#ubuntu-marketing 2006-07-24
<nixternal> bimberi: i need the australian loco website theme for drupal ;)   i need it for http://chi.ubuntu-us.org  so i want it to look like ubuntu ;)
<bimberi> nixternal: the site is run by Fujitsu so he should be able to help out
<nixternal> ya, i know i missed his ping earlier..and now he isn't online
<bimberi> ah, sorry i don't have any access to it
<adamant1988> hello all
<gaz00> hi adamant1988
<adamant1988> how's everyone today?
<Kamping_Kaiser> hows it going all?
* Kamping_Kaiser has been a bit quiet recently
<Kamping_Kaiser> nixternal, fujitsu is online
<adamant1988> hello all
<Kamping_Kaiser> hey
<adamant1988> how's everyone this morning?
<Kamping_Kaiser> looking at bed :(
<adamant1988> I just woke up
<adamant1988> I have to work
<Kamping_Kaiser> i have a tafe intro thing tomorrow, so i /have/ to be awake and tehre by 10... i'm usualy in bed at 10 still :|
<Kamping_Kaiser> *next week* i have to be there by 9... :|
<adamant1988> well... there is a wonderful caffeine drink called 'bawls'.
<adamant1988> that should make waking up easy
<Kamping_Kaiser> never heard of it
<adamant1988> look it up
<adamant1988> it has so much caffeine that it has a warning label, and grips on the botle.
<adamant1988> bottle.
<Kamping_Kaiser> lol
<adamant1988> i'm telling you it's wonderful for late night study sessions or late running install parties :)
<adamant1988> I'm thinking about ordering a case of it for my LUGs first meeting this year
<Kamping_Kaiser> hehe
* Kamping_Kaiser doesnt do caffine
* adamant1988 was an avid coffee drinker at age 2
<Kamping_Kaiser> hehehe
<adamant1988> man I'm going to sleep for another 15 minutes
<adamant1988> I'll be back.
<Kamping_Kaiser> later
<adamant1988> i'm back
<Kamping_Kaiser> wb
<adamant1988> I feel a lot better
<adamant1988> 15 minute naps are wonderful
<Kamping_Kaiser> :)
<Kamping_Kaiser> problem is  i dont wake up :\
<adamant1988> get a screaming meanie alarm
<adamant1988> I guarantee that you and most of your neighbors WILL get up
<Kamping_Kaiser> hehe
<Kamping_Kaiser> a slogan to sleep on - does your os dial home? ubuntu wont :)
<ormiret> when is the next meeting?
<ormiret> (the wiki is out of date)
<ormiret> (and the minutes now(now that I have gottenthem to download) say the 21st)
#ubuntu-marketing 2006-07-25
<matthewrevell> morning all
<matthewrevell> Burgwork: how do corey?
<Burgwork> not bad, tired
<Burgwork> jenda: we have a spread ubuntu, it is called the fridge
<bbrazil> Burgwork: jenda's not around for the next 3 weeks
<Burgwork> bbrazil, hmm
#ubuntu-marketing 2006-07-26
<matthewrevell> Hey guys - is there a Fridge irc channel?
<ormiret> haven't heard of one
<matthewrevell> ormiret: cheers
<mdke> matthewrevell: it's a world!!
<mdke> what looks like the moustache is australia, surely
<matthewrevell> mdke: Really? Oh!
<matthewrevell> mdke: BTW - I wasn't the one that suggested it looked like Hitler :)
<mdke> yes, I know. He's got a point though
<matthewrevell> I don't actually remember what the emblem was before, but I think that globe possibly has too little contrast to be, well, emblematic at 16x16
<bimberi> LOL - i won't be able to look at the icon in the same way again
<bimberi> matthewrevell: it's from this - http://art.ubuntu.com/backgrounds/ubuntu/54
<MenZa> When did we get an art section o_O?
<mdke> MenZa: about a year ago?
<MenZa> wtf.
<MenZa> And I haven't seen it?
<MenZa> :\
<mdke> you mean art.ubuntu.com?
<matthewrevell> bimberi: Now in that version it loojs more like ESR :)
<mdke> haha
<MenZa> Yeeees, mdke.
<bimberi> matthewrevell: stop it, you're killing me! ;-p
<matthewrevell> Guys, has there been a resolution to the "selling stickers" debate? I don't want to jump into an old thread, if it's all been sorted out :)
<bimberi> matthewrevell: Not imo.
<matthewrevell> bimberi: Right, thanks.
<bimberi> matthewrevell: i agree with those that have said that https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MarketingTeam/Shipping seems like a solicitation
<bimberi> however unintended
<matthewrevell> bimberi: Yeah, it's a tricky one and a lesson for how we should proceed with the team.
<matthewrevell> Action's great, but things like that shouldn't be done unilaterally, with an after the event ML post.
<matthewrevell> It's a case of being seen to do the right thing, I think.
<mdke> quite right
<bimberi> I don't agree that "selling Ubuntu branded items by folks who are engaged in the community is a bad idea".  It needs to be at arms length.  The question is whether (and how) to disclose.
<bimberi> ref: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-marketing/2006-July/000619.html
<mdke> the real point is that the team is not well organised or well run enough at the moment to start thinking about dealing with a budget
<matthewrevell> bimberi: The problem also comes when one person decides on a commercial venture, then promotes it through the marketing pages of the wiki.
<matthewrevell> Jenda's primary concern may not be profit, but it still looks like a commercial venute.
<matthewrevell> If we decided, as a team, that it was a good idea, and we had the infrastructure to handle it, then it wouldn't be a problem, IMO.
<matthewrevell> Look at the way the doc team handle printed docs at cost through lulu.com
* mdke nods vigorously
<bimberi> Yes there can be team initiatives.  But I'm more than happy for jenda-or-whoever to undertake their own commercial venture and for them to keep any profits.  Just keep it low-key.  But how low-key?  Again, whether (and how) to disclose.
<bimberi> fwiw ;)
<Madpilot> low-key enough that it's not being promoted from the wiki, and from a sub-page off the main MT page...
<matthewrevell> I've no problem in Jenda doing whatever he likes in his own name and with his own resources.
<matthewrevell> Provided he has permission to use trademarks....
<bimberi> oh yes! (re: trademarks)
<matthewrevell> We're a team. Okay, we're currently a loose team.
<matthewrevell> But we need to behave like a team.
<matthewrevell> Not like a bunch of people doing random things under a loose banner.
<bimberi> right, yes, that has been said a lot.  Can we take lessons from other teams on how they became "tighter" then?
<matthewrevell> bimberi: I hope so. We have mdke and other people from well established teams who are subscribed to the list. mdke helpfully jumps in from time to time :)
<matthewrevell> bimberi: We appear to be going through the motions - meetings, Launchpad, etc - we just need everyone to sign up to the way of working.
* mdke jumps
<bimberi> matthewrevell: processes and procedures?
<matthewrevell> bimberi: We don't wanna get bogged down but it'd be nice to feel that we were working towards the same level of, ugh, professionalism (dirty word in some circles)
<bimberi> hehe, not to me :)
<bimberi> they (Ps & Ps) are things the docteam has that the marketing team doesn't
<matthewrevell> hey adam
<adamant1988> hello matthewrevell :)
<adamant1988> matthewrevell: you are somewhat in charge of the marketing team no?
<matthewrevell> adamant1988: Not at all, no.
<matthewrevell> adamant1988: There isn't really anyone in charge
<matthewrevell> I just had a loud mouth :)
<matthewrevell> s/had/have
<adamant1988> oh, but you are in an administrative position on the launchpad, yes?
<matthewrevell> Oh yeah, I'm an admin on Launchpad for the marketing team
<adamant1988> ok, that's where I was going with that...
<matthewrevell> How can I help? :)
<adamant1988> I was thinking to myself today... what is holding us back, what is holding linux back, and what can we do to best destroy or side-step these barriers...
<matthewrevell> Big questions, but good to think about!
<adamant1988> It occured to me, though.
<adamant1988> How can you advertise Ubuntu, to a world that knows so very little about Linux.
<matthewrevell> Well, you could ask the question of whether the world needs to know about Linux to find out about Ubuntu.
<matthewrevell> Perhaps it's better to think of the ways ubuntu can help people
<adamant1988> No, they don't need to know it to find out about Ubuntu.
<matthewrevell> e.g. no viruses
<adamant1988> But, do they need to know about it to understand why Ubuntu is good?
<adamant1988> They go on the main site and read 'Ubuntu- Linux for human beings"  instantly they get into thoughts of command lines and all kinds of difficulty, or they just get confused.
<adamant1988> I think that if Ubuntu isn't going to try be "less linux more ubuntu" we need to tell people about linux too.
<mdke> I don't think so.
<matthewrevell> It's an interesting point.
<mdke> my parents recently went onto the main site
<adamant1988> mdke, you just made my next point for me.
<mdke> their response was that it couldn't be a serious project because it sounded like it was "hippy" stuff
<matthewrevell> Personally, I think we need to talk about the benefits of Ubuntu, to the average computer user, rather than  confuse the issue with talk of Linux.
<adamant1988> you just said "my parents"
<matthewrevell> mdke: Really? Interesting.
<mdke> all the talk of freedom and such
<mdke> yep
<adamant1988> You've made another point that I've been trying to push
<adamant1988> Linux, and more to the point, Ubuntu adoption will not be made through conventional channels
<matthewrevell> mdke: My issue with the Ubuntu.com home page is that it's not clear enough and still looks too much like a project, rather than non-community members can trust.
<adamant1988> I think person to person, in contanct with one another, is the best way to spread Ubuntu
<adamant1988> It's a slower advertising method, but it works.
<matthewrevell> adamant1988: That's the beauty, it's not advertising.
<matthewrevell> adamant1988: One to one advocacy is immensely important to Ubuntu.
<adamant1988> I agree, the problem is that the loco teams are just kind of told to wing it.
<matthewrevell> adamant1988: People trust people they know, whereas they apply a great deal more cynicism to advertising
<adamant1988> the loco teams could be amazingly effective.
<matthewrevell> adamant1988: Well, it'd be great if we, the marketing team, could build up resources to support the loco teams. If we draw on what has worked for the loco teams and then help share it with others, that should help.
<adamant1988> I think that the marketing team should do what it can to help give some structure and guidelines and such with the loco teams etc....
<adamant1988> also, some kind of aid...
<adamant1988> marketing kits, and so forth.
<mdke> right, there has been some good work done by locoteams that the marketing team could latch onto and support/spread
<matthewrevell> Absolutely.
<mdke> the australian team is a good example
<adamant1988> I just wish that Ubuntu's business model weren't so dead.
<matthewrevell> adamant1988: In what way?
<adamant1988> the whole 0 cost for everything kind of sucks.
<matthewrevell> Pretty big statement. What do you mean?
<adamant1988> if I want to order Ubuntu in boxes with as many CD's as I like to take to a show, I shouldn't have to worry about Shipit downsizing an order that was made too small in the first place.
