-2.23.0/./configure': No such file or directory
<LaserJock> yeah, because autogen.sh has to be run to create it
<LaserJock> often times that's done before an official release
<zasf> ah, so does it mean I have to run autogen in my source dir before debuild?
<tuxmaniac> Hi folks! what could be the reason for configure to run twice? any general reason possible or is it case to case?
<zasf> LaserJock: I added a 'DEB_CONFIGURE_SCRIPT := $(CURDIR)/$(DEB_SRCDIR)/autogen.sh' to debian/rules.. let's see
<RainCT> if a package needs tar, should it depend on it or is it supposed to be always installed?
<RainCT> or rather, is ubuntu-minimal always installed?
<StevenK> Essential: yes
<StevenK> tar can not be removed without apt having a major hissy fit
<RainCT> ah, right. thanks
<RainCT> (lintian) W: packjam: new-package-should-close-itp-bug
<RainCT> should this be patched to look for LP instead of Closes?
<pochu> perhaps it should be changed in Debian so that if it has 'ubuntu' in the version string, it looks for LP instead of Closes
<RainCT> pochu: do you know if they have accepted any change like that before?
<LaserJock> sure
<pochu> they have merged our entire diff
<LaserJock> I'm pretty sure they've taken a lot of our checks
<RainCT> ok, great
<RainCT> uhm.. it already does :). I'm just stupid xD
<pochu> RainCT: what was the issue then? did you have -1?
<RainCT> yeh :P
<RainCT> for some reason I *always* forget to check the version number, also when reviewing :P
<LaserJock> tsk tsk
<LaserJock> I always forget to add the Closes LP: part
<superm1> what woud be the most sane way to pass to a postinst that we are upgrading from an old version?
<superm1> i can't think of anything beyond touching something in /tmp in the preinst
<pochu> superm1: if [ "$1" = install ] || [ "$1" = upgrade ]; then
<pochu> ...
<pochu> (or ony upgrade, if you don't need it for a new installation)
<pochu> s/ony/only/
<pochu> superm1: look at the gstreamer0.10's postinsts
<geser> and you can also compare the version from which the upgrade happens (iirc it's in $2)
<superm1> pochu, i didn't think upgrade was passed in the postinst
<superm1> only in the preinst
<superm1> http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-maintainerscripts.html
<superm1> as per that
<superm1> postinst passes a configure
<geser> superm1: yes, postinst gets passed configure and the old version (if applicable)
<geser> superm1: http://women.debian.org/wiki/English/MaintainerScripts has some nice graphs
<superm1> "postinst configure most-recently-configured-version", i dont see any calls with the old version
<superm1> its the new version that it is called with
<superm1> oh wait, i think i see what you mean
<superm1> in that graph now
<superm1> most recently configured version means old version
<geser> yes
<superm1> thanks geser and pochu
<slangasek> azeem: yay :)  package for me to sync/merge?
<pochu> superm1: err, then the gstreamer0.10 stuff is useless?
<superm1> well if you are doing it just like that, then it wouldn't do much from what i see in debian policy and that debian women page
<pochu> slomo_: ^^
<superm1> pochu, you still do get the old version installed in $2, but $1 needs to be configure then
<pochu> phew!
<pochu> emilio@saturno:~/deb/gstreamer/gstreamer0.10-0.10.18/debian$ ls *inst
<pochu> gstreamer0.10-doc.preinst  gstreamer0.10-tools.preinst  gstreamer-tools.preinst  libgstreamer0.10-0-dbg.preinst  libgstreamer0.10-dev.preinst
<pochu> slomo_: false alarm, those are preinst so we are safe :)
<geser> gstreamer0.10 has only preinst no postinst
<superm1> ah okay :)
<pochu> debian/changelog was confusing though :)
<pochu> but it didn't make sense to remove directories in postinst
<superm1> it really sucks though when you make a bad choice in a convention of where to name files, and then have to deal with it in new versions via postinst/postrm
<pochu> superm1: conffiles?
<superm1> pochu, no it's for a theme.  i didn't realize that when we "changed" the theme, it can cause crashes due to a dated cache
<superm1> so the new theme is in its own directory and the old one in its own directory
<superm1> but for folks upgrading need a symlink in place
<superm1> so that they can use the old one by the same name
<slangasek> superm1: looks like my change to the backports-modules regexp still had a thinko, fixing now - so the /next/ DVD should really be fixed ;)
<superm1> hehe
<stani> pochu: are you there?
<slangasek> azeem: w00t, google-calendar synced
<stani> slangasek: with evolution?
<slangasek> stani: I mean that the plugin package has been synced from Debian...:)
<stani> ok, I just got in so missed the context
<RB2> I had a question about a particular package and what happens when it's put into the repo. The app has a bug or two that manifests itself when installing from the application's site. But, they don't in the repo version. Would this be the appropriate channel?
<sebner> aloha afflux :)
<afflux> heya sebner :)
<LaserJock> RB2: what's the package?
<slangasek> azeem: are the various 'multisync' packages obsolete?
<slangasek> azeem: for that matter, have you ever used multisync0.90?  built on libopensync0, but doesn't appear to see python-based plugins :)
<LaserJock> slangasek: I'm uploading the last (hopefully) ubuntu-docs now
<LaserJock> if that's ok with you, that is ;-)
<slangasek> LaserJock: go for it :)
<slangasek> azeem: well, or at least it doesn't see the moto plugin.  Kinda hard to say where the problem is yet
<superm1> slangasek, we caught a really bad bug on a theme last night that causes mythfrontend and mythbackend to crash during upgrade scenarios.  i uploaded a workaround for those upgrade scenarios when you touch all that frozen stuff again
<slangasek> superm1: that's mythtv-theme-mythbuntu?
<superm1> yeah
<slangasek> accepted
<superm1> thanks
<RB2> LaserJock, sorry was afk. The package is nexuiz
<LaserJock> RB2: well, we get our package from Debian
<LaserJock> RB2: there are a couple of patches that debian applies to nexuiz
<RB2> LaserJock, thanks! Is there someplace that I can take a look at what patches they apply? The new nexuiz releases take a very long time to get into the repos, so I wanted to see if I could make it work correctly.
<LaserJock> RB2: yeah, have a look at http://packages.qa.debian.org/n/nexuiz.html . Down on the lower left are the source package files
<RB2> LaserJock, thanks again!
<emgent> heya
<LaserJock> hi emgent
<azeem> slangasek: hrm yeah, multisync0.90 should work in theory
<slangasek> azeem: ok. neither multisync0.90 nor kitchensync seem to like the moto plugin much :)
<slangasek> but perhaps we're off-topic, since that one didn't manage to get synced for hardy. :)
<azeem> slangasek: you need both python-opensync *and* opensync-module-python for that to work
<slangasek> and they're both installed
<azeem> hrm, right
<azeem> well, I see it when I run multisync0.90 on unstable
<azeem> I don't have my hardy install around currently
<slangasek> fun
<azeem> slangasek: you can try exporting OSYNC_TRACE=/foo and then grep the resulting Thread* files for ERROR
<azeem> slangasek: msynctool --listplugins doesn't list moto either, I assume?
<slangasek> azeem: correct
<slangasek> azeem: hmm, what do you want to bet that it's because I installed the opensync-module-python .deb from sid without rebuilding it against python 2.5? ;)
<azeem> ah
<azeem> slangasek: can you maybe try with the one from https://launchpad.net/~debian-opensync/+archive ?
<azeem> would be good to know those work, at least for the packages which won't make hardy
<slangasek> checking
<slangasek> azeem: ah yes, now it shows up ;)
<azeem> yay
<macogw> is the process for getting a patch in the same in here and in main?
<macogw> #ubuntu-devel is pretty quiet, so i thought maybe someone here might know what to do
<RainCT> macogw: well, mostly yes. the main difference is that for main you have to subscribe ubuntu-main-sponsors and for universe ubuntu-universe-sponsors to the bug to get the debdiff sponsored
<RainCT> if that's what you mean
<macogw> yeah thats what i was wondering
<RainCT> good night
<TheMuso> Fujitsu: Recommends are not installed by default afaik.
<xtknight> Suggests aren't either are they?  What is the difference?
<Fujitsu> TheMuso: They have been since Gutsy.
<Fujitsu> And aptitude did them even before that.
<TheMuso> Fujitsu: For metapackages.
<TheMuso> Fujitsu: Not everybody uses aptitude.
<Fujitsu> TheMuso: No, aptitude has done it for everything for ages, and apt does it for metapackages.
<Fujitsu> Well, having it depend on the pulse plugin is just plain wrong.
<Fujitsu> Not everyone wants pulse.
<TheMuso> Alright then. A user installs Ubuntu, and installs VLC with pulse as a recommend. They get no sound. They complain/file bugs/whatever...
<Fujitsu> A VLC user tries to remove pulseaudio because it doesn't work. They can't.
<Fujitsu> No solution.
<sebner> gn8 folks :)
<TheMuso> Fujitsu: If pulse can't be found running, vlc will fall back to alsa
<TheMuso> Fujitsu: They only need turn it off.
<Fujitsu> TheMuso: Note that apt-get also mentions the recommends, and anyone adept enough to use apt-get directly should notice.
<TheMuso> Fujitsu: Alright, I'll change it, and deal with the bugs that will eventuate.
<xtknight> user prolly doesnt even know what pulse/alsa are he just heard to install vlc and wants his sound
<Fujitsu> Depends is for relations where it really, really won't run without it.
<xtknight> just my 2c
<emgent> Heya people
<Fujitsu> Morning emgent.
<Fujitsu> TheMuso: There might be bugs, but the people who don't know what they're doing probably aren't using apt-get.
<TheMuso> Fujitsu: Well, doubtless there will be complaints when people install vlc, use pulse, and get no sound, but ok, I'll deal with that.
<Fujitsu> I guess it all depends on how many people will use apt-get, and not notice the recommended packages.
<superm1> people installing with synaptic won't notice it though
<Fujitsu> Doesn't synaptic do recommends?
<superm1> i didn't think it did
<Fujitsu> Argh, you're right. That must be a bug.
<superm1> i dont think too much harm will come from the pulse plugin being a depend
<superm1> it will prevent the support requests
<Fujitsu> Seems very odd that the primary package tool doesn't install recommends.
<superm1> and take up what, 3 megs?
<Nafallo> Fujitsu: it's a feature. only for the metapackages :-)
<superm1> at least for the hardy release
<superm1> a more complete feature can be done for intrepid perhaps
<Fujitsu> Nafallo: So packages that are strongly recommended by others shouldn't be installed automatically for the users who are most likely to want them?
<Nafallo> Fujitsu: that's correct.
<Fujitsu> TheMuso: In the light of Synaptic's misbehaviour, I can see why you did it. I believed only apt-get didn't install recommends.
<jdong> grumble ack fsck.
<jdong> stupid msmtp
<jdong> I can't connect to MIT SMTP anymore with msmtp thanks to gnutls's new anal-retentive security expectations :)
#ubuntu-motu 2008-04-13
<jdong> I see the patch for it in some sketchy 1.4.14 "prerelease".... probably not final release material at this point
 * jdong opens up his SRU tomboy note instead :)
<emgent> Fujitsu: I go to sleep :)
<emgent> It`s 1.00 am
<emgent> night all
<Nafallo> night emgent
<Fujitsu> Night emgent
<RB2> LaserJock, you still around?
<LaserJock> RB2: I am
<RB2> Quick additional question if you have a minute. Once an upstream debian package is released, what determines how long it takes to filter into the Ubuntu repos? I'm not familiar with the process.
<LaserJock> RB2: well, we sync our packages from Debian at the beginning of every release cycle
<LaserJock> which is every 6 months
<RB2> Ahh, ok. That makes sense.
<LaserJock> on top of that Ubuntu developers may select to bring in Debian packages if they are wanted to fix bugs, add features, etc.
<RB2> ok, thanks again for your time!
<jdong>  vlc (0.8.6.release.e+x264svn20071224+faad2.6.1-0ubuntu2) hardy; urgency=low
<jdong> sheesh!
<Fujitsu> jdong: That was partly my idea.
<Fujitsu> It has embedded copies of x264 and faad, so it's nice to track their versions too, plus it's ugly and cumbersome, so it's an incentive to unembed them.
<Fujitsu> Speaking of which, I need to remove x264 from vlc, as it's in multiverse.
<jdong> Fujitsu: how on earth did vlc end in universe?
<jdong> Fujitsu: AFAIK it has all of its encoding abilities intact
<Fujitsu> jdong: I really, really don't know.
<Fujitsu> And we can't demote it.
<Fujitsu> Without demoting other stuff.
<Fujitsu> We at least need to remove the embedded multiverse source package from it.
<jdong> Fujitsu: heh well we're kinda screwed... either way....
<jdong> Fujitsu: I mean we could just turn off all the encoders at buildtime
<jdong> Fujitsu: which is in effect what we need to do to make it unencumbered
<crimsun> jdong: history lesson: it has origins in Debian.  I separated the bits post-hoary, but it essentially crippled the player, so I left the embedded bits in.  And then I stopped caring for it.
<jdong> crimsun: thanks
<Fujitsu> faad is in universe nowadays, but x264 is not.
<crimsun> come to think on it, that was about the time the wxw2.4->2.6 crack was happening.
<crimsun> back then, all the crap was in multiverse.  I voted to have the whole crackfulness demoted to multiverse.  A lot of people balked.  Oh well.
<Fujitsu> We might be able to force more sanity on it by merging with Debian in Intrepid, but it's far too late for Hardy.
<jdong> crimsun: IMO we should demote the whole stack to multiverse
<Fujitsu> I'll look at what needs demotion.
<jdong> I don't want to strip out half of the featureset of VLC
<jdong> even more people will balk at that
<Fujitsu> It would be nice if we could split it out into a multiverse plugins package, like gstreamer.
<jdong> Fujitsu: is it modular enough for that to happen though?
<Fujitsu> I doubt it.
<jdong> me too
<Fujitsu> It's an insecure media player which shares code with MPlayer and Xine.
<Fujitsu> It can't be modular.
<Fujitsu> Urk.
<Fujitsu> Anybody up for demoting mythbuntu-live? They might not like that.
<Fujitsu> Oh. MythTV itself is in multiverse. Not too bad, then.
<jdong> Fujitsu: maybe we need to come up with some sort of organized double-build system for stuff like this
<Fujitsu> If we send freeplayer and mythbuntu-live to multiverse, vlc and its multitude of binaries can go there too.
<jdong> Fujitsu: heck even ffmpeg I'm not too happy about the half-neutered appraoch we do currently
<Fujitsu> Anybody got any other solutions, or should I get all three demoted?
<Fujitsu> mythbuntu-live is already breaking the rules.
<superm1> go ahead and bring mythbuntu-live to multiverse, that's not a big deal
<superm1> i'm nto sure why it was put in universe in the first place
<Fujitsu> It already depends on lots of stuff in multiverse.
<superm1> yeah
<Fujitsu> Soyuz shouldn't even be letting mythbuntu-live be in universe, as its source is in multiverse...
<slangasek> azeem: heh, the moto and evolution plugins don't seem to cross-index very well :/
<LaserJock> slangasek: would strncpy and strncat be better?
<LaserJock> sorry wrong channel
<jdong> what do y'all folk think about making update-manager more aggressive at removing/downgrading/forcing non-hardy-origin packages away during the upgrade?
<jdong> when I did my upgrade last night, a lot of my heartaches were caused by stale presence of 3rd party debs, overly aggressive backports, etc.
<jdong> IMO anything that is not of Hardy origin after the upgrade should cause update-manager to raise a red flag
<LaserJock> hmm, maybe as an option
<LaserJock> that sounds pretty invasive to just do
<jdong> LaserJock: right, either as an opt-in option or simply to alert the user or dump to /var/log as post-upgrade debugging info
<jdong> LaserJock: because one of my ABI-incompatible packages actually caused every GTK menu creation to yield a segfault.
<jdong> LaserJock: and it was only thanks to apport which tipped me off to what was going on
<LaserJock> well, if you were a user I'd tell you it's your own darn fault and serves you right ;-p
<imbrandon> evening all
<TheMuso> imbrandon!
<imbrandon> heya TheMuso
<TheMuso> Long time no see.
<imbrandon> :)
<imbrandon> been working alot, took a little break from IRC, but I'm still arround/alive
<LaserJock> imbrandon, TheMusoL you both have an email coming your way
<imbrandon> cool , ok
<LaserJock> bah, TheMuso ^^
<TheMuso> right
<imbrandon> LaserJock: sent yet? i dont see anything
<LaserJock> I'm running to bed now though
<LaserJock> yeah, *just* sent
<imbrandon> ahh okies, gnight
<Hobbsee> oh noes, email
<LaserJock> imbrandon: get it?
<imbrandon> LaserJock: i dont see it, but sometimes my mail is slow
<imbrandon> if you want "speedy" delivery try bholtsclaw@mac.com , other accounts tend to delay delivery an hour or so sometimes
<LaserJock> well, I just wanted to make sure it went out
<imbrandon> ahh i'm sure i'll get it, just takes a bit sometimes
<TheMuso> LaserJock: I have no comment, as I am preparing to step down from MOTU SRU.
<LaserJock> well, any input is valued
<LaserJock> but we'll see anyway how it goes
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: already?
 * LaserJock out
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: For SRU, yes. Too many other things going on, and I don't feel I can do it justice If I'm not paying full attention.
<Hobbsee> ahhh
<imbrandon> LaserJock: got the mail, i'll add my 0.2c soon
<imbrandon> probably before you wake
 * Hobbsee whinges.  There's another kmos-type coming :(
<geser> Hobbsee: please tell that is not true :(
<jscinoz> hmm
<Hobbsee> geser: i wish i could tell you that.
<Hobbsee> geser: fortunately, he's only in kubuntuland yet.
<jscinoz> I'm torn, i have a package in progress, and since it is too late for hardy, I need to know if i package it for debian, will it by synced available in Intrepid?
<jscinoz> provided i get it into debian soonish
<Hobbsee> jscinoz: yes
<jscinoz> alrighty then
<jscinoz> quick question..
 * Hobbsee looks for a *very* large drink.
<jscinoz> rofl
<Hobbsee> hehe :)
<jscinoz> ok, this game im packaging, has two source packages, the client and server binaries, and the data files, currently the data package is too big to likely be included (750mb deb, 710mb orig.tar.gz) i can call dh_builddeb with -- -Zlzma to get the deb down to 693mb, but would this still be too big?
<jscinoz> as this game is quake3 based, if i extract the main .pk3, the game can still read it just fine, and this results in better compression with lzma, as it can work on each individual file rather than the pk3 (which is simpyl a renamed zip) with this method the .deb is now 556mb
<jscinoz> the downside of this, once the deb is installed and decompressed the installed-size is much larger (1.3gb vs 750mb)
<jscinoz> what would be the best option?
<harrisony> jscinoz, what game is it
<jscinoz> urbanterror
<harrisony> ahh fun game :)
<jscinoz> anyideas on the file-size issue?
<jscinoz> I'm leaning towards higher deb size, but lower isntalled size (693/730)
<geser> jscinoz: my suggestion is to talk to the archive admins (both of Ubuntu and Debian) about their opinion as it's them who decided if it's acceptable for the archive
<jscinoz> if i did the other thing it would be (553/1320)
<jscinoz> alrighty
 * jscinoz heads to #debian-games on irc.oftc.net
<Hobbsee> fixed.
<RainCT> morning
<jscinoz> in my watch file i need it to find a link on the page http://www.teeworlds.com/?page=downloads pointing to teeworlds-0.4.2-src.tar.gz (obviously replacing 0.4.2 with (.*) or something like that) how would i do this, everything i've tried has failed >_<
<siretart> apachelogger: the updated pulseaudio plugin has been accepted into hardy. could you please clean up malone?
<RainCT> jscinoz: version=2
<RainCT> jscinoz: http://www.teeworlds.com/?page=downloads http://www.teeworlds.com/files/teeworld$
<jscinoz> thanks
<RainCT> argh
<jscinoz> wait i got it to work.
<RainCT> jscinoz: http://www.teeworlds.com/?page=downloads http://www.teeworlds.com/files/teeworlds-(.*)-src.tar.gz
<RainCT> terminals are evil :P
<jscinoz> version=3
<jscinoz> http://www.teeworlds.com/?page=downloads (?:.*)/teeworlds-([\d.]+)-src.tar.gz
<jscinoz> that also worked
<jscinoz> which would be better to use?
<RainCT> jscinoz: yours would continue working if they change the place where they put the tarballs
<jscinoz> so i should use mine?
<jscinoz> thanks :)
<RainCT> jscinoz: yes. no problem :)
<jscinoz> hmm this is strange
<jscinoz> im making a get-orig-source rule and it wont cd >_<
<jscinoz> cd $(TMPDIR)/teeworlds-$(VERSION)-src stays in ./ >_<
<jscinoz> ack
<jscinoz> anyone see anythign wrong with "cd ./tmp.IJDKSb9119/teeworlds-0.4.2-src"?
<jscinoz> because the darn thing will not cd
<jscinoz> and i have no idea why
<RainCT> jscinoz: I'm not sure but it might be that each line is being executed in its own subshell
<jscinoz> if i pastebin the whole section would that help?
<RainCT> jscinoz: so that it actually does cd, but it gets back to where it was on the next line
<jscinoz> how would i stop that from happening?
<jscinoz> http://pastebin.com/m634c8a2e
<jscinoz> wait i fixed it
<jscinoz> all is well :P
<RainCT> nice, what was the problem?
<jscinoz> what you said
<jscinoz> strung the commands together with a ;
<jscinoz> :P
<RainCT>  :)
<RainCT> if you want to have it over multiple lines, using $(stuff here...) should work
<jscinoz> i used..   command args; \ (newline) othercommand otherargs: \ etc
<RainCT> that's an option, too :)
<jscinoz> now to work around this strange custom build system
<jscinoz> basically my debian/rules first has to build the build system then build the package
<jscinoz> >_<
<jscinoz> oh god thats infuriating
<jscinoz> uploading a 750mb package to PPA which built fine on my system and failed on theirs.
<megabyte405> I need some help getting a package sponsored and uploaded.  I have the AbiWord 2.6 packages all ready to go, all necessary MIR's approved, and so now i just need them sponsored in/uploaded  - bug 202174
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 202174 in abiword "Please update to version 2.6" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/202174
<megabyte405> I have followed the sponsorship steps already
<deepak_> hi , i want to contribute to ubuntu and  you can see my details hear https://launchpad.net/~apenguinlinux can any mentor can suggest me how to start bcz i am new to ubuntu philosophy and how they work is the same as Debian does of bit different. i am comfortable with Debian way of working? Please suggest me ?
<RainCT> Hi deepak_
<deepak_> RainCT, hi
<RainCT> deepak_: Is there anything particular you are interested in or just bug fixing in general?
<WujcioL> Can somebody explain me howto create no-compilated package for some python program??
<deepak_> RainCT, i am interested in packaging of the packages which i do maintain Debian and also bug fixing
<RainCT> WujcioL: http://wiki.debian.org/DebianPython/NewPolicy
<RainCT> WujcioL: does the program have a setup.py file?
<WujcioL> thanks
<WujcioL> no it doesn't have it
<WujcioL>  http://wiki.debian.org/DebianPython/NewPolicy
<WujcioL> http://wiki.debian.org/DebianPython/NewPolicy
<deepak_> RainCT, or new packages which are not in Debian and ubuntu .so i will create for both. so at the same time both distribution have new packages.
<deepak_> RainCT, But i haven't find any group like debain-perl .. etc or any ITP type of stuff??
<RainCT> deepak_: Ubuntu automatically imports new/updated packages from Debian at the start of a development cycle
<deepak_> RainCT, yes that correct but instead of taking it from Debian , i want to package it.
<RainCT> deepak_: ITP's are called needs-packaging bugs in Ubuntu (you can find them searching for the needs-packaging tag)
<deepak_> RainCT, oh ok
<RainCT> deepak_: and Ubuntu has some groups but they aren't that visible as in Debian as the packages in Ubuntu is community maintained (instead of having a Maintainer everyone can change them)
<RainCT> deepak_: for new packages:
<RainCT> !revu
<ubotu> REVU is a web-based tool to give people who have worked on Ubuntu packages a chance to "put their packages out there" for other people to look at and comment on in a structured manner. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU
<deepak_> RainCT,ok
<RainCT> deepak_: but if you are already involved in Debian I recommend to get them in there instead of into Ubuntu as that way both distros (+ derivatives) get it
<deepak_> RainCT, yes i thought the same thing . but lets take an example .one of my packages libnet-tftp-ruby
<RainCT> deepak_: ah, forgot to say that about syncs when they are no longer done automatically you can request them manually, see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SyncRequestProcess
<deepak_> RainCT,  oh ok
<RainCT> WujcioL: if it hasn't a setup.py if it isn't a module you can use dh_install to place the files where you want, and if you use cdbs don't include python-distutils.mk (which depends on setup.py) but rather call dh_pycentral/dh_pysupport manually
<RainCT> WujcioL: or you can just write the setup.py file yourself
<elmargol> dpkg-shlibdeps: failure: no dependency information found for /usr/lib/libmicrohttpd.so.4 :/
<elmargol> how do I fix this?
<RainCT> deepak_: you said something about libnet-tftp-ruby before, what's with it?
<deepak_> RainCT, libnet-tftp-ruby is not available in ubuntu (Currently) so was thinking that i will go ahead with this package in ubuntu ,
<deepak_> RainCT, where "Need Packaging"  tag i will will find out?
<RainCT> deepak_: it will be synced into Intrepid once the archive opens
<deepak_> RainCT, ok
<RainCT> deepak_: for Hardy it's to late to get new packages into it
<deepak_> RainCT, ubuntu releases are faster then Debian . :)
<deepak_> RainCT, where i can find 'Needs packaging " tags .like if i will go for new packages
<RainCT> deepak_: for existing ones https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.tag=needs-packaging
<RainCT> deepak_: to file one yourself, file a bug and then on the Actions panel at the left go to "Edit description/tags"
<deepak_> deepak_, oh ok
<tacone> hello, I am looking for online resources about packaging php scripts
<apachelogger> siretart: sure
<LaserJock> Balaams_Miracle: hi :-)
<Balaams_Miracle> LOL!!! :-)
<LaserJock> Balaams_Miracle: are you wanting to do a completely new package, never been in Debian/Ubuntu before?
<LaserJock> or just an update to an existing one
<Balaams_Miracle> LaserJock: It would be a brand new package, but it's not mine. It was suggested to me by someone in the forum, and i think it would be a great addition to the already extensive repo's. The package is here: http://sourceforge.net/projects/easymp3gain/
<LaserJock> Balaams_Miracle: check out https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/NewPackages
<Balaams_Miracle> LaserJock: So... If i understand correctly, i would need to file a needs-packaging bug. Correct?
<LaserJock> yeah, that's usually the first step
<Balaams_Miracle> I see... I think :-)
<Balaams_Miracle> Well, if i hit a snag or something, i'll let you guys (and gals?) know.
<xtknight> anyone mind getting an upload going on Bug 213827 ?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 213827 in flashplugin-nonfree "typo in prerm file breaks failed-upgrade processing" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/213827
 * LaserJock runs
<sebner> xtknight: LaserJock is ready :P
<xtknight> flashplugin is your favorite package
<blueyed> xtknight: that typo is quite irrelevant. The code block only gets called with an unknown prerm argument.. it's only cosmetic, AFAICS.
<blueyed> ..but I might be totally wrong, so.
<blueyed> xtknight: the error for Tiziano appears to be in postinst: "dpkg (subprocess): unable to execute post-installation script: Exec format error"
<xtknight> blueyed, ah i have no idea what's going on w/ his setup
<jdong> and I quote: "You'll probably have to remove the flashplugin-nonfree block from /var/lib/dpkg/status and try again. That's a last resort, though."
<jdong> spawn cjwatson to yell at xtknight :)
<xtknight> lol
<xtknight> well i dont see errors in postinst
<xtknight> and it seems 'cho' would make prerm fail
<blueyed> xtknight: well, yes, but the next line would be "exit 1" anyway..!
<xtknight> blueyed, when the command fails, the debian script receives an error and stops.  this prevents installing other packages
<xtknight> at least afaik
<blueyed> xtknight: the same for "exit 1", no?
<jdong> xtknight: in the future it's better to ask him to edit his prerm/postinst script to not set -x
<jdong> xtknight: or exit 0
<jdong> xtknight: editing dpkg/status is extremely strongly discouraged, the last time I suggested that I was yelled at by all the core folk :)
<xtknight> jdong, apparently a lot of my "methods" yield that
<blueyed> xtknight: so your debdiff should probably change the "exit 1" to "exit 0", too.
<xtknight> hmm
<xtknight> odd.  there must be a reason "exit 1" is there though
<blueyed> xtknight: maybe.. but I think it's rather the same oversight as with "cho".
<jdong> xtknight: IMO there really shouldn't be a reason to purposely fail in a dpkg installation script
<jdong> unless continuing the installation will result in serious data loss, breakage, etc
<jdong> which I doubt would ever be true with flash
<xtknight> yeah i agree
<xtknight> because it would break the whole debian thing and require you to *gasp* edit the status file
<xtknight> ;)
<superm1> guys, vnc4server is very very broke in hardy currently.  if you move the mouse when you have vnc.so loaded, it will crash X.  what would folks think about my adding a postinst that will disable vnc.so in /etc/X11/xorg.conf and display a warning?
<superm1> touching conf files is against policy, but there is no other immediate solution that i see
<jdong> superm1: is it possible to disable vnc.so at build time?
<superm1> jdong, it FTBFS now
<superm1> oh crap, that makes this more difficult then doesn't it ....
<jdong> superm1: I'm pretty shaky about the idea of editing xorg.conf from a postinst
<superm1> can't change the postinst :)
<jdong> superm1: haha
<jdong> last-minute archive removal? :)
<LaserJock> please do
<superm1> well the thing is the vnc4server "binary"
<superm1> works
<superm1> its just vnc.so that's broke
<superm1> so if you use it as a standalone x server that's fine
<jdong> superm1: ok, can we just not install vnc.so?
<superm1> well if it built sure
<superm1> but that also causes breakage..
<superm1> because if someoen has that in xorg.conf
<superm1> X won't start
<jdong> superm1: well if someone has that in xorg.conf the error log should be obvious why it failed
<jdong> superm1: and people who have it in xorg.conf probably know what they're doing.
<superm1> well not necessarily...
<xtknight> blueyed, the problem is, the clause with "exit 1" doesn't do the same as the clause above it (when the if statement is true)
<superm1> we have functions in mythbuntu control centre that enable it for you in gutsy
<superm1> by touching xorg.conf and putting it in place
<jdong> superm1: ah
<superm1> so i
<jdong> superm1: well it should definitely be mentioned in the release notes if it's this broken
<superm1> 'm trying to look at the best migration path
<superm1> well its not just going to hurt us of course though
<jdong> right
<superm1> so i was hoping to help everyone in the process
<blueyed> xtknight: what do you mean with "the same"? Surely it doesn't, otherwise there would no other block  be required. I've left a comment in the bug.
<jdong> but still, editing xorg.conf from a postinst is a bad idea IMO
<superm1> well what about if it just checks that its an upgrade from gutsy in the postinst
<superm1> and if it is then touch xorg.conf
<jdong> superm1: does the package already have debconf support so we can pester the user interactively about this?
<superm1> no it doesn't
<jdong> superm1: otherwise an update manager notification hook?
<superm1> well adding the debconf support would be trivial though
<superm1> the more important thing would be fixing the FTBFS though
<superm1> i spent a good week and a half of evenings trying to port it to the new xorg stuff
<superm1> without any luck
<superm1> oh interesting though, debian has some sort of solution for the ftbfs
<superm1> well i'll revisit this then
<xtknight> blueyed, would asking the original maintainer of the package be a good idea?
<overbenny> hello, can someone re-sync the REVU uploaders keyring?
<LaserJock> superm1: does vnc still include it's own Xorg version?
<superm1> yeah it does (unfortunately)
<superm1> vnc4server does
<superm1> there was a fork called baracuda
<superm1> that i started to package, but then realized it wasn't feature complete enough to replace vnc4server
<LaserJock> vnc was one of the first packages I worked on
<superm1> so would it be acceptable you suppose to propose the debconf question, "Detected that vnc.so is loaded from xorg.conf, this is gone for the hardy package due to bug blah blah.  Would you like it removed from xorg.conf for you?"
<blueyed> xtknight: who would that be? asac?
<xtknight> blueyed, i guess before changing exit 1 to exit 0 willy nilly i better be sure it's not breaking anything else.  it seems stopgap to me at best
<superm1> and then call the pyhton script I wrote to remove it?
<superm1> *python
<xtknight> blueyed,  debian maintainer  Bart Martens <bartm@knars.be>
<LaserJock> what a mess, shipping another X
<xtknight> well maybe someone else introduced the exit 1 code, i'll have to see
<blueyed> xtknight: ahem, the package is quite different in Debian. At least the prerm.
<superm1> LaserJock, yeah i wish that was better thought out
<superm1> but its do the monolithic history of XFree86
<LaserJock> I worked on vnc4 and wxwidgets, good projects for newbs ;-)
<blueyed> xtknight: sure, you need to be sure. But you understand that the typo is only cosmetical here, yes? http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-maintainerscripts.html#s-exitstatus
<blueyed> xtknight: so, "exit 1" is the same as "exit 127" (command not found)
<xtknight> blueyed, ah sorry i was AFK
<xtknight> blueyed, but yea i understand
<xtknight> because falling thru to exit 1 would do the same thing i guess
<xtknight> asac, would you by any chance know why "exit 1" is in the debian scripts for flashplugin?
<xtknight> or any idea who made the flashplugin for ubuntu
<xtknight> so that i could ask them
<asac> xtknight: please paste. in general it should work (except for the typo)
<xtknight> asac, won't exit 1 give dpkg troubles?
<xtknight> one sec i'm pasting prerm and postinst
<xtknight> prerm : http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/63094/  ;   postinst: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/63095/
<asac> xtknight: it only returns exit 1 in case there is an error
<asac> should be ok imo
<xtknight> asac, ah alright, so the errors he was getting when installing my new package is due to the old package having screwed something up?
<xtknight> cuz he got errors in postinst, and the error is only in prerm
<asac> yeah ... the old script will still be run
<asac> so he is somewhat lost
<xtknight> ah so old prerm of old pkg is run when you install a new version of the same package?
<xtknight> makes sense i guess
<xtknight> blueyed, he got this error first dpkg (subprocess): unable to execute old pre-removal script: Exec format error
<xtknight> so postinst of new one is failling becaues prerm of old one is failling
<xtknight> or someting
<xtknight> purging the old one would have yielded the same error he got in the beginning
<xtknight> so i do not see that he has any option besides editing the dpkg status file to get rid of the old package
<xtknight> which i think is perfectly acceptable when the package has a problem
<xtknight> i also do not see why "exit 1" is a problem because it is supposed to quit when the package has an issue.
<xtknight> but cho is cosmetic
<xtknight> so at least he'd know something wrong if exitcode was 1
<geser> xtknight: according to http://women.debian.org/wiki/English/MaintainerScripts the new prerm is run if the old one fails
<xtknight> geser,  ah well new prerm also would have failed (as it would still fall through to exit 1)
<geser> xtknight: why has dpkg a problem with executing the prerm script (which is usually a shell script)?
<xtknight> i don't know, i'm confused why he had the bug in the first place.  somehow he got an old package on his Hardy
<xtknight> i can't reproduce his problem
<xtknight> and i have no idea how to fix it.  changing "cho" to "echo" wouldn't do it.  Bug 213827
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 213827 in flashplugin-nonfree "typo in prerm file breaks failed-upgrade processing" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/213827
<xtknight> so the title is wrong.  it's an old flash package (which triggers exit 1 in prerm) causing him trouble, not a typo
<geser> xtknight: the exit 1 shouldn't cause the exec format error
<xtknight> geser, yea "cho" causes this, but the end result would be the same (dpkg failing with nonzero error code) if it went thru to exit 1
<xtknight> he's screwed either way, right?
<xtknight> i do think the "cho" patch should go in, but at least it won't be fixing the reporter's problem
<xtknight> "exit 1" came right after cho
<geser> the "cho" should cause a "command not found" error but not a exec format error
<xtknight> oh?
<xtknight> o dpm
<xtknight> err..  i don't even know what exec format error means
<geser> I'd suggest to test if the bug submitter can execute other shell scripts and check if /bin/sh is correct (or broken)
<xtknight> i think he somehow got a tainted package on his system
<xtknight> or something else is messed up
<xtknight> yeah
<xtknight> geser, thanks for your input
<LaserJock> so we went through an email discussion, blog post, and MOTU Meeting and still can't get a name for Universe Apprentices?
<sebner> LaserJock: if that's the only blocker it's somehow stupid
<LaserJock> well, I'm sort of regretting saying anything now
<ScottK2> As long as it's not monkeys or hackers, I'm pretty much fine.
<LaserJock> I agree
<LaserJock> ScottK2: I noticed againin the meeting notes that it's "contribution" to Ubuntu not specifically Universe
 * ScottK2 missed the meeting, so if that's what's decided, I can live with it.
<spacepluk> hi, i
<spacepluk> i'm trying to setup a chroot to make a source package. I've followed the instructions on this howto https://help.ubuntu.com/6.10/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/appendix-chroot.html. Is this outdated?
<LaserJock> yeah
<LaserJock> try wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide
<spacepluk> LaserJock: thanks
<spacepluk> LaserJock: so this chrooting guide is supposed to work on hardy? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebootstrapChroot
<jdong> oh deities, what's the best way of using LVM to implement a COW "overlay" type of temporary workspace?
<LaserJock> spacepluk: I think so yeah
<jdong> i.e. i have /srv and am about to do some horribly wreckless thing. I want to do it on a snapshot and be able to either (1) revert to the original (2) make the new overlay the default, really fast.
<spacepluk> LaserJock: thanks :)
<mok0_> ZZzzzz
<jdong> ack that's really annoying
<jdong> ctrl-u shows source in firefox
 * jdong crackports banshee for fun
<Nafallo> crackport?
<Nafallo> is that like in Amsterdam?
<RAOF> jdong: Yeah, that'd be awesome.
<RAOF> Nafallo: I think that's where you backport a snapshot of svn trunk :)
<Nafallo> RAOF: in Amsterdam? :-)
<jdong> RAOF hits the nail on the head :)
<jdong> actually the debian experimental package this time :)
<jdong> so it's not as cracky as a svn backport + drop all debian/patches :D
<RAOF> It does have the problem of not actually being feature complete, of course.
<crimsun> mm.  gcj-4.2 just ate 1.3 GB RAM for breakfast and didn't stop to blink.  And sent my system into a near-spiral o' death for 1 hr.
<RAOF> crimsun: Is this meant to surprise us? :X
<crimsun> no, I'm bemoaning that I'll have to buy more RAM just to debug these issues.
<RAOF> I remember building Azureus - gcj ate all my 1GB of ram, 4GB of swap and then OOMd.
<crimsun> actually it looks like it went through 5.5 GB swap, too.  Nice.
<jdong> RAOF: and that's a good reason not to build azureus with gcj :D
<jdong> not to mention gcj has an incomplete and incompatible java.nio stack
<jdong> so the fact that azureus even worked with gcj is astounding
<crimsun> so, anyone have a box with at least 4 GB RAM?  ;)
 * RAOF should've asked for a couple of sticks for his birthday :)
<jdong> crimsun: PPA?
<crimsun> jdong: I don't think testing internal fixes on a PPA is Good Practice.
<Nafallo> Fujitsu: around?
<jdong> crimsun: oh come on, a crimsun-crack-dept team would be awesome!
<RAOF> I'm sure the LP servers would appreciate the work.  They sit around idle far too much!
<RAOF> They'll get rusty.
<spacepluk> bye
#ubuntu-motu 2009-04-06
<directhex> does it need to be modified? can't it go into the upstream kblog?
<superm1> dtchen, ping.  are you around momentarily to talk to a mythtv dev about pulseaudio?
<jdong> superm1: he told me 90 minutes 30 minutes before your ping.
<jdong> (unrelated audio trap)
<superm1> ah thanks
<superm1> dtchen, well when you get back to your keyboard, i may not be here, but if you can drop in #mythtv, danielk22 is one of the main mythtv devs and is seeing loads of issues latency wise with pulse. if you can pop in there and speak to him about them and/or fire him an email at danielk@cuymedia.net, we'd appreciate it
<dtchen> superm1: sure, i'll e-mail, thanks for the heads-up
<superm1> thank dtchen
<mrooney> is there any reason that "chown .users dir; chmod g+w dir" doesn't allow everyone to write to "dir/" ?
<mrooney> I am going crazy trying to share this packaging stuff between two users on my machine
<lifeless> its not sticky
<mrooney> lifeless: what does that mean?
<lifeless> just that
<RAOF_> That files created in there will not have the directory's permissions, but will have the creating user's umask.
<lifeless> it allows the group to write to dir, but doesn't affect the permissions of things created withint it
<lifeless> neither their group, nor their mode
<mrooney> lifeless: ah so if I do +t on the dir, then user a can create a directory and user b can remove it?
<jdong> mrooney: delete permissions are handled by write permissions on the directory
<mrooney> jdong: right, so the answer is..? :)
<jdong> mrooney: marking a directory sticky causes everything created inside it to inherit the directory's permissions
<jdong> which is clearly helpful in a shared dir setup
<mrooney> ah excellent, that sounds like just what I want!
<mrooney> jdong: any idea why with the directory "drwxrwxr-t  4 michael users 4096 2009-04-03 19:18 test" I can't mkdir test/something, I get perms denied
<jdong> mrooney: you're sure you're in users?
<mrooney> jdong: oh, I guess not! I assumed that "users" was all users due to the name and also seeing all users listed in "Users and Groups"
<jdong> hehe :)
<mrooney> thanks for the help :)
<jdong> of course :) don't forget to logout/login to apply group changes.
<mrooney> maybe in the future I should use cdrom or something everyone will reasonably be
<mrooney> I wonder why 'users' exists if it isn't all users
<Toadstool> g'morning
<AnAnt> Hello, I am making a package that needs to have /var/run/dicod and  /var/lib/dicod, those will be empty during install, but would be populated during runtime, so should I create those dirs in postinst or should I install those empty dirs in the deb file itself ?
<mok0> AnAnt: yes.
<AnAnt> ?
<mok0> AnAnt: use a .dirs file
<AnAnt> ok
<AnAnt> thanks
<AnAnt> won't lintian complain about empty dirs in deb file ?
<mok0> AnAnt: no
<AnAnt> ok, thanks
<mok0> AnAnt: only if you ship /usr/bin or something like that
<AnAnt> ok
<AnAnt> mok0: and chown them in postinst ?
<mok0> AnAnt: who needs to own the dirs?
<AnAnt> user created by postinst
<wgrant> Watch out - /var/run is a tmpfs
<soren> AnAnt: Note that /vaR/run/dicod should be created in an init script, since /var/run is a tmpfs.
<mok0> AnAnt: well, then chown the dirs after the user has been created
<soren> Or from within the application or whatever.
<mok0> ah
<mok0> of course
<AnAnt> soren: thanks !
<mok0> AnAnt: you need a postrm script to remove the stuff you create as well
<AnAnt> mok0: you mean /var/lib/dicod/ ?
<mok0> AnAnt: as said above, you need to create /var/run/dicod in the postinstall script. You can create /var/lib/dicod in a <package>.dirs file
<mok0> AnAnt: then /var/lib/dicod will be deleted when the package is removed, but not the user
<mok0> AnAnt: /var/run/dicod will be on a tmpfs, so it will be removed automatically as well
<soc1> hi
<soc1> i uploaded a package to my ppa, but i just got an email: "Rejected: Signer has no upload rights at all to this distribution. [...]"
<soren> How did you upload it?
<directhex> soc1, you may have accidentially uploaded to the main archive instead of your ppa
<soc1> uh ...mom
<soc1> how could i have done that?
<soren> How did you upload your package?
<soc1> dput merkaartor_0.13.1-0ubuntu1_source.changes
<soren> Yup, that's how you upload to Ubuntu, not your ppa.
<directhex> you forgot a target repo
<directhex> dput reponamefromdputdotcf foo.changes
<soc1> ok thanks
<soren> Or just:
<soren> dput ppa:your_launchpad_id something.changes
<soc1> i thought dput .changes would be enough ---
<soc1> because my own repo is the only one in .dput.cf
<soren> There's also /etc/dput.cf
<soc1> ah ok
<soc1> thanks
<soc1> btw, what do i have to do with packages which i updated, but the maintainer has his packaging in his svn?
<directhex> try to team up with the maintainer
<directhex> or at least send hima  debdiff
<soc1> hi
<soc1> could someone test merkaartor from my ppa?
<soc1> https://launchpad.net/~soc-krg-nw/+archive/ppa
<soc1> it's an app to create maps with a gps and openstreetmap
<soc1> i would just be intersted, if you are having performance problems with it
<soc1> because on my pc it made my pc totally unresponsive ... i think it's a problem with my nvidia gpu, but i would need someone to verify that ...
<wintellect> apt-cache search for nucurse (the lib) returns lubncurses4 and libncurses5 - is there no generic one to include? Or is it a necessity to specify a version in the depends version of the control file?
<wintellect> s/ncurse/ncurses/
<geser> wintellect: you don't specify the version of libraries in (runtime) depends at all but use dh_shlibdeps during build for it
<geser> it will fill the needed packages the binaries need
<wintellect> geser: ok - where can I readup on dh_shlibdeps ?
<Jimbo> Hey guys.  Over the weekend I put together my first package.  Is there a place that I could submit it for review?  Currently it is up on launchpad
<geser> wintellect: it's part of debhelper; man dh_shlibdeps
<wintellect> geser: ok, that worked its magic... "shlibs:Depends=libncurses5 (>= 5.6+20071006-3), libc6 (>= 2.4)"   would still love to know how it worked that out. Seems like magic at the mo
<hyperair> wintellect: ldd any binary and you'll see
<hyperair> wintellect: ldd /path/to/ELF_binary_or_so
<hyperair> well that and a shlibs file which is shipped with lib packages
<wintellect> so it takes the ldd of the final binary to calculate it?
<hyperair> wintellect: probably something to that effect, yes
<wintellect> hmmm... ok, it fails with pbuilder
<hyperair> that's because you don't have the required library
<hyperair> probably
<wintellect> saying it can't find ncurses.h
<wintellect> yeah
<hyperair> libncurses-dev
<wintellect> so where do I add that entry - the control file?
<hyperair> or something
<hyperair> add that to build-dep
<hyperair> in control
<wintellect> Ahhh, k
<wintellect> makes sense
<hyperair> =)
 * wintellect slaps self with a wet fish
<wintellect> YAY - it built. But installed in the wrong place. Need to look at the Makefile me thinks
<soc1> could someone test merkaartor from my ppa? it's an app to create maps with a gps and openstreetmap. i would just be intersted, if you are having performance problems with it, because on my pc it made my pc totally unresponsive ... i think it's a problem with my nvidia gpu, but i would need someone to verify that ... https://launchpad.net/~soc-krg-nw/+archive/ppa
<AnAnt> Hello, is there a tool like requestsync to request a merge ?
<wintellect> If an app comes with a hardcoded Makefile - is it ok to manually fix it to make the package work?
<bddebian> Heya gang
<AnAnt> wintellect: yup, patch it
<AnAnt> bddebian: how are you ?
<AnAnt> do you know if  there is a tool like requestsync to request a merge ?
<bddebian> Hi AnAnt
<wintellect> AnAnt: am about to watch the youtube video on patching with Daniel Holbach :D
<AnAnt> wintellect: huh ?
<wintellect> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SAxFpKBG-bU
 * directhex wants a video on how to use git without committing suicide
<cody-somerville> git is eww
<cody-somerville> bzr is yay!
<directhex> cody-somerville, when all's said & done i just want a way to collaborate on packaging. but whilst i can wrangle the svn-based bits fine, git is boo
<soc1> cody-somerville: there aren't many differences between git an bzr, are they?
<cody-somerville> bzr just works
<soc1> git is a bit faster and has github and bzr is a bit slower and has launchpad ...
<soc1> cody-somerville: under which conditions doesn't git work
<cody-somerville> git works
<cody-somerville> bzr just works
<soc1> ah ok :-)
<cody-somerville> as in Just Works (TM)
<cody-somerville> git's error messages can be confusing
<soc1> i never do mistakes :-P
<cody-somerville> and having to re-add files to resolve a conflict seems weird to me
<cody-somerville> and then the whole fast forwarding thing is weird
<cody-somerville> git says you can fast forward but you can't really fast word - it isn't an action
<soc1> ah ok
<cody-somerville> I do like how git tells me where I am in relationship to the parent though
<cody-somerville> and I hate how bzr's revision history isn't immutable
<soc1> mhh, but cvs and svn isn't dying fast enough ...
<soc1> although most open-source projects have gone to dvcs ...
<soc1> mhh could you look at my merkaartor package?
 * cody-somerville nods.
<cody-somerville> me?
<soc1> yes
<cody-somerville> lol
<soc1> i would just need to know if it makes your pc unresponsive or not ...
<cody-somerville> I'm the Xubuntu Project Lead
<cody-somerville> I run an old computer
<soc1> ah ok
<cody-somerville> Of course it'll make my pc unresponsive - almost everything does :P
<soc1> so no qt packages on the harddisk :-)
<cody-somerville> that too
<soc1> yes, but on my pc it almost killed it
<cody-somerville> doh
<soc1> 20 seconds where nothing responds then a half second where you could click on something then 20 seconds of total freeze agian ... and so on ... for 5 minutes until i could kill it
<soc1> i only saw that xorg used 50% of the cpu ...
<soc1> i fear it has soemthing to do with the nvidia gpu
<soc1> because on my laptop with a ati radeon everything works absolutley smooth
<soc1> oops, closed the window ...
<Jimbo> Hey everybody.  I created my first package over the weekend.  Currently it's on launchpad, what's the next step for submitting it to ubuntu?
<directhex> Jimbo, google "revu"
<Jimbo> thanks directhex
<hyperair> Jimbo: http://www.lmgtfy.com/?q=revu
<Laney> unnecessary ;(
<iulian> Hah
<Jimbo> hyperair, Is this not the right channel for a question like that?
<Laney> Yes, it is
<RainCT> Is the fallback in /usr/bin/compiz needed nowadays?
<hyperair> =p
<hyperair> sorry, i was uh debugging my lmgtfy script =p
<RainCT> (I ask because it breaks gnome-shell if you start it when Compiz is running)
<hyperair> RainCT: it's hard to start a window manager if you don't have one running already.
<hyperair> yo e-jat
<e-jat> yo hyperair
<hyperair> =)
<wintellect> I'm slightly confused. I made changes to the Makefile so the app installs correctly - how do I ensure those changes are added?
<wintellect> nm, ignore me
<ScottK> Done
<imbrandon> morning all
<imbrandon> skype + ipod touch ( 2nd Gen ) + iphone headphones & mic == love
<wintellect> ScottK: thanks :P
<balachmar> Hi, I want to try and fix bug #337926 For I have also found this problem to exist when using x2x. Does anybody else know if anyone is working on this, or how to find out?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 337926 in xfree86-driver-synaptics "vino: mouse cursor stays in upper left corner" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/337926
<hyperair> balachmar: notice that it says [Medium,New]
<hyperair> balachmar: Medium is priority. New is status. if someone was working on it, it'll be In Progress.
<hyperair> well should be.
<balachmar> hyperair: OK new is the status :) (should have known that...) Well one of the last posts says there is a fix. So I shall try and but some of the bug fixing lessons into action.
<hyperair> =)
<hyperair> good luc
<hyperair> k
<mok0> balachmar: assign the bug to yourself, and set status to "In progress"
<helbuns> hello everyone, i'm running through the packing guide tutorial on hello, i had a question on the change log. my change log has this "hello (2.1.1-1-0ubuntu1) jaunty; urgency=low", but the deb one has "hello-debhelper (2.2-3) unstable; urgency=low". so do i rewrite the debs to  look like "hello-debhelper (2.2-3-0ubuntu1) jaunty; urgency=low" ??
<binarymutant> helbuns, ya
<helbuns> sweeeeeeet, thanks man
<binarymutant> helbuns, actually it might be 1ubuntu1
<helbuns> oh okay, in the future how do i know what number that is? or what does it reference
<mok0> helbuns: -0ubuntu1 means the package is not in Debian
<binarymutant> helbuns, if debian has it, it's 1ubuntu1, if debian doesn't have it it's 0ubuntu1. It goes: (debian-version)ubuntu(ubuntu-version)
<binarymutant> if that makes any sense :/
<helbuns> ohhhhhhhhh i see.... if they have it... meaning it's no an ubuntu specific package, which of course i can check first... then i put their number, otherwise its a 0
<helbuns> and of course. you put the ubuntu number last
<binarymutant> ya
<dlynch> binarymutant: so this is correct, right? 0.0.8~b7-0~ppa1 (here the deb exists only as a PPA)
<binarymutant> helbuns, in your example I would say it's 3ubuntu1 ?
<GuyFromHell> If I'm to be making a patch to a file, do i patch against the fully patched version? or the upstream version? i can't tell from https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing but my gut says patched
<helbuns> this is sweet... wait now i gotta ask, hello (2.1.1-1-0ubuntu1), that package says 2, so shoudl i make it ubuntu2
<helbuns> biinarymutant, thanks i see what
<helbuns> 's goin on now i think
<binarymutant> dlynch, it's only relative to whats in the debian and ubuntu repos, not in PPAs
<dlynch> binarymutant: since my package doesn't exist in either the debian or ubuntu repos, in that case should I name it something like apid-photo-downloader - 0.0.8~b7~ppa1 ?
<dlynch> whoops, I mean rapid-photo-downloader-0.0.8~b7~ppa1
<hyperair> you need a debian revision all the same. how about -0ubuntu1~ppa1?
<hyperair> the stuff after "-"
<binarymutant> dlynch, if it's going into ubuntu I would name it 0ubuntu1, if it's just staying in you ppa I doubt there's any policy on the naming scheme
<hyperair> i personally use upstreamversion-0+ppa1.
<dlynch> one day I would like it in ubuntu, but it's a bit rough around the edges for now...
<binarymutant> dlynch, I would name it 0ubuntu1 then but I guess its all personal preference when it comes to PPAs
<dlynch> binarymutant: thank you
<binarymutant> np
<binarymutant> GuyFromHell, you patch against the deb, if that answers the question
<GuyFromHell> binarymutant, yes i believe it does. thank you
<pochu_> so who is attending UDS?
<binarymutant> will there be video again from UDS? I really liked the interviews that were put up on youtube
<GuyFromHell> Can i get someone to message me (checking a patch im' making for xchat)
<a|wen> GuyFromHell: works?
<GuyFromHell> a|wen, yep, thanks to binarymutant
<a|wen> :)
<a|wen> GuyFromHell: you needed a private message as well, or this wa okay?
<GuyFromHell> a|wen, i just needed something that will popup messages in quick succession. either way would have worked ^_^
<a|wen> he
<GuyFromHell> Okay so, if there's a patch, lets call it 71_im.dpatch, that changes a string to 'im' when it should be 'IM', should i be making 72_IM.dpatch or edit 71_im.dpatch and diff against that?
<mok0> GuyFromHell: Add a new patch
<pochu> stgraber: are you attending UDS this year?
<mok0> GuyFromHell: easier to maintian
<GuyFromHell> mok0, alrighty, will do that then
<Laney> mok0: huh? If a patch is wrong then it should be fixed
<james_w> I'd say that mok0's rule might be reasonable if the original patch was from Debian, but if it is an Ubuntu patch then fix it up directly
<Laney> I'd rather fix the patch and send it back
<Laney> patching the same line twice for the same problem seems crackful to me
<james_w> true
<james_w> if it's something that Debian have rejected then I would find a separate patch more maintainable, but some may disagree
<quadrispro> hi guys
<Laney> howdy
<wintellect> Evenin all
<jpds> Evening wintellect.
<wintellect> jpds: I've built a new package (that wasn't listed as needs-packaging in launchpad). What's the next step to get it approved/reviewed, whatever?
<Laney> !revu
<ubottu> REVU is a web-based tool to give people who have worked on Ubuntu packages a chance to "put their packages out there" for other people to look at and comment on in a structured manner. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU
<Laney> wintellect: ^
<jpds> wintellect: Upload it to revu^
<wintellect> Ahhh, key
<wintellect> erm... "kay"
 * Laney is dying due to a stupidly hot curry
<Laney> thanks dad :(
<jpds> Laney: I know the feeling...
<Laney> he likes to bring me food when he comes up, then asks me how it was with a knowing grin when I next see him
<Laney> child abuse, that is
<Laney> even though I'm 23
<wintellect> oh dear (cue excitement) : "Feature Freeze is currently in effect and new packages are no longer accepted into Ubuntu Jaunty"
<wintellect> from REVU site
<Laney> that's right
<Laney> karmic is your friend now
<jbailey> Laney, Curry isn't good unless you can feel your intestines bleed.
<Laney> jbailey: I'll tell you how good it was tomorrow then...
<wintellect> Does it matter if my gpg signature takes the form:   foo bar (nick) <email address>   ?
<wintellect> I notice the examples don't have the "(nick)" bit
<wintellect> is that an issue?
<jpds> That can't be your name.
<jpds> wintellect: No, I don't think it will be, just try it and see.
<wintellect> The signing bit works - just wanted to make sure it doesn't break any MOTU rule or something
<Laney> not one that I'm aware of
<hyperair> if you were that paranoid, just alias it or something
<dtchen> siretart_: do you plan to backport the xine-lib fixes from 1.1.16.3 for bug 355825?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 355825 in pulseaudio "Pausing a media will most of the time freezes the software used while using Xine and PulseAudio (default configuration in Kubuntu Jaunty)" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/355825
<dtchen> siretart_: i've committed the PulseAudio fixes (they will be in the next Jaunty upload)
<sladen> http://launchpad.net/bugs/356615  FFe data-package-only request if anyone's awake
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 356615 in ubuntu "FFe bve-route-cross-city-south/bve-train-br-class-323 for jaunty/universe" [Undecided,New]
 * nhandler goes to look
<nhandler> sladen: The FFe itself looks pretty reasonable, but the packages are not ready to enter the repositories. For instance, look at the warnings displayed for http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/bve-route-cross-city-south
<siretart_> dtchen: feel free to upload, I'll import your upload in the hg branch then, ok?
<sladen> nhandler: warning (1) is the Maintainer:   (2) is "unreleased", which I'm going to set in Git until I do a release
<siretart_> dtchen: if you have your work already in hg, feel free to submit your patches via mail
<sladen> nhandler: (there ar eno other warnings)
<dtchen> siretart_: err, i can only attach debdiffs (i don't have upload privileges...)
<Laney> dtchen: Don't suppose you know anything about bug 346204?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 346204 in alsa-utils "Volume control setting itself to mute on reboot" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/346204
<dtchen> Laney: it's queued, but i may not get to it this evening
<Laney> no worries
<Laney> thought I'd ask incase it slipped the radar
<dtchen> well, with a few hundreds bugs on my radar ...
<nhandler> sladen: (1) You are technically required to use an @ubuntu.com email address for the maintainer. (2) You are meant to change this prior to uploading to REVU. But I get I can ACK the FFe. Someone else will need to Advocate the packaging
<Laney> indeed
<siretart_> dtchen: debdiff is fine. I need to check with darren, I think he is working on a new upload to sid, which I'd prefer to merge. there is a sec. issue pending...
<dtchen> siretart_: ok, if you're going to merge in time for jaunty, then i'll refrain
<sladen> nhandler: groovy, I'll add the (LP: #bug number) and prepare it
<nhandler> sladen: Just give me a little bit to finish up what I am working on
<siretart_> dtchen: feel free to push me in case I forget, but I'll try to do it
<dtchen> siretart_: thanks
<Ampelbein> hi! could some MOTU have a look at bug 352653?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 352653 in coherence "python-coherence: /usr/share/dbus-1/services/org.Coherence.service should be included" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/352653
<sladen> siretart_: can I safely push a same-version-number to REVU without having to do a full .orig upload
<sladen> siretart_: (tried this by using -sd  and managed to upset it)
<jpds> sladen: No, REVU doesn't behave like a proper debian archive.
<mok0> sladen: yes, no problem
 * sladen smiles
<dtchen> IOW, yes you no
<jpds> You  could try, but I think it'll complain that it can't find the .orig in the uploads directory.
<mok0> sladen: REVU creates directories for sources based on date/time
<sladen> anyway, so I /did/ try this (forcing -sd) and got a "cannot unpack directory"
<mok0> sladen: use debuild -S -sa
<sladen> mok0: I'm trying to /avoid/ uplaoding 30MB.  Not force it
<jpds> sladen: Upload the .dsc and .diff.gz and .changes somewhere and I'll copy the .tar.gz from the pervious upload across.
<jpds> Might want to /msg me the URL for the .changes
<sladen> jpds: ta!
<xnox> Hi everyone! If I remember correctly there was at one point somewhere a script mentioned which creates / uploads source packages for multiple ubuntu series ready to be uploaded to launchpad straight from the bzr-builddeb managed package. Can someone please point me to it?
<xnox> nevermind found it! it's called autoppa
<xnox> and it was featured in launchpad blog
<xnox> cheers anyways and happy hacking everyone ;-)
<kb9vqf> I was referred here about possibly getting my Intrepid + Jaunty KDE3.5 packages into the official repositories...any advice? ;-)
<cody-somerville> You probably want to talk to the folks in #kubuntu-devel
<kb9vqf> I just came from there...
<kb9vqf> daskreech suggested that I start here
#ubuntu-motu 2009-04-07
<miki4242> hi all, i'm trying to fix a bug (LP: #354522) "espeak sound doesn't play correctly", which kills ubuntu speech accessibility. help is very welcome because this can be a show-stopper for people with vision problems installing Ubuntu.
<stgraber> pochu: yes, I'll be at UDS. What about you ?
<miki4242> i believe the problem is with portaudio v19, but i'm having problems with building a package from newer svn snapshot.
<pochu> stgraber: me too!
<stgraber> pochu: oh, finally :)
<pochu> indeed :)
 * pochu waves good night
<Zarel> Hey, guys.
<Zarel> How locked down is Jaunty right now?
<JontheEchidna> No UI changes, string changes or new features
<Zarel> Can we update minor (bugfix) versions of packages?
<s0nix> hi
<Zarel> Warzone 2100 has version 2.1.1 in the Ubuntu repos. -> http://packages.ubuntu.com/jaunty/warzone2100
<Zarel> But the latest stable release is 2.1.3.
<Zarel> Is it too late to update?
<s0nix> Anyone could explain to me the "advantage/goal" of using this king of version number in a ubuntu package: 4:4.1.2-0ubuntu1~hardy1~ppa1 ...... especially the "hardy1" if ubuntu1 is already in it
<JontheEchidna> Zarel: nah, not too late
<Zarel> JontheEchidna: Oh, good. How would I go about doing that?
<Zarel> It's fortunately already in the Debian repos.
<s0nix> then, it should be synched, no?
<JontheEchidna> Come the 9th it will be too late, though
<Zarel> Yeah. How do I request for it to be synced?
<JontheEchidna> File a bug requesting the sync from the appropriate debian repo (unstable, etc)
<JontheEchidna> then an MOTU will look over it and subscribe the archive admins, who will sync it
<Zarel> JontheEchidna: I don't deal with Ubuntu's bugtacker very much. Is there a guide for doing this kind of request somewhere?
<JontheEchidna> nope, that's how it's done
<JontheEchidna> oh
 * JontheEchidna misread
<JontheEchidna> just search for "please sync" in the bugs
<Zarel> JontheEchidna: It still confuses me. "main", "universe", "multiverse"... How do I ask for it to be in Jaunty?
<JontheEchidna> warzone2100 is in universe
<Zarel> So if I ask "Please sync warzone2100_2.1.3-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)", it will go into Jaunty?
<JontheEchidna> yeah
<StevenK> 2.1.3 is a new upstream release, it will require an FFe.
<Zarel> StevenK: FFe?
<Snova> Zarel: Feature Freeze Exception
<Zarel> Snova: But it doesn't add any new features; it's just a bugfix release.
<Zarel> Maybe that explains all my problems. In Ubuntu, bugfixes count as features!
<Snova> I wouldn't know...
<StevenK> Zarel: No, you just need to explain in the sync request that 2.1.3 only fixes bugs, and doesn't introduce new features.
<Zarel> Okay, I've submitted the report.
<Zarel> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/warzone2100/+bug/356753
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 356753 in warzone2100 "Please sync warzone2100_2.1.3-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,New]
<StevenK> ScottK: Any plans to fix havp and dansguardian with the new clamav?
<Juli_> Hi MOTUs. Could you please explain how things go after Final Freeze? I've fixed a bug: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/netbeans/+bug/345562 and attached debdiff several days ago but still don't have sponsor. Will it be possible to upload the changes after April, 10 or FException is required? Thanks!
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 345562 in netbeans "Add important patches for NetBeans 6.5 in Jaunty" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<siretart_> sladen: should make no problems
<ttx> Juli_: I'll have a look.
<Juli_> ttx: Thanks!
<toabctl> hi all
<toabctl> i create a debian package (python script with setup.py) with cdbs and have a MANIFEST.in file, but in the debian package, the files from MANIFEST.in are not included. why?
