#ubuntu-motu 2005-05-09
<ajmitch_> morning motus
<dholbach> yes... morning MOTUs
<tseng> hi
<ogra> hi guys
<jeld> hello all
<jeld> anybody home?
<Burgundavia> nah, they all died
<ajmitch_> almost..
<dholbach> jeld: so whats up?
<dholbach> :-)
<jeld> hi
<jeld> I was actually looking for a nice MOTU, to check out a few packages I updated
<jeld> http://mitechki.net/ubuntu
<jeld> there is updated plone (and a few components) and updated spambayes
<crimsun> oh, so you posted to u-d
<jeld> yup
<ajmitch_> versioning is wrong..
<ajmitch_> (at least for plone)
<bradb> whiprush: hey. did you take a pic of the notes i made on the flip chart about malone motu?
<tseng> bradb: i did
<tseng> bradb: hang on
<tseng> bradb: http://tseng.ath.cx/images/p1010106.jpg
<schweeb> nothing like seeing "b0rked" on a whiteboard
<tseng> thats nothing
<tseng> ill upload all the shots sometime
<tseng> there are better whiteboards
<bradb> tseng: awesome, thanks dude
<tseng> np
<schweeb> tseng: you're bradb's bish
<tseng> gah
<tseng> did you get our picture yet
<schweeb> which one?
<tseng> the one where we are giving you the finger
<schweeb> no
<schweeb> where is it?
<tseng> whiprush has it
<schweeb> so I'll probably never see it
<schweeb> because he's lazy
<schweeb> yea, it's not in his photostream yet
<schweeb> did you see the pic of Me vs. Sun ?
<schweeb> http://www.flickr.com/photos/whiprush/9747733/
<tseng> ok
<schweeb> Sun won ;_;  no Ubuntu on teh Blade
<schweeb> wow, amazingly enough, I'm wearing that shirt today too
<tseng> im wearing my super sexy ubuntu shirt
<schweeb> omg pics plz
<tseng> ok
<schweeb> heh
<schweeb> I'm told whip's bringin one back for me :)
<tseng> http://tseng.ath.cx/images/p1010146.jpg
<tseng> whiprush is big daddy
<tseng> hanging out with the kids
<d3vic3> http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2005/04/msg01048.html
<d3vic3> I'm totally speechless
<whiprush> tseng: shush sonny
<schweeb> hah
<schweeb> ahaha
<schweeb> whip looks so goofy there
<tseng> yes
<d3vic3> holly potatos
<schweeb> tseng: thanks for that pic, it's providing pure entertainment in another channel
<tseng> rock
<tseng> np
<d3vic3> hahaha
<tseng> d3vic3: :D
<schweeb> for example (wrt whip): <@StoneTable> he's sitting there like, "I'm the dumbest person in the room"
<tseng> he was.
<tseng> d3vic3 and I represent
<schweeb> and this: "<@whip|au> you can all go die."
<tseng> hm
<tseng> can I join?
<schweeb> sure
<tseng> where to
<schweeb> irc.arstechnica.com/#linux
<tseng> oh
<tseng> eff that
<schweeb> rol
<schweeb> it's where I do most of my trolling at :)
<schweeb> I'll need a roll-call for that pic... who is everyone
<tseng> uh
<StoneTable> eff that why? :)
<schweeb> ^^^^ arstechnica irc op
<schweeb> heh
<tseng> d3vic3, dholbach, koke, whiprush, riddel, Unfrgiven, colin, my laptop
<schweeb> here's my laptop, it's a dell too :) http://www.flickr.com/photos/whiprush/9747743/
<tseng> except yours sucks
<schweeb> all Dells suck
<schweeb> next one's gonna be an IBM or a Fujitsu
<tseng> my dell rocks your face
<tseng> centrino for the win
<tseng> wb
<d3vic3> ta
<d3vic3> I'm having X hiccups :(
<tseng> ya i saw
<tseng> gdm on crack
<tseng> oh nose
<d3vic3> (O.o)
<\sh> morning
<tarzeau> !seen herve
<Unfrgiven> hey all. im having some problems using cdbs for a package im trying to create... actually it seems to be a pbuilder issue. im running a "pbuilder build <app>.dsc" and get a warning about packages that cannot be authenticated. any ideas?
<ajmitch_> yeah, it's a pbuilder issue with gnupg not being installed in the chroot, there's a PbuilderHowto page on wiki.ubuntu.com, iirc
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch_: hmm i thought i followed that howto to the letter, but ill double check
<ajmitch_> yiirc you need to add an apt option in the chrrot, making sure you save it
<ajmitch_> I just did pbuilder login --save-after-login, added gnupg, and I think that worked
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch_: ill give that a shot.
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch_: whats the recommended way to deal with updated upstream releases? the new maintainers guide suggests using uupdate.
<ajmitch_> that works, if there's a watch  file
* ajmitch_ has close ties with upstream for his debian packages, so doesn't bother with that
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch_: and if there isnt? is it just easier to unpack the new version and copy across the debian directory?
<ajmitch_> yeah
<Unfrgiven> cool.
<Unfrgiven> by the way i've uploaded two packages ready for MOTU review. i put the details on the MOTUToReview wiki page as dholbach told me to.
<Unfrgiven> do i need to notify anyone that they should go review them?
<Unfrgiven> oh and the third and fourth packages arent too far off ;)
<ajmitch_> welcome, ogra
* ogra waves to ajmitch_
<ajmitch_> hello _matth, jsgotangco
<jsgotangco> where's he-man
<ajmitch_> he's busy just at the moment
<ogra> jsgotangco, gone to bed i think
<trulux> morning
<trulux> ogra: hi :)
<ogra> hey trulux
<trulux> ogra: howya?
<ogra> trulux, fine, even its very exhausting here
<trulux> ogra: how's that?
<ajmitch_> because we're doing BOFs all day long, and spending our free time writing them up
<ajmitch_> evening d3vic3
<d3vic3> ajmitch..... dude, you sitting right next to me
<jsgotangco> haha
<zul> ajmitch_: a little work wont kill you ;)
<ajmitch_> the problem is when it's a lot of work ;)
<ajmitch_> night all..
<Unfrgiven> ogra: hi ogra
<ogra> heya Unfrgiven
<bddebian> Heya
<herve> houba !
<Amaranth> can anyone tell me what linda means when it says "File /home/travis/Projects/smeg_0.5-0ubuntu1_all.deb failed to process: Format args for usr-lib-in-arch-all don't match Description. (0 vs 1)"?
#ubuntu-motu 2005-05-10
<ajmitch_> morning ogra
<ogra> morning all
<tseng> hi.
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch_, ogra, tseng
<tseng> dholbach++
<StoneTable> heard you guys are having a great time down there
<tseng> you heard wrong
<tseng> its totally shithouse
<chmj> O.o
<StoneTable> lol
<tseng> kidding.
<chmj> tseng, ?
<ajmitch_> the food is getting to him
<tseng> the food *is* shithouse
<dholbach> oh come on
<dholbach> don't be a sissy
<ajmitch_> at least it's a barbeque tonight
<dholbach> =>>>>    MaloneUniverseWishList
<ajmitch_> we need to do our Pub BOF sometime
<dholbach> we'll have a meeting with the malone guys in two weeks
<tseng> dholbach: dude we did that on monday
<tseng> oh.
<dholbach> ALL OF US
<dholbach> on IRC
<ajmitch_> yeah, brad wants updates
<tseng> we arent having a pub bof
<dholbach> i will announce it on the list
<tseng> it had to be yesterday
<tseng> dholbach was being a sissy
<dholbach> yes
<dholbach> absolutely pathetic
<ajmitch_> afternon, aka_daemon
<aka_daemon> hi
<aka_daemon> could anyone advice me where to best start reading about howto make packages for debian?
<aka_daemon> I recently tried to make a mplayer package, but that didn't work out very well; some strange dependency errors?!
<tseng> there is already an mplayer package.
<dholbach> aka_daemon: the best way is actually to set up a pbuilder (wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto) and trying to modify an existing one
<dholbach> i.e. add a .desktop file
<dholbach> the debian-policy or the new-maintainer guide is a bit scary
<dholbach> but they're good
<aka_daemon> but there are problems with that package: for some people the internal acc is broken
<dholbach> for looking stuff up
<aka_daemon> dholbach: i'll have a look at that..
<tseng> do you have a patch?
<tseng> its usually not our policy to make a whole new package to fix a bug
<aka_daemon> I had a read at the new-maintainer guide.. didn't get too much :/
<dholbach> aka_daemon: start with the existing package, use the pbuilder
<aka_daemon> tseng: I'm new to the whole package business and yet haven't got a clue at all...
<aka_daemon> Can't even build myself proper packages :/
<tseng> well making a new package doesnt fix anything
<dholbach> that's the best way to start, i feel
<ajmitch_> provide a source package for us to review once you have something
<tseng> what we need is a patch for the bug
<aka_daemon> dholbach: I'll do that for a start..
<ajmitch_> then we can give feedback
<tseng> or at least a bug report
<dholbach> aka_daemon: good one
<aka_daemon> please, slow... :panic: ;)
<aka_daemon> how would I be able to make a patch?
<tseng> do you know how to fix the bug?
<aka_daemon> tseng: yes, by installing mplayer from source ;)
<aka_daemon> tseng: other then that: sorry, no.
<dholbach> aka_daemon: wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingTips might be helpful as well, although it still lacks a bit of content
<aka_daemon> I posted the issue on the user mailinglist..
<aka_daemon> dholbach: thanks, I'll have a look there later..
<aka_daemon> tseng: signal 11 decode_audio error was the error..
<tseng> um.
<aka_daemon> some internal stuff..
<aka_daemon> ajmitch_: I don't even quite grasp the difference between source package and whatever...
<aka_daemon> sry, having some problems with the irc connection..
<tseng> ajmitch_: ping
<tseng> ajmitch_: can you please change --with-tls=__thread on mono and upload again? i think it might fail on x86 now
<tseng> ajmitch_: we can make it arch specific if we have to
<tseng> bbiab
<ajmitch_> ok
* ajmitch_ down in forum for proactive security
<elmo> yeah, watch out, the proactive security folks are table invaders
<tseng> elmo: cut them.
<Amaranth> can anyone tell me what linda means when it says "File /home/travis/Projects/smeg_0.5-0ubuntu1_all.deb failed to process: Format args for usr-lib-in-arch-all don't match Description. (0 vs 1)"?
<dholbach> Amaranth: run lintian -i on it
<Amaranth> lintian gives no errors
<Amaranth> or warnings
<dholbach> what about linda -v ?
<dholbach> or linda -i
<dholbach> linda -h  told me
<Amaranth> nothing
<Amaranth> i and v give me the same error, no extra information
<dholbach> well what does it install in /usr/lib ?
<Amaranth> /usr/lib/smeg/menu_handler.py and /usr/lib/smeg/dialogs.py
<tseng> ajmitch_: ill give you a new rules file in a few minutes
<ajmitch_> tseng: too late, it is t3h building
<tseng> ajmitch_: ok.
<tseng> ajmitch_: rock on.
<ajmitch_> tseng: at least mono built on i386
<tseng> ajmitch_: ok.
<tseng> ajmitch_: can we try amd64 please
<ajmitch_> sure, get me an amd64 box with bandwidth
<ajmitch_> or I'll just upload it
<tseng> uh
<tseng> buildd
<tseng> the only amd64 i have access to otherwise is gentoo
<tseng> and nvidia donated to gentoo, so
<tseng> ubuntu chroots wouldnt be appreciated if someone found it.
<ajmitch_> heh
<thom> mine's turned off currently; sorry
<tseng> thom: the buildd is fine
<tseng> thom: i can handle rejection if it fails
<ajmitch_> btw mono doesn't rebuild cleanly - automated testing will catch it
<tseng> and no one else is really using it
<thom> tseng: *g*
<ajmitch_> clean target is incomplete
<tseng> ajmitch_: as in make clena?
<tseng> i know
<tseng> thats not pressing
<tseng> the buildd could care less
<ajmitch_> accepted, time to watch build logs
<tseng> rock on.
<ajmitch_> what are you editing now?
<tseng> im not editing
<ajmitch_> ok, just going to work on selinux then
<tseng> ok.
<ajmitch_> since we're scheduled for a session
<tseng> ajmitch_: um
<tseng> ajmitch_: whats your rules file look like now? its still broken
<ajmitch_> obviously I wrote it wrong then
<tseng> im looking up your diff in pool
<ajmitch_> you could always look it up on your box & fix it there
<tseng> i could
<tseng> is it still in my ~ ?
* ajmitch_ will bbiab
<ajmitch_> no, ~ajmitch/breezy-chroot/tmp/breezy
<ajmitch_> probably drop the quotes
<tseng> yes
<tseng> and the +=
<tseng> +ifeq ($(DEB_BUILD_ARCH), s390)
<tseng> +  JIT = --with-jit=yes --with-nptl=no
<tseng> +  ATG = arch_target=s390
<tseng> +endif
<tseng> i guess the + is ok
<tseng> since we are setting it up before
<tseng> quotes are the main thing
<tseng> ajmitch_: i built a new source package in there
<ajmitch_> ok
<ajmitch_> still waiting on network issues..
<tseng> i think ill bug elmo about keychain if he shows up again
<GheRivero> hello everyone
<GheRivero> i need a package to be uploaded to breezy, can anyone help me?
<ajmitch_> what package, is it not in debian?
<GheRivero> yes, it' sin debian, but not in breezy
<GheRivero> libevent
<ajmitch_> libevent1 in debian?
<GheRivero> nfs-utils have been alot of days failing to compile in breezy due to a broken dependencie
<GheRivero> yes, that one
<GheRivero> http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/n/nfs-utils/1:1.0.7-3ubuntu1/nfs-utils_1:1.0.7-3ubuntu1_20050429-0807-i386-failed
<ajmitch_> it's in unstable, no idea why it's not in breezy..
<thom> libevent1 is in hoary
<ajmitch_> check for build failures on libevent, the source may be there
<thom> can't imagine it's anything but FTBFS
<GheRivero> libevent has not fail to build, really strange
<thom>  libevent1 |      0.8-2 | hoary/universe | amd64, i386, ia64, powerpc, sparc
<thom>  libevent1 |   1.0b-1.1 | breezy/universe | amd64, i386, ia64, powerpc, sparc
<GheRivero> and i suppose libevent-dev is available too without any problem...
<ajmitch_> yep
<GheRivero> then why this:
<GheRivero> Checking for source dependency conflicts...
<GheRivero>   /usr/bin/sudo /usr/bin/apt-get --purge $CHROOT_OPTIONS -q -y install debhelper libwrap0-dev libevent-dev libnfsidmap-dev libkrb5-dev
<GheRivero> Reading package lists...
<GheRivero> Building dependency tree...
<GheRivero> E: Package libevent-dev has no installation candidate
<thom> don't expect breezy to work right for a while
<GheRivero> uhm... then i will wait, but this have been failed for more than 2 weeks already
<GheRivero> thx everyone
<tseng> ajmitch_: are you near lamont?
<ajmitch_> yeah, he's just talking to jbailey
<tseng> it seems odd that there is no build log
<tseng> (still)
<\sh> moins
<ajmitch_> tseng: buildd fun again, lamont is looking into it
<ajmitch_> the package built ok though
<hunger> libboost-dev is missing lots of files. The debian one works fine though. The guys at #ubuntu said I should report that here.
<ogra> hunger, please file a bug in malone (url is in the topic)
<hunger> ogra: Already did that. (bug#512)
<GheRivero> res everyone
<tritium> Good morning, trulux
<trulux> hey tritium
<trulux> tritium: howya today?
<tritium> trulux, great.  You?
<trulux> fabbione: I'm going to port the ssp kernel patch to more archs right now
<trulux> tritium: fine too, worried about my crt monitor
<trulux> tritium: it's broken
<trulux> and I need to move all the work to my laptop
<tritium> trulux, that's no fun
<trulux> tritium: it's a royal pain
<trulux> I move even they keyboard table and it losses signal
<tritium> yeah...
<trulux> and I've been looking at the internals, it smells like burnt out
<trulux> the f*cking power connector moved all the base of the connections piece
<trulux> it's an HP mx70 with less than 2 years
<trulux> that's the worst part
<tritium> Be careful with the flyback transformer.  You can really shock yourself!
<trulux> yeah, I haven't touched it while connected ;P
<trulux> I'm not in the best time for buying a new screen, but I've started looking for good TFT offers
<trulux> until then, this f*cked up my weekend hacking
<trulux> or, as a bash.org kid would say, how can I watch my porn if any movement causes the screen to switch off!?
<herve> 'evening
<trulux> hey herve
<trulux> herve powah!
<herve> ?
<herve> :-)
<herve> thanks for the warm welcome :-)
<trulux> herve: ;P
<trulux> herve: hmm, I got time to work on the gcc-3.4--hardened package
<trulux> herve: did the libssp package slook good to you?
<herve> I haven't reviewed it
<herve> you just gave me the gcc hardened diff.gz
<herve> and I missed the orig.tar.gz
<trulux> herve: ok,I'll send them again
<herve> trulux, failed
<trulux> herve: ...
<trulux> herve: done
<trulux> :)
<herve> now let's find the time
<herve> :-)
<trulux> herve: ok, is it working? have you applied the diff?
<herve> later this night
<trulux> herve: ok
<trulux> hey tritium
<herve> hi tritium
<tritium> hey trulux, herve
<trulux> tritium: what was that url for the university webcam?
<tritium> trulux, I'm not there today.
<tritium> Still want it?
<trulux> tritium: yes
<trulux> tritium: I've seen the sun rising over it until my screen got completely broken
<tritium> trulux, I was in the "Drawing Room": http://www.krannert.purdue.edu/info/home.asp yesterday
<tritium> trulux, this is outside my office (except that I'm on the 2nd floor): https://engineering.purdue.edu/ECN/WebCam/cam02
<trulux> tritium: btw, MacOS X 10.4 out
<tritium> yep
<tritium> trulux, so are you hoping that blonde girl will be there again today?  ;)
<trulux> tritium: not really ;D
<trulux> I will try if sometime I get there ;)
<tritium> try what, trulux ?
<trulux> to look beyond the camera
<trulux> *grin*
<tritium> heh
<trulux> fabbione: ping
<trulux> tritium: just scrolled around the tabs and that blond girl you were talking about seems back
* trulux grins
<tritium> trulux, is that right?
<herve> man! 50 million downloads of firefox
<tritium> Progeny Debian 3.0 has a graphical installer...
<tseng> its based on anaconda
<tseng> which is crack.
<tritium> yeah
<zul> hey tseng
<Burgundavia> tseng, what is so crackish about anaconda? I understand it is, but have never heard the full explanation
<tseng> Burgundavia: it has alot of bad python
<Burgundavia> ah
<tseng> and the gentoo fanboy making an anaconda installer
<tseng> he put his base tarballs in an rpm
<zul> lol
<tseng> im not sure if progeny made it grok deb or not
<trulux> tritium: yep
<trulux> tseng: hey
<tseng> Burgundavia: its pretty tied to redhat
<tseng> hi
<Burgundavia> ok
<trulux> tseng: I'm doing the portability job for the ssp kernel level helpers
<trulux> tseng: I have a job for you: find someone to test them
<trulux> I don't have the needed infrastructure
<trulux> nor time to check, I just believe they will work
<trulux> fabbione: I've ported the patch to alpha,ppc,ia64 and arm
<tseng> we arent targetting ssp
<tseng> and I still thing ssp in the kernel is crack
<tseng> ssp apps in a non-ssp glibc chroot isnt a compelling use case to me
<trulux> tseng: ... you're again wrong ...
<trulux> tseng: what about integration? what about having a weak reporting routine?
<trulux> I don't want to talk about it again, too much already said
<tseng> integration with?
<trulux> tseng: SELinux in the near future
<tseng> I must be too dumb for you.
<trulux> tseng: just I have a larger wide range of view, and some imagination for this job
<tseng> that sounds like a cool idea
<tseng> linking avc to it
<trulux> tseng: no, the audit framework
<trulux> that's what would rock
<tseng> sure
* trulux reveals his kernel domination project
<tseng> we really need a ssp implementation that is upstream-able
<trulux> yeah, I just suck on explaining what I do, most times people believe I'm a jerk that doesn't do anything, until I bomb out a good set of patches or send an out-dated mail to the list ;P
<trulux> tseng: I need someone to do the basic politics, I need some new volunteers
<trulux> I can't waste a lot of time doing excessive packaging
<tseng> excessive?
<tseng> i can think of < 10 packages you have
<tseng> anway yeah we set the agenda this week, SSP didnt make it
<zul> without packaging you have nothing concrete to show for
<tseng> so i wont be working on it this cycle
<trulux> zul: I was talking in other terms, currently we need a consistent base before doing any packaging, and that means doing upstream job
<tseng> there is plenty more to do with universe security, mono, maybe some selinux patching up.
<trulux> tseng: I agree, mono kid
<trulux> :)
<trulux> anyways, I've got 7 free days to mess with all of this stuff
<tseng> if you want to be more involved in ubuntu, you'll have to work closer to the rest of us instead of on your own numerous tagential paths
<tseng> if you want to go your own way, fine
<tseng> i cant help you get testing and devs for your "crack of the day" ssp stuff or selinux addons
<trulux> tseng: I agree, it's just that we gain momentum, thus, we have time to do the deployment and integration work
<trulux> tseng: so, how was the BOF, finally?
<trulux> tseng: I'm on the sysctl stuff
<tseng> which?
<tseng> cool
<trulux> tseng: SELinux
<tseng> it was mostly ajmitch and I
<trulux> tseng: *shrug*, I asked ajmitch to call him (phone) for talking on it
<tseng> we'll start looking at the patches and pushing them to maintainers
<trulux> but now it's too late
<trulux> ok, great
<trulux> the bugs are already in the bugzilla
<tseng> prolly from FC4
<trulux> I'm tracking FC4 selinux work
<trulux> le tme worry about it, you must be fresh and cool with the patches integration
<tseng> so about ssp, thats a regular thing you are pushing
<tseng> i dont think we are going to make any headway on it in ubuntu until something is maintained upstream
<tseng> not by etoh
<trulux> Etoh is not too fast at working on it, but he does it well
<tseng> thats fine.. we move gcc faster than etoh
<tseng> its not going to happen while that is the case
<trulux> I think I will focuse on my career the next months, improving some skills, I need money
<trulux> right
<trulux> bbl, dinner
<trulux> I'll be back in 15 minutes
<bur[n] er> now that java is in backports repository... could someone snag the azureus .deb from sid and put in universe??
<tseng> backports != ubuntu
<bur[n] er> well damn
<herve> what's the relation ship between backports and universe?
<tseng> we dont support and, and we arent going to add something based on a backport
<bur[n] er> maybe I should ask the backports folks :)
<herve> (relationship)
<bur[n] er> sorry tseng, my bad
<tseng> maybe you should all work on ubuntu :(
<tritium> tseng, what do you mean?
<bur[n] er> i didn't mean to cause any tension, just curious
<tseng> tritium: backports are evil, and people could study up a bit more on packaging and join MOTU, do something proactive
<tritium> bur[n] er, you didn't cause any tension
<herve> bur[n] er, but still, you could say "hello" when you come in :-)
<tseng> we are looking into doing java for breezy using GCJ
<bur[n] er> hello ;)
<herve> hi bur[n] er ;-)
<tritium> greetings, bur[n] er
<herve> tseng, the mess between gcj, classpath, each one's strenghts and weaknesses, is cleared out?
<bur[n] er> gcj == free right?
<herve> g = GNU, I hope so :-)
<tritium> I guess you could call it a right, and yes, it's free ;)
<mjr> free it is
<mjr> herve, in addition to those, there's at least swingwt, which might be useful as a more complete swing/awt implementation...
<mjr> (no, dunno about clearing out the messes)
<trulux> tseng: back
<trulux> 7 minutes, new record :)
<herve> mjr, that's my point, there's a constellation of free java alternatives, each one focusing on a issue
<mjr> yeah, just pointing out one major one
<trulux> tseng: could you tell me what exactly are the goals of the kernel patches proposed by the pro. sec. bof?
<tseng> trulux: its very clear on the wiki
<tseng> the biggest thing we want is the tmp race fix
<trulux> tseng: no, I mean, upstream submission
<tseng> upstream for that would be nice
<trulux> tseng: dilinger desires
<tseng> yes.
<trulux> tseng: ok, working on it
<tseng> dilinger talks to mm
* netjoined: irc.freenode.net -> tolkien.freenode.net
<trulux> tseng: ok, where do you think it should be (the sysctl entry)?
<tseng> no idea
<tseng> its 6am
<trulux> I won't add a new domain (ie. SECURITY=11)
<trulux> tseng: it's 22:00 here fater a long week, I'm suffering somewhat type of No-i-won't-sleep illness and I'm tired too
<trulux> but I'm the kid behind the sysctl interface being modified, who needs to know where to put the beatiful entry
<herve> I don't remember kids are playing with systcl :-)
<herve> but admitedly, I'm old-fashioned ;-)
<trulux> herve: then I'm a strange kid, anyways.... :)
<mjr> hmm, seems the classpath awt/swing is in better shape than I thought...
<trulux> fabbione: is mips support imperative? I need to work out tseng's stuff and I've rent a movie in the videostore, it's waiting in the table and I'm too sleepy to wait more for watching it
<trulux> ;)
<tseng> fabbione: we arent even build on mips afaik
<tseng> er, trulux
<\sh> evening gentlemen
<\sh> herve: ping
<herve> evening and pong, \sh
<\sh> herve: u read my comment to the eric3 bug?
<herve> either I replied to it, or you're talking about another one I did not have notifcation for
<\sh> herve: u said, that we should replace python qt and sip....well...I'm waiting for the new version of pyqt and pykde...there r some bugs in it and the upstream dev will fix it in 1 or 2 weeks..after this I will update the packages
<trulux> tseng: that's it, ok, thanks
<herve> \sh, ok, I don't even remember it :-) old comment?
<\sh> hehe...didn't read your new comment ;)
<\sh> the old one of yours ;)
<herve> I need to dive again into it
<herve> which I'm not able to do without having *slept* !
<\sh> ok..I'll make some dpatches tomorrow :)
<trulux> herve: why? take some oz of Offee
<\sh> just because i need sleep as well :)
<\sh> too many beers yesterday with our nagra consultans
<herve> trulux, oz? the wizard? :-) nah, just need to *sleep*!
<\sh> and I'm an old man ;)
<trulux> herve: no, 50oz of coffee: http://www.google.es/search?hl=es&q=50+oz+to+kg&btnG=BAsqueda+en+Google&meta=
<trulux> 50 ounces = 1.41747616 kilograms
<herve> it's based on the logarithm of kilograms?
<herve> just kidding :-)
<trulux> ok
<trulux> ;P
<herve> but sure 50 ounces of coffee will kill a man!
<\sh> not me ;)
<\sh> 1.4kg equals to 1.4l?
<trulux> no, it will cause him the same effect that most Gentoo devs suffer
<trulux> like being on too-much crack
* trulux hides from tseng 
<herve> \sh, depends on the density of the liquid you're considering
<\sh> then 1.4kg of coffee is 3l of coffee in our company..so I'm not dead u see :)
<trulux> herve: hah, that amount of coffee won't get disolved in just 1.4l
<trulux> :)
<\sh> finally, we have to discuss if we're talking about coffee powder, beans or ready to drink liquid coffee ;)
<trulux> \sh: hah
<\sh> c
<\sh> cause 3l of black liquid coffee is no problem for me
<herve> 3 l makes two regular bottles of mineral water...
<\sh> yepp
<\sh> herve: ask ogra how much coffee i'll drink during a 8 hours workday :)
<herve> I'm afraid to :-)
<\sh> heh
<\sh> ok...bedtime :)
<herve> good idea
<herve> yes it is, job can wait
<herve> bedtime too
<herve> night all!
<tritium> trulux, sorry, back now
<trulux> tritium: ok :) how was the work?
<tritium> trulux, it's just administrivia I'm dealing with this afternoon.
<sybren> hi there
<sybren> I was told I'd have to talk to you people if I wanted a package to be added to Universe
<sybren> I'd like to see the package 'mkvtoolnix' in Ubuntu. There is already a Debian package that's statically linked, I see
<sybren> One moment, I'll give that one a go and report back ;-)
<Treenaks> what is it?
<sybren> it's a toolkit for manipulating and creating Matroska files
<sybren> Ubuntu has already support for those files via (amongst others) Xine
<sybren> I thought it would be rather silly to have support for playing those files without being able to create them
<sybren> and since it's a 100% free container format, I thought it fitted Ubuntu quite well
<sybren> in case you don't know Matroska: it's an audio/video container format
<sybren> quite a tad better than OGM
<sybren> yep, the debian package works just fine
<sybren> anyone still here?
<\sh> yeah
<\sh> please add your package to https://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/UniverseCandidates
<dholbach> hellas!
<\sh> huhu dholbach
<\sh> dholbach: home sweet home
<dholbach> \sh: yes :-)
<\sh> dholbach: tired or no jetlag at all?
<dholbach> tired completely
<\sh> hehe
<dholbach> i think i will take a nap
<\sh> hey ogra
<ogra> hey
<\sh> ogra: nice to have u back where u belong :)
<ogra> hmm, i'm not really sure where is belong yet ;) jetlagging hard here
<ogra> s/is/i/
<bddebian> Hey folks
<bddebian> tritium: Hey, congratulations on figuring out why there are unpopped kernels of popcorn.. ;-P
<tritium> bddebian: hey there!  Say again?
<bddebian> tritium: http://www.indystar.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20050418/BUSINESS/504180327/1003
<tritium> Oh, okay.  heh ;)
<bddebian> :-)
<tritium> How's it going?
<bddebian> Shitty.  You?
<tritium> I'm okay.  What's the matter?
<bddebian> Work, life, Debian, you name it.. :-)
<tritium> Sorry to hear that, bddebian...
<herzi> dholbach: http://www.blaubeermuffin.de/packages/hula/svn202/
<bddebian> tritium: Bah, it's not that bad man, thanks.  I just like to whine. :-)
<bddebian> But I'm going to lose my NM status and I still can't decide if I care or not.. :-)
<tritium> bddebian: I'm trying to stay connected 24/7, using screen and irssi-text at home, so I can attach from my laptop wherever I'm at
<bddebian> Heh
<dholbach> herzi: can you put it on MOTUToReview? i seem to have to catch up with quite a load of things
<bddebian> And I thought I was an IRC addict.. ;-)
<tritium> bddebian: trying not to be...
<GheRivero> res
<herzi> dholbach: can't edit that page
<dholbach> herzi: hm?
<dholbach> wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTUToReview ?
<herzi> dholbach: www.ubuntu.com/wiki/MOTUToReview doesn't allow me to login, www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/... does
<jabra> for trying to build a package if I am getting dpkg-source: unrepresentable changes to source
<jabra> debuild: fatal error at line 764:
<jabra> dpkg-buildpackage failed!
<jabra> what should I do to fix that
<jabra> ?
<herve> houba!
<herve> heya daniel! oliver!
<tritium> Hi herve
<herve> michael too!
<herve> :-)
<tritium> :)
<bddebian> Hello herve
<bddebian> Betcha don't know my name.. ;-P
<herve> Barry?
<bddebian> Doh
<bddebian> Yes
<herve> heya barry!!
<herve> :-)
<bddebian> :-)
<bddebian> You didn't cheat and use /whois did you?? :-)
<herve> right click on your nickname, does it count?
<bddebian> Yep :)
* netjoined: irc.freenode.net -> orwell.freenode.net
<herve> i'll remember it for the next time then
<bddebian> No worries
<jabra> dpkg-source: debuild: fatal error at line 764: where is the file I need to look at or how should I go about fixing this
<jabra>                unrepresentable changes to source
<GheRivero> jabra, there should be some binary file that you didn't delete properly  or something similar
<jabra> ok cool thanks
<herve> or the "make clean" didn't delete
<herve> alternatively, you introduced a binary file, yes
<jabra> ok cool I wil try that and see if that fixes things
<jabra> ok everything looks like it worked but my key had errors
<jabra> gpg: [stdin] : clearsign failed: secret key not available
<jabra> debsign: gpg error occurred!  Aborting....
<jabra> debuild: fatal error at line 787:
<herve> do you have a GPG key?
<dholbach> hey herve
<dholbach> jabra: you seem to have not changed debian/changelog or don't have a gpg key
<herve> yes, not changing the changelog is harmful too :-)
<herve> there you see the master of the masters of the universe ;-)
<GheRivero> jabra, you can force the use of a gpg key with the -k option
<herve> or ignore it with --us --uc :-)
<jabra> ok I will check those
<jabra> if it is a new package what should be in the changelog?
<dholbach> you could use dh-make for a new package
<jabra> right
<jabra> that is wat I am using
<dholbach> or  dch   for debian/changelog in general
<herve> ho yes!
<herve> always use dch for changing the changelog!
<herve> dch -Dbreezy for ubuntu
<jabra> it just says initial release
<dholbach> emailadress and name alright?
<jabra> ya
<herve> jabra, you're making a new package?
<jabra> ya
<herve> ha!
<herve> different matter then :-)
<jabra> well this package isn't new , only new to ubuntu
<jabra> I will be making a new package soon for ubuntu
<herve> so there's an existing debian directory?
<jabra> ya
<herve> and you're not the actual maintainer?
<dholbach> jabra: you have a gpg key?
<jabra> yes
<jabra> wait it isn't the full name in the config
<jabra> can I change the name with from dh_make
<dholbach> i have these in .bashrc
<dholbach> export DEBFULLNAME='Daniel Holbach'
<dholbach> export DEBEMAIL='dh@mailempfang.de'
<jabra> o ok cool thanks
<dholbach> maybe you still need dh_make -e <email> or something
<jabra> ya but the name wasn't my full name whihc is probalby why it failed on the gpg key
<herve> yes it probably needs the name your gpg key is associated to
<jabra> ok done
<jabra> anyone wanta test radmind ?
<herve> not yet
<jabra> should I just post it to the wiki
<herve> jabra, you read the new maintainer's guide,
<herve> ?
<jabra> yes
<herve> so you should know you need to test your package by yourself at first :-)
<jabra> ya obviously
<herve> installing, removing, reinstalling, force installing, purging, reinstalling...
<herve> and it should fail a single time
<jabra> gotcha
<herve> should *not*
<herve> :-)
<jabra> right
<herve> hi matthias too :-)
<jabra> herve: aight I tested it
<herve> you mean it passed the test?
<jabra> ya it passed
<herve> good, while I'm waiting for trulux
<herve> I think I can review it
<herve> but be warned
<herve> I'm not easy :-)
<jabra> ok who is
<jabra> jk should I email it to you?
<herve> url
<jabra> k
<tritium_> trulux, how are things?
<jabra> herve: let me know wat I need to fix
<herve> jabra, I need the *source* package :-)
<jabra> ok
<jabra> so you want the .orig source or just the source
<dholbach> orig.tar.gz .dsc and .diff.gz
<jabra> k
<jabra> sorry for all the dumb questions
<dholbach> jabra: they're not dumb at all
<herve> ho yes
<herve> don't tell me you made a native package with no diff.gz :-)
<dholbach> herve: even if jabra had: that's how all of us started ;-)
<jabra> no there is a diff
<herve> ok I admit, I found it cool to write a software package debianizable from scratch
<bddebian> Hehe
<herve> but now I understand much more what I do
<herve> it's like doing xhtml, I understood a week ago why I and many others were doing it bad
<bddebian> Unless your ignorant like me.. :-)
<herve> unless the web is not your job :-)
<bddebian> Bah I know a lot of people who don't know shit about their "jobs".. :-)
<herve> ho don't tell me...
<jabra> dholbach: ok http://www.ccs.neu.edu/home/jabra/build/radmind.html
<jabra> let me know what I need to fix
<herve> well, now I'm thinking about all the crap I believed in and taugh... *fear*
<dholbach> jabra: could you please put it on: http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTUNewPackages
<jabra> ok
<herve> jabra, it's not a well formed html document :-p
<herve> I told you I'm not easy!
<dholbach> jabra: i have still a lot of stuff to do, so i will get back to it at some stage
<herve> no, kidding, that's not our matter
<jabra> heh ok
<jabra> herve: I will put in on the wiki that ok?
<jabra> that is well formed enough
<herve> dholbach, anyway, I think he should have asked, since I told him I'll review it :-)
<dholbach> i'll be happy to review it... but just not today :-)
<herve> hmm not really, it's serving html with an xhtml syntax
<dholbach> after 22h in the plane i feel a bit... shitty
<herve> ho no, let's not feed the troll :-)
<jabra> herve: what would you like me to do
<herve> jabra, I'll review you package
<jabra> ok cool thanks
<dholbach> me too
* jabra runs for cover
<herve> feel free to add an entry to the wiki meanwhile
<jabra> will do after I have to rebuild it
<Burgundavia> dholbach, seen this little tempest meets teapot? http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2005/05/msg00000.html
<jabra> herve: are you going to email me or pm me or something?
<jabra> also I have my public key off my main site just delete the word build  in the url
<herve> jabra, you active presence on the chan sure helps
<herve> your key isn't really usefull
<herve> I can't trust it
<dholbach> Burgundavia: i'm getting a headache
<herve> Burgundavia, I was about to write "well, write to Ubuntu instead of complaining on Debian lists, *this* will not feed the troll."
<Burgundavia> indeed
<herve> then the author of the pages an mdz answered
<jabra> herve: wat should I do about the key?
<herve> keep it warm
<herve> make it sign by others
<herve> so you enter the web of trust
<jabra> ok well I just created it recently so will you not review my package until I enter the web of trust and what do I need to do to get other to sign it . (like key sign party)
<ogra> jabra, you just gave the answer :)
<jabra> thought so
<ogra> jabra, meet a person you want to sign your key in person (doesnt necessarily need to be a signing party)
<jabra> I will get a bunch of my friends to have a key signing thing
<jabra> ok
<herve> jabra, that doesn't prevent me from reviewing your package
<ogra> ah, yes... the key is only needed for upload rights...
<herve> just that I cannot trust the identity of the person who did it
<herve> which I strictly don't care for now
<jabra> herve: ok cool thanks
<herve> ogra, glad to hear you :-)
<jabra> heh cool
<dholbach> see you tomorrow
<ogra> hey herve
<ogra> :)
<herve> bye dholbach
<jabra> I will have my key signed tomorrow
<herve> jabra, first thing
<herve> I saw you changed 3 files outside the debian/ dir
<herve> generally speaking, you should use dpatch for changes
<herve> (will I'll show you later)
<herve> but these are config.guess and config.sub
<herve> I guess it's an allowed exception
<herve> but about build-deps
<herve> if you changed it for your debian needs, it's a candidate for the dpatch system
<herve> otherwise, the fixed version should be in a new upstream tarball
<herve> jabra, you intend to see you package some day in the future?
<herve> or just ubuntu?
<herve> jabra, please remove .ex files
<herve> these are examples from dh-make to remove if not needed
<herve> debian/control is obviously not ready
<herve> debian/copyright almost worst :-)
<herve> please read debian/README.Debian :-)
<ogra> and use lintian ;)
<herve> that would have been my word of conclusion
<herve> you introduce a dependency on autotools-dev but don't declare it in your debian/control
<herve> in debian/rules, remove dh_* command in comment if you don't need them
<herve> and last but not least
<herve> install linda and lintian
<herve> rebuild your package
<encolpe> use linda
<jabra> ok
<herve> they will say more or less the same thing than me
<herve> thanks ogra and encolpe, my two padawans :-)
<jabra> heh
<encolpe> hehe
<jabra> can the description be longer than 60 chars?
<ajmitch> hi
<herve> hi ajmitch
<GheRivero> res
<herve> jabra, I think your debian/control is informative enough
<jabra> it says up to 60 chars
<jabra> the best I can do is like 90 ish
<herve> so you give too much information
<jabra> just wondering if anyone is going to complain about that
<herve> yes, me :-)
<ogra> and lintian :)
<herve> ogra, I'm worst than lintian! muhahaha!
<bddebian> ajmitch!!!
<herve> jabra, remember you have Debian's new maintainer's guide in your hands
<ogra> herve, but you both are not as imporant as elmo, who will just not accept it ;)
<herve> sure, but the package wouldn't have passed the herve workflow anyway ;)
<ogra> jabra, if you want elmo, herve or any other MOTU to accept a package, just make sure its lintian clean
<jabra> ok good to know
<ogra> herve, btw.... we should finally make you official ;)
<herve> ogra, no answer from elmo
<ogra> herve, he's jetlagging (like most of us)
<herve> clean as snow
<herve> I love snow
<herve> let it snow, let it snow, let it snoooooow
* herve hasn't taken his pills yet...
<ogra> heh
<herve> ogra, I was told he came back (from something else?) last monday, I was misinformed
<ogra> yep...
<ogra> i saw him yesterday leaving sydney
<herve> lucky you all, you were there :-/
<ogra> herve, currently it doesnt feel to good (just woke up from falling asleep over my keyboard)
<ogra> jetlag is evil
<herve> that's my little revenge! muhahaha!
<ogra> heh
* ajmitch has to go to work, will try & recover sleep there :)
<herve> anyway, daniel's postcard was nice
<herve> ajmitch, you're jetlagging too? :-)
<ajmitch> no
<ogra> heh
<ogra> hey ajmitch
<ajmitch> but I had to sleep in the airport on sunday night
<ajmitch> hi ogra
<herve> ajmitch, come on, go to work! :-p
* ajmitch goes to work
<jabra> ok obviosly this isn't ideal but package something that includes a shell script with no man page any thoughts?
<jabra> there are man pages for everything else but not this script
<herve> is this shell script a command accessible from the shell prompt?
<jabra> good questions I think so
<jabra> a man page will be included in the next version of the package
<herve> if so, this is a bug with regard to the debian policy
<jabra> right
<jabra> next version will include a man page but can it still be included despite not having the man page?
<herve> if there are other forms of help, probably
<herve> note it's not a policy violation, though
<herve> there a packages still in debian with serious bugs against them ;-)
<herve> night all!
<\sh> re guys
<\sh> oh I hate washing salons
<\sh> hmmm
<\sh> http://kitenet.net/~joey/blog/entry/debian_founder_not_allowed_on_planet_debian-2005-05-02-16-36
#ubuntu-motu 2005-05-11
<Unfrgiven> hey ogra :)
<ajmitch_> morning Unfrgiven
<tseng> hi
<Unfrgiven> morning ajmitch and tseng
<Unfrgiven> how are we today?
<tseng> tired.
<Unfrgiven> has anyone had a chance to review the packages i made by any chance? :)
<tseng> surely not
<Unfrgiven> tseng: did you work today?
<tseng> right now im listening to my roomate tell me about his "fuck friend"
<tseng> so
<tseng> s/listening/tuning out
<Unfrgiven> hehe
<tseng> oh and building muine pre2
<Burgundavia> lovely
<Unfrgiven> tseng: you managed to get quite a wrap from one of the bloggers on planet gentoo
<Unfrgiven> for your muine work
<tseng> Unfrgiven: oh did I?
* tseng looks
<Unfrgiven> tseng: someone called Joe McCann
<tseng> oh
<tseng> he's my boy
<Unfrgiven> wow you seemed quite young to have a child...
<Unfrgiven> ;)
<ajmitch_> hey tseng
<tseng> hi
<tseng> Unfrgiven: hah, he called me "the awesome"
<Unfrgiven> tseng: :)
<tseng> Unfrgiven: i used to work on gentoo
<Unfrgiven> tseng: yeah i got that impression... why'd you stop?
<ajmitch_> tseng: btw what mono crack do I still need to upload?
<tseng> Unfrgiven: because their toolchain and alot of devs got more crackful than we're known for
<tseng> ajmitch_: um
<tseng> ajmitch_: a bunch
<ajmitch_> gecko-sharp2, monodoc, gtk-sharp - what else do you need done?
<ajmitch_> and a fixed mono
<Unfrgiven> tseng: i was thinking though that the ebuild shell concept sounds pretty neat... should help writing those complex ebuilds
<tseng> Unfrgiven: its a fun system, just crappy QA and politics
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch_: wasnt there a list from the mono Bof?
<tseng> i liked working on it when it was smaller
<tseng> it was about the same size of ubuntu, very new and friendly community
<tseng> oh well
<Unfrgiven> i must say that im VERY impressed with the ubuntu community
<Unfrgiven> i do hope it stays that way
<tseng> indeed
<tseng> ajmitch_: yeah those
<tseng> ajmitch_: um
<tseng> whatever is in my ~/mono is ready atm
<tseng> i updated it last night
<tseng> could you please do those?
<Unfrgiven> btw, did you guys receive signed keys in your email from lamont jones and bjorn tillenius? i cant seem to import them
<tseng> ive not touched gpg yet
<tseng> but i have them in my inbox
<Unfrgiven> i managed to import most of them except ones from those two...
<ajmitch_> sure, I'll grab those, sign & upload
<tseng> rock on
<tseng> i can do the rest after that
<ajmitch_> Unfrgiven: I could import from bjornT
<tseng> hm
<tseng> i cant build gtkspell
<ajmitch_> tseng: gtk-sharp-unstable is built as a native package
<tseng> um
<tseng> yeah
<tseng> meebey fucked that up in svn i think
<tseng> it imported the sources
<tseng> ajmitch_: you see what i mean? or im crack
<Unfrgiven> ajmitch_: hmmm yeah its working now... i musta botched somethin ealierl
<Unfrgiven> aight guys im gonna get back to work... ill catch up with y'all later
<tseng> bye.
<tseng> ajmitch_: howd that go?
<Nafallo> night all!
<ajmitch_> morning AndyFitz
<ajmitch_> tseng: just uploading them now
<AndyFitz> morning ajmitch
<AndyFitz> how you going mate ?
<ajmitch_> I'm managing alright
<ajmitch_> how about you?
<AndyFitz> yeah really well. came down from the sugar high yesterday lol  damn those mentos
<ajmitch_> yeah they got a bit addictive
<AndyFitz> its funny how they picked up on what people were drinking more of .    by the end of the week they stocked almost only redbull pepsi and water
<ajmitch_> and I'm glad of that
<ajmitch_> how's the art coming along?
<AndyFitz> yeah good,  I'm pretty happy with the style,    I've changed the folders back to the normal rotation since this screenshot http://andy.fitzsimon.com.au/screenshot-1.png
<AndyFitz> right now it looks ugly without using a custom clearlooks gtkrc    ( because I'm using 22x22 instead of 24x24 )
<ajmitch_> still trying to load, it's great to be back in NZ :)
<AndyFitz> but jeff is writing a script to increase the margin around the borders to 24x24  so we can test it at both sizes
<ajmitch_> looks good
<AndyFitz> thanks :-)  after doing a few more icons I'll write a short styleguide and start visiting the uni's asking for help from keen illustrators
<tseng> AndyFitz: rock out
<tseng> ajmitch_: rock out
* ajmitch_ hasn't done gtk-sharp2-unstable just yet. is there an upstream tarball that can be used with it?
<tseng> yes
<tseng> http://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php?group_id=40240
<ajmitch> what changes are there from the version in debian (1.9.3-1)?
<tseng> none
<ajmitch> I'll grab hat then
<ajmitch> uploaded
<tseng> rock out dude
<ajmitch> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch!  What's happening?
<ajmitch> hopefully it'll hit the changes list real soon now
<ajmitch> bddebian: just uploading some packages in my lunch break
<bddebian> Nice
<ajmitch> & fixing some of my own
<bddebian> Damnit, I need to do some DNS queries but nslookup keeps getting "query refused".. :-(
<ajmitch> lunch break over, bbl
<bddebian> Later d00d
* ajmitch_ hasn't seen the packages on the changes list yet.. got any rejection letters, tseng ?
<tseng> um
<tseng> yes
<tseng> Subject: gtk-sharp2-unstable_1.9.3-1ubuntu1_source.changes is NEW
<ajmitch_> as expected
<tseng> Subject: gtk-sharp_1.0.8-1ubuntu1_source.changes REJECTED
<tseng> Rejected: The key (0x8A5A6772D0DC9743) used to sign gtk-sharp_1.0.8-1ubuntu1.dsc wasn't found in the keyring(s).
<ajmitch_> crap
<tseng> for the rest
<tseng> and
<ajmitch_> I was sure I re-signed that
<tseng> gecko-sharp still thinks its NEW
<tseng> er
<tseng> experimental
<tseng> thats my bad
<ajmitch_> gecko-sharp has breezy in the changes file
<ajmitch_> gecko-sharp2 needs fixed, will check
<bddebian> FUCKING THINKPAD...
<tseng> so lamonts key stuff
<tseng> isnt actually your encrypted key, its text
<ajmitch_> yeah, and he says that the key is attached
<tseng> yes
<ajmitch_> when it's not
<tseng> right.
<ajmitch_> bug him in -devel
<ajmitch_> gecko-sharp2 fixed up & ready for upload
<tseng> the rest say
<tseng> bad sign and bad md5
<ajmitch_> that's crack
<tseng> yes
<ajmitch_> I just verified the signature on them
<tseng> well, i think it is checking the ones from the other day
<tseng> in incoming
<tseng> that got rejected?
<tseng> maybe.
<ajmitch_> could do
<ajmitch_> tseng: btw, seen the latest mail on the u-hardened list?
<tseng> no
<tseng> mdz?
<ajmitch_> trulux is unhappy with the UDU results
<tseng> no shit
<tseng> what a toolbat
<tseng> uh dude
<tritium> ajmitch_: are you referring to his first email, or the latest one he sent a few hours ago?
<tseng> both are pretty crackful
<tritium> I wouldn't know...
<ajmitch_> mostly the first one, I haven't checked since
* ajmitch_ reads the followup
<tritium> I'm not familiar with the work being done, but I hope the issues, whatever they are, can be resolved.
<dholbach> morning
<tritium> Hi Daniel :)
<ajmitch_> hey dholbach
<dholbach> hey you two
<ajmitch_> how was your trip?
<dholbach> i could have done with a bit more of sleep, but it was ok
<schweeb> wassup dholbach
<dholbach> today i woke up at 04:00, but i think there's nothing wrong, with getting up early, right? ;-)
<dholbach> how are you three guys?
<schweeb> Solaris = pain
<schweeb> that's how I am :)
* dholbach comforts schweeb a bit
<schweeb> I miss working in Linux all day long
* schweeb pouts
<tritium> dissertation = pain
<dholbach> tritium: next 12 weeks will be thesis weeks, so i will share your pain
<schweeb> heh
<tritium> dholbach: yes, same for me.  I defend on July 22.  You?
<schweeb> I managed to skip out of my thesis, hehe
<schweeb> was just about time to start work on it
<tritium> how'd you manage that?
<dholbach> tritium: i'll have 12 weeks
<schweeb> tritium: put school on hold for my new job
<tritium> dholbach: it'll be nice being in the same boat :)
<tritium> schweeb: Ah, gotcha.
<schweeb> hopefully, I can figure out how to balance school and work eventually... kinda wanna get my degree
<tritium> schweeb: go for it!
<schweeb> school and I don't get along too well though :)
<tritium> Me too.  We're about to break up.
* ajmitch_ checks the MOTUTodo page for something to do
<tseng> uh
<tseng> wow
<dholbach> hey tseng
<ajmitch_> ?
<tseng> hi dholbach
<tseng> ajmitch_: declaration quote
<tseng> ajmitch_: im writing a reply btw, this is unacceptable to me
<jabra> anyone know if there is any sites that can help someone with warning from lintian
<charles> yay nigger masters of the universe!!!!!
<charles> niggers are ubuntu!
* mode/#ubuntu-motu [+o dholbach]  by ChanServ
* mode/#ubuntu-motu [+b *!*fiendofmi@*.indstr01.fl.comcast.net]  by dholbach
* charles was kicked off #ubuntu-motu by dholbach (dholbach)
<schweeb> nice work, dholbach
<ajmitch_> thanks daniel
* mode/#ubuntu-motu [-o dholbach]  by dholbach
<tseng> :(
<crimsun> they always troll the good distros, heh
<jabra> anyone know where I could find something about warnings I am getting from lintian
<schweeb> the Debian Policy Manual
<schweeb> generally
<crimsun> 1) please use lintian -v; 2) http://www.debian.org/doc/maint-guide/ch-checkit.en.html#s-lintians
<crimsun> http://lintian.debian.org/ is also a good web site
<jabra> cool thanks
<jabra> probably man lintian and rtfm
<jabra> heh
<jabra> ah -i is great
<jabra> is anyone around to review a new package?
<jabra> dholbach: are you around?
<dholbach> jabra: yes, i am around
<jabra> ok do you have a few minutes to review this package
<dholbach> not atm
<dholbach> but later
<jabra> ok should I just put the link on the wiki
<dholbach> that would be perfect
<jabra> o ok cool
<jabra> one thing that I noted on the site that there is a shell script that is included that doesn't have man pages
<jabra> I hope that doesn't rule this out as a package
<jabra> what I did was emailed the developer list to see if I could get a release of the man page early since it will be included in the next version
<dholbach> you could write one yourself, i always use the manpage.xml template copied by dh_make
<jabra> umm thinking pod2man?
<jabra> does it have to have a man page?
<dholbach> if the user is supposed to use it
<jabra> so then I have to write one
<dholbach> just briefly describing what it is for
<jabra> ok
<jabra> it can be brief but it does need to exist
<jabra> ok I will
<dholbach> the .xml file is readable and with a fancy   xsltproc   command you can convert it to a manpage
<jabra> is pod2man ok
<dholbach> (you can read it all in comments in the manpage.xml file)
<jabra> that is wat I have used
<dholbach> never used it
<dholbach> if it works for you, use it :-)
<jabra> probably the same thing
<jabra> k
<dholbach> yes... probably :-)
<jabra> perl module to convert basic format similiar to html to a man page
<dholbach> ah ok
<jabra> seperate issue if I wanta package something that is just a shell script with a man page how could I do that since it isn't compiled
<womble> jabra: Have the package build scripts just copy the script into the appropriate place in the package build dir
<jabra> right where would I set that dir since there is no makefile
<womble> jabra: Your debian/rules file should have something in it to create either a debian/tmp or debian/<pkg> directory, and probably relevant dirs inside that (like /usr/bin).  Stick the copy somewhere after that.
<jabra> ok cool
<jabra> thanks
<dholbach> hey Riddell
<jabra> dholbach: almost done with the man page
<Riddell> hello dholbach
<Riddell> everyone back where they belong?
<dholbach> Riddell: seems to :-)
<ajmitch> hi Riddell
* ajmitch is just having fun breaking his box
<ajmitch> currently installing kde 3.4 from breezy :)
<crimsun> you might need http://moba.linuxfaqs.de/kdelibs-debug.sh
<ajmitch> thanks crimsun
* crimsun wonders at a segfault on amd64 in libtool
<Mithrandir> I doubt that ; libtool is a shell script. :)
<crimsun> that's why I'm wondering
<crimsun> s/wonder/boggl/
<jabra> not sure wat file I should change to add in a man page to build this package it is in the man dir named ra.sh.1
<jabra> ?
<jabra> ls
<jabra> oops
<dholbach> hey koke
<koke> hey!
<koke> how was the flight?
<dholbach> ok... but could have done with a bit more of sleep :-)
<koke> :d
<dholbach> how was yours?
<jabra> dholbach: ok got it with a new man page
<dholbach> excellent!
<jabra> ya
<jabra> I want this to be done
<jabra> can ya tell?
<jabra> I will put it on the wiki with a url
<koke> dholbach: long enough :D
<jabra> whenever you have sometime I would appreciate it if you review it
<dholbach> jabra: i can absolutely understand that you're eager to get it in ASAP, but i must ask you to be patient
<jabra> no problem
<dholbach> ok, even better
<ajmitch> we're still recovering from the week :)
* ajmitch is breaking his box
<jabra> ya I heard you guys had the first MOTU meeting like march 3rd?
<ajmitch_> some of us just met in sydney
<jabra> this weekend?
* dholbach got home yesterday
<jabra> damn
<koke> lamont: there was no key in your "keysigning result" message
<lamont> koke: you and several others.  otoh, several _did_ have the sig... sigh.
* lamont needs to argue with the script, and maybe even send out another round... sigh.
<lamont> doesn't help that I can't read the contents of the messages... :-(
<koke> hey all, what scripts are you are using?? (it's my first party)
<dholbach> koke: i use the one pitti's page
<koke> dholbach: what page ?? :D
<ajmitch_> look on the wiki, he put it on the keysigning page iirc
<dholbach> piware.de
<jabra> dholbach: thanks for your help
<jabra> I really appreciate it
<jabra> the wiki has be updated
<dholbach> koke: http://www.piware.de/tools/signkey.pl
<dholbach> you just have to add your keyid into it and your set
<dholbach> s/your/you're
<dholbach> jabra: anytime :-)
<jabra> I will get my key signed tomorrow
<dholbach> ROCK
<jabra> I have to say you guys make this distro 100 times better than fedora
<jabra> since I have been using redhat distro since 6.2
<jabra> I really think ubuntu is soo much better in all aspects
<dholbach> jabra: it's great you want to help out
<dholbach> i think with a big MOTU crew and loads of teams ubuntu we will get even better
<p0m> Darn, all the python stuff has been fixed allready :)
<jabra> well you guys make it easier than fedora for someone to help out
<dholbach> p0m: the next step will be the zope modules, right ajmitch?
<jabra>  the thing I am going to on next is the wireless tool I have been working on
<p0m> Hmm, I'll have a look into that. Ohh, and hi :)
<jabra> it joins wireless networks based on a precedence in a config file similair to windows
<jabra> it is a shell script since I wanted it to be able to run on anything
<jabra> going to add in wep and wpa next week after I make a bit more stable
<jabra> /s/a/it/g
<p0m> Hmm.
<p0m> I've eyed up a couple of packages I think I can fix.
<GheRivero> res
<dholbach> p0m: wiki.ubuntu.com/UniverCxxTransition :-)
<p0m> Err?
<dholbach> yes
<p0m> There doesn't seem to be a UniverCxxTransition page
<dholbach> UniverseCxxTransition
<dholbach> sorry
* p0m looks
* Mithrandir read a "sexx" in there.  I must be tired.
<dholbach> i'll grab another coffee :-)
<p0m> That list takes a while to load :)
<jabra> anyone know if there is a BostonTeam ?
<jabra> don't see it on the wiki
<p0m> Boston or Boson?
<jabra> boston
<p0m> dholbach: Is it just me, or are these mainly amd64 items?
<ajmitch> p0m: dholbach has an amd64 :)
<p0m> Ahh.
<p0m> Lucky.
* ajmitch just ran into some missing python2.4 transitions when crossgrading to breezy from sid
<p0m> I might go through and check some of the python packages that don't need transitioning.
<chmj> morning
<crimsun> morning!
<GheRivero> morning
<koke> dholbach: I've just signed your key
<koke> tell me if it's all ok and I'll sign the others :D
<dholbach> koke: was alright
<dholbach> could we agree on a date for an irc meeting with the malone guys
<dholbach> something around may, 11th?
<chmj> hi dholbach
<dholbach> hey chmj
<chmj> dholbach: mind you my time is 9:00 - 17:00 GTM +2
<koke> dholbach: it's ok for me
<koke> I'll try to test malone more :D
<dholbach> what do the guys from .us and .au/.nz say?
<dholbach> i don't mind getting up early
<crimsun> 11th? Hmm. Anytime's good.
* mode/#ubuntu-motu [+o lamont]  by ChanServ
* mode/#ubuntu-motu [-o lamont]  by lamont
<ajmitch> rock, gtk-sharp2-unstable acceepted
<ogra> YAY
<dholbach> NEW mono crack?
<ajmitch> yeah
* ogra feels amd64 mono love coming along
<ajmitch> been working on this stuff with tseng since UDU
<ajmitch> since his key isn't in the keyring still
<ajmitch> and I like mono stuff for some reason :)
<dholbach> :-)
<crimsun> man, _none_ of the packages I've worked on in the past week have built on amd64
* ajmitch is partway through a sid->breezy crossgrade
* crimsun weeps
<ajmitch> there's some substantial pain involved here ;)
* dholbach comforts crimsun a bit
* ajmitch collects more gpg sigs
<dholbach> does malone work for everyone of you? did you all set a "preferred mail adress"?
<dholbach> could you please play with it? (open new bugs, re-assign them, ...) and add stuff to http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MaloneUniverseWishList ?
<ajmitch> I've set preferred mail, but not played with it much yet
<dholbach> malone will be used also for main in 7-8 weeks
<ajmitch> I've got a pile of bugs to file, I think
<tseng> ajmitch_: mm we need to start the gnomedb fixing
<tseng> whos package is that
<tseng> ohhh
<dholbach> gnome team :-)
<tseng> However the following packages replace it:
<tseng>   libgnomedb2-common
<tseng> just need to fix build-dep I guess
<dholbach> tseng: could you tell seb128? i recall him fixing something in the last days
<tseng> dholbach: no, its in my package
<dholbach> ah ok
<tseng> ill fix it tonight
<tseng> i need to get to work now
<tseng> an hour late
<tseng> stupid lag
* ajmitch_ has a wonderfully broken box now ;)
<dholbach> MOTUNewPackages got really full
<tseng> :(
<tseng> i am getting security notices from pitti now also
<dholbach> MOTUToReview as well
<ajmitch_> we've also got a lot of merging to do - I'm going to write up something to streamline that
<tseng> i need to build a hoary chroot
<ajmitch_> hopefully by the end of the week
<tseng> i might get on from work for a few minutes.. cya
<ajmitch_> ok, have a good day tseng
<\sh> i have a couple of bugfixed packages left
<\sh> to review and upload
* mode/#ubuntu-motu [+o dholbach]  by ChanServ
* mode/#ubuntu-motu [-b *!*fiendofmi@*.indstr01.fl.comcast.net]  by dholbach
* mode/#ubuntu-motu [-o dholbach]  by dholbach
<tritium_> Good morning.
<bddebian> Morning folks
<tritium_> good morning bddebian
<Nafallo> morning :-)
<bddebian> Hello tritium_, Nafallo
<jabra_> gmorning
<Nafallo> jabra_, good afternoon :-)
<jabra_> true
<jabra> to get someone to review your package it should be on the MOTUToReview site correct
<tritium> yep
<zul> heylo
<trukulo> hello, do you admit guests ? :)
<Nafallo> hi trukulo :-).
<trukulo> hi nafallo
<trukulo> ubuntu-dev is very quiet lastly
<trukulo> and #ubuntu is... well, always has been very boring
<Nafallo> trukulo: sometimes :-). then something happens and they discuss away.
<trukulo> i have one question
<trukulo> specially to ogra
<trukulo> graveman 0.3.10-1 is in universe
<trukulo> but this package has bugs, good one in sid es graveman 0.3.10-2
<trukulo> you will wait to breeze to update it?
* bur[n] er waits on the edge of his seat to find out... then realizes he uses gnomebaker ;)
<trukulo> :)
<trukulo> well, we have many options, that's the good thing
<bur[n] er> for sure
<bur[n] er> graveman looks better in xfce ;)
<trukulo> i ask because im co-mantainer of package in debian
<trukulo> and talked about this package a lot with oliver, that intend to package at first on universe
* bur[n] er has no authority to answer
<trukulo> well, it's just curiosity
<bur[n] er> i would imagine it would get in universe for breezy unless it's security related
<trukulo> it's not security
<ogra> trukulo, then we cant update it for hoary, sorry
<trukulo> ogra: no, don't sorry for it, just asking :)
<herve> houba!
<omglol> who knows how to ssh over https
<omglol> oh man my friends irc script sucks
<tritium> tseng|work: busy?
<tseng|work> well, I cant do much but http
<tseng|work> I can talk.
<tritium> It's just that trulux called a meeting in #ubuntu-hardened, and I thought you might want to be there if you can.  It's been going on for a while.
<tseng|work> is it more flamebait?
<tritium> No, just a working meeting.
<tseng|work> we seem to be having a misunderstanding about breaking the desktop vs being as secure as possible
<tseng|work> ill come if he invites me.
<trulux> tseng|work: sorry, I agree with you. I've been trying to break my desktop for being more secure, mostly breaking my CRT screen ir order to avoid undesired viewing of my porn
<tseng|work> hah :P
<trulux> tseng|work: I invited all people, feel free to join only if you don't want to feed a personal flame
<tseng|work> sure.
<trulux> we can solve the problem if it's something personal but don't take it to the lists nor the IRC channels, feel free to call me if you want, I'll setup skype for my hot line
<tseng|work> yeah i thought most of your email was something against me that didnt really come out as strongly on irc before
<tseng|work> I already responded, no hard feelings here, dropping ssp isnt about you, its about maintainance
<trulux> tseng|work: also, don't forget that I wanted to work with you since the start, so, it's always better to look beyond the red line, maybe there's something wrong that happened to make things going bad
<trulux> and well, you know as others do, that Im 'not someone that gets upset for no good reason
<tseng|work> rock on.
<trulux> tseng|work: remember: you, as well as others, have rights to propose, suggest and recommend for the RFC, before the spec. is written
<herve> in case you care, sarge is frozen!
<tseng|work> hm
<herve> and planned to be release on may, 30th
<herve> end of the month, roughly
<Nafallo> what I wonder is what the first planned date was ;-)
<herve> no, let's not kick them
<herve> we're part of the same family
<Nafallo> agreed. but the delay was one of the main reasons I switched all my computers to ubuntu :-).
<Nafallo> no assault intended :-)
<herve> yeah, I won't react :-)
<herve> I can understand
<herve> like I can understand the debian project suffered
<Nafallo> same. another reason was all the internal fights that went on all the time.
<Nafallo> I would think many of the problems with sarge won't happen with etch though.
<herve> the human problems? hard to say :-)
<Nafallo> hehe. I was thinking about all the other problems with that notation ;-)
<GheRivero> res
<herve> night all
<tseng> hi
#ubuntu-motu 2005-05-12
<jabra> anyone able to review a package
<jabra> that has some time now?
<tseng> put it on MOTUTodo please
<jabra> well it is on https://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/MOTUToReview
<tseng> yes
<tseng> great.
<jabra> tseng: could you review it? my package is radmind
<tseng> is there a reason you put yours ahead of everyone elses
<jabra> no I figured that it should be added to the top of the list ?
<tseng> they are ordered by date
<jabra> or should it be the bottom?
<jabra> o ok then let me fix it then
<tseng> first thing to fix, you dont need to patch the makefile to install a manpage
<tseng> you can use debian/manpages from debhelper
<tseng> if you do want to patch files in the future, use dpatch, changes in diff.gz should only be for debian/
<jabra> ok
<tseng> likewise the manpage should be in debian/
<tseng> until its merged upstream
<tseng> you should definately not have stuff in there for config.sub
<tseng> and all that autotools crud
<tseng> 80% of your diff.gz is extraneous crap, did you not make clean at some point?
<tseng> anyway make the fixes I said, and cp debian/ into a clean source tree
<tseng> and rebuild the package
<jabra> ok
<tseng> off to walk the dog.
<jabra> I def didn't cp the debian/
<tseng> no
<tseng> thats what you have to do to remove this crap
<jabra> o ok that is easy enough
<tseng> unpack the tarball fresh and cp debian
<tseng> to get a clean diff
<jabra> o ok cool so start from scratch with my tweaks in debian/
<jabra> that will fix all the problems?
<tseng> yes
<tseng> well, this problem
<jabra> cool so are you going to be around later
<tseng> your build-depends looks awfully short, no idea if its acurate
<tseng> maybe.
<jabra> ok I will ping you
<tseng> ping the channel.
<jabra> should be done after I get home
<jabra> k
<jabra> tseng: ok I repackaged it and add the manpage properly
<jabra> let me know what else if anything I need to fix
<tseng> you need 2 other people to look at it
<jabra> 2 other people? don't I need 3 for new packages and 1 for already build packages
<tseng> jabra: yes? 1 + 2 = 3
<jabra> maybe I misunderstood
<jabra> but it looks acceptable to you?
<tseng> I gave you my comments, go to your next person
<tseng> im so tired
<jabra> thanks
<ajmitch_> gah, already bugs in malone asking for mono apps to be built for amd64 now
<tseng> um
<tseng> annoying
<jabra> anyone know how good the support for the alpha is for ubuntu
<mjr> jabra, umm, nonexistant?
<tseng> there is none
<jabra> thought there was but it was  unofficial
<tseng> if you can confuse alpha with sparc or ia64
<jabra> no
<tseng> yes
<jabra> maybe
<jabra> no I had definatly had read that alpha was unoffically supported
<jabra> wait it was sparc
<tseng> sigh.
<jabra> nm
* netjoined: irc.freenode.net -> orwell.freenode.net
<GheRivero> res
<p0m> Helllo netsplit.
<Treenaks_> p0m: freenode is worse than darker sometimes ;)
<p0m> Treenaks_: To be honest, I'd say darker's stabler ;)
<Nafallo> morning all
<GheRivero> res
<\sh> morning guys
<emmanuel> Hi.
<emmanuel> How do we report a bug against an universe package ?
<\sh> malone
<tritium_> emmanuel, https://launchpad.ubuntu.com/malone
<emmanuel> Ok. Thanks.
<tritium_> Hi tseng|work
<tseng|work> hi tritium, ogra
<ogra> hey tseng|work
<tritium_> hi ogra
<Mithrandir> hi tseng, ogra, tritium_
<tritium_> Hello, Mithrandir :)
<tseng|work> hi :D
<tseng|work> how is your firefox
<Mithrandir> he's fine.  Got a keyring and all
<Mithrandir> and he's Karianne's, not mine, really
<tseng|work> of course
<ogra> hmm, no libgtk-cil on amd64 yet....
<tseng|work> libgtk-cil was reject
<tseng|work> libgtk2-cil ftbfs for now
<tseng|work> needs libgda transition
<tseng|work> i went in the keyring this morning, so ill try and get the rejected stuff fixed
<tseng|work> it got wonky when aj tried to resign it
<tseng|work> ogra: most of the stuff is arch all or any, just needs a quick repack
<tseng|work> what happens when you try to install it?
<ogra> yeah, that what i thought
<tseng|work> it used to fail on no mono-jit or mono-mint available
<tseng|work> what happens now?
<ogra> E: Package libgtk-cil has no installation candidate
<tseng|work> huh
<ogra> Package libgtk-cil is not available, but is referred to by another package.
<tseng|work> ok, we'll see what happens on the next build, since mono is installable on the buildd now
<tseng|work> can you install.. libgecko2-cil ?
<ogra> E: Couldn't find package libgecko2-cil
<ogra> not yet....
<ogra> but there is already a lot of mono stuff in the archive
<tseng|work> yes
<tseng|work> bwar gecko has the libgda problem also
<ogra> so i'll wait in patience .... or help testing where i can
<tseng|work> thanks dude
<thully> hi - is this where I request packages for breezy's universe/multiverse?
<zul> hey ogra
<ogra> hi zul
<thully> hi - where do I request additions to universe/multiverse?  I'm interested in some extra gstreamer plugins/some apps compiled with AAC support
<ogra> thully, UniverseCandidates on the wiki for now
<thully> OK - I'm unable to package them (in fact I'm running Hoary now for stability purposes) but I'd like to see them in the next release if possible
<thully> also - is that for multiverse as well?
<ogra> depends on the license, i'm not sure about AAC
<ogra> yep
<thully> I think AAC must be OK, since faad and faac are already in multiverse
<thully> Just not the gstreamer plugins - same with lame
<ogra> ah, ok....just put it on the wikipage
<thully> I guess the gstreamer stuff is already up there (I think I requested it a long time ago, and it somehow made it up there) - I'll just add gtkpod-aac up there
<thully> Also, do you think pymusique is reasonable for multiverse, or is there too many problems with that (issues with the iTunes EULA mostly)
<ogra> hmm, no idea...
<ogra> ...probably something to ask a lawyer about
<thully> OK - never mind with that one
<thully> maybe I'll put it up there and note any possible issues with packaging it
<tritium_> thully, you'll have to sing the Ohio State fight song before we package it ;)
<tritium_> nah, just kidding :)
<abelli> ciao
<abelli> ogra: ding
<ivoks> hi
<GheRivero> res
<ivoks> i have three packages for universe if that's ok?
<ivoks> quodlibet, quodlibet-ext and python-flac
<ivoks> quodlibet is music player, something like rhythmbox
<ivoks> http://master.grad.hr/~ivoks/ubuntu is URL if anyone interested
<ogra> ivoks, put it on the wiki please... on the "to review" page
<ivoks> ok
<ivoks> ok, bye guys...
<Mithrandir> tseng: hm, how's beagle coming along?
<bddebian> Hello
<tritium_> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Howdy tritium_!  How are you today?
<tritium_> Pretty good, thanks.  How about you, bddebian ?
<abelli> ciao
<abelli> ogra: re-ding, im sorry.
<bddebian> tritium_: Not too bad, thanks
<tritium_> Good.
<jon1012> helllo
<jon1012> I'm an applicatio developper, and would like to find someone kind enough to package my app for ubuntu :)
<jon1012> I'm the Appliworks (http://appliworks.jondesign.net) maintainer
<bddebian> Hello jon1012
<jon1012> hi bddebian
<jon1012> bddebian: do you know someone who can be interested in doing it ?
<hunger> Is there any best practice on when to use which log_* in the start/stop scripts?
<bddebian> jon1012: I would say I would eventually but I am not an MOTU "yet" and I'm bogged at my "real" job right now.. :-(
<jon1012> bddebian: maybe you can do package some day and ask someone to include them in universe ?
<jon1012> bddebian: it's not urgent at all
<jon1012> bddebian: it's just that a lot of users have ubuntu... and having them recompile it is really a pain :(
* hunger is not a MOTU either, but wonders what that app actually does.
<jon1012> hunger: http://www.gnomefiles.org/app.php?soft_id=836
<hunger> Oh... its gnome:-(
<jon1012> yeah gnome
* hunger does not have gtk.
<jon1012> everything with gnome-vfs (net transparent), and DND, and bonobo lol...
<ogra> jon1012, put it on the UniverseCandidates wikipage
<ogra> abelli, dong ?
<abelli> ogra: bonne jour mon ami.
<bddebian> ogra: hehe
<abelli> ogra: how is life? how was udu?
<jon1012> ogra: tu es francais ?
<ogra> jon1012, non
<hunger> How can I find out who maintains a deb in universe?
<jon1012> abelli: you have to say "bonjour mon ami" ;)
<ogra> jon1012, je suis allemand
<jon1012> ogra: oh ok
<jon1012> ogra: what are the universecandidates wiki pages ?
<abelli> jon1012: ou la la.
<jon1012> ogra: I don't use ubuntu anymore
<abelli> ogra: have you received those bothering emails by me?
<ogra> abelli, udu was heavy work .... mataro was a boy scout camp in comparison
<abelli> jon1012: bad ..
<abelli> ogra: grrr :)
<jon1012> abelli: I'm a member of the foresight linux team ;)
<ogra> jon1012, http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/UniverseCandidates
<abelli> ogra: cmon dude, mataro was special .. i was there.
<jon1012> abelli: but a lot of users have ubuntu, so I ask for an ubuntu package for appliworks lol
<jon1012> ogra: thanks :)
<ogra> abelli, but not as much work at all....
<Nafallo> ogra: and the picture with you and mvo in the pool? ;-)
<abelli> ok ill be back in 15 minutes ..
<abelli> ogra: did you check ubm, ubuntu boot manager?
* Nafallo is jealous on both the work and the pool, he might add :-)
<ogra> Nafallo, that was the first day...
<jon1012> ogra: I don't have an account on the ubuntu wiki, could you add it ? (I would be very happy if you could :))
<ogra> jon1012, ok, i put it on my todo list
<jon1012> ogra: thank you really much
<Nafallo> ogra: I'm still jealous :-P
* jon1012 is not an ubuntu guy anymore lol
<jon1012> (even if ubuntu is nice)
<ogra> jon1012, why did you drop it ?
<jon1012> (but apt-get beurk, conary is really better)
<jon1012> bwah, I'm a Foresight Desktop Linux guy...
<jon1012> I work a lot on this distro now :)
<jon1012> (I'm a member of the team)
* ogra never heard of Foresight
<jon1012> since conary is a great package managing system
* Nafallo either
<jon1012> ogra: http://www.foresightlinux.com
<jabra> ogra: could you review my radmind package
<ogra> abelli, put ubm on UniverseCandidates ....
<jon1012> for example with debian packages it takes hour to make packages, review them etc... with conary in 5 minutes a recipe (this is how we call the packages sources) is made and added in the repos. if it's accepted
<ogra> jabra, i go through the to review wiki page regulary... so i will indeed eventually do it :)
<jon1012> (I'm Jonathan Schemoul, the art director and gnome devel. of foresight linux)
<ogra> jon1012, how do you guys handle the apple patent issues with howl ?
<jon1012> ogra: well... for the moment we don't really know, but it will probably be passed in our extra european repositories loool
<jon1012> ogra: just like mp3 support and things like this
<ogra> hmmm
<ogra> http://www.foresightlinux.com/screenshots/index.php?image=xlock.png
<jon1012> ogra: yeah a lot of users asked us something like this... we have worked a lot on it, and we even have round password stuff
<jabra> ogra: cool thanks
<ogra> you have worked a lot on what ?
<jon1012> on the xscreensaver stuff
<ogra> could elaborate on that ? what exactly did you do, except changing the logo and colors
<jon1012> because the password where appearing as squares at first, so we worked to made it appear as round
<jon1012> and also yeah to put the colors and all
<jon1012> I am not the guy who made the C coding for this, but I'm the logo creator, so I did the xpm stuff
<jon1012> ogra: however thank you ubuntu guys forthe xlock work you did
<ogra> youre welcome, it was my patch
<abelli> jon1012: i was behing ogra, when he done that.
<abelli> :)
<jon1012> oh thank you really much then
<abelli> s/done/did
<jon1012> ogra: if you want we have our modifications on the conary repositories, a simple cvc co xscreensaver could give you the sourcecodes
<abelli> well, i actually have a photo of him and mark working on the design.
<ogra> jon1012, nope, no need for that... this patch will die in ubuntu for breezy.... we'll have a cooler solution by then
<jon1012> ogra: maybe we could work together on it... (I mean the person in the foresight team working on it and you)
<ogra> keep it and spread it as you like ;) if he has questions he can mail me...
<jon1012> thanks :)
<ogra> but beware, it wont work with the next upstream update anymore, upstream made to many changes in this code
<jon1012> ogra: have you done the patches to make it appear as round stuff instead of squares in ubuntu ?
<jon1012> (in foresight, xiaowen, the girl who was in charge of it, worked for hours to find the solution, and finally our xscreensaver is now working correctly)
<ogra> yep, but you need a fully utf8 aware system and the right font for that, so the patch as it is can only work on a system configured like hoary...
<jon1012> oh ok :)
<jon1012> so that's why it didn't work directly, and now after our patches it works :)
<ogra> good
<jon1012> ogra: have you received the mails from Ken Vandine about your patch ? he told me he sent you some mails about it
* ogra digs hist 65000 mails....
<ogra> ah, yes, he sent one in the beginning of may... i somehow missed it, sorry....
* Nafallo is ashamed of the first version of his trafficshaping script with U32 as classifier :-P
<hunger> How do I find out whom to contact about a universe deb?
<jon1012> ogra: I don't think he is angry :) no problem :)
<abelli> hunger : sudo aptitude show packagename?
<ogra> hunger, contact this channel
<hunger> abelli: That is the debian maintainer.
<hunger> ogra: So who is responsible for cryptsetup?
<ogra> hunger, all motus care for all universe packages more or less...
<abelli> hunger: right. what do you want to know?
<abelli> hunger: ahh right.
<ogra> hunger, some have favorites, but then the rest knows about it
<hunger> abelli: I changed the initscript of that script and consider it to be better than what currently is there:-)
<ogra> hunger, nobody... whats wrong with it ?
<hunger> abelli: So I was wondering how to submit it for revision/inclusion.
<abelli> hunger: why dont you contact the debian mantainer ..
<ogra> it should be lsb-init clean
<abelli> you will avoid work to motus
<ogra> (your patch)
<hunger> abelli: Because a) he does not respond and b) debian does not follow LSB.
<hunger> ogra: lsb-init clean?
<abelli> hunger: well ogra is surely more informed on facts than me.
<ogra> yeah, follow the lsb ;)
<hunger> ogra: Well, I can always sed s/log_blah_msg/echo/ ;-)
<ogra> there are some standards for init scripts... they are used in all service start/stop scripts in main, but very rare in universe
<abelli> ogra: right .. what about implementing in ubuntu the service status flag :)?
<hunger> ogra: I noticed... and hated it;-)
<abelli> fabio really had bad times with ub,
<abelli> ..ubm
<hunger> abelli: incidentally my cryptodisks supports "status";-)
<abelli> hunger: just yours ... :(((
<abelli> hunger: what is it all about.
<hunger> abelli: Please look at https://launchpad.ubuntu.com/malone/bugs/563
<hunger> abelli: I had assumed a wishlist bug was appropriate, only to find out that I can not attach files.
<tseng|work> oh man malone is starting to look nice
<abelli> hunger: right
<Mithrandir> tseng|work: 19:18 < Mithrandir> tseng: hm, how's beagle coming along?
* hunger does not yet grasp the idea behind malone.
<hunger> Is it meant to be a not too feature complete bug tracker? ;-)
<tseng|work> Mithrandir: just need to push the updated deps into universe
<tseng|work> Mithrandir: and its ready to go
<tseng|work> it was in NEW for hoary, but we vetoed it
<tseng|work> rampant memory leaks are teh suck
<Mithrandir> tseng|work: ok; ETA of any kind?
<tseng|work> alot of stuff should get done tonight
<tseng|work> i cant promise beagle will be in it
<Mithrandir> ok, thanks
<tseng|work> the last outstanding issue is, aj uploaded some stuff for me and the sigs are messed up, now im getting md5 conflicts like some diff.gz's are still around
<tseng|work> if I dont run into that again, or get that cleared up
<tseng|work> and get libgda sorted...
<tseng|work> blah
<tseng|work> we might not get gtk-sharp
<tseng|work> zomg
<tseng|work> sucks dude, maybe not today at all
<herve> evening
<Nafallo> herve: evening :-)
<\sh> anybody has a clue here what 37000 british pounds are in euro?
<\sh> or is someone interessted to do php development in SW london for 37k pounds + bens? extreme programming experience is a ++
<herve> \sh, yahoo finance
<\sh> ah well
<\sh> ca. 54k euro too less for london
<Nafallo> http://daniel.haxx.se/currency/
<\sh> so i have to say no...anybody up for it?
<herve> england? no thanks :-)
<\sh> herve: hehe...
<herve> \sh, it's free of "taxes" ?
<herve> I don't know the accoutancy term in Enlighs
<\sh> herve: don't think so...I think i have to pay taxes in london then and in germany
<herve> I don't think we're talking about the same taxes
<herve> to roughly translate French terms, there are the "raw" wages and after the social loads
<herve> because that's a nice salary, even enough to live in paris
<\sh> herve: hmm...there is a tax law, if i'm right, that if I work in a foreign country, I have to stay at least one year there, then I don't need to pay my social and income tax here in germany
<\sh> herve: in london u have to pay at least twice the price as in munich :)
<herve> \sh, ho right, I just realised you're german, not english :-)
<\sh> herve: I'm not proud of it, but's the truth :)
<herve> i certainly hope you're kidding :-)
<\sh> herve: well...I'm not proud to be a german :)
<\sh> i will write my headhunter "sorry, no, not much for living in london" ;)
<herve> \sh, you should, I'd like to be german if not french
<\sh> herve: well, I only like "Goethe" and "Schiller" but the rest, forget about that :)
<\sh> oh ok, prof. weizenbaum indeed i like too :)
<\sh> einstein was more amerikan then german, wernher von braun was a nazibastard, even he brought the american into space ;)
<herve> einstein was german?
<\sh> sure he was
<zul> uh yeah
<GheRivero> rez
<\sh> herve: u think he was swiss?
<herve> \sh, sure he was from the east, from my point of view, but couldn't remember
<herve> hi GheRivero
<herve> \sh, yes I know he worked in zurich
<zul> my father worked in kenya doesnt mean he was kenyan
<\sh> herve: einstein was german, moved to zurich and than back to germany, and was being pushed to america cause of the nazis
<herve> yes I remember now
<\sh> in america he was accused to be a communist
<herve> for the history: I never said he was swiss!
<\sh> herve: nono :) i never said this :) but most of the people think he comes from switzerland ;)
<\sh> herve: right now, 2005 == einsteinjahr (year of einstein) here in germany...:)
<\sh> 2067 == wernher von braun year ;)
<herve> there's a valuable typography heritage in germany
<trulux> tritium: heya
<trulux> tritium: my presentation for the LSM got accepted
<trulux> tritium:
<\sh> anyways...I have to choose between einstein or ratzinger.. einstein, the man who invented e=mc^2 or papa ratzi, formerly known as the german pope after 482 years ;)
<herve> trulux, you come to the lsm ??
<trulux> herve: A presentation of mine got accepted for the Security mini-conf
<trulux> herve: if everything goes well, I'll do
<herve> and we could meet :-)
<trulux> I need to clarify some things, put up some clear stuff and we'll be done
<trulux> herve: sure!!
<trulux> sivang is not here :(
<\sh> ok..g'night guys...have work to do at 4:00am in our office
<herve> night
<herve> I can understand
<herve> i woke up at 5
<trulux> \sh: sleep well
<trulux> herve: shit...
<herve> and spent half the day in trains
<herve> trulux, I'll speak spanish :-p
<trulux> herve: why?
<herve> haven't done for so long
<trulux> herve: hah, OK
<trulux> but note that I need to clarify some things
<trulux> I'm still not sure if I will be able to go
<herve> i can't really help you for the accomodations
<herve> but if you need to, i'll see what i can do
<trulux> herve: I'll ask Axelle, she knows Serge Hallyn, who has worked with me and helped with many things, so, I may be able to get something
<trulux> herve: thanks in advance
<dholbach> hey
<herve> hi dholbach
<dholbach> hey herve
<Nafallo> dholbach: hi there :-)
<abelli> dholbach: im here
<dholbach> abelli: even better
<abelli> :)
<abelli> dholbach: so that page is on the wiki?
<dholbach> abelli: as i said: i'm terribly busy atm, have to finish my thesis in 3 months
<dholbach> abelli: but if i find the time, i'd be happy to review your package or help you, if you run into trouble
<dholbach> yes, wiki.ubuntu.com
<abelli> ok ..
<abelli> thesis, what about?
<abelli> dholbach: ill bother ogra .. no probs :)
<dholbach> server and client library for storage of user preferences
<abelli> but will you gain to get ubm in?
<abelli> dholbach: what framework?
<dholbach> gain?
<dholbach> framework?
<ogra> abelli, if its packaged ok, we'll get it in universe, dont worry
<abelli> ogra: :))))))
<abelli> dholbach: those libraries ..
<herve> that reminds me, I'll ask for a review soon
<abelli> dholbach: how do they work.
<herve> that's the point of his thesis he hasn't written yet ;-)
<dholbach> abelli: i wrote the server already and the library will make the requests to the server
<abelli> c?
<dholbach> the server is c++ and the library will be in C
<abelli> gpl ? :)
<dholbach> does somebody have the strange BUG that the screen turns blank every few seconds?
<dholbach> *GRRR*
<abelli> ogra: the problem is (im clearly joking, put your combat knife back .. im too young for it) .. when?
<dholbach> and NO: the problem is not that i have a screensaver interval of 10 seconds
<dholbach> yes, gpl and lgpl
<herve> dholbach, check how your cable is connected
<ogra> abelli, before breezy indeed....
<abelli> ogra: :) which is tomorrow or the day after tomorrow ? :D
<herve> abelli, you'll see
<trulux> abelli: did you see the new photos on the antenna "indoor"?
<abelli> trulux: i just got in because the frenchy .. is writing some emails ..
<abelli> trulux: ive got the logs, and hopefully your mail .. ill do it .. thank you very much.
<abelli> s/frenchy/my girl friend
<trulux> abelli: frenchy? do you mean the girlie :)?
<trulux> abelli: hah
<trulux> abelli: my pleasure, I hope you good luck and fun with the antenna
<abelli> trulux: don't worry ill be back to you soon, with antenna's, tarzan, monkeys, lions..
<trulux> abelli: haha, no problem, bene!
<trulux> ;)
<abelli> we want to be anonymous .. because we have a mind .. and we want to be judged for what we are and not what we look like ... ;)
<abelli> herve: mm i can't see since .. i think my hoary is stable enough .. im not going to do any upgrade.
<abelli> even if .. if i want to bother trulux, pitti && company .. i need to have it running ..
<abelli> trulux: qemu or uml?
<trulux> abelli: VMWare ;P
<abelli> never :)
<trulux> bbl, dinner smelling damn good
<abelli> trulux: buon appetito.
<abelli> its quite late dude.
<trulux> abelli: time has no meaning for me if there's no business at issue ;)
<ajmitch_> hi all
<abelli> trulux: soooo cooolllllll ...
<abelli> ajmitch_: ciao
<herve> hi ajmitch_
* ajmitch_ just about has a fully breezy box :)
<herve> yeah, so?
<herve> :-)
<ajmitch_> after installing ~2000 packages to go from sid->breezy
<herve> okay, *that* is adventurous!
<abelli> sid ? is it a virus?
<abelli> illness?
<ajmitch_> :)
<ajmitch_> abelli: you're thinking of grumpy
<herve> see you spoon
<abelli> hey ppl, if someone will ever ask me "hey i want to package something for ubuntu, but i dont know what a .deb is" .. what should i say?
<dholbach> abelli: so what we have on the wiki is PbuilderHowto - which is IMHO very good to start serious packaging
<dholbach> and PackagingTips (which just note SOME hints)
<ogra> abelli, additionally reading the debian new maintainer guide is very helpful
<abelli> ogra: that is the base .. but .. what about .desktop ?
<ogra> but we'll have our own guide soon
<dholbach> .desktop is the same as in debian
<abelli> dholbach: is it explained?
<abelli> a mean in the mantainer's guide?
<abelli> well .. i read it some yrs ago ..
<abelli> i dont remember it.
<dholbach> the .desktop stuff is a more recent invention :-)
<abelli> in fact :)
<abelli> i didnt want to break Gods' karma :)
<dholbach> http://standards.freedesktop.org/desktop-entry-spec/latest/
<ogra> you use dh_desktop to handle it ...
<abelli> ok thank you .
<dholbach> hey bur[n] er
<dholbach> oops
<dholbach> hey Burgundavia
<dholbach> ;-)
<Burgundavia> salut
<tritium_> crimsun, do you use an irc proxy?
<dholbach> hey tritium
<tritium_> hi dholbach :)
<crimsun> tritium_: a shell, usually.
<tritium_> crimsun, how's that?
<crimsun> tritium_: our users group (http://www.trilug.org) provides a free shell for its members
<crimsun> it works out well
<tritium_> crimsun, oh, okay
<crimsun> we're #trilug on freenode; we also have the most members on biglumber
<tritium_> thanks
<tritium_> crimsun, I've been trying out irssi-text in combination with screen, but was thinking about trying ctrlproxy or something similar
<crimsun> tritium_: some people like dircproxy, but I find screen+irssi-text quite useful
<crimsun> particularly since you can turn irssi-text into a proxy (per-network)
<crimsun> then just use ssh tunneling to connect to your irssi proxy (it acts as an irc server) from any location using any irc client
<tritium_> hrm, perhaps I'll try that, rather than this 2-nick business
<crimsun> try this: http://www.irssi.org/?page=docs&doc=proxy
<tritium_> many thanks
<crimsun> np
<tritium_> I'll be back around later.
<crimsun> same here, need to run errands
#ubuntu-motu 2005-05-13
<jabra> dholbach: can you review my radmind package?
<dholbach> not tonight, but i will review it
<dholbach> promise
<jabra> awesome
<jabra> thanks, I really appreciate it
<jabra> I am going to have another package soon as well
<dholbach> is it on MOTUToReview or MOTUNewPackages?
<jabra> ToReview
<jabra> I had added it to NewPackage by mistake. I then removed it
<dholbach> then everything's fine
<dholbach> try to be patient
<dholbach> there are unfortunately loads of people waiting
<jabra> right
<jabra> ok well I will build this other package in the meantime
<jabra> I wanta get it into debian and ubuntu
<dholbach> jabra: don't get me wrong: we all appreciate your work with the MOTUs but pushing people towards your packages won't help i fear
<jabra> ok I understand
<jabra> it just seems that there isn't anything be updated on that site.
<jabra> that is just what it seems to me
<jabra> I am probably wrong though
<dholbach> you must understand: we are 10 people doing this in our free time
<jabra> right
<dholbach> and we're maintaining packages ourselves and some of us just returned from australia
<ogra> and universe are ~15000 packages
<jabra> right
<dholbach> it's pretty annoying to wait for a review, i can absolutely understand your point
<jabra> ok right
<dholbach> but i'm afraid that only patience helps here
<jabra> ok
<jabra> sorry for being annoying
<dholbach> don't worry
<dholbach> i just want to explain our current situation
<dholbach> i hope we will grow soon, so i'm glad you still do work on packages
<jabra> basically I have sometime before I start my job and I just finished a semester of college (CO OP)
<dholbach> ah ok
<jabra> so I am working on personnal projects and packaging for tools I use
<dholbach> brb
<dholbach> re
<tseng> weee
<tseng> monodoc_1.0.6-1ubuntu1_source.changes ACCEPTED
<dholbach> :-))))9
<ogra> yeah
<tseng> thats my first "real" upload
<dholbach> waaaaaah, the new beep-media-player skin is UGLY
<tseng> dude, beep is ugly
<Burgundavia> use muine
<Burgundavia> or sonance
<tseng> he has to wait for me and libgda :(
<tseng> for those
<Burgundavia> is muine borked in breezy?
<tseng> if you use amd64
<Burgundavia> oh
<Burgundavia> ok
<tseng> im fixing that atm
* Burgundavia feels guilty as he hasn't done any packaging in ages
<Nafallo> yay! my firewall works :-)
<dholbach> and you can even access IRC? impressive!"
<Nafallo> hehe
<Nafallo> just run a test from pcflank.com on 1-65535, everything does what it should :-)
<Nafallo> stealthed except ssh, smtp and www :-)
<dholbach> good night everyone
<ajmitch_> hey
<ajmitch_> tseng: anything you want me to break/unbreak now for mono?
<ajmitch_> or are you still waiting on the libgda stuff
<ajmitch_> hey AndyFitz
<ajmitch_> tseng: congrats on getting into the keyring, btw
<AndyFitz> heya ajmitch_
<tseng> ajmitch_: i can fix from here
<tseng> ajmitch_: its taking my uploads now
<ajmitch_> excellent
<tseng> dammit
<ajmitch_> just about got to breezy status
<tseng> yeah i lost the amd64 fix
<tseng> gotta readd
<tseng> should fix the changelog too
<tseng> gah upload privelages rock
<tseng> ogra: that last upload was just for you
<tseng> im getting used to this svn-buildpackage stuff
<tseng> ajmitch_: im about to trash the hell out of your chroot I think
* Nafallo let's festival read the log from #ubuntu-hardened ;-)
<tseng> hows my nick sound?
<tseng> silly
<Nafallo> tseng: I'm not there yet ;-)
<Nafallo> tseng: I had to sed "greater than" ;-)
<tseng> oh man
<Nafallo> hehe
<tseng> yeah i always wonder how that works
<tseng> because dmwaters uses all that text-to-speech stuff
<Nafallo> joins are really irritating ;-)
<tseng> i hope this is the last revision of mono for awhile
<Nafallo> tseng: I just did cat rfc-1.log | sed s/\<// | sed s/\>/\ / | festival --tts
<Nafallo> :-)
<tseng> weve made 5
<tseng> one because ajmitch_ cant cut and paste code :P
<tseng> one because I'm a tool
<tseng> mmm where is seb
<tseng> is it sleep time there?
<Nafallo> should be 1:34 or something...
<Nafallo> spain, right?
<tseng> france
<Nafallo> should be either 1:35 or 2:35 then...
<Nafallo> not sure which of them...
<tseng> oh well
<tseng> i mailed him
<tseng> no wonder ive been talking to myself
<Nafallo> hehe
<Nafallo> I let the computer talk ;-)
<tseng> oh man we are so close
<tseng> mono++
<Nafallo> hmm, festival says SE Linux as SouthEast Linux ;-)
<tseng> ajmitch_: http://tseng.ath.cx/images/mono.png
<tseng> ajmitch_: tommorow could be the big day :)
<Nafallo> tseng: Brandon Hale sounded good enough :-)
<tseng> hah ok
<tseng> i meant nick
<Nafallo> hmm, capitalized code wasn't fun to hear for once.
<Nafallo> tseng: you should soon join the channel I think ;-)
<tseng> yay
<ajmitch_> hey I didn't cut & paste that code, I just did it from scratch :P..
<tseng> yeah, wrong!
<tseng> :D
<tseng> and then I went and clobbered it
<tseng> oh well
<tseng> oh fuck me
<tseng> cli-common isnt available on amd64?
<tseng> whats the deal with that
<tseng> The following packages have unmet dependencies:
<tseng>   cli-common: Depends: mono-utils but it is not going to be installed or
* ajmitch_ checks
<tseng>                        cil-disassembler
<tseng> Arch: all
<ajmitch_> mono-utils not built on amd64? did we miss it in the arch lines?
<tseng> *looks*
<tseng> we did
<ajmitch_> nah, debs are there
<tseng> well
<tseng> its not in my copy
<tseng> of control
<ajmitch_> there are debs for 2ubuntu4
<ajmitch_> none for 3ubuntu1
<tseng> ok
<tseng> well
<ajmitch_> which is what the buildd will try & install
<ajmitch_> perhaps
<Nafallo> tseng: lol
<Nafallo> tseng: t-s-e-n-g ;-)
<tseng> is anyone who can try to install mono-utils and see whats broke
<tseng> on amd64
* ajmitch_ chuckles at jba's job hunting
<tseng> he /msg me first
<tseng> and I told him it was a long shot
<Nafallo> tseng: damn your nick is irritating ;-)
<zul> has he got anything actually to show with ubuntu other than showing up at udu?
<tseng> so can I put a # in control?
<Nafallo> btw, I'm building a breezy chroot on amd64 :-)
<ajmitch_> Nafallo: thanks, you can test mono for us
<tseng> zul: he must have done something on mono or be pretty slick with whois, he found the dec channel
<tseng> dev.
<zul> heh
<tseng> miguel invited me or i would have nfc
<zul> must go back to gcc4 thingy
<tseng> cli-common only has a build log for i386
<Nafallo> ajmitch_: yepp, that's the plan :-)
<tseng> or i guess it is arch all so it builds on the 386?
<ajmitch_> yes
<tseng> yeah wtf is broken
<ajmitch_> just that mono-util does'nt want to install on amd64 now
<Nafallo> my internet connection is saturised by my nightly mirrorsync :-/
<tseng> ajmitch_: i know
<tseng> ajmitch_: why
<Nafallo> I'm trying to add a archive.ubuntu.com to my sources.list
<Nafallo> mono-utils: Depends: mono-assemblies-base but it is not going to be installed
<tseng> hm
<tseng> do you have amd64 for -assemblies-* ajmitch_ ?
<tseng> also
<tseng> http://www.go-mono.com/archive/1.1.7/
<tseng> crack of the day!
<tseng> "Mono no longer requires a separate shared process to provide the previous features, this has significantly improved Mono's I/O performance. Beagle is three times as fast indexing files and xsp tripled its speed."
<Nafallo> if I try to install to install that package it want's mono-common.
<Nafallo> I try to install mono-common then... :-)
<tseng> well
<tseng> ill just read the diff out of pool
<Nafallo> hmm, those packages are from my local mirror. they wasn't up2date.
<tseng> uh
<tseng> so 2ubuntu4 had amd64 in all the right places
<Nafallo> I removed local mirror from sources.list, apt-cache policy still claimes mono-common to be 1.1.6-2ubuntu4
<tseng> because it is
<Nafallo> ahh
<tseng> so
<tseng> what cant you install please
<tseng> root cause
<Nafallo> mono-common has candidate 1.1.6-2ubuntu4
<Nafallo> mono-assemblies-base: Depends: mono-common (= 1.1.6-3ubuntu2)
<Nafallo> seems that's the problem...
<ajmitch_> explains a bit
<ajmitch_> seems that all archs need to be built in sync
* ajmitch_ wonders who that jba person is
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch_
<ajmitch_> hello bddebian
<jabra> I am wondering what the differnce for packages build for ubuntu compared to those built for debian
<tseng> um, what
<tseng> ooooh
<tseng> since the arch amd64 stuff borked its fucked, ok
<tseng> no problem
<Nafallo> goodnight people :-)
<schweeb> tseng: quit being lazy, mono 1.1.7 is out now. don't sleep  until it's packaged.
<\sh> morning gentlemen
<tritium> crimsun: well, I tried to setup the proxy over ssh tunnel, but I can't seem to get it working
<crimsun> where does it not work?
<crimsun> can you connect to your irssi proxy without the ssh tunnel?
<tritium> No
<crimsun> is the proxy module loaded in your irssi client, and have you set a port and a passwd for freenode?
<tritium> not remotely, that is
<crimsun> ok, I presume 'tritium' is the irssi client?
<tritium> yes
<tritium> and yes to proxy module, port, and password question
<crimsun> ok, so from another irc client (say, from the same host), you should be able to connect to port $x and get the freenode session
<tritium> yes, I can do that okay
<tritium> can't do it remotely
<crimsun> ah, so you can't connect from outside to ip:x
<tritium> right
<crimsun> does your isp allow a range of high incoming ports?
<tritium> yes, but I've only port-forwarded ssh through my router.  I believe that's what i have configured incorrectly
<tritium> I mean the ssh tunnel
<crimsun> ah, yeah. You'll need to forward additional ports on your router
<\sh> ok..change request was successfull...now I can go back home and sleep
<crimsun> night, \sh
<tritium> crimsun: despite tunneling?
<tritium> Ah, I think I understand.
<\sh> crimsun: not so fast :)
<crimsun> ah :)
<dholbach> hey
<tritium> Daniel!  :)
<dholbach> hey michael! :-)
<tritium> Hi dholbach :)
<tritium> crimsun, okay, all setup now.  Got ssh tunnel working.  No need for port-forwarding on my router.
<crimsun> tritium: awesome.
<tritium> crimsun, thanks again for the suggestion, and the help :)
<crimsun> np at all
<crimsun> morning daniel :)
<dholbach> hey crimsun :-)
* tritium is a happy camper
<ivoks> 'morning
<tritium> Morning, ivoks
<ivoks> what's up? :)
<dholbach> hey ivoks
<ivoks> dholbach
<dholbach> how are you?
<ivoks> sleepy :)
<dholbach> me too
<ivoks> i'm up since 3AM
<ivoks> now is 7:12
<dholbach> ivoks: here too :-)
<ivoks> lol
<ivoks> i had to finish some drawings in autocad :(
<ivoks> so, what's the procedure with packages in motu?
<ivoks> who is reviewing them and how long does it takes?
<dholbach> anybody of us will do it
<dholbach> but we're in a bottleneck situation at the moment
<dholbach> but i hope it'll get better soon
<ivoks> i can imagine :)
<dholbach> we're like ten people, doing it in our free time
<ivoks> i know
<dholbach> and maintain own packages as well, so being patient is highly appreciated :-)
<ivoks> hehehe
<ivoks> it's ok...
<dholbach> i can't give any ETAs
<crimsun> I will try and do a few reviews tonight
<ivoks> oh, crimsun
<dholbach> crimsun: good one... i will join you
<ivoks> crimsun i created my kernel package :)
<ivoks> crimsun but not ur way :)
<crimsun> ivoks: many paths to the same destination :)
<dholbach> ivoks: you should joing #ubuntu-kernel for that
<ivoks> dholbach i know
* dholbach wonders, if he should introduce a "review day" for himself, like thursdays
<ivoks> :)
<ivoks> crimsun /usr/share/doc/kernel-package/debian.README says it all ;)
<ivoks> well... i have to reboot now :(
<tritium> speaking of kernel-package, is it naming the result kernel-image or linux-image ?
<ivoks> i have to print those cad drawings and of to university
<ivoks> tritium it's linux-image on ubuntu
<ivoks> tritium but, by default it calls it kernel-package
<tritium> ivoks, right, so kernel-package in ubuntu names them correctly?
<ivoks> tritium nope :(
<tritium> That's what I thought.
<ivoks> tritium i explaied all in howto
<tritium> ivoks, oh, where at?
<crimsun> wait, kernel-package creates kernel-image-foo?
<crimsun> that's a rather significant bug if so
<ivoks> crimsun i said that couple of times on couple of places :)
<tritium> a few people I've recommended kernel-package to have told me the same
<tritium> I've not used it in ubuntu, only debian
<ivoks> tritium http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/KernelCompileHowto
<tritium> ivoks, thanks
<crimsun> that probably needs to be merged, but we'll have to ask MOMs
<ivoks> crimsun https://bugzilla.ubuntu.com/show_bug.cgi?id=10148
<tritium> uh-oh, a new acronymn I don't know...
<crimsun> tritium: (Masters of Main)
<tritium> crimsun, thanks...should have guessed
<tritium> There should be a MON for jack-of-all-trade types ;)
<tritium> So perhaps kernel-package should be ubuntuized.  dh-make could be modified a bit too
<ivoks> tritium heh...
<ivoks> i would sugest leave as is
<tritium> kernel-package, or dh-make?
<ivoks> but change linux-image to kernel-image
<ivoks> but, that's only me :)
<tseng> dh_make could spew alot less crap
<dholbach> tritium: i will change dh-make, if i get approved for main uploads in next tb meeting
<tritium> dholbach, super@
<tritium> !
<ivoks> ah...
<ivoks> why was decided to name images linux-image?
<dholbach> i already have a patch for it, but the debian guy didn't want it
<ivoks> well, i agree it's better than kernel-image, but produces more work
<dholbach> (using lsb-release and such)
<tritium> ooh, good idea
<ivoks> this is longest period ubuntu stayed on my computer :)
<ivoks> last time i reinstalled debian after 2 weeks :)
<tritium> ivoks, how come?
<ivoks> tritium it was warty
<tritium> ivoks, oh, ok
<ivoks> i wasn't satisifed it it...
<ivoks> with it
<ivoks> man... i have to see a doctor
<tritium> you okay?
<ivoks> i had car accident
<ivoks> week ago
<ivoks> since than i make a lot of typos....
<ivoks> and my car is... well, there is no more car :)
<tritium> sorry to hear that.
<dholbach> oh shit :-/
<ivoks> me too :(
<ivoks> guy smashed me from in the rear
<ivoks> bumbed me in the car in front of me
<ivoks> didn't even brake...
<tritium> ivoks, you got medical attention, I hope
<ivoks> tritium yeah, i was in hospital, but i didn't feel anything strange
<ivoks> they sanitized my neck
<tritium> okay, good that you were checked
<ivoks> yeah..
<ivoks> small car... i have to go to insurance company to see wich price they figured out :)
* dholbach has his fingers crossed
<ivoks> dholbach me too
<ivoks> but the day didn't start well... it's raining :(
<ajmitch_> time to finally use an ubuntu kernel, brb
<ivoks> looks like ajmitch_ didn't make it :)
<tritium> hopefully nothing serious
<crimsun> those fscks can take a bit ;)
<ivoks> :)
<ivoks> not on ext3/xfs/etc...
<crimsun> if you hit the mount limit, sure
<crimsun> (for ext3)
<ivoks> ah, tune2fs
<ivoks> -c 99999999
<crimsun> yikes
<crimsun> I kinda like the ole 20
* tritium wishes G5s with 970MP would be available soon
<ivoks> i don't like ext3 at all
<ivoks> molotov follow ubuntuguid.org, u can't miss
<ivoks> ups :)
<ivoks> bye all, time to go
<crimsun> cya
<dholbach> bye ivoks
<tritium> crimsun, it's nearly 3 am there, isn't it?
<jabra> sleep is for the weak
<tritium> heh, I'm weak then ;)
<jabra> ya me too
* jabra => bed
<tritium> Same for me.  Good night all.
<koke> hi all!
<dholbach> hey koke, AndyFitz
<AndyFitz> hi dholbach
<ajmitch_> wb dholbach :)
<tseng> yayay
<Nafallo> morning all
<ajmitch_> hi
<Nafallo> hmm, I'm going to build my test environment for my lappy. dunno if I should use chroot or pbuild though.
<ajmitch_> I tend to use both
<Nafallo> well, chroots should be easier to set up from what I've heard :-)
<ajmitch_> I use the pbuilder base.tgz for setting up chroots :)
<Nafallo> hehe
<Nafallo> I might aswell use my local mirror :-)
<Nafallo> hmm
<Nafallo> hmm
<Nafallo> dependancy problems with cpp gcc and g++ while debootstraping.
<Nafallo> anyone else get this?
<ajmitch_> can't say I've tried debootstrapping breezy in the last couple of days - I know some changes have been made
<Nafallo> I'll try debootstrapping without --variant.
<Nafallo> dooh!
<Nafallo> I shouldn't follow wikipages without thinking...
<ogra> which one ?
<Nafallo> http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/DebootstrapChroot
<Nafallo> I copied my sources.list and just runned apt-get update
<Nafallo> I should use breezy in the chroot, not hoary.
<ogra> yeah
<Nafallo> beware the power of sed ;-). fixed :-).
<dholbach> does anybody of you have a postgresql server up, on which i could try glom? :-)
<ogra> not yet
<ajmitch_> dholbach: yeah, I think postgresql still works..
<ajmitch_> what is glom?
<ogra> a new DB frontend
<dholbach> database designer and user interface
<ajmitch_> ah ok
<dholbach> what do you mean by "postgresql still works"? :-)
<ajmitch_> I upraded to breezy, remember :)
<ajmitch_> just starting to hack on a tool to help me merge some of these packages - so many packages are still newer in debian
<ogra> dholbach, didnt you package fast-user-applet already ? shouldnt it be on ToReview ?
* ogra cleans out UniverseCandidates
<dholbach> i packaged it, but the new version requires /etc/gdm/gdm.conf to lie around in configure target
<dholbach> Unfrgive1's fusa build-deps on gdm
<ogra> hmm...
<dholbach> i want to discuss this with upstream, since it's unacceptable
<ajmitch_> it should be runtime only, not compiletime
<dholbach> yeah... it's insane
<ogra> depends would be necessary (gdmflexiserver) , but build-depends...
<dholbach> ogra: it requires gdm.conf at build-time
<ogra> ouch
<dholbach> yes
<dholbach> the compiler options should workaround it, but they don't work
<dholbach> i suspect broken m4-foo in configure.ac
<dholbach> but i don't want to fix it
* ogra lols at FreeDoko
<ogra> sounds like free willy
<ajmitch_> heh
<dholbach> hahaha
<Nafallo> aha!
* Nafallo backports the new version of debootstrap ;-)
<ajmitch_> he said the word!
<ogra> GAH
<Nafallo> hmm, failed anyway :-/
<Nafallo> should work to debootstrap hoary and dist-upgrade, right? ;)
<ogra> huh... why do i have nvu in my apt-cache....
<ajmitch_> yes
<ogra> is it in debian now ?
<ajmitch_> ogra: it landed in sid
<ogra> yay...
<Nafallo> ehm... something bad must have happened at some point...
* ogra happily wipes out all traces of nvu from the wiki
<ajmitch_> I remember thom complaining about yet another copy of the firefox source in the archive :)
<dholbach> :-)
<Nafallo> Xlib: connection to ":0.0" refused by server
<Nafallo> Xlib: No protocol specified
<Nafallo> I tried to run sudo synaptic & :-P
<dholbach> ok... i'm out... see you later
<Nafallo> dholbach: laters :-)
<Nafallo> brb, hopefully
<Nafallo> never ever bindmount stuff, forget about them, and try to recursivly remove the tree where you home is/was.
<Nafallo> I'm glad I detected my failure in time and only erased all settings.
<Mithrandir> rm should grow a -x
<Nafallo> -x?
<Mithrandir> aka --one-file-system; find has it, du has it, why not rm too?
<Nafallo> ah, _that_ would be really good. that's a security upload, no? ;-)
<Mithrandir> ;)
<Nafallo> fuck! I've lost .bash_profile and .bashrc :-P
<Mithrandir> restore from backup, then
<Mithrandir> or check them out again.
* Mithrandir hugs CVS, SVN and Arch
<Nafallo> /etc/skel is my backup for the moment :-)
<Mithrandir> :P
<Nafallo> hmm
<Nafallo> I think I've just found use for the empty 4.5GB SCSI-drive in my server ;-)
<Nafallo> hmm
* Nafallo plugs his usbstick and hopes to find .ssh and .gpg
<Nafallo> s/gpg/gnupg/
<Nafallo> I could get them from my server.
<Nafallo> *puuh*
<Nafallo> finally.
<Nafallo> I can run tests on stuff :-)
<tseng|work> Nafallo: know much about building packages?
<Nafallo> tseng|work: not yet. but I snag sources to look at from time to time :-).
<tseng|work> ok rock on
<tseng|work> you have breezy/amd64 right?
<Nafallo> tseng|work: amd64 hoary with breezy amd64 and i386 chroots :-)
<tseng|work> rock out
<tseng|work> have 20 minutes or so?
<Nafallo> tseng|work: I got the whole day :-)
<tseng|work> heh
<tseng|work> if you could, grab the source for mono on breezy
<tseng|work> edit debian/rules
<tseng|work> remove the extra tab in the ifeq (... amd64) block
<tseng|work> and try to build it
<Nafallo> oki
<tseng|work> apt-get build-dep mono; dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot
<tseng|work> basically
<ogra> worked fine for me yesterday already (with homebuilt libgnomedb).... i'm wondering where this strange error on the buildd comes from
<tseng|work> gr
* Nafallo makes backup of the chroots first *
<tseng|work> anyway, its not weird ogra
<tseng|work> mono can use nptl or linuxthreads
<tseng|work> linuxthreads is default.. amd64 doesnt have it
<ogra> hmmm....
<tseng|work> so there is some code that sets the confflags per arch
<tseng|work> which worked once on the buildd
<tseng|work> now its failing
<tseng|work> only change is some extra whitespace
<tseng|work> i got from pasting it
<ogra> looks rather like a buildd oddity...
<tseng|work> could be
<tseng|work> but it worked before with *almost* the same code
<tseng|work> ill ask lamont
<tseng|work> i guess
<tseng|work> you left the whitespace in?
<ogra> i didnt touch the surce at all
<ogra> source even
<Mithrandir> you should just switch the default to nptl, since all our platforms support it, afaik.
<ogra> tseng|work, 1.1.6-2ubuntu4
<tseng|work> oh no
<tseng|work> 3ubuntu3
<tseng|work> or was it 4 already
<Nafallo> 3ubuntu4
<ogra> ah, yeah, i c you already switched to -3
<tseng|work> Mitrandir: nptl has problems on x86
<tseng|work> Mithrandir: ill look into enabling it again and testing later
<tseng|work> a few months ago nptl mono on x86 crashed 100% of the time, it was awesome
<Mithrandir> tseng|work: uhm, how so on x86?  It'll be the default for breezy+1 so you have to fix it anyhow. :)
<tseng|work> yes
<tseng|work> (x86 will still have linuxthreads in breezy+1 btw)
<tseng|work> ill definately test it again nptl only later
<tseng|work> ogra: would you mind building 3ubuntu4?
<ogra> no... just grabbing the source...
<tseng|work> awesome
<Nafallo> 35% grabbed :-P
<Nafallo> I need faster downstream :-P
<tseng|work> oh you know what
<tseng|work> I'm retarded
<Nafallo> hehe, didn't know that ;-)
<tseng|work> i bet I left --with-tls=pthread in confflags at the top
<tseng|work> and it isnt overriden by defining it again
<thom> oops
<Nafallo> hi thom! how's it going? :-)
<tseng|work> will fix when I get home
<tseng|work> working with my own changes and anonymous svn to alioth is annoying
<tseng|work> I cant wait till everyone uses arch/hct and I can make my own branch and merge things
<tseng|work> vs trying to merge by hand, I'm obviously too dumb for that
<Nafallo> tseng|work: you shouldn't be so hard on yourself. in my opinion you're neither dumb or retarded.
<Nafallo> s/or/nor/
<tseng|work> Nafallo dude ive made like 10 revisions already
<Nafallo> tseng: and uploads are cheap, so? :-)
<tseng|work> fucking up the merge
<Nafallo> will probably straighten out in the end.
<tseng|work> sure
<tseng|work> once it finally works we can go to 1.1.7
<tseng|work> 3x beagle indexing speed
<tseng|work> im very excited
<Nafallo> tseng|work: what changes do you want me to make before building?
<whiprush> morning everyone
<Nafallo> whiprush: morning :-)
<tseng|work> Nafallo, now that I know whats wrong
<tseng|work> remove --with-tls=pthread at the top of rules
<tseng|work> and leave the ifeq that sets it per arch
<tseng|work> and the extra whitespace in the ifeq
<Nafallo> tseng|work: hmm, ifeq ($(DEB_BUILD_GNU_TYPE), $(DEB_HOST_GNU_TYPE))
<Nafallo> tseng|work: that whitespace?
<tseng|work> no, next one
<tseng|work> one of the lines has a trailing tab
<Nafallo> there are no whitespace... _ARCH),amd64)
<Nafallo> ahh
<Nafallo> endif
<tseng_> cgi-irc is the worst
<Nafallo> hehe
<tseng_> anyone have a solution for ssh over https?
<tseng_> someone mentioned one at udu
<Mithrandir> tseng_: just ssh on port 443?
<tseng_> hm well
<tseng_> it has to go through an http proxy
<tseng_> you cant go directly out :(
<tseng_> but: you can on ftp
<tseng_> ill try that port later
<Nafallo> tseng: wasn't there a package for http-tunneling somewhere in debian...
<Nafallo> http://htun.runslinux.net/
<Nafallo> :-)
<ogra> tseng_, seems it still fails...
<tseng_> hm nice
<ogra> same place, same eroor
<thom> tseng_: nstx and ssh over that
<Nafallo> ogra: it should just return error when failing, right?
<ogra> yep
<Nafallo> ogra: built here.
<ogra> make[9] : *** [../../class/lib/net_1_1_bootstrap/mscorlib.dll]  Fehler 1
<ogra> (Fehler = Error)
<ogra> Nafallo, what exactly did you rip out of the rules file ?
<tseng_> if it works for Nafallo it should be fine
<tseng_> ill upload tonight
<Nafallo> ogra: the tab after ifeq (... amd64)'s endif and --with-tls=pthread in build-stamp: cli-wrapper
<ogra> argh...
<Mithrandir> tseng_: if you have working ping you can abuse that
<ogra> i missed the last one
<tseng_> i think overdoing ping or dns might set something off
<tseng_> http might be ignored
<Nafallo> hmm, is there an easy way to clean up the chroot? ;-)
<tseng_> especially if it can do https
<Mithrandir> tseng_: openvpn can tunnel over http
<tseng_> clean  how?
<tseng_> if i have alot of -dev stuff around i dont want, sometimes ill do:
<tseng_> apt-get remove libc6-dev
<Mithrandir> debfoster is your friend
<tseng_> then apt-get install ubuntu-desktop to add it back
<tseng_> or for minimal just lsb-base libc6-dev
<tseng_> but you are really better off using pbuilder for that sort of thing
<tseng_> in the long run.
<bddebian> Hello Mithrandir  ;-)
<Nafallo> I thought I saw something about pbuilder on the wiki :-P
<Mithrandir> hiya bddebian
<Nafallo> have I told you how much I love that wiki? ;-)
<Mithrandir> tseng_: http://sebsauvage.net/punching/, btw.
<tseng_> im going to drop the pbuilder doc on there into my ubuntu packaging quickstart
<Nafallo> tseng: mhm, URL? :-)
<Nafallo> I clean up with rm -r <chroot> && tar jxf <chroot>.tar.bz2 this time ;-)
<tseng_> http://udu.wiki.ubuntu.com/IntroDeveloperDocs?highlight=%28MediumPriority%29%7C%28UduBof%29
<tseng_> just notes
<tseng_> yeah having a tar'd up chroot is good
<Nafallo> ahh, they aren't done yet :-)
<tseng_> yeah i am just starting to get over jet lag
<tseng_> and beating my head against mono merges
<Nafallo> *s*
<tseng_> when thats all in i can start working on the doc
<tseng_> Mithrandir: that looks too easy, ta
<Nafallo> tseng: I can be your testperson how well the docs work. when I become a MOTU it worked ;-).
<tseng_> hah rock on
<tseng_> i taught a few people at UDU and they seemed to catch on very well
<tseng_> but that was hands-on
<tseng_> more fun that way
<ogra> you taught the edubuntu guys ?
<tseng_> ya
<ogra> yay
<tseng_> jeff and colin
<Nafallo> yea. and they knew programming before I suppose :-)...
<tseng_> daniel got them setup with gpg
<tseng_> they knew python
<Nafallo> hmm, oki.
<Nafallo> well, learning by doing should be my way I belive :-). that's how I got this far into computers ;-).
<Nafallo> hmm
<Nafallo> I forgot to rip out my frenchclasses from the playlist :-P
<Nafallo> hmm
<Nafallo> xchat didn't detect my change of ip and interface ;-)
<Nafallo> hmm
<Nafallo> anyone experimented with pbuilder from within a chroot? ;-)
<thom> Nafallo: why would you bother?
<Nafallo> thom: keep up2date with debootstrap without having to backport it all the time :-)
* Nafallo reconsiders. debootstrap of breezy is borked atm anyway.
<tseng|work> better to bootstrap hoary and dist-upgrade
<tseng|work> its going to stay that way
<Nafallo> tseng|work: yea, that's what I'm doing now :-)
* thom comes to the conclusion he should start throwing mail away
<thom> -Mutt: Mail/ubuntu/users [Msgs:32506
<Nafallo> hehe
<ogra> hmm, so i have some doubled....
<ogra> 33915 says evo
<tseng|work> mm i unsubbed from -users
<tseng|work> -devel is noisy enough
<tseng|work> ogra: alot of people cross post or double post
<tseng|work> i have a duplicate filter
<ogra> not really
<ogra> (not relly a lot)
<tseng|work> well
<tseng|work> i get a few mails a week in duplicates
<ogra> geez, i got a working tomboy
<tseng|work> rock on dude
<tseng|work> so you built mono, gnomedb, gtk-sharp ?
<ogra> tseng|work, http://beatniksoftware.com/pipermail/tomboy-list_beatniksoftware.com/2005-February/000558.html
<ogra> try this one... except the second part of the patch...
<Nafallo> I can't get pbuilder to update unauthenticated *scratches head*
<tseng|work> eh, whats that ogra
<tseng|work> supposed to force gtk-sharp1?
<ogra> the source didnt build... looks like PanelApplet is declared as class and as namespace...
<ogra> so one of them needed to be changed...
<tseng|work> oh yeah build time
<ogra> calling it PanelApplet1 seems a bit odd though
<tseng|work> im using http://download.dajobe.org/debian/experimental/
<tseng|work> 	* Tomboy/Tray.cs: Apply minimal patch to support building under	mono 1.1.x.
<tseng|work> 0.3.2, new upstream with mono 1.1 fixes
<tseng|work> ill upload it as soon as libgnomedb is fixed
<tseng|work> lamont: libgnomedb errors out on buildd, cant install libgda2-3.. could it be that the apt database is out of date?
<tseng|work> lamont: as I can install that.
<lamont> tseng|work: no.  it's because libgda2-3 is in universe
<tseng|work> oh, yuck
<tseng|work> ok.
<lamont> (promotion has been requested, fwiw)
<tseng|work> yeah im sure everyone can do just fine without me bothering
<tseng|work> ogra: did you get my messages
<ogra> nope
<tseng|work> well there is a new upstream with mono 1.1 fixes
<tseng|work> that i am using
<ogra> (update-manager tried to upgrade pcmcia ;)
<tseng|work> lunchtime bbl
<ogra> ah, ok
<ogra> now i know why i have the old icon
<Nafallo> I don't know why, but I had a .pbuilderrc in my homedir. Now I know why things failed for me.
<herve> hi
<Nafallo> hi herve
<bddebian> Heya Herve
<ivoks> hi
<bddebian> Hello ivoks
<ivoks> hi
<ivoks> omg
<ivoks> 50 spams today
<bddebian> Light day eh? ;-P
<ivoks> uhh...
<ivoks> looks like SA died on server :)
<ivoks> http://www.grad.hr/amavis-stats/
<ivoks> hm... that's too many mails registred as regular :(
<ivoks> jesus... what to do :(
<Nafallo> ivoks: pray ;-)
<ivoks> lol! i found error :)
<ivoks> bayes_seen and bayes_toks are rw for root
<ivoks> but, not readable for amavis user :)
<ivoks> and spamassassin runs as amavis user :)
<ivoks> those spamers... worst kind of people...
<ivoks> i wouldn't kill them...
<ivoks> i would cut their fingers, one by one... :)
<Nafallo> baah, they are most often transparent to me :-)
<Nafallo> most people of that kind is ;-)
<ivoks> eh
<tseng|work> ogra: back
<thom> tseng|work: dude, what's the obsession with power adaptors about? :-)
<dholbach> thom: good question :-)
<thom> dholbach: *g*
<Mithrandir> they're.. sexy?
<Mithrandir> :P
<tseng|work> thom: there was some really crack stuff going on with power conversion
<tseng|work> i had half a mind to take a picture of smufix every day too
<tseng|work> and post them all sorted by date
<tseng|work> wouldve been pretty mean, though
<thom> heh
<Amaranth> smufix?
<Amaranth> did he/she look worse everyday or something?
<tseng|work> er, sortof
<thom> mostly identical every day...
<tseng|work> he lost his suitcase and wore the same outfit for at least 2 weeks
<Amaranth> o_O
<tseng|work> not for a lack of free tshirts
<tritium> speaking of t-shirts, are there now MOTU shirts?
<tseng|work> no
<tseng|work> you could make some on cafe press
<tritium> dholbach, that's your brainchild, isn't it?
<dholbach> herve had the idea as well, ogra too - dunno whose idea it was in the first place
<tritium> cool
<dholbach> so if somebody had a design, i would pass it directly to sabdfl :-)
<ogra> lets just take the simple launchpad t-shirt design...
<Burgundavia> any idea? I can mock something up quickly
<dholbach> an ubuntu logo, MOTU in capital letters and "guess who compiled the package you're using?"
<dholbach> maybe a link to our wiki page :-)
<Burgundavia> ok
<Burgundavia> how about
<Burgundavia> "We compile your packages"
<Burgundavia> or "Can we compile your package?"
<ogra> i like "...guess who compiled the package you're using?"
* dholbach likes herve's version better, but any other opinions?
<tseng|work> "let us fix your package"
<tseng|work> it would be pretty funny in the us
<ogra> and MOTU in this typesetting http://community.webshots.com/photo/338849189/338853480iMyAXJ
<tritium> since we're talking Universe here, would be cool to work in the phrase "The world is not enough."
<ogra> a logo anywhere and the text somehow handwritten....
<ogra> tritium, on the back ?
<tseng|work> what does that mean anyway
<tseng|work> fogo na bamba
<tritium> ogra, anywhere :)
<ogra> no idea...
<Burgundavia> the world is not enough on the sleeve?
<ogra> i just like the typesetting
<thom> hey, canonical *compiles* the packages ;-)
<tritium> Burgundavia, cool :)
<ogra> ok, probably "fixed" then ;)
<thom> </pedant>
<Burgundavia> then I like tsengs
<dholbach> thom: the slogan evolved when herve was compiling some package which took 2,5h for the 5th time or something
<tseng|work> mine is raunchy
<Burgundavia> yours is funny
* Burgundavia is from Canada
<tseng|work> yeah, im just guessing ESL people dont get it
<Burgundavia> nope
<Burgundavia> tseng|work, where are you from?
<dholbach> pennsylvania, iirc :-)
<tseng|work> yes
<Burgundavia> an idea http://img197.echo.cx/img197/4254/path28897mt.png
<ivoks> we fix :)
<ogra> to much logo for my taste...
<Burgundavia> too much? how so?
<ogra> but the idea with the planet is nice
<tritium> Ah, cool, it's a planet.  I was thinking it was an electron :)
<ogra> the logo should just be a small thingie, the MOTU should slap you right in the face, so everybody will ask you about it ;)
<tritium> yeah, it's deuterium.  One proton, two neutrons, and an electron ;)
<ogra> heh
<ivoks> i agree with ogra, if i can vote :)
<Burgundavia> http://img213.echo.cx/img213/1849/path28895ls.png
<ivoks> great one
<Burgundavia> need to move the planet
<ivoks> yep
<Burgundavia> and other small tweaks
<ivoks> but good idea
<ogra> hmm, yep...
<tritium> looks good, Burgundavia
<Burgundavia> spacing is off
<Burgundavia> on the letters
<ogra> the letters could also be thicker...
<Burgundavia> hmm
<ogra> but you wont get that with the font...
<Burgundavia> need a different font for that
* Burgundavia curses at the default font packages in Ubuntu
<ogra> heh
<ogra> yep
<Burgundavia> I have a bunch I grabbed from a windows install, but gave up when I read how much config there is
<Burgundavia> why can't I just drop them into a directory?
<ogra> you can...
<Burgundavia> oh?
<Burgundavia> how and where?
<ivoks> Burgundavia ?
<ogra> as long as you use ttf
<ivoks> just make links
<ivoks> and then mkttfdir
<Burgundavia> ok
<ivoks> or ttmkfdir
<ogra> drop them into fonts:// with nautilus
<ivoks> something like that...
<Burgundavia> ah
<ivoks> or that :)
<ivoks> nautilus should have something like "copy as root" :)
<ogra> bah
<ivoks> but that could be managed with scripts...
<ogra> filemangers simply shouldnt be used as root
<ivoks> i agree
<ivoks> but sometimes i need that pic over there
<ivoks> and... well... i need xterm
<dholbach> ok... any opinions on the meeting with the malone guys? something like the 11th? any preferred time?
<tseng|work> erm
<Burgundavia> should I dump the logo up on the wiki?
<ogra> dholbach, guys ? there are more ?
<Burgundavia> and let others hack away?
<tseng|work> i vote for 6pm est
<tseng|work> but yeah
<dholbach> ogra: at least bradb, kiko and bjornt will want to hear us
<ogra> ah, ok
<dholbach> tseng|work: please give UTC times :-)
<tseng|work> dholbach: did they come up for anything with my request?
<dholbach> your request?
<tseng|work> about moving bug tracking off the wiki and into malone
<tseng|work> linked tasks
<dholbach> tseng|work: this will be about the 1.0 release (due in 7 weeks) when main will use it as well
<dholbach> tseng|work: so i fear it won't be the QA solution  we all  had in mind
<tseng|work> 7 weeks seems like forever in coding time
<ogra> hmm
<dholbach> tseng|work: they aren't
<ogra> depends
* thom gibbers at 7 weeks till malone
<tseng|work> oh well
<tseng|work> I guess we can keep doing bug tracking on a wiki
<tseng|work> and let malone fill up with silly stuff
<herve> re
<dholbach> hey herve
<herve> hi daniel!
<herve> read about the t-shirts
<dholbach> yeah! t-shirts!
<herve> it's still a nice idea but cafe press and other us shops cost a fortune to europeans
<herve> especially french probably, we have lots of nice custom taxes ;-)
<ogra> herve, sabdfl will care for the printing
<herve> Burgundavia, create ~/.fonts, drop yours in there, run fc-cache and you're done
<Burgundavia> herve, ok
<herve> ha ok, it's that serious
<herve> I like tseng motu logo
<herve> i mean the logo I saw, not sure who made it
<Burgundavia> http://img213.echo.cx/img213/1849/path28895ls.png <-- this one?
<herve> yes
<Burgundavia> mine
<Burgundavia> I am trying to put up the wiki, but it is failing me
<herve> the motu, ubuntu logo plus universe theme
<herve> ho sorry then
<Burgundavia> np
<jabra> so I wanta package a shell script but the docs are only for source is there someplace I should look for docs on build a deb of a shell script
<herve> I would see a black t-shirt, just the white ubuntu logo with the orbit on the heart
<herve> and your image in white behind
<Burgundavia> sure
<herve> jabra, it's 99% of the time just about copying the script to its dest dir
<herve> cp, install, tar, choose your weapon ;-)
<herve> I know a pretty good t-shirt printer in france if needed
<dholbach> "choose your poison" :-)
<herve> dholbach, your thesis gives you suicidal tendencies? ;-)
<dholbach> not yet :-)
<jabra> I guess I am unclear about where that would be set. Obviously I know where it should go but when I am building debs I am not sure. I have a tarball already
<herve> jabra, it's the same package I have reviewed once,
<herve> ?
<jabra> no something I am creating
<jabra> it's a wireless tool
* Burgundavia beats head against wall over wiki upload form
<herve> jabra, I don't find what would cause you a problem
<herve> I think this weekend is *the* weekend
<herve> where I change my debian server for a hoary one!
<jabra> ok let me get more information, so I am be more specific
<herve> Burgundavia, also beating my head against the wall trying to file a bug in bugzilla
<bddebian> Does it hurt?
* Burgundavia loves the bad tools
<dholbach> Unfrgive1: iptraf looks good apart from s/unstable/breezy and it doesnt seem to build in breezy :-)
* Burgundavia thinks he going to start using windows, just to have more pain
<herve> dholbach, so not that good! :-)
<dholbach> Unfrgive1: what did you intend with the putty package?
<ogra> whats wrong with the putty package ?
<dholbach> the debdiff just shows an added entry in the changelog
<jabra> herve: ok so since I don't have a Makefile debuild isn't sure what to do since my package is a shell script
<Burgundavia> if you want the logo idea, just ask me
<herve> jabra, debuild does what you tell in debian/rules
<ogra> jabra, sure you have a makefie ;)
<jabra> no I dont
<ogra> debian/rules is a makefile
<jabra> I am wondering if I should make one of if I can get away without it
<jabra> ok
<herve> in the absolute you can, it depends on your needs :-)
<jabra> then I should just add DESTDIR=place for my tool
<herve> just cp it to the usr/bin of your temporary package hierarch
<herve> +y
<herve> if you're using debhelper
<herve> you probably have left dh_fixperms
<herve> which is a good thing (TM)
<jabra> k and same for the manpage
<herve> hmm
<herve> you could
<herve> you could also use debhelper facilities
<jabra> just wondering if a real  Makefile would make this easier cause I could just build one
<herve> if you have things for it to do, sure
<jabra> but not sure since it doesn't compile
<herve> but I don't think so
<herve> makefiles are not just for compiling
<jabra> ya
<herve> they are for automating tasks
<jabra> k
<herve> and save time by detecting which tasks are already done
<jabra> can I just create dir by hand or just I use a dh tool and cp my binary there
<dholbach> jabra: just as a notice: NEW packages don't belong on MOTUToReview :-))
<jabra> o my bad I will remvoe it.
<jabra> why is that
<herve> jabra, as you feel it, dehelper is not mandatory
<herve> but really handy, sure
<herve> that reminds me I should take a look at cdbs
<dholbach> jabra: just did it :-)
<dholbach> ivoks: ping
<ivoks> :)
<ivoks> i'm alive
<ivoks> not sleeping :)
<dholbach> ok
<ivoks> you needed me...?
<dholbach> first thing: in debian/changelog: your entries should never have "unstable" in it
<ivoks> oh, ok...
<herve> dch -Dbreezy :-)
<dholbach> please don't change the maintainer field, unless you REALLY REALLY REALLY want to be the maintainer: i.e. activily maintain it, get all the blame, fix all the bugs, ... :-)
<bddebian> hehe
<ivoks> :)
<herve> start flamewars on debian-devel list, etc. :-)
<ivoks> well, the problem is...
<ivoks> guys at debian don't like that
<ivoks> i had problems with one package and it had debian maintainer
<herve> but guys at debian don't dictate the ubuntu procedures
<ivoks> yeah...
<dholbach> bugs should be filed in malone
<ivoks> hm...
<ivoks> maintainer stays :)
<dholbach> if you make a change and the version was 1.2.3-1 before, it is 1.2.3-1ubuntu1 afterwards
<dholbach> (if you don't have a new upstream version)
<ivoks> ok
<ogra> and if its not a simple rebuild
<ivoks> lot of mistakes :)
<dholbach> if we have a newer upstream version than debian: 1.2.4-0ubuntu1
<dholbach> ivoks: don't worry :-)
<ivoks> i know that... ok -1 is -1ubuntu1, ok
<dholbach> -1 is a debian version
<dholbach> -1ubuntu1 is the -1 version with ubuntu-specific changes
<ivoks> ok
<jabra> herve: I created the dirs and cp the binary there. so how would I build the deb since debuild gives errors
<dholbach> why did you change the (build)-depends for quodlibet?
<ivoks> then if u have package-1.1.1-1woody and package-1.1.1-1ubuntu
<ogra> or a rebuild ;) elmo asked that we dont tag rebuilds with a ubuntuX version
<ivoks> dholbach ?
<ivoks> dholbach libc version I think?
<herve> jabra, fix the errors :-)
<jabra> error is no makefile
<herve> jabra, because you're calling make in your debian/rules?
<dholbach> ivoks: for quodlibet you enforced newer versions of debhelper, python-gtk2-dev, python-gtk2, libgtk2.0-0
<ivoks> dholbach IRC yes
<jabra> so then I comment that out
<dholbach> ivoks: why?
<ivoks> dholbach to make it ubuntu specific package...
<ivoks> but i realize now that was a mistake
<herve> dholbach, we asked debhelper 4.1 or something for python 2.4 support
<dholbach> herve: ah ok, ivoks: you should describe that in debian/changelog  ...  ok, now i understand
<ivoks> jesus... so simple package, and so much mistakes :)
<herve> CountofDijon, ?!
<Burgundavia> joke on #wikipedia
<ivoks> ok, i'll build new ones and upload them
<herve> ivoks, first package? that's pretty normal :-)
<Burgundavia> listen to me talk! http://cs.georgefox.edu/~jdodson/videos.php
<Burgundavia> bottom link, linuxfest northwest
<ivoks> herve if u don't count those created with make-kpkg :))
<herve> sure!
<jabra> herve: I think I got it
<jabra> herve: but it seems messy the way I did it
<herve> Burgundavia, you don't feel comfortable :-)
<herve> jabra, I'll tell you when I'll review it :-)
<Burgundavia> herve, sorry, don't follow
<Mithrandir> ogra: are you interested in multisync stuff?
<herve> Burgundavia, it wasn't even you (the first one)
<ogra> Mithrandir, not really, i have no device to test it
<jabra> ok cool
<Burgundavia> herve, I didn't make the video, scroll through to the Ubuntu talk
<ogra> Mithrandir, my ipaq has linux on it, i do nfs there ;)
<Mithrandir> ogra: ok; ISTR somebody was, do you by any chance know who?
<ogra> dholbach, multisync for you ?
<dholbach> multisync?
<ogra> dholbach, can you test it ? i cant
<dholbach> Mithrandir: what shall i test?
<Mithrandir> I was more wondering if you were interested in it, since we might want to get a new version in breezy.
<herve> Burgundavia, yes, now I am
<Mithrandir> one with the gnokii support.
<dholbach> i can't test gnokii - it's about nokia stuff, isnt it?
<dholbach> Mithrandir: you want me to package a newer version?
* dholbach isnt sure, if he got the question right
<Mithrandir> dholbach: gnokii is nokia syncing, yes.
<dholbach> i can't test nokia stuff, sorry
<Mithrandir> I can test it.
<Mithrandir> but I don't want to spend time maintaining even more stuff. :)
<dholbach> i see
<dholbach> azeem is the multisync man
<Mithrandir> ah, that's who it was.
<Mithrandir> I'll prod him next time I see him around
<Mithrandir> thanks.
<herve> Burgundavia, you behave much better than the others, I just hope your audience was a geeky one!
<Burgundavia> herve, the room was pretty full
<dholbach> he's in #u-d
<Burgundavia> lots of women and old people
<herve> talking about the hardware database ;-)
<ogra> :)
<Burgundavia> I think the hardware database is one of the coolest little pieces of polish I have seen
<Burgundavia> nobody else that I know of has it
<ogra> thanks :)
<ogra> but it still has a lot of bugs....
<Burgundavia> bug, smugs
<Burgundavia> the concept and the idea is what is cool
<herve> I particulary like the like transition effects on dialog change ;-
<Burgundavia> I think he missed some of my talk
* dholbach shouldnt highlight "transition" :-)
<Burgundavia> he also missed about 1/2 hour of question and answer time
<herve> (ho boy, don't think I'm drunk... well, not that much at least)
<herve> Burgundavia, he couldn't keep it all
<ogra> Burgundavia, fedora thought that too, they start their own one now and asked me for hints and help...
<herve> you already eat like 80% of the video :-)
<herve> ogra, why not using a common one?
<ogra> yep
<ogra> herve, but that would mean they have to patch their HAL too, so its something we should do after upstream accepts my patches....
<ogra> ....which is unlikely because its not that asy to provide a xml spec for the bios data.... it varys a lot
<ivoks> ok, i hope it's better now :)
<tseng|work> did you see some other distro ripped off your xscreensaver ogra
<ogra> http://www.foresightlinux.com/screenshots/index.php?image=xlock.png
<ogra> this one ?
<Burgundavia> doesn't debian now have it as well?
<ogra> nope
<Burgundavia> I have seen it in a few places
<Burgundavia> not just foresight
<ogra> debian didnt accept it
<ivoks> :(
<ogra> they have instead introduced a "new login" button in the old dialog for now...
<ivoks> i just love ubuntu :)
<ogra> which unfortunately changed the lock.c code a lot....so my patch would have to be rewritten
<ogra> (completely)
<jabra> ok it appears that dh_installman is putting the manpage in the proper place but lintian says no man file for binary?
<herve> jabra, I guess they wear the same name?
<jabra> ya
<jabra> getwifi with no extension
<jabra> the man has .1
<herve> so I guess it's in usr/share/man/man1 ?
<jabra> ya
<jabra> thoughts?
<herve> I'll need the whole package to audit it
<herve> my connection may cut
<herve> so see you later in case
<jabra> aight
<jabra> sounds good I will put it on the wiki when it is done
<jabra> probably later today
<jabra> herve: really appreciate your help
<ivoks> http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/MOTULogo
<ivoks> guys, this is disaster :)
<herve> correction: it will cut
<herve> in 5... 4... 3... 2... 1...
<jabra> umm use screen ?
<Burgundavia> ivoks, I tried to upload a file, but it failed (user stupidity)
<ivoks> :)
<ivoks> np
<Nafallo> I think that page says; MOTU is so good they don't need a logo ;-).
<ivoks> Burgundavia http://www.grad.hr/~ivoks/P3260060.JPG u have my permissone to use this one as a logo :)
<Burgundavia> ivoks, lol
<ivoks> rule #1 don't ever underestimate power of the sun in the mountains :)
<dholbach> OUCH
<dholbach> OUCH OUCH OUCH
<ivoks> hehe
<dholbach> this is you? :-)
<ivoks> yep
<ivoks> winter before this one...
<dholbach> that must have hurt
<Burgundavia> how about this one? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Corey_Burger.jpg
<ivoks> lol
<ivoks> anyone likes blonde girls?
<Burgundavia> not really
<ivoks> http://www.grad.hr/~ivoks/francuska/dsc02811.jpg :)
<ivoks> ok
<ivoks> it isn't porn :)
<Treenaks> eutelsat? :)
<ivoks> heh, chairs?
<Nafallo> in what lang?
<Treenaks> Nafallo: "eutelsat" is a European telecom satellite company, I guess
<Treenaks> Nafallo: http://www.eutelsat.com/home/index.html
<Nafallo> ahh
<herve> hmm... seems like I'm back
<Treenaks> wb then, herve
<Nafallo> I thought eutelsat was chairs in some strange language ;-)
<Treenaks> Nafallo: that'd just be sick :)
<herve> I guess it would mean european telecommunication satellite?
<ivoks> :)
<Nafallo> Treenaks: that's what I thought ;-)
* Nafallo should go to bed early :-/. have to call the vet as early as possible tomorrow :-(.
<ivoks> Nafallo what happend?
<Nafallo> ivoks: my rabbit jumped down from the sofa at the same time I rushed by.
<ivoks> oh no
<Nafallo> ivoks: he landed on the side and now he refuse to use one of his front feets :-/
<ivoks> uh...
<ajmitch_> morning all
<herve> morning ajmitch_
<ivoks> i hate going to vet...
<ivoks> morning...
<Mithrandir> if anybody cares about zope, fixing http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=279323 (which was 3961 in our bugzilla) should be easy enough.
<herve> ivoks, where was the photograph taken?
<Nafallo> I locked him in the cage, that's what I can do for now I think... he tries to bite me when I come to close :-/.
<ivoks> herve witch one? all in france...
<ivoks> Nafallo he hates u now :)
<herve> ivoks, the "eutelsat" one :-)
* ajmitch_ looks at zope bug
<ivoks> herve alpe'de'huez, france
<ivoks> near albertville
<Nafallo> ivoks: I belive he hates everything right now.
<herve> Mithrandir, zope 2.6 is *dead* anyway
<ivoks> herve girls are from croatia, not france :)
<herve> and if not yet, i'll beat it to death
<ivoks> :)
<Mithrandir> herve: ok
<herve> ivoks, just curious about the location :-)
<ivoks> herve :)
* Mithrandir is mostly trying to get rid of old "marked for action" emails.
<herve> Mithrandir, we are not concerned by that version, to stay polite :-)
<Mithrandir> herve: :P
<herve> ivoks, near where I live, in fact
<herve> well, near... "near" I mean
<ivoks> herve and that is...?
<herve> Grenoble
<ivoks> ah
<ivoks> herve tell me something...
<ivoks> herve i had truble communicating with people in france... why do u refuse to speek english? :)
<ivoks> herve by "u" i mean french :)
<herve> your accent may be the problem :-p
<Nafallo> they are actually smart. when all the rest of the world speaks english, they fixed so that the human kind still has _two_ languages :-).
<ivoks> herve :)
<herve> Nafallo, seriously speaking, having a single language may be the worst thing that would happen to mankind
<ivoks> i agree
<Nafallo> herve: yea. that's where french come into picture :-).
<ivoks> ok, i didn't want to start a war :)
<Nafallo> *s*
<Nafallo> I like french. that's why I'm learning it ;-)
<herve> ivoks, don't worry, we change #u-m to a philosophical bar from time to time :-)
<ivoks> i tried learning german?
<ivoks> omg...
<Nafallo> *s*
<ivoks> s/german?/german/
<ivoks> i never learnd english (u can tell by mistakes)
<ivoks> but german is very very hard...
<herve> :-)
<ivoks> i heard from people that croatian is even harder...
<Nafallo> not to talk about swedish ;-)
<ivoks> i can imagine...
<ivoks> Nafallo swedish just sounds hard
<Nafallo> ivoks: not for me ;-)
<ivoks> :)
<ivoks> i know
<herve> but pronounciation sounds funny :-)
<Nafallo> ivoks: I wouldn't want to try finish though ;-)
<ivoks> how many declinations has swedish?
<ivoks> german and english have 3 or 4
<ivoks> we have 7
* Nafallo should look up that word first
<ivoks> :)
<ivoks> nominativ, genitiv... etc...
<herve> that reminds me the latin courses :-)
<herve> well,
<ivoks> :)
<herve> when you say some language is hard or harder than another
<Nafallo> hmm, dunno really. I think we have 5 or 7.
<ivoks> http://www.german-grammar.de/grammar/chapter_24/24_3_summary.htm
<herve> remember two-year old kids manage to learn it :-)
<ivoks> german has 4
<ivoks> ah... time for bed...
<ivoks> long day tomorrow :(
<abelli> my lords .. good night.
<ivoks> bye all
<herve> bye
<abelli> ivoks: ciao
<ivoks> abelli
<ivoks> finally someone from a country next to mine :)
<ivoks> arrivederci
<abelli> ivoks: where are you from?
<ivoks> croatia
<abelli> ou la la .. croatian girls.
<ivoks> :))
<abelli> ivoks: im ready for an exchange
<Nafallo> well, I gotta sleep. night all! and if I say "morning" tomorrow, tell me to go call the vet.
<abelli> haggai: ciao
<herve> night Nafallo
<abelli> Nafallo: ok.
<ivoks> abelli u have few nice ones too :)
<abelli> Nafallo: sweet dreams.
<abelli> herve: do you know what burning app is going to be supported eventually?
<herve> abelli, not a clue
<abelli> herve: thx anyway.
* Mithrandir kicks transcode
<Burgundavia> abelli, serpentine
<Burgundavia> abelli, with nautilus for the data burning
<abelli> Burgundavia: thank you very much
<herve> yet another burning app? :-)
<Burgundavia> serpentine looks pretty cool
<Burgundavia> drag and drop mp3-->cd burning
<Burgundavia> dead simple interface
<abelli> Burgundavia: is not very intuitively fast .. but yes its nice
<abelli> moreover .. i think that implementing some kind of keyboard control in gnome wouldnt be that bad.
<herve> gnome (gtk) handles keyboard quite bad
<herve> hit enter in a dialog... hit a dozen times more... then you take the mouse to click ok :-/
<Burgundavia> where does gnome keep its icons for file types?
<abelli> aint in in somewhere/pixmaps .. wait
<herve> /usr/share/icons/<theme>/mimetypes/
<herve> er no
<abelli> hu yeah right.
<herve> there a dir per size before the end
<Burgundavia> thanks
<abelli> good night everybodyu
<herve> night
<abelli> .. and have a good day to the others ..
<abelli> ciao
* Burgundavia is beating my against glade
<herve> what would you advise me to run a multidomain imap server along with postfix?
<Mithrandir> dovecot or courier.
<Burgundavia> can I have opinions? http://img161.echo.cx/img161/6384/filecopydialogtest5yx.png
<jabra> should man pages be gzipped before being installed?
<herve> jabra, dh_installman does the right thing :-)
<jabra> ok
<herve> Burgundavia, I don't like the arrow, and the size and time info need too much effort to find how to read it
<Burgundavia> herve, they need to be bigger and more centered I think
<Burgundavia> the from --> to, needs to be tied together more visually
<Burgundavia> by being more seperate
<herve> Mithrandir, does courier handle multiple domains?
<Mithrandir> herve: works for me at least.
<herve> night all
#ubuntu-motu 2005-05-14
<mert38> selam millett
<tseng> seb is my hero
<Burgundavia> oh?
<tseng> yes
<tseng> he fixed gnomedb
<Burgundavia> why?
<Burgundavia> ah
<whiprush> tseng: you put your pictures up anywhere?
<tseng> tseng.ath.cx/photos
<whiprush> ta
<whiprush> I misplaced my cable so I'm ripping you off. :)
<tseng> huh?
<whiprush> cable to my camera
<whiprush> can't find it
<tseng> i see
<tseng> lamont: sorry, any chance of kicking gtk-sharp2-unstable_1.9.3-1ubuntu1 for gnomedb love
<whiprush> man, you got some great shots
<tseng> sure did
<tseng> http://tseng.ath.cx/photos/index.php?galerie=udu&snimek=14
<tseng> im a fan of that
<whiprush> yeah, thanks for making me 2x as huge as I already am.
<whiprush> FEE FI FO FUM ...
<lamont> FEE FIE FOE FEE FIE FEE FOE
<tseng> hah
<tseng> i wish this one of lamont turned out better
<tseng> with his homeland security approved pliers
<tseng> http://tseng.ath.cx/photos/index.php?galerie=udu&snimek=19&exif_style=&show_thumbs=
<lamont> tseng: from the comedy club last night....  that's Mike Tyson telling someone his phone mumber
<lamont> with apologies to our non-english speaking audience
<tseng> hah!
<whiprush> any other galleries?
<lamont> tseng: I just gave back everything in universe that had 'libgda2-3' or 'libgnomedb' in it's log.
<lamont> which included gtk-sharp
<tseng> lamont: oh rock on.
<tseng> still 2 steps ahead
<tseng> whiprush: ive seen a few
<tseng> um
<tseng> jane and dilinger had some
<tseng> ogra
<whiprush> k
<lamont> hrm.. guess I should go get my camera and download my pics, eh?
<whiprush> I'll have a weeklong blogathon with them then
<lamont> tseng: sigh... is mono bootstrappable on amd64 yet?
<tseng> lamont: i know what part i missed merging now, should build properly with this upload
<lamont> tseng: doesn't require any bootstrapping love from me?  way cool!
<tseng> lamont: nope, just me doing nasty things to make cli-common build
<tseng> which is hopefully a one-time deal
<ajmitch_> we hope
<ajmitch_> it's such a small, insignificant change with that cli-common stuff
<tseng> gar i feel like im back at udu
<ajmitch_> just enough to be annoying
<ajmitch_> network is that crap?
<tseng> dhclient every 2 minutes
<ajmitch_> ah
<tseng> did you see the muine made the tray icon a plugin?
<tseng> im not sure if i want to install it in the package
<ajmitch_> if muine has an alarm plugin, I'll switch
<tseng> it does
<tseng> 2, actually
<ajmitch_> excellent
<ajmitch_> that's the main reason I use xmms still
<tseng> oh man
<tseng> welcome to 1998
<ajmitch_> xmms is great, it Just Works almost 50% of the time
<tseng> gtk-sharp_1.0.8-1ubuntu1_source.changes ACCEPTED
<tseng> there we go
<ajmitch_> rock on
<tseng> and 2 is already up
<tseng> um
<tseng> so gecko and gtksourceview
<tseng> dbust
<Nafallo> hi all! anyone else suffering from insomnia? ;-)
<ajmitch_> no, it's lunchtime here
<Nafallo> ajmitch_: where is here? .au? :-)
<Nafallo> ahh, .nz
<Nafallo> dholbach: are you busy atm?
<Nafallo> dholbach: anyway, my bug against gparted was a user-to-fast-to-read-bug. please read my comment and do what you think will suffice :-).
<Unfrgive1> dholbach: ill have a look at why iptraf doesn build in breezy. it built fine in hoary.
<Unfrgive1> dholbach: what did you think of my packaging in general? is it ok? have i made any major blunders?
<Unfrgive1> dholbach: ive got some more gnome applets on the way
<tseng> wow!
<tseng> mono 1.1.7 rocks.
<ajmitch_> ?
<tseng> ajmitch_: io rewrite
<tseng> ajmitch_: its so f'n fast
<ajmitch_> excellent
<tseng> the official claim is beagled is 300% faster
<tseng> i believe it now
<ajmitch_> worthwhile crack-of-the-day then
<tseng> yes
<tseng> next we need to get inotify working
<tseng> gamin cvs should be alright now
<ajmitch_> do the patches still break everything when enabled?
<tseng> whenever we get a new kernel
<tseng> no
<tseng> actually i could turn it on now
<tseng> only one real bug
<tseng> hm nevermind that, i need a newer patch
<tseng> ajmitch_: http://people.ubuntu.com/~lamont/buildLogs/m/mono/1.1.6-3ubuntu6/
<tseng> ajmitch_: we have arrived.
<ajmitch_> and it is good
<ajmitch_> so was that 10 uploads in total?
<tseng> something like that
<tseng> im a tool
<ajmitch_> sweet, sweet crack
<tseng> so should i upload 1.1.7
<tseng> or another 1.1.6
<ajmitch_> 1.1.7
<tseng> hell yeah
<ajmitch_> get that speed
<ajmitch_> I think you should hack the preinst script to put up a huge notice if any backport versions are installed
<tseng> right..
<tseng> ill get right on that after updating this dpatch
<tseng> Subject: mono_1.1.7-0ubuntu1_source.changes ACCEPTED
<tseng> party time
<ajmitch_> that was nice & quick
<tseng> only had to fix one patch
<tseng> im done abusing the buildd for today
<tseng> good night
<dholbach> nafallo: i won't tell publicly in what way i was busy... :-)
<ajmitch_> night tseng
<dholbach> night tseng
<tseng> :(
<tseng> still cant sleep
<dholbach> good night
<ajmitch_> night dholbach
<ajmitch_> sleep well :)
<dholbach> thanks
<ivoks> morning
<ajmitch_> hi
<pjo> hello
<pjo> i got problems
<pjo> i do not know where to post my questions   so pls advise where
<pjo> questions on http://ubuntuforums.org/archive/index.php/t-27811.html
<ivoks> go to #ubuntu
<pjo> ivoks  thanks   i asked about there but not yet gotten any advise
<ivoks> well, u can try here, but on this channel are motu developers, not users
<pjo> ok
<pjo> I followed what is written on the page and I got errors http://pastebin.com/280316
<pjo> i would appreciate if you could examine the errors, ivoke
<ivoks> there isn't anything to follow on that page
<pjo> It looks like scim is trying to open a small window for inputting Japanese but scim could not do that
<ivoks> this is kde
<ivoks> i don't use and don't know anything about it
<pjo> "follow"  i meant, i did what was written in there
<pjo> ok
<ivoks> where?
<pjo> http://ubuntuforums.org/archive/index.php/t-27811.html
<ivoks> there is only sh startkde.sh
<ivoks> ok, let's start from begining
<ivoks> go to #ubuntu, i'm over there
<pjo> can I open channel withb you because #unbutu is very busy
<ivoks> ok
<Nafallo> morning all
<ivoks> bye all
<Nafallo> ogra: morning :-)
<ogra> hi
<\sh> morning
<ajmitch_> hi
<herve> morning
<\sh> *grmpf*
<dholbach> morning
<Nafallo> dholbach: hi! saw my msg?
<herve> morning dholbach
<dholbach> Nafallo: yes, but i don't quite remember, what it was about *blush*
<dholbach> *backlog*
<Nafallo> dholbach: hehe, my bug against gparted.
<dholbach> ah yes ok :-)
<Nafallo> dholbach: I looked through the source and the message was there, but I would love it to be more visible.
<Nafallo> dholbach: right now it's like <big>Do you want to convert this partition?</big>
<Nafallo> <br />
<dholbach> upstream is in surinam atm, but i'll see if we can't change it
<herve> big? baaaah ! it's a deprecated element :-)
<Nafallo> <small>This will destroy all data!</small><br /><ok><cancel>
<dholbach> morning herve
<Nafallo> herve: and <ok> and <cancel> isn't there ;-)
<Nafallo> dholbach: change it to red text and make the text bigger or something :-)
<Nafallo> dholbach: or should I take a look at it again later?
* Nafallo knows dholbach should do other things *
<herve> s/should/must
<dholbach> if you like to do it, don't stop yourself :-)
<herve> :-)
* Nafallo thinks of changing "convert" to "destroy&create" ;-)
<ogra> herve, <big> is fine in pango ;)
<\sh> 19:00 UTC == 21:00 german time?
<ogra> yep
* \sh needs utc -> gmt + 2 converter *hehe*
<Amaranth> utc == gmt ?
<Nafallo> big is also fine on irc to describe stuff ;-)
<Mithrandir> use date -d '2005-05-06 19:00 UTC'
<ogra> \sh, gworldclock ;)
<\sh> dholbach: why did u assign amu on  the eric3 bug of malone? :)
<dholbach> date -u
<\sh> ogra: well...;)
<Mithrandir> dholbach: that's the other way around
<dholbach> Mithrandir: but he could verify :-)
<Nafallo> damn I need faster downstream...
<\sh> i need a bigger harddrive for my laptop
<Nafallo> my sync just finished first pass. after 6 bloody hours!!
<\sh> all the startrek seasons are not fitting :(
<dholbach> \sh: because it's some QT crack... i just wanted to have some assignees for bugs :-)
<Nafallo> \sh: hehe, feel the same about charmed and dead zone ;-).
<\sh> dholbach: yeah...and I'm fixing this bug, creating dpatches against pyqt and pykde :)
<ogra> \sh, get on with your MOTUness so we can bomb you with QT bugs !
<\sh> ogra: hahaha...:) I'm waiting to become CoC member first :)
<dholbach> \sh: have fun :-)
<\sh> dholbach: it's done here locally...to test
<dholbach> that's how all patches start ;-)
<\sh> dholbach: and if upstream does not provide a new release on monday, I will release the patched working version
* Nafallo have a haircut on saturday and a job interview the 17:th :-)
<ogra> \sh, how about your packagemanager thingie ? did you et in contact with mvo already ? kubuntu looks for something like that it seems
<Nafallo> ...and time at the vet in 2 hours :-/
<ogra> how's your rabbit ? better today ?
<\sh> dholbach: upstream said that he wants to provide a new release with patches applied
<dholbach> cool
<Nafallo> ogra: yea a little, he actually uses the bad leg when standing, but he isn't when jumping around :-/.
<Nafallo> ogra: he still tries to bit me when I get close to :-/.
<Nafallo> s/bit/bite/
<ogra> but at least he stands again.... sounded bad yesterday....
<\sh> ogra: not right now...but as i saw from a couple of postings of michael, he has also some problems with this thing
<\sh> ogra: and changing the kynaptic source is a fscking hell of work
<\sh> ogra: problem is, there is no documentation
<ogra> \sh, i think they want to drop kynaptic for something better
<Nafallo> ogra: he stood on three legs yesterday. he's layed down mostly.
<ogra> \sh, SO WRITE SOMETHING AND GET FAMOUS MAN !
<Nafallo> right now he's sleeping...
<\sh> ogra: harhar
<\sh> ogra: u had a nice time down under, I had fscking stress and work here ;)
<\sh> ogra: i need a life ;)
<ogra> \sh, we had 200 BOFs in 6 days with about 40 ppl.... it was hard work....
<ogra> 10-12h schedule every day
<\sh> ogra: yeah, but working in a swimmingpool is much better than doing +80h in 2 weeks overtime work
<ogra> that was  only possible on the first day.....
<ogra> i didnt see the pool afterwards
<\sh> ogra: just joking, but in the last 3 weeks I did my normal 40hour week + add 12 hours per day ... i had  in one week 5 nightshifts without ok from guenther
<\sh> but forced by guenther
<ogra> heh
<ogra> \sh, there are better jobs out there
<\sh> ogra: yeah...php devel in london for 37k pounds/yeah
<\sh> -h+r
<ogra> go on :)
<\sh> ogra: too less money ;)
<ogra> bah...
<\sh> ogra: have to pay income taxes in uk and social taxes in germany == the money as here :)
<ogra> not for the first 6 months
<\sh> ogra: not for the last 6 months :)
<\sh> ogra: and u have to think about the prices...double the price e.g. for cigarettes...the pubs are only opened until 11
<\sh> nono...:)
<\sh> ogra: but if you have time..review my bugfix packages ;)
<dholbach> reviewers! reviewers! reviewers! :-)
<herve> yes?
<herve> who's calling me? :-)
<dholbach> hahaha :-)
<Nafallo> lol
<\sh> actually
<\sh> dholbach...when r u visiting ogra again? tell me :) u can buy some nice "hansa tin beer" I'm need something to taste from my hometown ;)
<\sh> -'m
<\sh> oh audio problems...br
<\sh> b
<dholbach> hansa tin beer?
<hunger> Any chance of getting a new qemu deb anytime soon?
<dholbach> can't you get that anywhere apart from blankenheim?
<ogra> isnt that the aldi brand ?
<hunger> Hmmm... debian still has the old one, too.
<dholbach> hunger: would you like to package it? :-)
<\sh> ogra: no :)
<hunger> dholbach: Nope, I would like to use it;-)
<\sh> dholbach: hansa beer :)
<ogra> in tin cans
<\sh> but hansa beer in tins ;)
<dholbach> hunger: would you file a wishlist bug for it on malone?
<\sh> ogra: ok :) tin cans ;) but we were naming it: "Blech Bier"
<hunger> dholbach: I am stupid wrt. packages.
<dholbach> hunger: that's how we all started
<\sh> ogra: aldi beer == karlsberg quell ;)
<ogra> ah, yes
<\sh> ogra: old beer from dortmund == hansa :)
<hunger> dholbach: Oh, believe mee, I tried... and failed horribly:-)
<herve> I feel odd about buying beers from aldi :-)
<ogra> me too
<\sh> herve: get wife and child, and u will drink everything u get ;-)
<dholbach> hunger: what does the new version have apart from a nicer version number?
<ogra> for the two current bottles in my fridge i flew 16000km ;)
<\sh> ogra: fosters u can buy here as well ;)
<hunger> dholbach: Full x86_64 and MMX/SSE/SSE2 emulation support for one thing.
<ogra> 2 times ;)
<hunger> dholbach: Good to test x86
<ogra> \sh, fosters isnt australian
<hunger> _64 stuff on my 32 bit box.
<dholbach> \sh: fosters doesnt exist
<ogra> \sh, it just pretends to
<dholbach> hunger: so would you file a wishlist bug for it?
<\sh> what was the name of this wannabe australien beer?
<hunger> dholbach: I am.
<dholbach> hunger: else it will be lost in the conversation
* hunger thinks malone is a really stupid bugtracker.
<ogra> \sh, thats a real ausssie beer: http://www.surf4wine.co.uk/Victoria_Bitter.html
<\sh> ah..:)
<dholbach> hunger: would you please add ideas on malone to http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MaloneUniverseWishList ?
<ogra> even better: http://www.australianbeers.com/beers/coopers_sparkling_ale/coopers_sparkling_ale.htm
<\sh> but fosters has the more beautifull grid girl ;)
<herve> haggai, those geeks and their beer... :-)
<\sh> well...in the moment I can't even buy normal drinks...as I saw now on my account
<\sh> 2051 are payed for this month
<\sh> and my account is empty :(
<\sh> shit
<ogra> pheew
<ogra> you had so much less then me ?
<\sh> ogra: normally i get 1900
<\sh> 2051 was with nightwork, on duty calls etc.
<\sh> ogra: and I'm tarif worker :(
<ogra> \sh, i was too
<\sh> ogra: but the problem is: I don't have a dispo
<\sh> ogra: and I won't get one
<ogra> me neither.....
<\sh> ogra: so my account is now 0,0 
<ogra> claim my job, i bet its still free
<\sh> ogra: forget it
<ogra> you'll earn a good bunch more...
<\sh> ogra: ralf hilke and someone called "Kueppers" were fired last week
<ogra> nah
<\sh> ogra: yes
<ogra> alex kuepper ??
<\sh> ogra: and because of the desaster of the 1st April it looks like that someone from marketing will be fired, too
<\sh> ogra: i don't know this guy, frank told us only "hilke and kuepper"
* ajmitch_ returns
<ogra> alex was one of the last sane managers...
<ajmitch_> what's new, people?
<ogra> a mono on amd64 that actually compiles ?
<ajmitch_> ogra: already knew about that - it compiled while we were at UDU :)
<ogra> not on the buildd's
<ajmitch_> it just took a couple of extra tries to get the packaging right
<ajmitch_> yes, on the buildd's
* ajmitch_ uploaded 1.1.6_2ubuntu4 that built on amd64
<ogra> it didnt with the last uploads... until tonight
<ajmitch_> that's because it was rebroken, and then refixed
<ogra> ah...
<ajmitch_> in a sense
<ogra> ok, so no news then....
<ajmitch_> yes, it is news
<ajmitch_> since the first stage of the mono bootstrap is done
<ajmitch_> these packages should no longer have these issues
* ogra already has a running tomboy and gnome-sharp packages locally ;)
<ajmitch_> tseng did good work getting them there
<ogra> yep
* ajmitch_ wants to tryout tomboy & muine
<ogra> muine (at least from the available source package) crashes after some seconds here
<ajmitch_> possibly an amd64 bug - does mono crash or just the app?
<ogra> just the app
<hunger> dholbach: OK, added all the annoyances I found with malone to that wiki page you suggested.
<dholbach> hunger: rocking :-)
<herve> I thought you would have opened bugs in malone :)-
<ajmitch_> ogra, dholbach: heard that sid auto-syncs will stop for awhile real soon now
<ajmitch_> so that the c++ transition can take place
<hunger> herve: IIRC that is not possible.
<\sh> ajmitch_: oho
<ogra> hey... muine works !
<ogra> YAY
<hunger> dholbach: Is there a page for the other bugtracker as well? ;-)
<ajmitch_> ogra: great :)
<\sh> ajmitch_: and how they want to resolve the broken kde? right now, kde.org is blacklisting gcc4
<ajmitch_> \sh: c++ transition is going ahead anyway, afaik
<ogra> must have been the latest update.... so it was mono that crashed ajmitch_
<ajmitch_> ogra: last update was 1.1.6->1.1.7
<ogra> yep
<ogra> exactly
<ajmitch_> we've got a *lot* of universe packages to merge changes with - want me to put together a list?
<\sh> ajmitch_: yeah true, but I don't think we will get a working g++-4.x compiled kde in the next 6 months ;)
<ajmitch_> \sh: kde should fix their code then ;)
<ogra> \sh, we have to
<ogra> \sh, in less then 3 months
<\sh> ajmitch_: hehe...:) sure...but read the mailings ;)
<\sh> ogra: they're blocking ;) looks like :)
<ajmitch_> \sh: g++ will be switched to 4.0 in less than a week, I think
<ogra> \sh, so kubuntu will have to fix it
<\sh> ogra: u mean jonathan and andreas can do the work of kde ? ,-)
<ajmitch_> fedora FC4 uses g++ 4.0, so what will they do?
<\sh> ajmitch_: fedora == redhat == gnome focused
<ogra> \sh, tey already did ;)
<ajmitch_> fedora also has some kde stuff
<hunger> ajmitch_: Redhat has a history of delivering brokenish c++ compilers.
<ogra> \sh, and you will hopefully be motu before freeze to help them out ;)
<\sh> ajmitch_: yeah...but i think they have two compilers on their distri
* hunger remembers the gcc 2.96 horrors...
<\sh> ogra: your word in gods ear ;)
<ajmitch_> we've got more than enough work to keep us busy in the next few weeks :)
<\sh> hunger: that was 2000
* ajmitch_ wants to try & beat dholbach's upload record for hoary ;)
<ajmitch_> hey chmj
<chmj> hello ajmitch_
<ogra> ajmitch_, go ahead :)
<\sh> ajmitch_: review my packages and upload them after reviewing ,-I)
<hunger> \sh: Yeap, but it was still horror.
<\sh> hunger: well...at this time I was working for this company :) and I knew how pissed bero was at this time
<ajmitch_> ogra: I'll write up this merge comparison tool tomorrow, that'll get us a list of versions for sid & breezy
<ogra> great
<hunger> \sh: And they did fumble it a couple of times afterwards... not that thouroughly as back then, but they did.
<\sh> hunger: because of gcc-2.96 and stuff, bero had to go from redhat (I think it was 2001 or 2002) cause he opened his mouth and was complaining
<\sh> and I had to go because I pissed off our female marketing manager ;)
* ajmitch_ loves the total lack of docs for python-apt :)
<dholbach> ajmitch_: ask mvo - docs enough
<dholbach> ajmitch_: the example code is quite good, i found
<ajmitch_> dholbach: yeah, I'll talk to him when I see him around
<dholbach> ajmitch_: he is around :-)
<ajmitch_> he went offline about 10min ago
<ajmitch_> ah, he reconnected :)
<dholbach> :-)
<dholbach> Unfrgiven: are you there?
<\sh> ajmitch_: what informations do u need about python-apt?
<tseng> hm whats this
<ajmitch_> \sh: just talking to mvo now :)
<\sh> ajmitch_: oh...let me talk with him too ;)
<tseng> stuff doesnt seem to be copying from buildd to archive?
<ajmitch_> so many users using breezy already...
<chmj> ajmitch_, I just removed it, its super broken
<tseng> hiya chmj
<chmj> hiya tseng
<\sh> ajmitch_: http://linux.blogweb.de/archives/12-More-from-Pynaptiq.html
<ajmitch_> chmj: breezy is?
<\sh> need a coffee and some nicotine
<ajmitch_> thanks \sh
<chmj> ajmitch_, yes
<\sh> ajmitch_: if u need the source of it, i can send it to you...or i will apply for a berlios project
<Mithrandir> tseng: if you need access to an amd64 box, tell me. :)
<ogra> hmm, tseng muine is now running too thanks to the 1.1.7 update, but f-spot looks like its going to be a pita
<dholbach> see you later
<ivoks> hi
<\sh> ok..added my bugfix packages  to motutoreview
<Nafallo> hi all
<tseng|work> any bets on how long before someone backports mono 1.1.7?
<ogra> hi Nafallo
<tseng|work> hi :P
<ajmitch_> tseng|work: < 24 hours
<ajmitch_> they can't live without it
<tseng|work> ./universe/binary-i386/mono-mcs_1.1.6-2~5.04ubp1_all.deb
<tseng|work> what the hell?
<ogra> i just tried that weird packaged beagle source pkg....
<ogra> argh
<tseng|work> ogra arch
<tseng|work> use jeffs
<tseng|work> i dont think i uploaded mine
<ogra> from p.u.c ?
<Nafallo> Storm is fine, he got analgesic.
<tseng|work> yes
<tseng|work> just uupdate it
<ajmitch_> tseng|work: they backported 1.1.6 from experimental
<ogra> ok, i'll try
<Nafallo> he's ordered to be in the cage for one week though.
<tseng|work> ajmitch_: i know
<ajmitch_> crackful
<tseng|work> retarded++
<tseng|work> at least its meebeys stuff
<tseng|work> and not one of the other ones
<tseng|work> #*** PyMusique supposedly needs additional packages??
<tseng|work> does this guy have any idea what he's doing
<Amaranth> What about PyMusique?
<tseng|work> someone tried to backport it and has nfc what build-deps are I guess
<Amaranth> Please tell me someone isn't trying to get it into ubuntu.
<tseng|work> oh, someone is
<Amaranth> Can I decline? :)
<tseng|work> uh, i can decline just based on past experience with the guy
<Amaranth> Well, I meant as the upstream developer.
<tseng|work> sure
<tseng|work> i dont think this guy is even clueful enough to put it on motutodo or newpackages
<tseng|work> so youre pretty safe
<Amaranth> It a little too risky for others to distribute it right now, I think.
<ogra> tseng|work, i told him to put it where it is...
<ajmitch_> Amaranth: considered unclean at the moment?
<Amaranth> If 'unclean' means you might get sued, yes.
<tseng|work> ajmitch_: dude apple has a hardon for IP legislation
<ajmitch_> heh
<tseng|work> even though they are legally barred from the music business
<Amaranth> That's a trademark thing though.
<tseng|work> (i think they bought their way out of that, though)
<Amaranth> Well, and a contract they signed after System 7.
<mjr> yeah, I too think that they paid Apple Records enough to do music business
* Amaranth wonders if anyone has a copy of the sosumi sound
<Amaranth> herve: On a live cd?
<herve> yes, the last xfs filesystem I have left just exploded
<Amaranth> o_O
<Treenaks> Amaranth: sashimi sound?
<ivoks> ?
<ivoks> xfs works for me for years...
<ogra> herve, i have never seen a xf you couldnt fix
<ogra> xfs even
<Amaranth> Treenaks: sosumi, the start up sound in System 7
<Amaranth> Treenaks: say it out loud :)
<Treenaks> Amaranth: oh, not the piece of sushi ;)
<herve> ogra, tell that to my laptop with a corrupted fs just because I ran out of battery
<herve> and this one exploded because I have no space left
<ogra> herve, look at xfsrepair
<ogra> it has options for such cases
<herve> ogra, hence the live cd :-)
<herve> another thing I couldn't stand
<herve> lost files are deleted
* ajmitch_ still sticks with ext3
<herve> not copied to some lost+found dir for postmortem backup
<Amaranth> it doesn't dump them in /lost+found?
<Amaranth> that's...lame
<ogra> if there is no space left to write to.... *shrug*
<herve> yeah... xfs_repair pieces me off...
<Nafallo> btw, lvm2 can't resize reiser on-the-fly?
<Nafallo> I know lvm could :-P
<ogra> who wants reiser anyway
<herve> ho don't tell me about reiser!
<herve> it was worse :-)
<ogra> yep
<Nafallo> ehm, worksforme(tm) ;-)
<herve> looks like I'll install two hoary this weekend...
* ogra has seen too many people loosing their data with reiser already
<herve> I never had problems with ext3 when I think about it
<Nafallo> hmm
<ogra> herve, http://gnome-hacks.jodrell.net/hacks.html?id=45
<Nafallo> I've thrown all the "must save" stuff on reiser on my server :-P
<ogra> an old odd hack to prevent you from running out of diskspace
<herve> ogra, thanks but too late :-)
<ogra> for the next time ;)
<herve> anyway, it's abnormal a system explodes when ran out of disk space
<herve> gnome wouldn't crash and disappear step by step with ext3
<ogra> its normal for a system, but not for a filesystem...
<ogra> true...
<herve> I already seen my linux giving me more space than available
<herve> I cleaned a bit a everything was fine
<Treenaks> herve: sparse files?
<herve> Treenaks, I don't remember, it was years ago
* ajmitch_ will be worried if he runs out of diskspace soon
<\sh> grmpf
<ajmitch_> great, I've just got to get the version comparison done & I can get a wiki page out of this ;)
* ajmitch_ heads off to sleep
<\sh> ajmitch_: python-apt?
<dholbach> hunger: the malone guys will be grateful for your ideas
<hunger> dholbach: Are you sure?
<hunger> dholbach: I'd be pissed if some stupid "Besserwisser" would whine about my app;-)
<dholbach> hunger: yes... they really need to sort out some things before it goes live for main
<dholbach> we'll have a meeting as soon as i contacted them
<thom> hunger: 15 is pointless, the whole point of malone is so everyone can use it
<\sh> hmmm...when is the next council meeting?
<hunger> thom: Is it? I have to report in either the bugzilla or malone.
<thom> hunger: 14:01 < dholbach> hunger: yes... they really need to sort out some things before it goes live for main
<hunger> thom: With debian I just did "reportbug package"... with ubuntu I have to keep track of trackers;-)
<dholbach> \sh: next week, can't quite remember if it was tuesday or thursday
<ogra> hunger, see the udu wiki
<hunger> thom: Right. I didn't know that when I wrote it this morning.
<ogra> hunger, there was a BOF in udu about that
<hunger> ogra: What is udu?
<\sh> Ubuntu Down Under
<dholbach> ubuntu down under
<ogra> ubuntu down under
<dholbach> the conference
<\sh> hehe
<Nafallo> echo!
<Nafallo> :-P
<\sh> ogra: i talked to mvo :)
<ogra> great
* hunger finds the ubuntu web-sites really confusing!
<\sh> ogra: i have now his working repos of python-apt and can work on it :)
<dholbach> hunger: they unfortunately are
<ogra> \sh, even greater
<ivoks> jesus...
<hunger> So how is a user supposed to know that he has to check udu wiki (wherever that is)?
<\sh> hunger: one word, one action: ask :)
<Nafallo> udu.wiki.ubuntu.com if I remember correctly
<ogra> http://udu.wiki.ubuntu.com/FrontPage
<hunger> \sh: Well, my parents i.e. would never ask... they would just whine till I replaced ubuntu with something else.
<\sh> and listen to the channel carefully, make the names of the cracks red blinking and read the backlogs :) information gathering ;)
<\sh> hunger: oh well, yes, I don't have parents, it's an advantage :)
<thom> hunger: a user doesn't; the point is *you* are not a typical user, we expect you to be able to gather information correctly by dint of being in the irc channels that you are
<dholbach> but we should have more visibility of our plans
<hunger> \sh: That is reasonable for a developer centric distribution... but that is not really the focus of ubuntu, is it?
<dholbach> so i sort of agree with hunger, although it's no easy task
<\sh> hunger: I don't think the typical user should read dev related stuff....he wants something else.and this is on wiki.ubuntu.com
<dholbach> *throwing another buzzword in* TheFridge will solve all of our problems ;-)
<hunger> thom: Well, actually I am in the IRC channels to find out the stuff I couldn't find on the websites:-)
<ogra> yeah, the fridge
<thom> dholbach: *giggle*
<dholbach> i mean: what's left, when we have launchpad and thefridge?
* hunger acusses everybody of being obstrusive! ;-)
<\sh> hunger: well...there r many ways to get the information u want...1. MLs 2. google 3. http://www.ubuntulinux.org/wiki/FrontPage/searchwiki?expr=UdU&submit=Search 4. IRC :)
<thom> TWD
<thom> we already have TRLS, MPBS should be here soon...
<hunger> \sh: 3 does not really work well...
<dholbach> not to forget HCT
<\sh> hunger: of course :)
<\sh> hunger: the 3 link in the resultlist is UbuntuDownUnder ;)
<\sh> and in this wiki article, there is a link to udu.wiki...
<\sh> oh I forgot planet.ubuntu.com
<hunger> \sh: You must have a different search than I do then!
<\sh> hunger: "Wiki Search"
<\sh> hunger: not "search"
<hunger> \sh: AAAAHHHHHH!
<\sh> hunger: and most of the time, our channel bot is working quite well ;)
<\sh> !ogra ubuntu binary drivers
<dholbach> Using fallback bot: "You're probably looking for: http://wiki.ubuntu.com/RestrictedFormats"
<hunger> \sh: Who would have thought that there are several different searches on the ubuntu wiki? And that you have the more obscure one:-)
<\sh> hehe
<\sh> hunger: well...wiki == wiki search...but anyways...I'm used to it :)
<hunger> \sh: Thanks for that tip!
<\sh> dholbach: ;)
<herve> fridges? have I been absent for that long!
<\sh> devels brain is not working like normal ones...most of the time we have to think different...to have a good communication between e.g. dev and sales or dev and marketing ;)
<\sh> herve: u didn't here about TheFridge?
<\sh> -here+hear
<dholbach> bbl
<\sh> brb
<herve> \sh, no, please light my candle :-)
<thom> herve: udu.wiki.ubuntu.com/TheFridge
<herve> thom, thanks
<tseng|work> hm im not sure how much we want to spread that around
<tseng|work> alot of people at the bof had doubts
<\sh> tseng: why?
<\sh> the idea behind it is quite good...but the problem is more: who is operating it, who will write the content etc.
<ogra> tseng|work, beagle 0.0.7 didnt work....segfaults on Util.dll, 0.0.9 compiles, but the daemon crashes from time to time
<\sh> we wanted to this for redhat, a user concentrated portal, but it never saw the light of the world, cause nobody wanted to take care about it
<\sh> oh sh*t...I'm getting old...forgot some words in the sentence
<tseng|work> ogra did you install all the deps
<ogra> yep
<tseng|work> libevolution-cil libgmime-cil libgsf-cil
<tseng|work> hrm
<ogra> yep
<tseng|work> whats it crash on
<tseng|work> you can do beagle --fg --debug
<tseng|work> beagled rather
<ogra> yep, wait, just got it running via best now...
<\sh> smoke
<ogra> heh, i cant stop the running beagled
<Mithrandir> beagle on the run!
<Mithrandir> :)
<ogra> yeah
<ogra> hmm, cant stop the daemon, but it semms to run stable now... weird
<tseng|work> well
<tseng|work> mono apps dont show up as "beagled"
<ogra> heh
<tseng|work> its mono
<tseng|work> gotta kill the pid
<ogra> there is a wrapper script
<herve> killall? rampage? slaughter?
<tseng|work> killall++
<ogra> hmm, but it runns just fine ....
<tseng|work> k
<ogra> dont like to be this nasty to it
<tseng|work> good
<tseng|work> we like running beagles
<ogra> yeah
<ogra> argl
<ogra> the script writes the pid in /var/run....
<tseng|work> oh nice
<ogra> there was a crash before, now the pid doesnt match...
<ogra> ok, killed and restarted... lets see
<tseng|work> did you get 1.1.7?
<tseng|work> this morning it didnt seem like Packages.gz was getting updated
<ogra> got it this morning
<tseng|work> awesome
<tseng|work> its so much faster
<ogra> ouch... best froze this time
<ogra> hm, works fie if i start beagled through best
<ogra> hmm, how long is this supposed to index ? it seems its still indexing...
<ogra> i can see more results after every other search
<tseng|work> it indexes for a long long time
<tseng|work> it does your whole ~
<tseng|work> but it throttles
<ogra> hmmkay...
<tseng|work> so if you go idle or turn on a screensaver it is more aggressive
<tseng|work> if you are using it it doesnt thrash your disk/cpu
<ogra> i'm playing with beagled since some hours
<ogra> so i'd expect it to end once :)
<tseng|work> ive never seen it doing nothing
<tseng|work> its always finding new mail or something
<tseng|work> shrug
<ogra> yep, looks like
<ogra> i'll just eave it alone and wait a while
<tseng|work> and blogs
<tseng|work> it reads all my feeds from blam
<ogra> ah, blam...
<ogra> didnt try it yet
<tseng|work> is any of that stuff installable from the archive yet?
<ogra> only f-spot.... but thats not even trying to compile...braks very early
<ogra> there are source pkg's
<tseng|work> i guess gtk-sharp didnt build on amd yet
<ogra> i built it locally
<tseng|work> https://www.jahc.net/work/discuss/index.cgi
<tseng|work> im not sure what happened there
<tseng|work> maybe the log just got lost again
<ogra> it asks for user/pw
<tseng|work> erm sorry
<tseng|work> thats my cgi-irc script
<tseng|work> meant to be the buildLog dir
<tseng|work> with missing amd64 log
<ogra> oh
<tseng|work> firefox puts that stupid url in every tab
<\sh> so...ppls....going home now...cu later
<Nafallo> hmm
<Nafallo> do people see italic test better than plain normal? :-)
* tritium thinks he'll buy his wife the iMac she wants
<GheRivero> res
<koke> hey, does anyone know why sqlobject was not transitioned??
<koke> http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/universe/s/sqlobject/
<koke> hey, I have my first package for breezy :)
<dholbach> ROCK! :-)
<koke> sqlobject was not pytransitioned :(
<bddebian> Hi
<koke> I still need an uploader :)
<koke> http://amedias.org/~koke/debian/breezy/
* Nafallo joins the I-love-pbuilder-fanclub
* thom smirks at pbuilder
* koke upgradin pbuilder to breezy :D
<Nafallo> hehe
<Nafallo> hmm
* Nafallo wants an update to pbuilder
<Nafallo> imagine pbuilder food recipe
<Nafallo> :-)
<bddebian> Oh no, I think there needs to be an emacs-pbuilder
* bddebian hides
<abelli> buona sera
<zul> jeu
<zul> doh..hey
* Nafallo tries to decrypt what zul says
<zul> i type too fast sometimes
<Nafallo> yay! I must have parse error :-P
<tseng|work> hi
<ivoks> hi
<tseng|work> hm so the mono stuff in breezy is actually further along that i thought
<tseng|work> i can install most of the apps
<tseng|work> and run
<herve> see you all
<dholbach> byeeeeeeee
<tritium> bye dholbach :)
<tseng> hi
<Nafallo> tseng: hi :-)
#ubuntu-motu 2005-05-15
<Nafallo> *sigh* users.
<Nafallo> why compile stuff that's in the archive themselves? :-P
<ajmitch_> because they're users
<Nafallo> ajmitch_: I should just ignore them ;-)
<Nafallo> ajmitch_: I told them se.archive.ubuntu.com needs to sync, and one of them told me he had 1 megabit against that mirror :-P.
<Amaranth> err, doing what?
<Nafallo> Amaranth: install packages I assume. but that doesn't help it download the securityfix for OO.o ;-)
<Amaranth> heh
<tseng> ajmitch_: new muine!
<Nafallo> http://bash.org/?500890
<Nafallo> hilarious :-)
<tseng> ogra: my beagled is mostly stopped now btw
<tseng> ogra: just keeps polling (since no inotify)
<Nafallo> hmm, and that depends on the new kernel?
<tseng> yes
<tseng> and a fixed gamin
<tseng> so about the aac gstreamer plugins requests
<tseng> we might have to make a seperate source package?
<tseng> gst-plugins-multiverse
<tseng> and build just those
<tritium> rest up, crimsun
<Burgundavia> gah, tseng, you borked blam
<ajmitch_> that's the price of running breezy :)
<Burgundavia> indeed
<Burgundavia> just switched today
<Burgundavia> blam doesn't appear to have any debugging options that I can find either
<ajmitch_> how borked is it?
<Burgundavia> starts, but doesn't do anything
<Burgundavia> won't search for updates
<ajmitch_> works for me (tm)
<ajmitch_> testing updates
<ajmitch_> right, so hitting refresh all doesn't do much
<Burgundavia> nop
<dholbach> morning
<ajmitch_> hey daniel
<ajmitch_> how are you?
<dholbach> hey ajmitch_, still a bit tired :-)
<dholbach> went into the pub with mvo yesterday and got home at 3:30 or something
<ajmitch_> great :)
<dholbach> how are you?
<ajmitch_> I'm alright
<ajmitch_> had a quiet day today
<Nafallo> morning
* ajmitch_ waits patiently for his crappy script to run :)
<ajmitch_> dholbach: http://ajmitch.dhis.org/~ajmitch/breezy_merges.txt
<ajmitch_> more fun ;)
<Nafallo> I can see... pipes :-)
<dholbach> i can't believe it - are we ahead of debian in SO MANY places?
<ajmitch_> I haven't sorted it into what's newer in breezy vs debian
<ajmitch_> just what differences there are - there are lots of packages newer in sid still
<ogra> morning
<ajmitch_> Nafallo: wiki syntax
<dholbach> maybe python-apt gives you the nice dpkg comparison operator
<dholbach> hellas ogra
<ajmitch_> hey ogra
<Nafallo> ajmitch_: ahh, kewl :-)
<ogra> is tseng around ?
<ajmitch_> perhaps, but the VersionCompare only takes ints as arguments
<ajmitch_> still working thru python-apt :)
<dholbach> ajmitch_: then you should use   ||    instead of   |  right? ;-)
<ajmitch_> dholbach: whatever works, it's only a print statement  ;)
<ajmitch_> I'd also like to change it to work on source packages instead of binaries
<ajmitch_> and then fetch the diffs for review from MoM
<dholbach> ajmitch_: grab the two Sources.gz before :-)
<ajmitch_> dholbach: yes, but this is using the apt interface -  libapt is reading the sources.list :)
<ajmitch_> otherwise I'll just write up something quickly
<dholbach> this is what i used for the apt-get.org stuff
<dholbach> http://ubuntu.gplan.info/apt-get.org.py
<dholbach> i downloaded 523798752989257 Sources.gz before (via apt-get) and compared them to our own Sources.gz
<ajmitch_> ok :)
<ajmitch_> nice mail template
<dholbach> not that exciting, but   src_recs = apt_pkg.GetPkgSrcRecords()   and  while  src_recs.Lookup(package):   seem to be the important stanzas
<ajmitch_> yep
<ajmitch_> I'm mainly wanting to compare versions
<dholbach> yeah
<ajmitch_> so I'll have to work out the syntax for that
<dholbach> i wonder, when mvo will get up ;-)
<ajmitch_> depends on how much you made him drink ;)
<dholbach> it was ok :-)
<dholbach> i mean, WE didnt end up in the gay bar :-)
<ajmitch_> I'm glad..
<dholbach> (compared to the majority of the ubuntu guys in sydney ;-))
<dholbach> ogra: how are you?
<ogra> fine... tired...
<dholbach> :-)
<ogra> just built the new tomboy source here
<dholbach> me too
<Nafallo> ogra: amd64?
<ogra> there is a typo in the source
<ogra> yep
<Nafallo> ogra: rock!
* ajmitch_ is waiting for the new muine to hit the mirrors
<Nafallo> hmm, s/rock/kewl/
<ogra> runs fine
<ajmitch_> ah, looks like I do have it installed
<Burgundavia> 8.3 already has for me
<ajmitch_> and muine still doesn't work :)
<Nafallo> No, I'm NOT influenced by this channel in any way :-P
<ogra> heh
* ajmitch_ will have to complain to tseng or someone
<Nafallo> ajmitch_: eyy, you we're smiling ;-)
<ajmitch_> ?
* ajmitch_ sees problem, fixes
<Nafallo> ajmitch_: means that you probably LIKE that muine doesn't work ;-)
<ajmitch_> Nafallo: no, why do you think that?
<Nafallo> ajmitch_: the smiliey :-)
<Nafallo> nm, I shouldn't be up this early, but I have a haircut to be made :-)
<dholbach> why is aaronlake (metallikop) on the CCAgenda?
* ajmitch_ wonders if VersionCompare takes two indices into the Packages files..
<ogra> ajmitch_, ? muine just needs a built gtk-sharp2-unstable, then it should (nearly) work
<ajmitch_> ogra: PEBKAC ;)
<ogra> PEBKAC ?
<ajmitch_> problem exists between keyboard and chair
<ajmitch_> ie, user (myself) error
<ogra> ah
<ogra> also the dependency to mono-mint must go,  cli-common (>= 0.1) needs to be tightened to 0.1.1 and dh_netdeps and dh_makenetlibs need to be changed s/net/cli then it works fine :)
<ogra> whoops....
<ogra> 0.8.3 has no trayicon anymore :/
<Burgundavia> I noticed that
<Burgundavia> was most sad
<ogra> yeah
<Burgundavia> and the gnome-panel-app link it dead
<ogra> worksforme
<Burgundavia> http://pedro.codemonkey.cl/muine/applet/index.html
<Burgundavia> this one?
<ogra> 404 ?
<Burgundavia> yep
<Burgundavia> you know of another?
<ogra> looked at gnomefiles ?
<Burgundavia> nope
<ogra> he probably m,oved
<Burgundavia> the download link goes to the same website
<ogra> but works
<Burgundavia> yes
<Burgundavia> hmm, no package means I don't install
<ogra> hmm,  dh_netdeps and dh_makenetlibs are changed in muine 0.8.3 .... funnily debuild still complains about them...
* Burgundavia whinges at tseng about broken blam
* Burgundavia beats his against the desk
<Burgundavia> and I curse malone
<Burgundavia> does launchpad have a mailing list?
<p0m> I think I saw one.
<Burgundavia> so did I
<Burgundavia> there is
<Burgundavia> they just don't list it on lists.u.c
<p0m> Wait, you mean Launchpad as in the ubuntu launchpad?
<Burgundavia> yes
<p0m> I seem to be thinking of something else then :)
<p0m> So you're looking for the malone mailing list
<dholbach> Unfrgiven: ping
<dholbach> hey herve!
<herve> (cloudy) morning!
<dholbach> here as well
<herve> so let's eat my easter egg to cheer up :-)
<thom> launchpad mailing list is private; i guess suggesting to bradb/sabdfl that you need a malone users list would be a good first step
<Burgundavia> thom, thanks
<Burgundavia> thom, I was using malone, and then I felt like ripping my spleen out (this also happens when I use bugzilla)
<Burgundavia> so I needed to vent and tell them what was crack and needed to fix
<Burgundavia> s/to/to be
<Burgundavia> ed
<herve> I have feedback too
<herve> I don't feel comfortable with its ergonomy
<Burgundavia> herve, I am in #launchpad talking about it right now
<p0m> Burgundavia: I thought bugzilla removed your spleen for you.
<Burgundavia> felt like != doing
<herve> Burgundavia, later, I'm with my family
<Nafallo> morning all
* ..[topic/#ubuntu-motu:dholbach] : Ubuntu Masters of the Universe | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/Calendar | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTUTodo | => http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MaloneUniverseWishList <= | please file universe bugs in https://launchpad.ubuntu.com/distros/ubuntu/+bugs | Meeting with Malone crew: 12 Apr 16:00 UTC
<Nafallo> dholbach: that last statement seems a bit off IMHO
* ..[topic/#ubuntu-motu:dholbach] : Ubuntu Masters of the Universe | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/Calendar | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU | http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTUTodo | => http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MaloneUniverseWishList <= | please file universe bugs in https://launchpad.ubuntu.com/distros/ubuntu/+bugs | Meeting with Malone crew: 12 May 16:00 UTC
* dholbach pipes innocently
<Nafallo> :-)
<dholbach> who wants to add something to the MOTU report?
<Nafallo> dholbach: we're is the draft? :-)
<tseng> bur[n] er: i can install blam just fine
<tseng> bur[n] er: er burgandiva..
<Nafallo> hi tseng :-)
<dholbach> Nafallo: not in the net yet, just tell me, what you want to see in there :-)
<tseng> hi
<Nafallo> dholbach: "We _ROCK_!!!" :-)
<dholbach> ok :-)
<Nafallo> you people deserve that statement :-)
<tseng> ogra: ?
<tseng> ajmitch_: ?
<Nafallo> *sigh* I hate my downstream
<ogra> tseng, i have a fixed tomboy package for you if you like
<tseng> ogra: rock on !
<tseng> ogra: his patch was bad
<ogra> and for the wrong version....
<Nafallo> my mirror was just synced, started 10 HOURS ago.
<ogra> tseng, http://www.grawert.net/mono/
<Nafallo> hmm, 1G on the other hand :-P
<tseng> the beagle stuff is?
<ogra> not ready yet
<tseng> ok.
<tseng> changes to mine?
<ogra> missing manpages etc
<ogra> do you have a 0.0.9 ?
<tseng> its in NEW
<ogra> i havent found one
<ogra> ah, ok
<tseng> I did not review manpage love
<ogra> hmm, i built mine new from source... so i think i should wait for the sync...
<tseng> http://tseng.ath.cx/log/?p=20
<tseng> sweet i got trolled on my own blog
<tfheen> heh
<Nafallo> lol
<ogra> heh
<tseng> I clearly dont know the difference
* Nafallo should take pictures to make tseng happy
<tseng> ogra: uploaded your tomboy
<ogra> thanks :)
<tseng> thank you.
<tseng> ogra: today I want to work on getting aac gstreamer plugins built
<tseng> faac and faad
<tseng> that would be rad
<ogra> yeah
<tseng> thinking about gst-plugins-multiverse
<ogra> cool
<tseng> (the libs are in universe/multi)
<ogra> yep
<tseng> that kind of sucks
<tseng> i cant add aac support to gtkpod in universe if the lib is in multiverse
<tseng> right?
<ogra> it should be...
<Nafallo> dooh!
<dholbach> it's out
<Nafallo> tseng: http://www.magicalforest.se/~nafallo/haircut/ ;-)
<Nafallo> I believe I look more decent now than before ;-)
<Nafallo> tseng: ping?
<ogra> darn, tomboy is missing a uudecode build-dependency
<ogra> tseng, fixed the missing sharutils build-dep in tomboy, ok if i upload ?
<dholbach> hey herve
<tseng> ogra: yes
<ogra> fine
<tseng> ogra: ajmitch_ http://tseng.ath.cx/photos/index.php?galerie=udu&snimek=104 < mono team rocks!
<ogra> yay
<tseng> after lunch i need to finish up monodevelop deps
<tseng> but im hearing gecko#-2 doesnt build on mono 1.1.7
<tseng> (yet)
<herve> ogra, you're on the right if I remember your face?
<ogra> yep
<dholbach> bye
<herve> ogra, who are the others?
<dholbach> the one looking stupid on every picture is me :-)
<dholbach> like on 101
<ogra> herve, left is tseng center is ajmitch_
<dholbach> *wave*
<herve> http://tseng.ath.cx/photos/index.php?galerie=udu&snimek=4&exif_style=&show_thumbs=
<herve> this is mako, right?
<ogra> herve, thats Mithrandir
<tseng> http://tseng.ath.cx/photos/index.php?galerie=udu&snimek=61
<tseng> thats mako
<tfheen> tseng: http://tseng.ath.cx/photos/index.php?galerie=udu&snimek=23&exif_style=&show_thumbs= is such an excellent picture.  mjg59 and hal, mjg59 seems very, very happy
<tseng> tfheen: yes :)
<tseng> its the MAGIC*
<tseng> for some reason original stopped counting # of views on each picture
<tseng> latexer has a patch for blam for whoever was complaining
<ogra> Nafallo
<tseng> ill fix that after lunch also
<tseng> hm and sync with debian while im at it
<Lathiat> damn, the FTBFS list is rather long
<tseng> blam fix is in
<tseng> bbl
<Nafallo> tip for everyone. DO NOT, I repeat DO NOT look at the second season of dead zone if you can't handle very motionfull programs.
* Nafallo just want to kill their storywriter atm :-P.
<Nafallo> s/want/wants/
<Nafallo> s/motion/emotion/
<Treenaks> Nafallo: [spoilers]  why not?
<Nafallo> Treenaks: the emotions between episodes 11-15 is tense, every one of those made me cry ;-).
<Treenaks> Nafallo: lots of TV programs make me cry.. but for other reasons ;)
<Nafallo> I've only watched up to 15 yet :-P
<Nafallo> Treenaks: hehe. those has intelligent in them ;-)
<Nafallo> intelligens even
<Burgundavia> tseng, thanks
<tseng> for?
<Burgundavia> the blam fix
<Burgundavia> now I can have news crack
<tseng> rock on
* tseng tries building nptl only mono
<Nafallo> tseng: rock! that's the way :-)
<tseng> we'll see
<Lathiat> oh yhoh yeh
<Lathiat> blah
<Lathiat> oh yeh
<Lathiat> tseng: i meant to send thanks about that too. :)
<Lathiat> was pissing my rss crack
<Lathiat> damnit
<Lathiat> im too tired to be ircing
* Lathiat disappears back to coding
<Burgundavia> tseng, are there any debug options for blam? as i couldn't get any useful info out of it as to why it wasn't working
<tseng> edit the wrapper script to call mono --debug blam.exe
<tseng> but this particular bug didnt show anything
<tseng> just a helpful tip in general
<Burgundavia> ok, thanks
<ivoks> hi
<ivoks> i'm trying to debianize wifi-radar package for breezy
<Burgundavia> if I provide a patch against a .desktop file, should I diff against the .desktop file or the whole package?
<bur[n] er> ivoks: i'll test it :)  i've been waiting for wifi radar.deb :)
<Nafallo> ahh, that thing
* Nafallo want it to ;-)
* Nafallo should learn to type wants ;-)
<ivoks> bur[n] er it's done
<ivoks> bur[n] er URL in couple of minutes
<ivoks> http://www.grad.hr/~ivoks/ubuntu
<ivoks> well, i know it's pice of cake to create that deb, but this is my first one :)
<bur[n] er> i have no idea how to make a .deb from .py files
<bur[n] er> seems hard to me
<ivoks> ?
<ivoks> try it, I added .desktop and changed wifi-radar.sh to use gksudo instead of sudo
<ivoks> i'll be back...
<ivoks> ok... couple of fixes...
<ivoks> ok, that's finall -1 release :)
* Burgundavia hugs tseng, as his news crack now flows
<Nafallo> digital cameras work on breezy?
<tseng> Burgundavia: rock on.
<Nafallo> or is it the same error as usbkeys, flashdrives and stuff?
<fitheach> hi
<Nafallo> ogra: ?
<ogra> Nafallo, ?
<Nafallo> ogra: you never told me what you thought about my branch so far ;-).
<ogra> nice, do you provide it to others ?
<ogra> or is it your private mirror ?
<Nafallo> ogra: ahh :-). people are allowed to use it, if they like the speed ;-).
<ogra> heh
<Nafallo> ogra: only got 512/512kb :-P
<Nafallo> ogra: I will provide my scripts though :-)
<Nafallo> ogra: and logs :-)
<ogra> just because i think its a bit overkill to pull several GB for a private mirror
<ogra> thats why i asked :)
<Nafallo> ogra: well, if I want to get the source for openoffice for exampel, I don't have to wait for the 76MB :-).
<Nafallo> ogra: also, when security updates comes in, all three computers doesn't have to download it :-).
<Nafallo> ogra: and the best reason; because I can ;-)
<Nafallo> hmm, I should put this on the webpage :-P
<ogra> thats a usecase, but you still pull a lot of stuff you'll never use...
<Nafallo> ogra: thanks for inspiration :-).
<Nafallo> ogra: ofcourse. and I pull it from se.archive.ubuntu.com :-).
<ogra> heh
<Nafallo> ogra: swedish university, so no bandwidth costs for them :-)
<ogra> i know... its maswan's and Mithrandir's territory ;)
<Nafallo> ogra: cvs.gnome.org is there to :-). and cdimage.debian.org.
* tseng tries his first build of gst-plugins-multiverse0.8
<tseng> the packaging of gst-plugins is very interesting
<Nafallo> ogra: I'll add more stuff I probably won't use later :-). I plan to build install-isos daily when breezy starts with that :-).
<tseng> everything is built by substitution
<Nafallo> ogra: btw, do you recognize the layout? ;-)
<ogra> yep
<ogra> did you test it in explorer ? ;)
<ogra> explorer isnt able to show these nice dotted lines...
<Nafallo> ogra: I don't use MS products :-)
<ogra> heh
<Nafallo> ogra: and if IE can't handle W3C standards they might aswell go to hell for what I care ;-).
<ogra> heh
<Nafallo> ogra: and yes. I've told my teacher in webdesign that ;-)
<ogra> hehe
<Nafallo> ...and she probably hates me quite a bit now :-).
<Nafallo> :-D
<tfheen> well, webdesign classes where you're not taught that w3c is the holy grail (more or less) are probably useless.
<Nafallo> tfheen: if I put it this way... she want's us to use 600px centered tables just because she thinks it's standard :-P.
<tfheen> Nafallo: sounds like a waste of your time.
<Nafallo> tfheen: naah, I get to take a studyloan and have a _must do_ for fixing a homepage for the domain :-).
<Nafallo> tfheen: I already got grades for the course ;-)
<ogra> so you use frontpage in wine there *g* ?
<tfheen> Nafallo: you know, loans must be paid back. ;)
<Nafallo> tfheen: and money is a must have, unfortunatly.
<tfheen> I've never really considered that a problem, but I'm lucky.
<Nafallo> ogra: I did s/FrontPage/Screem/g && s/Paint\ Shop\ Pro/GIMP/g first thing I did :-).
<ogra> :)
<Nafallo> tfheen: you must be :-). but well, I'll get a job soon hopefully :-).
<Nafallo> tfheen: that means I see you in the autumn if I do :-)
<tfheen> you're in .se; you should just come visit sometime or something.
<Nafallo> tfheen: I've told Simira the same thing for you two when I spent time on #debian-women :-).
<tfheen> are you coming to debconf?
<tfheen> you should.  It's fun.
<Nafallo> tfheen: probably not, I don't have the job yet. have to save money for next ubuntu conference :-).
<tfheen> do useful work, get sponsored.
<tfheen> works for most people . ;)
<Nafallo> tfheen: you were in Trondheim, right? :-)
<tfheen> ATM, yes.
<tfheen> moving to Oslo in a couple of months.
<Nafallo> tfheen: :-). have to learn the programming-dance first :-).
<Nafallo> tfheen: oooh, Oslo is _way_ closer :-)
<tfheen> the programming part is easy, it's the "how-the-fuck-do-I-design-this-thing-so-I-can-maintain-it" part which is hard.
<Nafallo> tfheen: lol :-). as you can see I'm probably starting in the wrong end ;-).
<tfheen> probably, but we'll beat you with a stick until you get the design part right too.  It's not that hard, really.  Usually at least.
<Nafallo> tfheen: I know :-). the weird thing is that I like it ;-).
<tfheen> :P
<Nafallo> tfheen: I shall probably wear my chainmail when meeting you IRL ;-).
<tfheen> Nafallo: well, both Simira and I are LARP people, so we'll just wear swords then. ;)
<Nafallo> tfheen: dang! ;-)
<Nafallo> tfheen: but axe would be better, you know ;-).
<tfheen> axe is slow.
<tfheen> dodging axes is actually fairly easy.
<Nafallo> tfheen: but it cuts throw the chainmail...
<tfheen> so does a nice sword, pike or stiletto
<Nafallo> tfheen: meeh! now you're just mean :-).
<Nafallo> tfheen: that would cut throw leather to :-P.
<tfheen> true enough
<tfheen> the hint is either to catch people's weapons or don't get hit.
<Nafallo> tfheen: hehehe
<tfheen> at least with LARP weapons, wearing a cloak is a brilliant thing.  hold it up and you can catch a lot of slashes in it.
<Nafallo> tfheen: dang. you have lot's to teach me :-).
<tfheen> you're not LARPing, just wandering around in chainmail?
<ogra> tseng, looks like a missing gtk-sharp is blocking tomboy....
<ogra> (on amd64
<ogra> )
<Nafallo> what a surprise :-P
<ogra> i'll trigger a rebuild if thats ok..
#ubuntu-motu 2006-05-08
<theCore> is there any special way to deal with packages that uses SCons?
<dholbach> good night everybody
<bddebian> Heya gang
<tseng> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Wow, 2 tsengs :-)
<tseng> i would rather bs with you here
<tseng> than in #u-d
<bddebian> Heh
<tseng> dont wake the mdz
<LaserJock> hi bddebian and tseng
<tseng> hi
<bddebian> I didn't thing you bs'd? :-)
<LaserJock> tseng: what about the elmo?
<bddebian> Heya LaserJock
<tseng> LaserJock: the elmo is more bark than bite
<tseng> but one scary bark
<tseng> i dont recommend throwing things at him
<tseng> or taking his picture
<tseng> both a good way to get a big red beat down
<LaserJock> yeah, I've seen a couple pictures where he expressed his view on taking pictures :-)
<tseng> i took mdz's picture
<tseng> and he hit me in the head with mentos
<LaserJock> hmm, physically abusive
<tseng> not really
<LaserJock> elmo only seems emotionaly abusive ;-)
<bddebian> I thought all you commie hippies were anti-violence? ;-P
<tseng> mentos were thrown non-stop at udu
<tseng> daniels and i are little kids
<LaserJock> tseng: so it was group abuse? hmmm
<tseng> well there was a room called Vibe (the fuck) Out
<tseng> where most of the throwing things happened
<tseng> at thom
<LaserJock> hmm, and I was thinking of going to Paris. Maybe I'd have to bring defensive weapons and plenty of mentos
<LaserJock> but I don't think I have money for it actually. Paris is still pretty expensive to fly to for me. If it was in Vegas I'd be set
<tseng> in sydney the hotel put out the menthos
<tseng> mentos
<LaserJock> heh
<LaserJock> and did they have to clean them up?
<hub> LaserJock: what's wrong with Paris?
<tseng> LaserJock: yeah they did
<tseng> LaserJock: and refill them
<bddebian> hub: It's full of French people? ;-P
<hub> bddebian: yeah, I prefer Paris in August for that sole reason
<bddebian> ?
<hub> bddebian: August is the month of the year were most of french people leave for vacations
<bddebian> Oh, hehe
<hub> bddebian: so Paris is a desert populated by tourists
<hub> July is not bad either
<FunnyLookinHat> Paris sucks.
<FunnyLookinHat> ^_^;;
<LaserJock> hub: I'd just like it to be closer so it wasn't so expensive.
<hub> LaserJock: closer to what?
<LaserJock> hub: me
<hub> LaserJock: still does not tell me
<LaserJock> Nevada, USA
<hub> ah
<tseng> i cant go to Paris
<hub> well for me Paris is closer, not in distance
<tseng> i am going to Spain the next week
<tseng> i dont have that much vacation time
<hub> btw, what is in Paris?
<tseng> hub: next ubuntu conf
<hub> oh
<tseng> hub: the week before guadec
<hub> no shit
<tseng> yeah
<hub> will be a no for me
<hub> even if I could have free room
* hub would go to his mom
<hub> but Ubuntu Conf is not gonna happen
<hub> as 1/ I'm already scheduled for GUadec, 2/ I don't see my employer letting me go
<tseng> hub: same here
<tseng> ubuntu conf is boring anyway
<tseng> such a hectic schedule
<hub> tseng: it is to get work done
<tseng> i know
<tseng> but you get tired of it after a few days
<hub> tseng: I was at the last one
<hub> all week
<hub> I had nothing else to do
<tseng> yeah
<tseng> you were in your own country
<hub> tseng: Paris is my own country
<hub> Montreal was my place of unemployment
<tseng> ok
<tseng> do you still live in canada?
<hub> yeah
<hub> near Ottawa
<hub> I work for a canadian Linux vendor
<hub> not hard to guess which one
<tseng> i know
<LaserJock> I guess I should have gone to UBZ, it might be my best chance for a while
<LaserJock> maybe Mexico will be next
<LaserJock> that I could probably do
<hub> LaserJock: distance is not the biggest problem
<hub> fortunately it is not in the US
<LaserJock> I still think Las Vegas would be cool
<hub> LaserJock: uncool
<tseng>  LaserJock half of canonical hates the US
<hub> lot of people would not be able to come
<tseng> LaserJock: so good luck
<hub> tseng: including me
* hub is just a motu
<LaserJock> I know, I just wish they could get past it for 1 conference :-)
<hub> LaserJock: why don;t you come?
<hub> most off the countries haven't had the balls to be strict with US tourists
<hub> unlike Bush is doing
<LaserJock> well, it is expensive to fly
<hub> LaserJock: it is more expensive to get the right to enter your country
<hub> flying to france is not expensive
<hub> it cost me CAD$900 last time
<LaserJock> something like $1000 USD
<LaserJock> I'd really have to save for it
<hub> the is what lot of people have to pay to even have the right to submit a visa application
<bddebian> tseng: 1/2?  I think like 90% of "Free Software" folks hate the US
<tseng> bddebian: thats because they are a bunch of pinko commies
* tseng hides
<bddebian> tseng: EXACTLY :-)
<LaserJock> I love the US but I can see where it is difficult for people why aren't from here
<hub> bddebian: there are still some in the US
<hub> bddebian: before they get arrested for communism in a big witch hunt
<nictuku> hi!
<hub> LaserJock: the problem is more the regime
<tseng> wow ok, a 40 year old political scandal
<LaserJock> hub: well, I like it too, but I won't go there ;-)
<hub> LaserJock: then blame yourself
<ajmitch> afternoon
<hub> hey ajmitch
<LaserJock> hub: hehe, alright. I'll just have to save up the money
<LaserJock> hi ajmitch
<polpak> Anyone awake? ;p
<ajmitch> no
<polpak> damn =p
<LaserJock> all asleep here
<polpak> Just curious, but why is the python2.4-ctypes package so old?
<hub> polpak: not asleep let
<polpak> in dapper even
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<LaserJock> polpak: is it that old?
<ajmitch> polpak: because upstream version freeze was in january
<bddebian> Hmm, should I look at bugs tonight...
<LaserJock> nah, just hang out and BS with us slackers ;-)
<polpak> ajmitch, ah.. gotcha
<bddebian> LaserJock: :-)
<polpak> ajmitch, there was just a big jump in version numbers in feb
<polpak> ajmitch, sorry for the confusion =)
<infinity> Does anyone give enough of a damn about vpopmail/libvpopmail-perl/php4-vpopmail/qmailadmin to fix them up so that they're buildable, installable, and not RC buggy?
<ajmitch> infinity: they sound scary
<infinity> They also appear to be mostly unmaintained in Debian (no uploads for ages, no reponse to RC bugs), so I'm inclined to just drop them entirely.
<bddebian> infinity: What are you doing in here? :)
<ajmitch> giving us more work, of course
<Toadstool> 'night
<infinity> bddebian: Trying to get MOTUs to either fix multiverse or tell me to remove stuff from the archive, that's what. :)
<bddebian> ajmitch: :-)
<ajmitch> yeah, 3 RC bugs against vpopmail, 2 years since last upload
<ajmitch> messy
<bddebian> Hmm, I guess I could take a look but I'd vote for removal
<ajmitch> security bugs included
<infinity> ajmitch: And in my experience trying to install it just now, those 3 RC bugsa aren't comprehensive.  I could file another 2 or 3 based on a 30-second audit.
<ajmitch> I'd remove it rather than having to spend time getting it up to par
<infinity> Anyhow, I figured maybe someone here was enough of a qmail nut to want to fix them up and make them work.
<infinity> If not, I'm happy to drop them.
* infinity uses exim and postfix, so has no iterest in fixing qmail-related junk.
<hub> infinity: I hate qmail
* ajmitch only uses exim here
<hub> infinity: because it is not free, it developer is not even open to anything and because qmail is buggy
* hub only uses Postfix
* bddebian uses neither
<infinity> hub: I'm not looking for anti-qmail sentiments.  I know all the arguments. :)
<ajmitch> I really should fix my debian RC bugs
<bddebian> infinity: Drop them
* bddebian makes executive decision
<infinity> bddebian: sendmail?  smail?  nullmailer? :)
* infinity finds the latter particularly effective for dealing with his bug backlog.
<bddebian> Outlook express :-)
<infinity> ajmitch: So, am I just completely retarded?  I never knew until I just looked you up RIGHT NOW that you're a DD.
<ajmitch> infinity: I've only been a DD for a bit over a year
<infinity> ajmitch: And you maintain a PHP application... You must despise me.
<infinity> (Or, perhaps, I despise you...)
<ajmitch> or I despise it
<bddebian> heh
* infinity finds that every DD who maintains something PHPish generally has a gripe with him.
<infinity> Doesn't help that I never got around to publishing the PHP policy that I keep smacking people with.
* infinity <--- slacker.
<infinity> ajmitch: Hrm.  Were you always the pnet maintainer?
<ajmitch> yes
<infinity> Oh, then I guess we probably crossed paths long before I joined Ubuntu.
<ajmitch> you actually know of it?
<ajmitch> surprising
<infinity> I vaguely recall making some promises to help bootstrap it on m68k, then completely forgetting about it until, uhm, today.
<ajmitch> ah yes
<ajmitch> I remember that now
* infinity really should find a weekend to port both pnet and mono to m68k.
<ajmitch> pnet ought to be easy
* infinity really should find a weekend that's not dedicated to work.
<infinity> Yeah, pnet doesn't look as scary as mono.
* ajmitch should just find a machine to do the porting work on & find the motivation to do it
<infinity> ajmitch: Well, as a DD, you have access to crest.  If you need anything installed in the sid chroot there, let me know.
<ajmitch> alright
<ajmitch> the 2nd part is the hardest
<infinity> Motivation is a killer for me too these days. :/
<infinity> My recent Debian upload record isn't exactly stellar.  I think working on Ubuntu all day kinda kills any motivation to do EXACTLY THE SAME THING in my dwindling spare time.
* bddebian whips out the catlle prod
<bddebian> Err cattle even
<LaserJock> bddebian: the electric kind?
<ajmitch> I suspect so
<LaserJock> the electric ones work pretty well, but a good ole' 2x4 can do the job as well
<bddebian> heh
<ajmitch> I find beer works better for motivation
* bddebian hands infinity a 6 pack and points him at ivtools
<LaserJock> oh, I was talking about cattle ;-)
<ajmitch> I'm sure infinity didn't move to .au for the beer..
<LaserJock> never tried beer on a cow before but I suspect it wouldn't work as well as on a Linux dev
<infinity> There's some adequate beer here, but I'm not a heavy drinker (I know, shock, programmer that doesn't drink much), and Canada's beer was just fine.
<LaserJock> I think I've only had beer once, when one of my college buddies swapped out my apple juice :(
* bddebian rarely drinks.  But isn't a "programmer" either :-(
<chillywilly> bddebian: beer is good though
<chillywilly> :)
<LaserJock> chillywilly: it sure isn't good when you are expecting apple juice ;-)
<infinity> It's an acquired taste.  I can't imagine that it's best acquire through subterfuge.
<bddebian> chillywilly: Oh, I didn't say it was bad.. But with 3 kids, et al, it's tough :-)
<infinity> s/acquire /acquired/
* infinity goes back to work.
<infinity> So, the concensus on the broken qmail vpopmail stuff is "drop it like a hot potato"?
<chillywilly> bddebian: I ship you some beer ;)
<ajmitch> seems to be
<infinity> Good enough for me.  Thanks guys.
* bddebian gets no love
<ajmitch> I'd hate to ship security holes in universe
<bddebian> No, THANK YOU infinity
<bddebian> chillywilly: Sweet :-)
<bddebian> Linenkugels? :-)
<bddebian> None of the Old Milwaukee spit :-)
<chillywilly> bddebian: Leinies?
<chillywilly> bddebian: http://www.leinies.com
<chillywilly> bah that's not the right website
<chillywilly> bddebian: http://www.leinie.com
<bddebian> Heh a user admin page? :-)
<chillywilly> their site seems broken
<chillywilly> after stupid flash animation firefox display the html as text...
<chillywilly> weird
<chillywilly> displays
<bddebian> heh
<ajmitch> wonderful
* ajmitch waits for the NEW queue
<tritium> hi ajmitch, bddebian
<ajmitch> hey tritium
<ajmitch> how's it going?
<tritium> Not bad.  Yourself?
<ajmitch> good :)
<ajmitch> just building packages as usual
<tritium> Glad to hear it :)
<tritium> I'm riding the bus to work, so I feel environmentally responsible :)
<bddebian> Heya tritium
<tritium> Hello Barry deFreese.  Haven't I seen you in my Inbox lately?
<tritium> Nice work ;)
<LaserJock> tritium!
<tritium> LaserJock!
<ajmitch> tritium: he's been spamming everyone
<bddebian> tritium: Yeah, I've been slacking :-)
<tritium> yeah!
<tritium> bddebian: heh
* ajmitch builds yet more sponsored uploads
<LaserJock> ajmitch: had a chance to test praat?
<ajmitch> no, I'll install it now
<ajmitch> what's it meant to do?
<LaserJock> well, I think on AMD64 it was hanging
<ajmitch> right
<ajmitch> and you hope the new version doesn't
<ajmitch> well I get the UI appearing
<LaserJock> yep
<ajmitch> nothing hung so far
<ajmitch> but it's very very ugly (lesstif)
<LaserJock> well, I'm *not* going to fix that today
<ajmitch> good
<LaserJock> I just wanted to make sure that it indeed did work on AMD64
<ajmitch> seems to
<LaserJock> it should since the authors made a point to fix it
<LaserJock> I just wanted some verification
<LaserJock> thanks ajmitch
<bddebian> Ack, where's the binary for doomlegacy-sdl?
<LaserJock> tritium: btw, I registered #ubuntu-science today
<ajmitch> bddebian: probably FTBFS
<ajmitch> either that or something is broken
<tritium> LaserJock: cool :)
<ajmitch> bddebian: https://launchpad.net/+builds/+build/166664
<ajmitch> bad CFLAGS for gcc
<bddebian> Hmm, well it installed :-)
<LaserJock> does Keybuk still create patches?
<LaserJock> http://people.ubuntu.com/~scott/patches/ looks like it was last updated april 17th
* Hobbsee waves to everyone
<dholbach> good morning
<ajmitch> morning dholbach
<dholbach> hey ajmitch
<ajmitch> how are you?
<dholbach> I'm fine - thanks
<dholbach> getting read for the crasher bugs :)
<dholbach> how are you?
<ajmitch> good thanks :)
<ajmitch> getting a bit of bugfixing done today
<dholbach> rock'n'roll :-)
<Hobbsee> hi dholbach and ajmitch
<ajmitch> hello Hobbsee :)
<siretart> goood morning, folks!
<ajmitch> morning siretart
<Hobbsee> oh, fancy seeing you here ajmitch :P
<Hobbsee> hi siretart
<ajmitch> good to see you around
<siretart> hey Hobbsee. huhu ajmitch :)
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: you expect me to ever leave irc?
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: sure, when you're on the plane.
<ajmitch> haha
<Hobbsee> :P
<ajmitch> that's when I detach screen :)
<Hobbsee> hehe!
<dholbach> hey Hobbsee, siretart!
<siretart> huhu dholbach
<siretart> ajmitch: did you have the change to look at the updated praat package (bug #42510)
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 42510 in praat "praat UVF exception request" [Normal,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/42510
<ajmitch> siretart: yes, it worked for me
<siretart> ajmitch: ok thanks
<siretart> ajmitch: may I assign the bug to you (for uploading the new version)
<siretart> oh, sorry, daniel didn't respond to that yet
<ajmitch> isn't it a sync request to make?
<ajmitch> ah no, it's not
<dholbach> I responded to 42510
<siretart> dholbach: I was looking at the wrong tab. sorry
<ajmitch> no sync just because of a .desktop file - I can upload that
<dholbach> siretart: no problem
* Mongoose is away: /_\ zzZzZZZZzz
<siretart> dholbach: could you perhaps post it to ubuntu-motu?
<dholbach> siretart: I thought about that, but then again, I thought it'd be good to not post massfiling scripts around :-)
<dholbach> siretart: http://daniel.holba.ch/bzr/massfile/ is the bzr branch
* ajmitch fetches
<ajmitch> might come in handy one day
* tseng hugs dholbach ajmitch 
<ajmitch> hi tseng
<tseng> i hope beowulf pops up today
* dholbach hugs tseng back
<ajmitch> tseng: bug 6300
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 6300 in gfax "gfax crash" [Normal,In progress]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/6300
<tseng> soon we will be right back where we started
<ajmitch> you think gfax from sid will be ok?
<tseng> with me uploading every change straight to ubuntu
<tseng> ajmitch: yes, meebey maintains it
<ajmitch> that's what I thought..
<tseng> i gave up trying to walk gfarris through doing it himself
<ajmitch> dholbach: want me to put it through as a UVF exception for the team to decide on?
<tseng> if I have a vote I vote yes already
<ajmitch> slomo will vote yes
<ajmitch> and siretart & dholbach are here already
<tseng> ok.
* ajmitch hasn't asked slomo, but I'm sure he will..
<dholbach> ajmitch: sounds good
<ajmitch> reassigned, add comments where appropriate & I'll ask for a sync when done
* tseng adds Card for Mako to his tomboy notes
<pef> does a restriction exists right now for uploads to universe ? I've added a desktop file, and no confirmation e-mail of my upload
<ajmitch> pef: no restrictions
<ajmitch> check that you didn't accidentally set distro to unstable
* ajmitch did, and got no REJECT mail
<ajmitch> hello pygi :)
<pygi> hi ajmitch
<pygi> ajmitch: long time no see :P
<ajmitch> yeah
<ajmitch> I thought I'd better find out about this ubuntu development thing before I submitted a proposal, you see
<pygi> ajmitch: heh 
<pef> ajmitch: had set to dapper, but still nothing, strange
<pef> will check later...
<mikl> eeh, where do you go, if you want a version bump of a package in dapper?
<TomaszD> good question
<TomaszD> wish there was 0.20.1 of quodlibet available.
<Hobbsee> wonder why he wants it bumped..
<crimsun> TomaszD: I'll try and whip up a uvfe req for that today
<TomaszD> crimsun, cool, thanks!
<Lathiat> whats lucas nussbaums irc nick?
<LaserJock> Lathiat: lol, lucas
<Lathiat> just checking cause wasnt online :)
<LaserJock> siretart: ping?
<truz24> Whats going on LaserJock
<LaserJock> truz24: oh, not a whole lot. Got up nice and early for and Edubuntu meeting
<truz24> So what is your research in for your PHD?
<LaserJock> detecting molecular motors
<Coyctecm> I think that cinelerra would be fine if found in universe/multiverse
<Coyctecm> and jashaka
<ajmitch> night all
<LaserJock> ajmitch: just a sec
<LaserJock> ajmitch: you merged praat?
<tritium> good night, ajmitch
<LaserJock> jeeze, I ask him to test it out and he steals my upload ;-)
<siretart> LaserJock: pong
<LaserJock> siretart: heah, I was just wondering about the praat UVFe
<TomaszD> could I request another uvfe ? this time for Kino 0.8.1 http://www.kinodv.org/article/view/123/1/7/ .
<TomaszD> I'm really looking forward to this release
<LaserJock> siretart: ajmitch said he would upload it?
<siretart> LaserJock: I'd suggest asking him himself, but I remember that because of a desktopfile, a sync wasn't possible
<siretart> maybe I mix up things, though
<LaserJock> siretart: yeah, but I had a package ready to go
<LaserJock> so was just waiting for the ok.
<siretart> LaserJock: if you can upload yourself, just assign the bug to you and do it
<LaserJock> siretart: well, ajmitch already took care of it. I just wondered if there was a reason ajmitch was supposed to do it
<siretart> LaserJock: no, he was just the first in sight
<siretart> LaserJock: I'm experimenting if assigninging UVF requests to specific people improves the processing of them
<siretart> rather than to leave them assigned to motu-uvf, that is
<LaserJock> siretart: ok
<zakame> hi all
<kagou> hi
<LaserJock> hi kagou
<kagou> is there a nice developer for Bug #36753 ?
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 36753 in gdesklets "upgrade to gDesklets 0.35.3" [Wishlist,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/36753
<kagou> like siretart asked me " then ask on #ubuntu-motu some developer to look at your bug, your package or whatever in order to get it to the archive"
<kagou> so any volunteer ?!
<LaserJock> hmm, that would require a Upstream Version Freeze exception this late in the release cycle
<kagou> LaserJock: look description UVF is accepted
<tritium> Does the status of bug #6687 mean that it was rejected for dapper?  That would be nice to get fixed...
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 6687 in gnome-session "Options in system > preferences > sessions, various little problems" [Minor,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/6687
<LaserJock> kagou: nice, you did a lot of work on this
<kagou> thanks LaserJock. I do my best. it's the minimum that i can do to help Ubuntu team.
<LaserJock> tritium: I don't think so.
<siretart> LaserJock: the uvf is granted, it needs someone to assemble and upload it
<siretart> if nobody steps in, I'll handle it tonight
<LaserJock> siretart: the debdiff looks pretty simple, I can sponsor the upload for kagou I think
<tritium> LaserJock: you think it will get addressed, in other words?
<LaserJock> tritium: yeah, there was a problem where a bunch of dapper tasks were created and they shouldn't have been, I think
<tritium> I see...
<LaserJock> kagou: so why did you chance the gdesklets-data dependency?
<LaserJock> s/chance/change/
<kagou> LaserJock: to close a bug. It's very simple. If you use the Add/Del software and you install gdesklets, gdesklets-data is not installed so gdesklets is not working
<LaserJock> kagou: ok, give me a bit to build it for myself
<kagou> np LaserJock
<zakame> hmm bug 32252
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 32252 in tuxpaint "Installs two desktop launchers in different sections" [Normal,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/32252
<LaserJock> zakame: probably 1 .desktop with multiple Categories
<zakame> yep it seems
<kagou> LaserJock: patch adding depend for gdesklets-data have been created for Bug #38080
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 38080 in gdesklets "gdesklets should probably have dependency of gdesklets-data" [Normal,Fix released]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/38080
<LaserJock> slomo: ping?
<slomo> LaserJock: pong
<LaserJock> slomo: I'm fixing up gdesklets. kagou mentioned you said to remember to no install mime
<slomo> LaserJock: to not install mime.cache, yes
<slomo> LaserJock: look at the changelog of our current gdesklets for the reasons
<LaserJock> yeah, do you know about "chmod 644 debian/gdesklets/usr/lib/gdesklets/NullObject.py" in rules?
<slomo> LaserJock: no idea
<slomo> LaserJock: NullObject.py was removed in the new version afaik anyway
<LaserJock> that was what i was wondering
<LaserJock> I'm trying to figure out what all needs to be merged back in
<LaserJock> I've got the mime.cache and python-orbit dep done
<LaserJock> welcome back kagou
<kagou> LaserJock: :)
<kengra> what programming language would you suggest i learn if i want to contribute? c++?
<hub> to ubuntu?
<kengra> hub, yes
<hub> kengra: shell and eventually python
<hub> most likely
<hub> contributing to ubuntu is a lot of packaging task
<hub> knowing other programming language is always a plus as it sometime allow to fix bugs in the program themself, but since the goal is not to patch too much...
<kengra> so you would say that learning python would be a good place to start?
<kengra> can you recommend a good developer tool?
<hub> kengra: I don't know python
<hub> that does not prevent me from being a motu
<LaserJock> dholbach: ping?
<dholbach> LaserJock: pong
<LaserJock> dholbach: I'm preparing an upload of the new gdesklets
<dholbach> LaserJock: nice
<LaserJock> dholbach: and the .deb failes on the postrm
<LaserJock> dholbach: with "touch: missing file operand"
<LaserJock> dholbach: and the only place touch is called is by the dh_iconcache part
<dholbach> LaserJock: get the new debhelper - adam fixed that
<LaserJock> when?
<LaserJock> I have a pretty updated system. let me dist-upgrad and try again
<LaserJock> argg, I need a little help
<LaserJock> apt doesn't work anymore
<LaserJock> how do I force the removal of a package
<zakame_away> dpkg --purge?
<LaserJock> ugg, it is still failing on postrm and it insists I reinstall before removal
<LaserJock> but I can reinstall for the same reason
<LaserJock> s/can/can't/
<LaserJock> dholbach: do you know of a way to get rid of package that has that dh_iconcache problem?
<dholbach> LaserJock: get the new debhelper - adam fixed that
<dholbach> LaserJock: build with new debhelper
<bddebian> Heya gang
<zakame> heya bddebian
<LaserJock> dholbach: what I'm saying is I can't do anything with dpkg or apt-get because of it
<bddebian> Heya zakame
<LaserJock> dholbach: so I can't get a new debhelper
<bddebian> Uh oh, what'd LaserJock break now? :-)
<dholbach> LaserJock: edit .postrm
<LaserJock> dholbach: ah, should have thought of that
<Tonio_> hello
<bddebian> Heya Tonio_
<bddebian> siretart: ping?
<Tonio_> hey bddebian
<bddebian> or dholbach?
<dholbach> bddebian: I'm quite busy - what is it?
<bddebian> dholbach: siretart asked me to sync vnc4.  Can we do that now?
<bddebian> Boy, I don't even get love from dholbach anymore :'-(
<dholbach> bddebian: man, i'm just busy - sorry
<dholbach> bddebian: if he said you can sync it, then go ahead - assign the bug to ubuntu-archive and say that it's ok to override ubuntu changes
<dholbach> sorry, if i'm a bit blunt
<bddebian> Oooh, OK, sorry
<bddebian> NP
<dholbach> i'll be better later :)
<dholbach> promise
<bddebian> No worries
<Tonio_> hi dholbach
<dholbach> hi Tonio_
<LaserJock> bddebian: have you built vnc4?
<bddebian> LaserJock: Yes and installed
<bddebian> Crap, varconf probably should have been a UVF exception request instead of a sync request?
<Tonio_> dholbach: Riddell is interested in libagg in dapper
<Tonio_> dholbach: there is a debian package available, so it could eventually be sync, but we don't know the sync status
<dholbach> Tonio_: make a request to get it synced or ask in #ubuntu-devel how happy everybody is with it
<Tonio_> dholbach: what is the best way to do this actually ? sunchronizing or porting and getting it revued ?
<Tonio_> dholbach: thanks
<dholbach> build it, test it
<dholbach> the file a bug, assign to ubuntu-archive
<Tonio_> dholbach: sure I will in the first place
<dholbach> describe why it's needed
<dholbach> etc
* dholbach hugs bddebian
<Tonio_> dholbach: great thanks
<bddebian> dholbach: Heh, suuure :-)
* LaserJock is going to hide for a while
<bddebian> LaserJock: Why's that? :)
<LaserJock> bddebian: dapper-changes
<bddebian> LaserJock: ?
<LaserJock> I just uploaded a new upstream version of gdesklets
<bddebian> Oh, nice :-)
<jpatrick> LaserJock: oh, naughty
<LaserJock> well, the first time I tried uploading it it was rejected because I forgot to include the new .orig.tar.gz
<bddebian> tsk tsk :-)
<LaserJock> which was good because I overlooked merging a couple things
<LaserJock> so needless to say, I sure hope it works and slomo doesn't have my hide
<slomo> LaserJock: i see everything ;)
<LaserJock> but I've been up since 05:00 this morning
<LaserJock> I'd like to just say that kagou did a great job with that UVF exception
<LaserJock> anyway, I've done enough work/breakage for a bit. I got to get to work
<bddebian> Later Laser_away
<carthik> We need an motu-mentor program, don't we?
<bddebian> Yes
<bddebian> Someone needs to mentor my sorr arse :-)
<carthik> bddebian, great, so let me know when we can get started :)
<carthik> oh I thought you'd be my mentor ;)
<bddebian> :-)
<carthik> I wish I could help out with some of the more mechanical/rote tasks, is all.
<bddebian> Bug triaging is a big help
<bddebian> dholbach: Isn't the changelog diff there for varconf?
<dholbach> that's for debian/changelog
<dholbach> ChangeLog is a bit more informative
<bddebian> Ahh, OK
* bddebian gets no love
<bddebian> dholbach: Diff the upstream changelogs or just send the new changelog?
<dholbach> diff upstream changelogs
<bddebian> dholbach: sent
<dholbach> bddebian: thanks
<bddebian> dholbach: No, thank YOU :-)
<LaserJock> carthik: when I first started I wanted to start a motu-mentor program
<LaserJock> carthik: but really I think it is better to view #ubuntu-motu as your mentor
<bddebian> Why, we never help anyone in here? ;-P
* LaserJock  thwaps bddebian over the head with a print copy  of the Ubuntu Packaging Guide ;-)
<LaserJock> I'd like to start coming up with a curriculum for #ubuntu-motu-school though
<dholbach> LaserJock: in the beginning of next release, I'd like to help with that
<LaserJock> dholbach: yeah, I can't do it until the release. But I was thinking of using the Packaging Guide
<dholbach> yeah and random stuff we come up with
<LaserJock> which can also be encorporated back into the Packaging Guide
<dholbach> yeah
<LaserJock> I sure would like it to be more of a comunity thing than me running around trying to document everything
<LaserJock> I don't mind being the doc team contact and handling the XML
<bddebian> LaserJock: But you do it so well :-)
<LaserJock> bddebian: I don't particularly think so, luckily crimsun helped proofreading
<LaserJock> I was very worried I would have some serious Policy violation in there or something just out of shear ignorance
<bddebian> LaserJock: Bah, ignorance is MY sepcialty
<LaserJock> bddebian: that's what I like about you. we can be brothers in ignorance ;-)
<bddebian> heh
<LaserJock> but I've gotten fairly good reviews so far and there is even going to be a print version soon that people can get
<carthik> LaserJock, that looks awesome (the packaging guide) - but a page describing how/when packages are normally "synced" with the latest from debian, a page describing how a normal ".desktop" bug is fixed etc, with steps would be helpful, imho
<LaserJock> carthik: sure
<carthik> The reason I said a mentor program would be nice is so that a wannabe has one guaranteed answering post :) (through email+IRC)
<LaserJock> carthik: I can surely understand that, I was there myself
<LaserJock> carthik: but being a mentor is pretty demanding and I think the MOTU survive on an atmosphere of community effort so getting help from many source is good
<LaserJock> carthik: I would be more in favor of a mentor-team or something like that, but in esscence the MOTU is that already
<LaserJock> if we can get the MOTU school fired up again that would probably help
<Gloubiboulga> LaserJock, I agree with you, but maybe a mailing list could help more than IRC only
<carthik> LaserJock, couldn't agree more. Besides, if a current MOTU finds a low-hanging fruit - it must be rather tempting to just pluck it than to show some wannabe how to pluck it.