<matthewrevell> So, you'd rather have the option to pay towards the cost of the CDs?
<adamant1988> or if I just flat out want to order some posters, flyers, premade documentations, etc. I should be able to...
<adamant1988> I'm saying if I can get them faster and get the number I actually need, I would pay for it, yes.
<matthewrevell> Right.
<adamant1988> and I would also like to help keep the people packaging those CD's in a position to have a job.
<matthewrevell> There are ways to float ideas up to the Community Council.
<mdke> what do you mean by "have a job"?
<mdke> and who are you talking about?
<adamant1988> I mean get paid.
<mdke> who doesn't get paid?
<adamant1988> Mr.Shuttleworth is an amazing person for doing what he's doing, but he's spending a lot of money lately, if there are no returns he won't be able to keep doing that.
<silbs> adamant1988: you can buy larger quantities of CDs. write to marilize@canonical.com, cost is EUR 1 / CD, payment in advance.
<mdke> don't worry about him. He'll have a business model in mind
<adamant1988> another thing that I *Think* ubuntu should do is a second install CD that you pay for...
<mdke> ah, that's cool. silbs, is that integrated with shipit already?
<adamant1988> I recently popped a Linspire disk into my laptop just to play around with it.
<matthewrevell> adamant1988: What do you mean by a second install CD? Something to avoid having to download from online repositories?
<adamant1988> I was amazed, my wireless JUST WORKED, mp3 support, etc. Just worked.
<adamant1988> Something for people who can't get to those repos, and something LEGAL for people in the US
<silbs> mdke: not yet.  Although there is no reason why there shouldn't be a notice about it on the site. I'll ask someone to add that if it's not there already.
<matthewrevell> adamant1988: There's a philosophical difference between the two distros, though.
<mdke> silbs: good idea.
<adamant1988> I know, but does the mean that Ubuntu should downright refuse to meet a need that a lot of people have?
<adamant1988> I want to legally have everything just work in Ubuntu, I don't care to pay for that... and everyone would find that the only people who would mind paying for it are people who can't.  Either they don't have a CC or they don't have any money... in which case they're welcome to the completely free version.
<silbs> adamant1988: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/node/412 are dvds with more s/w from the repos. Ships int he US
<matthewrevell> adamant1988: Mark S said in a talk, at the weekend, that Ubuntu makes it as easy as possible for people to add the non-free stuff. However, the free software aspect of Ubuntu is fundamental.
<silbs> not proprietary stuff though, just free s/w from our repos
<matthewrevell> adamant1988: The beauty of free software is that you can choose between different providers.
<adamant1988> so then the problem is not just spreading Ubuntu anymore.
<matthewrevell> adamant1988: However, you can get all your stuff working fairly easily in Ubuntu. It's a compromise that Mark feels is important.
<adamant1988> It's telling people that they can't legally watch their DVD's and that their mp3 collections won't work legally, etc.
<matthewrevell> adamant1988: Fluendo have, I believe, recently licensed mp3 and DVD technology for free of charge use by the community. So, it's not a legal issue, AFAIK.
<matthewrevell> But yes, I take the point that it's a stumbling block.
<adamant1988> I knew about the mp3, but DVD?
<matthewrevell> adamant1988: I may be wrong on the DVD thing...
<matthewrevell> It's true that the average home computer user expects everything to just work. Ubuntu makes it as easy as possible, while remaining true to its purpose.
<matthewrevell> adamant1988: I'd suggest focusing on the great stuff about Ubuntu, when telling other people about it.
<mdke> right. there's no point trying to fool the users that something works, when it doesn't
<mdke> Ubuntu doesn't make any apologies for its free software policies
<adamant1988> Oh I know that, I'm just saying it makes ubuntu a harder sell to home users.
<mdke> we have to work with what we have, and hope that the foot in the door increases enough for the rest to follow
<adamant1988> especcially when they get the feeling that "the government" could bust through their door because they're using libdvdcss
<matthewrevell> Yeah, true, Linspire and the forthcoming Freepsire compromise on the issue of MP3 etc. But Ubuntu is streets ahead of either *spire in other ways
<matthewrevell> Community, package repositories, interface, etc.
<adamant1988> Yeah, Ubuntu is much more up to date, yes.  But Linspire has it's merits... CNR, hardware detection, and excellent installer.
<adamant1988> the Ubuntu community however, is amazing
<matthewrevell> Ubuntu's hardware detection has always been good for me and the installer with Dapper is, IMO, better than what I remember of the Linspire 5.0 installer
<mdke> potentially something which makes dvd playback available legally would be a good thing. But the right way to approach it isn't to release a separate cd of Ubuntu at a price, it is to make software for Ubuntu which allows users to purchase support for their free Ubuntu
<adamant1988> Yeah, I wouldn't be against having a desktop icon that told me I could buy mp3 support, DVD playback, and other things.
* ormiret remebers talk of CNR being made to work on ubuntu
<mdke> well, mp3 support is free already
<ormiret> did that ever get further than talk?
<adamant1988> Yeah, CNR would be great for ubuntu
<adamant1988> I would pay for it in a second.
<mdke> ormiret: just talk I think
<matthewrevell> adamant1988: Thankfully, CNR is now free software, and Linspire is a .deb based distro, so I'm sure it could be ported without any need for cash to change hands.
<matthewrevell> Back to your original point, though
<matthewrevell> If you believe in what Ubuntu is trying to achieve and that it's the best option for someone else, focus on the positives.
<matthewrevell> Other issues, such as MP3 playback, can be resolved.
<adamant1988> Oh I believe in the free software thing, but I believe in usability first =\
<mdke> well, mp3s should be fine for edgy
<matthewrevell> Then you need to decide which is more important. I believe Ubuntu is very usable, moreso than most Linuxes. If you go for Linspire, you'll have to sell the $50 annual CNR fee and $50 upfront cost. If you go for Mac OS, you don't have any real usability problems, but it isn't free software.
<matthewrevell> mdke: cool
<mdke> if you want to investigate whether it would be possible to write some software to provide dvd support to Ubuntu at a modest price, I think it would be successful
<adamant1988> yeah, they're doing great with multimedia in edgy
<mdke> but it's a reasonable sized project
<ormiret> mdke: and a huge legal issue as well as code
<adamant1988> the biggest thing would be paying for the right to use libdvdcss legally
<mdke> ormiret: well no, because you'd be buying the right to use the software, and the vendor would arrange the legal permission
<adamant1988> if mark could just secure powerDVD for Ubuntu, we'd be set
<ormiret> mdke: ok, thought you meant making the software to play DVDs
<mdke> ormiret: yes, that's exactly what I meant.
<ormiret> mdke: then you're going to need contracts with the patent holders for the CSS stuff
<adamant1988> or we could just get power DVD for Ubuntu :P
<ormiret> which is not something that a small company can get
<mdke> ormiret: yes, the person making the software would arrange that, of course. as adamant1988, powerDVD for Ubuntu, or some other similar program
<adamant1988> I guess that my main problem with it is that stuff like works "out of the box" in every other operating system, save for most of linux.
<mdke> dvd support doesn't work out of the box with Windows either
<mdke> you need to buy it
<mdke> (for example, by buying power dvd)
<adamant1988> Ubuntu should require very little configuration, actually, next to none when you install it
<ormiret> it does on a lot of machines, but its added by the vendor
<matthewrevell> adamant1988: Like I say, focus on the positives. Think of no more spyware, no viruses, etc. Compare that to the trivial matter of setting up one or two things as a one-off
<adamant1988> Oh, I know how to keep on the positives of a project, I'm just noting some things that could make life easier for everyone
<ormiret> when we get vendors selling ubuntu machines this kind of issue goes away :)
<adamant1988> unless they're like system76
<adamant1988> system76 won't install anything past nvidia drivers as far as I know...
<matthewrevell> adamant1988: Yeah, but Ubuntu will only ship with free software, so unfortunately what you're asking for isn't going to happen, as far as I can see. So, you have to work around it.
<adamant1988> I know, but the community counterbalances that I suppose
<mdke> a vendor might ship Ubuntu with dvd support, if there was an easy way for the vendor to buy that support
<adamant1988> that's one thing that's keeping me from recommending Linspire... if something goes wrong in Linspire the user would have to ask the very limited number of people in the linspire forums.
<ormiret> are there any legal dvd players for linux?
<adamant1988> yes ormiret
<adamant1988> Linspire has one and PowerDVD is another
<matthewrevell> adamant1988: to be fair to Linspire, I thought their forums were pretty active
<adamant1988> they are, but they're nothing compared to Ubuntu's
<matthewrevell> right
<matthewrevell> I see
<adamant1988> I can honestly tell people when they start using ubuntu, that they have picked the most "living" operating system of any of them
<adamant1988> from the soft human colors, to the easy access community of thousands... not to mention that Ubuntu's community spreads ubuntu.  People join the community and instantly it's like they want to help out however they can...  You get all this talent doing things tohelp, for free.
<adamant1988> So back to the point, Loco teams will be the most effective way to spread ubuntu, in my opinion
<adamant1988> no website or anything is going to have NEAR the amount of effectiveness that a person on person marketing would have.
<ormiret> adamant1988: agreed, what we need to do is help them (pooling material and "what works" info etc)
<ormiret> (which I think was said a while back)
<adamant1988> and with Ubuntu's rediculous 6 month release cycle... it's going to evolve into something more user friendly drastically fast
<matthewrevell> yeah, we need to be a support function for the rest fo the community
<adamant1988> I wish that they did the repos a little differently though
<adamant1988> I don't like that the repos "get frozen" and nothing new is added...
<adamant1988> but the edgy repos will have a ton of new crap I'm sure
<ormiret> adamant1988: you mean after release?
<adamant1988> yeah
<ormiret> there is backports if you want new stuff
<adamant1988> does that add new programs as well? not just updated ones?
<ormiret> but the risk of breakage every time something is added makes it unfeasible for a released distro
<adamant1988> I didn't know that... I wonder how Linspire works that out =\
<adamant1988> I remember in the CNR thread that was something that Keving Carmony was saying a LOT was that new stuff was added every day
<ormiret> do linspire release new stuff continuously?
<adamant1988> yeah, they proud the fact that they're always adding new crap to the CNR warehouse
<adamant1988> pride*
<ormiret> adding new stuff that you can download if you decide too isn't too bad, but releasing updates continuously will prevent use in a production system
<ormiret> then you want to test all updates yourself first (and you can't realistically do that every day)
<adamant1988> yeah, I think they work that out with a test warehouse
<ormiret> trying to support a continuously moving target isn't much fun either :)
<adamant1988> lol yeah
<adamant1988> life is so fricking complicated lol
<ormiret> :)
<adamant1988> hello all
<gaz00> hiya adamant1988
<adamant1988> You know I was thinking to myself because I was bored... Ubuntu has no real target market does it?