<Toadstool> hi all
<giskard> hi *
<giskard> i'm a OLD ubuntu-motu
<giskard> but it's a lot of time that i don't do an upload
<giskard> or something usefull for ubuntu
<giskard> i don't know if there is a policy for retirment
<giskard> do we have something similar
<giskard> where i have to look?
<giskard> retirement*
<gaspa> bdmurray, there has been a pending change in harvest-data for sime time. please, could you take a look? ( I don't see dholbach ATM..)
<wintellect> As everything is gpg signed - is there any suggestions as to how long a current key should be used? Eg. should you have keys that expire every 3 years? 5 years? never? or does it not matter?
<slytherin> giskard: I believe there is but I don't have any link. You better mail to MOTU Council
<slytherin> wintellect: it is personal preference.
<wintellect> slytherin: k, thanks for clarifying :)
<giskard> slytherin,  thank you.
<sladen> siretart: in the, I had jpds copy the tarball back into incoming/
<sladen> siretart: I might investigate the exact squence when the .orig is less than 10MB :)
<sladen> siretart: and see if I can replicate it again
<wintellect> lintian gives me errors about hyphens in the manpage needing backslashing - is it customary to fix this with a patch file in debian/patches/ ?
<hyperair> wintellect: i should think so
<hyperair> wintellect: but you should also submit the patch upstream.
<wintellect> I thought that anything in debian/ was included in the diff.gz?
<savvas> wintellect: it is, also any direct changes in the root folder of the source packages are also included :)
<savvas> hyperair meant checking if the package is in Debian, and submitting your changes there as well
<hyperair> savvas: no, i meant to the upstream authors of the said package. or basically whoever wrote the manpage
<hyperair> wintellect: if it's in debian/ then fix it in debian/ directly. if it's not, then use a patch.
<hyperair> wintellect: that's the general rule.
<wintellect> hyperair: gotcha
<savvas> oh
<savvas> my mistake :P
<hyperair> savvas: ;)
<savvas> and excusable, I
<savvas> I'm recovering from a 5-day cold-a-thon :)
<hyperair> hahaha get well soon
<savvas> thank you :)
<slytherin> wintellect: if the man page is in debian/ directory then it is created by the packager/maintainer in Debian. In that case you need to modify it directly. The patches in debian/patches directory are for the source provided by upstream not for the files in debian/ directory.
<wintellect> slytherin: yeah. It's in the main source so I'll need to use debian/patches
<wintellect> any suggestions for a good patchfile name - it's backslashing hyphens in the manpage
<wintellect> ?
<wintellect> manpage_backslash_hyphens.patch
<wintellect> ?
<wintellect> that too long?
<slytherin> wintellect: fix_man_page.patch and with appropriate number prefix.
<savvas> wintellect: which package is it?
<slytherin> wintellect: then explain it in changelog what you actually fixed. Also if the patch system is dpatch then the patch header should contain some description.
<wintellect> just using plain old "patch"
<wintellect> slytherin: if it's the first patch, should it be: 0_fix_man_page.patch or 1_fix_man_page.patch ?
<savvas> I like to use 10-fix_man_page.patch :)
<wintellect> savvas: tmux. It's not a complicated pkg but saw a needs-packaging bug and wanted to give it a go
<wintellect> the pkg itself already builds and works - just tidying up for lintian, etc
<slytherin> wintellect: which patch system does it use? dpatch reserves prefix 00 for the file that contains patches to be applied. apart from that starting with 01 is better (note 2 digits).
<savvas> wintellect: even if it's the first patch, using a higher number gives other people more options if say it needs to be patched later on
<wintellect> savvas: gotcha
<wintellect> slytherin: none as far as I can tell. It's never had a patch applied. Is it ok to use plain old "patch -u" ?
<slytherin> savvas: I don't understand your comment.
<slytherin> wintellect: I am not sure how that would work. You canread about patch systems here - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/PatchSystems
<wintellect> slytherin: I took savvas to mean if you start at "10" then people can apply earlier patches later by giving them a number lower, eg "05"
<savvas> slytherin: maybe a patch in the future needs to be done before another patch, so if it's 10-fix_manpage the current, and they add 05-some_patch, 05 would be taken before 10, isn't that right?
<savvas> woops, I just realised we use series for patching systems :)
<hyperair> you mean quilt.
<slytherin> savvas: but why would be a patch in future need to be done before this patch. And even if it did, you can always use alphabetical order.
<slytherin> savvas: and if you are using dpatch or quilt you can define any order you want.
<savvas> I think that's my queue to stop giving advice to people until I get better :P
<technologiclee> #ubuntu+1 suggested this channel - and that i file a request at launchpad: https://answers.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+question/66717    any further suggestions?
<wintellect> slytherin: If I were to use dpatch, how do I generate the patch file with the differences in it? Do I need to use dpatch for this? Or just generate a standard "diff -u"?
<hyperair> daptch-edit-patch
<slytherin> wintellect: have you read the page I pointed you? It has decent explaination about all three patch systems.
<slytherin> technologiclee: if there is no source available how do you expect anyone to add it to repositories?
<wintellect> slytherin: I did, and the entry about dpatches only shows how to apply patches
<andol> cjwatson: Ok if I ask a question regarding you comment on bug #355800:
<andol> This report is public
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 355800 in nagios3 "*** WARNING: ucf was run from a maintainer script that uses debconf, but the script did not pass --debconf-ok to ucf." [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/355800
<technologiclee> the source is available from Nanorex - with an account request - does listing in Sourceforge mean that anyone can develop it further? - it is supposed to be 'open source'
<slytherin> technologiclee: if it is open source why does it require an account to download?
<technologiclee> i don't know that is the way they do it but it claims GPL liscence - i believe
<wintellect> hyperair: thanks. The man page told me all I needed to know :D
<hyperair> wintellect: =)
<wintellect> I didn't know dpatch created a copy of the directory too :D
<hyperair> i prefer quilt
<slytherin> wintellect: Ok. Here is a short note. When you do dpatch-edit-patch name.patch it will create a temporary copy of the source where you can edit file you want. when you type 'exit' and enter you have the patch created. Then add the patch name to debian/patches/00list. You will also need to do some changes to your debian/rules file for patching/unpatching.
<slytherin> hyperair: quilt is confusing for new developers.
<wintellect> Do you have to be in the root of the src directory when you call dpatch-edit-patch?
<slytherin> wintellect: yes
<hyperair> slytherin: what's so confusing?
<wintellect> slytherin: Thanks! Makes perfect sense now :D
<slytherin> hyperair: did you try it when you were new to packaging? :-)
<hyperair> slytherin: no, i used cdbs-edit-patch.
<hyperair> slytherin: after that i switched to quilt.
<hyperair> slytherin: i think dpatch is redundant.
<slytherin> hyperair: I tried all three and the packages that used quilt were last on my list. :-)
<hyperair> slytherin: i use quilt on all of the packages i maintain =)
<slytherin> now it doesn't matter to me what system the package is already uses. But if I am adding a new system then cdbs, dpatch, quilt is my order of preference.
<hyperair> slytherin: i liked being able to quilt refresh
<slytherin> technologiclee: tell them to make it available without account and then file a bug with tag 'needs-packaging'.
<technologiclee> awesome - thanks
<cjwatson> andol: yes, what about it?
<andol> cjwatson: Regarding marking version depency. From what I can see the --debconf-ok option depends on >= 0.28, while even dapper hade ucf 2.0. Is it really neccesary to mark such a trivial/old dependency.
<andol> cjwatson: Not that I mind, since there is already the patch. I'm more curious on a general level.
<directhex> the GPL doesn't prevent you from putting your code behind a passworded page - it also doesn't prevent other people redistributing it without said impediment
<cjwatson> andol: it's probably not all that important but since I feel you ought to remove the incorrect --debconf-ok from the postrm anyway, and edit the changelog, syncing up with the rest of the Debian change does no harm
<cjwatson> andol: I wouldn't have asked you to go back round just for that
<ttx> Juli_: libnb-platform-java sponsored/uploaded, i'll do netbeans when libnb-platform-java will be published.
<andol> cjwatson: I agree. Just wanted to know for future cases. Thanks for explaing. I'll try to do my homework better next time.
<slytherin> directhex: right, how many packagers will be willing to download a source which requires registering?
<alexander_> hy, I'm needing help to packing a software
<alexander_> someone could help me?
<alexander_> someone could help me?
<alexander_> I have a problem to create a package .deb
<alexander_> could someone help me with pbuild ?
<mok0> DktrKranz: ping
<alexander_> <mok0> pong
<mok0> huh?
<alexander_> could you help me with a pbuild ?
<mok0> !ask | alexander_
<ubottu> alexander_: Please don't ask to ask a question, simply ask the question (all on ONE line, so others can read and follow it easily). If anyone knows the answer they will most likely reply. :-)
<alexander_> <ubottu> Sorry
<hyperair> lol ubottu's a bot.
<mok0> hehe
<hyperair> =p
<mok0> hi hyperair
<hyperair> hi mok0
<hyperair> long time no see =p
<mok0> hyperair: yeah, I've been busy doing other stuff
<hyperair> mok0: hahah same here =p
<hyperair> mok0: also i'm waiting out feature freeze =p
<mok0> hyperair: yep
<mok0> hyperair: how are your apps doing in jaunty?
<hyperair> mok0: fine fine
<mok0> great
<hyperair> mok0: just that there's a new version of codelite, geanyvc, and geanyproj, all of which appeared after FF
<hyperair> i mean after FF started.
<mok0> ah. They can go in karmic
<hyperair> yep
<hyperair> i'm trying to get codelite into debian, but after a looong while, a sponsor appeared, and i think he's busy, so he'll take some time to look at it
<slytherin> alexander_: no one can help you unless you state the question
<directhex> Subject: 	Your Oxford Bus the Airline Booking Confirmation
<mok0> hyperair: it does take extremely long to get something into Debian
<mok0> hyperair: best bet is to become part of a team
<alexander_> I'm packing a software. And I'm having problem to create system user
<hyperair> mok0: yeah, but there isn't really any team for c++ apps/libs right?
<mok0> hyperair: hmm, I don't know...
<hyperair> mok0: also, regarding sigx's FTBFS, it magically fixed itself after i got the upstream author to fix his code, but without me attempting to get another upload in
<directhex> alexander_, you want your package to create a new user on installation?
<slytherin> My best experience is when one Debian developer asked my what was stopping me from porting a package updated in Ubuntu to Debian. He helped me all the way through clearing the NEW queue. :-)
<alexander_> Yeah
<hyperair> mok0: sigx ftbfs'd on everything non i386,amd64,lpia that time
<slytherin> alexander_: how are you doing it?
<alexander_> I need my package create a system user
<mok0> hyperair: heh. Perhaps it was due to a missing dep?
<hyperair> mok0: no, there was some weird compilation error.
<hyperair> mok0: i think the dep was there, but something changed in one of the deps
<alexander_> I'm adding in the debian/rules the commands to create user
<directhex> alexander_, wrong.
<directhex> alexander_, debian/rules is a makefile, executed at package compile time
<alexander_> hmm
<mok0> alexander_: take a look at some other package that creates a a user
<directhex> alexander_, debian/rules is never installed or executed on an end-user's system
<hyperair> mok0: something regarding g_atomic_pointer_set.
<alexander_> <directhex> hmm
<mok0> hyperair: perhaps the compiler chain was updated?
<alexander_> <directhex> So How can I do it ?
<hyperair> mok0: perhaps.
<directhex> alexander_, postinst.
<slytherin> alexander_: I believe you will need to do it in postinst file. You can take a look at how apache package does it.
<directhex> alexander_, download the ntp source package, look in debian/ntp.postinst
<directhex> alexander_, ntp is a very simple example package for you
<alexander_> <directhex> oh thanks
<alexander_> <directhex> hmm , thanks
<alexander_> <directhex> I'll download the source ntp code
<mok0> alexander_: alternatively, go into /var/lib/dpkg/info and do a grep grep adduser *postinst
<directhex> that works
<alexander_> <mok0> thanks
<mok0> alexander_: np. Good luck
<alexander_> thanks to all
<wintellect> what goes in the "XSBC-Original-Maintainer" field in the control file - the maintainer of the source? Ie. who wrote the app?
<hyperair> wintellect: no, the original maintainer of the debian package
<hyperair> wintellect: i.e. the maintainer in debian, or you.'
<hyperair> wintellect: for stuff entering ubuntu through revu, Maintainer says MOTU, and XSBC blah blah says you
<maxb> wintellect: The Debian maintainer, for a source synced from Debian. You can, and probably should, omit the field entirely if its not a packaging synced from elsewhere.
<hyperair> maxb: don't you mean merged?
<maxb> uh, yes, yes I do :-)
<wintellect> hyperair: maxb: it's not from Debian, it's my own work. So, do I omit the field or put my name?!?
<hyperair> =)
<maxb> wintellect: You're allowed to do either
<hyperair> wintellect: generally for stuff entering through revu i put my own name.
<wintellect> ok
<wintellect> thanks
<DktrKranz> mok0: timeout error :)
<hyperair> heheh
<hyperair> maybe he set his TTL really high you know? =p
<DktrKranz> hyperair: yeah. my T1 is still experimental :)
<hyperair> DktrKranz: hahah =p
<DktrKranz> I've a videoconference call next thursday to fix it
<DktrKranz> so I can go 2Mbyte/sec :)
<DktrKranz> my bad I can only dowload intercompany files, no P2P or packages ;)
<hyperair> meh lucky you
<hyperair> i can go... at around 1Mbye/sec for some streaming sites, but i think that's some transparent proxy cache thing going on
<hyperair> on the other hand, the ubuntu mirror here goes at 10MB/s
<hyperair> =D
<hyperair> the one maintained by me on the campus of course
<DktrKranz> hyperair: heh, my DSL at home goes at 30Kb/sec :/
<directhex> my bus to heathrow is booked
<hyperair> DktrKranz: mine goes at 50kB/s at home.
<bddebian> Heya gang
 * hyperair yawns
 * mok0 yawns
<Pici> boo
<hyperair> hehehe
<mok0> It's contageous :-)
<Pici> I keep mistaking this channel for -bugs.
 * hyperair whois's bddebian
<hyperair> ooh bdefreese!
<hyperair> remember me? =p
<bddebian> heh
<bddebian> hyperair: Sure :)
<hyperair> =D
<tzn> hi there
<tzn> what is the best way to patch a package, that doean't ahve any patches yest
<slytherin> tzn: is the package from Debian? if yes then don't introduce the patch system. If the package is from ubuntu (i.e 0ubuntuX version) then you are free to introduce patch system.
<incorrect> I am packaging zabbix 1.6.4 and got dpkg-buildpackage: failure: dpkg-source -b zabbix-1.6.4 gave error exit status 1
<RainCT> incorrect: look some lines above that for the real error message
<incorrect> dpkg-buildpackage: failure: dpkg-source -b zabbix-1.6.4 gave error exit status 1
<incorrect> that i guess
<incorrect> dpkg-source: unrepresentable changes to source
<RainCT> incorrect: OK, so you've added/modified some binary file
<incorrect> possibly
<incorrect> basically i took the source code from zabbix.org and the diff file from the package of 1.6.1
<incorrect> i should remove the patches that have been applied too
<GuyFromHell> By something being assigned to me, does it suggest that I should have the ability to merge it as well? or just fix the bug?
<hyperair> fix the bug.
<hyperair> basically it means you're working on it
<hyperair> if you're not, unassign yourself
<GuyFromHell> hyperair, alright, thanks.
<hyperair> GuyFromHell: you're welcome
<incorrect> thanks! sorted!
<james_w> RainCT: I gave you wrong information earlier, sorry
<tzn> thanx slytherin
<ttx> Juli_: netbeans sponsored/uploaded
<Juli_> ttx: Thanks a lot!
<alexander_> <mok0> hy, thanks for help. I made my package
<alexander_> <directhex> Thanks for help, my package is donne :)
<Laney> gah
<Laney> I keep thinking you're pasting peoples lines, alexander_
<lfaraone> Laney: he isn't? :)
<Laney> nope, those are replies
<alexander_> lanay, I think too
<alexander_> sorry , I'm new in roons like this
<alexander_> bye
<Laney> whoops
<goshawk> i'm packaging a compiler for a programming language, this compiler (call it project A) needs a runtime library (static library) which is a separate project (call it project B). To create project A i need the sources of B too and compile them all together. Project B is a static library and it's unuseful without project A. How should i package it? just packaging the project A alone?
<goshawk> or should i package project B too, from the same sources of project A?
<quadrispro> hi guys
<pochu> hi quadrispro
<quadrispro> hi pochu
<marrow> Hi
<defcon> n8
<habtool> How does one go about finding someone to package a program into a deb for inclusion in ubuntu? I am a user of the program, not the developer.  Its one of the only tools that can backup and restore a ext4 partition (similar to partimage, but cli only) Partimage does not support ext4. http://www.fsarchiver.org/Main_Page
<jpds> habtool: File a [needs-packaging] bug for it at bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+filebug
<lfaraone> habtool: you either A) find someone who knows packaging to do it for you, B) learn packaging and do it yourself, or C) hire a consultant. :)
<habtool> <lfaraone> I can run it from the /home/bin folder, it is more for other that may want to use it, not for me as such ;)
<lfaraone> habtool: packaging isn't terribly difficult, if you want you could do it in a few hours.
<habtool> partimage is great but no longer developed :(
<jpds> habtool: See: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/NewPackages
<habtool> <jpds> Ok, will have a look
<maxb> habtool: <someone'snick> usually means you are quoting them, not replying to them
<habtool> maxb: Sorry was just coping the names in xchat. Now know for future reference.
<maxb> Instead, try typing the first few letters, then tab complete
<habtool> maxb, thanks, that works great :)
<goshawk> i'm packaging a compiler for a programming language, this compiler (call it project A) needs a runtime library (static library) which is a separate project (call it project B). To create project A i need the sources of B too and compile them all together. Project B is a static library and it's unuseful without project A. How should i package it? just packaging the project A alone?
<goshawk> or should i package project B too, from the same sources of project A?
#ubuntu-motu 2009-04-08
<gouki> Hi. Is there a way of getting all content of the debian/ folder out of a package? Even when extracted, I only get control.
<nhandler> gouki: How are you downloading the package?
<Kamping_Kaiser> gouki, grab it from the source tarball?
<Kamping_Kaiser> s/source/patch
<nhandler> gouki: Either use apt-get source or pull-lp-source from the ubuntu-dev-tools package
<gouki> Thanks! I'll look into pull-lp-source.
<vorian> i think he means one that isn't in archives
<vorian> w/out source available
<nhandler> vorian: He said he was getting the control file, so my guess was he was trying to extract the .deb
<vorian> those evil 3rd party type
<gouki> vorian, actually, it's for a package present on the archives.
<vorian> rock on
<vorian> apt-get source ftw
<nhandler> vorian: That only works if you have jaunty deb-src lines in /etc/apt/sources.list. That is why I suggested pull-lp-source
<vorian> sigh
<gouki> nhandler, yeah, and I'm running 8.04, so pull-lp-source is better. Also, the package on backports doesn't come with pull-lp-source :(
<vorian> nhandler: this is why i suxorz at this stuff
<nhandler> gouki: You should be able to install the intrepid or jaunty .deb in hardy
<gouki> nhandler, working on it :)
<dtchen> vorian: don't worry, that just means you're sane. once you get to the point where you simply "know" what url to dget, then...
<kb9vqf> I have two KDE3.5 LiveCDs that I would like to create torrents for on torrent.ubuntu.com, but when I do this the file is rejected as unauthorized.  How would I go about authorizing it?
<kb9vqf> This is for Jaunty Beta
<kb9vqf> I was referred here by #kubuntu-devel
 * kb9vqf feels lonely, is anyone here?
<kb9vqf> See previous question :-)
 * hyperair yawns
<hyperair> no, nobody's here.
 * iulian looks around.
 * kb9vqf still wonders about getting the LiveCD torrent authorized
<kb9vqf> Maybe I'll check back tomorrow :-)
<quadrispro> hi nhandler, updated description of bug #333485
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 333485 in aqualung "Please sync aqualung 0.9~beta10-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/333485
<quadrispro> now i'm waiting for someone who could test that package
<tzn> i'm going to make custom package, and I have to apply some patches on it. Because they are really experimental, I'd like to create new package (with new name) from existing sources. How can I change package name?
<maxb> Just do it? (In the top changelog entry and in debian/control, and probably various references in debian/rules and potentially elsewhere)
<maxb> What is the preferred way of submitting a bugfix for sponsorship when the package, and the upstream, are both in launchpad bzr, and I've already submitted a branch+merge-proposal of the fix based on upstream, but want to proactively get it into Jaunty even if upstream does not merge+release in time?
<a|wen> maxb: which project/application?
<maxb> editmoin
<a|wen> maxb: i don't think a new upstream release will get in at this point in any case ... so you would probably want to change the current package in ubuntu
<maxb> Indeed. So what I'm wondering is (1) .debdiff, or (2) just ask someone to cherrypick the bzr revision, or (3) a new branch from the packagging branch on LP, and cherrypick that revision from my merge-proposed upstream branch.
<a|wen> maxb: what is the fix for?
<maxb> DeprecationWarning with Python 2.5
<maxb> * 2.6
<a|wen> maxb: so bug 357221 ... just attach the debdiff or a patch there
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 357221 in editmoin "[Jaunty] editmoin warning: use hashlib instead of md5 module" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/357221
<maxb> oh! I didn't notice there was a bug already :-)
<maxb> I was too focused on what I was going to put in the bug after I'd filed it :-)
<a|wen> hehe
<a|wen> maxb: if you ping me i can have a look at it later tonight ... unless someone else beats me to it
<maxb> Does a link to http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~maxb/editmoin/python2.6-deprecation-warning/revision/27 work as well as a patch?
<wintellect> Hi all
<wintellect> I'm looking at the use of dput
<wintellect> but I have two changes files
<a|wen> maxb: is good enough to me
<wintellect> one for the source and one for i36
<wintellect> i386*
<wintellect> do I upload both?
<wintellect> or just the source one?
<maxb> Ubuntu primary and PPA archives accept source uploads *only*
<wintellect> cool
<wintellect> DO I need to create a PPA in launchpad before I can upload? Or does the upload go to a central server?
<maxb> What are you uploading?
<maxb> If you want to upload to a PPA you have to create it in the web interface first
<wintellect> No, I want to upload to REVU
<wintellect> it's a complete package that needs to be reviewed
<wintellect> my first one :D
<maxb> If you want to upload to REVU then you just need to have (1) registered a GPG key in Launchpad, and (2) Logged into the REVU web interface at least once
<wintellect> done those two
<maxb> just upload, then
<wintellect> cool, thanks maxb
<wintellect> maxb: one final thing if I may... dput says it successfully uploaded the package and that the sigs were ok. But how can I find it? There's nothing listed under my profile on REVU?
<maxb> wait at least 5 minutes before concluding there may be a problem
<wintellect> k
<wintellect> maxb: ok, I screwed it up somewhere - can you help me?
<wintellect> I got an email back saying:
<wintellect> Rejected:
<wintellect> Signer has no upload rights at all to this distribution.
<wintellect> Not permitted to upload to the RELEASE pocket in a series in the 'SUPPORTED' state.
<maxb> wintellect: Did you *actually* upload to REVU?
<maxb> Sounds like you accidentally uploaded to the Ubuntu primary archive
<wintellect> maxb: I did :P
<wintellect> oops
<wintellect> all sorted now
<wintellect> uploaded to REVU - YAY
<wintellect> maxb: do I need to change the status on launchpad for the needs-packaging? Or just add a link to the REVU page in a comment?
<maxb> uhm. Not sure. The comment's far more important than the status, anyway
<wintellect> maxb: K, thanks for all your time and help
<wintellect> wont bother you anymore today :P
<kb9vqf> I have two KDE3.5 LiveCDs that I would like to create torrents for on torrent.ubuntu.com, but when I do this the file is rejected as unauthorized.  How would I go about authorizing it?
<kb9vqf> ^^ This is for Jaunty
<CarlFK1> svn co https://cmusphinx.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/cmusphinx/trunk/sphinxbase includes debian/control that has Build-Depends: debhelper (>= 4), autotools-dev, libasound2-dev, gettext, python2.5-dev
<CarlFK1> Is there a command that will apt-get the Build-Depends?
<maxb> apt-get build-dep will get the build-depends as determined by the deb-src lines you have configured for a package.
<maxb> I don't know of a way to do it directly from a control file
<CarlFK1> maxb: it isn't in a repo (that I can find)
<maxb> I suspect you'll just have to manually remove the commands and (...) then
<maxb> erm
<maxb> s/commands/commas/
<CarlFK1> yeah - been doing that now and then.  was hoping there was something that would just do it
<james_w> sudo /usr/lib/pbuilder/pbuilder-satisfydepends
<CarlFK1> bingo.  Thanks
<CarlFK1> http://dpaste.com/30135/  make: *** No rule to make target `configure', needed by `config.status'.  Stop.
<CarlFK1> how does autoconf stuff fit into building a package?
<CarlFK1> I can figure out how to make it work, wondering if I should report a bug/ submit a patch
<CarlFK1> Build-Depends:  ... autotools-dev
<CarlFK1> so shouldn't debian/rules run audogen.sh?
<hyperair> autoreconf?
<hyperair> no
<hyperair> upstream should run autogen.sh before creating the tarball
<hyperair> autogen.sh provides the configure file
<hyperair> occasionally you get idiots upstream who don't, and refuse to listen when you tell them that the proper way to generate a tarball is "make dist" and not "tar czf bla"
<CarlFK1> k - I am grabbing from the repo, so i can understand it not being ready to go
<huats> Tonio_:
<CarlFK1> make: *** No rule to make target `dist'.  Stop.
<CarlFK1> assuming (./configure &&  make && make install) works, is there a generic rules that can used?
<CarlFK1> no debian/ in svn co https://cmusphinx.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/cmusphinx/trunk/sphinx3
<Laney> the minimal debhelper would be a good place to get started
<Laney> /usr/share/doc/debhelper/examples/rules.tiny
<CarlFK1> thanks
<CarlFK1> figured there was something like that
<CarlFK1> tiny is an understatement :)
<hyperair> heh yeah
<CarlFK1> anything to walk me though creating changelog, control... ?
<CarlFK1> other than google :)
<hyperair> CarlFK1: dh_make
<CarlFK1> hyperair: bam!
<hyperair> O_o
<CarlFK1> why didn't I ask for this before? :)
<hyperair> hahahaha
<directhex>  dh_make is overly verbose by default
<directhex> so beware
<directhex> beware!
 * CarlFK1 shutters
<hyperair> shutters indeed
<hyperair> lol
<CarlFK1> assuming all is well, is this the bestest: dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot -uc -b
<CarlFK1> it is what I used yesterday, it is doing stuff...
<RainCT> CarlFK1: You can ommit the -rfakeroot, that's used by default now
<CarlFK1> groovy
<a|wen> maxb: editmoin uploaded; thanks for the patch
<maxb> thank you for the upload :-)
<gouki> Anyone knows if there is a way of making make-kpkg generate a .changes file?
<CarlFK1> this works:  make clean && ./autogen.sh && ./configure && make
<CarlFK1> this errors: dpkg-buildpackage -uc -b  (compile error... logs and stuff coming up)
<CarlFK1>  /home/juser/sr/sphinx/sphinx3-3.7/src/libs3decoder/libcfg/s3_cfg_convert.c:211: undefined reference to `ckd_free'
<CarlFK1> debian/ came from dh_make
<CarlFK1> I am starting over ... rm -rf... svn co https://cmusphinx.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/cmusphinx/trunk/sphinx3
<CarlFK1> http://dpaste.com/30357/  shoudln't that 'just work' ?
<CarlFK1> guessing there is something not quite right with the source
<CarlFK1> like README says: ./autogen.sh (Make sure you do this twice.)
<javito> hi
<RainCT> hi javito
<javito> do you know what status i should to use when i subscribe universe-motu-sponsors on bug i'm waiting for be sponsored? in process or confirmed?
<javito> LP:#357369
<javito> where is the bot
<CarlFK1> #357369
<CarlFK1> bug #357369
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 357369 in xubuntu-docs "Typing error in version numbers" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/357369
<javito> thanks CarlFK1
<Adri2000> hmm, when exactly are we entering final freeze?
<Snova> About 2h, 40m, I believe.
<Snova> Based on something somebody said in #ubuntu-devel.
<Adri2000> so that'd be the start of the utc day...
<javito> date -u
<javito> ups
<javito> and what happend with final freeze? can be continue fixing bug for jaunty?
<javito> is karmic opened?
<Laney> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FinalFreeze
<javito> anal-retentive hahahaha
<nhandler> javito: The Karmic repositories will not open until after Jaunty is released
<javito> so we have a time of holidays then :D
<Laney> we have time to fix rcbugs!
<Laney> http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/bugs/rcbugs/
<hyperair> pretty interesting bug right at the top
<hyperair> modprobe spelt wrongly
<hyperair> kudos to whoever introduced it. he brings a whole new meaning to fail.
<Laney> hyperair: get it fixed!
<maxb> the missing "fi" in hotkey-setup wasn't great, either ...
<hyperair> Laney: i would, but i kinda have exams.
<Laney> you're already most of the way there
<hyperair> =(
<hyperair> no, it looks like it may need a merge or godknows what
<hyperair> i don't have time to download and stare at it
 * Laney puts hyperair on The List
<hyperair> List?
<hyperair> O_o
<Adri2000> hmm the rc bugs page doesn't seem to be up to date
<quadrispro> is final freeze in effect?
<directhex> not for a few hours i hope
<quadrispro> oh ok, thanks directhex
 * quadrispro going to sleep
<quadrispro> bye
#ubuntu-motu 2009-04-09
<timClicks> hi all, i'm new to packaging and am currently working on bug #271260, i'm trying to get https://launchpad.net/sahana/trunk uploaded into REVU
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 271260 in ubuntu "Sahana - disaster management application - for inclusion to repos, deb uploaded" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/271260
<timClicks> i have two questions
<timClicks> 1) is there a guide on packaging programmes written in interpreted languages (PHP ideally)
<directhex> does debian have a pkg-php team? they might have a guide
<directhex> if not, look at another package & steal their packaging files
<timClicks> 2) a debian/changelog, etc. has not been used so far - is it sufficient to have *first Ubuntu package in the log?
<timClicks> directhex - cheers, will look into it
<directhex> timClicks, yes. use "dch" to edit changelogs.
<timClicks> ok - that's a relief, there's +3800 revisions already
<maxb> timClicks: Yes, it's perfectly normal for the first debian/changelog entry to just say "* Initial package (LP: #number of needs-packaging bug)."
<maxb> I see pbuilder-dist has the option to create i386 chroots on amd64, but it doesn't use linux32 when invoking things in them (afaics)
<maxb> Does that matter?
<directhex> maxb, in some cases, yes
<directhex> maxb, exceedingly stupid cases, mind you
<maxb> The only one I know of is uname
<maxb> :-/
<maxb> So far I've managed to cram all my pbuilder magic into .pbuilderrc, but it looks like there just aren't the hooks for this.
<timClicks> debian/control question : is it possible to set an either/or dependency?
<bddebian> foo | bar
<timClicks> ta
<ossud> hi!
<nhandler> Hey ossud
<ossud> i would like to compile software packages for the ubuntu universe repo ... where can i upload my .debs?
<ossud> (mostly not my own programs)
<timClicks> ossud: try googling REVU
<nhandler> ossud: You can also upload them to your PPA on Launchpad
<ossud> u shure? because i would upload programs of other people which i had compiled from source
<ossud> (not the people)
<nhandler> ossud: You would need to actually packagethe application before you could upload it to these locations
<ossud> as .deb
<nhandler> ossud: No, a .deb is a binary package. You would need to upload the source package
<nhandler> ossud: Take a look at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Complete for all the information you could ever want about creating the source package
<ossud> thanks but i don't own the source
<ossud> how can i be shure that's ok with the developer of this app?
<nhandler> ossud: Check the license the code is released under
<ossud> ah!
<ossud> would this appear in a repo or just on the site?
<nhandler> ossud: The license should be included in the .tar.gz that contains the source code
<ossud> i ment: would the appilikation then be includet in a ubuntu repo where i can install it from?
<ossud> because i saw that there are a lot of old versions of programs in the normal repos
<nhandler> ossud: Your PPA is a repository. If you want it included in the official ubuntu repositories, follow https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/NewPackages
<ossud> thank you! you are very kind :)
<calc> what is the proper Ubuntu MOTU line for maintainer field?
<calc> Ubuntu MOTU Team <ubuntu-motu@lists.ubuntu.com> ?
<StevenK> Ubuntu MOTU Developers
<jdong> https://wiki.edubuntu.org/DebianMaintainerField
<jdong> see Design
<jdong> (but in short StevenK is always right :D)
<calc> ah ok
 * calc is beating a package someone else created into revu clean
<calc> what do i do for a package that has no original source location, eg just in a branch in lp bzr?
<calc> grr i can't determine how to cause make to execute a grep after bzr checkout to determine the version number, it seems to do it immediately before the bzr checkout even happens
<calc> trying to do something like this:
<calc>         bzr co lp:~flimm/+junk/bash-ooo-thumbnailer && \
<calc>         UPSTREAM_VERSION=`grep version bash-ooo-thumbnailer/setup.py | cut -f 2 -d \\"` && \
<calc>         mv bash-ooo-thumbnailer ooo-thumbnailer-$(UPSTREAM_VERSION)
<calc> is there a way to delay evalution until execution?
<calc> got it working :)
<calc> needed $$
<calc> grr now its complaining about setup.py not having a copyright
<calc> anyone have any ideas about this: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/report.py/legal?upid=5448
<mrooney> calc: shouldn't setup.py have a copyright file? that seems like a legit complaint
<calc> mrooney: its already listed as cc public domain in the header
<mrooney> ah I see
<calc> mrooney: i think maybe its a problem of the revu grepper not being good enough?
<mrooney> that could be, if lintian is fine with it
<calc> i fixed it up to say this and it is still complaining:
<calc> +# Copyright 2009 - David D Lowe <DavidDLowe.flimm@gmail.com>
<calc> +# Released into the public domain:
<calc> +#   http://creativecommons.org/licenses/publicdomain/
<calc> yea lintian was clean long before revu got close to passing it
<calc> the setup.py itself is what is public domain the script is licensed as gpl
<mrooney> I assume you aren't the owner and can't just gpl the setup.py the same way?
<calc> no
 * calc is headed to bed, maybe someone will take a look at it later today :)
<calc> once i get it approved i am going to send it back to the original author since he also made the debian packaging but it had lots of issues
 * calc gone to bed now
<savvas> hm..
<savvas>  â The configuration file /etc/default/console-setup specifies a keyboard    â
<savvas>  â layout and variant that are not supported by the configuration program.   â
<Laney> What's the exception process for bugfix uploads now?
<Laney> The mail that slangasek linked to implies that only one ack is needed. Is that right?
<mok0> Laney: what mail are you referring to?
<james_w> the freeze mail
<mok0> Ha, just got it this second
<james_w> there's also https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-motu/2008-October/004845.html
<james_w> which confuses matters a bit more
<james_w> perhaps motu-release would like to comment on whether that policy will be used again
<Toadstool> hi all
 * Laney mails the list
<Laney> hi Toadstool
<Toadstool> hi Laney
<radix> hi guys, is there a good place to put instructions for future maintainers? i.e., for procedures on making updates to the package, version number conventions, and so on?
<james_w> radix: debian/README.Source is the preferred place for that I think
<james_w> http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-source.html#s-readmesource
<james_w> debian/README.source sorry
<radix> okay, cool
<bddebian> Heya gang
<mehdid> general question: if a bug is found in a package (in a supported version of ubuntu, not current), what can I do to get it updated (if possible)? Can I make an updated package and send a link to the .dsc?
<cjwatson> mehdid: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SponsorshipProcess
<joaopinto> !sru
<ubottu> Stable Release Update information is at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates
<mehdid> ubottu: thanks, that's what I was looking for
<ubottu> Error: I am only a bot, please don't think I'm intelligent :)
<mehdid> :)
<CarlFK1> why does pbuilder depend on postfix?  http://packages.ubuntu.com/jaunty/pbuilder
<Pici> CarlFK1: I don't see that listed there.
<CarlFK1> Pici: it must be in the tree somewhere
<Pici> hm
<CarlFK1> what's the d-foo command that shows the tree?
<geser> I guess it's because pbuilder recommends devscripts which recommends bsd-mailx which depends on postfix | mta
<CarlFK1> oh yeah...  something about now recommendeds get installed by default
<jpds> --no-install-recommends.
<CarlFK1> is there a way to not prompt "Hit <enter> to confirm:"  dh_make --single -f ../sphinx3-3.7.tar.bz
<calc> anyone have time to revu a package? http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/ooo-thumbnailer
<calc> its still complaining about a file but i think its just a bad test afaict
<RainCT> calc: nevermind the legal thing, that's just the output of license-check
<calc> RainCT: ok
<RainCT> calc: is that for Jaunty?
<calc> RainCT: yea
<calc> RainCT: trying to get it in for jaunty to universe
<RainCT> calc: No need to install the README as it doesn't say anything useful; e-mail of upstream is missing in the manpage (and it is a bit poor anyway, at least adding an example would be good); debian/copyright doesn't mention from where the source is; drop all changelog entries except for one with version -0ubuntu1.
<RainCT> That's all I can find from looking at the diff
<calc> ok
 * calc didn't do the original packaging but is trying to beat it into shape
<calc> RainCT: will dropping back to 0ubuntu1 work uploading to revu?
<RainCT> calc: Yep, REVU doesn't mind about the version number
<calc> ok
<RainCT> It takes whatever you give it and achieves it labeled with the upload date
<calc> ok
<RainCT> *archives
<fatal_> would be nice if someone would do the necessary massaging to get iproute synced from debian.... see https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/iproute/+bug/335554
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 335554 in iproute "iproute in Jaunty is out of date" [Undecided,New]
<fatal_> ^-- filed by upstream himself.
<cjwatson> fatal_: needs a freeze exception, and is far from guaranteed to get one at this point; "out of date with respect to upstream" isn't in itself enough
<cjwatson> I understand it's missing some things but we also have to consider our fallback position if things break
<cjwatson> james_w: ^- reminder for that bug, since you were looking at it earlier
<cjwatson> fatal_: sorry we apparently forgot about this, I think it may have to wait for karmic at this point
<james_w> ah, damn
<james_w> thanks for the ping
<cjwatson> (but will let james_w decide if he wants to go for a freeze exception)
<directhex> i wonder if a pretty MOTU could tickle https://edge.launchpad.net/bugs/358558 before the next level of freeziness begins
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 358558 in monodevelop-boo "Sync monodevelop-boo 2.0-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)." [Undecided,New]
<fatal_> cjwatson: no need to say sorry. I'm just suggesting that it's a possibility to update it. I haven't seen any possible regressions and there has been no new issues reported since the lenny version = what you have....
<fatal_> (personally I'm mostly here to poke around and see if there are any possibilities to hook up some nice ubuntu/debian collaboration contacts w.r.t. iproute. Don't really care if you update or not. :P)
<fatal_> anyway, feel free to send me an email if there's anything I can help out with.... I'd be happy to.... ah-iproute@debian.org
<bdmurray> Is there a MOTU release person around?
<LaserJock> any MOTU Release people about?
<iulian> LaserJock: A bit busy at the moment but I'm here.
<LaserJock> the sugar team is wanting an FFe for the latest bug-fix releases of Sugar and I'd personally like to get it in, but I wanted to get some broader opinion from motu-release
<iulian> LaserJock: I was looking at those packages right now.
<LaserJock> iulian: ah, excellent
<bdmurray> iulian: Can you help explain the type of freeze we are in right now?
<iulian> bdmurray: We are in Final Freeze, two weeks from the final release.  Please see https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2008-April/025259.html.
<iulian> LaserJock: I'd say go ahead.
<LaserJock> iulian: awesome, thanks
<iulian> LaserJock: Would you like to take care of sponsoring those packages?
<bdmurray> iulian: I did so "more intrusive changes" are okay now since it just started right?
<LaserJock> iulian: I don't have to, if you'd like me to I can though
<bdmurray> iulian: and no motu-release approval is required now?
<iulian> LaserJock: That would be great, I'd appreciate it.
<LaserJock> iulian: will do
<iulian> bdmurray: What do you mean by "intrusive changes"?  Could you upload a debdiff somewhere so I can see exactly what you're on about?
<iulian> LaserJock: Thanks a lot.
<bdmurray> iulian: that's the wording in the announcement you pointed me to.  Regardless my specific question is about sponsoring the debdiff in bug 349114.  It adds a patch system which may be inappropriate based off the wording in that announcement.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 349114 in rawstudio "Rawstudio crashes on export" [Unknown,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/349114
<iulian> bdmurray: By the way, all uploads to universe and multiverse will need to be acked by motu-release.
 * iulian looks
<iulian> bdmurray: Yes, please go ahead and upload.
<bdmurray> iulian: okay, thanks!
<bdmurray> iulian: What's the correct process for getting an ack? asking in irc subscribing to the bug?
<iulian> bdmurray: Subscribing motu-release is better IMHO.
<iulian> I've just commented on that bug.
<iulian> bdmurray: You could ask on IRC as well.  That would make things easier for us.
<iulian> Blah, I cannot find the list of motu-release delegates. :(
 * iulian is always forgetting!
<iulian> Ah, got it.
<ode> hi
<ode> lintian is giving me an message about duplicate name for source and package in control
<ode> how do I just name it once
<ode> and then reference when I use it the second time?
<geser> can you please pastebin your debian/control?
<ode> http://pastebin.com/m39cf641
<hyperair> ode: can you give the exact lintian error?
<hyperair> verbatim
<geser> what's the exact lintian message? as the control looks ok to me
<bddebian> Is it complaining about the duplicate section: perl?
<ode> http://pastebin.com/d6724f4b0
<ode> i think it's the duplicate of the name of the package
<bddebian> No, you don't need Section: perl in the binary if the sourc epackage is Section: perl
<ode> I guess there is a way to reference the name
<hyperair> ode: no you can omit Section: perl completely
<hyperair> ode: in the binary package
<hyperair> ode: just have it once in the source package section
<LaserJock> bddebian: my favorite MOTU!
<bddebian> Heh, your lame-ass MOTU! :)  How are you?
<LaserJock> doin' OK
<LaserJock> can't wait to get Jaunty out the door
<bddebian> heh
<ode> thanks, that fixed it
<LaserJock> anybody seen something like this before:
<LaserJock> dh_install -psugar
<LaserJock> dh_install: sugar missing files (debian/tmp/usr/lib/*), aborting
<geser> isn't sugar written in python?
<LaserJock> there's a debian/tmp/usr/lib/* line in sugar.install
<LaserJock> but it shouldn't bail I'd think
<geser> does the directory exist after running the install target?
<geser> dh_install complains that it should install files from that location but they aren't there
<geser> as sugar build-depends on python-dev my guess it it didn't transitioned to python 2.6 yet and installs the files to usr/local/lib (missing --install-layout=deb to setup.py install)
<LaserJock> geser: I missed what you said
<LaserJock> stupid Jaunty is locking up on me
<geser> dh_install complains that it should install files from that location but they aren't there
<geser> as sugar build-depends on python-dev my guess it it didn't transitioned to python 2.6 yet and installs the files to usr/local/lib (missing --install-layout=deb to setup.py install)
<LaserJock> geser: ah, yeah, that'd make sense
<ode> when i package a perl app am i meant to just rename the orig tarball to the perl naming scheme e.g. orig=stockmonkey-2.9013.tar.gz package=libmath-business-stockmonkey-perl-2.13?
<ode> just wondered since it's meant to be orig, unchanged tarball
<LaserJock> my goodness this is a nasty CDBS package
<LaserJock> what's the point of using CDBS if you're just going to build your own .mk files anyway
<Laney> siretart: do you have any preview debs for screen-profiles for debian for the daring?
 * Laney likes it too much
<Laney> kirkland: good work on it btw \o
<maxriskfactor> any MOTU here who manages eric?
<MOKHTE> INA perian ki miharfe
<geser> anyone here using vim and bicyclerepair?
<bdmurray> iulian: Could you ack bug 254992?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 254992 in nicotine "Nicotine crashed because of unknown options in configuration" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/254992
<ScottK> Other motu-release people: If there's stuff you've acked, that's been uploaded, but not accepted, please let me know and I'll accept it.
#ubuntu-motu 2009-04-10
<_Groo_> hi/2 all.. any motu alive?
<_Groo_> im having trouble with webkit and java in kubuntu
<_Groo_> aparently the java plugin (sun) doesnt work with both libwebkit and qt 4.5. both midori and arora cant run the plugin, midori says is misses a symbol
<_Groo_> eya all
<_Groo_> any motu alive?
<cypher1> is there anyway i can help to get the fix for bug 188468 in intrepid ? there is a debdiff already attached by someone else in the bug, but i am not not seeing it in the ubuntu packages
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 188468 in epiphany-browser "Epiphany icon missing" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/188468
<Snova> How would one go about requesting something be packaged?
<cypher1> Snova: just curious to know is that a new package or a fix to an existing package ?
<Snova> New package.
<jdong> Snova: generally wave-the-wand package christmas lists don't produce much effect; would you be interested in packaging it? :)
<Snova> I don't even know how. :) Somebody else asked if something could get packaged, I was going to tell him after finding out here. :P
<cypher1> maybe raise a bug with the url of the package homepage may get it to the next release ?
<persia> Well, only if someone happens to find the bug and want to package it.
<persia> The general rule is that the person who wants to package something decides what will be packaged.
<persia> This rule is sometimes called doocracy
<cypher1> persia: how about bug 188468.. someone has uploaded a debdiff too.. how can i help to get that into intrepid ?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 188468 in epiphany-browser "Epiphany icon missing" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/188468
<persia> cypher1, The patch provided actually makes the file violate the specification.
<persia> I'm certain that isn't the correct fix.
<persia> It's probably a missing call to dh_icons or something.  As I never encountered that issue in Intrepid, and used it for about 9 months, I doubt anyone would consider it important enough for SRU.
<persia> (and I use epiphany-browser by preference, so I ought be affected)
<cypher1> persia: but wouldnt these kind of bugs gets fixed and made available on intrepid-updates ? or is it as you say because of not being very important ?
<persia> Well, the provided patches actually violate the spec, so they'd likely get ignored or rejected.
<persia> But, yes, I don't think this is important enough for -updates (because I never saw it, and used epiphany every day in intrepid for many months).
<persia> But I'm not one of the people who decides whether something is important enough, so I may be mistaken.
<cypher1> persia: ok thanks.. i have this problem and i think i say some others reporting too
<jdong> Snova: I guess technically the process is to open a bug against Ubuntu wishing for the package to be made, but it probably is like throwing a penny down the well (minus the dead mollusks)
<persia> The problem is that it isn't in the menu at all, or that the icon is ugly until you restart the session?
<jdong> Snova: Better to find someone interested in learning packaging to take up the job
<Snova> jdong: More or less what I said. Thanks.
<cypher1> persia: for me it is not there in menu.. i have restarted many times after that
<persia> cypher1, OK.  Do you see it as disabled if you edit the menu?
<cypher1> persia: ah.. i do see multiple entries for it in menu editor. epiphany browser and epiphany browser (gecko) and one of them has the show enabled
<persia> And it doesn't show?
<cypher1> no.. i tried checking the other also and now it has shown up
<persia> Odd.
<cypher1> let me deselect what i have just done and see whether it goes away
<persia> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/epiphany-browser/+bug/201224/comments/6 could probably use some more investigation.
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 201224 in epiphany-browser "epiphany has no menue entry in Hardy" [Low,Invalid]
<persia> Perhaps there's some way to change the menu handling infrastructure, but that's too much change for -updates: it would be for some future release.
<cypher1> persia: i deselected the one i selected but the menu changed but the earlier one epiphany browser still shows
<cypher1> so it seems my problem is solved
<cypher1> persia: thank you very much
<persia> cypher1, I didn't do anything, and the problem isn't fixed.  Check the comment link above: there's a race condition, and it ought be soluable.
<persia> Just needs someone to dig into it.  I suspect your dpkg log has useful information to help understand it, so you're in a better position than most of us to track down the bug.
<cypher1> persia: sorry i was away.. sure i will try to find the root cause..
<persia> cypher1, Good luck: there's a lot of reasons it's nice to have .desktop files in different packages than binaries: right now most people simply duplicate the .desktop file in lots of places, which is wasteful.
<cypher1> ok! can i contact you if i need to have some help on this bug ?
<persia> I don't know much about it: I'd recommend asking for help in #ubuntu-desktop once you understand the race condition.
<cypher1> ok sure.. thanks!
<artfwo> Hi! After a sponsored package upload I've got a lot of e-mails with subjects like "Import problem - Galician (gl) - inkscape in Ubuntu Jaunty package "inkscape"" - what can I do with those?
<artfwo> Is it safe to ignore them, or can something be done?
<dtchen> those look like translation issues
<dtchen> generally you'd want to fix those
<artfwo> well, here's what launchpad said: "To fix this problem, please upload the file again, but with the 'PO-
<artfwo> Revision-Date' field updated."
<artfwo> but PO-revision-date field is normally updated when a translation is revised
<artfwo> so, if a translation is unchanged, there is no sense in bumping revision-date?
<Toadstool> g'morning
<geser> imbrandon: are you there for the MC meeting in #ubuntu-meeting?
<savvas> isn't there a lintian rule check about .desktop that have to be in the same binary package with the binary they represent?
<persia> savvas, Yes, but like any lintian rule, it's not always correct (just usually correct, for most packages, most of the time).
<persia> In the case where a given .desktop file has a very large number of translations, and long strings, it's nice to have it be in a -common package, to save archive space.
<savvas> ah so it's not based on a debian policy :)
<persia> But that means that it's subject to the race condition that causes the previously described bug.
<persia> Um, well, policy follows practice, so it's somewhat murky.
<savvas> is there anything someone could do about bug 201224?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 201224 in epiphany-browser "epiphany has no menue entry in Hardy" [Low,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/201224
<savvas> logging out and back in leaves the user misguided
<persia> As I explained earlier, all the patches presented actually break things more.
<persia> Plus, it's probably not important enough for an SRU.
<savvas> it's not just hardy unfortunately, it's in jaunty as well
<savvas> it's that "race condition" between packages sebastian bacher explained
<persia> Right, but adding the deprecated "Application" to Categories doesn't address that.
<persia> The two ways to address it are 1) put the .desktop file in the package with the binaries, or 2) fix the menu system to not be broken.
<persia> And 2) can be done in several different ways, of which I think processing through triggers is the least broken.
<savvas> hm..
<savvas> 2 sounds like a good way of fixing it
<persia> That's what I thought :)  Mind you, it probably needs to be for Karmic, as it's invasive.
<savvas> do you happen to know what handles the registration of desktop files? update-desktop-database ?
<savvas> sure, I don't mind, as long as in the near future (my) users have the package available the minute it's installed :)
<persia> I think that only processes the MIME entries.
<savvas> ok I'll look into it a bit more
<savvas> thanks for the tip!
<persia> Good luck.
<savvas> something tells me I'll need it :P
<iulian> Is there any configuration tool for notifications?
<jpds> No.
<jpds> iulian: The configuration for notifications for each app are in the apps options themselves.
<iulian> Ah-ha, thanks.
<quadrispro> hi guys, anyone release manager here?
<quadrispro> s/anyone/any
<persia> quadrispro, You might try #ubuntu-release
<quadrispro> thanks persia
<zorael> How long does it take for a "fixed" package to hit jaunty repositories? OpenJDK has a bug that makes the IcedTea plugin not work at all (just maxes cpu), supposedly fixed in a newer version (6b14-1.4.1-0ubuntu5) as per https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/openjdk-6/+bug/344705, but it doesn't seem to be in the repos
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 344705 in openjdk-6 "IcedTea Plugin Doesnt Work" [High,Fix released]
<mok0> zorael: that depends how often the mirror updates the repo
<mok0> zorael: it hit's Ubuntu's main archive within an hour or so
<zorael> mok0: okay, thanks, launchpad post was ~19h ago so should pop up soon then
<soc> flashplugin-installer requires nspluginwrapper and ia32-libs on amd64, should i file a bug about it?
<persia> soc, Well, does the flashplugin it installs require those?
<soc> no
<persia> Then it's probably worth a bug.  I thought we were recommending people install adobe-flashplugin anyway.
<soc> flashplugin.installer installs the newest alpha refresh which runs native on 64bit
<soc> persia: adobe-flashplugin doesn't ecist, but flashplugin-installer uses the binary from adobe
<persia> soc, It's a free/non-free thing.  adobe-flashplugin pulls a binary from adobe.  http://archive.canonical.com/ubuntu/pool/partner/a/adobe-flashplugin/ contains packaging of adobe's player under license.
<soc> ah ... ok weird ...
<persia> MInd you, some people may want the "free-ness" of having an open code download, but others may trust Canonical's packaging.
<soc> mhh, there is now package for amd64 in canonical's archive
<soc> s/now/no
<persia> Well, it's because Debian needs flashplugin-installer, because nobody (to my knowledge) has an agreement with adobe to distribute flash for Debian, so we import it.
<persia> Oh, hrm.  Dunno.
<soc> imo, we should fix the dependencies of flashplugin-installer
<persia> I think both should be fixed, but fixing the Canonical archive is outside the scope of this channel :)
<soc> that's not about canonical's archive
<soc> it's in universe
<persia> Right.
<persia> So, fix the one you can fix, and let others fix the other :)
<soc> it has wrong dependencies, which results in 128 mb wasted
<persia> I just remembered reading somewhere that Canonical's flash packaging was recommended, as it was a normal package, rather than being a downloader (and I also remember *many* complaints about flashplugin-installer being broken because adobe changed something on their site).
<soc> yes, that might be true
<soc> but canonical has no amd64 package!
<persia> RIght,  Like I said, you probably want to fix flashplugin-installer, and let someone else fix adobe-flashplugin.
<persia> At least one of the two should work
<soc> yes, that's what i do
<persia> Mind you, I'm being a bit hypocritical, as I use gnash, but still.
<jpds> soc: There is no amd64 package for it as it's considered 'unstable'.
<soc> yepp, so people _must_ use the package from universe ...
<persia> jpds, That's adobe-flashplugin, or flashplugin-installer pulling the 32-bit version?
<jpds> persia: Both.
<persia> soc, Based on that, I'd say that the dependencies aren't the bug: that it's not downloading the 32-bit version in the bug.
<soc> persia: huh?
<persia> soc, from the above, I have the impression that flashplugin-installer is supposed to pull the 32-bit version, because of the apparent stability of the 64-bit version.
<soc1> afaik there is no 32bit version that 64bit alpha prerelease ...
<jpds> soc1: http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2009/04/09/%23ubuntu-devel.html look 19:40 onwards.
<pmjdebruijn> thus far the 64bit flash player has worked great over here :)
 * pmjdebruijn thinks it's a share it's not packaged
<jpds> See log!
<soc1> ok, let me see if i understand that:
<soc1> a) the version we use is unstable b) so we use the 32bit binary pulling 128mb of 32bit libraries + nspluginwrapper c) we hope that's more stable than using the 64bit binary
<pmjdebruijn> seems so
<pmjdebruijn> heh
<pmjdebruijn> right
<soc1> mhh, is there a tool to find out if a binary is a 1386 or a amd64 binary?
<pmjdebruijn> soc1: file?
<soc1> s/1386/i386
<pmjdebruijn> try file
<pmjdebruijn> anyway, too bad there aren't two packages
<soc1> "file" worked ... -> 32bit
<persia> soc, Which means the dependencies are correct after all.  Bug belongs to adobe: maybe they will fix it for the next cycle.
<soc1> i wonder how that should be maintained ...
<soc1> persia: ok
<soc1> i guess i build me the package for personal use ...
<soc1> manually copying things to /usr/lib/mozilla is not the way i like it ... although it works at least
<pmjdebruijn> anyway, the current 32bit flash can't be maintained by anybody other than adobe as well, so that point is very moot
<soc1> pmjdebruijn: i meant the whole ia32 and nspluginwrapper mess around it ...
<persia> soc1, That's known unmaintainable.  Various people keep talking about adjusting the relevant rules files to build an ia32 variant of the libraries on amd64, but nobody every does enough of them.
<soc1> mhh, how long does it take until an upload to my ppa appears in launchpad?
<pmjdebruijn> soc1: yeah, but the point was, because the 64bit plugin isn't official, it can be maintained, but any binary blob can't be maintained... so wether it's beta or not... the point is moot... not even considering the nspluginwrapper mess around it
<soc1> yes ... i understand, it's hard to get something right, if people have different views on that matter
<soc1> i just took tha package modified it to suit my needs and i'm happy with it ...
<t325> Hello, I'm trying to build mysql-5.1.33 from the generic source code on an Ubuntu box (not sure of the version, it's an EC2 box) with OpenSSL; cannot figure out which value I have to pass to --with-ssl= in the configure statement (--with-openssl doesn't exist anymore in the last MySQL 5.1 releases, you have to specify the path where to find the OpenSSL libs). Have the openssl package installed.
<t325> btw is here the right place to ask?
<persia> Probably not :)
<persia> You might try looking in the debian/rules file of the packaged mysql server to see what happens there.
<persia> You might try asking in #ubuntu-server, but I don't know if they support that.
<persia> You might try asking in #mysql or similar fora
<t325> I am trying to add new functionality to MySQL and would like to test it on Ubuntu.
<t325> the default tree builds fine with bundled yaSSL lib, but I need OpenSSL
<persia> right.  That's a great goal.  I'm just not sure of the best place for you to get your questions answered.
<t325> What is the channel for developing apps on Ubuntu?
<persia> I don't think there's any channel that specifically provides support for developing on Ubuntu
<t325> hmm
<persia> There's several channels that specifically don't, and many of them would send you to #ubuntu, but I'm not sure the folk there can help either, as most of them concentrate on support for using Ubuntu, rather than developing on it.
<persia> That's why I suggest #ubuntu-server, as probably the closest.
<t325> ok thanks
<persia> At least it's the team that maintains mysql in Ubuntu, so you may find someone with a kindred interest.
<persia> Or somewhere in #mysql-* in case it's more on the development side, and less on the Ubuntu side.
<t325> no, it is Ubuntu-specific
<persia> Yeah, then the server channel is probably the closest.
<persia> It might be worth starting a "Developing on Ubuntu" channel.  Something like #ubuntu-app-devel
<persia> But I doubt you'd find that many people there today (but it would be good for next time).
<t325> yes, that would be fine.. but in fact there must be some private canonical channel about it - they just seem to have decided not to do it in public
<persia> I doubt it.
<persia> Most of the packages in Ubuntu are pulled from somewhere else.
<soc1> ok, if someone wants native 64bit flash, here it is: https://launchpad.net/~soc-krg-nw/+archive/ppa package was built now
<t325> persia: I found this explanation for doing it on Debian Etch http://talkingcode.co.uk/2007/11/12/error-2026-hy000-ssl-connection-error-the-joy-of-mysql-ssl-on-debian/ ; could you provide me some hints to adapt it to Ubuntu?
<persia> t325, I'm really not an expert with either mysql or openssl.
<persia> I'd expect it to be mostly the same, although intrepid is closer to lenny than etch.
<t325> ok thanks; will try #openssl, maybe they know/care about having their stuff work with MySQL on Ubuntu..
<persia> Good luck.  Sorry I don't know more to help you.
<Adri2000> asac: what's the rationale for renaming flashplugin-nonfree two weeks before the final release?
<imbrandon> morning all
<nhandler> Hi imbrandon
<directhex> is there a package for the 64-bit plugin yet?
<soc1> directhex: yes
<soc1> i made one, a few hours ago ... https://launchpad.net/~soc-krg-nw/+archive/ppa
<directhex> i kinda meant in the real archive
<soc1> no
<soc1> probably for 9.10
<soc1> i wouldn't expect, that they would change that in the middle of 9.04
<bdmurray> What should happen with something like bug 358608?
<ubottu> Error: Could not parse data returned by Launchpad: The read operation timed out (https://launchpad.net/bugs/358608/+text)
<leifdk1978> hello
<leonel> scottK for the  intrepid/hardy clamav  security updates what is the plan   backport from Jaunty the packages or apply the patches to the Intrepid,Hardy clamav packages ...
<leonel> scottK  in the debian-clamav list there are the patches for 0.94-dfsg2 version
<hggdh> a question -- the .la files should belong to the -dev or the normal (run-time) packages?
<Laney> neither
<Laney> don't package them
<Laney> (in general)
<chrisccoulson> but if they are packaged, they tend to go in -dev
<DawnLight> hello. is this an ok place to ask for a small project to be packaged?
<Laney> DawnLight: not really, filing a needs-packaging bug on launchpad is
<DawnLight> Laney: any docs on that, please?
<Laney> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/NewPackages#Requesting%20a%20new%20package%20for%20Ubuntu
<DawnLight> thanks
<directhex> and it'd better be an interesting project, or nobody's going to want to give away their time to you for free to work on it
<directhex> oh, he ran away
<sebner> directhex: you scared him :P
<savvas> how rude!
<savvas> :p
<savvas> RainCT: is there any chance you might implement a backports parameter for build/create of pbuilder-dist? :)
<directhex> RainCT is going to UDS, is he not?
<RainCT> savvas: Good idea, patches welcome :)
<RainCT> directhex: Yep
<directhex> RainCT, yay! you can buy me cake! :p
<savvas> hm...
<savvas> hey it's python!
<savvas> I'll see what I can do
<savvas> RainCT: license the cake as GPL, so directhex must share it with everyone :P
<directhex> savvas, just don't relicense from lgpl2.1 to gpl3
<RainCT> Why would I buy directhex a cake? o_O
 * hyperair wants cake too
<directhex> RainCT, for awesomeness in the face of duty
<directhex> RainCT, and to celebrate my being at UDS
<RainCT> Heh. Get Mono out of Ubuntu and you have a chance... :D
 * RainCT runs
<savvas> what happened to epiphany-webkit?
<directhex> it's hiding?
<savvas> anyone?
<savvas> no seriously, it was in jaunty :p
<savvas> http://changelogs.ubuntu.com/changelogs/pool/main/e/epiphany-browser/epiphany-browser_2.26.0-0ubuntu3/changelog
<savvas> ah wait
<jpds> savvas: Best ask seb about that (re: 2.25.91-0ubuntu1 upload).
<savvas>     - don't build a webkit variant the upstream tarball doesn't allow doing now,
<savvas>       this version uses gecko and the next one will use webkit (lp: #317305)
<savvas> found it!
<jpds> âº
<savvas> now that's a tiny cute smile :)
#ubuntu-motu 2009-04-11
<Yasumoto_> should a sync from debian wait until karmic opens?
<nhandler> Yasumoto_: If it is not necessary to have the new version in Jaunty, then yes
<Yasumoto_> nhandler: darn, alright. I've been playing around with the recently released version of guake, and it feels much more solid than the one currently in the repos
<leonel> scottK what will be the procedure for  bug 354189  in hardy , Backport from intrepid or bug fix ?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 354189 in clamav "Security fixes from clamav 0.95 need backport" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/354189
<gouki> I've been running into several 404 with mirrors of packages.ubuntu.com. Would a report of these be something of interest?
<directhex> gouki, running jaunty?
<gouki> directhex, manual downloads of packages.
<directhex> gouki, manual downloads for jaunty?
<gouki> directhex, yes, some of them.
<directhex> gouki, jaunty often updates more frequently than some mirrors, so 404s happen fairly often when the packages.ubuntu.com site expects mirrors to be up-to-date
<gouki> directhex, ohh, got it. Thanks.
<xxxxx1> hey
<ScottK> leonel: I want to get the 0.95.1 fixes into intrepid-security and then backport that and push it to hardy-security with rdepends.
<savvas> does anyone have two PPAs in their account to check the format of the second ppa?
<savvas> darn I forgot to subscribe motu sponsors for bug 237674
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 237674 in zsi "Please merge python-zsi (2.1~a1-2) (universe) from Debian unstable (main)." [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/237674
<savvas> and I've been wondering why no-one replied :P
<savvas> I guess it's too late now
<cjwatson> bdmurray: re bug 349114, we shouldn't be adding patch systems to packages that don't already have them. If the package doesn't have a patch system, the source should just be patched directly rather than via a dpatch file or whatever. (I know you just sponsored this and weren't the original contributor ...)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 349114 in rawstudio "Rawstudio crashes on export" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/349114
<mok0> cjwatson: speaking of which, all packages ought to have a patch system... I believe that will happen with the source package format 3.0
<mok0> But when that will be deployed is what I'd like to know...
<DktrKranz> mok0, patches against dak have been proposed, but they need to be tested
<cjwatson> mok0: I reject that premise
<cjwatson> but I agree that format 3.0 is likely to help matters
<cjwatson> the problem with patch systems today, as many maintainers see it, is that dpkg-source -x doesn't give you the source that will be built, and you need an extra step. Format 3.0 will at least fix this problem, and will hopefully mean that we no longer need to consider "patch systems" as such - it'll just be integrated into the packaging system
<mok0> cjwatson: so no news when 3.0 goes into production mode?
<mok0> cjwatson: We can't test it if it's  not deployed
 * maxb supposes that would really be a question for the Soyuz folks
<cjwatson> mok0: I don't know
<ScottK> cjwatson: albatross accepted.  Thank you.
