#ubuntu-us-ca 2011-06-20
 * pleia2 waves
<Skullz> Allo :)
<pleia2> almost meeting time :)
<Skullz> Yep :D
<DarkwingDuck> Aye it is
 * Skullz looks around
<philipballew> 7:00
 * pleia2 IRCs from new desk!
<pleia2> ok, let's get this rolling
 * Shakata|Home waves
<pleia2> agenda: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CaliforniaTeam/Meetings/11June19
<pleia2> looks like grantbow isn't here for the first item, we'll come back to it if he arrives
<pleia2> [TOPIC] Discuss changing the launchpad team from moderated to open.
<pleia2> DarkwingDuck: all yours!
<rww> o/
<DarkwingDuck> Okay, as it stands at the moment we have a policy for jioning the LP team.
<DarkwingDuck> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CaliforniaTeam/LaunchpadMembership
<DarkwingDuck> I'm trying to understand why we have closed membership for our team
<DarkwingDuck> I would propose that we open our LP team
<DarkwingDuck> IMO Having a closed team sends the wrong message.
<rww> DarkwingDuck: Did you read the log from the meeting at which that was implemented? iirc, we went through the reasons for it there.
<pleia2> currently we ask that people applying get in touch with the team somehow, while this was a nice idea when it was proposed, in reality no one does it
<pleia2> so even if we had great reasons for it, the process as it stands now doesn't work
<DarkwingDuck> rww: You have a link to those logs by any chance?
<philipballew> i never got in touch. i was just accepted a hour later. so pleia2 is correct that it isn't implemented
<rww> DarkwingDuck: I'm looking. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CaliforniaTeam/Meetings/10June27 seems to be one of them, and I imagine the meetings around it probably have some discussion.
<pleia2> philipballew: I knew you :)
<rww> Data point: there are 37 pending memberships in the LP team right now.
<pleia2> philipballew: if I didn't know you I wouldn't have approved you, our approval queue is huge
<pleia2> yeah, 37 :(
<akk> We definitely don't want people applying and sitting in the queue. That's bad.
<pleia2> akk: *nod*
<DarkwingDuck> I'm just pointing out that it sends the wrong signals and messages. Not ones that I would assume that a friendly open group woudl like to send.
<philipballew> i never got in touch just to get accepted. 37... because were so popular!
<DarkwingDuck> Does anyone have objections to an Open team?
<pleia2> so I think we need to either: 1: open the team; 2: empower our admins to add people based on believing they are a human (this is what we did for pennsylvania) or 3: come up with a solution to make our process we have now work somehow
<rww> In my opinion, this is tied to what the LP team is actually used for. aiui, that's 1) determining who can vote in leadership elections, 2) determining who has access to write to the team bzr repository. I don't think that having both of these be unrestricted is a particularly good idea.
<akk> I remember those discussions of why people should have to renew (in the log rww referenced) -- but that doesn't answer why they should have to wait in a queue to join in the first place.
<pleia2> 3) adding things to the loco directory
<philipballew> i have wanted to be able to sign people up to the group at Ubuntu hours before. but didn't want the people to have to wait. it was just a though to implement if sd hour gets big.
<philipballew> it would help us grow possibly
<pleia2> rww: I've never really seen it abused in other teams
<pleia2> (and bzr has reverts! and a bunch of us keep an eye on loco directory)
<rww> pleia2: Neither have I, though the only other team I have experience with that's open is UW.
<akk> I can't imagine people joining our LP team in order to game our voting".
<pleia2> rww: honestly I think UW is the one where it would be most likely to be abused - of all the community teams in ubuntu
<rww> and all in all, people who don't put in enough effort to satisfy the membership criteria are unlikely to vote anyway
<akk> yeah, UW is much more of a target.
<pleia2> rww: there are active members who didn't follow the procedure, I like and respect these people now that I know them but even they didn't read the directions
<DarkwingDuck> So, does anyone have any issues with opening the team at all?
<aaditya> o/
<DarkwingDuck> yes aaditya?
<pleia2> so I don't really see it as "not putting in enough effort"
<rww> I think it's a little odd to propose and implement opening it without looking into why it was closed in the first place. Other than that, I'm pretty much apathetic either way.
<pleia2> people just don't expect it, so they don't look for joining rules on loco teams
<aaditya> I don't have any issues. Also, Hi!
<jbermudes> Is there a way to set permissions on LP so that people can join but aren't automatically granted those certain rights?
<DarkwingDuck> Ahhh, Hi :)
<pleia2> jbermudes: no
<pleia2> launchpad is not particularly flexible (you'll see this reflected in some teams having a half dozen launchpad teams to handle permissions, it's awful)
<akk> rww: Do we know why it was closed? That log you pasted is about requiring renewals, not about joining (unless I've missed something).
<rww> akk: I don't know, I only read the agenda right before the meeting started.
<akk> Seems like if nobody can come up with a good reason for it, that's a good argument for opening it.
<pleia2> if I recall correctly part of it was not having a launchpad team full of unactive people, and getting some kind of introduction so that new members could be contacted when there were events in their area
<pleia2> and weeding out spam bots
<pleia2> the wiki page DarkwingDuck linked says "To give us a chance to get to know you (and to weed out spam bots), we ask that you get in touch before we approve your join request."
<akk> Do we have introductions now, or any record of who lives where?
<jbermudes> Right, that was also the reasoning behind the renewal was to have some sort of way to keep a somewhat active roster
<akk> I know it's taken me a long time to figure out which IRC nicks are northern vs. souther.
<akk> n
<aaditya> Do we reach more people through the mailing list by allowing unactive and lazy people on the LP team?
<pleia2> all that's actually required is that they make some kind of contact somehow, even if it's just "hi"
<pleia2> we don't track where people are formally, and don't require them telling us
<pleia2> aaditya: the mailing list is completely unrelated to LP
<rww> Do you need to be in ~ubuntu-california to RSVP to LoCo Directory events? Something philipballew said earlier seems to imply you do, and I think that's relevant.
<rww> (as a reason to make it open, that is)
<pleia2> rww: nope
<rww> hrm
<pleia2> since people often go to other people's loco events when they're in town
<rww> because the other side of the coin is "what are we losing by keeping it restricted?"
<pleia2> in general trying to join a team and being stuck in a queue for months is demotivating
<akk> We're probably losing members who try to join, and get frustrated at waiting.
<rww> being in the LP team isn't a requirement for doing LoCo stuff, though :|
<DarkwingDuck> And just the appearence of having a restricted LP team.
<akk> Even if they eventually get approved, that probably makes them figure the team is pretty dead and not worth caring about.
<aaditya> Can we improve this process by not making them wait for that long?
<pleia2> and when people see so many people waiting they get the impression that it's closed, some people have told me in person they didn't apply because they assumed the admins were dead and not approving anyone
<jbermudes> So isn't that an issue with the people approving as opposed to a problem with the idea of approval?
<philipballew> does it have to be pleia2 who approves or can we off load to others?
<akk> Making them not wait that long sounds like it requires volunteers.
<rww> One thing I think we used to do is reject applications after some amount of times with an explanation of how the team works. I assume that doesn't happen now?
<eps> (1) Whatever we decide should be documented (and dated?) (2) This issue seems bigger than us ... is there a "best practices" we should be referring to?
<akk> It's easy to say "those dang people not doing their job! why don't <<they>> approve people faster?"
<rww> (which would prod people into actually doing it properly, and get rid of that "oh noes, 37 people are waiting, the team must be dead" thing)
<pleia2> philipballew: everyone in the leadership team does, we can add more, but that's not the bottleneck
<jbermudes> pleia2: then what's the bottleneck?
<pleia2> our policy
<rww> the bottleneck is that people who hit the join button aren't reading the "*** IMPORTANT NOTE:" and contacting an admin, aiui
<pleia2> we require people to introduce themselves somehow, if they don't we can't add them
<akk> They have to apply, then also send an email somewhere?
<aaditya> If they fail to provide enough info or otherwise prove that they're human, we could reject the membership and tell them to retry with relevant info.
<jbermudes> couldn't we do it via IRC? they have to come into the channel, say hi, and then Eureka can add them?
<rww> "Some ways of doing this are using our mailing list or IRC channel, coming to an event or meeting, or contacting one of our group administrators privately."
<rww> so yes, IRC works fine.
<pleia2> things I count as introducing: joining IRC with a name that's obviously tied to LP, emailing the list, coming to an event
<aaditya> However, the question boils down to: Should we require introductions?
<pleia2> but I have to know they are the same person joining, and sometimes I don't know
<pleia2> every time someone joins I search my IRC logs and mail for them
<philipballew> not all new people do irc
<pleia2> if I find them I add them, if not they stay in the queue
<rww> philipballew: which is why we wrote several options when making the policy
<philipballew> i did forms and still do mostly
<jbermudes> if it's an issue of not knowing that the queue is getting long, we could make Eureka alert us just like it does that the wiki has changed
<akk> It feels like setting up hoops to jump through, like the SRU or patch submittal processes.
<pleia2> so even with me searching email and trying to track down activity from these people... we have 37 in the queue
<akk> "Mwa ha ha, you may have done this step, but you missed that you also need THIS step! Denied!"
<pleia2> the process doesn't work
<rww> akk: right, and the question is whether the hoops are necessary given the benefits you get from joining the LP team (which boils down to voting rights)
<pleia2> I approve maybe 10% of people joining, and that's usually due to my effort in trying to see if they've been active
<akk> And if they're on IRC but their nick is different from LP, you probably wouldn't see them.
<aaditya> akk: imho, it works if we also make it clear that they can apply again immediately and need to provide XYZ.
<pleia2> akk: *nod*
<akk> (unless you're going to extraordinary effort)
<DarkwingDuck> But shouldn't anyone be able to vote?
<rww> pleia2: If we switch the team from Restricted to Open, does the renewal preference go away, or is that still applied?
<DarkwingDuck> it's not like this is Ubuntu Membership
<pleia2> rww: I'd say it's still applied
<pleia2> we have expiration for a different reason which I think is fine
<sn9> akk: irc nicks are listed on one's lp page, even if the lp name is different
<rww> pleia2: I meant technically, but yeah :)
<pleia2> rww: oh no, you can still set expirations on open teams :)
<rww> pleia2: yay
<akk> aaditya: Sort of, but it's demoralizing to keep having to reapply. That's why i've had patches sit in bugs for years ... I get tired of "no, submit it this way." "Okay, now we have that, but we also need this other format."
<akk> aaditya: After a while you decide it's not worth it.
<aaditya> DarkwingDuck: that'll be an issue if someone brings their 20 inactive friends, e.g., to vote in their favor.
<pleia2> even the ubuntu-women team hasn't had trouble with ballot stuffing
<akk> sn9: Assuming they listed their irc nick there, and the person on our end doesn't mind the extra step of looking for it.
<DarkwingDuck> I just didn't like the image a closed loco team sends.
<aaditya> akk: introduction isn't a big requirement. If they can't go through that much, maybe it's not worth it to them, which raises the question of whether or not we should let them in.
<sn9> akk: correct
<pleia2> aaditya: mostly it's just that people don't read the directions, there are active people in the team who didn't notice them until I pointed them out
<rww> I think opening the team and saying "Anyone who's been a member of the LP team for more than x days is eligible to vote in this election." may be a reasonable solution. x could equal 30.
<pleia2> I wouldn't put that against their character, humans are just lousy
<pleia2> rww: yeah, UW does that
<aaditya> pleia2: oh, fair enough.
<akk> aaditya: I don't mind groups where the Join page also has a section "tell us something about yourself." But if it's an extra step you have to notice, that's not so good.
<DarkwingDuck> That would assume that everyone has an LP account.
<aaditya> akk: agreed.
<DarkwingDuck> What about those who are on the ML but have no LP Account?
<philipballew> depends on what type of group we want to me.
<rww> DarkwingDuck: as I understand it, you currently need to have an LP account to vote in our elections currently. If you want to change that, that's a whole separate issue.
<aaditya> Can we limit voting to those who have been a member for, say, 6 months?
<rww> s/currently //
<rww> aaditya: yes
<pleia2> rww: yes, that's how it works now
<rww> well, yes it's technically possible. I think 6 months is too long.
<pleia2> I think 6 months is too long as well
<sn9> i find "humans are just lousy" to be more typing than "people suck"
<akk> I agree, 6 months is a long time.
<DarkwingDuck> 1-3 months is a better solution
<rww> yup ^
<aaditya> I would be inclined towards setting it to 3 months.
<akk> 3 months ++
<aaditya> (6 was just an example.)
<akk> (that's not "3 or more months", it's support for ==3 :)
<sn9> 6 months is one release cycle, to put it in perspective
<rww> How often are elections? I can't find the page I vaguely remember existing with these details :|
<DarkwingDuck> Yes.
<aaditya> Are 3 months enough for a new person to understand the team
<DarkwingDuck> 1 year?
<aaditya> ...team's general direction?
<DarkwingDuck> I believe?
<pleia2> 1 year
<DarkwingDuck> Last election was mid/end october 2010
<pleia2> should just be /Leadership
<pleia2> but the wiki is being horrible
<akk> I thought it was "whenever the team gets sufficiently annoyed with current leadership" :)
 * DarkwingDuck hates the wiki
<rww> oh, there it is. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CaliforniaTeam/Leadership
<DarkwingDuck> LOL
<DarkwingDuck> assuming no one steps down.
<rww> akk: If the last election is anything to go by, the next one might be as controversial as the recent DPL election ;P
<aaditya> I got an HTTP 50x error on the leadership page a moment ago, and it worked after rww posted it.
<aaditya> Wiki sucks.
<rww> aaditya: yeah, the wiki has issues
<pleia2> they upgraded it last week, it hasn't been a particularly graceful upgrade
<pleia2> hoping they'll fix it when they get back into work tomorrow ;)
<aaditya> (I easily mistook it for a 404 done incorrectly.)
<rww> Anyways. Any objections to opening the team up, keeping renewal policy as it is, and requiring that voters in elections have been in the LP team for 90 days* prior to the election announcement?
<DarkwingDuck> I have no issues with that rww
<rww> * I personally like 30 better, but everyone else likes 90 so whatever.
<pleia2> rww: sounds perfect
<aaditya> rww++
<sn9> 60 :P
<pleia2> (I like 30 better too)
<aaditya> (pleia2: before I forget, we didn't do newbie introductions at the beginning of this meeting.)
 * DarkwingDuck is in favor of 30
<DarkwingDuck> Bugger
<pleia2> aaditya: we're been trying to do announcements and intros at the end, but I suppose introductions at the beginning do make sense
<pleia2> so maybe we should just do announcements at the end ;)
<aaditya> That works too. I thought we skipped it.
<sn9> jdeslip: 30 or 90? what say you?
<DarkwingDuck> I don't think jack is here is he?
<pleia2> no, he's not
<sn9> just in case
<DarkwingDuck> I'm not going to die if people vote 90 instead of 30
<pleia2> ok, well we have a couple months until voting, do we want to table that portion and add it to a meeting item next meeting so people who care can vote then?
 * aaditya murmurs 90 from a corner.
<pleia2> just go with "open team and keep renewal policy"
<DarkwingDuck> Why not vote via ML?
<pleia2> DarkwingDuck: I've never really seen that work well, but we can try
<DarkwingDuck> :D
<eps> I oppose using the ML for this
<rww> you could do a CIVS poll of everyone eligible to vote currently... *runs off giggling*
<sn9> why not vote with that voting thing used for the first geeknic(s)?
<sn9> i mean, what rww said
<pleia2> rww: don't make me cry :'(
<DarkwingDuck> rww: We could make an LP poll....
 * DarkwingDuck hides
<aaditya> I personally easily overlook emails on the ML, so I'd say ML--. Also, how hard would it be to make a tool that uses launchpad API to validate voters and allows them to vote?
<sn9> lp poll would make sense
<pleia2> LP has polls, and would work for something this simple
 * aaditya starts to scribble something on a piece of paper.
<aaditya> LP polls +1
<pleia2> so let's set up a poll, have it expire after our next meeting so we can remind people at the next meeting to vote real quick before it ends
<pleia2> and we'll email it to the list
<rww> would be useful as a demonstration of whether LP polls do in fact work, at least ;P
<pleia2> rww: indeed!
<sn9> and civs for the actual votes
<pleia2> yeah, CIVS for elections is tricky (we need to get jono to pull some strings), but we should use it
<DarkwingDuck> CIVS isn't so bad... We used it for our Kubuntu Council elections.
<pleia2> ok, so I think we're agreed: opening the team up, keeping renewal policy as it is, setting up LP poll to see how long you have to be a member before you're eligable to vote in an election
<rww> DarkwingDuck: the major hurdle is getting email addresses of people with email addresses hidden on LP. but yeah, it's doable.
