#ubuntu-translators 2011-01-31
<andrejz> hello dpm! you there ?
<dpm> hey andrejz, yep, I'm here :)
<andrejz> i was wondering what is the status of package upload into launchpad
<dpm> it's still unchanged since the last message on Friday
<andrejz> ok
<dpm> the team lead who'll deal with it is US-based, so the earliest time there can be an update will around this afternoon. Notice I say "there can be", not "there will be" :)
<dpm> don't worry, I'll keep people up to date through the translators list
<andrejz> ok, great
<dpm> sorry about the inconvenience, I know it's a bit of a pain. Fortunately, we're still not in string freeze
<gtriderxc> Whenever I unplug usb drive or photo camera, a massage  like this occurs: "Nie moÅ¼na wyÅwietliÄ "computer:///". which means "cannot dispay computer". never mind the post doesn't make any sense but word "computer" makes it all look like Windows 95 or MS-DOS. can anyone elp me to find the "computer" from this string?
<gtriderxc> the next few lines from that post are: ~~ Error: Location is already mounted
<gtriderxc> ~~choose another browser and try again
<andrejz> let me try ...
<artnay> gtriderxc: that's just bad design, not much that translation can do about it
<andrejz> i think computer:/// cannot be changed
<gtriderxc> if I knew in which packege it is I could report a bug
<gtriderxc> it looks like an alpha version :/
<artnay> that would more likely require a blueprint
<andrejz> it has to be a gnome package
<artnay> i.e. what should nautilus display when user unplugs device that has content visible on Nautilus' window
<gtriderxc> ok, i'll look 4 'em
<gtriderxc> umounting also generates errors
<andrejz> i think this is the string - "Could not display \"%s\"."
<andrejz> it's present in nautilus
<gtriderxc> ok thanx
#ubuntu-translators 2011-02-01
<dpm> good morning all
<andrejz> morning dpm
<dpm> morning andrejz :)
<TLE> morning everybody
<andrejz> morning TLE, how is freeciv going ?
<TLE> good, we didn't quite make it for the beta, but we will for teh final version
<andrejz> great. I just finished writing the report from yestardays translations meeting and sent it in all possible directions ;)
<andrejz> it took a while but it's wort it
<dpm> andrejz, I haven't seen it yet. Was that a meeting from your team?
<andrejz> we have meetings twice a month - once a more formal online so as many people can attend and once informal translation beer
<dpm> ah, yeah, I remember youtold me about the translation beers :)
<andrejz> you can see the list of events here and there are also links to google docs, but it's all in slovenian so i guess it might not help you much - http://slovenski-prevajalci.blogspot.com/p/pretekli-dogodki.html
<dpm> cool :)
<andrejz> but from the dates you can see some stuff is happening :)
<andrejz> now i am trying to energise a wider loco community (besides translators) but there hasn't been much effect so far. I am considering taking it over but i am not certian my timetable allows this
<dpm> hi happyaron, a quick question: I've got a couple of translations (audacity.mo, for example) on /usr/share/locale/zh/LC_MESSAGES - so there is no country code specified that can be used to tell Simplified vs. Traditional Chinese apart. Is that a bug in the apps providing those translations, or is the 'zh' code an alias for a particular Chinese variant?
<trijntje> Hi all, can someone give an indication as to how 'un-wise' it would be to begin translating programs for natty? Would a lot of work get lost?
<andrejz> hello trintje!
<andrejz> i don't think the changes are going to be drastic
<andrejz> especially for gnome package (meaning not unity and similar)
<andrejz> we have been translating natty (or more preciesly upstream sources) in slovanian team since it was available and not many strings have changed up till now, but strings always change among releases and it's soem extra work one must take into account
#ubuntu-translators 2011-02-02
<dpm> good morning all
<andrejz> Hello dpm! I was wondering if importst of ddtp_ubuntu packages are also halted
<dpm> hi andrejz, no, they shouldn't be. They are not imported as Ubuntu packages, IIRC. They are updated whenever there is a commit in the DDTP project
<andrejz> ok thanks
<dpm> yw :)
<dpm> ok, bye everyone, see you all tomorrow!
#ubuntu-translators 2011-02-03
<dpm> good morning all
<happyaron> dpm: morning!
<happyaron> dpm: could you have a look at bug 659280?
<ubot4> Launchpad bug 659280 in poppler-data (Ubuntu) (and 3 other projects) "subject: Remove the string tags include Bitstream VeraãDejaVu inside in the setting file /etc/fonts/conf.avail/69-language-selector-zh-xy.conf where xy represents cn, hk, mo, sg and tw individually. (affects: 2) (heat: 38)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/659280
<dpm> hi happyaron, good morning. Just a few minutes, I need to reboot. brb...
<happyaron> :)
<dpm> good morning again :)
<happyaron> :)
<happyaron> the bug I mentioned just now is bug 659280
<ubot4> Launchpad bug 659280 in poppler-data (Ubuntu) (and 3 other projects) "subject: Remove the string tags include Bitstream VeraãDejaVu inside in the setting file /etc/fonts/conf.avail/69-language-selector-zh-xy.conf where xy represents cn, hk, mo, sg and tw individually. (affects: 2) (heat: 38)" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/659280
<dpm> reading...
<dpm> happyaron, so as far as I understand, there is no agreement in how to fix this?
<happyaron> no
<happyaron> there are two opinions: fix it by changing fontconfig configuration so PDFs can work, but typefaces would be uglier; wait to fix it in poppler-data and all other applications that does not work as expected.
<dpm> happyaron, the thing is that we don't have a font expert anymore, and I'm not knowledgeable enough to propose a solution in this case. Right now, it is a bit difficult to follow with all the opinions. Do you think you could add a comment with a summary of the two alternatives, with pros and cons of each one?
<happyaron> dpm: I've tried to do that, but in fact the bug reporters are also arguing about which to choose on their forum.
<happyaron> you can only see few people write on that bug report because he's just a translator who summarize things on their forum.
