#ubuntu-us-mi 2011-04-18
<snap-l> Wow, that was loud. :)
<Black839> what up
<rick_h_> brousch: I hear that the rush concert was so bad the band is burning all the tape and breaking up now. ;)
<brousch> rush? are they still around?
<brousch> my step mom has some of their albums
<brousch> do they mount their instruments to walkers or hoverounds?
<rick_h_> I'm not sure, the video will never survive
<brousch> and anyone who was there won't remember due to Alzheimer's
<brousch> bummer
<rick_h_> probably
<snap-l> I think someone is looking for a paddling
<tjagoda> Oh my
<rick_h_> lol
<rick_h_> I'm surprised you're up and about this early
<snap-l> I am too
<slestak> Rush is a bad name for a band that old
<slestak> (and I do like them)
<slestak> Im reminded of the Carol Burnett show cahracter with Tim Conway "I'm On My Way..... There"
<snap-l> If you saw the band that I saw last night, you wouldn't be saying that. :)
<snap-l> They're still well in the height of their powers
<snap-l> They recorded the show two nights prior, so if anyone wants a free screening of why Rush is still the #1 band out there, LMK, and when the DVD comes out, we'll do a screening
<rick_h_> well no point seeing it if we can't see snap-l going nuts in the front row throwing underwear on stage
<snap-l> One does not throw things at Rush
<snap-l> one gets things thrown to him by Rush
<snap-l> like Back Stage Passes
<snap-l> which would be nice if they'd work on their throwing arm a little bit
<rick_h_> too told to make the back seats?
<rick_h_> /told/old
<jrwren> i just read vwduder's tweet about a gtk3 based abiword... I haven't heard or thought about abiword in at least 7 years.
<snap-l> rick_h_: You're just jealous that Kiss isn't touring. :)
<rick_h_> yea, that'd be a good use of a bomb
<snap-l> A love bomb, maybe.
<rick_h_> lol, never could stand kiss, like ac/dc
<rick_h_> for some reason, just never got it
<snap-l> Yeah, about the only thing that I can appreciate of Kiss is the marketing mind of Gene Simmons
<snap-l> I mean, putting the logo and his ugly mug on just about anything out there exhibits the same shock value that the band were so well known for
<snap-l> But after that, it's all pretty middling for me
<snap-l> Funny enough, Rush toured with Kiss for a while
<tjagoda> http://arstechnica.com/open-source/news/2011/04/oracle-gives-up-on-ooo-after-community-forks-the-project.ars
<tjagoda> Good summary of why Oracle threw the towel in its OOo fight
<snap-l> Gee, you mean people will leave if we treat them like shit?
<snap-l> Whooda thunk it
<tjagoda> I like the last line of that article
<tjagoda> "Oracle's current approach to dealing with the communities that  participate in its own open source software projects is clearly not  sustainable, and is arguably becoming detrimental to some aspects of the  company's long-term business agenda. "
<snap-l> Oracle's reasons for the acquisition of Sun can be summed up in one word: hardware.
<snap-l> They don't give a shit about the software side of the house
<snap-l> Java might get some attention
<snap-l> Owning MySQL means they have the mindshare of the small database market (at least those that haven't skipped off to another fork or PostgreSQL)
<snap-l> Virtualbox is Virtualbox.
<snap-l> It's a shame that Jonathan Schwartz wasn't more successful
<jrwren> why is that a shame?
<snap-l> Because I'm one of the few people that appreciated what Sun did in it's last days.
<jrwren> what do you appreciate?
<jrwren> I saw Schwartz's role as cleaning up after mcnealy and preping for sale.
<snap-l> That they opened up Star Office, made NetBeans available for free, started the path to open-sourcing Java, and released VirtualBox as GPL
<snap-l> And didn't screw too much with the licensing of MySQL
<snap-l> Essentially, they gave away their products
<jrwren> didn't nearly all of that happen before schwarz?
<tjagoda> Because who was going to buy Star Office anyway?
<tjagoda> =P
<snap-l> Which, um, isn't a particularly sustainable business model, but didn't make me wince in pain when I saw their logo
<snap-l> jrwren: I thought that all happened within his reign
<jrwren> i have no idea.
<jrwren> i only know that sun has never impressed me.
<jrwren> the 80s they may have had some great tech, that was before my time.
<jrwren> but since 1994 everything they have done has been trumped by abilities of linux and open source.
<snap-l> jrwren: You were born in the 1990s?
<jrwren> before my unix time silly.
<jrwren> i'm only a few yrs younger than you.
<snap-l> I always thought you were born yesterday. ;)
<jrwren> yes yes.
<jrwren> and you just started using linux yesterday.
<snap-l> Every day I start using Linux. :)
<snap-l> Feel like I'm constantly learning
<jrwren> and every day its like the first time.
<jrwren> me too.
<jrwren> that is great.
<snap-l> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qBxbPts5tOk
<snap-l> jrwren: ^
<jrwren> i just learned about Windows Search Services or some such and its a never been attempted GSoC
<jrwren> I really hope someone picks it up
<jrwren> hahaha.
<jrwren> snap-l: i will not listen to that, but you made me laugh.
<snap-l> Yeah, I didn't get too far into that song
<snap-l> Schwartz was president and COO of Sun in 2004
<snap-l> So it could very well have been his hand making these decisions with Scott McNealy rubber-stamping them
<snap-l> McNealy became a ghost after a while.
<tjagoda> snap-l wants to believe in the Schwartz
<jrwren> got ya.
<jrwren> I knew mcnealy wasn't out that early
<jrwren> but i can respect that he was COO
<snap-l> tjagoda: May the Schwartz be with you.
<snap-l> McNealy went to cranbrook
<snap-l> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scott_McNealy#Opinions
<tjagoda> I hate it when my Schwartz gets twisted.
<snap-l> Very profound idea on the networking piece
<jrwren> really?
<jrwren> the network is the computer?
<jrwren> well, it turned out sun was right on that, but it certainly wasn't like anything they ever suggested.
<snap-l> Thereâs a pendulum thing where stuff is on the client side and then goes back into the network where it belongs. The answering machine put voicemail by the desk, and then it went back into the network. Your iPod is like your home answering machine. I guarantee you it will be hard to sell an iPod five or seven years from now when every cell phone can access your entire music library wherever you are."
<snap-l> Of course he didn't see the iPhone coming. :)
<jrwren> yeah.
<jrwren> or rather he DID see the iphone coming. he called it exactly ;)
<snap-l> I assume he meant that these devices would all be running some shit like Blackberry's JVM. ;)
<jrwren> i thought it would be a sun client to a sun server somewhere.
<jrwren> like the Sun RAY protocol in your hand.
<tjagoda> Don't be hating the JVM
<snap-l> Oh, more than likely
<tjagoda> =(
<jrwren> how can you not hate the JVM?
<snap-l> tjagoda: The JVM is nice, when it isn't running Java. ;)
<jrwren> even then it kind of sucks, no runtime generics.
<jrwren> Hotspot JIT is very cool though.
<snap-l> Grr, I'm going to have to shovel
<jrwren> my thunderbird profile is 9GB.
<rick_h_> dammit, I'm going to kill someone today. There's no saving it any more
<_stink_> i'll start taking donations for bail
<jrwren> rick_h_: where is your github?
<jrwren> I want to try that jj in my .vimrc
<rick_h_> github.com/mitechie/
<rick_h_> add /pyvim for the vim repo
<rick_h_> _stink_: yea, send a layer to NC
<_stink_> *that* guy again?
<rick_h_> yea, except now I'm being told to fix his code
<rick_h_> he gets some stupid mysql timeout errors he can't trace
<rick_h_> and blames my auth code that runs fine on 4 other projects
<rick_h_> so boss sends it to me to fix, so now I have to deal with all this crap code
<_stink_> ... yikes
<rick_h_>    # Most of the stuff below is from Rick's QMAIL project - it represents code to support
<rick_h_>     # the CRUD of user accounts. Since my page flow didn't map well to Rick's, I've created my own
<rick_h_>     # controller (admin.py) and template (admin/start.mako) to handle these functions.
<rick_h_> so he comments out my working freaking code, that's 5 methods, all working
<tjagoda> We have a business critical web app
<tjagoda> It doesn't work in firefox 4
<tjagoda> it doesn't work in IE 9
<rick_h_> and creates a giant 400 line single point "add, edit, displayu users" master controller
<tjagoda> It doesn't work in the latest version of chrome
<tjagoda> -_-
<rick_h_> tjagoda: heh, we have that too, our ereview system
<rick_h_> the JS that asks "Are you sure" is ie specific to IE < 9
<tjagoda> Fucking webapps
<_stink_> rick_h_: hah.  "page flow" == "brain" in this case
<jrwren> mitechie... here I was googling for rick_h
<rick_h_> no, fucking dumass devs that can't learn how to use a language without being retarded about it
<tjagoda> Even the aesthetics don't render correctly
<rick_h_> _stink_: exactly, so how much time did he waste with this pile of shit when I GAVE him working code
<tjagoda> When a sizable portion of the community does it wrong, I move on from blaming devs and instead target the entire market =P
<rick_h_> and oh let me count the bugs...1...2...12
<rick_h_> tjagoda: your one app == entire market?
<tjagoda> We also have the same issue with Covisint web apps
<tjagoda> They just never work in anything other than IE
<tjagoda> and probably not in IE9 anymore either
<rick_h_> then send them a bug and tell them to hire real web devs vs kids in high school
<tjagoda> Covisint publishes what Chrysler makes, I think
 * snap-l avoids the "your first problem..." joke
<rick_h_> or just make sure they're not kids in high school
<tjagoda> snap-l should know
<tjagoda> he's the chrysler insider =P
<rick_h_> yea, I've seen chrylsers shit
<tjagoda> Maybe I should revise my statement to say "Fucking automotive webapps"
<snap-l> tjagoda: ding ding ding
<rick_h_> they can't get a single header worth of CSS to be cross browser and that's with one image and two links
<snap-l> tjagoda: You only have to test one browser, and that's IE6
<snap-l> everything else be damned.
<tjagoda> I hate this market so much
<tjagoda> Everything is done for the minimum cost
<tjagoda> Which is real fun for IT, the HUGE COST CENTER
<snap-l> tjagoda: Yeah, it's all IT"s fauly.
<snap-l> fault, even
<tjagoda> I mean, I understand why they only dev to one browser
<tjagoda> because their managers cut off all the funding to do more than one
<tjagoda> but that does not make me hate them any less
<jrwren> jj is gonna take some getting used to. I'm an esc basher.
<_stink_> same here
<_stink_> i haven't tried jj yet
<rick_h_> jrwren: yea, give it a couple of days though
<snap-l> I can't get away from the escape key
<snap-l> Sorry, but I've dismissed otherwise good keyboards because the escape key felt like a mushy calculator button
<tjagoda> Have I complained about the keyboard on my new HP laptop yet?
<tjagoda> It is easy to type on
<tjagoda> but it bounces
<tjagoda> the rest fo this EliteBook 8740w is built like a rock
<tjagoda> but the keyboard flexes
<snap-l> Friend brought over the new Chrysler-issued laptops
<tjagoda> -_-
<snap-l> Oh.My.God.They.Are.Shit.
<tjagoda> What are they?
<snap-l> HP ProBook
<snap-l> locked down beyond belief
<tjagoda> I bought one ProBook
<snap-l> with a runway of lights on the front
<tjagoda> They are so flimsy
<tjagoda> so much flex
<slestak> anyone know if thre is gonna be a beta 3 before golive?
<tjagoda> I'd doubt there's time
<snap-l> slestak: Not sure
<tjagoda> Beta2 is still open, yes?
<snap-l> I thought this one wasn't getting a release candidate, though
<tjagoda> You are correct
<snap-l> tjagoda: Beta 2 was released.
<tjagoda> That's what beta2 is
<slestak> i would consider my bug from the weekend a showstopper
<slestak> repeatable.
<tjagoda> There are still a lot of big bugs
<snap-l> slestak: Repeatable on other hardware?
<tjagoda> 3d screensavers still kill X11 for me
<tjagoda> and I found a plethora of bug reports from multiple people describing the same bug
<tjagoda> They even said they patched it in the last beta, but they did not =(
<slestak> well, cant say for that.  repeatable on this hardware, when other releases of ubunto and distros are an easy install
<slestak> i have had this setup for years and have had prob 5 distros on this machine
<snap-l> slestak: See if you can get some other hardware to do the same bug
<tjagoda> Slestak sounds like he's in my boat
<snap-l> if so, then you've got a showstopper
<tjagoda> Solid ubuntu since 2009
<slestak> i dont have anything I can use, i will try
<tjagoda> But no longer
<slestak> anyoen have a dual boot setup?
<tjagoda> whats your bug?
<snap-l> slestak: Unfortunately, no
<slestak> lemme get teh number
<tjagoda> Is it impossible to install two versions of IE side by side?
<slestak> 763155
<slestak> what is wierd, is this only showed itself on "reinstall".  not on first install
<snap-l> tjagoda: I think it's possible to have two versions of IE
<slestak> I used option 3 to choose partitions myself all times
<snap-l> but NFC how to do it
<jrwren> EliteBook is nice, bummer to hear about the KB
<slestak> the first install succedded (but was not usable for Unity issues).  on first install I also tried booting with /home preserved from Mint Debian install
<slestak> reinstall was wiping /home and starting fresh
<slestak> after that first install, no other installes of beta2 would succeed.
<slestak> i should try beta1
<slestak> see if it is a regression
<snap-l> And now for a conference call. Wooot
<tjagoda> And now I reboot to remove IE9
<brousch> darnit. what's the vim command for delete the current line?
<greg-g> dd
<brousch> awesome. greg-g you win a cookie
<greg-g> yay!
<snap-l> Taking some lunch time to make another Club Metal Episode
<snap-l> aka: Music to have kinky sex by
<tjagoda> Oh my
<tjagoda> Remember
<tjagoda> that shit is now logged
<tjagoda> =P
<gamerchick02> wow.
<snap-l> bah
<brousch> not that there's anything wrong with kinky sex
<snap-l> Funny enough, if I stick to my original release date, it'll release the Friday of Penguicon. :)
<gamerchick02> hehe, cool.
<greg-g> is Penguicon supposed to be related to kinky sex somehow?
<greg-g> :P
<snap-l> greg-g: You tell me. ;)
<greg-g> lol
<rick_h__> hmm, is it supposed to? or is it anyway
<_stink_> this is the closest #ubuntu-us-mi will get to a locker room.
 * brousch forgot his towel
<greg-g> awww man!
<brousch> lemme use your cookie
<gamerchick02> if it's a locker room, i'm in the wrong one.
<rick_h__> heh, "family locker room" like those family bathrooms
<tjagoda> It's like the starship troopers locker room.
<tjagoda> =P
<gamerchick02> http://www.jumbojoke.com/the_worst_ethnic_joke_ever_told.html
 * gamerchick02 loves bad jokes
<gamerchick02> and contrary to the title, it's not really ethnic. more of a pun.
<greg-g> lolz
<wolfger> all the same, i don't want that URL popping up in my work laptop's browser history :-p
<gamerchick02> good point.
<wolfger> so how is everybody this fine snowy day?
<tjagoda> lol
<wolfger> looks like the snow has finally stopped falling
<wolfger> Let the melting commence! And another round of muddy pawprints all through the house :-p
<tjagoda> Solution: do not let the dog outside
<tjagoda> Instead, clean up far more localized poop and urine stains
<wolfger> note to self: do not let tjagoda come up with solutions
<tjagoda> =(
<_stink_> hah
<gamerchick02> it's stopped snowing here.
<greg-g> rick_h__: http://www.serverwatch.com/tutorials/article.php/3931076/Get-More-Out-of-Git-Use-Gist-With-Vim.htm
<rick_h__> greg-g: heh, http://www.vim.org/scripts/script.php?script_id=2423#4.9 was just in my rss feed to follow up with
<rick_h__> I had the plugin before, but it was very limited and  had some bugs
<rick_h__> seen it's been updated recently so want to try it again
<slestak> anyone know any pythonistas that need a gig in a2?
<slestak> i have a solid lead, involved embedded stuff, twisted, and gtk
<rick_h__> embedded python?
<rick_h__> or just embedded C along with python for gui/etc?
<PainBank> twisted and gtk... oh sounds fun.
<slestak> c for microcontrollers,
<slestak> here is the link.  i know a guy that already works there.  he asked me if I had any python friends lookign for work.
<slestak> http://www.reddit.com/r/forhire/comments/gbxss/hiring_build_robots_with_python_seriously_mi_or_mn/
<rick_h__> cool
<slestak> i think they are lookign for junior dev so those of us w mortgages need not apply :)
<snap-l> http://braiker.tumblr.com/post/4710736472/tina-feys-prayer-for-her-daughter
<rick_h__> http://blog.mitechie.com/2011/04/18/first-bookie-sprint-good-friday/
<rick_h__> come one come all...
<rick_h__> I'll settle for some
<rick_h__> :P
<snap-l> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZPEvNSlYdf4
<greg-g> rick_h__: retweeted
<rick_h__> ty kind sir
<rick_h__> going to be low key, but wth...first of many right? :)
<ColonelPanic001> rick_h__: you hold an event like that on a... wait, that's a holiday
 * ColonelPanic001 checks to see if he has that off
<rick_h__> rgr
<rick_h__> that's the point, I can use day care for the kid and wife has to work so might as well hack
<ColonelPanic001> _stink_ told me a little about bookie, sounds great - I kind of always wished a open alternative would come up
<_stink_> ColonelPanic001: we don't have that day off
<_stink_> i took it off
<ColonelPanic001> ah, k
<ColonelPanic001> I suspected we might not, being that it's religious
<_stink_> Labor day is also religious
<ColonelPanic001> :P
<ColonelPanic001> I'm a dirty heathen and shall be working on the Good day
<_stink_> yes
<rick_h__> that's ok, suppose you're better off than the guy that takes advantage of getting the day off for holy reasons...and plans a party instead
<jrmy> hello
<jrmy> anyone recognize me?
<_stink_> Mom?
<jrmy> lol
<jrmy> no
<jrmy> well its been awhile since i was on this channel
<jrmy> maybe half a year..
<jrmy> probably longer
<jrmy> decided to use my old computer with linux on it again seeing as my laptop broke
<jrmy> try playing some emulators or somethin..
<jrmy> i need to fix my sound issue though
<jrmy> i followed a link for updating alsa.. idk if it will work but i swear that before you could simply select your audio devices. must of been on ubuntu though and not xubuntu which btw im using 10.04 or lucid i think its called
<_stink_> the pulseaudio applet lets you do that.
<jrmy> how do i run the program?
<_stink_> or pavucontrol
<_stink_> if you apt-get install pavucontrol
<jrmy> i believe pulseaudio is installed
<_stink_> it is.
<_stink_> for pavucontrol,
<_stink_> apt-get install pavucontrol
<jrmy> well i'll do that when i finish updating the alsa driver
<jrmy> and im only at 48% so its gonna be awhile
<jrmy> thats a name ive never seen
<jrmy> so anyways has the channel gotten bigger in terms of getting more users?
<snap-l> hard to tell
<snap-l> some folks come, some folks go
<jrmy> hey snap-l
<snap-l> howdy.
<jrmy> lol liek me for instance
<snap-l> exactly. ;)
<jrmy> looks like alot of the peopel i met before are still here
<jrmy> isnt penguincon happening soon?
<jrmy> or however its spelled again
<snap-l> Yeah, it's at the end of this month
<jrmy> yep.. more then likely not attending
<jrmy> definitely low on money currently
<jrmy> reminds me.. did we ever have a picnic for our states group?
<jrmy> geeknic.. thats what its called
<jrmy> lol never did go to my cities weekly get togethers either
<slestak> not just bigger in numbers, we've also gained weight and lost hair
<snap-l> Speak for yourself
<snap-l> and not for me.
 * snap-l notices less hair, and more weight
<slestak> i didnt lose hair, it just relocated
<jrmy> lol
<snap-l> Yeah, mine seems to be going south
<snap-l> from the top of my head to out my nose and ears.
<snap-l> IF the trend continues, I might actually be able to grow that neckbeard I've always wanted.
<slestak> someone in my wow guild was bragging about his "hair down to his butt" and I wanted to comment that my butthair is down to my ankles
<snap-l> nice. :)
<jrmy> lol
<slestak> any other WoW ppl in the house?
<jrmy> i played it once on a private server
<snap-l> I've successfully avoided that timesink by replacing it with other timesinks.
<slestak> it is def a timesink
<snap-l> Wow, no more snow on the ground
<jrmy> my timesink is minecraft
<snap-l> That's amazing
<snap-l> went from Christmas morning to early spring in a manner of hours.
<jrmy> lol yep
<snap-l> The hardest part of podcasting: Pacing releases.
<snap-l> I've got two episodes for http://openmetalcast.com ready to go
<snap-l> and hopefully an interview tomorrow with Cloudkicker
<slestak> i was looking into that based on Fabians love for the game on LO
<jrmy> oh yeah metal is liked by users of this channel
<slestak> add kicked in and i drifted off though.  is minecraft really good?
<jrmy> slestak: its rather addicting
<jrmy> its still in beta though
<jrmy> but cheaper so might as well buy it now
<jrmy> also works on mac and linux which is nice
<slestak> is it a puzzle game or what is its model?
<slestak> empire building?
<snap-l> virtual legos, afaict.
<jrmy> well i dont know how to explain it
<slestak> did you all see there is a new humble indie bundle?
<snap-l> yep, bought it day of release
<snap-l> Mentioned it at MUG as well
<slestak> good games?  i havent gotten it yet
<snap-l> I like the Shadowgrounds games.
<jrmy> what now?
<snap-l> humblebundle.com
<snap-l> Trine is a little frustrating for me because I suck at platformer games.
<snap-l> I have Super Mario Deficiency.
<jrmy> lol
<jrmy> not me.. but i found the game boring when i tried a demo on my ps3
<snap-l> Well, the other two come highly recommended
<jrmy> when i put in a command and it makes the next line blank that means its processing right?
<snap-l> or it's waiting for more input
<snap-l> ie: from stdin
<jrmy> i used the wrong characters.. thats why
<jrmy> i thought it was ' and not `
#ubuntu-us-mi 2011-04-19
<PainBank> rick_h__: where do you live at anyhow?
<rick_h__> Clarkston
<rick_h__> right by DTE
<wolfger> morning
<tjagoda> yoyo
<tjagoda> Why has my playbook not shipped yet?
<tjagoda> Best buy is BAD AT PREORDERS
<rick_h__> they know you'll just hate it
<rick_h__> hoping you'll cancel your order before it's too late
<wolfger> Playbook?
<rick_h__> It's the great white hope for BB users :)
<greg-g> g'morn
<rick_h__> morning
<brousch> playbook has been recalled
 * tjagoda stabs brousch
<brousch> it exceeded the marketplace's tolerance for lameness
<tjagoda> Your face exceeded the marketplace's tolerance for lameness
<wolfger> heh
<wolfger> the marketplace has a really high tolerance for lameness, in case you hadn't noticed the Zune...
<brousch> i expect they'll show up a flea markets next to the lava lamps soon
<tjagoda> Nah
<tjagoda> Those are full of outversioned apple products
<rick_h__> heh, I hear with the right app installed they make great photo frames
<brousch> i saw a lot of knock-off ipod-like mp3 players at the liquidation store. the only actual apple products were G3 ibooks
<brousch> woohoo! i got my invite to tedxgr
<rick_h__> oooh, brousch is a mover and a shaker
<wolfger> snap-l: You didn't like the Big Tronbowski? ;-)
<wolfger> One nitpick with your review. CLU was made in the original movie. :-p
 * wolfger now doubts snap-l's geek cred
<snap-l> wolfger: Tron Legacy did for Tron what The Matrix Reloaded did for The Matrix
<wolfger> ouch
<snap-l> wolfger: Seriously, di the plot make any sense?
<wolfger> and yet, I can't really argue
<wolfger> plot? What plot?
<snap-l> exactly
<wolfger> It was cool
<wolfger> Jodee was right
<snap-l> It was a screensaver
<wolfger> It was the ultimate argument in favor of "style over substance"
<rick_h__> all pretty
<rick_h__> I was laughing, last TWIT kevin rose was raving about the plot
<wolfger> very pretty, but nothing to it
<rick_h__> Tron was pretty, and good soundtrack, that was all
<wolfger> worth doing once, but not worth owning
<snap-l> Yeah, some people thought it was great, just like some people thought that The Matrix: Reloaded was great
<snap-l> honestly, I thought they could have done a much better job with the plot
<rick_h__> didn't meat those people
<snap-l> maybe it was just disappointment for what they could have done
<wolfger> yes. that.
<rick_h__> definitely, the plot deserved some more work for sure
<wolfger> squandered opportunity
<snap-l> They could have done something with the internet, facebook, data, etc
<rick_h__> oh hell no
<snap-l> instead we got Disney's take on Darwinia
<wolfger> No! It is all about teh arcade gamez!
<wolfger> and kids watching that movie are probably saying, "Dad, what's an arcade?"
<snap-l> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Darwinia_(video_game)
<snap-l> Yeah, there were some nice flourishes here and there
<snap-l> but the plot really suffered
<snap-l> partially because they're looking to do a sequel
<wolfger> also I disagree with your assertion that Flynn is sadistic. Programs are not people. And he tried to protect the sentient ISOS.
<snap-l> wolfger: seriously? He broke bread with Tron and Yori
<snap-l> He practically cried when he killed Crom
<wolfger> Yes. Tears of frustration at so much programming time down the drain.
<wolfger> :-D
<wolfger> are we seriously going to have this argument which will by necessity devolve into the ridiculous very rapidly?
<wolfger> The appearance of a Tron video game in the movie is 100% pure meta.
<tjagoda> http://www.energyfiend.com/death-by-caffeine
<snap-l> wolfger: Right, but it's like saying that after coming home from a war, someone decides to make a video game of it
<snap-l> That's just not right
<snap-l> And worse, you know that with your game, things that have personality die with your actions
<snap-l> That's my point
<snap-l> !openmetalcast 19 releases today, fortified with 8 essential tracks for a complete metal diet. http://ur1.ca/3w2b6
<wolfger> how much screaming?
<snap-l> It's balanced out
<snap-l> though the last track should set you off. ;)
<wolfger> I say it's all PainBank's fault
<PainBank> it is!
<PainBank> let's kick his ass!
<PainBank> oh, um, wait... that's me
<PainBank> let's kick wolfger's ass!
<wolfger> I don't follow the logic there...
<wolfger> How's it going? You ready for Penguicon?
<tjagoda> Penguiwho?
<wolfger> penguitron
<wolfger> seen the artwork for the souvenir book yet?
<tjagoda> I 'unno
<tjagoda> I don't DO anything this year =P
<wolfger> ve vill *make* you do somethink!
<greg-g> Tom Callaway takes the piss out of the Google Chrome devs by calling out their Java roots: http://ostatic.com/blog/making-projects-easier-to-package-why-chromium-isnt-in-fedora
<snap-l> greg-g: I don't think it's quite as intentional as he's making it to be
<snap-l> though I cancompletely sympathize.
<Milyardo_> I don't know of any Java software projects that embed libraries because they've made extensive changes to it that deviate from upstream's interface or implementation
<Milyardo_> where did he get that from?
<snap-l> I've seen java projects embed the entire JRE in their distro
<Milyardo_> I've see that as well
<greg-g> yeah, I've seen weird things like that as well
<Milyardo_> but not because they've modified it
<jrmy> who listens to metal again?
<greg-g> Milyardo_: yeah, I guess what I saw was the entire grails stack in a github repo for a small little webapp
<greg-g> jrmy: I point you toward snap-l, our resident metal head
<snap-l> That's me.
<snap-l> http://openmetalcast.com/
<jrmy> ok, just refreshing the memory
<snap-l> new episode just released today. :)
<jrmy> in a black folk metal band
<jrmy> wondering if you go to shows around the area
<snap-l> Oh yeah?
<snap-l> Not too many, I'm afraid.
<jrmy> ive only been to one.. well if i count the other 2
<jrmy> then 3 but yeah
<snap-l> Not a fan of hanging out in bars to watch metal music. :)
<jrmy> heh
<jrmy> dont know if i'll liek playing ashow at a bar
<snap-l> jrmy: So you're in a black folk metal band?
<Milyardo_> greg-g: If most java libraries like my experiance with Hibernate it could be because distro packing of java libraries are completely ass backwards for some reason
<jrmy> well thats what i'd call it.. we probably are death as well but the lyrics are predominantly folkish not to mention theres some more happy sounding riffs in songs
<snap-l> jrmy: Have you recorded anything that you'd be OK with having played on a podcast?
<jrmy> but then weve got some heavy stuff and some black styles which the vocals are the higher pitched liek in most black
<snap-l> (and is it Creative Commons?)
<jrmy> i'd have to talk to my band mates
<snap-l> OK, because I'd love to listen to it, and possibly put it on the show
<jrmy> i might be fine with it..
<snap-l> Well, give the show a listen, regardless
<jrmy> in all reality were playing till august
<snap-l> jrmy: FOlks heading to college?
<jrmy> seeing as our bassist has a contract to be in texas for a year doing his work
<snap-l> Ah, I know how that goes
<jrmy> but yeah if we got more fans and were able to play more shows or get more peopel to come to shows then it could possibly be worth putting music on your site
<jrmy> and/or*
<snap-l> I live to promote. :)
<jrmy> i'd even give you a sample or 2 but we havent recorded much yet so.. yeah
<jrmy> but were at the stage where were.. well me and our bassist is ready
<greg-g> jrmy: and if you guys have questions about the use of Creative Commons licenses, let me know
<jrmy> guess our drummer wants to smooth out parts more.. dunno
<jrmy> yeah
<snap-l> A recording is a snapshot of the band at a particular moment in time
<jrmy> yeah, thats true
<snap-l> If anything, it'll give you guys something to show your friends / family later on. :)
<jrmy> well i'll have attachment after were done
<jrmy> good memories i'd hope
<jrmy> never been this far with music before
<snap-l> Yeah, good times
<jrmy> so, anything knew with linux stuff?
<jrmy> new*
<snap-l> jrmy: All I'd recommend is go it yourselves for a while, and promote the heck out of the band any way you can
<jrmy> seems steam is having more linux and mac now
<jrmy> yeah..
<snap-l> and don't sign with any record labels until you're damned certain you're not going to get screwed
<jrmy> lol right
<snap-l> The Beatles didn't become the Beatles because they were musical geniuses out of the womb, they became the Beatles because they played gigs as much as they could
<jrmy> well im not the band leader.. but the info is nice
<snap-l> The old joke goes "Do you know the way to Carnegie Hall?" "Practice practice practice"
<jrmy> never heard of it
<jrmy> both in this case
<snap-l> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carnegie_Hall#Carnegie_Hall_joke
<brousch> fml i had to teach the consultant ctrl-c ctrl-v
<Blazeix> brousch: holy crap, you just changed my life.
<jrmy> lol.. fail if you use a computer and dont know those shortcuts
<jrmy> probably a few exceptions but anyways
<snap-l> tomorrow, how to use context menus by right clicking
<Milyardo_> jrmy: what about crtl+insert and shift+insert?
<greg-g> brousch: wow, you deserve a beer for lunch
<greg-g> (or 3)
<jrmy> dont know about those
<jrmy> Milyardo_: ^
<wolfger> brousch: ctrl-c halts the program. What's ctrl-v do? :-D
<brousch> i rally hope he'll be useful once things are setup
<jrmy> lol wolfger
<jrmy> so is this state ever gonna have a geeknic?
<JonathanD> geeknic!
<greg-g> jcastro: is that lifehacker post on burnout any good. being someone who is way to busy and in danger of burning out, I don't want to read it if it isn't worth my time! ;)
<jrmy> hey JonathanD, its been awhile
<JonathanD> Hi.
<jcastro> greg-g: I am in the same boat, I was just like "oh this is probably me but it's too late" and hit share
<jcastro> heh
<greg-g> hehe
<snap-l> hah
<jrmy> ha
<greg-g> alright, it is open in a tab, I'll get to in my next "kill all tabs!" sessions
<jrmy> well, i'll brb
<jrmy> food time
<brousch> jrmy: a state-wide geeknic doesn't make much sense. who is going to spend a few hours driving each way to spend a few hours hanging around outside with a few geeks?
<brousch> a geekin local to each major urban area makes sense
<JonathanD> they are generally localized.
<JonathanD> To a major city.
<brousch> yeah, that's the only thing that makes sense
<JonathanD> We've done multi-day things in NJ that draw people from larger regions.
<JonathanD> But those were camping trips. people drive farther for that.
<brousch> i swear west MI has some conference scheduled every other weekend already
<JonathanD> Grand Rapids could pull one, probably.
<JonathanD> and perhaps Lansing.
<wolfger> but where would we find a good picnic site with wifi?
<greg-g> yeah, definitely. GR, Lansing, and Detroit/A2
<brousch> GR has barcampgr, 2 days, ~150 people last year
<greg-g> wolfger: build your own!
<JonathanD> wolfger: I'm bringing wimax to the next one out my way.
<greg-g> wolfger: also, http://wiki.daviddarts.com/PirateBox
<brousch> who needs ifi? everyone has a smartphone
<wolfger> greg-g: OK, we're all gonna tether off of your data plan! :-D
<JonathanD> I have a 6 pack APC battery thing I'm using to run it.
<greg-g> wolfger: if I had one. Have you seen my phone lately? it is from 2005/6, I kid you not. It is a Sanyo flip phone.
<wolfger> brousch: right. Because we can all do everything we want on our phones... ?
 * greg-g really wants to make a piratebox, or maybe some pirateboxen
<wolfger> greg-g: how sad
<greg-g> meh, only when I'm lost in a suburb of detroit do I ever really want a new phone, luckily that doesn't happen too much
<wolfger> pirateboxen seem cool. We should definitely have one or more at Penguicon. Probably too late to make that a reality this year.
<greg-g> though, I guess I wouldn't want to be the one to take that piratebox home after the event and see what was shared on it :/
<ColonelPanic001> love when I can hear other people's music lofting through the cubefarm
<ColonelPanic001> odd, since they're using headphones.
<ColonelPanic001> enjoy your hearing loss, dumbass.
<wolfger> greg-g: Oh, I'll do that. I have a high tolerance for that sort of thing.
<greg-g> wolfger: figured ;)
<wolfger> alternatively, you could rig it, I'm sure, to simply clear its contents after a set amount of time
<greg-g> wolfger: I do as well, I suppose, but I was going to make a joke about "having posession of illegal material" but didn't care enough to make it funny
<wolfger> then you'd never have to damage your brain with knowledge of the contents
<greg-g> wolfger: yeah, at the end of penguicon or something
<greg-g> not a bad idea. totally ephemeral
<greg-g> (for certain values of "totally")
<wolfger> but me, I'd rather see exactly what had been shared. I'd probably be totally bored by it, though.
<greg-g> true
<greg-g> "'Rush discography' bah, snap-l was here"
<greg-g> ;)
<wolfger> ROFL
<brousch> moose and bear furries playing hockey? tjagoda
<wolfger> that's "moose and squirrel"... :-p
<jrmy>  back
<snap-l> What did I miss? :)
<jjesse> the answer to the secret of life
<snap-l> The complete Rush Discography would definitely be the secret ingredient. ;)
<snap-l> greg-g: Nah, I'd just load it up with CC metal
<jrmy> missed the talk about the geeknic
<Milyardo_> greg-g: Do you guys still do CHC?
<greg-g> snap-l: yeah, that'd be sweet, all of your OMCs and other things
<greg-g> Milyardo_: I haven't been to the A2 one in a long time, they now do it on Monday nights, I believe
<snap-l> I'm still debating on the whole DVDs of all of the OMcs.
<brousch> sell a 4 disc dvd set?
<brousch> how about just broadcasting it continuously over local radio and digital stream?
<snap-l> If anyone would want it, and could spare the bandwidth. ;)
<brousch> you can sell the blank DVDs and they can burn them themselves
<jrmy> whats chc and omc?
<wolfger> jrmy: CHC == CoffeeHouse Coders weekly (or monthly in A2) meetup
<wolfger> omc == ???
<jrmy> A2?
<wolfger> ah... OMC == OpenMetalCast
<wolfger> A2 == Ann Arbor
<jrmy> ah.. i get it
<wolfger> LOL. Damn we are lazy people who don't want to type
<jrmy> lol
<wolfger> LOL == Laughing Out Loud (just in case...)
<jrmy> lol
<jrmy> have any of you heard of year 200X?
<jrmy> theyre a band from my city here in lansing
<wolfger> the last of those was a couple years ago :-D
<jrmy> they play metal covers of NES music
<jrmy> what was a couple years ago?
<jrmy> wolfger: ^
<wolfger> jrmy: year 200x
<wolfger> now we're in 201x
<jrmy> ah a joke i see
<wolfger> <-- smartass
<jrmy> so havent heard of the band then?