<LaserJock> Gloubiboulga: we have the ubuntu-motu list
<Gloubiboulga> LaserJock, I don't see it as a "mentor" list
<LaserJock> I agree
<LaserJock> but there isn't anything that says it can't be really. I don't know how the other MOTUs would feel about that
<LaserJock> it doesn't seem to be very high traffic these days
<Gloubiboulga> true
<LaserJock> Gloubiboulga: it would just take making people aware of it
<LaserJock> carthik: I try to encourage Wannabes to grab that low-hanging fruit, but yeah, sometimes it is just easier to do it
<LaserJock> it would be kinda nice to come up with a Wannabe To Do list that MOTUs can dump the low-hanging fruit
<ohoel> anyone thinking about packaging GShare?
<ohoel> ( http://yimports.com/~cpinto/projects/gnome/gshare ) looks promising
<bluepixel> hey guys, what's the default gcc-version i should take to compile packages "ubuntu-conform"?
<bluepixel> and the most important, what c/cxx/ld-flags
<bluepixel> libc is 2.3.6 i guess
<kagou> many thanks to LaserJock for uploading my UVF of gdesklets :)
<LaserJock> kagou: well, you are doing good work there. I hope you keep it up
<crimsun> bluepixel: gcc. none. 2.3.6 in dapper.
<kagou> :)
<bluepixel> crimsun: ah okay, what about compiler flags?
<crimsun> bluepixel: see the "none".
<bluepixel> i see ;) yes ok thanks
<kagou> see you later
<LaserJock> cya kagou
<dholbach> good night motu world
<LaserJock> cya dholbach
<pygi> night dholbach
<dholbach> night LaserJock, night pygi
<ajmitch> morning all
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<Mithrandir> hi ajmitch, bddebian
<bddebian> Heya Mithrandir
<LaserJock> hi ajmitch, upload stealer ;-)
<ajmitch> LaserJock: sure, I'll hand in my key now..
<LaserJock> ajmitch: you gonna close the praat UVFe request?
<ajmitch> no, then I'll be stealing it from you
<LaserJock> well, it is assigned to you
<LaserJock> done
<bddebian> Catch you in a while folks
<LaserJock> if I edited a postinst script in /var/lib/dpkg/info will it take effect when I run dpkg?
<TheMuso> LaserJock: Yes it should.
#ubuntu-motu 2006-05-09
<LaserJock> hmm, I'm having a problem removing a package that has a bad posinst script
<bddebian> Heya gang
<welshbyte> if an original source bundle is written in python and uses a setup.py script for installation, would i need to bypass it in and do all the installing manually in debian/rules or use the setup.py script in debian/rules?
<Kyral> Assembler should die...
<bddebian> No way
<Kyral> Yes way
<Kyral> for letting the idiot professor teach it
<bddebian> Java should die
<Kyral> I mean the guy is brillant
<Kyral> but he can't teach worth a damn
<Kyral> and yes, Java should die :P
<Kyral> Python for EVER!
<bddebian> Kyral: :-)
<schweeb> what's up all, been a while since I've been around here
<tritium> hey schweeb :)
<schweeb> work = busy schweeb
<schweeb> lotta work goin on now, or kinda coasting till Dapper release?
<ajmitch> busy busy busy
<ajmitch> get to work
<bddebian> heh
<schweeb> I'm workin on gettin to work
<schweeb> been so long, I'm out of the loop
* ajmitch hands bddebian the whip
<dholbach> hey schweeb
<dholbach> hey tritium
<schweeb> what's up dholbach, you all graduated now?
<ajmitch> heh, you must be a little behind :)
<tritium> hey dholbach :)
<bddebian> schweeb: I felt the exact same way about 3-4 weeks ago..
<ajmitch> schweeb: dholbach has been with canonical for a little while, whipping gnome & the desktop into submission
<schweeb> oh yea, I had heard such stirrings
<schweeb> I've just been slurping the dapper kool-aid, haven't had time to be in the loop or participate
<schweeb> sooo, search launchpad for bugs?
<ajmitch> yep
<ajmitch> 10K or so for you to work on
<dholbach> yeah :)
<dholbach> schweeb, tritium: how are you guys?
<schweeb> crazy busy, wishing they would hire someone else in my group
<schweeb> but still laughing all the way to the bank
<ajmitch> nice
<tritium> dholbach: not bad, you?
<dholbach> i'm fine - a bit tired - had to get up at 3:40
<dholbach> to be at a meeting at 4 :)
<schweeb> ick
<dholbach> then I just got on working
<ajmitch> that's just wrong
<pschulz01> Greetings.. I have a patch for a package (mdbtools), can someone point me to a URL or explain what I should do next? (Email the developers directly or pass it through motu/launchpad?)
<dholbach> pschulz01: file a bug report and assign to motureviewers
<pschulz01> dholbach: launchpad?
<dholbach> yes
<schweeb> it appears as though mdbtools is in main
<pschulz01> schweeb: iis it a motu issue then?
<schweeb> I'm not sure what the current process is, I'll let dholbach speak for that
<schweeb> still a bug report, but not sure who to assign to
<dholbach> oh mdbtools is main
<schweeb> yes
<bddebian> Gnight gang
<pschulz01> Yup.. I see it's in main.. I'll have a chat on #ubuntu+1
<schweeb> hrmph
<schweeb> just did a search for universe bugs in 6.06 and I'm only seeing 10 :-/
<ajmitch> don't search for them by release
<schweeb> here we go
<Laser_away> ajmitch: so what is supposed to go on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/NotInDebian
<ajmitch> you're asking me? :)
<ajmitch> that url will be out of date, of course
<ajmitch> use one of the ones on tiber
<Laser_away> I saw you edited https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/New/Policy so I wondered
<ajmitch> the only thing I changed was ubuntu-discuss back to utnubu-discuss
<schweeb> man
<schweeb> bddebian as comments in like every bug I look at
<schweeb> *has
<Laser_away> ok, I'm away again
<ajmitch> some helpful user trying to correct what was though to be a typo ;)
<schweeb> busy busy
<schweeb> and someone used the word "b0rks" in a bug title.  nice.
<Laser_away> ajmitch: actually, I don't think that was a typo. the utnubu team is a real team (ubuntu backwards) ;-)
* Laser_away is really away, again. honest
<robitaille> http://utnubu.alioth.debian.org/
<ajmitch> yes, that's what I said
<aa_> hi, I am author of a universe package, but the version in universe is a year old and we are nearly two major versions on from there
<aa_> even unstable has had the newest one for a while now
<aa_> package is pida
<aa_> (and I am just the developer)
<dholbach> aa_: thanks for letting us know - is the new versio mostly features or mostly fixes?
<aa_> um, its almost a different application
<aa_> I doubt it shares a word of code
<aa_> dholbach: I noticed it in this thread http://www.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=155529
<dholbach> that's not really good :/
<dholbach> because we're in upstream version freeze for quite a while now
<aa_> I use dapper myself, but then I use pida from svn, so I never noticed :)
<dholbach> http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/UVFStatus lines out the process to get an UVF exception
<aa_> um, cool thanks
<aa_> but well (I don't mean to be all developery about it) I guess I should leave that up to you guys whether you care about it or not
<aa_> I should file the bug though
<aa_> :)
<dholbach> if you say: that's something I can help you to support and it's a serious problem to have the old version in and I'm very confident in the new version, you should file a bug, yes
<dholbach> that's a problem with ~20000 packages
<aa_> oh well, that's kind of sad
<dholbach> yeah, but it happens and I'm happy you jumped in.
<aa_> I certainly can't make a package etc, I am just not clued
<aa_> I guess I could learn
<aa_> could I steal the debian unstable thing?
<schweeb> you shouldn't have to make the package
<schweeb> the instructions say nothing about that
<schweeb> they want a diffstat of your upstream tarballs
<aa_> "Please note that we expect requesters to have an updated package already prepared and tested! You will need this anyway to provide proper diffstats and buildlogs."
<dholbach> aa_: we need the upstream changelog and a diffstat of the diff
<dholbach> aa_: if you say you'll need somebody to do this for you that's fine
<aa_> um, I misunderstood that last line then
<dholbach> aa_: you can speak for an upstream release
<dholbach> some people request stuff and didn't even test it
<schweeb> I would count the debian package as an appropriate package
<aa_> hah, diffstat for 500 svn revisions <grin>
<aa_> actually, it is more like 800
<aa_> I wish I had caught this before the freeze, anyway, thanks for the advice. Much appreciated
<dholbach> thanks a lot
<aa_> muahah, 500K diff
<aa_> you really want it?
* Mongoose is away: /_\ zzZzZZZZzz
<aa_> oh well, I attach it anyway
<aa_> wow that bug tracker is nice to use
<kelmo_lap> moin
<Toadstool> hi MOTUs
<Gloubiboulga> hello Toadstool
<Toadstool> hey Gloubiboulga
<aa_> I like launchpad so much I think I am going to register my product and use it. Anyway have a nice day everyone.
<ivoks_live> hi
<pygi> hello ivoks_live :)
* ivoks_live is impressed with Ubuntu LiveCD
<ivoks_live> the thing just works :)
<pygi> heh :) tried it for the first time now? :)
<ivoks_live> yes
<pygi> nice =P
<ivoks_live> even my synaptic sid scroll works out of the box :)
<ivoks_live> s/sid/side
<Hobbsee> hi all
<pygi> :-P
<ivoks_live> uh... clock is wrong :)
<pygi> really? :) file a bug :P
<ivoks_live> eh... back to the disk
<ivoks> eh... we have a great distribution here :)
<ivoks> i would say the best :)
<pygi> ivoks: hehe :P
<pygi> ivoks: we have to make it even better :)
<ivoks> that's why we are all here
<pygi> agreed
<zakame> hi all
<ajmitch> zakame: so what SoC spec are you going to do? ;)
<zakame> ajmitch: for ubuntu?  I'm thinking of BetterBugreportingTools :)
<ajmitch> ah ncie
* pygi goes to see what's that all about
<ajmitch> I was thinking of selinux or even network-auth
<ajmitch> since network-auth is rather useful to have
<zakame> yeah network-auth needs a lot of love :)
<ajmitch> might be some competition for that one though :)
<pygi> ajmitch: if you feel confident, network-auth is what I suggest :)
<ajmitch> pygi: of course I'm confident ;)
* ajmitch has the advantage of being able to upload to edgy directly
<zakame> I was supposed to try that one out, but turns out I need more eXP :D
<pygi> ajmitch: heh :)
<ajmitch> pygi: depends if there's someone who can adequately mentor that, with time
<pygi> ajmitch: yes, we have mentor for that
<ajmitch> good
<ajmitch> am I allowed to ask who? :)
<pygi> no, no, that's a top secret :)
<pygi> anyway, just write a good application
<pygi> altought I don't think it can be any worse *actually it can* from the one we received already =P
<zakame> yup
<ajmitch> heh
* ajmitch has to judge what time allows for development
<tseng> hi
<zakame> hello tseng
* cbx33 thought about doing an SoC
<cbx33> but i just don't have the time for it
<zakame> aww
<pygi> ajmitch: it's mithrandir
<cbx33> yeh, too much edubuntu work
<ajmitch> pygi: I expected that
<pygi> cbx33: you can do a SoC project for Edubuntu
<zakame> cbx33: btwcongrats yon your new edubuntu membership :)
<cbx33> thank you zakame
<pygi> cbx33: no really...why don't you choose a SoC project related to Edubuntu?
<cbx33> pygi: I could, but I think for anything that would be useful to edubuntu the mentoring would be too great :p - I'm a good all round coder, can hack up most things, but would need a lot of help with like python cos i never used it
<cbx33> well not in any great depth
<cbx33> I've done PHP and a lot of other scripting lanugages 15 in all :p  but nothing anyone would consider a proper languague
<pygi> cbx33: well, you can learn python :)
<cbx33> done some C
<cbx33> a little c++ recently
<pygi> cbx33: python (at least basics of it) can be taught rather fast
<cbx33> yes so I've heard
<cbx33> i mena i read through some code the other day, and...i mean I understand it...but wouldn't be able to write it at the moment
<Mithrandir> ajmitch: I'd be a lot happier to see a person like you grab the NetworkAuth soc than the current guy, at least from what I've seen so far.
<pygi> Mithrandir: I hearily agreed
<ajmitch> Mithrandir: that bad?
<zakame> Mithrandir++
<pygi> ajmitch: very bad =P
<ajmitch> sigh
<ajmitch> I'll put something together tomorrow
<Mithrandir> ajmitch: you're quite good, so in comparison, quite bad.  Actually, more that his application is incomplete and doesn't really convince me.
<ajmitch> right
<ajmitch> I'll have to see if I could get server+client-side stuff done in time to a reasonable level
<ajmitch> I'd say it's fairly possible :)
<Mithrandir> it's a fair bit of work, but if you know your way around how network authentication generally works, it's doable.
<tseng> *cringe*, pam.d
<ajmitch> I should have access to both netware & AD setups here
<ajmitch> the main one would be LDAP
<tseng> i use krb5 with ad
<cbx33> ajmitch: go for it, I want that code once it's done :p
<Mithrandir> ajmitch: if we just end up with something that's a basis for doing really simple rollouts of AD-like setups, I'd be really, really happy.
* cbx33 too
* tseng three
* cbx33 .......
<cbx33> I thought about it
<ajmitch> ok, good
<cbx33> ajmitch: I'd be happy to test anything if ya need it
<ajmitch> thanks
<ajmitch> I'd probably want lots of testers, of course
<cbx33> hehe
<ajmitch> no way I could setup all the test networks required
<cbx33> ajmitch: that's just not dedicated enough
<pygi> talk to you all later
<cbx33> :p
<cbx33> bye pygi
<ajmitch> cbx33: I know, but I'll give it a go :)
<zakame> cya pygi
<Mithrandir> ajmitch: I'm sure we can arrange a vmware license or something if you don't have enough machine to go around.
<cbx33> ajmitch: I was kidding
<cbx33> vmware server is free now
<ajmitch> Mithrandir: I've got vmware server on here
<ajmitch> and this box has 4GB of RAM, so should be adequate to run a few
<Mithrandir> yeah, I'd imagine so.
<ajmitch> probably about 10 machines lying around the house
<Mithrandir> for lots of bonus&brownie points, make the infrastructure interoperable with AD as a drop-in.
* ajmitch will see if there's an evaluation copy of w2k3 server around
<ajmitch> 180-day evaluation from MS ought to be long enough
<Mithrandir> yup
<ajmitch> wonderful, downloading it now
<ajmitch> should be interesting to see how it goes
<cbx33> keep us posted ajmitch
<ajmitch> yeah, I've got to write up the SoC application first, asap
<zakame> rock on ajmitch
<zakame> :)
* Hobbsee_away cheers ajmitch on in writing his SoC application
<Tonio_> hello everybody
<zul> heylo
<kelmo> hi siretart
<bddebian> Heya gang
<Gloubiboulga> hello bddebian
<bddebian> Heya Gloubiboulga
<zakame> hi all! :D
<zakame> bug 41886
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 41886 in launchpad-publisher "kdissert_1.0.5.debian.orig.tar.gz  MD5Sum mismatch" [Critical,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/41886
<trappist> I filed two bugs on two separate universe packages and attached patches, and both bugs were closed with comments that the patches had been applied and the new packages uploaded, but in both cases it appears not to be the case.
<trappist> before I reopen the second bug, is there some chance I'm doing something wrong?
<trappist> both packages have changelog entries, but both packages also still have the bugs I filed on them, and if I apt-get source them and peek at the source, the changes are not there.
<bddebian> trappist: What bugs?
<trappist> 41207 and 36051
<trappist> both patches applied by chuck short
<trappist> could it be that I'm using amd64 and just that arch hasn't been patched?
<bddebian> trappist: Shouldn't be.  Are the source and binary versions matching?
<trappist> yes
<trappist> bddebian: could it be, then, because my patches don't make new files in debian/patches, but just modify the source?
<bddebian> trappist: No, that shouldn't be an issue
<bddebian> Unless a patch in debian/patches is somehow overriding your changes
<trappist> new packages were definitely uploaded - the changelog entries are there - but there's not other evidence that the patches have been applied
<trappist> I wouldn't think so
<trappist> bddebian: so, any idea why this would happen?  should I reopen the second bug?  can somebody try reapplying the patches?
<bddebian> trappist: If it isn't fixed, yes I would re-open the bug
<trappist> k
<phanatic> hi masters
<bddebian> Heya phanatic
* bddebian won't say what he is a master of :-)
<phanatic> hey bddebian
<zul> bddebian: of your domain?
<bddebian> I was thinking of bation ;-P
<bddebian> Of course I probably just violated CoC there :-)
<zul> hehe
<phanatic> hey Gloubiboulga
<Gloubiboulga> hi phanatic
<LaserJock> morning MOTU Land
* LaserJock gets no love ;(
<bddebian> Heya LaserJock
* bddebian hugs LaserJock
<bddebian> I was smoking, sheesh :-)
<LaserJock> hi bddebian
<LaserJock> bddebian: I actually got some bugs fixed yesterday
<bddebian> LaserJock: w00t.  I'm not getting shit done as usual :-(
<LaserJock> bddebian: well you still have 4x the karma I do
<bddebian> LaserJock: So catch up homeslice :-)
<highvoltage> one day, the karma rules will change and then it will be recalculated and everyone will have different karma anyway
<LaserJock> highvoltage: yeah, but I think any way you look at it bddebian will always have more than me ;-)
<highvoltage> heh :)
<LaserJock> unless Edubuntu give lots of karma ;-)
<highvoltage> :)
<LaserJock> highvoltage: I did get more karma yesterday but I don't think it was because of the EC thing. That would have been cool ;-)
<zul> heh...im catching up to bddebian
<LaserJock> zul: yeah, you've been a monster lately
<shawn_work> we have a bug on archive
<shawn_work> http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/multiverse/x/xvidcap/
<shawn_work> is this 'dead' or nobody maintaining xvidcap/gvidcap?
<shawn_work> ideally, I'd like to get xvidcap 1.1.4 into echy+
<bddebian> shawn_work: What is the bug exactly?
<shawn_work> there's no .deb package built
<bddebian> Ah, hmm
<Toadstool> shawarma: the package can't be built, there is a missing dependency, libavcodec1-dev
<Toadstool> erf, shawn_work
<bddebian> Ah, that's no bueno
<shawn_work> doh
<shawn_work> we stil have that dependency issue?
<bddebian> IIRC libavcodec was dropped because of a license issue???
<shawn_work> oh really? the license was no good?
<bddebian> That was my recollection but I could certainly be wrong
<shawn_work> libavcodec can't be in multiverse?
<shawn_work> or restricted
<shawn_work> ?
<shawn_work> we're sorely lacking a x recording session tool
<shawn_work> istanbul doesn't work at 1600x1200 :)
<carthik> General question: After Dapper is released will all the universe packages be synced with the latest versions from Debian automatically, or is it a manual process?
<crimsun> carthik: the debian packages that lack any ubuntu modifications will be synced automagically, yes
<crimsun> carthik: the rest will need to be merged. In the past this is a by-hand process.
<carthik> crimsun, thank you. And how could I help with the others, if I may?
<crimsun> carthik: presuming we're using the same tools, the motumerge* wiki pages have hints
<carthik> crimsun, thanks again. Was curious, would like to start helping in some way, some future day :)
<crimsun> carthik: never fear, there are plenty of opportunities to help out
<LaserJock> true
<carthik> crimsun, gotta start somewhere, where I don't break things. Trying to find the path of least initial resistance. Thanks for the answers.
<crimsun> np
<zul> but its fun to break things ;)
<LaserJock> carthik: merges and syncs are a great place to get started
<carthik> LaserJock, I'll check in when that process gets going. :)
<zul> carthik: you are already an motu arent you?
<carthik> zul, me? no. Still thinking about whether I am ready to apply for Ubuntu membership.
<zul> ah ok
<bddebian> Later gang
<crimsun> cya
<tseng> bye bddebian
<kiko> hey motus!
<kiko> is there anyone here who knows a bit about listadmin, the mailman interface?
<crimsun> not I, unfortunately
<kiko> it would be really nice if the newer version was packaged
<kiko> because the current version doesn't work with our current mailman
<kiko> who can be a bug contact for listadmin?
<crimsun> kiko: does the debian unstable version work? if so, a uvf exception request might be in order?
<kiko> let me check
<kiko> crimsun, good call. I'll update the bug -- who do I need to get to UVF except it?
<crimsun> kiko: just file a bug on LP for it. let me dig up the url.
<crimsun> kiko: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-motu/2006-February/000545.html
<kiko> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/listadmin/+bug/43008
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 43008 in listadmin "listadmin doesn't work with the current version of mailman we ship" [Major,Unconfirmed] 
<kiko> thanks
<crimsun> err
<crimsun> that's a main package
<crimsun> main is handled slightly differently from universe/multiverse
<crimsun> sorry, I looked at mailman
<crimsun> (long day)
<kiko> :)
<kiko> no problem
<kiko> but I did come to right channel after all :)
<crimsun> yes :)
<tseng> hi kiko
#ubuntu-motu 2006-05-10
<ajmitch> morning
<LaserJock> hi ajmitch
<ajmitch> ah, we do have life
<alexandros_se> Hello,
<alexandros_se> I would like to get in contact (e-mail?) with Mark Shuttleworth
<alexandros_se> anyone?
<LaserJock> alexandros_se: hmm, not sure what his prefered  address is
<alexandros_se> LaserJock, mkay :/
<LaserJock> alexandros_se: I'd check out his Launchpad page: https://launchpad.net/people/sabdfl
<LaserJock> alexandros_se: but I've only talked with him on IRC
<alexandros_se> he use nickname sabdfl on irc?
<LaserJock> yeah
* carthik_cook plans to make Kerala style egg curry ;)
<infinito> is there any way to get a UVF exception for gotmail ???
<infinito> right now gotmail in dapper is unusable
<infinito> and it just needs a sync from debian unstable to work...
<freeflying> infinito: seems hard to get UVFe now,but you can have a try
<infinito> freeflying: what can i do?? i'm not motu...
<freeflying> infinito: file a bug on it, attach the diffstat and changelog, also the build log ,then assign it to motu-uvf
<zakame> hi all
<zul> hi zakame
<freeflying> zakame: hey
<zakame> hi zul and freeflying
<infinito> freeflying: sorry but... how do i get the diffstat?
<freeflying> infinito: diff -ruN oldsource newsource | diffstat > filename_you_wanna_use
<infinito> freeflying: thanks!
<infinito> freeflying: there's a bugreport already, im gonna attach diffstat and buildlog, but should i assign it to motu-uvf?
<infinito> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/gotmail/+bug/41650
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 41650 in gotmail "gotmail 0.8.9 is out, with an important fix" [Normal,Unconfirmed] 
<zakame> yep
<freeflying> infinito: sure
<infinito> freeflying: ok
<crimsun> gruuu.
<crimsun> just spent the past three hours chasing down #31699
<welshbyte> ugh
<welshbyte> wallpaper-tray FTBFS
<zul> hmmmm?
<welshbyte> zul: i was going to have a look at a couple of (seemingly simple to fix) bugs in wallpaper-tray but it won't build
<zul> whats wrong with it?
<zul> welshbyte: built fine here
<welshbyte> really? hmm
<welshbyte> what did you build it with?
<zul> apt-get source and debuild
<welshbyte> ah i see, it does build from source but when you change the source (i deleted 2 characters) it gives a "collect2: ld returned 1 exit status" and fails
<lifeless> unknown symbols cause link failure, news at 11
* welshbyte slaps himself with a header file at 5am
* Mithrandir waves
<Hobbsee> hey Mithrandir :)
<Mithrandir> hello Hobbsee
<Mithrandir> how's your day been?
* Hobbsee has cleared out rubbish from ~/.kde so it works much faster :D
<Hobbsee> ah yeah, interesting - came home from uni early :P
<tritium> rubbish!
* Mithrandir has slept about six hours this night and is so bloody tired.
<Hobbsee> hehe
* Hobbsee hands Mithrandir a replacement pillow, aka a keyboard
<Mithrandir> nah, I'm going to the gym in about half an hour, just need to start livefs builds, read a bit of email and get some food first.
<Hobbsee> ah, fun
<Kyral_ZzZ> night
<ajmitch> afternoon
<dholbach> good morning
<Hobbsee> hey dholbach
<dholbach> hey Hobbsee
* zakame hugs dholbach 
<pef> hello
<pef> my uploads to universe are silently discarded, why ? I've set distribution to dapper, upload using dput to upload.ubuntu.com, used my gpg key to sign the source.changes file...any idea ?
<ajmitch> ask in -devel or #launchpad
<ajmitch> someone will have access to the upload logs
<pef> ajmitch: thank you :)
<ajmitch> from what I can see on launchpad, you're part of the right teams, signed the CoC, etc
<ajmitch> so if the source package is universe, it should be accepted
<pef> ajmitch : yes, I already uploaded, and since a few days I cannot :/
<ajmitch> I don't *think* packages are being held in a queue right now
<ajmitch> though with flight-7 freeze it's quite possible
<ajmitch> eg if publisher has been stopped to avoid unnecessary uploads
<pef> ajmitch: only concern main, isn't it ?
<ajmitch> if publisher is stopped, it affects all
<ajmitch> I don't know how fine-grained the launchpad freezing might be at the moment
<pef> mmm... the topic on -dev says it only affect main
<ajmitch> yes
<ajmitch> but it may affect universe for technical reasons
<ajmitch> though I've seen a few zul uploads today
<pef> I've asked on -dev, just have to wait a little :)
* Mongoose is away: /_\ zzZzZZZZzz
<Mithrandir> can somebody please slap mongoose and tell him to turn off public away next time he joins?  He's been doing that for ages.
<ajmitch> gladly
<Mithrandir> (and he always quits after he does /away so I never remember to do it myself)
<pef> Mithrandir: you should send him a memo :)
<Toadstool> hi MOTUs
<ajmitch> hi
<Toadstool> hi ajmitch
<aa_> Hi, I made a UVF request yesterday, and promptly told there is not enough information. The request is https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/pida/+bug/42882/+index
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 42882 in pida "PIDA version in dapper is very old" [Normal,Needs info] 
<aa_> well, anyway, I did my best, and I was just trying to help you guys. So well, when you spend your lunch doing something, and someone just says "Not enough info, NEXT" think about it, the poor guy already wrote the software. The software already got updated in Sid (not to mention all other major linuxes and even minor linuxes). And then you will wonder why I start publicly recommending to my users to use a different distro of 
<aa_> this is not a flame, but really, sometimes you need to just think. Thank-you. :)
<lifeless> aa_: your position here presumes that there is no risk in the upgrade
<aa_> lifeless: I have no firm position, I just wrote the software, and get asked approximately 5 times a day why the version in ubuntu is so old
<aa_> the answer "it will be updated soon" is not washing since "people keep telling me it is also in Sid"
<Toadstool> aa_: well, your uvf exception request clearly lacks information, there's no diffstat, no changelog diff and no buildlog
<aa_> of course, I am not doing this for your benefits, in particular, it is a really old and crappy version
<aa_> Toadstool: I chatted to the main dude of universe
<aa_> Toadstool: I was to be represented in these matters by the debian package
<aa_> (since I am not a package maintainer, I don't even know how to make a deb)
<aa_> now, if you really want the author of a piece of software to download a debian package, download a ubuntu package and diff them...
<aa_> I think you might be on planet la-la
<aa_> (but of course, maybe I am entirely missing the point)
<lifeless> there are 16000 software packages in ubuntu
<aa_> and fedora and suse and all the others
<lifeless> no
<aa_> I am not complaining!
<lifeless> debian has ~13000 software packages
<lifeless> fedora is < 8000 last I heard
<aa_> ok, ok
<lifeless> don't know the exact figure on suse
<Toadstool> furthermore there are only three dev' processing this kind of bugs and they have a lot of work aside too as we're about only 3 weeks far from release... they don't have time to download each package and check the diffs
<aa_> but please, there is no reason to make excuses
<aa_> Toadstool: maintainers are not devs. Devs wrote the stuff.
<Toadstool> I meant Ubuntu devs
<aa_> anyway, yes I agree it is hard and everything
<aa_> but, do we want the best linux or not?
<aa_> Toadstool: after chatting with the universe chap we decided that an upstream debian version bump was enough evidence. Maybe I misunderstood *him*
<ukh> sorry for the noise, but I'm an old debian die-hard and an ubuntu newbie.  is there anything equivalent to buildd.debian.org?  that is official build logs?  or is there a "Ubuntu-for-Debian-People-FAQ"?
<Toadstool> ukh: everything's on launchpad :)
<tseng> https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/beagle/
<tseng> from the source overview
<tseng> you can drill down to a single version
<tseng> and see its logs
<Toadstool> aa_: you'd better ask dholbach again then, I can't speak for him and according to your bug report it's the MOTU you spoke with
<aa_> hmm, ok I shall, although I have wasted enough time on this.
<ukh> tseng: ah, thanks!  :-)
<tseng> ukh: np.
<Toadstool> aa_: he's in charge for universe uvf exceptions with slomo_ and siretart
<aa_> Toadstool: might just be easier to write ubuntu into a specific exclusion license. It would make me giggle too, and give me massive infamy and advertisement...hmmm
<aa_> no I have it
<aa_> "security"
<tseng> that doesnt fit into anyones definition of free software, if you are suggesting what i think
<aa_> muahah, is there a "security" path?
<Toadstool> aa_: "release schedule" in fact
<ukh> mmm.  too bad, "Build log: not available" for the one I'm looking for.  oh well.
<aa_> tseng: doesn't really matter, only ubuntu users will be affected (sad since I am one of them) [I am just kidding] 
<aa_> Toadstool: well, the version in current ubuntu has huge huge security holes, where can I advertise this, is there a separate tracker?
<Toadstool> nope, but you can add that kind of information to the already opened bug report along with the diffstat and so on
<aa_> hmm, I am trying not to get angry :)
<tseng> hysterics here isnt going to help you very much
<aa_> right
<aa_> is there a developer here that might understand the point of view of another developer?
<tseng> you have spoke to several today
<tseng> +n
<aa_> do you package your own software?
<aa_> (if I may ask)
<tseng> not exactly, no
<tseng> "my own" software cant be distributed outside my company
<tseng> i package software from projects that i am involved in, but i dont "own" then by any strech
<aa_> but you might understand how I am frustrated that the version in dapper was released before hoary?
<tseng> has it changed in Debian since hoary?
<aa_> yes!
<tseng> to be very honest
<tseng> you can blame you/your users for that
<tseng> we have something like 30 packagers at present
<aa_> ok, then tell me what me/my users shuld do to fix it please
<tseng> if no one steps up for their favorite out of 15,000
<tseng> it wont be worked on
<aa_> should we release an unofficial deb for ubuntu?
<tseng> what is this business about "I have updated the report"
<aa_> I updated the initial report
<tseng> what is the initial report
<aa_> I wasn't aware launchpad had such amazing diffing features at the time :)
<aa_> the initial bug report
<tseng> ...
<tseng> i am looking at it
<tseng> what did you change
<tseng> oh, the description?
<tseng> here's your problem
<tseng> he asked you to go read the proceedure for filing for a UVF exception
<tseng> and as far as I can tell, you have made two edits
<aa_> I discussed the procedure with a motu
<tseng> and gotten no closer to complying
<tseng> ok, so where is the ChangeLog diff
<tseng> and diffstat?
<aa_> he told me what is needed
<aa_> he also told me, that I would not need a new package
<tseng> ok so what is all the trouble
<aa_> and that the newer debian package would support me for the diff stuff
<tseng> who is "he"
<aa_> you want me to download the debian package?
<tseng> no
<tseng> I want you to attach a changelog diff and full diffstat, if i am not missing something
<aa_> you know what, I am going to upload a 15M diffstat just to make you happy
<Toadstool> aa_: a diffstat not a diff
<tseng> you already uploaded the entire diff
<tseng> do you know what diffstat is?
<aa_> yes
<aa_> I'll do it really
<tseng> so how could it possibly be bigger than the full diff
<aa_> the fact that it is a complete rewrite, probably passed you guys by on the bug report
<aa_> yes, not 15M really :)
<aa_> anyway, I'll do it, why not
<tseng> we have pretty simple policy for requesting UVF, you didnt follow it. it was pointed out to you nicely
<aa_> after all, who keeps tarballs of software they haven't used for a year
<tseng> now you are here making a fuss over it, and it still isnt done properly
<aa_> lucky I am the developer really :)
<aa_> no no, give me a few minutes to comply
<tseng> the tarball is in the ubuntu archive
<zakame> hi all
<Toadstool> hey zakame
<tseng> bye zakame
<zakame> hey Toadstool ,bye tseng
<aa_> ok, now on the UVF procedure it says a "diffstat of the upstream tarballs"
<aa_> is that what you really really want?
<tseng> I want
<tseng> untar oldversion
<tseng> untar newversion
<tseng> diff -ruN old new | diffstat > your-diffstat
<aa_> right
<tseng> diff -ruN old/changelog new/changelog
<zakame> or a diffstat between debdiffs
<aa_> but I am just following the procedure
<aa_> ali@book:~/tmp$ diffstat pida-0.3.1.tar pida_0.2.2.tar 0 files changed
<tseng> zakame: lets not complicate this any more
<tseng> oh jeez
<zakame> s#debdiff#dsc#
<tseng> you know what it meant
<aa_> ok
<aa_> yes I did
<zakame> tseng: oops sorry
<aa_> just pointing to the fact that if you are going to be exact, please be exact :)
<zakame> what am I doing wrong with kdevelop3?
<zakame> grrr, s#binar-#binary-#
<tseng> i didnt know # worked as an fs
<tseng> cool
<tseng> i use / or :
<zakame> in perl it is usable :)
<tseng> oh
<tseng> in sed also
<zakame> probably not in other re's
<tseng> $ echo foo | sed -e "s#foo#bar#g"
<tseng> bar
<zakame> now that i didn't know, cool! =)
<tseng> eh
<tseng> $ echo foo | sed -e "s}foo}bar}g"
<tseng> bar
<tseng> i think you can use about anything
<zakame> hehe
<aa_> tseng: I have attached the specific changelog between the svn release tags, is that satisfactory?
<aa_> it asks for a changelog diff, which I think amounts to the same thing anyway
<tseng> ok that sounds fine
<aa_> right, while this is becoming fun, I may as welll attach the NEWS file too
<tseng> I guess so
<zul> hey tseng
<tseng> hi
<aa_> well, I set the status from needs info, back to uncomfirmied, is this the best way to get it reviewed?
<tseng> yes
<aa_> excellent, many thanks for your help, have a nice day
<zakame> yup
<tseng> thank you
<zakame> and yours too aa_, thanks for helping us! =)
<zakame> hi jbailey
<zul> hey jeff!
<jbailey> Heya.  Sorry for popping in and out.
<jbailey> I'm at a trade show, and people keep asking me about MOTU stuff.
<zakame> ooh!
<zul> ah heh..
<jbailey> So I log into the channel to point them to the URLs in the title.
<Mithrandir> just hang aroud, then?
<phanatic> hi people
<zakame> hi phanatic
<phanatic> hey zakame
<jbailey> Mithrandir: My machine's been hanging.
<truz24> Sun plans to alter its licensing to make it easier to bundle Java Runtime Environment with Linux.
<truz24> apt-get install jdk1.5  anyone :-)
<Mithrandir> JRE != JDK, though
<truz24> Right, thats why I said jdk
<truz24> I do some development in java.
<sivang> hey all
<sivang> Preparing a changed source that will eventually get infinitiy's approval and and be NEW'd for its binary as well, would anybody be on for sponsering its upload ?
<sivang> (this is about homeUserBAckup)
<bddebian> Heya gang
<Hobbsee> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Heya Hobbsee
* Hobbsee croaks, instead of speakign normally :P
<Mithrandir> hi bddebian, Hobbsee
<ajmitch> hello *
<Hobbsee> hey Mithrandir
<Hobbsee> hi ajmitch
<bddebian> Heya Mithrandir
<zakame> hi all
<siretart> hi from linuxtag/wiesbaden! :)
<azeem> heya siretart
<azeem> I'll be there tomorrow
<zakame> heya siretart ! :D
<ogra> me too
<ajmitch> hey siretart
<siretart> azeem: cool! let's meet at the debian booth then :)
<siretart> ogra: cool! :)
<siretart> huhu ajmitch
<ajmitch> siretart: I saw you were interested in NetworkAuthentication for paris?
<siretart> ajmitch: I'm always interested in that. Thats why I started to work on wpa_supplicant with kelmo
<ajmitch> siretart: right, I'm putting in an application to do it as a SoC project
<ajmitch> well, I'm getting there with the application :)
<siretart> ajmitch: sounds great! :)
<ajmitch> however I doubt I can get to paris to talk about it :)
<Hobbsee> exams tend to stop that, yes :P
* ajmitch could just skip them
<Hobbsee> no!
<Hobbsee> you have to pass the things!
* zakame cheers ajmitch on :D
* Hobbsee contemplates skipping her exams too
* bddebian has no exams.. mwuhahaha
<sivang> any of the happy gang care to check out my package and upload teh source ? :)
* Hobbsee assigns all the bugs in malone to bddebian 
<Hobbsee> bddebian: that's your exam...
<bddebian> Hobbsee: Ouch :-)
<Hobbsee> you have 23 hours...
<Mithrandir> Hobbsee: you're a harsh mistress
<bddebian> heh
<Hobbsee> hehe yep.  you may address me as your Queen :P
* Mithrandir waits for the rsync to complete
* zakame is enjoying the hot Philippine summer
* bddebian bows to Hobbsee
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: now I guess you really do have to go for MOTU
<Hobbsee> haha!
<Hobbsee> whyever should i, when i can just poke people like you to upload for me?  :P
<zakame> Hobbsee: lol
<bddebian> heh
* Hobbsee wonders how good keyboards act as a pillow substitute
<ajmitch> they're quite inferior
<Hobbsee> hmmm...
<Hobbsee> so people make better pillows?
<sivang> depedesn on the person I guess :p
<Hobbsee> hehe
* sivang waits for someone with upload privs to take interest in upload hubackup from revu soon
<highvoltage> Hobbsee: i'v fell asleep at my computer before, with my head on keyboard, ended up with a lot of keys indented in my face
<Hobbsee> hehe!
* Hobbsee has done that with her watch before, at school :P
<sivang> bddebian: what do you say about uploading a new source for upbackup which is now hubackup?
<sivang> bddebian: I'm trying to get this baby in the archive for a week or more now :)
<bddebian> sivang: I thought it already went up?
<sivang> bddebian: no quite, had soem issues that Adam spotted for the bin pacage. I now have a new source, with all the required changes hopefully, and with a new name , final .
<Hobbsee> ack, my touchpad is on drugs!
<sivang> Hobbsee: T43 ?
<Hobbsee> sivang: huh?  no, toshiba a10 satellite
<bddebian> Should we remove pcsx from the archive?  Bug #41501
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 41501 in pcsx "[unclear]  [UNMETDEPS]  pcsx has unmet dependencies" [Normal,Needs info]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/41501
<bddebian> ANyone, anyone,... Buehler
<sivang> bddebian: source is in REVU at http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2321
<sivang> bddebian: can see if you can upload it? it has been already reviewed in the previous name by slomo_ and another MOTU
<sivang> bddebian: so I don't reckon there should be too many issues relating to it.
<slomo_> where's hub btw? ;)
<sivang> slomo_: hehe
* sivang hugs slomo_ 
<sivang> slomo_: how have you been due?
<sivang> dude, eve
<slomo_> i need to talk to him this time... and now he's not here ;)
<slomo_> hm extremely tired and busy lately :/
<sivang> slomo_: oh, busy too much with school?
<slomo_> sivang: university, yes... and you?
<sivang> slomo_: dayjob tireing and boring as always , trying to get HUB on the archive finally (now with fixes as requested by infinity) , changed the package name at last :)
<slomo_> oh it wasn't accepted yet?
<sivang> slomo_: tearing up between dayjob commitments and ubuntu work :)
<zakame> awww
<sivang> slomo_: no, Adam requested to remove the versioned depdencies against the ones against which it was un neccessary,
<sivang> slomo_: and to drop coreutil since it an essential package
<bddebian> sivang: OK, seems to build OK, should I upload or is slomo_ wanting to do it?
<sivang> slomo_: so it makes no sense to depend on it.
<slomo_> bddebian: i'm not doing anything except eating cookies currently ;)
<sivang> slomo_: I haven't changed anything besides refactoring:
<bddebian> slomo_: Good, have any thoughts about removing pcsx?  Bug #41501
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 41501 in pcsx "[unclear]  [UNMETDEPS]  pcsx has unmet dependencies" [Normal,Needs info]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/41501
<sivang> slomo_: s/UPBackup/HUBackup/
<sivang> slomo_: and s/upbackup/hubackup/ and s/uprestore/hurestore/
<bddebian> sivang: uploaded
<sivang> slomo_: throughout the sources
<sivang> bddebian: yay thanks!!
<sivang> bddebian: now I'll go bug infinity :)
<sivang> or Kamion, or whatever
<slomo_> bddebian: hm, i would get the dependencies in if there isn't a good reason to do not and it fixes the problem
<slomo_> bddebian: why remove something that could work? ;)
<LaserJock> slomo_: thanks for fixing gdesklets :-)
<slomo_> LaserJock: np :)
<LaserJock> slomo_: my computer still seem messed up from that dh_iconcache thing
<slomo_> LaserJock: please "grep \#ICONDIR\# /var/lib/dpkg/info/*.postrm"
<LaserJock> slomo_: what would I replace it with? I don't have access to the machine at the moment :-/
<slomo_> LaserJock: if there's nothing you have another problem and should upload rebuilds of those packages
<slomo_> LaserJock: and if there's something do the same ;)
<slomo_> don't replace it with anything... just upload a rebuild and wait :)
<LaserJock> well I have, the problem was that it can't uninstall the package that was already there, I thought
<LaserJock> maybe I'll try again when I get home
<slomo_> but it can update without problems normally
<slomo_> the icon stuff is in postrm which is afaik only called on a real remove
<LaserJock> well, I'll try it again, but before it was still giving me the error even though I hade a corrected upload
<LaserJock> but maybe it is all better now
<LaserJock> bddebian: at least you got an answer this thim ;-)
<LaserJock> s/thim/time/
<bddebian> Yeah and I thought just Kamion and infinity hated me :-)
<TomaszD> hi, are there any plans to package http://home.gna.org/gaupol/ in the universe?
<LaserJock> TomaszD: look at the UniverseCandidates wiki page and  REVU please
<TomaszD> ok, will do LaserJock
<sivang> yay, source accepted
<TomaszD> nope, no gaupol on either of the pages
<phanatic> hi people
<Gloubiboulga> heya phanatic
<phanatic> hey Gloubiboulga :)
<LaserJock> hi tuxmaniac
<tuxmaniac> LaserJock: Will brb..
<tuxmaniac> LaserJock: Hi
<LaserJock> welcome back tuxmaniac
<tuxmaniac> LaserJock: Can I delte my comment on a bug from launchpad
<LaserJock> tuxmaniac: nope
<tuxmaniac> LaserJock: :( Somehow for bug 42976 my comment got posted twice!! I dont know how!!
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 42976 in xcircuit "Xcircuit menus don't work. " [Normal,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/42976
<LaserJock> tuxmaniac: Malone has a permanent record, Debian's BTS is like that as well
<tuxmaniac> LaserJock: Any problems?? Sorry.. But it was not my mistake!
<LaserJock> tuxmaniac: ah, no biggie
<LaserJock> it really doesn't matter
<LaserJock> btw, have you uploaded a new xcircuit to REVU?
<tuxmaniac> LaserJock: Oh ok. :) I was really worried whether someone would kick me :)
<tuxmaniac> LaserJock: It is the same that I uploaded wuite sometime back
<tuxmaniac> LaserJock: I am working on two more software packaging..Alliance VLSI CAD and MAGIC Layout tool.
<tuxmaniac> LaserJock: Also trying to cut down on the Lintian and Linda errors
<LaserJock> yeah, I'd like to see if we can get a UVF exception but we need a package first
<tuxmaniac> LaserJock: You mean Xcircuit? The package is up on the revu!
<LaserJock> tuxmaniac: yeah, but it isn't ready to be uploaded
<tuxmaniac> LaserJock: Can you be more specific as to what it lacks apart from Lintian and Linda errors so that I can work on it !
<LaserJock> mostly those lintian and linda errors, let me look again though
<bluefoxicy> Hey, is the newest version of SPE going to go into universe before dapper?
<bluefoxicy> I just found that the last version had allocated over a gig of ram just by being open all night and me not really using it
<bluefoxicy> Mem:    963844k total,   938120k used,    25724k free,        4k buffers
<bluefoxicy> Swap:  2104472k total,   909864k used,  1194608k free,    81496k cached
<bluefoxicy> Then closing SPE
<bluefoxicy> Mem:    963844k total,   460000k used,   503844k free,        4k buffers
<bluefoxicy> Swap:  2104472k total,   284560k used,  1819912k free,    70992k cached
<bluefoxicy> I just installed 0.8.2.a, I'll let that run and see if it fixes it.
* bluefoxicy doesn't know python so he just lets it sit open for forever
<LaserJock> Gloubiboulga or Toadstool: around? What is going on with siptoolbox?
<Gloubiboulga> LaserJock, I can't fix it
<LaserJock> Gloubiboulga: why not?
<Gloubiboulga> because I'm not good enough I guess :)
<LaserJock> Gloubiboulga: hehe, np. I'll take a look and see if I can have a go of it. If not then I'll have to let bddebian do his magic
<Gloubiboulga> LaserJock, there's a new release
<LaserJock> heh, there's always a new release :/
<Gloubiboulga> yep, but it's a new release candidate actually
<Gloubiboulga> I guess it's only bugfixes
<Gloubiboulga> LaserJock, I look at this, if it's only bugfixes, an UVFe could be requested
<LaserJock> Gloubiboulga: did you look at the Debian info page for siptoolbox?
<Gloubiboulga> I looked 2 weeks ago, the maintainer asked to remove the package from debian iirc
<Gloubiboulga> our version is the same than the debian one
<LaserJock> Gloubiboulga: well, the maintainer orphaned it
<bddebian> Beauty
<Spec> Are there certifications for Ubuntu?
<tseng> yes, from LPI
<Spec> are most MOTUs certified? :p
<tseng> no..
<tseng> the LPI certs are for business demands
<Spec> and resumes?
<tseng> I am listed under "Core Developers", I think that speaks a little louder
<Spec> but...you're not certified, so you probably don't know a thing about ubuntu
<Spec> sorry, that was a joke.
<tseng> yeah
<tseng> PHBs
<Gloubiboulga> LaserJock, the new sources fail to build with the same error than our version anyway
<bddebian> Spec: tseng knows everything :-)
<LaserJock> Gloubiboulga: what new source? new upstream?
<LaserJock> Gloubiboulga: and what does it fail on?
<Gloubiboulga> LaserJock,  error: too few arguments to function 'MogrifyImage', using the April 14, 2006 tarball
<tseng> bddebian: happy Cinco de Mayo
<bddebian> And to you :-)
<bddebian> Gloubiboulga: So fix it :-)
<LaserJock> Gloubiboulga: is that on AMD64?
<Gloubiboulga> LaserJock, nop, x86
<LaserJock> Gloubiboulga: uggh
<LaserJock> Gloubiboulga: and you have all the build deps right?
<Gloubiboulga> yep
<LaserJock> Gloubiboulga: could you add a note to the bug report with what you have found?
<Gloubiboulga> LaserJock, sure
<Spec> so, tseng, you know everything?
<Spec> is the best way to package a .py script with dh_make, manual editing of control/scripts, and then dpkg-buildpackage?
<tseng> dpkg-buildpackage -S -sa -rfakeroot
<tseng> and then build it in pbuilder
<tseng> is more correct
<Spec> err
<Spec> what does pbuilder building do that dpkg-buildpackage doesn't?
<tseng> it builds in a clean chroot similar to the real buildd
<tseng> which makes sure you have the right build-deps
<Spec> so you build it, then rebuild it with pbuilder?
<tseng> no
<tseng> you build the source package only
<Spec> ohh
<tseng> and build that in pbuilder
<Spec> haha, -S = source
<tseng> which is the same thing that happenes in a real upload to ubuntu
<tseng> you upload source, its built in a chroot
<Spec> ah
<Spec> so that'll produce the .dsc file
<Spec> that pbuilder requires as an argument?
<tseng> yeah
<tseng> pbuilder build foo.fs
<tseng> foo.dsc
<Spec> yeap
<Spec> i knew how to use pbuilder, but not like that
<Spec> it makes 100% more sense now
<tseng> cool
<Spec> i'll have to bug you when i get more questions :)
<tseng> just so you arent disappointed, I dont actualyl know everything
<Spec> damnit.
<Spec> is it okay to call pbuilder as root?
<tseng> you have to
<Spec> ah, ok
<tseng> sudo pbuilder
<Spec> so, if i apt-get source a package and pbuilder build *.dsc, the result isn't signed....should I just manually call debsign?
<crimsun> yes
<zul> debuild -S shouldnt be good enough shouldnt it?
<Spec> I get "Skipping screwed changefile /path/to/program.changes" when I mini-dinstall -r :-/
<Spec> with no indication on how the changefile is screwed :p
<crimsun> zul: ...with pbuilder?
<crimsun> zul: normally yes, that suffices
<zul> oh...with pbuilder sorry..
<Gloubiboulga> LaserJock, I have to go but I'll spend some time on siptoolbox when I'm back
<Gloubiboulga> LaserJock, I'll add a comment on the bug if I really can't do anything else ;)
<LaserJock> Gloubiboulga: great, thanks
<Spec> How do I get mini-dinstall to associate "dapper" with "unstable"?
<bddebian>   MogrifyImage(ImageInfo *,const int,const char **,Image **,ExceptionInfo *),
<bddebian>    stat = MogrifyImage(image_info, argc, argv, &image);
<bddebian> That's your siptoolbox problem
<LaserJock> bddebian: is that the problem or the fix?
<LaserJock> :-)
<bddebian> LaserJock: That's the first problem.  I fixed that.  Now I'm trying to figure out why it can't find UndefinedCompressionQuality
<Spec> Where does pbuilder get the distribution from? The .diff.gz file? I'm trying to switch unstable to dapper and it keeps making it unstable in the .changes file
<tseng> the changelog
<tseng> edit the debian/changelog
<tseng> and rebuild the source package
<Spec> i did
<Spec> the changelog says dapper
<Spec> that's what i thought at first, but the .changes file is still saying unstable
<tseng> then you didnt build the source package (correctly)
<tseng> move the old stuff out of the way and try again
<Spec> i deleted the old stuff
<Spec> then did pbuilder build *dsc
<tseng> then you are doing something wrong
<Spec> hmm
<Spec> so it'll never look in the diff file? that's the only place where "unstable" is mentioned
<tseng> i am not sure what you think is doing the looking
<tseng> to answer that
<tseng> what is "it"
<Spec> whatever program creates the .changes file, dpkg-buildpackage i assume?
<Spec> all i've done is apt-get source <package>, went into package-version/debian/changelog, changed all unstable to dapper, and then did pbuilder build *dsc
<LaserJock> Spec: you have to build the source package first
<Spec> bah
<Spec> oki :)
<LaserJock> Spec: ie. debuild -S or dpkg-buildpackage -S
<tseng> yeah i told you that
<Spec> *slowlearner*
<tseng> at least twice :)
<Spec> well, dpkg-buildpackage -S -sa
<tseng> yes.
<Spec> :p
<tseng> -rfakeroot
<Spec> ah, yeah
<tseng> you dont always need -as
<tseng> -sa
<tseng> but
<tseng> i wasnt going to complicate things
<Spec> and i need to sit in the source for that
<tseng> yes, you do
<LaserJock> I usually just use debuild -S or debuild -S -sa if I need the .orig.tar.gz included
<tseng> its the same thing
<Spec> -sa is for orig.tar.gz
<Spec> ?
<tseng> -sa = sign all
<Spec> really?
<tseng> which means you are uploading orig.tar.gz
<tseng> if you have a new version, you do that
<Spec> ah
<tseng> if its a new revision, the orig is already in the archive
<LaserJock> or if you are uploading to REVU
<Spec> the first upload
<tseng> and you dont need to upload it
<Spec> yeap
<Spec> what's REVU?
<Spec> that's where MOTU's upload their packages to be built in a chrooted environment? </guess>
<LaserJock> Spec: that is where people can upload package to be review by MOTUs and eventually uploaded
<LaserJock> wiki.ubuntu.com/REVU
<Spec> so this is a way out of the debian mentor system?
<tseng> no
<tseng> its for ubuntu
<Spec> yeah, i meant
<Spec> for ubuntu to not do what debian does, which is require a new package person to have a mentor
<Spec> and have a mentor sponsor the package, etc etc
<sivang> guys, will working on http://tinyurl.com/rjcqu , or either on http://tinyurl.com/nl87h will get me approved for UNiverse uploads if I do it enough?
<sivang> (i.e., it's not making packages from scratch so I thought it has less value for that)
<LaserJock> sivang: umm, any work for Universe will help to become a MOTU
<LaserJock> bug fixing, unmet deps, FTBFS, .desktop files, whatever
<sivang> LaserJock: cool, what about uploading a package from scratch for a cool python program one wrote? :)
<jpatrick> pieces of pizza
* sivang waits now for the bin to be built after Kamion has NEW'd the binaries
<LaserJock> sivang: sure
<sivang> LaserJock: unmetdeps is automatically filed btw?
* sivang goes to see interesting packages in unmentdeps
<ogra> sivang, the more packages you touched^Wfixed the better look your skills in the TB meeting
<sivang> ah, indeed. I now see how it was created
<sivang> ogra: okay, I want to create a critical mass to help me progress a bit in MOTU, having to ask for someone to upload hubackup for me everytime could get annoyning :)
<Spec> how's hubackup going?
<sivang> Spec: there's a first version waiting to hit to archives in an hour I think
<sivang> Spec: make sure you check it out and opne all the bugs you see :)
* sivang suspects there are some. epsecially in trapping errors, refusing to work when there are no writeable devices on the system etc..
<Spec> hmm, my karma got cut in half
<sivang> eeryone's did
<Spec> ah, okay
<sivang> dunnon why
<Spec> maybe i shouldn't have eaten that lamburger with duck egg infused in it yesterday
<sivang> Spec: if you put a medium or connect a pluggable drive then you should be able to do backups without problem
<sivang> restore, and verify as well
<Spec> err
<Spec> what if i'm running off a usb harddrive?
<Spec> that shouldn't affect it?
<Spec> wtf
<sivang> Spec: will be just excellent
<sivang> Spec: HUBackup likes best when you work with usb harddrives :)
<sivang> (although might not be accurate on the messages it might display, as I've put numerous work to make multi volume backups work with rw/r cds)
<sivang> LaserJock: what if a package I was interested in already got assigned, should I ask the guy who's assigned there if he already fixed it?
<Spec> stupid laptop overheated :-/
<sivang> status does not say fix release/commited whateeve
<sivang> whatever
<LaserJock> sivang:  you could, but they are probably working on it
<LaserJock> if they assigned it to themselves
<sivang> LaserJock: okay, there a way to view all the unassigned stuff?
<LaserJock> hmm, not sure abou that
<Spec> unassigned bugs?
<Spec> because there's a way to see all the unassigned bugs...
<bddebian> Unconfirmed
<bddebian> Would be a great start
<bddebian> LaserJock: If Gloubiboulga comes back around, I made some comments on the siptoolbox bug :-)
<LaserJock> Spec: well unassigned that have a certain title, I guess you could use the advanced search
<Spec> hah
<Spec> there's no unassigned search option under the advanced search option
<Spec> err, under status
<Gloubiboulga> bddebian, thanks :)
<Gloubiboulga> bddebian, I try to find how to fix the UndefinedCompressionQuality error too :)
<bddebian> Coolio :-
<bddebian> )
<bddebian> Gotta run folks, catch you in a while
<Gloubiboulga> LaserJock, siptoolbox is fixed
<Gloubiboulga> I don't know how I didn't find a solution earlier :/
<LaserJock> Gloubiboulga: you uploaded?
<Gloubiboulga> I'm pbuilding it
<Gloubiboulga> LaserJock, I have not used a patch system since it's a tiny diff, are you ok with this, or do you prefer a patch system?
<LaserJock> does it have a patch system already?
<Gloubiboulga> no
<Toadstool> well done Gloubiboulga, I had completely forgotten about siptoolbox
<LaserJock> Gloubiboulga: then don't bother making it have one ;-)
<Gloubiboulga> Toadstool, bddebian's comment was really usefull :)
<Toadstool> yes indeed, I've just read it
<Gloubiboulga> Toadstool, just a missing #include and a MogrifyImage broken syntax
<Gloubiboulga> LaserJock, built/installed :)
<LaserJock> Gloubiboulga: great
<Gloubiboulga> Midnight here, it's time to sleep for me
<Gloubiboulga> later
#ubuntu-motu 2006-05-11
<ToadZzZztool> 'night
<LaserJock> quiet on all fronts it seems
<LaserJock> calm before the storm perhaps?
<crimsun> no, you're in the eye
<crimsun> some of us have been in the storm for months ;)
<ajmitch> hi
<crimsun> morning ajmitch
* ajmitch really really didn't get enough sleep :)
<crimsun> saturday! time to sleep in ;)
<ajmitch> sure..
<LaserJock> I haven't been getting enough sleep either :/
<LaserJock> and I need to finish this Edubuntu Advocacy thing before I go home
<crimsun> need assistance?
<crimsun> (haven't been paying attention to irc lately due to chasing alsa bugs)
<ajmitch> speaking of alsa bugs...
<tritium> LaserJock: what's involved?
<ajmitch> :)
* ajmitch has to finish up this soc application, too
<ajmitch> crimsun: you know what may have changed in the last weeks to kill off doom3? I can't recall the error messages, but the sound really didn't go well
<LaserJock> I'm trying to clean https://wiki.ubuntu.com/EdubuntuSchoolAdvocacy into https://wiki.ubuntu.com/EdubuntuSchoolAdvocacy/LaserJock
<crimsun> ajmitch: are you using oss or alsa output in doom 3?
<ajmitch> alsa, afaik
* ajmitch did end up having to reboot the box, so couldn't get many useful error messages
<tritium> looks pretty good, LaserJock
<crimsun> ajmitch: hmm, what were the symptoms?
<ajmitch> sounds playing at a very bad sample rate - I could still hear speech but everything else was drawn out beeps on top
<LaserJock> tritium: working on it. Now that I'm on the Edubuntu Council I feel like I should help out ;-)
<tritium> yeah, congrats :)
<crimsun> ajmitch: do you remember which alsa virtual device you were using?
<ajmitch> crimsun: it's on amd64, if that matters
<ajmitch> no, I don't sorry
<ajmitch> I don't have much info unless I go & restart the game & kill the box :)
<LaserJock> I got to help approve the first member, that is pretty cool
<crimsun> ajmitch: ok, if you could reproduce it and file a bug, I'll look
<crimsun> ajmitch: sure
<ajmitch> I'll try, it just required a reboot last time :)
* ajmitch really doesn't like rebooting this box
* LaserJock never gets to start his box :(
<LaserJock> one of these days I'm going to figure out exactly how much power my computer uses and compare that to the curling iron and sewing machine, and all of my wifes other contraptions
<LaserJock> she swears the computer makes the power bill higher
<welshbyte> good idea, my mother did that when i lived with my parents
<tritium> computers are hardly green machines ;)
<ajmitch> LaserJock: my power supply has a nice little LED display for the front of my computer - at the moment it's using 110W
<ajmitch> LaserJock: and that's for 5 hard drives, and the dual-core CPU stuck at 100%
<LaserJock> tritium: yeah, but all I need is for it to be greener than all her junk ;-)
* tritium wonders when computer users will be branded environmentlly irresponsible
<LaserJock> tritium: nah, all the environmentalists need their computers to organize their protests, etc.
<tritium> so maybe we're safe ;)
<tritium> later on, folks
<bddebian> Heya gang
<bddebian> Hello jaldhar
<jaldhar> hello
<jaldhar> I'm so proud of my boy.  At 18 months he did his first google search
<jaldhar> he was searching for JH"""""k.i but I'm still impressed
<bddebian> hehe
<bddebian> Heya Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> hi bddebian :)
<bddebian> jaldhar: Better keep him off of myspace ;-P
<ajmitch> hi
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<bddebian> ajmitch: Are we supposed to do a sync request on LP to bring something NEW in from Debian?
<ajmitch> I guess so
<bddebian> Shit it doesn't build anyway :-(
<bddebian> What replaces gimpprint?
<whiprush> gutenprint iirc
<bddebian> I don't see a gutenprint and gimpprint isn't installable either
<whiprush> cupsys-driver-gutenprint?
<persia> bddebian: on my system, gimp-print depends on libgutenprint2, both of which install.
<whiprush> ^^^
<bddebian> Ah gimp-print, not gimpprint :-)
<persia> Sneaky unpronounceables: get you every time :)
<bddebian> So any ideas what replaces usermin-postgresql?
<ausimage> Hello... wanted to let all know that secpanel needs a dependency change... from ssh to openssh packages...
<bddebian> ausimage: Is there a bug on LP for it?
<ausimage> no did not think of it as a bug....
<bddebian> And isn't ssh just a metapackage for openssh?
<ausimage> No... ssh is a transitional package... now at least in dapper
<bddebian> Ah, gotcha
<ausimage> hmmm???
* persia believes there should be a bug: otherwise it will become an unmetdep in Edgy.
* ausimage did not know unmet deps are bugs
<bddebian> ausimage: Typically because they usually keep a package from installing
<ausimage> K... then I will post a bug for the unmet dep in Sec Panel...
<bddebian> ausimage: It would really be better in Debian so we can just sync in Edgy
<ausimage> hmmm, I do not usually visit any Debian sites...
<ausimage> could you make sure the unmet dep is taken care of, please.....
<bddebian> It's not an unmet dep currently :-)
<zakame> hi all :D
<bddebian> Heya zakame
* ausimage confused... just want the dep noted so that it gets taken care of
<persia> ausimage: If you are not familiar with the Debian bug tracking system, it's probably fine to put it in Malone: one of the bug triagers may post it to Debian.  It should be "wishlist", and mention that it is a proactive solution, rather than a current problem.
<zakame> hi bddebian
<ausimage> K.. that makes sense... I believe so much in Ubuntu and want help wherever I see problems.....
<bddebian> So, any of you know of a replacement for usermin-postgresql?
<persia> bddebian: I'm not finding many usermin or webmin packages in the archive at all.  Are you sure these weren't deprecated for security reasons?
<bddebian> persia: No I'm not sure.  I know usermin was removed hence why I'm looking for a suitable alternative
<persia> bddebian: Perhaps pgadmin3 or phppgadmin?
<bddebian> persia: That will do, thx
<bddebian> ajmitch: Still here?
<persia> Any suggestions on updating packages with annoying version numbers (e.g. 2.0.4.20051017ubuntu2)?
<bddebian> Not much can be done about that unfortunately, unless it's an Ubuntu native package.  And even then it can be a touchy subject
<persia> bddebian: It's not.  It looks like a typo was made in the changelog in the past.  Perhaps just ...ubuntu3 for now, and hope it gets solved in the next Debian version?
<bddebian> Yep :-(
<persia> bddebian: Oh well.  Thanks.
<ajmitch> bddebian: am now
<ajmitch> sort of
<Hobbsee> heh.  sort of
<ajmitch> yep
<ajmitch> well I'm hardly all here :)
<Hobbsee> :P
* Hobbsee notices a leg and an eye missing...poor ajmitch 
<bddebian> ajmitch: It looks like python2.3-psycopg is a depends for a zope package.  Are you intending on "fixing" that?
<ajmitch> depends on what's broken
<ajmitch> Mongoose: ah you're here. *please* turn off the auto-away :)
<bddebian> ajmitch: It depends on python2.3-egenix-mxdatetime which are not in the archives
<ajmitch> right
<Mongoose> ajmitch: ?
<ajmitch> so more NEW packages
<Mongoose> ajmitch: that's my log off warning
<Mongoose> ajmitch: it's not really an away
<ajmitch> Mongoose: yes, and it's rather irritating :)
<Mongoose> ajmitch: you only see it once a day
<Mongoose> ajmitch: if I say "I'm going now" every time it's the same thing
<ajmitch> not really
<Mongoose> it's exactly the same
<Mongoose> you only see it when my quit timer starts
<Mongoose> ajmitch: do you stay up every night at 0100 or 0200 just to watch me logout?
<Mongoose> ajmitch: that's sweet  =)
<persia> Could anyone point me at a good config.guess/config.sub cleanup example?
<crimsun> persia: meaning?
<crimsun> afternoon,, StevenK
* StevenK waves.
<persia> crimsun: I've just updated a package, and there was config.sub/config.guess in the debdiff.  I've seen a couple packages that handle this by removing in the clean rule, and was looking for an example to emulate.  I'm currently using cdrtools, but would welcome a better example, or a pointer to a howto.
<crimsun> persia: diff will ignore its removal, so it doesn't really matter. It's probably better to leave the clean rule as is and build-dep on autotools-dev if you need a current config.{guess,sub}
<ajmitch> hi StevenK
<crimsun> alternately, pipe the debdiff through filterdiff and -x config.{guess,sub}
<crimsun> 'lo (again), ajmitch
<ajmitch> hi crimsun
<persia> crimsun: I don't need a current one.  The existing package copies /usr/share/misc/config.{sub,guess} in the clean rule.  I'm moving this to the build-stamp rule, and removing in clean.
<Hobbsee> hey StevenK
<freeflying> any motus around
<freeflying> crimsun: around?
<crimsun> freeflying: pong
<freeflying> crimsun: shall I change the debhelper compat to up-to-date in a apckage sync from sid
<freeflying> s/apckage/package
<crimsun> freeflying: it's not strictly necessary, and we should avoid unnecessary deltas if possible
<freeflying> crimsun: ok, thx
<crimsun> freeflying: np
<tuxmaniac> Heya masters!! I have pastebin'd the lintian error report which I have reduced from 12 to 6 now! Need help with the autotools error. Someone pls? http://pastebin.com/701291
* StevenK belatedly jumps on Hobbsee.
<Hobbsee> hehe
* StevenK was driving to his mothers house.
<ajmitch> heh
* StevenK is now stuck behind a 256k ADSL instead of his yummy 1.5M
<ajmitch> yay
<ajmitch> don't worry, my parents still have 56k dialup at home
<StevenK> It's only for an hour or so.
<crimsun> tuxmaniac: do you build-dep on autotools-dev?
<StevenK> My wife and mother-in-law are here for a Tupperware thing.
<ajmitch> StevenK: you'll survive..
<LaserJock> my parents are at about 28.8?
<LaserJock> s/?//
<StevenK> I'm hiding out in the study with the laptop.
<tuxmaniac> crimsun: No
<tuxmaniac> StevenK: Tuperware!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Ugh its everywhere!! :(
<StevenK> Oh, that reminds me. Does someone want to add me to the MOTU team on LP?
<StevenK> tuxmaniac: Tell me about it.
<ajmitch> StevenK: sure, how much $ do you have?
* StevenK tackles ajmitch.
<tuxmaniac> StevenK: Even my girlfriend keeps saying tupperware marketing and crap and irritates me :(
<ajmitch> heh
<crimsun> StevenK: err, you're already in ubuntu-dev
<ajmitch> StevenK: I can't add you as admin, but you're added to the not-very-useful motu team
<tuxmaniac> crimsun: Any way to solve that! Am pretty new to packaging so pls bare!
<ajmitch> assuming I got your right LP username :)
<StevenK> Should the MOTU team even exist?
<tuxmaniac> :)
<ajmitch> it's useful for bug assignments
<ajmitch> nothing else
<crimsun> StevenK: probably not, it's there for historical reasons
<StevenK> crimsun: That's "hysterical raisins"
<tuxmaniac> MOTU sounds Cool!!! MOTU means Fat is INDIAN Official Language! :)
<crimsun> darned raisins
<tuxmaniac> s/is/in
* StevenK wonders what's going on with LP.
<crimsun> tuxmaniac: you can b-d on autotool-dev, and newer versions will be pulled in when you debuild -S
<crimsun> autotools-dev^
<tuxmaniac> crimsun: Hmm will give it a try1
<crimsun> tuxmaniac: (that means you would need to have autotools-dev in your env, but the b-d is important for the buildds)
<tuxmaniac> crimsun: I do have!
<crimsun> tuxmaniac: do you update config.{guess,sub} in clean?
<tuxmaniac> crimsun: No
<tuxmaniac> crimsun: Thats has not solved the problem! still lintian is giving the errors!
<crimsun> tuxmaniac: they're not errors, they're warnings, and if you build-dep on autotools-dev, you generally don't need to mind them (presuming you update them in debian/rules)
<tuxmaniac> LaserJock: Ok yeah Warnings. But LaserJock asked me to resolv all the issues with lintian before it can be ready for upload!
<crimsun> tuxmaniac: keep in mind there are at least two camps regarding config.{guess,sub}; one camp hates seeing them in the diff.gz. I tend to rely on the b-d for autotools-dev
<tuxmaniac> ^^^ crimsun
<tuxmaniac> crimsun: Ok. will keep in mind
<LaserJock> tuxmaniac: I wanted you to at least look into each. Some you don't need to worry about (like NMU) and some you do (installing .xpm in X11R6)
<tuxmaniac> LaserJock: That ^^^ has been cleared
<LaserJock> k
<StevenK> Hopefully, Russ will add/fix an Ubuntu mode for Lintian.
<StevenK> I personally think that Lintain bitching about NMUs is pointless.
<tuxmaniac> StevenK: But there are people who also package for Debian
* StevenK nods.
<tuxmaniac> StevenK: IMO if you want to package only for Ubuntu then ignore it manually ;) else these are very helpful
<LaserJock> tuxmaniac: I'd upload a fixed package to REVU and then have crimsun or ajmitch review it
<infinity> Hey, dudes.  ruby1.9 is FTBFS on amd64.  The newer version in Debian builds on amd64 fine.  Someone may want to look into that and either generate a patch or do the UVF thang.
<carthik> tuxmaniac, sorry had to leave ina  hurry earlier, but xcircuit still acts really funny.
<StevenK> make[2] : Leaving directory `/build/buildd/ruby1.9-1.9.0+20050921'
<StevenK> *** glibc detected *** corrupted double-linked list: 0x0000000000635d90 ***
<StevenK> test failed
<StevenK> Hrm. I'm not sure who to blame.
<LaserJock> carthik: can you describe that a little more?
* StevenK sighs at the five bugs reported against mldonkey-server.
<StevenK> And I can't reproduce any of them.
<carthik> LaserJock, Bug #42976 tuxmaniac was interested in the package, and did a recent upload of a newer version - my menus don't work in xcircuit
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 42976 in xcircuit "Xcircuit menus don't work. " [Normal,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/42976
<LaserJock> carthik: right, but can you describe that more? You don't see anything?
<LaserJock> I know that you have to hold the click to see the menu
<carthik> LaserJock, xircuit opens up,a nd clicking on File etc on the top does nothing.
<carthik> Holding the mouse button down doesn't help neither. Nor does Alt+F (just tried that for kicks)
<tuxmaniac> carthik: That is strange!
<carthik> tuxmaniac, yup that it is. I only get "Warning: locale not supported by C library, locale unchanged" in the terminal.
<carthik> just once at the beginning. That's it.
<LaserJock> hmm, well that is something
<tuxmaniac> Yeah that comes in every version right from the initial versions!! :)
<tuxmaniac> LaserJock: You dont get that warning?
<LaserJock> I didn't think so
<LaserJock> I could be wrong though, I don't remember
<tuxmaniac> It came for me in 3.1 and 3.4 !
<tuxmaniac> also in some versions before that! :)
<tuxmaniac> LaserJock: Done with upload in revu!! If you can check pls?
* carthik decides to try an reinstall
<carthik> Now when I Ctrl+C ed, I get this error: "Exception exceptions.TypeError: 'an integer is required' in 'garbage collection' ignored
<carthik> Fatal Python error: unexpected exception during garbage collection
<carthik> Aborted
<carthik> "
<LaserJock> tuxmaniac: I can't tonight but I will in the morning, you'll need to get a UVF exception report going if you wan tto get it into dapper
<tuxmaniac> LaserJock: I will do that!
<carthik> tuxmaniac, it still doesn't have menus - if you can think of something that can help find out what the problem is, anytime, please let me know. This is a 386 kernel on a pentium III desktop. Thanks.
<LaserJock> ok, I'm off for the night
<tuxmaniac> LaserJock: Sleep tight! Gnite
<carthik> Good night, LaserJock
<tuxmaniac> carthik: Sure!
<tuxmaniac> is revu.tauware.de working?
<phanatic> hi people
<tuxmaniac> ajmitch: I uploaded my package some one hour ago but still the latest is not getting reflected! It was update package after reviw comments!
<tuxmaniac> ajmitch: Package name xcircuit
<Gloubiboulga> tuxmaniac, did you get an error message?
<tuxmaniac> Nope
<Gloubiboulga> not a 'package already uploaded' or something like that?
<tuxmaniac> Gloubiboulga: I did use a -f
<Gloubiboulga> ok, so I can't help
<zakame> hmm are the kdelibs broken at the moment? I can't seem to get kguitar build on amd64
<Hobbsee> zakame: ah...is that the problem..
<zakame> Hobbsee: hmm same for kid3 too
<Hobbsee> hehe...machine likes the extra ram for buildign things :D
<phanatic> hey Gloubiboulga, zakame
<Gloubiboulga> hi phanatic
<zakame> heya phanatic Gloubiboulga
<Hobbsee_away> wow!  look at that go!
<zakame> Hobbsee_away: wha?
<Gloubiboulga> hello zakame, Hobbsee_away :)
<Hobbsee_away> zakame: i got more ram for my system yesterday - it's faster now :D
<Hobbsee_away> hi Gloubiboulga
<Hobbsee_away> from 512 to 768mb
<zakame> Hobbsee_away: rocking!
<Toadstool> hi everybody
<phanatic> hey Toadstool
<Toadstool> hi phanatic
<phanatic> congrats for your membership :)
<Toadstool> thanks :)
<Hobbsee> hey, did anyone do the keurocalc upload with the dh_iconcache stuff?
<Hobbsee> zakame:
<Hobbsee> ping
* Hobbsee will start at the bottom of the k list, and work up!
* Hobbsee is bored.
<ajmitch> aww
* ajmitch runs off for dinnre
<Hobbsee> at almost 11 pm...yep!
* Mongoose is away: /_\ zzZzZZZZzz
<Hobbsee> why do we have a new kernel in the dapper repos for 686, but linux-image-686 not updated to depend on it yet?
<tseng> because if you dont have linux-restricted-modules to match
<tseng> you will break people using those modules with the new kernel
<tseng> so its a manual process to bump both of them in the meta package
<Hobbsee> ah :)
* Mithrandir gets more beer-brewing stuff.  Yay.
<Hobbsee> Mithrandir: ooh fun :)
* Hobbsee keeps testing out her new ram with making her machine build things :D
<Mithrandir> Hobbsee: first batch, which I made a few months ago is a bit too bitter, so we'll aim for a bit less hops this time around.
<Hobbsee> hehe
<Hobbsee> Mithrandir: fair enough
<Hobbsee> Mithrandir: not a lover of bitter beer?  :P
<kelmo_lap> what sort of brew is it Mithrandir ?
<Mithrandir> sure, I like it, but most other people prefer something which is a bit less bitter.
<Hobbsee> :P
<Mithrandir> kelmo_lap: first one was aimed for something resembling a brown ale but hit closer to an altbier.
<kelmo_lap> export it down to australia then ;-)
* kelmo_lap likes bitter beer
<Mithrandir> I could bring a few bottles to paris, if somebody wants to taste.
* Hobbsee doesnt like beer or alcohol at all :P
<Hobbsee> probably a good thing, too
<Mithrandir> Hobbsee: beer is an acquired taste and I'm sure we could teach you if you came to Paris. :-P
<Hobbsee> hehe
<Hobbsee> i have exams, and then i have a visitor coming :)
<Hobbsee> oh, and i have no passport
<Mithrandir> excuses, excuses. :-)
<Hobbsee> hehe
* Hobbsee isnt able to get a passport until july
<Mithrandir> well, paris+1.  I'm sure there'll be beer left in the world.
<Hobbsee> well, it would be silly, anywya
<Hobbsee> haha yeah - and i'll be legal to drink then...
<Mithrandir> oh, I thought you were older.
<Hobbsee> Mithrandir: how old did you think i was?
<Mithrandir> unsure, 20-something?
<Hobbsee> ah okay
<Mithrandir> I don't go around putting precise ages onto people I just know on irc, but you get a feeling whether they're kids or not. :-P
<Mithrandir> at least, so I thought. ;-)
<Hobbsee> hehe
<Hobbsee> anyone feel like uploading some things for me?
<Hobbsee> StevenK: you around?
<zakame> hi all
<Hobbsee> hey zakame
<Hobbsee> zakame: do you happen to have upload priveledges?
<zakame> Hobbsee: yes, to {uni,multi}verse
<Hobbsee> zakame: oh good.  feel like uploading some debdiffs for me, with those dh_iconcache changes?
<Hobbsee> figured i shouldnt load ajmitch down with *all* of them :P
<zakame> sure, actually I'm doing dh_iconcache stuff too
<Hobbsee> zakame: cool, where do you want me to email them to?
<bddebian> Heya gang
<Hobbsee> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Morning Hobbsee
* Hobbsee has killed off more of the dh_iconcache fixes :D
<zakame> heya bddebian
<bddebian> Nice going Hobbsee
<bddebian> Heya zakame
<zakame> yeah Hobbsee is Da Gal :)
<Hobbsee> :D
* zakame is wondering why his svn.debian.org commit access doesn't work :/
* Hobbsee bows, and twirls in her skirt :P
<Hobbsee> hmmm...i think i left that wiki page up to date
<slomo_> is someone with a microphone or another recording device here?
* zakame looks for one
* Hobbsee thinks hers got eaten
<phanatic> hi people
<Hobbsee> hi phanatic
<Hobbsee> night all...
<phanatic> night Hobbsee
<zakame> hi phanatic
<phanatic> hey zakame
<bddebian> Hello phanatic
<phanatic> hello bddebian
<phanatic> bddebian: how many bugs fixed today? :)
<bddebian> phanatic: 0, just woke up a little bit ago :-)
<phanatic> bddebian: oh, then the bugs have just begun to fear ;)
<zakame> have a cup of MOTU proprio then :D
<bddebian> phanatic: I don't think they fear me much :-)
<bddebian> zakame: proprio?
<zakame> bddebian: `motu proprio' latin, "in one's own accord"
<bddebian> Ahh
<zakame> when I first heard of MOTU that went into my head first
<bddebian> Ah, hehe
<zakame> funny, in retrospect, that's exactly what we're doing :)
<bddebian> Aye
<pianoboy3333> How can I find out what packages I needed to build the audacity beta? I'm trying to write a howto.
<bddebian>  apt-get build-dep audacity
<bddebian> Or apt-cache showsrc audacity
<phanatic> hey raphink and Gloubiboulga
<Gloubiboulga> hey phanatic
<raphink> hi phanatic
<raphink> hi Gloubiboulga
<Gloubiboulga> salut raphink :)
<bddebian> Heya Gloubiboulga and raphink
<bddebian> Gloubiboulga: Any luck with siptoolbox?
<Gloubiboulga> bddebian, hi!
<Gloubiboulga> bddebian, it's fixed
<bddebian> Sweet, how'd ya do it?
<Gloubiboulga> bddebian, I just added '#include <the_file_you_suggested.h>' and it worked :)
<bddebian> Really?  I tried that and couldn't get it going. Hmm.  Which file did you add it too?
<Gloubiboulga> mogrify_int.c
<bddebian> Weird
<bddebian> Great work
<Gloubiboulga> bddebian, you comment helped me a lot, we should work together ;)
<pianoboy3333> bddebian: no, that doesn't work, I compiled the audacity beta by myself from source
<bddebian> Gloubiboulga: :-)  Cool, we could try xsim or swt-gtk from Debian (it's need for swingwt :)
<bddebian> pianoboy3333: Ahh.  Do any of the README's or anything mention what it needs?
<pianoboy3333> bddebian: yes they do, I think I have it ok, I was just wondering if there was a way, ok, thanks
<bddebian> NP, sorry I couldn't be more help
<Yagisan> G'day all.
<jpatrick> good day
<Yagisan> is there some sort of libopenal0 to libopenal0a transition happening ? I noticed a few universe apps have gone to libopenal0a, which conficts with libopenal0. This will result in a quite a few apps not able to be installed.
<jpatrick> please revu: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=2322
<MagnusR> Hi! I am trying to package Apparmor for Dapper but have a problem. My init-script fails to find the apparmor kernel-module when it runs automaticaly at boot as S20 in runlevel 2. But it works fine when I run it after complete boot. The thing that fails is the command: modinfo -F filename apparmor
<MagnusR> Any one has an idea why and how I can get it to work?
<bddebian> Heya Yagisan
<Yagisan> G'day bddebian
<Yagisan> MagnusR: your ambitious, IIRC AppArmor was a kernel patch wasn't it.
<MagnusR> Tagisan: Yes it was. But it was no problem to get it work, the patches from the apparmor project workt right on the Ubuntu kernel source.
<Yagisan> MagnusR: you're lucky. I needed a .16 kernel to play with my pax stuff
<MagnusR> Then it is harder. Apparmors patches are quite small
<MagnusR>  Yagisan: My bigest problem so far is that I never befor had built debian packages, only rpm:s.
<Yagisan> MagnusR: I'm sorry I can't help with kernel-patch packages. I only have done games and multimedia apps. I'm planning to do a 6 month trial of a "hardened" ubuntu with my choice of sec patches to demonstrate they should be on by default in dapper + 2
<MagnusR> Yagisan: I think hardening is necessary to do. I have talked with some people that are very happy with grsecurity. I choosed Apparmor since it very easy to use compared to SELinux, which I have tried to work with before.
<Yagisan> MagnusR: I agree, but ajmitch, pitti, and myself failed to get it in at the last proactive security bof I attended. I felt the reason was because others were concerned it would cause issues for users, so I plan to demonstrate it has little to no effect.
<Yagisan> Yagisan: I can't do it in universe as the kernel team shot down my idea of hardened kernels in universe, so I need to do it outside of ubuntu
<Yagisan> MagnusR: when you are done with AppArmor I'd be happy to test it on amd64 and i386
<MagnusR> Yagsian: Good to know. I will only be able to test it on i386.
<trappist> I've never seen this before - apt-get dist-upgrade just says libopenal-dev is held back, and nothing else to install.  adept notifier sits in my systray with a /!\ but can't do anything about it.  should I file a bug in libopenal?
<Yagisan> trappist: did you see my post a short while ago. Scroll up
<Yagisan> trappist: I think we sucked in a libopenal transition
<Evaso2> hi guys somebody knows the status of freepascal in ubuntu?
<tuxmaniac> Hi all
<LaserJock> hi tuxmaniac
<tuxmaniac> LaserJock: Hi
<tuxmaniac> LaserJock: Still what I uploaded on REVU has not got reflected!!
<tuxmaniac> almost 12 hrs
<LaserJock> tuxmaniac: hmm, is it the same version number or did you bump it?
<tuxmaniac> No version number change!!1
<LaserJock> ok, did you get any errors with dput?
<tuxmaniac> No errors.. It said files uploaded!! Not running dinstall
<LaserJock> hmm, maybe try it again with dput -f
<tuxmaniac> Ok trying it now!
<tuxmaniac> dput -f revu <package>_source.changes right?
<LaserJock> yeah
<tuxmaniac> LaserJock: Done once again!
<LaserJock> k, let me see if I can find it in the reject pile
<tuxmaniac> LaserJock: Ok
<LaserJock> I don't see it, in rejected
<tuxmaniac> LaserJock: Any changes to be done in the command dput?? Because its an update on the previous upload?
<LaserJock> I wouldn't think so
<tuxmaniac> LaserJock: logins, passwords etc etc?
<LaserJock> tuxmaniac: hmm, weird. I can see it is there
<tuxmaniac> LaserJock: it is where?
<tuxmaniac> LaserJock: rejjected?
<jpatrick> tuxmaniac: having problems? again.... ;)
<tuxmaniac> hi jpatrick yeah..
* tuxmaniac and REVU not good friends!!!
<jpatrick> what package is it?
<tuxmaniac> same xcircuit
<tuxmaniac> jpatrick: An update after review comments
<jpatrick> isn't in incoming...
<tuxmaniac> LaserJock says he say w it somewhere!!
<jpatrick> do "ping tiber.tauware.de"
<tuxmaniac> jpatrick: No issues!
<tuxmaniac> jpatrick: Do I have to change the dput.cf login=<my email ID> for the second upload?
<jpatrick> no
<LaserJock> jpatrick: I see his uploads in /var/revu/revu1-incoming/
<LaserJock> it just doesn't seem to be linked to the webpage
<jpatrick> yeah, me too
<jpatrick> tuxmaniac: so it ain't your fault
* tuxmaniac and REVU have some bad previous birth enemity I guess!
<LaserJock> tuxmaniac: don't worry, I had a lot of problems as well
<tuxmaniac> LaserJock: hmm
<LaserJock> I usually ended up bumping the version number and it would work, but that isn't a terribly great solution
<LaserJock> although some MOTUs like it that way
<tuxmaniac> LaserJock: heh
<tuxmaniac> LaserJock: you like it that way too?
* jpatrick thinks "eh?" at xcircuit's build
<jpatrick> "/bin/ls: *.deb: No such file or directory"
<tuxmaniac> jpatrick: what>
<jpatrick> tuxmaniac: maybe 3.4.21-0ubuntu1 would be a better version to use
<LaserJock> oh yeah
<LaserJock> I didn't catch that
<tuxmaniac> jpatrick: hmm..
<LaserJock> and the build failed because it didn't find xutils
<jpatrick> oh yeah
* jpatrick updates pbuilder
<jpatrick> hmm, I get a permission denied
* tuxmaniac wonders whether you guys are playing around on the server?
<tuxmaniac> jpatrick: Do i have to change the version and again upload?
<jpatrick> try it
<tuxmaniac> jpatrick: uploading!!
<jpatrick> I see it
<tuxmaniac> jpatrick: done! You should be seeing that too :D
<jpatrick> what? It's there, it's just not linking to the web page
* tuxmaniac wants to hit REVU on its head three times !! :))
<jpatrick> it has a head?
<tuxmaniac> if it was a living creature!
<tuxmaniac> :)
<jpatrick> I'm going to rest of a while
<LaserJock> tuxmaniac: you might have to email the revu admins or talk to one here
<tuxmaniac> ajmitch: !!! Are you there!!!
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: not yet 7am there. he may still be in bed
<tuxmaniac> Yagisan: Ok..
<Mithrandir> Mongoose: can you please turn off public away?
<Mongoose> Mithrandir: that's actually my quit message
<Mongoose> Mithrandir: if you're so concerned about it you'll notice it only fires when I log off
<Mithrandir> Mongoose: it's annoying because it generates activity when there's nothing.
<Mithrandir> and it says "away", hence away message. :-P
<Mongoose> Mithrandir: so does my quit message
<Mithrandir> please turn it off.
<Mongoose> this is the only channel that bitches about it -- in fact I get more package work done in other channels
<Mongoose> this is the only thing discussed is quit messages
<Mongoose> it sets an away and then quits
<Mithrandir> *shrug*; I'm talking about the 13:06  * Mongoose is away: /_\ zzZzZZZZzz
<Mithrandir> line
<Mithrandir> which is just annoying and useless.
<Mongoose> Mithrandir: yeah then look at the quit message
<Mithrandir> what about that?
<Mongoose> Mithrandir: it alerts people to IM me
<Mongoose> Mithrandir: look at the log
<Mithrandir> uh, no?
<Mithrandir> how does "13:07 -!- Mongoose [n=mongoose@ip68-106-216-206.oc.oc.cox.net]  has quit ["Did you hug a mongoose today?"] 
<Mongoose> exactly
<Mithrandir> " say anything about IM?
<Mongoose> Mithrandir: it lets people know I'm offline and they can contact me before I leave the machine
<Mongoose> Mithrandir: I don't know how many projects you run but it's handy for me
<Mithrandir> uh, if you're not online (because you've quit), it's obvious that you're not online.
<Mongoose> Mithrandir: no I'm not on irc
<Mithrandir> if you're online on whatever IM service you use, you're online there, and people can see that.
<Mongoose> Mithrandir: you have 1min to contact me
<Mongoose> Mithrandir: actually they can't  =)
<schweeb> Mongoose, just respect the fact that this channel is asking you to stop
<Mongoose> Mithrandir: freak out I have a cell phone
* Yagisan sighs.
<schweeb> not a personal attack
<schweeb> just a request to stop
<Mithrandir> Mongoose: please just turn off the * Mongoose is away: /_\ zzZzZZZZzz message.
<Mithrandir> I don't care what you put into your /quit message.
<Mongoose> schweeb: the only reason I find this stupid is no one chats in here except for this
<Mithrandir> uh, they do.
<Yagisan> Mongoose: obviously you haven't been here long then
<schweeb> like I said, don't argue, respect the wishes of the channel
<Mongoose> Yagisan: when I log out there is no one in here
<schweeb> it's a common courtesy
<schweeb> most channels I know of don't like away messages either.
<Yagisan> ???? this place is never empty
<schweeb> and much work is done in here
<Mongoose> I'll just leave here since this is channel is worthless -- if all of ubuntu operated this way nothing would get done
<schweeb> without this channel there would be no universe
<Mongoose> one less package maintainer
<schweeb> kthxbai
<crimsun> Mongoose: (I think it's fine to ask you to mute your aways in here; Mithrandir probably finds it distracting from his Debian and Ubuntu development work)
<Mithrandir> *shrug*
<zul_> okie dokie
<schweeb> "hi I'm 12 and I'm using mIRC"
<schweeb> is what I heard there
<Yagisan> don't insult 12 year olds
<schweeb> s/12/immature/
<schweeb> better?
<Yagisan> schweeb: sure
<Yagisan> :)
<Yagisan> schweeb: I missed the smiley when I typed
<Mithrandir> well, as he doesn't even have a useful name in ircname, I have no idea who he is and if he has contributed useful stuff.
<schweeb> he's set to invis as well
<schweeb> can't tell where he's joined
<Yagisan> Mithrandir: I don't recall seeing him before, so I'll check my logs
<Mithrandir> Yagisan: he's been in here for ages and I've been annoyed about his away message before.  Even more so because he doesn't say anything.
<schweeb> 23:20 < ajmitch> Mongoose: ah you're here. *please* turn off the auto-away :)
<schweeb> not his first warning
<schweeb> and the conversation appears to have gone much the same way
<schweeb> *shrug*
<Yagisan> ah yes. I see
<Mithrandir> 107 lines of chat, including the last stuff since March 11th.
<Yagisan> annoying lurker
<Mithrandir> so not a very active person anyway.
<Mithrandir> well, I didn't intend to chase him away, just turn off the away noise.
<schweeb> you asked politely, and I tried to calm him down... not much else we can do
<schweeb> went on the defensive
<Yagisan> no, he seems thin-skinned and agitated about something. probably woke up on the wrong side of the bed.
<zul_> anyways...back to development
<Yagisan> anyone here know if we have some sort of libopenal0 to libopenal0a transition happening ?
<crimsun> Yagisan: probably unintentionally. Someone mentioned torcs not coexisting with the current libopenal-dev
<Yagisan> crimsun: yeah. I noticed it today that we have breakage now with libopenal apps if libopenal0a is installed
<crimsun> cool. time to fire up the old rebuilder.
<Yagisan> crimsun: ok. glad I could get it across to someone that can fix it
<trappist> could I get somebody to take a look at #41207
<crimsun> bug #41207
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 41207 in libast "Eterm built against libast on amd64 has its buffer filled with garbage" [Normal,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/41207
<trappist> oh he wants to hear 'bug'
<crimsun> I see an eterm upload, but the patch touches libast. There's no libast upload in May for d-c.
<trappist> there's a new libast2 package on apr 25 whose changelog says it fixes this bug, but the patch wasn't applied to it
<trappist> I mentioned that in the bug report and somebody said oops and changed it back to fix released, but still no new package
<crimsun> ok, let me look
* crimsun updates pbuilder
<crimsun> trappist: looks like a mistaken upload of confused source package (eterm instead of libast)
<trappist> didn't catch the new eterm package
<trappist> it will probably need a new package once libast has been fixed
<crimsun> I'll trigger that. Fixing libast now.
<trappist> awesome, thanks
<crimsun> np
<Seveas> slomo_, ping
#ubuntu-motu 2006-05-12
<\sh> evening
<Laser_away> hi \sh
<\sh> hey laserjock
<slomo_> Seveas: pong
<bddebian> Hey folks
<Se7h> hi
<bddebian> Heya Se7h
<Hobbsee> hi everyone
<tuxmaniac> Hobbsee: Waass up??
<tuxmaniac> Hobbsee: Morning!
<Hobbsee> doing my darned maths assignment, and i think my boss would love to shoot me.
<Hobbsee> or fire me, take your pick.
<Hobbsee> i think she'd prefer to shoot me :P
<Hobbsee> morning tuxmaniac
<freeflying> hi Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> hi freeflying
<tuxmaniac> ajmitch: You here?
<tuxmaniac> .away
<Hobbsee> tuxmaniac: it doesnt look like it.  he's shown as afk on other IM services...
<tuxmaniac> Ok. I need a REVU Admin o my revu admin to have a chat with me!
<bddebian> Heya Hobbsee, tuxmaniac, freeflying
<tuxmaniac> Hobbsee: There was a problem yesterday. when I  upload a package it is seen in /incoming but does not get reflected on the webpage!! :(
<freeflying> bddebian: hey
<Hobbsee> hi bddebian
<Hobbsee> ah, great
<tuxmaniac> bddebian: boo :))
<bddebian> heh
<tuxmaniac> Is any REVU Admin out there? :)
<bddebian> I think I'm supposed to be but I'll be damned if I can remember my account info :-(
<Hobbsee> hehe
<Hobbsee> you cant remember numbers easily?
<Hobbsee> or are they letters and numbers?
<nictuku> bddebian, tried 123456?
<bddebian> No, I got it right before I disappeared for a little while
<tuxmaniac> nictuku: :))
<Laser_away> siretart, sistpoty, ajmitch, \sh, and raphink ar the admins
<Hobbsee> hi Laser_away
* Hobbsee should start making passwords like that.  they'd make a lot more sense.
<tuxmaniac> Laser_away: You saw these names on the Wiki I guess!!??? ;) I was just going through!
<tuxmaniac> Laser_away: BTW Good Morning!
<nictuku> if you want to use complex passwords, you can reverse that one.
<bddebian> Ah, I'm on but apparently not an admin
<bddebian> Hmm, I see 5 xcircuit dirs
* tuxmaniac 's karma has dropped drastically to les than 1000 because of No activity in launchpad for two days :(
<bddebian> tuxmaniac: No, they were cut in half
<bddebian> I went from 40K to 20K overnight
<tuxmaniac> bddebian: Whats that cut in half?
<tuxmaniac> bddebian: Oh ok
* Hobbsee thinks that her karma is way too high for what it should be, so doesnt think it's right, and doesnt look as a result :P
* tuxmaniac wonders about bddebian 's goal of 50K!! 
* Hobbsee 's brain is dead.
<bddebian> tuxmaniac: Yeah, that's pretty much shot :-(
* tuxmaniac is worried about the treat which bddebian promised next time I come to US
<bddebian> I promised a treat? :-)
<nictuku> people should also remember that LP karma does not replace real life karma
* tuxmaniac runs straight at bddebian and gives him a punch..
<nictuku> hmm what I'm saying? I'm an atheist
<tuxmaniac> How do I become a Ubuntero? It still says Not yet.
<nictuku> tuxmaniac, sign the code of conduct (CoC)
<tuxmaniac> nictuku: Ahh.. Next problem.. I try to sig the COC and it pops up the error after I do the cut and paste saying "Public key not available"
<nictuku> tuxmaniac, is your public key on the keyserver and in your LP profile?
<tuxmaniac> nictuku: http://launchpad.net/people/aanjhan
<nictuku> tuxmaniac, also, signing the 1.1 version of the CoC is not working ATM, AFAIK
<tuxmaniac> hmmm.. I think I tried 1.0 also.. Let me give it another shot
* Hobbsee managed to sign 1.1, she thinks
* tuxmaniac has no luck yet in signing the COC
<nictuku> :-(
<tuxmaniac> nictuku: Got the problem! The key that is used to sign is different from that of the one in the keyring!! :))
<nictuku> :-) dup
<bddebian> Time for this old man to hit the hay.  Gnight folks
<Toadstool> hi everybody
<ajmitch> evening all
<tuxmaniac> ajmitch!!!
<tuxmaniac> ajmitch: Good evening
<tuxmaniac> ajmitch:
<siretart> chninkel: around?
<ajmitch> hi siretart
<siretart> huhu ajmitch
<ivoks> hi siretart ajmitch
<ajmitch> how's it going?
<ivoks> nice... translating desktopguide :)
<siretart> just woke up my first day after linuxtag :)
<ajmitch> great :)
<ajmitch> how'd linuxtag go?
<siretart> met a lot of interesting ppl, marks keynote was great!
<siretart> (about 300 ppl in the audience, biggest talk there)
<ajmitch> another one I couldn't go to :)
* ajmitch is annoyed at being busy during the paris conf
<ivoks> nice
<ivoks> paris conf?
<siretart> what wiki page is documenting the '-d' switch to update-manager?
<ajmitch> next ubuntu developer summit
<ivoks> ajmitch: is there any info about it?
<siretart> ivoks: it was annuonced on u-d-a
<ivoks> argh... :)
<ivoks> too many mailing lists :)
<robitaille> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDeveloperSummitParis
<ajmitch> ivoks: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDeveloperSummitParis
<ivoks> thanks
<ivoks> siretart: i think it's dapperbeta
<siretart> ok
<ivoks> siretart: http://www.ubuntu.com/testing/dapperbeta
<siretart> thanks
<tuxmaniac> ajmitch: My uploads to REVU are not getting reflected on the webpage
<ajmitch> siretart can probably help you more
<ajmitch> since I can see that they're getting accepted & put in the right place, but I don't know the rest of the code well
<tuxmaniac> siretart: ^^ Pls help me out
<zakame> 2hi all
<Gloubiboulga> hello zakame
<zakame> hi Gloubiboulga
<ajmitch> hi zakame, Gloubiboulga
<zakame> heya ajmitch
<Gloubiboulga> hello ajmitch
<siretart> \sh told me at linux tag that there was a amarok version around which could also listen to last.fm
<siretart> does anyone know about that?
<tuxmaniac> jpatrick: hi
<jpatrick> hi tuxmaniac
<jpatrick> made friends with REVU?
<tuxmaniac> No yaar.. Seems ajmitch does not know the details about webpage linkage
<jpatrick> tuxmaniac: should I rm your pervious uploads?
<jpatrick> start again from the beginning
<tuxmaniac> jpatrick: I dont see any feedback from the admins yet!
<tuxmaniac> may be we can do that for a last time
<tuxmaniac> jpatrick:Clear all!!
* jpatrick rm -rf xcircuit*
<jpatrick> arg
<jpatrick> Permission denied
<ajmitch> jpatrick: I really don't suggest doing that
<jpatrick> ajmitch: was going to move it to my folder
<ajmitch> jpatrick: even if you move files, the upload will be in postgresql
<jpatrick> ah, right
<tuxmaniac> jpatrick: ajmitch : You guys figured out the reason for not linking to the webpage?
<ajmitch> nope
<tuxmaniac> ajmitch: Hmmm..
<tuxmaniac> ajmitch: Is it the first time you are coming across such a problem? Can it be any config settings issues with my dput etc?
<ajmitch> yes, first time I've seen it
<ajmitch> I doubt it's a dput issue
<ajmitch> since the files appear to get uploaded & accepted
<jpatrick> yep
<tuxmaniac> hmm
<tuxmaniac> jpatrick: Should I upload once again or not? Have you cleared it or left it alone?
<jpatrick> tuxmaniac: can't
<tuxmaniac> jpatrick: guess you have also caught the *virus* :))
<jpatrick> what?
<jpatrick> I can upload fine
* tuxmaniac is angry with REVU
* ajmitch sees this discussion in -devel going absolutely nowhere
<zakame> getting logn , isn't it? :(
<ajmitch> over an hour
<zakame> interesting way to pass the time, aside from dh_iconcache
<ajmitch> I'm sure ;)
<ajmitch> I've got far more interesting things to do, to be honest
<ajmitch> obviously Mithrandir has far more patience than I do :)
<Mithrandir> heh
<zakame> hmm, I finally got around to bug 34217
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 34217 in firestarter "Initscript does not use lsb-base functions" [Normal,In progress]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/34217
* ajmitch watches the hand-waving continue
<\sh> morning
* zakame waves to \sh 
<ajmitch> hey \sh
<ajmitch> how's it going?
<\sh> morning ajmitch, totally tired from the past linuxtag :)
<ajmitch> great, how'd it go? :)
<\sh> great :) we had a good kubuntu team, international so to say,
<\sh> all 1500 kubuntu cds were "sold out" thx to the kde.org people as well :)
<ajmitch> fun
<ajmitch> going to be at the paris conf?
<zakame> w00t
<\sh> many many people were interested to see kubuntu, some of them weren't interested how they can install kde on ubuntu actually there has to be kde on ubuntu :)
<kelmo_lap> moin siretart
<zakame> hey kelmo_lap
<kelmo_lap> hi zakame
<kelmo_lap> whats doing
<siretart> hey kelmo_lap
<zakame> checking and uploading Hobbsee's work for dh_iconcache
<siretart> huhu \sh!
<\sh> hey siretart
<zakame> heya siretart
<siretart> \sh: didn't you tell me that latest amarok had a last.fm receiver?
<siretart> \sh: I cannot find any information about this on the website
<\sh> I was sure it had...but it could also be that I was in my marketing amok run ;)
<siretart> \sh: re: fai-kernels: if you are interested, I've written a status update on malone bug #36991, maybe you want to subscribe to that bug
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 36991 in fai-kernels "Sync fai-kernels from Debian" [Major,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/36991
<kelmo_lap> siretart, when or if you are interested, i have contrustce the wifi roaming daemon that you decsribed some weeks ago
<kelmo_lap> contructed*
<kelmo_lap> +s
<\sh> siretart: done :)
<kelmo_lap> siretart, in /branches/wpasupplicant-roaming
<phanatic> hi people
<siretart> kelmo_lap: cool. will have a look at this this afternoon. thank you
* siretart is currently testcompiling a fai kernel for ubuntu
<kelmo_lap> siretart, can you keep that off the lists for now? we don't need to attract the sharks at this stage
<siretart> kelmo_lap: you mean felix? ;)
<siretart> yeah, no problem
<kelmo_lap> well, its totally undocumented
<kelmo_lap> i just wrote the shell glue for it
<kelmo_lap> thanks, and looking forward to your comments ; )
<tuxmaniac> \sh: Hi
<tuxmaniac> \sh: I have a problem..Whatever I upload onto REVU is seen in /incoming but not getting reflected on the webpage!
<zakame> hmm bug 36771
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 36771 in ipmasq "UVF exception 4.0.6 -> 4.0.7" [Normal,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/36771
<tuxmaniac> Witnesses --> jpatrick Laser_away ajmitch
<\sh> tuxmaniac: you key is known to revu? you are uploading signed source packages?
<tuxmaniac> \sh: I have already uploaded the xcircuit package
<tuxmaniac> \sh: This upload is a update after review comments
<\sh> tuxmaniac: increased the version number?
<jpatrick> \sh: packs accepted, not appearing on site tho
<tuxmaniac> \sh: Did that also! No luck
<\sh> siretart: did you see anything strange with this package?
<siretart> shawarma: with what package?
<jpatrick> xcircuit
<kelmo_lap> siretart, and just one more annoyance for this evening, any objections to stripping upstream from our svn archive? (and setting mergeWithUpstream propset)
<siretart> I can't remember looking at it, sorry
<siretart> kelmo_lap: can we please keep the upstream sources? why do you want to strip them?
<siretart> kelmo_lap: wpasupplicant isn't that large to use that, and I find it very convinient to have them around
<kelmo_lap> updating them is prone to problem, we only require to work on the debian difference
<kelmo_lap> ok, i don't really care that much, we can keep upstream in trunk if you like working with it
<siretart> kelmo_lap: it is nontrivial, but I don't see much problems with that. we don't touch any files outside debian/ yet
<siretart> I also have some really big packages in mergeWithUpstream mode, but I generally find it more convinient to have the sources around in place
<tuxmaniac> \sh: Are you looking into the issue?
<\sh> tuxmaniac: to be honst, siretart or stefan are the better people to have a look into this, they are more in the source then me for revu :)
<tuxmaniac> \sh: Hmm. Thanks. I will mail up stefan Potyra
* siretart is out for lunch now. cu later
<zakame> cya siretart
* ajmitch ought to sleep now or something
* zakame goes away, really
<siretart> kelmo_lap: I'm pretty sure that the ctrl_iface_hide patch can be dropped. it was taken from upstream cvs, iirc
<kelmo_lap> siretart, i thought so too
<kelmo_lap> siretart, upstream did it a bit different
<kelmo_lap> siretart, so i thought it was best to ask first ;-)
<siretart> kelmo_lap: I don't think it was infinity himself who did the patch. at least, I'm not sure
<Hobbsee> zakame: thanks mate :)
<Hobbsee> hi room
<Gloubiboulga> hi Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> hi Gloubiboulga
<kelmo_lap> siretart, i can only say that i am pretty chuffed with the first attempt at the self-contained roaming daemon for wpa_supplicant
<siretart> kelmo_lap: :)
<siretart> close
<bddebian> Heya gang
<Hobbsee> hi bddebian :)
<bddebian> Hi Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> i saw some of my fixes in the archive today :D
<Mithrandir> hiya
<bddebian> Nice
<Hobbsee> hey Mithrandir
<bddebian> Hello Mithrandir
<Hobbsee> bddebian: very :)
* tuxmaniac bows to bddebian 
<bddebian> Bah, hi tuxmaniac
<phanatic> hey bddebian
<tuxmaniac> Hmm.. You know what.. My xcircuit package upload problem is yet to be resolved :((
<bddebian> Hi phanatic
<bddebian> tuxmaniac: :-(
<bipolar> can we get a UVF exception for the QT4 packages? Nothing depends on them, and there is a bug in the packages as well as memory leaks in the current version.
<bipolar> heres the bug that I hit: https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/qt4-x11/+bug/29954
<bipolar> version 4.1.2 is now in sid, btw
<bddebian> bipolar: I thought I had changed one of those bugs to a UVF request?
<bddebian> Hmm
<bipolar> bddebian: maybe you did and I didn't notice....
<bipolar> bddebian: I can't tell from launchpad. Maybe I just don't know how to use it well enough to see.
<bddebian> bipolar: I may not have.  I probably meant to and didn't
<bipolar> here's another bug report asking for an upgrade: https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/qt4-x11/+bug/40069
<bddebian> bipolar: Does it build successfully from Debian?
<bipolar> bddebian: I don
<bipolar> bddebian: I don't know. havn't tried it.
* bipolar is typing with a cast on...
<bddebian> Doh :-(
<bipolar> Want me to give it a shot?
<bipolar> I think I can figure it out :)
<bipolar> bddebian: you are talking about building the source package srom sid on dapper, right?
<bddebian> bipolar: Aye
<bddebian> bipolar: Go to packages.debian.org and search for source package qt4-x11
<bipolar> yep
<bddebian> Then pull the .dsc, .orig.tar.gz and .diff.tar.gz
<bipolar> ok
<bddebian> dpkg-source -x foo.dsc
<bddebian> Or just pbuilder build qt4foo.dsc if you prefer
<bipolar> ok. ty!
<bipolar> I'll do that and report back
<bddebian> Thank YOU :-)
<bipolar> no prob. i like to help whenever i can
<bipolar> Thats why I'm learning qt :)
<tseng> Hobbsee is uploading, yay
* tuxmaniac has mailed sistpoty
* Yagisan waves hello
* Hobbsee waves back to Yagisan 
* StevenK jumps on Hobbsee.
<Hobbsee> argh!
* Hobbsee is jumped on
<Yagisan> so what's up Hobbsee, StevenK ?
* Hobbsee bashes StevenK into the ground :P
<Hobbsee> Yagisan: i'm avoiding my evil maths assignment :P
<Mithrandir> you aussies always have to fight it out.
* Mithrandir joins in the fray
<Hobbsee> heh
<Hobbsee> want to come join us Mithrandir?
<Mithrandir> .au was nice when I was there for UDU
<Hobbsee> :)
<tuxmaniac> Hobbsee: I would luv to come to AU for vacation
<Hobbsee> :)
<tseng> tuxmaniac: too bad it costs 3k usd to get there
<tseng> i am broke after buying a ticket to barcelona
<Mithrandir> tseng: why not to paris?
<tuxmaniac> Ug!!!
<tseng> Mithrandir: would rather hit guadec, I think
<tuxmaniac> tseng: Thats way too high for my budget
<tseng> Mithrandir: i dont have vacation for both
<Mithrandir> tseng: shame that. :/
<tseng> sorry :(
<tseng> we will meet again
<tseng> somewhere
<jpatrick> someday
<tuxmaniac> sometime
<jpatrick> somehow
<tuxmaniac> :)
<tuxmaniac> jpatrick: I have mailed Stefan, you want a copy?
<jpatrick> Not much I can do
<Yagisan> Hobbsee: nice. I'm trying to scare^W convince more people they should be customers ;) (well as best I can with a 2 year old intent on helping dad press the keys anyway)
<Hobbsee> hehe!
<Yagisan> Hobbsee: my problem is artwork. I can't draw to save my life, so it takes a while. It's nice I have all the tools to do it in Ubuntu.
<Hobbsee> eep
<Hobbsee> true
<bipolar> bddebian: I'm trying to run debian/rules binary but it gives me an error when building. should i need to run configure first?
<bddebian> bipolar: Are you building locally or using pbuilder?
<bipolar> locally
<bddebian> What's the error?  Missing dependencies?
<bipolar> I guess I should just use pbuilder. :)
<bipolar> make[1] : *** No rule to make target `sub-src'.  Stop.
<bddebian> Hmm
<bipolar> I ran configure, then debian/rules and it now seems to be building
<bddebian> I usually do dpkg-buildpackage -us -nc or debuild
<bipolar> ok. i'll do it that way. retrying
* bipolar grabs another redbull
<bipolar> bddebian: looks like it's building now
<bddebian> Great
<MagnusR> Yagisan:I have working packages for Apparmor on Dapper as we talked about yesterday. You can find them at:http://www.linuxalert.org/ubuntu/apparmor/
<Yagisan> MagnusR: ok. Will look at as I get time.
<Yagisan> MagnusR: Apparmor only works with your kernel at the moment ?
<tuxmaniac> \sh: I have mailed sistpoty.. hope he corrects the problem
* tuxmaniac feels bad for bugging the REVU Admins so much
<tseng> apparmor, eh
<zakame> hi all
<phanatic> hey zakame
<zakame> heya phanatic
<sivang> re all
<Yagisan> tseng: no harm in trying it.
<phanatic> hi sivang
<sivang> hey phanatic , how's it going?
<zakame> yo sivang
<phanatic> sivang: well, preparing for soc :)
<sivang> phanatic: cool, what is your chosen project?
<phanatic> sivang: bzr-gui
<sivang> ah, right, that nice little thingy
<sivang> anyway, guys, is https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DhIconCacheChanges reflecting current status of work?
<zakame> coolness
<zakame> sivang: yep
<sivang> I'd like to get more MOTU work, and I try to decide which is more importan, http://tinyurl.com/nl87h , or http://wiki.ubuntu.com/DhIconCacheChanges or http://tinyurl.com/rjcqu
<zakame> you're more than welcome to get into DhIconCacheChanges :)
<sivang> zakame: it seems that no package has yet been worke don in main, right?
<sivang> (according to the table)
<zakame> that's because we're not touching it yet :/
<zakame> I suppose you could make debdiffs, then get a main uploader to put them in :)
<sivang> cool, I won't have trouble finding main uploaders to upload on my behalf :) it's just that everytime I wanted to do some MOTU work I saw it either already been done, or most of it been assigned or so.
<sivang> couldn't believe this hasn't yet started :-)
* sivang would like to try get approved for MOTU upcoming TB.
<zakame> oh it has started already, see Hobbsee's uploads :)
<zakame> coolnes! :D
<\sh> zakame: kguitar and kid3 what's the problem on amd64?
<zakame> \sh: kdelibs4-dev doesn't pull in the needed pkgs
<\sh> zakame: which packages are missing on amd64?
<zakame> I suppose its a problem with the kdelibs; kid and kguitar will then need just a rebuild
<sivang> zakame: ah right, I recall now - she told me she had done some dh_icon stuff uploads :-)
<sivang> anyway, I'll be off to tackle the main packages first.
<sivang> ohh nice! peopel already reported bugs against hubackup :)
<zakame> \sh: see http://librarian.launchpad.net/2491056/buildlog_ubuntu-dapper-amd64.kid3_0.6-2ubuntu1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<zakame> sivang: rock on :) I hope to see you and Hobbsee become MOTUs soon :D
<sivang> zakame: me too, and then move forward to main, then I could bugfix or upload the next version of hubackup myself :)
<zakame> wb \sh
<\sh> zakame: kid3 is building nicely on amd64
<zakame> ooh, it does? strange, it doesn't on the autobuilder :/
<bipolar> bddebian: all the packages built
<\sh> http://photos.shermann.blogweb.de/main.php/v/Linuxtag2006/
<sivang> \sh: nice
<zakame> ooh! =)
<\sh> oh and on www.kubuntu.de you can see a picture of me, talking to a new kubuntu user :)
* zakame should start using kubuntu too
<zakame> hi freeflying
<freeflying> zakame: hey
<webwolf_27> porting packages can be real bi*ch
<MagnusR> Yagisan: (late answer) Yes it only works with my kernel. Since Apparmor still requie a minor kernel patch that is not possible to have as a modul.
<webwolf_27> I have a problem creating a deb. the error I get is cp: cannot create regular file `debian/avidemux/usr/share/applications': No such file or directory
<Yagisan> webwolf_27: we already have avidemux
<webwolf_27> Yagisan, yes in dapper, I want it on breezy
<Yagisan> MagnusR: ok. I'm grabbing the source now
<webwolf_27> the same as I want OGRE in breezy
<Yagisan> webwolf_27: apt-get source avidemux and run it through a breezy pbuilder, or use my unoffical repo
<webwolf_27> Yagisan, url?
<webwolf_27> Yagisan, I'm getting the error from pbuilder
<Yagisan> webwolf_27: add the repo for the game here. I suggest the faster mirror. http://eyagi.bpa.nu/eyagi/community-projects/yagisan-s-doomsday-for-debian-ubuntu/
<Yagisan> webwolf_27: it is in the game repo
<webwolf_27> Yagisan, checking it now
<Yagisan> webwolf_27: that reminds me, I should make sure I sync the repos
<webwolf_27> Yagisan, I'm just waiting for it to load
<Yagisan> webwolf_27: yeah, my link is saturated.
<Yagisan> webwolf_27: I don't have ogre though
<webwolf_27> Yagisan, worst case, I'll have to build it, or upgrade my main box to dapper
<Yagisan> webwolf_27: ok. btw i386 or amd64 (if you are powerpc you'll need to build it yourself)
<webwolf_27> Yagisan, ix86, nothing big
<webwolf_27> Yagisan, and if I can get 3d accel to work on my notebook, I'd rather do the OGRE work on that
<Yagisan> webwolf_27: no worries. I triggered a sync, so depending on how quick my line clears it should appear anywhere from 15minutes to 6 hours from now.
<webwolf_27> I'm not worried, I need to get off anyway. I'll just let the packages download
<webwolf_27> thanks for the link
<webwolf_27> bye
<tuxmaniac> Guys as per stefan's reply I reuploaded the entire package!
<tuxmaniac> Still it is not reflecting on the webpage! Can someone verify whether it is there on /incoming
<siretart> tuxmaniac: what package is that? ubuntu-live support?
<tuxmaniac> Xcircuit
<siretart> there is a binary package about that lying around there
<siretart> Xcircuit is not in incoming
<tuxmaniac> xcircuit
<tuxmaniac> not there?
<tuxmaniac> I jus uploaded it and it dint even give me an error.. It said succesful upload!
<tuxmaniac> siretart: ^
<siretart> tuxmaniac: perhaps you uploaded it to the wrong host?
<tuxmaniac> I am not doing this for the first time! SO it cannot be.. Stefan just cleared all remains of xcircuit and asked me to upload
<tuxmaniac> Ok.. I will re upload !
<tuxmaniac> It says already uploaded to revu.tauware.e
<tuxmaniac> .de
<siretart> hm. strange
<tuxmaniac> siretart: Should I use -f now
<tuxmaniac> ?
<siretart> tuxmaniac: delete the .upload file
<tuxmaniac> done
<tuxmaniac> siretart: now I reupload?
<siretart> jupp
<tuxmaniac> siretart: Can you see it in /incoming?
<siretart> siretart@tiber:~ftp/incoming
<siretart> >> ls
<siretart> rejected/  xcircuit_3.4.21-0ubuntu1.dsc  xcircuit_3.4.21.orig.tar.gz
<tuxmaniac> why?
<tuxmaniac> Ok. Should I upload just the xcircuit_3.4.21 package.. I mean without changing the version number?
<siretart> err, you confuse me
<tuxmaniac> Any specific reason for it to get rejected?
<tuxmaniac> siretart: ^
<siretart> err, no, there happens to be a subdir called 'rejected'
<siretart> your package isn't (yet) :)
<tuxmaniac> hehe.. sorry! :)
<siretart> accepted, but intersting lintian errors :)
<tuxmaniac> Yeah.. I am not sure how to get rid of the autotools warning..
<tuxmaniac> siretart: How long does it take for it to be seen on the webpage?
<jpatrick> 5 mins
<siretart> tuxmaniac: it should be already there
<siretart> I hand processed it
<tuxmaniac> siretart: I dont find it yet!
<phanatic> hi people
<tuxmaniac> siretart: Stefan also said if it does not show up he asked me to manually upload the files to /incoming/tst directory.. via anonymous! But seems like there is no such directory!
<Yagisan> siretart. you can remove x264 from revu. It was already synced in.
<ajmitch> morning
<sivang> morning ajmitch
<ajmitch> how are you today?
<sivang> ajmitch: mostly fine :)
<sivang> ajmitch: working on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DhIconCacheChanges , I took amarok
<sivang> ajmitch: I should upload patches packages to REVU yes?
<sivang> and then let a main uploader upload them for me :)
* sivang starts with main section of the pakcages in that wiki page
<ajmitch> no, I wouldn't upload patches to REVU
<ajmitch> but put them on malone instead
<sivang> ajmitch: yes, doesn't make much sense with main packages, although the extra checks by REVU's build are useful.
<sivang> ajmitch: I see KDE has a cdbs class, why is it inside the package and not part of site installed CDBS?
<ajmitch> why are you asking me? :)
<ajmitch> if you want to patch cdbs, go ahead
<sivang> ajmitch: I thought you were close to KDE packagin and would know :)
<ajmitch> hah
<ajmitch> I never do kde packaging
<sivang> okay , sorry for bugging
<sivang> \sh: ping, you around?
<\sh> sivang: somehow...
<sivang> \sh: I'd like to ask something about the amarok package, I'm trying to patch it according to the instructions in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DhIconCacheChanges
<sivang> \sh: now I'm not sure where I need to put this in :) I spotted two make targets there I assume to be called for installation, but the rules files and the KDE.mk seems rather confusing :)
<\sh> sivang: I wonder if we are right here for kde apps...
<sivang> \sh: actually, yes, another questoin I had but needed a KDE dev to ask :)
<sivang> \sh: KDE probably uses other mechanisms for icon cache..
<\sh> sivang: ok...I just read the page totally wrong :)
<\sh> no
<\sh> I don't think kde has something like this..an icon which isn't there doesn't explode suddenly :)
<sivang> \sh: could you explain? I did not understand the email , and the page at all :)
<\sh> sivang: well, to be honest, I don't know what icon cache does exactly, but it looks like that gnome apps which are using icon cache and if they're missing some icons, they crash ;)
<sivang> \sh: I see. What's funny, is there are quite some KDE packages in universe that seem to have been worked out for this problem by other MOTUs.
<sivang> (on the list on that page)
<\sh> yes, but we are doing this for people who are using kde apps in gnome :)
<\sh> so gnome needs to know these kde icons as well
<\sh> well, ask seb128 about what iconcache in gnome is doing exactly...
<sivang> \sh: okay, or dholbach if he comes here some time
<Seveas> @config channel plugins.bugtracker.bugsnarfer True
<Toadstool> 'night everybody
<phanatic> what is the appropriate place to put 'dh_iconcache' inside of debian/rules?
<sivang> phanatic: from what I saw in some already fixed packages,
<sivang> phanatic: in binary-arch for arch dependent packages
<phanatic> sivang: thanks
<sivang> phanatic: I guess that measn it should go into binary-indep for arch independent packages
<sivang> phanatic: do you know why are we also patching KDE packages? I thought this was only GTK thing?
<phanatic> is there a way to get rid of /tmp/blabla stuff in the debdiffs? or is it okay to upload them in that way?
<phanatic> sivang: dunno :(
<sivang> phanatic: I'm trying amarok, it has rather, discint packaging and uses KDE.mk (cdbs lookalike) from inside the source.
#ubuntu-motu 2006-05-13
<phanatic> sivang: huh...
<phanatic> some weeks ago i was able to produce clean debdiff output (no /tmp/blabla stuff included in filenames), but now it just not works (no tm :))
<phanatic> the answer to my question is interdiff
<phanatic> sivang: shall i file a bug with my stuff? (i don't have upload rights)
<sivang> phanatic: you mean, with you debdiff ?
<phanatic> yep
<phanatic> i thought of filing a bug report and assign it to motu-reviewers
<sivang> phanatic: you can do that, and you can also upload a new package to REVU I guess
<sivang> (thats what I intend to do)
<sivang> phanatic: I happen to like the extra checkups REVU does and the convinient logs
<sivang> phanatic: did you solve the clean debdiff stuff btw? I
<phanatic> yeah, aswered for myself :)
<sivang> phanatic: ah, you had interdiff missing?
<phanatic> exactly
* Czessi is away: Away at the moment
<bddebian> Heya gang
<ajmitch> hi
<ajmitch> bye
<crimsun> hi bddebian, hi/bye ajmitch
<bddebian> Later ajmitch
<bddebian> Hi crimsun
<bddebian> What's new?
<crimsun> filing UVF exception requests, bug hunting, and the like. Yourself?
<bddebian> Just getting back on it :-)
<bddebian> Been out with the family all day
<crimsun> nice. It's dreary here (50 F, raining).
<bddebian> Bummin'
<crimsun> it's always sunny on irc ;)
<bddebian> Thus is true :)
<bddebian> Gads it's so overwhelming I never know where to start :-(
<\sh> morning bddebian
<crimsun> morning \sh
<crimsun> bddebian: I'm just combing for duplicates atm
<\sh> ok..just wrote the flight7 announcement for kubuntu.de
<crimsun> \sh: awesome.
<\sh> no it's not..now I'm trying to tidy up my asoundconf gui tool for kubuntu and release it somewhere ;)
<crimsun> \sh: are you following bug #31699?
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 31699 in alsa-utils "Can't use other than default sound card" [Major,In progress]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/31699
<crimsun> \sh: your gui tool needs to set the variables I've described in the post timestamped (2006-05-05 02:51:46 EDT).
<\sh> crimsun: it's already working :)
<crimsun> ...which reminds me I need to ping pitti so I rework asoundconf.1
<\sh> the bug report I actually can use all of my sound cards, but only one card at a time.
<\sh> it's not possible to change soundcards during a kde session, don't know how it is in gnome
<\sh> I'm talking about the default sound card
<\sh> when I'm configuring e.g. amarok xine engine to play on ICH-6 which is not the default when I'm using my headset, it plays on this card..
<\sh> but changing the default soundcard e.g. ice-6 is set to default, and it doesn't matter if you do it with asoundconf or manually, it doesn't work
<crimsun> right. To cover every possible case, though, it's not enough to just set !defaults.pcm.card and !defaults.ctl.card
<\sh> if the default goes away, the engine just goes away as well
<\sh> but what's in your eyes the best way to accomplish it...restarting a session is not a good solution, reloading the modules didn't work for me either
<crimsun> right. Dunno how to address the arts part easily. Perhaps kill and restart arts whenever the default card is changed using your tool?
<\sh> arts has nothing to do with it :)
<\sh> xine engine is doing the same
<\sh> forget about arts
<crimsun> eww, I see what you're saying now.
<crimsun> xine needs to be made to release /dev/dsp* /dev/snd/*
<\sh> quite funny...I declare one card not as default but as "foobar", now foobar is my usb headset, I configure xine to play on card foobar...works.
<\sh> I remove foobar, xine tells me, you don't have a soundcard named "foobar" and xine won't work
<\sh> now, I'm trying to set the default sound device to "barfoo", which is my second card, declared via .asoundrc, it won't works, but setting card 2 to foobar doesn't work, because xine is not rereading the global asound.conf and therefore not the local .asound.conf
<\sh> but alsa is saying: appliation X has to reread the asound.conf every time it starts
<crimsun> yeah, that's a corner-case
<\sh> and amarok is more broken with xine engine
<crimsun> gnome skirts the issue with gconfaudiosink
<\sh> crimsun: xine engine is configured via .xine/config right?
<crimsun> \sh: believe so, though I've seen some apps use ~/.[weird hierarchy] /xine-config
<\sh> ok..amarok does the same...I have to try it :)
<\sh> until now it looked to me, that even xine engine didn't read it's own config file
<\sh> .kde/share/apps/amarok/xine-config should be a symlink to .xine/config
<crimsun> yeah, I'm not sure how to workaround that without requiring a restart of amarok
<crimsun> ok, I'm heading out for some dinner, will check scrollback
<\sh> even then it's not working :)
<bddebian> Sorry \sh, crimsun, I got knocked off
<bddebian> Hi \sh :-)
<\sh> bddebian: how is life? rocking on universe lately? :)
<bddebian> NO, I seem to suck lately :-(
<\sh> ah no ways...
<bddebian> \sh: Yeah, I'm on a negative hit rate :-(
<\sh> bddebian: can't be...
<\sh> oh well...i didn't sleep again this night...and I have to get ready in 15 minutes to prepare my travel to karlsruhe ... i'm doomed
<bddebian> Ack
<zul_> bddebian: ping
<bddebian> Yo
<zul_> Why did you close #31170?
<zul_> Bug #31170?
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 31170 in linux-source-2.6.15 "To fix in Dapper: Firewire portion of ALI combo cardbus" [Normal,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/31170
<bddebian> Oh, hehe, I read the description wrong.  I backported the bug to breezy
<zul_> uh...ok
<ajmitch> afternoon all
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<ajmitch> Mithrandir: btw, I did get the SoC proposal in
<zakame> hi all
<crimsun> 'lo zak, ajmitch
<zakame> heya crimsun
<bddebian> Heya zakame
<persia> Is anyone overseeing the libopenal transition?  I was thinking of creating a wiki page listing the outstanding packages, but don't want to duplicate effort.
<ajmitch> siretart is
<persia> ajmitch: Thanks.  I won't do anything then.
* bddebian doesn't do anything either lately :'-(
<ajmitch> bddebian: only about 25x as much as I do
<bddebian> ajmitch: Nah, the last fews days I have been striking out :-(
<ajmitch> bddebian: have you seen my name on dapper-changes at all? :P
<bddebian> To be honest, I haven't subscribed to dapper-changes :-)
<crimsun> I'm not either; I refresh the Web page
<bddebian> Well I don't read that either :-)
<persia> When updating from version 1.7-4build1, does one go to 1.7-4ubuntu1?
<ajmitch> yes
<persia> ajmitch: Thanks.
<ajmitch> assuming it's a change, not a rebuild
<bddebian> Bah, ya beat me to it :-)
<persia> ajmitch: Yes, a change.  I don't do rebuilds :)
<bipolar> bddebian: I just want to make sure you know that qt 4.1.2 from sid built on dapper w/ no problems.
<bddebian> bipolar: Yeah, I saw your note but missed you.  Thx
<bipolar> np :)
<bbrazil> hi, where should I report incorrect links on the main ubuntu.com website to?
<Hobbsee> hi everyone
<bddebian> Hello Hobbsee
* Hobbsee munches on her last easter egg
<jsgotangco> hi
<bddebian> Heya jsgotangco
<Hobbsee> hi jsgotangco and bddebian
<ajmitch> hello Hobbsee, jsgotangco, bddebian
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<Hobbsee> hi ajmitch :D
<bddebian> Ack, 1am.. Gnight folks
<Hobbsee> hehe night bddebian
* Hobbsee pokes Seveas over his rogue bot
<tritium> heh
<Mithrandir> ajmitch: yay. :-)
<ajmitch> Mithrandir: up early, or up late? :)
<Mithrandir> ajmitch: half past seven in the morning, so up early.
<ajmitch> yeah, I was awake around 6 this morning, which is a bit early for me
<ajmitch> if you want any changes made to the application, just ask
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: you got it in?  yay!
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: it got written, at least
<Hobbsee> :)
<Hobbsee> that's a start...
<Mithrandir> ajmitch: I need to read my mail first, I suspect. :-)
<ajmitch> no rush, there's still about 18 hours left till the deadline :)
<Hobbsee> hehe
<crimsun> urg. these mplayer bug reports are piling. :/
<siretart> morning
<siretart> persia: if you see a package that is affected by openal, please file a bug and assign it to me
<siretart> persia: I'll handle them. or if you insist, go ahead with fixing them. but the transistion is because of me.
<persia> siretart: the only ones I really notice are vegastrike and torcs, although it looks like the complete list is "boson-base, crystalspace, pyopenal, schorched3d, torcs, trigger, vergastrike, xpilot-ng".  They're just rebuilds, so I can't fix them, but was previously thinking of creating /MOTU/Transitions/openal on the wiki (perhaps not required).
<siretart> persia: most of them are already uploaded and in dep-wait
<persia> siretart: Nevermind then, I'll just wait.  Sorry to trouble you.
<siretart> persia: no problem. It may be that I missed some. if you want to help me, file bugs with status updates
<dholbach> good morning motu world
<Mithrandir> hiya daniel, hugmaster
<dholbach> Mithrandir: how are you?
<Mithrandir> fine, woke up at a little past seven, have gotten through my mail and it's a really nice day outside.
<dholbach> same here :)
<dholbach> i just needed to rush to bring the rented car back and get the dog out
<Mithrandir> it's been shorts and t-shirt weather since Thursday, which is nice.
<persia> siretart: Before I open a bunch of bugs, I just want to verify that searching by source package on https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+builds with no success for any status is a good way to verify that the package needs a rebuild forced.
<lifeless> bug 30222
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 30222 in xclip "xclip installs binary in wrong directory /usr/X11R6/bin" [Normal,Needs info]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/30222
<lifeless> this is open with a fix ready
<Lathiat> siretart: well, sometimes they were built on the old build system/
<Lathiat> siretart: err
<Lathiat> persia: that was to you
<lifeless> it makes the package unusable :[
<Lathiat> persia: best way is to
<Lathiat> persia: compare source and binaries in the archive
<persia> Lathiat: By version number?  Would I be correct to be looking at the difference between aptitude show binpkgname and apt-cache showsrc srcpkgname?
<siretart> Lathiat: this is not an issue here, the transition started last week
<Lathiat> siretart: ah, ok
<Lathiat> persia: in that case that would work
<Lathiat> i guess
<persia> Lathiat: Thanks
<persia> siretart: Based on that, I'll open bugs.  Thanks for the suggestions.
<persia> siretart: Malone bugs 43509-43516.  That should complete the transition.
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 43509 in boson-base "Needs rebuild for openal transition." [Normal,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/43509
<siretart> persia: thanks. some of them can be fixed by syncing the latest debian version, some of them need to be merged
<sivang> morning MOTUers
<ajmitch> hello sivang
<kelmo_lap> moin
<persia> siretart: I thought that under UVF, we weren't using the new debian versions.  Would attached merge diffs be useful for these bugs?
<siretart> persia: most of them don't include new upstream versions, but only new debian revisions
<siretart> thats okay
<siretart> persia: are you familiar with crystalspace?
<sivang> hey ajmitch , siretart others :)
<persia> siretart: I understand.  I'll check if merges are required, and upload diffs if they are.
<siretart> hi sivang
<persia> siretart: I'm not familiar with crystalspace.
* sivang goes on to continue with DhIconCache
<siretart> persia: I know that crystalspace is kind of a pita.
<siretart> will need more time for that. if you want to take over, no problem
<persia> siretart: I'll start with the other ones then - looking at packages.debian.org, the status of crystalspace frightens me :)
<siretart> persia: as said, crystalspace is a pita
<Lathiat> network-manager broken for anyone else?
<Lathiat> gnome variaety
<Mithrandir> works for me
<Lathiat> hrm
<Lathiat> just installed it on dapper here on a mates notebook and the applet doesnt start
<siretart> Lathiat: try restarting it along with the dispatcher, and check that the interfaces are commented out in /etc/n/i
<Lathiat> yep
<siretart> Lathiat: /etc/dbus-1/event.d/*networkmanager restart
<Lathiat> rebooted too
<Lathiat> "The network manager applet could not find some required resources, it cannot continue"
<Lathiat> might source it and see what triggers that
<Lathiat> dispatcher/n-ma re running
<Lathiat> just the paplet that fails
<ajmitch> afternoon Lathiat
<Lathiat> howdy ajmitch
<Lathiat> hrm every thign i see that says that.. says "the glade file was not found" on the end
<Lathiat> odd
<Lathiat> ah, somethign about not being able to load icons
<Lathiat> i saw something about dh_iconcache recently?
<Lathiat> icon nm-npn-lock is missing
<Lathiat> *vpn
<siretart> where has persia gone now?
<siretart> hrmpf
<Lathiat> ok
<Lathiat> had to run
<Lathiat> gtk-update-icon-cache -f .
<Lathiat> in the hicolor directory
<siretart> ok. I think I should have uploaded now almost everything for openal transition. 2 packages are waiting for sync from debian, one more is to be merged but requires the sync
<siretart> and crystalspace is still a pita. if someone wants to fix it, go on! make sure you fix sear along with it ;)
<siretart> need to run now, cu
<dholbach> Lathiat: we're moving all the packages that install to hicolor and gnome to use dh_iconcache atm
<dholbach> Lathiat: http://wiki.ubuntu.com/DhIconCacheChanges has the remaining list
<dholbach> Lathiat: after that we should be fine
<Lathiat> ah cool
<sivang> dholbach: I already did amarok :)
<sivang> dholbach: working on the main pkgs on that page
<sivang> dholbach: but I wanted to ask, does it make any sense to patch KDE packages? I've seen work done at them already
<dholbach> sivang: Riddell should be informed about that kind of stuff (main)
<sivang> dholbach: already CC'd him on the bug report
<sivang> dholbach: should I ping him on IRC?
<dholbach> sivang: yeah just ask him as soon as he's around
<sivang> dholbach: cool, thanks, trying to get some work done for tomorrow's universe approvals by TB
<ajmitch> sivang: nice, apart from upbackup & dh_iconcache stuff, what do you have?
<sivang> ajmitch: also got sponsered for the following https://launchpad.net/people/sivan/+packages , see the 'uploaded packages'
<sivang> ajmitch: I plan to get more work done on DhIcon today
<sivang> ajmitch: or should I work in unmetdeps instead?
<sivang> (which is more importat...)
<ajmitch> dh_iconcache changes are fairly simple
<ajmitch> not really a good display of packaging skill :)
<ajmitch> since TB approval means you'd have free reign on universe
<sivang> ajmitch: thanks for noting, so I will switch to unmetdeps then? or universe bugs?
<ajmitch> both
<ajmitch> a few unmet deps are rebuilds
<ajmitch> a few others are quite a lot more involved
<sivang> ajmitch: could you suggest the ones which are more involved?
* sivang wants to try the hard part of stuff
<ajmitch> no, since to do that I'd end up doing the work :)
<sivang> haha
<sivang> right
<sivang> ajmitch: anyway, thank you for the guidance. I'll go now check out the unmetdeps page
<sivang> ajmitch: hmm, what about fixing bugs all over the place? (main as well)
<ajmitch> do what you wish
<sivang> k, will do
<ajmitch> just don't break stuff
<sivang> ajmitch: even if I do, i quickly fix it :)
<sivang> ajmitch: one more question, why on most of the unmetdeps bugs there's "xsim has ..." ?
<ajmitch> bug in script used to create bugs
<sivang> okay, that makes alot more sense now
<sivang> hmm, Barry already went on almost all of them ....;-)
<phanatic> hi people
<phanatic> Gloubiboulga: fixed some more dh_iconcache packages ;)
<Gloubiboulga> hey phanatic
<Gloubiboulga> I've seen your patches and uploaded 2 :)
<phanatic> yeah, thanks a lot :)
<Gloubiboulga> but maybe avoid making too many changes
<Gloubiboulga> for bug 43524 for example
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 43524 in potracegui "dh_iconcache added and some minor fixes" [Normal,In progress]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/43524
<phanatic> ok, i just wanted to have clean diffs
<phanatic> if you don't like it, feel free to exclude the appropriate lines :)
<\sh> moins
<phanatic> hi \sh
<phanatic> hello Toadstool
<Gloubiboulga> phanatic, yep, I understand ans agree with that, but we try to keep the diff with debian as small as possible
<Gloubiboulga> hey \sh
<Gloubiboulga> s/ans/and
<Toadstool> hi \sh
<phanatic> Gloubiboulga: thanks for the note, i'll concentrate just on dh_iconcache then...
<Gloubiboulga> phanatic, thanks for your work :)
<phanatic> my pleasure to be able to help :)
<phanatic> Gloubiboulga: what to do if a package has -1build1 version? shall i bump it to build2?
<persia> phanatic: Earlier I was told to use ubuntu1 after build1
<Gloubiboulga> yep
<phanatic> persia: thanks, i was just wondering if it's okay
<phanatic> thanks :)
<Mithrandir> if you make source changes, change it to ubuntu1, if you just rebuild, change it to build2.
<Gloubiboulga> 'build' is used if you don't change a thing in the package (except the changelog)
<phanatic> Mithrandir: since it's a dh_iconcache issue, i suppose to change it to ubuntu1
<Mithrandir> phanatic: isn't it just a rebuild, then?
<phanatic> yeah
<phanatic> i men
<phanatic> mean
<phanatic> no :)
<phanatic> i change the debian/rules
<persia> phanatic: Doesn't it involve changes to debian/rules?  If so, ...ubuntu1
<phanatic> it's not a simple rebuild then i think
<ajmitch> only a rebuild for those cdbs-using packages with gnome.mk
<phanatic> ajmitch: this package uses debhelper
<zakame> hi al
<phanatic> hey zakame
<zakame> hey phanatic
<persia> siretart: Sorry for stomping you.  I think I have a solution also for crystalspace - did you already do this as well?
<Tonio_> heya people
<Gloubiboulga> hello Tonio_
<persia> Is the python transition complete?  Is it now safe to leave python2.3-dev | python2.2-dev | python-dev in Build-Depends?
<Gloubiboulga> sivang, don't fight with the xfce4 unmet deps ;), porting the plugins to the new panel is a huge work
<Gloubiboulga> sivang, if upstream doesn't do it, the plugins will be dropped from the archive I think
<sivang> Gloubiboulga: thank you for the note :)
<Gloubiboulga> sivang, np :)
<Riddell> sivang: patch them if you want yes
<Riddell> but I'll not spend time on it, it's a gnome issue only so far
<sivang> Riddell: I see, so what's the rationale in patching KDE apps as well? (quite some have done so)
<Riddell> sivang: so that when KDE apps are installed their icons are added to the cache and gnome can find the icons quicker, I expect it will only make a difference for the app icon in the application menu
<sivang> Riddell: I see, thanks again.
<sivang> anybody knows what we should do with https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/xfce4-goodies/+bug/41545 ?
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 41545 in xfce4-goodies "[UNMETDEPS]  xsim has unmet dependencies" [Normal,Needs info] 
<Gloubiboulga> sivang, the package will be updated as soon as the other Xfce unmet deps will be fixed
<sivang> Gloubiboulga: okay, thanks
<sivang> siretart: any idea where to go next with https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/manderlbot/+bug/41551 ? there is not note about where this is standing.
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 41551 in manderlbot "[UNMETDEPS]  manderlbot has unmet dependencies" [Unknown,Unconfirmed] 
* sivang aplogizes for the massive bugging. trying to find where to be helpful on unmetdeps.
<siretart> sivang: well, I noticed that this bug is also in debian/unstable. and the problem was explained in the referenced debian bu
<siretart> g
<siretart> sivang: I don't think we can fix this bug in time for dapper, unless you find someone familiar with erlang
<siretart> it would be best if it could be fixed on the debian side and we merge it. but well..
<sivang> siretart: okay, thanks. then I'd better stay off of this.
<sivang> hmm, zope is not installable in dapper?
<sivang> this seems to be the cause for zope-zshell missing depends
<siretart> sivang: ask ajmitch, he has been working a lot on zope and related packages
<siretart> sivang: and check malone there may be some syncs pending
<sivang> ajmitch: ping, is there a problem with zope installation in dapper currently? zope-zshell is unmetdeps , drilling down I see 'zope' matches zope2.8, which is uninstallable.
* siretart points to https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-motu/2006-May/000654.html
<siretart> persia: --^
<persia> siretart: I'll take a look at worldforge.  Thanks.
<zul> heylo
<Yagisan> G'day all
<Mithrandir> hello
<Hobbsee> hi Yagisan and Mithrandir
<Yagisan> Do we have any tutorials on packaging python applications. I might be misunderstanding it, but the debian reference looks more like it is for python modules.
<Yagisan> hey Hobbsee.
<Yagisan> finish your assignment ?
<Hobbsee> nope
<siretart> Yagisan: have a look at the londonlaw packaging.
<sivang> Yagisan: what are you trying to package?
<Yagisan> siretart: thanks
<Yagisan> sivang: a gui lancher for a game
<sivang> Yagisan: is it complex?
<persia> siretart: sear needs some work (in progress), but I don't see a relationship to crystalspace (aside from lack of attention).  Am I missing something?
<Yagisan> sivang: not really as far as I can tell, but I'm sort of the linux guinea pig. I need to package it, and hunt down windows and mac assumptions
<sivang> Yagisan: well, if it's not that complicated, you can check out hubackup
<siretart> persia: IIRC, sear, the worldforge client was developed on top of crystalspace?
<sivang> Yagisan: I based the packaging of it on gdebi's , and it turned out to be quite okay.
<siretart> persia: maybe I'm not uptodate anymore. would be good if you could enlighten me (best would be in the bugreport or as follow up to the email)
<Yagisan> sivang: we have a book on python don't we. I should install and read it.
<persia> siretart: Looking at recent materials, I'm not sure, but any connection is at several removes.  I'll try to get a working compile and demonstrate a connection between sear and cyphesis-cpp locally, and update 6527, which is more likely to be the preferred solution.
<sivang> Yagisan: well, I started by reading all I can about distutils,
<phanatic> hi people
<sivang> Yagisan: then watchign how its stuff gets called from debian/ruels
<sivang> hey ph	
<sivang> hey phanatic
<sivang> :)
<sivang> phanatic: how's it going?
<Yagisan> siretart: a simple rebuild is enough for the openal transition ?
<sivang> siretart: who do I ask fro sync request from debian sid?
<sivang> (elmo?)
<phanatic> hey sivang, a storm is comin :)
<Yagisan> sivang: ok. I know absolutely 0 python.
<sivang> phanatic: storm?? where are you in?
* sivang notes is bloody hot in here
<phanatic> salut Gloubiboulga, i'll create less agressive debdiffs for the packages ;)
<phanatic> sivang: budapest, hungary
<Gloubiboulga> phanatic, ok, thanks :)
<siretart> Yagisan: often, but not always. you need to identify if the package is not actually using alut, which was split into its own package
<siretart> Yagisan: if the package is really using openal only, yes, it should be done with a simple rebuild
<siretart> sivang: read the updated DeveloperRessources wiki page, and note the updated part about 'syncs'
<phanatic> Gloubiboulga: i have a problem tho... pureadmin depends on libfam-dev. when i want to install that package, it wants to remove a lot of others (part of the desktop), so i cannot build a package which i could try in a pbuilder environment (.dsc). what to do? when i remove that dep, the pkg builds well
<phanatic> hey, it's like a monsoon here :\
<persia> phanatic: Does it work with gamin?
<phanatic> persia: what do you mean?
<persia> phanatic: The replacement for libfam.
<phanatic> i didn't know that :) how to change the deps? and may i change if i only want to do the dh_iconcache stuff? (Gloubiboulga suggested me not to touch other parts of the source)
<Gloubiboulga> phanatic, you can change anything needed to fix a bug :)
<Yagisan> siretart: ok. if it FTBFS I needed alut ;)
<Gloubiboulga> phanatic, but I've successfully built pureadmin on my system and in pbuilder without changing the dependency
<phanatic> Gloubiboulga: thanks :) shall i file a separate bug, or is it enough to mention it on the dh_iconcache bugreport?
<Gloubiboulga> phanatic, don't open a new bug, just mention it :)
<persia> phanatic: The dependencies are adjusted in debian/control.  You'll first want to read the docs for libfam and gamin, and make sure they are source compatible.  If not, you'll want to patch the source to work.  There's no patch system for pureadmin, so it would be rather invasive, merge-wise (although it may still be worthwhile).
<phanatic> but i need that dsc file for debdiff + pbuilder
<phanatic> please correct me if i'm wrong, or could do somehow without installing libfam-dev to my system :)
<Gloubiboulga> phanatic, libgamin-dev provides libfam-dev now
<Gloubiboulga> so with libgamin-dev installed, it should build
<phanatic> thanks
<phanatic> then i'll change the dep
<Gloubiboulga> ok
<sivang> can someone please upload a fixed package with the debdiff I provided in https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/bzrk/+bug/37162 ?
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 37162 in bzrk "bzrk is broken with current version of bzr in dapper" [Major,Confirmed] 
<persia> Glah!  ftp.debian.org is down (at least for me) :(
<phanatic> sivang: thanks for fixing that one ;)
<sivang> phanatic: no problem, should I upload a fixed package to REVU ?
<sivang> phanatic: (this is a very small debdiff, so I figured is useless to do so)
<phanatic> i think i can wait till it hits the archive :) (have other things to do)
<sivang> phanatic: so no need to ? is someone else going to upload that for me?
<phanatic> i don't have access for upload, sorry :(
<phanatic> Gloubiboulga: another issue with pureadmin. it generates a file in autpackage/ during the build, but make distclean doesn't remove it. is it okay to rm it from debian/rules, or shall i leave it unchanged?
<persia> sivang: Assign the bug to motu-reviewers, and someone will upload the patch when they have a chance.
<tuxmaniac> seems like my libgnome*-dev are all broken.. And it is so on Breezy :O
<siretart> phanatic: yes, remove it from debian/rules. you need to clean up after upstream scripts
<tuxmaniac> Guys any body tell why the follwoing Broken Package error is due to On breezy http://pastebin.com/705252
<phanatic> siretart: thanks
<sivang> persia: done
<tuxmaniac> I have run apt-get update!
<tuxmaniac> still no luck
<zakame> hi all
* tuxmaniac welcomes zakame 
<sivang> hey zakame
<sabdfl> hi guys
<sabdfl> who are the best folks to speak with about REVU?
* tuxmaniac welcomes sabdfl 
<sabdfl> hey tuxmaniac
<tuxmaniac> ajmitch \sh
<sabdfl> i'm keen to get going on building similar functionality right into LP
<sivang> woo, that sounds cool :)
<sabdfl> ajmitch_ \sh: around?
<Hobbsee> sabdfl: afaik, ajmitch was doing an assignment
<tuxmaniac> sabdfl: You better build it.. I have been facing problems with REVU for the past 2 weeks.. Even the REVU admins are unable to solve it
<sabdfl> sivang: should be, if we do a classy job of it
<Gloubiboulga> siretart is a REVU admin iirc
<sabdfl> ok, i will ping them by mail
<sabdfl> thanks guys
<sivang> sabdfl: indeed. could go along well with DistroPolicyTracker verifications
<zakame> hi all
<phanatic> hi zakame
<zakame> hey sab
<phanatic> hey bddebian
<zakame> hey phanatic bddebian
<phanatic> Gloubiboulga: https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/pureadmin/+bug/43451 hope it's ok now :)
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 43451 in pureadmin "dh_iconcache added and some minor fixes" [Normal,In progress] 
<bddebian> Heya gang
<bddebian> Hi phanatic, zakame
<Hobbsee> hey bddebian
<bddebian> Hi Hobbsee
<Gloubiboulga> hey bddebian :)
<zakame> Hobbsee!!
<bddebian> Howdy Gloubiboulga
<Gloubiboulga> phanatic, looking :)
<Toadstool> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Heya Toadstool
<bddebian> Wow, the gangs all here this morning :-)
<freeflying> bddebian: hi
* Hobbsee is procrastinating.  again.
<bddebian> Hello freeflying
<phanatic> bddebian: no wonder, it's already afternoon here ;)
<bddebian> Ahh :-)
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: no idea why you get problems with revu. I think you are the unlucky one that gets all the problems.
<sivang> hey there Hobbsee !
<zakame> heya Toa	
<Hobbsee> hi sivang :)
<Yagisan> Hobbsee: need help procrastinating ? I've been told I'm good at it
<tuxmaniac> Yagisan: And at a time when I plan to get some UVF's running :((
<Hobbsee> Yagisan: hehe...i need someone to do this paper for me...
<Hobbsee> that's what would *really* help
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: you only do source only uploads ?
<tuxmaniac> I tried uploading the binaries also!! No luck!
<Yagisan> Hobbsee: no worries. just do what people at CSU do, ask someone on the internet to do it
<Hobbsee> heh
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: nah, revu doesn't take binaries. you use dput ?
<tuxmaniac> Yagisan: And for the past two days one more has propped up.. http://pastebin.com/705252
<tuxmaniac> Yagisan: Duh! Yeah.. dput -f revu <packagename>_source.changes !!!
<phanatic> Gloubiboulga: https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/potracegui/+bug/43524 this is another v2 patch fixing iconcache only
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 43524 in potracegui "dh_iconcache added and some minor fixes" [Normal,In progress] 
<tuxmaniac> Yagisan: And guess what.. It says succesful upload!
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: and it's a signed changes file ?
<tuxmaniac> Yes!
<tuxmaniac> Yagisan: ^
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: odd. I'll upload something, see if it still works for me.
<tuxmaniac> Yagisan: The thing is everybody is able to see it on /incoming and also see it getting accepted but not getting reflected on the webpage :((
<sivang> any anyone tell me what I am doing wrong?
<sivang> pooh@tigershark ~/src/zope-zshell $ dpkg -x zope-zshell_1.60-2.2.dsc .
<sivang> dpkg-deb: `zope-zshell_1.60-2.2.dsc' is not a debian format archive
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: fantastic. whats' one of your packages there ?
<tuxmaniac> xcircuit
<persia> sivang: You probably want dpkg-source -x foo.dsc
<zakame> hmm bug 28810 has the sync been done?
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 28810 in kdrill "undeclared dependency on libXp6" [Major,In progress]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/28810
<sivang> persia: oh crap, right! :)
* sivang got confused
<persia> zakame: Not yet.
<zakame> wb \sh
<sivang> hmm, and another quesionts. still about zope-zshell
<\sh> re
<zakame> persia: should I re-request then? =)
<sivang> After realizing that the zope depdendency will be fixed with zope2.8 will get out of NEW,
<persia> zakame: I'd like that.  I haven't used kdrill in a while, and need to practice more :)
<sivang> I now see that it also depdens on python2.2
<sivang> so this is more then just a sync as it seems..
<sivang> as this will rquire patching
<sivang> anybody an idea?
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: hmm. odd. anyone else try to upload it ?
<tuxmaniac> nope!
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: I'll try. where is it ?
<tuxmaniac> I have it on my comp :)
<bddebian> Heya persia.  Anyone touched your list yet?
<tuxmaniac> I will upload the files to my server and get back?
<zakame> persia: thanks :D
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: that works. I think dcc also works (at least if I set my firewall up right this time)
<tuxmaniac> Yagisan: So what do I do? Try uploading again?
<tuxmaniac> I have done that 10 times or more :))
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: send me a copy. I'd like to see if it hates me too
<tuxmaniac> hehe :)) Sure Yagisan
<sivang> hmm, actually, python2.2 installs nicely from unvierse
<sivang> no issue :)
* sivang request a sync from ubuntu-archive
<bddebian> sivang: python2.2 2.2-dev should be fine but no other modules I think
<persia> Is the MOTU Merge Team still the correct assignee for merge bugs, or should they currently be assigned to MOTU-UVF?
<sivang> bddebian: it also depdens on jaxml (3.01-1ubuntu1)
<sivang> I assume this is okay as well
<bddebian> persia: If it requires a UVF exception, yes
<zakame> hmm seems kdrill would need more than just a sync, as the current Debian pkg fails to build in dapper :/
<persia> zakame: Does the new debian version assume the changes to imake?  That's what caught me before when I was looking at that bug.  It was suggested that significant effort would be required, and it would be a post-dapper fix.
<siretart> dholbach: bddebian: regarding sear: from the past I remember it is a quite fragile package, which is currently uninstallable. since we updated varconf and eris, I think we should update sear. I don't know how much time michael (the maintainer) has had in the past, but I remeber it being a pita in breezy and hoary :/
<bddebian> siretart, dholbach, persia: Please see Bug #41504
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 41504 in sear "UVF Exception: sear" [Normal,Needs info]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/41504
<persia> siretart: BTW, there is no relation between sear and crystalspace.
<ryu> hi, will vim 7 be in dapper?
<persia> ryu: No.
<siretart> persia: ok, then I got something terribly wrong.
<siretart> persia: I'm currently testbuilding the latest crystalspace from debian on dapper/amd64. the changelog promises alut transition and amd64 compile fixes
<ryu> ok, then i have to pack in on my own
<zakame> persia: lemme check again
<siretart> bddebian: uuh, great duplicate uvf requests :/
<siretart> thanks for heads up
<persia> siretart:  Take a look at #43510.  It has some of my notes from when I was playing with it.  Let me know if I can generate any more useful files.
<siretart> bug 43510
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 43510 in crystalspace "Needs rebuild for openal transition." [Normal,Unconfirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/43510
<bddebian> siretart: Well I was working on the Unmet Deps list so that's how I caught it :-)
<siretart> persia: ah, thnx
<siretart> persia: diffstat doesn't work with debdiffs. please diffstat the upstream tarballs
<siretart> and this is really ridiculous:  1521 files changed, 1650310 insertions(+), 1033018 deletions(-)
<bddebian> I ALREADY HAVE!!!
<siretart> bddebian: for crystalspace?! i thought you are talking about sear?
<bddebian> Ohh, I thought we were talking about sear too, sorry
<persia> bddebian: For crystalspace?
* bddebian bows his head in shame
<siretart> bddebian: hehe, no problem. I think we are all a bit confused today ;)
<bddebian> Heya ivoks
<zakame> persia: yes, seems that this is an imake bug
<siretart> persia: thanks for your merge on crystalspace, the patch is looking good
<zakame> hmm bug 29802, would probably require an UVF except/sync right?
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 29802 in mysql-admin "MySQL Administrator Locks when trying to do User Administration" [Major,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/29802
<zakame> just checked the new debian -kg of mysql-admin, seems to fhix that
<persia> zakame, it will be fixed by bug #28707 later, once dapper is released.
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 28707 in imake "ProjectRoot set incorrectly" [Minor,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/28707
<persia> siretart: better diffstat uploaded.
<Yagisan> siretart: ok. I'm relatively sure tuxmanic's trouble with revu is a configuration or user issue
<Yagisan> siretart: I had no trouble uploading his package
<siretart> Yagisan: I think so as well
<Yagisan> siretart: his key on the keyring ?
<siretart> Yagisan: if you uploaded xcircuit, then yes
<Yagisan> siretart: yeah, but I signed the changes with my key, so I thought I'd check
<siretart> oh.
<siretart> whats his keyid?
<Yagisan> siretart: brb- need to attent to kids. I'll look it up on google when I get back
<siretart> ok
<tuxmaniac> Yagisan: Sorry
<tuxmaniac> Yagisan: Murphy at his best ! Nework was down suddenly
<phanatic> tuxmaniac: he's away now
<persia> tuxmaniac: Yagisan is away, but before he left he promised to look up your keyid.  Perhaps you can shortcut the process?
<tuxmaniac> hmmm.. The package got uploaded for him on REVU! :)
<tuxmaniac> persia: WHat shortcut?
* tuxmaniac is off for dinner.. will be back by half hour max
<Yagisan> siretart: can't find his key
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac_dinner: speaking of which
<tuxmaniac> Yagisan: Am back
<tuxmaniac> yeah Yagisan My key is not htere?
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: just found it. had to try a few keyservers
<tuxmaniac> hmmm..
<tuxmaniac> Yagisan: you figured out the problem?
<Yagisan> siretart: keyid is 23088C1E
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: I suspect either key or configuration
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: use your uid Aanjhan Ranganathan <aanjhan@tuxmaniac.com> for the changelog
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: hopefully it will sign ok then
<tuxmaniac> hmm.. I am doing it
<siretart> gpg: key 23088C1E: "Aanjhan Ranganathan <aanjhan@tuxmaniac.com>" not changed
<siretart> he was already in the keyring
<Riddell> what's the current practice for syncing from debian?
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: nope, your changelog is Aanjhan <aanjhan@tuxmaniac.com>
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: it may make a difference
<Yagisan> siretart: thanks for checking
<tuxmaniac> yes.. I am changing and resiging!
<bddebian> Riddell: File a sync request or UVF exception on LP
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: don't forget to retarget to dapper instead of hoary
<Riddell> bddebian: and what happens if it's approved?
<bddebian> Riddell: It gets synced :-)
<Riddell> clever, thanks
<bddebian> Riddell: It is a new upstream version?
<tuxmaniac> sure
<tuxmaniac> Yagisan: Sure
<bddebian> Riddell: If so:  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/UVFStatus
<tuxmaniac> Yagisan: I will try uploading again or how is it gonna work?
<siretart> lucas: do you have time to handle the ruby1.9 upgrade the next days?
<lucas> hi siretart
<siretart> huhu lucas
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: can you pm me your dput config for revu ?
<lucas> mmh
<lucas> I'll try to
<lucas> I can't promise anything
<zakame> gn8 all
<bddebian> Later zakame
<Kyral> hmm
<Kyral> what do with an 8 year old P1
<bddebian> hmmm
<bddebian> Install Debian GNU/Hurd ;-P
<Kyral> I was about to ask how HURD was with legacy lol
<bddebian> That's about all it runs on ;-P
<Kyral> Can it run BIND9 yet?
<bddebian> Hmm, we had it at one point, but I think there might be some PATH_MAX or MAXPATHLEN regressions?
* Kyral looks blankly at bddebian
<azeem> > net.c:271: error: 'IPV6_PKTINFO' undeclared (first use in this function)
<bddebian> Ahh, IPV6
<bddebian> Kyral: azeem knows all :-)
<Yagisan> Kyral: works well with ubuntu as a firewall
<bddebian> Kyral: You could take on one of the Hurd SoC projects!! :-)
<Kyral> bddebian: I have a job lol
<Kyral> Web Bitch :P
<bddebian> heh
<Kyral> Yagisan: Ubuntu|HURD?
<bddebian> heh
<Kyral> I'd rather pull Infinity/HURD
<Yagisan> Kyral: why not ? and while you are at it how about Ubuntu|ReactOS
<Kyral> Yagisan: ReactOS is a full OS
<Kyral> not a kernel
<Yagisan> Kyral: well. It is wine with a kernel
<Kyral> oy...
<Kyral> I still need to put a NIC into the old machine
<bddebian> kernel+wine.. Ugh
<Yagisan> Kyral: sure its what $2 for a realtek now isn't it ?
<Yagisan> bddebian: sounds like fun. would not boot on my amd64 though
<Kyral> Yagisan: I was just thinking of pulling out the NIC from my 8 year old eMachines
<Kyral> seeing as I have scavanged most of the other hardware from it lol
<Yagisan> bddebian: it's a toy like HURD isn't it ?
<Kyral> Yah, a Secondary DNS server running HURD
<Kyral> owned :P
<bddebian> Yagisan: Yes, but why re-invent Windows?? :-)
<Yagisan> bddebian: to prove it can be done right
<Yagisan> bddebian: maybe they really like virualdub ?
<bddebian> :-)
<Kyral> Its interesting
<Kyral> Quicker too
<Yagisan> I'd like it to work, most of my customers use windows, and I'd rather not need to buy a copy just to test something for them
<Kyral> my friend had it running in an unaccelerated Qemu
<Kyral> and thing booted fully in like 10 secs
<Yagisan> I think in future, with more bios updates coming as windows installers, it will become more important, like freedos used to be
<bddebian> Is it a no-no to mix gcc-4.0 and gcj-4.1?
<Yagisan> bddebian: I don't think it breaks anything. it's a bit late to get gcc-4.1 synced from debian, but I have it in a private repo if you want it
<Yagisan> bddebian: that reminds me, I should see if I need to update that too.
<bddebian> Yagisan: No, I added it to meta-ul without thinking
<tuxmaniac> Yagisan: Ugh!!! Murphy is playing havoc in my life today :(
<sivang> tuxmaniac: but Murphy is dholbach's dog, not yours?
<tuxmaniac> sivang: heh
<tuxmaniac> sivang: But seriously I am in no mood to laugh! :(
* Yagisan notes that one day, he may get to bed at a reasonable hour
<tuxmaniac> Yagisan: never till I am around :)
<tuxmaniac> Yagisan: did you check my config http://pastebin.com/705547
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: you don't have "allow_unsigned_uploads = 0" in your revu section
<tuxmaniac> hmm
<tuxmaniac> Added!
<tuxmaniac> Yagisan: ^
* Yagisan debates if he should scare windows users with how bad their systems are.
* tuxmaniac feels Yagisan need not scare them.. They are already scared!
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: upload working yet ?
<tuxmaniac> Yagisan: are you clearing the previous upload you did?
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: not here. they are ignorant little sheep. baa baa.
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: just upload over it
<tuxmaniac> Yagisan: ok
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: besides, I never receive support calls from people that I've converted to ubuntu :)
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: just takes 1~2 hours to teach them the differences
<tuxmaniac> Yagisan: Heh.. Wana do some support for me? I have some serious broken dependency problem! Resolving it?
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: dapper, breezy or hoary ?
<tuxmaniac> breezy!
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: production system ?
<tuxmaniac> Yes!
<tuxmaniac> Yagisan: And it is like this
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: universe & multiverse enabled ?
<tuxmaniac> Yagisan: I do a apt-get install libgnome*-dev It shows Broken packages unable to install
<tuxmaniac> Yagisan: heh.. Thats basic.. I have done that!
<tuxmaniac> i mean any libgnome dev files
<tuxmaniac> Yagisan: Uploaded!
<tuxmaniac> Yagisan: My pastebins --> http://pastebin.com/705252
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: I tempted to be cheeky and say upgrade to dapper
<bddebian> hehe
<tuxmaniac> Yagisan: That is easy to say for everyone!! Try resolving it and I promise you a treat!
<tuxmaniac> :D
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: ok. you did an apt-get update right ?
<tuxmaniac> Yagisan: Yes.. I did it
<tuxmaniac> I tried to manually install whatever package it said.. And at last It gave me a different error message
<tuxmaniac> Yagisan: ^
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: humour me. use aptitude instead of apt-get
* Yagisan off to get a coffee
<tuxmaniac> Yagisan: http://pastebin.com/705301 <--- This is what I got finally after a lot of traversals down the dependency chain!! :D
* tuxmaniac says HIP HIP Hurray!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
<bddebian> :-)
* tuxmaniac hugs REVU, Yagisan bddebian siretart ajmitch and who ever helped him out in this time!!
<Yagisan> your welcome tuxmaniac
<tuxmaniac> Yagisan: you still have one more to go ^^^^
<tuxmaniac> :D
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: add breezy-updates and breezy-security (+ universe & multiverse)
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: run aptitude update
<siretart> tuxmaniac: good to have you in our team! :)
<jpatrick> tuxmaniac: hi
* tuxmaniac apologises for missing out jpatrick 's name 
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: then using eg synaptic or aptitude search for that package
* tuxmaniac thanks jpatrick for reminding :D
<jpatrick> ;
<jpatrick> ;) *
<tuxmaniac> Yagisan: I did that!!
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: as my breezy box as all of those packages avaiable
<tuxmaniac> Yagisan: Still no luck! Wanna take a look at my sources.list?
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: you have dapper in your sources list don't you
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: yes. you have stuff in it from another repo, that's why you have dependency issues
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: libglib2.0-dev: Depends: libglib2.0-0 (= 2.8.3-0ubuntu1) but 2.10.2-1ubuntu1 is to be installed
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: that isn'y pure breezy
<Yagisan> s/isn'y/is not
<tuxmaniac> Yagisan: hmm.. How do I resolve?
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: pastebin sources.list
<tuxmaniac> Yagisan: http://pastebin.com/705625
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: that is odd.
<tuxmaniac> Yagisan: I told you. I get bugs that are odd!! :D You need to be really at it to solve my problems!!
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: where did you install those .debs from ? dpkg -i my_cool.deb ?
<tuxmaniac> Yagisan: Which .debs?
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: ever use "backports" ?
<tuxmaniac> Yagisan: Never used it till date!
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: try apt-cache clean then apt-get update then try to install again
* tuxmaniac welcomes LaserJock with a wide grin!! :D
<tuxmaniac> Yagisan: Ok
<tuxmaniac> Yagisan: says E: Invalid operation clean
<Mithrandir> apt-get clean
<tuxmaniac> Mithrandir: Yeah just figured out! :) Thanks
<Yagisan> sorry, typo :-[
<tuxmaniac> Yagisan: Still no luck!! Same Broken Package problem :(
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: use this sources.list http://pastebin.com/705654
<trappist> the way I understand it, kuickshow was dropped because imlib (a dependency) was dropped from main - is there any reason not to maintain kuickshow in universe now?
<tuxmaniac> Yagisan: No change! Same broken package error!
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: got a backup ?
<tuxmaniac> of sources.list or the data itself?
<tuxmaniac> Yagisan:  Entire hard disk?
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: make a nice good backup of your important data. test it. then s/breezy/dapper in your sources.list && apt-get dist-upgrade to happiness
<Yagisan> :)
<tuxmaniac> Hmm.. I have all data backed up.. I guess thats the only happy day solution!!
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: I have no idea why you get that error
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: by all rights, it should only be pointing to breezy, unless the us mirror is stuffed, in which case others would be here complaining
<tuxmaniac> Yagisan: No its a problem with my system only.. I am sure abt it
* Yagisan wishes he could see the system
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: you have a breezy pbuilder ?
<tuxmaniac> Yagisan: Yes
<tuxmaniac> Yagisan: Do I have to wait for Dapper final?
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: do a pbuilder login and see if it installs in there
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: well, none of my breezy -> dapper upgrades were smooth
<tuxmaniac> I am planning to do a fresh install rather than a dist-upgrade!
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: those all worked well
<Yagisan> tuxmaniac: anyway, does it install in pbuilder ?
<tuxmaniac> I am checking out wait
<tuxmaniac> Yagisan: ^
<tuxmaniac> it does not
<sivang> Yagisan: I did not back up anything...ooo I'm naughty :)
<sivang> but then again, I switched to dapper a bit after UBZ
<Yagisan> sivang: I had an incomplete backup and flight 6 ate some of my xvids :( I had to reencode them
<sivang> Yagisan: Ah, I see
<sivang> Yagisan: well, I've never lost anything yet in ubuntu dist-upgrades, besides for when once experimenting with reiserfs
<Yagisan> sivang: well 200GB of data, and not enough dvds
<sivang> go get some more ! :)
<Yagisan> sivang: I have a nice big stack now. (and a new burner. the other one didn't make it)
<sivang> poor him, did you at least arrange for proper burrierl ?
<Yagisan> sivang: nope. I'm using it as a coaster for my coffe right now
* Yagisan wonders if getting connection failed to ubuntu forums is actually a blessing in disguise
* Yagisan bets his pm is "dUd3 y0uR p@c|<@G3 sUx b3c@uS3 |T |5|\|'T 4 d@PP3r"
<bddebian> Yagisan: :-)
<Yagisan> bddebian: I'm not cynical really. I admit only what 9 out of 11 pms were like that. the other 2 were thanks
<bddebian> :)
<Yagisan> bddebian: yep. some idiot has gone to dapper and hit the openal transition.
<ivoks> dholbach: making a mess? :)
<Yagisan> bddebian: why do people not the the 44pt message saying "breezy only" ?
<bddebian> Why do people do a lot of the things that they do? :-)
<Yagisan> bddebian: I don't know. one of them poked around and found my dapper development repo. the one where all my half working eat you system stuff lives
<bddebian> hehe
<Yagisan> bddebian: they must be determined. It's not advertised anyware, and I redirected you back to my main webpage if you access non-existent files or folders
* Yagisan takes a deep breath. in out in out in out. nope doesn't help
<bddebian> hehe
<LaserJock> anybody know anything about the sponsorship for Paris? I'm interested in how fast decisions will be made?
<sivang> LaserJock: aren't we all :)
<LaserJock> sivang: well, my problem is that sponsorship would determine if I could go or not. I really can't get plane tickets, for example until I know
<LaserJock> there's no point in applying if we are going to find out the day before the conf starts
<sivang> LaserJock: that's true, but I am sure replies will be sent pretty quick
<phanatic> LaserJock: same problems here :\
<LaserJock> sivang: well, I'll just signup and see what happends
<phanatic> LaserJock: deadline was 5th may i think, but some people have signed up after that ;)
<LaserJock> ack, it was?
<phanatic> yep
<Yagisan> some opinions please. Biggest bang for buck. -Os or -O2 ?
<sivang> LaserJock: indeed.
<sivang> -O2
<sivang> ;-)
<LaserJock> well, that makes me a little upset :/
<phanatic> Gloubiboulga: ping
<siretart> dholbach: err, re bug #43648: are you sure you wanted to set that 'confirmed'?
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 43648 in quodlibet "UVF 0.18 -> 0.20.1" [Normal,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/43648
<crimsun> I would object, because I'm still chasing down a crasher
<crimsun> I have not confirmed with Joe whether his latest changesets fix it
<crimsun> I'll cherry-pick from svn and check tonight
<crimsun> the crasher being a random segfault due to stack explosion.
<dholbach> siretart: arg no
<dholbach> siretart: needsinfo would be a bit more appropriate :)
<siretart> :)
<Gloubiboulga> phanatic, pong
<phanatic> Gloubiboulga: https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/perlpanel/+bug/43673
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 43673 in perlpanel "0.9.1+cvs20051225-1ubuntu1 FTBFS" [Normal,In progress] 
<Gloubiboulga> It built fine here :/
<Gloubiboulga> phanatic, I update (again) my pbuilder, retest the build and upload
<Gloubiboulga> phanatic, thanks :)
<phanatic> Gloubiboulga: in pbuilder it builds fine, however on the server it failed...
<phanatic> Gloubiboulga: i mean -1ubuntu1 built fine in pbuilder
<Gloubiboulga> strange
<phanatic> yeah...
<phanatic> hope the patch helps
<ajmitch> morning all
<tseng> hi
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch, tseng
<tseng> hi bddebian
<bddebian> LaserJock: This mayavi thing is a weird one.  Has this been working until recently?
<dholbach> bddebian: yes - we had trouble in hoary to get it working - herve finally made it
<bddebian> Well it's expecting the Patented modules and vtk isn't building them because they aren't DFSG Free
<LaserJock> hmm, so we need to patch mayavi then?
<Toadstool> nope vtk IMHO
<Toadstool> see bug 43095
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 43095 in vtk "Mayavi does not start (dependency problem ?)" [Normal,Confirmed]  http://launchpad.net/bugs/43095
<Gloubiboulga> and there's a bug filed against pyvtk, with the same problem
<Toadstool> Gloubiboulga: I marked this one as a duplicate of 43905 and closed it
<LaserJock> yeah, but if the problem is that vtk isn't shipping DFSG non-free stuff then I think it is mayavi's problem that it is looking for it, no?
<Gloubiboulga> Toadstool, yep, I've just seen this :)
<Toadstool> LaserJock: I've quickly examined mayavi source code and it looks like it doesn't use the Patented stuff
<LaserJock> so vtk is looking for, but we aren't building it?
<bddebian> vtk is a PIG
<Toadstool> :)
<bddebian> It's been building for like 2 hours :-)
<Toadstool> LaserJock: Patented was removed from Debian vtk 4 years ago
<bddebian> Just rip that out of __helper.py and see if it works :-)
<Toadstool> bddebian: only the del sys.modules["..."]  thing :)
<bddebian> Yes
<Gloubiboulga> is there a known problem with some perl builds?
<bddebian> Yeah, perl sucks
* bddebian hides
<Toadstool> lol
<bddebian> Toadstool: I don't know how to build python object files and such so I don't know if I can just hack that file to test
<Toadstool> bddebian: you can, I've already tested and it works
<ajmitch> sivang: fwiw, zope2.8, etc provide the virtual package zope
<bddebian> mayavi works too?
<Gloubiboulga> perlpanel builds fine with pbuilder but FTBFS on LP: http://tinyurl.com/gebmr
<Toadstool> bddebian: let me try
* ajmitch knew he should have assigned the rest of the zope unmet deps bugs to himself
<sivang> ajmitch: I reassigned them all to you back :) I only touched 2 of them IIRC
<ajmitch> reassigned them? you mean you assigned some to yourself that were assigned to me?
<sivang> ajmitch: yes , I know , and I found out with doko that it's pending getting out from NEW. I did a workaround to verify zope-zshell becomes installable aagain, and so request a sync
<sivang> ajmitch: never. only 2 that were unassigned.
<Gloubiboulga> phanatic, I'll upload a new package with your patch, I hope the missing package is the only issue...
<Toadstool> bddebian: mayavi "works"... it fails to start on my box 'cause I don't have glx extensions
<Toadstool> at least it doesn't complain about patented
<bddebian> hehe
<bddebian> Toadstool: So upload that fix will ya? ;-P
<Toadstool> bddebian: you can try to comment the line in /usr/lib/python2.4/site-packages/vtk_python/vtk/__helper.py and launch mayavi
<ajmitch> sivang: I've just been waiting for a week for python2.3-xml to get out of NEW
<ajmitch> and then there's some others
<sivang> ajmitch: using doko's workaround (changing control info in the source) I managed to build it, and so could install zope2.8 , and so could test zope-zshell :)
<ajmitch> sigh
<bddebian> Toadstool: I just have to comment out of the py?  I don't have to worry about the pyo, etc?
<Toadstool> nope
<sivang> ajmitch: already sub'd ubuntu-archive for the sync request, I hope I did not step on your toes?
<Toadstool> bddebian: just the .py
<Gloubiboulga> Gnight all
<Toadstool> g'night Gloubiboulga
<ajmitch> I'll recover
<sivang> ajmitch: could you please let me know what I did wrong?...
<ajmitch> nothing bad, as such
<bddebian> Toadstool: Comment out the if and raise lines?
<ajmitch> sivang: except that zope-zshell still depends on python2.2
<Toadstool> bddebian:    #del sys.modules['vtk.%s'%mod_name]  <-- this line
<ajmitch> so it shouldn't have been a sync request
<sivang> ajmitch: I asked bddebian , he said it was okay if it depends on 2.2 and 2.2dev
<sivang> ajmitch: rather a patch to change depdendencies?
<bddebian> Wait, what did I do now?
<sivang> bddebian: well, you're not to blame. It's me. I should not have touched anything...and ajmitch told me the day before not to break anything..
<Toadstool> bddebian: http://public.kitware.com/cgi-bin/viewcvs.cgi/Wrapping/Python/vtk/__helper.py?r1=1.6&r2=1.7 <-- upstream fix
<ajmitch> I'm just surprised that python2.2 is still in the archive, and that anything zope would depend on it
<bddebian> Toadstool: mayavi works with that commented out :-)
<ajmitch> it'll possibly work, I guess
<Toadstool> bddebian: cool :)
<bddebian> Toadstool: Ah nice.  Can you upload yet?
<Toadstool> bddebian: nope, I don't have upload rights
<sivang> ajmitch: this is why I asked a sync, I saw it in the archive, and that the thing would install pulling it etc...
<bddebian> Toadstool: OK, I'll do it.  Thanks for the help!!
<Toadstool> bddebian: no problem :)
<ajmitch> sivang: it'd need updated to work with zope-common anyway
<ajmitch> but that's not an absolute requirement
<sivang> ajmitch: zope-common also depends on 2.2 ?
<ajmitch> no
<Toadstool> good night everybody
* ajmitch watches his computer start to heat up a bit
<tseng> whats new ajmitch
<ajmitch> not much
<ajmitch> applied for that summer of code thing
<bddebian> Later gang, time to head home
<ajmitch> so I might waste some time over the next 3 months doing that
<tseng> bye bddebian
<tseng> nice
<LaserJock> ajmitch: what sort of thing would you be doing for SoC?
<ajmitch> network authentication
<ajmitch> impressive
<ajmitch> cpu temp just dropped about 10C
<Kyral> what didja do?
<ajmitch> turned the fan speed up & stopped some programs
<ajmitch> nothing much
<Kyral> ah
<LaserJock> hi Kyral
<Kyral> hi LJ
<Kyral> can Sendmail send a properly formatted text file as an email
<Kyral> from the commandline?
<dholbach> good night guys
<Kyral> cya
<dholbach> Kyral: cat bla | mail somebody -s subject     ?
<Kyral> dholbach: can I get this to be a cronjob?
<dholbach> sure
<Kyral> okay
<Kyral> where is mail's config file?
#ubuntu-motu 2006-05-14
<dholbach> you have to set up a local mail server
<Kyral> yah like Sendmail?
<Kyral> or MSMTP
<LaserJock> dholbach: cya
<LaserJock> Kyral: he's trying to go to bed ;-)
<dholbach> yeah, like exim, postfix, etc
<Kyral> sorry dholbach :P
<dholbach> don't worry :)
<Kyral> cat dholbach >> /dev/bed :P
<dholbach> yup
<dholbach> I'm off
<LaserJock> Kyral: maybe you should have thrown a | shower in there just in case ;-)
<Kyral> lol
<plugwash> afaict the sendmail command can send any e-mail, not sure exactly how you use it though
<plugwash> i think you may have to feed it a smtp command sequence or something like that
<Kyral> well, once I get it once, I can script it and bang
<phanatic> g'night, guys
<LaserJock> anybody got a ppc I could borrow for a test? I need to to see if xcircuit starts up on ppc.
<LaserJock> hi seth
<seth> LaserJock, yo
<LaserJock> seth: how's it going?
<seth> it's finals week
<seth> yay for finals :/
<LaserJock> heh
<seth> but it does mean that I'm almost done
<LaserJock> I'm glad I'm done with those
<seth> but then, 2 weeks after finals, our company is launching its new product
<seth> so things are going to be intense for the next month
<seth> at least
<persia> Is UTF8 the standard encoding yet?  Is it safe to convert things found in KOI8-R during build?
<LaserJock> persia: I'm not exactly sure. UTF8 is standard for Ubuntu but there  are apps that still have issues with it
<persia> LaserJock: Are the problems on a per-app basis, or are there a significant number of users likely to be using a non-UFT8 locale?  I'm especially interested in the status for RU, as I'm tracking down an encoding complaint in audacity.
<LaserJock> persia: seems on a per-app basis
<persia> LaserJock: Thanks.  Barring testing issues, I'll look at an iconv call in the rules file.
<crimsun> persia: if apps aren't Unicode-aware by now, they need to be fixed
<persia> crimsun: audacity is unicode aware, it just has KOI8-R encoding for ru.po, and the results under ru_RU.UTF8 are very ugly.
<crimsun> ick.
<persia> Is anyone familiar with bind_textdomain_codeset()?  I'd like to find a proper usage example before creating my patch (iconv in the rules file didn't really work right).
<bddebian> Heya gang
<crimsun> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Howdy crimsun
<LaserJock> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Hello LaserJock
<ajmitch> hello bddebian
<ajmitch> our king returns!
<crimsun> hmm, interesting new volume icon
<bddebian> Heya ajmitch
<bddebian> Your king.. pfft
<ajmitch> of course
* ajmitch grovels
<bddebian> phooey
<LaserJock> all hail bug king bddebian !! ;-)
<bddebian> STOP IT :-)
<bddebian> I'm useless lately :'-(
<crimsun> cool, BddebianIsAKing now?
* ajmitch waits patiently for dapper to boot
<ajmitch> slow thing
<lifeless> bddebian: upload xclip
<Laser_away> alas, group meeting awaits
<bddebian> lifeless: ?
<lifeless> bddebian: theres a bug on xcllip
<lifeless> xclip
<lifeless> where you claim you prepped a fix, but wanted to test it, its marked needsinfo,
<bddebian> Hmm
<lifeless> but xclip is currently fucked in dapper because its in /usr/X11R6/bin
<bddebian> I'm afraid it will break on other archs though
<bddebian> Maybe I should just hack rules to cp them to usr/lib
<ajmitch> such as?
<bddebian> ajmitch: ppc
<bddebian> amd64
<persia> bddebian: I can test amd64.  Which bug number?
<bddebian> persia: It's a local fix.  I had the package stop using xmkmf
<bddebian> I'm probably better off cping or mving the files after the fact
<lifeless> bddebian: put the debdiff in the bug
<lifeless> bddebian: then persia can test
<bddebian> Oh, that's gonna break the build though
<persia> bddebian: Ah, you too were caught by 28707!
<bddebian> persia: There are several packages b0rked because of that :-)
<persia> bddebian: Too bad we didn't expect the delay in February or March: this would be solved by now :(
<bddebian> Yeah
<bddebian> Hmm, anyone know much about -e with make?
<lifeless> it changes the precedence of FOO=BAR
<lifeless> with make by default:
<lifeless> FOO=BAR make
<lifeless> will only set FOO=BAR in the Makefile rules if there is no FOO= line, or if its using the special syntax (?:= IIRC)
<lifeless> make FOO=BAR will set FOO=BAR in the makefile always
<bddebian> So I can't override?
<bddebian> Ahh
<lifeless> FOO=BAR make -e
<lifeless> behaves like make FOO=BAR
<persia> Audacity depends on wxwindows for gettext translation, and contains .po files with various encodings (UTF8, ISO-8859-1, KOI8-R, etc).  wxwindows doesn't apply bind_textdomain_codeset() to automatically convert to a given locale.  As a result, audacity renders .  In which package should this be fixed?
<crimsun> more than likely wxwidgets
<crimsun> which well, has historically had ... issues with encodings.
<persia> crimsun: wxwidgets?  I don't have that package for -2.4.  I'll prepare a patch for wxwindows, and make sure it works with audacity.  Thanks.
<crimsun> persia: both wxwidgets2.6 and wxwindows2.4 have ... unique encoding handling.
<persia> crimsun: unique?  Perhaps I should just convert the po in audacity, and avoid changes that could break someone else's hack?
<crimsun> persia: whichever is least likely to touch wxwindows.
<bddebian> Hmm, what should LIBEXECDIR be?  Just /usr/lib?
<persia> crimsun: OK.  I won't play with wxwindows.  Thanks for the warning.
<bddebian> OK, it doesn't like that:
<bddebian> /usr/bin/make \
<bddebian>         INCROOT = /usr/include \
<bddebian>         USRLIBDIR = /usr/lib \
<bddebian>         SHLIBDIR = /usr/lib \
<bddebian>         MANPATH = /usr/man \
<bddebian>         PROJECTROOT = /usr \
<bddebian>         BINDIR = /usr/bin \
<bddebian>         LIBEXECDIR = /usr
<bddebian> make: *** empty variable name.  Stop.
<bddebian> make: *** [build-stamp]  Error 2
<bddebian> SHouldn't the above work?
<persia> bddebian: Have you tried it with fewer spaces (FOO=BAR rather than FOO = BAR)?  In some cases, this makes a difference.
<bddebian> Hmm no, I will thx
<bddebian> persia: That was it, thx
<Kyral> yo bddebian
<bddebian> Heya Kyral
<bddebian> Stupid thing still installs in X11R6 path.. :-(
<persia> bddebian: Perhaps you could do something with sed between the call to xmkmf and the call to make?
<bddebian> I thought about that but it seems like overkill..
<crimsun> sometimes ya gotta do what ya gotta do
<persia> bddebian: the problem is that xmkmf makes extremely robust Makefiles, which are difficult to fix otherwise :)  Personally, I fell back on 28707 as the fix.
<Kyral> If I disappear for a very long time, ask bddebian where I am....
<Kyral> I'll prolly be on HURD Island :P
<bddebian> w000t :-)
<bddebian> persia: What do you mean fell back on 28707?
<persia> bddebian: I mean I gave up on the other bugs until 28707 was fixed.
<crimsun> I hate when I discover soft blockers
<bddebian> OK, who's the sed expert to replace /X11R6/ with / ? :-)
<Kyral> uhhh
<Kyral> s/\/X11R6\//\/?
<crimsun> s/\/X11R6//  is simpler
<persia> bddebian: FOO=mktemp; sed s/X11R6\///g < Makefile > $FOO; mv $FOO Makefile is a quick&dirty way to do it.
<Kyral> I think he wants tot replace it with a literal /
<Kyral> I dunno
<crimsun> Kyral: which is fine, since the trailing / is that literal /
<Kyral> my sed-fu is weak
<bddebian> Kyral: Stronger than mine :-)
<crimsun> guh, time to think about an UVFe for wxwidgets2.6 :(
<ajmitch> crimsun: to 2.6.3.x?
<crimsun> ajmitch: yes, to Sid's
<ajmitch> hopefully it wouldn't break *too* much
<bddebian> heh
<ajmitch> wx has a history of being nasty with updates
<ajmitch> too many apps depending on existing bugs :)
<bddebian> hehe
<crimsun> yeah, I'll have to test it locally before I decide
<crimsun> ->coffee
<persia> Could someone please remind me of the command to see exported symbols from a library?
<Kyral> objdump?
<bddebian> persia: objdump -T
<ajmitch> ah, curry... an important part of the diet
<Kyral> ajmitch: he said COFFEE
<Kyral> not CURRY
<ajmitch> Kyral: yes, I saw that
<ajmitch> you don't have be yell it
<Kyral> ah you were referring to yourself sorry
<ajmitch> yes, I was
<Kyral> ajmitch: I dunno howto bold in Irssi
<persia> Kyral: Thanks.
<Kyral> sorry
<ajmitch> since I just had some vindaloo for lunch
<bddebian> OK persia that doesn't work :-)
<persia> bddebian: Which part doesn't work?  Does the Makefile get updated?
<bddebian> No, I get unknown option to 's'
<zakame> hi all
<bddebian> Heya zakame
<zakame> heya bdd! :D
<persia> bddebian: Playing with the shell, I found echo This is /usr/X11R6/lib | sed 's/X11R6\///g'
<zakame> coolness, the SoC got extended
<ajmitch> only by less than a day :)
<zakame> persia: is that the imakefile bits again? :)
<persia> zakame: Yep.  bddebian is bravely attempting to use sed in local rules files to avoid 28707.
<ajmitch> zakame: what have you applied for?
<zakame> ajmitch: ubuntu, tpf and osdl
<zakame> I'm thinking of submitting one for debian too :)
<ajmitch> zakame: yes, but to do what projects? :)
* ajmitch only had time to write up 1 application :)
<zakame> persia: rocking!  I was dreaming over your last statement about the 5-year support... and I think its better tosupport a usable app for 5 rathern than a borked one :/
<zakame> ajmitch: sendpage for osdl, nms-cgi for tpf, and smart-bugreporting-tool for ubuntu (currently drafting)
<ajmitch> great :)
* ajmitch has to go off to uni & actually do something now
<ajmitch> so hard..
<persia> zakame: You may be right, and if bddebian is successful, we'll have a supportable model package (xclip).
<zakame> awww
<bddebian> Well I'm not so far :'-(
<zakame> rock on!
* zakame hugs persia and bddebian
<zakame> ajmitch: are you going to do NetworkAuthentication?
<ajmitch> zakame: hopefully
<persia> I think I'm missing something.  When running torcs, I get: "symbol lookup error: /usr/lib/torcs/modules/graphic/ssggraph.so: undefined symbol: alutLoadWAVFile", but `objdump -T /usr/lib/libalut.so.0.0.0 | alutLoadWAVFile` prints an address.  Can anyone point me in the right direction?
<ajmitch> back later :)
<bddebian> persia: Is it really looking in /usr/lib/torcs/modules....
<bddebian> Oh, nm, I read that wrong
<zakame> coolness :D
<zakame> brb
<bddebian> w000t
<bddebian> Ugly as hell but it seems to work
<persia> bddebian: How ugly?  I just tried it for kdrill (libalut is frustrating), and it was only four lines of mush (sed 's/\/X11R6//g' < $(CURDIR)/Makefile.xmkmf > $(CURDIR)/Makefile type stuff).
<bddebian> I did this:
<bddebian>         mv Makefile Makefile.in
<bddebian>         cat Makefile.in | sed 's/\/X11R6//g' > Makefile
<persia> bddebian: Well then, perhaps 28707 isn't the blocker it was.  The cruft shouldn't break anything once ProjectRoot is adjusted, as it should become a NOP.
<bddebian> Aye
<bddebian> Hmm, do I need to add sed as a build-dep now?
<crimsun> no, it's in base and is present already.
<persia> bddebian: Does Ubuntu have Essential?  If not, yes.  If so, then only if sed is not essential.
<bddebian> OK, thx guys
<crimsun> Essential: yes
<crimsun> Priority: required
<crimsun> Section: base
<zakame> back
<zakame> woohoo! seems we can break the imake ice after all :)
<crimsun> heh. I did that sed cruft with wxwidgets2.6 a while ago ;)
<zakame> persia: what are the changes to debian/dirs and *.menu , from the patch? they're not documented in debian/changelog
<persia> zakame: It's part of "Removed statis references to X11R6 from the debian directory".  Hold on a minute: I made a mistake with the last patch - a new one should be forthcoming.
<zakame> ah yes... /me am used to listing individual changed files in the log
<persia> zakame: There were so many!  I can edit if you like.
<zakame> no, it ok now, that's just mypreference anyhow :) rocking work :D
<persia> zakame: Thanks.  You'll upload, or should I list it on my wishlist page?
<zakame> persia: ok :)
<persia> zakame: Thanks.
<Yagisan> Is getting an ICE in gcc a good enough excuse to get a import gcc-4.1 ?
<ajmitch> usually not
<ajmitch> you'd have to convince doko, and then mdz, I suspect
<crimsun> Yagisan: it doesn't build with gcc-4.0?
<Yagisan> ajmitch crimsun I was using the nifty new -ftree-vectorize and it gave an ICE on valid code with 4.0 and a working file with 4.1
<Yagisan> anyway I should get make to delivering my ads. Catch you later tonight
<Yagisan> s/make/back
* Yagisan is tired
<zakame> awww
<imbrandon> stupid question , why does php5 depend on apache2* ( it can also be used as command line only like python etc )
<Hobbsee> hi everyone ;)
<Mithrandir> ehlo, Hobbsee
* Hobbsee waves to Mithrandir 
<bddebian> Hello Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Gnight Hobbsee :-)
<Hobbsee> heh
<bddebian> Gnight everyone
<Hobbsee> afternoon bddebian
* StevenK jumps on Hobbsee.
<Hobbsee> argh!
* Hobbsee is jumped on
* Hobbsee sends StevenK to her computer lecture in punishment.
<StevenK> What computer lecture?
<Hobbsee> which...would be finishing in...5 mins, i guess :D
<Hobbsee> StevenK: the one i'm not at.
<StevenK> What subject?
<Hobbsee> computing
<Hobbsee> c++ programming
<StevenK> Ah. I passed that unit 4 years ago.
<Hobbsee> actually, better still...you can do my evil maths assignment!
<StevenK> Hobbsee: It's been a while since I've sunk my teeth into maths, I'm happy to help.
<Hobbsee> heh
* StevenK just spent 10 minutes finishing the last prac for SP2.
<Mithrandir> Hobbsee: is it evil or is it just maths?
<StevenK> Spending 15 minutes using Performance Monitor on Windows XP does not make a hard prac.
<Hobbsee> Mithrandir: it's calculus.
<StevenK> Therefore, evil maths.
<Hobbsee> exactly
<Hobbsee> well, there are some matrix proofs in there...
<StevenK> Yummy, matrixes.
<Hobbsee> hehe
<Mithrandir> cruuunchy matrices.
<StevenK> With butter inna bun
<Hobbsee> hehe!
<Hobbsee> StevenK: http://rutherglen.ics.mq.edu.au/math132s106/m132-a3.pdf
<Hobbsee> StevenK: i'm up to 1f, have done question 2, and have no clue about the lovely question three :P
<ajmitch> afternoon
<Hobbsee> hi ajmitch :)
<crimsun> excellent, just python version changes for Sid's wxwidgets2.6
<\sh> moins
<crimsun> moin \sh
<dholbach> good morning motu world!
<Hobbsee> hi dholbach :)
<dholbach> hey Hobbsee - how are YOU?
<Hobbsee> dholbach: i'm avoiding my maths assignment, and fighting a bit with my wireless card, with this new kernel :)  And yourself?
<dholbach> Hobbsee: just started working and we have beautiful weather over here
<Hobbsee> :)
<dholbach> Hobbsee: is the maths assignment sooo bad?
<Hobbsee> dholbach: yes.  i'ts calculus, among other things.
<dholbach> you should find some guys in here who can help you :)
<dholbach> hey slomo_
<Hobbsee> heh
<slomo_> hi dholbach :)
<dholbach> slomo_: you seem to be trying to stay awake for 22h a day?
<slomo_> dholbach: not really... i slept ~6 hours last night... like almost every night
<slomo_> dholbach: why? :)
<dholbach> slomo_: then you were up real early :)
<siretart> hey motus!
<dholbach> hey siretart
<slomo_> hi siretart
<crimsun> hey folks
* Hobbsee considers just crawling into a corner somewhere and passing out
<Hobbsee> i'm off for a while - see you later...
<Mithrandir> enjoy your passout.
<Hobbsee> heh
<Toadstool> hi everybody
<Riddell> siretart: what does it take to get my UVFe approved?
<\sh> oh wow...I love ssh X11 Forwarding and Cygnus software
<siretart> Riddell: it was set to 'confirmed', so it is approved
<siretart> Riddell: I assume you talk about qt-4.1.2, right?
<Riddell> yes
<Riddell> ok, cool, how do I request the sync then?
<siretart> Riddell: thats documented on DeveloperRessources wiki. You just need to subscribe 'ubuntu-archive', and say exactly what version from which origin you want to sync from and confirm that you have checked that all ubuntu changes can be dropped
<Whoopie> Hi
<Whoopie> siretart: with regard to bug #43385 (acroread): couldn't we just mention that we switched to marillat's repo and rebuilt it for dapper? It's not a new version upload, it's a bugfix. See #41787.
<Mithrandir> uh, we're shipping acroread?
<Mithrandir> has the license been fixed to allow redistribution?
<Whoopie> Mithrandir: it's in multiverse.
<Mithrandir> yes, and?
<Mithrandir> if it's not redistributable, we can't redistribute it
<siretart> Mithrandir: we've been shipping acroread (the binary package) since warty
<siretart> Mithrandir: I was told that sabdfl himself decided to ship it, but I havn't heared that someone investigated the matter deeper. but I may be wrong
<Mithrandir> siretart: the license doesn't appear to give rights to redistribute it.
<siretart> Mithrandir: right
<Whoopie> Mithrandir: and what about 2.2.1 in the EULA?
<Mithrandir> Whoopie: that talks about installed copies.
<Mithrandir> and it talks about internal use, and it doesn't allow usage over anything but NFS.
<Mithrandir> there, https://launchpad.net/distros/ubuntu/+source/acroread/+bug/43780
<Ubugtu> Malone bug 43780 in acroread "Redistribution not allowed" [Critical,Unconfirmed] 
<Whoopie> why is it in marillat's repo? If Adobe was concerned about it, wouldn't they have done anything against it?
<StevenK> Whoopie: They may not.
<StevenK> Whoopie: It's up to Adobe to chase it. They may choose not to.
<Mithrandir> that doesn't mean you can redistribute.
<siretart> Whoopie: marillat has a lot of stuff with highly doubtful licences. so this argument doesn't really count
<StevenK> So, surely we punt the (useless) acroread out of the archive, and close all its bugs.
<StevenK> Mithrandir: Well, you can. You just shouldn't.
<StevenK> I don't think marillat even reads licenses.
<Whoopie> ok, that's bad. I hoped to find a solution to upgrade it, not to ban it from the archive.
<Mithrandir> StevenK: can as in "is allowed to".  You can jump off bridges, but I'd advise you not to.
<Whoopie> But I understand your concerns.
<Whoopie> another question: we're shopping kismet, but our version doesn't support the newer wireless cards (e.g. ipw3945). Would it be possible to sync with debian and ship a version which supports all our supported cards?
<Lathiat> whast the current debain version?
<StevenK>     kismet | 2005.08.R1-1.2 |        dapper | source, amd64, i386
<StevenK>     kismet | 2006.04.R1-1 |           sid | source, amd64, i386
<StevenK> We are releasing in less than a month. A new upstream version is very unlikely.
<StevenK>     kismet | 2005.08.R1-1.2 |        dapper | source, amd64, i386
<StevenK>     kismet | 2006.04.R1-1 |           sid | source, amd64, i386
<StevenK> Crap, sorry.
<StevenK> Who knew the 4th button on my mouse pasted.
<Mithrandir> it does?  Weird.
<StevenK> I have a Microsoft IntelliMouse.
<StevenK> The wierd glowy one that happens to have 7 buttons.
<StevenK> The button on the left hand side seems to paste as well as pressing the whell.
<StevenK> Er. Wheel
<Mithrandir> I have a logitech mx518 or something which has 8 or so, but apart from the wheel, it doesn't paste.
* StevenK wants to replace it with a maus that doesn't have a tail.
<StevenK> Whoopie: If you'd like to try and get kismet sync'd, you're welcome to test it to death and see if there are no regressions.
<StevenK> And then beg a MOTU to ask for UVF exception, and then a sync.
<StevenK> Mithrandir: It appears (from my reading of the Adobe website), that we can distribute acroread if we fill out the Adobe Reader Distribution Agreement.
<Mithrandir> StevenK: ok.  I guess Somebody might want to do that.
<Mithrandir> StevenK: care to add that info to the bug?
<StevenK> Mithrandir: Done.
<Mithrandir> thanks
<Whoopie> StevenK: I rebuilt it under dapper. And it works here. But I can't say that there are no regressions.
<phanatic> hi people
<sivang> hey phanatic
<sivang> phanatic: what's up?
<phanatic> hey sivang, got answer from JaneW, she updated the UDS page :)
<\sh> hmmm..is there a wiki page for the Ubuntu conference in Paris?
<waldo> anyone around?
<\sh> somehow yes :)
<waldo> i was sent here to get some help on a strange error I'm getting in (386) Ubuntu Dapper when using gnome-nettool -- namely that it crashes with a glibc error
<waldo> I was told to report the error here....
<waldo> by someone in ubuntu+1
<waldo> I just did a ton of updates today (hadn't used the machine in weeks) so.. anyway here goes
<waldo> So I type "gnome-nettool" and I get the following:  "*** glibc detected *** free(): invalid pointer:  0x08123500 *** Aborted"
<waldo> what's this all about?
<sivang> waldo: you have some sort of memory corruption
<sivang> waldo: trying to free a non existant pointer
<sivang> (or so)
<waldo> memory corruption?
<waldo> this happens consistently after reboots, etc.
<sivang> waldo: well, free is trying to release memory at the pointed location by 0x0812350
<sivang> waldo: but apparently there is nothing to be free there according to it's tables.
<waldo> I saw something somewhere about problems w/mismatching glibc when I googled this error....
<sivang> (it uses tables IIRC to track allocated addres ranges)
<phanatic> \sh: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDeveloperSummitParis
<waldo> sivang well, what could be causing this?
<sivang> phanatic: you did? wow
<waldo> this is drake+all current updates
<phanatic> sivang: was too impatient :)
<waldo> am I the only  one getting this error?
<sivang> phanatic: congrets
* sivang did not get a response yet
<sivang> phanatic: I'll probably have to track the conf from home, or come by myself :)
<phanatic> sivang: it will be decided tonigh/tomorrow
<waldo> it only crashes when I use the UI.  If I run nettool from the commandline only it doesn't dump
<phanatic> so nobody got answer yet
<phanatic> i just got the answer for the "when do we get results?" question :)
<Yagisan> hmm. Why do I have "unattended-upgrades" installed ?
<sivang> phanatic: ah :)
<sivang> phanatic: so there's still hope ;-)
<sivang> phanatic: what do you mean 'who do we get restuls?" quesiton ?
<phanatic> sivang: i asked JaneW to tell me when the sponsorships will be decided
<sivang> phanatic: ah!
* sivang goes to stand in the corner for his stupidity
<phanatic> sivang: she answered and updated the wiki page, so everybody knows the answer :)
<Yagisan> my amusing though for today. gcc-4.1 FTBFS in pbuilder due to it dieing in the initial patching, yet apparently it builds in Debians buildds
<waldo> gnome-nettool runs for everyone else fine?
<StevenK> Yagisan: Whee.
<StevenK> sivang: If it happens consistenly with the same program only, then it probably isn't memory corruption.
<sivang> StevenK: hmm, right, in any event I cannot reproduce it here
<waldo> can anyone reproduce my crash of gnome-nettool (from terminal) or System->Adminstration->Network Tools ?
<RandolphCarter> waldo: nope, could you paste any output on the terminal somewhere?
<waldo> So I type "gnome-nettool" and I get the following:  "*** glibc detected *** free(): invalid pointer:  0x08123500 *** Aborted"
<waldo> that's the output.  It only does this when it tries to go to the screen.
<waldo> I mean, if I do a command line only function like --ping=localhost it doesn't crash until it tries drawing the window...
<waldo> then it eats it
<RandolphCarter> mmm, malloc :) sorry, but without gdb'ing, I can't help
<waldo> okay just ran gdb and it says this
<Mithrandir> waldo: which architecture?
<waldo> 386
<waldo> very old computer
<waldo> umm...
<Mithrandir> I can't reproduce it either..
<waldo> actually I don't know if this is helpful
<waldo> it's the same error, then Program received signal SIGABRT, Aborted
<waldo> [switching to thread -121965600 (LWP 4995)]   0xffffe410 in __kernel_vsyscall ()
<waldo> do i need to do like a traceroute or something?
<waldo> i'm not good at this gdb thing... :)
<waldo> hmm.
<waldo> well, i'm gonna go to bed.  And hopefully this magically fixes itself.
<waldo> fwiw the error seems to be in __kernel_vsyscall and before that in raise() from /lib/tls/i686/cmov/libc.so.6  -- I don't know why there's 686 anything since this is an old 386 but whatever.
<waldo> night
<RandolphCarter> night - if you get the time, run 'ltrace gnome-nettool 2> call.log' and upload call.log somewhere
<waldo> hmm one sec
<waldo> i'll do that quickly..
<RandolphCarter> cheers
<waldo> okay I have the log.. where to send it?
<waldo> hmm.
<RandolphCarter> try: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/ if it's a reasonable size
<waldo> k give me 20 seconds
<waldo> okay done
<waldo> sorry for the blank lines at the top ,it was to help me find the top of the log and I forgot to cut it off
<waldo> does that help you at all?
<waldo> there?
<waldo> sorry again... :blah:
<waldo> I'm turning off the linux box...
<RandolphCarter> thanks, I'll have a look, we might be able to tell where it's failing at least
<waldo> it seems to draw out the window and the widgets and stuff .  Then takes a dump
<waldo> fwiw this is a laptop I'm setting up for a friend.  Circa 1998..
* freeflying is away: 
<zul> heylo
<crimsun> four core-dev candidates today? Neat.
<crimsun> g'luck zakame & zul
<Lathiat> nice
<zul> thanks
<ajmitch> hi
<Yagisan> evening ajmitch
<ajmitch> how's it going?
<Yagisan> ajmitch heath getting better, money getting worse.
<Yagisan> + typing getting worse
<ajmitch> ah :(
<ajmitch> still trying to get customers?
<Yagisan> ajmitch: been making up and distributing flyers this week
<Yagisan> ajmitch: is that an offer ;)
<ajmitch> sadly no :)
* ajmitch wonders if he should get up for the TB meeting in the morning
<Yagisan> ajmitch. I'm trying to relax by testing out -ftree-vectorize and seeing how much speed up I can get, and is it measurable enough to be worth it
<ajmitch> interesting
<ajmitch> any results so far?
<Yagisan> ajmitch: yes. some code actually did get faster, others had no change, and some valid code caused an ICE :)
<Yagisan> ajmitch: but without -msse etc it doesn't work
<Yagisan> ajmitch: so not suitable for base i386, but amd64 might be able to use it. no idea about powerpc
<ajmitch> evening Hobbsee
<Hobbsee> hi ajmitch :)
<Yagisan> ajmitch: to be honest, if I could utilise -fprofile-generate and -fprofile-use in the .deb build scripts, I'd expect a bigger boost, but I'm not sure the buildds would like that.
* StevenK waves to Yagisan and ajmitch
<Hobbsee> hi StevenK and Yagisan
* StevenK jumps on Hobbsee.
* Hobbsee falls to the floor
<Hobbsee> :P
<StevenK> Ooof
<bddebian> Heya gang
<Hobbsee> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Hi Hobbsee
<phanatic> hey bddebian
* Yagisan takes polaroid of StevenK and Hobbsee jumping incident
<Hobbsee> heh
* Yagisan scans it
<Mithrandir> Yagisan: yet another one. :-P
<Mithrandir> Yagisan: post it on teh intarweb
* Yagisan uploads to web http://eyagi.bpa.nu/~jamie/uf/StevenK-Hobbsee-jumping-incident.png
* Hobbsee destroys Yagisan's camera and scanner
<Hobbsee> hehe
* Mithrandir distracts Hobbsee with chocolate
<Hobbsee> LOL!
<Hobbsee> thanks Mithrandir :)
<Hobbsee> bad Yagisan!  you shouldnt make me laugh so hard whne the parents are asleep!
<StevenK> Yagisan: My hair is darker. :-P
<Yagisan> and that folks is the total extent of my artistic ability
<StevenK> Hahaha
<Mithrandir> Yagisan: nice. :-)
<StevenK> Yagisan: Your artistic ability seems to be better than mine,
<StevenK> s/\,/./
<Yagisan> StevenK: well, I've spent 3 days trying to draw artwork for my ads. I'd hope it would be better then that
<StevenK> Hah
<bddebian> Hi phanatic, Mithrandir, Yagisan, StevenK :-)
<Yagisan> G'day bddebian
<StevenK> Yagisan: Oh, speaking of, Sean wanted to see your CV.
<Yagisan> StevenK: oh ?
* StevenK waves to bddebian.
<Mithrandir> hiya bddebian
<StevenK> Yagisan: Just to see and have it on file. I think.
<Yagisan> StevenK: Will have done up tomorrow then.
<StevenK> Yagisan: Aye
<crimsun> bddebian: what do you mean by "libglib2.0-data packages"?
<tuxmaniac> Hello world!
<bddebian> crimsun: http://www.w00tlinux.com/bb/sutra227407.html
<crimsun> bddebian: $ COLUMNS=120 dpkg -l libglib2.0-data |grep ^ii
<crimsun> ii  libglib2.0-data          2.10.2-1ubuntu1          Common files for GLib library
<\sh> siretart: any news from fai kernel on ubuntu? :) looks like I need it somehow faster then expected :)
<bddebian> crimsun: Weird it doesn't show up for me
<Whoopie> Hi, how can I do a snapshot of the gksu window? I doesn't look nice here.
<crimsun> bddebian: it's a dependency of ubuntu-desktop, even.
<bddebian> Weird
<Dulin> Hi
* Yagisan sighs
* Yagisan had a very stressful hour
<Yagisan> my 2 year old grabbed the washing powder and made a "sand pit" while I was in the dunny
<Yagisan> she was completely covered in the stuff
<Yagisan> her and dad were not happy about her impromptu shower to wash it off
<crimsun> ah, the joys of children
* Yagisan has to clean up that sand pit now
<Kyral> morning MOTU people
<crimsun> I bet my folks are happy to be empty-nesters
<crimsun> morning Kyral
<Yagisan> G'day Kyral
<Kyral> Morning dholbach
<Yagisan> crimsun: she emptied 4kg of the stuff ! from a new box.
<Kyral> whats a dunny?
<Yagisan> Kyral: toilet
* Hobbsee snorts at Kyral's question
<Hobbsee> Yagisan: he's clearly *never* been to australia :P
<Kyral> ah
<Kyral> Yah I'm a stupid american
* Kyral sticks his tongue out
<Hobbsee> hehe
<Kyral> Kyral baka ja nei
<Kyral> ( I hope I got the grammer on that right)
<Spec> japanese?
<Yagisan> Kyral: nope. Kyral baka desu ne. or in hiragana Kyral 
<Yagisan> Kyral: what you actually said was
<Spec> hiragana is apparantly a language comprised of blackboxes and 'a's with tildes above them...
<Yagisan> Kyral: Kyral stupid. See you later
<Kyral> lol
<Kyral> sorry lol
<Yagisan> Spec: missing fonts
<Spec> i know :p
* Kyral should really take a proper Japanese language course instead of gleaning a shitload from anime and manga...
<Spec> yeah, i was thinking about that
<Spec> but then i'd be expected to do work
<Kyral> lol
<Kyral> If my college offered it I would do it in an instant
<Kyral> but they don't
<Spec> Mine does - and I'm at a community college
<Kyral> I'm at an Engineering college
<Kyral> Liberal Arts programs aren't our thing :P
<Spec> i'm trying to transfer to one, eventually
<Yagisan> I tried formal lessons. didn't work for me
<Yagisan> I learn better "interacting" with them :-P
<crimsun> Kyral: consider teaching English in Japan
<Yagisan> Kyral: avoid Nova then
<Yagisan> Kyral: need your bachelors first
<Yagisan> though
<Kyral> Nova?
<Yagisan> Kyral: major english language school
<Spec> avoid Nova?
<Yagisan> Kyral: basically treats you, like you'd treat a mexican
<Yagisan> Spec: as a teacher. NoVa = No Vacation
<Spec> ah
<Kyral> ...I'd treat a Mexican the same way I'd treat an American
<Kyral> if you're an ass to me, I'm an ass to you
<Yagisan> Spec: sick for 1 day and you lose your job
<Kyral> if you are nice to me, I'm nice to you
<Kyral> etc etc etc
<Yagisan> Kyral: actually, I'm refferring more to the recent protests I saw on tv
<Kyral> ah
<Yagisan> Kyral: english as an ambiguous "you"
<Yagisan> s/sa/has
<Yagisan> Kyral: steryotypical I know, but even US shows portrey it that way
<Spec> I feel awkward being American. :-/
<Kyral> yah....
<Kyral> lol
<Kyral> I mean wesa hated no?
<Spec> there's a bug in launchpad, I just submitted a comment and it sent two of them, timestamped differently: 10:42:34 and 10:54:25
<Spec> well, we're hated for good reasons....
<bddebian> BS
<Yagisan> Kyral: no. people nice. Government , well, the current one isn't a good one
<Kyral> and how!!
<Kyral> cat Bush > /dev/null
<Kyral> I didn't vote for the arseclown
<Kyral> I love what my mom always told me about voting
<Yagisan> Kyral: rather like down here. I mean, what were people think oh wait thats right "tax cuts" (sure, first you raise taxes, then at election time you lower it. sheep vote for you.)
<Kyral> "You don't vote, you don't get the right to bitch for the next 4 years" :P
<Yagisan> Kyral: your system is odd. It's not majority wins, its first to get counted
<Kyral> yah yah
<Kyral> I wanna move to Canada damn it :P
<Kyral> or someplace like Britian
<Kyral> I know I swapped the i and a sorry
* Yagisan has to stop procrastinating and clean Kachan's mess
<Kyral> Yagisan: where do you live btw?
<Yagisan> Kyral: Australia
<Yagisan> Kyral: kind of odd, as well, I'm allways around at these odd hours
<Lathiat> Yagisan: what city?
<Kyral> Yanno, with all the Ubuntu People down there, maybe I should move down there lol
<Yagisan> Lathiat: Sydney
<Lathiat> need more people in perth :(
<Kyral> Lathiat: izzat an offer? :P
<tseng> Lathiat: sydney is more better
<Lathiat> yeh but im not in sydney
<Lathiat> :(
<Kyral> Seriously find me a Computer Science / IT job down there and I'll move lol
<Yagisan> Soon as my bachelors is done me -> tokyo same day
<Yagisan> anyway bbl
<Kyral> As much as I love the culture of Japan
<Kyral> I wouldn't move there
<Kyral> because I'd make a royal idiot of myself within' a week
<persia> Kyral: You'd be doing well then.  Most foreigners feel like an idiot before they leave the airport :)
<Kyral> lol
<Kyral> What is the word? Stupid American?
<Kyral> I know just enough not to be clueless, yet at the same time enough to make dangerous overgeneralizations :P
* Hobbsee discovers a good online grapher - yay :D
<Kyral> cat /dev/urandom > Hobbsee ?
<Hobbsee> hehe
<Kyral> Then again I would just find some coders and we would have conversations in C or Bash lol
<Hobbsee> i think you mean cat /dev/null > /dev/kyral.brain
<Kyral> you CAN'T cat /dev/null!
<Hobbsee> oh cant you?
<Kyral> no!
<Hobbsee> darn!
<Kyral> you can cat /dev/zero, /dev/random, and /dev/urandom
<Kyral> but not /dev/null
<Hobbsee> ah, i meant the first then.
<Kyral> the universal datasink, /dev/null is
<Kyral> (and I had to phrase it that way so irssi wouldn't think /dev/null was a command)
<Hobbsee> heh
<Kyral> I dunno, I tried learning Japanese via WikiBooks, but never had enough time lol
<tseng> hard to learn a language from a book
<Kyral> yah
<Hobbsee> night all...
<Kyral> cya Hobbsee
<Kyral> Gak I dunno what fontpack I need for that to render hiragana right
<Kyral> wait....would rxvt-unicode do it?
<Kyral> Hmm now it should work
<Yagisan> re
<Kyral> re?
<Yagisan> Kyral: returned. You didn't notice I left ?
<Yagisan> Kyral: if I'm quiet - I'm not here
<Kyral> ah
<Yagisan> Kyral: Kochi or Mincho fonts should work for you
<Kyral> Yagisan: I switched over to rxvt-unicode
<Yagisan> Kyral: ok. So,  what is it about Japan/Japanese that you like ?
<Kyral> Dunno
<Kyral> I'm inherently curious
<Kyral> and right now American pop-culture is pissing me off lol
<Spec> can you dd if=/dev/null of=/dev/brain bs=1024
<Kyral> no
<Kyral> you can't cat /dev/null
<Spec> it makes a null file
<Kyral> you can't cat /dev/null
<Spec> dd isn't catting
<Kyral> ah
<Kyral> sorry lol
<Yagisan> Kyral: I'd give you my reasons but this is a G rated channel ;)
<Kyral> ....if it begins with H I'm gonna smack you
<Yagisan> Kyral: H ? no.
<Kyral> lol
<Yagisan> Kyral: that stuff is weird.
<Kyral> yah
<Kyral> I don't watch it
<Yagisan> Kyral: can you say "never been on a date"
<Kyral> can you say "yes"
<Kyral> :P
<Kyral> wait was that for you or me?
<Yagisan> Kyral: I find spam for it often also arrives at the same time as viagra spam
<Yagisan> Kyral: the people that like it
<Kyral> ah
<Kyral> well, I've never been on a date
<Kyral> but thats because I'm a socially-naive Hacker :P
<Yagisan> Kyral: my secret to catching a chick. hide the pc
<zul> Yagisan: hehe...that didnt work for me
<Mithrandir> displaying them worked for me.
<zul> same here
<Kyral> Yagisan: I'm at a school known for Computer Science
<Kyral> what is the Think Geek shirt?
<Yagisan> Kyral: stalking^W showing an interest in her helps. I know it's hard when you seee the pc
<Kyral> "Chicks Dig Unix"
<Kyral> what was the ^W?
<Kyral> oh there is this girl who has stronger Shell-Fu than I
<Kyral> with excellent sed and grep-fu as well
<Yagisan> I find it odd being with another "geek". We are to similar for my taste
<Kyral> Its comforting
<Kyral> to me
<Kyral> because I can relax and let my Hackerness out
<Yagisan> I like differences. I can be myself without the need to compete with her
<Kyral> oh its not competition
<Kyral> (Keep in mind this girl and I are only friends)
<Kyral> She is a Computer Engineering/Software Engineering Major and I'm a Computer Science Major with a minor in IT
<Yagisan> Kyral: my wife has an English Linguistics Degree. She officially knows more then I do, and I'm supposed to be the native speaker
<Kyral> lol
<Kyral> nice
<Kyral> well, then again, most foreigners speak better English than 50% of Americans
<Yagisan> Kyral: please don't temp me
<Yagisan> s/temp/tempt
<Kyral> huh?
<Yagisan> Kyral: Americans and English. Funny joke ;)
<Kyral> Bah stuck up British English bastard :P
<Kyral> Though I do admit, I love the accent
<Yagisan> Kyral: English is what the Queen speaks ;)
<Kyral> Have the ability to make anything sound elegent, I mean a British man could be swearing a blue-streak and it would still sound refined
<Yagisan> Kyral: I suppose that would depend where he's from. I can imitate one rather well
<Yagisan> Kyral: we have fun teasing them a bit down here. They all seem to want to retire down under
<Kyral> now who?
<Yagisan> Kyral: Britsh. Are you sure you are a native speaker :-P
<Yagisan> bah typos
<Kyral> Yagisan: I have trouble following conversations sometimes
<Kyral> ADHD, OCD, Aspburgers Syndrome
<Yagisan> Kyral: I know the first 2, whats the last one ?
<Kyral> Best described as a "Highly-functional Form Of Autism"
* tuxmaniac waves at all HE-MANS !!
<Kyral> I translate it as "Socially-Impaired"
<Yagisan> Asp Burger - sounds like a exotic delicacy
<Kyral> or, in better words, I have a hard time picking up on things like sarcasm, or the other invisible "signals" of social conversation
<Yagisan> Kyral: so, your a geek then
<Kyral> hehehe
<Kyral> and I misspelled it on purpose BTW
<Kyral> in pronoucation, its "Assburgers"
<Yagisan> Arse Burgers ? =-O no thanks
* Yagisan wishes his son would sleep
<Kyral> yah
<enyc> Hrrm... anybody here having trouble with 'drip' package for dapper ?
<Kyral> now you know why I misspelled it
<enyc> it wont work -- gtk modules foil to find shared librarieos that are there already and stuff!
<enyc> (drip:7159): Gtk-WARNING **: Failed to load module "libatk-bridge.so": libatk-bridge.so: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory  and stuff --even though libatk-bridge.so is there in /usr/lib/gtk-2.0/modules
<sistpoty> hi folks
<sistpoty> ping siretart
<enyc> Hello sistpoty , master of the getting-freedoom-updated ;-)
<sistpoty> hey enyc ;)
<enyc> I cant get drip to work...
<Yagisan> sistpoty: freedoom ?
<sistpoty> Yagisan: free wad file for doom ;)
<Yagisan> sistpoty: you the maintainer ?
<sistpoty> Yagisan: nope... I just got it synced from debian, that's all
<Yagisan> sistpoty: I package a doom engine. Currently doesn't work with freedoom
<Yagisan> sistpoty: ahh. the wad. is it called freedoom.wad or doom2.wad ?
<sistpoty> Yagisan: doom2.wad
<Yagisan> sistpoty: that will cause problems with the real doom2.wad
<enyc> hrrm freedom is a 'doom 2 compatible replacement' wad iirc
<sistpoty> Yagisan: it's meant as a complete replacement, so it shouldn't be installed together with doom2.wad
<enyc> p.s. recently PrBoom 2.4.1 has come out -- good everhaul mixing itn changes from many places/projects together...
<Yagisan> sistpoty: ah no. it should be able to be installed alongside doom2.wad
<enyc> O well I must go
<enyc> speak later ;-)
<Yagisan> sistpoty: it can replace it, but should not conflict with it. That denies the user choice of what data to use
<Gloubiboulga> hi sistpoty :)
<sistpoty> hi Gloubiboulga
<sistpoty> Yagisan: maybe... but I must admit I'm not very well informed on what current doom engines expect as iwad file (maybe prboom hardcodes doom.wad or doom2.wad)...
<sistpoty> Yagisan: but FWIW there is some development about freedoom going on inside debian
<sistpoty> Yagisan: http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-games/2006/04/msg00067.html
<Yagisan> sistpoty: ok. kinda disturbing to see that it's called doom2.wad because an engine does not understand -iwad foo.wad
<Yagisan> sistpoty: thanks. I'll subscribe to that list
<Yagisan> sistpoty: so, what is your preferred engine ?
<sistpoty> Yagisan: haven't played it for some time, but back then I preferred prboom
<Yagisan> sistpoty: my preferred is deng.
<Yagisan> sistpoty: doesn't yet support boom features, hence no freedoom support yet
<sistpoty> Yagisan: didn't try deng yet, only saw some screenshots (that looked quite cool)
<Yagisan> sistpoty: I periodically upload it to revu for people to check my packaging
<Yagisan> sistpoty: I am resolving potential dfsg issues in the code base atm, but you can always grab it from my private repo
<sistpoty> Yagisan: once I got a little bit more time, I'll certainly test it :)
<Yagisan> sistpoty: sure. resource packs won't be ready until after the dapper release though
<Burgwork> what would it take to get a deb into multiverse at this late time? (ie, something new)
<LaserJock> Burgwork: do you have a source package ready to go?
<Yagisan> Burgwork: act of god ?
<LaserJock> Yagisan: make that mdz ;-)
<Yagisan> Burgwork: what is it ?
<Yagisan> LaserJock: there is a difference ?
<Burgwork> LaserJock, not yet
<LaserJock> not so much, although that would make me wonder where elmo is in that scheme
<Burgwork> Yagisan, sorry, can't tell you until I have it ready. Something from my company
<LaserJock> Burgwork: it might be hard to get a package going and approved in time, but theoretically yes, we have Feature Freeze exceptions
<Yagisan> Burgwork: that may make it hard to get it in then
<crimsun> it's actually just the same group as motu-uvf
<LaserJock> right
<Yagisan> Burgwork: every man and his dog here knows what packages I want to get in, but that won't happen any time soon. No harm in saying what it is though.
<crimsun> actually I don't know
<LaserJock> me neither
<Yagisan> anyone know where lists.debian.org hides mbox archives of the lists ?
* Yagisan is off to bed (at last sighs the whole channel)
* sistpoty is off again... cya
<lucas> if I package rubygems for dapper (new software, can't break anything except itself), will I be allowed to upload it to dapper ?
<crimsun> you would need to file a FF exception
<crimsun> same basic procedure as a UVF exception
<lucas> ok
<Amaranth> i thought the consensus was that rubygems was a bad idea
<lucas> it is
<lucas> but providing a package for it is harmless, and it's still better than having users compile it by hand
<lucas> it doesn't mean other packages will depend on it
<LaserJock> ack, do the Ubuntu install .isos have build-essential on them?
<LaserJock> nvm, I checked the seed
<crimsun> 'grats, zul
<LaserJock> yeah, way to go zul!
<bddebian> Damn, if zul can get in, I should apply.. ;-P
<phanatic> hey raphink
<raphink> hi phanatic
<sivang> hey phanatic
<sivang> phanatic: what's up?
<phanatic> hey sivang, waiting for the decision :)
<phanatic> and fixing tons of dh_iconcache ;)
<sivang> phanatic: cool, I fixed some transparency stuff
<sivang> but I need sponsers
<sivang> http://muse.19inch.net/~sivan/tray_icon/
<sivang> anybody in for it?
<phanatic> me too... i still don't have upload rights to universe (maybe the time has still not come)
<crimsun> 'grats, sivang
<Toadstool> yeah, congrats sivang
<phanatic> sivang: congrats :)
<LaserJock> way to go sivang
<dholbach> good night
<LaserJock> cya dholbach
* sivang jumps around the room
<phanatic> :D
<lucas> I have a question. I have breezy, dapper and sid chroots
<lucas> on my laptop
<lucas> I'd like to use some sort of caching mechanism to avoid fetching the packages from archive.ubuntu.com or ftp.debian.org all the time
<lucas> I've considered apt-cacher, but it doesn't work at all with different distros, because the same binary pkg file name might have different content on ubuntu and debian
<ogra> lucas, there were some mails to -motu about unionfs usage for that
<ogra> (or was that only about preventing the tarball, i cant really remember)
<lucas> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-motu/2006-March/000583.html
<lucas> yup it was about avoiding the tarball
<ogra> yeah ...
<lucas> otoh, I could just set two apt-cachers
<LaserJock> but how is that going to help you?
<lucas> one apt-cacher for debian files, one for ubuntu files
<lucas> this would work
<lucas> ... or I could use classic caching using apache2 ...
#ubuntu-motu 2007-05-07
<TheMuso> Hey MOTUs.
<ScottK> Hey TheMuso
<cbx33> if i need to storesome information in a database type environment for a python project
<cbx33> what would one recommend?
<cbx33> gadfly?
<pochu> hi TheMuso 
<ScottK> cbx33: Most major database types have Python bindings available.  Pick the one you want and it'll probably work out.
<ScottK> TheMuso: Do you have time to look at a merge? Bug #112710
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 112710 in clamav "Merge clamav 0.90.2-1 from Debian Unstable (Main)" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/112710
<TheMuso> ScottK: Sure./
<ScottK> Great.
<cbx33> sqllite
<cbx33> ;)
<cbx33> it's a standard lib 
<cbx33> ;)
<cbx33> I like that
<cbx33> and requires no server
<ScottK> TheMuso: I'll afk for a bit, but will stop in to see if there are problems/questions when I can.  Thanks again for having a look at it.
<TheMuso> ScottK: Ok.,
<minghua> subscribing bugs to ubuntu-qa without discussion is a very annoying thing to do...
<DaveMorris> hey guys, what pacakge does the mni iso (aka net installer) count as so I can raise a bug against it?
<minghua> thanks ScottK for unsubscribe that
<TheMuso> ScottK: I still see patches in debian/patches, yet I don't see anything in the latest changelog entry about them still being needed.
<TheMuso> ScottK: Should they be mentioned?
<TheMuso> ScottK: I notice you mention them in a previous entry.
* ScottK looks
<ScottK> TheMuso: I mentioned it the previous time because it was a new upstream release, so are the patches required seemed like a question that ought to be answered.
<ScottK> TheMuso: I didn't mention it this time because with the same upstream release, it seemed clear.  Also, the patches are not a remaining diff with Debian.  They have the patches too.
<ScottK> TheMuso: I didn't think it necessary, but if you want, I'll redo it.
<TheMuso> ScottK: No thats fine.
<ScottK> TheMuso: Thanks.
<mr_pouit> TheMuso: very strange, ctorrent doesn't fbfts here ^^" (gutsy pbuilder)
<persia> ScottK: Regarding gaphor in Debian: I'm not confident enough with python to really maintain the package, although I'd be happy to assist another.
<TheMuso> ScottK: uploaded
<ScottK> TheMuso: Great.  THanks
<minghua> computer games are harmful -- wesnoth crashes my X :-(
<Lathiat> haha
<nixternal_> StevenK: no response back from the guy who was/is in charge of krename for Debian, any recommendations for a next step?
<nixternal_> I did find a DD in Chicago who has agreed to meet up and sign my key which is cool
<ScottK> persia: If you can get it into Debian, it'll be here too, so we can help you here and you can just apply updates in Debian.  Everydody wins.
<persia> ScottK: OK.  I'll mail Cdric.  Separately, does the DATA_DIR definition look OK to you?
<ScottK> persia: I haven't had time to review in detail.  If I were going to do the package, I'd probably redo it as a cdbs package.
<ScottK> persia: I just looked at your diff.  To understand the data directory stuff I need to see what setup.py has in mind for it.
<persia> ScottK: That depends on my communication with Cdric :), but I don't think that would fix the DATA_DIR definition in the source.
<persia> ScottK: No worries.  Let me know when you've had a chance.
<ScottK> persia: No, not fix it in the source, just want to understand what upstream intended.
<ScottK> With a good setup.py and cdbs a lot of this stuff just magically happens.
<ScottK> geser: Did you ever get a chance to look at uploading the fix for Bug #112140
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 112140 in pythoncad "pythoncad fails to exit when all windows are closed" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/112140
<ScottK> crimsun: Do you have a moment to give an opinion on an SRU proposal?
<crimsun> url?
<ScottK> We have a fix for Bug #108612 sitting in Feisty updates.  I'm wondering if it would be wise to add the fix for Bug #112140 to it before we release it.  It's a one liner
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 108612 in pythoncad "[apport]  pythoncad crashed with ExpatError in parse()" [Medium,Fix committed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/108612
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 112140 in pythoncad "pythoncad fails to exit when all windows are closed" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/112140
<ScottK> err Feisty proposed, not updates
<RAOF> ScottK: Incidentally, I'm here, anytime you want to get AMD64 build accesss.
<ScottK> OK RAOF.  Thanks.  My time is pretty short tonight, so I'll probably pass.
<RAOF> :)
<crimsun> ScottK: I'd respin http://librarian.launchpad.net/7563882/pythoncad-clean-exit.debdiff without the DebianMaintainerField change
<crimsun> (I think I accidentally did it for azureus, but I shouldn't have.)
<ScottK> OK
<nixternal_> crimsun: Riddell said earlier "grab the kde4 debs, install them into a chroot, and build the rest of the kde 4 alpha packages."  I have been lost at that point. I have been trying OTHERMIRROR and BINDMOUNTS with pbuilder to get this. any ideas?
<ScottK> crimsun: Just to make sure I got it right...  I take that diff less the maintainer change and add it to the version in feisty-proposed..
<crimsun> nixternal_: I doubt he did that with pbuilder (unless he used --login and copied over using host's root).
<ScottK> crimsun: I can also make the version number for feisty-proposed align to the new e-mail so it can just be copied over when ready...
<crimsun> nixternal_: I'm pretty sure he just built a clean $release chroot, installed the kde4 debs, and went from there.
<nixternal_> I have never built packages in a chroot, only used dpkg & pbuilder
<nixternal_> crimsun: do I just create the chroot, chroot into it, and build packages like I am used to?
<crimsun> nixternal_: technically, pbuilder is a chroot
<crimsun> nixternal_: yeah, that's one way
<nixternal_> whats the best way?
<crimsun> ScottK: yes
<nixternal_> I have my chroots setup and working
<ScottK> Great.
<ScottK> crimsun: Thanks.  It may be tomorrow before I can get to it, but I'll get it done.
<crimsun> nixternal_: it's really up to you
<crimsun> ScottK: ok, thanks!
<nixternal_> so install them debs in chroot, and then just build the packages with dpkg like always and I should be rocking?
<crimsun> nixternal_: sure.  Takes more legwork, but it'll suffice.
<nixternal_> well if there was something less consuming and more efficient, I am all ears for that
<nixternal_> man, I love the Debian GDM login screen
<crimsun> I think that's about as "efficient" as it gets
<crimsun> you'd end up doing the same thing (and more) with pbuilder --login
<nixternal> oh OK...thanks for that crimsun, very much appreicated
<RAOF> When doing a merge, what do we do with the "Uploaders" field?
<persia> RAOF: Leave it be.
<RAOF> k.
<crimsun> RAOF: in effect, anyone who's a member of ubuntu-dev is implicitly an Uploader, so we don't really have that equivalent to Debian.
* RAOF wills g++ to compile faster.
* ScottK wonders what the heck is up with the Gutsy Sparc builddds.
<jdong> ScottK: pfft.... my ktorrent feisty package is mysteriously stuck in build queue
<ScottK> jdong: Looks at the Gutsy build queue and how much of it is sparc...
* persia has sparc packages now waiting 5 days.  It just takes longer on sparc: look at the times for the successful builds compared to the other architectures.
<jdong> ScottK: heh I saw at least one of the sparc buildd's is down
<jdong> but KT Feisty was first approved, but there have been no attempted builds on any arch for 4 days
<jdong> while Edgy and Dapper immediately built on all arches....
<jdong> :(
* RAOF tests his texmacs merge
<persia> Would anyone be willing to run a test build on powerpc?
<ScottK> jdong: I've got stuff that built on every other arch three days ago, but still waiting sparc, so can't mark fix released an move on :-(
<jdong> heh
<RAOF> Anyone know how I can test my texmacs merge in my gutsy pbuilder chroot over my ssh-forwarded X connection? :)
<TheMuso> RAOF: You may have more luck if you use a generic chroot, i.e one that you build by hand.
<crimsun> err, don't.  Make a separate gutsy chroot, configure an openssh-server instance listening on a different non-privileged port there, install the texmacs merge in it, and ssh -X
<RAOF> Right.  Is feisty's debootstrap able to make gutsy chroots at this point?
<TheMuso> Twas a couple of weeks back.
<RAOF> Awesome, I thought I saw that in the changelog.
<crimsun> if not, just debootstrap feisty and dist-upgrade
<TheMuso> RAOF: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebootstrapChroot
<RAOF> Or, just copy out the pbuilder chroot?
<RAOF> That'd be faster, is there any reason why it wouldn't work?
<TheMuso> dchroot absolutely rocks!
<TheMuso> RAOF: Probably would be fine, but you do need to add various files as explained by the above link.
* TheMuso thinks that it could do with a bit of reworking.
<_Enchained> hi motus
* RAOF watches deboostrap slowly crawl through.
<_Enchained> How can I do if I need a version a a package and this version isn't in ubuntu or debian ?
<_Enchained> version of*
<_Enchained> and ubuntu package is actually sync from debian but debian hasn't the version I want
<RAOF> You can either update the Ubutnu package to the new upstream version, or ask the Debian maintainer to update.
<Ursinha> Hi all
<Ursinha> is there a reason for acroread not to be supported in feisty anymore?
<Ursinha> guess everybody is sleeping
<Ursinha> :)
<Ursinha> found the answer, but thanks :)
<crimsun> I'm sure I answered that to you last week.
<crimsun> (the bug is closed)
<nixternal> chroot is all setup, grabbing all of the kde4 alpha source files to build away
<nixternal> so hopefully sometime tonight, or tomorrow we will have kde4 alpha release available for feisty
<Ursinha> crimsun, guess you're wrong, i didn't have this question till now
<crimsun> Ursinha: ok, I've only answered it a hundred times or so, so I lose track.
<Ursinha> crimsun, i can imagine so
<Ursinha> crimsun, but i don't miss it, you can bet
<minghua> crimsun: is it because of bug #43780?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 43780 in acroread "Acroread: Redistribution may not be allowed" [Low,Fix released]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/43780
<minghua> apparently crimsun's answer doesn't have enough google juice, or my google-fu sucks
<crimsun> minghua: yes.
<minghua> crimsun: do you think adding a comment and link to 43780 in bug 107434 and keep 107434 open a good idea?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 107434 in acroread "Adobe Acrobat reader not available in Feisty" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/107434
<crimsun> adding a comment, yes.  Keeping it open, no.
<minghua> add a comment and reject, then?
<crimsun> It is not a bug.  It is intentional and an archive admin's decision.
<crimsun> correct.
<minghua> done.
<crimsun> thanks.
<crimsun> uh
<crimsun> persia: did you ok this bug?  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/112985
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 112985 in Ubuntu "[Sync Request]  Please sync audacity (1.3.2-2) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  
<crimsun> I'm going to reject that one.
<persia> crimsun: Thanks for pointing me at that.  I'll reject it.  I'm still waiting for an i386 jack report on bug 112606
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 112606 in audacity "Please merge audacity 1.3.2-2 from Debian unstable" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/112606
<crimsun> ok, you do that
<crimsun> (finger poised above mouse button ;)
<persia> crimsun: Ah, sorry.  Always feel free to preempt me :)
<crimsun> I love our somewhat overzealous user community.