<cjwatson> ScottK: ta
 * ScottK notes to people that 'final freeze' doesn't me stop work, it means we still want stuff fixed, just want to check.
<ScottK> If someone has an upload, feel free to ping me for a motu-release ack.
<superm1> ScottK, bug 350962 . i'm just about to subscribe motu-release for it
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 350962 in gnome-screensaver "[9.04 beta] no way to access screensaver enable/disable or timer settings like pre-beta 9.04" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/350962
<superm1> er well i think gnome-screensaver is main isn't it, so i guess i need ubuntu-release.  nvm
<ScottK> Yep
<ScottK> cemc: Looking at gurlchecker now.
<ScottK> I dropped your doc changes (since we're close to release and those really ought to go into a separate -doc package) and the standards version change (we don't change standards version from Debian as a matter of Ubuntu policy).
<ScottK> cody-somerville: Are you good with the libxfce4util and xubuntu-default-settings uploads?
<cemc> ScottK: got it
<ScottK> cemc: Uploaded.  Please review how I formated debian/changelog after it's in the archive.
<mr_pouit> ScottK: they are ok
<ScottK> mr_pouit: Thanks.
<ScottK> mr_pouit (and cody-somerville): accepted
<mr_pouit> ScottK: thanks.
<mr_pouit> superm1: for which apps is this xfce4-utils fix needed?
<superm1> mr_pouit, startxfce4
<superm1> mr_pouit, it needs to keep /etc/xdg in XDG_CONFIG_DIRS
<superm1> as well as whatever is being used by xubuntu, mythbuntu ,etc
<mr_pouit> mmh, libxfce4util already adds /etc/xdg by default iirc
<superm1> well i was checking export output, and it was definitely not present in xubuntu or mythbuntu
<superm1> tried dailies from both today.  after making this change, gnome-screensaver-preferences shows all the right screensavers...
<mr_pouit> ah ok, fine then
<ScottK> mr_pouit: Please let me know if I should accept it?
<mr_pouit> (non xfce apps don't use libxfce4util ^^)
<mr_pouit> ScottK: yes, it looks fine
<ScottK> mr_pouit: OK.  Thanks.
<ScottK> mr_pouit and superm1: Accepted.
<superm1> thanks
<superm1> i'll have one more for mythbuntu-default-settings, but i need to work out another menu bug for it first
<superm1> mr_pouit, i've been seeing this weird situation going on where xfce4-panel isn't spawning occasionally on login.  you guys been coming across that at all?
<mr_pouit> ScottK: thanks.
<ScottK> No problem.
<mr_pouit> superm1: no (sometimes it takes a very long time here, but it always eventually starts)
<superm1> mr_pouit, hm very odd then.  i've been seeing it quite frequently from fresh installs in a VM, but wasn't really sure what to blame it upon since I just reboot and it comes up the next time
<superm1> i'm wondering if it's only happening before xfconf gets things prepped in ~/.config
<superm1> because it's also happening to xfdesktop sometimes too
<mr_pouit> (superm1: btw, can I merge ~superm1/xfce4-utils/fix-xdg-fallback to xfce4-utils?)
<superm1> mr_pouit, yeah, i didnt get the merge request filed yet (Wish there was a way to do that directly from bzr and/or debcommit)
<mr_pouit> done
<superm1> thx
<superm1> ok ScottK i've got the mythbuntu-default-settings one sorted out too, and then ubuntu-release will have to handle the last task
<ScottK> superm1: OK.  Ping me when it's uploaded.
<superm1> ScottK, okay just got the waiting for approval email
 * ScottK looks
<ScottK> superm1: Accepted.
<superm1> thanks.  okay so now on to harder bugs :)
<YokoZar> Can I sponsor a small change upload that's been in the sponsorship queue for like 3 weeks or is it too late for this now?
<DktrKranz> YokoZar, which kind of change?
<YokoZar> Moves a suggests to a depends and uses the dependent package's icon
<YokoZar> instead of duplicating it
<DktrKranz> is dependency really required?
<DktrKranz> if not, I'd go for Karmic at this point
<YokoZar> DktrKranz: the program is an xmms2 client, the dependency in question is on xmms2, so yeah I'd say it's required
<DktrKranz> bug number?
<YokoZar> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/esperanza/+bug/342221
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 342221 in esperanza "esperanza uses its own copy of the xmms2 icon" [Undecided,New]
<YokoZar> I built/tested it so it works fine
<YokoZar> Actually
<DktrKranz> I don't see the point in moving a package to Depends only for an icon
<YokoZar> I guess it might be possible to use remote xmms streams without a local xmmsd running
<YokoZar> I'm only now becoming aware that xmms just changed this way
<YokoZar> DktrKranz: Right, the question is really if it should be depends or not
<DktrKranz> Indeed.
<DktrKranz> OTOH, icon is a Ubuntu change, it could be worth pushing it to Debian
<ScottK> YokoZar: Sounds like recommends might be better (without looking further than the backscroll)
<YokoZar> ScottK: yeah, either way not depends, so it should have a separate icon, so I can feel ok not sponsoring this one for now
<jdong> directhex: it would seem like Phoronix forgot to test Bork File Encrypter performance with the Logitech MX1100 cordless mouse review.
<jdong> *ducks* (joking)
<directhex> jdong, their hearts are in the right place!
<jdong> I know, I know, <3 Michael
<cellofellow> is the ubuntu-packaged cherokee web server compiled with fcgi and scgi support?
<superm1> cellofellow, well how do you check to find out? would the build log show it?
<superm1> if so, then take a look here: https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/cherokee/0.11.6-1
<gouki> When a software isn't licensed (and the author doesn't reply to the emails), this software can't be packaged, right?
<ScottK> That's correct
<gouki> ScottK, ok. Thanks.
<_Groo_> hi/2 all
<CarlFK> if Makefile doesn't have an install: , should I patch Makefile, or is there some way to tell debian/rules to install the binary to /usr/bin?
<CarlFK> codewad is http://sourceforge.net/projects/pdf417encode/    wget http://voxel.dl.sourceforge.net/sourceforge/pdf417encode/pdf417_enc.4.4.tar.gz
#ubuntu-motu 2009-04-12
<CarlFK> whats a better Makefile install: cp pdf417_enc $(DESTDIR)/usr/bin/pdf417_enc
<CarlFK> cuz that makes me feel icky
<meoblast> hi
<nhandler> Hello meoblast
<meoblast> does anyone know how a PCSX-DF deb was possibly created
<meoblast> i can't compile it
<meoblast> compile errors when i have all the dependencies
<CarlFK> meoblast: what's the package name?
<meoblast> pcsx-df
<meoblast> i'm just upgrading my whole system
<meoblast> dependency errors ftw
<meoblast> i'm only running 7.10 for the kernel
<ripps> I'm building a new version of mpd for the gmpc-trunk team, and I'm wondering which version name I should use: 0.15~alpha1~git$date or 0.15~git$date? Either way, the ~ denotes a less than version, right?
#ubuntu-motu 2010-04-12
<psusi> yea, but what do you use for the orig tarball when the package you are releasing IS the upstream?
<Laney> you make an upstream release
<lifeless> psusi: if you want to make debian packages of your upstream release; you need to think og it as doing two releases.
<lifeless> psusi: a) an upstream tarball release that all distributions can use and
<lifeless> psusi: b) a .deb package for e.g. Ubuntu
<psusi> but they are the same thing
<lifeless> psusi: what is your package that you say that?
<psusi> having an ubuntu release means having changes from upstream.... I don't
<psusi> e2defrag
<Laney> the Ubuntu package explains how to turn your upstream tarball into a deb file
<psusi> there is no upstream tarball though...
<lifeless> psusi: so e2defrag is useful for redhat and gentoo as well, right ?
<psusi> maybe
<Laney> there will be if you follow our advice
<lifeless> psusi: so, the best thing to do here is to make an upstream tarball. If your code is in bzr you can jsut do 'bzr export ../e2defrag-1.2.3.tar.gz'
<lifeless> or use make dist
<lifeless> or whatever you like
<psusi> so you're saying I should create a tarball to be an upstream release... ok... now the tarball is already set up as a debian package, so no changes are needed to debianize it
<lifeless> psusi: thats ok, it doesn't really matter either way.
<Laney> your tarball shouldn't include debian/
<lifeless> psusi: though some people will argue that it does matter, they are wrong ;)
<Laney> ha
<psusi> then there's no .diff to apply to the upstream to arrive at a -1
<Laney> 3.0 makes this matter less somewhat
<lifeless> psusi: once you have that tarball, you can upload that to debian for other people to download
<lifeless> psusi: and do a debian package build
<persia> A zero-byte diff is fine.
<psusi> how does that differ from a native package?
<lifeless> Laney: http://rbtcollins.wordpress.com/2009/12/18/upstreams-should-package/
<wgrant> We can make changes without changing the packaging style.
<lifeless> psusi: a native package is harder for everyone else to work with
<wgrant> Other distros can more reasonably make changes without feeling second-class.
<psusi> you already can... just append a -1 to the version
<lifeless> psusi: its harder to derivative changes
<lifeless> psusi: and harder to feed the changes back
<ajmitch> plus you don't have to make a new upstream release for ubuntu-specific changes
<ScottK> An update can be uploaded without replacing the orig.tar.gz.
<psusi> right... and that will happen if you decide to make ubuntu specific changes and add a changelog entry taking it to -1 won't it?
<Laney> lifeless: I would have encouraged it to be in a branch which is then merged in ;)
<wgrant> Laney: That's what I do. It works excellently.
<psusi> but until there are any ubuntu specific changes made, it's a native upstream release isn't it?
<lifeless> Laney: I think that that can be better, but that we should primarily focus on the collaboration
<wgrant> psusi: It may be the same as the upstream release, but it's not socially native.
<lifeless> psusi: if its a 'native package' we have to make a new tarball
<lifeless> psusi: but we're not upstream, so its inappropriate for us to do that.
<lifeless> psusi: thus, your packages should not be 'native packages'.
<lifeless> the only things that make sense as native packages are ubuntu-dev-tools, dpkg, apt, aptitude; possibly a couple of others.
<lifeless> in the entire archive.
<persia> Also the germinate-based metapackagse.
<lifeless> ah right
<lifeless> and translation packs
<Laney> I remember a thread duking this issue out on debian-devel a few months back
<lifeless> so maybe a couple hundred, automatically generated packages
<persia> and one could argue against apt and aptitude as these are available in other places (e.g. fedora)
<lifeless> indeed
 * ajmitch remembers the mess of wxwidgets being a native package in debian
<wgrant> I don't think native packages make sense except for the auto-generated case.
<lifeless> psusi: so please please please please just trust us
<lifeless> psusi: even if you don't get the distinction, we do.
<persia> ajmitch: That was wxwindows: wxwidgets has always been non-native.
<wgrant> As persia says, the dpkg stack could usefully have upstream releases.
<ajmitch> persia: right, I couldn't remember if it happened before/after the rename :)
<Laney> http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2009/09/msg00107.html
<lifeless> psusi: its fine to release a tarball that contains a debian/ dir; its *not fine* to upload a 'native package' to Ubuntu except when it really should be - and this should not be.
<Laney> that's the thread, if you like debian-devel style discussions :)
<psusi> ohh, so if someone does make a -1 release, they have to manaully create the .orig.tar?  it won't just use the native release that came before it as the orig?
<lifeless> psusi: native packages don't *have* a .orig.tar.gz
<lifeless> psusi: they only have a tar.gz, containing everything
<persia> psusi: One would hope that if the project was on launchpad, the project developers would have made a release tarball downloadable from launchpad.
<psusi> right... it IS the .orig.tar.gz... but you're saying that the tools won't figure that out when you make a -1 release, they have to have a human manually feed them the .orig.tar.gz?
<Laney> Could there ever be an upstream release without an Ubuntu release?
<lifeless> psusi: I think we've found the knowledge you are missing.
<psusi> hrm.... I think I see now
<lifeless> psusi: debian packages have two *nearly-totally-different* ways of representing the source [and this simplified to skip the whole v3-mess]
<lifeless> psusi: *normal* packages, which are a orig.tar.gz + a diff.gz (which can be empty - thats ok).
<lifeless> psusi: *native* packages, which are **just** a tar.gz
<lifeless> psusi: native packages can't be patched, and every upload uses a new entire tarball.
<lifeless> psusi: normal packages can be patched, and only the first upload includes a tarball.
<psusi> well, I wasn't really planning on having the ubuntu and upstream releases diverge at all
<ajmitch> imagine the fun of openoffice as a native package :)
<persia> psusi: Except you can't control that, because there are no maintainers in Ubuntu, so anyone might upload your package (e.g. library rename, etc.), and they may not be members of the upstream development team.
<psusi> I suppose...
<ajmitch> it's quite common, even for things like a rebuild
<lifeless> psusi: divergence is normal - you can't upload to e.g. mint linux
<lifeless> psusi: but they might need to do a bugfix; why would you make it harder for them ?
<lifeless> psusi: unless it also makes it *much* easier for you.
<lifeless> psusi: and this doesn't - all you need to do is *1* bzr export or make dist. Easy-as.
<psusi> yay... upstream tarball release uploaded
<micahg> siretart: FYI, I've almost got all the vlc xul192 commits cherry picked
<psusi> well by golley I think I got e2defrag working with uninit_bg
<psusi> that was much easier than I thought it would be
<psusi> spoke too soon
<dholbach> good morning
<Ciemon> Morning all. I'm been patching the predict package, which is amateur radio software. It's been suggested that I push the branch into the Ubuntu ham developer branches area rather than predict; possibly because I've applied 4 patches. Opinons?
<sistpoty|work> james_w: thanks a lot for processing syncs :)
<james_w> np
<james_w> just replied to the haskell/ia64 issue too
 * sistpoty|work reads mail
<sistpoty|work> james_w: ok, will do for haskell/ia64... I'll also check about P-A-S, maybe it's already done in debian
<sistpoty|work> james_w: got a few more syncs, if you don't mind: bug #548812, bug #561316, bug #535386
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 548812 in libelf "FFE for lucid - libelf" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/548812
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 561316 in codelite "Sync codelite 2.5.2.4031~dfsg-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/561316
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 535386 in gnat-4.4 "FFEs for ada packages in lucid / arm builds" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/535386
<Ciemon> A question on subscribing the Ubuntu Sponsors Team, I've just made a branch which covers 4 bugs in a package, how do I deal with subscribing the team? Do it on each bug?
<sistpoty|work> Ciemon: I guess one bug should suffice... maybe you can create a new bug report referring to the 4 bugs containing the sponsoring request?
<Ciemon> well.. the first one I asked for a sponsor for a week ago will pick it up I guess
<Ciemon> and in doing so, see them all.
<sistpoty|work> that should suffice then, I guess
<Ciemon> thanks for the confirmation
<Laney> Ciemon: have you sent them all to Debian?
<Laney> Hi sistpoty|work, I was thinking about uploading a new highlighting-kate to get building on armel/sparc, what do you think?
<sistpoty|work> Laney: what's the problem with the current version?
<Ciemon> Laney: no
<Laney> sistpoty|work: it's too monolithic or something, upstream reworked it somewhat
<Ciemon> trying to talk with the patch author, but I suspect I'll end up send them
<Laney> ok then
<Laney> I'm looking at your branch
<sistpoty|work> Laney: from a quick look, highlighting-kate is a leaf package? if so, go ahead
<Laney> yep
<Laney> thanks a lot
<sistpoty|work> thanks for all your work wrt the haskell stack! :)
<Laney> it's a *lot* better now that we have the DHG
<sistpoty|work> *nod*
<Ciemon> Laney: all comments welcome, it's my first proper go.
<Laney> I'm not particularly qualified to review the quality of the patches themselves
<Laney> heh, highlighting-kate is still quite a hefty build
<Laney> Ciemon: I find it weird that it first applies and then unapplies the patches before applying them once more for the build
<Ciemon> Laney: can you tell me where you're looking so that I can check it out?
<Laney> I just built it with pbuilder and saw it happen
<Laney> I don't think you introduced that problem though
<Laney> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/42798458/buildlog_ubuntu-lucid-i386.predict_2.2.3-2ubuntu1_FULLYBUILT.txt.gz <- you can see it there
<Laney> applies the patches, cleans, applies them again
<Laney> weird stuff
<Ciemon> excellent, thanks for the link
<Laney> Ciemon: you can look at that later, I'm going to upload your stuff now
<Laney> good work
<Laney> oh, wait :(
<Laney> Ciemon: Yeah I think your stuff is technically fine, but â¦ really it needs a feature freeze exception at this point in the cycle
<Laney> !ffe
<ubottu> Feature Freeze Exception. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess for the freeze exception process.
<Ciemon> Laney: not worried about getting into Lucid tbh (personally)
<Laney> alright, then you should unrequest sponsorship until after lucid ;)
<persia> Um, please so.  If there is a known good patch that isn't lucid targeted please push it to Debian and/or upstream.
<persia> s/so/no/
<Laney> that's already in hand aiui
<persia> I figured as much given the identity of the requestor, but wanted to make sure that the procedure was clear to all :)
<Ciemon> ok.. just so I'm clear, unrequest sponsorship, and push the patches to Debian? The assumption being that we'll get it all on the synch for M ?
<Laney> right
<Laney> and if you don't hear from Debian, then you can request sponsorship again then
<Ciemon> Thanks Laney.
<Daviey> Ciemon: One of the patches has already been pushed to Debian (by me)
<Daviey> BTW, There is already a patch delta between Debian and Ubuntu, regarding a fix done a few weeks ago by someone else.
<Daviey> (that has been fixed to Debian aswell)
<Daviey> I'd be suprised if this package is updated in unstable before FF.
<sistpoty|work> dholbach: looks like b-d's didn't get synced in bug #556593... (at least I can't see them in the new queue), can you take a look please?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 556593 in openttd "sync openttd 1.0.0-1 from Debian unstable" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/556593
<dholbach> sistpoty|work: WEIRD - I'll pass it on to jordi - I'm a busy myself right now
<sistpoty|work> dholbach: ok, thanks!
<dholbach> no worries
<MTecknology> Would truecrypt go in the Utilities section?
<MTecknology> err- no.. that's not right..
<MTecknology> utils*
<persia> Sounds reasonable.
<RainCT> persia: is the u-u-s team still used?
<persia> Only by accident.
 * sistpoty|work has subscribed ubuntu-sponsors to a number of granted FFe's that need sponsoring
<RainCT> persia: OK, so I can let my membership expire? Or do I need to subscribe somewhere else?
<persia> Well, if you want to be a sponsor, you'll want to join ~ubuntu-sponsors.
<persia> Do you want to be a sponsor?
<RainCT> persia: Yeah, I think so, although I'm not really active lately.
<persia> That's why I'm asking :)
<persia> I'm happy to add you to the sponsors if you're going to sponsor stuff :)
 * persia needs to run off for a bit, but will fiddle group memberships if requested upon return
<RainCT> ok, cya
<showard> showard314 is here, i'll be right back
<abogani> showard: ;-)
<showard> ha i just got your email
<showard> ubuntu-meeting looks open until 17:00, looks like motu-mentors reception can use it
<cyphermox> showard, let's go there?
<showard> I see huats is here too, sure let's hop over
<MTecknology> If there's a really long license for a package, should I include the whole thing in copyright or just the header and reference the full version in the source code?
<persia> MTecknology: Which license?
<MTecknology> persia: it's their own license
<persia> Then it needs to be in debian/copyright.
<ScottK> Fully copy in debian/copyright then.
<MTecknology> ok
<persia> Essentially, the end-user needs to have the license on their system when they install the package.  For licenses in /usr/share/common-licenses/ we only ship a header and a reference to save space.
<MTecknology> oh
<MTecknology> persia: I was just curious because it's 176 lines, I suppose there's others that are a lot worse thoguh
<persia> Indeed.  There's one debian/copyright that is > 2Mb
<MTecknology> wow
<MTecknology> what's that for?
<persia> I forget.
<persia> One of those ancient projects that has *lots* of different compatible licenses accumulated over the years.
<kklimonda> the one for chromium is over 1M
<\sh> hmm...
<persia> Well, for chromium-browser.  chromium itself has a much saner one.
<kklimonda> hmm, right :)
<Laney> sistpoty|work: Hi, I just collated the list of haskell packages on ia64. Wanna take a look? http://pastebin.com/yd2TTeLq
<persia> For upstreams considering new software: "chromium-browser" is a classic example of how not to do it: 1) please collaborate with other projects so that your code works as part of the wider ecosystem, 2) strive for license sanity, 3) pick a name that isn't already in use.
<persia> Oh, and 4) actually publish supported releases.
<ScottK> persia: It's the future.  See Firefox.
<ScottK> :-(
<Laney> huh, some arch:all stuff is in there
<sistpoty|work> Laney: excellent, thanks a lot!
<persia> ScottK: Doesn't make it less of an example of how not to do it.
<sistpoty|work> Laney: hugs98 can stay as well?
<ScottK> Agreed.
<Laney> sistpoty|work: Oh, someone did an upload to fix the ftbfs
<sistpoty|work> Laney: yeah, looks like it
<Laney> good stuff
<\sh> grmpf....bug #554106 is fixed now and works, but having two monitors + ati oss drivers == no compiz anymore...this was diff this morning
<sistpoty|work> Laney: others than that (and apart from the arch:all packages), the list looks good to me, at least from a glimpse
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 554106 in gnome-control-center "Gnome Appearance Properties dialog hangs when changing desktop effects" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/554106
<ScottK> TheMuso: FYI, powerpc for Kubuntu is looking really good this cycle.  We even have a working (not oversize) and tested live CD.
<MTecknology> So what do := and ?= do?
<Laney> sistpoty|work: I guess you need to ack this then â bug 561583
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 561583 in ubuntu "Remove Haskell packages from Lucid/ia64" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/561583
<sistpoty|work> Laney: just go straight to ubuntu-archive (actually I wanted to prepare the list anyways)
<Laney> ok then
<sistpoty|work> Laney: do you know if these packages are in p-a-s in debian?
<persia> MTecknology: := sets a variable at parse time, rather than at runtime.  ?= sets a variable at runtime IFF it currently has no value.
<Laney> sistpoty|work: no they aren't
<sistpoty|work> Laney: do you think we should add them to p-a-s?
<Laney> no, there's no need
<Laney> they can't be tried again until ghc6 builds on ia64 anyway after the binary is removed
<sistpoty|work> ah, good :)
<Laney> which will probably have to be bootstrapped as ghc6 b-d ghc6
<sistpoty|work> *nod*
<MTecknology> persia: oh, so if the make file does := then I can't override it in rules?
 * sistpoty|work heads home now... cya
<Laney> seeya
<persia> MTecknology: Not easily, no.  It's possible, but you'd have to dig in the make manual (no, not man make) and experiment.
<MTecknology> persia: thanks
<MTecknology> Is there any way to get a lit of directories that a package uses? the Makefile seems to do just about everything and doesn't really let me change the install directory which seems fine because it installs to /usr/bin/ anyway.
<MTecknology> I also need to figure out how to make the Makefile make two binaries and it doesn't look like it wants to do that either :P - yay I get to learn more about rules
<hyperair> MTecknology: what ar eyou trying to do?
<MTecknology> hyperair: package up truecrypt
<hyperair> MTecknology: you do know that the license isn't permissive enough for us to put into the archives, right?
<hyperair> MTecknology: they claim it's free but it isn't.
<nigelb> hyperair, okay, nice to catch you this time.  Can you sign up as a review lead for a few hours for patch day?
<hyperair> nigelb: when is patch day again?
<nigelb> hyperair, may 5th (in all tz)
<MTecknology> hyperair: oh... I thought that as long as the original source isn't modified at all it was ok
<hyperair> MTecknology: that's considered non-free.
<hyperair> nigelb: no problem.
<MTecknology> hyperair: I thought sun java was like that
<hyperair> MTecknology: no, sun java was GPL'd, iirc.
<Rhonda> MTecknology: Well, I would expect that their Makefiles could be considered source, too. Please be very wary on such topics, especially when you plan to upload it to PPA and thus even redistribute it through that â¦
<nigelb> hyperair, feel free to fill up the hours https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PatchDay
<hyperair> nigelb: cool.
<MTecknology> Rhonda: I wasn't going to modify the source Makefile either, only make the rules file work with it.
<MTecknology> That sucks- I'd now like to go yell at them - I was excited because I thought I could do something a lot of people might like.
<persia> MTecknology: If you can't convince them any other way, try to convince them to allow folks to distribute patches along with their source, and ship binaries with the patches applied.  That's enough for multiverse (but not wonderful).
<Rhonda> MTecknology: A lot of people like weird stuff and don't care about licenses. Within the boundries of our distribution though we should guard them from licensing weirdnesses instead of just pleasing them with something that might get them into troubles.
<MTecknology> Alrighty, I already made contact with them and they just referred me to their license section 3, I guess I'll mention the problems with their license and ass if there's anything they could do about it..
<Rhonda> Freud'schian typo, "and ass"? :)
<hyperair> nigelb: done
 * nigelb hugs hyperair 
 * hyperair needs to reorganize his irssi windows
<nigelb> thank you :)
<hyperair> nigelb: no.. thank you for organizing this =)
<nigelb> hyperair, I was hoping you'd cover that vast empty space :D
<hyperair> nigelb: unfortunately, i've got a project which requires me to sit in the lab from 8AM-5PM on weekdays.
<hyperair> nigelb: i'm willing to dedicate my entire weekend to it though
<nigelb> hyperair, then shall I change my times so we cover more hours?
<Rhonda> hyperair: How many do you have currently? :)
<Rhonda> hyperair: You do use /layout save and /save, right?
<hyperair> Rhonda: i do use those. but i kinda memorized the numbers =(
<hyperair> Rhonda: now that there are more #ubuntu-* channels, i'd like to group them together, which means shifting all the windows around.
<nigelb> hhaha
<Rhonda> Then don't shift. :)
<hyperair> nigelb: i say just add every hour you're free =)
<hyperair> Rhonda: but adding them to the back feels messy =\
<Rhonda> I don't shift at the front.
<hyperair> Rhonda: anyway i have 42 windows, including the status and the hilight window
<Rhonda> Up to 60 windows are pretty much fixed.
<nigelb> hyperair, It was either the late hours of evening or early hours of morning.  If you're covering evening, I'll take the morning
<Rhonda> When I drop in those early numbers I move a later window to the spot to not move them around. :)
<Rhonda> #ubuntu-motu has replaced #debconf in spot 23 a while ago, e.g. ;)
<hyperair> nigelb: i'll add more hours on the day itself, if i'm free =)
<hyperair> nigelb: but mornings are off-limits for me.
<hyperair> nigelb: what timezone are you in? your hours seem really similar to mine
<nigelb> hyperair, thanks again :)
<nigelb> IST
<hyperair> Rhonda: ahah nice one.
<nigelb> I love mornings.  Stable power.  and nice and quiet here
<hyperair> nigelb: my early mornings would be past-midnight hours before sleeping =p
<nigelb> hyperair, I'm very bad at staying up late considering I need to get in to work at 6 am
<hyperair> nigelb: ahah i see.
<nigelb> hyperair, you're in malaysia?
<hyperair> nigelb: no, i'm in singapore.
<nigelb> or somewhere around there?
<hyperair> nigelb: but the timezone is there, yes
<hyperair> the same timezone
<nigelb> aah, I'm in india... closeby
 * hyperair nods
<hyperair> how did you guess?
<nigelb> I read somewhere.. wiki perhaps?
<hyperair> hmm i see.
<hyperair> =p
<hyperair> my wiki said that i'm studying in singapore, but come from malaysia =p
<hyperair> well during holidays i go back to malaysia \o/
<hyperair> the land of great food.
<nigelb> hyperair, my memory works sometimes ;)
<hyperair> great, cheap food =p
<ari-tczew> kklimonda: any progress on bug 368855 ?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 368855 in cherrypy3 "formatwarning() definition from cherrypy3 incompatible with Python 2.6" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/368855
<kklimonda> ari-tczew: hmm, still waiting for sru ack I think
<ari-tczew> kklimonda: I subscribed ubuntu-sru, because motu-sru is out of business generally. I think that jdong will check this bug soon
<kklimonda> heh
<jdong> ari-tczew: done.
<jdong> :)
<Ciemon> Laney: You said to unsub Ubuntu Sponsors Team, I don't see how to https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/predict/+bug/552568 I can unsub myself but no-one else I guess I don't have the required access.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 552568 in predict "hamlib rotctld support" [Undecided,In progress]
<ari-tczew> jdong: cool, thanks!
<jdong> sure thing :)
<persia> Ciemon: I'll unsubscribe for you.
<ari-tczew> please sponsor debdiff from bug 368855
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 368855 in cherrypy3 "formatwarning() definition from cherrypy3 incompatible with Python 2.6" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/368855
<Ciemon> persia: thank you
<psusi> jdong: you played much with the e2freefrag utility?  found it the other day and have been using it to quantify the job that e2defrag does... it's kinda neat
<jdong> psusi: yeah I briefly looked at its out put and it was kinda cool
<psusi> would be interesting to see what effect pydefrag has on the free space fragmentation
<jdong> oh yes :)
<jdong> lol I'd like to try that some day when I have time
<jdong> just run it blindly on / and do a before-after
<psusi> e2defrag makes it clean up A LOT... gets rid of all of the fragments under ~32-64mb entirely
<psusi> yea, exactly
<psusi> also I found that it normally only shows up to 1-2 gb maxium free extent size... this is because mkfs defaults to a flex_bg size of 16 groups, which means every 16 x 128 mb = 2gb you have a bg that actually contains an inode table and bitmaps, thus breaking up the free space... you can mkfs with a larger flex size and get bigger free extents
<shadeslayer> hi i need to package kipi plugins for digikam,but i dont fully understand the process of merging my package with debian changes
<shadeslayer> can someone explain this to me?
<persia> shadeslayer: Could you give a bit more context?
<shadeslayer> persia: see #kubuntu-devel ;)
<persia> Oh, so it's just a normal merge: a package with Ubuntu changes and a new version in Debian?
<shadeslayer> persia: apparently there are some huge issues...
<shadeslayer> persia: Debian introduced loads of changes
<Laney> Ciemon: yeah sorry, I forgot that not everyone can do that
<MTecknology> persia: could you give this a glance and tell me what you think?  http://dpaste.com/182929/
<persia> MTecknology: Sounds like the easy solution is to name it realcrypt :)
<MTecknology> persia: I hate doing that - I think it sounds MUCH nicer to give them proper credit in the name and everywhere else - I guess that's not what they want :S
<MTecknology> persia: you think that would be the best solution?
<hyperair> i think they ned to know the difference between "need to" and "able to"
<persia> I specifically don't have an opinion on whether this is the best solution, and won't develop one :)
<MTecknology> hyperair: hm?
<hyperair> s/ned/need/
<persia> But http://www.ubuntu.com/community/ubuntustory/licensing may be useful as comparison
<MTecknology> persia: I guess that renaming it like that would at least be enough to get it into multiverse and maybe universe if you can modify the whole thing under that new name?
<persia> MTecknology: Indeed.
<hyperair> MTecknology: he stresses that there is no need to patch, blah blah, when what is needed is the *freedom* to patch, not necessarily meaning that there will be patches
<MTecknology> hyperair: ya, I mentioned it like that actually. It's true that it does work wonderfully like that, but by their definition of modification, just adding debian/ is an alteration afaict
<hyperair> MTecknology: they were always a sucky upstream >_>
<MTecknology> persia: I really like that page, thanks
<hyperair> "Modification" means (and "modify" refers to) any alteration of This Product, including, but not limited to, addition to or deletion from the substance or structure of This Product, translation into another language, repackaging, alteration or removal of any file included with This Product, and addition of any new files to This Product.
<hyperair> repackaging is part of this modification
<MTecknology> I guess if they want it distributed as another name it'll just lose it's reach a little bit and there will be the rist of users diassociating it with TrueCrypt which is worse for them... Espcially because that means I'll need to make a patch that completely renames TrueCrypt to RealCrypt
<hyperair> MTecknology: i don't see iceweasel and what was that other thing called losing reach.
<hyperair> icedove?
<MTecknology> good point
<jdong> "what was that other thing called" is somewhat indicative of the opposite of your point though ;-)
<MTecknology> that's pretty much the exact same thing?
<hyperair> jdong: that's because i don't use debian. ;-)
<jdong> :)
<hyperair> jdong: isn't there a way we could negotiate this trademark issue in ubuntu though?
<jdong> has anyone tried talkign with upstream about a Ubuntu / Canonical Partners effort?
<hyperair> i mean we did it for thunderbird and firefox
<jdong> lol we said that at the same time.
<jdong> before we take this rebranding solution, at least make sure that indeed upstream wants nothing to do with us
<hyperair> jdong: but i didn't mean partners ;-)
<jdong> hyperair: you can argue that mozilla is right now partner-esque.
<jdong> :)
<hyperair> jdong: is it?
<jdong> hyperair: in that it's not a purely RMS-y definition of FOSS
<jdong> hyperair: I'm quite sure I'm not allowed to just arbitrarily add a patch to Firefox
<hyperair> jdong: either way, unless i was reading that email wrong, it sounded hostile.
<MTecknology> jdong: nothing to do with us, referring to what i'm talking about or firefox?
<jdong> MTecknology: truecrypt
<hyperair> jdong: really? i thought firefox was freely patchable..
<jdong> hyperair: I thought that was delegated to just the Ubuntu Mozilla Team
<persia> No.
<persia> Not even them.
<hyperair> then who?
<persia> The patches have to be "approved" by upstream to keep using the branding.
 * hyperair facepalms
<MTecknology> hyperair: I think I offended him some, not intentionally, I tried to be friendly thoguh
<hyperair> MTecknology: maybe.
<jdong> persia: in practice does asac have to consult with Mozilla each time?
<jdong> persia: or is it somewhat understood that he is trusted to make these decisions for Ubuntu as long as he doesn't do anything crackful?
 * sebner pets hyperair 
 * hyperair woofs
<jdong> hyperair: but yeah bottom line point is there's definitely a "special" "relationship" going on between us and Mozilla
<hyperair> jdong: i see. that makes sense, i suppose.
<jdong> I wonder to what degree TrueCrypt would be receptive towards that
<persia> jdong: I don't know the details, but I think the process is that the mozillateam pushes patches upstream and packages official releases.
<micahg> jdong: it's touchy
<jdong> of course if the question was framed from the perspective that we-want-full-control... TrueCrypt will get pissy
<jdong> but maybe a more constructive attitude can work towards a common ground solution
 * hyperair nods
<jdong> I just personally feel that the loss of branding is a somewhat big deal :-/
<jdong> maybe not to techie users, but the general audience definitely recognizes buzzwords
<hyperair> i agree. me too.
<MTecknology> oh, the logo on that app will need to change too, won't it...
<persia> Indeed.
<hyperair> i was pretty annoyed with the strange globe we had instead of our firefox icon at first.
<jdong> MTecknology: as an example, just look at CentOS vs RHEL
<jdong> MTecknology: that's the degree to which things will need to change
<hyperair> jdong: i don't think things are that serious.
<jdong> (iceweasel is an easier example because there's a magical build flag that de-brands automatically anyway)
<persia> The question is whether the brand has enough value to be worth the extra effort to support the brand.  For very valuable brands, that argument can be made.  For not so valuable brands, there's no point supporting more folk trying to use branding to control software.
<jdong> hyperair: if you take a literal read of their license, I think it does evaluate to that serious
<hyperair> jdong: CentOS and RHEL are distros. that means every bit of branding in whatever packages they  have that do have branding will have to be changed.
<hyperair> jdong: it's an entirely different scale, i should think.
<persia> hyperair: CentOS goes to great trouble to be binary-compatible with RHEL: it's really just branding changes.
<persia> (but yes, the scale is different)
<MTecknology> wow- I really fired up an interesting conversation
<hyperair> heh yes you did
<hyperair> imo truecrypt has enough of a brand name that we should at least attempt to preserve it.
<hyperair> but their license does not even permit rebuilding.
<hyperair> which means you can't upload their sources (with their debian/) and distribute the resulting debs
<hyperair> because such rebuilding would be classified under repackaging
<MTecknology> hyperair: I mentioned that in the email, I think they just ignored that in the response..
<MTecknology> hyperair: I referred to it though as the debian/ would be adding to the source which by their definition is altering it
<hyperair> MTecknology: could i see the transcript of your email?
<MTecknology> hyperair: obviously I'm still very novice but I did my best - http://dpaste.com/182947/
<hyperair> MTecknology: i doubt many of us have had experiences dealing with upstreams of truecrypt's level of stubbornness
<hyperair> "I'm sure this isn't likely
<hyperair> to happen. However, you can't blame me for trying...
<hyperair> "
<hyperair> *cough*
<MTecknology> hyperair: I was referring to them changing their whole license
<MTecknology> sorry
<hyperair> heheh nevermind =p
<MTecknology> hyperair: overall was it ok?
<hyperair> i think it is necessary to point out to them that Ubuntu has a strict policy of binaries only coming from the sources, and enforced by having source-only uploads to the archive, however the act of building .debs from sources already constitutes "repackaging" as mentioned in the license
<micahg> can a MOTU please ack bug 555235
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 555235 in phpmyadmin "[FFe] sync phpmyadmin 3.3.1-1 from debian testing" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/555235
<hyperair> don't you need the FFe acked first?
<hyperair> oho it's acked.
<showard> while we're on FFEs, this one has been acked and needs a MOTU bug 221332
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 221332 in tiemu "[FFE] The tiemu package is not installable and not buildable in lucid" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/221332
<micahg> hyperair: :)
<micahg> hyperair: also, format-patch is pretty cool, just hope I used it right
<hyperair> ^_^
<ari-tczew> micahg: did you fix libjdic-java's FTBFS upstream?
<micahg> ari-tczew: no, not yet
<micahg> ari-tczew: didn't we decide to fix that for next cycle
 * hyperair updates his lucid cowbuilder
<ari-tczew> micahg: no fix for maverick?
<MTecknology> hyperair: so, completely rebrand the thing and it'll fall into their license - does that mean I can attach a different license? say GPL?
<micahg> ari-tczew: yeah, for maverick, but not lucid
<ari-tczew> micahg: ok, I know
<hyperair> MTecknology: er. i don't think so...
<hyperair> MTecknology: i'm not sure. did it say what derivative works have to be licensed under?
<abogani> cowbuilder?
<hyperair> abogani: yeah, it's part of the cowdancer package.
<ScottK> MTecknology: No.  You can't change the license unless you are the copyright owner.
<hyperair> abogani: think pbuilder, but using copy-on-write.
<micahg> ari-tczew: I still need to upload the fix for Lucid to move to xul192 which I'll do this week
<abogani> hyperair: Ahhhhh
<ari-tczew> micahg: do you mean about libjdic-java? I think that rebuild is enough
<micahg> ari-tczew: yeah, just a rebuild
<MTecknology> ScottK: ok
<micahg> ari-tczew: wait, not just a rebuild, 1 tweak in rules I think
<ari-tczew> micahg: do you will prepare a fix?
<MTecknology> ScottK: but the license does reference TrueCrypt, would I keep that name intact?
<hyperair> what is the "confirmed" status for a sync request supposed to mean? FFe granted, or MOTU Ack?
<ScottK> In the license you'd have to I think.
<micahg> ari-tczew: yeah, I have the fix, I just want to test the build one more time before pushing
<ScottK> hyperair: Yes.
<ScottK> depends on who's subscribed.
<hyperair> ScottK: i mean which one?
<hyperair> ah
<ScottK> It can mean either.
<persia> hyperair: status doesn't really mean much for ACK, although "confirmed" and "triaged" are common outputs.  I think status is actually used for the FFe process.
<hyperair> i see.
 * hyperair thought "confirmed" was meant to show that the sync request has been acked by MOTUs and can be passed on to archive admins
<ari-tczew> what's the different between outstanding and updates merges?
<hyperair> micahg: acked.
<micahg> hyperair: thanks
<showard> ari-tczew: for MoM output, outstanding means that it has not been updated at all in lucid, and updated means that it has been merged at least once in lucid and is out of date again (a debian upload after FF)
 * micahg saw an archive sync this morning, so I figured there won't be too many more before FF
<showard> (correction: debian upload after debian-import-freeze)
<hyperair> showard: tiemu doesn't build. http://paste.debian.net/68612/
<hyperair> oh wait, it's not a sync
<hyperair> whoops
<hyperair> brain not functioning
<ari-tczew> showard: I understand like: "outstanding" are merges without touch since lucid-1 but "updated" are packages touched in lucid. so conclusing: "outstanding" are older merges than "updated", am I correct?
 * hyperair notices sebner in tiemu's changelog
 * hyperair suggests dep3 to showard
<showard> ar-tczew: Yes, "updated" merges are no more than 6 months out of date, "outstanding" has no limit of being out of date
<hyperair> but not a blocker
<geser> ari-tczew: not necessary
<showard> hyperair: yeah, they use dpatch still, so I just kept the default dpatch headers - sorry about that
<ari-tczew> geser: so?
<hyperair> showard: ...i didnt's see patch headers. another instance of brain not functioning
<geser> ari-tczew: assume, foo 1 got uploaded to Debian 2 months ago and merged, foo 2 got uploaded to Debian 1 month ago, but not yet merged (-> listed in updated), bar 3 was upload 1 week ago but not yet merged in lucid at all (-> listed in outstanding)
<ari-tczew> geser: I don't understand. Any examples?
<ari-tczew> real examplers
<showard> geser: thanks, I was trying to think of an example - those are good ones
<geser> ari-tczew: outstanding: "pydoctor", last Ubuntu upload: 2009-10-07 (in karmic), last Debian upload: 2010-03-04, migrated to testing on 2010-03-15
<ari-tczew> geser: ha! "(in karmic)"
<ari-tczew> so lucid-1
<geser> yes, but there was nothing to merge till March 2010 for pydoctor
<geser> while "abcde" was merged on 2009-11-04 (lucid) and the last Debian upload was in 2010-02-14 (migrated to testing on 2010-02-25)
<ari-tczew> heh
<geser> so "abcde" (updated) is waiting longer on a merge than "pydoctor" (outstanding)
<ari-tczew> geser: heh why all not-refreshed merges are not in one list? I think there is no bigger difference
<geser> sorry, don't know the reason behind this (it was always like this)
<ari-tczew> geser: may this is time for change this state? 2 sections on component is confusing
<ari-tczew> I'm finding the way for easiest contribute to Ubuntu
<showard> I think the argument is that you know that "updated" packages are no more than 6 months old, but "outstanding" packages can be anywhere from a day to several years old. Maybe sorting the list by time since last merge (<1 month, 2 months, 3 months, etc)
<showard> would be useful
<ari-tczew> showard: if no all merges per section in one list, your idea +1
<ari-tczew> s/section/component
<showard> or days out of date, like debian's build lists do
<ari-tczew> btw. is MoM paused due to Feature Freeze? or is it a bug?
<geser> good question
<geser> might be something broke it again
<geser> ari-tczew: btw there is also http://people.ubuntuwire.com/~lucas/merges.html
<MTecknology> !quilt
<MTecknology> sad, I was hoping for a quick easy link :P
<geser> MTecknology: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/PatchSystems#quilt%20%28example%20package:%20xterm%29
<MTecknology> geser: thanks :)
<ari-tczew> geser: I know lucas merges very well, but I'm suggesting to expand MoM system.
<geser> ari-tczew: I'm not sure about the process to get updates into the MoM source and there seem to be a slow migration to bzr merges
<ari-tczew> geser: do you mean about merging packages by bzr or mean about import MoM to bzr branch?
<geser> I mean merge packages with bzr from the auto-imported packaging branches
<geser> and the MoM source is also in a bzr branch if you want to work on it (lp:merge-o-matic)
<ari-tczew> geser: btw. current I'd like to concentrate my work in security sector, but in May I want to organise meeting to discuss about drawing new Ubuntu contributors
<geser> really nice, in both parts help is always welcome
<hyperair> showard: your patch doesn't apply. the dpatch one you added.
<showard> that's odd, i built a package (in my ppa) with it
<hyperair> showard: perhaps the generated debdiff had missing things..
<hyperair> showard: i've had a few cases where the debdiff i attached to an email to launchpad ended up not appliable
<hyperair> hmm wait a sec. something is weird.
<hyperair> the patch is reversed.
<showard> ahh, that's embarrassing
<hyperair> no wait
<hyperair> it was dpatch's fault
<hyperair> it applied halfway and when i tried to apply again it failed miserably
<hyperair> but
<hyperair> showard: http://paste.debian.net/68624/
<sebner> quilt to the rescue!
<showard> yay quilt! ok, how about let it sit for now - tonight I'll get another chance to look at it and see what the problem is (unless you want to look at the ppa build to get the source from there: https://launchpad.net/~showard314/+archive/ppa)
<hyperair> showard: actually could you just upload your 04 patch somewhere?
<hyperair> oh heh i think i know what may have been the problem.
<hyperair> line endings.
<showard> hyperair: my debdiff is against debian's package, not ubuntu's - I mentioned that in the report. I did that because the changes were so great, I acted as if it was a sync with debian and then a merge of our changes
<hyperair> showard: yes yes, i know.
<hyperair> showard: anyway the reason your patch didn't apply was because of line endings.
<showard> hyperair: ahh ok, thanks
<hyperair> showard: dbg_dock and dbg_wnds had dos line endings.
<hyperair> showard: they probably got lost in the debdiff somewhere along the line. did you upload via the web interface?
<hyperair> or did you email as an attachment?
<showard> yes, web interface
<hyperair> then it's a bug in launchpad.
<hyperair> please file it =p
<maco> the Uploaders: field in packages from Debian... do those get XSBC- in front just like Maintainer/XSBC-Original-Maintainer?
<ScottK> maco: Leave it unchanged.
<ScottK> Ubuntu doesn't use uploaders so there's no point in messing with it.
<maco> ok
<TheMuso> ScottK: Great. I hope to get Ubuntu out of the oversized area somehow as well...
<ajmitch> I should probably fix up pbuilder on my laptop, getting errors about failinfg to install initramfs-tools is annoying
#ubuntu-motu 2010-04-13
<lightnin> Trying to upload a new package to my PPA, but dput keeps giving me this error: Checksum doesn't match for ...diff.gz
<lightnin> I built the source package with PDE build, signed it with debsign... am I missing something?
<maxb> PDE build? You mean pdebuild? That's not an acronym :-)
<maxb> that checksum error implies the .diff.gz you've got isn't the one that was built at the time the .changes you are trying to upload was built
<lightnin> maxb: Hmmm... thanks. Yeah, sorry -- pdebuild
<lightnin> maxb: So would this be a good command to build a source package using pdebuild: DIST=jaunty pdebuild --buildresult ../
<maxb> uhm. I've never used --buildresult myself, which makes me wonder if it might be related to your problem
<maxb> Typically I won't bother with pbuilder if I'm just building a source package for a PPA upload
<lightnin> Oh, ok.
<lightnin> So I should probably just use debuild, eh?
<lightnin> maxb: Ok, debuild worked. I'm thinking of releasing this package as a download on our website too - so I figured I'd be as kosher as possible and use pdebuild. But I guess it doesn't matter as long as pdebuild is able to build it...
<maxb> pdebuild is useful for ensuring the binary packages build in a clean environment
<maxb> However for a PPA upload you want a source only build anyway
<maxb> I suspect the  --buildresult ../ as the root of your problems, because I can't imagine what else it could be
<lightnin> maxb: Many thanks for your help!
<IntuitiveNipple> Do I need to subscribe ubuntu-release or ubuntu-sponsors for a Universe package (apt-cacher) bug fix ?
<ajmitch> ~ubuntu-sponsors
<IntuitiveNipple> thanks ajmitch
<asac> jdong: i am trusted to do the right hting
<asac> sometimes i add stuff before consulting them
<asac> but i always consult them
<asac> usually we should consult them first
<jdong> asac: thanks for clarifying; I'd assume after some point there'd be a level of trust built where they trust that you will make decisions that are reasonable to them
<asac> jdong: right. its officially not that way
<asac> inofficially i might act that way if needed though ;)
<jdong> right, understandably so :)
<jdong> I guess the point is things that sound absurdly bureaucratic in legalese can work out in practice
<jdong> (at least the point I was trying to bring up in that discussion)
<asac> well. in practive we have this:
<asac> we do stuff and have to discuss upstream by first beta
<asac> in security updates i really try to avoid any changes so we are safe
<jdong> ah
<jdong> does that cover just the Mozilla source/codebase, or also things like our debian/ packaging changes?
<jdong> (now I'm just asking out of pure curiousity)
<Ciemon> Laney: when you've 5 mins, ping me please.
<EzraR> there is a command to download a source package from debians repo is there not? anyone know?
<persia> pull-debian-source might work.
<persia> Alternately, dget from the .dsc URL (found in various places, but always at packages.qa.debian.org if nowhere else)
<EzraR> seems pull-debian-source is broken, im pretty sure that is what i was looking for thnx
<persia> Please fix :)
<EzraR> hehe
<EzraR> i was just going to look
<EzraR> ok fixed
<persia> Excellent.  Do you use bzr?  If so, please submit a merge proposal to lp:ubuntu-dev-tools.  If not, please file a bug with the patch.
<EzraR> yeah i will, i just was going through the bug reports to see if it was reproted already etc...
<EzraR> i find it strange that it hasent been reported, maybe people dont really use it or it doesnt effect all packages
<persia> most of the users of ubuntu-dev-tools are, unsuprisingly, developers, so bugs tend to get swatted on discovery (but not always).
<EzraR> persia want to try it out on a random package for me? if you get the error i would feel a little better about it :)
<persia> works for me, no error.
<EzraR> hmm
<EzraR> persia: are you using karmic?
<persia> no.
<EzraR> what package did you try it on?
<persia> hello-debhelper
<dholbach> good morning
<ajmitch> hi
<dholbach> hey ajmitch
<Rhonda> wgrant, persia: Haven't heard about the sdl issue in some days and seen no mail to the bug neither - what's the plan? :)
<ajmitch> dholbach: bug 559059 is committed if you want to check it out
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 559059 in ubuntuwire-website "Please update rcbugs to always use the current development release" [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/559059
<dholbach> ajmitch: WOW, that was quick
<ajmitch> really didn't take long to do
<persia> I don't agree with that bug though.
<persia> I think we ought align with DIF.
<dholbach> good work
<persia> pre-DIF, we'd do better to concentrate on SRUs for RCbugs.
<persia> Rhonda: I wasn't able to come to any useful conclusions regarding consumers of the regression: do you think we should just push the patch?
<dholbach> persia: it had karmic a few minutes before
<persia> I know.  It had karmic too long, but I think the fix is too large a hammer.
<dholbach> persia: maybe file a separate bug so that we can get a separate view for "sru stuff"
<ajmitch> dholbach: that's because I made a mistake in what should still be default, it was meant to be karmic until DIF & then switched
<ajmitch> though lucid was always available
<ajmitch> persia: the simple way is for me to just disable the part of the cronjob that looks up the current relese from LP
<ajmitch> which was as quick & hacky as http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ajmitch/%2Bjunk/ubuntu-scripts/annotate/head:/ubuntu_series.py
<dholbach> thanks a bunch ajmitch
<ajmitch> np
<persia> dholbach: Every release is available, one just has to enter the right URL.
<persia> ajmitch: heh, OK.  If you happen to figure out how to make it work magically, that'd be cool too :)
<ajmitch> persia: sure, I could hack something into there now to only run it a certain number of weeks after the current release is open
<ajmitch> but that sounds like work
<dholbach> I think it makes sense if it defaults to the current development release and has a "nav bar" to the supported releases
<ajmitch> dholbach: right, I was going to add that, I should do that now
<dholbach> where nav bar is really just "a bunch of links" :)
<dholbach> ajmitch: you are a man of awesome
<dholbach> rcbugs is such a brilliant tool
<persia> Indeed.
<ajmitch> it's a shame it's so ugly underneath :)
<persia> shhh!
<ajmitch> as long as noone looks at the code...
<ajmitch> ok, looks ugly, but the links are there for each release
<ajmitch> see if the bugs listed match reality
<Rhonda> persia: Not sure wether people really complained about the fix that did stir this kind of regression, at least I never heard of any drag'n'drop issues.
<persia> Rhonda: So, if you recommend it be applied, I'll apply it (or if you prepare a candidate, I'll upload it), but I'd like a firm recommendation as you've looked into this much more than I.
<persia> (unless wgrant is already preparing an upload)
<Rhonda> persia: Just in case, gentoo did pick up on that patch already. :)
<persia> We should all really grant gentoo the appreciation they deserve: they apply patches faster than most of us, and get testing feedback quickly.
<Rhonda> :)
<ajmitch> what an amusing cross-post on ubuntu-devel-discuss
<arand> I was planning on reporting https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/virtualbox-ose/+bug/562187 straigt to debian, without testing specifically on a debian install, since it's an upstream issue, is that an ok practice for this case?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 562187 in virtualbox-ose "BUG: soft lockup - CPU#0 stuck for 61s! [modprobe :66]" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<persia> I generally prefer to see things tested in Debian if being reported to Debian.
<persia> An example of what you haven't tested is whether this issue expresses itself with a Debian kernel.
<persia> But there's no reason not to report directly upstream if it's an upstream issue.
<arand> persia: True... well, I won't be able to test it, so that'll pretty much be leaving debian to find out for itself...
<arand> persia: It's reported already to furthest upstream (vbox), and fixed in SVN there, figured it would apply to debian... but yea, that's just an assumption.
<persia> arand: The trick is to send all the bugs we can to Debian without ever sending them a bug that doesn't affect Debian.
<Laney> Ciemon: hiya
<Ciemon> hiya, ok for a quick msg?
<Laney> absolutely
<Laney> I just noticed bug 496274 needs a SRU ack and has been sitting for months. Could someone on the team please poke it?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 496274 in haskell-src-exts "No-change source rebuild necessary to make installable" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/496274
<arand> If game for some more SRU, there's Bug #510571 that's a bit mouldy as well.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 510571 in virtualbox-ose "Lucid guest won't boot with acpi in virtualbox" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/510571
<MTecknology> I ran dput without speficying where it should go and I got this - Rejected: The signer of this package has no upload rights to this distribution's primary archive.  Did you mean to upload to a PPA?
<MTecknology> mr. error is right, but where the heck did I try to upload to :S
<james_w> ubuntu
<james_w> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/Uploading#Avoiding%20uploading%20to%20the%20wrong%20place
<MTecknology> james_w: thanks
<joaopinto> can someone help me getting libuser into a buildable state in the repository ?
<joaopinto> the fix is trivial, I would spend too much time research all the required process to get it in :P
<james_w> joaopinto: you have a patch?
<joaopinto> james_w, kind off, the easier wayt to fix requires to run autoreconf, the patch would be huge
<joaopinto> I have added AC_CONFIG_MACRO_DIR([m4]) to configure.in and ran autoreconf
<joaopinto> it will build and install file with the updated autoconf* files
<joaopinto> the  AC_CONFIG_MACRO_DIR([m4]) was just to fix a warning with the newer autoconf
<james_w> right
<james_w> but what actually fixes the problem?
<joaopinto> the problem is within aclocal.m4
<joaopinto> which uses: from distutils import sysconfig; print sysconfig.get_python_lib(0,0)
<joaopinto> to detect the python install dir
<joaopinto> regenerating aclocal will replace it with a function that detects the proper path
<joaopinto> but regenerating aclocal will require to regenerate the automake/autoconf files
<joaopinto> my goal is to make usermode installable, I have a requirement to use it :\
<james_w> so would a targeted patch to change that function be the best idea?
<joaopinto> does it make sense such an effort for a package which does not currently build/install ?
<james_w> well, it sounds like you need it?
<joaopinto> is there a bug automatically generated because of  FTBFS or should I file a new one ?
<james_w> you can file a new one
<james_w> we don't need one though
<joaopinto> james_w, a smaller patch against configure would make the approval easier ?
<james_w> yeah
<joaopinto> ufff, ok
<james_w> push up a bzr branch and I'll take a look
<joaopinto> does any know the equivalent to from distutils import sysconfig; print sysconfig.get_python_lib(0,0) to get site-packages ?
<joaopinto> I mean the site-packages path
<james_w> the build log from the failure has some code
<joaopinto> hum, a simpler fix would be to disable the python module building :P
<james_w> no, that uses sysconfig.get_python_lib()
<joaopinto> james_w, hum, ok so I need to figure why it is using site-packages instead of the sysconfig return
<joaopinto> argh, it's the (0,0 on the get_python_lib()
<james_w> no, it's not is it?
<james_w> it may be different versions of python
<joaopinto> yup
<joaopinto> >>> sysconfig.get_python_lib(0,0,prefix='something')
<joaopinto> 'something/lib/python2.6/site-packages'
<joaopinto> >>> sysconfig.get_python_lib()
<joaopinto> '/usr/lib/python2.6/dist-packages'
<joaopinto> actually it's the "prefix" parameter
<james_w> yes
<joaopinto> there is a bug with get_python_lib(, assuming I am reading the docs properly
<joaopinto> "If prefix is given, it is used as either the prefix instead of PREFIX, or as the exec-prefix instead of EXEC_PREFIX  if plat_specific is true"
<joaopinto> I am not setting plat_specific to try, but setting a prefix will do so
<joaopinto> s/try/true
<joaopinto> james_w, 4 lines fix: http://pastebin.org/149302
<james_w> hmm, please push it to a bzr branch so that I can review a whole fix
<joaopinto> hum, I am not used with bzr for packaging, you just want me to import the entire source+debian dir to a bzr branch ?
<james_w> bzr branch lp:ubuntu/libuser
<james_w> make the changes, commit, push to lp:~joaopinto/ubuntu/lucid/libuser/fix-ftbs
<james_w> then propose for merging
<joaopinto> ok
<joaopinto> james_w, how I do I propose for merging ?
<james_w> joaopinto: bzr lp-open and then click the link in the page that opens in your browser
<joaopinto> hum, I didn't take care of the changelog
<joaopinto> hum, now that I look into the changelog
<joaopinto>   * debian/rules:
<joaopinto>     - Adapted python2.6, by changing site-package to $(call py_sitename_sh, $*)
<joaopinto> it was supposed to be fixed on the previous change
<joaopinto> james_w, I need to add a changelog entry and bumpt the version to ubuntu2 right ?
<james_w> yes
<joaopinto> grr, it uses dpath, is it a requirement to use the existing patch system for the configure patch ?
<joaopinto> dpatch
<james_w> yes
<joaopinto> grr, grr, grr :P
<joaopinto> james_w, propose to merge done
<joaopinto> james_w, do I need to poke someone else now ?
<james_w> joaopinto: so you have confirmed that the package will now build with your change?
<james_w> joaopinto: patching just configure is usually bad as changes may be overwritten as it is a generated file. You have confirmed that if it is regenerated it will retain this change or an equivalent one?
<joaopinto> james_w, yes, build & installed on lucid
<joaopinto> james_w, regeneration should be done with recent tools wich will override aclocal with a correct function to detect the python paths
<joaopinto> that was my initial approach
<james_w> ok
<james_w> where does the macro that is used come from?
<joaopinto> from the local alocal.m4
<joaopinto> the patch could also be extended to aclocal.m4 but that is also a file expected to be re-gerated
<joaopinto> ...generated..
<james_w> where does aclocal get that part from?
<james_w> aclocal is like a cached copy of macros from elsewhere
<joaopinto> hum, good question
<james_w> another way to ask would be what statement in configure.ac expands to include the thing you are patching?
<joaopinto> I assume it's AM_PATH_PYTHON
<joaopinto> which probably uses /usr/share/aclocal-1.11/python.m4 (from alocal-1.10)
<james_w> joaopinto: that file still uses prefix= here
<joaopinto> james_w, you mean configure ?
<james_w> /usr/share/aclocal-1.11/python.m4
<joaopinto> ah, hum, I didn't check the alocal.m4 after the regeneration
<joaopinto> james_w, aren't we spending too much time for such a simple fix ?
<james_w> you wanted to get it fixed
<james_w> joaopinto: why don't we just change the packaging to not expect the upstream build system to have put the file in site-packages?
<joaopinto> james_w, I want, as long it's a reasonable effort, I really don't see any risk with the current patch, and I can't see the advantage of further effort
<joaopinto> there are plenty of other things which I would like to do and I will not be able by spending more time on this package
<james_w> joaopinto: well, your patch could easily regress in the future
<joaopinto> james_w, I really don't care at this time, a better patch maybe provided when someone else as the time/interest to do so
<joaopinto> james_w, IMHO a future-concerned patch would regenerate the entire autoconf/automake/aclocal chain
<joaopinto> I did the cherry picked patch to make the review/approval easier
<james_w> well, you haven't convinced me that the regeneration would work, as it appears a regenerated file would produce the same code
 * james_w has a packaging fix. I'll test and upload after dinner
<joaopinto> james_w, uff: bzr branch lp:ubuntu/libuser && cd libuser && autoreconf && ./configure
<joaopinto> check the configure output for the detected python modules dir
<joaopinto> james_w, will you approve my merge ?
<james_w> no, I don't think so
<joaopinto> ok, thanks for your effort, I will try to find someone else willing to help
<joaopinto> what is the team/group that can approve an univer FTBFS patch ?
<joaopinto> how can I file a bug for a package which is not installable ?
<james_w> joaopinto: fix uploaded
<james_w> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/lucid/libuser/lucid/revision/11
<arand> joaopinto: Find the package in LP and report the bug there?
<blueyed> Is there a convenient way to try applying all debian patches to a source package, before trying to build it? just to see if they fail?
<blueyed> At best, something which incorporates info from what-patch and works with any patch system.
<james_w> ./debian/rules patch should work for the majority
<blueyed> ah. sure. thanks.
<blueyed> next one: what's the most convenient way to build from the current dir using sbuild, like sdebuild for pbuilder? Currently I "bzr builddeb -S" then "sbuild -A -d lucid ../*.dsc"
<james_w> dunno
<james_w> that's the way I use
<blueyed> ok. not too bad - but this could be one step IMHO.
<blueyed> What apt-caching mechanism are you using? I'm using apt-cacher-ng since a while, and it's really great to get the packages a lot faster when the first sbuild failed! :)
<joaopinto> james_w, will you be proposing your patch to fix the FTFBS package ?
<joaopinto> james_w, ah, it's already uploaded, thanks
<joaopinto> james_w, any idea on how long it takes to get built/available on the repository
<joaopinto> ?
<james_w> joaopinto: it's already built for some architectures: https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libuser/1:0.56.9.dfsg.1-1ubuntu3
<james_w> it's in NEW though, so will need to be checked and allowed in
<joaopinto> ok thanks
<micahg> directhex: do you have a PPA for the latest moon/moonlight?
<sebner> bdrung: don't forget to merge audacious-plugins or .. or ... or I'll file a bug! :P
<bdrung> sebner: don't panic ;) i was away for three hours. this gave audacious enough time to build.
<sebner> bdrung: right and br0ke on upgrade :P
<bdrung> sebner: time will cure the wounds :P
<directhex> micahg, nothing newer than in the archive. upstream's build system is painful enough without throwing svn snapshots into the mix
<micahg> directhex: k, someone asked for  a moon PPA, so I thought I'd ask
 * sebner hugs bdrung :)
<micahg> directhex: did upstream have any idea what is causing xul192 to crash with gluezilla?
<directhex> micahg, yeah, bad patch. i uploaded a fixed gluezilla earlier
<micahg> directhex: really, awesome :)
 * micahg will have to look
<bdrung> sebner: uploaded
 * sebner ^5 bdrung :)
 * bdrung ^5 sebner.
<bdrung> sebner: are you audacious user?
<sebner> bdrung: from time to time, yes
<bdrung> me, too
<sebner> bdrung: my main player is banshee but for quick audio stuff I use audacious :)
<bdrung> my main player is xmms2
<sebner> heh
<sebner> bdrung: any good?
<bdrung> just look at my debian qa page ;)
<bdrung> sebner: any good? what?
<sebner> bdrung: xmms2
<sebner> bdrung: gui gui giu
<bdrung> sebner: i control it mainly with my remote control and use xmms2-notify
<bdrung> sebner: lxmusic is quite promising. gxmms2 works (but doesn't look nice).
<sebner> bdrung: any difference to audacious?
<bdrung> gapless playback was my reason to switch.
<bdrung> IIRC
<sebner> ah Ic
<bdrung> and: cover support for flac files
<bdrung> xmms2-notify shows the covers embedded into the flac files
<bdrung> sebner: you remind me that i want to package xmms2-notify
<bdrung> damn, eclipse is still fucked up
<ajmitch> how badly broken?
<bdrung> some user have problems with xulrunner (freezing, etc)
<bdrung> and i cannot reproduce it
<sebner> bdrung: haha, glad to hear
<bdrung> sebner: glad?
<kliango> is it still possible to synch a universe packages with the appropriate version from unstable?
<sebner> bdrung: that I could remind you of something
<ajmitch> kliango: possible, depending on what changes there are
<bdrung> sebner: aha, that wasn't the response to eclipse
<sebner> bdrung: of course now! I will give eclipse a deeper test tomorrow, let's see if I can reproduce anythin
<bdrung> kliango: bug fix sync: yes
<kliango> is a bug report enough or is there a standard way for a request?
<kliango> bdrung^^^
<bdrung> kliango: a bug report is enough
<bdrung> kliango: ping me and it will be fast processed
<kliango> bdrung, thx, is this always possible or only until the release ?