<happyaron> I tried to read their forum posts, and they do not have an agreement either. personally I prefer to fix the problem in poppler-data, but unfortunately I cannot reproduce the bug in Debian so not sure whether I can forward it to Debian.
<dpm> happyaron, still, I think you have a good overview on this. If someone who either does not speak Chinese or doesn't follow those forums would definitely get confused with all the current comments. I'm not saying it's the solution, but I think such a comment with a summary would help
<happyaron> dpm: okay, I'll make the summary. But I think it's really an issue to be fixed. As far as I know most research papers in Chinese cannot be rendered correctly due to this issue, either zh_CN or zh_TW. I don't know the situation about Japanese and Korean.
<dpm> happyaron, is freeflying aware of this bug?
<happyaron> the special case in those research papers is they don't embed Chinese fonts to the PDF file, and our current settings cannot handle it at all.
<happyaron> dpm: not sure
<dpm> I'll point it to him, but as I say, right now all the comments make it a bit confusing (and the title of the bug, especially). The clearer it is, the easier it will be for someone to fix
<dpm> You've got a good understanding of the bug, do you think you could come up with a better title, e.g. "Cannot render PDFs without embedded fonts in Chinese and other languages" or something along the lines?
<happyaron> I'll try to make it clear for people who don't speak Chinese, but I failed to figure out why Debian works but Ubuntu does not (with same appearance on users experience, but not the same configuration files)
<happyaron> OK, let me try
<dpm> thanks happyaron
<happyaron> dpm: done
<happyaron> We'd move one to seek an expert to solve the problem.
<dpm> thanks happyaron, it looks much better now
<dpm> I'll point freeflying to it too
<happyaron> :)
<dpm> hi TLE, how are you doing? I sent you an e-mail about the language packs spec, have you had the chance to look at it?
<happyaron> dpm: personally I think we'd find someone knows about poppler and poppler-data
<dpm> happyaron, I'll look into it, but I cannot promise anything. I'm not familiar with it and I don't know anyone who is
<dpm> you might want to ask around in #ubuntu-devel or in #ubuntu-desktop
<happyaron> thanks
<TLE> dpm: hallo
<dpm> hey :)
<TLE> yes I saw your email
<TLE> I agree with you and it should just be done
<TLE> I can handle it myself and I think I should have time to do it tomorrow
<dpm> that sounds excellent, thanks
<TLE> np
<dpm> I'm looking forward to announcing this, it will address an important issue that hadn't been handled properly for a looong time.
<dpm> great work
<andrejz> @dpm: what is this about?
<dpm> andrejz, the language pack updates policy spec Kenneth has been working on -> https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/ubuntutheproject-community-n-translations-training-sessions
<andrejz> cool
<dpm> :)
<dpm> hi everyone, Translations training session starting in ~10 minutes, feel free to join in!
<dpm_> Hi everyone!
<dpm_> Welcome to the first ever Translations Training Session :)
<dpm_> we'll wait a couple of minutes to see if there are any late-comers
<dpm_> ok, let's get started
<dpm_> Let's see who's here, any new translators around?
<dpm_> ok, first of all, a few words about these sessions.
<dpm_> Here's how they will work:
<dpm_> We'll be running IRC sessions every two weeks, covering different topics on each one, all related to different aspects of translating Ubuntu.
<dpm_> The main goal is to help new translators giving them a quickstart on how to start contributing,
<dpm_> but we will also cover topics that can be of interest to more experienced translators or to people starting to create a new translation team.
<dpm_> As such, the range of topics will be broad. We've got a bunch of suggestions here:
<dpm_> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Translations/Training/Suggestions
<dpm_> and I encourage you to add your own suggestions on that page,
<dpm_> so we can make this more personal and tailor the sessions to what you think it is important to know as a translator.
<dpm_> When we run out of topics, we can repeat them again, as there are always new translators willing to learn :)
<dpm_> Eventually, I'd like the resources created during these sessions (translations training projects in Launchpad, session logs, session outlines) to be useful for each local translation team
<dpm_> to reuse them to run sessions in their language
<dpm_> But enough introductory talk. Let's get started.
<dpm_> * What we'll learn today: we'll focus on describing and using the Launchpad Translations web interface, which is what you'll be using to translate Ubuntu
<dpm_>  
<dpm_> The Translations Web UI
<dpm_> -----------------------
<dpm_> Generally, you'd be going to http://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu to translate your favourite distro
<dpm_> But today we'll be using a kind of a playground project in Launchpad,
<dpm_> so you can start playing around with translations and submitting data without the worry of sending or overwriting real translation data.
<dpm_> Here it is:
<dpm_> https://translations.launchpad.net/translations-training/trunk/+pots/translate-this
<dpm_> The Translations Training project
<dpm_> So if you all go there, we'll first start looking at all of the elements of the UI.
<dpm_> Go and click on the name of your language in that page, which should take you to the translatable messages.
<dpm_> For example in my case (Catalan), it takes me to:
<dpm_> https://translations.launchpad.net/translations-training/trunk/+pots/translate-this/ca/+translate
<dpm_> Once you are there, click at the little magnifier icon on the far left of the first translatable message.
<dpm_> It's the icon with a plus sign (+) on it.
<dpm_> If you cannot find it, don't worry, you can just go to the Catalan version here:
<dpm_> https://translations.launchpad.net/translations-training/trunk/+pots/translate-this/ca/1/+translate
<dpm_> Ok, so we're all set now, and we can start having a look at all the UI elements.
<dpm_> Here are the most important:
<dpm_> 1. The original English message.
<dpm_> That is the message on top, which says "My first ever translation".
<dpm_> This is the message you'll have to translate into your language.
<dpm_> We'll be calling this the original message or string (as in a string of characters),
<dpm_> and it will be always in English.
<dpm_> So you will in principle only need knowledge of English and the language you are trying to translate into
<dpm_> 2. The translators comment.
<dpm_> You'll see this text right below the original English message, next to a small info {i} icon.
<dpm_> These are messages that are written by developers to give additional information to translators as to the context of the message.
<dpm_> These are really useful to provide accurate translations, especially when the original text can be ambiguous
<dpm_> 3. Current translation.