<wolfger> nope
<jrmy> i'll try to remember that
<jrmy> heh, i used to be the one making jokes liek that
<jrmy> now i see why peopel never caught the jokes to often
<jrmy> but anyways i saw them at an anime convention i went to last month.. they were pretty good
<brousch> i found tjagoda on twitter! "I haven't used one yet but I can confidentally state that when i do use one I will proclaim the BB Playbook as the best tablet on the market"
<_stink_> haha
<rick_h__> I don't see how a tablet without local email is the best of anything
<rick_h__> "we don't need an email app, people will write one"
<rick_h__> "oh right, there's no apps for it yet"
<jrmy> lol
<snap-l> rick_h__: Hey, they perfectly replicated the Palm Foleo, only in tablet format
<rick_h__> http://www.bgr.com/2011/04/19/at-no-officially-blackberry-bridge-support-yet
<rick_h__> oh man that's great
<rick_h__> tjagoda: hope you're not getting ATT BB
<rick_h__> the only way to do email is to tether your phone and ATT is blocking that
<snap-l> Oh that's brilliant
<snap-l> I don't think they could have asked for a worse launch if they'd shipped the thing with a hive of killer bees in every package.
<snap-l> Though I would morbidly watch every single unboxing video if they did
<tjagoda> rick_h: What're you hating on now?
<tjagoda> =P
<tjagoda> ATT doesn't block tethering
<tjagoda> If you buy the tethering plan
<snap-l> tjagoda: Please to be reading the article
<rick_h__> tjagoda: right, they're specifically blocking the BB bridge software
<tjagoda> Oh yes
<rick_h__> even BB says so "works on all carriers but ATT"
<tjagoda> i misread what you originally typed, sorry
<tjagoda> Assumed you were talking about normal tethering
<tjagoda> but yes, AT&T is kind of Asshat tehre
<tjagoda> there*
<tjagoda> I guaruntee they're trying to turn it into an add-on billable option and blackberry is resisting the push
<snap-l> Right, it couldn't POSSIBLY be the other way around. ;)
<tjagoda> No
<tjagoda> Frankly
<tjagoda> it couldn't be
<rick_h__> trolling trolling trolling, keep those puppies trolling! troll-hide!
<tjagoda> That would make absolutely no business sense you evil bastard
<tjagoda> At least make plausible trollish arguments
<tjagoda> =P
<snap-l> I heard each Playbook includes a strand of Hitler's DNA on the circuit board.
<snap-l> And that Glen Beck was first in line to purchase one at the AT&T store.
<tjagoda> I'm not certain you can buy them at carrier stores
<snap-l> And Mel Gibson claims the Playbook cured him of his alcoholism.
<tjagoda> Best Buy and Staples are carrying them I believe
<tjagoda> Not sure if they're alongside the mobile devices
<snap-l> AT&T reserved one just for Glen Beck
<tjagoda> ORDER IN PROCESSING
<tjagoda> WOOT
<tjagoda> SHIP YOU MOTHERFUCKERS
<tjagoda> SHIIIIPPPP
<rick_h__> it would have been faster to just go get it in a store
<snap-l> Or just take a brick with you to work
<rick_h__> not like there's a big line or anything
<snap-l> same difference.
<tjagoda> http://www.bgr.com/2011/04/19/research-in-motions-blackberry-playbook-available-to-public/
<tjagoda> Poll results aren't bad really
<tjagoda> 50% of that poll wants to buy one
<snap-l> http://decafbad.net/2011/04/19/research-in-motion-blackberry-playbook-makes-osborne-1-look-like-the-better-machine
<rick_h__> 21% are going to change their minds once they seem them in person/irl
<snap-l> tjagoda: 35% of that poll reported brain damage
<tjagoda> I am so pissing in your cornflakes
<snap-l> Seriously, this thing is about as exciting as MC Hammer announcing he's coming back on tour
<snap-l> Ho boy, Blackberry has a tablet. Wooo!
<snap-l> and it requires a phone to do e-mail. Yay!
<tjagoda> Only until third party apps are in the store
<snap-l> Foleo. This thing is the Foleo
<tjagoda> Why am I still replying to snap-l
<tjagoda> =P
<brousch> snap-l: that link is broken
<snap-l> brousch: It'll be there once the Playbook releases a native email client
<snap-l> give it time.
<snap-l> Along with the Android compatability
<krondor> BB fail seriously, how can they even think the product is ready with no email client.  That's insane too given what their company is.
<krondor> The hardware looks decent though I suppose...
<snap-l> krondor: It's likely because they're targeting the business customers
<snap-l> the regular consumer is an afterthought
<snap-l> they're hoping to jam this sucker down company throats
<krondor> yeah they gave us three days before the launch.
<snap-l> Guarantee you, this will be showing up in a few board rooms
<snap-l> but I'll buy tjagoda a beer if I see these things in anyone else's hands outside of his own grubby mits
<krondor> the ipads are already there in force, there's a few galaxy tabs too floating around.  I don't really see this taking off even in the corporate space w/ that phone dependency.
<snap-l> krondor: It''ll take off with the people who are already married to the BB ecosystem
<snap-l> The folks that can't stay more than 5 minutes away from their e-mail
<krondor> we're married to the ecosystem, but divorcing as we speak.  It's too expensive for what you get, and now that we can manage iphones and android it's pointless.
<tjagoda> I don't drink alcoholic things
<tjagoda> I would settle for a mountain dew and/or Bawls though
<snap-l> tjagoda: You've got it.
<brousch> a canadian that doesn't drink? wtf
<krondor> we had somewhere near 3,000 blackberries that were corporate issued.  Now we have like 2,000 blackberries and 2300 iphones and 1600 androids.
<krondor> the iphones and android are personal devices so the business is thinking hell, we don't even need to buy their phones or pay their plans just support that phone.  Takes a big expense off the books
 * krondor off to meeting hell...
<snap-l> krondor: Have fun!
<jrmy> well off to band practice
<jrmy> bye
<Blazeix> woo, I was optimizing this data access layer, and I've "improved" it to the point where it issues zero SELECT statements.
<Blazeix> but I still get data back...
<Blazeix> (I think it's more likely that I broke the logging, than achieved infinite improvement)
<gamerchick02> sounds fun, Blazeix.
<gamerchick02> http://linuxoutlaws.com/live might be relevant to everyone's interests.
<PainBank1> anyone heard of a drunken monkey test?
<brousch> i think it's part of the shaolin kung-fu graduation ceremony
<PainBank1> nice
<snap-l> https://twitter.com/#!/segphault/statuses/60448509228351488
<snap-l> Heh, Adam Curry is still using the icon that I edited for him
<jrwren> jcastro: what was the name of that pxe boot helper you said was in oneiric ?
<jrwren> cobbler?
#ubuntu-us-mi 2011-04-20
<tjagoda> I think that is correct
<jrwren> ok, forget cobbler... are there any helpers for setting up a PXE server?
<brousch> wait a minute. rush's singer is a man?
<brousch> i always thought it was a woman singing tom sawyer
<greg-g> lol@brousch
<brousch> no way that's a man
<brousch> geez, she is ugly. good thing she can sing
<snap-l> brousch: You wound me
<snap-l> Got my interview with Cloudkicker bagged.
<snap-l> Exporting it now
<rick_h__> yay
<snap-l> Man my flash is completely fucked
<snap-l> both under Chrome and Firefox
<greg-g> snap-l: w00t! interviews!
<snap-l> Yeah, should be out by Friday.
<greg-g> weird, I usually go to chrome when Fx's is messed up since the whole "chrome bundles everything" thing :)
<snap-l> Was looking forward to this one. He's definitely got some interesting music, and I want to help promote him as best I can
<snap-l> greg-g: Yeah, I know
<snap-l> I've been using Chrome just for that reason
<tjagoda> I use the native 64bit Alpha 2 from Adobe
<tjagoda> gives me brilliantly solid flash
<tjagoda> everything else is either flaky or crashy
<jjesse> yay for thunderstorms
<snap-l> Yeah, we're starting to get some storms as well
<rick_h__> morning party people
<snap-l> Good morning
<brousch> no
<snap-l> Great morning?
<rick_h__> no
<snap-l> Well, poo
<jjesse> mroning
<rick_h__> yea, might not make CHC tonight snap-l
<rick_h__> germ attack again, so not sure how it'll be tonight
<snap-l> ugh, sorry to hear that
<snap-l> hope you feel better quickly
<rick_h__> yea, thinking of early bed and try to make sure I can still do Friday
<rick_h__> heh, snap-l but tweetdeck doesn't talk to identica
<jrwren> morning.
<jrwren> PXE is FAST.
<jrwren> or rather, gigabit network installs are FAST
<rick_h__> rgr
<rick_h__> now imagine 10G
<rick_h__> http://phx.corporate-ir.net/phoenix.zhtml?c=176060&p=irol-newsArticle&ID=1552678&highlight=
<rick_h__> awesome
<rick_h__> I might go to the library for the first time since high school
<rick_h__> or maybe jr high
<snap-l> rick_h__: I thought tweetdeck did talk to identi.ca?
<jrwren> i can't imagine 10G. My disks aren't faster than gigabit so I don't think 10Gbit would help much
<jrwren> lol... my wife goes to teh library every week.
<snap-l> We used to go to the library about once a week
<snap-l> unfortunately we haven't duplicated that over here
<snap-l> We'll probably do more once the weather clears up, and we can just walk there
<rick_h__> snap-l: well, maybe the air client, but not the google chrome app
<rick_h__> yea, my wife is a library person
<rick_h__> I alwauys lived on base growing up so the library was a trip
<snap-l> verifying
<rick_h__> so I've been a bookstore/etc person forever
<rick_h__> http://blog.tweetdeck.com/introducing-chromedeck-our-shiny-new-friend
<rick_h__> search for identica in that thread of comments
<snap-l> nice.
<rick_h__> yea
<rick_h__> http://identi.ca/mitechie/all
<rick_h__> 80% snapl, 10% spam, 10% I don't care
<snap-l> http://identi.ca/snapl/all
<brousch> 100% snap-l FTW!
<rick_h__> woot! pyohio call for talks coming soon
<rick_h__> thinking of doing one on sqlalchemy
<rick_h__> any requests?
<rick_h__> http://blog.venthur.de/2011/04/20/introducing-python-ardrone/ too cool
<rick_h__> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EmQOEX9a3tM&feature=youtu.be hah
<snap-l> That's awesome
<snap-l> I was hoping it was a little more autonomous, but I don't think it has the stuff on there to be environment aware.
<rick_h__> jcastro: there you go, take your heli addiction to a new level
<rick_h__> python powered
<jcastro> lol
<jcastro> awesome
<jcastro> I need glue to fix my rotor
<rick_h__> yea, needs gps on there
<snap-l> jcastro: Already snapped it?
<rick_h__> but it's wifi, so it can't travel all that far or you lose signal
<snap-l> yeah, but still. ;)
<rick_h__> yea, think you have to move up to the few $k models to get what you want
<rick_h__> http://www.bgr.com/2011/04/20/apple-recording-storing-gps-position-of-iphone-3g-ipad-users-video/
<rick_h__> so how will the fanboi's spin this?
<rick_h__> google grabs a couple seconds of wifi data, big huge fines
<brousch> apple is only doing it to help law enforcement find you when you're kidnapped
<rick_h__> apple tracks all your location for a full year? ...
<brousch> it's for your own good
<PainBank> Evo or Evo Shift?  Any thoughts?  Evo has Android 2.1 and the Shift has 2.2...
<brousch> which one has better cyanogenmod support?
<rick_h__> love this "there's no reason to worry, this data has't left your phone"
<rick_h__> ummm, but if your phone is lost/stolen (or your laptop wiht the backup) they now know everywhere you've been the last year
<rick_h__> and when you were there
<greg-g> or the gobment who searches your devices at border crossings
<rick_h__> exactly
<rick_h__> I wasn't going to go law enforcement since most people think 'not me'
<rick_h__> but you see that story the MI police can backup a whole phone for a traffic stop these day?
<rick_h__> that file with your 1yr of location points is in that data
<rick_h__> http://exchange.ydr.com/index.php?showtopic=10996
<greg-g> rick_h__: what the hell? backup a whole phone for speeding? ef that
<greg-g> I'm keeping my dumb phone from 2005 forever then
<rick_h__> yea, they've got a device that in 30s will backup all of the data, pics, call logs, etc
 * greg-g pets his Sanyo VI-2300
<PainBank> hmm...
<rick_h__> Complete extraction of existing, hidden, and deleted phone data, including call history, text messages, contacts, images, and geotags,
<greg-g> other than the battery being a bit lame, this thing is a tank.
<rick_h__> the sanyo vi-2300 is cable #67 for connection
<rick_h__> http://www.cellebrite.com/ufed-support-center/ufed-supported-phones.html
<greg-g> rick_h__: thanks :)
<rick_h__> greg-g: you can be helpful to the office when he tries to find the right one now :)
<greg-g> :)
<rick_h__> /office/officer
<greg-g> haha
<rick_h__> it's like getting asked 'how tall are you'
<rick_h__> I'm a 67
<greg-g> I wish
<greg-g> (6'7")
<greg-g> snap-l: have fun with the ionic foot bath guy ;)
<snap-l> Yeah, I'm not going too go too hard on him
<snap-l> He got a nice foot massage. I can appreciate that.
<greg-g> :)
<snap-l> I have a big problem when folks get duped
<snap-l> Like those fucking balance bracelets.
<snap-l> If someone wants to spend $50+ on a plastic bracelet, I have no problems. If someone spends $50+ on a plastic bracelet because someone did a disingenuous leverage demonstration on them, then I have a problem.
<PainBank> hmm sounds like someone needs to write a virus for their phone... you want my data... sure.... not my fault you clicked on that file...
<snap-l> PainBank: Or overwrite it with impossible data
<snap-l> "I see you broke the speed of light three times before breakfast"
<snap-l> "All in a days work, citizen"
<PainBank> haha
<rick_h__> snap-l: think I'll make it tonight. Looks like it's going to be a bookie hack night
<_stink_> hack on code or hack up lung?
<rick_h__> lol, think we'll stick with code
<rick_h__> boss is coming to help on FF extension
<_stink_> dang
<_stink_> gotta push my stuff
<_stink_> my failures
<snap-l> rick_h__: Awesome. Don't get me sick
<greg-g> _stink_: just push it! don't pretty it up! :)
<gamerchick02> http://www.linuxjournal.com/content/fabulous-virtual-window-manager-sees-first-release-five-years for all the people who like light window managers.
<rick_h__> nice, but does it tile?
<rick_h__> :P
<gamerchick02> i don't know. just said that it was lightweight.
<ColonelPanic001> wat
<_stink_> ColonelPanic001: thank you for that
<ColonelPanic001> ?
<snap-l> fvwm does tiling much the same way that the System 7 Macintosh does tiling
<_stink_> rick_h__: i'll be there tonight
<gamerchick02> i'd like to be there. but i can't. is there a way i can help from my humble abode here in Saginaw?
<_stink_> gamerchick02: https://github.com/mitechie/Bookie/issues?milestone=5&state=open :)
<gamerchick02> :) thanks
<snap-l> rick_h__: http://ubuntuone.com/p/nkt/
<gamerchick02> oh, that's hilarious, snap-l
<greg-g> gamerchick02: also how to get started http://bmark.us/started.html
<gamerchick02> danke.
<_stink_> duh, left that out, thanks greg-g.
<greg-g> snap-l++
<greg-g> _stink_: we're a team
<_stink_> high-five!
<greg-g> o/
 * greg-g wishes he could relax on top of his computer
<gamerchick02> greg-g, you have a laptop? i wouldn't lie on top of it... :-P
<gamerchick02> wow, i just used the "move a window when looking at the workspaces" thing that ubuntu lets you do. not sure if that's an ubuntu or a gnome thing, but it's cool.
<snap-l> One of the folks in an e-mail thread at work ins named "Sista"
<snap-l> Having a hard time not thinking of "Sista Soljah"
<snap-l> Bah, Souljah. :)
<gamerchick02> heh
<greg-g> gamerchick02: yeah, ok, I wish i could relax on top of a nice humming along supercomputer
<gamerchick02> that sounds wonderful, actually. might give a little bit of a massage to your back.
<gamerchick02> nice and warm too.
<greg-g> yep :)
<greg-g> though, the radiation might not be the best for me... uhhh, 'down there'
<gamerchick02> good point. radiation shouldn't be good for anyone regardless.
<_stink_> are computers radioactive?
 * _stink_ dons his lead cup
<ColonelPanic001> Radiation is good.
<gamerchick02> some radiation is good. not all
<ColonelPanic001> I'm just not fully awake until I've had my morning cup of alpha emitters.
<gamerchick02> heh
<gamerchick02> a German penguin has fallen in love with a boot.
 * gamerchick02 is listening to Wait Wait Don't Tell Me.
<_stink_> a u-boot?
<gamerchick02> no, a Wellington
<gamerchick02> the penguin's name? Bonaparte.
<gamerchick02> not sure how relevant this is to our interests... but still. :)
<gamerchick02> WWDTM is hilarious.
<_stink_> it is.
<greg-g> and then followed up by one of the lamest/slowest moving shows ever, Whadya Know
<_stink_> OH MAN
<_stink_> i'm glad i'm not the only one who thinks that
<_stink_> i want to like Whadya Know
<_stink_> but it's HORRIBLE
<_stink_> i feel so bad for the people in that live audience
<greg-g> yeah, I think I used to like it, when I was in elementary school. but that could also be because my grandpa always used to ask me "whatdya know?" and the correct reponse was "not much, you?" (its a wisconsin thing)
<_stink_> heh
<snap-l> OK, apparently I'm one of the few folks that likes Whaddya KNow
<snap-l> granted, I'm not about to listen to a podcast of it, but it's at least entertaining
<gamerchick02> Whaddya KNow? I haven't heard that
<gamerchick02> i've never heard it before. must not play on my local NPR
<_stink_> sorry snap-l.
<gamerchick02> then again, i like A Prairie Home Companion, so...
<snap-l> gah, now that I can't listen to
<greg-g> I like Prairie Home every now and then
<greg-g> Carrie hates it
<gamerchick02> i like Garrison Keillor.
<snap-l> I already know all of the Lutheran jokes
<snap-l> I'm good, thank you.
<gamerchick02> funny as shit, especially his monologue.
<gamerchick02> brb, gonna see if my mom needs help
<gamerchick02> ok
<gamerchick02> i'm going to dextek. bbl. car issues.
<greg-g> fun fun, good luck
<PainBank> anyone tried using Panda3D?
<rick_h__> sounds like a zoo exibit
<PainBank> http://www.panda3d.org/
<PainBank> usese python for the game engine scripting.
<snap-l> PainBank: Does it support Linux? :)
<PainBank> supposed to be cross platform.
<snap-l> Yeah, just noticed that
<PainBank> ah yup
<PainBank> http://www.panda3d.org/download.php?sdk&version=1.7.2
<PainBank> http://www.panda3d.org/download.php?platform=ubuntu&version=1.7.2&sdk
<gamerchick02> thanks, i'm back. the cars are dropped off. hopefully Dex can fix mine.
<ColonelPanic001> o.o
<gamerchick02> it does sound like a zoo exhibit.
<snap-l> Fuckin' hell
<snap-l> http://www.miroguide.com/audio/14156
<snap-l> http://www.miroguide.com/audio/14157
<ColonelPanic001> wat
<gamerchick02> nice!
<snap-l> Only took them for fuckin' ever to approve them
<ColonelPanic001> I have to catch up on that one
<gamerchick02> oh
<gamerchick02> didn't know
<gamerchick02> but it's cool they're in there.
<snap-l> Yeah, that makes me happy. :)
<snap-l> I think tjagoda got his playbook
<brousch> yes, he has been spamming the tubes
<brousch> the FB tube anyways
<gamerchick02> you'll be proud of me. i'm installing bookie.
<snap-l> gamerchick02: yay!
<gamerchick02> :)
<greg-g> yay+1!
<gamerchick02> i'm willing to give it a shot. i have a pinboard account (which i love) but i'd like to try this out too
<greg-g> gamerchick02: just fyi, don't expect polish yet :)
<gamerchick02> that's ok
<gamerchick02> ok. i'm following the directions on the bookie website, but i get the following:
<gamerchick02> gamerchick02@Sidle:~$ python boostrap.py bookie
<gamerchick02> python: can't open file 'boostrap.py': [Errno 2] No such file or directory
<gamerchick02> so, i need to create the directory somewhere. does this go in my /home?
<Blazeix> gamerchick02: is that a typo? should be "bootstrap"
<gamerchick02> really? ok
<gamerchick02> ok
<gamerchick02> seems to be working now
<greg-g> boo!strap :)
<gamerchick02> i'm getting an error about fab files
<gamerchick02> says it can't find any
<gamerchick02> (bookie)gamerchick02@Sidle:~$ fab new_install:gamerchick02bookie
<gamerchick02> Fatal error: Couldn't find any fabfiles!
<gamerchick02> Aborting.
<_stink_> paste output of pwd?
<gamerchick02> just run pwd?
<_stink_> yeah
<gamerchick02> /home/gamerchick02
<_stink_> forgot this step:
<_stink_> cd bookie/bookie/Bookie/
<gamerchick02> (bookie)gamerchick02@Sidle:~$ fab new_install:gamerchick02bookie
<gamerchick02> Fatal error: Couldn't find any fabfiles!
<gamerchick02> Aborting.
<gamerchick02> whoops
<gamerchick02> (bookie)gamerchick02@Sidle:~$ cd bookie/bookie/Bookie
<gamerchick02> bash: cd: bookie/bookie/Bookie: No such file or directory
<gamerchick02> there we go.
<_stink_> erm
<gamerchick02> perhaps i should create that, eh?
<gamerchick02> heh
<_stink_> naw
<_stink_> the boostrap should do that for you
<_stink_> heh, boostrap, there i go.
<brousch> booztrap?
<brousch>  do those work?
<_stink_> gamerchick02: whatever directory you were in when you ran 'python bootstrap.py bookie', there should be bookie/bookie/Bookie/
<gamerchick02> just added it.
<_stink_> then it'll be empty.
<_stink_> bootstrap.py should create it and put a bunch of stuff in it.
<gamerchick02> i had a /bookie folder
<gamerchick02> but no /bookie/bookie/Bookie setup.
<gamerchick02> and it's still saying it can't find fabfiles
<_stink_> hmm.  i confess i am confused about how your directories are set up.
<gamerchick02> i think i'll restart the process
<Blazeix> gamerchick02:  try not manually creating any directories. the setup should automatically create everything for you
<gamerchick02> thanks
<gamerchick02> http://pastebin.com/huuV59qk
<gamerchick02> that's what i have so far.
<Blazeix> ah, you need to install git
<Blazeix> I'm kind of surprised that wasn't a fatal error
<gamerchick02> lol
<gamerchick02> thanks
<gamerchick02> thanks for your help, Blazeix. pardon my newbishness...
<gamerchick02> and _stink_ too
<_stink_> no.
<_stink_> er
<_stink_> hah
<_stink_> np.
<gamerchick02> :)
<gamerchick02> http://pastebin.com/FCT5YnRY now why is it stopped here? Hrm.
<snap-l> I swear, you'd think I'd learn by now that Java isn't meant to be developed from the command line
<gamerchick02> how is it supposed to be developed?
<_stink_> gamerchick02: just keep waiting
<_stink_> that step takes a while
<gamerchick02> oh. ok. i'll wait then. thanks, _stink_
<snap-l> gamerchick02: It's more frustrating to try to develop without an IDE
<gamerchick02> ok.
<gamerchick02> hrm. perhaps i ought to boil some water for tea while this goes?
<_stink_> hmm.  dunno.  i don't think it took quite that long last time i did it.
<gamerchick02> it seems to have stopped.
<Blazeix> that step took forever when I was doing it
<gamerchick02> i'll wait a while longer and see if anything happens
<Blazeix> it's best to just forget about it and do something else while it downloads/installs everything :)
<gamerchick02> cool beans
<Blazeix> rick_h__: any thoughts on making git's absence a fatal error? I have http://vpaste.net/DwgRR?bg=light&ft=git ready.
<gamerchick02> heh. i guess i'm already helping even though i haven't done anything yet.
<Blazeix> gamerchick02: yep :)
<gamerchick02> HEY! cool. it's now doing something!
<gamerchick02> ok. cd-ing into the directory worked.
<gamerchick02> i ran the fab stuff and this is what i got: http://pastebin.com/q8qRb1ri
<_stink_> gamerchick02: it looks like paramiko stuff isn't installed in your venv.
<gamerchick02> venv?
<gamerchick02> ok.
<_stink_> virtualenv.
<gamerchick02> so what do i have to look for and install?
<_stink_> the thing you activate.
<gamerchick02> oh
<gamerchick02> ok
<_stink_> i wonder if that's why the install took so long
<_stink_> if pypi timed out
<_stink_> can you paste ~/.pip/pip.log?
<_stink_> i think that's what the filename is
<gamerchick02> part 1: http://pastebin.com/enYz9bsM
<gamerchick02> meh. trying ubuntu pastebin. i got a "too large error" before
<gamerchick02> hre we go: http://paste.ubuntu.com/596687/
<gamerchick02> and that'd be here. holy cow, i'm horrid at typing today
<_stink_> huh, looks like it should've worked
<_stink_> this might require rick_h__'s attention
<gamerchick02> i'm gonna put a pot on for tea. bbiab
<gamerchick02> back
<greg-g> mmm, tea
<gamerchick02> Earl Grey
<greg-g> mmm, Earl Grey
<gamerchick02> :)
<rick_h__> sorry was afk at a bad time it looks like
<rick_h__> catching up
<rick_h__> gamerchick02: you need build-essentials
<gamerchick02> build essentials. ok
<rick_h__> at the top of the started page of docs it goes through some ubuntu packages it needs
<rick_h__> build-essentials, some xml lib stuff, and the database-dev packages
<gamerchick02> yeah, but i searched for it and i thought i had it
<gamerchick02> ok
<rick_h__> yea, so that error says it can't find gcc, to build the C-extension stuff
<gamerchick02> ok
<rick_h__> unfortunately it's one of those tradoffs...pure python == easy, but not fast
<rick_h__> c extensions == much faster
<gamerchick02> yeah
<brousch> pure python ftw
<gamerchick02> is it build-essential or build-essentials
<gamerchick02> ?
<rick_h__> sorry, not sure
<rick_h__> try to auto complete it
<rick_h__> sudo apt-get install build-ess<tab>
<gamerchick02> i have a package that says build-essential
<rick_h__> sure, that works
<gamerchick02> well i have that, and had it before.
<brousch> i always install build-essential and linux-headers-generic
<rick_h__> hmm, then why was the error gcc not found
<rick_h__> oh sorry, gcc failed with error
<rick_h__> crap, sudo apt-get install python-dev
<gamerchick02> and fingerprint-gui is messing with sudo, so i'm stuck with synaptic right this minute
<rick_h__> I'll add that to the list
<rick_h__> right, ok sorry
<rick_h__> python-dev it looks like
<gamerchick02> ok
<gamerchick02> doing that now
<rick_h__> k, added that one to the docs and updated them
<rick_h__> Blazeix: that's probably the right way to go. But what kind of fool doesn't have git :P
<gamerchick02> hey now.
<rick_h__> :)
<rick_h__> yea, as we get more people installing/setting up we find all the bits that we have in our system, but others don't
<rick_h__> and try to get better docs about getting it going
<rick_h__> I need to get things going to where I can do the hosted version
<rick_h__> by the end of the year...at least that's what I keep telling myself is the goal
<rick_h__> gamerchick02: once that's downloaded: http://paste.mitechie.com/show/295/
<rick_h__> http://paste.mitechie.com/show/296/ sorry, take that back, forgot a step
<gamerchick02> i'm trying from the beginning.
<gamerchick02> it sounds dumb but that's the way i learn.
<rick_h__> no, works for me
<greg-g> and better to make sure the docs are right
<rick_h__> eventually want to get the docs on that rock-solid.
<rick_h__> greg-g: ++
<greg-g> word
<rick_h__> what sucks is I don't know how to handle making this easier
 * greg-g has been using "word" a lot lately, like I'm back in the 1990s
<rick_h__> otherwise I'll have to build python packages that are platform specific
<rick_h__> greg-g: it's ok, we figure it's a hippie thing
<rick_h__> hah
<greg-g> :/ not fun
<gamerchick02> how about a "step 0: make sure git and python-dev are installed"?
<rick_h__> gamerchick02: yea, I missed that one when I updated the docs with packages
<rick_h__> did you get the rest?
<rick_h__> http://bmark.us/started.html
<rick_h__> the libmysqlclient-dev, ...
<gamerchick02> yes
<rick_h__> awesome
<gamerchick02> i'm redoing it from the beginning so i don't miss anything.
<rick_h__> ok, have to get the boy from daycare, but will try to keep tabs on the phone irc if you run into anything else
<gamerchick02> and catching up on world cafe
<rick_h__> obviously sorry for you hitting the issues and thanks so much for sticking through them to help test/catch our missing bits
 * rick_h__ sends virtual coffee up to saginaw
<gamerchick02> :) thanks!
<_stink_> good god
<gamerchick02> i like helping out. doing this is no big deal.
<_stink_> i have hosed my git repo twice in a row now
<greg-g> I think I'll make a "these are the build-deps of bookie" section at the top of that which is just a list of the required packages, then a copy/pasteable line for Ubuntu 10.10 (others can supply the copy/pasteable lines for their own distros, *cough*arch*cough*)
<gamerchick02> :)
<greg-g> _stink_: :(
<gamerchick02> you're talking to someone who runs the daily of gwibber.
<rick_h__> greg-g: the big thing is that the version for the pgsql package depends on what version of ubuntu you have installed :(
<rick_h__> but yea, coming up was a single "apt-get install xxxxxxxxx"
 * greg-g nods
<gamerchick02> that's nice, but a list is fine for me. i know enough to apt-get or search in synaptic
<greg-g> I'll even get one for natty, since I have a vm for that installed
<greg-g> gamerchick02: yeah, I just like copy/pasteable bits :) But, I can also not do that if it takes up too much space as we add more "supported" platforms
<gamerchick02> yeah, but typing everything helps me learn though.
<gamerchick02> i dunno.
<greg-g> true
 * greg-g shrugs
<gamerchick02> though if i'm not careful, i'll make mistakes in my typing. i've been having a horrible typing day today
<brousch> can you put it in a pre-install script?
<brousch> detect ubuntu version, install the right stuff?
<gamerchick02> you can write a script to do that?
<brousch> have to run it with sudo, but sure, why not?
<greg-g> well, hopefully this will be packaged for Ubuntu/distros one day, so we shouldn't do *too* much of that and instead let the packagers take care of that. Then, once it is packaged, we can just say "do an apt-get build-dep bookie" or whatever the command is
<gamerchick02> what about a ppa on launchpad?
<rick_h_droid> that ends up ubuntu specific and were trying to keep it just straight python
<gamerchick02> oh. ok.
<brousch> bah, ubuntu is the only linux that matters
<gamerchick02> i was just saying that makes it easy for ubuntu users. myself included
<rick_h_droid> yea, if someone can ppa it more power
<rick_h_droid> but it's a bit harder, edpecially when you get to hodting the app
<gamerchick02> eff yeah, i think it worked
<rick_h_droid> hosting
<gamerchick02> wow
<gamerchick02> so... what do i have to do to keep this running? go through all those steps? or... something else?
<rick_h_droid> heh, don't look there fow now
<rick_h_droid> just use the paster command to run it to syart
<gamerchick02> the poster command. do i have to keep the terminal running?
<_stink_> rick_h_droid: ok, sent pull request for feature/ff_ext so folks can grab easily. (copy from #bookie)
<_stink_> not sure where you're looking. :)
<Blazeix> gamerchick02: http://bmark.us/hosting.html
<gamerchick02> bbl
<gamerchick02> dinner
<rick_h_droid> gamerchick02 you can pass a --daemon flag to bavkground it
<gamerchick02> thanks, rick_h_droid
<rick_h_droid> gamerchick02 you get it all working ?
<rick_h_droid> chrome extension as well?
<gamerchick02> uh, i haven't installed the chrome extension yet
<rick_h_droid> ah, ok
<rick_h_droid> just checking
<gamerchick02> what's the api key?
<Blazeix> gamerchick02: you set it in the ini file
<gamerchick02> oh
<gamerchick02> ok
<Blazeix> just so random people can't add stuff to your bookie install
<gamerchick02> that's cool, and it makes sense.
<gamerchick02> ok. i installed the chrome extension. and... i'm getting an error: could not find Bookie instance at http://127.0.0.1:6543/delapi
<rick_h_23> ok, make sure you went into thr options and set the right pasdphrase
<snap-l> Ugh, I feel terrible
<snap-l> Just took a cat to the humane society
<gamerchick02> ok
<snap-l> No collar, no chip
<Blazeix> oh, the chrome extension docs might be out of date
<Blazeix> I think the url should just be http://127.0.0.1:6543
<Blazeix> don't need /delapi after it
<gamerchick02> thanks
<rick_h_23> sorry, does it still say the delapi?
<gamerchick02> it did on the setup site
<Blazeix> yeah, I changed that a while back, and I didn't realize that docs for the chrome extension even existed :)
<Blazeix> I'll add that to my "bookie things to finish tonight" list
<rick_h_23> ha I've been trying to keep up with some docs
#ubuntu-us-mi 2011-04-21
<snap-l> http://www.jwz.org/blog/2011/04/a-badge-for-the-software-industrys-failures/
<rick_h__> man, you guys rock, so psyched driving home tonight
<rick_h__> snap-l _stink_ Blazeix
<snap-l> rick_h__: Awesome. :)
<snap-l> Yeah, I've gotten the urge to do something magnificent
<rick_h__> it's invigorating
<rick_h__> even with people finding bugs/etc
<snap-l> Getting tired of waiting for shit to happen at work.
<rick_h__> just awesome how cool things get, keep moving forward
<rick_h__> snap-l: ++
<rick_h__> then again I can't speak. How many years did I talk about bookie before *doing* it?
<snap-l> Well, considering I have an e-mail that i sent to Metal Injection about doing a podcast that was around 2005 or so...
<snap-l> I'm not one to talk. ;)
<rick_h__> lol
<rick_h__> we're such slackers
<snap-l> I think you just get busy with the things that you think are more do-able
<rick_h__> I think it's more "that's a lot of work, I don't have time for all that work right now"
<snap-l> Pretty sure I didn't stop doing things like check e-mail, twitter, etc.
<rick_h__> but once you get started and breaking it into smaller and smaller bits you get rolling
<snap-l> A-yep
<rick_h__> but before you start, you see the whole project
<rick_h__> after you start, you see the next feature
<rick_h__> and I htink that's really what it comes down to (at least for me I think that sums up bookie)
<snap-l> Yeah, you have to think about what the smaller pieces are to get to the bigger pieces
<snap-l> and make sure that you don't freak out over the size of the whole project
<snap-l> like trying to move a gravel pile one rock at a time
<rick_h__> yea
<snap-l> eventually, it'll get done, but it seems like a lot when you get started.
<rick_h__> right, but along the way you go "if I stopped working on bookie today...it's still useful cool stuff"
<rick_h__> that accomplishment comes along pretty quick after getting started and fuels more
<snap-l> Yeah, you need to get to the rhythm part
<rick_h__> and then nights like tonight where multiple people are finding things cool, trying, testing
<snap-l> That's when you get the shovel out. ;)
<rick_h__> just get motivated to move it forward more and more
<rick_h__> thanks for submitting the issue btw
<snap-l> np, promised I would. :)
<snap-l> Speaking of rhythm, time to do the dishes. ;)
<snap-l> brb
<rick_h__> hmm, I do have a test for bookmark deletes, how is this passing? ugh
<snap-l> did you save the page content prior to the delete? :)
<snap-l> Could also be a corner case where I tried to delete something that wasn't read-in yet.
<rick_h__> I'll poke at it, something is missing, but figured it was more obvious at first
<rick_h__> all good
<snap-l> Yeah, leave it to me to bring the stupid bugs. ;)
<snap-l> "what does this do?"
<rick_h__> ah, got it
<rick_h__> yea, found the issue and you're right, because adding a new bmark doesn't auto populate the readable content
<rick_h__> snap-l: so fix pushed to develop, will add a new test for it
<jcastro> snap-l: http://castrojo.tumblr.com/post/4795149014/the-power-users-guide-to-unity
<jcastro> BEHOLD
<rick_h__> http://houkedekwant.com/weblab/VforVendetta/
<rick_h__> love V for Vendetta
<snap-l> rick_h__: This proves one thing...
<snap-l> HTML5 is perfect for ytmnd.com. ;)
<_stink_> rick_h__: glad to be involved.  hoping to crank this badboy out now that the underpinning looks ready.