<bdrung> kliango: until some days before the release. after that point you have to follow the SRU process. then you will cherry-pick fixes instead of syncing a version.
<kliango> bdrung, thx, i will do a rebuild to test everything works fine, then you will get an email
<bdrung> kliango: email?
<kliango> no?
<bdrung> kliango: just paste the bug links here in irc
<YokoZar> Is it still possible to do a sync request for a new version of a game?
<simon-o> YokoZar, I don't think so. which game and version?
<YokoZar> simon-o: Hedgewars made a new release and it's needed for online play (version 0.9.13) -- upstream says they were specifically targeting this release for Lucid too.
<YokoZar> simon-o: I could make another upload myself but I'd prefer to just use the Debian package
<bdrung> YokoZar: you need a FFe: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess
<YokoZar> bdrung: right right of course but would syncing be a good idea or would a normal upload just be the right solution
<bdrung> YokoZar: syncing/merging is preferred over a normal upload
<simon-o> YokoZar, see bug 555082. There's a discussion
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 555082 in hedgewars "new version 0.9.13 released ... ppp (pretty please package)" [Unknown,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/555082
<YokoZar> bdrung: Right, but at this point we've been frozen for a good enough period of time I'm worried we've diverged
<bdrung> YokoZar: make a diff of the debian directories and compare the sync to the normal upload
<YokoZar> bdrung: I'll make sure the debian version works right and put it in the bug report and then mark it as a FFE request
<bdrung> yes
<jpds> micahg: Ping.
<micahg> jpds: pong
<jpds> micahg: Hi, any idea why xul-ext-noscript has been removed from the archive?
<micahg> jpds: too fast of a moving target as they do a release about twice a month
<jpds> micahg: Hmm, OK. Shame.
<micahg> jpds: usually security fixes, so it really should be updated through -security often which is too problematicv
<micahg> jpds: I've been using the version frmo addons.mozilla.org without issue for quite a whil;e
<jpds> Would be nice if https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/lucid/+source/mozilla-noscript had such a message.
<micahg> jpds: https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mozilla-noscript/+changelog
<jpds> micahg: Aha, hmm.
<jpds> Thanks for the info.
<micahg> jpds: we might do an extensions PPA at some point, that seems the only sane way to do it
<joaopinto> is it acceptable for a package to generate/change an /etc file on it's postinst ?
<Nafallo> micahg: do you know if adblock-plus will be dropped as a package as well?
<bdrung> Nafallo: it will stay
<Nafallo> interesting
<sebp> hi, I tried to upload a package to my ppa, but if I run dput I get: Please select a .changes file to upload. Tried to upload: build
<sebp> I provide the .changes file, though
<domibel> hi, it would be nice if a motu could take care of bug #562609
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 562609 in slicer "Missing modules" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/562609
<blizzkid> Hi ppl, when packaging, in a control/rules file is it possible to have another package removed? "Conflicts" only indicates it conflicts apparently?
<micahg> blizzkid: http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-relationships.html
<bdrung> blizzkid: you want remove a package in debian/rules? it's possible to conflict with an package on build time.
<blizzkid> bdrung: let me clarify: if I install eg wicd, it'll remove network-manager. Now if I install my-own-package, it has to remove some-other-packge. Is that done through "control" or through "rules"?
<bdrung> blizzkid: in debian/control
<bdrung> conflicts
<blizzkid> bdrung: I guess automatic removal only works with apt-get/aptitude?
<domibel> bdrung, please fast process 562609
<bdrung> blizzkid: yes
<blizzkid> ok, thx bdrung, will try adding it to my ppa then to test ;)
<bdrung> blizzkid: already commented ;)
<blizzkid> bdrung: what? *confused*
<bdrung> domibel: already commented ;)
<bdrung> blizzkid: the last message was for domibel
<blizzkid> oh, ok :)
<bdrung> it's too late -> my brain needs a rest
<domibel> bdrung, thanks for taking care of this
<bdrung> domibel: can you test a sync and tranform the bug in a sync request?
<domibel> bdrung. a sync might break things, the provided patch is minimal and already included in unstable, i prefer the patch
<bdrung> k
<bdrung> domibel: but you have to add breaks & replaces, because you move a file from one package to another
<quidnunc> Can someone confirm for me that ifhp doesn't show up in the repositories (e..g apt-cache search)
<bdrung> quidnunc: confirmed
<quidnunc> bdrung: Is that expected?
<bdrung> quidnunc: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ifhp
<quidnunc> bdrung: What should I take away from that?
<bdrung> quidnunc: you see that it should be in lucid and that it wasn't removed
<bdrung> i am still confused
<bdrung> quidnunc: you might ask this question in ubuntu-devel
<quidnunc> bdrung: Will do, thanks.
<bdrung> quidnunc: i have no explanation why it's missing
#ubuntu-motu 2010-04-14
<micahg> can I get an FFe ack for bug 562660?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 562660 in dojo "[FFe] Sync dojo 1.4.2+dfsg-1 (universe) from Debian testing (main)" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/562660
<ajmitch> you'll probably need to add more info about why a new version is needed
 * micahg didn't realize there was a -e option for requestsync
<ajmitch> yeah, it even lets you fill in the reasons for a FFe :)
 * ajmitch used it yesterday for that
 * micahg knows for next time
<micahg> ajmitch: you think what I just posted was sufficient?
<ajmitch> it may be enough, being a security issue, but https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess calls for a diff og the changelog, build log, stating that you tested it
<ajmitch> hopefully they'll just wave it through as-is :)
 * micahg could do that...
<ajmitch> you'll need to subscribe ~ubuntu-release
<psusi> jdong, ping
<ScottK> micahg: FFe approved.
<micahg> ScottK: thanks
<zooko> Anybody want to reproduce a performance issue on Ubuntu for me? We have this detailed, repeated report from one Ubuntu user of superlinear runtimes for larger mutable files, but I can't reproduce it on my Mac laptop.
<zooko> My Ubuntu workstation died the other day. :-(
<zooko> Well if you are interested, it is http://tahoe-lafs.org/trac/tahoe-lafs/ticket/983
<micahg> ScottK: can you help me with something?  libnetx-java seems to be missing, but it shows up in LP
<micahg> ah, that was on the list of binaries to remove
<micahg> ScottK: unping
<zooko> http://tahoe-lafs.org/trac/tahoe-lafs/ticket/983#comment:15
<zooko> ^-- exact, complete instructions on how to reproduce this alleged performance issue
<zooko> Does not require non-command-line interaction with your computer!
<zooko> And as an added bonus you get to see that Tahoe-LAFS that everyone's been talking about.
<zooko> And I'm about to keel over from some sort of sickness, so join #tahoe-lafs if you have any questions. Thanks folks!
<RoAkSoAx> ScottK, could you take a look to: bug #562709, bug #562710, bug #562711, and bug #562712
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 562709 in cluster-glue "[FFe] Please sync cluster-glue from Ubuntu-HA PPA" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/562709
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 562710 in cluster-agents "[FFe] Please sync cluster-agents from Ubuntu-HA PPA" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/562710
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 562711 in heartbeat "[FFe] Please sync heartbeat from Ubuntu-HA PPA" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/562711
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 562712 in pacemaker "[FFe] Please sync pacemaker from Ubuntu-HA PPA" [Medium,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/562712
<StevenK> ne
<ScottK> RoAkSoAx: We don't sync from PPAs.
<ScottK> RoAkSoAx: What does Ivoks say?
<RoAkSoAx> ScottK, he told me to go ahead with the new packages
<RoAkSoAx> ScottK, ok I'll change the bug from Ubuntu-HA PPA to debian unstable, cause, that's where they got actually synced at first, though I applied some changes that have not reached the debian packages yet
<ScottK> RoAkSoAx: Are they new or updates?
<RoAkSoAx> ScottK, new upstream checkouts
<ScottK> OK.
<ScottK> I'll try and look a little later.
<RoAkSoAx> ScottK, awesome. thanks
<micahg> could I please get a sponsor ack on bug 562745
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 562745 in libnetx-java "Sync libnetx-java 0.5-2 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/562745
<zooko> Hm, I wonder if it could be a bug in Python 2.6. Seems unlikely.
<zooko> But I'm using py 2.5 on Mac OS X and can't reproduce it.
<RoAkSoAx> ScottK, ok just changed the title/descriptions of the bug reports :)
<ScottK> OK.
<ScottK> zooko: Can't you use 2.6 on your Mac?
<zooko> Yes, but not tonight. :-) I would have to install it, and this could disturb other parts of my system.
 * RoAkSoAx off to sleep. Good nite
 * zooko also goes to sleep.
<zooko> Good night!
<micahg> siretart: do you have time to sponsor the vlc fix?
<dholbach> good morning
<Ciemon> Morning all, just looking for some patching practice, does https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/548513 just need patching, there's one there to use?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 548513 in oem-priority "Some firewire disks not working under 10.04" [Critical,In progress]
<RAOF> Ciemon: The kernel isn't a particularly good place to look for patching practice - it's got quite a different patch policy.  And it'll take you in excess of 4 hours and 20GiB of disc to actually build a kernel package, too.
<Ciemon> Thanks :) Moving on....
<joaopinto> good morning
<ara> james_w, around?
<james_w> hi ara
<ara> hey james_w, lp:ubuntu-qa-tools is now ready to be built and upload to lucid
<james_w> ok, I'll get to it shortly
<ara> james_w, thanks!
<sebp> hi, I get the following error when I try to upload a package to my ppa with dput: Not a .changes file. Please select a .changes file to upload. Tried to upload: build
<sebp> I provided the .changes file, though
<sebp> any idea?
<james_w> sebp: what command did you run?
<sebp> james_w, dput gdd-ppa build gnome-dvb-daemon_0.1.17-0~ppa1~lucid1_source.changes
<james_w> what's 'build'?
<sebp> no idea, that's the error message I get
<james_w> well, why did you put 'build' there?
<sebp> ops, stupid mistake
<sebp> thanks a lot for pointing out the obvious :)
<siretart> micno, I'm at a conference right now
<persia> micahg ^^
<DmitryKurochkin> Hi all! I would like to update polygraph package for lucid with a new upstream release. It is a bugfix only release with no new features. How can I do that? Should I file a bug, attach a debdiff and look for a sponsor?
<persia> DmitryKurochkin: If you're sure it's bugfix-only, that seems the right path to me.
<DmitryKurochkin> persia: thanks
<DmitryKurochkin> Another question, why needs-packaging bug is non automatically closed with package initial upload? Here is the bug https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/415395 and here is a changelog of accepted package https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/lucid/+source/polygraph/+changelog.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 415395 in ubuntu "[needs-packaging] Web Polygraph" [Wishlist,Fix committed]
<persia> DmitryKurochkin: Because the bug isn't against the package, but against Ubuntu, and so launchpad-closes-bugs can7t find it.
<persia> It's an unfortunate limitation, but I'm not sure anyone has dug deep enough to figure out what would be required to fix it.
<DmitryKurochkin> how should I(?) close the bug correctly? Just change status to "fix released"?
<persia> DmitryKurochkin: Yeah, if it's been packaged and in the archives, set to Fix Released.
<DmitryKurochkin> closed it. Thanks again, persia!
<persia> DmitryKurochkin: Thanks for helping keep polygraph in Ubuntu in good shape
<c_korn> Rhonda: ping
<Rhonda> c_korn: http://packages.debian.org/wesnoth-1.8
<c_korn> Rhonda: you read my mind. thanks :)
<Rhonda> No, I read backlog. I still wonder why you want to put it on getdeb at all, though.
<Rhonda> â¦ or at least the part of backlog that contains hilights for me. :)
<joaopinto> he doesn't want it now :P
<joaopinto> oh it does
<joaopinto> :P
<joaopinto> erm, he
<c_korn> joaopinto: good morning :)
<Rhonda> c_korn: If you put it on getdeb, pretty please make sure that you track changes I do later to the package. I don't want to yet again receive bugreports about outdated sources that just got the upstream source updated but not the packaging work.
<joaopinto> Rhonda, lucid is providing 1.6.5
<Rhonda> â¦ or produce installation conflicts with the official packages.
<Rhonda> joaopinto: Yes, and maverick will provide 1.8 and lucid will receive a backport when maverick is open.
<Rhonda> joaopinto: 1.8 was just released two weeks ago, just for the record.
<c_korn> Rhonda: hm, we update the maintainer field and remove launchpad integration patches so bugs won't be filed against the official version.
<joaopinto> Rhonda, regular wesnoth user's can afford that delay, answering your question "why you want to put it on getdeb"
<joaopinto> Rhonda, right, which means we re two weeks late already :P
<Rhonda> joaopinto: Exactly. They _can_ afford that delay. :)
<ScottK> Rhonda: Is there a reason not to update Lucid?
<joaopinto> ops, can't :P
<ScottK> Generally for games I'm pretty free with FFe.
<Rhonda> c_korn: Doesn't help with people complaining on IRC or on the wesnoth forum. I'm not talking about people using reportbug or tools. :)
<Rhonda> ScottK: It's a completely new source package, it's not an update per se.
<Rhonda> But it would be swift if 1.8 could get shipped in lucid, too.
<ScottK> Rhonda: If it's in Debian proper, I'm open to a sync.
<joaopinto> and 1.8 is actually broken on Lucid, unless there is a patch on debian that helps :)
<ScottK> Rhonda: Are any new build-dep/depends needed?
<Rhonda> joaopinto: I highly differ there, to be honest. 1.6 multiplayer server support isn't going to get dropped before the next stable release after 1.8 is done. That is not 1.8.1 but 1.10 or such. :)
<Rhonda> ScottK: Yes, there are some new build-deps, and the packaging was _totally_ reworked in the sense that it's not possible to even ship 1.6 (the wesnoth package that's in the pool right now) and 1.8 - and people can even install them side-by-side. :)
<joaopinto> Rhonda, we have different views, we rely on upstream for release/qa management
<Rhonda> joaopinto: And that upstream would be me, too. So I would have to rely on â¦ me.  :P
<joaopinto> Rhonda, I mean still upper, the authors :P
<Rhonda> joaopinto: In what way is 1.8 actually broken on lucid? What do you refer to?
<Rhonda> joaopinto: â¦ which also involves me. :P
<ScottK> Rhonda: If you could look at if any other packages would need updating, then I think it might be good to get it in depending on how much other impact there is.
<joaopinto> Rhonda, mouse clicks don't works, might be sdl related
<persia> That's the SDL bug, for which there is a proposed fix.
<joaopinto> Rhonda, I read *stable* on wesnoth page :P
<joaopinto> brb
<persia> wgrant: Did you ever look at that more?  Should I just upload it?
<Rhonda> ScottK: I don't think any other package would need updating. It's just lua from what I remember and that should be in lucid proper already.
<joaopinto> persia, oh, so its affecting more games ?
<ScottK> Rhonda: In that case, I think an FFe and getting it in is reasonable.  If you'll file it, I'll approve it.
<persia> joaopinto: Dunno: it mostly gets reported about wesnoth.
<Rhonda> joaopinto: That's not 1.8 related, the same issue also is affecting the 1.6 part - and it's not wesnoth related, and also there is a patch for SDL available that persia somehow wants me to make the official decision statement for inclusion or such. ;)
<joaopinto> Rhonda, I don't know if it's 1.8 related, I just know it does not work
<Rhonda> ScottK: Sweet - I wouldn't have dared because with last release an update got turned down because I had some packaging rework in it and it got rejected because of that. Great!
<persia> I just want someone else to say "It's good" or be told "just do it".  Doing it because it seems like a good idea based on IRC backscroll strikes me as insufficiently carefull.
<joaopinto> argh, we are likely to have a broken SDL *again* ?
<Rhonda> joaopinto: ctrl-f for fullscreen, it works in there. The bug is "only" affecting windowed mode. And right-click and _then_ left-click is another workaround that works.
<persia> joaopinto: If you have time to test the patch in lucid against a variety of SDL apps, and want to confirm it ought be applied, it would be something that would make me apply it :)
<Rhonda> persia: I guess i can be your scapegoat, I really think that the drag'n'drop fix that triggered this issue is minor compared to this clicking issue.
<ScottK> Rhonda: I think different people on the release team may have differnt views.  My view on games is that the latest crack is almost always desirable.  Particularly in this case where the old version is still available.
<Rhonda> ScottK: Actually, it wouldn't be a FFe from what I understand, it would have to be an import freeze exception.
<persia> I agree in principle.  I'm just wary about uploading something I only half-understand when nobody else says "Yeah, that's good" :)
<ScottK> Rhonda: FFe can cover that too
<Rhonda> Ah, alright.
<ScottK> Rhonda: I'm also and archive admin, so I can cover those parts too.
 * persia will dig up the patch, verify against lucid wesnoth1.6 and upload shortly after finding a mouse
<Rhonda> ScottK: I'll postpone my approach to add alternative-handling into the wesnoth-1.8 package then. This is something that I can't test in time properly.
<ScottK> OK.  Thanks.
<wgrant> persia: I didn't, beyond confirming that the patch fixes it.
<wgrant> Uni has me reasonably busy at the moment.
<persia> Yeah, that's all I've done with it, and confirming that it doesn't break KVM.
<wgrant> IMO, upload away.
 * persia needs to find a mouse first
 * persia hunts more
<c_korn> Rhonda: if their bug is related to our package just point them to #getdeb or http://www.playdeb.net/contact/
<Rhonda> c_korn: That would be something needed to remember. %-)
<joaopinto> persia, I can test the sdl patch on wesnoth, I didn't found the problem on other games yet, I probably tested about 10 sdl games lately
<persia> joaopinto: We know the sdl patch fixes wesnoth.  If you've not found it anywhere else, that's good news.
<persia> joaopinto: But after I upload, getting feedback fom SDL users is important: please let me know if you hear of any issues.
<joaopinto> ah ok
<joaopinto> persia, do you know if the PA related problems are also fixed ? I mean those from jaunty
<persia> joaopinto: Which class of PA issues?
<joaopinto> hangs with 100% cpu
<joaopinto> that one affected several games
<persia> I never encountered that one.  Was it hardware-specific or client-specific?
<joaopinto> I didn't experienced yet, but this one was random
<joaopinto> not sure, let me try to find the master bug
<persia> That sounds hardware-specific then.  I know there have been *huge* efforts to fix all the ALSA bugs that made pulse go insane in 9.10 and even more in 10.04.
<joaopinto> bug 454879
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 454879 in libsdl1.2 "Applications using libsdl1.2-alsa randomly use 100% cpu and have broken sound playback" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/454879
<joaopinto> I am sure it affected more apps/people, less techie would not figure it out that it was SDL/PA causing the system freeze
<persia> If it was irreproducible, I strongly suspect SDL/PA/ALSA, but yeah.
<arand> Hmm, that's one that's been bothering me... Very random that one, generally happens more frequently after the system has been in use for some time, can be avoided for a while if respawning PA...
<joaopinto> arand, are you still getting it with lucid ?
<arand> joaopinto: Have not tested enough to tell...
<arand> I'll put that on a todo list.
<joaopinto> we should have some system for end users to report their feedback on applications usage during development
<joaopinto> right now there is no way to assess package testing in general
<persia> joaopinto: What sort of interface do you imagine beyond Malone?
<joaopinto> persia, a simple wizard that would show me a random list of packages that I have installed (if we could identify the most used even better), asked some simple rating about the package stability an dupload thata data somewhere
<joaopinto> something that could be used for people not directly involved in bug reporting/fixing, those already cover their used packages
<persia> We can identify the most-used, with popcon.
<persia> That does sound like a good idea.  Just needs some implementation.  I'd recommend looking at the popcon source and coordinating with cr3 who somehow got checkbox to be able to report to LP in a useful way.
<joaopinto> I guess that bug counts are so high these days that they are no longer an important QA metric
<joaopinto> and they don't provide "positive" data
<persia> The overall volume doesn't matter, really.
<persia> The issue is that we can't usefully distinguish between a good package with lots and lots of users and a poor package with very few users based on bug counts.
<persia> Doing someting like bugcount/popcon might generate some idea of which packages are buggiest, but that then isn't a good metric to use to figure out what needs fixing.
<nenolod> how does one get a package removed from ubuntu?
<persia> We end up mostly fixing bugs in packages with lots of users and lots of bugs, which is useful, but not necessarily optimal.
<joaopinto> with a rating system we could identify per user "satisfaction"
<persia> nenolod: File a bug against the package requesting removal.  subscribe the archive admins if you can upload that package, otherwise subscribe ubuntu-sponsors
<nenolod> cool.
<persia> joaopinto: Right.
<nenolod> i would like to remove audacious from ubuntu.
<persia> nenolod: Why?
<nenolod> it's lack of proper maintenance in ubuntu and the general attitude of the people who try to maintain it are offensive to us.
<persia> Surely that can be fixed in other ways, no?
<persia> Generally we only remove packages when they are superceded or hopelessly buggy, unmaintainable, and dead upstream.
<persia> I seem to recall you used to maintain it in Ubuntu fairly well: what changed?  Can that be fixed?
<nenolod> the reason why i attempted to fix the package was because we were getting an influx of ubuntu users bothering us (upstream) about the package
<persia> Hrm.  We appreciate you helping out of course, but we ought be a better buffer.
<persia> I know lots of folk use audacious in Ubuntu, so I'm not tempted to see it gone.
<persia> How do you think users could be provided with a good audacious, and not end up pestering you all the time?
<nenolod> by ensuring bdrung does not touch it any further.  we cannot work with him, he is far too abrasive.
<nenolod> his latest plan is to edit the artwork in the package because he does not like it.
<nenolod> if that occurs, we will be forced to place the artwork under non-free license in future versions.
<persia> bdrung: Um, why would we distro-patch artwork?
<ScottK> bdrung: If that's accurate, that's not appropriate.
<persia> nenolod: We specifically don't have maintainers in Ubuntu, so it's hard to say "This person should not touch package X".  That said, you'll get support if you need to avoid inappropriate changes.
<nenolod> thanks.
<persia> nenolod: So, setting aside the personal issue (and I suspect there's history, but don't think we need to rehash now), are there pending changes that you think need to be in Ubuntu to make sure the audacious experience for lucid matches what you'd like to see in a distribution?
<nenolod> persia, i understand that, but patching the audacious logo to fit better into a dark background is not really a desired or appropriate change
<persia> Agreed, especially since my memory is that audacious has fairly broad theme support, and can be rethemed with ease if there is a need/desire to change the theme on a per-distro or per-flavour basis.
<nenolod> oh, this is the icon for the status icon plugin.
<persia> nenolod: Is that not themable?
<nenolod> persia, 2.3 is fine as it presently stands.  the icon being distro-patched is not something we find desirable
<nenolod> persia, no, it is not presently themable.
<persia> Does it look terrible with the lucid default themes?
<kklimonda> it does look bad with the radiance theme
<kklimonda> ambiance*
<persia> Ugh.  That's annoying then.
<persia> nenolod: Can it be made themeable?
<wgrant> Most notification area and indicator icons should be monochromised.
<wgrant> (ideally in the theme, though)
<bdrung> persia: i just asked this question: is it intended to have a small white border around the black circle of the audacity logo: http://de.tinypic.com/view.php?pic=6sujo2&s=5 ?
<persia> kklimonda: Do you happen to have a handy screenshot?
<nenolod> as i said, if the icon is modified, it becomes non-free in 2.4
 * nenolod isn't playing this game
<kklimonda> persia: sure, give me a sec
<segler> hi, i am searching for help. i need a motu to upload my feature freeze exeption accepted package to universe, please. https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/rhythmbox-radio-browser/+bug/544416
<persia> nenolod: As I said before, it's inappropriate to modify your artwork.  I won't support that.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 544416 in rhythmbox-radio-browser "new upstream release" [Wishlist,Confirmed]
<persia> nenolod: That said, if there's a way to add theme support, I'd like to enable that, if it otherwise looks bad (but let's wait for kklimonda's screenshot).
<persia> nenolod: So, I don't encourage you to make the artwork non-free: it's not going to make any useful difference to my opinion (because I don't want to modify your artwork), but it does make it hard to distribute.
<joaopinto> nenolod, I am not an ubuntu developer but I am an open source developer and let me tell you, regardless of the reasonably of bgrunts changes, you threat is not respectful with the free sofware spirit
<azeem> nenolod: wow, you'll get the mako Hill Schily award for "excellence in being upstream" then
<kklimonda> http://syntaxhighlighted.com/~kklimonda/audacious/
<kklimonda> persia: ^
<bdrung> the questionable file is: pixmaps/audacious2.png
<persia> nenolod: That said, if there's some reason it cannot be made themeable, or there's a good reason not to make it themeable, I can support that.
<persia> kklimonda: Thanks.
<Laney> Ciemon: I'm going to upload your branch now, good work!
<persia> kklimonda: That looks a lot like bdrung's icon to me.  Is that the modified one, or the upstream one?
<bdrung> persia: grab the source -> pixmaps/audacious2.png
<nenolod> that is the upstream one
<bdrung> persia: i did not modify anything
<nenolod> patches are accepted to make the icon themeable
<persia> nenolod: Cool.  In that case, if it ends up being consensus that the icon doesn't work with the Ubuntu theme, we'll send you a patch for that.  We will not modify your artwork.
<nenolod> joaopinto, i'm sorry but i'm not involved in this "free software" movement, because it produces things like http://www.boycottnovell.com/
<nenolod> joaopinto, therefore i could care less if GPL zealots are butthurt
<azeem> nenolod: please refrain from personal attacks in here
<azeem> you#re supposed to follow the Code of Conduct
<joaopinto> nenolod, open source software freedom is not about license restrictions or enforcement, you clearly fail to acknowledge that
<persia> Let's not make this a discussion about philosophy.
<persia> We have a package that needs attention.  Let's focus on that.
<nenolod> i fully agree that the audacious icon does not fit those themes and should be modified, however
<nenolod> it should be modified in a way that does not distro-patch the package
<azeem> that's not your call
<kklimonda> ugh..
<Rhonda> Why doesn't the black circle just fade into alpha channel but fade into white?
<persia> nenolod: That may be tricky.  That said, if we end up with a patch, we'll definitely send it to you for comment/consideration, and appreciate any guidance on improving it (and will hope to see you adopt it).
<nenolod> Rhonda, ask whoever made the thing
<persia> I see an alpha channel.  What am I missing?
 * persia is looking at pixmaps/audacious2.png from the source.
<azeem> maybe the code is setting a background before rendering it?
<Rhonda> nenolod: But you seem to defend that this icon is appropriate - or I'm not really getting what you are offended with when someone else makes that happen.
<Rhonda> nenolod: â¦ actually noone _did_ the change, there was just a question _wether_ the change was acceptable - which actually wouldn't even be needed. bdrung just asked, he didn't make any change?
<nenolod> Rhonda, what i am against is distributions pointlessly modifying audacious because then *I* have to deal with the brunt of audacious users in ubuntu who ask me about your patches.
<Rhonda> nenolod: I wonder why you consider it pointlessly when you don't even know why it's that way? That sounds strange to me â¦
<nenolod> Rhonda, ubuntu has applied plenty of patches to audacious in the past which have broken core parts of the application
<persia> nenolod: Understood.  We have no desire to pointlessly modify it.  We would like to work with you to ensure the audacious experience in Ubuntu is ideal.
<Rhonda> nenolod: Please don't distract - this seems to be a completely different and hopefully seperate issue.
<nenolod> nobody contacted us when bryce harrington applied 6 patches (which were already fixed in newer versions)
<joaopinto> I think it should be clear that patches are accepted based on technical merit while respecting legal rights and not on copyright threatening
<persia> nenolod: All of bryce's patches were already fixed upstream?  He ended up uploading those because he had submitted them 18 months ago, and nobody appeared to have reviewed them.
<nenolod> persia, we don't make point releases, and all of those subsystems were antequated vestiges of XMMS
<nenolod> therefore, they were fixed correctly, with a complete rewrite
<persia> nenolod: So, how can we better ensure patch sharing?  We don't tend to have anyone specifically as a contact for a package, which makes this tricky.
<Rhonda> nenolod: Actually, I fully understand where you are coming from. I package wesnoth for Debian (and thus Ubuntu) and got several users reporting issues by the packages in getdeb/playdeb and itwesnoth, which have very little to do with my work. I totally can understand that you don't like that. Though, patching an icon to work in every colored environment instead of only white doesn't play into that area, at all. At least IMHO. :)
<nenolod> Rhonda, i f'ing hate getdeb
<nenolod> Rhonda, i actually wrote a plugin for JIRA to automatically close bugs with the word GetDeb in them as invalid
<Rhonda> Actually I'm neither aroused by the quality they spread around. But we are again losing focus. :)
<joaopinto> Rhonda, there was no need to get getdeb into a different trouble :P
<nenolod> getdeb was already in trouble for years
<Rhonda> joaopinto: I know, they can do that on themself pretty well. ;)
<persia> Anyway, let's not get distracted.
<Rhonda> The point that I wanted to raise - even if you disagree with others doesn't mean that one should behave disrespectful to them.
<persia> We want audactious to be a good experience for Ubuntu users.
<joaopinto> nenolod, To be honest after seeing you threatening other people which trying to improve your own work I don't find your opinion respectful enough to debate it :)
<nenolod> and actually bdrung has done a lot to improve that.
<Rhonda> joaopinto: Actually, it isn't even nenolod's work. "ask whoever made the thing"
<persia> So it looks like we have 2.3.0 upstream and 2.3-1ubuntu1 in lucid.
<persia> and we have an issue with an icon.
<nenolod> joaopinto, i have not threatened anyone.  i have simply said that i will separate the audacious artwork and release it under a creative commons license.  really, the artwork needs to be separated anyway.
<joaopinto> Rhonda, work as in the product, as far I understood the goal is  to make audacious more appealing to users
<persia> And the issue with the icon appears to be that it has a white background, rather than an alpha channel background.
<azeem> nenolod: you said non-free
<persia> Does that match everyone's understanding?
<nenolod> azeem, yes.
<azeem> not creative commons
<nenolod> azeem, there are non-free CC licenses.
<azeem> if that helps getting audacious removed from Debian, I'm all for it
<Rhonda> azeem: Not all CC is free.
<azeem> I know
<nenolod> azeem, if you want audacious removed from Debian, file the request for removal
<azeem> I don't care that muhc
<azeem> much*
<persia> Let's not go for removal.
<persia> We can sort this in better ways.
<nenolod> note that audacious in Debian isn't the problem
<azeem> nenolod: I was talking the other way round
<persia> nenolod: bdrung: kklimonda: Rhonda: Do you all agree that the issue is that the icon should use alpha-channels?  Do you think the best way to do this is to submit a change upstream, or to implement theme support?
<azeem> if an upstream threatens to take stuff non-free, maybe it's not in Debian's best interest to ship it
<azeem> but I'm getting off-topic
<persia> azeem: Indeed.
<nenolod> ah yes, ubuntu is flexing it's control of debian again
<nenolod> nice
<persia> nenolod: No, there is no control.  Several folks happen to be involved in both Debian and Ubuntu, that's all.
<kklimonda> persia: I see that status icon already uses a icon from theme and only falls back if it can't find it. I wonder if we couldn't just distribute "our" icon in the ubuntu-mono package.
<Rhonda> persia: I always agree with submitting patches upstream instead of keeping them just in a distribution. And if I'm not mistaken, that's even part of the CoC. ;)
<nenolod> kklimonda, that does sound like a good solution.
<persia> Rhonda: It is: the question is whether to work with nenolod on an icon change or on theme support.
<nenolod> persia, theme support is actually there
<persia> nenolod: Sorry, I thought it wasn't from what you said before.  If there's theme support, then just adding the icon to the ubuntu-mono theme is definitely the solution.
<Rhonda> persia: That icon isn't part of a theme, to the best of my knowledge.
<persia> kklimonda: Would you mind running with that?
<persia> Rhonda: Yes, but that's easy to change :)
<nenolod> actually, the status icon uses an XPM file
<nenolod> not the png file
<joaopinto> Rhonda, afaik we getdeb had worked to resolve those packaging issues with you, please let me know the bug numbers which have not been properly addressed
<nenolod> ah
<nenolod> joaopinto, you're with getdeb!
<Rhonda> nenolod: It has nothing to do with Ubuntu when azeem says that if audacious turns to use non-free license for the artwork then Debian won't be able to ship the package (in main). That's just pointing out the results that your move would make, nothing more, nothing less.
<nenolod> joaopinto, please stop publishing audacious packages, they are really a nightmare upstream
<bdrung> persia: yes, i think that it's an issue with the alpha channel.
<nenolod> bdrung, it's an XPM issue.
<nenolod> bdrung, XPMs do not have alpha channels.
<persia> Look.  We're not going to remove the package.  We have a strategy.  Let's not focus on what might have happened if we couldn't get along.
<Rhonda> nenolod: Oh, hmm. And XPM only have one alpha channel, not a scaled one. Now I see the actual issue.
<nenolod> exactly
<persia> Hrm.  This makes it trickier.
<nenolod> persia, i was referring to getdeb
<joaopinto> nenolod, they are ? we never got a complain, neither from developers or users
<nenolod> joaopinto, i'm a developer.  i'm complaining.
<Rhonda> nenolod: Would it be acceptable to you if the icon would be switched to png instead? :)
<nenolod> Rhonda, yes, that's fine.
<nenolod> Rhonda, it should anyway.
<joaopinto> nenolod, right, and you found the problem today...
<nenolod> joaopinto, no, we've been aware of getdeb for several years
<Rhonda> joaopinto: I'm happy to hear that - one thing was that you shipped all the campaigns in a single package and didn't add conflicts. Not sure if that is still the case these days. And I hope c_korn will try to follow my git repository for the packaging. :)
<joaopinto> nenolod, still you didn't had the time to report any of those problems, so they were not serious enough
<nenolod> joaopinto, we just haven't bothered to contact you, because we figured it would be a waste of our time.
<bdrung> i think the png file i affected, too
<nenolod> modify it then
<nenolod> but regardless
<nenolod> the icon should be monochromized
<persia> bdrung: The one in pixmaps/audacious2.png appears to have alpha channels in my image viewer.  Are you sure?
<joaopinto> Rhonda, that had a tecnhical reason, we were not using a repository at that time
<bdrung> persia: the icon in the menu is affected
<bdrung> let me check what we install
<persia> But that's the XPM.
<nenolod> no, the menu icon should be the .png ... oh right
<nenolod> *grr*
<nenolod> the debian package makes XPMs
<nenolod> for whatever reason i do not know
<bdrung> k, then i have to fix this
<lfaraone> In squeak, /usr/bin/squeakvm has been moved to /usr/lib/squeak/3.11.3-2147/squeakvm. The "etoys" package expects it to use the bin one. There is however a helper script in /usr/bin/squeak that accepts less options than squeakvm. Should I use the helper script in etoys, or how should I deal with the potentially changing path of the squeakvm application?
<azeem> because the Debian menu only takes/took spms
<azeem> xpms*
<joaopinto> nenolod, that is sad to know, you assume people don't care about problems :P
<persia> Can we change how audacious loads, so that it prefers .png to .xpm?
<bdrung> azeem: we could create a audacious32.xpm that do not interfere with the .png file
<kklimonda> persia: it falls back to xpm only if it can't find audacious icon in the current theme
<persia> lfaraone: I think the safest path forward would be to have the helper script in squeakvm accept more options and pass them to the real binary.
<nenolod> azeem, oh right
<Rhonda> nenolod: The Debian menu system requires xpm files. If there is a desktop entry though, that one can freely use the png file.
<persia> Lets do that then: not create an .xpm that gets picked up, and use the .png, which *should* get us alpha blending without needing a theme.
<persia> Rhonda: But if the two have the same name, and one autopicks, ...
<nenolod> the audacious_player.xpm is hardcoded into the statusicon plugin actually
<Rhonda> persia: Yes, but gnome should do the proper thing here.
<bdrung> nenolod: audacious detects only SSE on compile time and not on runtime, right?
<nenolod> that's an old XMMS vestige
<lfaraone> persia: okay, so I'll add a "-- [parameters to squeakvm]" to the spec?
<nenolod> bdrung, yes.
<nenolod> bdrung, so it should be disabled on i386.  all amd64 chips have it.
<bdrung> yes, that was my plan
<persia> lfaraone: That seems safest to be, and most likely to offer general support for 3rd party squakvm users.
<Rhonda> persia: The desktop entry should be without extension, and gnome picks up the png first. At least everywhere I looked myself.
<bdrung> nenolod: are there plans to detect it on runtime?
<nenolod> bdrung, no.
<bdrung> k
<persia> Rhonda: Last time I looked, openbox preferred xpms, but yeah, pngs are preferred most places.
<Rhonda> persia: And the xpm file is still required to not break the Debian menu. Please remember the pgadmin3 issue, I think you were involved in my rant back then. ;)
<persia> Rhonda: I agree the package should have an .xpm (go look at the set of bugs I filed in the BTS, and notice that > 50% of them included adding a .xpm file to the package), but there's no reason it needs to have precisely the same barename as the .png is that is shown to cause some runtime issue (as seen in this case).
<Rhonda> persia: It doesn't hurt neither.
<Rhonda> /usr/share/pixmaps/pgadmin3.svg
<Rhonda> /usr/share/pixmaps/pgadmin3.xpm
<Rhonda> :)
<kklimonda> persia: in case of the audacious it doesn't load xpm because it finds it in the theme - it loads xpm because it can't find "audacious" icon in the theme and falls back to /usr/share/audacious/icons/audacious_player.xpm
<kklimonda> ugh - it loads xpm not because it finds it in the theme*
<persia> Rhonda: for pgadmin3 (and very many packages) it doesn't hurt.  For audacious, I think it does, because of the xpm/alpha channel thing.  Very specific case.
<bdrung> we provide only audacious2.png files (note the 2 in there)
<kklimonda> the icon is called audacious2 and it's used for a desktop file
<nenolod> joaopinto, http://archive.getdeb.net/getdeb/ubuntu/pool/apps/a/audacious/audacious_2.2-1~getdeb3.dsc
<nenolod> joaopinto, it's missing.
<kklimonda> so we can't really change it to the monochrome icon as we'll change the application icon itself. we'll have to do the same we have done with other applications - create a patch that first tries to load "audacious2-panel"
<persia> It seems the audacious2.png used in the .desktop file is created by debian/rules.
<persia> nenolod: What's your thought on a patch that first tries to load audacious2-panel and then audacious2 ?
<nenolod> patch for what, specifically?
<nenolod> oh i see
<nenolod> that sounds fine.
<persia> Let's do that then: probably less invasive.
<persia> nenolod: Do you want that patch in JIRA, or should it be distro-specific?
<Rhonda> persia: If the xpm would be preferred to the svg the report wouldn't have got closed, to be honest. :)
<nenolod> i can handle it upstream
<persia> Rhonda: heh, yeah.
<lfaraone> heh. /usr/bin/squeak is in a huuuge single patch called "linex.dpatch"
<persia> nenolod: Cool.  Thanks.  Do you expect to do that soon, so we can cherrypick, or ought we generate a patch locally?  (we're running against release freeze soon).
<nenolod> audacious-plugins: William Pitcock <nenolod@atheme.org> default * 4426:822c842d471e /src/statusicon/si_ui.c: Look for audacious-panel before audacious when looking up icons in the icon theme.
<nenolod> go for it
<segler> hi, i am searching for help. i need a motu to upload my feature freeze exeption accepted package to universe, please. https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/rhythmbox-radio-browser/+bug/544416
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 544416 in rhythmbox-radio-browser "new upstream release" [Wishlist,Confirmed]
<bdrung> nenolod: persia: kklimonda: Rhonda: i took audacious2.png and placed it on a black background: http://de.tinypic.com/view.php?pic=2ps3mf6&s=5 can you confirm this result? if yes, then something is wrong with the alpha channel.
<nenolod> bdrung, i do see that in enlightenment's taskbar on e17
<lfaraone> sistpoty|work: uh, is there a rationale for the NUV? please post the changelog, so it can be deterined that it introduces no new features.
<lfaraone> segler: see above
<nenolod> that icon sucks anyway it should be converted to SVG
<lfaraone> sistpoty|work: oops, mishilite :)
<sistpoty|work> heh :)
<persia> bdrung: That looks clean to me.
<bdrung> nenolod: i would love to see a svg icon.
<segler> lfaraone: what do you mean?
<bdrung> persia: what do you mean with clean?
<persia> That I can read the 'a' and the background appears black, and not incedibly ugly.
<bdrung> the question is, if the icon should look like this on a black background: http://de.tinypic.com/view.php?pic=2r4gy7c&s=5
<bdrung> nenolod: ^
<Rhonda> bdrung: Yes, it doesn't fade into alpha channel but into white. nenolod did also confirm that he thinks that's an problem and could get fixed.
<persia> I see where I'm confused.  The alpha channel was around, but the fade was white.
<bdrung> i think that's the only issue.
<bdrung> can someone change the fade or do you, nenolod, want to do it?
<nenolod> bdrung, go for it.
<bdrung> i am not a graphics guru. i don't know how to fix it.
<lfaraone> segler: well, we only accept new upstream versions that do not include new features.
<persia> kklimonda: Do you know how?
<segler> lfaraone: it is already accepted, i only need someone to upload it
<kklimonda> persia: no, I'm more of a coder than a graphic designer :)
<lfaraone> ah, didn't read the rest of the bug :)
<persia> Pity.  Any artists about?
<jcastro> hi
<jcastro> persia: anything I can do to help wrt. audacious?
<sistpoty|work> what's the deal with audacious?
<persia> jcastro: Mostly we need an artist to fix the alpha-channel blending for an icon at this point, and we can get the fixed icon distributed upsteam and in Ubuntu.
<persia> jcastro: If you can source someone with skils to get that done, it would be lovely.
<jcastro> I can source! I need a bug or something with all the details the artist will need
<sistpoty|work> ah, k... thought things would have really gone wrong with the new upstream version, *phew*
<persia> bdrung: ADowe already have a bug for this?
<lfaraone> segler: you have to subscribe ~ubuntu-sponsors. I've done that for you.
<segler> lfaraone: thanks
<bdrung> persia: no
<lfaraone> persia: I just briefly reviewed some documentation on bash, does http://sprunge.us/jKVb?sh seem like what I should be adding to the script? ( and the associated manual page, of course)
<lfaraone> there is probably a better way to handle this.
<lfaraone> scratch that, http://sprunge.us/cZFZ?sh
<bdrung> i think i manage to work with gimp
<bdrung> no, still not perfect
<persia> bdrung: OK.  If you get stuck, jcastro will get you an artist.
<bdrung> jcastro: artist please
<persia> lfaraone: Something like that ought work, I think.
<jcastro> bdrung: I need a bug with requirements pls.
 * bdrung is only a hacker
<bdrung> jcastro: k
<jcastro> so I can assign it to someone
<jcastro> bdrung: I'll make it my priority
<lfaraone> persia: heh. this isn't made easier by the fact that /usr/bin/squeak is written in half-english, half-spanish
<nenolod> lfaraone, ouch
<bdrung> jcastro: bug #563043
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 563043 in audacious "audacious2.png alpha blending is wrong" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/563043
<bdrung> nenolod, persia: ^
<bdrung> jcastro: a svg version wouldn't hurt.
<bdrung> nenolod: should the svg icon look like the png one or do you plan to create a totally new one?
<nenolod> bdrung, just trace it with umm
<nenolod> what is that app
<nenolod> inkscape
<bdrung> nenolod: k
<bdrung> jcastro: if possible, a svg version is preferred
<jcastro> on it
<debfx> I just read that packages should disable the launchpad integration (hide the "report a problem" menu entry) for the final release. is that true?
<shadeslayer> i have a package which has .pot files,how do i build them with the package?
<shadeslayer> with the 3.0 format
<kklimonda> debfx: yes
<kklimonda> at least that's what I've heard too
<kklimonda> debfx: https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/desktop-lucid-bug-management
<shadeslayer> also,how do i build the docbook with the new format :)
<debfx> kklimonda: ok thanks, do you know the reason behind it?
<shadeslayer> ok more specifically i need help with  dh_installdocs :D
<kklimonda> debfx: not really but it's probably worth asking about
<shadeslayer> im reading the manpage but i need a bit of help ;)
<kklimonda> debfx: you can read more at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Specs/Lucid/BugHandling
<evilshadeslayer> yeah so any ideas guys?
<joaopinto> is anyone aware about the licensing issues with audacious plugins ?
<joaopinto> I am being threatened with DMCA, does the official package cover such concerns, bdrung ... ?
<kklimonda> debfx: also "users usually want to use the answer tracker to have somebody looking at their issue rather than report bugs"
<bdrung> joaopinto: no
<persia> joaopinto: What's the license issue?  Under what license are they distributed?
<bdrung> joaopinto: are you getdeb dev?
<joaopinto> <nenolod> joaopinto, the plugins collection contains plugins under many different license options.
<joaopinto> yes
<joaopinto> and I am being threatened to get a DMCA noticed for distributing it
<bdrung> joaopinto: we removed one plugin in the debian package
<persia> joaopinto: You have to grep all the files, and check what can be distributed.  My memory is that it needed a repack.
<joaopinto> ok, maybe I should compare it with the current lucid version
<nenolod> joaopinto, i want you to stop
<nenolod> joaopinto, providing audacious
<nenolod> joaopinto, in getdeb
<persia> joaopinto: How much patch are you carrying?  If none, ought we do a backport so you can share that?
<nenolod> joaopinto, is this really worth your time?
<bdrung> joaopinto: i recommend to pull the lucid version and to keep close
<bdrung> yeah, a backport seams a good idea
<bdrung> (after fixing the icon and the sse2 issue)
<joaopinto> nenolod, I don't like random persons violating free software policies, so yes, it does worth my time, is not about the package itself, is about the freedom which you are trying to restrict
<nenolod> hope you have a lot of money
<sebner> bdrung: WTH is this new Audacious GTKui player thing btw :)
<persia> joaopinto: Um, have you checked the licenses?  Lots of audio codecs end up being problematic to redistribute.
<bdrung> sebner: don't ask me, ask upstream ;)
<persia> joaopinto: As bdrung mentioned, some had to be removed in Debian.
<sebner> bdrung: upstream doensn't provide any changelogs or forums with information :P
<persia> joaopinto: So if getdeb isn't doing that, you're vulnerable (and you want to fix it).
<joaopinto> persia, the discussion was drove  for the DMCA, was the fact that getdeb drivers to much poor quality bug reports (which are not related to packaging), so I am not quite sure they are bing honest about the license issue
<persia> sebner: No, but upstream idles here and helps us deal with some classes of issue, so we oughtn't complain too much (live people are more precious than changelogs)
<nenolod> joaopinto, the USF plugin is not free software.  but it doesn't affect you.
<persia> joaopinto: For your own due dilligence, you need to check.  That something was removed in Debian is a strong indicator there is an issue.
<joaopinto> ok, I will
<bdrung> DEB_BUILD_ARCH is "i386" on x86?
<persia> I believe so.
 * persia checks
 * persia checks on a non-powerpc machine
<persia> bdrung: Yes.
<persia> (at least according to `dpkg-architecture -qDEB_BUILD_ARCH`)
<bdrung> great
<nenolod> sebner, audacious2 has modular frontends.
<nenolod> sebner, GTKUI is one of those frontends.
<sebner> nenolod: Ic, thx
<dupondje> its nice the newest audacious got into Lucid :)
<persia> dupondje: Thank bdrung and nenolod for that.
<dupondje> feel the love !!!
<dupondje> :)
<nenolod> actually it's ctaylor and bdrung
<lfaraone> If debian is not using a patch system for a package, and I need to modify it in Ubuntu, should I add such a system?
<persia> lfaraone: Generally not, but it depends on how Debian isn't using a patch system.
<persia> lfaraone: Check the diff: if there's really no patches at all (it's quite possible to patch without a patch system), check other packages with the same maintainer, to try to determine maintainer preference.
<persia> If there are patches in the diff (without a patch system), just stay with that model.
<lfaraone> persia: yep, they make changes directly it seems.
<persia> Then do it that way.
<james_w> anyone want to help with https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/lucid/+source/am-utils/+bug/509981 ?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 509981 in texlive-base "Please sync texlive-base 2009-7 (main) from Debian testing (main)." [Wishlist,Fix released]
<james_w> should be fairly easy changes and I will be on-hand to sponsor (preferably from bzr)
<persia> This usually happens when a maintainer has a private VCS and doesn't want to fuss with dealing with two different classes of patch management.
<sistpoty|work> james_w: debian-faq already has a debdiff at bug #531711
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 531711 in debian-faq "Please merge debian-faq 4.0.4+nmu1 (universe) from debian unstable (doc)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/531711
<sistpoty|work> (not too sure if it's correct though)
<james_w> sistpoty|work: cool, thanks, I'll take a look
<james_w> ah, don't worry, I've never been bothered with correctness
<sistpoty|work> haha
<lfaraone> persia: interesting, in /usr/bin/squeak it says "If the available arguments to start the squeak virtual machine have to be used, you should avoid using this script, and call the real virtual machine using squeakvm"
<lfaraone> persia: I could just have etoys use the same magic that the squeak script uses to find squeakvm.
<nigelb> bdrung, poke
<persia> lfaraone: That would be easier, yes.  The rationale for chaning the handler is to support random 3rd party scripts.  That's not a high priority.
<lfaraone> persia: okay. well, I tryed making the change and I can't seem to do it right, so I'll just fix etoys. :)
<jcastro> bdrung: can you attach the original icon to the bug please?
<persia> lfaraone: That seems reasonable :)
<jcastro> bdrung: kwwii found someone to do the work!
<bdrung> jcastro: icon added to bug #563043
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 563043 in audacious "audacious2.png alpha blending is wrong" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/563043
<jcastro> thank you sir!
<nigelb> bdrung, for the vlc, what did you need again?
<bdrung> nigelb: only the translation patch
<nigelb> its already there in the bug I believe
<bdrung> k
<nigelb> bdrung, sorry about the typo in the name.  I was at work and quickly rushing through my mails
<bdrung> nigelb: no problem
<bdrung> it was funny
<nigelb> I only noticed it now
<lfaraone> persia: mk, fixed in etoys right now at bug 561332, filed a separate wishlist bug 563164 asking for more magic in /usr/bin/squeak
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 561332 in squeak-vm "bad path to squeak virtual machine" [Undecided,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/561332
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 563164 in squeak-vm "squeak should accept additional command line parameters to be passed to squeakvm" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/563164
<persia> lfaraone: Good plan with the wishlist bug.
<lfaraone> (not fixed, rather "proposed for merging")
<lfaraone> persia: thanks. I should either learn bash at some point or convert /usr/bin/squeak to a Python script :)
<persia> lfaraone: The former is probably easier, as it introduces fewer dependencies on the package :)
<Ciemon> Laney: thanks, long may it continue :)
<c_korn> does someone know the bug+ of the SDL bug affecting wesnoth 1.8 ?
<sistpoty|work> c_korn: bug #528957
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 528957 in wesnoth "mouse button clicks not detected in windowed mode" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/528957
<jcastro> nenolod: ok so we're fixing the icon, what were your other concerns?
<c_korn> sistpoty|work: thanks
<sistpoty|work> yw
 * sistpoty|work heads home now... cya
<nenolod> jcastro, i think that was the general concern
<jcastro> ok, we've got someone working on it now.
<jcastro> when things like this come up just ping us and we'll fix it
<segler> hi, could somebody help me with uploading this package? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/rhythmbox-radio-browser/+bug/544416
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 544416 in rhythmbox-radio-browser "new upstream release" [Wishlist,Confirmed]
<nenolod> jcastro, i believe the icon was bdrung's concern
<segler> it already got accepted, i only need someone to upload it
<nigelb> Is it too late to sync something from debian?  not syncing causes 2 packages to be broken in lucid
<nigelb> the package in question ins epiphany-extensions
<nigelb> unless its synced, the current epiphany-extensions and epiphany-extensions-more would be broken
<hyperair> i don't think it's too late.
<hyperair> if it's a bugfix only thing, of course
<nigelb> its a new upstream release
<nigelb> which is whats giving me a little jitters about syncing
<hyperair> heh i see.
<hyperair> well talk to some ubuntu-release people.
<hyperair> that's what i do when i encounter situations like this
<nigelb> ah
<nigelb> lemme ask in #ubuntu-release then :)
<lfaraone> james_w: fixed issues with dropping @prefix@ in etoys, missed that.
<Rhonda> ScottK: Should I submit the FFe for wesnoth right on - upstream told me that there are two bugfixes that I should pull in and I'm starting to prepare 1.8-2. That will take me a few days though because of my baby. :/
<james_w> Rhonda: congratulations btw :-)
<nigelb> james_w, for what?
<james_w> a new arrival
<nigelb> james_w, core dev?
<james_w> no
<sebner> nigelb: baby
<nigelb> ooooh...
<nigelb> Rhonda, congrats :)
<sebner> Rhonda: from me too of course, so will you be at GLT next week?
<segler> hi, could somebody help me with uploading this package? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/rhythmbox-radio-browser/+bug/544416
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 544416 in rhythmbox-radio-browser "new upstream release" [Wishlist,Confirmed]
<segler> it already got accepted, i only need someone to upload it
<Rhonda> james_w, nigelb, sebner: Thanks. :D
<Rhonda> sebner: Yes, will be there - the small one though won't attend the conference. ;)
<sebner> heh
<sebner> Rhonda: good, to know, where can I find you then? :)
<Rhonda> Debian booth, grml booth, LPI booth and especially LPI examns (for most of the time probably). Oh, and keysigning of course.
<Rhonda> sebner: Did you sign up for keysigning yet?
<sebner> Rhonda: nah because I won't be able to be around until the signing party (~18.00) starts so I thought we two can do this alone
<mdeslaur> nhandler: Unfortunately, I need to cancel the packaging training tomorrow
<Rhonda> sebner: Sure, fits too. :)
<Rhonda> sebner: Bring enough slips of paper then, also for others. :)
<sebner> Rhonda: great :D you have to tell me what I have to do though xD
<Rhonda> sebner: Print your fingerprint onto it of course. ;)
<Rhonda> sebner: The rest is reading the manpage of caff and getting familiar with it (package signing-party)
<mdeslaur> james_w: I unfortunately need to cancel my package training session tomorrow
<james_w> oh, that's a shame
<james_w> mdeslaur: who did you talk to about setting it up?
<mdeslaur> james_w: sorry, but I just got home from emergency surgery :(
<james_w> ouch, get well soon
<mdeslaur> james_w: I think it was nhandler
<nigelb> mdeslaur, oh.. get well soon
<james_w> mdeslaur: don't worry about it, we'll take care of it
<james_w> thanks for letting us know, now go and rest :-)
<mdeslaur> james_w: thanks, and sorry...I'm looking forward to giving it in the future
<segler> hi, could somebody help me with uploading this package? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/rhythmbox-radio-browser/+bug/544416
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 544416 in rhythmbox-radio-browser "new upstream release" [Wishlist,Confirmed]
<segler> it already got accepted, i only need someone to upload it
<segler> please, i need someone to upload something for me, it is already approved. it is only a rhythmbox-plugin https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/rhythmbox-radio-browser/+bug/544416
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 544416 in rhythmbox-radio-browser "new upstream release" [Wishlist,Confirmed]
<segler> somebody out there? :)
<segler> i could still could use some help: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/rhythmbox-radio-browser/+bug/544416
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 544416 in rhythmbox-radio-browser "new upstream release" [Wishlist,Confirmed]
<cr3> if I want to debianize an upstream project, would it make sense to create a project in launchpad where to push branches and build packages?
<segler> hi again, i know you guys are really busy right now, some answer would be nice
<blueyed> just ask, segler
<micahg> mr_pouit: I don't like the new cpufeq applet
<blueyed> known? http://downforeveryoneorjustme.com/wiki.ubuntu.com - where to report?
<mr_pouit> micahg: mmh, "new"?
<blueyed> with a ubuntu-only package, the version should be -0ubuntu1 always, shouldn't it? re bug 544416 - which I'll sponsor in case segler asked here before already.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 544416 in rhythmbox-radio-browser "new upstream release" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/544416
<ajmitch> morning
<micahg> mr_pouit: maybe it was just me, I thought it required powernowd for some reason...I'll do some more research I guess, but the dynamic frequency changing doesn't seem to work right...probably not the applet's problem in any case, just coincidence...
<blueyed> ScottK: re bug 544416: I will upload 3.0.1 straight away, ok? - as 3.0.1-0ubuntu1
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 544416 in rhythmbox-radio-browser "new upstream release" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/544416
<blueyed> ^^ sry.. 548389
<ScottK> blueyed: As long as you've tested, fine.
<ScottK> Rhonda: A few days for Wesnoth is fine.  Since it's Universe we have pleanty of time.  I totally understand about children.
<ajmitch> ScottK: I assume you'll wave through the syncs that ~ubuntu-archive is subscribed to if they're not done by final freeze in a few hours?
<mr_pouit> micahg: xfce4-cpu{,-}freq-plugin aren't really maintained upstream anyway. So it's possible they don't work well =]
<micahg> mr_pouit: as long as I have you here, I was wondering why we didn't jump to xfce4-power-manager without hal...
<ScottK> ajmitch: "Final freeze" is really only at all final for seeded packages.
<ScottK> We've got ~10 days for Universe yet.
<ajmitch> I'll try not to touch too many seeded packages then
<RoAkSoAx> blueyed, tentative changes for nginx the index in /var/www: http://paste.ubuntu.com/414519/
<Laney> It won't affect my ability to do give-backs, will it?
<ScottK> Also, since I don't have shell access due to not being a Canonical employee, I can't actually do the sync's anyway.
<ScottK> Laney: No
<Laney> good
<Laney> there seems to be a backlog on the buildds so I'm not abe to get these haskell rebuilds done as fast as I'd like
<ScottK> Laney: Do be at least a bit careful.  The buildds are quite backed up at the moment.
<Laney> ;)
<ajmitch> ah, I didn't realise it *still* needed shell access :)
<ScottK> It does.
<mr_pouit> micahg: unfortunately, it depends on libxfce4ui, which is still in development (will be released with Xfce 4.8).
<ajmitch> how frustrating
<micahg> mr_pouit: ah, ok
<ajmitch> the rcbugs page still has a few packages to look at, I suspect
<mr_pouit> micahg: afaik, there is a package for that in the xubuntu-dev ppa if you want it
<Laney> ScottK: I imagine they will be freed up somewhat after the freeze
<ScottK> yes.  Things should slow down somewhat then
<micahg> mr_pouit: I was wondering if it might make power management better...I'll have to check out the dev PPA
<ajmitch> ScottK: we'll still be allowed to just push through new upstream versions which just fix bugs for the next few days without approval?
<Laney> Yes
<ScottK> ajmitch: For unseeded packages yes.
<ajmitch> great
<ScottK> The queue will be frozen, so they'll need a manual push.
 * ajmitch had someone asking about bug 531275, it needs a quick merge to do it
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 531275 in postr "New version needs packaging" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/531275
<Laney> ajmitch: *cough* fancy being a Debian sponsor?
<ajmitch> Laney: I haven't updated my sid VM for a week or so, so it may take a little bit
<ajmitch> what do you want uploaded?
<Laney> docky. See in #-cli
<Laney> we can wait for 'hex if you'd rather
<Laney> I just feel a bit impatient about this one
<ajmitch> probably best, since I don't have git-buildpackage & co setup properly in the vm, it's all arcane magic :)
<Laney> ooer
<ajmitch> yeah
<ajmitch> tips on setting that up properly for sponsoring would be nice at some point :)
<Laney> I don't think there are any tricks, just install it and make sure your user.name and user.email are set
<Laney> then git-buildpackage --git-tag{,-only} when you upload
<Laney> but others would obviously know better
<keffie_jayx> hello guys
<ajmitch> as long as that'd automate generating the orig.tar.gz & preparing something useful for upoad
<Laney> yep
<keffie_jayx> I am trying to package something from scratch, the tarball is name satanas-Turpial-1fe9fa5. the source tarball should have the same name?
<Laney> providing you have pristine-tar branched
<keffie_jayx> eventhough it is a branch name and a revision number?
<ajmitch> Laney: it's those little gotchas...
<Laney> indeed
<Laney> but if you want to do it, come to #-cli and we'll hand hold you for the first couple of goes
<ajmitch> eep, 872MB of sid updates, I forgot it's been awhile since I touched that
<ajmitch> this may take some time :)
<ajmitch> keffie_jayx: having a revision like that in the version name may not be sensible
<ajmitch> given that it probably won't be an increasing revision number like with svn
<Laney> there are schemas for git version names
<Laney> 0~gitDATE+rX+shorthash
<Laney> where x is an increasing number
<keffie_jayx> and the x increases how?
<Laney> if you have to make more than one upload on a given day
<Laney> then increase it from 0 to 1
<keffie_jayx> right
<Rhonda> hmm. I have issues with calling requestsync.
<keffie_jayx> source package would then be turpial_1.0_b1~git20100414+r0+??
<ScottK> Rhonda: What's the issue?
<keffie_jayx> or turpial_1.0_b1~git20100414+r0+??.orig.tar.gz
<Rhonda> E: No credentials found for 'ubuntu-dev-tools', please see the manage-credentials manpage for help on how to create one for this consumer.
<Rhonda> ScottK: Do I have to configure it somehow before I use it first?
<ajmitch> Rhonda: see the end of that manpage
<ScottK> Rhonda: You can either follow those instructions or submit via gpg signed mail.
<ScottK> The man page for requestsync gives you the flag for doing it by mail.
 * ScottK has never tried the Launchpad way
<Rhonda> Is the wiki down currently?
 * ajmitch really really felt like stabbing requestsync the other day - turns out that it'll happily try ipv6 by default before ipv4
<micahg> ScottK: it's cool, it checks your package upload rights
<ajmitch> 10 minutes of wated time per sync trying to connect to packages.debian.org before I setup an ipv6 tunnel :)
<blueyed> when you're waiting for a reply, please resend, computer locked up.
<jpds> ajmitch: Is that not always the case?
<ScottK> micahg: The email one used to do that before it was crippled somehow.
<ajmitch> jpds: possibly, but it took about 5 minutes to timeout per ipv6 address tried
<micahg> ScottK: I thought the email one just asked you if you have rights
<ScottK> I suspect we're being 'encouraged' to use the launchpad way.
<ScottK> micahg: It does now.  That wasn't always the case.
<keffie_jayx> is there any guide I could follow that could help me through packaging naming convention for sources from version control like git
<blueyed> persia: re ubuntu-sponsors.. how to ask those for main then in particular? or is only u-u-s deprecated?
<Rhonda> ScottK: Acutally I wonder wether I should just turn bug #557696 into the FFe as additional reasoning. ;)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 557696 in wesnoth "upgrade-request: version 1.8 released" [Wishlist,Won't fix] https://launchpad.net/bugs/557696
<keffie_jayx> i am sure renaming the source package to what I think is not aceptable right?
<ScottK> Rhonda: That looks sensible.
<keffie_jayx> the tarball I mean
<RoAkSoAx> ScottK, I was re-checking the dropping of python-dev build-dep for pacemaker, and they also use it on RPMs to build, so I'm unsure if I should go ahead and drop it or keep it
<RoAkSoAx> blueyed, tentative changes for nginx the index in /var/www: http://paste.ubuntu.com/414519/
<persia> blueyed: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2010-February/030194.html
<blueyed> RoAkSoAx: thanks, I've got that, but had not looked at it. will do.
<ScottK> RoAkSoAx: If you aren't compilling C code into a Python extension then you  shouldn't need the -dev.
<Rhonda> Hmmm, who was to be subscribed again? Unfortunately the wiki.ubuntu seems to be down for me. :(
<ScottK> blueyed: Note that Red Hat's python-dev split may be different than ours.
<RoAkSoAx> blueyed, i'll be uploading it to my ppa and start testing
<ScottK> Rhonda: Just ping me when you've got the bug fixed up.  I'll deal with it.
<Rhonda> ScottK: If it won't be too much bother I would like to request 1.8-1 now and when I manage to get 1.8-2 ready request the update then again. As sort of save net. :)
<RoAkSoAx> ScottK, right. So how would I check if there's compilation of C code into Python extensions?
<ScottK> Rhonda: That's fine.
<ScottK> RoAkSoAx: Look at the source and see or test build without -dev and see if it explodes.
<Rhonda> ScottK: I think I adjusted the subject correctly, can you look?
<RoAkSoAx> ScottK, well it builds without the -dev but I'm waiting for it to build on PPA to test if it works after dropping the dependency
<micahg> could I get a MOTU to respin IA64 on miro please: https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/miro/2.5.4-1ubuntu2
 * persia presses the shiny button
 * ScottK looks
<c_korn> can someone please test this code http://paste.debian.net/68889 and confirm that it gives this error http://paste.debian.net/68891 ? (I opened the bug with this bug_id just for the purpose of modifying)
<persia> micahg: Just as a side note, the ia64 queue is long enough that you'll need a buildd-admin to reprioritise if you want it done before release.
<micahg> persia: as long as it gets done at some point, I guess I don't care
<micahg> persia: 3.0 or 3.0.1 might supersede by then
<persia> micahg: The queue is currently at 7 days, and any new uploads take precedence over any rebuilds by default.
<micahg> persia: thank you
<ScottK> Rhonda: Approved.
<micahg> persia: yep, that's fine, my guess is not too many people on that arch are using it anyways
<Rhonda> ScottK: \o/
<ScottK> Rhonda: Now we just need a kind archive admin with shell access like james_w perhaps to do the sync.....