<dpm_> Shown below the translators comment, this shows the current translation, if any, into the local language.
<dpm_> If there isn't any translation, it will show the text "(no translation yet)".
<dpm_> You'll see it's got a radio button, so that you can select the appropriate translation in case there are already translation suggestions (more on this below).
<dpm_> 4. Translation suggestions.
<dpm_> Right below the current translation, there is a space with radio buttons where translation suggestions (if any) are shown.
<dpm_> You will not see this if there haven't been any suggestions yet.
<dpm_> Translation suggestions are either translations that contributors have provided directly, or that have been found in other projects in Launchpad.
<dpm_> Launchpad is quite clever on this, and if it finds the same original message in any of the hosted projects, it will show it as a suggestion automatically for you.
<dpm_> meaning it will show the translations for the original message as a suggestion
<dpm_> Suggestions are quite a cool feature: they allow you to basically do "point and click" translation and save you a lot of work.
<dpm_> They will also allow you to ensure the quality of translations through review (more on this below).
<dpm_> You can also dismiss suggestions by ticking the "Dismiss all suggestions above" checkbox and committing the change by pressing the "Save & Continue" button.
<dpm_> 5. New translation.
<dpm_> This is the interesting part.
<dpm_> On this textbox you'll be able to submit your translations, which can be direct ones or suggestions - depending on the permissions of the translatable project and on your team membership.
<dpm_> It might show an expander at the end of it, which you can click in case you need to expand the text box to provide a longer translation
<dpm_> 6. Needs Review checkbox.
<dpm_> Right below the "New translation" text field, you'll see the "Someone should review this translation" checkbox.
<dpm_> You can use this to let reviewers look at your translations before they are accepted.
<dpm_> This is generally recommended for translation quality, as the reviewers will spot mistakes, typos and inconsistencies, and will help you getting translations right before they are released to users.
<dpm_> You will learn a lot from reviews, so I encourage you to get your translations reviewed by contacting the team responsible for your language
<dpm_> or to do reviews yourself
<dpm_> Ticking this checkbox and pressing the "Save & Continue" button will make your translations be submitted as suggestions, and applies only if you are already a member of a translation team.
<dpm_> If you are not yet, your translations will be submitted as suggestions always, without the need to tick that box.
<dpm_> As an example, you can see several suggestions, not yet reviewed and accepted, here:
<dpm_> https://translations.launchpad.net/translations-training/trunk/+pots/translate-this/ca/1/+translate
<dpm_> And here you can see a suggestion which has been reviewed and accepted:
<dpm_> https://translations.launchpad.net/translations-training/trunk/+pots/translate-this/ca/2/+translate
<dpm_> Notice how Launchpad properly credits both the translator and the reviewer.
<dpm_> 7. Source code reference.
<dpm_> Below the Needs Review checkbox you'll see a smaller text telling you where in the code for the program the string appears.
<dpm_> You shouldn't worry much about that, but in some cases,
<dpm_> this can be really useful to find out which file the string belongs to, or it might give you a hint to what kind of translation that is, depending on the type of file
<dpm_> 8. Zoom.
<dpm_> You've used this already, and it's the magnifier icon with the plus (+) or minus (-)
<dpm_> on the far left of the translatable message
<dpm_> If you click on it, it will let you switch between the single message view or all translatable messages view.
<dpm_> Useful to concentrate on a difficult translation or to get the URL to a particular message you want to point out to (i.e. for review or to show someone a particular translation).
<dpm_> 9. Copy text.
<dpm_> That's the arrow icon right to the left of the translatable message.
<dpm_> It provides a shortcut to be able to just copying the original text into the translation field
<dpm_> without having to retype the message
<dpm_> This comes in quite handy when the translation is actually the same as the original
<dpm_> i.e. it is actually not translated. This happens in the names of programs, acronyms, names of programming languages, etc.
<dpm_> 10. "Save & Continue" button.
<dpm_> That is a key part of the UI.
<dpm_> The moment you press it, your translations or suggestions are saved in the Launchpad database.
<dpm_> This allows you coming back at a later time to review them and they will be right there where you left them last time.
<dpm_> You don't have to complete all translations in a page
<dpm_> you can press it at any time and it will save only the ones you've made.
<dpm_> Ok, so that has covered the most important UI elements of the Launchpad Translations interface.
<dpm_> I tried to detail each one of them, but you'll see that they are quite intuitive and it will just take you a couple of minutes to get used to them.
<dpm_> -> Any questions so far?
<dpm_> ok, let's move on
<dpm_> Doing Your First Translations
<dpm_> -----------------------------
<dpm_> So now for the fun part.
<dpm_> The translations-training project is thought for you to experiment with translations and with all the UI elements.
<dpm_> It's thought of as a hands-on tutorial, as the translator comments will tell you more about the particular translation
<dpm_> and help you learn more about elements of translation.
<dpm_> It has just a few translatable messages now, but we'll be adding more in future sessions.
<dpm_> If you are not there yet, you can go to
<dpm_> https://translations.launchpad.net/translations-training
<dpm_> Then click on your language and start submitting your translation suggestions.
<dpm_> Right now the project is set up with Restricted permissions, in the same way Ubuntu is.
<dpm_> This means that you can only submit direct translations if you are a member of an approved translation team,
<dpm_> but you'll always be able to submit translation suggestions.
<dpm_> If, after you've tried submitting suggestions you want to see what it's like submitting direct translations, do let me know and I can change the permissions temporarily to Open, so that anyone can do it.
<dpm_> So go and play with this project, and do come back if you've got any questions
<dpm_> Everything clear so far?