<rww> pleia2: +1
<sn9> pulling the strings should not be difficult, considering the need for civs is ultimately due to a decision from up above
<DarkwingDuck> rww: That's what Scott Kitterman was going on about.
<DarkwingDuck> pleia2: +1
<akk> +1
<pleia2> DarkwingDuck: you need everyone's email address, not everyone makes their email address public, so you need to get a list from LP admins (which is Wrong but possible if you're jono) or use up all your daily allowance of "emailing people on LP" to contact them and get their email addresses
<pleia2> this usually takes several days and the result of all this effort is a couple people replying with their email address to be added to the poll, some people yelling at you, and mostly people ignoring you
<rww> this is probably obvious, but I'll note it for posterity: I assume that while opening the LP team, everyone currently pending will be added?
<pleia2> rww: yes, thanks for mentioning it
<DarkwingDuck> IIRC yes
<eps> Not everyone has an @ubuntu.com address, and not everyone wants non-@ubuntu.com addresses made public
<pleia2> eps: yep
<pleia2> ok, shall we move on?
<DarkwingDuck> Yes.
<pleia2> [TOPIC] Review Approval Application and discuss goals
<pleia2> I have a lot of non-ubuntu things to say about the wiki today
 * DarkwingDuck snickers
<pleia2> I had intended to finish the events portion of https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CaliforniaTeam/ApprovalApplication2011
<pleia2> but with the wiki practically unusable, I couldn't
<pleia2> so we'll have to finish reviewing those later, but for now I wanted to bring up that we need to write up some goals
<pleia2> for reference, our goals last time around are on our Approval App from 2009: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CaliforniaTeam/ApprovalApplication
<DarkwingDuck> Internal Server Error
 * DarkwingDuck snickers again.
<pleia2> indeed
<DarkwingDuck> So we are looking at our goals for the next year?
<pleia2> I'd call "short term" in the next 6 months, and "long term" the next two years (when we go through reapproval again)
<DarkwingDuck> I would like to see what "Bigger Programs" our LoCo woudl like to get involved with.
<pleia2> we don't need to decide upon goals right now, but I at least wanted to get the discussion rolling
<pleia2> DarkwingDuck: such as?
<DarkwingDuck> Italy does Laptop Testing Team
<DarkwingDuck> There are programs that we, as a LoCo can get involved with.
<pleia2> ah, that's a good one
<rww> I'd like us to look into whether there are more conferences/conventions/whatever than SCaLE we could be going to. OSCON moving northwards made a gap in the calendar :|
<pleia2> I did some xubuntu testing at the last global jam, that went really well
<DarkwingDuck> Are there any confereces in NorCal?
<rww> and yeah, what DarkwingDuck said. QA stuff always needs people.
<rww> DarkwingDuck: I don't know ;P
<philipballew> none really DarkwingDuck
<akk> DarkwingDuck: Not really. :(
<philipballew> unless i'm wrong
<DarkwingDuck> So, SCaLE is our yearly conference.
<akk> Well, lots of confs but no specifically linux-related or ubuntu-related ones.
<philipballew> oscon is in august
<philipballew> portland
<rww> It's just weird to me that there isn't one so I assumed there is. Maybe there isn't :|
<pleia2> yeah, the washington and oregon teams are doing oscon
<DarkwingDuck> Oh, I'm designing a booth for us at SCaLE. I'll upload and post the finished blueprint when it's done.
<DarkwingDuck> Anyway, that's for a SCaLE discuss.
<DarkwingDuck> If you would like I'll go through and find some good places and assemble a list.
<pleia2> ok, so these are both good goals - get involved in more QA stuff and put more effort into conferencey venues other than SCaLE
<DarkwingDuck> I know that soon there will be a QA Community person and maybe that person will have more stuff for Locos to do.
<pleia2> I've also been talking to the folks in Italy about their best practices for testing, so their ISO and Laptop stuff is pretty much ready to go
<DarkwingDuck> But, having something outside our state would be a good idea IMO
<rww> this is a little apropos, but Oneiric ISOs are now dd'able to USB sticks instead of needing that USB Creator thing, which might make ISO QA a little easier.
<akk> That'll be great.
<pleia2> nice
<pleia2> usb sticks really are the way to go about testing, and it's silly that ISO Creator required 2G sticks (I didn't actually own any that big until I bought some)
<akk> You can't buy anything smaller than 2G now.
<akk> But of course lots of people have old stuff.
<pleia2> yeah, most of mine are free-from-conferences kinds, which are all 256-1G
<rww> a non-technical end user brought an 8GB stick into work to backup about 100MB of stuff the other day, so I take it USB sticks are cheap ;P
<akk> ISO Creator also required a lot of stuff software-wise -- I've tried it on many different machines and never gotten it to work.
<akk> dd works from any linux machine.
<pleia2> I think I paid $10 for my 4G sticks
<rww> akk: or OS X, or Windows even
<rww> which is wonderful
<pleia2> nice
<akk> ah, didn't know windows had dd
<pleia2> ok, well I think this is good goal-wise for now
<rww> akk: well, there are programs that do it. they're a /lot/ less annoying than the previous way of doing it.
<akk> usually I see instructions like "if you're on linux, type this dd command. If you're on windows, follow the next two pages of instructions."
<pleia2> I'll add them to the wiki once that's possible, and hopefully by next meeting we'll have a more complete app to review :)
<pleia2> [TOPIC] Announcements, intros, other misc
<pleia2> so, anyone new here tonight who cares to introduce themselves? or anyone with announcements about upcoming events or anything?
<Skullz> I'm new here :3
<pleia2> welcome Skullz :)
<Skullz> Thank you. :)
<Skullz> Anything I should add? Aha.
<pleia2> only if you care to share, but whereabouts are you in the state? have you been to any events? any questions or expectations of the team?
<DarkwingDuck> Skullz, where are you from?
<DarkwingDuck> NM, Lyz beat me to it.
<pleia2> (this goes for anyone who is new :))
<DarkwingDuck> Oh, I'm David Wonderly and I'm in San Diego.
<Skullz> Ah. I am from San Francisco, and I've so far been to yesterday's geeknic. :)
<DarkwingDuck> Awesome. :)
<Skullz> Ah, yes, and my name is Dash.
<BrightAmbition> Oh
<pleia2> Skullz: me too! but I don't we formally met?
<BrightAmbition> ok
<BrightAmbition> I think i did meet him but i forgot what he looks like
<BrightAmbition> lol
<Skullz> I don't believe so, no.
<pleia2> ah, well next time then
<Skullz> Hopefully, if I can before I move :)
<DarkwingDuck> I need to make it up there for events.
<DarkwingDuck> Maybe if I get this job...
<Skullz> Meet who, BrightAmbition?
<BrightAmbition> Skullz: I was the person in the Linux Chicks shirt
<pleia2> looks like we're pretty sparse event-wise on the loco directory right now, but I'm sure that'll pick up once people add their monthly ubuntu hours
<pleia2> for july
<BrightAmbition> Skullz: I think i talked to you for a bit but i don't remember what you look like for some reason
<Skullz> Ahh.
<Skullz> I was the tall one, in the grey shirt with the rolled up sleeves.
<pleia2> we'll have at able at the linux picnic here in norcal in august, but that's a bit far out for an announcement :)
<pleia2> s/able/table
<BrightAmbition> Skullz: Short or long hair?
<Skullz> Ear length, brown.
<BrightAmbition> Skullz: Glasses or no glasses?
<Skullz> No glasses.
<pleia2> Skullz: oh, are you the one moving to an island?
<Skullz> Yes, yes I am.
<pleia2> we didn't formally meet, but I heard part of that conversation
<BrightAmbition> Skullz: What were you wearing for some reason i could now remember people by which color they were wearing but usually i remember by face
<Skullz> Ahh, oka :)
<aaditya> Skullz: Welcome to Ubuntu California!
<pleia2> anyway, we should wrap up this meeting so I can finish putting my office back together! ;)
<pleia2> anyone else have anything to add?
<BrightAmbition> sounds fun pleia2
<Skullz> BrightAmbition, I was wearing a grey, long-sleeve shirt with the sleeves rolled up. I had on tan cargo shorts as well, and white sneakers.
<BrightAmbition> Skullz: oh
<aaditya> Yes, Geeknic was a blast yesterday. Looking forward to the next one.
<BrightAmbition> I feel that same way aaditya
<Skullz> I was probably seen moving around my backpack a bit.
<pleia2> btw, we're planning the next one for July 16th down in los gatos
<BrightAmbition> Hopefully we could crash a wedding next time
<BrightAmbition> lol
<aaditya> yes!
<Skullz> Yeah, I'm disappointed I had to leave early.
<rww> I'm looking forward to there ever being a geeknic that doesn't conflict with my work schedule. Mainly so I can look at how time was bended to make that happen since I work constantly ;P
<aaditya> We'll be more prepared for crashing weddings next time.
<BrightAmbition> Awesome!
<rww> bended? bent. pah.
<BrightAmbition> lol
<pleia2> rww: I think you should have fewer jobs
<pleia2> :)
<DarkwingDuck> Any other buisness?
<pleia2> ok, let's wrap this thing up, thanks for coming everyone!
 * DarkwingDuck waves.
<BrightAmbition> Mark should wear the penguin suit and dancing at a wedding reception so people could take pictures
<BrightAmbition> lol
 * DarkwingDuck snickers
<pleia2> chasing geese: http://www.flickr.com/photos/pleia2/5159643579/in/set-72157625344546226
<BrightAmbition> k, are we done talking yet?
 * BrightAmbition continues to talk
<BrightAmbition> hehe
<BrightAmbition> I got a picture of that on my phone, lol
<DarkwingDuck> LOL
<pleia2> meeting is over, but everyone is welcome to stay and chat forever
<BrightAmbition> yay!
<DarkwingDuck> Mark is great.
<BrightAmbition> More chatting!
<DarkwingDuck> Oh I forgot something!
<rww> my Facebook photo is of that time I wore that penguin suit... |:
<pleia2> oh, the photos from the geeknick yesterday: http://www.flickr.com/photos/pleia2/sets/72157626874010053/
<DarkwingDuck> Happy Fathers Day to all the dads in teh channel.
<pleia2> geeknic!
 * pleia2 didn't take enough photos
<BrightAmbition> I had my birthday last week, that was fun
<BrightAmbition> Well not really
<BrightAmbition> I wanted to do karaoke
<pleia2> DarkwingDuck: happy father's day :)
<BrightAmbition> Even better Mark doing karaoke in a penguin suit
<BrightAmbition> lol
<DarkwingDuck> Thanks Lyz :)
<BrightAmbition> Geez that was today?
 * BrightAmbition is in panic mode
<DarkwingDuck> Girls are in the bath and my son has taken over my playstation
<pleia2> DarkwingDuck: haha
<BrightAmbition> That sucks
<BrightAmbition> I would want the playstation back
<BrightAmbition> :)
 * pleia2 wanders back to cleaning up her office
<crashsystems> I hope you never gave sony your credit card number
<DarkwingDuck> About to take it back over... Time for some Call Of Duty: Black OPS
<BrightAmbition> It's funny i forgot mother's and father's day
<BrightAmbition> Not good
<BrightAmbition> My parents are probably mad at me
<BrightAmbition> lol
<rww> pleia2: I did that the other week. As a reward, I now have three extra power strips and some spare ethernet cable :)
<BrightAmbition> Black OPS is fun
<BrightAmbition> But i keep dying on that game
<DarkwingDuck> You play?
<Skullz> Hahahaha
<BrightAmbition> I have the demo of it
<DarkwingDuck> ahhhh
<BrightAmbition> When i did play it
<DarkwingDuck> I was going to say add me LOL
<Skullz> What platform?
<DarkwingDuck> PS3
<BrightAmbition> I'm too broke now to buy video games so i just get demos
<Skullz> Woot, what's your PSN?
<BrightAmbition> I have no clue
<BrightAmbition> lol
<BrightAmbition> I don't even remember
<BrightAmbition> Not good
<DarkwingDuck> Hakazakarekamaka
<BrightAmbition> Because i'll have to log in somehow
<Skullz> Mine's naeahuau
<BrightAmbition> My friend list is full on there
<BrightAmbition> lol
<Skullz> Hahahahaha
<BrightAmbition> I don't even remember what my username was
<BrightAmbition> That's sad
<Skullz> I can't play anytime soon, my family got hooked on net streaming Netflix
<Skullz> T~T
<BrightAmbition> Yea i have an account there
<BrightAmbition> But i never use it
<BrightAmbition> It costs after that i think
<BrightAmbition> The free trial
<eps> How 'bout those Sony films (oops!)
<Skullz> They don't realize that it literally slows EVERYTHING down on the Internet
<BrightAmbition> Why don't they just go on Hulu?
<BrightAmbition> Hulu has movies too
<BrightAmbition> Especially with Hulu plus
<crashsystems> I need to get a non-comcast issued modem so that netflix stops killing my network.
<BrightAmbition> Even more movies
<Skullz> They don't want to pay for anything else
<BrightAmbition> Comcast sucks
<BrightAmbition> They are like the windows of cable companies
<BrightAmbition> lol
<rww> I'm seeding everything legal I can find until I hit 90% of my Comcast monthly allocation, because Comcast annoys me.
<Skullz> Comcast is like the only thing here
<Skullz> Whenever they turn it on, I find a band I like and torrent an album
<Skullz> Just to mess with them >__>
<BrightAmbition> Skullz: Where do you live?
<rww> This project started a little over a day ago. 26.5GB total up and down today :)
<Skullz> San Francisco, BrightAmbition.
<rww> (250GB is the Comcast monthly cap, for anyone who doesn't know)
<eps> Eww.
<Skullz> Ahhhh.
<BrightAmbition> Skullz: There's other stuff i think
<BrightAmbition> sn9 what other stuff do they have in SF?
<Skullz> OH, well, at the moment I'm at my father's in Pacifica.
<crashsystems> my connection can actually handle netflix just fine if only the QoS on the modem would stop screwing everything up.
<DarkwingDuck> Skullz: Request sent.
<rww> The only ISP on the couple of blocks around me is Comcast. The AT&T station is too far away for reasonbly-sized DSL :(
<rww> s/sized/speed/
<Skullz> cool! :D
<eps> Some parts of SF are served by Astound
<Skullz> So, if I may, how long has everyone active been using Ubuntu?
<crashsystems> work gets level 5 fiber, but 1.87 miles away I can only get comcast.
<crashsystems> Skullz: since summer 05
<DarkwingDuck> I started in 2006 and switched to Kubuntu in '08
<Skullz> Cool :)
<DarkwingDuck> I'm pretty much the KDE whore of the Loco LOL
<BrightAmbition> ubuntu is great
<rww> I've been switching between Ubuntu and Debian since feisty, I think. The last time I switched distros was 2011-05-30, to Kubuntu.
<Skullz> I'm still a noob, as I started in November, I believe.
<BrightAmbition> No "Do you want to update?" crap that windows gives me
<DarkwingDuck> Oh yeah... rww you are a Kubu-nut now :P
<akk> I think I started with ... the H that was long before Hardy. Dunno when that was.
<BrightAmbition> I actually wanted Kubuntu but i think sn9 only had the disk thing for ubuntu
<akk> Hoary, that was it.
<Skullz> I started off with Lucid when my friend gave me a live disk.
<BrightAmbition> How many updates does windows need? Like seriously?
<BrightAmbition> There's like a million updates
<rww> 11 in the past week!
<Skullz> And then, during installation, I forgot to specify the partition and overwrote Windows.
<rww> Ubuntu has a lot too, they're just not obnoxious.
<DarkwingDuck> Windows? I have not used that since I left the military.
<rww> Windows Update is extremely annoying.
<BrightAmbition> Windows updates are annoying
<akk> Do they still do multiple reboots?
<Skullz> Yep.
<rww> akk: yes
<DarkwingDuck> I have yet to use Win7
<rww> My work machine is currently refusing to download Windows 7 SP1 for some reason I haven't figured out yet :(
<akk> Admittedly I do have to restart firefox after an ubuntu upgrade.
<BrightAmbition> I only use windows for itunes
<akk> (pretty much every time -- there's ALWAYS a firefox upgrade.)
<BrightAmbition> Besides that i'm mostly on ubuntu
<rww> It dies after an hour or so of trying with some error that doesn't tell me anything even with Google's help.
<Skullz> I would only ever re-introduce Windows to my system for Photoshop.
<BrightAmbition> They need to put itunes on linux
<Skullz> I agree.
<akk> I can't help but think Apple sees Linux as a competitor and so deliberately blocks it.
<BrightAmbition> I think they do that on purpose
<Skullz> Yeah.
<Skullz> Which is really stupid, because of the MacOS.