<crimsun> persia: nah, it's all yours. :)
* crimsun -> dinner
<RAOF> Hm.  One needs to be careful when messing around with chroots & bind-mounts.
<jdong> rm -rf recklessly?
<RAOF> A bit of a mv reclessly.
<RAOF> There will be a brief hiatus in the testing of my texmacs package :(
<RAOF> Although anyone is welcome to test it from raof.dyndns.org/falcon/ :)
<nixternal> jdong: I went with the chroot, it works, well kind of, some of the builds are crashing out on kde4base for some reason
<StevenK> nixternal: Yes. Wait longer. :-)
<nixternal> wait longer?
<nixternal> derr, nevermind :)
<nixternal> I forgot I told you I haven't gotten a response back
<StevenK> Heh, that's okay.
* StevenK just unawayed and saw the log.
<nixternal> I talked with Edd today, he is a local DD who I am meeting up with him and 2 others to get my key signed, but they said "steal it damnit"
<nixternal> haha
<StevenK> nixternal: To be polite, you want to give the current maintainer about a week.
<StevenK> Edd Dumbill?
<StevenK> (sp?)
<nixternal> no, his name is much longer than that
* StevenK looks him up
<nixternal> his real name is Dirk, by he shortens his last name and goes by Edd
<nixternal> s/by/but
<StevenK> Ahhh
<StevenK> Hence my confusion. :-)
<StevenK> Dirk Eddelbuettel -- the name rings a vague bell.
<nixternal> no, hence my confusion, I have been calling him Edd, and he goes by Dirk, but his email is edd@de|3ian.org
<nixternal> heh
<nixternal> that is him
<TheMuso> StevenK: I've seen that name on planet debian.
<nixternal> super busy guy, super cool
<nixternal> lives about 20 minutes away
* StevenK has a DD sitting about 7 metres away from him.
<StevenK> TheMuso: That might be the bell...
<TheMuso> heh
<nixternal> StevenK: tell him to drive to Chicago and sign my key ;)
<nixternal> StevenK: umm, aren't you sitting on a DD ;p
<StevenK> nixternal: Said DD has roughly 1% vision and isn't driving anywhere. :-P
<nixternal> you drive him then, that would be 2 more to add to the key ;)
<StevenK> It's a bit wet driving to Chicago.
<StevenK> Ahh, Dirk is in Illinois.
<jdong> nixternal: cool; glad to see it at least somewhat works :)
<jdong> and I doubt the crashes are your fault in any way :)
<jdong> unless your friends are as mean as me and my friends :)
<nixternal> hehe
<jdong> (i.e. toying with a Gentoo sysadm by randomly killing his GCC processes with -SEGV)
<nixternal> I am going to blame it on Riddell anyways
<jdong> bwahahaha
<jdong> we managed to get him to rebuild the whole system with a different set of CFLAGS :D
<StevenK> jdong: Muahaha. Switch to SIGILL, much more fun.
<nixternal> ouch
<jdong> StevenK: but more obvious
<StevenK> In terms of what?
<jdong> StevenK: give em the dreaded segfaulted compiler, and they'll spend the next 48 hours on mailing lists and /etc/make.conf....
<jdong> :)
<nixternal> I think if I don't get these working, I am to find some poor soul to build kde4 alpha
<jdong> a SIGKILL looks fishy, but a SEGV sounds a lot more real and less like a prank
<StevenK> On first parse, I thought you meant build KDE 4 on alpha. :-P
<StevenK> jdong: If the arch isn't i386/amd64, what about SIGBUS?
<jdong> StevenK: haha, ouch :)
<jdong> StevenK: almost as good as my prank emerge
<jdong> I once replaced /usr/bin/emerge with a pranked python script that generates random compiler-like output for hours and hours
<jdong> :)
<StevenK> Ohh, *NASTY*
<jdong> lol
<jdong> he got suspicious after the 8th or so hour of compiling bash.
<tonyyarusso> hahaha
<StevenK> I've built bash before, I would have gotten suspicious at about the 40 minute mark. :-)
<RAOF> Awesome, I can now pipe sound out from my KVM through pulseaudio.  Time to test whether I can break democracyplayer on i386!
<StevenK> jdong: Did you also busy-loop?
<StevenK> jdong: Otherwise, you get the output with no or very little CPU time used.
<jdong> StevenK: of course.... it actually does use gcc to compile a binaries in /tmp named gcc, make, cc1, and ld
<jdong> each of which is just a randomly gigantic null for loop
<jdong> so even top output seems believable
<StevenK> Nasty.,
<StevenK> s/\,//
<jdong> haha :)
<jdong> I'm a bad bad person :D
<StevenK> Remind me not to piss you off if you end up getting access to machines I use. :-)
<jdong> lol
<TheMuso> offline for a while. Got renovations starting soon, and have to move the gear out of the line of fire. :p
<nixternal> hrmm, I thought it was working, I found my problem with building though
<nixternal> I installed the kde4 packages into chroot, but pbuilder insists on using the old kde4 packages
<ranf> hi
<imbrandon> re
<nixternal> re
<RAOF> re, re, re your boat?
<nixternal> imbrandon: I am about to strangle these kde4 builds man
<nixternal> haha
<imbrandon> lol
<nixternal> harshly down the stream
<RAOF> angrily, angrily, ...
<StevenK> merrily, merrily, this is but a nightmare?
<nixternal> robitaille: you dropped your sandwich over there ->
* RAOF can't be bothered writing aout the rest of that.
<nixternal> StevenK: yes, yes it is a nightmare
<robitaille> nixternal,  sandwich?
<nixternal> ya, you dropped it on the floor ;)
<nixternal> my buddy does that, goes up to someone he doesn't know and says "you dropped your sandwich"
<nixternal> and the person never had a sandwich, yet the turn around and look for it :)
<robitaille> :)
<nixternal> he has gotten me a few times with "you dropped your pocket"
<nixternal> first thing I do is fell my arse, and then turn around, while he is laughin' at me
<nixternal> anyone interested in a hacked version of the latest yakuake beta from Sho_? I had to shrink down the splitters to like 2px I think
<StevenK> Hrm. I wonder when MoM will update again.
<Fujitsu> StevenK: Not soon.
<StevenK> Fujitsu: Oh?
<Fujitsu> It was broken for 2 months last time, so it should be at least several days before they get around to fixing it this time.
<jml> RAOF: I think the line is "blame it all on upstream"
<Fujitsu> I note we've done almost half of the merges already, and a lot of the rest have syncs requested. Not a bad effort!
* StevenK just filed another sync request.
* StevenK ought to look at doing some main syncs.
<nixternal> they have DaD up and running though correct/
<Fujitsu> nixternal: Of course.
<StevenK> Yes. Which is for universe.
<nixternal> well, when you are just a peon like I, universe is your friend
<nixternal> universe and I are drinkin' buddies
<Fujitsu> StevenK: I'm sure we're all devastated that you'll have to work on universe instead.
<StevenK> Oh yes, I bet.
<bluefoxicy> I have a question.  What is this "mentor" thing in Launchpad.  That reads to me like "Sit on your ass and watch someone else do the work, while you tell them what you want."
<bluefoxicy> Like getting involved without getting your hands dirty
<RAOF> jml: What was that in reference to?
<bluefoxicy> ...sounds like project management, actually.
<jml> RAOF: the final line of the angry version of "Row, Row, Row Your Boat"
<jml> RAOF: I thought it worked quite well
<RAOF> jml: I'll need to remember that, certainly :)
<StevenK> Huzzah!
<StevenK> clanlib has been orphaned in Debian.
<StevenK> Because that's going to make our lives so much easier.
<StevenK> </sarcasm>
<RAOF> Good job with that tag, I was wondering.
<RAOF> :)
<RAOF> jml: I can blame democracyplayer on upstream, at least :)
<StevenK> RAOF: Don't make me go over there. :-P
<RAOF> Feel free to come over, I need someone to sign my key :P
<StevenK> Hah
<Fujitsu> RAOF: You're in Melbourne, aren't you?
<RAOF> Sydney.
<ranf> Any MOTU around that has time to look at http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5058 ?
* StevenK finds a bug in DaD.
<StevenK> If the upstream version contains a dash (which is perfectly legal), DaD attempts to download the wrong files.
<StevenK> Oh yes, clanlib is the most pointless merge ever.
<StevenK>  2 files changed, 10 insertions(+), 2 deletions(-)
<Fujitsu> Lutin: ^^
<StevenK> Lutin: Package for reference is clanlib.
<crimsun> ranf: have you communicated with upstream (folkert at vanheusden dot com) regarding the license?
<ranf> crimsun, yes. He said having a GPL snippet in every source is not needed.
<Fujitsu> The GPL says it is needed.
<Fujitsu> Or the archive admins, or somebody similarly godlike.
<crimsun> ranf: but he explicitly stated that it was redistributable under the GPL?  i.e., GPL v1 or GPL v2 or ...
<crimsun> there's no indication in the source or on the program's web page indicating any license, which is quite ambiguous
<ranf> I've chatted here about it. Then I got 3 FSF links which I sent him. Haven't heard back from him.
<ranf> crimsun, his license.txt contains a download link for a GPL v2 text.
<crimsun> err, please restore his original license.txt, then, and include a copy of the GPL v2 as COPYING
<ranf> crimsun, ah ok.
<Fujitsu> The archive admins won't like that.
<vil> hi hjmf
<ranf> Fujitsu, I'll try to stay in contact with upstream.
<ajmitch> morning
<RAOF> Evening :)
<Hobbsee> hi RAOF 
<RAOF> Hey Hobbsee 
<RAOF> How's Seville treating you?
<Hobbsee> fun ;)
<RAOF> :)
<ajmitch> Hobbsee: stop causing trouble
<siretart> Gooooood morning, MOTUs! :)
<RAOF> Hobbsee: Poked anyone recently? :P
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: why should i?
<ajmitch> hey siretart 
<Hobbsee> RAOF: uh, yes.
<Hobbsee> multiple people
<Hobbsee> hiya siretart :)
<siretart> \o
<RAOF> How did the doom stick go through customs?
<Hobbsee> fine - customs was lax
* RAOF wonders whether it would be too much to expect 1st years to *answer the damn question*
<Hobbsee> RAOF: yes.  it would.  very much so
<RAOF> The answer to "find the solutions p(z)=0" should, at some point, include the *solutions to p(z)=0*.  A factorisation of p(z) is interesting, but ARGH.
* RAOF vents on another poor 1st year paper
<Hobbsee> hahahaha
<Hobbsee> you poor teacher.
<RAOF> >:(
<dn4> what doom stick?
* Hobbsee attacks RAOF with the Long Pointy Stick of DOOM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 
* RAOF deflects it, and it impales another 1st year paper, sending it up in flames
<RAOF> Woah, it conducts annoyance as heat!
<ajmitch> Hobbse is worrying
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: nah...i couldnt possibly be
<crimsun> we have nothing to worry about.  She's in the same room as you guys.
<dn4> deflecting a doom stick
<dn4> now that is unheard of in these parts
<ajmitch> crimsun: that's what I'm worried about
<\sh> moins
<crimsun> yanno, I could use tiber instead of this pokey PII/266
<Hobbsee> hi \sh 
<\sh> Hobbsee, hey...how is europe for you? :)
<Hobbsee> \sh: fun :)
<crimsun> \sh: you should be there, too!
<nixternal> crimsun: so should you!
<ajmitch> hi \sh 
<crimsun> nixternal: nope.  I prefer to NOT be prodded with sharp pointy objects, thank you very much.
<ajmitch> crimsun: customs isn't usually that bad
<nixternal> hehe
<\sh> crimsun, well, no time, no money, and too busy with my move of my home :)
<\sh> crimsun, and TBH I don't even know what I should do there...;)
<crimsun> I'm sure a wine spec could be made...
<\sh> crimsun, so a much better candidate for wine is scott ritchie :)
<\sh> crimsun, but eventually I'm visiting one of the two UDS next year
<crimsun> \sh: excellent
<\sh> hey ogra
<ajmitch> ogra: how's the little laptop going?
<ogra> great :)
<persia> crimsun: I've not had any success getting audacity-distributed portmixer to compile against ubuntu-distributed portaudio, and I'm reaching the point where I believe the value of my tweaks to non-audacity clients is becoming negative.  Would you be willing to test i386 JACK for the candidate audacity in 112606 (my last volunteer has gone missing)?
<\sh> little laptop?
<ogra> http://classmatepc.com/
<crimsun> persia: I can later, right now I'm doing six ALSA tasks and trying to print off 300 final exams.
<persia> crimsun: Later is excellent.  Thank you.
<crimsun> bug 112606
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 112606 in audacity "Please merge audacity 1.3.2-2 from Debian unstable" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/112606
<crimsun> tomboyed.
<Bra1> hello?
<Hobbsee> hiya
<Bra1> hey, finally!
<Bra1> I am in need of some help
<Hobbsee> shoot
<Bra1> I have vista installed on my laptop, and I would like to partition it out to be able to dual-boot ubuntu
* Hobbsee is in a session at UDS, though
<Hobbsee> i think you want #ubuntu
<crimsun> yes, he definitely does.
<arejay> Bra1: didnt you just ask that in #ubuntu
<Bra1> ya, but I can't get a response
<Bra1> everyone is troubleshooting other problems, so I figured I'd try this one
<Hobbsee> this *isnt* a support channel.  it's not a replacement #ubuntu
<Bra1> my bad, thanks anyway
<imbrandon> Hobbsee, where is the UDS VoIP list ? can you ask please ?
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: same as last time?  nixternal knows
<ajmitch> wiki.ubuntu.com/UDS-Sevilla/Participate
<imbrandon> i was actualy there last time , dident need ti
<imbrandon> hehe
<nixternal> hahaha
<ajmitch> and the schedule is http://people.ubuntu.com/~cjwatson/uds-sevilla/2007-05-07/
<nixternal> need to setup an account first
<Hobbsee> go on, thne
* arejay just looked at the classmatepc - seems cool :)
<\sh> ogra, nice one :)
<\sh> hey imbrandon 
<imbrandon> heya sharms 
<imbrandon> err
<imbrandon> \sh
<imbrandon> ( sorry for the hilight sharms )
<nixternal> ya sharms he is sorry
<imbrandon> ajmitch, thanks
<nixternal> hey sharms if you were awake you could pimp your enhancedbash
<Fujitsu> The audio quality is really bad :(
<nixternal> sharms: and the Bulls are going to devestate the Pistons
<nixternal> he is going to wake up thinking he is popular or something :)
<crimsun> let him enjoy his popularity a bit.
<nixternal> hehe
<nixternal> I am going to do what crimsun never does
* nixternal beds
<crimsun> it sure beats coming back to several hundred messages in one's awaylog all filled with alsa or sound or whatever gripes.
<StevenK> Fujitsu: How bad?
<persia> StevenK: One can barely understand it.
<Fujitsu> Some bits seem to be reversed, but there's one guy really close to the microphone that I can understand well.
<Fujitsu> The rest sounds like... well, it's indescribable.
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: which session?
<Fujitsu> Hobbsee: Automated installation thingy, 5005.
<Hobbsee> ahhh
<imbrandon> what timezone are the sessions?
<Fujitsu> imbrandon: +2
<Hobbsee> spain local, i think
<imbrandon> eg is it 950-1045 now?
<Hobbsee> yep
<imbrandon> k
<StevenK> Hrm. Can anyone remember a site that you put something in the URL and it ends insulting that thing?
* StevenK feels he isn't being very clear.
<harrisony> um
<harrisony> @insult StevenK 
* harrisony hopes it works
<StevenK> Didn't seem to.
<\sh> who wrote the wine spec on gobby? siretart?
<StevenK> An example is say, http://warty.sucks.com/ and the webpage loads with "Warty really sucks" or something like that.
<lfittl> \sh, yep siretart and smurf during a BoF session
<\sh> lfittl, ah ok
<\sh> siretart, ping I added some things to it...please have a look...quite important
<siretart> \sh: we wrote it yesterday in the bof
<siretart> \sh: there are no changes to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/WineGutsySpec - what changes are you talking about?
<siretart> \sh: did you contact Scott about the wine spec? he added a note to the whiteboard that he had some comments about that
<lfittl> siretart, he added stuff in gobby, not in the wiki
<siretart> oh
<\sh> siretart, hehe...I'm using gobby ;)
<\sh> and yes, cfengine is not nice, when it comes to renew a deployment of a server which was already there :(
<\sh> hmm...I'll add my blabla to the wiki page
<Burgundavia> \sh: do you use puppet?
<\sh> BugMaN, puppet? you mean as a replacement for cfengine? no, right now we are working on something similar to RHNetwork...but not distro specific 
<\sh> aeh Burgundavia 
<\sh> Burgundavia, it will be a deployment tool and a configuration management 
<BugMaN> BugMaN: ??
<siretart> \sh: now I have had a look at your wine notes
<siretart> \sh: I reordered your comments abit.
<siretart> \sh: your remarks about apport is a bit out of scope of the spec, I think. - they are of course useful and we should probably do that, but that doesn't concern too much how we should handle wine in the gutsy release cycle
<siretart> \sh: see also the 'scope' part
* TheMuso decides to trawl uus.
<persia> TheMuso: please consider wxwidgets2.6 for sooperlooper and trustedqsl in the process :)
<TheMuso> persia: Thanks for the heads up.
<pochu> amule is shipping a debian/ dir since today :/
<harrisony> woo
<pochu> slomo: did you get my mail? :)
<slomo> pochu: yep but what's the url of the new upstream version again? :)
<pochu> slomo: http://emilio.pozuelo.org/deb/ :)
<slomo> pochu: thanks, i'll take a look
<pochu> cool, thank you!
<TheMuso> Evening RAOF.
<Q-FUNK> is everyone still in Sevilla today?
<shawarma> Yes.
<Hobbsee> yep
<Hobbsee> will be for more days
<Hobbsee> MOTU session tomorrow - if youv'e got stuff about that, or MOTU mentoring, ti'd be great if you could email me, or the motu ML about it.
* TheMuso hopes its early in the evening here, so listening in is possible.
<Q-FUNK> Hobbsee: are you there yourself?
<Hobbsee> Q-FUNK: yep
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: i think it is, actually.  http://people.ubuntu.com/~cjwatson/uds-sevilla/schedule.html
<Q-FUNK> Hobbsee: can you please ask magicfab to check his e-mail, if you see him?
<Hobbsee> um, sure
<TheMuso> Sweet.
<Q-FUNK> thanks! :)
<Hobbsee> havent seen him today, iirc
<Hobbsee> was talking to him yesterday though
<Hobbsee> Q-FUNK: what was teh name / subject of the email?
* StevenK wonders what was wrong with the pizza he had for dinner, and attempts to settle his stomach.
<Lutin> StevenK: thanks for reporting the issues, I'm looking into it
<StevenK> Lutin: No problem!
<Lutin> StevenK: what are the wrong files ?
<StevenK> Lutin: If you try and grab-merge clanlib, it can't find clanlib_0.6.5.tar.gz
<StevenK> Whereas it's really clanlib_0.6.5-1.orig.tar.gz
<StevenK> Lutin: That's from memory, I might have the filenames a little wrong.
<Lutin> StevenK: seems that it's been fixed on our new server, though it's not fully ready yet. maybe I fixed it but it didn't get properly updated
<StevenK> Lutin: The REPORT looks different?
<Lutin> StevenK: could you check another REPORT file to see if the filenames sound good ? I /notice you the url
<StevenK> Lutin: Certainly.
<StevenK> Lutin: Looks fine.
<Lutin> StevenK: cool :)
<Lutin> StevenK: maybe for this one you can use this new server, universe is ready iirc. main is on its way ;)
<StevenK> Lutin: That's the first problem with DaD I've noticed...
<Lutin> StevenK: good to hear :) . thanks again for reporting it
* proppy hugs dholbach
<TheMuso> Looks like all packages that go into gutsy will FTBFS on anything other than I386/AMD64.
<TheMuso> This should be resolved once the new jack is autosynced.
<TheMuso> that depend on jack-audio-connection-kit
<persia> TheMuso: I'd love to fix that.  You don't happen to have a PPC around, do you?
<TheMuso> persia: Its being fixed up stream.
<TheMuso> persia: Once the new jack is in, we can ak for packages to be given back. i.e rebuilt.
<TheMuso> persia: What package anyway?
<persia> TheMuso: Thanks.  I'll go check the website again.
<TheMuso> persia: And I do have a ppc.
<persia> TheMuso: Jack.  There'S a new 103-3 that works, but it has a problem compiling for PPC and IA64.  I was hoping to get the config.log from a failed build to track it down.  Apparently, gcc cannot create binaries :(
<persia> TheMuso: It compiled in Debian fine, so it's something with our toolchain.
<TheMuso> persia: Yep, and as I said, upstream i.e debian knows about it, and a fix is in the works.
<TheMuso> Its got to do with i386 specific optimization flags being used.
<TheMuso> On arches that don't support that.
* StevenK scoffs.
<persia> TheMuso: Odd.  It compiled fine for Debian.  I'll go check Debian sources again...
<marseillai_> hi! anyone to take a look at that : http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5054 it's smplayer 
<marseillai_> ??
<persia> TheMuso: Thanks.  I guess we're waiting for 3.1.
<TheMuso> persia: Indeed.
* StevenK sternly asks his stomach if it's going to behave now.
<TheMuso> StevenK: SOunds like a bad pizza.
<StevenK> Yeah, but what about the pizza is what I'm more concerned about.
<TheMuso> marseillai_: I am looking at it now.
<marseillai_> TheMuso: gpocentek too
<marseillai_> thanks
<TheMuso> StevenK: heh yeah.
<\sh> siretart, thx for resorting them :)
<gnomefreak> running dpkg-buildpackage -S -sa -vVERSION# needs root or fakeroot?
<harrisony> fakeroot 
<harrisony> i think
<persia> gnomefreak: Yes.
<gnomefreak> so i can just add -rfakeroot to it?
* gnomefreak forgot about that
<gnomefreak> ok thank you its building
<persia> gnomefreak: Either -rkaferoot, or fakeroot dpkg-buildpackage ...
<TheMuso> marseillai_: Why did you remove libqt3-mt-dev from build-depends?
<marseillai_> TheMuso: i'm currently testing debian/rules without configure-stamp and i'll  reupload but i've remove it because libkde4 depends on libqt3
<TheMuso> marseillai_: Ok.
<marseillai_> TheMuso: and thanks for your revu
<marseillai_> :)
<TheMuso> marseillai_: You're welcome.
<DarkSun88> Hi Motu's
<persia> DktrKranz: Did you have a chance to test audacity?
<DktrKranz> hi persia
<DktrKranz> I compiled it correctly and prepared VM
<DktrKranz> now you should tell me how to proceed, I'm not confortable with JACK :)
<persia> DktrKranz: Ah.  Does ALSA work in your VM?
<DktrKranz> yep
<DktrKranz> I played an ogg file without worries
<gnomefreak> once its built i use dput *.source.changes revu?
<\sh> DktrKranz, please have a look at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/galago-daemon/+bug/112573
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 112573 in galago-daemon "Please merge galago-daemon 0.5.1-1 from Debian" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  
<StevenK> dput revu <changes>
<marseillai_> TheMuso: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5063 all should be fix
<gnomefreak> StevenK: ok ill try it
<DktrKranz> \sh, I will. thanks
<TheMuso> marseillai_: Ok one moment.
<marseillai_> oki np
<\sh> DktrKranz, you have to use the source packages from ubuntu and fiddle the changes from debian in ,)
<DktrKranz> ok
<\sh> DktrKranz, because our tar.gz is (IMHO) different from debians...(you can read it from the -0ubuntu1 revision number) so it was uploaded first to ubuntu then afterwards to debian
<DktrKranz> I'm going at it later this evening (if i get out of office in time)
<\sh> DktrKranz, hehe :) just scratching over your mail :) doing it while I'm in the office ;)
<DktrKranz> lunch time here
<\sh> here too...just had a dner ,)
<DktrKranz> my boss is going to kill me if I package during business time :P
<geser> ScottK: it was too late yesterday when I got home, but I'm uploading pythoncad now
<ScottK> geser: Great.  crimsun blessed adding that fix to a pending SRU for pythoncad in Feisty, so once you're good, I'll go do that one.  
<geser> ScottK: uploaded
<ScottK> geser: Thanks.
<DktrKranz> see you
<persia> That's the fastest I've yet seen a bug reported, patched by a contributor, and uploaded.  Thanks eolo999, ScottK and geser :)
<ScottK> eolo999 is in the midst of moving, so you might mention it to him when he gets back.  It was his first upload.
<bluekuja> hello guys, a question...all source files must be tagged by a copyright line to be approved?
<bluekuja> or it's important only debian/copyright informations
<bluekuja> about copyright holder, year etc
<persia> bluekuja: It depends on the license, but it's best if all the sources are tagged, and there is a LICENSE.txt somewhere.
<bluekuja> GPL licensed
<geser> bluekuja: better put a copyright into each file. this makes it obvious how each file is licenced
<ScottK> bluekuja: I'd look at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/CommonPackagingMistakes/DebianCopyright and https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/Packaging/Tips?action=show&redirect=PackagingTips#head-84cf4ff980c600210856eb59a3d1b05b5e6c31e9
<marseillai_> thanks TheMuso ! :)
<bluekuja> geser, Scottk: tnx
<ScottK> Does bug #113058 get rejected because real emacs users don't need documentation?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 113058 in emacs21 "documentation missing in feisty" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/113058
<_Enchained> hi
<_Enchained> I put a package in build-deps, it's in repos but when I build, it doesn't find it ...
<_Enchained> what's the problem?
<ScottK> What error do you get?
<_Enchained> E: Couldn't find package libshhopt1-dev
<Hobbsee> _Enchained: which arch?
<_Enchained> 386
<Hobbsee> _Enchained: oh.  you've not enabled universe in the pbuilder, i expect
<_Enchained> I checked and it's enabled
<Hobbsee> chroot, or pbuilder?
<_Enchained> pbuilder
<_Enchained> I check again for universe ...
<_Enchained> because I can get the sources with apt-get source
<StevenK> pbuilder has it's own sources.list
<_Enchained> COMPONENTS="main restricted universe multiverse" in my .pbuilderrc
<_Enchained> it should be good
<Hobbsee> did you add that before or after creating the tarball?
<_Enchained> before, I done a update --override-config to be sure
<_Enchained> and it's the same
<StevenK> pbuilder login and look at the /etc/apt/sources.list
<geser> if you login into your pbuilder, can you install it?
<_Enchained> I check..
<_Enchained> no
<_Enchained> and the sources.list is not ok :s
<_Enchained> there is no universe into
<TheMuso> Night folks.
<pochu> night TheMuso
<Hobbsee> night TheMuso 
<lionel> I am starting to merge asterisk package. Debian fork the changelog file when they begin to package asterisk 1.4. That means that there is no in the changelog all the 1.2 relases after that :(. Should I do the same and get rid of all the Ubuntu version since last october?
<persia> hey bddebian
<ScottK> lionel: Does the asterisk 1.4 package have a different name than the old one?
<lionel> no, it is still called "asterisk"
<bddebian> Heya gang
<bddebian> Hi persia
<lionel> hey bddebian
<ScottK> Heya bddebian
<Hobbsee> hi bddebian 
<bddebian> Hi lionel, ScottK, Hobbsee :)
<ScottK> lionel: I'm really not sure what the right answer is on that.  I'd be inclined to keep all the changelog history and then file a bug against the debian package for losing part of the changelog.  Anyone else?
<StevenK> It isn't installed as changelog.old or something?
<lionel> I am not happy on the idea to maintain a changelog merge on Ubuntu and Debian changes
<lionel> no it is not
<lionel> It is a real fork :-(
<Hobbsee> lionel: you should be using merge-o-matic or equivalent for that
<lionel> Hobsee: it is not only Ubuntu changes, hte changelog is also missing all the Debian releases since last october
<lionel> http://packages.debian.org/changelogs/pool/main/a/asterisk/current/changelog for current version in Debian
<lionel> http://changelogs.ubuntu.com/changelogs/pool/universe/a/asterisk/asterisk_1.2.16~dfsg-1ubuntu3/changelog for current version in Ubuntu
<StevenK> lionel: I think I'd merge all of the changelog entries back for this release, and file a nastygram on the Debian package for deleting history.
<lionel> Ok, let's do that so
<lionel> thanks for your comments
* Hobbsee curses over the script which she's lost again
<Hobbsee> oh, found it
<afflux> what to do if the debian package that has to be merged had no changes since the last merge (only a new maintainer)?
<Hobbsee> afflux: then add the new maintainer into the merge
<afflux> hm, k
<slomo> pochu: ping?
<slomo> pochu: please also take a diff of your 1.2.14 package and the debian 1.2.7 package (err, diff of the debian directories) and try to keep the diff as small as possible (i.e. reorder build dependencies, update copyright, package descriptions, etc)
<slomo> pochu: oh and the new debian changelog entries...
<slomo> pochu: and in your latest changelog entry you say: "* Merge with Debian, remaining Ubuntu changes:" and then list ALL ubuntu changes that are not in the debian package
<slomo> pochu: other than that good work :)
<pochu> slomo: ok, will do :)
<slomo> thanks :)
<pochu> this will be my first merge :-)
* Hobbsee pokes 
<Hobbsee>  \sh: 
* \sh pongs
<alg> Hi guys. Will the respected admins help me with re-syncing the REVU uploaders keyring? I've registered my key on Friday.
<\sh> Hobbsee, what can I do for you? :)
<Hobbsee> \sh: remind me of merging policy please?  the part about not stealing other's merges for a while?
<\sh> Hobbsee, oh, well, I just did a couple of packages ... during the weekend...
<Hobbsee> \sh: right.  which i've now duplicated, and this is bad.
<Hobbsee> \sh: i believe you could steal dholbach's, if you wish
<Hobbsee> or anybody we havent seen in a while
* \sh just went most of the time down the list..from top...and then go back to the top...:( leaving most of the time the packages with -0ubuntuX revs
<alg> So no help with re-syncing of the REVU keyring? Do I need to write an official letter?
<Hobbsee> alg: oh sure, no problem
<Hobbsee> alg: didnt see your question
<alg> Hobbsee: Oh, ok. Thanks!
<alg> Hobbsee: Please say when, ok?
<Hobbsee> alg: a lot of people who have access are at the developer summit - and arent actually at their keyboard
<Hobbsee> yep, sure
<alg> Hobbsee: what summit, btw?
<pochu> Sevilla uds
<geser> Ubuntu Developer Summit
<alg> yup, got it. (https://launchpad.net/sprints/uds-sevilla)
<Hobbsee> yep :)
* Hobbsee should really go and get power
<alg> :)
<Hobbsee>      Battery 1: discharging, 7%, 00:14:45 remaining
<Hobbsee>      Thermal 1: ok, 43.0 degrees C
<Hobbsee>   AC Adapter 1: off-line
<Hobbsee> bah.  long enough
<pochu> are there some photos anywhere?
<pochu> I've seen a few, but not enough :-)
<Hobbsee> i've only seen 2 lots
<Hobbsee> i think people are only updated today
<pochu> Hobbsee: don't you have a camera?
<cypherbios> hey folks. Anyone knows why I'm getting this warning ? : 'dpkg-genchanges: warning: unknown information field `Xb-Python-Version' in input data in package's section of control info file'?
<cypherbios> Is the XB-Python-Version field unrecognized by the Standards-Version 3.7.2.2?
<Hobbsee> pochu: sure.  it's up near my power cable
<Hobbsee> cypherbios: dpkg doesnt recognise it, it seems
<Hobbsee> i'd say so
<pochu> Hobbsee: then upload them! :)
<Hobbsee> pochu: so how am i supposed to upload non-existant pictures/A
<Hobbsee> we went to see a castle last night
<pochu> lol :)
<persia> cypherbios: 'Xb' vs. 'XB' maybe?
<alg> :)
<Hobbsee> pochu: x/xserver-xorg-video-intel/
<pochu> you could take your camera to the alcazar :)
<Hobbsee> oops
<cypherbios> persia: in the debian/control I have XB-
<jekil> hello
<Hobbsee> pochu: http://err.no/pictures/2007-05-07/
<Hobbsee> (mithrandir's)
<pochu> that's better :)
<cypherbios> persia: XB-Python-Version: ${python:Versions}
<pochu> Hobbsee: and yes, i'm using the intel driver ;)
<persia> cypherbios: I don't know then.  Sorry.
<cypherbios> persia: it's ok. thanks
<alg> Hobbsee: very nice indeed
<Hobbsee> pochu: yes - i was looking at merging it
* Hobbsee keeps waiting
<alg> Hobbsee: I have to run. How long does it usually take to update the keys?
<cypherbios> persia: I found
<cypherbios> persia: Add an "XB-Python-Version: ${python:Versions}" field to each binary package in the debian/control file ("XB-" is not a variable, its literal, it is needed so dpkg-gencontrol will know that it's a unusual field and that it should keep it)
<cypherbios> source: http://wiki.debian.org/DebianPython/NewPolicy
<shawarma> cypherbios: It's fine. Just leave it.
<persia> cypherbios: Then you're doing the right thing.  Ignore the warning.
<cypherbios> OK. Thank you folks
<shawarma> cypherbios: It's just warning you because it doesn't know the field, but it's not supposed to.
<alg> have a nice day, everyone! ttyl
<highvoltage> win 29
<Hobbsee> bah.  it just finished.
<\sh> bah...I'm fcked
<sharms> nixternal: help pimp my spec!
<sharms> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Spec/EnhancedBash
<\sh> help ! pimp my dapper kernel towards seeing my raid6 device on an MSA60 storage *grmpf*
<sharms> We could make a pimp alliance: I will pimp yours if you pimp mine :)
<Q-FUNK> who gets to pimp hoora_ ?  *grin*
<ScottK> crimsun: When you have a minute...  I've updated the feisty-proposed version of pythoncad to fix Bug #112140 and revert the maintainer change as we discussed on IRC last night.  Debdiff is attached to that bug.  I'd appreciate it if you would confirm the Feisty task for that bug and review/upload the new fix.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 112140 in pythoncad "pythoncad fails to exit when all windows are closed" [Medium,Fix released]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/112140
<ScottK> Also adjusted versioning to conform with pitti's last mail on SRU versioning.
* ScottK hopes he reads the scrollback...
<geser> ScottK: what was the reason for not changing the Maintainer field?
<geser> just curious
<ScottK> geser: Crimsun said not to do if for an SRU.  
<ScottK> ..  not to do it for ..
<ScottK> geser: For Dapper/Edgy SRU pitti has told me not to change it because the tool chains for those releases haven't been tested with the maintainer changes.  Not sure of why crimsun said not to do if for Feisty.
<afflux> If I merge a package without any debhelper-compat-version, should I set it, and if so, to which value?
<geser> we usually try to keep the delta small
<afflux> so I should leave it?
<afflux> (any dh_ app complains, thats why I'm asking)
<geser> the change of the debhelper-compat-version isn't large but it may require additional changes as the package excepts the old debhelper behaviour
<geser> try it
<afflux> It build good with my pbuilder, I'll just debdiff the debs
<geser> if it doesn't cause any problems you might leave it in
<ScottK> I'd ask yourself if it's an issue (as in this case) that isn't driven by some about Ubuntu that's different than Debian, then is it a big enough issue to file a bug report against the package in BTS.  If it's not, ask yourself again if you think you really need it.  If it is, don't forget to file the bug report too.
<afflux> Well... It didn't work... I'll leave it, since the messages from debhelper are only warnings...
<xxxxx1> hi all
<lionel> hi xxxxx1
<bddebian> Hello xxxxx1
<proppy> is the feisty stock kernel vserver enabled ?
<zul> no
<sladen> proppy: no
<proppy> ok thanks :)
<ant30> Hi all, I proposed two blueprint on launchpad, about network-manager and the other bluetooth about (excuse me for my bad english)
<ant30> Are there any person on UDS?
<ScottK> ant30: #uds-sevilla
<ant30> sorry, the unique channel name that I haven't check
<ant30> thanks ScottK 
<crimsun> ScottK: err on the side of the minimal necessary fix
<crimsun> ScottK: looking now.
<ScottK> crimsun: Thanks.
<ScottK> geser: ^^^
<crimsun> ScottK: which bug # is it?
<ScottK> getting...
<crimsun> either I'm blind, or I can't find it in pythoncad
<ScottK> Bug #112140
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 112140 in pythoncad "pythoncad fails to exit when all windows are closed" [Medium,Fix released]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/112140
<ScottK> It's already marked fix released because it's fixed in Gutsy.
<crimsun> argh
<crimsun> I didn't change the filter under Advanced
* ScottK is glad that wasn't argh ScottK messed that one up....
<\sh> re
<crimsun> ScottK: oh sorry, I hadn't realized you had already made the maintainerfield change in ~proposed1
<ScottK> crimsun: How should I proceed?  Reverting the maintainer field change leaves as with the least invasive change when we release it to updates...
* \sh 's patching gnome-ppp to know about nozomi umts pcmcia devices
<crimsun> ScottK: it's fine as is, uploaded.
<ScottK> crimsun: Thanks.
<ScottK> Time to get it tested then...
<ScottK> crimsun: I think something is wrong with the sparc buildds.  They've been building the same packages for days.  Just restarted over night with the same packages again.  I was wondering if you'd have a look and see if I'm misunderstanding before I bug MIthrandir?
<crimsun> link?
<ScottK> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/gutsy/+builds?build_state=building&build_text=
<ScottK> https://launchpad.net/+builds/sejong/+history?build_state=all&build_text=lyx
<crimsun> I don't know how often it's snapshotted, but it seems to be ... proceeding
<crimsun> ping mith in the morning, I think
<ScottK> crimsun: OK.  Will do. 
<\sh> grmpf
<\sh> why is gnome-ppp not working as kppp...
<\sh> crap
<\sh> looks like, that I have to rewrite it or make it working
<\sh> wvdial is crap
<dothebart> hm, how do i add a contributor to a project over at launchpad?
<\sh> brb
<slomo> pochu: any progress with liferea? :)
<pochu> slomo: I'm doing it ATM, and have a couple of questions :)
<\sh> grmpf
<pochu> should I merge the changelog?
<slomo> pochu: cool, feel free to ask :)
<\sh> does anybody know, if network-manager is supporting modems or modem devices (latest sourcetree)?
<slomo> yes
<slomo> \sh: afaik it doesn't
<\sh> slomo, hmm...just because the "interfaces" method is not nice...and gnome-ppp is just crap
<pochu> slomo: how? should I remove all the Ubuntu entries, and take the debian ones?
<slomo> pochu: no, insert the debian ones at the correct places
<pochu> ah, ok
<pochu> slomo: also, debian is shipping debian/README.debian, (which says that the gtkhtml engine has been removed, and they only ships now the xulrunner engine). Should we also ship it?
<slomo> yeah but s/xulrunner/firefox/ or something so it makes sense :)
<pochu> yeah :)
<\sh> sladen, it should support modems, regarding upstream changelog from 2006-04-06 by rlove ;)
<pochu> \sh: do you mean slomo? ;)
<\sh> aeh yes
<\sh> slomo
<pochu> slomo: what's liferea-lua? (liferea replaces it)
<AlinuxOS> hello, maybe someone knows where is locobot_3's guide ?
<AlinuxOS> for manage #ubuntu-ge channel.
<pochu> AlinuxOS: ask smurf at #ubuntu-locoteams
<pochu> I think he runs it
<AlinuxOS> pochu, thanks
<pochu> np
<\sh> hmmm..suse does run networkmanager and modems...lets have a look at their patches
<sladen> hello krissie
<Lutin> geser: sorry, I just uploaded plplot
<gnomefreak> can someone look at this and comment so i can read it later and fix it as needed or you can always ack it ;) http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5064
<bddebian> gnomefreak: iceape? Are you on crack? :-)
<geser> gnomefreak: why are you using the iceape name? afaik Ubuntu can use seamonkey
<geser> and why is this a native package?
<pochu> maybe it's for the new-full-free-ubuntu-derivative :)
<geser> Lutin: np, could you update bug #113118 and assign it to you?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 113118 in plplot "[Merge]  plplot 5.6.1-11ubuntu1" [Undecided,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/113118
<nomin> are there any developers in here that would be interested in packaging qjoypad?  It's a program that let's you emulate the mouse and keyboard with a joystick.  there is no program in the ubuntu repos that do this and the developer of qjoypad isn't working on it anymore.
<bddebian> nomin: File a packaging request bug on Launchpad
<Lutin> geser: sure
<gnomefreak> geser: asac and i decided to use iceape
<\sh> hmmm...how could I tell network-manager to reload it's configuration ?
<\sh> i mean to reread everything?
<giskard> dbus reload?
<Kmos> gnomefreak: http://revu.tauware.de/revu1-incoming/iceape-0705070840/lintian -> fix these ones first
<geser> \sh: /etc/dbus-1/event.d/ and call the n-m file with restart?
<gnomefreak> Kmos: if i do it locally can i just upload again?
<\sh> geser, well, and from an application? let's say g-n-s?
<\sh> geser, situation: I just added a dial-up connection with system/admin/network and I want NM to reload and catching up with the latest config from /e/n/i
<Kmos> gnomefreak: many times you want..
<gnomefreak> Kmos: ok ty
<gnomefreak> Kmos: thank you ill work on them tonight depending on time i get done here
<geser> \sh: sorry, don't know.
<Kmos> gnomefreak: Standards-Version: 3.7.2.2 -> you can use just 3.7.2
* \sh needs to read the dbus doc
<Kmos> gnomefreak: after you have it fixed.. just dput revu *.dsc
<gnomefreak> Kmos: k
<Kmos> and it will appear there with a new date and time, like a new package
<Kmos> gnomefreak: change debhelper (>= 5.0.0) to 5.0.38
<gnomefreak> k
<Kmos> you can do it with vim :)
<geser> gnomefreak: don't forget to make it a non-native package
<Kmos> and test it with pbuilder, to see if the patches are applied
<slomo> pochu: re... liferea-lua had the lua plugin for a short period of time... just drop the Replaces, it was in no release
<gnomefreak> You've specified an unknown `target distribution' for your upload in
<gnomefreak> N:   the debian/changelog file.
<gnomefreak> i did so!!!
<gnomefreak> iceape (1.1.1+1-0ubuntu1) gutsy; urgency=low
<DarkSun88> \sh: Hi, can you so kind to check this merge? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/kile/+bug/110779
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 110779 in kile "Please merge kile 1.9.3-2 from Debian unstable" [Undecided,Confirmed]  
<pochu> slomo: ok. Also, you added libxt-dev as a build-dep, and removed dbus-1-utils from liferea depends, do I keep that?
<slomo> pochu: yes, first is required for session managment stuff, second is absolutely useless, especially as dbus-1-utils doesn't contain anything useful anymore
<pochu> ok, I think I just need to merge the changelog now and I'm done :)
<slomo> cool
<Kmos> gnomefreak: maybe it don't like +1-0
<gnomefreak> k ill yell at asac when i see him about that since he told me to use that versioning
<\sh> DarkSun88, send me an email please, I'll check tomorrow morning when I'm in the office..:) 
<slomo> gnomefreak: that version is correct, your lintian is just too old for gutsy ;)
<xxxxx1> gnomefreak: you can ignore these lintian warn
<gnomefreak> maybe i should install it first :(
<Kmos> xxxxx1: not the .bzr one
<xxxxx1> gutsy?
<Kmos> xxxxx1: delete .bzr directory
<gnomefreak> lintian is not installed i thought it was grabbed by another package i got
<gnomefreak> xxxxx1: yes
<gnomefreak> bzr is gone
<xxxxx1> gnomefreak: you don't need, but you can create one with pbuilder
<xxxxx1> (gutsy distro)
<xxxxx1> gnomefreak: just ignore this warn, lintian is not updated
<DarkSun88> \sh: Yesterday I had sended mail to you with the packages which must be uploaded.
<Kmos> DarkSun88: sended or sent
<Kmos> hehe
<DarkSun88> Right, sorry :D
<Kmos> it happens to all of us :)
<Kmos> my first language isn't english too :)
<\sh> DarkSun88, ah...yeah..have it on my todo...was too busy today :( just finished 2 sponsorings :(
<DarkSun88> \sh: Don't worry. :)
<\sh> brb
<DarkSun88> \sh: Tomorrow you check it?
<DarkSun88> check you* :D
<pochu> hey folks: If I have to merge the changelogs, how do I do that? do I just insert the debian entries in the right places, or do I also remove the ubuntu ones?
<DktrKranz> pochu, you have to inser ubuntu changelog entries in the correct order
<DktrKranz> *insert
<ScottK> pochu: If you use grab-merge it'll do that for you.
<TheMuso> Hey MOTUs.
<DktrKranz> hi TheMuso
<DktrKranz> are you in Spain?
<TheMuso> No.
<ScottK> Hey TheMuso
<Lutin> hey TheMuso 
<TheMuso> Hey ScottK.
<TheMuso> Hey Lutin.
<pochu> hi TheMuso 
<TheMuso> Hey pochu.
<marcin_ant> hi guys
<marcin_ant> I found a bug in dbconfig-common package but unfortunately cannot create patch to fix this bug
<marcin_ant> is there anyone that could help me with that?
<DktrKranz> marcin_ant, try to expose your problem
<DktrKranz> you will surely find someone able to help you :)
<marcin_ant> DktrKranz: problem is that dbconfig-common doesn't create database during package installation
<marcin_ant> DktrKranz: for example if someone want's to install package cacti
<marcin_ant> DktrKranz: then dbconfig-common fails to create empty database named 'cacti' for this application
<marcin_ant> DktrKranz: user can manually create this database and if an empty database 'cacti' exists then package installation procedure is successfull
<marcin_ant> DktrKranz: I identified where is a problem.
<marcin_ant> Problem is that dbconfig-common cannot create database user for cacti
<DktrKranz> probably this is a cacti problem
<DktrKranz> nor dbconfig-common
<DktrKranz> *not
<marcin_ant> and bug is in file /usr/share/dbconfig-common/internal/mysql
<marcin_ant> and function named dbc_mysql_createuser
<marcin_ant> DktrKranz: no it's not cacti problem because even scripts from dbconfig-common examples doesn't work properly
<marcin_ant> DktrKranz: and all dbconfig-common packages are affected
<DktrKranz> go on
<marcin_ant> in dbc_mysql_createuser function in line 271 there is dbc_mysql_exec_file
<marcin_ant> that is just not called at all
<marcin_ant> we got if/else in line 266 
<marcin_ant> and if we don't have user (and we really don't have when this function is called for first time)
<marcin_ant> then else should be executed and should run:
<marcin_ant> _dbc_nodb="yes" dbc_mysql_exec_file "$l_sqlfile"
<marcin_ant> and this line is just ignored
<marcin_ant> I changed this part to something like this:
<marcin_ant> if _dbc_nodb="yes" dbc_mysql_exec_file .........
<Kmos> marcin_ant: and why you can't create a patch?
<Kmos> don't know how to use diff?
<marcin_ant> Kmos: because I don't know how to write this patch properly?
<Kmos> not a coder :)
<marcin_ant> kind of...
<marcin_ant> this dbconfig-common script is just a little too complicated
<DktrKranz> marcin_ant, you should file an new bug report
<DktrKranz> providing all the information you just supplied
<marcin_ant> DktrKranz: well right but I hoped that maybe here I will find someone that with all these informations will provide easy patch for this
<marcin_ant> DktrKranz: It's propably very trivial
<DktrKranz> probably, maybe it's just a one-liner
<marcin_ant> DktrKranz: and while I added "if" to this line (where in my opinion is bug)
<DktrKranz> but that could help someone else, so it should be shared
<marcin_ant> DktrKranz: sure but we can create patch here and file bug report with patch inside
<pochu> where can I find grab-merge? :)
<DktrKranz> that can be done in a later time
<DktrKranz> pochu, http://adrishost.homeip.net/DaD/grab-merge.sh
<marcin_ant> DktrKranz: anyway if we add "if" to this line then this script can add user
<pochu> DktrKranz: thanks
<DktrKranz> np :)
<marcin_ant> but then I got message that there is no database selected, so it's not 100% solution
<Lutin> xxxxx1: 
<Lutin> err. sorry
<marcin_ant> I don't have time and skills to analyze all this dbonfig-common code
<DktrKranz> I'll give it a try
<DktrKranz> I'm not familiar with dbconfig, but I can look at it briefly
<marcin_ant> DktrKranz: in /usr/share/doc/dbconfig-common/examples there is db-test-mysql-2.1 sample package
<marcin_ant> DktrKranz: this package is good for development (it's also usefull to uncomment "set -x" in /usr/share/dbconfig-common/dpkg/common
<DktrKranz> ok
#ubuntu-motu 2007-05-08
<toodles> hello motus! Would one of you masters know, when building a deb package, what this error means: "dpkg-buildpackage: source version without epoch"?
<TheMuso> We would need to know the package you are trying to build, and the history of its version number.
<toodles> I'm building my own package, or at least trying to.
<TheMuso> Is it a package that is not yet in Ubuntu/Debian/
<toodles> yes
<toodles> I've created a little python program that I wanted to make into a deb for ubuntu/debial
<TheMuso> Ok, what version number do you have in the changelog?
<toodles> The package builds if I specify a "Source:" tag in the debian/control file. If I remove that, then I get the above error.
<pochu> slomo: finished! :-)
<toodles> 1 sec
<toodles> smspie (0.2.2ubuntu1) feisty; urgency=low
<slomo> pochu: nice :)
<TheMuso> toodles: How did you create the debian packaging?
<TheMuso> toodles: That should be 0.2.2-0ubuntu1
<toodles> TheMuso: ok, I'll fix that. To answer your question, I looked at a few packages to see how they were made, read some documentation and then used dpkg-buildpackage to create my debs.
<pochu> slomo: http://emilio.pozuelo.org/deb/ : there are 2 diffs: one with debian (so you see the changes are minimal!) and the other with 1.2.13-0ubuntu2 (so you see the real changes)
<TheMuso> toodles: Ok.
<TheMuso> toodles: Have you looked into dh_make?
<slomo> pochu: thanks, i'll look at it later after fixing something else and then upload :)
<TheMuso> That can help you get a lot of stuff done straight away with one command
<toodles> TheMuso: cool, thank you :-) ,  I'll look into it.
<toodles> That error I mentioned though, that doesn't have any particular meaning?
<Fujitsu> It's not an error.
<Fujitsu> It's simply information.
<toodles> Oh?
<toodles> ah
<toodles> ok, I know I've still a LOT of learning ahead of me :-) ,  thank you
<pochu> slomo: please let me know if I've done any mistake! :) (e.g. I removed dh_iconcache, I think after reading the man page, that we don't need it, but I may be wrong) :-)
<slomo> pochu: we need it ;)
<pochu> oh :/
<slomo> because of /usr/share/icons/hicolor/48x48/apps/liferea.png
<pochu> and doesn't debian need it?
<slomo> debian doesn't have it yet unfortunately#
<pochu> oh, then we can file a bug :)
<pochu> otherwise, I hope the other changes are fine! ;)
<pochu> slomo: I'm off to bed, please let me know any mistakes I may done :) you have my mail in the changelog ;)
<pochu> night everybody!
<slomo> no reason to file a bug, they're aware of it
<slomo> did you update the package with dh_iconcache?
<TheMuso> Night pochu.
<slomo> gn8 pochu :)
<pochu> slomo: no, but I can do it in a second
<slomo> pochu: please do it then :)
<pochu> done :)
<pochu> I haven't updated the diffs, though, but I don't think they're important ;)
<pochu> Good night slomo, TheMuso!
<illovae> hello
<TheMuso> Hi illovae 
<illovae> hi TheMuso :)
<jmg> anyone know udev rules? what is wrong with doingKERNEL="xvc0", NAME="xvc0"
<toodles> TheMuso: Can you point me in the right direction with dh_make? After I use it to get my package setup, what should I use to build it?
<Fujitsu> toodles: dpkg-buildpackage, or debuild
<toodles> Fujitsu: thanks - any preferences?
<bddebian> Heya gang
<persia> Hi bddebian
<bddebian> Hi persia
<RAOF> Hey bddebian, persia.
<bddebian> Hello RAOF
<persia> Hi RAOF
<bddebian> persia: Fixed all the wx packages already? :-)
<persia> bddebian: Nope.  Still working on freqtweak now: somehow I introduced a crash :(.  Three are done, and another just waits for a new python-support though, so it's not all bad.
<RAOF> I suppose python-support will get merged after UDS?
<bddebian> You DA MAN
<persia> RAOF: Probably.  Most main people are there.
<persia> bddebian: If you've a bit of time, bug# 111399 is a wx2.4, and kwave still needs help for bug# 111797 (libflac++ transition).
<bddebian> persia: I can't fix anything, haven't you figured that out yet? :)
<persia> bddebian: Not fixing, just uploads, but no worries :)
<bddebian> Oh, ahh
<bddebian> Jesus, REVU is like a perpetual monition machine...
<bddebian> Err motion even
<bddebian> persia: Are you just doing these for gutsy?
<persia> bddebian: I was.  I thought that feisty has a clean libflac++5.  Now I'll go check.
<persia> bddebian: Yep.  In feisty, flac provides libflac++5c2, rather than libflac++5, so there's no need to backport 111797 (just rebuilds, really).
<ScottK> bddebian: I thought it was perpetual admonition.
<bddebian> heh
<ScottK> You've been reviewing up a storm.
<bddebian> And getting no-where :-(   :)
<ScottK> bddebian: Not so.  The packages are getting better.  A few have even gotten uploaded.
<ScottK> Hola jdong.
<jdong> hey scott
<ScottK> jdong: I'm not familiar with the backport timeline.  The spamassassin one was the first I filed.  What's the process now?  How long does it take?
<ScottK> It's Bug 112456
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 112456 in feisty-backports "Backport of spamassassin 3.2.0-ubuntu2" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/112456
<jdong> ScottK: how sure are you of spamassassin? :)
<ScottK> jdong: I'm sure the packaging is good.
<ScottK> I'm sure the dependencies are right.
<ScottK> I've tested the upgrade.
<ScottK> The real question is it's a .0 release.
<jdong> ScottK: sounds good then; I am supposed to be on hiatis but I'll accept this backport :)
<ScottK> They've been testing it quite a while.  I'm confident the parts that relate to another open source project are good.
<ScottK> jdong: Thanks.
<ScottK> that's another open source project I'm involved in.
<jdong> cool
<jdong> accepted and subscribed -archive
<ScottK> Great.
<ScottK> Thanks again.
<ScottK> Wanna do one more that I'm even more confident of becuase I packaged it and I'm one of the upstream maintainers?
<jdong> ScottK: sure, what is it?
<ScottK> jdong: If you're up for it it's Bug 112463
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 112463 in edgy-backports "Backport pyspf-2.0.3-0ubuntu1 from Feisty to Edgy" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/112463
<jdong> ScottK: sounds good, will do
<ScottK> Great.
<ScottK> If you'd just backport python-support 0.2 to Dapper, it could go there too...;-)
<jdong> lol
<jdong> is that safe to do?
<ScottK> Actually I have no idea.  But we ought to look into it I think.
<ScottK> Dapper is going to be around for a long time and bumping them from python-support 0.1 to 0.2 would open up a LOT of possibilities.
<persia> Testing would involve recompile of just a few apps to avoid FTBFS...
<ScottK> Bumping them all the way to the current version would be kind of scary.
<ScottK> We should ask doko about it when he's not busy at UDS.
<minghua> we are still doing edgy backports?
<persia> minghua: 18 months...
<minghua> persia: true, but I really doubt many people still using edgy would fancy the idea of backported packages
<minghua> -security, sure; -updates, maybe, but -backports...
<minghua> anyway, just my personal opinion
<minghua> if there are people willing to work on it, why not
<persia> minghua: You might be right.  Those seeking backports probably upgraded soonest.
<jdong> ScottK: heh I'll put asking about that on my todo list, the next time I see a python deity
<persia> bddebian: Thank you :)
<bddebian> persia: Glad to be of SOME use :_)
<gbutler69> How do I begin the process of becoming an Ubuntu contributer, MOTU, etc?
<RAOF> gbutler69: Start working on something useful :).  Once you've done a bunch of stuff, ask to become a MOTU.
<persia> gbutler69: Find a bug in launchpad, and submit a patch.
<gbutler69> OK. What package would you recommend? What is the highest priority?
<plugwash> look for bugs on packages you have some prior experiance with at least as a user and preferablly with the code of
<RAOF> gbutler69: You could try checking out any of the "mentoring available" bugs in the /topic
<gbutler69> RAOF: What do you mean "/topic"?
<RAOF> You can type /topic to get the channel topic.  Alternatively, just look up at the heading :).
<minghua> gbutler69: type "/topic" and read
<gbutler69> No, I understand about "/topic" in IRC. I meant, how do I find the "Mentoring Available" ones?
<gbutler69> in Launchpad that is...
<synjet> gbutler69: https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-dev/+mentoring
<gbutler69> Ahh...thanks...
<RAOF> Texmacs is ready to be merged (bug #113234) if anyone's looking for something to do :)
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 113234 in texmacs "[MERGE]  Please merge texmacs 1:1.0.6.9-4 from Debian" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/113234
<concept10> Are Launchpad bug reports filed for all packages waiting to be sync'd or merged ?
<ScottK> For anyone in UUS, Bug #113235 is ready for review.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 113235 in pypolicyd-spf "sync request pypolicyd-spf 0.3-1 from Debian Unstable (main)" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/113235
<persia> concept10: Only by the person working on the sync/merge
<concept10> persia, but, does this happen for each and every package?
<dougsko> hi! is there a way to install a package locally as opposed to a system wide install? im trying to install something without superuser privileges. dpkg's options --root, --admindir, and --instdir didnt help any
<RAOF> concept10: We've got a list of packages to be merged/sync'd in the /topic (DaD)
<persia> concept10: Not always, but usually (where a sync/merge is considered)
<concept10> persia, thanks.
<RAOF> dougsko: Interesting question, but I'm pretty sure the answer is "no, you can't".
<RAOF> dougsko: Although you could just extract the contents of the deb with dpkg, and put them in appropriate places.
<gbutler69> How do I look for bugs (high-priority) in Launchpad for Ubuntu 7.04? Those are what I'd like to start with. The mentoring bugs seem a little unfocused at this point.
<dougsko> RAOF: yeah thats all i could really ocme up with, but that just seemed so lame
<TheMuso> RAOF: Wouldn't work if library dependencies had to be unpacked.
<dougsko> TheMuso: if you had the right directories in your $PATH it would
<RAOF> And had LD_LIBRARY_PATH set to the right thigns.
<TheMuso> RAOF: True.
<RAOF> But it's just not a use-case dpkg is interested in.
<TheMuso> dougsko: Yes thats true
<RAOF> Why do you want to do that, anyway?
<dougsko> yeah, you could also get the source package, tear it open, and recompile it with local paths
<dougsko> a friend wanted to install something, but he doesnt have root
<RAOF> Ah.  Source install then.
<minghua> sometimes packages just won't work if you don't install them in the places intended
<minghua> a lot of software hardcode paths at compiling time
<dougsko> wow, i always thought debs pwned all, but this is really disapointing
<dougsko> weak sauce :/ thanks for the input though, guys
<RAOF> Either a compile, or dpkg -x is what you're after.
<RAOF> Or patch dpkg!
<dougsko> heh yeah seriously
<RAOF> What could *possibly* go wrong? :)
<dougsko> hehe
<gbutler69> Is there a way to have launchpad list bugs that are: "Ubuntu 7.04, Confirmed, High Priority" only. That's what I'd like to look at to find bugs to tackle.
<gbutler69> s/only
<gbutler69> s/only./only?/
<gbutler69> As it is "Launchpad" doesn't seem very approachable for finding bugs worth attempting and effort on.
* RAOF hopes you won't find many of those :)
<persia> gbutler69: Take a look at https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.tag=bitesize for something to start with.
<concept10> can you guys close some bugs in my name?
<TheMuso> concept10: You can close bugs yourself.
<concept10> TheMuso, I have reviewed the options, I don't see that. im trying to close: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/flumotion/+bug/86573
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 86573 in flumotion "flumotion 0.2.x won't start with Twisted 2.5" [Medium,Confirmed]  
<TheMuso> concept10: When you mark it as fix released, its closed.
<TheMuso> Or rejected
<concept10> TheMuso, im not a MOTU
<TheMuso> concept10: oh ok. I thought anybody could do that.
<TheMuso> concept10: Does it need to be fix released, or rejected?
<TheMuso> I don't want to touch it.
<TheMuso> It still seems rather open to me.
<concept10> TheMuso, im not 100% sure on fix released.  They say that they have fixed in flumotion 0.4
<TheMuso> Yeah well I'll leave it as is.
<concept10> I hate having bugs open for packages I don't have on my system.
<persia> concept10: Check in #ubuntu-bugs.  I think you might need to join the bugsquad to adjust bug status.
<concept10> TheMuso, persia: thanks
<konam> im having problems with the aMSN package in ubuntu repositories
<konam> when i try to lauch it the terminal prompts "core dumped" or something alike
<konam> ubuntu feisty
<crimsun> there are undoubtedly dozens of such bug reports.  Which one fits yours?
<konam> crimsun me? i don't understand
<konam> is the amsn program, i install it smoothly but when i try to launch it in a terminal the prompt tells me "core dumped" or something alike, I dont know why it is. the dependencys are ok....
<crimsun> konam: right, so which of the ones listed at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/amsn/ fits your symptoms?
* crimsun finds three boxes to test the upcoming NewAlsaStateManagement
<konam> crimsun the mine fits in the "amsn Segmentation fault & core dumped" one
<konam> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/amsn/+bug/110509 crimsun
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 110509 in amsn "amsn Segmentation fault & core dumped" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  
<crimsun> konam: does the trace match precisely?
<konam> yeah
<konam> ohh, theres a trace log, let me see......
<crimsun> what differentiates it from the other "crash" reports?
<konam> crimsun the core dumped thing
<crimsun> konam: err, there are /several/ coredump ones.  What makes you think yours is unique?
<konam> i haven't seen the that trace when i try to launch the amsn, i only see one message
<konam> crimsun how do i see my amsn trace
<konam> ?
<bddebian> crimsun: Is alsa-tools on REVU of interest/concern to you?
<crimsun> bddebian: sure, it's queued.  I need to do 112606 first.
<bddebian> crimsun: No worries, just checking since it is alsa related
<crimsun> as soon as I submit my grades tomorrow, I'm going to start spec'ing NewAlsaStateManagement
<konam> crimsun could be this one too https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/amsn/+bug/46979
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 46979 in amsn "Segmentation fault" [Medium,Needs info]  
<crimsun> konam: right, you need to investigate.
<minghua> bddebian: I saw the new GTK with dh_gtkmodules entered gutsy the other day, just to let you know
<bddebian> minghua: Ah cool, thanks!
<crimsun> did konam just join expecting us to fix his symptom?
<crimsun> I was attempting to walk him through triaging.  Oh well.
<bddebian> Apparently :-)
* TheMuso was going to start packaging secretmaryo, but can't find a license for the music files. Gotta love that.
<bddebian> Is that the Super Mario Brothers knock-off?
<TheMuso> something like that.
<bddebian> Seems like someone tried that once before.. Hmm
<TheMuso> Just felt like starting fresh with a package, for something to do
<TheMuso> bddebian: Really?
<TheMuso> Getdeb have a package, which is in a shocking state.
<bddebian> TheMuso: It sounds familiar but I'm old and senile
<crimsun> mm, yes, debian/alsa-utils.init is definitely not doing the right thing
<ranf> hi
<crimsun> I need to kill the spin, which means killing the initscript's current implementation
<bddebian> Hello ranf
<crimsun> yet another reason for NewAlsaStateManagement!
<TheMuso> crimsun: Fun times.
<crimsun> TheMuso: on gnome-based systems, it's a no-brainer.  Use pulseaudio, which restores state on its own.
<TheMuso> Right.
<crimsun> yep, that means we'll need a11y testing for it
<crimsun> we're building a store of asoundrcs, too, so soon we'll have common configurations for just about every driver.
<crimsun> want dmixed surround sound?  Click here.
<bddebian> You rock d00d :-)
<crimsun> Extra credit assignments for my students.  :-)
<TheMuso> crimsun: Want one for two/three ice1712 cards for simultaneous use?
<TheMuso> Or is that already there.
<jmg> crimsun: nice
<jmg> crimsun: i was thinking of building a speaker test/configuring thingy
<jmg> I identified that as a weak spot
<crimsun> jmg: you can halfway do that with speaker-test and wishie's configs.
<jmg> crimsun: its not point and clicky
<crimsun> nope, not yet.
<TheMuso> bah. Not worth my time.
<TheMuso> smc that is
<jmg> crimsun: also, DTS decoding doesnt work
<crimsun> jmg: neither does pony over IP.  One step at a time.
<jmg> but its ambiguous whether its meant to work in software or not.
<crimsun> it won't.
<jmg> OMG PONIES?
<crimsun> we lack all sorts of rights to do it.
<jmg> but it appears that the xine we ship actually uses the software dts decoder library, libdts or whatever
<crimsun> right, but that's at least one layer up.
<jmg> but that should do it
<crimsun> hauling that into alsa makes me sweat.
<jmg> it doesnt need to be in alsa. xine should output 6 channels
<crimsun> it doesn't already?
<crimsun> or do you mean DTS specifically?
<jmg> ive done it with 5.1 encoded avis
<jmg> but not ac3 or dts dvds
<crimsun> ok, right, that's one layer up
<jmg> ok
<jmg> so xine's problem.
<bddebian> Gnight folks
<crimsun> 'night.
<crimsun> hmm, a few of these merges listed on DaD are missing notes
* crimsun fixes
<crimsun> e.g., ones with existing sync requests that aren't noted under the Comment column
<persia> crimsun: Do you believe files should be generated for bug #58309?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 58309 in alsa-tools "missing entry on kde menu" [Wishlist,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/58309
<crimsun> persia: hmm, well, I'm not keen on polluting the menu, but it's certainly a valid wishlist.
<\sh> moins
<crimsun> so yes, I believe they should be generated.
<crimsun> moins \sh 
<persia> crimsun: Thanks.
<\sh> argl...dad is just a bit bugg
<\sh> y
<\sh> and please remind me, to not start merging after waking up 
<\sh> moins Hobbsee 
<Hobbsee> hi \sh 
<\sh> Hobbsee, you are early this morning :)
<Hobbsee> \sh: yeah - we're usually up around this time
<Hobbsee> timezones are so screwed anyway
<\sh> Hobbsee, hehe...I remember siretart and me during UBZ...the very first day was really jetlagged ;)
<Hobbsee> \sh: well, just based on the time of flight, it wasnt too bad
<Hobbsee> but it's different from au timezones, based on when they eat dinner, so it's all a bit weird
<\sh> Hobbsee, but I hope you enjoy your time with all those geeks down there :) it's quite an experience how the work is done, just to see how everything is being planned for the near future :)
<Hobbsee> \sh: :)
<Hobbsee> \sh: it's been pretty good :)
<\sh> Hobbsee, I hope I can go to one of the Summits next year
<StevenK> Hrm. Methinks the wireless at the hotel is not quite fixed yet.
<Hobbsee_> !ping
<ubotu> pong
<Hobbsee> it....gets us an ip, for a start
<Hobbsee> StevenK: but, there are 2
<Hobbsee> right.
<\sh> k...see you later...need to get a shower and go to the office...laters people
<Hobbsee> bye!
* StevenK waves to Fujitsu.
<imbrandon> moins all
<crimsun> re
<imbrandon> heya crimsun 
<crimsun> heya
* Fujitsu waves to StevenK.
<Fujitsu> Evil parents.
<ajmitch> morning all
<RAOF> Afternood ajmitch 
* StevenK waves to ajmitch.
* siretart waves to *
<Fujitsu> Aaaaaargh, I take it that Ubuntu CE has released its Feisty version. I've seen quite a number of GNOME Sword bug reports mentioning CE and Automatix.
<ajmitch> interesting
<Fujitsu> Nice to have apport giving us bugs.
<Hobbsee> hi Fujitsu 
<Hobbsee> ubuntu ce?
<Fujitsu> Hi Hobbsee, ajmitch.
<Fujitsu> Christian Edition.
<Hobbsee> ahhh
<Fujitsu> Basically Ubuntu + Automatix + various GNOME Swordish applications.
<Hobbsee> even CE doesnt have automatix, does it?
<crimsun> even better, there's a planet.ubuntu post mentioning automatix2.  At least it's a bit unabashed in its dislike.
<Fujitsu> crimsun: WHERE!? Let me at it.
<crimsun> Fujitsu: it's not quite as bad as it sounds.  At least it's a big honking warning.  http://www.belutz.net/2007/05/08/17-not-really-must-have-free-apps-for-new-ubuntu-users/
<RAOF> Ubuntu CE doesn't *ship* with automatix, surely?
<StevenK> If it did, surely it's not Christian to break upgrades. :-P
<Fujitsu> Can't these CE people get their own bugtracker and point apport at it or something similar?
* ajmitch waves to hobbsee
<Q-FUNK> ubuntu CE *shivers*
<Hobbsee> hi ajmitch 
<alg> hi everyone!
<Hobbsee> hiya
<Fujitsu> `Automatix is also installed by default in Ubuntu CE so users can quickly get their system running.'
<StevenK> Argh!
<RAOF> s/running/broken/
<RAOF> Score!
<alg> Hobbsee: I still can't login into revu :(
<Fujitsu> Looks like it might have been removed in the Feisty version, though.
<alg> Hobbsee: any chance the keyring wasn't resync'ed?
<Fujitsu> Oh no, it's still there. Yay!
<RAOF> SIGKILL FTW!
<StevenK> Fujitsu: Can we crucify them?
<Fujitsu> It comes with IEs4Linux too.
* StevenK ducks.
<Fujitsu> These are the features that seem to justify having a seperate distribution:
<Fujitsu> http://www.whatwouldjesusdownload.com/christianubuntu/2007/05/features.html
<StevenK> Might it suggest a different name than Ubuntu CE, too?
<StevenK> Might I point to the Debian vs Trusted Debian debate?
<Fujitsu> I know not of that debate.
<StevenK> Damn youngsters.
<Fujitsu> However, I know that I have to be at the train station in 9 minutes.
<StevenK> Fujitsu: Heading home?
<Fujitsu> No, heading to TAFE again.
<StevenK> Ah
<Fujitsu> I'll be back in about 40.
<Hobbsee> alg: it was
<alg> hm, then I must be doing something wrong?
<alg> I use this page: http://revu.tauware.de
<Hobbsee> did you use dput revu *.changes, or dput *.changes?
<ajmitch> alg: you can login once a package has been successfully uploaded & appears on revu
<alg> and try both my e-mail address I used to register on the launchpad and the one from the key
<alg> ah, that's the problem I guess. I thought I have to login, then upload... not the other way
<alg> Hobbsee: what's the correct "dput ..." among these two? (just to save another bug-hunting session :) )
<StevenK> alg: The former.
<Hobbsee> alg: dput revu *.changes
<StevenK> alg: If your dput.cf has revu.
<Hobbsee> as you want to upload to revu
<alg> yeah, thanks!
<alg> will try in a couple of minutes
<alg> btw, here's the dilemma I face. I have two versions of the same package. One is the stable release and one is the most recent. Any suggestions on how to handle this?
<alg> (in the uploading context I mean)
<StevenK> Is the most recent stable and backward compatible?
<alg> no, it's the development release, but having far more new exciting features than the stable one.
<alg> and yes, it's backward compatible
<geser> how useable is the development release?
<Burgundavia> which pagackage?
<alg> however.... stable and development releases save data files in the different directories under home not to interfere, so you can use both in fact
<alg> it's usable, but can have bugs. the development release cycle is two weeks
<alg> Burgundavia: blogbridge (www.blogbridge.com)
<alg> Would it be a good idea to upload two separate packages, like package-... and package-weekly-...?
<crimsun> persia: my primary dev machine is being used to chase down a race condition ATM, so I haven't had time to test 112606.  Sorry.
<Lutin> \sh: do you have issues with dad ?
<persia> crimsun: Actually, I was expecting to hear that the new jack 0.103.0-3.1 was taking too long, and so you hadn't had a chance to test.  That there is something else as well is probably a good thing :)
<\sh> Lutin, sure...all packages which are firstly uploaded to ubuntu are totally borked regarding the merges
<Lutin> \sh: a yeah, that one :/
<\sh> Lutin, can you filter them out, so we can do manual merges, without the tool....just mark them with "red" <tr> ,-)
<crimsun> persia: sorry.  It takes a while to chase down these emu10k1 races.
<alg> StevenK, geser: I believe, I better stick to the stable releases so far. :)
<alg> (for now)
<Lutin> \sh: yep, we have to find a clean way to handle that
<persia> crimsun: Understood.  I'm not in any hurry.  Good luck with emu10k1.
<\sh> Lutin, check the changelog entries for -0ubuntuX revisions, as a first shot
<Hobbsee> persia: does supercollider use packages-arch-specific now?  ie for anything but amd64?
<crimsun> have I mentioned that I hate Creative hardware?
<Hobbsee> heh
<Hobbsee> crimsun: dont you hate all sound hardware?
<Hobbsee> persia: oh, nvm
<Lutin> \sh: that would discard a whole bunch of packages who have to be merged
<persia> Hobbsee: Has since forever (Hoary or Breezy I think: I'd have to check).  Why?  Do you know how to delete the stale binary?
<crimsun> Hobbsee: I hate everything that works and everything that doesn't work.  Hmm, I guess I do.  :D
<Hobbsee> persia: right, good.  just checking.  and indirectly, yes
<\sh> Lutin, no..mark them on the webpage, so that we know, that it has to be a manual merge without the merge grabbing tool
<Hobbsee> persia: it's done
<Hobbsee> crimsun: haha :)
<persia> Hobbsee: Really?  Thanks ever so much.  I think that's my longest outstanding bug :)
<Lutin> \sh: I meant, there are a lot of -0ubuntuX packages which can be merged automatically
<Hobbsee> persia: no problem.  archive admin is in the room, and on irc ;)
<\sh> Lutin, hmm..I never found one, which wasn't broken, e.g. the changelog wasn't merged correctly, all ubuntu entries were lost
<Lutin> \sh: the problem is only with packages that are not based on any debian version, but that"s not the biggest part of the -0ubuntuX from wht I can see
<persia> Hobbsee: So the procedure for those is to bug archive admin?  I thought that it was hard to remove only binaries.
<Hobbsee> persia: launchpad keeps changing
<crimsun> persia: that was the situation some time ago.  It may well have changed.
<Hobbsee> persia: but yeah
<\sh> Lutin, e.g.  pygoocanvas	0.6.0-0ubuntu1	0.8.0-1
* persia celebrates launchpad improvements
<\sh> Lutin, it was uploaded first to edgy..now it's in debian...
<crimsun> \sh: / Lutin: I can confirm that happened with galago-gtk-python as well.
<crimsun> md5sums are identical for orig.tar.gz
<crimsun> need an additional check for the case we're hitting.
<crimsun> (in the case of galago-gtk-python, it's ok ultimately, since it's a sync)
<TheMuso> Today's schedule not up yet?
<StevenK> TheMuso: Haven't seen it.
<tarzeau> can i somehow help w/ #105996 ?
<StevenK> bug 105996
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 105996 in Ubuntu "[needs-packaging]  FreeBasic" [Wishlist,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/105996
<StevenK> Package it for Debian?
<tarzeau> StevenK: i did, can you sponsor it?
<StevenK> Not at the moment.
<StevenK> I'm on Windows machine on my uni network, and I trust neither.
<tarzeau> StevenK: that's fine, maybe later today?
<StevenK> Maybe.
<StevenK> I could also suggest mentors.debian.net
<Hobbsee> **** MOTU SESSION ON NOW ***
<tarzeau> oh wait i have a sponsor already
<crimsun> Hobbsee: irc channel?
<ajmitch> (you can listen in on voip)
<StevenK> Hobbsee: Which I could. :-(
<Hobbsee> crimsun: #uds-sevilla and the VOIP
<crimsun> ajmitch: can't, blocked.
<Hobbsee> VOIP's better
<Hobbsee> aww :(
<ajmitch> or hobbsee can transcribe
* ajmitch can't type it fast enough
<StevenK> Heh
<Hobbsee> hah
<joejaxx> motu yay
<ajmitch> so, what problems do we have in MOTU?
<\sh> ajmitch, which number?
<\sh> there is no schedule
<ajmitch> 5004
<Hobbsee> it's room C
<ajmitch> http://people.ubuntu.com/~cjwatson/uds-sevilla/2007-05-08/
<ajmitch> gobby session is being started
<ajmitch> or not
<\sh> I'm in :)
<joejaxx> :)
<ajmitch> so we heard
<\sh> ajmitch, who is there
<ajmitch> lots of people :)
<\sh> gobby.ubuntu.com ?
<ajmitch> it's dead
<\sh> yeah
<concept10> where are the gobby pages for the other sessions?
<Hobbsee> same place.  but it's broken
<persia> up now
<Hobbsee> persia: VOIP is being used more now
<crimsun> port 6522 for gobby?
<persia> Hobbsee: Noise has been improved as well
<persia> crimsun: Yes
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: you'll keep....
<ajmitch> :)
<crimsun> ah, ssh tunneling.
<\sh> oh shit
<ajmitch> ?
<\sh> need to work here
<siretart> who is talking via voip actually?
<\sh> not me...I'm lurking...and I'm really scared ;)
<Hobbsee> siretart: imbrandon 
* ajmitch wonders... :)
<ajmitch> who else has a voice like that?
<Hobbsee> other rednecks.  :P
<joejaxx> who else is in the motu session? i cannot see everyone's nametags :P
* \sh has to deploy another bunch of servers while I'm listening ;)
<imbrandon> ?
<imbrandon> siretart, me
<joejaxx> \sh: nice
<imbrandon> :)
<siretart> ah, hi imbrandon  :)
<imbrandon> ello
<\sh> imbrandon wants to take over wine, I heard it ;) 
<imbrandon> nooooooooooo
<imbrandon> lol
<\sh> YES!
<concept10> I can only understand one person on the call :(
<crimsun> dude, awesome.  I hear imbrandon wants azureus, too.
<imbrandon> ugh, i quit
<imbrandon> lol
<imbrandon> crimsun, are you on this call ?
<crimsun> I'm in gobby.
<imbrandon> ahh ok
<crimsun> are we looking at any particular doc?
<imbrandon> no idea, i dont have a gobby client avail to me here at work
<imbrandon> so i'm VoIP only
<crimsun> hey, maybe if we join forces, we can hobble along
<imbrandon> hehe
<\sh> PLEASE TAKE OVER WINE...SOMEONE PLS! ;)
* Fujitsu drops a "Hahahaha, it's yours forever!" on \sh.
* ajmitch hands wine to laserjock
<\sh> no we need scott ritchie
<\sh> he wants to be a motu too just because of wine
<\sh> we should think about a special case for him...like the other guys from beryl/compiz I think
* \sh has a meeting now...bbl
<crimsun> that's what the sabdfl was wanting IIRC
<crimsun> (I honestly have no idea if anything's actually being discussed, so I'm just kinda...twiddling my thumbs.)
<imbrandon> crimsun, just talking about the next motu meetitng etc
<imbrandon> nothing much
<imbrandon> lot of dead air
<dholbach> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/better-mentoring
<dholbach> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/motu-wiki-cleanup
<siretart> \sh: I think this is the biggest problem of wine: lot's of users, but very few people willing to care for it
<rollerskatejamms> siretart, Isn't that winehq's job
<\sh> siretart, because wine is a bitch...regarding debugging, apps etc.
<imbrandon> i dont mind helping care for anything, i just dont want to take on any packages fully myself right now
<imbrandon> untill i get a little more time
<rollerskatejamms> imbrandon, you provide one of the seveas mirrors right?
<\sh> imbrandon, wine itself is nothing too time consuming...the problem are the bugs, which are mostly upstream
<imbrandon> rollerskatejamms, yes
<rollerskatejamms> imbrandon, Thanks!
<imbrandon> yw :)
<\sh> imbrandon, and right now, our apport stuff for wine is useless...(see wine spec) so I have to change some things to get better bugreports..
<rollerskatejamms> I'm hoping he'll backport pidgin and thunderbird
<imbrandon> ahhh
<jacquesmerde> i'm new to ubuntu. i've just done an apt-get source package. now which file tells me which configure options are used?
<imbrandon> rollerskatejamms, i plan on officialy trying to backport pidgin ( maybe )
<imbrandon> jacquesmerde, <package>/debian/rules
<imbrandon> if there are any used
<siretart> rollerskatejamms: well, it's always SEP (somebody's else problem) - that doesn't help ubuntu
<rollerskatejamms> good point
<jacquesmerde> imbrandon: cheers!
<siretart> rollerskatejamms: what would rather help is looking at the bugs in launchpad, and decide on a policy on how to handle upstream bugs we can't fix in ubuntu, and actually maintain the package
<jacquesmerde> now, can i just edit the rules file to add a configure flag, then compile and install the whole thing?
<jacquesmerde> i want to build bmpx with soulseek support
<crimsun> well, you need to add the appropriate build dependency(ies) to debian/control, too.
<crimsun> if in fact it requires additional ones.
<jacquesmerde> crimsum, sweet, the installing the package will pull in the dependency, rather than having to install it manually?
<jacquesmerde> so i can just edit debian/rules and debian/control? then what?
<crimsun> debuild -S, run it through pbuilder
<crimsun> or if you're lazy, debuild binary
<jacquesmerde> you mean just run: <package>/debuild -S && debuild <package> ?
<jacquesmerde> i'm completely new to ubuntu/debian
<crimsun> you need to be in the root of the extracted source package.
<jacquesmerde> of course
<jacquesmerde> but thats it?
<jacquesmerde> not in the debian directory, but the one below it, yeah? for both commands?
<crimsun> correct.  You probably want `debuild binary` then, since it doesn't seem as if you want to use pbuilder.
<Hobbsee> dholbach: i spoke to bjorn
<jacquesmerde> debuild binary?
<crimsun> it's a literal command.
<crimsun> you need the devscripts package.
<jacquesmerde> it doesnt need a specific argument? not debuild binary package.deb?
<crimsun> 04:57 < crimsun> it's a literal command.
<crimsun> as in that's the entire command.
<joejaxx> jacquesmerde: anything inside the `   ` is a command :)
<joejaxx> jacquesmerde: like `echo "hello"`
<crimsun> did I just miss the entire motu session?
<luisbg__> crimsun, yeap
<imbrandon> crimsun, not really there was alot of dead air 
<luisbg__> there are going to be more though
<imbrandon> cept when i piped up
<crimsun> ugh.  It's 5AM.
<persia> For a CDBS package, I'd like to both rename and install a file as part of the build.  Can I do something with dh_install, or do I need to overload the install rule (or maybe the configure rule)?
<imbrandon> crimsun, we're on the 1100 sessions now
<shawarma> persia: Just put the full filenames in your .install file?
<persia> shawarma: WIll that handle a rename?  I thought that wasn't supported?  I'll test.
<rollerskatejamms> siretart, What defines whether a bug is something that can't be fixed in ubuntu or not?
<imbrandon> rollerskatejamms, if its a package bug or a code bug
<rollerskatejamms> imbrandon, package can be fixed, code cant?
<shawarma> persia: It's entirely possible that I'm on crack, though. I just seem to remember doing something like that at one point.
<crimsun> persia: rename it prior to using dh_install(1).
<imbrandon> mostly yes, there isnt any hard fast rules
<persia> crimsun: Does CDBS have a handy file for that, or do I need to overload?
<persia> shawarma: Yep.  You're on crack :)  Testing demonstrated that the limitations section of dh_install still applies.
<crimsun> persia: IIRC, install/binpackagename::
<persia> crimsun: I was just going to overload install::, but thanks.  I was hoping for a shorter rules file.
<crimsun> ugh, need to run.
<shawarma> persia: Ah, yes, it must have been a directory I was renaming back then. My bad.
<persia> shawarma: No worries.  Overloading in CDBS is easy, just not as pretty (I hear of debian/rules files 2 lines long (with the first being #!/usr/bin/make -f)
<ivoks> most of the times, rules done with cdbs contains only includes
<siretart> Lathiat: around?
<siretart> Lathiat: we need to talk to you about motugames
<TheMuso> persia: Heh now that all jack needing apps are back in, we can get them rebuilt.
<TheMuso> predius_: I meant, now that a fixed jack is in.
<TheMuso> damn typing
<TheMuso> persia: ^^
<persia> TheMuso: Well, hydrogen and rosegarden down...
<TheMuso> Yeah.
* TheMuso is watching ia64/powerpc build.
<persia> I got lucky with hydrogen: sparc worked before the jack failure (oddly enough, given recent sparc performance).
<TheMuso> heh
<TheMuso> Now if only I could work out why ardour builds fine in pbuilder, yet fails on the build servers.
* TheMuso suspects he will have to set up sbuild to get the answer.
* persia takes a look
<TheMuso> persia: I asked in -dev last week, and Mithrandir and cjwatson were puzzled by it.
<TheMuso> Its not somethign simple.
<TheMuso> something
* persia has a stale schroot around that uses sbuild, and doesn't really feel like fighting with wxwidgets right now.
<shawarma> TheMuso:  That was the pkg-config thing, right?
<pochu> slomo: thanks for the upload! so there weren't any other mistakes? :)
<StevenK> persia: Masochistic, aren't we? :-P
<TheMuso> shawarma: Yes.
<slomo> pochu: nope :)
<pochu> :-)
<slomo> pochu: want some other jobs? :)
<persia> StevenK: I'll give up quick if I can't find it.  Looks like something about how scons is configured in the schroot, at first glance.
<pochu> slomo: sure!
<shawarma> TheMuso: Yeah, that one was really interesting.
<slomo> pochu: get monodevelop from debian :) this includes merging stetic, cecil and probably other stuff and switching monodevelop from xulrunner to firefox which you already know now ;)
<pochu> slomo: if you promise to review it, I'll do it :)
<slomo> sure
<pochu> yay!
<slomo> stetic is probably a sync, so is cecil
<TheMuso> persia: Found anything? Or are you not looking?
<persia> TheMuso: I'm wondering if it might have something to do with the current version being 0.21, rather than 0.21.0, but I need to test more (and will have to cook soon).  Separately, Oooh!  Shiny! (local build works just fine).
<TheMuso> persia: Ok thanks anyway. Ardour2 is cool, and yeah pbuilder is fine.
<persia> TheMuso: I'll keep looking, but don't block on me.  At this point, it's really more of an excuse for me to get sbuild working again, rather than finding a quick solution.
<TheMuso> Right. I am not sure if I want to be crazy enough to set up sbuild yet.
<persia> TheMuso: If you can get a free partition, siretart wrote a nice (but outdated) guide at https://help.ubuntu.com/community/SbuildLVMHowto.
<TheMuso> pochu: Thanks. Partitions/disk space is no big deal.
<TheMuso> sorry persia 
<TheMuso> ugh typing tonight
<TheMuso> persia: Page not exi/c
<TheMuso> argh
<TheMuso> sorry 
<persia> TheMuso: I dunno.  Works for me.  There's another spin at http://www.pseudorandom.co.uk/2007/sbuild/, but I've not reviewed or tried it.
<TheMuso> ok
* persia cooks
<TheMuso> Evening RAOF 
<RAOF> Good eventide
<RAOF> Heh, just confirmed a democracyplayer crash for myself.  Curiously, it works in amd64, but not i386
<TheMuso> Usually its the other way round
<RAOF> Indeed, but it works perfectly on both my amd64 systems, and crashes on startup on my shiny new Gutsy i386 VM
<TheMuso> lovely
<RAOF> Also, looks like I get to write an autotools build system for Tao.  Yay!
<TheMuso> Fun.
<RAOF> Better than their current build system, which is "generate a project file for a bunch of IDEs"
<TheMuso> yuck
<RAOF> Oh, and there's some broken support for generating an (evil, broken) autotools system.
<Lathiat> siretart: howdy...
<Lathiat> siretart: yeh i've done entirely nothing for motugames, feel free to drop my membership?
<xxxxx1> morning!
<lionel> hi xxxxx1
<slomo> RAOF: sounds good :)
<siretart> Lathiat: ok, so it seems decided for now to just redirect interested folks to the debian games team, which is much more active
<siretart> Lathiat: actually, I'm way more active there compared to the debian games team
<fluxy> Hello. I am new to this channel, so I don't know how things work, but I'd like to know why updates take so much time to arrive in ubuntu? (e.g: gaim changed to pidgin, package anyone?)
<ivoks_> fluxy: feisty was frozen when gaim was renamed
<ivoks_> (and released)
<crimsun> but .. but .. SHINY
<crimsun> must have shiny
<ivoks_> :D
<fluxy> yeah but you can always add pidgin package in universe so anyone can install it after release of feisty
<ivoks_> yeah, we could also have 5 vesions of firefox too
<fluxy> well does this mean we gotta wait 6 months to get updates
<ivoks_> no
<ivoks_> you can compile it
<fluxy> then?
<fluxy> or i can dload a compiled deb somewhere and install it
<fluxy> nice
<crimsun> fluxy: 7.04 is a  /frozen released/  distro.  We do not make changes to it.  One can backport it from gutsy once it enters.
<zul> crimsun: shiny my precious
<fluxy> but let's say i am a n00b (half true)
<ivoks_> adding new package, with name-change isn't that simple
<StevenK> It was also a new upstream release.
<Fujitsu> Released == stable == no possibly breakage-inducing changes
<zul> this isnt gentoo <tm> :)
<ivoks_> and changelog between feisty's version of gaim and pidgin is... big?
<fluxy> m' kay if u say so, but really this stinks *sigh*
<Fujitsu> I suppose it's absolutely devastating to have a different name.
<Fujitsu> I don't know how the world will survive.
<fluxy> pidgin is just an example (pidgin looks better)
<ivoks_> fluxy: it's the same app
<ivoks_> new release was cause of the name change
<fluxy> there are apps i would have loved to have in universe
<ivoks_> almost only
<fluxy> like wxdfast 
<ivoks_> fluxy: http://revu.tauware.de/ is your friend :)
<crimsun> fluxy: please consider joining our efforts, then.  You can get involved by reading the links in this channel's topic.
<crimsun> fluxy: remember, it's up to  /you/  to make things happen!
<xxxxx1> :)
<fluxy> uh looks good (revu...) - i've been dloading packages from getdeb.net too, but a bit unreliable
<xxxxx1> "just do it". heh
<shawarma> fluxy: It's not a place to download new and shiny packages. It's a place where you can upload *your* packages to.
<ivoks_> lol
<fluxy> oop sorry my bad
<shawarma> fluxy: There are basically two ways we can do things: Always package the latest versions of everything and just throw it in the archive and hope things work, or we can spend loads of time making sure that we have a collection of stuff that all works together and only release every once in a while.
<shawarma> It's only 6 months. 
<shawarma> Plus we backport security fixes.
<ivoks_> and apps get backported
<shawarma> Yes.. It's entirely unsupported, though.
<fluxy> dang
<fluxy> that's the prob with linux
<fluxy> application distribution is entirely centralised
<ivoks_> no it isn't
<fluxy> reminds me of communism
<StevenK> Then switch to Gentoo. And be damned to compile everything yourself.
<xxxxx1> hehe
<ivoks_> fluxy: i didn't notice gaim updated on my windowse when pidgin was released :/
<fluxy> lol *no comments*
<shawarma> fluxy: I sincerely apologise for spending all of my spare time making sure that your entire system works in a coherent manner.
<shawarma> not
<fluxy> hey chill dudes
<fluxy> i guess that's your way of doing things
<crimsun> fluxy: seriously, there are lots of distros to fit your particular itch.  Foresight might be up your alley.
<shawarma> It's just not very constructive to show up and just start criticising people's volunteer work.
<crimsun> shawarma: dude, your work isn't SHINY enough
<fluxy> (ivoks: it's easier to get myself a new-reliable-working-supported version of pidgin or whatever software)
* Hobbsee looks in
<fluxy> no no
<shawarma> crimsun: I know. I cry mysleep to sleep every night.
<crimsun> :D
<fluxy> my aim is not to criticise
<fluxy> but to understand
<ivoks_> fluxy: cause you can download .exe?
* Hobbsee hears the troll alert..
<fluxy> (yeah) now that i did 
<fluxy> lol
<fluxy> i was about to leave (and stop trolling ;))
<xxxxx1> fluxy: you don't need to release always the latest upstream version. whatever, in a good distro some packages are needed by others and vice-versa, the ubuntu, like debian is a concise and mature distro.
<shawarma> fluxy: Your very first line in here contained stuff like: "why updates take so much time to arrive in ubuntu?", later: "but really this stinks".. that's not criticism in your world?
<ivoks_> shawarma: of course not
<ivoks_> that's an attack :)
<fluxy> lol
<fluxy> "this really stinks" was bad - Sorry 
<shawarma> fluxy: If that's your way of not criticising, that "really stinks".
<shawarma> fluxy: If you really think we're going about this all wrong, write up a proposal of how we should do it instead. Be constructive.
<xxxxx1> fluxy: you're a maintaner of some app?
<fluxy> not really, just an end user and ubuntu promoter (in my part of the world)
<shawarma> fluxy: Just moaning about wanting the name of something to change to something else is neither constructive nor encouraging.
<xxxxx1> fluxy: you should be, to know how things work. ;)
<fluxy> =)
<xxxxx1> is not a easy task
<shawarma> fluxy: Truly: If you just log off now, noone will ever care that you were here. If you *really* have an idea of how to go about this in a better way, write a proposal about it and fix it and be the person who salvaged every Ubuntu user from stale 6 months old software.
<fluxy> some people have already come up with the idea i guess (alternative apt server with shiny releases or getdeb)
<shawarma> fluxy: Cold, hard facts. We're doing what we think is best. Walking into a room shouting "you're doing everything wrong" and running off again will just make everyone shrug and be on their merry way.
<fluxy> but i wish they had better servers or more reliable debs (like ubuntu)
<shawarma> fluxy: Blood is shiny, I suppose.
<shawarma> I take it you're familiar with the concept of bleeding edge?
<fluxy> uh yeah
<shawarma> right. It's shiny, but there's a reason it's called "bleeding". It's *almost* broken by design.
<zul> ie you want to slit your wrists when you want to use it?
<shawarma> Not the invidual pieces of software, of course, but we're not packaging individual pieces of software. We're packaging a distribution.
<crimsun> fluxy: if you truly seek "decentralised", then look into a conary-based distro.  See Foresight.
<fluxy> well the thing is ubuntu is really well glued as a whole distro which is why I love it
<crimsun> fluxy: please try to remember, however, that we're working within a Debian-based packaging framework, which may not be what you seek.  We're all interested in constructive criticism.  You can contribute; see the Blueprints on https://launchpad.net
* Hobbsee smells either a troll, or a user who wants to have the cake, and eat it too...
<ivoks_> :)
* fluxy wants to have the cake and eat it too ;)
<Hobbsee> fluxy: you cant.  neither can you wand wave.
<StevenK> But .... I want a pony!
<StevenK> And I want to eat it too.
* StevenK runs.
<crimsun> unless you're Hobbsee, but she gets away with it because she has a pointy stick of doom.
<ScottK> hmmm ... pony...
<fluxy> ok folkz i guess i got the point
<Hobbsee> heh
<StevenK> "folkz" Dear.
<Hobbsee> StevenK: the pony is nice looking.
<fluxy> and sorry for the offense
<fluxy> (folkz = guys + gals) =)
<StevenK> I'm well aware of that.
<Hobbsee> anyone feel like dealing with all the u-u-s bugs?
* TheMuso will do some tomorrow.
<Hobbsee> good ;)
<lionel> Lutin has done some this morning
<Hobbsee> woo!
<lionel> but there is still 179 bugs in the queue :(
<Hobbsee> lots refer to debian
<lionel> I will check old ones to reject or mark them as fix released
<Hobbsee> :)
* ajmitch returns
<xxxxx1> fluxy is the best! yeah!
<StevenK> ajmitch: What, back in .nz? :-P
* persia recommends 35375, 112973, and 111391 as fun bugs to upload :)
<StevenK> bug 35375
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 35375 in scorched3d "Scorched3d SIGSEGV on startup" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/35375
<crimsun> bug 112973, 111391
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 112973 in gmsh "Please merge gmsh 2.0.7-1 from Debian unstable" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/112973
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 111391 in sooperlooper "Build against wxwidgets2.6" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/111391
<crimsun> I'll take #111391
<persia> crimsun: Thanks.
* Fujitsu prods sbuild.
<ajmitch> StevenK: not yet :P
<ajmitch> though I see I missed all the fun about releases & updates
<Fujitsu> Why is it fetching the source package from the archive when I specify a local source package?
<Fujitsu> Or is that all it does?
<slomo> pochu: so how are things progressing? :)
<bddebian> Heya gang
<persia> hi bddebian
<ScottK> Heya bddebian
<bddebian> Hi persia, ScottK
<ajmitch> hi bddebian 
<lionel> hi bddebian
<xxxxx1> bddebian <o/
<bddebian> Damn persia, going for top contributor for Gutsy or something? ;-P
<bddebian> Hi ajmitch, lionel, xxxxx1
<persia> bddebian: Nah.  I still have 21 packages to go to break my Dapper/Feisty numbers :)
<bddebian> Sheesh :-)
* bddebian feels inadequate :-)
<ScottK> Maybe bddebian should join UUS then?
<persia> bddebian: You, too, could generate tiny patches to insignificant bugs :)
<bddebian> ScottK: I'm not?
<ScottK> Hmm maybe I missed it then.
* ScottK was looking the other day and didn't see you.
* ScottK will look again.
<bddebian> It's possible that I'm not
<lionel> bddebian: you do not seem to be in
<bddebian> Hrmph
<ScottK> bddebian: Nope https://launchpad.net/%7Ebddebian/+participation
<lionel> note that there is no need to be in uus to go in through the bug list: https://bugs.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-universe-sponsors/ :)
<StevenK> persia: I'm a little wary of that wxwidgets bug
<persia> StevenK: What about it?
<StevenK> persia: Has upstream been involved at all?
<StevenK> Duh, of course they have.
<StevenK> The original patch is from their CVS.
<persia> Upstream wrote the original patch (in head).  I only backported to Ubuntu 2.8 (in the archived), and now for Ubuntu 2.6.  I can get back to upstream and speak to them about inclusion in a 2.6 release, if you think it's important.
<StevenK> persia: No no, I was just worried about some large patch just coming out of the ether.
<persia> StevenK: OK.  I usually at least send those back :)  This one though is an upstream fix.
<StevenK> persia: I'm a little concerned about the wierd characters - sounds like encoding.
* persia looks at the patch again
<persia> StevenK: Do you mean that multibyte characters are converted to spaces in wxSafeConvertMB2WX?
<pochu> slomo: haven't started yet, but I'm going to do it now. but I'm first going to build liferea with both gtkhtml and gecko, so we can confirm whether bug 98725 is in gecko or not. what do you think about that bug?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 98725 in sun-java5 "[feisty]  liferea crash with undefined symbol PR_NewMonitor" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/98725
<slomo> pochu: with gtkhtml no java would be used at all so that's gecko
<pochu> slomo: can you comment on the bug? :)
<slomo> pochu: i didn't even read it yet, just the title ;)
<slomo> pochu: can you add that? :)
<pochu> sure. btw, he tested with gtkhtml, and the crash wasn't happening
<pochu> do I move it to firefox, then?
<slomo> not sure
<slomo> either java or firefox
<slomo> both ugly and huge pieces of software... no idea which one is at fault here ;)
<pochu> java is already there :)
<pochu> but doko doesn't know about it
<slomo> maybe ask asac or doko
<pochu> ok
<slomo> how many advocated are required on revu nowadays?
<pochu> I think two, but not sure
<shawarma> :w
<shawarma> Yes, save #ubuntu-motu...
<ScottK> slomo: Two for a new package.  One for an update of an existing pacakge.
<shawarma> ffs..
<slomo> ok, good to know ;)
<slomo> thanks
<xxxxx1> anyone here is using reiser4?
<RapidStorm> hey al
<RapidStorm> l
<Hobbsee> hiya
<RapidStorm> is the the right room with for help with ubantu ?
<RapidStorm> -1the lol
<Hobbsee> uh, no.  try #ubuntu
<afflux> no. check #ubuntu
<lionel> RapidStorm: for general help #ubuntu is the best
<lionel> :)
<afflux> hehe :D
<RapidStorm> ok ty 
<RapidStorm> im out ty
<bddebian> @#$%^& Lauchpad
<Hobbsee> heh
<Hobbsee> what's it doing now?
* Hobbsee has some of the devs nearby
<bddebian> Keeps timing out while I'm trying to submit a bug report :-(
<persia> Launchpad is your friend.  It decides what may be done, and when.
<Hobbsee> bddebian: useful
<Hobbsee> persia: hah.
<bddebian> persia: :-)
<pochu> slomo: starting with the merge, let's see how it goes :)
<slomo> pochu: cool :) again, get new stetic and cecil first (cecil is probably waiting on binary NEW, stetic needs a sync) from debian
<Hobbsee> slomo: are you here?
<slomo> Hobbsee: yep
<Hobbsee> slomo: cool.  i wonderw who you are...
<slomo> Hobbsee: well, you should probably know me although i wasn' _that_ active during feisty... just look at my lp page, https://launchpad.net/~slomo
* Hobbsee looks for slomo in a blue suit, without any eyes....
* Hobbsee finds no such person.
<geser> :)
<persia> Grumble.  LVM2 won't snapshot for me.
<shawarma> Hobbsee: If you haven't guessed yet, he's not in Sevilla.
<shawarma> slomo: While you're poking texlive, could you fiddle it to build libkpathsea?
<shawarma> slomo: That's the major missing bit for us to yank (un)trusty old tetex out of main and stuff texlive in, I think.
<Hobbsee> shawarma: ahhh
<slomo> Hobbsee: ah that's what you meant, sorry ;)
<slomo> shawarma: hm, i wonder why debian doesn't build it yet
<shawarma> Hobbsee: I saw this guy in the lobby, though: https://launchpad.net/@@/person-mugshot  Freaky!
<Hobbsee> shawarma: hehe
<Hobbsee> slomo: yes ;)
<slomo> shawarma: any idea?
<shawarma> slomo: Why they're not doing it?
<slomo> yes
<shawarma> slomo: They don't have as much of an incentive to do it as us, I suppose. Unless of course they're removing tetex altogether?
<slomo> shawarma: that's the plan... well, i'll look at adding th package later... could you poke pitti if he's fine with this when you see him somewhere? :)
<shawarma> slomo: We want texlive to do it so that we can have libkpathsea in main when we pull out tetex. They just want to have libkpathsea around.
<shawarma> slomo: He is. it was him who asked for it on the mailing list.
<shawarma> slomo: :-)
<slomo> which list?
<shawarma> Don't remember.
<slomo> and debian wants to get rid of tetex too, it just needs much more time because of slow maintainers of random packages being unable to switch from tetex to texlive
<shawarma> I was trying to hide that fact by just saying "the mailing-list".
<shawarma> I failed.
<slomo> :)
<shawarma> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel-discuss/2007-April/000806.html
<shawarma> slomo: ^^
<slomo> shawarma: thanks... if you see him ask him if there's something to be careful with
<shawarma> He's at his laptop right now.
<shawarma> I can throw something at him?
<shawarma> slomo: I don't there is, though. We just need to fix all the build-deps quickly. There's not really any clear mapping between the texlive-* packages and the tetex-* ones. Not that I know of, anyway.
<shawarma> "don't think"
<slomo> i'm talking to him already ;)
<shawarma> Ah, cool.
<pochu> slomo: so I have to request a sync for stetic, and wait for cecil to be in? and in the meantime merge monodevelop building cecil and stetic from debian?
<slomo> pochu: exactly... where's the bugreport to ack it?
<pochu> slomo: give me a second :)
<slomo> afterwards you could do muine or smlnj if you want
<shawarma> \sh_away: Did you actually check if the dietlibc build still needed that fix? I thought the latest debian revision would work with SSP..
<pochu> slomo: bug 113359
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 113359 in stetic "Please sync stetic from Debian unstable" [Low,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/113359
<mattva01> are their any good guides for packaging python modules in debian/ubuntu?
<slomo> pochu: ack'ed
<shawarma> Hey ho, hey ho, and off to BoF we go... Hmmmm-mm-mmm-mmm-mmm-mm-mm-mm, hey ho...
<pochu> cool :)
<pochu> slomo: and for cecil, I guess I can't do anything but wait, right?
<slomo> right
<pochu> k
<mattva01> i have started but its pretty confusing
<ScottK> mattva01: If it's got setup.py, look into cdbs.  It's dead easy.  Look at the pyyaml source package in Feisty for a clean example.
<mattva01> thanks
<mattva01> wow that is easy
<jellyfish2002> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Heya jellyfish2002
<jellyfish2002> bddebian any things i can read up on
<jellyfish2002> to understand more abt lintian & linda?
<bddebian> jellyfish2002: How much time do you have? :-)
<jellyfish2002> hmmm... abt 45 mins?
<bddebian> Gah
<bddebian> jellyfish2002: You have a pbuilder set up right?
<jellyfish2002> yup
<bddebian> jellyfish2002: Let's go to http://revu.tauware.de
<jellyfish2002> i there
<bddebian> jellyfish2002: Look for the cspace package
<jellyfish2002> okie
<bddebian> You will want to click on the package link and pull down the .dsc, .orig.tar.gz and .diff.gz files
<jellyfish2002> okie gt them
<bddebian> jellyfish2002: OK, now pbuild the .dsc.  sudo pbuilder build foo.dsc
<persia> TheMuso: My apologies, but I cannot replicate the bug with ardour 2.0-0ubuntu1: it builds correctly with sbuild locally.
<Hobbsee> hiya persia 
<jellyfish2002> it's getting the required giled
<jellyfish2002> files*
<persia> hi Hobbsee
<slomo> persia: persia uses scons, right?
<bddebian> hehe
<shawarma> slomo: Yes, it does.
<shawarma> slomo: Why?
<slomo> so there's the reason
<persia> slomo: Yep.  On the buildds there is an error that pkg-config => 0.8.0 isn't satisfied.
<slomo> scons almost never ever works on the buildds but works locally
<persia> slomo: Even with sbuild?
<slomo> yes
<shawarma> slomo: Why? And why does scons not have any bugs reported against it?
<persia> slomo: Do you know why?
<slomo> no idea why... infinity or lamont did some magic to get it work
<shawarma> We must have answers!
<bddebian> scons r t3h suXX0r
<persia> Nobody seems to know.  Alas :(
<jellyfish2002> bddebian it's done
<bddebian> jellyfish2002: Cool, Look in your results dir for the .deb
<shawarma> I'd love to see a config.log from that build..
* persia prefers autoconf
<shawarma> Here's a thought: Clutter the make files with all sorts of debug stuff and look at the build logs?
<shawarma> That's what I did with apcalc.
<shawarma> :-)
<slomo> hehe
<slomo> if you understand scons go on ;)
<jellyfish2002> yup found it
<shawarma> Well, that bit isn't even in scons. it's in the configure script.
<persia> Is there a handy guide on making a buildd?  Be nice to have a build vm for local buildd testing.
<shawarma> Or am I not getting what scons is?
<slomo> shawarma: scons is like autoconf+automake+more
<persia> scons is opaque
<bddebian> jellyfish2002: OK, now just "linda foo.deb" and then "lintian foo.deb"
<shawarma> I like opacity. 
<persia> shawarma: Buy a blindfold :)
* slomo updates to gutsy now
<bddebian> jellyfish2002: Hah, of course, it's a clean package, so that is boring..
<jellyfish2002> but there is no output even if it's clean?
<bddebian> jellyfish2002: No, if its linda/lintian clean you get nothing
<jellyfish2002> bddebian oic
<jellyfish2002> what if it's not clean?
* ..[topic/#ubuntu-motu:Adri2000] : Ubuntu Masters of the Universe: Universe/Multiverse Repository Maintainers | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Documentation | Add yourself to http://tinyurl.com/fgpgy to upload to REVU | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/TODO | Gutsy open for uploading | Let's merge! http://dad.dunnewind.net/universe.php | Want to join MOTU? Try helping out on these: https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-dev/+mentoring | Ubuntu Development Summi
<bddebian> jellyfish2002: You will see W: (warnings) and E: (errors) like so:
<bddebian> W: youtranslate; File /usr/lib/youtranslate/youtranslate.exe contained in /usr/lib of Architecture: all package.
<bddebian> You can then use -i to get more info on the warnings and errors if they are not obvious
<jellyfish2002> okie
<slomo> bddebian: not a bug
<bddebian> slomo: Aye, just showing him the output :)
<Hobbsee> Adri2000: channel topics have limits
<lionel> Hobbsee: we are not at Ubuntu Deelopment Summi ? :)
<Adri2000> Hobbsee: oops :p
<persia> "Gutsy is open for uploading" is probably older news now, and might be dropped.
* ..[topic/#ubuntu-motu:Adri2000] : Ubuntu Masters of the Universe: Universe/Multiverse Repository Maintainers | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Documentation | Add yourself to http://tinyurl.com/fgpgy to upload to REVU | https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/TODO | Let's merge! http://dad.dunnewind.net/universe.php | Want to join MOTU? Try helping out on these: https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-dev/+mentoring | Ubuntu Development Summit
<Hobbsee> lionel: hehe, seems not :P
<bddebian> Damn, why are there so many sync requests subscribed to UUS?
<lionel> because most of them do not need ubuntu changes any more
<lionel> but yes, this is surprising :)
<persia> bddebian: archive-admin requires MOTU ACK prior to acceptance.  They can probably be unsubscribed if they have been ACK'd.
<bddebian> persia: Understood but are these merges that can now be synced or what?
<lionel> bddebian: that what I said :)
<bddebian> lionel: Oh, missed that sorry
<Lutin> Adri2000: ;)
<lionel> at least, the sync I had a quick look
<persia> bddebian: They are probably one of 1) merges that can be sync'd, 2) inappropriate sync bugs inappropriately subscribed, or 3) [post auto-sync freeze]  new bugfix syncs.
<lionel> we are not in post auto-sync yet
<persia> lionel: No, but there might be some old bugs (I had at least one years old just closed today).
<jellyfish2002> bddebian can u teach mi how to build a package from source (e.g pidgin) next time i see ya?
<bddebian> jellyfish2002: I can try :)
<jellyfish2002> bddebian thx alot gtg cya :)
<bddebian> Fujitsu: I already merged jumpnbump, why do you have Sync on DaD?
<bddebian> Oh, newer package, nm
<DarkSun88> Hi
<bddebian> Hello DarkSun88
<DarkSun88> Hi bddebian :)
<pochu> slomo: re: monodevelop: why do we need libmono-cairo2.0-cil?
<slomo> pochu: because gmcs has a bug
<pochu> ok :)
<pochu> btw, is it already filed?
<pochu> slomo: merge done, but I can't build it (dependency issues)
<slomo> pochu: it's already filed upstream and in LP, yes
<slomo> pochu: what dep issue?
<pochu> hmm, should I rebuild stetic?
<pochu> I've just installed the .deb from debian :-)
<pochu> let me see
<pochu> slomo: I can't install firefox-dev locally, it wants to remove half of my desktop :)
<pochu> asac ^
<slomo> pochu: interesting... remove xulrunner stuff please ;)
<pochu> doesn't work
<pochu> The following NEW packages will be automatically installed: libnspr4-dev libnss3-dev 
<pochu> The following packages will be automatically REMOVED: libnspr4 libnss3
<ajmitch> that's not unusual
<ajmitch> package names have changed
<pochu> and they have to be fixed ;)
<pochu> but in the meantime, is there any workaround so I can install firefox-dev and build monodevelop? :)
<ajmitch> pochu: and what needs fixed?
<\sh> re
<DarkSun88> \sh: Hi :)
<\sh> damn...installing vmware esx is so windows
<pochu> ajmitch: the dependencies in gaim and evolution-data-server, I suppose
<pochu> I'm filling a bug
<\sh> moins DarkSun88 ... will upload your stuff a little bit later ... need to do some more work today :(
<DarkSun88> \sh: Don't worry. Afflux has finished the debdiff of Kile. The package has been uploaded.
<pochu> ajmitch: or firefox, I'm not sure
<pochu> bug 98695
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 98695 in gaim "Missing SSL support (MSN and GTalk don't work)" [Medium,Fix released]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/98695
<DarkSun88> \sh: Now, I have to do again the debdiff of Nagat because I just checked the actually debdiff and don't work it.
* \sh has other things to do , then building packages right now...installing esx and build up a complete test environment in it...*damnI'mdoomed*
<\sh> hmmm...I wonder what I want to do next...fixing bugs in wine ... yeah...nice task
<\sh> at least, I'm lucky to have beer in the office
<shawarma> \sh: Did you see my message a few hours ago?
* ajmitch waves to shawarma 
* shawarma waves back
<\sh> shawarma, nope...I wasn't online and don't run backlogs..
<shawarma> 17:10 < shawarma> \sh_away: Did you actually check if the dietlibc build still needed that fix? I thought the latest debian revision would work with SSP..
<shawarma> ajmitch: Dinner?
<ajmitch> shawarma: tempting, I'm getting hungry
<\sh> shawarma, hmm...I have to recheck it...I'll take it directly from debian (but tomorrow) 
<shawarma> \sh: I can do it myself. I was just curious if you checked it.
<\sh> shawarma, no problem..I'll do it tomorrow morning ... it's not time critical right now ;)
<shawarma> \sh: True that. Cool.
<\sh> shawarma, and you are in sevilla I think...so going out with the people is more fun then compiling dietlibc ,-)
<shawarma> \sh: Depends on the people. :-) And dietlibc to some extent. :-)
<\sh> shawarma, well, going out with siretart, ajmitch, corey and ogra or with riddell is quite fun....especially when you go with riddell into an irish pub ;)
<\sh> (on halloween)
<shawarma> \sh: Oh?
<\sh> shawarma, we did during UBZ...fun for a scottsman ;) 
* \sh needs a new beer...
<shawarma> slomo: texlive with libkpathsea ftw!
<slomo> :)
<slomo> pochu: so what happened to monodevelop? you can do pbuilder login and install everythnig there and copy the debs that are not in the archive yet by hand in the chroot
<slomo> shawarma: oh, i shouldn't have copied that description from tetex :)
<pochu> slomo: yeah, I didn't remember that :)
<pochu> btw, I've filed and attached patches for bug 113400 :)
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 113400 in evolution-data-server "Unable to remove the package due to dependency changes in firefox / nspr4" [Low,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/113400
<slomo> ok
<pochu> slomo: and since I've built theme, I can install them, and install firefox-dev :)
<pochu> though it's better to build in pbuilder, so I'll do what you suggest ;)
<slomo> pochu: when you're done just upload your monodevelop merge somewhere and i upload it if it's fine :)
<pochu> slomo: sure!
<siretart> jdong: so you are SantaClaus now?
<jdong> siretart: haha, I hope not :)
<jdong> I've been watching my carbs
<jdong> ;-)
<bddebian> heh
<welshbyte> do the different apt* programs treat "suggests:" differently? i.e. do some of them install suggested packages automatically and others don't?
<afflux> should I unsubscribe UUS from uploaded merge bugs or just set the status to fix released when the binary are in the archive?
<DktrKranz> afflux, just mark it as fix released
<afflux> okay
<tuxmaniac> If there is a report that seems to be like a support query and not a bug, do I have to assign the bug to the related team and get it closed? What should be the status of such bugs?
<tuxmaniac> For eg. #111981
<tuxmaniac> bug #iii981
<tuxmaniac> sorry bug #111981
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 111981 in Ubuntu "getting Beryl Working on Feisty" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/111981
<alecjw> hi. im interested in getting involved in the ubuntu mobile project. does anyone know who i should contact?
<concept10> I would like to know that information also
<alecjw> concept10, hmmm do you think maybe #ubuntu-devel would be  a better place to ask although it says "to get involved with development, go to #ubuntu-motu"?
<concept10> alecjw, maybe so, I asked in #uds-sevilla earlier for any notes or docs on the planning with no success
<alecjw> ok lets ask in -devel then :)
<bddebian> Are merges just free game these days?
<ScottK> bddebian: Apparently.  Some people have been marking their territory in the comments field on DaD.
<bddebian> Yeah, it seems to be a freakin' free for all this go'round :-)
<ScottK> Then if you quit doing your own and steal someone else's, you should be safe.
<bddebian> Well I don't do anything anyway, soo :)
<SoftIce> good day, was wondering the support with kernel-patch-vserver
<SoftIce> its over a year old, and i'm using dapper what in essence is supported till 2011?
<SoftIce> what sugestions does one have?
<\sh> moin
<\sh> re
<bddebian> Heya \sh
<\sh> hey bddebian 
<\sh> bddebian, how is live? :)
<bddebian> Fair to midland thanks.  You?
<\sh> overworked
<\sh> but private life is going up....I'm close to a marriage  :)
<bddebian> Nice, congrats!
<\sh> think it will happend at the end of  this year :)
<micahcowan> If a bug was submitted to package A, but the actual problem/fix would be package B's, so that I reject package A's bug and add package B to it, is it appropriate to "Confirm" the new bug for package B, given that both I and the bug reporter have verified that the problem itself exists? In this specific context, I'm also taking responsibility for the bug and in discussion with upstream regarding a solution. Bug 113227.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 113227 in vim "Incomplete/broken mouse handling in screen" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/113227
<Fujitsu> micahcowan: You don't reject the package A bug. You change the source package name.
<micahcowan> Ah. Well. Too late.
<micahcowan> But, good point.
<bddebian> Damn I need a ppc machine :-(
<dothebart> qemu?
<jmg> like you need a hole in the head
<bddebian> pfft
<dothebart> i have one. 
<dothebart> a dreambox ;)
<jmg> basilisk?
<dothebart> and two mipes, a wrt and a qube, a dual proc sparc 10, a vax vlc 4000... 
<dothebart> and an arm phone.
<jmg> qube!
<jmg> vax!!!
<jmg> dothebart: do you have a significant other?
<dothebart> no, i'm not marden-s.
<dothebart> ;)
<dothebart> ah, well, there is an agenda with a mips-el cpu somewhere in the closet.
<bmhm> hi
<bmhm> please update BIONC package
<bmhm> its SOOOOO outdated!
<jmg> like for sure
<dothebart> ah, wait!
<dothebart> i forgot those two rs-4000's with 400 mhz that stuck with a hex-boot-code.
<jmg> totally!
<bmhm> di you get that?
<Fujitsu> !info boinc-client feisty
<Fujitsu> !info boinc-client gutsy
<ubotu> boinc-client: core client for the BOINC distributed computing infrastructure. In component universe, is optional. Version 5.4.11-5 (feisty), package size 338 kB, installed size 860 kB
<bmhm> yeah
<bmhm> Fujitsu: 5.4 is WAY outdated!
<Fujitsu> We have 5.8 in Gutsy.
<bmhm> 5.8 is current, 5.10 comming soon
<Fujitsu> So it is no longer outdated.
* Fujitsu kicks ubotu
<bmhm> whats gutsy?
<Fujitsu> The development version.
<jmg> gutsy is feisty +1
<bmhm> ..
<Fujitsu> I'll check if it can be backported to Edgy and Feisty.
<bmhm> .i dont want to wait that long... a lot of ppl won't ;) thanks a lot Fujitsu 
<dothebart> apropos... any of the REVU guys arround?
<bmhm> Fujitsu: when gutsy will be released, 5.8 will be VERY outdated as well :
<bmhm> the problem is, that it won't work
<Fujitsu> bmhm: We'll likely have the newer one then.
<bmhm> other apps still work with older versions, boinc won't. Ok, thanks a lot
<Fujitsu> Well, BOINC's architecture is obviously pretty stupid.
<bmhm> it is?
<Fujitsu> Sort of line Wine.
<bmhm> tell me
<bmhm> hmm
<Fujitsu> If you can't use it unless it's the latest release, it's really not good.
<Fujitsu> How are distributions meant to cope with that?
* dothebart wants to get further with the citadel debs.
<bmhm> well you can... anything from 5.8 will work, 5.9 is current afaik
<bmhm> perhaps 5.7 will work
<bmhm> but you're right
<bmhm> its not done well
<bmhm> got to sleep now... late already. cya & thanks
<Fujitsu> BOINC should really fix their product to be more sane, but until then I'll try to get them backported to Edgy and Feisty (it can't go all the way back to Dapper; it needs's stuff that isn't there)
<xxxxx1> bye all!
<bddebian> Gnight xxxxx1
<Fujitsu> Bye, xxxxx1.
<rollerskatejamms> Whats the difference between universe and multiverse packages?
<bddebian> basically multiverse == non-free
<Fujitsu> multiverse has non-free licensing.
<Fujitsu> It also has some patentish stuff.
<bddebian> OK this merge crap on LP is making me batty
* Fujitsu is a bad MOTU
<Fujitsu> I haven't sponsored any uploads in quite a while.
<dothebart> Fujitsu: go and check out my citadel packeges then ;)
<Fujitsu> Unfortunately, I must depart for school in about 5 minutes.
<dothebart> you may also do so tomorow... ;)
<Fujitsu> It's a Hobbsee! RUN!
* Fujitsu runs off to school.
<rollerskatejamms> Ah ok, I'll try to avoid using multiverse pacakges then bddebian 
<Hobbsee> Fujitsu: indeed!
<Fujitsu> MPlayer is approaching a level of prereleaseness only before seen in Google and Gaim.
<Hobbsee> bye!
* Hobbsee continues to ignore the idea of uni
<Fujitsu> Their last release candidate was 7 months ago!
<Hobbsee> fun!
<Fujitsu> Yes, it's great.
<Fujitsu> There are a few things that are apparently fixed in trunk that have been issues for us.
<Fujitsu> OK, really going to school now.
<Hobbsee> ok
<TheMuso> persia: I got sbuild set up before I went to bed, and it built for me as well.
<TheMuso> Hey MOTUs.
<Hobbsee> hiya TheMuso 
<Lutin> heya TheMuso 
<TheMuso> Heya Hobbsee. How goes the UDS?
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: good!
<TheMuso> Heya Lutin.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: got stuff to add to the various specs?
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: Not really. There is nothing of great interest to me this UDS.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: not MOTU stuff?
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: I'm just happy to go with what the community disucsses. I don't really have any views on it.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: really?  even though you do a lot of it?
<TheMuso> And unfortunately the schedule is made available too late for me to make time to listen in a lot of the time.
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: true that
<TheMuso> Hobbsee: I may have a read of the motu spec at some point, but yeah.
<Hobbsee> timezones suck
<rollerskatejamms> They should just abolish timezones. So what if it'd be nighttime at 1am in some places and daytime in others. Simpler for everybody to communicate.
<Hobbsee> sounds good to me!
<jmg> fuck that
<jmg> sorry fsck that
<Nafallo> haha
<jmg> !ohmy | jmg
<pochu> slomo: I just need to update the firefox patch and I'm done, but it seems that the configure now looks for mozilla and if it's not there, it looks for firefox :)
<pochu> 	MOZILLA_HOME="`$PKG_CONFIG --variable=libdir mozilla-gtkmozembed`"
<pochu> 	if !(test -n "$MOZILLA_HOME"); then
<pochu> 		MOZILLA_HOME="`$PKG_CONFIG --variable=libdir firefox-gtkmozembed`"
<pochu> so we don't need to patch it, do we?
#ubuntu-motu 2007-05-09
<pochu> slomo: uploaded at http://emilio.pozuelo.org/deb/ :) I've removed firefox.dpatch, so the delta with debian is small. Let me know if it's not a good idea ;)
<pochu> I'm off to bed, cu folks!
<DarkSun88> Notte a tutti
<mattva01> hmm i'm a bit new to packaging and i have a question
<mattva01> im packaging a python module using cdbs and when using pbuilder i get an error error: package directory 'distutils' does not exist
<mattva01> are their any obvious reasons for that?
<minghua> sounds like missing build dependency on python-dev
<minghua> or something like that
<mattva01> ok i'll check
<mattva01> thanks
<mattva01> ah think iv figured it out
<mattva01> thanks
<beuno> hello, anyone around who can answer me something about packages imported from Debian?
<bddebian> We can try
<beuno> I'm looking at this package: http://changelogs.ubuntu.com/changelogs/pool/universe/k/kflickr/kflickr_0.7-0ubuntu1/changelog
<beuno> http://packages.debian.org/changelogs/pool/main/k/kflickr/current/changelog
<beuno> sorry, that's the link
<bddebian> OK and?
<beuno> it's 0.7-0 in Ubuntu, but it's been 0.7-1 in Debian for a while now
<beuno> http://packages.debian.org/changelogs/pool/main/k/kflickr/current/changelog
<beuno> why hasn't it been resynced?
<bddebian> Probably came in to Ubuntu first
<bddebian> Possibly different orig.tar.gz
<persia> beuno: The two versions are roughly identical (this is usually the case with Debian foo-1, and ubuntu foo-0ubuntu1.  There are probably no improvements to sync.
<bddebian> Heya persia
<beuno> persia: and the decision to import or not is automatic or by the package maintainer in Ubuntu?
<bddebian>  ubuntuX versions are never autosynced
<persia> beuno: By MOTU generally.
<beuno> right, so it hasn't been synced due to the MOTU deciding no major changes where made to it?
<bddebian> Probably
<beuno> great, that helps me understand it a lot, thanks bddebian, persia
<beuno> I'm trying to revive the "Debian Collaboration Team", so I'm going to be hanging around here a lot  :D
<bddebian> Great welcome
<bddebian> persia: Damnit, I had a question for you today and I totally forgot it
<persia> bddebian: That's OK.  You will be reminded if you upload a new gmsh :)
<bddebian> URL?
<beuno> I'm going to re-check the progress that's been made up to now and cook up some sort of roadmap, then I'll start recruiting volunteers  :D
<Lathiat> siretart: *nod
<persia> bddebian: bug #112973
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 112973 in gmsh "Please merge gmsh 2.0.7-1 from Debian unstable" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/112973
<beuno> persia: is there any documentation on how Debian syncs (both to and from) are working at the moment?
<beuno> I've read many pages in the wiki, but none of them are too clear on it
<RAOF> Sync *from* Ubuntu to Debian?  Does that happen at all?  We try to push patches up, but it would seem strange for the Debian repository to contain a package with a -xubuntuy version :)
<persia> beuno: I haven't seen a really good page.  Basically, in the beginning of each cycle, Ubuntu imports everything from that doesn't have local changes, and Ubuntu developers merge those that have changes.  After the freeze, this stops until the next cycle.  When bugs are found that also apply to Debian, often Ubuntu developers will open a bug in the BTS, and will provide a patch if one is available in Ubuntu.
<persia> RAOF: It's manual.  Take a look at packages.qa.debian.org for something with an ubuntu version.
<beuno> persia: great, that helps a lot, and what about upstream versions imported into Ubuntu, does Debian get any diff or notification on that?
<persia> beuno: For new upstreams, usually not (AFAIK), as the Debian maintainer may have reasons to keep the current version.  Some Ubuntu developers are also Debian developers, and so will absorb Ubuntu changes into Debian.
<beuno> persia: right, that leads me to two questions then, can you think of any way to semi-automate the notifications to Debian for new Upstream versions in Ubuntu taking the same approach as with patches?
<persia> beuno: There'S patches.ubuntu.com, and the interface on packages.qa.debian.org, but I'm not sure if most Debian maintainers would want too much automation.  You'd do better to track down some of the DCT or utnubu folk for detailed answers.
<beuno> persia: it seems I'm heading up the DCT team now since it's been dead for months (got admin on the launchpad group), and I've recruited a DD to help me out on the Debian side
<beuno> so basically now we're starting from scratch
<persia> beuno: You probably want to get in touch with the utnubu team (http://utnubu.alioth.debian.org/).  They are the natural counterparty to DCT.
<beuno> persia: great, will do
<beuno> now, my second question, I'd like to document a bit on how a DD can become a MOTU to encourage DDs to help out on both ends
<bddebian> It's usually extremely easy for DDs to become MOTUs
<beuno> do you think a special process con be made for DDs?  considering they already know how to package  :D
<persia> beuno: It's the same process as a regular MOTU, but it's easier to demonstrate packaging skills.  First, become an Ubuntu Member, then apply to the MOTU Council.
<bddebian> persia: Your build-deps are killing me :-)
<beuno> persia: so for a DD to become MOTU, has to be a Ubuntu Member first?
<persia> bddebian: Sorry.  I only end of with the little leaves at the edges :)
<beuno> that seems a bit of on over kill, no?   I mean, it makes the process for them very ahrd since they have to contribute in a substantial way to ubuntu first
<bddebian> :-)
<persia> beuno: As far as I know, although the Community Council is usually very happy to welcome DDs to Ubuntu.
<bddebian> What would be the point if they don't want to contribute to Ubuntu?
<beuno> bddebian: they will, by maintaining packages for Ubuntu as well
<beuno> it just seems like a "chicken and egg situation" to me
<persia> beuno: All MOTU means is the ability to upload to universe.  For their own package, a DD has that (usually), and when not, can usually contact any MOTU and get a sync.  The process is to ensure they want to be involved enough with Ubuntu that when the upload other packages, they'll watch the breakage.
<beuno> and I'm trying to build bridges, and since I'll be going to debconf, I want to have some of this layed out beforehand
<persia> beuno: The Community Council usually considers contribution to Debian to amount to contribution to Ubuntu, so if a DD can point to good work to improve Debian, that counts towards improving Ubuntu as well.
<beuno> persia: that's good to know (I'm going to document all this for DDs to know), but I still feel that it's too burocratic, and that both parties might benefit a lot if DDs could become MOTUs easier
<bddebian> beuno: What is your expected result?  If they can upload/update their packages to Debian, they will get synced, they really don't even need to touch Ubuntu unless they want to be involved?
<beuno> consider that I'm just starting to get involved in this, so feel free to point out anything I'm approaching the wrong way
<beuno> bddebian: the package I mentioned before is a good example, the DD has a newer version uploaded and an even newer one to upload (0.8), plus a bug that's been reported both in Debian and Ubuntu, she would like to upload it to Ubuntu as well as Debian
<bddebian> If "she" uploads it to Debian, we will sync it
<bddebian> We brought the newer upstream in August 2006.  They didn't bring it in until Feb of 2007
<persia> beuno: 0.8 will be synced or merged soon after upload (as long as Ubuntu is not in a freeze)
<bddebian> And foo-1 in Debian is not a newer version then foo-0ubunt1.  They are roughly equivalent
<beuno> right, I'm starting to understand this a bit more, the only thing that still puzzles me is the fact that she's willing to do the work *for* the MOTU, leaving him time to tend to other packages
<bddebian> *for* the MOTU?  Is she not the package maintainer in Debian?
<bddebian> We have no maintainers.
<beuno> oh, well, it says that "Brandon Holtsclaw" is the uploader, so I assumed that he would have to check the diffs once the new package hits Debian
<persia> beuno: The only work involved in a sync is the archive-admin marking it OK for sync.  MOTU doesn't have the ability to do that.  A sync is easier than parallel uploads, as then it only has to go into Debian in the future for automatic synchronisation.
<bddebian> If she wants to ensure the newer version gets synced once she uploads it to Debian, she could file a bug on LP requesting a sync
<beuno> persia: right, that helps me understand it better thanks
<beuno> I'm trying to figure out a way to take advantage of the DDs that want to help with Ubuntu too
<bddebian> I completely agree.  I am just asking in what way you are expecting that help?
<bddebian> We would certainly welcome more MOTUs
<beuno> I greatly appreciate both your time bddebian and persia, sorry for all the questions, I'm trying to have a complete picture on how things work
<bddebian> No worries
<beuno> and since I got a DD to take interest in this, I thought it would be a great opportunity to help get the team moving again
<persia> beuno: If they want to help with their own packages, using launchpad to add Debian bugs to reported bugs, and request sync's would be great.  If they want to help with other packages, they should start by submitting patches, and following the process.
* persia types too slowly :)
<bddebian> :-)
<bddebian> beuno: Trust me, Ubuntu tends to be much more inclusive than the Debian dev community.
<beuno> ok, that's a good place to start, help associate Launchpad bugs with Debian bugs and mark them fixed and ask for syncing when fixed
<bddebian> Not saying that we don't contribute enough back, that is still up for debate
<beuno> bddebian: I've spend the last weeks surounded by Debian users/developers, so believe me, I know
<bddebian> I wanted to be a DD for ages but got tired of getting abused.  Came here and wham, I started contributing.
<persia> beuno: If you're up for serious effort, I believe the best way the DCT can help is to check all launchpad bugs against Debian, and make sure that if they apply to Debian, they are linked to Debian bugs, and that small, specific patches get back to Debian cleanly.  This is probably best done in collaboration with utnubu.
<beuno> persia: I'm very serious about this, and I am willing to put a lot of effort into it, and that seems a very resonable way to start
<beuno> once Debian bugs associated are marked as fixed, launchpad closes them as well, right?
<persia> beuno: It'S 120,000 bugs :)
<persia> beuno: LP closes them in Debian, but they aren't automatically closed in Ubuntu.  The subscribers to the Ubuntu bugs are notified.  For the packages I watch, I usually mark them Fix Released in Ubuntu when the next merge or sync happens (and I can see the bug is fixed).
<bddebian> We can close the Debian bugs?
<persia> bddebian: Anyone can.  Just send mail to to bug-closed@bugs.debian.org :)
<bddebian> Is that a joke? :-)
<bddebian> I mean the (Debian) bugs on LP
<persia> bddebian: It's intended as a joke, but it works technically.  On the other hand, I wouldn't suggest closing Debian bugs unless they are really fixed in Debian.  Once the BTS closes, LP updates.
<bddebian> Yeah, well I get tired of wading through them :-)
<beuno> persia: in what cases does LP send the email to close a bug?
<ASCIIGirl> persia, from BTS devel info "The person closing the bug, the person who submitted it" :-)
<persia> bddebian: Unsubscribe, unless you want to be told when Debian fixes them.
<bddebian> persia: I mean just when perusing some of the lists on LP.
<persia> bddebian: That's a launchpad issue.  One hopes that the new Debian bug import system will make it easier to differentiate.
<bddebian> I know it is :_)
<persia> ASCIIGirl: My apologies, but I'm confused.  Looking at the BTS interface, I think foo-done@ should close from anyone (although submitter/maintainer are notified), as with closes foo to control@.  Am I mistaken?
<ASCIIGirl> persia, http://www.debian.org/Bugs/Developer#closing
<persia> ASCIIGirl: That's policy, not code.  That's the reason we don't close bugs: we're not supposed to do so.  The BTS accepts it anyway (and the Maintainer gets annoyed).
<beuno> persia: so what's happening in practice?   is LP closing bugs or not?  if yes, do you have any exampls of this happening?
<persia> bddebian: Thanks for gmsh.  Did you remember?
<persia> beuno: bug #110788 is a good example of one that was fixed in Debian, and will soon be fixed in Ubuntu.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 110788 in scim "There should be a way to quit scim" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/110788
<beuno> persia: so bugs *are not* being closed in BTS automatically, right?  even though it's tecnically possibe
<persia> beuno: bug #44734 is an example of the opposite behaviour
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 44734 in electric ".desktop file" [Low,Fix released]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/44734
<persia> beuno: No: LP does not automatically close bugs in the BTS (see the policy link from ASCIIGirl).
<bddebian> persia: Did I remember what?
<persia> bddebian: You had a question for me, and had forgotten it.  I suggested an upload might help you remember, and I'm curious if I was correct.
<beuno> persia: great, I'll start documenting and investigating all this, thanks a lot, you've been *extremely* helpful
<mtaylor> anybody on here happen to be involved with kernel packages? 
<bddebian> Oh, no.  I ran across a couple of packages today.  One used libflaac and one wx2.4 but I'll be dammned if I can recall what they were
<persia> beuno: Please also check with others also.  I may well be incorrect about some details.
<beuno> persia: will triple check, but at least I can start writing this up and then go back and fix it
<beuno> I'm off to eat something now, again, thanks a bunch!
<minghua> persia: the scim bug is probably a bad example...
<persia> bddebian: For libflac, all the binaries imported from feisty (except kwave and prokyon3 on sparc) have been rebuilt, so the transition may be ignored.  For wx2.4, everything left needs significant code changes.  I'm working on patches, but they should all go upstream and back down before application.
<beuno> (I'll stick around, so if anything comes up, I'll read it later)
<persia> minghua: Why?
<minghua> scim has ubuntu-specific patch, so a merge is needed
<bddebian> persia: OK
<beuno> and of course, ASCIIGirl is a DD, so she might benefit from all this too
<beuno> aaaand I'm off
<bddebian> Later
<ASCIIGirl> byebye beuno :)
<minghua> persia: and from my experience, the merge of scim is rather slow, as nobody understands the ubuntu patch very well
<persia> minghua: Ah.  Do you have an example for a sync?  I didn't see any in a quick search.
<minghua> persia: not from the top of my head, sorry
<persia> minghua: No worries.
* bddebian fires up F.E.A.R
<mattva01> hmm i'm confused, i'm trying to install my package on another computer and it keeps asking for the build  dependencies (like python-support)
<bddebian> Install shouldn't ask for build dependencies.  I assume you mean dependencies?
<bddebian> Geeps, the patch for F.E.A.R. is 600 freakin Mb :-(
<bddebian> jdong: You up?
<jdong> bddebian: that's what she said?
<bddebian> hrm
<bddebian> jdong: You've done stuff with xserver-xgl?
<jdong> bddebian: some....
<TheMuso>  /c
<bddebian> jdong: Ever seen/heard about bug #48404
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 48404 in xserver-xgl "netbeans java app gui is blank in xgl and java5" [Medium,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/48404
<jdong> bddebian: only the most infamous Xgl limitation :D
<bddebian> Oh yeah?
* bddebian wouldn't care if Java ran on anything personally :-)
<jdong> yep :(
<jdong> it's a java+Xgl interaction
<jdong> I don't know much more than that
<jdong> other than there's apparently some workarounds you can export
<bddebian> There's a patch for it on there ;-P
<jdong> cool
<bddebian> Crap, can someone please explain to me when we decide to do SRUs?
<jdong> I don't know much about X server structures... so I don't feel qualified to do much with it :(
<bddebian> jdong: Aye, me either really :-(
<persia> bddebian: When it's really broken (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/SRU (when))
<mattva01> bddebian: no the installer is def asking for the build dependencies
<bddebian> persia: Thanks, that's what I thought.  I sure question some updates then. :-)
<bddebian> So why the hell then do we keep any bugs open for packages against older distros, "supported" or not?
<persia> bddebian: I think in this case, "supported" only means security & no data loss, although it's not always treated that way.  Look at Debian stable updates for a counterexample.
<bddebian> Ha, nice, the bug is in Debian too:  Tags: patch; 1 year and 172 days old.
<persia> Could anyone point me to a good resource on what's happening with tetex / texlive?
<bddebian> texlive is replacing tetex in Debian afaiui
<persia> bddebian: That's all I know as well.  ia64 didn't like gmsh, and I'm wondering if I have to adjust my build-deps.
<micahcowan> persia, the switch had already happened in Debian, so you might want to google around for Debian threads related to the change.
<persia> micahcowan: Thanks.
<micahcowan> bddebian, bugs for older releases are generally closed out I think, if they qualify for neither SRU nor backport.
<bddebian> micahcowan: Not from what I see :)
<micahcowan> bddebian, I mean, when we come across them and notice :)
<persia> bddebian: What's an example bug?
<micahcowan> At least, I have seen bugs closed for that very reason. Assuming it no longer applies in the latest release/development release.
<bddebian> persia: About half the bugs UUS is subscribed to :-)
<micahcowan> :o
* persia looks
<micahcowan> bddebian: So, they're bugs that are fixed in the current release?
<bddebian> In some cases, no, I'm working on that.  But I know if I close them I will catch shit :-)
<persia> bddebian: I'm not familiar enough with most of the bugs I found in the list to specifically comment, but in general, I see U-U-S bugs marked "Needs Info" when the patch is outdated, but the bug exists.  I generally mark bugs "Fix Released" as soon as the latest version in the repository no longer contains the bug.  I've only ever had one user comment, and they were happy with the response that version x.y-z contained the fix, an
<bddebian> persia: Maybe I'm over-reacting, I dunno
<bddebian> Just seems like we have a shitload of old bugs out there
* persia misses Breezy, when 40% of universe bugs could be closed during bug day :)
<persia> bddebian: I think it's partly because we don't have "maintainers".  I personally watch about 5 packages closely, and try to manage their bugs, but the more active people can't concentrate like that, and the bug list just gets too long.
* Starting logfile irclogs/ubuntu-motu.log
(zul/#ubuntu-motu) bluekuja: what about it?
(bluekuja/#ubuntu-motu) zul: I pm you something
<ScottK> Any suggestions on how to find out why a package got deleted?  https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/amavisd-new depends on https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libnet-perl and libnet-perl got removed?
<lionel> check closed bugs
<lionel> a general reason is "removed from Debian"
<ScottK> lionel: Thanks.  Will do.
<lionel> ScottK: np :)
<ScottK> Well it looks like it got migrated into perl-modules, so no problem.  Thanks again.
<jdong> someone say something in unicode :D
<dothebart> in unicode
<\sh> jdong: print u("")
<beuno> espaol  :D
<\sh> s ;)
<jdong> excellent
<jdong> thanks
<jdong> now my freebsd is all unicode-happy :)
<jdong> so I can see all those silly unicode smilies
<\sh> freebsd? a new toy or just curious how a real OS is working ,-)
<jdong> \sh: haha, a new toy... a 32MB FreeBSD VM on my home server for my persistent IRC sessions
<jdong> and some educational purposes
<jdong> I'm lovin it
<\sh> well yeah, BSDi was my favorite in early internet days...
<jdong> I am pleasantly surprised at how well it responds to me limiting its RAM so much
<jdong> I would not expect Ubuntu cmdline to be able to build 3 packages at 32MB RAM and maintain some level of responsiveness
<ScottK> jdong: Done - Bug #113665
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 113665 in feisty-backports "Backport of pypolicyd-spf 0.3-1 to Feisty and Edgy" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/113665
<\sh> how do we do backports? just test if gutsy source  compiles on feisty/edgy?
<\sh> I'll think to join backporters, too :)
<jdong> ScottK: thanks
<ScottK> Not a problem.
<jdong> \sh: yep, pretty much, pbuilder compile, and then preferably try to run it and make sure it doesn't eat anything :)
* xxxxx1 is away, autoaway after 15 min [em/bx]  [l/on]  
* xxxxx1 is back, I yam back, pheer [gone (32s)] 
<_MMA_> Wow. http://symphonyos.com/cms/?cat=1 "Ubuntu 7.04 Base system"
<\sh> Automatix 2 argl
<_MMA_> yeah :(
<\sh> every new release == new install of the customer
<\sh> great ,->
<\sh> "linux is so stupid, I need to reinstall every release"
* _MMA_ looks for their ML.
<xxxxx1> simphonyos? wth is that
<xxxxx1> oops. symphonyos
<xxxxx1> :/
* ScottK looks for hobbsee to use her long pointy stick on the Sparc buildds for Gutsy....
<\sh> siretart, pingeling....fai-kernels...question
<DktrKranz> Adri2000, Lutin, around?
<Adri2000> DktrKranz: yes
<DktrKranz> I'm not sure if this has been reported already
<DktrKranz> but take a look at these pages:
<DktrKranz> http://dad.dunnewind.net/dolphin/
<DktrKranz> http://merges.ubuntu.com/d/dolphin/
<DktrKranz> you'll notice dolphin_0.8.1-0ubuntu2.patch is null, while MoM one is 57K
<DktrKranz> this breaks sync process (as happened to me)
<Lutin> is it the 0ubuntuX-only thing ?
<Adri2000> DktrKranz: known problem.
<Adri2000> Lutin: it is
<\sh> DktrKranz, use merges.ubuntu.com/universe.html
<Adri2000> DktrKranz: it's on our TODO list and will be fixed asap
<\sh> Adri2000, talk to keybuk (scott)
<DktrKranz> ok, unluckily some of my syncs were published
<Lutin> almost implemented actually ;)
<DktrKranz> so I need to get ubuntu changes back
<Adri2000> \sh: what for?
<\sh> Adri2000, to join forces ,-)
<\sh> he's the father of MoM ... and his mother is really pretty ,-)
<Adri2000> I'm ok if they make MoM open-source, otherwise I can't work on it :)
<\sh> Adri2000, http://linux.blogweb.de/archives/136-Its-Merging-Time.html .. well talk to scott...and ask him for help...he's good and knows some things ,-)
<\sh> anyways..time to go out of the office
<Ursinha> hi guys
<Ursinha> i have a question about packaging
* Ursinha wondering if will be sent to #debian-something...
<Ursinha> i need to repackage a metapackage, but i'm not the official maintainer
<beuno> Ursinha: no reason for you to get sent to somewhere else unless it's a Debian package you are trying to repackage
<Ursinha> thanks beuno :)
<beuno> Ursinha: care to explain a bit more what you want to do?
<Ursinha> it's simple
<Ursinha> beuno, i have a metapackage of codecs, and i want to change one dependency
<Ursinha> when i repackage with debuild, it runs lintian, and it says that i have to name it as a non-maintainer update
<Ursinha> the original version is 0.8
<Ursinha> my version, as a nmu, should be 0.8.1 or 0.8ubuntu1 or something, right?
<Ursinha> but lintian complains, saying that is not the correct version number
<beuno> that's a bit out of my league, but I'm sure someone else can help, bddebian?
<afflux> 0.8-0ubuntu1 would be the right thing i think
<Ursinha> if i version it simply 0.9, lintian complains too, saying that i should mention an nmu update, and that the version number is wrong
<ScottK> NMU is a debian thing.  Don't worry about it here.
<afflux> Ursinha: just ignore these warnungs about Nmu
<Ursinha> afflux, hmmmm -0ubuntu1
<Ursinha> afflux, can i just ignore them?
<afflux> jep
<Ursinha> i thought you at ubuntu care about all debian policy as much as they do
<Ursinha> oh , okay
<Ursinha> :)
<Nafallo> Non-Maintainer Uploads becomes hard when you're not using the concept of Maintainers.
<ScottK> Ursinha: There are some differences.
<Ursinha> so which is the concept of ubuntu?
<Ursinha> ScottK, where can i find about it?
<ScottK> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebianMaintainerField talks about it in part.
<ScottK> In general, packages are team maintained in Ubuntu.
<afflux> I'll go to bed. n8
<ScottK> Good night.
<Ursinha> night
<Ursinha> oh, late
<Ursinha> ScottK, i see
<xxxxx1> bddebian: <o/
<Ursinha> ScottK, thanks
<bluefoxicy> James Bunnell (jamesbunnell) added Contributors of packages for ubuntu universe (ubuntu-universe-contributors) (which you are a member of) as a member of Ubuntu New Mexico Team (ubuntu-newmexico).
<bluefoxicy> <-- has no idea where new mexico is, aside from that it's somewhere west.. maybe middle of the US or closer to the west coast
<ScottK> Yes and a bunch of other teams too.
<Nafallo> ehrm
<ScottK> He has no e-mail address on his LP profile either.
<bluefoxicy> but apparently I'm in team new drunk-lazy-corona-vacation
<Nafallo> how can what looks like a LoCo be a packagingteam? :-)
<ScottK> It's not.
<ScottK> Someone should go smack him.
<bddebian> xxxxx1: ?
<crimsun> bddebian: I think that's a "hello"
<bddebian> Ahh :-)
<\sh> re
<crimsun> my ascii art interpretation may be off, though
<Nafallo> I think it's a call for help :-)
<xxxxx1> bddebian: hello
<bddebian> Hello xxxxx1
<ScottK> bluefoxicy: It's getting fixed on #launchpad right now.
<\sh> k...going to bed...good night motus :)
<pochu> night \sh_away 
<crimsun> bluekuja: which?
<bluekuja> crimsun, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ivtv/+bug/113696
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 113696 in ivtv "merge ivtv 0.10 .1 from debian unstable" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  
<crimsun> bluekuja: did you work with Mario on it?
<bluekuja> crimsun, nope
<jmg> bluekuja: how about luigi?
<bluekuja> there were only 2 conflicts to be solved
<bluekuja> jmg: lol
<crimsun> bluekuja: superm1 (aka Mario Limonciello, #ubuntu-mythtv) should ACK it
<crimsun> (I'm not familiar w/ the mythtv codebase)
<bluekuja> crimsun, k gonna pm him when online
<bluekuja> crimsun, tnx ;)
<crimsun> np
<xxxxx1> bye all
<ScottK> Bye
<bddebian> Later xxxxx1
<TheMuso> Hey MOTUs.
<nixternal> don't forget us MOTUwannabes as well ;)
<TheMuso> Yeah I should change my greting then.
<pochu> hey TheMuso 
#ubuntu-motu 2007-05-10
<TheMuso> Hey pochu.
<geser> Hi TheMuso
<TheMuso> Heya geser.
<Hobbsee> hiya
<TheMuso> Heya Hobbsee.
<TheMuso> You're up late, although thats nothing new.
<Hobbsee> heh
<Hobbsee> going to bed soonish
<beuno> Hobbsee: how's UDS going?
<Hobbsee> beuno: good :D
<Hobbsee> it's fun :)
<beuno> I just saw a video with Jono's music in the background, seems like fun  :D
<Hobbsee> hehe
<Hobbsee> yeah, that's a cool video :)
<TheMuso> I hear that the power is still up and down like a yoyo.
<TheMuso> lol at #uds-sevilla
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: at which bit?
<Hobbsee> power?  no, power's up
<Hobbsee> lots of people are having trouble with the above-basement wifi, though
<TheMuso> right
<wolfeon> man. can't breath in #ubuntu.. too many users.
<pochu> heh :)
<wolfeon> oh oh
<wolfeon> I need to remember to report the python-fam bug, heh
<wolfeon> stupid module is so outdated they still use the old way of deallocating memory which makes python segfault
<wolfeon> :/
<wolfeon> *opens launchpad and sends patches*
<leonel> hello  motus ...   
<leonel> to add a patch to a deb
<Hobbsee> hiya leonel 
<leonel> unpack the package.orig.tar.gz
<Hobbsee> you add a patch to the source, not a patch to the deb.
<leonel> apply the diff
<leonel> then apply my patch
<leonel> and then  get the new  diff ??
<leonel> so I can rebuild the .deb ?
<leonel> I mean   I  have the   orig.tar.gz   the  diff.gz and  the  dsc
<micahcowan> leonel, you almost never patch the original source directly: instead, you use a patch system, such as dpatch or quilt, and place your patch in debian/patches (or similar). When you've verified that that works as expected, then you build a new source package, and use debdiff.
<leonel> oooo
<leonel> micahcowan:  thanks ..
<micahcowan> Unfortunately, that's fairly complex. :/  ...but there are very good reasons why it is done that way.
<leonel> micahcowan: ok  thanks
<leonel> it's for squrrelmail
<leonel> I've downloaded  the   orig.tar.gz  dsc  and diff
<leonel> http://www.squirrelmail.org/patches/1.4.10-security/  there's the patch  for   1.4.9a that is  in feisty
<leonel> I want to backport it  to   Dapper
<leonel> i've already done the .deb on dapper
<leonel> now I need to apply that patch
<leonel> let's see  dpatch ..
<leonel> thanks
<micahcowan> leonel, if you have questions or need help, I'd be happy to help via email (I don't know that I'd have a block of time to help interactively), at micah@cowan.name. Note that I am not a MOTU, but only a hopeful, currently.
<leonel> micahcowan:  thank  you very much 
<ScottK> leonel: If you get the patch packaged correctly, keescook could publish it in dapper-security, then everyone would benifit.
<leonel> ScottK: let's do it ... 
<ScottK> leonel: First step is get the source package and see if the patch applies.  Have you packaged stuff before?
<leonel> I have rebuilded the package from feisty on dapper
<ScottK> OK
<leonel> and now  the patch is what stoped me
<ScottK> OK.  What version of squirrelmail are you trying to patch?
<leonel> 1.4.9a from  feisty
<ScottK> OK
<ScottK> But you want to run it on Dapper?
<leonel> and apply this http://www.squirrelmail.org/patches/1.4.10-security/ 
<ScottK> Ahh
<leonel> ScottK: on dapper and Festy  but  edgy could  do ..
<ScottK> OK.
<ScottK> Let's do Feisty first then.
<leonel> ok
<ScottK> Have you made a pbuilder before?
<ScottK> You are going to need them before we are done, and they take a while to build.
<leonel> nop  just   get the sources  and  rebuildem
<ScottK> OK
<ScottK> It's better to build in a pbuilder because then you know you always have a clean build environment.  If you don't mind, let's start with that.
<leonel> ok
<leonel> pbuilder  installed 
<ScottK> Go here http://revu.tauware.de/~laserjock/ and get the script called pbuilder-feisty.  Put it somewhere convenient.  By default data will be storted in ~/pbuilder.  Run the script sh pbuilder-feisty create.
<ScottK> Note for later, you can copy that script and rename it pbuilder-dapper and pbuilder-edgy to make pbuilders for those distros.
<ScottK> It's going to run for a while.
<ScottK> Let me know after you get it started.
<leonel> is running
<ScottK> OK
<ScottK> You have the source package for Feisty?
<leonel> source  from upstream ?
<ScottK> No, 
<ScottK> Make a new directory and then apt-get source squirrelmail if you are running Feisty.
<leonel> ok
<leonel> done with the source 
* TheMuso th inks that the pbuilder script should be in ubuntu-dev-tools.
<ScottK> Now I looked at the source package and it does not appear to have a patching system installed.  Your patch is 408 lines.  This just got complex.
<ScottK> TheMuso: I agree.
* TheMuso adds it then.
<ScottK> TheMuso: Would you have a moment to take a look a leonel's squirrelmail problem.
<leonel> squirrelmail  today released a new version   security fixes only
<TheMuso> ScottK: Whats the problem?
<ScottK> He's got a 408 line security patch, no patching system in the source package, and it's a package that uses debhelper, so it's non-trivial to add dpatch.
<leonel> and  I'd like  to have  those fixes on squirrelmail
<leonel> this is the  patch  for  1.4.9a that is on  feisty  http://www.squirrelmail.org/patches/1.4.10-security/ 
<ScottK> The wiki says adding dpatch is in the don't bother it's to hard catagory, but I don't see doing a 408 line change without it.
<TheMuso> ScottK: Same.
<TheMuso> ScottK: Let me add the pbuilder script to ubuntu-dev-tools, and I will be right with you.
<micahcowan> ScottK, !  ...what do they propose as an alternative?
<ScottK> TheMuso: Thanks.  I am going to have to go cook dinner in moment.
<ScottK> micahcowan: What do you mean?
<ScottK> Squirrellmail just released a new version.  Not there problem how to package the in service version.
<ScottK> there/their
<micahcowan> ScottK, I mean, if not dpatch, then what?  ...it doesn't seem to me to be any more difficult to roll patches with than, say, quilt, and the only thing easier than that would seem to be... directly editing the sources.
<ScottK> micahcowan: The problem is that dpatch integration into debian/rules when it's not there at all is non-trivial.
<ScottK> micahcowan: If you are a motu-hopeful, it would be a good learning experience.
<micahcowan> Ah. Okay, that I could understand. Haven't yet had to do it: I'm mostly patching debs that already have some system or other in place, or else rolling new ones (one) that don't have patches yet. :)
<ScottK> micahcowan: If you look at the current pysol package and diff it with the previous Gutsy version, you can see what's invovled.
<micahcowan> BTW, aren't you also a "hopeful"? :)
<ScottK> Yes, but I've done it once and I have to go cook dinner.
* ScottK is trying to get someone else to help leonel
<micahcowan> :)  enjoy
<leonel> thank  ScottK
<TheMuso> ScottK: Sure.
<TheMuso> Where did you get up to?
<ScottK> We got up to he's building his Feisty pbuilder, has the upstream patch and so we need to add dpatch to the source package.
<TheMuso> Right.
<TheMuso> Just fetching the source now to look for myself.
<ScottK> Great.  It's a security update, so I feel it's urgent.  I feel badly I can't stay.
<TheMuso> I am not sure where to go once we have the package ready however.
<TheMuso> I've not done security before
<TheMuso> I know kees does it however.
<ScottK> leonel: Do you have information on the impact of the security issue?
<leonel> TheMuso:  having hte package  is a Great advance
<TheMuso> ScottK: I know.
<ScottK> TheMuso: What I would do is let leonel gather impact information, ping keescook once you know.  All that changes in the end is does it got to feisty-proposed or feisty-security and the version number
* ScottK is guessing if squirrelmail pulled the trigger on a new upstream release, keescook will want it for -security.
<ScottK> -security is really easy.  You make the package and then keescook parts the waters and it's published.
<ScottK> Gotta run.
<TheMuso> ok
<ScottK> Plan B would 'encourage' micahcowan to do it and give him advice along the way.
<TheMuso> Right.
<leonel> ScottK: http://www.squirrelmail.org/security/issue/2007-05-09  
<leonel> TheMuso: http://www.squirrelmail.org/security/issue/2007-05-09  this is the  advisory 
<TheMuso> leonel: Just had a glance at it.
<micahcowan> ScottK, I'm not opposed to that :)  ...however, I wouldn't have time to do an actual walkthrough right now... via email or something could work. :)
<TheMuso> leonel: So this is for dapper, correct?
<leonel> that's for dapper edgy and  feisty
<TheMuso> Ok.
<TheMuso> leonel: SO do you have your pbuilder set up yet?
<TheMuso> leonel: Make sure you have universe enabled for it.
<leonel> just finish
<TheMuso> Ok.
<leonel> it's
<TheMuso> Ok. Have you downloaded the source package for Ubuntu?
<leonel> TheMuso: yes
<TheMuso> leonel: Ok. We need to do a couple of things to be able to apply the patch to the source.
<leonel> ok
<TheMuso> leonel: Ok. Go into the top directory of the source package. By this I mean the squirrelmail directory.
<TheMuso> leonel: Before we go much further, do you have dpatch installed? If not, install it.
<leonel> yes
<TheMuso> Ok.
<TheMuso> The first thing we need to do is set up the patch system. So open debian/rules in an editor, and find the second occurrance of build-stamp
<TheMuso> It has a : after it.
<leonel> found it
<TheMuso> Ok after build-stamp: you need to add patch-stamp
<leonel> before   clean:  
<leonel> ?
<TheMuso> No, on the same line as build-stamp:
<TheMuso> SO it would look like this
<TheMuso> build-stamp: patch-stamp
<leonel> done
<TheMuso> Ok. I just missed something we also need to do. Below the line #export DH_VERBOSE=1, add the following: include /usr/share/dpatch/dpatch.make
<leonel> done
<TheMuso> I suggest putting a blank line between DH_VERBOSE and the include line, and a blank line under the include
<leonel> done
<TheMuso> Ok. Now after clean: you add unpatch. So it would look like
<TheMuso> clean: unpatch
<leonel> done
<TheMuso> Ok. Now we need to create the patch.
<TheMuso> Exit the editor, and return to the prompt.
<leonel> done
<TheMuso> Make sure you are in the squirrelmail directory, i.e with debian/ as a subidrectory, and run the following command:
<TheMuso> dpatch-edit-patch 01_name-of-patch <-- Where name-of-patch is a short name for what the patch does.
<leonel> so in  squirrelmail-1.4.9a   do that ?
<TheMuso> We number patches, so that if one patch depends on another, we know what order they need applying.
<TheMuso> Yes.
<leonel> so this is the  first patch  is  01
<TheMuso> Yes.
<leonel> I rename the  patch to that name ?
<leonel> and put it  in   squirrelmail-1.4.9a ?
<TheMuso> No.
<TheMuso> Whats the name of the patch?
<leonel> 1.4.9a.patch
<leonel> its on ~/Desktop
<TheMuso> Ok. It may be worth naming it something better, like html-security-fix for example.
<TheMuso> So you would run dpatch-edit-patch 01_html-security-fix
<leonel> and the patch where i put it ?
<TheMuso> Once you have run that comand, apply the patch against the sources.
<TheMuso> So patch -p1 -i whatever.patch
<leonel> ok
<TheMuso> make sure to run dpatch-edit-patch first
<TheMuso> as explained above
<leonel> fakeroot dpatch ?
<TheMuso> No.
<leonel> ok
<TheMuso> That probably gets run by dpatch-edit-patch
<leonel> haven't installed fakeroot 
<leonel> installing it
<leonel> ok
<leonel> exit 230
<TheMuso> right
<TheMuso> As you can see, it says edit the files as you need to.
<TheMuso> You will also notice that you are in a /tmp directory.
<TheMuso> SOmething like /tmp/dpep-work.Kz6879/squirrelmail-1.4.9a
<leonel> ok
<leonel> yes
<TheMuso> Now you apply the patch against the sources as you would normally. So patch -p1 -i whatever.patch
<leonel> done
<leonel> patching file functions/mime.php
<leonel> patching file src/compose.php
<leonel> patching file src/view_text.php
<TheMuso> Now exit as explained above.
<leonel> ok
<leonel> just type exit ?
<TheMuso> Now if you look in debian/aptches, you will notice the patch file
<TheMuso> exit 230
<leonel> type exit 230 ?
<TheMuso> yes
<leonel>  Error: Shell exited with an exit value of 230, aborting
<TheMuso> Ah sorry, thats to abort.,
<TheMuso> Ok lets try again.
<TheMuso> Rerun dpatch-edit-patch
<leonel> ok
<TheMuso> You can use your up arrow to get to it quickly again if you don't want to type it all out
<leonel> done
<leonel> just exit ?
<leonel> permission denied
<leonel> go with sudo ?
<TheMuso> hang on
<leonel> ok
<TheMuso> how did you get permission denied
<leonel> runned  dpatch  as my user
<leonel> now 
<leonel> sudo  dpatch 
<TheMuso> now
<TheMuso> no
<leonel> and  finshed with 
<leonel> dpatch-edit-patch: /home/leonel/sq/squirrelmail-1.4.9a/debian/patches/01_html-security-fix.dpatch created.
<TheMuso> Did you apply the patch against the sources after running dpatch-edit-patch?
<leonel> in the shell 
<leonel> root@ubuntu:/tmp/dpep-work.B11409/squirrelmail-1.4.9a# patch -p1 -i /home/leonel/Desktop/html-security-fix 
<leonel> patching file functions/mime.php
<leonel> patching file src/compose.php
<leonel> patching file src/view_text.php
<leonel> root@ubuntu:/tmp/dpep-work.B11409/squirrelmail-1.4.9a# exit
<leonel> exit
<leonel> dpatch-edit-patch: * Creating new patch /home/leonel/sq/squirrelmail-1.4.9a/debian/patches/01_html-security-fix.dpatch
<leonel> dpatch-edit-patch: Warning: debian/patches/00template not exist, using hardcoded default.
<leonel> dpatch-edit-patch: /home/leonel/sq/squirrelmail-1.4.9a/debian/patches/01_html-security-fix.dpatch created.
<leonel> that was with 
<leonel>  sudo dpatch-edit-patch 01_html-security-fix
<leonel> 
<leonel> I need to do a phone call urgent 
<TheMuso> dpatch-edit-patch does not get run with sudo
<leonel> give me 10 minutes
<TheMuso> Sure.
* gnomefreak doesnt ever remember needing sudo
<TheMuso> gnomefreak: You don't.
<gnomefreak> but its been a month or so
<TheMuso> How he got permission denied, I don't know.
<gnomefreak> he wasnt in /temp
<gnomefreak> hes also using full path
<TheMuso>  /tmp is used as a temporary placeholder for when one is creating patches with dpatch-edit-patch
<gnomefreak> right
<TheMuso> Once you exit, it returns you to where you are
<TheMuso> s/are/were before running dpatch-edit-patch/
<gnomefreak> so when he runs dpatch-edit-patch <patch> he should be in /tmp/
<gnomefreak> after he runs it
<TheMuso> /tmp/whatever/squirrelmail-version yes
<TheMuso> You make your modifications, and when you exit, a patch file is created, and you should be back to where you had the source originally.
<gnomefreak> shouldnt this drop him into /tmp/? 
<gnomefreak> dpatch-edit-patch: 
<gnomefreak> /home/leonel/sq/squirrelmail-1.4.9a/debian/patches/01_html-security-fix.dpatch
<TheMuso> Patching systems like this aren't easy to explain.
<TheMuso> That was created after he exited.
<gnomefreak> oh
<TheMuso> Dpatch is not easy to explain.
<TheMuso> But once you understand how it works, its really handy.
<gnomefreak> dpatch is handy but i have only used it a few times since mozilla/dpatch wasnt/maybe still not working
<TheMuso> Right.
<gnomefreak> i dont mind appling them by hand
<gnomefreak> asac_: home pc still down?
<gnomefreak> debian/changelog should only have package(<version>) gutsy urgency=low  right?
<TheMuso> gnomefreak: If its for gutsy, yes.
<gnomefreak> i shouldnt need to add universe to it right?
<TheMuso> No.
<TheMuso> Nowhere do we specify universe in any package metadata.
<TheMuso> We don't put universe anywhere in the package.
<gnomefreak> gusty shouldnt need to be in caps right
<TheMuso> gutsy is all lower case
<gnomefreak> You've specified an unknown `target distribution' for your upload in
<gnomefreak> N:   the debian/changelog file.
<TheMuso> That can be ignored
<TheMuso> if its gutsy its fine
<gnomefreak> error itself is E: iceape_1.1.1+1-0ubuntu1_source.changes: bad-distribution-in-changes-file gutsy
<crimsun> that's fine.
<gnomefreak> than it lists the N stuff
<gnomefreak> if that is fine why are people telling me to change it
<gnomefreak> before they revu it
<gnomefreak> :(
<crimsun> who's telling what?
<gnomefreak> i cant view the changes file atm im on different patition and i dont have access on revu
<gnomefreak> crimsun: a few guys (cant remember who) 3 days ago told me to fix that error before it can be reviewed
<gnomefreak> crimsun: here is the source http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5064
<leonel> TheMuso:  I'm back  sorry  
<TheMuso> leonel: Ok thats fine.
<TheMuso> leonel: What directory are you currently in?
<leonel> /home/leonel/sq/squirrelmail-1.4.9a
<TheMuso> Ok.
<TheMuso> Lets start with the patching again. rm -rf debian/patches and we will do dpatch-edit-patch again.
<TheMuso> Because sudo shouldn't be used with it.
<leonel> ok
<leonel> rm -rf debian/patches
<leonel> PLOP wrong window :-P
<TheMuso> yes
<leonel> all the debian dir  go away ?
<TheMuso> No.
<TheMuso> rm -rf debian/patches
<TheMuso> Only the aptches dir will be removed
<leonel> permission denied
<leonel> sudo ?
<TheMuso> Yes.
<leonel> done
<TheMuso> Ok.
<TheMuso> So run dpatch-edit-patch 01_name-of-patch again
<TheMuso> Whatever you called the patch.
<leonel> without sudo ?
<TheMuso> Yes.
<leonel> shell
<leonel> now patch ?
<TheMuso> Apply the patch
<leonel> done
<leonel> exit ?
<TheMuso> Ok and just type exit
<leonel> mkdir: cannot create directory `/home/leonel/sq/squirrelmail-1.4.9a/debian/patches': Permission denied
<TheMuso> Ok thats weird.
<TheMuso> How did you unpack the source package originally?
<leonel> sudo apt-get source squirrelmail
<TheMuso> ah!!
<leonel> remove all an  redo it ?
<TheMuso> You don
<TheMuso> You don't run apt-get source with sudo.
<leonel> learned ..
<TheMuso> Before you remove it, copy debian/rules to somewhere else
<jmg> you can
<leonel> ok
<TheMuso> jmg: If you want to do everything as root, sure.
<leonel> copied 
<leonel> removed
<TheMuso> leonel: Fetch the source again without using sudo.
<jmg> leonel: chown -R name sq
<jmg> sudo chown
<leonel> downloaded
<TheMuso> leonel: Is it unpacked?
<leonel> yes
<TheMuso> Ok. COpy the rules file you backed up into the debian dir.
<leonel> replace rules ?
<TheMuso> Yes.
<leonel> done
<leonel> dpatch ?
<TheMuso> Ok. Check that the rules file still has the patch modifications we made earlier.
<leonel> include /usr/share/dpatch/dpatch.make
<leonel>  build-stamp: patch-stamp
<TheMuso> So its there? Great.
<leonel> clean: unpath
<leonel> ok
<TheMuso> that should be clean: unpatch
<leonel> yes it is  
<TheMuso> Ok good.
<leonel> was a typo here
<TheMuso> Just checkig.
<TheMuso> checking
<TheMuso> Ok. now run dpatch-edit-patch as before.
<leonel> better be safe :)
<leonel> patch-edit-patch: /home/leonel/sq/squirrelmail-1.4.9a/debian/patches/01_html-security-fix.dpatch created.
<leonel> done 
<TheMuso> leonel: You applied the patch to the source after dpatch-edit-patch?
<leonel> yes
<TheMuso> Great!
<leonel> leonel@ubuntu:/tmp/dpep-work.p12582/squirrelmail-1.4.9a$ patch -p1 -i /home/leonel/Desktop/html-security-fix 
<leonel> patching file functions/mime.php
<leonel> patching file src/compose.php
<leonel> patching file src/view_text.php
<leonel> leonel@ubuntu:/tmp/dpep-work.p12582/squirrelmail-1.4.9a$ exit
<TheMuso> GOod.
<TheMuso> Now, open up debian/control in an editor.
<leonel> ok
<TheMuso> Find the line starting with Build-Depends: At the end of that line, you need put the following:
<TheMuso> , dpatch
<TheMuso> So a , straight after the ).
<leonel> Build-Depends: debhelper (>= 5), dpatch
<TheMuso> The whole line should look like this:
<TheMuso> Build-Depends: debhelper (>= 5), dpatch
<leonel> ok
<TheMuso> Yes.
<TheMuso> Save the file and exit.
<leonel> done
<TheMuso> Now we need to tell dpatch about the patch. Go into the debian/patches directory.
<leonel> done
<TheMuso> You will see the patch file there that we created. Simply echo the file name into a file called 00list, like this.
<TheMuso> echo 01_patch-filename.dpatch > 00list
<leonel> that  on   debian/patches ?
<TheMuso> Yes.
<leonel> leonel@ubuntu:~/sq/squirrelmail-1.4.9a/debian/patches$ ls -l
<leonel> total 28
<leonel> -rw-r--r-- 1 leonel leonel    28 2007-05-09 18:25 00list
<leonel> -rwxr-xr-x 1 leonel leonel 21023 2007-05-09 18:20 01_html-security-fix.dpatch
<leonel> leonel@ubuntu:~/sq/squirrelmail-1.4.9a/debian/patches$ 
<leonel> ok
<leonel> leonel@ubuntu:~/sq/squirrelmail-1.4.9a/debian/patches$ cat 00list 
<leonel> 01_html-security-fix.dpatch
<TheMuso> Great.
<TheMuso> crimsun: Where do we stand regarding people preparing security packages, changelogs, and letting Kees know?
<TheMuso> crimsun: I haven't dealt with security yet, so am unsure.
<crimsun> we do need to test the new-spun source packages alongside
<crimsun> otherwise, community contributions are always welcome
<TheMuso> Right. So should we create a changelog entry at this point, and if so, what target?
<crimsun> ok, for feisty-security
<TheMuso> Right.
<crimsun> 2:1.4.9a-1ubuntu0.1
<TheMuso> leonel: Ok, return to the top directory of the source package.
<gnomefreak> jdong: you still around?
<TheMuso> crimsun: Thanks.
<crimsun> np
<leonel> TheMuso: done 
<leonel> on squirrelmail-1.4.9a
<TheMuso> Ok. Do you have devscripts installed?
<TheMuso> Right.
<leonel> installing
<TheMuso> Ok
<leonel> installed 
<TheMuso> Ok. run the following command: dch -i
<TheMuso> THis will create a new changelog entry, and place you in an editor so you can edit the file.
<leonel> wow
<TheMuso> leonel: On the top line, change the version to 2:1.4.9a-1ubuntu0.1
<TheMuso> and change feisty to feisty-security
<leonel> has : 
<leonel> squirrelmail (2:1.4.9a-1ubuntu1) feisty; urgency=low
<leonel> change to  0.1 ??
<TheMuso> Yeah change to the version I stated above
<leonel> o feisty security
<TheMuso> so 2:1.4.9a-1ubuntu0.1
<gnomefreak> will it upgrade like that?
<TheMuso> ah sorry, 2:1.4.9a-1ubuntu1.1
<gnomefreak> ;)
<crimsun> hmm?
<crimsun> squirrelmail | 2:1.4.9a-1 | http://archive.ubuntu.com feisty/universe Sources
<leonel> changed squirrelmail (2:1.4.9a-1ubuntu0.1) feisty-security; urgency=low
<gnomefreak> leonel: change version to 2:1.4.9a-1ubuntu1.1
<TheMuso> crimsun: I am now confused.
<crimsun> there's no Ubuntu delta currently in 7.04's source package; it's a direct sync from Debian
<crimsun> gnomefreak: no
<crimsun> see above
<gnomefreak> ubuntu0.1 < ubuntu1
<crimsun> for security, we use dot increments just as in -proposed and -updates
<TheMuso> gah of course
<crimsun> the correct procedure is to bump 1 -> 1ubuntu0.1
<TheMuso> 2:1.4.9a-1ubuntu0.1 is still greater than 2:1.4.9a-1
<TheMuso> leonel: I'm still learning here too, so 2:1.4.9a-1ubuntu0.1 is what you want.
<gnomefreak> but he stated the changelog version was 2:1.4.9a-1ubuntu1
<crimsun> gnomefreak: that's the default for dch -i
<gnomefreak> is that current feisty version
<TheMuso> THats what dch -i created
<gnomefreak> oh ok
<leonel> ok  
<gnomefreak> 2:1.4.9a-1 =  version that is in feisty
<gnomefreak> than right?
<leonel> 2:1.4.9a-1ubuntu0.1  is ?
<TheMuso> Yes.
<gnomefreak> k
<leonel> squirrelmail (2:1.4.9a-1ubuntu0.1) feisty-security; urgency=low
<leonel> ok
<leonel> done
<crimsun> gnomefreak: yep.  On a current feisty box, ``apt-cache madison squirrelmail''
<TheMuso> Now. You will notice a * on an empty line. You need to explain what has been changed, in this case, the security fix.
<gnomefreak> im not on feisty atm :(
<TheMuso> This is done by creating bullet points of each change.
<crimsun> gnomefreak: cheat and use LP :)  https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/feisty/+source/squirrelmail
<TheMuso> crimsun: What necessary information is required in a changelog for the security fix? An URL to an explanation
<gnomefreak> :)
<crimsun> TheMuso: pitti mentored me, so to speak: include the files changed, what changed in those files, and include the CVE(s)
<TheMuso> crimsun: Ok.
<TheMuso> leonel: Is there a CVE entry for this fix, and do you know what has been changed in the files that get patched?
* TheMuso is starting to feel that the rest of this is beyond him, as he's not dealt with security fixes.
<leonel> TheMuso:  http://www.squirrelmail.org/security/issue/2007-05-09
<crimsun> e.g., * src/asplode.c::ohno() : Use strncpy() instead of strcpy().
<crimsun>  * CVE-somenumber
<TheMuso> leonel:Does that mention a CVE entry anywhere?
<gnomefreak>     CVE-2007-1262
<crimsun> I also normally put [SECURITY]  above the first changelog entry
<gnomefreak> TheMuso: the above i posted
<gnomefreak> is the cve
<leonel> the yes  
<gnomefreak> http://cve.mitre.org/cgi-bin/cvename.cgi?name=CVE-2007-1262
<TheMuso> gnomefreak: Just saw it.
<leonel> it's a 408 lines  patch 
<TheMuso> leonel: Ok we need to know what files have been changed, and what was changed in them.
<gnomefreak> leonel: how many different files doe sit patch?
<gnomefreak> does
<leonel> TheMuso: there where 3 files patched
<TheMuso> leonel: Yes, do you know what was changed in them to fix the issue?
<leonel> and  the patch is  408 lines long
<leonel> in each file  ??
<leonel> that's something long
<TheMuso> I don't know how else to explain whats required.
<leonel> can we put  [SECURITY]  put the fixed things  and  add the url for the advisory ?
<gnomefreak> we cant use debian/patches: added <nameofpatch> to fix LP bug#xxx?
<leonel> looking  at the change log
<leonel> previous bugfixes  say  
<TheMuso> gnomefreak: I think it needs to be done the same as, or mostly similar to what crimsun said above...
<leonel>  * New upstream security release.
<leonel>     - Additionally tightens HTML filter for IE <= 5 parsing
<leonel>       absolutely everything and it's hors
<gnomefreak> 408 lines == a little less than 200 fixes give or take maybe less without looking at patch
<gnomefreak> wait a minute
<gnomefreak> http://www.squirrelmail.org/security/issue/2007-05-09  the 5 or so fixes that the patch made
<gnomefreak> :)
<gnomefreak> cheat if you can
<gnomefreak> This release contains fixes for the following:
<gnomefreak> - HTML attachments containing "data:" URLs and so on
<gnomefreak> might want to chage it a bit but to get idea of what was change
<gnomefreak> d
<TheMuso> leonel: Unfortunately, I have to run. Sorry I am unable to help you any further at this point.
<leonel> so finishing the change log ?
<leonel> just rebuild ?
<TheMuso> Sorry, I really have to go now.
<leonel> Ok
<leonel> thanks  a lot 
<TheMuso> No problem.
<crimsun> leonel: use [SECURITY]  once before the first changelog item (marked by an asterisk), then include the URL to the announcement in a References section
<crimsun> leonel: I normally place the vendor URL(s) beneath the CVE(s)
<leonel> crimsun:  
<leonel>   * [SECURITY]  
<leonel>      - This Release applies the bugfixes for  CVE-2007-1262
<leonel>      - http://www.squirrelmail.org/security/issue/2007-05-09
<leonel> like that ?
<crimsun> I would use separate sections
<crimsun> [SECURITY] 
<crimsun> * foo blah
<crimsun> References
<crimsun> * CVE-2007-1262
<crimsun>   http://www.squirrelmail.org/security/issue/2007-05-09
<crimsun> the one.  the only!  bddebian. 
<crimsun> &freeflying
<bddebian> Heya gang
<bddebian> Hi crimsun
<RAOF> morning crimsun, bddebian :)
<crimsun> allo RAOF 
<bddebian> Hello RAOF
<freeflying> crimsun: hi
<freeflying> bddebian: hi
<bddebian> Hello freeflying
<persia> h bddebian
<bddebian> Heya persia
<RAOF> Hello freeflying, persia
<bddebian> Fixed the world yet persia? :-)
<freeflying> RAOF: hi
<leonel> crimsun: 
<leonel> 
<leonel>   [SECURITY] 
<leonel>   * Cross site scripting in HTML filter
<leonel>   References
<leonel>   * CVE-2007-1262
<leonel>   http://www.squirrelmail.org/security/issue/2007-05-09
<persia> bddebian: Nah, someone else handles the gaia package :)
<leonel> 
<leonel> like that ?
<crimsun> leonel: Can you glean from the patch(es) what was actually done to fix the XSS?
<crimsun> leonel: something along the lines of:  "Properly escape user input to fix XSS in HTML filter"
<crimsun> New bug: #113717 in blueprint "jesus, if you dont speak ubuntu it will take you down all kinds of blind alleys.  make it easy[..] "
<crimsun> hehe
<leonel>   * Cross site scripting in HTML filter
<leonel>     - HTML attachments containing "data:" URLs;
<leonel>     - Internet Explorer in various versions accepts many permutations of HTML
<leonel>     and JavaScript in many charsets. We now properly canonicalize the incoming
<leonel>     HTML to us-ascii before applying further filters. IE only.
<leonel>     - Request forgery through images. It was possible to include "images" in
<leonel>     HTML mails which were in fact GET requests for the compose.php page sending
<leonel>     mail. These images are now properly detected, and the compose form will only
<leonel>     send mail through a POST request.
<leonel>   * References
<leonel>    CVE-2007-1262
<leonel>    http://www.squirrelmail.org/security/issue/2007-05-09
<crimsun> whoa
<leonel> 
<leonel> just added  the  advisory descriptions
<crimsun> no need for that level of detail
<crimsun> a reader can glean that from navigating to the URL
<leonel> that's what I though when just put :
<crimsun> a simple "Validate input to resolve XSS in HTML filter" will suffice as the description
<bddebian> Hmm, reviews or stare at bugs I probably can't fix...
<crimsun> both!
<bddebian> Maybe just play F.E.A.R. instead.. :-)
<persia> bddebian: That's the spirit!
<leonel> 
<leonel>   [SECURITY] 
<leonel>   * Validate input to resolve XSS in HTML filte
<leonel>   References
<leonel>   * CVE-2007-1262
<leonel>   * http://www.squirrelmail.org/security/issue/2007-05-09
<leonel> like that ?
<bddebian> persia: I'm all washed up anyway. :-(
<crimsun> leonel: with the trailing 'r' in filter appended, but yes.
<leonel> done
<leonel> now  ?
<crimsun> leonel: attach the debdiff to the bug
<crimsun> leonel: then subscribe (don't assign to!) ubuntu-universe-sponsors
* ScottK is back for a moment.
<bddebian> Heya ScottK
<ScottK> leonel: Good job sticking with it.
<leonel> attach to the bug ??
<ScottK> TheMuso: THanks for all the help you gave leonel.  Sorry again I had to run.
<ScottK> leonel: The debdiff, yes.
<leonel> run debdiff  ?
<ScottK> leonel: I didn't see in the scrollback where you made a new source package.  Have you done that yet?
<ScottK> leonel: debdiff eventually.
<leonel> ScottK:  runned  dpatch-edit-patch
<ScottK> OK
<leonel> added the patch to the source
<ScottK> One more step.
<leonel> done the patchlist
<ScottK> Then we make a source package.
<ScottK> Right
<leonel> edited  the change log
<leonel> and  
<leonel> ScottK:  came ..
<ScottK> from within the source tree, do debuild -S -uc
<ScottK> That will build a new source package.
<leonel> parsechangelog/debian: error: badly formatted trailer line, at file debian/changelog line 11
<leonel> debuild: fatal error at line 617:
<ScottK> OK.  We need to fix that.
<ScottK> leonel: Please pastebin the first roughly 15 lines of your changelog
<ScottK> Some amount more than 11.
<leonel> squirrelmail (2:1.4.9a-1ubuntu0.1) feisty-security; urgency=low
<leonel> 
<leonel>   [SECURITY] 
<leonel>   * Validate input to resolve XSS in HTML filter
<leonel>   References
<leonel>   * CVE-2007-1262
<leonel>   * http://www.squirrelmail.org/security/issue/2007-05-09
<leonel>  -- Leonel Nunez<leonel@enelserver.com>  Wed,  9 May 2007 18:30:32 -0600
<leonel> squirrelmail (2:1.4.9a-1) unstable; urgency=high
<leonel>   * New upstream security release.
<leonel>     - Additionally tightens HTML filter for IE <= 5 parsing 
<leonel>       absolutely everything and it's horse.
<ScottK> !pastebin | leonel
<ubotu> leonel: pastebin is a service to post large texts so you don't flood the channel. The Ubuntu pastebin is at http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org (make sure you give us the URL for your paste - see also the #ubuntu channel topic)
<leonel> ScottK:  ok
<ScottK> You've got things a bit out of order.
<leonel> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/20100/
<leonel> plop
* ScottK looks
<ScottK> Actually it's just one extra line
<ScottK> You have two lines before the line with your name on it.  Remove 1 and run debuild -S -uc again.
<leonel> now on line 10
<leonel> running 
<leonel> missed a space  between my  Leonel Nunez <leonek ...
<leonel> ScottK: ok
<ScottK> That'll do it too.
<leonel> dpkg-buildpackage (debuild emulation): source only, diff-only upload (original source NOT included)
<leonel> done
<ScottK> now move up to one level above your source tree and you should see a bunch of new files
<leonel> ok
<ScottK> debdiff packagname-version.dsc packagname-version0.1.dsc > patchname.debdiff
<ScottK> Debdiff like that.
<ScottK> That will give you a diff you can attach to the bug.
<ScottK> Once that's done, sh /path/to/pbuilder/script/pbuilder-feisty build packagname-version0.1.dsc to do a test build of the new binary .deb.
<leonel> the patchname  is  the filename  on  debian/patches ?
<ScottK> patchname is the name you want on the debdiff.  It can be anything, but should be descriptive
<ScottK> feisty-squirrelmail-security.debdiff
<ScottK> For examplse
<ScottK> When you are pbuilding the package, check and make sure the patch gets applied.
<leonel> gpg: failed to create temporary file `/home/leonel/.gnupg/.#lk0x811ce20.ubuntu.16030': Permission denied
<leonel> ok
<leonel> got the  debdiff
<ScottK> Good.
<leonel> run the pbuilder-feisty ?
<ScottK> Does this have a bug in LP yet?
<ScottK> Yes
<leonel> don't know 
<ScottK> Yes to pbuilder Feisty.
* ScottK looks
<ScottK> leonel: It does not have a bug.  While the pbuilder is running, make a new bug, mark it for security, but not confidential.
<ScottK> Don't mark either if you aren't sure.
<ScottK> Then attach the debdiff.
<leonel> sh /home/leonel/pbuilder-feisty build  package.dsc   asks for password ?
<ScottK> Normal
<ScottK> Normal for me anyway.
<leonel> ok 
<leonel> running
<ScottK> leonel: Are you filing the bug now?
<leonel> yes
<leonel> where do I uplodad the debdiff ?
<leonel> in 
<leonel> Add a comment/attachment ?
<ScottK> Yes
<bddebian> Hmm, I wonder if Bug #46318 even makes sense.  It's a recommends not a depends
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 46318 in tutos2 "Change dependency from postgresql to postgresql-client" [Medium,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/46318
<leonel> what description ?
<leonel> ScottK: ?
<persia> bddebian: The linked bug (45968) seems to provide a compelling argument in the last comment.  Otherwise, perhaps suggests?  Odd to have a recommends (which typically autoinstalls) for a server on my workstation, when I might already have it installed on my server.
<leonel> ScottK:  the pbuilder finished 
<RAOF> leonel: "debdiff for fixed package"?
<ScottK> what ROAF said.
<leonel> this attachment is a patch ?
<ScottK> If the pbuilder was successful and the patch applied, mention that as a comment on the bug.
<ScottK> Yes
<leonel> ok
<leonel> comment added 
<leonel> debdiff submited
<leonel> now ?
<leonel> Pizzas for everyone ?
<RAOF> Back to base for debriefing and coctails!
<bddebian> persia: True 'nuff
<leonel> now can I build the package ?
<ScottK> You just did
<ScottK> look in ~/pbuilder and you should see the new .deb
<ScottK> What's the bug#?
<leonel> bug # 113725
<leonel> Great
* RAOF is offering a free pony for anyone who can get C++ code to compile in less than 10% of the estimated age of the universe.
<ScottK> Bug #113725
<ubotu> Bug 113725 on http://launchpad.net/bugs/113725 is private
<leonel> makeit public ?
<ScottK> leonel: You made it private.  Yes.  
<ScottK> This vulnerability is not a secret.
<ScottK> Already disclosed.
<ScottK> crimsun: Can you look at it after he makes it public?  I have to be afk for a while again?
<leonel> keep confidential ?   no
<leonel> ?
* RAOF goes off to cure cancer while scribus-ng builds
<bddebian> hehe
<leonel> Bug #113725
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 113725 in squirrelmail "Cross site scripting in HTML filter" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/113725
<leonel> ScottK:  now ? 
<RAOF> bddebian: I'm confident I'll have something before it's finished :P
<leonel> what's next ?
<RAOF> leonel: Now that you've got a debdiff for a fixed package up on launchpad, and you've subscribed ubuntu-universe-sponsors, and at least one MOTU knows about it, you're done.
<leonel> subscribed to  ubuntu-universe-sponsors ?
<leonel> I'm done ? 
<ScottK> leonel: Add the link for the CVE and subscribe UUS
<ScottK> Add CVE linke
<ScottK> Then you are done with Feisty.  Still need Edgy and Dapper....
<leonel> those can be done with backports ?
<leonel> or has to do the same ?
<ScottK> leonel: No
<leonel> the CVE marks as under review 
<ScottK> Pull down the source package for their current verions and see if the patch applies.  Some or all of it will.
<ScottK> We don't fix bugs with backports.
<leonel> ok
<ScottK> For backports, wait for the new upstream to hit gutsy and propose backporting that.
<leonel> now suscribte to the ubuntu universe sponsor  ?
<ScottK> Yes
<ScottK> I've got to run.
<leonel> that's a mailing list ?
<ScottK> It's a team of people that approve uploades
<leonel> what this means  I'm I a motu now ?
<ScottK> leonel: Thank you VERY much for your contribution.
<ScottK> No, it means you are a contributor though.
<leonel> ok
<leonel> I'll work with dapper  and  edgy later on
<ScottK> MOTU is people who know enough to have their stuff uploaded without review.  Not me yet.
<leonel> MOTUS  YOU ROCK !
<ScottK> Great.
<ScottK> You know the process now.
<leonel> Great !
<ScottK> Good job.
<ScottK> Good night all.
<leonel> wait
<leonel> it's a list  the   ubuntu universe sponsor ?
<leonel> ok
<leonel> suscribed 
<TheMuso> ScottK: No problem. Looks like you've dealt with security before.
<leonel> ScottK: TheMuso crimsun   Thanks    
<leonel> now to work on the dapper patch 
<leonel> but that will be tomorrow
<TheMuso> leonel: You're welcome. Sorry I had to leave when I did.
<leonel> TheMuso:  no problem 
<TheMuso> leonel: Has anybody uploaded the update for dapper yet?
<ScottK> leonel: This was the firehose method of learning.  You did well.
<TheMuso> Sorry, gutsy
<leonel> hehe
<leonel> TheMuso:  don't know 
<TheMuso> ok
<ScottK> TheMuso: No one has.  Since it's a straight Debian package and there's a new upstream release, it might make sense just to wait.
<TheMuso> ScottK: Yeah true that.
<ScottK> IMO anyone running Gutsy just now deserves whatever they get....
<TheMuso> Hense me using a chroot/pbuilder only.
* ScottK too.
<leonel> TheMuso:  no  there's no  dapper  bug report
<TheMuso> leonel: Yeah I just saw that.
<leonel> but there are other bugs for dapper
<leonel> I think I can do the diffs for those
<ScottK> leonel: The bug report you did is now nominated for Dapper too.
<ScottK> And edgy.
<leonel> but will it work ?
<ScottK> Bug #113725
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 113725 in squirrelmail "Cross site scripting in HTML filter" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/113725
<ScottK> You need to check it and see.
<leonel> ScottK: because there are other reports  for edgy  and dapper
<leonel> thos had to be done  separated ?
<leonel> or can be done in the same  diff ?
<ScottK> leonel: Other reports for this issue or other problems?
<ScottK> leonel: Just fix the security problem in the security upload.
<ScottK> There is another, more deliberate process for non-security fixes to stable releases.  See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/SRU
<ScottK> You can combine multiple fixes in the same diff, just not security with non-security.
* ScottK will be around most of the day during the day (US East Coast) tomorrow if you have questions.
<ScottK> Good night again everyone. leonel - Great job tonight.
<bddebian> Gnight ScottK.  You're the master! :)
<ScottK> No, just old and sneaky.
<leonel> ScottK:  thanks  good night every one
<leonel> good night everyone 
<leonel> got to go 
<leonel> and thanks  for all the help 
<bddebian> Gah, damnit
<RAOF> ?
<bddebian> I patched the wrong version :-(
<RAOF> Whoops!
<TheMuso> heh
<sharms> anyone think I am going to far on this? http://www.sharms.org/blog/?p=101
<AnAnt> Hello,
<AnAnt> if I got 2 packages X & Y
<AnAnt> Y depends on X
<AnAnt> and it is better that since you got X to install Y
<AnAnt> ie. in the Depends: field of Y , there is X
<AnAnt> so is it correct to put Y in the Suggests: field of X ?
<dabaR> sharms: Dunno, it is pretty harsh, I hope it was called for by the article. That quote you have in no way seems to have called that kind of response.
<persia> AnAnt: Only if most users of X want Y.  If X is independently useful, no need to suggest Y.
<AnAnt> persia: ok, thanks
<dabaR> sharms: the article does not call for that, IMHO.
<dabaR> sharms: But it is in alignment with some of the content you have been putting out on the planet that I have read.
<sharms> ha
<sharms> appreciate the view
<sharms> see I take offense to the fact that he claims Ubuntu is "So let Ubuntu take the lead in building the better horse."
<jmg> sharms: where is the original url?
<jmg> oh, found it.
<dabaR> sharms: Sure, but that is his opinion, and then yuo went and dissed mugshot, olpc, and maybe others, I can not remember. You went on a defensive by doing an offensive.
<jmg> sharms: this is weird
<jmg> hes going on about how havoc pennington tried to change the desktop
<jmg> and failed
<jmg> talking about the purchase of yahoo as if it were possible
<dabaR> We should be positive as a community, it looks better. Not to blame you at all, I understand how hard it is in certain situations to be positive. I leave my replies to sit for a while if what I am replying to annoys me.
<sharms> yeah I am about 50/50 on removing it
<sharms> I wanted to vent, but I don't want a war of who can piss on who
<jmg> yep
<jmg> i actually think it doesnt dignify response
<dabaR> Ya.
<jmg> his is just an unstructured rant
<dabaR> But see someone else's opinion still. You can always readd it, when the thoughts ripen more.
<sharms> ha
<sharms> he replied to my post
<sharms> I just took it down though
<jmg> who is this guy and why cant he use a real name?
<dabaR> WHat was the reply?
<sharms> So why not post your rejoinder on Shadowmans blog? Thats what the comments section is for, after all. :)
<dabaR> jmg: Havoc...:)
<sharms> he only refers to himself in the 3rd person
<sharms> shadowman@redhat.com
<dabaR> I think he makes an OK point. But there will still be a need for horses for a long while, and bug #1 is bug #1.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 1 in Ubuntu "Microsoft has a majority market share" [Critical,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/1
<jmg> what a retard
<dabaR> jmg: his post really offends you that much?
<sharms> dabaR: definitely.  He is saying our work is worthless
<sharms> that is pretty darn mean
<jmg> dabaR: it just strikes me as the delusions of a crackhead
<sharms> because redhat is apparently full of visionaries, who are claiming their mugshot site with its 12 users is some huge thing
<dabaR> sharms: I don't think so. He just says that the goals we have are worthless. And different people have different goals. The widespread usage of Ubuntu points that the goal is not so bad.
<crimsun> sharms: lots of people say lots of things.  His work on $whatever doesn't make him a deity.
<sharms> crimsun: his comments are in the official redhat magazine, meaning that represents the company
<crimsun> sharms: that doesn't make him or Red Hat the biggest thing since toilet paper.
<jmg> its weird hes going
<dabaR> sharms: well, every newspaper has a columnist that is a little opinionated. That is what gets conversations like this going. And you linked to him. In google terms, you voted for him.
<sharms> agreed, just it really frustrated me
<jmg> "the desktop doesnt matter, only online matters"
<dabaR> jmg: to me it is only an admission of defeat.
<jmg> because ubuntu broke the choke hold of wintendo on dell
<jmg> and not deadrat
<dabaR> hehe:)
<sharms> dabaR: it's not defeat though, in the same way where if someone punches me in the face I can't sit there and just smile back and know I am right
<jmg> i bet if it had been deadrat installed on michael dell's laptop, hed have become so frustrated, "this will never work for the end user" and buried the project
<sharms> sometimes you need to be right, and punch them back
<jacquesmerde> after doing an apt-get source package, and editing package/debian/rules, how do i install it?
<dabaR> sharms: OK. Again, like I said, the post went with the personality you portray in your blog posts. And every person has their place in the world.
<sharms> jacquesmerde: build it in pbuilder or debuild?
<jacquesmerde> sharms: yeah....how do i do that?
<jacquesmerde> all i've done is add a confure option
<jacquesmerde> *configure
<jacquesmerde> !debuild
<ubotu> Sorry, I don't know anything about debuild - try searching on http://bots.ubuntulinux.nl/factoids.cgi
<jacquesmerde> !pbuilder
<ubotu> pbuilder is a system to easily build packages in a clean chroot environment. To get started with PBuilder, see http://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto
<sharms> http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/index.html
<jacquesmerde> how do i use debuild? i think thats what i want
<persia> jacquesmerde: debuild is part of devscripts
<persia> jacquesmerde: Just run debuild in the package directory (foo-x.y)
<dabaR> jacquesmerde: try running debuild -uc -us -b -i
<sharms> jacquesmerde: this is required reading: http://doc.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/packagingguide/C/index.html
<dabaR> jacquesmerde: if you get an error about your GPG key with just debuild.
<jacquesmerde> sharms: it would take me a while to get the background knowledge to understand all of that link. does that mean i shouldnt be fiddling with packages?
<sharms> jacquesmerde: fiddle all you want, but the answer to your question and many more future ones are in that link
<jacquesmerde> sharms: then i'll bookmark and hopefully come back to it later in more detail
<sharms> awesome
<jacquesmerde> fakeroot && debuild gives me: "debuild: fatal error at line 987: You do not appear to have all build dependencies properly met, aborting." why won't it tell me the critical build dependency?
<sharms> apt-get build-dep
<jacquesmerde> "E: Build-dependencies for bmpx could not be satisfied." EQUALLY useful
<jacquesmerde> how do i find out what i'm missing?
<bddebian> as sharms said, use apt-get build-dep <package>
<bddebian> Oh, nm
<jacquesmerde> i did, thats where the above error came from
<bddebian> debuild should tell you what packages it can't meet
<jacquesmerde> it didnt
<bddebian> Try to install them 1 by 1
<bddebian> Use dpkg-buildpackage
<nixternal> boo
<bddebian> aahh
<jacquesmerde> should apt-get build-dep package install all deps of that package?
<bddebian> All build-deps, yes
<persia> jacquesmerde: It's supposed to do that, but sometimes is has trouble if there are conflicts.
<jacquesmerde> whats the install equivalent of build-dep? not isntall-dep...
<Flannel> jacquesmerde: just plain installing will do it
<bddebian> dependencies are at install build-dependencies are build time
<persia> jacquesmerde: There isn't one.  Try `sudo gdebi -i foo.deb` to help with this.
<jacquesmerde> i'll just do apt-get install && apt-get remove (not autoremove)
<jacquesmerde> i dont have a .deb yet
<dabaR> I think the difference b/w libX and libX-dev will cause problems in this case.
<jacquesmerde> i have to use a lot of -dev packages to build its dependency
<dabaR> to build it, there are many required -dev packages?
<dabaR> you have all the source repos enabled, right?
<jacquesmerde> ok, i'm trying to install bmpx, but i want to use the soulseek feature, so i had to install moodriver from source (which required getting a lot of dev pacakges to build somehow), and now i've added a configure option to bmpx which is enable-moodriver
<jacquesmerde> dabaR: i THINK so...
<dabaR> jacquesmerde: you could show the sources file on pastebin. I will look at it.
<jacquesmerde> in synaptic i went to options, repositories, then selected the source option (below universe, multiverse, etc...) and then clicked reload
<jacquesmerde> this all seems too complicated for me. maybe i should go back to archlinux
<bddebian> Anyway, gnight gang
<jacquesmerde> dabaR: is that all i'm supposed to do to enable sources?
<dabaR> jacquesmerde: I would personally just ./configure, make, and then sudo checkinstall
<dabaR> jacquesmerde: I have not used synaptic in ages, but it sounds right. Post your /etc/apt/sources.list file to paste.ubuntu-nl.org, please. I will see whether that is properly set up.
<jacquesmerde> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/20110/
<jacquesmerde> sudo apt-get build-dep bmpx
<jacquesmerde> Reading package lists... Done
<jacquesmerde> Building dependency tree       
<jacquesmerde> Reading state information... Done
<jacquesmerde> E: Build-dependencies for bmpx could not be satisfied.
<dabaR> jacquesmerde: yes, it is fine. If you do not need to use debuild, I would recommend checkinstall myself.
<crimsun> just some words of caution: "checkinstall" really is likely to send us into convulsions.
<jacquesmerde> so just do ./configure && make && sudo make install?
<jacquesmerde> will that take into account my changed /debian/rules?
<crimsun> jacquesmerde: did you apt-get build-dep bmpx ?
<jacquesmerde> i tried!
<jacquesmerde> see directly above...
<crimsun> jacquesmerde: are main and universe components both uncommented for deb  /and/  deb-src?
<dabaR> crimsun: thanks for the words of caution. I was a little scared of recommending it, but I did it because it always works here. 
<jacquesmerde> dabaR: are they?
<dabaR> crimsun: Yes, they are, see http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/20110/
<dabaR> crimsun: I also get the same error.
<crimsun> hmm, so do I.  Let's walk the stack.
<jacquesmerde> walk the stack? i'm guessing i'll have to sit this conversation out...
<crimsun> jacquesmerde: it means, roughly, "check the entire list of build dependencies".
<jacquesmerde> ouch!
<dabaR> crimsun: can we see that with the apt-cache show bmpx command?
<dabaR> crimsun: can we see the list, that is.
<crimsun> apt-cache showsrc bmpx|grep ^Build
<dabaR> crimsun: Thanks.
<crimsun> ah, libfam-dev
<crimsun> sudo aptitude install libgamin-dev && sudo apt-get build-dep bmpx
<jacquesmerde> so what went wrong??
<jacquesmerde> why didnt build-dep install that?
<crimsun> libfam-dev is a direct build-dependency, but another build-dependency needs libgamin-dev (which provides and replaces libfam-dev)
<crimsun> apt-get threw its arms up because it can't resolve conflicting dependencies 
<crimsun> libgamin-dev provides, conflicts, and replaces libfam-dev, rather
<jacquesmerde> so the debian/rules file needs to be fixed? or somethnig less superficial as well?
<crimsun> change debian/control's libfam-dev build-dependency to libgamin-dev, or just remove libfam-dev altogether
<crimsun> the background and necessary reading is here: http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-relationships.html
<jacquesmerde> ok, i'm apt-get build-dep bmpx now. then fakeroot && debuild?
<jacquesmerde> crimsun: ?
<jacquesmerde> are you filing a bug report?
<imbrandon> debuild will call fakeroot its self ( as will pbuilder iirc )
<jacquesmerde> so all i have to do is type `debuild' in the directory?
<jacquesmerde> then how do i install it?
<nixternal> dpkg-buildpackage is the only one you would call fakeroot -rfakeroot
<imbrandon> depends on exactly what you want to do, most likely you want `debuild -us -uc` if you looking for something to install
<nixternal> the rest call it automagically
<imbrandon> heya nixternal 
<nixternal> hola imbrandon 
<jacquesmerde> i've dont an apt-get source, and just edited /debian/rules...
<jacquesmerde> this is all new to me
<freeflying> do we automatically sync from sid now? or need file bug
<imbrandon> sure, but what are you wanting to do ?
<imbrandon> freeflying, automagicly
<freeflying> imbrandon: thanks
<jacquesmerde> install an existing package in universe, just with an extra configure --enable-moodriver
<imbrandon> then yes, call `debuild -us -uc` in the directory
<imbrandon> and it will make a .deb for you in ../
<jacquesmerde> too late, did a plain debuild. it seems to be going ok. do i cancel it and add -us -uc?
<imbrandon> ( assuming it builds )
<imbrandon> jacquesmerde, well at the end it will fail because you likely dont have the secret key to the last person in the changelog
<crimsun> no need to cancel
<crimsun> right.
<jacquesmerde> right? so i DO need to cancel?
<jacquesmerde> its up to make...
<imbrandon> or wait for it to bomb, upto you
<crimsun> there's no need to cancel.
<crimsun> the "right" referred to imbrandon's comment
<jacquesmerde> crimsun: no need to cancel coz i can just wait for it to fail then start again?
<crimsun> debsign's the step that will fail.  By that point, the debs will have been generated.
<jacquesmerde> crimsun: did you file a bug report about the libfam-dev thing?
<jacquesmerde> debs? plural?
<crimsun> jacquesmerde: no, I'm in a meeting.  Feel free to file one.
<crimsun> (if one doesn't already exist)
<jacquesmerde> crimsun: i would, but i dont really understand the problem
<crimsun> see ``apt-cache showsrc bmpx|grep ^Bin''
<crimsun> the bmpx source package builds three binary packages.
<imbrandon> a single source package can generate more thna one .deb binary
<jacquesmerde> crimsun: i need to install them all? in the right order?
<imbrandon> i havent looked but assuming one is -dev and one is -dbg so no
<imbrandon> probbaly not
<jacquesmerde> so just install the one without the -dev or -dbg, etc..?
<imbrandon> if you dont need/want those ( and assuming i was correct in my assumption )
<imbrandon> yes
<jacquesmerde> sweet
<jacquesmerde> and i can just install the .deb via nautilus yeah?
<imbrandon> sudo dpkg -i blah.deb
<jacquesmerde> right click, install, or whatever...
<jacquesmerde> -i = install?
<imbrandon> man dpkg for the diffrent options like -i ( but -i is all you should need )
<imbrandon> yes
<jacquesmerde> sweet
<jacquesmerde> this a whole lot harder than archlinux's ABS and pacman, but i'm guessing a LOT mroe powerful to justify it?
<crimsun> if you're using gnome, just secondary-click the .deb and install it
<imbrandon> or yes gdebi via natilus should work too, but its good to know the other ways
<jacquesmerde> crimsun: yeah, thats what i meant
<crimsun> (gdebi is what does the work for you if you secondary-click and choose install)
<jacquesmerde> i'm still put off that there was a case with ubuntu that i had to use the cli when i felt i shouldnt have had to
<jacquesmerde> not this case, of course...
<crimsun> what case?
<imbrandon> for ? 
<jacquesmerde> samba shares
<jacquesmerde> i did 99% of it via gui, and it never hinted there was a cli part too
<imbrandon> gnome i'm guessing ? ( not to pot shot but KDE has a GUI samba share util in the control center )
<imbrandon> what part via the cli ?
<jacquesmerde> the cli part was just setting smbpasswd. does kde do THAT via gui?
<jacquesmerde> i think debuild has crashed
<imbrandon> not sure to be honest, never tried it using smbpassword
<jacquesmerde> well, with the gnome one, it shared a directory over samba fine, but i couldnt ACCESS the directory without a username and password, which i had to set vis smbpasswd
<imbrandon> ahh
<imbrandon> back in a bit, time for some lunch
<crimsun> jacquesmerde: what do you mean by crashed?
<jacquesmerde> crimsun: sorry, i take that back
<dabaR> crimsun: What does one do with a bug like https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/revelation/+bug/113728 ? I have confirmed the error. I am unable to get the fix they cite in their bts tested, as their code is undergoing major changes. 
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 113728 in revelation "Cannot export to xhtml/css" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  
<crimsun> dabaR: set it to Confirmed
<persia> For packages maintained by Debian QA, is minimal-diff still best policy, or are things like adding debian/patches, updating to current policy, etc. received well?
<minghua> persia: want to adopt it? :-)
<persia> minghua: I'm not a DD.  I hear the process is lengthy.  Otherwise, sure.
<ASCIIGirl> which package are you offering?
<minghua> persia: you can always send you patches to Debian BTS
<persia> ASCIIGirl: I'm working on freqtweak.
<minghua> persia: if they are good patches, someone in QA group can upload it
<persia> minghua: That's my plan: I just didn't know if a general update would be accepted.  Usually, I try to keep the patches small.
<ASCIIGirl> Im a DD, if you need help on uploading to Debian...
<minghua> persia: after sending several good patches, I believe it's easy to find a sponsor (you don't need to be a DD to maintain a package)
<RAOF> My understanding is you don't *need* to be a DD to maintain a package, you just need a sponsor
<ASCIIGirl> right.. RAOF... you need a sponsor to upload your package
<crimsun> correct.  There are also several DDs{,' clients} here.
<minghua> persia: or you can ask around here, there are quite a few DDs in the MOTU and they are very willing to sponsor packages
<persia> ASCIIGirl: Great.  If you're up for that, I'll grab the CVS for the never-to-be-released 0.7.0 (basically inactive upstream), and bring the package up to current standards.
<RAOF> Thinking of which, once I get around to working out what dh_iconcache (IIRC) acutally does, I'll need a sponsor for specto :)
<ASCIIGirl> perfect persia :)
<dabaR_> crimsun: What does one do with a bug like https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/revelation/+bug/113728 ? I have confirmed the error. I am unable to get the fix they cite in their bts tested.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 113728 in revelation "Cannot export to xhtml/css" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  
<minghua> dabaR_: <crimsun> dabaR: set it to Confirmed
<dabaR_> minghua: thanks.
<persia> minghua: Regarding scim-hangul, does this just need forward-porting of your previous patches, or is it more involved?
<minghua> persia: you mean the skim module thing?
<persia> minghua: Yes.  I don't mind running patches and testing, if you're short time, but I don't know skim that well, so if it's deep code changes, I won't grab it.
<Hanusz_Leszek> I am new to the ubuntu build process. I just created a pbuilder environment and compiled a modified version of nautilus for testing. How can I test this modified version without screwing my system? Can i uncompress /var/cache/pbuilder/base.tgz and chroot in it ? Is it the default method ?
<minghua> persia: I think scim-hangul has a new upstream version, let me check
<minghua> persia: yes, upstream has 0.3.1 now
<minghua> persia: as to my patch, I am not so sure about its quality, and haven't touched for a year
<persia> minghua: OK.  Thanks for the feedback.  I'll take a quick look against 0.3.1.
<minghua> persia: there is also the complexity of scim-hangul being main package
<minghua> persia: and lack of feedback from Korean users.  I basically just lot the motivation.
<persia> minghua: I've had two main uploads for gutsy so far, so I'm OK with that :)
<persia> minghua: Do we have a very active Korean community?  Most of what I see is for Chinese or Japanese.
<minghua> persia: cool.  feel free to ping me if you have any questions
<persia> minghua: Thanks.
<minghua> persia: atie (the bug reporter) was quite active at that time (dapper development cycle, I believe), but not anymore
<minghua> persia: but I didn't see anyone else
<imbrandon> hrm am i missing something or is libapache-mod-php5 not in feisty
<imbrandon> !info libapache-mod-php5 feisty
<ubotu> Package libapache-mod-php5 does not exist in feisty
<imbrandon> !info libapache-mod-php5 edgy
<ubotu> Package libapache-mod-php5 does not exist in edgy
<StevenK> It's only in sid.
<imbrandon> hrm
<imbrandon> wtf, over!
<imbrandon> so i cant use php5 with apache 1.3 ?
<imbrandon> ( in feisty )
<StevenK> But why use Apache 1.3?
<imbrandon> because it much less of a resource hog than apache2.2
<imbrandon> on my poor old webserver
<StevenK> Use the apache2.2 prefork MPM with a low child count?
<imbrandon> StevenK, hrm your speeking greek to me, and what would that do when there are tons of hits , give thema  server busy ?
<StevenK> Not sure.
<imbrandon> is there a reason its not in feisty or ...
* imbrandon consders building the sid packages for ubuntu
<ajmitch> morning
<imbrandon> heya ajmitch 
<nixternal> imbrandon: your buddy is haunting me damnit
<imbrandon> ?
<imbrandon> who?
<nixternal> he is like a cold sore, he disappears for a while, and then all of a sudden he shows back up
<nixternal> the ninja
<nixternal> NINJA!
<imbrandon> jbruouhard or w/e his nick was?
<nixternal> yup
<imbrandon> hahahahahaha
<nixternal> glad you find that funny
<nixternal> he is trying to sell all of his stuff now
<imbrandon> send him to cutiecoders chan :)
<nixternal> he has like 5 machines for sale
<nixternal> cutiecoder is dead I thought
<nixternal> overdosed on BS
<imbrandon> he is always selling something, thats how i met him , buying an iBook from him
<nixternal> ya, i reember that
<nixternal> reember, must be from watching to much cheech and chong
<imbrandon> brb
<jacquesmerde> now that i've installed a universe package from source, how do i stop update manager trying to update it?
<RAOF> jacquesmerde: Choices include: pinning it, giving your local copy a higher version number, and probably some others.
<imbrandon> jacquesmerde, http://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/apt-howto/ch-apt-get.en.html read up on pinning
<imbrandon> or give it a bigger version
<imbrandon> yea what RAOF said :)
<Loic> imbrandon: hi. libxvidcore4 in feisty-proposed has received 3 "Ok" and has been out for one week now at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xvidcore/+bug/84705. Do you know how to get it into main?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 84705 in xvidcore "[Feisty]  libxvidcore missing dependency for yasm for i386 arch : more than 3 times slower than in edgy" [Undecided,Fix committed]  
<nixternal> haha
<imbrandon> Loic, its been in -proposed 7 days ?
<Loic> Yeah
<Loic> It's been in proposed since 05/02
<imbrandon> k , i'll upload it here in just a bit
<minghua> why is everybody recommending pinning when a simple "apt-get hold" should solve the problem?
<Loic> Thank you
<imbrandon> np
<jacquesmerde> thanks, will the pinning be a problem if i want to remove the package, and then install a higher one with dpkg?
* RAOF didn't recommend "apt-get hold" because he didn't know about it.  But claims that it falls under "probably some others" :P
<jacquesmerde> updatemanager wanted to update as soon as i'd installed it. i think its the SAME version
<jacquesmerde> so what version do i put it inpreferences?
<jacquesmerde> and why did i have to MAKE the preferences file?
<imbrandon> if it was me personaly i woudl just rebuild with a higher version number
<imbrandon> ( done via editing the debian/changelog and then rerunning `debuild -us -uc` )
<jacquesmerde> can i just pin at version 0.000000000001?
<RAOF> Rejoice, for scribus-ng merge is now available to clog the build-daemons with hours of C++ building fun! (u-u-s bug #113758)
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 113758 in scribus-ng "Please merge scribus-ng 1.3.4.dfsg~cvs20070427-1 from Debian" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/113758
<imbrandon> you can but then if there are security updates etc it will not update, but if you add ~jacquesmerde to the version it will ( but not right now )
<jacquesmerde> but if i update it, i'll lose my configure options, yeah?
<imbrandon> yes, but security update > configure options IMHO
<minghua> imbrandon: I wouldn't say that for my music player, though
<jacquesmerde> imbrandon: yeah, but in this case the configure is required for the only functionality of the app i want!
<jacquesmerde> i had to set version to 0.1 and priority to 1000. this seems kinda hacky to me, to solve a fairly commonplace problem...
<persia> RAOF: You should open the bug earlier - keeps anyone from pouncing :)
<RAOF> persia: Ok.  I *had* commented on DaD, but I'll also open launchpad bugs if you recommend it :)
<persia> RAOF: To the best of my knowledge, DaD and MoM have about equal brainshares currently.  Once DaD takes over completely, the bugs can probably go away.
<StevenK> Why would DaD take over completly?
<RAOF> Because it has the comment field :)
<persia> StevenK: Why not?
<StevenK> Because Canonical have spent money developing MoM?
<imbrandon> i forgot we were canonical ...
* imbrandon ducks
<persia> StevenK: I'm just guessing, but if DaD is as good or better than MoM, it would be worth reassigning developers.  Depends on the DaD community, really.
<minghua> oh
<RAOF> Hm, it seems that 
<RAOF> DaD doesn't like the faad2 package very much.
* minghua just realized why DaD is called so
* RAOF has an epiphany also.
<StevenK> Yes. Done and Dusted
<StevenK> or something ...
<RAOF> Ok, rather than see whether MoM likes faad2, I'll go and do some of the marking I need done by tomorrow :)
<sorsis> how may I join this jolly group?
<imbrandon> sorsis, as in MOTU?
<sorsis> yes
<imbrandon> sorsis, just jump in :) http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU is a good place to start
<imbrandon> and poke arround in here
<sorsis> i have seen it
<imbrandon> we always love new blood , keeps us on our toes 
<Hobbsee> mmm....blood
<Hobbsee> oh wait.
<sorsis> i've joinde launchpad
<imbrandon> Hobbsee, heh
<sorsis> i tried to join motu group but it's restricted
<imbrandon> sorsis, well tobecome a full fledged MOTU with upload rights normaly takes a few 6 months or better contributing
<imbrandon> and learnging the systems
<sorsis> no problem
<imbrandon> but to help out and start its very trivial
<imbrandon> just pick something and start asking questions :)
<sorsis> i've been using debian quite many years now so i know the basics
<imbrandon> heya Hobbsee :)
<sorsis> is there software development needed?
<Hobbsee> hi imbrandon :)
<sorsis> i saw that you need some people to test packages
<RAOF> sorsis: If you want to build some awesome software, we'll be happy to help you package it :)
<sorsis> packages and iso images
<persia> sorsis: We always need help testing packages and fixing bugs :)
<imbrandon> sorsis, yea testing is always needed, bug triage is ALWASY needed and packageres of patches is always welcome too
<imbrandon> fooooood bbiab
<sorsis> is there anywhere any assignment to apply or should i just poke blindly
<RAOF> Depends on what you want to be doing.  If you want to bugfix/triage, you should check out the untriaged bugs.
<persia> sorsis: I recommend checking the bug pages for packages for which you understand the source, picking a package that looks like you can fix the bugs, and hitting as many as you can.
<RAOF> If you want to help package, then merging/syncing packages from Debian is what we're currently doing
<imbrandon> sorsis, https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.tag=bitesize is a good place to start off
<imbrandon> IMHO
<RAOF> Or the mentoring bugs? https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-dev/+mentoring
<imbrandon> those are the bugs deemed bitsized
<imbrandon> RAOF, there is a + beside the bitsized ones with mentoring too
<orion2012> I have a package that I'm trying to debianize, it's an app that should have a .desktop file, but it doesn't. What would be the proper means of patching it to add a .desktop file? Thanks for any hints.
<RAOF> Cool, take the intersection! :)
<persia> orion2012: I'll walk you through it.
<orion2012> persia: Thanks.
<sorsis> thank you. i'll start looking for those
<luisbg> hello all
<TheMuso> RAOF: How long does scribus-ng take to build?
* TheMuso considers whether he is game enough to sponsor...
<RAOF> On an Athlon64 3500+ with 1Gb of ram?  About an hour.
<TheMuso> Hmmm.
<dholbach> good morning
<RAOF> c'mon, you know you've got an hour of processor time lying around spare :P
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: go for it
<Hobbsee> hi dh
<Hobbsee> hi dholbach 
* Hobbsee kills the tab key
<dholbach> hello Hobbsee
* dholbach hugs Hobbsee ecstatically :)
<ajmitch> dholbach
<ajmitch> !
<dholbach> ajmitch
<ajmitch> Hobbsee!
<ajmitch> :)
<Hobbsee> help!  i'm being squished!
<dholbach> 
<Hobbsee> oh noes, it's ajmitch!!!!
<ajmitch> run aways!
<Hobbsee> careful, ajmitch likes picking people up, and attempting to throw them into the pool!
<ajmitch> I would never
<sorsis> can i suggest a project where i could be member?
<Hobbsee> of course
<Hobbsee> ajmitch: sure you wouldnt.  i believe there are incriminating pictures.
<sorsis> i would like to help people choose their programs
<sorsis> and some to make some kind of tutorial of linux to be excecuted in start of first start up
<ogra> TheMuso, oh, you are poking on scribus-ng ? i was planning to replace scribus in main with it since the one we have there is not supported upstream anymore
<TheMuso> ogra: Go ahead.
<TheMuso> I wasn't really thinking of doing it.
<TheMuso> Don't have time atm
<ogra> TheMuso, well, i was to busy last release to manage that ....
<TheMuso> right
<sorsis> how could i drive this forward?
<ogra> so no promises from my side ... i was hoping debian would have done the switch before we sync the archive ... but they seem to want to keep the old one
<ajmitch> sorsis: sounds like it may be related to 'ubuntu welcome centre', which is a project I've only heard of
<TheMuso> ogra: Ok then, if nobody does it in the next couple of hours, I will probably poke at it.
<ogra> TheMuso, well, i'm at UDS, i will surely not do it while being here ...
<TheMuso> Righto.
<TheMuso> ogra: I just thought another sponsor might.
<Hobbsee> sorsis: write the program, then package it?
<sorsis> Hobbsee: there is quite a lot of depencies to other programs as far as i have planned it. i can't do it alone.
<sorsis> actually to other project would be better word
<sorsis> projects :)
<persia> Mez: Hey.  Whatever happened to nostromo?
<sorsis> well.. i quess i can contact other project members and start doing work....
<Mez> hey persian
<persia> UUS Team: Do you tend to use bugmail or +subscribed to track UUS bugs?
<Hobbsee> persia: i use subscribed, but keep an eye on bugmail
<Hobbsee> persia: i've filed a bug to be able to get all bugs sub'd to a team, for a distro, so hopefully that'll happen
<TheMuso> persia: Combination of both.
<persia> Hobbsee, TheMuso: Thanks.  That matches my understanding of how it works.  I'm just concerned about bug #58410, and wanted to verify that +subscribedbugs was important.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 58410 in malone ""Subscribe Someone Else" should be restricted to drivers of relevant software" [Low,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/58410
<Hobbsee> persia: interesting
<sorsis> hey guys. i would like to make a whole new distro of Ubuntu
<sorsis> Rubuntu
<sorsis> Raw Ubuntu with Ubuntu-welcome-center
<Hobbsee> go for it
<sorsis> i need help
<Hobbsee> what's Ubuntu-welcome-center?
<sorsis> it's empty project since last summer
<sorsis> no code done
<sorsis> so i guess i have to be making my own
<sorsis> but i need help of some more experienced ubuntu "developer"
<Hobbsee> quite likely
<Hobbsee> but, is it useful to all the current ubuntu flavours?
<sorsis> actually it would be quite raw version of ubuntu
<Hobbsee> raw?
<sorsis> yes
<sorsis> more closer to xubuntu than ubuntu or kubuntu
<imbrandon> man jono seems to be the superstar of blogs from UDS :)
<sorsis> more like installation media of edubuntu, xubuntu and kubuntu
<sorsis> with spices
<imbrandon> guess he's doing his job
<imbrandon> lol
<Hobbsee> sorsis: i'd suggest you write the program, then look at exactly how you put it in
<sorsis> Hobbsee: but see. there is some depencys on other projects and before i want to write it i would like to ask how they would think of it
<ajmitch> imbrandon: http://jonobaconfanclub.co.uk/
<Hobbsee> sorsis: it's all GPL'd - you can link against anything in the repos
<Hobbsee> of course, depending on what you link to will partly define where it goes
<imbrandon> ajmitch, ahhahahahahaha
<imbrandon> zomg <blink></blink>
<imbrandon> and marque ...
<sorsis> Hobbsee: wouls spare a moment of you time for private conversation? i would like to have oppinion of more experienced ubuntu maintainer/developer.
<sorsis> would you
<sorsis> or should i spit out the ideas what i'm thinking of
<sorsis> on this channel
<imbrandon> sorsis, your welcome to here if it becomes tooooooo far offtopic someone might point you elsewhere for more info
<imbrandon> etc
<sorsis> ok
<Hobbsee> this channel
* Hobbsee is in a session at the developers summit at the moment
<imbrandon> ( note too a good portion of the ubuntu devs are in spain atm )
<imbrandon> Hobbsee, what session ?
<Hobbsee> imbrandon: bug reporting
<sorsis> quite many people install first regular ubuntu, and then later kubuntu because they want more intitive interface etc. other want more simple system to save power of their laptop
<sorsis> it would be nice if installation media would execute a dialogue which would ask are experienced linux user etc. i'm not going to interfere this experienced guys while they install their system, but would like to make installation media to preconfigure their installation on their true needs
<sorsis> then installation media would install needed packages from internet if everything wouldn't be on the CD or DVD
<sorsis> so that one disc wouldn't be for a certain kind of system
<Hobbsee> so you're really trying to integrate with ubiquity
<Hobbsee> which isnt a separate distro thing
<sorsis> young hippies and energy saving laptop owner wouldn't get so much fof eye candy and so on
<Hobbsee> or flavour
<sorsis> i don't know what i'm doing so thats why i'm talking with you guys
<sorsis> i have planned some code and system integration but like i said it would be nice to have some help with it
<sorsis> and if installation media would benchmark the system before installation starts user, wouldn't get un wanted slowness and new comp users would have all the eye candy unless they are energy saving hippies
<sorsis> i'm just thinking these to make user experience of first trial more pleased for newbies, older people and other people who don't want to know how much their CPU has cache
<sorsis> and it would allso be nice if old people would get easy system to have make contact with other older people
<sorsis> and so on
<sorsis> isn't ubuntu about people collaboration? lets try to bring everyone around the linux
<sorsis> lets not try to compete favor of geeks who can spell asbcd... in binary
<Hobbsee> of course.  so write it :)
<sorsis> lets make them dependat about it because their mother uses it and they want to make their mother silent by creating more easier system to contact her friends
<sorsis> i need help
<Hobbsee> i think you're looking for cjwatson, for the installer
<StevenK> My thought was the Installer was pretty easy already.
<RAOF> Precisely because it *doesn't* have (much) configuration?
<sorsis> but the problem is that it install ubuntu. not the system you mother wants
<StevenK> So you'd rather the Ubuntu Live CD be a Vista DVD?
* StevenK is confused.
<Hobbsee> i'm not sure that your mother who hasnt used ubuntu before actually *knows* what she wants
<Hobbsee> in terms of which particular apps, by names
* persia is sure she doesn't
<RAOF> Maybe the better solution is to make ubuntu the system your mother wants?
<sorsis> se can could say for the installation media that "news of my home country are very important for me" then installation media would bring links on the desktop for those news
<sorsis> maybe an rss reader
<sorsis> most easiest system to use
<sorsis> not the best
<sorsis> easiest
<sorsis> damn this keyb and my messy head
<sorsis> she could say to installation media that "news are very important for me"
<StevenK> But that is a slippery slope.
<sorsis> why so?
* Hobbsee thought that gnome picked the easiest stuff to use anyway
<RAOF> Wasn't there a "Common configurations" spec sometime?  Sounds like (1) you probably don't want to implement this in the installer, and (2) you want to implement some common configuration profiles
<Hobbsee> i mean, who doesnt want an easy system?
<Hobbsee> (unless they use kde)
<RAOF> :)
<StevenK> Because if add that, then the installer should add support for every other thing you want set up?
<sorsis> StevenK: now i don't see where's the problem
<RAOF> sorsis: Because if you offer a lot of choice, you've made the problem worse.
<Hobbsee> "choose between 10 billion optoins for which type of users you are"
<StevenK> Exactly.
<RAOF> How do I know if I want to select "news is very important for me"?
<StevenK> You make the installer quick and simple, and then configure the installed system.
<sorsis> but your mother is not capable to configure that system
<RAOF> Additionally, she's not capable of choosing between a whole bunch of options.
<sorsis> i still think that amount of eyecandy should be selected with benchmark program in installation procedure
<sorsis> RAOF: she could say that se wants energy saving system
<sorsis> few options
<StevenK> Which it does by default.
<sorsis> not much
<sorsis> then other guy would like all the neatiest eye candy, but is not capable to configure hes system
<RAOF> ...and he goes System->Preferences->Desktop Effects
<RAOF> And it just works
<RAOF> Sane defaults, easy configuration.
<RAOF> > *
<RAOF> sorsis: It sounds like you might want to extend some things (maybe add a metapackage or too to the repositories, extend some Gnome capplets).
<sorsis> yes
<RAOF> But I don't think you want to ask as few questions as possible on install.
<sorsis> not as few as possible
<RAOF> Since they don't have any idea as to the concequences then.
<sorsis> more intuitive dialog
<minghua> I still think my mom shouldn't be installing ubuntu, it's my job.  I ask her what she wants, install for her, then tell her which apps to use.
<minghua> it's always going to be hard to have a computer program asking what computer-illiterate people want
* persia agrees with minghua - If I'm not nearby, the shop should configure my mother's PC.
<Hobbsee> or you can search in synaptic/adept, by category
<sorsis> but when your mothers friend wants ubuntu too because it's so pretty and it has something nice and her son is not capable to set ubuntu properly on her laptop
<Hobbsee> i'm not sure that the gnome-app-install already does this
<sorsis> are you going to travel 50 miles to set up a system just to please your mother
<sorsis> and then again it would be nice if people could copy their installation set from their friend
<RAOF> That might be worth doing, and pretty simple, too.  Is it already done, in fact?
<sorsis> partly yes
<sorsis> in debian there was a project which allowed it
<Hobbsee> RAOF: only with dpkg.  it's not well known
<sorsis> but the problem is that it's not an option on regular installation media
<Hobbsee> RAOF: ie, you can --get-selections, and pipe that, then install selections, or something
<Hobbsee> it's rather a corner case, though
<RAOF> Hobbsee: I knew it was possible with dpkg, I just thought it's probably something someone's wanted to put a trivial GUI on sometime.
<Hobbsee> yes, of course
<Hobbsee> i'd like to see that
<sorsis> and remember those energy saving hippies. linux can easliy beat vista in energy consumption. 
<sorsis> meta package of "energy saving easy programs"
<RAOF> sorsis: So add a "make my system really energy efficient" option to System->Preferences->Power
* RAOF is not sure what an "energy saving program" would be, or why it wouldn't be installed by default.
<sorsis> i don't have preferences button under "System"
<RAOF> Then you're presumably using that system-control thingy
<RAOF> It'd be System->Settings or something like that then.
<sorsis> maybe i should note that i'm using kde
<RAOF> Indeed, you should.
<sorsis> :)
<sorsis> i'm not that energy saving hippie. i like eye candy
<RAOF> But you want to implement the ability to be an energy saving hippy.  That implementation should be in the power-management config applet for $DESKTOP_ENVIRONMENT
<sorsis> to be truly power saving it needs more than just hibernating settings etc.
<RAOF> I don't see what the problem is.
<RAOF> So make the power-management thing do what it needs to do.
<sorsis> ripped interface with with very few services on background
<sorsis> ok.
<RAOF> Ah, so you want to enable a "cripple my system" option, rather than a "save power" option :)
<sorsis> i want it to install crippled system from start
<sorsis> no unneeded service
<sorsis> so on
<dharrigan> dholbach: did you get my email yesterday? Any thoughts?
<RAOF> sorsis: That is, in my opinion (and I'm pretty sure it's the consensus here), a bad idea.
<RAOF> sorsis: Install sane defaults, configure later.
<Hobbsee> woot, crippled
<Hobbsee> DRM too?
<sorsis> ok
<RAOF> If you want no unneeded service, install gentoo :P
<sorsis> but how about that copied installation of reference computer
<Hobbsee> "no you may not install any other software apart from main, ever, else you cant upgrade"
<Hobbsee> sorsis: that'd be good.  functionality is in dpkg, someone just needs to write a GUI for it.
<RAOF> sorsis: Implement the trivial GUI required to parse dpkg output.
<persia> geser: Thanks.
<dholbach> dharrigan: yes, but I'm at a conference, so I didn't have much time to think about it - let me read it now
* ajmitch hugs dholbach :)
<dholbach> dharrigan: wow - NO idea
<dholbach> dharrigan: I don't think it's as serious as harpreet says, but better to ask people like elmo or Mithrandir about that
<dholbach> (in #ubuntu-devel)
<dholbach> dharrigan: I'm not much into legal stuff
<bashelier> Hi :)
<bashelier> is there somebody using wine arround ? I'd like to "announce" wineui, GUI which allow you to uninstall your win32 softwares easily, using the UninstallString key in the registry
<bashelier> here is the project overview : https://launchpad.net/wineui, and here is the current branch : bzr get http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~bashelier/wineui/dev
<bashelier> dholbach: ping, did you get my mail about it ? :)
<dholbach> bashelier: yes, but I'm at a conference and didn't have much time to look at all of my mails
<dholbach> let me take a look at it now
<bashelier> dholbach: ok cool :)
<dholbach> bashelier: besto to write a spec about it, so people see what it's about and what you want to achieve until gutsy feature freeze
<dholbach> bashelier: the more complete the spec the better - then best to discuss it on ubuntu-devel-discuss@
<bashelier> dholbach: ok thanks, let's write the spec
<dholbach> rock and roll :)
<bashelier> ^^
<bashelier> dholbach: and the devel is easyer than I thaught, wine devs are doing some really good job, considering winegcc & co :)
<dholbach> cool
<lfittl> dholbach, are you in a session, or do you have time for wiki cleanup?
<dholbach> lfittl: we're cleaning up the wiki here in the main room
<lfittl> dholbach, ok, will join you in a moment
<bashelier> dholbach: here it is : https://blueprints.launchpad.net/wineui/+spec/easier-wine-uninstalling-apps
* ajmitch waves to lfittl 
<dholbach> bashelier: best to use http://wiki.ubuntu.com/SpecSpec for the spec format
<bashelier> oups ^^"
<dharrigan> dholbach: okay, thanks for the feedback - how do I contact elmo or mithrandir?
<dholbach> dharrigan: ping them in #ubuntu-devel
<dharrigan> dharrigan: ta
<dharrigan> dholbach: ta :-)
<bashelier> dholbach: and another thing, can a non-MOTU review package on REVU ? I've already review a couple of packages on -fr-classroom, and I wonder if there is a way to add a comment on REVU as a simple packager, but with no advocating possibilities
<dholbach> not advocating, but reviewing+commenting
<imbrandon> bashelier, sounds sane, you might poke siretart about it ( not sure who else is still active on hacking REVU )
<Hobbsee> persia: how out of date is https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UniverseDesktopFileAbsolutePath?highlight=%28CategoryMOTU%29 ?
<bashelier> imbrandon: ok thanks :)
<bashelier> siretart: ping
<crimsun> success!  prelim testing indicates I can wipe alsactl usage from alsa-utils.init {start,stop} completely for ubuntu and edubuntu.  Now to figure out how to rig Kubuntu...
<Hobbsee> heh
<crimsun> Ramifications: volume control info is no longer stored through alsa state files but through PulseAudio's session restoration.
<persia> Hobbsee: Immensely.  My scripts are probably aged, but I should be able to regenerate something in the next few days.  On the other hand, I'm not sure if it's currently tracking a useful thing.  Might it be better to just track those pacakges for which no .desktop is required?
<Hobbsee> persia: great, OK.
<persia> crimsun: Congrats!
<Hobbsee> persia: we're just doing a wiki clean up now.
<TheMuso> crimsun: How does that help us pro audio guys?
<crimsun> Hobbsee: / imbrandon: do you know if kmix, if enabled as an applet (or its equiv.), restores volume state on KDE login?
<persia> Hobbsee: OK.  Thanks for checking about that one.  I don't really know how to merge, but I think https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UniverseDesktopFileAbsolutePath should be part of https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/NoDesktopFile, and will try to accomplish that in the rewrite.
<Hobbsee> crimsun: i believe it does.  i'm not sure
<crimsun> TheMuso: the functionality will not disappear at all from the initscript.  I'll just be shifting the targets.
<Hobbsee> persia: okay.  you can merge by adding the info from one to the other, then delete/redirect teh next page
<TheMuso> crimsun: Targets?
<crimsun> TheMuso: start/stop/restart/reload/reset
<imbrandon> crimsun, it /should/
<siretart> bashelier: pong
<imbrandon> crimsun, i havent tested it lately
<crimsun> TheMuso: now, one thing I haven't considered fully is whether to still call start but zero out Master, PCM, Wave, Front.
<bashelier> siretart: hi, is it possible to add the comment rights on REVU for a non-MOTU ?
<crimsun> TheMuso: it's all very, very prelim  (I haven't even spec'd it yet)
<siretart> bashelier: the problem is, that I cannot give out reviewing without voting rights out
<crimsun> TheMuso: so there are at least a couple diverging use cases: 1) don't invoke start from the udev rule, and have stop be a no-op; 2) maintain the current config for "pure ALSA users"
<crimsun> TheMuso: 1) having stop be a no-op essentially means we use update-rc.d's new multiuser semantics, so we don't store the state file on shutdown
<bashelier> siretart: ok, is it right if I ask the french MOTUs to vote for it ?
<siretart> bashelier: of course!
<bashelier> siretart: ok, I've already ask them if it could be possible, so I think there will have no problem, I'll ask them to confirm soon, thanks a lot :)
<TheMuso> crimsun: ok
<Hobbsee> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Logo
<lionel> :)
<siretart> http://www.stil-his.no/brukerfiler/Innebandy/He-man%20-%20She-ra%2004.jpeg
<dholbach> ^ Treenaks said: "Is that jono?"
<siretart> "he sould be"
<dharrigan> What's the recommendation process for getting something into the distro? Isn't there a deb validation wiki?
<dharrigan> StevenHarperUK: hi
<StevenHarperUK> Hi
<StevenHarperUK> Yello Channel
<StevenHarperUK> **hello
<siretart> dharrigan: file a bug in launchpad, and add the 'needs-packaging' tag
* dharrigan is just reading the motu wiki :) Thanks siretart 
<Treenaks> dharrigan: .. or the part that's left of it anyway ;)
<dharrigan> :)
<sorsis> Hobbsee: it says "MOTO possible logo" not motU
<Hobbsee> sorsis: fix it, i'ts a wiki :P
<pochu> good morning
<rollerskatejamms> WE ARE THE MASTERS OF THE UNIVERSE!
<rollerskatejamms> sorry couldn't resist.
<pochu> rollerskatejamms: not me ;)
<rollerskatejamms> Yeah I'm not part of the team either.
<rollerskatejamms> I just couldn't resist saying that.