<Burgwork> the world?
<adamant1988> I don't even think that's the target market.
<adamant1988> It occurs to me that all the changes to Ubuntu are made because there is a demand present inside the community that supports it... Ubuntu doesn't sell itself to a target market, it just meets the needs of it's community... it's actually brillian
<adamant1988> brilliant...
<adamant1988> and as that community grows, more and more peoples needs are met, and slowly but surely the needs of almost everyone are met.
<adamant1988> I just can't believe that didn't occur to me earlier... -_-
<gaz00> heh... ubuntu's odd like that
<gaz00> but they only appeal to the common denominator - at the moment, anyone that's in a field that requirse any kind of specialization can't use it.
<gaz00> but given that the average home users use pretty much the same apps, it's golden.
<adamant1988> I think it's targeted to the home user, and at the same time isn't.
<gaz00> uhm
<gaz00> okay?
<adamant1988> It's targeted to the home user by how it's built... but the absolute refusal to use non-free software is kind of a stumbling block in the home user market
<adamant1988> so it's actually targeted to the home user who doesn't do anything multimedia related, I suppose...
<gaz00> heh... while at the same time providing a venue for that particular niche market to install such apps and codecs, without eliminating other groups as potential users.
<Kamping_Kaiser> but can also be installed on sun T[12] 000 machines ;)
<adamant1988> yeah, now if only it were legal we would be seet
<adamant1988> set
<adamant1988> Edgy is going a long way to fix that problem, as long as they make getting libdvdcss easy enough that I don't have to download any potentially unsafe scripts, I'll be happy
<Kamping_Kaiser> OMG
<Kamping_Kaiser> Etch is Debian 4.0!!
<Klaidas> SUre is!!
<Kamping_Kaiser> and due for release in December!
* Kamping_Kaiser zomg's
<Klaidas> yup :)
<Kamping_Kaiser> :)
* MenZa whacks Kamping_Kaiser with a sledgehammer
<MenZa> I felt like doing that.
<Kamping_Kaiser> i'll sell my soul to them if they manage to get it out in december ;0
* adamant1988 is excited too?
* Kamping_Kaiser bleeds on MenZa 
<MenZa> :D
<Kamping_Kaiser> :)
<adamant1988> LOL guys look at this http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/18840276/
<Kamping_Kaiser> heh
<adamant1988> I like this one
<adamant1988> http://www.deviantart.com/deviation/21314645/
<Kamping_Kaiser> nice :)
* Kamping_Kaiser saves to images
<Kamping_Kaiser> night all :)
<Kamping_Kaiser> see you soon
<sebpayne> hey matthewrevell :-D
<sebpayne> matthewrevell: should i join the Marketing team on launchpad
<matthewrevell> sebpayne: oi, you're too drunk to be here
<matthewrevell> :)
<matthewrevell> sebpayne: Sure, join that and the ubuntu-marketing mailing list
<sebpayne> matthewrevell: i'll write a note
<sebpayne> i cna't find freefox atm
<matthewrevell> use a legacy writing device
<matthewrevell> :)
<sebpayne> damn pens
* sebpayne leaves IRC to stop making a fool of himself!
<matthewrevell> Not making a fool of yourself :)
<matthewrevell> Anyway, I'm off to bed m'self.
<matthewrevell> nixternal: you in here this evening?
<nixternal> yes sir
<matthewrevell> :)
<nixternal> working on http://chi.ubuntu-us.org right now
<matthewrevell> Thanks for posting that to the list, I think it was better coming from you, as you were in the conversation
<nixternal> no problem. i am hoping there will be a meeting soon on everything with the fridge
<matthewrevell> cool - I think the best thing is just to start getting stuff up there and see where it leads
<matthewrevell> Otherwise it could become yet another thing where people talk endlessly and in vague terms about what they think is required
<matthewrevell> :)
<nixternal> exactly
<matthewrevell> There's a lot of that on the marketing ML
<nixternal> well, after conversations with sabdfl, hopefully it will take off
<matthewrevell> yeah, you had a chat with him about it?
<nixternal> heh, sounds like marketing ;)
<nixternal> well, via email that everyone seen im sure
<matthewrevell> oh right, yeah.
<matthewrevell> TBH getting the Fridge going is gonna be easy. Building on it'll take a bit more work, but it'll be fun :)
<nixternal> i understand your frustrations here as well with this team. on a good note with marketing, ubuntu chicago has a meeting tomorrow night, where we are planning on handing out a couple hundred more cds
<matthewrevell> Cool :)
<nixternal> without a doubt on that one
<Burgwork> I am excited about hte fridge
<matthewrevell> I have more time now, so plan to stir things up a bit :)
<Burgwork> I think it can bring together the magazine and SU teams
<nixternal> good deal. friday i go on vacation, but will be around to catch up a little at night
<nixternal> between 0300UTC and 0600 UTC maybe
<matthewrevell> Burgwork: I hope so. it concerns me that people are pursuing vanity projects, to some extent.
<matthewrevell> Maybe that's harsh.
<nixternal> heh
<matthewrevell> but it feels that way
<Burgwork> I wouldn't say that
<nixternal> i know what you mean ;)
<Burgwork> I would say that they have failed to consider the larger picture
<matthewrevell> Burgwork: Well, maybe it's an organisational thing.
<nixternal> so far i see nothing but words, i have seen no action, and when i start action it usually leads nowhere
<Burgwork> it is
<Burgwork> hence why the fridge is so important
<Burgwork> creates something for these people to start
<matthewrevell> Absolutely.
<matthewrevell> Or more for people to become involved in. starting things is hard, getting into someting that's already there is somewhat easier
<matthewrevell> Anyway, I gotta get to bed. catch you guys tomorrow
<nixternal> they can definitely provide information, but if im not mistaken, all admins/editors will be Ubuntu Members... i hope this doesn't create a wall, one that has been somewhat visible in the past
<nixternal> g'nite matthewrevell
<matthewrevell> g'nite :)
<Burgwork> nixternal, ubuntu membership is not exactly onerous
<nixternal> well, from the past couple of CCs, it seems that is kind of changing..you need good backing and a good track record
<Burgwork> still not hard
<nixternal> no not at all
<nixternal> as long as you can show contributions, you are usually good to go
<nixternal> having a couple people behind you helps as well
#ubuntu-marketing 2006-07-27
<adamant1988> hello all
<ormiret> morning
<Madpilot> ah, the unified branding thing has surfaced on the mailing list...
<Burgundavia> which one?
<Madpilot> that wiki page
<Madpilot> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UnifiedUbuntuBranding
<Burgundavia> but which mailing list
<Madpilot> the marketing team ML
* Burgundavia gets out the LART
<bimberi> be gentle
<Burgundavia> I think I was
<bimberi> grr - my email redirection is slow (yet again)  *heads to the archives*
<Burgundavia> I basically told him we would gain nothing and lose lots
<nixternal> ARG!!!
<nixternal> it wouldn't be
<nixternal> Ubuntu > Linux > Gnome
<nixternal> Linux then Ubuntu then Gnome, even if it was acceptable
<nixternal> and even then it doesn't work
<Burgundavia> regardless of minor things like that, it still won't work on the grand scale
<nixternal> you know, he really does mean well, but I think there needs to be some FOSS reviewing on his side
<nixternal> he is a real marketer as well I believe, and is pretty intelligent.
<Burgundavia> ah
<Burgundavia> that is why it is so well laid out
* bimberi decides to actually read the whole thing
<nixternal> ya Burgundavia, he knows what he is doing with the legalities i guess you could say
<bimberi> i stopped at the 'Hector Quintero Story' before
<Burgundavia> I can produce well polished turds too
<Madpilot> Burgundavia, you're in sales, it's how you make your living :)
<Burgundavia> heh
<nixternal> hahaha
<nixternal> i haven't figured out just how to polish them yet
<nixternal> but when i do!!!
<bimberi> yes, he has missed the Canonical aspect
<bimberi> hm, neither ubuntu.com or the CD cover mention Canonical (except in the fine print)
<Madpilot> that's the only place it needs to be mentioned
<bimberi> but "Canonical --> Ubuntu" ????
<Burgundavia> yes, for the people who matter
<Burgundavia> companies
<Burgundavia> that is the only reason I could even see why we would rebrand
<nixternal> Linux Kernel + Community + Gnome -> Ubuntu
<nixternal> Ubuntu + Community + KDE -> Kubuntu
<nixternal> and so on
<nixternal> actually
<bimberi> yet somehow it _is_ the press's perception as you said Burgundavia
<nixternal> Debian + Community + Ubuntu Philosophy + Gnome = Ubuntu ;)
<bimberi> + CoC !!!
<nixternal> Ubuntuhaha
<nixternal> i was just going there
<nixternal> Ubuntu + Kubuntu + Edubuntu + Xubuntu + CoC + Community + Philosopgy = rm -rf /world
<bimberi> it's the press's perception because Mark Shuttleworth is the story
<bimberi> so it's
<bimberi> Mark Shuttleworth -> Ubuntu
<Burgundavia> right, Mark, who has Kubuntu on the desktop he never uses
<Burgundavia> funny how the last part of the story always gets forgotten
<nixternal> hmm
<bimberi> i'm yet to experience a story i know about being correctly reported in the media
<Madpilot> someone pinged me just before I dropped off - was that here?
<bimberi> nope
<Burgundavia> nope
<adamant1988> hello all
<gaz00> lol
<gaz00> seems like every time that i open this window, you're saying "hi" adamant1988
<adamant1988> well, you know how it is
<adamant1988> someone has to talk in this channel
<gaz00> how, you and i saying "hi" all day long?
<gaz00> Done.  Filler it is!
<gaz00> how's that shop thing coming along?
<adamant1988> It's slowly but surely coming along
<adamant1988> I'm trying to determine if I want to go for distro agnostic, or if I want to do ubuntu only.
<gaz00> wouldn't ubuntu only be easier?
<adamant1988> most likely, but the thought crosses my mind... I might apply for a business license for it...
<gaz00> hrm..   sounds like a lot still has to be planned out
<adamant1988> There is a lot to be planned out.
<adamant1988> I'm constructing a business plan... I'm hoping that I can turn this center/shop into a viable business.
<adamant1988> Take a cue from wal-mart... if you want to make people see something, make it visible... PHYSICALLY visible.
<gaz00> so what exactly would you be selling?
<adamant1988> by offering a service that other computer users need, using either Windows or Linux, I can get their attention.
<adamant1988> So probably hardware, custom built computers tailor made to the users needs.
<gaz00> ahh...    i'd be interested to see the deal that you end up working out with the shopowners
<adamant1988> currently I have 60 square feet
<gaz00> especially if you're after prime space
<gaz00> not bad at all
<adamant1988> But it's show room space, and it's free.
<adamant1988> if the center does well, I will be allowed to rent out a 75x50' show room that's attached to the building for a couple hundred a month.