<BrightAmbition> Yea
<akk> Why? It's a competitor to MacOS (and therefore a competitor to their hardware).
<eps> Who maintains your printing architecture?
<Skullz> But what I really hate, is when the advent Mac users tout their "knowledge of computers" and lump anything that isn't a Mac into the "PC" categorization, referring to Windows.
<akk> Not that I think many people would leave MacOS just because iTunes started working from Linux.
<rww> I don't think the competition from Linux is likely to be a significant problem compared to the competition from Windows (which has iTunes).
<Skullz> Yeah.
<akk> ooh, I hate that "PC" == Windows, Skullz
<Skullz> Yeah, akk, it irks me to no end.
<rww> It's probably more just the usual reasons why companies don't port to Linux. Cost of maintenance vs. how many people care, incompatible distros, etc.
<akk> rww: They have to support Windows, they'd lose too much business if they didn't.
<rww> akk: I know.
<BrightAmbition> Do you think itunes would work in wine?
<Skullz> Well, did Aaditya tell y'all about one of the members of his room managing to switch his entire company to Ubuntu?
<akk> rww: There used to be browser ways to get to iTunes, and they blocked them, IIRC.
<rww> BrightAmbition: http://appdb.winehq.org/objectManager.php?sClass=application&iId=1347
<sn9> BrightAmbition: i tried to get kubuntu on, but it just wasn't working
<sn9> Skullz: what part of SF, again?
<rww> akk: It's been a while, but my understanding was that that was blocked during the time when iTunes had DRM that was being repeatedly cracked.
<Skullz> Well, when I'm at my mother's (rare) I'm in the Haight-Ashbury
<Skullz> @sn9
<rww> akk: i.e. as part of their general hardening of iTMS security, not just to annoy Linux users ;)
<sn9> Skullz: since when is it not possible to get DSL in that part of town?
<BrightAmbition> rww: How does it work?
<Skullz> sn9: Well, I'm at my father's ATM, in Pacifica.
<Skullz> Either way, our internet is Comcast and ATT&T I believe.
<rww> BrightAmbition: I haven't tried it, but given that WINE appdb ratings tend to be optimistic in my experience, and the most recent one is "Silver", I'd guess "badly".
<BrightAmbition> rww: Ok
<rww> oh, sorry, Bronze. so even more so.
<sn9> neither comcast nor at&t deserve the internet business of the larger community
<BrightAmbition> rww: There was one that was silver though
<rww> you could ask #winehq about it though, somebody probably knows.
<Skullz> I agree, the service is terrible.
<BrightAmbition> is it in freenode, rww?
<sn9> rww: itunes does not work under wine
<BrightAmbition> grr
<akk> All cable companies seem to have terrible service.
<Skullz> Media Monkey does, though.
<akk> Comes from having a monopoly.
<BrightAmbition> So you mean i have to deal with windows?
<BrightAmbition> AHHH!
<BrightAmbition> lol
<BrightAmbition> Sorry
<BrightAmbition> It just annoys me
<Skullz> Hahahahahahahaha
<rww> or stop using Apple firmware (which involves not using Apple hardware, for recent versions)
<rww> which is what I did ;)
<sn9> BrightAmbition: yes, but virtualbox makes it less bad
<BrightAmbition> sn9: I tried that it's not the same
<BrightAmbition> sn9: Well kinda
<Skullz> I only have one Apple device in my life.
<BrightAmbition> sn9: I need a bigger screen
<akk> It should certainly run in windows under virtualbox.
<sn9> rww: she doesn't wanna get rid of the 18GB or so of apps on the ipod touch
<rww> sn9: heh
<rww> akk: it does. I imagine you need the non-OSE version for syncing.
<BrightAmbition> sn9: The truth is i don't know how to
<akk> rww: Yeah, anything that involves USB. Grr.
<sn9> rww: there no longer is a non-OSE version
<BrightAmbition> sn9: I put them there and don't know how to delete them i've tried no luck
<akk> sn9: ?! So have they released the extras they were hoarding in the full edition?
<rww> sn9: fine, the "VirtualBox Extension Pack". Six of one, half dozen of the other.
<BrightAmbition> I tried GTK pod or something like that
<rww> akk: no
<BrightAmbition> Too
<BrightAmbition> But like it doesn't sync that well
<BrightAmbition> Neither does rhythm box
<Skullz> BrightAmbition, Rhythmbox works well if you're jailbroken
<sn9> gtkpod works for what it does, which is different from itunes
<BrightAmbition> I'm not jailbroken
<Skullz> Ahh, okay.
<sn9> rhythmbox needs to crawl into a hole and die
<BrightAmbition> lol
<BrightAmbition> Yea rhythmbox screwed up my ipod
<BrightAmbition> Some songs won't play anytmore
<Skullz> Which reminds me- I need to do a fresh reinstall of Banshee
<akk> Really? I'd always heard great things about it.
<BrightAmbition> oops anymore
<BrightAmbition> yikes
<BrightAmbition> typos suck
<BrightAmbition> hello
<BrightAmbition> welcome welcome
<Skullz> Hallo :)
<BrightAmbition> ^-^
<crashsystems> hmm, FIOS
<sn9> banshee is what you get when microsoft writes your gnu/linux media player engine for you
<Skullz> Hahahahaha
<BrightAmbition> banshee?
<BrightAmbition> Does that work for ipods?
<Skullz> sn9 is that good or bad? XD
<Skullz> And I dunno, I rather like Banshee >__>
<sn9> Skullz: if you can avoid C#/.NET on the gnu, awesome
<Skullz> Haha okay.
<Skullz> And it works better than AmaroK on my system, anyways.
<BrightAmbition> k
<sn9> amarok is fine for kubuntu, but anything kde is still too confusing for everyday use IMO
<Skullz> Okay, I think I'm going to make some dinner. If anyone wants to talk at a later date, I know I have Darkwing on PSN and anyone is free to stop by supernova.speeqe.com as Jabber is more my deal, and I'm there most of the day. :)
<Skullz> Cheers, everyone!
<sn9> Skullz: you can get here via jabber too
<Skullz> jnsfjnsfbhsdf
<Skullz> Really? Cool!
<Skullz> Hahahhahahahahaha.
<Skullz> Anyways, I'm off. Have fun, all.
<rww> jyo: Looks like devin wants that phrase signed and sent to him, btw (he got back to me about it the other day)
<crashsystems> sn9: irc via jabber?
<sn9> crashsystems: yes
<Skullz> Owait.
<crashsystems> how in the world have I never heard of this?!
<Skullz> Before I go, I don't believe Psi+ supports IRC.
<Skullz> And that's my primary client.
<sn9> jabber transports, duh
<Skullz> So, for real now, I'm off.
<Skullz> XD
<sn9_> hello from jabber
<crashsystems> hello
<sn9_> crashsystems: join ubuntu-us-ca%irc.freenode.net@irc.talkr.im
<crashsystems> I joined, but I just keep getting messages from ubuntu-us-ca%irc.freenode.net@irc.talkr.im saying that I've entered an invalid command.
<rww> so the amazonaws.com address sn9_ just joined from is the hostname that this irc.talkr.im thing is running off?
<sn9> yes, rww
<sn9> crashsystems: worked for me, as you just saw
<crashsystems> I wonder if the fact I was using a google talk account had something to do with it
<crashsystems> I really think xmpp has more potential than IRC, but everyone is already using irc/freenode
<rww> for some values of "everyone" ;)
<sn9> i was using a google apps acct logged into google talk via pidgin
<sn9> so there
<crashsystems> well by everyone, I mean the average geeky person who tends to hang out in online chat rooms with other geeky people.
<sn9> xmpp may have a lot of potential, but generally it's badly implemented
<DarkwingDuck> This is beyond epic http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lAl28d6tbko
<akk> <3 Will It Blend
<DarkwingDuck> It's amazing.
<DarkwingDuck> Who did no one show me this awesomness before today?
<akk> Be sure to watch the whole series!
<pleia2> the one with the phone that still rang after it was blended was pretty awesome
<akk> If you get tired of blending, this is good too: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mkOaQNiKgoo
<pleia2> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wt1fNKhQdKk
<akk> haha, I hadn't seen the sonim phone
#ubuntu-us-ca 2011-06-21
<seidos> haha, that reminds me.  is "Mr. Poppers penguins" a metaphor for sabdfl or Linus Torvalds?
<DarkwingDuck> Mark
<DarkwingDuck> It's a metephor for Mark
<seidos> i think i might be stinky then
<akk> penguins are stinky
<seidos> all of them are?
<DarkwingDuck> Hey Flannel
<seidos> oh wow, it started as a children's book
<seidos> hey DarkwingDuck, should've asked earlier but got sidetracked, how are you?
<Flannel> Howdy DarkwingDuck
<DarkwingDuck> I'm good.
<seidos> oh, here are all of them:  Captain, Nimrod, Stinky, Lovey, Loudy and Bitey
<seidos> i think i may be Nimrod
<DarkwingDuck> Flannel: We still have not met up re the Loco stuff you have. :)
<seidos> awesome!
<seidos> it's either that, or Bitey, only because i watched a video on youtube that says biting is a good defense against a rear naked choke
<Flannel> DarkwingDuck: yeah, still have to meet up at some point.
<DarkwingDuck> Flannel: Lemme know. :)
<MarkDude> Well that appears the 1st time I have seen akk be wrong. Penguins smell like roses
<MarkDude> And magic.
 * pleia2 doesn't think MarkDude has met many real penguins
<pleia2> at CAS they had a "penguins and pajamas" for adults, I was all "I want to go! but I won't actually sleep near the penguins because they stink" - they do! even behind glass!
<pleia2> I didn't go though :( was sick that weekend
 * MarkDude hears your reality
<pleia2> lol
<MarkDude> And *chooses* to substitute his own
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-us-ca to: Welcome to the Ubuntu California Local Community (LoCo) Team! | Webpage: http://ubuntu-california.org (has links to mailing list, forum, and more!) | Next Meeting: Sunday, July 3rd, 7:00pm PDT | This channel is publicly logged at irclogs.ubuntu.com | We have an unlogged channel at #ubuntu-us-ca-offtopic
<seidos> i think i remember some stinky tropical penguins at the zoo, once
<seidos> the non-tropical ones, never smelled them, so i'll take your word on it
<seidos> maybe some penguins are extra stinky...
<MarkDude> All the penguins I have seen smelled great
 * MarkDude has never been up close to a real one- without glass in the way
 * akk remembers the ones in the SF zoo being quite stinky. Though also way cute.
<MarkDude> Well that appears the 1st time I have seen akk be wrong. Penguins smell like roses
<MarkDude> Oh, you missed my comment earlier :D
<akk> MarkDude, when you're saving me seedlings, I don't want any of your roses. :-)
<MarkDude> lol
<MarkDude> No extra roses
<akk> Oh! speaking of which, is it normal for gooseberries to start out as great big paper pods with little tiny berries inside (then the berries get bigger later)?
<MarkDude> Extra peppers tho
<MarkDude> a few
<akk> Or is my soil doing weird things to stunt this poor plant? It has tons of great big paper pods with pea-sized berries inside.
<akk> (speaking of which, time to go water it now that the sun is down ...)
<MarkDude> akk that is normal
<MarkDude> You may be overwatering
<MarkDude> But the berries should start to get bigger
<akk> Whew!
<akk> I have quite a few of them ... pretty jazzed about it. :)
<shadowchaser> hello all
<seidos> watt up
<philipballew> yo!
<seidos> how's your notebook philipballew ?
<philipballew> seidos, fixed it yesterday!
<philipballew> now im fixing my desktop
#ubuntu-us-ca 2011-06-22
<seidos> philipballew: cool.
<philipballew> hows yours?
<philipballew> i would rather fix whats broken then buy something new
<seidos> me too
<seidos> i installed fluxbox...again
<pleia2> ok, finished adding our 2011 events so far and put in the goals we discussed at the last meeting: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CaliforniaTeam/ApprovalApplication2011
<philipballew> ^nice! good job working hard. Thanks!
<seidos> pleia2: i wonder why links wouldn't work just as well, just thought that because i wondered if the ubuntu hours are something that would be good on there
<seidos> since the last thing i did was attend the pasadena ubuntu hour
<seidos> that is, outside of this computer
<seidos> oh yeah, i wonder if Mindshare is something
<pleia2> seidos: links to what?
<seidos> nah, probably not.  i would have to frequent it for awhile before i could try to inject some ubuntu there
<pleia2> I can link to every single ubuntu hour ever, but we do that in team reports and it's a lot of tedious work to copy them all over
<seidos> pleia2: the events
 * seidos reopens
<pleia2> we could just link to the event page for each, but this is prettier :)
<seidos> i guess the council doesn't want to click anything
<seidos> just a thought, nevermind
<pleia2> it's the same format we used when we were originally approved: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CaliforniaTeam/ApprovalApplication
 * seidos nods
<MarkDude> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Meetup/San_Francisco/Wiknic
<MarkDude> Next weekend
<MarkDude> lol Molly Wood just cut loose with a sudo make me a sandwich line on Buzz out loud :D
<seidos> a friend i met in SF linked me this:  http://www.avaaz.org/en/save_the_amazon/96.php
<seidos> i should ask her if it's real, it looks like a tree pattern etched into the ground
#ubuntu-us-ca 2011-06-23
<philipballew> hardware question: where would you guys recommend getting a new Internet modem? i'm fine with buying used. just need to make sure it works
<sn9> define "internet modem"
<sn9> a modem is nominally a device for dial-up
<philipballew> dsl modem
<philipballew> phone line in. cet5 out
<sn9> garage sales and craigslist, as well as dumpsters
<sn9> oh, wait, you said "new"
<philipballew> haha. but would all dsl modems work with att?
<sn9> no
<philipballew> no. i prefer used
<sn9> most would
<philipballew> yeah. most should
<sn9> relatively few exceptions
<philipballew> how so?
<sn9> but i'd recommend against at&t
<philipballew> i dont like it either. but its that or satellite here. what do you dislike about them?
<sn9> satellite is not worth it
<sn9> but i'd STILL recommend against at&t
<sn9> how is it possible for there to be fewer choices in roseville than in sac?
<philipballew> its auburn. and the other choises dont go our way of town here
<sn9> hmm. lemme try a prequal
<philipballew> alright!
<philipballew> its been several years since we looked at other options
<sn9> should i check by phone# or address?
<philipballew> 5308858516
<akk> There's no rhyme or reason to where there are broadband choices.
<philipballew> akk very true
<akk> I'm a short bike ride from downtown SJ, and we have hardly any choices.
<akk> I knew people who lived up on Skyline and had broadband 2 years before we could get it.
<philipballew> heres my choice http://cgi.ebay.com/AT-T-Westell-DSL-Modem-/140566772438?pt=PCC_Modems&hash=item20ba6ebad6#ht_500wt_1156
<sn9> it says you already have dsl
<philipballew> i do have dsl
<philipballew> and its att dsl
<philipballew> i just need a new modem
<sn9> then you can have any isp you want
<sn9> just file a change of isp form
<philipballew> hum. ill have to look into this
<sn9> what are you putting behind the dsl modem, btw?
<philipballew> a firewall and router connected to a desktop and a desktop server
<sn9> so you have 3 separate boxes? firewall, router, modem? you know you can use just one as all 3 if it runs linux, right?
<philipballew> yeah. i have the server and firewall on the same box but i want my own desktop as i would prefer my server/firewall to be more stable then my computer habbits  make things
<philipballew> so i have 2 boxes
<sn9> server/firewall, router, modem is 3
<sn9> unless the server is also the router
<philipballew> well the modem and router are not was i thought you ment by boxes
<sn9> why are the router and firewall separate?
<philipballew> i have a firewall on the router. biut i have a firewall with my server
<philipballew> i gtg!
<philipballew> ifa laptop wont boot from usb and has no internal cd drive. what would you say is a good way to install a linux bassed system?
<MarkDude> put it in another system, and install Puppy Linux
<MarkDude> wait for reboot after installing- take it out, put it in system
<philipballew> hum. makes scene. would it pull all the drivers then on reboot in the new system?
<MarkDude> yes
<MarkDude> taht is how Puppy works
<MarkDude> I have seen it done with Ubuntu, Fedora, it depends on the video card - if it will let you do it
<pleia2> yeah, I've done it with Ubuntu, it's pretty clever if you don't have complicated hardware
<pleia2> (one of the good things about non-static xorg.conf)
<MarkDude> the main thing with it is removing video drivers if there is an issue, although it will let you go to a failsafe mode
#ubuntu-us-ca 2011-06-24
<pleia2> tomorrow, if anyone is interested: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Meetup/San_Francisco/Wiknic
 * pleia2 busy though
 * MarkDude too
<MarkDude> Watching Cars2 - although the picnic sounds fun
<pleia2> cars2 doesn't take all day!