<dpm_> So if there aren't any questions, we'll wrap up and leave it here for today, and we'll continue in two weeks time in the next session
<dpm_>  
<dpm_> Summary
<dpm_> -------
<dpm_> So today we learnt about:
<dpm_> * The Launchpad Translations UI elements and how to use them
<dpm_> * Submitting translations and suggestions through the Translations Training project in Launchpad: https://translations.launchpad.net/translations-training
<dpm_> Next session we can look at the rest of UI elements and to more advanced topics, for example translations workflow: how translation teams work
<dpm_> If you've got any questions, feel free to ping me any time on #ubuntu-translators
<dpm_> And thanks for reading! :-)
#ubuntu-translators 2011-02-04
<TLE> good morning eveybody
<TLE> love the new wiki theme, hadn't seen it before now
<dpm> good morning all
<TLE> good morning
<dpm> good morning TLE :)
<TLE> dpm: quick question
<TLE> Back when we were making the first schedule I had a chat with pitti about timings, and back then he told that when the lang packs are built, they are supposed to be automatically uploaded to the PPA, but that it was broken at the time. Do you know if it has been fixed?
<TLE> My reason for asking is that Lucid packages start build on Fridays, and therefore should be done and be automatically uploaded on saturdays. But if the automatic part does not work, and if pitti have as little desire to work on weekends as I have ;) then what
<dpm> TLE, it has been fixed, afaik
<TLE> great
<TLE> ok, that would mean that 2 weeks testing for the final Lucid lang pack should start tomorrow, that may be to short notice, push it back a week?
<dpm> yeah, perhaps. Let me remind myself of the schedule and check the status of the Lucid PPA...
<dpm> TLE, and re: the day of upload, I'm not sure if we should worry too much when they are built, and simply use the same day to announce testing. The reason being the simplification of the schedule, and that at the beginning of each cycle we might have to change the days of the PPA builds, as the older releases get dropped from https://dev.launchpad.net/Translations/LanguagePackSchedule and we make new way for the new release there. It would be great
<dpm>  if we could find a way not to have to change the langpack release schedule everytime we change the day on https://dev.launchpad.net/Translations/LanguagePackSchedule
<TLE> dpm: ok, the "standard" scedule is, testing starts thurs, testing deadline on wed (+1 or 2 weeks) and released thurs (+1 or 2 weeks)
<TLE> so then we will announce testing start this coming thursday and release 2 weeks after that
<dpm> sounds good. Let me have a chat with pitti in a few minutes and then check out what it looks like timewise for the release team. I'll need to request the generation of a full language pack as well (for point releases we always need full langpacks, no deltas)
<dpm> let me come back to you in a few minutes
<TLE> ok
<TLE> dpm: meeting for the next 1.5 hours, will check in later
<dpm> TLE, ok, thanks for letting me know, I'll post the outcome of the chat with pitti here for you to read later
<TLE> thanks
<TLE> well skipping the first hour meeting, I'll get started on the natty schedule as well and work with the same weekdays, let me know as soon as you know something
<dpm> TLE, ok, well if you join us on #ubuntu-desktop, pitti is just answering
<TLE> will do
<dpm> TLE, just to give you some context: I looked at the dates and saw that it was way too tight if we started next week. We always have to cater for the possibility that langpacks need to be regenerated if there is any breakage or if there is negative feedback on the testing. Thus here was my proposal:
<dpm> <dpm> heya pitti, seeing that the 10.04.2 release is on the 17th Feb, we need to generate new Lucid language packs. Here's a proposal:
<dpm>  As there isn't much time left if we want to have time to regenerate them if there is any problem,
<dpm>  I think I should request a full export today.
<dpm>  That would mean the PPA is built on Saturday and on Monday we can upload to -proposed and announce the testing period to translators
<dpm>  Does that sound ok? If we want to give people ~a week to test them, what would be the latest day we could upload them to -updates?
<dpm> --> cking (~king@cpc7-craw6-2-0-cust128.croy.cable.virginmedia.com) ha entrat a #ubuntu-desktop
<dpm>  virtuald (~vld@unaffiliated/virtuald) ha entrat a #ubuntu-desktop
<dpm>  seb128 (~seb128@ubuntu/member/seb128) ha entrat a #ubuntu-desktop
<dpm> <-- jmarsden s'ha desconnectat (Ping timeout: 276 seconds)
<dpm>  dbarth__ s'ha desconnectat ()
<dpm> --> dbarth__ (~dbarth@81-65-157-127.rev.numericable.fr) ha entrat a #ubuntu-desktop
<dpm>  sabdfl (~sabdfl@ubuntu/member/sabdfl) ha entrat a #ubuntu-desktop
<dpm>  jmarsden (~jmarsden@unaffiliated/jmarsden) ha entrat a #ubuntu-desktop
<dpm> <pitti> hi dpm (sorry, talking to other folks ATM)
<dpm>  dpm: that sounds good indeed, yes
<TLE> thanks
<dpm> That gives short notice for translators if they want to finish off any Lucid translation
<dpm> as I'll be requesting the export today
<dpm> but I prefer to be on the safe side
<dpm> in any case, if I announce this early today, that would give people still some hours until 22:00 UTC to fix or finish any critical translations
<TLE> yes
<TLE> dpm: couldn't you just annouce last chance to correct and testings beginds monday today and the follow up with testing deadline later
<dpm> TLE, yeah, that's what I was thinking
<dpm> I'll do that now
<dpm> so I'll send an e-mail explaining the situation and I'll send another one with an update after the release meeting
<TLE> yes
<TLE> dpm: now I really have to go to meeting, would you have a look at the draft for natty schedule: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Translations/NattyLanguagePackReleaseSchedule and see if you can spot any problems, then I'll check in with you shortly before lunch of after
<dpm> TLE, sounds good, just finishing off the announcement mail to translators and then I'll have a look. Thanks
<TLE> great :: np
<andrejz> hello dpm! I have a quesion for you :)
<andrejz>  it's about a string in ubitquity debconf
<andrejz> You can try ${RELEASE} without making any changes to your computer, directly from this ${MEDIUM}.
<andrejz> Do you happen to know where i could change the $medium variable?
<dpm> hi andrejz :)
<dpm> what do you mean by "change the variable"?