<adamant1988> but, I won't be allowed to rent out the room until I get a business license.
<gaz00> makes sense...
<adamant1988> yeah...
<adamant1988> my goal is to spread linux the way it needs to be spread..
<adamant1988> My issue is, do I back just Ubuntu? or do I back multiple distros?
<gaz00> i'm thinking aobut an article that i read about how mark is still trying to recoup his investment and wondering how he was planning on doing it
<gaz00> well -  the easiest answer is to back what you know to start.   It does you no good if someone walks in and has a question, but you can't answer it.
<adamant1988> there are 3 distros that I know fairly well.
<adamant1988> Ubuntu, SLED 10, and Linspire 5.
<gaz00> then start with those
<adamant1988> I don't think I'll branch past those, to be honest...
<adamant1988> I might offer a service where I'll download and install any distro the user wants, but I will only officially support a combo of those three.
<gaz00> that's still a big bite...3 separate distros can be very different (note:  i'm not familiar with SLED nor linspire)
<adamant1988> Linspire..., If it weren't for being completely out-dated Linspire could be very big for the linux desktop
<gaz00> the way that ubuntu's been going lately, imho, it still makes sense to cover the biggest distro first and focus on that.
<adamant1988> SLED 10 is the best for businesses, I don't doubt.
<adamant1988> But Ubuntu... ubuntu comes "crippled" out of the box as a full OS.
<adamant1988> That's my issue with Ubuntu... Ubuntu does everything BUT multimedia support, great.
<gaz00> maybe i'm just trying to be too simplistic, but wouldn't what you just said make the most sense?   ditch linspire - worry about what it is and not what it CAN be...   promote SLED for business and Ubuntu for other situations
<adamant1988> Although I believe Ubuntu would benefit from CNR type technology (which is now open source) I don't think it's necessary because Ubuntu has the next easiest app install.
<gaz00> or make one big install script that loads MM support all at once
<adamant1988> Well, I've got time, and the next Linspire is supposedly releasing 4th quarter this year.
<adamant1988> I think I'm going to have to see what happens in the linux landscape this year.
<adamant1988> I expect Ubuntu will always be much more technologically up to date than Linspire can or will be. just because of the difference in release cycles.
<gaz00> heh.   when do you get the floorspace?
<adamant1988> the floor space is open all year, I can move in whenever I want.
<gaz00> i would imagine that ubuntu has a bigger dev following as well, which will add even more to ubuntu
<gaz00> oh
<gaz00> that's a pretty sweet deal that you have set up there
<Burgundavia> adamant1988: exactly what does CNR offer over GAI
<adamant1988> Yeah, but I need for this center to make some serious ground.
<adamant1988> Burgundavia, The main thing that it does is it allows you to see if that package is worth downloading.
<Burgundavia> via what method?
<adamant1988> it lets you read user reviews etc.
<adamant1988> It shows you screen shots, gives you data on getting support for that package, etc.
<adamant1988> ALSO the AISLES feature
<adamant1988> Aisles allow you to download a group of program all at once, with one click, and install them...
<adamant1988> so if you get a new computer and you want to set it up like your old one was... it only takes one click.
<gaz00> that includes setup, or just a list of programs?
<adamant1988> setup and everything it downloads and installs them all.
<gaz00> that is quite interesting...   never heard about that before
<adamant1988> not to mention another thing
<adamant1988> Click-N-Buy
<adamant1988> You can buy commercial applications through CNR as well... just one click.
<adamant1988> Crossover, Cedega, Win4Lin, several CAD programs, etc.
<adamant1988> and you can sort the information by user rating, etc.
<adamant1988> you can view the basic CNR repo on the linspire site... it looks out of date, but actually if you bother paying the $4 something a month it has more programs and they're more up to date.
<gaz00> hrm....  I'm not quite sure that I understand
<adamant1988> CNR is subscription based
<gaz00> $4.xx / month lets you browse for more up-to-date items which you can buy?   what does the $4 get you?
<adamant1988> custom aisles, and a crap load of extra's updates etc..
<adamant1988> the basic account can only have one custom aisle, but the gold account can have as many as it wants.
<adamant1988> gold accounts get MASSIVE discounts on commecial software
<adamant1988> I think you get like 30 dollars off of Crossover if you're using a Gold Account, etc.
<adamant1988> oh and then DVD playback only costs like $5 instead of $30.
<gaz00> it sounds like the costs add up though.
<adamant1988> They do, but it's all legal and easy as hell, that's the plus.
<adamant1988> It's certainly not the cheapest desktop linux, but it is hands down the easiest.
<adamant1988> no need to install mp3 and flash and all that, they're in it right out of the box.
<adamant1988> the biggest question for people is... would they pay for the convenience?
<gaz00> heh
<adamant1988> it has AMAZING hardware detection, wireless... right out of the box, etc.
<gaz00> i'm sure that many will and do, but it really does detract from one of linuxes biggest selling points in that it's free
<adamant1988> I agree with you
<adamant1988> Freespire fills in that gap actually...
<adamant1988> Freespire is supposedly "the distro about choice"
<adamant1988> there are two versions... one has mm installed by default, one has everything free in it.
<adamant1988> so no mm.
<adamant1988> CNR isn't "forced" like it is in Linspire 5.
<adamant1988> you can use apt if you want to.
* bimberi wonders if he's in #linspire-marketing ;-P
<gaz00> heh... you're going to spend your 60ft of spaces with charts detailing differences :p
<gaz00> bimberi, lol
<Burgundavia> honestly, there is nothing for the average consumer to be able to tell the difference
<adamant1988> Burgundavia, I would think the average consumer would see a massive difference between distros... the difference is that if I go the Ubuntu route, I am almost guaranteed that they will be back for help with getting multimedia, wireless, or video cards to work.
<Burgundavia> after they have purchased it maybe
<adamant1988> which may not be a bad thing at all, I could use that guaranteed return as an opportunity to sell more services.
<adamant1988> believe me I'm really weighing the pros and cons of each, I'll probably support all 3... each for a different scenario...
<gaz00> yeah, i'm still thinking that with how fast they change, you'll end up spending a lot of your time keeping up with all 3
<gaz00> but you seem ot know them pretty well, so it is up to you.
<adamant1988> I'm really adamant about Linspire actually being a good distro (in case you haven't noticed)... most people who like FOSS hate it on principle, but now that CNR is open sourced I don't see what grounds that argument has against it that wouldn't be against Mepis as well.   Just needs to be more up to date.
<adamant1988> Ubuntu is just awesome and the community is amazing
<adamant1988> that community is Ubuntu's largest selling point.
<gaz00> lol... yeah, you're not exactly too subtle about it ;)
<adamant1988> I never claimed to be.
<gaz00> actually, while you guys are here, I do have a question....
<adamant1988> I've always been very opinionated, it's a curse.
<gaz00> and a blessing...   opinions can be good or bad, but it's up to the audience to decide :)
<gaz00> the question:   what do you guys think that the best way of measuring Ubuntu usage would be?
<Madpilot> gaz00, traffic to the repos & various mirrors
<adamant1988> gaz00 look in the forums and you have a pretty decent idea, IMO.
<gaz00> Madpilot, is that information public?   and it wouldn't include CDs nor copies distributed between people directly
<Madpilot> no idea if it's public or not, but Canonical might be able to provide some figures from their main repos
<adamant1988> it goes against the ubuntu way to download ubuntu and start using it and not at least posting on the forums...
<Madpilot> there's 120,000+ registered users of ubuntuforums.org, but for sure there's lots more Ubuntu users than that, worldwide
<adamant1988> is that counting all the other national forums?
<Madpilot> no, that's only ubuntuforums.org
<adamant1988> ok, I don't know about the other national forums, but I'm fairly certain the community activity speaks for which people are actually using Ubuntu.
<gaz00> hrm...  personally, of the ubuntu users that I know, none of them are active in the forums.
<adamant1988> it's the exact opposite for me =\
<gaz00> you sound like you're surrounded by technically minded people though
<Madpilot> gaz00, I know a number of Ubuntu users who either don't use or actually avoid ubuntuforums
<gaz00> Madpilot, that's the impression that i had
<Madpilot> some people more involved with Ubuntu that I am even deliberately avoid those forums...
* ormiret isn't a fan on forums
<ormiret> *of
<adamant1988> the forums keep me busy and entertained
<nixternal> Commercial/Typical/General/Corporate/Merchandise/Product Marketing != FOSS Marketing!!!  To many good ideas, just with a "Microsoft $$$$" frame of mind
<gaz00> lol
<gaz00> nixternal, sounds like you need to gripe :p
<nixternal> nah, just people who think they know marketing and what not, try to create an argument that doesn't even fit or go with the FOSS community or the marketing strategies of FOSS
<nixternal> for instance, I am almost complete with my Master's in Business Administration with a Major in Entrepreneurship and a Minor in Marketing
<Madpilot> ick, we're in the presence of an MBA ;) (almost)
<nixternal> now, I have worked in the marketing dept b4, however everything i learned, cannot really be utilized in FOSS, Ubuntu, Linux, this community
<nixternal> Ya Madpilot, it seems they get the big bucks now a days
<Madpilot> heh
<Madpilot> true 'nuff
<nixternal> all my bosses have that stupid plaque on the wall that says MBA
<nixternal> hell, i guess i needed one ;)
<Burgundavia> GWB is the first MBA president...
<nixternal> woohoo
<nixternal> i will be the 2nd
<nixternal> ;)
<Burgundavia> lets hope you do better than the 1st
<Madpilot> he's got a Masters in Badly Administering, GW
<nixternal> hey now, you are talking about my Commander and Chief
<Madpilot> nixternal, you military?
<nixternal> I voted for him twice, so I guess there are some dumber then him
<nixternal> yes sir
<nixternal> reserves now
<nixternal> 5 years until retirement
<nixternal> 5.5 years to be exact...December 6th, 2011 i am eligible for 20yr term retirement
<nixternal> and with my rate and rank, i fall right in between the high enough to go and the low enough to fight category
<Burgundavia> oh, lovely, quote Milton Friedman at me. That is *really* going to convince me. NOT!
<gaz00> sweet...  a FOSS advocate in a capitalistic society.   hrmmm
<Burgundavia> this branding thread is another giant useless mess already
<Burgundavia> lots of hand waving without much else
<Madpilot> all that stuff about "the community won't move without a crisis" - true, but first, prove we have a crisis...