<MarkDude> No, but it is a date. So it might ;)
<MarkDude> Besides, Im old
<pleia2> lol
<MarkDude> The 3D might tire me out
<pleia2> :)
<MarkDude> Not sure if I should see in 3D or 2D
<MarkDude> 3D towtruck sounds fun tho
<pleia2> btw, I followed up (first requested in April) and Canonical should be shipping this out today: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuAtConferences/ApprovedTeamGift
<pleia2> it's the new branding banner (not california-specific)
#ubuntu-us-ca 2011-06-25
<philipballew> does anyone know if libre office 3.4 is going to be put into the repositories?
<pleia2> they probably are waiting to see if it'll go stable before freeze
<pleia2> so it's hard to say
<philipballew> haha. makes sense pleia2 . freeze is not far off
<pleia2> if anyone is looking to pitch in with ubuntu weekly news we need people to write article summaries over in #ubuntu-news
<BrightAmbition> :(
#ubuntu-us-ca 2011-06-26
<MarkDude> http://www.flickr.com/photos/pleia2/5874689360/in/photostream/  <<<< Penguins
<BrightAmbition> Pengu!
<BrightAmbition> lol
<MarkDude>  \m/ penguins \m/
<BrightAmbition> yay penguins!
<BrightAmbition> lol
#ubuntu-us-ca 2012-06-18
 * jtatum waves
<pleia2> hey jtatum :)
<pleia2> bot testing in 9 minutes!
<pleia2> er, meeting
<jtatum> Evenin'. Yeah! Looking forward to it.
<DonkeyHotei> what is the test bot's trigger character?
<jtatum> It's @
<DonkeyHotei> @action nominates [echo $randnick] to lead the meeting
<darthrobot> DonkeyHotei: Error: "echo" is not a valid command.
<DonkeyHotei> bot test failed.
<jtatum> Hehe
<DonkeyHotei> @commands
<darthrobot> DonkeyHotei: Error: "commands" is not a valid command.
<jtatum> It's a supybot
<DonkeyHotei> @list
<darthrobot> DonkeyHotei: Admin, Channel, Config, Detroll, MeetBot, Misc, Owner, and User
<Eureka> DonkeyHotei: Channel, Misc, and User
<DonkeyHotei> trigger conflict
<jtatum> Doh. I'll fix.
<DonkeyHotei> Eureka: list channel
<Eureka> DonkeyHotei: alert, ban add, ban list, ban remove, capability add, capability list, capability remove, capability set, capability setdefault, capability unset, cycle, dehalfop, deop, devoice, disable, enable, halfop, ignore add, ignore list, ignore remove, invite, kban, key, kick, limit, lobotomy add, lobotomy list, lobotomy remove, mode, moderate, nicks, op, unban, unmoderate, and voice
<Eureka> Factoid list channel not found
<DonkeyHotei> Eureka: list misc
<Eureka> DonkeyHotei: apropos, help, last, list, more, ping, source, tell, and version
<Eureka> Factoid list misc not found
<DonkeyHotei> Eureka: list user
<Eureka> DonkeyHotei: capabilities, changename, hostmask, hostmask add, hostmask list, hostmask remove, identify, list, register, set password, set secure, stats, unidentify, unregister, username, and whoami
<Eureka> Factoid list user not found
<DonkeyHotei> darthrobot: list detroll
<darthrobot> DonkeyHotei: That plugin exists, but has no commands.  This probably means that it has some configuration variables that can be changed in order to modify its behavior.  Try "config list supybot.plugins.Detroll" to see what configuration variables it has.
<DonkeyHotei> darthrobot: config list supybot.plugins.Detroll
<darthrobot> DonkeyHotei: public
<pleia2> ok, meeting time now
<pleia2> jtatum: let me know when you're ready
<jtatum> Normally I disable config for unauthenticated users :)
<jtatum> Anytime
<pleia2> can we unload everything except meeting stuff? (not now, but sometime)
<jtatum> It already is - except for URL titling
<pleia2> ok
<pleia2> #startmeeting
<darthrobot> Meeting started Mon Jun 18 02:01:43 2012 UTC.  The chair is pleia2. Information about MeetBot at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<darthrobot> Available commands: #accept #accepted #action #agree #agreed #chair #commands #endmeeting #endvote #halp #help #idea #info #link #lurk #meetingname #meetingtopic #nick #progress #rejected #replay #restrictlogs #save #startmeeting #subtopic #topic #unchair #undo #unlurk #vote #voters #votesrequired
<pleia2> ok, who all is here for the meeting? :)
<jtatum> I/
<jyo> o/
<DonkeyHotei> u
<pleia2> #link https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CaliforniaTeam/Meetings/12June17
<darthrobot> Title: [CaliforniaTeam/Meetings/12June17 - Ubuntu Wiki]
<pleia2> that's our agenda, as you can see it's empty :)
<pleia2> #topic upcoming events
<pleia2> anyone have some upcoming things they wish to share?
<DonkeyHotei> awesome! that means everything is already done!
<jtatum> MV hour on Thursday
<jyo> hooray for Mt. View
<pleia2> #link http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/ubuntu-california/1822/detail/
<darthrobot> Title: [Ubuntu Hour: Mountain View/Silicon Valley | Ubuntu LoCo Team Portal]
<pleia2> Ubuntu User Days is coming up on Saturday: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UserDays
<darthrobot> Title: [UserDays - Ubuntu Wiki]
<pleia2> still fleshing out the schedule a bit, but it's IRC-based in #ubuntu-classroom and #ubuntu-classroom chat
<pleia2> app developer sessions are happening soon too, a couple days next week some some the next: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuAppDeveloperWeek
<darthrobot> Title: [UbuntuAppDeveloperWeek - Ubuntu Wiki]
<jtatum> Looking forward to it
<jtatum> I always learn something at app developer week
<pleia2> MarkDude told us last meeting about a geeknic on the 24th too, but I can't seem to find any information about it on geeknic.org and there were no links in the last meeting log
<pleia2> so if anyone is interested in that, "Ask Markdude" :)
<DonkeyHotei> of june?
<pleia2> yeah
<DonkeyHotei> one week from today, not much lead time
<pleia2> er, 23rd
<DonkeyHotei> even less
<pleia2> yeah, that's why he told us 3 weeks ago ;)
<pleia2> didn't announce it on the list or anything though
<DonkeyHotei> and the 23rd overlaps CABAL
<pleia2> yeah, overlaps with Ubuntu User Days too
<pleia2> https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Release_Party_F17_Bay_Area
<darthrobot> Title: [Release Party F17 Bay Area - FedoraProject]
<pleia2> actually looks to be the proper link
<pleia2> (I was thrown off by the title)
<DonkeyHotei> fail.
<pleia2> looks like you rsvp via the facebook link
<pleia2> #topic Any other comments, questions, ideas
<pleia2> anyone? :)
<jtatum> Business as usual :)
<pleia2> oh, here's a photo from the debian dinner we had with the ubuntu hour in sf last week: http://www.flickr.com/photos/pleia2/7370768128/
<darthrobot> Title: [Squeeze and Wheezy enjoyed some beef with broccoli | Flickr - Photo Sharing!]
<pleia2> :)
<pleia2> ok, I guess we'll wrap up then
<pleia2> thanks everyone
<pleia2> #endmeeting
<darthrobot> Meeting ended Mon Jun 18 02:18:34 2012 UTC.
<darthrobot> Minutes:        http://ihas.5cat.com/~darthrobot/ubuntu-us-ca/2012/ubuntu-us-ca.2012-06-18-02.01.moin.txt
<jyo> See you guys Thursday.
<philipballew> pleia2, I can take care of post meeting stuff again
<pleia2> philipballew: thanks :)
<philipballew> alright
<jtatum> philipballew: does that mean you're going to edit the wiki pages post team meeting?
<pleia2> that and more: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CaliforniaTeam/MeetingChecklist
<darthrobot> Title: [CaliforniaTeam/MeetingChecklist - Ubuntu Wiki]
<philipballew> Its really hard!!!
<philipballew> took me 20 minutes last time!
<pleia2> hehe
<jtatum> philipballew: the meetbot plugin has wiki output which should help. it puts a link to it after the #endmeeting.
<jtatum> should just be able to paste that in
<philipballew> i should look into that
<pleia2> right now we just paste in the logs from irclogs.ubuntu.com
<pleia2> but if we started doing meeting minutes again it might help with that if we can get people to use #info
<pleia2> (otherwise meeting minutes generated by meetingology aren't all that useful)
<bkerensa> ;d
<philipballew> im a noob at smart computer people stuff like that
<scientes> are we doing a meeting?
<pleia2> no, it was last night
<scientes> ahh
<scientes> missed it
<philipballew> every other sunday scientes
<philipballew> pleia2, If spots are needed for user days  can do one probably, I need to check when ill be free as im on the other side of america now
<pleia2> philipballew: we still need someone to do one on installing stuff (software center, PPAs, from source)
<pleia2> http://timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?iso=20120623T22 and the hour after are our free spots, so saturday evening back east
<darthrobot> Title: [Event Time Announcer]
<pleia2> (6pm and 7pm)
<philipballew> that seems doable. I will be as the airport waiting for my flight,  can probably do that. I will get back to you about that
<philipballew> I should really start using the software center so i know about it more
<pleia2> not sure we want to rely upon airport power and wifi :\
<bkerensa> Anyone in CA working on RC bugs in Debian to try and get them trickled into Ubuntu? ( http://udd.debian.org/bugs.cgi?release=wheezy_and_sid&fnewer=&fnewerval=7&rc=1 )
<darthrobot> Title: [Debian Bugs Search @ UDD]
<DonkeyHotei> i wish the new nvidia binary drivers just released could be SRU'ed in
<DonkeyHotei> they finally added xrandr support
#ubuntu-us-ca 2012-06-19
<kdub> lul, tv talking about irc: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=O2rGTXHvPCQ#!
<darthrobot> Title: [Numb3rs' description of IRC - YouTube]
<kdub> raevol: you're in sd still, no?
<raevol> kdub: yeya
<raevol> woah that was nutty
<raevol> window manager freaked out
<MarkDude> Yay, Ubuntu Oregon Team is now OFFICIAL
<MarkDude> :)
<pleia2> MarkDude: "approved" they were always official :)
<MarkDude> pleia2, fair enough
 * MarkDude is hella proud of them 
<MarkDude> They kick ass
<MarkDude> When they went in for meeting
<MarkDude> Instead of saying here for rolecall
<MarkDude> all of us said
<MarkDude> Quack :D
<MarkDude> it was awesome- and we had to exaplin about the Oregon Ducks to a few of the international folks -lol
#ubuntu-us-ca 2012-06-20
<raevol> for a command-line automated backup tool, would you guys use rsnapshot?
<philipballew> raevol, Ive used rsync. Its kinda like a backup tool
<raevol> yea, rsnapshot uses rsync, but also uses hardlinks to make space-efficient snapshots
<philipballew> hum, seems good enough then
<greg-g> I'm checking out/testing obnam right now, in fact
<akk> Does rsnapshot make multiple backup copies by date ... is that what the hardlinks are for?
<raevol> akk something like that... i'd need to look at it again
#ubuntu-us-ca 2012-06-21
<philipballew> pleia2, would you be around for a pm that takes like 90 seconds?
<pleia2> sure
<pleia2> (running out to dinner soon though)
<pleia2> ^^ philipballew
<bkerensa> pleia2: CA might find this tool were working on useful https://code.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-us-or/+junk/get-contributors
<darthrobot> Title: [get-contributors : Code : âUbuntu Oregon LoCoâ team]
<jtatum> bkerensa: instead of the code on lines 43-46, you can probably do LOCOTEAM = [member.name for member in TEAM]
<jtatum> rather than calling str() on each person object and parsing out the url
<jtatum> can see a list of all the attributes available on person objects at https://launchpad.net/+apidoc/1.0.html#person
<darthrobot> Title: [About this service]
<bkerensa> jtatum: I passed it along to the guy working on it
<jtatum> ok :)
<bkerensa> eventually Ill have a look and likely optimize some things and pop in some UI
<jtatum> the all caps variable names are a bit distracting.. ooh, looks like a typo on line 27
<jyo> Looks like twitter is under high load?
<pleia2> it was down for a while this morning
<greg-g> Federated Social Networks FTW!
<bkerensa> heh
<bkerensa> huge box of like thousands of firefox buttons, stickers and a few hundred firefox pull string bags came
<bkerensa> :D
<jledbetter> cool
<akk> Mountain View Ubuntu Hour tonight, right?
<pleia2> yep
<akk> yay
<philipballew> yeah, I had twitter problems today jyo
<philipballew> Over ssh, If I install a Debian backport kernel, then reboot, will my new kernel be chosen automatically?
<pleia2> yeah, but you can check in /boot/grub/grub.cfg if you want to be sure
<pleia2> look for "set default" and then go down to the list of kernel stanzas and make sure the 0th (or 2nd, or 4th...) kernel is the one defined and the one you want to use
<pleia2> if it's not, you can edit /etc/default/grub to select the right one and run update-grub again
<philipballew> alright. thanks pleia2 :)
#ubuntu-us-ca 2012-06-22
<jtatum> http://changelog.complete.org/archives/7562-i-introduced-my-5-year-old-and-2-year-old-to-startx-and-xmonad-theyre-delighted
<darthrobot> Title: [I introduced my 5-year-old and 2-year-old to startx and xmonad. Theyâre DELIGHTED! | The Changelog]
<pleia2> jtatum: ended up having to work late due to meetings this morning, so no Ubuntu Hour for me, hope you all are having fun :)
<jtatum> no worries, pleia2 :) see you another time.
<scientes> FREEDOM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 * scientes just successfully booted with coreboot ;)
<bkerensa> morning Californians
<greg-g> oh, and now scientes is gone
<philipballew> pleia2, I gotta do some post meeting stuff, but don't fear. Its in a list of things to do when I am back in the Country of California...
<pleia2> thanks :)
<philipballew> I have a list titled Ubuntu Stuff. All will be done in due time. Now if only my plane would have wifi...
<bkerensa> Man Robert Scoble has a magic of sorts :)
#ubuntu-us-ca 2012-06-23
<scientes> Markdude....not here
<scientes> damn i missed the party
<scientes> wait i guess not
<scientes> Happy birthday Alan Turing
<pleia2> if anyone is around and interested, we're doing a "community roundtable" in #ubuntu-classroom for this next session of User Days, casual Q&A, pretty free-form :)
<pleia2> in just a few minutes
#ubuntu-us-ca 2012-06-24
<bkerensa> weird... I got a call from "UPS Customs House Brokerage" informing me that a package from Canonical Ltd., has been placed in Hold Status by U.S. Customs
<bkerensa> lol
<bkerensa> pleia2: have you ever by chance had a package from Canonical (CD's and such) held in customs for some sort of "Import Duty"
<pleia2> bkerensa: a long time ago an order by NJ/PA teams of stuff ordered from the Canonical store was held due to improperly declared t-shirts, the guy receiving it just paid the fee :\
<pleia2> bkerensa: I'd email shipit and tell them what happened, see what they recommend
<bkerensa> pleia2: ok will do... yeah Bilal Aktar said UPS has bungled a shipments to people in Canada and tried to charge them some weird fees related to dealing with customs
<bkerensa> but I mean I got two shipments prior and had zero issues with any fees so no idea
<pleia2> yeah, I haven't had problems in ages
<pleia2> international shipping is weird like that
 * pleia2 off to dinner
<pleia2> good luck :)
<bkerensa> pleia2: I found out what the issue was apparently Merchandise Mania which handles the shipments marked on the customs declaration "Promotional Material" and this was to vague for Customs so they just want to know exactly whats inside
<bkerensa> I told them that although I did not know with absolute certainty all of the contents that at the very least it would be CD's and lanyards with no commercial value
#ubuntu-us-ca 2013-06-17
<pleia2> meeting in 10 minutes :)
<pleia2> #startmeeting
<darthrobot> Meeting started Mon Jun 17 02:00:36 2013 UTC.  The chair is pleia2. Information about MeetBot at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<darthrobot> Available commands: #accept #accepted #action #agree #agreed #chair #commands #endmeeting #endvote #halp #help #idea #info #link #lurk #meetingname #meetingtopic #nick #progress #rejected #replay #restrictlogs #save #startmeeting #subtopic #topic #unchair #undo #unlurk #vote #voters #votesrequired
<pleia2> ok, who all is here for the meeting? :)
<pleia2> #agenda https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CaliforniaTeam/Meetings/13June16
<darthrobot> Title: [CaliforniaTeam/Meetings/13June16 - Ubuntu Wiki]
<pleia2> nothing really on the agenda either
<eps> Well, we could wish a happy Father's Day to sabdfl ... he is, after all, Ubuntu's "father."