<andrejz> because in slovenian we add stuff to words. so with the current value of $medium this sentence can not be gramaticylly correct
<andrejz> well it works like this
<andrejz> i tried 11.04 today
<andrejz> and the string in slovenian ends with "usb disk"
<andrejz> but correct would be "usb diska"
<dpm> oh, I see
<andrejz> note the "a" in the end
<dpm> yeah, I understand
<andrejz> the problem is i cannot change the sentence in a way to sound correct with "usb disk"
<andrejz> usually this is possible but in this case it's not
<andrejz> in addition this is the first sentence a user sees when installing/trying ubuntu
<dpm> unfortunately, there is no way to change the variable. What I would recommend you to do is to file a bug against ubiquity and explain the case, and why a variable canot be used in this case
<andrejz> and first impression is very important
<dpm> I'm sure it affects other languages as well
<andrejz> ok
<dpm> so yeah, that'd be my suggestion ^ https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubiquity/+filebug
<dpm> you can add a task for the 'ubuntu-translations' project as well when you've done it
<andrejz> dpm how can i add ubuntu translators to the bug? I don't see the link?
<dpm> andrejz, can you give me the link to the bug? Then I can show you how to do it
<andrejz> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/ubiquity/+bug/712974
<ubot4> Launchpad bug 712974 in ubiquity (Ubuntu) "Impossible to properly translate ubiquity due to usage of $medium variable (affects: 1) (heat: 6)" [Undecided,New]
<dpm> andrejz, ok, to do this: first click on the "Also affects project" link on the bug page. Then, on the next screen:
<dpm> click on the "Choose another project" link
<dpm> Finally, on the "Project:" text field,
<dpm> replace "ubiquity" by "ubuntu-translations"
<dpm> Then press the "Continue" button and you're all set :)
<andrejz> ok done thanks!
<dpm> cool, thank you :)
<dpm> TLE, ok, the Natty schedule looks great, I've got two pieces of feedback:
<dpm> 1/ I'd make all the testing cycles 1 week, as we did in Maverick. For two reasons:
<dpm> * Consistence. And it's easier to remember that language pack testing lasts a week, rather than having to consult if it's a 2 week or 1 week cycle
<dpm> * The QA team have 1 week testing period for their milestones. It would be good to align with their QA practices
<dpm> 2/ I realise that's something that should probably be changed in the template, but I think, rather than having the "1 week cycle" text in the first column it would be more helpful to have the week number, similarly to what's done in https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LucidReleaseSchedule (i.e. +2, +6, etc.)
<dpm> 3/ Ok, that's more than two pieces of feedback, but it just dawned on me :) Perhaps we should rework the template to align more with the general w.u.c/${CODENAME}ReleaseSchedule layout. People are already familiar with it, and it would be easier to migrate the language pack schedule pages to the main schedule page if in the future we decide to move the langpack info to the main calendar. We can do this later, I think we should now concentrate on g
<dpm> etting the Lucid and Natty schedules done
<dpm> TLE, on 3/, I've gone ahead and done the changes, as a proposal of the alternative layout to match the main release schedule page. This way it's easier to see the effect. Let me know what you think (we can revert to a previous wiki revision if you like): https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Translations/NattyLanguagePackReleaseSchedule
<dpm> ah, too slow typing, he's gone :/
<TLE> dpm: hey
<TLE> I has to reboot, for some wierd reason my mouse sometimes behaves very strange
<dpm> hi TLE, no worries, I just sent the feedback per e-mail, just in case
<TLE> thanks for e-mailing it to me, I will have a look at in a little while, untill when are you here today
<dpm> either 19:00 or 20:00, I think
<TLE> ok great
<dpm> :)
 * dpm lunch
<kamusin> Hola!
<dpm> hola kamusin, como te va?
<TLE> dpm: hey
<dpm> hey TLE
<TLE> i am looking at your comments now
<TLE> changing to one week sound fine for me
<TLE> and counting week in the first column ditto
<TLE> same for the style
<TLE> of the page
<TLE> I can see that you have already made some of the corrections
<dpm> great
<TLE> I'm afraid however that you moved the wrong end of the interval, if it is still supposed to follow the schedule we made ;)
<TLE> but thats a minor detail
<dpm> It was probably my mistake, as I wasn't intending to change the original schedule
<TLE> the week number + 2, 6, 12, 22, 35 and 43 refer to the week they should be released, not where the testing starts
<dpm> oh, I see what you mean
<dpm> then no, it wasn't my intention to change that
<dpm> sorry
<TLE> np, I'll change the dates and then hopefully we are done with the wiki version
<dpm> ok, cool
<TLE> actually for the first ones the dates were right but the week numbers off, at least the way I count it
<TLE> dpm: I think for the one that arrives right after x-mas it makes sense to keep the 2 week schedule, upload for testing right before x-mas and release right after new years
<dpm> TLE, yeah, I was actually looking at it now :)
<dpm> I agree
<dpm> yeah, feel free to correct what's necessary. I didn't check carefully the week numbers to match the dates, I just added the week numbers you had in the page with the previous layout to the first row/date
<TLE> dpm: there we go, the week numbers seem to be differently aligned when they span several rows and when they don't, you wouldn't happen to know the syntax to fix it by heart?
<dpm> TLE, vv
<dpm> ||<|2> row cell 1 || row cell 2 ||
<dpm> || row cell 2 ||
<dpm> For a table with two rows
<dpm> the first column spanning 2 rows
<TLE> yes that's the markup to make it span, but how do I fix the alignment (row cell 1 is centered) but non spanning cells are left aligned
<dpm> oh, alignment, sorry
<dpm> no, I don't know then. Perhaps a bug in moin or in the Ubuntu wiki theme?
<dpm> is the different alignment very obvious on the rendered page?
<TLE> it is in my browser, have a look for your self, it is saved now: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Translations/NattyLanguagePackReleaseSchedule
<TLE> anyway, I can search for it my self, I just thought maybe you knew the magic words
<dpm> no, sorry :(
<kamusin> bien gracias dpm y tu? :)
<dpm> it looks fine (or non-obvious for me in FF, though) looking at it with chromium now
<TLE> I'm using chrome
<dpm> kamusin, bien, bien, tambien :)
<TLE> dpm I figured it out: replace <|2> with <style="text-align: left;" |2> then it's all good
<dpm> ah, so explicitly setting the alignment
<TLE> dpm: yes, I don't know why i changes it when you merge cells, but this will work
<TLE> other than that do we then agree that it is as it should be at this point?