<siretart> dholbach and me are having a discussion: Didn't we decide that only one MOTU needs to approve a package to be uploaded to universe? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/New/Policy mandates there need to be 2
<ajmitch> hm
* ajmitch will look up irc logs
<gpocentek> IIRC we still need 2 acks...
<ajmitch> I think so
<lionel> we checked yesterday with lfittl, it's two hacks
<dholbach> ok
<geser> how much ACK needs MOTUs creating a package?
<ajmitch> none
<persia> geser: Used to be one, now none
<lionel> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-motu/2007-March/001356.html
<\sh> dholbach, do you have any clue to give networkmanager the clue about reloading it's devices? 
<ajmitch> none *needed*, but it's often recommended to get stuff reviewed
<lfittl> lionel, not talking about sru ;)
<lionel> Oups... my bad. I'm off topic :-(
<lionel> yeah, thanks lfittl :)
<dholbach> \sh: whenever network manager is behaving badly I do this:
<dholbach> daniel@lovegood:~$ cat bin/strangle-nm 
<dholbach> sudo /etc/dbus-1/event.d/22dhcdbd restart; sudo /etc/dbus-1/event.d/25NetworkManager restart; sudo /etc/dbus-1/event.d/26NetworkManagerDispatcher restart; killall nm-applet; nm-applet &
<dholbach> daniel@lovegood:~$ 
<dholbach> \sh: that's no real solution though
<ogra> dholbach, you really should package that and push it to main ;)
<dholbach> pffft :)
<jmg> Exception in thread "main" java.lang.UnsupportedOperationException at gnu.java.awt.peer.gtk.GdkGraphicsEnvironment.getAllFonts(libgcj.so.70)
<Amaranth> why oh why did i volunteer to do the packaging for compiz? :)
<Amaranth> ooh, lunch time
<jmg> Amaranth: because you are awesome and cool
<Hobbsee> Amaranth: insanity
<jmg> why did i drink so many headless mexicans and margaritas last night?
<sorsis> is there way to distribute ubuntu packages via torrent to large cluster of copmuters?
<sorsis> should i try to implement that to my linux state duplicator?
<slomo> shawarma: ping? :)
<gnomefreak> for a package new to ubuntu am i allowed to use 1.1.1+1ubuntu1 or do i need to drop the ubuntu1?
<StevenK> 1.1.1-0ubuntu1
<gnomefreak> that would be a downgrade from 1.1.1-3.mt8 right?
<man-di> gnomefreak: yes
<gnomefreak> than that wont work :(
<man-di> gnomefreak: is 1.1.1-3.mt8 in the Ubuntu archive?
<man-di> gnomefreak: if not, its not a problem
<gnomefreak> debian version == 1.1.1-3
<man-di> gnomefreak: then use 1.1.1-3ubuntu1
<gnomefreak> man-di: no its in mozillas team testing repo
<gnomefreak> in m-t feisty repo. when they go to upgrade i want them to beable to upgrade smoothly
<shawarma> slomo: You rang, sir?
<slomo> shawarma: you know that there is a channel named #debian-utopia? :) i just saw that you committed something to pkg-utopia svn
<shawarma> slomo: No, I didn't.
<slomo> shawarma: you didn't commit? shawarma-guest@pkg-utopia unstable r1481 network-manager-vpnc/packages/unstable/network-manager-vpnc/debian/ (3 files in 2 dirs): ....
<shawarma> Ah, yes, I committed.
<slomo> ok :)
<shawarma> I did *not*, however, know that there was such a channel.
<slomo> :)
<shawarma> What do you handle in utopia?
<slomo> shawarma: well, everything where i'm listed in Uploaders... dbus stuff, avahi and a bit hal
<shawarma> slomo: Ah, ok.
<TheMuso> I see the voip hasn't got any better.
<jsgotangco> all the high bandwidth went to face to face talks eh?
<xxxxx1> morning!
<TheMuso> heh
<ajmitch> dholbach!
<ajmitch> jsgotangco: congrats :)
<jsgotangco> thanks!
* Jucato does a victory dance for jsgotangco
<gnomefreak> jsgotangco: you were the person up for CC right?
<gnomefreak> one of
<jsgotangco> gnomefreak: yes
<gnomefreak> jsgotangco: congrats :)
<jsgotangco> thanks thanks :-)
<ScottK> Good morning Hobbsee.
<Hobbsee> hi ScottK 
<ajmitch> Hobbsee!
* Hobbsee throws a javellin at ajmitch 
<Hobbsee> in greeting
<ajmitch> cruel person
<StevenK> Yay for packages changing to CDBS. Not.
<ScottK> Why not?
* ScottK is curious...
<ajmitch> seems like this is a non-bof
* ajmitch now has ~2 hours free
<StevenK> Because the Ubuntu changes require changes to debian/rules, which is now CDBS-ified.
<StevenK> ajmitch: Play in the traffic? :-P
<ajmitch> sounds like fun
<StevenK> Heh
<ScottK> So it all has to be redone.  So is it not that cdbs is inherently bad, just that the switchover drives a bunch of work?
<StevenK> ScottK: Well, okay, the Ubuntu change was changing the arguments to one dh_ command. The problem I need to RTFS to see how to do it with CDBS.
<StevenK> The problem is
<ScottK> The problem is that cdbs is black magic...
<shawarma> StevenK: What was the change?
<ScottK> You need a different shade of black in this case.
<ScottK> ?
<StevenK> dh_installinit -- multiuser
<persia> Hobbsee: .desktop bits should be sorted now (barring a script).  Let me know if I broke anything :)
<shawarma> StevenK: gimme a sec.
<StevenK> This package seems to be quality software.
<StevenK> Quality with a K, that is.
<shawarma> Set "DEB_DH_INSTALLINIT_ARGS= -- multiuser"
<StevenK> shawarma: Now how am I supposed to complain? :-P
<ajmitch> simple
<Hobbsee> StevenK: like kino, yes.
<ajmitch> you had to ask on irc
<shawarma> StevenK: Oh, there's plenty of things to complain about. :)
<ScottK> StevenK: Complain about lack of documentation in cdbs.  That should keep you going for a while.
<StevenK> Hobbsee: This is work, since it's net-snmp, and has a daemon.
<StevenK> Er, worse
<StevenK> ScottK: I tend to ignore the documentation for CDBS and read the makefiles directly. My make-foo seems to cope.
<Hobbsee> StevenK: heh
* ScottK is pretty well entirely lacking in make-foo.  What little he has was learned here...
<imbrandon> wtf would cause this ( only in 3 out of 4 boots ) ....
<ajmitch> StevenK: that is the documentation
<imbrandon> Starting up.
<imbrandon> [    43.481077]  crc error
<imbrandon> [    43.483243]  Kernel Panic . not syncing: VFS: unable to mount root fs on unknown-block(0,0)
<imbrandon> [    43.483310] 
<StevenK> ajmitch: Heh, yeah, well.
<shawarma> StevenK: as ajmitch just pointed out, you can use DEB_UPDATE_RCD_PARAMS instead. in that case, leave out the "--"
<Treenaks> imbrandon: bad disk
<StevenK> shawarma: Which would you suggest?
<shawarma> StevenK: Now that I've also checked the dh_installinit man page, I'd go for DEB_UPDATE_RCD_PARAMS=multiuser
<ajmitch> StevenK: find a coin
<StevenK> ajmitch: I'm married, what's one of them?
<shawarma> In case it's a multi-binary package, and you just need it for one package, use DEB_UPDATE_RCD_PARAMS_packagename=multiuser
<StevenK> shawarma: Thanks!
<shawarma> StevenK: any time.
<imbrandon> Treenaks, kk thanks
* shawarma has the blue belt in cdbs-fu
<Treenaks> imbrandon: or bad ram
<StevenK> shawarma: That beats my dorky yellow.
<ScottK> imbrandon: or a bad/not well seated cable.
<imbrandon> Treenaks, knowing the hdd's in that box its propbably the hdd's
<DarkSun88> Hi all
<xxxxx1> hello DarkSun88 
<persia> Could anyone suggest a faster solution for CONTENTS=/var/cache/apt/apt-file/archive.ubuntu.com_ubuntu_dists_gutsy_Contents-amd64.gz; for i in `zgrep usr/share/menu $CONTENTS | awk '{ print $2 }'`; do zgrep $1 $CONTENTS | grep .desktop || echo $i; done
<StevenK> apt-file ?
<persia> StevenK: apt-file just seems to do the zgrep $CONTENTS | grep.  Is there a way to check for two things for each package?  I'd rather avoid the exponential algorithm, if possible :)
<StevenK> You're looking for packages which don't contain a desktop file?
<persia> StevenK: From the subset of packages that do contain a menu file
<StevenK> Oh, which do.
<StevenK> May I suggest Perl? :-P
* persia failed to put > /dev/null after the last grep above
<StevenK> persia: -q, not >/dev/null
<persia> StevenK: regarding -q, why?  Regarding perl, I still need to determine how to do it without the double pass.  Perhaps I'll parse the entire file, and ony check chunks at a time.
<StevenK> persia: grep -q won't print the match, and is less typing than >/dev/null
<persia> StevenK: Thanks for the advice, and very much for the -q: my keyboard will appreciate that :)
<StevenK> persia: Yes, I was thinking of parsing the entire contents file and printing package names that match your criteria
<StevenK> persia: It's just like grep -c versus grep | wc -l
<persia> StevenK: I had some scripts to do it and generate a wiki table last February, but was surprised how manual it was upon review.  perl it is.
<StevenK> persia: I can write it as a one liner if you wish.
<persia> StevenK: My perl-foo is not that strong.  I'd be more than happy to use yours.  I'm planning to put the script on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/DesktopFiles so that the table doesn't need to be regenerated every couple months.
<StevenK> persia: I'm a cheater, because I get paid to code Perl.
<persia> Rather, the table that used to be there that I deleted.
<persia> StevenK: That's not cheating, that's just good planning.  I had a job like that about 10 years ago, but somehow migrated into talking to people instead of coding...
<Lutin> persia: btw, do you mind if I merge blobwars (dh_iconcache change only)
<persia> Lutin: Not at all, but I'll get to it this evening if you don't.
<Lutin> ok
<persia> Lutin: Umm..  so does that mean you are, or you aren't?
<Lutin> persia: I am
<persia> Lutin: Thanks.
<Lutin> persia: np
<StevenK> persia: Right, I think I have half of it working.
<persia> StevenK: Half?
<StevenK> Parsing the contents file.
<gnomefreak> ok looks like i fixed iceape should i use dput *.dsc or *.changes again?
<Hobbsee> gnomefreak: .changes
<Hobbsee> i believe
<gnomefreak> ok ill try it
<ScottK> leonel: Have you had a chance to look at squirrelmail in Dapper/Edgy yet?
<StevenK> persia: I'm just about done.
<persia> StevenK: OK.  It must be time to change the requirements :) look for menu files in both /usr/share/menu and /usr/lib/menu.
* StevenK kicks persia.
<StevenK> :-P
<persia> StevenK: There's only about 35 packages in all of Debian still using /usr/lib/menu, so don't really worry about it.
<ScottK> It's not programming if there isn't requirements creep.
<leonel> hey ScottK  installed the deb on  Feisty  and worked fine
<StevenK> Damn Perl not having 'x not in list' constructs.
<ScottK> leonel: Great.
<leonel> but ... today  upstream issued another patch for a regression  
<ScottK> OK
<ScottK> Need to deal with that first then.
<luisbg> hello all
<Treenaks> StevenK: if( !grep { $_ eq 'blah' } @list ) { not_in_list(); };
<ScottK> leonel: I just noted that in the bug.
<Treenaks> StevenK: or maybe List::Utils
<leonel> ScottK:  now  do the same as yesterday to add the 2nd  patch ?
<ScottK> leonel: The Ubuntu security manager is aware of this (he's changed some stuff in the bug), so I'd say let's get this rolling.
<leonel> perfect
<ScottK> leonel: Yes, but don't make a new version, just add the 2nd patch to your existing changelog entry.
<leonel> ScottK:  where can I see that change
<ScottK> leonel: If you pull up the bug, Bug #113725 you will see that it now has tasks for all 4 open releases
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 113725 in squirrelmail "Cross site scripting in HTML filter" [High,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/113725
<ScottK> leonel: I nominated it, but keescook confirmed it.  He's the security manager.
<leonel> Great !
<leonel> so  To the 2nd patch and  add the diff to  the bugreport ?
<ScottK> Yes.  
<leonel> Ok
<ScottK> Pastebin your changelog for me to review when you get that done first though.
<leonel> I've got to do some thing now but Back in 1 1/2 hours to do the job
<leonel> OK
* ScottK should be here then.
<leonel> Another thing   for dapper  there are more patches needed    
<leonel> dapper has   1.4.6 
<leonel> I think we need to add the patches  for security issued  as  for  1.4.10a
<ScottK> leonel: More patches needed for the security fix or for other problems?
<leonel> for other problems with dapper
<leonel> but let's do first  Feisty ...
<ScottK> The non-security stuff needs to be addressed through a different, more deliberate process.
<leonel> ok
<ScottK> I'd be glad to help you with that after the security stuff
<ScottK> Yes, get Feisty first.
<ScottK> Ping me if you need help.
<leonel> let me see if there are security things  because  there hasn't been  updates for  dapper's  squirrelmail
<leonel> according to  changelog for dapper squirrelmail 
<leonel> the last update was  23 feb 2006
<sorsis> has anyone thought torrent based package distribution?
<leonel> and theres been some security updates    
<leonel> http://www.squirrelmail.org/security/
<leonel> ScottK: but lets do that after  feisty got done
<leonel> ScottK:  ok  got to go 
<leonel> Thanks
<StevenK> persia: I think that's it.
<StevenK> persia: Are you able to confirm one or two to see if it works?
<persia> StevenK: Sure.  My script is still running (something about an exponential algorithm), but I have a whole list of them.  swisswatch and synaesthesia are two that just came up.
<StevenK> persia: My issue is it takes ~ 360Mb of RAM on my amd64.
<persia> StevenK: I'm be happy to run it (I've about 1GB free right now) and compare the results, if you like.
<StevenK> Hold on, I seem to have broken it.
<persia> StevenK: Just in case you want a quick abort: the first 3 that showed up for me were 3dchess, 9wm, and aatv.
<StevenK> I have 1357 matches.
<persia> Mine'S exponential, so I don't have that data yet.  So far, I have 914 matches.
<StevenK> Okay, all 5 you mentioned are in there.
<StevenK> Beat you, etc etc
<persia> StevenK: I think it's probably good.  And of course you win: you used a real algorithm :)
<StevenK> Not bad for 25 lines of Perl
<persia> What about "StevenK: persia: I can write it as a one liner if you wish"?
* persia ducks
<StevenK> I still can, it involves putting it all on one line. :-P
<StevenK> I'm just trying to race it on my machine.
<persia> StevenK: 25 lines is probably better anyway.  This is to go on the wiki for people to run if they wish, so it should be easier to understand, if possible.
<StevenK> steven@liquified:~% zcat Contents-amd64.gz | /usr/bin/time ./find-menu-no-desktop > lets-see
<StevenK> 32.93user 0.84system 0:37.75elapsed 89%CPU (0avgtext+0avgdata 0maxresident)k
<StevenK> 0inputs+0outputs (0major+86178minor)pagefaults 0swaps
<StevenK> 32 seconds versus whatever time your shell script has been running. :-P
<StevenK> persia: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/20171/
<persia> StevenK: Thanks a lot.  That's better, faster, and easier to read :)  Mind if I paste it to the wiki for the various .desktop junkies?
<StevenK> persia: As long you put a comment in it saying I wrote it.
<StevenK> As long as, even
<persia> StevenK: Sure.  Full Name or Handle?  Also, what license?  Code or general wiki?
<StevenK> persia: full name <(nick)@u.c> , um, GPL
<StevenK> persia: Which wiki page?
<persia> StevenK: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/DesktopFiles
<persia> StevenK: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/20175/
<StevenK> persia: Personally, I prefer e-mail address to all lowercase... Other than that, it looks fine.
<persia> StevenK: OK.  I'll post it then (after fixing the email).  Thanks again.
<StevenK> Gasp. I wrote Perl code that was understandable.
<persia> StevenK: As long as it's GPL, it is permissible to write comprehensible code.  It's only proprietary code that must be obfuscated.
<bddebian> Heya gang
<joejaxx> imbrandon: may i pm you?
<joejaxx> hello bddebian !
<xxxxx1> hello bddebian 
<joejaxx> :)
<persia> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Hello joejaxx, xxxxx1, persia :)
<StevenK> persia: :-P
<imbrandon> joejaxx, sure
<imbrandon> i might be slow to respond
<ScottK> heya bddebian.
<bddebian> Hi ScottK
<joejaxx> ScottK: i still think that apt-get moo bug is funny
<joejaxx> :P
<xxxxx1> hey guys
<xxxxx1> i need to repackage the upstream tarball without debian dir.
<xxxxx1> well
<xxxxx1> i should rename the repacked upstream tarball with +debian ?
<effie_jayx> where do I read about learning to triage bugs
<ScottK> xxxxx1: Do you have to or have you decided you'd prefer to?
<xxxxx1> ScottK: i have
<ScottK> effie_jayx: Go to #ubuntu-bugs and look at the topic.
<effie_jayx> ScottK,  thanks 
<ScottK> xxxxx1: OK.  If you look (I think) in the Debian New Maintainer's Guide it tells you exactly how to do it.
* ScottK doesn't have the link handy.
<xxxxx1> ScottK: deb new maint guide don't mention that.
<ScottK> hmmmm
<xxxxx1> ScottK: but i think is necessary the +debian in the tarball name
* ScottK will look in a few minutes.
* ScottK would hate to speculate.  There is a specific way to do it.
<xxxxx1> :)
<mattva01> Is there a good example of a python  module that uses cdbs with pycentral ?
<xxxxx1> ScottK: i'm reading http://people.debian.org/~daniel/documents/packaging.html
<persia> xxxxx1: See http://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/developers-reference/ch-best-pkging-practices.en.html#s-bpp-origtargz for guidance on repackaging
<xxxxx1> persia: thx
<xxxxx1> 6.7.8 Best practices for orig.tar.gz files
<ScottK> Yes.  Just found it.
<ScottK> That's the one I was thinking of http://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/developers-reference/ch-best-pkging-practices.en.html#s-bpp-origtargz
* ScottK should read the entire scrollback before posting...
* persia was looking for it anyway...
<mattva01> im getting an message dpkg-genchanges: warning: unknown information field `Xb-Python-Version' in input data in package's section of control info file
<mattva01> is that normal?
<persia> mattva01: Yes.  All fields beginning with X generate that warning.
<mattva01> ah ok
<mattva01> thanks
<Acksys> G'morning, all.
<bddebian> Hello Acksys
<Acksys> Beautiful day where I am.
<EtienneG> dear MOTUs
<nixternal> oh no, isn't that what a "breakup" letter starts with?
<nixternal> oh wait, that is "Dear John"
<EtienneG> I have an upload lovingly prepared at http://people.ubuntu.com/~etienne/bzr-gtk/
<EtienneG> nixternal, good point, I will find another introduction for next time :)
<nixternal> haha
<EtienneG> bzr-gtk depend on same major bzr release
<EtienneG> the upload for bzr 0.16 is in the queue, waiting for my sponsor to get a little time to take care
<EtienneG> so all the deps should be in the pipeli ne
<Hobbsee> hiya EtienneG - you're a canoical person, arent you?
<Hobbsee> *canonical
* Hobbsee cant type
<Hobbsee> oh yes, to get the p.u.c, of course you are
<EtienneG> Hobbsee, yep, and you are in Seville right ?
<Hobbsee> yep
<Hobbsee> where are you?
<EtienneG> there (raise hand)
<EtienneG> hand down
* Hobbsee is in room B...
<EtienneG> but I wear a "Do you Ubuntu" t-shirt
<EtienneG> that help a lot, right ?
<Hobbsee> so do a lot of people
<Hobbsee> hehe :P
<EtienneG> ponytail
<EtienneG> really handsome
<EtienneG> (I wish the later was true)
<EtienneG> I hang out a lot with MagicFab
<Hobbsee> ahhh
<EtienneG> a tad overweight
<EtienneG> but only a very small tad
<Hobbsee> ponytails dont help narrow it down either :P
<Hobbsee> much
<EtienneG> well, yeah
<EtienneG> i guess I am the standard issue Linux geek
<EtienneG> early thirties
<Hobbsee> right
<EtienneG> what else can I say about myself
<EtienneG> ...
<Hobbsee> dunno :)
<EtienneG> what's in room B ?
<highvoltage> personal package archives (I think)
<EtienneG> highvoltage, apparently not
<EtienneG> highvoltage, I have the BoF chairman righ here
<EtienneG> and I am in the pit
<EtienneG> PPA is really something i am looking forward to
<EtienneG> apparentl, they will do a lightning talk tomorrow morning
<Hobbsee> EtienneG: PPA.
<EtienneG> Hobbsee, it
<EtienneG> it is happening now ^
<EtienneG> ?
<EtienneG> I am running there then
<Hobbsee> it's about ot start, eyah
<Hobbsee> right
<EtienneG> ok, I will go grab cprov and get myself to room B
<highvoltage> EtienneG: ah
<Hobbsee> not sure who's staying here though
<Hobbsee> or coming in
<persia> A few days ago I was reading a nice tutorial on using get-orig-source for cvs snapshots, but I don't seem to be able to find it in my browser history.  Does anyone have any suggestions as to what the URL might have been?
<EtienneG> I would like to reiterate my request for a review and upload bzr-gtk at http://people.ubuntu.com/~etienne/bzr-gtk/
<EtienneG> since the first one got lost int he scrollback
<bddebian> EtienneG: Can you stick it on REVU?
<bddebian> LaserJock: !!
<LaserJock> hi bddebian 
<Acksys> Will there be any MOTU school lectures soon?
<EtienneG> bddebian, in meeting, will do right afterward
<EtienneG> bddebian, it's not a NEW package, though
<EtienneG> it is an update
<leonel> ScottK: ping
<ScottK> pong
<ScottK> leonel: How's the new patch going?
<leonel> bad bad
<leonel> ScottK: do I need to patch in the same enviroment as the previous patch 
<ScottK> Not sure what you mean...
<leonel> yesterday  we finished  with the debdiff 
<bddebian> EtienneG: That's OK
<ScottK> OK
<ScottK> Like this...
<EtienneG> bddebian, so I should still upload to REVU
<bddebian> Yep, please
<leonel> in the same directory  run   dpatch-edit-patch  to   add the 2nd patch ?
<EtienneG> okidoki
<ScottK> Go into your source directory and dpatch-edit-patch newpatchname oldpatchname
<ScottK> If you do it that way, your dpatch-edit-patch environment already has yesterday's patch applied, so the new one should apply directly.
<leonel> ok 
<ScottK> See man dpatch-edit-patch for examples.
<leonel> let me copy from the backup I made  before  start adding the 2nd
<EtienneG> bddebian, not so sure ... https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU says it is for new package, and I have not uploaded my last update to REVU
<EtienneG> so ... ???
<ScottK> EtienneG: NEW and new versions.
<EtienneG> ho, ok
<ScottK> NEW packages on REVU need two MOTU acks.  Updates only need one.
<EtienneG> REVU admin, please stand up (need a keyring re-sync, just joined the team)
<ajmitch> EtienneG: ok, wait a few min
<EtienneG> ajmitch, thanks pal
<ajmitch> it takes a few minutes to run
<EtienneG> ajmitch, do you think I can dput right away
<ajmitch> no
<leonel> ScottK: so   dpatch-edit-patch 02_regression 01_html-security-fix   where   01_html-security-fix  is yesterday patch ?
<ScottK> leonel: That looks right to me.
<leonel> even  the 01 has already been  aplied ?
<ScottK> leonel: Not in your original source tree it hasn't.  It gets applied when you build the package.
<leonel> ok
<leonel> then in the shell apply the 2 patches  first  the  2nd  ?
<leonel> or just the  2nd ?
<ScottK> Just the 2nd.
<leonel> ok
<leonel> running
<leonel> ScottK: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/20195/
<leonel> errors
* ScottK looks
<ScottK> leonel: Did you start from where you finished work in your source yesterday or from a completely pristine source?
<leonel> were we left yesterday
<ScottK> OK
<leonel> should I edit the patch  ?
<ScottK> Are you still in dpatch-edit-patch?
<leonel> yes
<leonel> I'am
<ScottK> Do exit 230 and we'll start over.
<leonel> exit
<ScottK> No exit 230
<ScottK> That makes sure nothing gets left from this attempt.
<leonel> yes
<leonel> exit 230
<tsmithe> anyone know why tk is built in ubuntu without antialiasing?
<ScottK> leonel: Then do dpatch-edit-patch 01_html-security-fix. look into at least one of the files and make sure it's been changed by the patch, then exit 230 again.
<leonel> patching file functions/mime.php
<leonel> Reversed (or previously applied) patch detected!  Assume -R? [n]  
<leonel> ok
<leonel> ok
<leonel> LOOK not PATCH 
<leonel> ok
<Denni2> Can I ask a question here ?
<ScottK> !question
<ubotu> Don't ask to ask a question. Just ask your question :)
<ajmitch> EtienneG: apologies, you can upload now :)
* ajmitch was distracted by being in a bof session
<ScottK> leonel: Are you in dpatch-edit-patch now?
<Denni2> should a bug be filed before working on a merge ?
<ScottK> Denni2: Did you do the last merge?
<leonel> ScottK: yes and the patch was applied
<leonel> the 01
<ScottK> OK.  THat's good.
<Denni2> no i'm just starting 
<ScottK> Denni2: Before you start a merge you should check with the last person to merge it and make sure they are OK with it.
<Denni2> ok
<ScottK> leonel: It looks to me like the file name changes in the new patch threw patch off.
<leonel> edit the patch ?
<ScottK> leonel: I'm thinking yes.
<EtienneG> ajmitch, thanks a lot
<EtienneG> doing it right away
<ScottK> Change the 1.4.10s to 1.4.9
<ScottK> Then see if it applies.
<leonel> in the 02 patch ?
<ScottK> Yes
<leonel> ok
<ScottK> If not, the 02 patch only has one small code change in it, it can be applied by hand inside dpatch-edit-patch easily enough.
<leonel> it'is
<leonel> let me do the changes in the 02 
<ScottK> OK
<leonel> renamed 
<leonel> now  exit230
<leonel> dpatch-edit-patch  patch02 patch01?
<leonel> ScottK:  renamed in the patch  
<leonel> --- squirrelmail-1.4.9/src/compose.php	2007-05-09 15:46:30.000000000 +0200
<leonel> +++ squirrelmail-1.4.9a/src/compose.php	2007-05-10 10:22:49.000000000 +0200
<leonel> same error
<ScottK> OK
<leonel> can I  
<leonel> unpack the source
<ScottK> Then exit 230 and re-enter dpatch-edit-patch.
<leonel> exit
<ScottK> exit 230
<leonel> exit 230
<leonel> ok
<leonel> reenter dpatch-edit-patch  no parameters ?
<ScottK> with the 01 patch
<ScottK> Like you did last time.
<leonel> ok
<leonel> shell
<ScottK> Then use your favorite text editor to make the code change in /src/compose.php
<ScottK> The bit that starts +if ( !sqgetGlobalVar...
<ScottK> Check it carefully to make sure you didn't get it wrong...
<leonel> done 
<leonel> just edit that ?
<ScottK> exit
<ScottK> wait
<ScottK> done as in made the changes?
<leonel> only added :
<leonel> +if ( !sqgetGlobalVar('identity',$identity, $SQ_GLOBAL) ) {
<leonel> +    $identity = 0;
<leonel> +}
<leonel> and removed  the -sqgetGlobalVar('identity',$identity, $SQ_GLOBAL
<leonel> of course  removed the  +  and  - 
<ScottK> And you deleted the line -sqgetGlobalVar('identity',$identity, $SQ_GLOBAL);?
<leonel> yes
<ScottK> OK
<ScottK> Then exit
<leonel> no 230?
<leonel> just exit
<ScottK> No 230, just exit
<leonel> ok
<ScottK> A regular exit will result in the changes getting saved.
<leonel> ok
<ScottK> No we update debian/changelog
<ScottK> Add an entry saying the patch has been updated to fix the regressionand pastebin it.
<ScottK> No/now...
<leonel> working..
<ScottK> OK
<leonel> not with vi right ?
<ScottK> With vi is fine.  Use whatever editor you want.  You can also call dch and that'll open your default editor in the right spot to add the entry.
<ScottK> Which in Ubuntu is nano unless you changed it...
<leonel> ok
* ScottK waits for the pastebin...
<leonel> hold on
<leonel> ScottK:  http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/20202/
* ScottK looks
<ScottK> Close.  I'll fix it and give you the pastebin back.  Can't have the same version twice in the changelog
<leonel> that's what I was going to ask
<leonel> now ?
<leonel> ScottK: http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/20205/ ?
<ScottK> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/20204/ is what I did.  I'll look at yours
<ScottK> leonel: That would work, but we don't bump to a new version because 0.1 has never been uploaded.
<leonel> ok
<leonel> put what you did ?
<ScottK> Yes
<leonel> working
<leonel> ScottK: done
<leonel> save and exit ?
<ScottK> yes
<ScottK> Now debuild -S -uc again
<leonel> working..
<leonel> done
<leonel> dpkg-genchanges: not including original source code in upload
<leonel> dpkg-buildpackage (debuild emulation): source only, diff-only upload (original source NOT included)
<ScottK> No problem
<ScottK> Now pbuild the package again like you did yesterday and do a debdiff like you did yesterday.
<leonel> ok
<ScottK> Once you've verified the new package applies the patch and works, attach the debdiff to the bug.
<leonel> ok
<ScottK> Ping me if you have trouble.
<leonel> ok
<Adri2000> ScottK: I've juste committed the fixes for the two DaD bugs you reported :) you'll see the changes after the next update of the universe page which is at 18UTC
<ScottK> Adri2000: Cool.  Thanks.  I'll have a look.  That's in ~70 minutes, right?
<Adri2000> yep
<ScottK> OK
<leonel> no errors after pbuilder
<ScottK> Excellent.  Does it install?
<leonel> ScottK:  installed
<leonel> but the  debdiff  is from yesterday 
<ScottK> Ummm you made a new one, right?
<ScottK> leonel?
<leonel> wait  
<leonel> how I make  the debdiff ?
<leonel> can't find  how I made it yesterday
<ScottK> debdiff packagname-version.dsc packagname-versionubuntu0.1.dsc > filename.debdff
<leonel> sorry
<ScottK> No problem.
<ScottK> debdiff packagname-version.dsc packagname-versionubuntu0.1.dsc > filename.debdff
<leonel> thanks 
<leonel> now uploading debdiff to launchpad
<ScottK> OK
<tsmithe> hmm i've added the required parts to tk8.4 to add xft support, but, well, i can't remember what amsn looked like before to see if it's made a difference and thus fixed bug 91095. is it worth me uploading a debdiff anyway?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 91095 in tk8.4 "tk missing antialiasing support" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/91095
<leonel> ScottK:  Done !
* ScottK looks
<ScottK> leonel: Looks good to me.  I think it's ready for keescook to upload.
<leonel> ScottK: Great !
<leonel> ScottK: Thank You very much !
<ScottK> leonel: Now you do Edgy and Dapper...
<leonel> ScottK: now  I'll work with  dapper 
<ScottK> OK
<leonel> even  it installed on dapper 
<leonel> also
<leonel> to update the dapper's version
<leonel> I need to see all the pending patches in case there are any 
<ScottK> Great.
<ScottK> leonel: Just don't add anything that's not a security fix and document everything you do.
<leonel> and do the same 
<leonel> ScottK: OK
<leonel> only security 
<leonel> there are other packages I'd like to  do  too ...
<geser> could someone review http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5093 for me?
<leonel> ScottK:  I'll eat  a big pizza for you !  thank you
<ScottK> No, thank you for your contribution.
<leonel> ScottK: squirrelmail in dapper  depends on  php4   means that  the security for php4 has to be checked too ...
<leonel> ScottK: or can It be changed to depend on  php5 ?
<ScottK> leonel: No
<ScottK> I'd just focus on squirellmail and not worry the php.
<leonel> ok
<leonel> but  php4 the las update was on Apr 6 2006  http://changelogs.ubuntu.com/changelogs/pool/universe/p/php4/php4_4.4.2-1build1/changelog
<leonel> first things  first
<leonel> go with squirrelmail
<sharms> Ok I got a new, less offensive dig at redhat now :) http://www.sharms.org/blog/?p=102
<leonel> ScottK: squirrelmail in dapper  works with php5 which is in main  ..  you where right  don't worry for php
<bddebian> Gah, so much crap on REVU :-(
<cbx33> hey guys
<cbx33> i used to build packages with debuild -S -sa -kblahblah
<cbx33> and i used to get a .tar.gz chucked out
<cbx33> but i don't get that not
<cbx33> y?
<cbx33> i put a .orig.tar.gz
<cbx33> and i get the dsc and everything else
<cbx33> but i don't get the .tzr.gz
<cbx33> why?
<highvoltage> hey cbx33, we missed you
<cbx33> hi highvoltage 
<cbx33> sorry
<cbx33> heheh
<geser> bddebian: could you review http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5093 for me?
<cbx33> howz UDS?
<bddebian> geser: Sure, give me a minute
<cbx33> hmmm
<cbx33> hmmm
<cbx33> the debuild says it's doing a source include
<cbx33> but pbuilder doesn't?
<cbx33> hmm
<cbx33> oh
<cbx33> maybe I didn't tell it to build a source package....oh I'm confused
<cbx33> been a while since i made a package
<geser> so you have an orig.tar.gz, diff.gz and dsc for your package?
<cbx33> yes
<cbx33> is that all that's needed?
<geser> yes
<ASCIIGirl> hello all! about repositories ubuntu main + universe == debian main?
<cbx33> geser, ok
<cbx33> how did I get just .tar.gz files beforehand?
<bddebian> ASCIIGirl: For the most part, yes
<ASCIIGirl> thx bddebian :)
<geser> cbx33: if you have no orig.tar.gz you get a tar.gz (source + changed/new files)
<cbx33> ahhhhhh
<cbx33> thanky geser
<cbx33> i remember now
<geser> that one with a orig.tar.gz is a non-native package and the other a native one
* gnomefreak went through a bunch of the packages on revu and all that i saw had the <packageversion>.changes: bad-distribution-in-changes-file <release> error from lintain. this is starting to look normal
<gnomefreak> is this as normal as i think it is?
<ScottK> Yes
<bddebian> No
<ScottK> No?
<bddebian> Yes
<persia> Maybe!
<ScottK> Maybe then.
<bddebian> hehe
<bddebian> Sorry
<ScottK> It's normal that lintian on REVU whines about the distribution name.
* persia :)
<geser> thanks bddebian
<bddebian> NP
<gnomefreak> whos up for a review? here is the link http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5092   ignore the linda warning too ;) thats not ubuntus issue
<\sh> ScottK, if tiber is dapper, sure it whines about gutsy ,)
<bddebian> gnomefreak: Didn't a bunch of people give you feedback on IRC a few days ago?
<gnomefreak> bddebian: about the error i told you above and the bzr stuff is all fixed
<gnomefreak> its all fixed now.
<bddebian> Oh, you did a new upload, OK
<Daviey> How can i get an upload nuked?
<gnomefreak> Daviey: if in revu ask a reviewer to drop it
<Daviey> gnomefreak, are you a revu reviewer?
<gnomefreak> Daviey: nope
<Daviey> :(
<ScottK> Daviey: Why do you want it nuked?
<Daviey> it's been superseeded by another upload
<ScottK> Then don't worry about it.  It will just be the most recent that gets reviewed.
<Daviey> ScottK, it's got a diff package name
<ScottK> Oh.  That's different then.
<Daviey> A reviewer did recently added a comment; and i don't want to waste their time
<ScottK> Daviey: Then I'd log into REVU and leave a comment that says something like "This package superceded by X package.  REVU admins please remove."
<Daviey> I've added a comment to that effect - without the REVU admins bit tho
<ScottK> Right.  WIth the comment they'd know until an admin got around to nuking it.
<Daviey> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=4566
<ScottK> OK
<Daviey> ScottK, thanks
<ScottK> Adri2000: Thanks for the quit upgrades for DaD.
<ScottK> Looks good
<bddebian> Daviey: I archived it
<ScottK> eolo999: Hello.
<Daviey> bddebian, thanks
* eolo999 is investigating kde-guidance bug... 
<eolo999> hi ScottK 
<ScottK> Can you reproduce it yet?
<eolo999> i cannot reproduce it!
<ScottK> OK.  Then if you can't make it happen on your machine, then I think it's unlikely you will be able to fix it.
<eolo999> i tried stopping my powermanager on kde and launch from command line: no import errors!
<ScottK> It's a very odd bug.
<ScottK> This is the problem is that it hasn't happened yet to someone with a chance of fixing it.
<ScottK> I'd say move on to another then.
<ScottK> eolo999: You're synch of pythoncad in Gutsy got uploaded while you were offline.  I marked it fix released after it built.
<eolo999> great ScottK 
<eolo999> I'll continue trying with kde-guidance, but it needs a lot of time to investigate what could be the reason, in the meanwhile i can work on some other thing
<ScottK> Hmmm
* eolo999 would like to talk with Sherlock PyHomes
<ScottK> Heh
<eolo999> ScottK, have you talked to doko?
<ScottK> Not yet
<ScottK> He's still at UDS
<ScottK> eolo999: Want to have a look at Bug #113803
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 113803 in python-scientific "Python-netcdf crashes in Feisty" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/113803
* eolo999 is looking
<eolo999> Seems to be a gentle bug....apt sourcing...
* ScottK will be AFK for a little bit now.
<eolo999> package can have aliases?!??!
<eolo999> why apt-get source python-netcdf actually get python-scientific?
<ScottK> eolo999: Source package name and binary package name are not always the same
<ScottK> Some source packages produce more than one binary
<eolo999> ok, thx ScottK 
<ScottK> Good afternoon stratus.
<stratus> ScottK: hey
<stratus> ScottK: afternoon, howdy?
* persia grumbles about programmers making silly assumptions that work on their i386 machines
<bddebian> persia: ?
<persia> bddebian: It's when *foo = (unsigned) bar => *foo = (unsigned long) bar isn't enough to fix it :(
<bddebian> Ahh :-)
<eolo999> ScottK, replicated Bug #113803
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 113803 in python-scientific "Python-netcdf crashes in Feisty" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/113803
<eolo999> should I tag it confirmed
<eolo999> ?
<ScottK> Yes
<bddebian> Yep
<ScottK> Then go fix it....
<bddebian> heh
<eolo999> I promise
<ScottK> eolo999: Also assign it to yourself so no one else duplicates your work.
<ScottK> bddebian: He will fix it.
* ScottK will set it's importance to medium.
<eolo999> bddebian, I'll try and in case ask for your help...
<ScottK> eolo999: Don't ask for his help, bddebian will just whine about how he doesn't know anything while he cranks through new package reviews at a rate exceeding 30 packages per hour.
<eolo999> heh
<bddebian> ScottK: Thanks buddy :-)
<persia> ScottK: You've ruined the mystique that generated the most famous wiki page :)
* eolo999 is getting comfortable with kde!
<ScottK> persia: If you are interested at all in getting involved in Python stuff in Debian, stratus, who just joined, is a founder of the Debian Python Modules Team.
<ScottK> eolo999: It's easy to do.
<bddebian> I'm so bad with Names/Nicks.  Someone remind me who William Grant is please?
<ScottK> Fujitsu I believe
<bddebian> Yep, thanks
<ScottK> Once you get old your memory goes ;-)
<persia> ScottK: I really don't know python.  Give me C, C++, Java, perl, shell scripting, really anything but python.  gaphor is an extreme exception, and only because I've been subscribed to the bug where people complain it doesn't work for the past couple years.
<eolo999> http://www.python.org/doc/2.5/whatsnew/whatsnew25.html
<eolo999> ... aa starting point...
<stratus> persia: You don't need to be a python coder to package python module in most cases. You need to have deb packaging skills though.
<stratus> persia: Good knowledge about Python is just a plus, you need to make sure that the package works (most of them include built-in unit tests or examples, so, not a problem here), and that it can be installed, upgraded, removed and is following the packaging policy.
<persia> stratus: I don't like to work on packages where I can't fix the bugs.  I prefer to try to improve the software we have, rather than install new software.  Of the roughly 70,000 open bugs, only about 100 are requests for new software :)
<stratus> persia: np, work on to fix current bugs and not introduce new ones is also great indeed.
<geser> is here someone familiar with packaging python modules, distutils and namespace packages?
* stratus hidess
<stratus> err hides
<geser> stratus: loo late :)
<stratus> geser: heh, tell me. which module? new or old stuff? what's the problem/doubt ?
<eolo999> !pastebin
<ubotu> pastebin is a service to post large texts so you don't flood the channel. The Ubuntu pastebin is at http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org (make sure you give us the URL for your paste - see also the #ubuntu channel topic)
<geser> stratus: DecoratorTools (see http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5093 for my current package)
<geser> DecoratorTools specifies peak and peak.util as namespace packages
<geser> and I don't know how I get python to find the installed module
<pochu> stratus: nice to meet you :) I'm packaging a python app, do you suggest me pycentral or pysupport? :)
<fredix> does someone using ruby-gtk ?
<geser> stratus: it works if I comment out the namespace line in setup.py
<stratus> pochu: pysupport ;)
<pochu> stratus: cool, ty! :)
<stratus> pochu: just my preference, pycentral is also good enough
<stratus> geser: d'getting the source package, hold on please
<persia> pochu: Unless it interfaces with zope - then use pycentral (that caught me for feisty).
<vil> hi, all
<vil> I am currious, if anyone here experiences strange font rendering in gutsy?
<vil> especially in firefox
<pochu> persia: why, if I can know :)
<ScottK> vil: I don't think people are actually running Gutsy right now to know.
* pochu has issues with ssl certificates
<pochu> ScottK: I'm running it! :)
<persia> pochu: My experience was that pysupport didn't support as much granularity of control of which packages were compiled, and which not (zope requires uncompiled packages for includes for some reason, or it spews errors).  Then again, I don't really know python.
<pochu> vil: but rendering is just fine
* ScottK steps away carefully...
<vil> pochu, so did you already switch to gutsy?
<pochu> yep :)
<pochu> but I have a feisty partition just in case something fails ;)
<persia> pochu: like Liferea?
<pochu> persia: heh, no it works fine ;)
* persia starts gutsy vm
<pochu> pretty fine I would say :)
* pochu doesn't know now whether use pycentral or pysupport :/
<geser> pochu: flip a coin :)
<pochu> why are there two options? if there were one, I shouldn't have to chose :)
<ScottK> pochu: Dedicated Python people argue about it a lot.
<persia> pochu: pysupport is easier.  pycentral is more flexible.
<pochu> That's what I don't like from FLOSS, that there are a lot of options!
<ScottK> pochu: Vi or Emacs?
<pochu> (just kidding ;)
<pochu> ScottK: nano :p
<persia> ScottK: ed!
<pochu> geser: that's a good option :)
<vil> pochu, after some upgrade a week or so ago, something went wrong and fonts in firefox and window title changed
<vil> any idea how to troubleshoot that?
<pochu> ScottK: sorry, argue about what?
<ScottK> pochu: pycentral or pysupport.
<pochu> oh, yes :)
<stratus> geser: did you mean namespace_packages line?
<geser> yes
<geser> that way the deb contains the __init__.py files and it works
<pochu> persia: then I think I'll go with the easier one! :)
* pochu is still a n00b :)
<stratus> geser: could you try with pycentral instead, please? leave the namespace_packages as is
<ScottK> tsmithe: Bug #113892 ...
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 113892 in Ubuntu "Terratec EWX 24/96 soundcard not working after installation" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/113892
<stratus> geser: If you can do it now, better, I'll be waiting here, I've no feisty or gutsy chroot in place to do a test build.
<geser> stratus: changing debian/rules now
<stratus> geser: good, remember debian/control build-depends also
<eolo999> bye ScottK I have to go (hard day today). collected a lot of info for the bugs...
<ScottK> eolo999: Good bye.  Thanks for helping out.
<ScottK> eolo999: Have a good evening.
<eolo999> i'm trying
<ScottK> err night
<eolo999> just a bed.
* ScottK remembers TZ difference.
* ScottK would love a nap about now...
<eolo999> what's a nap?
<nixternal> can someone (crimsun since you packaged it before) take a look at plucker in MoM and tell me which way is best to go about doing it? Merge/Sync?
<nixternal> http://merges.ubuntu.com/p/plucker/REPORT
<nixternal> I just test built the debian 1.8.21.dsc package and it built fine in gutsy pbuilder
<nixternal> but in the Debian changelog they talk about dropping the plucker-desktop since it can't be built anymore
<persia> nixternal: Please consider coordinating with the Debian maintainer to migrate to 1.9.0.  There's a patch available for wx2.6 for 1.9.0.
<nixternal> persia: you rock!
<nixternal> I just was catching wind of it :)
* persia deletes the plucker directory from src/scratch
<persia> nixternal: Thank you :)
<nixternal> haha
<nixternal> so you were looking at it as well
<persia> nixternal: Only the wx2.6 part - I hadn't gotten to the merge yet.
<persia> nixternal: http://bugs.plkr.org/1784
<geser> stratus: it works with pycentral
<pochu> so do I use pycentral too? :-)
<gnomefreak> exit
<ScottK> pochu: It depends on your package
<ScottK> AFAICT, geser was trying to solve a very specific problem.
<geser> pochu: does your package has a namespace_packages line in setup.py?
<pochu> persia: looking at http://www.debian.org/doc/packaging-manuals/python-policy/ap-packaging_tools.html, I won't say python-support is easier :)
<pochu> geser: it doesn't have a setup.py!
* pochu is confused
<persia> pochu: Most things are similar.  pysupport autocompiles everything.  pycentral let's you control that in the postinst.  There are other little differences.
<pochu> Is that a big issue? I've already packaged it, and it works fine, but I want it to enter into debian
<ScottK> pochu: Is it a python application or module?
<pochu> ScottK: an app (text editor)
<stratus> geser: oh, keep pycentral then. I'll need to track down the problem into pysupport.
<geser> thanks for the help
<stratus> geser: np, you're welcome.
<ScottK> pochu: The Debian Python Modules Team wouldn't do that directly, but their IRC is a good place to find people to help or possibly sponsor your upload into Debian.
<ScottK> pochu: See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ContributingToDebian/PythonModulesTeam
<pochu> ScottK: thanks!
<stratus> ScottK: did you read the last updates at wiki.debian.org/Utnubu? Bart did some interesting work there.
<ScottK> stratus: No. I did not.
* ScottK will look
<ScottK> stratus: Yes.  Interesting.  For Feisty I did one major update to a Python module, one new Python module, and a new Python application.  They are all now in Debian and synced from Debian for Gutsy, so the process definitely works.
<gpocentek> bddebian: stop spamming my mailbox! :p
<mr_pouit> ^^
<ScottK> stratus: I have been looking at python-dns in Debian and it looks to me like the maintainer has lost interest.  I've got a number of fixes I've gotten into Ubuntu that I'd like to get into Debian.  Any suggestions on how best to proceed?
<orion2012> I seem to be having trouble with REVU. I've uploaded, yet when I decrypt my key it results in "None" and the package isn't listed on the web page. I also never received an e-mail. Can anyone help?
<bddebian> gpocentek: I'm spamming your mailbox?
<stratus> ScottK: hold on, I'm checking the maintainer status on NMU lowthreshold
<ScottK> Thanks
<gpocentek> bddebian: yes, but honnestly, I'm glad to see all the REVU mails ;)
* gpocentek hugs bddebian 
<stratus> ScottK: have you mailed Joerg directly ? His last upload was in 03, the last package upload was made by buxy due to the new python policy.
<ScottK> stratus: I did not yet.
<stratus> ScottK: I suggest you mailing Joerg asking permission to move the package to python-modules
<bddebian> gpocentek: Oh, those :-)
<ScottK> stratus: I will do that.
<gpocentek> bddebian: yep :)
<stratus> ScottK: let me know in some days if he replied to you or not.
<ScottK> stratus: Will do.
<stratus> ScottK: thanks
<ScottK> stratus: Sent.  I'll let you know if I hear back.
<stratus> ScottK: ping me back even if you don't in the next week, please.
<ScottK> stratus: Will do.
<ScottK> I see I've managed to move the pysupport/pycentral arguement to #debian-python (on OFTC).
<sacater> Hey, I will be contributing again tommorow, SATS ARE OVER!!!!
<highvoltage> yay!
* persia hides from the bug yellow thing
<bddebian> bug yello thing?
<persia> bddebian: big
<bddebian> OK,still, what big yellow thing? :)
<persia> You've got a planet in the way: easier to hide :)
<bddebian> Oooohh :-)
<brentc4m> is there always need for more coders for ubuntu? i'd like to get involved and i've been reading around, but I can't tell if there's a genuine need or not
<ScottK> brentc4m: What do you code in?
<brentc4m> ScottK, c/c++ at the moment, but it looks like python is the language of choice around here. it wouldn't be difficult for me to pick up other languages
<ScottK> Do you use Ubuntu or Kubuntu?
<brentc4m> I don't have a ton of experience, but I can definitely get what I want done with enough time
<brentc4m> ubuntu
<ScottK> Python is the language of choice for Ubuntu specific tools, but we have bug fixing to be done in any number of languages.
* ScottK would suggest looking around for interesting bugs in launchpad,  If you get a fix, then we can help you get it packaged and uploaded.
<dothebart> re.
<brentc4m> ah, alright. I'll take a look around. thanks :)
<ptitdav69> hello bddebian ! thanks for reviewing my packages volleyball (http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5096) ! you said that it should have a manpage but there is one in the volleyball-data (provided like this by the upstream author)
<ptitdav69> sorsis, is it good like this ?
<bddebian> ptitdav69: Hrm, no, that makes sense
<ptitdav69> s/sorsis/so :-S
<ScottK> ptitdav69: Does your package install the man page?
* ScottK hasn't looked at it.
<ptitdav69> yes ScottK 
<bddebian> I suppose really the man page should be with the binary package though.  I'm not sure
* ScottK would suggest then investigating why lintian complains then.
<bddebian> ScottK: It complains on the binary package but the data package contains the man page
<ScottK> Ah.
<ScottK> That would make sense.  Data package doesn't need a man page, the binary package does...
<ptitdav69> so I need to extract the .6 from the source package off volleyball-data and include it on the binary package ? 
<bddebian> ptitdav69: Yes.  In fact can they not be in the same source package and just build two different binaries?
<bddebian> OK, except for iceape and alsa-tools, everything should have at least 1 review.. Sheesh..
<ScottK> bddebian: So, what you are saying is that you are someone who quits before the job is done ;-)
<bddebian> Well it's time to head home
<ScottK> Have a good evening.  You got a lot done this afternoon.
<ScottK> No more whining about never doing anything.
<ptitdav69> bddebian, the upstream author made one package for the binary and one other for the data... but I can ask him to merge them... and after, I will create 2 binary package... am I right ?
<bddebian> ScottK: Whining is what I do best :)
<bddebian> ptitdav69: If upstream is that way, it's OK, but really it could probably be 1 source package.  Unless they are maintained seperately.  But the man page should be in the binary package, not the data package.
<ptitdav69> ok bddebian, thanks a lot ! :)
<bddebian> No, THANK YOU! :-)
<ptitdav69> ^^
<DarkSun88> Good Night
<bddebian> Gah time to head home.  Later folks
<xxxxx1> bye bddebian 
<Ursinha> folks
<Ursinha> is there a gstreamer0.10-mms on the way?
<xxxxx1> Ursinha: only for 0.8
<Ursinha> i mean, there is a 0.8 now, are there plans for creating a 0.10 version?
<Ursinha> i need it to reproduce mms streams in feisty, but i can't get it to work with 0.8
<xxxxx1> Ursinha: try pkg-gstreamer-maintainers@lists.alioth.debian.org
<Ursinha> the version exists, i just want to know if it will be packed for ubuntu :)
<Ursinha> in gstreamer's page it seems that it's incorporated at 0.10-plugins-bad, but looking at 0.10-plugins-bad in ubuntu libmms doesn't shows as dependency
<Ursinha> well, seems that i read wrong, actually libmms0 is there... but still doesn't work
* Ursinha scratches her head...
<Ursinha> ok.. i'm going, thanks xxxxx1 
<Ursinha> bye all
#ubuntu-motu 2007-05-11
<nixternal> StevenK: did you check out krename merge the othernight? bug 112528
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 112528 in krename "[Gutsy Merge]  krename_3.0.14-0ubuntu1" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/112528
<nixternal> getting that merged will close 2 bugs for krename
<nixternal> brb
<Acksys> I'd like to get set up with a mentor.
<Acksys> What's the best way?
<etank> what is the process of getting teamed with a mentor?
<gnomefreak> etank: talk to the person offering the mentoring maybe. i guess it depends on what you want mentoring in and who is willing to help in that
<etank> gnomefreak: ok. 
<wolfeon> oh damn it :/
<wolfeon> keep forgetting to submit my patches :)
<wolfeon> "send patches or stfu" :D
<TheMuso> Hey MOTUs and MOTU hopefuls.
<Simon80> hi Dr. Nick!
<RAOF> Hey TheMuso 
<Simon80> I'm just being random
<paran> is feisty-backport not opened yet?
<nxvl> hi
<nxvl> i want to help, and be part of the MOTU
<nxvl> i have read the web
<RAOF> nxvl: Excellent!  How do you want to help?
<nxvl> and write to sistpoty but i don't have any answer yet
* RAOF thinks that reading the interweb must have taken some time :)
<paran> If I look in launchpad it seems like ktorrent have been backported to feisty, but there is nothing in the archives.
<nxvl> RAOF: i will like to help with ruby, wich is the lenguage with i feel more comfortable
<j-dizzle> paran: it's open... I'm on break while exam season's here....
<j-dizzle> paran: and infinity said he'd fix the backports build problem for ktorrent.....
<j-dizzle> "this morning"
<j-dizzle> where this morning was 3 days ago
<nxvl> RAOF: and as i read it seems to need lot of help
<j-dizzle> so umm.... yeah.....
* j-dizzle walks over to -devel....
<RAOF> nxvl: And you want to help by... fixing bugs in ruby packages?  Packaging new ruby programs?
<paran> j-dizzle: lol
<nxvl> RAOF: yes, packaging, reporting bugs, maybe fixing
<nxvl> im not a ruby expert
<nxvl> but i will learn
<j-dizzle> paran: all the devs are at their conference thing, so it's been an odd week :)
<RAOF> Right, so reporting bugs you can do right now, to launchpad.net :)
<j-dizzle> not to mention I'm supposed to be learning how curl and stokes theorem works....
<nxvl> RAOF: that i know ;)
<bddebian> Heya gang
<paran> j-dizzle: there is no rush for me, I have backported it myself with some extra patches from SVN. was only wondering why it wasn't in archives
<RAOF> hey bddebian 
<bddebian> Hello RAOF
<nxvl> RAOF: but i want to make packages, and try to fix bugs
<j-dizzle> paran: ok; "mystery buildd magic" I guess is the official explanation.
<j-dizzle> paran: I have some personal conspiracy theories... but I'd rather not share them :D
<j-dizzle> haha
<RAOF> nxvl: Ok.  Have you read the packaging guide?  That's how I learnt to build debian/ubuntu packages.
<harrisony> nxvl,  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Teams/Ruby sounds good for you :)
<paran> j-dizzle: exam periods is a rather good excuse for you not working
<paran> j-dizzle: although I seem to spend _more_ time on things unrelated to studies when I have those.. :)
<j-dizzle> paran: I'm trying to prevent the same from ahppening here :D
<j-dizzle> I'm pretty sure I bombed my calc test this morning :)
<j-dizzle> I'm awaiting the "you've failed, you miserable piece of garbage" e-mail... :D
<paran> calc as in calculus?
<nxvl> RAOF: im reading
<j-dizzle> yep
<j-dizzle> 18.02, multivariable calc
<nxvl> harrisony: thnx
<harrisony> nxvl, can i have a link to your launchpad profile? 
<nxvl> harrisony: https://launchpad.net/~nvalcarcel
<nxvl> harrisony: i haven't use it very much
<harrisony> nxvl, have you been told about REVU?
<paran> j-dizzle: ah, I know that feeling. I also have a failed multivar course that I will pass any year now
<nxvl> harrisony: nop
<j-dizzle> well... 2 weeks left to go
<j-dizzle> then my first term at the suicide mansion will come to an end :)
<harrisony> !revu > nxvl 
<harrisony> the bot will pm you
<nxvl> im reading
<nxvl> well, first i need to know how to make packages
<nxvl> :D
<harrisony> yep also check out https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuOpenWeek have a look at the package sessions and MOTU related sessions logs as they are quite good 
<minghua> !packagingguide > nxvl
<_MMA_> Hi all. Ubuntu Studio 7.04 has been released. http://ubuntustudio.org Thanx to everyone. :)
<bddebian> Is it just me or do we have people coming out of the woodwork lately? :)
<Acksys> What is the best way to get hooked up with a mentor?
<bddebian> Acksys: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Mentors
<Acksys> Do I need to pick one that reflects the area in which I'd like to contribute? Because I'm not sure about that yet.
<bddebian> Nope.  In fact you don't "have" to have one.  You are welcome to ask questions here.
* RAOF hasn't had one.
<Acksys> Well, I have some programming experience, but no experience in a real development environment.
<bddebian> RAOF: And it shows. ;-P
<Acksys> So I'm at somewhat of a loss about where to begin.
<minghua> ubuntustudio has a nice looking website
<bddebian> RAOF: j/k
<RAOF> bddebian: :P
<bddebian> Acksys: Do you have any specific areas of interest?
<RAOF> bddebian: Only in stupid things like assigning bugs to u-u-s & u-m-s
<_MMA_> minghua: Thanx
<Acksys> My major is graphic communications.. that's a print management major, so I'm interested in graphics
<Acksys> and music as well
<bddebian> Acksys: Look for some bugs in music or graphics packages and fix them. :-)
<Acksys> bddebian: You make it sound easy.
<Acksys> I'll give it a shot.
<_MMA_> ;)
<RAOF> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.tag=bitesize is a list of bugs marked as "bitesized" ie: should be quick/easy to fix.
<Acksys> ah, ok
<RAOF> It might be good to start there, since most of the work involved in fixing those (should) be in the learning of the various processes :)
<Acksys> RAOF: That looks like a good place to start, thanks for the info.
<nxvl> i have send mi first patch
<nxvl> :D
<chillywilly> um, so the only way to do a desktop install via the desktop feisty iso is to boot into a full desktop?
<chillywilly> and double click on the "install" icon
<minghua> chillywilly: check out alternative install CD
<chillywilly> it's just kinda weird if you ask me
<bddebian> chillywilly: Oh hush up and go back to your rbuild or whatever the fsck it's called. ;-P
<chillywilly> I hadn't downloaded and burnt that one
<chillywilly> anaconda is a nice installer and customizable via python :)
<persia> chillywilly: If you *really* want, you can manually partition and debootstrap using the pool directory on the regular CD, but it won't be very friendly.
<harrisony> anaconda is used by fedora
<chillywilly> but no I am building a distro using rPath linux appliance platform for the record ;P
* chillywilly slaps bddebian w/ a large Halibut
<_MMA_> chillywilly: Why aren't you on: #rpath #rpath-support #foresight or #conary. Those are the places you should ask.
<chillywilly> I am on #conary
<chillywilly> ask what?
<chillywilly> I didn't ask anything here :)\
<persia> Could someone please advise me as to how to automatically generate -dbgsym packages with sbuild?
<minghua> persia: the dh_strip(1) man page (assuming you have a debhelper >= 5)
<persia> minghua: Thanks.  Now to complicate things, I need to override for CDBS :)
<persia> minghua: Thanks a lot.  You've pointed me in the right direction.  I just need to install pkg-create-dbgsym in the chroot.
<freeflying> minghua: will you merge scim into gutsy?
<minghua> freeflying: not now, don't have time
<minghua> persia: Hmm, I didn't know about pkg-create-dbgsym.  Is that a package name?
<freeflying> minghua: ok, I've done
<minghua> freeflying: sure, thanks
<RAOF> It's what the buildds use to automatically create the foo-dbgsym packages for everything, right?
<RAOF> (The package, I mean)
<persia> minghua: Yep.  It diverts dh_strip to always generate -dbgsym packages.  Handy for local testing.
<freeflying> imbrandon: ping
<minghua> persia: I see.  I also found out it's an Ubuntu-only package.  No wonder I haven't heard of it before.
<persia> minghua: I think it's fairly new too (perhaps six months old, or so?)
<minghua> persia: launchpad says it has existed since edgy
<minghua> 2006-07-04 first upload, acutally
<minghua> so yes, fairly new
<persia> minghua: Ah - almost a year old.  My apologies for misremembering.
<dabaR> persia: did you get a response on where to file a bug on the ubuntu web site?
<persia> dabaR: For the ubuntu website, I have an answer, but I haven't really followed up on where to file a bug about the behaviour of patches.ubuntu.com (which might be Soyuz?  I'm not sure).
<dabaR> persia: I would personally file it against the ubuntu web site, but you're right, that may be wrong.
<persia> dabaR: Just yesterday I had what I thought was a Malone bug turn out to be a duplicate of a Soyuz bug, so I want to avoid causing more extra work for the triagers.  It's only wishlist anyway (preserve last three ubuntu patches, for convenience of packages.qa.debian.org, instead of only the lastest patch; alternately, provide a symlink "latest" in each directory for link convenience).
<dabaR> sharms: Do you know that both the  Archive and the About links on your blog are broken?
<StevenK> nixternal: Hrm? What about krename?
<nixternal> just wondering if you had looked at it for the merge previously? I think last time talking about getting it into Debian threw it off
<nixternal> I still haven't received contact back from the maintainer
<StevenK> How long has it been?
* nixternal checks
<nixternal> Saturday
<StevenK> Hrm. I'd give it a little longer.
<ceros> i'm trying to upload my packages again
<ceros> dput -f isn't working for me
<RAOF> You've changed ~/dput.conf so that revu is the default server?
<ceros> yes
<RAOF> And you've added yourself to the revu team, and the revu keyring has been sync'd?
<persia> StevenK: Thank you.
<ceros> i don't know if the keyring has been synced
<RAOF> How long ago did you add yourself to the team?
<persia> ceros: As far as I know, last sync was about 18 hours ago.
<ceros> about 2 or 3 days ago
<bluefoxicy> when something has a Replaces: foo
<RAOF> And what exactly isn't working/what errors are given?
<bluefoxicy> and I try to install a .deb and it goes "Cannot satisfy dependency:  foo"
<bluefoxicy> what does that mean?
<ceros> Error '553 Could not create file.' during ftp transfer of sauerbraten_0.0.20070413-0ubuntu1.dsc
<bluefoxicy> assuming I have the first thing installed already.
<bluefoxicy> Does it mean the dependency checking code is horribly broken?
<ceros> i'm trying to upload again since my last attempt errored out
<ceros> when it was about to upload the changes file
<RAOF> ceros: It's possible that you've got some files from your previous attempt blocking the new files.
<ceros> i can't force it to upload again?
<RAOF> No, you need to prod a REVU admin.
<RAOF> Who can look at incoming, and delete stuff or whatever
<persia> bluefoxicy: Replaces: means that the package is allowed to share filenames with the replaced package.  It should generally only be used where multiple binaries are built from the same source, and some files moved,  or there is a transition (in which case it should Conflicts: as well).  For either case, it may well depend on some version of the replaced pacakge to ensure the user is never without the affected file.
<RAOF> I forget who the actual admins are, though.  crimsun is, I think.
<minghua> bluefoxicy: do you have a versioned Replaces?
<RAOF> ceros: Bah, silly me.  wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU
<RAOF> ceros: that page says admins are siretart, sistpoty, ajmitch, raphink.
<ceros> ok
<bluefoxicy> minghua:  no, it just seems gdebi doesn't like libusplash-dev instead of usplash-dev
<harrisony> RAOF, you live in australia?
<RAOF> harrisony: Yup, Sydney.
<bluefoxicy> minghua: but libusplash-dev Replaces usplash-dev
<bluefoxicy> it won't satisfy dependencies though.
<harrisony> RAOF, how come i dont see you in #ubuntu-au , what suburb in sydney?
<persia> bluefoxicy: If they were the same, libusplash-dev would need to Provides: usplash-dev.  Wait a while, and it will become more stable.
<RAOF> harrisony: Because if I joined every relevant IRC channel, I wouldn't get even what little work I do get done done :)
<harrisony> haha
<minghua> bluefoxicy: that's correct behavior
<minghua> bluefoxicy: Replaces has nothing to do with satisfying dependency, it's Provides' job.
<bluefoxicy> ok
<bluefoxicy> then the other package is broken
<minghua> okay, next time I should read all conversations before repeating what persia said...
<persia> minghua: No, your phrasing is easier to understand :)
* persia resolves to avoid scim & CJK bugs whilst minghua is actively triaging
<minghua> persia: :-)
<minghua> not exactly all CJK bugs
<minghua> I'm just subscribed to bugmail of all scim related packages, and triage them on a best-of-effort basis
<persia> minghua: No, but I'll at least concentrate on fixes, rather than grabbing easy "gutsy isn't ready yet" bugs :)
<minghua> persia: yeah, sounds a good idea
<minghua> persia: you can spend you time working on the code, and let me do the commenting work :-)
<persia> minghua: :)
<minghua> persia: as I don't have a gutsy system right now, doing really packaging is a little problematic
<persia> minghua: vm?  chroot?
<minghua> chroot is not exactly convenient for testing input method stuff
<minghua> it usually requires a working X
<minghua> as for VM, I've never played with one
<RAOF> I've recently set up a gusty VM with KVM, that was pretty easy.
<minghua> I suppose I can update my feisty pbuilder chroot and do some test building stuff
<minghua> but I only want to upload stuff I'm very confident of this way if that's all my testing
<persia> minghua: For chroot, run the X server on a different vterm.  Of course, when gutsy crashes, feisty might :).  For VM, try vmware-player and http://www.vmware.com/vmtn/vm/ubuntu.html.  There's an ubuntu.org link too, but I can't find it right now.
<minghua> my problem is, trying to keep an up-to-date development system with both GNOME and KDE installed is a bit taxing to my DSL line
<Treenaks> minghua: get a better internet connection :)
<minghua> persia: my main system is sid, not feisty :-)
<persia> minghua: In that case, you'd do better to wait until later.
<minghua> yeah I know how to set a chroot with X
<persia> minghua: sid?  My sid VM is less stable than my gutsy VM, but perhaps that's just me.
<minghua> but things are always a bit iffy and I don't want to mess with my good sid system
<minghua> I think it depends on what "stable" means
<Treenaks> it's our Burger King! :)
<minghua> I am quite confident on the kernel and basic stuff in sid
<minghua> although I've been experiencing an OO.o bug and a video driver bug recently
<persia> minghua: Stability is king.  That's why I like using VMs, but I don't know that vmware-player works on sid.  In reference to "stable": I am currently les surprised by changes to gutsy than to sid.  I expect this to change next week, after UDS.
<Treenaks> persia: kvm should work on sid
<Treenaks>  kvm
<minghua> persia: yeah, sid is rather turbulent right now
<persia> Treenaks: Doesn't kvm have processor requirements?
* minghua needs to find time to play with VM stuff
<Treenaks> persia: oh... yeah..
* RAOF needs to chase down why kvm doesn't boot properly all the time
<Treenaks> persia: it needs intel vt or amd-v
<RAOF> Surely everyone has a <1 yr old Intel or AMD chip :P
<Treenaks> RAOF: ;)
<minghua> Treenaks: apparently not a choice for my AMD K6 CPU then :-)
<persia> RAOF: No.  My main computers are XScale 624 and Athlon X2 4400+.
<RAOF> Old school!
<RAOF> persia: The X2 supports kvm, doesn't it?
<Treenaks> minghua: xen?
<persia> RAOF: Not the first batch off the ship.  A newer one might.
<minghua> maybe vserver, I think
<minghua> or vmware stuff
<minghua> although my priority is taking care of my Debian package now
<minghua> so sid system is good enough :-P
<ajmitch> morning
<geser> morning ajmitch
<sorsis> /lastlog sorsis
<BugMaN> hi all
<persia> If I upload a foo-1.2-0ubuntu1 revision, and Debian later publishes a foo1.2-1 version, is a sync possible so long as the same orig.tar.gz is in use?
<crimsun> yes.
<persia> crimsun: Thanks.
<crimsun> cf. galago-python, galago-gtk-python recently (this devel cycle).
<crimsun> err, was that versioning you used intentional?
<crimsun> (I presumed you meant foo_1.2-0ubuntu1 and foo_1.2-1)
<persia> crimsun: No, there was a typo - it should have been as you typed.  I somehow managed to commit my comment whilst still composing :)
<crimsun> ah, I've been a victim of that, too.
<minghua> persia: did you really mean foo-1.2 and foo1.2?
<minghua> persia: i.e., the difference of a hyphen in the package name?
<persia> minghua: Not at all.  I really meant foo_1.2-0ubuntu1 and foo_1.2-1
<freeflying> crimsun: arounds
<crimsun> freeflying: hi
<freeflying> crimsun: would you likde sponsor uplad
<crimsun> freeflying: sure, url?
<freeflying> crimsun: a momnet plz
<freeflying> crimsun: or I mail u
<crimsun> freeflying: I'm on a very slow connection now, so a URL is probably best
<freeflying> crimsun: http://211.147.215.100:~/freeflying/scim/scim_1.4.6-1ubuntu1.dsc
<freeflying> crimsun: http://211.147.215.100~/freeflying/scim/scim_1.4.6-1ubuntu1.dsc
<freeflying> crimsun: can you access to it
<crimsun> freeflying: testing
<crimsun> freeflying: yes
<freeflying> crimsun: all others package has build-dep on it need rebuild against it, or they can not work
<crimsun> freeflying: ok, can you link me to the diff.gz?
<freeflying> crimsun: http://211.147.215.100~/freeflying/scim/scim_1.4.6-1ubuntu1.diff.gz
<crimsun> freeflying: did you work with minghua on this merge?
<freeflying> crimsun: minghua said he hasn't time now for merge, so I did
<crimsun> freeflying: ok.  And you've tested it?
<minghua> crimsun: yeah, he asked earlier today, I told him to go ahead
<freeflying> crimsun: sure, I'm using it now
<crimsun> minghua: ok.
<crimsun> freeflying: thanks.
<crimsun> all right, grabbing orig.tar.gz
<freeflying> debian's powerpc builld dosen't work now, I can not close the bug of skim now
<crimsun> err, the previous Ubuntu changelog entries are missing from debian/changelog
<TheMuso> c
<TheMuso> ugh
<TheMuso> evening folks.
<crimsun> freeflying: would you readd the missing previous Ubuntu changelog entries, please?
<crimsun> hi TheMuso 
<freeflying> crimsun: ok
<persia> good evening TheMuso.
* elkbuntu pokes ajmitch
<elkbuntu> oi you. who keeps signing me up for stuff
<crimsun> I hear a certain Melissa would like to join the ubuntu-audio LP team...
<jmg> lp?
* elkbuntu thwacks crimsun
<crimsun> jmg: Launchpad
<jmg> notice there is a melissa at google
* jmg had an ex melissa
<jmg> all the same :)
<crimsun> I was referring to "elkbuntu" Melissa
<jmg> elkbuntu: greetings
<elkbuntu> hi jmg
<elkbuntu> crimsun, i'm thinking it's mr mitchell
<crimsun> hmm!
<elkbuntu> crimsun, i somehow was signed up to a motu session the first day
<elkbuntu> crimsun, now this
<elkbuntu> and goodness knows how many else i havent noticed through the week
<freeflying> crimsun: done
<crimsun> freeflying: new URLs?
<freeflying> crimsun: same as above
<persia> Is it a Debian bug is a Build-Depends is not specified that causes a build failure for Ubuntu (where the Debian package built successfully)?
<StevenK> persia: Curious. Which package, and which package is missing?
<persia> StevenK: aqsis and libtiff (or, probably, really libtiffxx0).
<ajmitch> elkbuntu: yes?
<StevenK> Perhaps one of the Build-Depends in Debian pulls in the tiff libraries?
<StevenK> And doesn't on Ubuntu.
<ajmitch> elkbuntu: I told you I don't subscribe you to specs
* persia goes to investigate again - perhaps more is needed
<StevenK> persia: I saw your removal bug, and dealt with it.
<elkbuntu> ajmitch, then wtf is happening? you and hobbsee were plotting evil things before we came here :
<ajmitch> I'm evil, not mean
<elkbuntu> ajmitch, ah, so it must be hobbsee then
<elkbuntu> is she in the same session as you at the moment?
<ajmitch> nope
<persia> StevenK: For wstools?  Thanks.  Only 5 packages to go :)
<StevenK> Heh
<crimsun> freeflying: uploaded.
<freeflying> crimsun: thanks
<elkbuntu> hmm, i wonder where she is then
<ajmitch> well I'm in a mdadm/lvm/evms session
<ajmitch> which I doubt she's interested in
<minghua> persia: according to aqsis's debian build log (http://buildd.debian.org/pkg.cgi?pkg=aqsis), Debian uses libtiffxx0c2
<TheMuso> I see no schedule for today
<StevenK> TheMuso: It's there, just not linked to.
<persia> minghua: Ubuntu does as well - I just saw "TIFF C++ bindings" when first commenting.
<TheMuso> gotcha
<StevenK> TheMuso: You have no idea how much self-control that took. :-P
<minghua> persia: okay.  in Debian libtiffxx0c2 is pulled in by libtiff4-dev
<TheMuso> early finish today
<StevenK> There's a big dinner on, isn't there?
<ajmitch> StevenK: yep, around 7:30 tonight
<StevenK> minghua: In Ubuntu as well.
<crimsun> aka the big ole dinner in which everyone eats way too much and gets drunk
<ajmitch> and then the later evening when people get even drunker
<ajmitch> except that many have a flight at about 6:30 AM
<StevenK> ajmitch: Like yourself?
<persia> minghua: Interestingly enough, yellow pulled all of libtiff4, libtiff4-dev, and libtiffxx0c2 before trying to compile.  I'm suspicious of scons for this one.
<ajmitch> nah, my flight is after lunch
<minghua> persia: ah, scons
<minghua> persia: I met a mysterious FTBFS related to scons in Debian as well a few days ago
<persia> minghua: rumor has it that scons packages build correctly until uploaded to production :)
<StevenK> persia: Sounds about right.
<StevenK> persia: scons ought to be avoided.
<minghua> the only thing I know about scons is its colorful output :-)
<persia> StevenK: I agree, but Upstream does as Upstream wills.  I'm not sure I want to maintain a backport to autoconf ;)
<StevenK> persia: Actually, I'd find it amusing if a package Build-Depends on scons and Build-Conflicts on scons because it's so horrid.
<persia> StevenK: Amusing yes, but surely a sufficient bug not to be tolerated (although I am tempted)
<crimsun> hah, I really misinterpreted that.  I thought you were saying that autoconf build-depends on scons.
<StevenK> Twitch
<crimsun> that would be quite tragic/humourous.
<persia> crimsun: That would be a feature :)
<Treenaks> that would make little baby bunnies cry
<Treenaks> a lot of them
<Treenaks> at the same time
<gnomefreak> how do i sign into revu to reply to a comment?
<persia> gnomefreak: "recover" the password you were probably never sent of the email address on the registered key.
<elkbuntu> announcement: amaranth just got kicked out of the hotel room by the maid
<gnomefreak> persia: i tried that but it gave me None and it doesnt work
<elkbuntu> that is all. i must now go rofl
<crimsun> elkbuntu: just what  /was/  he doing in that hotel room...
<Treenaks> elkbuntu: so.. he's sitting on the floor, naked?
<Treenaks> elkbuntu: just outside the room
<elkbuntu> he's walking around now, ask him
<Treenaks> elkbuntu: *BAD MENTAL IMAGE*
<persia> gnomefreak: Sorry, that's what I did.  Perhaps someone with more REVU experience could help?
<Hobbsee> gnomefreak: on the main page
<gnomefreak> when i click recover it gives me a couple of lines
<gnomefreak> to decrypt ..... than > gpg command   than now paste the lines below ... no lines are there
<elkbuntu> Treenaks, do you think i'm IRCing from above a porcelain bowl or something?
<gnomefreak> http://revu.tauware.de/lostpw.py?email=gnomefreak@ubuntu.com
<persia> gnomefreak: You need an admin.
<gnomefreak> :(
<Treenaks> elkbuntu: maybe
<gnomefreak> also why would a build fail in pbuilder and not with dpkg-buildpackage  (patch failing in pbuilder)
<persia> gnomefreak: That can happen if your source tree was dirty before dpkg-buildpackage, or if your Build-Depends are insufficiently satisfied (for your patch system), or lastly, if you are patching after the autoconf fun, and need to patch configure.ac or configure.in (or similar for other build systems).
<crimsun> magic patch?
<crimsun> gnomefreak: have you uploaded a package to revu?
<gnomefreak> yes
<gnomefreak> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5092
<gnomefreak> it builds fine here without pbuilder ;)
* ajmitch blames gpg on tiber
* Hobbsee blames everything on ajmitch 
<ajmitch> I'm used to that, thanks for your helpful input
<Hobbsee> :)
<persia> Does anyone know whether Soyuz uses chroot or schroot for the sbuild processes?
<pochu> persia: I would ask that in #launchpad ;)
<persia> pochu: Oh well.  Thanks.
* persia waits until after UDS for #launchpad bothering
<joejaxx> Good Morning Everyone
<pochu> hi joejaxx 
<joejaxx> hello pochu :)
* joejaxx finally has time for motu-hopeful work :D
<gnomefreak> hmmmmmmm
<gnomefreak> brb something is off here
<TheMuso> persia: schroot and sbuild are rather tied together, so I'd say schroot.
<persia> TheMuso: The man page for sbuild-setup makes lots of references to buildd.chroot, which makes me unsure.  I wouldn't be surprised if dchroot was the mechanism of preference.
<TheMuso> Heya imbrandon.
<Hobbsee> StevenK: do you remember how to use requestsync for gutsy, when running feisty?
<gnomefreak> crimsun: this is due to something that was updated in gutsy because before today (for me) it built fine.
<shawarma> Hobbsee: eh? You specify the distro on the command line?
<gnomefreak> and if you go through and # out in 00list you will end up with no patches
<gnomefreak> i tried in 2 gutsy chroots and a gutsy main sys.
<Hobbsee> shawarma: says i dont have gutsy in apt-cache madison
<Hobbsee> although i do have the source version
<pochu> mr_pouit: around? I'm packaging scribes for Debian (since the packager i revu doesn't intend to do it), and I saw you said the .svgs have a CC license. Where have you read it? :)
<shawarma> Hobbsee: Oh, really? Ah, yes, that makes sense.
<shawarma> Hobbsee: You can just specify the base version?
<shawarma> Hobbsee: As the last argument.
<shawarma> Hobbsee: forget it.
<shawarma> Hobbsee: I'm on crack.
<persia> Hobbsee: change your sources, update (don't upgrade), requestsync, fix your source, update?   (sed --in-place s/feisty/gusty/ & reverse)
<minghua> sounds painful
<minghua> maybe add gutsy and pin it down is a better idea
<shawarma> Hobbsee: apt-cache madison actually lists it, but requestsync fails to get it?
<Hobbsee> shawarma: it lists the feisty version
<Hobbsee> well...
<Hobbsee> sarah@LongPointyStick:~/Desktop$ madison fillets-ng
<Hobbsee> fillets-ng |    0.7.3-3 | http://archive.ubuntu.com feisty/universe Packages
<Hobbsee> fillets-ng |    0.7.3-3 | http://archive.ubuntu.com gutsy/universe Sources
<Hobbsee> shawarma: ^ is what i get
<Hobbsee> shawarma: yes, i can, but that doesnt list the changes between the base version, and the latest, as the latest is in experimental...
<gnomefreak> is there a way to find out what was upgraded in last 24 hours?
<geser> on your system?
<gnomefreak> yeah
<gnomefreak> or chroot
<geser> /var/log/dpkg.log
<Treenaks> /var/log/dpkg.log
<gnomefreak> i remember binutils
<gnomefreak> ty
* minghua wonders how could bugs like bug 113870 happen
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 113870 in octave2.1-forge "feisty, package octave-forge2.1: missing sparse.oct" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/113870
<StevenK> Hobbsee: That looks fine.
<StevenK> In fact, I get the same output.
<imbrandon> wow one little digg and you can satuate a 100MB/s connection heheh http://www.imbrandon.com/misc/bandwidth/current.jpg
<Hobbsee> oh wiat, it worked.
<minghua> imbrandon: how did you end up on digg?
<imbrandon> ubuntustudio release ( i have a mirror )
<mr_pouit> pochu: I can't remember exactly, but I think I made 'grep -Ri copyright *' or 'grep -Ri license *', and there were some occurrences in the .svg ^^
<pochu> mr_pouit:             <cc:license
<pochu>                rdf:resource="http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-sa/2.5/" />
<pochu> mr_pouit: thanks! :)
<mr_pouit> np ;)
<gnomefreak> who is a revu admin?
<Hobbsee> gnomefreak: what's up?
<gnomefreak> Hobbsee: i cant get my password to comment
<Hobbsee> ah.   no idea
<gnomefreak> when i use recover it never gives me a sig. to decrypt
<thp> If I have packaged a piece of software for Debian, and it is in Debian unstable already, what needs to be done to get the same package into Ubuntu (and maybe always update the package in Ubuntu when it's updated in Debian)?
<StevenK> At this point, nothing.
<StevenK> We're early in the release cycle for Gutsy, so it will get pulled in automatically.
<thp> when does these updates happen and where can I see what packages have been pulled?
<StevenK> For packages that are in Debian but not in Ubuntu, they happen on the whim of the ubuntu-archive team.
<TheMuso> joejaxx: When troy_s is around tomorrow my time, I'll see about getting access to his. What needs building
<TheMuso> oops wrong channel
<StevenK> As for seeing what packages have been pulled, you could search in Launchpad.
<thp> so, if i want to package for Debian and have the package in Ubuntu, I don't have to do anything but just wait until it gets synchronized? so no motu upload is necessary or such?
<gnomefreak> StevenK: wouldnt someone need to tell the archive team what package it is since not all debian packages come over to ubuntu?
<minghua> gnomefreak: I believe not
* gnomefreak would have thought he would have to build it for ubuntu but i guess it would depend on package
<StevenK> gnomefreak: No, they just get pulled over.
<gnomefreak> oh
<gnomefreak> hmmm it seems it still builds on feisty :(
<geser> thp: this is only true till the automatic import stops. after that a sync request (acked by a MOTU) is needed
<thp> geser: the package i'm talking about is http://packages.qa.debian.org/g/gpodder.html -- does it qualify for automatic importing from Debian to Ubuntu or do I have to beg a MOTU to have a look?
<thp> or is it only synced from Debian testing?
<StevenK> It will be synced from unstable.
<StevenK> thp: Exercise patience, it will find it's way over here.
<TheMuso> Most people are only running gutsy in a chroot at this point anyway.
<thp> ok, thanks. just wanted to know if there is anything i have to do or if it will do that automatically =)
<geser> thp: you have time to get it included till mid August
<thp> and if gutsy is shortly before release, it will be frozen and after the gutsy release ubuntu will pull again the latest package version from debian unstable, right?
<geser> yes
<thp> so when working on Debian, i'm indirectly contributing to ubuntu :) that's cool.. thanks for your time and the answers.. see ya
* TheMuso is workin on ivman
<Lutin> hey DktrKranz 
<DktrKranz> hi Lutin 
<gnomefreak> ok this is getting really odd
<gnomefreak> does dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot -S -sa not apply patches?
<persia> gnomefreak: If debian/rules specifies patching, it should.
<gnomefreak> persia: it fails when testing the build with fakeroot ./debian/rules binary  "OR"  dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot -nc  but doesnt fail using the -S -sa
<minghua> well, dpkg-buildpackage -S only builds the _source_ package
<persia> gnomefreak: Try `dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot` without the -nc.  You need to clean before you patch.
<gnomefreak> i get dpkg-source: warning: executable mode 0755 of `debian/patches/80_app_name.dpatch' will not be represented in diff on all patches but should still be fine i would have thought
<gnomefreak> persia: these patches have been here. ive been building this package for 2+ months
<gnomefreak> trying it without the -nc and maybe the patches need to be updated for gutys :(
<persia> gnomefreak: That's probably the issue.  Copy the files you changes somewhere else, grab the original sources, and patch back to what you think it should be.  Likely you ran debuild (or the quivalent) twice in a row at some point in the past (or at least, that's what usually happens to me).
<gnomefreak> i use fakeroot ./debian/rules clean before each build just habit :( i know dpkg-buildpackage will clean for me but habit
<xxxxx1> morning!
<gnomefreak> xxxxx1: morning
<TheMuso> geser: I'm happy to sponsor bluekuja for apt-move, as I am working with him on other merges.
<TheMuso> geser: Unless you would rather do it.
<geser> TheMuso: he asked me already about merging apt-move and it's ok if he does it
<TheMuso> geser: I know.
<TheMuso> I suggested he do so.
<TheMuso> Just letting you know I'm willing to sponsor.
<Amaranth> Hobbsee: So how do I make pbuilder give me a shell when a build fails?
<ajmitch> put in a hook
<siretart> Amaranth: look in /usr/share/doc/pbuilder for example hooks
<siretart> Amaranth: there is a hook for that there
<Amaranth> Pretend I have no idea what you're talking about :)
<TheMuso> Shell on build failure is damn handy.
<Amaranth> siretart: alright, cool
<Amaranth> neat
<StevenK> I find it is irritating sometimes, but most times it is a big help.
<Amaranth> so i have to use --hookdir all the time or can i add this to a config file somewhere?
<Hobbsee> what they said
<StevenK> % cat .pbuilderrc 
<StevenK> HOOKDIR=/home/steven/.pbuilder/hooks
<Hobbsee> in .pbuilderrc
<Amaranth> ah
<TheMuso> The only time its a pain is if you need to generate a log file.
<StevenK> TheMuso: I don't find that, since I tend to only generate a logfile if the build was sucessful.
<TheMuso> StevenK: Ah.
<TheMuso> I find logfiles useful sometimes if a build fails, and I can't get enough info from whats shoing on the console when I'm in a shell inside the chroot.
* StevenK wonders if he has the guts to upload xbitmaps
<Amaranth> arg
<Hobbsee> StevenK: i dont think mithrandir will come and kill you if you get it wrong - too far away
<Amaranth> compiz doesn't have make dist or distcheck
<StevenK> Hobbsee: :-P
<StevenK> I don't think I've gotten it wrong.
<Amaranth> and dpkg-buildpackage -S will put this file in the .tar.gz (doing a native package for now) but in the pbuilder it's missing
<Treenaks> Hobbsee: you on the other hand... :)
<StevenK> Mind you, I don't think I'll bother, since it seems to be about as pointless as my clanlib merge.
<Hobbsee> Treenaks: true
<Amaranth> so, need some build system help
<Amaranth> :)
<Amaranth> i have this file that doesn't get copied into obj-i486-linux-gnu so the build fails
<Amaranth> it's in extra_DIST
<StevenK> Hrm. Then again, it reduces the debdiff to 1.5K as opposed to 48K.
<persia> Amaranth: You can force it in configure: if you really want.
<shawarma> Amaranth: Not EXTRA_DIST?
<Amaranth> EXTRA_DIST, right
<Amaranth> i don't want to force it, the build system upstream is broken
<shawarma> Amaranth: Ah, good. It's case-sensitive, so..
<Amaranth> but when i'm not making a package in pbuilder i can hack around it :)
<gnomefreak> is anyone else having issues building packages with dpatch error?
<Hobbsee> gnomefreak: dpatch error?  dpatch has many errors...
<Hobbsee> well, can have
<gnomefreak> test -d debian/patched || install -d debian/patched
<gnomefreak> dpatch  apply-all  
<gnomefreak> applying patch 10_components_no_exec to ./ ... failed.
<gnomefreak> make: *** [patch-stamp]  Error 1
<Treenaks> wow, nice descriptive error
<gnomefreak> :)
<gnomefreak> yeah no kidding
<shawarma> gnomefreak: It means it didn't work. Easy.
<shawarma> :-p
<gnomefreak> i started with fresh everything and same error
<gnomefreak> shawarma: got that much ;)
<shawarma> gnomefreak: Right, ok. Just trying to be helpful.
<StevenK> gnomefreak: The patch output is in debian/patched/<patch>
<gnomefreak> can't find file to patch at input line 11
<gnomefreak> Perhaps you used the wrong -p or --strip option?
<gnomefreak> The text leading up to this was:
<StevenK> gnomefreak: The file mentioned in the patch was no found in .
<StevenK> s/no/not/
<gnomefreak> looking for it now
<StevenK> gnomefreak: Any luck?
<gnomefreak> StevenK: let you know in a few
<afflux> TheMuso: you rejected bug 112867 because it already got merged, but the package is still mentioned on DaD and I can't find 8.2a-1 or newer in the archives
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 112867 in conquest "Please merge conquest 8.2a-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,Rejected]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/112867
<TheMuso> afflux: I'll have another look in a bit.
<afflux> no need to hurry
<Lutin> seems that it hasn't been meged actually
<Lutin> merged*
<TheMuso> Lutin: Yeah I know.
<TheMuso> I'll take care of it.
<Lutin> TheMuso: ok :)
<Treenaks>  http://www.cafepress.com/cp/prod.aspx?p=foodfight.132171648
<joejaxx> Treenaks: :P
<TheMuso> afflux: Ok, I updated the bug.
<afflux> TheMuso: thank you. I'll update the diff because I did not include the previous ubuntu changelog entrys.
<TheMuso> Which I noted in the bug.
<afflux> oh, just read it :)
<freeflying_> looking for sponsor upload to main http://211.147.215.100/~freeflying/scim/scim-pinyin_0.5.91-0ubuntu8.dsc
<xxxxx1> StevenK: ping?
<StevenK> xxxxx1: Pong.
<xxxxx1> great
<xxxxx1> steven, i have a question for you
<xxxxx1> should I post my package with ubuntu-motu as maintainer and me as xsbc-original.. ?
<xxxxx1> or stay only with maintainer and after he's approval became with these model
<xxxxx1> ?!
<Hobbsee> the former
<xxxxx1> Hobbsee: only maintainer?
<Hobbsee> as in, maintainer being motu, and xsbc as you
<xxxxx1> lintian asks NMU
<xxxxx1> W: ecryptfs-utils source: changelog-should-mention-nmu
<xxxxx1> W: ecryptfs-utils source: source-nmu-has-incorrect-version-number 15-0ubuntu1
<xxxxx1> i should create a lintian-override for source or just ignore them?
<persia> xxxxx1: Ignore that warning.  Every Ubuntu upload is an NMU.
<xxxxx1> ok. thx guys :)
<TheMuso> argh. Whats the most reliable way to use a variable in a for loop within debian/rules?
<TheMuso> I've seen examples that use $$, but that doesn't seem to be working for me.
<StevenK> $$var should work
<persia> TheMuso: Take a look at docbook - it has a good example
<StevenK> for i in in foo ; do echo $$i ; done
<TheMuso> persia: Thanks.
<TheMuso> hmmm ok.
<persia> TheMuso: StevenK is also right.
<sharms> dabaR: thanks for the info
<persia> TheMuso: When you have a bit of time, would you mind testing to see if a new candidate version of audacity works with JACK on powerpc?
<TheMuso> persia: Unfortunately that box is headless.
<persia> TheMuso: Ah.  No worries then.
<TheMuso> And its only a G3 300.
<nixternal> alright StevenK, I am getting the ball rolling here. Signed up for everything on Alioth, attempting to join the Qt/KDE Packaging team, getting my key signed with in the next week or so...outlook looks good!
<nixternal> waiting for Ana to approve/deny
<StevenK> Great.
<StevenK> Which means krename will be handled by the team as well?
<nixternal> It would be nice
<nixternal> the KDE Extras team at least should have it anyways imho
<nixternal> if they had it, I don't think there would be this lapse in updates
<TheMuso> afflux: Working on the merge now.
* TheMuso is doing his final merge before heading to bed.
<afflux> thank you
<TheMuso> afflux: Apologies about that. I got mixed up with version numbers, assuming there was a greater version number there, without actually checking. :)
<afflux> Yes, I guess this "a" in the version is confusing
<ajmitch> bye :)
<nixternal> heh, they pulled the plug huh
<Ademan_> what's the difference between the dia-gnome and dia packages?  All the dia-gnome package says is that it's the GNOME version, what exactly does that mean?  I mean they both use Gtk+...
<geser> without checking I'd guess dia-gnome is linked against the Gnome libs and dia isn't
<Ademan_> but for what purpose i guess is my question
<persia> Does anyone have any suggestions about how I might debug http://pastebin.ca/482976?  LImited exploration with gdb and valgrind hasn't pointed me at anything particular yet.
<Ademan_> sorta seems like you're out of memory, but that shouldn't happen lol
<Ademan_> definitely seems like g_malloc() is failing
<Ademan_> or returning NULL maybe
<Ademan_> which generally indicates out of memory
<Ademan_> http://mail.gnome.org/archives/gtk-app-devel-list/1999-November/msg00151.html    ah apparently g_malloc() won't return null, it aborts your program
<Ademan_> so i suppose that could be the problem you're describing
<persia> Ademan_: Nope.  Plenty of memory available,  Just allocations are odd.  I'm guessing that I'm not checking the memory bounds correctly, but I'm not sure where.
<Ademan_> this is your own app?
<persia> Ademan_: No.  Just one I'm working on.
<Ademan_> hrm well i honestly don't know, it just seems as though every error is a failed memory allocation
<pochu> Ademan_: regarding dia, dia-gnome includes the files in /usr/share/applications/, while dia doesn't
<Ademan_> pochu: *.desktop files?
<pochu> Ademan_: yes
<Ademan_> ah cool, thanks
<pochu> yw
<ceros> hello, are any revu admins here?
<xxxxx1> yep
<ceros> i'm trying to reupload a package
<ceros> it has the same name so i was wondering if it can be deleted from the incoming folder
<xxxxx1> no, just overwrite
<ceros> it's not working for me
<xxxxx1> revu maintain the versions
<ceros> isn't it dput -f
<xxxxx1> -f is necessary only if you already have .upload file
<xxxxx1> just upload again
<ceros> just tried
<ceros> error 533 could not create file
<xxxxx1> what's your package?
<ceros> sauerbraten
<xxxxx1> can you paste link?
<ceros> ftp://revu.tauware.de/incoming/sauerbraten_0.0.20070413-0ubuntu1.tar.gz
<xxxxx1> no.
<xxxxx1> the http link
<ceros> you mean this one? http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=4204
<xxxxx1> yep
<ceros> there was an error trying to upload the first time
<ceros> it errored while trying to upload my changes file
<ceros> now i can't upload at all
<xxxxx1> you have created the source properly? sign the package too?
<ceros> yes
<xxxxx1> paste the error
<afflux> ceros: do you know that debian is already working on sauerbraten?
<ceros> Error '553 Could not create file.' during ftp transfer of sauerbraten_0.0.20070413-0ubuntu1.dsc
<ceros> Note: This problem might be caused by files already existent on the server.
<ceros>       For the official Debian upload queues, the dcut(1) utility can be used
<ceros>       to remove stale files from unsuccessful uploads.
<ceros> afflux: which version?
<afflux> debian has 200612something in the repos and is working on 20070413
<ceros> i didn't know they were working on 20070413
<ceros> i checked http://www.debian.org/devel/wnpp/
<ceros> didn't see it
<afflux> ceros: check http://svn.debian.org/wsvn/pkg-games/packages/trunk/
<ceros> alright thanks afflux
<leonel> ScottK: ping
<jussi01> Good afternoon motu's!!
<jussi01> Has anyone got somthing that needs doing... Im in between projects at the moment. Id like something specific if possible... :D
<DarkSun88> Hi all
<bddebian> Heya gang
<pochu> hi bddebian 
<bddebian> Hello pochu
<geser> Hi bddebian
<bddebian> Heya geser
<xxxxx1> bddebian: <o/
<bddebian> Hello xxxxx1
<xxxxx1> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5105
<xxxxx1> ecryptfs-utils
<xxxxx1> :)
<geser> FTBFS for me
<geser> cp: cannot stat `./debian/tmp/lib/security/pam_ecryptfs.so': No such file or directory
<xxxxx1> ?
<geser> xxxxx1: the file is not there and can't be copied into the deb
<xxxxx1> hmm
<xxxxx1> i had tested many times.
<geser> in a pbuilder?
<xxxxx1> directly in my gutsy jail
<xxxxx1> probably you need the libpam dev files.
<xxxxx1> pbuilder don't install depends
<xxxxx1> build deps.
<xxxxx1> try to check.
<xxxxx1> Build-Depends: debhelper (>= 5), autotools-dev, libkeyutils-dev, libgcrypt11-dev
<xxxxx1> , libpam0g-dev, libssl-dev
<geser> sure does pbuilder install build-depends
<xxxxx1> if the file is not in the place, is not compiled.
<geser> if it doesn't build in a pbuilder it will sure fail also on the buildds
<ranf> hi
<xxxxx1> can you check these dep?
<xxxxx1> in your pbuilder root
<geser> pbuilder installs B-D as specified in the control file
<gnomefreak> bddebian: thank you for comment on revu you found major bug 
<pochu> it seems that debian doesn't have a dh_iconcache
<man-di> pochu: no, it hasnt
<xxxxx1> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5110
<xxxxx1> ecryptfs-utils
<Fahuadai> Hello
<jayteeuk> Hi all.
<jayteeuk> Could someone offer me some guidance on bug #93413 please.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 93413 in vpnc "vpnc dead peer detection disconnects immediately" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/93413
<Fahuadai> hi
<jayteeuk> Severe regression from Edgy (version 0.3.3 I think) to Feisty (version 0.4.0).
<jayteeuk> The introduction of dead peer detection in 06_stolen_from_head.dpatch basically renders vpnc useless for a number of users.
<crimsun> jayteeuk: have you created a debdiff?
<jayteeuk> I created a patch (09_config_disable_dpd.dpatch attached to the ticket) which adds an extra config option to disable dead peer detection.
<crimsun> err, that's ~1000 lines to revert
<crimsun> fairly significant in size and definitely not "eyeballable"
<jayteeuk> Please bear in mind this is the first time I've tried to submit a patch, so I'm a total n00b. :)
<jayteeuk> Upstream, vpnc HEAD contains a patch which adds an option to set the DPD timeout, where a value of 0 disables DPD.  I think this is a cleaner fix than mine.
<crimsun> http://lists.unix-ag.uni-kl.de/pipermail/vpnc-devel/2007-April/001498.html  would be more sane than reverting 06.
<crimsun> now.  Have you  /tested/  that patch?
<jayteeuk> Not the one suggested there, no.  I've tested mine and use it on a daily basis.
<crimsun> ok, so what you should do is roll r170 from svn trunk into a new source package and test it [not your fix] .
<crimsun> I can walk you through it if you have ~15m
<jayteeuk> Sure.
<crimsun> first, create a scratch dir and cwd into ti
<crimsun> into it$
<jayteeuk> 1 mo while I arrange my windows. :)
<geser> as I'm also affected from this bug, I could do a SRU for it
<jayteeuk> OK, I'm ready. :)
<crimsun> jayteeuk: apt-get source vpnc
<jayteeuk> Yep.
<jayteeuk> So now I have a vpnc-0.4.0 directory with the debian package management stuff but none of the patches applied.
<crimsun> jayteeuk: ok, now in the scratch dir (not in the root of the extracted Debian source package) extract the r170 diff
<jayteeuk> The r170 diff?  Is that the one from the URL above?
<crimsun> yes
<jayteeuk> OK, so just save that in the scratch dir?
<jayteeuk> Baby steps, I'll learn. :)
<crimsun> well, you don't want the HTMLized
<jayteeuk> Actually it's probably HTML formatted so I'll copy/paste it.
<jayteeuk> Yeah. :)
<jayteeuk> OK.
<crimsun> the other way of doing it is probably a bit more painstaking
<jayteeuk> I'll go with whichever way you think will result in me not having to come back and ask how to do it again.
<jayteeuk> Unfortunately I'm completely at the mercy of you and what I read of the transcript of one of the Ubuntu Week sessions.
<crimsun> ok.  Have you saved the copied-n'-pasted diff?
<jayteeuk> Yes.
<crimsun> ok.
<jayteeuk> I now have an r170.diff in the scratch dir.
<crimsun> we'll attempt to use dpatch-edit-patch(1)
<crimsun> cwd into the extracted source dir
<jayteeuk> OK, I've read about that in the aforementioned transcript, but not gone through the process yet.  Here goes!
<jayteeuk> Done.
<crimsun> dpatch-edit-patch patch 09_dpd_timer_disable 08_auth_failed_return_code
<jayteeuk> "Now launching an interactive shell..."
<crimsun> patch -p1 --dry-run </tmp/diff
<xxxxx1> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5105 : ecryptfs-utils
<crimsun> you'll get one reject
<crimsun> s/get/see/
<jayteeuk> Should I replace /tmp/diff with the r170.diff?
<crimsun> yes
<crimsun> (/tmp/diff is what I used)
<jayteeuk> Yes, I've got one rejection in config.h
<StevenHarperUK_> Hi : I have just registered my lauchpad project https://launchpad.net/usb-adsl-modem-manager  I have a working application but I could really do with Mentoring : can anyon epoint me in the right direction please
<crimsun> jayteeuk: ok, now remove the --dry-run and actually apply the diff
<crimsun> jayteeuk: you'll need to fix up config.h by hand
<jayteeuk> OK, I'll have a look at what failed...
<crimsun> it's a one-liner that failed due to additional members that were added
<jayteeuk> Yep.  I think I'm OK to add that line where it is in the r170 diff, after CONFIG_UDP_ENCAP_PORT
<ivoks> StevenHarperUK_: does it support ethernet modems?
<crimsun> jayteeuk: after you save it, you need to remove *.orig and *.rej
<ivoks> oh, only pppoa?
<StevenHarperUK_> ivoks:Ethernet Modems?
<crimsun> jayteeuk: (along the lines of find -name '*.orig'|xargs rm && find -name '*.rej'|xargs rm)
<jayteeuk> rm *.{orig,rej}
<ivoks> StevenHarperUK_: yes, modems that are connected to ethernet card (better solutions than usb adsl modem)
<bddebian> bashism! eeks :)
<jayteeuk> OK, that's done.
<crimsun> jayteeuk: exit 0
<jayteeuk> "Creating new patch..."
<StevenHarperUK_> ivoks: if you ead my Wiki the reason I want to add USB modem support is for all the modems already out there and the old PC's that people put Ubuntu on for relatives etc
<crimsun> jayteeuk: then, echo 09_dpd_timer_disable|tee -a debian/patches/00list
<StevenHarperUK_> ivioks:  ** ready my wiki
<jayteeuk> OK.
<crimsun> jayteeuk: next, ensure that you have the devscripts package installed.
<ivoks> yeah, usb modems are weak link and it would be great it they could work
<StevenHarperUK_> I have them working
<StevenHarperUK_> I work for a Major ISP in the UK
<StevenHarperUK_> I have acess to all teh USB modem version they have sent out
<jayteeuk> Apparently not, but that's being rectified....
<StevenHarperUK_> they all work with my app
<ivoks> StevenHarperUK_: great
<ivoks> StevenHarperUK_: so, what help do you need?
<ivoks> packaging?
<StevenHarperUK_> I have written the app: I need help with the proccess to get it packaged n noticed n used
<StevenHarperUK_> Yeh
<StevenHarperUK_> & testing
<StevenHarperUK_> I have no access to a DSL line that needs PPPoe Auth
<ivoks> well, i can't help you with testing (in croatia we don't have speadtouch usb modems)
<ivoks> speed even :)
<jayteeuk> crimsun: OK, now I've got devscripts installed.
<crimsun> jayteeuk: then, dch -v0.4.0-2ubuntu1.1 -Dfeisty-proposed
<StevenHarperUK_> In the UK every ISP sent them out
<ivoks> but i could help you with packaging
<StevenHarperUK_> I have a SVN project
<ivoks> i noticed, yes
<StevenHarperUK_> http://www.squeezedonkey.com/svn/linux/
<StevenHarperUK_> Branch 0.3 is best
<jayteeuk> OK, I've understood everything up to that. :)
<StevenHarperUK_> Basically you have to run the App with > python USBAdslModemManager
<crimsun> jayteeuk: dch is a helper utility; -v accepts a version string; -D accepts a distribution
<jayteeuk> Ah, I'm creating a changelog entry?
<crimsun> jayteeuk: yes.
<StevenHarperUK_> I will need all teh Menu shortcuts n stuff - I am going to add auto start on login / computer startup
<ivoks> StevenHarperUK_: oh, it's a gui app?
<StevenHarperUK_> I know how to do them bits
<StevenHarperUK_> Yeh
<StevenHarperUK_> You can try it
<StevenHarperUK_> it wont break anything
<jayteeuk> So -v specifies the new version of the package, and -D specifies which distribution the package will go to?
<ivoks> heh i will, but not at 11PM :)
<ivoks> tomorrow ;)
<StevenHarperUK_> Theres no setup
<StevenHarperUK_> just SVN it out n run the python
<ivoks> i know
<StevenHarperUK_> k
<crimsun> jayteeuk: yes.
<ivoks> i'll take a look at it tomorrow
<StevenHarperUK_> The app extracts the firmware - and then sets up the PPP and secrets
<StevenHarperUK_> then dials up and the tray icon shows the status
<ivoks> for autostart, menu entry - don't worry, that's easy to set up
<StevenHarperUK_> Can  you drop me an Email ?
<ivoks> extracts firmware from?
<StevenHarperUK_> Well it uses firmware binary to get the correct one from teh modem
<ivoks> StevenHarperUK_: ivoks AT name_of_the_best_distribution_out_there DOT com
<ivoks> :)
<StevenHarperUK_> ta
<jayteeuk> Right.  So what would be appropriate in this case?  Should I just say I merged the r170 patch from svn?
<ivoks> StevenHarperUK_: so, firmware is not free?
<jayteeuk> Possibly explain what it does -- add an extra config option to specify DPD timeout?
<StevenHarperUK_> Im not sure
<StevenHarperUK_> ther is supposeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeed to be a fre eone
<StevenHarperUK_> sorry jammed key
<crimsun> jayteeuk: yes
<StevenHarperUK_> and it should work like the one I have
<crimsun> jayteeuk: e.g., http://pastebin.ca/483642
<jayteeuk> Ah, thanks. :)
<ivoks> StevenHarperUK_: i don't doubt it will work
<ivoks> StevenHarperUK_: but the license is important
<StevenHarperUK_> I have tested it for days
<StevenHarperUK_> Yes I know
<StevenHarperUK_> Ill check that nnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnow
<nixternal> ARGH! how come reportbug sent my bug to Ubuntu and not Debian
<StevenHarperUK_> sorry Jammed Key again
<nixternal> GRRRR
<ivoks> StevenHarperUK_: great, send me a mail with results
<crimsun> nixternal: anti-Vista user measures.
<ivoks> StevenHarperUK_: we have to have clear view on those firmwares in firmware/
<nixternal> hardy har har
<jayteeuk> Of course, mention the LP ID too.  I've just taken that verbatim if you don't mind.
<ivoks> StevenHarperUK_: i guess everything else is GPL? :)
<StevenHarperUK_> Oh yes
<StevenHarperUK_> Im going to go find out about the firmware now
<crimsun> jayteeuk: you likely want to mention the config option, too.
<jayteeuk> A couple of things -- I think the patch defaults the timeout to 300 seconds, in which case the disconnection problem will still manifest itself.  Should I change the default to 0 instead to disable the problematic feature by default?  And should I update the man page etc.?
<crimsun> yes, though if you do that, make sure you go back and use dpatch-edit-patch in the "edit patch" mode
<ivoks> StevenHarperUK_: ok, send results on email; i'm of to bed now :/
<StevenHarperUK_> I sent you a quick email already
<crimsun> geser: are you available to help jayteeuk with the remainder of the SRU for #93413?  I need to run to a meeting.
<StevenHarperUK_> ill send another
<StevenHarperUK_> goodnight
<ivoks> ok, 'night
<jayteeuk> OK, thanks so much for your help crimsun, very much appreciated.
<leonel> crimsun: do you know what's next with  this :  https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/squirrelmail/+bug/113725  ??
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 113725 in squirrelmail "Cross site scripting in HTML filter" [High,Confirmed]  
<jayteeuk> With a n00b like me 15 minutes quickly becomes an hour. :)
<geser> crimsun: sure
<crimsun> geser: / jayteeuk: thanks
<geser> where have you stopped?
<jayteeuk> No, thank *you*!
<jayteeuk> geser: I'm editing the changelog at the moment.
<crimsun> geser: he needs to rerun dpatch-edit-patch in "edit patch" mode to change the man page to reflect an additional change he will make
<jayteeuk> Last command was dch -v0.4.0-2ubuntu1.1 -Dfeisty-proposed
<crimsun> leonel: I have about three minutes; let me look.
<leonel> crimsun: it's not urgent  I'd like to know if there's anything I can do   
<geser> jayteeuk: are you done with editing the changelog?
<jayteeuk> geser: I think so, yes.
<crimsun> leonel: because the original source package does not use a patch management system, it is in our best interest to not add one (like dpatch).  In this context, please apply the patch directly to the source instead of using dpatch.  The diff will appear in the diff.gz anyhow.
<leonel> so start over ?
<leonel> crimsun: ?
<crimsun> leonel: reroll the debdiff with the patch applied directly, yes.
<leonel> crimsun: and all the info just  add it to the  bug info in launchpad ?
<crimsun> leonel: (i.e., don't modify debian/{control,rules} to add dpatch)
<leonel> ok
<leonel> unpack
<leonel> dpatch
<leonel> and send the debdiff ?
<jayteeuk> geser: OK, so just write that out and exit the editor?
<geser> yes
<jayteeuk> Done.
<crimsun> leonel: just create a new debdiff, and attach it to the bug report.  The new debdiff should have the dpatch applied directly, and the source should not modify debian/control or debian/rules to add dpatch.
<xxxxx1> night! bye all
<crimsun> xxxxx1: bye
<leonel> crimsun: OK  will do it  later    thank  you
<geser> jayteeuk: as crimsun said you need to add the new option to the manpage
<crimsun> leonel: sorry, but I'm nearly late for a meeting.
<leonel> run crimsun  run  :)
<leonel> thanks
<jayteeuk> OK, so I'll be editing the 09 patch that I've just created.
<jayteeuk> Using dpatch-edit-patch ?
<geser> yes, dpatch-edit-patch patch 09_dpd_timer_disable will create you a working copy
<geser> so you can simply edit files
<geser> and at the edit collect your changes and update the patch
<geser> *at the end collect*
<jayteeuk> Oh, actually the man page doesn't list the options, it seems to leave that to vpnc --long-help
<jayteeuk> Which I'm slightly glad about because I'd forgotten how strange the man page format is!
<geser> than you don't need to change it
<jayteeuk> No, just the default value for the option.
<geser> it the new option included in --long-help?
<jayteeuk> I won't know until I've built the package.
<geser> than that's the next step (if I didn't forget something)
<jayteeuk> But I've made the edit for the default value, so just exit 0 from the subshell to update the patch?
<geser> yes
<jayteeuk> OK, the patch is updated.
<geser> I assume you don't have a pbuilder setup?
<jayteeuk> I don't recognise the term, so I assume not too.
<geser> pbuilder is a scipt which helps to build package in a clean chroot and cleans up after build
<jayteeuk> I will most definitely be saving a transcript of this conversation. :)
<jayteeuk> OK, I see.
<geser> so you need to build the package in your normal environment
<jayteeuk> Should I set one up, and if so how?
<geser> or setup a pbuilder
<jayteeuk> OK, that's how I built the package with my previous patch, just in my normal environment.
<jayteeuk> So should I just go ahead and "debian/rules binary" in my normal environment?
<geser> so you have already the necessary packages installed installed
<jayteeuk> buildessential et al?
<geser> no, use dpkg-buildpackage or debuild
<geser> yes
<geser> apt-get build-dep vpnc will install all the needed packages
<jayteeuk> Ah, that's useful to know, thanks.
<geser> btw: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto
<jayteeuk> Brilliant, I'll have a read of that over the weekend!
<jayteeuk> OK, all build dependencies are already installed.
<geser> do you have fakeroot installed?
<jayteeuk> Yes.
<geser> than should "dpkg-buildpackage -rfakeroot" build the source and binary package
<geser> if you had a pbuilder you would build only a source package (-S) and do pbuilder build the binary packages
<jayteeuk> OK, I think that was successful.  Some warnings but I didn't notice any errors.
<jayteeuk> It asked me for my GPG key passphrase twice, is that normal?
* jayteeuk makes a note about gpg-agent.
<geser> yes, but you can ignore/abort it for now
<geser> this is only needed if you want to upload the package
<jayteeuk> Which I guess I can't anyway?
<geser> no
<jayteeuk> That's a whole other conversation. :)
<geser> if you are in the ubuntu-contributors team you can upload to revu (to let others check your package)
<geser> for upload to the archive you need to be a MOTU or core-dev
<jayteeuk> I'll look into both options.
<jayteeuk> Is joining ubuntu-contributors as simple as joining the team on LP?
<geser> yes,
<geser> !revu > jayteeuk
<jayteeuk> Excellent, thanks.
<jayteeuk> I'm learning a lot tonight.
<geser> if everything went fine you should have a deb (which you can test)
<geser> and a new .dsc/.diff.gz (the new source package)
<jayteeuk> Indeed I do.
<jayteeuk> And also a .changes
<geser> that is needed for upload
<jayteeuk> I thought as much, having checked the contents.
<jayteeuk> OK, so I can just go ahead and install the new .deb and test it?
<geser> (you sign the .changes file and the .dsc before uploading, therefore the question about your gpg passphrase)
<geser> sure
<jayteeuk> OK, it's installed... let's first check if the new option is listed in --long-help
<jayteeuk> Yes it is.  That's good.
<highvoltage> 9/win 12
<jayteeuk> Well so far so good.
<jayteeuk> At least with the default timeout set to zero.
<jayteeuk> So now I'm testing it with the timeout set to 300, as was the hard-coded default before the patch.
<jayteeuk> And it seems to have reverted to the old behaviour, as expected.
<geser> good or bad, depends how one sees it :)
<jayteeuk> Well, yes. :)
<geser> the next step is to create a debdiff (a diff of all changes between two packages)
<jayteeuk> OK.
<geser> debdiff unmodified.dsc new.dsc
<geser> you might want to redirect the output to a file as you need to attach it to the LP bug
<jayteeuk> Should I do this from the scratch dir or does it matter?
<geser> it doesn't matter
<geser> debdiff takes the path to the old .dsc file and the new .dsc file
<geser> it's like diff but for debian (source) packages
<jayteeuk> OK, that's done.
<jayteeuk> Eek, the 09_whatever patch file doesn't have my correct e-mail address but my username and hostname of my laptop.  Is that OK or should I change it?
<geser> like you want
<jayteeuk> And if it should contain my correct e-mail address, is there somewhere I can set that rather than it taking what it has as the default?
<geser> dpatch-edit-patch takes it from DEBFULLNAME and DEBEMAIL environment variables (also used by other tools)
<jayteeuk> Fantastic set of scripts. :)
<geser> in this case you don't need to redo everything, simply edit the debdiff 
<geser> but don't introduce new linebreaks
<jayteeuk> OK, well I made the change in the patch file and re-built, re-installed, re-debdiffed. :)
<jayteeuk> Maybe the long way around, but never mind.
<jayteeuk> So now I have my .diff -- is there a convention for naming debdiffs?
<geser> no
<jayteeuk> OK that's fine then.
<geser> that's the normal way (which works always), what I mentioned was a shortcut
<geser> I do it sometimes when I spot a spelling error (or something like that) when I look at my own debdiffs before submitting
<jayteeuk> I have some reading to do. :)
<jayteeuk> So how do we proceed?
<geser> when you are happy with the debdiff attach it to the bug
<jayteeuk> OK, that's easy enough.
<jayteeuk> Done.
<geser> As ubuntu-universe-sponsors is already subscribed to the bug nothing needs to be done.
<jayteeuk> Excellent.
<jayteeuk> Yes, I subscribed them earlier in the process after I'd attached a patch.
<jayteeuk> So now the patch will be reviewed and, in a perfect world, accepted?  Or what?
<geser> yes, I gave it a quick look and it looks good
<bmm> Hi everybody. I've got a program I'd love to be entered into ubuntu. It's a simple configure;make;makeinstall program and I've written it myself. It has no open bugs and probably will stay that way for a long time.
<jayteeuk> Phew.  I'm positively buzzing with excitement. :)
<bmm> Would it be faster to package it an put it in Revu or ask somebody else to package it?
<ScottK> bmm: Unless you know someone who knows how to package and is willing to do it, almost certainly faster if you put it on REVU.
<ScottK> jayteeuk: Congratulations. 
<jayteeuk> Thanks. :)
<bmm> ScottK: I don't know anybody, so then REVU is probably the best solution... well I'll be off packaging then.
<jayteeuk> I'm not quite sure how I'm going to sleep now... but it's time for bed.
<geser> jayteeuk: there is some unrelated change to vpnc-script in the dpatch
<jayteeuk> geser: Ah, thanks for pointing that out.
<geser> I try to understand why it does and talk to crimsun if it can stay or should be cut out (proably the later)
<jayteeuk> OK, I'll take another look at that on Monday.
<geser> and upload it then
<geser> jayteeuk: thanks for creating the debdiff
<jayteeuk> geser: No problem.  Thanks for all your help and patience. :)
<jayteeuk> Darn, Gnome Terminal is sorely missing a "select all" option. :)
<jayteeuk> OK, thanks all.
<jayteeuk> And goodnight!
#ubuntu-motu 2007-05-12
<Adri2000> afflux: I'm going to upload your briquolo merge, to but it would be cool to forward the changes to debian so that next time we can sync
<bluekuja> it seems that cddb files like libcddb etc cannot be used on a pbuilder
<bluekuja> they're available in packages.ubuntu.com under gutsy devel
<Fujitsu> What do you mean by `cannot be used'?
<geser> my guess is: universe not enabled
<Fujitsu> That was mine too.
<bluekuja> mmm...
<bluekuja> let me see my pbuilder
<bluekuja> conf file
<bluekuja> cannot be used means
<bluekuja> this
<bluekuja> apt-get install libcddb2-dev
<bluekuja> Reading package lists... Done
<bluekuja> Building dependency tree       
<bluekuja> Reading state information... Done
<bluekuja> E: Couldn't find package libcddb2-dev
<bluekuja> looking conf file
<bluekuja> COMPONENTS="main restricted universe multiverse"
<bluekuja> someone can try it on his pbuilder?
<bluekuja> (gutsy pbuilder)
<DktrKranz> bluekuja, try to login and see if universe is enabled
<bluekuja> already done ...
<bluekuja> it works for you?
<DktrKranz> I'm gonna check
<bluekuja> I'm able to get other universe files...
<DktrKranz> which package were you about?
<bluekuja> libcddb
<bluekuja> and others
<bluekuja> cddb related files
<DktrKranz> E: Couldn't find package libcddb
<bluekuja> *libcddb2
<bluekuja> try it
<DktrKranz> no problems here
<bluekuja> mmm...
<DktrKranz> libcddb2 |    1.2.1-1 | http://archive.ubuntu.com gutsy/universe Packages
<Daviey> imbrandon, you about?
<leonel> ScottK: ping
<TheMuso> Hey MOTUs and MOTU hopefuls.
<angasule> what about us useless lurkers? :?
<persia> Hello TheMuso
<TheMuso> heh everybody.
<angasule> hey :)
<TheMuso> I believe all people in here who lirk are MOTU  hopefuls.
<TheMuso> Or MOTUs.
<TheMuso> So everybody who is not a MOTU, is a MOTU hopeful in my eyes.
<TheMuso> Who is in here.
<persia> TheMuso: You forget MOTU-stalkers, IRC bots, etc. :)
<leonel> and me
<leonel> :P
<TheMuso> :)
<angasule> I'm an Evil Overlord
<pochu> hello
<TheMuso> Heya pochu.
<pochu> hi TheMuso 
<pochu> ScottK: I can't understand your second message to the list. What do you want to correct? :)
<Adri2000> -to your sources.list(5).  Then, update and upgrade (or install) azureus.
<Adri2000> +to your sources.list(5).  Then, update and upgrade (or install) lighttpd.
<Adri2000> pochu: ^ :)
<pochu> Adri2000: :)
<pochu> Adri2000: have you really done a diff to the mails? ;)
<Adri2000> no, just eye-diff :)
<pochu> :-)
* minghua wishes he has Adri2000's diff-able eyes
* pochu needs glasses
<superm1> hey anyone up for a revu right now?
<TheMuso> superm1: If nobody else has done it before I return, I'll have a look when I'm back at the computer.
<superm1> thanks TheMuso 
<TheMuso> superm1: Just give me the revu link, so I can look if you're not around later.
<superm1> http://revu.tauware.de./details.py?upid=5108 mythtv-themes-unofficial is the package
<TheMuso> superm1: Thanks.
<ScottK> pochu: There was a typo in the first.  It said to install the wrong packagename, it's fixed in the text on the 2nd.
<pochu> ScottK: didn't see it :)
<pochu> good night MOTUland!
<leonel> ScottK: about https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/squirrelmail/+bug/113725     I need to apply the patch directly  since   crimsun told me that there's no a patch management for squirrelmail  so I don't know how to patch it  
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 113725 in squirrelmail "Cross site scripting in HTML filter" [High,Confirmed]  
<leonel> ScottK: patched in the source already ..
<crimsun> leonel: about what are you unclear?
<leonel> I've patched the sourece  ..
<leonel> and  now ??
<leonel> the debdiff  against what ?
<leonel> this is what ive done 
<crimsun> leonel: the previous source package that's currently in feisty.
<leonel> apt-get source squirrelmail
<leonel> patched the source 
<leonel> and  now ?
<crimsun> edit debian/changelog
<leonel> done
<crimsun> debuild -S -uc -us
<leonel> running
<leonel> done
<leonel> now  I see the new  dsc
<crimsun> cd ..
<crimsun> debdiff old.dsc new.dsc >new.debdiff
<crimsun> replace old.dsc and new.dsc as appropriate
<leonel> yes
<crimsun> then attach new.debdiff to the bug
<crimsun> our friendly MOTUs must be inebriated beyond the point of sense, now.
<leonel> why ?? friday ?
<crimsun> yesterday was the last day of UDS
<crimsun> the big dinner, aka "drink & eat yourself silly", took place
<leonel> must been  there .. 
<crimsun> have you attached the new.debdiff yet?
<leonel> working
<leonel> not do a pbuilder ?
<leonel> crimsun: ?
<crimsun> well, I assume you've tested this new patch
<leonel> let's do that first :-P
<crimsun> pbuilder-feisty build foo.dsc
<leonel> yes
<leonel> working
<freeflying> crimsun: hi
<freeflying> crimsun: http://211.147.215.100/~freeflying/scim/scim-pinyin_0.5.91-0ubuntu8.dsc
<crimsun> freeflying: uploaded.
<leonel> crimsun: the deb installed  
<leonel> uploading the  debdiff
<freeflying> crimsun: thanks
<leonel> crimsun: this as a descripton :     patch applied without dpatch   ??
<crimsun> leonel: you don't need to say that in the description.
<leonel> just upload the debdiff ?
<crimsun> leonel: yes
<leonel> ok
<leonel> crimsun: uploaded 
<crimsun> leonel: ok, tweaked.
<leonel> what I did wrong ?
<leonel> crimsun:  ?
<crimsun> leonel: you didn't do anything  /wrong/  ; I just clarified.  It's in the bug report.
<crimsun> leonel: it's now up to the security team.
<crimsun> leonel: thanks for your work on it!
<leonel> now  on to dapper ..
<leonel> crimsun:  I assume apply the patches for dapper  the same ?
<crimsun> if you're extremely lucky, they'll backport cleanly.
<leonel> what this  patch ?
<leonel> the problem is that  Dapper has other security  issues 
<crimsun> yes.
<leonel> since dapper has  1.4.6
<leonel> and this patch was for  1.4.9
<leonel> is there any chance  that  this get to dapper backports  ?
<crimsun> err, no, this is a security erratum, not a backport wishlist.
<leonel> ok
<crimsun> it belongs in dapper-security (just like feisty-security).
<leonel> so it's  ok  to work on dapper's squirrelmail  security bugs  ?
<minghua> Also, I don't think everybody has dapper-backports enabled.  I don't.
<crimsun> leonel: absolutely.
<crimsun> leonel: Dapper is an LTS.
<leonel> ok 
<leonel> the procedure would be 
<leonel> report or check for bugs  in launchpad
<leonel> and  do all the patching as we did with feisty ?
<crimsun> leonel: yep
<leonel> crimsun: ok  thank you very much   
<persia> Oops!  One should never run debuild inside cdbs-edit-patch.
<jmg> persia: :)
<plugwash> persia why? what happens?
<persia> plugwash: It just spits an error, preventing you from making a big mistake :)
<TheMuso> heh
<TheMuso> Nice.
<nixternal> bug 114156 - available for a merge if anyone is around to do so. thanks!
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 114156 in tellico "[Gutsy Merge]  tellico_1.2.11-1ubuntu1" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/114156
<TheMuso> nixternal: If nobody takes it before I get this mass compile set up, I'll have a look after this is done.
<nixternal> rock on, thanks!
<crimsun> I'll do it.
<crimsun> oucheroo.  Debdiff against  /current/  source package?
<nixternal> ey?
<crimsun> that debdiff is gigantenormous.
<TheMuso> hahaha
<nixternal> d'oh
<nixternal> that is what I get for *1.dsc
<nixternal> let me fix that
<TheMuso> ROFLMAO
<crimsun> nixternal: the reason we ask for debdiffs against the current Debian source package is:  dpkg-source: cannot represent change to po/foobarblah.gmo: binary file contents changed
<nixternal> LOL, I know
<nixternal> I did a * and it grabbed the wrong (ubuntu revision) one
<nixternal> crimsun: fixed, sorry about that
<crimsun> silly rich forgetting DebianMaintainerField.
<nixternal> see, last time I switched it to MOTU I was told I wasn't supposed to
<crimsun> eh?
<nixternal> oh wait, we are talking about 2 different things
<crimsun> this is gutsy; you're definitely supposed to.
<nixternal> I am thinking about changing the orig maintainer
<nixternal> ya
<crimsun> maybe it wasn't such a good idea to upload this merge over a 56kbps dialup
<persia> crimsun: :)
<minghua> ubuntu-science list is just having too much spam
<nixternal> crimsun: did you fix that or do you want me to fix it really quick? sorry, there was a plane crash
<crimsun> I've fixed it.
<crimsun> (and updated debian/changelog to boot)
<nixternal> actually, he didn't crash, he landed in our damn roadway
<nixternal> thanks
* crimsun waits for the debdiff for #114159
<ranf> hi
<ranf> bug #114159
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 114159 in python-numpy "Merge python-numpy 1.0.2-2 from Debian Unstable (main)" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/114159
<TheMuso> Afternoon RAOF 
<RAOF> Good afternoon TheMuso
<RAOF> Ooh, feisty-backports
<TheMuso> heh
<chillywilly> kudos to the Ubuntu team, I just tried some other friggin desktop distro and it pales in comparison...that is all...
<imbrandon> Davie, I am now, kinda
<nixternal> stop lying!
<imbrandon> lol
<nixternal> who is your fathah, and what does he do
<superm1> imbrandon, that was like 8 hours ago?
<imbrandon> yup
<imbrandon> something like that
<imbrandon> hehe
<nixternal> hey, better late than never
<superm1> good point
<nixternal> is Davie even around anymore?
<nixternal> heh
<nixternal> no
<superm1> imbrandon, he was wondering about email on mythbuntu.org
<imbrandon> you know since ubuntu studio release i've bveen pushiong 60MB/s out heheh
<imbrandon> http://www.imbrandon.com/stats/bandwidth/
<imbrandon> superm1: sure, what emails you want setup and to point to where
* imbrandon is a little tipsy hehe shhhhh
<nixternal> mt. dew doesn't get you tipsy silly
<nixternal> it is the whacky tobacky that gotcha prolly
<imbrandon> heh redbull and vodka does
<nixternal> supermans!
<TheMuso> Heya imbrandon.
<nixternal> midwest in da house!
<imbrandon> heya TheMuso !
<nixternal> MO, IL, and WI covering MOTUland
<superm1> well lets see, we wanted mirrors@mythbuntu.org and packages@mythbuntu.org at least
<imbrandon> hows it going
<superm1> and MN up here :)
<TheMuso> imbrandon: Well thanks.
<nixternal> woowoo, and the MN
<TheMuso> superm1: Oh what was the name of the package you wanted reviewed?
<nixternal> sharms: wake up and represent the MI already
<imbrandon> superm1: honestly better to email me about them at this pooint and then i'll set some way up later tonight for you toadmin them
<superm1> nixternal, mythtv-themes-unofficial
<nixternal> oh wait, the MI probably crashed with your enhance bash your head script
<superm1> k imbrandon 
<superm1> woops, TheMuso ^
<superm1> not nixterna l 
<nixternal> I was gonna say, you lost me with that one ;)
<TheMuso> superm1: Thanks.
<TheMuso> yoooooooooooouchy!! Big orig.
<superm1> hehe
<superm1> 90 megs i think
<TheMuso> What the hell you got in here?
<nixternal> wow
<superm1> themes
<nixternal> 2 other distros
<TheMuso> 89MB
<TheMuso> You sure about that
<TheMuso> :)
<superm1> it was 100, but i had to pull one out that i couldnt straighten the licensing on
<imbrandon> brb
<TheMuso> superm1: Ok, its now downloaded.
<TheMuso> Unpacking...
<superm1> TheMuso, the way that i packaged it - since there are so many upstream tgz's - is that the correct way?
<superm1> to put them all in one big archive?
<TheMuso> superm1: Hang on a sec.
<TheMuso> superm1: Is there a reason why you used o instead of * for mentioning the themes in debian/control?
<superm1> not particularly?
<TheMuso> Ok.
<imbrandon> dum deee doo
<TheMuso> Its just that * is used mostly, but I guess it doesn't matter.
<superm1> sure
<TheMuso> I am not sure about debian/copyright. I am no expert in that area. I'm fine with it, but I am not sure if it will pass...
<superm1> because of the organization of it?
<superm1> or what are you thinking with it?
<persia> superm1: For so many upstream archives, consider adding a get-orig-source: rule to debian/rules, just so the super-paranoid can verify that you didn't repack something evil.
<superm1> persia, is get-orig-source typically used then to build the .orig.tar.gz?
<superm1> based on the links that I provide for it
<TheMuso> superm1: There are no binaries shipped in this package, so there is no need for dh_strip.
<superm1> k
<persia> superm1: Not yet.  It's proposed to become the typical way in the future (in Debian).
<superm1> but for the purposes of this package then, it would be used to build and compare to the orig.tar.gz that I uploaded correct?
<persia> superm1: That's the idea.  It would only be run manually.  If you're sneaky, you can have it check the watch file for sources, and that way when you update the watch file, you can use it to prepare the next upstream version.
* superm1 isn't sneaky though :)
<superm1> when i make these changes, is there any way i can avoid having to reupload the whole .orig.tar.gz to revu, and maybe just upload a debdiff? Or will it only accept a full source package?
<TheMuso> superm1: Depends on what is changed.
<TheMuso> And how you build the updated package.
<TheMuso> If you don't change anything in the orig.tar.gz, you can simply do debuild -S, which will only update the diff.
<superm1> ah okay
<TheMuso> Then when you upload, the orig won't be uploaded.
<superm1> that'd be the way to go then
<superm1> i wont change the orig.tar.gz at all
<superm1> no real need to
<persia> superm1: If you can make all your changes, and your new orig.tar.gz has all the same contents, you can fake it by hand-editing the .dsc file and re^running debsign.
<TheMuso> Well then thats easy
<TheMuso> persia: No need, if you use debuild right.
<TheMuso> That is if the md5sum doesn't change.
* persia goes and reads the debuild manual again :)
<persia> TheMuso: Ah.  For my packages, get-orig-source testing tends to mess that up.
<superm1> TheMuso, but what were you thinking about debian/copyright that is in need of possible work?
<TheMuso> superm1: Thats the thing. I don't know, as I am no expert, but I get the feeling that something needs changing. Exactly what though, I couldn't tell you.
<superm1> lol
<superm1> okay :)
<superm1> MOTU intuition
<persia> superm1: I think you have to indicate to whom the upstream copyrights belong, and declare copyright for the packaging modifications.
<superm1> ah okay
<superm1> that would make sense
<persia> superm1: Install debian-policy - all the rules are in there, and you can grep.
<superm1> will do
* StevenK appears.
<persia> StevenK: were you hiding?
<StevenK> persia: I've been out for most of the day.
<persia> StevenK: Welcome back.
<StevenK> In fact, I'm still out.
<jussi01> hello motu's!!
<jussi01> is there a reason there is no source here? https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/gutsy/+source/waon
<persia> jussi01: waon has never yet been released in Ubuntu.  If the page responds, you can expect it soon.
<crimsun> jussi01: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/gutsy/+queue?queue_state=0&queue_text=waon
<crimsun> jussi01: it's awaiting source NEW
<jussi01> ahhh... ok... so you guys upload it then it goes to new?
<crimsun> yes.
<jussi01> great :D thanks crimsun
<crimsun> source NEW, build, binary NEW.
<jussi01> ok... so how long does the process usually take?
<crimsun> depends on the archive admins.
<crimsun> seeing how they've all been at UDS, it's no surprise.
<rollerskatejamms> What would be the best language to learn if I want to start contributing to packaging, fixing bugs, etc? C?
<bmm> rollerskatejamms: first find the package, then learn that language.
<rollerskatejamms> bmm, true :-D
<bmm> Fixing bugs is not really allot of fun (not all the time) so you should find a piece of software you are willing to make the effort for ;-)
<bmm> What language would you like to learn?
<bmm> (C#, Python, C++, Lisp, Erlang, Fortran, Io, Perl, Javascript..)
<bmm> Java... and the list should go on even further ;-)
<bmm> Yeah! My lintian and Linda are 0 bytes :-D http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5113
<persia> rollerskatejamms: I have the opposite view: sometimes it's nice to learn a language by looking at bugs.  C, C++, and python seem to cover the majority of packages.
<bmm> If someone out there would have the time to take a look at it, It' be thrilled
<rollerskatejamms> bmm, I thought C# was a proprietary MS language.
<bmm> rollerskatejamms: there are mono based packages out there, written in C# which you could help with if you would want that.
<bmm> see www.mono-project.com for more info.
<rollerskatejamms> Cool. I'll have to think about which packages interest me most. I guess I'll take a look at the ones I use most frequently. (XChat, Gaim/Pidgin, Evolution, amongst others)
<bmm> But if you would have to choose a language, go with C++ if you are going to buy a book, C if you just have some hours left and Python if you want to start a project yourself.
<bmm> rollerskatejamms: With C# you can take a look at programs like F-Spot, Banshee... there is probably a list somewhere ;-)
<persia> bmm: delete config.{sub,guess} in clean: and copy them in configure:  This will make the diff smaller.
<rollerskatejamms> Ah yeah I use Banshee a lot.
<rollerskatejamms> I don't really love F-Spot though. I use it because its there.
<rollerskatejamms> I like Picassa a lot more, but it's not open source so I don't use it.
<superm1> persia, are you still here?  Would you be able to look over what I made into debian/copyright for mythtv-themes-unofficial to see if it looks kosher?
<bmm> persia: copy them from the default location you mean?
<bmm> (/usr...)
<persia> superm1: Sure, but I'M not an authority.
<superm1> of course :) its at the bottom of this diff: http://revu.tauware.de/revu1-incoming/mythtv-themes-unofficial-0705120325/mythtv-themes-unofficial_0.20070418-0ubuntu1.diff
<persia> bmm: Yes (you need to Build-depend on autotools-dev for this to work).
<persia> superm1: Nothing left sticks out for me, but you'll want someone who knows better than I for confirmation.
<superm1> K. thanks persia 
<superm1> TheMuso, i made that change to debian/rules and debian/copyright, would be able to reack the new revu?
<bmm> persia: autotools dev is there already. My dh_make template rules contains a line to copy the config is already. Should I move the "cp -f ..." from clean: to config-status in rules?
<bmm> (and add the delete in the clean)
<persia> bmm: Exactly (or at least I prefer packages that do this).
<bmm> persia: if you are going to advocate it in the end, that's NP :-D
<persia> bmm: I'm not MOTU :)
<bmm> bmm: you don't need to be to advocate them, right? Just to mentor them.
* bmm talking to himself
<bmm> persia: well, dh_make placed it there, so should I just leave it for now? I can make a comment about it on the revu page.
<persia> bmm: You can certainly leave it there.  dh_make and I disagree about this, but it's not policy or anything.
<bmm> persia: ok, then I'm going to leave it there so I don't have to do another upload to revu. It would be so cool if the package could get through without an update ;-)
<bmm> I'll post a comment about it....
<bmm> Well.. now it's just sitting here and waiting for somebody to notice my package, right?
<persia> Does anyone know if popcon data is available in such a way that I could discover the number of reported users of a package on each architecture?
<bmm> How do you know wether dh_installdirs is needed or not?
<persia> bmm: Do you have a <package>.dirs file?
<bmm> persia: you mean debian/dirs, yes I've got that.
<persia> bmm: If you have that, then you need it.  Otherwise, not.
<bmm> But dh_make made it and it contains /usr/bin and /usr/sbin :-S
<persia> bmm: I disagree with dh_make about a number of things, so I may not be the best responder, but I only use the dirs file for directories that are not created during upstream installation into which I need to put files (typically with debian/install).  You may not need it.
<bmm> persia: yeah, think so. I'm not using the /usr/sbin at all, so that should just be removed.. I'll look it up in the new-maintainers guide and start purging it ;-)
<bmm> ok, deleted that file :-D
<bmm> persia: Well, I cleaned up my installdirs and the unneeded commented dh_make things. The new upload should be there in a few minutes. (there being: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5113 ) Thanks for all the help!
<persia> bmm: No problem.  I'm currently failing to determine why something works fine on i386 and fails on amd64, and appreciate the distraction.
<bmm> persia: anything online? I don't have a amd64, but I could look at the code. It's probably some pointer arithmatic ;-)
<bmm> (or people trying to serialize using structs)
<fluxy> Hey uni masters, know a good msn (not multi protocol) client for ubuntu? (needs nudge, file transfer, display message, smileys and disp pic), also i prefer gtk. thx
<persia> bmm: I don't have it online, but I could upload it somewhere, if you really want to help debug it.  It's a C++ JACK client that uses wxgtk for everything.
<bmm> persia: if you upload it somewhere, I can take a look at it for you, don't expect any quick results though ;-)
<bmm> fluxy: I'm not a master, but you can try amsn
<fluxy> bmm: amsn is too buggy (am currently using it)
<bmm> I think you can only go MORE experimental if you start of with amsn :)
<bmm> fluxy: you could also try to find an online client with all that support. webmessanger probably has most of those features.
<persia> bmm: bug #114181
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 114181 in freqtweak "Please upgrade freqtweak" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/114181
<persia> bmm: You might also consider removing yylex.cc in clean:.   you don't need dh_installdirs.  If you are upstream, consider not using "doc/debiandocs/" as part of the upstream directory structure.
<stgraber> Does any MOTU have a minute to look at : http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5117 please
<stgraber> hey Sindwiller 
<stgraber> persia: ^ ?
<superm1> stgraber, persia's not a MOTU :)
<persia> stgraber: I'm not MOTU, but I'll look.
<stgraber> hehe, sorry :) but nevermind as soon as someone may find some details I didn't fix :)
<Sindwiller> hey stgraber :)
<TheMuso> superm1: Yep, will have another look.
<superm1> thx TheMuso 
<stgraber> TheMuso,gpocentek: I've uploaded a fixed version of miniracer, can you have a look when you've a minute.
<stgraber> s/./?/
<bmm> persia: thanks! I've added the rm -f src/SourceScanner/yylex.cc to my clean: rules. I'll do another dput in a few minutes :-D
<TheMuso> stgraber: Reviewing.
<bmm> persia: Well, the new update is in http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5118 REVU is fast btw.
<bmm> persia: have you put your code online already?
<persia> stgraber: I don't see much still wrong.  I like icons & menu files, but that's just sugar.  You might consider using dh_desktop to binary-arch:.  You might also consider using install -m 755 instead of cp to place miniracer-bin.
<TheMuso> persia: One would think that dh_fixperms fixes that up. I'll check once the package has finished building.
<TheMuso> But yes I agree, setting permissions once its copied over, i.e using the install command is a better idea.
<persia> bmm - I made a special bug for you: it's number 114181.  debian/ is there, and everything else is automated.
<bmm> persia: hahah, when you types bug #114181, my IRC directed me to bugzilla which also has a bug under that number. Thought you might just have spoke to rhe wrong person
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 114181 in freqtweak "Please upgrade freqtweak" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/114181
<bmm> :-D
<persia> TheMuso: Yes, dh_fixperms fixes it. I just like install.
<TheMuso> persia: Yeah, its certainly more complete that way.
* persia recommends new packagers take a look at the bitesize and packaging bugs as a way to get experience with different flavors of packaging, and develop a set of practices that work best for them.
<bmm> persia: Shouldn't the .orig.tar contain a directory with the package name? If so you might want to "mv freqtweak `dirname ${PWD}`' or something like that in getorigsource:.
<persia> bmm: All previous upstream tarballs were flat.  That's a good idea though - that way I can have a rule that preps the build environment :)
<stgraber> persia: the problem I had with using dh_install is that I should have renamed "miniracer-bin" to "miniracer" before using it and doing so, debuild remove "miniracer" from the debian/ directory ...
<stgraber> persia: It'd have been good if I was able to use dh_install to copy+rename the miniracer-bin file to usr/games/miniracer
<superm1> thx TheMuso .  i'm off to bed now :)
<TheMuso> superm1: No problem.
<persia> stgraber: My apologies for the confusion.  not dh_install, but rather use `install -m 755 ...` instead of `cp ...` in debian/rules.
<stgraber> ok, will look at it
<TheMuso> stgraber: I've added another comment to revu.
<stgraber> TheMuso: ok, for this description-starts-with-package-name is it that important ? All the game packages I've checked start with the game name in the description ...
<TheMuso> Probably not.
<TheMuso> stgraber: No need to worry about it I guess.
<dothebart> hm, i've been subscribed to REVU for a week now, and asked for adding my key...
<TheMuso> dothebart: Whats the problem?
<dothebart> but nobody answers my mail... 
<dothebart> or tells me my key is added...
<bmm> dothebart: there is something going wrong then. I've never asked for anything and got it without a problem :-D
<TheMuso> dothebart: Have you tried to upload a package?
<dothebart> no, not yet.
<dothebart> as the wiki states to ask the maintainers...
<dothebart> should that work without interaction?
<TheMuso> I am not sure about how often the keyring is synced.
<TheMuso> So I can't answer for certain.
<TheMuso> And unfortunately, as far as I am aware, there are no revu admins around at the moment.
<dothebart> is there a cheap way to find out if?
<TheMuso> Try uploading a package.
<dothebart> ok.
<TheMuso> The package should hopefully appear on revu in a few minutes.
<TheMuso> Whats the name of the package?
<TheMuso> And make sure you are only uploading the source.
<bmm> only do dput revu *_source.changes
<bmm> TheMuso: if you have some spare time, check ccbuild: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5118
<TheMuso> bmm: Sure, in a sec.
<bmm> Cool!
<bmm> NP, I was expecting this to take about months or so ;)
<stgraber> TheMuso: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5119
<TheMuso> stgraber: Will look again when I have finished reviewing bmm's package.
<bmm> yeah!
<bmm> persia: have you checked al the warnings for freqtweak?
<bmm> persia: the awnser might be in "CLFAGS=-Wall make 2>warnings.txt; grep -v wx < warninglog.txt |less"
<persia> bmm: I've been looking through them, and fixed a couple, but my last patch for wxwidgets2.6 is still pending, so I don't really want to push another yet (to many things depend on wxwidgets).
<bmm> and the problem is in the wxwidgets warnings?
<TheMuso> bmm: Left a comment.
<bmm> wxwidgets should work on amd64 right?
<bmm> TheMuso: ooh, where?
<TheMuso> On revu.
<bmm> oh, I though I left a comment in my debian/rules :-D
<persia> bmm: No, just that most of the warnings are wxwidgets.  And *should* is a good word there.  It does (98%), but there's still bugs.
<bmm> persia: that's why I used grep -v wx < warnings.txt ;-)
<persia> bmm: heh
<TheMuso> stgraber: Good. Acked it.
<stgraber> TheMuso: great
<stgraber> TheMuso: thank you
<TheMuso> stgraber: You're welcome.
<persia> bmm: I'm not sure about the type-punning, don't understand why a non-virtual destructor is bad, and will force-initialise the various mod values, which may help, but it crashes for me before I add a modulator, so I wonder if it might be one of the things I'm ignoring.
<bmm> persia: I currently have such a long comment on my "lintian free" package, that I'll have to get back to you on that ;)
<persia> bmm: No worries.  Thanks for the help.
<jtbates> Hi, I'm interested in getting started packaging.  I'm going through the Packaging Guide and I've hit a bump with setting up the chroot environment.
<jtbates> When I do dpkg-reconfigure passwd in the chroot environment I get a bunch of errors about stuff not being in /etc/gshadow
<jtbates> For example: 'cupsys' is a member of the 'lp' group in /etc/group but not in /etc/gshadow
<jtbates> Any idea why this is happening?
<jtbates> I followed the directions in the guide exactly
<stgraber> TheMuso: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5120 if you still have a minute (it's a new upstream version for an already uploaded package)
<TheMuso> stgraber: Sure.
<TheMuso> jtbates: If you are going to set up sudo, you don't really need to reconfigure passwd.
<TheMuso> Thats the experience I've had when setting up chroots.
<TheMuso> Juast as long as you set your own password with the passwd command, sudo is installed, and sudoers is copied over to the chroot.
<TheMuso> Heya Hobbsee.
<TheMuso> How was the dinner?
<jtbates> Ok, I just followed the rest of the instructions skipping that step and it seems to be working.  Thanks TheMuso.
<TheMuso> jtbates: You're welcome.
<stgraber> TheMuso: I've just read your comment, thanks
<Hobbsee> heya TheMuso!
<Hobbsee> was great :D
<TheMuso> Cool.
<TheMuso> So what are your plans until you fly out? :)
<stgraber> hi Hobbsee 
<Hobbsee> hiya stgraber 
<Hobbsee> TheMuso: not sure.  may explore the city a bit more
<TheMuso> Cool.
<TheMuso> Got anybody to go around with, Melissa perhaps?
<TheMuso> brb
<Hobbsee> dont think she wants to come
<Hobbsee> but yeah
<Adri2000> does anyone remember the name of the ubuntuwire powerpc buildd?
<geser> imbrandon: shouldn't aurora have a fast connection to mirror.imbrandon.com?
<Hobbsee> geser: probably should, yes
<geser> Adri2000: intrepid
<geser> 14% [1 cmake 1738760/4920kB 35%]                                 11.4kB/s 14m53s
<geser> on aurora
<Adri2000> geser: thanks
<stgraber> geser: well, that's 2xphone line, what are you complaining about ? :)
<geser> Adri2000: but it still points to aurora, last I heard intrepid had hardware problems
<Adri2000> hmm ok, will use sparky then (I need an arch different of i386/amd64)
<imbrandon> geser: yes but its on the same 100MB/s switch BUT ....
<imbrandon> right now the webserver ( e.g. mirror.* ) is dugg because of the Ubuntu Studio release
<imbrandon> sooo its a bit slow
<geser> ok, will be patient then
<imbrandon> it falling back though
<imbrandon> http://www.imbrandon.com/stats/bandwidth/
<imbrandon> peeked at 89MB/s out
<imbrandon> :)
<imbrandon> its about ~25 now
<imbrandon> soo the digg effect is slowly going away
<jussi01> heh, seems as your server is the only current working one right now imbrandon
<jussi01> lol
<imbrandon> wow
<imbrandon> really ?
<imbrandon> thats nuts
<jussi01> crazy huh
<Hobbsee> telephonica is broken.
<TheMuso> There are many people on the torrent also
<jussi01> the others ave been up and down...
<imbrandon> heya Hobbsee 
<Hobbsee> hi imbrandon!
<imbrandon> make it back to .au ?
<Hobbsee> havent started
<imbrandon> ahh
<imbrandon> jussi01: heheh /me hugs his webserver
<imbrandon> it can take the digg effect
* imbrandon knocks on wood 
<stgraber> Any MOTU can have a have a look at : http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5119 ? It needs a second +1
<jussi01> lol, well its good we have at least 1 server still up :D
<bmm> Do I need to mention NMU in my changelog (Non-maintainer upload)?
<imbrandon> not for ubuntu
<bmm> TheMuso: ok, I've changed it all, except the "section name should be preceded by contrib/non-free". the new upload is http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5123
<TheMuso> bmm: I'll look in a sec.
<TheMuso> E: Couldn't find package libtext-template-perl
<TheMuso> W: Unable to locate package libtext-template-perl
<TheMuso> E: Could not satisfy build-dependency.
<TheMuso> argh sorry wrong channel
<bmm> np
<TheMuso> bmm: Is the md5 rsa code GPL?
<TheMuso> Or another license?
<bmm> src/MD5Info/MD5Hash/md5-cc/README makes it look Public domain if you mention the right name.
<TheMuso> Right.
<TheMuso> You might want to state that in the cpyright file.
<TheMuso> I have put a comment on revu anyway.
<bmm> thanks!
<DaveMorris> hi all, is there any reason why the OpenChrome driver for Unichrome and Unichrome Pro Graphics chipsets aren't provided as packages but instead users have to compile and install the driver themselves?
<TheMuso> DaveMorris: WHats the license for the drivers?
<DaveMorris> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/OpenChrome - says they are free and open source 
<TheMuso> ah ok
<TheMuso> Are they X drivers, or is there kernel code as well?
<TheMuso> I guess nobody has got around to packaging them.
<imbrandon> looks to be all userland
<imbrandon> e.g. X
<TheMuso> Without having read anything myself, I'd guess thats why
<DaveMorris> so there won't be a problem with me attempting to package them up for mythbuntu
<TheMuso> I'd say not, no.
* TheMuso is still around, but off Ubuntu duty for a while.
<imbrandon> TheMuso: hehe
<TheMuso> imbrandon: Feel like doing other stuff that I want to get done.
<imbrandon> right on :)
<TheMuso> Its so easy to get into a rhythm with all the revu/merge work.
<imbrandon> yup
<jsgotangco> heh
* TheMuso has to work out a more efficient chroot management system in the long term I think, but that problem is for later.
<persia> TheMuso: What do you use now?
<TheMuso> persia: I currently use dchroot, with each chroot on its on small partition, and pbuilders inside these. WOrks well.
<persia> TheMuso: One dchroot for each release (on dedicated partitions), with a dedicated pbuilder for each?  Where do you do install testing? In the dchroots?
<TheMuso> persia: Yes.
<TheMuso> Keeps my default install tidy, and I can roll my chroots back from a tarball.
* persia considers not relying on vmware nearly so much ...
<arne_> Maybe someone here can answer this pbuilder question: I built packages for my library with pbuilder. Now I want to also build a package for an application using this library but this fails with unsatisfied deps since my library is not in the repositories. Can I fix this somehow?
<bmm> TheMuso: i've edited the copyright file. Whenever you get back on ubuntu duty and have some time over, it's now: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5124 Thanks for the comments!
<TheMuso> bmm: Heh sure.
<Kmos> arne_: sudo pbuilder login --save-after-login
<Kmos> arne_: after you can edit /etc/apt/sources.list
<imbrandon> arne_: and / or install it after logged in and it will save
<arne_> Kmos: if i change the sources.list this would mean I need to set up a local repository containing my packages, right?
<Kmos> arne_: i think so
<Lamego> that is why i love dchroot :P
<arne_> BTW. to get a package into universe, I would file a bug report?
<Kmos> arne_: yes.. with [needs-packing]  in the title
<Kmos> and a tag needs-packaing
<Kmos> packaging
<arne_> and final question: when I make new releases, how do I make sure the package will get updated?
<ranf> arne_, I think you also file a bug (wishlist: new version available. please update).
<Kmos> if there is a upstream new version, tag it with "upgrade"
<imbrandon> [..] 
<bmm> Hmmm... after installing my package I now get problems with the manual. Doing  man /usr/share/man/man1/ccbuild.1.gz works but man ccbuild will give an error and empty manpage
<ranf> What error?
<ranf> bmm, what error?
<bmm> ranf: Manual page ccbuild(1) line ?/? (END)
<ranf> bmm, sorry never seen this.
<bmm> ranf: You can get it with "touch a.tmp; man ./a.tmp"
<bmm> i just found out.
<bmm> So there seems to be an empty file with the same name somewhere.... I'll have to check my system. But it doesn't seem to be a packaging problem though.
<bmm> so that's ok ;-D
<ranf> locate
* PhinnFort wants rlocate
<bmm> ranf: thank! found the problem, was an empty manual in /usr/local/share....
<ranf> bmm, nice to know if ever I get the same prob.
<ranf> What can I do about these errors? http://revu.tauware.de/revu1-incoming/emelfm2-0705112325/linda  I'm quite sure the problem comes from the upstream debian/ dir.
<ranf> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5112 that is.
<AnAnt> how do I upgrade pbuilder to the new distro ?
<TheMuso> AnAnt: Use pbuilder login --save-after-login, and modify sources.list. Then exit, and run pbuilder update
<persia> ranf: If you just want to get rid of the errors, you could clean up in clean: (I think).
<AnAnt> TheMuso: thanks
<TheMuso> AnAnt: Welcome.
<TheMuso> c
<TheMuso> ugh
<AnAnt> TheMuso: I remember there used to be a more elegant way before
<TheMuso> Thats the only way I know of. :)
<Adri2000> \sh_away: xchm - your changelog says the only ubuntu change is the .desktop file change, but there are also Build-{Depends,Conflicts} and maintainer changes...
<ranf> persia, in debian/rules?
<persia> ranf: That's a thought (not tested).
<ranf_> persia, that didn't do it. Other ideas?
<ScottK> Bug #114159 is ready for UUS review (sorry crimsun - went to bed last night without attaching the debdiff).
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 114159 in python-numpy "Merge python-numpy 1.0.2-2 from Debian Unstable (main)" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/114159
<ScottK> geser: The new python-dns just hit Debian unstable.  You are marked as having touched it last because you uploaded it after fixing up my patch.
<persia> ranf: I've just tried a few things, and although I can get a clean binary, I cannot get clean lintian output from the source file without overrides.  My recommendations are summarised at http://pastebin.ca/484895
<ScottK> geser: I'm the new Debian maintainer for the package.  It's a sync now.  I'll go ahead and file the sync bug.
<geser> ScottK: if you have time you can merge/sync it
<ScottK> :-)
<ranf> persia, will look into it. Thanks.
* StevenK twitches over nixternal's blog entry.
<ScottK> StevenK: url?
<nixternal> stgraber: what are you twitchin' for?
<nixternal> err
<nixternal> StevenK: ^^
<nixternal> sorry st on that one
<StevenK> "A super cool DD" ? :-P
<nixternal> well I was going to put "an ass of a DD", but thought you wouldn't like that ;p
<ScottK> Bug #114249 is ready for UUS review...
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 114249 in python-dns "Sync request python-dns 2.3.0-6 from Debian Unstable (Main)" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/114249
<StevenK> nixternal: I bet you were. :-P
<nixternal> haha
<StevenK> ScottK: Looking.
<ScottK> StevenK: Thanks.
<bmm> If somebody is able to comment on my REVU upload http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5125 I'll be here to fix and reply it :-D
<nixternal> this sucks, I can't use revu at all. It will not decrypt the password correctly
<nixternal> AHHHHHH
<nixternal> slap me in the head somebody
<StevenK> ScottK: Done.
<bmm> nixternal, what is going wrong?
<nixternal> email=nixternal
<nixternal> login with full email address, not a username ;)
<bmm> haha
<nixternal> tells you how long it has been since I last logged in
<ScottK> StevenK: Thanks.
<AnAnt> Hello, I updated pbuilder , now when I try to build a package I get an error that it can't find debhelper !
<ScottK> StevenK: Any interest in another one (merge)?
<AnAnt> hmm, nevermind
<StevenK> ScottK: Not really, but that's because it's 12:30am. :-)
<ScottK> OK.
<ScottK> StevenK: Thanks for taking care of python-dns.
<StevenK> No problem.
<nixternal> quick question, the diff.gz that is created. I am getting the config.{sub,guess} in there and someone commented on revu:
<nixternal> * the diff.gz should not contain the config.{sub,guess} bits
<nixternal> how could I prevent that from happening?
<persia> nixternal: Delete in clean:, copy in configure:
<StevenK> That's still a little icky.
<nixternal> gotcha, thanks
<nixternal> k
<StevenK> But most of autobork makes things icky. :-P
<nixternal> which way would you go about doing it then?
* persia likes autobork^H^H^H^Hconf
* imbrandon groans
<bluekuja> imbrandon, do you have a minute for a merge review?
<imbrandon> bluekuja, not this second i have a down webserver, i can in about ~45 min if all goes well
<bluekuja> imbrandon, oh ok np then :)
<nixternal> anyone up for a revu?
<nixternal> http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5128
<leonel> hello mous 
<leonel> mous ??  motus !
<nixternal> hehe
<sorsis> why enemy territory is not as ubuntu package?
<ScottK> sorsis: Probably nobody packaged it.
<nixternal> I suck at that game, so I am not about to package it ;)
<sorsis> nixternal: good reason
<angasule> game support is kind of... not good
<leonel> I'm very good  with that game  i Finish  in seconds  always death but finish fast :)
<nixternal> hahaha leonel 
<jdong> leonel: you know... finishing fast is not always a good thing in life ;-)
<jdong> especially in terms of relationships... but enough about my personal 
<jdong> life
<leonel> jdong: you are right   
<leonel> really I'm not much a  games  fan
<jdong> nor am I
<jdong> I suck at all of them
<jdong> once in a while, I'll start up UT2004, name some bots after people that I hate, put them on novice, and run around with god mode killing them 5000 times
<jdong> lol I'm kidding :D
<Prezu> Guys, I recently added a package to Debian. I'd also like to see it in Ubuntu. So should I ubuntize it and add it to REVU?
<nixternal> jdong: so now I understand the the UT2004 screen shot with the one bot named nixternal ;p
<jdong> nixternal: LOL :)
<ScottK> Prezu: If it's in Debian, no need, just ask to have it synced from Debian
<persia> Prezu: As this is the beginning of a development cycle, it should be synchronisd in the next couple weeks (so long as it has passed NEW in Debian)
<Prezu> ScottK: Who should I ask for it?
<ScottK> Prezu: Once that's done, future updates you do in Debian automatically end up in Ubuntu.
<ScottK> Prezu: Not sure.
<ScottK> Prezu: They auto sync periodically as persia says, so I think just wait and see a bit....
<dabaR> hehe
<Prezu> It already left NEW queue. It's in the archive now.
<Prezu> So it should hit Ubuntu automaticly soon?
<Prezu> http://packages.qa.debian.org/k/kadu.html
<ScottK> persia: ? Do all Debian packages automatically appear here?  I didn't think so.
<Prezu> this is the one
<persia> Prezu: You can check the status of the Ubuntu NEW queue at https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/gutsy/+queue
<ScottK> Prezu: We are a long way from the Gutsy release, so I'd just keep an eye on Ubuntu NEW and if it doesn't show up, as for a sync via a bug: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SyncRequestProcess
<geser> ScottK: mostly as long as they aren't on the blacklist
<ScottK> geser: Thanks 
<ScottK> Prezu: geser is someone who would know.  Looks like you just need to wait.
<Prezu> Ok, thanks for info guys. :)
<ScottK> Debian NEW has only 5 packages in it right now.  Wow.  Someone has been very busy....
<plugwash> anyone know why ubutntu universe hasn't picked up pidgin
<plugwash> i thought packages from sid were imported automatically
<imbrandon> plugwash, because it JUST came out of debian NEW
<imbrandon> it will soon
<ScottK> 3 days ago (just checked).
<ScottK> plugwash: Automatically, but not instantly.
<ScottK> Interesting article for those with free reading time: http://www.riehle.org/computer-science/research/2007/computer-2007-article.html
<leonel> ScottK: hey ! the squirrelmail had to be modified  and  sent the new debdiff 
<ScottK> I saw.  
<ScottK> Great that you're keeping with it.
<leonel> yes 
<leonel> now I'm checking the security for dapper 
<ScottK> You're doing good.  Keep at it.
<leonel> thanks
<Adri2000> plugwash: gaim/pidgin is main, not universe; https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pidgin
<lionel> and it has been imported
<plugwash> gaim is main but afaict pidgin is a completely seperate package
<ScottK> Adri2000: I checked and your tooltip change for DaD works with Konqueror too.  It's interesting because Konq actually displays an open text entry box.
<plugwash> so i don't see why gaim being in main would stop pidgin being auto-imported to universe
<lionel> plugwash: pidgin has been imported
<Adri2000> plugwash: right pidgin is currently in universe, but it's going to be moved to main and will replace gaim, and it is/will be maintained by the core-devs (especially seb128) not by us (motus)
<Adri2000> ScottK: what is "open text entry box"?
<ScottK> Adri2000: The comments field looks very different in Konq.
<ScottK> There is a visible box and the text looks like it's been typed in, not rendered.
<ScottK> It makes it very clear that the text there is editable, and not static.
<ScottK> Much clearer for my pre-web 2.0 brain.
* ScottK makes a screen shot...
<Adri2000> yeah please a screenshot, /me doesn't want to install all the kde deps :p
<ScottK> Adri2000: http://www.kitterman.com/kubuntu/dad.png
<Adri2000> ScottK: ok, looks like it doesn't understand border-style: none;
<ScottK> Adri2000: Sounds reasonable.  I actually like it better.  Makes it clear what's editable and what's not.  Also I'd have figured out I could scroll to the right to read the rest of the text with than look.
<DarkSun88> Hi all
<ScottK> Hi DarkSun88
<DarkSun88> ScottK: Hi :)
<leonel> if I do a   apt-get source package  the downloaded package will be  the one in security  in case there's a newer package or the package in the universe repository  even if there's a security package ?
<ScottK> leonel: If dapper-security is enabled for universe source packages and no repo with a newer version is enabled, yes.
<ScottK> Alternatively, use dget to get it from launchpad and unpack it with dpkg-source -x
<man-di> ScottK: or shortcut both with dget -x ...
<ScottK> Ahh.  Did not know that.  Thanks.
<man-di> ScottK: millions of commands and their options are hard to remember
<ScottK> Heh.  That's certainly true.
<persia> If anyone is strong with debian/copyright, could you tell what is missing from http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/20520/?
<PhinnFort> what is the ubuntu moderators channel again?
<PhinnFort> there's a spammer in #kubuntu
<lionel> most of them must be flying :-(
<PhinnFort> argh... darn conferences;)
<man-di> persia: it lists no copyright
<man-di> persia: after the copyright headline follows the license
<man-di> persia: and license != copyright
<persia> man-di: That's one thing to fix, and I know I need copyright dates.  Anything else?
<man-di> persia: {GPL|LGPL}
<man-di> choose the right one
<ScottK> leonel: dapper-security doesn't have a squirrel mail in it: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/squirrelmail
<man-di> and edit the text next to this accordingly if its GPL
<persia> man-di: Thanks.  One finds the strangest things inthe archives sometimes :)
<ScottK> leonel: 1.4.6-1 in the regular dapper repo is what you should start from
<man-di> persia: and you have to say which parts are using what license
<ScottK> leonel: dget -x http://librarian.launchpad.net/1963659/squirrelmail_1.4.6-1.dsc
<man-di> and link/include the MIT license
<man-di> persia: I'm one of the Debian debian/copyright fascists
<man-di> persia: when you have fixed the issues I can take another look. just ping me
<persia> man-di: Right.  So I might just want to delete this, and start with a fresh debian/copyright, check the licenses of the code, and put the correct upstreams, dates, and licenses (and links) in the file.  Thanks for your help: I'll definitely ping you again when I have something better.
<man-di> persia: getting it right is always lot of work
<ScottK> persia: http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2006/03/msg00023.html and messages linked from it have detailed advice.
<persia> ScottK: Thanks.
<man-di> persia: and at least the Debian ftp-masters are very interested in getting it right before it enters the archive
<persia> man-di: The debian/copyright I pasted is already in the Debian archives :)  It's just four years old.
<ScottK> IME Mithrandir is even tougher than the Debian ftp masters on copyright/license stuff.
<persia> ScottK: Except on sync'd packages, I agree.
<ScottK> Yes
<man-di> persia: four years was before Ganneff started processing NEW queue
<persia> man-di: That's probably how this slipped through.
<man-di> persia: Ganneff is the guy who wrote the mail ScottK pasted
<leonel> thanks  ScottK
<man-di> persia: today you get rejected when the copyright year is missing
<ScottK> If I have depends lib1 | lib2, if lib2 is available (installed) will the system just use that or will it install lib1 in preference if it's available?
<plugwash> dpkg-buildpackage doesn't install anything, not source what apt-get build-dep, pbuilder and builldd do
<leonel> wow   dapper's squirrelmail needs  10 patches
<leonel> ScottK: Should I apply the 10 patches  once  and  put in the changelog de description for those 10 patches ?
<leonel> ScottK: and in launchpad  how do I handle ?
<leonel> ScottK:  fill 1 bug for  each patch ?  or  file a  10 bugs report ?
<nixternal> patching is so much fun..I prefer cherry picking an application in stable releases...it really takes up the entire day ;)
<ScottK> leonel: File one bug describing all 10 issues
<leonel> ScottK:  ok
<leonel> even  the  las one  is already  filed  with the  last bugfix ?
<ScottK> Changelog will have to describe all the changes.
<ScottK> hmmm
<ScottK> Given that's only one of 10 issues, I'd say file a new bug and mention that you are fixing the exisiting bug for dapper.
<leonel> Ok
<ScottK> Someone more experienced might have a better idea.
<ScottK> geser or crimsun are you around?
<persia> leonel: When I've uploaded packages that fix multiple bugs, I've opened a new bug, and made sure to note which other bugs were closed in the changelog.  When the upload was complete, I updated all the closed bugs.
<leonel> thank persia
<persia> man-di: Is http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/20525/ better?
<leonel> edgy's squirrelmail needs  7 patches ..
<geser> ScottK: I'm around
<ScottK> geser: leonel is looking for advice on how to update squirrelmail for security issues in dapper.  There are 10 outstanding vulnerabilities
<ScottK> I wasn't sure exactly what to advise him and was looking for someone more experienced.
<ScottK> and similarly 7 for edgy...
<ScottK> leonel: Neither of those packages have a patching system installed do they?
<ScottK> leonel: If you have questions, I will try to answer them as best I can.  Hopefully geser can watch over my shoulder as he's more experienced (is MOTU).
<geser> looks like squirrelmail doesn't use a patch system :(
<plugwash> does it use CDBS?
<geser> only build-dep is debhelper
<plugwash> :(
<ScottK> geser: That's correct.  For the feisty-security fix, crimsun advised leonel to use the edit the source and debdiff method rather than installing a patch system.
<geser> but that is only one patch, isn't it?
<leonel> ScottK: I don't  think they have the patching system     I'm installing  dapper and Edgy to start the patching and tests
<ScottK> Since the Feisty package didn't it'd be REALLY unusual if the older ones did.
<leonel> ScottK: and  I think I'll patch the others  the same way as feisty 
<ScottK> I think that's what you should do.
<leonel> ok
<geser> with ten or seven patches and each patch touching several files I would probably install a patching system
<leonel> let'me  finish installing  those 2 systems    and  let you know 
<geser> as it allows to review the individual patches easier
<leonel> qemu  is great :)
<geser> but security updates have their own rules, so don't take my word for given
<leonel> ok
<geser> keescook: are you around?
<man-di> persia: I would indent the three GPL paragraphs
<persia> man-di: Thanks.  I also noticed I forgot the trailer (The debian packaging is (c) ...).
<man-di> persia: and what is about the MIT license? where these wrong in the old version?
<persia> man-di: Completely.  I'm not sure where that came from, but it's not there now.
<man-di> persia: and you check all the sources?
<man-di> just to be sure
<ScottK> persia: grep -R copyright * can be useful
<geser> don't forget -i
<ScottK> geser: Good point.
<persia> man-di: Unfortunately, only two files contain copyright information (see http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/20527/ for an update), and I've noted these (in the improved version).  The rest is blank.  If upstream were even slightly active, I'd complain, but the project has been mostly dead for about three years.
<persia> ScottK: Only when upstream follows the terms of their own license :)
<man-di> persia: good work
<persia> man-di: Thanks again for reviewing this.  Now, to fix the archives :)
<psusi> did apt ever get fixed to look at the suggested and/or recommends: headers and install those packages as well?
<ScottK> psusi: IIRC it will install recommends, but not suggests.  Not sure though.
<psusi> ScottK: is there some option you have to set to make it do this?
<ScottK> Dunno.  Sorry.
* ScottK would suggest man apt-get...
<ranf> aptitude daes it different by default
<ScottK> Maybe that's what I was thinking of.
<psusi> yea, I can't find any docs on the subject
<ScottK> geser: I see you are doing merges...  If you have the time/interest, Bug #114159 is waiting for a uus ack.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 114159 in python-numpy "Merge python-numpy 1.0.2-2 from Debian Unstable (main)" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/114159
<Simon80> ok, someone must be able to help me out here:  what's the canonical way to check if a variable is set when using bash?
<Simon80> right now I've found that if [ ${!HOME[*] } ] ;  works, but it seems too esoteric, like there might be a less ugly way
<AnAnt_> Hello
<AnAnt_> in the docs file, can I add a directory ?
<Simon80> AnAnt_: that file is read by dh_installdocs, so you should check that
<Simon80> the answer seems to be year
<Simon80> yes
<Simon80> stupid hand, lol
<AnAnt_> tahnks
<Simon80> i.e., read man dh_installdocs, and same goes for any other files anyone has questions about
<Simon80> like, none of that stuff happens automagically, it's all just debhelper's doing, so the answers are in debhelper
<Simon80> ...I don't mean to say RTFM though, just trying to be informational
<leonel> so let me get this
<leonel> most of the updates come  from debian unstable ?
<leonel> so
<leonel> if there's a security bug
<leonel> search first  in debian if there's a fix  and  use the update here
<leonel> if there's no update in debian   do the fix for ubuntu  and  then  debian gets the update ?
<leonel> I'm I right ?
<redbullfx> How do i get rid of the splash screen right after login in???? or where the file is so i can config it????
<geser> leonel: in the development version or in released versions?
<leonel> geser: in released versions 
<geser> both Debian and Ubuntu has an own security team
<geser> although the Ubuntu security team only fixes security bugs in main and only publish security updates in universe if somebody prepares them
<leonel> ok
<geser> the security teams (from all distributions) exchange the patches that are available
<leonel> geser: so it's recommended to see if debian has fixes for any bug in universe ?
<geser> yes
<leonel> thanks
<geser> it's possible that Ubuntu is vulnerable but Debian stable isn't due to different versions (and vice versa)
<geser> so you should also check for security bugs fixed in unstable which more comparable to Ubuntu than Debian stable
<geser> especially when there are new Ubuntu releases after the last Debian stable release
<leonel> ok
<geser> sometimes you have to hunt down the patch yourself as it was fixed in Debian unstable with a new upstream version (which isn't acceptable for a security update)
<leonel> geser: yes backporting bugfixes  
<leonel> what can be done If I need a newer package for  dapper
<leonel> let's say  clamav    for example 
<leonel> clamav is in universe 
<leonel> can the new version be  backported and maintained ?
<geser> that was the question on the last MOTU meeting
<leonel> really ?
<leonel> is there a Log ?
<geser> the problem with clamav is that 0.90 changed the api and you need to update/backport all clamav using packages too
<geser> afaik there is no log, as nearly nobody appeared
<geser> ScottK sent a mail about it and keescook wanted to sent some info too
<leonel> ok
<leonel> yes  there's need to  update all the dependencies
<geser> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-motu/2007-April/001584.html is the mail
<leonel> thanks
<geser> one problem is how to test if the backported packages still work (regressions)
<geser> ScottK: uploaded python-numpy
<ScottK> geser: Thanks.
<leonel> geser: big work to test all the backported packages ...
<leonel> geser: but with time and resources  can be done ?
<shawarma_> Ah... Home at last.
<leonel> no pbuilder for  edgy and dapper ?
<leonel> http://revu.tauware.de/~laserjock/ ?
<leonel> found it
<leonel> name this script 'pbuilder-dapper', 'pbuilder-edgy', 'pbuilder-feisty'
<leonel> pbuilder-ubuntu has  :-buildresult $BASE_DIR/${DISTRIBUTION}_result
<leonel> and pbuilder-feisty  has :
<leonel> -buildresult $BASE_DIR/$DISTRIBUTION_result
<leonel> 
<leonel> which one to use ?
<leonel> feisty's and rename do dapper , edgy ?
<geser> the one with ${DISTRIBUTION}
<leonel> ok
<geser> you can rename it to -feisty, -edgy, -dapper, -gutsy too
<leonel> ok
#ubuntu-motu 2007-05-13
<crimsun> oh god, someone's spamming help messages across bug reports now.
<crimsun> oh how I wish I could stab over TCP/IP.
<bddebian> Heya gang
<lfittl> hey bddebian 
<bddebian> Hi lfittl
<persia> hi bddebian
<bddebian> Hello persia
<shawarma_> crimsun: What do you mean?
<crimsun> shawarma: spamming "omg no sound" comments across completely unrelated bugs
<crimsun> it would be similar to blaming firefox for your openoffice.org crashes
<Flannel> crimsun: I suppose launchpad has been `elevated` to webforum status, eh?
<geser> Hi bddebian
<shawarma> crimsun: Oh, that kind of help messages. 
<bddebian> Heya geser
<geser> crimsun: have you a minute?
<shawarma> crimsun: /win 7
<crimsun> geser: not ATM (alsa triaging), but in 10 mins.
<shawarma> ffs..
<crimsun> geser: hi, available now.
<geser> it's about that vpnc bug
<geser> http://librarian.launchpad.net/7607432/vpnc-0.4.0-2ubuntu1_0.4.0-2ubuntu1.1.diff
<geser> should the change to vpnc-script be removed or can it stay?
<geser> it looks unrelated to me
<crimsun> it doesn't look related
<geser> so remove it?
<crimsun> yep
<geser> thanks, I'll reread the procedure for SRU and upload it (once I removed this change)
<crimsun> make sure you upload to the correct place ;)
<crimsun> I forgot to use the correct host, which is a good thing now that I think about it.
<geser> different host?
<crimsun> yep
<crimsun> (security.upload.ubuntu.com)
<geser> is it documented somewhere?
<geser> I can't remember reading about it
<crimsun> the only documentation I have is "pitti, help!"
<crimsun> that was about a half-year ago
<geser> is it really for SRUs? the hostname suggests it's only for security updates
<crimsun> oh, uh, nevermind me.
<crimsun> Too many debdiffs flying around
<crimsun> sorry for the ambiguity
<geser> crimsun: need the archive admins to be notified about uploads to -proposed?
<crimsun> geser: not according to the SRU wikis
<geser> good
<crimsun> (only for the final move to -updates)
<geser> I guess the same change should also be uploaded to gutsy
<pochu> slomo: I'm gonna prepare an sru for bug 103688 for feisty. It's a one-line-fix. Do I apply it directly to the code? Since we don't have a patch system, afaik :)
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 103688 in liferea "liferea crashes - ** ERROR **: file itemlist.c: line 172 (itemlist_load): assertion failed: (NULL != itemSet)" [Medium,In progress]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/103688
<leonel> i'm patching squirrelmail for edgy  and does not have  patch system    after   apt-get source squirrelmail 
<leonel> cd sourcedir 
<leonel> and do  
<leonel> dpatch-edit-patch 01_bigpatch  
<leonel> ??
<leonel> and apply the patch to the source ?
<crimsun> err, no.
<crimsun> You should already have the patch and thus be able to test its application to edgy's source
<crimsun> patch --dry-run
<TheMuso> Hey all.
<geser> Hi TheMuso
<geser> afaik leonel will patch 7 security bugs in squirrelmail from edgy
<geser> leonel: how many different patches do you have?
<DarkSun88> Night
<leonel> geser: for edgy  I found 6 patches
<leonel> geser: and for  dapper I found 9
<minghua> sounds like we hasn't touched squirrelmail since dapper
<minghua> haven't*
<minghua> damn grammar
<leonel> minghua: yes  and that's what I'm trying to 
<leonel> minghua: already did the debdiff  for  feisty's squirrelmail  now on to edgy and dapper
<drbair_laptop> I'm attempting to compile and package ifolder and friends. While trying to compile I'm getting an error that it 'cannot find -lstdc++'. The library is installed, but complains unless I make a symlink to /usr/lib/libstdc++.so. What would be the proper way to resolve this?
<plugwash> install the appropriate -dev packages i expect
<minghua> that doesn't make sense, since g++-4.1 depends on libstdc++6-4.1-dev
<drbair_laptop> right, libstdc++6-4.1-dev is installed
<drbair_laptop> the build will only go through if I symlink /usr/lib/libstdc++.so.6 to /usr/lib/libstdc++.so
<minghua> drbair_laptop: so what's the output of "dpkg -L libstdc++6-4.1-dev | grep 'libstdc++.so'" ?
<minghua> sounds like a broken build system to me
<drbair_laptop> /usr/lib/gcc/i486-linux-gnu/4.1.2/libstdc++.so ... so apparently its not looking in the right place then
<plugwash> is its build system auto* based or something else?
<drbair_laptop> autoconf
<leonel> crimsun: the patch --dry-run  rejects  some   and   1 says  can't find file to patch
<crimsun> leonel: welcome to the world of backporting support.
<drbair_laptop> sys_lib_search_path_spec does include /usr/lib/gcc/i486-linux-gnu/4.1.2/ 
<leonel> crimsun: jejeje     can we  just    tar  xvzf   package and  be happy ???     just joking 
<leonel> crimsun: it's patching  version 1.4.8 with  1.4.10 patches and patch rejects some so 
<leonel> can I patch "by hand" ?
<crimsun> yes.
<leonel> because  dapper's squirrelmail is older and has more patches ..
<leonel> crimsun: this by hand  will be done in  dpatch-edit-patch  01_longpatch ?
<crimsun> leonel: I'd break it into separate patches for easier auditing/verification.
<crimsun> and if dapper's source package in fact build-deps on dpatch.
<leonel> for edgy  i have 6 patches  
<leonel> do you mean  do  6 debdiffs ?  and  6 bugreports ?
<crimsun> no, 6 dpatches
<crimsun> one debdiff
<crimsun> all the same bugreport (as feisty-security)
<leonel> 6 dpatches ?? 
<leonel> how ?
<crimsun> run dpatch-edit-patch six times
<leonel> ok
<leonel> sorry for too many questions ..  just learning ..
<crimsun> np.
<leonel> it's gonna be a nice trip to  backporting land 
<leonel> I got to go now  I'll do it later on or tomorrow  I hope  found  help here in case I need  .. In case ?  i will need ..
<leonel> thank you very much
<crimsun> np.
<crimsun> thanks again for working on it.
* TheMuso is amazed that ubuntu desktop isn't shipped with smart tools, or the smart notifier.
<crimsun> as in the package manager or smartmon*?
<TheMuso> crimsun: smartmontools & smart-notifier
<crimsun> both.  hmm.
* TheMuso is currently running extended tests on all drives
<TheMuso> smart-notifier is a GTK app.
<TheMuso> smartmontools actually does the monitoring.
<TheMuso> I guess whats needed, is a user-friendly applet to help people configure it.
<TheMuso> ...and make users aware of its usefulness.
<crimsun> yeah, gotta get out of the habit of using smartctl all the time, I suppose  :-)
<TheMuso> Yeah.
<Flannel> smart-notifier is in universe, that could be one reason
<TheMuso> Flannel: Yeah, but its not hard to write up a spec to see that changed.
* TheMuso might do that for next release.
<crimsun> I'm going to whiteboard (locally) the UI for the new asoundrc conf tool.
<TheMuso> Cool.
<crimsun> Do you think I should build it into control-center (System> Preferences> Sound) or into asoundconf-gtk?
<TheMuso> hmmmm
<TheMuso> Do many users usually need one?
<StevenK> People might want jack.
<crimsun> that's a good question.  I'm seeing a lot of users wanting dmixed surround5.1 by default.
<StevenK> Er, not jack, dmix
<TheMuso> StevenK: Dmix is on by default afaik
<crimsun> wishie and I have been cataloging and building up a database of known-working asoundrcs
<TheMuso> crimsun: What exactly do you maen mixed 5.1
<crimsun> TheMuso: by default, only 2-channel is dmixed
<TheMuso> ah
<crimsun> many people are wanting their 6-channel dmixed
<TheMuso> thats a lot of CPU though I would think
<crimsun> so they've been wanting upmixed + dmix
<TheMuso> Is that messy
<crimsun> nope.
<crimsun> I'd like to make a gtk app to facilitate it.
<TheMuso> Right.
<StevenK> Would PyGTK be suitable, or does it need to be in C?
<crimsun> e.g., if you want dmixed surround5.1 or whatever, you tick a checkbox instead of going to #alsa
<TheMuso> right
<crimsun> StevenK: pygtk would be fine.  It only needs to write out an asoundrc
<TheMuso> How good is PortAudio v19 and alsa these days?
<crimsun> according to persia, still lacking
<TheMuso> grmph
<TheMuso> great...
* TheMuso was *hoping* to get espeak using pa19 by gutsy release.
<crimsun> audacity (merge) uses an internal, patched copy of PA v19 (ugh!)
<TheMuso> So we could have ALSA goodness.
<TheMuso> crimsun: So thats what may still be lacking?
<TheMuso> Or is it being linked against the pa19 in universe?
<crimsun> bypassing system-wide PA v19 completely and using the copy of PA v19 distributed in the audacity 1.3.2 source.
<TheMuso> Riiiight
<TheMuso> Is that... um... wise?
<StevenK> No, it's dumb.
<crimsun> yeah, not too happy about it myself.  It's documented in the audacity merge bug on LP.
<TheMuso> Right.
<StevenK> TheMuso: Say we find a buffer overflow in PA. What then?
<TheMuso> StevenK: Yeah I know.
<crimsun> persia is the one to ask; I haven't been scrutinising it.
<TheMuso> Yey.
<TheMuso> yay even
<TheMuso> Drive tests seem to be ok on this machine at least.
* StevenK waits for debootstrap on his poor, poor sparc.
<StevenK> I should get around to putting a 20Gb drive with Dapper on it one of these days.
<TheMuso> Heh
<StevenK> It's running Debian testing, that pre-dates the release of Etch, and is held together by gaffa tape and willpower.
<TheMuso> oh shit
<TheMuso> Someone trying to run jackd on a pentium 2.
<TheMuso> ...yet I think jack is built with sse.
* StevenK smirks.
<StevenK> Some processor registers are not going to be pleased.
<TheMuso> Well the bug report I just saw is for an illegal instruction.
<TheMuso> SO jack doesn't run.
* TheMuso goes to look.
* TheMuso thinks jack needs something similar to ardour, where if sse is available, use it, otherwise, don't,.
<TheMuso> Yep...
<TheMuso>   * debian/rules:
<TheMuso>      - enable -m3dnow and -msse on i386 and amd64
<TheMuso> Great.
<TheMuso> crimsun: Your thoughts?
<crimsun> well, how ugly a patch do we need to create?  :-)
<TheMuso> Yeah I know.
<TheMuso> This is one reason why I was going to use gentoo for audio. I could build all this software with such flags, and know it would run.
<TheMuso> With binary distros such as Ubuntu, tradeoffs like this often have to be made.
<TheMuso> Which means performance suffers for someone.
<crimsun> well, it's early enough in the devel cycle to simply drop that change
<TheMuso> Yep.
<TheMuso> Do you want me to take care of it?
<TheMuso> Will just disable those flags for now...
<crimsun> we would be recommending the RT kernel and the PAM limits.conf addition anyhow, so it shouldn't be noticeable.
<crimsun> sure, please.
<TheMuso> Ok will do.
<crimsun> thanks.
<TheMuso> Actually, to be more practicle, I can still leave them turned on for amd64, and just drop for i386.
<crimsun> right
* bmm is amazed there isn't a new ubuntu motu mail waiting for him
<bmm> I thought the mailinglist was so active. Anything wrong somewhere,or have I just been gone for so little time?
<TheMuso> The MOTU list does not get much traffic at all.
<TheMuso> ah ok.
<TheMuso> Its a debian bug.
<bmm> oh, then the fault is with me :-D
<TheMuso> Didn't realise I was in the debian multimedia folder.
<TheMuso> I might let this sit for a couple of days then, and see what the multimedia team decide.
<TheMuso> Better to remain in sync for jack if possible...
<crimsun> TheMuso: right-o.
<bmm> TheMuso: are you on ubuntu time again?
<TheMuso> bmm: Not really.
<bmm> Ok, sorry to have bothered you then.
<TheMuso> bmm: Ah thats cool.
<TheMuso> Its just that I could get called away at any point atm.
<bmm> np
<TheMuso> bbl
<bmm> k
* jmg considers dist-upgrading to feisty
<RAOF> Is there any particular reason that dh_iconcache is not in Sid's debhelper?
<crimsun> RAOF: no agreement over its semantics and adoption.
<crimsun> so yes, we'll need to maintain that delta indefinitely.
<RAOF> Right.  So I'm going to have to manually implement what it does in my package, then?
<RAOF> That sucks.
<minghua> why indefinitely?  crimsun you think there will never be an agreement?
<crimsun> eh?  No.  Just don't invoke it from within your Debian source package.
<crimsun> minghua: in this context, indefinitely means until further notice.
<RAOF> But won't that break the icon cache?  Or does sid just not use that feature?
* minghua heads to dictionary
<crimsun> RAOF: sid simply doesn't use it.
<RAOF> Ah, cool.  Kinda.
<minghua> crimsun: I see, I thought indefinitely meant eternally
<minghua> sorry for the stupid question
<ranf> hi
<RAOF> Heeelo.
<crimsun> minghua: np, not at all stupid.
* StevenK sighs at the Freenode global notice that happened while he was away.
<DarkMageZ> maintenance downtime is sometimes required.
<StevenK> It's not the fact that downtime is required -- I can deal with that, it's the "This is your captian speaking ..." thing.
<DarkMageZ> ah
<DarkMageZ> i guess they're just trying to make things seem more interesting
<DarkMageZ> +1 point for creativity -2 points for annoyingness
<StevenK> Works for me.
<Fujitsu> When's the downtime, and for how long?
<imbrandon> moins all
<ranf> moin
<jmg> hey all
<jmg> is there a hal channel?
<jmg> or any hal gurus lurking?
<ASCIIGirl> Hi all! I would like to know why this packages appear on italics on the repository ftp://ftp.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/universe/a/adept/ 
<ranf> ASCIIGirl, I just looked at the source. It says symbolic link. Maybe that's the reason.
<ASCIIGirl> where that symlink goes to? 
<ASCIIGirl> adept-batch?
<ranf> right click it, then properties
<ASCIIGirl> ok, thanks...
<ranf> np
<imbrandon> ASCIIGirl, because its now in main ( not universe, but still symbolicly linked there iirc )
<ASCIIGirl> imbrandon, great!!!!!! :) thanks!
<jdong> imbrandon: I ordered a macbook today :)
<imbrandon> jdong, rockin
<jdong> I can't wait for it to arrive :)
<imbrandon> :)
* imbrandon hugs his apple
<jdong> yay for picking own birthday presents :D
<jdong> I've been hinting at my parents that I wanted a macbook... and for my birthday, they e-mailed me a screenshot of apple.com/store, and said "see your checking account" :D
<jdong> how sweet of them :)
<jussi01> jdong: NICE :D 
<Fujitsu> Not bad!
<jdong> so I'm really happy now :)
* Fujitsu kicks Debian maintainers who omit necessary build-depends.
<micahcowan> Doesn't that imply the dev didn't pbuild? :/
<imbrandon> why they are allowed to upload binary packages is past me
<Fujitsu> imbrandon: Same.
<imbrandon> micahcowan, yes
<Fujitsu> micahcowan: Most don't. They can upload binary packages.
<jdong> debian allows binary uploads?
<Fujitsu> So, if they've already got the build-depends installed, and they don't pbuild... 
<imbrandon> yes
<Fujitsu> jdong: Correct.
<jdong> so people could be building in tainted environments?
<imbrandon> jdong, and often do
<Fujitsu> That's right. It's stupid.
<jdong> :(
<jdong> sounds illogical
<jdong> for an otherwise very tightly regulated project in terms of quality
<Fujitsu> In that respect, using an obscure architecture is a good thing to do.
<Fujitsu> That way you get mostly autobuilt packages.
<micahcowan> But hey, they've got their signature on it! :
<jdong> lol
<jdong> so they can point fingers with 100% accuracy!
<micahcowan> :D
<minghua> Fujitsu: the argument I heard is that binary uploads guarantee that the package can at least be built, so you don't have really broken uploads
<Fujitsu> minghua: But then you have broken binaries that depend on some package on the DD's system.
<micahcowan> Huh. Of course, an automated build manager guarantees that, too...
<Fujitsu> *package that's only on
<jussi01> lol
<jdong> minghua: for the longest time the debian azureus packages were "mystery built"....
<minghua> Fujitsu: well, then they got RC bugs filed against them
<jdong> i.e. I could not for the life of me get it to not FTBFS
<jdong> despite there being "binaries" in the archive
<minghua> Fujitsu: and daily emails to -devel list with their names along with their RC bugs
<jdong> I thought they only allowed binary uplaods for like contrib/non-free or something
<man-di> jdong: debian azureus is crap
<minghua> s/daily/weekly/
<Fujitsu> minghua: But the source-only uploads eliminate that possibility entirely, and ensure the binaries are actually at least a bit real.
<jdong> man-di: true :)
<man-di> says the debian eclipse maintainer who fought a long fight with the azureus maintainer
<Fujitsu> Hahaha, Java.
<minghua> jdong: was azureus in main or contrib then?
<jdong> contrib?
<jdong> I think
<man-di> minghua: contrib
<jdong> I thought it was just a contrib issue
<minghua> well, then I don't see any problem
<minghua> they use Sun Java, I assume
<man-di> no, its in main now
<minghua> Fujitsu: I'm just telling you the argument I heard, not necessarily agreeing with it
<man-di> jdong: no, its a dumbness issue of the maintainer
<Fujitsu> minghua: Noted.
<man-di> jdong: he has no clue about java, thats his probelm
<Fujitsu> I saw something about it recently; possibly in one of the DPL platforms.
<imbrandon> Fujitsu, you actualy read those? heh
<Fujitsu> imbrandon: Some of them.
<man-di> minghua: lately he used GCJ
<man-di> minghua: but not in a good way
<man-di> minghua: its more mis-use
<minghua> man-di: yeah, I think that's the only way it can be main _now_
<minghua> maybe things will change in the future
* imbrandon considers gnusolaris for a webserver
<man-di> minghua: perhaps
<jdong> imbrandon: I've only roughly played with it... it seemed interesting
<man-di> minghua: thanks to doko for fixing azurues for Ubuntu a bit
<imbrandon> nextenia (sp? )
<imbrandon> jdong, ^
<minghua> Fujitsu: I think a recent change in Debian is that DDs are allowed to do binary-only uploads now
<man-di> minghua: this was always allowed
<minghua> Fujitsu: the platform, which I also heard about, should be about source _only_ uploads
<jdong> imbrandon: yeah, nexenta
<imbrandon> yea i have had it installed on a box here about 3 weeks ( since Ian went to Sun ), seems solid and its based on ubuntu packages ( abet old ones )
<Fujitsu> binNMUs, you mean? That has been there forever.
<man-di> minghua: but there were some restrictions on some archs lately and the GR reverted this again
<jdong> imbrandon: they were like dapper-age packages...
<jdong> not terribly bad
<minghua> man-di: no, by binary-only, I mean no sources, just the .debs
<imbrandon> yea dapper packages , edgy artwork
<jdong> though admittedly I liked FBSD ports better
<jdong> though overall I found FBSD to be pretty high maintenance
<jdong> though fun
<man-di> minghua: thats what I mean too
<minghua> Fujitsu: no, different thing, although binNMU is perhaps no more than two years old
<jdong> i.e. this irssi is running on a 32MB RAM FBSD vmware session :)
<jdong> why... because I feel like it :D
<imbrandon> lol
<man-di> minghua: the problem was that only 3 people were allowed to upload binaries for arm
<man-di> minghua: and this GR reverted this decision
<Fujitsu> minghua: Guhttp://www.nabble.com/update-on-binary-upload-restrictions-t3095812.html
<Fujitsu> Oops.
<Fujitsu> s/minghua: Gu//
<TheMuso> Evening folks
<Fujitsu> That gives the reasons for not moving to source-only.
<man-di> Fujitsu: this is what was reverted by the GR
<Fujitsu> Hi TheMuso.
<Fujitsu> man-di: GR?
<imbrandon> general resolution
<imbrandon> smoke break brb
<man-di> Fujitsu: Debian General Resolution, a way to overrule decisions
<Fujitsu> Ah.
<imbrandon> kinda like if -devel could veto a sabdfl decision
<imbrandon> by votes
<StevenK> imbrandon: Not really.
<imbrandon> StevenK, o rly? thats how i understood it
<imbrandon> splain pwease :)
<StevenK> Well, a GR goes to a vote, with one of the options being "Further Discussion"
<StevenK> And it uses Condercet, so the winner might not be clear anyway.
<StevenK> Besides, he wouldn't be the SADBFL if we could overrule his vote.
<imbrandon> heh :P
<ajmitch> hi
* Fujitsu waves to ajmitch.
<minghua> http://www.debian.org/vote/2007/vote_002
<minghua> the GR man-di mentioned
<minghua> although I still can't quite grasp what it means
* ajmitch waves to Fujitsu from hong kong airport
<man-di> minghua: the GR was a bit strange, I agree
<man-di> minghua: and many people want to have a more general solution
<man-di> wanted
<minghua> man-di: did you say people could do binary-only uploads long ago, then James changed it, then this GR is passed and the rule goes back to where it was?
<Fujitsu> Binary-only uploads were only restricted for some architectures.
* ajmitch still has nearly a full day of travelling to go, what fun
<Fujitsu> ajmitch: That does sound like fun.
<ajmitch> it really is
<minghua> ajmitch: maybe next time you can arrange to stay at Hong Kong for a day and play around :-)
<ajmitch> my flight for auckland leaves in ~2 hours
<ajmitch> and then I have 4 & 1/2 hours in auckland airport
<ajmitch> thankfully there's free wifi here 
<TheMuso> Heya ajmitch.
<man-di> minghua: yes
<man-di> minghua: James changed it only for arm and some other small arch
<imbrandon> ajmitch, heya
<imbrandon> man long layover
<ajmitch> I've had worse
<minghua> man-di: I see.  I think I only read the GR result and didn't know the whole story, therefore mis-intepreted it
<minghua> man-di: thanks for the explanation
<man-di> minghua: the GR was also misleading for people knowinf the whole story
* Fujitsu kicks Debian maintainers who produce packages that fail to build even after having the two missing build-deps added.
<man-di> Fujitsu: which package?
<Fujitsu> qgis
<Fujitsu> There was a serious bug filed on it 5 days ago about this.
* man-di hates security bug reports for problems I cant reproduce or even understand easily
* ajmitch should probably preserve some battery life for the airport in NZ
<ajmitch> since this wasn't fully charged
<minghua> they have free wi-fi but no free power?
<man-di> minghua: this way they can charge fo using your beard shaper too
<minghua> :-)
<minghua> although on second thought, you don't need a socket to use free wi-fi
<superm1> hey would any of you MOTU's have a few moments for a revu?
<ajmitch> oh they have free power
<ajmitch> but it requires an appropriate plug
<imbrandon> ajmitch, you dont have a plug that will work in NZ /
<imbrandon> man the coke machine at work is out of mt dew :'(
<Fujitsu> imbrandon: Can you survive?
<ajmitch> ok, got power now
* ajmitch just needed to put a deposit in for the adaptor
<minghua> I thought with his fridge, imbrandon would never need a coke machine for mountain dew...
<ajmitch> fridge? I thought he just stacked them in front of the cooling units at the DC
<imbrandon> minghua, hehe wellt he fridge is at home
<imbrandon> and i'm at work
<imbrandon> :)
* StevenK waves to ajmitch
<minghua> imbrandon: aren't you in US?
<imbrandon> minghua, yes, i work nights mostly , well 12am to 10am localtime
<minghua> imbrandon: ok.  still, it's a weekend night...
<imbrandon> and since tonight i'm at the DC that houses my servers ( not the one i normaly am at ) i've been doing a bit of upgrading and maint :)
<Fujitsu> Is intrepid going to reappear in the foreseeable future?
<imbrandon> Fujitsu, yea , i have it and the new sparc loading tongiht, probably be in the rack in the next 12 hours
<imbrandon> or so
<Fujitsu> Oh, nice.
<imbrandon> mostly i'm waiting on new ip's from the networking team for the sparc
<imbrandon> its ready to go
* imbrandon has used up his whole ip block so far
<ajmitch> wireless signal strength is low, ssh is getting *very* laggy
<imbrandon> brb, guess i get a dr pepper instead of a dew
<ajmitch> aw
<Fujitsu> Yay, sparc is slowly catching up...
<StevenK> ajmitch: Boost your txpower?
<StevenK> imbrandon: You'll get a new netblock, or a bigger one?
<ajmitch> StevenK: it's variable
<ajmitch> ok, back tomorrow
<StevenK> ajmitch: Enjoy your flight
<Fujitsu> Bye ajmitch.
* StevenK gets out and pushes his machine.
<StevenK> Come on, build quicker! I know it's a QT app, but give me a break!
<Fujitsu> StevenK: Lucky Hobbsee's travelling.
<DarkMageZ> StevenK, what are you building?
<StevenK> Fujitsu: Heh
<StevenK> DarkMageZ: kat
<imbrandon> StevenK, a bigger one
<imbrandon> StevenK, actualy i'm on a 255.0 netblock , i'll just more ip's that are mine
<imbrandon> from the network team
<imbrandon> the employee rack is all on the same class c
<Fujitsu> How many do you have allocated to you now?
<imbrandon> 5
<imbrandon> err 6
<StevenK> imbrandon: Ah. That's cheating. :-)
<imbrandon> 230 to 236 iirc are all mine, i would ahve to look to make sure, i know 230 231 and 232 are, would have to check the rest
<imbrandon> StevenK, hehe
<StevenK> It builds! Ship it!
<StevenK> imbrandon: What kind of sparc?
* minghua just realized that StevenK has been around forever seeing a fortune quote about StevenK
<StevenK> minghua: Oh?
<imbrandon> minghua, eh?
<minghua> StevenK: yes, from the "fortune" program, I assume that's you
<shawarma> minghua: Share it!
<StevenK> fortune -m StevenK doesn't return anything.
<imbrandon> minghua, what was the quote ?
<minghua> actually from my Wanda Fish, but the same
<minghua> hey, it's not easy to find a fortune quote once you've passed it...
<imbrandon> heh
<persia> StevenK: It does for me ("You're rewriting parts of Quake in *Python*?" and "I can usually supress the feelings that tell me to crash tackle a girl into the bushes"), although those may be misattributed.
<StevenK> Neither of them are.
<StevenK> I'd forgotten about the first one.
<imbrandon> hahahaha @ #1
<minghua> <StevenK> I can usually supress the feelings that tell me to crash tackle a girl into the bushes
* persia yet again fails to protect the guilty
<minghua> thanks StevenK for the "-m" tip
<StevenK> persia: :-P
* imbrandon gets to be on lugradio tomarrow, w00t
<Fujitsu> Google Code Search works well for that sort of thing.
<minghua> StevenK: who is knghtbrd?  I see a lot of quotes from him
<StevenK> An old DD from around '98 to '02
<StevenK> I've forgotten his real name.
<Fujitsu> StevenK: For how many eternities have you been a DD?
<crimsun> Joe Carter.
<imbrandon> Fujitsu, i think 6 years , correct ?
<imbrandon> [..] 
<DarkSun88> Hi all
<imbrandon> hello
* persia seeks UUS attention for bugs 35375 (BUGFIX PATCH), 112606 (SYNC REQUEST), and 113479 (MERGE).
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 35375 in scorched3d "Scorched3d SIGSEGV on startup" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/35375
<Fujitsu> bug 35375, bug 112606, bug 113479
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 35375 in scorched3d "Scorched3d SIGSEGV on startup" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/35375
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 112606 in audacity "Pleas sync audacity 1.3.2-3 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/112606
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 113479 in drscheme "Please merge drscheme 360-1 from Debian unstable" [Undecided,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/113479
<Fujitsu> drscheme is one of mine; I'll look at it.
<persia> Fujitsu: For me, this version finally solves the slib installation problem :)
<imbrandon> i'll poke the scorched3d one, i love that game
<imbrandon> heheh
<imbrandon> persia, ^
<persia> imbrandon: Warning: it's really a patch to wxwidgets2.6 to fix unicode characters in the GECOS field.
<imbrandon> err 
<Fujitsu> That sounds dangerous.
<persia> imbrandon: I'd appreciate a look anyway, and could walk you through testcases, etc. :)
<Treenaks> very dangerous#
<imbrandon> a bit
<Fujitsu> Experience has shown that the best way to deal with wxwidgets patches is to run away, terribly fast.
<persia> Fujitsu: Treenaks: It's just a backport of a patch I pulled from upstream and applied to 2.8 a couple months ago.
<StevenK> Fujitsu: I became a DD in July 2001
<StevenK> Fujitsu: Where were you in 2001? Primary school? :-P
<Fujitsu> StevenK: That impressive.
<Fujitsu> I was in year 5, yes.
<imbrandon> StevenK, diapers?
* TheMuso returns from dinner.
<StevenK> Bwahaha
<imbrandon> hehe
* Fujitsu drops a TheMuso on imbrandon.
<StevenK> I wasn't going to say that. I did think it, though.
<TheMuso> Fujitsu: ??
<StevenK> TheMuso: Read the backscroll.
<Fujitsu> TheMuso: You were the nearest thing, and I had to drop something on imbrandon.
<TheMuso> ah
<TheMuso> Thanks for giving me warning. :)
<Fujitsu> StevenK: You've been a DD almost as long as I've been using GNU/Linux :(
<StevenK> Fujitsu: Just think, I was using Linux for 3 years before I got DD-ship.
* Fujitsu feels young.
<Fujitsu> Well, I am young... but...
* Fujitsu goes back to his cave and pbuilds drscheme.
<StevenK> Heh
<imbrandon> hrm persia i'm not really comffy uploading that, mainly because i'm not familiar with wx*
<imbrandon> not hte diff its self
<imbrandon> the*
<Fujitsu> I only maintain two packages in Debian :(
<imbrandon> Fujitsu, i only maintain one
<imbrandon> in debian
<Fujitsu> I had one until a week ago
<persia> imbrandon: No worries.  Nobody seems confortable, and every app that uses the GECOS field segfaults on start for people with non-ASCII characters in their names.  Eventually, we'll all migrate to 2.8.
<Fujitsu> This is why we should all have normal Latin names :P
<imbrandon> heh
<persia> Fujitsu: It would simplify locale testing...
* TheMuso ponders Ubuntu work, but decides to do something else instead for a a change.
* imbrandon watches his Solaris boxen dist-upgrade
<Fujitsu> Solaris... dist-upgrading?
* Fujitsu hits ftp.au.debian.org for giving 404s while updating.
<minghua> Latin names lose too much information
<Fujitsu> I've been attacking a few Debian things tonight :(
<Fujitsu> minghua: Not if the name was Latin in the first place!
<minghua> many different Chinese names have the same latin transliteration
<minghua> Fujitsu: Hmm
<minghua> Fujitsu: which means Chinese people have to stop speaking Chinese, I think I'll pass
<imbrandon> Fujitsu, http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/20618/
<Fujitsu> minghua: Yeah, I didn't think they'd be very receptive to that.
<Treenaks> minghua: Speaking isn't the problem, writing is :P
<persia> minghua: You have a non-Latin name.  Would you be willing to upload the wxwidgets2.6 patch?
<Fujitsu> imbrandon: Ah, how well does Nexenta work? I've been pondering trying it for a while.
<minghua> although seriously, they tried to romanize written Chinese some years ago
<imbrandon> Fujitsu, solaris kernel + ubuntu dapper userland == Nexenta
<imbrandon> :)
<Fujitsu> imbrandon: I know, but does it actually work properly/
<imbrandon> Fujitsu, just been messing with it a few weeks, seems solid
<minghua> persia: looking at it
<Fujitsu> *?
<imbrandon> yea
<persia> minghua: Thanks.  Please let me know if you have any questions.
<Fujitsu> I haven't touched Solaris since the Fundamentals of UNIX classes at TAFE a couple of years back.
<imbrandon> unstable is truely unstable, but testing works good
<imbrandon> and with alpha6 you can run sun binarys too along with gnu ones
<imbrandon> like DTrace
<imbrandon> etc
<imbrandon> the only think i dont like is ssh is still on 80x24 no matter what your term is set to
<minghua> although I need to point out I use my romanized name in my GECOS field...
<imbrandon> but thats only a minor issue
<persia> minghua: Why?  In a UTF8 environment, you should be able to use Hanzi.
<minghua> I know, but there is no way to input hanzi in the installation process
<minghua> and I like in the US after all
<minghua> I always use the romanized name in email
<minghua> so I never bothered to have a Chinese GECOS field
<persia> minghua: Too bad.   is much more concise :).
<minghua> using romanized name in email also avoids the risk of being labelled as spam, I suppose
<persia> minghua: In the US, probably.  Other places, it's common.
<minghua> persia: sure.  I used to use Chinese names in college at China
<minghua> although I didn't know what a GECOS field is then :-)
<imbrandon> hahahaha StevenK http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=1f4_1179038976
<imbrandon> that 911 call is way way way too funnny
<Fujitsu> I think I'm dead.
<StevenK> Fujitsu: Oh?
<imbrandon> time is going by realy really really slow
<Fujitsu> persia: drscheme is uploading.
<persia> Fujitsu: Thanks.
<StevenK> Fujitsu: Consider yourself lucky that you don't have to upload l-r-m.
<Fujitsu> persia: No problem.
<StevenK> Fujitsu: The orig tarball is 140Mb.
<Fujitsu> Only 140MiB... What's the problem, StevenK?
<Fujitsu> Damn, you beat me to it :(
<Denni2> How do you mark a bug as duplicate ?
<Fujitsu> Denni2: Using the `Mark as duplicate' item in the Actions portlet.
<Fujitsu> drscheme is 14MiB.
<minghua> persia: looks like a very straight forward patch, but sorry I don't have time to test build it now
<Denni2> Sorry but I can't see such an option
* Fujitsu wishes Soyuz would note the lack of an orig.tar.gz and grab it from Debian.
<Fujitsu> Denni2: Are you logged in?
<Denni2> yes
<minghua> persia: I've subscribed to it and I'll come back to it later if no other MOTU has done the upload
<persia> minghua: No problem.  It's been around for a while :).  If you have time later, please consider uploading it.  Thanks for looking.
<minghua> persia: are you applying for MOTU by the way?
<Fujitsu> Denni2: It should be there, second from the top.
<persia> minghua: Hobbsee managed to convince me, but I need to become a member first.  I'm on the agenda for 5/15, after which I will apply.
<minghua> sounds a long way to go
<imbrandon> iirc you become a member if to become  MOTU 
<Fujitsu> Doesn't the MOTU Council have membership permissions nowadays?
<Denni2> Oops I missed it. Sorry !
<imbrandon> Fujitsu, yea
<minghua> persia: good luck
<persia> minghua: long way?
<persia> Fujitsu: Not yet, last I heard.
<imbrandon> persia, yes they do
<Fujitsu> Sounds very strange that they can grant upload rights but not membership.
<minghua> persia: oh, maybe the process changed nowadays, but when I applied, it took a while
<imbrandon> you can apply to be a MOTU and will be granted membership if you becomes MOTU
<persia> imbrandon: Really!  Thanks.  I'll compose my note earlier then :)
<minghua> persia: waiting for the two meetings to happen was not short time
<crimsun> correct, you're implicitly a member whenupon MC approves.
<imbrandon> Setting up libstdc++6-4.0-dev (4.0.3-1nexenta6) ...
<imbrandon> err
<crimsun> it's almost like the fast track we had for Hoary.
<minghua> good, good, so things indeed changed
<crimsun> ah, those were the days...
<imbrandon> crimsun, hehe
* crimsun hobbles about with his cane
* Fujitsu feels young again.
<persia> So, just to make sure I understand the process, should I list as "Sponsors" people who have uploaded 5 or more of my revisions to the repositories, or should I seek volunteers? <I really should have applied for Hoary>
<crimsun> persia: people who have worked with you
<persia> crimsun: Thanks.
<imbrandon> persia, people that know you ( and are MOTU or core already )
* Fujitsu notes that he hasn't even heard of about 10 of the 60 MsOTU. :(
<crimsun> speaking of which, I think my MOTU & ubuntu-dev memberships expire Real Soon Now.
<Fujitsu> crimsun: 5 days for MOTU.
<imbrandon> wow
<imbrandon> mine dont expire for another yea iirc
<imbrandon> either one
<Fujitsu> imbrandon: But crimsun has been around forever.
<imbrandon> year*
<imbrandon> Fujitsu, hehe ;)
<imbrandon> bddebian had to renew not long ago
<imbrandon> is core and MOTU both 2 years? /me looks
<Fujitsu> I think they're now 1 year, but existing memberships haven't been changed.
<imbrandon> yup i'm good on MOTU till 2008-07-30 and core-dev till 2008-09-10
<imbrandon> nother year
<imbrandon> :)
<Treenaks> imbrandon: unless you can stand another term, probably ;)
<imbrandon> :)
<imbrandon> what a bunch of riffraff https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-core-dev/+mugshots
<imbrandon> hehe
<Treenaks> imbrandon: You should see those new CC members ;) 
<Treenaks> http://foodfight.org/fotos/2007/05-07%20UDS%20Sevilla/00006.jpg.html
<Fujitsu> Treenaks: Nice (though I saw it a week ago)
<imbrandon> thats laserjock and who? ( i know its not corey )
<Treenaks> imbrandon: the name tag is correct ;)
<imbrandon> ????
<Fujitsu> It looks rather un-Coreyish.
<Treenaks> compare: http://foodfight.org/fotos/2007/05-07%20UDS%20Sevilla/00014.jpg.html
<Fujitsu> Who's that in http://foodfight.org/fotos/2007/05-07%20UDS%20Sevilla/00038.jpg.html?
<Treenaks> Fujitsu: racarr 
<Fujitsu> Ah.
<imbrandon> wow jono dident have a black t-shirt on in that pic 
<imbrandon> :)
<minghua> persia: BTW, do you know the upstream's take on wxwidgets 2.6?
<minghua> persia: is there a chance upstream will backport this fix themselves?
<persia> minghua: I haven't contacted them.  If it's a concern for you (and you're the first who has been willing to seriously look at the patch), I'll contact upstream for verification, and update the bug.
<minghua> persia: would be nice, but depends on how much time you have for this bug
<minghua> persia: contacting upstream isn't a requirement for me to do the upload
<persia> minghua: I've been chasing it for a year so far, so a few days more won't matter :)
<minghua> it's just we as MOTUs don't have enough time for the details of every package
* minghua is very confused by the wxwidgets2.6 package
<persia> minghua: I'm currently watching the WX stuff fairly closely, but it's not going to hurt to check with upstream anyway.
<minghua> anybody knows why Debian has a native package for wxwidgets2.6?
<minghua> persia: then please ask them, at least ask if there is ever going to be non-security new 2.6 releases
<persia> minghua: I'll do that, and update the bug.  Thanks again for looking at this.
<minghua> persia: thank YOU for putting much effort in it
<persia> minghua: It's how I spend my vacations :)
<imbrandon> nice
<imbrandon> cogent is having issues
<crimsun> minghua: it was posed by Adrian Bunk to Ron Lee way back when, and Ron's justification in so many words was that as upstream, he had the liberty to roll a native upstream as he wished.
<imbrandon> ( one of our main bw providers )
<minghua> crimsun: I see, so the maintainer can have his way then, I suppose
<imbrandon> http://internetpulse.com/
<minghua> (if just he can acknowledge NMU sooner)
<crimsun> minghua: for reference, Debian 344280 and Debian 351626
<ubotu> Debian bug 344280 in wxwidgets2.6 "wxwidgets2.6 is not a native Debian package" [Normal,Closed]  http://bugs.debian.org/344280
<ubotu> Debian bug 351626 in wxwidgets2.6 "wxwidgets2.6 should not be native" [Important,Closed]  http://bugs.debian.org/351626
<minghua> and to have a Debian-only 2.6.3.1 version after the upstream 2.6.3 release, then followed by _five_ 2.6.3.1.x NMUs is really... let's say, outsider unfriendly
<minghua> crimsun: thanks for the pointers
<siretart> heyha folks!
<Lutin> heya siretart 
<Fujitsu> Hi siretart.
<siretart> huhu Lutin + Fujitsu 
* minghua starts to understand Fujitsu's comments about wxwidgets patches
<minghua> unfortunately it's probably a bit too late :-P
* persia smiles
<imbrandon> heya siretart 
<minghua> bye guys
<rgl> hi
<Fujitsu> Hi rgl.
<rgl> :D
<rgl> I'm trying to rebuil bind9, but its faling with some errors that I dunno how to fix: http://pastie.caboo.se/61190   can you please help me?
<sorsis> would there be any sence if ubuntu package distribution would turn in to torrent based package distribution?
<StevenK> I believe there is a Google Summer of Code project about that.
<DarkMageZ> we already have plenty of mirrors
<DarkMageZ> maybe for 3'rd party repos it would be practical.
<Fujitsu> Argh, please... no 3rd party repos!
<DarkMageZ> sometimes 3'rd party repos are nessesary. such as for stuff like quake 3 which hasn't made it into the ubuntu repos
<Fujitsu> We don't want them to be more easily got at, I don't think.
<DarkMageZ> and the ubuntu satanic edition stuff
<Fujitsu> Don't forget Ubuntu Christian Edition 3.0, with Advanced Automatix Technologies(tm).
<DarkMageZ> yeah, they can burn as far as i'm concerned
* StevenK twitches.
<DarkMageZ> gnomefreaks mozilla stuff repo
<Fujitsu> Sorry StevenK.
<DarkMageZ> oh, and the ubuntu studio repo is also useful :P
* Fujitsu doesn't trust Ubuntu Studio at all any more.
<DarkMageZ> why?
<DarkMageZ> i've taken most of the theme stuff from their repo as their theme is good :)
<Fujitsu> Wasn't there an email to -devel-discuss a couple of weeks ago saying that it was very import that some new ALSA and something else were added to Feisty? After release?
* StevenK is quite happy with {U,{K,Ed,X}u}buntu.
<DarkMageZ> they ended up updating libpulse
* StevenK looks at the -devel-discuss archives.
<Fujitsu> `Please update the 7.04 repository with the current version of jackd 
<Fujitsu> compiled with default tmpdir=/dev/shm - thus maximising system performance.
<Fujitsu> Some 12 days after release.
<TheMuso> Fujitsu: WHo sent that?
* TheMuso doesn't follow -discuss
<StevenK> Adressed to Hobbsee, too.
<imbrandon> Fujitsu, crimsun ( aka alsa king ) helps a bit with studio :)
<Fujitsu> Simon Lewis. He then posted a followup about it being needed for Ubuntu Studio.
<Fujitsu> imbrandon: I thought so, but that post removed any good feelings I may have had about them.
<imbrandon> and they do follow ubuntu versioning in their repo and working on getting everything "official", actualty they are the best community derivitive as far as i'm consierned when it comes to thart type of stuff
<Fujitsu> The best community derivative is Xubuntu, surely.
* StevenK agrees with Fujitsu.
<sorsis> is there way to easily download packages even though those are installed on comp?
<_MMA_> DarkMageZ: The Puld thing was a mistake. That package should be fine but it was needed to build our disk.
<_MMA_> *Pulse
<imbrandon> Fujitsu, not imho but thats opinion :)
<imbrandon> :)
* imbrandon dosent care for xfce
<imbrandon> even less than gnome
<Fujitsu> imbrandon: Um, the entirety of Xubuntu is in the official repositories.
<imbrandon> Fujitsu, right but it wasent always that way, and as i said they are working on doing the same with studio, its psudo official
<imbrandon> as of now
<TheMuso> Fujitsu, imbrandon, its called not giving enough time to get everything into the repo.
<TheMuso> Unfortunately the guys pushed everything a little late.
* TheMuso is working with them now.
<imbrandon> TheMuso, i know, i am too
<imbrandon> :)
* TheMuso will be working with the others to get everything into feisty in plenty of time.
<_MMA_> Fujitsu: And we didnt send that JACK post so theres no need to be pissy with us. Also all our packages are built to ubuntu standards. Our repo really just has the art that the archive admins didnt process even after we files the proper exceptions.
<Fujitsu> 12 days after release, asking for a new upstream version, with changed default behaviour, with apparently no longer of the fact that a release means a release...
<TheMuso> s/feisty/gutsy/
<Fujitsu> TheMuso: Gutsy, you mean?
<_MMA_> err... JACK update I mean.
* TheMuso is tired...
<imbrandon> Fujitsu, that aparently dident come from the studio team though, thats like pissing on kubuntu because some user asks for a new ktorrent after release :)
<Fujitsu> Oh, I see. Oops.
<Fujitsu> `The reason for my request is that I think it is
<Fujitsu> very important for UbunuStudio to have these 2 versions on board.
<Fujitsu> '
<_MMA_> Sure, I saw it. Was a user.
<Fujitsu> That makes it sound like it's coming from the UbuntuStudio people.
<_MMA_> The whole team sits in here. You could just ask us. :)
<imbrandon> Fujitsu, sure let me make an annon post saying "its uber important to ahve the new ktorrent 5 in dapper" heheh
* StevenK hands Fujitsu his earlier words, and his hat.
* Fujitsu is hit by the door.
<imbrandon> lol
* StevenK also hands Fujitsu a knife and fork.
<enyc> Hrrrm... seems like things move between universe and main.. and vice versa sometimes ... cant remember examples now ;-)
<imbrandon> enyc, sure, that happenes at times, why do you mention it ?
<TheMuso> enyc: Yes, this certainly does happen
<enyc> imbrandon: not sure ;-) dont have a debugger for enyc_brain though
<imbrandon> heh
<_MMA_> Fujitsu: Rest assured all our stuff will be in the Gutsy repos. ;) Its was just about timing.
* Fujitsu proceeds to consume himself.
<StevenK> enyc: openoffice.org-voikko for Feisty I can recall.
* _MMA_ goes back to feeding the kids.
<imbrandon> _MMA_ might even convince kamoin to make some cd when the dailys start rolling ;)
* imbrandon ducks
<StevenK> I uploaded a build2 and got told by LP, "You can't do that, it's in main. Hands off."
<_MMA_> lol
<StevenK> imbrandon: cjwatson, kthnbye
<StevenK> kthxbye, even
<imbrandon> diaf
<Fujitsu> StevenK: Some of us still hold onto the hope that Kamion will return.
<imbrandon> yea shhhh
<imbrandon> so i'm a few months behind
<imbrandon> lol
<StevenK> Months?!
<TheMuso> cjwatson is boring.
* TheMuso preferred kamion.
<StevenK> TheMuso: Like StevenK?
<Fujitsu> At least 8 months, I think.
<Fujitsu> TheMuso: Right.
<TheMuso> StevenK: But you've had that since I first saw you on IRC.
<StevenK> I've had this nick since I first hit IRC.
<TheMuso> I guess he changed though, as he uses that for lp.
<StevenK> December '98 or so.
<imbrandon> i've had mine since 97/98ish
* Fujitsu continues to feel even younger.
<StevenK> Fujitsu: Where were you in 98? :-P
<imbrandon> since i first logged onto Stratics IRC
* persia has been persia since 1996
<Fujitsu> We didn't even have net access back then!
<Fujitsu> Um, grade 1 was '98.
<TheMuso> TheMuso: I've had this nick since early 2001, but never frequented IRC till late 2004.
<imbrandon> 1st Grade !!!!!!!!!!??!! /me feels old now
<TheMuso> As for getting on the net... Now that happened mid 97.
<StevenK> TheMuso: Telling yourself? :-P
<TheMuso> StevenK: heh
<TheMuso> My first distro was Debian potatoe.
<Fujitsu> s/e//
* TheMuso must be tired
<StevenK> My first was RedHat 4.2
<persia> Fujitsu: No, it deserves the extra "e".
<Fujitsu> Baaah, mine was Redhat 7 :(
<StevenK> Fujitsu: You have no hope of winning. :-P
<imbrandon> ugh Nexenta pbuilder/debootstrap is look http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu dapper 
* imbrandon groans
<persia> Yggdrasil
<TheMuso> I also tried Mandrake 7.2, but I started having a dislike for rpm very early on.
<imbrandon> my first distro was redhat 4.x
<imbrandon> i think
<imbrandon> lol
<StevenK> persia: People stopped using that because all of the developers choked on their tongues trying to tell people how to pronounce it.
<imbrandon> it was redhat something
<DarkMageZ> redhat 9 =D
<imbrandon> bah i never made it past 6 , i rember that
<StevenK> I never used RedHat 7. I jumped from RedHat 6.2 to Hamm.
<imbrandon> i went to suse
<Fujitsu> WHAT!? Somebody using it for less than me? Impossible.
* Fujitsu stabs imbrandon.
<persia> StevenK: Yeah, well, but it was a pretty disc!
<Fujitsu> Slackware!
<StevenK> Heh
<StevenK> Fujitsu: Don't use that language around me!
* TheMuso used slackware from mid 2001, to the time warty pre-release came out.
<Fujitsu> <3 Slackware
* StevenK ignored Ubuntu until Breezy.
<imbrandon> slackware? thats right up there with gentoo, gentoo == GENeraly TOO much trubble
<StevenK> Given how much I've enjoyed myself, I have no idea why.
* Fujitsu ignored Ubuntu until some pre-release of Hoary, before that was Debian, before that was Slackware, before that was Redhat.
<persia> StevenK: Did you have that much confidence in the sarge process?
<TheMuso> By the time I dumped Slackware, I was *VERY* pissed off with the way its *cough* package management *cough* was designed.
<imbrandon> TheMuso, slackware has packagemanagement ?
<StevenK> TheMuso: Slackware wouldn't know a package manager if it got bitten on the arse by one.
<imbrandon> wowo
<Fujitsu> A friend convinced me to try Mandrake one.
<Fujitsu> I used it for two days then gave up.
<StevenK> Fujitsu: He's no friend now?
<Fujitsu> *once
<persia> TheMuso: If you think that was bad, track down an old GNU Software Distribution disc :)
<Fujitsu> StevenK: This was some years ago, so not really.
<StevenK> Friends don't let friends use RPM.
<imbrandon> 1.4mb floppys ?
<Fujitsu> Pah, friends?
<TheMuso> <R>otten <P>ackage <M>anagmenet
<DarkMageZ> StevenK, what do you do if you've got a friend who thinks rpm's are better than debs?
<imbrandon> DarkMageZ, slap them with a dictionary
<Fujitsu> DarkMageZ: Cause them to have something sharp sticking through them?
<imbrandon> and then asl them to inplace upgrade a redhat 6.2 box to rh 9
<imbrandon> ask*
<StevenK> Ohh, that's a good one.
<StevenK> How about RedHat 9 to FC6?
<DarkMageZ> ooh, burn =D
<Fujitsu> Or just not have any real friends, as you can't /ignore people off IRC. Much easier.
<imbrandon> they will either 1) say it is impossible or 2) fail
<TheMuso> Or even upgarde FC5 to FC6.
<TheMuso> upgrade
<geser> give them debtakeover
<imbrandon> debtakeover rocks
<StevenK> TheMuso: Seen that done. Over, I think, 4 tries.
<TheMuso> yum! I love dealing with broken upgrades from a rotten package management system.
<TheMuso> :)
<TheMuso> StevenK: heh
<imbrandon> lol
<StevenK> Bwahaha
<StevenK> dpkg gets some strange ideas sometimes, but it's nowhere near as SNAFU as RPM.
<DarkMageZ> imbrandon, you made my friend yell stfu. congrats :)
<enyc> Hrrm''' does anybody know af a universe packgae I can use... something like using "ser2net" but so that I can directly "cat" a serial line at 9600,8,N,1 to current console/terminal without TCP sockets ?  (like minicom but without all the extra terminal emulation and all taht I dont want) ? ;-)
<StevenK> enyc: nc
<imbrandon> you know the only way i could keep away from dependcy hell with suse was to install every package on the DVD, all 12 gigs of it once installed
<imbrandon> DarkMageZ, hehe 
<TheMuso> imbrandon: SOunds like what I found whenever playing with RPM distros.
<enyc> imbrandon: I remember buggy suse
<enyc> StevenK: ereee thats TCP/UDP <> current terminal/console
<StevenK> I got turned off SuSE when I saw their splash screen proclaiming them to be "The Linux Experts"
<paran> rpm have some nice features as well
<enyc> StevenK: I want ttyS0 at 9600 8 N 1 <> current terminal/console ;-)
<enyc> StevenK: but without minicom's terminal emulator there
<StevenK> enyc: ser2net, nc ? :-P
* Fujitsu has a SuSE 6.1 manual here for some strange reason.
<DarkMageZ> StevenK, have you seen the splash screen in 10.2? or the bootloader
<Fujitsu> No idea where that would have come from :S
<enyc> StevenK: yes... but is there sometnhing in universe that does not need a TCP socket,  or not? ;-)
<DarkMageZ> StevenK, it's pretty
<StevenK> enyc: I have no idea. A getty?
<enyc> StevenK: seems that is for logins only
<enyc> StevenK: it seems so simplee....
<enyc> StevenK: but I dont know how.. bah!
* TheMuso is doing a talk on a11y at a local LUG organised event next Saturday.
<TheMuso> ...and shoudl start preparing.
<TheMuso> should
<imbrandon> ;)
<StevenK> TheMuso: Bootcamp or something?
<TheMuso> StevenK: Yup.
<StevenK> Hrm. I had no idea DarkMageZ was a local guy.
<ranf_> Is cdbs usable with a stock Makefile?
<imbrandon> [..] 
<ranf_> (ah nevermind file:///usr/share/doc/cdbs/cdbs-doc.html)
<siretart> xxxxx1: around?
<pochu> Hello there! I'm merging revelation, and I have a question. The ubuntu orig.tar.gz has intltool-[extract,merge,update] , while debian .orig.tar.gz and upstream doesnt. It was a mistake while packaging it, right? But the question is: What should I do with them? They are causing a really huge diff.gz, so is it possible to use the debian .orig.tar.gz?
<gpocentek> pochu: does debian have a newer upstream release?
<pochu> gpocentek: no, it's the same release
<pochu> we have -0ubuntu3, and they have -2, both 0.4.11
<gpocentek> pochu: you have to use the ubuntu orig then...
<pochu> ok, so I have to keep those files there :/
<pochu> gpocentek: thanks for your help
<gpocentek> np
<stgraber> gpocentek, TheMuso : http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5133 <-- Just changed the description
<sorsis> has anyone before thought of distrivuting zipped packages?
<stgraber> sorsis: What do you mean ?
<gpocentek> stgraber: gauvain@joe:~/dev/MOTU/miniracer/build$ lintian *deb
<gpocentek> E: miniracer: description-starts-with-package-name
<stgraber> gpocentek: hmm, ...
<sorsis> stgraber: that apt-get would download zips, unzip packages and install after that?
<gpocentek> stgraber: the short description is the origin of the lintian warning
<stgraber> gpocentek: oh, I see, I missed that line :)
<gpocentek> sorsis: what would be the interest?
<stgraber> sorsis: if you "ar x" a deb archive you'll see it content .tar.gz files and then is already compressed
<sorsis> ok
<stgraber> gpocentek: How were the Feistyvits ?
<stgraber> gpocentek: Lintian should be happy with : http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5135
<stgraber> short description updated
<gpocentek> stgraber: feistyvits was cool, but I didn't stay a very long time
<stgraber> ok, I heard there was a lot of people
<gpocentek> yes
<gpocentek> stgraber: +1 from me, I'll upload the package
<stgraber> ok, thanks
<luisbg> hello all
<eolo999> Hi ScottK 
<eolo999> is there anyone I can ask some C related question for a bug i'm working on?
<welshbyte> !ask
<ubotu> Don't ask to ask a question. Just ask your question :)
<bmm> just ask
<bmm> I'm more into C++... but ok. Any MOTU poeple online who have some time left to look at my package (ccbuild)?
<bmm> eolo999: are you still working on that question?
<eolo999> bmm, I have a python package that use some c libraries, i have some ideas on how to solve the bug, but i should recompile a c source file and don't know how to do it properly...
<bmm> No Makefile, or build script? Try to grep for the C filenames in all the files you have, if they are mentioned somewhere, then that's probably your build script/system.
<eolo999> can I use debuild?
<bmm> In the package? Yes, just mention it as a build-dependency (build-depend in debian/control)
<eolo999> sorry, i'm not clear but really C/C++ make me very confused!!!
<eolo999> compared to python...
<bmm> eolo999: it's like precompiled python: you have to run a compiler on the c sources and combine them into a library. I've never used debuild, but if that's the build system for it, then use that.
<eolo999> thanks bmm, i'm trying....
* eolo999 hopes ScottK get connected soon
<bmm> Before you start working on the package, you should be comfortable with building and installing the package from source. After that you can automate it into a package
<eolo999> I have just to test (often) if what I changed in sources helped fixing the bug... in python this is immediate...
<ScottK> eolo999: It's Mother's Day here in the US, so no computer time for me today...
<eolo999> ok ScottK 
<fargiolas> Lamego: ping?
<Lamego> pong ?
<fargiolas> Lamego: would you please consider building a gnu-readline-enabled gnuplot version?
<eolo999> i should test my change for Bug #13803 but it's in a C source file and not exactly know how to act...
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 13803 in mysql-dfsg "Mysql insecure temporary file creation with CREATE TEMPORARY TABLE privilege escalation (dup-of: 13818)" [High,Rejected]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/13803
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 13818 in mysql-dfsg-4.1 "MySQL Privilege Escalation and Command Execution Vulnerabilities" [High,Fix released]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/13818
<eolo999> srong bug number
<eolo999> wrong*
<fargiolas> Lamego: ubuntu does not include it because of license incompatibility between gpl and gnuplot license
<Lamego> fargiolas, I dont usually build command line apps :P
<eolo999> Bug #113803
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 113803 in python-scientific "Python-netcdf crashes in Feisty" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/113803
<Lamego> fargiolas, I don't violate licenses neither :)
<Lamego> for that you have medibuntu
<Lamego> try the medibuntu team
<fargiolas> Lamego: ok thanks, i'm not sure if is there a real license violation because gnuplot i distributed with readline code with no problems
<eolo999> ScottK, I send you an email with a diff file, give a look at it an if you can try it...
<fargiolas> s/i/is
<Lamego> fargiolas, they are the copyrith owners, they can "violate" the license which is selected by them
<Lamego> I mean copyright holders
<nixternal> ScottK: got the go ahead to maintain krename in Debian! Going to be moving it over to pkg-kde/kde-extras :)
<fargiolas> Lamego: gnuplot is free (i think a bsd like license) but not gpl. mm well maybe you are right
<fargiolas> i'll install it from sources then :P
<Lamego> :)
<Lamego> and today I already have a big queue :P
<fargiolas> ok don't worry
<fargiolas> how could i force -j2 using dh_make/debuild?
<Lamego> fargiolas, editing your debian/rules
<fargiolas> tnx
<fargiolas> is it a CFLAG?
<fargiolas> well i understood how to do it :)
<fargiolas> grrrr another ubuntu crazyness.. wxmaxima requires gnuplot-nox, even if drawing graphs is an optional feature
<Lamego> fargiolas, make -j2
<fargiolas> so i cannot remove gnuplot and i have to create a gnuplot-nox / gnuplot-x11 couple of packages
<pochu> Any MOTU to sponsor a merge? :)
<pochu> Toadstool: it's one of your merges :)
<nxvl> who is the manteiner of sudo?
<pochu> gpocentek, slomo_ ^ :)
<pochu> persia: good luck with your application!
<Lutin> pochu: revelation is bug # ????
<pochu> Lutin: it's not a bug, but a merge with debian. The files are in http://emilio.pozuelo.org/deb/ :)
<Lutin> pochu: asked for a bug because I thought you would have openend a bug 'please merge foo from debian' ;)
<pochu> Lutin: hehe :)
<pochu> Lutin: it's one of Toadstool's merges, but since he said that he wasn't going to do them, I've done it :)
<Lutin> pochu: sure
<pochu> Lutin: are you going to sponsor me? :)
<Lutin> pochu: at least going to have a look :)
<pochu> Lutin: that's enough :-) thanks!
<ranf> Can somebody have a look at this: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?upid=5131
<pochu> ranf: you should fix this issues: http://revu.tauware.de/revu1-incoming/powertop-0705130240/lintian
<Lutin> pochu: seems that you forgot to add 02_shebang.patch to debian/patches/00list
<pochu> ranf: forget it
<ranf> pochu, done :-)
<pochu> Lutin: it's the same as 20 or 30_python.dpatch, so I've removed it to keep the delta low
<Lutin> pochu: no, it's still in the diff
<pochu> Lutin: let me see :)
<pochu> Lutin: you're right :)
<Lutin> pochu: :)
<Lutin> pochu: btw, why is there a huge intltool thing in the diff ?
<pochu> Lutin: it's in the orig.tar.gz :/
<pochu> Lutin: and I can't remove it, since there's no new upstream version
<Lutin> eek :/
<pochu> Lutin: btw, new diff.gz and .dsc uploaded (removing the dpatch)
<Lutin> pochu: in the changelog from 0.4.11-0ubuntu1, there is   * debian/control: - Add intltool as a Build-Dep. any clues about not keeping the change ?
<pochu> Lutin: ouch, I thought it was automatically installed (via other build-deps) when building, but it was intltool-debian
<pochu> Lutin: re-uploaded :/
<fargiolas> hi i'm looking for some info about ubuntu and debian syncing process, for example if a package is already on unstable there is a chance for it to enter ubuntu more quickly?
<Lutin> pochu: have you updated the debdiff ?
<pochu> not yet
<fargiolas> could i file a bug requesting a sync from unstable or do i have to wait for it to enter testing?
<pochu> Lutin: uploaded, sorry for the delay :)
<Lutin> pochu: np
<geser> fargiolas: it's unimportant if its in testing, unstable or even experimental
<fargiolas> geser: but sync is a sort of automatic process or is there a review/voting system?
<geser> as non-MOTU you need an ACK from a MOTU
<Lutin> pochu: one thing I can't get ... if the intltool thing in the diff is caused by orig differences, it should appear in the diff.gz, should it ?
<pochu> Lutin: no, because the .orig.tar.gz was packaged with it
<pochu> Lutin: so it appears in the debdiff, as we have it but debian doesn't
<pochu> the .orig.tar.gz's are different
<fargiolas> can new packages (syncs from debian) enter feisty repositories? or do they need to wait for next release?
<Lutin> pochu: yep. it appears inr your .diff.gz though
<pochu> fargiolas: they can't, but can enter in gutsy
<pochu> Lutin: wtf :)
<fargiolas> pochu: ok thanks i'll file a bug request at launchpad asking for a sync
<fargiolas> then i'll ask here for some sponsor :P
<Lutin> pochu: np
<pochu> Lutin: it isn't in the .orig.tar.gz
<Lutin> pochu: I thought you told me it was
<Lutin> sorry
<pochu> Lutin: I told you it was ;)
<pochu> Lutin: but this is not my best day :)
<Lutin> pochu: hehe
<pochu> Lutin: let me see if they are needed :)
<Lutin> ok
* somerville32 stabs gaim.
<pochu> Lutin: not needed, it builds and works fine!
<pochu> Lutin: new diff, dsc and debdiff uploaded
<Lutin> pochu: ok, I'll upload it :)
<pochu> Lutin: cool, thanks a lot for your help!
<eolo999> ScottK, Solved, solved, fixed, fixed!!!
<jekil> hello
<Lutin> pochu: np
<superm1> pochu, do you have a few moments to do another revu?
<superm1> er i mean Lutin - looks like you were doing the revu not pochu
<Lutin> superm1: sure
<superm1> Lutin, mythtv-themes-unofficial, http://revu.tauware.de./details.py?upid=5114
<superm1> warning, its a bit of a big .orig.tar.gz
<Lutin> pochu: actually, I'm not that comfortable with this intltool thing...you'd better ask Nafallo to make sure it's not needed :)
<Lutin> superm1: ok
<pochu> Lutin: sure :)
<pochu> Lutin: mail sent :)
<Lutin> pochu: cool :)
<Lutin> superm1: sorry, I don't have much time to review it right now :/
<superm1> Lutin,  :(
<Lutin> superm1: will have a look at it in a couple of hours
<superm1> Lutin, ok, i should be on throughout the day
<Lutin> superm1: ok
<superm1> just ping with any questions/concerns/comments etc
<superm1> thanks
<Lutin> ok
<paran> What is the easiest way to build packages that depend on each other using pbuilder?