<blueyed> micahg: I'm working on miro 3.0.1
<micahg> blueyed: I know :)
<blueyed> ok.. just catching up.
<james_w> ScottK: package name and lp id of the requester?
<blueyed> persia: re sponsors, ok.
<james_w> could someone possibly testbuild and upload miro?
<blueyed> james_w: on the run.
<james_w> I can't install xulrunner in my build chroot for some silly reason
<ScottK> james_w: wesnoth-1.8 from experimental.  Rhonda: What's your LP id?
<james_w> blueyed: you're already uploading it?
<blueyed> james_w: 3.0 is in my ppa already (should be)
<blueyed> james_w: testbuilding
<persia> blueyed: So, do you want to join ubuntu-sponsors?
<blueyed> sure
<james_w> blueyed: you have upload permissions?
<ScottK> james_w: LP ID is rhonda
<blueyed> james_w: how do I know? ^^
<persia> blueyed: You do.  You have for a long time.
<Rhonda> james_w: Like ScottK said, surprisingly enough. ;)
<james_w> thanks
<lfaraone> For SRUs, if we're creating a new ubuntu delta we use ubuntu0.1, right?
<RoAkSoAx> persia, btw.. now that you are talking about ubuntu-sponsors... please add me too :) lp: andreserl
<persia> RoAkSoAx: OK.
<RoAkSoAx> persia, thank you :)
<james_w> blueyed: then please be more explicit when requesting reviews using bzr
<ajmitch> I think I'm still a member of ~ubuntu-sponsors, indirectly
<james_w> blueyed: I assumed you needed sponsoring
<ScottK> persia: Sounds like ajmitch just volunteered too.
<persia> ajmitch: You are, but none of the memberships in the teams that grant indirect membership are being renewed.
 * micahg needs things sponsored :)
<persia> ajmitch: If I add you, will you sponsor something?
<blueyed> I'm via motu, too. And cannot apply manually: persia, please add me, too.
<ajmitch> persia: I've been sponsoring a few changes in the last week or two
<persia> blueyed: It's not via MOTU, but I'm adding you.  Please wait for me to dig through the LP interface :)
<persia> ajmitch: I'll add you directly then :)
<blueyed> universe sponsors (motu) ;)
<james_w> Rhonda, ScottK: please ack: http://paste.ubuntu.com/414532/
<blueyed> persia: wow. that could get done with a single db query prolly for all ;)
<micahg> persia: will the meeting on the 27th be an ok time to apply for MOTU or will it be too busy?
<ScottK> james_w: That's the one
<ScottK> james_w: #557696  if you want to add it.
<ScottK> I'll do it manually if not
<micahg> ajmitch: would you like to sponsor vlc for me?
<persia> micahg: Hard to say: depends on how much administrative stuff we have.  I suspect admin will be light, so we'll end up with time for several candidates.  An exact number is hard to predict.  Worst case, you end up at the top of the queue for the following meeting.
<micahg> persia: k
<james_w> ScottK: I can do it, but just wanted a check I was doing what was requested
<ScottK> james_w: OK.  Thanks.
<Rhonda> james_w: Looks proper, yes.
<james_w> synced
<james_w> ScottK: can you handle NEW?
<Rhonda> cheers :)
<ScottK> james_w: Yes.
<james_w> or will it timeout due to the large size?
<Rhonda> cat /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu0/cpufreq/scaling_max_freq | sudo tee /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu0/cpufreq/scaling_setspeed  # maybe my wesnoth compile finishes earlier now
<ScottK> james_w: For New, it's the number of items in the package history, not the size of the package that seems to drive timeouts.
<ScottK> If it does, I'll ask for help.
<james_w> ah, ok
<james_w> I can get source actually
<james_w> it will just be if binaries make it through soon, as I'll be off shortly
<ScottK> OK  Great.  I'll keep an eye out for them.
<james_w> ok, waved through
<ScottK> Although as backlogged as the buildds are, I suspect you;ll be back well before the binaries are ready.
<james_w> heh
<ScottK> Great.
<ScottK> Rhonda: There you go.
<james_w> right, uploaded and sponsored everything on my plate, so I'm calling it a day on final freeze
<james_w> have fun everyone
<blueyed> james_w: wiki is down. how do I go on uploading now? (via builddeb plugin)
<ScottK> blueyed: How is a wiki related to uploading?
<blueyed> ScottK: documentation.. :)
<blueyed> the miro upload
<Laney> bzr bd -S ... do the normal thing
<Laney> then bzr mark-uploaded; bzr push lp:ubuntu/XXX
<ScottK> Laney: Actuall it's -S -- -sa IIRC
<ScottK> ...y
<Laney> depends what you want to do, but yes indeed you can pass extra flags in
<blueyed> yes.
<blueyed> the last push to the bug ID? or package name?
<Laney> package name
<ScottK> Since it's a new upstream, it needs -sa
<Laney> I presume it's a merge, so yes
<Laney> and -v then
<nhandler> mdeslaur: Thanks for the heads up. Hopefully we can reshedule you once you have time to recover
<nhandler> Are there any developers who might be willing to fill in for a Packaging Training session tomorrow?
<blueyed> Should have done debcommit, shouldn't I?
<blueyed> Now I've missed the "-v" to bd even.
<blueyed> should I reupload for finxing the changelog in changes to include all changes?
 * ajmitch wishes the wiki would work properly
<ajmitch> nhandler: sorry, 6AM local time is a bit too painful for me :)
<nhandler> ajmitch: We could change the time if necessary
<ajmitch> I don't feel confident that I'm familiar enough with everything again to be able to give a session
<james_w> nhandler: I could do it actually
<james_w> what time was it scheduled?
<ajmitch> 1800 UTC
<james_w> not great, but can probably swing it
<nhandler> james_w: Like I said, we can change the time
<james_w> nhandler: yeah, better if we don't though
<james_w> nhandler: yeah, can we move it 3 hours earlier?
<nhandler> james_w: Sure. What topic do you want to present?
<james_w> bzr!
<james_w> "Fixing an Ubuntu bug with bzr" is not the most imaginative title, but the best I can do right now
<james_w> where should I update?
<nhandler> james_w: Everything is updated. Thanks a lot!
<james_w> wow
<james_w> you rock
<james_w> thanks nhandler
<nhandler> james_w: Thank *you*.
<nhandler> I'll get a little publicity work done for it later today
<james_w> nice
<kklimonda> hmm.. is UI Freeze only for packages from main?
<james_w> kklimonda: it's for the assistance of the doc teams and the like, so the less likely it is to be documented somewhere then the less it applies I guess
<ScottK> There are Universe flavors that have documentation too.
<kklimonda> ok, thanks - that makes sense
<james_w> ScottK: yeah, I don't think I claimed there weren't?
<ScottK> james_w: No, I was trying to amplify your statement, not contradict it.
<james_w> ScottK: sorry, misunderstood then
<ScottK> james_w: I could have put it more clearly.
#ubuntu-motu 2010-04-15
<keffie_jayx> guys could anyone help me check why a package fails to build a source pacakge? http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/414593/
<RoAkSoAx> keffie_jayx, it seems because you are using a T in CAPS instead of lowercase somewhere.
<ScottK> keffie_jayx: Probably in debian/changelog
<keffie_jayx> mmm ok
<keffie_jayx> debian/control
<keffie_jayx> source=Turpial
<keffie_jayx> I think that is it
<micahg> directhex: we need the gluezilla patch in Ubuntu for sure
<micahg> directhex: s/gluezilla/GRE
<keffie_jayx> yep that was ir
<keffie_jayx> thank RoAkSoAx ScottK
<directhex> micahg, that's what broke it
<micahg> directhex: I got it working
<directhex> i did too, by removing the patch entirely
<micahg> directhex: yes, but in that case, it uses the first GRE it finds which we don't want it to do
<directhex> is it really the end of the world if it uses 1.9.1 when you have 1.9.1 installed?
<micahg> directhex: 1.9.3 is the problem
<directhex> howso?
<micahg> directhex: crashes
<directhex> with 2.4.3-2 ?
<micahg> directhex: yes
<micahg> without the GRE patch
<directhex> sigh
<directhex> this totally needs rewriting to use webkit instead
<directhex> this is with 1.9.3 only installed, no 1.9.2?
<micahg> directhex: no, with both 1.9.3 and 1.9.2
<directhex> are there 1.9.3 packages for karmic anywhere?
<micahg> directhex: mozilla-daily PPA
<directhex> tbh if it's crashing, you should post on mono-devel list. that's likely your best place for responses. i don't think your timezone and portugese timezone are entirely compatible
<micahg> directhex: I'm ok with the timezones...
<micahg> they're 6 hrs ahead of me
<directhex> it's gone 1am there though, so i doubt andreia is about
<micahg> directhex: I can try in the morning
<directhex> indeed
<directhex> also shana on gimpnet #mono. or @sh4na on twitter
<micahg> directhex: k, will have to try in the morning
<IntuitiveNipple> Anyone available to look at a universe package upload (no response to subscribing sponsors so far) ?
<keffie_jayx> pbuilder fails, could the archive for pulling dependencies be down? http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/414600/
<IntuitiveNipple> keffie_jayx: It's a 404 not found error: possibly the package version being requested has been superceded. You probably need to a pbuilder update before trying to build the package.
<keffie_jayx> IntuitiveNipple: I have just updated pbuilder
 * keffie_jayx updates again
<IntuitiveNipple> keffie_jayx: Maybe the mirror you're using hasn't synced yet? check it manually using a browser to see what's there
<keffie_jayx> thanks
<keffie_jayx> I am updating again and removing that mirror from /etc/pbuilderrc
<ajmitch> if it has 2.6.4 in its package listing for lucid, it's quite out of date
<keffie_jayx> http://ve.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/main/p/python2.6/
<IntuitiveNipple> keffie_jayx: Looking in that mirror, 1ubuntu1 isn't there:
<keffie_jayx> yep
<IntuitiveNipple> keffie_jayx: nor is 0ubuntu2
<keffie_jayx> what mirror do you recomend?
<keffie_jayx> plain archive?
<IntuitiveNipple> But there are *later* versions of those packages
<IntuitiveNipple> so that seems to imply that the Releases files fetched/used by the pbuilder are out of date in some way...not sure I understand how. I *assume* the package you're building doesn't build-dep on those exact python versions?
<keffie_jayx> what do I do If after I change the mirror pbuilder keeps loking in ve.archive....
<IntuitiveNipple> The mirror settings are in the pbuilder's own /etc/apt/ configuration so as long as that is changed it should be ok
<IntuitiveNipple> keffie_jayx: You probably need to do a "pbuilder login --save-after-login ..." to change the apt sources.list
<keffie_jayx> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/414604/ is my debian/control...
<IntuitiveNipple> keffie_jayx: Yeah, that looks fine, it must be the pbuilder's apt settings
<keffie_jayx> IntuitiveNipple:  I'll look into that
<keffie_jayx> IntuitiveNipple: after I login I have no editors :S
<IntuitiveNipple> I install nano for that reason :)
<IntuitiveNipple> there's vi but I never got the hang of its commands and interface
<keffie_jayx> ahh
<keffie_jayx> I can do vi
<IntuitiveNipple> Package upload request (universe) apt-cacher bug #561902
<keffie_jayx> IntuitiveNipple:  no vi there
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 561902 in apt-cacher "Sorry, not allowed to fetch that type of file" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/561902
<IntuitiveNipple> install it using apt-get from the command line
<keffie_jayx> Err http://ve.archive.ubuntu.com lucid/main nano 2.1.11-3 404  Not Found [IP: 91.189.88.45 80]
<keffie_jayx> sed can do the trick
<IntuitiveNipple> blimey you're not having much luck there!
<keffie_jayx> got it
<IntuitiveNipple> you can force apt-get to get the version you *know* is on the mirror using the version-suffix: e.g. apt-get install ${package}=2.1.11-4ubuntu1
<keffie_jayx> IntuitiveNipple: thanks ... pbuilder is now pulling deps fine now
<IntuitiveNipple> keffie_jayx: What did you do? change the archive mirror it was using?
<keffie_jayx> yep
<keffie_jayx> changed it with sed
<keffie_jayx> it worked fine
<IntuitiveNipple> might be worth reporting to the archive/mirror admins in case that issue on ve is important
<keffie_jayx> it complained a bit about pbuilder-dependdumy?
<keffie_jayx> but I guess it was not that important
<IntuitiveNipple> It always does, as in, unmet dependencies
<IntuitiveNipple> Like: "dpkg: dependency problems prevent configuration of pbuilder-satisfydepends-dummy"
<keffie_jayx> mmm
<keffie_jayx> my packages has binary filles in it and I hadn't noticed
<keffie_jayx> the script generates .eggs
<keffie_jayx> gotta go home for now
<keffie_jayx> see you in a bit
<RoAkSoAx> k/quit
<keffie_jayx> guys, just wanna thank everyone
<keffie_jayx> I have just packaged my first aplication from scratch
<keffie_jayx> it is a twitter client made in venezuela, and it is my first package in my ppa
<ajmitch> excellent :)
<keffie_jayx> the app is not in debian yet
<keffie_jayx> what would be the procedure to getting it in Ubuntu for the nextrelease
<ScottK> TheMuso (or any Ubuntu Studio dev) apparently the Audacious package structure has changed and you'll need to update your seeds: http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/NBS/audacious-plugins-extra
<ScottK> !revu | keffie_jayx
<ubottu> keffie_jayx: REVU is a web-based tool to give people who have worked on Ubuntu packages a chance to "put their packages out there" for other people to look at and comment on in a structured manner. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU
<ScottK> That's where you start, but don't expect much attention to be paid until after release.
<TheMuso> ScottK: Thanks for the heads up.
<keffie_jayx> ScottK: I thought so
<TheMuso> ScottK: BTW as of lucid's release, I am resigning from the ubuntustudio dev team.
<TheMuso> Just FYI.
<ScottK> TheMuso: Feel free to beat bdrung about the head and shoulders when you see him.
<keffie_jayx> ScottK: thanks for all the help
* persia changed the topic of #ubuntu-motu to: Final Freeze in effect | Lucid Beta 2 Released | Want to get involved with the MOTU? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing | Sponsor queue: http://is.gd/2y76G | http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/ftbfs | http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/NBS | http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/debcheck | latest rebuild failures: http://udd.debian.org/cgi-bin/ubuntu_ftbfs.cgi
<TheMuso> heh I am not that nasty.
<ScottK> persia: We still want Universe fixes though.  Let's make that clear in /topic.
<ScottK> TheMuso: Who else should I be pinging about Studio?
<ajmitch> persia: want to add that rcbugs url to the topic while you're at it?
<ScottK> Yes.  Please.
 * persia has to hand-type URLs because of a client issue: if someone else wants to change the topic: please just do it :)
* ScottK changed the topic of #ubuntu-motu to: Final Freeze in effect, but keep uploading fixes! | Want to get involved with the MOTU? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing | Sponsor queue: http://is.gd/2y76G | http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/ftbfs | http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/NBS | http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/debcheck | latest rebuild failures: http://udd.debian.org/cgi-bin/ubuntu_ftbfs.cgi
<persia> ScottK: Thank you.
 * ScottK leaves RC bugs URL to ajmitch.
 * ajmitch mutters
* ajmitch changed the topic of #ubuntu-motu to: Final Freeze in effect, but keep uploading fixes! | Want to get involved with the MOTU?  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing | Sponsor queue: http://is.gd/2y76G | http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/ftbfs | http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/NBS |  http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/debcheck | latest rebuild failures: http://udd.debian.org/cgi-bin/ubuntu_ftbfs.cgi
<ajmitch> typical
* ajmitch changed the topic of #ubuntu-motu to: Final Freeze in effect, but keep uploading fixes! | Want to get involved with the MOTU?  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing | Sponsor queue: http://is.gd/2y76G | http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/ftbfs | http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/NBS |  http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/debcheck | latest rebuild failures: http://udd.debian.org/cgi-bin/ubuntu_ftbfs.cgi | http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/bu
<ajmitch> doesn't quite fit :)
* ajmitch changed the topic of #ubuntu-motu to: Final Freeze in effect, but keep uploading fixes! | Want to get involved with the MOTU?  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing | Sponsor queue: http://is.gd/2y76G | http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/ftbfs | http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/NBS |  http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/debcheck | latest rebuild failures: http://udd.debian.org/cgi-bin/ubuntu_ftbfs.cgi
<ajmitch> sorry for spam
<persia> Just means we have to dop something.
<persia> Let's drop the rebuild failures in favour of RCbugs for now.
<persia> rebuilds are important, but we've done the binary removals, so the FTBFS lists should be populated correctly at this point.
<persia> (assuming LP did the sensible thing)
<ajmitch> drop the UDD FTBFS link?
<persia> Actually, try dropping debcheck first.
<persia> debcheck is important and all, but not as important as either rebuild failures or rcbugs.
* ajmitch changed the topic of #ubuntu-motu to: Final Freeze in effect, but keep uploading fixes! | Want to get involved with the MOTU? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing | Sponsor queue: http://is.gd/2y76G | http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/ftbfs | http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/NBS | http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/bugs/rcbugs/ | latest rebuild failures: http://udd.debian.org/cgi-bin/ubuntu_ftbfs.cgi
<ajmitch> it only matters if people actually read the topic :)
<persia> Cool, it fits.
<persia> Yeah, well.
<ScottK> persia: LP does not create a build record after a binary removal, so the FTBFS won't have all you need.  You need the rebuild failures.
 * ScottK notes "The Unapproved queue is empty." and invites people to change that.
<persia> ScottK: Should I process 500 changelog-only uploads to remedy that, or is there a better way?
 * persia grumbles.  This CD managed to install on this hardware successfully (except for bugs) the last 7 times, and now it fails :(
<TheMuso> lol
<TheMuso> ScottK: Re studio, for lucid, its pretty much me atm, but for Maverick and beyond, I don't know. The team are still sorting themselves out I think.
<ScottK> TheMuso: OK.  Thanks.
<ScottK> persia: There is a better way.
<persia> ScottK: What's the better way, and who is doing it?
<persia> Or is the better way to review each, and upload things that fix the FTBFS?
<ScottK> The better way is to look at /topic, investigate the links, and do something useful.
<ScottK> persia: Excellent.
 * ajmitch looks for this mythical empty queue
<persia> Oh well.  I was hoping for consolidated reporting.
<persia> ajmitch: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/lucid/+queue?queue_state=1&queue_text=
<ajmitch> ScottK: if you were bored, the karmic unapproved queue isn't empty :)
<ScottK> The output of apt-cache unmet |grep -v Recommends|grep -v Suggests|less is also somewhat instructive, although it does require some interpretation.
<ScottK> ajmitch: Boost accepted.  I'm not messing with Landscape.
<ajmitch> ScottK: I don't care about landscape :)
 * ScottK neither
<ajmitch> 'apt-cache -i unmet' will probably do what you wanted there, too
<ScottK> Sure enough.  Thanks.
<zul> whats wrong with landscape?
<ajmitch> I didn't touch it, so I don't know what changes it has in karmic-proposed
<zul> ah ok...i thought something was actually wrong with it
<ajmitch> nah, it just has an update to be accepted by an archive admin
<zul> heh..yeah i know I put it there ;)
<ajmitch> oh did you now? :)
<zul> well uploaded it
<zul> anyways
<zul> im falling asleep
 * ajmitch has been doing that all day
<ScottK> zul: It has special rules about what's OK.
<micahg> TheMuso: would you like to sponsor a vlc patch for me?
 * ajmitch wonders what we should do with spe - it depends on pychecker, which was removed 
<micahg> ajmitch: bring a new/working version of pychecker back?
<ajmitch> at this late stage? it's possible, but it was removed due to python2.6 compatibility
<micahg> ajmitch: did debian not get a working version since then?
<ajmitch> which may or may not have been correct
<ajmitch> it has a version which appears to work, but has some open bugs with regards to py 2.6 features
<micahg> ajmitch: well, idk about now, but I filed a sync for something that was removed due to FTBFS, but it was fixed
<ajmitch> so I'm not sure if it's worth dragging back in yet or not
<micahg> ajmitch: ah
<micahg> ajmitch: is spe needeed?
<ScottK> ajmitch: pychecker is needed, IIRC, for spe installability, so getting it back would be good.
<ScottK> (if it works)
<ajmitch> ScottK: yes, this is what I'm talking about, someone mentioned spe being uninstallable in the loco channel
<ajmitch> it at least has issues with relative imports
<ScottK> I heard someone say it worked with 2.6, but never had a chance to look into it.
<ScottK> That'd be a problem in 2.5 too, right?
<ajmitch> would you be able to approve letting it back in from sid if that's the case?
<ajmitch> not sure
<ScottK> I'll take care of Newing it, yes.
<ajmitch> I'll see how it builds & runs on lucid
<ScottK> For now I'm going to go collapse for a few hours.
<ajmitch> OK
<ajmitch> it passes a test suite when builkdding on lucid, so there's hope
<ScottK> Great.  Good night.
<ajmitch> night
<micahg> night Scottk
<imbrandon> ugh got a strange problem
<imbrandon> and arch : all package that has to be built on ppc though
<imbrandon> ...
<imbrandon> anyway to force that on soyuz ?
<wgrant> No.
<wgrant> It is, however, ridiculously easy to implement once a control field has been decided upon.
<ajmitch> something like Build-Architecture?
<wgrant> Something like that, yes.
<imbrandon> hum ok, i guess no openbios-{ppc,sparc} for lucid then
<ajmitch> those sort of packages have often been a problem
<imbrandon> yea, i rember them messing with my head a year or two ago
<ajmitch> I suppose it ought to be mostly safe by now to upgrade my laptop to lucid
<micahg> ajmitch: I'd wait for the 2.6.32-21 kernel to hit the repos first
<ajmitch> there have been a few issues with -20? :)
<imbrandon> i've been on it a few weeks on my laptop, seems fine so far, no major breakage
<imbrandon> Linux jordan 2.6.32-21-generic #31-Ubuntu SMP Tue Apr 13 20:34:00 UTC 2010 i686 GNU/Linux
<imbrandon> looks like -21 is in
<imbrandon> :)
<ajmitch> yeah, I saw the source upload
<ajmitch> didn't know how backlogged buildds are
<imbrandon> yea i downloaded it a few minutes ago from archive , not sure about the contry codes
<imbrandon> country*
<ajmitch> I have archive.u.c in sources.list
 * micahg is wondering why an upgrade hans't been offered
<imbrandon> micahg: apt-get update :)
<ajmitch> i386 vs amd64?
<imbrandon> maybe, i'm on x86_64 but run 32bit
<micahg> imbrandon: ah, that's probably it
<imbrandon> ajmitch: so i'm thinkin about sellin my wow acct
<imbrandon> lkol
<imbrandon> lol*
<ajmitch> k
<ajmitch> I'm not buying
<imbrandon> hahah i know
<imbrandon> i just keep seeing them on Craigslist for $1000 for about half of what i have
<imbrandon> i'm like hum, an easy $1k usd
<imbrandon> lol
<ajmitch> just because they're listed for that doesn't mean they'd sell for that much
<imbrandon> true
<imbrandon> imho someone would be an idiot to pay for one, but thats ok, an idiot is easily parted with his $
<ajmitch> yep
<ajmitch> now if you were to try & sell your LP account we'd have to beat you :)
<imbrandon> hahaha
<imbrandon> you know that had never crossed my mind, thats kinda nuts
<imbrandon> wonder what a dd gpg+ssh key would go for ? hahahahahahah blasphmy
<ajmitch> if any developer were to do that, they'd be blacklisted rather fast, I hope
<imbrandon> exactly
<imbrandon> and since the wot is fairly personal, i would be hard to get back
<imbrandon> the reputation that is
<ajmitch> they may even end up with a personal visit from some nice people...
<imbrandon> :)
<imbrandon> honestly now that you mention it, i wonder if its ever been attempted or if there is a contengcy plan ( other than that of any other time there has been untrusted access to the dd systems )
<imbrandon> i hope not but still ...
<imbrandon> you know i wish there was once place/page to manage all the lists.ubuntu.com subscriptions , instead of goting to each mailmans interface
<micahg> imbrandon: you can bulk change your address
<imbrandon> ?
<imbrandon> do tell
<micahg> imbrandon: you can change your address for all lists in one shot
<imbrandon> no no i got that part, but where
 * micahg is looking
<wgrant> I think you can do it once you're logged in to any of the lists.
<wgrant> I did it a couple of years ago, but don't remember the details. It wasn't that unobvious.
<micahg> maybe that's it
<imbrandon> see thats 3/4 of my problem, i've signed up to half the lists with diffrent email addresses etc ( but they all forward to my same inbox ) so its hard to manage them all
<imbrandon> lol
 * micahg did that too and migrated everything to ubuntu.com address once I acquired one
<imbrandon> some are @ubuntu.com some are @kubuntu.org some are my gmail , lol
<imbrandon> and heck its been 4 years since i signed up on some of the lists
<imbrandon> lol
<micahg> ajmitch: can you ack a sync?
<imbrandon> awesom, i found the area to do it ( on the ML pages ) thanks
<siretart> micahg: I'm at a conference in paris this week, so if you need a sponsor, I won't be avaiable before the weekend when I'm back home
<micahg> siretart: I'm trying to find someone to do it
<imbrandon> what do you need micahg ?
<micahg> imbrandon: I need vlc sponsored and phpmyadmin sync acked
<imbrandon> i can take a look at vlc for ya, where do you have it ?
<micahg> imbrandon: bug 558981
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 558981 in vlc "vlc fails to build against xulrunner-1.9.2" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/558981
<micahg> hi hyperair
<imbrandon> micahg: ok, added to my queue, i'll lookit over / upload before i sleep tonight
<micahg> imbrandon: great, thanks
 * micahg would like to get a few days of testing before release
<micahg> imbrandon: would you be able to push a packagekit rebuild for me or is it too late?
<ajmitch> micahg: I may be able to look at phpmyadmin in a bit, just in the middle of upgrading my laptop now
<micahg> ajmitch: k
<cody-somerville> Its too late
<cody-somerville> unless it meets final freeze exception criteria
<micahg> cody-somerville: k, seems like it only has a build-dep on xul191 and not a runtime dep
<micahg> seems like the only thing left that actually needs xul191 in archive to run is gjs
 * micahg will fix this weekend
<imbrandon> micahg: changes look good, test build is also fine, get me an FFe on IRC or on the bug report from a release team member and i'll upload it
<micahg> imbrandon: should an FFe ack already in the bug...
 * imbrandon will look closer
<micahg> imbrandon: wait, it's an FTBFS fix...I guess I do need an FFe...this gets confusing
<imbrandon> :)
<imbrandon> just ping any of the awake release team members on irc or get them to ack it, i'll take care of the rest if wanted
<micahg> imbrandon: I just asked pitti
<imbrandon> k
<imbrandon> brb more mt dew time
 * micahg requested several already this week and thought all were had
<micahg> imbrandon: pitti said it's bug fix only, so go for it
<imbrandon> micahg: k will so
<imbrandon> do*
<micahg> imbrandon: thanks
<hyperair> micahg: hello.
<RAOF> micahg: You've got a fix for that gjs madness?
<imbrandon> micahg: uploaded, should have email shortly
<micahg> RAOF: this weekend, sorry for the delay
<micahg> imbrandon: thanks
<micahg> RAOF: gjs is the last thing that depends on xul191 in lucid, but it depends on an older version ATM, so it doesn't  matter
<RAOF> micahg: No need to be sorry!  I was just wondering how you'd fixed it :)
<micahg> RAOF: I still have my idea, I just need time to look into it, unfortunately, I was thrown a curveball with vlc and we just got that uploaded tonight
<dholbach> good morning
<ajmitch> hi dholbach
<dholbach> hey ajmitch
<imbrandon> gnight all
<micahg> gnight imbrandon, thanks again
<splashote> hey, I'd like to propose guayadeque for inclusion in the Ubuntu repos. https://sourceforge.net/projects/guayadeque/ it's not my project but anonbeats. it's a quite advanced lightweight AudioPlayer with a very fast development and a very active group of users behind it
<splashote1> if there is anybody willing to help us in order to include guayadeque, we'll discuss this here: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1398128
<ajmitch> wow, plymouth looks ugly on fglrx :)
<micahg> ajmitch: I thought that release doesn't need to ack bug fix only universe packages until RC week
<micahg> ajmitch: ah, it seems that it was updated :)
 * micahg thinks he said the same thing by beta 2
<ajmitch> micahg: I thought I'd subscribe them before I got told off too much
<micahg> ajmitch: no, you're correct, I forgot that the policy changed this cycle
<directhex> is making a source package compile on amd64 as well as i386 something that needs a FFe?
<micahg> directhex: I don't think so, but I think at this point, you need a -release ack for upload
<directhex> even for universe?
<directhex> hm, spose so
<micahg> directhex: I should restate, I'm assuming that it was capable and something broke and it's not new like all to separate arch?
<micahg> directhex: I think it's new this cycle even for universe
 * micahg keeps forgetting
<directhex> micahg, it was previously Arch:i386, due to a very small bug
<micahg> directhex: idk, you should probably just ask in -release and you can get whatever ack you need at this point :)
<micahg> or maybe someone else will pop in here :)
<Laney> You don't need any additional approval for unseeded packages
<micahg> Laney: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess#Exceptions%20for%20Universe/Multiverse seems to imply something else
<Laney> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel-announce/2010-April/000705.html
<micahg> Laney: I thought I saw it somewhere :)
 * micahg goes to subscribe ubuntu-archive to my sync
<micahg> Laney: should I sync be confirmed after MOTU ack or still NEW?
<micahg> *a sync
<Laney> I don't understand
<Laney> "or still NEW"?
<micahg> Laney: the status on a sync bug should be confirmed or new after MOTU ack?
<Laney> oh, confirmed if you have sponsors ack
<micahg> Laney: yep, he just thought release ack was needed
<Laney> maybe it needs an ffe
<micahg> Laney: bug fix release
<micahg> Laney: you want to verify?
<Laney> no, it's alright
<james_w> ScottK: bug 563697 if you would be so kind
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 563697 in bacula-doc "FFe: sync bacula-doc 5.0.1-1 from unstable" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/563697
<ScottK> Looking
<ScottK> james_w: Approved.
<james_w> thanks
<ScottK> bdrung: Your vlc upload has an undocumented change in debian/rules.  I'm going to reject it.  If that was desired, please document both the change and the rationale.
<YokoZar> Can someone with archive please sync hedgewars?  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/hedgewars/+bug/555082
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 555082 in hedgewars "new version 0.9.13 released ... ppp (pretty please package)" [Wishlist,Confirmed]
<bdrung> ScottK: it's for installing the apport hook
<ScottK> bdrung: As long as you tested it, reupload with a more thorough changelog then.
<bjfs> If I include python-fpconst on lucid (pbuilder) for build depends, the build fails with "Depends: python-fpconst which is a virtual package", though it looks normal... any idea how to hack this?
<james_w> lfaraone: know what we should do with http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/NBS/sugar-0.86 ?
<james_w> hyperair: any idea about http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/NBS/banshee-extension-telepathy ?
<hyperair> james_w: oh yeah, sorry i forgot to tell you. please remove it.
<james_w> hyperair: remove what?
<hyperair> james_w: -telepathy.
<hyperair> i commented out the package
<hyperair> it's documented in the changelog
<james_w> eh?
<hyperair> telepathy-gabble >= 0.9 doesn't exist in lucid
<hyperair> it's not installable.
<james_w> you just uploaded?
<james_w> oh
<james_w> the problem is that banshee-community-extensions still depends on it
<hyperair> james_w: heh? i thought i commented that out as well.
<james_w> pls to be fixing
<hyperair> james_w: it is commented out.
<hyperair> james_w: are you sure you're looking at the correct version?
<hyperair> james_w: -1ubuntu3
<james_w> no idea
<james_w> I'm just going on the output of NBS
<hyperair> it's commented out
<james_w> your answer can be "It's waiting in the build queue", or "it was only built two hours ago"
<hyperair> er
<hyperair> more like it hasn't been built at all?
<hyperair> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/44184394/banshee-community-extensions_1.6.0-1ubuntu2_1.6.0-1ubuntu3.diff.gz
<hyperair> fine, it's waiting in the build queue.
<james_w> ok
<james_w> must have been skew with the old standalone package or something
<james_w> I'll remove the binary and it will all work itself out when that builds
<hyperair> okay
<kreuter> hi #ubuntu-motu.  how do I help fix a bug in a package whose maintainer is "Ubuntu MOTU Developers"?
<nenolod> make a debdiff containing the fix and subscribe ubuntu-universe-sponsors to the bug
<ScottK> nenolod and kreuter: ubuntu-sponsors, not ubuntu-universe-sponsors anymore.
<nenolod> oops.
<nenolod> well i haven't needed to fix a ubuntu package in some time. :p
<ScottK> james_w: Thanks for taking on the NBS stuff.
<james_w> there's still quite some to do unfortunately
<james_w> I'm starting a packaging training session on using bzr for Ubuntu development now in #ubuntu-classroom
<james_w> anyone is welcome to come ask questions
<james_w> even those who think they know everything ;-)
<lfaraone> james_w: not sure :(
<micahg> ttx: I'm not sure how they choose what to sync, I had something else requested to sync that wasn't this morning even though it was approved
<ttx> micahg: we'll see, I can upload the limited fix in case the sync gets rejected for any reason
 * ttx disappears
<bdmurray> How or who do I talk to about getting bughelper removed from the archive?
<geser> bdmurray: the archive admins via a bug
<rbaut0> exists a how-to about how packaging app that are build with maven ?
<geser> rbaut0: if you don't find any, you might check how other package are done (look for package build-depending on maven)
<ScottK> bdrung: Thanks to your audacious upload there are now a number of packages build-depending on the old, no longer built ones.  Please ensure they get transitioned.  See http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/NBS/ for details.
<bdrung> ScottK: there are four B-D on audacious-plugins-dev. This must be changed to audacious-dev, but all four package fail to build, because some functions are missing (renamed/removed?)
<ScottK> bdrung: OK.  Please take care of fixing it.
<ScottK> hyperair: Similarly your dropping of banshee-extension-telepathy has left banshee-community-extensions uninstallable.
<hyperair> ScottK: it hasn't built yet.
<ScottK> hyperair: OK.  Great.
<hyperair> ScottK: it's been stuck in the queue for nearly 20 hours now, i think.
<ScottK> hyperair: The buildds are really backed up.
<hyperair> ScottK: weird, some hours ago i checked the buildds, and there were at least 8 i386 buildds idling
<ScottK> hyperair: Those were PPA buildds.  Not interchangable
<hyperair> ScottK: aah i see.
<hyperair> hmm 24hours, not <20h
<ScottK> As the main freeze gets harder, things in Universe will catch up.
<ScottK> bdrung: Feel free to ping sistpoty for help when he's around since he approved the FFe.
<bdrung> ScottK: do we need a FFe for bug fixes?
<ScottK> bdrung: No.
<bdrung> ScottK: so for what was this notice?
<ScottK> Please don't do stuff like rewrite the entire build system if you can avoid it.
<ScottK> bdrung: Getting the audacious rdpends fixed.
<bdrung> ScottK: oh, i missreaded your comment: i read "since he approves FFe" instead of "since he approved the FFe"
<ScottK> Ah.  Right.
<bdrung> ScottK: bug #564087, #564088, #564091, #564092
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 564087 in g15daemon-audacious "FTBFS against audacious 2.3" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/564087
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 564088 in imms "FTBFS against audacious 2.3" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/564088
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 564091 in upse "FTBFS against audacious 2.3" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/564091
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 564092 in xmp "FTBFS against audacious 2.3" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/564092
<bdrung> where is sistpoty?
<ScottK> Not sure.
<ScottK> bdrung: I'd first check and see if any of those packages have new upstream versions that do build with 2.3.
<lfaraone> persia: in other news, it looks like asking nicely managed to convince the Debian maintainers to adopt the epoch for squeak-vm. Yay for cross-distro coordination!
<persia> "asking nicely" is the most powerful tool in free software :)
<persia> Extra points for asking nicely with a patch
<lfaraone> persia: heh, there wasn't much to patch :)
 * ScottK prefers asking nicely with a big stick, but doesn't always have that optin.
<ajmitch> ScottK: using a big stick in debian can be counterproductive
<lfaraone> For SRUs, we should use version numbers like ubuntu0.1, right? (what if I'm considereing SRUing to multiple serieses?)
<lfaraone> persia: uh, is bug 301190 corrently worded? (my second SRU)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 301190 in etoys "etoys does not launch" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/301190
<persia> I'm not the best person to ask about SRUs, but it appear to have rationale, test case, and a patch.
 * persia accepts some nominations, expecting lfarone will follow-up appropriately
<james_w> lfaraone: what was sugar-0.86 and why was it removed?
<mhall119> question: should this package branch have all the qimo-games* files in it?
<mhall119> http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-branches/ubuntu/lucid/qimo-games/lucid/files
<james_w> mhall119: no, they must have been in the source package when it was uploaded
<mhall119> do I file a bug and then propose a merge to remove them?
<ScottK> mhall119: Yes
<ScottK> Or attach a debdiff to the bug.
<mhall119> I already have the branch checked out
<mhall119> do I update the changelog when I do this, or will the person merging update it?
<james_w> mhall119: update the changelog, but the uploader can do it for you if you want
<mhall119> what's the usual way of doing it?
 * mhall119 is trying to learn the "correct" way
<james_w> adding the changelog entry is usual
<mhall119> ok
<mhall119> thanks
<mhall119> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/qimo-games/+bug/564152
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 564152 in qimo-games "Package branch has extra archive files that shouldn't be there" [Undecided,New]
<mhall119> does that look right?
<james_w> mhall119: looks ok to me
<mhall119> yay, I may finally be starting to get the hang of this
<lfaraone> james_w: older version of sugar. It was removed since .88 is out, I guess, and we need only one version.
<lfaraone> james_w: sadly due to some pyxpcom issues we can't ship a working sugar-browse, which is critical.
<lfaraone> james_w: by the way, I can propose for a package to be merged into RELEASE-proposed like I do with "lucid" during the development cycle, right?
<micahg> lfaraone: I can try to sort out the upstream pyxpcom goals after UDS
<lfaraone> micahg: mk, thanks. that's a bit above me unfortunately :(
<james_w> lfaraone: but we can't keep them around depending on the removed package either
<james_w> lfaraone: and you can propose for -proposed for karmic and earlier
#ubuntu-motu 2010-04-16
<lfaraone> james_w: hm. I'm trying to merge via https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~lfaraone/ubuntu/karmic/etoys/lp301190/+register-merge into lp:ubuntu/karmic-proposed/etoys, and it's not a branch. What path should I give it?
<MTecknology> Where did gnome-volume-manager go in lucid?
<micahg> MTecknology: (Reason:          obsolete, gvfs/nautilus do that now, and ivman is a more ...)
<MTecknology> micahg: thanks
<MTecknology> micahg: http://dpaste.com/184401/ :(
<micahg> MTecknology: you might not have hal installed as it was dropped from Ubuntu, idk about Kubuntu, but Xubuntu still uses parts of it
<MTecknology> micahg: i A hal                                                                                - Hardware Abstraction Laye
<micahg> MTecknology: try aptitude why-not halevt
<MTecknology> Unable to find a reason to remove halevt.
<MTecknology> micahg: that's a really neat trick :p
 * micahg is out of ideas :-/
<micahg> MTecknology: 1 more...try sudo aptitude install halevt
<MTecknology> micahg: that's what got me to that error
<micahg> MTecknology: do you want this package?
<MTecknology> micahg: I think I do, I'm trying to magically mount a device in /media when plugged in - no nautilus
<micahg> MTecknology: hal wouldn'
<micahg> t be the way to do it in lucid
<MTecknology> micahg: I thought I needed halevt for ivman..
<MTecknology> oops
<MTecknology> micahg: so what's the right way to do it if I don't want nautilus to deal wiht most of it?
<micahg> MTecknology: idk, I use xubuntu
<micahg> MTecknology: does udev handle that?
<MTecknology> micahg: I tried having udev running and that didn't seem to help any
<micahg> MTecknology: have you seen gnome-disk-utility
<MTecknology> micahg: is that a daemon?
<micahg> MTecknology: no
<micahg> MTecknology: actually, idk
<MTecknology> doesn't look like it
<MTecknology> gah - I thought this would be extremely simple
<MTecknology> pmount seemed to come close
<MTecknology> how do you check reverse dependencies of a package?
<micahg> MTecknology: have you tried +1 yet?
<micahg> MTecknology: apt-cache rdepends PKGNAME
<MTecknology> micahg: I'm on Lucid
<micahg> MTecknology: I meant the channel :)
<MTecknology> oh - ya
<MTecknology> there's a usbmount package....
<MTecknology> micahg: That seems to do exactly what I want - I think
<micahg> MTecknology: cool
<wrapster> it it possible to search the repo for a particular file?
<wrapster> i mean if i want to know which pkg provides "layout.h" how do i find out?
<YokoZar> Can anyone do a sync for me please? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/hedgewars/+bug/555082  (FFE granted already and tested)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 555082 in hedgewars "new version 0.9.13 released ... ppp (pretty please package)" [Wishlist,Confirmed]
<imbrandon> wrapster: via the web you can use package.ubuntu.com
<imbrandon> wrapster: via the cli use apt-file
<wrapster> imbrandon: i tried web. but could not find sys/layout.h
<wrapster> need it for compilation purposes..
<wrapster> apt-file --> command not found?
<imbrandon> wrapster: sudo apt-get install apt-file && sudo apt-file update
<wrapster> imbrandon: yes done that.
<wrapster> sorry was a little too curious to solve this fast.
<wrapster> that is solved.
<wrapster> but does layout.h not come in any ubuntu release?
<wrapster> i mean sys/layout.h?
<wrapster> im trying to compile i18n
<wrapster> and the repo does not show anything
<imbrandon> what provides the layout.h your looking for
<imbrandon> there are lots of layout.h's in the repo
<imbrandon> but none are what your looking for i supose
<wrapster> thats correct.. Im from solaris background and there its provided by SUNWctpls
<imbrandon> then it sounds like a solaris specific api , you might try to find what the linux alternative is
<wrapster> yes.. that was my next question.
<wrapster> is there a way to figure it out?
<imbrandon> automagicly ? no
<imbrandon> porting code is far from automagic ;)
<wrapster> :(
 * Rhonda . o O ( I knew why I wanted wesnoth 1:1.8-1 synced and not wait for 1:1.8-2  *sigh* )
<imbrandon> although with that said i'm sure your not the first to want to use a given api , there normaly are alternatives if ya dig a little
<imbrandon> e.g. what does layout.h give you ? is it a gui layout ? a fs layout etc etc etc
<wrapster> ok.
<dholbach> good morning
<imbrandon> moins dholbach
<dholbach> hi imbrandon
<kobrien> anyone got much experience with packaging Java programs?
<ScottK> kobrien: You might have more luck in #ubuntu-java
<kobrien> i'm trying :(
<james_w> lfaraone: lp:ubuntu/karmic/etoys
<YokoZar> ScottK: mind if I poke you personally?
<ScottK> YokoZar: No
<YokoZar> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/hedgewars/+bug/555082  <-- I wanted a sync last night, FFE has been approved for a couple days and tested
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 555082 in hedgewars "new version 0.9.13 released ... ppp (pretty please package)" [Wishlist,Confirmed]
<YokoZar> Upstream intended this to be the version in Lucid
<YokoZar> (and needed for online play and so on)
<ScottK> YokoZar: You need an archive admin with shell access
<YokoZar> I thought you had that
<ScottK> (i.e. employed by Canonical)
<YokoZar> ahh ok
<ScottK> Nope
<YokoZar> ok no wonder it went unanswered
<ScottK> Maybe StevenK is in a generous mood.
<ScottK> Maybe if you file a removal bug on something that will cheer him up.
<StevenK> Not currently, I'm not.
<StevenK> Crappy internet makes me grumpy
<YokoZar> Isn't that always the case in Australia?
 * ScottK thinks you aren't helping
<StevenK> YokoZar: You're helping your case, really ...
<YokoZar> StevenK: I'll fix Wine's libpng support tomorrow ;)
<james_w> YokoZar: doing
<YokoZar> james_w: thanks :)
<james_w> impugning our good nature is a good way to get immediate action
<james_w> done
<YokoZar> james_w: Thanks :)
<carstenh> there are three serious bugs in ubuntu lucid, two could lead to random packages to be purged when there are multiarch packages in ubuntu (e.g. when users upgrade from lucid to the following LTS release) and renders git repositories unusable when you ran for example tg help in them and deinstalled topgit later.  i guess i need to put lucid in the changelog and append ubuntu1 to the version, correct?  does the urgency matter, if it does, ...
<carstenh> ... which urgency do I choose?  where do I ask for sponsoring?  a sponsor oder your buildds would rebuild the package anyway and mountall fails to configure when I try to setup a lucid chroot, so building in sid would be ok?
<carstenh> s/renders/one renders/
<carstenh> s/oder/or/
<persia> The urgency doesn't matter at all (as defined in the changelog).
<jpds> (Though it tweaks the build score).
<persia> There are two acceptable ways to get an upload sponsored: one is to attach a debdiff to a bug and subscribe ubuntu-sponsors to the bug.  The other is to use bzr for the packaging changes, and submit a merge request against lp:ubuntu/lucid/${package}
<persia> jpds: By less than waiting an hour.
<persia> So it only really adjusts urgency against other packages uploaded within the same hour.
<carstenh> ok, then I will choose neither, thanks for your time
<persia> And it's also massively trumped by other modifiers (e.g. components)
<persia> carstenh: Why neither?
<persia> carstenh: What's the bug?  Is there a bug number?
<carstenh> persia: there are bugs in debian (two of three, the other is not filed), but not in launchpad and i don't want to subscribe to weird things
<carstenh> and I don't want to fight against bzr to fix bugs
<persia> OK.  Which are the Debian bugs?
<carstenh> bugs.debian.org/576221 but this bug report is not helpful to understand the problem
<carstenh> and bugs.debian.org/539340
<persia> Debian bug 539340
<ubottu> Debian bug 539340 in debfoster "debfoster: please add multiarch support" [Normal,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/539340
<persia> debian bug 576221
<ubottu> Debian bug 576221 in topgit "topgit: [PATCH] Don't call pre-commit hook if tg is not installed" [Important,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/576221
<carstenh> thedebfosterbug also misses a description of the problem
<persia> carstenh: For 576221, I think it's relatively easy, but needs a description of the problem.
<carstenh> debfoster removes packages which are orphaned, it will think non-orphaned packages would be orphaned if it does not strip :any from package names, deborphan has the same problem.
<persia> For 539340: I think we need a patch.
<carstenh> persia: a description attached to the debian bug?
<persia> carstenh: That would work.  It's more work for us, because we have to copy&paste, but if you have fixes and an allergy to launchpad, we can help get the fixes in.
<carstenh> persia: http://stateful.de/~carsten/tmp/100416v9Qgcml9Nyo/file7TRbHF
<carstenh> persia: if you tell me the url where i can paste it into launchpad ...
<carstenh> i already have an launchpad account
<persia> carstenh: It needs a new bug.  If you're up for filing it, that's `ubuntu-bug topgit`
<carstenh> i though you did this with this irc magic ;)
<carstenh> thought
<persia> No.
<carstenh> what did you men by "I think we need a patch."?  some kind of nmu-diff?
<carstenh> that is a patch against the package including patching debian/changelog
<persia> Essentially, yeah.  It's not immediately clear to me from the debfoster bug description precisely what code needs changing.
<persia> Doing a full patch including debian/changelog and everything makes it simpler for the uploader.  A targeted patch just fixing the code also works.
<carstenh> but a proper diff.gz would not work?
<carstenh> and .dsc
<persia> Doesn't really matter: just the debdiff saves space on LP, but any format works to represent the changes.
<persia> We prefer debdiffs because they transfer quick, generally.
<carstenh> debian is a lot less complicated
<carstenh> ok, I think I know everything I wanted to know, thanks :)  I'll start reading debfosters source later to find the right place to insert the few lines.
<persia> carstenh: Excellent.  Thanks.  Did you file the topgit bug, or shall I?
<carstenh> persia: you are more experienced with launchpad :)
<persia> Sure, I'll file it then, using your description and patch.
<carstenh> what about adding translation updates when fixing serious bugs?
<persia> We're past string freeze, so if you need to change a string, you need approval from the docteam.  If it's just a translations update, those are typically welcomed, although it's best practice to check with the translations team.
<carstenh> persia: my topgit fix is commited upstream, just in case you need to tag this patch somehow
<carstenh> | X-Launchpad-Message-Rationale: Subscriber (deborphan in ubuntu)
<carstenh> I got this a year ago, today I saw that there were bugs against deborphan which i never got
<carstenh> does lp lose subscriptions?
<persia> Shouldn't.
<wgrant> carstenh: Nobody is subscribed to deborphan in Ubuntu at the moment.
 * persia checks
<wgrant> LP doesn't go around deleting them without you telling it to, no.
<wgrant> Although there is talk about deleting the full Ubuntu subscriptions and forbidding future ones, source packages shouldn't be touched, and certainly haven't been yet.
<persia> carstenh: According to https://bugs.launchpad.net/~heyc you're subscribed to that specific bug, but according to https://bugs.launchpad.net/~heyc/+packagebugs   you aren't subscibed to any packages.
<persia> carstenh: If you want deborphan bugs, you can subscribe to them all from https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/deborphan (in the upper left)
<carstenh> i registered twice, once years ago and once 2008.  one of these accounts seems to be broken
<persia> carstenh: Does bug #564616 (and the attachment) look right to you?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 564616 in topgit "topgit breaks git trees if later purged" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/564616
<carstenh> persia: you forget to add 2
<persia> carstenh: It fails anyway, with that test case.  `git add 2` didn't appear in http://stateful.de/~carsten/tmp/100416v9Qgcml9Nyo/file7TRbHF
<carstenh> patch looks good, unless it's 3.0 (quilt)
<persia> No, it's 1.0+quilt
 * persia uploads
<persia> Err, except the topgit maintainers might not like that
<carstenh> thanks
 * persia fiddles the maintainer
<carstenh> madduck
<carstenh> responsible via irc
<persia> carstenh: Right, but we change the Maintainer field when we diverge from Debian.  I'm hoping that the fix gets into Debian from the patch you already submitted to the BTS.
<carstenh> 13:34:30 < carstenh> persia: my topgit fix is commited upstream, just in case you need to tag this patch somehow
<persia> I've referenced the BTS patch in the DEP3 header, which is likely enough.
<persia> Ideally the patch will be dropped from Ubuntu for the next release anyway.
<carstenh> i really don't see a problem here.  madduck forwarded this patch to upstream and he applied it.  after the next git pull it will be in his debian repository
<persia> Right, and when we next sync against Debian, I'll get poked to double-check and override the Ubuntu changes.
<persia> It ought all just work.
<joaopinto> is it possible to force dpkg to set an /etc/file generated on a postinst script as installed from the package ?
<james_w> no
<joaopinto> ok :( I needed to have a dynamic config file, but it would be nice to have it associated with the creating package
<joaopinto> otherwise purge does not clean the config
<persia> joaopinto: If you create the script dynamically, you have to clean up after yourself in the maintainer scripts.
<persia> joaopinto: Just put the necessary logic in postrm
<joaopinto> ok, it would be more elegant if we could have dynamic config associated with the packages
<carstenh> joaopinto: apt-cache show ucf
<carstenh> (does not solve this problem but should be the package you need)
<lfaraone> james_w: mk, I see. I proposed for karmic, jaunty, and intrepid
<directhex> isn't having qemu-kvm-extras-static meant to allow "chroot /tmp/somearmchroot" to work?
<ogra> directhex, only if you built it with qemu-debootstrap
<directhex> ogra, i see. how do i integrate qemu-debootstrap into my pbuilder workflow?
<ogra> directhex, if you have some arm chroot that doesnt have qemu-arm-static in it you need to copy it to $chroot/usr/bin/
<ogra> directhex, i thought persia did that already
<directhex> all the wiki pages are, like, use rootstock, it cures cancer! pbuilder barely gets a mention
<geser> directhex, ogra: yes, persia fixed pbuilder-dist from u-d-t to be also able to create arm pbuilders
<carstenh> how do use use pbuilder without a debootstrap that includes a lucid script?
<geser> either get a backport of debootstrap that knows about lucid or create a karmic pbuilder and dist-upgrade it to lucid
<carstenh> i couldn't find a cdebootstrap or debootstrap that supports lucid and the dist-upgrade failed in mountall's maintainerscripts.  but this is nothing that needs to be solved, i was just curious
<persia> carstenh: What's your base environment?
<carstenh> as i said this does not need to be solved. i checked versions in lenny, sid, karmic and luid
<persia> geser: There's still a bug with that which I'm not sure I understand entirely.  It seems that now creating an i386 pbuilder on amd64 uses qemu-debootstrap uselessly.
<carstenh> and i normally use lenny + sid chroots
<persia> carstenh: Oh, so you have a debootstrap that supports lucid, but it just doesn't work?  I suspect that's archieve skew (we're way behind on buildd time right now, because everyone uploaded stuff at the last minute)
<persia> carstenh: creating i386 chroots should always work.  Other architectures may or may not work depending on arch:all/arch:any skew (arch:all is built on i386)
<lfaraone> persia: does http://sprunge.us/AKjX read like something that introduces new features?
<sistpoty|work> lfaraone: looks bug fix only to me... which package is it out of curiousity?
<lfaraone> sistpoty|work: typo3-src.
<persia> I'M not the best person to ask about freeze exceptions either :)  That said, I'm unsure about 13252 ("changed behaviour"),
<carstenh> persia: no I coudn't find a debootstrap that supports anything later than karmic
<lfaraone> carstenh: use pbuilder-dist :)
<sistpoty|work> persia, lfaraone: nah, that's a bug fix for sure ;)
<lfaraone> persia: mk. looks like they pull out CSS variables from globals rather than hard coding them.
<carstenh> lfaraone: how does asking a driver to drive my car help when I have no tires?
<lfaraone> carstenh: Well, when I was on karmic, I had no problem passing lucid as the distribution to pbuilder.
<lfaraone> sistpoty|work: it's in Universe, so I should just file a sync request rather than a FFe, right?
<persia> FFe isn't component-specific: if it's bugfix only, you don't need it.  If it's not, you do.
<sistpoty|work> lfaraone: yes. and check if it builds and works and if typo3-dummy also needs to get synced
<lfaraone> sistpoty|work: of course.
<persia> That said, *every* upload gets manual review right now.
<sistpoty|work> :)
<sistpoty|work> persia: nope, universe is just shoved through (manually, though)
<lfaraone> persia: just asking, I wasn't clear how Final Freeze applies to Universe per se.
<sistpoty|work> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel-announce/2010-April/000705.html
<sistpoty|work> lfaraone: unless on a CD (and unless it would take a week to build), final freeze for universe is at april 26)
<carstenh> jtfr: the scripts in the latest debootstrap seem to be alphabetically ordered but aren't ...
<lfaraone> sistpoty|work: done, bug 564772
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 564772 in typo3-src "Sync typo3-src 4.3.2-1 (universe) from Debian testing (main)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/564772
<sistpoty|work> excellent!
<micahg> ttx: I just got phpmyadmin sync'd so we should be ok
<RoAkSoAx> Can we still ask for FFe for packages in Universe?
<persia> Absolutely.
<RoAkSoAx> till when?
<nigelb> faster the better
<RoAkSoAx> ok then I'll get to work :)
<RoAkSoAx> we can't request FFe for main anymore right?
<sistpoty|work> RoAkSoAx: you can always request one, but the chances are next to zero that it'll get approved
<RoAkSoAx> sistpoty|work, awesome then. :)
<ScottK> Laney: Your docky upload reverts the maintainer change.  I'm going to reject.  Please reupload.
 * sistpoty|work heads home now, and will be off until tommorrow.. cya
<Laney> ScottK: You really think it needs a reject for that?
<ScottK> Laney: If there wasn't time to redo it, I'd have accepted it, but there's plenty of time, so we might as well do it right.
<Laney> Actually it was kind of deliberate since it's essentially a sync
<Laney> I'll wait for the proper sync in that case
<nigelb> bdrung, thanks for taking care of the vlc bug :)
<maco> did i just get taken off the hook?
<nigelb> maco, I guess so :)
<nigelb> ok, so I hadn't even subscribed sponsors
<maco> now i have to remember what the *other* packages i started on and didnt finish were the last few days...
<maco> i think i surrendered to a new release of pdfsam
<nigelb> haha
<maco> if anyone who knows how to package java stuff is around, lemme know. i need some mentoring on this
<maco> its a zip full of other zips
<nigelb> I think slytherin does some java stuff
<maco> i dont know how deeply the zip nesting goes, just that there's java at the end of the rainbow
<nigelb> I wonder why vlc was ftbs for m
<nigelb> me
<ScottK> I have a package that FTBFS due to configure not being executable.  I could chmod +x configure in debian/rules, but someone that doesn't seem ideal.  Suggestions?
<carstenh> ScottK: you could use "sh configure" instead of "./configure"
<ScottK> Thanks.
<ScottK> That works, so which should be preferred?
<jdong> ScottK: chmodding +x is my preferred way; if the configure script requires a specific shell (like dash), I don't believe sh will reinterpret the shebang and start the requested interpreter
<jdong> s/dash/bash
<ScottK> Makes sense.
<carstenh> configure shouldn't require a specific shell and even if it would, one only needs to read the first line to choose the correct shell.  on the other hand, i don't think anybody really cares
<YokoZar> Does each upload need approval at this point or is that next week?
<ScottK> YokoZar: The queue is on manual.
<ScottK> You can upload
<YokoZar> ScottK:  ahh, ok.  About to do a small ia32-libs and then a Wine rebuild then ;)
<YokoZar> ScottK: I take that back. There is nothing "small" about ia32-libs.
 * geser wondered since when was ia32-libs small :)
<YokoZar> since lzma compression of course
<carstenh> is this understandable and foolproof? "Don't know how to handle package relationship fields of package\n`%s'. One of them includes the string `:%s'.\n\nLooks like you have packages installed that adhere to a more recent\nversion of the multiarch specification than deborphan knows about.\n\nTo solve this, you probably need to install a later version of the\npackage deborphan. After this, you should be able to use it again.\nExiting.\n"
<Caesar> Is it too late to get a new (not currently present in universe) package synced from Debian testing?
<geser> yes
<ScottK> Caesar: If you can convince me there's a really good reason, no.  It's not too late.
 * ScottK is out for a bit.
<Caesar> ScottK: I'm not sure if you consider "I'd like this piece of software to be available in Lucid" as a really good reason
<ajmitch> it'd probably depend on what it was :)
<Caesar> ajmitch: suricata
<Caesar> ScottK: I've filed a sync request, I'll leave it in your capable hands
<YokoZar> Caesar: ScottK can't do syncs at this point I think
<YokoZar> Caesar: you need someone with shell access (ie employed by canonical)
<Caesar> YokoZar: ok, I need to get the sync request approved/sponsored first. I assume ScottK can do that
<distatica> I was told to ask this here; I'm having a hard time understanding ubuntu package creation. I'm trying to distribute a web application and have read http://webapps-common.alioth.debian.org/draft/html/ and the complete packaging guide, but everything either grabs an existing package and recreates it, or seems geared towards Makefile based compiled software. This is a django application though.
<distatica> if anyone is experienced with this, and would be willing to lend a bit of a hand (PM would be nice) I could really use it.
<distatica> I should say, I haven't read the full packaging guide, I'm still trying to work my way through it..
<quentusrex> Anyone know how to use git to build nightlies? I use to be able to use the revision number with svn.
#ubuntu-motu 2010-04-17
<YokoZar> ScottK: so the revolution R people are JUST NOW sending me their packages...
<MTeck-ricer> So.. how do you make a package for the kernel?
<MTeck-ricer> Or is it pretty much just like any other package?
<crimsun> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/KernelTeam/KernelMaintenance
<crimsun> pretty much, just read the knowledgebase
<crimsun> meaning: "essentially you need to read the KB"
<crimsun> not: "it's essentially the same as any other package"
<MTeck-ricer> crimsun: I don't get what you mean, is there a wiki or anything?
<MTeck-ricer> :P
<MTeck-ricer> crimsun: thanks
<CTho> what is the distinction between PPA and backports?
<CTho> or, why would a package only be in a PPA?
<crimsun> sometimes it doesn't make sense to continuously push to $release-backports
<crimsun> e.g., daily builds of $package
<CTho> so does the frequency of firefox patches push it above that threshold?
<crimsun> I don't understand your intended question
<CTho> why is firefox 3.6 not in backports?
<crimsun> for which release?
<CTho> security patches are too often?
<CTho> karmic
<MTeck-ricer> crimsun: wow
<crimsun> are you not using the ubuntu mozillateam security ppa?
<MTeck-ricer> crimsun: there's a LOT to that...
<crimsun> ^^ CTho
<crimsun> CTho: also, backports is not intended for security.
<CTho> crimsun: should that be set by default?
<crimsun> CTho: you're asking questions that I can't answer for an entire distribution.
<CTho> i'm apparently not using the mozillateam ppa
<ScottK> You shouldn't need to.
<ScottK> Security fixes get pushed via the regular updates process.
<ScottK> Ubuntu backports are part of the Ubuntu distribution and you can be assured that anything in an Ubuntu backport has been checked by an Ubuntu developer.
<ScottK> Anyone can have a backport and put anything in it they want, so you need to evaluate them indifvidually and determine if you trust them.
<ScottK> PPAs are not part of Ubuntu.
<wgrant> ScottK: Did you mean 'Anyone can have a *PPA*'?
<ScottK> wgrant: I did.  Thanks
<ScottK> Long day.
<wgrant> Heh.
<funkyHat> Is it still worth working through FTBFS packages at this stage?
<wgrant> funkyHat: Yes.
<wgrant> The fewer FTBFSes we have, the easier LTS is going to be.
<wgrant> If we need to do an SRU or security update on a package that we can't build, we are in trouble.
<funkyHat> Just finished bug #565152 -- doesn't look like it will be relevant to debian unfortunately as they have a separate ftbfs relating to gcc 4.5
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 565152 in memcached "1.4.2-1ubuntu2 FTBFS in Lucid" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/565152
<imbrandon> ouch not good i need memcached /me looks
<imbrandon> funkyHat: i havent looked at the debdiff yet, but i noticed you say in the bug that you changed a bit of code, you did this via a patch file hopefully, correct ?
<imbrandon> funkyHat: i actualy would like to see that fixed too so if it all works after a bit of testing i'll sponsor it for ya
<funkyHat> imbrandon: yes, there were already some patches in the package so I added a new one. It's using quilt
<imbrandon> funkyHat: great, give me about ~30 min to look it over etc and i'll sponsor if its ready
<funkyHat> imbrandon: great â¢)
<ScottK> IIRC there was a memcached upload earlier today.
<ScottK> Ah, which didn't build either
 * ScottK lart's zul.
<imbrandon> lol
<imbrandon> this one looks fine, still doing a cursory test build though
<imbrandon> funkyHat: looks good build / test install finished fine, patch looks sane, i'm just gonna update your changelog entry to be a bit more desciptive and upload , ok ?
 * imbrandon is really suprised memcached isnt in main 
<wgrant> It's odd, yes.
<wgrant> Particularly since LP uses it now.,
<ScottK> Then that's probably a bug.
<ScottK> But if Canonical IS doesn't care, why should I?
<wgrant> Heh.
<imbrandon> lol
<imbrandon> funkyHat: uploaded
<imbrandon> wgrant: just out of curiosity ( if you know ) what does LP use to run its python stack ? apache ?
<imbrandon> err apache2 + mod_*
<ScottK> Not in the queue yet.
<imbrandon> ScottK: [ubuntu/lucid] memcached 1.4.2-1ubuntu3 (Waiting for approval)
<wgrant> imbrandon: haproxy in front of Apache in front of a Zope server running on Twisted.
<ScottK> There it is.  Let me have a look....
<imbrandon> wgrant: ahh sounds like a fun job for the IS guys/gals
<ScottK> Nice.
<ScottK> imbrandon and funkyHat: Accepted.
<imbrandon> ScottK: thanks
<imbrandon> funkyHat: and thanks for looking at the bug
 * ScottK hearts queuediff
<imbrandon> i have fell in love with offlineimap, i have no idea why i never used the GREAT tool untill this week
<persia> You were participating in the movement to avoid email at all costs?
<ScottK> imbrandon: Would you mind taking a look at libgda4 and making a recommendation.  It's FTBFS in lucas_' rebuild and we're several upstream versions behind.  What's the shortest/safest path to something that builds.
<imbrandon> persia: lol
<imbrandon> ScottK: sure
<ScottK> Thanks.
<imbrandon> ScottK: upstream or upstream;upstream ? ( did that make sense ? e.g. Debian or further up )
<ScottK> imbrandon: Debian.
<imbrandon> k
<imbrandon> my gut says a sync but lemme look at our deltas and such though
<imbrandon> ( havent even looked yet )
<wgrant> ScottK: That reminds me. I should see how hard it is to hook the diffs up into the UI.
 * wgrant suspects three lines of template should do it.
<ScottK> Nice.