<dpm> Yeah, but let me have a final look to confirm
<dpm> TLE, looks great. I think the +1 date might be a bit tight, but let's leave it as it is and refine it when we reach that point.
<TLE> dpm: maybe, I actually I think it would be great if we could give a try, I think it is good to have it for those rare very ugly errors, but we'll see
<TLE> ok then, it's about time to wrap it up, I'm getting thirsty and I can hear the friday bar calling me, so status is:
<TLE> natty wiki version complete (for now), you e-mail me about the decision about the dates (all 3 of them) for the final lucid release and then I update the wiki page accordingly and then it is done
<TLE> and after that I add both of them to the google calendar this weekend
<dpm> TLE, oh yeah, yeah, I agree. I'm just saying that in that week we've got other things to do which require different people to be available, such as setting up the schedule for exports in LP, setting up the Natty PPA, etc., so this might get in the way of meeting the +1 deadline and push it to +2
<dpm> TLE, great. Before you go, do you think you could update https://blueprints.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+spec/ubuntutheproject-community-n-translations-language-pack-updates-schedule with the actions that are done?
<TLE> yes I agree :: yes I will update it
<TLE> btw, about the lucid lang pack
<TLE> I think it makes a lot of sense to make the lang pack update even if it does not get to go on the cd, and then just send it out as a regular update
<TLE> just to make sure that all the final work that people have done on lucid will get sent out there, being a LTS and all
<dpm> yes, I'll make sure we address that, even if it's just released slightly after .2 in -updates
<TLE> yes :: you have a nice weekend
 * TLE is off for a beer
<dpm> TLE, you too! thanks!
<kamusin> hello again, please could somebody tell me the name of package that have all description for an application (description for your language)? by the way,  is not debian/control file
#ubuntu-translators 2011-02-05
<trijntje> Hi all, how do ubuntu package numbers correspond to those of gnome? For example yelp has yelp 2.91.10-0ubuntu2 on LP, but the highest version upstream is 2-30 (or master)
<happyaron> trijntje: 2.91 is "master"
<happyaron> trijntje: http://live.gnome.org/TwoPointNinetyone
<trijntje> thanks for the link
<trijntje> is launchpad able to automatically import the latest packages from upstream or should this still be done manually?
<happyaron> manually
<happyaron> at the beginning of a development cycle, launchpad auto sync from Debian, and we stop the sync at a special time called Debian Import Freeze, then all packages are uploaded either manually, or triggered by hand and then upload to archive with a semi-automatical script
<trijntje> happyaron, ok thaks, I've heard people are working on upstream import, but I wasnt sure what te status of that was
<happyaron> "upstream import" is probably for translations? I don't think people would do upstream import for packages.
<trijntje> yes, upstream import for translations
#ubuntu-translators 2012-01-30
<dpm> good morning everyone
<TLE> dpm: good news, I have something working now \o/
<TLE> sent you an email with the details
<dpm> TLE, cool. I started setting up the server on Friday (I've now got a server accessible from the net with public IP), but got stuck at setting up the django server with juju. I'll ask around today if someone can help me, and if not, I'll set it up without juju, just plain old apache + django
<TLE> dpm: great
<TLE> dpm: btw, it just hit me, you said that you couldn't give me admin rights for the server (so I can't e.g. set up apache and django) which is all right, because I have no idea of how to do that anyway. But as far as I know, the django code can live anywhere, so if you want me to still help maintaing it, you can just make an ordinary user for me and make sure that I have write access to the folders it is checked out for
<dpm> TLE, good point. We can try to set this up now while the server is just a test one on the cloud, but if it all works out and end up moving it to an ubuntu server (e.g. translations.ubuntu.com), then this will not work out - i.e. the IS deparment won't allow ad-hoc deployments, they need to be requested and they do the deployments themselves, even if it's just checking out a branch
<TLE> dpm: yeah I absolutely understand, it's not really that I need it, so if you don't doing that in the mean time, then you don't need to bother
<dpm> TLE, no worries, I'd happily give you admin rights, I just wanted to let you know the procedure after it's moved to a production server
<TLE> yes, I understand
<dpm> TLE, I've read your first e-mail. Re: "stealing" CSS, you can also safely use CSS from developer.ubuntu.com, as at least that site's code is properly licensed (GPLv3)
<TLE> dpm: ok, well, the lp one had some font definitions which falls back to downloading the font online, which was quite elegant, I'll see if I can find that somewhere on developer.ubuntu.com
<dpm> TLE, yeah, it does the same, it's standard practice on several *.ubuntu.com sites
<TLE> btw, is currently looking into allowing people to download a tarball with the original or localized figures
<TLE> which is actually a lot less trouble than I thought
<dpm> TLE, I'm not sure I understand the sentence, did you mean s/is/I'm/ ?
<TLE> ehh yeah, on what sentence, I meant to say
<TLE> btw, I'm currently looking into allowing people to download a tarball with the original or localized figures
<TLE> which is actually a lot less trouble than I thought
<TLE> aka I'm done
<TLE> dpm: ^^
<dpm> cool :)
<TLE> I luuuuuve python
<TLE> yeah
<TLE> I'll commit the changes i sec
<TLE> dpm: commited, btw, found all the fonts on duc, so that's all taken care of
<dpm> excellent
<TLE> dpm: hey, I'm registering a project for it, any special demands for the license if we hope to get it on a ubuntu server at some point?
<dpm> I think GPL 3 should be a safe option
<TLE> dpm: ok
<TLE> there we go: https://launchpad.net/translated-documentation-screenshot-viewer
<TLE> bbl
<dpm> cool
#ubuntu-translators 2012-01-31
<dpm> good morning all
<TLE> good morning
#ubuntu-translators 2012-02-01
<dpm> good morning
<jokerdino> morning there. :)
<dpm> hey jokerdino
<jokerdino> i had a chat with my translation team since we last discussed it.