<Burgundavia> actually, it is flat out wrong
<Burgundavia> we are not a democracy
<nixternal> hey Burgundavia, i read that book in high school, it is part of the economics course for high school in illinois ;)
<Burgundavia> I have read it too, sadly
<nixternal> iirc, friedman had more accusations of fraud then any other person in those times
<nixternal> lol
<nixternal> Burgundavia: i would say don't get all worked up over it, as you are probably batteling someone reading about.com, as the answers/replies are few and far between..and seem rather scripted
<Burgundavia> yep
<nixternal> i wonder if people actually read the community pages, the about pages, and such at ubuntu.com. to me, it sounds like they are sipping the kool-aid and don't even know the flavor
<Burgundavia> pretty much
<nixternal> they are actually trying to support something that goes against the Ubuntu philosophy
<nixternal> arg, i need ice cream
<Burgundavia> I have no problem with changing anything. I just need a good reason
<nixternal> i don't think a good reason will ever come out of it, unless somehow Ubuntu does the unthinkable and comercializes
<Burgundavia> never happn
<nixternal> that is why i love this place ;)
<nixternal> FREEEEEE!!!
<nixternal> ok, ice cream time ;)
<matthewrevell> RichJ: new nick?
<RichJ> no
<RichJ> im on my laptop
<RichJ> that is messed up hardcore right now because the edgy updates tonight are bad
<matthewrevell> ah :(
<RichJ> ya, it kind of hurts, as tomorrow is a busy day for me
<RichJ> gotta get ready for vacation on friday, and then i have an ubuntu chicago even tomorrow night that i gotta get ready for
<matthewrevell> mdke_: ping
<mdke_> matthewrevell: hi
<matthewrevell> mdke_: Yesterday, Nixternal, I think, mentioned that the docs team has a set of processes that govern the running of the team. I'm keen to help better organise the marketing team.
<matthewrevell> Maybe I've missed them, but I can't find reference to such processes on the doc team wiki pages
<matthewrevell> any chance of a pointer?
<matthewrevell> s/govern/support
<mdke_> matthewrevell: I suppose https://wiki.ubuntu.com/DocumentationTeam/GettingStarted
<matthewrevell> First place I looked, but thanks :) I take it that means there isn't anything more formal. That's cool. Thanks.
<matthewrevell> Hi Chris
<Ckenyon> matthewrevell: hi
<Burgwork> http://mail.gnome.org/archives/marketing-list/2006-July/msg00275.html
<nixternal> ya, i also read somewhere that they want to fix ubuntu.com the same way that the BBC did their site, for accessibility purposes mainly, that was the reason behind the BBC change
<MenZa> Ungoals..
<MenZa> Sounds like newspeak to me.
<Burgwork> no, actually, it is not
<Burgwork> it is all about being very targetted with what you do
#ubuntu-marketing 2006-07-28
<adamant1988> hello my fellow ubuntu marketing team members :)
<Burgundavia> greetings adamant1988
<Kamping_Kaiser> hey adamant1988
<adamant1988> I have to tell you guys, I am synergized lol.
<adamant1988> I feel all this great creative energy all about the Linux Center idea.
<Kamping_Kaiser> whats t about (*bit out of date :|*)
<adamant1988> haha Kamping_Kaiser I have been given floor space in a local shop to do what I wish with, I have chosen to use the space as a location to market linux, up until tonight I was truly at odds with what I would be able to do with the space... I had 3 distros that I wanted to support, but I've narrowed it down a lot.
<Kamping_Kaiser> nice job :)
* Kamping_Kaiser will try and pass a few cds  onto a local comp. shop.. now sure how well it will go, the bloke who runs its an MCSE A+ :|
<adamant1988> I have a lot of work to do... I know how to make Ubuntu everything the end-user needs it to be, legally. But I am going to have to do a lot of work on legal issues and patent holdings and all that...
<Kamping_Kaiser> :| bloody patents
<adamant1988> agreed....
<adamant1988> however I'll need to pull this off right... if I do everything the way it needs to be done... there may be more than one Ubuntu Center.
<adamant1988> GAH I need to write these things down.
<Kamping_Kaiser> just log :)
* adamant1988 starts up tomboy
<adamant1988> at least novell is damn good at producing applications that I like :)
<adamant1988> ok, guys work with me here
<adamant1988> what is a good incentives reward for bringing in more people to Ubuntu.  What can I offer as a reward, preferably cheap/free.
* Kamping_Kaiser is intencely disliking sled10 (just fwiw)
<adamant1988> SLED 10 will be perfect for Businesses... but Ubuntu... ubuntu can be made to do anything...
<adamant1988> all it takes is a little adjustment on the behalf of a preinstaller...
<adamant1988> The community takes what it likes from other distros and integrates, or at least adds, the option to Ubuntu... it's incredible...
<Kamping_Kaiser> i'm not sure about perfect for busness... depends which business to  a large degree - but lets just say i wont be deplying it anyware :)
<adamant1988> lol
<ormiret> adamant1988: to my mind the incentive you should be puching is doing something good for person B that preson A introduces to ubuntu
<ormiret> (with any luck you get what I mean - despite that horribly clumsy sentence)
<adamant1988> Yes, but there could be a more 'physical' representation of some accomplishment on the half of Person A.
<adamant1988> yay, beachboys...
<adamant1988> all the leaves are brown, and the sky is grey.
<adamant1988> I'm energized.. I was playing with linspire, and it I was like.. man... maybe Ubuntu isn't for the end user.... and then it dawned on me... ubuntu isn't about ever doing something with the OS on your own.  There's rediculous amounts of documentation available, forums, chat rooms, etc.
<adamant1988> I, personally, can make Ubuntu ready for the end-user.
<adamant1988> just by offering to help.
<Kamping_Kaiser> back in ~1hr. i'll chat then :)
<adamant1988> ok, quick, how can I make an application for ubuntu installable from CD?
<Kamping_Kaiser> you mean a repository on a cd?
<Kamping_Kaiser> or just installable?
<ormiret> just put the deb on the CD - gdebi will install it
<Kamping_Kaiser> make cd -> make index.html -> make autorun index.html -> tell them to click links ;)
<Kamping_Kaiser> or use something like falcon to make a repo, and move it to the cd (might work)
<adamant1988> I mean like putting a program on a CD and letting them install from it
<adamant1988> second thing... what functionality is it that Klik offers that is worth the time?
* Kamping_Kaiser didnt like the look of it, but as stated, back in 1 hour.
<Kamping_Kaiser> *gone*
<nixternal> http://www.flickr.com/photos/14577991@N00/sets/72157594214597851/
<nixternal> Ubuntu Chicago Local Community Team Meeting Kicked Arse
<whiprush> nixternal: there's an ubuntu chicago team?
<nixternal> yes
<nixternal> i am the team lead
<adamant1988> wow, I love the usp
<nixternal> we have around 20 members, 10 showed up briefly
<whiprush> <-- ubuntu detroit
<nixternal> nice whiprush, im originally from benton harbor, sw michigan guy here ;)
<whiprush> nixternal: dude I have a good friend in the area, I'll send him your way, you guys have a webpage?
<adamant1988> Ubuntu, West By-God Virginia :)
<whiprush> he's been looking for a LUG in chicago for like, 5 years.
<nixternal> http://chi.ubuntu-us.org   &    https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ChicagoTeam
<nixternal> there are a few good lugs
<whiprush> I'll send him your way
<nixternal> we handed out 200 CDs tonight
<nixternal> cool whiprush, he is more then welcome!
<adamant1988> Nice, nixternal :)
<nixternal> oh, and 200 sets of stickers
<whiprush> those cool silvery ones? the ones from that german site?
<adamant1988> we should be able to order CD's without worrying about shipit ignoring our request...
<nixternal> nah, the ones from shipit
<nixternal> shipit don't ignore my requests
<nixternal> i just got another 200 today for another event coming up
<whiprush> if you mail shipit and tell them it's for a show or a large gathering, they'll bump you up in priority.
<adamant1988> oh that reminds me... the 50 CD's I ordered... I can't get them... they're mailed to my mothers...
<whiprush> nixternal: dude you guys should come to http://ohiolinux.org. I gave an ubuntu talk there last year, there was like, 1000 people.
<whiprush> we gave out 800 CDs.
<nixternal> nice
<nixternal> this next event, total the team will have between 1000 and 2000 CDs if everythng goes as planned
<whiprush> the gnomejournal guys are from chitown too, they made the trip
<whiprush> we should so get a booth going this year.
<nixternal> all my CDs i have ordered have gotten here within a week as well
<nixternal> really
<nixternal> i gotta hit them guys up
<whiprush> It's a great show, TONS of ubuntu users.
<whiprush> it's becoming THE show in the midwest.
<whiprush> IBM, Novell, digium, etc ...
<nixternal> nice..i will definitely make it out
<whiprush> sweet, I had no idea there was a chicago team.
* whiprush envisions greatness 
<nixternal> just created it as a matter of fact
<nixternal> mike greenwood had the idea, and has been to busy, so since i have been workign with the community quite a bit, i took the reins and got it going..then i got lucky and had a few really good guys hop on with great skills, connections, and ambition
<nixternal> funny story, we had a guy snap a pic of the entire team in front of a fountain..and i gave him a cd and started to explain it to him..he said he would put it in his radio and listen to it on the way home
<nixternal> i wish we would have gotten a picture of him holding the cd...it was too funny
<adamant1988> I just placed an order for 200 shipit CDs
<adamant1988> I'm expecting them to bump it down.. I'll be glad to get 100
<Madpilot> nixternal, that Ubuntu Chicago poster came out well
<nixternal> dude, it is sweet!
<nixternal> i have a laminated one right here...the one in the photo got signed by the team, screen names, and gpg keys...we are sending it to Mark
<Madpilot> nice
<Madpilot> Canonical is going to have to start an "Ubuntu Archive"
<Madpilot> probably in a closet in someone's office ;)
<nixternal> haha
<nixternal> my poster better get hung up
<nixternal> i want a pic of Mark holding it
<adamant1988> lol
<Madpilot> Other cool Ubuntu stuff: my Ubuntu Canada logo, applied to a t-shirt by some guy in Toronto: http://i37.photobucket.com/albums/e97/lophyte/Shirts/IMG_0176.jpg
* adamant1988 hopes his CDs come through :)
<Burgundavia> whiprush: my ex is making a tshirt with the freedom quote
<whiprush> Burgundavia: count me in, I'll buy one
<Burgundavia> I guess I will have to scare a bunch up
<Burgundavia> whiprush: you think ubucon is still worth going to?
<Madpilot> Burgundavia, which freedom quote?
<Burgundavia> perkypants.org
<Madpilot> cool ;)
<whiprush> Burgundavia: Deborah from the book said she was going.
<Burgundavia> to ubucon?
<Burgundavia> in that case, I had better go
<whiprush> Burgundavia: also, last I talked to jdub he was going to ask chris dibona what the deal was, since google is hosting the thing.
<whiprush> Burgundavia: if you see jeff before I do on irc, ping him.
<Burgundavia> I saw him today, but only for 1 line
<Burgundavia> hmm, tickets just got cheaper. 289 CAD
<whiprush> Burgundavia: I've got tons of friends from ars coming, and between us all, we can probably fill a good day's worth of content, so if google is willing to host ...
<Burgundavia> ok, I will book tomorrow
<Burgundavia> well, I always did want to travel...