<pleia2> looking at our events calendar it looks pretty sparse until july: http://loco.ubuntu.com/teams/ubuntu-california/events/
<darthrobot> Title: [Ubuntu California Events List | Ubuntu LoCo Team Portal]
<pleia2> hehe
<pleia2> yes, happy father's day sabdfl
<pleia2> anyone else have any announcements, comments, etc?
<pleia2> eps: did you want to mention any upcoming things?
<eps> Not really. ;-)
<pleia2> alright, I think we just wrap this up then
<pleia2> thanks for coming, eps! :)
<pleia2> #endmeeting
<darthrobot> Meeting ended Mon Jun 17 02:12:22 2013 UTC.
<darthrobot> Minutes:        http://ihas.5cat.com/~darthrobot/ubuntu-us-ca/2013/ubuntu-us-ca.2013-06-17-02.00.moin.txt
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-us-ca to: Welcome to the Ubuntu California Local Community (LoCo) Team! | Website: http://ubuntu-california.org (has links to mailing list, forum, and more!) | Next Meeting: June 30th | This channel is publicly logged at irclogs.ubuntu.com | We have an unlogged channel at #ubuntu-us-ca-offtopic
<GNUdru> thought: if the dictator is the "father of Ubuntu" then Richard Stallman is perhaps great grandfather and Linus Torvalds the father. :-)
<GNUdru> oops i mean Torvalds the grandfather.
<GNUdru> so if we say "happy father's day" to the dictator (as suggested by eps in the meeting last night), we should also to Stallman and Torvalds
<raevol> anyone else having an issue with raring where the display will just lock up for about 15 seconds? mouse still moves but nothing else works
<pleia2> nope
<raevol> pleia2: you're on xfce though right? i wonder if it's a unity thing
<raevol> pleia2: also are you running conky by chance? i think it might be a conky issue
<pleia2> raevol: that kind of thing is more often a graphics driver problem (which may manifest itself when running a 3d desktop like unity)
<pleia2> unity itself is tested like crasy, and there would be riots in the street if this was common ;)
<pleia2> crazy too
<raevol> pleia2: yea that's what i am thinking too, i think it's an interaction between conky and X somehow, i added a line to my conkyrc and it fixed conky turning black after the lockup
<pleia2> and no, have never used conky
<raevol> hmm
<MarkDude> pleia2, we have a Fedora dude up from LATAM for a BAMF event. We were talking- your name came up. He wanted to say thanks- he has been learning bitleBee
<MarkDude> He likes your blog :)
<pleia2> MarkDude: yay :) glad he found my bitlbee stuff useful (gosh, I need to update my web quickstart)
<MarkDude> Yep, he heard Princess Leia and wondered why Bitlbee was there. He was at Scale- Ruben irc biker
<MarkDude> Yay for the Linux Penguin family :D
<bkerensa> mmm
<MarkDude> bkerensa, ok he is FLOSS person - his choice of Distro is secondary :D
#ubuntu-us-ca 2013-06-19
<regularjo_> I have wanted to use the windows Mach3 CNC maching program using wine. But I can't even make the programs shown on WineHQ work. Not one of them. Is anyone agreeable to discuss this issue with me. I used to chat on this channel, but gave up about a year ago.
<MarkDude> regularjo_, I am assuming you are using a newer version of Ubuntu than 9.10?
<MarkDude> Most folks here are agreeable to talk, the main question being time :)
<raevol> watching jono live :D
#ubuntu-us-ca 2013-06-20
<philipballew> pleia2, got a sec for a pm?
<pleia2> philipballew: go for it
<raevol> secrets!
<philipballew> raevol, we're talking about your birthday party we are planning
<raevol> sweet!
#ubuntu-us-ca 2014-06-16
<nhaines> Well, in the grand tradition of "My computer's working very well lately; I should break it," I'm going to see if I can get Windows XP installed for a triple boot setup.  Probably on a logical partition.
<DonkeyHotei> will it even run from a logical partition?
<nhaines> Oh yeah, it'll run fine.  That's not the main problem.
<nhaines> I figured out that the system reserved partition that Windows Vista and higher create is simply there in order to ensure an active primary partition for the bootloader.
<DonkeyHotei> if i want to break this computer, i can just upgrade it to trusty. instant elimination of usability
<Roguehorse> Just found out my nephew is turning down a FULL RIDE at MIT for a full ride at NC State...I want to kick his butt!
<nhaines> In other words, if I'd just partitioned the drive appropriately beforehand, I could've had a free partition available for XP.
<nhaines> The big questions now are: do I want to nuke my boot partition and resize my Win8 partition to make room for XP?  Also, do I know where my Win8 setup disc went to.
<akk> I assume you're fully backed up before starting any of this. :)
<nhaines> Eh.  :)
<nhaines> Ubuntu is.  But there's not a lot on the Windows size.  It'd be a huge pain to lose it but it's a reinstall, Firefox, Steam, and Catalyst install, and then the Windows upgrade treadmill.  Nothing crazy.
<nhaines> All of this is of course only to run X-Wing: Alliance.
<nhaines> With hardware acceleration, anyway.
<jose> who's going to watch GoT?
<DonkeyHotei> not me
 * ianorlin doesn't watch that
<nhaines> Nope.  Might read the books still.
<Roguehorse> No - I've been watching The Walking Dead on Netflix when I can and Gibson Research Company on YouTube
<nhaines> And the WinXP disc locks my system so that's the end of that.  More research to follow.
<Roguehorse> GRC - Security Now series is pretty cool
<DonkeyHotei> eps: i plan to see you tomorrow
<nhaines> On the bright side, I discovered that my laptop *does* have USB 3.0 ports after all.  On the less bright side, they're not where I want them and I only have one USB 3.0 device anyway.
<ianorlin> I was planning on having 6 on a desktop I want to build
<akk> My fast desktop system doesn't have usb3 but my silly little netbook does.
<nhaines> On the more bright side, it's a slimline USB drive, so I've got that going for me, which is nice.
<DonkeyHotei> is usb3 just as cpu-bound for i/o as usb2?
<jyo> nhaines: http://www.amazon.com/Apricorn-Notebook-Upgrade-Connection-ASW-USB3-25/dp/B005C983NA/
<darthrobot> Title: [Amazon.com: Apricorn SATA Wire Notebook Hard Drive Upgrade Kit with USB 3.0 Connection ASW-USB3-25 (Grey): Electronics]
<jyo> nhaines: The software is obviously pointless but it does works as expected[C.
<nhaines> jyo: that's used for file recovery.  I already have a similar one.  :)
<nhaines> So are we having a party or what?
<nhaines> rww, pleia2: ping  :P
<ianorlin> rww around?
<Roguehorse> : )
<nhaines> Don't make me start making phone calls.  :)
<DonkeyHotei> to jono?
<nhaines> I can call him too.
<nhaines> Okay, who all's here for the meeting?
<eps> o/
<ianorlin> o/
<DonkeyHotei> /o
<Roguehorse> o/
<jyo> o/
<DonkeyHotei> /o
<nhaines> Awesome.  Okay.  Normally this is where I'd just start running the meeting, but rww want to discuss a specific topic, so it's phone call time.  I'm sure we'll be up by 19:15.  :)
<Roguehorse> sounds good
<nhaines> So we'll probably discuss https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-us-ca/2014-June/002438.html
<darthrobot> Title: [[Ubuntu-US-CA] Event ideas for summer/fall]
<nhaines> And of course, after we use that to stall until rww gets here, we'll chat about https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-us-ca/2014-June/002437.html
<darthrobot> Title: [[Ubuntu-US-CA] Leadership Document amendment: Decisions on non-agendized topics during IRC meetings]
<eps> If he doesn't show, we should table it.
<nhaines> We can always discuss it again.
<nhaines> Okay, here we go.
<nhaines> #startmeeting
<darthrobot> Meeting started Mon Jun 16 02:15:23 2014 UTC.  The chair is nhaines. Information about MeetBot at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<darthrobot> Available commands: #accept #accepted #action #agree #agreed #chair #commands #endmeeting #endvote #halp #help #idea #info #link #lurk #meetingname #meetingtopic #nick #progress #rejected #replay #restrictlogs #save #startmeeting #subtopic #topic #unchair #undo #unlurk #vote #voters #votesrequired
<nhaines> Okay, so the agenda ended up empty this time: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CaliforniaTeam/Meetings/14June15
<darthrobot> Title: [CaliforniaTeam/Meetings/14June15 - Ubuntu Wiki]
<nhaines> Therefore, we're just going to have some informal discussion.
<nhaines> #topic Event ideas for summer/fall
<nhaines> So as you know, summer and fall are traditionally more quiet periods for the LoCo.
<nhaines> I've been thinking about Ubuntu App Development School presentations, and I know rww has as well.
<DonkeyHotei> Roguehorse: with regard to your msg, he.net already hosts a lug last i knew
<nhaines> OCLUG wants to do an installfest again in September and I'm going to talk about a bigger venue with them next Saturday.
<nhaines> Does anyone else have any thoughts or ideas on events we could put on?
<ianorlin> ubuntu hour somewhere?
<nhaines> Ubuntu Hours are always welcome.  But they're meant to be more informal style events.
<Roguehorse> DonkeyHotei: They do EBLUG and SILICON Valley Web Builder but I'm sure They wouldn't mind an occasional Ubuntu event
<nhaines> We have a lot of members and it'd be nice to work together and do something special and fun.  :)
<jyo> Wouldn't be my first choice for venue though, given the location.
<DonkeyHotei> jyo: the location being suboptimal for EBLUG is why BerkeleyLUG came into being
<Roguehorse> DonkeyHotei: Ok, I have not been informed on that history so I am not aware
<nhaines> Roguehorse, DonkeyHotei: can you please continue this after the meeting?
<Roguehorse> nhaines: Fair
<DonkeyHotei> nhaines: this was in response to the summer/fall events msg
<nhaines> DonkeyHotei: you're discussing https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-us-ca/2014-June/002440.html ?
<darthrobot> Title: [[Ubuntu-US-CA] Event ideas for summer/fall]
<Roguehorse> AFAIK - HE.net is a venue I have access to for events - Including UbuntuCA
<DonkeyHotei> nhaines: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-us-ca/2014-June/002438.html
<darthrobot> Title: [[Ubuntu-US-CA] Event ideas for summer/fall]
<nhaines> Roguehorse: It's definitely good to have friendly venues.
<Roguehorse> nhaines: TY : )
<DonkeyHotei> oops
<Roguehorse> As for ideas of stuff to do? DK
<jyo> I wouldn't worry too much about event space; plenty of companies close to public transit that would be happy to have us. (I think the AdRoll release party worked out quite well.) Should focus on ideas first.
<DonkeyHotei> nhaines: i meant https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-us-ca/2014-June/002440.html
<darthrobot> Title: [[Ubuntu-US-CA] Event ideas for summer/fall]
<nhaines> DonkeyHotei: that's what I linked to.
<nhaines> jyo: I tend to agree.
<nhaines> Still, I'm glad HE was mentioned because sometimes ideas follow from venue, too.
<DonkeyHotei> nhaines: the last link is Roguehorse suggesting he.net
<nhaines> DonkeyHotei: yes, that's what I linked.
 * ianorlin thinks this is looking for ideas would be good now
<DonkeyHotei> nhaines: sorry, misclicked, then
<nhaines> For any event, we would still need someone to stop up and volunteer to organize the event.  Are there any events that someone's wanted to run or be a part of that we haven't done?
<nhaines> Or maybe something went well and you want to do it again?  :)
<Roguehorse> just throwing it out there, but I just installed Mudlet. Maybe we could do some kind of party around that?
<nhaines> MUDs are all so different.  It'd be tricky to find something that was beginner-friendly and suited everyone's tastes.  :)
<DonkeyHotei> installfests can install packages, not just distros
<jyo> Well, typically, meatspace events are more successful at attracting interested newcomers and bringing out the old guard.
<nhaines> We can definitely do a team thing there, but LoCo events should be focused on public Ubuntu advocacy, since that's the purpose of a LoCo Team.
<DonkeyHotei> jyo: that depends on location, really
<Roguehorse> nhaines: True
<nhaines> Roguehorse: maybe we'll talk MUDs after the meeting.  :)
<eps> This isn't really a fully-formed idea, but I'd like to see some sort of "how to be an installfest volunteer" -- we're assuming that people come in with skills, and I don't think that's necessarily the case.
<Roguehorse> nhaines: k
<ianorlin> that could help people if they find freinds they want to convert as well
<akk> Even if they have installing/system skills, it can be confusing to know how to help people at an installfest.
<akk> How do you say you're one of the helpers? How do you find out who needs help?
<nhaines> eps: another important reason to put on events is to get new members at these events to gather experience.
<Roguehorse> So like "INstallfest Training Seminar?"
<eps> Roguehorse: yeah
<Roguehorse> could be cool
<DonkeyHotei> eps: i think there is the beginnings of that somewhere in the Linux Documentation Project
<nhaines> It was fully my intention to do some installfest training at the last one, but it didn't work out so well.  Not enough time.
<nhaines> DonkeyHotei: http://www.tldp.org/HOWTO/text/Installfest-HOWTO is very helpful.
<darthrobot> Content type: [text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1] Size: [46413]
<Roguehorse> like a training class....we could build an outline and everyone follows along
<DonkeyHotei> eps: what nhaines said
<nhaines> Would anyone be interested in a Google Hangouts online session, maybe?
 * ianorlin would
<Roguehorse> we could do something like that
<jyo> Yeah, Installfest Training feels more like a Google Hangouts session going over some common points before an event than an event in itself.
<nhaines> I have an "Advocacy for Advocates" presentation that I need to push to people.ubuntu.com that's a good start, too.  Better than nothing.
<nhaines> jyo: I'd *prefer* to do it in person, but we're so small and geographically scattered that online would probably be better.
<Roguehorse> I think I like where this is going : )
<nhaines> And as long as we're doing that, maybe we can steal #ubuntu-classroom or #ubuntu-meeting and do something bigger than just California.
<Roguehorse> We should combine the event as a local "in person" combined as a MOOC
<DonkeyHotei> if anyone objects to google hangouts, a guy at noisebridge demonstrated https://sylaps.com/
<darthrobot> Title: [Sylaps - Devilishly easy collaboration!]
<jyo> That feels like something someone at Noisebridge would object to.
<nhaines> DonkeyHotei: Thanks for that.  Alternatives are good.
<nhaines> Okay, so I like that idea.  Let's discuss it and develop it further.
<DonkeyHotei> note: it was demonstrated by its creator
<Roguehorse> jyo: can't please everyone
<nhaines> eps: do you feel like bringing it to the mailing list or shall I?
<ianorlin> although timezones come into effect if it is online but that should be disscussed later
<eps> nhaines: all yours
<nhaines> We have a lot of veteran event organizers in this LoCo and the more training we get the better people will feel about volunteering, I hope.  :)
<nhaines> eps: okay, I'll do that then.
<nhaines> #action Raise discussion for an "Installfest volunteer training" online class on the Ubuntu California mailing list.
<darthrobot> ACTION: Raise discussion for an "Installfest volunteer training" online class on the Ubuntu California mailing list.
<nhaines> All right, any other event ideas?
<nhaines> All right, then.  What does everybody think about Ubuntu App Dev schools?
<DonkeyHotei> i agree that ubuntu phone is a worthwhile agenda for such
 * ianorlin is mildly interested personally but thinks other people probably are more interested than I am
<Roguehorse> I like the phone app idea but I think it's limited
<eps> What are the prerequisites?
<nhaines> Pretty much someone who has some idea of app development and a venue where people can plug in laptops.
<Roguehorse> I like the Dev School idea though - I'm always big on Dev Ed
<eps> I mean, if you expect people to be comfortable with Qt you need to teach Qt first.
<Roguehorse> Qt is very cool but I've only dabbled with it. I would definitely be down on getting deeper into it with others though : )
<nhaines> Oh, gotcha.  No prequisites.  The presentations basically run down what an Ubuntu app is and some of the tools, and then presumably you'd lead everyone in a demo building an app.
<nhaines> Ubuntu apps use QML.
<ianorlin> sort of like Richard Gaskins live code at Ubucon?
<DonkeyHotei> Qt would be cuter without all the c++
<nhaines> They also use Javascript, not C++.  Unless you already know C++.
<nhaines> ianorlin: I literally don't remember anything about Ubucon other than that I harassed Jono during his talk.  :)
<nhaines> Okay, we'll have to figure out more about the App Development School idea.  I'll probably talk to rww and see where he is about that.
<DonkeyHotei> or where he is, period
<nhaines> That brings us to the next topic.