<jokerdino> they apparently said they were more involved in translating upstream than here.
<jokerdino> which i think is understandable. but what i don't understand is that, there are still no progress in the precise status.
<jokerdino> the upstream translation is auto updated or manual?
<dpm> jokerdino, upstream translations are automatically imported
<jokerdino> that just makes things more gloomy.
<jokerdino> upstream translations are close to completion but Ubuntu's is way below near completion.
<dpm> jokerdino, is there any particular package that you've noticed it's done upstream and not in Ubuntu?
<dpm> What I mean is, we need detailed info to investigate if anything is happening
<dpm> so the more detailed, the more likely we can solve the problem if there is any
<jokerdino> > debian installer is more or less completely updated.
<jokerdino> yet it still has incompleted strings in Ubuntu. (https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/precise/+lang/ta)
<jokerdino> and i see that most of the incompleted ones are Ubuntu specific apps.
<jokerdino> like ubuntu one and checkbox
<dpm> jokerdino, cool, more info makes things easier, thanks :-) debian-installer is a special case, as it's manually imported due to the differences on how the translations are handled at the technical level, so it's just a matter of time before upstream translations are imported. But yeah, it seems upstream translations in Launchpad are in pretty good shape, and your team would need someone to focus on the Ubuntu-specific templates
<jokerdino> right. that clears things.
<jokerdino> we have about two months before the translation string freeze...
<dpm> yeah, I think it might be worth starting anyway. Some of the strings might change, but it's unlikely that they all will do, and that should help you in getting organized and advancing some work
<jokerdino> and, do you know where i should be looking for help regarding the mailing lists? I have problem seeing the Tamil messages...
<dpm> jokerdino, what problem do you have exactly?
<jokerdino> All Tamil messages just appear as question marks.
<jokerdino> I can only read the ones sent in English.
<jokerdino> I am not sure if it can be tuned in the browser setting.
<dpm> jokerdino, can you send me a link to one of those messages?
<jokerdino> Where do I find the link for the message?
<jokerdino> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-tam/2012-January/001202.html
<jokerdino> Ah, that is the discussion thread.
<dpm> looking now...
<jokerdino> I can see the messages in that link. But, when I receive an email, I can't see the messages.
<dpm> jokerdino, it might be an issue with your e-mail client. Have you tried asking on the list, if anyone is experiencing the same problem?
<jokerdino> one of them said, here in the chat, that they had to alter some settings in the browser. But, they weren't too sure about which one that was.
<jokerdino> I use Gmail web client.
<dpm> jokerdino, there are some settings to use UTF-8 encoding by default, you can try that
<jokerdino> I tried those before... they gave some other funny characters.
<jokerdino> may be i will just visit the online lists archives. i didn't know such a thing existed before.
<dpm> jokerdino, or you might want to try to choose another encoding
<jokerdino> sure, i will try them and get it fixed sooner.
<jokerdino> BTW, I have nominated myself for the next moderator election on AU..
<jokerdino> Aye or Nay?
<dpm> what's AU?
<jokerdino> Oh hmm Ask Ubuntu
<dpm> ah, cool
<TLE> dpm: hey, how goes with the django deployment?
<TLE> and ... goodmorning
 * TLE remembers my lessons in polite interaction with other people ;)
<jokerdino> TLE:  that should be quite enriching.
<TLE> jokerdino: yeah
<jokerdino> usually, if you throw in a lot of smileys in an online convo, you will sound less rude.
<dpm> morning TLE :)
<jokerdino> oh my. i forgot the ubuntu dev classes.
<jokerdino> BBL people.
<dpm> TLE, I was trying to set up the django server again last night, but got stuck with some juju issues, I've asked the right people and I'm waiting for a response
<dpm> (just a quick FYI)
<TLE> dpm: ahh great, don't mean to be pushing, just looking forward to it
<dpm> yeah, no worries, I just thought by using juju it would be quick, but it seems it's still got a few things that need ironing out
<jokerdino> apparently, i don't know the exact timings of ubuntu dev classes. :/
<jokerdino> i misread the UTC timing as my local timing.
<jokerdino> in any case, BBL
<dpm> jokerdino, Ubuntu Developer Week starts later on, in a few hours
<dpm> well, it started yesterday, today it's day 2
<TLE> dpm: yeah off course, it makes sense with some in house testing when there is the chance for it
<jokerdino> well, yeah, now i know it. :(
<TLE> jokerdino: there are always the IRC logs if you missed something
<jokerdino> what's the fun in that?
<jokerdino> oh i forgot the smiley face.
<jokerdino> :D
<jokerdino> anyways, this is really off topic.
<jokerdino> let's just stick with the translation matters.
<TLE> jokerdino: I think that is ok, we usually don't get swamped with translation matters
<jokerdino> oh hmm
<jokerdino> dpm: reading up on the previous messages from my translation team that i failed to read, the current leader suggests that the new leader should best be in Tamil Nadu. For the sake of collecting CDs and organizing things in the field.
<jokerdino> Context: Tamil is mainly spoken in Tamil nadu, India and I am currently living in Singapore.
<jokerdino> more context: i was proposing to him that i be the next leader. which he said might not be the best decision going forward. instead he suggests that i can be leading the team in singapore.
<dpm> jokerdino, being at the same place is generally not a requirement for a translation team leader: for a while, I was leading the Catalan translation team while living on another country
<jokerdino> well yeah.
<dpm> jokerdino, it might make sense for the LoCo team leader, but afaik if the current leader is not active and not organizing these potential local events, and you're active and eager to drive the translation team forward, you should be the best candidate for the job
<dpm> also the translation team lead is not the same as the loco team lead (though he/she can be)
<jokerdino> you make sense.
<jokerdino> but in our case, the translation team and the loco team is just the same.
<jokerdino> just with different names.
<jokerdino> i am guessing he probably misunderstood me.