<imbrandon> dget http://ftp.de.debian.org/debian/pool/main/libg/libgda4/libgda4_4.0.8-1.dsc
<imbrandon> err
<imbrandon> ScottK: it looks like it can be just a solid sync, they have adopted all our deltas ( even the ones they dident need specifcly for debian , how nice of them ) BUT it might ftbfs on x86_64
<imbrandon> thats what i'm checking now
<imbrandon> per lp bug 537379
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 537379 in libgda4 "Sync libgda4 4.0.8-1 (main) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/537379
<ScottK> OK.
<ScottK> Also look at the rdepends and see if it might affect any of them negatively.
<imbrandon> yup
<imbrandon> suprisingly it has very few rdepends, but ya checkign them
<ScottK> imbrandon: BTW, this one is in Main, so it's useful for your core-dev reactivation
<imbrandon> ScottK: i noticed ;)
<imbrandon> ScottK: looks like it builds fine on x86_64 too
<imbrandon> dunno why it is not in debian
<ScottK> Cool
<imbrandon> anyhow looks like a solid sync, all deltas are accounted for, i'll say so on the bug
<imbrandon> if you wanna do the honors
<imbrandon> rdepends are also fine
<imbrandon> there are only 3 real ones and none will be affected
<imbrandon> done
<ScottK> imbrandon: File the sync request then and give me the bug number so I can ack it.
<ScottK> Explain how much you tested it
<imbrandon> ok
<imbrandon> ScottK: bug 537379
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 537379 in libgda4 "Sync libgda4 4.0.8-1 (main) from Debian unstable (main)" [Low,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/537379
<ScottK> imbrandon: Ack'ed.  Thanks.
<ScottK> imbrandon: Want another one?
<imbrandon> sure
<ScottK> imbrandon: How about flite3 ee http://udd.debian.org/cgi-bin/ubuntu_ftbfs.cgi
<ScottK> imbrandon: err flite 1.3-release-2
<imbrandon> k
<imbrandon> strange ver nums ;)
<imbrandon> sf.net hosts thinkgeek ? wow never knew
<imbrandon> ScottK: please check bug 565207
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 565207 in flite "Sync flite flite-1.4-release-2 (main) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/565207
<imbrandon> ScottK: btw per the jorge and planet ...
 * imbrandon hugs ScottK 
<imbrandon> ScottK: bug updated ( FFe info added )
<imbrandon> ScottK: ping
<dutchie> hi, I'm looking at pushing a fix to bug 64917 into my ppa. I've added a libwebkit-dev Build-Depends: into the debian/control.in file, but I can't work out how to regenerate the debian/control file from it
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 64917 in rhythmbox "Description of podcast episodes doesn't support HMTL formatting" [Wishlist,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/64917
<chrisccoulson> dutchie - the debian/control file should be regenerated automatically when you build the source package (debuild -S)
<chrisccoulson> AFAIR it's regenerated as part of the clean target
<dutchie> ok
<chrisccoulson> dutchie - /usr/share/gnome-pkg-tools/1/rules/uploaders.mk has the hook for regenerating it, in case you are curious
<dutchie> cool, thanks
<lfaraone> Would any MOTU have a chance to approve the merge of a SRU to {Karmic, Jaunty, Intrepid} in bug 301190? (already been approved by ~ubuntu-sru)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 301190 in etoys "etoys does not launch" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/301190
<kobrien> can someone review a patch for me in lucid libruby?
<kobrien> bug 561432
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 561432 in ruby1.8 "Improper undefined method error" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/561432
<kobrien> lfaraone: thanks
<lfaraone> kobrien: no problem. looks fine, but I'm not a MOTU :)
<kobrien> lfaraone: ah, I see. so what happens next?
<lfaraone> kobrien: we wait for a sponsor (who *is* a MOTU) to go through the sponsorship list and commit your fix.
<hyperair> lfaraone: you aren't? i thought you were.
<kobrien> hyperair: are you?
 * hyperair is.
<hyperair> a motu with no time.
<kobrien> I see, I know my patch works. Wouldn't take long :).
<hyperair> wait until after my exams and i'll look through anything you like.
<lfaraone> hyperair: heh, thanks, feel free to mention that on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LukeFaraone/MOTUApp when you *do* have time :)
<kobrien> lol, I know the feeling
<hyperair> lfaraone: sure ;-)
<hyperair> kobrien: glad you understand =)
<kobrien> hyperair: I've got 2.5 weeks to finish off my project and thesis. :)
<lfaraone> hyperair: actually, I just remembered ruby is in main, so we'll need to snag a core dev.
<kobrien> well, I'm sure a motu will get to it. As soon as the thesis is done, I'm full steam for becoming a motu. :)
<hyperair> kobrien: i've got 6 days to cover 2 months worth of study backlog ;-)
<kobrien> RoAkSoAx: ping
<RoAkSoAx> kobrien, pong
<kobrien> hyperair: good luck
<hyperair> kobrien: thanks
 * lfaraone seconds kobrien wrt hyperair.
<hyperair> lfaraone: thanks
<RoAkSoAx> kobrien, how may I help you
<kobrien> RoAkSoAx: are you a motu?
<hyperair> i guess that's how grim my situation is eh >_>
<RoAkSoAx> kobrien, yep
<kobrien> good you review a patch for me?
<kobrien> could*
<RoAkSoAx> kobrien, bug?
<lfaraone> kobrien: you don't just need a motu, you need a core dev.
<RoAkSoAx> bug #?
<lfaraone> RoAkSoAx: bug 561432
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 561432 in ruby "Improper undefined method error" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/561432
<kobrien> oh ok, I misunderstood
<lfaraone> kobrien: I misspoke earlier, no worries.
<RoAkSoAx> kobrien, ruby is in main so you'll need a core dev
<kobrien> RoAkSoAx: thanks. Seeing as how someone has subscribed "ubuntu sponsors" and "ruby motu" to the bug, do I need to do anything more?
<geser> be patient :)
<kobrien> cool cool. :)
<lfaraone> geser: hm. that won't make it into lucid, will it...
<RoAkSoAx> kobrien, nope, just wait for someone to review it and upload it
<kobrien> RoAkSoAx: cheers
<lfaraone> RoAkSoAx: but while we have your attention, could you review the merge proposals for SRUing bug 301190 ?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 301190 in etoys "etoys does not launch" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/301190
<geser> lfaraone: hard to tell
<lfaraone> RoAkSoAx: (it's the same change in each SRU, and I tested/built each in their own VM)
<RoAkSoAx> lfaraone, ok will take a look at it
<lfaraone> RoAkSoAx: thanks :)
<kobrien> eh, someone has changed my bug to wishlist but I really don't agree.
<kobrien> feedback?
<kobrien> ah, it's RoAkSoAx :)
<RoAkSoAx> kobrien, whenever you subscribe to ubuntu-sponsors you changed the bug to confirmed, and if possible, to wishlist
<kobrien> i see, so is it still considered a bug, cause it is incorrect behaviour of the code?
<RoAkSoAx> lfaraone, I'd get approvel from ubuntu-sru first, and then I'll sponsor your upload. And could you please provide buildlogs (of PPAs if possible) to test it?
<lfaraone> RoAkSoAx: uh, I thought persia approved it when he accepted the SRU request. Did I miss something?
<RoAkSoAx> lfaraone, i dont see any sru ack
<persia> I didn't approve anything but the nomination.
<RoAkSoAx> lfaraone, ^^
<RoAkSoAx> kobrien, yes whenever you subscribe to ubuntu-sponsors mark the bug as confirmed
<kobrien> RoAkSoAx: personally I can't
<RoAkSoAx> kobrien, btw... I just saw that ruby1.8 is using a patch system. You should make your change in a patch
<kobrien> RoAkSoAx: debdiff won't work? there's a link in the bugreport to a ruby site with a patch.
<RoAkSoAx> kobrien, yes you have to attache the debdiff, however, you are modifying the source directly. You need to create a patch and make the change in the patch
<kobrien> RoAkSoAx: ah, I've found docs, ok. thanks
<RoAkSoAx> kobrien, i have unsubscribe your bug from ubuntu-sponsors for now, subscribe again when you made the proper changes..
<kobrien> RoAkSoAx: ok, understood
<lfaraone> persia: my apologies. would you have time to review the attached branches?
<persia> lfaraone: I can't approve an SRU: you really want someone in the SRU team.
<lfaraone> jdong: poke.
<jdong> lfaraone: yeah, what bug number?
<lfaraone> jdong: bug 301190
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 301190 in etoys "etoys does not launch" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/301190
<jdong> *looking*
<jdong> apologies, I'm a bit behind in my SRU bug tracking.
<lfaraone> jdong: no problem, I only posted it two days ago :)
<jdong> lfaraone: ok, you've got a SRU ack :)
<jdong> I do like the shiny new workflow with bzr :)
<lfaraone> jdong: you and me both. I detested debdiffs, and the pretty colors make it easy to review.
<lfaraone> RoAkSoAx: see above :)
<hyperair> debdiffs rock.
<jdong> lol and I started a war ;-)
<hyperair> ;-)
<lfaraone> hyperair: but when you need to make a fix you need to build a new source package, generate the debdiff, upload it as an attachment... :P
<lfaraone> (vs. "commit, push, wait")
<hyperair> lfaraone: actually no you don't.
<hyperair> lfaraone: the thing about debdiffs are that... they are diffs.
<hyperair> lfaraone: any -p1 diff would do.
<lfaraone> hyperair: good point :)
<hyperair> my workflow is: git diff <old-tag>, and fire off an email
<lfaraone> well, we'll have both methods working for the immediate future; I don't think anybody's suggesting we dump them, I just think new people may find it easier. But I should shut up, since I havne't done testing.
<hyperair> lfaraone: there are many who share that opinion
<hyperair> lfaraone: but i just dislike bzr.
 * ScottK tried the new way and found it slower and more complex so far.
<directhex> ScottK, i tried it, then hyperair informed me (correctly) that the bzr branch on launchpad wasn't the same as the package in the archive. which annoyed me
<ScottK> I can imagine.
<directhex> given i'd spent my time preparing a bunch of changes which were already in the archive but not in bzr
<lfaraone> directhex: interesting. usually it is only 12h behind or so.
<Laney> 12h is way more than 0h
<lfaraone> Laney: ideally, we'd use push mirroring :)
<directhex> it's a good thing we don't have a release coming, or an un-warned 12h delay between developer doing one thing and being able to make changes to it would be vexatious
<hyperair> i imagine it must take 12 hours to import all the changes made in the archive into the bzr trees >_>
<Laney> I just accidently put Britain's Got Talent on
 * Laney scrubs eyes with acid
<hyperair> lol
 * ScottK notes a distressing lack of stuff to review in the queue.  Please fix stuff.
 * Rhonda sighs.
<hyperair> ScottK: if you have main upload privileges go upload indicator-application please =p
<directhex> Laney, i thought that wasn't until thursday evening
<Laney> dunno, check ITV1 if you dare
<ScottK> I do, but I'm not going to touch that one.  Also, stuff I upload, I can't accept.
<Rhonda> ScottK: Good that I asked you to sync wesnoth 1:1.8-1 right ahead, seems my support for parallel build in 1:1.8-2 is giving troubles, at least on Debian buildds. %-/
<directhex> IT'S A FUNNY POLITICS JOKE
<hyperair> heheh
<Laney> oh
<Laney> :(
<ScottK> Rhonda: I was about to ask.
<hyperair> ScottK: oh yeah, i filed a sync request about nautilus-share.
<ScottK> Rhonda: Is there anything in -2 we should cherrypick for a -1ubunu1 upload?
<Rhonda> ScottK: The two patches that I pulled from upstream would make a lot of sense, yes.
<hyperair> bug #565418
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 565418 in nautilus-share "Sync nautilus-share (main) 0.7.2-13 from Debian Unstable" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/565418
<ScottK> hyperair: It's best to wait for an archive admin with shell access to deal with the syncs.
<hyperair> ScottK: okay.
<ScottK> Rhonda: If we could get a bug with a debdiff, then we could get that going.
<hyperair> ScottK: i think it still needs an ack from someone with main-upload-privileges though.
<ScottK> hyperair: I don't really know enough about Gnome stuff to have an opinion.
<hyperair> ScottK: alright then
<Laney> how does the rcbugs page look?
<lfaraone> it's always interesting to see "ubuntu1) karmic" in debian changelogs :) http://packages.debian.org/changelogs/pool/main/n/ncpfs/ncpfs_2.2.6-7/changelog.html
<Laney> looks like those changes should have been forwarded
<lfaraone> Laney: they were merged back, yes.
<ScottK> Laney: Lots of bugs on it.
 * lfaraone is currently looking at syncing ncpfs.
<Laney> pulled though, not pushed
<sistpoty> ScottK: can you take a look at bug #542634 please? I'm a little bit lost there :/
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 542634 in zope.security "Add python-zope.security-untrustedpython metapackage" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/542634
<ScottK> Sure.
<sistpoty> thanks
 * ScottK is confused too.
 * imbrandon is always confused
<ScottK> sistpoty: Let's see if we can get an opinion from doko
<imbrandon> ScottK: did you see my note about libgda ?
<ScottK> imbrandon: I did.  I subscribed the release team.  I think it's reasonable, but didn't want to decide all by myself
<imbrandon> k
<imbrandon> bdrung: ping ( re: apt-mirror )
<ajmitch> sistpoty: sorry that I didn't comment on it, but I don't know that part well enough
<sistpoty> k, thanks ScottK and ajmitch
<ajmitch> zope has further turned into small piles of black magic :)
<imbrandon> lol
<lfaraone> ajmitch: it's always been magic :P
<ajmitch> but they've cut it up into smaller piles
<ajmitch> ScottK: do you know if ~ubuntu-archive is still syncing packages?
<bdrung> imbrandon: pong
<ScottK> ajmitch: It's a matter if someone has time.
<ScottK> Should be so.
<ajmitch> so I have to bribe someone, or perhaps change the importance away from wishlist
<ScottK> Just put something suitable RC sounding in the description.
<ajmitch> "package is burnt toast with php 5.3"
<imbrandon> bdrung: i seen you applied ( and authored ) a few patches in apt-mirror, just wanted to let you know i have commited those to upstreams svn today
<imbrandon> so they will be in the next release ( maybe today if i can get the other patches ready )
<bdrung> imbrandon: great
<ScottK> bdrung: Is Audacious all sorted out?
<bdrung> imbrandon: one thing that does not work properly: killing apt-mirror with ctrl+c (it kills only a subprocess)
<bdrung> ScottK: no, two bugs remain: bug #564087 and #564092
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 564087 in g15daemon-audacious "FTBFS against audacious 2.3" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/564087
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 564092 in xmp "FTBFS against audacious 2.3" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/564092
<imbrandon> bdrung: probably, never thought about it being run interactively, my mindset is normaly run as a cron, but yea i'll have a look at that
<ScottK> sistpoty: Since you approved the audacious FFe, I think you should help with those.
<bdrung> imbrandon: thanks
<lfaraone> bdrung: hm. whenever I kill it, the network IO stops, so I assume the threads die with it.
<sistpoty> crap, that's what you got for only checking rdepends but not build-rdepends
<lfaraone> but the lockfile does not go away :)
<imbrandon> lfaraone: yea the lockfile bug is fixed in svn now
 * sistpoty fixes
<ScottK> excellent.
<bdrung> sistpoty: and i forgot to check it completely.
<sistpoty> well, yeah, things happen... :(
<bdrung> lfaraone: do you use the latest version?
<lfaraone> bdrung: no, I mean the version in karmic. Is there a behavioral change in this regard in Lucid?
<ScottK> sistpoty: I'd appreciate your opinion on Bug 561631.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 561631 in libpcap "Lucid Sync-Request FFE libpcap version 1.1.1" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/561631
<sistpoty> *looking*
<bdrung> lfaraone: yes, the lock file removal is fixed in lucid
<imbrandon> yes, and once 0.4.7 is out i'm going to do a -backport, just need to find enough fingers to get it all done ;)
<bdrung> imbrandon: backport?
<imbrandon> for apt-mirror to older supported releases
<sistpoty> ScottK: libpcap is in main, and has very many rdepends, I fear I'll need to thouroughly review the entire diff
<ScottK> sistpoty: I think it's worth considering, but I don't know enough to really decide.
<bdrung> imbrandon: which releases?
<imbrandon> bdrung: all that are still under support, should be fairly simple given the lax dependencys
<crimsun> sistpoty: it's a bit big for my comfort, but I understand the discomfort with carrying the current version for 5 years, too.
<crimsun> sistpoty: I'm happy to help; there seem to be only 3 source packages that b-d on libpcap0.8-dev
<crimsun> 3 in main, that is
<sistpoty> crimsun: sure, any help is welcome
<sistpoty> crimsun: can you test the 3 packages in main?
<crimsun> sistpoty: sure. I'll work on that in about seven hours for a stretch
<sistpoty> excellent, thanks crimsun
<sistpoty> crimsun: and if you find anything other noteworthy, just add a comment to the FFe in question
<ScottK> geser: You TIL rbot.  There's a security fix in Debian I think we'd want.  Would you please have a look at a merge?
<geser> ScottK: can do. Does the switch to v3 format need a FFe?
<ScottK> geser: No.
<ScottK> If that's going to cause problems it'll almost certainly fail to build and we'll know
<geser> ScottK: merged
<ScottK> geser: Thanks.  I'll accept it when it hits the queue.
 * ScottK looks at http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/bugs/rcbugs/ and invites others to find fixes we could benifit from.
<geser> ScottK: do you know if sync requests will be processed in time or should packages get synced with the syncpackage script?
<ScottK> I don't know for sure, but I think they will.
<sistpoty> ScottK: commented on libpcap. I think I'm ok with getting it in, but I'd like someone else take a look at it as well (crimsun maybe?) and see testing of all rdepends in main
<ScottK> sistpoty: OK.  Please ask for that in the bug.  I think we should let slangasek make the final call on this one.
<sistpoty> ScottK: already done. an opinion from slangasek would certainly be preferred :)
<ScottK> lucas_: Is it possible your last rebuild was done with Main only even for Universe packages?  I see a lot of FTBFS due to non-existant packages that do in fact exist in Universe.
<imbrandon> ScottK: the more i look at libgda4-4.0.8 ( and subsuqent fix for ftbfs ) we'll need to push that as a sru when we get the x86_64 worked out
<imbrandon> ( thats the opinion of the DD's too from the gnome team )
<ScottK> imbrandon: OK.  Thanks for looking into it.  BTW, I think deciding stuff shouldn't be uploaded yet should count on core-dev apps too.
<imbrandon> heh
<slangasek> sistpoty: do you have the bug # handy for that one?
<sistpoty> slangasek: bug #561631
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 561631 in libpcap "Lucid Sync-Request FFE libpcap version 1.1.1" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/561631
<sistpoty> slangasek: crimsun volunteered to test rdepends in main, but will need a few hours before doing so
<sistpoty> bdrung: do you have the HW to test g15daemon-audacious?
<sistpoty> bdrung: as I've got a trivial fix around now
<bdrung> sistpoty: no. you can give me 100 euro and i will buy the HW ;)
<lfaraone> If a sync request would fix a bug (say, bug 549692), should I modify that bug, or create a new one?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 549692 in paros "paros won't start because it can't find license file" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/549692
<sistpoty> bdrung: haha... then let's just cross fingers that it'll still work with the ftbfs fix (just updating one include directive)
<sistpoty> bdrung: I haven't forwarded the change to debian yet, and am quite sure that I'll forget to do so... can you do that please (if it affects unstable as well)?
<bdrung> sistpoty: currently it affects only experimental
<sistpoty> bdrung: ah, ok
<bdrung> sistpoty: didn't we have a tool for sending our changes to debian?
<sistpoty> bdrung: could be... I prefer reportbug after checking on an unstable system though
<Kangarooo> to get programm to universe i found i need to post to launchpad request for packaging or package myself. if that is done then i post it to revu but http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/ is down
<Kangarooo> ups its forbiden
<lfaraone> Kangarooo: new packages are not being accepted right now, so there's no rush :)
<sistpoty> Kangarooo: hm? revu is down?
<geser> bdrung: submittodebian? never used it personally
<lfaraone> Kangarooo: I'd ask about it in #ubuntuwire
<sistpoty> crap, revu *is* down :(
 * sistpoty fixes it
<bdrung> geser: yes
<ajmitch> sistpoty: the server itself is down?
<sistpoty> ajmitch: nope, just apache returns a 403
<lfaraone> submittodebian works pretty well in my experience, but occasionally picks up extraneous changes (like debian/control)
<ajmitch> sistpoty: ugh, that's bad
<sistpoty> ajmitch: not necessarily, looks like md is not mounted
<sistpoty> (where revu resides)
<imbrandon> fun fun
<ajmitch> that's still bad
<sistpoty> ajmitch: or can you take a look, since you're already logged in?
<Kangarooo> and what to do if i asked for packaging and someone else packages then will he also post to revu or i need to check LP page and get and post to revu that package?
<ajmitch> yeah I can confirm it's not mounted
<ajmitch> but /dev/md0 isn't looking happy
<lfaraone> Kangarooo: most likely the packaging will  not be done unless you do it yourself :)
<imbrandon> is revu still on spooky ?
<ajmitch> sistpoty: the server was rebooted ysterday?
<ajmitch> imbrandon: yep
<Kangarooo> ajmitch: i hope this is small problem and server is in cloud :)
<Kangarooo> like in cloud computer not rip
<imbrandon> Kangarooo: revu will be fixed, its just a matter of when ( depending on the severity of the issue )
<lfaraone> Did I update bug 549692 properly to reflect its status as a sync request? (syncing would fix the bug the reporter asked)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 549692 in paros "Sync paros 3.2.13-6 (universe) from Debian testing (main) [paros won't start because it can't find license file]" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/549692
<Kangarooo> lfaraone: but if i post package request then if not me then someone from motu packages it or anyone also who is not motu can do that? (if yes dont answer- i think yes but not sure)
<lfaraone> Kangarooo: somebody *may* package it. if they are not in MOTU, they'll post it to REVU and be responcible for getting it accepted.
<ajmitch> sistpoty: I think someone needs to take a look at the raid setup there, /dev/md0 doesn't want to go
<Kangarooo> ok thx. ok now the bigest question this maybe a security issue: is programm put to universe checked by someone like checked All code it contains?
<sistpoty> ajmitch: ok, I'll take a look
<ajmitch> sistpoty: thanks :)
<doctormo> http://doctormo.org/2010/04/17/input-debian-packaging-guide/
<ScottK> sistpoty: g15daemon-audacious accepted.  Thanks.
<lfaraone> Kangarooo: uh, yes, that's the purpose of the sponsorship / mentorship guide.
<lfaraone> Kangarooo: * system, I mean
<doctormo> I'm after some really simple deb packaging guides, I got a few links so far, but they're rather more verbose.
<sistpoty> ScottK: thanks!
<ScottK> doctormo: The problem is that packaging is inherently complex.  Anything simple is wrong or dangerously incomplete.
<ScottK> Making it simple is an unsolved problem.
<doctormo> ScottK: It doesn't have to simple in it's end condition, it just needs to build up with grace
<doctormo> Instead of the lumbering clunky documents I read in a few of these links
<ScottK> That's not easy either.
<doctormo> At least I'll know where to come for critique ;-)
<ScottK> Part of the problem is that as soon as you understand packaging, you're inherently unqualified to write documentation for people that don't.
<ScottK> There's a very narrow window where you still remember what it was like to learn.
<Kangarooo> so no one can put programm witch contains line witch simulates virus? like deleting files. gaining sudo and listening to keystrokes and at random time execute that.
<ScottK> Trying to catch people in that window and force them to do documentation is hard.
<doctormo> ScottK: Well I don't know how to make deb packages, even though I've done it several times.
<ScottK> Kangarooo: In theory no.  In practice no system is perfect.  AFAIK it hasn't happened yet.
<jdong> Kangarooo: in general, yes, for new packages 2 sponsors and an archive manager reviews the code comprehensively
<slangasek> so I was just thinking yesterday that https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Complete could use some refining
<jdong> Kangarooo: and for most uploads in general, there are developers that look at what's being uploaded
<slangasek> but stopped short of editing it because I don't want to push things there that aren't considered community best practice
<jdong> Kangarooo: from personal experience, when I've made some careless oversights in my uploads, I've had fellow developers email me a few hours afterwards.
<jdong> (At the same time this does NOT mean you should blindly go trusting every package in the repository from a security standpoint...)
<bdrung> sistpoty: now only bug #564092 remains
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 564092 in xmp "FTBFS against audacious 2.3" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/564092
<Kangarooo> ok. i wast just confused 2 days ago why i had system update for sudo. and i hoped it wont take something over with sudo. couse i have never experienced any problem with it and problem with sudo may do some big problem like not overwriting some config and telling all done.
<sistpoty> bdrung: I'll take a stab at it
<bdrung> thanks
<bdrung> i will fix bug #563043 as counterpart
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 563043 in audacious "audacious2.png alpha blending is wrong" [Medium,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/563043
<Kangarooo> ok thx all and sistpoty ur welcome :)
<doctormo> What is the easiest way to install all build deps for a given control file?
<Kangarooo> doctormo: yes make post why packaged things work. im similar like u - tryg to package but cant understand why they work
<lfaraone> Kangarooo: if you have specific questions please ask.
<dutchie> doctormo: there's a mk-build-deps thingy
<dutchie> you can just "sudo mk-build-deps -i" and it creates and installs the build dependencies
<lfaraone> dutchie: copy and paste :)
<doctormo> This is very much like Alchemy, some things work, some others don't, no one knows quite why.
<lfaraone> doctormo: well, there are usually good reasons for this, but it's poorly documented :)
<doctormo> lfaraone: Of course! don't you know anything about Science!
<bdrung> i had two problems at the beginning: 1. i didn't know all tools. there are a bunch of tools. you need to know how they play together 2. i didn't know how debian/rules worked. which targets were called in which order.
<doctormo> bdrung: The targets thing sounds important
<bdrung> doctormo: there are only one or two websites showing the targets graph
<bdrung> doctormo: maybe it's time for a gui helping to create a package
 * lfaraone just used CDBS and didn't worry about targets :)
 * sistpoty recalls a packaging without helpes session
#ubuntu-motu 2010-04-18
<arand> How does cdbs simple patchsys handle patches normally, just take everything in debian/patches in alphabetical order? (So I can just cp a couple of patches there is they are otherwise in the right format?)
<bdrung> arand: yes
<arand> bdrung: cheers, that makes things simple enough :)
<ScottK> bdrung: Is this icon the same one that had audacious upstream here a few days ago asking for audacious to be removed from Ubuntu?
<doctormo> ScottK: please critique this diagram, it shows my current understanding: http://imagebin.ca/view/dswC-M0r.html and is very probably wrong.
<bdrung> ScottK: you are missinformed. i asked upstream if the upstream icon should look really like this http://launchpadlibrarian.net/44152900/audacious2-on-black.png - i did not create a new icon nor any other change.
<ScottK> bdrung: I was here in the channel when it happened.
<bdrung> ScottK: i asked upstream if they like the new svg icon and if they will accept it. they said yes.
<ScottK> bdrung: Get them to say that in the bug and I'll accept it.
<bdrung> <nenolod> bdrung, it looks nice
<bdrung> <bdrung> nenolod: will you accept it?
<bdrung> <nenolod> bdrung, sure
<nenolod> it's fine
<nenolod> go for it
<ScottK> nenolod: You're upstream audacious?
<nenolod> yes.
<ScottK> OK.  Thanks.
<bdrung> nenolod: what do you think about following change to the tray icon search logic: searching for audacious2-panel. if it fails search for audacious2
<nenolod> the audacious/audacious2 distinction is no longer really relevant
<nenolod> audacious classic (XMMS based audacious) has been dead for 2 years now.
<bdrung> nenolod: but the 2 is in the binary name and in the icon name. will you drop that?
<nenolod> bdrung, at some point.
<nenolod> bdrung, it was reworked to allow audacious and audacious2 to be installed alongside each other.  audacious 1.5 and audacious 2.0 PAPI/PABI were identical
<bdrung> nenolod: http://pastebin.com/S1a61Yhv
<bdrung> nenolod: this makes the statusicon themeable in an easy way
<nenolod> bdrung, i already added that
<nenolod> bdrung, to upstream...
<doctormo> So, does that diagram look reasonable guys?
<nenolod> like 3 days ago
<bdrung> nenolod: really? hg pull doesn't pull it.
<nenolod> it's there
<nenolod> hg pull -u
<nenolod> the -u is important
<Laney> I really didn't think that un(iverse|seeded) uploads were subject to AA review
<bdrung> nenolod: still not there
<nenolod> it is.
<nenolod> i am looking at it.
<nenolod> ---> http://hg.atheme.org/audacious-plugins/audacious-plugins/rev/822c842d471e <---
<bdrung> strange
<bdrung> nenolod: hg update did the job
<nenolod> bdrung, use hg pull --rebase
<nenolod> in the future
<nenolod> just noting!!
<nenolod> :p
<bdrung> nenolod: can you add the check for audacious2?
<nenolod> no
<bdrung> http://pastebin.com/aTs4u7iv
<nenolod> i disagree with that check
<nenolod> for the reasons outlined above
<nenolod> audacious2 name is deprecated
<bdrung> ok, then the icons should drop the 2
<nenolod> they will eventually.
<nenolod> it's not a high priority thing
<bdrung> then this will be a diff that we carry until it's renamed
<nenolod> i guess i'm going to have to protest that diff
<ScottK> doctormo: Looking now
<bdrung> nenolod: just retitle the bug to "rename the icons back to audacious" ;)
<nenolod> bdrung, i'll title it "ubuntu package maintainers are arrogant"
<nenolod> but do what you want
<nenolod> i just find it somewhat strange that someone who thinks having 9001 patches is dumb, wants to add 9001 patches
<ScottK> nenolod: Please don't paint your brush too widely.
<nenolod> oh well ScottK is ok
<bdrung> nenolod: the problem is that the icon is not found in the current situation. the statusicon searches for audacious, but the icons are called audacious2. i see only two solutions: 1. search for audacious2 as tray icon or 2. rename the icons to audacious
<nenolod> bdrung, rename the ubuntu specific icons then... the fallback icon uri should be changed
<ScottK> bdrung: I think this is an upstream issue and not a packaging issue and you should take the discussion to an audacious forum.
<nenolod> bdrung, that last part is not possible as the ubuntu-proposed replacement svg icon hasn't been committed to hg yet as it was just filed in a bug today
<bdrung> nenolod: "ubuntu specific icons"? the upstream png icon was called audacious2.png. - renaming the svg icon from audacious2.svg to audacious.svg?
<nenolod> yes.  as far as 2.3 goes, the new icon is still ubuntu-specific obviously
<nenolod> we didn't ship the svg icon in 2.3, as it did not exist...
<bdrung> nenolod: k (2.3 has the same problem, because it ships audacious2.png with the 2 in it)
<nenolod> as far as upstream goes, 2.4 will replace the icon with the new .svg icon installed as audacious.svg
<nenolod> :p
<bdrung> nenolod: i will rename the icon tomorrow and update the patch. then we can drop this patch http://pastebin.com/aTs4u7iv
<bdrung> and everybody will be happy :)
<nenolod> my point is
<nenolod> having 9001 patches doesn't benefit ubuntu audacious users
<nenolod> if that makes sense
<bdrung> nenolod: having 9001 patches makes only sense, if they end up in the next upstream release
<bdrung> good night
<nenolod> heh annoying story on that: the fedora guy keeps patching audacious (the patches are good), but when offered push access, he declines it
<nenolod> :p
<doctormo> thanks ScottK
<ScottK> doctormo: It's kind of right and kind of wrong in ways that I really like the time to explain today.  Maybe tomorrow.  Feel free to give me a ping.
<doctormo> ScottK: I presume you meant to add a "don't" in there somewhere
<ScottK> Actually the error was like/lack
<ScottK> But in principle, yes.
<doctormo> ScottK: A dedicated seriousness we rarely see these days.
<arand> doctormo: That diagram looks really nice (my cargo-cult kind of packaging knowledge might not be the best point of critique, but...). You planning to make more accessible guide to packages?
<doctormo> arand: Yea, someone asked for a vidual guide similar to the foss visual guide I made.
<carstenh> doctormo: the arrow from the "debian source control (not signature)" file to pbuilder means that you upload the dsc file to pbuilder?
<doctormo> carstenh: Ah right, it's the changes file right?
<doctormo> One I missed
<carstenh> doctormo: you don't seem to like answering questions ;)  when you upload a package to debian you have to sign .changes and .dsc but i have no idea how ubuntu handles uploads
<doctormo> carstenh: I don't?
<persia> It's precisely the same.
<persia> Well, kinda.
<persia> The signed .changes file needs to be source.changes, but otherwise the same.
<carstenh> doctormo: (unless ubuntu does weird things with uploading directly from launchpad) you have to feed dput with the .changes file, but that does not mean that this is the only file you upload. how would pbuilder extract the tar.gz when you don't upload ist?
<carstenh> s/ist/it/
<doctormo> carstenh: Of course you have to upload the whole lot of them (or rather that's what the command does) but you specify the changes file on the cli
<doctormo> I need to get away from what the computer does and focus on what the user does
<carstenh> doctormo: this is why i asked whether "you upload the dsc file to pbuilder". it's fine if this is by intention
<doctormo> carstenh: It's not, that's why I'm editing it, because I was wrong.
<carstenh> doctormo: you missed the most important part of packaging, the packaging itself. dh_make only generates templates
<carstenh> doctormo: this was done for debian from a different point of view but might be helpful to get some ideas: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Debian-package-cycle.png
<carstenh> persia: do you need to upload a build log to show that you tried to build it before uploading?
<ScottK> carstenh: No.
<ScottK> If you're a developer you just upload.  If you need to be sponsored, the sponsor might ask for that.
<persia> carstenh: No.  We trust uploaders to check first.  Part of how this is encouraged is that when sponsoring, the sponsors always test-build, and reject stuff that doesn't build, so folks are used to being sure before they are ready to be granted upload rights.
<persia> ScottK: Hey.  If you're a developer, you test-build for your own peace of mind, and upload, right?
<carstenh> are there any statistics how often ftbfs happen in comparison with debian where a dd obviously needs to build the package?
<ScottK> persia: Yes
 * persia knows of exceptions, but very much hopes they remain exceptions.
<doctormo> http://imagebin.ca/view/sp2isyc.html
<doctormo> I expect to go through 20 revisions of this before I get it right
<ScottK> carstenh: Actually I think we probably do better.
<persia> carstenh: There aren't, although we have had to fix a little over a thousand arch:all pacakges that could build on local DD machines but not build on the builders from source upload (thankfully nearly all of these patches are now integrated in Debian)
<ScottK> carstenh: It's not uncommon for me to see arch all package FTBFS on Ubuntu because the DD the uploaded it to Debian had something that would build in his local environment, but not in the pristine environment of a buildd
<ScottK> My favorite was the one I found where the username of the DD was hard coded into the maintainer scripts.
<lfaraone> lol.
<persia> doctormo: Please say "packaging files", rather than `dh_make -e`.  In 90% of cases, using dh_make only makes it harder for the user.
<doctormo> persia: packaging files isn't an action or command, if none are appropriate, I'll remove it.
<persia> (and really, one just needs control, copyright, changelog, contrib, and rules: of these 2 are trivially machine generated, 1 is available as an exampe that works in 90% of cases ,and the other two require thought)
<persia> doctormo: My contention is that none are appropriate.
<carstenh> ok, arch:all are some kind of special. before ubuntu or lucas built the whole archive ftbfs could get missed
<doctormo> persia: What makes a debian directory? manually created?
<persia> carstenh: s/could/would/, but yeah :)  Most are fixed now, between the various sources of rebuilds.
<persia> doctormo: My recommendation is currently `mkdir debian` for the general case, but there are some efforts to automate stuff (python-stdeb is a good example).
<ScottK> Well, it's an example
<doctormo> persia: Do you think that the automatic generation would likely to be dependant of the type of code/package?
 * ScottK is sure it's made it to good yet.
<ScottK> is/isn't
<persia> For the true general solution, we lack 1) polishing liw's work to autogenerate DEP5 copyrights, and 2) cleanup of the build-deps detectors for a few more languages, and 3) some integration scripts.
<persia> doctormo: The build-dep detector will always be language-dependent.  Nothing else needs be.
<persia> And there's no reason one can't write a generalised pluggable build-dep detector framework, but nobody has done this yet.
<doctormo> I mean for making good general debian directories
<persia> I don't think so.  For most packages, the implementation details of the code are irrelevant to the packaging, except in 1) determining build dependencies, and 2) working around any imperfections of the upstream build system.
<carstenh> persia: one thing you miss is that there is now a new dpkg format where a second tar.gz replaces the diff.gz and that is able to handle tar.bz2 as upstream source archive
<persia> carstenh: Hrm?  How do I miss that?
<ScottK> carstenh: It's an option, but in most cases really doesn't provide benifit.
<persia> carstenh: Or do you mean that I failed to list source/format as a required file?  It's useful, and recomended, but I don7t think it's any more required than watch.
<ScottK> Lintian whines about its lack, but that's one of it's sillier complaints.
<carstenh> persia: sorry, not you, doctormo :)
<persia> (and I usually recommend packaging by starting with the watch file)
<ScottK> The absence of source/format clearly means v1.  To pretend anything else is just insanity.
<carstenh> ScottK: optional yes, but people will expect a diff.gz when they read this diagram
<ScottK> Adding source/format for v1 packages is just busywork.
<ScottK> carstenh: For the general case that's reasonable.
<persia> adding source/format for v1 packages is against the lintian recommendation.
<carstenh> doctormo: see above
<persia> It says to only do that if filing a bug about how v3 fails.
<ScottK> persia: The assumption is that there's no other reason you'd not want to switch.
 * lfaraone thinks the idea of adding a new *directory* just to contain a single file is madness.
<persia> doctormo: Yeah, don7t break down how the source package works: it's .dsc + package files (identified in the .dsc)
<ScottK> lfaraone: If can contain more than one file if you have binaries in your debian.tar.gz.
<lfaraone> ScottK: debian/source/?
<ScottK> lfaraone: Yes.
<doctormo> persia: what do you mean?
 * lfaraone admits being only cursorly familiar with v3
<persia> doctormo: A .dsc contains some metainformation and a list of files (and checksums) that make up the source package.  There are steadily decreasing requirements regading the specific files that are required.
<carstenh> doctormo: if you substitute diff.gz with diff.gz or debian.tar.gz it should be more correct and less confusing for people rebuilding a package that produces a debian.tar.gz
<persia> Anyway, back to trying to set up a system that can play torcs to test whether the new openAL offers useful benefits for lucid (and other adventures in yak shaving)
<ScottK> carstenh: You can also have a debian.tar.bz2.
<doctormo> Revision 03: http://imagebin.ca/view/UdvI1Y.html
<carstenh> ScottK: do you have any idea how to write debian.tar.{gz,bz2} human readable and short? ;)
<ScottK> Sorry, need to run out (not really)
<doctormo> carstenh: I was thinking just tar or tar.xz
<wgrant> xz isn't supported yet, though.
<funkyHat> https://edge.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-dev points to a non-existant page on the wiki
<doctormo> wgrant: funny guy
<wgrant> doctormo: What? I'm serious.
<doctormo> OK I'm going to stop at rev 04 and then come back, I think I'll tackle each collection of transactions in the picture as a chapter.
<lucas_> ScottK: looking at the number of failed builds, I don't think so. the number looks normal
<ScottK> lucas_: OK, but a number of the universe package failures are for non-existant packages that clearly exist and at the time were in Universe
<lucas_> ScottK: I'll do another rebuild now that the archive is frozen
<lucas_> ScottK: I know there was a problem with updating the chroot at the beginning of the rebuild
<ScottK> lucas_: OK.  Thank you.  Sounds great.
<micahg> ScottK: some of the FTBFSs in the last rebuild were due to the deleted binary packages
<ScottK> lucas_: BTW, I've been finding quite a number of good fixes thanks to your tests.
<ScottK> micahg: Yes, but not relevant to the ones I was questioning.
<persia> micahg: That's part of what is useful to discover, and the point of it all.
<micahg> ScottK: k, seems I missed the beginning of teh conversation
<ScottK> micahg: BTW, where you find such cases we should get them removed binaries restored by fixing the FTBFS or get the binaries that now fail removed too.
<ScottK> That's useful work here in the end game.
<micahg> ScottK: I did for the one I noticed
<ScottK> micahg: Excellent.
<ajmitch> ScottK: I did end up filing that pychecker bug
<micahg> just needed a sync from Debian
<ScottK> ajmitch: I just went through syncs tonight and I didn't see anything.
<ajmitch> still waiting for ~ubuntu-release
<ScottK> ajmitch: What bug?
 * ScottK doesn't recall the bugmail.
<ajmitch> bug 563543
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 563543 in ubuntu "FFe: Sync pychecker 0.8.18-4 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/563543
<ajmitch> the main sync I'm caring about at the moment is bug 562178, if you had a look at that tonight
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 562178 in php-apc "FFe: Sync php-apc 3.1.3p1-2 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/562178
<ScottK> ajmitch: The latter one I looked at and put in a stack I asked slangasek to do.  It should go through.
<ajmitch> thanks
<ScottK> ajmitch: Approved.  Please see the comment.
<ajmitch> ScottK: alright, thanks
<ajmitch> I believe the changes aren't necessary, as they were just to run it on python 2.5
<ajmitch> I'll put that in the bug in a minute
<kaushal> hi
<kaushal> is TB 3.04 available in jaunty-backports ?
<kaushal> checking in again for my query ?
<DktrKranz> kaushal: no, it isn't
<sistpoty> haha, I just saw an epic merge + patch system fail
<sistpoty> ScottK: haha, just saw that you commented on bug #565836 about the same thing as /me... and I was actually referring to YokoZar for input and just now realised that this might not be that clear ;)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 565836 in playonlinux "[FFe] Please sync playonlinux 3.7.3-1 (multiverse) from Debian unstable (contrib)" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/565836
<nigelb> nhandler, is bug 564070 ready for sponsorship?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 564070 in libgtk2-perl "libgtk2-perl ftbfs" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/564070
<nhandler> nigelb: Don't worry about that bug
<nigelb> nhandler, came to review queue today :)
<lfaraone> Hm. If a file was included in a GPL-2+ project with the following header: "courtesy of velAr the meerkat, denizen of #mpeg3c,This file is in the Public Domain", can it be included in universe? (is it DFSG-free?)
<jcfp> why not? public domain = copyright disclaimed
<jcfp> lfaraone: there's such software in the archive already, btw; projects with gpl-2+ and public domain code.
<persia> Anyone happen to know the timing of debian dinstall runs offhand?
 * persia wants to pull a bugfix sync adding amd64+armel support, but it's not published yet :(
<pochu> 19:19 >>> Topic for #debian-ftp: Feel free to idle but this isn't a discussion channel || dinstall starts at 0152,0752,1352,1952 UTC || #debian-dak || git clone http://ftp-master.debian.org/git/dak.git
<pochu> persia: ^
<persia> Thanks!
<pochu> np :)
<nhandler> Does anyone know the reasoning behind not merging Ubuntu support back into Debian's version of pbuilder?
<persia> Now I'm confused.  Package accepted at 12:33 UTC, dinstall at 1352 UTC, and now it's 1720 UTC.
<persia> Ah, poor mirror choice.
<jpds> ...
<persia> nhandler: You might want to check with lool about that: he's been doing a lot of work on pbuilder in Debian (and was recently accepted into upstream), and uses it for Ubuntu.
<ScottK> persia: An archive admin with shell access can sync from incoming.
<persia> ScottK: I like to a avoid that if I can (and in this case, I just needed not to use the mirror I selected).
<ScottK> OK
<persia> Ugh.  "Unsupported CPU".
 * persia wishes folks would just trust porters, and not add special checks in their supposedly portable code to detect the environment and not run there.
<ScottK> persia: Could you find a javaish person to deal with http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/NBS/libnb-platform10-java - It's not just a rebuild.
 * persia grumbles faintly in the direction of Oracle
<persia> One would think that if a company sponsored two open-source projects, that company would have an interest in them working together...
<ScottK> Interesting theory.
<ScottK> bdrung: Looking at the audacious FFe bug I see someone is having problems with the lastfm plugin now that it's updated.  Would you please look into that.
<nhandler> ScottK: He commented
<ScottK> I see now.  Thanks.
<ScottK> Thanks bdrung.
<lool> nhandler: What Ubuntu support do you mean?
<nhandler> lool: I just had a DD try and use Debian's pbuilder to create a lucid chroot, but he said it was not recognized as a valid dist. I'm seeing ubuntu support in pbuilder's git branch, is this in the repos?
<lool> nhandler: The delta is really limited nowadays, it's only the default mirror and release which change; I'd like to default to lsb_release output at some point, but that's not trivial
<lool> nhandler: I'd guess it's his debootstrap being out of date
<nhandler> I passted that guess on to the DD (he is at dinner now)
<lool> nhandler: If that doesn't help, details on how he runs pbuilder would be nice
<nhandler> lool: Sure thing
 * ScottK points lfaraone at http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/NBS/sugar-0.86 and urges him to peddle harder.
<ScottK> persia: Any thoughts on 565836?
 * persia takes back criticism of Oracle, and just wishes that the libraries weren't embedded in sources.
<persia> ScottK: I've never used playonlinux, nor do I expect to do so in the future, but the upstream changelog, though sadly brief, seems to be bugfixes
<ScottK> OK.
<persia> I'd really want to hear from YokoZar about it, though.
 * ScottK looks at YokoZar.
<ScottK> Thanks.
 * ScottK looks at the krb5-auth-dialog depwait and hopes someone will look at it and figure out what needs doing.
<YokoZar> ScottK: I don't use playonlinux but its regression potential is very low
<ScottK> YokoZar: Thanks.  Does that means it works well and is unlikely to break or it's so fubar it can't get worse?
<YokoZar> ScottK: It's basically a collection of workarounds with Wine, so it's a good thing when it's kept in sync with the Wine version it was written to
<ScottK> YokoZar: OK, so which version matches our Wine for Lucid?
<YokoZar> ScottK: 3.7.3, judging from their changelogs.  Which also happens to be the one in debian unstable multivers
<ScottK> YokoZar: Thanks.
<ScottK> YokoZar: If you'd don your MOTU hat and sponsor 565836, I'd appreciate it.
<imbrandon> moins ( afternoon ) all
<YokoZar> ScottK: It's a sync request...what exactly would I sponsor?
<imbrandon> bdrung: whats your dm key email ( so i can add you to the uploaders )
<ScottK> YokoZar: Sync reqeuest for non-developers need developer approval.
<YokoZar> ScottK: Ahh ok.  I'll test it today then and post there.
<ScottK> YokoZar: So if you approve it, say so in the bug and subscribe ubuntu-archive.
<ScottK> Thanks
<Laney> http://orangesquash.org.uk/~laney/haskell-installability/armel.png
<Laney> I'd call that complete
<Laney> those two packages have porting problems
<Laney> yay :)
<ScottK> StevenK: My non-Perl trained brain says that http://launchpadlibrarian.net/44724101/buildlog_ubuntu-lucid-i386.libpoe-component-client-dns-perl_1:1.051-1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz is FTBFS on the buildd's because the last two tests in that particular file need network access to succeed.  I'd appreciate it if you would have a look and see if that's correct and render an opinion about the advisability of removing the tests so that the package will build
<ScottK> .
<ScottK> YokoZar: I see at least one package looking to build-dep on libwine-dev, which we don't provide.  What's the solution? https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/dssi-vst/0.8-2/+build/1497469
<ari-tczew> when maverick will be open?
<YokoZar> ScottK: adding provides: libwine-dev to wine-dev I think
<ScottK> YokoZar: Could you take care of that?
<YokoZar> ScottK: Well it might be better to just change the build deps in the package.  I'll look at it anyway.
<siretart> ari-tczew:  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MaverickReleaseSchedule/
<ScottK> YokoZar: Whichever.  Please fix.
<gastons> am I allowed to add files under the DEBIAN directory?
<gastons> (besides control, postinst etc.)
<imbrandon> gastons: sure, but if its the right thing to do depends on the case
<gastons> I want to add a xml file there. It will be copied to ~/.some_config_dir, but if Install my .deb it fails.
<directhex> gastons, you never ever ever ever ever mess with DEBIAN/ manually
<imbrandon> gastons: debs are installed system wide, they have no concept of ~/ , the program should create/copy the needed xml's to the ~/ if needed
<gastons> isn't the postinst script meant to do that? or maybe from postinst should I call a config script?
<imbrandon> gastons: not really, i guess postinst could modify skel , but ewww, and what about existing users
<imbrandon> think about when like you install wine, it dosent make a ~/.wine in all users homes, but it does for each user that runs it ( on first run )
<imbrandon> based on some sane defaults
<joaopinto> gastons, home dirs should never be touched by a package install
<gastons> omg yeah I get it
<gastons> kk thanks all for clarifying this
<joaopinto> you can also create a wrapper script
<joaopinto> which creates the default config, and then runs the real command
<lfaraone> Free motu around to merge bug 301190? (SRU, acked by ~ubuntu-sru)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 301190 in etoys "etoys does not launch" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/301190
<ajmitch> to do a merge, or just upload the SRU to -proposed?
<ajmitch> ah, using bzr branches for it
<imbrandon> i should look into a bzr workflow
<imbrandon> i always end up using so many RCS's though, i guess bzr-* plugins will help with that
 * imbrandon is still doing alot by hand
<lfaraone> ajmitch: yeah :)
<ScottK> ajmitch: Would you please look at 565781 for sponsor review?
<lfaraone> ajmitch: merge the branch into lp:ubuntu/{jaunty,karmic,intrepid}/etoys and it'll be taken care of, apparently.
<ajmitch> bug 565781
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 565781 in ipplan "FFE: ipplan incompatible with php 5.3" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/565781
<lfaraone> imbrandon: it's *really* nice, IMHO. and yes, those plugins make life so much easier.
<ajmitch> ScottK: ok, already had that one open
<ScottK> ajmitch: Perfect.
<ajmitch> lfaraone: I'm not familiar enough yet with the right procedures for sponsoring branches, I need to read up on it
<ajmitch> ScottK: ipplan 4.92a-1 isn't showing up yet on ftp.debian.org, you may want to ping me about it in a bit
<ScottK> OK.
 * ScottK will try to rememver
<ScottK> v/b
<ajmitch> ok, I can see it in incoming.d.o
<persia> spy6 just uploaded a couple hours back.
<lfaraone> ajmitch: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DistributedDevelopment/Documentation/UploadingAPackage is the relevant page.
<Laney> oh whoops, I've just run bzr merge in the past
<lfaraone> james_w: if I understand that page properly, you have to dput *and* merge the branches?
<Laney> yes
<ajmitch> lfaraone: I don't think branch merging will do the upload of a source package just yet
<lfaraone> ajmitch: I assume that's planned, though, right?
<ajmitch> I think so, depending on the issues around trust paths, etc
<ajmitch> the NoMoreSourcePackages spec has been around for awhile
<lfaraone> Just do tag signing, and you should be good, no?
<ajmitch> a lot of the stuff around build recipes is in place now, I think
<ajmitch> someone like wgrant would know far better than I :)
<persia> Would need someone to write a job in LP that did the branch->SPR translation bit as well as fixing all the authentication bits.
<ScottK> You still have to upload.  If you don't push the bzr bits back to LP, it takes them from the archive, so at this point all you lose is some possible bits of history in the merge detail.
 * ajmitch waits oh so patiently for pbuilder update
<lfaraone> Do we consider SSH keys as secure as GPG keys?
<lfaraone> if so, there's no problem, unless the LP box is compromised.
<ajmitch> ssh keys are a different sort of beast, you don't get digital signatures with them
<jdong> indeed there's no chain of trust either
<lfaraone> jdong, ajmitch, but by simply being on the server, you have to know the person who pushed up the changes had access to the SSH keys in the LP account, no?
<jdong> not necessarily
<ajmitch> each source package has a gpg-signed file with the md5/sha-1/sha-256sums of the various source package components
<jdong> that can be faked.
<jdong> the bzr upload protocol lets me put in changesets that have your name on them.
<jdong> and I'm pretty sure I can rewrite history too
<ajmitch> bzr-rebase?
<jdong> what you need is the testament signing form.
<jdong> which, again, uses a GPG key :)
<ajmitch> were there plans to gpg-sign every bzr revision?
<lfaraone> jdong: ah, to prevent other accessors of ~ubuntu-branches from spoofing another's upload.
<lfaraone> *members
<jdong> amongst other things.
<jdong> ajmitch: I sure hope so.
<ajmitch> jdong: found a blueprint for it :)
<jdong> ajmitch: otherwise I don't know how we can trust the authenticity
<Laney> can't you sign a tag?
<lfaraone> Laney: you can "Sign all commits by a given committer.
<jdong> Laney: well yes, signing one revision does guarantee the state of the branch at that point
<jdong> Laney: but what happens between tags is my concern
<jdong> i.e. a blind bzr merge untrusted-branch can have some not-so-awesome consequences
<Laney> responsibility of the uploader isn't it?
<lfaraone> jdong: even if signed, a blind merge may pull in changes in between reviewing-code-on-web and merging.
<lfaraone> jdong: so the uploader should of course review the diff :)
<jdong> yes, indeed
<Laney> why can't you branch and then merge from that?
<ajmitch> sigh, OO.o uploaded, that'll kill buildds for a day or so :)
 * ajmitch didn't do it, fwiw
<lfaraone> Laney: huh?
<ajmitch> ScottK: ok, ipplan ACked, and I finally got back to pychecker
<ajmitch> it's sad that I've pretty much doubled my karma in 1 week
<wgrant> persia, ajmitch, lfaraone, jdong: So, we have recipe building pretty much implemented. There's just one or two backend bugs, plus the UI to sort out.
<wgrant> The backend was actually mostly implemented at a sprint in January, but the other stuff is taking a while :/
<persia> wgrant: Thanks for the update.  So it's close, but not there yet?  Are we expecting that apt-get source will work to pull the current source from a bzr pushed build?
<wgrant> persia: We may have it deployed for PPAs in LP 10.04.
<wgrant> And yes, it uploads a source package just about as normal, so apt-get source will work.
<persia> Nifty.  I like having flexible systems that work both ways (so upload commits, and commit uploads).
<ajmitch> the rcbugs list is depressing
<persia> Why?  Because it's long, or something else?
<ajmitch> because it's long
<ajmitch> plus I can see a few flaws in the versions where bugs are found
 * ajmitch is just adding a few comments, in case someone wants to look further at packages on the list
<ScottK> ajmitch: Thanks.
#ubuntu-motu 2011-04-11
<MTecknology> Hrm..... I wonder if it's to late to get a new package into 11.04...
<MTecknology> just made it into unstable :P
<RAOF> Beta 2 freeze is today :).
<RAOF> StevenK: You might be interested to know that the Do mpris plugin is advancing.  Sadly, it's advancing into limitations of the core :)
<lifeless> RAOF: mpris?
<StevenK> RAOF: Haha
<RAOF> The standard media player DBus interface
<lifeless> ah
<lifeless> I knew I had heard of it
<RAOF> StevenK: It's not a big problem; it's just that you'll have orphaned items in the Universe until the next refresh when you quit the player.
 * RAOF has a DynamicItemSource API in mind to fix this, but that obviously needs a new core release.
<RAOF> I'll see if I can finish a slightly hacky plugin for you this evening :)
<StevenK> \o/
<RAOF> While waiting for the DMB meeting, presumably :)
<dholbach> good morning
<ajmitch> hi dholbach
<dholbach> hi ajmitch
<damno> anybdy here?
<Rhonda> Never ever.
<damno> hello.. .
<damno> I need a bit of help
<Rhonda> We can't help you if you don't describe your problem. :)
<damno> i just compiled abiword successfully; but collab isnt working
<damno> I did install asio needed for collab to work; as it mentioned
<Rhonda> is collab part of abiword? I don't find any hint in that direction?
<Rhonda> Or what do you mean with collab?
<RAOF> StevenK: One mpris plugin, working with banshee.  Allow me to rebuild it with the quodlibet dbus path and you can take it away!
<RAOF> RAOF: And, indeed, http://cooperteam.net/MPRIS.dll is now available for your delectation.
<matttbe> Hello,
<matttbe> I'm looking for a sponsor to fix these two bug reports: https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/723994
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 723994 in cairo-dock (Ubuntu Natty) "FFe: Please update Cairo-Dock to 2.3.0~0rc1 version" [Wishlist,Confirmed]
<matttbe> https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/723995
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 723995 in cairo-dock-plug-ins (Ubuntu) "[FFe] Please update Cairo-Dock Plug-ins to 2.3.0~0rc1 version" [Wishlist,Confirmed]
<matttbe> Last week we received an ACK, two branches has been linked to these bug reports and they are ready to be pushed on Ubuntu branches (we just need a sponsor to upload them :) )
<AnAnt> Hello, I was asked to package a new upstream release of ttf-kacst-one, since it added support for Uyghur fonts
<AnAnt> will that be accepted ?
<AnAnt> as far as I understand, Ubuntu does not have Uyghur fonts supported
<AnAnt> LP 757540
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 757540 in ttf-kacst-one (Ubuntu) "Missing many Glyphs to support Uyghur (Uighur) Language" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/757540
<directhex> i didn't know Uighur was its own language
<lfaraone> AnAnt: that sounds like a new feature.
<AnAnt> it needs an FFe I think
<ScottK> AnAnt: It does need an FFe, but that sounds like one that would be likely be easy to approve.
<AnAnt> where was the FFe processagain ?
<ScottK> !ffe
<ubottu> Feature Freeze Exception. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess for the freeze exception process.
<ScottK> AnAnt: ^^^
<AnAnt> splendid
<AnAnt> thanks
<ScottK> AnAnt: Replied to you in the bug.
<AnAnt> ScottK: I already did so
<ScottK> OK. Please say so in the bug.
<AnAnt> done
<ScottK> superm1: I see that the most recent mythtv upload FTBFS on armel.  This is due to us switching from GL to GLES in Qt on armel.  I'm not sure if mythtv has any compile time options to build without GL or not.  I've added it to Bug #707794 to track it with the other affected packages.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 707794 in avogadro (Ubuntu Natty) "libqt4-opengl on armel should be compiled with OpenGL ES 2.x support" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/707794
<psusi> isn't the current time 16:41 UTC?
<ScottK> Plus or minus a few minutes, yes.
<ScottK> I have it as 16:38.
<psusi> so why has this meeting already taken place in the future? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/devweek1103/GetStarted
<ScottK> psusi: Feb 28th, 2011
<dholbach> psusi, developer week - not app developer week
<dholbach> 21 more minutes :)
<dholbach> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuAppDeveloperWeek
 * psusi wonders where he made the wrong turn
<AnAnt> LP 757629
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 757629 in sabily-grub-artwork (Ubuntu) "[FFe] New grub theme for Sabily Badr release" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/757629
<ScottK> AnAnt: Approved.
<AnAnt> thanks
<dholbach> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuAppDeveloperWeek starting in 15 minutes in #ubuntu-classroom
<ScottK> superm1: Apparently it was fixed to not use GL on armel before but the fix got dropped.
<superm1> ScottK, yeah i've been aware of the failures. upstream won't be fixing 0.24 for GLES at all, it will be something for 0.25
<superm1> armel isn't a priority architecture to them right now anywho
<ScottK> superm1: The fix to avoid GL was just re-uploaded.  Please update whatever VCS needs updating to the change doesn't get dropped again.
<ScottK> Understand it's not a priority, but I'd rather keep stuff buildable.
<superm1> could jani not have committed that to the VCS?
<superm1> oh it looks like maybe that field isn't populated correctly in debian/control right now
<superm1> okay i'll pull it in
<matttbe> Hello there,
<matttbe> I'm still looking for a sponsor to upload 2 packages: LP:723994 & LP:723995.
<matttbe> Is somebody can help?
<matttbe> LP: 723994
<matttbe> https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/723994
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 723994 in cairo-dock (Ubuntu Natty) "FFe: Please update Cairo-Dock to 2.3.0~0rc1 version" [Wishlist,Confirmed]
<matttbe> Two branches has been linked to these bug reports and they are ready to be pushed on Ubuntu branches
<micahg_> no, the branches still need to be reviewed and upstream tarball imported properly
<matttbe> micahg_: but I've modified these branches (I've modified the debian/watch, is it not what we had to do?)
<micahg_> no
<matttbe> :(
<matttbe> ok so I don't know what's wrong
<matttbe> ok so... anybody can help me to fix this bug in my branches? => https://code.launchpad.net/~cairo-dock-team/ubuntu/natty/cairo-dock/2.3.0-0rc1/+merge/51034
<matttbe> https://code.launchpad.net/~cairo-dock-team/ubuntu/natty/cairo-dock-plug-ins/2.3.0-0rc1/+merge/51035
<tumbleweed> matttbe: look at the link micahg_ provided in his review
<tumbleweed> it's not about tags, it's about the necessary pristine-tar  bits (I'm assuming)
<tumbleweed> why where you using -r with merge-upstream?
<micahg_> tumbleweed: yep
<matttbe> but this is what I have $ bzr merge-upstream --version 2.3.0~0rc1 http://launchpad.net/cairo-dock-core/2.3/2.3.0-0rc1/+download/cairo-dock-2.3.0~0rc1.tar.gz --distribution=natty
<matttbe> Using version string 2.3.0~0rc1.
<matttbe> bzr: ERROR: [Errno 2] Aucun fichier ou dossier de ce type: u'http://launchpad.net/cairo-dock-core/2.3/2.3.0-0rc1/+download/cairo-dock-2.3.0~0rc1.tar.gz'
<tumbleweed> download the tarball, and point it at the local file?
<tumbleweed> (assuming google translate helped me there)
<matttbe> bzr: ERROR: Unable to find the tag for the previous upstream version, 2.3.0~0rc1, in the branch: upstream-2.3.0~0rc1
<broder> mattbe: undo the changelog, etc. changes you made first
<broder> err, matttbe, sorry
<matttbe> ok I will try
<matttbe> bzr: ERROR: Unable to find the tag for the previous upstream version, 2.2.0~4, in the branch: upstream-2.2.0~4
<tumbleweed> ok, that needs to be tagged in then
<matttbe> ok , it's done and it seems better
<matttbe> except that it removes the debian directory?
<matttbe> do I have to create a tarball with a debian directory?
<tumbleweed> matttbe: you probably tagged the wrong thing as 2.2.0~4 then
<tumbleweed> it should give you the previous debian directory (but uncommitted)
<tumbleweed> no tarballs need to be created
<matttbe> tumbleweed: but I have download the branch and then use the bzr merge-upstream with the local file
<tumbleweed> I guess I should actually pull this same branch so I can be of real help
<matttbe> (except that I've tagged the last rev)
<tumbleweed> you should tag different revisions as 2.2.0~4 and upstream-2.2.0~4
<tumbleweed> upstream-2.2.0~4 will be a merge revision
<matttbe> this is what I did:  bzr branch lp:ubuntu/cairo-dock ; cd cairo-dock ; bzr merge-upstream --version 2.3.0~0rc1 ../../cairo-dock_2.3.0~0rc1.orig.tar.gz --distribution=natty ; bzr tag upstream-2.2.0~4 ; bzr merge-upstream --version 2.3.0~0rc1 ../../cairo-dock_2.3.0~0rc1.orig.tar.gz --distribution=natty
<matttbe> should I have to create this tag? 2.2.0~4
<tumbleweed> hrm, /me has a paly with this branch
<matttbe> there is maybe something wrong because the plug-ins branch is not up to date. => https://bugs.launchpad.net/udd/+bug/704694
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 704694 in Ubuntu Distributed Development "import has failed with cairo-dock-plug-ins" [High,Confirmed]
<tumbleweed> that certainly makes merge proposals problematic
<tumbleweed> someone has to fix up the UDD branch before its useful
<matttbe> :)
<matttbe> thank you but what can I do now?
<tumbleweed> the easy answer is just don't use UDD for these packages, the UDD branches are broken
<matttbe> :) and do I have to do something else before contacting a sponsor?
<tumbleweed> i'm not quite sure what needs to be done to get this branch to behave
<tumbleweed> matttbe: prepare debdiff + tarballs and attach to bug, subscribe sponsors (like the old days)
<matttbe> tumbleweed: ok thank you
<matttbe> I guess I can open another bug report to UDD too
<matttbe> About these cairo-dock packages: a rc3 version of these packages is ready to be uploaded in Ubuntu repositories too. Do I have to wait for the update of the RC1 version or not (may I have to update the two branches linked to these bug reports)?
<matttbe> The final version should be available in a few days (this WE) but we just have to wait for the update of these packages on Ubuntu and check if there isn't any other bugs before having the final version.
<csjohn> hey
#ubuntu-motu 2011-04-12
<RAOF> StevenK: Have you tried\ out the mpris plugin?
<StevenK> RAOF: For Quod, or Do?
<RAOF> StevenK: For Do, to drive Quod.
<RAOF> It's a bit of a hack, in that it's hardcoded to quodlibet rather than enumerating the bus and being sensible, but it should work :)
<dholbach> good morning
<iulian> Morning dholbach.
<dholbach> hey iulian
<hrw> can someone sponsor bug 749944 - simple rebuild of gnote is needed
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 749944 in gnote (Ubuntu) "Gnote crashes with segmentation fault" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/749944
<hrw> debdiff attached
<sladen> hrw: building now
<hrw> thx
<astro73|derrial> is there a standard pattern for getting debian/rules and setup.py to work right?