<whiprush> sweet, dude be ready to do a talk
<Burgundavia> ah, crap
<whiprush> I have a feeling that this will be a "show up, you get to talk" event.
<whiprush> since the schedule is blank
<Burgundavia> I think/hope I have the money
<Burgundavia> whiprush: how long are you going for?
<whiprush> LWE+ubucon
<Burgundavia> I wish I had the time
<whiprush> 14-20 august.
<Burgundavia> maybe I can get my company to help me with LWE
<whiprush> work is sending me to LWE, the ubucon extension I pay for myself.
<whiprush> and (yay!), I get GNOME booth duty for lwe.
<Burgundavia> where do you work for again?
<whiprush> oakland.edu
<Burgundavia> why did I think you were in Detriot for some reason?
<whiprush> I am
<whiprush> oakland.edu is in oakland county, michigan.
<Burgundavia> ah
<whiprush> not to be confused with oakland, the city next to san francisco
<Burgundavia> yes, hence why I was confused
<whiprush> Burgundavia: I don't have space for you in my hotel room in SF though, I have like, three people claiming floor space. I got a spot for you in boston though.
<whiprush> I'll check with a coworker who is also going, see if he has space if you need a place to crash for LWE.
<Burgundavia> let me see if I can see if work will cover half
<Burgundavia> damn, tim is already going
<whiprush> tim?
<Burgundavia> company president. Just looking at the userful wiki to see if there was any plans of ours
<whiprush> to LWE or ubucon?
<Burgundavia> LWE
<whiprush> easy fix.
<whiprush> a) the gnome booth needs volunteers.
<whiprush> b) your new books' publishers will be there, surely in your bio you mention who you work for, so it's easy marketing for them.
<Burgundavia> yep, that I do
<whiprush> c) professional development
<whiprush> So, he can wander the floor looking at the commercial crap, you market your book and your services at a .Org booth, sounds like a win-win for him.
<Burgundavia> sounds good to me. Now I just need to sell it
<Madpilot> Burgundavia, is Userful doing a booth @ LWE?
<Burgundavia> no, just wondering the floor
<Burgundavia> wandering, rather
<whiprush> Burgundavia: you're in -marketing, be prepared to sell. :D
<Kamping_Kaiser> who was asking about making autorun cds?
* ormiret points at adamant1988 
<Burgundavia> ah, the stupidities of closed source companies
<Burgundavia> Userful has not one but two products for time control
<Kamping_Kaiser> thanks ormiret
<Burgundavia> ironically, it is the high end one that is now open source
<Burgundavia> whiprush: have you ever heard of openacs?
<whiprush> no, googling
<whiprush> wow, never heard of it, but apparently lots of people use it
<Burgundavia> it was an AOL project
<Burgundavia> night
<Kamping_Kaiser> later
<digitalmouse> greetings programs
<matthewrevell> digitalmouse: howdy
<digitalmouse> you folks staying out of trouble I hope?
<matthewrevell> digitalmouse: Yeah, more or less :)
<digitalmouse> good, good
<Madpilot> whiprush, if  you're still around: http://www.warbard.ca/temp/4quality4freedom.png
<Madpilot> just messing with Inkscape
<Madpilot> night all
<matthewrevell> night
<matthewrevell> hey - anyone in here?
<bimberi> hi matthewrevell
<matthewrevell> bimberi: Hi :)
<matthewrevell> You been following the ML?
<bimberi> oh yes
<bimberi> we've been shown the way eh?
<matthewrevell> I'm slightly concerned at the way my emails have got people on the defensive
<matthewrevell> If we don't debate stuff like that, we're gonna get nowhere...
<matthewrevell> I just wanted to check if anyone else thought I was coming across okay or as a ****
<matthewrevell> :)
<bimberi> hehe
<bimberi> no i don't think so
<matthewrevell> nice :)
<matthewrevell> I just think we need less of the, "Hey, you're so cool" stuff and more, "Right, let's see if this works"
<bimberi> i think jb's initial reaction was highly enthusiastic - good to get a steadying hand on that
<bimberi> btw, i agree that the counter isn't great as a 'get to know what your customer wants' tool but it could be useful for other marketing related things - assessing the effectivness of initiatives could be one example
<elkbuntu> calm down matthewrevell im not on the defensive
<matthewrevell> elkbuntu: Hey, I'm not worked up :)
<Kamping_Kaiser> (background info - i pasted elkbuntu from 'folloowing ml' to 'btw ,  i agree'
<matthewrevell> elkbuntu: I just wanted to check that I wasn't coming across as overly negative.
<elkbuntu> matthewrevell, im in agreement that it's not the holy grail, but the project is also still in it's infancy, it can grow with the right advice etc.
<matthewrevell> elkbuntu: I like your counter idea.
<matthewrevell> elkbuntu: Cool :)
* elkbuntu knows nothing about marketing as such.
<elkbuntu> i guess i shold probably add this channel to autojoin now ;)
<matthewrevell> elkbuntu: It'll be good to have you here :)
<bimberi> too right, you're a natural :)
* Kamping_Kaiser lols... good to have you here... 
<elkbuntu> heh
* Kamping_Kaiser gives elkbuntu a welcome hug
<elkbuntu> we cant go imposing on yet another channel karl :P
* elkbuntu hugs back anyway. ;)
* bimberi rolls eyes
* Kamping_Kaiser giggles
<matthewrevell> I take you guys know each other :)
<bimberi> matthewrevell: this goes on in #ubuntu-au quite a lot
<elkbuntu> bimberi, -au is my channel, biatch ;)
<matthewrevell> Where's mdke when you need him to remind people the channel is logged? :)
<bimberi> elkbuntu: ooer ;p
<Kamping_Kaiser> matthewrevell, i know it is -  so? :)
<Kamping_Kaiser> bimberi, hehe
<elkbuntu> 0:)
<elkbuntu> matthewrevell, i take it you took a look at the weekly snapshot. i'll be doing a monthly access report based on the awstats output as well. i'm also willing to share the user db with email addresses removed.
<Kamping_Kaiser> mmm. passwords?
<elkbuntu> Kamping_Kaiser, are md5 encrypted and trimmed :)
<matthewrevell> elkbuntu: YEah, saw the weekly. Interesting stuff. I recommend getting it in UWN.
<Kamping_Kaiser> :)
<elkbuntu> matthewrevell, who runs that show?
<matthewrevell> Sharing the stats in the marketing ML will definitely be interesting.
<matthewrevell> elkbuntu: Matt Galvin
<matthewrevell> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuWeeklyNewsletter
* bimberi finds a certain ratio of more than 5 to 1 quite interesting
<matthewrevell> right, must go. elkbuntu hope you realise that my intention on the ML was to query John, more than your project
<bimberi> matthewrevell: that was how i read it (as i said)
<elkbuntu> matthewrevell, sure. but i felt like i needed to clarify, which is hard to do without sounding on the defense
<adamant1988> hello all
<Kamping_Kaiser> hey
<matthewrevell> adamant1988: hey
<adamant1988> how is everyone today?
<Kamping_Kaiser> excited
<Kamping_Kaiser> you?
<adamant1988> same, and a little tired.
<adamant1988> I need to figure out where I can get some starting assets from to start the Ubuntu Center.
<adamant1988> and I need to talk to Ubuntu preinstallation companies like system 76 about carrying their line of computers..
<mdke> what is an Ubuntu Center?
<adamant1988> It's my own project Mdke... and if it goes over well, I'm going to apply for a business license for it
<adamant1988> right now I have 60 square feet of floor space to do what I want with in a store that gets somewhat decent traffic.  I'm allowed to advertise through them etc.
<mdke> so you're going to sell computers with Ubuntu on?
<mdke> very cool
<adamant1988> yep, I'm also going to do Ubuntu installations for free, I'm also going to package up special bundles of the live CDs for sale.
<mdke> awesome
<adamant1988> the main idea behind this is that I think Ubuntu will be better spread by physical stablishments that have a physical product, than an online site
#ubuntu-marketing 2006-07-29
<adamant1988> hello al
<adamant1988> all
<Burgundavia> http://www.desktoplinux.com/news/NS7181765564.html <-- wow, you can pay *less* for Linux
<Burgundavia> heh
<ompaul> Burgundavia, say it isn't so
<adamant1988> hello all
<MenZa> hi2u
<adamant1988> how is everyone today?
#ubuntu-marketing 2006-07-30
<Burgundavia> http://www.djangoproject.com/weblog/2006/jul/29/095/ <-- maybe calling your release "removing the magic" is not the best marketing
<Madpilot> Burgundavia, does this mean the next Ubuntu release won't be called "Crashing Chihauhau"?
<Burgundavia> not likley
<Burgundavia> but I like horny hornet, myself
<ompaul> is jbaer here?
#ubuntu-marketing 2007-07-23
<juliux> hi all
<juliux> i know it is a studip question but how can i submit a news for the fridge?
<elkbuntu> juliux, mail fridge-devel@l.u.c iirc
<juliux> elkbuntu, thxs
<elkbuntu> or harrass any fridge publisher. their names often accompany posts
<juliux> and who is a fridge publisher?
<juliux> oh beuno is a fridge publisher;)
<beuno> it would seem so  :D
<beuno> juliux: what can I help you with?
<juliux> beuno, i have an english announcment about the german ubucon including the call for papers
<beuno> juliux: great, send it over
<juliux> beuno, e-mail address?
<beuno> beuno@ubuntu.com
* jenda spams beuno 
* juliux also spams beuno 
* elkbuntu tells spambots beuno's email address
<elkbuntu> i win
* beuno hugs gmail's spam filter
* jenda bribes Mr. Bryn
<jenda> or whatever his name is spelt.
<beuno> haha
<jenda> I think I'd have to translate for 27 of my lifetimes to generate a bribe he'd be interested in :)
<beuno> jenda: don't underestimate a nice dress
<beuno> :D
<jenda> :D
<jenda> beuno: you've got me all wrong.
<jenda> beuno: you know I'd get him drunk first.
<beuno> right, then the dress
<jenda> uh oh
* jenda hides
* beuno flies away
<juliux> beuno, dennda will send you the text, it would be nice if you can check the spelling
<beuno> juliux: will do, and the story always get check by 2 editor before going live, so we have more eyes to catch those
<juliux> beuno, thank you very much
<beuno> juliux: np, I'm going to hit the shower and head to work
<juliux> beuno, have fun
<beuno> no one talk to jenda until he proves he finished translating
* beuno runs
<jenda> correct
* juliux is since 7:00 utc at work
<elkbuntu> jenda, i've heard that wealthy russians are rather expensive to get drunk :
<jenda> elkbuntu: damn :D
<jenda> elkbuntu: I didn't realise his heritage
<elkbuntu> haha
<jenda> I'll try his american collegue, then.