<brousch> job posted for GR: Candidates should have at least 7 or more years of experience in network, host, data, and/or application security in a LINUX Red Hat Enterprise 5.3 operating environment. Pluses would be experiene with Umbutu.
<rick_h__> morning
<rick_h__> _stink_: yea, hopefully it's educational/useful as well to go through it
<brousch> damn hootsuite is down
<greg-g> g'morning
<_stink_> morning
<snap-l> g'morning
<greg-g> looks like a fun bookie night last night
<_stink_> yeah, it was good
<_stink_> Blazeix got the firefox/jQuery stuff in a state where it actually behaves
<greg-g> oooo! yay!
<rick_h_droid> heh, these guys are good at finding bugs, almost as good as i am at creating them.
<greg-g> :)
<brousch> ouch. hootsuite has been down all morning and they say it's ec2
<ColonelPanic001> the hell with that, Reddit is down.
<ColonelPanic001> Oh, the humanity
<brousch> probably for the same reason
<ColonelPanic001> it is
<ColonelPanic001> http://networkedblogs.com/gVNoc
<brousch> apparently half the internet runs on amazon
<brousch> oh man, 4square is down too? how will i checkin to be king of my bathroom?
<ColonelPanic001> >_>
<jjesse> how many porn sites are now down is the bigger question
<ColonelPanic001> too. many.
<ColonelPanic001> but, Reddit!
<brousch> has bmark.us been affected?
<greg-g> bmark.us is safely running on autonomous colo servers without the aid of Amazon/Microsoft/Raskspace "cloud" technology
<brousch> whew
<Blazeix> _stink_ gives me too much credit :). We both sat down and figured this firefox/jquery stuff out.
<Blazeix> man, does anyone in here use groupon? I'm thinking I'm going to have to unsubscribe.
<brousch> unsubbed a few weeks ago. it's all crap
<Blazeix> yeah, there was supposed to be some level of personalization, but I'm not seeing it.
<snap-l> I promise I'm trying to get through this Java stuff with Eclipse, but frankly I think every document online regarding getting started with this stuff should include the phrase "Go fuck yourself" at the top.
<snap-l> at least I'd know it's not just me.
<jrwren> are you sure its not that it works a way that you don't want to?
<jrwren> you must embrace the tools workflow.
<jrwren> its not the kind of tool that bends to your will.
<jrwren> you must adapt to ie.
<jrwren> adapt to it
<snap-l> ergo my earlier statement
<snap-l> I feel lost and frustrated whenever I power this thing on
<jrwren> it just takes time to get to know the bug IDE
<snap-l> jrwren: And that's why I'm frustrated
<snap-l> I want something simple. get in, get out
<jrwren> i feel your pain.
<jrwren> use vim?
<snap-l> I want to have baklava, not learn the totality of Greek history.
<snap-l> jrwren: Vim doesn't suck down web services and make classes
<jrwren> no. i am pretty sure there are command line tools for that.
<jrwren> e.g. in .NET most people use visual studio adn dont' know about the svcutil.exe command line that will do the same.
<jrwren> what soap library are you using?
<snap-l> I've used wsimport.sh under jaxws
<jrwren> but what library are you using in your java?  jaxws still?
<snap-l> yes, although I'm sure I'm missing something on how to get a directory of jar files into my classpath
<jrwren> script it :)
<snap-l> ergo my initial statement. ;)
<jrwren> for i in *.jar ; do CLASSPATH=$CLASSPATH:$i ; done :)
<jrwren> well, you do that once and add it to your makefile.
<jrwren> or you have your make file do it.
<jrwren> http://stackoverflow.com/questions/219585/setting-multiple-jars-in-java-classpathhttp://stackoverflow.com/questions/219585/setting-multiple-jars-in-java-classpath
<jrwren> classpath wildcards?
<jrwren> are you alone on this dev or trying to help out a team?
<snap-l> yeah, I'll play with this some more.
<snap-l> I'm just trying to understand this as a support person
<jrwren> I know you were doing SOAP in perl a while ago, did you give up on that and move to java?
<snap-l> No, I got it working in Python
<jrwren> i see, so support.
<snap-l> Found that if I didn't "follow the RFC", it caused the server to throw a null pointer exception
<snap-l> RFC expecting CRLF, not LF.
<jrwren> figures.
<jrwren> so you are in the role of supporting programmers using this stuff?
<snap-l> Well, of telling them if they're doing something wrong
<snap-l> not necessarily showing them the intracacies of eclipse.
<jrwren> sounds like a bitch of a role. i hope you get paid well :)
<jrwren> also, I'd recommend checking out Apache Axi2. Much better soap.
<jrwren> when an API comes from SUN, it should immediately be questioned and attempted to be replaced by a community equiv or something from apache or google.
<snap-l> jrwren: Yeah, I've been checking out Axis2 as well
<snap-l> Mostly I'm just trying to understand what's going on. And I'm reacquainting myself with why I'm more of a fan of Python. ;)
<jrwren> apt-get upgrade tells me nux and jockey are being upgraded, but when I dpkg -p or apt-get show to find out what these are it says they don't exist.
<brousch> snap-l: If you want to code a Java app from scratch, you must first create the IDE
 * ColonelPanic001 becomes enlightened
<rick_h__> ColonelPanic001: enlightened?
<rick_h__> using a new window manager?
<snap-l> No, re: Java and the IDE
<rick_h__> ah
<snap-l> snapl: Tell my wife I've run away to join the circus. She'll understand. |12:37 PM Apr 21, 2011
<rick_h__> wheee! free peanuts?
<snap-l> Does anyone know how to show what the java environment is?
<snap-l> ie: show what it thinks is classpath, env variables, etc?
<snap-l> -verbose gets me what I'm looking for
<rick_h__> http://www.kdedevelopers.org/node/4414 hah, another kde stone
<rick_h__> snap-l: cool, sorry, java is not my forte
<snap-l> rick_h__: Me either
<greg-g> rick_h__: eeeek (re: kde)
<rick_h__> greg-g: yea, wonder if there will be a resurgant "red headed stepchild" after that
<snap-l> blue headed stepchild
<snap-l> get it right. ;)
<rick_h__> doh
<greg-g> :)
<jrwren> snap-l: echo $CLASSPATH ?
<snap-l> jrwren: Welcome to 2011, where we don't use CLASSPATH environment variables. ;)
<snap-l> At least everything that I've seen pretty much dismisses that as anachronistic
<brousch> the IDE is supposed to handle it for you
<jrwren> right.
<jrwren> it still gets used.
<jrwren> but I see, you were trying to ask a way to find out what the IDE was using.
<jrwren> "java environment" I read, but I didn't read IDE.
<jrwren> I'm slow.
<snap-l> No, I'm not using an IDE
<snap-l> but I wanted to see what it was trying to load
<jrwren> I'm not willing to installa JVM and/or compiler to find otu :)
<snap-l> jrwren: frankly, I've spent more time digging into this than it's worth
<jrwren> :(
<rick_h__> man, another lesson...EC2 is 'on demand' computing, not your freaking colo center
<rick_h__> people don't plan for this crap and it's just stupid
<snap-l> rick_h__: A-yep
<rick_h__> I mean I know it's hard...after all no databases do things like 'streaming replication' or anything
<rick_h__> what happened to all this nosql 'shard it baby' goodness?
<snap-l> http://i.imgur.com/RHTVW.jpg
<snap-l> rick_h__: Sharding is hard. Let's do SEO instead
<snap-l> Or they sharded it in the same instance.
<rick_h__> nice pic
<snap-l> I know tihs might get me nominated for the idiot of the year award, but I'm going to see if this java shit works better with Sun's JDK
<brousch> you weren't use sun-java6?
<snap-l> No, openjdk
<snap-l> and yes, I know there's a difference, but frankly I didn't think it was that big of a difference.
<snap-l> and if this works, I will be very pissed off
<brousch> you should punch yourself in the head if it works
<snap-l> Well, thankfully my melon can remain unthumped
<greg-g> nixternal: do you know of anyone who has written a good weekly report generator for taskwarrior?
<gamerchick02> howdy. any easy way to import your bookmarks into bookie? ;)
<gamerchick02> whoops, i'll ask in the bookie room... i guess.
<brousch> snap-l: I'm listening to the live omc. awesome music on there
#ubuntu-us-mi 2011-04-22
<gamerchick02> cool. i'm off for some Nero Wolfe, i think
<gamerchick02> see everyone tomorrow
<gamerchick02> when are you doing the hacking for bookie? like time?
<rick_h__> bwuhahaha: http://rick.bmark.us/recent click the -R- links :)
<greg-g> rick_h__: yay!
<rick_h__> all live, updated chrome extension and so from now all will always have my content parsed up
<greg-g> awesome
<rick_h__> nooooooooooooooo dammit, does all the EC2 crap mean my roky netflix is down?
<jjesse> probably
<rick_h__> crap, that was my chil plans
<greg-g> :(
<jjesse> sad trombone
<greg-g> I sent the sadtrombone.com url in a one-line work email today :)
<jjesse> nice
<snap-l> brousch: Thank you. :) Glad you're liking it.
<snap-l> What the hell is it with Yahoo Pulse not offering RSS feeds?
<snap-l> n/m, found it
<snap-l> Good morning
<rick_h_35> party
<brousch> yessir
<greg-g> morn morn
<snap-l> !openmetalcast's interview with Cloudkicker is now online. Learn more about this amazing band! http://ur1.ca/3xrsl
<brousch> snap-l: is jamendo broken for you? i'm trying to play unconditional surrender here to see if it's the one i liked but it won't actually play http://www.jamendo.com/en/album/85606
<snap-l> Yeah, it's not coming up
<snap-l> I wonder if they're another AMZ casualty.
<brousch> ok, thanks
<snap-l> Actually, now it's working
<snap-l> are you using the HTML5 player?
<brousch> they must've fixed it
<brousch> and, yep, that's the one
<brousch> french death metal? who knew they had it in them?
<snap-l> You haven't heard of Gojira, have you? :)
<snap-l> French Death Metal that is heavy has anything out there.
<brousch> i have not
<brousch> i know very little beyond what master snap-l has taught me
<snap-l> http://www.gojira-music.com/
<snap-l> Unfortunately, my flash is completley fucked at the moment
<snap-l> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v0B7I49fq_g
<brousch> the site works for me
<snap-l> Grr, I'm tired of people calling things podcasts that don't have enclosure tags
<snap-l> brousch: Yeah, it's my problem to fix
<snap-l> and I can't be bothered because The Daily Show is off this week
<brousch> heh
<snap-l> er, I mean, because I have more important things to worry about.
<snap-l> Learning Python is on sale today at O'Reilly
<snap-l> DD4PY is the coupon code.
<snap-l> (eBook version)
<smoser> jcastro, meant to tell you  yesterday, you post at http://castrojo.tumblr.com/post/4795149014/the-power-users-guide-to-unity is really good.
<krondor> quiet today
<greg-g> all the action is in #bookie ;)
<krondor> ooh nice a del.icio.us alternative
<snap-l> Sheesh, there's a lot of pain on identi.ca over the Fedora marketing
<snap-l> Seriously, Joe has a great point, and fabsh isn't having any of it
<rick_h__> oh no, you mean the fanbio won't listen to reason?
<snap-l> Well, fabsh is pretty well making Joe's point
<snap-l> and just thre my hat into the ring
<brousch> snap-l: would you have stayed out out of it if you weren't on your period?
<snap-l> brousch: And I was wondering how long you'd take... You're slowing down.
<brousch> i was out to lunch :P
<brousch> and jodee is awesome
<snap-l> She agrees with your assessment. ;
<snap-l> :)
<slestak> hola peeps.
<slestak> any of you that I discussed my beta2 ubiquity problem with, I posted a bunch more to the ticket today.
<slestak> i installed and reinstalled beta1 and no problem.  I am going to dl and install beta2 again
<snap-l> Oh it's on.
<jjesse> snap-l like donkey kong?
<slestak> i also installed opensuse for comparison and it installed w no drama
<slestak> i had to hold my breath though.  I almost passed out.  I cannto handle rpm distros
<snap-l> And I'm done.
<greg-g> snap-l: just ignore the trolls
<greg-g> he's a master
<snap-l> Yeah, he is
<rick_h__> fab?
<snap-l> fabsh
<rick_h__> he's a total troll, can't stand to listen to that podcast any more he's so bad
<snap-l> http://identi.ca/notice/71703303 <- So tempted to say "Yeah, and you have to wake up to them every morning"
<slestak> no way
<slestak> unpossible
<snap-l> but, letting my adult nature take over.
<slestak> nm, i dont follow anythign on twitter or identica
<snap-l> Some days I wonder why I bother. :)
<slestak> LO is my favorite podcast, still enjoy it
<greg-g> personally, I never really could get through a whole episode :/
<snap-l> Me either
<slestak> to each his own
<slestak> i could never stand Jono's old one
<snap-l> Lugradio?
<slestak> yeah
<snap-l> That was OK
<slestak> liekd his short ones with whachamijiggy
<snap-l> problem is, most tech shows like that start to get very navelgazey.
<rick_h__> now that lococast thing, that's one hot podcast :P
<slestak> :)
<brousch> finally got a personal pastebin-like site up on dreamhost. now i don't have to mooch off of rick_h__ http://paste.clusterbleep.net/paste/
<rick_h__> django? you're just trying to fire me up aren't you :P
<slestak> your no friend o django?
<slestak> im not either, just wondering
<rick_h__> no, huge fan of python, not a bit django fan
<rick_h__> just like to give brousch a hard time
<brousch> well i tried the flask-based one first, but i couldn't get it running on DH
<slestak> im not a web dev by any means, but i took a tour of framworks last year and I think I have settled on Flask for anything that comes up that I have work with
<Blazeix> brousch: the about page isn't working
<brousch> Blazeix: heh, and i left debug on, oops
<rick_h__> I like flask for small stuff
<Blazeix> but that's probably ok, no one ever visits about pages anyway :)
<binbrain> bobo FTW
<binbrain> only framework that comes truly barebones and lets you plug what you want
<slestak> bobo?
<slestak> not another to look at
<slestak> ;)
<rick_h__> or webob or weurkzeug
<binbrain> bobo uses webob and wsgi, that's it
<binbrain> and provides decorators for routes
<snap-l> There's this new awesome framework for Python. It's so minimalist, it allows me to integrate whatever I want
<slestak> flask uses weurk iirc and uses docrators for routes as well
<snap-l> it's called "from whatever import *"
<binbrain> ties you to a templating language though
<brousch> the flask-based one looked nice. i just couldn't seem to get it hooked up with dreamhost's passenger wsgi
<slestak> that still blows my mind to use mod_ruby for wsgi
<snap-l> slestak: Is it using Rack?
<slestak> i dunno
<slestak> passenger == mod_ruby right?
<brousch> if i create my own flask app i can get it working on there. i just can't get that pastebin one
<slestak> is wsgia python creation?
<snap-l> Thought rack was thehotness that allowed ruby to run practically anywhere.
<binbrain> slestak: sorda, but it shares a lot of similarities with cgi
<brousch> so i fell back to my good buddy django to use django-dpaste
<slestak> lets poke brousch some more.  nahh
<slestak> flask one on GAE?
<slestak> i just use pocoo.orgs pastebin
<brousch> GAE has limited number of apps i can use, so i want to save my slots for high traffic stuff
<slestak> text eoncoding of binaries, base64 is the only smart choice?
<brousch> the pocoo one is what i couldn't get running
<slestak> windows and python is the env so uuencode isnt coming out
<brousch> my wtf of the day http://paste.clusterbleep.net/paste/iHb7/
<snap-l> brousch: Wow, that's some fugly.
<snap-l> Who made this; accounting?
<brousch> no, it is old
<snap-l> Old like Cthulhu
<brousch> so the WTF is that they do these two giant queries, then the final little part completely ignores everything they just calculated and uses a number calculated from completely different numbers
<brousch> the giant queries are run but their results are never used
<binbrain> somebody decided it would be a good idea to name conf files for 100s of systems by the MAC instead of hostname, I can't handle this
<snap-l> binbrain: There's only one way that would have been smart, and that's at a level where the only thing you deal with is the mac address.
<slestak> anyone know if there is current unity breakage with nvidia cards?
<slestak> the same media that installed beta1 to my mini9 (intel chip) on my e1505 was responsive and usabel until I enabled nvidia driver, now everything looks ok, but ui will not register any mouse clicking anywhere.
<brousch> slestak: supposedly nvdiai-173 has been fixed but nvidia-96 is still broken
<krondor> slestak: I believe I'm affected by this; https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/compiz/+bug/733417 not sure what you're seeing.
<snap-l> Updated Open Metalcast to include some feedburner icons: http://openmetalcast.com/
<snap-l> a little annoyed that I couldn't use more than 7 characters without it getting overloaded
<slestak> I cannot tell because I have not terminal.  I will need to enable ssh and come in that way.
<slestak> I chose the (recommended) one from Hardware Drivers
<slestak> trying the No Effects login
<slestak> the NVIDIA X Server stiing reports version 270.41.06.
<slestak> yeah, classic and unity sufferring the same.
<slestak> I will try 173 explicitly and see if that is any better
<slestak> apply the 420 updates first
<slestak> excuse, 470
<brousch> slestak: yeah, install the updates first
<slestak> esp since beta1, a LOT has changed
<brousch> yes, beta2 is out and tons of updates since then
<snap-l> http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/team/918/detail/ <- Need some participants for this panel discussion.
<ColonelPanic001> I would volunteer, but I've never even seen Natty
<ColonelPanic001> I might not be very well qualified
<snap-l> ColonelPanic001: Awesome, you're hired
<ColonelPanic001> "What's the best feature of Natty" "Me, on panel: Well, you could install KDE, which is nice"
<snap-l> Feel free to say that during the panel
<ColonelPanic001> \o/
<snap-l> and I'll feel free to shove my foot up your ... ;)
<fdvalero> when and where
<snap-l> Penguicon, April 30th, 3pm
<slestak> lol
<ColonelPanic001> I'd really love to participate in stuff, I just don't have much to contribute to things, heh
<slestak> it reboots very fast
<slestak> what else
<ColonelPanic001> "which is useful when reinstalling with KDE"
<snap-l> Also, any metalheads should definitely check out the Open Metalcast with Cloudkicker
<snap-l> http://openmetalcast.com/2011/04/22/open-metalcast-special-episode-cloudkicker/
<snap-l> Seriously good stuff
<jrwren> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ugqaYJgv_F8#t=3m15s
<snap-l> grr... flash still busted.
<snap-l> heh, WRCJ had a promo re: the music of The Robe (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0046247/)
<snap-l> One of the actors is named "Jean Simmons", but of course my post 1970s ears heard "Gene Simmons"
<snap-l> Wondered what the heck Gene Simmons would be doing in a movie about the early Christian Church
<jrwren> lol
<jrwren> there is a japanese movie that is brilliant that you might like. It is called "Detroit Metal City".
<jcastro> snap-l: thanks for the retweet on the guide
<jcastro> I've gotten like 0 coverage from any linux news site
<jcastro> I guess my article must be too uncontroversial and useful
<snap-l> jcastro: No kiddin
<snap-l> I'm in linuxjournal helping someone out with Unity questions
<snap-l> Is there a way to keep the mac menu always on?
<jcastro> no unfortunately. :(
<snap-l> Ugh
<slestak> interesting.  all patches applied, rebooted numerous times.  nvidia-173 chosen explicitly.
<slestak> gnome classic works, however, unity will not.  Even the Ubuntu gdm selection still loads gnome standard.
<slestak> heading over to +1
<snap-l> Anyone able to post anything to reddit?
<nixternal> jcastro: yeah, you have to post lies and fud. once you do that, every linux news site will link to you. today i realized just how fucking useless these so-called news sites really are
<snap-l> I love that one of our sites for work is using Amazon's EC2, and is still down.
<jcastro> nixternal: Maybe it should be "unity power guide shuts down sounder"
<nixternal> i would post that
<snap-l> nixternal: Yah, with your hate speech about sounder
<snap-l> Canonical totally hates the community
<nixternal> fuck doing intellectual posts that help people, they don't get google ads clicks. i am just going to start posting nonsense
<nixternal> well, more than i already post
<snap-l> Canonical says babies are tastier with butter
<nixternal> little do people know, mark shuttleworth hates canonical
<snap-l> Canonical - Made from people.
<jcastro> nixternal: I think the people acting like idiots are totally missing the point
<snap-l> Ubuntu - Causes High Cholesterol in 80% of users
<jcastro> nixternal: at first you might think "oh wait, maybe we should think about this"
<jcastro> and then you see the tone of the responses
<jcastro> and you're like "oh, well, it's obvious the right decision was made."
<nixternal> jcastro: we are a linux distro for noobs, i expect nothing less than idiots. oh shit, and once they get wind of the fsf site, they become stallman hippies almost instantly and that makes them even worse
<snap-l> "It's obvious Canonical hates teh free speach"
<gamerchick02> lol. snap-l, wouldn't that make it soylent green?
<nixternal> once they realize if we did what stallman wanted, their computer would be nothing more than a pencil & a piece of paper
<jcastro> you shouldn't equate "noobs" with people acting stupid
<jcastro> they're not noobs because they are on a mailing list
<snap-l> gamerchick02: That's going to be the name of the release when they announce THE TRUTH
<snap-l> 14.04
<gamerchick02> ah
<nixternal> i do equate noobs that way though, and not all turn out that way. a vast majority do because they believe what they read and are so easy to be molded into an idiot
<gamerchick02> 14.04, Soylent Soybeans
<nixternal> that's just the way the mold falls i guess
<snap-l> MARK YOUR CALENDARS FOR SOYLENT STALLION
<gamerchick02> there we go. better than my soybeans one.
<gamerchick02> i'd go for Sexy Stallion. so i can ask, "are you runing Sexy?"
<snap-l> nixternal: Problem is folks try hard to fit in, so they lose sight of why they're part of the group in the first place
<nixternal> i am glad the idiots are going to gentoo. by the time they get it installed, setup, tweaked, and working, the desktop will be in high school history books
<gamerchick02> ok. gamerchick02 + alcohol + irc = stupid comments. whoops.
<snap-l> and it's very easy to get sucked into group-think
<snap-l> It's harder to take a deep breath and be rational
<snap-l> and think "maybe I _am_ being a dick"
<snap-l>  Lene Lovich - It's Only You (Mein Schmerz) (SomaFM: Underground '80's)
<snap-l> (heh, it's YOU)
<nixternal> everyone who comes around is so easy to brainwash. remember, i am the muppet master, i can mold and corrupt noobs with ease!
<snap-l> no, that's not possible, master nixternal
<snap-l> er, what? Where did that come from?
<nixternal> you need to check out ubuntu chicago. i got those puppets on a string. i tell them to switch to mac tomorrow they will
<gamerchick02> where'd what come from, snap-l?
<snap-l> gamerchick02: nixternal's brainwashing, no doubt.
<gamerchick02> ah
<nixternal> i need some undiewashing
<snap-l> http://finance.fortune.cnn.com/2011/04/22/sequoia-capital-backs-online-gaming-bundler/
<gamerchick02> my tumblr's been taken over by Gene Kelly. Not that i'm complaining...
<snap-l> Hello, bubble
<gamerchick02> snap-l, Humble Bubble?
<snap-l> Yeah, it's a name-your-price indie game promotion
<snap-l> http://humblebundle.com
<snap-l> there's one going on right now
<jcastro> nixternal: speaking of mac muppetry, how is specialK doing?
<gamerchick02> i know, snap-l, i've been a supporter
<gamerchick02> not this time, but the past two, i have bought. split my money between linux and windows
<snap-l> This one is good, imho
<gamerchick02> nice
<nixternal> jcastro: he is mac muppetry big time dude. he is so anti-linux it isn't even funny. he has become a bit weird lately
#ubuntu-us-mi 2011-04-23
<snap-l> Good morning
<rick_h_droid> party
<snap-l> And in two minutes, happy afternoon. ;)
<snap-l> Is anyone else having problems with flash video?
<snap-l> I can't get youtube or hulu or even magnatune to work
<rick_h__> nope, no flash problems here
<rick_h__> :P
<jcastro> OMG
<jcastro> http://www.engadget.com/2011/04/23/lenovo-thinkpad-x1-shows-up-online-looks-freakishly-thin/
<jcastro> rick
<jcastro> look at that
<rick_h__> wow, 13" gorilla glass?
<rick_h__> i5 with 8gb, nice
<jcastro> yeah
<jcastro> too bad about the price
<rick_h__> yea
<brousch> that laptop makes my pants feel tight
<rick_h__> doh, he's gone
<snap-l> jcastro: Got some more Rush albums from UHF
<snap-l> Show of Hands, shrinkwrapped, and Hemispheres.
<snap-l> They have Presto, first pressing for $24.95, which was too rich for my blood
<jcastro> oh nice
<jcastro> snap-l: I would kill for SoH and Hemispheres
<jcastro> rick_h__: you use offlineimap right?
<snap-l> jcastro: Down, sir.
<jcastro> snap-l: I'll trade you, you can have my Caress of Steel
<jcastro> haha
<snap-l> I don't need to be shirking off the mortal coil quite yet. ;)
<snap-l> I have Caress of Steel as well
<snap-l> Gah, just figured out why youtube wasn't working
<greg-g> jcastro: I use offlineimap, if you have a question about it
<snap-l> Managed to do something stupid with the router blocking
<greg-g> snap-l: hah, blocking facebook and youtube? you are a productivity crazy-head :P
<snap-l> No, I'm an idiot
<greg-g> or that
<snap-l> I checked something for blocking flash swf files, thinking that it was just for facebook
<snap-l> but apparently it blocked all .swf files.
<jcastro> greg-g: yeah is it possible to sync the inbox first?
<jcastro> greg-g: also, I found something awesome
<greg-g> hmmm
<jcastro> http://upsilon.cc/~zack/blog/posts/2011/01/how_to_use_Notmuch_with_Mutt/
<jcastro> this is AWESOME
<jcastro> it's like built in search now
<greg-g> yeah, rick and I both did that, it rocks
<snap-l> jcastro: That's like so two months ago
<jcastro> snap-l: I totally missed it!
<greg-g> jcastro: it looks like you can call offlineimap with -f and alist of folders to sync. Maybe do an offlineimap -f Inbox && offlineimap
<greg-g> https://github.com/nicolas33/offlineimap/blob/master/docs/MANUAL.rst#readme
<greg-g> it'll be a tad redundant, but, whatevs
<jcastro> yep
<jcastro> that did it
<jcastro> thanks!
<greg-g> rock
<greg-g> you're very welcome
<rick_h_34> jcastro yea, use offlineimap
<jcastro> I figured it out
<jcastro> greg0r helped me
<rick_h_34> ah, cool then
<rick_h__> ah, notmuch, yea that's pretty cool/useful
<rick_h__> uses xapian in the back
<rick_h__> I don't use it much, but when I do it's awesome
<jcastro> I binded it to f8
<jcastro> so it's basically like a google search
<jcastro> I needed that pretty hardcore
<rick_h__> yea, I use both F8 and F9
<rick_h__> to do the 'build current thread' thing
<rick_h__> I use that omre actually, get an email in inbox that i've put all the rest of the messages in some job folder
<rick_h__> and just F9 the whole thread together
 * greg-g loves it
<jcastro> https://forums.aws.amazon.com/thread.jspa?threadID=65649&tstart=0
<jcastro> man
<jcastro> "awesome"
<binbrain> that's gotta be fake
<binbrain> no way a medical monitoring device gets FDA approval without that blatant potential risk
<jcastro> I think it's so awesome
<jcastro> binbrain: I am going to beedubs tonight
<jcastro> binbrain: we're hanging out with meredith I guess
<binbrain> wish I was there
<binbrain> at least I get my wife back tomorrow
<snap-l> That's idiotic (AWS)
#ubuntu-us-mi 2011-04-24
<rick_h__> jcastro: that is just crazy
<rick_h__> It's bad enough company with $$ don't have a multiple availability zone plan
<rick_h__> but a freaking medical company that's now freaking out in forums?
<rick_h__> and then he's talking 3 servers?!
<rick_h__> later posts mention "two are back, one with most patients isn't"
<snap-l> Good morning, and Happy Easter!
<rick_h__> party bunny
<snap-l> Yeah, no kidding
<snap-l> Going to be AFK for most of the day today.
<rick_h__> yea, same here
<rick_h__> wife's working this morning and then grandma's house this afternoon
<snap-l> Yeah, church this AM with the parents, then off to JoDee's dad's, them back to my parents.
<snap-l> Party party.
<snap-l> Anywho, hope you all have a great day today! see you later!
<brousch> damn fools http://askubuntu.com/questions/36443/how-can-i-downgrade-python-or-use-many-versions/
<rick_h__> heh, poor brousch just trying to help
<jrmy> hello
<brousch> my incompetance tolerance gets lower every year
<rick_h__> welcome to the club
<jrmy> so have any of you heard about nintendo's new console?
<jrmy> or even care about consoles?
<jrmy> lol
<jrmy> man.. i hate sunburn
<jrmy> wish i didnt have to go outside again today.. only if i had something to cover my neck.
<maxsilver> jrmy: just the rumors about their new console
<jrmy> hear the facts?
<maxsilver> no? are they out?
<jrmy> maxsilver: sorry i was away..
<jrmy> what do you mean are they out?
<maxsilver> No, i dont think so. The way you asked made me think you might know something that wasnt yet announced
<jrmy> well did you hear the price range, earliest release date, size and gpu?
<maxsilver> ive only heard the gpu
<jrmy> yeah amd r700
<jrmy> full hd on a nintendo console should be cool
<jrmy> i dont care for the 3d but whatever
<jrmy> but the price was set as $350-$400
<maxsilver> that seems reasonable
<jrmy> earliest launch is somewhere between mid october and november
<jrmy> and the design is to be about the size of the xbox/xbox 360 whichever both are about the same size
<jrmy> and to look like a modern snes
<jrmy> but yeah thats about it for now
<jrmy> if youre subscribed to game informer as well as their mailing list you'd know this.. unless you didnt care to read the whole email
<maxsilver> i dont subscribe, but im interested to see their new stuff
<jrmy> but "miyamoto confirms a new console" caught my eye
<jrmy> as in game informer's or nintendo?
<jrmy> http://www.gameinformer.com/b/news/archive/2011/04/21/miyamoto-confirms-new-nintendo-console-pricing-and-release-rumors-surface.aspx
<jrmy> thats the page though
<jrmy> so i guess 3 day old news
<jrmy> lol
<jrmy> anyone know if subway is still doing the buy a 6" breakfast sub get one free?
<jrmy> 7am-9am
<jrmy> or is it just me and you maxsilver?
<jrmy> lost connection
<jrmy> maybe no one is talking because its easter
<snap-l> And now for round two...
<snap-l> swear this is worse than Christmas.
<jjesse> no one is talkign because we are in a food coma
#ubuntu-us-mi 2012-04-16
<greg-g> I finally found an excuse to use the <blink> tag in a blog post! http://blog.grossmeier.net/2012/04/15/learning-arduino/
<rick_h> hah, how did you end up with that?
<rick_h> awesome idea
<rick_h> I can understand howt he toys are crazy. I tried to stay away from too much noise stuff
<snap-l> greg-g: Send a note to the manufacturer that the toy is defective.
<snap-l> "It plays drums like a white country music fan"
<snap-l> rick_h: I think I figured out a way to do the json file for my playlists without sniplate
<snap-l> create a small script to read the id3 tags off of a series of flac / mp3 files.
<snap-l> should be a day project
 * snap-l is finally fed up with Miro
<snap-l> using gpodder now
<rick_h> snap-l: yea, something to json just screams script me
<snap-l> http://derivativecrafts.blogspot.com/2012/04/ogre-mk-v.html
<snap-l> Morning
<rick_h> morn
<brousch1> mo
<snap-l> btw: The Ubuntu Code of Conduct has been updated.
<snap-l> Expect the trout-slapping to increase
<snap-l> http://fridge.ubuntu.com/2012/04/16/code-of-conduct-update/
<brousch1> oh great, now we have to be agile
<brousch1> '''Leadership in the broader interest'''  We expect that leaders hold the interests of the team and the Ubuntu community above those of themselves, their employer, and other projects.
<brousch1> It looks like I won't be leading anything Ubuntu
<ColonelPanic001> heh, no kidding
<ColonelPanic001> "sorry boss, fire me if you must, I'M GOING TO THIS BUGJAM"
<brousch1> at least it doesn't say above their god or country
<ColonelPanic001> Everyone knows I only do that for WSULUG
<ColonelPanic001> ;)
<snap-l> Yeah, that needs some rewording
<ColonelPanic001> <God> Colonel Panic, go forth and teach thy peers to worship the One True God
<ColonelPanic001> <Me> K later God, I have to go do some questions on Launchpad Answers
<ColonelPanic001> <God> OMG wtf
<ColonelPanic001> <Me> *sunglasses* Deal with it.
<ColonelPanic001> I fear one day, my language abilities will devolve to being capable of expressing ideas only as internet memes.
<jrwren> i don't know that internet meme
<snap-l> http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/deal-with-it
<snap-l> rick_h: What was the command that creates setup.py for Python?
<snap-l> Not having much luck with Google.
<rick_h> http://pypi.python.org/pypi/modern-package-template
<snap-l> ty
<rick_h> np, it's good stuff
<rick_h> start every bit of code with that, there are a few examples in packages I wrote at MP that use it
<jrwren> thanks, I'll check that out too!
<brousch1> ug, this computer is driving me nuts. brb
<rick_h> jrwren: yea, nice to start out projects consistantly and you start out being able to do python setup.py sdist ootb
<snap-l> Hm, PasteDeploy 1.5 has a key error on setup.
<snap-l> Looks like a bug in the python I have on 11.10
<rick_h> snap-l: doh, sorry. Paste the traceback?
<snap-l> One sec
<rick_h> snap-l: also try the install again, I have had that happen lately for some reason
<snap-l> Trying it again in another virtualenv
<rick_h> what's the latest in editing text fields in vim for firefox? jrwren greg-g ?
<snap-l> CTRL-C / CTRL-V
<snap-l> ;)
<rick_h> bah
<snap-l> rick_h: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/9058804/pip.log
<rick_h> hmmm just chcked that I've got 1.5 here
<snap-l> 11.10?
<rick_h> oh hmm, that was pastescript throwing the error not deploy it looks like
<rick_h> snap-l: yea, try running it again if you haven't
<rick_h> in the same venv
<snap-l> wtf
<rick_h> because the traceback seems to imply that pastedeploy got installed, but that pastescript when trying to reference it failed
<rick_h> so guessing there's some race condition there
<snap-l> Yeah, it's working now
<snap-l> weird.
<rick_h> ok yea
<rick_h> cool
<snap-l> btw: In case someone is wondering if the Penguicon traffic regarding room parties applies to the release party
<snap-l> registration in this case means having the room party registered with the con
<snap-l> The hotel liaison helped us set up the release party location
<snap-l> They're aware of it
<snap-l> The hotel is VERY strict on keeping things quiet, so if a party erupts on a quiet floor, or the party isn't previously approved, the hotel will boot them from the con.
<snap-l> period.
<snap-l> So I don't foresee any problems.
<snap-l> Unfortunately, if you're planning on attending the release party, you'll still need to have a day pass for Penguicon.
<snap-l> Which is something we'll need to discuss in the future.
<jrwren> rick_h: i'm not even sure what you are asking. the latest in editing text fields in vim for firefox?
<rick_h> jrwren: I get a version breackages notice for itsalltext
<rick_h> and there's a few diff plugins
<rick_h> so curious what people are using and figured you might be using something
<jrwren> ah, I don' tuse that plugin.
<jrwren> i really should use a vim kb plugin for FF, but I've not yet.
<rick_h> jrwren: k, sorry to bug you :)
<jrwren> lol, i like it when you bug me.
<jrwren> nag me to increase my nerd levels
<jcastro> rick_h: your gear come in yet?
<rick_h> jcastro: no, UPS man comes late...so probably will be late night bleeding session for me tonight :)
<snap-l> Sounds like fun. ;-P
<rick_h> oh yea...can't wait lol
<snap-l> Y'know, some people pay good money for pain
<rick_h> this damn split url bar search bar in FF is maddening
<snap-l> God, this site is retarded.
<snap-l> https://www.provena.org/stmarys/body_psmhfoundation.cfm?id=578
<snap-l> The javascript makes it so you can't send in a donation under $100
<jrwren> rick_h: what equipment did you get?
<rick_h> jrwren: shaving stuff?
<rick_h> http://goo.gl/PlN31
<jrwren> ah, nice.
<rick_h> http://goo.gl/EkvO2
<jrwren> ah, you might have liked the longer handled model razor.
<rick_h> so I went back and forth on that
<jrwren> its same exact merkur heavy duty, but with a longer handle
<rick_h> supposedly the long handle is cool, but should make moving harder?
<jrwren> you'll probably adjust to the short handle and be just fine.