<paran> If for example package bar depends on package libfoo, how do I get my libfoo-deb into pbuilder when building bar?
<Lutin> paran: depends or build-depends ?
<paran> Lutin: build-depends
<superm1> paran, you can set up a hook
<Lutin> paran: just put in the Build-Depends filed in debian/rules
<superm1> in your pbuilder env
<paran> Lutin: yeah, but the problem is that in my example neither libfoo or bar is in ubuntus repositories
<superm1> that scans your results directory for packages that were built and adds them to the pbuilder env
<superm1> or better yet the pbuilder env's apt database
<superm1> paran, http://pastebin.ca/486159
<superm1> take a look at that
<superm1> there is my hook, and my pbuilder conf that i use with it
<paran> superm1: thanks! reading about hooks in the man-page now.
<superm1> paran, i ran into the same trouble last year with mythtv and mythplugins, so hopefully this works well for you :)
<paran> superm1: your hook will make all packages in /var/cache/pbuilder/result/feisty available too apt in the chroot right?
<superm1> right
<superm1> i set up my pbuilders like this so i can have a dapper, edgy, feisty, and gutsy pbuilder easily available
<superm1> and build for all of them with one command
<paran> superm1: if you do lots of builds for various versions then I guess you would go crazy if you didn't do something like that
<paran> superm1: recreating the pbuilder all the time would be pretty boring :)
<superm1> paran, I try to backport as many of the mythtv packages as possible
<superm1> but originally i was recreating the pbuilder, - waay too much work to do that all the time
<eolo999> someone can give a look to python-scientific for patch system?
<eolo999> it seems it has not one, i'm an unlucky newbie!
<eolo999> i fixed Bug #113803 and wanted to try packaging.
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 113803 in python-scientific "Python-netcdf crashes in Feisty" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/113803
<eolo999> doko_, I fixed a bug in python-scientific, you are maintaining that package so perhaps can help me
<doko_> eolo999: well, it's universe; I maintain it in debian; if you're MOTU just upload the fix
<eolo999> i'm new in packaging and couldn't see a patch system for py-sci...so hoped you could give me some advice
<eolo999> i put a diff in launchpad  Bug #113803
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 113803 in python-scientific "Python-netcdf crashes in Feisty" [Medium,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/113803
<eolo999> i'm not MOTU (yet,hope)
<ScottK> doko_: eolo999 has been doing some good work on Python bugs and on my advice applied to join your python* teams so he can get bug reports.  
<eolo999> Hi Saver of the Universe (Scottk)
<doko_> ScottK: thanks for the info, will look at my email tomorrow
<ScottK> eolo999: For a diff that small, don't worry adding a patching system, just edit the source directly.
<eolo999> ScottK, seems i fixed python-scientific bug
<ScottK> Sounds good.  I just looked at the diff you sent me.
<eolo999> i built a binary package with debuild and tested...
<ScottK> eolo999: Have you looked at the Gutsy package yet to see if the problem applies there too?
<eolo999> ops...not yet
* eolo999 doing it
<ScottK> OK
<ScottK> If the fix applies to the Gutsy version too, then do a debdiff for that first and then once that's uploaded, we'll see about a Feisty update.
<eolo999> sounds gutsy has the same package
<eolo999> ScottK, sounds gutsy has the same package
<ScottK> OK
<ScottK> Then do an update for that package first.
<eolo999> ?
<ScottK> Make a package that in debian/changelog has a target distribution of gutsy
<ScottK> Build that package in a Gutsy pbuilder to make sure it builds correctly.
<ScottK> Make a debdiff and attach it to the bug...
<eolo999> which version should i write in changelog?
<eolo999> and should I mention launchpud bug?
<ScottK> eolo999: looking
<ScottK> Yes
<ScottK> on the lp bug
<ScottK> eolo999: Version would be 2.4.11-1build1ubuntu1
<geser> no, 2.4.11-1ubuntu1
<eolo999> ScottK, it's never the same... hoped to find dpatch!
<geser> -XbuildY gets replaced with -XubuntuY if a Ubuntu change gets added
<ScottK> geser: Thanks
<ScottK> eolo999: What geser said.
<eolo999> Should I change maintainer to MOTU?
<ScottK> eolo999: Yes
<eolo999> !pastebin
<ubotu> pastebin is a service to post large texts so you don't flood the channel. The Ubuntu pastebin is at http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org (make sure you give us the URL for your paste - see also the #ubuntu channel topic)
<eolo999> http://paste.ubuntu-nl.org/20721/
<eolo999> ScottK, if I added MOTU in changelog should I change control too?
<ScottK> Yes
<eolo999> What was the old maintainer field? XCBS or what?
<ScottK> eolo999: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebianMaintainerField
<eolo999> ScottK, seen changelog in pastebin
<eolo999> ?
<ScottK> eolo999: Looked good to me.
<eolo999> ok after control, nothing more to change?
<ScottK> You made the changes in the source code, right?
<eolo999> yes
<ScottK> Then I think that's it.
<ScottK> Build the source package
<eolo999> my memory about building packaged is obscured...
<eolo999> i mean using pbuilder....
<ScottK> pbuilder is for the binary package.  You have to build the source package firest
<ScottK> firest/first
<ScottK> source package is debuild -S -uc
<eolo999> that i already did it and it gives an error for missinbg python-central (but I have it installed)
<eolo999> and: bad-distribution-in-changes-file gutsy
<ScottK> hmm
<ScottK> Ignore the bad distribution error.  That's expected
<ScottK> What is the exact error about python-central?
<eolo999> python-scientific source: missing-build-dependency python-central (>= 0.5)
* ScottK is looking
* eolo999 has 30 minutes left before sleeping!
<ScottK> eolo999: Add python-central (>= 0.5) to the build depends and add that you did that to the changelog.
<ScottK> The package does call python-central in debian/rules and I don't see it in the build-dep in debian/control.
<eolo999> ok no more error
<ScottK> OK
<ScottK> Do a debdiff and pastebin it so I can look at it.
<ScottK> eolo999: Do it quickly, my daughter is waking up from her nap.
<eolo999> done
<eolo999> i put it in launchpad
<ScottK> OK
<eolo999> done
<ScottK> eolo999: I don't see it
<eolo999> try again
<ScottK> trying
<ScottK> Got it now
<eolo999> same changelog empty line error!!!
<ScottK> eolo999: It looks generally good, but you need to add a blank line before your name in the changelog
<eolo999> yes i noticed
<eolo999> i already have a new debdiff
<ScottK> eolo999: Also there are some changes in the diff further down in the changelog.  Those shouldn't be there.
<ScottK> Gotta run.
<ScottK> Daughter's awake
<eolo999> ok
<eolo999> bye
<Lutin> superm1: around ?
<superm1> Lutin, yup
<Lutin> superm1: can I find the orig.tar.gz somewhere ?
<superm1> yes its on the first upload on that page
<superm1> http://revu.tauware.de./details.py?upid=5108
<Lutin> superm1: ahh yes. thanks
<superm1> thats the first upload 
<superm1> yup
<Lutin> superm1: looks good, though I'd say that including at least the preamble for each license in debian/copyright is a good practice
<superm1> i've seen several packages that do that and dont
<superm1> i'm not sure which is "more" right?
<Lutin> actually, practice is not the right word.  anyways
<Lutin> superm1: I think it's better to include them, but you feel free to poke any other motu around to have some people's opinion about it :)
<superm1> k
* eolo999 has hard real work tomorrow morning and says goodbye.
<Lutin> superm1: and btw, why do you require debhelper >> 5 rather than >= 5 ?
<superm1> oh hm.
<superm1> i had taken that from a package i did before
<superm1> >> 5 just make sure its a revision later than 5, i guess >= would do the trick though
<superm1> current version on my feisty box is >> 5, 5.0.42ubuntu1
<superm1> so never had issues with that
<Lutin> ok
<Lutin> geser: what's the reason for marking bzr-gtk 'Do not merge (or sync)' on DaD ?
<bluekuja> Lutin: I worked on it for a while
<bluekuja> Lutin: a problem with a python update, I think...or something like that
<bluekuja> Lutin: related to bzr
<bluekuja> Lutin, anyway I didnt add anything on dad
<bluekuja> Lutin, maybe someone tried it out too, 
<geser> Lutin: I compared the Debian package and the Ubuntu one (debdiff) and the Ubuntu one has a much better packaging
<Lutin> geser: ok, so same as gajim, we maintain a separate package from debian
<bluekuja> geser: you didnt find any problem related to python?
<geser> Lutin: I'd suggest it until the Debian package improves
<Lutin> geser: ok
<geser> bluekuja: I don't really understand
<bluekuja> geser: I worked on bzr-gtk while ago
<Lutin> bluekuja: this package won't be synced anyways :)
<geser> bluekuja: on the Debian package or the Ubuntu one?
<bluekuja> geser, after the merge, with a build test on a gutsy pbuilder
<bluekuja> geser: noticed something strange (dont really remember what)
<geser> I've to redo the debdiff to tell exactly what I disliked
<bluekuja> geser, ok great
<geser> but one thing was: in Debian it's arch: any and in Ubuntu arch:all
<bluekuja> let me know, if you get something strange in it
<bluekuja> I'm leaving...cya all tomorrow
<bluekuja> Gnight
<geser> and then there was this "mv" in debian/rules to make bzr-gtk find the modules
<bluekuja> geser: yeah
<bluekuja> geser: maybe something was wrong with it, I'll try to find bzr-gtk folder around
<pochu> geser, Lutin: now that you've mentioned gajim, could you review/sponsor bug 114301? :)
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 114301 in gajim "Bug in fr.po translation that breaks invitation" [Low,Confirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/114301
<DktrKranz> how to proceed with bug #112573 ?
<ubotu> Launchpad bug 112573 in galago-daemon "Please merge galago-daemon 0.5.1-1 from Debian" [Undecided,Unconfirmed]  https://launchpad.net/bugs/112573
<geser> pochu: it doesn't need a Maintainer change since it has already an ubuntu address
<pochu> geser: oh, didn't know :)
<pochu> dpkg-source -b warned about it
<pochu> geser: do I update it?
<Adri2000> and Nafallo is the actual maintainer in ubuntu
<superm1> Lutin, will not having the preamble in debian/copyright and using >> 5 be okay enough for an upload, or should I change these over ?
<Lutin> superm1: I'd prefer if you could change it before. you might want to wait a bit though, as I haven't time to run a build test on it :)
<superm1> k
<geser> pochu: have you talked with nafallo about this upload already?
<pochu> geser: no, I haven't seen him around lately
<pochu> btw, it's a one-fix-patch, so there shouldn't be any problem
<pochu> geser: anyway, he's subscribed to the bug, so he'll see it :)
<pochu> we can wait!
<geser> I already stepped on someone toes by uploading a fix for a ftbfs (the package had a dedicated maintainer in ubuntu), so I try to avoid to repeat it :)
<pochu> no worries, I'll talk to him when he connects :)
<geser> good night all
#ubuntu-motu 2008-05-05
<TheMuso> crimsun: http://www.pastebin.ca/1007528 for esdctl attempting to cache the startup sound.
<crimsun> TheMuso: nice, thanks!
<TheMuso> crimsun: np.
<TheMuso> esdctl should return a slot number, and a name to use to play the cached sample.
<TheMuso> Which doesn't occur.
<crimsun> right
 * ajmitch is glad that he's only had one audio app causing no end of problems, rather than several
<Mez> \sh, xdebug now in debian - do you wanna have a looksie see if it
<Mez> s ok to just overwrite on Intrepid>?
<ffm> Is this http://scratch.mit.edu/pages/source DFSG compliant?
<RAOF> ffm: I'm not #debian-legal, but it looks DFSG non-free to me.
<i4x> I made it!! I made my first package!.. it works and finally finished the project!! thank you guys for the wikis.. but now I'll sleep!... (it's getting late!)
<RAOF> ffm: The 'non-commercial' certainly smacks of DFSG #6 non-freeness.
<RAOF> ffm: http://www.debian.org/social_contract#guidelines
<i4x> wow.. and it seems I've found an error/bug/whatever while printing!! where do I report this problem?
<i4x> is there any specific site/channel/blog for printing problems??
<RAOF> i4x: There's always launchpad.net :)
<i4x> hm, fine!!
<i4x> well, c yall!!
<bbyever> hi
<bbyever> im trying to build audacity after a merge but it gives me this http://paste.ubuntu.com/10117/ any ideas?
<zul> do you have cdbs installed
<bbyever> no
<zul> try installing cdbs then
<bbyever> ok
<bbyever> thanks
<nxvl> RoAkSoAx: ping
<RAOF> Ah, x86-64.  An extra 32bits you need to try _really hard_ to make work.
<danielm> hi all, when i work on update a package to a new upstream version, i need to provide a get-orig-source rule, right?
<RAOF> That would be nice, but not 100% necessary. (yet)
<danielm> ok :)
<RAOF> At this point in time, you should also be very much working with the Debian maintainer to get whatever it is in Debian, too.
<emgent> crimsun: i go to sleep, night and big thanks :)
<RAOF> Things I didn't know before today: fedora's base install includes latex.
<jdong> RAOF: gotta stay protected man
<bddebian> Heya gang
<RAOF> jdong: >.<
<RAOF> Yo!  bddebian!
<bddebian> Hi RAOF
<RoAkSoAx> nxvl, pong
<LaserJock> RAOF: I think Ubuntu's base install includes some elements of tex at least
<LaserJock> not sure about latex specifically
<LaserJock> anybody know if the intrepid debootsrap just does a simlink like Hardy?
<jdong> LaserJock: the changelog hints so
<LaserJock> I might just do it locally
<jdong>   * Add (Ubuntu) intrepid as a symlink to gutsy.
<LaserJock> I'm trying to figure out how to do an intrepid chroot for sbuild/LVM
<LaserJock> I might be able to name it intrepid but have it build a hardy chroot
<LaserJock> then I can dist-upgrade it
<LaserJock> seems to be working
 * TheMuso duplicated his hardy chroot and dist-upgraded, although I do intend to create fresh chroots in the coming days.
<bitbuzter> hello. I've a question, when packaging a new upstream release, i have to attach the diff.gz, or a debdiff?
<LaserJock> I'm not very good with the LVM foo so I let kees do it for me ;-)
<LaserJock> bitbuzter: diff.gz
<LaserJock> I believe
<LaserJock> jdong: what do you think of an SRU fixing a .menu file?
<jdong> LaserJock: what was wrong with the file before?
<LaserJock> jdong: since we don't use the Debian menu by default I can't imagine why it'd be very important
 * persia notes that the default install set doesn't even change the interface based on a menu file
<LaserJock> jdong: it was missing a
<LaserJock> "\"
<ajmitch> sounds like a serious bug
<LaserJock> it is broken, but I really don't think we need an SRU for a .menu file
<jdong> LaserJock: does it make the menu file unusable for people who do use the Debian menu?
<persia> Actually, it might be, if it blocked the menufile parser on installation.  Can the package be installed?
<bitbuzter> LaserJock: thanks, the diff.gz that is created when i build the package, right?
<LaserJock> jdong: it does
<jdong> LaserJock: I can't see the regression potential of fixing it....
<LaserJock> persia: yes, it can be installed, it just won't run
<persia> LaserJock: There's no .desktop file they can use as an alternative?
<persia> And it will run, just not from the menu.
<ajmitch> it's a fairly non-invasive change to upload
<LaserJock> oh wait
<LaserJock> persia: I don't think that's the point
<LaserJock> this is important though:
<LaserJock> "The bug manifests itself by making sure no applications installed after
<LaserJock> this package appear in the Applications menu."
<LaserJock> so apparently it screws up the Debian menu
<jdong> LaserJock: that's pretty rough
<jdong> yeah, let's fix that
<LaserJock> rightio
<persia> Ah, yes, that's a parser issue, in which case it deserves an SRU.  Be better to make the menu parser more robust, but...
<LaserJock> rexbron: ping?
 * ajmitch thinks that the bar should be fairly low for hardy fixes anyway
<ajmitch> though my opinion is worth little
 * jdong agrees with ajmitch at least until 8.04.1
<LaserJock> well
<persia> ajmitch: Why low for hardy as opposed to something else?
<LaserJock> I agree it should be low
<LaserJock> but I also don't want a -proposed full of fixes nobody is going to test or care about
<persia> I'm not arguing for hardy being high, just for consistency in the application of policy
<ajmitch> persia: mainly because of the LTS thing, and that people have a higher expectation for hardy
<jdong> persia: up until 8.04.1 I think we should treat it as a RC-freeze w/ no upstream version clause....
<ajmitch> either way, it's not up to me
<jdong> persia: I think it's important for our LTS that we make a continual effort to "get it right" and more polished
<persia> jdong: That'd be very different: in that case, why shouldn't anything RC-freeze acceptable go to any release?
<jdong> persia: though if the effort pays off in a positive way,we can consider using it as a precedent for future releases
<persia> jdong: I disagree.  I would be happy with a policy that said for all releases we made a continual effort to "get it right", but don't think LTS is sufficiently special.
<LaserJock> in policy I don't think it should really be any different
<LaserJock> in practice everybody is more focused on hardy
<jdong> no no in policy it should be the exact same
<jdong> but I honestly don't think we "made a continual effort to get it right" in previous releases
<LaserJock> so they are more likely to file/look at/fix bugs
<persia> ajmitch: While it may not be up to you, 40% of the people to whom it is up are present, so it's a good place to make your arguments :)
<jdong> to be honest
<persia> LaserJock: That's fine.  Any SRU policy is tempered by the interest of those preparing patches.
<jdong> we can do better and here's a good chance for us to prove that
<ajmitch> persia: I have no arguments to make, only uninformed opinions
<persia> s/uninformed/informed/
 * jdong just noticed his GNOME weather applet said "Sky: Broken clouds"
<jdong> that doesn't sound like the right way of wording it
<LaserJock> somebody gonna patch it?
 * LaserJock files an SRU on jdong's weather
<jdong> LaserJock: I think there's too many patches already ;-)
<jdong> </pun hell>
<LaserJock> hmm
 * LaserJock ponders "Broken clouds" and "Patchy weather"
<jdong> even patchy clouds sounds better than broken clouds
<persia> Isn't that string pulled from the updating service, rather than encoded in the applet?  It might be hard to change.
 * ajmitch doesn't understand why it's considered wrong
<jdong> broken clouds simply sounds awkward
<LaserJock> it's not wrong it just maybe sounds funny
<ajmitch> it's a common description
<persia> I'm not sure.  The phrase "A break in the clouds" has a long history.  "Broken clouds" typically means patches of blue whilst mostly overcast.  "Patchy clouds" would be the inverse.  Either works for 50% coverage.
<ScottK> jdong: Persia's right.  Broken (and partly broken) clouds are standard weather terms.
<dholbach> good morning
<RoAkSoAx> good night :)
<dholbach> sleep tight RoAkSoAx
<RoAkSoAx> thanks dholbach, you have a nice day =)
<dholbach> thanks a lot :)
<nixternal> hrmm, anyone else having problems building their intrepid pbuilder due to libc6?
<nixternal> mornin' dholbach
<RAOF> nixternal: Yup.
<dholbach> hiya nixternal
<nixternal> OK, so it isn't just me then
 * nixternal does a dput and pray for Intrepid then :p
<nixternal> I gotta catch up on my 5-a-days
<nixternal> should be 2 to 4 or more 'really fix its' fixed
 * nixternal does one more Hardy backport before calling it a night
<nxvl> dholbach: guten nacht!
<nxvl> dholbach: is monday already in there?
<dholbach> hehe... sleep tight nxvl
<dholbach> nxvl: yes, it's 7:49
<TheMuso> nxvl: Its 15:49 here on Monday.
 * dholbach hugs nixternal
<nxvl> TheMuso: where do you live?
<nxvl> here is still sunday
<nxvl> well
<nxvl> monday already
<nxvl> 00:50
<TheMuso> nxvl: Sydney, Australia.
<nxvl> oh!
<nxvl> nice!
 * nxvl want's to visit Australian Waves some day
<tbielawa> Wow, this makes me feel good about myself. some one commented on my progress on a simple bug I was working on and said they learned from it
<tbielawa> :)
<tbielawa> And this is only my first week contributing :D
<dholbach> tbielawa: excellent! keep it up! :)
<Syntux> Morning
<tbielawa> thanks
<tbielawa> Morning
<nxvl> well
<nxvl> time to sleep
<dholbach> good night
<nxvl> see you all later (tomorrow for me )
 * nxvl HUGS everyone
 * tbielawa waves
<RoAkSoAx> im not tired.. cant sleep :P
 * Syntux hugs back
<TheMuso> c/c
<RoAkSoAx> dholbach, can i ask you a favor? i did my first merge... could you check it? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/blam/+bug/226670
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 226670 in blam "[wishlist]Please merge blam 1.8.5-1 from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<geser> good morning
<dholbach> hi geser
<dholbach> RoAkSoAx: it's in the sponsoring queue - once I've caught up with my mail backlog I'll dive into sponsoring head-first
<warp10> Good morning
<dholbach> hi warp10
<RoAkSoAx> dholbach, yep i uploaded it to u-u-s as stated by nxvl, thanks for checking it :)
<warp10> hey dholbach!
<nixternal> I need a pbuilder for intrepid!!! hopefully I don't wake up to any FTBFS in the morning
<RAOF> nixternal: Eh.  Make the archive your build experiment!
<nixternal> been there, done that...thus far I have been lucky
<nixternal> at least I built and tested all of my backports for Hardy :)
<nixternal> g'nite all!
<tbielawa> byeeee
<tbielawa> So has anyone gotten a working intrepid pbuilder set up?
<tbielawa> I've seen that topic come up a few times in here over the past few days
<tbielawa> actually, i have a more pressing concern. my lintian check on revu is upset about a missing .orig.tar.gz
<tbielawa> http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=bibus
<tbielawa> even when I rename the source gz to the correct name and rebuild the source package it only wants to reference and create the tar.gz with the original name scheme: bibus_1.4.2-1.tar.gz
<geser> tbielawa: I have copied my hardy base.tgz and upgraded it to intrepid (a few days ago)
<tbielawa> geser: I attempted the upgrade method. My attempt failed due to unmet build dependencies. It seemed wrong because apt-cache search had results for each failed dep with the >= the min version required
<jdong> last night debootstrap worked for intrepid
<jdong> idn if that's still the case now
<jdong> murphy's law says no
<tbielawa> I was chroot'd into the hardy environment when I ran the search with an updated source.list
<tbielawa> jdong: ya, no joke there :(
<geser> tbielawa: I did the upgrade a few days ago and I got some unmet deps today when I tried to update it
<geser> tbielawa: how did you name your .orig.tar.gz?
<tbielawa> apt-get source from the upstream repo (hack through sf.net) privides bibus_1.4.2-1.tar.gz. it came debianized but needed updating
<tbielawa> I renamed the tarball with a proper .orig.tar.gz and went into the decompresed source dir and did a source build of the original source so I had a dsc
<tbielawa> it insisted on recreating the tarball with the bibus_1.4.2-1.tar.gz format, even in the dsc "Files: " log
<geser> have you tried to rename the the tar.gz to bibus_1.4.2.orig.tar.gz?
<tbielawa> geser: Yes I did
<geser> hmm
<tbielawa> I thought that if I took the source and rebuild the original source (unmodified) to produce a dsc and had a properly named *orig.tar.gz in the ../ from the source dir it would reference that in the new dsc.
<DreadKnight> hello
<DreadKnight> will somebody fix the plone mess in the repository?
<tbielawa> then my thoughts were, make changes and dch for the ubuntu1 release so I'd get a fancy diff.gz, but it failed at recognizing I even had a orig.tar.gz!
<DreadKnight> i think there are 2 instances of the old plone... and zope-plone3 is like missing or something
<DreadKnight> i'm talking about www.plone.org .. the cms
<tbielawa> no luck with intrepid pbuilder today :(
<geser> tbielawa: I fetched your package from revu, renamed bibus_1.4.2-1ubuntu1.tar.gz to bibus_1.4.2.orig.tar.gz and run debuild -S (inside bibus-1.4.2) to build a new source package and got a diff.gz
<geser> and empty one because the debian dir is already in your .orig.tar.gz
<tbielawa> the gz you got is after I made changes (update fsf address in all files, etc).  Should there be a diff generated from upstream to the ubuntu1 versions then?
<tbielawa> let me know if it's not clear what I'm trying to express
<geser> tbielawa: yes, if you can take a .orig.tar.gz without the debian/ dir as .orig.tar.gz so the contents from debian/ will end in the .diff.gz
<tbielawa> ok
<tbielawa> what can I do to fix the lintian error?
<geser> you mean the native-package-with-dash-version
<geser> error ?
<geser> it should vanished if you have a proper .orig.tar.gz
<tbielawa> Would that mean taking the debian/ dir out of the upstream tar.gz and recompressing it at .orig.tar.gz then applying all my changes (put back in debian/) into the now un-debianized folder?
<geser> yes
<geser> tbielawa: I've to run now but I hope someone else will pick up and help you further
<tbielawa> geser: thanks for being helpful. This process is pretty new to me still, thanks for your patience too
<tbielawa> alright, bye, thanks again
<\sh> grmpf
<\sh> did anyone succeed in creating a chroot for intrepid?
<soren> Sure.
<\sh> soren, hmm...W: Failure trying to run: chroot /home/shermann/intrepid_chroot dpkg --force-depends --install var/cache/apt/archives/libc6_2.7-10ubuntu3_amd64.deb <-- bad
<\sh> soren, using a.u.c. and local mirror...
<soren> What's the error?
<\sh> soren, what I pasted...it can#t install libc6
<soren> *shrug* It worked for me.
<\sh> soren, could you try again? :)
<soren> sure
<RAOF> \sh: Doesn't work for me, either.
<\sh> after I resolved my "dear wife, why did you label my cds, and if so, why did you label them totally wrong?"
<\sh> I thought I'm done with the errors ;)
<soren> Ah, I know what's going on.
<soren> Gimme a minute.
<\sh> soren, go for it :)
<soren> \sh: For now, adding "--add perl-modules" to debootstrap's command line should fix it.
<\sh> soren, hmm..if it works, ok...but why? :)
<BunnyRevolution> as i recall, motu's "package" *buntu deb's for *buntu distrobutions
<BunnyRevolution> correct?
<soren> \sh: libc6's postinst uses debconf, which ends up requiring a file from perl-modules, but perl-modules is priority: standard, so debootstrap doesn't pull it in.
<soren> BunnyRevolution: Er... Something like that.
<BunnyRevolution> the packaging guide would tell me the information i need to know for packaging, correct?
<soren> That's the intent, yes.
<\sh> soren, is it new? and if so, the fix is only a matter of time, right?
<soren> \sh: Yes.
<soren> \sh: and yes.
<BunnyRevolution> thank you soren
<\sh> soren, --add or --include?
<\sh> i guess it's --include
<soren> Oh, right.
<\sh> soren, but it doesn't work actually..perl-modules is getting included...but the same error occurs
<\sh> ah damn
<\sh> perl-modules included, but isn't extracted before libc6
<soren> \sh: Try reexecuting the command line.
<soren> \sh: Oh.
 * soren kicks debootstrap
<\sh> hehe
<\sh> well, perl-base is the only perl package which is extracted..but not perl-modules
<soren> WEll, you *could* add perl-modules to $base in /usr/share/debootstrap/scripts/intrepid
<soren> ..if you're in a hurry.
<\sh> soren, yes..that's what's next on my list
<\sh> soren, $base doesn't help...
<\sh> soren, imho $required is better
<\sh> soren, but doesn't solve it ;)
<\sh> now it's mawk
<\sh> which pre-depends on -> voila libc6
<Hobbsee> bah, sebner isn't here.
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: give the bugsquad a list about bugs that they really should just leave alone?
<Hobbsee> LaserJock: i've suggested that in my current mail to them
<Hobbsee> ScottK: people who assign MOTU to a bug to get it fixed faster only do so once, though....
<Hobbsee> and, if done well enough, tell their friends, so they don't make the same mistake
<Hobbsee> ScottK: ditto those who do the entire ~ubuntu-dev
<\sh> damnit...working on hardy sbuild...better then nothing
<white> /usr/share/debootstrap/scripts/intrepid is empty on my debian system :/
<\sh> white, ln -s gutsy intrepid ;)
<white> :)
<white> i'll see, if it works now
<white> i am using cowbuilder, so --include does not really work
<white> E: Couldn't find these debs: zlib1g,
<white> bah, i only want a base.cow here :/
<dholbach> hum, can we change the icon of revu-uploaders to be less similar to ubuntu-core-dev? :)
<\sh> white, forget it...it's a perl pkg bug...see #ubuntu-devel
<\sh> white, soren determined it, and hopefully is fixing it ;)
<\sh> ScottK, claws-mail* <--- should we drop the old sylpheed-* transitional packages now for intrepid?
<wgrant> \sh: Unless we had the old packages in Hardy, we don't need them any more.
<\sh> wgrant, ok...so we can hopefully sync it from debian now...
<wgrant> \sh: We'll be able to sync a lot of stuff again now that Dapper isn't relevant.
<\sh> wgrant, sure
<tjaalton> hm, shouldn't audacious default to pulseaudio in hardy? now it uses alsa
<wgrant> tjaalton: I smell an SRU.
<tjaalton> wgrant: yep, me too
<tjaalton> and it doesn't seem to have a systemwide config to set it in the meantime
<jpatrick> morning norsetto
<norsetto> jpatrick: hi there
<rexbron> I have question regarding getting a fix into both intrepid and an as an SRU. Will the same debdiff be used  and just uploaded to different archives or do I need to prepare different debdiffs?
<\sh> hmmm
<wgrant> rexbron: The latter.
<wgrant> The versioning is different.
<rexbron> ok, one should be versioned -0ubuntu2.1 and the other (for intrepid) be -0ubuntu3, even though they are the same?
<wgrant> That's right.
<rexbron> ok
<tjaalton> wgrant: audacious fixed :)
<wgrant> tjaalton: What did you have to do?
<tjaalton> wgrant: patch bmp_default_config
<wgrant> Aha.
<tjaalton> like patch 003 does
<tjaalton> changes the theme
<emgent> morning
<tseliot> emgent: good morning to you ;)
<emgent> heya tseliot :P
<LucidFox> dholbach, I'm not sure how I should handle debian/changelog for -proposed updates
<Hobbsee> LucidFox: stick it as hardy-proposed, iirc.
<Hobbsee> as the target
<LucidFox> Yes, I know, but I'm modifying a version that is already in hardy-proposed
<LucidFox> should I increment the version number?
<Hobbsee> i expect so - else it won't get accepted
<LucidFox> then dholbach is right, my debian/changelog _is_ incorrect
<LucidFox> On an unrelated note, I posted a Debian bug about old FSF address in debian/copyright, but the maintainer is reluctant to change it until upstream does
<LucidFox> does it have merit?
<broonie> LucidFox: Technically but it's not really worth worrying about.
<norsetto> lucidfox: personally, I think it makes sense
<ex1stenz> http://www.colectionarul.com/existenz1.html
<Hobbsee> ex1stenz: ?
<ex1stenz> http://www.colectionarul.com/existenz1.html
<megabyte405> ex1stenz: That looks like spam to me.
<slytherin> has revu opened for intrepid? is anyone planning to package jmeter?
<ScottK> \sh: Yes (drop the transitional packages).
<jpatrick> Hobbsee: random..
<ScottK> persia: Unison backport is done (IIRC it was you that had some interest in this).
<ScottK> Hobbsee: Thanks for the support on bugsquad.
<Hobbsee> ScottK: NP - but us adding to their documentation of bugs not to touch might be a good idea.
<persia> ScottK: I felt some responsibility, and wanted to see it to avoid as much noise as fedora got, but I'm not a user.
<persia> What's the next step: does it need testing or something?
<ScottK> Hobbsee: Agreed.  I discussed it with bdmurray and I'd thought he was going to do it.
<ScottK> persia: At this point it'll still be building and such.  I'd suggest leave it for a bit and see if there's a user push for it.  Personally I'm not in a rush since a lot of people are still using older Ubuntu versions.
<persia> ScottK: That mirrors my thoughts on the matter.  I just didn't want to miss a process step if there was something pending which required action.
<ScottK> The way Unison tends to break on the wire between versions is a definite problem with Unison.  One in release and one in backports isn't so bad.
<ScottK> persia: OK.  Thanks for looking after it.
<persia> Sure.  We ought have the new one for intrepid, and so with the backport for hardy be covered until the next thesis, unless someone really wants to push an SRU.
<ScottK> Whoever was looking after pulse by default issues ( TheMuso, was that you) might be interested in http://nenoblog.net/?p=4
<ogra> ScottK, i think the proposed solution is now to use nspluginwrapper even in i386 and let libflashsupport return
<ogra> (the issues were mainly flash/firefox related)
<persia> nenolod: Is there a bug for that?
<nenolod> there is no bug (yet)
<ogra> (and keep pulse as is)
<nenolod> the issue is that the patch is not guaranteed to work in the future
<persia> nenolod: Ah.  It'd probably be accepted :)
<nenolod> and .. i mean it's an ugly hack!
<persia> heh.
<nenolod> then again, so is the "appease josselin mouette" hack
<nenolod> which is admittedly done the same way, and by me
<wgrant> nenolod: I'm failing to see why a blog post is better than filing a bug.
<nenolod> wgrant, i'm failing to see how the patch was accepted in the first place
<broonie> wgrant: There's a process issue here as well as a technical issue with the patch.
<nenolod> wgrant, it is clearly wrong
<persia> broonie: Surely, but nenolod is about a lot, and active enough to know the right people to poke.
<ScottK> Nether of which are best addressed by an "Ubuntu sucks" blog post.
<nenolod> ScottK, it's not a ubuntu sucks blog post
<ScottK> Nether/Neither
<wgrant> "Yay! Ubuntu patches my code horribly wrong! And I don't even bother to tell them!"
<nenolod> it's a "this person made an ubuntu patch, it was horribly wrong and it ticked me off" post
<ScottK> nenolod: OK.  If you say so.  Maybe it was an "Ubuntu developers are idiots" blog post then.
<nenolod> wgrant, they could have easily done about 2 seconds of clicking around on launchpad, saw that i was on IRC, and then went "hey is this a good way to do it"
<nenolod> and then i would have gone, "fix PLUGIN_FILENAME() and use my previous patch, as that will always work"
<ScottK> nenolod: I dispute its possible to find anything useful in Launchpad in 2 seconds.
<nenolod> haha
<nenolod> ScottK, well, i was more annoyed that nobody actually poked me before uploading such a hideous patch
<nenolod> i would have been happy to ensure it is done correctly
<nenolod> which i will get around to doing
 * norsetto wonders since when ubuntu-motu has become a support list
<nenolod> but i should have been to bed about 3 hours ago :p
<Hobbsee> norsetto: it's not, but people don't read list descriptions.
<Hobbsee> norsetto: and probably since some of the MOTU's stupidly started to answer them.
<wgrant> Hobbsee: Oh, you mean launchpad-users isn't for requesting CDs? Damn.
 * Hobbsee beats wgrant
<Hobbsee> clearly those people don't work enough retail - in retail, you learn to not let the stupids get away with things, because it'll encourage them to keep trying.  There are definite parallels with the MOTU ML.
<Hobbsee> (not saying that the MOTU ML people who ask support questions are stupid, but...)
<wgrant> Hobbsee: Exactly. Same with people who answer support queries in #ubuntu-devel - they're just encouraging.
<wgrant> *encouraging it.
<Hobbsee> wgrant: exactly.
<Hobbsee> wgrant: better to send them away, so they don't try it again, for their next question.
<wgrant> Mhm.
<Hobbsee> same with hardy stuff in #ubuntu+1, too.   Topics are hard.
<ScottK> Previously I thought #ubuntu+1 redirected to #ubuntu until later in the release cycle.
<ScottK> I'd hate to have any end users thinking running Intrepid is a sane thing they can do and get help with.
<Hobbsee> ScottK: it usually does.
<Hobbsee> ScottK: Amaranth whined repeatedly, until they reopened it when intrepid's archives were open for proper development.
<ScottK> Hobbsee: OK.  I don't see the sense in it, but whatever.  It sounds like inducement to idiocy to me, but who knows.
<Hobbsee> ScottK: as for how that will make the quality of the end users better, i've no idea.
<Hobbsee> and their feedback
<ScottK> IMO if you know enough to provide useful feedback at this point, you don't need #ubuntu+1
<Hobbsee> ScottK: well, that was my thought on it too, but if that's the way they want it, then that's how they can have it, as long as they're doing the moderating, and not me.
<ScottK> Right.
<\sh> ScottK, sync requested :)
<ScottK> \sh: Great.
<emgent> heya \sh :)
<Hobbsee> ScottK: then again, if circumstances regarding the irc ops team were different, i probably wouldn't be saying that.
<\sh> hey ember
<\sh> aeh emgent
<\sh> ScottK, I compiled new claws as well for hardy...you could start to deal with backports for it :)
<emgent> :)
<ScottK> \sh: File a hardy-backports bug, say it builds, installs, and runs and then ping me.
<emgent> \sh: when you have time see query
<nenolod> that patch will make audacious segfault at exit too
 * nenolod headdesks
<nenolod> what's the procedure for recalling that upload?
<nenolod> i've commented on the bug, hopefully someone will read and deny that upload for inclusion in 8.04.1
<ScottK> nenolod: It needs an SRU to fix it.
<ScottK> !sru | nenolod
<ubottu> nenolod: Stable Release Update information is at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates
<persia> nenolod: I don't think it can be recalled at this point: more likely updated with a new upload
<nenolod> which will of course be denied
<nenolod> thanks :P
<nenolod> persia, bummer. good thing nobody is using intrepid at this point
<persia> Why would it be denied?  Segfault at exit is pretty critical, and the SRU team has been talking about making it easier to fix bugs in hardy anyway
<sebner> mok0: around?
<mok0> sebner: yeah
<nenolod> persia, the patch causes the segfault
<nenolod> persia, :)
<ScottK> nenolod: The people who decide stuff on SRUs are different than the one that uploaded it.
<nenolod> persia, it also causes potential doublefree
<mok0> sebner: wassup
<persia> nenolod: Right, which means there needs to be a new patch that doesn't segfault uploaded to hardy
<sebner> mok0: Maybe ScottK already told you. I took over the courier merge. I suppose it's ok for you?
<mok0> sebner: oh, that's fine, np
<ScottK> mok0: I asked him to look into it.
<nenolod> strings in the cfg object are supposed to be strdup'd. the only exception is the skin path, which is leaked so that vendors can rebrand the player easily
<mok0> ScottK: It's in good hands then :-)
<mok0> I'm kinda busy with other stuff at the moment
<sebner> mok0: Well at least I have 1 question.  "- Removed trailing whitespace everywhere." Would you mind explaining that to me?
<mok0> sebner: in the debian/ directory...
<mok0> sebner: or rather, in FILES in debian/ :-)
<sebner> mok0: an what whitespaces do they have?
<mok0> sebner: white space at the end of the line _______
<nenolod> really though ubuntu should push mudkip-player over audacious
<nenolod> audacious is this audiophile thing
<nenolod> mudkip-player uses gstreamer and looks exactly like XMMS
<nenolod> although i haven't released it yet :)
<sebner> mok0: in every file?
<persia> nenolod: That's likely too late for hardy, but we'd welcome it in intrepid.
<mok0> sebner: actually you shouldn't repeat that, if you're doing a merge
<nenolod> well, audacious has it's place too, but "XMMS replacement saviour" isn't it
<nenolod> audacious2 doesn't even load winamp skins :D
<persia> It seemed the best option at the time.
<sebner> persia: I don't want to be too annoying, really, but any news on my application?
<persia> sebner: Best not to ask.  Anyway, all application processing is public on the mailing list.
<sebner> persia: I know, just wondering if that was an official vote the MC has 48 hours to vote IIRC. :)
<mok0> sebner: it just makes the diff bigger and more unmaintainable.
<nenolod> persia, it is the best option at the moment, but i believe there is a better solution for that kind of user (e.g. who uses it because it looks like winamp, and doesn't care about anything technical about it)
<persia> sebner: Well, someone put that on the wiki.  I can't remember the last time all voting was complete in 48 hours, especially when it crossed a weekend.
<sebner> mok0: kk, btw. Thanks for your nice comment :)
<mok0> sebner: Sure :-)
<sebner> persia: ^^. nvm
<persia> nenolod: That matches my understanding.  Of course, I'm not that familiar with the codebase, and so welcome a better solution :)
<ScottK> sebner: Remember that the contributors/member thing is new, so be patient.
<sebner> ScottK: Yeah, I know. sorry :) btw, what about a shiny icon for the group. revu-uploaders also have one
<ScottK> Dunno if there is one or not.  Maybe someon should develop one.
<mok0> sebner: you can find trailing spaces by: grep ' $' *
<persia> An icon would be very welcome.  If someone has a candidate, sending it to ubuntu-motu@ for comment would likely be a good path towards acceptance.
<sebner> mok0: cool, thanks :)
 * persia notes that grep -e '\s$' also finds trailing tabs
<mok0> persia: sorry i can't find it in the scrollback, an icon for what?
<ScottK> sebner: Don't remove the trailing spaces.  It's no worth the trouble.
<ScottK> mok0: The new contributors team
<persia> mok0: https://launchpad.net/~universe-contributors
 * mok0 looks
<mok0> Ah cool
<sebner> ScottK: ah ok then
<ffm> Hey, anyone in the mood for a package REVU?
<ScottK> sebner: Why did I tell you it's not worth the trouble?
<sebner> ScottK: maybe because whitespaces are not that important and the debdiff is already big enough?
<ScottK> Maybe.
 * mok0 cheers
<ScottK> sebner: What is the impact of the spaces on the end of the lines?
<slytherin> anyone already working on packaging jmeter? If not I will start sometime tomorrow.
<sebner> ScottK: bigger debdiffs? I once had whitespaces in debian/control. Took me some time to discover that -.-
<ScottK> sebner: What else?
<ScottK> slytherin: Is there a needs packaging bug in Ubuntu or a Debian ITP?
<sebner> ScottK: in generel or in case of courier?
<ScottK> sebner: That's the impact of changing the package to remove the spaces.  What's the impact of leaving then?
<ScottK> In general.
<slytherin> ScottK: Not in Debian. Havne't checked launchpad. But I would like to see the package in Ubuntu.
<sebner> ScottK: don't make the delta to debian even bigger?
<ScottK> slytherin: OK.  Just suggesting that's the best way to find the answer to your question.
<ScottK> sebner: Debian has the spaces (in this case).  What if we just leave them?
<sebner> ScottK: they don't do anything, except take up space
<ScottK> sebner: Yes.  Exactly.
<ScottK> sebner: So that's why it's not worth maintaining a bigger diff with Debian over.
<ScottK> sebner: Additionally, it's hard to see and so it makes for a hard debdiff to review.
 * sebner sucks somehow on answering questions but thinks it's funny that ScottK is the only one asking =)
<Amaranth> Hobbsee: _I_ wanted to wait until the start of UDS
<ScottK> sebner: It's OK.  This is one way to learn.
 * mok0 once had a package rejected in revu because of trailing spaces... :-/
<sebner> ScottK: It's not negative. As I said it's somehow nice
<slytherin> ScottK: FYI ... It is java based load testing tool for web applications and web services. Not sure how many use it but it is 'the best' free tool available for load testing.
<ScottK> mok0: That's different.  There's no downside associated with making you fix it.  I had the same thing happen to me in Debian.
<ScottK> slytherin: As soon as you use the "J" word, I know I'm not the guy.
<persia> Regarding extraneous whitespace: it's messy.  It should be fixed.  It isn't worth a patch except to the originating source, which might be upstream, Debian, or REVU.
<mok0> ScottK, sebner, I certainly would not bother with trailing spaces anymore. Can't remember why I did it back then, probably didn't consider the consequences
<\sh> slytherin, load testing tool?
<slytherin> ScottK: I know. I will probably have to poke doko.
<broonie> sebner: Easiest thing to do with something like that is get the change made in Debian.
<persia> slytherin: jmeter would be great, but do check for ITP or needs-packaging first, and maybe file them if they don't exist.
<Hobbsee> Amaranth: hmmm, must have gotten the voices confused then.  i knew you were one of the severe advocators for it
<slytherin> \sh: yes, why? Is the term load testing/ stress testing not familiar?
<ScottK> broonie: The courier maintainer has not, historically, be what I would call responsive.
<sebner> broonie: well if the debian maintainer is willing :\
<ScottK> Generally broonie is right however.
<mok0> broonie: yeah, except you could be viewed as something of a nitpicker if you file a bug "please remove trailing spaces in debian/"
<Amaranth> Hobbsee: Right, but then we seemed to compromise on start of UDS instead of me saying when the archive opens and you saying alpha4
<broonie> ScottK: Well, IIRC that's idiomatic given courier upstream :)
<broonie> mok0: Oh, you *totally* would.
<persia> mok0: As long as it's "Severity: wishlist", nitpicking is usually acceptable.
<ScottK> Yeah.  That too.
 * sebner is asking himself if ScottK or mok0 should review the debdiff then =)
<slytherin> persia: there are none. I will file bug for Ubuntu. But will do for debian only when my package is in shape.
<ScottK> sebner: I'll review it.
<mok0> sebner: you're in boot-camp now
<ScottK> slytherin: You ought to go ahead and file the ITP to avoid duplicate work.
 * broonie also notes that doing such a change in the Ubuntu package is only going to annoy anyone trying to find changes from Debian.
<slytherin> ScottK: ok
<sebner> ScottK: hihi. I would have choosen you since we learn from mistakes :)
<ffm> So, what should I do to ask for a package review?
<persia> slytherin: I tend to recommend filing both if you're doing it right away, just because not everyone checks both places, and it tells people you're working on it.  No issue with having an open ITP for a while whilst you get reviews, etc.
<ffm> s/ask/get/
<Hobbsee> Amaranth: mmm.  i gave in, there was no point in arguing.
<ScottK> slytherin: That way even if your package isn't done, if someone in Debian is interested, they should contact you.
<\sh> slytherin, no because there is another java based (including jython driven) load testing tool available ;)
<ScottK> ffm: Patience.  Asking once or twice a day is OK.
<slytherin> persia: ScottK: Will file both bugs tonight.
<slytherin> \sh: which one?
<\sh> slytherin, grinder its the name
<\sh> slytherin, also possible to have it on different servers and controlled by one instance on your WS
<ScottK> slytherin: Also Debian ITP's go to debian-devel and you can get good feedback on package name/description too.
<slytherin> \sh: same with jmeter. Will have to check what is the difference. :-)
<slytherin> \sh: found the main difference, grinder has its own scripting. jmeter has a nice GUI with lots of D&D :-D
<ScottK> lucas: When you have a moment, I'd like to discuss my libdb4.6-ruby ITP with you.
<\sh> slytherin, yes...grinder has jython as scripting engine in its back
<\sh> slytherin, for load testing a better alternative then d&d ;) because people who are using it, they are doing all strange things to those tools (at least me) ;))
<slytherin> \sh: since I have used loadrunner at some point of time I feel the jmeter approach is better. Let's see, I will finish jmeter first. :-)
<\sh> slytherin, kk...
<ffm> ack, spam!
 * nenolod spams ffm
<white> \sh: still around?
<\sh> white, always...but sometimes busy and not at my place ;)
<white> \sh: how again can i get my base.cow now with cowbuilder --create for sid? :)
<white> both cdebootstrap and debootstrap are failing (i assume due to the perl-modules bug)
<\sh> white, in this moment, it's not possible...even upgrading from hardy to intrepid fails
<\sh> white, adding perl-modules as required packages to debootstrap forces mawk to be pulled in, and that pre-depends on libc6...not really nice and doesn't work actually
<white> bah
<white> i hope it is getting fixed soon then
<\sh> white, what I'm doing now, since the changes between hardy and intrepid are not soo much, I'll testbuild with hardy....and hopefully it builds somehow in intrepid...if not, the fix comes later ,-)
<\sh> white, the bug is also in debian, so it should be fixed soon...
<\sh> bah...emacs21 still build-deps on old libungif4-dev
<white> i am not using ubuntu, so i just need something for sid :)
<\sh> white, try with deboostrap etch etch_chroot -> enter chroot and upgrade to sid manually?
<\sh> white, for ubuntu it doesn't work from hardy to intrepid, as I said
<white> yeah, will do that tomorrow probably, thanks
<slytherin> can anyone please point to how to do merges with help of MOM?
<mruiz> hi all
<highvoltage> norsetto: I caught you. You *do* have a sense of humour!!!
<highvoltage> norsetto: "Cesare (the real one)" :)
<norsetto> highvoltage: I deny with all my strength!
<Ward1983> how do i need to remove gnash? sorry if its considered offtpic but i dont find how to get it done
<jpatrick> Ward1983: sudo apt-get remove gnash?
<Ward1983> jpatrick, in your dreams that might work :p
<azeem> if you're asking off-topic questions, at least supply necessary information along
<Ward1983> azeem, i uninstall gnash, then i install flash-nonfree with forefox, then it acts like its not installed, so i click install plugin again
<Ward1983> then it tells me its allready installed
<azeem> what does that have todo with gnash?
<Ward1983> azeem, whateverit is, i dont like it one bit
<Ward1983> if ubuntu renders me unable to install simple plugins like flash i think its best i change distros
<jpatrick> Ward1983: restarted firefox?
<RainCT> jpatrick: was about to ask the same :)
<Ward1983> just a sec i deinstalled again
<jcastro> sudo update-alternatives --config xulrunner-addons-flashplugin
<jcastro> and pick the adobe player
<Ward1983> im pretty sure i tried that too some time ago, i have this problem for months now
<Ward1983> but ill try again to make sure
<Ward1983> i hope thats the problem
<Lamego> Ward1983, btw, the support channel is #ubuntu, in case you don't know it :P
<Ward1983> Lamego, will do, thought it wqs some pqckaging problem
<Ward1983> someone else has the exact same problem
<azeem> Ward1983: this channel is for solving packaging problems, not for reporting them
<ScottK> Ward1983: That's what Launchpad is for.
<bobbo> RainCT: mind if i try the guarddog merge? You were the last uploader.
<ScottK> jpatrick: Answering such questions just encourages them.
<Ward1983> azeem, ScottK i have no knowledge to determine what kind of problem it is
<RainCT> bobbo: I think I already started that one
<azeem> Ward1983: so that means you're in the wrong chan
<Ward1983> so only one thing left for me to do, leave
<ScottK> Ward1983: Then just report the bug (what you are experiencing).
<bobbo> RainCT: ok no problem :)
<Ward1983> azeem, i was still typing...
<Ward1983> ScottK, i'll just get debian, im tired of these retarded problems i never have had with debian
<jcastro> man dude, I told you how to fix the problem
<Ward1983> thanx to the people who wanted to help
<Ward1983> byebye
<jpatrick> well..
<ScottK> If he's happier with Debian, he should use that.
<wgrant> What a nice guy.
<ScottK> I always get some humor value out of users who say "Pay attention to $MYPETPROBLEM or I'll go use X instead".
<ScottK> I always translate that as "Please ignore any request I make".
<laga> "i demand that my feature request is implemented". :(
<\sh> wtf was that?
<Hobbsee> laga: "pay up"
<sebner> Hey folks. What can we do if a uploader forgot to upload .orig.tar.gz and so it FTBFS (in hardy)
<Hobbsee> :)
<\sh> sebner, hmmm?
<wgrant> sebner: That's impossible.
<wgrant> It will be rejected, so will never even have builds attempted.
<sebner> \sh: months ago I did a merge and the sponsor forgot to upload the orig.tar.gz
<sebner> https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/qmail/1.03-45ubuntu1
<\sh> sebner, .dsc + .diff.gz needs a version + deb rev , if version of .dsc/diff.gz is not matching with available orig.tar.gz it won't even build..but will be not accepted from our buildd system
<RainCT> sebner: there is a .orig.tar.gz
<sebner> true
<sebner> but the build log says
<sebner> Error: ../qmail_1.03.orig.tar.gz missing
<\sh> sebner, hehehe...
<Hobbsee> sebner: then the build is broken.
<wgrant> Uh.
<wgrant> WTF.
<wgrant> Big WTF.
<sebner> Hobbsee: would you mind doing a give back?
<wgrant> Oh.
<wgrant> No, that's not what it looks like.
<wgrant> It's a tar within a tar.
<RainCT> sebner: seems like debian/rules tries to access a .orig.tar.gz
<RainCT> well I'm away
<wgrant> That's a legitimate bug in your packaging.
<RainCT> bbl
<sebner> RainCT: cya
<Hobbsee> wgrant: yes, exactly.
<Hobbsee> wgrant: ie, not likely to have been test built.
<\sh> binary-src: checkdir debian/control \
<\sh> ../$(PACKAGE)_$(PKG_UPVER).orig.tar.gz \
<\sh> ../$(PACKAGE)_$(PKG_VER).dsc ../$(PACKAGE)_$(PKG_VER).diff.gz
<sebner> well this was months ago and yes I didn't testbuild it but also not the sponsor
<Hobbsee> .....
<Hobbsee> ......
<Hobbsee> .....
<Hobbsee> sebner: here is the riot act:
<Hobbsee> unless anyone else wants to give it?
<\sh> sebner, the debian/rules file is totally fcked up
<\sh> sebner, it will never build...
<sebner> strange since the only debian change was "* Updated prerm to remove dependancy on update-inetd"
<sebner> and the old version built
<Hobbsee> sebner: you must test build *everything* before you upload it, or get it uploaded.  People won't do uploads for you if they know you have a history of uploading broken stuff.
<Hobbsee> sebner: tarball version changed?
<ScottK> Note for those reading the riot act is that qmail has historically be shipped as source only.
<\sh> Hobbsee, no
<sebner> Hobbsee: yeah I know it. This was really at the very beginning of my contributions
<Hobbsee> sebner: right.
<\sh> actually it builds in a normal sbuild / pbuilder environment
<Hobbsee> ScottK: granted.  but stuff that builds, no matter how it does, is usually good.
<\sh> it won't build hopefully in a XEN environment
<ScottK> Hobbsee: Agreed, but lack of building isn't actually a regression.
<Hobbsee> ScottK: my objection was more to the point that he didn't test build it, to see if it built or not, before asking for sponsorship.
<wgrant> ScottK: It built a qmail-source package, didn't it?
<Hobbsee> that's just wasting people's time.
<ScottK> Agreed.
<\sh> wgrant, yes...no....
<\sh> dpkg-gencontrol -isp -pqmail-src -Pdebian/tmp-src
<\sh> fakeroot chown -R root.root debian/tmp-src
<\sh> fakeroot: FAKEROOTKEY set to 164044714
<\sh> fakeroot: nested operation not yet supported
<\sh> make: *** [binary-src] Error 1
<\sh> sry for pasting this
<Hobbsee> ScottK: whether it builds on some funky combo of pbuilder but not sbuild, or something, is immaterial if he didn't test it, on any useful environment, in the first place.
<ScottK> Hobbsee: I agree.  I just think the impact in this particular case is lower than usual.  He still should have done it.
<Hobbsee> oh, indeed.
 * Hobbsee wasn't talking impacts, and such, nor possible solutions.
<Hobbsee> ooh!   my tute will actually submit this week!
<sebner> ehm. So what can we do now? Fixing in hardy isn't worth it. but for intrepid?
 * DktrKranz2 notes fixing FTBFS is usually worth a SRU upload
<ScottK> DktrKranz2: Generally, but in this case it's not really a regression.
<\sh> the rpoblem is known since feisty
<\sh> and there are only two bugs...one because of this ftbfs and the other as pkg request
<\sh> so I think right now, postfix and exim4 and sendmail are ruling our universe
<gnomefreak> is anyone having issues with hal on Hardy? problem upgrading
<ogra> gnomefreak, to the version in -proposed ?
<ogra> works fine here
<gnomefreak> 0.5.11~rc2-1ubuntu8
<gnomefreak> i have someone getting polkit errros about auth.
<gnomefreak> polkit-read-auth-helper: needs to be setgid polkituser
<ogra> yup, thats what i got
<gnomefreak> that might mean its his system with messed up permissions
<laga> upgrading in the chroot?
<laga> never mind, i was having a completely different set of packages
<gnomefreak> ogra: thanks im having him reinstall it maybe it will help
<blueyed> Am I right that I should upload a new virtualbox-ose-modules source package for the new kernel ABI to hardy-proposed? Does this need some ACK or something?
<ogra> that needs an SRU i guess
<ogra> ask pitti in -devel
<ScottK> blueyed: Read the SRU wiki page.
<ogra> blueyed, since i suspect its only a rebuild you can probably get around the SRU if pitti acks it
<blueyed> ScottK: I know about SRU. But shouldn't all kernel module packages get an Auto-ACK if the kernel ABI gets bumped?
<Hobbsee> it's something we have to have....
<blueyed> ogra: ok, will ask.
<blueyed> Another related issue: a lot of users pick the from virtualbox-modules package (e.g. -386 although they would need -generic).
<ScottK> blueyed: There's nothing in the process about certain stuff being automagically OK.  It used to be everything was up to a MOTU to decide, but now it's not.
<blueyed> This causes a lot of breakage (no working sound, graphic etc after reboot), because modules are missing.
<ScottK> blueyed: I think having a set of automatically OK criteria is a good idea.
<blueyed> So, I'm thinking about removing the dependency on the kernel-image from the virtualbox-ose-modules packages. (i.e. Depends => Recommends). This would at least only make virtualbox non-working, but not break the whole system.
<ScottK> blueyed: Don't do that in an SRU.
<ScottK> Save that kind of thing for Intrepid.
<ogra> blueyed, see -devel ;)
<blueyed> ogra: thanks. I'm test-building already.
<blueyed> ScottK: well.. it's a major issue after all.. I'll put the info together in a bug report and get it through the SRU process then. If it does not get acked, ok, but I want to try.
<ScottK> blueyed: First rule of SRU is fix in the development release first.  I think that's particularly good for this one.
<blueyed> ScottK: yes. I don't see it happening for the kernel though.. which makes it kind of difficult. The package in Intrepid would have that change then but the lower kernel dependency. But I'm find with uploading it to Intrepid first.
<ScottK> If you are making changes to package relationships it really ought to get tested out in the development release first.
<ScottK> But I'm not motu-sru.  They may feel differently.
<Hobbsee> ScottK: most stuff in intrepid doesn't build atm, due to the libtools stuff.
<Hobbsee> so i don't know how he'd test it there
<Hobbsee> and most people aren't running it
<ScottK> Well the package relationship stuff isn't urgent.
<ScottK> IMO.
<ScottK> My thought would be do an SRU for the kernel update and deal with packaging changes in a later SRU.
<jdong> *sigh* that virtualbox-ose-modules architecture is a big bloddy carcass
<jdong> Ubuntu really needs to streamline the packaging policy for kernel modules
<ScottK> And the carcass should be recarved and split in the development release.
<jdong> I don't like the idea of packaging changes for it
<jdong> in Hardy that is
<blueyed> bug 226960
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 226960 in virtualbox-ose-modules "Installing module for wrong kernel flavor breaks system (modules missing)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/226960
<blueyed> jdong: it should get included in linux-ubuntu-modules, for Intrepid.
<blueyed> It was too late, when I realized that already.
<jdong> blueyed: IMO the fix at this stage should be v-o-m-$FLAVOR pulls in linux-$FLAVOR instead of linux-image-$ABI-$FLAVOR
<jdong> as a depends
<blueyed> jdong: well, that would work, too, yes. Except that it's not what the user really wants.. (and I cannot see a reason for a Depends here, strictly speaking)
<jdong> demoting the same package to a recommends makes no sense
<jdong> blueyed: sorry lost my wifi link
<jdong> blueyed: what I meant to say, is if a user sees the recommend for l-i-$ABI-$FLAVOR, the next lgoical step is to mark it for install too
<jdong> blueyed: in which case we're back at square one
<jdong> blueyed: ideally we should depend on the linux-$FLAVOR metapackages for whatever kernel we want
<jdong> blueyed: or recommend them
<jdong> blueyed: recommends IMO is inappropriate because vbox is nonfunctional without it.
<blueyed> jdong: yes. I would be fine with changing the depends to the meta package.
<jdong> blueyed: at this point, Depends: linux-$FLAVOR1 | linux-$FLAVOR2 | ..... $FLAVOR_N is most appropriate IMO
<jdong> blueyed: with generic in the front
<jdong> err what am I saying
<jdong> blueyed: I mean vbox-ose-modules-$FLAVOR1...
<jdong> I did find it odd that it suggests -386 first
<blueyed> jdong: the dependency is through virtualbox-ose-modules-$ABI-$FLAVOR - currently on linux-image-$ABI-$FLAVOR, but should be linux-$FLAVOR instead then.
<blueyed> jdong: virtualbox-ose itself only recommends virtualbox-ose-modules (which is a policy violation btw.. it should also depend on a real package)
<blueyed> "-386 first" comes from apt.
<blueyed> Strictly speaking, depending on linux-$FLAVOR does not make sure that the ABI matches (and the module will work - so that it's functional).
<blueyed> jdong: IMHO recommending linux-$FLAVOR seems to be the safest thing..?
<bddebian> Heya gang
<norsetto> oh no! bddebian!
<geser> Hi bddebian
<bddebian> Hi norsetto, geser
 * RoAkSoAx hi all!
<blueyed> jdong: I'll upload the module for the new ABI first. Would be nice, if you could follow up on the dependency issue.
<blueyed> Something else: any idea why "depmod" would search in /lib/modules/2.6.24-12-386, when on a -generic system? (bug 210127)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 210127 in virtualbox-ose-modules "virtualbox-ose-modules-2.6.24-12-generic couldn't find kernel-modules" [Medium,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/210127
<LaserJock> norsetto: ping
<norsetto> LaserJock: pong
<LaserJock> norsetto: SRUs don't have to wait 7 days in -proposed
<LaserJock> they just need 2 positive acks with 0 negatives
<norsetto> LaserJock: ah, so it was changed
<norsetto> LaserJock: good to know
<LaserJock> I think soonish I'm gonna send out a "SRU refresher" email for people :-)
<LaserJock> since the policy has changed quite a bit over the years
<DktrKranz2> LaserJock: is minimun aging period still in place (at least for archive-admins) ?
<jdong> DktrKranz2: it's a side effect of archive admin latency
<jdong> ;-)
<nxvl> 4/me waves
 * nxvl 
<laga> they need to be uploaded to -proposed first ;) can anyone from motu-sru can take a look at bug #221921 and bug #220087? thanks!
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 221921 in mythbuntu-control-centre "SRU: progress bar oddities break creation of diskless clients" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/221921
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 220087 in mythplugins "Some mythplugins packages fail to configure if /var/lib/mythtv NFS mounted" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/220087
<DktrKranz2> jdong: mh... https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ArchiveAdministration#head-1f27dc12ab1558ec21b31ac44e4c86a87a4cd053
<LaserJock> ah hah
<LaserJock> I wondered
<LaserJock> we need to resolve those then
<jdong> DktrKranz2: ah :)
<LaserJock> SRU policy has no such requirement
<DktrKranz2> yes
<jdong> laga: ok the first one (mcc) looks good
<DktrKranz2> probably aging period is a common practice
<LaserJock> DktrKranz2: it used to be the SRU policy
<LaserJock> the archive admin page just isn't up-to-date
<DktrKranz2> ah, cool then :)
<jdong> laga: please use 0ubuntu2.1, not ~hardy1
<jdong> laga: the only time it's possibly appropriate to use ~hardy1 is when introducing a new upstream version as a SRU
<jdong> laga: most of the time it's old_ubuntu_revision.1
 * DktrKranz2 leaves
<norsetto> is anyone on i386 willing to do a short test (install)?
<norsetto> i386 hardy
<tacone> if you don't need someone particulary experienced i may do it
<rexbron> hello, I just got an ack on an sru (bug 221518), would someone be able to upload it to hardy-proposed for me?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 221518 in genpo "broken .menu file" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/221518
<norsetto> tacone: just need someone to try installing a package
<tacone> norsetto: no problem, let's do it.
<norsetto> tacone: in hardy, just do an "apt-get install no-ip"
<tacone> ok
<norsetto> tacone: you should be asked some questions, try to give some sensible answers
<tacone> The following NEW packages will be installed no-ip noip2
<norsetto> tacone: so far so good
<tacone> ok
<tacone> I did it.
<tacone> beware, I have no no-ip accounts :)
<norsetto> tacone: no problem experienced?
<tacone> You have entered an incorrect username -or - an incorrect password for this username.
<tacone> the first is true, I have no account
<tacone> Starting dynamic address update: Can't locate configuration file /var/lib/noip2/noip2.conf. (Try -c). Ending!
<norsetto> tacone: right, but the install was ok and it did not fail
<tacone> no, it didn't fail.
<norsetto> tacone: good, thx, appreciate your help
<tacone> autoconfiguration failed, for obvious reasons.
<tacone> also noip2.conf was not found. don't know whether this is normal or not.
<norsetto> tacone: yes, thats ok
<tacone> ok, good work.
<norsetto> tacone: if you don't want that just remove with an "apt-get remove --purge no-ip noip2"
<tacone> I already did, but thank you anyway :)
<norsetto> tacone: no, thank YOU ;-)
<bbyever> hi
<bbyever> when building bygfoot it gives me this error
<bbyever>  fakeroot debian/rules clean
<bbyever> debian/rules:11: *** missing separator.  Stop.
<bbyever> debuild: fatal error at line 1247:
<bbyever> fakeroot debian/rules clean failed
<bbyever> this is the debian/rules http://paste.ubuntu.com/10291/
<bbyever> could somone help me, please?
<tacone> is it allowed to ask questions about packaging on this channel ? (keep in mind I am currently not involved with motus). If the answer is "no", is there a channel where could  I ask ?
<RoAkSoAx> tacone, you are allowed to ask for question related to packaging
<rexbron> bbyever: the debian/rules file looks like it is been merged (Where did you get the sources?) and you will need to manually fix conflits in the file
<bbyever>  ï»¿rexbron: from dad http://dad.dunnewind.net/bygfoot/
<rexbron> conflicts rather
<bbyever> ï»¿rexbron: the report said something about conflicts, but i dont know how to handle them
<rexbron> bbyever: then you definately need to finish the merge
<rexbron> bbyever: look for merge information on the wiki first
<rexbron> bbyever: if you still have questions, don't hesitate to ask
<bbyever> ï»¿rexbron: ok, thanks
<tacone> general question: digging the docs I rode that setting up a chroot environment is usually preferred. I could chroot easily, but I don't like particulary the idea of messing up with fstab and would preferer setting up a virtual machine (I have a fat computer, so performance is not a problem). Could a VM be acceptable or is it a bad practice for some reason I overlooked ?
<norsetto> bbyever: all you wanted to know about merging and never dared to ask: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/Merging
<bbyever> ï»¿norsetto: thanks
<norsetto> tacone: you mainly need a clean environment which you are not afraid to mess with build-depends, and that it gives you the possibility of checking log files produced during build
<norsetto> tacone: also, you could have unexpected results if you have other packages installed beside the minimal set needed for build, or could miss some vital build-deps
<tacone> norsetto: thank you I was just going to ask about having more than minimal set.
<bbyever> ï»¿rexbron: so which part in debian/rules is making the conflict?
<rexbron> bbyever: look at the parts between the >>>>s and the <<<<<s
<rexbron> they are seperated by a ====
<laga> jdong: thanks, much appreciated. (re the mythbuntu-control-centre SRU)
<norsetto> tacone: personally, I use pbuilder, it gives me all I need, others swear by schroot or similar. Why would a chroot mess up your fstab?
<bbyever> ï»¿rexbron: yes
<jdong> tacone: there's nothing wrong about using a VM, but a pbuilder is much easier and does most of what you want it to do
<tacone> norsetto: ok, I'll check pbuilder. on wiki I primarly saw schroot or (!) dchroot. never mind about fstab, beginner doubts (you need to bind some dirs)
<bbyever> ï»¿rexbron: but i woulnt know how to fix the problem. i dont know what those things do
<tacone> thanks jdong.
<rexbron> bbyever: then why are you trying to perform a merge?
<jdong> tacone: yeah don't look at dchroot/schroot for a beginner's setup
<jdong> tacone: those are nice for doing a massive number of builds (more efficient) but pbuilder is a lot easier to get going
<tacone> jdong: what then ? pbuilder ?
<jdong> no fstab modification
<tacone> oh, nice. ok.
<jdong> tacone: ubuntu-dev-tools has a frontend called "pbuilder-dist"
<DreadKnight> hello
<jdong> for maintaining multiple pbuilders (i.e. Hardy and Intrepid) more easily
<tacone> jdong:  very nice.  installing right now
<bbyever> ï»¿rexbron: warp10 told me i should do a few and this one seemes easy. besides, i want to know how to merge packages that have conflicts
<rexbron> bbyever: ok, read up on the wiki and look at bazaar-vcs.org on the section about resolving conflicts in three-way mergers
<DreadKnight> any MOTUs around?
<bbyever> ï»¿rexbron: ok, thanks
<ScottK> DreadKnight: Yes.
<DreadKnight> ScottK: would be cool if anyone would fix up the plone mess from ubuntu repository...
<DreadKnight> i'm talking about the plone cms   www.plone.org
<ScottK> DreadKnight: I'm familiar with, but don't use plone.
<ScottK> DreadKnight: Guidance in the form of bugs with patches/suggestions would be really helpful.
<DreadKnight> im sure other people complained already on LP a while ago
 * ScottK hasn't particularly looked.
<DreadKnight> recently i can see a package zone-plone3 .. but it says is missing when i try installing it
<DreadKnight> zope-plone3 *
<ScottK> "Please fix this mess" doesn't really give us a lot to go on.
<DreadKnight> there are 2 old packages in the repository, with an old version nobody would use
<ScottK> DreadKnight: Please remember that virtually all MOTU are volunteers, so we are limited in our ability to deal with all the packages in the repository.
<DreadKnight> i know
<DreadKnight> this is the latest plone https://edge.launchpad.net/plone/3.1/3.1.1
<DreadKnight> it's a goal for me for this year to become MOTU ^^
<ScottK> Great.
<DreadKnight> still working on it
<coppro> what do you do about an upstream library without a SONAME
<coppro> do I have to add one myself?
<ScottK> DreadKnight: If you can figure solutions to getting plone is shape for Intrepid, you can get them sponsored and that will help.
<DreadKnight> ScottK: a resync with debian will do it anyway xD
<ScottK> Perfect. Then the next question is how to get Hardy fixed.
<durapraxis> Hi, everyone. Can anyone please tell me how can I store symbolic links in a .deb package?
<coppro> use dh_link in your rules file
<bbyever> ï»¿rexbron: uhh im not understanding anything, i think i'll just wait till warp10 get online to ask him...
<rexbron> bbyever: you understand the concept of a merge correct?
<bbyever> ï»¿rexbron: yes
<rexbron> bbyever: then what part are you having difficulty with?
<bbyever> ï»¿rexbron: fixing the conflicts. i dont understand how its making a conflict nor how to fix it
<blueyed> I've accidently uploaded version 24.1 to intrepid instead of hardy-proposed. Should I use 24.0.1 for the correct upload (to -proposed)? Or 24.1~hardy1?
<ScottK> blue
<ScottK> blueyed: 24.0.1.
<ScottK> blueyed: The ~hardy1 versioning would be appropriate for backports.
<durapraxis> coppro: tks. When I do it with dh_link, are they actually created on my build directory, or just created on the binary .deb file, when I do the package?
<blueyed> Thanks, ScottK
<bbyever> ï»¿rexbron: ok so i just commented all the lines with >>>>> <<<<< ==== and those in between and it built alright, was that ok or it the merge going to be wrong?
<rexbron> bbyever: that is not correct, you need to resolve the conflict by choosing one or the other based on looking at the changelog to see why there was a change
<bbyever> ï»¿rexbron: ah ok
<rexbron> bbyever: if there is a good reason for ubuntu making a change, you "merge it" by manually incorperating the change into the new ubuntu package
<rexbron> by the change I mean the new debian version
<bbyever> ï»¿rexbron: ah ok, i understand now
<rexbron> :)
<bbyever> ï»¿rexbron: thanks!
<rexbron> bbyever: no problem, if you have any other questions, don't be afraid to just ask them in the channel. Any idling motus will pick it up
<bbyever> ok
<slytherin> Hi all, need an advice. I had uploaded a package to revu in hardy cycle but didn't work on it much after December. I am now finishing it for intrepid and will be changing name of source package to match the upstream tarball. How can I ask to discard old package on revu?
<ScottK> slytherin: Just archive it and don't worry.
<slytherin> ScottK: I think it is already archived. If I upload the package bu changing source name it will be a separate package right?
<RainCT> slytherin: yes
<slytherin> thanks
<slytherin> is there any documentation about merge-o-matic. I mean how can we do merges with help of MOM?
<bbyever> ï»¿slytherin: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/Merging
<kirkland> zul: I'm working on merging php5...  is it correct for me to create a bug in launchpad to associate with this work?
<zul> what do you mean?
<kirkland> zul: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/Merging
<kirkland> zul: "File a merge bug"
<zul> kirkland: nah...its the begining of the release dont worry about it
<kirkland> zul: k
<RainCT> kirkland: leave a comment on DaD saying that you're working on it, though
<ScottK> kirkland: php5 is in Main, right?
<LaserJock> when are DaD and MoM getting merged?
<ScottK> LaserJock: I understand it's being worked on now.  No idea of schedule.
<RainCT> LaserJock: it's in progress :P
<LaserJock> so RSN .. :-)
<kirkland> ScottK: yes, main.
<kirkland> RainCT: okay
<ScottK> kirkland: Most core-dev's don't look at DaD, so a commet there won't help much.
<Adri2000> LaserJock: when Keybuk merges the patches :)
<LaserJock> so it's set to go?
<Adri2000> yeah, the patch have been ready for a while now, they just need to be reviewed and committed to trunk
<Adri2000> patches*
<RainCT> Adri2000: well, the redesign isn't finished yet
<Adri2000> sure, but I think that once the comments feature is in MoM, we don't have any strong reason to keep DaD running. even if the new design comes a bit later
<RainCT> Adri2000: true :)
<RainCT> Adri2000: (just wanted to ensure that you know that it's not ready.. although you probably already knew that)
<Adri2000> yep :)
<slytherin> when I do grab-merge.sh lucene2, why does it create a source directory lucene2-2.3.1+ds1-1ubuntu1? Shouldn't it be lucene2-2.3.1+ds1?
<RoAkSoAx> slytherin, i believe it create it like that because you are going to merge the from debian and you will create an ubuntu source after making the changes
<ScottK> slytherin: IIRC it does that whenever a merge has confilcts.
<slytherin> ScottK: What should be next step once I resolved all conflicts and updated changelog accordingly? should I rename the directory and then do debuild -S -sa?
<RoAkSoAx> slytherin, i think you just do debuild -S .. then the .dsc will be generated and you will have to create the debdiff between the newer debian version (lucene2-2.3.1+ds1.dsc) and the just generated ubuntu version (lucene2-2.3.1+ds1-1ubuntu1.dsc)...
<bbyever> ï»¿slytherin: you also need one between old ubuntu and new ubuntu, afaik
<slytherin> hmm, let's see what happens
<Adri2000> a debian current / ubuntu candidate debdiff is enough
<RoAkSoAx> nxvl, help me with virt-viewer
<RoAkSoAx> my new debian/control http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/10317/
<RoAkSoAx> and my changelog  http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/10316/
<rexbron> Hey, if it has not been do so already (and I don't think it has as I did not get a responce on my last request), could I get someone to do an upload to hardy-proposed. Already have the SRU ack. Bug 221518
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 221518 in genpo "broken .menu file" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/221518
<nxvl> RoAkSoAx: please include the changelos from last merge until the new one
<RoAkSoAx> nxvl, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/10318/
<nxvl> rexbron: suscribe motu-sru and universe sponsors to the bug report
<nxvl> soren: around?
<rexbron> motu-sru has already been subscribed, so I'll add uus
<soren> nxvl: Yup.
<nxvl> soren: can you help RoAkSoAx merging virt-viewer please
<nxvl> soren: maybe you have some plans for it
<soren> Not in particular.
<soren> That's the problem?
<soren> Er..
<soren> I mean: What's the problem?
<nxvl> RoAkSoAx: soren is the virtualization guru
<RoAkSoAx> hi soren i tried to merge it and this would be my changelog: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/10318/ and this my new debian/control: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/10317/...
<RoAkSoAx> is it ok?
<RoAkSoAx> ok thanks nxvl :D
 * soren looks
<soren> RoAkSoAx: And the rest of the merge is still fine?
<RoAkSoAx> soren, seems like, the REPORT file only showed my conflicts in debian/control
<soren> RoAkSoAx: I mean... The rest of what MoM did works as intended?
<RoAkSoAx> soren, MoM REPORT only showed conflict there in debian/control
<soren> RoAkSoAx: That doesn't mean that the package will build correctly.
<kirkland> zul: okay, i've got php5 merged, build succeeded, ready for your review/sponsorship
<soren> RoAkSoAx: Did you build the package?
<RoAkSoAx> soren, not yet should I do it now?
<RoAkSoAx> (i'm just learning by the way =) )
<soren> RoAkSoAx: Yes. That should be the first thing you try when you think you've finished the merge.
<RoAkSoAx> soren, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/10321/
<nxvl> soren: did you know what graphical libraries uses virt-manager?
<nxvl> soren: as in qt, gtk, etc..
<soren> RoAkSoAx: debuild -S only builds the source package.
<soren> RoAkSoAx: What you want to do is try to build the binary package.
<soren> RoAkSoAx: Preferably in a clean environment (using either pbuilder or sbuild).
<nxvl> soren: yep, but with the source package you can use pbuilder or a chroot environment, to use intrepid's build-deps
<RoAkSoAx> like this?: sudo pbuilder build virt-viewer_0.0.3-2ubuntu1.dsc
<soren> RoAkSoAx: If you already have pbuilder set up, then yes, that looks about right :)
<nxvl> RoAkSoAx: use pbuilder-dist
<nxvl> RoAkSoAx: first pbuilder-dist intrepid create
<soren> nxvl: virt-manager used gtk indirectly. All of its interface is done using glade.
<soren> Ah, right.
<soren> I've not used pbuilder for a while :/
<nxvl> soren: sbuild?
<RoAkSoAx> i created it with: sudo pbuilder create --distribution intrepid --othermirror "deb http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu intrepid universe multiverse"
<nxvl> mmm
<nxvl> that will work
<nxvl> but with pbuilder it's easy to manage several distributions
<soren> nxvl: The same system as the buildd's use. It's kind of like pbuilder, just different :)
<RoAkSoAx> yeah i created it the other day, how to clean it?? or should i upgrade it first?
<nxvl> soren: heh, i know it, i was asking if you use sbuild
<nxvl> soren: since you said you don't use pbuilder
<soren> nxvl: Oh, right. :)
<soren> nxvl: I somehow thought that I had said "I use sbuild instead of pbuilder" or something. I must be tired. :)
<nxvl> heh
<RoAkSoAx> soren, nxvl : seems it is ok: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/10322/
<nxvl> soren: some time it happend
<nxvl> soren: it is 10 pm out there, isn't it?
<RoAkSoAx> now it is downloading the required packages
<nxvl> heh
<nxvl> Y and wait
<nxvl> :D
<soren> nxvl: 22:35 now.
<RoAkSoAx> here it's 3.35
<nxvl> yep, 7 hours more than here
<nxvl> soren: so you wont have the timezone choke in Prague
<nxvl> shock*
<soren> nxvl: I don't get that anyway.
<nxvl> soren: huh?
<soren> nxvl: My body just somehow doesn't give a hoot which timezone it's in.
<nxvl> oh! ok
<nxvl> i haven't been in a tz change before
<geser> soren: nice feature :)
<nxvl> and my body lives in the oposite tz, so i don't think i will have any problem
<nxvl> :P
<RoAkSoAx> nxvl, you will be sleepy during the UDS :P
<soren> nxvl: I went to Bali last Autumn. That's a 13 hours difference. No problem. When I came back, I think I went to bed a bit early the first night, but that might just as well have been from traveling fro 20 hours.
<nxvl> soren: yes, the long trip helps
<nxvl> i will arrive Prague at night
<nxvl> so, i will go to have some beers and then to sleep
<nxvl> :P
<nxvl> soren: are you going for FOSS Camp?
<soren> nxvl: Yeah.
<nxvl> soren: when are you going to arrive?
<soren> nxvl: May 15th 14:50.
<nxvl> i will arrive May 15th at night
<nxvl> so wait meto start with the beers!
<nxvl> or leave a note on the hotel so i can find you
<nxvl> :D
<soren> nxvl: :) We'll figure it out.
<soren> RoAkSoAx: Any luck?
<RoAkSoAx> soren, still downloading the required packages
<soren> RoAkSoAx: Ok :)
<nxvl> soren: the bandwith in Peru isn't the best it could
<nxvl> :P
<soren> nxvl: I can imagine. :) How much bandwidth do you usually get?
<RoAkSoAx> soren, for 500kbps it is like 40 USD
<soren> :(
<nxvl> here i have 1.5 Mbps
<nxvl> at home 1 Mbps
<nxvl> RoAkSoAx: call you ISP, i pay 30 - 35 $ for 1Mbps
<RoAkSoAx> nxvl, really?? Telmex??
<nxvl> nop
<nxvl> tdp
<RoAkSoAx> tdp for 500kbps is S/110 almost 40USD
<nxvl> oh yes!
<nxvl> :P
<nxvl> i pay 50 $, you are right
<nxvl> :P
<RoAkSoAx> soren, seems it has build successfully
<RoAkSoAx> soren, this is the end of the building process: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/10337/
<soren> RoAkSoAx: Great.
<RoAkSoAx> soren, so i just file the bug in LP and create the debdiff?
<soren> RoAkSoAx: Have you had merges..
<soren> Right, that was exactly what I was going to ask you to do :)
<RoAkSoAx> soren, should i suscribe it to u-u-s?
<RoAkSoAx> too?
 * ajmitch should learn how to do merges again
<nxvl> ajmitch: merges is the funniest and easy part of UD
<RoAkSoAx> nxvl, not the first merge :P
<nxvl> RoAkSoAx: heh, not, the firsts ones not
<nxvl> :P
<RoAkSoAx> nxvl, but they are addicting :P
<nxvl> yep
<nxvl> thay are
<nxvl> as i always said
<nxvl> FOSS is like drugs
<nxvl> once you get in, yo don't stop until you can't go out
<nxvl> :D
<RainCT> good night
<ajmitch> nxvl: oh it's not that hard to escape
<nxvl> ajmitch: if you try to escape, you always want to came back again
<zul> kirkland: cool put it up somewhere so I can have a look and Ill do it when my son goes to sleep
<kirkland> zul: what do you want?  just the debdiff btw the .dsc's?
<kirkland> zul: or do you want my whole tree?
<zul> debdiff would be good but the whole tree would be better so I can upload it
<kirkland> zul: okay, i'm sanity checking the debdiff at the moment
<zul> ok
<RoAkSoAx> soren, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/virt-viewer/+bug/227073 . Should i change the status to "confirmed" and suscribe it to u-u-s?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 227073 in virt-viewer "Please merge virt-viewer 0.0.3-2 from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,New]
<nxvl> RoAkSoAx: yup
<tacone> how long should pbuilder take to create a basic env ? it's taking ages (1 hour at least)
<kirkland> zul: chinstrap:~kirkland/php5.intrepid/
<skorgu> Hey the gmetad package recommends ganglia-webfrontend which doesn't exist afaics. There doesn't seem to be a package for the php parts of ganglia at all. Hardy, I checked i386 and x86_64.
<LaserJock> tacone: might depend on how hard hit the archive is
<LaserJock> tacone: what release are you building a pbuilder for?
<tacone> LaserJock: nice point. I guess it's sinking in the deeps then :)
<tacone> LaserJock: I am following a wiki page. I did  sudo pbuilder create
<POX_> does the dak equivalent in Ubuntu support bz2 in .debs ?
<POX_> my jinja package was just rejected and I don't know why (it wasn't even me who uploaded it, it was sparc build daemon)
<ScottK> POX_: No.  It doesn't.
<POX_> can you upgrate to new dak or are you using something else?
<POX_> upgrade
<tacone> LaserJock: anyway it's building hardy.
<ScottK> POX_: No.  It's part of Launchpad.  The only think still using dak in Ubuntu is -security.
<LaserJock> tacone: yeah, it can take quite some time. I'm currently doing Intrepid and it's also taking forever
<POX_> almost all of my packages are now compressed with bz2
<ScottK> POX_: Was this a sync from Debian that blew up?
<ajmitch> ScottK: I'm fairly sure they migrated that as well, and that soyuz supports bzip2 compression on binary packages
<POX_> I thnink so, ues
<POX_> yes
<ajmitch> not so sure on bzip2 for source
<ScottK> ajmitch: OK.  So maybe I'm wrong then.
<tacone> LaserJock: ok, TheMuso
<tacone> err
<tacone> ok, thanks.
<ScottK> wgrant: ^^^ ?
<ScottK> wgrant: Is soyuz working with .bz2 compressed source packages these days?
<wgrant> Mm?
<wgrant> Ah.
<wgrant> No.
<POX_> rejection message could be a little bit more verbose (I have "None" :)
<wgrant> POX_: File a bug. It might be fixed at some point.
<POX_> wgrant, ScottK: not source packages, binary ones
<crimsun> LaserJock: creation will likely fail due to base-files, e2fsprogs, and util-linux.
<POX_> I will upload lzma source packages after Lenny release
<ajmitch> crimsun: even of hardy?
<LaserJock> crimsun: I saw reports that it was working so I thought I'd give it a shot
<crimsun> ajmitch: no, just referring to his intrepid bit
<LaserJock> I can't do a dist-upgrade so might as well try something else
<crimsun> LaserJock: I've not tried massaging it, so it may well be forceable.
<wgrant> POX_: Oh, Soyuz does do lzma for binaries.
 * ajmitch hasn't even touched intrepid yet
<wgrant> So I presume it does bz2.
<crimsun> bah, the great soname bump love.  yay, alsa-lib.  :-(
<POX_> ok, so what does "Rejected: None" mean?
<LaserJock> it handles bz2 binaries I"m pretty sure
<ajmitch> POX_: it means that soyuz is being funny & that you should probably file a bug on it
<LaserJock> as the ubuntu-docs package builds bz2 .debs I'm pretty sure
<ajmitch> probably launchpad.net/soyuz/+bugs
<sebner> gn8 folks
<mtaylor> hey all - I'm looking for someone from motu-sru who can give me an opinion on if something is a "severe regression" or not
<LaserJock> mtaylor: what bug?
<wgrant> !ask
<ubottu> Please don't ask to ask a question, ask the question (all on ONE line, so others can read and follow it easily). If anyone knows the answer they will most likely answer. :-)
<mtaylor> LaserJock: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/debian/+source/genshi/+bug/226285
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 226285 in genshi "Due to packaging changes, Genshi no longer works with TurboGears" [Unknown,Fix committed]
<ajmitch> hm
<mtaylor> LaserJock: it was due to a dpatch added upstream by debian - I've got the patch reverted upstream
<ajmitch> if it completely breaks genshi as you say, then I'd say it's a severe enough regression
<LaserJock> mtaylor: off-hand it certainly looks SRU-worthy
<mtaylor> LaserJock, ajmitch: ok... I think that's enough at least to start it through the SRU process
<LaserJock> mtaylor: I'll need a test case that shows how to test that it breaks/works
<mtaylor> LaserJock: ok. will do
<LaserJock> mtaylor: thanks for working on it
<mtaylor> LaserJock: my pleasure!
<LaserJock> anybody know of a good way to find out what packages are installed by default on a server install?
<mathiaz> LaserJock: a server install pulls in ubuntu-standard.
<mathiaz> LaserJock: it uses -server as the kernel flavour and won't install any langage pack.
<LaserJock> yeah
<crimsun> http://releases.ubuntu.com/8.04/ubuntu-8.04-server-i386.list ?
<LaserJock> what I'm trying to do is "roll back" to a basically fresh install
<LaserJock> I installed xubuntu-desktop to get some setup tools
<LaserJock> but I'd like to try to go back a bit
<mathiaz> LaserJock: if you remove xubuntu-desktop and then autoremove, you should get what you want
<LaserJock> well, it didn't quite work that way
<LaserJock> I can't remember what all I did though
<LaserJock> apt-get remove libgnome2-0 gets rid of a lot
<mtaylor> LaserJock: you could debootstrap into a chroot, then do dpkg --get-selections in the chroot
<mtaylor> and dpkg --set-selections outside of the chroot
<mtaylor> then apt-get dselect-upgrade
<LaserJock> yeah, that's probably more than what I want to do
<LaserJock> but I might end up doing that
#ubuntu-motu 2008-05-06
<no0tic> hi everyone :) I would like to start contributing in MOTU, I've already read on the wiki but it's not clear how to _really_ start contributing :)
<no0tic> I would like to initially focus on packaging new revisions of some packages like rtorrent and irssi, for example, but I'm also willing to help in any other type of package work
<no0tic> ok, irssi is in main :)
<coppro> if it's in main, don't bother
<mathiaz> no0tic: we're currently merging packages from Debian unstable in Ubuntu
<mathiaz> no0tic: have a look at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/Merging
<no0tic> ok I'm reading, thanks
<ScottK> Even more important right now is finding changes that can be sent back to Debian so maybe later in the release cycle we can sync from Debian.
<no0tic> utnubu? :)
<ScottK> Generally I find filing bugs with patches for the relevant changes works best.
<ScottK> The trick is knowing which are relevant and which are not.
<ScottK> Feel free to ask if you're uncertain.
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, i could help you with merges im learning too and i quite understand them xD
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, nice!
<no0tic> I really don't know where to start from :)
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, ok let's see... to merge what you need first is to obtain the grab-merge.sh script: http://merges.ubuntu.com/grab-merge.sh
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, done!
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, then install all the packaging tools listed here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Complete because after doing all necessary changes, we might need test if the package builds
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, already done previously ;)
<LaserJock> RoAkSoAx: make that, "we will always need to test if the package builds" :-)
<LaserJock> even if it's a sync
<RoAkSoAx> ok you will also need debootstrap to create a chroot enviroment
<RoAkSoAx> LaserJock, ok :)
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, so then... first we will have to obtain a package to merge. we will try with a package i just merged today... it is called virt-viewer
<RoAkSoAx> note that all packages needed to be merge (or might need to be synced) are here: http://merges.ubuntu.com/universe.html or here: http://dad.dunnewind.net/universe.php
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, yes, I was staring at that page :)
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, so create a work dir, for example: mkdir virt-viewer
<RoAkSoAx> cd virt-viewer
<RoAkSoAx> and then: ../grab-merge.sh virt-viewer
<no0tic> ok
<RoAkSoAx> it will download all the necessary packages
<cheatr> whois cheatr
<coppro> you
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, is the downloading process finished?
<cheatr> coppro: Yeah, wrong window, lol
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, yes
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, ok, so if you see. there is a file named REPORT that will show us where are the conflicts that we will need to fix
<no0tic> ok, I'll read it
<RoAkSoAx> in the section conflicts it will show us that there are conflicts in  C  debian/control
<no0tic> found
<RoAkSoAx> ok, so we have to check that file
<RoAkSoAx> first we enter the package directory
<RoAkSoAx> cd virt-viewer-0.0.3-2ubuntu1
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, I know something of basic commands ;)
<RoAkSoAx> and we open the file: vim debian/control
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, and something of packages structure
<RoAkSoAx> hahaha no0tic yeah i know.. but i'm used to help newbies :P
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, eheh :)
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, ok, I'm in, anyway :)
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, I can read conflicts :)
<no0tic> <<<<<<<<<<<< and >>>>>>>>>>>>>> lines :)
<RoAkSoAx> yep... so, what it is telling us is that the conflicts are referred basically to Build-depends
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, changes in mantainer build-depends and standard version
<RoAkSoAx> yep
<RoAkSoAx> so first of all, we are going to check the changelog
<no0tic> it seems it no longer depends on libgtk2.0-dev, dpatch, libxen3-dev
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, nope, the first fields are ubuntu related, and the parts of below are the debian related
<RoAkSoAx> so we have to see the changelog to understand what changes were done when they were merged the last time
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, ok, so on debian it doesn't depend on those
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, ok
<RoAkSoAx> yep
<no0tic> Changelog or debian/changelog ?
<RoAkSoAx> yep
<no0tic> I suppose the latter
<RoAkSoAx> i use dch -e
<no0tic> done
<RoAkSoAx> check the last merge, that it was done for hardy and you'll see that they added a package to build depends
<no0tic> a second
<no0tic> build depend on recent libgtk-vnc (>= 0.3.4)
<no0tic> debian/control: depend on gtk that has gtk_widget_is_composited
<RoAkSoAx> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/10358/
<RoAkSoAx> there
<no0tic> ok
<no0tic> ok last hardy change
<RoAkSoAx> so if you can see the ubuntu version aAdd libxen3-dev to Build-Depends.
<no0tic> yes
<Laney> Has anyone had/fixed an error about libc6 when creating an Intrepid pbuilder?
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, but then it seems that debian has synced the package back, no?
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, they released a new upstream version
<RoAkSoAx> but still there are changes between ubuntu and debian packages since ubuntu might not have the same names
<no0tic> ok
<RoAkSoAx> so, we've seen the changelog and it is telling us that build-depends have been modified in relation to debian
<RoAkSoAx> so we are confirming that those changes showed in debian control were added in ubuntu and might remain like that
<RoAkSoAx> because we can use debian changes, ubuntu changes or combine them
<RoAkSoAx> so, to know further we have to check the differences between the older ubuntu version, and the older debian version, we do this in : ../virt-viewer_0.0.2-1ubuntu1.patch
<RoAkSoAx> you can open it with any editor you like
<RoAkSoAx> i use gedit cuz it shows it in colors and stuff
<RoAkSoAx> so in hat file we go to the debian/control part
<no0tic> ok
<RoAkSoAx> in that file, debian/control shows this: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/10361/
<no0tic> yes, I found it in red :)
<no0tic> I use kde :P
<RoAkSoAx> we now there that the maintainer , and original maintainer changed
<RoAkSoAx> as well as build-depends
<RoAkSoAx> and we can see that ubuntu added 2 new packages: dpatch, libxen3-dev
<no0tic> yes, we already knew that :) now we are here to fix things, I suppose
<RoAkSoAx> yeah we already new that but we should verify it in that .patch file because it will show the exact changes
<no0tic> ok
<RoAkSoAx> so now, we have to verify what has changed in the newer debian version against the older debian version
<RoAkSoAx> so we open ../virt-viewer_0.0.3-2.patch
<RoAkSoAx> go to the debian/control part
<RoAkSoAx> and see that the only thing that has changed is libgtk-vnc-1.0-dev (>= 0.3.4)
<RoAkSoAx> right?
<no0tic> yes
<RoAkSoAx> and we also see that standards version has changed from 7.3.2 to 7.3.3
<RoAkSoAx> 3.7.3*
<RoAkSoAx> 3.7.2*
<no0tic> sorry, I'm helping folks on #ubuntu-it in the meanwhile :)
<no0tic> yes
<no0tic> ok, here I am
<RoAkSoAx> ok, so if we check the changelog again, or the other .patch file (of the older version) we will see that ubuntu already made the change of standards version from 3.7.2 to 3.7.3 so we keep it like that
<RoAkSoAx> and now, in the newer debian version, they changed libgtk-vnc-1.0-dev (>= 0.3.4)
<RoAkSoAx> so, comparing the oldes ubuntu version with this newer debian version, we can see that the only thing that changed in debian is libgtk-vnc-1.0-dev (>= 0.3.4)
<RoAkSoAx> and since we are merging we should check that all packages are the same in the ubuntu repos
<LaserJock> oh?
<RoAkSoAx> we will find that they are... so.. since debian is the newer version we will have to use the build-depends of this newer debian version, but we have to add the changes made in the ubuntu older version
<no0tic> ok
<RoAkSoAx> so our build depends will look like: Build-Depends: cdbs, debhelper (>= 5), autotools-dev, libvirt-dev, libgtk-vnc-1.0-dev (>= 0.3.4), libxml2-dev, libgtk2.0-dev (>= 2.10), dpatch, libxen3-dev
<RoAkSoAx> Standards-Version: 3.7.3
<no0tic> LaserJock, too much mess?
<LaserJock> I'm trying to follow all this :-)
<RoAkSoAx> note that we are adding:  dpatch, libxen3-dev were added to the build depends
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, yes, this is written in the changelogs
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, nope, note yet
<RoAkSoAx> just keep aside the build-depends
<no0tic> Add libxen3-dev to Build-Depends.
<no0tic> anyway
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, we dont take note of that because it was already added in the older ubuntu version. so it is on the changelog
<RoAkSoAx> and in the changelog we only write changes in UBuntu and not changes in debian
<no0tic> ok
<no0tic> understood
<RoAkSoAx> so, after knowing how our build depends are going to be, we have to make the change in debian/control and it will look like this: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/10363/
<no0tic> ok
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, I'm editing it
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, libgtk2.0-dev changed too
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, it depends on 2.10 a least
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, and previously didn't
<RoAkSoAx> yep!
<RoAkSoAx> but we don't put that as a change in the changelog because it is not a Ubuntu specific change.. it is debian's
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, yes, but we need to change it on our new build-depends
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, yes, we are taking the build-deps of the .patch file of the newer debian version
<RoAkSoAx> and adding the changes made by ubuntu in the older version
<RoAkSoAx> i mean, adding dpatch, libxen3-dev
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, ok
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, now I've really understood :)
<RoAkSoAx> ok, so the debian/control file is done, with the new build-depends
<RoAkSoAx> so, now we head up to the changelog
<RoAkSoAx> dch -e
<no0tic> ok, what we need to put in there?
<RoAkSoAx> in the changelog we only put the Ubuntu specific changes...
<brica1> can anyone point me in the right direction if i'd like to contribute to dh-make-perl?
<RoAkSoAx> here we usually put the changes done before and that they remain and the new changes we've made
<RoAkSoAx> we haven't made any new changes
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, so add dpatch to build-depends and new standard-version ?
<LaserJock> brica1: what kind of thing do you want to contribute?
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, not really, because those changes were made in a previous Ubuntu version... check part of the log: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/10366/
<RoAkSoAx> in that log, in the merge done for hardy, specifies that tey added libxen3-dev  to build-depends
<RoAkSoAx> so we havent really made a change, we just used the changes made by debian in the newer version and the changes made by ubuntu in the older versio
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, ok
<RoAkSoAx> and since in the changelog we put the changes made before+ changes made now... we just copy the changelog of the merge done for hardy
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, lines for 32 to 34 in your last paste
<RoAkSoAx> yep
<RoAkSoAx> note here: virt-viewer (0.0.3-2ubuntu1) intrepid; urgency=low
<RoAkSoAx> we have to change that hardy after the ) to intrepid
<no0tic> yes.. I have hardy :)
<RoAkSoAx> and verify if the ubuntu version is correct
<no0tic> I was about to ask :)
<brica1> LaserJock: I'm getting some warnings when using it, so i'd like to fix those. perhaps clean the code up where appropriate (i'm heavy into perl, check my cpan dir (cpanid: BRICAS))
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, it doesn't matter, we are marging a package for intrepid, so change that to intrepid
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, ok, done
<RoAkSoAx> ok so we've done with the changes
<RoAkSoAx> now we have to create the source package
<RoAkSoAx> but before, do you have any questions or have u missunderstood something or is ther anuything you don't understand?
<no0tic> I'm saving it in debian/changelog, ok
<LaserJock> brica1: I think you're best off to talk with the Debian maintainer then. see http://packages.qa.debian.org/d/dh-make-perl.html
<no0tic> no, I'm quite sure of what arewe doing :)
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, does you chanelo added your name and email?
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, yes, I modified it to the correct one
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, and yes, I have a gpg key associated with it
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, Gabriele Postorino <no0tic@ubuntu.com>
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, ok, so to avoid modifying it by hand, we can do this in $home/.bashrc
<RoAkSoAx> export DEBFULLNAME='Andres Rodriguez'
<RoAkSoAx> export DEBEMAIL='andreserl@ubuntu-pe.org'
<RoAkSoAx> export GPGKEY=F7B278D7
<RoAkSoAx> i put that at the end of .bashrc
<bricas> woops. got disconnected.
<RoAkSoAx> so that when i do dch -e it will automatically change it
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, do that and then: source $HOME/.bashrc to get the variables loaded (this is done just the first time we are adding them to the file cuz it will save us from rebooting)
<bricas> LaserJock: sorry, i didn't catch anything after my last message
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, already done :P
<RoAkSoAx> ok cool, so we have to build the source
<RoAkSoAx> for that we do: debuild -S
<no0tic> -S is single binary, right?
<no0tic> ah no, source package :)
<RoAkSoAx> -S is source
<RoAkSoAx> yep
<RoAkSoAx> doing that will create ../virt-viewer_0.0.3-2ubuntu1.dsc
<no0tic> done
<RoAkSoAx> ok, so what we are supposed to do next is to create the debdiff and build the package to see it it builds ok.
<RoAkSoAx> we will use the debdiff to updload it when we report the merge in LP
<no0tic> right
<LaserJock> brica1: I think you're best off to talk with the Debian maintainer then. see http://packages.qa.debian.org/d/dh-make-perl.html
<RoAkSoAx> and we have to build the source package to make sure it will work....
<RoAkSoAx> so for that we have to create a pbuilder environment but it will take long, so first we are going to create the debdiff
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, I think I already have a pbuilder environment, for hardy
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, let me see
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, but since the merge is for intrepid, we need a pbuilder for intrepid
<RoAkSoAx> that is why we changed our changelog from hardy to intrepid
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, ahah, right :D
<RoAkSoAx> so it doesn't really matter if we build the binary after we created the debdiff
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, can we start the creation of the pbluider environment while we create the debdiff?
<RoAkSoAx> yes
<RoAkSoAx> sudo pbuilder create --distribution intrepid --othermirror "deb http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu intrepid universe multiverse"
<RoAkSoAx> so meanwhile... we can create the debdiff
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, we do it like this: debdiff  virt-viewer_0.0.3-2.dsc virt-viewer_0.0.3-2ubuntu1.dsc >  virt-viewer_0.0.3-2ubuntu1.debdiff
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, will 1GB be enough? :)
<RoAkSoAx> RoAkSoAx, don't really know, i didn't give it size... it will install other 125MB of packages when trying to build
<LaserJock> a pbuilder tarball is ~ 100MB
<no0tic> ok
<LaserJock> but when you're actually building you need enough space for it to unpack and build the package
<no0tic> I'm buying a larger laptop disc during this week :)
<LaserJock> i.e. you won't be building OpenOffice on there
<RoAkSoAx> the thing is that we are only creating the pbuilder to see if the packages builds succesfully without errors
<no0tic> LaserJock, I have enough space on another partition, not under / ...
<bricas> LaserJock: okay. tanks!
<bricas> urr thanks
<LaserJock> no0tic: most packages should be fine
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, ok, debdiff created
<LaserJock> OpenOffice takes something like 4GB to build
<no0tic> eheh
<LaserJock> and something like 20hrs
<LaserJock> so you don't want to do that anyway ;-)
<LaserJock> RoAkSoAx: you gonna pastebin the debdiff?
<no0tic> 109 lines.. :)
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, so now we have to see if there are some things that need to be filtered from the debdiff, we do: lsdiff file.debdiff
<RoAkSoAx> if there apperas some *.po files we should filter them
<RoAkSoAx> but they don't
<no0tic> the don't :)
<no0tic> virt-viewer-0.0.3/debian/patches/01_ctrl-alt-f9.dpatch
<RoAkSoAx> so our .debdiff is ready to be uploaded after we report the bug
<no0tic> this is a change made in ubuntu, am I right?
<RoAkSoAx> yeah we have to filter .po or .EX files, but they don't apper
<no0tic> ok
<RoAkSoAx> but, now we have to see if it builds without errors
<no0tic> indeed
<kirkland> zul: let me take a look
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, I'll ping you when pbuilder environment is created
<zul> kirkland: sure...im guessting the strotime patch did since its a new version but you should mention it in your changelog though
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, ok so let's imagine that it builded succesfully we now have to report a but like mine: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/virt-viewer/+bug/227073
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 227073 in virt-viewer "Please merge virt-viewer 0.0.3-2 from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<RoAkSoAx> after reporting the bug you can attacht the debdiff
<no0tic> k
<RoAkSoAx> and wait for someone to review it.. then change status to confirmed and suscribe it to u-u-s
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, you need to change it to confirmed?
<LaserJock> I would leave it as New
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, or who reviews it will do?
<LaserJock> for a merge it doesn't really matter
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, yeah if someone reviews it and says it is ok, you need to change status to confirmed and suscribes it to u-u-s
<no0tic> u-u-s ? ubuntu-universe-s?
<RoAkSoAx> sponsors
<LaserJock> no0tic: those are the MOTUs who'll actually upload your package
<RoAkSoAx> yep
<no0tic> LaserJock, ok
<no0tic> what groups do I need to join?
<LaserJock> you don't need to join any particular one
<no0tic> I only joined ubuntu-bugs
<LaserJock> you are good to go right now
<no0tic> ok
<no0tic> LaserJock, mailing lists to subscribe to?
<RoAkSoAx> -motu and -motu-mentors maybe
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, im only suscribed to motu i think...
<RoAkSoAx> and virt-viewer was my sencond merge
<RoAkSoAx> xD
<LaserJock> no0tic: and if you aren't already you should subscribe to ubuntu-devel-announce
<LaserJock> and ubuntu-devel (or ubuntu-devel-discuss) if you want
<kirkland> zul: does not look like the 64bit time patch made it upstream here
<kirkland> zul: i mean, not into the 5.2.5 version
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, thanks a lot
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, no prob :)
<no0tic> can I pick a package from the list?
<no0tic> contact the previous uploader and start working?
<LaserJock> no0tic: it's good to also first look on Launchpad to make sure there isn't already a merge/sync bug filed
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, yeah pick a package that you like and if you are lucky you will have one that need changes in debian/control
<no0tic> LaserJock, yes
<RoAkSoAx> some packages are easier , some are harder
<sommer> hey all, I'm trying to use a ppa in pbuilder, but for some reason its not using the packages
<no0tic> ok, found a package
<sommer> I copied my sources.list into /etc/pbuilder and did pbuilder --override-config
<no0tic> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/kid3 http://merges.ubuntu.com/k/kid3/REPORT
<no0tic> no merge bugs in launchpad, should I contact previous uploader now?
<sommer> just wondering if I've missing anything?
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, if you wan't... you can contact him and ask him to help you with it if there is something you don't know how to do
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, ok, I know him very well :)
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, I saw kid3 in hardy is version 0.10 and in sid is 1.0 :)
<RoAkSoAx> so go for it and try to merge it
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, and there aren't any conflicts
<RoAkSoAx> if there aren't conflics it may be a sync
<cheatr> RoAkSoAx: I just wanted to thank you for this nice guide on how to merge packages. I've been silently watching and following along. I've just saved a copy of the chat transcript and I am about to attempt a merge on my own
<kirkland> zul: okay, looks like i need to add a few things to the changelog
<RoAkSoAx> cheatr, haha you are welcom, it was my second merge :D you can also check this done in the OpenWeek by nxvl: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/openweekhardy/PackageMerging
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, if there aren't conflics might be a sync... which is much easier
<LaserJock> RoAkSoAx: that's not really true
<cheatr> RoAkSoAx: I actually read that earlier today. Personally, I think your informal guide was more beneficial for me. If you want, I can send you a cleaned up version of the transcript
<RoAkSoAx> LaserJock, that is why i said *might* =)
<LaserJock> RoAkSoAx: some merges will have no conflicts, and sometimes there will be a conflict we can drop and sync
<RoAkSoAx> LaserJock, yep i know, we are supposed to check the changelog to see what changes have been made and stuff
<no0tic> LaserJock, I go ahead, then
<RoAkSoAx> cheatr, would be great :)
<cheatr> RoAkSoAx: I'll remove everything except what you said. That way, it will be easier to read through it
<RoAkSoAx> cheatr, if you wan't you can check my blog where i explain how i did a previous merge: http://roaksoax.wordpress.com/ (it is not yet well edited though)
<cheatr> RoAkSoAx: After a quick look, the blog post looks like a nice guide. You might consider turning this into a wiki page on wiki.ubuntu.com
<LaserJock> cheatr: we probably don't need another wiki page for it
<LaserJock> but RoAkSoAx should look at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/Merging and see what could maybe be improved :-)
<cheatr> LaserJock: In my opinion, you can never have too many guides. It doesn't need to replace the current /UbuntuDevelopment/Merging page, but just adding it to the wiki (so it can be found in a search) can't hurt
<LaserJock> cheatr: yes, yes it can
<sommer> nm, forgot the --othermirror option :)
<LaserJock> we already have a rather large mess of wiki pages
<cheatr> LaserJock: Ok, it's just my opinion. I'll just bookmark it
<cheatr> Thanks again RoAkSoAx
<LaserJock> yeah, that was a good tutorial, especially from somebody who just started
<LaserJock> rock on RoAkSoAx
 * no0tic claps his hands
<LaserJock> hmm, this reminds me
<LaserJock> we should do a MOTU School session on merging soon
<ajmitch> LaserJock: reminds you that you've got a long list to get through?
<LaserJock> pfft
<no0tic> ok, now I have this package, kid3, it seems that any previous ubuntu change has been merged upstream and then in debian.. it is a sync, right?
<nxvl> RoAkSoAx: only problem i see is that pastebin doesn't have you data forever
<LaserJock> no0tic: yeah, you just want to make sure that it still builds
<no0tic> oh, hi nxvl, I finished reading your class logs right now :)
<nxvl> RoAkSoAx: best upload it in plain text to you server or paste it inthere
<nxvl> no0tic: great!
<crimsun> nxvl: you can on pastebin.ca.  We use it for ALSA debugging.
<coppro> rafb.net
<nxvl> no0tic: hope it helps
<RoAkSoAx> nxvl, yeah i will
<no0tic> LaserJock, I need pbuilder environment to do that, and it is still creating it :)
<nxvl> crimsun: yes, but he has it as a link in a post
<nxvl> crimsun: so it will not last forever
<nxvl> crimsun: if you read it in 6 months
<nxvl> you wont find the info
<no0tic> nxvl, yes, I would really like to contribute in packaging :)
<nxvl> need to run
<nxvl> bbl
<cheatr> The debian version added "Vcs-Svn", "Vcs-Browser", and "XS-DM-Upload-Alloed" to the control file. Are these allowed in Ubuntu? Also, is "Uploaders" allowed in Ubuntu?
<no0tic> nooo
<SEJEff_home> What is the proper way to go about a sync request for a package which has been packaged, but is waiting to be sponsored into Debian?
<no0tic> pbuilder exited with an error, I'll paste it for you
<crimsun> cheatr: they're all allowed (but not necessarily used)
<RAOF> cheatr: In order: yes, yes, and 'allowed, but doesn't do anything'.
<no0tic> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/10370/
<LaserJock> SEJEff_home: at this point, wait
<cheatr> crimsun and RAOF: If they were added in Debian, should I leave them in when I merge the changes, or should I remove them?
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, have you installed debootstrap?
<crimsun> leave them.
<cheatr> crimsun: ok, thanks
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, no :P
<RAOF> crimsun: What about the vcs tags?  If this is a merge, they're then wrong, right?
<SEJEff_home> LaserJock, And if they don't make it into Debian intime before the merge freeze, doesn't that seem silly?
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, uhm, yes it was, really
<SEJEff_home> LaserJock, ^for Intrepid
 * RAOF is obviously too tired to construct beautiful sentences.
<crimsun> RAOF: only if they've been modified by Ubuntu.  I don't think Vcs-Svn would be an issue.
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, it seems to be an error with libc6_2.7-10ubuntu3_i386.deb
<LaserJock> SEJEff_home: you can't file a sync request for a package that's not in the Debian archive
<RoAkSoAx> i believe someone earlier said something about that if that issue with libc6 was already fixed :
<RoAkSoAx> :
<RoAkSoAx> :S
<bddebian> Heya gang
<crimsun> 'lo barry
<bddebian> Hi crimsun
<LaserJock> SEJEff_home: what you could do is a "fake" sync where we just manually upload the package, but that's sort of a last-resort
<SEJEff_home> LaserJock, So would be best plan of action be to upload a rebuild of the debian package to revu and just let the sync-monster overwrite it if it makes it to Debian?
<SEJEff_home> Right
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, so we need to wait someone to fix it?
<RAOF> crimsun: What I meant was: aren't the vcs tags meant to indicate where the canonical source package is?  If this is a merge, then Debian vcs won't have the current Ubuntu package in it, or in its history.
<SEJEff_home> LaserJock, Ok, so what would you suggest I do? Wait until close to the debian import freeze for Intrepid? Use your last resort in the last few weeks before that freeze if it isn't in Debian yet?
<LaserJock> SEJEff_home: is this a whole new package or just an update?
<SEJEff_home> LaserJock, New package
<SEJEff_home> glusterfs
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, i guess so.. try installing dpatch
<LaserJock> SEJEff_home: then you have up until Feature Freeze
<no0tic> error changed http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/10371/
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, dpatch is installed
<SEJEff_home> LaserJock, So we've got plenty of time. Great
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, i had a similar issue and i installed debootstrap and dpatch and problem solved :S
<LaserJock> RAOF: it is still the VCS source
<LaserJock> basically regardless of what we've done to it
<LaserJock> so you wouldn't want to remove the vcs bits
<LaserJock> so unless we have something to replace them with they should stay as-is
<RAOF> LaserJock: Cool.  I'll try to squirrel that away.
<mathiaz> LaserJock: the VCS field should be renamed to XS-Original-VCS
<LaserJock> mathiaz: if we replace it
<mathiaz> LaserJock: if we merge it from debian, we should replace it.
<mathiaz> LaserJock: the VCS for the ubuntu package is not in debian.
<LaserJock> mathiaz: most packages don't have Ubuntu vcs
<mathiaz> LaserJock: correct - thus rename if to XS-Original-VCS
<mathiaz> LaserJock: without replacing it
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, was that error showed while your were creating the pbuilder environment for intrepid?
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, yes!
<LaserJock> are you saying to us XS-Original-VCS even if we don't have aVCS_ to replace it?
<LaserJock> *use
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, yeah so i guess there is a prob with libc6... i saw someone asking about it earlier
<mathiaz> LaserJock: yes - that's what I was told by soren
<RAOF> mathiaz: With the idea being that vcs-* should appear if and only if the source package in Ubuntu is contained within the revision history of the vcs?
<LaserJock> mathiaz: that may work in Main, but it's not policy
<LaserJock> and I'm not sure we'll be doing it in Universe in the near future
<crimsun> is this documented somewhere?
<mathiaz> crimsun: not that I know of :D
<ajmitch> yay
<mathiaz> so you may wanna confirm the usage of it
<bddebian> Documentation is for ponies
<mathiaz> but that's what soren told me when he reviewed a mysql merge
<LaserJock> I'm guessing that's a sorenism ;-)
<RAOF> Ponies are love!
<mathiaz> LaserJock: he didn't decide it on his own - there was a discussion (somewhere, sometime) and that was the outcome
<LaserJock> not a MOTU discussion
<mathiaz> LaserJock: probably not.
<LaserJock> anyway, not terribly important
<mathiaz> LaserJock: I wasn't aware of that change until soren told me
<ajmitch> an outcome that hasn't been communicated down to the serfs in the field?
<mathiaz> LaserJock: agreed.
<no0tic> hey effie_jayx :)
<LaserJock> maybe something we should take up though at a MOTU Meeting
<mathiaz> ajmitch: apparently :D
<LaserJock> I understand how it'd work if there was actually something to replace the existing Debian VCS field
<ajmitch> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/?action=fullsearch&context=180&value=XS-Original-VCS&fullsearch=Text
<LaserJock> but very few Universe packages use VCSs for maintainence
<ajmitch> not on the wiki, at least :)
<bddebian> *cough* thank god *cough&
<ajmitch> someone needs to hunt it down so that it can be clarified
 * ajmitch appoints bddebian 
<LaserJock> ah, I found it on -devel
<mathiaz> ajmitch: yeah - but as LaserJock pointed out, it's a minor thing - the world won't fall apart if you don't do it.
<LaserJock> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2007-March/023332.html
<ajmitch> mathiaz: I know, but it's useful to have for consistency
<ajmitch> so that people don't end up confused by others telling them 2 or 3 different things
<effie_jayx> no0tic,  hey dude
<mathiaz> ajmitch: right
<mathiaz> LaserJock: so it seems that the proper usage is to rename the VCS tags to XS-Debian-VCS
<LaserJock> *if* we are replacing it with an Ubuntu VCS
<crimsun> err, wait, not XS-Original-VCS?
<LaserJock> crimsun: colin argued "what happens for Ubuntu derivatives?"
<jdong> hah XS-Original-VCS? :)
<jdong> that sounds a bit silly
<mathiaz> crimsun: according to the thread not - but the outcome wasn't a definitive answer
<LaserJock> so derivative would be able to have a XS-Debian-VCS and a XS-Ubuntu-VCS
<ScottK> LaserJock: That's a problem for Ubuntu derivatives to worry about.
<LaserJock> how fun would that be?
<crimsun> LaserJock: right, and the ambiguity remains.
<LaserJock> well, XS-Original-* is pretty confusing, IMO
<ScottK> Personally I view the VCS header as a place to look for possible bug fixes.  I don't care how far up the food chain it is.
<LaserJock> you don't really know what "Original" is
<LaserJock> ScottK: but how would you add a second layer?
<LaserJock> a XS-Original-Original-VCS? :-)
<ScottK> LaserJock: Why does there have to be just one?
<LaserJock> I wasn't saying that
<LaserJock> I was saying:
<LaserJock> Debian -> XS-Original-Original-VCS
<LaserJock> Ubuntu -> XS-Original-VCS
<crimsun> we need it written up formally and definitively.
<ScottK> I guess I don't see why one would bother to change it.
<RAOF> ScottK: Wheras I think of it somewhat the other way 'round; the VCS is the place to checkout to apply fixes to :)
<ScottK> RAOF: Only if you have access to the VCS, in which case you already know where it is.
<mathiaz> LaserJock: I don't think the lineage of the VCS has to be kept
<LaserJock> mathiaz: why not?
<RAOF> ScottK: Well, no.  To diff against to make the patch I send upstream easier to apply.
<ScottK> Ah.  I see.
<mathiaz> ScottK: the idea of the VCS field is to be able to check out from the vcs when apt-get source pkg
<LaserJock> I think that's a terrible idea
<ScottK> mathiaz: That sounds completely wrong tome.
<ScottK> apt-get source should get the source from a repository.
<LaserJock> until we go No-More-Source-Packages I think apt-get source should get *the* source package
<ScottK> mathiaz: We went through this once already when mvo added a big warning with a confirmation box if there were VCS headers.
<ScottK> mathiaz: After discussion he reverted the warning and made it the notice we have now.
<ScottK> Let's not do this again.
<ScottK> apt-get source is to get source packages.
<ScottK> Period.  Full stop.  Nothing else.
<mathiaz> LaserJock: yes - until we go No-More-Source-Packages
<LaserJock> though I do like it telling me a VCS exists
<ScottK> mathiaz: When is that?
<ScottK> LaserJock: Agreed.  I think the current notice is completely appropriate.
<mathiaz> ScottK: I have no clue
<SEJEff_home> Seems like basing off of debian would be difficult then
<LaserJock> not too horrible
<LaserJock> just extract the source packages into VCS
<ScottK> mathiaz: I think we should follow Debian in such major package management changes and so there's no great need for Ubuntu to solve it.
<ScottK> YokoZar: Did you see Debian Bug #479659?
<ubottu> Debian bug 479659 in wnpp "RFH: wine -- Windows API implementation" [Normal,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/479659
<LaserJock> well, *just* in a probably highly fragile way
<ScottK> Until someone can make a VCS that will scale to manage 20,000 packages, I think we are going to use source packages in some form.
<LaserJock> ScottK: there's also a huge barrier, IMO, of what to do with the .orig.tar.gz
<ScottK> LaserJock: That too.
<LaserJock> for packages where a patch system is used you'd most likely want the entire source in VCS
<SEJEff_home> ScottK, besides the obvious love for bzr, git wouldn't even try that hard to manage 20k packages
<ajmitch> ScottK: I was just about to ping YokoZar about that... :)
<ScottK> SEJEff_home: So far I'm still learning git.  I takes me about a century to get a single debian dir out of LP using bzr.
<SEJEff_home> ScottK, bzr is the perfect vcs for someone used to svn. Nothing, not even mercurial, is as user friendly. But for raw performance and space, git wins just about every time
<LaserJock> I just keep learning both
<ScottK> SEJEff_home: For stuff like Debian packaging where merge conflicts are rare, I think svn is perfect for someone used to svn.  So far I'm still declining to try and learn yet another VCS that I run into nowhere outside Ubuntu.
<LaserJock> since there's no VCS to rule them all I just learn the basics of most of the common ones
<ScottK> In Debian Python Modules Team we manage over 200 packages with svn and it works quite well.
<cheatr> Could someone look over this debdiff for a merge that I made: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/10376/
<StevenK> ScottK: Personally, I found my SVN knowledge just snapped into using bzr.
<ScottK> StevenK: You're younger than I am.  Your brain isn't so full yet.
<StevenK> ScottK: Add a few extra commands, like init, bind, uncommit and shelve, and you're done.
<LaserJock> you can use basically the same commands
<ScottK> When I tried it in combination with LP, it was so stunningly slow that I fled in horror.
<StevenK> ScottK: Seriously, install bzrtools and run 'bzr shelve --help'
<StevenK> ScottK: And what format was the repository in?
<ScottK> StevenK: Whatever LP does.  Dunno.
<sommer> ls
<LaserJock> that's been my only real problem with bzr
<sommer> woops
<StevenK> ScottK: bzr info will tell you. svn info does the same, too...
<LaserJock> they are constantly changing formats and things
<ScottK> The Kubuntu team tried to keep all the core KDE packages in bzr during (IIRC Gutsy) and it just wasn't workable.
<LaserJock> there have been a lot of speed improvements
<LaserJock> it's workable for most bzr branches on LP
<nixternal> speed improvements?
<nixternal> Bzr is great locally, but using any of the bzr repos in LP take me 2 days to co, even using --lightweight
<ScottK> I checked one of the packages out late in the Hardy cycle just to make sure nothing had been missed and if that's faster, it's still really slow.
<LaserJock> nixternal: that's just because of the branches you work on
<nixternal> I can grab KDE trunk in less time than I can the hardy doc branch from LP
<persia> cheatr: It's generally better to point to diffs attached to a bug,  Also, for merges, we tend to take the Debian .po files, unless there is a strong reason not to do so.
<StevenK> ScottK: Does it use packs? Try to upgrade the repository to using packs
<ScottK> StevenK:
<ScottK> StevenK: I think you're assuming I care more than I actually do.
<nixternal> effie_jayx: you around at all? msg me when you get a chance
<StevenK> ScottK: If you don't want to investigate and possibly change your viewpoint, why are you complaining?
<LaserJock> because we were talking about reasons not to switch from source packages to bzr branches
 * ajmitch has generally seen poor lp+bzr performance when it's checked out via http:// urls
<nixternal> we use Bzr on a few local projects, and it is great...but it depends on the type of config your branch has...the new stuff is notably quicker
<sommer> frog70
<ScottK> StevenK: It's bzr on one end and LP on the other.  If the LP setup is broken, there are people paid to worry about that.  If it's bzr that's broken, well that's a good reason for me not to worry about it.  Either way, I'm not motivated.
<ajmitch> sommer: change that password now :)
<LaserJock> sommer: dude, you need to check which terminal you're in
<LaserJock> :-)
<sommer> heh, almost time for bed
<ScottK> nixternal: You might want to look at the Kubuntu bzr repo then and see if it can be made better.
<persia> sommer: Still, about 150 seconds before that goes out on public http, never mind the IRC disclosure...
<RAOF> ajmitch: http won't use the smart server IIUC, which will will make it slower (at least after the initial branch).
<sommer> ScottK: I've got a patch for python-clamav that I think will work for 0.93
<ajmitch> RAOF: yep
<nixternal> ScottK: it can, the repo was created with the old formats, that's why it is god awful slow
<nixternal> if you check the website repo, it is considerably faster
 * ajmitch should try & catch up with a few of the lp-bzr people sometime 
<ScottK> sommer: Great.  You have upload rights for the PPA.
 * RAOF is helped in that his bzr-lp integration friend has recently moved to Sydney :)
<ajmitch> RAOF: yeah, and is in dunedin this week :)
<sommer> ScottK: I wasn't sure how to apply the patch, and since it's only one line I just changed the source
<ScottK> sommer: For a test that's fine.
<sommer> ScottK: but I noticed the hardy pyclamav is 0.3.1, and the latest is 0.4.1... is it possible to backport python-clamav?
<RAOF> ajmitch: Crash the sprint!
<LaserJock> it seems quite easy to shoot yourself in the foot with git
<ScottK> sommer: That's Gutsy, not Hardy.
<ajmitch> RAOF: it's only about 5 minutes walk from here, too
<ajmitch> though they might not appreciate it :)
<LaserJock> but then bzr is always changing and every time I go to do anything non-trivial I have to spend an evening in #bzr :-)
<SEJEff_home> LaserJock, How so? And does bzr have anything close to git rebase?
<sommer> ScottK: actually if you check the version in pyclamav.c it's 0.3.1 on hardy as well
<LaserJock> SEJEff_home: well, part of it is the difficult UI, I just start doing things hoping they do what I want
<LaserJock> SEJEff_home: or they behaving in unexpected ways and I lose everything :_0
<LaserJock> :-) rather
<RAOF> ajmitch: Bring your wireless with you; they're having irc connection problems :)
<ScottK> sommer: Maybe upstream didn't change it or something.  The package version is 0.4.0
<ajmitch> RAOF: yeah I've seen
<RAOF> SEJEff_home: There's a bzr-rebase (and bzr-bisect) plugin.
<sommer> ScottK: ah gotcha, well either way I'll test and upload if it works
<SEJEff_home> LaserJock, http://blogs.gnome.org/newren/tag/easy-git/ eg is basicly a really nice way to learn all of the proper git commands because git's documentation blows
<ajmitch> jml: no time for WoW this week, I imagine? :)
<LaserJock> SEJEff_home: yeah, I'm kinda used to it now
<SEJEff_home> RAOF, Oh fantastic, thanks
<LaserJock> but I'm still afraid of it
<LaserJock> as I understand it though, the use of git-rebase is not encouraged
<RAOF> LaserJock: That's because it's _crazy_.  Who knows what it might do?!
<SEJEff_home> LaserJock, git rebase is only evil when your repository is public. If someone pulls your repo, you rebase it, and they pull it again things get all strange when they have local mods
<LaserJock> actually, I mostly go with whatever DVCS will work well with CVS and SVN
<LaserJock> most of the repos I actually use are CVS or SVN
<SEJEff_home> So use svk :)
<ScottK> sommer: According to upstream, 0.4.1 works with clamav 0.93, so maybe we just need the new version (.1)
<LaserJock> SEJEff_home: no thanks
<LaserJock> right now I use bzr for svn and git for CVS
<sommer> ScottK: yep, I tried the other day and it worked fine... the diff from 0.4.1 and the hardy version is just one line being removed
<ScottK> Ah.
<ScottK> sommer: OK.  Why don't you upload that and I'll work with Debian to get is uploaded there and we can sync.
<SEJEff_home> LaserJock, Yeah that would be a bit strange
<LaserJock> SEJEff_home: yeah? it works pretty well
<sommer> ScottK: sounds good, thanks
<SEJEff_home> LaserJock, Just switching between the two
<LaserJock> SEJEff_home: why not?
<RAOF> Some of my problems with git are just that I'm familiar with a different workflow; others seem more fundamental (why make it easy to change the revision history?)
<LaserJock> I've yet to see where I can do much FLOSS work without using multiple VCSs
<SEJEff_home> LaserJock, It probably works great, I just meant it would be difficult to do. bzr does svn interop really well
<SEJEff_home> Difficult to switch between the two
<LaserJock> if bzr had decent CVS interop I'd just use it
<ScottK> sommer: I just suggested to the Debian Maintainer I'd be glad to NMU his package if he didn't have time to update it.
<LaserJock> as I don't use git other than with CVS
<LaserJock> but I do use bzr
<LaserJock> I guess I'm in the opposite situation as ScottK
<sommer> ScottK: cool, configuring dput now :)
<ScottK> Yeah.  For me bzr's goodness or badness is entirely secondary to the fact that I run into it no where else.
<LaserJock> yeah, I use bzr for more things that git
<LaserJock> although there are an awful lot of git repos these days
 * Hobbsee is thinking of using git for some of her stuff
<LaserJock> for me it kinda comes down to if you like your branches in directories or not
 * StevenK *still* can't get his head around git
<StevenK> Either it's too complicated, or I'm too dumb. Or both.
<LaserJock> to me its like a VCS programmers VCS
<LaserJock> I have no clue what the documentation is saying most of the time
<LaserJock> and I don't think most users care
<RAOF> Yeah; and some of the default behaviours seem insane to me.
<SEJEff_home> It was designed to handle very large repositories with thousands and thousands of files well. Do you know of any vcs that does it better?
<SEJEff_home> Of course it has warts, all software does
<LaserJock> well, "better" is a bit subjective in a way
<RAOF> SEJEff_home: Which is entirely orthogonal to 'default UI has crazy behaviour'.
<LaserJock> if you mean faster and things like that, then yes
<SEJEff_home> RAOF, Not really when you consider the guy who developed it doesn't do much ui kind of work
<LaserJock> but it's also very fast at messing me up too
<SEJEff_home> RAOF, But you are right
<LaserJock> so I'm not sure I'd consider it necessarily "better"
<SEJEff_home> So how well would bzr do with the linux kernel source? Probably not so much
<RAOF> And some of the default behaviours seem *designed* to mess you up; 'git revert' is my current favourite.
<SEJEff_home> At the same time, bzr is a more accessible vcs because you can pick it up and run with it in a few minutes
<LaserJock> yep
<LaserJock> at this point I have a hard time saying "better" with much of any VCS but CVS
<SEJEff_home> They both have valid uses. It is a matter of prefernces
<LaserJock> more like "different"
<RAOF> I wonder how bzr _would_ do with the kernel source.
<SEJEff_home> RAOF, Why don't you benchmark it
<RAOF> I might, on a lazy afternoon.
<persia> LaserJock: Try RCS
<LaserJock> I don't think it would necessarily fair too bad except for things like initial branching speed
<LaserJock> persia: I thought you might say that
<LaserJock> I wasn't putting RCS in my VCS list ;-)
<LaserJock> svn can really kick butt
<LaserJock> CVS I just can't get
<LaserJock> persia: I use RCS at school
<LaserJock> although I basically just don't use it
<LaserJock> I just leave stuff checked out
<LaserJock> bbl
<SEJEff_home> RAOF, So when you have a lazy afternoon, you might copy this page: http://git.or.cz/gitwiki/GitBenchmarks
<ScottK> sommer: Congratulations.  It built.
<ScottK> sommer: Do you want to prepare an NMU for Debian?  If not, I will.
<effie_jayx> nixternal, ping
<sommer> ScottK: sweet!, sure I can, but I don't have a singed gpgkey yet
<ScottK> sommer: You don't need that to get an NMU sponsored.
<sommer> ScottK: ah just wondering, because I just revoked the original I uploaded to LP
<ScottK> So how did you manage to upload to the PPA then?
<sommer> ScottK: so what's the NMU process?
<sommer> ScottK: revoked it after uploading
<sommer> ScottK: new key is uploaded already... hope to get it signed at UDS :)
<ScottK> I see.
<ScottK> OK.
<ScottK> I'm looking for a current HOW TO.
<ScottK> sommer: http://www.debian.org/doc/packaging-manuals/developers-reference/ch-pkgs.en.html#s-nmu
<ScottK> sommer: My recommendation is that you package the new version for the NMU, not patch their current one.
<sommer> ScottK: cool, I'll read through it... thanks for the link
<sommer> I concur, I'll use the current version
<ScottK> sommer: I can help you get it sponsored when you have it prepared.
<sommer> ScottK: sounds good, I'll ping you when ready
<RoAkSoAx> sommer, you applying for ubuntu membership aswell right?
<sommer> RoAkSoAx: yeppers, but with the new process it's kind of in a holding pattern
<RoAkSoAx> sommer, yeah, but they already did the wiki pages: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Membership/RegionalBoards/Americas
<RoAkSoAx> so i gues have to remove ourselves from the CCAgenda and add us to that new wiki page
<sommer> ooohhh, checking
<ScottK> sommer: You've done enough for MOTU, I think you could definitely apply to but a Universe Contributor.
<persia> It might still be a bit before it's all organised, but it doesn't hurt to change your queue
<sommer> ScottK: really, I figured I had a ways to go before MOTU
<persia> Yes.  The Universe Contributors model is more mature than the Regional Membership Boards at the current time.
<ScottK> sommer: Universe Contributors is a way to get Ubuntu Member via MOTU Council.  Different than getting MOTU.
<sommer> ah, cool that sounds good
<ScottK> persia: Where on the wiki did the Universe Contributor stuff land?
<persia> sommer: Take a look at the Contributing Developers section of https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopers
<sommer> persia: ah, thanks for the link... checking
<persia> ScottK: Only as a side note on the UbuntuDevelopers page.  It would benefit from someone wanting to document identity, and building a real team page.
<ScottK> sommer:^^^ Maybe you could work on a wiki page for it while you work on your applicaiton?
<sommer> ScottK: sure I'll take a crack at it
 * ScottK 's score for the first round of merges: 14 syncs, 2 merges done, 2 merges to do, 1 more to try to get fixes into Debian.
<nixternal> groovy
 * nixternal hugs ScottK 
<Hobbsee> tasty.
<ScottK> That's better than my ratio at the start of the Hardy cycle.
 * nixternal double checks that he is on the sponsors team - haven't seen any request emails
<nixternal> ScottK: at the beginning of the Hardy cycle you were quitting :p
<nixternal> or slowing down rather
<ScottK> nixternal: I still did my merges
<nixternal> I still have a bum pbuilder
<ScottK> The point is not leaving them as merges, but getting them back to syncs.
<ScottK> nixternal: What's the error?
<nixternal> libc6 still
<ScottK> Oh.  Not this one: http://www.bebt.de/blog/debian/archives/2008/05/02/T07_25_25/index.html
<ScottK> I didn't get the libc6 one.
<nixternal> I can't even create my pbuilder
<LaserJock> ScottK: I got that one when dist-upgrading a hardy chroot
<ScottK> nixternal: Can you dist-upgrade your hardy pbuilder?
<nixternal> W: http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/intrepid/main/binary-i386/Packages.bz2 was corrupt
<ScottK> LaserJock: The fix in that blog post works.
<nixternal> gahahahaha
<nixternal> ScottK: I am creating a new pbuilder for intrepid
<nixternal> keeping hardy, gutsy, and feisty
<ScottK> nixternal: dist-upgrade your hardy one and then make a new hardy one.
<nixternal> I can give that a shot, but have to wait until Packages.bz2 isn't corrupt now
<ScottK> K.
<tbielawa> evening, all
<ScottK> Good evening tbielawa.
 * nxvl HUGS everyone without a reason
<nxvl> :D
<ScottK> nxvl: I'm marking you down as looking after tiny-erp-server.  OK?
 * tbielawa notices how ScottK totally avoided that one
<nxvl> ScottK: huh?
<ScottK> nxvl: Weren't you reporting our changes to Debian on that one?
<nxvl> oh
<nxvl> yes
<ScottK> If you're motivated you might look at poker-network and see if the db-common predepends is really needed.  If it's not, I think we can sync that one.
<ajmitch> pre-depends is fairly unusual
<ScottK> Agreed.
<nxvl> ScottK: no news on bts report
<ScottK> It seemed to solve a problem a year ago.  I'm really not sure it's needed, but don't really know enough about it to know for sure.
<nxvl> i will ping the DD tomorrow
<ScottK> nxvl: Patience.
<ajmitch> was there a bug report about it?
<ScottK> nxvl: Pinging to much can be counter productive.
<nxvl> i haven't ping him
<ScottK> ajmitch: IIRC there was, but it's been a while.  Let me look.
<nxvl> at all
<ScottK> nxvl: You submitted the bug, right?
<nxvl> well, if we are counting it a ping
<nxvl> then you are right
<ScottK> Maintainer's get bugmail on their packages.
<ScottK> So that counts.
<ScottK> nxvl: It's no rush.  At this point worry more about the relationship with Debian than getting the fix in.
<nxvl> yep
<nxvl> that's why i try to ping them personally in this kind of thing
<nxvl> so i can make a friendship with them
<nxvl> meet them
<ScottK> nxvl: I'd say not pinging at all for a couple of weeks is better.
<nxvl> and know they point of view
<nxvl> ScottK: yep, it's alos a good idea
<nxvl> ScottK: i use to do this way when i'm patching a bug, so i know their opinion about the patch i'm going to use
<ScottK> OK.
<ScottK> Your call.  I tend to let the bugs ripen for a while.
<nxvl> but at this point of the RC it's better to keep working and ping them when we are reaching the DIF
<nxvl> well
<nxvl> i need to run
<nxvl> is quite late in here
<ajmitch> bug 138836
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 138836 in poker-network "poker-network mysql installation issue" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/138836
<nxvl> and tomorrow is my first day at PWC
<ScottK> ajmitch: It was Bug #138836
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 138836 in poker-network "poker-network mysql installation issue" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/138836
<ajmitch> yes, as I just said 2 minutes ago :)
<ScottK> Ah.  Yes.  Sorry about that. Missed you put that up.
<ajmitch> ScottK: fwiw, I don't see where dbconfig-common is used in the preinst
<ScottK> ajmitch: Thanks.
<ScottK> It's about 1am here, so I think I'll go to bed and worry about it some other time when I'm not so tired.
<RoAkSoAx> does anyone has this error when trying to create a pbuilder environment? W: Failure trying to run: chroot /var/cache/pbuilder/build/30042/. dpkg --force-depends --install var/cache/apt/archives/libc6_2.7-10ubuntu3_amd64.deb
<ajmitch> from earlier reports, yes other have had that problem
<tbielawa> yeah
<tbielawa> You're making intrepid or sid right
<RoAkSoAx> intrepid
<tbielawa> :(
<RoAkSoAx> anyone know how to fix it? or what to do instead?
<persia> RoAkSoAx: You could chroot into your chroot directly, and try to resolve the issues.  Aside from that, wait for updates to the packages...
<RoAkSoAx> ok thanks persia :)
<tbielawa> I haven't had any luck with that method. I hope you have more success than I do
<RoAkSoAx> i guess i'll wait for the updates
<dholbach> good morning
<RAOF> Oh no!  It's morning for dholbach.  The end of the day approaches :)
<RAOF> dholbach: Good afternoon ;)
<tbielawa> good 2am all!
<dholbach> hiya RAOF, hi tbielawa
<dholbach> how are you guys doing? :)
<tbielawa> Alls well on the eastern coast
<tbielawa> Failed at getting ubuntu on a friends laptop last night though. The laptop would not change what it booted from for the life of it.
<nixternal> mornin' dholbach
<dholbach> hiya nixternal
<TheMuso> tbf: If it had windows on it, you could have used the boot helper program that launches when you insert the CD.
<TheMuso> gah
<TheMuso> tbielawa: ^^
<tbielawa> lol
<tbielawa> wubi gave me the impression it was going to do a regular reboot to do a full install
<TheMuso> tbielawa: Wubi installs onto the windows partition. You can either use wubi to do that, or use umenu I think its called to allow the booting of the CD.
<tbielawa> See, the thing is
<nixternal> man, you have no clue how many people at our university is giving Ubuntu/Kubuntu a shot now due to Wubi...it is insane
<tbielawa> internal optical drive would get read errors as it read more of the disk. ide=nodma helped us get to a gui but it never loaded beyond an orange background
<TheMuso> tbielawa: SOunds like the drive needs a clean.
<tbielawa> we thought itw as being slow with the nodma and all, about 20 minutes passed...so I droped into a tty and saw it vomiting all over :(
<tbf> TheMuso: heh :-)
<tbielawa> that along with restabalized, you could head the sides of the disk spinning on the tray :'(
<tbielawa> I'd have netbooted it if we had a router!
<TheMuso> tbielawa: Ouch.
<TheMuso> nixternal: Thats awesome.
<tbf> wubi is possible, it gives more people access to ubuntu - so it is a good thing.
<tbielawa> nixternal: sexy!
<nixternal> you haven't seen me with my shirt off, so careful with the sexy there :p
<tbielawa> :-o
<nixternal> I am dead sexy with my clothes on
<StevenK> And the lights dimmed?
<tbielawa> :)
<nixternal> shit, the lights wouldn't even help
<nixternal> err, I mean shoot
<StevenK> Haha
<tbielawa> lets not go there, ububot might have to censor this
<TheMuso> lol
<jdong> don't worry the new bot is not very good at this ;-)
<tbielawa> !taunt
<ubottu> Factoid taunt not found
<tbielawa> dang
<jdong> !was found but
<ubottu> Factoid was found but not found
<tbielawa> lol
<tbielawa> !ubottu
<jdong> hehe
<ubottu> Factoid ubottu not found
<tbielawa> it's lost!
<persia> It may also have channel-specific factoids
<tbielawa> !motu
<ubottu> motu is short for Masters of the Universe. The brave souls who maintain the packages in the Universe section of Ubuntu. See  http://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU
<nixternal> %editors
<tbielawa> !help
<ubottu> I am ubottu, the all-knowing infobot, standing in for ubotu while he's getting his haircut done, nose powdered, updated and transitioned to his new gorgeous looks in the near future ;)
<nixternal> nope, damn bots
<dholbach> hi persia
<persia> Hey dholbach
 * RoAkSoAx by all
<nixternal> don't everyone work to hard while I am asleep, please leave some work for me! kthxbye :)
<nixternal> g'nite
<tbielawa> bai2u
<\sh> what was the magic to reconfigure passwd to enable non-root again?
<\sh> dpkg-reconfigure passwd or something?
<\sh> passwd -l root  does what I wanted...no need to think complicated
<nicolasvw> What would be the best way to upgrade a package in ubuntu which is orphaned in debian, package it for unstable and wait for autosync or directly package it for intrepid?
<StevenK> nicolasvw: If you package it for Debian and wait for the autosync, you benefit both Debian and Ubuntu.
<nicolasvw> StevenK: Thankx, that's the way I'll go then ;)
<RAOF> Gah, time to write a RFS, I suppose.
<RAOF> Unless you'd like to sponsor stuff, StevenK ;)
<superm1> bah is refit in main for Intrepid?
<superm1> it's in universe for hardy..
<superm1> that's weird, no its not
<persia> superm1: rmadison is your friend, and the current source is in main, with binary in universe.
<superm1> that's what got me confused
<superm1> i see
<superm1> looks like i gotta find a sponsor then :S
<persia> superm1: Blame gptsync-udeb
<superm1> yeah i see that now.  silly udebs
<superm1> maybe i'll just get it updated in debian instead then
<persia> It's choice of sponsors, but if it's a good fix, that's likely better.
<superm1> yeah, the maintainer hasn't touched it since 2006
<superm1> so hopefully he's responsive to e-mail
<\sh> does anyone know which ports freenode supports (other ports then 6667?)
<tbielawa> here's what scrolled across when I logged in
<tbielawa> Looking up irc.ubuntu.com. Connecting to irc.ubuntu.com (140.211.166.3) port 8001..
<jpatrick> 6667->6669 and 8001
<\sh> thx a lot :)
<jpatrick> recommended is 8001
<\sh> ok...reconnecting ;) hopefully :)
<\sh> brb
<tbielawa> hi 2 u \sh
<tbielawa> You made it through ok!
<\sh> nope
<\sh> it's the old server...damn xchat
<\sh> now :9
<tbielawa> wb
<jpatrick> avoiding the DCC exploit?
<\sh> jpatrick, nope...moving dircproxy from old root to new root server, but company is blocking 6667 ;)
<jpatrick> \sh: they don't know the power of IRC :(
<\sh> jpatrick, I'll have to talk to them for my root server because they are also supporting ubuntu in general, so I think they help to support me ;)
<\sh> anyways...dircproxy move successful, was just changing the connection port from 6667 to 8001 ;)
<jpatrick> :)
<\sh> siretart, i don't think ove wants to move to the single package method for wine
<slytherin> persia: do you have some time to review and sponsor merge for lucene2?
<persia> slytherin: I don't take sponsor requests, but if it's in the queue, I'll take a look when I look at the queue, and if you've a question, I'll take a quick look to answer the question.
<slytherin> persia: No, I don't have any question. I will wait, thanks.
<siretart> \sh: what's the problem with that? - or other way round, why do we insist on a big monolithic package?
<DktrKranz2> james_w: do you want bug 114688 to be unsubscribed from motu-sru for now?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 114688 in uswsusp "uswsusp does not depend on libusplash0" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/114688
<siretart> my point in that post was to have the situation documented
<james_w> DktrKranz2: I think so yes. It can't be currently fixed by an upload of uswsusp, so that seems to be the right thing to do doesn't it?
<DktrKranz2> james_w: I can unsubscribe it, waiting for a good fix. thanks
<james_w> thanks DktrKranz2
<\sh> siretart, because imho even debian people are using just the winehq packages...just KISS ;)
<\sh> s/people/users/
<siretart> \sh: that doesn't answer my question
<siretart> a possible answer that would indeed answer my question could be 'because we want to annoy ove'. (please don't misunderstand me here)
<\sh> siretart, ok...the technical part: it's easier to maintain it in the monolithic approach...reading the debian package  structure actually scares jesus out of me...regarding the amd64 approach of debian it's just crap...ok ia32-libs is also crap, but is a more nicer approach
<\sh> siretart, and no...I don't want to annoy anyone here :)
<siretart> well, we do in fact annoy people with that here. you state the reason for that is 'maintainability', which is okay for me.
<\sh> siretart, well, we could discuss this in #ubuntu-wine ;)
<\sh> siretart, anyways..I'm awaiting some replies from Ove to my mails...
<siretart> \sh: I wouldn't expect him to answer. your tone was pretty rude, IMO.
<siretart> regarding wine, I don't have particular interest in wine since I don't use it
<\sh> siretart, well, I just replied what I think is important for the users, not pleasing the maintainers soul...as he stated, that he only expectes us to answer, when we agree with him on doing the debian way...evolution is change..change is good...;)
<siretart> and change only for the sake of changing things is the road to hell
<\sh> siretart, there was a decision made during breezy, why we took the winehq packages of scott...because they are following winehq development ... and watching users, who are actually using the packages, they want to follow the winehq development as well, because wine is changing too fast..and wine users wants to have new crack every 2 weeks...
<\sh> siretart, and those packages from winehq were well maintained by Scott...
<siretart> and what is Scott's particular reason to not merge his packages with ove's? are ove's package so hard to maintain?
<\sh> siretart, when you have several changes in between releases, it's hard to maintain several binary packages...you miss new files, you will miss new features, which are not even known by anyone involved in wine development...there are several reasons to just follow the "one upstream tarball == one (at least we have two) distro package" approach...
<\sh> siretart, so yes, it's really hard to maintain the package, and staying on top of each wine release...
<siretart> I see.
<\sh> siretart, and regarding the amd64 approach of debian, I don#t want to comment on this...
<siretart> I think it is sad that we have that divergence at all and so few people are interested in solving it
<charliecb> hi
<\sh> siretart, I'm not saying that the debian package in general is wrong...it follows all debian standards for sure...but following the rules does not mean following the reality and I don't know anyone who just installs libwine-print to enable printing for windows apps, without having wine-bin installed...
<\sh> siretart, so reality means: apt-get install wine which pulls the whole bunch of bin packages onto real users computer
<charliecb> i searched a package in ubuntu called "libjogl-java". i found the package in debian unstable, but i didn't found in intrepid
<james_w> charliecb: it appears to be a new package in Debian, is that correct?
<charliecb> it's maybe 2 month old, i think
<james_w> if so then it is probably just waiting to be imported to Ubuntu, which should happen soon.
<charliecb> james_w: ^^
<charliecb> james_w: thanks
<i4x> good morning everyone!!
<i4x> :)
<tbielawa> woohoo!!
<tbielawa> I got syndicated on planet ubuntu users, http://ubuntuweblogs.org/ woohoo!
<i4x> syndicated? what is it?
<tbielawa> well, just included
<i4x> hm.. ok!
<tbielawa> Best i can tell it's a ubuntu universe blog, similar to planet.ubuntu.com except for non main ubuntu people
<tbielawa> like, a motu type folk blog aggregater + general ubuntu talk. that's what i see there. MOTUs, people working to be then, and general ubuntu + linux posts
<i4x> I see..
<i4x> what is a "sponsor"?
<tbielawa> I think it it some one with more administrative power than you who can vouch for a package you have your name on and upload it to the repos
<i4x> hm.. fine! so, if I want to contribute, I'll need a sponsor, right?
<persia> Actually, "sponsor" means different things in different contexts.  For uploads where the person preparing the revision doesn't have upload access to the component for which the revision is targeted, it just means someone to upload for you.  For most other contexts, it means someone to report good things in your favour, preferably people whose opinions have been acknowledged as wise.
 * tbielawa nods
<tbielawa> persia has this wisdom he speaks of
<persia> i4x: You'd need a sponsor for any given revision, but there are teams who do sponsoring.  See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing
<i4x> hmm, interesting!! :)
<tbielawa> i4x, how long have you been in this comminity?
<tbielawa> *community
<tbielawa> on the motu side of things
<i4x> I thought that "sponsor" was like the one who spends money for getting hes "name" on it!!..
<tbielawa> lol
<i4x> I'm discovering the motus side for about one week!...
<persia> Ah.  There's that too.  There are several groups that sponsor various aspects of Ubuntu development in a financial sense, most notably Canonical.
<tbielawa> i4x: me too@!
<tbielawa> i4x: how are you getting along so far?
<i4x> I was searching "how to build a package", and found this side!.. what I never thought it was so.. simple? yes, because it seems anyone (with a good programming, etc) can contribute to the community!
<i4x> tbielawa_shower: what do you mean with "how are you gettin...." ?
 * mok0 finds konqueror-kde4 pretty buggy
<i4x> anyone knows a channel for report printing problems??
<soren> i4x: That's what launchpad is for.
<joaopinto> launchpad.net ?
<persia> i4x: Problem reports ought be filed as bugs.  #ubuntu-bugs is a place to discuss them after they are filed.
<i4x> I know it.. thx!
<i4x> but, where should I go to discuss the problem? will #ubuntu-bugs answer a problem about printing? is there any #printing ?? because I don't even know if it is really a problem!! :S
<joaopinto> i4x, if you need support (not a bug report), ask on #ubuntu
<slytherin> Please help. I am trying to create pbuilder chroot for intrepid but getting this error - http://pastebin.com/m40aeb50
<mok0> slytherin: did you update it today?
<slytherin> mok0: I was trying to create it about 25 minutes ago
<mok0> slytherin: hmm
<tbielawa_shower> slytherin: everyone is getthing that error
<tbielawa_shower> same goes with creating a sid environment
<tbielawa_shower> :(
<mok0> slytherin: there must be some dependency  out-of-sync with the repo
<norsetto> mok0: is that the libc error? (sorry, I just popped in)
<slytherin> norsetto: yes
<mok0> norsetto: err, don't know
<tbielawa_morning> i4x: what I meant before was: how has your experience on the motu side of ubuntu been so far?
<mok0> norsetto, Ah, of course, yes
<norsetto> mok0, slytherin: yeah, thats DBTS 479202
<mok0> norsetto: thought you were talking about a run-time error
<mok0> ubotu, 479202?
<jpatrick> guten tag dholbach
<dholbach> hi jpatrick
<slytherin> mok0: any solution?
<i4x> tbielawa_morning: you mean: what made me get so far?
<norsetto> heya dholbach
<dholbach> hey norsetto
<i4x> tbielawa_morning: that is a question my English do not translate so well! :D
<mok0> slytherin: slytherin, looks like there's a patch at http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=479202
<slytherin> has anyone built any package for intrepid in PPA? I uploaded one yesterday in my PPA, it says 'Built' but I can't find .deb anywhere
<ubottu> Debian bug 479202 in perl-base "fields tries to use Hash::Util" [Unknown,Open]
<mok0> ubottu, you are too slow
<norsetto> mok0: do us all a favour and shoot him in the head
<slytherin> mok0: Yes, I saw that. So I will have to wait till that is fixed.
 * mok0 looks for his electron phaser
<joh> Hi, any admins here who can re-sync the REVU uploaders keyring please?
<mok0> slytherin: apply the patch yourself, perhaps?
<mok0> slytherin: or install the missing package?
<i4x> tbielawa_morning: but anyway: I'm studying "installation and management of networks and informatic (?) systems"!
<mok0> slytherin: in a non ii environment, of course
<slytherin> mok0: I haven't yet created chroot. How can I install the missing package?
<mok0> slytherin: there are some hooks and stuff in pbuilder that you may be able to use.
<tbielawa_morning> i4x: so you
<mok0> slytherin: never did it, though, so I am not of much use here
<tbielawa_morning> i4x: *so you're enjoying all this, I am too
<slytherin> mok0: I think I will instead use old hardy chroot, install perl and then upgrade it.
<mok0> slytherin: good idea
<mok0> (you may want to keep your hardy-base.tgz around
<slytherin> mok0: yes I have.
<mok0> slytherin: I mean, make a backup of it :-)
<slytherin> mok0: yes, I meant the same. :-)
<mok0> slytherin: Perhaps you can post your base.tgz when you get it made
<slytherin> mok0: I am using two different pbuilderrc, each referring to different base.tgz
<slytherin> mok0: I don't have any hosting space.
 * tbielawa_morning seconds mok0s idea
<i4x> tbielawa_morning: I've to make a little project to "System Programming", but it is too easy for me! as I like to know everything, I've to complicate the project to make it better and to learn more than what the teachers teach! :)
<tbielawa_morning> if we need some space and bandwith, I can host at my domain
<mok0> slytherin: can we use dcc?
<mok0> slytherin: I can host it
<slytherin> mok0: wait for some time, let me first update the base.tgz
<i4x> tbielawa_morning: so I'm building a package instead of making a manual!! to make the installation easier and to learn how the universe rocks.. :)
<tbielawa_morning> i4x: i do the same thing. last semester i wrote a gui for a program that wasn't even required
<slytherin> i4x: I suggest you start fixing small bugs in packages instead. That way you get to learn a lot before you do packaging from scratch
<i4x> slytherin: I've already the ideas!.. and I know how to do it.. but even if I want to fix small bugs first, I'll be spending time I don't have! :S
<i4x> so I'm trying to make the .c file and scripts working quickly as I can to then have time to test the package..
<i4x> my problem is that I've never done it before, and even knowing how to do it, I don't know where to start! :)
<i4x> it's like doing all at the same time!!
<i4x> where do I report a problem about system-config-printer? Launchpad says: "System Config Printer does not use Launchpad as its bug tracker."
<mok0> i4x: find the package under the Ubuntu project
<persia> i4x: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/system-config-printer/+filebug
<i4x> thx..
<i4x> ppl, while reporting the bug, I made "apt-cache policy system-config-printer" and appeared: system-config-printer:  Installed: (none)  Candidate: (none)  Version table:
<i4x> is that normal?
<i4x> :S
<tbielawa_morning> i4x: try using apt-cache search system-config-printer
<tbielawa_morning> there are three options
<i4x> wow, thx!!
<i4x> :)
<tbielawa_morning> i4x: you're welcome
<tbielawa_morning> I <3 the slackware website. they regularly go 3 years between news posts, and no one things odd of it
<tbielawa_morning> *thinks
<StevenK> tbielawa_morning: Of course not.
<joh> I'm having trouble getting my package uploaded to REVU. Any help?
<tbielawa_morning> joh: error message? pastebin it if it's big
<joh> tbielawa_morning: Well, there were none. dput completed successfully but the package doesn't show up on the revu site.
<tbielawa_morning> i heard it takes around 5-10 minutes to update, has it been that long? are you in the keyring?
<joh> tbielawa_morning: I beleive it has been that long yes. I'm not sure if I'm in the REVU keyring though.
<tbielawa_morning> joh: unless you've asked you won't be in the keyring. you'll need an admin on here to add you
<wgrant> joh: Have you joined the revu-uploaders team on Launchpad?
<joh> wgrant: Yep
<joh> tbielawa_morning: Ah, I see.
<wgrant> joh: When?
<wgrant> joh: Have you requested that the keyring be synced?
<joh> wgrant: Last night, so it's probably not updated yet.
<joh> wgrant: I have requested but got no response :-)
<wgrant> joh: I'll sync it now.
<joh> wgrant: Great, thank you!
<wgrant> It will take several minutes; I'll ping you when it's done.
<joh> Alright, will I have to re-upload my package afterwards?
<wgrant> joh: You will.
<wgrant> Or I could just move it back and accept it myself. Probably better, as it's easy enough.
<joh> Great, the package name is 'alarm-clock'.
<i4x> as no1 read my questions in ubuntu, ï»¿anyone here knows if evince uses system-config-printer to print files??
<wgrant> i4x: This isn't a support channel.
<i4x> wow, that helps!!
<wgrant> joh: Accepting upload alarm-clock from Johannes H. Jensen <joh@pseudoberries.com>
<joh> wgrant: Thank you!
<cheatr> Quick Question. I'm doing a merge. In the last ubuntu entry in the changelog, the only change was adding a couple provides/replaces/conflicts entries to the control file. All of these are able to be removed. Since normally you are meant to copy the entries from the last ubuntu entry in the changelog to the entry for the merge you are performing, what should I do?
<ScottK> You should figure out why they were added and then determine if they are still needed.
<persia> cheatr: Will the package work properly without the changes now?  Can the divergence be ended with a sync?
<emgent> heya ScottK persia
<ScottK> Heya emgent
<cheatr> persia and ScottK: The only change that would be lost would be the Maintainer field if a sync were to be performed instead of a merge. Is this important enough?
<persia> cheatr: Certainly not.  That sounds like a sync.  Modify your merge bug to a sync bug, and subscribe the sponsors for confirmation.
<ScottK> cheatr: So we don't need the provides/replaces/conflicts anymore?
<cheatr> ScottK: The provides/replaces/conflicts was added for the transition from dapper->hardy. It says in the comment that it can be removed for hardy+1.
<mok0> Anybody knows what package contains GL/GLwMDrawA.h ??
<ScottK> cheatr: Then it should be a sync.
 * sebner waves :)
<StevenK> mok0: I *think* none of them.
<ScottK> mok0: I'm with StevenK.
<mok0> StevenK: Arrgh
<mok0> I feared as much
<cheatr> Thanks ScottK
<StevenK> I *think*, and this is streching back to Dapper, that we removed GLw since it's a buggy pile of crap.
<ScottK> p.u.c doesn't know anything about it.
<StevenK> If I recall correctly, Breezy was the last release to know about it.
<wgrant> Hmm.
<wgrant> I thought there was some component conflict which meant we had to remove it.
<wgrant> Or at least that was GLw related.
<ScottK> Before my time.
<wgrant> But I really don't remember.
<StevenK> I'm having a hard time remembering, since I came across this during Dapper's development cycle.
<joh> wgrant: I've uploaded my package to REVU and added the link to the [needs-packaging] bug description. Is there anything else I need to do but wait at this point?
<mok0> StevenK: I will look for it on the packages site
<wgrant> joh: I'm not sure. I don't do that side of the process.
<joh> wgrant: Ok
<StevenK> mok0: Patch it out and move on. I did. :-)
<mok0> StevenK: What do you use instead?
<mok0> StevenK: I just need to compile a tarball and don't want to spend too much time on it
<slytherin> does anyone have any idea when will ppa be able to build packages for intrepid?
<StevenK> mok0: Nothing.
<StevenK> slytherin: Ask in #launchpad.
<ScottK> joh: Generally not other than have patience.  You may, if you choose, ask once or twice a day here (with a link to your package on REVU) ask for someone to review it.  More often is considered rude (except on REVU days).
<slytherin> StevenK: ok
<mok0> StevenK: and your program still works? Fascinating
<slytherin> StevenK: I thought the decision was to be made bu Ubuntu dev.
<ScottK> slytherin: Ubuntu has nothing to do with PPA.  It's totally a Launchpad thing.
<StevenK> mok0: This was a merge for Dapper. I remember disabling GLw example programs for <some package>
<slytherin> joh: make sure you tag the bug with 'needs-packaging'
<mok0> StevenK: On CentOS the include file is part of xorg-x11-devel
<StevenK> So CentOS don't disable GLw. Okay.
 * mok0 cries... whaaaaaaaa
<mok0> StevenK: Things have happened in the mesa source package
<mok0> StevenK: why not just spilt off the glw stuff in a separate package?
<StevenK> mok0: Because the choices were made before my time, I was just preserving the status quo.
<mok0> StevenK: looks like these are local ubuntu changes
<mok0> StevenK: does it have to do with removing lesstif?
<StevenK> The choices were made before my time -- no idea.
<ScottK> proppy: Are you going to look after poker-network?  I think we may be able to sync it.  I'm not at all convinced the pre-depends on db-common is really needed.
<proppy> ScottK: is there some issue with poker-network ? let me check my mail, I may not have noticed it
<ScottK> proppy: It needs to be merged/sync'ed for Intrepid.
<proppy> ah remembering the ubuntu patch that were introduced with gutsy
<ScottK> Right.
<ScottK> I'm not convinced it's needed any longer.  Could you look into it?
<proppy> yep, I'm in the middle of submitting a patch to Evolution right now, I'll check that just after
<ScottK> Great.
<proppy> poker-network is 1.2.0-1ubuntu1 in hardy
<proppy> It seems that I could have merged it earlied :)
<proppy> r
<proppy> it's 1.4.0-1 in unstable
<proppy> upstream is 1.5.0
<ScottK> So the question is, is 1.4.0-1 workable for Ubuntu or do we need to retain the diff?
<proppy> the diff is dependencies to simple-patch-sys
<proppy> (without patch)
<proppy> and db-common predepend
<proppy> let me find the launchpad bug report where we added the predepend
<ScottK> proppy: https://launchpad.net/bugs/138836
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 138836 in poker-network "poker-network mysql installation issue" [Undecided,Fix released]
<proppy> there seems to be differencies in Build-Depends and Depends too, but the diff is difficulte to read
<proppy> ScottK: faster than google
<ScottK> proppy: There are some other differences, but that's the one that seemed the most critical.  I took a quick look and it seemed the rest was adding stuff (it's less different than I remember).
 * proppy just noticed the bug number was listed in ubuntu patch 
<proppy> From debian policy:
<proppy> Â Â Â Â Pre-Depends are also required if the preinst script depends on the named package. It is best to avoid this situation if possible.
<slytherin> mok0: Lots of hiccups in upgrading base.tgz. :-(
<proppy> checking poker-web preinst
<ScottK> proppy: I don't think it uses it.
<mok0> slytherin: what kind of hiccups? Tool chain issues?
<slytherin> mok0: yes, unmet dependencies for perl packages
<mok0> slytherin: ydrk
<Hobbsee> that's known
<mok0> slytherin: I actually thought perl was part of the base set
<proppy> ScottK: may I try a prevu in intrepid using debian .dsc ?
<slytherin> mok0: liblocale-gettext-perl has unmet dependenciy
<mok0> slytherin: can you force it?
<ScottK> proppy: I've no idea.  I don't use prevu.
<ScottK> jdong: ^^^?
<slytherin> mok0: don't think so
<proppy> ScottK: a chroot would work too
<proppy> ScottK: I was suggesting that I try a build of the debian source package, as a first step
<proppy> ScottK: is intreprid available for deboostrap
<proppy> ScottK: I quite remember one should add a deb-src
<mok0> proppy: apparently not according to slytherin
<ScottK> There is one in hardy-backports.
<ScottK> Some people report problems.  I haven't had any myself.
<proppy> ScottK: that what I remembered that the dist+1 deboostrap was in dist-backport
<slytherin> mok0: wait, perl-base provides the package which is dependency of ï»¿liblocale-gettext-perl but I am not sure why it is giving problem
<mok0> slytherin: the way I read the discussion at the BTS, all you had to do was to install both perl and perl-base.
<slytherin> mok0: tried that. this is the error - http://pastebin.com/m224aa5ee
<proppy> deboostraping intrepid
<proppy> would be nice if ubuntu-wire supplied copy-on-write chroot, accessible via ssh using launchpad public keys :)
<Hobbsee> a copy on write chroot?
<mok0> slytherin: I don't know what to suggest :-(
<mok0> slytherin: except wait
<proppy> Hobbsee: to share one deboostrap with multiple chroot
<slytherin> mok0: I think Iwill start again
<Hobbsee> proppy: -v?
<mok0> slytherin: yeah
<proppy> Hobbsee: Imagine that you want to share a fresh debootstrap intrepid intrepid, for testing merging of different package
<proppy> s/merging/merge/
<proppy> or build
<Hobbsee> proppy: so what you actually want is pbuilder, so that anyone can share it.
<Hobbsee> er, use it
<Hobbsee> (you can't split debootstrap)
<proppy> Hobbsee: pbuilder store the deboostrap in a base.tgz IIRC
<Hobbsee> proppy: that's correct.
<proppy> Hobbsee: I know that there are way to use if over lvm snapshot but never tried
<Hobbsee> proppy: it's a security risk to run pbuilder on a multi-user system like that, though
<Hobbsee> which is why revu, etc, have it disabled.
<proppy> Hobbsee: even if you only provide accessto the pbuilder chrooted environement
<Amaranth> you have to be root to run pbuilder
<Hobbsee> proppy: i guess you could disable switches.
<Amaranth> root can break out of a chroot
<Hobbsee> Amaranth: you can set it to not require a root password.
<Hobbsee> Amaranth: the bigger problem is the --bindmounts option
<Amaranth> ah, right
<proppy> Amaranth: I wasnt' meaning to run pbuilder, just to provide access to a chroot initialised by debootstrap (or pbuilder)
<Hobbsee> Amaranth: which lets you mount whatever you want.
<Amaranth> Hobbsee: but not if you aren't root? :)
<Hobbsee> Amaranth: hmmm.  maybe you can run it as non-root, if you kept it all inside ~
<slytherin> mok0: found the reason, a sync is needed for liblocale-gettext-perl
<proppy> ScottK: I'm afraid deboostrap is taking ages here
<ScottK> proppy: No rush.  I leave it in your hands.
<proppy> ScottK: can I open a bug somewhere ? so I notify other pokersource people with it ?
<ScottK> proppy: Sure.  Just title it as a merge bug and assign it to yourself.
<Hobbsee> Amaranth: i've always thought it's a bigger problem that people could bindmount ~
<proppy> ScottK: If I understand the process correctly one have to check if it is a sync or a merge before opening a bug ?
<ScottK> proppy: Ideally yes, but you can edit the bug later if it turns out different.
<proppy> ScottK: nice :)
<proppy> Hobbsee: xen would be an option too, I heard it can spawn multiple readonly instance or the same image
<Hobbsee> proppy: hmmm, it probably would.
<proppy> Hobbsee: then one could be able to provide ssh:// next to launchpad bug url :)
<Hobbsee> heh :)
<wgrant> Or one could provide a PPA URL.
<wgrant> That's easier than us reinventing PPA.
<proppy> wgrant: can you ssh to a PPA ?
<Hobbsee> ...no
<wgrant> No. Why would you need to?
<proppy> wgrant: to have an instant shell on a bug reproduction environement instead of deboostraping locally, and trying to reproduce the condition
 * StevenK shivers
<wgrant> Oh. Bugs, not builds. I see.
<proppy> wgrant: builds bug :)
<wgrant> Doesn't everyone have chroots?
<ScottK> Not of Intrepid currently.
<wgrant> Everyone will soon enough.
<ScottK> Agreed.
<proppy> wgrant: I thought you'd have to have one chroot by bug, but I maybe wrong
<wgrant> proppy: Why can't you just reuse them?
<proppy> wgrant: I guess you can, I just think it is easier to reproduce build and installation issue from a clean environement
<wgrant> ... yes?
<wgrant> Of course is it.
<wgrant> Reuse the clean chroot.
<broonie> eg, a pbuilder chroot
<proppy> wgrant: and then if you get into the bug reproduction situation it would be nice to be able to provide a shell to someone else
<proppy> instead of giving an howto reproduce in the bug comments :)
<proppy> But I agree it is not *needed*, just thinked it was handy
<wgrant> Perhaps so, but there would be a lot of work in it.
<proppy> s/was/would be/
<proppy> maybe it doesn't worth this work :)
<proppy> ScottK: #227323 filled
<proppy> bug #227323
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 227323 in poker-network "Please merge poker-network-1.4.0-1 (intrepid) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/227323
<ScottK> proppy: Great.  Let me know when you get something worked out.
<slytherin> are latest gstreamer plugins (bad/ugly) going to get SRU?
<emgent> tseliot: \o
<tseliot> ï»¿emgent: hi ;)
<norsetto> emgent: thats the right arm ....
<emgent> norsetto: ahahaha :)
<emgent> we can use this too:
<emgent> o
<emgent>  \O
<awen_> has anybody who had problems got pbuilder / debootstrap to work with intrepid? ... fails miserably for me for both sid and intrepid
<azeem> awen_: try to bootstrap hardy, then dist-upgrade, maybe
<persia> awen_: I think it's Debian bug #479202
<ubottu> Debian bug 479202 in perl-base "fields tries to use Hash::Util" [Unknown,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/479202
<awen_> persia: oh, looks like it could be it ... hopefully got to be fixed soon then
 * norsetto -> away
<fargiolas> hey, any motu sru team member?
<proppy> proppy@nihiki:~$ sudo apt-get remove gsynaptic
<proppy> Note, selecting synaptic instead of gsynaptic
<proppy> ouch
<soren> proppy: This is surprising?
<proppy> soren: yep, I've forgotten an *s* :), I wanted to remove gsynaptics
<proppy> :)
<jdong> slight namespace clash :)
<Hobbsee> no great problem removing synaptic anyway
<jdong> ^^ KDE user above.
<jdong> *ducks*
 * Hobbsee beats jdong
<Hobbsee> jdong: apt works just fine.
<Hobbsee> jdong: i really don't like adept.
<proppy> Hobbsee: the 'update available' popup is still handy, even if using apt :)
<Hobbsee> true
<Hobbsee> but i thought that was update-manager, not synaptic
<proppy> Hobbsee: yep but removing synaptic removed me update-manager as well :P
<Hobbsee> proppy: awww.  no fun
<Hobbsee> hi jono
<jono> hey
<no0tic> anyone who wants to mentor me on the path of the motu?
<bddebian> Heya gang
<geser> Hi bddebian
<bddebian> Hi geser
<\sh> ok...45 mins left until party time
<Iulian> Hey bddebian, geser.
<bddebian> Hello Iulian
<geser> Hi Iulian
<geser> \sh: what party?
<\sh> geser, Einstand ;)
 * \sh doesn't know the word in English :)
<\sh> first day party
<jdavies> no0tic: see: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Mentoring
<no0tic> jdavies, read
<persia> no0tic: Alternately, jump in with https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/TODO, and review https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing
<no0tic> persia, yes, I've already read them..
<\sh> ok..cu tomorrow...I'll put some beer into my system now ;)
<sebner> \sh: hf
<emgent> bye \sh :)
<norsetto> proppy: synaptic is the first thing I remove on a new installation :-)
<proppy> norsetto: you're a blueman too ? :)
<norsetto> proppy: I'm a k-man (trumpet sound) I'm a k-man (trumpet sound)
<bddebian> heh
<proppy> norsetto: pi po pa la to po
<norsetto> proppy: sorry, french music is not my best (les frics, sont chic)
<proppy> norsetto: "le fric (money) c'est chic"
<norsetto> proppy: but you want a lot of it ....
<proppy> norsetto: not really
<norsetto> proppy: you are right, frugal is beautifull
<i4x> how do I declare/initialize a mysql in C? isn't it "MYSQL mysql.conn;"
<i4x> with the mysql/mysql.h included..?
<i4x> wow, I think I forgot the -lmysqlclient while compiling..
<i4x> thx anyway!
<proppy> see you :)
<RainCT> OT, can someone recommend me a graphical IRC client for GNOME?
<jdavies> RainCT: XChat-gnome is very good I hear
<kirkland> zul: yo
<kirkland> zul: php5 uploaded to my homedir on chinstrap again
<zul> okies Ill have a look
<kirkland> zul: thx, let me know
<zul> yep
<kirkland> zul: any feedback on php5?
<zul> kirkland: not yet....gimme a sec
<zul> kirkland: looks ok to me
<kirkland> zul: yay \o/
<zul> kirkland: mind cleaning that directory up a bit and ill start getting it uploaded
<kirkland> zul: sure, clean how?
<zul> rm -f *.deb  etc
<kirkland> zul: i can do that...  what do you need to push?  just the .dsc or changes, right?
<kirkland> zul: deb's removed
<zul> dsc changes diff and orig
<kirkland> zul: okay, deb's removed, let me know what else
<zul> sure gimme a sec
<soyyo> hi
<zul> cool i can take it from here
<zul> kirkland: uploaded
<kirkland> zul: you rock, sucka
<zul> sucka?
<kirkland> zul: bad movie reference, http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0095348/
<kirkland> zul: failed to build :-/
<zul> kirkland: grumble grumble...
<kirkland> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/14264042/buildlog_ubuntu-intrepid-i386.php5_5.2.5-3ubuntu1_FAILEDTOBUILD.txt.gz
<kirkland> Some packages could not be installed. This may mean that you have requested an impossible situation or if you are using the unstable distribution that some required packages have not yet been created
<zul> kirkland: *grumble **grumble*
<jdavies> kirkland: one of the dependencies of the dependencies must be uninstallable
<kirkland> jdavies: thanks, so it'll auto retry the build later?
<jdavies> I think so.
<RoAkSoAx> is libc6 already updated in the intrepid repos? cuz we were unable to create a pbuilder environment
<jdavies> kirkland: it's a shame it does say where _exactly_ the problem lies
<kirkland> jdavies: you speak of libsnmp-dev -> libsnmp-perl, libsnmp15 ?
<Creationist> Any word on when the Hardy repos will be fixed.... I've got a useless system right now without being able to install what I need..
<jdavies> kirkland: ..or whichever the broken dep is
<kirkland> TheCreationist: um, broken hardy repos?
<TheCreationist> kirkland: The default repos either can't be connected to at all, or they're VERY slow to download.
<kirkland> TheCreationist: ah, gotcha. sorry, i mirror locally  ;-)
<secretlondon> TheCreationist, try another mirror?
<TheCreationist> kirkland: Yeah, I'm trying to do that too... but can't remember my password to msg ubottu to learn how :)
<TheCreationist> How do I use local repositories?
<coppro> add it to your sources.list?
<TheCreationist> No, what I mean is that the official repositories seem to be broken; I can't install anything from them.  I was told to try another mirror... no idea how to do that or where to find that list.
<RoAkSoAx> TheCreationist, sudo vim /etc/apt/sources.list
<TheCreationist> RoAkSoAx: No, I know how to edit the list, but I don't know where to find a list of different mirrors for the repos.
<TheCreationist> ...or are they all really only hosted on one server?
<RoAkSoAx> TheCreationist, for example, the us will we deb http://us.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ hardy universe, Peru deb http://pe.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ hardy universe
<RoAkSoAx> . Netherlands, deb http://nl.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ hardy universe, and so on
<TheCreationist> Right... the us repositories don't work.
<RoAkSoAx> TheCreationist, neither the peruvian ones, or the simepl deb http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ hardy universe
<RoAkSoAx> simple*
<TheCreationist> So my only option would be to use a different region'ss repos?
<RoAkSoAx> so might be a general problem between all the repos
<TheCreationist> ah.
<RoAkSoAx> i've tried the general repos, the us repos and the nl repos and the same thing
<TheCreationist> And no one has any idea when this may be fixed?
<TheCreationist> lol ironic that at the moment it's much easier to install software in Windows than in Ubuntu ;)
<RoAkSoAx> TheCreationist, you can always donwload the binaries from: packages.ubuntu.com
<norsetto> RoAkSoAx: it.archive.ubuntu.com is working
<RoAkSoAx> norsetto, thanks =)
<RoAkSoAx> gonna change my repos then xD
<TheCreationist> Yeah for the Italians.
<TheCreationist> Now, I trust using their repos will still install English-version software, right? lol
<RoAkSoAx> TheCreationist, off course.. lol
<TheCreationist> Finally, I can get multimedia support and Amarok :)
<TheCreationist> thank you, norsetto
<norsetto> TheCreationist: np
<RoAkSoAx> norsetto, you able to install a pbuilder environment for intrepid?
<norsetto> RoAkSoAx: I did before the perl bug hit it
<emgent> there is a problem on libc
<emgent>  W: Failure trying to run: chroot /var/cache/pbuilder/build/4400/. dpkg
<emgent>                   --force-depends --install var/cache/apt/archives/libc6_2.7-10ubuntu3_i386.deb
<RoAkSoAx> norsetto, yeah i did that too but when compiling a package it wast able to download some dependencies so i believe there is a problem with dependencies too...
<norsetto> RoAkSoAx: yes
<RoAkSoAx> oh well so i guess i'll have to wait to do another merge xD
<LaserJock> anybody happen to know of a good resource for how to code for writing large data files?
<dantalizing> question for the package masters:
<dantalizing> i installed handbrakegtk with --ignore-deps ...but now whenever i want to install something else, apt wants to remove it
<dantalizing> is there a way to force apt to ignore my 'broken' package
<dantalizing> ?
<nand> dantalizing: you should maybe give a try with /etc/apt/preferences (see bottom of http://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/apt-howto/ch-apt-get.en.html )
<dantalizing> nand: i will try that thx
<joh> Hi, I'm trying to get my package into the universe repositories. I've uploaded my package to REVU and added the link to the [needs-packaging] bug description. Is there anything else I need to do but wait at this point?
<RAOF> joh: That's about it for the moment.  Every now and then you can ping this channel advertising your package, and you might want to turn up for revu days (they're on mondays).
<joh> RAOF: Ok, great. Thanks!
<norsetto> joh: it also helps if you give the link when asking ...
<joh> norsetto: Sure! Here you go: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/227248
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 227248 in ubuntu "[needs-packaging] alarm-clock" [Wishlist,In progress]
<norsetto> joh: you don't need dirs for just /usr/bin /usr/sbin
<norsetto> joh: anything of relevance in NEWS and README?
<norsetto> joh: distro is intrepid, add the LP bug as (LP: #227248) in changelog
<norsetto> joh: maintainer is ubuntu-motu, you can list yourself as XSBC-Original-Maintainer
<norsetto> joh: pls. remove all the cruft from rules
<warp10> Heya all
<norsetto> heya warp10
<warp10> hey norsetto!
<no0tic> norsetto, warp10 accepted to mentor me :)
<no0tic> right, warp10?
<norsetto> no0tic, warp10: this is not so good ...
<warp10> no0tic: it is, for just 10â¬/day and free beers
<no0tic> norsetto, because he is a new motu?
<norsetto> no0tic: no, becuase now you have an excuse to not talk english
<RoAkSoAx> lol
<joh> norsetto: Ok, thanks!
<warp10> hehehe
<joh> norsetto: What do you mean that I don't need dirs for just /usr/bin and /usr/sbin? How do I fix that?
<no0tic> norsetto, ahah
<norsetto> joh: remove it
<no0tic> norsetto, I have it anyway
<emgent> lol
<sebner> norsetto: don't bully our new members :P
<norsetto> sebner: you want me to bully you?
<sebner> norsetto: seems you are bored? ^^
<joh> norsetto: How? :P Sorry, I'm new to packaging.
<norsetto> warp10, no0tic: seriously, I'd rather prefer if no0tic has a non-italian mentor, but if you guys are happy I can't stop you
<norsetto> joh: errr, rm debian/dirs ?
<sebner> norsetto: hmm. When I'm a motu in some months I thought to mentor a friend of mine. also bad, hm?
<joh> norsetto: Aha! Now I get it :-)
<no0tic> norsetto, ok then, waiting for a non italian mentor I will start learning something from him and other italian devs, is it ok?
<warp10> norsetto: Yeah, I understand. no0tic, what do you think about that?
<norsetto> sebner: in general is a bad idea, it doesn't bode well for integration in an international team
<sebner> norsetto: hmm somehow true but when I'm in a query with a german MOTU we talk german ^^
<norsetto> sebner: but there is no rule, its good to have a friend helping you at least at the beginning
<RoAkSoAx> i have some similar issue, nxvl always tells me to ask him the questions here instead of doing it in -pe and spanish xD
<RoAkSoAx> and in spanish
<norsetto> sebner: you mean austrian :-)
<sebner> norsetto: rofl.
<norsetto> RoAkSoAx: yes, thats good
<RoAkSoAx> norsetto, yes indeed
<sebner> the later it gets the funnier norsetto becomes ^^
<norsetto> sebner: don't say that to my wife
<sebner> norsetto: does she think that you are drinking? ^^
<joh> norsetto: NEWS is empty, but required by automake-1.9. README contains a short description and build instructions.
<joh> norsetto: What cruft should I remove from rules?
<norsetto> sebner: well, the first time we met it was at a party where I got drunk :-)
<norsetto> joh: yes, but you don't need to add NEWS to docs then
<sebner> norsetto: hrhr oh my dear
<joh> norsetto: ok
<norsetto> joh: and, for what you tell me, it seems that README is also of no interest to an ubuntu user
<joh> norsetto: Ok, removed.
<joh> norsetto: So if my package is accepted, it will first be included in intrepid universe, not hardy?
<sebner> joh: yes
<norsetto> joh: yes, do you need to call dh_installexamples?
<joh> norsetto: Probably not, it was on by default. :-)
<norsetto> joh: dh_make is evil :-)
<joh> norsetto: Oh?
<RoAkSoAx> does anyone has an idea of how many packages someone has to work on before asking for a mentor?
<sebner> norsetto: a fan of black magic cdbs?
<norsetto> sebner: quite the contrary
<sebner> norsetto: well, at least dh_make gives a good starting point :)
<ajmitch> sebner: I'm sure he prefers yada instead
<sebner> ajmitch: hmm yada?
<norsetto> RoAkSoAx: there is no set rule, but the queue is pretty long, so only the most promising contributors get a chance
<joh> norsetto: Anything else I should change? :-)
<norsetto> ajmitch: ah yada ... the good memories
 * norsetto cries silently
<ajmitch> norsetto: running away screaming sort of memories?
<RoAkSoAx> norsetto, ok so i'll guess i'll have to work on lots of packages before asking for one :)
<norsetto> ajmitch: sorry, I'm busy collecting my hair from the floor
<norsetto> joh: that was just a cursory look to the diff, for some detailed comments it takes longer
<joh> norsetto: Ok, I'll upload the new version then. Thanks a lot :-)
<ScottK> no0tic: What norsetto is telling you is good advice.  My advice is don't seek a single mentor, but ask for advice here from everyone.
<no0tic> ScottK, nice
<ScottK> Asking here in the channel lets other MOTU see what advice you are given and correct it if it's not the best.
<ScottK> It also allows others to learn from the advice you are given.
<norsetto> joh: looks like you miss a build-depends
<joh> norsetto: Ok?
<emgent> ScottK: heya :)
<norsetto> joh: gnome-icon-theme
<ScottK> heya emgent
<joh> norsetto: Ah, true.
<sebner> gn8 folks :)
<no0tic> ScottK, nice, I will
<joh> norsetto: Added
<no0tic> ok, warp10 adivced me to create an hardy chroot and then upgrade it to intrepid, as far as at the moment it is not possibile to create it directly, is it correct?
<no0tic> I issued: sudo pbuilder create --basetgz /var/cache/pbuilder/hardy.tgz --distribution hardy
<norsetto> joh: I don't think the archive admins will complain too loudly, but all the sources in src/tests don't have an header containing license and copyright
<joh> norsetto: Ok, I'll add that as well.
<norsetto> joh: I stand correct, test_alarm.c does have it, but all the others not
<norsetto> corrected even
<joh> norsetto: Yeah, the others aren't real unit tests. Some are just random test programs. I could probably exclude some of them in the tarball.
<norsetto> joh: since you quote him in AUTHORS, is Lasse GullvÃ¥g SÃ¦tre a copyright holder for the artwork?
<joh> norsetto: Yeah, although he has agreed to release it under the GPL.
<joh> norsetto: Should I add him to debian/copyright?
<norsetto> joh: ok, but then you should quote him in debian/copyright as a copyright holder. You may want to specify of what too.
<joh> norsetto: Ok
<norsetto> joh: in hardy (and I guess also intrepid) /usr/share/common-licenses/GPL points to the GPL-3
<joh> norsetto: Oh, I'll update to GPL-2 then.
<norsetto> joh: having a watch file and a get-orig-source target in rules would be great
<joh> norsetto: Alright, how would I add that?
<norsetto> joh: they should be covered by the packaging guide
<norsetto> joh: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Recipes/DebianWatch
<joh> norsetto: Great! thanks
<norsetto> joh: here is an example of a get-orig-source target: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Examples/ChangingTheOrigTarball
<joh> norsetto: Ok, thanks again
<norsetto> joh: check out your control, there are a lot of blank spaces at each end of line
<joh> norsetto: What do you mean?
<norsetto> joh: when you used a CR to split lines, you left a blank space
<joh> norsetto: Aha, *fixing*
<joh> norsetto: Will debian/watch work with launchpad?
<norsetto> joh: not that I know
<pochu> could someone please subscribe me (pochu on lp) to this blueprint? https://blueprints.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/packaging-tools-usability
<pochu> I want to make sure bug 177508 is really fixed :)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 177508 in blueprint "Tell who subscribed you to a blueprint in the notification mail" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/177508
<norsetto> joh: do you really autotools-dev as a build-dep?
<norsetto> pochu: subscribed
<joh> norsetto: Not sure actually...
<tacone> norsetto: why is dh_make evil ? any url ?
<pochu> norsetto: thank you, I've already received the notification mail and indeed the bug isn't fixed yet...
<norsetto> tacone: dh_make makes some attempts at guessing what your package needs. You need to check it, not just take it for granted that it is ok (most of the time, it isn't fully)
<tacone> thanks norsetto
<joh> norsetto: I'm having trouble getting debian/watch to work with launchpad. Trying the instructions at https://answers.launchpad.net/launchpad/+question/21146
<norsetto> joh: ah ok, thats what you meant with "it is working with launchpad"
<joh> norsetto: Yep
<joh> norsetto: I tried with the following: https://launchpad.net/alarm-clock/+download https://launchpad.net/alarm-clock/trunk/.*/alarm-clock-(.+).tar.gz
<norsetto> joh: I don't know actually, I never had a package which was hosted on lp before
<Amaranth> um...
<Amaranth> this room list for UDS includes some extra info....
<joh> norsetto: Ok, how exactly does the watch matching work?
<norsetto> joh: you may want to ask in #launchpad, or check the file for another project which is hosted on lp
<joh> norsetto: Alright
<norsetto> joh: its checking for matches in the source file of the web page
<norsetto> I guess the <a href=""> tags
<joh> norsetto: Ah
<norsetto> joh: maybe you could try with your page, it should catch the links there
<norsetto> joh: you may also want to check the man page for uscan
<joh> norsetto: I guess, but it's wierd that it doesn't in launchpad...
<norsetto> joh: don't know, but http://launchpad.net/alarm-clock/trunk/0.2/+download doesn't exist
<joh> norsetto: Right, https://launchpad.net/alarm-clock/+download
<joh> Still won't work though
<joh> https://launchpad.net/alarm-clock/+download http://launchpad.net/alarm-clock/trunk/(.*)/+download/alarm-clock-(.+).tar.gz
<Nafallo> hmmm
<norsetto> gotta go, g'night all
<Nafallo> not in Ubuntu yet it seems :-/
<ajmitch> Nafallo: ?
<Nafallo> ajmitch: alarm-clock :-P
<Nafallo> ajmitch: looks like something I could have use for :-)
<ajmitch> Nafallo: because that's what joh is trying to get into ubuntu? :)
<Nafallo> ajmitch: yea, thought so :-)
<Nafallo> ajmitch: hopefully it's a quick process ;-)
<RAOF> joh: I've got a correct LP watch file in the gnome-do package.
<RAOF> joh: Although maybe not in Ubuntu's gnome-do package, I forget.  LP seems to have moved stuff around semi-recently.
<RAOF> joh: You can find a working example in pkg-cli-apps SVN in the gnome-do packaging.
<joh> RAOF: Thanks, just got it working though :) Had to escape the + in +download
<RAOF> Yup.  Otherwise that means "one or more of the previous character" :)
<joh> Mhm :-)
<RAOF> Technicaly, s/character/expression/
<joh> Great, works now :-)
#ubuntu-motu 2008-05-07
<joh> How would you typically invoke get-orig-source? Directly with debian/rules?
<joh> Is ${DEB_SOURCE_PACKAGE} set anywhere?
<cheatr> Could someone explain the difference between  Build-Depends and Build-Depends-Indep?
<pochu> joh: I think './debian/rules get-orig-source' is ok
<pochu> cheatr: -Indep are only used for building arch:all packages (they are only built once, usually on i386 for Ubuntu, whereas arch:any packages are built once for each architecture)
<mok0> cheatr: -indep are also used to run the clean target
<joh> pochu: Ok
<pochu> mok0: I thought packages used in clean should be in Build-Depends and not -Indep
<pochu> mok0: as you want to clean it in every architecture ;)
<joh> pochu: You always want to be able to clean the package though, arch dependent or not :-)
<mok0> pochu: you may be right
<joh> s/package/source tree/
<mok0> you have to be very careful with debian/rules to design it so it can build arch and indep targets independently of each other
<mok0> for example, if the indep package is doxygen generated documentation, you can put doxygen in Build-Depends-Indep
<mok0> pochu: I think the clean target is only called when you build the source package
<pochu> mok0: right, but if you build some arch:any packages in say hppa you will call the clean target, so you need things called in clean to be installed
<pochu> so they need to be in Build-Depends and not in -Indep
 * jdong thinks the new update-manager security update notification icon is evil and nice :)
<jdong> that bold red exclamation mark really gets the point across
<jdong> only thing that'd do it better is if in 7 days it turns into a glowing pair of red eyes...
<mok0> pochu: afaik the indep targets are only built on the i386 platform, all others are binary package only
<pochu> mok0: yes, but they will call clean anyway
<pochu> that's http://lintian.debian.org/reports/tags/clean-should-be-satisfied-by-build-depends.html
<pochu> "The specified package is required to run the clean target of debian/rules and therefore must be listed in Build-Depends, not Build-Depends-Indep, even if no architecture-dependent packages are built. "
<mok0> pochu: I stand corrected
<pochu> I should be misunderstanding you then
<pochu> 01:40 <      mok0> cheatr: -indep are also used to run the clean target
<mok0> Of course the easiest is to avoid using Build-Depends-Indep altogether :-P
<superm1> jdavies, got a few min?
<superm1> oops
<superm1> jdong,
<superm1> that is
<emgent> there is a big problem in pulseaudio
<emgent> now my laptop sound dont work
<jdong> superm1: reviewing for a test, but shoot if it's fast
<emgent> last ubuntu updates?
<pochu> good night
<superm1> jdong, no i am just trying to get you for more than 3 min to discuss this handbrake build system
<superm1> to see where you got on things
<jdong> superm1: I havent' given it much of a look
<superm1> o
<jdong> superm1: if the archive admins are okay with it carrying embedded versions of the libs it wants, I think we should just prefetch the versions it wants for it, then build statically against it
<jdong> superm1: i.e. do the fetching step while building the src pkg
<superm1> jdong, could you shoot an e-mail to ubuntu-devel about it ?
<jdong> superm1: I think this is not a bad idea either because we are talking about encoding against iPods and other sensitive-to-format devices and upstream often has good reason for picking said versions
<superm1> well not often, sometimes it 's just for convenience
<superm1> eg look at the date that they picked the version and the latest version available on that date
<jdong> superm1: I recall there being a big differential the last time I looked
<jdong> superm1: esp. for things like ffmpeg that change on a daily basis, it felt to me like they made particular choices
<superm1> jdong, well if ubuntu-devel says no, then i say we go to devs
<superm1> and talk to them about the choices they made
<superm1> and how hard coded they are on those versions
<jdong> superm1: agreed
<jdong> but we do have precedence for bundling encoders with volatile APIs
<jdong> VLC, mplayer (at some points), gstreamer, etc
 * superm1 shoves mythtv aside
<bddebian> Heya
<sommer> ScottK: uploaded an adjusted php5-clamav package to the ppa
<ScottK> sommer: Cool.  How did it go?
<sommer> ScottK: built and tested fine on my machine... basically the same issue as python-clamav
<ScottK> Cool.
<sommer> the url in the debian/copyright file is no longer active however
<ScottK> sommer: I'm asking the Debian clamav maintainer how he'd like to proceed now.
<sommer> ScottK: cool, which channel?  (I need to get more involved with debian :)
<ScottK> It's a PM at the moment.
<sommer> ah
<sommer> I also took a look at dansguardian, and there's a new up up stream release that covers 0.93
<sommer> is it better to backport or do an NMU, and sync?
<ScottK> I'll ask.
<sommer> ScottK: cool thanks
<ScottK> According to him dansguardian was just uploaded.  Would you check if it needs a merge or is we can just wait for it to sync.
<sommer> ScottK: sure, where do you chack for merges? :)
<ScottK> sommer: Look in Launchpad and see if there's an Ubuntu diff.
<sommer> ScottK: nm, reading https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/Merging
<ScottK> K
<sommer> ScottK: ah thanks, I'll do that too
<sommer> ScottK: from what I can tell after reading the merge page and the package page: http://packages.ubuntu.com/intrepid/dansguardian... a sync will be fine
<sommer> ScottK: is the package page the one you meant when refering to LP?
<ScottK> That's the one.
<sommer> great, I'll move on down the list
<ScottK> sommer: I tend to look on LP becuase it's more up to date.  We have it already: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/intrepid/+source/dansguardian/2.9.9.4-1
<sommer> ah, I always forget the /ubuntu/codename part of the url
<sommer> ScottK: that's the latest version on the dansguardian website, so we should be good
<ScottK> Would you please upload that to the PPA.
<sommer> sure
<ScottK> With an appropriate version number.
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, have you created a pbuilder already=
<RoAkSoAx> ?
<no0tic> not for intrepid
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, im building it without problems
<no0tic> I'm waiting the new disc! :)
<RoAkSoAx> i thought you already got it
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, anyways, i guess they fixed libc6 issue, but i did this and it is going good so far: sudo pbuilder create --distribution intrepid --othermirror "deb http://it.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu intrepid universe multiverse"
<CTho> !seen mario_limonciell
<ubottu> CTho: Error: I am only a bot, please don't think I'm intelligent :)
<sommer> ScottK: dansguarding == success, uploading to the ppa
<ScottK> sommer: Great.
<bddebian> Anyone very familiar with doxygen?
<ScottK> sommer: Would you please file a bug against php-clamavlib with a debdiff for your change and I'll upload it to Intrepid and then send it to Debian.
<sommer> sure will do
<sommer> ScottK: Bug #227588, in case it doesn't email you :)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 227588 in php-clamavlib "Patch for clamav-0.93" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/227588
<ScottK> sommer: Thanks
<sommer> np, think I'm going to call it a night... I'll update the wiki tomorrow
<ethana2> anderson58ken: hi
<ethana2> hey, could we get tesseract into repositories?
<ethana2> or is there some other OCR software already there?
<RoAkSoAx> ethana2, tesseract-ocr
<ethana2> oh
<ethana2> is there any way to make add/remove show things without gui frontends?
<ethana2> anderson58ken: sudo apt-get install tesseract-ocr
<RoAkSoAx> ethana2, you mean in the comand line?
<anderson58ken> y
<ethana2> nevermind ;)
<ethana2> back in 10
<ethana2> anderson58ken: you got it installed?
<dholbach> good morning
<RoAkSoAx> anyone here that can help me?
<ethana2> possibly
<RoAkSoAx> ethana2, packaging stuff ?
<ethana2> involving a package needing modification in or addition to ubuntu repos?
<ethana2> oh
<ethana2> yeah, this is the place
<ethana2> ...i think
<ethana2> (I'm not talking about /me/ though)
<RoAkSoAx> ethana2, yeah i know, but i ment you lol...
<ethana2> sorry ;(
<RoAkSoAx> ok np ;)
<RoAkSoAx> seems everyone is sleeping
<RAOF> !ask | RoAkSoAx
<ubottu> RoAkSoAx: Please don't ask to ask a question, ask the question (all on ONE line, so others can read and follow it easily). If anyone knows the answer they will most likely answer. :-)
<RoAkSoAx> RAOF  i know that.. but at this time of the day everyone is sleeping so i was just wondering is someone was alive that could helo me
<RoAkSoAx> RAOF, you expert in packaging?
<RAOF> RoAkSoAx: I'm a MOTU.  I can _probably_ help.
<RAOF> RoAkSoAx: The nice thing about worldwide collaboration is that someone's _always_ awake.  It's mid afternoon here :)
<ethana2> late evening here :)
<RoAkSoAx> RAOF, here is almost 1 hour after midnight xD
<ethana2> I mean, it's 9:53, but since we're so far north, still very bright out
<RoAkSoAx> RAOF, ok 'll explaing my prob... i did a merge and after doing the necessary changes i tried to build the binary and i got this error: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/10679/
<RoAkSoAx> RAOF, since it shows problem with patch 99_... i supposed i had to drop the patch and i did it... so after dropping, i built another source package and then tried to build the binary again and i got this error: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/10680/
<warp10> Good morning
<RoAkSoAx> any ideas what could be wrong?
<RoAkSoAx> good morning warp10
<warp10> hi RoAkSoAx
<RAOF> RoAkSoAx: Right; so, this is one of autotools less endearing features.
<RoAkSoAx> RAOF, so what should i do?
<RAOF> What's happened is that someone has made some changes to the build system, presumably to make it look for mozilla-xpcom in teh right place or something.
<RAOF> Changing the build system requires re-running autoconf, which shouldn't be done at package build time because it makes things non-deterministic (or less obviously deterministic).
<RAOF> So, you re-run autoconf and then work out the diff between the new buildsystem files and the old files; this is what 99_... was.
<RoAkSoAx> ok, the Build-Depends in debian/control are: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/10681/ and i think mozilla-com is this package: xulrunner-1.9-dev (something to note, MoM only showed me that there were conflics on the Build-Depends)
<RAOF> This indicates that the packaging is non-trivial; you'll need to understand what's being patched and why before you can actually perform the merge.
<RAOF> (Moreso than usual; you should have at least a basic understanding of the packaging for any merge, and checking for that is part of the sponsorship duties)
<RoAkSoAx> RAOF, that patch was for:   * rerun autotools
<RoAkSoAx>     - debian/patches/99_autotools_rerun.patch
<RAOF> RoAkSoAx: Yeah; I know.  What you need to work out is what part of the buildsystem was patched, why it was patched, and probably end up re-running autotools and creating a new 99_autotools_rerun.patch.
<RAOF> One of the previous patches probably touches a Makefile.am or configure.ac; that's the buildsystem change you're interested in.
<RoAkSoAx> RAOF, do you have any documentation that i can see to do it (i'm just learning packaging =)
<RAOF> RoAkSoAx: I'd suggest trying a different merge if you're just learning; build system changes are always ugly and autotools is the work of Satan.
<RoAkSoAx> RAOF, what if i've already reported it and suscribed to u-u-s ? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/blam/+bug/226670
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 226670 in blam "[wishlist]Please merge blam 1.8.5-1 from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<RAOF> RoAkSoAx: You shouldn't have subscribed u-u-s until you'd finished the merge.  u-u-s subscription should be once you've finished and have uploaded the debdiff.
<RAOF> RoAkSoAx: I'm a member of u-u-s, so I can unsubscribe; you'll want to unassign yourself from the bug with a comment that it's free.
<ethana2> DANGIT
<ethana2> Satan on irc.freenode.net is already registered
<RoAkSoAx> RAOF, yep now i know i shouldn't have, but i did what i was told there... and i just realized of this problem when redoing the merge (because i wanted to redoit to get more familiarized)
<RAOF> RoAkSoAx: Did you upload that debdiff without testing that it built?
<ethana2> I was going to have him show up and denounce it ;)
<RAOF> Heh.
 * RAOF stops trying to chase the null pointer through nv40 gallium.
<ethana2> oh?
<ethana2> RAOF: is it close to being usable?
<ethana2> RAOF: the FOSS nVidia drivers?
<RAOF> ethana2: Depends on what you mean by "usable".  ~
<RAOF> Yes, the foss nvidia drivers.
<ethana2> Human Being playing tremulous
<ethana2> ...usable?
<RAOF> Dunno.  Never tried tremulous.
<ethana2> nexuiz?
<ethana2> any 3d thing
<RAOF> It works for neverput & neverball.
<RAOF> And PPracer
<ethana2> sweeeet!
<ethana2> compiz?
<RAOF> And OpenArena
<ethana2> does OpenArena work well with it?
<RAOF> No, not compiz.  It doesn't yet support a bunch of necessary hooks.
<RAOF> Yes.
<ethana2> but it probably will soon, right?
<RoAkSoAx> RAOF, in my learning process i didn't realized that it haven't built the first time... and as i said... i just realized that it didn't when redoing it :(
<ethana2> within 6 months?
<RAOF> ethana2: Dunno.  If Canonical hired a full time dev, my answer would be 'almost certainly, and we'd be shipping nouveau by default for nv40'.
<ethana2> ok then
<ethana2> my Ubuntu dell will be an nVidia card
<RAOF> But it depends.
<ethana2> is nv40 what's in the 8400gs?
<RAOF> Noooooo.
<ethana2> oh
<ethana2> what's the 8400gs?
<RAOF> nv4x == 6xxx/7xxx, nv5x = 8xxx/9xxx
<ethana2> ah
<ethana2> are there any exceptions to that?
<RAOF> nv5x is currently undersupported.  I'm not sure if there's _any_ 3d for it yet, and 2d is very much unfinished.
<RAOF> ethana2: No, I don't think so.  Not like that stupid Geforce 4 MX business.
<ethana2> I think I heard about that card today....
<ethana2> when i mentioned my radeon 9200se
<ethana2> something about sucking horribly, i may be mistaken
<RAOF> Yeah; the GF4MX was _actually_ a GF2 chip.
<RoAkSoAx> RAOF, so... you going to unsuscribe it from u-u-s and i should do that too and add a comment that it is free to be merged??
<RAOF> RoAkSoAx: Yes.
<RAOF> RoAkSoAx: Unsubscribed.
<ethana2> RAOF: well it sounds like you wouldn't consider nv5x support to be a /problem/ in the future
<ethana2> just the present
<ethana2> that's good enough for me to buy one I guess
<RAOF> That's true; I'd be buying ATI at this point though.
<ethana2> my other option on the Dell Inspiron is the X3100
<ethana2> 1/2.8x the power of the 8400gs
<RoAkSoAx> RAOF, ok thanks, and sorry for the inconvenience... but i would still like to have documentation to work on it and just learn by myself... got any?
<ethana2> and I'm going to be watchin peach and playing apricot, so I need all the power I can get ;)
<RAOF> Yeah.  If it wasn't blown out of the water by ATI or nvidia cards, I'd be totally there.
 * ethana2 goes to leave you fine gentlemen alone now
<RAOF> RoAkSoAx: I'm not sure if I've seen any 'patch the buildsystem' documentation.  I certainly can't remember any.
<ethana2> thanks for all the info, RAOF
<RoAkSoAx> RAOF, ok thanks, and sorry for the inconvenience  =(
<RAOF> No inconvenience at all!
<RAOF> Feel free to ask as many questions as you like; much easier to learn from other peoples experience than from your own mistakes :)
<RoAkSoAx> yeah thanks very much for your help RAOF :D
<CrippledCanary> could someone pleas look at possibly sponsor Bug #224241
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 224241 in smstools "smstools stop working after upgrade" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/224241
<slytherin> where can I see how many packages are there in u-u-s queue? Just curious.
<Hobbsee> bugs.lp.net/~ubuntu-universe-sponsors
<slytherin> Hobbsee: guess what, your link does not go to launchpad. :-P
<Hobbsee> slytherin: expand it :)
 * Hobbsee typed it from memory, rather than visiting
<slytherin> Hobbsee: still you should check it. There is actually a site called lp.net. :-)
 * Hobbsee thought you would be skilled enough to automatically expand it.
<Hobbsee> apologies for not typing every single character.
<slytherin> Hobbsee: are you being serious? It is not your fault. I overlooked it. No offense meant.
<Hobbsee> slytherin: oh ;)
<Hobbsee> slytherin: sorry, i'm still kinda stunned at the stuff that has come out in -meeting today.
<Hobbsee> so i'm trying to be careful, and not break rules that i don't know about
<\sh> Hobbsee, one solution: just swear at me..I'm used to it ;)
 * norsetto swears at \sh
<Hobbsee> \sh: i can't.  even if i apologise to you, i'm still a leader in stuff related to ubuntu, and so it gets held against me forever.
<Hobbsee> \sh: i'm unsure if it makes a difference if the apology is publically logged or not, but i do hope not to need to try it.
 * \sh doesn't file complains for every little crap said in any channel here
<Hobbsee> yes, you don't.  but others might, on behalf of you, and it still gets me lynched.
<Hobbsee> see the -meeting earlier :)
<Hobbsee> (this is the kind of stuff as to why i'm still stunned)
<\sh> Hobbsee, oh hell yes...the moses problem and the hundreds of thousands laws around them
<\sh> no crime without a law
 * slytherin searches meeting log
<laga> slomo__: URL? ;)
<laga> err, slytherin. sorry.
<slytherin> laga: I am not sure I have found the right one, I just started reading it. - http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2008/05/06/%23ubuntu-meeting.txt
<laga> ugh. interesting drama.
<i4x> good morning!!
<i4x> hugs for everybody!..
<Hobbsee> laga: unfortunately, yes ;)
<ajmitch> did I miss something interesting?
<\sh> ajmitch, you miss all the funny things ;) /me too ;)
<norsetto> all bow to huats (so that he will give you an ubuntu t-shirt)
<mok0> Please remind me: how can I list all packages that provide a certain meta-package?
<pochu> mok0: do you mean that provide a virtual package?
<mok0> pochu: yes, I need to know what packages provide libgl-dev
<pochu> If so, 'aptitude show $package' will do the trick
<mok0> pochu: THANKS!
<mok0> pochu: AFAIK some of the proprietary Nvidia packages also include a version of GL
<mok0> pochu: I hope they provide that virtual package as well...
<wgrant> mok0: IIRC they divert something.
<mok0> wgrant: ok, great
<wgrant> So they probably won't provide them.
<pochu> what's the right place to explain the renaming of a source package? debian/README.Debian-source?
<pochu> hmm, README.source
<wgrant> Isn't it README.source?
 * wgrant checks.
<wgrant> There's a standard now.
<mok0> pochu: copyright I think
<wgrant> mok0: No.
<mok0> README.source has been discussed on the DD list
<mok0> As I understand it, it's for explaining how to build a source package that can not be done using the standard tools
<pochu> http://lists.debian.org/debian-devel-announce/2008/04/msg00016.html
<pochu> but I'm not sure this can be included here
<pochu> "a
<pochu> package where one one cannot unpack the source package with dpkg-source -x
<pochu> and immediately get the source that would be built"
<mok0> pochu: right
<wgrant> pochu: Are you renaming binaries as well?
<pochu> here if you can do 'dpkg-source -x' I assume you already have it packaged, so the renaming of the upstream tarball has already been done...
<gnomefreak> anyone with a intrepid system/chroot can you please try gpg --edit-key adduid <keyID> or <email for key>? im trying to add an address to my key and its not working
<mok0> pochu: in what way are you renaming a source package?
<pochu> wgrant: this is because there's too 'alarm-clock' packages been packaged, one in Debian and one in REVU, so I'm suggesting the REVU packager to rename it (or to talk to the Debian owner of the ITP)
<gnomefreak> and it prints gpg info (version, ect...) than back to command propmt
<wgrant> pochu: Is it already in Ubuntu?
<joh> pochu: Hi, could you please see my comment on revu regarding alarm-clock?
<pochu> so he has proposed to rename it to alarm-clock-applet, but that would need to be done to the source package too, which should then be documented
<pochu> oh joh, you're here :)
<pochu> wgrant: nope
<slytherin> gnomefreak: shouldn't keyid be immediately after --edit-key?
<joh> Hah, you're talking about my app :P
<wgrant> pochu: Why would you document it, then?
<gnomefreak> slytherin: i thought adduid was but maybe that is after getting into gpg :) thanks ill try
<mok0> pochu: I would think changelog, then, that's what I am doing with mesa-glw
<wgrant> pochu: No point documenting it if it's only on REVU.
<joh> pochu: Why would the source package need to be renamed btw? The binary itself is named 'alarm-clock-applet' for what it's worth...
<gnomefreak> slytherin: thanks that was it
<pochu> joh: because (I think) there can't be two source packages with the same name
<pochu> wgrant: well, it will some day hit the archive and if I go and update it I would like to know what changes have been done to it
<joh> pochu: Ah you meant that source package. I thought you were talking about the original tarballs. Sure :-)
<pochu> wgrant: although I think i see your point, that it's obvious to what it has been renamed looking at the actual name
<mok0> What's the difference between the two alarm clocks?
<wgrant> pochu: It hasn't been renamed if it was only known by the old name on REVU.
<joh> mok0: the one in debian is a stand-alone python app, mine's a gnome applet.
<pochu> wgrant: ah, sorry, with renaming I mean renaming from the upstream tarball, not from an old package
<wgrant> pochu: No need for a comment.
<pochu> I mean, this is not a transition
<mok0> joh: then I think the package should be called alarm-clock-gnome-applet
<joh> mok0: Really? Cause other gnome-applets have names ending only in -applet, like sensors-applet.
<mok0> pochu: I would think it is sufficient to document in the changelog
<wgrant> alarm-clock-applet
<wgrant> It's not a change!
<mok0> ah well
<joh> wgrant: *nod*
<wgrant> it doesn't need documentation.
<pochu> ok
<mok0> As someone running kubuntu, it is nice to be able to see from the package name that the applet is for gnome
<mok0> But that's only my 2 cents
<wgrant> mok0: Other GNOME applets are -applet.
<wgrant> Aren't KDE applets plasmoids?
<mok0> wgrant: yeah
<mok0> wgrant: plasmoids? :-)
<wgrant> It does seem odd to just call them -applet, but it's also odd to not follow convention.
<pochu> well, the description is "Description: Alarm Clock applet for the GNOME panel"
<mok0> wgrant: it's probably wise to follow convention
<wgrant> mok0: Plasma has plasmoids.
<norsetto> whats wrong with gnome-alarmclock-applet?
<mok0> I like the sound of that
<joh> So what changes are needed to change the name? Other than editing control and changelog?
<mok0> joh: that's it
<joh> norsetto: Well, it's not officially part of gnome so I'm a bit reluctant about branding it that way...
<joh> mok0: Nothing in rules needed?
<mok0> joh: is the applet already in hh?
<joh> mok0: hh?
<mok0> hardy heron
<joh> mok0: no
<norsetto> joh: it doesn't need to be officially in gnome for that
<pochu> joh: that's for the binary package. for the source package, rename the orig.tar.gz and move the alarm-clock-*/ directory to the new name
<norsetto> joh: see gnome-mplayer as an example
<joh> pochu: ok, thanks.
<\sh> grmpf
<joh> norsetto: That's true.
<\sh> damnit
<norsetto> joh: btw, it fails compilation in intrepid, did you check if it compiles with gcc-4.3?
<\sh> who the hell packaged this tool
<joh> norsetto: Haven't tested against intrepid yet now...
<joh> norsetto: *no
<\sh> fireflier-client-kde doesn't depend on fireflier-server neither recommends it
<norsetto> joh: I'm getting few warnings (unused variables, implicit declarations) and a couple of fatal errors
<wgrant> \sh: Why should a client need a server?
<norsetto> joh: alarm.c:1858: error: expected ')' before ';' token
<joh> norsetto: I'll look into it. Probably a missing header.
<\sh> wgrant, it should recommend it actually :)
<\sh> or suggests
<joh> norsetto: Could you pastebin the whole output please?
<norsetto> joh: yes
<\sh> wgrant, I just thought it's a stupid frontend for iptables ;)
<wgrant> \sh: If it is client-server one might conceivably want the client without the server.
<norsetto> joh: for the fatal error is just that and alarm.c:1858: error: too few arguments to function 'g_timeout_add_seconds'
<\sh> wgrant, yes..but it should actually point someone to "hey, there is actually a server, and this tool does not use iptables only" ;)
<wgrant> \sh: .*client.* matches.
<joh> norsetto: That's wierd, which version of glib?
<joh> Alright, alarm-clock-applet source package uploaded to revu
<norsetto> joh: the one currently in intrepid, in my build log is libglib2.0-0 2.16.3-1
<joh> norsetto: They wouldn't change API from 2.14 to 2.16 though. How can I test this out myself without upgrading my entire system? pbuilder?
<\sh> ah damnit..I'll hack manually my iptables...so I know it works out of the box ;)
<norsetto> joh: yes
<joh> \sh: If you're looking for a frontend to iptables, shorewall is pretty nice.
 * norsetto -> lunch
<jdavies> norsetto: bon appetit
<broonie> stgraber: Is there any great reason why pastebinit isn't in Debian?
<stgraber> broonie: the debian packager not having uploaded it yet :)
<stgraber> broonie: David Paleino is supposed to do it (last I spoke with him)
<broonie> stgraber: Ah. I've got someone else (Rolf Leggewie) wanting me to sponsor an upload of it just now.
<stgraber> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=425226
<ubottu> Debian bug 425226 in wnpp "ITP: pastebinit -- command-line pastebin client" [Wishlist,Open]
<stgraber> that bug is almost one year old :)
<broonie> And no activity.
<broonie> Plus the initial ITP is malformed.
<broonie> OK, thanks.
<stgraber> np
<joh> How exactly do I create an intrepid chroot with pbuilder? I tried upgrading my hardy build with DIST=intrepid sudo pbuilder update --override-config --othermirror "deb http://no.archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ intrepid main" but there are package conflicts...
<stgraber> joh: sudo pbuilder --distribution intrepid create
<joh> stgraber: Ok, thanks
<joh> sudo pbuilder --create --distribution intrepid: E: No such script: /usr/share/debootstrap/scripts/intrepid
<jw2328_> joh: do you have hardy-backports enabled>
<joh> jw2328_: no?
<james_w> you need it so that the updated debootstrap that knows how to create intrepid can be installed.
<joh> Ok, I'll try that then
<slytherin> joh: upgrade is not working due to a bug. And create is not working due to another bug. :-P
<joh> slytherin: Seems to be working now though :P
<joh> Or not...
<slytherin> joh: What is working? create or upgrade?
<jcfp> until libc6 fails to install...
<joh> slytherin: create, but: W: http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/intrepid/main/binary-amd64/Packages.bz2 was corrupt
<joh> W: Failure trying to run: chroot /var/cache/pbuilder/build/13869/. mount -t proc proc /proc
<slytherin> joh: please tell me once you are finished with the create process. Last time Itried it didn't work.
<joh> slytherin: It didn't work here either. pbuilder: debootstrap failed
<mok0> ls
<mok0> focus error, sorry
<joh> Could someone please review http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=alarm-clock-applet ?
<mok0> joh: collapse your changelog entry into just one
<joh> mok0: Ok
<mok0> joh: in rules, remove the sample comment at the top
<joh> mok0: The entire comment?
<mok0> joh: and remove the debhelper calls that have been commented out and that you're not using
<mok0> joh: yes
<mok0> joh: that's the custom
<mok0> joh: get rid of all not needed fluff
<mok0> :)
<joh> Done :-)
<mok0> joh: also, the #ifeq ... stuff, it seems you always want to compile w/o optimization
<joh> mok0: Yeah, for debugging purposes actually...
<joh> mok0: Is that a bad idea?
<mok0> joh: if someone else is ever to take a look at the package, s/he will not know why that is still there, if it is commented out for debugging, or what. So it's best to remove it
<joh> mok0: I meant -O0 was for debugging purposes, not the commented out block :-)
<mok0> joh: in fact, it's just boilerplate left over from the template
<joh> *nod*
<mok0> joh: ah!
<mok0> joh: well, then activate it :-)
<joh> -O0 makes gdb backtraces more sensible though - better bug reports :P
<mok0> joh: in .pod file, spelling mistake: "appelt"
<joh> Whups :P
<mok0> joh: also, avoid "speech" style: It's -> It is
<joh> Alright
<slytherin> Do you have any policy about 'machine interpretable copyright'?
<mok0> joh: same in control
<joh> mok0: Ok, fixed
<mok0> joh: that's all at the moment... nice work!
<joh> mok0: Great, thanks for your help!
<mok0> joh: sorry, I don't have time to build and test the application, I need to go soon
<joh> mok0: No problem, when/if you have time let me know if it works or not ;-)
<joh> Changes uploaded.
<joh> Too bad I'm unable to test it in intrepid though.
<mok0> joh: yeah ii is not really ready yet
<joh> mok0: Yeah, but norsetto reported he had trouble building it in ii...
<mok0> It's in a state of flux at the moment... I am sure it will stabilize in a few weeks
<joh> Alright :-)
<mok0> New packages from Debian unstable are streaming in
<emgent> heya
<mok0> norsetto: ping
<mok0> wgrant: ping
<wgrant> mok0: Morning.
<mok0> wgrant: I need a pair of eyes to look at my split-out package for the GLw libraries
<wgrant> Oh dear.
<mok0> wgrant: are you available?
<wgrant> I guess so, though my library packaging knowledge isn't great.
<mok0> wgrant: I will post a debdiff to Debian's mesa package, hang on
<wgrant> mok0: You need to split the source...
<Hobbsee> oh no, jono's here.
<Hobbsee> everyone behave.
<mok0> wgrant: I did
<mok0> wgrant: but I need to know if I did it correctly :-)
<jono> hey
<mok0> wgrant: Bug #227712
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 227712 in ubuntu "[needs-packaging] GLw libraries from Mesa" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/227712
<mok0> wgrant: It is only modifications to the packaging, not the building of the libraries
 * mok0 thinks there should be a XS-Original-Source: field to tell the merging system that this is a source package splitoff
<norsetto> mok0: pong
<joh> norsetto: The reason alarm-clock-applet didn't compile was actually a bug in the source. Fixed now :-)
<norsetto> joh: cool
<ramvi> ï»¿I've made a deb using checkinstall. It works great, but when I add it to my repository apt-get returns: E: Problem parsing dependency Depends \ E: Error occurred while processing eeepc-wlan (NewVersion1) \ E: Problem with MergeList /var/lib/apt/lists/... / E: The package lists or status file could not be parsed or opened.
<ramvi> What am I doing wrong?
 * Hobbsee shrugs
<Hobbsee> checkinstall isn't supported here, sorry.
<Hobbsee> checkinstall often doesn't work, and is known to produce strange output.
<ramvi> Ok, thanks
<wgrant> And is completely offtopic for here.
<joaopinto> and you should learn regular packaging instead
<ramvi> The thing is: I've read the packaging guide about 10 times now. Using debhelper, I don't understand why I don't get a deb after running sudo pbuilder build ../*.dsc
<ramvi> I get changes, diff.gz, dsc, build, but no deb
<Hobbsee> ramvi: probably because you're not looking in /var/cache/pbuilder/result, or wherever you've specified it to be?
<ramvi> Haha, that should be in the docs some where
<ramvi> Thanks! Plenty of debs :p
<Hobbsee> ....
<Hobbsee> ramvi: try man pbuilder
<Hobbsee> ramvi: scroll down to the section where it says '--buildresult'
<Hobbsee> ramvi: see the sections in bold, in those couple of paragraphs.
<Hobbsee> !pbuilder
<ubottu> pbuilder is a system to easily build packages in a clean chroot environment. To get started with PBuilder, see http://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto
<ramvi> thanks
<ramvi> Soon I'm a motu
<joaopinto> just make sure you read the mans first :P
<joh> norsetto: Let me know if you get the time to try building alarm-clock-applet btw.
<ramvi> I'm building a kernel module for the Eeepc, but sudo pbuilder build ../*.dsc returns Makefile.inc:66: *** /lib/modules/2.6.24-16-generic/build is missing, please set KERNELPATH.  Stop.
<jdavies> ramvi: have you st KERNELPATH?
<ramvi> The default seems good: /lib/modules/$(shell uname -r)/build
<ramvi> But I guess it isn't as I get that message
<bddebian> Heya gang
<Iulian> Hi bddebian
<bddebian> Hello Iulian
<wgrant> ramvi: You are actually build-depending on the requisite packages, right...?
<ramvi> wgrant: didn't think there were any dependencies. Other then the kernel maybe.. Should I depent on linux*-generic?
<wgrant> ramvi: If you need a part of it to build, you probably do want it installed, yes.
<ramvi> wgrant: linux-source. That's it?
<wgrant> ramvi: Check what other kernel module packages do.
<ramvi> Thanks! I'm trying with this now:
<ramvi> Build-Depends: debhelper (>= 5), bzip2, linux-source, linux-generic, linux-headers-generic, linux-image-generic, linux-restricted-modules-generic, linux-restricted-modules-common
<wgrant> ramvi: Please look at other kernel module packages so you can do it properly.
<ramvi> OK, please tell me one to check out
<wgrant> I'm not quite sure. virtualbox-ose-modules, perhaps.
<ramvi> Thanks
<ramvi> Oh my, this is too hard. Can someone five minutes out of their day and make a deb of http://snapshots.madwifi.org/special/madwifi-nr-r3366+ar5007.tar.gz for all the Asus Eee users out there? Please pretty please
<joh> ramvi: Did you read the packaging howto on the wiki?
<ramvi> Yes. Several times
<gnomefreak> did you try the debian dir from the stable one in the repos?
<gnomefreak> and adapt it that way might give you a good starting point atleast
<ramvi> gnomefreak: What do you mean?
 * gnomefreak not saying its the best way to do it but see if it works
<gnomefreak> ramvi: we have madwifi in archives afaik grab the source and use it to help with building it
<wgrant> gnomefreak: Not in any separate source...
<ramvi> gnomefreak: It's part of linux-restricted-modules
<gnomefreak> cant copy the top level dir over to new source and fix as needed
<gnomefreak> oh
<gnomefreak> thats gonna be a beast to do if you havent done much packaging from new package
<ramvi> or you could help me? ;)
<gnomefreak> are repos dead?
<gnomefreak> ramvi: not with that i cant thats above my head, as in ive never done anything kernel related
<gnomefreak> maybe its just smart that died while fetching
<ramvi> oh, ok :)
<broonie> ramvi: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/EeePC FWIW
<jdong> ramvi: I had such a .deb that compiles-on-boot the madwifi module; currently I only have the packaging for the regular madwifing-trunk but it would work with a svn URL to the ar5007 branch too
<ramvi> broonie: Most of that is from my wiki :) ubuntu-eee.tuxfamily.org
 * jdong looks at where he put it
<ramvi> jdong: what does that mean? Sound good
<jdong> ramvi: install the deb, it compiles the module. Every boot, it checks via a bootscript if the module is loadable. If not, it rebuilds it.
<ramvi> Wow, great!
<jdong> ramvi: source package tarballed here http://jdong.mit.edu/~jdong/macbook/crackwifi.tar.gz
<jdong> ramvi: running debuild checks it out from svn
<ramvi> jdong: love you
<jdong> ramvi: see debian/rules to customize the rule that grabs madwifi... the package collects ./madwifi so you can get it from a tarball too
<jdong> ramvi: a bit rough around the edges but should be a very good starting position.
<jdong> as a bonus, it depends on the kernel headers so you never end up in a case where after an upgrade you can't build the module
<jdong> (all MOTU REVUers should probably look far away from that package....)
<ramvi> hehe, thanks!
<persia> jdong: You didn't put it in REVU did you?
<jdong> or use it as an example for how NOT to do an Ubuntu package ;-)
<jdong> persia: no :)
<jdong> persia: I wouldn't torment you guys THAT much when it's not april 1st
<Hobbsee> jdong: and somehow, you got upload rights...
 * persia breathes again.  The automatix upload was enough for at least two releases...
<jdong> Hobbsee: it was a personal package, never meant to see the light of day ;-)
<ramvi> Just did though
<bobbo> Is anyone around to sponsor a debdiff for me?
<cbx33> hey guys
<cbx33> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/kdenlive/+bug/223260
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 223260 in kdenlive "Kdenlive crashes loading saved .kdenlive files" [Undecided,New]
<cbx33> do those backtraces make sence to any one??
<taishi28012> quit
<ScottK> jdong: I'm thinking we need to add a rule in backports about transitional packages.  We're dropping a bunch of them Hardy -> Intrepid and to backport across that boundary would really suck on upgrades.
<jdong> ScottK: (brain offline) you mean to {reject, prefer source-change to hardy-like convention} backports that involve a package transition?
<persia> jdong: did you mean "intrepid-like" convention?
 * persia excitedly points at https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-motu/2008-May/003776.html and encourages people to brainstorm
<persia> Does anyone know the status of the various "click-to-install" solutions?  Either third-party or core repository?
<laga> apt-url can point to packages available from sources.list AFAIK
<laga> "is there some way we can help you with your own deb, stuff that makes
<laga> things easier for you?
<laga> "
<laga> for the love of god - open source the damn thing or make it suck less.
<persia> Can Adobe craft a special link on their page that points at our flashplugin-nonfree?
<laga> persia: yes
<laga> persia: http://www.mythbuntu.org/existing-ubuntu
<persia> laga: If you understand how, would you mind explaining it to Sebastian?
<laga> we do that for mythbuntu
<laga> persia: i'm not subscribed to ubuntu-motu, sorry.
<laga> apt:mythbuntu-desktop?section=universe <- but it looks straight forward
<persia> laga: Well, you could send a reply there, and it would likely get approved in the moderation queue...
<laga> alright.
<persia> laga: Thanks.  I thought it was possible, but really don't understand the mechanics.  As much as I'm not a fan of non-free, it might help resolve part of the whole "Cannot install flash" mess for quite a few people.
<laga> interesting. it doesn't work in kubuntu in firefox for me. might just be a fluke, though
<laga> done
<persia> laga: Thanks a lot.
<xander21c> Hello :D
<xander21c> i traying to do a merge i got all the tools but how do i choose a package?
<persia> xander21c: You're typically encouraged to merge packages for which you've previously applied the patch, and so are responsible for the deviation.
<persia> If you have listed with your name on merges.ubuntu.com, you can look at others.
<persia> First, check to make sure there's no comment about it on dad.dunnewind.net, and no merge bug in launchpad.
<persia> Those conditions satisfied, it's considered nice to highlight the last uploader and tell them you are planning a merge, to avoid duplicated work.
<persia> Many people are busy with one thing or another, and would be happy to have your assistance with their merges.
<xander21c> persia for example  pidgin-libnotify has no comment in DaD so i email to the last uploader before merge
<persia> xander21c: Right.  This might take a bit.  Would you like something else to work on whilst you wait?
<xander21c> actually yes, i am really newbie on this, so i hope my questions are notÂ annoying
<persia> Not annoying at all.  Thanks for being intersted in helping.  It's merge season, so there's lots of talk about merges, but there's always plenty else to do as well.
<ScottK> jdong: I mean if there are transitional packages that were dropped in Hardy, don't backport past Hardy our you end up with a mess.
<persia> xander21c: Two classes of stuff that might be good for someone starting would be package updates, or bugfixes.  For updates see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Howtos/PackageUpdate and http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/uehs/
<persia> xander21c: For bugfixes see https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs and https;//wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing
<mok0__> I need a fresh pair of eyes to take a look at my mesa package split, bug 227712
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 227712 in ubuntu "[needs-packaging] GLw libraries from Mesa" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/227712
<xander21c> ok :D
<xander21c> persia: will be back after careful reading
<mok0_> i'm on the train... just went under a tunnel and lost connection :-)
<norsetto> mok0: about bug 227712, I'm not very clear of what you want to do. Are you using the mesa tarball to create a new source package and two new binary packages?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 227712 in ubuntu "[needs-packaging] GLw libraries from Mesa" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/227712
<RoAkSoAx> hi all.. i need some help here.. why a package... when trying to build the source will show this:
<RoAkSoAx>  fakeroot debian/rules clean
<RoAkSoAx> debian/rules:10: *** target file `clean' has both : and :: entries.  Stop.
<RoAkSoAx> dpkg-buildpackage: failure: fakeroot debian/rules clean gave error exit status 2
<pochu> RoAkSoAx: how's the line containing 'clean'?
<RoAkSoAx> pochu, i figured out... the package in new debian version changed to CDBS so i removed the hole debian/rules and just left include /usr/share/cdbs/1/rules/debhelper.mk
<RoAkSoAx> include /usr/share/cdbs/1/class/autotools.mk
<RoAkSoAx>  and the source build without any problems
<pochu> alright
<RoAkSoAx> pochu, but now i got an error when building the binary
<pochu> pastebin it :)
<RoAkSoAx> pochu, ok but first, i'm working with "atanks" (trying to merge it)
<RoAkSoAx> MoM showed me conflicts in:
<RoAkSoAx>   C* debian/atanks.desktop
<RoAkSoAx>   C  debian/atanks.install
<RoAkSoAx>   C  debian/rules
<RoAkSoAx> atanks.desktop easy to fix aswell as atanks.install... but before checking out debian/rules i checked the changelod
<RoAkSoAx> pochu, so changelog is this one: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/10790/
<devfil_> RoAkSoAx: http://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/atanks/+bug/227416
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 227416 in atanks "Please sync atanks 2.9-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)." [Wishlist,Confirmed]
<RoAkSoAx> i can see that now... well that bug already answered my question cuz i was thinking it was a sync.. that bug wasn't there yesterday... thanks devfil_
<devfil_> RoAkSoAx: I did it yesterday, I didn't know that you wanted to work at the package... sorry
<pochu> hey devfil_!
<RoAkSoAx> devfil_, nah it is ok, i'm just learning =)
<devfil_> hi pochu :)
<devfil_> RoAkSoAx: I'm learning  too
<RoAkSoAx> devfil_, and there are lots of packages to work with =)
<devfil_> pochu: how are you?
<Arby> working on a merge and the newer Debian version has older Build-Depends versions than the current ubuntu version, which should I use?
<Arby> this is the diff http://paste.ubuntu.com/10793/
<vorian> the new version
<RoAkSoAx> Arby, and change standards-version to the newer one
<Arby> vorian: the newer package or the newer build-depends
<vorian> the newer standards version
<vorian> and versions in general in this kde package
<Arby> standards version I knew about, it was the build depends that had me confused
<geser> Arby: is it documented why the versioned Build-Depends are higher?
<geser> in debian/changelog
<Arby> not that I've found yet
<Arby> looking back
<Arby> no, nothing in debian changelog
<Arby> I'll try the newer build depends and see if it builds
<wasabi> Any policy information common for packages that provide software that should run as a particular user?
<wasabi> As in, how should you prompt the user for the account to use? Debconf?
<wasabi> Should you offer to create a new system user if one does not exist? Etc.
<RoAkSoAx> when doing a merge, whne we have this fields Vcs-Svn: and Vcs-Browser:, in debian/control, should we keep them in ubuntu?
<geser> RoAkSoAx: yes, no need to remove them (and adding some extra diff for nothing)
<james_w> geser: I disagree
<RoAkSoAx> geser, what about the uploaders field?
<geser> RoAkSoAx: the same, keep it
<RoAkSoAx> ok
<geser> james_w: why?
<RoAkSoAx> thnks
<james_w> if it's a merge then the repositories they point to won't contain the code in the distro, and so could cause confusion.
<james_w> if a branch of the vcs is not used for Ubuntu then I would advocate deleting the headers.
<RoAkSoAx> by the way, i'm trying to merge alsa-tools, noone working with that?
<RoAkSoAx> james_w, so these are the ones i was asking about:
<RoAkSoAx> Vcs-Svn: svn://svn.debian.org/pkg-alsa/trunk/alsa-tools
<RoAkSoAx> Vcs-Browser: http://svn.debian.org/wsvn/pkg-alsa/trunk/alsa-tools/
<ScottK> james_w: OTOH, if you're trying to feed fixes back to Debian, it's a useful bit of info.
<RoAkSoAx> and: Uploaders: Jordi Mallach <jordi@debian.org>, Mikael Magnusson <mikma@users.sourceforge.net>, Elimar Riesebieter <riesebie@lxtec.de>
<ScottK> james_w: We aim for a minimal diff with Debian, so there's no need to remove either.
<james_w> ScottK: true, but an "Original-" prefix would allow that without causing the problems wouldn't it?
<ScottK> james_w: OK, but then what about the packages we don't touch?
<ScottK> The decision to modify maintainer we made after a poll of Debian Developers and required some time to get proper tool support for.
<ScottK> I don't see those fields adding any actual harm.
<james_w> ScottK: for the packages that we don't touch the fields point to the source that we have in Ubuntu, so I don't see a problem there.
<ScottK> james_w: I'd see it as more needless diff.  Also more chance of a merge conflict needing more manual intervention with attended risk of messed up merges.
<ScottK> Up until we need to do a security update and then they don't.
<ScottK> At that point we really need to do the minimal change.
<james_w> these headers aren't great anyway, so I doubt anyone really relies on them, but I don't think we should have bad information there.
<ScottK> james_w: It's not bad information.  It's a pointer to some revision history.
<ScottK> The canonical source for the package is still the source package.
<james_w> yes, but not the revision history that Ubuntu has.
<ScottK> I'd describe it as a portion of the revision history that Ubuntu has.
<james_w> I'm not disagreeing with your other arguments, and I don't think this is the best place to discuss it.
<ScottK> For a package that's basically forked, I can see removing them.  For a temporary divergence, I don't see the need.
<ScottK> OK.
<james_w> If I want to do something about it I will bring it up in a better forum.
<ScottK> OK.  In the meantime, there's no policy to remove it, so people just learning shouldn't be told to remove it.
<ScottK> james_w: What would be a better forum?
<james_w> ScottK: the mailing list, or a MOTU meeting perhaps.
<ScottK> MOTU meeting for a decision on a policy change, certainly.
<james_w> somewhere where we can get the input of other people, rather than just those that happen to be reading IRC now.
<RoAkSoAx> ok so should i remove those fileds or not?
<james_w> RoAkSoAx: no, keep them, as that is the current status-quo.
<RoAkSoAx> james_w, ok thanks =)
<jimcooncat> hi, motu! I want to start a new project (small and simple at first). Is there anyplace I need to register the product's name with ubuntu or debian to reserve it?
<james_w> jimcooncat: I don't think that's possible.
<jimcooncat> Or do people just name their projects by checking google to see if anyone else has named theirs the same?
<james_w> registering the project on launchpad, sourceforge or similar places would perhaps discourage people from picking the same name.
<ScottK> jimcooncat: Filing a Debian ITP bug and an Ubuntu needs-packaging bug would let people know about it, but there is no actual reservation system.
<jimcooncat> thanks folks. you see any problem with a project called "loda"?
<jdavies> jimcooncat: google doesn't bring much up
<pochu> devfil_: I'm generally fine, thanks :) starting with sync and merges for Intrepid, and busy with uni. what about you?
<sebner> pochu: damn you :P
<devfil_> pochu: I'm fine too, I know you are also helping emesene project, this is good
<slytherin> james_w: Vcs-Svn etc specify the VCS for packaging, right?
<RoAkSoAx> hey guys... what about this warnings when building the source of alsa-tools: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/10805/
<james_w> slytherin: yes.
<james_w> RoAkSoAx: ah yeah, crimsun is probably the most likely to want to merge alsa related stuff, so asking him whether he is working on it would be best.
<RoAkSoAx> ok thanks james_w =)
<slytherin> james_w: so those are going to be refered only be developers then why remove them?
<james_w> because developers are people too?
<james_w> RoAkSoAx: those warnings are probably ok.
<RoAkSoAx> james_w, ok so i'll build the binary, create the debdiff and talk to crimsun =)
<james_w> RoAkSoAx: great.
<RoAkSoAx> whois ebner
<sebner> RoAkSoAx: hmm?
<RoAkSoAx> sebner, :) you the llast one who merged athcool... can i give it a try or you working on it?
<sebner> RoAkSoAx: hmm. You could but I didn't touch it yet since a dependency isn't ready in intrepid yet. IIRC it's a sync though
<cbx33> hey guys
<cbx33> if I got this cc -shared -o ../libmltavformat.so factory.o producer_avformat.o consumer_avformat.o filter_avcolour_space.o filter_avresample.o filter_avdeinterlace.o -L/lib -lavformat -lavcodec -ltheora -lavutil -logg   -L../../framework -lavformat -lavcodec -lavutil -lavdevice  -lmlt -lswscale
<cbx33> /usr/bin/ld: cannot find -lavdevice
<cbx33> what would be the probable cause
<cbx33> ??
<wasabi> Um. How do I exclude a file from conf file management? I'd like it to never replace with the built in version.
<RoAkSoAx> sebner, so it would be better yo wait until the pciutils(>= 1:2.2.10) package is in the repos to sync?