<elkbuntu> yeah. that might be easier
<jenda> beuno: the Czechs are nothing compared to the Russians in that aspect ;)
<jenda> "Pa, are the Russians our friends, or our brothers?"
<jenda> "Hmm, son... I'd say... brothers. You can choose your friends."
<elkbuntu> lol
<elkbuntu> that's a good one and so easily applied to other groups
<jenda> elkbuntu: but it has strong roots in this country ;)
<jenda> every person in any position whatsoever had to sign that he/she welcomes the "Brotherly intervention of the friendly soviet forces" in '68.
<elkbuntu> how cute
* beuno goes to the office
<beuno> elkbuntu: ignore jenda, he'll talk about anything. Make him translate  :D
* elkbuntu notes the 12 minute lapse since he last spoke until you said his name
<jenda> gaargh :)
<jenda> yes, it's beuno's fault I'm not translating this very second :)
<beuno> I knew that would come back and bite me...
<beuno> bbl
* elkbuntu lashes jenda with the whip of slave driving
<boredandblogging> UWN #49 is out:  http://www.digg.com/linux_unix/Ubuntu_Weekly_Newsletter_49
* jenda diggs in
<jenda> wow, an "ubuntumarketing" user? :D
<boredandblogging> haha, yeah
<johnc4510> greetings marketing
<johnc4510> boredandblogging: ping
<jenda> hey jono
<jono> he
<jono> hey
<Admiral_laptop> beuno: i had to change a part of the UWN, the HP + ubuntu deal.  It didn't make a lot of sense as it was written so I hope its a bit more readeable now
<Admiral_laptop> I seriously read it 5 times and couldn't understand it..
<beuno> Admiral_laptop: thanks, those kinds of corrections help a lot  :D
#ubuntu-marketing 2007-07-24
<jenda> beuno: there was a quiz yesterday! :)
<jenda> beuno: which calls for the quiz section in the UWN again... when's the next UWN due?
<jenda> beuno: it was hosted by theCore, Alexander Vassalotti and won by coNP, Aaron Sisak. I sponsored it, but coNP donated his prize towards the next quiz, so he's the sponsor.
<rjian> hello everyone
<Mike_Feravolo_> hello
<rjian> wats new here
<Mike_Feravolo_> I am not sure, I think something is going on in Oregon
<rjian> really? an event hehe
<Mike_Feravolo_> I guess it's a little to far for me to drive to.
<rjian> even me coz im in php :)
<Mike_Feravolo_> time to get out there and sell
<Mike_Feravolo_> then i can get back to programming
<rjian> heh
<johnc4510> beuno: you around?
<beuno> hey johnc4510
<johnc4510> how come issue 49 not on fridge or rss feed?
<johnc4510> http://fridge.ubuntu.com/uwn/feed/
<beuno> ah
<beuno> I forgot
<johnc4510> np
<beuno> that's why  :D
<johnc4510> also   
<johnc4510> fridge events calendar only goes thru end of month   
<johnc4510> where can i get first of next month?
<beuno> johnc4510: there's an arrow on top, in the same line where the month is
<beuno> you can go through the months with that
<johnc4510> k thanks     duh
<johnc4510> :)
<beuno> or you can use: http://fridge.ubuntu.com/event/2007/07/24/list/all/all
<beuno> np  :D
<johnc4510> ty
<johnc4510> oh, that link is nice
<johnc4510> ty
#ubuntu-marketing 2007-07-25
<worzel> hi any chance off a bit a help please 
* Starting logfile irclogs/ubuntu-marketing.log
#ubuntu-marketing 2008-07-21
<meoblast001> ive descovered something
<meoblast001> it is IMPOSSIBLE to get anyone to switch to Ubuntu
<cody-somerville> meoblast001, oh
<cody-somerville> I've switched a number of people
<meoblast001> well when i ask ppl to try it out
<meoblast001> they always say no
<meoblast001> i tell them of the features, they think its going to be too hard of a switch
<meoblast001> or they dont want to do itbecause they're too lazy to put in a cd rom
<meoblast001> i have a friend who is suffering from a major virus in Windows that wont let him open his web browser
<meoblast001> he wont even try Ubuntu out
<meoblast001> i have him my live cd
<meoblast001> every time i have a problem in ubuntu they tell me to switch to windows
<meoblast001> when i had a major system crash every 1 month in windows compared to every 6 months in ubuntu
<cody-somerville> meoblast001, I'm not sure what to tell you but there are some great resources on the wiki to help you
<meoblast001> i'm also quite angry because usplash crapped on me and no one knows how to help me
<meoblast001> its hard to show off ubuntu when usplash fails on shutdown and my "friend" has to stare at a terminal shutting the system down
<meoblast001> they'd be like "thats too complicated i dont want it"
<meoblast001> and even if i explain "only my computer does that" they wont believe me
<cody-somerville> I'm pretty sure usplash on shutdown kinda disappeared for everyone due to xorg changes.
<meoblast001> cody_somerville: didnt do it to me
<johnc4510-laptop> if i set someone down at my laptop, and they start using it, they usually say: "Oh this is great"
<meoblast001> cody-somerville: when i did Ctrl+Alt+F1 for maintance it stoppped working and hasnt worked since
<meoblast001> johnc4510-laptop: well no one really wants to come in my house or hang out with me.... Aspergers Syndrom..... not many friends
<johnc4510-laptop> ah, don't sell yourself short
<johnc4510-laptop> :)
<meoblast001> when my comptuer broke last night, i was thinking about just giving up on using my comptuer
<meoblast001> but then from 8 - 10 i'd just eat stuff and get fat and i dont want to be fat
<meoblast001> i need a new comptuer
<meoblast001> i cant even use CD-ROMS on this thing
<meoblast001> but im too poor to buy a new computer
<cody-somerville> : (
<cody-somerville> omg. :(
<johnc4510-laptop> odd
<meoblast001> you see what i get "(10:13:26 PM) Jason White: its cuz of ur OS"... ppl always blame every problem i have on Ubunt
<meoblast001> u
#ubuntu-marketing 2008-07-22
<meoblast001> hi
<meoblast001> why odnt we ever take the windows aproach?
<meoblast001> make a good program
<meoblast001> and make it linux only
<meoblast001> cut microsoft's balls off
<sbc> meoblast001: With open source that is kind of hard. Once you have a great program linux only with the source out there it should be pice of cake to make a windows / OSX port
<meoblast001> sbc: we should make a few closed source ones (only a few)
<meoblast001> sbc: that is one advantage microsoft has
<meoblast001> they get all the programs we hav
<meoblast001> e
<meoblast001> sure... LMMS is an exclusive
<meoblast001> but seriously.... what else is a good Linux exclusive
<meoblast001> sbc: are we gonna get silverlight?
<sbc> meoblast001: Proberly not right away.
<meoblast001> sbc: it said it will only be made for Linux throught Novel
<meoblast001> that means... SUsE only right?
<sbc> meoblast001: Once they make a suse port it should not be hard bringing it to other linux distributions
<meoblast001> sbc: do we currently have a way to convert SUsE packages?
<meoblast001> does SUsE use RPM?
<meoblast001> never triedSUse
<sbc> meoblast001: I'm not sure, but it should not be impossible
<meoblast001> sbc: i'll check the wine status on silverlight
<meoblast001> i want to see if this is any good
<meoblast001> nope it fails
<meoblast001> youtube time
<jonpackard> ï»¿meoblast001: have you seen Moonlight? I think it's still in Beta, but the idea is it's a OSS replacement for Silverlight
<jonpackard> here's a link if you're interested: http://www.mono-project.com/Moonlight
<meoblast001> already there
<meoblast001> what do you mean "OSS replacement"
<meoblast001> OS replacement?
<jonpackard> OSS = open source software
<meoblast001> oh
<meoblast001> shaweet
<meoblast001> installing
<jonpackard> like... Gnash hopefully will completely replace adobe flash for most Linux users when it is perfected =)
<meoblast001> NOOO
<meoblast001> i think different
<meoblast001> Adobe should open the flash format up
<meoblast001> GNASH is so buggy that the idea of it being good enough is hard to believe
<meoblast001> and then Adobe would switch a bunch of stuff and GNASH would need fixed
<jonpackard> or another example.. Nouveau can provide 3D for nvidia users instead of using proprietary modules.. it's usuable for older cards but not much love for my Geforce8 series card yet
<meoblast001> GeForce8 isnt linux compatible?
<meoblast001> moonlight is SLOW
<jonpackard> I agree at this time Gnash is very limited.. I tried it and ended up switching back to Flash =(
<meoblast001> me too
<meoblast001> i havent had any problems with Flash proprietary edition
<meoblast001> well
<jonpackard> nouveau for Geforce 8 series is not quite there yet
<meoblast001> i change my mind
<meoblast001> i have
<meoblast001> but it was repaired
<meoblast001> and i use Wine + Flash 8
<meoblast001> runs great
<meoblast001> what does moonlight do?
<meoblast001> lock up my browser?
<meoblast001> its quite good at that
<jonpackard> Wine is great but to have to use it for a program that's been ported to Lunix seems odd to me
<meoblast001> no
<meoblast001> Flash MX 8
<jonpackard> ohh... i see
<meoblast001> what is mono?
<meoblast001> jonpackard: ?
<jonpackard> hmm "flash for linux".. still in beta of course =) http://f4l.sourceforge.net/
<jonpackard> mono = open source development platform based on the .NET framework
<meoblast001> and that means?
<meoblast001> its like WIndows for Linux?
<jonpackard> no idea.. im a bit behind on programming.. basically it's a set of libraries for programming
<meoblast001> oh
<meoblast001> Novel owned?
<jonpackard> .NET is big in windows programming now.. Novell sponsors it
<jonpackard> mono that is.. not .NET
<meoblast001> oh
<meoblast001> so its supposed to encourage programmers to port to linux by easing the porting process?
<jonpackard> not only that but to add the same capabilities for linux programs as well =)
<jonpackard> it's not all about porting from windows
<meoblast001> oh
<meoblast001> that's because Microsoft is evil
<meoblast001> we need to make them have to do the same thing
<jonpackard> lol.. microsoft did pretty darn good for their time.. but that time is ending very quickly
<meoblast001> not really
<meoblast001> most ppl dont know what an OS is
<meoblast001> and as long as it's put on their computer when they buy it
<meoblast001> and they recognize it from the commercials
<meoblast001> or the name
<jonpackard> most people don't need to know.. they just want something that works
<meoblast001> they'll use it and think that it being slow is normal
<meoblast> ok
<meoblast> im back
<jonpackard> wb =)
<meoblast> jonpackard: sorry i got disconnected
<meoblast> so i have to wait for my old name to disappear
<meoblast> so i can take it back
<meoblast> anyways
<meoblast> how are we supposed to make ppl open minded
<meoblast> and try ubuntu out
<meoblast> my friend eric completely dispises it but has never used it
<meoblast> jonpackard: we need to find a way to get ppl in contact with ubuntu and break their adiction to windows
<jonpackard> lol.. sounds like os prejudice.. how can he hate something he's not seen?