<rick_h> yea, I figured short handle == more agile perhaps?
<rick_h> but we'll see
<jrwren> oh wow, that looks like a nice brush and a great deal too.
<rick_h> I did think about it and debate back/forth
<jrwren> i have a travel model wiht a short handle and i adjust to it just fine when I travel.
<rick_h> k
<rick_h> I've not gotten a stand yet and if I end up with two razors I'll get the 4 place stand/holder
<rick_h> and just deal with it, but whatever
<rick_h> it's a start to try out
<jrwren> i didn't get a stand until much later.
<jrwren> all of these items are nice htings for wives to buy husbands so i just let janice get 'em for me.
<jrwren> wishliste 'em or whatever.
<jrwren> good fathersday gifts ya knwo.
<rick_h> yea, true
<jrwren> travel one I have: http://www.amazon.com/Merkur-Travel-Razor-Chrome-Plated-Leather/dp/B001LY5WZ2/ref=sr_1_53?s=hpc&ie=UTF8&qid=1334590214&sr=1-53
<rick_h> nice
<jrwren> even shorter handle, but its cool, it screws apart in 4 pieces.
<jrwren> yeah, folds down to very small for travel.
<rick_h> what soap/etc do you use? That seems to be the big giant whole to fall into
<jrwren> and TSA has never paid it notice
<rick_h> hah, cool
<jrwren> i use wahtever soap i have around.
<jrwren> wife got me some very fragrant soap i'm using now.
<rick_h> ah k
<jrwren> but in the past I've used fragrant stuff that I snag from hotels
<rick_h> really?
<jrwren> yup, really anything works.
<rick_h> oh cool, didn't realize that.
<jrwren> its just if you really want to spoil yourself you get the stuff with that a.... acid   can't remember the a word
<jrwren> it makes your face tingle and feels real nice.
<rick_h> gotcha
<brousch> does it linger? i used aftershave a couple of times, but it made my coffee taste like windex
<rick_h> yea, more worried about stuff that'll sud/hold water well I guess
<jrwren> acetic maybe?
<jrwren> nah, it doesn't linger.
<brousch> i seriously thought someone poured ammonia in the coffee machine. dumped it out and made a new pot
<rick_h> ouch
<jrwren> brousch: GROSS
<brousch> yeah, so no smelly aftershave now
<jrwren> i did enjoy the soap that was in jorge's picture. that came in the black plastic container.
<jrwren> it was very nice.
<rick_h> yea, I got a thing to start with that's like that
<jrwren> that lasted me a long time
<jrwren> 6-9mo IIRC
<rick_h> yea, I figure at the end of a few weeks I'll have an idea how it works out and what to look at going forward
<jrwren> *nod*
<jrwren> maybe you will like lots of fragrance, maybe you won't.
<jrwren> maybe you will like the luxury of a nice soap, maybe you won't.
<jrwren> or maybe you won't care enough to care about the fancy soap <-- me
<jrwren> i like it when it is there, but i don't go out of my way to get it.
<rick_h> hah, need to start up a new podcast on shaving. jcastro can star in it
<jcastro> COUNT ME IN
<greg-g> alright, who has an X-series 9-cell lenovo battery they want to sell me? :) no luck here for the last few weeks http://outlet.lenovo.com/accessories/batteries.html
<jcastro> greg-g: come to UDS, I might give you mine
<jcastro> my x220 isn't becoming travel friendly anymore, too much shell damage
<rick_h> smoser: you going to UDS?
<jcastro> rick_h: if you don't have a stand don't let the brush sit upright like that when it's  drying off
<rick_h> ouch, shell damage? what did you do to the thing
<snap-l> jcastro: Dude, what the heck?
<jcastro> rick_h: supposedly you don't want water down by the knotty end of the brush over long periods of time
<rick_h> jcastro: yea, figured getting it all up there would be bad
<rick_h> I'll get a stand, just going to wait a few days of trial first
<jcastro> laying it on it's side should do the trick, heh
<rick_h> yea, or rig to hang it via string/something for a bit
<brousch> you need a special fan and sanitizing gel to make sure it stays clean
<jcastro> hahaha
<rick_h> I'm already afraid of the brush after seeing posts about the smell of them to start with
<jcastro> mine smelled a little bit for the first 3 times
<jcastro> that was it
<jcastro> it's not like, OMG, I AM DYING.
<brousch> an autoclave will work too
<snap-l> I am feeling very facially hair challenged.
<greg-g> jcastro: yay! I will! (though, admittedly, I won't be there the whole week, but I'll be there for part of it)
<jcastro> I have the small battery too
<jcastro> greg-g: I need the laptop for UDS but towards the end?
<greg-g> sure thing, when are you leaving town?
<jcastro> that saturday morning
<jcastro> so the Friday perhaps?
<greg-g> yeah, def that Friday I'll be there
<greg-g> just added to my calendar, 5pm - Midnight "Get laptop battery from jorge, etc"
<greg-g> ;)
<snap-l>  s/Get laptop battery/Try to find Jorge to find that window of time to get laptop battery/
<greg-g> yeah, exactly :)
<greg-g> hah, this diff really isn't very helpful at all http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~sabdfl/ubuntu-codeofconduct/v2-draft/revision/17
<snap-l> greg-g: Maybe we could do a git merge. ;)
 * greg-g snickers
<snap-l> It looks on the surface like they made it less verbose.
<greg-g> right, but, as I've learned talking to lawyers and politicians, you have to watch every single word because once it is gone and you agree to a version, it is near impossible to get it back (if you care about that word, that is)
<jrwren> the more i use desktop linux, the more i hate it :(
<greg-g> aww man, such a nice response from an All Hands Active person on my blog post, too bad I can't go take him up on the offer: http://blog.grossmeier.net/2012/04/15/learning-arduino/
<jrwren> i really like the new brush smell
<jrwren> why do I have to hold the mouse button down in menus?
<jrwren> shouldn't 1 click leave it open and let me click my selection?
<greg-g> jrwren: it does in gnome-shell :)
<jcastro> that sounds odd jrwren
<jcastro> rick_h: heh! 9 minutes.
<jcastro> rick_h: I shave around lunch time now
<jrwren> jcastro: vnc session might behave differently?
<jcastro> I am down to 3 passes, 9 minutes.
<jcastro> jrwren: hmm maybe, I don't see why it would though
<jrwren> 3 passes, 9 minutes, what does that mean?
<jcastro> does it do that in other OSes?
<jcastro> jrwren: 3 lathers and shaves
<jrwren> oh damn. i just do a single pass and its good enough.
<jcastro> jrwren: according to the guy-who-looks-like-Craig videos that's how you're supposed to roll
<jcastro> oh, well, I am hairy too
<jrwren> yeah, you always had the 5 oclock shadow at noon.
<jcastro> indeed
<jcastro> in the army I had to shave like 3 times a day
<jcastro> it sucked.
<jcastro> 6am, noonish, and then around 5ish if I was working at night
<greg-g> jcastro: what?! really? 3x a day?
<greg-g> wow
<greg-g> army efficiency! (or something ;) )
<jcastro> my brother is even worse, he shaves and you can't tell
<rick_h> heh
<jrwren> i always forget you are army
<ColonelPanic001> greg-g is the Army?
<rick_h> ColonelPanic001: no, jcastro
<ColonelPanic001> jcastro is the Army?
<jcastro> no, WAS
<smoser> rick_h, yes, going to uds. i arrive wed of previous week.
<ColonelPanic001> then they had to form the DoD to replace him, I assume.
<jrwren> once army, always army
<greg-g> ColonelPanic001: I got it, don't worry :)
<rick_h> qotd https://twitter.com/#!/garybernhardt/status/191935421738008577
<jrwren> lol.
<jrwren> i was actually running linux on the desktop in 1997
<jrwren> and today I'm not.
<rick_h> well the whole thread there is fun to watch a little bit
<rick_h> it started out more with the estimated logevitiy of these node apps and such
<jrwren> i only show one reply :(
<greg-g> yay status net!
<rick_h> jrwren: just check out gary's stream
<rick_h> it wasn't all in a single thread, he just spurted out and ended up dragging it over several posts
<jrwren> ah, i see. thanks.
<snap-l> jrwren: You're still running UNIX though
<snap-l> or at least something that can cope with 20 year old code reasonably well
<jrwren> you-nicks!
<rick_h> uh oh...here we go
<jrwren> saved myself from the dinosours
<jrwren> UNIX on my phone.
<jrwren> UNIX on my linksys router.
<snap-l> jrwren: You're on a Mac?
<jrwren> UNIX on my mac.
<brousch> i am jrwrenning today
<jrwren> ya know... for a week there i didn't know bash well enough and I needed an expr feature that is in gnu but not bsd, had ot gnuify my system.
<brousch> old dell is not running well
<snap-l> jrwrenning === winning
<jrwren> :) lol.
<jrwren> <3 u guys
<jrwren> snap-l: remember my comment on overmastery the other day?  I just had to turn volume WAY down on this becasue it was so bad it hurt my ears: Eminem Without Me
<rick_h> brousch: do you have any good way of queue'ing up things in google music?
<rick_h> guess just create a playlist nad keep adding crap to it?
<jcastro> it's the one thing that sucks about G music
<jcastro> well, 2 actually
<jcastro> rick_h: So I retagged and reripped some stuff
<jcastro> and it reuploaded it to GMusic
<jcastro> which I was like "oh awesome"
<jcastro> except now I have exactly two copies of every metallica album on there
<brousch> playlist is the only quque, i think
<brousch> queue
<jrwren> can't delete 'em?
<rick_h> jcastro: yea, it's a bit quirkly in playback
<rick_h> I'm liking it overall, but I keep hitting little things going..ugh, come on
<brousch> funny. i copied all of my music to itunes and gmusic hasn't doubled up anything
<jcastro> rick_h: I know, that last 10% is so annoying
<jrwren> anyone know CGI well enough to know how the server invokes the script?
<jrwren> i know it sets QUERY_STRING and PATH_INFO and some other stuff
<jrwren> but how does it pass docroot?
<jrwren> does it change pwd and invoke the script as ./script ?
<jrwren> hrm... scripts executed from ServerRoot.
<snap-l> jrwren: I think there's a little more sandboxing than just cd $DOCROOT;./script
<jrwren> snap-l: you are probably wrong :)
<snap-l> I don't know offhand what that is, though
<snap-l> jrwren: Wouldn't be a first. :)
<jrwren> anyway, I was looking for SCRIPT_FILENAME
<jrwren> snap-l: there is zero sandboxing.
<snap-l> I thought 2.x added some more
<jrwren> unless you run something like suexec
<jrwren> well, i'm talking CGI
<jrwren> server agnostic
<snap-l> Ah, OK
<snap-l> I've only worked with Apache for Perl CGI
<snap-l> and php-cgi for NGINX
<jrwren> php-cgi is waht i am using too.
<jrwren> but i'm trying to run it cmdline.
<jrwren> i want to pass QUERY_STRING and have it run a for-web php.
<snap-l> something different than this? http://stackoverflow.com/questions/3848901/how-to-pass-query-string-parameters-to-the-php-binary
<jrwren> snap-l: yes, that is what i'm doing, but those answers are unsatisfactory
<jrwren> use argv is not a real answer.
<jcastro> greg-g: sounds like you need MORE WHITESPACE in your life
<jrwren> any vimmers use set switchbuf=usetab ?
<greg-g> jcastro: :)
<jrwren> its possible my vimconfig is not good.
<jrwren> 2G of usage just seems wrong.
<jcastro> greg-g: hah man
<jcastro> "see you on identi.ca"
<jcastro> awesome
<rick_h> jrwren: 2G of ram?
<rick_h> jrwren: no, using switchbuf useopen
<snap-l> ????
<snap-l> greg-g: What's this about identi.ca?
<rick_h> snap-l: see his G+ post
<greg-g> snap-l: actually, I didn't mention identi.ca, but, I've basically said I won't use G+ anymore :)
<greg-g> it was a long time coming, something stupid just tilted me over the edge
<snap-l> greg-g: Always the way it happens.
 * greg-g uses a ton of will power to not click that red 1 at the top of GReader because he knows its in response to his last post and dang would that be hypocritical
<snap-l> heh
<greg-g> watch, it'll be the best conversation ever on G+ (on something I said) and I'll miss it
<snap-l> Well, it's part of the reason I switched back to r2e
<snap-l> I missed the part about people sharing back with me in my reader, not my plus page.
<snap-l> Although I want to know when greg-g became the angry hippie.
<brousch> i miss wave and buzz
<snap-l> buzz, maybe. Wave was a solution in search of a problem.
<greg-g> snap-l: yeah, it was gradual, but precipitated after the move to SF, I believe. I really need to work on getting the angry back out
<snap-l> greg-g: You should move back to Michigan. We don't harsh mellow.
<snap-l> We just bbq the mallow.
<brousch> roast the mallow on a stick ovr an open flame
<greg-g> ok ok ok I clicked it!
<greg-g> jcastro: now I get why you mentioned identi.ca ;)
<rick_h> haha
<greg-g> this is awesome:
<greg-g> http://arxiv.org/pdf/1204.0162v1.pdf
<greg-g> guy proving his innocence (accused of running a stop sign) via a paper he wrote and put on arXiv
<jrwren> anyone want to help me with a bash quoting problem. maybe if I ask, i'll figure it out.
<jrwren> blah  | awk '{print "define('\'\"$1\"\'', 1);//"$1}'
<jrwren> teh second $1 displays, hte first doees not, i can't figure what I'm doing wrong with quoting.
<jrwren> nvm, got it
<jrwren> see, i just had to ask
<greg-g> what's the solution?
<jrwren> | awk '{print "define('\''"$1"'\'', 1);//"$1}'
<greg-g> when in doubt, add more 's
<snap-l> http://www.metalinjection.net/around-the-interwebs/what-kind-of-metalhead-are-you
<jrwren> zomg snap-l this is awesome.
<ColonelPanic001> heh. the pantera one made me snicker
<snap-l> funny thing is I don't fit any of those
<ColonelPanic001> meh, they're stereotypes from one guy
<snap-l> "Guy that's just there to listen to the music"
<ColonelPanic001> lame
<jrwren> i don't fit them either.
<jrwren> but I'm not a metaler
<brousch> snap-l: You are the power metaller, but lack the hair
<snap-l> brousch: I think I'm offended
<jrwren> lol, vim just gave me OOM !
<snap-l> If you want any Cloudkicker merch, better get on it.
<snap-l> Ben Sharpe is getting married, so he'll be AFK for a month
<snap-l> http://cloudkicker.bandcamp.com/
<rick_h> grrrrr....if you do python and use tabs I'll...I'll......bah!!!!!!!!!!!
<jrwren> i might have done just that, lemme check
<jrwren> nope, guess my conditional vimrc is working.
<rick_h> better...else you end up with diffs like this: https://github.com/mitechie/python-readability/commit/edccec5d3b4cecee3fdccff7667dd81bb3ed6258
<rick_h> because I get freaking syntax errors adding code that has spaces in it
<widox> yuck
<jrwren> someone reformated your spaces?
<jrwren> just tell diff to ignore whitespace :)
<jcastro> it's past work hours
<jcastro> let's talk about shaving
<greg-g> I got a new beard trimmer today!
<rick_h> jcastro: got my stuff in, but have ot make dinner and get the boy to bed
<rick_h> looks shiny
<rick_h> jrwren: I reformatted their tabs into spaces so I could edit their code
<rick_h> it's going to go through a pep8 religous experience tonight
<rick_h> and if they don't like it I'll just keep my fork
<greg-g> rick_h: hah
<jrwren> rick_h: nice.
<jrwren> rick_h: install a precommit hook that runs *.py through a pep8 command
<rick_h> jrwren: no kidding
<rick_h> http://build.bmark.us/job/bookie-api/violations/ build servers people...
<rick_h> I need to do some light cleanup on the main bookie app
<rick_h> http://build.bmark.us/job/bookie-main/violations/
<rick_h> jcastro: ok, first shave done
<rick_h> all tingly
<rick_h> http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0007XD3EU/ref=oh_o04_s01_i00_details has me feeling all pretty :P
#ubuntu-us-mi 2012-04-17
<jcastro> rick_h: your tank looks awesome
<jcastro> 2 coreys?
<rick_h> jcastro: 6
<jcastro> rick_h: ooooh nice! (wrt. the shave)
<rick_h> 6 cories, 6 rainbows, down to 8 harlequin and 8 cardinal tetras
<rick_h> one rubber nose pleco, 3 chinese algae eaters
<rick_h> one of the harelquins committed suicide jumping out the tank :/
<jcastro> Jill is traumatized by our last die off
<rick_h> yea, my wife wasn't happy
<jcastro> though I personally want to just double down
<rick_h> she told me "I don't want to know about these things..."
<rick_h> yea, I mean fish are fragile and you lose some.
<rick_h> the two main ones you could tell were sick/not schooling with the others
<rick_h> I told the wife "oooh, that's a bad sign..."
<rick_h> and got yelled at for saying that
<rick_h> two days later....poor fishies
<jcastro> heh
<rick_h> but 3 out of the what...over 30 I conider a good run
<jcastro> I was doing awesome
<jcastro> it's the one getting stuck in the filter
<rick_h> and the guys in tehre are starting to really get some good color going, feeding real stuff vs flake ftw!
<rick_h> heh
<jcastro> and turning it into a filter of ammonia death for like a week before I found it
<rick_h> ouch, yea I try to do a quick count each morning
<rick_h> so I've caught most of them next day
<jcastro> heh
<jcastro> My tank was humming just fine until then
<jcastro> everything was awesome
<rick_h> shave was good, learned a lot, next one will be better
<jcastro> it was like a perfect SimCity
<rick_h> the brush is crazy
<jcastro> yeah
<rick_h> heh, aw3esome
<jcastro> it's all about the prep
<rick_h> the blades tripped me up, didn't realize they'd be that small/bendy
<rick_h> almost feel like plastic they're so thin
<jcastro> yeah I always flip out when changing them
<jcastro> remembering the long sides are sharp
<jcastro> but the other ones, not so much
<rick_h> I was thinking like the razor blades you'd get at the hardware store
<rick_h> pretty stiff
<jcastro> ah, right
<jcastro> what blades?
<jcastro> I am trying the gillette 7 oclocks next
<rick_h> just the defeault merkur one that came with the razor
<rick_h> it came with some other ones, box of 10
<jcastro> ah
<rick_h> so I've got 11 blades to work with for now
<rick_h> I'm sure I'll try something out and find some stuff
<jcastro> 11 weeks worth!
<jcastro> I like the merkur ones, they're my favorite so far
<jcastro> the only ones I suck with are the Lord ones ...
<rick_h> good to know
<jcastro> I think depends on the face and the person
<jcastro> From what I can gather it's easy to fall into monster-cable-type idiocy with this stuff
<rick_h> yea, seems to be the idea, interchange more parts to find what works for you
<rick_h> yea, I don't think I shave enough to get that into it
<jcastro> heh yeah
<rick_h> I'm a twice a week shaver, would love a little more, but don't think I'll be doing it twice a day nuts or anything
<jcastro> I have this waking nightmare of craig watching the scrollback and being like "what happened to you guys."
<rick_h> heh, I think I've already left him like that.
<jjesse> yeah i tuned this whole channel out lately
<jjesse> sounds like some extreme makeover?
<jcastro> hah
<jcastro> well, what do we normally talk about at 9pm on a monday?
<rick_h> beer!
<jjesse> well you were talking about it at 9am this morning as well
<rick_h> oh crap, not allowed to do that lately
<jjesse> i learned that jcastro shaved 4 times in the army
<jjesse> or something silly
<jcastro> 3!
<snap-l> jcastro: Too late
<snap-l> Figure you gents are busily manscaping and such
<jcastro> hah
<jcastro> we're brogramming
 * rick_h does a twitch...damn word
<snap-l> Hah, latest Prog magazine has a newspaper in the style of "Thick as a brick"
<jrwren> it reminds me of queer eye for the straight guy.
<jrwren> 'cept even teh queer didn't teach proper shaving.
<jrwren> the show instead got sponsors liek gillette and the hawked the latest 3, 4,5,6,7 blade razors that dont' work nearly as well as a proper shave.
<jrwren> how about: straight eye for the straight guy. real shaving, none of that sissy shit.
<snap-l> jrwren: You expected something else?
<snap-l> tsk tsk, it's all about the marketing
<jrwren> snap-l: expected: no.  wanted: of course.
<rick_h> bah, couldn't get all the way to pep8 in one shot
<rick_h> going to take some effort... https://github.com/buriy/python-readability/pull/15/files
<rick_h> that time when you submit a pull request and wait for someone on the other side of the world to get around to peeking at it...
<Shakes808> Hello all,
<rick_h> howdy
<Shakes808> I have a question if you could be so kind :D
<rick_h> depends on the question, but shoot
<Shakes808> I am new to Linux and am installing and configuring GIT
<Shakes808> I am going through the progit.org tut
<Shakes808> What should I use for a diff tool?
<rick_h> I just use git diff
<rick_h> if you want you can use an external program. I think meld is pretty good with a gui, or gdfiff if you're a good vim users
<rick_h> but I'd suggest getting comfy with the normal git diff output
<Shakes808> I am going to try using VIM
<Shakes808> I have Eclipse downloaded as well
<Shakes808> So GIT comes with a Diff tool?
<Shakes808> Do I need to install it or does it come with the package?
<rick_h> http://luhman.org/blog/2009/08/25/git-difftool-and-vimdiff
<rick_h> git diff is just a git command that will output a diff for you
<Shakes808> alright, looks like i have it already :D
<Shakes808> Thank you
<rick_h> np, have fun
<Shakes808> :)
<Shakes808> So question about that
<Shakes808> I put in what they suggested for the colors and all that jazz, but when I go to open vim I get"
<Shakes808> "Error detected while processing /home/aaron/.vimrc:
<Shakes808> line   3:
<Shakes808> E185: Cannot find color scheme green
<Shakes808> Press ENTER or type command to continue
<Shakes808> It goes into vim but doesn't hold the configurations that I put in per the site
<Shakes808> User Error! I miss spelled greens
<rick_h> morning
<snap-l> Good morning
<snap-l> Latest OMC is up
<rick_h> party on!
<snap-l> And, just because I can't seem to win when it comes to smart phones: I asked Ting if it would be possible to upgrade to the Motorola Photon to get a phone to me sooner
<rick_h> http://shop.oreilly.com/category/deals/pocket-references.do?imm_mid=083695&cmp=em-code-books-videos-pocket-reference-direct
<snap-l> checked the device list: Photon is nw shipping in 2-3 weeks
<rick_h> oh hmmm, :/
<rick_h> ok yea not sure on the photon as an ok phone
<snap-l> but my inner child wants new toys.
<snap-l> WAH!!!
<snap-l> rick_h: I have some of those pocket references. I don't find I use them nearly as often as I think I would
<rick_h> I do like the regex one
<rick_h> I don't use the python one much admittingly
<rick_h> I think the key is they have to be kept right in front of you
<snap-l> Yep
<rick_h> then there's that brousch guy
<snap-l> ALthough I don't have the ebook version of the regex book.
<rick_h> well not a fan of htem as ebooks
<snap-l> but that's $4.99 as an upgrade, so no hurry
<rick_h> just not good for that
<snap-l> Yeah
 * snap-l decides to take the pocket reference books to work
<snap-l> God, the Python "Pocket Reference" is 210 pages.
<rick_h> well it's for a whole lang
<rick_h> I got that one in ebook and never ever use
<brousch> eh, what aboot me?
<snap-l> I want to know what it is about Mr. Lutz that makes his books so damn huge.
<brousch> good grpug last night. 2 new guys, 2 old guys came back, 3 python jobs mentioned
<rick_h> nice!
<rick_h> got my branch merged into the readability library, think I'm going to try to take ownership of it
<brousch> of the project?
<rick_h> yea, she says she's in maint mode, but already have 6 todo items to fix up on it
<rick_h> and there's a fork that's done a ton of good work on it I want to cherry pick 20 commits or so
<rick_h> but it's go no tests, no build, poor setup.py setup, no pep8...it needs a lot of <3
<brousch> carpe forkum
<rick_h> yea, but I want my changes on pypi
<rick_h> so unless I fork/rename/etc but why if I can get commit rights or even maintainership?
<brousch> yeah
<rick_h> speaking of modern-package-template from yesterday http://kennethreitz.com/repository-structure-and-python.html
<rick_h> though note he doesn't advocate the src directory which a lot of commenters do
<brousch> i'm not sureabout src
<brousch> seems unnecessary
<rick_h> well it won't work on heroku :/
<rick_h> but I like it
<brousch> pydev tries to do it by default
<rick_h> it splits up the clear package bits from virtualenv and other things
<brousch> so you and pydev agree on something
<rick_h> doh!
<rick_h> no I mean... that... crap
<brousch> muahahahah
<brousch> rick_h: o'reilly is looking for reviewers for "Fitness for Geeks" http://shop.oreilly.com/product/0636920015475.do?imm_mid=083cf6&cmp=em-code-ug-ug-nl-apr12
<rick_h> good stress uh oh
<brousch> good stress?
<rick_h> from the book description
<brousch> ah, at the end
<brousch> i had to install the ginormous XCode and the XCode Command Line Utilities (an additional giant download) just to get virtualenvs working on OSX
<rick_h> heh, I don't get devs on osx sometimes but oh well
<brousch> and then i needed an additional apt-like program called homebrew to install the poppler library
<brousch> i cannot live like this
<jrwren> brousch: why not? brew is really nice.
<jrwren> brousch: and IIRC there is some way you can install xcode command line utils without full xcode.
<brousch> maybe, but the instructions i found had you go through XCode->Prefs->downloads and download it from inside of xcode
<rick_h> yea, I think armin setup the command line tools only package or something
<jrwren> brousch: me too. i've no idea how to get them wihtout full xcode.
<jrwren> but i use full xcode occasionally, so I'm find with snagging it
<rick_h> http://librelist.com/browser//homebrew/2012/2/16/command-line-tools-for-xcode/
<rick_h> sorry, kenneth did it I guess then
<rick_h> see if it shows up in homebrew for you
<jrwren> https://github.com/downloads/kennethreitz/osx-gcc-installer/GCC-10.7-v2.pkg  looks like that it one option
<rick_h> or that I guess
<rick_h> :)
<brousch> bah, well it's done now. my gigabytes are occupied
<rick_h> well for future reference
<jrwren> you might not be able to brew install it becuase it installs to system paths and brew does not install things to system paths.
<rick_h> gotcha
<rick_h> yea, just going off the email there
<jrwren> from __future__ import print_function #pros?cons?
<brousch> i think it just works in 2.7
<rick_h> yea
<brousch> is that for 2.6?
<rick_h> maybe 26?
<jrwren> oh?
<rick_h> make sure to test it first
<jrwren> ty.
<rick_h> pro if you can use it
<jrwren> i'm not sure how to tell the difference.
<jrwren> print("hi"); works no matter what.
<rick_h> looks like it works in python 2.6
<rick_h> jrwren: yea, but doens't print without () error if that's imported?
<rick_h> jrwren: yea, so testing it on my 2.6 ec2 box
<rick_h> if you import print_function it makes `print 'test'` a syntax error
<rick_h> and that imports in 2.6
<jrwren> but the function syntax works either way.
<jrwren> ah, so it just makes the old syntax error.
<jrwren> ok, I get it.
<jrwren> anyone used proxmox ? looks like pretty sweet virtualization
<rick_h> nope
<jjesse> anyone watching tDiscovery land at Dulles Airport?
<jjesse> looks like its finally coming in after a flyby of DC
<snap-l> How poetic. ;)
<snap-l> "Hey DC, get a glimpse of how great America was"
<jjesse> basically
<jjesse> maybe they should've done this more often so we would still have a shuttle program
<snap-l> Nah, because then they'd bitch for the added air travel.
<jjesse> well people are now interested in the shuttle
<jjesse> should've done that earlier
<snap-l> Maybe they'll get interested in the XPrize contenders
<snap-l> Maybe NASA can compete then. ;)
<rick_h> bwuhahah, upload stupid @#$#@ to pypi, I just point requirements.txt at my git repo!
<snap-l> rick_h: Context, or we'll label you raving mad
<rick_h> the readable maintainer merged my branch in, but uploaded an .egg to pypi
<snap-l> Ah, OK
<rick_h> .egg == no pip install == no heroku since it uses pip requirements.txt
<rick_h> so I ping'd a heroku guy, found outit supports git installs
<brousch> heh
<rick_h> and thus bypass stupid paackage mantainer and just use my fork for heroku so it works
<brousch> carpe forkum!
<rick_h> yep, though I now have commit bits
<rick_h> so I can commit to her git repo, but still need to get her to upload proper source dists
<rick_h> so merged in a makefile with a make upload command that forces sdist :)
<rick_h> bwuahhahaha, I'll makify the world!
<rick_h> and `make heroku` is complete and my app is updated
<rick_h> <3
<rick_h> sometimes I just love software, work around all the problems and just make it go
<brousch> does make work on windows?
<rick_h> no idea, who cares :P
<rick_h> http://gnuwin32.sourceforge.net/packages/make.htm
<brousch> well, you're assuming the maintainer can run make
<rick_h> true
<snap-l> http://www.quickmeme.com/meme/3ou16t/
<snap-l> rick_h: ^^
<JonEdney> Good morning folks.
<rick_h> snap-l: yay
<rick_h> howdy JonEdney
<snap-l> http://gizmodo.com/5902609/the-only-us-blackberry-store-might-be-the-saddest-place-on-earth
<snap-l> Apparently it's in Farmington Hills
<snap-l> And no, it's not tjagoda's house.
<greg-g> but he goes there daily
<greg-g> to apparently listen to jazz and get photo ops with mascots
<snap-l> Actually, it was Wireless Giant
<jrwren> TIL: if you don't have /etc/resolv.conf but do have dns in nss hosts, glibc will automatically try localhost, and if you have dns on localhost, it will work.
<rick_h> ummm, nice?
<jrwren> IMO its weird.
<rick_h> <3 this little powergen battery thing. Forgot to charge the mifi...no problem.
<snap-l> Man, I need to get a new music drive
<snap-l> 99% with 8GB left
<snap-l> of a 640 GB drive
<JonEdney> Thats a lof of music..
<greg-g> geebus, mirroring jamendo, bandcamp, .. what else?
<snap-l> CD rips
<snap-l> all FLAC
<greg-g> you know, if I had a workable CD drive in my possesion, I might do that
<greg-g> as it is, the closest I have is my shelf stereo but even the cd player on that makes noises of impending death
<greg-g> x-series all the way, baby
<brousch1> i have an external usb cd/dvd burner
<brousch1> has lasted for many years
<greg-g> yeah, might need to do that at some point when I have a bit more time on my hands to backup all my CDs before they bit rot
<brousch1> you can just buy them again
<snap-l> I haven't seen much bit rot on my discs
<snap-l> and I have discs dating back to high school
<greg-g> I'd rather not contribute to the creation of more plastic-based music discs
<greg-g> snap-l: unpossible
 * snap-l treats his discs like a librarian
 * greg-g prevents self from making an old joke
<greg-g> I sure didn't, my are in a 200-disc case that has been in the sun way too many times
<snap-l> greg-g: I probably have discs that are older than you are.
<snap-l> 1988 is when I started getting CDs.
<greg-g> I"M NOT THAT YOUNG!
<greg-g> :)
 * greg-g was born in '82
<snap-l> I think the only thing that might be older than you is some alvin and the chipmunks records. :)
<brousch1> greg-g: i meant buy them again in digital format
 * snap-l was a musical square in elementary school.
<brousch1> snap-l: did you get those from the battle creek cereal festival?
<greg-g> brousch1: :(
<snap-l> brousch1: eh?
<brousch1> guess not
<snap-l> I have no idea what you're talking about. :)
<snap-l> Do you mean some flexidiscs?
<brousch1> no, as a kid i got free cheesy records like alvin and the chipmunks from the battle creek longest breakfast table thing
<snap-l> brousch1: Huh, never heard of it
<snap-l> God, I <3 archive.org
<snap-l> I currently see 32 items created by that account. Please contact us again when you have created 50 items
<snap-l> (asked about creating a collection)
<jrwren> 1988! that is when cd players cost $1000
<snap-l> I had a portable CD player
<snap-l> it cost $250 or something like that.
<jrwren> i didn't know what a cd was until 91ish
<jrwren> no, that can't be eright.
<snap-l> Folks were starting to get them when I was in high school
<snap-l> I saved up an entire summer of caddying to get a CD player
<brousch1> i got one from aol in the mail around 1993 before i had a computer. i hung it up because it was so pretty
<jrwren> oh yeah, I had a portable in 91 too.
<jrwren> maybe as early as 89.
<snap-l> That was sophmore year into junior year
<jrwren> i forgot entirely.
<snap-l> I remember the first three albums I bought
<jrwren> snap-l: you are my age, old man?
<snap-l> graduated in 1989
<snap-l> so a little older.
<jrwren> ah, no my youngest cousins age.
<jrwren> at SRT i worked with 4 or 5 people that were class of '89
<jrwren> which is a high mode given a 20 person company
<greg-g> whoa, segphault mentioned my literally 4 minute blog post on twitter
<greg-g> I was wondering why my views were going crazy but my short link (goo.gl) wasn't showing anything :)
<rick_h> p
<snap-l> Hey, there's AaronThul
<jcastro> and there he goes
<jcastro> rick_h: please charm bookie so we can serve it over spdy, because why not: http://www.jorgecastro.org/2012/04/17/want-to-mess-with-spdy-easily-come-experiment-with-it-via-juju/
<greg-g> when did github's 404 page image move on mouse over?
<greg-g> https://github.com/blahdeblah
<Blazeix> since forever, i think
<Blazeix> at least a long time
<greg-g> oh, well then, apparently I'm not a big mouse user
<greg-g> I can't make sense of this table: http://sopatrack.com/bills.html
<greg-g> specifically HR 1 and HR 2354
<greg-g> (how they label the vote going)
<rick_h> jcastro: lol
<rick_h> jcastro: I did give it a go of juju'ing it
#ubuntu-us-mi 2012-04-18
<rick_h> with allt he python deps it takes forever and is painful
<rick_h> so I've got on the todo to work on a tarball install that'll be a better way to go with the juju setup
<rick_h> 576445
<rick_h> oops, rick touched his laptop...doh
<snap-l> muhahahahahahaha
<snap-l> I have created a script that extracts most of the metadata for shownotes from the mp3 files themselves.
<snap-l> I am > < this close to having the whole damn thing automate.
<snap-l> so I can just point it at a directory of files, generate the .json file, and then run shownotes, and have it figure out times, order, and create a cue sheet.
<rick_h> awesome
<rick_h> time to get another book! http://pragprog.com/book/dnvim/practical-vim
<brousch> awesome?
<rick_h> awesome re: snap-l's automation of his stuff
<brousch> ah, missed that
<snap-l> Well, it made creating lococast's music shownotes a breeze
<snap-l> copy files into a directory, run create_json.py *, then run the shownotes script on the resulting stuff
<rick_h> awesome
<rick_h> now you need to make shownotes accept input from a pipe
<rick_h> and do stuff like
<rick_h> create_json * | shownotes > output
<rick_h> http://stackoverflow.com/questions/1450393/how-do-you-read-from-stdin-in-python
<snap-l> rick_h: This has occurred to me. :)
<rick_h> just helping :) err prodding errr
<snap-l> Nah, it's good.
<snap-l> The less barrier to entry, the happier I am.
<snap-l> I hate making show notes
<rick_h> what's cool is as you learn the bits and start to find other areas to make handy cmd line scripts out of them
<rick_h> and if they interact with pipes properly you really start to have fun
<snap-l> Yeah, though I do have a question for you re: setup.py for tonight
<rick_h> and you update that entry points bit in your setup.py to package and reuse it
<rick_h> cool
<snap-l> re installing two scripts
<snap-l> Only problem with making the shownotes after creating the json file is unfortunately bandcamp doesn't have metadata on license / artist URL
<snap-l> at least I haven't found it.
<jrwren> rick_h: i'll bet you could write practical-vim more than you'll get out of it.
<rick_h> jrwren: yea, but if I can get two tips that I use daily it's worth $20, but there's the supporting vim stuff bit
<rick_h> not enough books on some things out there (postgres, vim, vim scripting though I've been checking out https://github.com/sjl/learnvimscriptthehardway)
<rick_h> so always like to put $$ where my mouth is
<jrwren> *nod*
<snap-l> I like putting food where my mouth is
<jrwren> I've got a tip for ya: Explore, Vex and Sex
<snap-l> money tastes funny
<rick_h> jrwren: yea, good stuff
<rick_h> though I don't explore much at all now with ctrlp
<jrwren> fugitive Ggrep, Gedit
<jrwren> you could port fugitive to bzr! :|
<snap-l> OK, Googling Explore, Vex and Sex did not get me anything related to vim
<rick_h> lol
<jjesse> brousch, your post this morning made me laugh
<jjesse> brousch,  have fun in Japan :)
<rick_h> :ex :vex :sex
<jrwren> the casing is required IIRC
<rick_h> ah right sorry
<brousch> jjesse: at least i got away with a vague "some day"
<jjesse> yeah
<jjesse> i can't believe you guys had breakfast after that
<jjesse> i would've made Caleb go back to bed
<snap-l> Nerdtree. ;)
<brousch> he will lay there and get up every 5 minutes to bug us
<brousch> better to just get up, do an early workout, and let my wife sleep
<jrwren> you go on a bender?