<sebner> RoAkSoAx: totally right :)
<RoAkSoAx> instead of doing a merge
<sebner> RoAkSoAx: we *want* to reduce the delta/merges and increase the syncs ;)
<RoAkSoAx> sebner, ok cool then... thanks for help =)
<sebner> RoAkSoAx: but if you want you can claim it in case you will process the sync request then
<james_w> cbx33: hi. You need to Build-Depend on libavdevice-dev
<cbx33> james_w: there is a script I'm using to build kdenlive
<james_w> however it appears that package is built by ffmpeg-free, which is not in Ubuntu yet.
<cbx33> and it pulls in libavcodec fine
<cbx33> and libavdevice is built
<cbx33> but it's not pulling it in
<sebner> james_w: though it seems that it will be there in a few days
<cbx33> I'm just trying to get a usable kdenlive
<james_w> cbx33: you're building libavdevice at the moment?
<james_w> sorry, at the same time?
<cbx33> no that's built
<cbx33> yes
<cbx33> the script builds that first
<james_w> is it installed first?
<cbx33> and that's all done
<cbx33> yes
<cbx33> now it's trying to build mlt
<james_w> so you have /usr/lib/libavdevice.so?
<cbx33> no it's in a seperate build dir
<cbx33> and the script is set to use that
<cbx33> apparently
<cbx33> so if I add
<james_w> ../../framework/ ?
<cbx33> no
<cbx33> DEST_DIR/lib/
<cbx33> so it's looking in the wrong place
<james_w> ah, there is "-L/lib"
<cbx33> yes
<cbx33> but it's still failing
<james_w> which is odd, and seems to indicate that it is trying to do it, but $DEST_DIR is empty when this is expanded
<cbx33> ahh ok
<cbx33> hmmm
<cbx33> maybe it's just not putting it in anywhere
<james_w> can you pastebin the script/makefile whatever that does this so I can see it?
<james_w> or a pointer to where you got it from?
<cbx33> http://pastebin.ca/1011075
<cbx33> i added  -I$DEST_DIR/include/  to line 287
<james_w> cd ../mlt++; ./configure --prefix=$DEST_DIR --enable-debug
<cbx33> and that fixed one bug
<james_w> lines 323/324
<cbx33> ignore mlt++
<cbx33> we're still stuck at the one before
<cbx33> :)
<james_w> ah, ok.
<cbx33> hehe
<cbx33> sorry
<cbx33> see....where does it tell it to use DEST_DIR
<cbx33> for the -L
<cbx33> it doesn't
<cbx33> does it
<Arby> on trying to build a binary I get this error, what does it mean?
<Arby> Trying patch debian/patches/kubuntu_01_fix_missing_output.diff at level 1 ... 0 ... 2 ... failure.
<Arby> make: *** [debian/stamp-patched] Error 1
<james_w> cbx33: --prefix=$DEST_DIR is probably supposed to do it.
<Arby> apart from obviously the patch has failed
<Arby> what might cause it?
<cbx33> yeh
<cbx33> james_w: ecept it isn't
<cbx33> :p
<james_w> Arby: it conflicts somehow with the new upstream code.
<james_w> Arby: do you know what patch system is in use?
<Arby> let me check
<Arby> james_w: whatever cdbs uses (simple-patchsys?)
<Arby> debian/rules has include /usr/share/cdbs/1/rules/simple-patchsys.mk
<james_w> Arby: cool, in the unpacked sources try
<james_w> cdbs-edit-patch kubuntu_01_fix_missing_output.diff
<james_w> cbx33: I'm trying to find the upstream code.
<cbx33> james_w: ok
<cbx33> there is a downloader in there
<james_w> cbx33: I've found it from that
<james_w> the mlt configure script is handwritten, it's not autotools
<cbx33> ouch really
<cbx33> that explains it then
<cbx33> james_w: it's really annoying me
<cbx33> if only the ubuntu pckages had been tested
<cbx33> :p
<cbx33> :(
<Arby> james_w: output of cdbs-edit-patch http://paste.ubuntu.com/10811/
<Arby> looks like a problem with build-deps
<james_w> cbx33: what subdir is it in when it fails.
<Arby> should I follow through and try to answer the questions or is that likely to cause more problems
<james_w> cbx33: also, can you pastebin your config.mak from the root of the mlt tree please?
<james_w> Arby: it seems as if the patch has been applied upstream.
<ScottK> sommer: php-clamavlib uploaded to Intrepid.  Thank you for your contribution to Ubuntu.
<cbx33> james_w: it ends up in ~/source/kdenlive3
<james_w> what you can do is answer "n"
<cbx33> as that is what i put in for the source dir
<sommer> ScottK: party! thank you
<Arby> james_w: what is it that tells you that
<Arby> oh I see it
<Arby> nevermind
<cbx33> james_w: http://pastebin.ca/1011094
<james_w> Arby: and then if it asks to continue say yes, you can then check the .rej files to ensure that the code is applied, then "exit 1", and delete the patch
<cbx33> james_w: brb
<james_w> cbx33: there are several subdirs of mlt, in which is "factory.o producer_avformat.o consumer_avformat.o filter_avcolour_space.o filter_avresample.o filter_avdeinterlace.o" ?
<Arby> james_w: output after continuing http://paste.ubuntu.com/10814/
<Arby> where do .rej files live?
<ajmitch> cbx33: hey
<Arby> james_w: nevermind I think I figured it out
 * Arby writes down 'read the changelog better'
<james_w> Arby: heh, you on top of it now?
<Arby> I think so, it had been applied upstream. just with a different name
<Arby> I'll remove the kubuntu patch and try to rebuild
<Arby> this may take some time
<james_w> good plan
<james_w> cbx33: http://mlt.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/mlt/trunk/mlt/src/modules/avformat/Makefile?view=markup is probably where the problem is.
<cbx33> hey ajmitch
<james_w> cbx33: or http://mlt.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/mlt/trunk/mlt/src/modules/avformat/configure?view=markup
<cbx33> can we hack a fix?
<james_w> probably, I can't see exactly what the problem is though.
<Arby> progress, if a different error counts as progress
<Arby>  /tmp/buildd/kdevelop-3.5.1/./configure: line 38683: syntax error: unexpected end of file
<Arby> but the end of the configure file looks fine
<james_w> Arby: has one of the patches got "autotools" or similar in the name?
<cbx33> james_w: what about changing -L
<james_w> it's probably a quote missing somewhere, or something like that.
<cbx33> yeh
<james_w> cbx33: that would be the best way.
<Arby> james_w: the complete set of pathces is http://paste.ubuntu.com/10816/
<Arby> *patches even
<Arby> I did have to fix a conflict in the configure file, I really hope I didn't delete the wrong thing
<james_w> Arby: 03_libtool_update.diff and 04_am_maintainer_mode.diff look a little suspect
<james_w> Arby: that may well be it.
<RoAkSoAx> what is the difference between debian/control and debian/control.stub ?
<james_w> also, what is the update.sh file?
<Arby> checking
<james_w> RoAkSoAx: debian/control will normally be generated from the latter in that case.
<RoAkSoAx> james_w, so should i drop .stub ?
<Arby> james_w: it mentions autotools http://paste.ubuntu.com/10818/
<james_w> RoAkSoAx: no, that's probably what you should be editing.
<james_w> RoAkSoAx: check debian/rules, and look for mention of debian/control
<RoAkSoAx> james_w, ok thanks
<james_w> Arby: you could try running it, I'm not exactly sure what the purpose is.
<RoAkSoAx> james_w, it only has: #!/usr/bin/make -f
<RoAkSoAx> include /usr/share/cdd-dev/rules
<james_w> Arby: I would also check that conflict you had in configure again.
 * Arby crosses everything and hopes
<RoAkSoAx> and debian/control is much more elaborated than debian/control.stub
<Arby> ok
<james_w> RoAkSoAx: yep, if you are changing the maintainer, or Build-Depends you should edit debian/control.stub for cdd packages.
<james_w> RoAkSoAx: which package is it out of interest?
<RoAkSoAx> ok thanks james_w
<RoAkSoAx> =)
<RoAkSoAx> finally alsa-tools finished building the binary...  but it showed many warnings..
<james_w> RoAkSoAx: is it debian-edu you are working on?
<RoAkSoAx> james_w, yes
<james_w> (apart from alsa, obviously)
<RoAkSoAx> james_w, yes that's the one
<james_w> RoAkSoAx: it doesn't need merging
<RoAkSoAx> james_w, so should i just report a sync bug?
<james_w> it wasn't on my list of packages, as dholbach was the last uploader because I made a mistake.
<james_w> RoAkSoAx: yes please.
<james_w> the changelog says that the changes can be dropped, all the other changes were just necessary things for the upload.
<RoAkSoAx> james_w, yeah i haven't got to that part yet, but thanks for the tip xD =)
<RoAkSoAx> james_w, so like this: requestsync -s debian-edu intrepid 0.831
<james_w> 0.824
<james_w> you specify the base version, not the current Debian version.
<RoAkSoAx> james_w, ok thanks, and what do i put in the Explanation of the sync, just that it needs to be synced?
<james_w> you can say that the change was made to build against an updated cdd-dev. There is a separate sync bug for cdd-dev, and syncing will still ensure that a new enough version of cdd-dev will be used.
<jcfp> Reviewers, please have a look at http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=sabnzbdplus
<RoAkSoAx> james_w, ook so i'll put there: "the change was made to build against an updated cdd-dev. There is a separate sync bug for cdd-dev, and syncing will still ensure that a new enough version of cdd-dev will be used."
<james_w> RoAkSoAx: that should be sufficient.
<RoAkSoAx> thanks very much james_w
<james_w> no problem, thanks for taking care of it.
<tjaalton> a package in hardy universe is currently uninstallable (vdr-plugin-burn, a missing package and falsely named dependancies). AIUI it would need two SRU's to fix the situation; first get the missing package in, and then fix the broken package dependancies. is this doable? the current situation is not a regression because v-p-b was introduced in hardy, but annoys me like hell
<tjaalton> motu-sru members ^^
<RoAkSoAx> james_w, going back to alsa-tools... it showed lots of warnings while building the binaries.. but it build them successfully... any suggestion?
<james_w> RoAkSoAx: what were the warnings?
<james_w> RoAkSoAx: two suggestions. Firstly, look at the build logs for the current hardy package, you can see if there are warnings there.
<james_w> Secondly, if you are building in Intrepid there are a bunch of new default CFLAGS that may be causing the issue.
<RoAkSoAx> some where about some char variable that was deprecated
<RoAkSoAx> other was related to ${misc:Depends}. where can i find the whole log?
<james_w> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/12740476/buildlog_ubuntu-hardy-i386.alsa-tools_1.0.15-2ubuntu4_FULLYBUILT.txt.gz
<james_w> that's the hardy i386 one
<RoAkSoAx> i had these same warning: ../pixmaps/alsalogo.xpm:451: warning: deprecated conversion from string constant to 'char*'
<the_belgain> hi there - is there any chance anyone can review a package which I uploaded to REVU a few months back but didn't make it in for hardy?  It's fuppes, at: http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=fuppes
<cbx33> james_w: do I hard code the -L you think?
<james_w> cbx33: that will probably work for you
<james_w> but others may be interested in having it work properly
<cbx33> yeh
<cbx33> seems to have worked
<RoAkSoAx> james_w, where can i find the buildlogs in my own pc?
<james_w> RoAkSoAx: they're probably not stored
<RoAkSoAx> james_w, oks so then how to compare?? i've seen some similar warnings in the i386 (but im using amd64)
<james_w> RoAkSoAx: you can build again and redirect the build output to a file.
<james_w> RoAkSoAx: you can grab an amd64 build log
<RoAkSoAx> oh right lol haven't thought about it
<RoAkSoAx> james_w, before re building it i have to delete the binaries created in /var/cache/pbuilder/result right?
<RoAkSoAx> or they will be overwritten ?
<james_w> RoAkSoAx: nope, they'll just be overwritten.
<RoAkSoAx> ok so building againg
<RoAkSoAx> james_w, ok so after comparing the buildlogs... if there are the same warnings it will be ok??? but if there are new warnings.. what should be done?
<coppro> okay, I am going to try this question again?
<james_w> RoAkSoAx: you should work out if they are serious.
<coppro> If the upstream distribution doesn't include a SONAME, do I need to add one myself?
<RoAkSoAx> james_w, so if needed, make patches and stuff like that?
<james_w> RoAkSoAx: in one sense if it builds and runs then it is "ok". However, warnings are there for a reason, and can often point to real problems that will bite users later.
<james_w> coppro: you mean Debian, or the upstream code released by the particular project?
<coppro> james_w: I mean the upstream code. The default build for the library has no SONAME
<RoAkSoAx> james_w, ok cool... and seems there is no build log for alsa-tools amd64
<the_belgain> don't mean to pester, but just wanted to check whether this is the right place to ask to get a package reviewed for multiverse?
<the_belgain> i've tried a few times but haven't had much luck...
<coppro> this library has no Debian package
<james_w> RoAkSoAx: on the left of https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/hardy/+source/alsa-tools/1.0.15-2ubuntu4
<james_w> coppro: ok, in most cases you want one, otherwise it is a headache
<RoAkSoAx> thanks james_w =)
<james_w> however if upstream doesn't use one, then it would often indicate they weren't going to care about their ABI, and so using a soname would also be a headache. Do you think that applies in this case?
<coppro> I think so. They have a version number in the library anyway (kinda like libc6)
<james_w> the_belgain: yes, it would be. However, asking for a review doesn't mean you are always going to get one, so don't take silence the wrong way.
<james_w> coppro: why aren't they using a SONAME for that?
<coppro> possibly because they are primarily Windows developers and don't know better?
<coppro> I could always use that number as the SONAME
<RoAkSoAx> james_w, as far as i can tell... there are the same warnings...
<james_w> coppro: but will they change that number in the way that is required for a SONAME?
<coppro> I believe so. I can ask
<james_w> RoAkSoAx: it's probably ok. Just test the binaries well.
<the_belgain> ok.  i appreciate that time is limited, it's just that it seems like there's a few packages like this one which a lot of people are asking about installing in the forums etc. and i'd like to get packages for but it seems like actually getting things reviewed and committed seems pretty hard to actually manage
<coppro> or they may not :/
<james_w> coppro: it's probably worth asking, at the very least you will get to gauge their understanding of the issues.
<coppro> yeah
<coppro> in the meanwhile, is there a great guide for packaging libraries? I'm trying to find as many places as I can, as everyone says library packaging is difficult.
<james_w> the_belgain: yeah, it's unfortunate. Reviewing new packages is very time consuming, so it can be a slow process for contributors.
<james_w> the_belgain: also, intrepid is only just open, and most people can't even set up a development environment for it yet. In a couple of weeks I hope things will start to flow a little more smoothly.
<james_w> coppro: it's not necessarily difficult, but you have to be aware of the issues, and on top of the changes in the upstream code that could break the packaging.
<Arby> james_w: you were right, there is some libtool strangeness occurring.
<james_w> coppro: have you seen the Debian libarary packaging guide?
<coppro> no, which is that?
<Arby> the readme for the update.sh script says http://paste.ubuntu.com/10825/
<the_belgain> do packages in REVU get updated for intrepid automatically (i.e. the distribution in the debian/control file etc) or does it need to be reuploaded?
<Arby> so I've run the script, which didn't throw any errors
<james_w> coppro: there's also https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/School/LibraryPackaging which is a fantastic introduction to the issues.
<Arby> then attemted to rebuild
<coppro> yeah, that's the one I was going to use
<Arby> which fails with unexpected end of file immediately after configure: creating libtool
<james_w> coppro: I'm trying to turn that in to real documentation at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/SharedLibraries , but I haven't had the time recently.
<james_w> coppro: http://www.netfort.gr.jp/~dancer/column/libpkg-guide/libpkg-guide.html
<the_belgain> and is there anything to do process-wise to get an uploaded package reviewed (eg. does the [needs-packaging] launchpad bug need to be assigned the MOTU team, or do MOTUs check through packages in REVU periodically)?
<james_w> the_belgain: it would need to be updated manuall.
<james_w> the_belgain: I believe it is just done through REVU
<the_belgain> ok, thanks
<coppro> sorry, my computer just decided to randomly suspend itself
<james_w> coppro: did you get my links
<coppro> yeah
<coppro> thanks
<RoAkSoAx> james_w, is it ok to use a PPA to test the packages i build when merging??
<james_w> RoAkSoAx: sure
<RoAkSoAx> james_w, and to test it, should i create a VM, install hardy, upgrade to intrepid and test it?
<james_w> mmm, do you have a VM solution that provides a sound card?
<RoAkSoAx> james_w, i just have vmware installed
<james_w> can that do that?
<RoAkSoAx> i don't know, but i'll try
#ubuntu-motu 2008-05-08
<kiko> hello hello
<kiko> I have a user who's produced a package of gscrot in a PPA
<kiko> was curious about what the procedure is for getting that sponsored into universe proper?
<kiko> which MOTU wizard can point me to the proper procedure?
<TheMuso> kiko: !revu
<TheMuso> darn thats not availabe
<kiko> TheMuso, so that's a good hint at least! tell me more. :)
<TheMuso> kiko: Basically they upload it to revu, file a needs packaging bug and we take it from there
<TheMuso> let me see if I can find the docs on the wiki.
<kiko> TheMuso, would you care to give this user some help in doing it?
<cbx33> james_w: thanks for the help
<TheMuso> kiko: I can point them in the right direction at least.
<kiko> james_w!
<cbx33> but it's still crashing like a dog
<kiko> TheMuso, thanks muchly
<cbx33> :(
<cbx33> I got it built successfully :)
<cbx33> but it just crashes now on startup, worse than the installed version
<TheMuso> kiko: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/NewPackages
<cbx33> Hey TheMuso
<kiko> TheMuso, the fantastically-nicked dasdsdsadsdasd is the user I'm telling you about
<kiko> TheMuso, I'm given him that URL; dasdsdsadsdasd, if you have any questions, ask away
<dasdsdsadsdasd> ok, thanks
<dasdsdsadsdasd> just reading the page
<dasdsdsadsdasd> TheMuso, first of all thanks for your help
<dasdsdsadsdasd> i think its the "packaging it yourself" part that i am interested in
<pochu> !revu | kiko
<ubottu> kiko: REVU is a web-based tool to give people who have worked on Ubuntu packages a chance to "put their packages out there" for other people to look at and comment on in a structured manner. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU
<dasdsdsadsdasd> where do i have to upload my package so that it is reviewed
<kiko> dasdsdsadsdasd, to REVU, apparently -- pochu gave me a link there
<TheMuso> pochu: Thanks, I thought it worked the other way. :p
<pochu> !packagingguide | dasdsdsadsdasd
<ubottu> dasdsdsadsdasd: The packaging guide is at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide - See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/NewPackages for information on getting a package integrated into Ubuntu - Other developer resources are at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment - See also !backports
<pochu> TheMuso: np :)
<i4x> ï»¿c y'all tomorrow! hugs..
<pochu> superm1: hey mario, do you have any special opinions regarding a vostro 1310? :)
<dasdsdsadsdasd> ok, thank you all for your help
<dasdsdsadsdasd> i'll have a look at the pages tomorrow
<dasdsdsadsdasd> cu, folks
<kiko> sure thing
<superm1> pochu, what are you looking for?
<bddebian> Heya gang
<crimsun> heya
<bddebian> Hi crimsun
<tbielawa> evening all
<crimsun> hi.
<crimsun> joejaxx: e-mail me the alsa-info.sh --debug output for your macbook, please.
<joejaxx> crimsun: ok
<joejaxx> crimsun: i will have to install hardy on it again
<crimsun> joejaxx: desktop CD should suffice
<joejaxx> ok
<McRib> Is there any way to install mozilla-mplayer WITHOUT installing Firefox3?  Firefox3 is useless to me and I need the Mplayer plugin for Firefox2...
<Flannel> McRib: Looks like any sort of browser will satisfy it, yes.
<McRib> Flannel: I can't install it... it depends on FF3 and is installing it automatically
<Flannel> McRib: install firefox2 first, then install it.  If you just try to install it, it'll grab the first one automatically.
<McRib> Flannel: That's it... I already have FF2 installed.
<Flannel> McRib: through package management?
<McRib> Flannel: Throught apt, yeah.
<bbyever> doest the Depends field have/should be the same as the Build-Depends-Indep?
<Flannel> Hmm, thats an oversight on the mplayer package.  It depends on firefox or mozilla-browser or galeon or epiphany browser or konquerer.
<Flannel> McRib: so, if you create a dummy package (or install a second browser from that list), you'll be able to install it no problems.
<Flannel> McRib: You may also want to file a bug against said package to include firefox-2 in the depends (assuming its compatable)
<McRib> Flannel: It's compatible... once I installed it, it worked in FF2 just fine (but it also had install FF3)
<ScottK> bbyever: No.  Packages should only be listed in one or the other.  Depends is for arch dependent stuff and anything needed to satisfy clean in Debian rules.  Arch independent stuff that's not needed for clean goes in build-dep-indep.
<bbyever> ï»¿ScottK: ok, thanks
<tbielawa> Has anyone on here successfully applied the perl shlibs patch to build an intrepid environment yet?
<tbielawa> nm, it's a hash util patch deb #479202
<jumpkic2> http://packages.ubuntu.com/ï»¿ï»¿linux-ubuntu-modules -- returns    " Error  keyword not valid or missing "
<jumpkic2> the packages search appears to be broken
<Flannel> No, that's always been like that.  p.u.c has a horrible, horrible search
<Flannel> thats what happens if you search for two words
<jumpkic2> Flannel: surely at least http://packages.ubuntu.com/ï»¿ï»¿linux or http://packages.ubuntu.com/search?keywords=ï»¿ï»¿linux&searchon=names&suite=hardy&section=all should work
<Flannel> jumpkic2: It works for me....
<jumpkic2> gives me an error page every time
<Flannel> http://packages.ubuntu.com/search?keywords=linux&searchon=names&suite=hardy&section=all ?
<jumpkic2> has that server got some kind of fancy geographical dns set-up or something?
<Flannel> I guess it may
<jumpkic2> does it resolve to this for you packages-vs.djpig.de (78.47.136.187)?
<no0tic> why packages from hardy-updates have hardy-proposed in their changelog?
<ajmitch> no0tic: because they are copied into -updates without changes after testing
<Flannel> jumpkic2: it does
<no0tic> ajmitch, shouldn't be better if the changelog would be changed importing them into -updates?
<bbyever> ScottK: the uploaders field should be kept, right?
<ScottK> bbyever: For a merge from Debian, yes.
<ajmitch> no0tic: then various little things like gpg signatures wouldn't be valid
<no0tic> ajmitch, ah, right
<bbyever> ScottK: ok
<no0tic> ajmitch, thanks for the clarification
<ScottK> bbyever: It's generally better to ask the channel than a specific person.  You're more likely to get a timely answer.
<bbyever> ScottK: ok
<ajmitch> no0tic: a re-upload just for the distro in the changelog would then require a rebuild, etc
<ScottK> sommer: avscan has a new upstream release for clamav 0.93
<sommer> ScottK: cool, is that one going to be around for intrepid?
<sommer> since there's clamtk and klamav and all
<ScottK> Why not.  I'm sending a mention to the Debian maintainer about it now.  Avscan is actually a rather newer program than some of the others.
<sommer> ah, maybe I was thinking of another app, but it seemed like the code wasn't as polished as the others... but then again I'm probably thinking of the default dapper version
<ScottK> The dapper one was very immature.  It was very new then.
<RoAkSoAx> does anyone know if this debdiff needs filtering? http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/10861/
<sommer> ah, I'll give it another chance then :-)
<ScottK> sommer: How is this for confidence inspiring from the klamav developer on klamav-users in response to complaints about integration with clamav 0.93: "Note to self: start reading ClamAV release notes again!"
<sommer> lol, whoa
<sommer> did you take that survey they sent out this morning?
<ScottK> What survey?
<ScottK> YokoZar: Did you see the Debian wine RFH?
<sommer> ScottK: it was sent to the clamav-devel list at 5:59 by nigel horne... the survey seems closed now
<sommer> ScottK: I can forward you the message if you'd like... the gist is that the clamav RC release didn't get tested enough and wouldn't build on some systems, I guess
<ScottK> sommer: Ah.  No.  I guess I'm only subscribed to their announce list, not the devel list.
<ScottK> sommer: It's fine.
<ScottK> They mentioned that on IRC.  They felt the RC wasn't getting tested, so there was no point in an RC2, they might as well release.
<sommer> heh, I was the opposite until this morning... their devel list is very low traffic
<sommer> ah
<ScottK> sommer: That's when I decided for SURE I didn't want to push 0.93 into Hardy.
<sommer> heh makes sense, seems to be working fine from my testing though
<sommer> ScottK: looks like gurlchecker is suffering from the "maxratio" change as well
 * sommer looking for patch
<ApOgEE-> how to fix the b43legacy problem on hardy kernel 2.6.24-16-generic?
<ApOgEE-> any way to trace the error?
<ajmitch> ScottK: that doesn't quite sound like sane release policy
<ScottK> ApOgEE-: I'm guessing you want either #ubuntu for support or #ubuntu-kernel for kernel development.
<ApOgEE-> issuing sudo modprobe b43legacy will freeze my laptop
<ScottK> ajmitch: clamav is not a particularly sane upstream from the way we tend to view things.
<ajmitch> I can see why they're not at 1.0 yet
<ScottK> ajmitch: They also change config parameters without warning or even leaving them deprecated for a release.
<ScottK> Yeh.
<ajmitch> building tools for themselves
<ScottK> ajmitch: 100% of the packages that build-dep on libclamav-deb FTBFS without patching in the new version.
<ScottK> I think building code without a lot of thought for maintenance and hanging onto the "we're not 1.0 yet, so the API doesn't have to be stable".
<ScottK> ...excuse
<ajmitch> because noone else would possibly be using clamav
<sommer> heh, the kicker is the api isn't even that complicated... load virus db, scan file, unload db
<ajmitch> yet they still manage to constantly break that?
<ScottK> Yep.
<ajmitch> impressive
<ajmitch> so when is it going into main?
<ScottK> I'm actually planning on talking to kees about that at UDS.  Insane or not, I think Ubuntu Server really needs a supported anti-virus package.
<ajmitch> certainly
<ajmitch> I wasn't completely joking :)
<ScottK> Of course if it was in Main I wouldn't get away with half the risks I'm taking on keeping it current.
<ajmitch> like abusing backports?
<ScottK> No.  That'd be fine.  It's the pushing stuff from backports to updates that'd be frowned on.
<ScottK> ajmitch: Look at clamav in Dapper.
<ajmitch> I don't think I want to
<ScottK> Then you certainly don't want to look at the ~dozen other rdepends that needed upating too.
<ScottK> And you absolutely don't want to look at the one new package we had to add.
<greg-g> calc: any plans of getting a ppa for OO.o 3.0beta?
<ajmitch> it could be worse, I'm sure
<ScottK> But so far I only broke one custom 3rd party app and annoyed one user who lost some configs AFAIK and wiped out about two dozen open CVEs.
<ScottK> I'd call that a fair trade.
<ajmitch> reasonable, yes
<ffm>  Hey, anyone in the mood for a package REVU? http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=thinkcspy2
<sommer> ScottK: doh, seems that gurlchecker's site is unavailable: http://gurlchecker.labs.libre-entreprise.org/  can you get to it?
<ScottK> sommer: No.  I can't get to it either.  Google's cached page is from last week, so I imagine it's temporary.
<sommer> okay, I'll try again later... moving on to havp
<sommer> ScottK: looks like havp-0.88 supports 0.93, debian is at 0.87... can you request an update?
<ScottK> Can I have a link please?
<sommer> http://www.server-side.de/
<ScottK> Thanks.
<sommer> I just did an apt-get source in a sid chroot, didn't actually check the debian site
<ScottK> http://packages.qa.debian.org/h/havp.html
<ScottK> You had it right.
<sommer> ooo, that's a good link, thanks
<ScottK> sommer: Get to know and love the PTS.
<sommer> heh, it'd definitely on the agenda :)
<tbielawa> nothing like cleaning the carpet off your heat sink to make your build stop freezing your system :)
<YokoZar> ScottK: yes
<cbx33> hey anyone alive in here?
<RAOF> braaaaaaains!
<cbx33> RAOF: hey
<cbx33> well anyone who is alive
<RAOF> Heya :)
<cbx33> well
<cbx33> I was hoping to fix up kdenlive
<cbx33> you think the best way is to get the package sources and update the source trees?
<dholbach> good morning
<nixternal> mornin' dholbach
<nixternal> sorry I was afk yesterday morning
<dholbach> hiya nixternal
<dholbach> don't worry :)
<nixternal> we had a nice spring storm blow through, had the window open, and I wasn't moving out of bed :)
<dholbach> oh :)
<ajmitch> hello dholbach
<RAOF> cbx33: By update the source trees, you mean?  Pull down upstream svn and package it?
<dholbach> hiya ajmitch
<RAOF> lo dholbach, ajmitch.
<dholbach> hey RAOF
<ajmitch> hello RAOF
<\sh> moins
<cbx33> RAOF: yes
<cbx33> hey ajmitch dholbach
<dholbach> hi cbx33
<RAOF> cbx33: Packaging svn is _always_ fun.  Do you know if upstream is releasing anytime soon?
 * RoAkSoAx finally has his cluster working =)
<cbx33> noidea
<cbx33> no idea
<cbx33> right off to work
<cbx33> bbl
<RAOF> Have fun!
<dholbach> RAOF: seems like upstream fixed a bunch of crashers in SVN - so I'd rather somebody cherry-picked them and rolled them in a SRU if they fix the crashes
<RAOF> dholbach: Ah, right.
<Hobbsee> RAOF: did you want to see it?
<tbielawa> woohoo. the new perl version has been released into the hardy repos
<tbielawa> I can finally make an intrepid pbuilder
<RAOF> Hobbsee: See what?  Your assignemnt?
<Hobbsee> RAOF: yes.  the crap that we have to do :(
<Hobbsee> RAOF: for a second yaer subject, no less.
<RAOF> Hobbsee: Go for it.
<Hobbsee> RAOF: http://hobbsee.com/tmp/comp247.tar.gz
<Hobbsee> RAOF: it's a tarball because it's actually a pdf-ified .doc file, and so throws up 404 errors when uploaded as a .pdf.
<RAOF> Heh.
<Hobbsee> nfi why.  it downloaded originally as a .pdf.
<RAOF> What?  Can you still _buy_ dialup access?
<tbielawa> ewww
<RAOF> Hobbsee: Why, exactly, are you writing _essays_ for CompSci?
<pochu> superm1: something to carry to uds... I have nothing but my desktop right now
<pochu> superm1: so something good a good battery life, portable and cheap ;)
<Hobbsee> RAOF: NFI
<Hobbsee> RAOF: it's a networking unit, which doesn't require prior knowledge in computing, for some reason.
<Hobbsee> yet, they don't actually tell people what routers and switches and hubs, etc, actualy are used for
<superm1> pochu, i'm a fan of the xps 1330 personally for something really small, portable, cheap
<Hobbsee> nor show what any look like
<superm1> but no experience working with the vostro.  i've been working with the inspiron and xps series portables mainly
<RAOF> Hobbsee: Right.  General compsci craziness, then.
<Hobbsee> RAOF: apparently we get this waffly crap if it doesn't require actual code.  :(
<superm1> pochu, i'll probably bring one to UDS
<Hobbsee> superm1: i'm envious.
<Hobbsee> those are nice machines.
<RAOF> Hobbsee: Which is why they should always ask for actual code ;)
<Hobbsee> yes, well
<Hobbsee> anywya, time to finally go into uni
<superm1> Hobbsee, yeah and they will work out of the box for everything on 8.04 cept for HDMI audio and modem
<cbx33> ping Lutin
<Lutin> cbx33: pong.
<Lutin> (leaving in a couple seconds)
<Lutin> cbx33: I'm off for 4 days, please drop me an email. I'll answer asap
<cbx33> Lutin: wait
<cbx33> please
<cbx33> just a quick question
<cbx33> dang it......I guess he left already
<tbielawa> fail :(
<cbx33> Noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!
<cbx33> pr0g80X.vid ep 0.3 is doomed
<tbielawa> i think I removed that virus from a machine at work yesterday
<cbx33> heheha
<cbx33> you calling my videocast a virus
<cbx33> :p
<tbielawa> I kid I kid :)
<cbx33> yeh yeh, you'd better
<tbielawa> be happy, intrepid pbuilders should work now
<tbielawa> go
<tbielawa> rejoice
<cbx33> i care not about those
<tbielawa> :(
<cbx33> I only care about getting a working kdenlive in hardy
<tbielawa> it doesn't work?
<cbx33> no it doesn't
<tbielawa> at all?
<cbx33> no
<cbx33> it crashes soo much it's unusable
<cbx33> I just upgraded from Gutsy
<cbx33> and it's .... well I can't produce the next episode
<cbx33> and I'm getting pushed by a lot of people to get it out the door
<tbielawa> pretty good incentive to make kdenlive work then I suppose
<cbx33> indeed
<cbx33> so I'm trying
<cbx33> http://www.progbox.co.uk/wordpress/
<tbielawa> best of luck to you
<cbx33> I've posted twice baout it in the last 24 hours
<cbx33> :D
<tbielawa> I hope that goes well
<tbielawa> i'm going to sleep
<slytherin> hi, I am not sure which is the correct channel to ask. ubottu got removed from #ubuntu-in sometime this week. Whom should I ask for help?
<pochu> superm1: how does it perform with the battery (6/9 cells). I've googled a bit and it looks like 5/6 hours with the 9 cells one, is that right?
<pochu> (with intel onboard graphics)
<wgrant> slytherin: #ubuntu-ops
<slytherin> wgrant: thanks
<emgent> morning
<slytherin> anybody other than me getting this error - The following signatures were invalid: BADSIG 40976EAF437D05B5 Ubuntu Archive Automatic Signing Key <ftpmaster@ubuntu.com>
<\sh> slytherin, yes...it's the .31 server leningradskaya
<\sh> slytherin, try the .45 or .46
<\sh> slytherin, without using a.u.c.
<slytherin> \sh: I do not understand.
<\sh> slytherin, nslookup archive.ubuntu.com
<\sh> you will see 3 RR servers
<slytherin> \sh: Oh. Thanks
<\sh> x.y.z.31/.45/.46
<\sh> if you check the ips directly, you see that it always defaults .31 in your case...(in mine too)
<\sh> slytherin, use .45 or .46 depends
<slytherin> \sh: trying .45, lets see what happens
<\sh> slytherin, you can check it when you http://<ip>/ubuntu if tehre is a lock file a la "Archive Update in Progress <hostname>.canonical.com> so the archive server is busy doing updates
<\sh> slytherin, and .31 is in the round robin list the first server..so it will mostly the prefered server, but it should change, if your ISP doesn't do hostname caching and destroys the RR idea
<slytherin> \sh: Ok. .45 worked without problem.
<pochu> is it significant the increase in energy efficiency (and thus in battery life) from a 65nm processor to a 45 one? (core2duo T5550 to a T8100) ? I guess it's worth 50 euros?
<norsetto> asac: what do you think of bug 228044? This is (a problem) commonto many plugins I guess.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 228044 in mplayerplug-in "In Hardy, mozilla-mplayer depends on firefox-3.0 - does not accept firefox-2" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/228044
<albert23> pochu: t8100 has Intel Virtualization Technology, so you can use kvm. T5550 does not have that. For me that would be worth the â¬50. Maybe for you too?
<asac> norsetto: if our build works with ffox2 we should fix it ... further mplayer-plugin should be installed in /usr/lib/xulrunner-addons/plugins ... not sure if that is done atm
<asac> commented
<norsetto> asac: ok, thx
<asac> norsetto: iirc you were the right contact: could you take a look at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Jazzva and tell me what i shall tell jazzva about his motu application? he didn't do much merges and would be willing to do a few more in the next few weeks.
<pochu> albert23: possibly... OTOH I could still use VirtualBox, although that has a lower performance. So given the Intel VT, the better processor and the better energy usage (because that's right, isn't it?) I think I'll go for the T8100
<norsetto> asac: yes, he was away for a while but he is back now. He should definetively do more merges/syncs (perhaps he hasn't documented them all). If he wants, I have a couple of updates to be done (bug 226195).
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 226195 in gnome-mplayer "Please update gnome-mplayer/gecko-mediaplayer" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/226195
<asac> norsetto: i would appreciate if you could assemble a list of merges he can do in the next week. he does a great job in the extensions team and i need him to have  upload powers asap
<asac> s/next week/next weeks/
<norsetto> asac: I would say all those for which the previous uploader is not with us anymore (gothicx, xxxxx, etc.). There are about 20 or so in the queue
<albert23> pochu: I don't know about the energy. I have a 65nm T7500  with Intel graphics and I am happy with it's battery live (>4 hours)
<asac> norsetto: do you have names you have in mind? i can forward that list to him and he can pick deliberately then
<pochu> albert23: 6 cells?
<albert23> pochu: 9 cells
<pochu> ah, ok
<norsetto> asac: Marco Rodrigues, William Lima, Barry deFreese (he usually doesn't mind)
 * wgrant has a heart attack.
<wgrant> Adobe people on the ML!?
<norsetto> asac: bug 226195 would be good for him since gecko-mediaplayer is a browser extension
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 226195 in gnome-mplayer "Please update gnome-mplayer/gecko-mediaplayer" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/226195
<asac> norsetto: ok, i can reassign the bug. do you know who pikini is?
<emgent> heya wgrant :)
<norsetto> asac: no idea, he assigned it to himself and hasn't done anything in 5 days
<emgent> norsetto: o/
<norsetto> emgent: o/
<\sh> does anyone know if zope3 now supports python 2.5 in debian? ,-)
<pochu> superm1: I got disconnected. when you're back, I'd be interested if you know how the 6 cells battery perform in the xps :)
<superm1> pochu, i'm flying tonight, so i'll bring one with me and see how far I can push it
<txwikinger> what is again the command which I can use to test order of version names?
<superm1> i'll be doing some compiles and what not too
<superm1> so hopefully good indicator
<joaopinto> txwikinger, dpkg --compare-versions
<txwikinger> joaopinto: yes ... thank you :)
<DRebellion> I am trying to set up an intrepid build enviroment for pbuilder under hardy, however the 'create' command fails lacking a debootstrap script. Looking about on the internet, it appears I must download and install the intrepid version? I am not sure which of these I need: http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/main/d/debootstrap/
<joaopinto> DRebellion, http://packages.ubuntu.com/intrepid/debootstrap
<DRebellion> joaopinto, thanks
<DRebellion> Then to create the intrepid env just: << sudo pbuilder create --distribution intrepid >> ?
<pochu> superm1: great, thank you :)
<norsetto> asac: will we have firefox 2 in intrepid?
<asac> norsetto: we will keep it until firefox 3 is final + one or two more updates
<asac> then we will auto upgrade
<norsetto> asac: ok, I will fix bug 228044 for intrepid then
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 228044 in mplayerplug-in "In Hardy, mozilla-mplayer depends on firefox-3.0 - does not accept firefox-2" [Medium,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/228044
<asac> great
<asac> if you want feel free to prepare an sru with the part i mentioned too
<norsetto> asac: sru are a pain, but I will try to overcome my feelings ...
<asac> i'd be supportive to mileston this 8.04.1
<asac> norsetto: just come up with the patch ... i can guide this in then ;)
<norsetto> asac: okki
<norsetto> asac: its not very clear to me, are firefox-2 plugins for hardy/intrepid in /usr/lib/firefox/plugins/ or /usr/lib/firefox-addons/plugins/ ?
<asac> the are in /usr/lib/firefox/plugins/
<asac> and ffox 3 plugins should go to xulrunner-addons/plugins
<bddebian> heya gang
<norsetto> heya bddebian
<bddebian> Hi norsetto
<slicer> Hi. I've been talking a lot with the debian-voip team lately, and since both Hardy and Debian unstable offer almost identical mumble packages, we've been thinking about merging them. Thing is that there are tiny differences between what suitable defaults are in Ubuntu and Debian. For example, the default audio subsystem in Ubuntu should be PulseAudio, while in Debian it should be ALSA. We've discussed adding a call to lsb_release in the rules file to distin
<Iulian> Hey
<bddebian> Hi Iulian
<Iulian> Hello bddebian
<no0tic> sudo pbuilder create --basetgz /var/cache/pbuilder/intrepid.tgz --distribution intrepid
<no0tic> W: Failure trying to run: chroot /var/cache/pbuilder/build/16595/. dpkg --force-depends --install var/cache/apt/archives/libc6_2.7-10ubuntu3_i386.deb
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, install a pbuilder for hardy and then upgrade to intrepid
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, how?
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, it creates a tgz under /var/cache/pbuilder
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, may I uncompress it and chroot?
<james_w> "pbuilder login --save-after-login" will allow you to upgrade
<no0tic> james_w, thanks
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, i did this: sudo pbuilder create --distribution hardy --othermirror "deb http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu hardy universe multiverse"
<RoAkSoAx> and then: sudo pbuilder update --distribution intrepid --override-config
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, I changed /etc/pbuilderrc
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, ok
<RoAkSoAx> hi james_w =)
<james_w> hi RoAkSoAx
<RoAkSoAx> how ya doing?
<james_w> good, you?
<RoAkSoAx> good, working on my thesis xD
<ember> someone should sync the perl on NEW to fix that
<Jazzva> Any idea what causes this multiple diff markers in files? http://paste.ubuntu.com/10963/
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, it doesn't work :/ some packages have unmet dep
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, pastebin?
<no0tic> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/10964/
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, i had the same unmet dependencies but the pbuilder was upgraded successfully
<james_w> Jazzva: that looks like conflicts of conflicts or something.
<james_w> Is there any chance that there were conflicts stored in the original file?
<james_w> otherwise it may be a bug in MoM (this is from there right?)
<Jazzva> DaD...
<Jazzva> I thought I could use any :).
<james_w> might be a bug there then :-)
<Jazzva> I suppose it wasn't uploaded to the archives with this, since it's part of configure file. Dunno if it would build with those left :).
<Jazzva> james_w: Ok, I'll report a bug, so someone can check it... Thanks for the help :)
<james_w> yeah, doesn't sound likely.
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, any luck?
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, recreating all from scratch
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, no
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, same error
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, let me try
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, wait, probably it's a problem of the italian mirror
<pochu> Jazzva: is that conflict also in MoM?
<Jazzva> pochu: I don't know. On the phone atm, so I still haven't downloaded the sources...
<pochu> ah, ok
<pochu> I bet the conflict isn't in Liferea in the archive... I uploaded it :-)
<Jazzva> pochu: I'm sure too... My guess it would FTBFS if the conflict was there :)
<Jazzva> pochu: Finished the call, so I will check liferea from mom now
<Jazzva> DaD's buggy... Sources from MoM are fine.
 * pochu hopes the Comments feature from DaD will be merged into MoM soon :)
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, ok, it worked!
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, which mirror are you using now?
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, no mirrors archive.ubuntu.com
<sebner> pochu: damn you :P
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, ok, i'm updating my pbuilder again and see what happens=)
<pochu> sebner: heh, I've already seen that before! Dejavu!! ;-)
<sebner> pochu: I'm damning you as often as possible ^^. You may remember that we talked about libbeagle? ;)
<pochu> sebner: heh, lol
<pochu> it's already synced but currently FTBFS due to pygtk not being installable...
<pochu> I haven't created an intrepid chroot yet though
<sebner> pochu: I know. But you may remember that I told you that I opened a sync but and just waiting for a dep or something similar ;)
<pochu> yeah, but why wait for a sponsor to check it if I can ask seb to sync it for me? ;-)
 * pochu apologizes to sebner :-)
<pochu> sebner: I forgot about it, TBH... my mind is so bad ;)
<sebner> pochu: ... I don't have a problem if you want to do that but if you say to me that this is ok then I have a problem ;)
<sebner> pochu: ya. np. just wanted to damn you :P
<pochu> sebner: I suck :(
<sebner> pochu: np. it's just that such a case happened the 2nd time to me ^^
<pochu> heh
<pochu> I hope I didn't cause the first one too :)
<sebner> pochu: no no. :)
<pochu> ;)
<pochu> hi mok0_
<sebner> hi mok0_ :)
<mok0_> hi pochu
<joh> Hi, could someone review my package at revu? http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=alarm-clock-applet thanks!
<norsetto> anyone in motu_sru is feeling bored?
<norsetto> !jdong
<ubottu> <Hobbsee> jdong: yes, but you're FULL OF CRACK!
<Jazzva> pochu: I'm having a little problem here. Build-Depends state dpatch is used, we put our patches in 00list, and debian uses series (which is for quilt, iirc). Should I dismiss series file, and prepare dpatches from quilt patches, in case we need to apply them?
<Jazzva> (that's the problem in liferea)
<Jazzva> And I'm puzzled why quilt wasn't mentioned in the Build-Depends... :/
<geser> Jazzva: Build-Depends: autotools-dev, quilt (>=0.40-1), [from http://ftp.debian.org/debian/pool/main/l/liferea/liferea_1.4.15-1.diff.gz ]
<sebner> Jazzva: if debian uses quilt we want to keep it rather then replacing it with dpatch ;)
<sebner> geser: hiho. What does MC "Call" means?
<ajmitch> sebner: it was originally the MC talking on skype or similar
<sebner> ajmitch: so similar to Meeting
<geser> sebner: yes
<geser> the mc members meet and "talk" about open applications and other business
<sebner> geser: cool. just don't see the result of the talk ^^
<geser> sebner: iirc persia wanted to process you on friday (if no other mc member does it till then)
<Jazzva> geser: Strange, it didn't report quilt here: Build-Depends: autotools-dev, dpatch, debhelper (>= 5), and it's the same version... And we already used dpatch befote. This is the source pulled from MoM...
<ajmitch> 'process'. that sounds worrying
<sebner> ajmitch: hmm? ^^
<ajmitch> nevermind :)
<sebner> geser: ah. no worries. wasn't specially interested in me. just I looked at the ML and the Minutes are missing :)
<geser> sebner: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/motu-council/2008-May/001113.html are the minutes from the "MC Call" from wednesday
<norsetto> jazzva: you know you have been assigned to bug 228044?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 228044 in mplayerplug-in "In Hardy, mozilla-mplayer depends on firefox-3.0 - does not accept firefox-2" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/228044
<sebner> geser: hm? I saw that but there are only listed the agenda items and the attendens and nothing more
<Jazzva> norsetto: You mean bug 226195?
<geser> nothing more didn't happen
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 226195 in gnome-mplayer "Please update gnome-mplayer/gecko-mediaplayer" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/226195
<sebner> geser: kk. thx
<norsetto> sebner: there was a great debate if they should accept you in the contributors team which ended with a vote of 19864 against and 0 for ....
<geser> Jazzva: I guess it's because MoM could merge that part from the ubuntu delta
<norsetto> jazzva: yes, that one
<geser> Jazzva: look at the unmodified debian diff.gz
<sebner> norsetto: rofl. so the comments by them are faked :P
<Jazzva> geser: Ah... So, you think I should prepare quilt patches from our dpatches?
<Jazzva> norsetto: Yes, I got the mail today. I'm planning to look into it.
<geser> Jazzva: yes, as that will make merging in the future easier (you need to convert them once)
<norsetto> jazzva: ok, let me know as you proceed
<ajmitch> norsetto: do you think I could get into the teams? I need more icons on LP
<norsetto> ajmitch: we could have a team together with a kiwi icon :-)
<Jazzva> norsetto: Ok...
<ajmitch> well we've already got an icon for the ubuntu-nz team
<norsetto> ajmitch: yeah, but our team will be special, its gonna be kiwi (the fruit) not kiwi (the bird)
<sebner> lol
<sebner> ajmitch: the universe-contributors teams needs an icon ;)
<ajmitch> norsetto: oh, right
 * jdong volunteers persia 
<jdong> oh the graphical thumbnail thing. not ... never mind
<RainCT> a little off-topic question.. "egrep -r "blocked"  .lyrics/* | cut -d':' -f 1 | xargs rm". How do I have to change there so that it considers all words as a single argument (so that the rm works if the filenames contain spaces)?
<jdong> RainCT: xargs -i rm '{}'
<RainCT> jdong: thanks. so the {} is replaced with whatever value it is, or how does that work?
<jdong> RainCT: correct. -i means replace {} with filename
<jdong> RainCT: -I allows you to specify the placeholder character too
<crimsun> another way is to set IFS to something else.
<crimsun> use whatever makes your brain hurt the least.
<RainCT> thanks :)
<RainCT> so, gonna go. good night
<sebner> RainCT: gn8 =)
<sebner> gn8 folks
#ubuntu-motu 2008-05-09
<pochu> Jazzva: that's because Liferea's maintainer switched to it in 1.4.12: http://packages.debian.org/changelogs/pool/main/l/liferea/liferea_1.4.15-1/changelog#versionversion1.4.12-1
<pochu> Jazzva: so let's follow him
<Jazzva> pochu: K... I'll do that :)
<cosmodad> heya. I'm trying to do a Gutsy-backport of easytag-aac using pdebuild. When configure runs, however, MP4 support isn't enabled, and I'm advised to install libmp4v2.
<cosmodad> The library, however, is installed. Any clue?
<cosmodad> specifically, the library libmp4v2 is installed during pdebuild run.
<zul> when is the motu meeting again?
<RoAkSoAx> 09 May 04:00 UTC: MOTU
<no0tic> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/lastfm/+bug/228482
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 228482 in lastfm "Please merge lastfm 1.4.2.58240.dfsg-2 (universe) from Debian unstable" [Wishlist,New]
<no0tic> is this ok?
<emgent> sure.
<no0tic> emgent, I don't want your assurance :D
<emgent> -.-
<emgent> no0tic: "succhese"
<emgent> :)
<no0tic> emgent, you helped me out, you are not objective
<emgent> gh
<RoAkSoAx> lol
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, so how ya doing with the merging thing?
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, I'm on my path of enlightenment, more or less
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, cool then
<RoAkSoAx> i'm stuck with 1 merge cause i can't test the packages T.T
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, I built smootly lastfm on my intrepid chroot
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, i build alsa-tools aswell in my intrepid chroot but there are lots of warnings, the same warnings as in the Hardy built... so i was recommended to test it before reporting it... but i cant test it until i have an intrepid vm with sound working
<bddebian> Heya
<RAOF> Good morning bddebian
<bddebian> Hello RAOF
<no0tic> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/kid3/+bug/227405 - dholbach didn't acked beacuse there's a change in ubuntu, I'm trying to figure out if dh_icons is needed, I'm building the package and installing it on hardy to see if it works with dh_icons or without it. Is it the right way?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 227405 in kid3 "Please sync kid3 1.0-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)." [Wishlist,Confirmed]
<sommer> is there significance to the different hues of green on merges.u.c ?
<mathiaz> sommer: the colors refer to how long it's been since the last merge
<sommer> mathiaz: ah thanks
<RAOF> no0tic: dh_icons replaces a dh_installicons (or something) that we had in Ubuntu's debhelper but not in Debian's.  dh_icons will be needed to update the gtk-icon-cache (and the KDE etc one should they get around to making one).
<sommer> mathiaz: so the lower ones are oldest?
<no0tic> RAOF, dh_iconcache :) now dh_icons is present in debian too but the maintainer didn't added it to his debian/rules
<mathiaz> sommer: well - the upper ones are the packages that have *not* been merged for a while
<sommer> mathiaz: gotcha
<RAOF> no0tic: Then you can't sync it yet, you'll need a merge which adds a dh_icons call.
<no0tic> *didn't add
<no0tic> RAOF, ok, it is what I'm doing
<mathiaz> sommer: red - long time since the last merge - green not so long
<crimsun> no0tic: push the debdiff to the Debian maintainer; wait for it to be applied; request sync post.
<RAOF> Or, indeed, what crimsun says is better.
<bbyever> could someone please review this debdiff before i upload it to lp ? http://paste.ubuntu.com/11040/
<no0tic> crimsun, ok, so it's better to wait them to change their package... until when? When could we say, well let's do a merge?
<crimsun> no0tic: we're still quite early in the merge cycle; I'd say if the Debian maintainer(s) doesn't apply something within 3 weeks, just go ahead and merge it.
<no0tic> crimsun, ok, thank you
<RoAkSoAx> crimsun, are you the maintainer of alsa-tools?
<crimsun> RoAkSoAx: used to be.  What's up?
<no0tic> crimsun, filing a bug in debian bug control is ok? or it's better to mail the mantainer?
<RoAkSoAx> crimsun, i tried to merge it, but when building the binary i got lot's of warnings... the same warnings as in the hardy built... so james_w told me to talk to you about it
<crimsun> no0tic: mail via bugs@ or control@ with patch attached (and tags + patch) is best
<crimsun> RoAkSoAx: which set of warnings?
<RoAkSoAx> crimsun, lots of these: ../pixmaps/lad_banner.xpm:1875: warning: deprecated conversion from string constant to 'char*'
<RoAkSoAx> ../pixmaps/rme.xpm:2338: warning: deprecated conversion from string constant to 'char*'
<RoAkSoAx> HDSPMixerSelector.cxx:51: warning: deprecated conversion from string constant to 'char*'
<RoAkSoAx> ../pixmaps/Slider2.xpm:273: warning: deprecated conversion from string constant to 'char*'
<RoAkSoAx> ./pixmaps/b_solo.xpm:78: warning: deprecated conversion from string constant to 'char*'
<RoAkSoAx> ../pixmaps/buttons.xpm:513: warning: deprecated conversion from string constant to 'char*'
<RoAkSoAx> some others like that
<RoAkSoAx> Cus428State.cc:323: warning: enumeration value 'eFaderM' not handled in switch
<crimsun> RoAkSoAx: yes, those are ok
<RoAkSoAx> dpkg-shlibdeps: warning: debian/qlo10k1/usr/bin/qlo10k1 shouldn't be linked with libXt.so.6 (it uses none of its symbols).
<RoAkSoAx>  (and others with other libraries)
<RoAkSoAx> dpkg-gencontrol: warning: unknown substitution variable ${misc:Depends}
<RoAkSoAx> pretty much the same as the hardy ia64 built log
<crimsun> we should really get r365 in, too.
<no0tic> crimsun, bugs@debian.org ? subject: package_version: Use dh_icons in debian/rules  and debdiff attached, ok?
<no0tic> crimsun, sorry if I bother you, but I'm not so confident and I don't want to make mistakes :)
<RoAkSoAx> these too warning, `debian/alsa-tools/DEBIAN/control' contains user-defined field `Original-Maintainer'
<RoAkSoAx> crimsun, so what to do?? should i just go ahead and report the merge in LP ?
<crimsun> no0tic: submit@bugs.debian.org, with the guidelines at http://www.debian.org/Bugs/Reporting .  See the pseudo-headers.
<no0tic> crimsun, thanks
<crimsun> RoAkSoAx: sure, go ahead and merge it
<crimsun> RoAkSoAx: please also apply http://hg.alsa-project.org/alsa-tools/raw-rev/9d1e48f8dd5d
<crimsun> (out for a bit)
<RoAkSoAx> crimsun, how to do that...? (i'm in learning process xD)
<bbyever> uhh im not sure this debdiff is correct (http://paste.ubuntu.com/11040/), could someone have a look at it before i upload it to lp?
<RoAkSoAx> bbyever, i think you do no't have to put this:
<RoAkSoAx> debain/rules
<RoAkSoAx> -      - added removal of po/*.gmo files
<RoAkSoAx> but i do not know for sure
<bbyever> but shouldnt all the changes be in the changelog?
<RoAkSoAx> bbyever, yeah... but just UBuntu changes, and not debian changes... and that part of the changelog i can see it in the debian changelog part
<bbyever> ï»¿RoAkSoAx: ahh right
<bbyever> ï»¿RoAkSoAx:thanks
<RoAkSoAx> welcom bbyever
<no0tic> crimsun, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/11041/ <- this body and debdiff attached
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, i believe that if you added dh_icons in debian/rules would be something like http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/11043/
<RoAkSoAx> but i'm not sure
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, I _copied_ from hardy's merge
<no0tic>   * Merge from Debian unstable, remaining changes:
<no0tic>     - debian/rules:
<no0tic>       + Use dh_icons instead dh_iconcache.
<RoAkSoAx> didn't know that.. so i guess it is good then :P xD
<no0tic> in that case debian package used dh_iconcache, in my case it uses nothing, so it is a bit different
<StevenK> no0tic: Debian never had dh_iconcache.
<StevenK> dh_iconcache is an Ubuntu-ism, dh_icons is in Debian. If anything, the patch should be commited to Debian.
<no0tic> StevenK, "now" also ubuntu uses dh_icons, right?
<StevenK> no0tic: Right.
<no0tic> User: ubuntu-devel@lists.ubuntu.com
<no0tic> Usertags: origin-ubuntu intrepid ubuntu-patch
<ember> StevenK but dh_icons is now on gnome.mk in Debian cdbs 0.4.52
<no0tic> are these tags ok for the bug report?
<StevenK> ember: Okay, so if the package uses gnome.mk it doesn't need to do anything.
<no0tic> StevenK, ok, so no need for the bug report?
<StevenK> no0tic: Well, does it use gnome.mk?
<ember> yes, so no need to commit that change into Debian, and as soon that cdbs get into intrepid that packages if use gnome.mk really doesnt need that delta
<StevenK> CDBS has been merged in Intrepid already
<ember> cool
<no0tic> StevenK, it is a kde package, does it make any difference?
<RoAkSoAx> hey guys, can you help me? how to apply this: http://hg.alsa-project.org/alsa-tools/raw-rev/9d1e48f8dd5d
<StevenK> no0tic: I'd need to check myself
<no0tic> StevenK, sorry, but I'm learning how things work.. it's only few days since I started in this field :)
<StevenK> no0tic: What is the package name?
<no0tic> StevenK, kid3
<StevenK> no0tic: Give me a few to do the merge myself
<no0tic> I'll be here :)
<jdong> StevenK: you're gonna be merging kid3? that sounds hot ;-)
<jdong> *ducks*
<StevenK> jdong: No, no0tic is.
<StevenK> I'm helping.
<jdong> StevenK: whoa.... didn't \sh blog about something like that a few days ago on Planet?
 * jdong is going to hell
<StevenK> no0tic: Right, the Debian source of kid3 does not include dh_icons in it's debian/rules, and we do.
<StevenK> no0tic: So the delta is adding dh_icons, and it's *adding*, not replacing dh_iconcache. A bug report should be submitted to Debian's kid3 maintainer asking them to include dh_icons
<no0tic> StevenK, ok
<no0tic> StevenK, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/11041/  this would be the bug report mail body at which I will attach the debdiff
<StevenK> no0tic: You need to strip the debdiff to only include the relevant changes -- the Debian package does not need the Maintainer change, or the Ubuntu changelog entries.
<no0tic> StevenK, ok
<StevenK> no0tic: I'd suggest you word it, rather than pasting from the changelog too. "The Ubuntu package of kid3 uses dh_icons during its build to update the icon cache during installation, I am attaching a patch to debian/rules that adds it."
<no0tic> StevenK, thank you very much, once finished I'll post here the patch
<ember> no0tic here's an example http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=464459
<ubottu> Debian bug 464459 in giggle "giggle: Please call dh_icons during build" [Normal,Closed]
<no0tic> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/11048/ <- this is the patch I'm attaching
<RoAkSoAx> can anyone help me on applying this?? http://hg.alsa-project.org/alsa-tools/raw-rev/9d1e48f8dd5d i dunno how to do it! :( (i'm just starting with packaging and stuff)
<StevenK> no0tic: That patch looks good.
<no0tic> StevenK, fine, I'm posting then, thanks a lot
<no0tic> StevenK, crimsun advised me to wait some time before continuing in the merge. If debian does the change then we can sync
<StevenK> no0tic: Exactly.
<jdong> ^^ ooh I need to track him down :)
<emgent> :D
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, how did you made the patch?
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, by hand
<no0tic> RoAkSoAx, vim'ed the debdiff :)
<RoAkSoAx> no0tic, lol ... i guess i have to do the same thing then xD :)
<LaserJock> soo
<LaserJock> MOTU Meeting in 45 min?
<ajmitch> there is?
<LaserJock> I believe so
<ajmitch> I'd better hide then
<TheMuso> Don't think there is anything on the agenda yet.
<TheMuso> I think it has something to do with the time of day.
<ajmitch> what, being close to beer o'clock?
<LaserJock> I was gonna maybe add a couple items
<TheMuso> LaserJock: Go for it.
<LaserJock> ok, added
 * ajmitch looks
<ajmitch> hm, a fan club
<ajmitch> I could join one of those
<RoAkSoAx> someone available to help me with something related to alsa-tools?
<TheMuso> LaserJock: I do wonder whether we will get a deacent turn out however.
<persia_> It's the 04:00 meeting, which is traditionally the least well attended...
<LaserJock> TheMuso: well, I just didn't want a meeting without anything :-0
<LaserJock> I'm mostly just interested chatting about things
 * TheMuso nods.
<LaserJock> my goal is to make the 04:00 MOTU Meeting *the* place to be ;-)
<ajmitch> isn't it already?
<LaserJock> no, it's the least attended one
<LaserJock> I gotta start bringing pizza or something
<LaserJock> that works for grad students
 * ajmitch had pizza for lunch today
<ajmitch> it was good :)
<LaserJock> darn
 * RAOF is making pizza for dinner
<LaserJock> now I'm craving a pepperoni pizza
 * TheMuso had pizza the other night.
<ajmitch> yeah, it was a bit of foreigners being shown the local culture :)
<virtuald> shut up, i have about $40 for the next 10 days
<TheMuso> Pizza seems to be a geek food.
<RAOF> Simple, cheap, and delivered.
<RoAkSoAx> lol =)
<ajmitch> TheMuso: considering who I was with, I'm not surprised that pizza was the suggestion
 * ajmitch is glad that it's mostly stopped raining now though
<LaserJock> ok, so I'm gonna email -motu about the "fanclub" team and email the rest of MOTU SRU about 7-day aging
<LaserJock> that's all right?
<ajmitch> that's what was agreed on, iirc
<RoAkSoAx> LaserJock, what will be the specific purpose of having the fan club?
<LaserJock> RoAkSoAx: to give a team for new people to identify with MOTU
<LaserJock> right now we have no "entry-level" team
<RoAkSoAx> LaserJock, but.. besides?? they should be given specific task so that they feel more identified with the team
<LaserJock> well, I'm not sure what to do there
<LaserJock> in the Doc Team we have the Documentation Students team
<LaserJock> and they are part of a mentoring program
<RoAkSoAx> LaserJock, for example.. they could have the task to help newbies ... because there is a waiting list to Obtain a MOTU Mentor
<LaserJock> and I think they have a copy of the docs in bzr for them to play with there
<RoAkSoAx> they could be like "junior mentors"
 * TheMuso will get the minutes done some time this weekend.
<RoAkSoAx> i believe that if you gonna make a fanclub, you should give them specific tasks so that they can feel more involved than just being part of another LP team
<LaserJock> that makes some sense
<LaserJock> I'm just not sure how to "give" them things
<bbyever> assign them to bitsize bugs
<RoAkSoAx> for example, nxvl has been a great teacher to me and helped introducing me to the packaging world and stuff.. they could be like junior mentors of newbies.. because nowadays there is a wait list for a MOTU mentor...
<bbyever> or other simple tasks
<LaserJock> I was just thinking of something along those lines
<RoAkSoAx> what bbyever says makes sense too
<LaserJock> RoAkSoAx: well, we just created a Universe Contributors team
<LaserJock> I would see that team as more the "experienced non-MOTUs"
<RoAkSoAx> LaserJock, yeah i now, i'm just giving you ideas of how to improve things xD
<LaserJock> RoAkSoAx: well, do you think an entry-level team would be useful
<RoAkSoAx> if its experienced non-MOTUs, would be great to have them mentoring newbs
<persia_> LaserJock: Could you please not use "fan club", but instead something more general, that emphasised that they was to be members of some team, rather than that they are fans of MOTU?
<RoAkSoAx> LaserJock, i believe so... but if you have specifics task for that team...
<LaserJock> persia_: sure, I just couldn't think of a short name for it
<RoAkSoAx> specify*
<persia_> LaserJock: Understood.  I just think "fan club" is misleading.
<LaserJock> persia_: well, it seemed to me that that was along the lines of what sebner was talking about
<LaserJock> although maybe my definition of "fan club" is not quite accurate
<persia_> See, I'd disagree.  I think he wanted to be part of a group that contributed something, not a group that was a fan of something.
<LaserJock> ah
<persia_> Yes: it's just semantics.  I disagree with your definition of "fan club", not your other thoughts about it.
<LaserJock> i took him to me just something to say "heah, I like MOTU"
<ajmitch> LaserJock: it's people like me who want to be fans
<LaserJock> as an identification rather than contributory motivation
<persia_> No.  He wanted a badge that said he was someone who was working on stuff, and planned to have cooler badges soon.
<LaserJock> ok, i gotcha
<RoAkSoAx> but that team should be created not to give a badge to users who are working on stuff... that team should be a team with specific tasks that way they will have certain "resposibility"
<LaserJock> it would be cool if we could make such a team a member of ubuntu-bugcontrol
<LaserJock> so as to say "these are the people working on MOTU bugs/tasks"
<LaserJock> obviously we wouldn't do an purely open team then
<persia_> RoAkSoAx: I don't think it appropriate to pass responsibility to an open team: we should know someone for a while before they are assumed to be responsible.  Doesn't mean people not in closed teams aren't responsible, or can't help, only that they ought work with others.
<persia_> Anyway, I have to be off, as for me, now is not an ideal time.  I'll read logs later, and hope for more.
<LaserJock> but a very low "barrier"
<LaserJock> I'm just not sure that an open team is what we want
<LaserJock> in the case of the Doc Students team
<RoAkSoAx> persia, yes but, LaserJock is saying that the team is for experienced non-MOTUs that want to be MOTUs... that way.. if you give them responsibilities... you will know who is suitable to become a MOTU and who's not
<LaserJock> all somebody has to do is send an email saying "heah, I'd love to join" and we add them
<LaserJock> RoAkSoAx: no, I said we already have such a team
<LaserJock> what we're wondering about is an entry-level team
<LaserJock> for newish people
<bbyever> personaly i think such a team would only be useful as a "mentor waiting list" to give them simple things to do
<RoAkSoAx> LaserJock, in the spanish translations team, people have to work on translations for 3 months. After that they can apply, if they have good translations and the team accepts them as official translators they will have a responsibility, that is not just to translate.. but to review an correct and so on
<LaserJock> RoAkSoAx: right
<RoAkSoAx> so, that way you ensure that things go right
<LaserJock> right now we have MOTU
<LaserJock> and Universe Contributors (which is experienced non-MOTUs)
<LaserJock> the question is whether we need yet another team for new people just getting started
<RoAkSoAx> so if you create the newbie team... would be a team of people who needs mentoring and guidance...
<bbyever> IMO no
<LaserJock> I guess "need" is also maybe a bad word
<LaserJock> the question is if people want or would be helped by such a team
<bbyever> but the mentor already serves that purpose
<RoAkSoAx> but if they are part of a team, i would say that it would be better to give some responsibilities, guidance and mentoring so that way they can feel more involved
<bbyever> mentor program*
<RoAkSoAx> bbyever, but not everyone gets a mentor
<RoAkSoAx> as far as i've heard, there is a waiting list to obtain a mentor
<RoAkSoAx> so what about people who does not have a mentor, and many times are on their own?
<LaserJock> well
<LaserJock> there are a few different issues there
<LaserJock> one is that "mentoring" doesn't necessarily mean a formal mentor/mentee relationship
<LaserJock> I consider MOTU as a team to often be mentors for people wanting to become MOTUs
<LaserJock> it's more informal, but that's kinda the idea
<LaserJock> we also have a formal Mentoring program
<LaserJock> which, as I understand it, is stalled out because of a lack of mentors
<RoAkSoAx> maybe but for example, as i said, nxvl has been a great mentor to me... he has helped me a lot to get started and he is trying to get the Other Ubuntu-PE members involved too so that is good
<LaserJock> sure
<LaserJock> that's great
 * jdong has thought "come in here and ask a question" has worked beautifully
<LaserJock> jdong: me too
<jdong> a dedicated mentor has to work on a schedule to meet up with the mentee
<jdong> which can work out less favorably than just pitching problems to this open forum
<LaserJock> however, some people do really prefer a one-on-one interaction
<LaserJock> I tend to think mentoring works best as sort of an organic process, to use a fad phrase
<RAOF> (You mean involving carbon-carbon bonds? :))
<RoAkSoAx> but, besides of having a mentor that has to work on a schedule, you could have other kind of mentors, that can help users to get started with packaging... perfect example: nxvl to me and other peruvian members
<RoAkSoAx> he does not have the obligation to mentor me... but he does whenever he cans
<RoAkSoAx> and would be great to have those kind of "mentors"... not one who has to do it... but one that wants to do it
<RoAkSoAx> for example, offering Universe Contributors to mentor 2 people a year.... or something like that... they would have to work on a schedule, but they will be like the primary support of the learner
<LaserJock> mentoring is just a really tough thing
<LaserJock> we've not really had all that high of a success rate with formal mentoring programs
<LaserJock> and the mentors have to put in lots of time
<jdong> I personally have no time in my schedule to do a full-time mentoring thing
<jdong> my workflow is I'm in here for 5 minutes, out for 10-20 minutes, repeated over 18 hours
<jdong> and I think I still do a okay job of answering questions that pop in and out of here
<jdong> but I wouldn't be able to contribute meaningfully to a 1:1 mentorship program
<cbx33> GLARG!!
<RoAkSoAx> yeah, i don't expect every MOTU to be a formal mentor... i know people have to do other things besides mentoring...
<jdong> cbx33: is that the 2nd argument to initializing OpenGL?
<cbx33> no it's the pain I'm about to feel by slamming my own head into a table
<LaserJock> cbx33: Pete!
<jdong> RoAkSoAx: but if there's reasons that you feel a formal mentor works better for some than just asking questions to the channel / mailing list, please do try to organize that into a wiki page / spec
<cbx33> hey LaserJock
<jdong> I would be interested in reading that
<jdong> but speaking of 5 minutes, time to go deliver a hardcopy paper
<cbx33> kdenlive
<cbx33> why do you hate me so
<RoAkSoAx> jdong, i believe that a formal mentor is just to have someone to be the one who answers all your questions...
 * jdong shoves HandBrake in cbx33's face
<RoAkSoAx> it would be better to have 1 session a week to answer questions or maybe half an hour every day or something like that
<jdong> cbx33: try a build system that uses Jam and wgets its dependencies from random places to statically link against them :D
<jdong> while. building.
<cbx33> jdong: you think that'll help?
<cbx33> I'm willing to try anything
<jdong> cbx33: haha, no, that won't help
 * cbx33 jumps up and down
<jdong> that's what handbrake does and it's a nightmare for me
 * cbx33 starts to cry in the corner
<cbx33> hehehe sorry jdong
<cbx33> wow jsgotangco
 * jdong pets cbx33 
<cbx33> long time
<cbx33> I just wanna get ep 0.3 of progbox.vid done
<jsgotangco> greetings
<cbx33> I spent 4-5 hours getting footage together
<cbx33> and editing audio
<ajmitch> hello cbx33
<cbx33> hey ajmitch
<cbx33> WARNING: use unsermake instead of make or use a wrapper script, e.g. makeobj!!!
<cbx33> unsermake all
<cbx33> /bin/bash: unsermake: command not found
<RoAkSoAx> LaserJock, it would be great for example, to have that new team created... and help those users in packaging or giving them bugs to do in a week or so (and give them special lessons)... and help them resolving the issues and stuff like that... than just having a team to say, ok i have a badge
<cbx33> what can i do about that?
<jdong> cbx33: install unsermake
<cbx33> can't
<cbx33> doesn't exist in repo
<jdong> cbx33: well you're gonna have to grab it from KDE SVN then
<cbx33> more SVN
<cbx33> GAAHHH!!!
<cbx33> hehehe
<jdong> http://wiki.kde.org/tiki-index.php?page=unsermake
<jdong> yeah chasing down build deps can be a real pain
<cbx33> hahaha
<cbx33> well at least the KDE team tell me I'm gonna fail
<cbx33> Installation notes
<cbx33> You won't be probably able to install this, because there are no installation notes and those generic do not work. Shame, unusability at its best.
<jdong> ignore everything after Creating Slackware .tgz package with unsermake
<RAOF> jdong: Is that page for real?
<jdong> cbx33: lol I don't think that's true
<cbx33> heheh
<jdong> RAOF: sounds like someone REALLY grumpy one night vandalized the header :)
<LaserJock> RoAkSoAx: I undestand. I just wonder if we can really commit to that
<LaserJock> RoAkSoAx: I don't want to end up with a team that's just full of disappointed people
<RAOF> A compelling replacement for autotools sounds fun.
<RoAkSoAx> LaserJock, that is true... and i believe that if you create a team to identify those who want to become a motu someday... would not help much
<jdong> RAOF: apparently unsermake builds KDE some 2x faster
<cbx33> oh man
<cbx33> the svn link is wrong
<jdong> RAOF: I know a lot of Gentoovians use it
<RAOF> jdong: My excitement knows no bounds.
<jdong> RAOF: lol. I can tell you're drooling over this.
<RAOF> Because, you know, I build KDE all the time.
<jdong> RAOF: lol I said Gentoovians, didn't I? :D
<RoAkSoAx> for example, i joined the marketing team long time ago... but... there was nothing specific to do than just to do marketing on your own... so i thought... why should i be part of this team... if it would be the same thing if i'm not part of the team... so that's why i think there should be a purpose with specific tasks for that team
<jdong> that's a bi-nightly ritual
<LaserJock> I'm using cmake quite a bit these days, it's not too bad
<RAOF> It'd be nice to have a tool with some CIL smarts.
<LaserJock> RoAkSoAx: I fully realize what you're saying. That was my initial objection to creating such a team.
<LaserJock> RoAkSoAx: however, I'm uncertain how we'd actually go about giving a team like that tasks or purpose
<bbyever> LaserJock: IMO, this new team should just have tasks set out every weak, like a page of bitesize bugs. it could be just while waiting for an actual mentor.
<cbx33> right well there's my 30 mins up for the day
<LaserJock> bbyever: well, how would one actually give them the list?
<cbx33> :(
<RoAkSoAx> bbyever, that is a good idea
<bbyever> wiki or mailling list
<bbyever> lp teams now have mailling lists
<RoAkSoAx> LaserJock, like saying: ok these week you can work in these bugs, A B and C... you can work with someone else or by yourself... during the week we'll have a session for troubleshooting and by the end of the week we'll review the bugs or something like that...
<LaserJock> RoAkSoAx: no, like I'm saying, how can we communicate with these people
<LaserJock> it's just a Launchpad team
<LaserJock> there's no mailing list, etc.
<LaserJock> so how are we to "tell" them anything?
<bbyever> LaserJock: lp teams do have mailling lists
<LaserJock> well
<bbyever> afaik
<RoAkSoAx> i believe there are lists for lp teams right?
<LaserJock> the CC has requested that we not use those for now
<LaserJock> eventually that may work, though it would mean yet another mailing list
<RoAkSoAx> so, i believe that the people who are going to be in that team... are also suscribed to motu ML and motu-mentors right?? so that could be a way of communication... other way could be the wiki page
<cbx33> unsermake doesn't seem to be in SVN anymore
<cbx33> kdenonbeta is gone
<bbyever> also, there has to be some sort of interest or initiative from the people who join. they can't expect to be gives everything, and joining an ubuntu mailling list isn't so hard...
<LaserJock> RoAkSoAx: we've no way of knowing if they are subscribed to those lists
<RoAkSoAx> LaserJock, and besides.. if someone joins that team.. it is because they are committed to become a motu or at least to learn... so if they are committed, the communication method could be any! and maybe using the current motu ML
<RoAkSoAx> LaserJock, one of the requirements to join the team could be to suscribe to those lists...
<bbyever> I agree with roaksoax
<LaserJock> RoAkSoAx: well, an open  team means there are no controls on who joins
<LaserJock> but if we did have a closed team that said "If you'd like to join this team people interested in contributing to Universe please email an introduction to ubuntu-motu" ?
<RoAkSoAx> yes
<RoAkSoAx> LaserJock, exactly... that way you will know who of those people are commited to contributing
<bbyever> I like that better
<bbyever> otherwise it would be pointless even having a team
<RoAkSoAx> not just joining a team to have more badges and say "ok i'm a team member of 5 teams, i'm of 6 teams" and so on...
<LaserJock> bbyever: well, it's  not exactly pointless, but maybe not all that useful
<LaserJock> having a closed team does require maintainence
<LaserJock> we'd need people who can add people
<RoAkSoAx> LaserJock, yes... those people could send a presentation mail to the motu list, after the presentation someone approves him on the team
<bbyever> the way I see it is: an open team requiering responsibility from the people joining or a closed team requiering responsibility from inside
<RoAkSoAx> if its an open team... every single one who wants to be part of ubuntu, could join the team but will have no idea what that team is for...
<RoAkSoAx> but, if it is a close team... you filter people and just add those who are really interested in become part of motu
<bbyever> they would, but they'd have to read wiki and join lists
<RoAkSoAx> bbyever, by doing that.. they will show their commitment to the team...
<bbyever> exacly
<bbyever> an open team filters itself
<RoAkSoAx> yeah... for example, if LoCo's where open teams... everybody could join but what for... team members in a LoCo team are team members because they committed themselves to help the community through the LoCo team, and they had to fit some requirements to joing the team...
<RoAkSoAx> otherwise... we will have lots of people on the team with no use...
<RoAkSoAx> for example, in the peruvian team there are hundreds suscribed in the ML, and in the website... but there are few in the LP team... Those who are suscribed in the LP team (including myself) are the ones who really committed to work for the team and are the ones who doing something about it
<bbyever> same in the mx team
<RoAkSoAx> because many others say, ok i want to be part of the team, but they don't show their commitment by just suscribing to a ML or a website...
<nxvl> RoAkSoAx: go merge!
<RoAkSoAx> nxvl, we're discussing a serious issue here... master yoda!!
<RAOF> I'm not sure what this emphasis on 'commitment' is for.  Surely people demonstrate commitment by actually _doing_ things?  There's plenty to do, and plenty for someone just starting out to do.
<RoAkSoAx> RAOF, yeah.. that's why if a new team is created... members of that team should show their commitment by fitting certain requirements
<nxvl> what's the topic
<tbielawa> evening
<bbyever> RAOF: the thing is new people don't always know what to do
<nxvl> i have no time to scrollback now
<LaserJock> nxvl: we were discussing the formation of a LP team for new people to MOTU
<RAOF> bbyever: Right.  But is the best solution a new team?
<cbx33> Personally I think not
<LaserJock> rather, if such a team were desirable to have
<nxvl> bbyever: that's why the Wiki Pages are for, and the team stand for
<nxvl> LaserJock: the motu contributors thing?
<tbielawa> as a person new to MOTU I think I'd find it more confusing
<tbielawa> well maintained wiki ftw
<RoAkSoAx> and it is pointless to have and open team without a purpose...
<nxvl> LaserJock: the one we discuss on the list some weeks ago?
<RAOF> Is a better solution to add something to w.u.c/MOTU?  Something like 'if you're not sure what to do, join #ubuntu-motu or pipe up on ubuntu-motu@l.u.c'?
<LaserJock> nxvl: yeah, now that we turned u-u-c into revu-uploaders we wondered if a general team for people wanting to get involved would be appropriate
<nxvl> i think not
<nxvl> ScottK has a good point on this
<RoAkSoAx> nxvl, not if it's an open team...
<nxvl> and i think like him
<LaserJock> nxvl: uh oh ;-)
<nxvl> MOTU developers and contributors are to splited
<nxvl> there are 2 ML
<nxvl> -motu and -motu-mentors
<bbyever> RAOF that could be a better solution
<nxvl> that split the community on "people who know what they are doing come here, and people who doesn't know go there"
<nxvl> so you are making a barreer for new contributors
<nxvl> and making things harder for them
<nxvl> and that's now that we need to look for
<nxvl> it will be better if everyone is on the same ML and same places
<RoAkSoAx> nxvl, we were suggesting to use the -motu list or -motu-mentors list for those new contributors if the new team is to be created
<nxvl> so the new contributors also know the other contributors and community members so they can help them
<RAOF> nxvl: Right.  I wasn't even really aware of -motu-mentors.  Does it have a lot of traffic?
<nxvl> RAOF: not really
<nxvl> RAOF: but new contributors suscribe themselfs to it
<RoAkSoAx> i'm suscribed to motu-mentors =)
<nxvl> i will suggest to remove -mentors ML i don;t see the point
<nxvl> it only make new contributors be afraid to ask on -motu
<RAOF> I agree there.
<mok0_> nxvl: ... and it's mostly duplicates of -motu anyway
<cbx33> do we have a good documentation set yet for being a MOTU
<nxvl> mok0_: yes, most of the mails are send to the 2 ML
<nxvl> cbx33: yes
<cbx33> nxvl: link me
<RAOF> cbx33: By 'being a MOTU' you mean the various tasks we perform, or the process of becoming a MOTU?
<cbx33> and what the processes are for new packages
<cbx33> and where to go when you get stuck
<cbx33> and commen questions asked
<cbx33> etc
<nxvl> cbx33: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/GettingStarted
<nxvl> there are documents in the wiki for everything
<nxvl> or almost everything
<LaserJock> cbx33: it's probably better than when you started, but still lots that could be done
<cbx33> right
<nxvl> you just need to learn what are you seraching for
<cbx33> LaserJock: to be honest I think that's the number one thing you can do
<cbx33> make a MOTU handbook
<LaserJock> nxvl: I don't think the problem is so much that info isn't there, but rather it's hard to find
<cbx33> even make it as a PDF and a lulu.com download
<cbx33> give them a manual so you can say RTFM :p
<nxvl> LaserJock: that's right
<cbx33> also
<nxvl> cbx33: there are a lot of MOTU Jurneys out there
<nxvl> effie_jayx wrote one some moths ago
<nxvl> months
<cbx33> I'd look at giving people in the MOTU community almost like job titles.....
<cbx33> so you can say
<cbx33> MOTU manager does this
<cbx33> instead of relying on a name of a person
<cbx33> which may change 6 months away
<nxvl> heh
<nxvl> ScottK is missing this conversation
<cbx33> give them a chain of command
<RoAkSoAx> it would also be great to have it in the system documentation xD
<cbx33> who can I go to if someone is holding my stuff up
<cbx33> etc
<nxvl> if he were there i'm almost sure he will be reneging
<LaserJock> cbx33: have a look at wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Leaders
<cbx33> if that isn't in place....it should be
<cbx33> LaserJock: ko
<cbx33> I've been out of touch for a while
<RoAkSoAx> the documentation could be improved a lot by giving actual examples of how doing merges, patches and stuff like that.. and step by step
<cbx33> I'm using my kdenlive rage to drive me on
<cbx33> RoAkSoAx: definitely
<cbx33> and then put it in a book
<cbx33> "So you want to be a MOTU"
<cbx33> :p
<RoAkSoAx> yeah
<RoAkSoAx> "The Ubuntu MOTU Book"
<RoAkSoAx> with lots of recipes and stuff like that
<cbx33> yup
<cbx33> i actually see a whole range of Ubuntu books
<nxvl> cbx33: dholbach is the person to ask for it
<cbx33> so you want to be a ........
<cbx33> MOTU
<cbx33> Developer
<cbx33> Documentor
<RoAkSoAx> Translator
<RoAkSoAx> xD
<cbx33> yup
<cbx33> Artist
<cbx33> Tester
<nxvl> well
<nxvl> need to sleep
<cbx33> nn nxvl
<RoAkSoAx> bye nxvl good look with "contabilidad" (i don't remember the translation for that lol :P)
<nxvl> tomorrow i need to be in training at 8:45 (it is 1:15 here)
<nxvl> RoAkSoAx: es2en@bot.talk.google.com
<nxvl> :D
<RoAkSoAx> tomorrow... i don't have anything else to do besides doing my thesis :P
<RoAkSoAx> nxvl, i remembered: accounting :P
<nxvl> RoAkSoAx: merge something i don't see your name on the intrepid-changes ML yet
<cbx33> RoAkSoAx: ahhh I remember doing mine
<cbx33> crikey was about 5 years ago now
<nxvl> bye
<RoAkSoAx> nxvl, i have virt-viewer in whishlist and have to finish alsa-tools
<RoAkSoAx> cbx33, i just obtained my BS in SYstems Engineer (Similar to Computer Science) last year.. and know i'm finishing my thesis...
<cbx33> cool
<RoAkSoAx> and since i'm on "vacations", cuz i'm not doing anything else besides that
<RoAkSoAx> :)
<bbyever> Its late here as well
<bbyever> see ya guys
<cbx33> LaserJock: can you see what I see?
<LaserJock> sorry, was afk for a minute
<LaserJock> well, here's the deal
<cbx33> bbl
<cbx33> :p
<LaserJock> real life examples and recipes are what everybody wants
<LaserJock> but they're very very difficult to do and maintain
<LaserJock> I've been doing merging examples for somethign like 2 years
<LaserJock> they just get outdated, and because each package is so different I'm not sure people get out all that much more out of them
<LaserJock> a MOTU Handbook would quickly swell into a monster that nobody would want to write or read I'm afraid
<LaserJock> I *have* been thinking about a MOTU quick reference
<cbx33> heheh
<cbx33> well
<LaserJock> doing one each for MOTUs, Contributors, and Triagers
<cbx33> I have an idea....
<RoAkSoAx> LaserJock, yeah but you can have categories like "merges with conflicts in debian/control" "merges with conflicts with patches" or for example, how to resolve issues in debian/rules and so on
<RoAkSoAx> LaserJock, that would be a great idea
<cbx33> yes
<LaserJock> RoAkSoAx: yeah, but each package is different
<cbx33> Trye
<cbx33> but.
<LaserJock> and people will complain "I did it just like the recipe but it didn't work, your documentation sucks!"
<RoAkSoAx> LaserJock, yeah i know that's the problem but all of'em have some similarities.. and someone could cover the basics...
<cbx33> you gotta think......if these people are going to contribute you want people who are semi-intelligent
<LaserJock> cbx33: don't start me down that road
<cbx33> Well
<RoAkSoAx> but giving a big banner "This doc only covers the basics with conflicts in debian/control. Beware... each package is different..." and stuff like that
<cbx33> my point, if they are not able to take a concept and adapt it
<cbx33> ....
<RoAkSoAx> cbx33, i think the same
<LaserJock> cbx33: seriously, you don't want me to go there
<cbx33> "Itold you not to go there, I Told you not to go there"
<cbx33> name that film
<cbx33> :)
<RoAkSoAx> lol
<tbielawa> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/GettingStarted That has helped me get started
<tbielawa> seemed pretty straight forward
<LaserJock> in some ways I think some "issues" are perhaps due to different learning styles
<LaserJock> some people do quite well if you just point them to docs to read
<LaserJock> other's just don't get anywhere 'til they get their hands dirty
<mok0_> Getting Started with MOTU makes no sense IMHO
<LaserJock> in practice we need to try to effectively teach to both
<LaserJock> mok0_: care to elaborate?
<LaserJock> I kind of agree with you, but wonder what things are problematic for you
<mok0_> It is not clear what it means "get started in MOTU"
<mok0_> ... and that whole page should be updated to replace "motu" with "contributor"
<tbielawa> that gets me too
<tbielawa> where they are drawing the line between contributors and MOTUs
<LaserJock> ah
<LaserJock> see, that's something too
<LaserJock> we have dual meanings to MOTU often
<LaserJock> we talk about MOTU as in the people who can upload to Universe/Multiverse
<LaserJock> but we also us "MOTU" in a generic sense to mean the collective community of  MOTUs and contributors
<mok0_> I think a good way to explain is to say that a MOTU is something you can become when working as a contributor for a while. As a MOTU, you get the right to upload to the Universe archive
<LaserJock> the heavy use of "contributor" is relatively new
<LaserJock> we used to use MOTU Hopeful
<mok0_> LaserJock: yeah
<tbielawa> Contributor sounds very politically correct, and more obvious
<mok0_> LaserJock: but you can be a contributor without being a MOTU hopeful
<tbielawa> if you say some one can be an ubuntu contributor it makes sense immeadiatly
<LaserJock> yes, that's why it was changed
<LaserJock> before in  our community you were basically either a MOTU or on your way to becoming one
<RoAkSoAx> well i'm tired.. going to sleep... good night all (or should i say day??)
<LaserJock> we didn't really have people who contributed but had no intention of becoming MOTUs
<tbielawa> good nuight
<LaserJock> RoAkSoAx: cya, thanks for the chat
<RoAkSoAx> LaserJock, anytime =) bye
<tbielawa> I hate to break up the serious discussion
<tbielawa> but I just found out that my first patch has gotten accepted into intepid!
<LaserJock> s/discussion/bikeshedding/
<tbielawa> lol
<tbielawa> i like green, personally
<LaserJock> tbielawa: congrats!
<tbielawa> LaserJock:  Thanks man!
<LaserJock> tbielawa: what package?
<tbielawa> slocate
<tbielawa> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/intrepid/+source/slocate/3.1-1.1ubuntu4
<tbielawa> It was on the 'bugs for the week' list when I showed up last weekend. So I took it since it looked easy
<LaserJock> I was thinking the other day when I was adding you to MOTU Science that it's been over 2 years since I started it
<tbielawa> :)
<tbielawa> on the main science motu page there is packages we'd like included
<LaserJock> that was a loooong time ago
<tbielawa> I've got one of them in REVU now :)
<LaserJock> which one?
<tbielawa> Bibus
<LaserJock> oh really?
<tbielawa> ya'rly
<LaserJock> that's been on the list for a long time
<tbielawa> Seriously?
<LaserJock> yeah
<tbielawa> It was debianized, I just had to clean it up http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=bibus
<LaserJock> glad to see somebody take it on
<LaserJock> yeah, when i put it on the list it was the hot new thing on the forums
<tbielawa> nifty
<LaserJock> and there weren't any package around
<tbielawa> ohhhhh
<LaserJock> it didn't look like a treat to do
<LaserJock> but I'm glad somebody's looked into it :-)
<tbielawa> I saw the work upstream put into it. the debianization was pretty intense
<LaserJock> did you intend to make it a native package?
<tbielawa> ha, ya.... um... I'm working on that part ;)
<LaserJock> ok ;-)
<tbielawa> This weekend I'm going to finish that up.
<tbielawa> I'll have a lot more time starting at 1pm on saturday (EST). My final- final exam is over wish
<LaserJock> hmm
<LaserJock> that packaging is pretty intense
<LaserJock> I think we'll have some work to do :-)
<tbielawa> what is it, what do you see?
<LaserJock> lots of stuff
<LaserJock> tbielawa: I've got to run right now, it's late here
<tbielawa> LaserJock: alright. lets try and work on cleaning up bibus some time after saturday/.
<tbielawa> ?
<LaserJock> tbielawa: send me an email (mantha@ubuntu.com) and I'll reply with a review
<tbielawa> nice!
<LaserJock> we'll get this baby busted out ;-)
<tbielawa> LaserJock:  You got it man, thanks
<LaserJock> night
<mok0_> I guess we need a general discussion of the MOTU wikipages
<tbielawa> ok
<LaserJock> mok0_: yes, I've been discussing that some with other MOTUs
<LaserJock> just need people who are willing to do work :-)
<LaserJock> but now I'm really away ;-)
<tbielawa> lol
<mok0_> LaserJock: any consensus?
<mok0_> LaserJock: On the GettingStarted page, we could in fact s/MOTU/Contributor/g
<tbielawa> I think you lost him mok0
<mok0_> tbielawa: ?!?
<tbielawa> mok0_ he left for bed methinks
<mok0_> Ah I see it now
<mok0_> heh
<mok0_> morning here...
<tbielawa> it's 3 here, it's probably midnight for him,
<mok0_> tbielawa: you mean 03?
<tbielawa> 0300
<tbielawa> yep
<tbielawa> -5 UTC
<mok0_> time for you to go to bed too... :-)
<tbielawa> If I knew what was good for me
<tbielawa> Hanging out in #-motu is kinda surreal some times to em
<tbielawa> it's strange for me anyway
<mok0_> yes, it's funny that way
<tbielawa> The job I got last fall is with the computer science department, before that job I hadn't used ubuntu
<tbielawa> I asked my manager where he got all our server names, and he said from posters on planet.ubuntu.com
<tbielawa> and in the last week I've talked to a few of the people on there that our boxes are named after
<mok0_> tbielawa: hah!
<mok0_> tbielawa: so what are the servers' names?
<tbielawa> holbach I see all the time. I talked to savage last night
<tbielawa> fittl, elep, karsemaker,
<tbielawa> fuchs
<tbielawa> edwards, denter,
<mok0_> :-D
<tbielawa> henstridge
<tbielawa> god damn henstridge
<tbielawa> that was our student file server and we were cursing that name afew weeks ago
<tbielawa> bacon, castro, zacchiroli, shuttleworth, helmke, droge.. the list goes on and on
<mok0_> if the students ever come to IRC, they might be puzzled
<tbielawa> well, I'm one of them as well, it's pretty neat now that I am hanging out here getitng into the community
<mok0_> ... to see their server chatting along
<tbielawa> lol!
<tbielawa> i have one more of our new machines to build, and our policy is whoever builds it names it.
<tbielawa> hear that folks? want a server named after you then now is the time to suck up :)
<mok0_> tbielawa: by "build" you mean install os?
<StevenK> tbielawa: I would, but my name is a crappy machine for a name.
<tbielawa> nope, i have a 1u rack mount case in our server building along with the mobo + hdd + ram, etc ready to inventory, build, and rack
<mok0_> tbielawa: cool
<StevenK> crappy name for a machine. Sigh.
<tbielawa> what's your last name?
<mok0_> tbielawa: what cpu
<tbielawa> mok0_: dual amd opterons, i forget the speed now, but it's a pretty mean box
<mok0_> tbielawa: we find the best buy to be intels currently
<tbielawa> mok0_: we're considering a shift towards intel hardware specs for our next round of purchases
<StevenK> tbielawa: /wii will tell you
<mok0_> tbielawa: you can get dual quads now... 8 CPUs in one...
<tbielawa> I don't understand this thing!
<tbielawa> the /wii is beyond me
<tbielawa> oh baby, dual quads
<tbielawa> I don't know what we'd do with all those cores, other than consolidate and run a basket of virtualmachines :)
<mok0_> tbielawa: exactly
<tbielawa> The research I'm doing in our shift to a hardy infrastructure is focusing around using KVM to consolidate
<mok0_> tbielawa: we have delegated a few server tasks to virtual machines (KVM)
<mok0_> tbielawa: we have delegated a few server tasks to virtual machines (KVM)
<tbielawa> mok0_: do you have much experience setting up the network configurations?
<mok0_> tbielawa: not much, a bit. I wrote a wiki page on what I did
<tbielawa> The hardware we're going to be implementing the virtualizing on has dual ethernet connections, I'd like to consider the practical benefits of utilizing each adapter
<mok0_> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/KvmWithBridge
<tbielawa> wait, you're Morten?
<mok0_> Yes
<tbielawa> mok0_: i'm on the page now
<gnomefreak> package wordpress there are 2 depends that are no longer in our repos im huessing they are fairly important. the depends that cant be found are libjs-prototype, libjs-scriptaculous  are these dafe to remove?
<tbielawa> I've been referencing that thoroughly
<gnomefreak> s/dafe/safe
<gnomefreak> there is no longer any package/lib that starts with libjs
<tbielawa> in intrepid?
<gnomefreak> tbielawa: yes but the packages were not in HArdy either i just found out
<tbielawa> oh
<gnomefreak> !info libjs-prototype hardy
<ubottu> Package libjs-prototype does not exist in hardy
<tbielawa> I have no idea man. if it's running without them it might be safe to remove. give it a try
<gnomefreak> i just set up a wordpress account so i never tested in on hardy
<gnomefreak> tbielawa: ill try it
<gnomefreak> thanks
<tbielawa> sure
<tbielawa> mok0_: I read your wiki page, I think you would be very interested in what we're doing my department.
<mok0_> gnomefreak: your question will reach a wider audience if you write to the mailing list
<gnomefreak> mok0_: i know i always check here first :)
<mok0_> gnomefreak: yeah, you might be lucky of course
<tbielawa> mok0_: check out the launchpad project if you have a moment https://launchpad.net/loud-platform
<mok0_> tbielawa: nice!
<tbielawa> last weekend when I was getting assimilated into motu science I browsed everyones wiki pages and book marked yours since your idea matched up to what we're doing
<mok0_> tbielawa: I am very pleased it is useful to you!
<tbielawa> On our mirrir we're setting up virtual packages for the professors which will install the tools relevant to that professors course for the semester
<mok0_> tbielawa: when we did the work some months ago, I just wrote down what we did
<dholbach> good morning
<mok0_> tbielawa: that's a good idea
<tbielawa> morning holbach
<mok0_> morning, dholbach
<dholbach> hi mok0_
<tbielawa> dholbach: a server in my work palce is named after you
<tbielawa> I figured I'd tell you to help make you feel uncomfortable :p
<mok0_> hehe
<dholbach> tbielawa: eh?
<tbielawa> ha
<StevenK> It made me feel pretty uncomfortable, and glad I don't blog.
<tbielawa> lol
<StevenK> It'd, even
<dholbach> tbielawa: how is it named? where did you get that idea? ;)
<tbielawa> it wasn't my idea, my manager (ex debian maintainer) decided to name each machine we build after some one from the planet.ubuntu.com site
<mok0_> so now you understand why you shut down at irregular intervals
<tbielawa> we run the entire infrastructure (computer science department) off Ubuntu machines
<soren> tbielawa: Is there a hansen server?
<tbielawa> [CSEE]<tbielawa>@(denter)[~] 03:32:24
<tbielawa> $ lsearch cn=hansen cn
<tbielawa> [CSEE]<tbielawa>@(denter)[~] 03:34:43
<tbielawa> $
<tbielawa> nope
<tbielawa> but we have denter as a shell server :)
<soren> Ok, good :)
<soren> I'm safe for now.
<dholbach> tbielawa: man.... if I ever read comments like "it's dholbach acting up again"....
<tbielawa> no
<warp10> Good morning!
<dholbach> hi warp10
<tbielawa> you shoudl ahve heard us cursing henstridges name recently
<warp10> heya dholbach
<tbielawa> morning warp10
<warp10> hey tbielawa
 * dholbach hugs jamesh
<tbielawa> it's pretty neat to talk to the people i've been naming hardware after and reading docs written by
<dholbach> . o O { "dholbach is down for maintenance tasks", etc... }
 * cbx33 patches dholbach 
<tbielawa> well, it's just holbach on the dns entry
<tbielawa> aparently holbach is a tftp server. oh god....
<cbx33> dholbach: lutin is away for 4 days :(
<tbielawa> dholbach: I think youre about to be depricated!
<cbx33> so no fixing in sight
<dholbach> tbielawa: please don't hurt my ego
<tbielawa> lol
<dholbach> cbx33: you could just follow up on the bug report or forward it upstream if it doesn't happen with the newest SVN snapshot
<dholbach> cbx33: I even gave you the numbers of SVN commits that are supposed to fix crashers - there are lots of option aside from "waiting for lutin to fix it" :)
<cbx33> dholbach: well
<cbx33> I've tried
<cbx33> compiling from source and that doesn't work either....I'm attacking this on all fronts
<cbx33> believe me
<dholbach> cbx33: if the newest svn snapshot shows the same problem, I'd forward the stack trace upstream
<cbx33> already done
<cbx33> but it is a different issue in the new SVN
<cbx33> I think the main problem
<cbx33> is that 0.6 isn't officially released
<cbx33> 0.5 was
<cbx33> 0.6 is still being worked on......
<cbx33> I think we just synced from debian
<dholbach> you could package a 0.6.really.is.0.5-0ubuntu1 and try to get that backported
<dholbach> (if nothing else helps)
<cbx33> i could, but
<cbx33> for a start unsermake is no longer in hardy
<cbx33> so that'd have to be ported to for build deps right?
<dholbach> yes, it'd help if it built :/
<cbx33> hey jono
<\sh> damn...is there any mirror which is not outdated or broken like a.u.c.?
<soren> I'm quite happy with se.a.u.c.
<gnomefreak> i use de and they work
 * StevenK blinks. uk.a.u.c gives an IP that reverses to ubuntu.datahop.it.
<gnomefreak> where would the menu item for wordpress be once installed?
<gnomefreak> i think i fixed it i just cant find it
<wgrant> gnomefreak: ... Wordpress is a webapp.
<gnomefreak> wgrant: thanks im working on figuring it out now
<gnomefreak> where would i find it it doesnt seem to be anywhere. a true web app you should find something about it alteast on wordpress.com or in browser menu i would think
<gnomefreak> no info from terminal at all just says commandnot found when i run it as wordpress and wordpress --help and than man wordpress doesnt have  aman page
<gnomefreak> i would have thought it would be in the add to panel menu when right clicking top panel
<wgrant> gnomefreak: It is a webapp! Why would it have a binary in the path, a panel applet, or a browser menu item?
<gnomefreak> because its a webblog manager and that is how the rest of them work
<wgrant> No, it is a blog webapp.
<wgrant> Not like blogtk or whatever it is.
<gnomefreak> Description: weblog manager  from show wordpress
<wgrant> Right, your definition of weblog manager is biased.
<gnomefreak> wgrant: so ther eis no way to run it is what you saying (it wont edit my blog from DE
<wgrant> No. That's not at all what it is designed for.
<gnomefreak> weblog manager to me would be drivel and friends
<wgrant> That might be a blog client.
<gnomefreak> so with this im gonna have to go to wordpress.com for it to help me at all?
<wgrant> What?
<wgrant> No.
<wgrant> Wordpress is a blog webapp. You run it on a web server.
<gnomefreak> oh that sucks
<wgrant> ...
<wgrant> Why?
<gnomefreak> atleast i fixed the depends on it and built it :)
<gnomefreak> wgrant: im not running a server
<wgrant> Built it?
<wgrant> It's PHP.
<wgrant> No building.
<gnomefreak> wgrant: the package we had in repos had 2 depends that no longer exsited
<wgrant> Where do you expect to host a blog if you're not running a server?
<wgrant> gnomefreak: Which release?
<gnomefreak> wgrant: yes very much packaging
<gnomefreak> 2.5.1-2ubuntu1
<gnomefreak> i removed the 2 libs and it built fine
<gnomefreak> and installed
<gnomefreak> would have liked to have tested it before pushing to PPA
<wgrant> That's in intrepid. What do you expect?
<gnomefreak> wgrant: hardy doesnt have them either
<gnomefreak> makes me think it hasnt worked in a while
<wgrant> I meant that version is in intrepid.
<gnomefreak> wgrant: right
<wgrant> Regrettably, wordpress installs fine in Hardy.
<wgrant> You can't expect an intrepid version to work on hardy.
<gnomefreak> wgrant: afaik libjs-prototype, libjs-scriptaculous are not in hardy and it has them as depends
<gnomefreak> so it shouldnt install if it didnt here
<gnomefreak> !info libjs-scriptaculous hardy
<ubottu> Package libjs-scriptaculous does not exist in hardy
<wgrant> gnomefreak: wordpresss 2.5 is not in Hardy!
<gnomefreak> !info wordpress hardy
<ubottu> wordpress (source: wordpress): weblog manager. In component universe, is optional. Version 2.3.3-1ubuntu1 (hardy), package size 853 kB, installed size 4540 kB
<gnomefreak> ah that could be a good reason
<wgrant> Why did you get some strange intrepid version?
<gnomefreak> wgrant: what do you mean strange?
<gnomefreak> its what is in repos
<wgrant> Yes. But it's in intrepid.
<gnomefreak> wgrant: yes so am i
<gnomefreak> atleast atm i am
<wgrant> So why were you complaining about the deps being missing in Hardy?
<\sh> gnomefreak, de.a.u.c is at least 24h old...
<proppy> oy
<proppy> Hi, is there a way to get which dependencies is missing when apt-get build-dep fails "with E: Build-dependencies for poker-network could not be satisfied." ? http://pastebin.com/m74e13a3c
<joaopinto> proppy, you can use the psatisfydepends script from pbuilder
<proppy> joaopinto: Aptitude couldn't satisfy the build dependencies
<proppy> E: pbuilder-satisfydepends failed.
<joaopinto> :|
<proppy> joaopinto: but the log file is pretty informative :)
<proppy> thanks a lot
<proppy> http://pastebin.com/m752aae09
<slytherin> I am trying to do sync/merge of cairo-java. I get - checking for jar... no, configure: error: no acceptable jar program found in $PATH. Can anyone help?
<james_w> slytherin: you have some sort of jre installed?
<slytherin> james_w: I am doing it in pbuilder chroot. And AFAIK, the dependencies are specified correct. It somehow looks like there is problem with 'alternatives'
<james_w> that could be it.
<slytherin> james_w: I just logged in the chroot and manually installed fastjar. But /etc/alternatives/jar points to jar binary in Sun 1.5.0 jdk installation which obviously does not exist
<slytherin> james_w: It was some problem with my chroot
<james_w> slytherin: you got it sorted now?
<slytherin> james_w: yes
<james_w> great
<slytherin> If I am filing a sync bug, whcih team should I subscribe?
<james_w> ubuntu-universe-sponsors if it is a universe package and you need a sponsor
<Jazzva> pochu: ping
<mok0> join #ubuntu
<slytherin> geser: are you working on any merges for the -java packages where you are the last uploader? ex. libgtk-java, libglade-java etc
<geser> slytherin: no, you can have them if you want
<geser> slytherin: I don't if the delta is still needed so please check before you merge
<slytherin> geser: Ok. Thanks. By the way I have just files sync bug for cairo-java.
<slytherin> geser: glib-java is also a sync. ï»¿bug 228643 and bug 228650. Going out for some time. Will do other packages later. :-)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 228643 in cairo-java "Please sync 1.0.8-9 (universe) version from Debian (main)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/228643
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 228650 in glib-java "Please sync 0.4.2-10 (universe) version from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/228650
<pochu> Jazzva: no route to host ;)
<Jazzva> pochu: Heh :)... I wanted to ask you what should I do to the 99_autoconf patch? It should be updated, afaics...
<Jazzva> pochu: Is it easier to generate a new one?
<Jazzva> And how :)?
<RainCT> hey
<RainCT> Jazzva: just replicate the changes as a new patch
<RainCT> (disabling the old one first)
<Jazzva> RainCT: I think the changes were made automatically... That's why I'm asking how to generate new one.
<geser> slytherin: both sync requests ACKed. Please add also the new Debian changelog entries to the sync bug the next time.
<slytherin> geser: Ok
<pochu> Jazzva: yes, 'autoreconf -fiv' should regenerate everything
<Jazzva> pochu: Thanks :)... I'll go with that...
<afflux> which parts of the changelog should I add to a sync request where the ubuntu version does not derive from a debian version?
<afflux> (they use the same .orig.tar.gz though)
<jw2328_> afflux: what do you mean "does not derive"?
<afflux> james_w: I mean that the ubuntu package has it's own packaging (x.y-0ubuntu1 vs. x.z-1)
<james_w> afflux: ah, ok, so it is derived from Debian, just not the current upstream version?
<james_w> you should add all the changelog entries from debian since the last Debian version that was in Ubuntu
<afflux> hm okay
<dholbach> RainCT: do you think you could forward your liquidwar desktop entry change to debian and/or upstream? I just did the merge
<Jazzva> pochu: I have to go off for a while, most of the merge for liferea is completed, just to test-build it. I'll submit it in a few hours, so you can review it :).
<RainCT> dholbach: If you can give me a diff, sure. (But the Maintainer doesn't seem very active anyway).
<dholbach> RainCT: http://paste.ubuntu.com/11109/
<dholbach> RainCT: thanks a lot
<dholbach> RainCT: it's the only remaining change, so we could sync the next release
<bddebian> Heya gang
<dholbach> heya bddebian
<bddebian> Hi dholbach
 * dholbach -> ice cream
<RainCT> dholbach: ah, nice. no problem, thx for the diff.
<joh> Could someone be so kind and review my package at revu? http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?package=alarm-clock-applet thanks!
<RainCT> joh: little question, have you followed the example from PackagingGuide/HOWTOS for the POD manpages?
<RainCT> s/manpages/manpage
<RainCT> joh: Anyway, good work, on a quick lock I can't find any real problem. Just some insignificant things:
<RainCT> joh: debian/rules has some unneeded commented-out examples; debian/copyright *might* have a wrong encoding (but it may also be just my browser) (and I usualy prefer linking to '.../GPL' (without the -2) if it is "or later" but you can do whatever you want); the Closes in debian/changelog is not needed an is usualy not written;
<RainCT> joh: and FYI, in debian/control you could use " ." to leave an empty line between the two paragraphs (but that might not be what you want, just telling your for the case you didn't know)
<RainCT> joh: ah, there is a "package = hello
<RainCT> " in debian/rules.. what does that do there? :P
<slytherin> when does MoM updates its reports?
<joh> RainCT: Thanks for your comments! (And sorry for this late reply)
<joh> RainCT: Regarding the manpage I followed this template: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Complete#head-be1e4a635cbcf6a0bf2ff344a99ca45cc87ae17a
<joh> RainCT: The commented-out examples you're referring to are the docbook-to-man & friends, right?
<joh> RainCT: The license needs to be GPLv2 as far as I know as I borrow some code from other GPLv2 apps.
<joh> RainCT: I was asked to refer to the LP bug report somehow and figured a closes bug comment in changelog would be appropriate. Is there any other way this could be done?
<slytherin> joh: I think he meant Closes word is unnecessary. Just LP: #xxxxxx is sufficient.
<joh> slytherin: Ah I see, thanks
<persia> Regarding the use of "Closes LP: #nnnnnn", the "closes" is not just unnecessary, but actively discouraged, as it can lead to confusion with the syntax for closing Debian bugs, and it is preferred that these be easily separable during changelog review.
<joh> Ok, so I should rather use "Initial release (#nnnnnn)" ?
<joh> Err, "LP: #nnnnnn"
<slytherin> joh: yes
<joh> Great
<jcfp> MOTUs, if you have some time to spare please review http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=sabnzbdplus
<ember> for -proposed the version is x.1 and assign motu-sru right?
<james_w> ember: subscribe, not assign.
<ember> yes, that.
<ember> thanks
<afflux> do you think bug 199600 is suitable for a SRU?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 199600 in aptoncd "aptoncd crashed with DBusException in call_blocking()" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/199600
<afflux> hi sebner
<sebner> afflux: huhu :)
<sroecker> hi
<sroecker> does anyone know how to create a diff for a glade file?
<laga> it's just XML. use diff?
<sroecker> if I edit it with glade I can't diff it
<sroecker> it always makes a huge diff
<laga> glade probably changed the file too much?
<sroecker> yes
<sroecker> it sucks editing glade files manually
<laga> yup.
<laga> and reviewing the big diffs from glade isn't fun.
<sroecker> ok, seems to be normal :(
<slytherin> sroecker: It is possible that old file was made with different glade version and now you are trying to edit it with latest glade version, hence so bug changes.
<mok0> Any experts on python-central here?
<mok0> Where do I install stuff when distutils is not used
<mok0>  /usr/share/package ??
<dholbach> doko: ^? :)
<slytherin> geser: Few more syncs. tomcat5.5 - 228665, libgtk-java - 228695, libglade-java - 228702, libvte-java - 228711, libhiglayout-java - 228724
 * mok0 could look at dh_python but I'm not much of a perl guy
<doko> mok0: just put it into .../site-packages, then call dh_pycentral
<mok0> doko: thanks I will try that
<slytherin> geser: will work on other java related syncs/merges over weekend. Signing off now. :-)
<white> Mez: around?
<mok0> ZZZzzzzzz
<joaopinto> secret maryo chronicles is not playing sound: ALSA lib pcm_dmix.c:874:(snd_pcm_dmix_open) unable to open slave
<joaopinto> I have seen some bug reports with similiar messages for other apps, should I still file the bug for smc ?
<morten> Hi, just a quick question about versioning. I have a small repository with a package (for lenny, sid, hardy, intrepid), and I have so far named it -0ubuntu2, but there is no differences between the versions. Would it be better to rename it to -3 ? (since there are no ubuntu changes)
<morten> (this is just a small test package for myself, so renaming it now would really mather)
<morten> also, in the changelog.. what should i use for distro? do i need to create one for each?
<pochu> afflux: are you going to do the screenlets sync/merge?
<pochu> 0.1.1 is already in Debian
<afflux> pochu: I'm not exactly sure how to document the delta "and why it can be dropped", and since I'm currently running out of time I'd appreciate if someone else would take it ;)
<pochu> afflux: ok, do you know if all the patches are merged upstream?
<afflux> pochu: I took a quick look and it seemed so
<pochu> ok, thanks. if I do it, I'll verify it
<afflux> thank you
<Amaranth> wow, you mean screenlets is maintained?
<afflux> hehe
<afflux> Amaranth: there is even some upstream, somewhere... ;)
<Amaranth> that's what i mean
<Amaranth> the original upstream author completely dropped off the face of the earth
<afflux> I see
<cbx33> hey guys
<cbx33> in an strace
<cbx33> what would this mean
<cbx33> http://pastebin.ca/1012995
<cbx33> is it crashing because the file isn't present?
<pochu> afflux: including those "new patches from ubuntu:" from 0.0.12-0ubuntu4? Other than the patches, this is a sync
 * pochu checks the code
<Mez> w00t
<pochu> afflux: all merged, sync requested filed
<afflux> pochu: excellent, thanks
<pochu> thanks for your work there! :)
<DarkSun88> hi all
<DarkSun88> xlibs-dev in hardy there isn't?
<RoAkSoAx> DarkSun88, check it: packages.ubuntu.com and search it in the hardy repos, if it does not appear there... means that it is not
<sebner> RoAkSoAx: pciutils are now in intrepid ;)
<DarkSun88> i'm already tryed, there isn't
<james_w> DarkSun88: correct
<DarkSun88> but the name is different?
<RoAkSoAx> sebner, so can i go ahead and post sync bug for athcool ?
<sebner> RoAkSoAx: after checking, yes ;)
<RoAkSoAx> sebner, what should i check?? ( i guess it have not been updated on the repos cuz i can't the pciutils-dev (>= 1:2.2.10) version just yet)
<DarkSun88> see you soon :)
<DarkSun88> thanks a lot
<sebner> RoAkSoAx: I may be wrong and it isn't a sync ;) 1:3.0.0-3 is in intrepid now or at least should hit the archive soon
<RoAkSoAx> sebner, ok so as soon it hits i'll check xD
<sebner> RoAkSoAx: no need. After you filed the sync bug it will take some days to process it so please go aheas
<sebner> *ahead
<sebner> huhu norsetto :)
<norsetto> sebner: how is the merging?
<RoAkSoAx> sebner, ok so i just file the sync bug, with what description ??  "Since pciutils-dev (1:3.0.0-3) is in the archivo, Ubuntu changes can be dropped" ??
<sebner> norsetto: well haven't done anything since I had stress in school. but I'm finalizing the courier merge now
<sebner> RoAkSoAx: yes. but you can't trust my words. Ok I'm quite sure that it's a sync but a double check is always better
<RoAkSoAx> sebner, i will :)
<sebner> RoAkSoAx: fine :)
<Jazzva> pochu: Seems that liferea works fine :). I'll clean up, report a merge request and let you know once it's up, so you can review it
<norsetto> RoAkSoAx: whats the problem with pciutils-dev?
<sebner> norsetto: what's wrong if I have a big debdiff and I want to patch debian package. It cries because debian rules is malformated but if I extract the rules diff thing I can patch it without problems
<norsetto> sebner: some specifics could help me to understand what you are talking about
<RoAkSoAx> norsetto, the other day i was trying to merge "athcool", but in the last hardy changelog (which was done by sebner) says that: "Note: If the package pciutils (>= 1:2.2.10) is in Intrepid we can drop all remaining changes and make a sync.". So since sebner just told me version  pciutils-dev (1:3.0.0-3) is in the archive... i have to check it before filling a sync bug
<sebner> norsetto: ^^. Ok I' merging courier now and I have a big debdiff. Now I want to see if the debdiff is working so I download the debian source pakage and apply the debdiff. But it complains that debian/rules can't be patched -> malformated. If I extract the debian rules patch from the debdiff I can apply it without problems
<sebner> RoAkSoAx: well not only pciutils. All the other things also ^^
<norsetto> RoAkSoAx: how can pciutils-dev (1:3.0.0-3) be in the archive!?
<sebner> norsetto: https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pciutils
<RoAkSoAx> sebner, yeah i know i have to check everything, to see if there are no more UBuntu changes xD, right?
<sebner> RoAkSoAx: fine ^^
<norsetto> sebner, RoAkSoAx: thats the source package, the pciutils-dev package has been replaced
<RoAkSoAx> norsetto, that's why i told sebner that i can't see that version on: http://packages.ubuntu.com/search?keywords=pciutils&searchon=names&suite=intrepid&section=all
<norsetto> RoAkSoAx: its been renamed to libpci-dev
<sebner> RoAkSoAx: see, you can't trust my words xD
<RoAkSoAx> norsetto, can't find it here either: http://packages.ubuntu.com/search?suite=intrepid&section=all&arch=any&searchon=names&keywords=libpci-dev
<norsetto> sebner: what is the exact error message?
<sebner> norsetto: patch: **** malformed patch at line 1488: diff -Nru courier-0.59.0/debian/rules courier-0.59.0/debian/rules
<norsetto> RoAkSoAx: libpci-dev |  1:3.0.0-3 |      intrepid | amd64, i386
<norsetto> sebner: and what is in that line?
<sebner> well at least it's really version 1:3.0 :)
<emgent>   o
<emgent> O/
<emgent> hi norsetto :P
<RoAkSoAx> norsetto, i guess it has not been updated yet... so i just merge and change the build-Depends from pciutils-dev to libpci-dev ?
<norsetto> emgent: ./
<sebner> norsetto: http://paste.ubuntu.com/11172/  <-- first line
<sebner> norsetto: As I said if I extract that in a single patch it applies without problems
<norsetto> RoAkSoAx: yes, its better, it may not ftbfs if you don't change it (if it is Provided by libpci-dev) but its better to have it explicitely.
<RoAkSoAx> norsetto, ok thanks i'll try it then :)
<norsetto> sebner: that line is funny indeed
<sebner> RoAkSoAx: As I said. Check everything ^^
<sebner> norsetto: ^^ -> :(
<RoAkSoAx> sebner, i will xD
<norsetto> sebner: how could you do that? It seems that you are diffing the same file
<norsetto> sebner: how it is for the other chunks?
<slytherin> when does MoM usually update it's reports?
<sebner> norsetto: the others are working. http://paste.ubuntu.com/11175/
<RoAkSoAx> norsetto, i have these conflicts: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/11176/ should i keep debian changes?
<norsetto> sebner: I understand, my question is, how is the header for the other files?
<sebner> norsetto: exactly the same ;)
<slytherin> sebner: I suggest that you change into the directory of extracted source package and then do patch -p1 < some.debdiff
<slytherin> sebner: That is the procedure I usually follow
<sebner> slytherin: not p1 ?
<norsetto> RoAkSoAx: why did we add libz there?
<sebner> slytherin: Ã¤h. p0
<sebner> norsetto: before and after example. http://paste.ubuntu.com/11177/
<slytherin> sebner: if you change into the source root, as opposed to outside source, you will need p1
<RoAkSoAx> norsetto, because of this: Depend on pciutils-dev (>= 1:2.2.10) and pkg-config, and use
<RoAkSoAx>     "pkg-config --libs libpci" to build statically with the correct
<RoAkSoAx>     libraries. (Closes: #445016, #450447)
<RoAkSoAx> that's in the debian changelog
<norsetto> RoAkSoAx: I understand that, my question is why did we add the -lz switch? Thats a diff we have with Debian
<norsetto> RoAkSoAx: check the ubuntu changelog, hopefully it is there
<RoAkSoAx> norsetto, here:  Patched Makefile to link against zlib (added -lz)
<RoAkSoAx> that's in Fiesty changelog
<norsetto> RoAkSoAx: right, so check why (there should hopefully be a bug reference) and if it is still needed
<sebner> slytherin: same mistake
<norsetto> sebner: how did you do the debdiff?
<sebner> norsetto: ehm. like everydebdiff. debdiff debian ubuntu > test.debdiff
<RoAkSoAx> norsetto, and they - Added zlib1g-dev to build-deps (in fiesty aswell) but debian does not use that zlib1g-dev
<norsetto> sebner: where?
<sebner> norsetto: where the files are ^^
<norsetto> sebner: I think you might be missing something, perhaps interdiff
<sebner> norsetto: hmm. never needed that before
<norsetto> sebner: did you install patchutils?
<sebner> norsetto: no -.- damn hardy reinstall. but why isn't a plain debdiff enough?
<RoAkSoAx> norsetto, there is no bug reference for that in the UBungu changelog
<norsetto> RoAkSoAx: try to search in launchpad
<RoAkSoAx> norsetto, these are all the bugs ever reported for athcool and none of them is related to that: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/athcool/+bugs?search=Search&field.status=New&field.status=Incomplete&field.status=Confirmed&field.status=Triaged&field.status=In+Progress&field.status=Fix+Committed&field.status=Fix+Released&field.status=Invalid&field.status=Won%27t+Fix&field.omit_dupes.used=
<sebner> norsetto: wuhu. running debuild again and again made it working. That's the magic of opensource =)
<sebner> RoAkSoAx: I was in the same situation. I asked \sh but can't remember the answer now
<sebner> RoAkSoAx: he introduced these things
<RoAkSoAx> sebner, so i guess i'll have to wait for him
<sebner> RoAkSoAx: I think so
<norsetto> RoAkSoAx: if you don't know why ask the uploader that made that change
<RoAkSoAx> norsetto, yep i'll have to wait for \sh to come online
<norsetto> RoAkSoAx: also, check in the upstream docs or sources if libz is needed
<norsetto> RoAkSoAx: you can also check the binaries with ldd to see if it is linked at runtime
<RoAkSoAx> norsetto, ok thanks =)
<RoAkSoAx> weird i can't find it with apt-cache search :S
<norsetto> RoAkSoAx: what?
<RoAkSoAx> athcool
<sebner> xD
<RoAkSoAx> i can see it in packages.ubuntu.com but can't install it cause it does not find it
<norsetto> RoAkSoAx: are you on amd64?
<RoAkSoAx> yes
<norsetto> RoAkSoAx: athcool is for i386 arch only
<RoAkSoAx> yeah lol... haven't realized that
<RoAkSoAx> norsetto, could you help me with other thing?? i was trying to merge alsa-tools, and crimsum told me to apply this before reporting the bug: http://hg.alsa-project.org/alsa-tools/raw-rev/9d1e48f8dd5d  ... but i've checked in the Hardy source and that change is already there... so... should i apply it?
<norsetto> RoAkSoAx: this could be the reason: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pciutils/+bug/87436
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 87436 in pciutils "pciutils-dev possibly somewhat broken in feisty?" [Undecided,New]
<psusi> say, I could have sworn you used to be able to mark bugs as depending on other ones in launchpad... has this feature been removed or can I just not find it?
<crimsun> RoAkSoAx: no, the change that I mentioned most definitely does not exist in the hardy source package.
<crimsun> RoAkSoAx: you should apply it for intrepid.
<RoAkSoAx> crimsun, ok, i've checked in the source package used in hardy, that i downloaded from: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/hardy/+source/alsa-tools/1.0.15-2ubuntu4 and checked the same file for those lines... so that's i thought that change was already...
<RoAkSoAx> and those lines are:  channel_map = meter_map_ds;
<RoAkSoAx>  dest_map = dest_map_ds;
<RoAkSoAx> crimsun, so anyways, how do i apply it, do i just manually add those changes to the debdiff?
<crimsun> RoAkSoAx: no, please use the existing patch management system.
<crimsun> RoAkSoAx: are you familiar with quilt (and/or have you read pitti's overview of patch management systems)?
<crimsun> (I'm happy to walk you through this particular merge.)
<RoAkSoAx> crimsun, nope (i'm just learning...)
<sebner> RoAkSoAx: that quilt. I thinkt it's very easy and funny =)
<RoAkSoAx> link me =)
<sebner> RoAkSoAx: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/PatchSystems?action=show&redirect=MOTU%2FHowToPatch
<RoAkSoAx> found it too xD
<crimsun> RoAkSoAx: let me know if you'd like me to point out anything.
<emgent> heya crimsun :)
<crimsun> heya emgent :)
<sebner> LaserJock: around?
<LaserJock> yeah, what's up?
<sebner> LaserJock: for edenmath.app I have to mail gnustep maintainers right, and not Debian QA team. right?
<LaserJock> yeah, I'd ask the gnustep maintainers
<sebner> LaserJock: k. thx. on the way =)
<LaserJock> just to see if anybody is interested
<LaserJock> they may just ignore it
<sebner> LaserJock: We'll see.
<pochu> Jazzva: great, thank you :)
<LaserJock> sebner: after I made a big deal of "we should try to get the diff to Debian first before merging" all the packages I looked at were basically dead upstream
<LaserJock> so we'll probably have to keep the diff anyway :-)
<sebner> LaserJock: -.- archive removals =)
<norsetto> LaserJock: do you feel particularly bored? Do you want to get a rush of excitement by looking at an sru request?
<Jazzva> pochu: No problem ;)
<LaserJock> norsetto: hehe, maybe. bug #?
<norsetto> LaserJock: bug 228044, be careful, you could get a kick
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 228044 in mplayerplug-in "In Hardy, mozilla-mplayer depends on firefox-3.0 - does not accept firefox-2" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/228044
<sebner> LaserJock: btw. at least gnubiff is still a merge ;)
 * LaserJock runs
<sebner> LaserJock: go go go. upload =)
<norsetto> LaserJock: btw, take care of my baby, now its in your hands (gelemental)
<geser> sebner: I'm just testbuilding gnubiff and will upload it in a minute
<sebner> geser: ah cool. Haven't seen you as such a strong uploader in hardy :)
<LaserJock> norsetto: that SRU looks entirely sane to me
<LaserJock> norsetto: I saw svn commits with you listed as Uploader
<geser> sebner: http://ubuntu.joejaxx.org/ :)
<RoAkSoAx> crimsun, should i do something like: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/11184/ ???
<joejaxx> geser: that has not been updated in a while
<norsetto> LaserJock: oh well, we have no choice then
 * joejaxx goes to update
<crimsun> RoAkSoAx: yes.
<psusi> say, I could have sworn you used to be able to mark bugs as depending on other ones in launchpad... has this feature been removed or can I just not find it?
<sebner> geser: ok ok. ^^ but you haven't uploaded anything from be IIRC, or at least hardly anything :)
<RoAkSoAx> crimsun, ok, but when i enter the file the changes are already made...
<joejaxx> geser: i still need to open the stats for ibex
<joejaxx> when the repo opens
<geser> sebner: true, I didn't have much time since this semester started
<sebner> geser: ah. didn't know that you are a student :)
<LaserJock> norsetto: did you want me to reject that SRU? :-)
<norsetto> joejaxx: repo is open
<norsetto> LaserJock: well, I entertained the notion for a while, now I've got no excuse but to upload it
<crimsun> RoAkSoAx: they're not applied
<geser> sebner: gnubiff uploaded
<crimsun> RoAkSoAx: the change is subtle; don't be confused by the surrounding lines
<sebner> geser: cool thanks. but if I were you I wouldn't upload that much for me. Otherwise you'll become me upload victim number 1 ;-P
<RoAkSoAx> crimsun, ok that patch has to be applying in all "CASE 1", of every ELSE condition??
<crimsun> RoAkSoAx: I hope you're not attempting to do it by hand :)
<geser> sebner: it would only make my job as MC easier as I wouldn't need to review your debdiffs for your MOTU application anymore :)
<crimsun> RoAkSoAx: which commands have you executed so far?
<RoAkSoAx> crimsun, till quilt add hdspmixer/src/HDSPMixerCard.cxx
<crimsun> RoAkSoAx: ok, now you need to download the patch file.
<crimsun> RoAkSoAx: cd ..; wget http://hg.alsa-project.org/alsa-tools/raw-rev/9d1e48f8dd5d; cd -
<sebner> geser: hrhr. well my application is still not that near ;)
<LaserJock> norsetto: I think it's worthwhile. It's a pretty trivial change and I consider it a regression
<sebner> geser: first I want to become a universe-contributor ;)
<RoAkSoAx> crimsun, ok done...
<crimsun> RoAkSoAx: (I presume you're in the top-level of the extracted source packageD[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[D[D)
 * norsetto sighs
<LaserJock> norsetto: I've seen a lot of people going back to FF2 on Hardy so it'd be good if that worked
<crimsun> oh geez
<jdavies> cat!
<RoAkSoAx> crimsun, i'm here: xxx/alsa-tools-1.0.16-1ubuntu1$
<sebner> LaserJock: yah. I've also seen a lot of people returning :\
<crimsun> RoAkSoAx: good.
<RoAkSoAx> crimsun, ok i downloaded the diff, now what?
<crimsun> RoAkSoAx: now, patch -p1 --dry-run <../9d1e48f8dd5d;echo $?
<RoAkSoAx> done
<crimsun> what was returned?
<RoAkSoAx> patching file hdspmixer/src/HDSPMixerCard.cxx
<RoAkSoAx> 0
<crimsun> good.
<RoAkSoAx> crimsun, now: quilt refresh changes.diff ?
<norsetto> sebner: do you realise we still have 587 merges to do? What have you been doing until now!?
<crimsun> no, patch -p1 <../9d1e48f8dd5d
<RoAkSoAx> patching file hdspmixer/src/HDSPMixerCard.cxx
<sebner> norsetto: la scuola e` molto importante :P
<crimsun> (--dry-run doesn't apply the actual diff)
<crimsun> now, quilt refresh
<crimsun> then, quilt pop -a
<norsetto> sebner: keine gegenstende aus der fenster werfen
<crimsun> then adjust the conflicts that MoM reported.
<sebner> norsetto: perche`?
<crimsun> RoAkSoAx: BTW, I recommend you use a patch name more reflective of its intent than "changes.diff"
<geser> norsetto: do you think 587 merges are enough to prove that sebner is ready for MOTU? :)
<norsetto> sebner: because is dangerous ...
<crimsun> RoAkSoAx: e.g., fix_channel_map_adat_speed_1.patch
<norsetto> geser: perhaps, but surely are enough to kill one or two sponsors in the process
<crimsun> RoAkSoAx: (make sure the precise name is reflected in debian/patches/series, of course)
<RoAkSoAx> crimsun, ok the ouput of quilt pop -a http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/11186/
<RoAkSoAx> and the changes.diff was just for learning purposes
<RoAkSoAx> xD
<sebner> geser: rofl
<crimsun> RoAkSoAx: right, that's good.  except I'd change muhaha.diff.  :)
<sebner> norsetto: true but what has that todo with merges? ^^
<norsetto> patch muhaha.diff !? The evil laugh hits again ....
<RoAkSoAx> crimsun, ok let me do it again with the correct file names :D
<norsetto> sebner: its an ironic contemplation on the nature of multilinguistic relationships
<sebner> norsetto: I suck at such things )
<nxvl> RoAkSoAx: fighting with patch systems?
<Amaranth> I thought you were supposed to get MOTU when your sponsors got tired of uploading your stuff :P
<sebner> geser: btw. how was the MC today ;)
<norsetto> sebner: its ok, it will come with age
<ethana2> I'm requesting a backport of intrepid pavucontrol
<ethana2> it uses decibels instead of percentages
<ethana2> and I absolutely must have that
<crimsun> dude, I totally mentioned the wiki.
<Amaranth> ethana2: this is not the place to do such a thing
<ethana2> oh
<ethana2> I misunderstood, sorry
<norsetto> ethana2: bribes are accepted
<crimsun> not "come into -motu and announce 'blz backport kthx'"
<sebner> norsetto: kk. btw, instead of uploading my merges (have you reviewed even one? ^^) you can help me learn italian :P
<Amaranth> You know, I've never done a merge
<RoAkSoAx> nxvl, i would say.. learning quilt :D... and nice PDF you got on that :D
<ethana2> norsetto: we call them 'bounties'
<norsetto> sebner: just the thought its enough to sends shivers down my spine
<norsetto> ethana2: hard cash, no US$ not-worth-the-paper-is-printed-on pls.
<jdong> LaserJock: you might wanna check with the bzr folk about the diff-on-no-changes behavior... I can't recall exactly but I believe I was told that the other VCSes used some corner-cutting method of assuming if a file had been modified or not?
<sebner> norsetto: Why I'm having a feeling that tells me that you would need mental health care after working with me? ^^
<RoAkSoAx> crimsun, ok i did all of this: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/11188/ is it correct?
<Amaranth> norsetto: Hey, the metal of our pennies is worth more than a penny
<crimsun> RoAkSoAx: that is one correct method, yes.
<Amaranth> jdong: perhaps the mtime of the directory?
<nxvl> RoAkSoAx: quilt is kewl
 * nxvl loves quilt
<LaserJock> jdong: yeah, that's right
<jdong> Amaranth: I believe it had to do with mtimes
<LaserJock> jdong: but apparently all the other VCSs I've seen cut the same corners ;-)
<Amaranth> bzr actually diffs everything, everything else checks mtimes
<crimsun> bzr does it correctly here, IMO
<jdong> Amaranth: and the fact the penny costs more to manufacture than represent is not that big of a deal....
<RoAkSoAx> crimsun, ok, so my changelog will be like this: http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/11189/ is it correct?
<jdong> Amaranth: pennies are (gasp) reusable for many transactions
<Amaranth> jdong: Not more to manufacture, the metal itself is worth more than a penny
<RoAkSoAx> nxvl, haha but nice PDF you've got on packaging101 :D
<Amaranth> jdong: Apparently we're going to use steel pennies again due to this
<jdong> Amaranth: we need all digital currency.
<jdong> :D
<LaserJock> ewww
<Amaranth> no, evil
<crimsun> RoAkSoAx: that is a bit more verbose than necessary but not incorrect.
 * jdong proposes the RFID dollar
<LaserJock> hah
<nxvl> RoAkSoAx: which one?
<Amaranth> digital currency makes it easy to spend more than you want and easy for others to track your spending
<jdong> and the $20+ bills can have GPS and webcams built in.
<jdong> you know. to catch the terrorists.
<nxvl> RoAkSoAx: the presentation?
<Amaranth> Oh, right.
<Amaranth> Let's do that then.
<norsetto> Amaranth: do you actually use pennies? I mean, when you pay $0.99 for something they give you a penny back? Seriously!?
<RoAkSoAx> nxvl, this one: www.debianperu.org/files/dd2k7/presentaciones/Nicolas%20ValcÃ¡rcel,%20Packaging%20101.pdf
<jdong> norsetto: yes
<LaserJock> norsetto: yes
<crimsun> pennies are very useful.
<norsetto> norsetto: yes
<jdong> norsetto: if you pay cash they must give you exact change back.
<RoAkSoAx> crimsun, ok should i strip it out by removing the names of the one who made the changes???
<jdong> norsetto: and you cannot buy a $1.01 item with $1 either
<Amaranth> norsetto: Yep
<crimsun> RoAkSoAx: that's one acceptable approach.
<Amaranth> norsetto: I know in Europe they like to steal your pennies but not here
<RoAkSoAx> crimsun, anything else?
<Amaranth> s/pennies/one euro cents/
<nxvl> RoAkSoAx: oh! the presentation, yes, i summarize PackagingGuide/PatchSystems in there
<nxvl> and add some thing myself
<crimsun> we declare pennies tools of terrorists.
<jdong> too bad you can't melt them for copper :)
<crimsun> RoAkSoAx: well, yes.  build it, install it, test it.
<jdong> what 2% copper they still contain.
<Amaranth> That's a felony
<Amaranth> iirc the metal in a penny is worth $0.03
<RoAkSoAx> crimsun, thank you very much for you help, i really appreciate it!! :D
<crimsun> RoAkSoAx: yw
<jdong> Amaranth: last I heard was 1.2 cents
<psusi> yea, they are mostly zinc... just copper plated
<RoAkSoAx> nxvl, link me to all your presentations
<norsetto> this reminds me when I called europe from the states from a phone boot
<Amaranth> jdong: I guess I got my info from someone bad at rounding
<nxvl> RoAkSoAx: there are on nvalcarcel.aureal.com.pe/stuff
<jdong> Amaranth: but again, there's nothing silly about the fact that the penny costs more than it's worth.
<nxvl> RoAkSoAx: but i don't remember which ones i have in there
<nxvl> :D
<psusi> it's fun to file off the edge a bit and drop one in a glass of lye and watch the zinc insides disolve and hollow out
<jdong> Amaranth: because each penny is likely to be used many many times before it is discarded
<Amaranth> jdong: That bit of economics still does my head in
<psusi> it is silly because people will stop using them for pennies and melt them down for the metal ;)
<LaserJock> we were just talking about the penny situation in my group meeting this morning
<LaserJock> we have some copper bars in the lab
<LaserJock> and we're not sure what to do with them, but they're pretty valuable now so we're keeping them
<RoAkSoAx> nxvl, haha ok i'll download em
<psusi> also it costs the gov't millions to produce them
<Amaranth> jdong: The bit where spending $10 contributes $50 to the economy or some such thing
<RoAkSoAx> nxvl, it says Not Found
 * jdong still thinks digital money will be the cheapest :)
<jdong> Windows LiveMoney
<jdong> (tm)
<crimsun> I wonder if anyone is returning his incentive from the treasury.
<Amaranth> eh?
<nxvl> RoAkSoAx: it isn't browsable
<crimsun> the $600 or whatever.
<Amaranth> returning it?
<jdong> it's a part of $5000 going into a 36-month CD for me.
<crimsun> yes, returning it
<nxvl> RoAkSoAx: but it's called packaging101.pdf IIRC
<RoAkSoAx> crimsun, and how to test it?? install a VM with Intrepid, enable sound and test it??
<LaserJock> I'm gonna pay bills with it
<Amaranth> I don't get one, I owed money for taxes
<emgent> heya nxvl :)
<jdong> it was either a CD or a laser jammer.
<crimsun> RoAkSoAx: if you have hardware that uses it, sure
<jdong> and at the last moment I decided to do the sensible thing
<Amaranth> jdong: I would have gotten the laser jammer
<jdong> or the Asian thing as people told me.
<RoAkSoAx> nxvl, merging101.pdf too?
<crimsun> I refuse to cash the check.
<RoAkSoAx> crimsun, other ways to test it?
<jdong> Amaranth: yeah but I still have $2500 liquid cash + $100/wk. The jammer can STILL work out.
<jdong> Amaranth: considering that there's a new shiny car waiting when I get home....
<norsetto> is ff3 really that bad?
<jdong> Amaranth: and it just so needs "front" and "rear" "parking sensors"
<Amaranth> ff3 got me to stop using epiphany
<crimsun> norsetto: compared with what?  IE 3?
<Amaranth> asac was thankful
<norsetto> crimsun: well, ff2 I would say
<jdong> norsetto: in general I've found it to be good except (1) that nasty fixed sqlite bug (2) the new instability of Flash for some reason
<jdong> #2 is not really Mozilla's fault though
<Amaranth> jdong: uninstall libflashsupport
<jdong> Amaranth: I did.
<Amaranth> or figure out how to setup nspluginwrapper
<jdong> Amaranth: now it only crashes 5% of the time rather than 95%
<jdong> Amaranth: and yeah I'm setting up nspluginwrapper now.
<Amaranth> I installed swfdec
<crimsun> you can also use UWashington's flashproxy.
<Amaranth> Screw it, I only watch youtube and huffington post videos anyway
<crimsun> they could use some testing; I've already sent them some bug fixes.
<LaserJock> I've never had FF3 crash
<psusi> why would you not cache your return check?
<nxvl> RoAkSoAx: yes, maybe
<crimsun> psusi: because it's worthless to cash it.
<jdong> Amaranth: the other day I was watching 150 or so laser jammer test videos (cough)... I had concurrent firefox profiles running to cycle between crashed ones.
<psusi> crimsun: mine was worth $600
<crimsun> psusi: sure.  I'm a bit more concerned about its long term effect.
<Amaranth> psusi: Thank the Chinese government for the money :)
<psusi> Amaranth: indeed
 * RoAkSoAx is going to wath iron man xD
<jdong> Amaranth: we've outsourced thanking China to India.
<psusi> saw that last night... was great
<crimsun> besides, the 600$ isn't really "mine"; it just goes back to my employer.
<psusi> it's yours if you cash the checque
<crimsun> no, I fall under something called "invasive monitoring."  Nothing I own is really mine.
 * psusi wonders what drugs were in that cool aid
<crimsun> some people employed by gigantenormous banks experience it, too
<LaserJock> how nice :/
<Amaranth> that's...weird
<crimsun> RoAkSoAx: you might want to use bzr for that source packaging, BTW
<RoAkSoAx> crimsun, how come?
<crimsun> RoAkSoAx: makes managing source packages more efficient in some workloas
<crimsun> workloads*
 * norsetto wonders how he could do without regexes until now
<RoAkSoAx> crimsun, so i should use bzr to work with source packagin with alsa-tools or while learning packaging?
<crimsun> RoAkSoAx: while learning packaging is a good tie-in
<RoAkSoAx> crimsun, ok cool i'll read more about it... thanks fro the advice
<RoAkSoAx> crimsun, any link that you'll recommed me to read about that?
<crimsun> RoAkSoAx: james_w did a session IIRC
<crimsun> seems https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/openweekhardy/Bazaar
<RoAkSoAx> ok thanks =)
<james_w> RoAkSoAx: I'd be happy to help you with any problems that you may encounter.
<RoAkSoAx> james_w, i appreciate that =), i'll read your session of the OpenWeek and after that i'll loading you up with question :P
<james_w> I look forward to it :-)
<LaserJock> I need to get my butt in gear and start using VCS for packaging
<LaserJock> I just haven't gotten the hang of it
<crimsun> don't feel too bad; I just today uploaded my first set with XS-Debian-Vcs-*
<LaserJock> heh
<norsetto> anyone knows what will happen to puc?
<LaserJock> I guess mostly my problem is that I rarely work on the same package
<LaserJock> so it's rather pointless to use a VCS if you're not really going to use it
<LaserJock> james_w: does bzr build-deb work with svn repos?
<LaserJock> if you're using bzr-svn
<james_w> LaserJock: yes, it should.
<nxvl> you can package using bzr?
 * nxvl looks
<james_w> jelmer has sent me patch that makes it detect mergeWithUpstream property and switch modes based on that, but I haven't applied it yet.
<james_w> hi nxvl
<nxvl> hi!
<LaserJock> james_w: I mean packages that are maintained in svn
<LaserJock> not svn upstreams
<james_w> LaserJock: yes, should work.
<james_w> if it doesn't work then let me know, there may need to be some more trickery employed to make it seamless.
<LaserJock> also, what you call merge mode would be what I would think of as Normal mode
<LaserJock> do you have any idea on just how many people use one over the other?
<james_w> no, I don't.
<james_w> I think full source is the best way to go. I used to think otherwise.
<LaserJock> most packaging repos I've seen just do debian/
<LaserJock> other than TeX, and their svn repo is 20GB and takes hours to check out :-)
<sebner> LaserJock: you mentioned me at the MOTU-Meeting ;) besides that I also want to join the LaserJock fan club :P
<LaserJock> pfft
<LaserJock> I don't need a fan club
<LaserJock> maybe a club to the head ;-)
<sebner> ^^
<sebner> gn8 fols :)
 * cheatr clubs LaserJock on the head
<RoAkSoAx> i want pizza!!
<cheatr> RoAkSoAx: http://lifehacker.com/388708/track-your-dominos-pizza-order-from-a-terminal
<RoAkSoAx> haha lol
<Jazzva> pochu: uploading debdiffs (between debian and ubuntu new, and ubuntu old and ubuntu new, with and without po changes (Someone once told me I should upload only without po files, but I wasn't really sure)). Anyway, first one is uploaded... it's gonna take another few minutes for the rest, since debdiffs are a bit larger.
<Jazzva> That 99_autoconf patch has 1.5MB...
<LaserJock> sounds about right
<Jazzva> pochu: I'll be around for two more hours for sure, in case you have any questions/suggestions about changes :)
<LaserJock> last autoconf patch I read was 1.49MB
<Jazzva> LaserJock: That's huge... oh, well.
<LaserJock> that's auto*
<Jazzva> and that's a plus :)
<Jazzva> pochu: Oh, bug 228827
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 228827 in liferea "Please merge liferea-1.4.15-1 from Debian unstable" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/228827
#ubuntu-motu 2008-05-10
<RoAkSoAx> nixternal, around?
<pochu> Jazzva: regarding autoreconf patches: yes, they tend to be huge, but you can make them smaller by running the same autoconf/automake/intltoolize... versions as upstream did
<pochu> Jazzva: but that's ok, thanks for the debdiff!
<Jazzva> pochu: No problem... I noticed I missed one change - to add to lintian-overrides that it depends on quilt 0.40-1, lintian produces one warning for depending on -1.
<Jazzva> pochu: So, I'll just add that and upload new patches... to reduce the upload, do you need diffs with or without .po files :)?
<pochu> Jazzva: can't you depend on 0.40?
<pochu> without the -1
<pochu> Jazzva: and regarding the po changes from MoM... always remove them
<Jazzva> pochu: It's introduced in debian, I know I saw a log why it has to depend on -1
<pochu> Jazzva: ok, live it anyway, that's just a warning and we don't want to add more useless diff
<Jazzva> pochu: Ok...
<Jazzva> pochu: Tracker merge seems to be a lot easier ... just to remove some Debian deps we don't use (qdbm), and to check if we still need patches from debian/patches...
<pochu> yup
<pochu> Jazzva: you will likely need all of them, as Debian has 0.6.6 too
<Jazzva> pochu: Yep... Just checked. I'll do a testbuild and upload the diffs...
<pochu> Jazzva: wait, I'm reviewing it
<pochu> Jazzva: looks fine, just make the changelog entry a bit more verbose (mention what files you have removed, that we don't build a liferea-webkit package...)
<pochu> Jazzva: feel free to copy&paste from older changelog entries for the remaining changes if you want ;)
<pochu> Jazzva: but other than that the merge looks perfect, I'd sponsor it if I could :-)
<Jazzva> pochu: Thanks :)... I'll prepare a new patch and subscribe sponsors.
<Jazzva> pochu: Uploading new debdiffs. I'll be off when it finishes, too tired.
<LaserJock> anybody familiar with python conditionals about?
<persia> LaserJock: I'm not familar, but suspect that if you described your test problem, one of you, I, or some lurker might have the answer :)
<LaserJock> sure
<LaserJock> I'm wanting to do a pretty extended if statement
<LaserJock> basically something like:
<LaserJock> if x == y && z == (q|r|s)
<x1250> does that even work?
<persia> OK.  I think that's if(x==y){if(z=(q|r|s){...
<LaserJock> x1250: no, that's why I'm asking
<LaserJock> :-)
<LaserJock> ok, so x == y and z = ( q or r or s ) it seems to be ok with
<persia> Ah.  Maybe you wanted || instead of | ?
<Amaranth> if x == y and z in (q, r, s)
<x1250> LaserJock: try #python, they answer fast ;-)
<LaserJock> no, it doesn't like || or &&
 * persia retreats from python again, wishing it were slightly less prevalent
<LaserJock> persia: why?
<LaserJock> Amaranth: actually, I want to do x == y and z != (q or r or s)
<x1250> then use -> not in
<LaserJock> Amaranth:  so you if x==y and z notin (q,r,s) work?
<persia> LaserJock: The syntax is un-C like.  Also, whitespace treatment may require bit-analysis, rather than visual analysis.
<LaserJock> persia: C-like syntax is a good thing?
<Amaranth> LaserJock: if x == y and not z in (q, r, s)
<Amaranth> i think that'll work
<x1250> LaserJock: (q or r or s) will return true if anyone of them is true, or whatever value != false and != 0 any of the members would have
<x1250> is that what you want?
<persia> LaserJock: I think so, but I've been reading C since around the first flight of the Space Shuttle Discovery
<LaserJock> x1250: yeah
<LaserJock> I want it to work if x == y and z != any of q,r,s
<x1250> ("text" or false or true") will be == "text"
<x1250> (0 or false or True) will be == True
<LaserJock> these conditionals are one thing I just can't get the hang of in Python
<x1250> the only case the result is false is when every member is false
<LaserJock> sweet, Amaranth's recipe worked
<Amaranth> :)
<LaserJock> persia: I'm getting somewhere http://laserjock.us/files/ubuntu/buglist.html
<persia> LaserJock: That's looking great!  Is it that just approved tasks, or nominations as well?  Also, is it possible to pull the descriptions?
<LaserJock> persia: I can pull pretty much anything now that I've hooked into python-launchpad-bugs
<LaserJock> persia: those are bugs that are subscribed to by MOTU SRU
<LaserJock> I'm working now on how to get a list of tasks that haven't been targeted yet
<persia> Interesting.  That list would be the list of things that need review/action by the approval team, and there'd be another list of things that need review / approval by the wider stable developers team?
<LaserJock> persia: items that are "Fix Commited" have been accepted into  -proposed and need testing
<LaserJock> items that are "Confirmed" are ack'd by the SRU team
<LaserJock> maybe I should seperate out those lists
<persia> Might be nice to have a few lists: things that need testing, things that need review/approval of the proposed solution, and things that need someone to either prepare a proposed solution, or determine that it doesn't qualify for SRU.
<LaserJock> yeah
<LaserJock> actually, those are better categorizations than release
<LaserJock> I'll put the release as a column
<persia> Just out of curiosity, what is the workflow to handle approvals?  To me there seem to be two approval stages: firstly whether a given issue meets the criteria for SRU, and secondly whether a given solution is acceptable for upload, (regression analysis, etc.).  Are both stages handled by the SRU team?
<jdong> *cry* car shopping sucks....
<persia> The reason I ask is that I wonder if it is possible to generate a list of pending updates that would benefit from someone preparing a patch.
<LaserJock> persia: well, first SRU approves the "worthyness" of it and makes sure things are following policy, then it gets uploaded to -proposed (verification-needed tag is added)
<LaserJock> then once it's been tested it gets a verification-done tag and gets moved to -updates
<persia> Ah, so currently the SRU team determines both whether the bug is suitable for SRU and whether the patch is good at the same time?
<LaserJock> basically
<LaserJock> we don't do testing per se
<LaserJock> but make sure things are being done sanely
<persia> Oh, sure, I wouldn't expect testing.
<LaserJock> we might say "that's too invasive", etc.
<LaserJock> but we expect the contributors and their sponsors to test before upload
<persia> So the contributors end up responsible for determining what gets development attention for SRUs?  I'm just thinking it might be awkward for someone to determine that something should be updated, do all the work, and only at the end be advised that they ought have selected a different bug.
<LaserJock> well, we like people sub'ing SRU if they thing something should be an SRU
<LaserJock> and work with us early on
<persia> OK.  So there are two cycles: first an approval for the class of bug, and then for the proposed patch?
<LaserJock> sometimes
<LaserJock> depends on if the patch is already there
<LaserJock> but informally yes
<persia> Let's assume it's not.  If there is a patch, it falls back to the case where someone didn't get pre-approval, and may be advised they've wasted their time.
<LaserJock> I'll say "looks good, work up the SRU", then once it's ready actually ack it
<LaserJock> I think mostly we get to bugs and comment before people get all that far
<LaserJock> I can't think of any cases where somebody got all the way to having a ready debdiff and I rejected it
<persia> Hmm.  Well then, if it's not broke, no point fixing it :)  I think it still might be nice to have a supplementary list of all tasks nominated or approved for stable releases, but maybe only as a source for contributors to review when selecting candidates to bring to the SRU team.
<LaserJock> hmm, yeah. I agree
<persia> Might get a little confused with security vs. SRU, but I'd think that would be obvious from the bug description, etc.
<LaserJock> perhaps yeah
<Amaranth> LaserJock: so was your question so you could do something like   not status in ("Incomplete", "Invalid", "Won't Fix") ?
<LaserJock> I wouldn't mind having to go through some false positives
<LaserJock> Amaranth: Invalid, Won't Fix, and Fix Released
<Amaranth> ah
<Amaranth> close enough :)
<LucidFox> Does the ALSA device "default" in Hardy correspond to PulseAudio by default?
<TheMuso> LucidFox: No.
<LucidFox> Is "pulse" present by default, then?
<TheMuso> LucidFox: If you install Ubuntu/GNOME, yes.
<TheMuso> LucidFox: But it can be disabled.
<LucidFox> ah
<TheMuso> LucidFox: However when pulse is playing audio, it accesses the audio hardware directly, so alsa apps won't work while pulse plays audio.
<LucidFox> yes, I know that
<LaserJock> persia: ok, so maybe I'll do two pages. One for potential SRUs and one for the tasks we're actively tracking
<LucidFox> I was patching an app that used "plughw:0,0" as the default audio device, and wondered whether to set the default to "default" or "pulse"
<persia> LaserJock: That seems sensible to me.  Perhaps for the former, it might make sense to coordinate with SWAT as a common list towards which to point people who want to work on the stable environments.
<LaserJock> persia: agreed
<TheMuso> LucidFox: default.
<geser> good morning
<Iulian> G'morning
<LucidFox> If I'm going to upload a NEW package from debian-multimedia.org that requires Ubuntu changes, do I need to submit it to REVU?
<LucidFox> I can't find mpeg4ip on REVU, for one...
<wgrant> LucidFox: Quite old == latest release? Tracking SVN is foolish.
<wgrant> We have 1.0rc2 in Hardy, IIRC.
<LucidFox> yes
<wgrant> They say 1.0rc1 is old.
<LucidFox> Well, smplayer uses some features that aren't even in rc2 - I'll ask upstream which exactly
<wgrant> If mplayer actually made any vaguely useful releases..
<LucidFox> also, how about shipping mplayer in Ubuntu with the compiz xv patch?
<LucidFox> the one that enables use of the compiz video output plugin
<wgrant> LucidFox: Wasn't that patch rejected violently by upstream?
<wgrant> Or is there another one which is blessed?
<LucidFox> hmm, this was proposed as bug #121476
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 121476 in mplayer "Use Compiz' "video" plugin when available" [Wishlist,Won't fix] https://launchpad.net/bugs/121476
<LucidFox> there was a new version of the patch posted after it was closed as Won't Fix, though
<wgrant> Doesn't Xv work in Compiz on most cards these days?
<wgrant> Even textured video should work on Intel soon, at list.
<wgrant> *at least
<LucidFox> hmm
<LucidFox> "There is an unofficial patch for mplayer/compiz (it'll never be official, it's more like a temporary and dirty hack)"
<LucidFox> looks like that answers it
<wgrant> Yes.
<Laney> Is there a fix/workaround for the pbuilder libc6 issue yet?
<RAOF> LucidFox: The compiz 'video' plugin is in some sort of perpetual limbo.  Davidr consistently threatens to do it again, correctly.  So nothing supports it, because it's kinda temporary.
<RAOF> Also, debhelper 7 is whack.
<persia> RAOF: Please define "whack"
<RAOF> Two line debian/rules kinda whack.
<RAOF> Like CDBS, but it seems that doing advanced stuff doesn't require sacrifices to the four dark gods of chaos.
<persia> Simple.  Concise.  Readable.  Says "Nothing to see here.  Please move on." to people, and they look at the useful files.  Fewer irregular debian/rules hacks.
<RAOF> Yeah.  Whack is not necessarily indicative of disapproval.
<RAOF> I'm just packaging Do for debian, and playing with dh and cli-common-dev 0.5.7.
 * Hobbsee waves
<geser> Hi Hobbsee
<bardyr> what benefits does packaging programs as perl5.8, perl5.10 and making other packages depend on them instead of a meta package for perl and depends on the perl5.8 like the linux-image packages
<mok0> bardyr: I am not a perl programmer, but I assume that new features were introduced in 5.10
<mok0> another package making use of those features needs to depend on 5.10
<bardyr> mok0, but then special packages can depend on certain version of perl
<mok0> bardyr: yes
<bardyr> mok0, im on intrepid and trying to install some perl depended programs but they all depend on 5.8 but its gone
<bardyr> now i need to manually change dependencies to 5.10 :/
<Hobbsee> which means they need to be updated, which may well require code changes
<Hobbsee> or removed.
<mok0> bardyr: or just >= 5.8
<bardyr> mok0, it has that, but it points to perl5.8 and it has been replaced with perl5.10
<mok0> bardyr: there may be a virtual package perl, that depends on the "current" perl version for any given distribution
<pochu> Do FTBFS bugs have a whitelist from motu-sru?
<sistpoty> hi folks
<geser> Hi sistpoty
<sistpoty> hi geser
 * sistpoty merges ghc6... just trying to rebuild itself with the merged version
<LucidFox> Anyone want any REVU packages reviewed?
<slicer> Hm. Is there a way to get PPA to build the same source package for both hardy and gutsy?
<rexbron> slicer: Look at the copy package option
<slicer> rexbron: Ah, I must be blind :) Thank you.
<rexbron> slicer: np
<sebner> is there a difference between debhelper (>> 5) and debhelper (>> 5.0.0) ?
<rexbron> sebner: I would guess that >>5.0.0 would be satisfied by 5.0.1 while >>5 would not
<Hobbsee> sarah@saturn:~% dpkg --compare-versions 5 lt 5.0.0 && echo true         11:09PM
<Hobbsee> true
<Hobbsee> interesting
<Hobbsee> sarah@saturn:~% dpkg --compare-versions 5 lt 5.0.1 && echo true         11:09PM
<Hobbsee> true
<Hobbsee> rexbron: both should be satisfied.
<Hobbsee> sebner: i don't really think so - there's no number in between 5 and 5.0.0 except for 5.0
<Hobbsee> which all equates to the same thing, in real version #'s, anyway
<sebner> Hobbsee: cool. thanks :)
<Mez> wow. the debian NM process is complex
<bddebian> Heya gang
<sistpoty> hi bddebian
<emgent> heya :D
<bddebian> Hi sistpoty, emgent
<LucidFox> Hmm
<LucidFox> In the orig.tar.gz for cairo-dock on REVU, various automake files in the root are symlinks to files in /usr/share/automake-1.10
<LucidFox> is this allowed?
<sistpoty> LucidFox: hm... looks like a mistake from upstream to me, though (if it b-d on automake 1.10 it imho is ok *packaging* wise)
<sistpoty> LucidFox: if it's gpl (or lgpl) however, the license file must not be a symlink though
<LucidFox> it isn't - only config.guess, depcomp, install-sh, all that stuff
<sistpoty> ok... packaging wise I guess it's ok, but the packager should really ask upstream to fix that (as it defeats the purpose of autoconf/automake actually)
<sistpoty> anyone know if intrepid is currently safe? or are there any big issues?
<sistpoty> (as I'm pondering dist-upgrading)
<wgrant> sistpoty: libxfonts1 is broken.
<wgrant> But downgrading that gets things working again, I believe.
<geser> sistpoty: I've only a intrepid chroot for working on packages and a intrepid pbuilder. Both doesn't seem to be broken right now.
<sistpoty> hm... apt tries to remove quite a bunch of important packages from me... (e.g. dia, exim4-daemon-heavy, svn-buildpackage)...
<sistpoty> and kvirc! *g*
<sistpoty> oh... apt changes the behaviour when puring old packages... strange
<sistpoty> purging even
<geser> my intrepid chroot is only minimal (enough to work on packages). I'll upgrade my main system to intrepid around the first or second alpha.
<geser> what did change during purging=
<geser> ?
<sistpoty> geser: I'm entirely unsure actuallly... I've thought the packages I purged were entirely unrelated
<sistpoty> geser: it changed from removing many packages to hold back a bunch of others
<sistpoty> however I don't see a pattern yet for apt doing so
<sistpoty> and now it upgraded some packages while purging only other ones... *strange*
<geser> may it be related to recommends?
<sistpoty> do we have recommends by default now?
<sistpoty> hm... there's at least nothing in apt-cache -i unmet for e.g. kvirc or exim *shrug*
<geser> sistpoty: "* enable installation of recommends by default" [from the changelog entry for apt (0.7.14ubuntu1)]
<sebner> sistpoty: don't hestiate to upgrade. it's never false to get rid of this kde stuff ^^ ;P
<sistpoty> geser: ah, thanks
<sistpoty> sebner: :P
<geser> sebner: luckily kernel-image got renamed to linux-image so you can do now: "apt-get --purge remove k*" :)
<sebner> geser: hrhr :)
 * sistpoty is bold and dist-upgrades *g*
<sistpoty> bug #228997 reported
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 228997 in apt "[intrepid] apt-get happily removes packages" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/228997
<sebner> sistpoty: nice comments xD
<sistpoty> hm... I'm still puzzled. maybe the difference is that apt-get install will do an apt-get upgrade (vs. apt-get dist-upgrade) under the hood?
<geser> as sistpoty isn't swearing, either the upgrade went fine, or is still in progress or sistpoty is fighting to bring his box back to life :)
 * sistpoty is still upgrading (replacing packages right now)
<penper> hi! I have a python app that depends on python-pygame. My app just contains python files with nothing to compile. Can anyone point me to the easiest way to make a .deb with my python files and the pygame dependency? Thanks :)
<pochu> penper: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Python
<pochu> penper: that should guide you into making a deb package for a Python application
<penper> pochu: perfect! Thanks
<sebner> pochu: wow. really great work by Michael Gliwinski for putting your session on the wiki page.
<pochu> yeah he did a nice work
<LucidFox> Holy...!
<LucidFox> dh_make was updated just yesterday!
<sebner> LucidFox: that means?
<LucidFox> well... it's been long time since the last update
<sebner> ah. k
<RainCT_> lol
<LucidFox> It's somewhat ironic that dh_make only updated to debhelper 6 after debhelper 7 was released
 * sistpoty is off again... cya
<stgraber> btw, if some of you have some spare time can they have a look at : http://revu.tauware.de/details.py?package=emu8051
<stgraber> Pierre Ferrari is one of my teachers, trying to learn packaging. It looks good to me but as I only do some packaging updates nowadays I probably missed a lot of things :)
<geser> stgraber: I've only looked at the diff.gz yet, and at first I only see a very minor issue: move the Homepage field to the source stanza in debian/control
<geser> stgraber: and the link to the GPL in debian/copyright should point to GPL-2 as GPL is a symlink to GPL-3
<stgraber> geser: ah, right code is not GPL2 and higher. Thanks
<LucidFox> stgraber, geser> I also have doubts about Section: x11
<LucidFox> to be fair, the Debian section conventions are far from clear
<geser> LucidFox: as I can't find a better section and it has a gui, it could stay in x11
<LucidFox> makes sense to me
<LucidFox> Holy cow... someone submitted a 9.1 MB debdiff for a new upstream release, including upstream changes
<LucidFox> uncompressed to boot
<LucidFox> actually... two people did it
<LucidFox> sebner, congratulations!
<sebner> LucidFox: ah.. thanks ^^
<geser> sebner: congrats
<sebner> geser: thanks. :) ehm yes, you made it possible ^^
<LucidFox> I feel a little lost here, to be frank
<LucidFox> universe-contributors is a recently created team, how is it different from MOTU?
<sebner> LucidFox: I have no upload right ;)
<geser> LucidFox: universe-contributors is like ubuntu-members but you don't have to go the CC but to the MC
<geser> LucidFox: it grants ubuntu membership and is a step towards MOTU
 * persia notes that it's possible to be MOTU without being a universe-contributor, but most people will likely reach the threshold for universe-contributor before reaching the threshold for MOTU (lower technical requirements, same community requirements)
<LucidFox> ah
<LucidFox> oh, hello blueyed_
<no0tic> I reported a bug on kid3 debian package to add dh_icons on debian/rules and the mantainer forcibly merged this bug to an unsolved previous one (156 days old). Is this a sign she won't fix it again? Can we proceed with the merge?
<no0tic> http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=480246
<ubottu> no0tic: Error: Could not parse data returned by Debian: timed out
<no0tic> merged to http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=454526
<ubottu> no0tic: Error: Could not parse data returned by Debian: timed out
<coppro> there's a typo on a REVU page
<coppro> "Please consider  submitting your package to Debian as well. The Utnubu team would be more than happy to help you to get started. "
<coppro> or is that intentional?
<jdavies> coppro: Utnubu is a team
<coppro> ok
<jdavies> coppro: it's focused on getting Ubuntu packages into Debian
<LucidFox> coppro> A largely defunct one, really
<pochu> sebner: congrats :)
<LucidFox> If you can't find a sponsor otherwise, I suggest pitching packages to the Debian team that's involved in similar packages
<sebner> pochu: also thanks to you :)
<jdavies> sebner: congrats!
 * RoAkSoAx hi all
<sebner> jdavies: thanks ^^
<RoAkSoAx> sebner, congrats too (what for? hehexD :P)
<sebner> RoAkSoAx: xD. You remind me of me when I started contributing ^^
<RoAkSoAx> sebner, looool
<warp10> hey sebner, congrats! ;)
<sebner> warp10: thanks. But I'm now contributing member and not president of the USA ^
<slytherin> geser: Do you have time to take a look at merge for lucene2?
<LucidFox> Where can I find debhelper 7 documentation? Other than "man dh" :)
<warp10> sebner: How knows, maybe a day you will be the first MOTU-president...! :P
<sebner> warp10: hrhr
<LucidFox> also... why do I see so many debdiffs uploaded as text/html? (including yours, slytherin)
<slytherin> LucidFox: I am filing a bug report about it right now. :-)
<LucidFox> heh
 * LucidFox can't wait for openjdk-6 to get into Debian finally
<geser> slytherin: sure
<slytherin> geser: As LucidFox has already mentioned, debdiff is shown in html format.:-( You will need to wget it.
<slytherin> LucidFox: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/launchpad/+bug/229040
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 229040 in launchpad "debdiff shown as html" [Undecided,New]
<geser> sebner: if you would told me two years ago, I will be a part of the MC I wouldn't believe you. Let's recheck in two years again.
<geser> slytherin: I've changed the filetype of your debdiff from text/html to text/plain so I can review it in firefox
<slytherin> geser: where did you find that option?
<slytherin> ahh, in edit attachment
<geser> exactly
<Laney> I'm doing a merge, some of the previous Ubuntu patches just modified the source directly. Is it worth me refactoring these to use cdbs or similar, or should I just leave them?
<geser> Laney: does the package use a patch management system (dpatch, quilt, etc)?
<Laney> geser: No, there is no debian/patches or anything
<Laney> Actually, the Debian patches do it too. I guess it's not worth it, eh?
<geser> then leave them as they are as adding a patch system would increase the Ubuntu delta even more (unless there a many and/or big patches)
<Laney> geser: Right then, cheers
<slytherin> what does this error mean - debian/rules:16: *** target file `build-indep' has both : and :: entries.  Stop.
<pochu> slytherin: I think that's because you added a 'clean:' target and included a CDBS include which has 'clean::', so if that's the case, change your 'clean:' to 'clean::'
<geser> slytherin: re lucene2: why got the patches 80 and 81 removed from 00list?
<pochu> slytherin: err, the same but 's/clean/build-indep/g'
<slytherin> geser: they were removed on debian side.
<slytherin> pochu: thanks. There is a debhelper include which is not needed.
<sebner> geser: hmmm?
<geser> slytherin: debian/patches/00list from the unmodified Debian package lists 80_prevent-downloading-data-files.dpatch and 81_prevent-network-access.dpatch
<slytherin> geser: let me take a look
<geser> slytherin: but these are different patches as the patches from the old Debian package with the number 80 and 81
<slytherin> geser: Oh, Wait. These patches were included in Debian as fix for FTBFS. Remember 'no-internet-access-on-buildd' problem? We fixed it in different way.
<geser> ah, ok then
<NorthernLights> Hello all
<geser> slytherin: does the DTD fix replace also patch 80 (prevent downloading data files) or only patch 81?
<NorthernLights> Would someone have a look at my package "gtkvncviewer" on REVU? Its Debian version has been accepted by Debian mentors, so I believe it's not bad.
<slytherin> geser: both. we patch the unit test to use local DTD.
<geser> slytherin: please document it better the next time you merge this package, that the ubuntu patch replaces the other two patches
<slytherin> geser: Can you please wait. Looks like patch 80 should not be dropped. My bad. :-(
<geser> slytherin: so I should readd patch 80 again?
<geser> slytherin: no need to create a new debdiff just for that
<slytherin> geser: Yes, if that is not much trouble to you. Otherwise I will add it and document things properly
<geser> slytherin: no problem. it's probably easier than to start from fresh
<NorthernLights> Bye all
<ScottK> sebner: Congratulations.
<slytherin> geser: I have reverted that changed and documented why patch 81 was removed. Should I delete old debdiff and upload new one or simply upload new one?
<sebner> ScottK: oh. thanks :) Just hoping that I won't be thrown out of the team after the courier merge ^^
<RoAkSoAx> sebner, lol... now i know.. you've been the first accepted as a u-u-c member
<sebner> RoAkSoAx: exactly :)
<no0tic> ScottK, did you follow the kid3 merging adventure two days ago?
<ScottK> no0tic: No.  I've been offline the last few days.
<RoAkSoAx> sebner, congrats then ;)
<sebner> RoAkSoAx: thanks thanks ^^
<no0tic> ScottK, may I bother you anyway? :)
<ember> is there a simple way with debhelper to install a debian/desktop and debian/desktop.png or i have to link in install?
<ScottK> no0tic: You can ask.  Not sure I'll have time to answer.
<ember> congrats sebner !
<sebner> ember: also thanks to you
<ScottK> ember: Isn't there a dh_desktop for that.
<no0tic> ScottK, I reported a bug on kid3 debian package to add dh_icons on debian/rules and the mantainer forcibly merged this bug to an unsolved previous one (156 days old) reported by DarkSun88 during hardy merging. Is this a sign she won't fix it again? Can we proceed with the merge?
<slytherin> Can someone point me to some page that explains you-you-c?
<ember> ScottK yeah that registers the .desktop file
<ember> and the png i link it on .install right?
<ScottK> no0tic: What bug?
<sebner> slytherin: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopers
<RoAkSoAx> slytherin, https://launchpad.net/~universe-contributors
<ScottK> Note that dh_icons is still somewhat controversial in Debian.  Some DDs favor the idea and some don't.
<no0tic> ScottK, http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=480246 was merged to http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=454526
<ubottu> Debian bug 480246 in kid3 "kid3_1.0-1: Add dh_icons in debian/rules" [Normal,Open]
<ScottK> no0tic:
<ScottK> no0tic: Looking
<slytherin> sebner: RoAkSoAx: thanks
<ScottK> no0tic: Yes.  I'd say go ahead.
<geser> slytherin: like you want
<ScottK> no0tic: I don't think you needed to file your bug as it appears essentially the same as the existing bug.
<slytherin> geser: I will simply upload the new one so you can compare it with old one if you want.
<no0tic> ScottK, ok, I'll file the merge wishlist bug on LP, thanks a lot
<ScottK> no0tic: No problem.  Thanks for contributing and working to get Debian and Ubuntu in better sync.
<sebner> ScottK: already looked at courier?
<ScottK> sebner: I have not.  I just got back from being out of town.  I'll probably look at it tonight (I'm at -0400).
<sebner> ScottK: ah ok. sry
<ScottK> sebner: No problem.
<no0tic> since kid3 turned out to be a merge and not a sync I set this bug https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/227405 to invalid, is it ok?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 227405 in kid3 "Please sync kid3 1.0-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)." [Wishlist,Invalid]
<slytherin> geser: Done. Uploaded new debdiff.
<geser> slytherin: Uploaded.
<ScottK> no0tic: Just edit that bug to be a merge bug.  No need to start a new one.
<no0tic> ScottK, I hope not to miss another merge, but if it will happen I'll do that way
<ScottK> no0tic: OK.
<nxvl> is there something like an upload count?
<slytherin> geser: Thanks. And since you have ack'ed my previous sync bugs, I would be glad if you also did it fro tomcat5.5 :-D
<sommer> geser: I was looking at merging bioperl and noticed you were the merge-o-matic, just wondering if it's cool if I take a crack at merging it?
<sebner> huhu no0tic
<sebner> huhu norsetto
<norsetto> err, yes, huhu 2u2 sebner
<sebner> ^^
<norsetto> sebner: so you made it eh? Bribing the MC with home-made sauchertorte proved to be a worthy tactic after all
<sebner> norsetto: hrhr. psst! don't reveal my top secret success plan ;)
 * norsetto didn't realise he wasn't quering :-O
<sebner> norsetto: xD xD xD
<sebner> norsetto: btw, filed the flightgear bug and reported the changes to debian. We'll see what happenes :)
<norsetto> sebner: I'm eagerly awaiting
<sebner> norsetto: ^^, why?
<norsetto> sebner: "We'll see what happenes :)"
<sebner> norsetto: well, if they accept our changes or not
<norsetto> sebner: yes, thats why I said that I'm curious to see it too
<sebner> norsetto: I thought that was just a joke because you are working on a lot of other packages ^^
<norsetto> sebner: do you think this guy (bug 228976) is upset?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 228976 in xsensors "The Xsensors program STILL will not install and/or run under Hardy final release version" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/228976
<sebner> norsetto: STILL, maybe a little bit =)
<norsetto> sebner: but we are very nice guys, so we will ask debian to update it to 0.60 (supposing the DM is still alive)
<sebner> norsetto: 0.6 fixes it? Not worth a SRU or? We are very nice guys, indeed ^^
<norsetto> sebner: there are very high chances it will, the version right now in hardy is from beg. 2006
<sebner> norsetto: I see. bug 206862
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 206862 in xsensors "New upstream version (0.60) available" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/206862
<norsetto> sebner: if it works in intrepid, we could backport it, but first we need to check
<crimsun> hmm, unstable still has 0.50-1
<sebner> norsetto: yep. do you want me to file a bug in debian BTS?
<norsetto> sebner: why not, check if there isn't one already, and if you really feel nice you can try to upgrade it yourself in the meantime, it will be a good exercise for you
<sebner> norsetto: well then I have to be pretty quickly. Today is the last the I will work for ubuntu for at least for one week. You know. final exams :)
<norsetto> sebner: there is a bug alreday btw: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=446530
<ubottu> Debian bug 446530 in xsensors "xsensors: New upstream version (0.60) available" [Wishlist,Open]
<norsetto> alreday !?
<sebner> norsetto: pretty old :\ what already?
<sebner> sistpoty: thanks for the nice comment ^^
<norsetto> sebner: if this is true (bug 225362) this could be easily solved
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 225362 in xsensors "xsensor will not install and run correctly in Hardy final release" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/225362
<sebner> norsetto: sry. doesn't understand what you mean now
<norsetto> sebner: check last comment of bug 225362
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 225362 in xsensors "xsensor will not install and run correctly in Hardy final release" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/225362
<geser> sommer: afaik nobody claimed it already, so you can have it
<sebner> norsetto: launcher = .desktop file?
<sommer> geser: cool thanks, do I need to file a merge bug as mentioned here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/Merging ?
<norsetto> sebner: yes, but I wonder if this could not be solved via configure/rules
<sebner> norsetto: good question
<sommer> geser: nm, since I'm not the previous maintainer I do :)
<norsetto> sebner: looks like this is hardcoded as /etc/sensors.conf
<sebner> norsetto: possible solution? just curious because I'm just doing a merge and then bye bye ubuntu for one week :)
 * sistpoty ponders if haskell-utils is safe to merge... as it will be quite rigid in regards to version numbers
 * sistpoty decides to at least wait for ghc6 being built :)
<norsetto> sebner: that last comment seems to be an hoax ....
<sebner> norsetto: -.- If you can wait for one week I'll try to update it
<sebner> sistpoty: intrepid up and running?
<sistpoty> sebner: partly... bug #229079 and bug #229016 still prevent me from a full upgrade
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 229079 in libxfont "[intrepid]: broken" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/229079
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 229016 in system-config-printer-kde "missing conflicts" [High,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/229016
<sebner> sistpoty: what about upgrading excluding these two?
 * norsetto still has not updated to hardy even
<sebner> norsetto: good. it's not that stable ^^
<sistpoty> sebner: might be an idea
<sebner> sistpoty: at least this is my plan ^^
<sistpoty> (though I'm partially at new versions already *g*)
<sistpoty> sebner: also check, what apt will remove (the bug with the funny comments) ;)
<sebner> sistpoty: yeah I know ^^. I also upgraded partly. It took me 10 minutes to realize that debuild is complaining that dh_clean can't be done because it need debhelper 7 whats only in intrepid -.-
<norsetto> RainCT_: are you working on bug 225362 too? (meaning, is it the same as bug 206280)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 225362 in xsensors "xsensor will not install and run correctly in Hardy final release" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/225362
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 206280 in lm-sensors "[hardy] Error opening config file: /etc/sensors.conf" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/206280
 * norsetto is now entering maintenance-mode
<gnomefreak> norsetto: its the weekend monday == maintainance-mode :)
<norsetto> gnomefreak: I'm synced with LP unfortunately
<laga> it's saturday night, some geeks are trying to get something done ;)
<gnomefreak> norsetto: sorry to hear that
<sistpoty> laga: :P
<norsetto> gnomefreak: not as much as I'm ;-)
<gnomefreak> norsetto: i forgot LP was going down :(
<tbielawa> you all ever get the error where pdebuild will fail at: debsign: Can't find or can't read changes file /var/cache/pbuilder/result//bibus_1.4.2-1ubuntu1_amd64.changes!
<tbielawa> except, insert your package name there.
<gnomefreak> are PPA repos affected by LP gown down?
<LaserJock> gnomefreak: I would think the actual repos would be still up
<LaserJock> but you won't be able to do soyuz bits
<gnomefreak> LaserJock: thanks i was thinking that too but its db update
<LaserJock> sure, but the archive is the archive
<LaserJock> it should be technically independent of LP
<sistpoty> LaserJock: so I'll be able to attach a debdiff? *g*
<gnomefreak> thanks LaserJock :)
<LaserJock> gnomefreak: I don't know for sure, we can try it :-)
<gnomefreak> LaserJock: ill test as soon as i know for sure its down
<gnomefreak> as of this moment they are working
<LaserJock> LP is down right now for me
<gnomefreak> ok PPA are working than
<gnomefreak> yay libc6 updates
<gnomefreak> maybe i will be going down with LP ;)
<sebner> LaserJock: yeah, they are updating it. And I was currently filing a bug -.-
<LaserJock> darn, that'll mean I can't work on my SRU script :(
<sebner> LaserJock: btw, gnustep maintainers answered and it's a sync now ;) But they also told me that they maybe remove edemapp because of troubles with gnustep upgrades
<LaserJock> sebner: awesome, good work
<sebner> LaserJock: yeah fine that's a sync now but not that good if they remove it ^^
<LaserJock> either way really
<LaserJock> I doubt much of anybody uses it
<LaserJock> so if it's time to get rid of it then it's better overall for us
<sebner> LaserJock: ok :)
<RainCT_> norsetto: I got a fix ready for Hardy but nobody uploaded it
<RainCT_> norsetto: (lm-sensors is in main)
<norsetto> RainCT_: yes, main is ... main
<norsetto> RainCT_: so the new libsensors doesn't replace the old one
<norsetto> RainCT_: I have bot sensor.conf and sensor3.conf in my hardy chroot, I guess thats because I upgraded
<RainCT_> yes, I think the config file name changed
<tbielawa> LaserJock: i got a version of bibus up on revu. looks like I fixed it making a native package this time
<RainCT_> (I don't know the program, thought; actually I don't even remember what it is for :P)
<LaserJock> tbielawa: ah excellent
<tbielawa> LaserJock: it's summer break, time for the ubuntu hackery to begin
<geser> tbielawa: good to hear that you managed to build a non-native package
<tbielawa> i guess changing a - to an _ changes a lot with debuild
 * gnomefreak is missing something :( LP going down made wiki go down?
<gnomefreak> damn
<gnomefreak> i cant paste it
<LaserJock> tbielawa: with Launchpad down I know what I can do with my time ;-)
<tbielawa> LaserJock: w00t
<gnomefreak> it says The authentication database is temporarily unavailable. Anonymous access only.
<LaserJock> gnomefreak: yeah, wiki is authenticated via Launchpad
<gnomefreak> LaserJock: thanks
<sistpoty> hm... anyone with upload rights for main around, who'd like to sponsor me two packages?
<sistpoty> (I can post debdiffs on a site that will work :P)
<LaserJock> sistpoty: you're not Cre Dev?
<LaserJock> *Core
<sistpoty> LaserJock: no, I'm interested mainly in universe... so no reason for me to go for core-dev
<sistpoty> (unless a package in main is fubar)
<LaserJock> huh, I thought you'd been a core dev forever
<LaserJock> sistpoty: what packages?
<sistpoty> LaserJock: I also didn't go for core-dev when being on MC, since I was the only motu back then (and I think MC back then should have been mainly for motus)
<sistpoty> LaserJock: system-config-printer and system-config-printer-kde
<LaserJock> sistpoty: make sense
<LaserJock> I'm both MOTU and Core-Dev, I don't feel like it has to be one or the other
<norsetto> hmmmm, can you be a core-dev and not a MOTU?
<LaserJock> norsetto: not technically, but socially very much so
<norsetto> LaserJock: we love you even if you are a core-dev ;-)
<LaserJock> hah
<tbielawa> *hug to LaserJock*
<sistpoty> hm... I at least couldn't describe *why* I'd be a core-dev... fixing up the bad things in main that are left behind doesn't make a good impression for an application imho :P
<norsetto> sistpoty: lol
<LaserJock> sistpoty: oh, I don't know
<LaserJock> sistpoty: well, get me debdiffs and I'll have a look
<LaserJock> I'm upgrading my intrepid chroot now
<geser> it depends if you count the indirect membership of ~ubuntu-core-dev in ~motu as being MOTU or not
<sistpoty> LaserJock: thanks... first one is http://www.potyra.de/s-c-p-kde.debdiff
<LaserJock> geser: isn't the relationship via ~ubuntu-dev ?
<sistpoty> LaserJock: second one is http://www.potyra.de/s-c-p.debdiff
<sistpoty> (I didn't report the remaining lintian warnings about system-config-printer yet, before lp went down)
<geser> LaserJock: I don't remember exactly and can't currently look it up but you could be right
<sistpoty> geser, LaserJock: afair it's core-dev -> ubuntu-dev and motu -> ubuntu-dev
<LaserJock> yeah, I think that's how it is
<LaserJock> so core-dev can upload to Main and ubuntu-dev to Universe
<sistpoty> yes
<norsetto> oh $DEITY, I don't believe this
<geser> so it's even technically possible to be core-dev but not MOTU (if MOTU == member of ~motu)
<sistpoty> geser: fwiw, yes
<sistpoty> (and iirc not only technically)
<norsetto> anyone that can spot whats wrong with the output of "apt-cache show gtkgo" wins a hug
<geser> norsetto: don't forget to "export DEITY=bddebian" :)
<sistpoty> heh
<norsetto> geser: thx for reminding me!
<sebner> norsetto: package doesn't exist ;)
<norsetto> sebner: nope
<sebner> norsetto: I want my hug! ^^
<geser> norsetto: the maintainer address
 * norsetto hugs geser
<LaserJock> hah
<LaserJock> funny
<sebner> wth?
<norsetto> geser: the fastest eyes in #ubuntu-motu :-)
<sebner> can somebody explain that to me?
<LaserJock> I'm surprised we don't have more of those
<LaserJock> sebner: explain what?
<norsetto> sebner: check the maintainer line
<sebner> norsetto: ?? http://pastebin.com/m429b63d
<LaserJock> odd
<norsetto> sebner: yes, its amd64 only
<sebner> grml
<sebner> norsetto: unfair. Not possible for me to win a hug -.-
 * norsetto hugs sebner
<sebner> hihi
 * sebner hugs norsetto back =)
<sistpoty> oh, norsetto: do we need to revisit gfortran dependant packages for intrepid, or will everything work fine with gfortran 4.2 -> 4.3?
<norsetto> I owed you one anyhow to congratulate you on your membership :-)
<geser> gtkgo | 0.0.10-15ubuntu3 | hardy/universe | source, amd64, i386
<sebner> norsetto: hehe. true :)
<LaserJock> I saw it and I'm on i386
<sebner> geser: hmm. so wth?
<norsetto> ah ....
<geser> sebner: did you forget to enable universe?
<LaserJock> sebner: you're special :-)
<sistpoty> (austrian mirros are behind at least one release :P)
<sebner> geser: I'm a universe-contributor xD
<sebner> LaserJock: I use them main servers ;)
<norsetto> sistpoty: it should be ok, my only concern was with R but we only had two packages to merge and I made sure they were built after R was built
<sebner> And I br0ke my sources.list ^^
<sebner> no
<sebner> everything enabled
<sebner> :\
<sistpoty> norsetto: cool, thanks! :)
<sistpoty> norsetto: you also took care of the package I still couldn't verify from hardy-proposed?
<norsetto> sistpoty: to be sure, I have anyhow some syncs I'm waiting to request so that they are built with the new blas/lapack
<norsetto> sistpoty: libittp?
<norsetto> sistpoty: or libitpp, can never remember
<sistpoty> norsetto: yes
<sistpoty> norsetto: neither can I ;)
<norsetto> sistpoty: AFAIK, its still in proposed
<sebner> norsetto:  <ubunto-motu@lists.ubuntu.com>
<sebner>   <.---- lol
<sistpoty> norsetto: but what about intrepid?
<norsetto> sistpoty: that should be autosynced
 * norsetto checks
<sistpoty> norsetto: ah, excellent! :)
<norsetto> sistpoty: yes, its autosynced
<sistpoty> :)
<norsetto> sistpoty: btw, we should really push that to hardy, its a rebuild, and all the tests run during build are fine
<sistpoty> norsetto: hm... I think it's definitely worthwhile, but I cannot figure what is broken with the old version :/....
<sistpoty> norsetto: maybe compile some fortran packages against it? (which I guess is out of my scope, since I just can't figure fortran)
<sistpoty> (linked against it even)
<norsetto> sistpoty: tried that, but short of looking at the API and do some stupid program which is anyhow much simpler than any of the test which are run during build seems hopeless
<sebner> LP is running again. wuhu
<geser> LP is back
<sebner> geser: faster :P
<sistpoty> norsetto: it would prove the point that the old version needs to be replaced afair (since iirc you cannot link to libgfortran2 and s.th. else at the same time)
<sistpoty> norsetto: if you can attach s.th. like this to the bug, I'd be very happy to pick it up and check what's going on (or try to modify it so that the hardy package breaks)
<LaserJock> grr, sbuild isn't likingn me
<LaserJock> hmm, maybe it's the problem pitti was talking about
<LaserJock> it complains that it can't find fakeroot
<norsetto> sistpoty: you have a point actually, why should the current libitpp in hardy not work!?
<sistpoty> norsetto: my believe is that it won't work, if you compile a fortran program against it... maybe. maybe it does work, that's what I'd like to find out
<norsetto> sistpoty: I don't see why it shouldn't work
<sistpoty> norsetto: oh, then I guess we can leave hardy as is? or what do you think?
<norsetto> sistpoty: well, the idea was to complete the transitionm, its just not clean but I think it should be perfectly workable
<sistpoty> :)
<norsetto> sistpoty: its just funny to leave the bug thats started it all as the only one that was not fixed :-\
<RainCT_> good night
<sistpoty> heh
<sistpoty> gn8 RainCT_
<sebner> RainCT_: gn8 =)
<sistpoty> LaserJock: any news about sponsoring for main?
<sebner> is anybody here member of the Debian Scientific Computing Team?
<sistpoty> sebner: not too sure, but I guess norsetto is and LaserJock as well
<sebner> sistpoty: that would be great
<norsetto> sistpoty: I'm not actually
<sistpoty> ah
<sebner> LaserJock: still around?
<emgent> sebner: try in #debian-devel
<sebner> emgent: I know. It's just that I would need a MOTU who is part in this team ;)
<emgent> oh ok :)
<LaserJock> sebner: yeah
<LaserJock> sistpoty: trying to get my sbuild working
<sistpoty> ok :)
<sebner> LaserJock: are you member of the Debian Scientific Computing Team?
<LaserJock> no
<sebner> damn
<sebner> sistpoty: damn you ^^
<LaserJock> I hang out with Debian Science and Debichem
<sebner> LaserJock: sorry then
<sebner> LaserJock: do you know a MOTU who is in this team?
<LaserJock> are you looking at pkg-compsci ?
<LaserJock> no
<sebner> LaserJock: ok, np. And no
<LaserJock> is there even really a team for it?
<LaserJock> I thought it was just a couple people
<sebner> LaserJock: it's pkg-scicomp
<LaserJock> yeah, that's the one
<LaserJock> I don't think there's all that many people in it
<LaserJock> and none that are connected to Ubuntu that I'm aware of
<LaserJock> sebner: what do you need?
<sebner> LaserJock: ok. thanks
<sebner> LaserJock: somebody that needs to push our changes back since persia filed a bug there but a debian-dev didn't trust him. persia told me to ask directly a member. So I have to file a bug now and hope the best
<LaserJock> if all else fails you might be able to email debian-science for discussion
<sebner> LaserJock: yeah. We'll see
<LaserJock> anybody have problems with fakechroot in an intrepid sbuild?
<norsetto> sebner: what package was that?
<sebner> norsetto: gmsh
<tholdar> why. Czessi?
<sistpoty> heh, so I just sent a very short application for core-dev to mc... let's see what will happen :)
<tholdar> why
<sistpoty> tholdar: you could aks that on a follow-up mail (in case you are responding to my comment)
<sistpoty> ask even
<LaserJock> sistpoty: heh, good luck!
<sistpoty> LaserJock:  thanks!
<sebner> sistpoty: now I'm universe-contributor. I'll comment ^^ Maybe then the think you application is a  joke ^^
<sistpoty> :O
<sebner> hmm. It's pretty late and I can't write -.-
<sebner> sistpoty: just a joke ^^, good luck :)
<sistpoty> :)
<sebner> norsetto: special interest in gmsh?
<norsetto> sebner: no
<sebner> norsetto: ok :)
<sebner> so. gn8 folks :)
<norsetto> sistpoty: nighty sistpoty
<sistpoty> gn8 sebner
<sistpoty> gn8 norsetto (or did you mean sebner there?)
 * norsetto has a fried brain
<sistpoty> heh
<sistpoty> geser, persia, dholbach, nixternal, soren: you've got mail :)
<LaserJock> sistpoty: I'm having to rebuild my intrepid chroot, but I'm still working on your packages
<sistpoty> LaserJock: no problem... ;)
<sistpoty> LaserJock: thanks for looking actually :)
<LaserJock> sistpoty: lol, that is such a typically sistpoty application :-)
<sistpoty> heh
<LaserJock> I don't think sistpoty even has a -v switch
<sistpoty> LaserJock: I do have... just give me lots of beer ;)
<LaserJock> heh
<LaserJock> alright, intrepid chroot rebuilt
#ubuntu-motu 2008-05-11
<LaserJock> argg, still not working
<no0tic> persia, can I merge criticalmass? I saw you're the last uploader
<LaserJock> sistpoty: you built  these packages on intrepid?
<sistpoty> LaserJock: yes
<sistpoty> LaserJock: that is... partly... I build them using an intrepid pbuilder
<LaserJock> k
<sistpoty> (though I'm behind one day or so, due to the mirror)
 * norsetto thinks he will call it a day
<LaserJock> sbuild doesn't like them (doesn't look specific to the packages though)
<LaserJock> I'll try with pbuilder
<norsetto> no0tic: persia is in Japan, so he might not be on line right now
<norsetto> g'night all
<no0tic> norsetto, night
<ScottK> sistpoty: Saw you core-dev application.  Good for you.  It's about time.
<sistpoty> thanks ScottK
<LaserJock> sistpoty: huh, works with pbuilder
<sistpoty> :)
<ScottK> sistpoty: You might want to point at an update to your wiki page that describes all the cool stuff you've done.  While I'm sure the MC members know a lot about it, the tech board may not.
<LaserJock> I'm not sure if it's some sort of weirdness with intrepid right now or what
<sistpoty> ScottK: I deliberatly didn't do this... as my rationale is basically, that I don't intend to fix main stuff (unless, it's broken, and once again core-devs did not a job as good as I expect them to do)
<ScottK> sistpoty: OK.
<sistpoty> (which really concerns me recently)
<ScottK> sistpoty: You didn't ask for endorsements, but I intend to give you one.
<sistpoty> ScottK: that would be nice. thanks! :)
<LaserJock> sistpoty: so basically Main QA?
<sistpoty> LaserJock: not really, I rather believe that there have been too many packages included into main, which shouldn't be there in the first place
<ScottK> So I was at the Apple store tonight buying my wife her Mother's Day present (she has a Mac) and I think I talked the guy at the store into trying out dual booting to Ubuntu.
<sistpoty> LaserJock: it somehow overlaps with the fact, that main packages aren't necessarily covered by canonical support
<sistpoty> ScottK: cool, congrats :)
 * sistpoty admits a big failure of ubuntu: I didn't manage to get the beamer to work under kde during the conference I visited this week :(
<LaserJock> sistpoty: what kind of packages do you think shouldn't be in Main?
<sistpoty> LaserJock: that's a tough question... let me check a few instances
<LaserJock> sistpoty: btw, did you know the two copies of smburi.py are not the same? there is a small diff
<ScottK> sistpoty: Laptops, projection screens, and Kubunty Hardy are problematic.  See the release notes about dual screen operations.  The best I've done so far is to hard lock the machine.
<sistpoty> LaserJock: didn't check this actually... thanks for the note
<sistpoty> LaserJock: for example, I guess that there's no reason for libsdl1.2 to be in main (and its rdepends). As it has many rdepends, I'm not entirely sure though. Of course there are other libs which used to live in universe and have got adapted to main later one, but shouldn't be there as well imho
<LaserJock> sistpoty: pitti did a whole lot of work to get uneeded stuff out of Main
<LaserJock> for hardy
<sistpoty> LaserJock: smbury.py diff seems to be ok for me (afaict it drops "smb://" when it hits it)
<LaserJock> sistpoty: so it's good like it is then?
<sistpoty> LaserJock: imho yes... at least it will install then, so it's better than the current state
<sistpoty> LaserJock: I haven't checked though, if system-config-printer-kde still finds smburi.py
<sistpoty> (wouldn't know how to do that right now)
<LaserJock> sistpoty: uploaded, thanks
<sistpoty> thanks LaserJock!
<wgrant> sistpoty: That's a failure of Kubuntu, not Ubuntu. xrandr works really, really well normally.
<sistpoty> wgrant: most probably, yes
<ScottK2> sistpoty: He's right.  Our KDE3 displayconfig doesn't use xrandr.
<wgrant> Rather unfortunate that it wasn't convinced to :(
<ScottK2> Not crashing routinely was major progress.
<ScottK2> We did achieve that, so it's at least reasonably functional with a single screen.
<sistpoty> it didn't help me when I needed to present s.th. on a recent conference (whith an ubuntu sticker on the laptop *g*)
<ScottK2> We do intend to have it taken out and shot for Intrepid.
<ScottK2> sistpoty: The release notes have some useful hints.
<sistpoty> ScottK2: yes, of course :)
 * sistpoty needs to go to bed now... cya
<LaserJock> tbielawa_dinner: did you updated the FSF address in the bibus files?
<LaserJock> *update
<RAOF> Ok.  Why does the compiz application switcher leave my windows slightly blurred? :)
<Laney> RAOF: I had that for a short while after Hardy released. Some update seems to have fixed it now though.
<Laney> I worried that my eyes were going for a bit
<pwnguin> hmm. the mythbuntu theme is pretty nice, exept for the tri-color gnome-panel
<RAOF> Let's see how it compares to my current chocolate nodoka theme.
<RAOF> pwnguin: It should go all the way with the dark theme.  The light-grey dropdowns from the black panel looks silly, IMO.
<pwnguin> yea
<pwnguin> but you can fix that
<pwnguin> change to shiny-black ;)
<RAOF> You know, I could learn to love Debian pink.
<pwnguin> ...
<pwnguin> I always thought those colors were chosen to look good on a twenty year old CGA monitor or solaris workstation or something
<RAOF> It goes quite nicely in the mythbuntu theme with darklooks everywhere else.
<Jazzva> pochu: ping
<pwnguin> darklooks is too flat
<RAOF> Agreed.
<RAOF> Nodoka does reasonable dark themes.
<RAOF> (Gah!  Still need to write that RFS)
<pwnguin> nodoka?
<RAOF> Yeah; fedora's gtk engine/theme.
<ScottK> Any distro that picks brown as it's primary theme color really has no place to pick about other's choices.
<pwnguin> who's picking?
<ScottK> "I always thought those colors were chosen to look good on a twenty year old CGA monitor or solaris workstation or something" didn't sound like a compliment to me?
<pwnguin> oh right
<ScottK> So that would be you.
<pwnguin> debian magenta i think is worse than orange :P
<ScottK> Dunno.  All my desktops are a nice pretty blue color.
<pwnguin> besides, dark orange is a fairly unique and identifying color
<pwnguin> its usually pretty simple to pick out an ubuntu screenshot ;)
<wgrant> I quite like our orange.
<wgrant> It's better than OldHuman brown.
<ScottK> It's definitely unique.  I won't argue that.
<ScottK> superm1: You around?
<ScottK> superm1: Never mind.  Got my derivates mixed up.
<pwnguin> he is the mythbuntu guy, no?
<ScottK> He is.
<ScottK> I want an Ubuntu Studio guy.
<pwnguin> oh. (i orginally brought up the mythbuntu theme)
<ScottK> Right.  This is a different topic.
<LaserJock> I like the browns
<LaserJock> I'm not fond of the heavy blue and greens
<pwnguin> the problem with dark themes I think is the web
<LaserJock> pwnguin: how so?
<ScottK> I think the problem with themes period is my teenage children come up with stuff that makes my eyes hurt.
<LaserJock> hmm
<LaserJock> I like dark colors
<LaserJock> I prefer black/grey backgrounds
<RoAkSoAx> dark colors are not good for our eyes xD :)
<LaserJock> they aren't?
<RAOF> LaserJock: Because the web is uniformly black-on-white, so looks outrageously bright in a dark theme?
<LaserJock> RAOF: why would they depend on the theme?
<RAOF> LaserJock: They don't; that's the problem.
<LaserJock> really?
<RAOF> When the rest of the theme is light-background, dark text, it's not a huge contrast.
<RAOF> When the theme is dark background, light text, the black-on-white web looks insanely bright.
<LaserJock> I guess when I switch from FF which is black-on-white to my terminal which is white-on-black it's a big change
<LaserJock> but that doesn't really depend on the theme
<LaserJock> the theme really only affects the window title/border
<LaserJock> so is white-on-black or black-on-white better for your eyes?
<RoAkSoAx> it is better to use light colors
<pwnguin> LaserJock: like RAOF says, the rest of the desktop is fairly dark, so a huge white WWW canvas is way brighter than the rest of the screen
<RoAkSoAx> i've had dark colored themes... and my eyes got tired more often
<RoAkSoAx> than when using light colors
<LaserJock> hmm
<LaserJock> well, I guess maybe my problem is "rest of the desktop"
<RoAkSoAx> believe me i spend almost like 16 hours a day in front of a computer :D
<LaserJock> I run all my windows maximized
<pwnguin> right, so when you alt tab, it's huge
<LaserJock> so if I'm looking at FF it's all white
<LaserJock> RoAkSoAx: as do I
<pochu> Jazzva: pong
<LaserJock> but I haven't figured out a good combination
<RoAkSoAx> LaserJock, do you use glasses??
<pwnguin> tab or switch virt desktops and bam, sore irises
<LaserJock> RoAkSoAx: contacts, yeah
<pwnguin> i coud imagine this making your eyes sore after a few hours
<RoAkSoAx> LaserJock, that's why you don't feel it.. i don't use any kind of glasses
<LaserJock> hmm
<pwnguin> esp with the monitor as the only light source in the room
<LaserJock> RoAkSoAx: well, my eyes are read and kill me
<persia> sebner: No reason to restrict yourself to a MOTU for gmsh.  Any coordination is good, and if you can't get anywhere, we can also merge it next time.
<LaserJock> I just haven't figured out how to make it better
<persia> no0tic: If you haven't already, please feel free to merge criticalmass
<RoAkSoAx> LaserJock, same as mine.. but everytime i had dark colored themes... my eyes got more tired and red
<LaserJock> hmm
<LaserJock> maybe I should change my terminal then
<RoAkSoAx> LaserJock, the only thing i use in black*/white combination is my terminal
<tbielawa> evening
<Jazzva> pochu: I did a test-build of tracker, and cleaned it after... the diff between that and the original from mom shows that ./src/libtracker/tracker-client.h is removed. But, if I don't build it and clean it, the file stays there. It is auto-generated, on the other hand..
<RoAkSoAx> and my theme is the uUbuntu default
<LaserJock> RoAkSoAx: well, that's what I spend most of my day using
<Jazzva> pochu: Any ideas? Is that ok?
<LaserJock> so wouldn't I want it black-on-white?
<pochu> Jazzva: will it be generated on build?
<LaserJock> tbielawa: hi, did  you see my question fro a while ago?
<Jazzva> pochu: I'm building it again, to check... I suppose it is
<tbielawa> LaserJock: no I did not, please ask it again
<pochu> Jazzva: if so, that's alright, yes. It shouldn't be there in the first place but that's an upstream thing and it's ok
<LaserJock> tbielawa: did you modify all the FSF addresses?
<RoAkSoAx> LaserJock, if for example you have the screen all black with white letters... wont affect
<tbielawa> LaserJock: yes I did
<pochu> Is there any way to know what packages build-depend on another one?
<LaserJock> tbielawa: I'd suggest doing it as a patch
<RoAkSoAx> but if you have a theme that has combination of black colored and maybe some light colors it will affect
<Jazzva> pochu: Ok, thanks... I'll submit a debdiff for tracker soon.
<pochu> something like 'apt-cache rbuilddepends <package>' would rock :)
<LaserJock> RoAkSoAx: well, what do you mean by "theme" here?
<pochu> Jazzva: ok, thanks!
<Jazzva> no prob :)
<ScottK2> pochu: grep-dctrl -FBuild-Depends,Build-Depends-Indep,Depends -s Package libclamav-dev -n /var/lib/apt/lists/*_Sources
<LaserJock> pochu: look in ubuntu-dev-tools, I seem to remember there being such a script
<RoAkSoAx> LaserJock, let me take a screenshot :)
<tbielawa> LaserJock: I can include the patch I generated and mailed upstream. Proper procedure would be creating a debian/patches dir and adding an action in rules?
<ScottK2> pochu: Just put the package you're interested in where I had libclamav-dev
<LaserJock> tbielawa: yeah, I'd suggest using dpatch for it
<tbielawa> LaserJock: thanks for the guidance, I'll read up on dpatch
<LaserJock> tbielawa: if you need help ping me
<RoAk> LaserJock, this is my laptop's desktop, and is a bad combination of colors: http://img214.imageshack.us/img214/1779/screenshotot5.png
<pochu> ScottK2, LaserJock: thank you!
<LaserJock> RoAk: ok
<tbielawa> RoAk: teh contrast! it burns us!
<pochu> ScottK2, LaserJock: there's /usr/bin/reverse-build-depends from ubuntu-dev-tools too :)
<LaserJock> RoAk: I would probably do something like that
<pochu> ScottK2: which does exactly your magic, but it's easier to remember ;)
<RoAk> LaserJock, yeah i like dark colors too but i really hurts eyes more than having a lighter colored theme...
<wgrant> I ran a dark theme with some custom default CSS for a while, but websites really don't like it.
<pwnguin> RoAk: rounded edges shouldn't round on fullscreen =/
<RoAk> pwnguin, it ain't full screen :)
<RoAk> LaserJock, it is because of the combination of dark and light colors what affects your eyes.. it is better not to use such combination
<RoAk> but if you use glasses... you might not feel the difference.. since i don't i do feel it =(
<LaserJock> RoAk: here's my current screenshot:http://laserjock.us/files/snapshot1.png
<LaserJock> sort of the opposite of yours
<pwnguin> somewhere i have a shot where i made wip3out the default font
<bluefoxicy> argh wine has no sound unless I kill whatever's using alsa
<pwnguin> it looks neat in places, but irc aint one
<wgrant> bluefoxicy: s/alsa/PulseAudio/
<pwnguin> bluefoxicy: isn't that sorta how alsa works?
<bluefoxicy> wgrant:  I killed pulse
<bluefoxicy> it's still not working.
<LaserJock> RoAk: so should I rather use white-on-black for my terminal so everything is light?
<RoAk> LaserJock, maybe not... but i would change the white messages to a  more grey than white color...
<RoAk> LaserJock, i also use black terminal... it does not hurt me... what it does is everything else.. as my screenshot of xchat
<wgrant> I can't stand white terminals.
 * tbielawa runs translucent white on black terminals
<RoAk> wgrant, me neither
 * pwnguin runs green on black
<LaserJock> RoAk: so is the white of the xchat the problem in your screenshot or is it the black everywhere else?
<LaserJock> pwnguin: ewww, I can't do that
<LaserJock> I tried and it gives me bad eye strain
<pwnguin> works great on my 2001FP
<RoAk> LaserJock, the black makes the white appear more brigth than usual... and since i have that combination is like if i was looking to directle to a flash light in the complete darkness
<RoAk> *looking directly to a flash light in the complete darkness
<tbielawa> http://csee.wvu.edu/~tbielawa/screentoday.jpg
<tbielawa> figured i'd follow suit since we
<LaserJock> tbielawa: that's similar to the kind of thing I'd do
<tbielawa> 're all showing off our screens :)
<LaserJock> although I like more solid backgrounds
<tbielawa> I just bought a sub to digitalblasphemy and I  think that background's my favorite so far
<pwnguin> you know, I found a wiki article on how to make those with gimp
<wgrant> I very rarely see my background. All my windows are fullscreen most of the time (probably from using ion3 for a significant period)
<LaserJock> wgrant: same here, from primarily using laptops with crummy resolution
<RoAkSoAx> both my laptop and desktop computers terminals look like this though: http://img266.imageshack.us/img266/5781/screenshotlh1.png
<pwnguin> http://gentoo-wiki.com/TIP_GIMP_Fractal_Backgrounds
<wgrant> That's a few temperature sensors.
<pwnguin> http://jldugger.deviantart.com/art/Dualism-Ubuntu-79575306
<RoAkSoAx> wgrant, my sensors you mean?
<wgrant> RAOF: Yes.
<wgrant> Er, RoAkSoAx.
<RoAkSoAx> wgrant, yeah.. my mainboard does not support my processor officially so i have to monitor how it goes :D
<pwnguin> aha, found it
<pwnguin> http://people.cis.ksu.edu/~jld5445/wipeout.png
<RoAkSoAx> wgrant, check the volts http://img410.imageshack.us/img410/6415/screenshot1an6.png
<wgrant> that terminal just killed me, I think.
<pwnguin> yea, it was ... unusable
<RoAkSoAx> yeah
<tbielawa> pwnguin: was that even english?!
<RoAkSoAx> i think it was old egipcians language :P xD
<RoAkSoAx> gerogliphics? (i'm not sure if that is the word nor even the correct spelling )
<ScottK> pwnguin: That's almost as hard to read as what my teenager's come up with (although for the 14 year old pink is much more prominent).
<wgrant> OMG PONIEZ
<tbielawa> it's not fair to tease like that, wgrant
<ScottK> wgrant: I didn't show her the Kubuntu April Fools release for a reason.
<ScottK> RoAkSoAx: You'll want to change the password in that screen shot.
<RoAkSoAx> ScottK, which one?
<ScottK> RoAkSoAx: Kidding.  There isn't one.
<RoAkSoAx> ScottK, ahah phew.. you worried me :P
<ScottK> ;-)
<tbielawa> you had me searching
<RoAkSoAx> tbielawa, yeah i was searching too... lol
<ScottK2> So if I have a package that uses quilt, why is removing an un-needed patch and removing the patch name from series not sufficient to get the patch not used to build the package?
<tbielawa> decisions... sit at home drinking alone, or drink alone at the bar
<tbielawa> ?
<RoAkSoAx> tbielawa, go to the bar and look for someone to make you company :
<tbielawa> RoAkSoAx: :)
<RoAkSoAx> that's what i'm going to do anyways xD
<tbielawa> nice
<tbielawa> There's a CD release show for a local band @ my favorite venue + watering hole, I think I'll check it out
<RoAkSoAx> here is the same thing as every saturday.. hang out in multiple bars :D
<tbielawa> We need a good west virginia ubuntu gathering
<tbielawa> get everyone to come to morgntown, have a grand ol' time
<RoAkSoAx> tbielawa, how is WVU, good place to study?
<tbielawa> RoAkSoAx: I don't feel very challenged but our engineering college is ABET accredited.
<tbielawa> The famed couch burnings of the past don't happen as much anymore. but if you're looking for a party scene, we got that too
<RoAkSoAx> tbielawa, cuz i might be doing a Masters Degree in the US and i'm between IIT, WVU and FIU
<tbielawa> RoAkSoAx: in what field, CS?
<RoAkSoAx> tbielawa, yep
<Jazzva> pochu: Uploaded debdiffs for tracker, bug 229146
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 229146 in tracker "Please merge tracker 0.6.6-1 from Debian unstable" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/229146
<RoAkSoAx> tbielawa, if i choose FIU i might go for Telecommunications and Networking
<tbielawa> WVUs got a talked up Masters of Software Engineering Path
<tbielawa> I'd say its worth checking out for sure
<tbielawa> we have professors from a wide range of disciplins int he cs field as well. we've got a lot of ground breaking stuff going on for a cozey mountain town :)
<RoAkSoAx> tbielawa, i really don't like software engineering path.. i preffer telecom & networking
<RoAkSoAx> i would be an International Student
<tbielawa> I don't know off hand anyone in our department that specialized in those fields
<tbielawa> we have plenty of international students, especially at the graduate level
<RoAkSoAx> tbielawa, yeah i've seen that CS masters there are not related to telecom & networking, but IIT and FIU are...
<tbielawa> what is FIU?
<RoAkSoAx> tbielawa, yeah.. i have to apply for an schoolarship too
<RoAkSoAx> Florida International University
<tbielawa> oh god -- florida *vomit* sorry... I moved out of that state as quick as I could, you may end up loving it if you attend university there
<RoAkSoAx> tbielawa, i was on vacation there winter 2007... (january trough february) and i really liked it... lots of party... and since i have family there.. might choose FIU
<tbielawa> awesome
<tbielawa> well folks, I'm heading out. time to check out the venue
<RoAkSoAx> have fun tbielawa
<RoAkSoAx> O_o
<tbielawa> its strange to me that this room is never under 180 participants, yet I can identify the.... 15 people who speak regularly
<RoAkSoAx> tbielawa, werent you going to a bar_
<RoAkSoAx> ?
<tbielawa> RoAkSoAx: how'd your night go? Is it even night to you?
<RoAkSoAx> tbielawa, yeah 12:50
<RoAkSoAx> how about you?
<tbielawa> oh wow, so you're on central time (or something close). I just got back! The three bands just stopped playing.
<tbielawa> I had a good time
<RoAkSoAx> im at utc -5 ... should be close to Central time but without daylight saving
<tbielawa> My typing is impared. I've never typed drnka on a ergonomic keyboard before
<RoAkSoAx> and rock on... i didn't go out cuz i remembered that i have examen tomorrow 8am
<tbielawa> RoAkSoAx: I went out because I had my _last_ exam today :) Wound up talking to my manager at the bar/venue for a few hours. Good conversation was had
<tbielawa> he mentioned grootboot. My mission tomorrow is to find out what it is and does
<RoAkSoAx> cool!! i have a CCNA Module 1 exam.... so i decided not to go out
<tbielawa> CCNA exam
<RoAkSoAx> yep, module 1
<tbielawa> You made the intelligent decision
<tbielawa> RoAkSoAx: what does your handle even mean?
<RoAkSoAx> tbielawa, handle?? my nickname you mean?
<tbielawa> Yes
<RoAkSoAx> nothing at all
<RoAkSoAx> it just came to my mind once
<tbielawa> oh
<tbielawa> Mine's short for "Timothy Bielawa" quite original don't you think? :p
<RoAkSoAx> yep, i used to be ^4nDr3s but i stayed with this
<RoAkSoAx> ahaha
<RoAkSoAx> yeah lot's of people do that...
<RoAkSoAx> some take it as an standard for user control in organizations
<tbielawa> dholbach comes to mind
<RoAkSoAx> emails, user accs. etc...
<tbielawa> ya. that's what we do for user accounts @ work to
<tbielawa> *too'
<RoAkSoAx> yep, it's kind of and standard
<RoAkSoAx> so, you studying CS?
<tbielawa> if you search teh intertubes for 'zokosiman' or 'zoko siman' you might dig up stuff I've done in years past.
<tbielawa> RoAkSoAx: ya. I'm a CS and mathematics dual major. I added Math this last semester.
<RoAkSoAx> Undergrad?
<tbielawa> And you?
<tbielawa> Yes. Undergrad, going for B.S.
<RoAkSoAx> cool.. i obtained my BS in Systems Engineering (Which would be equivalent to CS in Peru)
<RoAkSoAx> on january
<pwnguin> systems engineering == CS?
<RoAkSoAx> so now i'm finishing my thesis.. and they apply for an schoolarship in the US :D
<RoAkSoAx> pwnguin, in Peru... Systems Engineering would be the equivalent to CS in the US
<pwnguin> so systems engineers in peru study compilers and Big O notation
<pwnguin> huh
<tritium> Systems engineering != CS, no
<jdong> pwnguin: you ain't gonna reduce us CS'ers to compilers and big-O, are you?
<jdong> pwnguin: we might be the worst at achieving the big O ;-)
<pwnguin> jdong: i think theres a common experience around such things
<tbielawa> RoAkSoAx: You would loooooooove my job at the university
<pwnguin> cs is theory and that's the theory ;)
<RoAkSoAx> i've seen the Masters Curricula in FIU for CS, and its very similar to mine in Peru
<RoAkSoAx> tbielawa, what do you do?
<tbielawa> RoAkSoAx:  Put briefly,  I'm a system administrator for the computer science department.
<RoAkSoAx> cool
<pwnguin> jdong: laugh all you want, but any presentation of software in a journal would be remiss if it doesn't analyze the runtime
<RoAkSoAx> tbielawa,  yeah i would love your job
<tbielawa> But the part you would enjoy is beyond that. hold on for a minute and I'll get a URL for you
<RoAkSoAx> tbielawa, i don't wanna work just yet until i get my thesis done... but i was working last year developing software for a financial institution in my city
<jdong> pwnguin: I'm here limboing 6-2 (EE+CS)... consider me an onlooker ;-)
<tritium> systems engineering is a very broad term, practiced by many disciplines, including degreed engineers
<RoAkSoAx> tritium, it is a broad tearm, but in peru it's realted to informatics (software development, AI, and networking)
<tbielawa> We're developing a infrastructure platform. The senior design group this year demonstrated the first implementation of it:  https://launchpad.net/loud-platform
<tritium> RoAkSoAx: really, it goes beyond just informatics, and involves the integration of subsystems, requirements management, etc.
<RoAkSoAx> depends on the university... but it is pretty much similar to CS
<tbielawa> mok0 is details exactly what we're developing https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MortenKjeldgaard
<tritium> It is similar to CS, but not identical.  It is utilized on mechanical systems, electrical systems, electromechanical systems, etc.  Much more than just software systems.
<pwnguin> i think you two are talking about different things
<RoAkSoAx> tritium, yes, it does, the term does... but as i'm saying... in Peru.. they use it for all the related to CS
<tritium> RoAkSoAx: I understand what you're saying
<pwnguin> his degree and "Systems Engineering as practiced in the US"
<pwnguin> my point is simply that what's important to a CS degree is computation theory
<RoAkSoAx> tritium, in peru there's one only university that use CS as the name of the carreer... few use Informatics Engineering.. and most of Universities use it as Systems Engineering
<tritium> pwnguin: international, really: http://www.incose.org/practice/whatissystemseng.aspx
<pwnguin> tritium: i'm only familiar with the US =|
 * jdong personally thinks CE/IT/SE are distinct from CS
<jdong> then again I'm also thinking from a US perspective
 * tbielawa nods at jdong
<tritium> Wikipedia's Systems engineering page isn't bad either
<pwnguin> software engineering, at least at my university, is sort of a weaker "we program but dont think as hard about it" deal
<jdong> pwnguin: nah I wouldn't say that much
<RoAkSoAx> jdong, i do too that-s why i think it should be renamed to CS, but they put it in Peru like Sys.. ENgine.. because it was "more commercial"
<RoAkSoAx> whatever that means
<jdong> pwnguin: CS just looks at it from a more theoretical point of view
<tbielawa> we have 'information systems' in the WVU business college
<jdong> pwnguin: while SE tries to approach a "real world working solution ASAP" way
<jdong> pwnguin: actually.... 6.005 (my SE course) is approaching it from a "let's make all the students commit suicide" way.
<pwnguin> heh
<tbielawa> 0_o
<jdong> and it's working.
<pwnguin> oh my
<jdong> the last weekly project took me 40 hours to complete
<pwnguin> we run the operating systems class that way
<jdong> and I consider myself to be a fairly experienced coder
<jdong> lots of kids were spending significantly longer
 * tbielawa is glad he's not a business school manager
<jdong> one property of MIT computer labs.... you will notice starting from 5PM people bringing sleeping bagsi nto the lab.
 * RoAkSoAx is glad he want's to be a sysadmin and networkadmin :D
<jdong> that was one of the weirdest sights during my first term
<pwnguin> but we don't work our students on the thesis that they're MIT students dedicated and super intelligent
<tbielawa> jdong: 2 things: (1) you're in MIT? (2) you'd work in it/cs there?
<jdong> tbielawa: (1) yeah, I'm a 2nd year undergrad in EECS (2) I do work as a sysadmin of 50 or so Ubuntu laptops for our intro to EECS course
<pwnguin> jdong: i sorta take issue with the entire OO design. programs are a set of instructions for a computer, not a collection of things. OO (which I hereby equate with Software Engineering) seems very database centric =(
<tbielawa> jdong: speaking frankly, I think that's badass :)
<tritium> I'm not a big fan of the title "software engineer," as so many who claim that title are not degreed engineers.
<RoAkSoAx> jdong, how much did you obtain in your GRE to get accepted there?
<pwnguin> wtf
<tbielawa> I think pwnguin just openened a box that shouldn't have been
<pwnguin> undergrads aren't grads
<pwnguin> grads take the gre
<jdong> RoAkSoAx: undergraduate, no GRE
<jdong> tbielawa: thanks, I'm flattered :)
<RoAkSoAx> jdong, oh right, so in STA's?
<jdong> pwnguin: well OO is not the buzzword anymore...
<RoAkSoAx> SAT's*
<jdong> RoAkSoAx: my standardized test scores, I can only say are average
<jdong> I think my best set of SAT scores were the low 2300's/ high 2200's
<RoAkSoAx> jdong, i see.. here they say that if i get a really hi GRE score i could get to MIT
<pwnguin> wasnt 1600 a top score?
<tbielawa> pwnguin: yes
<jdong> pwnguin: it's 2400 now, They moved the SAT II WRiting test into the main SAT
<pwnguin> fun
<jdong> pwnguin: so we can lurn our grammarz and stuff
<pwnguin> meh. i got a 5 on the AP so i dont have to do that kinda crap :P
 * tbielawa didn't take standardized tests until _after_ high school
<jdong> I envy you :)
 * tbielawa fails @ keeping up with 'the man'
<jdong> standardized testing sucks
<RoAkSoAx> tell me i have to take the GRE if i ever want to do a masters degree in the US
<jdong> almost all schools require scores for it
<tritium> RoAkSoAx: correct
<RoAkSoAx> yeah
<tbielawa> RoAkSoAx: if you want to do masters then taking the GRE is a necessary step
<RoAkSoAx> yeah but vocubulary part is just too tedious to study xD
<tbielawa> :(
<pwnguin> i recall reading a few years back they caught a ring of people cheating at the computerized GRE stuff so they basically said "no tests this year"
<RoAkSoAx> i should have taken it on march... but i was to lazy so i might take it this month
<jdong> pwnguin: ETS is pretty evil about that
<jdong> pwnguin: they've yanked AP programs at schools locally before because a teacher gave grader-perspective tips.
<pwnguin> interesting
<pwnguin> oh i should note
<RoAkSoAx> i would have to take the paper based.. if i want to take the computer based i will have to travel like 14 hours by bus or 1 by plane to another city
<tbielawa> :(
<tritium> RoAkSoAx: I'm old enough to not have ever had the computer based option ;)
<pwnguin> apparently my English teacher uses me an example of why you should take the AP
<RoAkSoAx> tritium, lol...
<pwnguin> "I had a student that I thought had no chance at it, but he came out with a 5"
<jdong> pwnguin: LOL
 * pwnguin damn near failed that class in HS
<RoAkSoAx> lol
<tbielawa> pwnguin: What is your nationality?
<jdong> pwnguin: I didn't take it because I knew I wouldn't be doing well
<pwnguin> United statesian
<jdong> pwnguin: you didn't take AP Geography did you?
<tbielawa> oh
<jdong> </joke>
<pwnguin> jdong: nope. not sure it existed
<pwnguin> oh
<jdong> pwnguin: it doesn't
<tbielawa> then I LOL at this because I am also and did terrible in english classes :)
<pwnguin> jdong: you've never heard of USian?
<tbielawa> except I got a 2 instead of 5 in AP :'(
<pwnguin> heh
<tbielawa> *ap english
<pwnguin> well they do all this ridiculus stuff like write down these note cards about books you read
<tbielawa> http://galleries8.petiteteenager.com/3/nikkysdreams/vivorange/3.jpg
<tbielawa> FAIL
<pwnguin> so you can study before the test for the essay question
<jdong> pwnguin: our AP English class made us write impromptu essays every meeting of the class
<tbielawa> fail
<tbielawa> no you
<jdong> pwnguin: the moment I heard that, I decided to back out
<tbielawa> do not want
<pwnguin_> man
<pwnguin_> my internet died about the second that pr0n link hit =/
<RoAkSoAx> i had to write essays every day for over 2 months
<RoAkSoAx> for the GRE prep.
<pwnguin_> anyways, I pretty much never did that stuff with cards or studying. Test day I just broke out the good old tom sawyer
<RoAkSoAx>  me too lol
<tbielawa> I apologize
<pwnguin_> tbielawa, you hit the internet so hard there my screen session failed
<tbielawa> I see your're on a pwnguin_ name now
<pwnguin_> local irc
<tbielawa> I'm embarssed about what jsut happened
<pwnguin_> its wierd though, being smart. I had a job during school at a movie theater, and a coworker says, Hey, congratulations
<pwnguin_> turns out i was in a local paper for national merit commendation
<RoAkSoAx> pwnguin_, i had the uggliest job ever when i was in the US... general labor
<RoAkSoAx> at a resort
<RoAkSoAx> un MN under 10 below
<pwnguin_> well
<pwnguin_> you win
<RoAkSoAx> yeah
<RoAkSoAx> worst job ever
<pwnguin_> its also wierd when people say they know you, but you dont know them.  it's not like i ever ran out on a field while an announcer read my name. but that's mostly over, hurray
<RoAkSoAx> lo
<RoAkSoAx> l
<pwnguin_> maybe I was "that guy"
<pwnguin_> "you know, the wierd one"
<pwnguin_> anyways, this doesn't have much to do with motu-ing
<RoAkSoAx> well guys have to.. i have an my CCNA module 1 exam in 6 hours.... and it's mothers day!!
<RoAkSoAx> peace out
<pwnguin_> is the debian sync window open yet?
<tbielawa> pwnguin that was me. I heard those words verbatim once
<pwnguin_> tbielawa, but in my recollection, there were far WIERDER people than I
<tbielawa> RoAkSoAx: hope you do welll. see you another time
<RoAkSoAx> thanks tbielawa see ya around
<pwnguin_> dude carried all his books around on a collapsable luggage cart
<pwnguin_> oh, i did kick miss teen kansas in the back once while playing hacky sack
<tbielawa> ??
<tbielawa> kick as in, with your foot?
<tbielawa> that's intense
<jdong> tbielawa: I'm pretty sure miss Teen Kansas isn't an IRC user!
<jdong> :)
<tbielawa> lol
<pwnguin_> well, it was a stray sack
<pwnguin_> duty calls to put forth a best effort. unfortunately her back was in the way
<tbielawa> lol
<tbielawa> on the note of MOTU....
<tbielawa> anyone know a good dpatch tutorial
<tbielawa> ?
<pwnguin_> use quilt?
<tbielawa> pwnguin: ?
<pwnguin> ive seen several developers say that quilt is a better patching system
<tbielawa> 2 items then: (1) why do you recommend quit (2) do you have URLs to nice tutorials on quilt?
<tbielawa> pwnguin: looks like (1) was answered
<jdong> pwnguin: it's IMO much tougher to use.
<jdong> tbielawa: is there something that man dpatch doesn't answer?
<pwnguin> jdong: really? they looked about the same to me
<jdong> pwnguin: I thought dpatch was eaiser to use
<jdong> pwnguin: quilt is certainly more powerful
<jdong> but the UI is a bit overwhelming
<tbielawa> i'd love to continue this conversation we're all having but I must /sleep
<tbielawa> good night all
<Hobbsee> mutter, quilt.
<Iulian> G'morning
<LucidFox> jdong> I used to use dpatch, now I use quilt because it doesn't require a special format for patches
<LucidFox> also I like the fact that it doesn't open a separate shell session, and I found the command sequence for editing patches easy to memorize
<Amaranth> just make sure you stick export QUILT_PATCHES=debian/patches in your .bashrc
<LucidFox> ah, indeed - thanks for the advice, I used to type it manually :)
<RAOF> Anyone want to review a fun new Gnome Do package?
<Hobbsee> woo!
<RAOF> Aha!  A victim!
 * Hobbsee wants to use it, but not review it.
<Hobbsee> dream on.
<Hobbsee> i'm not reviewing anything with mono in it.
<Hobbsee> . o O { why does it need a review anyway?}
<RAOF> How about something with debhelper 7? http://svn.debian.org/wsvn/pkg-cli-apps/gnome-do
<persia> RAOF: How different is it from the last Gnome Do package?
<RAOF> Oh, yeah.  Because it's in Debian.  And as such, there isn't a previous package :)
<RAOF> I should probably have flagged that in the initial ping :)
 * persia isn't qualified to review things for Debian :)
<persia> RAOF: On the other hand, I don't like your use of make.  Try:
<RAOF> Hah!  This is why I pinged :)
<persia> I believe you can drop dh $@ from everything if you use %;;, build::, clean::, install::, and binary-arch::
<persia> Also, DH_VERBOSE should be unset for any thing planned for upload: that ought be set only when debugging, rather than a standard build.
<RAOF> Yeah; that's the plan.
<RAOF> I've never quite got the difference between : and :: in make syntax.  What does it flip?
<persia> : defines a rule
<persia> :: defines a rule overloading
<persia> Using :: allows one to set additional steps or dependencies for a rule, when that rule is defined elsewhere as well.
<RAOF> Ah, right.  So there's the catch-all %:, with overrides (for dependencies only) for the other targets?
<persia> Using : means that the listing is the only definition of the rule, and the last definition in the list wins (make parses before processing rules)
<persia> Right.  %: matches any rule not previously defined.  %:: indicates something that should be an additional step for every rule.
<persia> You could also do something like DH_RULES := build clean install binary-arch
<persia> and later use $(DH_RULES)::
<persia> dh $@
<persia> Which adds a call to dh with the argument matching the rule name to any rules listed in the DH_RULES definition.
<RAOF> Right.
 * persia dist-upgrades sid to determine if a watch file is sufficient for dh to provide a get-orig-source rule
 * RAOF believes the answer is 'no'.  Good catch.
<RAOF> So you'd prefer something like http://pastebin.ca/1014561
<RAOF> ?
<persia> %::
<RAOF> Don't you need the rules defined somewhere?
<persia> (ortherwise it doesn't overload the previously defined rules)
<persia> No.  %:: defines every possible rule.
<RAOF> Oh, :: _defines_ a rule if it doesn't yet exist?
<persia> No.  It defines a rule whose name is a wildcard.  Anything matching the wildcard (everything) calls the rule.
<persia> But you need the second colon to define the wildcard as override, rather than only applying when there is not another rule.
<RAOF> Aaaah.
<RAOF> Right, now makes sense.
<persia> If one thinks in OO terms, using :: declares that the current definition inherits from any previous definition.  Using : declares that this is a new object, blocking the namespace.
<RAOF> Right.  So %: matches any _undefined_ rule, %:: appends commands to every rule.
<persia> That is my understanding.  While I have read the make manual, and written lots of makefiles, it's better to trust testing than my statement.
<RAOF> Heh.  I've read the make manual, too, just without paying too much attention to : vs :: :)
<RAOF> Or at least bits of it :)
<persia> Mind you, %:: also appends commands to rules not elsewhere defined.  As a result, calling debian/rules supercalifragilisticexpealidocious will call dh ï»¿ï»¿ï»¿supercalifragilisticexpealidocious, so long as %:: is defined as dh $@ (as $@ is a variable replaced with the current rule name)
<persia> Right.  For an exercise in your understanding, please explain the difference between the use of = and := :)
<RAOF> Oh, this one I know.
<RAOF> := is simply defined once, whereas = is essentially recursive text substitution.
<RAOF> Where that 'essentially' is hideously misleading.
<persia> Well, almost.
<RAOF> = will be evaluated each time the variable is substituted, too.
<RAOF> Whereas I don't think := gets that treatment?
<persia> := is defined at parse time, so it is guaranteed to be processed for every invocation, regardless of target, but is only processed once.  = is defined at runtime, and is processed at each substitution, which can be interesting when using FOO = $(shell increment-counter) or similar constructions.
<persia> (or QUUX := $(shell mail-maintainer-your-personal-details) )
<RAOF> QUUX?
<persia> METASYNTACTIC_VARIABLES := foo bar baz quux
<RAOF> quux.  Wow.
<RAOF> I've often needed more than 3 metasyntactic variables.  Now I know about quux :)
<persia> I only know 4, and have run out before.  Please advise if you encounter the next in the series.
<RAOF> Hm.  I wonder if just defining %: dh $@ is enough there.
<RAOF> How smart is dpatch.make, in other words.
<RAOF> Or dh, I suppose.
<persia> My memory is that it is considered incorrect to have two rules with the same name (including wildcard expansion) defined in the same makefile without using ::.  If nothing else, it may require significant use of make -p to understand what is being done.
<sebner> persia: yesterday I looked at uqm. my debdiff tells me more than your last changelog entry ^^
<persia> sebner: What's wrong with the changelog entry?  I didn't think I changed anything other than the .desktop installation and the menu file (and I wish upstream would stop complaining about wanting to define a special folder in the menu and have three or four executables, and just apply the patch already)
<persia> sebner: Or do you mean the changelog for uqm-content?
<sebner> persia: no uqm
<persia> sebner: What did I miss in the changelog?
<sebner> persia: you changed things in debian/control, rules .. without mentioning it
<RAOF> persia: I mean - define no rules other than %: dh $@
<persia> RAOF: You lose dependencies if you do that, but the dh manpage says that ought be sufficient for most standard packages.
<sebner> persia: http://paste.ubuntu.com/11391/
<RAOF> persia: Yeah.  So, I was in effect wondering whether dpatch has had the dh treatment; ie: whether the right commands are run in the right place automatically.
<RAOF> The quickest answer to this question is of course to fire up my sid VM and see.
<persia> sebner: Umm.  All the changes in debian/rules are about installing the desktop file & icon, and the changes to debian/control are about changing the maintainer and installing the icon.
<persia> RAOF: There you go :)
<sebner> persia: shareutils = necessary for installing the icon?
<persia> sebner: Yep.  The icon is uuencoded in debian/, and so must be uudecoded at build-time.  This is required because the packaging format used for uqm doesn't support the addition of binary files.
<persia> See debian/uqm.png.uu
<persia> (and it's sharutils: no 'e')
<sebner> persia: I see. ok then. but I just want to note that some sponsors wouldn't upload it if I attach this debdiff now ;)
<persia> I used to just use an .xpm, but upstream complained, and wanted the .png as well.
<persia> sebner: For what reason?  What's missing?
<sebner> persia: Document *everything* in the changelog entry. So also the changes in debian/control and rules though they are only necessary because of the icon thing
<persia> That's a waste of disk and archive space.  debian/changelog is a means by which developers communicate to end-users about the changes in the package.  It ought include a brief line describing each type of change, but it oughtn't matter which specific files were touched, or what was done: those are implementation details better understood from a debdiff.
<sebner> persia: nevertheless I will adjust the changelog a bit and upload it then. You can review it then ;) maybe you also want to ACK bug 229088
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 229088 in uqm-content "Please sync uqm-content 0.6.0-2 from Debian(Unstable)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/229088
<persia> Joey uploaded again?  Excellent.
<wgrant> persia: I saw an email recently to some Debiany list from some official person saying changelogs must say more than `Fix such-and-such'. They should say how it was fixed, and which files were touched, unless there were lots of them.
<sebner> wgrant: well sometimes I whishes the same ;)
<persia> wgrant: Really?  That's an interesting change.  Any pointer?
<wgrant> As do I.
<wgrant> It was a while ago, sorry.
<wgrant> A month or two.
<persia> Ah.  Not d-d-a, but that's the only wide-view Debian list to which I subscribe.
<sebner> persia: btw, normally I wouldn't procress the this merge and sync since it doesn't seem that worth.!?
<persia> sebner: Why not?  If we don't install the .desktop file properly, it doesn't appear in Add/Remove programs, and nobody plays the game.
<sebner> persia: no. I mean the merge and sync of the new debian version. they don't contain that important changes ...
<persia> sebner: Oh.  That's a release cycle timing thing.
<persia> To my understanding, there are basically four parts of the release cycle, as it affects integration with Debian, as follows:
<persia> Archive Open through Debian Import Freeze: merge everything, no matter how trivial.
<persia> Debian Import Freeze through Feature Freeze: merge everything interesting, unless it might break something.
<persia> Feature Freeze through Beta Freeze: merge anything interesting that is really wanted for the next release
<persia> Beta Freeze through Archive Close: merge anything considered release-critical
<persia> So at this point, everything gets merged.  Come DIF, we'll get picky again.
<sebner> persia: I see though part 1 should be: Merge everything, no matter how trivial if debian is unwilling you accept our changes and we can't make a sync :)
<persia> sebner: I guess.  Works either way.  In the case of uqm, I've been coordinating with the Debian maintainer and upstream for a significant number of releases.  No point waiting.
<sebner> persia: I see
<RAOF> Aww.  The dependencies are necessary.  No magic dpatch yet :)
<persia> RAOF: You could create a magic dpatch: use := to check the version of debhelper installed at parse time, and then use if to have separate stanzas to do the right thing depending on the version installed...
<sebner> persia: btw. Why is it "-rm uqm.png" and not "rm uqm.png"
<persia> sebner: Because I don't really care if uqm.png cannot be removed, and don't want make to have an error if it fails to delete the file.  Imagine the case where debian/rules clean is called when the uqm.png file has not yet been created.
<persia> (e.g. `debian/rules clean; debian/rules clean`)
<sebner> persia: so the "-" is for ignoring errors?
<persia> Yes.
<sebner> cool :)
<persia> Mind you this can be abused.  It's best to only use on a single line.  Don't use it like "-$(MAKE) clean": for that it's better to have appropriate error management in the makefile being executed, rather than the meta-makefile.
<sebner> persia: good to know :) Are you a fan of this game? It's rather strange for me ^^
<persia> I spent many enjoyable hours playing that game, although now I've solved it enough times that I am still waiting to forget enough to play it again.
<sebner> persia: ^^, debdiff uploaded :)
<persia> sebner: Great :)
<sebner> A pleasure
 * LucidFox appreciates the addition of debian/clean in debhelper 7
<persia> sebner: While I think that is sufficient, you've not actually indicated that you've added the icon in the changelog :p
<afflux> morning
<sebner> persia: Well, I'm just doing what you said. Don't make the debdiff too big :P
<sebner> huhu afflux
<afflux> heya sebner
<persia> sebner: Yep.  I'm just poking fun because you wanted to list everything :)  No reason to change it.
<sebner> persia: you wanted to keep as it is. I wanted to list everything. The result is somewhere in the middle :)
<persia> sebner: Actually, I just didn't want to merge it.  Your update to the changelog is fine: the best bit is that your name will show up next time :)
<sebner> persia: yeah. Everybody wants to load there merges on me ^^
<sebner> *their
<geser> sebner: it's called delegation :)
<sebner> geser: hehe I see, and in the end I'm more often than you on DaD ^^
<geser> sebner: till the next merge round you're hopefully a MOTU and can delegate your merges *g
<afflux> sebner: btw glÃ¼ckwunsch  :)
<sebner> geser: ^^, Personally I *want* to do merges. Unlikely that that I will delegate :P
<sebner> afflux: thanks (danke) :)
 * cody-somerville waves to everyone.
<cody-somerville> Heya Gang :)
<cody-somerville> Good Morning from Atlantic Canada :)
<sebner> uhu cody-somerville
<Laney> If a needs-packaging bug's upstream has discontinued development, should the bug be invalidated?
<persia> Laney: Depends on the software.  If it's done, it might be useful.  If it needs lots of work, maybe it's not so useful.
<Laney> persia: No, nobody had started work on it. I was looking for something to do and came across this one.