<fileneed> hello!
<fileneed> anyone interested in helping to fix a bug in meshlab for natty?
<fileneed> http://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=3187111&group_id=149444&atid=774731
<astro73|derrial> I have my setup.py pulling a lot of metadata from the control file, but it seems to be tripping over the swig-generated .so
<broder> how do i set a comment on MoM?
<broder> ah, i see - there's a hidden <input>
#ubuntu-motu 2011-04-13
<ApOgEE> good morning
<dholbach> good morning
<iulian> Morning dholbach, mok0.
<dholbach> hey iulian
<iulian> Does anyone know how one can increase the number of workspaces in Unity?
<Rhonda> Isn't this rather a question for #ubuntu?  :)
<iulian> True.  I'll try in #ubuntu+1.
<ajmitch> iulian: compizconfig-settings-manager, general options, desktop size
<iulian> Uhm, I thought I looked in there.
<iulian> Thanks ajmitch.
<ajmitch> it's not under the unity options, which is where I was looking :)
<iulian> Indeed.
<hrw> iulian: basically if you want to change something related to window management in unity you have to check ccsm (compiz settings)
<AnAnt> Hello, how can I add software categories in Unity's application browswer
<AnAnt> Hello, how can I add software categories in Unity's application browser ? I've got extra-xdg-menus installed , yet I don't see the Electronics category for example
<c2tarun> AnAnt: I dont think this is the proper channel for this question.
<AnAnt> c2tarun: #ubuntu-desktop ?
<c2tarun> AnAnt: I guess try #unity
<AnAnt> thanks
<iulian> hrw: Understood.  Thank you.
<lfaraone> ScottK: when you have a chance can you sync bug 759830? (fixes CVE-2011-1500 and other bugs)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 759830 in pithos (Ubuntu) "Sync pithos 0.3.8-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/759830
<ubottu> ** RESERVED ** This candidate has been reserved by an organization or individual that will use it when announcing a new security problem.  When the candidate has been publicized, the details for this candidate will be provided. (http://cve.mitre.org/cgi-bin/cvename.cgi?name=CVE-2011-1500)
<ScottK> lfaraone: I can't.  I don't have sufficient access.
<ScottK> lfaraone: Ask pitti in #ubuntu-devel.
<lfaraone> ScottK: I thought you were in ~ubuntu-archive. The bug only affects natty.
<ScottK> lfaraone: I am, but doing a sync requires shell access in the Canonical data center, which I don't have.
<lfaraone> Ah, fun, mk.
<ScottK> I'm, unfortunately, limited to what the LP U/I provides for archive admins to do, which is a lot, but not everything.
<lfaraone> And we haven't implemented that "sync me" button yet :)
<ScottK> Nope.
<ScottK> Once that's implemented anyone that can upload the package in question will have it.  It won't be limited to archive admins.
<lfaraone> Mhm. That'll make life much easier.
 * davidgiluk_ has an MPI related FTBFS on ARM and isn't sure of the right way forward - any MPI MOTUs around?
<Arash_> Hi there
<Arash_> I have a problem in packaging an update
<Arash_> anybody there?
<Arash_> I am trying to do a package for an update so I got the source code of the latest version
<Arash_> then I dowloaded the new version
<Arash_> I'm trying to do "debuild -S -sa"
<Arash_> but I get this error
<Arash_> :
<Arash_> dpkg-buildpackage: error: dpkg-source -b opencv-2.2.0 gave error exit status 1
<Arash_> anyone can help me?
<davidgiluk_> I guess the question is what do you see before that point
<Arash_> dpkg-source: info: use the '3.0 (quilt)' format to have separate and documented changes to upstream files, see dpkg-source(1)
<Arash_> dpkg-source: unrepresentable changes to source
<Arash_> dpkg-buildpackage: error: dpkg-source -b opencv-2.2.0 gave error exit status 1
<Arash_> debuild: fatal error at line 1337:
<Arash_> dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot -d -us -uc -S -sa failed
<micahg> !pastebin > Arash_
<ubottu> Arash_, please see my private message
<marktraceur> I don't suppose this is the place to ask for help about packaging?
<Pici> marktraceur: Usuaully #ubuntu-packaging is a better place to start
<marktraceur> Pici: I'm there now, looks pretty dead there too
<marktraceur> Pici: But thanks
<soren> There's an #ubuntu-packaging? Wow. Who knew.
<micahg> soren: persia set it up about a year ago to take the generic packaging help out of here and #launchpad
<Arash__> I am trying to build a package for un update
<Arash__> after doing "debuild -S -sa" I get this error
<Arash__> dpkg-source: info: use the '3.0 (quilt)' format to have separate and documented changes to upstream files, see dpkg-source(1)
<Arash__> dpkg-source: unrepresentable changes to source
<Arash__> dpkg-buildpackage: error: dpkg-source -b opencv-2.2.0 gave error exit status 1
<Arash__> debuild: fatal error at line 1337:
<micahg> !pastebin > arand
<ubottu> arand, please see my private message
<micahg> arand: sorry
<Arash__> dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot -d -us -uc -S -sa failed
<micahg> !pastebin | Arash__
<ubottu> Arash__: For posting multi-line texts into the channel, please use http://paste.ubuntu.com | To post !screenshots use http://imagebin.org/?page=add | !pastebinit to paste directly from command line | Make sure you give us the URL for your paste - see also the channel topic.
<Arash__> I am trying to build a package for un update. After doing "debuild -S -sa" I get this error: dpkg-source: info: use the '3.0 (quilt)' format to have separate and documented changes to upstream files, see dpkg-source(1) dpkg-source: unrepresentable changes to source dpkg-buildpackage: error: dpkg-source -b opencv-2.2.0 gave error exit status 1 debuild: fatal error at line 1337: dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot -d -us -uc -S -sa faile
<Arash__> I am trying to build a package for un update. After doing "debuild -S -sa" I get this error: dpkg-source: info: use the '3.0 (quilt)' format to have separate and documented changes to upstream files, see dpkg-source(1) dpkg-source: unrepresentable changes to source dpkg-buildpackage: error: dpkg-source -b opencv-2.2.0 gave error exit status 1 debuild: fatal error at line 1337: dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot -d -us -uc -S -sa faile
<broder> Arash__: what does debian/source/format say?
<Arash__> broder: I did not get what you mean: "what does debian/source/format say?"
<broder> does that file exist?
<Arash__> debian folder exists
<broder> and the rest?
<Arash__> I just copied debian folder from an older version 2.1 into newer version 2.2
<Arash__> what I read in toturials
<Ampelbein> Arash__: the error message indicates that you changed for example a non-text file. (dpkg-source: unrepresentable changes to source)
<Arash__> Ampelbein: Thanks, I will check it
<Arash__> I've just done as in toturial : https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Recipes/PackageUpdate
<Ampelbein> Arash__: what package?
<Arash__> Ampelbein: I try to make a package for opencv-2.2.0
<Arash__> opencv-2.1.0 already exists
<Ampelbein> Arash__: can you copy the complete debuild output to a pastebin?
<Arash__> http://paste.ubuntu.com/593751/
<Ampelbein> Arash__: see all the lines starting with "dpkg-source: error: cannot represent change" like line 24.
<Ampelbein> Arash__: nevermind, your problem seems to be that you didn't add a correct entry in debian/changelog with 2.2.0 as the version number
<Arash__> Yes, that's true. I did not put a correct version
<Arash__> thank you
<Arash__> I will try again
<Arash__> Ampelbein: Now I have another error. Could you help me please? : http://paste.ubuntu.com/593757/
<Ampelbein> Arash__: did you by chance just rename the bz2 to gz?
<Arash__> yes, I did. But I did not rename. I extract bz2 and I did ziped to gz
<Ampelbein> Arash__: "gzip: stdin: not in gzip format" is the error
<Arash__> thanks
<Arash__> ok I will try
<Arash__> Thank you so much. I did it!
<Arash__> Ampelbein: Thank you so much. I did it!
<Ampelbein> Arash__: great! ;-)
<Arash__> when I do "pbuilder build package.dsc" it takes lots of time to unpack all the packages in the system! Is it normal?
<paultag> Arash__: yes, do you know what pbuilder is actually doing?
<paultag> Arash__: you can do quick builds locally, but pbuilds are critical to run before any meaningful upload. I usually do all testing in a pbuilder, but others might not (and that's OK :) )
<Arash__> making package?
<paultag> Arash__: yeah, but it extracts a chroot, installs the packages needed to build (in build-deps), and runs the build -- this is to make sure you have everything set up to build in a clean setting
<Arash__> I think it would be better to do it locally because if I have some errors it takes lot of time to show error
<paultag> Arash__: e.g. you might take awk for granted as being on the system or something (I think it might be, but not the issue), and if you leave it out, when it builds on the clean build machines, it throws an error that awk is not found
<paultag> Arash__: this way it tests it in a very clean chroot
<paultag> Arash__: kosher?
<Arash__> OK, I see
<paultag> :)
<paultag> Arash__: dpkg-buildpackage will do it without a chroot
<paultag> Arash__: just use a pbuilder build to test before any sort of debdiff, upload or patch
<Arash__> Sorry I am kind of new. I did not get
<paultag> Arash__: http://man.cx/dpkg-buildpackage(1)
<Arash__> I just tried to update a package
<Arash__> so after debuild I do pbuilder
<Arash__> and you said i can do it locally before
<paultag> Arash__: sure. if it's for something you'd like to see in use, that is the best way to do it.
<Arash__> so I would like to know how I can do it locally
<paultag> Arash__: yes, you can, with dpkg-buildpackage. pbuilder creates a chroot, installs packages in the chroot and builds it
<Arash__> aha, ok
<paultag> Arash__: I sent you the manpage for dpkg-buildpackage :)
<Arash__> i will test it
<paultag> it works, I assure you :)
<Arash__> paultag: thank you so much
<paultag> Arash__: sure! Good luck!
<Arash__> while doing pbuilder I am facing another error : http://paste.ubuntu.com/593791/
<Arash__> I think the error is rather here : http://paste.ubuntu.com/593792/
#ubuntu-motu 2011-04-14
<freeflying> hi guys, I'm wondering if its possible to emove an upload from repository
<dholbach> good morning
<freeflying> dholbach: hi
<dholbach> hi freeflying
<freeflying> dholbach: do you know whom shall I check with to see if I have upload permit or not?
<dholbach> as far as I can see you are in ~ubuntu-dev so you should have some upload rights, but I can't exactly tell right now which packages you can upload
<dholbach> geser, ^?
<iulian> Morning.
<freeflying> dholbach: even a pacakge maintained by myself in universe need to be grant privilige?
<dholbach> freeflying, is it a package that is not in Ubuntu yet?
<freeflying> dholbach: it is
<dholbach> freeflying, everybody needs to get their package approved if it has never been in Ubuntu before
<freeflying> dholbach: ic, but it has been uploaded before, so not a new one
<dholbach> oh ok
<dholbach> bdrung, Laney, geser: ^ can one of you check if freeflying has upload rights for the package?
<dholbach> freeflying, which package is it?
<freeflying> dholbach: thanks
<freeflying> dholbach: ubuntu-chinese-meta
<freeflying> bdrung: Laney geser http://paste.ubuntu.com.cn/84089  error mesages
<jussi> o/
<jussi> good morning my super motus!
<jussi> I am guessing its too late to drag in a package from debian for universe?
<jussi> Im thinking of http://packages.debian.org/sid/openerp-web
<dholbach> jussi: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess
<Laney> freeflying: that's not an error with launchpad, that's a dput problem
<Laney> check the signature on your changes file
<bdrung> dholbach, freeflying: http://paste.debian.net/113979/
<ajmitch> Laney: there was a LP error that was cauing it to throw bogus GPG warnings
 * ajmitch doesn't see the package in the queue though
<Laney> i didn't know lp checked the signature at that time
<geser> the new FTP server (from soyuz) does it
<Laney> interesting
<geser> but sometimes (like now) the ftp server and the keyserver don't want to talk to each other
<geser> but sometimes the upload gets accepted anyways
<freeflying> Laney: so what shall I do?
<Laney> freeflying: sounds like it's a launchpad bug, so ask in #launchpad i guess
<freeflying> Laney: it works now, thanks
<poolie> hi all, i'd like to fix https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/python-demjson/+bug/753035
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 753035 in python-demjson (Ubuntu) "natty regression: jsonlint crashed with NameError in main(): global name 'encoding' is not defined" [High,Confirmed]
<poolie> the fix is pretty straightforward
<poolie> i have a patch, but it's also fixed upstream in a later release, which is now in debian
<poolie> can we still sync that across?
<Riddell> poolie: yes is the sync doesn't have notable other changes
<Riddell> if it's a new upstream bugfix only release that should be ok
<Riddell> if it has new features it needs a FFe and probably won't get in
<poolie> only bug fixes according to the upstream changelog
<poolie> i will have a look at the diff
<Riddell> poolie: ok file a bug report, subscribe ubuntu-archive and ping me with the number
<poolie> Riddell, will my existing bug report do?
<poolie> 753035
<Riddell> poolie: yes just add a "please sync version X from debian [unstable,experimental,testing]"
<poolie> k thanks
<poolie> ok done
<Riddell> poolie: I'll sync it after beta is out, it'll still need to get approved by an archive admin since we're in freeze
<poolie> thanks for that
<poolie> it's not the most important program in the world but it does make it a bit useless
<poolie> s//this bug does
<jussi> dholbach: thank you for your help, I filed the freeze exception bug, shadeslayer built the package and Pitti acked it :) Really happy how fast things can happen :)
<ricotz> micahg, hello, if you havent heard of this one perhaps it is considerable for packaging https://github.com/nougad/firefox-gnome-keyring.git
<ricotz> micahg, g2g, sorry
<c10ud> hello, i have a question: there's python-papyon (it should be in main, used by empathy and emesene (universe)) that currently had important fixes. is there a deadline to propose a ffe? current version is 0.5.4, next version is still unreleased, we're testing hard the changes along with the admins
<micahg> c10ud: hard freeze for main is today
<c10ud> next will be 0.5.5, 10 little diffs from 0.5.4 and they're all bugfix. i'm not really into the ubuntu/debian process but does that mean the package cannot be updated anymore?
<micahg> lfaraone: does firefox-sugar-activity need updating for firefox 4?
<micahg> c10ud: you might want to ask in #ubuntu-releasre
<micahg> *#ubuntu-release
<c10ud> ok, thanks
<bdmurray> How can I go about getting a sync from debian done for gpsprune?  Its a bug fix only for bug 735412.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 735412 in gpsprune (Ubuntu) "Filenames with spaces not supported on command line" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/735412
<micahg> bdmurray: create a sync request or change that bug to a sync request (requestsync)
<bdmurray> micahg: request sync will modify an existing bug?
<micahg> bdmurray: no, but you can copy the syntax into the bug if you like or just create a new bug
<micahg> bdmurray: if you do the former, set to wishlist/confirmed (assuming you did the MOTU checks) and subscribe ubuntu-archive, otherwise, wishlist/new and subscribe sponsors
<lfaraone> micahg: it shouldn't' need changes.
<micahg> lfaraone: have you tested it?
<lfaraone> micahg: no, but it doesn't modify firefox or interact with it beyond wrapping it.
<micahg> bdrung: I'd like to switch vlc to build-depend  on firefox-dev for the NPAPI headers
<bdrung> micahg: if that works. would be nice if it can be included in the debian package (alternative build depends)
<micahg> bdrung: well, we still have xulrunner-dev, but that might go away by release
<micahg> bdrung: should I just upload a new vlc later with the firefox-dev change if it works and/or should I commit the change to pkg-multimedia ubuntu branch?
<bdrung> micahg: in the ubuntu branch first (so i can have a look at it)
<bdrung> micahg: i uploaded 1.1.9-1ubuntu1 some time ago and it waits for approval
<ScottK> bdrung: Accepted.
<ScottK> mdeslaur: I rejected your vlc upload because bdrung's included the security fix (and other stuff).
<mdeslaur> ScottK: that's fine, thanks
<bigcx2> hey all
<bigcx2> i have a question about bumping a package version
<bigcx2> i have a package i got via apt-get source
<bigcx2> i already made some changes to it
<bigcx2> and i just ran dch -i
<bigcx2> edited the changelog
<bigcx2> and i get:
<bigcx2> dch warning: no orig tarball found for the new version.
<bigcx2> and then when i build with dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot
<bigcx2> it errors out with
<bigcx2> dpkg-source: error: can't build with source format '3.0 (quilt)': no orig.tar file found
<bigcx2> this is in natty
<bigcx2> has anyone run into this before?
<Ampelbein> bigcx2: do you have the tarball that fits the new upstream version?
<ziviani> Hi all
<ziviani> suppose I have a package that I want it to perform somethings before installing
<ziviani> if the current system is natty I want it to do something different
<ziviani> so I created my package.preinst and using lsb_release I did what I want
<ziviani> However, suppose that I have a lib to be copied from the package to the filesystem and, if it's natty I don't want this lib copied in the filesystem
<ziviani> the only way I see to address it is returning something different from 0 in my preinst script, which throws an error in the installing
<ziviani> this is a bad idea
<ziviani> does anybody knows how may I exclude some files to be installed from the preinst script?
<micahg> ziviani: you should do that in rules, not in preinst
<Ampelbein> but wouldn't that only apply to package build time and not install time?
<ziviani> micahg, but how would I know for which Ubuntu version this package will be installed
<micahg> ziviani: well, we build packages for each release separately
<ziviani> micahg, hmmmmmm
<ziviani> micahg, I think this is my case now
<ziviani> micahg, Ampelbein, thanks!!
<micahg> ziviani: so, at build time, you override dh_install and remove the file if it's natty
<micahg> or later
<ziviani> micahg, perfect man I got your point. Thank you very much!
<chrisccoulson> lfaraone, you have a WI assigned to you on here: https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/packageselection-desktop-n-firefox-4/
<chrisccoulson> do you want to postpone that?
<micahg> chrisccoulson: I asked him earlier and he said it shouldn't need any changes, but hasn't tested
<chrisccoulson> ah, ok. thanks
#ubuntu-motu 2011-04-15
<dholbach> good morning
<Laney> \o
<RAOF> Yo, Laney!~
<Laney> ello
<RAOF> I'll email the DMB to graciously accept your offer of email processing, btw.
<Laney> :-)
<Laney> I hope we can cleave through the backlog imminently
<hrw> I hope to get processed too
<aboudreault> hi,
<aboudreault> what's that dpatch warning: No base-patch supplied, not applying any patches
<aboudreault> I see that it doesn't apply existing patch when I try to create a new one
<aboudreault> ha, it was because I had a patched directory
<mok0> Just installed natty beta 2. Where should I report bugs?
<ScottK> Launchpad.
<mok0> ScottK: heh, yes but which package?
<ScottK> That rather depends on what the problem is.
<mok0> ScottK: during installation, keyboard is defined after you need to use it the first time
<ScottK> There's an open bug for that.
<ScottK> Let me see if I can find it.
<ScottK> mok0: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/oneiric/+source/ubiquity/+bug/656777
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 656777 in ubiquity (Ubuntu Oneiric) "Wrong keyboard selection with starting directly ubiquity" [High,Confirmed]
<mok0> Thanks ScottK
<ScottK> You're welcome.
<mok0> ScottK: "ubiquity", I guess that is what I was looking for...
<ScottK> Yep
<mok0> Also, my unity menu is black, I presume it should have some icons but it hasn't
 * ScottK has no idea about Unity.
<csjohn> cyphermox when you
<csjohn> you're here let me know*
<cyphermox> csjohn, I'm here :)
<csjohn> luck of the draw, hows it going? pm?
<cyphermox> sure.
#ubuntu-motu 2011-04-16
<sebrock> hey, I need to get some help with a certain package... is this the place to ask?
<sebrock> I'm looking for a PPA channel or something
<sladen> sebrock: what package.  what PPA
<sebrock> sladen: well netatalk
<sebrock> there is a 2.2-beta now that supports AFP 3.3 which I need for my Time Machine
<sebrock> running 10.04
<sebrock> amd64
<sebrock> so I remember getting help from someone building it for me but I cant remember now
<sladen> sebrock: the only PPA I can find with anything close to 2.2-beta  is  https://launchpad.net/~codebutler/+archive/ppa  perhaps it would be worth getting in contact with  https://launchpad.net/~codebutler  who might be able to assist
<sebrock> ok thanks sladen
<sebrock> I was in a channel somewhere and got the help on the fly. Ie upon request someone built it for me
<sebrock> I dont remember if it was here though
<jfi> Hello, if I have correctly understood, new packages from Debian (unstable/sid) are automaticaly imported into Ubuntu before the DebianImportFreeze. So I don't need to require it, right? Is the starting date of the import known for Oneiric, or it occurs package per package until the DIF?
<sladen> jfi: release (2 weeks), compiler/toolchain updates to oneiric (2 weeks), oneiric open/import starts
<sladen> sebrock: that was very of them!  Was it #ubuntu, or #ubuntu-motu, or a more specific channel.  Perhaps your IRC client has logfiles or autocomplete entries which remind you who was able to help so effectively last time
<sebrock> slad1
<sebrock> sladen
<sebrock> sladen: I checked.. it was some time ago so the logs are gone :P
<sebrock> it was a specific channel... I do think it was here
<jfi> sladen, ok, so it will occur between middle may and middle june, thanks for the information! Is there a convenient way to track the import of a specific package?
<sladen> jfi: rmadison -u ubuntu netatalk     rmadison -u debian netatalk
<jfi> sladen, Ho great! thanks!
<ScottK> sebrock: PPA support is in #launchpad.  If you're looking for packaging help for a PPA package, I think #ubuntu-packaging is what you want.
<sebrock> thanks ScottK
<fach> Hello
<fach> Guys, I have a question about the repository.... I'm programmer and I'd like to create a text-based game (MUD style but single player).... Theres anyway to send the game (source code) to canonical and maybe put my program in the oficcial repository (if its enough good for it)???
<ScottK> fach: Yes, but it's not necessarily anyone at Canonical that would do it.
<ScottK> !REVU | fach
<ubottu> fach: REVU is a web-based tool to give people who have worked on Ubuntu packages a chance to "put their packages out there" for other people to look at and comment on in a structured manner. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU
<fach> Thank you guys.
#ubuntu-motu 2011-04-17
<nixternal> Changes file must be signed with a valid GPG signature: Verification failed 3 times:
<nixternal> dput ubuntu foo.changes and I get that. any help will be greatly appreciated
<geser> nixternal: the LP FTP server checks now the signature upon upload. But sometimes the keyserver and the FTP server don't like to talk to each other. But your upload might got accepted anyways.
<c_korn> is bug 762215 a duplicate of bug 762761 or the other way around? (i.e. what is the correct package?)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 762215 in Indicator Date and Time "comma used in abbreviated month name" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/762215
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 762761 in gnome-panel (Ubuntu) "Date in Unity panel has wrong format (Natty, beta 2)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/762761
<paissad> hello guys, i would like to know if this is a correct version naming
<paissad> 1.21.1-svn234-3
<paissad> i mean, may we have more than 1 dash in the version string
<paissad> ?
<micahg> paissad: preferably not, if it's revisions on top of 1.21.1, it should be 1.21.1+svn234-X if in Debian or -0ubuntuY for Ubuntu (archive)
#ubuntu-motu 2012-04-09
<ScottK> Dunno.
<broder> uh, i know i haven't been paying attention, but why is the archive frozen? we're not in an actual freeze, are we?
<ajmitch> broder: apparantly this is the freeze-before-final-freeze
<broder> i...see
<broder> but i should just upload things as usual?
<ajmitch> for some reason the release team decided to freeze things a bit earlier than expected
<ajmitch> if you get yelled at, you know you did it wrong ;)
<mvdk> Is there any possibility of importing octave from Debian into precise?  I would very much like an octave that's a little more recent than 3 years or so...
<tumbleweed> broder: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-release/2012-April/001058.html
<tumbleweed> ^ anyone feel like investigating syncing octave 3.6? seems like a non-trivial job...
<jtaylor> thats connected with hdf5
<ajmitch> not a small transition then
<jtaylor> it may work with the old one, but the current package has a dependency on >1.8.8
<tumbleweed> doesn't sound like that much fun
<ScottK> broder: Unseeded Universe/Multiverse stuff just gets pushed through.
<jtaylor> octave does compile in precise, but the transition is not done in debian ye
<tumbleweed> jtaylor: right, and I can't see anyone tracking the state of this transition anywhere
<micahg> bdrung: vlc still isn't upgrading cleanly for me on my current system, Ãll try to debug a little later
<bdrung> micahg: meh. i thought that i cover all cases.
<micahg> bdrung: hmm, vlc-nox got upgraded ahead of the rest and now it seems to have dependency issues
<bdrung> micahg: it's too late here => i am tired. i fail trying to understand the dependency chain
<micahg> bdrung: does that mean you want me to explain more or try again in the morning?
<bdrung> micahg: try again in the morning.
<micahg> k
<bdrung> good night
#ubuntu-motu 2012-04-10
<dholbach> good morning
<Laney> ello
<ajmitch> hi
<iulian> Morning.
<highvoltage> http://me.veekun.com/blog/2012/04/09/php-a-fractal-of-bad-design/
<jtaylor> where has maverick gone from the lp page?
<jtaylor> support already ended?
<astraljava> jtaylor: According to https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-announce/2012-April/000158.html it has.
<jtaylor> interesting wasn't aware there was a release so early in april, and why am I not subscribed to that list :O
<jtaylor> oh yes that was the 10.10.2010 release ... ^^
<ajmitch> morning
#ubuntu-motu 2012-04-11
<dholbach> good morning
<ajmitch> morning dholbach
<geser> Hi dholbach and ajmitch
<dholbach> hi ajmitch, hi geser
<ajmitch> hi geser
<Whoopie> broder: Hi, do you have time to discuss bug 898003? What's the right way to get usbip updated?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 898003 in usbip (Ubuntu) "usbip source is maintained in kernel tree now" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/898003
<tumbleweed> Whoopie: get it on the sponsorship queue
<tumbleweed> !sponsorship
<ubottu> You can find out about the package sponsorship process here http://wiki.ubuntu.com/SponsorshipProcess - For !UDS sponsorship see http://uds.ubuntu.com/participate/sponsorship/
<Whoopie> tumbleweed: yes, but we need to agree how to package usbip as it's in the kernel tree now. Just make a snapshot of the folder? What should be the version number, e.g. 3.2.0?
<tumbleweed> yes, sounds sensible
<tumbleweed> err, 3.2.0-0ubutnu1 obviously
<tumbleweed> and assume I can spell Ubuntu
<Whoopie> hehe
<Whoopie> tumbleweed, broder: I subscribed the sponsors team. I'm idling here if you have any questions/remarks.
<tumbleweed> Whoopie: the current sponsorship turnaround time is a week or so, so hopefully broder doesn't neglect you :)
<tumbleweed> are there significant changes in the new version?
<Whoopie> usbip_bind_driver binary was merged with the usbip binary. And the command syntax changed. That's all I can see from user perspective.
<Whoopie> tumbleweed: and btw, I'm good in prodding, so broder has no chance. :-D
<tumbleweed> he does seem rather busy atm, though
<tumbleweed> those changes sound significant enough to need a feature freeze exception at this point, but also likely something that'll be easily approved (I don't see any reverse dependencies)
<tumbleweed> !ffe
<ubottu> Feature Freeze Exception. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess for the freeze exception process.
<Whoopie> it "should" be approved as the current usbip package doesn't work at all with the current kernel modules.
<tumbleweed> ah, then don't bother :)
<Whoopie> tumbleweed: just found a version number in usbip's configure.ac (https://git.kernel.org/?p=linux/kernel/git/torvalds/linux.git;a=commitdiff;h=0aee58894551d7a9992f79d77d89f5846eb5e938)
<Whoopie> Should I use this version number then?
<tumbleweed> Whoopie: yeah, probably a better choice. And it's still less than 3.2.0, so when this does eventually come from the kernel, that can use a kernel version without causing any harm
<dholbach> thanks ScottK for reassigning bug 978671 - I originally meant to mark it 'fix committed', but seem to have missed that status :)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 978671 in s2tc (Ubuntu) "FFe: Sync s2tc 0~git20110809-1 (universe) from Debian sid (main)" [Wishlist,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/978671
<ScottK> dholbach: No problem.
<dholbach> ScottK, is release team activity higher than in past releases?
<ScottK> I don't think so.
<ScottK> No metrics though.
<dholbach> sure, I was more interested in gut feeling than pie charts ;-)
<dholbach> cool
<ahasenack> hi, quick initscript question that http://refspecs.linuxbase.org/LSB_3.1.0/LSB-Core-generic/LSB-Core-generic/iniscrptact.html didn't answer me
<ahasenack> if a service isn't running and I issue "/etc/init.d/<service> reload", should it fail?
<ahasenack> http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-opersys.html#s-sysvinit also didn't help
<ahasenack> /etc/init.d/skeleton has a sample do_reload() function that always returns 0
<jcfp> ahasenack: you could argue that the expected result of a reload is for the service to be active with the latest config loaded, along the lines of a restart action on an inactive service
<matttbe> Hello,
<matttbe> Currently, Alacarte (a menu editor for menus made with libgnome-menu) recommends gnome-panel (Gnome Classic session) and exo-utils (XFCE session) packages but Alacarte can be used with other sessions: e.g. Cairo-Dock (but I'm sure there is also other applications) also uses libgnome-menu in order to have a "Gnome-Menu-like" and we can use Cairo-Dock without Gnome/XFCE Panel. Alacarte can be used to edit this menu but currently if we
<matttbe> install Alacarte on Ubuntu, Gnome-Panel and the Gnome Classic session will be installed...
<matttbe> A solution is to no longer recommend these packages but we can add them as suggestions. Do you think it's a good solution?
<matttbe> This is what I said on the bug #975299
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 975299 in alacarte (Ubuntu) "gnome-panel and exo-utils should not be recommended by Alacarte package" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/975299
<matttbe> A bzr branch has been linked to this bug report.
#ubuntu-motu 2012-04-12
<dholbach> good morning
<ajmitch> morning dholbach
<ajmitch> & geser :)
<dholbach> hi ajmitch
<geser> Good morning dholbach, good evening ajmitch
<dholbach> hi geser
<dholbach> blueyed, bdrung, did you get home alright last night?
<gotwig> Hey, I would be pleased if someone can help me in packaging  my unity lens and scopes properly in one package, so its ready for USC. launchpad.net/lens-cooking . Its alredy packaged but with some sort of hacks, so it uses e.g absolute paths.
<gotwig> al-maisan: hey
<al-maisan> hello gotwig
<gotwig> mhall119: hey
<gotwig> please help :/
<tumbleweed> ARB members: ^ I thought there was supposed to be an example package for lenses and scopes?
<bdrung> good morning, dholbach. yes, and you?
<dholbach> bdrung, yes - I guess it didn't take me as long :)
<bdrung> dholbach: how long?
<dholbach> bdrung, maybe 15m by bus - that's nothing compared to your bike ride :)
<bdrung> k, 15m wouldn't even be possible with car
<bdrung> i could have saved up to 15m if i would have taken the S-Bahn.
<Kiall> Can anyone point me at a decent guide for how to make use of UCF in a package?
<Kiall> Or - better yet - a simple example package that uses it?
<tumbleweed> ScottK: re u-d-t bugs. do you do a lot of work on remote machines?
<ScottK> tumbleweed: No, but I don't blindly give applications access to my LP account either.
<ScottK> Since I'm an archive admin, giving an application maintained by non-archive admins blind access to my LP account is a priviledge escalation path.
<ScottK> (yesterday's unicode bug happened in a chroot)
<tumbleweed> fair enough. The new desktop-authorisation apporach to LP really doesn't help there
<ScottK> I don't mind doing the authorization dance each time it's needed, but for --no-lp there's no need for it.
<tumbleweed> I guess we need more than 4 levels of authorisation to solve that properly
<tumbleweed> totally agreed re --no-lp
<tumbleweed> I was just wondering why you seem to run into these issues more than anyone else
<ScottK> Most people probably just click the 'have your way with me' button the first time it comes up.
<tumbleweed> yeah
<ScottK> Also https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/precise/+queue is the only page that still needs dgetlp, so I doubt it gets a lot of use.
<tumbleweed> yes, you are probably one of the sole users of it
<tumbleweed> err the sole
<tumbleweed> have you raised these concerns with LP people? IIRC canonical people have two-factor authentication for SSO
<tumbleweed> but the launchpad API is getting pretty powerful, and there's much less protection around it then there is around my gpg key
<ScottK> No.  I haven't.
 * tumbleweed adds it to the mental list of things to chat about over beer at UDSa
<dupondje> Getting something merged/synced is WAY to late I guess ?
<scott-work> i've been told there are some concerns about the ubuntustudio-default-settings package?  specifically about the inclusion of an *.svg
<scott-work> i am very anxious and motivated to resolve this issue as soon as possible
<scott-work> does anyone know about this situation?
<tumbleweed> dupondje: no. Especially if it isn't on a CD
<tumbleweed> dupondje: and if it's just bug-fixes, go ahead
<dupondje> hmz :) cause in the current state its quite useless for me :)
<dupondje> aka opensc :)
<tumbleweed> !ffe|dupondje
<ubottu> dupondje: Feature Freeze Exception. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess for the freeze exception process.
<dupondje> i'll spam doko first, he did some changed to it less then a day ago :) so
<dupondje> tumbleweed: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/opensc/+bug/979986
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 979986 in opensc (Ubuntu) "[FFe] Please merge opensc 0.12.2-2 (universe) from debian unstable" [Undecided,New]
<dupondje> looks fine to you ? :)
<tumbleweed> dupondje: summary of the new features, please
<dupondje> added
<tumbleweed> dupondje: approved
<dupondje> thanks!
<tumbleweed> ScottK: sorted
<ScottK> tumbleweed: Cool.
<tumbleweed> BTW, LP people have strongly encouraged everyone to login whenever possible, I seem to recall the anonymous API being described as "for web use, primarily"
<ScottK> I can understand why they want it, but from a user perspective it's backwards.
<ScottK> I should give out no more permissions that needed.
<tumbleweed> yeah
<ScottK> tumbleweed: Are you going to upload u-d-t again?
<ukbeast> Does gnome-media-player work for anybody else on ubuntu 12.04 beta 2? I still receive a "segmentation fault"
<ukbeast> Does it work for anybody else?
<blair> svn 1.6.18 was released today with some repository corruption issues, how do i request an update from 1.6.17 to 1.6.18?
<blair> for 12.04?
<micahg> blair: today's final freeze, so you need to find someone to do the update, I'd suggest asking in #ubuntu-server since they have the most use from it
<blair> micahg, thanks!
<micahg> blair: that's only if it's bug fix only, if it's got features, it'll probably not fly at this point
<blair> 1.6.x is the older active branch and 1.7.x is the active one, but they both neither get new features, just fixes
<c_korn> hello, I have a package which build depends on xulrunner-dev in lucid. I now want to rebuild it in precise but there is no such package any longer. what is the correct dependency now?
<micahg> c_korn: depends what you need it for, there's no gecko runtime for third party apps in precise, for NPAPI, use firefox-dev, for spidermonkey, use libmosjs185-dev
<micahg> *libmozjs185-dev
<c_korn> hum
<c_korn> I'll try with firefox-dev,thanks micahg
<tumbleweed> ScottK: there's time, we can.
<ScottK> tumbleweed: Since you've been fixing my bugs, I'd like to see it.
<tumbleweed> ScottK: if you have any dget patches...
<ScottK> I don't.  I think I'll remember not to try dgetlp inside a chroot again.
<tumbleweed> heh
#ubuntu-motu 2012-04-13
<dholbach> good morning
<ajmitch> morning dholbach
<dholbach> hi ajmitch
<dholbach> huats, warp10, broder: any comments on the report?
<huats> morning !
<dholbach> salut huats
<huats> dholbach: honnestly I found it great
<huats> and I am really impressed by the work done
<dholbach> huats, you had some comments about the 'conclusions' section - if you could look over it again and suggest something that is missing, that'd be nice
<huats> dholbach: sure
<Zhenech> mh, how are my chances to upload a new upstream minor(bugsfix) release to debian tomorrow and get it synced in time for precise?
<dholbach> zhenech: which package is it?
<Zhenech> dholbach, pokerth (a poker game/client), so pretty leaf-package
<dholbach> it certainly sounds doable
<Zhenech> cool, thanks
<Whoopie> broder: Hi, have you found some time to look at bug 898003? Or could another dev have a look? The new package is to avoid a regression in precise.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 898003 in usbip (Ubuntu) "usbip source is maintained in kernel tree now" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/898003
<Whoopie> dholbach: ^ do you have perhaps some time?
<dholbach> Whoopie, can you maybe ask in #ubuntu-devel - it looks like there are currently two patch pilots available
<dholbach> I'm a bit busy with something else right now
<Whoopie> dholbach: sure, thanks for the hint.
<dholbach> de nada
<dholbach> (just check the topic)
<broder> dholbach: sorry, i've basically not been reading any ubuntu-related emails since starting my new job last week. i think i'm likely to be pretty useless until uds
<ScottK> tumbleweed: Thanks for taking care of my u-d-t bug so quickly.
<dholbach> broder, no, that's fine :)
<vibhav> Is ubuntuwire down?
<tumbleweed> ScottK: np
<ScottK> vibhav: It seems so.
<vibhav> ah
<jtaylor> is it possible to add an rc to precise and possible update it to final also after release?
<jtaylor> concerns matplotlib
<tumbleweed> that's a question for the SRU team. But I don't know of this ever happening
<gotwig> I think I found a broken package
<gotwig> npm and/or nodejs(-dev) seems to be broken
<gotwig> people on the web said the npm version is too old
<gotwig> Radium: hey
<gotwig> Do you want a paste ?
<gotwig> tough its very easy to install npm without a package
<gotwig> ok, here is the paste....
<gotwig> http://paste.ubuntu.com/928180/
<jtaylor> gotwig: does the version in debian work?
<gotwig> jtaylor: yes
<gotwig> jtaylor: I think so
<gotwig> they have a newer version
<gotwig> its an old bug
<gotwig> but its a shame
<gotwig> that a broken packages comes into precise
<jtaylor> it has no rdepends and ts broken, I guess its feasable to update it
<gotwig> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/npm/+bug/863094
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 863094 in npm (Ubuntu) "npm versions less than 1.1 will not work with registry.npmjs.org" [Critical,Triaged]
<gotwig> critical but triaged :/
<gotwig> jtaylor: do you think there is a way? couse of feature freeze
<jtaylor> can you need a feature freeze exception
<gotwig> becouse if there is no way; you are not able to use node.js with packages
<gotwig> if that affects ubuntu server
<gotwig> its very very
<gotwig> bad
<gotwig> and I think; it does!
<gotwig> jtaylor: please help
<gotwig> philipballew: hey
<gotwig> may anyone else help???
<jtaylor> hm it needs a whole tail of other packages ...
<gotwig> becouse this is critical
<gotwig> jtaylor: example?
<jtaylor> some of them are RC in debian
<gotwig> jtaylor: hm, so what can we do...?
<jtaylor> gotwig: let me check what is all needed
<SpamapS> gotwig: hi!
<tumbleweed> SpamapS: there's been a fair bit of discussion of that here too
<SpamapS> Ok
<gotwig> SpamapS: hey
<jtaylor> gotwig: we'd ahve to pull a huge node stack for it which has never reached debian testing
<gotwig> !logs
<ubottu> Official channel logs can be found at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/ . LoCo channels are now logged there too; for older LoCo channel logs, see http://logs.ubuntu-eu.org/freenode/
<jtaylor> + the main executable has 2 RC bugs one of them might cause a name change in future
<tumbleweed> SpamapS: http://paste.ubuntu.com/928200/
<jtaylor> I think its better to remove it from precise
<SpamapS> If we ship npm, we're shipping it alone
<tumbleweed> gotwig: logs only update hourly
<SpamapS> the debian version is pretty much dead
<SpamapS> unless something changed in the last 2 weeks
<jtaylor> its been updated
<jtaylor> 5 days ago
<SpamapS> oh thats good to hear
<SpamapS> so what else are we missing?
<jtaylor> ~ 10 packages
<jtaylor> lots of node-+ stuff
<gotwig> that also affects ubuntu server, right?
<jtaylor> I don't like debian bug 611698
<ubottu> Debian bug 611698 in nodejs "nodejs: conflicts with package node needlessly" [Serious,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/611698
<tumbleweed> gotwig: ubuntu server is ubuntu. Just some different packages installed by default
<tumbleweed> jtaylor: that bug isn't particularly new, thuogh
<jtaylor> yes have it in oneiric already
<jtaylor> so its probably not so bud
<jtaylor> though it will cause problem when the debian maintainer gives in and renames it
<tumbleweed> it sounds like ax25 node is being renamed
<SpamapS> not having /usr/bin/node as nodejs binary path will without any
<SpamapS> doubt render nodejs package unuseful for a vast majority of users.
<SpamapS> I have to agree with that
<tumbleweed> IIRC ax25 node doesn't need to be on PATH, and really, *who* uses it...
<SpamapS> The fact that node.js, a widly popular program, uses the same namespace as node, an almost completely unknown program, should not mean that node.js has to call itself something else. That is *insanity*
<tumbleweed> OTOH, the debian policy around that is sane
<tumbleweed> things just take time to shake out
<SpamapS> So, I'd rather ship with a Conflicts to node, than not ship at all
<tumbleweed> +1
<SpamapS> inappropriate? yes, likely to cause problems? no.
<jtaylor> ok then who files the FFE for all the node- packages? :)
<gotwig> +t
<jtaylor> doing it on so short notice risks that we ship with a new but broken node stack :/
<gotwig> +1 :/
<tumbleweed> jtaylor: none of the node stack is seeded, so we have some time still
<jtaylor> gotwig, SpamapS: if you get an FFe I can help with syncing etc but I'm not using node myself, so you need to do some testing
<SpamapS> We have some node.js apps in the juju charm store. Testing is as easy as 'juju bootstrap && juju deploy subway' :)
<SpamapS> In fact subway uses npm too
<SpamapS> (it points at the PPA right now.. so we'd have to tinker a bit, but yeah, I can test easily enough)
<SpamapS> So is this an FFE just for syncs from debian?
<jtaylor> and the new version of npm
<gotwig> jtaylor: I am not a packager, or what ever :(
<jtaylor> gotwig: but you can test?
<gotwig> jtaylor: yes, but I also dont have *much* time
<gotwig> only a few hours :X
<SpamapS> I can put an hour into testing.
<gotwig> hm, so *what* exactly
<gotwig> is there a stable package somewhere?
<gotwig> there are few ubuntu ppa's with packages, right... ?
<gotwig> but they are not actual, I think
<gotwig> so whats with all these dependencies?
<onli> hi. can someone direct me to what i should do if i have a new version of a program, which is in universe but not developed anymore, and would like the ubuntu-package to use the new version (which is on github instead of sourceforge, where the original version was?)?
<tumbleweed> onli: contact the debian maintainer of the package (possibly by filing a bug)
<onli> tumbleweed: i tried that. he is not active anymore (he lead me here ;) )
<tumbleweed> onli: which package?
<onli> tumbleweed, simdock
<SpamapS> gotwig: So what we should probably do is pull the desired packages into a clean precise PPA and test them, then if we're satisfied that this is what we want for precise, file the FFE.
<gotwig> SpamapS: ok. It looks that there not a few packages that are dependencies and right now not part of universe
<gotwig> 're
<SpamapS> gotwig: if you can note all of them, I can put them into a precise PPA.
<gotwig> SpamapS: hm, I try to...
<SpamapS> part of me wants to say meh.. and just drop node and npm.. they move pretty fast.. and in a year, nobody will want the version in precise anyway
<gotwig> SpamapS: but than the whole infrastructure cra*hes
<gotwig> :X
<gotwig> SpamapS: http://packages.qa.debian.org/n/npm.html that does not look good, the thing in ()
<gotwig> all unconsidered
<jtaylor> it all goes down to nodejs
<gotwig> SpamapS: Are you able import these packages for testing into a ppa ?
<jtaylor> is it likely that there is a "whole infrastructure" ?
<jtaylor> npm only exists in oneiric
<gotwig> jtaylor: not exactly npm
<gotwig> jtaylor: but the whole charms thing... etc.
<gotwig> npm is needed to install dependencies, etc...
<SpamapS> npm is node's cpan
<jtaylor> then they are already broken
<gotwig> jtaylor: seems so
<gotwig> SpamapS: ^
<SpamapS> gotwig: ?
<gotwig> SpamapS: are you able to import these packages, directly?
<SpamapS> which packages?
<gotwig> SpamapS: the dependencies for the "new" npm on http://packages.qa.debian.org/n/npm.html
<gotwig> SpamapS: and npm
<jtaylor> they should all be syncable
<SpamapS> ahh
<SpamapS> yeah thats easy enough
<SpamapS> how do we handle NEW on syncs?
<SpamapS> like do we just let it go through since it already passed debian's NEW?
<gotwig> NEW?
<gotwig> what do you mean
<jtaylor> someone from -release needs to check them
<SpamapS> packages that don't exist in ubuntu hit the "NEW" queue
<gotwig> oh 1.1.16 ?
<Laney> technically it is the same, practically it is just approved
<gotwig> ohh ok
<Laney> but it is still manual
<gotwig> SpamapS: why dont package the very new version...?
<gotwig> SpamapS: or is that not stable? :X
<SpamapS> why don't we package everything from trunk?
<SpamapS> at some point..
 * EvilResistance chuckles
<SpamapS> pick a version.. and test it
<gotwig> SpamapS: what xD?
<gotwig> SpamapS: :/ but that testing may take very long
 * SpamapS is so tired of working on the bleeding edge all the time.. :-P
<EvilResistance> anyways, can someone point me to the formatting for package update/sync requests for post-release versions of Ubuntu?
<EvilResistance> SpamapS:  you and me both :p
 * gotwig likes to dance, but he is unable
 * gotwig has dreams of a better npm for Ubuntu and the World
<SpamapS> gotwig: it will be better.. until the next NPM shift where they break their repo's again..
<jtaylor> fast moving large stacks are not things that work well in ubuntu :/
<SpamapS> Yeah, universe is meant to be a convenience for tools and things that will be useful for a while. node developers are going to hate the version from precise.
<SpamapS> Its already 0.6.12 and 0.6.14 is out.. quick call the flying monkies and get me that new version!
<tumbleweed> even if it wsa brand new today, they'll hate it in6 months, never mind 5 years
 * gotwig_ 's internet is broken
<gotwig_> do you got my last message?
<gotwig_> SpamapS: so are you going to use 1.1.16?
<SpamapS> gotwig_: no, I'm going to at best sync what is in Debian
<SpamapS> if it all builds fine
<gotwig_> SpamapS: ok, I hope that version is fine
<SpamapS> ok I'm uploading all of those packages to this PPA https://launchpad.net/~clint-fewbar/+archive/latesyncs
<SpamapS> I'll try the subway nodejs app with it once it all builds. If that succeeds, I'll file the FFE to sync all those packages in and do the sync myself.
<jtaylor> you need someone to ack a whole bunch of packages, maybe its better to file the FFe first to see if someone is willing to do that?
<gotwig_> SpamapS: and please dont forget the viruses lol
<gotwig_> SpamapS: how have you synced them so fast :O ?
<tumbleweed> I'm happy to review the FFe, if nobody gets there earlier
<gotwig_> tumbleweed: oh yes, please ^^
<gotwig_> tumbleweed: what do you mean :X
<SpamapS> gotwig_: backportpackage .. amazing tool
<jtaylor> :( seeded-in-ubuntu times out
<SpamapS> $ for i in npm node-abbrev node-fstream node-graceful-fs node-ini node-minimatch node-mkdirp node-nopt node-request node-rimraf node-semver node-tar node-which ; do backportpackage -u ppa:clint-fewbar/latesyncs -s unstable -d precise -y -w . $i ; done
<SpamapS> specifically
<jtaylor> just for me or everyone?
<tumbleweed> jtaylor: ubuntuwire is down
<jtaylor> k
<tumbleweed> I'll set up another source for that data
<gotwig_> tumbleweed: can you make a FFe?
<tumbleweed> gotwig_: can't review it until you've done the testing :)
<gotwig_> tumbleweed: oh thats what you want ;)
<SpamapS> gotwig_: take a deep breath. :)
<gotwig_> alright, but I have to note, I only noted the error when I wanted to install npm to install dependencies xD
<gotwig_> so I can try node.js I am a total noob...
<SpamapS> gotwig_: looks like the PPA builders are about 20 minutes behind, so it will be about an hour before we can test those
<gotwig_> SpamapS: you can count on me ;)
<SpamapS> gotwig_: use this time wisely. Get yourself a clean precise VM setup (to the cloud!) and then be ready to add the PPA and test.
<gotwig_> SpamapS: what
<gotwig_> SpamapS: to the cloud?
<SpamapS> gotwig_: just suggesting that the cloud would be useful here. :)
<gotwig_> I am a total noob
<gotwig_> I have to drink my big boy milk first :O
<gotwig_> SpamapS: or with chroot
<SpamapS> gotwig_: yeah that should work fine too
<tumbleweed> jtaylor: http://corelli.tumbleweed.org.za/ubuntu-qa/ubuntu-seeded-packages/seeded.json.gz
<gotwig_> SpamapS: are there ubuntu cloud * images out there?
<gotwig_> SpamapS: got a link for me ?
<SpamapS> gotwig_: https://cloud-images.ubuntu.com/
<gotwig_> oh that was easy thanks
<gotwig_> SpamapS: server?
<gotwig_> SpamapS: or precise/ ?
<SpamapS> gotwig_: you'll want precise I think
<gotwig_> SpamapS: but that are no isos
<SpamapS> gotwig_: images != isos
<gotwig_> SpamapS: I know
<SpamapS> gotwig_: those are installed images. You can boot them up as a VM.
<gotwig_> SpamapS: but now I download a tar gz
<gotwig_> I just pressed 64 bit
<gotwig_> is that wrong :/ ?
<gotwig_> SpamapS: btw can I use that with virtualbox, too ?
<SpamapS> gotwig_: in theory yes
<SpamapS> gotwig_: though I don't know how to make that work
<gotwig_> SpamapS: I am going to take a look for that..
<gotwig_> SpamapS: why cant I choose my normal notebook for the tests?
<SpamapS> gotwig_: you can, but its more meaningful if you test without any extra packages installed.
<SpamapS> gotwig_: test with both!
<gotwig_> SpamapS: of course, Sir
<tumbleweed> most of use use minimal schroots for testing things
<gotwig_> SpamapS: Do you have no test environmen ? Germany has slow Internet.
<SpamapS> yeah chroot should be fine for this case
<gotwig_> SpamapS: I am downloading ubuntu core right now, too
<EvilResistance> are Universe repositories still being updated for precise?
<gotwig_> SpamapS: do you think that works?
<EvilResistance> i.e. not completely frozen
<SpamapS> EvilResistance: yeah, they need release team ACK, but can be uploaded to right up to release day.
<Laney> erm
<Laney> you shouldn't rely on being able to upload your crack
<SpamapS> EvilResistance: should only be bug fixes at this point.
<Laney> but bug fixes are welcome
<SpamapS> Laney: if node.js isn't crack.. I don't know what is. :)
<Laney> hoho
<Laney> if it's that fast moving then some kind of SRU thing should be worked out
<EvilResistance> i think i know of a few bugs in ZNC that were released with the recent 0.206-1 in Debian, i'm digging up the changelogs now (which are semi vague), and am checking against the devs
<gotwig_> SpamapS: I love node.js... So you should )
<gotwig_> *should you - hard english
<EvilResistance> SpamapS:  what do i need to submit to get a sync from sid to precise for a specific package?
<EvilResistance> (its got a few bugfixes)
<SpamapS> EvilResistance: file a bug. You can even use the 'requestsync' tool to do it from the CLI
<SpamapS> EvilResistance: then you probably want to mention it in here so somebody can help get it done foryou.
<EvilResistance> mmkay, gimme a few minutes, my internet is laggy as [CENSORED]
<EvilResistance> SpamapS: as the debian changelogs dont outline the changes between 0.204-1 (Precise) and 0.206-1 (Debian Unstable), should i add to the sync request the changelogs from ZNC's main site to detail the specific changes?
<SpamapS> EvilResistance: if it helps support the case for the sync, yes.
<SpamapS> EvilResistance: or if it has anything that might be a concern.. so.. actually, no if.. just include it :)
<EvilResistance> :P
<Laney> yes, you should definitely include that
<Laney> as well as evidence you have build, installed, upgraded and tested it
<gotwig_> SpamapS: got my chroot
<EvilResistance> Laney:  getting to that, the download/build is *slow* on this network
 * EvilResistance blames the massive number of ARP packets floating around on said network
<gotwig_> SpamapS: in which package is "add-apt-repository" ?
<gotwig_> SpamapS: so what tests I have to run? I test every package , ok?
<gotwig_> SpamapS: do you know a test command or something like that?
<EvilResistance> isnt it in some dev tools thing?
 * EvilResistance forgets the specific package name
<tumbleweed> gotwig_: python-software-properties
<gotwig_> tumbleweed: yeah, I already knew it thanks
<gotwig_> tumbleweed: btw the ubuntu core image is a very good thing
<tumbleweed> gotwig_: for chroots, I use mk-sbuild (in ubuntu-dev-tools)
<gotwig_> I use chroots directly
<tumbleweed> if you're doing a lot of this, you'll find some automation handy :)
<gotwig_> tumbleweed: I know what you mean, I did it always on my own
<gotwig_> becouse of virtual filesystems and such stuff
<gotwig_> in this case not important, I think...
<tumbleweed> indeed
<SpamapS> gotwig_: for npm, you should install some of the libraries
<gotwig_> SpamapS: eh yeah
<gotwig_> SpamapS: I have a problem somehow
<gotwig_> SpamapS: PM would be better, kay?
<gotwig_> SpamapS: ^
<tumbleweed> onli: sorry, forgot to reply
<tumbleweed> so, simbock has never been in Debian, only Ubuntu
<tumbleweed> *simdock
<tumbleweed> and it hasn't been touched since the initial upload to hardy :/
<tumbleweed> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/simdock/1.2-0ubuntu1
<tumbleweed> onli: so, there's still time to update it before precise releases, but you need to go through the feature freeze exception process
<tumbleweed> !ffe
<ubottu> Feature Freeze Exception. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess for the freeze exception process.
<tumbleweed> alternatively, if it's totally broken, we should remove it
<onli> tumbleweed: i dont know if it's broken, its just really old
<tumbleweed> if there are good upsides to updating it, and not too much risk, we can do it
<onli> ok. think their should be (and the risks are low, it's a not much known desktop-app, nothing depends on it)
<onli> "Please note that we expect requesters to have an updated package already prepared and tested!"
<onli> think that will be the issue. i dont have that - that was kind of the reason why i reached out to the original maintainer
<tumbleweed> onli: yes, it does need someone to do the work
<tumbleweed> but that could be you
<onli> ok. i never done that cleanly, only with debinstall or plainly with dpkg -b, without the schroot-environment for dependency-checking
<tumbleweed> mk-sbuild can get you going pretty quickly
<onli> ok
<tumbleweed> or you could use pbuilder / pbuilder-dist
<onli> pbuilder sounded great
<tumbleweed> or test-build in a PPA, but the turnaround there is slower
<onli> that was my original plan, especially if universe wouldn't work ;)
<onli> ok, now i know the general proceedings
<onli> thank you
<tumbleweed> np
<onli> (if you have an motu-apprentice on hand who wants to learn how to package, i would have a testproject for him now^^)
<gotwig_> why is packaging so hard :O ?
<tumbleweed> there's a lot to learn, but it's not that hard
<fo0bar_> time permitting, could I get a review on #946067 please?  it affects cricket and mrtg, throwing warnings during cron runs.  thanks.
<gotwig_> hm
<SpamapS> Ok, testing is successful for a sync of npm+deps from Debian
<SpamapS> I marked bug 863094 as a FFE and subscribed ubuntu-release
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 863094 in npm (Ubuntu Precise) "[FFE] npm versions less than 1.1 will not work with registry.npmjs.org" [Critical,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/863094
<gotwig_> what version should we pick ? debian  http://packages.qa.debian.org/n/npm.html     OR newer PPA ppa:chris-lea/node.js
<SpamapS> gotwig_: *debian*
<SpamapS> new is great, but I'm not really going to put in the time to resolve the diff
<SpamapS> FACEFOX: can you perhaps fix your IRC client?
<SpamapS> FACEFOX: btw, howdy from a neighbor also in Los Angeles ;)
<EvilResistance> he's doing this across the network i think
<ScottK> SpamapS: Approved npm
<SpamapS> ScottK: thanks!
<gotwig_> ScottK: huh=
<gotwig_> so what's now about npm?
<gotwig_> I sent the maintainer of the PPA a mail
<gotwig_> maybe he helps...
<ScottK> SpamapS: Accepted.
<SpamapS> gotwig_: the PPA is something to look at next cycle. Its over. Syncing > trying to figure out if that PPA is worth using
<SpamapS> ScottK: I hope I didn't misunderstand, I submitted syncs for all the deps too
<SpamapS> which was rather tedious because syncpackage has no -y
<gotwig_> ehhh
<gotwig_> ok
<ScottK> SpamapS: That's the only one I saw in the queue.
<gotwig_> just becouse the different packages
<ScottK> It's also the only one I saw in the FFe.
<SpamapS> ScottK: ahh, the FFE asked for all the deps
<SpamapS> but maybe only in the comments, and not clearly enough
<gotwig_> but how do we later remove all these packages, if there is no need for them?
 * ScottK looks again
<SpamapS> gotwig_: there *is* need for them
<gotwig_> why does the PPA not have all these packages
<SpamapS> gotwig_: people will want to use those libraries without npm.. hence them being split out.
<gotwig_> incomplete?
<SpamapS> gotwig_: thats exactly the kind of question I don't have time to answer ;)
<gotwig_> oh I understand
<ScottK> SpamapS: Are they all unseeded/universe?
<SpamapS> ScottK: they're all NEW
<gotwig_> that is better than I tought...
<ScottK> Ah.  Different screen.
<gotwig_> SpamapS: thank you for syncing
<ScottK> Got it.
 * ScottK will take care of.
<SpamapS> ScottK: you're my hero.
<gotwig_> SpamapS: and you are my one ^^
<gotwig_> I am happy that you react so fast
<SpamapS> gotwig_: you happened to catch me at a unique moment of clarity + interest :)
<gotwig_> I have to go to sleep... too late for a 17 years old boy ^^
<gotwig_> thank you all. So that is going to come into the release, right?
<gotwig_> got any link :X ?
<SpamapS> yes
<gotwig_> no link, good night :(
<ScottK> SpamapS: I think that's the lot of them.
<SpamapS> ScottK: indeed I counted 14+npm
<EvilResistance> thanks SpamapS for helping me get the sync request created quickly with requestsync.
<EvilResistance> for MOTUs: LP Bug #981044
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 981044 in znc (Ubuntu) "Sync znc 0.206-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/981044
<EvilResistance> or anyone who can process that sync request
<jtaylor> EvilResistance: does it have a granted FFe?
<EvilResistance> jtaylor:  FFe = ?
<EvilResistance> i only just filed the sync request, who else do i need to poke
<jtaylor> or does itneed one
 * EvilResistance points out ZNC is already in Precise, this is just an update from Debian sid to that version in precise
<EvilResistance> that'd be a question for you guys, as ZNC is already in, 0.206-1 from Debian fixes several bugs, as to whether it needs a FFe, i'd have to look into it
<jtaylor> it does have a couple of changes
<EvilResistance> who do i need to poke then regarding whether it needs an FFe or not?
<EvilResistance> because one of the bugs addressed is a crash bug when ZNC is told to shutdown or restart
<tumbleweed> EvilResistance: you make that decision yourself
<EvilResistance> ah, see i forgot about feature freeze >.>
<EvilResistance> shows you what happens when someone gets too busy to monitor release schedules >.>
<tumbleweed> EvilResistance: that's why you subscribe to ubuntu-devel-announce
<Laney> it's basically the same every cycle ...
<EvilResistance> i'm already subscribed to enough mailing lists, any more and my emails will be flooded :/
<tumbleweed> announce lists are low traffic
<EvilResistance> true, but i'm on multiple non-announce lists, so they can be pretty high-traffic
<EvilResistance> it might just be prudent to wait until precise is released as stable, then SRU it *shrugs*
<EvilResistance> s/to/for me to wait/
<jtaylor> the changes look quite small
<tumbleweed> if it's SRU worthy, do it now
<jtaylor> if it fixes a bug it should be synced now
<EvilResistance> it fixes a couple of bugs including RFC compliance bugs, but they werent filed on LP
<EvilResistance> as for whether it needs an FFe, i'm unsure, so...
<gotwig_> hey
<EvilResistance> because it not only is a newer upstream release, but also contains bugfixes
<gotwig_> SpamapS: I want to report an dependency
<Laney> yes, it does
<gotwig_> for npm
<gotwig_> SpamapS: that is not included in the debian package
<Laney> ideally you would test an upgrade from oneiric and lucid
<gotwig_> SpamapS: buildutils becouse of make
<gotwig_> SpamapS: very often people complain about the error that make is not found; so there have to be the dependency for make; for npm install
<EvilResistance> Laney:  which is why i might have to wait until after release, this system here is extremely close to death (hard drive death), so i dont have the luxury of test-upgrading
<Laney> do you have chroots?
<gotwig_> like just now in my case when I did npm install express ; than entered that directory and than ran npm install; I got error becouse make isnt installed
<EvilResistance> Laney: crupted by bad sectors
<EvilResistance> as i said this system is *VERY* close to death, almost half the drive is riddled with bad sectors
<EvilResistance> (unfortunately its the only system i have at the moment)
 * EvilResistance likely won't get a replacement drive until after release occurs, hence why this sync request may become an SRU
<EvilResistance> so unless you're volunteering to test, Laney, this'll remain pretty much stagnant
<jtaylor> an sru is a lot more work
<jtaylor> you need to extract the bugfixes from the changes
<EvilResistance> tell that to the Debian packager for ZNC, they refuse to use patches
 * EvilResistance has said this to them time and time again
<EvilResistance> oh, and what's more, their trunk on github doesnt have logs for when a stable release occurs, making finding bugfixes exceptionally harder
<jtaylor> why should they use patches?
<kklimonda> EvilResistance: the diff for znc 0.206-1 looks simple enough, and I don't see us maintaining znc ourselves anyway so I'd be for syncing it now
<kklimonda> the actual code diff is small: "10 files changed, 55 insertions(+), 14 deletions(-)"
<gotwig_> SpamapS: sorry, just the packages 'make' and 'g++' are missing .
<gotwig_> SpamapS: make sure you add them both to dependency list. Seems that these packages also are missing in the dependency list of the version of that PPA packager.
<SpamapS> gotwig_: Thats certainly a bug, but its not critical. Should probably be in the Recommends, since many of the npm packages will work w/o make.
<EvilResistance> ugh, system finally froze up and died, now i'm IRC-ing via my ZNC with my phone (EVIL way of IRCing... >.>)
<gotwig_> SpamapS: ok.. I find it critical :X I mean very many noobs wrote about that (on mac) in forums
<SpamapS> things that affect noobs are important, but they're not critical.
<EvilResistance> kklimonda:  this'd need an FFe according to Laney, and since my system is dead, i cant file an FFe (given that my phone is limited in capabilities)
<gotwig_> SpamapS: so are you adding the both somehow?
<SpamapS> gotwig_: when make is not installed, you can work around it, by.. installing make :)
<gotwig_> SpamapS: :O you're so smart ^^
<SpamapS> gotwig_: no, but it should be opened as a bug against the Debian package.
<gotwig_> SpamapS: hm, so why not
<SpamapS> gotwig_: its a legitimate issue. Please file a bug.
<gotwig_> SpamapS: yes... I have to look...
<gotwig_> SpamapS: does Ubuntu sync Debian packages one to one?
<SpamapS> gotwig_: yes
<SpamapS> gotwig_: for the first half of the release cycle, they're automatically synced
<SpamapS> gotwig_: unless the Ubuntu package has changed
<gotwig_> SpamapS: ok, I am unfamiliar with reporting debian bugs :(
<SpamapS> gotwig_: report it in Ubuntu then, and it will get forwarded
<gotwig_> SpamapS: for that package? but its not included in ubuntu yet
<SpamapS> gotwig_: npm or something else?
<SpamapS> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/npm
<SpamapS> very much included in Ubuntu :)
<gotwig_> that was * fast
<SpamapS> gotwig_: well it was included long before we started
<SpamapS> just at an older version
<gotwig_> yes
<gotwig_> SpamapS: and does oneiric get an update, too?
<kklimonda> EvilResistance: I can test upgrade from znc lucid version to precise, if someone else can test upgrade from oneiric I don't see why would that even need a FFe - there aren't really any new "features" and FinalFreeze doesn't affect unseeded packages afair (although this one could be better documented).
<kklimonda> (in other news, sbuild is a terrible tool for building packages - any idea if pbuilder supports lvm snapshots? ;))
<gotwig_> SpamapS: https://bugs.launchpad.net/iranpm/+bug/981213 , correct?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 981213 in npm (Ubuntu) "Add g++ and make to Dependency/Recommend list" [Undecided,New]
<gotwig_> SpamapS: could you please change the "affects debian" or something like that, part?