<snap-l> http://www.catonmat.net/blog/proof-that-sed-is-turing-complete/
<jjesse> we've taught caleb to wait until there is a 7 on his clock before he can get up
<jjesse> so if he gets up early all we have to do is ask
<snap-l> 3:57 here we come
<jjesse> nice try we told him what order the 7 has to be
<jjesse> has a little sticker over the hour location
<brousch> i'm pretty sure that won't work. the best we've gotten is to tell him to go downstairs and play with his computer until we get up. sometimes that will buy us 30 minutes
<snap-l> jjesse: You will rue the day he learns how to set the clock
<jjesse> already happened 1
<jrwren> jjesse: yup, that was a good teaching tool for us too
<jjesse> he changed it at my folks house
<jrwren> waiting for the 7 really worked for us.
<jjesse> when "grandpa and grandma" was watching him over night
<jjesse> it was 5am and he changed the clock to a 7
<brousch> fml. someone sent us a bunch of .msg files, which is a file format used by outlook. each file has dozens of emails inside it
<rick_h> wheeee
<brousch> now i must wander the slum world of windows crapware utilities to find a viewer
<jrwren> http://www.vim.org/scripts/script.php?script_id=3025
<jrwren> zomg!
<rick_h> brousch: lol http://readable.bmark.us/view/http%3A%2F%2Fclusterbleep.net%2Fblog%2F2012%2F04%2F18%2Ffour-forty-five-this-morning%2F
<rick_h> jrwren: get ctrlp for that instead
<jrwren> TIL: command line in ssh.  ~C -L5900:localhost:5900  new tunnel on existing connection FTW!
<jrwren> rick_h: really? ctrip > Command-T ?
<jrwren> ok, i'm going to get ctrip
<rick_h> yes
<rick_h> ctrlp
<rick_h>  /i/l
<jrwren> trlp
<jrwren> ctrlp
<jrwren> ty
<snap-l> jrwren: That's interesting. Is there a way without using ~C to have all of the tunnels use an existning connection?
<jrwren> huh?
<snap-l> Maybe I'm misunderstanding
<snap-l> Yeah, I think I am.
<snap-l> n/m
<jrwren> this is for adding a tunnel to an existing connection
<snap-l> Right.
<jrwren> so you don't have to establish a new ssh session to add a -L, -R, -D tunnel
<snap-l> Currently I have a script that adds tunnels
<jrwren> adds them to what?  .ssh/config?
<snap-l> No... it just runs ssh to create new tunnels
<jrwren> oh, yeah, not that :)
<snap-l> but I have to re-type the key password every time if I'm not running an agent
<snap-l> and I'm running n ssh connections
<jrwren> http://github.com/sjl/z-fish
<rick_h> ...don't use tab completion?!
<jrwren> huh?
<jrwren> oh sorry, that is for fish, this is for us: https://github.com/rupa/z
<rick_h> hmm, intersting. I tend to use workit to jump to common places
<jrwren> i don't know that one.
<rick_h> it's my fork of the virtualenv-wrapper to be non-python specific
<rick_h> https://github.com/mitechie/workit
<jrwren> ha! interesting.
<rick_h> so I've got ~/src, ~/Dropbox and ~/launchpad/lp-branches as my workit dirs
<rick_h> and then just workit bookie
<rick_h> workit docs
<rick_h> etc
<rick_h> but it's zsh only I think for tab completion and such
<rick_h> and doens't work all the way, deactivate I think is broken
<rick_h> well the post deactivate scripts at least
<rick_h> deactivate works fine
<rick_h> snap-l: http://techcrunch.com/2012/04/18/qa-with-bill-amend-creator-of-foxtrot-and-certified-geek/
<rick_h> you seem a foxtrot fan
<snap-l> I am
<brousch> is that like foxpro?
<snap-l> brousch: Foxtrot will make you laugn more than cry, as opposed to Foxpro
<snap-l> which will likely make you sob and assume the fetal position
<brousch> it's not so much fetal as ankle-grabbing
<jrwren> greg-g: did you see? http://bradhicks.livejournal.com/459368.html
<greg-g> jrwren: no, and tl;dr :)
<jrwren> its interesting, and I know you posted about that pepper spray a while back.
<jrwren> but yes, tl;dr all of it
<greg-g> :)
<greg-g> I'll keep it open for a potential lunch time read
<snap-l> tl;dr: the protesters followed protocol, the police didn't.
<jrwren> and there was a HUGE communication breakdown between all the police leaders, including university chancelor
<jrwren> who was directing the cheif of police at the time.
<snap-l> I would be extremely surprised if heads didn't roll from this
<brousch> rolling heads is a bit extreme. maybe just make their eyes burn and throats contract
<greg-g> damn those dirty hippy protest... er, what? you mean they weren't at fault?! ;)
<jrwren> i'll be pissed if they all aren't fired.
<snap-l> greg-g: I'm sure they'll get a nice byline on page 13 next to the pictures of adoptable pets.
<jrwren> Lt, Cheif and Chancelor should all be replaced.
<snap-l> greg-g: Because it's better to be right than front page. ;)
<rick_h> widox: no linky in your post?
<rick_h> widox: we want details!
<rick_h> ok, one day I want to meet this instagram guy, balls of steel that man: http://arstechnica.com/business/news/2012/04/zuckerberg-closed-instagram-deal-without-facebook-board.ars
<rick_h> "While the Instagram founder initially sought $2 billion..."
<devinheitmueller> You don't get what you deserve; you get what you negotiate.
<rick_h> no kidding
<rick_h> I mean, I liked the idea of a guy not wanting to sell getting "what's it going to cost me...oh a BILLION dollars!"
<rick_h> but saying it was 2B just makes it all the more crazy
<brousch> oh come on, Zuck carries $1B in gold stuffed into his whitey tighties
<jrwren> negotiating is a sweet skill to have.
<ColonelPanic001> $1B in gold in your underwear is a sweet thing to have.
<ColonelPanic001> I imagine walking would be difficult, but you could afford a hoveround thing
<snap-l> jcastro: http://www.rollingstone.com/music/news/exclusive-stream-rush-return-with-heavy-headlong-flight-20120418
<snap-l> Kudos to you, greg-g. I can't keep interested int he CC license discussions.
<greg-g> haha, you think I'm up to date on those threads :)
<rick_h> terminal ftw! http://wynnnetherland.com/journal/a-stylesheet-author-s-guide-to-terminal-colors
<snap-l> greg-g: Well, what's worse is they come in mail bundles
<snap-l> whenever someone moderates a whole slew of 'em
<greg-g> snap-l: yeah, the moderation queue
 * greg-g nods
<greg-g> Diane (our GC) or Mike (our ex-VP now on sabbatical who knows more than any one person should)
<snap-l> Yeah, so my inbox gets a giant CC-shaped dump in there with 921 e-mails about DRM (the subject, not the actual number)
<greg-g> yeah, I loved that one, still haven't read it all, but man, his summarizes are some of the best things around :)
<brousch> time to enroll in kindergarten
<snap-l> Poor brousch. He's not even made it to Kindergarten
<JonEdney> Some people need to repeat certain grades for better understanding :)
<jrwren> jcastro: i can try and answer jono's iso call for amd64+mac if the iso can be burned and booted to usb, is that an acceptable answer? I've only mac book airs :)
<jrwren> ah, fuck that, one of the test cases is an entire disk install.
<greg-g> "one of" so do the others?
<jrwren> yeah.
<jrwren> its jsut, if you can do that one, then the other cases are REALLY EASY
<greg-g> ah, gotcha.
<greg-g> jrwren: hey, re that 501 thing yesterday. Why is the statement "contribute to Open Source projects" automatically in the bad category?
<greg-g> :)
<snap-l> devinheitmueller: https://tbe.taleo.net/NA3/ats/careers/requisition.jsp?org=CANONICAL&cws=1&rid=435
<snap-l> devinheitmueller: Let me be the umpteenth person to send you that. :)
<devinheitmueller> snap-l: you're actually the first person to send that to me.  :-)
<snap-l> devinheitmueller: I'm surprised.
<devinheitmueller> It looks interesting, and from a technical standpoint it's right up my alley.  That said, I don't think they can afford me.
<snap-l> Considering the're betting part of the company on it, you may be surprised.
<devinheitmueller> Well, I'm never against having a conversation.
<snap-l> Plus you have experience with shipping products. I have a feeling tht counts for a lot. :)
<rick_h> devinheitmueller: ooh, say I sent you pls :)
<rick_h> snap-l: counts as part me
<devinheitmueller> .... and of course I appreciate your pointing out the opportunity.
<devinheitmueller> rick_h: heh.
<snap-l> np. Hope it leads to something positive.
<snap-l> rick_h: The sane part? :)
<rick_h> snap-l: there is a sane part?
<snap-l> lol
<jrwren> greg-g: probably some open source haters wrote it.
<snap-l> I have a feeling thee's this idea of OSS developers as amateur enthusiasts
<jrwren> greg-g: but for real: its not in a bad category.
<snap-l> as opposed to professional hacks.
<jrwren> greg-g: 'That is to say, we value the things on the left more than we value the things on the right. And some of the things on the right aren't even on our radar.'
<greg-g> hmmm, I read that on a phone, and it may have lost some columns
<greg-g> link?
<jrwren> http://501manifesto.org/
<jrwren> stupid squeezebox just stopped scrobbling. wtf :(
<greg-g> wait, there are no columns, what's left and right here, then?
<greg-g> yeah, so, they're unrealistic in their observations of the world, that's ok. moving on
<snap-l> jrwren: I don't use the scrobbling, so I'm not sure.
<snap-l> I see it more as railing against the whole start-up mentality of never being able to bring up your head
<jrwren> greg-g: lol.
<jrwren> greg-g: or are you unrealistic in your observations of the wrold?
<snap-l> but OSS is what people can do for fun
<jrwren> right.
<jrwren> if OSS falls under "Our personal creative projects over commercial products the world doesn't need"  then awesome!
<snap-l> jrwren: greg-g is planning on building a big net to keep the kids off his lawn
<greg-g> complete with spiked bottom pits
<greg-g> again, all I'm saying is: classifying by the license the software is released under is STUPID
<greg-g> so, all Red Hat employees that contribut to open source software form 9-5 are in that group?
<greg-g> it is just a meaningless distinction.
<greg-g> (in this context)
<greg-g> where's my net....
<jrwren> but I didn't see anything about...
<jrwren> i see what you are saying.
<jrwren> its a point against certain circles valueing OSS contribution over life.
<jrwren> e.g. "i put another rails gem on git hub"
<jrwren> "cuz I'm so awesome dude"
<greg-g> yeah, I see that
<snap-l> Right, but I don't think rick_h's bookie fits into that category
<greg-g> but, then just say "contribute to projects outside of work that aren't part of your work project"
<snap-l> That's a passion. It's a creative product
<rick_h> when I read that I just read it more like "Hey, those of us that just write code 9-5 and earn a paycheck for it are ok people too and doens't mean we suck as dev wrk"
<rick_h> because many (looks in mirror) tend to think a lot less of those that don't get out and do the community thing, the conference thing, the personal project thing in your spare time
<jrwren> greg-g: they specifically say that.
<jrwren>  "Our personal creative projects over commercial products the world doesn't need"
<jrwren> greg-g: but I think its meant to be tongue in cheek
<jrwren> rick_h: and others of us (looks in mirror) are tired of the community thing, conf thing and personal project thing and enjoy our 9-5
<greg-g> and I love you both!
 * greg-g puts his net away for another day
<jrwren> of course, that said, I spent a few hrs this weekend doing dev-type things, and i don't even count it. its just who I am.
<snap-l> Man, DIck Clark passed away.
<greg-g> I actually kind of like his use of bots to tell him things like the weather, the theme, ugh http://matrix.jpope.org/
<rick_h> jrwren: yea, but you do things outside of work. You didnt' get this new job based on only things you learned during your day job
<jrwren> oh definitely.
<rick_h> Get your long awaited Lococast! http://lococast.net/archives/585
<Blazeix> woo
<snap-l> WOo hoo!!!
<rick_h> snap-l: found a way to link by middle-clicking them and getting them in a new window
<snap-l> OK< this is ballsy
<snap-l> Guy joins ubuntu-mi identi.ca group
<snap-l> and then favorites my "Seeing a 20:1 spammer to user ratio in the Ubuntu MI group. Wondering if it's possible to just delete the group and have done with it." post
<greg-g> yeah, he favorited one of mine, too
<greg-g> rolf?
<greg-g> not a spam related one, though
<snap-l> I'm not sure if he's a spammer
<snap-l> yep
<greg-g> he sure is favoriting a lot of notices:
<greg-g> http://identi.ca/rolfie132/favoriteshttp://identi.ca/rolfie132/favorites
<greg-g> grr, sorry
<greg-g> man, that big red button with a "2" in it is sooo tempting..... :)
<rick_h> greg-g: dooooo it!@
#ubuntu-us-mi 2012-04-19
<rick_h> morning
<brousch> is it?
<rick_h> rumor has it
<jrwren> yay morning
<snap-l> Good morning
<snap-l> http://silktide.com/cookielaw
<rick_h> http://design.canonical.com/2012/04/pebble-watch-and-ubuntu/ kind of cool
<jrwren> https://google-styleguide.googlecode.com/svn/trunk/pyguide.html
<jrwren> google's python style guid
<jrwren> i'd rather have a mechanical watch :)
<snap-l> That watch is pretty interesting
<snap-l> Though I fear it'll be more than I'm willing to spend for a watch I will likely wear infrequently.
<rick_h> I'd like a mechanical watch for sure, but ouch $$
<rick_h> this is cool though, I love the idea of a watch talking to the phone, app potential is kind of neat
<rick_h> things like getting my google voice texts on teh wrist and such is cool and notifications is neat if it vibrates as sometimes I don't notice the phone vibrating in my pocket
<rick_h> was my first kickstarter I did heh
<snap-l> rick_h: This watch?
<jjesse> i am supporting the pebble
<jjesse> my 1st kickstarter as well
<jrwren> timex is cheap :)
<snap-l> Now, if it never had to be set, and was accurate, I'd pony up. :)
<rick_h> snap-l: yea
<snap-l> Yeah, as in it is, or yeah, as in that would be nice?
<rick_h> yea, I did the kickstarter for the watch and yea it was my first kickstarter thing I'd done
<rick_h> man, I love my wife but this was a great conversation.
<jrwren> well, its bluetooth, as long as it is connected it will get ntp time from the device to which it is connected.
<rick_h> "I ordered my contacts" oh, how much did they end up being? "I don't know" so these were those new daily things right? "Yea" did you ask her for a ballpark on the pricing? "umm, no...she didn't have it handy"
<jrwren> ONE BAZILLION DOLLARS!
<rick_h> no kidding lol
<jrwren> like you have never done that? just went and got something you really wanted without caring about price
<rick_h> but I had to at least know it
<snap-l> "But she did ask for our check routing numbers, and my mother's maiden name"
<rick_h> "her eye equipment was all cool and low tech...just shined a flashlight in my eye"
<snap-l> "The waiting room was pretty interesting. It was all done up in cardboard and magic marker"
<rick_h> "very eco friendly"
<jrwren> lol
<snap-l> "BANANA PHONE!"
<jrwren> snap-l: do you scrobble with your LMS ?
<jrwren> oh no way... they aren't using libc to do dns?
<jrwren> imma lmao
<snap-l> jrwren: No, I deleted my last.fm account
<snap-l> Once they started making everything pro account, I lost interest in giving CBS all of my listening habits.
<jrwren> snap-l: ever look at the LMS source? it looks like it does its own DNS, but at the same time it looks like it just calls gethostbyname (like it should).
<jrwren> rick_h: what was that python impl of some cmopiler you linked recnetly? was it SASS?
<rick_h> jrwren: yea, pyscss is what I'm using for sass compiling
<jrwren> cool, ty.
<brousch> i couldn't get it to work, so i'm using the ruby version for now
<rick_h> brousch: no?
<rick_h> https://github.com/mitechie/Bookie/blob/develop/Makefile#L251 is what I'm using to build it
<rick_h> https://github.com/mitechie/Bookie/blob/develop/Makefile#L294 and for a watcher while I develop
<brousch> i just needd a watcher
<brousch> i'll try it again
<brousch> i think it's working now. i needed to use python2.7 and install the watchdog module
<rick_h> ah ok
<brousch> hm, i get a no logging handlers found each time it runs
<rick_h> yea, I get that as well
<rick_h> I need to peek at it
<brousch> ok, i didn't see a way around it so i thought i'd ask the master
<rick_h> yea, basically logging isn't setup right
<rick_h> greg-g: ok what's this knoxville stuff?
<jrwren> <3 watchdog.
<jrwren> i just found watchdog last night, did you know ruby has no gem that is equiv.
<jrwren> and so they have 2 gems for every thing that might use watchdog, e.g. autotest - tehre is autotest-inotify and autotest-wahteverOSXuses
<jrwren> so sad :(
<jrwren> oh, and no ruby lib for the win32 watchdog api.
<jrwren> python watchdog ftw
<rick_h> I thought they had some inotify stuff though
<rick_h> https://rubygems.org/gems/rb-inotify
<brousch> pyscss is not compiling the same as sass
<brousch> not palying nicely with semantic.gs
<brousch> oh well
<rick_h> sucky, file a bug I guess
<rick_h> I know it listed a couple of things it didn't support
<brousch> imports i think
<rick_h> I use imports
<brousch> also throws it all on 1 line
<rick_h> just have to make sure the -I dir is there
<rick_h> yea, I htink that's the minification bits
<brousch> ah, it is making my semantic.gs stuff a fixed grid instead of fluid
<brousch> http://paste.mitechie.com/show/625/
<brousch> turning the %s into fixed pixels
<jrwren> yeah, autotest-inotify uses rb-inotify, but there is no uniform api like watchdog :)
<rick_h> jrwren: ah, not looked at watchdog much
<rick_h> so just figured it was a inotify wrapper
<jrwren> it is.
<jrwren> but it is also a whatever bsd has, wahtever osx has, and whatever windows has wrapper
<jrwren> all into a single API.
<jrwren> which makes it excellent.
<rick_h> ah, gotcha
<jrwren> poll: black bg terminal or white bg terminal or other and why?
<brousch> terminal is for dweebs. real men use Eclipse
<rick_h> black, can't stand the white, too much light in my face
<rick_h> especially at night darkened office
<krondor> black bg.  My work environment is overly lit as it is.
<rick_h> plus I prefer the color pallette you're required to use overall
<jrwren> brousch: if i ever find a nice shell plugin for vim, I must just use it :p
<rick_h> conque I think?
<rick_h> is supposed to do it ok, but you're basically making vim a tiling WM at that point
<rick_h> just tile WM and get over it
<jrwren> i moved to white bg in vim and I like it a lot, I'm thinking about moving to white bg in terminal.
<jrwren> rick_h: good point, i'm on OSX, and I actually like iTerm here :)
<krondor> "But we are hackers and hackers have black terminals with green fonts!" -- John Nunemaker
<jrwren> who the fuck is john nunemaker ?
<krondor> rails guy I think
<rick_h> jrwren: cool, I know some people like it
<rick_h> I tried it very briefly a bit back and just didn't care for it
<krondor> ooh the HP Cloud Beta is 20 GB / ram and 2 TB of data?  That's a nice sized playground even if it is only temp.
<rick_h> yea
<rick_h> lots of folks using it happy with performance in the testing phase
<krondor> activated mine today, hope to get some time this weekend logged
<jrwren> gonna be hard to get a nice irssi color scheme for a light bg terminal
<rick_h> heh
<_stink_> yeah, black bg here too.
<ColonelPanic001> light background terminal?
<ColonelPanic001> you monster
<brousch> hm. no animated gifs in my upcoming presentation. this cannot stand!
<rick_h> heh, I call progress
<brousch> maybe i'll go with lolcats this time
<snap-l> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZcFGrWjOX0E#!
<snap-l> Click on that video, or lead a poorer life for it.
<rick_h> rush, aren't they dead?
<rick_h> :P
<snap-l> You wish you were that cool
#ubuntu-us-mi 2012-04-20
<greg-g> hello from Gatlinburg, TN
<greg-g> rick_h: funeral for Carrie's g-pa
<rick_h> greg-g: ah, gotcha
<rick_h> so the moving was a joke then?
<rick_h> and condolences
<snap-l> greg-g: Sorry to hear about your family's loss
<snap-l> http://www.metalinjection.net/tv/view/8857/cat-covers-despised-icon-on-drums
<snap-l> http://www.metalinjection.net/tv/view/8845/kids-cover-rammstein
<snap-l> Good morning
<brousch> yessir
<rick_h> party
<rick_h> TGIF, man this week blew past
<brousch> no kidding
<brousch> i am really pumped about my talk monday. i have way too much actual content
<rick_h> awesome!
<rick_h> oh crap, next weekend is my talk. I've got to stop coding and get more talk writing done :/
<rick_h> but hacking is the fun part!
<brousch> yeah
<brousch> putting slides together isn't vry fun
<brousch> which is probably why i get bored and stick crap into them
<rick_h> lol
<brousch> i only have 1 lolcat in this talk
<brousch> it might be offensive to old people, so i may remove it
<brousch> i just realized i am twice as old as some of the people who will be there. they will consider me old
<snap-l> Yes, yes they will
<snap-l> You need to create a new meme
<snap-l> geriatricats
<brousch> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/101667/crabby-old-man-kitteh.jpg
<brousch> i was going to use this one until i realized the irony http://dl.dropbox.com/u/101667/OldPeople.png
<snap-l> brousch: Heh
<brousch> this video hurts my ears :( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zqYdwJ-DTGo&feature=digest_thu
<brousch> someone needs to buy gib a nice camera
<rick_h> that would only encourage him
<brousch> and a tripod
<snap-l> brousch: Yeah, it clips way too much
<snap-l> Also, I need a treadmill
<rick_h> treadmill's suck...eliptical ftw
<rick_h> but biking >
<rick_h> ordered a bike jersey today so I light up like a candle while riding
<rick_h> and people driving need to get off the @#$@# phones. It's crazy
<brousch> pedal-powered lights?
<rick_h> heh no, just bright yellow
<brousch> you could add LEDs and a generator that works by flapping your upper arms
<brousch> this made me lol, but lots of F-bombs http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FJ7QsEytQq4
<brousch> slow-mo robot is the best
<greg-g> rick_h: yeah, and I may have to take that back ("me moving to knoxville") while the music is still awesome, and the airport is better than most, the number of confderate flags has surpassed any reasonable limit for free speech :)
<jrwren> i have friends who lived in memphis and couldn't stand the segregation and so moved back north.
<jrwren> now that I know greg-g thinks there sholud be reasonable limits on free speech, I shall give him dirty looks and shake my fist at him until I surpass the limit
<greg-g> jrwren: :P
<greg-g> I'm actually still on the fence vis a vis US style free speech vs eg: Germany free speech (where hate speech is heavily ... scruitinized? prevented in public places? something, not sure of the exact law)
<brousch> greg-g: only a fascist would suppress hate speech
<ColonelPanic001> hate speech is a symptom more than a problem
<ColonelPanic001> banning it is a bit like putting a bandaid on a chest would hoping it'll re-inflate the lung
<ColonelPanic001> s/would/wound/g
<jrwren> it just festers behind closed doors instead of in public
<jrwren> in the us we know what the skin heads are saying
<jrwren> in germany they had a reasonably large neonazi movement
<jrwren> USA is the greatest country in teh world! FREE SPEECH! USA USA USA! USA USA USA!
<ColonelPanic001> what jrwern said, too
<ColonelPanic001> it's like the boss coming by a work room and everyone shuts up. Him not hearing it doesn't mean they don't complain about him
<snap-l> greg-g: It's like belleville, but far worse
<snap-l> And I hope that racism naturally dies off, just like any sufficiently innoculated disease
<jrwren> belleville? hardly
<snap-l> jrwren: All I know is that my theory about Walmart having only a handful of stores, and each store being a portal to somewhere in the south germinated in Belleville.
<ColonelPanic001> hah
<jrwren> lol
<jrwren> but AK is friendly south
<snap-l> That and the Feral children that are left in the store get adopted as part of some cashier / worker traning program
<brousch> hey, i used to work at walmart!
<snap-l> brousch: That's unpossible
<jrwren> i always knew tehre was something wrong with taht guy.
<jrwren> :p
<snap-l> brousch: I thought there was some GR law about requiring everyone to work at Meijer
<brousch> in the garden department, but i spent more time cleaning up wayward pogs in the toy department than lugging plants for old ladies
<jrwren> lol @ pogs
<brousch> fucking pogs
<snap-l> brousch: Hah, I worked at Pet and Garden at Meijer one summer
<snap-l> Hated people asking me about the differnet plants
<snap-l> "I can make any bush a burning bush if you give me a lighter"
<brousch> at walmart people just assumed the employees were clueless
<snap-l> brousch: Some trips I don't think it was an assumption
<brousch> i didn't say they were wrong
<rick_h> if it wasn't friday...I might need to go find a bridge to jump from
<rick_h> let me just say, you guys never want to know how the bug crap you use for ubuntu in LP actually works...never
<snap-l> There are three in Michigan
<brousch> it's kind of cold out to go swimming
 * rick_h goes to order more whiteboards...3 insn't enough to fit it together
<snap-l> Macinack, Ambassador, and whatever's in Port Huron
<brousch> need some fine-tip markers
<snap-l> rick_h: I saw how Idea Torrent worked. I have an idea it requires duck tape, rubber bands, wires, paper clips, and a female gerbil.
<rick_h> lol
<rick_h> something like that
<snap-l> OK, this is just insane: http://addyosmani.github.com/todomvc/labs/
<rick_h> woot! yui on there
<jrwren> i dont get it
<rick_h> don't get what?
<jrwren> todomvc
<snap-l> jrwren: Because every five seconds another developer pushes out another MVC framework for Javascript, and we need a site to see which ones might actually be usable.
<snap-l> jrwren: And we know that the benchmark for usability is a todo application
<snap-l> much like the car to beat at a drag race is a Honda Civic.
<snap-l> With a muffler the size of a 55 gallon drum
<rick_h> yea, it's the new 'write a wiki/blog in our web framework'
<rick_h> for client side MCV it's todo lists
<jrwren> i see
<rick_h> http://peternixey.com/post/21437829768/cook-something-or-get-out-of-the-kitchen <3 it!
<jrwren> pretty great.
<jrwren> turn kitchen into computer and you basically have the coders saying the same things to the non coders.
<rick_h> yea, I think that was the point of hte article
<rick_h> a rant on all the "I have a brilliant idea, I just need a co-founder tech guy to make it happen"
<jrwren> zomg, i laugh at those.
<jrwren> or wait... i actualy did one once.
<jrwren> i never did see that 80k$ :)
<rick_h> heh
<snap-l> btw: Wordpress has a new security update
<rick_h> ty for the heads up
<brousch> http://priceonomics.com/e-readers/#kindle-index
<brousch> i think Detroit is ahead of Grand Rapids mainly due to rick_h
<rick_h> I do what I can
<snap-l> I think TIm O'Reilly will be able to buy a small island nation because of rick_h and I
<snap-l> Also,I have way too few Tiles records.
<snap-l> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tiles_(band)
<rick_h> any of you guys going ignite again?
<rick_h> widox: snap-l _stink_ etc?
<rick_h> wife is curious about going again and seems like I missed that it's next week :/
<snap-l> Not this time either.
<brousch> i'm such an idiot. i've been pondering how to work with heroku and private info in git for a month or two now http://dl.dropbox.com/u/101667/heroku-git-repos.png
<rick_h> huh?
<brousch> like db passwords and such for heroku, how to keep it out of git
<brousch> keep it out of the public repo, but still push it to heroku
<rick_h> ah
<brousch> so just set up another repo that pulls from the public but has private stuff in it. sync that to heroku
<rick_h> yea, seen a few ways, s3 fetching, etc
<brousch> this makes sense to me
<snap-l> brousch: Or you could gpg encrypt it in a secure repo, then have some script on the heroku instance decrypt them and put them where they need to be
<brousch> that sounds simple
<snap-l> that sounded sarcastic. ;)
<brousch> or just create a repo just for the purpose of deploying to heroku :P
<rick_h> heh, a meta package
<snap-l> brousch: THat way you're not keeping passwords in plaintext in a git repo
<brousch> but the repo is only on my machine
<snap-l> but it's deployed to your heroku instance
<brousch> yes
<snap-l> so if someone cracks your machine, they get access to your passwords on the heroku instance
<brousch> if someone cracks my machine that is the least of my worries
<jrwren> antoerh repo or another branch?
<brousch> jrwren: a branch is probably sufficient, but i haven't used them so i would feel more secure using a repo
<jrwren> o_O?
<jrwren> poor brousch
<rick_h> lol
<jrwren> http://stackoverflow.com/questions/5203320/passwords-in-git-tree-heroku-github  config vars, its a solved problem.
<jrwren> https://devcenter.heroku.com/articles/config-vars
<jrwren> you should jump in that twitter conversation and tell people to stop being stupid :)
<snap-l> jrwren: It's the Internet. Does anyone need a reason to stop being stupid?
<jrwren> no
<_stink_> rick_h: not this time
<widox> rick_h: I was wanting to go, but also just realized myself that its next week
<widox> a Wed. even
<Blazeix> http://me.veekun.com/blog/2012/04/09/php-a-fractal-of-bad-design/
<rick_h> yea, there's a nice pic of a guy that made a double sided hammer based on that post
<Blazeix> yeah, i think that's how i found it
<Blazeix> but there are some amazing things in there,  like the behavior of chaining ternary operators
<rick_h> http://www.flickr.com/photos/raindrift/sets/72157629492908038/
<JonEdney> LOL awesome
<brousch> php? https://groups.google.com/forum/#!msg/grpug/zSbX6sQyZQ4/nJmjok6rpE0J
#ubuntu-us-mi 2012-04-21
<rick_h> damn I <3 git
<rick_h> turn this https://github.com/jcharum/lxml-readability/commit/cdd30f625eaedbaf47e11385666199245f31a309
<rick_h> into this: https://github.com/mitechie/python-readability/commit/b78d7e85012eaded4e792dba126f118335131854
<rick_h> and finally into this https://github.com/buriy/python-readability/commit/b78d7e85012eaded4e792dba126f118335131854
<rick_h> so badass
<rick_h> all from one directory in my laptop
<jrwren> did I link to sslh yesterday?  this is soooo much nicer than doing it manually :)
<rick_h> no, but saw your twitter post, very cool
<jrwren> i love that it is such a hack too
<rick_h> hah
<rick_h> best kinds of things
<jrwren> truth
<rick_h> I'm going to be getting damn good at resolving merge conflicts :/
<jrwren> rick_h: its damn easy with a nice merge tool.
<jrwren> kdiff3 is pretty good
<rick_h> yea, just lots of cleaning up as I go
<rick_h> the guy I'm merging from did some good stuff, but in bad ways, or needs more cleanup
<rick_h> so it's like merge, check conflicts, clean up how it was done, commit
<jrwren> no reviewboard?
<rick_h> no, this is some OSS library I'm trying to take over basically
<rick_h> I'm using it for bookie stuff and want to make it better, original author is in 'maint mode' and this guy has a decent fork with a lot of good work, but done non-pythonically
<jrwren> ah, cool
<rick_h> https://github.com/mitechie/python-readability original https://github.com/buriy/python-readability
<rick_h> doh! hate forgetting my headphones when I hit the coffee shop
<snap-l> http://analogindustries.bandcamp.com/ <- I <3 how this digital album is being released as Vinyl
#ubuntu-us-mi 2012-04-22
<snap-l> http://www.jwz.org/blog/2012/04/usda-guide-to-obliterating-animal-carcasses-with-explosives/
<rick_h> http://readable.bmark.us/view/http%3A%2F%2Flunduke.com%2F%3Fp%3D2813
<rick_h> good review of 12.04
<snap-l> Yay, new Neurotech is out.
<snap-l> Oh hell no...
<snap-l> The Maemo -> Unity comparison just hit me like a ton of bricks.
<snap-l> Hello from SSH on an upgraded precise pangolin machine
#ubuntu-us-mi 2013-04-15
<jrwren> snap-l: did you see Ivan Moravec has a 2009 release of Antonin DvorÃ¥k?
<derekv> i'm not seeming to get around to this ubuntu install , maybe i should bring the tower with to chc
<derekv> and a disk
<derekv> =p
<snap-l> jrwren: I did not
<snap-l> At least I didn't realize it was that new
<snap-l> derekv: Feel free.
<snap-l> Good morning, everyone
<snap-l> Happy Tax Day.
<rick_h_> yay tax day. Instead of buying a new ford focus I paid annual and quaterly taxes.
 * rick_h_ goes over and grumbles in the corner 
<snap-l> rick_h_: Yeah, know the feeling
<snap-l> Though not to that extreme
<snap-l> Looked at our bank account and thought "That won't be that high for long"
<snap-l> Not sure when they'll cash the check, but know it'll make a noise when it hits. :)
<rick_h_> hah
<rick_h_> yea, poor morgan stanley was getting excided they'd be able to invest our $$ except the govt is going to do it form them when the checks hit. :)
<rick_h_> /form/for
<derekv> could be worse
<derekv> ofc, could be better
<rick_h_> derekv: definitely.
<snap-l> "Who knows what's updated I guess [mitechie]"
<snap-l> Love this comimt message. :)
<rick_h_> lol, where did I put that one? my vim config?
<snap-l> Yeah
<rick_h_> yea, once in a while I just go in there and git st and git xa "made changes and such"
<snap-l> Was checking if you weere using git submodules
<snap-l> Yeah, same here
<rick_h_> no no no no no no no
 * rick_h_ hates those evil things
<snap-l> yeah, they look... awful.
<rick_h_> they've gotten better I guess but man I tried using them once and just found it more painful than anything
<snap-l> Yeah, I'm reading the chapters on submodules in the O'Reilly git book, and while they look improved, they still have hairy edges
<snap-l> Damn, greg-g isn't in here.
<snap-l> I was hoping he might explain this: https://soundcloud.com/bonobo
<snap-l> I don't get it
<brousch> snap-l: You summoned him!
<snap-l> I was hoping greg_g might explain this: https://soundcloud.com/bonobo
<snap-l> ;)
<snap-l> Because I don't get it
<greg-g> snap-l: I uhhh
<greg-g> what?
<snap-l> greg-g: But you're in SOMA. You should be able to explain these things. :)
<greg-g> snap-l: hip music?
<snap-l> Chris Messina posted this album, and apparently people are calling brilliant
<snap-l> I'm thinking I'm wasting my life nto being an electronic musician
<greg-g> snap-l: I mean, it is nice
<greg-g> enjoyable
<greg-g> fun sounding
<snap-l> Yeah, it's not horrid
<greg-g> I don't think it's bad at all
<greg-g> not earth shattering or anything though
<greg-g> I might listen to it today
<snap-l> But I'm no getting the "brilliant" platitudes
<snap-l> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/9058804/stomp.mp3 <- This, on the otherhand, is brilliant. ;)
<nullspace> any setup 802.3ad before?
<snap-l> Not I
<rick_h_> nope
<nullspace> going to give whirl sometime this week, bond nics sounds handy, luck I have a switch that supports it
<snap-l> nullspace: So it's a way to use two networks at the same time to send data to a machine?
<rick_h_> anyone know anyone that's gotten a system76 water cooled system?
<rick_h_> after seeing the videos I'm getting sucked into the idea of a quiet monster of a machine
<snap-l> rick_h_: You'd be the first I would know. :)
<rick_h_> but never done water cooling
<snap-l> water cooling gives me some pause
<snap-l> but that's because I think of these frankenstein's monster contraptions with some not-quite-bright-boy trying to OC their machine one more MHz
<rick_h_> snap-l: yea, me too but man. https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=cQX9ifbfdeA
<rick_h_> that's a cool watch once you get past the hosts and don't pay attention to their 'benchmarks'
<snap-l> rick_h_: Yeah, Linux Action Show drives me nuts
<snap-l> but they have personality
<snap-l> OK, they don't drive me as nuts as I remember.
<greg-g> watered cooled 10 years ago: no way. Now, with an respectable OEM doing it: sure.
<rick_h_> greg-g: yea, I know it's not scientific, but would love to have someone say "yea, np" or something.