<nhaines> #topic Leadership Document amendment: Decisions on non-agendized topics during IRC meetings
<nhaines> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-us-ca/2014-June/002437.html
<darthrobot> Title: [[Ubuntu-US-CA] Leadership Document amendment: Decisions on non-agendized topics during IRC meetings]
<nhaines> It's been suggested that the LoCo should formally adopt a time limit before meetings.
<DonkeyHotei> there is really no reason to'
<nhaines> After that time limit, no item placed on the meeting agenda will be actionable.  That is, it can be discussed but no action may be voted on that will commit the LoCo for or against a topic.
<ianorlin> not sure if it gets put on last second could not be discussed
<nhaines> DonkeyHotei: the reason is that in the past, topics have been added minutes before the meeting, and then votes have been called.  This makes it very difficult for all stakeholders to be present during the discussion.
<DonkeyHotei> ah, ok
<nhaines> ianorlin: no one's suggesting that.
<ianorlin> argh worded that badly
<nhaines> Plus, sometimes items have been added for discussion and the adders have been accused of trying to push discussion through, too.
<nhaines> So this amendment would make it clear that last-minute agenda items wouldn't be actionable.
<Roguehorse> I like having agendas - and sticking to them - then open discussion after
<nhaines> An "action" would mean formal voting, adoption of position statements, disbursement of LoCo funds, and other significant decisions like that.
<DonkeyHotei> how about 8pm the preceding friday?
<nhaines> The proposed amendement puts the deadline at 7pm the preceeding Friday.
<nhaines> Or rather to say, 48 hours before the meeting.
<DonkeyHotei> rush hour ends at 7pm on weekdays
<DonkeyHotei> i propose adding an extra hour for that reason
<nhaines> and by 7pm Friday, many already have their weekends planned.
<ianorlin> is one hour really that big a deal in the time frame?
<nhaines> #idea Allow agenda topics to be added on Friday evenings.
<nhaines> Does anyone have any thoughts on that?
<Roguehorse> 36hr cut-off might be better
<jyo> It's a two week timeframe. 48 hours before (i.e. 7p) should be fine.
<eps> Change 48 hours to 72 hours
<nhaines> #idea 36-hour cutoff instead of 48-hour cutoff.
<nhaines> #idea 72-hour cutoff instead of 48-hour cutoff.
<DonkeyHotei> Roguehorse: many people will not notice something added on a weekend
<DonkeyHotei> eps: again, rush hour
<eps> DonkeyHotei: don't wait until the last minute
<ianorlin> you don't have to add it at the deadline
<Roguehorse> DonkeyHotei: Gives time through Friday night after rush-hour to put in last minute thoughts
<DonkeyHotei> Roguehorse: whether thurs or fri, 8pm can accomplish that
<jyo> Maybe we should predicate all our timing decisions on local traffic conditions.
<DonkeyHotei> jyo: it's a big state
<Roguehorse> jyo: Yeah, define "local"?
<nhaines> jyo: well, I don't think it's unreasonable to think about these things when we discuss events.
<nhaines> So it's definitely worth bringing up.
<nhaines> Is anyone opposed to a restriction such as the one proposed?
<ianorlin> no not opposed to the restriction
<Roguehorse> no oppositions
<eps> We have a restriction -- all of the proposals are for lengthening it.
<DonkeyHotei> i am not opposed in general, just have reservations about the exact cutoff
<nhaines> Do we have a restriction?
<eps> 24 hours
<jyo> Set one and then walk it forward as necessary.
<nhaines> eps: That's not in the leadership document.  Do you have a source?
<eps> It's been the established convention
<DonkeyHotei> the proposal is to codify
<nhaines> The leaders are looking to codify this restriction.
<ianorlin> which makes sense
<rww> oh, howdy
<nhaines> Okay.  Everyone seems in favor of having a restriction.  At least, no one's opposed to it.
<rww> apparently 7pm happened
<nhaines> Oh hey rww
<rww> sorry :[
<DonkeyHotei> it happened an hour ago
<nhaines> rww: it's okay, I remembered how to bot.
<eps> bot is a verb now?
 * ianorlin needs to get his dad dinner
<rww> elky distracted me with amazing food
<nhaines> eps: http://www.languagetrainers.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/calvinverbing.jpg
<DonkeyHotei> eps: it's not a verb how google is not a verb
<darthrobot> Content type: [image/jpeg] Size: [36417]
<nhaines> For the official meeting record.  :P
<nhaines> rww: I find this an acceptable excuse.
<rww> anyways, I just read scrollback for this topic. We're fine with a timing restriction, just not sure what the length should be?
<ianorlin>  yes
<nhaines> Okay, does anyone think the time limit should be extended back from the meeting from Friday, or pushed forward to Saturday?
 * eps thought "xerox" was the only thing you couldn't verb
<nhaines> rww: pretty much.
<Roguehorse> 'bout
<rww> I figure we set it to 48 hours and see how it goes. If you want something on the agenda, you have two weeks to do it. If you are able to show up for a meeting on Sunday but can't read an agenda all of Sunday or Saturday, or Friday evening, your schedule is odd.
<Roguehorse> so far we have: 24, 36, 48 and 72 hr proposals
<rww> And anyways, it's not getting decided on today. If the only point of contention is the time period, yay.
<elky> 48 is fairly typical
<DonkeyHotei> Roguehorse: add mine of 47
<nhaines> Roguehorse: also 23-hour proposals.
<ianorlin> 47 hours as well I think
<nhaines> Also I meant 47.
<Roguehorse> ah geez!
<eps> n is n-m with an m grace period ;-)
<eps> or something like that
<nhaines> No grace periods, please.  :)
<eps> n+m maybe
<nhaines> If there's a grace period, just make *that* the time limit.
<Roguehorse> 23, 24, 36, 47, 48 and 72 hr proposals
<DonkeyHotei> and i responded to the 72 with 71
<nhaines> Well I was going to call for a vote on this but now rww's here so he'll catch me.
<Roguehorse> and to think I'm missing the Gong Show for this!
<nhaines> But it's good to know that we're all in general agreement, anyway.
<rww> I specified the meeting two weeks from today for voting on the actual amendment.
<Roguehorse> : P
<ianorlin> ah yeah vote on it then
 * ianorlin goes to get his dad dinner
<nhaines> Might be good to take it back to the mailing list, then.  Any other comments on this before we wrap it up?
<rww> This is because voting on something that I proposed today that would ban voting on something that I proposed today is a bit too funny for me.
<nhaines> rww: it's the entire reason I wanted to call the vote.  :)
<rww> lol
<rww> I like you, you should run for u-us-ca council
<rww> anyway
<DonkeyHotei> rww: so two weeks minus 24 hours of more numbers are allowed?
<rww> DonkeyHotei: enoparse
<nhaines> But right, the discussion topic was intended to be an informal discussion and not actionable at this meeting.
<eps> CIVS, here we come.
<DonkeyHotei> rww: don't worry, parsing stuff i say isn't something everyone can do
<nhaines> rww can actionate it next time.  :P
<rww> actionize **
<nhaines> ALL SYSTEMS ACTIONATED
<nhaines> Okay, so I think that's about it for this topic, then.
 * rww nods
<nhaines> #topic Miscellaneous
<nhaines> Anything else before we wrap it up?
<rww> sensible proposals for alternate time frames (or other amendment improvements) welcome on mailing list
<nhaines> rww: I'm sorry, we've already moved on.
<rww> nhaines: network lag, clearly
<Roguehorse> LOL - schooled : P
<rww> nhaines: blame jyo
<nhaines> This whole channel is out of order!
<nhaines> haha, we'll call it lag.  :)
<rww> I think we should start deciding who's going to do post-meeting stuff at the end of the meeting.
<rww> I nominate nhaines.
<nhaines> #vote Should rww do all the post-meeting stuff at the end of meetings?
<darthrobot> Please vote on: Should rww do all the post-meeting stuff at the end of meetings?
<darthrobot> Public votes can be registered by saying +1, +0 or -1 in channel, (private votes don't work yet, but when they do it will be by messaging the channel followed by +1/-1/+0 to me)
<nhaines> +1
<darthrobot> +1 received from nhaines
<DonkeyHotei> speaking of lag, what's rww's take on summer/fall events as discussed?
<nhaines> Too bad we don't have that 48-hour rule thing right?  Also I don't think I know how to end the voting.
<eps> +0
<rww> -1
<darthrobot> +0 received from eps
<darthrobot> -1 received from rww
<rww> #endvote
<rww> which I can't do because not chair
<rww> because coup or something
<rww> -5
<rww> aww
<nhaines> OVERRULED!
<nhaines> #endvote
<darthrobot> Voting ended on: Should rww do all the post-meeting stuff at the end of meetings?
<darthrobot> Votes for:1 Votes against:1 Abstentions:1
<darthrobot> Deadlock, casting vote may be used
<nhaines> You win this time, rww!
<elky> the casting vote by who?
 * nhaines shakes fist.
 * eps cackles
<rww> elky: me, as the only member of the oligarchy currently present
<rww> With my casting vote, I vote for systemd as default Debian init system.
<rww> No wait.
<rww> anyway
<elky> you vote systemd for president, we get it
<rww> I vote elky does the post-meeting tasks
<elky> wat
<nhaines> Casting vote accepted.  Congrats, elky!
<rww> elky: there is a checklist and everything, and you love moin so much
<elky> i already made you dinner, what is this
<nhaines> elky: next time he demands medium-rare cook temps.
<rww> elky: I'm balancing out the patriarchy.
<rww> nhaines: #endmeeting plz :P
<eps> It's Fathers' Day.
<rww> DonkeyHotei: I'll take a look later; I was in the middle of something before elky noted we failed at alarm.
<Roguehorse> That got scary for a while : |
<nhaines> Okay, so I think we did pretty good for an informal meeting.  Couple of event suggestion ideas, a beginning concensus on the agenda thing.
<DonkeyHotei> elky didn't even answer as present for the meeting
<nhaines> See everyone here in two weeks, and also immediately following the meeting.  Thanks to everyone for their time.  :)
<nhaines> #endmeeting
<darthrobot> Meeting ended Mon Jun 16 03:18:42 2014 UTC.
<darthrobot> Minutes:        http://ihas.5cat.com/~darthrobot/ubuntu-us-ca/2014/ubuntu-us-ca.2014-06-16-02.15.moin.txt
<Roguehorse> Do we have to start over?
<nhaines> Roguehorse: yes.  That meeting was just practice.
<Roguehorse> \o/
<rww> elky: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CaliforniaTeam/MeetingChecklist
<elky> goddammit i request a deferral until the no-railroading thing is settled
<darthrobot> Title: [CaliforniaTeam/MeetingChecklist - Ubuntu Wiki]
<rww> oh, /op != /opup
<rww> elky: there you go, now you can do all the checklist, glhf
<elky> noooo
<eps> Best. Meeting. Ever.
<Roguehorse> Being a new guy you miss out on all the inside jokes - kinda sucks
<rww> Roguehorse: there were no inside jokes, we're just a bit silly
<rww> not usually that silly
<nhaines> But it is a holiday after all.
<Roguehorse> I had fun, glad I got to be here and not stuck in History homework
<nhaines> Well that's definitely a plus.  :)
<jyo> oh what fun you have on the IRC!
<nhaines> rww: pleia2's going to have kittens when she sees the log.  :P
<Roguehorse> Yes, a lively bunch : P
<rww> nhaines: ikr
<nhaines> Roguehorse: so how do you feel about the Discworld MUD?
<Roguehorse> nhaines: I haven't had the chance to fire it up yet
<Roguehorse> But, I've thought about writing something along the same context as a project so I was excited to see it in the repos
<Roguehorse> When I was in JR High (before GUI times) all our games were text based
<nhaines> I had plenty of graphical games but Rogue for PC captivated me.
<nhaines> Half the reason I run Linux is so I could play nethack.  :P
<Roguehorse> These are all text based?
<Roguehorse> I'm still a table-top D&D guy (started in 1979)
<nhaines> You've... never heard of Rogue or nethack?
<Roguehorse> no - much of this is new to me
<nhaines> Okay, well, 'sudo apt-get install nethack-console' and you're all set.
<nhaines> And that's the last anyone ever heard of Roguehorse.  RIP in peace.
<Roguehorse> I've only been on Linux since 2009 and most around me don't even use their computers to the degree I do
<nhaines> Nethack basically looks like this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NetHack#mediaviewer/File:Nethack_releasing_a_djinni.png
<darthrobot> Title: [NetHack - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia]
<nhaines> It's a turn-based dungeon crawler.  Basically anything you can think of to do is in the game.
<nhaines> It's a rogue-like game.  Procedurally generated, random seed every game.
<Roguehorse> installing
<nhaines> Fiendishly difficult.
<nhaines> You'll probably like it.  :)
<Roguehorse> LOL : )
<nhaines> It's basically a procedural hero death simulator.
<Roguehorse> Rogue-like has no meaning to me (unfrotunately)
<Roguehorse> ok
<nhaines> Roguehorse: that's why I mentioned it.  Context will soon fill in the rest.
<jyo> if you want it in space then FTL. :)
<Roguehorse> uncursed? Really? LOL
<nhaines> Also a roguelike hero death simulator.
<nhaines> Roguehorse: really  :)
<Roguehorse> jyo: In space??
<eps> That
<eps> That's your next Ubuntu App: You are eaten by a grue ... in space
<nhaines> FTL is another roguelike: http://www.ftlgame.com/
<darthrobot> Title: [FTL: Faster Than Light]
<nhaines> You can buy it from the Ubuntu Software Center or from Steam.
<Roguehorse> hah. . so find the Amulet of Yendor huh?
<nhaines> My favorite part was when they added another 20% of content to FTL and then just released it as an update free.  Also it's clear now I'll never beat the game.
<nhaines> Roguehorse: Amulet of Yendor.  happy hunting.
<Roguehorse> Hmm : P
<eps> You want it, you know you want it: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CaliforniaTeam/Projects/GameNights
<darthrobot> Title: [CaliforniaTeam/Projects/GameNights - Ubuntu Wiki]
<Roguehorse> eps: I saw that a while back
<Roguehorse> what's up with that?
<eps> It was proposed; it's been languishing for years
<Roguehorse> Yay - Roguehorse the Elven Ranger!
<Roguehorse> Lets press it forward ... What's the idea?
<Roguehorse> brb - bath time for my son
<Roguehorse> k
<nhaines> That was quick.  Did you dip him in en route to a towel?
<pleia2> nhaines: thanks for chairing (I'm in Croatia this week, so the timing wasn't great, it's 6:30am here right now)
<nhaines> pleia2: my pleasure!
<DonkeyHotei> likely everyone there watching world cup
<nhaines> pleia2: it *might* have gotten a little silly by the end.
<pleia2> DonkeyHotei: yeah, it's a big deal over here
<DonkeyHotei> you should ask what's their world cup size
#ubuntu-us-ca 2014-06-17
<Roguehorse> Good Morning
<nhaines> Good morning!
<akk> Morning!
<nhaines> It's still bright and early today.  :)
<akk> Indeed it is.
<Roguehorse> oh yes
<Roguehorse> looks like I just installed the KDE update
<nhaines> How is it working?
<Roguehorse> haven't rebooted yet
<nhaines> Exciting.  :)
<Roguehorse> eh, kinda
<Roguehorse> just hope nothing breaks - I hate chasing that kinda stuff down
<nhaines> Well, that's what I meant by exciting, heh.
<Roguehorse> so far with Kubuntu I have had good luck : )
<Roguehorse> when I was on openSUSE - not so much
<nhaines> We try!  :)
<Roguehorse> well, it's obvious why it's the most popular distro : ) (including derivitives)
<nhaines> I got off of SuSE in 2003, 2004 because it kept breaking, too.  I was really glad when Ubuntu showed up.
<nhaines> Hard to think I've been using it for 9 years now.  :)
<Roguehorse> I did Ubuntu for a couple years - openSUSE for a couple - then back again
<Roguehorse> I thought the first Unity was hard to adjust to from Gnome 2
<nhaines> Unity was a bit of an adjustment.  Alt-~ was the winning move as far as I was concerned, although I liked it enough to fight with it for that first 6 month.
<Roguehorse> I liked it and kept it for a while then wanted to experiment with other things
<Roguehorse> This is Linux after all - an open book for experimentation
<Roguehorse> of course then I learned about VM's and everything changed again : )
<nhaines> Yup!  And with Ubuntu being as solid as it is, that's almost free license to experiment.  You can always go back to the standard install. :)
<nhaines> Hehe, yeah, VMs work too.