<dpm> as far as I understand it from previous conversations, the current Tamil Ubuntu translation team is dormant, so it might be worth separating it from the loco and infuse some energy into it
<dpm> it's not like separating, it's distributing work
<dpm> which is the beauty of Ubuntu and the community
<dpm> so for me, if no one is actively leading the translation team, it makes very much sense to have someone new picking it up
<jokerdino> both the loco and the translation team are dormant.
<dpm> oh :(
<jokerdino> i will get back to them and clarify that i was only nominating myself for the translation team and not the loco team.
<dpm> yeah, that sounds great. Let me know if I can help in any way
<jokerdino> one more thing, are there any prerequisites for someone to be a leader of the translation team?
<jokerdino> why i am asking this is because i am not currently active translating, because the lack of support and activity kinda makes me demotivated.
<dpm> the prerequisites are actually simple and pretty common sense ones. Let me dig out the url where we explain this...
<dpm> jokerdino, here you are: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Translations/KnowledgeBase/TeamCoordinatorResponsibilities
<jokerdino> thanks!
<dpm> no worries, if there is anything I or the rest of the translations community can do to help, feel free to ask here or on the ubuntu-translators mailing list
<jokerdino> thanks. i am on the mailing list.
<dpm> excellent, so one requirement for becoming a translation team leader ticked off the list ;-)
<jokerdino> ;D
<trijntje> dpm: are there still plans to open up some universe packages for translation? The dutch team is doing a huge revision of virtualbox, it would be nice if those could be included in the LTS
<kelemengabor1> dpm: ping, is it meeting time yet?
<dpm> kelemengabor1, argh, I thought it was tomorrow!, let me check!
<kelemengabor1> IIRC wednesday is today :)
<dpm> I've just finished a call, just a sec...
<dpm> yeah, it's definitely wednesday :)
<dpm> let me quickly pull the agenda...
<dpm> kelemengabor1, give me 2 mins and then we can start
<kelemengabor1> sure. I just pinged andrejz
<dpm> excellent, thanks
<dpm> kelemengabor1, ok, invite sent
<dpm> kelemengabor1, https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Translations/KnowledgeBase/#Special_translations
#ubuntu-translators 2012-02-02
<dpm> good morning all
<TLE> dpm: good morning
<TLE> btw, did yo guys have a meeting yesterday? I missed it in my calendar
<dpm> TLE, no worries. Yes, we did, I'll send the notes some time this morning
<TLE> dpm: ok, I'll have a look at them
#ubuntu-translators 2012-02-03
<dpm> good morning all
<Mirv> morning :)
<TLE> good morning
<dpm> morning TLE
<TLE> hallo
<dpm> TLE, so it seems after talking to some canonicalers, that I'll have to give up on juju to install the django server and just do it straight from packages
<dpm> sorry it's taking a while, I'm doing it between other jobs
<TLE> dpm: that's no so good, isn't that supposed to be one of those things that you should be able to do with juju?
<TLE> *G*
<dpm> lol
<TLE> in any case, don't worry about the deployment taking time, I'm just eager to get it up and running so I attention-wise can put it a little on the backburner
<dpm> TLE, yeah, but it's depending on charms being written for each type of deployment. So juju works well, but the current django charm is simply not finished
<TLE> dpm: yeah I figured as much
<TiMiDo> greetings my Ubuntu Friends ;)
<TLE> TiMiDo: greetings and salutations
<TiMiDo> like wise TLE
<TiMiDo> how is Denmark TLE
<TLE> freaking cold right now, but otherwise great
<dpm> hi TiMiDo
<TiMiDo> hello there dpm
<kelemengabor> dpm: TLE: hi, could you guys give a little publicity on FB/G+ to this link: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/MeetingLogs/devweek1201/FixingI18NBugs
<dpm> kelemengabor, oh, damn, I forgot to do it last night!
<dpm> shit
<dpm> I'll do this now
<kelemengabor> nevermind, it is too thick anyways to understand it in "live" mode :)
<dpm> I'm sorry about that, I promoted the app dev talks and then I got sidetracked
<dpm> kelemengabor, done
<kelemengabor> thanks!
<TLE> dpm: that IRC mode for the wiki is a little annoying, in that it doesn't break the lines
<dpm> TLE, I know, I too noticed that the theming in the wiki has become worse in that regard :/
<dpm> text used to be out of the central column if it was longer. It wasn't pretty, but at least it was readable
<TLE> I was pondering scripting something to somehow fix it, maybe forcing a 80 char line width and if the IRC wont accept that, then make some custom markup
<TLE> err: the IRC mode
<TLE> afk
#ubuntu-translators 2013-01-28
<dpm> hi danilos, good morning. If you're around, would you mind looking at this merge proposal I sent for intltool yesterday? https://code.launchpad.net/~dpm/intltool/add-qtdesigner-support/+merge/145112
<danilos> dpm, hi, overall it looks good: can you ping me towards the end of the day please (so I can focus a bit more on the regexes)?
<dpm> danilos, sure, thanks
<dpm> danilos, here's the "ping me towards the end of the day" ping, if you've got a minute to review the regexes on the intltool MP: https://code.launchpad.net/~dpm/intltool/add-qtdesigner-support/+merge/145112 :-)
#ubuntu-translators 2014-01-28
<eyfour> Hi, all. I am having problems with Launchpad. It returns an 'msgstr' error, even when I copy the original string and try to use it. See https://tinyurl.com/omdzfwg (change "nb" in the parsed url to your preferred lang-code, e.g. "it" for Italian). Any ideas?
<eyfour> This only happens with the particular string that I linked above.
<dpm> eyfour, hm, that sounds like a malformed original string -> that (%&#x27;f) looks a bit suspicious to me. Launchpad runs gettext on the string to check for errors, and it seems gettext is throwing that msgstr error
<dpm> Not much there we can do unless the original string is fixed upstream
<eyfour> I see. Thanks for the reply anyway :)
#ubuntu-translators 2014-01-29
<sasa84> hi guys! may i ask if there is any list of primary/most important translations (translation packages)  to do for 14.04?
<trijntje_> sasa84: yes there is
<trijntje_> https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/trusty