<greg-g> :)
<greg-g> snap-l: I'm tapping my foot to this bonobo album ;)
<nullspace> snap-l: yes,kinda, you bond two nics together on the same machine and they are used like one interface. It improves bandwidti to/from machine and is fault tolerance
<nullspace> torleant
<snap-l> greg-g: Report to Michigan immediately.
<nullspace> but you need a switch that can trunk the two ports that those nics are connected to
<snap-l> nullspace: Yeah, it kinda breaks my brain on how networking works.
<snap-l> but on thinking about it, it makes sense.
<nullspace> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/UbuntuBonding
<rick_h_> so is this on some server doing bandwidth over the wall or just to tinker with?
<rick_h_> dual nics are great, gigabit each one, dns round robin or proxy server them, run two isntances of your app or bind to both interfaces, and rock and roll.
<rick_h_> bonding seems like unnecessary complication
<snap-l> rick_h_: It seems like something where you don't want to do round-robin
<greg-g> snap-l: :P
<snap-l> ie: SAN
<rick_h_> snap-l: right, so that's what I mean. use case?
<rick_h_> sure SAN, backing up a 30TB server and you have one giant tarball to move, just seems limited uses.
<nullspace> it's for home, and yes it's essentially for moving large files around
<snap-l> Or multiple clients on a SAN picking up TB files
<rick_h_> but even then, why not have the multiple clients hit a front end that picks a non-peak connection to give you on the other nic?
<rick_h_> "here, you heach get a GB of pipe, enjoy" vs "let's toggle back/forth between you guys on 2GB of pipe after it goes through bonding overhead"
<snap-l> bercause you want to saturate two separate networks with file transfers?
<snap-l> Or multiple networks
<snap-l> It looks like a way to get around the limitations of one datacenter network
<snap-l> Not every company runs their VOIP next to their desktop machines next to their servers. ;)
<rick_h_> sure, but missing how that fits into bonding a connection between the server and the switch?
<snap-l> Think two switches
<nullspace> rick_h_: isn't that what the aggreation software essentially do? Pick the least busy of the two nics ona  new request?
<rick_h_> nullspace: sure but bonding makes it one pipe right? Like a raid0. Half the bits to one, half to the other allowing for 2x the pipe (approx)
<nullspace> well there are different types of bonding it seems
<rick_h_> a proxy just allows you to use some smarts to pick a good pipe.
<snap-l> Right, but proxying ties you to one pipe
<rick_h_> ah, well that makes sense.
<snap-l> as opposed to giving you multiple pipes.
<rick_h_> snap-l: right, but provides fail over and the ability to add/shrink resources and the like
<snap-l> yeah, different use cases.
<snap-l> For a web server, bonding doesn't make much sense
<rick_h_> seems some overlap, but ok. I was just curious on the use case for the bonding setup.
<snap-l> at least I don't see how it would make sense
<greg-g> snap-l: still enjoying it :P
<snap-l> greg-g: *sigh*
<snap-l> et tu, Grossmeier?
<brousch> Interesting http://inventwithpython.com/hacking/
<snap-l> http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Appendix:Glossary_of_military_slang
<snap-l> I'm going to use the term "bag of smashed asshole" from here on out.
<snap-l> Also: what's the python hotness for blogging?
<rick_h_> snap-l: blogofile looks to be un-maintained atm, but some fans. Pelican is the latest hotness I guess.
<rick_h_> of course you're supposed to write your own
<rick_h_> see http://pydanny.com/choosing-a-new-python-based-blog-engine.html
<rick_h_> for a year-ago view
<snap-l> Yeah, I looked briefly at Pelican. Looked interesting.
<brousch> I've seena  lot of django-based blogging tools that produce static sites
<brousch> I still use wordpress
<snap-l> Yeah, I saw Hyde, which looked... odd
<rick_h_> if the reason to use djawngo is the ORM/admin site...why do static generation in django?
<rick_h_> it's like using the worst bits for everything. template, settings, etc.
<snap-l> rick_h_: ++
<rick_h_> but yea, pay wordpress the $$ and stop worrying about the blog, but I have to say it hasn't helped me blog more.
<snap-l> Reminds me of my little blogging thingie that used MySQL as the backend
<brousch> I pay dreamhost
<snap-l> had a text box that just stuffed entries into a database table, and then created static files off of that.
<rick_h_> which ever static site generator gives me a makefile wins!!
<snap-l> Pelican has a makefile. ;)
<rick_h_> winner!
<brousch> hah
<snap-l> Honestly, if I didn't cre about my old blog entries, I'd be using Pelican right now
<snap-l> but the porting is a little wonky
<snap-l> and I'm not 100% sold on Disqus
<snap-l> But the Wordpress attacks are getting more sophisticated, so I'm wondering if it's only a matter of time until it gets cracked.
<brousch> Disqus is the bizomb
<greg-g> :(
<snap-l> greg-g: Why the sad?
<greg-g> Disqus, I hates it
<snap-l> What's wrong with Disqus/
<snap-l> ?
<rick_h_> heh, who's data is it :P
<rick_h_> JS loading or bust
<rick_h_> etc and so on
<snap-l> I figured it was one of the two. :)
<greg-g> option a
<greg-g> also privacy
<greg-g> also lockin
<greg-g> ya know, the same reasons I don't like facebook-powered comments
<rick_h_> I will say privacy came up in their pycon talk we watched at CHC and their answer is "we only support public comments"
<greg-g> so.... that's skirting the issue
<greg-g> privacy as in: who knows what blogs I read and comment on
<rick_h_> what' privacy if there's no private data?
<rick_h_> ah, I see
<greg-g> if I'm forced to use a single service, they do, and that info is very easily taken by whomever
<snap-l> greg-g: You shouldn't be blogging on those [expletive deleted] sites anyway. :)
<greg-g> zactly
<brousch> http://help.disqus.com/customer/portal/articles/472149-comments-export
<greg-g> brousch: only part of my complaint :) facebook also lets me "export my data"
<rick_h_> lol, sometimes recruiter calls can be fun.
<rick_h_> "what's your current work situation"
<rick_h_> "Well, I work for canonical, from home, doing OSS full time. Why do you ask?"
<rick_h_> "well, got a thing in NY for converting asp.net apps to django if you're interested"
<rick_h_> ummm...no thanks
<brousch> djangoooooooooooooooooooooooooo
<rick_h_> oh man...boston marathon bombing? w..t..f
<rick_h_> wow, that's one disturbing pic...
<rick_h_> ugh http://slashdot.org/firehose.pl?op=view&type=submission&id=2603667
<_stink_> yeah, there are a few kind of gory ones
<_stink_> floating around
<jjesse> 2 explosions at Boston
<jjesse> my wife's marathon time is 4:10 on her last one, the explosion went off at 4:09
<snap-l> Unbelieveable
<jjesse> btw G+ is terrible for me for news like this
<_stink_> yeah, i had to back off everything
<jjesse> what i meant was that I've seen 2 posts on G+ about this and Twitter is actually giving me information
<_stink_> ah, hah
<snap-l> yeah, Twitter is good for the stream of information
#ubuntu-us-mi 2013-04-16
<rick_h_> http://techcrunch.com/2013/04/15/netflix-html5-chromebooks/ woot
<snap-l> Good morning
<rick_h_> morning
<nullspace> work sucks when your waiting on others to do their job
<rick_h_> needing to do other's jobs for them
<snap-l> nullspace: That's what a waiting for list is for. :)
<rick_h_> that sucks worse :)
<snap-l> So you can park it and move on. :)
<snap-l> rick_h_: Hey, I'm the most theoretically productive person I know. :)
<nullspace> I can do some of their job but I'm not envious of the conversation they need to have with our collective boss telling them that they are wrong in their shoot from the hip ideas
<nullspace> dislike the idea of being a yes man, but I'm not a fan of telling my boss your idea is stupid
<snap-l> There are tactful ways to tell your boss to rethink his position
<snap-l> none of which use the word "stupid"
<nullspace> I've tried a couple, he's not reading between the lines
<nullspace> so thus we are down to an uncomfortabel conversation where he has to explain his actions
<nullspace> needless it needs to be handled delicately
<jrwren> i tell my boss his ideas are stupid all the time.
<jrwren> and then I tell him why.
<jrwren> i don't use the word stupid.
<snap-l> Well, I was excited about Elsevier partnering with O'Reilly books, but apparently all of the titles that I care about for Game Development are now with CRC press
<snap-l> and they appear to have not hit the enlightenment age of ebooks
<jrwren> there are good books for game development? :)
<snap-l> Yeah, there's some decent ones for AI, game desgin, etc.
<snap-l> And Morgan Kaufman had a bunch of them that apparently are now published by CRC press
<snap-l> http://shop.oreilly.com/product/9780123847171.do <- there is no reason a book on Tcl / Tk should be a $709 ebook
<snap-l> er, $70
<snap-l> though $709 is even less justifiable. ;)
<brousch> It is rare and valuable knowledge which cannot be easily duplicated
<_stink_> they're everywhere
<snap-l> It's a language that lost half it's userbase once we stopped trying to pick apart dial-up modem PPP connections
<_stink_> oops, miscan
<_stink_> h
<snap-l> _stink_: You were ahead. :)
<_stink_> hazards of irssi by phone.
<brousch> I was excited by this until I realized it's just a Google App Engine webapp https://github.com/googleglass/mirror-quickstart-python
<brousch> Anyone going to MobiDevDay Detroit? I have a free ticket
<rick_h_> nope
<rick_h_> not I
<rick_h_> I thought Blazeix was tempted to go
<jrwren> django peeps: do you have a good example of a setup.py for your django app?
<brousch> For the application a Django app?
<brousch> Let me try again. For an application or for a single Django app?
<jrwren> yes
<jrwren> is there an uninstall for setup.py ?
<rick_h_> no
<rick_h_> it's why we <3 pip so
<rick_h_> and use virtualenvs so we can make clean && make
<brousch> rick_h_++
<jrwren> i can't figure out module path finding.
<jrwren> yes, its a virtualenv
<jrwren> ok, pip uninstall worked.
<jrwren> find_packages doesn't seem to be finding __init__.py in root of package dir, but docs say that it should.
<rick_h_> hmm, yea that sounds bad. Always have a package name dir in the same dir as your setup.py. Never put your setup.py in the same dir
<jrwren> i'm not sure what you just said :)
<rick_h_> lol
<rick_h_> sorry, been a long week
<jrwren> any why? when http://pythonhosted.org/distribute/setuptools.html#using-find-packages says it searched . for __init__.py
<rick_h_> assuming the same dir that contains a setup.py has a __init__.py ?
<jrwren> yes
<rick_h_> don't do that
<jrwren> i must.
<rick_h_> then quit :P
<jrwren> nevar.
<jrwren> i'll rewrite setuptools if I must
<rick_h_> lol
<rick_h_> enjoy, that walls broken many a man
<jrwren> brownfield dev leads to fun things.
<jrwren> ok, I see what is happening now.
<jrwren> don't do that.
<jrwren> :)
<jrwren> ugh.
<rick_h_> lol
<snap-l> jrwren: Remember Star Wars?
<jrwren> its a trap?
<jrwren> that was return of the jedi.
<jrwren> umm...
<snap-l> When R2D2 and Chewbacca were playing chess, and R2D2 was winning, and Chewbacca got mad?
<jrwren> But Uncle Owen, I was going to go to toshi station to get some power converters.
<jrwren> setuptools will tear your arms off.
<snap-l> Rick is always right. Let the Rick win. :)
<jrwren> if that were true, he would write in F# or Haskell.
<snap-l> That's because they don't want to find out they're wrong
<snap-l> They won't let him write in F# or Haskell
<snap-l> True story.
<rick_h_> lol, trust me...if you could be in my work irc channels you'd see how un-right I can be
<brousch> It's obvious rick_h_ isn't always right. Look at his opinion of Django
<rick_h_> when I die, my last words will be "$@# you django..."
<jrwren> rick_h_: what is your opinion of django?
<rick_h_> some people like php, some people like doing web dev in perl, and some people like django...
<jrwren> cute.
<rick_h_> they've got something in common, they do crap I don't care to do :)
<rick_h_> I try :)
<jrwren> my opinion is much, much worse :p
<rick_h_> hey, if someone can get their job done using eclipse...more power to them. I'll just talk about them behind their backs in my ubuntu irc channels lol
 * brousch alt-tabs away from pydev
<brousch> rick_h_: So what's your ideal web development framework?
<rick_h_> brousch: pyramid
<brousch> That's as good as it gets?
<rick_h_> it fixes about everything I hated about pylons
<rick_h_> like my pebble it just keeps getting better. :P
<jrwren> used flask for something trivial. it was great.
<snap-l> http://memegenerator.net/instance/37050320
<jrwren> django has 1 thing going for it: the admin interface. if you aren't using the admin interface, django is the wrong choice.
<brousch> Ha, you'll be proud of me. I met some guys at a meeting that were talking about doing a new project in Django, except they weren't going to use the ORM, or the templating, so I tried to convince them to try Pyramid instead
<rick_h_> and 90% of that can be solved with phpmyadmin/pgmyadmin/real code
<brousch> Really? Use phpmyadmin as the admin for your python website? That's just wrong!
<jrwren> agree, it doesn't solve 90%
<jrwren> django orm + admin interface does some *very nice things*
<snap-l> http://memegenerator.net/instance/37050432
<snap-l> rick_h_: ^^
<brousch> snap-l: beautiful
<rick_h_> time to go try starbucks as my away work place vs my poor closed caribou
<brousch> Welcome to the dark side
<widox> rick_h_: :(
<greg-g> rick_h_: NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
<rick_h_> I know, I've got to get out of the house!
<rick_h_> and I walk into a table full of kids playing magic
<rick_h_> *sigh*
<jrwren> could be worse, could be yugio
<greg-g> wait, *kids* still play magic?! I thought that was only 30+ people now?
<greg-g> yeah, thought it transitioned to those games, the ones I forgot that jrwren didn't
<rick_h_> if any of them shave weekly I'd be surprised
<greg-g> so they're asian?
<rick_h_> lol
 * greg-g apologizes
<rick_h_> no, I live in whitey ville
<greg-g> or...
<greg-g> so they're girls?
<greg-g> alright, /ignoring IRC for a bit.....
<jrwren> i think those games are big amongst azns
<jrwren> or maybe just some starcraft overlap
<rick_h_> interesting http://tosbourn.com/2013/04/development/stack-exchange-is-winning-the-internet-and-this-is-not-a-good-thing/
<jrwren> stupid.
<rick_h_> I don't know it's stupid. I think it's a boon for copy/paste coders that don't understand what it's doing.
<snap-l> I'm sorry, but that's a red herring
<snap-l> If you're not willing to put forth more than 5 minutes to understand what it is you're pasting from a site, you're asking for trouble
<snap-l> And instead of whining, what's the solution?
<snap-l> Kill Stack Exchange?
<jrwren> the post starts with "time was that the canonical result from a Google search would probably be a link to some spec documents or some general advice around the language."
<jrwren> this is not true, nor was it ever true.
<snap-l> jrwren: ++
<rick_h_> snap-l: didn't say let's go fix it. Just interesting. I'd seen some copy/paster stuff on there but hadn't put it with really basic google searches
<nullspace> rick_h_: I have been hearing this from several other developers that they are noticing that exact trend
<snap-l> You'd get some other BS blog post
<jrwren> yup, shitty blog post, or shitty usenet post or google group if it was before the blog boom
<jrwren> or you'd get nothing if it was pre-gooogle
<snap-l> So instead of serching Google, ask God for the answer
<snap-l> I'm sure it'll be more researched.
<snap-l> You can't protect against garbage answers
<jrwren> you used to get experts exchange hits.
<jrwren> that is why stackoverflow was created, remember, because exertsexchange sucks
<nullspace> I think google could easily push their code university regarding cases like that
<jrwren> and i don't want an ExpertSexChange
<snap-l> and if you can't be assed to delve deeper, then please stop being a developer
<nullspace> though how many people learn to code on the web get scooped up by corporations to write their code?
<_stink_> what other way is there to learn to code?
<snap-l> nullspace: I'm not even sure how to start to take that apart. :)
<nullspace> school
<snap-l> Just because you learned your instrument on the street doesn't mean you're any less of a proficient player.
<rick_h_> lol
<jrwren> school doesn't teach anyone to program very well.
<nullspace> but it does teach the basics
<jrwren> if you stop learning when you leave school, you have failed and are a shitty coder
<_stink_> i know of no person who finished a program in anything who couldn't learn about 50 times more than they just learned in school from the interwebs.
<nullspace> I feel like your putting words in my mouth
<jrwren> i could argue that it doesn't even teach teh basics, general programming.
<_stink_> wrt writing software.
<snap-l> If I were to have stopped learning out of school, I'd be writing things in turbo pascal and Atari Basic. :)
<jrwren> you did atari basic in school?!!?!?
<nullspace> wouldn't it give them enough to play with and learn on their own and form specific questions to google for?
<jrwren> exactly.
<jjesse> so why even get a college education?  just google everything
<jrwren> jjesse: i know lots of people for whom that has worked.
<snap-l> jrwren: I had BASIC in elementary and high school.
<jjesse> jrwren, interesting how did they get pass the "college degree' requirement to get the job
<nullspace> ^
<jrwren> only shitty workplaces have a "college degree requirement"
<brousch> Work for yourself. Make great things. Get hired without a degree
<_stink_> or else those requirements are ignored if the hiring manager wants yoj.
<nullspace> so 90% of the employeers are shitty places to work
<jjesse> my job has a college degree requirement does that make it a shitty place to work/
<jrwren> i wouldn't say 90% of employeers, because of so many wonderful small business.
<jrwren> 90% of employement positions are shitty positions, yes.
<jrwren> jjesse: likely.
<jjesse> wow that is harsh
<greg-g> unenlightened, at least
<greg-g> ;)
<nullspace> troll
<greg-g> nullspace: you know jrwren, right? :P
<jrwren> i'm not trolling, I'm just opinionated.
 * greg-g failed at ignoring IRC
<_stink_> hah
<nullspace> I'll give you that every place has it's shitty parts but they are far from 100% shitty
<nullspace> and besides if they don't hire smart people how will they ever get rid/ or fix those shitty parts
<jrwren> i agree.
<jrwren> i agree.
<jrwren> hire smart people and fix shitty parts, regardless of a college degree.
<nullspace> well I did hire a guy who doesn't have a degree
<nullspace> awesome programmer, teaching me some things
<jrwren> what happened to the college degree requirement?
<nullspace> those that had college degrees sucked
<nullspace> I found no qualified people aside from this guy
<nullspace> plus we had worked together previously
<nullspace> but he did have some college
<greg-g> so he's a quitter?
 * greg-g trolls
<_stink_> ulz
<nullspace> and previous employemment
<_stink_> lulz
<jrwren> I like quitters.
 * greg-g is here to make _stink_ laugh
<_stink_> aw.
<greg-g> it's a good gig
<jrwren> Quitters are awesome. They quit smoking. They quit doing smack. They quit writing shitty code.
<greg-g> hah
<nullspace> though he started to learn to code in school and so did I
<greg-g> people do tend to hire people similar to themselves
<greg-g> that's really a meta statement, not really anything specific to anyone
<nullspace> I think that would breed weakness
<greg-g> nullspace: which is why hiring is really hard, and many orgs are bad at it, and people are trained in how to do it better
<nullspace> that seems like it could be a vicious cycle
<greg-g> which?
<nullspace> could they hire bad trainers or companys that hire bad tainers that train others how to hire?
<greg-g> people being trained how to do things better based on past experience/research sounds like a properous cycle
<nullspace> if that's how it works then I'd agree
<greg-g> of course, there are dumb people everywhere
<greg-g> they do badly, and don't get hired again
<nullspace> uh huh sure that's how it works
<greg-g> ok, they get hired by even more stupid orgs and become dead weight, I've seen 'em before
<jrwren> its how at works in the world of awesome places where greg-g is.
<greg-g> I'm lucky that I get to work at an org that is intelligent with it's hiring
<jrwren> remember, greg-g has lived in the reality distortion fields of ann arbor and san fransisco for the past 10 yrs!
<greg-g> jrwren: but, the university is FULL of those dead weight people who fail other places
<jrwren> is it?
<greg-g> I can point out a few people and managers, yeah
<greg-g> that I directly worked with
<jrwren> we hired a guy from teh U, and he is pretty awesome.
<greg-g> oh, yeah, they aren't all bad (I"
<greg-g> I'm not!)
<nullspace> anyone else see this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=csyL9EC0S0c
<nullspace> totally relevant
<jrwren> i turned it off.
<greg-g> tl;dw
 * greg-g really ignores IRC now
<greg-g> laterz
<rick_h_> cool! https://github.com/pokey9000/twostep
<rick_h_> crazy and not ready for prime time but still cool step
<brousch> Pebble is dead. Long-live Glass
#ubuntu-us-mi 2013-04-17
<rick_h_> ok, this is kind of cool https://developers.google.com/glass/quickstart/python
<brousch> It's a GAE webapp
<rick_h_> yea, cool selling point for GAE to be able to bootstrap your communication with he glass api
<brousch> I think it's required
<rick_h_> no, you just have to setup your oath2 and such yourself. You have to talk to the glass api, but you don't have to be on GAE
<brousch> And the API console
<brousch> Seems too locked-in to Google for me
<brousch> No ads. No charging for the apps
<rick_h_> brousch: but you can charge for your service
<rick_h_> to get the time news you have to pay for the times new
<rick_h_> evernote, etc
<brousch> hm
<mathomastech> Check out my review of the aftershokz bone conducting headphones. They are really something awesome! https://plus.google.com/u/0/103260909450809151378/posts/TqnvXYzk8Ee
<rick_h_> mathomastech: cool, I'll have to get a pair for biking this summer. Do hate the earbuds while biking and seems like a great way around it.
<rick_h_> booo for them not being on amazon
<mathomastech> rick_h_ They just became available on their website again. I think their lack of amazon support is more due to supply issues.
<rick_h_> mathomastech: ah, good to know
<mathomastech> rick_h_ I think amazon has their other models on sale. Makes sense they will get the bluez as well at some point
<rick_h_> yea
<rick_h_> all good, I just ended up ordering a new google hangouts headset so should wait a bit anyway :)
<mathomastech> Google Hangouts headset?
<rick_h_> yea, I have daily google hangouts, multiple really
<rick_h_> and want a portable headset when I'm at the coffee shop and such
<rick_h_> at my desk I've got my podcast mic and such
<mathomastech> Is it branded for hangouts, or just a headset to use for hangouts?
<rick_h_> just for conference calls
<rick_h_> the trouble with hangouts is that on mobile devices they won't work with BT headsets for some reason
<rick_h_> so maybe I should say "wired conference headset"
<mathomastech> Yea I have noticed that. The Bluez dont work with mobile hangouts either :(
<rick_h_> yea, my current BT headsets fail. Just something with hangouts that drives me bonkers
<mathomastech> Well, I will bring my Bluez to CHC tomorrow. Your welcome to try them out if you'd like.
<rick_h_> starbucks fail. Verizon signal here is too weak. Must be that cursed ATT store next door blocking my air waves :P
<brousch> Use their wifi
<rick_h_> yea, fail there as well. It's not good enough to hold my google hangout with work
<brousch> Time to find a co-working facility
<snap-l> rick_h_: that sucks
<snap-l> http://rtsixty.bandcamp.com/
<snap-l> Wow, the Penguicon schedule is pretty littered with tech talks
<snap-l> http://2013.penguicon.org/schedule/
<brousch> snap-l: did they ban the furries?
<snap-l> brousch: No, you're still welcome to come. ;)
<jjesse> nice
<brousch> :P
<snap-l> i'd like to know what the big deal about watches is
<snap-l> Seriously, it's like everyone decided to make their own buggy-whips
<snap-l> So you can... whip your car to work?
<nullspace> snap-l: it's better than years before
<snap-l> So this is a thing: https://github.com/Pylons/pyramid/pull/984
<snap-l> I look forward to our eventual âº and â¹ truthiness.
<snap-l> And also try, catch, and (â¯Â°â¡Â°ï¼â¯ï¸µ â»ââ»
<snap-l> I think that last one is the rick_h_ exception. ;)
<brousch> what the
<brousch> Oh, using the checkmark unicode character?
<brousch> So what would be false?
<snap-l> The x character
<brousch> x is already true
<brousch> Well, 'x'
<rick_h_> lol, asbool is a helper to turn any format of true/false to the bool value since ini doesn't support bool
<rick_h_> crap, forgot CHC reminders
<rick_h_> wonder who will show lol
<brousch> Reminders for weekly meetings get annoying
<brousch> Annoying to send
<snap-l> http://www.marketwatch.com/story/88-of-spreadsheets-have-errors-2013-04-17?reflink=MW_GoogleNews&google_editors_picks=true
<nullspace> those who don't know what they are doing will likely shoot themselves in the foot
<greg-g> I'll just leave these here for you to be amused by:
<greg-g> https://twitter.com/SquidDLane/status/324576892852256769
<greg-g> https://twitter.com/SquidDLane/status/324577882053681153
<greg-g> https://twitter.com/SquidDLane/status/324580214837506049
<rick_h_> ok, w...t...f http://techcrunch.com/2013/04/17/google-announces-provo-utah-as-the-third-google-fiber-city-acquires-the-local-fiber-provider/
<rick_h_> greg-g: what was the RH bashing he mentioned going on?
<rick_h_> and for rebuttal http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/2219364/red-hat-says-customers-dont-care-about-open-source-software left for amusement as well :P
<greg-g> just read title, but at least their shit is FLOSS, no? Can't say that for landscape.
<greg-g> btw, to answer re RH:
<greg-g> 16:53 < Ryan_Lane> he never mentioned red hat by name
<greg-g> 16:53 < Ryan_Lane> but it was really obvious who he was talking about
<greg-g> 16:53 < Ryan_Lane> cost was one of those things
<greg-g> 16:54 <    greg-g> huh
<greg-g> 16:54 < Ryan_Lane> some things about commitment too
<greg-g> 16:54 < Ryan_Lane> which is funny because red hat was one of the largest contributors
<greg-g> hahaha
<greg-g> 16:56 < Ryan_Lane> he somehow decided that ubuntu mobile was worth talking about too
<greg-g> oh mark
<greg-g> to not selectively censor Ryan:
<greg-g> 16:58 < Ryan_Lane> it wasn't a really bad talk over all, and the red hat bashing was pretty non-direct, though
<greg-g> ok, done copy/pasting/bombing the channel
<jrwren> i'm finally groking some python packaging :)
<derekv> do we have the room tonight?
<snap-l> derekv: I believe so
<rick_h_> party
<rick_h_> in the room
#ubuntu-us-mi 2013-04-18
<snap-l> Blazeix: http://decafbad.net/2012/06/06/i-love-my-phone-company-or-why-ting-com-is-awesome/
<mathomastech1> jcastro: Hey, rick_h_ mentioned that you use simple mobile on the T-mobile network. Any opinions on it? I am planning on moving to T-mobile soon, currently on ATT with an unlocked N4
<widox> Blazeix: http://blog.forecast.io/its-not-a-web-app-its-an-app-you-install-from-the-web/
<Blazeix> mathomastech1: http://files.fuqua.io/upload/jump/a.html
<snap-l> Good morning
<rick_h_> morn
<mathomastech> morning
<brousch> You see that video of the Texas fertilizer plant? Crazy
<snap-l> No, I missed it
<snap-l> I've been avoiding news as of late.
<brousch> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ROrpKx3aIjA&sns=em
<snap-l> That's awful
<snap-l> Also, dumbass
<snap-l> Seriously, that's way too close to plant
<mathomastech> Yea, that is kinda scary.
<mathomastech> Unfortunately, another victim of VVS http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bt9zSfinwFA
<rick_h_> I have to say...I don't get how twitter and music fit together.
<rick_h_> but hey, if they can make $$ more power to them I guess
<jjesse> on a local news site for the texas explosion some commentor has said that iy look closely at the video you ee a missile streak by
<jjesse> hahahaha idiots make me laugh
<snap-l> Seriously? They'll make a conspiracy about anything.
<snap-l> rick_h_: Yeah, I don't understand the Twitter Music thing at all
<brousch> I normally wouldn't share this, but I had to for #7 for rick_h_ http://www.buzzfeed.com/jessicamisener/29-things-only-people-from-the-midwest-understand
<rick_h_> brousch: yea!
<rick_h_> #4, #5, #7, #8, #15, #20, #28 and definitely !#29 :(
<brousch> It's actually a good list. More than half apply to me or my immediate family
<rick_h_> yea
<brousch> #1 my uncle claims to have invented cornhole, but someone stole his plans. #2 half of my family has worked at a Steak & Shake for the last decade
<rick_h_> I was kind of cranky when I went to a steak and shake and didn't find steaks
<rick_h_> I've been bitter ever since
<brousch> steak burgers!
<brousch> It's like they pre-chew the steak for you!
<brousch> I'm actually not a big S&S fan
<snap-l> Garrison Keilor is not God in the flesh
<snap-l> Seriously, I don't understand this list.
<brousch> I had no idea who was in that picture
<brousch> And now, aside from having heard the name before, I still have no idea
<snap-l> Prairie Home Companion on NPR
<snap-l> Which is the moment when I realize my radio can switch stations in .2 seconds.
<snap-l> I think this list is more geared to the west-side of the Midwest
<snap-l> Frankly there aren't enough chains and manacles in the world to get my ass into a Steak and Shake
 * jrwren starts a LAke Woebegon monolog
<snap-l> Pepper it with Lutheran jokes, and you're halfway there.
<jrwren> ok, this is cool:https://github.com/dsc/pyquery
<rick_h_> jrwren: that's cool it'll do that from ET
<rick_h_> this is cool http://www.nycresistor.com/2013/04/16/pebble-hackathon/
<snap-l> This is not a library to produce or interact with JavaScript code. If that's what you need, check out
<snap-l> ...
<jrwren> wtforms looks cool
<jrwren> omg.
<jrwren> i just wrote this
<jrwren> x = dict.get('x', True)
<jrwren> dict.pop('x', True)
<rick_h_> lol
<rick_h_> "this damn well better be true...unless there's a value...but if not.."
<jrwren> yeah. need more coffee and sugar or something.
<jrwren> stupid brain.
<rick_h_> defaultdict to True :P
<snap-l> jrwren: That's a nice language you're writing in. I hope you try Python soon. ;)
<jrwren> that isn't python
<jrwren> ?
<jrwren> omfg, stfu about having a clue what the fuck i'm working k?
<jrwren> defaultdict DIAF
<jrwren> :p
<snap-l> jrwren: I'm just messing with you. :)
<jrwren> i know, i'm j/k too, sorry about the language.
<jrwren> on a serious tip, what isn't pythonic about
<snap-l> No worries.
<rick_h_> ok, so the world just ended here. Hope you guys are all doing well
<jrwren> somearg = kwargs.pop('may_not_be_there', True)
<jrwren> rain?
<jrwren> we just dumped on and very dark all of a sudden but just for a few minutes.
<rick_h_> evidently it's now dark time and the rain is falling sideways straight into the house
<jrwren> yup
<snap-l> rick_h_: Yeah, it's supposed to get nasty by my house too
<rick_h_> so much for the whole idea of open windows with a nice breeze
<greg-g> rain? what's that?
<rick_h_> greg-g: it's how flowers grow :P
<snap-l> rick_h_: Yeah, time to hunker down
<greg-g> nuh uh, there's flowers here, but no rain
<rick_h_> and the crud from the winter gets washed into the sewers
<snap-l> rick_h_: You hope
<greg-g> oh, your crud gets washed away? our's just pools around forever.
<rick_h_> all that salt from the roads left in the corners now flushed
<snap-l> jrwren: I thought you were using dict as a keyword
<snap-l> not as a variable.
<snap-l> and was having some parsing problems.
<rick_h_> oh heh, now RSS shows "severe thunderstorm warning expires 2:30...filed 2:23pm
<brousch> My city is in a state of emergency
<brousch> The creek near my house is flooding everything
<jjesse> i can imagine
<jjesse> i've seen pictures
 * rick_h_ double checks the sump pump
<brousch> I'm high enough up that it doesn't affect me
<jrwren> i'm glad i live on top of a hill
<greg-g> did you see the stuff in Chicago? crazy
<brousch> jrwren++
<rick_h_> we've got a guy on the team in CO with 16" of snow the last two days
<greg-g> niiiiice
<rick_h_> so at least not there. A bit much for april
<jrwren> yeah, my friend in denver was like TOO MUCH SNOW< WTF
<greg-g> too much snow? never, go skiing
<jrwren> skiing is a rich persons sport. I'm too poor for that.
<jrwren> give me a basketball in a concrete jungle plz
<greg-g> ok, cross country skiing? snow shoeing? make awesome homemade ice-cream with snow+milk+sugar? make a snow fort?
<greg-g> anyways, snow == endless fun, imo ;)
<rick_h_> I almost cleaned up the table ont he deck to work outside today so I'm putting snow behind me now
<rick_h_> however, glad I didn't end up getting out there today
<rick_h_> lol ah penguicon
<greg-g> huh, found another musician that Tom Morello/The Night Watchman sounds exactly like: Dave Alvin, who's currently on Bootleg Liquor on SOMAFM
<jrwren> we are building debs. I was considering using debconf. I have decided not to. Anyone have thoughts on this decision?
<rick_h_> jrwren: debs of your .py?
<rick_h_> jrwren: or just debs in general?
<rick_h_> jrwren: either way I guess I don't know enough to say anyway. Toss it out to G+ or the like and I can RT and see if someone has opinions
<jrwren> rick_h_: thanks, yes, I'll G+ it.
<snap-l> https://plus.google.com/100139456300784928828/posts/BUjUvbtUVvP
<snap-l> Apparently ratshack is on G+
<brousch> I posted a video to Facebook and this is the actual text of the email I received when it was done processing: "You video is now ready to view on Facebook!"
<brousch> That email must be sent out thousands of times a day
<snap-l> They probably have an orbital satellite sending those emails.
<greg-g> brousch: with the typo or without?
<brousch> greg-g: With the typo
<greg-g> brousch: hilarious
<greg-g> (delayed)
<rick_h_> doh, reformatted and forgot to set back up NAS rsync. 50GB more to go.
#ubuntu-us-mi 2013-04-19
<snap-l> Good morning
<rick_h_> morning
<rick_h_> party party
<snap-l> That good, eh?
<rick_h_> heh, TGIF, project that's due but not due is now here, and tried to order a desktop but blocked on shipping since I think it'd arrive while I was in CA :(
<ColonelPanic001> 'morning
<snap-l> rick_h_: Ugh.
<jjesse> morning folks
<rick_h_> jjesse: so that mic I picked up..meh
<rick_h_> but it does work
<jjesse> well glad i didn't rush out and buy it then
<rick_h_> jjesse: I cannot find a single earbud headset with dual noise cancelling mics
<rick_h_> jjesse: the world doesn't seem to make what I want
<jjesse> ah
<jjesse> i got a big ole pair of logitech headphones right now that works well but i look like a loser wearing them
<rick_h_> jjesse: yea, I've got this folding thing with a 14' cord on it that sucks to pack for travel and untangle when I go to use it
<rick_h_> I jsut want a pair of earbuds with dual mic so I can pocket them easily, and yet cancel out the coffee shop noise on hangouts
<jjesse> yeah mine is the same, though there is a hard plastic case that came w/ mine just a pain to have another case in them
<snap-l> I don't know why it took me so long to adopt vi keybindings under bash, but <3
<rick_h_> snap-l: one step closer to zsh :P
<snap-l> heh
<jrwren> i still refuse to.
<rick_h_> it has much better vim functionality
<jrwren> emacs kb shell fl
<snap-l> http://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2013/04/ibm-looks-to-sell-its-x86-server-business-to-lenovo-as-profits-crash/
<snap-l> And when (or if) the server business starts booming again, will lenovo sell it back? :)
<rick_h_> heh, well lenovo was recently listed as the only growing PC vendor, even over apple
<rick_h_> pure growth of numbers that is
<brousch> Butterfly http://i.imgur.com/CdCGOjQ.jpg
<greg-g> morn
<rick_h_> morning
<snap-l> brousch: :)
#ubuntu-us-mi 2013-04-20
<snap-l> Evening
<rick_h_> evening
<jjesse> evening rick_h_
<rick_h_> everyone partying hard?
<jjesse> lol
<jjesse> friday night is not a party night as we are usually up early to go for a run
<jjesse> wife is in bed already
<rick_h_> hah, we managed to score a baby-sitter so we had a dinner out. celebrate work calming back down a bit
<jjesse> awesome
<jjesse> we did dinner out as well tonight (celebrate pay day :) )
<rick_h_> woot
<jjesse> hailing again outside
<jjesse> and driving rain
<jjesse> mother nature is drunk
<rick_h_> yea, kind of bummed. Was hoping for some nice weekend weather to get the bike out now that work has calmed down
<jjesse> must be nice to have work calm down
<jjesse> its gotten crazier for me
<rick_h_> well 13.04 is next week and now we've got a couple of weeks vs days.