<pep> one of the ideas is a web-accessed try out... I'm not sure what its technical name is... eyeOS does that for example.
<meoblast> jonpackard: because i support it
<meoblast> jonpackard: and this ignorance and stupidity pisses me off
<meoblast> so he probably finds fun in it
<jonpackard> lol
<meoblast> jonpackard: i have another friend with a terrible comptuer virus
<meoblast> cant open internet explorer
<meoblast> and he was too pc illiterate to install firefox
<meoblast> i told him to dual boot with ubuntu
<meoblast> even gave him my hardy disk
<meoblast> asked him to try it out
<meoblast> jonpackard: he wouldnt even stick the disk in and run it in live cd
<jonpackard> that's one of the best ways to encourage people to switch.. adware/malware/viruses have almost nil affect on Ubuntu
<meoblast> i got my sister to switch
<meoblast> this is how
<meoblast> "the windows can catch on fire when you close them"
<pep> :)
<meoblast> and this
<jonpackard> another great way is to refurb an old PC and donate it
<meoblast> "that gay popup you get everyday wont happen again.... ever"
<meoblast> my mom is SUPER computer illiterate but because my PC and my sister's PC have Linux, she is forced to use ours
<meoblast> she first was very iffy about it
<meoblast> but now she admits its just as easy as Windows
<jonpackard> people don't like change.. once Linux gets a firm hold in schools and business, it will make the jump to the desktop very easily.. how do you think MSFT did it?
<jonpackard> schools is the big thing.. everybody grew up learning Windows
<meoblast> jonpackard: actually i printed off the ubuntu flyers
<meoblast> and im going to give them to my ignorant school
<jonpackard> cool.. I haven't seen the flyers yet
<meoblast> and hope they dont throw them right in the garbage
<meoblast> with a live cd
<meoblast> im waiting it out incase Intrepid comes out before school starts
<meoblast> i'd rather give them a copy of Intrepid
<jonpackard> make sure to have http://www.wubi-installer.org/ on there.. "one-click" Ubuntu install inside windows
<meoblast> jonpackard: OH YEAH
<meoblast> i forgot
<meoblast> wubi is in the new cd's =P
<meoblast> from Hardy +
<meoblast> didnt know that?
<jonpackard> i prefer to hand out CDs.. but that is the best way over the net
<meoblast> ok had to turn compiz fusion on
<meoblast> they need to make an easier way to adjust window opacity
<jonpackard> gotta go catch a bus.. perhaps we can continue this tomorrow =)
<meoblast> i like mine sitting at 85 percent
<meoblast> k cya
<meoblast> nice talking to you
<jonpackard> you can change the opacity steps for Alt-Mousewheel in the compiz-settings-manager
<jonpackard> ohh you don't usually use compiz
<jonpackard> nice talking with you too meoblast :) later!
#ubuntu-marketing 2008-07-23
<meoblast001> hey
<meoblast001> if anyone is here i have to say something funny
<meoblast001> my friend wants to install ubuntu
<meoblast001> but its his mom's computer
<jonpackard> let's here it friend :)
<meoblast001> and his mom said "do you think ur gonna learn it so u know it in the future. no ones even heard of it"
<jonpackard> er hear lol
<meoblast001> i said i would tell the hundreds ubuntu users on the various ubuntu channels that
<jonpackard> Current ubuntu counter users: 23121
<jonpackard> registered linux counter users: 136005
<jonpackard> nobody indeed =D
<meoblast001> lol
<meoblast001> actually
<meoblast001> jonpackard: thats not a lot of ppl
<jonpackard> ï»¿meoblast001: keep in mind not every user is registered ;-)
<jonpackard> gotta catch a bus.. see ya later ï»¿meoblast001 :)
<bolek> hi
#ubuntu-marketing 2008-07-24
<xivulon> hi all, as mentioned a few days back I'd like to do a wubi-banner competition. What prizes could be made available for the winners? I was thinking about tshirts and such.
#ubuntu-marketing 2008-07-26
<alefteris> can you recommend any website where I can create a t-shirt shop for our loco team?
<hubuntu> alefteris, are yuou thinking of making your own web site for sale of t-shirts or more a link recommending an existing site?
<alefteris> hubuntu, a link, recomenting a site
<alefteris> like the one from cafepress, but for europe?
<hubuntu> http://shop.canonical.com/
<hubuntu> worldwide AFAIK
<hubuntu> it works in Europe (I have used it, I'm in Norway)
<alefteris> hubuntu, We would like to put our loco team logo on the t-shirt
<hubuntu> oh,,,
<hubuntu> we had the same issue in our LoCo. A guy ended up taking initiative and made 100 t-shirts
<hubuntu> but it was private
<hubuntu> that's true of the NOrwegian and Ecuadorian teams
<alefteris> I have found this, but haven't tried it spreadshirt.net. Anyone has any experience with it?
<alefteris> hubuntu, it's difficult to organise something like this, last time someone did it from our team, ended up with anwanted t-shirts :(
<hubuntu> I know
<hubuntu> we ended up buying our own t-shirts and used them in the FLISOL
<alefteris> so, I'm looking for a website where we can make our own shop with our own designs, where people can order from
<alefteris> if canonicals shop supported that, it would be great
<hubuntu> true
<hubuntu> I have heard of such things and have a friend who used to work on that
#ubuntu-marketing 2009-07-20
<Takyoji_> Woo, I think I might have a good visual representation sheet that describes open source with diagrams and/or analogies
<Takyoji_> Still drawing a draft yet, but good results.
<Beyecixramd> hiii!
#ubuntu-marketing 2009-07-24
<Guest8810> hello am interested to make ubuntu grow, is there a developer or marketing person whos is willing to read my suggestions?
<Guest8810> whats the topic?
<Guest8810> hello?
<BHSPitMonkey> Guest8810: http://brainstorm.ubuntu.com/
<RD> hello?
<Takyoji> Yes?
<RD> I have an Idea to solve bug #1
<ubot4> RD: Error: Could not parse data returned by Launchpad: The read operation timed out
<BHSPitMonkey> Free t-shirts?
<Takyoji> Which would be?
<RD> Canonical should start counting its users by installing a package popularity contest during first time installation for more details here is the link I found:
<RD> http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?p=7668093#post7668093
<RD> I think this will solve bug #1
<ubot4> RD: Error: Could not parse data returned by Launchpad: The read operation timed out
<RD> did anyone took a look at at the link?
<BHSPitMonkey> RD: you have that option during installation
<RD> I do?
<RD> where?
<BHSPitMonkey> Yes
<RD> are you talking about ubuntu 9.04 or 9.10?
<BHSPitMonkey> It's under the Advanced options, on the screen right before it starts actually installing
<BHSPitMonkey> It's been there for a few versions.
<RD> I never seen it, how about if they make it part of the installation without having to hide it under the advanced tab?
<BHSPitMonkey> It's not enabled by default because that would be a glaring breach of privacy
<RD> am sure average users wont even look at the advanced tab
<BHSPitMonkey> Put it on http://brainstorm.ubuntu.com/
<RD> someone already put it there but the devs dont seem to pay attention to it, however it has lots of votes
<RD> I was thinking if Canonical would do the same thing as mozilla
<RD> mozilla advertized firefox all over the web and look now firefox has more than 25% markettshare
<RD> can canonical do this?
<RD> hello?
<Takyoji> Numbers on marketshare for software is a bit inaccurate typically
<Takyoji> or at least in my perspective
<RD> I understand its not accurate but at least it gives you an idea of how many users are using ubuntu or firefox
<RD> so can canonical do the same thing as mozilla?
<RD> anyone?
<Takyoji> They just need to make it more apparent is all (in terms of the package popularity survey option)
<RD> so you are telling me that canonical is considering/ developing the package popularity idea?
<Takyoji> Stupid me, I'll review the whole topic, I'm most likely missing a detail
<RD> sorry I got diconnected
<Takyoji> also, that's another factor, people are also behind caching proxies/mirrors sometimes (which helps reduce server load)
<RD> no am not using proxy, I accidently closed the chat tab under firefox :-D
<Takyoji> Erm, stupid me, it wouldn't have to be forced to go through the specified mirror..
<RD> so just to make it more clear, canonical already has the popularity contest package hiden under the advanced options during ubuntu installation right?
<RD> are you still there takyoji? :)
<RD> are you still there takyoji? 
<Takyoji> Yes
<Takyoji> To my understanding, yes
<RD> someone told me that options is hidden? it shouldint
<RD> anyway am leaving for now
<BryanNL> Hey all
<BryanNL> Can somebody help me?
#ubuntu-marketing 2009-07-26
<DPic> #ubuntu-gaming meeting in 50 mins
<johnc4510> The newest issue of the Ubuntu Weekly Newsletter #152 is now available:
<johnc4510> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuWeeklyNewsletter/Issue152
#ubuntu-marketing 2010-07-28
<akgraner> The new edition of the Ubuntu Weekly Newsletter is now available here:
<akgraner> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UbuntuWeeklyNewsletter/Issue203
#ubuntu-marketing 2010-07-29
<abraCadaver> mind if I make a suggestion?
<abraCadaver> just going to come out with it... :) new to the community, not really sure what the feel is here yet, but I've noticed something
<abraCadaver> recently started using ubuntu and I started trying to get my friends to use it and nobody wants to, didn't want to myself until I thought it would make a great os for my old laptop / desktop, etc
<abraCadaver> when I mentioned "linux loves old hardware", suddenly everybody got interested
<abraCadaver> from 0 people to four people in one comment
<abraCadaver> Every dev has an old laptop or desktop laying in a corner somewhere collecting dust that they don't want to throw out even though they don't use it
<abraCadaver> I'm wondering if this idea might be a good thing to bring front and center?
#ubuntu-marketing 2010-07-31
<buntfu> hi everyone
<buntfu> anyone alive?
<buntfu> hi
<buntfu> anyone alive in here?
<buntfu> i'm not sure why this room exist
<buntfu> there is never a response from anyone
<buntfu> even the mailing list is a joke
<buntfu> i believe effective marketing involve communication
<buntfu> is this room and the mailing list just for show
<buntfu> nothing really happens at all i guess
<buntfu> sigh what an effective marketing team here
<buntfu> good god
<quesh_i> bonjour
<buntfu> OMG let me take down the date and time of a response in this channel LOL
<buntfu> how r u quesh
<buntfu> sigh
<buntfu> hello?
<quesh_i> hi buntfu
#ubuntu-marketing 2011-07-27
<meway> If I want to stress to customers to try and use ubuntu what could I do to add to my site?
#ubuntu-marketing 2015-07-21
<rstreeter> I am having issues trying to login to spreadubuntu.org but it sends back an error "Sorry, that is not a valid OpenID. Please ensure you have spelled your ID correctly." I was wondering how to correct this?