<Roguehorse> oh nicely - I have KVM running and VirtualBox
<Roguehorse> although I've found my graphics drivers lacking for KVM : (
<Roguehorse> trying to play a web browser game on Chrome through KVM is like watching a DVD with a scratch in it
<nhaines> That's a poor use of KVM.  :)
<nhaines> Although there's always VGA passthrough mode... I think. :)
<Roguehorse> I wanted to see what it could do
<nhaines> Ooh, actually... maybe that's the solution to my X-Wing Alliance problems.
<Roguehorse> I haven't had time to play with it a whole lot
<Roguehorse> what? VM?
<nhaines> KVM and QEMU with VGA passthrough.
<nhaines> VirtualBox doesn't cut it because it uses DirectX 5.
<Roguehorse> try it - I'll look inti it and see if things get better
<Roguehorse> I like KVM better than VBox but the performance was lacking so I refrained
<nhaines> They're two different tools for different scenarios, really.  :)
<Roguehorse> lets explore that - Define?
<Roguehorse> I know there is argument of whether KVM is really type 1 or 2 and VBox is type 2 - VBox works through the host while KVM goes directly to the kernel - correct?
<nhaines> Not really.  It's sort of a gray area.
<Roguehorse> which part?
<nhaines> KVM is extremely lightweight and can be run without any other software.
<nhaines> But VirtualBox is intended to be run in a standard guest environment.  It *can* be run on a server, but I'm not sure why anyone would want to, with KVM around.  :)
<nhaines> KVM's more of a server tool and VirtualBox has always been more of a workstation tool.
<akk> KVM doens't work on a lot of machines -- it requires CPU extensions that not all processors have.
<akk> Virtualbox works on everything.
<nhaines> akk: can't KVM use QEMU on machines without VT, though?
<Roguehorse> but don't most of the *newer* processors have support?
<akk> It couldn't a few years ago. Perhaps things have changed.
<akk> Roguehorse: I'm not sure, but I know people said exactly that a couple of years ago and lots of processors still didn't have support then.
<akk> Even fairly hefty fast processors sometimes didn't include those extentions.
<Roguehorse> I understand - I've read some of the articles
<akk> extensions
<akk> And it wasn't easy (at least with intel) to figure out which processors/machines would or wouldn't have support.
<DonkeyHotei> they still make processors without the extensions
<Roguehorse> I think things have changed and VT is now pretty much standard aside from maybe some rare instances
<akk> We bought one thinking surely this fast new processor will do it, and nope, it didn't.
<Roguehorse> with VM being able to cut down on carbon footprint, consumers are expecting it
<akk> Maybe for servers. I'm not convinced most computer buyers have ever heard of virtualization.
<nhaines> akk: my favorite part was when the processor supported it but the OEM removed support from the BIOS.
<akk> Or heard of power saving, come to that. :)
<Roguehorse> akk: ??? you think?
<nhaines> I agree with akk.  :)
<Roguehorse> come on now - everyone is green! : )
<akk> Roguehorse: Think of your average mac or windows user. Why on earth would they know about virtualization flags?
<akk> They can't even upload photos from their camera to their computer.
<DonkeyHotei> Roguehorse: no, some people are purple
<Roguehorse> LOL! (good one)
<akk> Green is hard to do too. Have you ever tried to research power use of computers before buying one?
<akk> You can't get the numbers at all, in most cases.
<akk> It's certainly not something a casual buyer would even try to do.
<Roguehorse> I believe it was nhaines who showed me a website that calculates it for you, but you'd have to know about it
<Roguehorse> or care : )
<akk> And if you're building a machine -- go to Fry's and look at power supplies. You'll see a lot of 500W models. Show me the efficient 80W models.
<nhaines> I'm not so sure that was me. :)
<Roguehorse> I concur, most people don't think about their consumption
<Roguehorse> I know it was from this forum (someone) looking to build a desktop
<Roguehorse> I don't remember for sure, but the site was nice. Made all the calculations for you.
<nhaines> It does sound nice.  :)
<Roguehorse> http://pcpartpicker.com/
<darthrobot> Title: [Pick Parts, Build Your PC, Compare and Share - PCPartPicker]
<Roguehorse> I knew I saved that link : )
<Roguehorse> for sating morbid curiosity, the design in question http://pcpartpicker.com/p/6RQprH
<darthrobot> Title: [Intel Core i5-4460, Cooler Master N200 - System Build - PCPartPicker]
<Roguehorse> notice the lack of sound or graphics? The discussion entailed the intended use which was for VM implementations
<Roguehorse> (as I recall)
<akk> Looks useful!
<Roguehorse> I does - doesn't it?
<Roguehorse> I know when I threw the box I'm on now I researched everything separately
<Roguehorse> The GPU stated a min of 500w PS for this NVidia9800GT so I grabbed a Black Widow 550w
<akk> yikes
<Roguehorse> Yeah, I don't know all the specifics related to that but I didn't want to chance it so I follow the instructions
<akk> Definitely more red than green. :)
<Roguehorse> that was the only thing that was specific related to power consumption - and it's not even that great of a board really
<nhaines> It got really bright outside an hour ago, and I said to myself, "what the fsck is outside the window?"  Then I pulled back the shade and looked directly into the sun.
<Roguehorse> well, the GPU was more of a "budget" thing, I had so much money ya know?
<Roguehorse> BRIGHT LIGHT - BRIGHT LIGHT!!
<Roguehorse> ... and no eating after midnight and absolutely no water!!
<Roguehorse> http://www.realhardtechx.com/index_archivos/Page362.htm
<darthrobot> Title: [PSU REQUIREMENTS - RealHardTechX]
<Roguehorse> worth reading:  http://www.sigops.org/sosp/sosp09/papers/hotpower_6_ma.pdf
<darthrobot> Content type: [application/pdf] Size: [492782]
<Roguehorse> http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/graphics/display/gpu-consumption2006.html
<darthrobot> Title: [The Grand Clash for Watts: Power Consumption of Modern Graphics Cards - X-bit labs]
<Roguehorse> hopefully the KDE updates will be all fine and good - should be
#ubuntu-us-ca 2014-06-18
<nhaines> I remember running some alpha 3 or beta 1 of Ubuntu 10.04.  Xorg and apt needed updating at the same time.  I was like, "What could possibly go wrong?"
<nhaines> (spoiler alert: nothing went wrong.)
<Roguehorse> Good to know!
<Roguehorse> I believe we who use Ubuntu or derivitives thereof are spoiled in that our stuff always works
<nhaines> Oh, things have broken before.  Maybe twice in 10 years? :)
<Roguehorse> peanuts compared to other distros...I like having freedom to try and experiment - but at my liesure and not by necessity
<Roguehorse> sometimes I believe too much "manual labor" gives LInux a bad name to the GP
<nhaines> I forced the LUG members at the last installfest to not talk about the command line.  :P
<Roguehorse> LOL!
<nhaines> Luckily, the president said he completely agreed and that he'd back me up to anyone who complained.  :)
<Roguehorse> there has to be balance - much is only capable there while some is more efficient from GUI
<Roguehorse> which is your primary LUG?
<nhaines> OCLUG
<Roguehorse> ah, down south
<Roguehorse> Right now I'm just hoping my guest presenter shows up tomorrow night
<nhaines> What's the backup plan?  :)
<Roguehorse> I have a presentation on ssh -D proxy
<Roguehorse> I'm also working on a blog on fdupes which I could probably make into a short presentation as well
<Roguehorse> I really should keep about 2 or 3 on hand at all times huh?
<Roguehorse> I'm still really new at this and learning as I go
<nhaines> Hehe, yeah, I have 3 or 4 presentations I can do at the drop of a hat.  :)
<nhaines> That's okay.  It comes with time and practice and experience.
<Roguehorse> So far I've gotten lucky and everyone who said they would present has followed through
<Roguehorse> although I don't want to take that luck for granted either : )
<nhaines> Yeah, I've only had to fill in once or twice.
<nhaines> Of course, one time was at Ubucon, which was annoying.  :P  But I did open Q&A, which was so popular that two years after I handed the event over they're still doing it.  :D
 * ianorlin should come to oclug but I don't want to go to one at 7pm on Thursday as traffic is bad before that time
<nhaines> Every meeting is always at 10am on Saturdays?
<ianorlin> no for other lug
<nhaines> Oh.  :)
<DonkeyHotei> SoCal has too many freeways to keep track of
<ianorlin> I know the 405 is evil
<nhaines> Also the 5.
<ianorlin> sort of unrelated but there is a Hrud peak in California
<ianorlin> *Hurd
<nhaines> I feel like maybe I should do those things I said on Sunday.
<Roguehorse> Good Morning
#ubuntu-us-ca 2014-06-19
 * ianorlin is sorry for dragging something more offtopic in mailing list
<markdude> pleia2: sooo, I just went to play the Star Wars Disney musical, Cats apparently did not like starting title.
 * markdude has not seen them run soooooo fast in long time- ripped out audio cord in process, Now one is looking from down the hall, still not sure
<markdude> http://blog.angryasianman.com/2014/06/star-wars-musical.html
<darthrobot> Title: [Star Wars... The Musical!?]
<DonkeyHotei> does star wars disney like the Cats starting title?
#ubuntu-us-ca 2014-06-20
<markdude> Good question- turnabout IS fair play of course
<DonkeyHotei> i can't imagine archie would be in great health with all that weight
<markdude> He died in Feb
<DonkeyHotei> ;-(
<markdude> We now have a fat cat with a very small head. Muning ulo in Tagalog
<markdude> Kitten head. His name is Nitro, but small head is better choice :D
<DonkeyHotei> i can't hold back the tears now
<DonkeyHotei> he REALLY liked me
<markdude> Yes, it was sad, the otehr cats knew sumthin' was wrong, so they actually got a whole bunch of quality time together
<DonkeyHotei> i quite despise death, period
<DonkeyHotei> markdude: how old was he?
<markdude> at least 14
<markdude> Gma got him when he was at least 4-6
<DonkeyHotei> and how much did he weigh at that time?
<DonkeyHotei> suzuki will almost certainly outlive her, btw
<markdude> Suzuki is right next to me now
<markdude> Cross -eyed as per usual
<ianorlin> I don't think bug 132555 will be above low in severity
<DonkeyHotei> ianorlin: there's no bug with that number
<ianorlin> sorry meant 1332555
<DonkeyHotei> that is so esoteric
<akk> ha, that's cute.
<ianorlin> dang oclug meeting got rescheduled
<nhaines> Pushed back a week.
<markdude> http://openwebcamp.com/ is July 12th Good event. Ubuntu had decent session there a few years ago :)
<darthrobot> Title: [Open Web Camp VI | The Bay Area's (Almost) Free Web Developer Conference]
<Dezryth> Hello!
#ubuntu-us-ca 2014-06-21
 * ianorlin is so regreting not seeing corey's talk at scale
<Corey> Ahoy.
<ianorlin> why does it seems most jobs want you to be the kind of person that finds networking with other people more enjoyable that manaul backups?
<DonkeyHotei> it's the nature of the industry
<DonkeyHotei> it's run by assholes
#ubuntu-us-ca 2014-06-22
<Corey> ianorlin: It's a strange world. You on the market? :-)
<ianorlin> yep
<ianorlin> have been for a year
 * ianorlin graduated ucla with math econ degree
<Corey> ianorlin: You still down in LA?
<Corey> (I was until two weeks ago, mooved to SF)
<ianorlin> yes
<Corey> ianorlin: Dev, ops, or just pure math at this point? :-)
<ianorlin> not really sure at this point I have done some testing for lubuntu and lxqt
<jose> why not a math devop?
<ianorlin> math devop?
<jose> a devop who also does maths
<DonkeyHotei> Corey: what part of sf?
<Corey> DonkeyHotei: Next door to Twitter.
<MichaelPaoli> Ubuntu Hour Berkeley - noon - 1pm & Bobby G's - same location as Berkeley LUG http://www.berkeleylug.com/?page_id=67
<darthrobot> Title: [Berkeley Linux Users Group Â» Meetings]
<MichaelPaoli> Oh, my booboo, actually Ubuntu Hour Berkeley was 2 weeks ago (2nd Sunday in even months) ... of course Ubuntu folks are more than welcome to Berkeley Linux Users Group (which also meets this Sunday noon-3pm).  http://www.berkeleylug.com/?page_id=67
<darthrobot> Title: [Berkeley Linux Users Group Â» Meetings]
<DonkeyHotei> can't make it, schedule conflict
<grantbow> thanks for hosting MichaelPaoli
* rww changed the topic of #ubuntu-us-ca to: Welcome to the Ubuntu California Local Community (LoCo) Team! | Website: http://ubuntu-california.org (has links to mailing list, forum, and more!) | Next Meeting: June 29th at 7PM (oops!) | This channel is publicly logged at irclogs.ubuntu.com | We have an unlogged channel at #ubuntu-us-ca-offtopic
#ubuntu-us-ca 2015-06-15
<nhaines> Okay, meeting time in 4 minutes.
 * ianorlyn is logged in here as I don't have an ssh key for this wily install yet
<pleia2> o/
<DonkeyHotei> o_
<nhaines> #startmeeting
<darthrobot> Meeting started Mon Jun 15 02:00:42 2015 UTC.  The chair is nhaines. Information about MeetBot at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<darthrobot> Available commands: #accept #accepted #action #agree #agreed #chair #commands #endmeeting #endvote #halp #help #idea #info #link #lurk #meetingname #meetingtopic #nick #progress #rejected #replay #restrictlogs #save #startmeeting #subtopic #topic #unchair #undo #unlurk #vote #voters #votesrequired
<nhaines> #chair ianorlyn
<darthrobot> Current chairs: ianorlyn nhaines
<pleia2> good evening, friends
<nhaines> Welcome to the meeting tonight!
<nhaines> Our agenda for this meeting is availble here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CaliforniaTeam/Meetings/15June14
<darthrobot> Title: [CaliforniaTeam/Meetings/15June14 - Ubuntu Wiki]
<nhaines> So before I begin, huge thanks to pleia2 for sprucing up the agenda this week.
<pleia2> yeah, better late than never I suppose :)
<nhaines> I didn't think sitting at home all month was that boring, but it was a very pleasant surprise!
<pleia2> haha
<DonkeyHotei> but it was less than 48 hrs prior
<nhaines> #topic Upcoming events
<nhaines> So we have some fun stuff coming up this week, actually.
<ianorlyn> hmm I had not heard of big data mingle and jingle before
<nhaines> Canonical announced with a bit of short notice that they're hosting a "Mine and Mingle" event in San Francisco.
<pleia2> jcastro sent an email to the list about it on Friday
<DonkeyHotei> why is it called that?
<pleia2> I did tell him that it was quite short notice, but having them tell us about these things at all is progress :)
<nhaines> It's a bit of a gettogether about data mining using Ubuntu, Spark, and Juju.
<pleia2> (usually I find them via @ubuntucloud on twitter)
<ianorlyn> yeah I saw it on google+
<nhaines> pleia2: that's a good source to watch for news!
<pleia2> indeed :)
<pleia2> anyway, I signed up, so I'll show up for a bit at least
<ianorlyn> I can't really go that far
<pleia2> indeed, this would be for san francisco bay area locals :)
<nhaines> Ubuntu is already a pretty worry-free server, and Juju makes cloud and service deployment magic.
<pleia2> I'm not really on board with Juju, but it's good to meet other cloud industry folks, and thirsty bear has good beer :d
<nhaines> So if anyone has any interest at all in the topic and wants to learn more, this probably isn't to be missed.  Plus there's free beer.
<nhaines> More information is available here: https://insights.ubuntu.com/event/big-data-mine-and-mingle/
<pleia2> oh, and "Space is limited so sign up early!" :)
<darthrobot> Title: [Big Data Mine and Mingle | Ubuntu Insights]
<nhaines> And if you're going, you must sign up!  Tickets are limited but free!  https://www.eventbrite.com/e/mine-mingle-tickets-17372270930
<darthrobot> Title: [Mine & Mingle Tickets, San Francisco | Eventbrite]
<nhaines> So that's Tuesday.
<nhaines> And if you can survive the excitement, on Wednesday, the Fremont EBLUG meeting has a presentation on Partimus.
<pleia2> that's Roguehorse's LUG
<nhaines> They've been building Ubuntu-based servers that handle PXE, Clonezilla, NFS, and proxy stuffs.
<pleia2> it's more discussion-oriented about strategy for building the server and documenting it
<nhaines> Anyone who's had to administer more than 3 computers knows exactly why they need to go to that meeting.  :)
<ianorlyn> I sort of wish virt-manager had per host folders
<pleia2> not sure if there will be a formal presentation, but I offered to do one if needed
<nhaines> So it's more of the theme of the meeting rather than a formal presentation?
<pleia2> yeah
<ianorlyn> hmn I don't think way have anyone way up north almost at oregon border
<pleia2> I asked if there was a meeting announcement, if there is one I'll forward on to the list
<pleia2> ianorlyn: Fremont is near San Jose
<nhaines> Perfect.