<jjesse> ah
<rick_h_> until we start the next batch. Then it's the race to get it all for 13.10
<rick_h_> http://uistage.jujucharms.com:8080/bws/sidebar/precise/apache2-6/ almost looks like something :)
<jjesse> is this what you've been doing
<rick_h_> yea
<jjesse> its pretty sweet looking
<rick_h_> yea, a week ago it didn't look so sweet, at least now it's getting close enough to show/walk through.
<jjesse> nice
<rick_h_> with just a bunch of bugs/missing bits that still need to be added
<rick_h_> funny when you reach a point where things start to work you can just sit there hitting the buttons back/forth :)
<jjesse> nice
<snap-l> df
<snap-l> Good morning
<snap-l> Installing Windows 7 into a virtual machine.
<snap-l> yippee. :)
<snap-l> Actually, Windows 7 install is not that bad
<snap-l> They really cleaned up things from XP
<snap-l> Of course there's a few maddening things in there as well, but overall not bad.
<jjesse> windows 7 is good
<jjesse> but that's because vista was bad :P
<rick_h_> Blazeix: ping, do you have notes/docs on how you were setting up your redis/sql data models?
<rick_h_> snap-l: yea, what I did with my wife. Pretty happy with it
<Blazeix> rick_h_: no real docs, though this presentation was super-helpful: http://nosql.mypopescu.com/post/34748264438/modeling-a-simple-social-app-using-sql-and-redis
<rick_h_> Blazeix: cool, going through the redis cookbook and tempted to start poking at some things.
<brousch> snap-l: The maddening part is after install when you have to download hundreds of updates and reboot 10 times
<brousch> Blazeix: Do you want a free ticket to mobidevday detroit?
<Blazeix> brousch: thanks for the offer, but i already have one :)
<Blazeix> how'd you end up with an extra, are you not able to make it?
<snap-l> brousch: This is SP1, so not too bad on that front
<brousch> Blazeix: they are giving speakers a free ticket
<snap-l> So I just received my new Google Chromebook Pixel. Now what??
<snap-l> I refuse to further increase my dependence on Google by running Chrome OS.
<snap-l> ^- Quote from this post: https://plus.google.com/108313527900507320366/posts/G3MxjUv2zFj
<brousch> I think ChromeOS is lock-in than Android
<brousch> You're using webapps, which you could control
<brousch> Google pisses you off? go run Linux/Windows/OSX and you still have all the same webapps
<brousch> ChromeOS is LESS locki-in
<brousch> With Android many of your apps only run on Android
<snap-l> My point is why buy a Pixel if you're not happy with Google.
<brousch> snap-l: Supposedly the screen is the bizomb
<brousch> 3:2  2,560x1,700  12.8"
<brousch> And it's a touchscreen, which some people like
<brousch> They evacuated the 2nd tallest building in GR due to flooded basement and generator fire
<rick_h_>  ok, coffee shop test #2. Good 4g connection here +1. Farthest one from my house -1
<rick_h_> coffee is served in a big milkshake mug...hmmm...
<rick_h_> and servied with a spoon and a straw
<rick_h_> Blazeix: you sure you don't want to work in some python? :)
<brousch> rick_h_: That's not coffee, that's a dessert
<rick_h_> brousch: yea, I'm confused for sure
<Blazeix> i'm not certain, but it sounds like you may have accidentally ordered a milkshake.
<Blazeix> i'll write python, but i demand we use django's orm.
<rick_h_> Blazeix: lol
<rick_h_> Blazeix: https://trello.com/board/bookieio/5172f2ebf2e69b95770022fa
<rick_h_> there goes my next 3 years :)
<Blazeix> haha
<Blazeix> rick_h_: did you see this? http://www.commafeed.com/welcome
<Blazeix> straight up java, so yuck, but might still be interesting
<rick_h_> Blazeix: no, hadn't seen it
<rick_h_> *sigh* screenshots or sample UX or bust people
<Blazeix> "Add an application, select JBoss Enterprise Application Platform 6.0" /runs away
<Blazeix> rick_h_: credentials are demo/demo
<rick_h_> hmm, UX issues. feed items only show after I moues over them.
<rick_h_> not bad though after that
<rick_h_> hmmm, python3 chance.
<brousch> rick_h_: What is 3 years?
<rick_h_> brousch: well bookie was 3yrs worth of work really
<rick_h_> brousch: so figure here goes my coding spare time for another 3
<rick_h_> brousch: have you done virtualenvs in py3?
<brousch> yes
<rick_h_> brousch: how did you get pip in there?
<brousch> pdfserenitynow was python3.2
<rick_h_> when I create one it creates the virtualenv but pip/etc is still pointed to the normal system versions
<rick_h_> did a python3.3 -m venv venv  seems to setup just the python bits but no easy_install, pip, etc to use to get things into the venv
<brousch> virtualenv includes its own pip
<brousch> I'm using Ubuntu's python-virtualenv python3-setuptools, python3.2 from deadsnakes
<brousch> virtualenv -p python3.2 venv
<brousch> (venv)brousch@foxmeat:~$ pip --version
<brousch> pip 1.1 from /home/brousch/venv/lib/python3.2/site-packages/pip-1.1-py3.2.egg (python 3.2)
<rick_h_> hmm, it doesn't in python3.3 I guess :(
<brousch> I just tried 3.3 and pip failed
<brousch> Looks like ubuntu virtualenv is 1.7.1 but 1.9.1 is available on pypi
<brousch> Ubuntu pip is too old to install newer virtualenv
<brousch> geekers
<brousch> There has to be a ppa for this
<brousch> OK, got it
<brousch> sudo apt-get remove --purge python-vitualenv; sudo apt-get autoremove;
<brousch> sudo easy_install3 pip; sudo pip-3.2 install virtualenv;
<brousch> Then virtualenv works for python3.3
<snap-l> rick_h_: Which coffeeshop were you at?
<tony-smlr> SMLR is live now!  (4/20) Video: http://www.youtube.com/user/tbemus?v=DklbU5eRNm8 , Audio: http://live.smlr.us:8000/streaming
<brousch> rick_h_: Did that work for you?
#ubuntu-us-mi 2013-04-21
<rick_h_> brousch: sorry, met up with krondor and ended up not going that far.
<rick_h_> brousch: the issue there is that I want to try to get 3.3 working side by side. I'll tinker with it some more
<rick_h_> snap-l: it's a local place. L.A. Cafe
<brousch> Well that just gives you the newest pip and virtualenv. You can still install a 2.7 cirtualenv
<rick_h_> hmm, 3.3 seems to have some virtualenv fail
<rick_h_> http://paste.mitechie.com/show/937/
<brousch> http://paste.mitechie.com/show/939/
<rick_h_> well better with my own compiled python http://paste.mitechie.com/show/940/
<rick_h_> 3.3.1 vs 3.3.0
<rick_h_> there we go, redid it with py3.3.1 compiled, did distribute-setup.py and then easy_install pip and all good
<jjesse-home_> everyone having fun tohgit?
<rick_h_> party party
<snap-l> morning
<rick_h_> morning
<rick_h_> so today, after switching the mifi to 4g only mode holding an ok connection at starbucks it seems.
<rick_h_> actually /me goes to run speedtest
<rick_h_> wow, actually it's all over the map. the speedtest starts at over 12MB, then nadda, then 5, then nadda
<rick_h_> one run avg'd 1MB/s since it hung for half the test
<rick_h_> so guess life isn't all peachy
<snap-l> lovely
<rick_h_> all good
<snap-l> cool
<snap-l> we are off to meijer
<snap-l> woo woo
<rick_h_> party one
<rick_h_> on
<rick_h_> such that it is
#ubuntu-us-mi 2014-04-14
<jrwren> sounds great.
<cmaloney> Evening
<derekv> Is there something in common between Dr Who and kung fu films?
<derekv> Cause I like both the same way.
<derekv> They like making dramatizations of Ip Man's life a lot.
<derekv> they entirely disagree with eathother except, he was pretty cool in a fight.
<brousch> cmaloney: You back from PyCon?
<cmaloney> Sticking around for Sprints.
<cmaloney> Hanging out with rick_h_ hacking on Bookie
<cmaloney> learning the install process. ;)
<brousch> heh
<Havenstance2> morn
<brousch> OK, well I have Linux and a music keyboard question when you have some time
<cmaloney> WHat's up?
<cmaloney> brousch: ^^
<brousch> I got an M-Audio KeyRig 49 at surplus for $35
<brousch> I got it working under LMMS, but it's too complicated for a kid. Is there a simpler interface on Linux?
<brousch> I found a nice Android app
<cmaloney> brousch: Haven't tried much else. Everythign that I've looked at is more complicated
<brousch> Yeah, I found some things that need Jack, but they are more complicated
<Havenstance2> cursed blasted darn gpg not found errors....
<cmaloney> Although you might be able to find somethingin Pygame that would support MIDI
<cmaloney> Since it's just a USB serial device.
<brousch> hm, that's a good idea
<cmaloney> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jhNow4cUMV8
<jrwren> brousch: surplus?
<cmaloney> You could write something. :)
<brousch> cmaloney: Yes, I don't have enough projects in my backlog :P
<brousch> jrwren: GVSU Electronics Surplus Sale
<cmaloney> brousch: Consider it free advice from the person who was supposed to trawl Montreal for a drum. ;)
<brousch> You didn't need to trawl, I found one for you!
<cmaloney> heh
<Haven|Work> not bad, already installed on server before 10am. now to wait and see if I can get it to work without any extra toying around.
<Haven|Work> cmaloney, I have a question about the Mug?
<cmaloney> What's up?
<Haven|Work> cmaloney, pm
<cmaloney> Got it.
<cmaloney> https://brumichigan.com/tickets/
<cmaloney> If you like Beer and helping kids with Leukemia this is an awesome event.
<cmaloney> Get drunk for a cause.
<Havenstance2> is there a way to mount a USB Flash by Label with fstab?
<jrwren> yes?
<Havenstance2> i tried adding Label=Thumb it said it couldn't find the disk when running sudo mount -a
<Havenstance2> eh, name is all capitols, put it in as label=THUMB it took it
<jrwren> does it show in /dev/disk/by-partlabel/ ?
<Havenstance2> jrwren, yeah I got it man
<Havenstance2> I had the name right but the wrong format
<Havenstance2> Thumb was actually spelled THUMB
<Havenstance2> when i added label=THUMB to fstab and ran mount -a it mounted the drive correctly
<Havenstance2> I forgot Linux is case sensitive
<jrwren> #neverforget
<Havenstance2> lol
<Havenstance2> im doing this whole encryption with truecrypt, it will be interesting to see if it works
<jrwren> https://isecpartners.github.io/news/2014/04/14/iSEC-Completes-Truecrypt-Audit.html
<Havenstance2> jrwren, not my data  I don't care, I'm just doing what i'm told :)
<Havenstance2> he has to know that if the NSA ever wanted his ass no encryption algorithm would last more then about 10 minutes with them
<mrgoodcat> What is bookie-sentry?
<rick_h_> mrgoodcat: it's a error service used to log/find errors with trace info
<rick_h_> mrgoodcat: basically go to sentry
<mrgoodcat> Got it
<mrgoodcat> I was confused when it joined then promptly left
<rick_h_> yea, external service
<rick_h_> https://getsentry.com/welcome/
<rick_h_> bwuhahahahahhaa https://plus.google.com/+RickHarding/posts/3UhbtVyhqta
<rick_h_> <3 GSoC + Pycon sprints
#ubuntu-us-mi 2014-04-15
<cmaloney> Evening
<rick_h_> heh, interesting https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=744306
<rick_h_> cmaloney: ^
<cmaloney> Viva la Bookie
<brousch> rick_h_: You are not allowed to go to any more conferences. Every time you do your wife ends up having to shovel
<rick_h_> brousch: she doesn't have to shovel. The snow will melt and our cars can all go through that much snow
<cmaloney> Good morning
<rick_h_> party
<cmaloney> So apparently my mom tried to tell JoDee that red lnar eclipses only happen during high times of conflict
<cmaloney> Apparently someone said that on the radio and it resonated with her.
<rick_h_> ruh roh
<cmaloney> Yeah, that radio (WJR) needs to have a little accident
<cmaloney> It's making her more nuts than usual.
<jrwren> rush limbaugh ?
<jrwren> Sean Hanity?
<jrwren> Other?
<cmaloney> Not sure
<cmaloney> bonkershit mcblabbermouthy for all I know
<brousch> Well there's always conflict somewhere
<cmaloney> brousch: Exactly. :)
<Havenstance2> ughh
<jrwren> is pycon over?
<jrwren> are sprints over?
<rick_h_> nope
<rick_h_> going strong
<greg-g> 2nd day of sprints, apparently
<rick_h_> yep
<cmaloney> Yeah, rick_h_ and I are sitting in the Pyramid room
<jrwren> cool
<jrwren> oh! i saw a pyramid release recently. was that you?
<cmaloney> It was released prior to Pycon.
<jrwren> in prep for sprints so you can gut it and do major changes? :)
<cmaloney> Heh
<cmaloney> Pretty much
<brousch> Switching default ORM to Django's?
<Havenstance2> so i have a bunch of packages to install on this machine. but I have other work to do. can i input sudo apt-get install xxxpackage -y && sudo apt-get install yyypackage -y and so on for all the packages and have it run everything while im away ?
<rick_h_> sudo apt-get install -y xxx yyy zzz
<rick_h_> and walk away
<Havenstance2> perfect, apparently i was trying to do it the hard way :)
<cmaloney> wee
<brousch> cmaloney: Are you being taken for a ride?
<brousch> Or having bladder control issues?
<cmaloney> brousch: Fun times at home
<cmaloney> Headed back to the hotel for hangout call
<cmaloney> Which is Google's way of telling me "you're welcome"
<brousch> ut oh
<cmaloney> Yeah, fun tmes.
<brousch> the usual thing?
<cmaloney> No, no. See PM.
<mrgoodcat> widox: ping
<Hitmanactual121> Oh hai there Waf
<widox> mrgoodcat: pong
<mrgoodcat> hey you're the one that makes irc bots right?
<mrgoodcat> and hi :)
<mrgoodcat> is that a no?
<mrgoodcat> rick_h_: do you have any sort of automated testing for bookie?
<cmaloney> mrgoodcat: rick_h_ just set up a Jenkins server for Bookie
<mrgoodcat> does it test pull requests do you know?
<cmaloney> I think so but not 100% sure
<mrgoodcat> ok
<waf> mrgoodcat: i think that's me. chc, right?
<mrgoodcat> ah yes
<mrgoodcat> i think i probably got you mixed up with widox
<mrgoodcat> oops....
<waf> it happens. we are both amazing individuals.
<mrgoodcat> haha
<mrgoodcat> i'll take that under advisement
<mrgoodcat> have you found any reliable way to detect netsplits?
<mrgoodcat> I have gotten disconnected from freenode on more than one occasion and my bot hasn't been able to recover from it as of yet
<waf> no silver bullets. i have a jvm-based bot that uses pircbotx, and that recovers gracefully (usually)
<waf> so you could take a look at what pircbotx is doing
<mrgoodcat> ok
<mrgoodcat> ty
<mrgoodcat> widox: I know it was a long time ago but in the #bookie channel you said "bookiebot: give me a link, too". what did you mean by that? I maintain bookiebot and if something is missing i'll add it
<mrgoodcat> widox: i just checked my hilights so that's why this is so much later
<widox> haha
<widox> mrgoodcat: ugh.
<mrgoodcat> I know if you forgot it's cool
<widox> oh, I think I had mentioned a ticket# or something and it shoots out the ticket/pr title, but I thought it would be handy if also put a link out there
<mrgoodcat> You had pasted a link actually
<mrgoodcat> And it does post the title
<widox> oh, maybe I was thinking that's the link it should have pasted?
<widox> s/pasted/posted/
<mrgoodcat> If you just #233 it does link iirc
<bookiebot> open - integrate celery errors into sentry setup for production - https://github.com/bookieio/Bookie/issues/233
<widox> oh, hell. then it has been to long ago :)
<mrgoodcat> Lol ok
<mrgoodcat> https://www.irccloud.com/pastebin/SBqLwddl
<mrgoodcat> ^^ relevant logs if it helps your memory
<mrgoodcat> lol
<mrgoodcat> sorry if i'm being too pushy, just having fun coding today and i figured i'd fix any gripes I could find
<jcastro> http://imgur.com/wuYorF4
<mrgoodcat> test #234
<bookiebot2> closed - non-activated accounts should be cleaned up occassionally - https://github.com/bookieio/Bookie/issues/234
<mrgoodcat> test http://www.isnull.com.ar/2011/10/ubuntu-11-fatal-error-libxmlxmlversionh.html
<bookiebot2> http://is.gd/XiekGS - isnull: Ubuntu 11 : fatal error: libxml/xmlversion.h: No such file or directory
<mrgoodcat> .reload
<bookiebot2> reloaded 10 plugins in 0.005357 seconds
<mrgoodcat> .reload
<bookiebot2> reloaded 9 plugins in 0.003541 seconds
<mrgoodcat> .help
<bookiebot2> bookie issue helper | chanlist | echo | hash | help | reload | uptime | url shortener
#ubuntu-us-mi 2014-04-16
<derekv> whatsit
<derekv> we'll add a bookie plugin
<cmaloney> .reload
<bookiebot2> reloaded 10 plugins in 0.003833 seconds
<cmaloney> .reload
<bookiebot2> reloaded 10 plugins in 0.003787 seconds
<cmaloney> .reload
<bookiebot2> reloaded 10 plugins in 0.003937 seconds
<cmaloney> .reload
<bookiebot2> reloaded 10 plugins in 0.003879 seconds
<cmaloney> .reload
<bookiebot2> reloaded 10 plugins in 0.003788 seconds
<cmaloney> ;)
<mrgoodcat> lol cmaloney
<mrgoodcat> .source
<bookiebot2> https://github.com/dyladan/alan
<cmaloney> I think youmight want to code in a trusted user on some of these bots
<mrgoodcat> yea i'm going to
<mrgoodcat> but there isn't too much i'm worried about right now
 * cmaloney just crashed a bot in #linuxjournal because it tried to get the mimetype of http://localhost:8080
<mrgoodcat> no damaging plugins yet
<cmaloney> Right, but it could get a DDoS
<cmaloney> or annoy someone on freenode to take it offline
<mrgoodcat> cmaloney: it can't join other channels right now
<mrgoodcat> and it doesn't exactly have any spammy functions
<mrgoodcat> derekv: I rolled it myself. you can add a plugin if you want though. the source is at https://github.com/dyladan/alan . The plugin format is pretty easy to understand but feel free to ask any questions and pull request away :)
<bookiebot2> http://is.gd/b6jXTe - dyladan/alan Â· GitHub
<mrgoodcat> .reload
<bookiebot2> reloaded 12 plugins in 0.006654 seconds
<mrgoodcat> .message rick_h_ save messages for later :) maybe useful, maybe not
<bookiebot2> mrgoodcat: I'll tell him
<mrgoodcat> .reload
<bookiebot2> reloaded 12 plugins in 0.006234 seconds
<mrgoodcat> .message rick_h_ save messages for later :) maybe useful, maybe not | now persistent over reloads too :) hopefully...
<bookiebot2> mrgoodcat: I'll tell him
<mrgoodcat> .reload
<bookiebot2> reloaded 14 plugins in 0.00824 seconds
<mrgoodcat> .memory
<bookiebot2> Threads: 4, Real Memory: 27.32 MB, Allocated Memory: 298.43 MB, Peak Allocated Memory: 354.43 MB, Stack Size: 204.00 KB, Heap Size: 237.01 MB
<mrgoodcat> .reload
<bookiebot2> reloaded 14 plugins in 0.006041 seconds
<mrgoodcat> .memory
<bookiebot2> Threads: 4, Real Memory: 27.32 MB, Allocated Memory: 298.43 MB, Peak Allocated Memory: 354.43 MB, Stack Size: 204.00 KB, Heap Size: 237.01 MB
<mrgoodcat> test
<mrgoodcat> .reload
<bookiebot2> reloaded 14 plugins in 0.005617 seconds
<mrgoodcat> .system
<mrgoodcat> .reload
<bookiebot2> reloaded 15 plugins in 0.010134 seconds
<mrgoodcat> .system
<bookiebot2> Hostname: dyladan.me, Operating System: Linux-3.8.0-29-generic-x86_64-with-Ubuntu-12.04-precise, Python Version: CPython 3.2.3, Architecture: 64bit-ELF, CPU: x86_64
<greg-g> jrwren: cmaloney: this appears to be the next good economics book. TONS of commentary out there. Also, it reaffirms my assumptions, so it must be good/right. http://www.vox.com/2014/4/8/5592198/the-short-guide-to-capital-in-the-21st-century
<bookiebot2> http://is.gd/8O1qO0 - The short guide to Capital in the 21st Century - Vox
<mrgoodcat> lol
<greg-g> does it expand shortened urls?
<mrgoodcat> no
<greg-g> http://ur1.ca/h3b27
<mrgoodcat> should it?
<greg-g> I find that more useful
<mrgoodcat> short.com
<greg-g> I want to know where I'm going
<mrgoodcat> http://short.com
<mrgoodcat> wtf
<mrgoodcat> where did he go?
<mrgoodcat> oh lol too short
<mrgoodcat> http://verylongwebsite.com
<mrgoodcat> .help
<bookiebot2> bookie | bookie issue helper | chanlist | echo | hash | help | memory | message | reload | source | system | sysuptime | uptime | url shortener
<mrgoodcat> http://verylongwebsite.com
<mrgoodcat> hmmmm
<mrgoodcat> http://www.vox.com/2014/4/8/5592198/the-short-guide-to-capital-in-the-21st-century
<bookiebot2> http://is.gd/8O1qO0 - The short guide to Capital in the 21st Century - Vox
<mrgoodcat> now i'm confused...
<mrgoodcat> oh i get it :)
<greg-g> http://short.com/something
<mrgoodcat> it's trying to get the title of the page, if it gets 404 it breaks the flow
<greg-g> http://short.com/somethingah
<greg-g> ah
<greg-g> grossmeier.net/about
<mrgoodcat> http://google.com
<greg-g> http://grossmeier.net/about
<bookiebot2> http://is.gd/OwycZW - Google
<bookiebot2> http://is.gd/W69Sv7 - Consilience
<mrgoodcat> http://is.gd/W69Sv7
<mrgoodcat> http://bit.ly/1bdDlXc
<mrgoodcat> .reload
<bookiebot2> reloaded 15 plugins in 0.006863 seconds
<mrgoodcat> http://bit.ly/1bdDlXc
<bookiebot2> http://bit.ly/1bdDlXc - Google
<mrgoodcat> .message greg-g bookiebot2 grabs titles from shortlinks now at least. it's difficult to figure out when to expand and when to shorten. I'd need a list of shortening services and even then it wouldn't be perfect
<bookiebot2> mrgoodcat: I'll tell him
<mrgoodcat> http://steamcommunity.com/groups/ccowmu
<bookiebot2> http://is.gd/UwyRfK -
<mrgoodcat> .reload
<bookiebot2> reloaded 15 plugins in 0.006442 seconds
<mrgoodcat> http://steamcommunity.com/groups/ccowmu
<bookiebot2> http://is.gd/UwyRfK - Steam Community :: Group :: Computer Club of Western Michigan University
<mrgoodcat> .reload
<bookiebot2> reloaded 15 plugins in 0.006462 seconds
<mrgoodcat> http://steamcommunity.com/groups/ccowmu
<bookiebot2> http://is.gd/UwyRfK - Steam Community :: Group :: Computer Club of Western Michigan University
<mrgoodcat> oops. sorry to everyone about the spam. i thought i was in my test channel
<cmaloney> Good morning
<brousch> yes
<MaskedDriver> morning
<mrgoodcat> Morning
<mrgoodcat> If anybody has any ideas for bookiebot2 please don't hesitate to let me know. Been having fun adding features
<jrwren> greg-g: very interesting read.
<brousch> mrgoodcat: How do I see it's current features?
<cmaloney> ;)
<jrwren> til: *.wp.dg.cx is a domain with txt records with wikipedia summaries.
<jrwren> host -t txt linux.wp.dg.cx
<jrwren> can you specify minimum version to apt-get
<jrwren> e.g. apt-get install libssl1.0.0>=1.0.1-4ubuntu5.12
<jrwren> I'd like to be able to do that, but it seems i cannot :(
<jrwren> and awk -F^I is easy too
<mrgoodcat> brousch: .help
<mrgoodcat> .help
<bookiebot2> bookie | bookie issue helper | chanlist | echo | hash | help | isup | memory | message | reload | source | system | sysuptime | uptime | url helper
<brousch> .bookie
<brousch> bookiebot2: bookie
<mrgoodcat> .help bookie
<bookiebot2> Bookie plugins - .bhelp for commands
<mrgoodcat> .bhelp
<bookiebot2> newbug | gh | logs | ot | bugs
<mrgoodcat> .newbug
<bookiebot2> https://github.com/bookieio/Bookie/issues/new
<brousch> mrgoodcat: You might add viewing the newest bookmark submitted to bookie, or a list of the recent 5
<brousch> view them by username or tag
<brousch> hehe https://bitbucket.org/cliff/microdjango/src
<bookiebot2> http://is.gd/g1zZIk - cliff / microdjango / source / â Bitbucket
<cmaloney> http://localhost:8080
<greg-g> jrwren: a short discussion on identi.ca about it; https://identi.ca/greg/note/TqU59AdGRkuJyi4UtC0n5g
<bookiebot2> greg-g, at 2014-04-16 01:38:41 EST mrgoodcat said: bookiebot2 grabs titles from shortlinks now at least. it's difficult to figure out when to expand and when to shorten. I'd need a list of shortening services and even then it wouldn't be perfect
<bookiebot2> http://is.gd/uygtDi - Money - Identi.ca
<greg-g> heh
<greg-g> oh bookiebot2
<rick_h_> heh, bot overload
<jrwren> identi.ca is that still a thing?
<brousch> I thought it died and turned into push.io
<cmaloney> pump.io
<cmaloney> and it's very much alive
<cmaloney> even though the lack of a twitter api makes it less appealing. ;)
<brousch> so identi.ca is still alive?
<greg-g> yep
<greg-g> but you can't register an account on identi.ca, you can use one of the many other (Evan P-hosted) pump.io servers
<greg-g> it's cheaper to run a bunch of smaller pump.io servers than one big one (or one big statusnet server)
<greg-g> http://pump.io/tryit.html
<bookiebot2> http://is.gd/A04au7 - Try pump.io
<greg-g> that redirects you to a random pump.io server
<cmaloney> One of the bigger issues with it is discoverability.
<greg-g> yeah
<greg-g> :/
<cmaloney> It's not exactly easy to figure out who is using what
<greg-g> I miss the old days :(
<cmaloney> Yeah, me too
<cmaloney> It's not good when I can scroll a page and a half and find stuff that I read a while ago.
<jrwren> anyone know how i can view a procs limits pre-2.6.24 ?
<cmaloney> jrwren: Which limits?
<jrwren> RLIMIT_NOFILE
<jrwren> i never did find a way, but we dug in other areas and are moving forward.
<mrgoodcat> jrwren: can't you check /proc/<pid>/limits?
<mrgoodcat> or /proc/self/limits
<mrgoodcat> cmaloney: i was planning on doing that when i get time
<cmaloney> OK, this is just insane.
<cmaloney> Apparently my wifi on my laptop is wonky
<cmaloney> (technical term)
<cmaloney> so instead I'm using the phone to tether the computer to the wifi connection for the phone
<brousch> Wonky brand wifi is well-known
<cmaloney> and listening to music on the phone
<cmaloney> Hello future.
<cmaloney> That said if it isn't a puddle of overheated goo by the end of this I'll be srprised. :)
<brousch> place it in your pocket to keep it safe
<cmaloney> Excellent idea
<cmaloney> I shall call it the brousch BBQ Nuts plan
<brousch> mmmm, bbq nuts
<mrgoodcat> cmaloney: thanks for fast response but it was a duplicate bug
<cmaloney> Yeah, no worries.
<jrwren> mrgoodcat: /proc/self|<pid>/limits didn't exist until 2.6.24
<jrwren> maybe I should run a kernel from this decade :)
<mrgoodcat> .reload
<bookiebot2> reloaded 15 plugins in 0.006802 seconds
<mrgoodcat> .bmark brousch
<mrgoodcat> .reload
<bookiebot2> reloaded 16 plugins in 0.008009 seconds
<mrgoodcat> .bmark brousch
<bookiebot2> http://grasch.net/node/26 - ReComment: A speech-based Recommender System | Peter Grasch
<mrgoodcat> brousch's latest bmark :)
<brousch> heh
<dyladan> .reload
<bookiebot2> reloaded 16 plugins in 0.007088 seconds
<bookiebot2> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-5wpm-gesOY - The problem with timezones
<dyladan> wut
<bookiebot2> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-5wpm-gesOY - The problem with timezones
<dyladan> .reload
<bookiebot2> reloaded 16 plugins in 0.006541 seconds
<dyladan> fixed now. it was going to post every time anyone posted anything.... that would have been annoying
<dyladan> rick_h_: have you ever thought about adding shortlink support to bookie?
<rick_h_> dyladan: I kind of do, it's not super short but 'short enough'
<rick_h_> the hash is https://bmark.us/craig/redirect/85b07ce1739f3f
<rick_h_> and https://bmark.us/redirect/85b07ce1739f3f
<rick_h_> also should owrk
<dyladan> oh
<dyladan> ok
<cmaloney> .bmark admin
<bookiebot2> http://www.getoffmalawn.com/blog/playing-with-asyncio - Nathan Hoad - Playing with asyncio
<cmaloney> ;)
<cmaloney> .bmark craig
<bookiebot2> http://nbviewer.ipython.org/github/rasbt/python_reference/blob/master/not_so_obvious_python_stuff.ipynb - nbviewer.ipython.org/github/rasbt/python_reference/blob/master/not_so_obvious_python_stuff.ipynb
<dyladan> cmaloney: the description is the same as the link apparentlhy
<cmaloney> yep
<dyladan> and nice link :)
<cmaloney> danke
<cmaloney> I found it myself (with the help of a reddit run)
<dyladan> .reload
<bookiebot2> reloaded 16 plugins in 0.007231 seconds
<dyladan> check this out
<dyladan> .bmark craig
<bookiebot2> http://nbviewer.ipython.org/github/rasbt/python_reference/blob/master/not_so_obvious_python_stuff.ipynb - nbviewer.ipython.org/github/rasbt/python_reference/blob/master/not_so_obvious_python_stuff.ipynb
<dyladan> .bmark craig 2
<bookiebot2> http://docs.pylonsproject.org/projects/pyramid-tutorials/en/latest/ - Pyramid Tutorials â The Pyramid Tutorials v0.1
<dyladan> .bmark craig 3
<bookiebot2> http://shop.oreilly.com/product/0636920010326.do - Jenkins: The Definitive GuideÂ -Â O'Reilly Media
<dyladan> .bmark craig 4
<bookiebot2> https://juju.ubuntu.com/docs/getting-started.html - Juju Documentation
<dyladan> history :)
<dyladan> up to the last 100 bookmarks
<dyladan> .test
<dyladan> .echo etst
<bookiebot2> etst
<dyladan> .echo etst bookiebot2
<bookiebot2> etst bookiebot2
<cmaloney> nice
<cmaloney> .bmark craig 256
<cmaloney> .bmark craig 255
<cmaloney> .bmark craig 101
<cmaloney> .bmark craig 100
<bookiebot2> 2014-03-01 03:53:48 - http://blog.learningbyshipping.com/2013/11/09/realities-of-performance-appraisal/ - Realities of Performance Appraisal | Learning by Shipping
<dyladan> unfortunately it is a limitation of bookie that it is limited to 100 bookmarks
<dyladan> rick_h_: could maybe help me get more/all history if we want it
<dyladan> cmaloney rick_h_ waf: is there CHC tonight? aren't rick_h_ and cmaloney at pycon?
<cmaloney> We are, and not heading home until tomorrow
<dyladan> i'm going anyways. waf might too who know
<dyladan> s
<cmaloney> May want to check with waf widox or trevlar to see if they'll show up
<cmaloney> or lmorchard if he'd rejoin channel. ;)
<widox> mrgoodcat: not sure if I'll make it tonight - but be sure to look out for wandering geek-types :)
<mrgoodcat> ha
<mrgoodcat> ok
<mrgoodcat> .help
<bookiebot2> bookie | bookie issue helper | chanlist | echo | hash | help | isup | memory | message | reload | source | system | sysuptime | uptime | url helper
<mrgoodcat> waf: ping
#ubuntu-us-mi 2014-04-17
<cmaloney> evening
<mrgoodcat> hey
<cmaloney> howdy
<mrgoodcat> added authentication :)
<cmaloney> w00t
<mrgoodcat> .adminecho testing
<bookiebot> testing
<cmaloney> .adminecho testing
<mrgoodcat> right now i'm working on making it so you have to reauth after changing nick
<mrgoodcat> otherwise if i change my nick someone can impersonate me
<mrgoodcat> cmaloney: done :)
<mrgoodcat> no commands are marked adminonly right now except adminecho but that can come later
<jrwren> happy launch day!
<mrgoodcat> and a happy launch day to you as well :)
<brousch> Is SpaceX going up today?
<mrgoodcat> 14.04
<brousch> aoril 4 has already passed
<brousch> 14
<mrgoodcat> ah
<mrgoodcat> well idk then
<mrgoodcat> jrwren: knows tho. maybe he had a product launch?
<brousch> I'm just messing with you
<jrwren> 14.04 today
<jrwren> you silly #ubuntu-us-mi folks
<brousch> 17.04.14 today
<jrwren> trusty today
<brousch> So is mrgoodcat, which is why he was easy to troll
<mrgoodcat> gdi
<mrgoodcat> i didn't even think to check it
<mrgoodcat> i was like "how did i miss launch day?"
<jrwren> brousch: saucy today, you are.
<brousch> I think Tim Hortons gave me caffeinated coffee
<mrgoodcat> brousch: those cheeky bastards
<jrwren> as they say in #openstack, ã½à¼¼àºÙÍàºà¼½ï¾ RELEASE or RIOT! ã½à¼¼àºÙÍàºà¼½ï¾
<waf> mrgoodcat: hey, sorry i couldn't make chc. i was traveling for work yesterday.
<mrgoodcat> got it
<mrgoodcat> no big deal really. i was more productive alone anyways
<mrgoodcat> http://www.wwmt.com/shared/news/features/top-stories/stories/wwmt_witnesses-report-shooting-at-wayside-west-kalamazoo-20097.shtml#.U0_S2M-x15S
<bookiebot> http://is.gd/WOBk5P - 23-yr old Kalamazoo man shot and killed at Wayside West - WWMT - Kalamazoo MI Top Stories - News, Sports, Weather, Traffic
<jrwren> great, i'm going there next weekend.
<brousch> jrwren: To that sports bar?
<jrwren> well, kzoo, not wayside.
<jrwren> I've been to waysides countless times.
<brousch> I think KalamazooX will be slightly less violent
<jrwren> all more than 10 yrs ago :)
<mrgoodcat> lol
<mrgoodcat> yes likely kalamazoox will be less violent than a sports bar
<mrgoodcat> wayside is a pretty meh bar anyways
<brousch> slightly
<mrgoodcat> it's not bad, just difficult to get to and from without driving
<mrgoodcat> next thing to add to bookiebot is database support so i can play with message history
<mrgoodcat> when i started pickling dicts to store information i realized i should probably get goin on real database storage
<brousch> pickled dicts just sounds dirty
<jrwren> waysides is terrible.
<jrwren> i rarely had fun when I was there.
<mrgoodcat> brousch: i needed key-value store
<mrgoodcat> i was just using a dict
<mrgoodcat> but then i wanted it persistent over restarts
<mrgoodcat> so i started pickling
<mrgoodcat> pickle is faster than in thought...
<mrgoodcat> 99999 random 7 character strings in a dict with ints as keys pickled in 0.049 seconds as timed by datetime module...
<mrgoodcat> it took longer to create in memory than it took to write it to the disk
<mrgoodcat> file ended up 2.0M
<jrwren> yup, pickle is good.  it has downsides too
<mrgoodcat> jrwren: anything specific i should be looking out for?
<jrwren> executable code.
<jrwren> when you read the pickle it can/will just start running code if it finds it.
<jrwren> its fine if you always trust your pickle files.
<jrwren> but you shouldn't unpickle things from untrusted sources
<mrgoodcat> ah, well i'm not _too_ worried about that, since i'm creating the pickle files
<jrwren> right.
<jrwren> also, pickle versions change.