<SpamapS> gotwig_: it will get picked up during normal triage
<EvilResistance> kklimonda:  if you upgrade in that fashion, you may need to change the debian requirements, remove 'swig' as a build-dep, not sure about Lucid's ability to upgrade easily (given that there've been significant changes since lucid's version)
<gotwig_> SpamapS: do you have found any other bugs?
<SpamapS> gotwig_: no
<gotwig_> SpamapS: so does it work for you :) ?
<kklimonda> EvilResistance: that will affect upgrades to 0.204-1 anyway, right?
<EvilResistance> kklimonda: there'll also be build dep errors on lucid, because swig2.0 isnt available in lucid (last i checked) and won't backport
<kklimonda> EvilResistance: I don't have to build it on lucid though
<EvilResistance> (same applies to maverick, and natty), but when upgrading from lucid to precise, it should work (as swig2.0 exists on precise)
<EvilResistance> ah, right, upgrading direct from lucid -> precise, that'd fix the builddeps issues
#ubuntu-motu 2012-04-14
<bobweaver> Does anyone know where I can get examples of rules for make files I am real green to all this and am wondering about things like. Can I use bash in make files how are they structured ect  I think that If I was to look at some examples that would help me.Thanks
<SpamapS> bobweaver: make files for your upstream build, or for making a package?
<SpamapS> bobweaver: there are tens of thousands of packages you can look at for debian/rules examples. :)
<bobweaver> making a package the rules file under debian dir
<bobweaver> oh wait I could just download the source code facepalm ....   what about learning about rules and how makefiles need certian things like ending quotes. how to mirror dir's can I run loops in them ect
<bobweaver> pardon my n00bie question just trying to learn :)
<bobweaver> http://web.mit.edu/gnu/doc/html/make_3.html   is looking good
<SpamapS> bobweaver: a must read http://wiki.debian.org/IntroDebianPackaging
<bobweaver> Thanks SpamapS  I just thought that by asking here I would be able to learn from other's mistakes
<SpamapS> bobweaver: the ideal rules file is *two* lines long and has no loops or weird conditions. :)
<bobweaver> cool I will keep that in mind
<SpamapS> bobweaver: well if you're going to ask questions, make them specific or it will be hard to commit to an answer.
<bobweaver> SpamapS,  Is there any gui based programs for making debian packages ? that you know off ?
<bobweaver> everything that I have found is for heron or drapper
<SpamapS> bobweaver: lots of GUI text editors. ;)
<tumbleweed> \o/ beer festival today
<bobweaver> I did it it worked I can not believe it my 1st make file http://paste.ubuntu.com/929107/  \o/ It worked !!!!!!! I am so flipin happy right now. To think that I started with nothing and now I have my own program YES !
<bobweaver> OH.... It's on now every tar ball I see with no debian package is going to get one now. What a great feeling YES
<Zhenech> soo, who wants to sync me pokerth into precise? :)
<Adri2000> Zhenech: does it need a FFe?
<Zhenech> Adri2000, it's a new upstream bugfix release, dholbach said yesterday it would be fine
<Laney> "New report bad-game-name system"
<Zhenech> Laney, what?
<Laney> that doesn't sound like a bug fix
<Laney> anyway, it should be fine for FFe
<Laney> file it and I'll approve
<Zhenech> uhm, https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/981511
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 981511 in pokerth (Ubuntu) "Sync pokerth 0.9.4-1 (universe) from Debian sid (main)" [Undecided,New]
<Laney> ty
<Zhenech> i just think I forgot -e to syncreq
<jtaylor> dupondje: comment on bug 979986, the autoreconf call in debian rules was wrong and did nothing, so its probably not needed anymore, I still fixed it, should do not harm
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 979986 in opensc (Ubuntu) "[FFe] Please merge opensc 0.12.2-2 (universe) from debian unstable" [Undecided,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/979986
<jtaylor> also integrated the ubu5 changelog
<jtaylor> also the profile diff is in debian, though I forgot that for the upload ^^
<Adri2000> Laney: are you handling the pokerth sync sponsorship as well or may I do it?
<Laney> I am doing an upgrade test from lucid now
<Laney> "Yes, do as I say!"
<Laney> Adri2000: syncing it
<Adri2000> ok
<dupondje> jtaylor: must have missed the profile diff indeed :(
<jtaylor> a meld wrapper that does wrap-and-sort is useful for that :)
<dupondje> you uploaded the new version now ? :)
<jtaylor> dupondje: I use those two scripts for binary and source packages: http://paste.ubuntu.com/929406/
<jtaylor> yes
<dupondje> saving that ;) thx
<dupondje> the autoreconf call was just taken from previous versions btw ..
<dupondje> and ubu5 was missing because the MoM seems out of date again
<dupondje> cjwatson: MoM stuck again?
<bdrung> jtaylor: "cd $tmpdir/old/ && wrap-and-sort" could be changed to wrap-and-sort -d $tmpdir/old/debian"
<cjwatson> dupondje: it's been having some trouble (crashing on base-installer merge), but I've poked it; hopefully it'll recover this time
<dupondje> hehe thx
<dupondje> I guess it wants to get poked sometimes :)
<jtaylor> is there a sru channel?
<cjwatson> no
<cjwatson> (afaik)
<jtaylor> hm, anyone on the -sru team here?
<cjwatson> well, I am, but really ought to be doing housework etc.
<jtaylor> cjwatson: just a question about updating from rc to final post release
<jtaylor> matplotlib 1.1.1 is currently rc and as its the last versin supporting py2.4 it is supposed to be "rock solid"
<jtaylor> bugfix only compared to 1.1.0 i precise
<jtaylor> but probably final 1.1.1 will not be released before precise is out
<jtaylor> i was wondering if it is possible to update to the rc now and maybe updating to the final as a SRU
<cjwatson> depends on the scale and importance of the changes; I don't normally consider version numbers in themselves to be important, personally
<jtaylor> 672 files changed, 22588 insertions(+), 20016 deletions(-) between the RC and the branch head :/
<jtaylor> probably to much for an SRU
<jtaylor> oh no wrong tag
<jtaylor> 10 files changed, 449 insertions(+), 15 deletions(-)
<jtaylor> I'll then update to the RC and observe what SRU worthy changes later
<bobweaver> I have a real important question I am getting ready to make a huge .deb file while big for me. http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~josephjamesmills/zpanelcp/trunk/files       I am at the part that I have to make the rules file.  I had made a dialog installer script for zpanel. Is there anyway that I can call that installer script after the dependency have been installed ? I see all these .ex files and wondering if I can make my installer script i
<bobweaver> nto one. then call to it in rules ? thank you so much for your time.
<bobweaver> the installer scrip is wrote in bash
<bobweaver> installerscript = http://paste.ubuntu.com/929556/     thanks again
<bobweaver> I know that I would have to mod it some but is there a way ?
<bobweaver> I used dh_make -e <email> -c gpl3 -f my.tar.gz to make what I have now
<cjwatson> postinst scripts are run after dependencies are installed and your package is unpacked
<cjwatson> however, if it's interacting with the user, it should use debconf, not your own dialog code
<cjwatson> (that should give you some keywords to google for ...)
<bobweaver> Thanks cjwatson
<cjwatson> call to it in rules> it's important to understand that debian/rules is run at build time, while you're looking for something to run when the package is installed - those probably won't even be on the same computer, so it's not a matter of calling something from rules
<cjwatson> (maybe that was just sloppy language, but I often find it saves people time if they get a good mental model of what's going on right from the start)
<bobweaver> +1million
<bobweaver> I want to release good code that is the goal if it is not soild I will not release. you can see by how I put comments in and also how I indent but I am a n00b 100% at this I made my first to packages last night they can be found here http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~josephjamesmills/ubforums-2-ubwiki/ubforums-2-ubwiki/files    . Thanks again for the Hints and if you can think opf any links please pass my way as I not only need them but want th
<bobweaver> em. it is a great feeling to watch your code come to life. I only have been coding for under 6 months or so. Cheers Joseph
<alket> How to make a deb package with binaries which will basicly move to /opt/ ?
<ockham> do i need an FFe if i want to have ocrfeeder 0.7.9-1 synced from debian? both 0.7.8 and 0.7.9 were mostly about fixing http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=661499
<ubottu> Debian bug 661499 in ocrfeeder "ocrfeeder: Interprets Tesseract's version string as part of the OCRed text" [Normal,Fixed]
<SpamapS> If anybody from the release team is monitoring, I missed 3 packages in the syncs from debian tomorrow for bug 863094 , so npm is now not installable
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 863094 in npm (Ubuntu Precise) "[FFE] npm versions less than 1.1 will not work with registry.npmjs.org" [Critical,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/863094
<SpamapS> opened bug 981851 to track the issue
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 981851 in npm (Ubuntu Precise) "npm is uninstallable" [Critical,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/981851
<Laney> SpamapS: they were in the initial FFe â why do you think you need another?
<Laney> anyway, ScottK ^^^ perhaps you want to accept
<ScottK> SpamapS: Please upload and fix.
 * ScottK will accecpt.
<Laney> they are in NEW
<jtaylor> if you're going over ffes bug 980602 needs ack/rej
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 980602 in mdp (Ubuntu) "[FFe] python-mdp raises an AttributeError on import" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/980602
<jtaylor> see comment 1
<ScottK> OK.  I'll look in a bit.
<ScottK> SpamapS: Source New done.  I'll get the binaries after they appear too.
<ScottK> SpamapS: Done.
<jtaylor> thx Laney
<Laney> yw
<ockham> for building packages for future distribution versions, there's pbuilder, cowbuilder et al. but what's the best way to test packages, say, for Precise, if I don't want to give it a partition of its own? some chroot magic? is there any documentation on this?
<jtaylor> VM's are an option
<jtaylor> for many partitions use lvm
<cjwatson> or schroot if it doesn't need much in the way of desktop infrastructure
<ockham> that's the thing about chroots, right? if i want to test desktop applications, that'd be rather difficult with them
<cjwatson> if you use mk-sbuild to create the chroots, then you can schroot into them and you'll get a throwaway overlay filesystem, so you can install stuff, test it, and then it all magically vanishes when you stop using it
<cjwatson> yes, VMs might be more practical in that case
<ockham> i was hoping for something as comprehensive as the stuff on the ubuntu wiki for pbuilder...
<ockham> documentation-wise
<ockham> any pointers to some blog article or anything covering this? let's say for the VM way...
<SpamapS> ScottK: thanks! :)
<SpamapS> Laney: and just to respond, it wasn't that I needed another FFE, just that I needed a release team member to ack the NEW's
 * SpamapS really appreciates the responsiveness of the release team, ScottK in particular. :)
<ScottK> Glad I could help out.
<SpamapS> anything for the node.js community right? ;)
<ScottK> SpamapS: Any thoughts on syncing nginx?
<ockham> ScottK: thx for approving bug 981850
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 981850 in ocrfeeder (Ubuntu) "FFe: Sync ocrfeeder 0.7.9-1 (universe) from Debian sid (main)" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/981850
<ScottK> You're welcome.
<SpamapS> ScottK: +1
<SpamapS> ScottK: I'm going to be evaluating nginx for main in 12.10
<ScottK> SpamapS: Do me up an FFe so we have a paper trial, I'll approve it, you mash the sync button, and then I'll accept it.
<ScottK> OK.
<SpamapS> ScottK: gladly!
<ScottK> Thanks.
<SpamapS>      + Fixed a buffer overflow in the ngx_http_mp4_module. See: CVE-2012-2089
<ubottu> ** RESERVED ** This candidate has been reserved by an organization or individual that will use it when announcing a new security problem.  When the candidate has been publicized, the details for this candidate will be provided. (http://cve.mitre.org/cgi-bin/cvename.cgi?name=CVE-2012-2089)
<SpamapS> ScottK: do we even need a FFE for this?
<ScottK> SpamapS: There's two upstream versions we'd get from a sync.  If they're both all bugfix, no.
 * ScottK didn't check.
<SpamapS> no there are a couple of new binaries
<SpamapS> a new module for webdav and something called 'nginx-naxsi
<ScottK> FFe then.  I'll do the New for them.
<SpamapS> ScottK: Ok I'll file FFE
<ScottK> Thanks.
<SpamapS> ScottK: sync requested, FFE filed
<SpamapS> ScottK: bug 981969
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 981969 in nginx (Ubuntu Precise) "[FFE] sync nginx 1.1.19-1 from Debian unstable" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/981969
<ScottK> SpamapS: Approved.
#ubuntu-motu 2012-04-15
<pellaeon> Hi, is there any guide on manually backporting packages?
<micahg> pellaeon: man backportpackage
<pellaeon> thanks
<pellaeon> uh, if I want to backport a package from precise to lucid, I must have precise?
<micahg> pellaeon: no
<pellaeon> I couldn't find backportpackage command on lucid
<pellaeon> I have ubuntu-dev-tools installed
<micahg> pellaeon: oh, yeah, that's only in oneiric on I think
<pellaeon> So what should I do?
<pellaeon> Are there other similar tools?
<micahg> pellaeon: well, it just adjusts the version for you, you can use pull-lp-source to get the code and then add a revision with a lower version on top (~lucid1~ppa1)  ~lucid1 would be an official backport
<pellaeon> OK, I'll try that
<micahg> pellaeon: which package is it?
<pellaeon> ibus
<micahg> have fun :)
<pellaeon> Hope this is not too difficult for a newbie...
<paissad> hello guys, why do Ubuntu version always get released on thursdays ?
<ockham> what's a good VM for testing Precise?
<ockham> (under 11.10, that is)
<ockham> ideally fast, lightweight, and no need to emulate another architecture than the host (amd64)
<jtaylor> can someone see what goes wrong here: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/openvas-server/+bug/634247
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 634247 in openvas-server (Ubuntu) "package openvas-server 2.0.3-3 failed to install/upgrade: subprocess installed post-installation script returned error exit status 10" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<jtaylor> apparently also opccurs in precise but I can't reproduce it
<cjwatson> ockham: kvm works well as long as you don't need 3D passthrough
<cjwatson> I do nearly all my installer testing in it
<SpamapS> cjwatson: and the automated daily tests of the installer are run via kvm as well
<pellaeon> Hello, I was building gettext-0.18.1.1 inside pbuilder chroot, I encountered an error:
<pellaeon> mkdir: cannot create directory `debian/gettext/usr/lib/': File exists
<pellaeon> I am now in the shell (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto#Running_a_Shell_When_Build_Fails_.28Intro_to_Hook_Scripts.29)
<Nafallo> hey. is it to late to upload a build1 ?
<Nafallo> dovecot-antispam needs to get rebuilt against current dovecot, or it won't work.
<cjwatson> Nafallo: in universe, should be ok
<pellaeon> what should I do to solve this error?
<Nafallo> excellent. then I'll go ahead and find my gpg key :-)
<cjwatson> pellaeon: are you building a package you downloaded, or one you created yourself?  which exact version on which release/
<cjwatson> ?
<pellaeon> from precise http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/main/g/gettext/gettext_0.18.1.1-5ubuntu3.dsc
<pellaeon> My current version is lucid
<cjwatson> and your aim is to produce a backport of that version to lucid?
<pellaeon> yes
 * cjwatson tries it in sbuild to see what's going on
<cjwatson> I mean, your next step is to debug the problem :-)
<cjwatson> which is a creative task, in general
<pellaeon> some hints?
<cjwatson> don't have any until I've had a look
<pellaeon> Ok, i'll wait, thank you!
<cjwatson> debugging is far too general a subject to give general hints that are at all useful
<cjwatson> I assume you've already backported git or something
<cjwatson> ?
<cjwatson> or are you weakening that build-dep?
<pellaeon> er, it's kinda complicated,
<pellaeon> I have git PPA enabled, so I now have git 1.7.10
<pellaeon> 1.7.10 meets the reqiurement of gettext
<cjwatson> can you give me the URL of that PPA, to save me time following your footsteps?
<pellaeon> https://launchpad.net/~git-core/+archive/ppa
<pellaeon> Actually backporting gettext is just a step for me to backport ibus-1.4.1
<pellaeon> I don't know how to use sbuild yet, should I learn it? or pbuilder is just enough for my backporting work?
<cjwatson> I strongly prefer it, but since you have an actual problem to solve it's probably better to solve it first
<pellaeon> OK
<cjwatson> oh, I see, the problem is that the source has been converted to multiarch and lucid doesn't have that
<cjwatson> basically you'll need to find the appropriate matching recipe in http://wiki.debian.org/Multiarch/Implementation and reverse the steps
<cjwatson> it's a shame the source didn't have a suitable build-dependency to act as a warning there
<pellaeon> Ok, thank you very much!
<cjwatson> does ibus genuinely require the newer version, or is it sort of artificial?
<cjwatson> I don't see the build-dependency in question - what was the trail that led you to a newer gettext?
<cjwatson> it's possible that it will be easier to break the backport chain somewhere different
<pellaeon> ibus-1.4.1 depends debhelper-8.13.0 depends dpkg-dev-1.16.0 depends gettext_0.18.1.1-5ubuntu3
<pellaeon> I don't really know if ibus really needed it, this is my first time
<cjwatson> a build-dependency on debhelper 8.1.3 is almost certainly for multiarch
<cjwatson> you don't want that in lucid anyway
<cjwatson> so instead, you should reverse the Multiarch/Implementation recipe in ibus, and forget about the rest of that chain
<pellaeon> So you mean I have to patch it ?
<cjwatson> yes
<cjwatson> the conversion was done in ibus 1.4.0-3, so you may be able to get hints from the diff between 1.4.0-2 and 1.4.0-3
<pellaeon> Thanks for the hint
<cjwatson> though it might not be a simple matter of just reverting that; I expect it might be a bit tangled up
<cjwatson> I guess you already know you might need to backport individual input methods as well ...
<pellaeon> Thank you, I'll study the code
<pellaeon> I know that
 * cjwatson nods
<pellaeon> I've got much to learn
<cjwatson> certainly not an easy task you've set yourself here
<cjwatson> though not intractable or anything
<pellaeon> Is this too difficult for a beginner?
<cjwatson> depends how persistent you are :-)
<cjwatson> I can probably help at some point if you get completely stuck, but would rather not take away the learning opportunity ...
<pellaeon> I understand, thank you very much!
<pellaeon> Bye, it's quite late here, good night
<cjwatson> night
 * cjwatson ceremonially burns his maverick chroots
<SpamapS> maverick was my first release
<SpamapS> fare thee well brave meerkat!
<cjwatson> you always remember your first?
 * SpamapS also pushes it off into the hinterlands
<SpamapS> cjwatson: but does your first always remember you? :)
 * Laney discovers feisty..maverick chroots
<cjwatson> a good question to which I do not honestly know the answer ;-)
<jbicha> Rhonda: should wesnoth-1.8 be removed from Precise since we have wesnoth-1.10?
<Nafallo> hrm. it got rejected.
<Laney> Yes, do as I say!
 * Laney enjoys that
<Rhonda> jbicha: Hmm, I'm uncertain, but probably yes because precise is an LTS release.
 * Rhonda . o O ( syncpackage wesnoth-1.10 )
<Rhonda> oh, -d unstable
<jbicha> Rhonda: and you're going to drop wesnoth-1.9 from Debian too, right?
<Rhonda> That for sure, but that is blocked from sync anyway
<ScottK> jtaylor: Accepted inspircd.  If you're looking for something productive to do, I think asterisk really, really needs a merge before release.
<jtaylor> ScottK: yes I did already merge it, but a user complained
<jtaylor> the release in debian is supposed to be unstable
<ScottK> Debian Bug 664411 has me concerned.
<ubottu> Debian bug 664411 in asterisk "[CVE-2012-1183 - CVE-2012-1184] Asterisk: AST-2012-002 and AST-2012-003 flaws" [Grave,Fixed] http://bugs.debian.org/664411
<ScottK> We should at least get those taken care of somehow.
<Laney> Daviey loves asterisk
<ScottK> That's true.
<jtaylor> see bug 920020
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 920020 in asterisk (Ubuntu Oneiric) "NOT FOUND answer on OPTIONS request" [Low,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/920020
<jtaylor> there are patches from him for the sec issues, I'll have a look
<jtaylor> ok but they contain features from later versions ...
<ScottK> Not having huge security issues at release is a great feature all by itself.
<ScottK> If they only way to get some of them fixed is to glom some other stuff in, then so be it.
<jtaylor> I have a branch that merges asterisk if someone who actually uses it overrides paul I can upload it
<jtaylor> provided an ffe is given too
<ScottK> Daviey: Know any Ubuntu asterisk users?
<ScottK> Get something reasonable to upload and we'll figure out the paperwork.
<jtaylor> lp:~jtaylor/debian/sid/asterisk/merge-ubuntu
<verwilst> if a package has been removed from the archive, with the note NBS, what does that mean?
<verwilst> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/precise/amd64/dlm-pcmk :(
<verwilst> no more distributed lock for pacemaker?
<bobweaver> hello there I a quick question that I must be missing in the debian packaging guide  Under depends do I have to put greater then or eq too on all packages ?   here is a example of  my control file.  http://paste.ubuntu.com/931775/
<ScottK> bobweaver: You only have to specify a minimum version it you actually need a certain version.
<Zhenech> bobweaver, you usually dont do equal
<Zhenech> and then what ScottK says
<bobweaver> Zhenech,  so just > like    bash (> 3.0)
<bobweaver> off cource that is not the right version just a example
<jtaylor> it must be (>> 3.0)
<ScottK> Usually you use >= and specify the minimum version you need rather than > and a version less than you need.
<ScottK> And jtaylor is right.  >> is the proper way to specify strictly greater than.
<Zhenech> please use >= minimum.version
<Zhenech> and try not to include debian/ubuntu revision there unless really needed
<bobweaver> I make my depends list by 1 taking a fresh copy of ubuntu server 12.04 then  make clone of that  in the og server run dpkg-query --list      then install package on clone run same thing then grep and awk and sed come into play      is this a good idea ?
<jtaylor> in general no, but for some personal use maybe
<bobweaver> like grep -xvF -f og.txt wdep.txt
<jtaylor> what kind of a package is it? e.g. for simple native code stuff there are helpers to generate to minimal dependencies automatically
<bobweaver> then that gets sent to new list and then I make list but I have been taking out the 2nd table that has versions I should leave
<bobweaver> code is here http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~josephjamesmills/zpanelcp/zpanelcp/files  it is a control panel alternitive to Cpanel
<bobweaver> jtaylor,  there is that is cool . I am just starting out as you can tell. So thanks so much for that info
<bobweaver> my goal is to learn how to package right (foloowing you all ) then partice partice partice and maybe one day I too could also be a ubuntu packager
<bobweaver> Or at least know how to package right. IS there a mentore thing that you all do ? or a mailing list stuff that I can learn from ?
<bobweaver> like the debian mentor program
<jtaylor> you can always ask questions but if you want to package something its better to do it in debian
<bobweaver> Wow I did not know that thanks so much !
<bobweaver> Is there a thing for ubuntu like the debian mentor program ?
<ScottK> bobweaver: Mostly asking here and people will answer.  There is also an ubuntu-motu list, but it's very low volume.
<bobweaver> Thansk ScottK  Did you join the debian mentor team 1st. I just want to kinda learn from others. if [ a <= debian mentor] then do $this  else  echo you should do $this1   ect
<bobweaver> like should I learn to use r ? or is it just so old that it is not worth it
<bobweaver> I am going to read this and make look cleaner also :)
<bobweaver> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU
<ScottK> I don't do much sponsoring in Debian.
<bobweaver> Thanks ScottK
<bobweaver> I would also like to say that I am sorry about my spelling as I am nonsense word dyslisic
#ubuntu-motu 2013-04-08
<dholbach> good morning
<iulian> Gooood morning dholbach.
<dholbach> hey iulian
<jussi> hrm, found something not in the repo's, gpl2, packaging pretty much done... anyone want to volunteer to get it into the repos ? :D
<jussi> http://www.zpanelcp.com/
<Laney> tumbleweed: btw I mailed DSA about that UDD thing
<Laney> seems that SSL cert validation is knackered
<Laney> laney@ullmann> python -c "import httplib2; httplib2.Http().request('https://eff.org', 'GET')"                                              ~
<Laney> Traceback (most recent call last):
<Laney> â¦
<Laney> httplib2.SSLHandshakeError: [Errno 1] _ssl.c:504: error:14090086:SSL routines:SSL3_GET_SERVER_CERTIFICATE:certificate verify failed
<tumbleweed> aah
<tumbleweed> yay
<Laney> not sure how all that stuff works, but it corresponds to some mtimes in /etc/ssl/
<AnAnt> Hello, I've done an upload & forgot to close the LP bug, is anyone a distro manager ?
<tumbleweed> AnAnt: you shouldn't need any rights to close a bug
<AnAnt> tumbleweed: what I meant is that the upload needs approval of a distro manager, and I don't think that a distro manager would approve without knowing the bug this upload fixes
<tumbleweed> oh, I see what you are asking
<tumbleweed> which package is it? I'm a release team member, I can reject it
<AnAnt> tumbleweed: dia
<AnAnt>  LP #704990
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 704990 in Ubuntu App Developer site "Provide a web development landing page" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/704990
<AnAnt> oops, wrong LP
<AnAnt> LP 1166203
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1166203 in dia (Ubuntu) "dia crashes on raring" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1166203
<tumbleweed> AnAnt: rejected. please re-upload
<AnAnt> ok
<tumbleweed> too late, someone accepted it
<tumbleweed> you just get to close the bug by hand
<AnAnt> sure, no problem
<AnAnt> by the way, is that considered an FFe ?
<tumbleweed> AnAnt: it looks like that was a merge, without -v
<AnAnt> -v ?
<tumbleweed> when you merge, build with -v
<AnAnt> erm, I merged manually
<tumbleweed> in this case, debuild -S -v0.97.2-8ubuntu1
<tumbleweed> doesn't matter that you merged manually
<tumbleweed> you want the changelog that goes out to -changes (and shows up in LP) to show everything that changed in Ubuntu in that upload
<tumbleweed> so, you want to include all the Debian changes in the .changes file
<AnAnt> ahhhh, I understand now
<tumbleweed> that's what -vOLD_UBUNTU_VERSION does
<tumbleweed> (it has a side-effect of closing any bugs that debian uploads closed)
<AnAnt> ok
<tumbleweed> but to really answer your question about FFes
<tumbleweed> this upload looks like bugfixes only, so no FFe required
<AnAnt> ok
<AnAnt> thanks
<TheLordOfTime> any free MOTU/bugcontroller available for a few minutes?
<TheLordOfTime> oh, and any sponsors awake?
<tumbleweed> !ask | TheLordOfTime
<ubottu> TheLordOfTime: Please don't ask to ask a question, simply ask the question (all on ONE line and in the channel, so that others can read and follow it easily). If anyone knows the answer they will most likely reply. :-) See also !patience
<TheLordOfTime> tumbleweed, the bugcontroller question is unrelated to MOTU, though.  as for sponsors, I pinged mdeslaur to sponsor a debdiff which fixes my own previous patch which accidentally introduced a bug (and that was also sponsored by mdeslaur)
 * TheLordOfTime was getting zero response in -bugs :P
<TheLordOfTime> anyways, it's irrelevant, i'll let it sit since i already answered my own question
<saiarcot895> Are merges into ubuntu raring currently being approved by ubuntu-sponsors, or are they still frozen?
<jtaylor> depends on the merge
<jtaylor> bugfix can just go in
<jtaylor> new features need an Freeze exception from ubuntu-release
<saiarcot895> new upstream versions?
<saiarcot895> already have that
<jtaylor> then its just a matter of someone finding time to do it
#ubuntu-motu 2013-04-09
<dholbach> good morning
#ubuntu-motu 2013-04-10
<ESphynx> 'evening guys :)
<Aaron> Aevening ESphynx
<dholbach> good morning
<geser> good morning
<Rhonda> Hmm.  From whom or where can I get more information about the planned ubuntu mobile OS?
<Rhonda> found a youtube video with sabdfl :)
<ogra_`> Rhonda, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch ... there is also an #ubuntu-touch channel
<Rhonda> Thanks, ogra! :)
<Rhonda> When did someone see sabdfl last on irc?  :)
<Laney> nickserv info suggests it's been some time
<Laney> try mail? :-)
<Rhonda> oh, right, nickserv.
<Rhonda> Mail?  Oh that RTT  %-/
<Laney> 10/04 12:57:06 -NickServ(NickServ@services.)- Information on Rhonda (account Rhonda):
<Laney> 10/04 12:57:06 -NickServ(NickServ@services.)- Registered : Jan 30 16:44:43 2004 (9 years, 10 weeks, 2 days, 19:12:23 ago)
<Laney> 10/04 12:57:06 -NickServ(NickServ@services.)- User reg.  : Jan 08 13:28:18 2001 (12 years, 13 weeks, 3 days, 22:28:48 ago)
<Laney> !!!
<Laney> You so old skool
<Rhonda> Just because I was on irc before you were born?  :P
<Laney> haha
<Laney> I was impressed with my 8-and-a-bit years, then the first person I checked was you who easily beat me
 * Laney slinks off
<Rhonda> I'll never beat you (up)
<Rhonda> haha, slink.  Nice pun, and my first Debian install. ;)
<Zhenech> thank root ircnet has no nickserv to tell about me :)
<Rhonda> ircnet does have neither. :)
<Rhonda> erm, that's what you meant.  *getting more caffein*
 * Rhonda muses about bouncing all misguided mails that I receive through packages.u.c to Laney
<Laney> print them, then burn the copies
<Laney> it'll keep you warm through the winter
<ogra_> winter is over though ... that will require storage space
<Laney> shred them for comfy bedding?
<Laney> 101 uses for emails from confused usersâ¢
<ogra_> but all your suggestions involve killing trees !
<Rhonda> I have enough advertise papers in the mail, and wood infront of the house.
 * Laney stabs ullmann
<Laney> i'm going to reduce the cron frequency until dsa fix it
#ubuntu-motu 2013-04-11
<lfaraone> If we upload a package with a target of precise-updates, will Launchpad DTRT?
<ScottK> lfaraone: No.
<ScottK> You need to reupload it.  What package (I'll reject the -updates one for you)
<dtchen> -proposed should be the target, no?
<ScottK> Yes
<ScottK> Also just precise will work now.
<dtchen> yes, as I discovered to my chagrin :)
<lfaraone> ScottK: please reject pithos from precise-updates
<ScottK> (due to the change made for the development release to have everything land in -prposed)
<ScottK> lfaraone: Done.
<ScottK> Good night all.
<dtchen> night!
<lfaraone> ScottK: reuploaded to -proposed, thanks.
<dholbach> good morning
<ESphynx> good morning dholbach :)
<dholbach> hey ESphynx
<Laney> jtaylor: you asked sylvestre to file https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/morse-simulator/+bug/1167229 ?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1167229 in morse-simulator (Ubuntu) "FeatureFreeze for Morse new upstream release " [Undecided,New]
<DamienCassou> I would need some mentoring for making a great package out of a working one. I'm currently building a package for the Pharo IDE
<DamienCassou> some people told me that ${shlibs: Depends} should find all the depencies but that does not work. So I'm looking for someone to help me fix that (and other problems)
<DamienCassou> PPA is at https://launchpad.net/~cassou/+archive/pharo/ and packaging files and scripts  are at https://github.com/pharo-project/pharo-vm-ubuntu
<mitya57> DamienCassou: there shouldn't be a space before "Depends" word
<DamienCassou> mitya57: I know, but without a space I get a smiley ${shlibs:Depends}
<DamienCassou> :-)
<mitya57> :D
 * mitya57 looks at source in github
<DamienCassou> mitya57: thank you
<mitya57> DamienCassou: shlibs:Depends=libc6 (>= 2.3), libc6 (>= 2.3.6-6~), libfreetype6 (>= 2.2.1), libssl1.0.0 (>= 1.0.0) â anything missing here
<mitya57> ?
<DamienCassou> the compilation should generate a vm-display-X11 file that depends on libGL1.so and libX11-6.so
<DamienCassou> can I remove the "libssl1.0.0" part of my 'Depends:' line?
<mitya57> DamienCassou: you can, but it should work...
<mitya57> DamienCassou: also, http://paste.ubuntu.com/5698510/
<mitya57> maybe that's the reason
<DamienCassou> mitya57: is there anything I can do about those?
<mitya57> DamienCassou: which file is linked against libGL or libX11?
<DamienCassou> the generated vm-display-X11
<DamienCassou> built in the results/ directory
<mitya57> DamienCassou: that file should be executable
<mitya57> when I chmod +x it, I get
<mitya57> shlibs:Depends=libc6 (>= 2.3), libc6 (>= 2.3.6-6~), libfreetype6 (>= 2.2.1), libgl1-mesa-glx | libgl1, libice6 (>= 1:1.0.0), libsm6, libssl1.0.0 (>= 1.0.0), libx11-6
<DamienCassou> mitya57: this file should not be executed by itself, it is just a .so
<DamienCassou> mitya57: should I still set the execute bit?
<mitya57> DamienCassou: I think yes, some other .so's in results dir are also executable
<DamienCassou> mitya57: what is the best place to set this bit? override_dh_install?
<mitya57> DamienCassou: well, dpkg-shlibdeps has this check:
<mitya57> $obj->is_executable() or $obj->is_public_library()
<mitya57> in your case the latter should be true, but for some reason isn't
<mitya57> let me investigate
<DamienCassou> mitya57: could it be because the extension .so is not there?
<mitya57> DamienCassou: ah of course
<mitya57> yes, so please either add an extension or set executable bit
<mitya57> the *best* place to do that is upstream
<DamienCassou> I will see if the project still works when the extension if present
<DamienCassou> s/if present/is present/
<mitya57> but otherwise you can do that in override_dh_auto_install or as a patch for upstream buildsystem
<DamienCassou> I have a maintainer of the upstream project next door, I will send him a list of bug reports as soon as I found them
<mitya57> by the way, did you see a list of lintian warnings?
<mitya57> let me paste here some (these are actually errors, not warnings)
<mitya57> E: pharo-vm source: ancient-autotools-helper-file platforms/unix/config/config.sub 2002-09-05
<mitya57> ^ x4
<mitya57> E: pharo-vm: embedded-library usr/lib/pharo-vm/pharo: pcre3
<mitya57> E: pharo-vm: embedded-library usr/lib/pharo-vm/pharo: libjpeg
<mitya57> E: pharo-vm: possible-gpl-code-linked-with-openssl
<DamienCassou> mitya57: fixing them is on my todo list and they are also part of the reasons why I need a mentor
<DamienCassou> mitya57: do you volunteer in keeping on helping me?
<mitya57> DamienCassou: no, sorry (lack of time), but feel free to ask questions when I'm here
<DamienCassou> thank you anyway
<mitya57> when I am not, there are other people here who can help
<DamienCassou> I made progress
<gotwig> hey
<gotwig> what about linux 3.9 and nvidia-319 in Ubuntu 13.04. Is it possible, out of the box?
<gotwig> shadeslayer: hey there
<shadeslayer> hi gotwig
<gotwig> shadeslayer: do you know if nvidia-319 is going to come to ubuntu 13.04?
<shadeslayer> nope
<shadeslayer> probably #ubuntu-x knows
<jtaylor> Laney: re morse, well I saw a jump from 0.6alpha to 1.0.1 and said that probably needs a ffe
<jtaylor> I don't know the software
<Laney>  678 files changed, 28058 insertions(+), 20124 deletions(-)
<Laney> I wonder ...
<lfaraone> RAOF: I finally uploaded a minimal SRU to precise-proposed for pithos for LP 988395, apologies for the delay
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 988395 in pithos (Ubuntu Precise) "Pandora v34 API Update Required" [High,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/988395
#ubuntu-motu 2013-04-12
<dholbach> good morning
#ubuntu-motu 2013-04-13
<Lasall> hi, is there a graph/statistic about the difference of debian and ubuntu package archive (e.g. unmodified packages from debian, new ubuntu packages, etc.)? i remember a graph but don't find it any more :( .
<tumbleweed> Lasall: look on merges.ubuntu.com
<Lasall> yeah, thank you tumbleweed :)
<gotwig_> hey, can you help me a bit with packaging?
#ubuntu-motu 2013-04-14
<jtaylor> Laney: is your answer to bug 1167229 equivalent to a ffe?
<ubottu> bug 1146637 in morse-simulator (Ubuntu) "duplicate for #1167229 Sync morse-simulator 1.0.0-1~exp3 (universe) from Debian experimental (main)" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1146637
<jtaylor> a you are part of -release so I'll take that as an ack
#ubuntu-motu 2014-04-07
<dholbach> good morning
<ochosi> hey dholbach
<ochosi> as you've done that once before during this cycle already, i wanted to ask you whether you could help us merge some branches into xubuntu-default-settings
<dholbach> hi ochosi
<dholbach> ochosi, did you follow https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SponsorshipProcess?
<dholbach> ochosi, that's a way to get everybody's eyes on a change which needs uploading and not just mine
<dholbach> I'm a bit busy right now
<ochosi> yes, i know
<ochosi> ok
<ochosi> well, the main problem is that we have no available developer that can merge even branches
<dholbach> I don't understand... what's the problem?
<dholbach> you have nobody in the xubuntu team who could do your (upstream?) code review?
<ochosi> we only have 1 developer who can push to most of our branches, and he's a bit MIA
<dholbach> is that access to projects on Launchpad or uploads to the ubuntu archive?
<ochosi> we intended to change that, xubuntu project lead even approved adding more ppl to the -dev team (including me), but it hasn't happened (because of MIA)
<ochosi> access to projects
<ochosi> it used to be that xubuntu-dev team also had uploads
<dholbach> gotcha
<ochosi> but not anymore
<dholbach> ah yes - it looks like it makes a lot of sense to decouple that
<ochosi> yup
<ochosi> so yeah, it's been a problem we've been having :)
<ochosi> and i thought since we talked about this before and you merged some branches for us, i could ask you again, but if you're busy nvm
<ochosi> we'll find another way, no worries
<dholbach> feel free to drop me a mail with links to the branches and I'll have a look (if nobody got around to looking at them, once I'm done with the other stuff)
<ochosi> ok, thanks, that's very kind of you
<dholbach> dholbach at ubuntu dot com - thanks :)
<Laney> ochosi: put it in the queue, I'll look shortly hopefully
<Laney> patch piloting atm
<ochosi> Laney: thanks! will do
<ochosi> Laney: done
<Laney> ty
<Laney> ochosi: do you have one branch to rule them all for this?
<Laney> like last time
<Laney> brb
<ochosi> Laney: not yet, but i can create one if needed/wanted
<Laney> ochosi: would be easier if you can
<ochosi> ok, will try to push that asap and ping you again once it's done
<Laney> ty
<ochosi> Laney: this is the branch, shall i update the bugreport as well? lp:~ochosi/xubuntu-default-settings/trusty_updates
<Laney> ochosi: you can 'link a related branch' on the bug
<ochosi> Laney: ok, done
<Laney> ty, looking in a second
<ochosi> let me know if there's more, i'm around
<Laney> ochosi: done
<Laney> now it'll wait in the unapproved queue for the release team
<ochosi> thanks a lot Laney
<ochosi> i really hope we don't have to bother you guys with this anymore next cycle...
<ochosi> (or: i expect...)
<Laney> yeah, hope so
<Laney> In the meantime I don't mind helping out with uploads where possible
<ochosi> thanks
<ochosi> we have quite a few things in the sponsors queue, as you might've noticed
<ochosi> i also hope Logan_ will help on this
<Laney> I did some sponsoring earlier
<Laney> arges is piloting in #ubuntu-devel if you want to ask for some stuff to be looked at
<Laney> if anything's particularly urgent
<ochosi> ok, thanks
<ochosi> yeah, we have a few things that are security related
#ubuntu-motu 2014-04-08
<dholbach> good morning
<Laney> ochosi: who writes light-locker for you guys? :-)
<Laney> Just looking at your diff & I think life would be easier if you used GDesktopAppInfo and GSettings from glib instead of manually parsing the desktop file and finding its Exec= line
<ochosi> Laney: i'm one of the two maintainers/authors of light-locker
<Laney> Well, saw it go by in the queue and noticed that
<ochosi> we considered introducing some sort of configuration storage, it's still on the roadmap
<Laney> Reading the options out of the exec line doesn't seem like the easiest way to do it
<Laney> gsettings isn't too bad to use, I recommend it
<ochosi> for the moment, the desktop file is the best available workaround for us
<Laney> GDesktopAppInfo has built in support for finding the user's copy if it exists btw, that's why I recommend that
<ochosi> yeah, it's mostly a question of picking up dependencies along the way and providing light-locker for as many distros as possible
<ochosi> but i guess we can pick up the same depends as lightdm
<Laney> both standard functionality
<ochosi> mhm, i'll discuss it with cavalier once we've fixed that strange issue with suspending
<Laney> shouldn't introduce any depends outside of glib
<ochosi> mhm, sounds good
<Laney> and gobject-introspection since you're python
<ochosi> yeah, actually that python app was written very quickly
<ochosi> at first there was no plan to provide a separate configuration dialog for light-locker
<ochosi> we wanted to integrate that in xfce4-power-manager
<ochosi> but then the small python app seemed like the best fallback plan for 14.04
<Laney> nod
<ochosi> it's funny how both unity and xubuntu took a (slightly risky) leap to a new locker in 14.04
<ochosi> (i have to admit, i would've loved it to be light-locker, cause then we'd have some common bugfixing)
<Laney> yeah, people realised that 1995-style lock screens aren't cool any more
<ochosi> :)
<ochosi> i'm pretty sure in a few years they will be cool again
<ochosi> then we'll have to port xscreensavers various crazy animations to our lockscreens :p
<Laney> true, I do miss floating teapots
<ochosi> huhu
<ochosi> yeah, that was a nice one
<ochosi> gah, i *already* feel nostalgic about that â not a good sign
<sergio-br2> hey hello
<Noskcaj> hey sergio-br2
<sergio-br2> hey Noskcaj, fine?
<Noskcaj> Yeah, pretty good. How are you?
<sergio-br2> yeah, fine too. I have a doubt, would you help me?
<Noskcaj> sure
<sergio-br2> i'm trying to put VBA-M (you know?) in the repos, it is licensed in gplv2. So, what is the best to do? Try in debian or motu?
<sergio-br2> trying to fix bug #378561
<ubottu> bug 378561 in Ubuntu "[needs-packaging] vbam" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/378561
#ubuntu-motu 2014-04-09
<dholbach> good morning
#ubuntu-motu 2014-04-10
<dholbach> good morning
<Laney> hey motu!
<Unit193> Howdy.
 * iulian waves.
<Laney> anyone perused the rcbugs page yet?
<Noskcaj> Laney, I've been scanning it occasionally. haskell probably needs looking at, and i though we were going to sync pycangjie anyway
<zequence> Any core-dev around, that could lend us some upload rights? Bug 1291675
<ubottu> bug 1291675 in lmms (Ubuntu) "[FFe] LMMS 1.0.0" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1291675
<zequence> This package has some major improvements to the released one. Has been tested and is pretty much ready to go.
<bregma> hey experts, I have a source package that produces two binary debs, and I no longer want to produce the second deb or have it in the archive... is uploading a new source package enough or do I need an archive admin to actually remove the unloved binary deb?
<jtaylor> uploading a new source is enough
<jtaylor> but you may need a transitional package if others depend on it
#ubuntu-motu 2014-04-11
<jtaylor> mh are packages in universe auto accepted?
<jtaylor> or just very fast release team?
<ScottK> jtaylor: Auto acceted if they are unseeded.
#ubuntu-motu 2014-04-12
<ScottK> Logan_ or jtaylor: Would one of you have time to look at uploading for [Bug 1291675
<ubottu> bug 1291675 in lmms (Ubuntu) "[FFe] LMMS 1.0.0" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1291675
<jtaylor> if I get a freeze exception for lz4 ;)
<jtaylor> I want the pytables bugfix update that unfortunatelyneeds a newer lz4 with a new soversion
<jtaylor> though pytables is its only rdepend
<ScottK> jtaylor: Where's the bug report?
<jtaylor> didn't file one yet
<ScottK> File it and I'll be glad to look.
<jtaylor> my motivation is somewhat vague
<jtaylor> I think the main bug pytables fixes does not affect most of our arches
<jtaylor> but a newer lz4 might be worthwhile on its own for trusty
<ScottK> OK.  Feel free to ping me if you decide it's worth doing the paperwork.
<jtaylor> ScottK: lmms is a bit confusing
<jtaylor> upstream is git but package is based on bzr
<jtaylor> but the orig tar does match a certain git commit, so its probably fine
<jtaylor> I can upload though I have to assume it was tested by others
<ScottK> The bug indicates it was.
<jtaylor> yes
<ScottK> So if you're comfortable with the packaging bits, go for it.
<jtaylor> seems resonable
<jtaylor> copyright looks outdated
<jtaylor> still one i386 test build and up it goes
<ScottK> Please file a bug about the copyright.
<jtaylor> mh
<jtaylor> the package may not build on non x86
<jtaylor> but only one way to find out
<ScottK> Hmm.  It was in some PPA.  I'd have imagined that would be noticed.
<jtaylor> ppas don't build ppc arm etc
<ScottK> Oh.
<ScottK> Right.
<ScottK> You said x86 and that translated in my head to 386.
<ScottK> We'll see shortly, accepted.
<jtaylor> I tested i386 and amd64
<jtaylor> that works
<jtaylor> but the gcc-multilib [amd64] build dep makes me wonder what happens on other arches
<ScottK> jtaylor: So far built on more archs than the last one did.
#ubuntu-motu 2014-04-13
<basd82> Hi i hope in the correct channel now, are there any ubuntu sponsors online ?
<ari-tczew> basd82: yes
<basd82> I have question about syncrequest https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/burp/+bug/1303307
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1303307 in burp (Ubuntu) "Sync burp 1.3.48-3 (universe) from Debian sid (main)" [Undecided,Won't fix]
<ari-tczew> everyone on this channel is online, just can to be afk :)
<basd82> I have made the request fix to debian packages
<basd82> and version 1.3.48-4 was uploaded to fix this
<basd82> do i need to file a new sync request
<ari-tczew> basd82: what gives something special in -4 release, that should be uploaded yet in trusty?
<basd82> I prefer to have the LTS in trusty
<ari-tczew> if your latest upload contents only current Ubuntu delta, there is no point to syncing this time. it'll be done in the next development cycle
<basd82> in 1.3.48-3 contains a broken init script
<basd82> big show stopper
<ari-tczew> basd82: trusty got already https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/burp/1.3.48-3ubuntu1
<ari-tczew> it has been merged
<basd82> Oke didnt know that
<ari-tczew> no problem
<basd82> becouse of the syncrequest i was in idea that 1.3.48-3 wasnt sync
<basd82> But request of the sponsor team was to change debian/rules to include autotools-dev
<basd82> so a delta isnt needed any more
<basd82> does there need to happen someting special for that ?
<ari-tczew> basd82: that's right, but we cannot upload -4 in this cycle, no reason to do it
<basd82> understand that
<basd82> But does this mean i dont have take any action to get the delta removed, this hapens automaticly ?
<ari-tczew> in practice, there is no different between -3ubuntu1 and -4
<basd82> Correct
<ari-tczew> basd82: you can reopen your closed request or open a new sync request, but please subscribe ubuntu-sponsors when new devel cycle is open
<basd82> just i want to streamline te proces, thats why i am asling
<basd82> oke wil do new sync request
<ari-tczew> it won't get synced automatically until we got *ubuntuX upload in the archive
<jtaylor> ScottK: filed an ffe for lz4, bug 1307220
<ubottu> bug 1307220 in lz4 (Ubuntu) "FFe: sync lz4 r114 from debian unstable" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1307220
#ubuntu-motu 2015-04-06
<elky> (unauthorised logging bot)
#ubuntu-motu 2015-04-08
<dholbach> good morning
<Laney> hullo
<geser> hello
<iulian> Morning.
#ubuntu-motu 2015-04-09
<dholbach> good morning
#ubuntu-motu 2015-04-10
<Rhonda> Alright.  The five uploads for wesnoth to Debian are down, now I need 10 more for Ubuntu where two should be taken of automaticly.  *groans*
<Rhonda> How regular are packages from Debian autosynced currently?  And are they taken from unstable or from testing for vivid?
<Laney> Autosyncs are off, we're in freeze
<Rhonda> oh
<Rhonda> Oh wait. It's april.
<Rhonda> I have a security update for wesnoth, both 1.10 and 1.12 are affected.  Is it possible to get that still in or shall we do that after vivid release?
<Laney> Totally still possible, we're just in feature freeze
<Rhonda> Thing is, given that backports to older releases depend on the update in vivid, it would delay the fix for the other releases too as I understand it, right?
<Rhonda> Alright. :)
<Rhonda> So, requestsync is my friend here I guess.  What options do you suggest?  :)
<rbasak> For a security fix, the usual SRU procedure doesn't apply - the security team will sponsor the fix for you into the security pocket for stable releases.
<Laney> Just sync as usual it if you don't need an exception
<Laney> Then for the stable releases you can follow the security update procedure as rbasak says
<Rhonda> As a motu I don't think I need an exception, do I?
<Laney> Only if the upload is not pure bugfix
<Rhonda> For wesnoth-1.10 it is, for wesnoth-1.12 it's new upstream stable release, which is mostly bugfix but also includes translation updates.
<Laney> Oh yeah, those are fine too
<Laney> I consider those bugfix as far as the freeze is concerned
<Laney> (for default packages there are langpack and documentation considerations but those don't apply here)
<Rhonda> It's a stable release update and they have tightly defined rules for those, all 1.12 series clients must be compatible with each other.
<Rhonda> Please enter password for encrypted keyring:
<Rhonda> Oo
<Rhonda> What keyring is this talking about?
<Rhonda> I don't find anything in the documentation about that â¦
<Laney> launchpadlib ends up using python-keyring - you'll probably have set it up when you first used it
<Rhonda> I won't use this system anymore within two months, so I won't debug what's going wrong.  On a different system it didn't ask me for any password, did the sync from there. :)
#ubuntu-motu 2015-04-11
<mitya57> Rhonda: python-keyring has multiple backends, and it uses some unpredictable magic to decide which one to use. You probably ended up with having a text file based keyring backend.
<mitya57> On GNOME/Unity it should use gnome-keyring based backend you have python-secretstorage installed.
<mitya57> s/you have/if you have/
<Laney> I sort of remember configuring that
<Laney> once upon a time
<Rhonda> Whom do I have to subscribe to a bug if a package should get removed from vivid?
<Rhonda> I guess ubuntu-archive is the proper way?
<Rhonda> Or rather, shall I assign it to them instead of only subscribing?
<mitya57> Rhonda: ubuntu-archive is the right team, just subscribe them
#ubuntu-motu 2015-04-12
<Unit193> micahg: Howdy.  Sorry to poke again, but I got poked by xiphos upstream again.  Everything still looking good?  Going to hit soon?
<micahg> Unit193: yeah, should be done by end of weekend
<Unit193> Great, thanks!
<micahg> thanks for the reminder
<Unit193> Of course, thanks for checking into it.  Should I set it to some other status, the merge proposal?
<micahg> no, I think it's ok
<Rhonda> What's the version schema for a SRU?
<Rhonda> Hmm, reading the SRU wiki page is the test case really required?  The upstream wesnoth bugreport is still set to private and I'm not sure if I feel comfortable to copy the data from there â¦
#ubuntu-motu 2016-04-12
<karstensrage> micahg, any chance we can work on my backports ?
#ubuntu-motu 2016-04-14
<karstensrage> hey micahg just bugging you again
<karstensrage> not sure how much to do that
<karstensrage> where are backports generally pulled from?
<karstensrage> is that debian unstable like the latest LTS or is it somewhere else?
<ogra_> karstensrage: the newer ubuntu version
<highvoltage> h01ger: /win 9
<highvoltage> (derp)
<karstensrage> ah ok, that makes sense
#ubuntu-motu 2017-04-13
<Scars> Hi, is this a place where I can ask about getting started with the ubuntu distributed development?
<rbasak> o/
<rbasak> bzr-based UDD is dead
<rbasak> The server team (my team) has been working on a git-based replacement.
<rbasak> We hang out in #ubuntu-devel or #ubuntu-server.
<Scars> ok thx
* Unit193 changed the topic of #ubuntu-motu to: Zesty released! | Want to get involved with the MOTU? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing | Sponsor queue: http://bit.ly/fz6AyQ | http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/ftbfs | http://people.canonical.com/~ubuntu-archive/nbs.html | http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/bugs/rcbugs
#ubuntu-motu 2017-04-14
<tsimonq2> Unit193: I didn't know MOTU was plural?
#ubuntu-motu 2017-04-16
<Unit193> mapreri: You generally like cool scripts/etc, ever looked at arch-install-scripts? :3  (https://git.archlinux.org/arch-install-scripts.git)
<mapreri> Unit193: should I notice something in particular, except the usage of some non-common things like `shopt -s extglob` and a severe lack of quotes around some variables? :)
<chatter29> hey guys
<chatter29> allah is doing
<chatter29> sun is not doing allah is doing
<chatter29> to accept Islam say that i bear witness that there is no deity worthy of worship except Allah and Muhammad peace be upon him is his slave and messenger
<Unit193> mapreri: More that they seem pretty handy, and if you patch some policy.d into arch-chroot, even better!
<Unit193> But, ah well.
<sergio-br2> hi
<sergio-br2> I'd like to know who uploaded the last changes on libretro-beetle-pce-fast and libretro-gambatte in the ubuntu repo
<sergio-br2> Maintainer: Ubuntu Developers <ubuntu-devel-discuss@lists.ubuntu.com>
<tsimonq2> sergio-br2: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/PACKAGENAME/+changelog
<sergio-br2> I already take a look at changelog,
<tsimonq2> sergio-br2: In this case, jbicha
<tsimonq2> Well, do you know how to find the uploader from the changelog? ;)
<sergio-br2> but not always the guy that did the changes is the same who allow upload
<sergio-br2> nevermind, thanks
<tsimonq2> sergio-br2: It says that on that page...
<tsimonq2> sergio-br2: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libretro-beetle-pce-fast/0.9.38.7+git20160609-1ubuntu1
<tsimonq2> Upload details
<tsimonq2> Uploaded by:
<tsimonq2>     Jeremy Bicha on 2017-04-09
<sergio-br2> humm, right, if I click in the first link
<sergio-br2> thanks
<sergio-br2> so it was the same guy
<tsimonq2> Mhhhhm.
<tsimonq2> sergio-br2: Just to show you what a sponsored upload looks like, here: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/vc/1.3.0-0ubuntu1
<tsimonq2> sergio-br2: I did the work on that package, but Mattia uploaded it.
<sergio-br2> right
<sergio-br2> thanks
<tsimonq2> sergio-br2: Anytime. :)
#ubuntu-motu 2018-04-09
<tsimonq2> handsome_feng: Hi there!
 * tsimonq2 sponsors some stuff for Ubuntu Kylin
<handsome_feng> tsimonq2: hi
<tsimonq2> handsome_feng: While I have you here, I just wanted to make sure you saw https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-release/2018-April/004387.html :)
<handsome_feng> tsimonq2: Yes, I saw it, and I agree with your idea, you can add ubuntukylin to the list of 'Xubuntu, Ubuntu MATE, Kubuntu, and Ubuntu Budgie'
<tsimonq2> handsome_feng: Please respond (preferably signed with your GPG key) that you agree. :)
<dodobrain> hi all, can someone tell me how libavl is being packaged? https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libavl  says "GNU libavl is a library in ...."
<dodobrain> that is NOT the GNU libavl that is being packaged
<tsimonq2> dodobrain: looking
<dodobrain> i think the upstream debian package is also wrong
<handsome_feng> tsimonq2: sure, I will
<dodobrain> this is GNU libavl here: http://adtinfo.org/
<tsimonq2> dodobrain: I see "AVL tree manipulation library"
<tsimonq2> I see "GNU" nowhere.
<tsimonq2> handsome_feng: Awesome. :)
<dodobrain> tsimonq2, so you dont see "GNU libavl" on this page? https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libavl  i can post a screenshot if it helps
<tsimonq2> dodobrain: Throw me a screenshot and I can throw you one too. ;)
<tsimonq2> handsome_feng: So this isn't a showstopper, but it's something that would be nice to look into for ukui-panel.
<tsimonq2> I: libukui-panel-applet-4-1: no-symbols-control-file usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libukui-panel-applet-4.so.1.0.1
<tsimonq2> Also:
<tsimonq2> P: ukui-panel source: debian-watch-does-not-check-gpg-signature
<tsimonq2> That last one can be solved by signing your upstream tarball.
<tsimonq2> Otherwise, looks good, so sponsoring.
<dodobrain> tsimonq2, im sure you will send me a screenshot too, im just saying that on the launchpad page it says GNU libavl and this is *not* the GNU libavl
<handsome_feng> tsimonq2: OK, I will fix it in next version
<tsimonq2> dodobrain: And I'm telling you I see "GNU" nowhere. ;)
<tsimonq2> Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhh.
<tsimonq2> I get what you're going at now.
<tsimonq2> So, that has nothing to do with the package itself.
<tsimonq2> dodobrain: In any case, I don't see how that's a problem. ;)
<tsimonq2> handsome_feng: Excellent!
<dodobrain> you dont see the problem? it is because the GNU libavl api is completely different from this thing that is being packaged
<dodobrain> tsimonq2, https://i.imgur.com/lOCL9k1.png
<dodobrain> i tried the debian channel, but it seems very quiet with almost no chatter
<tsimonq2> Clicked a button.
<tsimonq2> Fixed?
<dodobrain> tsimonq2, also, that http://changelogs.ubuntu.com/changelogs/pool/universe/liba/libavl/libavl_0.3.5-4/copyright says:  downloaded from http://www.fruit.eu.org/avl/
<dodobrain> that server itself does not exist anymore
<tsimonq2> dodobrain: Report that one to Debian.
<Unit193> You asked the Debian support channel, that focuses on Debian stable.  Likely not quite the right place.
<tsimonq2> Oh.
<dodobrain> Unit193, yes i wasnt sure. i did ask in the main channel if this is the right spot
<dodobrain> i know about ubuntu-motu, hence why i didnt ask in #ubuntu first :)
<tsimonq2> dodobrain: #ubuntu-devel is more frequented.
<dodobrain> sure, but in the long past i've found motu to be more packaging specific
<dodobrain> maybe that has changed
<tsimonq2> It has, I think.
<tsimonq2> handsome_feng: One more thing, Debian Policy 4.1.4 has been released. Please update your packages whenever convenient. :)
<handsome_feng> tsimonq2: I will, Thanks!
<dodobrain> tsimonq2, so what do i do now? you did something and now the launchpad page asks me to select the properupstream and the libavl linked there is the correct gnu libavl
<dodobrain> do i need to do something now?
<tsimonq2> dodobrain: It should be fine now.
<tsimonq2> handsome_feng: OK :)
<dodobrain> tsimonq2, when you say 'it should be fine now' do you mean the real gnu libavl will get packaged by ubuntu?
<tsimonq2> dodobrain: Yes.
<dodobrain> goodness, thank you very much
<dodobrain> i imagine there will not be corrected libavl package in backports
<dodobrain> given that someone might have depended on it in their own development
<dodobrain> or actually, im not sure how to check, but can you verify if any other ubuntu package depends on libavl1 or libavl-dev ?
<Unit193> 'fair' seems to.
<Unit193> Though in fairness, it doesn't seem to actually use it. :>
<Unit193> (Looking at the wrong package, it links against it and configure bails without: https://sources.debian.org/src/fair/0.5.3-2/configure.ac/#L18)
<tsimonq2> handsome_feng: Thanks for the email. :)
<handsome_feng> tsimonq2: Not at all :)
<tsimonq2> handsome_feng: This as well:
<tsimonq2> I: libukwm-1-0: no-symbols-control-file usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libukwm-1.so.0.0.0
<tsimonq2> You also might want to look into fixing hardening-no-bindnow in all of your packages.
<handsome_feng> tsimonq2:  Ok, I will fix all these in next version, thanks for uploading them! :)
<tsimonq2> handsome_feng: No problem. :)
<kkremitzki> The FreeCAD project, which I work with, has finally released version 0.17 after being in feature freeze since January--is there any hope still for it to make it into 18.04?
<ogra_> kkremitzki, there is a snap package of 0.17 (see "snap info freecad") perhaps that should be updated instead (contact the publisher shown in the snap info output)
<kkremitzki> ogra_: That user is on hiatus and I've had a hard time getting ahold of him, if it's at all possible I'd like to try to make it available in the repositories as well. I've been working on packaging from the Debian end of things so I'd feel more comfortable taking care of it that way
<ogra_> kkremitzki, sure, not opposing a deb but with the deb you are pretty much stuck on a version (or have to use a complex process to get it updated) ... the snap runs independently from the underlying OS version from 14.04 to 18.04 and can be updated whenever needed
<rbasak> kkremitzki: to answer your question, upding the deb repository is possible. Assuming it's only bugfixes, it needs someone to contribute the change and an uploader to review it in time. If it contains feature changes, it needs consideration and approval by the release team in time as well.
<kkremitzki> I'm interested in making it available via snap as well, but from patrolling our help forum I know a lot of people default to installing with apt and having the package trailing a version often results in unnecessary frustration from users. It does contain feature changes, over 6000 commits' worth (woohoo!)
<rbasak> 3000 commits of feature changes since 0.16.6712+dfsg1-1ubuntu2? It seems unlikely that will be permitted to land in Bionic then.
<kkremitzki> Well, I wouldn't say 1 commit = 1 feature, but there are a lot of new features
<kkremitzki> It was a little over 2 years of development
<kkremitzki> We also have a daily build PPA which has quite a bit of use so those changes haven't been getting worked on without testing
<rbasak> You'll need to explain that to the release team.
<rbasak> But in any case, you need someone to prepare the updated packaging.
<rbasak> If you aren't likely to get that in time, there's no point taking it further.
<kkremitzki> I can do that
<rbasak> See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FeatureFreeze and https://wiki.ubuntu.com/FreezeExceptionProcess
<kkremitzki> How would I submit it?
<rbasak> Once you have approval, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SponsorshipProcess
<rbasak> I warn you though: sponsors tend to be quite busy at this time of an LTS cycle.
<rbasak> You're already very late, so you may struggle to find the required review time from a sponsor.
<kkremitzki> Indeed, I'm sure it's especially tight with meltdown/spectre having eaten into other work
<kkremitzki> I think it's worth a shot though, so thank you for the guidance
#ubuntu-motu 2018-04-13
<handsome_feng> tsimonq2: Hi, could you help upload the kylin-video? LP: #1738680
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1738680 in Ubuntu Kylin "[FFe] kylin-video" [Critical,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1738680
<tsimonq2> handsome_feng: Done.
<handsome_feng> tsimonq2: Thanks!
<tsimonq2> handsome_feng: No problem, have a good day. :)
<handsome_feng> tsimonq2: Thanks, you too! :)
#ubuntu-motu 2019-04-09
<Thomas_Kostas> Hello, I'm and absolute beginner in terms on participating to Ubuntu packaging so I thought here can be a good starting point as advised by the wiki. I recently modified the  Rpi-distro package "pi-bluetooth" in order to make bluetooth work more easily on raspberry pi 3 b + using Ubuntu 18.04.2 (4.15.0-1033). The modified package branch can be found on this branch: https://github.com/ascentai/pi-bluetooth/tree/experiment?files=1
#ubuntu-motu 2019-04-10
<Unit193> Logan: Have you had any contact with Noskcaj anytime remotely recently? :3
#ubuntu-motu 2019-04-11
<tkostas> I would like to submit my first package, can Anyone help me a bit ? I read on wiki a good way to start was to discuss on this IRC :)
<tkostas> Package can be found here: https://github.com/ascentai/pi-bluetooth
<teward> any MOTU willing to assist me with sponsoring iptables-persistent uploads for https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/iptables-persistent/+bug/1820144 for the SRU team to review?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1820144 in iptables-persistent (Ubuntu Cosmic) "iptables-persistent fails in containers due to modprobe being unavailable even though module could've been loaded outside of the container" [Medium,Confirmed]
<tsimonq2> teward: I can in a few hours if nobody else does.
<teward> tsimonq2: ack.  it's a native format package if it makes any difference
<teward> i'll prod the SRU team once it's uploaded to the unapproved queues :P
<tsimonq2> ok
#ubuntu-motu 2019-04-12
<tkostas> I would like to submit my first package, can Anyone help me a bit ? I read
<tkostas>                  on wiki a good way to start was to discuss on this IRC :)
<tkostas> Package can be found here: https://github.com/ascentai/pi-bluetooth
<tkostas> Anyone willing to give me advices ?
<rbasak> tkostas: how have you changed the package from upstream? Have you read https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/NewPackages? Have you spoken to upstream at all?
#ubuntu-motu 2020-04-07
<handsome_feng> RikMills: Hi,  would you mind syncing ukui-sidebar(1.1.2-1) from Debian and uploading the qt5-ukui-platformtheme(1.0.3-0ubuntu1) from my ppa: https://launchpad.net/~feng-kylin/+archive/ubuntu/ukui-debian for me when you have time?  There are all bugfix-only, :)
<RikMills> sync done
<handsome_feng> Thanks a lot! \o/
<RikMills> handsome_feng: np. both done
<handsome_feng> RikMills: â â»