<persia> Laney: My apologies for being unclear.  I meant that if the software is complete (upstream is done), it may be worth doing the packaging.  If there are issues with the software, or it doesn't work perfectly, or otherwise needs upstream work, it's not worth packaging if upstream is inactive.
<Laney> persia: Ah, right. I guess I'll look into it then, thanks
<persia> Laney: No problem.  Thanks for asking.  Also, if you come to the conclusion that the answer is that it should not be packaged, the correct status is "Won't Fix", rather than invalid, because it's a valid request to include the software, but the software won't be included because there's no support for fixing bugs.
<Hobbsee> good evening
<RAOF> Ood evening.
 * Hobbsee is even on the correct timezone today.
<ryanakca> hmmm... what are the links to MoM & DaD again?
<sebner> ryanakca: http://dad.dunnewind.net/universe.php
<sebner> ryanakca: https://merges.ubuntu.com/universe.html
<ryanakca> sebner: thanks :D
* pochu changed the topic of #ubuntu-motu to: ï»¿https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU | Want to get involved with the MOTUs? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing | 8.04 is released: Let's fix any SRU-worthy bugs before the users try the package. | Intrepid open, go wild! https://merges.ubuntu.com/universe.html | QA targets available from http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/
<Arby> afternoon all, I've had a debdiff rejected for being too big.
<Arby> where do I start looking for what's wrong
<Arby> just saying it's too big doesn't help me a lot as a newbie to packaging
<sebner> Arby: ask the rejecter ;)
<laga> it'd help if you posted a link to the debdiff
<Arby> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/14375900/kdevelop_3.5.1-1ubuntu1.debdiff
<Arby> I had a lot of trouble getting this to actually build
<Arby> the output of debdiff is still alien to me so I don't really know what I'm looking for
<Arby> eventually got it to build by running make -f debian/rules buildprep then pdebuild
<Arby> on the recommendation of a developer
<Arby> sebner: I'll post a response to the bug report then, thanks
<sebner> Arby: k, would you mind posting the bug number?
<Arby> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/kdevelop/+bug/227939
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 227939 in kdevelop "Merge kdevelop 3.5.1-1 from Debian Unstable" [Wishlist,Incomplete]
<sebner> Arby: well, true. a debdiff shouldn't be more than a few kb's. What are the steps you are taking to make a debdiff?
<Arby> sebner: grab-merge from MoM, resolve conflicts, run debuild -S, run pdebuild,  then run debdiff new_version.dsc old_version.dsc
<laga> what does MoM and DaD stand for?
<Arby> MoM is Merge-o-matic I think
<sebner> Arby: it should be. debdiff old_version new_version > new_version.debdiff
<Jazzva> laga: Merge-o-Matic - http://merges.ubuntu.com, DaD is MoM alternative - http://dad.dunnewind.net
<laga> ah, thanks
<Jazzva> np
<Arby> sebner: ok let me try that and see what I get
<Hobbsee> erk.  don't relibtoolise for a start.
<Arby> Hobbsee: I don't know what that means sorry
<Hobbsee> Arby: running 'make -f debian/rules' will rerun libtool, which will do a lot of automatic file regeneration
<Arby> Hobbsee: it was suggested by riddell
<Arby> before that I couldn't get it too build at all
<Arby> at least it builds now
<Arby> prior to that command it was failing to build with this output,
<Arby> http://paste.ubuntu.com/11422/
<jerry> hi, everyone! I am new baby for ubuntu. Where could I get my first task ?
<slytherin> I am having trouble with bash completion with almost all development tools like dput, pbuilder debdiff etc. Does anyone have any idea what could be wrong?
<Arby> sebner: I made a mistake with the debdiff command I must have done debdiff old new because I get the same result
<Arby> running debdiff kdevelop_3.5.1-0ubuntu2.dsc kdevelop_3.5.1-1ubuntu1.dsc >kdevelop_3.5.1-1ubuntu1.debdiff
<RainCT> slytherin: to be sure, do you have bash-completion installed?
<Arby> gives me an 8.4Mb debdiff
<RainCT> (it was moved out of the bash package itself)
<Arby> clearly I've stuffed up somewhere but no idea where
<slytherin> RainCT: Yes I have. It works perfectly at my office machine but not my desktop
<slytherin> I mean home PC
<RainCT> slytherin: no idea then :(. what problems do you have?
<sebner> Arby: debdiff new_debian new_ubuntu ;)
<Arby> ho hum, I'll try again
<slytherin> RainCT: It doesn't work. None of them suggestion any completion. Do you think my ~/.bashrc could be problematic?
<Arby> :)
<Jazzva> jerry: Hello, you can read a Getting Started guide at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/GettingStarted . The list of bitesize bugs, which should be easy enough for newcomers, is at http://tinyurl.com/6rnrky
<RainCT> !packaging > jerry
<RainCT> jerry: check the pages that ubottu will tell you
<Arby> sebner: that gives an 8.8M debdiff, I'm getting worse :)
<RainCT> jerry: if that gives you no clue on how you may help, you can ask for mentor.. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Mentoring
<jerry> thanks, Jazzva, RainCT. I wish I could provide some help. I wonder if I could find anything free on the net and try packaging it into ubuntu...
<sebner> Arby: would you mind if I give it a try?
<RainCT> slytherin: . /etc/bash_completion 2> /dev/null
<jerry> Oh, mentring will be great.
<Arby> sebner: feel free
<RainCT> slytherin: I've this line there (was there by default)
<RainCT> slytherin: there = in .bashrc
<jerry> I will try mentor see if anyone could give a hand..:)
<sebner> Arby: If it works here I will help you with it ;)
<slytherin> RainCT: What does it actually do?
<Arby> sebner: it probably means I've basically screwed up the merge :)
<Arby> it was bound to happen sooner or later :)
<sebner> Arby: We'll see
<RainCT> slytherin: load the bash completion
<RainCT> slytherin: (the . is to run the command on the current shell, and /etc/bash_completion defines some completion rules and loads the files from /etc/bash_completion.d/ too)
<Jazzva> jerry: There is a list of needs-packaging bugs: http://tinyurl.com/5mc7n3 . But, I would advise you to get familiar with the debian packages structure and how it all works first. Read the pages ubottu sent you.
<slytherin> RainCT: Found the reason. What you told me was there in .bashrc but commented. Also it is commented in /etc/bash.bashrc
<slytherin> RainCT: Is it supposed to be commented by default in /etc/bash.bashrc?
<jerry> thanks, Jazzva:) I think I will start with debian packaging first.
<RainCT> slytherin: oh.. that's evil
<RainCT> slytherin: a better default would be    if [ -f /etc/bash_completion ] ...
<RainCT> slytherin: I don't know, haven't done any clean Hardy installation myself
<slytherin> RainCT: Yes, that is what is present, but commented. Should I log a bug?
<slytherin> RainCT: It is not clean hardy install, it is upgrade
<slytherin> jerry: I suggest that you try to fix small bugs first. You will learn a lot. :-)
<sebner> Arby: *testbuilding* but it seems it's working. I'll guide you then
<slytherin> jerry: I mean problems in packaging. try to work on merges
<ryanakca> to build test packages for intrepid (merge), should I create an intrepid schroot, or can I test build it in hardy?
<Arby> sebner: great, thanks
<sebner> Arby: ok let's start. create a new folder for working with
<slytherin> ryanakca: intrepid chroot
<RainCT> slytherin: not a bug, someone just confirmed that it is enabled in a clean Hardy installation by default (with an if [ -f ... )
<Arby> sebner: done
<ryanakca> slytherin: thanks
<sebner> Arby: copy your grab-merge thing into the folder and fetch the kdevelop files
<Arby> fetching
<no0tic> I'm requesting a merge for criticalmass, we added an xpm file and its content was in the debdiff, I deleted them, is it ok? anyone can take a look to my debdiff? http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/11423/
<slytherin> RainCT: Then it is an upgrade bug. Because it is disabled and I did and upgrade from gutsy.
<persia> no0tic: Does Debian include the .xpm file now?  If not, we still need it.
<slytherin> anyway, leave it minor problem for me now
<sebner> Arby: Dad or MoM. What you are using. does not apply the changes so you have to do it manually
<no0tic> persia, no, it doesn't
<Arby> sebner: ok
<Arby> still fetching, slowly.
<sebner> Arby: k, tell me if you are ready
<persia> no0tic: The menu files use the .xpm icon.  If you don't include it, it will cause the menu to show a missing icon, which isn't ideal.
<no0tic> persia, so the debdiff is responsible for the creation of the file inside the package?
<slytherin> Can someone please give back ant?
<Arby> sebner: ready
<persia> no0tic: The debdiff is responsible for determining the changes between Debian and Ubuntu.  This may include additional files.
<sebner> Arby: ok. look at the LP kdevelop page and and debian changelog. Tell me what changes you have to apply
<no0tic> persia, ok, if you have time, please take a look at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/criticalmass/+bug/229260
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 229260 in criticalmass "Please merge criticalmass 1.0.0-1.2 (universe) from Debian unstable" [Undecided,In progress]
<slytherin> Hobbsee: Can you please give back ant? :-)
<sebner> persia: you may forgot to upload uqm?
<persia> sebner: Not forgotten, just not gotten to sponsoring anything recently.
<persia> no0tic: At first glance, that looks better.  I'd need to test to be sure.
<Arby> sebner: it seems to be the conflicts in the REPORT file and one other patch kubuntu_01_fix_missing_output.diff
<sebner> persia: ah ok. was just wondering because we talked about the changelog some hours ago :)
<sebner> Arby: -.- it's better to use DaD. I trust DaD more than MoM.
<Arby> sebner: actually the patch has been moved upstream on a second look
<sebner> Arby: yep
<Arby> sebner: looking at DaD
<JIan_Luo> hi everyone, I just MV myself to JIan_Luo from Jerry :) It seems there is a name collision.
<Arby> sebner: DaD doesn't seem to report conflicts in the same way, where can I find that information?
<sebner> Arby: shouldn't be one. let's continue
<sebner> Arby: so what changes do you have to apply?
<Arby> sebner: I don't know, I usually get that from the conflicts
<sebner> Arby: well. Look at the LP kdevelop site
<sebner> Arby: https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/kdevelop
<sebner> Arby: there are the latest changelog entries
<Arby> reading
<Arby> sebner: remove kubuntu_01_fix_missing_output.diff patch some build deps to check
<sebner> Arby: Dad removed it already. but yes. check the build depends
<Arby> and I think there is kubuntu_01_svn_724231_qmake.diff to add
<Arby> I don't think that one has made it upstream
<sebner> Arby: if it's still possible, yes
<Arby> sebner: how do I know if it's possible
<ryanakca> to build an intrepid chroot on Hardy, I need to install the intrepid debootstrap?
<sebner> Arby: argh. sry. I mean necessary
<sebner> ryanakca: no. it is in hardy backports
<ryanakca> sebner: thanks
<Arby> sebner: "kubuntu_01_fix_missing_output.diff" is still present in debian/patches but kubuntu_01_svn_724231_qmake.diff has been removed
<Arby> I assume that means the second one is no longer necessary
<Arby> sebner: and the first should be removed as it is redundant, correct?
<sebner> Arby: keep in mind that DaD didn't any changes automatically so you have to check
<Arby> sebner: I thought I just did, I'm missing something here
<Arby> sebner: I'm comfortable that fix_missing_output is redundant so should be removed
<Arby> if the svn patch is still relevant why would it be absent
<Arby> sebner: shouldn't it still be present in the source files
<sebner> Arby: no you shouldn't remove the fix_missing patch
<sebner> Arby: debian took our patch, not upstream
<sebner> Arby: for the svn patch. You have to check if it's still necessary of it's fixed now upstream since it's a new upstream version
<Arby> sebner: I don't understand. That means that there are 2 patches that do the same thing in debian/patches
<sebner> Arby: doing the same? which ones?
<Arby> sebner: 02_fix_build_output_view.diff  kubuntu_01_fix_missing_output.diff
<Arby> sebner: from the changelog that seems to be the same thing
<Arby> sebner: http://paste.ubuntu.com/11428/ sounds the same to me, am I wrong?
<sebner> Arby: seems so but keep it for now. Let's start with debian/control
<Arby> sebner: for the build-deps I took the debian versions
<sebner> Arby: why?
<Arby> because I was always advised to favour debian changes
<sebner> Arby: true but I think we want to keep our ones.
<Arby> sebner: ok
<Arby> changing back
<sebner> Arby: I'm checking the patches stuff
<sebner> Arby: argh. sry. how far are you?
<Arby> looking through debian changelogs trying to find what this svn patch is actually for
<Arby> changed the build-deps to the ubuntu versions and other bits in debian/control
<Arby> sebner: Maintainer names, Standards Version etc
<sebner> Arby: just adjust the Maintainer and the build.depends. nothing else
<sebner> Arby: We don't want to introduce new changes if they are not necessary
<Arby> sebner: but Debian have increased the standards version 3.7.2 -> 3.7.3
<Arby> shouldn't that be included
<sebner> Arby: ah. ok then. sry
<sebner> Arby: now check if the svn patch is still necessary. It may was included in the new upstream version
<Arby> sebner: I have http://paste.ubuntu.com/11431/ the rest of debian/control is unchanged
<Arby> sebner: I can't find any mention of it outside debian/changelog
<Arby> or what it does.
<sebner> Arby: maybe. kdevelop bugtracking system
<Arby> looking
<sebner> Arby: hmm not necessary since it's also not in 3.5.1-0ubuntu1
<Arby> sebner: doh, I should have thought of that :)
<Arby> right, is that the patches done? what next?
<sebner> Arby: AFAIK you also have to readd the ubuntu changelog entries
<Arby> sebner: there are only those 2 and we've dealt with them
<Arby> the others have all gone into debian
<sebner> Arby: Yeah but you have to readd all of them
<sebner> Arby: a tipp. take the changelog from the latest ubuntu package and add the missing debian ones. is a lot faster ;)
<Arby> sebner: noted thanks, as far as I can see all the kubuntu patches have gone into debian bar the two we have discussed
<sebner> Arby: yep
<Arby> sebner: I think debian/control is sorted now at least until we get to testbuilding. what now?
<sebner> Arby: if you have finished with debian/changelog run debuild -S -sa -us -uc
<sebner> and debdiff then
<Arby> sebner: ok just need to tidy up changelog
<sebner> k
<slytherin> sebner: what is us and uc option?
<sebner> slytherin: so you don't sign it with you key
<sebner> with the openpgp key
<sebner> not necessary here
<slytherin> sebner: what difference does it make anyway? When submitting debdiff it will be finally signed by someone else.
<sebner> slytherin: true but it's useless
<sebner> slytherin: so you don't have to type your password twice ,.. just a waste of time
<slytherin> sebner: I use seahorse for password caching. :-)
<sebner> slytherin: ^^
 * slytherin time for dinner
<Arby> sebner: done, debdiff new_debian new_ubuntu still gives me 1.2M debdiff, is that acceptable?
<sebner> Arby: no really. post it somewhere
<Arby> sebner: just for my information, what is the upper limit of 'too big' approximately?
<Arby> a few kb could be 50kb or 900kb
<sebner> Arby: few are 10-50
<Arby> sebner: http://launchpadlibrarian.net/14450924/kdevelop_3.5.1-1ubuntu1.debdiff
<Arby> only place I could put it sorry
<Arby> sebner: the MoM report file shows other conflicts that we haven't touched. Am I supposed to just ignore those?
<sebner> Arby: what conflicts?
<sebner> Arby: you debdiff still seems to be b0rken
<Arby> sebner: http://paste.ubuntu.com/11436/
<Arby> sebner: br0ken in what way?
<Jazzva> Arby: Please adjust content type to be text/plain, so it can be easily previewed in browser. You can do that by clicking "edit" in the left menu, next to the file page.
<sebner> Arby: on LP. I changed it to "it's a patch". now it displays correct. Let me take a look
<Arby> Jazzva: ok noted
<sebner> Arby: well. I think you can remove everything except the changes of debian/control and debian/changelog from the debdiff
<Arby> sebner: what criteria do I use to make that decision for myself in the future?
<Arby> i.e. how do you know that's a safe thing to do
<sebner> Arby: well there are that big changes because 1) some things are autogenerated 2) ubuntu packaged the version and so we have differences.
<sebner> Arby: but we want to have the debian version we just apply the changes what are really necessary
<Arby> hmm, sounds like something you have to 'just know'.
<sebner> Arby: in case you don't know, just ask here
<Arby> sebner: all I have left in debdiff now is http://paste.ubuntu.com/11437/
<Arby> does that look ok to you?
<Arby> it's 11k now
<sebner> Arby: upgraded build-depends kdelibs4-dev, libcvsservice-dev 4:3.5.8 -> 4:3.5.9
<sebner>   <-- did you do that or debian?
<Arby> I did that, we discussed earlier
<Arby> I took debians build deps and you said to keep ours
<Arby> sebner: those are what was different
<pochu> Arby: you can put the Homepage just once in the source stanza
<sebner> Arby: then you don't have to mention that ;) You should mention the python and the other thing you changed
<pochu> Arby: in fact it's already there, so remove the ones from the descriptions
<sebner> pochu: Yeah. pochu helps me.
 * sebner hugs pochu 
 * pochu hugs sebner back :)
<Arby> slow down folks :)
<sebner> Arby: btw. I'm no MOTU, pochu is ;)
<Arby> sebner: you've lost me on the changelog
<sebner> Arby: I thought it's clear *g*. Just ask if you are not sure
<pochu> Arby: now dpkg understands a Homepage field in the source stanza, so you don't need to put it in the description.
<Arby> sebner: why do I not record those differences? I thought that was the point
<LaserJock> anybody here know of to flush the disk cache?
<Arby> sebner: no, not that the build deps
<sebner> Arby: you have to mention everything you change in you changelog entry
<Arby> sebner: yes and the versions of those library packages are different in ubuntu than debian
<Arby> so I thought I should note that
<Arby> am I wrong
<sebner> Arby: yes but we go back to the debian version so it's ok and you just have to mention the remaining ubuntu changes
<Arby> that seems odd but fair enough
<sebner> Arby: DaD somebody ***** up the package
<sebner> Arby: We have the debian version. and normally you only have to change the python and the other thing. That's what you have to mention
<Jazzva> Hey, pochu... Care to look at tracker debdiff? It's not big :)
<Arby> sebner: the other thing?
<sebner> Arby: Upgrade build-deps to libdb4.6-dev, python2.5
<pochu> Jazzva: yeah, I'll have a look if no main sponsor does it before :) although they will have to look at it anyway, as I can't upload it ;)
<Arby> oh that thing ok
<Jazzva> pochu: OK, it's bug 225499. I thought it might be easier for them to approve it, if they see a comment from MOTU and previous uploader :). Thanks for your help with these merges.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 225499 in ksimus "Please sync ksimus from Debian unstable to intrepid" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/225499
<Jazzva> ugh
<Jazzva> bug 229146
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 229146 in tracker "Please merge tracker 0.6.6-1 from Debian unstable" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/229146
<Arby> sebner, pochu: http://paste.ubuntu.com/11442/ <-- that ok with you two before I upload it
<pochu> Jazzva: I'll probably review it and ask either seb128 or pitti to sponsor it, as they have touched the package before too
<pochu> Arby: you are still adding those Homepage fields in the description... you can remove that delta :)
<Jazzva> pochu: Ok... I'll be off for a while, another voting here in Serbia...
<Arby> pochu: ok apart from that?
<pochu> Arby: and you are still upgrading the kdelibs4-dev and libcvsservice b-d. If you are keeping that delta, mention it in the changelog
<sebner> Arby: and you changelog entry should be http://paste.ubuntu.com/11444/
<sebner> pochu: they shouldn't be keept
<sebner> *kept
 * Arby <- lost again
<pochu> well I don't know that as I haven't looked closely at it and I don't know why they are different
<Arby> one person says keep that one says don't
<sebner> ^^
<sebner> Arby: the best is to ask the last uploader
<pochu> Arby: I say, either keep it and mention it in the changelog, or don't keep it and don't mention it in the changelog
<pochu> Arby: right now you are keeping it, but don't mention it, which isn't fine
<RainCT> uhm.. PPA's have become fast :)
<sebner> pochu: it's horrible to package at our own and then go back to debian -.-
<sebner> RainCT: sounds great :)
<Arby> I'll check with the last uploader and see what he says
<sebner> Arby: maybe I/we confused you. always better to talk with the last uploader, especially in such cases
<Arby> sebner: I think I'm just finding all the things that aren't/can't be written down anywhere because they're different for every package
<Arby> there seems to be an awful lot you have to just know
<sebner> Arby: don't worry. you'll learn :)
<ScottK> Arby: This is also why all changes must be documented in debian/changelog.  It makes it much more possible for someone else to pick up and continue.
<ScottK> It's also why there is value in the same person getting first crack at a merge.  They know what needs to be done usually.
<sebner> ScottK: maybe it's also not that good to start with kdevelop or something similar
<Arby> ScottK: I asked the previous uploader before I started
<Arby> and he said fine
<ScottK> Arby: Which is a good practice (the asking) that I try to encourage.
<sebner> Arby: that only means that it's ok for him, not that's an easy one
<Arby> sebner: fair point but I have done other simpler ones previously that were successful
<Arby> this was just the first debdiff that I'd had rejected
<sebner> Arby: well, also the encoding was somehow b0rken
<Arby> not sure why that was
<Arby> could be me not using launchpad properly
<Arby> sebner: thanks for you patience, it's much appreciated
<Arby> *your
 * Arby goes off to do something less stressful for a while
<sebner> Arby: np. I'm now universe-contributor so I should know some things ^^. No, I remember when I started.. So np and keep up you work
<no0tic> :) is good to hear that, I think to be stressful too, with all my questions :)
<ryanakca> I'm attempting to merge 'john', however, I'm unsure about some of the differences in the rules file. Do I stick to the Ubuntu changes, or the Debian changes? (Default achetecture/etc)... http://paste.ubuntu.com/11461/
<ryanakca> Also, why can't I 'grab-merge.sh kio-apt' ? It complains about not being able to read REPORT, and it doesn't download anything...
<LaserJock> ryanakca: you might want to ask the Debian maintainer and/or Ubuntu person who did the changes
<ryanakca> LaserJock: ok, thanks :)
<ryanakca> LaserJock: and a more general packaging question. If the Depends includes debhelper (>= 4.1.0), can I bump it up to the current debhelper version, or once again, check?
<LaserJock> hmm
<LaserJock> unless you actually need a new debhelper version I'd probably leave it
<ryanakca> ok, thanks :)
<zul> do do do
<LaserJock> zul: dubey dowah
<zul> hey LaserJock how goes it?
<LaserJock> oh, alright
<LaserJock> trying to do redo my bzr linux tree performance testing for the 3rd time
<ryanakca> Whats the component of http://packages.debian.org/sid/kiosktool ? (kde) ?
<zul> LaserJock: sounds like fun im just watching tv and hoping Liam doesnt wake up
<LaserJock> ryanakca: what do you mean by component?
<ryanakca> LaserJock: whatever is ment by https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/Merging?action=show&redirect=Merging#head-32f94fb74efce0c3a0123e984fc5292245272e32 ... I'm trying to file a merge bug for it
<ryanakca> s/ment/meant/g   .... and sorry for the long link, ;)
<LaserJock> ryanakca: that'd be the Debian component
<LaserJock> ryanakca: check on packages.qa.debian.org/k/kiosktool.html
<ryanakca> LaserJock: thanks :)
<LaserJock> should be "main"
<pochu> bah, exaile's upstream ships a debian/ folder...
<LaserJock> pochu: is it a good one?
<pochu> LaserJock: haven't looked at it as we already have one, why?
<LaserJock> it might be useful
<LaserJock> sometimes upstreams do a good job with debian/
<LaserJock> it's a shame to just toss it
<ryanakca> ok, while that one is building, anybody know why 'grab-merges.sh kio-apt' fails? Its listed on MoM.
<pochu> LaserJock: heh, looks up-to-date, they even have a PPA: https://edge.launchpad.net/~exaile-devel/+archive
<pochu> and they take care of fixes in old releases too :)
<LaserJock> ryanakca: works here
<ryanakca> LaserJock: hmm... http://paste.ubuntu.com/11467/ ... *tries in a new directory*...
<pochu> hmm, they are packaging exaile as a native package...
<pochu> so if I can convince them to not do that, we are all done :-)
<emgent> heya people
<LaserJock> hi emgent
<no0tic> anyone willing to sponsor/take a look to a merge? :) https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/criticalmass/+bug/229260
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 229260 in criticalmass "Please merge criticalmass 1.0.0-1.2 (universe) from Debian unstable" [Wishlist,Confirmed]
<pochu> LaserJock: exaile's upstream copied our debian/ dir
<geser> no0tic: I would use the new Homepage field and not put it into the description
<no0tic> geser, Homepage: in debian/control ?
<geser> yes
<no0tic> geser, ok, I'm changing it
<pochu> bah, so our exaile diff.gz is a diff against upstream's debian/, which is a copy of our old debian/ ...
<LaserJock> :-)
<pochu> but Debian is repackaging and our diff to their debian/ dir is large...
<pochu> so I think I'm going to do as less changes as possible wrt our latest version in the archive, and ask upstream to stop shipping debian/ dir in their tarball (and use diff.gz for their PPA)
<pochu> and then see if I can get our changes into Debian
<ryanakca> In a chroot for building, I should install build-essential, correct?
<LaserJock> sure
<LaserJock> usually you can pass the --variant=buildd to debootstrap to do that
<ryanakca> LaserJock: ok, thanks. *should probably update the SbuildLVMHowto with that*...
<LaserJock> oh
<LaserJock> I think it already does that
<ryanakca> well, it didn't for intrepid... :( ... however, I don't seem to remember having to do that for Hardy... Has anything changed since then?
<LaserJock> not sure
<no0tic> geser, done
<penper> where can I find information on the available categories?
<penper> (available in deb packages I mean)
<LaserJock> penper: http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-archive.html#s-subsections
<penper> aha thanks
<penper> hmm, how do I make my deb package set up menu shortcuts? Is it something you configure in the control file or is it something you add to the filesystem?
<LaserJock> what do you mean by menu shortcuts?
<penper> the ones in the gnome-panel menu, e.g. Applications -> Games -> MyGame
<LaserJock> ah
<LaserJock> that is done with .desktop files
<penper> aha okey. Where can I find info on them?
<LaserJock> penper: http://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/Specifications/menu-spec and http://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/Specifications/desktop-entry-spec
<penper> LaserJock: thanks again :)
<norsetto> howdy
<emgent> heya norsetto :)
<ryanakca> I've merged kiosktool. However, the debdiff between the merged version and the Debian version is 1.7M, the Ubuntu version being 1.6K. Is that normal?
 * ryanakca waves to norsetto 
<norsetto> emgent: @/
<emgent> hahah
<emgent> left harm ?
 * norsetto has an headache today ....
<emgent> s/harm/arm/
<norsetto> emgent: always!
<LaserJock> ryanakca: what are the versions  you're debdiffing?
<ryanakca> LaserJock: Old Ubuntu version 1.0-1.1ubuntu6 vs. new Ubuntu version 1.0-2ubuntu1. Old Debian version 1.0-2 vs. new Ubuntu version
<ryanakca> the new Ubuntu version is the version of the merge... it has three small patches, a slightly different changelog and a slightly different control file....
<ryanakca> imho, that's all that should be in the Debian vs. Ubuntu debdiff
<LaserJock> ryanakca: well, look at the diff and see if anything looks funny
<pochu> or do a debdiff old new | diffstat
<pochu> and see where's the problem
<ryanakca> pochu: looks like a bunch of changes in po/
<norsetto> hi ryanakca
<norsetto> ryanakca: you can safely delete translations in your debdiff when seeking sponsorship
<ryanakca> norsetto: Is there an easy way to do that, or do I need to go in by hand?
<norsetto> ryanakca: by hand shouldn't be too difficult. I do remember an utility (something like diffedit or similar) that could be used. You can also use filterdiff
<Jazzva> norsetto: I'm done with the gnome-mplayer. It works ok. I will test-build gecko-mediaplayer and then upload both to the bug reports. Will let you know when all is done.
<norsetto> jazzva: ok, was everything ok with the new sources?
<norsetto> jazzva: (hint)pay particular attention to some of upstream changes
<Jazzva> norsetto: Yes. We still need the patch you provided in gnome-mplayer. I just remade it, because of other changes to the patched file.
<Jazzva> norsetto: Such as?
<norsetto> jazzva: hmmmm, have you checked them?
<ryanakca> norsetto: as well as Makefile.in ?
<norsetto> ryanakca: was it changed during the merge?
<McRib> I submitted bug #228044 a few days ago and the replies seem to suggest it has been fixed.  How do I get the working package installed (using apt still has the bug)?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 228044 in mplayerplug-in "In Hardy, mozilla-mplayer depends on firefox-3.0 - does not accept firefox-2" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/228044
<ryanakca> norsetto: no
<norsetto> McRib: that was fixed for intrepid, an sru is being processed to have the fix available in hardy
<Jazzva> norsetto: Yes, I took a look at the diff between the current one in the archives, and the new upstream. Mostly changes to po files, some changes to the source code, and the rest are changes to the build files.
<McRib> norsetto: Ah.  Is there a way to just download the .so and install it manually?
<norsetto> McRib: as soon as is available in hardy-updates (I hope tomorrow) pls. test it and report to the bug if the problem is fixed
<ryanakca> norsetto: 35000 lines of translations and fluff only in patch2: unchanged:
<norsetto> jazzva: look again, there are some changes which needs to be reflected in the packaging (for both packages)
<McRib> norsetto: I will do so.  Thanks for the update :P
<norsetto> McRib: np
 * norsetto didn't even have time to correct hardy-updates to hardy-proposed
<Jazzva> norsetto: I noticed the new doc file in gnome-mplayer, updated the homepage links in debian/. Also, I think that I should change the libxul-dev to firefox-dev for gecko-mediaplayer.
<Jazzva> I'll take another look, just to be sure
<norsetto> jazzva: yes pls, there is more
<norsetto> jazzva: as well as a couple of bugs in the upstream packaging which perhaps somebody already reported and who knows, maybe a fix is already available in the svn ....
<Jazzva> norsetto: upstream packaging?
<norsetto> Jazzva: yes
<Jazzva> norsetto: But they don't provide debian packaging. You mean the build system they use?
<norsetto> jazzva: the tarball its the upstream packaging, usually made with a specific target in upstream Makefile(s)
<Jazzva> norsetto: Ah, ok...
<norsetto> ryanakca: are you sure Makefile.in has not been changed by Debian or upstream? Otherwise it should not be in the debdiff, pls. check again
 * ryanakca does wish people wouldn't make inline patches
 * norsetto heartily agrees with ryanakca
<no0tic> why some packages that seem to need a merge/sync from debian are not listed in MoM? I'm referring to roundcube, for example
<RainCT> man.. damn kernel :P
<RainCT> (sorry for spamming, but I had to say it :P)
<norsetto> no0tic: why should it be listed? There is no ubuntu delta
<no0tic> norsetto, so in that case we simply copy the package from sid, right?
<norsetto> no0tic: yes, its done automatically until debian-import-freeze
<no0tic> norsetto, I'm just trying to figure out how the whole thing works
<no0tic> norsetto, thanks
<norsetto> no0tic: de nada
<no0tic> norsetto, so let me try to synthetize: we have three cases: 1) ubuntu delta, changes already imported in the new package version in sid -> sync 2) ubuntu delta not applied to sid package -> merge 3) no ubuntu delta -> automatic import
<no0tic> *summarize :)
<norsetto> no0tic: case 1) also includes when the ubuntu delta should be dropped (for whatever reason)
<no0tic> norsetto, yes, I forgot that
<norsetto> no0tic: sometime you may want to make a sync even if there are still ubuntu changes, for instance, suppose we did few changes in ubuntu, including some small ones, like bumping the standard version. If debian includes the ubuntu changes, but leave out this small changes, its usually not worth keeping a delta, so we just drop them and sync
<no0tic> norsetto, can you explain me what "standard version" is?
<norsetto> no0tic: its the version of the debian policy which applies to the package
<norsetto> no0tic: there is a field in debian/control which specifies it (called Standards-Version IIRC)
<no0tic> norsetto, yes, I noticed that field and found packages where this field changed in debian
 * norsetto really recommend to read and study the current debian policy
<no0tic> norsetto, but I wasn't sure what it meant
<ryanakca> can I still request a sync if some of the Depends haven't been merged/sync'd into Ubuntu yet (but they exist Debian & Ubuntu Hardy)?
<norsetto> ryanakca: what do you mean? That they haven't yet been built or something else?
<ryanakca> norsetto: ok, nevermind, it's just because I haven't enabled universe in my chroot. I thought it was because the updated Debian version hadn't been pulled in :)
<sebner> gn8 folks :)
<Jazzva> norsetto: I haven't found too much errors in gnome-mplayer. They are shipping binary language files po/*.gmo, but they're also shipped in the archives. I noticed one typo "nonemtpy" in build files, which were generated automatically. I checked the contents of the resulting deb, and everything seem to be installed at the right place.
<no0tic> apachelogger, may I take care of pokerth?
<apachelogger> no0tic: sure
<no0tic> apachelogger, ok
<norsetto> Jazzva: even though its not ideal, the gmo files are ok, since the po (the preferred form of modification) are provided
<norsetto> Jazzva: I found the following:
<norsetto> 1) Document Keyboard Shortcuts in file DOCS/keyboard_shortcuts.txt
<norsetto> This I understand you did (including it in debian/docs)
<Jazzva> yep
<norsetto> Jazzva: 2) Fix install code so that gnome-mplayer.schema is properly installed when installing from source
<norsetto> Jazzva: this needs checking, since it was broken what I did with the old package may not work anymore
<norsetto> Jazzva: 3) add commandline option "--disablefullscreen", which disables all fullscreen options
<Jazzva> 2) You did that in previous rules. It installs to /usr/share/gconf/schemas/
<norsetto> Jazzva: yes, it needs to be checked if it still works with the change mdae upstream
<Jazzva> norsetto: It is still installed to /usr/share/gconf/schemas/
<norsetto> Jazzva: for 3), this needs to be added to debian/gnome-mplayer.1
<norsetto> Jazzva: 4) there is a new check in configure.in: AC_CHECK_HEADERS([mntent.h])
<norsetto> Jazzva: did you check if we have to add a Build-Depends?
<norsetto> jazzva: 5) upstream website changed to "http://code.google.com/p/gnome-mplayer/" this needs to be changed in watch, copyright and control
<Jazzva> norsetto: No, I didn't. I thought mntent was provided by them.
<Jazzva> norsetto: Ok, 5 is done. I need to do 3.
<norsetto> jazzva: then there would not be a need to add a configure check
<Jazzva> norsetto: Ok, I'll do that.
<norsetto> Jazzva: re 5) also for debian/control?
<Jazzva> yep
<norsetto> Jazzva: good
<norsetto> jazzva: 6) upstream added two new source files, did you check if the license and copyright are ok?
<Jazzva> norsetto: Oh, I see.. they're missing headers. I'll send an e-mail upstream, to ask about this.
<norsetto> jazzva: well, check if this hasn't been reported already by any chance
<Jazzva> norsetto: It wasn't reported on their homepage
<norsetto> Jazzva: hmmm, don't they have a bug tracker?
<Jazzva> I checked for open bugs on their page, there is one open bug
<norsetto> jazzva: well, maybe its closed already
<Jazzva> norsetto: Oh, you reported it, and it was closed.
<Jazzva> marked as fixed
<norsetto> jazzva: right, so, what about patching those source files with the changes as provided in the SVN?
<Jazzva> norsetto: Ok.
<norsetto> jazzva: for gecko-mediaplayer:
<norsetto> Jazzva: 1) same issue for the gconf.schema
<norsetto> Jazzva: 2) same issue for the new upstream website
<norsetto> Jazzva: 3) did you see in the ChangeLog that they added a file: DOCS/tech/javascript.txt ?
<Jazzva> norsetto: I still have to take another look at that one.
<Jazzva> norsetto: 3 - I noticed it's missing
<Jazzva> Well, the whole DOCS folder with that one file
<norsetto> jazzva: right, so, again, check with upstream
<norsetto> Jazzva: perhaps some sob already reported it
<norsetto> Jazzva: one last thing, we should change the Depends from the metapackage to firefox-3.0 | firefox-2
<norsetto> jazzva: this is a new change, to be compatible with FF 2 (as for mozilla-mplayer)
<Jazzva> Right...
<norsetto> Jazzva: it would be good if an sru is made with this change alone btw
<Jazzva> Ok, I'll prepare one :).
<norsetto> jazzva: :-)
<norsetto> jazzva: once you are happy, build and check if everything looks ok, install (check if the schema files are installed correctly) and check if everything is working, ok?
<Jazzva> norsetto: Ok. I'll report to you tomorrow afternoon. I'm going to sleep now, have to get some rest for school and work :).
<norsetto> Jazzva: thx, you are doing great! A remaining concern I have is if it will work with gcc-4.3, we may need to patch and eventually report upstream
<Jazzva> norsetto: Thanks :).
<norsetto> jazzva: btw, do we have a formal team which is looking at mozilla extensions?
<Jazzva> norsetto: Yes, mozilla-extensions-dev.
 * norsetto checks
<norsetto> Jazzva: I think it will be a good idea to add gecko-mediaplayer to the list, you may also want to change maintainership
<Jazzva> Ok, I'll check with asac tomorrow :).
<Jazzva> I'm off now. See you later...
<norsetto> Jazzva: the only problem is that this goes hand-in-hand with gnome-mplayer, which would not pertain to that list
<norsetto> Jazzva: ok, good night then
<Jazzva> norsetto: Sorry... Can we talk about that tomorrow :)?
<norsetto> Jazzva: its already tomorrow :-)
<Jazzva> norsetto: I still call it today until I go to bed, and tomorrow starts when I wake up. Can't get rid of that habit. I have it for a long time.
<Jazzva> :)
<norsetto> g'night all
<dabaR> Octopus: foreach(array('bl', 'ah', 'stuff') as $field_name){ if($_POST[$field_name])...}
#ubuntu-motu 2009-05-08
<abin> hello everyone
<abin> I am new here.
<mariuz> anyone here expert with stack protection ?
<mariuz> hello
<mariuz> how do i know if a c++ package is compiled with stack protection ? or is on for all packages :mysql , firebird ...
<jpds> mariuz: kees ^^
<jpds> mariuz: Or you can: objdump -CR /usr/bin/program | grep chk
<mariuz> ok , i try to find if is stack protection on firebird2.1 related packages
<mariuz> for flamerobin is on objdump -CR /usr/bin/flamerobin | grep chk
<jpds> There should be something like: "__stack_chk_fai" I think
<mariuz> objdump -CR /usr/lib/firebird/2.1/bin/fbserver | grep chk , I got it 083da28c R_386_JUMP_SLOT   __stack_chk_fail
<mariuz> thanks so it's on
<abin> can someone show me how to join motu in launchpad
<jpds> mariuz: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/CompilerFlags#-fstack-protector
<jpds> abin: You can't just join, see: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/GettingStarted
<DktrKranz> #!/usr/bin/make -f
<abin> who can introduce  me a easy-use IRC client. i am using chatzilla
<directhex> smuxi?
<abin> ??
<highvoltage> irssi
<artfwo> pidgin
<abin> in windows?
<directhex> irc clients for windows are a little off-topic
<abin> sorry but i install ubuntu in vmware, ok i stop
<Pici> abin: If you just want to chat about Ubuntu you can join #ubuntu-offtopic
<abin> no i am in MOTU i use vmware because i cannot get touch to US internet without windows. I a Chinese
<lidaobing> abin, you can try #ubuntu-cn
<abin> ok thanks
<abin> you chinese?'
<lidaobing> abin, yes
<abin> You now in Chinese?
<lidaobing> abin, if you want talk, go to #ubuntu-cn, not here
<abin> æ©
<directhex> why is "dpkg-buildpackage" using a different GPG key to "debsign"?
<directhex> or to "gpg" as it happens
<james_w> directhex: do you have DEBSIGN_KEYID set in your devscripts.conf?
<directhex> james_w, yeah. everything behaves as it shuold except dpkg-buildpackage
<bddebian> Heya gang
<james_w> well dpkg-buildpackage doesn't use that file
<james_w> hey bddebian
<bddebian> Hi james_w
<directhex> i think i see the problem
<porthose> james_w directhex: congrats ! ;-)
<james_w> thanks porthose
<directhex> porthose, thanks
<bddebian> What'd I miss, have james_w and directhex taken over the world? :)
<savvas> any motu to review http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/gnote ?
<directhex> bddebian, yes
<bddebian> w00t
<directhex> free ice cream for everyone
<savvas> cool, congratulations! :)
<directhex> except microsoft employees. they only get bread & water
<james_w> time bzr branch lp:~james-w/ubuntu/karmic/ssss/karmic
<james_w> 4.681 total
<james_w> time apt-get source ssss
<james_w> 4.627 total
<bddebian> w00t congrats guys :)
<james_w> almost there...
<lamothe> pkern: Given up on Me TV?
<lifeless> james_w: format?
<hyperair> jpds: you around?
<james_w> lifeless: development-rich-root
<lifeless> scchweeet
<james_w> lifeless: a few more runs show that bzr doesn't get much quicker than that, but apt can get down to 1.5 seconds on some runs
<lifeless> james_w: run with -Dhpss
<james_w> there's ~0.5s ssh overhead there
<lifeless> I wager a fair chunk of that is ssh connections
<lifeless> be interesting to toss a master ssh connection up to b.l.n
<james_w> just did that
<james_w> ~3.8s
<jpds> hyperair: Hello.
<hyperair> jpds: well hello there.
<hyperair> jpds: may i make my changes to your package directly in svn?
<jpds> hyperair: Yes.
<hyperair> okay
<hyperair> another thing..
<hyperair> did you have anything dh7 specific?
<hyperair> i don't see anything, but you've used a dh >= 7 b-d and compat leel 7
<hyperair> level*
<jpds> No, but I like latest stuff.
<pkern> lamothe: Did I miss something?  Currently, yes.  Had some slowness trouble with it again and used kaffeine in the meantime.  (Which doesn't deactivate gnome-screensaver in jaunty, bah.)
<hyperair> jpds: may i lower it? or would you prefer to keep it at 7?
<pkern> lamothe: And I'm also incredibly busy.  If I missed some sponsoring request please resend it.
<hyperair> jpds: it doesn't look like you use anything above 5.
<jpds> hyperair: Don't mind really.
<hyperair> alright
<hyperair> and... i should shift everything into debian/
<artfwo> is there some kind of checklist for the differences between debhelper 5, 6 and 7?
<jpds> artfwo: man debhelper
<jpds> artfwo: Look for "Debhelper compatibility levels".
<artfwo> jpds: it's not complete, it does not mention dh_lintian for instance
<jpds> hyperair: Whatever makes it work.
<lamothe> pkern: Yeah, I sent it 1 month ago ... but figured you were busy.
<lamothe> pkern: Of course I've had a few updates since then.  So I'll package those up and send them onto you.
<lamothe> pkern: "slowness" ... like the UI not responding?
 * hyperair feels a little awkward reviewing a MOTU's package
<jpds> hyperair: It worked fine when I packaged it, so *shrug*
<hyperair> hmm
<artfwo> by the way, if anyone feels like reviewing a package, please check http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/scantailor :) thanks!
<lamothe> pkern: There's an issue with the sqlite3 version in Jaunty, it's very slow.  I have put in a Jaunty specific fix where I use a separate thread to persist data.
<hyperair> jpds: W: tomboy-latex source: timewarp-standards-version (2009-01-11 < 2009-03-12)
<hyperair> jpds: i hope you don't mind me changing the timestamp of your changelog entry
<jpds> hyperair: Yeah, update it for today, didn't see that when I packaged it..
<hyperair> course you didn't. the Standards-Version was still 3.8.0.1 at that time
<kees> mariuz: sounds like your question got answered, but yes, everything in Ubuntu is compiled with stack protection.  objdump -CR works, though I tend to use readelf -s
<mariuz> kees : thanks good to know , i check now every binary to see if is enabled
<kees> mariuz: what are you trying to determine?
<mariuz> There are some issues with udf functions with firebird2.1 classic , i try to solve this bug https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/firebird2.1/+bug/363694
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 363694 in firebird2.1 "firebird 2.1 compiled without stack protector, so UDF dlopen failed" [Undecided,In progress]
<mariuz> i checked the supper server and seems to be compiled with stack protector enabled by default , now i'm at the firebird-classic part
<kees> mariuz: it's not clear to me what the actual bug is -- what doesn't actually work?
<mariuz> i think in the end both firebird and user defined functions should be compiled with stack protector
<mariuz> for this user it seems that his udf works only if he compiles with no-stack-protector , and he says firebird classic is compiled without stack protection
<mariuz> so i thnk all binaries should be compiled with that enabled right ?
<mariuz> in the end i want to clarify for all users if they want to create their own UDF libraries
<jeki> Can anyone look at this report? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/app-install-data-ubuntu/+bug/368580
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 368580 in app-install-data-ubuntu "aMule should be offered instead of aMule AdunanzA" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<kees> mariuz: it shouldn't matter since __stack_chk_fail is defined by glibc.
<jpds> jeki: Please don't message different channels with the same thing.
<mariuz> ok i will close it then
<kees> mariuz: since I am unfamiliar with firebird, can you adjust the bug report with specific steps to take to see the problem?
<jpds> jeki: If you need general bug help, #ubuntu-bugs would be the place to start.
<directhex> so... how do i ack a sync request then?
<maco> directhex: upstream says "not gnote's bug if tomboy crashes" even though gnote's the one writing incompatible files
<directhex> maco, okay. so it's official, gnote is not compatible with tomboy, is that what i'm to infer?
<mariuz> kees: i will try to create one udf and then I will check if it works
<directhex> maco, adding a try{}catch{} to tomboy to not crash is easy (but may impact performance). how much work should go into tomboy to work around idiotic flaws in an aggressive fork?
<directhex> savvas, drop any mention of tomboy compatibility, by the looks of it
<savvas> it just mentions it's a port of Tomboy in C++
<maco> directhex: take a look at the bug http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=581844
<ubottu> Gnome bug 581844 in main "System.DateTime implementation produces timestamps incompatible with Tomboy" [Major,Unconfirmed]
<directhex> maco, so i see. WONTFIX.
<maco> i'm going to attempt to argue that interoperability = good
<maco> and so at least be a *compatible* fork
<maco> directhex: i dont think i like that guy's attitude
<directhex> maco, don't get me started, i might upset someone
<maco> heh
<jdong> directhex: meh if someone gets upset then you are not the one with the problem ;-)
<jdong> would it really kill them to output a compatible timestamp?
<directhex> jdong, with great MOTU hat comes great responsibility
<maco> being told "hey, you're breaking this already-well-established-format" and replying with essentially "too bad. i don't care"?  that's the part where you're supposed to go "oh? really? crud...uh....*hack*"
<directhex> jdong, yes. doing that would enable people switching to tomboy
<jdong> directhex: *gasp* the horror.
<jdong> but mo*NO*!
 * jdong dies a little inside
<maco> heh i had a question on one of my finals that was "explain why service-oriented architectures should be based on standards" and i put down that from the customer/user who wants options' perspective they should be, but from the perspective of the provider who doesn't want to lose marketshare, standards are evil
<jdong> exactly
<directhex> standards prevent lock-in. that's the *point* of standards
<directhex> you know, ECMA 335 is a standard.....
<maco> i also put down "and sometimes a company will come along and realise that there are people who really really want standards and are willing to pay if you are committed to standards, and then they can market to that niche and hope that recommendations will give them popularity"
<directhex> and fancy hats
<savvas> well the author of gnote says in the readme file "as close as possible to the original"
<maco> i'm thinking of things like how all us silly fossy people switched from twitter to identi.ca, where we can then export *all* our data as xml
<savvas> no promise of compatibility :P
<maco> well seeing as it's 100% possible for them to be exactly the same on timestamps...
<maco> he's missing "as close as possible" by a bit
<directhex> "as close to possible... in one direction"
<savvas> perhaps he'll implement an import function heh
<savvas> actually I don't know, I'm not arguing something I don't know :P
<maco> also, the excuse that "well this is how glib did iso8601" doesn't stand up to the "how many available formats are there for iso8601? OH YEAH there's a localtime version!"
<maco> (i wikipedia'd it. gnote's using iso8601 UTC and tomboy's using iso8601 local)
<maco> and then the tomboy dev popped up and said he'd edit tomboy to be able to handle gnote's notes without crashing
<pkern> lamothe: Sorry, looks like I missed it then.  I thought I synced everything you needed.  Yes, UI slowness, mainly.  I can retest on jaunty next week (that said, I don't want to make promises on that).
<artfwo> hello! is anybody interested in reviewing http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/scantailor on this REVU day? thanks!
<artfwo> (and sorry for spamming the channel, if that's not okay to do)
<ivoks> RoAkSoAx: hello
<RoAkSoAx> ivoks, heya :) how's it going?
<ivoks> RoAkSoAx: good, and you?
<RoAkSoAx> ivoks, tired but good...:)
<ivoks> RoAkSoAx: now remove your patches from drbd merges :)
<ivoks> so that main sponsors don't take yours, which aren't good :/
<ivoks> RoAkSoAx: the main issue there is changelog
<ivoks> RoAkSoAx: it's not your fault, but you should notice the problem
<RoAkSoAx> ivoks, i've already pdated the drbd changelog btw...
<ivoks> RoAkSoAx: take a look at http://launchpadlibrarian.net/26467890/drbd8_8.3.1-1ubuntu1.debdiff
<RoAkSoAx> ivoks, so I should remove this patch: ubuntu-cn-idx.dpatch ??
<ivoks> RoAkSoAx: that's the last debdiff there
<RoAkSoAx> yes
<ivoks> RoAkSoAx: in this debdiff everything is fine except debian/changelog changes
<ivoks> RoAkSoAx: in this patch there are lots of changes (removal) on debian's changelog part
<ivoks> RoAkSoAx: we can not remove debian entries in changelog
<ivoks> RoAkSoAx: make that we should never remove something from changelog or add changes that we didn't do
<ivoks> RoAkSoAx: so, while there was some errors in creating debdiff, they weren't your fault
<ivoks> RoAkSoAx: but once you know that developer cannot remove entries from changelog, you will see that this debdiff does that - and then you would fix it
<RoAkSoAx> ivoks, those entries where removed becuase mathiaz recommended so: could you remove all the changelog entries related to unstable that appear in the diff ( <0.6.12-5)? Only entries relevant to the ubuntu packages should be appear in the debdiff.
<ivoks> i'm not sure if you understand me :)
<ivoks> cause my english sucks at the momment
<ivoks> RoAkSoAx: right, mathiaz said that only ubuntu related changes should be in debdiff
<ivoks> RoAkSoAx: but this debdiff removes debian's changes :)
<ivoks> RoAkSoAx: so, all changes in changelog, but only ubuntu related changes in debdiff
<ivoks> bottom line; this wasn't your fault... it could be some mistake in previous merge (probably by me) or debian changed something in changelog
<RoAkSoAx> ivoks, but i did what mathiaz said: Remove all unstable entries < 0.6.15-5
<ivoks> RoAkSoAx: in *debdiff*
<ivoks> RoAkSoAx: not in debian/changelog
<mathiaz> RoAkSoAx: what I was saying was to remove the entries from the diff, not the changelog
<mathiaz> RoAkSoAx: which means adding them back to the changelog
<ivoks> RoAkSoAx: take a look at my patch
<ivoks> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/26462721/drbd8_8.3.1-2ubuntun1.debdiff
<mathiaz> RoAkSoAx: so that they don't appear in the debdiff
<RoAkSoAx> mathiaz, ohhh know i get it .. lol
<RoAkSoAx> dumb me
<RoAkSoAx> ok will do
<ivoks> don't be so hard on your self
<ivoks> that's why you are here - to learn
<ivoks> and we will help you
<ivoks> RoAkSoAx: once i did merge, i got the same debdiff as you did
<RoAkSoAx> haha yeah well i just misunderstood
<ivoks> RoAkSoAx: but i manualy removed the changes we shouldn't introduce
<ivoks> RoAkSoAx: as i said, this was a result from some error which wasn't caused by you
<RoAkSoAx> ok :)
<ivoks> i'd say you did a good job with merges
<ivoks> i haven't seen others
<RoAkSoAx> ivoks, thanks!! :) btw i am having trouble with paraview.. it won't build  and i don't know why :)
<ivoks> RoAkSoAx: consider that one as one of FTBS you have to solve :)
<ivoks> RoAkSoAx: how does it fail?
<RoAkSoAx> ivoks, yes, I've suggested it as FTBS :) and just a sec
<ivoks> RoAkSoAx: i've put qemu as FTBS you should also look at
<RoAkSoAx> ivoks, ok. do you think we should start working with FTBS after the merges?
<ivoks> RoAkSoAx: yes
<ivoks> RoAkSoAx: during that cycle, you'll learn a bit about patching
<ivoks> you already worked with dpatch
<ivoks> RoAkSoAx: i'm looking at irssi merge request
<ivoks> RoAkSoAx: did you do any changes to irssi or you just merged previous changes?
<RoAkSoAx> ivoks, nxvl said it was ok :)
<ivoks> RoAkSoAx: that's ok, but answer my question, please :)
<RoAkSoAx> ivoks, i merged previous changes, but fixed the patch: 90irc-ubuntu-com
<ivoks> ok
<RoAkSoAx> since the previous patch wasn't working
<RoAkSoAx> ivoks, btw.. I've worked with dpatch and quilt
<ivoks> RoAkSoAx: have you contacted debian about drbd's control file and double 'dpatch' dependecy?
<RoAkSoAx> ivoks, i've also worked with cdbs before
<RoAkSoAx> ivoks, not yet :)
<ivoks> great
<RoAkSoAx> i was planning to do that this weekend
<ivoks> ok
<ivoks> i see ttx and mathiaz helped you with openvpn...
<RoAkSoAx> ivoks, yes
<RoAkSoAx> ttx last night said it was ok, so I suscribed it
<RoAkSoAx> ivoks, i uploaded the new debdiff, is it ok?
<ivoks> debdiff for...?
<RoAkSoAx> ivoks, drbd
<ivoks> you didn't have to, but let me check it
<ivoks> lol, which one? :D
<ivoks> RoAkSoAx: again...
<RoAkSoAx> ivoks, hahaha what's wrong know?
<ivoks>  drbd (0.7_pre10-1) unstable; urgency=low
<ivoks> you are deleting some lines in debian's changelog entry
<ivoks> don't add any debdiff anymore
<ivoks> remove all yours and leave mine
<RoAkSoAx> ivoks, i think that was done automatically
<ivoks> RoAkSoAx: of course it was; as i said before, you should look at debdiff and notice errors like that
<ivoks> RoAkSoAx: you should *never* change debian's changelog entries
<RoAkSoAx> ok
<RoAkSoAx> but yes. I don't know why, but that deletion of those two lines was done automatically i didn't even noticed
<ivoks> well, you should always check debdiff and notice things like that
<ivoks> otherwise, everything else was good
<ivoks> RoAkSoAx: you've seen the comments i added on other bugs?
<RoAkSoAx> ivoks, yes
<ivoks> ok
<RoAkSoAx> ivoks, btw.. I guess that you already fixed the things you've commented about in the other bugs
<ivoks> RoAkSoAx: of course
<RoAkSoAx> ivoks, ok awesome... btw.. did you get to write to the fedora guy regarding on ha?
<ivoks> not yet
<RoAkSoAx> ivoks, ok, when we have some time we should discuss the goals and roadmap for the time, so that you can also talk about it on the UDS
<ivoks> yep
<RoAkSoAx> RoAkSoAx, just let me know when can we talk about it :)... meanwhile I'm gonna work on another merge
<RoAkSoAx> ivoks,  just let me know when can we talk about it :)... meanwhile I'm gonna work on another merge
<ivoks> RoAkSoAx: it would be much easier with email
<ivoks> since we aren't in the same parts of the world
<ivoks> and now my brain isn't in optimum state :)
<RoAkSoAx> ivoks, tell me... i just slept like 4 hours
<RoAkSoAx> ivoks, and ok, i'll bring up the issue in the ubuntu-ha ML
<RoAkSoAx> ivoks, what would be the difference between: libgstreamer0.10-ruby and libgstreamer0.10-ruby1.8
<ivoks> libgstreamer0.10-ruby depends on libgstreamer0.10-ruby1.8
<RoAkSoAx> ivoks, what would be the difference in using them in Build-Depends
<ivoks> i really don't know
<ivoks> a, i know
<ivoks> 0.10-ruby is a dummy package
<ivoks> it allways depends on latest libgstreamer0.10-rubyx.y
<RoAkSoAx> ivoks, so we should not use dummy packages in BUild-Depends?
<ivoks> i would use dummy package
<ivoks> that way i wouldn't have to change debian/control when new version of packages comes out
<RoAkSoAx> ivoks, yes, but why would someone would do that change, use libgstreamer0.10-ruby1.8 instead of libgstreamer0.10-ruby ?
<ivoks> if package builds only with libgstreamer0.10-ruby1.8, but not with libgstreamer0.10-ruby1.7 or libgstreamer0.10-ruby1.9
<RoAkSoAx> ivoks, on how do I determine that?
<RoAkSoAx> ivoks, and it is not in Build-Depends, it is in Depends
<ivoks> build it and test it, check changelog
<ivoks> there should be some info about that in changelog
<RoAkSoAx> ivoks, It just says this: debian/control{,.in}:   + Replace libgstreamer0.10-ruby with libgstreamer0.10-ruby1.8 in Depends for geekast-binary.
<ivoks> RoAkSoAx: then you know it wasn't an accident or mistake
<ivoks> RoAkSoAx: someone did it on purpose
<ivoks> RoAkSoAx: don't change that
<RoAkSoAx> ivoks, ok because debian added, a knew package that is a dummy package and i wanted to know if it could do the same kind of change, or just use the dummy one
<ivoks> leave the change debian did
<RoAkSoAx> ivoks, ok, now, when there's a debian/control.in and debian/control and both have conflicts in the same part, but debian/control also has conflicts in other part... we should resolve the conflicts in both files, but doesnt control.in overwrite control?
<ivoks> RoAkSoAx: you should resolve all conflicts
<RoAkSoAx> ok :)
<ivoks> well, take care
<RoAkSoAx> ivoks, you too thansk for the help :)
<ivoks> np
<directhex>    hnjml
<directhex> =-u7y6r fewdaMNIL#]
<directhex> *COUGH*
<fabrice_sp> Hi. Anyone in a REVU mood willing to have a look at gmerlin (http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/gmerlin). It's for a merge from Debian Multimedia, and is a mandatory dependency for new openmovieeditor
<fabrice_sp> it's linked to https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/283208
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 283208 in ubuntu "Please merge gmerlin 0.4.0-0.1 from Debian multimedia (unstable)" [Wishlist,Confirmed]
<pace_t_zulu> directhex: you here?
<directhex> yes, but not for long
<pace_t_zulu> directhex: congratulations on MOTU
<directhex> thank you
<pace_t_zulu> directhex: didn't want to trouble the list with that
<directhex> pace_t_zulu, i had a few thanks via email, but didn't want to flood the list either
<pace_t_zulu> directhex: maybe one day I can join you in MOTU
<pace_t_zulu> directhex: i suppose i need to accumulate much more karma... perhaps on Karmic Koala
<directhex> pace_t_zulu, it's not too hard - just contribute on something you enjoy, and don't suck at it for more than a few months. easy peasy!
<pace_t_zulu> directhex: that's what i must do
<directhex> back later. beer festival!
<geser> you celebrating your MOTUship there?
<pace_t_zulu> directhex: lucky you
<kklimonda> directhex: gratz :)
<kklimonda> directhex: so, does it mean that banshee will be default media player for KK? ;}
<directhex> kklimonda, not my decision. entirely up to the desktop team at UDS
<kklimonda> any MOTU would like to sponsor a sync: bug 373845 ?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 373845 in python-django-tagging "Sync python-django-tagging 0.2.1+svn154-2 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)." [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/373845
<pochu> kklimonda: I hope it doesn't ;-)
<maco> any of you know your way around piuparts?
<kklimonda> pochu: i guess that whatever the decission would be some people will complain :)
<\sh> moins world :)
<\sh> dear MOTUs and Hopefulls and all others, if anyone wants to do something, please take care of all packages my name tag is on....I won't have much time to work on them this time (much more important things to do ;)) things like zend-framework will uploaded in time for this release cycle....thanks :)
<ScottK> \sh: Congratulations.
<kklimonda> ScottK: what happens now with bug 367214 when it spent some time in -proposed and there was no negative feedback? Also the same fix was used by Debian Maintainer and upstream developers aren't responding to my mails.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 367214 in python-django-tagging "utils.calculate_cloud() can leave font_size unset for most frequent tag" [Undecided,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/367214
<ScottK> kklimonda: Someone other than you needs to verify it works.
<ScottK> Once that happens the tag ccan get changed to verification-done and it'll get copied to -updates
<ScottK> Also you need to get Karmic fixed too.
<kklimonda> I've already filled sync request (bug 373845)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 373845 in python-django-tagging "Sync python-django-tagging 0.2.1+svn154-2 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)." [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/373845
<ScottK> Excellent.
<Laibsch> hi, why is there no libarts1-dev package in jaunty anymore?  Debian still has it
<directhex> yay beer
<directhex> Laibsch, aRts is dead, no?
<Laibsch> is it?
<Laibsch> I don't know, I want it to recompile the latest twinkle
<directhex> "On December 2, 2004 aRts' creator and primary developer Stefan Westerfeld announced he was leaving the project due to a variety of fundamental development and technical issues with aRts.
<directhex> In KDE 4 developers choose to replace aRts with a new multimedia API known as Phonon"
<Laibsch> OK
<Laibsch> but debian seems to still make releases for the package
<Laibsch> unstable has a more recent version than squeeze
<Laibsch> and I don't see where else to get the mcopidl binary which is being called during compilation of twinkle
<james_w> directhex: hey
<james_w> I presume you can sponsor your own requests from the queue now
<james_w> Laibsch: ubuntu decided to kill the package for jaunty, so you'll have to find some way around it, or get consensus to resurrect the package
<directhex> james_w, i don't have an unsubscribe other button, so presumably i need to join u-u-s by hand?
<Laibsch> I'll just recompile libarts1-dev in my PPA which is where I recompile twinkle as well
<james_w> directhex: you need to ask one of the admins I think
<Laibsch> I wonder what Ubuntu will do with the later releases of twinkle, though, which apparently need that binary
<Laibsch> for compilation
<james_w> directhex: if they are sync requests then just move them on to archive and leave the sponsors subscribed for now
<james_w> Laibsch: prodding twinkle upstream about porting away from arts would be appreciated
<Laney> don't drink and subscribe
<james_w> Laney: my glass of wine disagrees
<Laney> WON'T SOMEBODY THINK OF THE CHILDREN?!
<Laibsch> :-(
<Laibsch> Rejected: File arts_1.5.9.orig.tar.gz already exists in Primary Archive for Ubuntu, but uploaded version has different contents. See more information about this error in https://help.launchpad.net/Packaging/UploadErrors. Files specified in DSC are broken or missing, skipping package unpack verification.
<Laibsch> Can't even upload it to my PPA
<james_w> Laibsch: you can if you use the same tarball
<james_w> you probably can't get that tarball by apt-get source unfortunately
<Laibsch> I was using the Debian orig tarball
<Laibsch> It is not good if the Debian orig tarball and the Ubuntu one differed
<james_w> it happens unfortunately
<Laibsch> upstream problem?
<james_w> try with the Ubuntu one, and if it fails then it's probably a launchpad bug
<Laibsch> I'm not even sure where to get it
<Laibsch> I'll try a few usual suspects
<kklimonda> Laibsch: https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/arts/1.5.9-0ubuntu1 ?
<RainCT> Someone from MOTU SRU please approve bug #206280, thanks :)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 206280 in lm-sensors "[hardy] Error opening config file: /etc/sensors.conf" [High,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/206280
<Laney> motu-sru seems under strength
<Laney> shouldn't it have 5 members?
<binarymutant> I received and email from the archive team and it has an acronym I've never heard of. What is DIF? ie. "If it hasn't happened by DIF then we should act on it"
<geser> Debian Import Freeze
<iulian> binarymutant: Debian Import Freeze - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DebianImportFreeze
<binarymutant> iulian, ah thank you
<savvas> you should add these in wtf :)
<savvas> $ wtf DIF
<savvas> Gee...  I don't know what DIF means...
<james_w> binarymutant: ah, that was you :-)
<james_w> that package will be imported semi-automatically until Debian Import Freeze, so asking for it to be done manually at this stage just creates more work
<james_w> I left the bug open so that we can check later if the package got missed for some reason, and do it manually then
<binarymutant> thanks james_w :)
<directhex> james_w, my list o' syncs is moatly stuff i intend to update but haven't yet - but are currently unsyncable
<directhex> james_w, so just write "ack", change to wishlist/confirmed, and subscribe archive admin?
<james_w> directhex: I was referring to e.g. sublib, giver, moon
<james_w> ah
<james_w> yeah that works
<james_w> I can ubsub sponsors for you until you are a member
<directhex> who do i poke for that?
<james_w> I'm not sure why ~ubuntu-dev isn't a member to be honest
<james_w> Emmet added me I think
<james_w> or Luke or Luca according to lp
<directhex> DktrKranz?
<james_w> yeah
<james_w> ah, Luke's up
<james_w> TheMuso: would you add directhex to ~u-u-s please?
<TheMuso> sure
<Laney> bah, sponsorship detection in requestsync is broken
<Laney> james_w: can you unsub the archive from bug 373906?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 373906 in f-spot "Sync f-spot 0.5.0.3-4 (main) from Debian unstable (main)." [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/373906
<TheMuso> james_w: the LP username is directhex?
<james_w> directhex: I assume that's correct?
<directhex> aye
<TheMuso> thanks
<directhex> ta!
<TheMuso> done
<savvas> any motu with some spare time, please review http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/gnote
<directhex> yay, thanks TheMuso
<TheMuso> directhex: np
<savvas> goodnight!
<savvas> or good-what-ever-time-you-have :P
<james_w> Laney: why am I unsubscribing archive from f-spot?
<james_w> I *wan't* f-spot to be synced :-)
<Laney> it's in main
<james_w> oh, yeah
<james_w> silly me
<james_w> nice work anyway
<Laney> thanks
<james_w> I presume you want to subscribe u-m-s?
<Laney> just did!
<james_w> I see it now :-)
<binarymutant> If anyone has the time to review my package for lxsplit, I would greatly be appreciate it. It can be found here http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/lxsplit thanks you :)
#ubuntu-motu 2009-05-09
 * Laney battles lplib
<NCommander> directhex, yay, welcome to the MOTU club!
<directhex> NCommander, do i get to ride around on some kind of sabretoothed tiger and chop up bad guys?
<NCommander> directhex, nope
<directhex> aw man, wrong MOTU :(
<Laney> you get to learn the secret handshake and have plumbers do work for you in half the time
<Laney> see: the stonecutters
<directhex> i can't join a secret society which is against the metric system
<Laney> oh, you can now get a free LWN subscription
<directhex> how about a hat? something dapper?
<directhex> at a jaunty angle
<directhex> man, ubuntu releases could totally be about hats instead of animals
<Laney> redhat have the hat thing going on already :(
<binarymutant> ^ too much like fedora
<persia> james_w, The reason for sponsor membership is historical and related to bugmail.  Feel free to raise for discussion.
<persia> directhex, I'lll add you to the team.  Welcome!
<directhex> persia, hello
<james_w> persia: I'll bring it up sometime, thanks
<directhex> persia, it was suggested by Laney that karma demands i do some sponsoring given how much sponsoring i've expected in the past
<james_w> heh
 * james_w notes that the sponsorship queue is quickly ballooning
<persia> Ooh.  Someone else already added you.  Nifty.
<directhex> i think it was TheMuso
<persia> Yeah.  I just received the membership addition mail between saying I'd add you, and the error.  No idea why it was delayed.
<directhex> clearly you ran out of internet, so it was held up
<binarymutant> If anyone has the time to review my package for lxsplit, I would greatly be appreciate it. It can be found here http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/lxsplit thank you for the time  :)
<binarymutant> did I miss revu day :(
<brywilharris> So who wants to REVU a package?
<brywilharris> So who wants to REVU a package?
<brywilharris> Anybody want to review a new package?
<hyperair> just post the link
<hyperair> whoever's dropping by will look at it
<brywilharris> Great, thanks
<brywilharris> I was beginning to think my client was borked.
<hyperair> heh
 * hyperair still doesn't see a link
<brywilharris> Gimme a minute
<_stochastic_> http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/a2jmidid
<brywilharris> http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/veusz
<hyperair> now then.. let's apt-get source both of them..
 * hyperair will look at a2jmidid first (it's simpler)
<brywilharris> OK
 * _stochastic_ is happy!
<hyperair> disclaimer: i'm not a MOTU, i'm just helping out because i'm bored.
<hyperair> and i've got one hell of a block trying to figure out how to write my nautilus-share patch
<brywilharris> Thanks anyway
<hyperair> np
<hyperair> hmm waf eh..
<brywilharris> what's the problem you're working on?
<hyperair> brywilharris: segfault.
<hyperair> bug #258570
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 258570 in nautilus-share "nautilus crashed with SIGSEGV in strlen()" [Medium,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/258570
<hyperair> _stochastic_: alright, first step.. bump up your Standards-Version
<hyperair> W: a2jmidid source: out-of-date-standards-version 3.8.0 (current is 3.8.1)
<_stochastic_> when did that happen?
<_stochastic_> 3.8.0 was the standards version when I uploaded it
<hyperair> debian sid.
<hyperair> i mean 3.8.1 is the new Standards-Version in debian sid, and karmic.
<_stochastic_> okay
<brywilharris> hell 3.7.3 was the standards version when I uploaded...
<hyperair> heheh
<hyperair> that's not even jaunty. that's intrepid i believe.
<brywilharris> It was
<brywilharris> at the time
 * hyperair facepalms.
<hyperair> waf.
<hyperair> good god
<hyperair> what's with the huge amount of obfuscated code there?
<hyperair> or is that base64'd stuff?
<brywilharris> in a2jmidid?
<hyperair> yes.
<hyperair> i've personally never used waf before so i can't comment on whether those strange looking symbols are suupposed to be there or not
<brywilharris> wtf is waf?
<lifeless> its a build tool
<hyperair> another ridiculous python-based build system
<lifeless> similar in many ways to scons
<hyperair> indeed
<brywilharris> Ah
<hyperair> it was inspired by scons, which in my opinion, is THE most ridiculous build system i've seen.
<lifeless> the base64 code is equivalent to configure - it allows a waf project to be fully selfcontained
 * hyperair needs to take note not to make statements like this after becoming UCD.
<brywilharris> so where are you seeing base 64?
<lifeless> hyperair: scons has some issues, its true.
<hyperair> brywilharris: look at the bottom of the waf file
<hyperair> lifeless: what exactly is in this base64'd code?
<lifeless> wafs library
<hyperair> _stochastic_: ping.
<lifeless> compressed
<hyperair> lifeless: good god. how ridiculous.
<lifeless> which is morally equivalent to configure
<lifeless> which is the autoconf library compiled for a specific project
<lifeless> its no better or worse
<hyperair> i don't remember seeing base64 code in autofoo
<lifeless> the base64ness is irrelevant
<hyperair> it is.
<lifeless> configure isn't the preferred form of modification
<hyperair> that's true.
<hyperair> but it looks goddamn obfuscated.
<lifeless> configure is the output of a compiler; so is that code blob
<lifeless> have you read a configure recently?
<hyperair> sure i have.
<lifeless> not exactly the shining light of small and simple sh code
<hyperair> in fact, i've patched it
<lifeless> *not* a configure.ac.
<hyperair> ...yes sir, i know the difference between configure and configure.ac
<lifeless> good, just checking.
<lifeless> anyhow, I'm not here to defend waf per se; but I think the self-hostingness (which is optional btw) is fairly well done
<brywilharris> So what's the difference
<hyperair> and i think it's ridiculous.
<brywilharris> I mostly write python code now
<hyperair> so let's leave it as that.
<hyperair> either way, i'm supposed to be reviewing a package, not commenting on the idiocy of upstream's build system of choice.
<hyperair> _stochastic_: you there?
<brywilharris> When I was writing code you still had a separate build and link step...
<hyperair> meh he disappeared.
<hyperair> i think make's awesome enough not to require crazy python hacks.
<_stochastic_> hyperair, sorry I ran away for a second
<hyperair> ah he's back!
<hyperair> so anyway
<hyperair> where was i
<brywilharris> waf?
<hyperair> nevermind waf.
<hyperair> right. debian/rules.
<hyperair> i'm not very familiar with the old debian/rules way
<hyperair> it's too easy to accidentally leave something out
<hyperair> i'd instead suggest the minimal dh7 rules way =D
<_stochastic_> care to show a template/example/spec?
<hyperair> hmm
<hyperair> where can i find an example..
<lifeless> /usr/share/doc/debhelper/examples/simple
<lifeless> or something like that
<hyperair> _stochastic_: you can take a look at geanygdb in revu
<lifeless> /usr/share/doc/debhelper/examples/rules.tiny | rules.simple
<hyperair> "man dh" for more information
<hyperair> it's awesome stuff.
<hyperair> you could also use cdbs, but many people say it's black magic.
<brywilharris> Yo got that right
<hyperair> mostly because it's that much harder to trace through a million and one .mk includes
<_stochastic_> is there anything wrong with the way its packaged?
<lifeless> as opposed to a mass of perl that calls a long arbitrary list of programs and hides errors?
<lifeless> :)
<hyperair> _stochastic_: you might like to ask upstream to include the GPL license.
<hyperair> _stochastic_: seems they forgot.
<_stochastic_> it is included
<hyperair> _stochastic_: i don't see a LICENSE or COPYING file anywhere
<_stochastic_> look again, it's titled gpl.txt
<hyperair> ooh it is
<hyperair> gpl2.txt
<_stochastic_> yes
<hyperair> alright then
<_stochastic_> that's a new warning in REVU, it wasn't there a couple days ago
<hyperair> _stochastic_: your debian/watch isn't working.
<_stochastic_> oh? okay, I'll look into that
<hyperair> Unknown verb pattern '' in regex; marked by <-- HERE in m/^(?:(?:http://download.gna.org)?\/a2jmidid\/)?a2jmidid-(*) <-- HERE .tar.bz2$/ at /usr/bin/uscan line 897, <WATCH> line 2.
<hyperair> very strange.
<hyperair> ah
<hyperair> right
<hyperair> .*, not *
<_stochastic_> ah
<hyperair> http://download.gna.org/a2jmidid/a2jmidid-(*).tar.bz2
<hyperair> see the * there
<_stochastic_> yes
<hyperair> they don't release .tar.gz's do they?
<_stochastic_> nope
<hyperair> hmm i see.
<_stochastic_> are you sure it should be .* the filename looks like a2jmidid-4.tar.bz2
<hyperair> yes i'm sure
<hyperair> this is regex.
<hyperair> man 7 regex for more information
<hyperair> test it with uscan
<_stochastic_> okay
<_stochastic_> done.
<brywilharris> uscan --verbose
<hyperair> alright, onto your copyright file
<brywilharris> sorry go ahead
<hyperair> haha no problem
<hyperair> you're missing a few copyrights
<_stochastic_> ? which files?
<cody-somerville> NCommander, I noticed that grendal has been maintaining the debian packaging in the pike CVS
<cody-somerville> NCommander, so I'm attempting to rebase all the changes in Debian onto the debian packaging in the CVS
<hyperair> eh um nevermind
<hyperair> whoops
<brywilharris> http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/report.py/legal?upid=5644
<hyperair> ./.waf-1.4.3-4cc0bec64a165ffe5dd3eed60cd2e01b/wafadmin/pproc.py <-- this
<hyperair> heheh
<hyperair> but i suppose this is one of the autogenerated files
 * cody-somerville hopes what he is doing is sane. :)
<hyperair> so nevermind
<cody-somerville> hyperair, In that case, the clean rule should delete that
<hyperair> cody-somerville: no i was messing around with waf earlier.
<hyperair> cody-somerville: i'll unpack it again to check later
<cody-somerville> ok
<hyperair> i remember hearing some mention about needing to use the copyright symbol instead of (C)/(c)
<hyperair> Â©
<hyperair> this one
<_stochastic_> previous REVU uploads I've had accepted just used (c)
<hyperair> _stochastic_: i think you can actually merge all the Nedko Arnaudov entries. i noticed you have three of those.
<hyperair> _stochastic_: it's a very recent change.
<brywilharris> alias Â©='echo GPLv3'
<hyperair> ._.
<hyperair> _stochastic_: also, i'd actually suggest that you document which copyrights go to which files
<_stochastic_> hyperair, which of Nedko's entries? where?
<hyperair> in debian/copyright
<hyperair>     Copyright (c) 2008 Nedko Arnaudov <nedko@arnaudov.name>
<hyperair>     Copyright (c) 2008 Nedko Arnaudov <nedko@arnaudov.name>
<hyperair>     Copyright (c) 2007,2008 Nedko Arnaudov <nedko@arnaudov.name>
<hyperair> three.
<_stochastic_> ahh
<hyperair> well actually two, but you repeated one of them
<hyperair> of course, if it's not too much trouble, you should actually document which copyrights go to which files
<_stochastic_> in the machine-readable format? or is there another way?
<hyperair> well you don't necessarily have to use machine readable format, but if you were to use it, there's http://wiki.debian.org/Proposals/CopyrightFormat
<_stochastic_> so can  Copyright (c) 2007,2008 Nedko Arnaudov <nedko@arnaudov.name> be used for all of Nedko's or does another need to explicitly list 2008 only?
<hyperair> i'd actually merge the files that belong to Nedko
<hyperair> in one single listing
<_stochastic_> okay
<hyperair> you're also missing one of the brackets in Copyright C) 2009, Eric Hedekar <afterthebeep@gmail.com>
<hyperair> and now the customary test-build.
<brywilharris> for foo in `grep -ir '(c)' .|cut -d ':' -f 1|uniq`; do sed  -e 's/(c)/Â©/' $foo >temp; mv temp $foo; done
<brywilharris> just make sure you don't have any variables named 'C'...
<hyperair> i think you meant sed -i -e $foo
<hyperair> -i means edit in place
<brywilharris> that would work too
<brywilharris> however, this breaks python files as I just discovered...
<hyperair> also, the Â© was supposed to be in the debian/copyright file i think
<hyperair> or something like that
<brywilharris> python complains about the character encoding
<hyperair> i think it's permitted to be (c) in tbe actual sources
<brywilharris> It has to be
<hyperair> yeah
<hyperair> haha
<_stochastic_> hyperair, any other issues you can spot?
<hyperair> _stochastic_: gimme a moment to build
<hyperair> i was updating my karmic pbuilder earlier
<hyperair> meanwhile, i'll take a look at veusz i guess.
<brywilharris> kk
<hyperair> brywilharris: regarding your rules file... why don't you use a .install file instead of manually running install -d -m644 bla
<brywilharris> OK
<hyperair> W: a2jmidid: binary-without-manpage usr/bin/a2j_control
<hyperair> W: a2jmidid: binary-without-manpage usr/bin/a2jmidi_bridge
<hyperair> W: a2jmidid: binary-without-manpage usr/bin/a2jmidid
<hyperair> W: a2jmidid: binary-without-manpage usr/bin/j2amidi_bridge
<hyperair> _stochastic_: ^
<hyperair> you're gonna have to write manpages for all of those =)
<hyperair> and then add them to debian/manpages
<hyperair> man dh_installmanpages for more information
<brywilharris> I gotta go to bed
<brywilharris> hyperair: Thanks for the help
<binarymutant> If someone has the time to review my package http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/lxsplit I would greatly appreciate it :)
<abuDawud> can someone explain the basic process of repackaging an unstable debian package to the latest and greatest Ubuntu distro?
<lifeless> abuDawud: generally its just a sync
<lifeless> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU has docs
<binarymutant> abuDawud, you pretty much just change the changelog and control file
<lifeless> binarymutant: unless it needs patching you should sync it not change changelog
<abuDawud> does it involve the apt pinning process if I wanted to use apt source for requisitioning the files?
<abuDawud> or is that over complicating things?
<binarymutant> lifeless, I understand :)
<abuDawud> essentially I am looking for an easy intro project into packaging after reviewing all of the documentation. I figured that would be pretty simple
<binarymutant> abuDawud, a sync is pretty much just a bug report
<abuDawud> binarymutant, I will look at the link lifeless posted and read up about it.
<abuDawud> is there somewhere simpler to start?
<lifeless> should we archive blankon-extra-backgrounds in revu, 6 months and the poster hasn't updated
<lifeless> abuDawud: the simplest place to start is to fix a bug in a package that is in Ubuntu
<lifeless> abuDawud: that way you're working with existing code and package, only making a small change, and don't need to know all the ins and outs
<abuDawud> lifeless, I have been trying to find one that is not patched using harvest and looking through launchpad and I can't seem to find one
<lifeless> abuDawud: what do you mean?
<abuDawud> well I can't seem to find where to watch for simple bugs that just need repackaging etc
<abuDawud> all of the bugs I find seem to either be complicated code issues or they are fixed
<lifeless> abcmidi is an example of package which has been synced, rather than patched by ubuntu
<lifeless> abuDawud: are you interested/experienced with any particular programming languages/environments?
<abuDawud> lifeless, a bit of perl but its all intro stuff
<abuDawud> lifeless, I was trying to find a way to help out with my limited code knowledge
<abuDawud> lifeless, packaging seemed to be the way to go
<lifeless> packaging is useful, but to package code properly you need to understand that particular language
<lifeless> when packaging you will run into compile problems/link errors/dependencies/language issues
<lifeless> the more you understand the particular language[s] the thing you are packaging is written in, the easier it is for you
<binarymutant> abuDawud, if you use the advanced search in launchpad you can find new bugs that need to be triaged or for packaging you can look through this listhttp://www.debian.org/devel/wnpp/orphaned
<abuDawud> binarymutant, thanks, I think I have some more reading to do :)
<lifeless> whats with licencing pacaking data (often under the (C) threshold anyway) as GPL
<lifeless> surely same-licence-as-package would be better
<binarymutant> I <3 gpl
<lifeless> so do I
<lifeless> for software
<binarymutant> how about for a Makefile? It scare me to see the nvidia license in a Makefile
<fabrice_sp> Hi. Anyone with access to a powerpc computer? I'd like to know what is the return value of dpkg --print-installation-architecture
<blacknred0> how come after making a package from a single script and then installing it the script will not go to /usr/sbin? what could of cause this?
<fabrice_sp> blacknred0, inside your deb package, is it in /usr/sbin?
<blacknred0> fabrice_sp, no
<blacknred0> so i figure that it will never execute
<blacknred0> how i could make the package and placing my script on /usr/sbin whenever any user executes the command?
<fabrice_sp> blacknred0, during the building of your package, you need to 'move' the files in the correct temporary directory?
<fabrice_sp> this temporary directory is debian/<package name>/usr/bin
<binarymutant> If someone has the time to review my package http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/lxsplit I would greatly appreciate it :)
<blacknred0> fabrice_sp, nope... currently is mypackage/tmp not mypackage/debian/...
<blacknred0> thnx... facbrice_sp.... i would do that then...
<fabrice_sp> ;-)
<blacknred0> fabrice_sp, so one last question.... so should i call form rules that package? or should i have a tmp for that same script?
<fabrice_sp> blacknred0, just put your script in the right place, in the install target in debian/rules, and it should be ok
<blacknred0> ok, thnx :P
<fabrice_sp> binarymutant, I'm trying to build your package in amd64, but it's not possible
<fabrice_sp> is it normal?
<fabrice_sp> I'm getting: lxsplit_0.2.4-0ubuntu1.dsc: amd64 not in arch list: i386 -- skipping
<binarymutant> fabrice_sp, arch i386
<fabrice_sp> binarymutant, why? It's not compatible with amd64?
<binarymutant> fabrice_sp, the site didn't say it wasn't, I should change to arch all
<fabrice_sp> binarymutant, yes
<fabrice_sp> as amd64 is a growing arch, it would be a pity not to have it :-D (and I won't review the package :-) )
<binarymutant> fabrice_sp, should be able to build on your architecture now, srry :)
<fabrice_sp> binarymutant, uploaded to revu?
<binarymutant> yes
<fabrice_sp> ok (trying to build again)
<fabrice_sp> binarymutant, all no. It's for arch independant packages. This one in compiled, so it should be any
<binarymutant> fabrice_sp, oh okay, thank you, I get those two mixed up sometimes
<fabrice_sp> so do I :-) But when building, and you see a *_all.deb, it clarify things :-)
<binarymutant> is there anything else that is noticeable to you fabrice_sp, it's my first C package so I'm very concerned about it
<fabrice_sp> binarymutant, I'll have a look at the packaging now (as arch is not correct, I'm getting errors in lintian)
<fabrice_sp> you miss ${shlibs:Depends} in depends for the binary package
<fabrice_sp> you should drop the A in the description (the short description extend the phrase this package is a ...)
<fabrice_sp> for the long description, don't repeat the short description
<fabrice_sp> for man page installation: I generally prefer to have it in a manpages file, but the way you do it is correct
<fabrice_sp> the same for docs
<fabrice_sp> otherwise, looks good (and simple ;-) )
<binarymutant> thank you for your time I'll correct these :)
<fabrice_sp> you're welcome. Did you uploaded a 'any' package?
<fabrice_sp> (just to check the resulting package)
<binarymutant> the last two issues about the manpage and the docs, could you elaborate?
<fabrice_sp> yes :-)
<fabrice_sp> instead of putting the name of the file you will install (for doc or for manpage) in the debian/rules file, you can put that in dedicated files in debian directory
<fabrice_sp> manpages for man file
<fabrice_sp> docs for doc files
<fabrice_sp> this way, you could even have a more simple rules file, using cdbs :-)
<fabrice_sp> (a 2 lines rules file :-) )
<binarymutant> oh instead of using dh_ I get you
<fabrice_sp> you still nee the dh_ stuff, but this way, it's easier to add a file
<fabrice_sp> s/nee/need/
<binarymutant> since its my first C package I wanted to try it with debhelper instead, it feels more in depth to me. But i've done a cdbs package and it definitely was simpler
<fabrice_sp> I mean, you will have dh_installman instead of dh_installman debian/lxsplit.1
<fabrice_sp> it's a good approach to learn ;-)
<binarymutant> if you still have any time to spare the updated package been cached into revu
<fabrice_sp> ok. I'll download it again
<binarymutant> ty :)
<artfwo> Hello! I am having a hard time resolving FTBFS of my REVU upload (on karmic). Does anyone have a little time to help?
<hyperair> artfwo: what's wrong?
<artfwo> well, here's the upload in question http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/scantailor
<artfwo> and it fails to build in the PPA
<artfwo> https://edge.launchpad.net/~artfwo/+archive/ppa/+build/987616
<artfwo> there're lots of cryptic preprocess messages in the build logs, which have led me to debian bug 505109
<ubottu> Debian bug 505109 in boost1.35 "FTBFS with GCC 4.4 and breaks other apps" [Important,Closed] http://bugs.debian.org/505109
<artfwo> it's fixed in the latest debian, yep
<artfwo> so
<artfwo> I have merged boost1.35 from debian and also uploaded it to the PPA
<hyperair> have you tried building with a sid pbuilder?
<artfwo> nope, didn't think of it
<artfwo> but anyways
<hyperair> i'm giong to try building
<artfwo> boost1.35 also fails to build in the PPA/Karmic after the merge
<artfwo> due to the following error:
<artfwo> ../boost/test/impl/debug.ipp:280: error: 'sscanf' is not a member of 'std'
<artfwo> which again led me to upstream
<artfwo> https://svn.boost.org/trac/boost/ticket/1542
<artfwo> (comment:1)
<artfwo> it does not seem to be fixed upstream, but I wonder if I can replace <stdio.h> with <cstdio> in my merge to fix it
<hyperair> ah!
<hyperair> right!
<hyperair> i had an issue with that as well
<hyperair> cstdlib
<hyperair> you need to include cstdlib to each and every one of those files using sscanf
<hyperair> it's not included by default any more
<artfwo> zomg
<hyperair> hahah
<fabrice_sp> artfwo, why using an old boost version?
<artfwo> fabrice_sp: mainly chose it because it's in main
<fabrice_sp> there isn't a boost1.37?
<fabrice_sp> in main also :-)
<artfwo> there is, but boost1.35 is in main, so it's better supported and all, right?
<artfwo> huh?
<fabrice_sp> my bad: 1.37 is in universe
<fabrice_sp> but I remember ScottK trying to get rid of boost1.35
<fabrice_sp> so try with 1.37
<ScottK> Actually it was boost, which is 1.34
<ScottK> We need to pick a target boost for Karmic.
<artfwo> right you are, 1.37 is in main as well: http://packages.ubuntu.com/source/karmic/boost1.37
<ScottK> 1.37 or 8 not sure.
<artfwo> 1.38 is universe
<fabrice_sp> ohh: i'm bad at numbers :-)
<ScottK> Doesn't mean it will stay that way.
<artfwo> damn, I have already opened a merge bug for 1.35
<fabrice_sp> anyway, a new package should use the latest version of a lib, right?
<ScottK> 1.38 is the version Debian is aiming to use for Squeeze, so the faster we can line up on that the better.  Might be Karmic + 1 though.
<artfwo> okay, I shall try 1.37 for now
<fabrice_sp> ScottK, this kind of things will be decided at UDS?
<ScottK> I hope so.
<fabrice_sp> ok
<artfwo> but then again - is 1.35 going to sink away from karmic at all?
<fabrice_sp> artfwo, until UDS, we don't know. But it could be
<artfwo> okay
<savvas> so the new boost is built?
<savvas> I'll have to proceed with cgal then :)
<savvas> good morning btw :P
<artfwo> well, it fails to build with boost 1.37 as well, but I think it's a matter of another bug - debian bug 525752
<ubottu> Debian bug 525752 in kmldonkey "FTBFS with GCC 4.4: missing #include" [Unknown,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/525752
<_stochastic_> Do any MOTUs want to take a look at this upgrade request that's ready for upload Bug #367735
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 367735 in calf "upgrade to newer upstream version" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/367735
<artfwo> everything has worked so nice on jaunty :(
<fabrice_sp> artfwo, we are so early in the cycle, that it's normal to have this kind of things
<artfwo> yep, but this GCC cleanups in Karmic have just uncovered an upstream bug, which I've got to fix and forward to the author
<artfwo> the only thing that frustrates me, is that I don't currently have enough bandwidth for pbuilder
<savvas> _stochastic_: 1) you need to follow sponsorship process: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SponsorshipProcess 2) did you test-build your new package?
<_stochastic_> savvas, yes I've tested it and the upstream version fixes some bugs
<_stochastic_> the bug is already attached to the universe sponsors, should I just sit and wait?
<savvas> oh ok, I think what's left now is to subscribe ubuntu-universe-sponsors
<_stochastic_> they're already subscribed
<savvas> hm..
<savvas> it's in the activity log but not in the subscribers list
<savvas> weird
<savvas> _stochastic_: oh by the way, you changed the status of the bug after subscribing the sponsors, please set it back to confirmed :)
<_stochastic_> savvas, is there anywhere that the status policy is outlined?  I constantly am adjusting things to what I think should be the right status, but then am told to change it etc.. (it was set to triaged not confirmed)
<savvas> it shouldn't matter what the status is, but I think "in progress" means you would take care of the sponsorship yourself
<_stochastic_> should it go back to triaged or be switched to confirmed?
<_stochastic_> to me, in progress was referring to the fact that progress has been made on the bug
<savvas> if you have bug control permissions, make it triaged, if not then confirmed :)
<_stochastic_> savvas, that sponsorship link you sent me claims that all bugs ready for sponsorship shouldn't be assigned to anyone, should I remove myself from that position now?
<savvas> I didn't see any outline or policy about the status, but that's what I was advised to follow hehe. you shouldn't change the status after subscribing the bug to the sponsors
<savvas> yes, that's true forgot that :)
<savvas> _stochastic_: do you see ubuntu-universe-sponsors on the right subscribers list?
<_stochastic_> savvas, yes I do.  don't you?  refresh?
<savvas> I have :\
<savvas> let me check with the normal launchpad server
<_stochastic_> I also see it here: https://bugs.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-universe-sponsors
<savvas> well launchpad bug I guess :)
<savvas> config.sub config.guess
<savvas> these are files right?
<savvas> not that important but if you require to make any new changes to the debian package, instead of "rm -f config.sub config.guess" use "dh_clean config.sub config.guess
<savvas> I mean something like this: http://paste.ubuntu.com/167576/
<savvas> any motu to review http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/gnote ?
<LucidFox> savvas> I'm hesitant to take responsibility for uploading it :/
<savvas> about tarball-in-tarball? :)
<lifeless> savvas: tarball-in-tarball is when I stopped reviewing
<savvas> lifeless: tarball-in-tarball in general or just the fact that the maintainer used tar.bz2?
<binarymutant> If someone has the time to review and possibly advocate my package http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/lxsplit I would greatly appreciate it
<lifeless> tar-in-tar
<lidaobing> savvas, if the upstream use tar.bz2, you can repack it with "uscan --repack"
<lifeless> I would have said 'bz2' if I mean that
<fabrice_sp> binarymutant, you didn't fixed the depend line
<fabrice_sp> W: lxsplit: missing-depends-line
<binarymutant> fabrice_sp, is Depends: ${shlibs:Depends}, not correct?
<fabrice_sp> this is what lintian tell me when I run it against deb file
<fabrice_sp> W: lxsplit: missing-depends-line
<fabrice_sp> if it's normal (no dependency), you should override this lintian warning
<savvas> well I see that's in generally not recommended on the Debian side, so I'll talk to nyu about extracting it. thank you all!
<binarymutant> fabrice_sp, there are no dependencies
<fabrice_sp> no even on c libs?
<fabrice_sp> could be
<fabrice_sp> dpkg-gencontrol: warning: unknown substitution variable ${shlibs:Depends}
<fabrice_sp> during build. This would explain why no dependency
<binarymutant> I'm not sure I understand, what options are you using with lintian?
<binarymutant> I've grepped through the includes on the files, http://paste.ubuntu.com/167625/
<binarymutant> #include "stuff" is that for including files from the same directory? or is that from /usr/include too?
<savvas> does that need dh_makeshlibs and dh_shlibdeps in binary-arch rule?
<binarymutant> ah right, that might be it
<binarymutant> thanks :)
<savvas> I'm really not sure, but try it :)
<binarymutant> what lintian options should I be using? I had been using -ivv
<tuantub> i have the same warning : "warning: unknown substitution variable ${shlibs:Depends}" while building a package, what can i do to correct this ?
<fabrice_sp> dh_makeshlibs
<savvas> dpkg-gencontrol: warning: unknown substitution variable ${shlibs:Depends}
<savvas> dpkg-gencontrol: warning: unknown substitution variable ${misc:Depends}
<savvas> still there :P
<savvas> I tried this:
<savvas> 	dh_makeshlibs
<savvas> 	dh_installdeb
<savvas> 	dh_shlibdeps
<lifeless> tuantub: it means the package doesn't have a library in it
<lifeless> that particular binary
<tuantub> lifeless: more detailed ? :-/
<tuantub> lifeless: is that important or i can simply ignore it while building packages ? :-/
<binarymutant> I can't get the lintian error :(
<fabrice_sp> did you run it on the deb?
<fabrice_sp> binarymutant, ^
<binarymutant> fabrice_sp, on the *.changes
<fabrice_sp> build the package and run lintian on the deb
<savvas> $ lintian -i lxsplit_0.2.4-0ubuntu1_amd64.changesW: lxsplit: missing-depends-line
<binarymutant> ah!
<savvas> binarymutant: not *_source.changes :)
<binarymutant> thank you thank you
<kostmo> I'm packaging an upstream source with a daemon that needs a configuration file to run.  This configuration file is stored in a subdirectory of the main source directory.  Can I use debian/conffiles to specify this file somehow?
<kostmo> The file needs to end up in /etc/ when installed.
<binarymutant> "dpkg-gencontrol: warning: unknown substitution variable ${misc:Depends}" I'm getting this when I run pbuilder on my package, what does this mean? I'm using debhelper
<lidaobing> hello, how clearsign a file with two gnupg key? (I am processing my new pubkey with this document: http://www.debian-administration.org/users/dkg/weblog/48)
<geser> binarymutant: it doesn't know what it should replace this variable with. this warning is common as not every package using it in Depends, specifies a value which should get put in (so doesn't really need it in Depends)
<geser> lidaobing: gpg -u keyid1 -u keyid2 --clearsign filename
<lidaobing> geser, thanks
<binarymutant> geser, thank you for the info. Do I need to keep it so that I don't get lintian errors though since I'm using debhelper?
<geser> I assume you shouldn't get any lintian errors if you remove it
<binarymutant> cool, thanks geser :)
<binarymutant> If someone has the time to review and possibly advocate my package http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/lxsplit I would greatly appreciate it :)
<trip0> anyone recommend repository creation/managment software?
<binarymutant> trip0, like a version control system?
<trip0> sorry, debian repository
* nhandler changed the topic of #ubuntu-motu to: Jaunty is released | Time for SRUs: http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/sru/ | Development of Karmic Koala has started -> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU | Want to get involved with the MOTU? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Contributing | http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/ftbfs/
<LucidFox> Laney> Thumbs up for your work on f-spot in Debian!
<Laney> LucidFox: \o/ let's hope it can stay in sync
 * LucidFox nods
<sebner> Laney: though you should have left it to "New" since u-m-s will set it to Confirmed :P
<Laney> sebner: I *just* changed that
<Laney> it was only set that way because requestsync messed up
<sebner> Laney: kk
<sebner> Laney: btw, can we sync gnome-do-plugins from Debian. What's with the use_csc patch in ubuntu?
<Laney> no, I'm afraid not
<Laney> I did the dfsging differently in Debian
<Laney> unless you can convince meebey to upload the same thing as +dfsg1
<sebner> Laney: what's the differenz?
<Laney> Ubuntu has the gdata lib in BundledLibraries/
<LucidFox> Laney> Have you talked to meebey yourself about it?
<Laney> LucidFox: no, because I don't think it's worthwile
<Laney> I don't mind just waiting for a new upstream
<sebner> Laney: override override override
<sebner> :P
<LucidFox> He seems quite cooperative about Ubuntu compatibility, judging by my experience with f-spot.
<Laney> yeah he's fine, I just think it'd be a waste of time
<LucidFox> I wonder if it would make sense for me to rejoin u-u-s if I don't actively sponsor, but occasionally stumble upon a patch or sync/merge request subscribed by u-u-s that I want to work on.
<james_w> LucidFox: you *could* actively sponsor :-)
<james_w> lidaobing: this ibus upload doesn't require rebuilding the other ibus packages or anything does it?
<Laney> sponsor-5-a-day?
<lidaobing> james_w, do not
<james_w> lidaobing: great, thanks
<lidaobing> james_w, ibus 1.1.0.* does not remove any API
<james_w> lidaobing: I'll review and upload now
<lidaobing> james_w, there is a symbol file record this
<james_w> ah, nice
<lidaobing> jacob, in debian/libibus0.symbols
<LucidFox> james_w> qutecom built in karmic pbuilder fine for me
<lidaobing> james_w, thanks
<LucidFox> -6, that is
<james_w> LucidFox: yeah, sorry about that
<james_w> LucidFox: please go ahead and ack it
<james_w> I'll unsub the sponsors if you like
<LucidFox> ok
<AdamDH> can any one recommend any packages that go off and downloads binary sources?
<Ampelbein> AdamDH: what do you mean?
<kklimonda> AdamDH: flashplugin-nonfree
<AdamDH> ah thanks flash-plugin is a good example, how when the package is installed it will download binarys so they are not part of the package
<AdamDH> after Januty what is the next version called?
<Nafallo> Karmic
<ghostcube> when will the anjuta bug be fixed in jaunty
<ghostcube> still no dist-upgrade possible
<ghostcube> 2 weeks now
<kklimonda> what bug?
<ghostcube> install overwritr libgbf-1-2
<ghostcube> its even not possible to get it manually
<ghostcube> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/anjuta/+bug/338464
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 338464 in anjuta "[Jaunty] anjuta >2.25 needs Conflicts: libgbf-1-2" [Undecided,Triaged]
<ghostcube> still no fix
<AdamDH> need to get my packages into revu for Karmic, try and get them included
<kklimonda> ghostcube: you could uninstall libgbf-1-2
<ghostcube> nope
<kklimonda> sure, it's just a suggestion ;)
<ghostcube> doesnt work
<kklimonda> hmm.. i can't reproduce it on my system..
<ghostcube> i can give you a pastebin
<ghostcube> it happens at upadte
<ghostcube> from intrepid
<kklimonda> can you paste a result of dpkg -L libgbf-1-2 ?
<kklimonda> but that's weird - anjuta should remove libgbf-1-2..
<ghostcube> http://pastie.org/473015
<kklimonda> it replaces libgbf-1-common so it should just remove it and libgbf-1-2
<ghostcube> itzs not removable
<ghostcube> this is an manual purge
<ghostcube> i posted you
<ghostcube> i can try to force dpkg
<kklimonda> why can't you remove it?
<ghostcube> see the post of pastie says cant remove
<kklimonda> it does? :)
<ghostcube> ah sorry german lol
<kklimonda> yeah..
<kklimonda> try LC_ALL=C <command>
<geser> ghostcube: try "sudo apt-get remove libgbf-1-2" and check what else it wants to remove before proceeding
<ghostcube> i can show you
<ghostcube> i did that
<ghostcube> libgbf-1-2* libgbf-1-common* libgladeui-1-7*
 * sebner waves at geser \o/
<ghostcube> pkg: Fehler beim Bearbeiten von /var/cache/apt/archives/anjuta_2%3a2.26.0.0-0ubuntu1_amd64.deb (--unpack):
<ghostcube>  Versuche, Â»/usr/bin/gbf-am-parseÂ« zu Ã¼berschreiben, welches auch in Paket libgbf-1-2 ist
<ghostcube> Fehler =Error
<geser> but it wanted to upgrade anjuta before it removed libgbf-1-2
<kklimonda> ghostcube: it happens when you try to remove libgbf-1-2 ?
<ghostcube> yes
<ghostcube> and if i do dist-upgrade
<geser> so you need to "help" it a little bit to force the correct order
<ghostcube> always the same
<ghostcube> geser: i tried to remove it before install no way
<geser> which error?
<ghostcube> the one i postet already
<ghostcube> this is manual
<ghostcube> it doesnt remove the package it installs first
<ghostcube> dont ask me why it does this
<ghostcube> never had this before
<geser> ah, so this is from "apt-get remove libgbf-1-2" and not "apt-get install anjuta"?
<geser> try removing anjuta too (temporarily) and install it again when libgbf-1-2 got removed
<ghostcube> ah ok
<ghostcube> worked
<ghostcube> thx
<ghostcube> but this is bad trouble as it seems
<ghostcube> inside some packages
<kklimonda> it shouldn't happen as anjuta conflicts with libgbf-1-2..
<ghostcube> yeah its a bit weird
<ghostcube> :)
<kklimonda> i don't have a II system anymore to test upgrade..
<ghostcube> but thx anjuta removal temp fixed it
<LucidFox> directhex, get aggregated on Planet Ubuntu already! :)
<james_w> dh_clideps: Warning! No Build-Depends(-Indep) on cli-common-dev (>= 0.4.4)!
<james_w> directhex: xsp ^
<hyperair> xsp?
<hyperair> also, dh_clideps has a bug that results in a false positive until very recently.
<Laney> some genius fixed it
 * hyperair whistles
<hyperair> that reminds me of something i should add to my UC application
<LucidFox> ^_^
<sebner> hyperair for UC \o/
<LucidFox> sebner> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/hyperair/UniverseContributorApplication
<sebner> LucidFox: nahah, can't comment because I worked too little with him (I know that he is a cool/clever guy though)
 * hyperair feels flattered
 * a|wen wonders why regina-normal seems to be acting out at each merge
<LucidFox> regina-normal?
<a|wen> the configure script refuses to find libboost-python whatever i do :/
<hyperair> python?
<LucidFox> Ha ha
<hyperair> shouldnt it be setup.py then?
<a|wen> well, python is just one of the 3 or 4 frontends built by the package
<a|wen> (and yeah, it has multiple backends as well)
<geser> for which boost version does it look?
<a|wen> we try to make it find 1.35
<geser> have you a log from configure you could paste?
<hyperair> pastebin the configure.ac or configure.in file. that could probably yield something about how it's looking for libboost-python
<hyperair> assuming it's an autotools script
<directhex> james_w, it's a false message, i'd ignore it if i were you
<james_w> fair enough
<james_w> I did, I was just passing it along instead of filing a bug as would take just a few seconds to commit it directly if needed
<a|wen> the configure run http://pastebin.ca/S:1417409
<a|wen> and configure.ac http://paste.ubuntu.com/167900/
<james_w> dear libplasma-dev, why are you out of date? no love, James
<geser> a|wen: does a configure.log also exist?
<a|wen> geser: no ... neither before or after a configure run
<geser> hmm, or was the file named config.status?
<geser> usually there is a file which is more verbose then the configure output
<a|wen> there is a config.status ... just need to get it out of the chroot
<james_w> config.log
<james_w> it's not always in the root
<a|wen> what is it that i need to install to have the cli pastebin thingy?
<james_w> a|wen: pastebinit?
<a|wen> :)
<a|wen> config.status http://pastebin.com/f13848d00
<a|wen> config.log http://pastebin.com/f43e6ccb1
<geser> the second pastebin doesn't want to load here
<geser> you broke pastebin.com: Fatal error: Allowed memory size of 8388608 bytes exhausted (tried to allocate 1095524 bytes) in /home/pastebin/lib/geshi/geshi.php on line 2474
<a|wen> oh, ups
<Ampelbein> james_w: hi. regarding sync of mldonkey: the problem is with the Replaces: in dh-ocaml, http://paste.ubuntu.com/167905/ . It replaces ocaml-nox (<= 3.10.2-3) but as we have 3.10.2-3ubuntu1 in the repositories, the replaces doesn't work right. should i change dh-ocaml to represent the ubuntu-version?
<lidaobing> Ampelbein,  change to: "<= 3.10.2-3.1~"?
<james_w> it sounds like the Ubuntu version of ocaml-nox might be wrong
<geser> I've filed a bug to get dh_ocaml moved to main to ocaml can build which should "fix" this too
<james_w> we have 3.11.0-5
<a|wen> geser: there is something in there that doesn't look good ... http://paste.ubuntu.com/167909/
<directhex> which chickens do i sacrifice to advocate a package in REVU?
<geser> a|wen: that's the reason why it couldn't find boost-python. Now you "just" need to find out why this happens :)
<geser> james_w: only in source, binary are in depwait in dh-ocaml
<Ampelbein> there is two issues here, i think. first is that our version of ocaml-nox is still with the dh-stuff included, second is the wrong replaces in dh-ocaml which should refer to the ubuntu-version
<a|wen> geser: to me it mostly looks like some syntax error ... and it being in a boost file
<james_w> Ampelbein: yeah
<fransman> How do I get a new package in Ubuntu, what's already in Debian?
<fransman> talking about openerp-client-web
<fransman> http://git.debian.net/?p=debian/openerp-client-web.git
<a|wen> fransman: it's in unstable?
<fransman> a|wen: I am not sure
<a|wen> fransman: it doesn't look to be in debian officially yet ...
<fransman> a|wen: Okay, but do we need to open a ticket yet?
<a|wen> fransman: if it get's into debian before the the feature freeze is there, you just need to test that it builds and runs on ubuntu and file a sync request (and possibly a sponsor) ... that is indeed the easiest way
<james_w> anyone have an opinion on this patch? http://launchpadlibrarian.net/26477752/splashy_0.3.13-3ubuntu2.debdiff
<directhex> hm. lsb-release isn't in a base ubuntu image?
<james_w> I can't remember whether that it encouraged, or discouraged, or neither
<james_w> directhex: how base?
<directhex> james_w, pbuilder build
<james_w> directhex: lsb-release probably isn't, but lsb_release might be
<directhex> lsb-release is the package
<directhex> make: lsb_release: Command not found
<james_w> ah
<directhex> causing me strife. i'll add a build-dep
<james_w> Task: minimal, mythbuntu-backend-master, mythbuntu-backend-slave, mythbuntu-desktop, mythbuntu-frontend
<a|wen> james_w: i would say that it makes sense with that patch ... but i don't know how our policy is
<james_w> so it should be in any minimal install
<directhex> sometimes life doesn't work out that way :(
<bizkut> root@wrt:~# cat /etc/issue.net
<bizkut> Ubuntu karmic (development branch)
<bizkut> root@wrt:~# uname -a
<bizkut> Linux wrt 2.4.37 #3431 Thu May 7 07:36:38 CEST 2009 mips GNU/Linux
<directhex> @_@
<directhex> bizkut, you have an ARM box?
<bizkut> directhex, i got a nlsu2
<bizkut> but that's my wrt router
<directhex> i meant MIPS
<directhex> but i'm dim, and mildly drunk
<bizkut> yeah wrt350n
<bizkut> lol
<bizkut> but still stick with 2.4 kernel for networking thing
<bizkut> so lame
 * hyperair mutters darkly about how intensely stupid the intel gpu driver is.
<doctormo> OK, I'm going to try this again now that I'm not sick and tired
<doctormo> I'
<doctormo> I'm not that good at packaging, I'm much more familar with python packages, which are dead easy.
<doctormo> But this package I have is more troublesome, it's not python, it's a binary package containing user space modules for epson scanners.
<doctormo> It requires postinst and prerm scripts to be run, but my attempts at including these scripts have so far failed.
<directhex> doctormo, what have you tried to do?
<a|wen> what is the news with libboost1.37 ... can we use it?
 * hyperair thinks python packages are a pain.
<hyperair> autotools packages are dead easy.
<doctormo> Well, I have the rules file and I created debian/postinst and debian/prerm files, didn't work.
<directhex> hyperair, port them to ipy!
<hyperair> directhex: nothanks.
<directhex> doctormo, how is your rules file written? cdbs, dh7, dh6 (lots of dh_foo commands), something else?
<doctormo> dh6, I gather, I'll pastebin it
 * a|wen mutters something about autotools and python combined
<doctormo> http://pastebin.com/m55dfa40a
<directhex> a|wen, autofoo generally.
<james_w> doctormo: how many binary packages does the source package build?
<doctormo> james_w: one, but it may or may not be good to have one per driver.
<a|wen> well, just not very easy to figure out what goes wrong
<directhex> doctormo, okay, for the sake of argument, can we try porting to dh7?
<directhex> doctormo, in case it's a missing dh_ stanza?
<doctormo> directhex: sure thing, your the bos
<james_w> directhex: nope
<james_w> dh_installdeb is there
<directhex> james_w, oh. hrm...
<james_w> doctormo: your sh_shlibdeps shouldn't be after dh_builddeb, but that's irrelevant
<directhex> doctormo, is it that preinst et al are not being executed, or are not being packaged? try running "dpkg -I /path/to/output.deb preinst" to make it show you the contents of the preinst
<james_w> there's no point in trying to calculate that stuff to put in the debs if they have already been built
<doctormo> directhex: They're not being packaged, the control.tar.gz doesn't contain them as it should.
<james_w> doctormo: also, presumably these modules aren't arch independent, so you should be doing the work in binary-arch, not binary-indep
<james_w> doctormo: you can turn on DH_VERBOSE and get some visibility in to what is going on
<james_w> maybe not enough, but it might work
<doctormo> james_w: Thanks, these are things I don't know.
<doctormo> http://divajutta.com/doctormo/iscan-plugins-all.tar.bz2 <- these are the relivent files
<doctormo> james_w: I have 2 parts, one is a 64 bit version and the other is a 32 bit version, I must admit to attempting packaging beyond my station. I'm such there is a lot at fault with it.
<james_w> # Automatically added by dh_makeshlibs
<james_w> if [ "$1" = "configure" ]; then
<james_w> 	ldconfig
<james_w> fi
<james_w> # End automatically added section
<james_w> that's a bit worrying
<james_w> is this file (postinst) just taken from epson?
<doctormo> james_w: yep, made sure there was distributing rights first though.
<james_w> well those file will want some fixing
<james_w> but that's not the immediate problem
<james_w> 	sed s/#DEBHELPER#// < debian/postinst > debian/iscan-plugins/DEBIAN/postinst
<james_w> so it's doing the right thing
<james_w>      998 bytes,    28 lines * postinst             #!/bin/sh
<james_w>      132 bytes,     7 lines * postrm               #!/bin/sh
<james_w>      900 bytes,    22 lines * prerm                #!/bin/sh
<james_w> I don't see the same problem as you
<doctormo> james_w: let me try again, `debuild` right?
<james_w> that was just "fakeroot debian/rules binary"
<james_w> debuild should work though
<doctormo> hmm
<james_w> you're not building the -64 package are you?
<doctormo> james_w: no, is there a way to organise these two packages together?
<james_w> probably
<doctormo> huh, well it all seems to work, I guess I was just too tired and sick to test it right last week
<a|wen> james_w: can you look at this ... doesn't this look like boost borked-ness? http://paste.ubuntu.com/167909/ (this is 1.35)
<james_w> yeah, might be
<a|wen> james_w: it looks to be the compiler going angry at the syntax ... anyone we want to report it too?
<james_w> well, I'd confirm it was a problem in boost first
<james_w> a minimal test case would be useful if it is
<a|wen> okay ... i'll just make a new fresh karmic chroot and see if i can make a small test case
<gilir> james_w: thanks for the ACKs :)
<james_w> gilir: np
<james_w> getting quite tiring now though, when are you going to stop for the day :-)
<gilir> also need to do something else for today :)
<james_w> I can't test xapian-omega as xapian-core FTBFS on i386
<a|wen> james_w: i have a "hello world" script to show the problem ... but apparently it is already known to broken
<james_w> 1.35?
<a|wen> jup
<a|wen> james_w: for reference ... this fails http://pastebin.com/f44e80488
<tgm4883> is there an easy way to test postinst without having to build the package each time?
<bddebian> Could someone possibly upload gnote for me from REVU?  I seem to have issues logging into REVU these days.
<Laney> if you upload it I can archive
<bddebian> I'm not sure I can upload to Ubuntu atm :(
<bizkut> http://osgeeks.blogspot.com/2009/05/compiling-ubuntu-karmic-koala-mipsel.html
<dtchen> bddebian: you can.
<dtchen> Barry deFreese    2005-09-06 21:09:02 UTC  2005-09-06    2010-04-06 00:00:00 UTC  2010-04-06   Approved
<geser> a|wen: compiling your paste with "g++ -I /usr/include/python2.6/ -l boost_python-py26 -lpython2.6 foo.c -o foo" works here (a karmic pbuilder)
<a|wen> geser: wich version of libboost?
<geser> libboost-python-dev               1.34.1-15ubuntu3
<a|wen> well... i'm claiming that 1.35 is broken
<bddebian> dtchen: I mean I don't have an Ubuntu box atm and I don't think I have dput set up for Ubuntu on sid but forget it
<Laney> debsign the packages for me and I'll dput
<Laney> that works, right?
<a|wen> geser: 1.37 works fine as well, and i suppose 1.34 also does, though i haven't tested that
<geser> the package for libboost-python-1.37-dev looks broken for me: /build/buildd/boost1.37-1.37.0/debian/libboost-python1.37-dev/usr/share/python-support/pyste/Pyste
<geser> is one of the dirs in the deb
<a|wen> he, that does not look good ... but at least it let's some things compile
<geser> a|wen: https://svn.boost.org/trac/boost/ticket/2069
<a|wen> geser: that does indeed look like it
<geser> try applying the mpl.patch from this ticket
<a|wen> geser: i'll try that a little later (rebuilding my karmic pbuilder af debootstrapping works) ... my real problem was solved by just switching to 1.37 (though someone needs to fix that packaging)
<geser> a|wen: after applying mpl.patch, your paste builds with boost1.35
<a|wen> geser: okay ... it sounding like swithching to 1.37 was encouraged over 1.35 so might just stick with that; but i'll apply and test just so we can get it fixed
<bizkut> how to automate "apt-get -b source" the Unmet build dependencies when "apt-get -b source"?
<RoAkSoAx> hey guys, how can I figure out why it FTBFS ? or how do I know which dependencies have failed to install?
<maco> RoAkSoAx: read through the log it emails you?
<hyperair> jpds: having done considerable work on tomboy-latex's packaging, may i add my name to debian/copyright?
<RoAkSoAx> maco, k thanks
<Laney> fun fix for anyone wanting to work on ubuntu-dev-tools: find all mentioned Ubuntu codenames and convert them to be pulled from LP using the API
<Laney> I made ubuntuDevelopmentSeries() but you could use the API to get all current series
<jmarsden> Laney: Wouldn't that make using the tools when one lacks an Internet connection impossible?  Or are you arranging for the tools to cache the set of names?
<nhandler> Laney: That would be a little annoying to do for the non-python scripts
<nhandler> jmarsden: Some of the tools do require an internet connection to work
<Laney> Most of them, I'd imagine
<Laney> nhandler: Yes. One could code up a wrapper to output them.
<kklimonda> hey, when i compile source I get an error "error: ignoring return value of âwriteâ, declared with attribute warn_unused_result", is there any way to explicitly ignore value returned?
<nhandler> Laney: And there would be a small performance hit for the extra api call
<Laney> that's right
<nhandler> I think updating them every release might be more work, but it definitely makes the scripts more efficient
<Laney> you could be clever and arrange for a cache to be generated in the postinst or similar
<tgm4883> Is there someone who can take a look at this debconf config file I made  http://mythbuntu.pastebin.com/m135d7b0b  I was following http://www.fifi.org/doc/debconf-doc/tutorial.html#AEN113  but when I answer yes I get "[: 92: =: unexpected operator" and it doesn't ask me the nested questions
<tgm4883> basically the problem is that debconf never asks the questions inside the if statement
<tgm4883> but I can't see a problem with it
<jmarsden> tgm4883: Can $RET be empty?  If so try testing more like if [ x"$RET" = x"true" ] ?
<geser> Laney: I'm looking at your u-d-t commit. Are you aware of bug 358332? I don't know what the fix will look like but you should perhaps check that _ubuntuSeries() still works as expected after that fix
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 358332 in launchpad-registry "[API] OOPS when distribution.getSeries() is called with an invalid name or version" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/358332
<Laney> geser: Right, we'll have to change which exception is caught
 * Laney subscribes
<james_w> why do we even allowing specifying a release?
<james_w> is it just because we don't record the current development release anywhere?
<Laney> I thought that, but that's a potential fight that I didn't want to have
<james_w> I like the change you made
<Laney> the requestsync code needs a good old cleanup
<james_w> me = findall('~(\S+)', '%s' % launchpad.me)[0]
<james_w> urgh
<james_w> me = launchpad.me.name
<Laney> wasn't me guv'nor
<james_w> yeah
<james_w> but still
<Laney> :)
<james_w> team = "motu"
<james_w> is that still used for anything?
<Laney> yeah, for upload privs now
<Laney> I think?
<james_w> you changed team = "ubuntu-dev" to that, but I'm not sure why requestsync would need to know anything about motu anymore
<RoAkSoAx> is there any documentation in the Ubuntu Wiki that shows how to work with FTBFS
<RoAkSoAx> ?
<Laney> james_w: only to say which team you're not a member of for the error
<james_w> ah
<Laney> s/error/message/
<james_w> "don't have upload rights for this package" might be better?
<Laney> yeah, could be. That isPerPackageUploader check is probably redundant too now.
<nhandler> james_w: ubuntu-dev is used for Per Package Uploaders and motus and core-dev. MOTU is for normal MOTUS
<james_w> yeah
 * Nafallo stealth hugs james_w 
<Laney> oh, no - it's used later on
<james_w>  canUploadPackage doesn't check per-package uploaders?
<james_w> _findMember should check is_valid as well I guess
<Laney> PPUs have a bit of extra text put on their sync requests
<Laney> what does that do?
<james_w> not sure
<james_w> it's for deactivated teams or something I guess
<james_w> probably won't be an issue, but for correctness I guess it should be checked
 * Nafallo got ignored
<james_w> hey Nafallo :-)
<Nafallo> james_w: :-)
<james_w> 388 		
<james_w>     if lp_functions.isLPTeamMember('ubuntu-bugs'):
<james_w> 389 		
<james_w>         task.transitionToImportance(importance='Wishlist')
<james_w> that's not right is it?
<james_w> ubuntu-bugcontrol is the team that controls that isn't it?
<stgraber> indeed
<jmarsden> RoAkSoAx: I don't see anything in the wiki about FTBFS specifically... but in the general case, you "just" add patches so that the package does BFS... right?  How much is there that could usefully be written about this?
<geser> RoAkSoAx: have you a specific FTBFS you try to solve?
<RoAkSoAx> geser, yes
<Nafallo> james_w: jpds says he didn't do that ;-)
<geser> RoAkSoAx: which one?
<RoAkSoAx> geser, : https://launchpad.net/~andreserl/+archive/ppa/+build/994515
<geser> RoAkSoAx: that one is easy
<RoAkSoAx> geser, how can I solve it?
<RoAkSoAx> geser, or better yet, how is a regular process to solve a FTBFS
<geser> /bin/sh is dash and it doesn't support {} expanding
<geser> RoAkSoAx: the first part is to understand why it failed. but as there are many different reasons it's hard to document
<geser> RoAkSoAx: in this case you need to expand the {} by hand
<geser> RoAkSoAx: rm $(CURDIR)/usr/lib/keysafe/libkeysafe/cryptobotan.a
<geser> RoAkSoAx: rm $(CURDIR)/usr/lib/keysafe/libkeysafe/cryptobotan.la
<geser> and so on for the other
<geser> or list all files on one line (which ever you prefer)
<RoAkSoAx> geser, oh I see... and should I document that on the changelog?
<geser> RoAkSoAx: yes, as you need to write one for the new version it would be best to fill it with something useful :)
<geser> I usually write something like "Removed bashism in debian/rules" in such cases
<RoAkSoAx> geser, ok awesome!! thanks :)
<RoAkSoAx> geser, and should this change be sent to debian or is it just an ubuntu change?
<RoAkSoAx> geser, and would it be better to do: Remove bashism in debian/rules that cause FTBFS?
<RoAkSoAx> geser, btw.. should it be: rm $(KEYSAFE_LIB_DIR)/cryotobotan.a or rm $(CURDIR)/usr/lib/keysafe/libkeysafe/cryptobotan.a ?
<geser> RoAkSoAx: I didn't look at the rules files itself, just guessed from the log: so rm $(KEYSAFE_LIB_DIR)/cryotobotan.a would be better
<geser> RoAkSoAx: and forward it to Debian too, as they try too to get everything build with dash (IIRC it was even a lenny release goal)
<RoAkSoAx> geser, it fails to build after doing the changes
<geser> RoAkSoAx: what exactly you put into the changelog entry is up to you
<geser> hmm
<RoAkSoAx> geser, http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/168127/
<geser> ah, that error, let me find the bug number
<geser> RoAkSoAx: see bug 373214
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 373214 in linux "/usr/include/asm/* is not present in linux-libc-dev" [Critical,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/373214
<RoAkSoAx> geser, so should I just update my pbuilder and it will be fixed?
<geser> yes
<RoAkSoAx> geser, k thanks :)
<nhandler> RoAkSoAx: If you do not have a download limit per month for your internet, you might consider installing the pbuilder hook that causes it to update itself before building
<RoAkSoAx> nhandler, k thanks :)
<RoAkSoAx> btw.. in the changelog, for example in last ubuntu version they created a patch, in the newer debian version that patch has been merged, but there's nothing on the changelog about it. In the ubuntu version i'm merging should I include something in the changelog that says: drop xxx.patch ?
<james_w> yep
<RoAkSoAx> james_w, so It would be something like: Drop debian/patches/xx.patch. Included upstream?
<james_w> yeah
<nhandler> RoAkSoAx: Keep in mind, there really aren't strict requirements for debian/changelog. You just want to explain the changes you make and why you are making them.
<RoAkSoAx> ok awesome. Thanks guys :)
<Laney> http://www.ouaza.com/wp/2009/05/09/quilt-patch-management-with-debhelper-7/
<Laney> phwoar
<sebner> Laney: lol, just a minute ago I read this blog entry and now you post the link ^^
<Laney> \o/
<nhandler> sebner: I read the blog entry on the planet too
<sebner> Laney: we have to tell meebey!
<sebner> nhandler: ^^
<nyu> whoops, debhelper is becoming cdbs
<sebner> nyu: but much saner ;)
<directhex> and overridable, rather than shake-your-fist-at-itable
<nyu> I was never really fond of the implementation in cdbs (even if I wrote part of it myself).  it's the concept that makes it so useful
<nyu> which has been implemented a few times already.  if debhelper will finally "get it right", I'm happy with that
<binarymutant> if anyone would care to review and possibly advocate my package, http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/lxsplit, I would be very appreciative
<neversfelde> hi, how do I test a get-orig-source rule in debian/rules?
<sebner> neversfelde: chmod +x rules then ./debian/rules get-orig-source
<Laney> or make -f
<neversfelde> it is up do date, so I think it works, thank you
<neversfelde> do I have to create a foo_version.orig.tar.gz of the svn dir by myself, or is that wrong?
<a|wen> neversfelde: you create an orig.tar.gz from an svn export
<Laney> neversfelde: if you are packaging a snapshot you should write a get-orig-source rule which generates the orig
<Laney> it will probably use svn export, yes
<neversfelde> mhh, I should have another look at the documentation, ty
<james_w> JontheEchidna: hey, do you really need a transitional package for windowslist if it was only in karmic?
<JontheEchidna> oh, for some reason I thought it was in jaunty
<JontheEchidna> it was in jaunty ;-)
<james_w> really?
<james_w> not according to LP
<JontheEchidna> brb
<james_w> oh, it's a source package rename as well?
<james_w> which was apparently renamed from something previous to that
<james_w> can't you make your minds up? :-)
<a|wen> not when upstream can't ;)
<JontheEchidna> sorry, phone
<james_w> np
<JontheEchidna> plasmoid -> plasma-widget was a rename for all plasma widgets
<JontheEchidna> Debian decided on a different name than we had...
<JontheEchidna> so we got to rename all of the plasmoids
<JontheEchidna> but windowslist -> windowlist was an upstream change
<neversfelde> gnah, I always gets an
<neversfelde> svn: Syntax error in revision argument 'svn://anonsvn.kde.org/home/kde/trunk/extragear/network/choqok'
<neversfelde> svn: Syntax error in revision argument 'svn://anonsvn.kde.org/home/kde/trunk/extragear/network/choqok'
<neversfelde> sorry
<neversfelde> and  I followed our MOTU docs
<neversfelde> the line in rules is
<neversfelde>         svn export -r $(SVN_REVISION) svn://anonsvn.kde.org/home/kde/trunk/extragear/network/choqok choqok \
<neversfelde> and I changed changelog before
<neversfelde> any suggestions?
<james_w> $(SVN_REVISION) is not set
<james_w> it's complaining that the url is a bad revision ('-r') argument
<neversfelde> I thought it is enough to do this in changelog?
<james_w> nope
<neversfelde> so where do I have to mention it?
<JontheEchidna> in debian/rules
<JontheEchidna> lemme paste an example
<JontheEchidna> http://paste.ubuntu.com/168179/ (This is from the old lancelot package
<neversfelde> mhh, thanks so far, it does not work at the moment, I will have another look tomorrow
<neversfelde> oh, I think I got it, was a simple typo
#ubuntu-motu 2009-05-10
<binarymutant> if anyone would care to review and possibly advocate my package, http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/lxsplit, I would be very appreciative
<nhandler> binarymutant: I don't have time for a full review, but you should mention the patch that you added in debian/changelog
<kostmo__> dear reviewers, would anyone like to take a look at my new package http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/ppower ?  It is for controlling X10 devices unsupported by the "bottlerocket" package.
<binarymutant> nhandler, thank you, I will add that information
<james_w> urgh, I wish I had never looked at this package now
<binarymutant> :( hope its not mine :(
<james_w> nah
<binarymutant> :)
<directhex> poor james_w
<james_w> I think maybe we should put it out to pasture
<directhex> as long as it's not "linux" we're talking about...
<binarymutant> if anyone would care to review and possibly advocate my package, http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/lxsplit, I would be very appreciative
<binarymutant> if someone has the time to review and possibly advocate my package, http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/lxsplit, I would be extremely appreciative. Thanks :)
<serialorder> I have a package that FTBFS because debian/rules calls pythong2.6
<serialorder> python2.6*
<serialorder> sorry i will start over
<serialorder> I have a package that FTBFS because debian/rules calls python2.5
<serialorder> changing it to python2.6 corrects the problem
<serialorder> what I am wondering is if I should change it to python2.6 or the less brittle /usr/bin/python ?
<lifeless> serialorder: well, find out why first
<lifeless> if there is a reason for it to call a specific version you will need to keep doing that
<serialorder> I dont think there is anything version specific in there, I will double check and if there is not then should I just call python ?
<lifeless> if there is no reason to use a specific one, just call 'python'
<serialorder> thanks lifeless
<binarymutant> If someone has the time to advocate my package http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/lxsplit I would greatly appreciate it :)
<Stupendoussteve> I am working on a merge on a package in Universe, Maintainer is set to Ubuntu Core Developers, is this correct?
<lifeless> unlikely but possible
<lifeless> some packages in universe build binaries for main
<jdong> could also be a hastily demoted package
<Stupendoussteve> It hasn't been touched since gutsy
<lifeless> likely wrong then... what package?
<Stupendoussteve> It is ssed
<Stupendoussteve> The changes are not large, I am doing it for practice but would like to correct that if it is wrong :)
<lifeless> certainly looks wrong to me
<lifeless> I'd change it
<binarymutant> any available to do a revu?
<iulian> directhex: Hey.  You don't need to ack your own sync requests, just file the bug and subscribe u-a.
<iulian> binarymutant: If you say what package it is, then perhaps someone will take a look at it.
<binarymutant> If someone has the time to advocate my package http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/lxsplit I would greatly appreciate it :)
<fransman> What got to be done to get debbug 473781 done, so we solve a ubuntu one
<Elbrus> fransman: have you contacted the maintainer?
<fransman> Elbrus: If I am well Savvas Radevic did that for bug 319204
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 319204 in flumotion "Please package new upstream version of flumotion (universe)" [Wishlist,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/319204
<savvas> present!
<fransman> savvas: Did you contacted the maintainer as Elbrus is asking for
<savvas> fransman: as far as I remember, the reply was it has to be tested and given the appropriate build-depends
<savvas> fransman: it was quite some time ago, so.. lool: what's the status with flumotion in debian? :)
<fransman> savvas: but that's ok, we are here now http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=473781
<ubottu> Debian bug 473781 in flumotion "flumotion: new upstream release" [Wishlist,Open]
<lool> savvas: ENOTIME
<savvas> er.. what?
<lool> As in I don't have time to take care of new upstream versions
<lool> I think the packaging is decent, there are some oddnesses, but updating it to new upstream versions requires careful checking of the deps
<savvas> ok thanks :)
<fransman> savvas: Are you in contact with Thomas Vander Stichele to help you out?
<lool> I'm not 100% sure he's the best contact
<fransman> lool: because he does the same for rpm if I am well
<savvas> fransman: I'm not interested in the package, but maybe I'll check it out later and provide a new cleaner patch for the new upstream version - but no promises though, exam perios is coming up soon :)
<lool> Well that's quite different packaging; I don't think he's versed in Debian packaging; he does know the flumotion code well though
<savvas> *period
<lool> Someone from Fluendo picked up my packaging for their internal use; but I don't recall who it was and I don't see him on #fluendo
<lool> (probably because it's the WEÂ°
<fransman> lool: was it jdahlin?
<lool> I think so
<fransman> lool: Thomas said we list the dependencies in our README, in configure.ac, and in the rpm spec
<lool> Some are split differently in Debian/Ubuntu, e.g. twisted, and the runtime deps are tricky to get right
<fransman> true
<fransman> lool: Can I forward a e-mail by Thomas to you?
<binarymutant> If someone has the time to review and possibly advocate my package http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/lxsplit I would greatly appreciate it :)
<lool> fransman: Sure
<artfwo> binarymutant: I am not a MOTU neither I am good at packaging, but you have a common mistake: the changelog should only contain an "Initial release" entry AFAIK
<lifeless> artfwo: it can contain multiple entries
<artfwo> oh, by was often told by the crowd to collapse all the entries into a single one
<a|wen> that depends on the sponsor ... some wants it collapsed, some don't and some don't care
<lifeless> its more style than anything
<lifeless> binarymutant: consider using dh 7, its much more compact
<lifeless> artfwo: that said, the package he's asking for review only has one changelog entry
<lifeless> --- lxsplit-0.2.4.orig/debian/changelog
<lifeless> +++ lxsplit-0.2.4/debian/changelog
<lifeless> @@ -0,0 +1,7 @@
<lifeless> +lxsplit (0.2.4-0ubuntu1) karmic; urgency=low
<binarymutant> lifeless, I was wanting to keep in good standing with backports
<binarymutant> for the dh5
<lifeless> backports can depend on other backported packages
<binarymutant> thanks a lot lifeless for taking the time to check out that package :)
<lifeless> np
<savvas> anyone to review http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/gnote ?
<artfwo> perhaps someone also feels like reviewing http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/scantailor ? :)
<AnAnt> LP #1
<JimHansson> how do I upload packages to REVU?
<artfwo> JimHansson: see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/Packages/REVU
<binarymutant> JimHansson, dput revu *.changes
<JimHansson> yes but it says i need to upload my public key first
<artfwo> GPG key is uploaded at https://launchpad.net/people/+me/+editpgpkeys
<JimHansson> found it, thanks
<geser> a|wen: re bug 371617: I've already a patch for it, should I proceed with it or will you?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 371617 in boost1.37 "Installs files to /build/buildd" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/371617
<a|wen> geser: testbuild at 98% ... do you have it testbuilt=
<geser> yes, in my PPA
<geser> my fix is removing $(pyste_root) from the --install-lib value
<a|wen> geser: that is not enough
<a|wen> you need to change to pyshared as well ... else python-support coughs and removes your pyste completely
<geser> ok, then you can proceed with this bug
<geser> a|wen: btw the boost-1.35 and gcc-4.4 problem is already fixed in the debian package, but needs to be merged. see bug 373962
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 373962 in boost1.35 "Please merge boost1.35 1.35.0-10 from debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/373962
<a|wen> geser: i'll put a correct debdiff on the bug that has been testbuilt in 3 minutes
<a|wen> geser: oh ... i have the FTBFS fix as well (at least mine builds with the patch currently)
<jpds> hyperair: Yes.
<jpds> hyperair: As long as mine's still there of course :)
<brennion_> I'm trying to fix a bug, but still hanging on a pid rights issue
<brennion_> the startup script uses chuid, and it seems the user have no right to write the pid file..
<brennion_> what is the nice way for solving this ?
<savvas> liblapack-dev is still not available for lpia right?
<savvas> hrm..
<savvas> why was support dropped on lapack in cgal package?
<directhex> when would you use LAPACK on lpia?
<savvas> good point :P
<savvas> ah my bad, it's atlas that's failing
<jpds> ./sync_db.sh
<jpds> ls
<jpds> Erm...
<savvas> Error: Wrong terminal!
<savvas> :)
<jpds> savvas: Not quite, just grouped the wrong windows :)
<savvas> oh :P ok
<AnAnt> what's Strachiatella sessin ?
<geser> a "vanilla" session with some "chocolate" parts :)
<AnAnt> oh
<AnAnt> and what are these ?
<geser> sorry, I don't know the details
<AnAnt> maybe I should checkout an ice-cream shop ?
<geser> lol
<AnAnt> james_w: ping
<AnAnt> LP 369914
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 369914 in sabily "Design an icon for new notification system" [Wishlist,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/369914
<AnAnt> LP #369914
<savvas> AnAnt: you could forward your patch to debian :)
<AnAnt> savvas: well, my question is, is this patch relevant to those using the old notification system or not ?
<savvas> ah no idea, but libnotify-bin tools seem to still work as expected
<BUGabundo> hi
<BUGabundo> building my 1st deb
<BUGabundo> having a bit trouble with debuild
<BUGabundo> signfile vuze_4.2.0.2-1~getdeb1.dsc BUGabundo <ubuntu@BUGabundo.net>
<BUGabundo> gpg: skipped "BUGabundo <ubuntu@BUGabundo.net>": secret key not available
<BUGabundo> how do I add what I need to add?
<jpds> gpg -K - take the key ID and add the -k$KEYID flag to debuild.
<BUGabundo> jpds: thanks... but slower.. ehh
<BUGabundo> I've got the key, now what?
<jpds> debuild -S -sa -kKEYID
<BUGabundo> ahh ok
<BUGabundo> Successfully signed dsc and changes files
<BUGabundo> jpds: thank you so much
<jpds> \o/ win
<jpds> BUGabundo: No problem at all.
<BUGabundo> now back to nag joaopinto to get it on getdeb or my ppa
<geser> BUGabundo: debsign tries to find the key by using the name and email from the changelog entry
<BUGabundo> geser: I think is that the email I use is a secondary of they
<BUGabundo> *the key
<BUGabundo> and so it failed to find it.... with key it worked
<BUGabundo> now I have to check what email it put there... it the one in the change log or the primary in the key
<geser> as long as it matches a uid of your key, it should get found
<geser> I don't know if it's case-sensitive or not
<BUGabundo> http://pastebin.ca/1418187
<BUGabundo> humm now that I look at it... something is not right
<savvas> maybe you have to set $DEBFULLNAME $DEBEMAIL ?
<hyperair> jpds: sure no problem
<BUGabundo> lunch... will learn more latter. thanks guys
<MaximLevitsky> I have a patch to fix small bug in open-terminal extension
<MaximLevitsky> I have attached it to bug report, yet I don't see it yet in the package
<MaximLevitsky> How I include it
<MaximLevitsky> ?
<MaximLevitsky> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nautilus-open-terminal/+bug/333462
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 333462 in nautilus-open-terminal "nautilus crashed with SIGSEGV in strlen()" [Medium,Confirmed]
<james_w> savvas, nyu: tar: gnote-0.3.1/gnote-0.3.1.tar.bz2: implausibly old time stamp 1970-01-01 01:00:00
<nyu> james_w: this is to archieve md5sum consistency with debian.  it was requested by directhex
<directhex> nyu, you only need to untar if you're repacking the source's contents (e.g. +dfsg)
<directhex> nyu, if you are not untarring, you can use bzcat and preserve the tar's integrity
<james_w> why did you have to set it to that date to achieve that?
<directhex> hang on, let me find a snippet
<james_w> couldn't you just use the same tarball?
<lifeless> james_w: same date always, vcs snapshot
<nyu> directhex, james_w: it complains about the parent tarball, not the upstream one
<nyu> the upstream tarball is pristine
<james_w> and is all this code really just (C) Hubert?
<nyu> no
<directhex> well, welcome to a tar-in-tar problem i suppose
<directhex>         bzcat $(DEB_SOURCE_NAME)_$(VERSION).orig.tar.bz2 | \
<directhex>                 gzip -9fn -c - > $(DEB_SOURCE_NAME)_$(VERSION).orig.tar.gz
<nyu> james_w: check debian/copyright
<directhex> that produces pristine gz from bz2, if you just mangle the upstream tarball rather than tar-in-tar
<directhex> without timestamp foo
<james_w> well, I was referring to the copyright headers
<james_w> but that's odd anyway
<nyu> james_w: the original tomboy authors didn't assert copyright in most of the headers.  in those where they did, it has been preserved
<james_w> still
<james_w> we *know* that he doesn't have sole copyright to those files
<azeem> nyu: last time I checked, gnote had something like a tomboy debian/copyright
<nyu> sure we do.  it's a very common situation
<james_w> how?
<directhex> the usual technique when there's ambiguity is to ask - i.e. "can you please add appropriate headers to these files, to make it clear you have copyright"
<james_w> how is it not a derivative work?
<directhex> there's an open tomboy bug about it afaik
<james_w> anyway, it's a reject for now
<nyu> james_w: what do you mean?
<james_w> I'll talk to other archive admins about the other issues when it comes back around
<james_w> nyu: the files were taken from tomboy and ported, which in all likelyhood makes them a derivative work
<nyu> james_w: indeed, it's a derivative work
<nyu> james_w: why would that be a problem?
<james_w> but it also suggests that the people who have copyright on the original probably have a call for a share of copyright in the derivative
<nyu> of course they do
<nyu> they just didn't bother to assert it
<directhex> http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=517369
<ubottu> Gnome bug 517369 in General "Tomboy licence headers" [Normal,New]
<nyu> but they can still do that
<james_w> well, they didn't put the statement in every header
<james_w> it's not the reason for the reject
<james_w> I just think it is disingenuous on the part of gnote
<azeem> I think gnote upstream is just somewhat incompetent WRT copyright maybe
<directhex> and/or tomboy upstream
<azeem> right
<nyu> james_w: so what's the reason?
<directhex> but like i said, "<directhex> the usual technique when there's ambiguity is to ask - i.e. "can you please add appropriate headers to these files, to make it clear you have copyright""
<azeem> but apparently the Debian/Ubuntu maintainers trying to sneak in some of their agenda through this
<james_w> nyu: debian/copyright is incomplete
<nyu> james_w: it refers to copyright.tomboy, which is a verbatim copy of the tomboy debian/copyright
<nyu> is that one incomplete as well?
<james_w> it asserts blanket GPL v3, which is untrue
<azeem> where's the proposed Ubuntu gnote debian/copyright?
<directhex> azeem, on revu
<azeem> k
<nyu> the combined result can be distributed only under GPLv3 (or later)
<nyu> the same happens in many other projects (e.g. gcc)
<nyu> or linux
<james_w> and yes, the tomboy debian/copyright isn't great either
<nyu> anyway, what do you suggest?
<azeem> nyu: obviously the copyright is wrong no?
<james_w> reject mail sent
<nyu> james_w: alright.  would you rather have those specified in copyright or in copyright.tomboy ?
<james_w> copyright
<savvas> ok, got the info :)
<directhex> and be warned that debian ftpmaster is unlikely to be more friendly than ubuntu archive-admin, IME
<nyu> directhex: after having dealt with mails from katie for 8 years, you get used to them
<nyu> I don't remember any of them being unfriendly, at least not by comparison with debian's standards
<directhex> well, sure, by debian standards, not being told to gobble on body parts is polite
<directhex> but ftpmaster is really REALLY strict over copyright these days
<james_w> I don't think that's helpful
<james_w> they have more to deal with than us, and are more thinly spread
<directhex> oh, absolutely
<directhex> my point is "make sure any changes made to meet ubuntu's standards also go into the package sat in NEW - BEFORE any DD has to duplicate james_w's work and say 'nuh'"
<james_w> oh, I'd agree with that :-)
<james_w> it seems that [REVU] mails are another convention we have that is poorly regarded
<nhandler> james_w: What are you talking about? The emails that users are meant to send out after they upload a new package?
<james_w> no, when you sponsor a package in to the archive you are supposed to send a mail to ubuntu-motu
<nhandler> james_w: Yeah, that was what I was talking about
<james_w> oh, sorry
<nhandler> james_w: Do you think it would be beneficial to add a section about uploading packages from REVU to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MOTU/New ?
<savvas> james_w: when the package is rejected, the fix is uploaded on revu again, correct?
<james_w> probably
<vadi2> In my package for a c++ program, how can I get 'make' to be executed in a specific folder, not the root one?
<james_w> savvas: ask your sponsor if they are willing to re-upload to the archive again
<nhandler> james_w: I'll try and add a small section sometime today. It is Mother's Day, so I might not get to it until later
<savvas> ok thanks!
<james_w> usually it's just small changes, so it doesn't need re-review
<james_w> thanks nhandler
<directhex> americanese mothers' day. t'is different to the britland one
<directhex> oh, who do i poke to be on planet ubuntu?
<soren> directhex: Noone
<soren> directhex: You add yourself.
<soren> directhex: Link to instructions is on the site itself.
<nhandler> directhex: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PlanetUbuntu
<LucidFox> Okay, I've prepared a dynamic libmp4v2 patch for gtkpod that will allow us to kill gtkpod-aac.
<directhex> LucidFox, yays!
<LucidFox> Can I add a transitional gtkpod-aac binary package to gtkpod while there is a separate gtkpod-aac source package?
<LucidFox> Or is the correct way something else?
<directhex> okay, in theory i've added myself to planet then
<nhandler> directhex: The planet runs through cron, so it might take a wihle for your blog post to appear
<directhex> nhandler, indeed. just hope i didn't get it horribly wrong
<directhex> same feed as i set planet.ubuntu-uk to use
<nhandler> directhex: Did you remember not to add the feed for your entire blog, but to add a feed that is linked to a certain tag?
<LucidFox> I don't see him in the user list on http://planet.ubuntu.com , is this correct?
<directhex> nhandler, aye
<nhandler> :)
<directhex> nhandler, yay for tags
<directhex> nhandler, and i have a mildly patched wordpress to express full blog posts in a standard way too, rather than wp's content:encoded
<james_w> is kblog the same as the kblogger we have in the archive?
<james_w> hmm, it appears to be part of kdepimlibs
<LucidFox> Oh, now I see the link to directhex's blog on the sidebar
<gnomefreak> apt install suggests by default now?
<james_w> nope
<gnomefreak> thanks
<LucidFox> How do I pass a ./configure parameter in debhelper 7?
<directhex> LucidFox, ehm... you have options here, depending on WHICH VERSION of dh7 is used
<LucidFox> It's just >= 7 and I don't want to have a stricter version dependency
<directhex> the "7.0" way is:
<hyperair> dh_auto_configure -- bla bla bla
<directhex> edit your build rule
<directhex> use:
<directhex>         dh build --before configure
<directhex> dh_auto_configure -- --foo --bar --prefox=/baz
<directhex> dh build --after configure
<LucidFox> One more thing. Since I'm going to make gtkpod-aac a transitional package...
<LucidFox> The old gtkpod-aac was in multiverse. Can the new gtkpod-aac transitional package be in universe and still have a multiverse dependency?
<james_w> no
<LucidFox> ok, I'll remove it then
<james_w> why does it need a multiverse dependency?
<LucidFox> Those who have already installed gtkpod-aac will have the dependency installed anyway
<james_w> I don't understand
<LucidFox> It's a library in multiverse - the reason gtkpod-aac, a version of gtkpod with libmp4v2 enabled, is in multiverse in the first place.
<james_w> but why does the new package need to depend on it?
<james_w> it seems that you don't want a transitional package here
<LucidFox> From what I have in mind, gtkpod-aac will be upgraded to the transitional package and pull gtkpod, which I patched to dynamically detect the presence of libmp4v2 and enable the functionality accordingly.
<james_w> yeah
<AnAnt> james_w: hello ?
<james_w> but if you want gtkpod-acc to pull in libmp4v2 as well then you're not really after a transitional package
<AnAnt> james_w: regarding LP 369914, what is a Strachiatella session ?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 369914 in sabily "Design an icon for new notification system" [Wishlist,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/369914
<james_w> if you want to keep a package that fives you gtkpod with libmp4v2 actually working then you need a package in multiverse still
<james_w> I don't know the rules on whether a package in universe can build a binary package in multiverse, if it can then you can do this from one source, if not then you still need two source packages
<james_w> hi AnAnt
<AnAnt> james_w: regarding LP 369914, what is a Strachiatella session ?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 369914 in sabily "Design an icon for new notification system" [Wishlist,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/369914
<LucidFox> The way I see it, the gtkpod-aac transitional package is only there for those who already have gtkpod-aac installed, and conversely libmp4v2 too.
<james_w> AnAnt: sorry, I can't spell, it's https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DesktopTeam/Specs/Jaunty/StracciatellaSession
<james_w> http://martinpitt.wordpress.com/2009/02/23/the-stracciatella-gnome-session/
<james_w> LucidFox: ok, so you can put that in universe, but it can't depend on libmp4v2
<LucidFox> Another way would be to replace the current gtkpod-aac with a small native package that does nothing except pulling gtkpod and libmp4v2.
<james_w> and apt autoremove might remove libmp4v2
<AnAnt> james_w: I see, thanks, but do I have to do that ?
<LucidFox> I think I'll just commit the patch for now, and bring it to the mailing list for discussion
<james_w> AnAnt: it would allow you to test whether the change worked with a normal GNOME session, which is what you were interested in
<james_w> there are probably other ways to achieve the same thing though
<binarymutant> If someone has the time to review and possibly advocate my package http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/lxsplit I would be greatly appreciative :)
<geser> nhandler: are you still interested in bug 255514?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 255514 in mod-bt "Please merge mod-bt 0.0.19+p4.2340-1.2 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/255514
<nhandler> geser: If the merge needs updating, you can go ahead and handle it if you want.
<geser> nhandler: I didn't check. I was just looking at my open merges and found it in a comment on one of my merges.
<nhandler> geser: Well, the merge appears to be up-to-date. Let me just confirm that I did it correctly ;)
<geser> nhandler: looks like it needs to be updated to libdb4.7-dev as libaprutil1-dev depends now on libdb4.7-dev
<nhandler> Do you want to handle it geser? If not, I'll update it later today (Mother's Day)
<nhandler> and does anyone have a link to that blog post that showed why getdeb packages are not of the same quality as those in the official ubuntu repos?
<geser> nhandler: if you've time you can merge it. I'm just asking to avoid that we both try to merge it at the same time.
<LucidFox> <nhandler> and does anyone have a link to that blog post that showed why getdeb packages are not of the same quality as those in the official ubuntu repos? <-- Now I'm interested
<nhandler> LucidFox: I know someone created a blog post on that topic a couple of months ago, I just can't find it now
<LucidFox> nhandler> I've just read your post about generating a new GPG key
<LucidFox> Is there a manual?
<nhandler> LucidFox: http://www.debian-administration.org/users/dkg/weblog/48
<nhandler> LucidFox: That is the guide that most blog posts on planet.debian.org linked to
 * directhex has a new key
<directhex> i hope people will sign it lots at UDS
<LucidFox> Gah, not loading. Slashdot effect?
<LucidFox> UDS... lucky you :(
<nhandler> LucidFox: You're not the only one who is not going :(
<directhex> LucidFox, become a key member of the debian mono group, then apply for sponsorship under the guide of "vital to stuff in ubuntu main". easy!
 * e-jat agreed with nhandler :) ..
<LucidFox> directhex> Eh?..
<james_w> LucidFox: I'm not sure that gtkpod can recommend the lib
<nhandler> directhex: I'm hoping that I'll make it to the next UDS in the states (if I can get sponsorship)
<e-jat> nhandler: me too ..
<LucidFox> It's not money that's the issue for me, if that's what you're implying.
 * nhandler has several things that make it difficult for him to attend
<directhex> LucidFox, i don't imply things. i'm not remotely subtle enough.
<LucidFox> ^_^
<nhandler> LucidFox: If you still can't get that page to load, Google has it cached
<LucidFox> the Google cache is taking forever to load :S
<LucidFox> although I can see the HEML source
<LucidFox> * HTML
<directhex> LucidFox, firefox 3 sucks in that regard
<directhex> LucidFox, other browsers don't wait for the whole thing to finish before diplaying, i.e. don't block on crappy ad servers
<directhex> 3.5 fixes it afaik
<LucidFox> arora isn't much better here
<directhex> which browser engine does that use?
<LucidFox> webkit
<directhex> hm. the internet sucks then. simple!
<LucidFox> IE6 in Wine only loads the top bar too
<directhex> ie6 is the very definition of suck
<directhex> like, if there was a suckiness convention, ie6 would be the guest of honour
<directhex> see also: special greeting for IE6 users who visit my blog
<LucidFox> directhex> You'll laugh, but I got it to work by putting Firefox in offline mode.
<directhex> LucidFox, awesome!
<calc> but IE8 is the best ;-)
<directhex> calc, i strongly recommend ie8 for not being ie6, the same way i recommend firefox, chrome, safari, etc
<directhex> i.e. "anything but ie6" is a noble goal
<calc> yea avoid ie6 at all costs :)
<calc> well except for ie1-5 ;-)
 * calc remembers ie1 being really suck
<directhex> i can sorta respect ie4, for being miles more awesome than ns4
<directhex> i never used ie1
<directhex> ie2 i used
<directhex> briefly
<directhex> to go "whoa, where's the netscape icon"
<calc> i used netscape but IE was already there as well
<calc> my first browser was netscape 1.0 iirc
<LucidFox> nhandler> I take it I need to create a wholly new key, not add a new subkey to an existing key?
<directhex> yay, planet works
<nhandler> LucidFox: I believe you need a new key.
<directhex> yes, you need a new key
<directhex> sec   1024D/DFC2AFC1 2006-08-25
<directhex> sec   2048R/0E1FAD0C 2009-05-08
<nixternal> I am waiting until the practical collisions can be done by a laptop before I switch my key :p
<directhex> nixternal, i have a grand total of 2 sigs that matter (DD sigs, for debian NM) on my key. so may as well change
<calc> sec   1024D/8E384AF2 2000-05-15
 * calc doesn't want to lose his old key :-\ heh
 * nhandler needs to get nixternal to sign his key at the next Ubuntu Chicago event
<Laney> bah
<Laney> I should do this too
<directhex> baaaa!
<Laney> I have 0 sigs which matter though
<calc> pretty much old sigs don't matter since the keys will be suspect soon
<nixternal> calc: hahah, me either
<nixternal> took me forever, but I remember my fingerprint :)
<calc> my fingerprint is on my business card though which is a bit annoying to get a new one
<nixternal> thankfully my DD sigs are local :)  I can drive to their house with a 6-pack of beer and force them to sign, if they won't do it via email that is
<nixternal> calc: that is really the reason I don't want to switch yet
<nixternal> I still have about 500 business cards to get rid of first :p
<calc> well i suppose we can always get new keys and just accept the old key still for a certain amount of time before revoking it
<calc> but only send out stuff using the new key
<directhex> calc, that's the recommendation
<calc> since its on business cards you may not want to revoke after 90 days though
<directhex> keep it longer. it's not as if it's trivial to crack yet
<directhex> get plans in place, but don't get hysterical
<calc> yea
<loic-m> I've got a source package that builds both a lib and a dev lib, but I've got a pb with dh_install
<loic-m> I'm using .install files, one for the main lib and one for the dev version
<loic-m> I manage to get the files I want in the -dev .deb
<loic-m> but I can't get rid of those same files in the main lib package
<loic-m> Is there a way to exclude those files from the main lib package?
<azeem> don't add them to its .install files I guess
<loic-m> I don't, but they still get included
<loic-m> the files get build in $(CURDIR)/debian/${version}/usr ( the line is: $(MAKE) -C build/generic install prefix=$(CURDIR)/debian/${version}/usr )
<loic-m> is that the reason they get included in the package?
<azeem> why ${version}?
<loic-m> That's what the previous rule file used
<azeem> it's customary to install into debian/tmp and then copy into the package dirs with dh_install from there
<loic-m> here ${version}=libxvidcore4
<azeem> eh
<azeem> that'd be the shared library package directory
<azeem> so not a staging directory
<loic-m> I've seen debian/tmp used in some package, but recent ones I've seen use ${version} or something similar instead
<loic-m> staging=building ?
<LucidFox> james_w> What's wrong with a universe package recommending a multiverse library?
<azeem> loic-m: I wonder who came up with that
<loic-m> azeem: by staging directory, do you mean $(CURDIR)/debian/${version}/usr is the directory commonly used when building packages?
<loic-m> azeem: no clue for who or why the rules file is like that
<azeem> loic-m: no, the staging directory is the directory the package is being installed at temporarily during package build
<azeem> usually debian/tmp or (for single-binary-packages rather) debian/$package
<loic-m> azeem: thanks, that's what I was trying to express
<loic-m> azeem: I'm still not so clear about where the staging directory is defined
<loic-m> azeem: not in the $(MAKE) line, is it?
<azeem> well, depends
<azeem> most commonly it's the directory defined for DESTDIR
<loic-m> I'm using debian/tmp now and it works. Whoever I still have no clue why before $(CURDIR)/debian/${version}/usr was used as the staging directory
<loic-m> the only line it appears in rules is the $(MAKE) line
<azeem> what is that line?
<loic-m> s/appears/appeared
<loic-m> $(MAKE) -C build/generic install prefix=$(CURDIR)/debian/${version}/usr
<loic-m> it's in install: build
<james_w> LucidFox: I'm not sure, but I think it might be against the rules
<azeem> loic-m: as I said, "most commonly" it's DESTDIR
<azeem> this package chose to mangle the prefix= variable
<azeem> as long as everything else depends on it, it's ok
<loic-m> azeem: I can understand the words, but I can't understand the sentences (both :X )
<azeem> I wrote three of them
<loic-m> azeem: only the first one makes sense to me :p
<azeem> ok, not mangle
<azeem> this package chose not to pass DESTDIR to make install, but the prefix= variable
<loic-m> indeed
<azeem> the end result is the same if (i) prefix= is undestood by the build system and (ii) all paths referenced in the Makefile are relative to ${prefix}
<azeem> sometimes, you see stuff like
<azeem> prefix=/usr
<loic-m> so prefix has the same effect as DESTDIR?
<azeem> shareddatatadir=/usr/share
<loic-m> In this case it's the place there the built files are stored, no?
<azeem> loic-m: in any case, DESTDIR refers to / while prefix refers to /usr
<azeem> what do you mean with "stored"=
<azeem> this is about copying the built files to their installation location
<loic-m> ok, I assumed it was to specify in what dir the files where built, and their installation location would only be set at dh_install time
<azeem> loic-m: the lines above runs the "install" target
<azeem> that's after stuff has been built usually
<loic-m> even though it's on the $(MAKE) command? Isn't $(MAKE) the time they're built?
<azeem> 19:30 < loic-m> $(MAKE) -C build/generic install prefix=$(CURDIR)/debian/${version}/usr
<azeem> I read a "install" in there
<loic-m> you're right. I thought it was the install rule of the upstream makefile, and had no effect on where debian/rules chose to install the files
<loic-m> (f.e. upstream might put their files on a dir, but in Ubuntu we'd use another directory
<maco> directhex: sandy merged a patch in tomboy so that it can handle the dates gnote outputs
<maco> they should be compatible again
<directhex> k
<Laney> how kind!
<directhex> maco, i still think someone failed to act like an adult over that, and it wasn't sandy
<hyperair> directhex: what about?
<AdamDH> any one haveing any issues with lanuchpad today?
<directhex> hyperair, gnote writing tomboy-incompatible notes
<AdamDH> *having
<maco> directhex: agreed
<dtchen> control struggles and ego, as per usual.
<dtchen> welcome to humanity.
<nyu> directhex: euh, why don't you send a patch?
<nyu> adults are busy sometimes
<maco> did you see his response?
<nyu> whose?
<maco> hub's
<nyu> no
<maco> to the "gnote writes incompatible notes that crash tomboy" bug i filed. he basically said screw compatiblity, that's tomboy's problem
<LucidFox> Hmm... more people than I expected actually care about signing GPG keys...
<maco> when tomboy established the format
<azeem> I really thought hub was a reasonable guy until he came up with gnote
 * nyu checks
<azeem> or rather until those kinds of issues came up
<LucidFox> Everyone I checked so far has a rather long list of signatures
<directhex> LucidFox, i don't!
<directhex> LucidFox, i will after UDS though, hopefully
<LucidFox> See :(
<directhex> LucidFox, signatures matter if you want to be a DD
<LucidFox> Ah well, I don't
<dtchen> s/if you want to be a DD//
<LucidFox> still, it makes me kind of sad to see how many of the Ubuntu folks have met each other in person
<nyu> maco: he doesn't exactly say that.  anyway, I think compatibility is important.  if there was a patch, I wouldn't mind adding it to the debian package
<maco> nyu: the bit about not supporting people who want to take their notes back to tomboy?
<maco> that screams "lock in!" to me
<nyu> anyhow, it's less of an issue now that tomboy can read the other timezone format
<maco> yes
<directhex> LucidFox, you said money wasn't an issue for attending UDS. perhaps you could go to the next one?
<LucidFox> And your old key has 5 signatures :)
<directhex> LucidFox, i only met 2 of them face to face, and one is a co0-worker
<maco> er...i got the impression you didn't like crowds so much, LucidFox?
<LucidFox> maco> Indeed
<LucidFox> although "asocial" would be more accurate
 * maco pokes dtchen
<directhex> pfft, you should have seen me at the jaunty release party
<LucidFox> Wait, how can one sign keys without meeting in person?
<nyu> maco: besides, I don't think the tomboy note format was designed with the idea of being interchangeable in mind.  if you just check the bug title, you'll see it's quite platform-dependant
<directhex> ended up standing in a corner looking totally out of place, at a room filled with linux people
<maco> you've seen me nearly every day for nearly a year and you've seen my passport and drivers license and school id as well i think. willing to sign my key yet?
<LucidFox> directhex> :(
<Flannel> maco: He has no way of verifying the person online is the same as in meatspace!
<dtchen> maco: no.
<maco> Flannel: ive given him my key fingerprint :( and he's looked over my shoulder as i've typed here as maco...
<directhex> Flannel, how much of an issue is that, though? that's the question. how much does what someone has in their passport say about whom you work on ubuntu with?
<dtchen> i've explained very clearly that i do not sign keys immediately.
<maco> dtchen: a year != immediate
<dtchen> i don't care if you're the POTUS.
<Flannel> directhex: erm... It's extremely important?
<maco> what do i have to do, marry you?
<dtchen> that will not suffice
<AdamDH> is there a page to show the status of Launchpad?
<maco> but that involves identfying oneself too...
<LucidFox> POTUS?
<maco> LucidFox: obama
<maco> LucidFox: president of the united states
<LucidFox> ahhhh
<maco> there's also SCOTUS: supreme court of the united states (for future reference)
<nixternal> lifeless: find out anything on the blank build-deps for lxsplit in REVU?
<nixternal> if you check out the hello package which is used to show how to package for debian, it has 0 deps
<LucidFox> A trip to an Ubuntu convention would cost a truckload of money, resolve various legal and upkeep matters I have absolutely no experience with, and I'd have to explain it to my paranoid parents, and I'd probably feel out of place anyway.
<LucidFox> Overall not worth it just for seeing you all in person and signing keys
<LucidFox> Sorry about venting :)
<LucidFox> s/resolve/I would have to resolve/
<Laney> andersk: what does super_teams do?
<Laney> btw, you should diff against bzr trunk
<Laney> (I actually rewrote that function yesterday, but your code looks better)
<binarymutant> If someone has the time to review and possibly advocate my package http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/lxsplit I would be greatly appreciative :)
<nixternal> lifeless: concerning lxsplit, I found out that if it builds in the most basic chroot, then have 0 env build deps is fine
<maxb> What does 'env' mean in the above?
<binarymutant> maxb, e
<maxb> huh?
<binarymutant> environment, sorry I'm on a tablet
<ScottK> LucidFox: Debian has a keysigning page that lists nearby DD's that are willing to sign keys.
<maxb> "environment build deps" still doesn't mean anything to me
<ScottK> Ubuntu doesn't have any requirement for signed keys.
<LucidFox> Even in Novosibirsk? Seriously now :p
<binarymutant> maxb, maybe if we switched a few words around.. "chroot env, then having 0 build deps" :P
<maxb> right :-)
<directhex> https://nm.debian.org/gpg_offer.php
<directhex> 2 in moscow, 1 in stalingrad
<LucidFox> ...
<LucidFox> directhex> Not Stalingrad. :p
<LucidFox> And that's like... half of Russia away from me. :)
<directhex> leningrad!
<binarymutant> maxb, nixternal will you advocate? :)
<LucidFox> Good thing it doesn't seem to really matter except for DDship
 * maxb is not motu
<ScottK> St. Petersburg != Stalingrad directhex
<binarymutant> oh, thanks anyways maxb :)
<directhex> scottK, i got my communist leaders mixed round
<sebner> lol
<LucidFox> You see, the other reason I get somewhat angsty is because I read Planet Ubuntu and think, "These are supposed to be geeks? Each and every one of them is 1000 times more social than me!" :)
<directhex> Maograd!
<ScottK> LucidFox: Some people are more social in writing than in person.
<binarymutant> LucidFox, have you tried Planet Gentoo ? j.k
<LucidFox> ScottK> What do you mean?
<directhex> LucidFox, people make themselves appear extra exciting. whereas i have no problem admitting i spent the past 2 hours glued to my chair playing a MMO. super social!
<nixternal> binarymutant: still looking into it....if you put this app on a blank install of ubuntu, and try to build it, it won't right? it needs at least build-essential, which you definitely don't want to dep on...but in a pbuild environment, it builds fine because build-essential is in there already...this is a tricky one, however if 'hello' can be in the archive with 0 build-depends, then I don't see why lxsplit can't
<nixternal> I should go ahead advocate and upload, if someone (archive admin) complains, then we request 'hello' to be removed for the same reasons :p
<binarymutant> nixternal, yes it only requires the build-essentials package to build, it's a very simple program. I thought I could safely leave that build-dep out
<binarymutant> nixternal, lol thank you :)
<maxb> IIRC it says somewhere in debian-policy that you don't have to list build-deps which are build-essential ?
<maco> sounds reasonable...
<directhex> maxb, yes
<binarymutant> maxb, I think it does say that, since build-essentials is required for every package(?)
<maco> LucidFox: you know how you're quite social on IRC but not so much in person? i think that's what ScottK means
<LucidFox> Ah
<directhex> maco, i do that. see also: jaunty release party
<directhex> directhex is a charismatic stallion, jo shields is not ;)
<LucidFox> heh
<maco> :)
<maco> directhex: did you know anyone at the party?
<maxb> nixternal: Policy 7.7 and 4.2 say it's ok
<maco> for me, that makes all the difference. if i dont know anyone there or only know them in passing: wallflower
<LucidFox> directhex> But I bet you have quite a few real-life friends that you often meet, and you get out of home every now and then?
<maco> if there are some friends there, and they can introduce me to their friends, then it's ok
<directhex> LucidFox, occasionally
<directhex> maco, i missed james_w as i didn't start talking to people until after he had left
<directhex> oops
<nixternal> lxsplit has been advocated, uploaded, and archived :)
<binarymutant> thanks nixternal thats awesome :)
<nixternal> no, thank you! :)
<hyperair> lx? got any correlation to lxde by any chance?
<binarymutant> hyperair, linux = lx
<binarymutant> I think
<hyperair> oh.
<hyperair> so what exactly is lxsplit?
<nixternal> you can split large binaries into a bunch of smaller ones
<binarymutant> hyperair, a lot of people using windows split movie files with this utility called, hjsplit. lxsplit can join those movies and it fully compatible w/ hjsplit
<ninix> When using PPA..... do you sign your packages with your personnal key, or another public (which is used by all maintainers that build packages for the same ppa) ?
<hyperair> ah i see
<hyperair> cool
<binarymutant> ya I like it
<hyperair> ninix: you sign your source packages with your personal key, then upload it.
<directhex> ninix, and the ppa signs the binary repo with its own key
<hyperair> right. i was goign to say that, but pbuilder's ldconfig decided to kick in and hang all my inputs again.
<ninix> directhex: Do I have to create a key for the ppa myself ?
<directhex> no
<ninix> cool. thx
<artfwo> hi! perhaps you guys also have a little time to review http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/scantailor - a tool for processing scanned books? thanks!
<binarymutant> does anyone have any advice to getting a sponsor in debian for this package, lxsplit? I don't think it could be uploaded to any of the alioth's teams. I know there is the mentors site but my packages usually are ignored there :/
<directhex> binarymutant, yours & everyone else's
<binarymutant> directhex, ya I know :/
<binarymutant> thats why revu is so much better
<ScottK> binarymutant: If you're willing to maintain the package in Debian, you might also find a sponsor here as a number of people here are DD.
<loic-m> binarymutant, wouldn't it possible to join the movie files with cat?
<james_w> binarymutant: did you post to debian-mentors@?
<james_w> not many people trawl the site to find packages
<binarymutant> loic-m, I have seen that in a previous wnpp(or was it a itp) bug somewhere. I just think that with a lot of people moving from other OSs would appreciate an easier way
<binarymutant> james_w, I havent posted the RFS yet
<binarymutant> too bad there isnt a C team, like with ruby and python :/
<ninix> btw, if i provide a package version X (greater than the version in ubuntu) in my PPA..... and after upload another package that needs the first package, launchpad will surely use mine instead of the older in the ubuntu repository?
<james_w> ninix: correct
<ninix> Ok
<directhex> LucidFox, oh, did you see, you got your very own mention on my favourite blog as an evil pro-mono canonical staffer?
<LucidFox> O_O
<LucidFox> ...where?..
<directhex> LucidFox, http://boycottnovell.com/2009/05/08/ubuntu-mono-motu/
<LucidFox> .......
 * LucidFox adds a sarcastic comment
<LucidFox> I wonder if I should post this to Planet Ubuntu
 * RainCT is also waiting for some months! already for packages on mentors.debian.org to get reviewed (and I did announce them to the ML.. I don't even remember what packages they are now XD)
<ajmitch> directhex: oh, you work for them now? :)
<LucidFox> RainCT> Yes, mentors.debian.net is quite... slowpokish
<LucidFox> even compared to REVU :p
<ajmitch> RainCT: perhaps you should annoy certain people here
<ajmitch> like when directhex gets out of NM :)
<RainCT> ajmitch: or I may just wait two weeks more, apply for DD and upload myself in some months more :P
<ajmitch> heh
<RainCT> I don't think there will be any Debian release that soon anyway :P
<ajmitch> I'm sure you could find some other DDs around who'd kindly sponsor stuff if they knew what it was
<LucidFox> From a brief look at boycottnovell.com... if I didn't know better, I would decide it's a prank.
<nyu> RainCT: need a sponsor for debian?
<directhex> LucidFox, sadly not
<ajmitch> LucidFox: but surely Canonical have made a secret backroom deal with Microsoft over making directhex a MOTU
<LucidFox> ajmitch> Can I quote this in my blog?
<ajmitch> haha
<RainCT> nyu: Uhm well yeah, there's this package for instance: http://mentors.debian.net/cgi-bin/sponsor-pkglist?action=details;package=vilistextum
<ajmitch> RainCT: that's not even been there 6 months
<ajmitch> LucidFox: you'd better not mention that there were people working on mono in ubuntu in past releases who were core developers
<LucidFox> Oh shame, looks like the author's going to correct it.
<RainCT> ajmitch: Hah. Well, I get most stuff in through teams (POX, meebey & co. rock :)), else there'd be quite some stuff more
<LucidFox> "I guess Daniel Holbach isnât one either, despite the domain/suffix. Iâll correct this."
<LucidFox> I guess they thought everyone with an @ubuntu.com address was a Canonical employee.
<directhex> LucidFox, "correct" on that blog means <strike></strike> - and it will be linked back to as truth in subsequent posts
<LucidFox> ^_^
<directhex> :o idea!
<directhex> UDS for Malevolent Monkey in Novosibirsk ;)
<ajmitch> ok..
<ajmitch> why Novosibirsk? I heard it gets a little chilly there in winter
<ajmitch> not so bad in summer, but it's still a fair distance to fly
<directhex> ajmitch, so LucidFox can collect some gpg signatures!
<LucidFox> Har har har
<LucidFox> If only.
<ajmitch> ah, is that where you live?
<directhex> LucidFox, the first UDS was near my office :<
<directhex> before i was involved though
<artfwo> I think I'm living not that far from LucidFox, but I am neither a DD nor a MOTU yet :)
<LucidFox> artfwo> Where do you live?
<artfwo> but you could help me become one by reviewing some of my uploads :)
<LucidFox> directhex> where is that?
<artfwo> LucidFox: Gorno-Altaisk, I think it's about 500 kilometers from Novosibirsk?
<LucidFox> artfwo> Oh.
<LucidFox> We've been on vacations to Altai a few times
<artfwo> well, make sure you stop by for signing a key next time you visit :)
<LucidFox> to Lake Aya and Lake Teletskoye
<LucidFox> we aren't going there anymore
<binarymutant> whats the site that I can follow packages that the AA is doing? (if that makes sense)
<james_w> the automobile association?
<directhex> LucidFox, oxford
<binarymutant> james_w, archive admin
<binarymutant> lols :P
<james_w> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/karmic/+queue lists what is currently in the queues, which is some of what we do
<binarymutant> ty james_w :)
<ninix> after the dput command, do I have to do something else in launchpad?
<artfwo> ninix: no, just wait
<ninix> All right, was asking because i receive this message: Not running dinstall.
<ninix> and, normally.. How long should we wait before see our package ?
<artfwo> it takes some minutes to appear on your PPA webpage
<artfwo> then it takes some time to build, it depends on how the build servers are loaded
<artfwo> and of course on how much time your package requires to be built
<ninix> that's good. will wait. I going to upload the same package for Hardy and jaunty now.
<gringo_> Hi, I need some help related to packaging a project that has changed their versioning scheme (if this isn't the propper channel to place this question, please redirect me :).
<artfwo> gringo_: perhaps an epoch will help
<artfwo> what have they changed exactly?
<gringo_> the package name is myspell-ro, until now versions were like this 20070502
<gringo_> now it's 3.2.8
<gringo_> I set an epoch in debian/control
<gringo_> and Format: 1.5
<gringo_> dpkg-genchanges: warning: unknown information field 'Format' in input data in general section of control info file
<gringo_> dpkg-genchanges: warning: unknown information field 'Version' in input data in general section of control info file
<artfwo> do you have your debian/control online somewhere?
<artfwo> so we could take a look
<gringo_> in a second :)
<artfwo> gringo_: could you also paste a few lines from your debian/changelog somewhere? (e.g. http://paste.ubuntu.com/ )
<gringo_> http://swarm.cs.pub.ro/~lucian/repo/myspell-ro/myspell-ro-3.2.8/
<gringo_> sorry for the delay.
<gringo_> all files are there
<artfwo> aha
<artfwo> you should get rid of Version and Format in debian/control
<artfwo> and set an epoch in debian/changelog
<soren> And Changed-By.
<artfwo> make it 1:3.2.8-0ubuntu1
<gringo_> ok. I added those fields now, after skimming through http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/
<soren> They do not belong in the control file.
<gringo_> http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-controlfields.html#s-f-Uploaders
<soren> Version, Format, and Changed-By belong in the changes file (which will be generated by dpkg-genchanges)
<gringo_> aah. sorry. misread. thank
<gringo_> ok it now runs fine, I'll uploaded to my ppa and see if Ubuntu tells me a new version of the package appeared.
<gringo_> oh, there's also this:
<gringo_> Now running lintian...
<gringo_> internal error: command failed with error code 123
<gringo_> warning: collect info file-info about package myspell-ro: 512
<nixternal> hey, I want to be a developer, I am elite...I have been programming in basic for 30 years, visual-basic for 15 years, and I am learning how to program in fortran...where do I start?
<nixternal> brlcad is a freakin' beast
<ajmitch> nixternal: start by uninstalling vista
<nixternal> ajmitch: it is gnome, it has all of those .NET windows bindings...I am cool and super elite with it
<nixternal> oh man, who uploaded gnote to revu?
<ajmitch> probably nyu
<directhex> nixternal, savvas. it was rejected from the archive earlier
<nixternal> directhex: really?
<nixternal> I like it, I will advocate it, and I will love it! :)
<ajmitch> directhex: copyright?
<directhex> ajmitch, aye
<savvas> I don't have access to the archive :)
<savvas> nor am I a motu :P
<nixternal> man, I picked brlcad to revu...bad bad idea on this laptop
<nixternal> Warning: YOU NEED MORE FANS! I AM BREATHING FIRE FROM YOUR CPU!
<directhex> fire in the disco
<savvas> ah to revu, yes I have, working together with nyu :)
<ajmitch> nixternal: you're a brave man. Your sacrifice will be remembered
<artfwo> that's strange, I have subscribed ubuntu-main-sponsors to a bug, but they don't not appear on the right sidebar - a problem with launchpad?
<savvas> artfwo: edge.launchpad I think
<artfwo> yes, I'm using edge
<savvas> they appear fine on normal launchpad, it happened to me before
<artfwo> ah, yes - stable launchpad is okay
<ajmitch> someone in #launchpad may want to know about that if you haven't filed a bug
<nixternal> Latest upload of gnote (http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/details.py?upid=5674) contains a slight change in the debian/control (removed the controversial "consumes less resources").
<nixternal> hahahahahahahahahaha
<ajmitch> nixternal: behave
<nixternal> come on, that was funny
<ajmitch> not as funny as LucidFox' intentionally quoting me completely out of context
<ajmitch> suddenly my name appears in lights on planet ubuntu
<nixternal> -rw-r--r-- 1 nixternal nixternal 1485612 1969-12-31 18:00 gnote-0.3.1.tar.bz2
<nixternal> interesting
<ajmitch> why so?
<nixternal> look at the date
<ajmitch> yes?
<nixternal> 1969?
<ajmitch> that's not uncommon
<directhex> hahaha
<nixternal> that is the first I have seen that, so it is uncommon to me :p
<directhex> nixternal, your timezone is -6?
<ajmitch> nixternal: think of when the unix epoch is
<savvas> the.. winter of '69 :p
<nixternal> directhex: yes it is
<directhex> nixternal, hence unix epoch, localised
<ajmitch> savvas: summer for the right part of the world
<savvas> 1) yes, it's a tar-in-tar 2) yes it's a tar.bz2 (smaller file) 3) yes, the change of timestamp was applied to keep it the same for ubuntu and debian, and finally 4) yes, that's the maintainer's preferred way :)
<lifeless> summer of 69 :)
<JontheEchidna> nixternal: http://penny-arcade.com/comic/2009/1/30/
<azeem> cetero censeo that "smaller file" is a bad argument for a tar-in-tar
<nixternal> JontheEchidna: omg that is nuts, i just wet myself...hillarious!
<azeem> ceterum*
<savvas> should I say better compressed? :)
<azeem> hrm?
<lifeless> savvas: no, azeem is saying that better compression is not worth doing tar in tar
<azeem> how is better compressed except that the size is smaller?
<azeem> certainly not for 1.5 vs. 1.4 MB
<azeem> or whatever the numbers were
<nixternal> feels good to be hacking again :)
<nixternal> go REVU go!
<ajmitch> nixternal: planning to have everything reviewed by the end of the week?
<savvas> but it's not wrong, it's only not recommended, I wouldn't want to extract the whole thing now that I'm one step from including it in the archive
<artfwo> nixternal: wanna review a neat package? look no further! :) http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/scantailor
<nixternal> ajmitch: that's my plan :)
<azeem> savvas: well, I certainly hope itÃ gs rejected from Debian due to that
<azeem> it's getting*
<savvas> I'm really not familiar with tar-in-tars, better to talk with nyu when he's around
<azeem> he has me on ignore
<azeem> and I communicated this to him via proxy today already
<nixternal> gnote has been reviewed, built, installed, uploaded, and archived :)
<nixternal> LET THE WARS BEGIN!
<Laney> it was already in NEW was it not?
<directhex> nixternal, is copyright fixed compared to last time?
<directhex> Laney, and REJECTed
<nixternal> directhex: yes
<Laney> i thought it was reuploaded
<nixternal> we will find out if it gets rejected :)
<Laney> PGP Signed Message, This message has been signed with the valid key ID Barry deFreese <bdefreese@debian.org>
<Laney> ooer
 * ajmitch thinks that nixternal is going for the mud-on-wall upload policy
<directhex> ajmitch, ooh, i'm used to mud-slinging
<ajmitch> battle-hardened from countless 'discussions' about mono
<nixternal> i could care less about the mono stuff anymore...i see its usefullness
<directhex> always productive and exciting
<nixternal> i am not a .net dev, didn't enjoy it in school either, so that's why I don't use it
<ninix> If i make 3 differents packages for a software. (hardy, intrepid, jaunty)... Do I have to upload the "full original source" 3 times ?
<directhex> discussions are fine, it's the "discussions" that are depressing
<binarymutant> any python ppl:  will hashlib give errors if it's not working correctly or is it silent?
<nyu> nixternal: I guess it's useful to write new software so you can later port it to C++ ;-P
<nixternal> haha nyu
<nixternal> I like gnote though, as I am porting it from gtk -> qt4
<nyu> oh, interesting
<andersk> Laney: I found super_teams using dir(launchpad.me).  It returns the collection of teams that the person is a member of.  I'm not sure it's actually documented.
<nixternal> though that is a huge pita which I am finding out every minute I play around with it
<nyu> you should tell hub about it
<directhex> see, that's a reasonable position in a way: RAD as useful
<nixternal> already did
<nixternal> though I think someone will probably beat me to it if they haven't already
<directhex> nixternal, port tomboy using qyoto ;)
<Laney> andersk: I've found the documentation to be a bit lacking. Does it count indirect memberships too?
<nixternal> directhex: you are the 12038403843 person to say that :)
<lifeless> ninix: 'no'
<directhex> nixternal, am i? waa :(
<nixternal> I do not like c# so I will have to say no
<maxb> ninix: You're talking about PPAs I assume. Questions about how to use Launchpad PPAs are slightly more on-topic in #launchpad
<directhex> nixternal, you can use vb.net then. or boo!
<ninix> yes sorry.
<lifeless> maxb: actually we encourage them here too :)
<lifeless> maxb: as motu has a very do-packaging skillset
<directhex> or java with ikvm! or python with ironpython!
<nixternal> geanygdb ack, uploaded, archived
<andersk> Laney: yes, it appears to.
<maxb> Fair enough. We suddenly got a burst of conversation, so I though ninix might be better off in a quieter channel
<savvas> ninix: you build the first one with "debuild -S -sa", wait until you get the "Accepted" email, then the rest with "debuild -S -sd"
<nixternal> james_w: keep on revu'ing, I will follow behind you and do the easier part :p
<james_w> how many uploads of gnote do we need people?
<Laney> andersk: If that's right then your version is better than mine
<ninix> So, another small question :P..... If i made a package x~ppa1, uploaded it in my ppa with the origina software source, and made a package ~ppa2 without reupload the orig source... can i delete the ~ppa1 version in my PPA ?
<lifeless> maxb: yeah, its not hard and fast
<savvas> ninix: -sd will exclude the orig.tar.gz from the rest of the uploads :)
<maxb> savvas, ninix: Though the need to wait is going away soon. There's a soyuz bug open on it
<lifeless> maxb: I will note that the intersection of people getting distracted here with those in lp is close to unity
<ninix> savvas: that what i thought for a alternative package, just didn't know if a package for another codename was an alternative or not. thx
<nixternal> heh, I have had 'revubuild' aliased to 'debuild -S -sa -k2e2c0124' since 2005/2006
<savvas> maxb: cool, thanks for the tip :)
<maxb> (This does of course assume that the initial one is accepted :-) )
<maxb> ninix: Uploading a later version to the same distroseries automatically obsoletes the earlier one
<directhex> james_w, we need twelvety
<savvas> ninix: here's what I do, I keep three different folders for each release, e.g. hardy and jaunty, and put in the required files, use for example a version like ~ppahardy1 for hardy and ~ppajaunty1 for jaunty - this will allow you to play with their versions safely (usually people get confused when they see ~ppa2 in hardy and ~ppa1 in jaunty)
<savvas> three = twp :p
<savvas> *two
<ninix> maxb: ok, so the software.orig.tar.gz will not be deleted.
<Laney> andersk: Could you prepare a branch for merging? I'd just do it directly but I'm a bit busy now so can't, and I'm afraid I'll forget
<Laney> (away all next week so might have minimal dev time)
<ninix> ho... i just put ~ppa1 in my version for all codename
<andersk> Sure, I'll work on that.
<savvas> ninix: you can work on it any way you wish, it's your PPA anyway :)
<Laney> andersk: Make sure to propose it for merging so people get mailed
<Laney> or you could just subscribe uus
<ninix> savvas: your way is less confusing, will do that :)
<james_w> nixternal: gnote rejected, there's already one in the queue
<hyperair> nixternal, james_w: thanks for reviewing geanygdb and uploading =)
<james_w> hyperair: nice work, it's a great example
<Laney> hyperair: you need to make pkg-geany
<hyperair> heh you're right.
<hyperair> (or i could take everythign on myself)
<directhex> hyperair for MOTU!
<hyperair> =O
<Laney> (and find a pet DD)
<hyperair> hahah
<hyperair> regarding the DD... once damian (geany's maintainer) returns from his hiatus, i'll probably ask him.
<hyperair> or i could ask patrick matthÃ¤i. he seemed rather happy to sponsor sigx for me =)
<Laney> gogogo
<directhex> hiatuses (hiati?) are the danger of single-maintainer packages
<lifeless> oh noes, not the haitan
<hyperair> indeed.
<hyperair> well jeromeg who maintains geany in ubuntu would probably NMU (and eventually adopt it) if damian does not return.
<ninix> If i've uploaded in my PPA a package X that need the package Y. after i've upgraded the package Y and reuploaded it..... How do I tell launchpad that the package X have to be rebuilt with the new dependency version of the Y package ?
 * Laney blinks
<Laney> ninix: you upload a new version of x
<Laney> with no changes apart from the changelog
<ninix> k, there is no way to just rebuilt a package in launchpad
<Laney> no, we don't have binNMUs
<ninix> Ok
<hyperair> not automatically anyway
<Laney> I remember someone saying that exact same thing to me a year or so ago
<nixternal> james_w: james_w yup, just got the reject notice :)
<Laney> and I had to run off and research what a binNMU was
<Laney> how much I've learned!
<ninix> :)
<hyperair> hahah
<hyperair> i remember asking meebey
 * james_w throws Laney a "yet"
<james_w> well, we'll never have binNMUs
<james_w> but launchpad will soon support rebuilding a binary package with an increased dependency without a change to the source
<james_w> what that ends up meaning for Ubuntu isn't yet clear
<hyperair> if that happens, won't the binaries be overwritten?
<hyperair> we can't have binaries of the same name having different contents.
<Laney> how can that be done other than the same way as a binNMU is?
<Laney> ie +b1
<james_w> hyperair: yeah, that's why it's not possible now. The version, and so the name of the .deb will be changed
<ajmitch> james_w: what magic will make this possible?
<james_w> I meant "increased version" not "increased dependency"
<savvas> artfwo: still here? which bug was it with ubuntu-main-sponsors not showing? I'm writing a bug report
<ajmitch> right
<james_w> ajmitch: soyuz magic
<artfwo> savvas: any bug that u-m-s is subscribed to
<hyperair> james_w: basically binNMU at the click of a button?
<james_w> see the open week session about soyuz
<artfwo> for example bug 373168
<directhex> life would be easier if more people remembered to set "1build1" not "1ubuntu1" for no-change rebuilds
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 373168 in sane-backends "Please merge sane-backends 1.0.20-3 from Debian" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/373168
<savvas> ok thanks, looking
<james_w> hyperair: perhaps
<hyperair> sounds cool
<ajmitch> directhex: they should have some automagic script that they use to do that
<l3on> Hi all...
<l3on> I'm some problem requesting a sync by requestsync script.
<l3on> This is the output:
<l3on> IOError: No credentials found for 'ubuntu-dev-tools', please see the manage-credentials manpage for help on how to create one for this consumer.
<Laney> have you seen the manage-credentials manpage?
<l3on> yep
<l3on> I've created a consumer with my username and logged in LP.
<l3on> I've to create a 'ubuntu-dev-tools' consumer?
<Laney> yep
<l3on> eh damn. WHY? :P I'm "l3on" no 'ubuntu-dev-tools' :D
<Laney> you are giving credentials to ubuntu-dev-tools
<james_w> why doesn't it just tell you the command to run?
<l3on> yes, I've just read it
<l3on>  manage-credentials create -c ubuntu-dev-tools -l 2
<l3on> Thanks.
<Laney> I don't know, it probably should
<savvas> james_w: should the original sponsor who uploaded gnote review the new diff.gz?
<james_w> savvas: gnote is in the NEW queue again
<savvas> I know but you said rejected, is there anything to do on my behalf?
<james_w> when?
<james_w> just now?
<james_w> I just rejected a duplicate upload
<savvas> ah ok
<james_w> it's still in the queue
<savvas> artfwo: can you please confirm bug 374627 ? :)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 374627 in launchpad "[edge] doesn't list the sponsors teams in bug report sidebar" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/374627
<Laney> I can
<savvas> thanks
<savvas> btw, I just noticed "Ubuntu 8.04.3 (TBC)" on wiki.ubuntu.com/HardyReleaseSchedule - what does that TBC mean? to be continued? :P
<ajmitch> to be confirmed
<savvas> that makes more sense hehe
<l3on> Thanks guys, I've requested the sync bug 374634
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 374634 in sonata "Sync sonata 1.6-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)." [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/374634
<artfwo> after I attached a debian->ubuntu debdiff to a merge request and subscribed u-m-s to the appropriate bug, should I just wait or notify someone about the bug to speed up the sponsorship?
<dtchen> patience, probably
<dtchen> i'm still waiting for motu-sru for a fairly trivial debdiff ;)
<artfwo> :)
<ninix> Can we upload a package with a debian codename in our PPA ?
<ninix> (it hasn't been modified..., that's why i changed nothing)
<ninix> i mean,  the codename in the changelog file.
<directhex> ninix, yes
<directhex> wait
<directhex> ninix, it depends where you upload to
<ninix> to launchpad
<directhex> ninix, if you dput specifically to distroname/ in your ppa, then yes
<directhex> ninix, if you upload to a generic ppa url, then no
<ninix> ok, i.e, i should change the incoming line in my dput.cf... ".../ubuntu/" to ".../ubuntu/intrepid/" ?
<directhex> i think that's it
<ScottK> ninix: But #launchpad is a better channel for PPA questions.
<ninix> ur right. thanks, will try what you said directhex.
<directhex> YMMV, IANAL, IDDQD
#ubuntu-motu 2010-05-10
<paissad> is this line ok ?
<paissad> Depends: sun-java6-jre | openjdk-6-jre
<paissad> if i want to search 1st for sun-java6-jre & then openjdk
<amikrop> Where can I find Ambiance's folder/places icons?
<suji> hi
<suji> i updated the iok package and upload in launchpad , now it is available in https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/iok under other version of iok in untrusted archive
<suji> how to make it trusted.
<suji> dholbach: hi
<wrapster> i have a set of pre-compiled binaries around which i built a pkg and used the pkg to just copy the files to certain dirs.. But strangely it does not work.
<wrapster> dealing with internationalization libs here.
<wrapster> however if i dont create a pkg and just copy the binaries to respective locaations... and then change the locale and reboot..
<joaopinto> wrapster, define "does not work" ? Are the .deb contents listed as you expect ?
<wrapster> joaopinto: yes they are.
<joaopinto> and they don't extract to the proper locations ?
<wrapster> during bootstrapping the loader complains that "unable to set locale"
<wrapster> joaopinto: they do...
<joaopinto> ah, so your question is not about packaging per si :)
<wrapster> joaopinto: no it is.. and here is the reason.
<wrapster> if i try to emulate what ever the pkg does manually.... as in it copies  a set of binaries to a few dirs...
<wrapster> if i manuallly do that. and then reboot the machine. it all works fine.
<wrapster> i've tested this a million times already.
<joaopinto> if copying the files manually does not provide the same behavior as installing from the package you must be missing something trivial, like a typo
<joaopinto> assuming you are copyting the same binaries
<wrapster> hmm..
<wrapster> but after the pkg is built when i look into the staging dir.. i find everything right where i want it.
<joaopinto> wrapster, there is nothing magic about dpkg, anyway to be sure you compare the md5sums of the files, the dpkg installed vs the manual installed ones
<joaopinto> if both files are on the same locations and have the same md5sums, you need to search for the problem somewhere else, it's not related to those files copy :)
<wrapster> hmm...
<wrapster> ok
<BlackZ> if a package has no version and I've taken it from a bzr, which version should I give to it? is packagename-bzrX ok? or packagename-0.0-bzrX (or something), thanks
<pabelanger> Is there any backlog on people waiting for a mentor?  I'd like to apply today and just getting a feel if there are any delays.
<Zhenech> BlackZ, pck-0.0+bzrâ¦
<Zhenech> BlackZ, or, if bzr uses non incremental ids (like git's hashes): 0.0+20100510+bzrID
<ScottK> bzr has monotonically increasing revision numbers.
<Breaking_Pitt> hello POX, do you know where I can fix this problem file-in-unusual-dir usr/local/lib/python2.5/site-packages/repositoryhandler/backends/watchers.pyo
<POX> .pyo (and .pyc) files should not end in .deb package, remove them (dh_pysupport and dh_pycentral does that for you)
<Breaking_Pitt> ok
<ari-tczew> bdrung: ping
<bdrung> ari-tczew: pong
<ari-tczew> bdrung: did you saw email from me?
<bdrung> ari-tczew: yes. the bug are fixed by me, because i uploaded the packages (with the syncpackage tool in ubuntu-dev-tools) instead of subscribing ubuntu-archive
<ari-tczew> bdrung: so therefore always be that since now?
<ari-tczew> The first time I met with this method
<bdrung> ari-tczew: yes (unless someone complains about the procedure)
<ari-tczew> bdrung: for universe as well?
<bdrung> ari-tczew: yesterday i tweaked the syncpackage script and updated my ack-sync script. you are the first tester of it.
<bdrung> ari-tczew: yes
<ari-tczew> bdrung: is it possible to upload a sync signing to requester?
<ari-tczew> like in merge uploading
<bdrung> ari-tczew: i dunno if i can get the correct email address of the requester from LP.
<bdrung> ari-tczew: gimme a script that pulls the correct signer from a LP bug and i will integrate it into my script.
<ari-tczew> bdrung: I think that this is possible, because when archive admin is doing a sync, then he sings package to sync requester
<bdrung> k
<ari-tczew> I don't have a script, but I think you should ask archive-admins like james_w
<bdrung> james_w: can you give me a pointer to the archive-admin sync script?
<ari-tczew> bdrung: you are a main sponsor as well, but what about only universe sponsors? can they use syncpackage tool as well?
<bdrung> yes
<Laney> you're suggesting a policy change
<ari-tczew> bdrung: are you an author of this script?
<Laney> this should have wider discussion imo
<bdrung> Laney: it was discussed on a ML
<Laney> not if we should change the syncing process completely
<Laney> if you mean the one I'm thinking of, that was about whether the script is alright to use *ever*
<bdrung> ari-tczew: yes
<ari-tczew> bdrung: I think that this is nice tool, because reduces a time between sponsor ACK and upload by archive-admins, but I think that this is unfair for sync requesters (like me today)
<ari-tczew> good tool for Quick Response strategy ;-)
<bdrung> ari-tczew: you can specify an uploader with -u to the syncpackage tool
<bdrung> i just need to pull the correct uploader from LP
<ari-tczew> bdrung: can I specify? I'm not a sponsor ;-)
<ari-tczew> I think that archive-admins specifies an uploader by LP nickname
<bdrung> ari-tczew: the person that calls this script.
<bdrung> btw, the ML thread is called "slowness of syncing process"
<ari-tczew> what is ML?
<bdrung> mailing list
<ari-tczew> bdrung: I'm applying for the suspension of the use of this script until you solve the question with uploader in syncpackage.
<Laney> I know the one. If you want to remove the AAs from the process (apart from autosyncing), it should require an explicit discussion though.
<bdrung> ok, then let's start a discussion
<ari-tczew> now? here?
<bdrung> the ubuntu-devel ML should be the right place
<ari-tczew> bdrung: can I join the discuss ML?
<bdrung> yes
<pabelanger> I just applied for junior mentoring via ubuntu-motu-mentors@lists.ubuntu.com.  I'd appreciate any helping getting it approved.
<bdrung> ari-tczew: everybody can send mails to ubuntu-devel@ and subscribe to it
<ari-tczew> bdrung: I never used a ML so please of indulgence
<bdrung> ari-tczew: https://lists.ubuntu.com/ -> https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel
<bdrung> there you can subscribe to it
<bdrung> writing a mail to a mailing list is like writing a normal mail and just sending it to the ML (in this case ubuntu-devel@lists.ubuntu.com)
<bdrung> ari-tczew: do you have another sync request for me?
<bdrung> i have tweaked my ack-sync script
<ari-tczew> bdrung: give me some minutes
<DktrKranz> bdrung, ari-tczew: I can patch syncpackage in ubuntu-dev-tools trunk in order to correct Changed-By field, it shouldn't be too hard
<DktrKranz> it could also close bug, with an appropriate comment
<ari-tczew> DktrKranz, would be great, but wait for bdrung tweak. I'm going to fill a new sync request and bdrung will test...
<DktrKranz> okay
<DktrKranz> feel free to commit the tweak there :)
<ari-tczew> bdrung: I'm going to add these 3 syncs to my MOTU Application under your sponsoring as OK
<bdrung> DktrKranz: syncpackage has the -u flag
<bdrung> i have tweaked my ack-sync script and needs to test it.
<bdrung> ari-tczew: the sync request were done by you and therefore they were your "job"
<ari-tczew> bdrung: bug 578364
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 578364 in pwrkap "Sync pwrkap 7.30-3 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/578364
<ari-tczew> bdrung: any news?
<bilalakhtar> People, is contributing 10 packages to debian enough to make a person an Ubuntu member?
<bilalakhtar> sorry, people, have to leave now
<bdrung> ari-tczew: your name + mail is "Artur Rona <ari-tczew@tlen.pl>"?
<ari-tczew> bdrung: exactly
<bdrung> ari-tczew: great. then it working. i am implementing another improvement and then i will test it with your bug report.
<ari-tczew> bdrung: cool, could you ship your improved script on bzr branch to merge with current version?
<bdrung> ari-tczew: i will push it into the master branch
<ari-tczew> bdrung: how you did improve in script? sign by LP username?
<bdrung> my ack-sync script get this line: uploader = bug.owner.display_name + " <" + bug.owner.preferred_email_address.email + ">"
<bdrung> then uploader will be passed to syncpackage
<bdrung> now i am working on a --bug switch to add the sync request bug number to the list of fixed bugs
<bdrung> then i don't need to close the lp bug "manually" with my ack-sync script
<geser> bdrung: does this construction of the uploader also work for LP users with hidden email addresses?
<bdrung> geser: i didn't test it.
<bdrung> geser: do you know someone with a hidden email address who filed a bug?
<geser> no, as I don't regularly look if somebody has a public email when working on bugs
<ari-tczew> bdrung: is Martin Pitt initial author of this script?
<ScottK> If it's the syncpackage script, yes.
<bdrung> ari-tczew: yes (syncpackage) and i have modified it heavily
<ScottK> bdrung: But it was working before?
<geser> bdrung: I'm looking at the syncpackage source and wondering why you use apt_pkg.check_dep() instead of simply using >= on the Version objects? as far as I know they support comparison
<bdrung> geser: feel free to improve it (after i pushed my changes)
<bdrung> ScottK: yes (i made it more flexible)
<bdrung> ari-tczew: sync sponsored. let's see if everything worked like it should
<bdrung> ari-tczew: \o/ it works
<bdrung> bug #578364
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 578364 in pwrkap "Sync pwrkap 7.30-3 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/578364
<ari-tczew> bdrung: yea I saw new package in my +related-software
<ari-tczew> bdrung: do you will expand script for include Launchpad Janitor/Launchpad Bug tracker to closing automagically bug?
<ari-tczew> oh, I saw, closed automagically! nice!
<ari-tczew> bdrung you are amazing ;-D
<bdrung> that was the thing i have been working on for the last half hour
<ari-tczew> we have a breakthrough! this is very important step to make more easier repositories management. I'm excited ;-D
<bdrung> geser: pushed my changes
<bdrung> \o/
<ari-tczew> bdrung: you and pitti should be awarded
<bdrung> one thing could be improved: automatic fakesync detection ;)
<ari-tczew> good point, wiki page about fakesync is necessary as well for documentation
<ari-tczew> bdrung: could I write in QR strategy about script syncpackage?
<bdrung> QR strategy?
<ari-tczew> quick response (my wiki)
<bdrung> yes
<ari-tczew> bdrung and other: what do you think about what do you think about leading statistics - who and how many has packages sponsored?
<ari-tczew> by syncpackage script we can get information who did wchich packages
<bdrung> leading statistics?
<ari-tczew> hmm, which word is correct... record statistics?
<geser> there were such statistics (who did how many uploads) in the past but they got discontinued (seems like the persons running those lost interest)
<bdrung> so you want to add there the count of sponsored packages (after reviving the statistics)? i think that this is a good idea. we need to make sponsoring more prominent and this is a good way to do it.
<ari-tczew> geser: I think that is easier by script. select information from data base "Sponsored by:"
<bdrung> BTW, if someone is interested in the ack-sync script: http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~ubuntu-dev/+junk/ack-sync/changes
<ari-tczew> bdrung: as you said :)
<bdrung> no sync to sponsor left ;) all the easy to sponsor things done
<geser> ari-tczew: for that you would need to get the script into LP itself (I don't believe one get this data from LP API efficiently if at all)
<geser> ari-tczew: the easiest way to get such statistics done currently is to use the maverick-changes mails and parse them
<kklimonda> can't we get this data from -changes mailing lists?
<kklimonda> right
<ari-tczew> geser: maybe your propose is better, I'm not a developer :)
<ari-tczew> but I guess that we can start counting this development cycle who did sponsors
<ari-tczew> * who and how many sponsors has finished
<ari-tczew> bdrung: are you on UDS right now?
<bdrung> ari-tczew: nope. i am sitting at home
<ajmitch> morning
<ari-tczew> hello
<geser> ajmitch: from your "morning" I conclude that you aren't at UDS either?
<ajmitch> geser: correct, I haven't been to UDS for awhile now
<corecode_> hey
<corecode_> RuntimeError: This installation of RMagick was configured with ImageMagick 6.5.5 but ImageMagick 6.5.7-8 is in use.
<corecode_> is that my fault or some packaging problem?
<geser> probably it didn't got rebuild when the newer imagemagick got uploaded (but this is just a guess)
<BlackZ> could a copyright file contain two authors of the packaging work?
<geser> sure, why not?
<BlackZ> hmm geser some doubts on it but now it's clear - another question: if I use dh_install should I specify the path in debian/dirs ?
<corecode_> geser: what has to happen to rebuild it?
<geser> corecode_: if it's really the case that a rebuild fixes it then a SRU (stable release update) should be proposed
<geser> BlackZ: IIRC dh_install creates the missing dirs as necessary, debian/dirs is only helpful if you need to call cp/mv in debian/rules and want the needed dirs created by dh_installdirs
<lfaraone> geser: by the way, I may be able to make the meeting tomorrow, but I have to leave at  15:50.
<geser> lfaraone: lets hope there is no time conflict with UDS and we get quorum
<corecode_> geser: i quite think so
<BlackZ> geser: and when there's a package on bzr is the watch file necessary?
<geser> BlackZ: no, as there is no release listing to monitor for a new release
<lfaraone> BlackZ: do they have separate upstream release tarballs? if so, yes, that's preferred over bzr.
<BlackZ> lfaraone: nope, they don't
<leleobhz> guys, im in a problem involving dbus package and chroot configuration (for instalation)
<leleobhz> if i install the dbus package inside a chroot, it cant find the session socket (obviously because dbus is running outside chroot) and the package config broke
<joaopinto> leleobhz, dbus installes fine on my lucid chroot, do you have /dev and friends bind mounted ?
<leleobhz> joaopinto: well, bind mount of /dev /proc and /sys
<leleobhz> i partially solved the problem running dbus-launcher --system --fork
<leleobhz> but
<leleobhz> why start dbus via init.d create the socket OUTSIDE the chroot even if inside chroot
<leleobhz> i cant understand
<carstenh> leleobhz: writing #!/bin/sh newline exit 101 to /usr/sbin/policy-rc.d in the chroot should solve this
<joaopinto> hum, I am using schroot -p from X, I am not sure if DBUS_SESSION_BUS_ADDRESS is helping on my case
<carstenh> and running chmod a+x /usr/sbin/policy-rc.d
<leleobhz> carstenh: my problem is im dist-upgrading a system that crashed when upgrading (libc problems)
<leleobhz> so i need to run distupgrade from inside a chroot
<joaopinto> hum, it installs fine here, with a clean environment, on a lucid schroot
<carstenh> how does upgrading inside a chroot help if the userland outside the chroot is broken?
<carstenh> dbus puts something in /var/run/dbus/
<joaopinto> carstenh, the userland is not broken, I assume he is running chroot from a livecd
<carstenh> that way around it makes sense :)
#ubuntu-motu 2010-05-11
<ajmitch> grr @ LP branches of packages in sid not being updated still
<imbrandon> ajmitch: how often do they sync ? or supose to ?
<cpscotti> Hello all, little problem here; what is the procedure to "update" a broken package which is already on Lucid,
<ajmitch> imbrandon: it's apparantly due to a debian bug that the LP mirror of debian isn't updating properly
<imbrandon> cpscotti | !sru
<imbrandon> !sru
<ubottu> Stable Release Update information is at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates
<imbrandon> there ya go
<imbrandon> :)
<cpscotti> oh
<cpscotti> thanks!
<Laney> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/community-m-universe-qa
<Laney> make it so if you want to come :)
<bilalakhtar> People, is contributing 10 packages to debian enough to make a person an Ubuntu member?
<Rhonda> bilalakhtar: No. Contributing 10 packages to Ubuntu would be enough though. :)
<Rhonda> Ubuntu procedures are a fair bit different than Debian's. Just think of the Debian BTS vs. Ubuntu's launchpad and you get the idea.
<bilalakhtar> Rhonda: bump! And there are people on this channel who say its better to contribute to debian and sabdfl himself says "one of the ways to contribute to ubuntu is to contribute to debian"
<azeem> you asked a very specific question abotu becoming an Ubuntu member
<Rhonda> And that's right. :)
<Rhonda> bilalakhtar: It's of course better to contribute to Debian because that is a benefit for Ubuntu without any effort on Ubuntu's side. :)
<Rhonda> â¦ and additionally also a benefit for Debian because the changes aren't only in one of the two.
<bilalakhtar> Then what should I put up to the membership board as a point to say in becoming an ubuntu member?
<Rhonda> It's putting the effort on the better suited place.
<Rhonda> I think it's quite similar with Debian, along the lines of triaging bugs in launchpad, taking a look at sync requests and check wether some ubuntu changes are still needed or can get pushed to Debian or even further upstream.
<Rhonda> Maybe https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Ubuntu/ForDebianDevelopers is a good entry point for you, bilalakhtar
<Laney> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopers#Ubuntu%20Contributing%20Developers
<Laney> also
<bilalakhtar> I know how to package for debian (thats not what I am asking). You should better understand my point.....
<bilalakhtar> The biggest contribution I can make to Ubuntu is packaging
<Rhonda> The link wasn't about packaging. :)
<Rhonda> But even in Debian packaging isn't the sole part of what a DD does, and shouldn't even be the major part. It's about keeping contact with upstream and being a proxy between the users and upstream for received bugreports.
<bilalakhtar> And folks on this channel say that its better to contribute to Debian than Ubuntu
<Rhonda> Which is right in the sense of packaging. :)
<bilalakhtar> Rhonda: I agree. But should I tell the membership boards that my contribution to ubuntu is "packaging for debian" ?
<BlackZ> bilalakhtar: contribute again and then apply for motu instead
<bilalakhtar> BlackZ: so people can become ubuntu motus by contributing to debian?
<BlackZ> bilalakhtar: include your work in debian would be great, just this
<ChogyDan> bilalakhtar: I don
<ChogyDan> bilalakhtar: I don't really know, but I think you can maintain the package in ubuntu as well, ie, test to make sure it works
<bilalakhtar> ChogyDan: Of course I would do testing on ubuntu, but the problem is, most of the packages in debian repos can work without any modification in ubuntu. only 1 in 15 packages has a problem
<BlackZ> but if you want contribute just to ubuntu, I think there's no problem - BTW, if you will contribute to debian too your work will be considered
<Rhonda> bilalakhtar: Why do you want to apply to membership boards anyway, if your contribution to ubuntu is "packaging for debian"? Just for the status? I think that's the wrong approach. You should apply when you feel you need special privileges for special jobs, not just to have it.
<Rhonda> So if you are self-aware of such a specific task I would think that that should be the main part of your application, not your packaging for Debian work, because for that you don't need ubuntu membership. :)
<BlackZ> bilalakhtar: if you aren't familiar with all MOTU tasks, wait again a while, we are setting up the mentoring reception program
<bilalakhtar> Rhonda: fine, will think of it after some more packages have gone in !
<bilalakhtar> BlackZ: what is that?
<BlackZ> bilalakhtar: it's an help program for new contributors
<bilalakhtar> BlackZ: ohk
<BlackZ> bilalakhtar: this doesn't mean that you can't read the MOTU documentation - the MOTU team is a good point to start for new contributors ;)
<Rhonda> bilalakhtar: Actually I'm in the same boat. I am thinking about applying for ubuntu membership - but I don't see the actual need for _why_ I would need it so I rather do the bit I do with poking persia and sebner (and others) from time to time. :)
<bilalakhtar> Rhonda: You package mostly for ubuntu or debian?
<sebner> Rhonda: ubuntu-sponsors queue ftw! we are not your sponsoring bitches :P
<Rhonda> bilalakhtar: http://deb.at/Qgerfried+fuchs - go figure. :P
<Rhonda> sebner: Oh yes you are. I signed your key to make you my â¦ erm, did you just use a swear word in here! :)
<astraljava> Oooh!! CoC violation!!! ALERT ALERT!
<astraljava> :D
<bilalakhtar> !coc | sebner
<ubottu> sebner: The Ubuntu Code of Conduct is a community etiquette document to which we ask all Ubuntu users to adhere, and can be found at http://www.ubuntu.com/community/conduct/ .  For information on how to electronically sign the CoC, see https://help.ubuntu.com/community/SigningCodeofConduct .
<nigelbabu> lol
<Rhonda> bilalakhtar: Your first contribution! Well done! :P
<sebner> pfffffff
<bilalakhtar> lol
<sebner> bilalakhtar: lowers your chances *that* much that I'll sponsor you :P
<Rhonda> heh
<nigelbabu> sebner: lol
<bilalakhtar> lol
<bilalakhtar> Rhonda: are you a dd?
<nigelbabu> bilalakhtar: yes I believe
<Rhonda> bilalakhtar: Did you take a look at the URL I gave you? :)
<bilalakhtar> Rhonda: yeah, but closed it, after seeing so many packages
<bilalakhtar> Rhonda: you bug sebner and persia for ubuntu packaging and are a dd yourself. am i right?
<Rhonda> Yes, but usually I just drop the LP bug number in here without specifically hilighting someone.
<Rhonda> bilalakhtar: e.g. for LP #576287
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 576287 in wesnoth-1.8 "Sync wesnoth-1.8 1:1.8.1-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/576287
<bilalakhtar> Rhonda: what does "Sync request ACKed" mean?
<carstenh> bilalakhtar: you asked me the same question and disappeared before I read it.  we are both dds.
 * carstenh cuddles his advocate :)
<Rhonda> carstenh: Who was that?
<Rhonda> â¦ not me, was it?
 * bilalakhtar is surrounded by experienced DDs
<carstenh> Rhonda: you might regret to have advocaded me, but you did ;)
<Rhonda> bilalakhtar: ACK as in acknowledge. So it got approved/accepted. sebner looked at it and noticed that the ubuntu diff wasn't needed anymore. Such reports are only needed when there is a ubuntu diff and that is obsoleted.
<Rhonda> carstenh: I regret to have advocated someone else, definitely not you. :)
<sebner> Rhonda: well, they are even with no diff after DIF
<bilalakhtar> Rhonda: Who is that "Someone else" ?>
<Rhonda> â¦ which I had to figure out in my mind, Debian Import Freeze. See, bilalakhtar, all new acronyms for DDs. :)
<bilalakhtar> I alreasy know about DebianImportFreeze
<bilalakhtar> *already
<Rhonda> bilalakhtar: I should have avoided that comment and it's not something that needs to go around. I prefer people to make up their own minds about others instead of listening too much to other people's complaints.
<bilalakhtar> Rhonda: ohk, thanks for the info till now, will resume debianization
 * bilalakhtar extracts his sid chroot
<Rhonda> Just a final regular disclaimer note: This is my personal experience and opinion and I don't claim that it's the only true one or even a right one.
<carstenh> Rhonda: btw. I recently found out how to colorize text in dialog, seems like a nice gimmick to differ orphaned packages from packages that are only orphaned because recommends/suggests are ignored
<Rhonda> â¦ or not selected ones in deborphan!
<Rhonda> erm, editkeep I mean
 * bilalakhtar notices that mentors.debian.net is not accepting any more packages, much to his horror
<Rhonda> bilalakhtar: What for do you need mentors if you are a DD?
 * hyperair thinks bilalakhtar is misunderstanding the term DD
<carstenh> Rhonda: the selection happens whilst you run editkeep, so this would be confusing (or I don't understand what you mean by selected)
<bilalakhtar> Rhonda: lol. You thought I am a DD?
 * bilalakhtar thinks hyperair is confused
<Rhonda> carstenh: Hmm. The indicator between * and section as sole indicator is a bit too weak for me. Also I would like to have in the interface the posibility to hide the one or the other list.
<hyperair> er maybe i am
<Rhonda> bilalakhtar: Didn't you say so before or did I puzzle that somehow? Anyway, if you have a webserver on your own to dump the packages too that's as good as mentors.d.n.
<bilalakhtar> Rhonda: I never said I am a dd. I am just a mentor. I will have to upload the package to a server I have for my website expatsinksa.com
<hyperair> mentee....
<Rhonda> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Membership/RegionalBoards/EMEA seems to be outdated, 4th of may is gone. I guess 1st of June will be next meeting?
<lfaraone> Would including the 10.04 CD in the unetbootin dropdown list be suitable for SRU in Lucid?
<jdong> lfaraone: honestly I'd bite if the debdiff isn't too bad
<Laney> jdong: My good man, do you have a minute to offer an SRU opinion?
 * Laney scrambles for the changelog
<Laney> http://packages.debian.org/changelogs/pool/main/d/docky/current/changelog â that upstream release, it's mostly serious bugfixesâ¦ what do you think?
<Laney> s/mostly/all/
<joaopinto> aren't SRU expected to be motivated by LP reported bugs :) ?
<joaopinto> SRUs
<Laney> I don't see why they should be
<Laney> if we find out about a serious bug before a user does...
<joaopinto> where is the bug tracked, the test case, and the feedback that it fixed the problem on that case ?
<Laney> I am asking if it is alright in principle
<Laney> the paperwork follows
<lfaraone> jdong: okay. would it be suitable to also SRU the change to karmic, jaunty?
<joaopinto> Laney, do you consider paperwork validating a fix ? :)
<Laney> what?
<Laney> I think you are hampering me when there is nothing to hamper
<joaopinto> I am playing devil's advocate :P
<jdong> joaopinto: if it's a serious bug I do not mind a preemptive SRU
<Laney> well I never proposed to circumvent the process
<jdong> joaopinto: but it is annoying with some packages when people start cherry picking little fixes every week from git :)
<joaopinto> jdong, without having a test case and resolution evidence :P ?
<Laney> nobody is proposing that!
<jdong> lfaraone: well lets see a debdiff. it's either a backport or SRU
<jdong> joaopinto: no you have to file a SRU bug with required information
<ari-tczew> !sru
<ubottu> Stable Release Update information is at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates
<jdong> of course I won't ask for a test case for reproducing a race condition ;)
<Laney> I want to know if it's ok to SRU the new upstream release
<Laney> backporting the commits would be tiresome
<jdong> Laney: eh that is kind of borderline. got a debdiff?
<slytherin> Laney: I did SRU for new upstream bug fix release in karmic. I could map only few upstream bugfixes to LP ones. The package was evolution-mapi.
<Laney> slytherin: did you have to produce a test case for each bug?
<Laney> that would also be tiresome ;)
<jdong> Laney: gnome stuff has magical exception powers too
<slytherin> Laney: Only for the LP bugs.
<jdong> ;)
<Laney> jdong: it's not a gnome module :(
<joaopinto> so you are using a trust-upstream release policy :P
<slytherin> jdong: AFAIK, evolution-mapi is not yet official gnome module.
<jdong> but if it isn't a big hairy debdiff I'll believe you that docky crashes ;)
<Laney> grr
<jdong> joaopinto: absolutely not. the changes are inspected
<joaopinto> jdong, but not runtime tested :)
<jdong> joaopinto: it still goes through SRU verification
<joaopinto> I mean trust from a stability perspective, not from security
<Laney> we get a lot of patches from upstream
<jdong> I meant changes are inspected from a stability perspective as well
<jdong> I don't mean look for new upstream Trojans
<jdong> *glares at Vuze*
<Laney> http://pastebin.com/GBLzjwZQ
<jdong> Laney: jeeeeeez! how about a backport? :)
<Laney> don't just look at the size of your scrollbar
<Rhonda> how about approving the wesnoth-1.8 backport!
 * Rhonda hides for jumping on the backport mentioning trigger.
<jdong> Laney: that's what she said
<Laney> I don't see that 2.0.2-1ubuntu0.1 which is really 2.0.3.1 benefits anyone
<ricotz> Laney, need any help ;-)
<Laney> ricotz: help argue that we want this!
<jdong> Rhonda: sorry, busy exams and such right now :( wanna email me the bug number?
<jdong> Laney: I said backport..... 2.0.3.1~lucid1
<Laney> oh I thought you meant backport the commits
<jdong> for a SRU there is no precedence for such a big debdiff
<jdong> but stuffing the new upstream ver in *-backports is totally fine
<Laney> I don't think we want to leave crashers and mem leaks in lucid for 3 years
<ricotz> jdong, there are serious bugfixes with detroys the user expierence, a backport is not the right way
<Rhonda> jdong: bug #570609 - if I really should mail you need to hand me a mail address, or is it jdong@ubuntu.com? :)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 570609 in karmic-backports "Please backport wesnoth-1.8 (1:1.8-3ubuntu1/universe)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/570609
<jdong> Rhonda: I'm AFK ish right now so yeah, mail
<sebner> jdong: mind looking at a SRU?
<jdong> ricotz: I'm not going to advocate a 3000 line debdiff with some bug fixes, sorry
<jdong> the two options I see, either backport the entire release or cherry pick bug fixes for SRU
<Rhonda> Also I would think that we should get wesnoth 1.8.1 upstream release into lucid-updates and not lucid-backports because it's a bugfix release that fixes a major usability issue in the multiplayer lobby. The new upstream version also has additional translation updates, but I guess those aren't an issue to require to backport the old lobby back in only as a seperate patch?
<jdong> sebner: bug number?
<sebner> jdong: https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/bareftp/+bug/568840
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 568840 in bareftp "Unhandled exception when trying to use gnome keyring" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<Laney> it's only 3000 lines due to line changes in the translations
<Laney> I really think that shouldn't be a problem :(
<ricotz> jdong, ok, cherry picking would result in a nearly 2.0.3.1 release, so taking the whole tarball is more consistent, the difference between 2.0.2 and 2.0.3.1 are only bugfixes + translations
<Laney> bah
<jdong> ricotz: can you filter out the translation noise? unless you want to try directly convincing the archive admins, the SRU team has no precedence to approve such a large debdiff
<jdong> or are the line numbers relevant to the translation system?
<jdong> sebner: ok, your pokemon patch is approved ;)
<sebner> jdong: thanks :D
<ricotz> jdong, they are not relevant, but updating translations is a benefit for the user experience
<sebner> jdong: gonna catch 'em all :D
<jdong> :)
<jdong> ricotz: you can try a second opinion from pitti who has seniority over me. if he accepts your line of reasoning I won't object
<Laney> does it update the translations?
<Laney> it just looks like it changes the line numbers
<ari-tczew> !time
<ubottu> Information about using and setting your computer's clock on Ubuntu can be found at https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuTime - See https://help.ubuntu.com/10.04/serverguide/C/NTP.html for information on usage of the Network Time Protocol (NTP)
<jdong> that's mostly what I saw it doing
<pabelanger> What would be my next step about getting some packaging reviewed?  I successfully creating packaging and have it in my PPA (https://launchpad.net/~pabelanger/+archive/ubuntu-asterisk)
<Laney> I'm trying to argue that the size of the diff shouldn't matter
<Laney> more the magnitude of the actual changes
<ricotz> Laney, there are updates included
<jdong> I mean... when I have a moment in the next week, I'll take a look at the upstream repo
<slytherin> pabelanger: upload the package to revu
<jdong> but the size of the diff certainly is correlated with the invasiveness of the changes
<ricotz> jdong, is pitti arround here sometime?
<ari-tczew> what is the time now? 4 minues left to 15:00 UTC?
<jdong> ricotz: go into #ubuntu-devel
<pabelanger> slytherin: thanks
<ricotz> jdong, ok
<slytherin> pabelanger: What is the package about by the way?
<pabelanger> slytherin: importing asterisk-sound files (en, fr, es), then update the asterisk package to reference them.
<slytherin> pabelanger: and does this have to be done in separate package?
<pabelanger> slytherin: Each upstream tarball include the same sound files, just recorded in different formats (gsm, g722, g729, sln16, etc).  So I have created separate packaging for them.
<slytherin> pabelanger: Why aren't these files available in official asterisk packages?
<pabelanger> slytherin: 2 types (asterisk-sounds-en-gsm and asterisk-moh-wav) are packaged into the asterisk package, they should be removed since they have there own separate versions.  The asterisk Makefile allows you to dynamically download them at build time, which does not work well for ubuntu packaging (if I understand right).
<pabelanger> slytherin: Other formats never made it into Ubuntu
<slytherin> Ok.
<slytherin> pabelanger: I would name the package something other than ubuntu-asterisk. It is not as if the data is ubuntu specific.
<pabelanger> slytherin: Agree, I just named my branch that.  Each package follows the naming syntax of the actual tarball (IE: asterisk-core-sounds-en-gsm).
<slytherin> pabelanger: Ok.
<pabelanger> Can packages from a PPA be moved directly into REV?
<lfaraone> jdong: re unetbootin, diff at http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~lfaraone/ubuntu/lucid/unetbootin/10.04-in-dropdown/revision/16
 * Rhonda sighs at last comment in LP #260290 - â¦
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 260290 in pgadmin3 "Incosistency: PgAdmin III is in a wrong group in menu" [Undecided,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/260290
<lfaraone> dholbach: for bug 567265, should I prepare a SRU for it?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 567265 in accerciser "does not depend on libgail" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/567265
<dholbach> lfaraone: as you like it
<joaopinto> Laney, from a quantitative appreciation the size  the diff is proportional to the risk of introducing regressions
<joaopinto> qualitative appreciation of the changes is more arguable :)
<nigelbabu> lfaraone: for that subscription, we could have a script or something written
 * nigelbabu explores possibility
<Laney> I am arguing for pragmatics rather than generalities
<lfaraone> nigelbabu: you mean a scripted action in the UI?
<nigelbabu> lfaraone: no, someone of python script that inputs the launchpad id and subscribes that person to everything that he/she packages
<joaopinto> Laney, the SRU policy is general :)
<nigelbabu> at least for now, but we could have osmething like that on the UI
<lfaraone> nigelbabu: mk. yeah, if it uses the API, it should be easy to put into the UI eventually, right?
<nigelbabu> I think so.  Best thing is to ask something who knows the ins and outs of launchpad api
<Laney> The policy needs to be flexible
<Laney> (and it is)
<Laney> (we've had confirmation)
<pabelanger> in debian/watch file, how can I reference the package name, is there a variable?
<BlackZ> pabelanger: packagename-(.*)\.ext example: packagename-(.*)\.tar\.gz
<pabelanger> BlackZ: what if I didn't want to hardcode 'packagename', is there an existing variable exported for it?
<jcfp> pabelanger: there isn't afaik
<pabelanger> jcfp: roger.  Thanks
<slytherin> pabelanger: why do you need to use a variable?
<BlackZ> pabelanger: nope, there isn't
<pabelanger> slytherin: I have about 50 packages to update and create watch files for.  I wanted to see if I could make something more generic
<slytherin> pabelanger: Not possible.
<pabelanger> slytherin: no problem
<carstenh> pabelanger: man uscan /PACKAGE
<mypapit> man uscan?
<carstenh> isn't uscan the tool that handels watch files?
<carstenh>  /PACKAGE is short for search for the string PACKAGE
 * abogani waves
<abogani> I would want  request an SRU for linux-rt package but I have a problem if I want update this package I should introduce 418 commit most of them provided by Stable Kernel Release Linux Team (that is from 2.6.31.6 to 2.6.31.12). Write a SRU justification documento seems impossible. What is the best way to proceed?
<nigelbabu> abogani: kernel stuff?
<abogani> nigelbabu: Exactly.
<abogani> imbrandon: ping
<nigelbabu> abogani: can ask in #ubuntu-kernel? They tend to be the experts in stuff related to kernel
<nigelbabu> um, he's most likely sleeping btw (its late night for him I believe)
<abogani> nigelbabu: They respond me than linux-rt is an universe package so it should handled by MOTUers. :-)
<nigelbabu> ahhh
<nigelbabu> abogani: have you filed a bug for this?
<nigelbabu> and is this fix in maverick yet?
<abogani> nigelbabu: No I don't filled bugs yet. Not fixed in Maverick yet.
<nigelbabu> SRU docs says that it needs to be fixed in stable release first
 * nigelbabu is not sure if there are exceptions
<imbrandon> abogani: pong
<abogani> imbrandon: Read your backlog, please.
<abogani> nigelbabu: I suppose that you meant *development* release first...
<nigelbabu> abogani: err, yes
 * nigelbabu is tired, long day
 * abogani understand well
 * abogani start to think than maintain an kernel package in a decent manner in Universe is impossible...
<Laney> abogani: you should speak to the kernel team about how they go about their updates
<Laney> I hope we can be flexible enough not to block you
 * Laney feels an urge to join the sru team
<abogani> Laney: My pains started at Intrepid time when rt kernel was moved from linux package (so under Ubuntu Kernel Team responsibilities) as standalone package to universe ( sounder MOTU responsibilities). :-(
<pabelanger> Daviey: ping
<imbrandon> abogani: re: linux-rt,  if you can send me the commit log via email, and what information you have
<imbrandon> and where i can find the new build at ( and exact version ) , i'll check it over this evening
<imbrandon> abogani: imbrandon@ubuntu.com
<abogani> imbrandon: List of commits: http://paste.ubuntu.com/431795/, Upstream git tree: http://git.kernel.org/?p=linux/kernel/git/mingo/linux-2.6-sched-devel.git;a=shortlog;h=refs/heads/rt/2.6.31. Actual tag v2.6.31.6-rt19. Tag than I would want upload is v2.6.31.12-rt21
<arand> Would anyone mind sponsoring Bug #526849 to proposed?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 526849 in pastebinit "pastes to pastebin.com no longer work" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/526849
<imbrandon> abogani: great, make sure and send it to me via email too so i dont forget tonight , and i'll get it asap uploaded
<BlackZ> someone has the time for review/advocate some package on REVU?
<pabelanger> I was looking for sponsorship for #578051
<pabelanger> bug #578051
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 578051 in asterisk "Asterisk 1.6.2.7 release" [Undecided,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/578051
 * lfaraone dances about becoming a MOTU
<Laney> oh the DMB happened, eh?
<Laney> nice one!
<POX> not that I contributed much here, but I will not contribute anymore until Python maintenance will be moved back to Debian
<Laney> erm
<Laney> what's that about?
<ajmitch> POX doesn't like stuff being done in ubuntu before debian
<Laney> is that a reasonable concern?
<Laney> I don't know much about python packaging
<ajmitch> well, check when python 2.6 was uploaded to ubuntu, and to sid
<ajmitch> there's that, and apparantly some of the transition around that wasn't done well in ubuntu
<jcfp> not to mention the complaints about the maintainer of python in debian...
<Laney> i'll stay out of this one ;)
<jcfp> join the club :p
<ajmitch> it's a wise choice :)
<BlackZ> lfaraone: congrats!
<crimsun> it seems petty to allow vendettas to obstruct technical progress.
<ajmitch> context is provided in the thread about debconf 2010 on debian-python
<lfaraone> For SRUs, do we need ubuntu-sru approval before uploading to proposed?
<crimsun> lfaraone: as MOTU, no, just upload
<ajmitch> archive admins will approve it once ubuntu-sru gives the go-ahead, I think
<geser> huh, did I miss the newest episode in the python story or what was it just about?
<lfaraone> crimsun: okay. does the bug need to be accepted for fixing in that release, even?
<crimsun> lfaraone: if by "accepted" you mean nominated for release X, yes, but you can do that as MOTU
<lfaraone> nevermind, I just realized I can target things myself.
<ajmitch> geser: nothing really new
<lfaraone> :)
<lfaraone> crimsun: but I cannot target it to Hardy?
<DktrKranz> geser: it's only some mails from someone blaming without knowing the full story behind, and people tend to become frustrated
<crimsun> lfaraone: are you using the nominate for release X?
<lfaraone> crimsun: Yes.
<crimsun> lfaraone: which bug?
<lfaraone> crimsun: bug 578841
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 578841 in unetbootin "unetbootin should contain the 10.04 LTS as an install option" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/578841
<DktrKranz> lfaraone: it's probably because it wasn't in hardy
<lfaraone> DktrKranz: ah, that'd explain it :)
<DktrKranz> congrats, btw :)
<ajmitch> looks like it was added in jaunty, might be backportable
<lfaraone> ajmitch: I'm considering it, but first I want to push my SRU through first :)
<crimsun> I accepted it anyhow
 * ajmitch can't believe how long this fsck is taking 
<lfaraone> Irssi 0.8.14 (20090728) - http://irssi.org/
 * lfaraone oopses.
<arand_> ajmitch: Bug #571707 ?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 571707 in mountall "fsck progress stalls at boot, plymouthd/mountall eats CPU" [High,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/571707
<ajmitch> it's not stalling as far asI can see
<ajmitch> since the % is slowly going up
<arand_> ajmitch: One percent per minute?
<ajmitch> just ticked over to 89% as I wrote that, but it's taken a long time
<ajmitch> yeah, quite possibly
<crimsun> nice, bug spam from 4-digit LP bug #s
<arand_> ajmitch: arrowkey out to VT, if it's this bug that will speed it up slightly
<ajmitch> so I've managed to hit this bug?
<arand_> ajmitch: possibly.
<ajmitch> how slightly? :)
<arand_> ajmitch: In my case 1minute vs 1 hour :)
<ajmitch> and yes, the slowdown starts at about 75% or so
 * ajmitch might have to install some updates once this boots then
<arand_> they're in -proposed currently, so hopefully they should come through soonish, bu then again, uds is a bit of a clog :)
<ajmitch> I have no problem with grabbing from -proposed, I need to test packages from there anyway
<ajmitch> arand: so I guess it'll move past 90% one day? :)
<arand_> ajmitch: Tomorrows about an hour for me... it will probably be today, I think.
<ajmitch> hehe
<ajmitch> it's a good thing I'm not needing to use the laptop right this minute
<arand_> But switching over to the non-graphic VT (just arrowkey), tends to get it going a bit quicker, unless you do want to revel in the mess of the bug :)
<ajmitch> it really doesn't seem to speed it up noticeably
<arand_> hmm, well for me it would take a rather non-variable 100s after switching over, wheas if I left it in plymouth well, about an hour or so..
<ajmitch> interesting
<ajmitch> fwiw, it did just get through the last few % on the VT
<ajmitch> I'll install mountall from -proposed now, and can now work on getting other packages ready for SRU upload
<arand_> ajmitch: Yea, though if you switch there, and then back, it will be horribly stuck again, just since graphical plymouth deals with the spammed fsck messages (I think it is) so much worse.
<lfaraone> If I am uploading to lucid-proposed, should I "bzr push lp:ubuntu/lucid/unetbootin", or should it be "bzr push lp:ubuntu/lucid-proposed/unetbootin"? the latter appears not to exist.
<ajmitch> I believe it'll be to the lucid branch
<ajmitch> since -proposed & updates are separate pockets in the same series, I think
<ajmitch> someone can correct my terminology :)
#ubuntu-motu 2010-05-12
<ajmitch> lfaraone: I see you mentioned the RC bugs stuff in the DMB meeting, what were you using to do that?
<lfaraone> ajmitch: http://qa.ubuntuwire.org/bugs/rcbugs/maverick/ and http://qa.ubuntuwire.org/bugs/rcbugs/lucid/
<ajmitch> OK, you have any suggestions for improving those?
 * ajmitch wrote & maintains that lot
<ajmitch> I see you mentioned AJAX in there, something that's been on my TODO list, especially as I've been doing a lot of that at work lately :)
<ajmitch> lfaraone: nothing to change then? :)
<lfaraone> ajmitch: it has no deficencies as it currently is. What would be nice is a page that would allow us to tell at a glance what the delta is, in terms of changelogs. Pie in the sky feature request:a full diff, which we might be able to extract from bzr or manually.
<ajmitch> no reason why that can't be cached & calculated
<ajmitch> I'll see what I can do
<lfaraone> ajmitch: awesome, thanks!
<ajmitch> there are a few other things I'd like, such as giving some information on the bug without having to click through everywhere
<ajmitch> it's currently generated through cron, and doesn't change that rapidly
<Rhonda> Can someone explain these two things to me? https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/6556 and https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/6477
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 6556 in wesnoth "wesnoth: merge new debian version" [Medium,Fix released]
<ajmitch> somehow/somewhen the bug was assigned to that time & it was getting set back
<ajmitch> registry administrators is a launchpad team that sort of ends up as a default owner for stuff, I think
<Rhonda> ajmitch: Ah, confusion on my part anyway. But still awkward a bit for 4 year closed bugs. %-)
<ajmitch> yeah, it looks rather strange, I wonder why it was done
<Rhonda> ajmitch: Just received a third mail about Bug 5606 :)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 5606 in wesnoth "wesnoth: merge new debian version" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/5606
<Rhonda> Seems like someone is doing historical cleanup
<pabelanger_> I was hoping somebody could help me and see if I have completed Bug #579045 properly?  I'm trying to get a package from Debian merged into Ubuntu
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 579045 in asterisk "[needs-packaging] openr2 -- MFC/R2 call setup library" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/579045
<Rhonda> pabelanger_: I would expect the package should automatically get synced into maverick once that job works again.
<pabelanger_> Rhonda: Where can I learn more about the sync process between Debian and Ubuntu
<Rhonda> pabelanger_: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SyncRequestProcess - but like said, that's only needed after DIF.
<pabelanger_> Rhonda: ok, thanks for the information.
<lfaraone> I prepaired a security upload a while back. I don't think I can upload to that queue, but nobody has taken a look at the bug.
<lfaraone> (rather, no actionhas been taken on it)
<nigelbabu> lfaraone: poke kees if you can catch him or ask in #ubuntu-hardened
<nigelbabu> someone should reply
<lfaraone> nigelbabu: thanks.
<nigelbabu> :)
 * ajmitch suspects that most of the people who could upload it will be at UDS right now
 * nigelbabu is pretty sure
<nigelbabu> but they can assign it to themselves and take care fo it later
<lfaraone> ajmitch: mk. the bug is about two months old, and the embargo ended 1.8 months ago :)
<ajmitch> yeah, I can see that, hopefully someone will see it when they get online in the morning
<lfaraone> ajmitch: are fake syncs frowned upon? I remember some discussion earlier in this channel about them.
<ajmitch> generally yes, why do you need to do one?
<lfaraone> ajmitch: just wondering, I don't.
<bcurtiswx3> http://paste.ubuntu.com/432007/ anyone know what i need to do?
<lfaraone> Hm. I'm having trouble determing the utility of the patch in https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/sablotron/1.0.3-1ubuntu1. Does anybody have an idea what exactly it does? (it touches a bunch of files, but I don't see the utility of it)
 * bcurtiswx3 waves to luke
<lfaraone> hey bcurtiswx3, let me take a look.
<lfaraone> bcurtiswx3: well, the package requires that the version of telepathy-logger be *exactly* 0.1.1. If that is a real (insofar as the newer version does not work) dependency you are screwed, otherwise you may be able to change it to a >= without problems.
<lfaraone> bcurtiswx3: I'm not sure where that's expressed in the package code, esp since I don't know the package this comes from :)
<bcurtiswx3> telepathy-logger
<bcurtiswx3> its simple actually
<bcurtiswx3> maybe i can find it
<lfaraone> bcurtiswx3: no, I mean what are you trying to build?
<bcurtiswx3> empathy
<lfaraone> bcurtiswx3: from the source in ubuntu, or some odd version?
<bcurtiswx3> source in freedesktop
<lfaraone> ajmitch: oh, it'd be nice to add comments to RCbugs marked as unimportant. I just did some research on syncing "lash" over, but I'll have to remove it from unimportant before commenting.
<ajmitch> lfaraone: that should be trivial enough
<MTecknology> Is it possible to uncompress a .deb and see the debian/ directory? Or is that completely separate?
<lfaraone> MTecknology: there is no longer a "debian" directory. There is "DEBIAN", but it's not the same.
<MTecknology> lfaraone: oh.. is it possible to reconstruct it or is it more of a binary form?
<lfaraone> MTecknology: I'm not sure, I try not to touch it :)
<MTecknology> lfaraone: alrighty- I'll try to find another way to get the stuff I'm looking for :P - thanks
<lfaraone> Why is it that running "rmadison -u qa libtinyxml-dev" gives me results while "requestsync -n --lp libtinyxml-dev" says it's not in sid?