<pleia2> I'll be attending, along with cje and of course Roguehorse
<ianorlyn> no there is something in over a week in portland
<nhaines> Take picture things!  :)
<ianorlyn> in over a week
<pleia2> nhaines: will do!
<ianorlyn> http://opensourcebridge.org/
<darthrobot> Title: [Open Source Bridge: The conference for open source citizens / June 23-26, 2015 / Portland, OR]
<nhaines> Open Source Bridge is coming.  I should ping wxl and see if Ubuntu Oregon's up to anything over there.
<ianorlyn> actually has quite a few interesting videos on youtube
<ianorlyn> I did a few months ago
<ianorlyn> but should again
<nhaines> Great. He's usually pretty on top of things.
<pleia2> yeah, wxl is great
<nhaines> Does anyone have any other upcoming events or annoucements?
 * ianorlyn knows
<pleia2> if anyone is going to dockercon in SF next week, there's this http://insights.ubuntu.com/event/conducting-systems-and-services-an-evening-about-orchestration/
<darthrobot> Title: [Conducting systems and services: an evening about orchestration | Ubuntu Insights]
<pleia2> unfortunately it's on Sunday night, on father's day
<pleia2> lazyPower is hooking me up to get in (I'm not going to dockercon), but I'm not positive I'll be back in town early enough (spending the weekend in Sonoma, woo)
<nhaines> And you said you weren't travelling this month.  :)
<pleia2> driving in the same state doesn't count :)
<nhaines> Not if you're used to LA or SF traffic it doesn't.  :)
<pleia2> hehe
<nhaines> Okay sounds like the weather isn't the only thing heating up in the end of this month.
<nhaines> #topic Announcements
<nhaines> SCALE 14x is a thing!  And they've announced that they'll be holding the expo at the Pasadena Convention Center in January 2016.
<pleia2> bigger venue! exciting times
<nhaines> SCALE continues its trend of both being amazing and also completely outgrowing its venue.  They've managed to book the entire convention center is what I've heard.
<akk> Yay Pasadena! I might have to try to make it there if I don't have to find lodging around LAX.
<nhaines> So I'm really excited for their expansion plans, and I'm also really happy that I can talk about it now that they've issued their press release.
<pleia2> :)
<pleia2> too early to think about the booth, but the call for papers is open now through oct 30th
<nhaines> I think I don't get in trouble if I mention that 2017 will be back to February again.  It's the same sort of scheduling thing that happened with their first year at the Hilton.
<pleia2> ah
<DonkeyHotei> sucks that it's way into the desert now
<nhaines> Pasadena is not a desert.
<nhaines> The good news is that there's still an airport nearby, great lodging, and a lot of tech businesses nearby.
<DonkeyHotei> so it rains?
<pleia2> it doesn't rain anywhere in california :P
<pleia2> nhaines: yay!
<nhaines> Plus, I'm joining the SCALE Training Committee this year, so I hope that there will be some great classes available!
<pleia2> sweet
<DonkeyHotei> the drought can kiss my rear
<nhaines> As for the call for papers, they're looking for a variety of topics from speakers of all experience levels.
<pleia2> I'm submitting a couple talks, but I'm planning on going regardless, which means I can participate in ubucon if we're doing it again in 2016
<nhaines> Richard Gaskin and I are going to work closely with SCALE to expand Ubucon and make it even better.
<pleia2> cool, please let me know if there's anything I can do to help
<nhaines> I'm certain you'll hear from us.  :)
<nhaines> Thanks, pleia2.
<ianorlyn> yes
<nhaines> #topic Proposal: Have static "Upcoming Events" and "Announcements" sections of the agenda skeleton.
<nhaines> Funny, I'd just been thinking about that when I was fixing the wiki pages last week.
<pleia2> great minds \o/
<pleia2> I figure it's helpful both for the meeting chair and people attending
<nhaines> I thought "Hmm, I'll have to figure out a nice way to sort that."  And since pleia2 already did that, yay!
<nhaines> I don't find this to be actionable in a policy sort of way, so I don't think there's any reason not to just say "let's do this."
 * pleia2 nods
<nhaines> Does anyone have any thoughts on the new layout for this week's agenda?
<DonkeyHotei> i like it
<ianorlyn> +1
<DonkeyHotei> +2
<nhaines> Okay, in that case, let's use that layout in the future.  It's easy to read and will encourage people to add events to the agenda.
<pleia2> or at least remind them during the meeting that they have something to share :)
<nhaines> At the least.  :)
<nhaines> Thanks, pleia2.  It's a simple change but has a big impact.
<pleia2> you're welcome
<nhaines> Okay, that's all of our scheduled agenda items.
<nhaines> Does anybody have new business they wish to discuss?
<pleia2> nothing from me
<ianorlyn>  /me doesn't really have anything
<pleia2> thanks for chairing, nhaines \o/
<nhaines> Okay, in that case, our next meeting is on Sunday, June 28th at 7pm.
<DonkeyHotei> i think paulproteus had an announcement
<nhaines> Note that the meeting page already has the new format.  ;)
<nhaines> Oh, that's right.  paulproteus is co-hosting a meetup about Sandstorm on Thursday the 18th.
<pleia2> ah yeah, sandstorm.io has a meetup on thursday http://www.meetup.com/Sandstorm-SF-Bay-Area/events/223113702/
<darthrobot> [403] Title: [Attention Required! | CloudFlare]
<pleia2> har
<nhaines> Sandstorm is an easy-to-use web app package manager, so do RSVP and join them to learn more!
<pleia2> should be fun, they are good people, if I have energy after tuesday and wednesday I'll go, but I'm not going to bet on it ;)
<nhaines> Nonsense.  We all know you have boundless reserves!
<pleia2> hehe
<nhaines> That wraps things up for this meeting.  Feel free to discuss anything new or old on the mailing list or in-channel.  Have a great Sunday, everyone!
<nhaines> #endmeeting
<darthrobot> Meeting ended Mon Jun 15 02:30:34 2015 UTC.
<darthrobot> Minutes:        http://ihas.5cat.com/~darthrobot/ubuntu-us-ca/2015/ubuntu-us-ca.2015-06-15-02.00.moin.txt
<paulproteus> Thanks to DonkeyHotei + pleia2 for the Sandstorm meetup mention!
<paulproteus> Nice to e-see you again, DonkeyHotei , btw!
<nhaines> paulproteus: makes sure you post about your Sandstorm meetup on the mailing list!  :)
<paulproteus> nhaines: Oh, on ubuntu-california? Good idea!
<nhaines> Yup!  :)
#ubuntu-us-ca 2015-06-17
<blitz> where did rww go
<ianorlin> I don't know
#ubuntu-us-ca 2016-06-20
<nhaines> pleia2: embarassing, but I may not be in town next weekend either (going for the triple crown!).  Will you be around for the meeting?
<nhaines> I'll let you know if my plans change.
<pleia2> nhaines: no, I'll be touristing around los angeles
<pleia2> which reminds me, I'm staying in Hollywood, what should I do aside from the Griffith Observatory?
<pleia2> have sunday, and probably monday morning to go on adventures
<lynorian> pleia2, I don't know about touristy stuff
<nhaines> Ooh, exciting!  I dragged Sujeevan and Rudy to the Santa Monica Pier.
<pleia2> that's far and I no haz car
<pleia2> I could see a movie at the chinese theater
<nhaines> You could do what we did and stand on a corner trying to figure out where to go for drinks and have a street hustler beg you for money until I say "Es tut mir leid, ich bin Tourist," and then he laughs and walks away.
<nhaines> That was an adventure.  Also Sujeevan and Rudy teased me.  :P
<pleia2> x_x
<nhaines> I haven't spent too much time in Hollywood unfortunately.  :)
<nhaines> There's the La Brea Tar Pits!
<pleia2> can't do that one w/o my husband :)
<DonkeyHotei> he's not coming?
<nhaines> I'm trying to think what the museum over there is called.
<pleia2> no, I'll be down there for a conference
<lynorian> Ok so I think I will run the meeting
<nhaines> lynorian: that'd be great. :)
#ubuntu-us-ca 2016-06-21
<pleia2> nhandler: the "yelp elite" had a sip-nic at the winery where I got engaged :D haha
<pleia2> https://www.flickr.com/photos/yelp/sets/72157666790070213/
<darthrobot> Title: [Yelp&#x27;s Summer Sip-Nic at Benziger Family Winery | Flickr - Photo Sharing!]
<pleia2> :d
<pleia2> love that place
<nhandler> pleia2: That is pretty cool. I should start writing some reviews to get to elite status
<nhaines> pleia2: daily 15 second cat video for you: http://i.imgur.com/2CAqJxe.mp4
<darthrobot> Content type: [video/mp4] Size: [1874040]
#ubuntu-us-ca 2016-06-22
<nhaines> In case you're wondering, it's a 1,874,040-byte MP4.
<pleia2> haha
<pleia2> very familiar with that scenario
<nhaines> We've recently gotten our cats into chicken, but mostly unless it's some kind of dairy they're completely uninterested in human food once they've smelled it.
<pleia2> mine like turkey
<nhaines> Ours seem to almost humor us when it comes to the chicken.  But at least we don't have to guard our food constantly.  I've played that dance before.
<pleia2> Simcoe has renal failure, so she's always thirsty and we have to keep our glasses covered or guarded
<nhaines> I don't remember seeing a chart lately.  How's she doing?
<pleia2> not great, but I think she's still happy
<nhaines> Happy is good to hear.
#ubuntu-us-ca 2016-06-24
<pleia2> where has lynorian gone
<pleia2> I don't want to wait forever on this, but I think it's an appropriate meeting topic, team logo refresh: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CaliforniaTeam/Meetings/16June26
<darthrobot> Title: [CaliforniaTeam/Meetings/16June26 - Ubuntu Wiki]
<pleia2> nhaines: since you can't make it to the meeting either, can you chime in on the wiki ^^
<pleia2> if leadership agress, I think we can open the discussion to the list
<DonkeyHotei> [Fri 2016-06-24 10:24:04 AM PDT] <pleia2> where has lynorian gone
<DonkeyHotei> [Fri 2016-06-24 10:35:25 AM PDT] <pleia2> I don't want to wait forever on this, but I think it's an appropriate meeting topic, team logo refresh: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CaliforniaTeam/Meetings/16June26
<DonkeyHotei> [Fri 2016-06-24 10:35:37 AM PDT] <pleia2> nhaines: since you can't make it to the meeting either, can you chime in on the wiki ^^
<DonkeyHotei> [Fri 2016-06-24 10:35:58 AM PDT] <pleia2> if leadership agress, I think we can open the discussion to the list
<darthrobot> Title: [CaliforniaTeam/Meetings/16June26 - Ubuntu Wiki]
<lynorian> ty DonkeyHotei
<pleia2> lynorian: added your name to and fixed up the formatting for your comment (though you'll be at the meeting, right?)
<lynorian> yes sorry
<lynorian> yes
<pleia2> no need for sorry :)
<nhaines> pleia2: the discussion goes on the ML first!  :)
<pleia2> nhaines: I didn't want to put out a call for volunteers until we were all on the same page
<nhaines> pleia2: agreed, but the discussion about changing the logo goes on the ML first, then on the meeting agenda for a vote. Typically, anyway.
<pleia2> ah, I see
<nhaines> I had a couple of PoC passes back in 2010, but there wasn't any buy in and I wasn't thrilled with them anyway.  I wonder if I could find them.  Probably not until I get back anyway.
<pleia2> I don't remember that, but I had just moved here in 2010 and wasn't very involved
<nhaines> I might not have gotten as far as sharing them publically.  Maybe a link or two in the channel.
<nhaines> I do recall that the logo's conceit (California silohuette) didn't work well with the new logo's thinner lines.
<nhaines> Although one of the prototypes of the current logo had the circle of friends with just the coastline on the outside, and that looked awkward, but that was pre-bear, which might help.
<pleia2> nhaines: where is the discussion of colors happening? I was under the impression that the blog post clarifying the new orange was it
<pleia2> which is why I chose now to propose a logo change
<nhaines> pleia2: it's not.  Occasionally someone (usually Alan Bell) will complain that no one knows what's happening, and then Canonical will say "there's a super important reason that we'll talk about but we're not ready yet and just trust us but we'll talk about it soon."
<pleia2> yeah, I thought the blog post was their "talk about it soon"
<pleia2> they published that whole new page on colors along with it
<pleia2> what more are we waiting for?
<nhaines> That was for the Ubuntu SDK UI color palette for programs.
<nhaines> Well, I'd like to hear if the colors are screen-use only, or if we're going to get new Pantone numbers.
<pleia2> ah, so maybe we should clarify what we're still waiting for?
<nhaines> Note to self: grab my documentation and see if the Pantone numbers have changed.
<pleia2> I think they are also under the impression that the community questions have been satisfied
<nhaines> I'm sure they are.  They were telling the people who weren't satisfied that.
<nhaines> pleia2: anyway, I don't plan to block the issue.  I'm just a little unsure of the timing.
<pleia2> that's fine, I misunderstood the status of things
<nhaines> It's not your fault.  Design changes are one thing Canonical are historically lousy about.
<nhaines> We didn't even have new-branded business cards until I *made* some.  Which reminds me, maybe I should get the 3x5 design fixed up and uploaded.
<nhaines> sabdfl liked them though!
 * pleia2 nods
<nhaines> Was a 4 year gap, though!
<nhaines> Phone says: 3 reddit messages in your inbox.  Finish lunch.  Phone says: 6 reddit messages.  Wonder what I've said this time.
<nhaines> On the bright side, Unicode 9.0 has an avocado emoji, so that's improved my quality of life.
<lynorian> yeah I have had lubuntu artwork people have communication and theme breakage as well
#ubuntu-us-ca 2017-06-23
<pleia2> nhaines: I'm speaking at a devops meetup in Tustin next month :)
<pleia2> should let me know what there is to do around while I'm in town (just a day really)
<nhaines> pleia2: ooh, cool!  :)  Let me think about that.  There's some cool stuff.
#ubuntu-us-ca 2017-06-25
<metalbiker> awesome! now i know that i can connect to the chat room really easy through thunderbird, which i never knew had the ability to do. this is cool!
<metalbiker> is anybody around?
<metalbiker> NickServ identify 666
<chelz> uhoh, might want to change that password
<chelz> NickServ identify hunter2
#ubuntu-us-ca 2018-06-18
<nhaines> Meeting in 5 minutes!
<pleia2> o/
<nhaines> o hai
<nhaines> #startmeeting
<darthrobot> Meeting started Mon Jun 18 02:00:14 2018 UTC.  The chair is nhaines. Information about MeetBot at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/meetingology.
<darthrobot> Available commands: #accept #accepted #action #agree #agreed #chair #commands #endmeeting #endvote #halp #help #idea #info #link #lurk #meetingname #meetingtopic #nick #progress #rejected #replay #restrictlogs #save #startmeeting #subtopic #topic #unchair #undo #unlurk #vote #voters #votesrequired
<nhaines> Welcome to the Ubuntu California meeting for Sunday, June 17th, 2018!
<nhaines> Tonight's agenda is available here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CaliforniaTeam/Meetings/18June17
<darthrobot> Title: [CaliforniaTeam/Meetings/18June17 - Ubuntu Wiki]
<nhaines> Tonight's agenda is empty.
<nhaines> #topic Upcoming Events
<nhaines> Are there any upcoming Ubuntu events happening in California over the next month?
<nhaines> #topic Announcements
<nhaines> Does anyone have any announcements for the LoCo this week?
<pleia2> sorry, pretty quiet up here :)
<nhaines> Same down here.  :)
<nhaines> #topic Agenda
<nhaines> There is no agenda for this meeting.
<nhaines> #topic Other Business
<nhaines> Is there any other business for this meeting?
<nhaines> Okay, our next meeting is scheduled for July 1st!
<nhaines> #endmeeting
<darthrobot> Meeting ended Mon Jun 18 02:07:58 2018 UTC.
<darthrobot> Minutes:        http://ihas.5cat.com/~darthrobot/ubuntu-us-ca/2018/ubuntu-us-ca.2018-06-18-02.00.moin.txt
<pleia2> thanks for holding down the fort, nhaines
<nhaines> Thanks, pleia2.
* ChanServ changed the topic of #ubuntu-us-ca to: https://ubuntu-california.org (has links to mailing list, forum, and more!) | Next Meeting: Sunday, July 15th, at 7:00pm PDT (UTC -7:00) This channel is logged at irclogs.ubuntu.com | We have an unlogged channel at #ubuntu-us-ca-offtopic
#ubuntu-us-ca 2018-06-22
<linuxliam> where can i find ubuntu's gnome shell theme in the iso i.e usr/share/..