<lifeless> rmadison hits a debian website; requestsync hits ubuntus mirror of sid
<ajmitch> ubuntu's mirror of sid is not being updated properly, mostly due to files not being generated properly on ftp.debian.org
<ajmitch> alsmot, requestsync probably requires the source package (tinyxml)
 * ajmitch is hoping that someone is able to fix it there soon
<ajmitch> it's a little annoying trying to do merges for maverick & having the branches on LP be out of date, which I suspect is related to this
<lifeless> yes
<lifeless> the debian branches are driven by the info about debian that lp holds
<lfaraone> ajmitch: just for clarification, what I was talking about earlier was http://people.canonical.com/~pitti/scripts/syncpackage.
<ajmitch> right, fake syncs are something different
<lfaraone> ajmitch: okay, bug syncpackage is kosher, though? I guess I misunderstood.
<ajmitch> I think it's ok, I know that some people have been changing that script around though, and will put it in ubuntu-dev-tools
<ajmitch> apart from that, I don't know the current status of it
<lfaraone> Mk. Long term there will be a LP button to do the same, so I understand.
<carstenh> lfaraone: utility of the patch? like cdbs' simple patch system?
<MTecknology> how can I uncompress a .deb?
<tsimpson> ar x file.deb
<ajmitch> dpkg-deb -x package.deb /path
<tsimpson> bah, that's just the long version
<carstenh> | dpkg-repack - puts an unpacked .deb file back together
<ajmitch> while you'll see the generated control file, maintainer scripts, etc, you won't h ave debian/rules & the other important biuts for reconstructing the package from source
<MTecknology> thanks
<wrapster> if i have pre built libraries.. and i use lets say i build a pkg around these libs to put them into respecitve locations.. would it make a differnce if i just copied these prebuilt libs than actually using the 'install' cmd?
<slytherin> is there any nice howto on using sbuild in lucid? Last time I tried it in karmic it wasn't as easy to setup as pbuilder.
<Rhonda> slytherin: It never is "as easy to setup as pbuilder". It's different and more powerful after all.
<slytherin> Rhonda: more powerful does not necessarily have to be complex to setup.
<Rhonda> Depends. More things to know about and consider. :)
<Rhonda> slytherin: Did you read sbuild-setup(7)? Are there specific issues? That manpage is mentioned in the README.Debian doc file.
<slytherin> Rhonda: I am still installing packages. Will check manpage after that.
<Rhonda> Regularly enough packages do come with documentation included. :P
<slytherin> siretart: is there any plan on working on mplayer in lucid-backports once updated version lands in maverick?
<siretart> slytherin: the problem is that a newer mplayer will not work with lucid's ffmpeg
<slytherin> :-(
<siretart> slytherin: I intend to create packaging scripts for a package called 'mplayer-snapshot', which will a) be in upstream's svn, and b) use the internal copy of ffmpeg
<siretart> and autoupload it daily or biweekly or something
<slytherin> that will be nice.
<siretart> that package will always be up-to-date but not really a candidate for a distro release
<ari-tczew> why http://qa.ubuntu.com/reports/bug-fixing/ maverick-fixes-report doesn't exist?
<mirsal> hey there :)
<bilalakhtar> Hi people, can anyone review my package gnome-media-player? its here http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/gnome-media-player and needs-packaging bug #551702
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 551702 in ubuntu "[needs-packaging] gnome-media-player" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/551702
 * slytherin hopes moovida gets faster UI in new version. :-(
<nickbnf_> Hi, quick question for you guys: does REVU supports the new 3.0 (quilt) format?
<slytherin> nickbnf_: don't think so
<bilalakhtar> nickbnf_: no. see bug #500753
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 500753 in revu "Cannot unpack 3.0 (quilt) packages" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/500753
<nickbnf_> aaw... now my package is "This package could not be extracted; there's no browsable directory for it on REVU."
<nickbnf_> ok, thanks!
<nickbnf_> So do you think it's better for me to re-add the quilt boilerplate in debian/rules and builddeps just so that my package displays nicely in REVU?
<bilalakhtar> nickbnf_: As you can see my package on http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/gnome-media-player , I have left it like that, and a motu has advocated. no need to do that
<bilalakhtar> sponsors don't care, they simply dget and dpkg-source
<nickbnf_> bilalakhtar: ok thanks!
<lfaraone> carstenh: no, like what it actually does.
<ari-tczew> bdrung: what about comment "ACKed." in syncpackage script? not necessary?
<azeem>  /W 36
<azeem> oops
<ari-tczew> near change importance to wishlist
<bilalakhtar> Hi people, can anyone review my package gnome-media-player? its here http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/gnome-media-player . Its lintian clean and a motu has already advocated it
<BlackZ> bilalakhtar: I suggest you to subscribe ubuntu-sponsors for your bug
<bilalakhtar> BlackZ: After I do that, will a message go to ubuntu-sponsors?
<BlackZ> bilalakhtar: Yes. But please, keep in mind you're in a queque.
<bdrung> ari-tczew: why should there be an "ACKed." comment?
<nickbnf_> BlackZ: a queque?
 * bilalakhtar asks the same question as nickbnf_ 
<bdrung> bilalakhtar: are you the guy who filed the ITP in debian?
<BlackZ> s/queque/queue
<astraljava> nickbnf_: bilalakhtar: a queue
<bilalakhtar> bdrung: yeah
<nickbnf_> BlackZ: :-)
<bdrung> bilalakhtar: i can have a look at the package later this day
<bilalakhtar> bdrung: But I have to maintain different versions in both distros, because of libgstreamermm missing in debian unstable. no problems so far for ubuntu
<nickbnf_> bilalakhtar: how is your pkg progressing on debian side?
<ari-tczew> bdrung: because you as sponsor give ACK for sync approv
<bilalakhtar> nickbnf_: Have to disable a feature in debian, as debian unstable doesn't include libgstreamermm (yet)
<bdrung> ari-tczew: instead of acknowledging the sync, i am doing the sync. you can see that the upload was sponsored by me.
<BlackZ> bilalakhtar: So you could package it :)
<bilalakhtar> BlackZ: I am one of the upstream authors as well
<BlackZ> bilalakhtar: Another reason for do that.
<bilalakhtar> yeah
 * bilalakhtar and BlackZ think the same
<ari-tczew> bdrung: ok. I'm thinking about link a branch to sync bug request. does will be done automatically, or your script can handle linking a branches?
<bdrung> ari-tczew: linking a branch?
<ari-tczew> bdrung: lp:ubuntu/current-development/package
<bdrung> ari-tczew: i doubt that this will work in the script, because the branch needs some time to pick up the uploaded package
<ari-tczew> bdrung: just only link to branch, not handling code in bzr
<bilalakhtar> bdrung: Thanks for your interest. I hope you look at the package whenever you are free.
<carstenh> lfaraone: the patch in debian did fix/prevent ftbfs bugs ages ago by re`libtool'izing. jbailey removed useless stuff from this patch when 1.0.2 was the current version (you see that it is based on 1.0.2 when you look at the filenames in the patch). the patch from jbailey is mentioned in the debian changelog version 1.0.2-4 and was included in debian until (including) version 1.0.2-5.2, whilst packaging the new upstream in debian the patch ...
<carstenh> ... has been recreated without the care a gnu maintainer like jbailey takes when doing such things.
<lfaraone> carstenh: okay, so can it be dropped?
<carstenh> lfaraone: debian did drop it when 1.0.3 was released and it did not break anything since then ;)
<bilalakhtar> People, can anyone over here review my (second) package for Ubuntu? Its liboauth,found at http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/liboauth
<carstenh> lfaraone: i would drop it, it might be cleaner when less files are patched but i consider having the packages in sync and avoiding such discussions twice a year more important than a "clean and minimal patch"
<lfaraone> What should we do about packages depending on a virtual package? (libmagickcore-extra
<lfaraone> What should we do about packages depending on a virtual package? (libmagickcore-extra is depended on by xpad, but only libmagickcore2-extra exists)
<carstenh> lfaraone: in debian sid it's libmagickcore3-extra.
<bilalakhtar> Sorry, people, had a connection problem
<bilalakhtar> People, can anyone over here review my (second) package for Ubuntu? Its liboauth,found at http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/liboauth . I have run a test build using pbuilder, no problem with build-depends
<lfaraone> bilalakhtar: "the MIT license" is ambiguous, quote the entire license text.
<bilalakhtar> lfaraone: But isn;t this much obvious?
<bilalakhtar> lfaraone: Can I give an internet address to the license ?
<lfaraone> bilalakhtar: "Several variants of the MIT license exist: (1) the standard version with three paragraphs (blanket permission, keep this notice, NO WARRANTY), (2) a version with a no-endorsement clause, and (3) other versions with slight wording differences."
<lfaraone> bilalakhtar: No.
<bilalakhtar> lfaraone: This is the 1st one
<lfaraone> bilalakhtar: by the way, your debian/copyright MUST declare the authorship and copyright of xmalloc.c, which it currently does not.
<bilalakhtar> lfaraone: Whenever I have been asked to correct a mistake in a package, it has always been a copyright error
<lfaraone> bilalakhtar: hehe, it's hard to get right.
<bilalakhtar> lfaraone: you are a motu, right?
<lfaraone> bilalakhtar: yes, I am. I'm currently checking other parts of your package.
<lfaraone> bilalakhtar: also, you need to reference /usr/share/common-licenses/LGPL-2 rather than /usr/share/common-licenses/LGPL. Use Â© instead of (C). The first line of your package's description MUST not exceed 80 characters. Lintain also reports "spelling-error-in-manpage usr/share/man/man3/oauth.3.gz recieve receive" as well as "liboauth-dev: spelling-error-in-manpage usr/share/man/man3/oauth.3.gz paramater parameter".
<lfaraone> bilalakhtar: let me know if you'd rather I post these comments on REVU, poke me when you update the package.
<bilalakhtar> lfaraone: ok, put the comments up on revu, in the meantime, I had updated the package on revu twice, since you began. check the lastest version for errors
<ari-tczew> in the shop
<bilalakhtar> lfaraone: I have made all these changes. uploading now. changes should be visible soon
<bilalakhtar> looks like lfaraone has gone away
<bilalakhtar> I am also going away, incase you come back, please be patient. shall be back in 20 minutes.
<bilalakhtar> lfaraone, the new upload is visible now. When you come back, please see 'em. If you find them to be ok, please advocate. else, comment
<lfaraone> If someone else has advocated a package, can I be the second advocate *and* uploader?
<bilalakhtar> lfaraone: see the package now. http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/liboauth
<lfaraone> bilalakhtar: building now.
<lfaraone> bilalakhtar: looks good. you might want to consider using a patch system rather than modifying the upstream source directly, but what you have is fine.
<bilalakhtar> lfaraone: so should I change it to 3.0 (quilt) or leave it like this?
<geser> I've seen that the software has also a test suite. I would be good to run it after build
<lfaraone> Hm. For some reason REVU does not realize I'm a MOTU, or I don't realize how to work it properly :)
<geser> and you can remove the commented out dh_* calls that you don't need
<bilalakhtar> lfaraone: yeah, I noticed that earlier. Are you a member of motu team in lp? then it should recognise you
<lfaraone> bilalakhtar: Yes, as of yesterday.
<geser> lfaraone: I'm not sure if REVU recognizes it itself or if you need to poke an REVU admin
<lfaraone> bilalakhtar: By the way, have you noticed http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=496737 ?
<ubottu> Debian bug 496737 in wnpp "RFP: liboauth -- secure authentication for desktop and web applications" [Wishlist,Open]
<bilalakhtar> lfaraone: oops, no
<lfaraone> bilalakhtar: your preference. I personally like using a patch system since it makes uploading new upstream versions easy.
<bilalakhtar> lfaraone: let this one go by, I will use quilt in the future
<lfaraone> bilalakhtar: no worries. that was opened upstream by the author, and is a "Request for Package", so don't worry, your work is not for naught.
<lfaraone> bilalakhtar: you might want to consider uploading the package to Debian rather than Ubuntu. In Debian, it will automatically be synced to Ubuntu. And maybe you can find a MOTU who's also a DD who will upload it for oyu...
<lfaraone> geser: where would I find such a creature?
<bilalakhtar> lfaraone: Fine, I will upload it to debian afterwards. Let this one go by
<bilalakhtar> lfaraone: you became a motu yesterday? wow
<bilalakhtar> lfaraone: I am going away. If you find it fit, and are able to (revu is the roadblock right now) then please advocate.
<bilalakhtar> thanks for your help and interest!
<lfaraone> bfiller: no problem.
<geser> lfaraone: usually in this channel, but I don't remember who is an REVU admin
<Laney> REVU says, doesn't it?
<lfaraone> Laney: hm?
<sebner> geser: RainCT persia ?
<RainCT> What's up?
<RainCT> ok
<RainCT> lfaraone: done
<Laney> http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/stats
<Laney> down there
<lfaraone> RainCT: thanks :)
<RainCT> no problem :)
<ari-tczew> on lucas merges red colorized packages seems to got a new upstream release?
<lucas> ari-tczew: yes
<ari-tczew> thanks lucas
<lfaraone> RainCT: speaking of REVU, if one other MOTU has advocated a package, and I want to advocate it as well, can I go ahead and upload, or does another MOTU have to do the upload after I sign off?
<RainCT> lfaraone: Usually the second MOTU to advocate uploads the package (so you) :)
<kklimonda> hey guys, do you have a working watch file for projects hosted on google code ?
<lfaraone> kklimonda: Yes, one moment please.
<lfaraone> kklimonda: http://svn.debian.org/wsvn/python-apps/packages/autokey/trunk/debian/watch
<kklimonda> lfaraone: thanks
<ari-tczew> zul: I saw that you did sponsor on bug 578729 you can sync package using script syncpackage
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 578729 in augeas "Sync augeas 0.7.1-2 (main) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/578729
<ari-tczew> and where is confirmed status if ACKed?
<zul> ari-tczew: no i didnt request the sync
<ari-tczew> zul: I know, I wrote: you did sponsor (ack comment)
<kklimonda> lfaraone: unfortunately it doesn't work anymore :/
<kklimonda> didrocks: can we sync vala now that debian has 0.8.1 ?
<kklimonda> or do they still have tests disabled?
<bilalakhtar> lfaraone: Hi. I saw your comment. do I need to remove the extra lines? is it important?
<bilalakhtar> lfaraone: I am currently installing the built deb and testing
<kklimonda> hmm, tests are enabled but they fail because buildd has no dbus running..
<lfaraone> bilalakhtar: well, it makes for a more readable rules file.
<lfaraone> bilalakhtar: but running the test suite is *definitely* a Good Ideaâ¢.
<bilalakhtar> lfaraone: I am running the test suite right now
<bilalakhtar> lfaraone: My question is about the rules file
<lfaraone> bilalakhtar: what geser means is that you should call the test suite in the rules file to verify the build worked as expected.
<bilalakhtar> ohk
<bilalakhtar> lfaraone: how do I do that? fakeroot debian/rules (what should be here) ?
<kklimonda> how stupid is launching dbus server at build time to make unittests pass? should I rather just comment out all tests related to dbus?
<lfaraone> kklimonda: as long as it doesn't require root, it's fine.
<bilalakhtar> lfaraone: how do I run the test suite? fakeroot debian/rules (what should be here) ?
<kklimonda> check
<lfaraone> kklimonda: he'd add it to the build-stamp rule, right?
<BlackZ> lfaraone: when you upload a package, you should set the status of the bug in "fix committed"
<lfaraone> BlackZ: In Debian, uploading a package which goes to NEW automatically sets the bug "pending", I'd expect Ubuntu to have something similar, but I could be mistaken.
<bilalakhtar> kklimonda: not working. `No rule to make target `check`. Stop.1
<kklimonda> lfaraone: hmm.. I'd add check-stamp to install-stamp as you can build package but not be interested in running unit tests..
<lfaraone> kklimonda: well, dh_auto_test honors "nocheck" in DEB_BUILD_OPTIONS
<kklimonda> lfaraone: shouldn't dh_auto_test be called automatically anyway if you don't override too much?
<bilalakhtar> lfaraone: I ran build-stamp. Is that what we need?
<lfaraone> kklimonda: he's using the old-style debhelper rules.
<BlackZ> lfaraone: nope, when you have uploaded the package and it's in the NEW queue, you should set the status of the bug in "Fix Committed", check that here: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/NewPackages
<bilalakhtar> yeah, guys, I am not using dh7
<BlackZ> "Once the approved package is uploaded, the uploading MOTU will set the bug status to Fix Committed."
<lfaraone> bilalakhtar: you neeed to add "dh_auto_test" as a command to the "build-stamp" rule.
<lfaraone> BlackZ: If you'd rather, I can get an Archive Admin to cancel the upload so we can solve this policy inconsistency. Or, you can change the flag in the bug yourself, I don't have it on hand.
<BlackZ> lfaraone: you can set the status now: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/503436
<BlackZ> :)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 503436 in ubuntu "[needs-packaging] autotrash" [Wishlist,In progress]
<lfaraone> bilalakhtar: does that make sense?
<bilalakhtar> lfaraone: yeah, done, no probs, removing the bummy commented lines now
<BlackZ> lfaraone: however I have few packages which needs review/advocation: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/anomos and http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/ppa-purge - I'd be glad if you can help me ;)
<bilalakhtar> lfaraone: uploading now. should be available soon on revu
<kklimonda> hmm, ppa-purge is worth advocation
<bilalakhtar> I hate revu for one thing: It never extracts 3.0 (quilt) packages
<bilalakhtar> lfaraone: upload available on revu now. just dget http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/revu1-incoming/liboauth-1005121833/liboauth_0.6.0-0ubuntu1.dsc
<bilalakhtar> people, will come back after some time (30 minutes) advocate if you find it fit
<BlackZ> bilalakhtar: dget -xu is more comfortable
<bilalakhtar> lfaraone: Hi there! I m back. Did you see the recent changes?
<DeeJay1> hi. Can someone point me to a reasonable guide how to make daily builds if the debian directory for a package is in bzr on launchpad?
<bilalakhtar> DeeJay1 I didn't completely understand it. Do you want every push to the branch to be pushed to the ppa also? or you want to build someone else-s branch?
<DeeJay1> no, I want a make a script running from cron which would pull the sources from launchpad, build it then push to a ppa
<DeeJay1> seems like I should use bzr-builder but Google doesn't return any serious results for me
<bilalakhtar> DeeJay1: ohk, thats somewhat long. ask someone else.
<DeeJay1> hehe, ok :)
<bilalakhtar> lfaraone: Are you there?
<RainCT> sebner: btw you were right that Java is better than C++, this thing sucks balls :P
<sebner> RainCT: hahaha, I told you :D
<stevecrozz> I've already built a package in my PPA for karmic, now I want to update it for lucid
<stevecrozz> I tried grabbing the source for the karmic package and doing debuild -S again using my new lucid install, but it was rejected
<stevecrozz> "File nginx_0.7.65-0ubuntu1~stevecrozz~ppa0.diff.gz already exists in stevecrozz, but uploaded version has different contents"
<ari-tczew> stevecrozz: change version to ~ppa1
<stevecrozz> ari-tczew: thanks, ill do that
<stevecrozz> ari-tczew: is there a better way to maintain current packages for multiple versions of ubuntu?
<ari-tczew> stevecrozz: on ppa? I don't think so. You can upload a head package to latest development or stable release, then backporting to older releases versioning ~backport~karmic1 ~backport~jaunty1 etc.
<wfaulk> what's the proper way to suggest a piece of software to be included in Ubuntu?
<jpds> File a needs-packaging bug.
<wfaulk> cool.  thanks.
#ubuntu-motu 2010-05-13
<didrocks> kklimonda: sure
<didrocks> kklimonda: can you open a bug for that? (on maverick, of course)
<Amaranth> What is a good example package for something using cmake? Please no cdbs :)
<imbrandon> most any kde app
<Amaranth> imbrandon: I thought they all used cdbs
<Amaranth> ooh, nice, they use dh 7 stuff
<bilalakhtar> lfaraone: Are you there?
<bilalakhtar> Oh, you are not there
<bilalakhtar> Anyone here to review my package? its here http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/liboauth
<bilalakhtar> People, I have been facing a problem with building package pino in maverick chroot. The zlib.pc file is not found by the configure script. in which package is it?
<bilalakhtar> Anyone here?
<bilalakhtar> Can anyone review my package http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/liboauth
<bilalakhtar> Amaranth: Hi there! Can you review my package?
<crimsun> bilalakhtar: please be patient
<bilalakhtar> crimsun: ok
<bilalakhtar> .quit
<mok0> I need a quick hint. How can I tell what date I upgraded?
<yofel> check the dates of the files in /var/log/dist-upgrade/ maybe?
<mok0> yofel: thanks I'll look
<mok0> yofel, yep.
<geser> you could also look at /var/log/dpkg.log
<mok0> geser: Indeed!
<bilalakhtar> is alien recommended to convert packages from rpm to deb? or is it better to install from source?
<geser> make a proper deb?
<bilalakhtar> People, if I run lintian with -I -E --pedantic tags on a binary package and still get no errors, does it mean my package is ready to go into the archives?
<kklimonda> no, it just means that lintian finds no problems with it
<bilalakhtar> kklimonda: thats good, right?
<bilalakhtar> kklimonda: Can I ignore the binary-without-manpage tag ?
<bilalakhtar> since its an upstream error
<kklimonda> you should still write one yourself
<bilalakhtar> kklimonda: is that important? I am uploading package gconjugo with that tag to revu right now
<kklimonda> there are quite a few programs without manpages but is it good enough reason not to provide one yourself? man page is a first place after --help that people use to get info about executable
<mok0> kklimonda: you should definitely provide a man-page
<mok0> kklimonda: as you say, it's the first place to look for info about a program.
<mok0> kklimonda: man pages are great. It's the only standardized way of documentation that actually works
<mr_pouit> except for graphical programs, they are not that useful
<mok0> mr_pouit: That depends how much effort the author puts into it
<imbrandon> !sru
<ubottu> Stable Release Update information is at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates
<mr_pouit> mok0: many graphical programs have only --help (and e.g. gtk specific switches), and a manpage is rather useless in this case
<mok0> mr_pouit: I respectfully disagree
<mr_pouit> a well written package description is probably better
<mok0> mr_pouit: if it's well written, it can be wrapped into a man-page :-)
<mr_pouit> mok0: of course, but why?
<mr_pouit> (it's time that could be used better)
<mok0> mr_pouit: the short answer is that it's policy
<mr_pouit> mok0: it's a "should", not a "must"
<astraljava> mr_pouit: I think that's what has been said all along: [14:28] < mok0> kklimonda: you should definitely provide a man-page
<mr_pouit> astraljava: yeah, but it's not a reason not to sponsor the package, nor to to override the tag
<mr_pouit> most of the time they are useful, but for some graphical programs without options, not really
<bilalakhtar> Uploaded a new package gconjugo to revu (http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/gnome-medai-player ) and needs-packaging bug #569687
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 569687 in ubuntu "[needs-packaging] gconjugo" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/569687
<astraljava> mr_pouit: Debian policy begs to differ: http://www.debian.org/doc/debian-policy/ch-docs.html third paragraph
<bilalakhtar> Anyone here to sponsor it?
<mr_pouit> astraljava: I know that, but nowhere is the word "must" ;)
<astraljava> mr_pouit: True. :) But one should strive towards a bugless package anyway. :)
<astraljava> bilalakhtar: That link says Package does not exist.
<bilalakhtar> astraljava: sorry wrong link. correct one http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/gconjugo
<bilalakhtar> astraljava: got it?
<astraljava> bilalakhtar: Yeah, that one works. However, I'm not a MOTU, was just helping you out to reduce any confusion. :)
<bilalakhtar> astraljava: ohk
<bilalakhtar> hyperair: Hi there! Are you there?
<bilalakhtar> This chap has sponsored one of my packages, so I am calling 'im
<JontheEchidna> persia: We have Colin over here, so we're good
<highvoltage> hi, I need some help on SRU
<highvoltage> I followed the instructions on https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates as closely as I could
<highvoltage> (for bug 474156)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 474156 in libmimic "package libmimic0 1.0.4-2 failed to install/upgrade: subprocess installed post-removal script returned error exit status 2 (dup-of: 512096)" [Undecided,Incomplete] https://launchpad.net/bugs/474156
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 512096 in dpkg "[MASTER] Exec format error : package failed to install/remove : installation/removal script returned error exit status 2" [Unknown,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/512096
<highvoltage> I first uploaded the fixed package to maverick for testing as the wiki page suggested, then when I tested it and it passed I uploaded the same package to lucid-proposed
<highvoltage> but I received an e-mail back saying that the package was already in the archive
<highvoltage> the package I uploaded to lucid-proposed is the same as the version I uploaded to maverick
<highvoltage> should the version be different?
<bilalakhtar> can any motu be kind enough to review my package http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/gconjugo and point out mistakes?
<JontheEchidna> persia: Though, we would like to hear a few of your opinions on the matter ;)
<ari-tczew> highvolate: I don't see any patches and ACK from SRU team
<ari-tczew> s/highvolate/highvoltage
<JontheEchidna> persia: though seeing as you have a different username in the uds channel, I am probably talking to your home pc
<highvoltage> ari-tczew: so I should put the patch on the bug report and get an ack first before doing the upload?
<ari-tczew> highvoltage: of course
<highvoltage> ok
<ari-tczew> no without reason is delegated team to deciding about SRUs
<ari-tczew> highvoltage: is it bug 512096 ?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 512096 in dpkg "[MASTER] Exec format error : package failed to install/remove : installation/removal script returned error exit status 2" [Unknown,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/512096
<geser> highvoltage: yes, the version should be different: lucid version < SRU < maverick version
<highvoltage> the original version in lucid was 0.71, so the SRU version should be 0.71ubuntu0.1 right?
<geser> yes
<bilalakhtar> lfaraone: Hi there! Did you see the latest liboauth I uploaded to revu (http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/liboauth ) ?
<highvoltage> ari-tczew: patch attached
<bilalakhtar> lfaraone: I fixed all the ones you mentioned
<ari-tczew> highvoltage: what's the bug?
<highvoltage> ari-tczew: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/edubuntu-artwork/+bug/574156
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 574156 in edubuntu-artwork "package edubuntu-artwork 0.1.0-71 failed to install/upgrade: subprocess installed post-installation script returned error exit status 1" [High,Fix released]
<lfaraone> bilalakhtar: I'm a little bit busy right now, I'll take a look at it in two hours.
<bilalakhtar> lfaraone: fine, no problem at all
<ari-tczew> highvoltage: you gave a wrong bug numer at start question. you can remove useless attachments
<highvoltage> ari-tczew: ok
<highvoltage> ari-tczew: how do I remove useless attachments, I don't see an option for that in LP
<highvoltage> (ah got it)
<ari-tczew> highvoltage: click on (edit)
<highvoltage> ari-tczew: all cleaned up, only error log and debdiff now attached
<ari-tczew> highvoltage: ok, now if you want get this SRU process ASAP, ask jdong and give him a SRU's bug number
<highvoltage> ari-tczew: thanks for your tips and advice!
<highvoltage> jdong: could you perhaps take a look at bug 574156 for an SRU?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 574156 in edubuntu-artwork "package edubuntu-artwork 0.1.0-71 failed to install/upgrade: subprocess installed post-installation script returned error exit status 1" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/574156
<ari-tczew> highvoltage: you're welcome
<ari-tczew> highvoltage: and once again... you can give a patch by bzr branch, not necessairly debdiff :) just information
<highvoltage> ari-tczew: ok. I assume that requires us to have the packaging in bzr inthe first place :)
<highvoltage> (which we're planning to do for this release)
<ari-tczew> highvoltage: head packaging in bzr is future planned. now you can attach a debdiff, but it's high time to learn and get used to bzr
<highvoltage> ari-tczew: ok
<Breaking_Pitt> I'm trying to do a debian package from a setup.py
<Breaking_Pitt> when I run make builddeb it stops saying that make[2]: *** No rule to make target `distclean'.  Stop.
<Breaking_Pitt> some advice?
<ChogyDan> Breaking_Pitt: I have no advice, but I think you need to add that to the makefile, right?
<c_korn> Breaking_Pitt: what is your debian/rules file ?
<Breaking_Pitt> one momento please i'll pastebin it
<Breaking_Pitt> http://pastebin.com/J8tB4FT4
<c_korn> odd, I thought dh_auto_clean checked for the existance of a distclean target
<Breaking_Pitt> Am I missing something?
<c_korn> just for testing purposes add: override_dh_auto_clean:
<Breaking_Pitt> where?
<Breaking_Pitt> in rules?
<c_korn> yes
<Breaking_Pitt> where exactly?
<Breaking_Pitt> ?Â¿
<c_korn> Breaking_Pitt: http://pastebin.com/R0Y2zQBP
<c_korn> Breaking_Pitt: pastebin the entire debuild output.
<ppannuto> Hi MOTU! I'm new to packaging / REVU / etc; I wrote a replacement for the gmail-notify package a little while back, and it was suggested that I try to package and release it so that others may enjoy it too.  I think I've gotten a hold of all of this, and I was wondering now that lucid is out and things have hopefully started to settle down what the best practice/policy is for getting a package reviewed?  ( link here: http://revu
<ppannuto> .ubuntuwire.com/p/gmail-notifier )
<ppannuto> link again not split across two messages: http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/gmail-notifier
<jcfp> ppannuto: looking
<Breaking_Pitt> hello i have finished my first package
<Breaking_Pitt> how can i know if this is correctly signed?
<mannyv> cjwatson, around?
<bulldog98> I try to package an package with source format 3.0 quilt but I get an error:
<bulldog98> Reversed (or previously applied) patch detected!  Skipping patch.
<bulldog98> 1 out of 1 hunk ignored -- saving rejects to file src/CMakeLists.txt.rej
<bulldog98> what does that means?
<azeem_> bulldog98: it means the patch didn't apply
<bulldog98> azeem_: what could Iâve done wrong?
<bulldog98> because quilt applys it
<bulldog98> and itâs not the error in the debian wiki
<azeem_> what command are you running when you get the error?
<bulldog98> debuild -S -sd -kMYKEYID
<azeem_> so the clean target does not work?
<bulldog98> azeem_: seems so
<azeem_> hrm
<azeem_> and quilt pop -a does work?
<bulldog98> after running the command yes
<azeem_> maybe dpkg-source's quilt gets confused if you run quilt manually  behind its back
<bulldog98> azeem_: I did quilt pop -a before running the command
<bulldog98> but it happend again
<azeem_> probably because dpkg-source thinks the patches are still applied and tries to unapply them
<azeem_> check the output
<azeem_> or pastebin it
<bulldog98> azeem_: http://pastebin.de/6461
<ppannuto> jcfp: thanks for looking, any progress?
<kklimonda> is there a good documentation how to use new deb format with full tree bzr branches?
<jcfp> ppannuto: almost, real life just keeps intruding
<ppannuto> I understand completely, no hurry -- I'm actually going to grab lunch, back in ~40; thanks again
<jdong> highvoltage: looked at your SRU; ACKed.
<ppannuto> hi john
<ppannuto> SRU?
<jdong> hey Pat!
<jdong> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/edubuntu-artwork/+bug/574156
<jdong> yup, update to lucid
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 574156 in edubuntu-artwork "package edubuntu-artwork 0.1.0-71 failed to install/upgrade: subprocess installed post-installation script returned error exit status 1" [High,Fix released]
<jdong> highvoltage: on that note I'm kinda surprised plymouth artwork doesn't have an actual alternatives system?
<kklimonda> hmm.. it doesn't?
<kklimonda> there is /etc/alternatives/default.plymouth and text.plymouth
<jdong> the debdiff led me to assume it didn't
<jdong> http://launchpadlibrarian.net/48390096/edubuntu-artwork.debdiff
<jdong> "FIXME: Will be accomplished with alternatives in Lucid+1"
<kklimonda> interesting
<kklimonda> maybe it got added later in lucid cycle?
<jdong> maybe
<bulldog98> anyone else able to tell me what I did wrong http://pastebin.de/6461
<ari-tczew> jdong: could you open a task on lucid then bug 574156?
<maxb> bulldog98: You have a patch in the quilt which does not apply
<jdong> ari-tczew: opened
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 574156 in edubuntu-artwork "package edubuntu-artwork 0.1.0-71 failed to install/upgrade: subprocess installed post-installation script returned error exit status 1" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/574156
<ari-tczew> jdong: sorry for taking your time, but I need open a task on hardy; bug 297933
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 297933 in libgadu "kadu: CVE-2008-4776 remote DoS" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/297933
<jdong> ari-tczew: done.
<jdong> (and wow, ubottu is slow today)
<ari-tczew> jdong: thanks!
<jcfp> ppannuto: commented
<Amaranth> wow the new compiz stuff has a bunch of problems :/ http://pastie.org/958987
<ari-tczew> maverick still doesn't exist on packages.ubuntu.com :(
<Amaranth> stupid rpath
<ppannuto> jcfp: Thanks, I'll start fixing these
<bulldog98> maxb: but quilt push -a doesnât says anything
<highvoltage> jdong: plymouth didn't at the time of packaging
<highvoltage> jdong: plymouth only started to use alternatives close to the end
<Turl> hi all
<Turl> I have a question
<Turl> gufw, the ufw ui, currently has a bug with rule deletion
<Turl> and I've talked with the devel and he will fix it
<Turl> what would be the next move to get that fix published for ubuntu users?
<Turl> gufw is in universe
<Laney> if it's a serious bug you can get it updated with an SRU
<Laney> looks like the person to talk to is devfil
<Laney> Turl: ^^^^
<Turl> Laney: would you consider this bug serious? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gui-ufw/+bug/578404
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 578404 in gui-ufw "GUFW erases the rule not selected to be erased" [High,Confirmed]
<Turl> when you click on a rule and delete it, gufw deletes some other rule sometimes
<Turl> I guess it's kind of serious, a normal user would say 'the app is broken', and if they don't pay attention they might be opening another port or something
<Turl> without even noticing, who knows what a user might do :P
<jdong> Turl: yes, that's a serious bug
<jdong> is there a fix for it?
<Turl> I'll talk with devid then, thanks Laney and jdong
<Turl> jdong: we know where the bug is, but there's no patch exactly now
<Turl> I guess Marcos (Gufw's devel) will commit a fix soon
<jdong> Turl: ok once a patch is available, it should be cherrypicked for a SRU
<jdong> I'd approve a SRU for an issue like this
<bulldog98> found my problem
<kklimonda> can I get a list of packages that has diverged from debian but has not been touched in lucid and debian has had an upload during lucid cycle? :)
<kklimonda> hmm, probably MoM
<Laney> what are you after?
<ajmitch> packages outdated in lucid that could have been synced
 * ajmitch is seeing if mdt has info for lucid
<kklimonda> Laney: I'm wondering how bad shape universe is in :)
<Laney> sounds like merge o matic
<ajmitch> http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/mdt/all.html has those sort of stats for maverick
<kklimonda> Laney: interesting blog post btw :)
<Laney> UDD has a lot of stuff you can query too
<jpds> kklimonda: Sounds like the package culling session we had earlier today.
<Laney> http://udd.debian.org
<Laney> kklimonda: *hides* :)
<kklimonda> jpds: probably - I've just read about Universe QA session on Laney's blog ;)
<ajmitch> jpds: it sounds more like the default state of universe - not touched by us, but had changes after DIF
<kklimonda> for some reason I find it impossible to actually participate remotely in UDS sessions :/
<ajmitch> it is rather hard to do when you're not in the same timezone
<Laney> this all started in a conversation with ajmitch
<Laney> blame him!
<crimsun> it's difficult even if you're in the same building, darned plethora of tracks
<ajmitch> who me?
 * ajmitch is innocent of all wrongdoing
<kklimonda> ajmitch: well, that's actually not the problem - it's just that I can't get around using IRC to participate in discussion when the rest can see each others :)
<ajmitch> there is that
 * ajmitch isn't even trying to keep up with UDS this time
<kklimonda> neither do I - all I've listened to were three or four discussions.. and I've almost fallen asleep on Upstart QA ;)
<kklimonda> Laney: ajmitch is there a gobby document from universe qa ?
<ajmitch> why ask me? :)
<kklimonda> erm.. jpds :)
<Laney> yes
<Laney> community-m-universe-qa, i believe
<kklimonda> ajmitch: your nick has a nice color in my weechat :)
<ajmitch> Laney: was anything useful written down, or was it mostly just discussion that wasn't recorded?
<Laney> I can't get on gobby :(
<Laney> but I think I remember it being quite decent
 * ajmitch wonders how the debian health check went
<crimsun> it was interesting. The most useful thing for me was learning that we should file RFAs for packages not in either U/D
<ajmitch> RFA for something not in debian?
<crimsun> err, for packages that U devs don't wish to maintain. Yeah.
<ajmitch> I suppose it makes more sense than an ITP, but I thought maybe an RFP, pointing to the ubuntu package
<ajmitch> but I don't deal enough with debian :)
<ajmitch> the debian/ubuntu crossover is an area I ought to work on more
<kklimonda> hmm.. I have this weird feeling that MOTU is supposed to be "the janitors of unseeded packages" after reorganization, or am I completely wrong? :)
<Laney> That's pretty correct
<ajmitch> those that clean up the mess
#ubuntu-motu 2010-05-14
<effie_jayx> hey all
<keenken> hey anyone home?
<azeem_> Cameron just moved into his new home
<hyperair> i thought cameron was a pace
<hyperair> place*
<keenken> if i wanted to start helping patch, read bugs, etc, where do I go.
<kklimonda> keenken: well, if you want to triage on bugs then #ubuntu-bugs is a nice place to start, if you'd rather fix them I guess this channel is a good place.
<keenken> triage means?
<kklimonda> housekeeping - checking if bugs are reported in a right place, if they have enough informations and if so if they have the right status. sending them upstream (or asking reporters to do it) etc.
<kklimonda> slangasek: can we drop delta for quodlibet-plugins now that debian package recommends either brasero or k3b and lastfmsubmitd has been moved to Suggests?
<keenken> if i wanted to fix bugs, what would I need to know?
<kklimonda> well, first it's good to know a bit about programming - it's good to understand a patch you are applying (or even writing)
<kklimonda> then you should know about packaging, bug triaging and how to work with debian and upstream projects
<keenken> kklimonda, where could I get a definitive guide or something of that nature(that incoporates all of that)?
<keenken> kklimonda, i know a bit of c++
<keenken> the rest after that, kklimonda, i'm not sure about.
<kklimonda> keenken: see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ContributeToUbuntu#Contributing%20to%20the%20Universe%20Repository%20%28MOTU%29
<lfaraone> lifeless: in bug 556968, you said that the bug was fixed in 0.5.0 upstream, yet you set the upstream but task to "confirmed". It is in fact fixed, no?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 556968 in bzr-git "bzr branch crashes with "exceptions.TypeError: expected string or buffer" when cloning a git repository (needs upstream cherrypick/backport)" [Critical,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/556968
<lfaraone> lifeless: re cherrypicking, it appears that the relevant fix is in http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~bzr/bzr-git/trunk/revision/743 if I'm reading the changlog properly.
<lifeless> https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/bzr-git/+bug/556968/comments/3
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 556968 in bzr-git "bzr branch crashes with "exceptions.TypeError: expected string or buffer" when cloning a git repository (needs upstream cherrypick/backport)" [Critical,Confirmed]
<bilalakhtar> Hi MOTUs! Call for sponsorship. Packages are liboauth (http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/liboauth ) , python-tweepy (http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/python-tweepy ) and gconjugo ( http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/gconjugo )
<bilalakhtar> Ann of the above packages are lintian-free and test built in maverick chroot with no problem
<nigelbabu> bilalakhtar: have you thought about getting that to debian?
<bilalakhtar> nigelbabu: nope, I put packages into debian after ubuntu
<bilalakhtar> I go *the* *long* way
<nigelbabu> bilalakhtar: well, if you put it into debian, its comes into ubuntu automatically
<bilalakhtar> so that I get credit for both
<bilalakhtar> nigelbabu: I know that
<nigelbabu> bilalakhtar: actually you get credit for both anyway
<nigelbabu> when packages are synced, its still your name that comes on it
<bilalakhtar> nigelbabu: but I can't become a motu just by sync requests, can I?
<nigelbabu> well, being a motu is not about maintaing a single package
<nigelbabu> or 2 or 3 packages
<nigelbabu> its about fixing whats broken in universe
<nigelbabu> if you want to maintain stuff, its best done in debian and letting it flow downstream (just my take)
<nigelbabu> if you want to be motu, you should be working on merges, fixing bugs, fixing rc bugs, etc
<bilalakhtar> nigelbabu: thanks for your advice, but I prefer to ring both the bells at the same time and get packages everywhere!
<bilalakhtar> I am fixing needs-packaging bugs right now.
<nigelbabu> I still dont get it
<nigelbabu> if you get your pckage into debian, they end up being everywhere
<bilalakhtar> nigelbabu: I know that. Ok, now my question is a different one. Which kind of bugs should we fix? shouldn't the upstream devels fix the,?
<bilalakhtar> nigelbabu: you mean we should update packages as soon as bug fixes are released?
<nigelbabu> bilalakhtar: depends on the upstream cycle.  if the upstream is going to make a new release soon, you're better off getting the new release in
<maco> working upstream is pretty strongly encouraged
<nigelbabu> and after that you can backport individual bug fixes
<maco> submitting a debdiff to both only really makes sense if it needs to be fixed urgently
<bilalakhtar> so thats it. and what are merges? (the last question)
<maco> merges are when there's a new version in debian and there are patches in ubuntu and you need to reconcile the differences
<bilalakhtar> maco: ok
<bilalakhtar> maco: so are you a motu? can you review my packages?
<maco> so if theres a -1ubuntu3 and debian puts out a -2, youd merge whatever changes were made from -1 to -1ubuntu3 with the -1 to -2 changes to make -2ubuntu1
<bilalakhtar> atleast one of them
<bilalakhtar> maco: yeah, got it
<maco> yes im a motu but no i cant do any reviews until at least sunday
<bilalakhtar> maco: Fine. another question. Can a person become a motu by just merges, bug fixing, package updating and new packaging ?
<maco> yes
<bilalakhtar> ok, then, so long. bye,guys!
<maco> bug fixing and package updating was the bulk of my stuff
<maco> only did one new package and one merge before applyin
<maco> bah
<maco> wouldve also liked to point out that there are enough danged packages already, no need to go adding /more/ to the pile in universe
<imbrandon> mornin all
<nigelbabu> maco: I wanted to add that part
<nigelbabu> maco: the 'fix-the-broken-stuff-before-you-add-more' thing
<maco> righto
<nigelbabu> well, thanks for joining in
<maco> when i said to persia when i first started thinking about motu that i needed to do a few more from-scratch packages on revu, he was like "no! we dont need more work!"
<nigelbabu> maco: yeah, he still says that
<maco> yep
<nigelbabu> and there's still more broken stuff
<maco> thats why ive only ever submitted one package to revu :P
<nigelbabu> I've never used it
<nigelbabu> I've used mentors.debian.org though
<maco> and now im co-maintaining it in debian! so thatll get fixed before hitting ubuntu from now on :)
<nigelbabu> wow, zach was right.  the trend is for ubuntu devs to become DM/DD
<nigelbabu> I need to start my work on gwibber in debian... being procrastinating
<Laney> yes! do it!
<Laney> there are lots of people offering help but none actually doing it afaics
<AnAnt> Hello, is the UDS over yet ?
<Laney> last day today
<AnAnt> ok
<nigelbabu> Laney: yep.  I'm just lazy to partition and install debian
<nigelbabu> once I get to it, things will move fast
<Laney> you can get very far with a debian chroot
<Laney> and the whole way with a vm
<nigelbabu> debian chroot isn't that hepful whn you want a dbus thingie I think
<nigelbabu> the last time I tried, I didn't have much time to test + gwibber wasn't really rocking then
<nigelbabu> so, in a week or so, I'll get back to it
<bilalakhtar> nigelbabu: Back. Your nick seems indian. Are you one?
<maco> bilalakhtar: i was going to point out when you disappeared that there's plenty of stuff in the archive already that needs fixing. adding *more* packages (and thus more work) isnt really necessary to become a motu
<nigelbabu> bilalakhtar: that's a surprise, most of the time folks say my nick seems enlighs.  Yes, I'm indian
<maco> nigelbabu: it's the "babu" that sounds indian
<maco> i only ever put one package through revu, and that was one that was previously in debian and ubuntu but was removed and i was taking over shepherding it
<nigelbabu> maco: oh yeah, I forgot I'm using this nick.  usually, I use the nigelb one.  I'll change after uds
<bilalakhtar> maco: You definitely know Indian words. Well, so you mean I should work on merges?
<maco> bilalakhtar: at this point in the release cycle, *definitely* merges need doing
<bilalakhtar> maco: After merging, should I attach a debdiff?
<bilalakhtar> I mean, to the bug? or should I upload the complete package to something like revu?
<maco> bilalakhtar: attach the .diff.gz if its a new upstream version (ie the .orig changed)
<maco> no, merges dont go to revu
<maco> youll know thats the case if 2.3-2ubuntu3 goes to 2.4-1ubuntu1
<maco> if the software version number (before the -) stays the same though, then sure, debdiff works
<bilalakhtar> maco: What is the difference betweek a debdiff and a diff.gz ?
<maco> but! don't forget to use -vFOO where FOO is the last ubuntu version in the debian/changelog, that way it diffs against far enough back
<Laney> maco: only the uploader has to do that
<Laney> it's for the .changes file
<bilalakhtar> Got it. https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PackagingGuide/Recipes/Debdiff
<maco> Laney: oh i thought the dsc would need too...
<maco> ok
<maco> debdiff is a patch of a package and you apply it after youve unpacked the orig.gz and diff.gz
<Laney> and you never need to attach the diff.gz for a merge
<maco> Laney: um ok i'll bow to you then
<nigelbabu> maco: haha
<Laney> just diff between the debian and ubuntu versions
<maco> ive only ever had to have a sponsor on a merge once, and it was 6 months ago
<Laney> :)
<Laney> we ask for a .diff.gz when uploading new upstraem versions (ie 0ubuntu1)
<Laney> of course there is always UDD these daysâ¦
<maco> yeah UDD is how i did the last merge for which i lacked upload rights
<nigelbabu> yeah, most of dev session went like this
<maco> then bzr push lp:~kubuntu-members/amarok
<nigelbabu> "we need to update docs" " we need to review patches" and "we need to use UDD more"
<bilalakhtar> maco: Check whether I am right :- orig.tar.gz is the upstream tarball, .diff.gz is the debian/ directory diff (this one should be the debian one) and debdiff is the patches to be applied to make the package ubuntu-centric
<nigelbabu> Almost all deve related sessions went into that mode at some point
<maco> bilalakhtar: debdiff is the changes to be applied in *this specific revision*
<maco> bilalakhtar: diff.gz contains all previous revisions as well
<bilalakhtar> maco: S=ok
<maco> (all kubuntu members can merge to the branches, then the ~kubuntu-dev folks check them and push to the buildds on occasion)
<bilalakhtar> maco: In merges, diff.gz  and debdiff will be modified. orig won't be, diff will contain the debdiff changes also. am I right?
<maco> depends
<maco> if debian got a brand spankin' new version of the software, then ubuntu will need a new .orig.gz
<bilalakhtar> maco: Can a merge have changes in the upstream part (outside debian folder) also? yeah, you answered it
<Laney> it can, but you should use any patch system that is in place already
<bilalakhtar> Laney: you mean quilt? yeah, I know how to use that. I have used it many times
<bilalakhtar> QUESTION: Where can I find merges on which I should work?
<bilalakhtar> I mean merge requests
<maco> heh at uds barcelona i was asked a bunch of times "so when you going to apply to motu?" and my answer was "when i figure out quilt"
<Laney> merges.ubuntu.com
<maco> http://people.ubuntuwire.com/~lucas/merges.html
<maco> bilalakhtar: by the way, see that touched-it-last column on the right of the page i linked? send an email to whomever is listed there letting them know you're doing that merge so they dont start trying to do it after youve already got it covered
<bilalakhtar> maco: These are the lp ids of the people?
<Laney> you can do any of mine without asking ;)
<maco> bilalakhtar: yep
<maco> ooh one of my TIL's is the package i'm co-maintaining in debian, and it can just be sync'd
<maco> Laney: do i just file a sync request then?
<Laney> I think I already did the haskell ones
<Laney> maybe not -testpack
<bilalakhtar> maco: I didn't understand what does "patch" mean in the third column in this page
<bilalakhtar> Laney: What is merges.ubuntu.com for?
<bilalakhtar> maco: I find all the patches there. nothing to work for.
<Laney> same as that other page, showing outstanding merges
<bilalakhtar> What is an "outstanding" merge?
<maco> bilalakhtar: not-done-yet
<bilalakhtar> maco: But what are the patches for, if the merge isn't done?
<maco> bilalakhtar: and patch seems to be showing what's different between the two packages...ie, what you need to resolve
<maco> its just a diff of the two
<maco> by the way, i think the UDD way of merging works *really* well
<maco> hmm
<Laney> it looks like the ubuntu delta
<maco> james_w: hey how do i get on the list of people who are willing to be spammed about merge requests?
<bilalakhtar> maco: Yeah, same question. What does "last uploader" mean? the person who last uploaded the package in ubuntu?
<maco> yes
<bilalakhtar> maco: See if I am correct: The red merges on this page are packages who have a major version number change (part before -0ubuntu1 ) and white ones have a change after - .
<maco> uhh dunno. i havent looked that closely. this is a fairly new page for this
<bilalakhtar> maco: Last question: What does UDD mean?
<maco> Ubuntu Distributed Development
<maco> the new bzr way of making it easy to not-clash when 2 people work on the same package
<maco> you can also just push stuff to launchpad and submit a merge request and someone will come along and do the uploady bits
<maco> and bzr handles 3-way merges (upstream, debian, ubuntu) like you need for this /really/ well
<bilalakhtar> maco: Do people use bazaar for pkg code hosting also? are all the packages having a branch in lp ?
<maco> all but about 500 do
<bilalakhtar> which are those 500?
<maco> i dont have the list memorized ;-)
<maco> i know some kde ones are on that list because they're so huge the import times out
<bilalakhtar> maco: You could say "new packages", "universe old ones " etx
<bilalakhtar> etc
<maco> and yes the push is to use bzr for working on packages, but convincing 150 people to stop doing things they way they always have and learn something new is *hard*
<maco> theyre fairly random
<maco> its not *intentional* that 500 arent done
<maco> its just that importing them has thus-far failed
<carstenh> bilalakhtar: the ubuntu changes in topgit are also in debian, so this can be dropped.
<imbrandon> maco: heh lots more than 150 i would say
<slangasek> kklimonda: I question whether an ORed recommends is correct, but there's no need to carry a delta for that
<shadeslayer> are new versions of packages allowed in SRU?
<imbrandon> in rare cases minor revisions are
<shadeslayer> like kraft recently released a new version 0.4 from their last stable release 0.2,i packaged it in my PPA
<imbrandon> sounds like a good -backport canidate not sru, 0.2 to 0.4 likely will be a big jump in code
<imbrandon> but you/i would have to look to verify that
<shadeslayer> imbrandon: ok,also debian has picked up my package as a base to package their version,so ill wait for it to go into debian,sync to maverick and then do a backport
<shadeslayer> debian bug 580718
<ubottu> Debian bug 580718 in wnpp "ITP: kraft -- small business-management application" [Wishlist,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/580718
<imbrandon> shadeslayer: sounds like a good plan
<shadeslayer> :)
<shadeslayer> but this really depends on debian.. how long they take to upload it to their archives :P
<carstenh> bilalakhtar: the ubuntu changes in topgit are also in debian, so this can be dropped.
<bilalakhtar> carstenh: yeah? what?
<bilalakhtar> carstenh: When did I talk about that?
<jetienne> q. how can i recompile a given package ?
<Laney> apt-get source foo; apt-get build-dep foo; cd foo-version; debuild
<james_w> maco: join the ubuntu-reviews mailing list
<Henk__> Hi guys; I have some questions with launchpad, bazaar and a project with subprojects (core, and large test files)
<Henk__> Anybody here able to help me out?
<shadeslayer> Henk__: try #launchpad
<lfaraone> Currently, we have an application that foo that wraps the application bar, and takes a single argument, a path. We want to pass all excess arguments from foo to bar. Would the appropreate way be "foo PATHTOFILE -- ADDITIONAL_PARAMETERS"?
<Henk__> the idea is to focus further development for ubuntu
<Henk__> and setup the directories for this
<carstenh> lfaraone: i really like this syntax for the necessary separation of arguments for the wrapper and the actual program, but if there is exactly one argument and this will not change there is no need for this explicit separation and it could be done easier: foo path bar_argument_1 bar_argument_2 ...
<carstenh> Henk__: you should be more specific if you want anybody to answer. if it is to complex to subsume in a few lines a mailing list might be a better way to communicate and it would also reach more people
<lfaraone> carstenh: on further review, it looks like there could be two arguments.
<lfaraone> carstenh: and the first argument may be optional.
<carstenh> lfaraone: an optional argument sounds like -- might be a sane choice :)
<Henk__> carstenh: I am already stuck for a couple of days; reading more docs/wikis/pdfs on the subject brings me not any further; I think I am missing some vital point
<carstenh> lfaraone: on the other side, dpkg chooses a different approach and it works quite well, but for this it is required that all options can be unambiguous assigned to one command
<lfaraone> Anybody have time to do some straightforward SRU verification on bug 578841?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 578841 in unetbootin "unetbootin should contain the 10.04 LTS as an install option" [Wishlist,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/578841
<carstenh> Henk__: nobody can help you if you don't ask your question ...
<Henk__> I am still puzzling about the directory structures... it is the combination of a group project in launchpad+bazaar (the basis for future inclusion in ubuntu) and a core package and optional large data/test packages to test/checkout the numerics
<Henk__> how to set up the local tree? where to init bzr and how about packaging?
<Henk__> you do not want to create an .orig.tgz of a 50 MB test data set
<Henk__> the way I normally work is to extract a code into a user directory and extract everything there; however following standard guidelines the 3 codes should go to /usr/bin, the doc to /usr/share/somting, where should the test files go?
<Henk__> so one should think of the following packages/lauchpad entries => code_x.y.z-all.deb, test_x.y-any.deb, doctex_x.y-any.deb
<Henk__> the tests produce files which are included in a (large checkout) pdf with proof of error free code
<Henk__> not evrybody will want to do that; but the doc shoul be included in the deb
<Henk__> or is there any package which has a similar setup; then I would be able to apt-get the sources...
<Henk__> preferable ubuntu native
<azeem> Henk__: why is code Arch: all and test Arch: any?
<Henk__> code wil be compiled; the tests contain ascii data sets; should work on any arch (incl windows)
<azeem> then you got it backwards
<Henk__> sorry; please read backwards then azeem :)
<azeem> *shrug*
<Henk__> pardon me?
<Henk__> (just a sec; something urgently to do)
<Henk__> (back again)
<carstenh> Henk__: -doc packages are commonly named packagename-doc, separation of verification tool and the actualy program seems to be fine
<carstenh> Henk__: native packages are debian/ubuntu-specific programs that are not useful on another system, unless you are a debian developer for at least 10 years, those can package their software however they like ;)
<Henk__> how do you accomplish that they go into the same packagename directory where tests are under "testdir" and the doc under "docdir"?
<azeem> what do you mean with "packagename directory"
<Henk__> well I meant by I am developing under ubuntu; so there is no upstream origin
<azeem> that has nothing to do with packaging
<Henk__> some tarball which comes from a distant source
<Henk__> the 3 subpackages will have to be packaged otherwise apt-get will not work
<carstenh> there are enough examples of non-native packages where the maintainer is also upstream
<Henk__> I am not upstream, I have some ubuntu machines myself
<carstenh> Henk__: /usr/share/debhelper/examples (or similar) has an example how to create multiple binary packages from one source package
<Henk__> I will peek into it; sec
<carstenh> Henk__: and if you are not sure which directories should your files go to you should first try to find the answer by reading the FHS (filesystem hierarchy standard)
<Henk__> no I meant my own develpoing file structure needed for launchpad/bazaar
<Henk__> the 3 codes can go into /usr/bin
<Henk__> the pdfs can go into /usr/share/doc/packagename
<carstenh> Henk__: you can change the layout later if you want and you don't need to publish your repository in early stages
<azeem> Henk__: what does launchpad/bzr have to do with /usr/bin?
<carstenh> so I wouldn't try to find the perfect directory layout before you even start the project
<Henk__> I want to start using launchpad/bzr
<Henk__> the code is up and running for a couple of years now
<Henk__> published with tarballs
<Henk__> now is the time to finally start with bazaar
<Henk__> and thus with launchpad as well
<carstenh> | Bug #337209 in bzr-builddeb: âimport-dsc doesn't work against ...
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 337209 in bzr-builddeb "import-dsc doesn't work against launchpad URLs" [Medium,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/337209
<carstenh> looks like bzr can import debian source packages
<Henk__> when that is all in place then part of std universe is an optiom
<carstenh> any reason why packaging it without bzr and then import it using this tool and let the tool developed by experienced bzr users decide which layout to choose?
<Henk__> it is not yet debian or any distro format; only tarball with an apache license (which by the way is not suportted by dh_make)
<Henk__> I am the developer, and I want start to use bazaar
<carstenh> dh_make just creates templates not ready to use packages
<Henk__> I know
<Henk__> but how to package the test files?
<carstenh> how can anything not beeing supported by a bunch of file templates and a tools that copies these around?
<Henk__> you do not want to copy them; the package will double to 100 MB for the test files only
<carstenh> are these files created during package building or are the distributed by upstream? if so, are they distributed in a different tarball?
<Henk__> they will be split
<Henk__> the test files are not distributed now
<carstenh> and they will be distributed how?
<Breaking_Pitt> guys I can't continue and i don't know what to do...can someone provide me some help in tus problem? http://pastie.org/960216
<Henk__> but are available on request
<carstenh> Henk__: so not in the upstream tarball ... create a different source package
<Henk__> they will be now; my ADSL line doesnt like webcrawlers to crawl such big tarballs
<Henk__> yes carstenh I concluded that; the way to go for the test files; but how about the optional (large) docs? they can go into .usr/share/doc or local
<carstenh> Henk__: i wouldn't split doc and binary into two source packages but into two binary packages
<carstenh> Breaking_Pitt: looks like a bug in debhelper or the upstream makefile unless you told it in your rules file tthat it should use the target distclean
<carstenh> Breaking_Pitt: let someone check your rules files or try to overwrite the clean target
<Breaking_Pitt> my rules file it's a default rules file
<Breaking_Pitt> can i pastie it?
<carstenh> not in a channel, there are paste sites ...
<carstenh> google after override_dh_clean should point you into the right direction
<Breaking_Pitt> here is my rules http://pastie.org/960282
<Breaking_Pitt> and here is my makefile
<Breaking_Pitt> http://pastie.org/960285
<carstenh> i don't know why dh runs the distclean target, both look ok.  try asking google what override_dh_clean is and does. i have to go now
<carstenh> i hope you can fix your problem :)
<Breaking_Pitt> can by setup.py the problem carstenh ?
<carstenh> Breaking_Pitt: | If there is a setup.py or Build.PL, it is run to clean the package.
<Breaking_Pitt> I have a setup.py
<carstenh> Breaking_Pitt: this says the manpage, so yes, it could :)
<Henk__> (away for 15 min)
<carstenh> Breaking_Pitt: man dh_auto_clean suggests the same solution i told you
<Breaking_Pitt> let me see
<Breaking_Pitt> I have to use this? override_dh_auto_clean: $(MAKE) packageclean
<Breaking_Pitt> carstenh, maybe this can be caused by my debhelper version?
<Breaking_Pitt> i have tested the same in the ubuntu vm an dit works correctly
<kklimonda> can we update all gnome projects to the newer micro release version (instead of backporting fixes) or is it only for packages in main?
<kklimonda> jdong: ^ :)
<ari-tczew> kklimonda: do you mean about lucid right?
<kklimonda> ari-tczew: lucid and karmic
<jdong> kklimonda: depends on how hairy the debdiffs look :)
<Henk__> (back again)
<Henk__> (still stuck)
<Henk__> thnaks for the help; bye
<kklimonda> jdong: the one for lucid looks harmless.. the karmic one is bigger (as there were two micro releases) and it touches parts of interface
<jdong> lucid one sounds okay then, but the Karmic one might need a closer look
 * kklimonda thinks that we should give it a go anyway as the upstream author asked to do that
<jdong> if upstream asks to do it, we can certainly evaluate it a bit more closely
<kklimonda> he's apparently getting bug reports from ubuntu users :)
<kklimonda> mhm, I have diffs ready so I'll upload them to the bug report and give you a link
<jdong> ok
<jdong> I'll be in and out today, but when you link them I'll certainly give em a look
<kklimonda> jdong: lucid patch uploaded at bug 580522
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 580522 in hamster-applet "pack bugfix versions of hamster" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/580522
<kklimonda> hmm, maybe I should just attach branch?
<carstenh> Breaking_Pitt: the debhelper version is not the problem
<Breaking_Pitt> what cause that in ubuntu works and in debian no?
<carstenh> Breaking_Pitt: oh, then it is the debhelper version, though the same could happen with the debhelper from debian and another build system
<Breaking_Pitt> I think that it's the main reason
<Breaking_Pitt> i have tested with unstable in debian
<Breaking_Pitt> and it create the package in a correct way
<carstenh> this part ofdebhelper is not considered to be working with all upstream build systems, at least according to the man page, but in your case a versioned dependency on debhelper instead of overwriting the clean target is another way to make your package build
<Breaking_Pitt> ;) thanks for all
<Breaking_Pitt> but still have a lot of doubts
<Breaking_Pitt> :(
<carstenh> Breaking_Pitt: could also be some python issue, i don't know how setup.py works. which debhelper version do you use under ubuntu?
<Breaking_Pitt> 7.4.15
<carstenh> Breaking_Pitt: changelog does not look like the different debhelper version could cause this
<Breaking_Pitt> i don't know
<carstenh> writing a clean target in debian/rules could avoid a lot of headache ;)
<carstenh> or you could install the newer debhelper on ubuntu and try ...
<Breaking_Pitt> in ubuntu works correctly... in debian no
<carstenh> so it fails with the newer debhelpre version. i would really just copy and adapt a clean target from /usr/share/doc/debhelper/examples/
<Breaking_Pitt> ok let me see
<kklimonda> jdong: do you, as a member of sru team, prefer working with branches linked to sru-able bugs or rather with patches attached to bugs?
<jdong> kklimonda: I don't have a preference either way :)
<kklimonda> jdong: and what is the "right" place to push branches to LP for packages to? lp:~<login>/<distro>/<serie>/<package>/<pocket> looks good?
<jdong> kklimonda: that I don't know :)
<kklimonda> jdong: I've also pushed branch for karmic part of bug 580522 lp:~kklimonda/hamster-applet/karmic-proposed
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 580522 in hamster-applet "pack bugfix versions of hamster" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/580522
<kklimonda> btw, who can verify sru in universe and who can do it in main?
#ubuntu-motu 2010-05-15
<arand> What does actually XSBC mean? (c.f. XSBC-Original-Maintainer: in ubuntu packages).
<geser>  X=user-defined field, S=include in source, B=include in binary, C=include in .changes
<arand> geser: Ah, ok... Completely not what I expected then, I though it just was a wierd acronym :)
<bdrung> arand: i sponsored your pastebinit patch
<arand> bdrung: Yea, I noticed, cheers. Sorry about the maintainer miss. Just a happy amateur so far :/
<bdrung> arand: if you want to get other things sponsored, just drop me a note and i will work on that instead of grabbing a random item from http://qa.ubuntu.com/reports/sponsoring/
<ari-tczew> what is rc bugs?
<bdrung> rc = release candidate
<kklimonda> and not release critical? I guess it depends on a context :)
<ari-tczew> +1 ^^
<kklimonda> ari-tczew: release critical bug (in debian) is a bug that has to be fixed before releasing stable
<bdrung> yeah, release critical is probably the correct one ;)
<ari-tczew> merge/sync is enough to fix?
<kklimonda> what do you mean?
<ari-tczew> http://qa.ubuntuwire.com/bugs/rcbugs/maverick/
<ari-tczew> row Fixed Version
<ari-tczew> so merging latest debian version is enough to fix rc bug?
<ari-tczew> if fix was published in debian revision
<kklimonda> Ubuntu doesn't have concept of release critical bugs AFAIK
<arand> bdrung: Well there's Bug #510571 , but if I understand things correctly that'd need an SRU-ack first..?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 510571 in virtualbox-ose "Lucid guest won't boot with acpi in virtualbox" [Undecided,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/510571
<kklimonda> the closest thing to RC bugs is targeting a bug to some milestone
<ari-tczew> o-O
<bdrung> arand: no, we don't need it. the common way is to upload the package to -proposed and then a ubuntu-sru member either approves the package or declines it
<bdrung> arand: the next sponsored bug will be yours.
<arand> bdrung: cheers :) Just hoping my debdiffs are all in order...
<bdrung> arand: they look fine
<bdrung> arand: did you build the packages in pbuilder?
<arand> bdrung: Yes.
<bdrung> arand: my root partition went out of space. therefore i build only one of both debdiffs.
<bdrung> arand: uploaded
<arand> bdrung: I've also built them in my ppa: https://edge.launchpad.net/~arand/+archive/virtualbox/+packages, (there's a newer unrelated patch for karmic there as well) So I hope they should be fine... Cheers :)
<lfaraone> james_w: with bzr merge-upstream, can I specify an upstream revision with with to merge with? (I want to get a specific tag, but using "-r TAG_NAME" gets me "bzr: ERROR: --revision is not allowed when merging a tarball                                                                                                                                                  ")
<lifeless> lfaraone: please file a bug on that
<Breaking_Pitt> I'm getting this error someone knows?
<Breaking_Pitt> dpkg-gencontrol: warning: unknown substitution variable ${python:Provides}
<ari-tczew> bdrung: have you got time for sponsoring other 3 my syncs?
<ari-tczew> Laney: ping
<bdrung> ari-tczew: yes, i will process all sync requests
<ari-tczew> ok
<ari-tczew> bdrung: btw. do you will process sync requests subscribed to ~ubuntu-archive ?
<bdrung> ari-tczew: not planned
<ari-tczew> who is responsible to site http://packages.ubuntu.com ?
<bdrung> ari-tczew: To report a problem with the web site, e-mail frank@lichtenheld.de.
<ari-tczew> ok, mail sent
<Breaking_Pitt> how can i avoid this error..I can't find info quilt-series-but-no-build-dep
<bdrung> Breaking_Pitt: http://lintian.debian.org/tags/quilt-series-but-no-build-dep.html
<bdrung> You should either remove the series file if it's effectively not useful or add quilt to the build-dependencies if quilt is used during the build process.
<Breaking_Pitt> where is the series file?
<Breaking_Pitt> i don't create any series file
<carstenh> Breaking_Pitt: which dpkg source format do you use?
<bdrung> debian/patches/series
<Breaking_Pitt> hi carstenh!
<Breaking_Pitt> I'm still figthing with my package
<carstenh> hi :) yes, i see
<carstenh> test -d debian && cat debian/source/format
<carstenh> what does this command tell you?
<Breaking_Pitt> let me see
<Breaking_Pitt> nothing! :)
<Breaking_Pitt> fixed.. now I only have this one native-package-with-dash-version
<carstenh> Breaking_Pitt: then you need to cd into the package directory and run it again
<Breaking_Pitt> no way of avoidint the error :(
<carstenh> correct, no way to avoid errors without either reading documentation nor answering questions ;)
<Breaking_Pitt> i know
<Breaking_Pitt> but seems that i have no file called bicho_0.3.0.orig.tar.gz
<carstenh> Breaking_Pitt: you could try man mv and man dpkg-source instead of answering my question
<bdrung> ari-tczew: you keep me working. ;)
<ari-tczew> bdrung: someone must :-)
<Breaking_Pitt> fixed ;)
<bdrung> ari-tczew: this list is already too long: http://qa.ubuntu.com/reports/sponsoring/
<Breaking_Pitt> thanks carstenh
<ari-tczew> bdrung: for this problem I want to join MOTU and help
<ari-tczew> but someone do not understand this
<bdrung> who?
<ari-tczew> bdrung: Laney don't want see my in MOTU: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ArturRona/MOTUApplication#Comments
<ari-tczew> s/my/me
<carstenh> ari-tczew: you do syncs to remove ubuntu diffs ... topgit would be easy, you just need to grep for a single line to verify
<ari-tczew> carstenh: propably you don't know what I'm working
<ari-tczew> I just interested more in security bug fixing instead FTBFS. is it wrong? lol :-D
<carstenh> ari-tczew: i read what Laney wrote, so maybe he doesn't know it too
<ari-tczew> carstenh: so please be quiet, if you don't know
<carstenh> ari-tczew: if you want me to be quiet, why to you tell me to be and don't just ignore waht I said?
<ari-tczew> bdrung: hmm, I guess that sync requests requested manually is not show in http://qa.ubuntu.com/reports/sponsoring/ is it true?
<bdrung> carstenh: i don't understand the connection between syncs and topgit
<bdrung> ari-tczew: if you subscribe ubuntu-sponsors to your sync request bug, it will
<carstenh> bdrung: there is a ubuntu specific diff that could be dropped
<bdrung> carstenh: are you talking about a specific package?
<ari-tczew> carstenh: just I don't like people who are saying a lot, but don't know the wole situation (in this context - my work structure)
<carstenh> bdrung: yes, the package topgit
<ari-tczew> and second: you wrote this to me, so I just answered to you
<ari-tczew> nothing abnormal
<bdrung> carstenh: aha - i thought he should use topgit to make syncing easier :D
<bdrung> ari-tczew: you sounded a little bit offending
<bdrung> (probably just the wording)
<carstenh> bdrung: indeed the concept of topgit could help with syncing if it would use bzr instead of git ;)
<carstenh> so, yes, the wording was suboptimal
<bdrung> carstenh: i'll sync topgit
<carstenh> fine, thanks :)
<carstenh> bdrung: if you have questions please ask, I wrote the upstream patch, did the debian upload and told persia to to the ubuntu upload
<ari-tczew> carstenh: so what's your conclusion: my work is unnecessary and not enough for MOTU?
<ari-tczew> if you want (you, Laney, and others) I can leave channel and launchpad, I'll leave more work for you! cheers :-D
<ari-tczew> and sponsoring list will be smaller, same benefits
<ari-tczew> and quantity of security bugs will be higher
<ari-tczew> what else?
<bdrung> carstenh: uploaded - no question
<kklimonda> ari-tczew: the problem is that MOTU is more than syncing, merging and backporting. It's also performing library transitions, packaging from scratch etc.
<ari-tczew> kklimonda: so or you are doing all, or you are too small for MOTU, right?
<carstenh> ari-tczew: i did not judge your work in any way until, but since you ask me: i have the impression that MOTOs should work more on sync request and collaboration with debian, it the only critic on your work is that you to too much work on collaboration with debian by taking care of syncing then it is more a reason to make you a MOTO than to veto. the packaging from scratch is IMHO useless if you could do the same or less work to get ...
<carstenh> ... packages into both debian and ubuntu
<carstenh> s/packaging from scratch/packaging from scratch for ubuntu/
<ari-tczew> everybody from this channel: please give me a comment on my wiki page that I'm not welcome in MOTU - please!!!!
<carstenh> ari-tczew: I don't know anything about your other work so I can't comment on this
<ari-tczew> just give
<bdrung> ari-tczew: you are overreacting
<ari-tczew> bdrung: no
<bdrung> ari-tczew: noone said that you are not welcome in MOTU
<ari-tczew> bdrung: but I see opinions
<ari-tczew> that I said: just give me a comment masters :-D
<ari-tczew> you are the best
<bdrung> ?
<ari-tczew> note: sarcasm is not the same as flamewar
<bdrung> i didn't use sarcasm
<ari-tczew> bdrung: I use
<bdrung> i use sarcasm only in face to face discussions to avoid misunderstandings
<bdrung> ari-tczew: please mark sarcasm as such in IRC discussions
<ari-tczew> carstenh: FYI yesterday I've looked all packages which were rebuilt for fakesync. tiring and time consuming.
<ari-tczew> but propably you and other (Laney) thinks that this is not enough
<ari-tczew> yeaa
<carstenh> ari-tczew: you don't need to convince me, my comment on 16:17:50 was clearly on favor for you becoming a motu, but I don't have any influence on this
<ari-tczew> carstenh: if you're with me, I'm glad, sorry for attacks
<bdrung> ari-tczew: i think nobody is against you. at most they want you to gain more experience.
<ari-tczew> looking at the fresh MOTU members, I don't think that they are doing these things (also performing library transitions, packaging from scratch etc.)
<om26er> I restored my gnupg dir and now dh_make shows om26er@unknown.com in changelog file :(
<bdrung> ari-tczew: yeah, library transitions are not the usual thing a newcomer does
<bdrung> ari-tczew: did you update a package to a new upstream version? do you maintain a package in debian? do you triage bugs?
<bdrung> that are thing that are not covered by syncs/merges
<ari-tczew> bdrung: I've packages a few packages manually, but when I met sync, I don't doing this. Not maintain packages in Debian. Only requests for new upstream releases, or sending delta from Ubuntu. Triages - when I'm looking on package for syncs or merge, I'll check what bugs are exist.
<carstenh> om26er: setting DEBEMAIL and DEBFULLNAME would fix this
<ari-tczew> bdrung: syncs/merges not covered to new upstream release? o_O
<bdrung> ari-tczew: they do not cover updating the package by yourself.
<ari-tczew> bdrung: what for me? packages in Debian have a maintainers
<bdrung> let me rephrase it: it's a difference if you sync/merge a new upstream release from debian or if you update the package by yourself
<om26er> carstenh, thanks alot it worked :)
<ari-tczew> bdrung: I know what's the difference, but what's going on?
<carstenh> ari-tczew: if you want to do a debian upload to be able to tell people about it when they ask such questions you could prepare cuneiform, i would sponsor it. there is a new upstream version and possibly there are some lintian warnings to be fixed. preparing the new version includess recreating the orig.tar.gz since there are non-distributable files in upstreams version.
<carstenh> since QA maintains the package there is no need to take care of this package in future
<ari-tczew> sorry, I must go, see you
<carstenh> ok
<ari-tczew> I'm late
<funkyHat> Can I use bzr to check out a branch of any ubuntu package, and what's the form of the URL I can use?
<funkyHat> Can't find anything for this on the wiki and https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Packaging/Training/Logs/2009-04-09 seems to be out of date
<funkyHat> I've tried bzr checkout lp:~ubuntu/fglrx-installer and a few other variations â¢)
<funkyHat> Aha. bzr branch lp:ubuntu/maverick/fglrx-installer
<funkyHat> hm. This branch seems pretty heavy... is it possible to make a lighter branch?
<funkyHat> Perhaps I'd be better of just working with apt-get source and submitting a debdiff â¢ D
<astraljava> funkyHat: Isn't the bzr way how it's supposed to be worked, in the future, however?
<bdrung> funkyHat: the normal way is "bzr branch lp:ubuntu/fglrx-installer"
<bdrung> or "lp:ubuntu/<series>/<package>" for a specific series
<funkyHat> astraljava: yes I think so...
<kklimonda> hmm.. I need to run setup.py configure, how can I do it using debhelper 7 in a nice and clean way?
<funkyHat> bdrung: ah thanks
<AnAnt>  /q bdrung
<funkyHat> I was going to try and make a package which included these patches https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/fglrx-installer/+bug/573748 but that looks more complicated than I thought it would
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 573748 in fglrx-installer "fglrx does not build on 2.6.34 kernel (Patch files available)" [Undecided,New]
<AcePreshaw> !caps
<ubottu> PLEASE DON'T SHOUT! We can read lowercase too.
<kklimonda> hmm, pull-debian-source is broken?
<kklimonda> ah, no - my bad (noty to myself: pull-*-source work on source packages ;))
<nigelb> sigh, bugs like 'ubuntu wallpaper made in mac!' make be laugh and cry at the same time
<nigelb> s/be/me
 * JontheEchidna waits for "the font was made in windows" to become public knowledge.
<nigelb> meh.  I liked the response to it :)
<arand> Not even just made in windows, but made bu MS tools :D
<nigelb> these are the stuff that are used to make fonts, can't run away from it.
<JontheEchidna> yeah
<JontheEchidna> heh
<nigelb> same goes for the wallpaper made in mac bug.  I closed the bug and I'm wiating for the flood to hit my mailbox
<nigelb> there is also a bug about an upstream change and users complaining in lp about it.  seb and I've reached breaking point explaining that its an upstream change
<arand> Hmm, those kinds are numerous.
<nigelb> we've adopted a middle patch by setting to triage and reporting upstream :D
<nigelb> s/patch/path
<nigelb> I wish there was someway that noone could mess with a Fix Released bug.
<BlackZ> hey nigelb
<nigelb> oh, yeah, the mail
 * nigelb gets to it
 * micr0spell Discounts!! Our Special Limited Time Offers Up To May,22!!! Notebooks,Plasma and LCD TV's.Buy your electronic needs at our unique prices. Laptop Sony VAIOÂ® VGN-FW590FFD-575,57$!!!Apple MacBookÂ® Air MC234LL/A-695,27$!!! http://www.elplace.com/
<nigelb> what the...
<astraljava> Oh dear.
<imbrandon> JontheEchidna: what font/bug ?
<JontheEchidna> imbrandon: Oh, the guy making the new Ubuntu font did a presentation/plenary at UDS. He admitted to using a windows font tool because none of the Linux ones were really up to snuff
<JontheEchidna> Though I think I did hear that somebody wanted to use the python fontforge bindings and Quickly to make a GUI for what he needed :P
<imbrandon> ahh
#ubuntu-motu 2010-05-16
<mac9416> Hello. When I open a deb in an archive manager, then data.tar.gz, I see that the top directory is called "." How is that directory created? I thought "." meant "current directory."
<niall_> quit
<imbrandon> it does, debs are created with dpkg-buildpackage
<mac9416> imbrandon, what is dpkg-deb --build for?
<imbrandon> mac9416: there are alot of diffrent alias for the same thing, the debian pacakge guide explains it
<mac9416> k
<mac9416> Will that guide explain the "." directories?
<imbrandon> but building the archive directly isnt really feasable
<mac9416> I see.
<imbrandon> the . is the current directory
<imbrandon> as you said
<mac9416> But how does dpkg make such a directory?
<mac9416> Rather, why is it visible in an archive manager?
<imbrandon> it dosent make it, thats how archive manager is representing it
<mac9416> OK
<mac9416> imbrandon, u say it wouldn't be feasiable to make a deb by hand. What if it was only a metapackage? No data, only a control file.
<mac9416> imbrandon, I'm looking at making a cross-platform metapackage creator, so I kinda want to make a simple deb with Python.
<mac9416> I doubt dpkg-buildpackage is cross-platform.
<lfaraone> mac9416: it will probably run in any unix enviornment.
<mac9416> lfaraone, what about Windows?
<mac9416> Is the information here still accurate? http://madabar.com/techblog/2007/07/15/manually-creating-a-deb-package-for-maemo/
<mac9416> Because I can read BASH. And if his methos still works, I can do it in Python.
<mac9416> *method
<imbrandon> mac9416: likely but you'll get a morer definitive response from the dpkg maintainers in debian ( on oftc )
<imbrandon> and the dpkg documentation
<imbrandon> as that is what you are re-implmenting
<imbrandon> dear lazyweb: i'm bored ... that is all.
<mirsal> lfaraone, ping
<mirsal> (Hello, there ^^)
<kobrien> any tips on where to look for help with packaging a java app?
<kobrien> docs seem scarce. My app uses ant as buildsystem...
<imbrandon> kobrien: http://wiki.debian.org/JavaPackage
<imbrandon> kobrien: sorry wrong link
<kobrien> kk
<imbrandon> kobrien: anyhow the ant build system should be supported just look at any of the programs that currently use it
<kobrien> good thinking
<kobrien> imbrandon: :) I have my answers. I downloaded a variant of lucene which uses ant to build. thanks
<imbrandon> kobrien: :)
<defcon> morning
<ari-tczew> hello
<pochu> quadrispro: hi, isn't simple-scan 2.31.x an unstable series?
<ari-tczew> pochu: simple-scan (2.31.1-1) is in unstable
<geser> ari-tczew: pochu asks about the upstream versioning. Some upstreams (e.g. Gnome) use even numbers (e.g. 2.30.x) for the stable releases and odd numbers (2.31.x) for development releases
<ari-tczew> geser: I know about gnome's versioning
<pochu> ari-tczew: I know it's in unstable, hence my question
<pochu> if 2.31.1 is an unstable release, having it in unstable is bad (tm)
<ari-tczew> yhy
<quadrispro> pochu, maybe but it works fine, i didn't find any bug for now
 * quadrispro on phone
<pochu> quadrispro: well I don't think that's a good enough reason to ship unstable software in a stable release, but YMMV
<pochu> but as long as you take care of bugs et al (and you do), I guess it's alright
<ari-tczew> does apt-cache policy say true of packages
<ari-tczew> component? main/universe etc
<geser> yes, for packages from the main archive (PPAs have only a main component)
<ari-tczew> geser: because I have a discrepancy. merge sites and apt-cache policy says that package is in universe, but LP show main component...
<geser> which one?
<ari-tczew> geser: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/trove
<bdrung> ari-tczew: update to lucid!
<bdrung> ari-tczew: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/trove/2.0.4-1ubuntu2 VS https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/trove/2.1.0-1ubuntu1
<geser> ari-tczew: ignore the "Component:*" field in the Package section but look instead at the second column in the table below it
<ari-tczew> geser, bdrung: heh, some time ago someone told me that this is LP bug
<bdrung> :) according to LP this package is moved to main in lucid
<ari-tczew> bdrung: is your mailbox full of requests? :P
<bdrung> 11 sync requests. you guys are mean to me ;)
<geser> bdrung: 2.1.0-1ubuntu1 got demoted again to universe (see https://edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/trove/+publishinghistory)
<bdrung> aha
<bdrung> ari-tczew: you could be more verbose. state the changes that can be dropped instead of using "All changes have been incorporated in the Debian package."
<ari-tczew> bdrung: I have this sentence saved in my statistic file. :P what could I write instead above^^?
<c_korn> where can I find an address to inform google about the problem we (Debian and Ubuntu) have with their design change on code.google.com rendering existing debian/watch files useless and the fact that new watch files would be somehow ugly: http://svn.debian.org/viewsvn/python-apps/packages/sinntp/trunk/debian/watch?revision=5212
<bdrung> for example: Debian has merged the Ubuntu changes (see second entry of changelog)
<bdrung> c_korn: good questions. next question? ;)
<kklimonda> c_korn: I don't think that it's something they would care about
<bdrung> c_korn: this issue is currently discussed on the debian-devel mailing list.
<c_korn> I know. http://groups.google.de/group/linux.debian.devel/browse_thread/thread/3f9bbca6687dcd27
<kklimonda> I like the idea of extending uscan to deal with things like that in a nice and clean fashion
<c_korn> yes, but these redirectors are only a workaround in my eyes. and in case of code.google.com the redirector would have to fetch a page. (according to this http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=581622#15 )
<ubottu> Debian bug 581622 in qa.debian.org "[qa.debian.org] Please provide a code.google.com redirector" [Wishlist,Open]
<bdrung> ari-tczew: bug #581228 what do you want to say with "In Ubuntu package is not interesting"?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 581228 in obexd "Sync obexd 0.23-1 (main) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/581228
<bdrung> ari-tczew: what to do with debian/patches/0001-Revert-Fix-the-session-is-shutdown-when-the-agent-ex.patch ?
<nigelb> bdrung: the fix for the pbuilder bug shuold be synced by now right?
<nigelb> so its only a matter of getting the sru in I suppose
<bdrung> nigelb: which bug?
<nigelb> bdrung: you had commented on an sru bug dont remember the nuber right now
<bdrung> nigelb: i comment on too many bugs
<nigelb> bdrung: busy core-dev ;)
<bdrung> nigelb: ari-tczew and Bhavani Shankar keep me busy.
<nigelb> hehe
<nigelb> patch review has reduced my motu work
<bdrung> nigelb: can you dig out the bug number?
<ari-tczew> bdrung: in obexd, the diff /debian/ between ubuntu and debian is changelog, standards version and description package. so I guess that these differents are not very importand
<nigelb> bdrung: yep, gimme a minute
<bdrung> ari-tczew: and 0001-Revert-Fix-the-session-is-shutdown-when-the-agent-ex.patch?
<ari-tczew> bdrung: what's the package or bug number?
<bdrung> ari-tczew: the same (obexd)
<ari-tczew> bdrung: fixed upstream
<ari-tczew> I should write that patch has been fixed upstream
<bdrung> ari-tczew: yes. that's one thing that should be in the bug explanation
<ari-tczew> sorry
<bdrung> ari-tczew: and where did you see that?
<ari-tczew> bdrung: what see?
<bdrung> ari-tczew: that the patch has been fixed upstream?
<ari-tczew> bdrung: tested - I've installed debian package, sent file to my phone and it works, and upstream changelog: 	Fix unneeded reset of session after a CONNECT.
<bdrung> ari-tczew: ok. acked this sync request
<ari-tczew> bdrung: is merging bzr harder than from debdiffs? (from sponsor point of view)
<bdrung> ari-tczew: a little bit. i need to get used to and use the advantages of the VCS.
<ari-tczew> yhy
<bdrung> ari-tczew: yhy?
<ari-tczew> just like aha
<ari-tczew> aha, heh, yhy...
<ari-tczew> ok
<bdrung> aha
<bdrung> ari-tczew: how do you pronounce this word without vowels?
<ari-tczew> bdrung: without vowels? hmmm "y" is not vowel?
<ari-tczew> aa
<ari-tczew> I just know! not in english
<ari-tczew> in polish  "y" is vowel
<ari-tczew> ok so I'll not use in future word "yhy" :-)
<bdrung> ari-tczew: interesting: wikipedia says that y can be a vocal in some cases in German.
<bdrung> the English wikipedia says: "representing a vowel in most languages that use it"
<ari-tczew> :-)
<bdrung> ari-tczew: does yhy sound like ihi?
<ari-tczew> bdrung: no, doesn't sound like ihi :)
<ari-tczew> bdrung: but... maybe. heh, not easy to compare
<ari-tczew> bdrung: I think that you're bored. do you want get more syncs to sponsor? :-)
<bdrung> ari-tczew: if you can catch up with me :P
<mok0> Any hints on how to deal intelligently with an svn-only upstream?
<mok0> Creating a tarball seems somewhat old-school
<jcfp> mok0: how else? iirc, one cannot assume internet access is available during build.
<mok0> jcfp: not during build, but during source package creation
<jcfp> get-orig-source in debian/rules?
<mok0> jcfp: yeah, I just wondered if something smarter was available
<astraljava> mok0: bzr-svn a branch, then use bzr-builder to create the source package? Would that work?
<mok0> astraljava: hmm, going via bzr eh? Good idea I'll give it a try
<astraljava> mok0: Isn't that where the whole ubuntu dev is going anyway? :)
<mok0> astraljava: indeed :-)
<mok0> astraljava: ... and it could be done via a LP project of course, it just seems a bit overkill for what I am looking at
<mok0> ... which is a one-file python module :-)
<astraljava> mok0: Granted, quite a lot of work for that.
<jcfp> convincing upstream to create releases is the other obvious way out.
<mok0> jcfp: not realistic
<mok0> jcfp: I am looking at just one directory of the whole svn.openstreetmap.org repo
<jcfp> ayay
<bdrung> mok0: use "svn export" and then tar the export
<mok0> bdrung: yes, I know that route, I was just wondering if anything smarter was possible
<bdrung> mok0: not that i am aware of
<fabrice_sp> bdrung, I've update the ack-sync script from your branch, and the script now requires a syncpackage script that is not the one in ubuntu-dev-tools package. where can I find it
<bdrung> fabrice_sp: bzr branch lp:ubuntu-dev-tools - it will be in the next upload
<fabrice_sp> ok. Thnaks!
<bdrung> debfx: regarding bug #581366 - i have no email address for sponsoring your sync request
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 581366 in kbuild "Sync kbuild 1:0.1.98svn2318-6 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/581366
<debfx> bdrung: it's in the last line of the bug description (i.e. changelog entry of 1:0.1.98svn2318-5)
<bdrung> ah, ok
<bdrung> debfx: it doesn't build
<bdrung> due to unmet dependencies
<debfx> bdrung: it requires the new gettext package which you've sponsored a few hours ago
<bdrung> ah, ok
<ari-tczew> I'm working with submittodebian right now, script want got "Please briefly describe your problem", do I need to write something?
<kklimonda> ari-tczew: well, I always add a brief description of a patch and rationale (if it's not obvious bugfix)
<ari-tczew> of course remove changes related to ubuntu maintainer field?
<kklimonda> yes, they are of not use for debian anyway :)
<ari-tczew> could be done submittodebian from bzr branch? not debdiff?
<fabrice_sp> ari-tczew, AFAIK, you run it from a source directory
<DeeJay1> hi, I'm having a problem with dh_repository mainly dh_girepository -pgir1.0-emerillon-0.1 \n dh_girepository: Could not find gir file for Emerillon-0.1.typelib is there a way to debug it somehow?
<ari-tczew> I don't know what I have to with this file in diff generated by submittodebian: diff -Nru junitperf-1.9.1/debian/changelog junitperf-1.9.1/debian/changelog
<fabrice_sp> just delete the lines
<fabrice_sp> (I always delete them)
<ari-tczew> ok
<pabelanger_> Where can I find information about the Debian import for Maverick? How it is done, and what packages are selected?
<ScottK> fabrice_sp: You sponsored the last blends merge.  I was wondering if you could work with the last merger (or do it yourself if they are not around) and get it updated soon.  It's blocking some other merges.
<ScottK> pabelanger_: It's all of them except a small list of blacklisted packages.  AFAIK, new packages didn't get brought in yet, but will soon.
<fabrice_sp> ScottK, sure. I'll check if the last merger is still active/willing to merge it
<ScottK> fabrice_sp: Thanks.
<pabelanger_> ScottK: Thanks, is that an automated process or manual?
<ScottK> There is a script that has to be manually triggered by an archive admin
<ScottK> So once started it's automatic.
<ari-tczew> bdrung: when sponsors will start use your sync script?
<pabelanger_> ScottK: Roger.  Where is the best place to follow that process?
<ScottK> I don't know that there is a good one.
<ScottK> It's safe to assume that any package in Debian that's not in Maverick yet will show up.
<bdrung> ari-tczew: which one do you refer to? ack-sync or syncpackage?
<ari-tczew> bdrung: hmmm syncpackage propably
<bdrung> ari-tczew: dunno. i will write a mail to ubuntu-devel to start a discussion about the script and the sync procedure
<ari-tczew> ok
<ari-tczew> bdrung: is your script ajusted to multiple closing bugs?
<bdrung> ari-tczew: multiple closing bugs?
<ari-tczew> bdrung: now you give a bug number to script, but what about when sync can fix/close e.g. 3 bugs? does your script can do it?
<bdrung> ari-tczew: you can run "syncpackage -b 12345 -b 23456 -b 345678 [...]"
<ari-tczew> bdrung: this is it what I'm looking for. thanks for information
<bdrung> yw
<bdrung> ari-tczew: please check the changes file before uploading
<ari-tczew> bdrung: yyyy before uploading?
<bdrung> ari-tczew: syncpackage generates a changes file that can be uploaded
<ari-tczew> bdrung: but I'm not a sponsor
<bdrung> ari-tczew: you don't need to act as sponsor
<bdrung> ari-tczew: i sent the mail "The syncing process and syncpackage (or: How to speedup the syncing process)" to ubuntu-devel
<ari-tczew> bdrung: nice
<bdrung> share your thoughts
<DeeJay1> could someone take a look at https://code.edge.launchpad.net/~deejay1/emerillon/lucid? I have trouble getting dh_girepository to work :/
<psusi> wtf?  I explicitly told lp to use lucid... I did bzr push lp:~psusi/ubuntu/lucid/parted/dmraid-fix and it comes back and says it created a stacked branch using maverick
#ubuntu-motu 2011-05-09
<kees> !~.
<wejaeger> Hey, anyone up for reviewing http://revu.ubuntuwire.com/p/l2tp-ipsec-vpn
<tumbleweed> wejaeger: this is a bad week to get any response, a fair bunch of us are busy at UDS
<wejaeger> tumbleweed: ok, no problem, i'm going to try it next week
<strycore> hello everyone
<strycore> I have a lintian related question about diff-contains-bzr-control-dir (  http://lintian.debian.org/tags/diff-contains-bzr-control-dir.html ). It says that I to pass the -i argument to dpkg-buildpackage. Now I suppose that I have to add this dpkg-buildpackage somewhere in my debian/rules file, right ?
<tumbleweed> strycore: build with bzr-builddeb (bzr bd), rather than running debuild in your bzr checkout
<strycore> ok, thx tumbleweed
<psusi> DMB is in an hour right?
<Laney> psusi: yes, but I apologise if we can't get to you â I think we ought to process those at UDS in person first
<Laney> (unless you are here ...)
<psusi> nope, I'm not there ;(
<Laney> we'll do our best :-)
<Laney> geser: are you going to attend the DMB meeting?
<geser> Laney: no, as I leave work in around 10 minutes and will be at home at 5pm
<Laney> ok
<aboudreault> Does anyone aware of a PPA that contains debhelper 8 for hardy?
<stlsaint> paultag: HEYO
<stlsaint> opps
<paultag> heh
<aboudreault> Do I need debhelper 8 to use source format 3 ?
<paultag> nope
<paultag> 7 handles it great
<aboudreault> ok
<jtaylor> when a bug is fixed by a simple rebuild do I need to make a debdiff for the sponsor? I guess he can do it himself just as fast as checking and applying the diff would take
<geser> jtaylor: I'd say it depends on your sponsor, but it's usual if you request sponsorship through the sponsorship queue
<geser> jtaylor: what do you need rebuild?
<jtaylor> python-fltk
<jtaylor> natty
<geser> that would be a SRU as natty is released
<jtaylor> yes
<geser> jtaylor: I guess it's about bug 779340? do you have a fix for oneiric?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 779340 in pyfltk (Ubuntu) "From python: import fltk fails" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/779340
<jtaylor> no but I forwared it to the debian maintainer
<jtaylor> so if he reacts it will probably get it automatically
<jtaylor> and for a SRU a rebuild is probably preferable to a patch
<geser> I guess it too
<geser> but it's a requirement for a SRU that it's first fixed in oneiric (so we don't get a regression because it got forgotten to fix it in the next Ubuntu release)
<jtaylor> In this case one can ignore this rule, it can't regress more than not working at all
<jtaylor> it also has no rdeps
<geser> but if we fix it in natty it works there again but stops working again when upgrading to oneiric (assumed that it gets forgotten to get fixed there too)
<jtaylor> hm ok I see the point
<jtaylor> I'll wait for debian maintainer reaction then
<Laney> well actually, the version in -proposed will be copied to oneiric by the sru publishing script
<Laney> as they currently have the same version in n and o
<geser> do the AA still do it that way and not only during the early days of a new release? (I don't do SRUs that often)
<Laney> I think it's done in general
<Laney> should confirm with one of them though
<geser> Laney: in this case it also depends on the solution to fix the bug: a rebuild won't work in oneiric, only when we apply a patch it could get copied to oneiric
<geser> jtaylor: you could also try to contact DktrKranz or porthose (both did the recent uploads of python-fltk) to let them know that a fix might be needed to move on with the SRU
<jtaylor> sry had to leave for a while, thanks for the advice
<aboudreault> debhelper 7 ---> dpkg-source: error: Unsupported format of .dsc file (3.0 (quilt))
<aboudreault> 3.0 quilt is not supported with version 7 ?
<jtaylor> yes it is
<jtaylor> whats in debian/source/format?
<aboudreault> jtaylor, "3.0 (quilt)"
<geser> aboudreault: you need a dpkg that supports v3 source packages, IIRC there exists a backport for hardy somewhere
<aboudreault> ha
 * aboudreault is looking for that backport...
<ajmitch> https://launchpad.net/~launchpad/+archive/obsolete?field.series_filter=hardy may have the dpkg you want, if you are running hardy, though it has a number of other packages for hardy
<aboudreault> ajmitch, sounds good ... thanks!
<stlsaint> nigelb: poke
<nigelb> stlsaint: pong
<stlsaint> nigelb: Hi
<nigelb> hello
<stlsaint> nigelb: lol, just saying whats up, havent spoke to ya in some months
<nigelb> stlsaint: yeah, I'm at UDS, loads of fun today :)
<stlsaint> nigelb: im jealous
<nigelb> stlsaint: heh
<ajmitch> nigelb: anything interesting at uds today?
<nigelb> ajmitch: well, I was a very good session about having a portal where you can see everything that's on the software center
 * ajmitch was hoping to see some of the notes on etherpad, but something seems to have died there :)
<Laney> the trolls got us
<ajmitch> uh oh
<ajmitch> not requiring a lp or other openid login for etherpad?
<nigelb> we're landing a fix that'll make the etherpad url sort of changeable
<nigelb> and we can link to a particular rev of etherpad
<ajmitch> so ther etherpad server was taken down overnight?
<lifeless> nigelb: synaptic-for-the-web?
<nigelb> will be back up soon :)
<nigelb> lifeless: its more like a catalogue
<nigelb> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu-webcatalog/+spec/desktop-o-software-center-web
<ajmitch> more like steam's website?
<nigelb> does it let you click there and install to your computer?
<nigelb> (I think these are going to be apturls)
<ajmitch> I believe so, I haven't installed anything except through the steam app (on wine) for awhile
<nigelb> ah
<ajmitch> I think it works in the same way, by a steam:// url
<nigelb> ajmitch: so, then that's how it'll look
<nigelb> and probably designed to be visually similar to software center per se
<ajmitch> so once that part is done, you just need to decide whether the whole archive is made available & then some?
 * ajmitch thanks whoever has put up the keynote talk on youtube
<nigelb> ajmitch: yeah
<nigelb> I wish etherpad was up to show you the notes
 * ajmitch might read them this evening, when the tuesday sessions are starting 
<nigelb> :)
#ubuntu-motu 2011-05-10
<qnix> using source format 1.0, can I specify to quilt which -p option value to use?
<qnix> like patch -pN
<qnix> I'm using quilt.make
<Laney> I think you can put it after the patch name in series
<Laney> possibly only p0 and p1 are supported
<hakermania> alo, does anybody know where can I find sample code in order to make an ubuntu indicator instead of tray?
<highvoltage> I love how many faces to names I could put to this UDS :)
<ssweeny> having the nicks on the name tags is genius
<MAbeeTT> hi
<MAbeeTT> I'm following this bug https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/777582
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 777582 in linux (Ubuntu) "System crash with serial port use" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<MAbeeTT> I've downloaded cu's source (apt-get source cu)
<MAbeeTT> for  getting the code, that makes the behaivor.
<MAbeeTT> i compiled uucp without making the deb. package but the message and interruption doesn't apears with the local binary.
<MAbeeTT> I want make the .deb package with the same commands that it was generated.
<MAbeeTT> what should I read?
<directhex> dpkg-buildpackage
<MAbeeTT> ok,
<MAbeeTT> directhex: thanks
#ubuntu-motu 2011-05-11
<JackyAlcine> U.D.S :)
<Laney> ScottK: we can backport from stableâstable, right?
<ScottK> Laney: We can backport from any Ubuntu release.
<Laney> great
<Laney> I've been looking at the lucid-backports confirmed reported. Some shoujld be good to go.
<psusi> how do you invert a test in bash?  according to the info page, if [[!true]] should work, but doesn't...
<siretart> psusi: if ! true; then echo "yes"; else echo no; fi
 * psusi facepalms... first thing I tried, but I didn't put a space between the ! and the true
<broder> psusi: and you probably don't want to use [[ ]], because it's weird and not as portable
#ubuntu-motu 2011-05-12
<kaushal> hi
<kaushal> I have upgraded java6 from u22 to u24, I get this issue http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/606323/ I am on Ubuntu 8.04 Linux. Any Clue ?
<kaushal> Further details -> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/606327/
<aboudreault> hiiiii
<aboudreault> what's that: http://packages.ubuntu.com/natty/i386/libpng12-dev/filelist
<aboudreault> /usr/lib/i386-linux-gnu/libpng.so
<aboudreault> This will break a lot of configure script, isn't?
<Ampelbein> aboudreault: not if they use pkg-config.
<aboudreault> most of them use autoconf and check the /usr/lib directory
<Ampelbein> aboudreault: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.searchtext=&orderby=-importance&search=Search&field.status%3Alist=NEW&field.status%3Alist=INCOMPLETE_WITH_RESPONSE&field.status%3Alist=INCOMPLETE_WITHOUT_RESPONSE&field.status%3Alist=CONFIRMED&field.status%3Alist=TRIAGED&field.status%3Alist=INPROGRESS&field.status%3Alist=FIXCOMMITTED&assignee_option=any&field.assignee=&field.bug_reporter=&field.bug_supervisor=&field.bug_commenter=
<Ampelbein> &field.subscriber=&field.component-empty-marker=1&field.tag=multiarch&field.tags_combinator=ALL&field.status_upstream-empty-marker=1&field.has_cve.used=&field.omit_dupes.used=&field.omit_dupes=on&field.affects_me.used=&field.has_no_package.used=&field.has_patch.used=&field.has_branches.used=&field.has_branches=on&field.has_no_branches.used=&field.has_no_branches=on&field.has_blueprints.used=&field.has_blueprints=on&field.has_no_blueprints
<Ampelbein> .used=&field.has_no_blueprints=on  lists 30 known issues that are related to multiarch, please file a bug on the package in question and tag it as "multiarch"
<Ampelbein> eek
<Ampelbein> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bugs?field.tag=multiarch is the link I wanted to send
<Ampelbein> aboudreault: anyway, most packages are fine. Please file a bug on the package that isn't.
<aboudreault> the package is mine so...
<aboudreault> but will have to tell dev to update their configure script.
#ubuntu-motu 2011-05-13
<c_korn> what is the correct way to install a python lib? I have this file /usr/lib/pyshared/python2.7/libjngl.so but python claims ImportError: No module named jngl
<tumbleweed> that's bceause it's called libjngl
<c_korn> ah, should just be jngl.so then I assume
<tumbleweed> yup
<tumbleweed> well, whatever upstream thinks it should be called
<c_korn> thank you, tumbleweed !
<tumbleweed> np
<zooko> Dear people of #ubuntu-motu: I am sad to find out that Tahoe-LAFS is broken in Natty. I opened a bug report: https://bugs.launchpad.net/foolscap/+bug/782414 If there's anything else I can do to help fix this as soon as possible, let me know!
<ubottu> Ubuntu bug 782414 in foolscap (Ubuntu) "tahoe-lafs can't start because foolscap packaging metadata doesn't declare the fact that it supports secure_connections" [Undecided,New]
#ubuntu-motu 2011-05-14
<jtaylor> ^^^^^^^^^ in progress
<jtaylor> -.- tahoe is a mess, fixing that bug uncovers 2 more regressions
<ari-tczew> lucas__: does not need http://people.ubuntuwire.org/~lucas/merges.html update for oneiric?
<stlsaint> hey folks im trying to setup using multiple pbuilders but i have hit a wall
<stlsaint> anyone?
<jtaylor> whats the problem?
<stlsaint> im having a issue setting up the use of multiple pbuilder
<arand> You have yet to describe the problem..
<stlsaint> i have followed the wiki page on pbuilder but when i run command to build environment the distribution is still set to debian my host
<stlsaint> from here https://wiki.ubuntu.com/PbuilderHowto#Multiple pbuilders
<stlsaint> i may be possibly running command wrong
<stlsaint> sudo pbuilder create distribution=lucid or sudo pbuilder create DIST=lucid do not work
<jtaylor> have you set DIST or have a changelog in the right location
<jtaylor> sudo DIST=lucid pbuilder create
<stlsaint> jtaylor: i tried that also and it still says wrong distribution
<jbicha> you said your host is Debian? maybe that's part of the problem
<stlsaint> http://paste.debian.net/116943/
<stlsaint> jbicha: i thought the same but the debian wiki said the same as the pbuilder wiki on how to setup building ubuntu packages on debian and still the same result
<jtaylor> does sudo preserve HOME in squeeze?
<jtaylor> try setting home to your home directory too
<stlsaint> jtaylor: sorry not following ya on that one
<arand> stlsaint: Are you not meant to set the vars before running the pbuilder command, as described on the wiki?
<jtaylor> sudo may not preserve the environment of your local user depending in the setting
<jtaylor> => it will look into /root/ for the rc and not into your directory
<jtaylor> sudo HOME=$HOME DIST=lucid pbuilder create
<stlsaint> jtaylor: hrm, so i need to move or edit the pbuilderrc?
<stlsaint> oh
<stlsaint> arand: both ways work if i wanted to create a regular debian environment
<jtaylor> sudo -H should also work
<stlsaint> jtaylor: will that still place the tarball in the /var/cache/pbuilder dir?
<jtaylor> yes
<stlsaint> jtaylor: aye that worked, thanks, so does that mean i need to move my pbuilderrc?
<jtaylor> either that, or use sudo -H or set sudo to preserve HOME
<stlsaint> jtaylor: how would i set sudo to preserve HOME?
<stlsaint> also would there be any side affects to moving the rrc? (why would the installation not automaticaly put the pbuilderrc in the right location of where it is looking??)
<jtaylor> Use Defaults env_check = HOME in /etc/sudoers I think
<jtaylor> s/Use //
<stlsaint> hrm, the debian wiki said change that to this: Defaults        env_reset,env_keep="DIST ARCH"
<jtaylor> env_chack should be safer
<stlsaint> jtaylor: i edited and saved the build errored with an abort and when i try to re-edit sudoers i get: Error opening terminal: unknown.
<jtaylor> still have env_reset in the line?
<jtaylor> read man sudoers and man sudo for details
<stlsaint> jtaylor: yea im locked out of my sudoers file
<stlsaint> ha, some more strange stuff happening
<stlsaint> http://paste.ubuntu.com/607416/
<stlsaint> looking bad for me
<jtaylor> probably TERM or SHELL not set
<stlsaint> only thing i changed was the env_check=HOME line and then all this happened
<jtaylor> did you replace the old one or just add it?
<stlsaint> really strange with the root-clear thing
<stlsaint> jtaylor: replaced the entry i added
<stlsaint> it should still have the default stuff that was there minus the env_dist stuff from the debian wiki as i replaced that one part with the env_check part
<stlsaint> is there a way to possibly export the output to a tty?
<stlsaint> back :D
<stlsaint> jtaylor: fixed the sudoers issue
<stlsaint> but when i run the original command you gave of: sudo HOME=$HOME DIST=lucid pbuilder create it errors out and aborts
<stlsaint> E: Release signed by unknown key (key id 40976EAF437D05B5)
<stlsaint> E: debootstrap failed
<stlsaint> W: Aborting with an error
<jtaylor> stlsaint: are you using the ubuntu keyring?
<jtaylor> --debootstrapopts --keyring=..../ubuntu-archive-keyring.gpg
<stlsaint> that was configured in the pbuilderrc
<stlsaint> i can show you mine if you want
<ari-tczew> stlsaint: try it: sudo pbuilder create --distribution lucid --debootstrapopts "--keyring=/usr/share/keyrings/ubuntu-archive-keyring.gpg"
<ari-tczew> or try sudo pbuilder-dist create lucid
<stlsaint> ari-tczew: http://paste.debian.net/116951/
<jtaylor> the mirror is wrong
<stlsaint> i had to rebuild my base.tgz for some reason
<jtaylor> http://ftp.us.debian.org/debian/dists/lucid
<jtaylor> debian has no lucid
<ari-tczew> http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/lucid-updates/Release
<stlsaint> jtaylor: i know that much but i thought the pbuilderrc would sort that
<ari-tczew> stlsaint: try it sudo pbuilder-dist create lucid --mirror ftp://http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ --debootstrapopts "--keyring=/usr/share/keyrings/debian-archive-keyring.gpg"
<ari-tczew> errr
<ari-tczew> sudo pbuilder-dist create lucid --mirror http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ --debootstrapopts "--keyring=/usr/share/keyrings/debian-archive-keyring.gpg"
<stlsaint> my pbuilderrc: http://pastebin.com/rUNGUat9
<stlsaint> ari-tczew: ok i will try
<stlsaint> ari-tczew: minor error in that one, you put pbuilder-dist create lucid where it should be lucid instead of create
<stlsaint> but i got ya
<stlsaint> ari-tczew: http://paste.debian.net/116952/
<ari-tczew> stlsaint: let's try to use only with mirror
<ari-tczew> sudo pbuilder-dist lucid create --mirror http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ -
<ari-tczew> without "-" at the end - err of copying
<stlsaint> kk
<jtaylor> your still using the wrong keyring
<jtaylor> ubuntu archive is not signed with the debian key
<stlsaint> ari-tczew: same error
<stlsaint> so the key signing is causing the abort
<stlsaint> ?
<ari-tczew> jtaylor: ah right, again wrong copying
<ari-tczew> sudo pbuilder-dist create lucid --mirror ftp://http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ --debootstrapopts "--keyring=/usr/share/keyrings/ubuntu-archive-keyring.gpg"
<ari-tczew> stlsaint: ^^
<stlsaint> ari-tczew: kk, one sec
<stlsaint> ari-tczew: E: Failed getting release file ftp://http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/dists/lucid/Release
<ari-tczew> wrrrrrrr
<ari-tczew> sudo pbuilder-dist create lucid --mirror http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/ --debootstrapopts "--keyring=/usr/share/keyrings/ubuntu-archive-keyring.gpg"
<ari-tczew> typo in url
<jtaylor> ^^
<stlsaint> ari-tczew: also you keep putting -dist create when its -dist lucid create ;)
<stlsaint> ari-tczew: same as original error: E: Release signed by unknown key (key id 40976EAF437D05B5)
<stlsaint> E: debootstrap failed
<stlsaint> W: Aborting with an error
<ari-tczew> stlsaint: I prefer to use pbuilder-dist
<ari-tczew> stlsaint: do you have installed ubuntu-keyring?
<stlsaint> hrm, lemme check
<stlsaint> honestly i probably dont
<ari-tczew> apt-cache policy ubuntu-keyring
<stlsaint> ari-tczew: no i do not
<ari-tczew> stlsaint: install it and rerun command which I have you
<ari-tczew> gave*
<stlsaint> ari-tczew: whats the name for the keyring?
<stlsaint> i tried ubuntu-keyring which did not work and a quick google wasnt helping
<jtaylor> its not in debian
<jtaylor> doanload it from launchpad
<ari-tczew> http://packages.ubuntu.com/search?suite=default&section=all&arch=any&searchon=names&keywords=ubuntu-keyring
<stlsaint> will do
<jfi> Hello, is there somebody who can review the (very trivial) fix of #778415, and let me know if there is something wrong (both debdiff and LP tags)?
<stlsaint> ari-tczew: seems to be running good now, still at retreiving packages point
<jtaylor> useful tips: use an cacher to save download time (e.g. apt-cacher-ng) and eatmydata to reduce installation time
<stlsaint> jtaylor: hrm, i head of that before but never got into it, i will surely take a look now, thanks
<ari-tczew> stlsaint: so, does it work now?
<stlsaint> ari-tczew: it is still getting packages but it seems to be working
<ari-tczew> nice
<stlsaint> yes thank you very much
<stlsaint> im now working to get apt-cacher setup to prevent this long wait again
<ari-tczew> np
<c2tarun> is there any difference between network-manager-applet and network-manager-gnome?
<stlsaint> ari-tczew: do you do multiple pbuilders?
<ari-tczew> stlsaint: yes I do
<stlsaint> ari-tczew: im asking because my different builds are now going into /root/pbuilder and im not sure why, (im sure its something with pbuilderrc again but i guess my bash-foo isnt up to par)
<ari-tczew> stlsaint: do you use Debian?
<stlsaint> ari-tczew: yes
<ari-tczew> stlsaint: I use pbuilder-dist and it has got .tgz files in ~/pbuilder/
<jtaylor> stlsaint: that can all be customized, read the manpage
<stlsaint> ari-tczew: im used to them going in /var/cache/pbuilder which is why i wonder why they go now to /root/pbuilder
<stlsaint> jtaylor: man pbuilder will show that?
<jtaylor> the options to do so
<stlsaint> kk, thanks
<stlsaint> jtaylor: also i wont be able to use apt-cacher as i am on a WAN which i do not control the ipaddress
<jtaylor> you can have a cacher on the local machine listinging on localhost
<stlsaint> hrm, didnt see that in docs
<stlsaint> good to know
<jtaylor> just set the mirror to http://localhost:port/
<stlsaint> oh ok
<stlsaint> thanks
<stlsaint> save me alot of resource
<jtaylor> unfortunatly apt-cacher-ng does not support debdelta :(
<stlsaint> bbiab
#ubuntu-motu 2011-05-15
<Semitones> hey yall, is grub 1.99 available in maverick as a backport?
<philsf> o tmepo/j #ubuntu+1
#ubuntu-motu 2012-05-07
<EvilResistance> does anyone here know which package the command ubuntu-bug is a part of?
<EvilResistance> apt-file suggests apport, but i want to be sure
<EvilResistance> nevermind, found it
<Resistance> i'll propose it to apport, but that'd be a feature request bug, so it wouldnt necessarily need a brainstorm topic (although this needed it: http://brainstorm.ubuntu.com/idea/29656/ )
<Resistance> whoops sorry
<Resistance> wrong channel
 * Resistance blames the laptop touchpad
<highvoltage> tumbleweed: ah, I was confused last night, my estimation was actuall ~thursday for #1m not today
<Noxygen> hello
<bobweaver> Is there live streaming going on ?
<jtaylor> if there is its impossible to find
<tumbleweed> http://icecast.ubuntu.com:8000/status.xsl
<bobweaver> Hi jtaylor  yeah I  have been looking for a bit
<broder> there are links in #ubuntu-uds
<bobweaver> thansk tumbleweed  !
<bobweaver> none work ^^
<broder> hmm, i guess not? that's unfortunate
<jtaylor> there where you look first there are no links, e.g. the room schedule or room irc channels
<EvilResistance> last i checked, they're in lunch break
<EvilResistance> 1PM - 2PM Eastern US
<jtaylor> it should be 10:33 there
<tumbleweed> correct, 10:33
<EvilResistance> you sure?
<tumbleweed> I'm at UDS
 * EvilResistance is looking at the schedule as listed on the wiki, unless that is not up to date
<bobweaver> the metting just started there live time
<EvilResistance> tumbleweed:  then someone needs to give me the updated schedule links
<bobweaver> ballroom f
<tumbleweed> EvilResistance: http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-q/2012-05-07/
<bobweaver> but there is no live feed ?
<bobweaver> I woke up early for this :)
<tumbleweed> bobweaver: yes, icecast.ubuntu.com
<bobweaver> Not working ^^
<tumbleweed> bobweaver: they seem to be working. I'm ubsy recording from them: http://mirrors.tumbleweed.org.za/uds-q/
<tumbleweed> or is it just silent?
<EvilResistance> tumbleweed:  then the pages I accessed from the UDS main page are out of date, or mis-linked
<tumbleweed> EvilResistance: which page?
<EvilResistance> tumbleweed:  might've been my end, i'll double-check later
 * EvilResistance has to attend to a phone call
<bobweaver> I have trid bot mp3 and xspf
<bobweaver> http://imagebin.org/211431
<bobweaver> tried *
<tumbleweed> bobweaver: they are ogg
<bobweaver> I am also signed in here http://summit.ubuntu.com/uds-q/meeting/20676/other-q-motu-bof/
<tumbleweed> that hasn't started yet
<ajmitch> bobweaver: the MOTU session is in 25 min, there's noone in grand ballroom f right now
<micahg> hmm, I was wondering, that session is scheduled twice, was that on purpose?
<tumbleweed> I saw that too. No idea
 * micahg is looking forward to meeting ajmitch
<ajmitch> micahg: unlikely, but the schedule seems to change all the time
<EpikVision> How do you do that star thing?
 * ajmitch is in grand ballroom c right now
<micahg> EpikVision: /me
<tumbleweed> ajmitch: oh, I also want to mee tyou. in C too
 * EpikVision finds this cool.
 * EvilResistance pokes EpikVision with a /me command
<EpikVision> AH
<EpikVision> thanks
 * micahg is in the security roundtable
 * EpikVision is excited to meet MOTU people in 25 min.
<bobweaver> ok I think I have figured out this page :)  have to use the PATH  as the path (there should just be link)
<bobweaver> ballroom f = http://icecast.ubuntu.com:8000/grand-ballroom-f.ogg
<bobweaver> like that ^^
<tumbleweed> correct
<tumbleweed> there are links to these in the topic for each room's IRC channel
<bobweaver> thanks tumbleweed  this is my 1st summit either there or not so I will take all the help I can get thanks again :)
<tumbleweed> bobweaver: np :)
<tumbleweed> bobweaver: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UDS-L/RemoteParticipation btw
<tumbleweed> err that's from an old UDS
<tumbleweed> ah, they've stopped doing that page since UDS-N
<EvilResistance> tumbleweed:  that was showing up actually :P
<EvilResistance> that was a page that someone in the LoCo i'm in distributed, that'd explain why the schedule shoed as wrong
<EvilResistance> showed*
 * EvilResistance sends an updated email out to his LoCo's mailing list
<EvilResistance> tumbleweed:  i assume that remote IRC participation (where applicable) is #ubuntu-uds-[room] ?
<tumbleweed> yes
<tumbleweed> and say hi at the start of the session, so thta people know you are there
<EvilResistance> tumbleweed:  will do, but i'll be lurking for the next session(s) for a while, got to go to a meeting :/
<EvilResistance> tumbleweed:  also, you might poke the IRCC, have someone update the UDS room topics with current session(s), they're not updating (someone already poked the IRCC, but still)
<iulian> What room is the MOTU bof in?
<iulian> Oh, nevermind.
<jtaylor> Grand Ballroom F
<Laney> the unsigned rooms
 * Laney spins around in circles
<iulian> Haha.
<bobweaver>  \0/
<bobweaver> SSO maybe ?
<tumbleweed> bobweaver: you need to be added to ~ubuntu-etherpad. Ask in #ubuntu-uds
<EvilResistance> tumbleweed:  members automatically have access to that, right?
<broder> EvilResistance: yes
<bobweaver> Thanks tumbleweed  !
<bobweaver> will do now
<bobweaver> tumbleweed,  what does that mean  ?
<AlanBell> EvilResistance: they are updating
<AlanBell> or grand-ballroom-h has updated
<bobweaver> motu beginners team  !
<micahg> MOTU bof in #ubuntu-uds-grand-ballroom-f
<bobweaver> Sorry if any of my questions in the meeting where off topic I am just dieing too learn :)
<bobweaver> Is there any documention on how too find what DEPENDS you need to put in your control file ? example here is my control  file http://paste.ubuntu.com/974245/   this is how I got too that point. I installed ubuntu server ran dpkg-query -l then saved and filtered the list after that I installed my package and ran dpkg-query -l again and filtered 0out the results and then compaired the two. I did not know what ${shlibs:Depends}, ${misc:Dep
<bobweaver> ends}, meant at the time. but now I do kinda. is there a beeter way to do what I am trying to do and if so how too go about it. I am sure that I have too many things under Depends:  thanks for your time
<tumbleweed> bobweaver: we try to generate them automatically where possible (so the shlibs:Depends takes care fo most libraries)
<tumbleweed> but for packages like that, you as the maintainer are expected to list the things it needs
<tumbleweed> I'm suprised to see libs listed in there...
<bobweaver> can I run command too see what shlibs picks up by default ?
<bobweaver> so I do not put in control file ?
<tumbleweed> bobweaver: shlibs picks up shared libaries
<tumbleweed> you can see what it picked up, by looking at debian/$package.substitutions
<bobweaver> but is there a command too see what ones it uses. like lets take mysql-server
<jtaylor> bobweaver: please use wrap-and-sort on so long depends lines
<bobweaver> redoing now
<bobweaver> re-doing *
<jtaylor> there are some tools
<jtaylor> but they never catch everything
<jtaylor> especially in such a package
<jtaylor> can't remember any names, autoapt or so, but its more for getting the depends from a configure script not at runtime
<bobweaver>  ldd  lists all ?
<bobweaver> like
<jtaylor> ldd is covered by shlib:Depends
<bobweaver> I see do if I look at that then I can see what not too put in control file ?
<jtaylor> anything that starts with lib and is not perl you normally don't have to list
<bobweaver> sweet thanks
<jtaylor> just check the substvars after a build
<bobweaver> so just to clarify I am going too use toilet as a example if I run whereis toilet I find that it is under /usr/bin/toilet  Now if I run. ldd /usr/bin/toilet      I get all the shDepends  now I do not need to include anything that is on that list too the control file ?
<jtaylor> yes
<bobweaver> thanks
<jtaylor> the only elf shared libraries you have to add by hand are plugins
<jtaylor> which are loaded at runtime
<bobweaver> what does ${misc:Depends}  do ?
<jtaylor> misc stuff :)
<bobweaver> I have asked this before but I am thick sometimes
<jtaylor> e.g. debhelper may need to add stuff
<bobweaver> is there a way too see what misc stuff is in a package like ldd  ?
<jtaylor> common example is when you use --link-doc, it adds a dependency on the main package (and then lintian complains...)
<jtaylor> read the substvars file
<jtaylor> 21:31 <tumbleweed> you can see what it picked up, by looking at debian/$package.substitutions
<bobweaver> I see
<bobweaver> sorry like I said I am thick but when I get it I get it :)
<bobweaver> so it is sor my  files that I push in my make file too $(DETDIR)
<bobweaver> $(DESTDIR)*
<bobweaver> arghh
<bobweaver> $(DISTDIR)*
<jtaylor> its DESTDIR
<bobweaver> lol I thinks that we have talked about this before :)
<bobweaver> but I am correct about above ?
<jtaylor> I don't understand the question
<bobweaver> s|sor|for
<bobweaver> so ${misc:Depends}  is for my  files that I push in my make file too $(DESTDIR)  is there anything else it does ?
<jtaylor> no its for misc dependencies from e.g. debhelper scripts
<bobweaver> OHH
<jtaylor> its empty in most cases
<bobweaver> jtaylor,  I took your advice for yesterday and made a whole new framework for upsource  I think that it is alot better it can be found here http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~josephjamesmills/zpanelcp/zpanelcp/files    as you can see my Makefile is now only 3 commands and I fully understand how the make file works now. This is all because of you just thought that you would like too hear that
<jtaylor> source files in /etc? oO
<jtaylor> also start stop are far to generic for /usr/bin
<jtaylor> e.g. it conflicts with upstart
<jtaylor> so every ubuntu system
<jtaylor> a no upstart is in /sbin/
<jtaylor> still bad
<bobweaver> so make into zpanelx-start
<jtaylor> yes
<bobweaver> I want to link it too services
<bobweaver> So user can do sudo services zpanelx-start /stop
<jtaylor> you need init scripts or upstart or systemd job files for that
<bobweaver> Thanks I will look into that
<EvilResistance> anyone know whether there's a UDS session on the LiveCD and installation of Ubuntu?  not sure if this is where i'd correctly ask, but...
 * EvilResistance can't find one, and already searched the entire schedule, and wants to make sure he didnt miss something
<tumbleweed> I poked jono to schedule https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/community-p-debian
<tumbleweed> err
<tumbleweed> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/community-q-debian
<Laney> YOU BEAUTY
<tumbleweed> lol
<sladen> EvilResistance: probably under Foundations if it's happening
<sladen> EvilResistance: was there something specific you had in mind?
<sladen> btw, remote people.  http://video.ubuntu.com/live/  is working now, live
<EvilResistance> sladen:  yeah... but i posted the idea(s) to brainstorm instead
<EvilResistance> sladen:  since i then realized the topic i wanted to bring up was a feature-request/change in ubiquity :P
<EvilResistance> my second thought was its better to use brainstorm for that :P
#ubuntu-motu 2012-05-08
<geser> Rhonda: forwarding from #ubuntu-devel: < twb > "http://packages.ubuntu.com/precise/msmtp is returning a 500 for me"
<geser> in case you want to look at the cause
<geser> and is the email address in that error message still correct?
<Rhonda> Hmm, same here.
<Rhonda> Erm, no.
<Rhonda> No clue where that comes from.
<Rhonda> Changed it in conf/apache.conf to rhonda@ubuntu.com  (should look better ;))
<Rhonda> \o/  apache logs are mode 644 :)
<eagles0513875_> hey Rhonda is there a channel for the ubuntu documents?
<Rhonda> "the ubuntu documents"?
<eagles0513875_> there is an issue with the dovecot documentation on the 12.04 portion of the wiki
<Rhonda> Why do you hilight me specificly for that? :)
<bobweaver> eagles0513875,  there is #ubuntu-wiki and #ubuntu-docs
<eagles0513875_> Rhonda: seeing your the onlyone active in the room at the moment
<eagles0513875_> thanks bobweaver  :)
<Rhonda> If I would know an answer I would state so, even without a specific hilight.
<eagles0513875_> ok
<Rhonda> geser: pfewh, looks strange.
<Rhonda> [error] Can't call method "get_document" on an undefined value at /srv/packages.ubuntu.com/lib/Packages/Search.pm line 264.\n
<Rhonda> *scratcheshead*
<Rhonda> Unfortunately my laptop isn't able to charge its akku anymore, so I am sort-of offline (only able to look into stuff from at work, where I should â¦ erm, work :))
<aboudreault> Hi
<aboudreault> I would need this package: http://packages.ubuntu.com/precise/debootstrap
<aboudreault> but 500 :(
<Zhenech> aboudreault, why not fetch it directly from a mirror?
<Zhenech> http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/main/d/debootstrap/
<aboudreault> Zhenech, thanks!
<Zhenech> debootstrap_1.0.40~precise1_all.deb is what you are looking for
<Zhenech> may I ask why you didnt fetch it via apt directly?
<aboudreault> Zhenech, well. I just install that package manually in  oneiric machine... to be able to do a pbuilder precise amd64 create
<aboudreault> doesn't seem to have worked though ;) It worked before using cowbuilder
<geser> debootstrap from oneiric should know about precise (according to changelog)
<aboudreault> not sure if I need to update pbuilder
<aboudreault> Unknown distribution: precise
<tsimpson> precise
<tsimpson> oops, I mean: it does know precise (I have it on oneiric)
<aboudreault> not why it doesn't work then..
<geser> aboudreault: can you pastebin the whole error you get?
<Zhenech> paste the whole error to pastebin
<Zhenech> geser, !
<Zhenech> :)
<aboudreault> http://pastebin.com/gGAgqK8B
<tsimpson> what version of debootstrap do you currently have installed?
<aboudreault> it's the version of precise now
<aboudreault> ahh I think I remember
<Zhenech> aboudreault, what the contents of your /usr/share/debootstrap/scripts/?
<Zhenech> is there a "precise" file?
<aboudreault> http://pastebin.com/RT9TwgZv
<aboudreault> no, umm
<aboudreault> I think the file I installed wasn't the proper one
<aboudreault> dated of 05-11
<Zhenech> neither you have oneiric etc
<tsimpson> you don't even have intrepid
<aboudreault> Zhenech, I think the package you pointed me was an old one
<aboudreault> let me reinstall the oneiric one
<tsimpson> !info debootstrap
<ubottu> debootstrap (source: debootstrap): Bootstrap a basic Debian system. In component main, is extra. Version 1.0.39 (precise), package size 34 kB, installed size 224 kB
<aboudreault> haa,, looks better
<aboudreault> it works. creation in process.
<tsimpson> though the 1.0.40~precise1 deb also has the correct files
 * Laney misses ScottK in the backports BOF
<micahg> +1
<CareBear\> hello! I'd like to get a backport going. I'm upstream for libusb and the new release we have since a while fixes lots of problems that would be good to get out to as many users as possible.
<micahg> CareBear\: hmm, libraries are a bit harder since they usually have reverse dependencies, are you on precise?
<CareBear\> I'm actually not a ubuntu user at all (so far)
<micahg> ah, ok
<CareBear\> reading further, I see that perhaps I should exploit SRU instead - since the old version actually has some bad bugs too
<micahg> this is for 1.0?
<CareBear\> yes
<micahg> well, if you want to fix specific bugs, SRU is the way to go, if you need new feature, backports would be appropriate, so, for backports, one needs to get someone to install/run all the reverse dependencies with the new package installed that built successfully on the older release
<CareBear\> would the SRU ever jump straight to the new upstream release, or only ever add bugfix patches on top of the original version in the release?
<CareBear\> testing all packages that depend on the library may not be really feasible.. I'm not sure.. it might depend on how thorough that testing must be
<micahg> CareBear\: usually just add bugfix patches unless there's a compelling reason to jump to the new upstream version (i.e. current version is totally broke and not easily fixable)
<micahg> CareBear\: just that the package installs and runs (for backports)
<micahg> CareBear\: are you thinking to backport libusb 1.0?
<CareBear\> 1.0.9 right
<CareBear\> it is API and ABI backwards compatible with what has been released so far, but I understand that my word for this is not so much to go on :)
<micahg> is this for precise or lucid?
<CareBear\> as many as possible!
<CareBear\> I don't know what the ubuntu version stats are like in terms of users, but my wish is for as many as possible to have the newest version
<micahg> CareBear\: backporting to lucid should be fairly straightforward, but nothing would use it by default since that version wasn't available
<CareBear\> I guess lucid is more important than natty or oneiric
<CareBear\> but a backported package would show up in the package manager and users could grab it manually?
<micahg> for precise, as it already has rc3, you might consider SRUing important bugs
<micahg> CareBear\: yes, it shows up as a drop down in software center
<CareBear\> rc3 is actually fine for precise
<CareBear\> that doesn't have to be updated, the bugs are fixed and it has the most important features of 1.0.9
<micahg> a backport to lucid would be fine (assuming it builds and we would just need someone to do an install/run test of it), anyone wishing to use it though would need to rebuild packages against it
<CareBear\> really? new version remains ABI compatible
<broder> Laney, tumbleweed, micahg: btw, the rebackporter did get imported into harvest: http://harvest.ubuntu.com/opportunities/?opp.list=rebackports&pkg=
<micahg> broder: cool
<CareBear\> micahg : I could also try to get some SRU in that will make a few revdeps pull the backport, yes?
<CareBear\> micahg : the backported version e.g. fixes pretty bad usability problems for smart card users
<micahg> CareBear\: I suppose we could backport some packages to build against it (they'd need the same testing as a normal backport and need to fit the backport requirements)
<CareBear\> (revdep is the ccid package)
<micahg> yeah, that has only one reverse dependency in lucid, so that should be easy (assuming someone can test it and it builds)
<CareBear\> given cluestick I could test in VMs, or try to motivate others
<micahg> VM testing would be fine
<CareBear\> oops. http://packages.ubuntu.com/lucid/libccid throws 500 at me
<micahg> yeah, there's a problem with the site ARM
<micahg> *ATM
<micahg> https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ccid
<broder> hmm, you can't open merge proposals against +junk repos, right?
<micahg> right (well, last I checked)
<CareBear\> how do you feel about "faking" a specific version dependency to ensure that a bugfree library gets installed, even if a reverse dependency will somehow work (but buggy) also with an older version?
<CareBear\> in a way it's not wrong, because the newer version is the first that has issues fixed..
<CareBear\> in another way it's not like the API is any different
<micahg> umm, not quite sure what you mean by that
<CareBear\> I'll gather some data and clarify
<CareBear\> how do I see deps for ccid ?
<CareBear\> found it
<CareBear\> hm no that didn't work out. rts
<CareBear\> lucid has ccid-1.3.11-1 but that isn't using libusb-1.0 at all, so no SRU there
<bobweaver> Hello there I am making a package for ubuntu server and the upsource code was real bad re-righting apache ect I have now re-wrote the files and what too see if there is a better way to write this into the package. the bug is located here https://bugs.launchpad.net/zpanelcp/+bug/996282   Code is located here http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~josephjamesmills/zpanelcp/zpanelcp/files/head:/etc/zpanel/configs/apache/      I will be trying too pu
<bobweaver> sh to /var/www/ and make avilble during build but I do not know the steps too link sites-enabled How too link ? any tutorial would be great thanks for your time
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 996282 in Zpanel cp X "Turning on zpanel should not re-write /etc/apache2/apache2.conf" [High,Triaged]
<bobweaver> my idea is too write into postinst and have it install the "site/controlpanel"  to /var/www
<bobweaver> and not overwrite the apache.conf
<Amoz> jdstrand, hey, just a heads up. Security fix. I got a PPA with the pidgin 2.10.4 built. See this bug https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pidgin/+bug/996691
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 996691 in pidgin (Ubuntu) "Update pidgin to 2.10.4" [Undecided,New]
<Amoz> dholbach told me you were one of the guys I should talk to :)
<jtaylor> how does one tag -updates regressions?
<psusi> jtaylor: regression-release
<jtaylor> thx
<dupondje> nobody bored around with upload permissions in main ? :P
#ubuntu-motu 2012-05-09
<EpikVision> for the bazaar 5-minutes tutorial, is it ok to create a team and project for the sample, despite it being an example?
<tumbleweed> bdrung: btw, I did a bunch of random u-d-t bugfixing on the plane on the way here
<tumbleweed> don't know if you want to look over any of it or I should just push it to trunk... lp:~stefanor/ubuntu-dev-tools/uds-flight
 * ScottK waves to Laney.
<bobweaver> Hello there I am trying to make a debconf password box and am running into some troubles. I have made the config and templates file located here http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~josephjamesmills/zpanelcp/zpanelcp/files/head:/debian/          but How do I test them locally ? so I know that they work just run the configs script ? if so what do I put for the path and what not. Thanks again for your time.
<jdstrand> Amoz: ack, I've assigned ubuntu-security-sponsors as per https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SecurityTeam/UpdateProcedures which will allow a member of the security to pick this up. I should note that we will need a debdiff rather than a new upstream version for the security update
<jdstrand> Amoz: if you are able and interested, feel free to follow the SecurityTeam/UpdateProcedures wiki page to submit a debdiff
<jdstrand> Amoz: otherwise, a member of the security team will provide an update at some point
<jdstrand> (I can't see when atm as I have not fully triaged it)
<bdrung> tumbleweed: the changes look good. go ahead and push it to trunk
<Rhonda> geser: Seems the 500 went away?
 * Rhonda likes bugs that solve themself.  :)
<geser> Rhonda: thanks for fixing it :)
<geser> I saw someone "reporting" that problem in #launchpad too yesterday
<Rhonda> Yep, Spads did also query me about it.
<Rhonda> I guess there might have been some dbd file issue which fixed itself during the next cronjob.
<verwilst> openvpn doesnt seem to be starting by default on 12.04
<verwilst> anyone encountered the same thing?
<verwilst> i always have to start openvpn manually
<verwilst> even when i've put the config in auto
<jpds> verwilst: Works for me.
<verwilst> hm
<verwilst> strange
<verwilst> always have to do service openstart start manually for it to come up
<verwilst> openvpn*
<dupondje> verwilst: something in errors? Always the case? Or does it work sometimes? :)
<broder> bah. forgot to set an alarm and overslept. will probably be late for part 2 of motu bof
<tumbleweed> oops. The curse of not having jetlag :)
<highvoltage> tumbleweed, broder, Laney, ajmitch: are you doing the debian thing tonight or the touristy thingy?
<highvoltage> (and also, anyone else here going to debian/BAD?)
<broder> probably touristy thing
<tumbleweed> highvoltage: I wanted to do the BAD thing, but pretty sure I can't make it
<highvoltage> k
<ajmitch> highvoltage: not sure yet
<ajmitch> broder: I tracked down that patch you had for LP, finally
<ajmitch> it'll need some changes since that part of the code was changed for -proposed, but should be possible :)
<EvilResistance> am i correct that an Ubuntu-specific modification that makes it distinctively different than the Debian package would need versioning of -#ubuntu1 where # is the debian package revision number?
<tumbleweed> EvilResistance: where "distinctively different" means any change at all. Yes
<EvilResistance> tumbleweed, you mean any change not already implemented in the Debian package? (say a patch is released on the Debian package, and then included in the Ubuntu package)
<tumbleweed> EvilResistance: I mean a change compared to the debian package
<EvilResistance> indeed
<EvilResistance> good, just wanted to make sure that was the case
<EvilResistance> thanks
<dupondje> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/remmina/+bug/937522 clipboard patch for quantal added, if somebody could review :)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 937522 in remmina (Ubuntu) "rdp clipboard sync doesn't work anymore." [Undecided,Confirmed]
<EvilResistance> for SRUs, does a change in the current release package (and hence the reason for filing the SRU) also have to be reflected in the development version of Ubuntu (Quantal) if the source(s) for precise and quantal are identical?
<geser> dupondje: is the g_printf() call in remmina_rdp_receive_channel_data() for debugging? and should it stay even for normal use?
<geser> EvilResistance: yes, first fix in quantal (if not already fixed) then SRU
<EvilResistance> thought so
<dupondje> geser: that g_printf() should be removed indeed :(
<dupondje> missed that
<EvilResistance> in which case this bug isnt able to be fixed until the current version builds/runs in Quantal: LP Bug 991179  (I'll have to modify my response in that bug)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 991179 in boinc (Ubuntu) "7.0.24 "computation error" bug" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/991179
<geser> EvilResistance: do you have a summary what needs to get changed for this but? I try to find a good summary in those 80 comments but didn't find yet
<geser> a comment number with a summary would be enough
<EvilResistance> geser, a fix was found for Precise, but the package doesnt build in any circumstances in Quantal
<EvilResistance> and the solution was sent via bugsquad mailing list
 * EvilResistance is on the bug squad
<EvilResistance> so my response was that it'd need fixed in Quantal then SRU'd for Precise
<dupondje> geser: you can upload, or do I fix a new debdiff ? :)
<EvilResistance> the subsequent response was that the package doesn't build in Quantal, so...
<EvilResistance> they have to fix that first
<geser> EvilResistance: is there a new upstream version that includes that fix and builds in quantal? (that counts as fix for quantal too, once the package is there)
<EvilResistance> geser, untested yet, i could try and figure it out, but since its not my bug... :P
 * EvilResistance didnt report it, nor does he use boinc, he only got involved because it was sent across the bugsquad mailing list
<EvilResistance> and, they asked for a fix to be posted ;P
<geser> dupondje: I'm currently not on my Ubuntu, so I can't upload right now. Did you sent it already upstream?
<EvilResistance> i have a debdiff for Precise, and that builds, but the same package doesnt work in Quantal (explodes)
<EvilResistance> good luck in asking me where that issue is, i dont have the logs locally
 * EvilResistance isnt in his primary dev environment for packaging
<geser> EvilResistance: "and so it begins" :)
<EvilResistance> geser, as soon as a solution comes out for Quantal, i'll be poking the MOTUs
<EvilResistance> geser, indeed.
<dupondje> geser: its already commited in the Remmina git
<geser> EvilResistance: you might need to ask a SRU member what to in this case, but if quantal doesn't get a fix there is a risk that it gets forgotten and quantal ships a broken package again
<EvilResistance> i agree
<EvilResistance> but considering that quantal's dev cycle is, what, about two weeks old?  i fully expect at this stage there to be broken packages
<EvilResistance> geser, i agree it needs to work in quantal first :P
<EvilResistance> and i'll poke the SRU team later
 * EvilResistance has to finish something else that is more important
<geser> EvilResistance: we have packages in precise that got last uploaded in oneiric or even older
<EvilResistance> this package in question was synced from Debian for Precise ;P
 * EvilResistance checked that
<geser> and such things tend to get easily forgotten in a few months (who will check in 5 months if this got fixed?)
<EvilResistance> (it was newer in Sid than Oneiric, during the Precise dev cycle)
<EvilResistance> geser, probably the guy who pinged the bugsquad, or the person who's assigned to that bug, its unlikely i'll care in about a week
 * EvilResistance has enough to deal with :P
<EvilResistance> s/unlikely/likely/
<geser> bug reporters don't care anymore either once it got fixed for them (usually the current release)
<geser> but talk to SRU members what to do in this case here
<EvilResistance> any of them here, or can you point me to the mailing list
<geser> EvilResistance: https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-sru/+members#active but I guess all of them are currently at UDS
<EvilResistance> yeah, well its not a high priority on my list
 * EvilResistance is busy with more important things
<geser> I don't know of any mailing list, but you could try to contact them through the LP mail feature
<geser> dupondje: I guess your debdiff will get sponsored once all patch pilots are back from UDS
<dupondje> ok :)
<bobweaver> what is this ?
<bobweaver> wrong room sorry
<broder> ugh. just tried to write an "unless" block in python. halp the ruby is getting to me :-P
<micahg> broder: that seems very perlish
<broder> micahg: yeah, ruby picked up a lot of perl
<broder> it also got the "foo if/unless bar" postfix operator
<broder> and it has a handful of $* special variables
<micahg> right, like I said, perlish :)
<lifeless> python has that too
<lifeless> a if test else b
<MTecknology> !logs
<ubottu> Official channel logs can be found at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/ . LoCo channels are now logged there too; for older LoCo channel logs, see http://logs.ubuntu-eu.org/freenode/
#ubuntu-motu 2012-05-10
<tbf> hi, anyone knows how to deal with such warnings when building a package?
<tbf> dpkg-gencontrol: Warnung: Paket qtgstreamer-plugins: unknown substitutions variable ${gstreamer:URISources}
<geser> tbf: try to figure out if something is missing (something should fill that variable with data) or if you can ignore it (the package doesn't really need that variable)
<elky> did python-docutils start reporting language with the full language name, eg, spanish rather than shortcode, eg, es, between oneiric (0.7-2) and precise (0.8-1)
<aboudreault> guys. how comes a apt-get install libpng12-dev install the libpng.so in /usr/lib/x86_64 ? and nothing in /usr/lib? This will cause a lot of software  configure to fail.. no?
<Zhenech> no
<Zhenech> unless it is literally looking for /usr/lib/libpng.so
<Zhenech> and not for libpath/libpng.so
<aboudreault> it is literrally looking for $PREFIX/libpng.so
<aboudreault> I suppose I would have to fix that
<Zhenech> but prefix is /usr? not /usr/lib, so it wouldnt find it anyways? :)
<Resistance> any MOTU or SRU team member available to outline the update procedure for how a bug/program would get updated in Precise *on that bug*?  I'm not SRU or MOTU, so the people on the bug hearing it from one of you guys would probably help a lot for their understanding.
<Resistance> that outlining would probably best be put on LP Bug 991179 (since the Debian devs are trying to get this direct to Precise, which is a no-no without an SRU)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 991179 in boinc (Ubuntu) "7.0.24 "computation error" bug" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/991179
<geser> Resistance: not Evil anymore? :) you'll probably have more luck to find a SRU member in #ubuntu-devel (most SRU members are core-devs) once they are back from UDS (next week)
<geser> or travel to UDS and discuss it with them in person :)
<Resistance> geser:  that's also why I said MOTU
<Resistance> MOTUs are aware of the steps in the process about as much as an SRU might
<Resistance> (at least as far as i've observed)
<Resistance> and my nick isn't evil right now, but it might end up that way later ;P
<Resistance> and the package in question is Universe, so... :P
<Resistance> geser:  i also spoke to one of the SRU team last night here on IRC, i've only got the summary of what's expected to update/fix that bug, not the entire process, hence the request :)
<geser> Resistance: what was the outcome about fixing quantal first? given that boinc doesn't compile there at the moment
<Resistance> geser:  that's what i've said, i want a MOTU or an SRU member to corroborate
 * Resistance only has summaries, not all the details
<Resistance> i'll poke the SRU team, probably this Sunday or Monday, they can outline the entire process
<Resistance> (although when I spoke to cjwatson, he outlined what i've said on that bug, so i'm regurgitating informatoin that i have, but not giving the full details since I don't know those)
<Resistance> i think the confusion is coming from the Debian side, they assume Precise is like sid, you can just easily get it in, but there's the whole SRU thing that sid doesn't have :P
<geser> Resistance: preparing a SRU isn't that difficult (once one has the patch to fix it): it's mostly adding a TEST CASE to the bug description (explaining how to test that the proposed fix really fixes it) and the patch (ideally in debdiff format for easier sponsoring) that someone with upload rights can upload
<Resistance> geser:  true, but the program with the fix (in Debian) doesn't build for Quantal.
<Resistance> and according to cjwatson, they'd like a working version in Quantal first
<Resistance> because if you update precise but not quantal, what's the advantage then
<Resistance> (considering the updated version that would fix this doesn't build in Quantal)
<Resistance> and since this isn't a critical bug, i dont really see a reason to push for the "Precise but not Quantal" angle of things.
<geser> the tricky part is if there isn't a simple patch which needs to get applied (e.g. fixed in a newer upstream version)
<Resistance> that is the issue
<Resistance> since the intermediary versions between 7.0.24 and the version in Debian don't exist
<Resistance> at least not in Debian or Ubuntu
<Resistance> as well, there's actually *two* bugs now, from what I've gathered, where pre-7.0.27 doesn't work with graphics cards with > 2GB RAM (For those who use their graphics card as processor memory, i.e. CUDA)
<Resistance> the bug that's affecting precise current version is a buggy patch (which can easily be removed), but the second bug (more critical in the Debian maintainers' eyes) is only addressed in a upstream version update (i.e. 7.0.27)
<Resistance> if Precise were still in development, I'd have filed a sync request and gotten it FFe'd
<Resistance> then this problem wouldnt exist :P
 * Resistance yawns
<Resistance> y'know, if this existed in Quantal (7.0.27), I'd have just filed a backport request, tested the backport(s) myself, and then if that all worked, everything would be fine and dandy :p
<geser> Resistance: I don't if it would be acceptable to sync the fixed package to quantal knowing that it will FTBFS (but at least we'll have the fix once the FTBFS get resolved)
 * Resistance forgot what FTBFS means, and goes to look that up
<geser> Fails To Build From Source
<Resistance> ah, fails to build from source
<Resistance> yeah, just looked it up :P
<Resistance> well, that's why i've been holding off on filing the sync request
<Resistance> the last, oh...
<geser> then you could backport it to precise (where it would build)
<Resistance> i want to say four requests i had for Precise when it was in dev were initially refused because it failed to build
<Resistance> but then i dug around and found that problem was caused by some oddball issue with a build-dep, adn removing that fixed it all
<Resistance> (then the sync/backport was accepted with ubuntu-changes)
<Resistance> i'm hesitant to act and file a request *given* the FTBFS
<geser> new upstream versions are usually backported, it's not easy to get new upstream versions accepted for SRUs
<Resistance> mhm
<Resistance> i'll probably note that, but I'd ideally like to see this fixed in Quantal
<Resistance> but again, given i'm not on SRU, or MOTU, I'm not going to file that sync request :P
 * Resistance goes to dig up the bug link again
<geser> I'll try to check if it's easy to fix boinc building in quantal or not when I'm home
<geser> Resistance: if it's Debian bug #671999 then it should get fixed in Debian in 2 days (uploaded to the 2 days delayed queue in Debian) and you might be able to file a sync request next week :)
<ubottu> Debian bug 671999 in src:boinc "boinc: FTBFS: ../tools/process_input_template.cpp:86:23: error: 'unlink' was not declared in this scope" [Serious,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/671999
<Resistance> possibly, i'll check with them, but given that my quantal chroot keeps going *pbbt* *fizzle*, i'm not willing to test ;P
<Resistance> ohey, didnt realize you were a motu, geser
 * Resistance looked up your info on LP
<Resistance> question, then: would you support a sync to Quantal of that package, if the FTBFS issue still exists, just for the purposes of backporting that to Precise?
<Resistance> if it were up to you
<geser> probably yes
<broder> micahg: i know we talked about killing off maverick backports bugs, but it's more complicated than that. if they want a backport to lucid, do we drop the natty/oneiric backports, too?
<micahg> broder: nope, you can backport for any one of natty, oneiric, precise IMHO to lucid
<broder> nono, i mean that if you have a precise->lucid backport
<broder> we would have opened l/m/n/o tasks
<broder> should we drop n and o when we drop m?
<micahg> ah, yeah, in that scenario, yes
<micahg> broder: well, hold on
<broder> i wish we had a better way to convey intent
<broder> like, i open bugs where the goal is explicitly "backport to EVERYTHING"
<broder> but i think that's often not the case
<micahg> broder: ask if the requester wants the natty/oneiric backports still
<broder> yeah, sure
<micahg> we don't have too many of those, so I'm fine with manual processing once we get a response (set to incomplete so they can expire maybe)
<broder> ok. backporters, get your mail filters ready. i'm going to go close out maverick-backports bugs
<broder> (done)
<broder> will do a followup sweep in a bit to get backports *from* maverick
<ajmitch> broder: I got your warning about email too late, now my lp mail is full of backports spam :)
<broder> muahaha
<Laney> T~N;WN
<Laney> :-)
<ajmitch> pretty much
<asomething> MOTU BoF in #ubuntu-uds-room-202
<broder> tumbleweed: you fixed my backportpackage bug! "./gnome-do-precise already exists. Delete it? [y|N]? y"
<highvoltage> nÊoÉ¯ ollÇÉ¥
<Laney> gah
<crjon> Hello, I am new here and I am trying to get involved with some projects to get coding experience, anyone able to help out
<micahg> hi cjwatson
<micahg> cjwatson: umping
<micahg> hi crjon
<highvoltage> hey crjon
<micahg> crjon: here's a link to a site where you can find lots of opportunities to fix bugs: http://harvest.ubuntu.com/
<Resistance> gah, microflood o.O
<crjon> hey everyone thanks for the site, I am checking it out
#ubuntu-motu 2012-05-11
<EpikVision> is anyone available?
 * hyperair is semi-available
<hyperair> oh he disapeared.
<psusi> I'm married and have a kid... definitely not available.
<EpikVision> ok
<bobweaver> Hello there I am haveig trouble when building it is my control file it is here http://paste.ubuntu.com/981264/  just wondering what I am doing wrong thanks for your time. Oh and the email address are in the control file I just took out for the paste. error is here http://paste.ubuntu.com/981275/
<bobweaver> thanks again
<geser> bobweaver: add a 2nd whitespace at the start of lines 2-7
<bobweaver> thanks
<bobweaver> I always get that mixed up if it is one or two spaces
<bobweaver> thanks again
<_ruben> that file could use some spellchecking and whitespace fixing :)
<bobweaver> I am on it thanks _ruben
<nigelb> Can someone grant nomination on this bug? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/sphinx/+bug/997891
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 997891 in sphinx (Ubuntu) "sometimes cannot build pdfs for de, sl, pt, es, nl, pl, or it locales" [Undecided,New]
<nigelb> geser: you around? :)
<geser> nigelb: sort of, why?
<nigelb> geser: I was wondering if you had the magical powers to ack the nomination on that bug.
<geser> should have as a MOTU
<nigelb> geser: Can you? :)
<geser> nigelb: sorry, I can't. It's either because it's in main or some other team membership is needed
<nigelb> AH.
<nigelb> I wonder if it needs release team.
<elky> https://launchpad.net/sphinx/trunk suggests it wants stub
<iulian> nigelb, elky: Done.
<elky> iulian, woot thanks
<CareBear\> hm
<highvoltage> hmm, where's the motu crowd, I'd thought you'd be in tha archive-reorg room by now :)
<highvoltage> (ah here you are)
<broder> i got really good at timing how long the drive would take
<broder> been inching my alarm later and later all week
 * ajmitch made it in time...
<ajmitch> starting to feel the effects of too many sleepless nights though :)
 * ScottK thinks being at a local UDS would be rough.
<broder> not getting a room at the hotel was a mistake, i think :)
<ajmitch> broder: at least you get to sleep in your own bed
<broder> yes, although i don't get to sleep in it for nearly long enough
<EpikVision> can someone help me in the package guide?
<broder> Laney: ping (one sec...)
<broder> if you're testing manual backporting, let me give you my patch to include an lp closer
<broder> (even though it will be ingored by lp, i feel moderately strongly hat we should have it there to capture history)
<Laney> push it to udt?
<Laney> also it looks like it doesn't pass -v
<broder> will land momentarily
<broder> i think that's mostly deliberate - we don't want to, e.g., close sru tasks
<Laney> would it?
<broder> well, if there was a closer in the history between current archive version and backported version
<broder> and an sru task on that bug
<vibhav> EpikVision: What do you want help with?
<tumbleweed> EpikVision: no need to ask to ask. Please just ask your question
<EpikVision> hahah
<EpikVision> ok
<broder> Laney: pushed
<EpikVision> http://developer.ubuntu.com/packaging/html/fixing-a-bug.html
<EpikVision> I'm going through "Work on a fix"
<broder> Laney: hmm. actually, the real reason to include the lp closer is for the sake of AA review
<EpikVision> vibhav: I've done all the steps to this point
<vibhav> EpikVision: What are you working on?
<EpikVision> Fixing a bug.
<EpikVision> from the packaging guide
<vibhav> I mean, which package
<EpikVision> tomboy
<vibhav> EpikVision: Whcih bug?
<EpikVision> vibhav: I don't think the guide goes through any bug.
<EpikVision> but i was just following the steps, up to the section "Work on a fix"
<EpikVision> I don't get why $ patch -p1 < ../bugfix.patch
<EpikVision> is giving me an error.
<vibhav> EpikVision: You need to fing a bug to work on
<EpikVision> alright then.
<EpikVision> vibhav: I'm totally new to the scene.
<EpikVision> and the package guide is confusing me.
<vibhav> IF no bug, no fix = NO changes in source
<EpikVision> alright
<vibhav> EpikVision: Which part?
<EpikVision> vibhav: "Work on a fix"
<EpikVision> up to the code ($ edit-patch 99-new-patch), everything went fine
<EpikVision> but I can't get past $ patch -p1 < ../bugfix.patch
<EpikVision> vibhav: when I put that command, I keep getting
<EpikVision> bash: ../bugfix.patch: No such file or directory
<EpikVision> I cd-ed to tomboy/tomboy.dev
<vibhav> EpikVision: bugfix.patch needs to be the name of the patch
<vibhav> you made to fix the bug
<EpikVision> ok
<EpikVision> so how do I work on the fix, if it were necessary?
<EpikVision> for this tutorial specifically?
 * EpikVision scratches his head
<tumbleweed> EpikVision: what are you fixing in tomboy?
<EpikVision> vibhav: as mentioned earlier, I was just following the package guide
<EpikVision> ohh
<EpikVision> hold on.
<EpikVision> tumbleweed:  I was just following the package guide
<tumbleweed> EpikVision: right, but that's the point where you need to fix something
<EpikVision> tumbleweed: really?
<tumbleweed> I mean, edit some source code
<tumbleweed> well, sure, that's the point of that guide, right? :)
<EpikVision> ok, do you any bitesized bug for tomboy that I should try?
<tumbleweed> you can find a bunch on harvest.ubuntu.com
<EpikVision> tumbleweed: i'm at harvest, but I'm having trouble filtering the list to tomboy.
<tumbleweed> EpikVision: http://harvest.ubuntu.com/opportunities/package/tomboy/
<EpikVision> alright.
<EpikVision> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/tomboy/+bug/386893
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 386893 in tomboy (Ubuntu) "Searching within a notebook should inform the user that no results were found within that notebook" [Wishlist,In progress]
<EpikVision> wait a min
<EpikVision> nvm this one.
<EpikVision> tumbleweed: is it courtesy to tackle a bug with no current assignee?
<tumbleweed> that person has been assigned for over a year
<EpikVision> whoa
<tumbleweed> let's assume that they aren't going to do it
<EpikVision> hahaha
<EpikVision> ok
<EpikVision> tumbleweed: so now that I'm at "Work on a fix" at this point
<EpikVision> how can I delve into the source code?
<EpikVision> I found the problem, figured out that the package could be looked through, and I branched the source package.
<EpikVision> now how can I start with a fix?
<tumbleweed> EpikVision: there's a patch in the linked gnome bug that you should try
<tumbleweed> note that the patch author mentions it wasn't perfect yet
<EpikVision> should, I should replace gnome-bug with myself?
<tumbleweed> what is 'gnome-bug'
<EpikVision> the assignee
<EpikVision> were you referring to the linked page I sent you earlier?
<tumbleweed> no. that's a linked bug. click on it
<EpikVision> ohhh
<EpikVision> ok, i clicked it.
<EpikVision> what should I do?
 * EpikVision feels slightly bewildered.
<tumbleweed> download the most recent patch and see if it applies?
<EpikVision> ok, according to the package guide, what step am I at?
<EpikVision> http://developer.ubuntu.com/packaging/html/fixing-a-bug.html
<tumbleweed> you are going to use patch patch, not edit patch
<EpikVision> alright.
<tumbleweed> err patch, not edit-patch
<EpikVision> it gives me (err: command not found.)
<tumbleweed> then install it :)
<EpikVision> so, I should patch patch tomboy?
<EpikVision> I cded to /tomboy/tomboy.dev
<tumbleweed> "patch patch" was a typo of mine
<EpikVision> what is the syntax i need to patch tomboy?
<EpikVision> I'm guessing (err patch <insert app name>)
<tumbleweed> no, the packaging guide shows you the right syntax
<tumbleweed> where ../bugfix.patch is the name of the patch
<jtaylor> quilt import <patch> should also work
<tumbleweed> sorry, yes that,s the best approach
<jtaylor> then: quilt push
<Laney> from within a quilt shell (which I assume edit-patch uses)?
<EpikVision> I wrote (quilt import ../bugfix.patch)
<EpikVision> but it gives me (Patch ../bugfix.patch does not exist.)
<EpikVision> :(
 * micahg is curious what manual backport testing is
<EpikVision> ../bugfix.patch doesn't exist in my folder...
<jtaylor> you need to download it from the bug first
<Resistance> and secondly:
<Resistance> <tumbleweed> [05/11/12 12:39:22] where ../bugfix.patch is the name of the patch
<Resistance> it might not be *named* bugname.patch
<Resistance> so you'll need to know (1) where you downloaded the patch to, and (2) what that patch's name is
<Laney> micahg: it means us uploading it instead of archive admins using the script
<Resistance> EpikVision:  after you download it from the bug
<EpikVision> https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=588730
<ubottu> Gnome bug 588730 in General "Searching within a notebook should inform the user that no results were found within that notebook" [Enhancement,New]
<EpikVision> Resistance: I'm trying to tackle this bug, but I can't work on a fix.
<EpikVision> How do I download it from here?
 * Resistance looks
<jtaylor> is it a good idea to add a patch that is not upstream?
 * Resistance seems to be missing backlogs
 * EpikVision is a new at this.  
<Resistance> what's the package the bug is in?
<jtaylor> tomboy
<EpikVision> yup. I got the source code from a branch.
 * Resistance reads the bug, and reads the equivalent LP bug
<EpikVision> I'm following the outline provided by the Package guide
<EpikVision> If I succeed, this would be the first bug I ever fixed.
<Resistance> EpikVision:  did you check the upstream bug to confirm that the patch(es) that fix LP Bug 386893 (linked to the upstream bug) are *committed* upstream, and not just proposed?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 386893 in tomboy (Ubuntu) "Searching within a notebook should inform the user that no results were found within that notebook" [Wishlist,In progress] https://launchpad.net/bugs/386893
<Resistance> upstream, there's two bugs on there
<jtaylor> unfortunatly I don't think this particular bug should be fixed in ubuntu
<Resistance> s/bugs/patches/
<Resistance> jtaylor:  i'm in agreement, it needs to be fixed upstream
 * Resistance is on BugSquad, and is giving his opinion on this one
<Resistance> perhaps the fix(es) will show up in Quantal at some point?
<Resistance> after fixed upstream
<EpikVision> ok then.
<EpikVision> Resistance: what do you mean by "checking">
<Resistance> EpikVision:  i.e. go to the upstream bug, check both of the submitted patches and figure out which one is needed to fix the issue listed on that bug
<Resistance> there's two patches submitted to that upstream bug
<Resistance> one which was committed already and the other which is proposed
<EpikVision> oh ok
<Resistance> having said this, i believe it needs upstream fixing.
<Resistance> jtaylor:  any objection to me voicing my opinion on that on this bug?
<Resistance> (the LP bug)
<PaoloRotolo> Hi all!
<EpikVision> Resistance: what's the link to go to the upstream bug?
<Resistance> its linked to the LP bug.
<Resistance> https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=588730
<ubottu> Gnome bug 588730 in General "Searching within a notebook should inform the user that no results were found within that notebook" [Enhancement,New]
<EpikVision> should I choose a committed one or a proposed one?
<Resistance> <jtaylor> unfortunatly I don't think this particular bug should be fixed in ubuntu
<Resistance> rather it needs to be fixed upstream
<Resistance> which means that it needs to be fixed in the program itself and applied for whatever version that gets included into
<EpikVision> ah
<Resistance> and while it may be nice to really have in Ubuntu, it should ideally be fixed upstream
<EpikVision> what's the downstream then?
<Resistance> i'm going to concur with jtaylor on this, it doesn't need fixing in ubuntu
<EpikVision> alright.
<EpikVision> perhaps, I'll find another one.
<EpikVision> since I'm new, i need to tackle a bite-sized bug.
<Resistance> there's a list of bite-sized ones, isnt there?
 * Resistance could have SWORN there was one
<jtaylor> http://harvest.ubuntu.com/
<Resistance> jtaylor:  any objection to me stating your opinion (which is also my opinion) that this does not need fixing in ubuntu (but rather upstream) on the corresponding LP bug?
<jtaylor> no
 * EpikVision hopes to fix at least one bug today.
 * EpikVision thanks Resistance and jtaylor for helping.
<EpikVision> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pidgin/+bug/395001
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 395001 in pidgin (Ubuntu) "apt-get install of finch requires X11 (deps wrong)" [Medium,Triaged]
<EpikVision> Is this a good one?
<jtaylor> judging from the amount of comments probably not
<jtaylor> also that again looks like an upstream issue
<Resistance> jtaylor: can you poke the LP people and see whether LP is having a comms issue with gnome-bugs' upstream tracker?
<EpikVision> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pidgin/+bug/395001
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 395001 in pidgin (Ubuntu) "apt-get install of finch requires X11 (deps wrong)" [Medium,Triaged]
<Resistance> LP suggests that it is having a comms error
<EpikVision> Resistance: maybe this is better.
<Resistance> EpikVision:  FYI: jtaylor's higher up in the chain than I am, i'm pretty comfortable immediately trusting his assessment of bugs
<EpikVision> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pidgin/+bug/395001
<Resistance> EpikVision:  posting three times gets annoying
<Resistance> and in some cases is floody
<EpikVision> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/lightdm/+bug/828359
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 828359 in lightdm (Ubuntu) "Help strings for session related command line options not very informative" [Low,Incomplete]
<EpikVision> I meant to get this one. I'm orry
<Resistance> might i suggest, EpikVision, that you not assign yourself to bugs willy-nilly?
<Resistance> just a small suggestion, is all
<EpikVision> willy-nilly?
<EpikVision> alright.
<Resistance> i'm noticing on 395001 you assigned yourself then removed yourself from assignee after jtaylor pointed out its an upstream bug
 * Resistance looks at 828359
<EpikVision> sorry about that.
<Resistance> this one's marked as incomplete
<EpikVision> I think I would like to be assigned a decent bug to start with.
<EpikVision> I have poor judgment and choice.
<EpikVision> :(
 * Resistance quickly runs off for a cup of coffee
 * EpikVision stares at the computer screen.
<Resistance> jtaylor:  tumbleweed:  sorry for interjecting and stealing your thunder, there
<Laney> broder: can we have it API close the bug with -c Ã  la syncpackage?
<tumbleweed> Resistance: no problem I ran off to the canonical shop in UDS between sessions :)
<Resistance> :P
<ajmitch> tumbleweed: got a bunch of goodies?
 * Laney need to get something
<Laney> got a voucher
<tumbleweed> ajmitch: yar, a new backpack and a hoodie
 * ajmitch has a hoodie & fleece jacket
<tumbleweed> plus some special orders for people in ZA :)
 * Resistance should make an effort to attend UDS in the future.
 * EpikVision had much fun at UDS.
<Resistance> the past two UDS, i've been showing up remotely, although i did a lot of lurking this one
<tumbleweed> I love that we have remote participation, but it's really hard to actually participate when you aren't there in person
<Resistance> mhm
 * tumbleweed is glad to be here
<Resistance> i should point out, though, that when people actually talk loudly enough to be heard over the live audio streams, it makes life easier
 * Resistance stopped by the MOTU BoF session yesterday
<Resistance> (remotely of course)
<tumbleweed> some people seem incapable of speaking up :)
<Resistance> mhmn
<Resistance> having said this, i could have said "Turn up the volume", but that crinkling noise was already too loud xD
<Resistance> (there was crinkling somewhere near the mic)
 * ajmitch blames highvoltage 
<EpikVision> https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity-2d/+bug/813041
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 813041 in unity-2d "[launcher] Drag And Drop should only be activated with the left mouse button." [Low,Triaged]
<EpikVision> guys, I think this one is ok.
<tumbleweed> the most useful thing you can do there is to provide a patch
<Resistance> mhm
<EpikVision> providing a patch?
<Resistance> aw, man, how is it i can just down a cup of coffee without realizing it...
 * Resistance goes off to get another cup
<EpikVision> haha
 * EpikVision laughs
<EpikVision> I should use http://developer.ubuntu.com/packaging/html/udd-patchsys.html
<Resistance> that bug'd need a patch at the most, that's the best you can do, its triaged upstream (with the Unity project)
<EpikVision> tumbleweed:
<EpikVision> tumbleweed: since you are UDS, can you lend a prospective developer a hand?
<EpikVision> *are at
<Resistance> EpikVision:  UDS is a busy time for devs :P
<Resistance> i think you'll need some patience ;P
<EpikVision> perhaps so...
 * Resistance is intentionally not bugging the MOTUs much during UDS, even though their attention is necessary for a sync request from Debian for Quantal
<tumbleweed> EpikVision: what are you needing a hand with?
<EpikVision> determining what is a proper bug to fix.
<EpikVision> how to recognize a easy bug from a hard bug
<EpikVision> etc.
<EpikVision> lol
<tumbleweed> bitesize tag is an esay way to find an easy bug
<EpikVision> some bitesize ones aren't meant to be fixed, I noticed during this discussion.
<EpikVision> or a starter can't try them.
<Resistance> probably because they're already merged/committed upstream
<tumbleweed> right, so for each bug we make a decision on where we want to fix it
<Resistance> for the first one you did, the one i came in on, that was already filed upstream and merged upstream with a fix
<Resistance> so that didn't need fixing in Ubuntu
<EpikVision> ahh ok
<Resistance> i didnt look at that second one very well
 * Resistance was too busy focusing on the need for coffee
<EpikVision> oh my
<tumbleweed> but if it's serious enough, we can apply the patch in Ubuntu rather than wait for the new version from the upstream that fixes the bug
<Resistance> mhm
<EpikVision> i c.
<EpikVision> starters should try simple bugs then.
<EpikVision> like typos
<Resistance> yep.
<Resistance> well, even then, minor fixes arent always accepted
<EpikVision> btw, does anyone know alejandro's irc name?
<tumbleweed> user-visible typos are a great thing to start with
<Resistance> i agree
<EpikVision> alrighty then, where and how can I find a bunch of them?
<tumbleweed> search for spelling / typo on bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu ?
<Resistance> the easy-to-fix stuff is good, including the bitesize bug i took up / filed against php5 to use unix sockets instead of TCP sockets, which was accepted upstream and exists in 5.4 in some debian repo :P
<Resistance> that was a very easy to fix one ;P
<Resistance> yeah, what tumbleweed suggested would work
<Resistance> (default setup, on that php5 bug/wishlist request, btw ;P)
<Resistance> speaking of which...
<Resistance> tumbleweed:  who do i need to prod about server packages, such as php5 and whether they'll update to whatever the latest is in debian for Quantal?
<EpikVision> Resistance: can you give an overview of the way of the developer?
<Resistance> the ubuntu server team?
<Resistance> i *should* be honest and point out that my duties with bugs primarily are deciding what's triage-worthy, and then filing it upstream as necessary
<Resistance> nowadays i dont usually patch/fix bugs
<Resistance> unless they're in the nginx project's PPAs, because i'm the manager of that ppa's lucid packages... :P
<EpikVision> wow, that's awesome.
<Resistance> OW!  hot coffee!
 * highvoltage kind of stumbles in
<Resistance> but to be honest, most bugs for that are fixed upstream, or have patches upstream that get included in the package
<highvoltage> (eek I've missed a lot)
<Resistance> (in regards to nginx's ppas which are more up to date than the repos)
<Resistance> highvoltage:  meh, that's what scrollbacks and ubuntu logs are for :P
<tumbleweed> Resistance: the last person who touched it is responsible for merging it from Debian
<Resistance> tumbleweed:  ah, i see.
<Resistance> how do i determine who was responsible for merging from debian?
<Resistance> changelog entries?
<broder> Laney: eh...i'm a bit iffy on that one - it has the same problem as syncpackage but worse since the upload hits unapproved
<Laney> yes
<tumbleweed> merges.ubuntu.com (which is currently a little out of date)
<Laney> I would just leave it open though
<Laney> I think most backporters are capable of doing that :-)
<broder> huh?
<Laney> what?
<Laney> just don't press yes until it gets accepted
<broder> ....that could take days, though
<Laney> it could
<Laney> the one i just did took 12 minutes
<broder> that's because cjwatson and i were sitting next to each other and testing manual backporting
<Laney> you are always free to quit and not do it
<Laney> fine.
<broder> i'm fine with adding the option
<broder> bah. connection fail. in any case, colin and i came up with a list of changes we want to see in backportpackage before we start using it for heavy-duty backporting
<broder> i will add bug closing to that list
<Laney> ty
<broder> in case you're curious, the changes are: switching from ~precise1 to ~ubuntu12.04.1 and passing -v because (a) that's what was always done and (b) it won't close bugs
<broder> (the -backports pocket is special cased to never be able to close bugs)
<Laney> interesting
<Resistance> broder:  mind if i pick your brain about requesting a package sync?
<broder> Resistance: i'm about to go afk for a while. asking the channel would probably be better
<Resistance> if i use requestsync to request a sync from Debian unstable to Quantal, do i put quantal or something else for the target release?
<Resistance> simple question, just a question of what to put in for target release
<jtaylor> bug 997201 is weird
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 997201 in qwt (Ubuntu) "libqwt-dev (6.0.0-1ubuntu1) in update loop" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/997201
<jtaylor> how can that happen?
<broder> Resistance: yes, quantal is correct
<Resistance> just wanted to make sure, thanks.
<broder> though you shouldn't have to specify anything - it should default to the current devel release
<Resistance> broder:  reminder that i'm on natty still (waiting for a replacement drive to come in), i'd rather not chance it ;P
<broder> requestsync will ask you to confirm what it's doing before it does anything
<Resistance> yeah, well i'm in the habit of putting information into the fields just to make sure it has the right info
 * Resistance made the mistake of not doing that before when packaging things, and ran into all sorts of crap from pbuilder when it locally-build the package he was building
<Resistance> locallybuilt*
<Resistance> bah, stupid keyboard
<Resistance> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/boinc/+bug/998195  <-- in case someone can take a look at this
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 998195 in boinc (Ubuntu) "Sync boinc 7.0.27+dfsg-3 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Undecided,New]
<Resistance> (it builds in Quantal, i tested locally, and in a Quantal VM)
<Resistance> bah, more firefox updates >.>
<Rhonda> How brave would it be to upgrade from maverick directly to precise?
<Rhonda> Huhm, I guess I should redirect myself to #ubuntu :)
<Laney> probably it should display an "I uploaded this, please wait for it to be approved" message too
<Laney> syncpackage could also do this during freezes ^o)
<tumbleweed> or we should have a separate tool that looks at recent syncs / backports uploaded by you that have open bugs nad closes them
<Laney> i'm thinking of Fix Committed which the same tool could/should do
<Laney> for Fix Released, maybe closemybugsd would be nicetm
<Laney> â¢
<Laney> well, maybe not backportpackage unless that is driving dput for you
<Rhonda> wow, 500mb ram and 380mb swap. this is going to be fun :)
<Laney> huh, what machine is this?!
<Rhonda> two cores atom 1.6 ghz, hmmm
<Rhonda> an aspire one netbook
<Rhonda> I think it was one which had ubuntu preintalled back then
<Rhonda> the display is broken, and there are some keys missing (I am typing on the rubber thingies mostly ;)
<Rhonda> It's the best I could get as a quick replacement for my hp laptop that doesn't want to charge anymore
<Laney> sounds like an enjoyable piece of hardware :-)
<Rhonda> Didn't know you are also into masochism like me, Laney ;)
<Laney> heh
<Rhonda> Reminds me of the days when the m key on my compaq notebook b0rked.
<Rhonda> I tweaked the keyboard bindings and even managed to get used to have the m above the tab key.
<Rhonda> sfvbm right alt menu and right windows key, also right shift key, those are the keys that are missing the regular plastic above the rubber thingy
<Rhonda> also, for additional fun, they keyboard layout is some qemrtz
<Rhonda> anyone got a clue which language uses qemrtz?
<Rhonda> italian potentially?
<Resistance> if i've filed a sync request for a bug on LP in which the package that is being synced to Quantal closes that bug, should I set the bug that the sync request will close  to  "In Progress" (and assign the bug to someone involved with getting that sync request completed)?
<Resistance> assuming the bug has "confirmed" as its current status
<tumbleweed> Resistance: mention all the bugs that this will close in the sync request
<tumbleweed> (assuming they aren't closed in the changelog)
<Resistance> they are closed in the changelog
<tumbleweed> perfect
<Resistance> but the LP bug that's being closed, does it need "In Progress" set to its status with the sync request having been filed?
<tumbleweed> you can, if you are worried that someone else is going to look at them
<Resistance> now i assume i just wait for someone on the sponsors team to see the sync request?
<tumbleweed> yes
 * Resistance has all the patience in the world, then, on that one :)
<bobweaver> hello there I am trying to find information about " Traditional Packaging "  is it like   make upstream  make make or autotolls/whatever  then start the debian package with dh_make -e <email> -c < license  -f foo.tar      then make all your debian/*  then make tar ball foo.orig.tar.gz  then build package with fakeroot and dpkg-buildpackage -F  ?
<bobweaver> This is why I ask  http://developer.ubuntu.com/packaging/html/traditional-packaging.html
<ScottK> bobweaver: In very general terms yes.
<Laney> That packaging guide is using "traditional packaging" to mean packaging without using UDD.
 * Laney tries to say "packaging" some more
 * ScottK thinks of it more as "way that works reliably" than "traditional".
 * Laney looks forward to reviewing that patch to the guide
<bobweaver> ahh cool so like a hardened package ? or like very sound package
<bobweaver> quilt is verry confusing for new comer like me and that guide if that helps at all
<ScottK> Quilt is confusing to a newcomer period.
<bobweaver> :)
<ScottK> I don't recall exactly why, but I had a lot of trouble with it.
<ScottK> Now I've gotten past it, but it's definitely a barrier to entry.
<bobweaver> thanks ScottK
<bobweaver> there was also something in the ,manual about RCD or something like that and I do not know what that is either I am looking for it now.
<bobweaver> I can not belive that I deleted my Quesytions file then again it was 4 am
<bobweaver> ok so I found it it is under the section Limitations of UDDÂ¶What is  RCS on top of RCS.  ?
<tumbleweed> bobweaver: RCS = revision control system
<tumbleweed> both bzr and quilt are RCSs
<bobweaver> ahh thanks that should be in maunal ? I should file bug ?
<bobweaver> or shouldd I just add that and push my branch ?
<tumbleweed> either works. If you're adding an explanation, that's great, that's what matters
<bobweaver> will do now
<bobweaver> thanks for the info everybody !
<ScottK> tumbleweed: Quilt isn't really an RCS.
<ScottK> dpkg tries to treat it that way, but that's dpkg's fault.
<tumbleweed> ScottK: yeah, it's more a patch management tool
<ScottK> Yes
<tumbleweed> which is a job taken on by modern RCS tools
<ScottK> Sort of.
<bobweaver> hello again is there any tips that you could give too a new comer that wants to learn but also wants too learn from your mistakes. Like one for me is learn debconf before you try to write a postinst script or you do not have too package something eachtime you make a change, Thanks again I know that that is a loaded question but any tips help thanks
<ScottK> Learning debconf is an advanced task.  Save it for later (until you find you need it).
<ScottK> Find a bug that bothers you and see if you can figure out how to fix it.  Then package the fix.
<ScottK> That's the best way to learn.
<bobweaver> Thanks ScottK  !
<bobweaver> I just got great news !
<bobweaver> for bringing devs into motu. If you know what the newboston that is great if not it is a place too watch tutorials online about programing and all sorts of other stuff. his python video #1 of like 60 or something has over 288,000 hits and watches on youtube  and that is just the pyhton videos. He has said yes that he would put any video tutorials from motu on his site. I think that this would bring a lot of people in not sure if this is
<bobweaver>  good or not what do you think  ?
<bobweaver> sorry I was wrong about the numbers on that video it has 399,246 views
<bobweaver> most have at least 100,000 per 1st video
#ubuntu-motu 2012-05-12
<broder> tumbleweed: do we have a helper function in ubuntutools yet for "what version of $foo is current across all pockets in $release"?
<broder> ooh, there is. sweet
<tumbleweed> :)
<pdtpatrick> Question - would someone please explain/help me with .deb packaging. I'm using deb helper and i've gone through the PackagingGuide.pdf -- and i still cannot understand how you move files around. For instance, if i want the .deb file when installed to have files in /etc/ and then /home/user/.filename  .. where/how do i do that ?  would this be the dh_installdeb helper script ?
<soren> pdtpatrick: You can't generally ship files in /home.
<soren> pdtpatrick: ...because you don't know at the time you build the package what the users on the system are called.
<pdtpatrick> soren: okay let's say i make a package and i want to dump them around for instance, in /etc or maybe /data
<soren> pdtpatrick: I'm supposing you'll elaborate?
<soren> pdtpatrick: Otherwise, my answer will be equally (un-)specific: Use the mv command.
<pdtpatrick> Let's assume i've created a shell script that allows admins to type "sstat" and it displays something like: http://cl.ly/1U0Z0a0R2e341z1f0c03
<pdtpatrick> soren: and i'd like that script deployed in /usr/local/sbin when the package is installed
<soren> pdtpatrick: Why?
<pdtpatrick> I'm just trying to learn how to do - it has also confused me on how to accomplish that
<pdtpatrick> soren: for instance, i'll install an asterisk package and it creates /etc with all the configs and such. I'd like to know how to do something like that
<soren> pdtpatrick: Then ask about that :)
<pdtpatrick> soren: sorry- would u please help with that :)
<soren> pdtpatrick: Don't ask how to put stuff in /usr/local/bin if you really want to put things in /etc.
<soren> Packaging tools will likely (and should) shout and scream if you try to put things in /usr/local.
<pdtpatrick> fair enough. Is this something u could explain/help with ?
<soren> Not with this little detail. Most things we package install things in etc themselves and the packaging magic just leaves it there.
<soren> So to figure out why that doesn't work for you... We need more detail.
<tumbleweed> if you don't have any kind of build system for the upstream package, it's fairly easy to install things with dh_install (see its manpage)
<pdtpatrick> for instance, i was learning by following the guide
<pdtpatrick> http://cl.ly/27142Z260M3w1F1y3q12
<pdtpatrick> but now i'd like for testing purposes to have it put something /etc/<dirname>/filename
<pdtpatrick> i don't know how to accomplish that
<soren> pdtpatrick: Yeah, what tumbleweed said ^
<pdtpatrick> tumbleweed: is there an example you can share please
<tumbleweed> pdtpatrick: "foo.cfg /etc" in debian/install
<pdtpatrick> and foo.cfg would be in debian/  right ?
<tumbleweed> no
<tumbleweed> I quote from the manpage: The name of the files (or directories) to install should be given relative to the current directory
<pdtpatrick> was just reading that. Thanks
<Laney> Packaging branch status: CURRENT
<Laney> is there anything sweeter?
<tumbleweed> debdiffs? :)
<Laney> i might agree with you, depending on how well bzr handles this merge
<Laney> (emacs23) :(
<Laney> although trying to bzr branch on crappy airport wifi â¦
 * Laney should get barry to do it as TIL :P
<broder> committer: Evan Broder <evan@caron.(null)> > uuuugh
<broder> i hate having to re-do this for every vcs
<broder> can i...do some sort of rebase to fix that?
<broder> tumbleweed: around to do a u-d-t review? (will timeout in a minute or so and open a mp)
 * Laney NFI
<tumbleweed> broder: in the bar
 * broder heads that way
<Laney> I assume you have an .$SHELLrc; you might want to make that set BZR_EMAIL
<broder> Laney: equally easy to run bzr whoami 'Evan Broder <evan@ebroder.net>'
<broder> there would be no difference if i actually had a sane dotfile management system
<Laney> equally easy to forget you mean? ;)
<Laney> I assume one dotfile you don't forget is that one
<broder> i don't really have any dotfile htat's on all my machines
<Laney> fair
 * Laney makes a mental note to digest http://vcs-home.branchable.com/ at some point
<Laney> 100mb to branch emacs23 so far ...
 * Laney reflects that this would have taken 33â hours on his first internet connection
<pdtpatrick> Question - i've got a setup like this: http://pastie.org/private/y6dsewj2lnbeamylrzg
<pdtpatrick> i would like the helloworld.py to get copied to /tmp on the filesystem when the .deb is installed
<pdtpatrick> however i seem to be doing it wrong
<pdtpatrick> I keep getting the following error after running "pbuilder create "
<pdtpatrick> http://pastie.org/pastes
<cody-somerville> pdtpatrick, You need to link to the specific paste.
<pdtpatrick> cody-somerville: http://pastie.org/3898537
<pdtpatrick> cody-somerville: here's a structure of my source
<pdtpatrick> http://pastie.org/private/y6dsewj2lnbeamylrzg
<cody-somerville> pdtpatrick, I need the full log including the command you executed.
<pdtpatrick> ok
<pdtpatrick> cody-somerville: http://pastie.org/private/hzuppi2mblgihjm27codfa
<pdtpatrick> cody-somerville: I'm using the default rules file.
<pdtpatrick> http://pastie.org/3898563
<pdtpatrick> well after some battles - finally figured it out by reading:
<pdtpatrick> http://static.debian-handbook.info/browse/stable/sect.becoming-package-maintainer.html#idp12507752
<PaoloRotolo> Hi all!
#ubuntu-motu 2012-05-13
<bobweaver> Hello there I was wondering if any one had any time and if they could help me with a lintian output here it is http://paste.ubuntu.com/984632/  I tried looking at http://lintian.ubuntuwire.org/precise/tags.html  maybe I missed them ?
<bobweaver> nm I have found them by googling each one
<tumbleweed> bobweaver: lintian-info --tags debhelper-but-no-misc-depends etc.
<bobweaver> Thanks tumbleweed  !
<tumbleweed> there's also a lintian option that makes it always show the full message
<tumbleweed> (-i)
<bobweaver> sweet thanks again.  I am almost getting to the point with the package that I started from scratch almost needs lintian checks.
<nigelb> Laney: I didn't notice you leave ~not-canonical until today. Congrats sir! :)
<tumbleweed> he kept it very quiet :)
<nigelb> tumbleweed: what team is he on?
<tumbleweed> desktop, part time
<nigelb> ah
<nigelb> nice
<vibhav> tumbleweed: You work for Canonical?
<vibhav> oops
<vibhav> Nevermind
<tumbleweed> vibhav: nope :)
<nigelb> tumbleweed: How was UDS being a local? :D
<tumbleweed> nigelb: I'm not a local, either. I live in ZA
<tumbleweed> but I am enjoying a nice trip to a part of the US I've never been to :)
<nigelb> tumbleweed: Ah draft. I confused you with broder I think :P
<tumbleweed> most likely, yeah he's local
<tumbleweed> broder: didn't see you at the closing party. Did you run away? :)
<nigelb> He proably decided he wants to use his ears again :P
<nigelb> UDS closing party is always so...tiring. It's more tiring than most of UDS :P
<tumbleweed> :)
<broder> tumbleweed: i was there for a bit, but decided that i needed to get home and catch up on sleep
 * vibhav is still waiting for other MOTUs to come back
 * tumbleweed was mostly outside for the first couple of hours, probably why I missed you
 * tumbleweed hopes I didn't break ajmitch in our whirlwind tour of SF today
<broder> nigelb: for the record, UDS as a local was cool, but if it's ever an option to you, DON'T try to commute to UDS from wherever you live. total mistake
<nigelb> broder: haha.
<broder> and with that, /me goes to continue trying to catch up on lost sleep
<Resistance> good luck on that, its hard to recover lost sleep
 * Resistance speaks from experience :)
<geser> Resistance: in case you didn't notice yet: boinc 7.0.27
<geser> is in quantal now
<jtaylor> why does clang depend on gcc-4.6 in quantal?
<geser> probably the DD didn't update it to build with gcc-4.7 yet
<geser> or because it didn't get updated yet in quantal
<eagles0513875> micahg: hey
<Resistance> geser:  i'm subscribed to the sync request, and the bug, thanks.
<Resistance> next step is to backport to Precise, but i'm busy backing up data off my 11.04 to put on my 12.04
 * Resistance finally replaced the drive and now has to spend six hours backing up the important data
<eagles0513875> Resistance: wanna help me with something or are you busy
<Resistance> in the middle of BugSquad stuff, can you wait 5 minutes?
<Resistance> eagles0513875:  still slightly busy, but what's up
<eagles0513875> just got my bug answered to an extent
<eagles0513875> in kubuntu devel
<Resistance> geser:  jtaylor:  either of you able to assist me with a BugSquad thing?
<Resistance> or any other MOTU or BugSquad person?
<Laney> #ubuntu-bugs
<Resistance> Laney:  i know that :P
<Laney> :-)
<Resistance> its already been brought up there
<Resistance> i need secondary opinions
<Resistance> and i havent seen many people chiming in
<Resistance> :P:
<Resistance> the question's regarding validity of a bug against a package
<Resistance> i'm just going to forward it to the BugSquad mailing list
<Resistance> Laney:  would a package synced into QUantal from Debian be published by now?
<Resistance> for Quantal
<Laney> Resistance: probably, unless it failed to build or something
<Laney> what is it?
<Resistance> boinc, in Universe
<Resistance> micahg confirmed it built in quantal prior to sync
 * Resistance wants to make sure its published in Quantal before requesting the backport to Precise
<Laney> boinc-client | 7.0.27+dfsg-3 | quantal/universe | amd64, armel, armhf, i386, powerpc
<Laney> looks ok
<Resistance> Laney:  the same package will need ubuntu-only changes
<Resistance> how do i propose those?
<Laney> just for the backport?
<Resistance> no, in Quantal as well
 * Resistance is double checking that this wasnt fixed upstream, as the bug linked to the sync request for boinc includes information that a specific patch breaks things
<Laney> well, request sponsorship in the normal way then
<Laney> and make sure it goes to Debian if appropriate
<Resistance> the patch works in Debian, the debian developer confirmed  that, it just causes crap in Ubuntu :P
<Resistance> refresh my memory about Ubuntu sponsorship again
<Laney> !sponsoring
 * Resistance hasn't had to get packages that have ubuntu only changes sponsored in a while
<Laney> no
<Laney> !sponsor
<Laney> no
<Laney> bah
<Laney> attach debdiff, subscribe ubuntu-sponsors
<Resistance> oh like it normally would be :p
<Resistance> i thought y ou meant upload a package for consideration :P
 * Resistance chuckles
<Resistance> the normal methodology then.  that makes life easier
<Laney> !sponsoring is For more information about the process for sponsoring uploads in Ubuntu, visit https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SponsorshipProcess
<Laney> I wonder if you can alias commands.
<Resistance> you can
<Resistance> syntax is: !factoid is <alias>command
<Laney> do it for me plz
<Resistance> !sponsor is <alias>sponsoring
<Resistance> <ubottu> Your edit request has been forwarded to #ubuntu-ops.  Thank you for your attention to detail
<Resistance> so now convince them to do it :P
<Resistance> Laney:  join #ubuntu-ops, tell them to approve "sponsoring"
<Resistance> because they won't approve the alias until your factoid is approved
<Resistance> (and you probably have a bigger say in things than I do)
<Resistance> Laney:  is there an easy way to remove a patch in a package with quilt?
<Resistance> the manpage isnt loading on my system
<Resistance> (probably because the manpage db on here is being updated by dpkg)
<Resistance> nevermind, i pulled the manpage from manpages.u.c
<bobweaver> hello there I have a question that I can not seem to find the correct answer. So As many of you know i am making a package that is a WHCP and for this I am using virtual box well too of them. one is for "clean install of ubuntu server" other is called "right after build server"    I build on well I am sure that you can guess which on I build on I then make a clone after build and try to install if something goes wrong I start all over a
<bobweaver> gain. Is there a better way to do this. I am sorry if there is a odd-ve-es  anwser too this I googled for a full day before I asked thanks for your time
<bobweaver> I have a built in repo in /usr/local/mydebs and a script that uses dpkg-scanpackage to add .debs
<bobweaver> Also if this is a question for a different channel I am super sorry plz just ask me to ask somewhere else and I will do that happily :)
<Resistance> i'd just recommend patience :)
<Resistance> it may take a while to get an answer :P
<bobweaver> Resistance,  patience is something that I have alot of thanks for the tips :)
<highvoltage> good morning
<Resistance> mornin'
<tumbleweed> highvoltage: you also slept in all morning? :)
<bobweaver> You guys are still in SF ? have you thought of going to santa cruz ? its only a hour away and worth the trip
<bobweaver> there is the boardwalk and all sorts of cool stuff it is a collage/server town well 8 years ago when I lived there
<bobweaver> college/surfer *
<ajmitch> tumbleweed: I'm only mostly broken, flight back wasn't a lot of fun :)
<tumbleweed> ajmitch: :/
<ajmitch> could have been worse, it was probably less than half full so I could move to an exit row by myself
<tumbleweed> nice
<ajmitch> yeah it was good being a bit less cramped
 * ajmitch is debating whether to just give up & sleep now
<lifeless> ajmitch: wh
<ajmitch> lifeless: thanks
#ubuntu-motu 2013-05-06
<dholbach> good morning
<iulian> Morning dholbach.
<dholbach> hey iulian
<sicness> Hi, guys! Pkg r8168-dkms has problem: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/r8168/+bug/1108068
<sicness> I want to try to fix it. I Applied patch, change changelog and have next errors:
<sicness> dpkg-source: warning: Version number suggests Ubuntu changes, but Maintainer: does not have Ubuntu address
<sicness> dpkg-source: warning: Version number suggests Ubuntu changes, but there is no XSBC-Original-Maintainer field
<sicness> Can anybody halp me? I'm making it first time :)
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1108068 in r8168 (Ubuntu) "r8168 fails to install in kernel 3.8.0-1 and 3.8.0-2 [error: expected â=â, â,â, â;â, âasmâ or â__attribute__â before ârtl8168_init_boardâ]" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<sicness> sorry for my English  )
<sicness> How should I help for fixing this bug?
<mitya57> sicness: if you are building locally, you can ignore that;
<mitya57> if you are going to upload that to ubuntu, run 'update-maintainer',
<mitya57> but it will be better to have it submitted to Debian
<sicness> If it will be submitted to Debian, when will it be in ubuntu repo?
<mitya57> yes
<mitya57> (immediately)
<sicness> Need to do something for it?
<mitya57> no, at this period of cycle
<mitya57> (if it was after DebianImportFreeze, you would need to file a sync request)
<sicness> ok. What I should to do?
<mitya57> You can file a bug in Debian manually (see http://www.debian.org/Bugs/Reporting) or use 'submittodebian' command from ubuntu-dev-tools package
<sicness> Thx, I'll read about submittodebian
<LeartS> Hi All. Newbie here: I'm trying to release my first bugfix for an Ubuntu package. I downloaded the source of the package with Baazar, created a branch, fixed the bug in the branch. I then tried to build the package in order to test if the bug was fixed, but got an error:
<LeartS> dpkg-source: info: you can integrate the local changes with dpkg-source --commit
<LeartS> ops, the error is: dpkg-source: error: aborting due to unexpected upstream changes
<ScottK> So run dpkg-source --commit
<LeartS> Do I have to run it every time? Shouldn't it be automatic? The Ubuntu packaging guide didn't mention it (http://developer.ubuntu.com/packaging/singlehtml/index.html#document-ubuntu-packaging-guide/fixing-a-bug)
<ScottK> Depends on the package and the packaging guide is by no means complete.
<tumbleweed> LeartS: it is mentioned in the packaging guide - see discussion of edit-patch and patch systems, in general
<bkerensa> why is submittodebian adding Ubuntu delta to branches I try and submit a patch to Debian with?
<jtaylor> has a compatibility header for pyconfig.h been added?
<jtaylor> why did we waste our time fixing the issues then ...
#ubuntu-motu 2013-05-07
<dholbach> good morning
<TheLordOfTime> anyone know how to fix this error on debuild -S?  make: dh_testdir: Command not found  (then an error 127 is thrown)
<Laney> install debhelper
<TheLordOfTime> ... that's  odd, i thought i had installed it...
<TheLordOfTime> ooh that's an interesting bug...
<TheLordOfTime> something uninstalled packaging-dev and the related packages o.O
<TheLordOfTime> is saucy open for sync requests from experimental yet?
<TheLordOfTime> s/experimental/debian unstable or debian experimental/
<maxb> I would take the channel topic as a "yes" to that
<TheLordOfTime> maxb:  but does "open for development" mean "open to sync requests"
<TheLordOfTime> :P
<TheLordOfTime> maxb:  half the time I ask things, its  usually for clarification
<TheLordOfTime> the other half it's legitimate
<maxb> Well, if it's open for general uploads, a sync request could be considered merely a special case of that
<TheLordOfTime> and 1% of the time of overlap is sometimes just ranting about something, but i save that for the ubuntuforums channel :P
<TheLordOfTime> maxb:  since its for universe i wanted to make sure there wasn't any kind of restriction on imports and syncs
<TheLordOfTime> and because... well...
<TheLordOfTime> i haven't exactly 100% tested the software in raring yet xD
 * TheLordOfTime blames VM problems
<TheLordOfTime> once i resolve my VM's problems, and test, i might request the sync hence the question :)
<c_korn> hello, trying to debootstrap raring-i386 on lucid there is an error with this command: "sudo debootstrap --variant=buildd --arch i386 raring /var/chroot/raring-i386 http://localhost:3142/ubuntu/" the last line it outputs is "I: Extracting libglib2.0-0..." and then it returns with error code 2.
<c_korn> just before the error strace reports a bad file descriptor. how can I find out what file that is? http://paste.ubuntu.com/5642717/
<c_korn> ok, upgraded to 12.04. fixed it.
<rostam> Hi I have a problem compiling a kernel module on Ubuntu, is this a right forum to ask question?
#ubuntu-motu 2013-05-08
<dholbach> good morning
<sicness> What is "whitespace" ?
<tumbleweed> bdrung: erm, so we sohuld backport the new distro-info-data
<Laney> SRU?
<tumbleweed> yes
<Laney> that thing
<tumbleweed> any objection to just SRUing a straight backport?
<bdrung> tumbleweed: yes and probably do another upload before (please have a look at my commits whether they are sane)
<tumbleweed> (it's less work)
<tumbleweed> oh, did I screw itup? :)
<bdrung> partially :)
<tumbleweed> wheezy was released on the 5th, not the 4th
<bdrung> the release notes have a different date
<tumbleweed> there's a date in the release notes?
<bdrung> $ debian-distro-info -t
<bdrung> experimental
<bdrung> http://www.debian.org/releases/stable/ says Debian 7.0 was released May 4th, 2013
<bdrung> and http://www.debian.org/News/2013/20130504 says "May 4th, 2013" at the top
<tumbleweed> lol
<tumbleweed> anyway I don't care about that too much
<tumbleweed> the testing thing is a bigger issue, though
<bdrung> i'll do an upload if that's okay to you
<tumbleweed> fine
<tumbleweed> can you request an upload into stable-updates?
<bdrung> tumbleweed: which procedure to i need to follow for that?
<tumbleweed> bdrung: actually, no idea. We should ask
<bdrung> tumbleweed: am i allowed to offload this work to you?
<tumbleweed> sure, I started it
<tumbleweed> um, so SRUing a straight backport?
<bdrung> what do you mean with "SRUing a straight backport"
<tumbleweed> I mean using backport style versions and a full changelog, rather than applying a patch to a bunch of releases
<tumbleweed> bdrung: FYI: from #debian-release: 09:48 < ansgar> tumbleweed: Same as into proposed-updates + mention stable-updates in the pu bug.
<bdrung> i prefer the latter, but it's up to you (if the latter is too time consuming)
<bdrung> tumbleweed: and the procedure? just upload the package isn't sufficient, right?
<tumbleweed> for p-u, one requests permission to upload before uploading
<tumbleweed> via a bug
<bdrung> bug against?
<tumbleweed> release.debian.org
<bdrung> okay, thanks for the info
<tumbleweed> anyway, why is it giving the wrong output for --testing?
<bdrung> tumbleweed: because you forgot to adjust "created" for jessie
<bdrung> http://anonscm.debian.org/gitweb/?p=collab-maint/distro-info-data.git;a=commitdiff;h=9b66417193f2e73c180f644a73fa14d7e8bf388f;hp=20d03b1bd2b589c0e432b829f9661be6dc2bf633
<tumbleweed> oh, duh
<bdrung> tumbleweed: hurry with the SRU, because oneiric will EOL tomorrow ;)
<tumbleweed> pff
<tumbleweed> I skipped oneiric in the last round of distro-info-data SRUs
<TheLordOfTime> where do i ping regarding a sync request for saucy for universe?
<TheLordOfTime> or do i just let it sit for a while?
<jtaylor> autosyncs are running
<jtaylor> so you should not need to request a sync
<mitya57> unless your package is in experimental
<jtaylor> right, but then its better to ask the maintainer to put it in unstable
<jtaylor> we generally don't want stuff that is intentionally in experimental
<Unit193> http://packages.qa.debian.org/s/screen.html I take it the RFH is blocking?  (https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/screen)
<mitya57> we have ubuntu delta
<jtaylor> oh right, I forgot about these :O
<Unit193> Ah, thanks.
 * mitya57 is right now uploading mathjax to unstable, that should make jtaylor happy
<jtaylor> I did say intentionally in experimental
<jtaylor> we do want stuff that is in exp because unstable is sort of frozen
<mitya57> that should anyway make you happy :)
<jtaylor> ipython should work with both, so I'm ambivalent :p
<mitya57> in 2.1 I've splitted png package out so libjs-mathjax is just 10 mb instead of 18
<jtaylor> nice
<TheLordOfTime> jtaylor:  it's *in* unstable
<TheLordOfTime> jtaylor:  if it's autosync
<TheLordOfTime> 'd, when's the next autosync
<TheLordOfTime> ... stupid keyboard...
<mitya57> TheLordOfTime: which package?
<TheLordOfTime> mitya57:  nginx, in universe
<TheLordOfTime> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nginx/+bug/1177919 if you want to burn the bug.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1177919 in nginx (Ubuntu) "Sync nginx 1.4.1-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,New]
<jtaylor> with delta it needs manual sync
<jtaylor> it will happen soon
<mitya57> TheLordOfTime: someone filed bug 1177919, was that you?
<ubottu> bug 1177919 in nginx (Ubuntu) "Sync nginx 1.4.1-1 (universe) from Debian unstable (main)" [Wishlist,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1177919
 * TheLordOfTime points at his name on the bug
 * mitya57 is stupid
<TheLordOfTime> mitya57:  yeah, it was, because i wasn't sure autosyncs had started
<mitya57> TheLordOfTime: why "Add ubuntu branding to server_tokens." should be dropped?
<TheLordOfTime> mitya57:  that's a question you should ask upstream, the main reason for the sync request is to *add* in additional highly-demanded features that've already been implemented and only recently included in unstable
<mitya57> TheLordOfTime: why not merge then?
<TheLordOfTime> mitya57:  if i had my ways, i'd try and merge the two
<TheLordOfTime> but i don't have the skills for that
<TheLordOfTime> unless there's a nifty requestmerge tool
<TheLordOfTime> in which case someone else would have to do the merging.  i don't have the packaging skills to merge.
 * mitya57 has to go sleep today, but will probably try tomorrow
<jtaylor> not having the skills to merge is no reason to do a sync
<mitya57> can you please unsubscribe sponsors and assign /me?
<jtaylor> only request a sync if the delta can really be dropped
<TheLordOfTime> jtaylor:  then explain requesting a merge?
<jtaylor> ask the person who did it last
<TheLordOfTime> jtaylor:  there needs to be MUCH better documentation on where to request merges, how to request merges, etc.  i was unaware there was a significant delta, also
<jtaylor> why does nginx need ubuntu branding oO
<jtaylor> especially as its universe
<TheLordOfTime> that's what i'm curious to now as well
<TheLordOfTime> it really DOESN'T need ubuntu branding
<mitya57> TheLordOfTime: http://developer.ubuntu.com/packaging/html/udd-merging.html
<TheLordOfTime> since it's a universe-maintained package
<TheLordOfTime> mitya57:  standby i'll remove/subscribe you
<TheLordOfTime> or do you want me to assing it to you
<TheLordOfTime> WORK, KEYBOARD!
 * TheLordOfTime is not pleased about this keyboard breaking
<mitya57> subscribing should be enough
<TheLordOfTime> mitya57:  what's your LP
<jtaylor> the merge does not look difficult
 * TheLordOfTime facedesks
<TheLordOfTime> nevermind
<jtaylor> can you please ensure that the branding is the only thing that can't be dropped
<jtaylor> or can, asl zul
<jtaylor> ask
<mitya57> probably branding is needed for "Nginx/1.4 (Ubuntu) Server at example.com Port 80"-like strings
<TheLordOfTime> mitya57:  i've subscribed you and unsubscribed sponsors
<mitya57> I see, thanks
<TheLordOfTime> it would help if zul is online, jtaylor
<jtaylor> write an email
 * TheLordOfTime can't email effectively from a mobile wifi connection
<TheLordOfTime> * TheLordOfTime can't email effectively from a mobile wifi connection
<TheLordOfTime> (gmail LAGS)
 * mitya57 waves good night
<TheLordOfTime> jtaylor:  after fighting with my mobile wifi, i got an email to zul
 * TheLordOfTime sits down and waits for a response
<LeartS> Hi guys! 2 days ago i was asking here why my command "bzr builddeb -S" was failing on a branch of a project of which i was trying to fix a bug (dpkg-source lamenting of upstream changes). Now, having read a lot more, I understand (tell me if I'm wrong) that 'bzr builddeb' uses dpkg-source, which raises an error when there are differences from the upstream source not addressed by a patch in debian patch
<jtaylor> yes
<ScottK> sometimes
<LeartS> Am I right until here? - So, i proceeded to write my changes on a patch file in two ways: using 'dpkg-source --commit' and 'bzr diff > bugfix.patch' and then importing the patch with 'quilt import bugfix.patch'
<jtaylor> no
<jtaylor> dpkg-source --commit does not commit to the version control
<jtaylor> first thing is if you use bzr-buildpackage and then get this error this probably means you committed a change to the upstream source in your bzr
<LeartS> Yes
<LeartS> I mean, I edited a source file of the upstream project (not a packaging-related file) to fix the bug
<jtaylor> I don't know the canonical way in bzr to create patches
<jtaylor> does edit-patch work with bzr?
<jtaylor> but you should not commit directly your changes
<jtaylor> in the main branch at least
<jtaylor> a yes it works somewhat
<jtaylor> possibly the simplest way is to run edit-patch <patch-name> from your source
<jtaylor> then you can edit the files directly
<jtaylor> then logout with ctrl+d
<jtaylor> it will create a quilt patch and changelog
<jtaylor> which you then commit to bzr
<jtaylor> you should first revert your previous direct commits to bzr (or convert them to patches with bzr diff -r... and import them with quilt and commit that)
<LeartS> Oh. I tought edit-patch wouldn't let me changes files "normally" so I avoided it!
<LeartS> I thought I had to write directly in diff syntax, lol
<LeartS> Thanks for the help. But right now I'm trying to try to build a bugfix branch created by another person (that i branched from his launchpad), so the upstream changes are already made, not in patch form
<jtaylor> there is possibly a direct way to do it, but I don't know it
<LeartS> but "directly committed", if I understand what you mean by it
<jtaylor> what you can do is create diffs with bzr diff of that branch and import these with quilt
<jtaylor> in git you would do e.g. git format-patch base-commit..branch-head-commit
<LeartS> Yeah, I did that. and the error about upstream changes went away
<jtaylor> and get a bunch of patches you can import
<LeartS> but another error came up:
<LeartS> dpkg-source: error: cannot read gnome-screenshot-3.6.1.orig.8S4BV4/debian/patches/bugfix.patch
<LeartS> bugfix.patch is the generated patch
<jtaylor> did you add the patch to bzr?
<jtaylor> for new files you have to do bzr add ...
<jtaylor> then commit
<jtaylor> see bzr status for untracked files
<LeartS> No I didn't, I think that was the problem (so stupid :( ). One (I hope last) problem: the patch file created using bzr diff uses relative paths, that do not work with quilt (I imagine Because when importing quilt moves it to debian/patches)
<LeartS> well, turns out dpkg-source creates a valid patch. I finally managed to build the source package!
<LeartS> (I meant 'dpkg-source --commit')
<jtaylor> not sure what kind of patches bzr creates
<jtaylor> you need -p1 type patches
<LeartS> there is a flag -p1 for the diff command of baazar
<LeartS> I'll try to use that
<jtaylor> I don't think its exactly the same, but similar
<jtaylor> -p1 type is the -p flag of patch
<jtaylor> -p1 is: <ignored>/patch/to/changed/file
<jtaylor> -p0 would be path/to/changed/file
<LeartS> 'bzr help diff | grep p1' says: "bzr diff -p1" is equivalent to "bzr diff --prefix old/:new/", and
<LeartS>   produces patches suitable for "patch -p1".
<jtaylor> oh ok
<LeartS> jtaylor: thanks for your help. you're amazing :)
<jtaylor> np, I'm offline now
#ubuntu-motu 2013-05-09
<TheLordOfTime> wow, i'm a tad confused.. the lshw source seems to build both universe *and* main packages, unless I'm missing something... but just to make sure I'm not hallucinating, the lshw-gtk package, part of the lshw source package, is a Universe package and not a main package, so it's maintained by the community instead of the developers right?
<micahg> TheLordOfTime: if it's to be fixed, yes
<micahg> TheLordOfTime: the source is in main though
<micahg> source in main, binary in universe means no official support for the binary
<TheLordOfTime> micahg:  so then bugs which are about the lshw-gtk package would be repaired by the community and basically left to rot by the devs unless it affects the lshw package in main
<TheLordOfTime> right?
<micahg> not necessarily left to rot, but you're free to fix them if you like :)
<TheLordOfTime> that's what i thought
<TheLordOfTime> mind answering the person in -bugs then?
<micahg> you're free to fix stuff in main too if you want,
<TheLordOfTime> you can explain it's a universe package and not maintained by the devs. :P
<TheLordOfTime> micahg:  indeed, i'm asking because of a question in -bugs that threw me for a loop xD
 * TheLordOfTime was a tad confused by the question, hence asking here
<micahg> TheLordOfTime: not maintained is a misnomer, Canonical provides support for stuff in main for a period of time
<TheLordOfTime> micahg:  you can explain it better
<micahg> the support can be of varying degrees
<micahg> not everything in main is actively maintained
<micahg> TheLordOfTime: you have a UTC time on the question?
<TheLordOfTime> micahg:  yeah, active discussion
<TheLordOfTime> ~20 minutes ago
<TheLordOfTime> to now
<ScottK> TheLordOfTime: Universe means not maintained by Canonical.  There's plenty of developers that aren't Canonical.  Ubuntu != Canonical.
<micahg> ScottK: universe means not officially supported by Canonical, there's no implication about maintenance even for stuff in main
<ScottK> Right.
<ScottK> "it's a universe package and not maintained by the devs" is just plain wrong though.
<micahg> right
<mitya57> TheLordOfTime: I've a couple of nginx questions for you
<mitya57> * the debian/conf/sites-available/default changes don't look like ubuntu-specific, did you submit those to debian?
<mitya57> * do we really need ubuntu branding? :)
<mitya57> it's basically about
<mitya57> -#define NGINX_VERSION      "1.2.6"
<mitya57> +#define NGINX_VERSION      "1.2.6 (Ubuntu)"
<ScottK> Personally, I think such changes are ridiculous.
<TheLordOfTime> mitya57:  to my knowledge I didn't submit those...
<TheLordOfTime> but...
 * TheLordOfTime digs around in the bugs list
<mitya57> ok, I'll submit the s/ipv6_only/ipv6only/ change to bts (the only relevant bit in debian/conf/sites-available/default), and then we'll be to just sync the new version
<TheLordOfTime> hang on a sec
<TheLordOfTime> will ya?
<TheLordOfTime> rather than just saying "OK"...
<TheLordOfTime> i think i sawa bug that needed those changes
 * TheLordOfTime double checks
<mitya57> looks like the history was:
<mitya57> - we added ipv6_only
<mitya57> - we fixed it to be ipv6only
<mitya57> - debian added wrong ipv6_only
<TheLordOfTime> ignoring the history
<TheLordOfTime> and reading the ACTIVE LP bugs
 * TheLordOfTime sighs
<TheLordOfTime> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nginx/+bug/1174158
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1174158 in nginx (Ubuntu) "Nginx fails to start on 13.04" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<TheLordOfTime> the "runfix" for that bug is the "ubuntu branding"
<TheLordOfTime> TBPH i don't like nginx-extras.
<TheLordOfTime> but i'll spare you my tirade of why i hate it because that requires swearing
<TheLordOfTime> mitya57:  i'm going to assume that zul didn't bother to mark it as "This fixes bug [blah]"
<TheLordOfTime> but 1.2.x is behind 1.4.x so they may have redone things that I'm not aware of.
 * TheLordOfTime yawns
<TheLordOfTime> but it's 02:22 here, and i'm tired, so i'm not going to be coherent much longer
<TheLordOfTime> mitya57:  i dropped zul an email, if the ubuntu branding is all that's changed as a runfix for 1174158 then that needs to stay
<TheLordOfTime> but... in tweaked form
<mitya57> ok, I'll add a bug reference and keep that for now
<TheLordOfTime> I.E. drop the changes as is, sync/update, then readd in the branding.  and possibly fix errors in the defaults.
<ScottK> TheLordOfTime: Or just drop the branding and count being able to sync as a win.
<TheLordOfTime> ScottK:  true.
<TheLordOfTime> ScottK:  until a regression of 1174158 shows up then I start banging my head on the keyboard
<TheLordOfTime> ... did I mention I hate the nginx-extras package?
<ScottK> The goal is to be in sync with Debian and silly things like adding Ubuntu to the version string are NOT a reason to diverge.
<ScottK> It might have come up.
<TheLordOfTime> (also agreed)
<TheLordOfTime> ScottK:  my goal is similar with the nginx stable PPA... ... which this discussion JUST reminded me I should triple check for regressions against...
<TheLordOfTime> ScottK:  keep it in line with Debian as much as I can
<TheLordOfTime> but... sometimes some minor changes had to be done to fix that for, say, Lucid, or for my own botched patchfixes.
<mitya57> TheLordOfTime: actually it seems that "runfix for bug 1174158" is removing the "(Ubuntu)" part
<ubottu> bug 1174158 in nginx (Ubuntu) "Nginx fails to start on 13.04" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1174158
<mitya57> (at least according to comment 5)
<TheLordOfTime> ... okay, i'm seriously off, before i pass out on my keyboard and end up with a reverse image of my keyboard keys on my face when i wake up.
<TheLordOfTime> mitya57:  oh duh, misread.
<TheLordOfTime> mitya57:  then wth is zul doing...
<TheLordOfTime> mitya57:  can you relay to zul that by adding in ubuntu branding they're CAUSING 1174158, and if we keep the branding they break everything?
<TheLordOfTime> not to mention asking them WHY we need ubuntu branding in nginx anyways, especially since universe?
<TheLordOfTime> ... okay, and now i'm off.
<TheLordOfTime> (messages will be logged)
<mitya57> zul is not here, and I agree that we should just drop that patch
<TheLordOfTime> ... oh and i should probably assign that bug to me and prep a fix for it tomorrow...
<ScottK> Yeah.  Just drop it.
<ScottK> Then prepare an SRU for 13.04.
<TheLordOfTime> that's the plan!
 * TheLordOfTime is assigning the bug to himself as we speak
 * mitya57 has pushed his merge to lp:~mitya57/ubuntu/saucy/nginx/1.4.1
<TheLordOfTime> done.  now... SLEEP TIME.
<TheLordOfTime> </off>
<dpm> Hi MOTUs, I'd like to get a package for a personal project into Universe. I've read https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuDevelopment/NewPackages#Going_through_MOTU and I've got a couple of questions if someone is around to give me a hand
<dpm> The first one being "When you start to work on a new package, assign the needs-packaging bug to yourself and set it In Progress (if there is no needs-packaging bug, file one" <- where do I file such a bug?
<dpm> my package is in a PPA, and I'm wondering how I can bring it to the MOTUs attention to get it reviewed and uploaded to the archive
<jtaylor> dpm: the preferred way to get it into the archive is over debian
<jtaylor> would it be useful in debian too?
<dpm> thanks jtaylor, indeed, I read the wiki. However, it has some Ubuntu-specific dependencies, but it will take me a while to remove them for Debian, so I thought in the meantime it would be useful to at least have it in Ubuntu
<dpm> and to answer the question, yes, I think it'd be useful in Debian as well, but as I say it requires some work
<dpm> brb
<Laney> dpm: File the bug on "Ubuntu"
<Laney> and you can just subscribe ubuntu-sponsors to the bug to get it looked at
<Laney> you should probably address the debian question up front though, so you don't have to answer it again
<dpm> ok, cool, thanks Laney
<dpm> another question: once it's in the archive, I'd like to backport it to at least Precise. Would that be possible? Is there anything else to bear in mind regarding backporting?
<Laney> should be easy but you'll have to backport to Q and R too, to maintain an upgrade path for users upgrading that way
<dpm> Laney, that should not be a problem, I'd prefer to have backports to all stable releases anyway
<dpm> well, P, Q, R
<Laney> cool
<dpm> Laney, hm, the +filebug package redirects to https://help.ubuntu.com/community/ReportingBugs - is there a better project I can file the bug against? Or I guess I can just file it against my app's project and then retarget to 'ubuntu'?
<dpm> sorry, I meant the lp.net/ubuntu/+filebug *page
<Laney> dpm: it should work if you append ?no-redirect to the filebug URL (that ReportingBugs page should say that somewhere, but it is a wall of text)
<Laney> or retargeting probably works too
<Laney> I swear the newpackages page used to have a link for that
 * Laney edits it
<dpm> ah, yeah, ?no-redirect did the trick, thanks!
<Laney> aha
<Laney> it does link in one place but not the other
<dpm> Laney, ok. Does bug 1178202 look ok?
<ubottu> bug 1178202 in Ubuntu "Request to include Qreator into Universe" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1178202
<Laney> dpm: Looks good - perhaps provide a direct link to the .dsc you want to be sponsored
<dpm> done, thanks Laney!
<Laney> np
<Laney> if you don't get any bites in a few days, ping me and I'll look
<dpm> excellent, thanks
<jtaylor> I noticed one of my packages was transitioned from guile 1.6 to guile 1.8
<jtaylor> there is also a guile 2.0
<jtaylor> someone know if I can just use that?
<jtaylor> hm news lists no backward incompatible things
<jtaylor> hm using 2.0 makes autoreconf fail, 1.8 it is
<TheLordOfTime> can someone approve Raring on https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nginx/+bug/1174158 so that we can set the Raring status separate from the Saucy status?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1174158 in nginx (Ubuntu) "Nginx fails to start on 13.04" [Medium,In progress]
<TheLordOfTime> mitya57's handling a merge that might fix the bug for Saucy.
<TheLordOfTime> but i'm SRUing a fix for Raring.
<jtaylor> did you get an answer why zul did this weird branding
 * mitya57 didn't
<jtaylor> the second time Ive seen zul screw something up with a pointless change ._.
<TheLordOfTime> jtaylor:  no answer whatsoever via email
<TheLordOfTime> might I recommend a reeducation in why you don't do pointless changes?
<TheLordOfTime> well, regardless (i typed without thinking! o.O) i'd like to get a debdiff up for it
<TheLordOfTime> but i'm curious whether this happens in Saucy
<TheLordOfTime> (and if it DOES, the bug needs to be handled separately for it, from Raring)
<mdeslaur> it's not pointless, it allows tracking market share, which is important
<TheLordOfTime> mdeslaur:  it also breaks nginx-extras
<mdeslaur> the fact that it's broken is unrelated to the fact that it's pointless or not
<TheLordOfTime> mdeslaur:  by adding ubuntu branding to the nginx software, it introduces bugs
<TheLordOfTime> mdeslaur:  jtaylor called it pointless, not me
 * TheLordOfTime was using their words
<TheLordOfTime> mdeslaur:  regardless, the fix is to drop the patch which introduced the branding, and I"ve got a debdiff ready for that for raring.
<jtaylor> mdeslaur: that should be stated in the changelog then
<mdeslaur> TheLordOfTime: that's not a proper fix
<jtaylor> its not obvious
<jtaylor> + actually tested ...
<mdeslaur> jtaylor: what's not obvious?
<TheLordOfTime> mdeslaur:  then state a proper fix
<jtaylor> not to anyone here
<mitya57> there can be no other fix for raring except just removing that patch
<TheLordOfTime> agreed with mitya57
<mdeslaur> that's nonsense
<jtaylor> if its important enough to use market share counter why is it not in main?
<jtaylor> universe can'T really provide good security support
<TheLordOfTime> if i remember right there was a discussion last UDS about whether it should be included in main
<TheLordOfTime> i don't remember what that discussion concluded though
<TheLordOfTime> s/last/in a previous/
<TheLordOfTime> given it's still in Universe i think the discussion of adding it to main went nowhere
<mdeslaur> TheLordOfTime: doesn't the fix stated in the bug work?
<TheLordOfTime> on which comment?
<TheLordOfTime> there's two fixes proposed
<TheLordOfTime> one in comment 5 and one in comment 7
<mdeslaur> #5 just reverts it, #7 fixes it properly
<mdeslaur> (has to be tested though)
<TheLordOfTime> mdeslaur:  i'll test-build in a PPA of mine, and then ask the bug to test it
<TheLordOfTime> if that fixes it, i'll debdiff #7's fix
<TheLordOfTime> if it does NOT fix it, then i'll be back here reaffirming dropping the branding patch is the fix
<TheLordOfTime> s/bug/people affected by the bug/
<TheLordOfTime> boy, i'm sucking at typing today...
<mitya57> if you want to push your "proper fix" to SRU, we first need to get that into saucy
<mitya57> (read: test the debdiff and point me to it so that I can update my branch)
<TheLordOfTime> mitya57:  if and only if it works will i dump the #7 debdiff onto  the bug (and you'll have access to it)
<TheLordOfTime> granted it'll be written for raring but...
 * TheLordOfTime yawns
<TheLordOfTime> first, coffee.
<TheLordOfTime> and regardless, can we get the Raring nomination approved?
<TheLordOfTime> since this needs fixing in two releases.
<TheLordOfTime> oop i missed the update
 * TheLordOfTime kicks his emial
<mitya57> maybe infinity can approve it
 * mitya57 facepalms
<jtaylor> hm got this mail: pyzmq_2.2.0.1-2_armhf.changes rejected
<jtaylor> Rejected:
<jtaylor> Server said:
<jtaylor> nothing more
<jtaylor> what does that mean?
<jtaylor> also why do I get a mail for that from ubuntu? I uploaded in debian
<jtaylor> hm https://launchpadlibrarian.net/139498554/upload_4564002_log.txt
<mitya57> looks like a failed sync
<mitya57> ah, I see that failure @ https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/pyzmq/2.2.0.1-2/+build/4564002
<jtaylor> I wonder if I just got the mail because I'm in motu or will every debian maintainer get that?
<mitya57> jtaylor: do you have a "retry" button there?
<jtaylor> (I was not subscribed to the package until now, so thats not it)
<jtaylor> mitya57: yes, I'll leave it for a bitmaybe someone wants to investigate
<mitya57> there were some cases where random DDs were receiving mails about Ubuntu failures (https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2013-January/036374.html)
<mitya57> but that should be fixed now
<jtaylor> the bug is still in progress
<jtaylor> its probably it, thx
#ubuntu-motu 2013-05-10
<quidnunc> Hey the package gpac is broken. I think the fix is simple (missing libraries) but I'm obviously doing something wrong. Can someone give me a hand?
<quidnunc> I think I should only need to set LD_LIBRARY_PATH before running MP4Client but that doesn't seem to wrk
<quidnunc> work*
#ubuntu-motu 2013-05-11
<sicness> Hi, guys! pkg in ubuntu r8168-dkms (8.035.00-1) has issue, which had fixed 7.05.2013  in debian afrter my bugreport and test patch on my PC. Url on new pkg http://packages.debian.org/ru/sid/r8168-dkms (8.035.00-2)
<sicness> Can I help somehow to update pkg for ubuntu? I need this updated pkg in ubuntu :)
<sicness> I can test it for ubuntu too.
<tumbleweed> sicness: https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/r8168 - 8.035.00-2 is already in Ubuntu
<tumbleweed> if you'd like to SRU that bugfix to raring, follow the SRU process
<tumbleweed> !sru | sicness
<ubottu> sicness: Stable Release Update information is at http://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates
<sicness> ok, thx, I'll read that
<jtaylor> LoganCloud: are you Logan Rosen?
<tumbleweed> AFAIK, yes
<jtaylor> if yes please update your launchpad profile :)
<jtaylor> and can you merge python-gevent? the -dbg package is broken, this is fixed in debian
<mitya57> jtaylor: thanks for geany :)
#ubuntu-motu 2013-05-12
<sicness> which pkg says 'The program '*' is currently not installed. You can install it by typing:' ?
<maxb> sicness: 'command-not-found'
<sicness> thx
<userr> lts here: chat clients disconnect (after a while) when i switch to another Xorg server (by using ctrl+alt+F8). how does the former Xorg server ("under ctrl+alt+F7") tell that i switched away from it? i need to suppress that.
<Nikratio> There's a data corruption bug in raring's S3QL package. I backported and uploaded a fix for the bug into Debian Wheezy. Can someone tell me how to get it into raring?
<Nikratio> https://bugs.launchpad.net/debian/+source/s3ql/+bug/1179281
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1179281 in s3ql (Ubuntu) "Data corruption with eglibc 2.17" [Undecided,New]
<jtaylor_> Nikratio: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/StableReleaseUpdates
<Nikratio> Thanks. I can't upload anything to -proposed in Ubuntu though (not an Ubuntu developer)
<jtaylor_> attach a debdiff to the bug and subscribe ubuntu-sponsors
<Nikratio> is it enough to attach a debdiff to the bug?
<Nikratio> :-)
<Nikratio> thanks!
<jtaylor_> but please fill out the bug according to the template in the wiki
<jtaylor> .
<TheLordOfTime> jtaylor:  careful with those dots, pacman might come for them :P
<jtaylor> just checking my nick, myirc client eats the message ._.
<TheLordOfTime> ah
<jtaylor> I could look in the console or the present list, but this is faster ;)
<Unit193> á§
<Unit193> á£ á£ á£   á§ * * * * * *
<TheLordOfTime> lol...
#ubuntu-motu 2014-05-05
<ScottK> dodobrain: As a rule, we suggest waiting until 14.04.1 is released.
<dodobrain> uumm.. ok. thanks. its not for a server, but my regular devel workstation
<dodobrain> when would the .1 release come out?
<ScottK> 3 months after the initial release (approximately)
<ScottK> Depends on how much breakage you're ready to deal with.
<ScottK> It should be mostly fine, but 12.04 -> 14.04 scenarios is one of the things we will focus on for 14.04.1.
<dodobrain> right.. i'll prolly do the upgrade on thursday evening then. cos friday is usually quiet and i also come early into the office.
<Logan_> rbasak: do you know if https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/blacs-mpi/1.1-31ubuntu1 is still necessary with this this release of blacs-mpi? http://packages.qa.debian.org/b/blacs-mpi/news/20140408T110007Z.html
<rbasak> Logan_: I'm not sure. Only way I can think of to check is to run ldd on the library without the patch to check.
<rbasak> Logan_: looks like I filed a Debian bug at the time though, and it's still open. https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=660214
<ubottu> Debian bug 660214 in blacs-mpi "libblacs-openmpi.so.1.1 is not built with correct dependency information" [Normal,Open]
<Logan_> ah, okay
<rbasak> I just linked the LP bug to it. Looks like I didn't do that originally - sorry
<Logan_> thanks :)
<Logan_> haha, no worries
<Logan_> I'll do some investigation
<rbasak> Thanks!
<rbasak> Logan_: AFAICS, it looks unlikely to have changed. Though a merge looks like a good idea anyway, and possibly awkward :-/
<Logan_> yeah, it appears that way to me as well
<vincent_c> Noskcaj: this is the last time I'll ping you before NMU-ing catfish to fix #746251
<dholbach> good morning
<jincreator> Hi, I'm trying to make LP: 1310017 and LP: 1251193 go on SRU. Can anyone see and give me advice?
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1310017 in freetype (Ubuntu) "freetype 2.5.x broke rendering of the default Korean font" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1310017
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1251193 in unity (Ubuntu) "Language issue from the unity lense screen" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1251193
<geser> are those bugs fixed in utopic (14.10) already?
<jincreator> As far as I knnow, not yet.
<jincreator> LP: 1310017's upstream is target for freetype 2.54 which is not yet released.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1310017 in freetype (Ubuntu) "freetype 2.5.x broke rendering of the default Korean font" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1310017
<jincreator> LP: 1251193 is not yet merged into Unity.
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1251193 in unity (Ubuntu) "Language issue from the unity lense screen" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1251193
<geser> as utopic doesn't differ much from trusty yet, you can probably apply the same fix you want to SRU on the utopic package too
<geser> so you don't need to wait for the proper fix to appear in utopic
<jincreator> geser: Umm...I mean I want to fix this problem also in trusty.
<jincreator> Or you mean should I land patch in utopic first and go on SUR?
<jincreator> SRU
<geser> yes
<geser> utopic needs to get fixed too before a SRU (so a fix doesn't get lost again in the next Ubuntu release)
<jincreator> Ok, I'll try it.
<jincreator> Oh, and about unity, it seems "bzr branch ubuntu:trusty/unity" is not working. Is unity managed different from other packages?
<geser> usually those branches should be up-to-date unless the package importer stumbles about bugs/problems (which seems to be the case for unity). I don't know where the Unity team has their current branches.
<jincreator> Ok, thanks.
<taihsiang> 201003-5427
<taihsiang> 201004-5570
<taihsiang> 201010-6646   kaxing
<taihsiang> sorry wrong channel
#ubuntu-motu 2014-05-06
<dholbach> good morning
#ubuntu-motu 2014-05-07
<dholbach> good morning
#ubuntu-motu 2014-05-08
<dholbach> good morning
<Laney> hallo
#ubuntu-motu 2014-05-09
<dholbach> good morning
#ubuntu-motu 2014-05-10
<Rhonda> erm, wtf?  bug #1318168
<ubottu> bug 1318168 in ejabberd (Ubuntu) "su: Failed to create session: No such file or directory" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1318168
<Rhonda> Anyone able to explain to me what this has to do with ejabberd, I am missing the context.  :)
<Zhenech> both are packages in ubuntu?
 * Rhonda creates some autoreject script for Zhenech
<Rhonda> Zhenech: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1NvgLkuEtkA  :P
<Zhenech> :x
#ubuntu-motu 2014-05-11
<oO0Oo> Hi; i'm trying to install mplayer2 from motumedia's PPA but it is faild to build; Is it going to do a successful build? or ?
<teward> oO0Oo, the ppa maintainers will have to go through the build failure logs and adaptively change the source to fix the build problems, otherwise, it's not possible to say if it will or won't build
<oO0Oo> teward: I googled & it seems the only PPA is motu's PPA that is 70 days inactive on that! so I wanted to know they are working on that or not!
<teward> oO0Oo, have you looked at the parent team?  https://launchpad.net/~motumedia
<teward> this looks like the Debian Multimedia Maintainers are in charge, but just an observation :0
<teward> i would say you're welcome to wait and see if someone in here can answer.
<teward> but based on the 78 weeks date on update, I'm going to assume 'no' on the question.
<teward> (note i'm not a MOTU nor a member of the team, but still)
<oO0Oo> teward: oh! thanks. I tought this is their channel!! thanks anyway!
<teward> this is the MOTU channel, but... again, all my statements are assumptions
<teward> oO0Oo, typically whne I see a PPA that hasn't had an update in well over a year, I'd say you might be staring at a no-longer-updated thing...
<oO0Oo> teward: you're right. thank you very much
#ubuntu-motu 2015-05-04
<dholbach> good morning
#ubuntu-motu 2015-05-05
<Unit193> barry: Since you were the last uploader, would you consider http://paste.openstack.org/show/yep7EhGfMTj1RNIpMPaH/ for bzr-fastimport?
#ubuntu-motu 2015-05-06
<teward> hey stupid question, but how can I get my sbuild on 14.04 to know about 'wily'?
<micahg> teward: symlink wily to gutsy in /usr/share/debootstrap/scripts/
<reversiblean> what if a package does not have a patchsystem used? And no /debian/patch folder. Can I use Quilt then?
<barry> Unit193: i'll think about it ;)  should that patch get into bzr upstream?  (not sure anyone actually *is* bzr upstream any more ;)
<teward> micahg: "Unable to determine distribution, please provide --distro"  <-- even with the symlink :/
<teward> fixed that now
<Unit193> barry: That's actually a plugin, and yeah it seems a bit slower.  Bit of a bummer, still useful for converting repos (except when you get phantom files.)  Thanks for taking a look.
<AndyDavis> Is there any way that I can set something in in d/changelog  for the version so it appends the distro name to it ?  example  foo (0.0.1-2$dist) UNRELEASED; urgency=medium  where dist would be ubuntu.  I am building with sbuild
<barry> Unit193: yeah.  i'm doing a lot of conversions these days :)
<Unit193> barry: Did you try a git reset && git status?  Several repos I've tried tend to have leftovers because of one of those bugs.  And yeah, you like the new LP git feature too :D
<barry> Unit193: interesting.  i did notice that after conversion i had to git add a bunch of stuff that seemed not to be added automatically.  is this bug responsible for that?
<Unit193> If you git reset  then I would guess it is.  Check if those files exist in the bzr repos.
<barry> oh, they definitely exist
<Unit193> Right, so testcase, do a quick and dirty  bzr branch lp:ubuntu-bots && cd ubuntu-bots && git init && bzr fast-export --plain --rewrite-tag-names | git fast-import && git reset && git status   before and after the package.
#ubuntu-motu 2015-05-07
<AndyDavis> Is there any way that I can set something in in d/changelog  for the version so it appends the distro name to it ?  example  foo (0.0.1-2$dist) UNRELEASED; urgency=medium  where dist would be ubuntu.  I am building with sbuild
<AndyDavis> where $dist would be some  sorta variable
<AndyDavis> ahh ha ! --append-to-version="foo"
<Unit193> barry: Get a chance for a closer look? :P
<barry> Unit193: no, sorry, uos
<Unit193> Ah right, have fun with that.  As long as it's on someones mind, I'm happy. :)
<barry> Unit193: it's in a browser tab, which i guess is better than buried in my inbox :)
<Unit193> barry: Anything else I can do to help, btw?
<barry> Unit193: has the patch been vetted by any bzr developers?
<Unit193> barry: Not that I know of, pinged jelmer a bit back with no luck.  https://code.launchpad.net/~unit193/bzr-fastimport/deletion-fixes/+merge/258178
#ubuntu-motu 2015-05-08
<dholbach> good morning
#ubuntu-motu 2015-05-09
<Unit193> Howdy.  Any MOTU around for a dvdstyler sponsorship?
<AndyDavis> Hello there is there anything that you know of that scans directorys looking for packages ?
<AndyDavis> source folder that is
<Logan> AndyDavis: I'm not sure I understand your question
<AndyDavis> Logan, So I am setting up a auto build network that use to use sbuild tool set.  It still does.,  But I am not "hip" with postgre and wanna build . so I am making my own with a front end that uses websockets.
<AndyDavis> So I am at the point where I need to scan a dir,  or make a deamon or use some lib like QFileSystemWatcher
<AndyDavis> but wanted to see if there was anything out there already
<AndyDavis> Logan, http://i.imgur.com/rCm7yRF.png
<AndyDavis> See the Build button in the nav on the left ?
<AndyDavis> that is where I need to scan a dir or make a list or database
<AndyDavis> so that I can get back the list.
<AndyDavis> Kinda happy with websocets.  makes it fun to open source schroots and install or maintain ect
<AndyDavis> So all in all I am asking if there is a tool out there (besides wanna build) That can be used on a dir to see if there is packages in it ?
#ubuntu-motu 2016-05-10
<sidi> Is there a document somewhere that describes the security checks done on packages in the Ubuntu repositories? And specifically, is there any difference in how main and community packages are checked/validated?
<rbasak> sidi: try asking in #ubuntu-hardened. You may want to expand on what you mean by "security checks".
<sidi> rbasak, thanks will ask there.
<sidi> rbasak, i'm doing studies with Ubuntu users, part of which covers their perceptions of security and where they deem it safe to download software
<sidi> i want to know if any forms of security check / process is in place to ensure that packages on main / universe are deemed secure and/or safe
<sidi> whether testing, static analysis, dynamic analysis, refusing packages with known vulns, verifying the identity of developers and using third-party assessments to ensure that the developers' products are not malicious, etc.
<persia> sidi: Be prepared for a lack of clear answers there: many of the packages in Ubuntu are derived unchanged (and unchecked) from Debian, many of which are code-identical to upstream.
 * persia is not authoritative on security practices in Ubuntu
<sidi> persia, i sort of expect that, yes :-)
#ubuntu-motu 2016-05-13
 * Laney discovers an ancient Rhonda backport in the queue
<Rhonda> Oo
<Rhonda> Wait what.
 * Rhonda eyes Laney
<Unit193> Logan: FWIW, when the new apt-file is merged, as it stands it'll either support Ubuntu repos or external repos due to the weirdness of Ubuntu ones.
<Unit193> barry: Pokepoke.  Know what I'm going to ask? :D
<barry> Unit193: oh hai.  you know warsaw's second law right?
<Unit193> Hah.
<Unit193> barry: What if I say I've been using it since Apr 29th? :P
 * Unit193 will poke later.
<barry> Unit193: awesome.  ping me monday
#ubuntu-motu 2016-05-14
<Logan> Unit193: yeah, I've been talking to the Debian maintainer about it
<amisha> hi! i want to start contributing to ubuntu-gnome. i am currently using fedora 23
<amisha> can someone help how should i start with it
<bdrung> how often does britney run?
 * Elbrus is preparing an SRU for xenial. Should I use xenial-proposed in the changelog or plain xenial?
<Laney> Either works, xenial is more usual these days
<Elbrus> Laney: thanks
<teward> I personally still use xenial-proposed in my SRUs, but that's just me - as Laney said, they both work :)
#ubuntu-motu 2017-05-08
<s1aden> hi
<sladen> hi
<Laney> hi
<Unit193> Howdy.
<chatter29> hey guys
<chatter29> allah is doing
<chatter29> sun is not doing allah is doing
<chatter29> to accept Islam say that i bear witness that there is no deity worthy of worship except Allah and Muhammad peace be upon him is his slave and messenger
#ubuntu-motu 2018-05-09
<tsimonq2> Unit193: Mind if I take that irssi merge?
<Unit193> Define "take"?
<tsimonq2> Do the merge.
<Unit193> I mean, it's already done and has been for a while...
<tsimonq2> I mean, merging 1.0.7-1 from Sid.
<Unit193> https://launchpad.net/~unit193/+archive/ubuntu/staging/+sourcepub/8845089/+listing-archive-extra ?
<tsimonq2> Oh, awesome.
<tsimonq2> Nevermind then, thanks. :)
<Unit193> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/irssi/+bug/1754781 links to it..
<ubottu> Launchpad bug 1754781 in irssi (Ubuntu) "Please merge the latest bug release, 1.0.7-1, from Debian" [Undecided,New]
<tsimonq2> Ah.
<Unit193> Though at this point, I'd just wait for 1.1.1
<tsimonq2> How long will that be?
<Unit193> Whenever Rhonda picks it up.
<tsimonq2> Ah.
<Unit193> (I've been using it since Feb 16th though.)
<tsimonq2> Cool.
<Rhonda> hmm
<Rhonda> But 1.0.7 should go in regardless because of the fixes, or are they all in 1.0.5-1ubuntu5 already?
<Rhonda> irssi | 1.0.5-1ubuntu5    | cosmic
<Unit193> Cosmic just opened, but yeah it's pending anyway.
<Unit193> BUt yeah, CVE fixes are in.
#ubuntu-motu 2018-05-10
<bigon> are you aware of the fact that you have twice the same code? https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/rng-tools https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/rng-tools5
#ubuntu-motu 2018-05-13
<Unit193> tsimonq2: Plz2sync gvpe once it's picked up. >_>
<tsimonq2> Unit193: ack
#ubuntu-motu 2019-05-10
<Unit193> Adri2000: Howdy!  First off, thanks for maintaining filezilla.  Have you considered using wxgtk-gtk3?