<jrwren> IIRC there was a bug between 2.7.2 and 2.7.3 :(
<mrgoodcat> i'm on 3.3
<mrgoodcat> so it will likely change even more
<jrwren> yes, beware.
<mrgoodcat> there's no long term storage of the pickle though
<mrgoodcat> .reload
<bookiebot> reloaded 20 plugins in 0.007452 seconds
<mrgoodcat> about 7 thousandths of a second
<jrwren> oh, only short term? then I'd not worry at all.
<mrgoodcat> it's just to persist over restarts
<jrwren> sure, and then one day apt-get upgrade upgrades your python and then you restart and KABOOM you cant read your pickle
<mrgoodcat> well i'm using virtualenv
<mrgoodcat> so that's not likely
<mrgoodcat> but nothing critical is stored
<mrgoodcat> .message jrwren it only stores messages right now
<bookiebot> mrgoodcat: I'll tell him
<mrgoodcat> .reload
<bookiebot> reloaded 20 plugins in 0.007524 seconds
<jrwren> its very likely with virtualenv
<bookiebot> jrwren, at 2014-04-17 10:18:17 EST mrgoodcat said: it only stores messages right now
<jrwren> virtualenv doesn't copy the python bin into the venv.
<brousch> virtualenv is a link to system python, not a copy (except on windows)
<mrgoodcat> ah
<mrgoodcat> didn't realize that
<jrwren> i've had apt-get upgrades make me recreate my venvs :(
<mrgoodcat> is there any way to force python version?
<mrgoodcat> i created with virtualenv -p python3.3
<mrgoodcat> so it will stay on 3.3 no matter what, but if a minor version change can break pickle, wouldn't i want to force that too?
<havnestance3> anyone use msmtprc for emailing notifications from a server?
<havnestance3> msmtp too
<jsivak> mrgoodcat: the only way I've found to "freeze" the version of Python to something I control is to do a "side/alt" install into /usr/local
<jsivak> .. and note that Python upgrades from 2.7.A to 2.7.B can break venvs.. heck I had a problems when 2.6.5 was updated without a version change once.
<mrgoodcat> well i guess i'm not that worried about it
<mrgoodcat> this is all very theoretical for an irc bot
<mrgoodcat> if it breaks i'll fix it
<mrgoodcat> simple as that
<jsivak> .. and recreating VE's is easy.. espeically with pip install..
<jsivak> Oh, another reminder, the code in a VE may not "break"/crash after a Python upgrade until you restart it (if it were a web app, or some other long running app)
<jsivak> we had that "surprise" as well.
<mrgoodcat> ha something to look out for i guess
<mrgoodcat> i like how i can make edits to running python files and just propogate the change when i feel like it
<brousch> Do you guys use venv in production, or a dedicated server for each thing?
<jsivak> its not often, but yeah.. VE's are still great, but it sucks when the "earth is moved"..
<mrgoodcat> .reload is my favorite command :)
<bookiebot> reloaded 20 plugins in 0.00777 seconds
<jsivak> brousch: we use them in production..
<jsivak> we host all of our webapps in their own VE.
<brousch> jsivak: you have a lot of them?
<jsivak> how many do you consider to be "a lot"? :)
<brousch> I don't know. I've just noticed you for the first time today so I'm trying to learn more about you
<jsivak> brousch: heh.. I've been to chc off an on; rick_h_ used to work for me and cmaloney currently does.
<brousch> Ah, OK
<brousch> Then I do have a small idea of how many you have
<jsivak> we've got 10+ production web apps, each running in their own VE on 1 particular server. Our pattern is 1 webapp == 1 VE
<jsivak> We do per-project web-simulators on another server.. there's probably about 30 VE's/apps there, but they have very low traffic/volume
<jsivak> right now we are finally starting to use the spooling features of uwsgi.
<mrgoodcat> 1 webapp == 1 VE and 1 VE != 1 server?
<jsivak> we host apps like portal.morpace.com/app_name_here..  so we use proxy prefixing a lot.
<jsivak> many of our apps have somewhat limited lifetimes and very limited user bases..
<jsivak> we also maintain a local copy of all pypi packages that we use.. so we can always re-create VE's in their "original" state..
<mrgoodcat> oops changed my nick on wrong server
<mrgoodcat> lol
<mrgoodcat> would be interesting to have a declarative VE config so you could assert versions and such
<mrgoodcat> like a gemfile in ruby
<jsivak> "virtualenv.py -p /usr/local/bin/python2.7 myenv_ve" is about as close as I can think of.
<jsivak> heh
<jsivak> you can be a little more "tricky" if you INSTALL virtualenv.py to /usr/local/bin USING /usr/local/bin/python2.7, then "virtualenv.py" automatically uses /usr/local/bin/python2.7 when creating new VE's.
<jsivak> (don't need the "-p" arg..)
<mrgoodcat> .reload
<bookiebot> reloaded 21 plugins in 0.009743 seconds
<mrgoodcat> .chanlist
<bookiebot> Current channels: #ubuntu-us-mi #bookie
<mrgoodcat> .shortlog
<bookiebot> Current commit is 21f43bb996dea28dbdaef70a7fffbfabeaa33650 removed adminecho and added chanlist
<jsivak> ok, I've been away from this channel for awhile, what's the "bookiebot"..
<mrgoodcat> i just made it
<mrgoodcat> .source
<bookiebot> https://github.com/dyladan/alan
<mrgoodcat> it's my way of experimenting/playing/learning with python
<mrgoodcat> i'm newish to python
<jsivak> ah, its not related to rick_h_'s Bookie?
<mrgoodcat> it is actually
<mrgoodcat> .bmark dyladan
<bookiebot> http://nbviewer.ipython.org/github/rasbt/python_reference/blob/master/not_so_obvious_python_stuff.ipynb - Not so obvious python
<mrgoodcat> my most recent bmark
<mrgoodcat> .bmark admin 99
<bookiebot> http://techblog.ironfroggy.com/2013/11/5-reasons-web-components-arent-ready.html - Developing Upwards: 5 Reasons Web Components Aren't Ready for Prime Time
<mrgoodcat> rick_h_'s 99th newest bookmark
<mrgoodcat> also if you reference a bookie issue number like #223 it pings the github api to get info about it
<bookiebot> closed - ERROR/PoolWorker-3] maximum recursion depth exceeded - https://github.com/bookieio/Bookie/issues/223
<brousch> Has anyone used Scratch?
<jsivak> brousch: heh.. I tried to get my daughter to use it..
<mrgoodcat> brousch: i'm not _that_ young...
<brousch> jsivak: Judging by the tone, it did not go well?
<jsivak> brousch: she's 12, Minecraft and Skyrim were "moar interesting".. :P
<jsivak> .. though she's getting good at managing different Minecraft plugins/installs..
<brousch> Hm, yeah, might be a bit old fro Scratch
<brousch> I have a 6 year old
<jrwren> <100 => trivial
<jrwren> 100-1000 => a little
<jrwren> 1000+ => a lot
<jsivak> lol
<jrwren> hey, you asked :)
<jsivak> yeah, walked into that one..
<jsivak> I'm not sure I'd classify < 100 as 'trivial'
<jrwren> what do you use to host.
<jrwren> ?
<jrwren> uwsgi?
<jsivak> yep
<jrwren> and nginx?
<jsivak> yep
<jsivak> some apache.
<jrwren> ugh
<jrwren> mod_wsgi or mod_uwsgi?
<jsivak> all the new stuff is using nginx...
<jsivak> oh, straight proxy to the uwsgi HTTP port.
<jsivak> (for the apache stuff)
<jrwren> ya know, I never had luck wiht mod_uwsgi
<jrwren> yeah, that is probably easier.
<jrwren> slightly more overhead though :(
<jsivak> yeah, I never tried it.. didn't like that *one* master Python instance was running the show
<jsivak> plus, as rick_h_ and cmaloney can attest to, I *LIKE* having the sites/apps being as indepedent as possible.
<jrwren> same here
<jrwren> once you go uwsgi process, I feel it is hard to go back to web server integrated
<jsivak> no kidding.
<jrwren> nginx support uwsig protocol. I wonder if there is an apache module to just uwsgi protocol to uwsgi sockets
<jsivak> dunno
<jsivak> I really dislike going back to apache config files.. ;)
<jrwren> same here.
<jrwren> esp since I never really learned 2.4 access changes, and I dont like access_compat
<jsivak> *but* I do miss the "mixed case URL" handling that apache offers..
<jsivak> ugh.. 2.4's "requires"..  ugh
<jrwren> ya know what would be a bit interesting... haproxy for uwsgi protocol
<jsivak> hmm.. not sure.. I almost ALWAYS want nginx "in front" to handle all of the goofy proxy/url/redirect things.. SSL too, even though latest haproxy supports SSL now
<jsivak> with our projects we need to great "glamour" URLs quite often.
<jrwren> haproxy excells at goofy proxy/url/redirect things :)
<jrwren> haproxy does not excel at ssl :)
<jrwren> but its in beta ;)
<jsivak> its not nice making the redirect rules with "variables" in them.. I have to use "if" sometimes in the nginx conf..
<jsivak> yeah, until 1.5 goes "gold" I wasn't going to try the SSL support in haproxy
<jsivak> .. but nginx does it well enough for us.. our load's aren't crazy high, so we can afford the overhead.. but I *LOVE* have all SSL handled at the front door and not at the web workers.
<jrwren> what kind of apps you hosting with uwsgi?
<jrwren> same here. nginx works great for me/us
<jsivak> have you had to deal with 'mixed-case' URL's? (or normalizing mixed-case URLs)
<jrwren> no
<jrwren> everything, well, 99% of what I do is machine to machine.
<jsivak> its on my radar; I'm sure to get bit by it someday.. we have IIS servers as well, and people get lazy with their URLs.
<jsivak> lucky you.
<jsivak> we invite people for surveys..
<jrwren> is there some mixed case url recent issue?
<jrwren> why would you get hit?
<jsivak> Oh, someone could print an URL invite like "http://s.morpace.com/VISITus"
<bookiebot> http://is.gd/KDiLF2 - Interviewer Server - Error
<jsivak> if that went to an nginx system, then the url may not redirect/map correctly.
<jsivak> (without 'admin' intervention).. trying to avoid work whenever possible. :)
<jrwren> just going for IIS compatility?
<jrwren> AFAIK, that is true of apache too
<jrwren> path_info has been case sensitive forever.
<jrwren> in fact, even case sensitive in IIS if it is an application
<jrwren> its just not case sensitive because NTFS is not case sensitive
<jrwren> an asp.net application would treat it case sensitive in IIS afaik
<jsivak> I thought that apache had an option/mode to process URL's in a case insenstive manner.. nginx chose not to for performance reasons.
<jsivak> in IIS we've only used classic ASP, so we've been able to "ride" on the case-insenstive wagon there.
<jsivak> I think I've see the case issue in one of the .NET apps we inherited recently..
<jrwren> yeah, i think I'm wrong about .NET
<jrwren> mod spelling in apache :)
<Havenstance2> so when is the release time for 14.04? cuz holy shit #ubuntu is blowing up with people asking about it already
<jrwren> lol
<jrwren> patience.
<jrwren> just wait until tomorrow
<Havenstance2> im good :)
<Havenstance2> I'm just finding it comical that they have it in their topic and people are still asking haha
<jrwren> cdimage.ubuntu.com is DDOS
<greg-g> go back in time and get the last beta
<greg-g> the diff between the last beta and release is minimal, there's rarely some weird install issue found/fixed between them
<jrwren> do-release-upgrade
<jrwren> most folks aren't devs and don't understand that its the same thing greg-g
<jrwren> most folks think there is magic in the release version.
<Havenstance2> do you guys know how to make mdadm monitor the raid and email on a status change? I have the email part setup, configured, and I can get test messages from the raid
<jrwren> they are wrong. it isn't magic, it is extra love.
<Havenstance2> but if i unplug to simulate failure nothing happens
<greg-g> jrwren: I assumed Havenstance2 wasn't in the category referred to as 'most folks'
<jrwren> Havenstance2: i do not know that exactly.  I know smartmontools is pretty good at watching disk health
<jrwren> greg-g: nah, definitely not.
<Havenstance2> greg-g, I understand the difference in Beta and Release candidates, all the RC is is a BETA that's been approved for release :)
<jrwren> all a release is, is a beta that has been approvate for release.
<Havenstance2> i've evne played with 14.04 in test machines and I love it
<greg-g> "Alright, change that number and regen the iso!"
<Havenstance2> yup that's about it lol
<Havenstance2> some companies even just rename the same iso lol
<jsivak> .. one step closer to "rolling relase".. heh heh.. (Arch user)
<greg-g> fully automated release based on scm tags is the only one true way
<greg-g> jrwren: coffee is my current upper of choice.
<jrwren> better than alternatives. :)
<greg-g> :)
<jrwren> I do fear I'm on the border line of it effecting greater health
<jrwren> I'd like to get better
<greg-g> I've got other shit to deal with first
<jrwren> ha! don't we all
<greg-g> like, that whole exercise thing
<jrwren> I did an hour on a stationary bike last night :)
<jrwren> I need to do it more than once a week.
<jrwren> I stopped drinking many beers every night of the week.
<jrwren> I thank spring. I'm emerging from winter blues.
<greg-g> in 2010? 2011? I did a 10k in 50ish minutes. Now, shit, no idea how slow I'd be.
<jrwren> WOW! that is fast.
<greg-g> I rocked it.
<mrgoodcat> in 2010 i did 5k in ~18
<jrwren> wait wait... ages?
<greg-g> I was 29?
<jrwren> greg-g is like 32, so he might have been 28 in 2010 :p
<mrgoodcat> i was 18
<jrwren> I was close.
<mrgoodcat> and in high school cross country team
<jrwren> hahah, yeah, mrgoodcat yours doesn't count :p
<greg-g> mrgoodcat: I was gonna say, that's a good HS time ;)
 * greg-g did XC in HS
<jrwren> i mean, awesome for you, but its not the same as being a middle aged man.
<mrgoodcat> haha
<mrgoodcat> no i'm pretty young
<greg-g> take that "mr" out of your nick!
<greg-g> ;)
<mrgoodcat> i was more of a swimmer than a cross country runner though
<goodcat> my cross country time was more of a result of my swimming conditioning than actually being on the XC team
<jrwren> hahahaha
<jrwren> <3 nick change
<greg-g> :) :)
<greg-g> goodcat: or I guess "mrgoodkitten" would also work :P
<goodcat> good cat still keeps the reference intact
<goodcat> so i'm good with it
<greg-g> :)
<jrwren> my ability to run was/is entirely dependent on my bike conditioning
<jrwren> i've NEVER been a runner
<goodcat> biking++
<goodcat> road or mtb?
<jrwren> both
<greg-g> I was a runner first, other things second.
<goodcat> i prefer mtb
<jrwren> i used to prefer mtb, but I learned to appreciate road
<jrwren> mainly for my commute :p
<goodcat> i like road for a different type of conditioning
<goodcat> but mtb is best
<goodcat> i love the challenge of mtb
<jrwren> which is on the road, but its not really RAOD BIKING
<goodcat> what bike do you ride?
<jrwren> Havenstance2: its official http://releases.ubuntu.com/14.04/
<bookiebot> http://is.gd/5PDYGK - Ubuntu 14.04 LTS (Trusty Tahr)
<jrwren> right now, I don't ride a bike. I totalled my old Trek830
<jrwren> I might not get back into biking.
<jrwren> my kid isn't interested in it, and I like to spend time with the kid.
<jrwren> i was hoping we'd bike together, but she is a big wuss
<goodcat> ahhhh totaled? how?
<brousch> jrwren: How old is she?
<goodcat> i ride an older diamondback but it's the equivalent of the overdrive carbon
<goodcat> hardtail, 26.5, full XTR equipment
<goodcat> i want a 29er though
<jrwren> brousch: she is 7, TODAY!!!
<goodcat> and a full suspension would be nice
<greg-g> jrwren: nice, happy birthday to her!
<goodcat> FOX locking front shock
<jrwren> getting 50Mbit download on ubuntu torrent :)
<greg-g> niiiice
<goodcat> jrwren.get_daughters()[0].happy_birthday()
<jrwren> so... i love mtn biking, but I'm not a gear head.
<jrwren> I love hving an old shit bike
<goodcat> well my bike is 2 years younger than i am
<goodcat> so it's not exactly new
<goodcat> but it's been taken care of excellently by my dad
<Havenstance2> jrwren, sweet, time to setup a vm and check it out :)
<greg-g> heh, my bike in grad school was as old as I was
<greg-g> Miyata 310
<greg-g> thing was an awesome fixie
<brousch> jrwren: Last year we did a ride-along bike. My son likes that more than riding his own
<jrwren> 70Mbit now :)
<greg-g> now I'm riding a Lemond Zurich, forget which year, but near the last they made.
<greg-g> Rowan *loves* the ibert
<greg-g> get to chat with him/tell him the things he pointing at with "what's that?!"
<brousch> ah, no this was half a bike you connect to your bike, so the kid gets to peddle
<greg-g> yeah, those are neat too
<greg-g> he's not there yet :)
<goodcat> brousch: I HAD ONE OF THOSE
<goodcat> that's the best
<goodcat> I loved riding with my dad like that
<brousch> ibert does look fun though. Ours is like the back part of this http://collegecyclery.biz/wp-content/uploads/2011/05/ibert_02.jpg
<goodcat> mine was just like that
<brousch> We're trying to transition him to his own bike this year (6-7)
<greg-g> the worst part of the ibert is you need a bike with the right geometry, mine is just barely off where I have to splay my knees a bit at the top of their arch
<greg-g> doing 5-10 miles is fine, but I'm not going to do a century with it :)
<jrwren> lilly loved the trail-a-bike, i thought she'd want to learn solo, but alas :(
<jrwren> sharing ubuntu torrents at 5Mbit... becuase comcast doesn't have limits anymore :)
<brousch> jrwren: Have you tried Scratch yet?
<jrwren> yes.
<jrwren> but not since she has gotten very good at reading.
<jrwren> We are going to be reviewing a raspberry pi programming book for pakt
<brousch> Yeah, reading skills seem ready now
<jrwren> yup. good reader now
<brousch> RPi comes with Scratch
<brousch> but a lot of books also use pygame
<goodcat> comcast doesn't have limits anymore?
<greg-g> monthly bandwidth usage ones
<goodcat> oh
<goodcat> i was gonna say....
<goodcat> i'm definitely still speed limited
<jrwren> lol, of course
<jrwren> no more 250GB/month cap
<jsivak> anyone using wwsgi to host a Pylons/Pyramid site with the number of uwsgi workers > 1?
<jsivak> I'm looking at logging messages to a file and it just dawned on me that uwsgi with workers > 1 means that I've got multiple processes logging to the same file.
<jsivak> Was curious if this has caused issues/prob's with anyone.
<jrwren> i think it cna cause issues, yes.
<jrwren> this is why syslog is good :)
<jsivak> I want the logging to stay "local" to each webapp.
<jsivak> Are the problems with "corrupt/messy" logs, or are they more "sinister" than that?
<jsivak> I haven't seen any problems to-date on our sites.
<jrwren> you just using python logging module
<jsivak> we've been using uwsgi for a few years now, so it's obviously not happening often, but I'm starting to use the  "spooling" function of uwsgi and its raised my awareness of multiple processes logging to the same file.
<jsivak> (been reading about it all day.. I think my eyes are starting to send log messages..)
<goodcat> jsivak: i think bookie maybe?
<jsivak> goodcat: to find out more links/info?
<goodcat> jsivak: what?
<goodcat> you asked who is using pyramids with >1 worker
<goodcat> i think bookie is
<jsivak> goodcat: last I heard rick_h_ was running it with gunicorn, but I'll check with him when he's back from pycon
<jsivak> .. for posterity: it looks like I can either setup logging SocketHandlers or just have the webapp dump its log to stdout/stderr and let uwsgi handle it..
<jrwren> http://i.imgur.com/44rFwrT.gif
<goodcat> i wonder why link wasn't shortened?...
<goodcat> no title attribute
<goodcat> thread died
 * goodcat off to code :)
<brousch> They drove?
<jsivak> brousch: I thought they flew
<goodcat> no idea
<goodcat> i was just trying to explain why he wasn't online
<jsivak> goodcat: you're supposed to be coding..
<jsivak> :P
<goodcat> i'm done
<goodcat> it was easy
<jsivak> lol.. then it wasn't coding..
<goodcat> well, it works
<brousch> def do_everything(): pass
<goodcat> i'm still trying to decide how to handle it
<goodcat> i just made a default no title message
<goodcat> but maybe i should check mime type or something
<goodcat> or google reverse image search on posted images
<goodcat> wouldn't it be cool to reverse image search on a posted image and return the first google result?
<goodcat> would be zacgorman.com for that image
<goodcat> which is good because he is the original author
<goodcat> .reload
<bookiebot> reloaded 22 plugins in 0.009063 seconds
<goodcat> http://i.imgur.com/44rFwrT.gif
<goodcat> :)
<Havenstance2> whats a good solution for offsite backups of files?
<goodcat> jsivak brousch: bookiebot checks content-type header now and only works on text/html
<goodcat> Havenstance2: what platform?
<Havenstance2> goodcat, zentyal,
<goodcat> damn
<goodcat> well backblaze is sweet but winders only
<Havenstance2> I want to store a copy of the files in the storage drives to the boss' server at home.
<Havenstance2> I checked out urbackup but the linux client software seems to be a bitch to get running.
<dzho> everybody got their torrents running?
<Havenstance2> dzho, already downloaded but seeding currently
<goodcat> oh wait you want hosted or not hosted?
<dzho> Havenstance2++
<Havenstance2> goodcat, unhosted, don't want any 3rd parties involved
<goodcat> well i was gonna say spideroak but nope
<goodcat> rsync ftw
<goodcat> just rsync it
<goodcat> backing up to home server is going to be SLOW though
<brousch> Havenstance2: crashplan
<Havenstance2> brousch, thank you. goodcat yeah i know it will be slow. urbackup will work great for all the machines in the building to sync to the server, however the server needs someplace to sync to, the boss wants it at his house most of the files we have are just simple text files or word documents not too large generally
<mathomastech> Anyone know how to pass a multiline string as an argument from the command line to a python file? It appears the interpret \n literally as \n instead of the new line charactor.
<mathomastech> Examples:    python server.py "this is a test" "this is a\n multiline test"
<brousch> That seems like the wrong way to do something
<brousch> send it to a file and pass the file name?
<mathomastech> That might be complicated. This is going to be running on a server where dozens of people may accessing it simultaniously. Each instance of the server.py file must be run uniquely.
<mathomastech> And the passed in parameters will be mostly unique as well.
<brousch> http://stackoverflow.com/questions/749049/passing-a-multi-line-string-as-an-argument-to-a-script-in-windows
<mathomastech> I'm attempting to push most of the processing work of my app off to the server. As it is, the app sucks up network usage like crazy. Mostly just constant pinging. Attempting to have it act more like a socket where the background thread sends off of the info and just idle's until the server returns to info it needs
<goodcat> mathomastech: get the data from stdin then `echo "line 1\nline2" | script.py`
<goodcat> has the added benefit of allowing `cat input | script.py`
<goodcat> time for class
<rick_h_> jsivak: goodcat it's uwsgi with nginx up front in production
<rick_h_> and waitress (pserve) in dev
<cmaloney> man, i go dark from IRC for a bit and all heck breaks loose
<rick_h_> lol
<cmaloney> :)
#ubuntu-us-mi 2014-04-18
<Haven|Home> I think I need to update this box to 14.04 now :)
<Haven|Home> 12.04 is what kinda obsolete? lol
<rick_h_> heh, 14.04 ftw
<Haven|Home> except, this server hosts teamspeak and mysql lol
<Haven|Home> I don't wanna break it yet xD
<Haven|Home> I don't have to have a server version to use mysql server do I? I know I don't with winblows
<goodcat> .words
<bookiebot> {'and', 'all', 'words', "don't", 'is', 'it', 'go', 'have', 'need', 'yet', 'what', 'from', 'for', 'lol', 'to', 'version', 'use', 'box', 'do', 'I', 'breaks', 'loose', 'update', 'dark', 'hi', 'know', 'kinda', 'bit', 'now', 'with', 'a', 'break', 'ftw', 'i', 'server', 'this', 'heck', 'hosts', 'wanna', 'think'}
<goodcat> Ohdeargod
<goodcat> Getting rid of that
<waf> those are indeed words. that module checks out.
<goodcat> Lol
<goodcat> .help
<bookiebot> bmark | bookie | bookie issue helper | chanlist | echo | hash | help | isup | join | memory | message | part | reload | shortlog | sleep | source | system | sysuptime | uptime | url helper
<Havenstance> what are the chances that sudo apt-get dist-upgrade would work for going from 12.04 to 14.04?
<rick_h_> no, it's sudo do-release-upgrade
<rick_h_> and it should work fine LTS to LTS
<Havenstance> okay
<Havenstance> im just gonna make sure i'm fully updated on 12.04
<Havenstance> then i'll run that :)
<Havenstance> had to enable all of the locations in the update windows. then i ran that command and its building it perfectly. thanks rick_h_
<rick_h_> Havenstance: best of luck to you
<Havenstance> rick_h_, thanks, either it works or I break it either way i'm not worried about it
<cmaloney> OK, I just fired up Chrome and it has an "a" on the hamburger stack
<cmaloney> what is that?
<rick_h_> cmaloney: it's something about the desktop manager for chromeos
 * rick_h_ looked it up long ago but can't recall
<goodcat> cmaloney: it's the new chrome toolkit
<goodcat> called aurora
<goodcat> it's only enabled by default in chrome-unstable i think
<goodcat> they switched away from gtk
<goodcat> they wanted to be able to have a less general codebase built specifically for what they wanted
<cmaloney> Right, so it appears I'm using it at the moment
<cmaloney> (aurora)
<goodcat> yes
<goodcat> are you on unstable?
<goodcat> or is it in mainline yet?
<cmaloney> Beta
<goodcat> oh also aurora is default on chromeos
<goodcat> in stable
<goodcat> in chromeos i believe it even encapsulates the entire desktop environment
<goodcat> i do believe the display manager is still X
<greg-g> aurora is a new chrome thing? wtf? can't they think of a name that at least Mozilla doesn't use?
<goodcat> greg-g: sorry aura
<goodcat> just looked it up
<goodcat> not aurora
<greg-g> whew
<goodcat> .system
<bookiebot> Hostname: dyladan.me, Operating System: Linux-3.8.0-29-generic-x86_64-with-Ubuntu-12.04-precise, Python Version: CPython 3.2.3, Architecture: 64bit-ELF, CPU: x86_64
<cmaloney> Morning
<rick_h_> oh kenisis how I missed you...and standing desk...ahhhh
<rick_h_> and morning
<rick_h_> hmm, feeling like I'm missing out on less now...http://r.bmark.us/u/362e1a6f541e8f guess no nest purchase in my future
<bookiebot> http://is.gd/FrDucM - Bookie: Nest Uses Its Data To Turn Electric Utilities Into Cash Cows | TechCrunch
<rick_h_> oh, good call bookiebot
<cmaloney> rick_h_: There's a surprise. :)
<cmaloney> Thing is you're already gettinng this in the form of AC lock-boxes so they can turn the AC off
<Havenstance2> i really hate it when some retard touches shit in my office
<Havenstance2> this is the second time he's broken one of my servers
<rick_h_> Havenstance2: let's try to keep the wording a bit friendlier please
<rick_h_> we all rant in channel, but it's logged and such
<Havenstance2> ya, sorry i tend to forget
<Havenstance2> thanks for the reminder
<Havenstance2> on the plus side, the email works for the raid failure lol
<Havenstance2> he hooked one of the plugs with his broom he said and pulled it out to free it up.... mind you the case was shut with the screws in it last night when I left
<Havenstance2> I gave it to my boss this morning cuz now I have 4 hours to wait before I can do anything with the server.
<rick_h_> man I wish I could chromecast this spacex launch
#ubuntu-us-mi 2014-04-19
<cmaloney> So I went out and picked up a Synology NAS this afternoon
<cmaloney> Going to use it as a backup system for now
<greg-g> cmaloney: coolio
<greg-g> cmaloney: which one?
<rick_h_> morning
<tony-smlr> SMLR Is live now Episode 124 - Video: http://youtu.be/7isiab6A3sM - Audio http://live.smlr.us:8000/streaming (April 19th 2014 @ 8am Eastern time)
<bookiebot> http://is.gd/GtfMRo - SMLR Live Episode 124 - YouTube
<cmaloney> greg-g: Synology 213J
<cmaloney> And Good morning
<mrgoodcat> that video link killed bookiebot
<mrgoodcat> he tried to download it lol
<mrgoodcat> is there a way to get headers only when using the requests module?
<rick_h_> mrgoodcat: make a HEAD request?
<rick_h_> mrgoodcat: http://docs.python-requests.org/en/latest/user/advanced/#http-verbs
<bookiebot> http://is.gd/NXVRkC - Advanced Usage â Requests 2.3.0 documentation
<mrgoodcat> i got it
<rick_h_> mrgoodcat: cool
<mrgoodcat> it wasn't actually the request causing the issue
<mrgoodcat> i was parsing the lxml tree to find the tile
<mrgoodcat> title*
<rick_h_> heh
<mrgoodcat> but that's a problem with an ogg file
<rick_h_> :)
<mrgoodcat> so now i put in some if/then to make it only parse html
<mrgoodcat> for everything else it just says content type
<mrgoodcat> like this https://i.imgur.com/ERV0bwB.png
<mrgoodcat> :/
<mrgoodcat> .reload
<bookiebot> reloaded 24 plugins in 0.048637 seconds
<mrgoodcat> like this https://i.imgur.com/ERV0bwB.png
<bookiebot> http://is.gd/DAmeKs - image/png
<mrgoodcat> :)
<mrgoodcat> Not sure if any of you game or play borderlands but I'll just leave this here https://twitter.com/DuvalMagic/status/457321493924306944
<bookiebot> http://is.gd/3LGBqu - Twitter / DuvalMagic: It seems reddit wants a Linux ...
<cmaloney> mrgoodcat: I'll believe a port when I see it
<cmaloney> That said, I hope there's a port
<cmaloney> (especially of the new Civilization game)
<greg-g> cmaloney: neat, I have a 213.. uh, normal? maybe?
<tjagoda> Hallo
#ubuntu-us-mi 2014-04-20
<cmaloney> mevening
<cmaloney> Evening
<rick_h_> party
<ColonelPanic001> what
<ColonelPanic001> There is no party here.
<tjagoda> Parrrtay
 * ColonelPanic001 did have cake today...
<tjagoda> lol
<rick_h_> easter candy
<cmaloney> Man, I'm really out of it.
<cmaloney> haven't looked at my lists and still have a desk that has bunches of crap on it.
<tjagoda> The caffeine, may it flow through you
<cmaloney> Happy morning Easter thingie
<derekv> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=9SIA1EB1C43500
<bookiebot> http://is.gd/QDgbvt - Newegg.com - Bidet4me MSH-10 Musical Showerhead Waterproof Speaker + Bluetooth + Shower Arm - Value Pack
<derekv> i sortof want it actually
<derekv> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=9SIA15M1GG5507 hahaha
<bookiebot> http://is.gd/3iTTy9 - Newegg.com - Water-Resistent Outdoor BluetoothSpeaker
<cmaloney> http://localhost:5000
<cmaloney> http://localhost:25
<derekv> wrong window?
<cmaloney> Nah, just trying to mess with the bot. :)
<derekv> oh ok lol
<cmaloney> mailto:craig@decafbad.net
<derekv> the planter outdoor bluetooth speaker would actually be cool if it could somehow recharge from sunlight or soil PH or something
<derekv> but you have to plug in to charge it, according to reviews, it doesn't come with aa charger and its not a usb charger, and it's $102
<cmaloney> http://uwstream1.somafm.com:80
<derekv> lol
<cmaloney> ;)
<derekv> hmm do you think?
<derekv> no the bot isn't going to get the data for every link
<cmaloney> Right, but I'm looking to see what it'll try to snag.
<derekv> action HEAD if it hits it at all
<derekv> its probably just sending to that url shortener
<derekv> for $8 TIL i'd say  http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=9SIA0UC0H07017&ignorebbr=1
<bookiebot> http://is.gd/ayPhOx - Angry Birds Air Swimmers Extreme Turbo Remote Controlled Flying Red Bird Balloon - Newegg.com
<cmaloney> why?
<derekv> i mean, seems like $8 worth of fun
<cmaloney> Evening. :)
<rick_h_> survived! barely
<cmaloney> Heh
<cmaloney> Brush With In-Laws, the brushening
#ubuntu-us-mi 2015-04-13
<derekv> daredevil, so dark
<cmaloney> Morning
<brousch> ayep
<greg-g> hah: https://www.globalsign.com/en/ssl/ssl-open-source/
<greg-g> think someone is afraid of letsencrypt?
<cmaloney> What the hell?
#ubuntu-us-mi 2015-04-14
<cmaloney> morning
<_stink_> yo
<cmaloney> Come to MUG tonight. I'm talkiing computer emulators. :)
<brousch> eq
<brousch> ew
<brousch> Run the real thing! Be a man!
<cmaloney> brousch: please to be sending me a Spectrum 48K / Spectrum 128K and Jupiter Ace. :)
<cmaloney> There were only 8,000 made of the Ace so that should be easy. :)
#ubuntu-us-mi 2015-04-15
<cmaloney> Afternoon
<rick_h_> party
<mthx> Afternoon!
<cmaloney> rick_h_: How's travel-life?
<rick_h_> cmaloney: ok, big day is tomorrow
<rick_h_> germany party party
<cmaloney> Woo woo.
<cmaloney> Hope for all the best for you.
<rick_h_> ty :)
#ubuntu-us-mi 2015-04-16
<dzho> cmaloney: did you see where Jupiter cantab the whole *company* was up for sale on ebay at one point?
<dzho> I don't remember if we've talked about this or not, I don't remember you being into the Jupiter Ace
<cmaloney> really?
<cmaloney> that's insane
<cmaloney> I wasn't too much into the Ace, but it did pique my interest
<cmaloney> Seemed like a neat machime that was too quirkly and underpowered for its own good
<cmaloney> Morning
<jcastro> cmaloney, https://www.youtube.com/watch?t=21&v=9x4bfHllX2A
<cmaloney> Nice!
<cmaloney> jcastro: That's awesome. :)
<cscheib> nice non-productive day at the office
<cmaloney> heh
 * greg-g puts on "5 Million Ways to Kill a CEO"
<cmaloney> Might not want to admit that
<cmaloney> Things not going well?
<greg-g> :)
<greg-g> things will be fine
<_stink_> sounds like a mantra
#ubuntu-us-mi 2015-04-17
<cmaloney> Om things will be fine om
<greg-g> :)
<greg-g> _stink_: you're not far from the truth, that's what I've been telling my team all week, which is true, I'm just stressed from the process, not the outcome
<_stink_> process determines at least half of daily satisfaction in my opinion.
<_stink_> REVOLT!
<greg-g> _stink_: oh so true. which is why I had a stress headache each day this week, it'll all be "over" on Tuesday (when we announce the reorg for realz)
<greg-g> not that everyone doesn't already know
<_stink_> so when are you hiring? :)
<greg-g> _stink_: next quarter, aka June-ish
<_stink_> cool!
<jrwren> "If you can't handle me at my worst, then you don't deserve me at my best.â apparently isnât an appropriate response to breaking production.
<rick_h_> jrwren: wtf did you do?
<brousch> rick_h_ with a pony tail http://xkcd.com/1513/
<jrwren> rick_h_: lol :)
<cmaloney> Good morning
<ColonelPanic001> 'morning
<greg-g> yo yo
#ubuntu-us-mi 2015-04-18
<cmaloney> Good morning
<_stink_> hello
<cmaloney> Afternoon now. :)
<cmaloney> Hanging out at the hospital for FIL
<_stink_> scheduled or unscheduled?
<cmaloney> unscheduled, of course. ;)
<_stink_> ah bummer.
<cmaloney> Yeah, no worries.
<cmaloney> I'm in a waiting room with a computer and two folks that stormed in here, changed the channel and promptly fell asleep
<cmaloney> Reminded me a lot of "Keeping Up Apperances" Onslow and his wife
#ubuntu-us-mi 2015-04-19
<tony-smlr> SMLR E149 Live now Video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KXADsfRZvmk Audio: http://live.smlr.us:8000/streaming
<cmaloney> Good morning
<cmaloney> btw: FIL came home last night. They think it was a pinched nerve. Considering what he ate that day I'm thinking it's more busted gut.
<_stink_> hah, gross.
<brousch> gut so busted it pinched a nerve
<derekv> recursion? what's recursion? http://images4.static-bluray.com/reviews/1526_2.jpg
#ubuntu-us-mi 2016-04-18
<cmaloney> Good morning and all that. :)
<widox> morning
 * widox is back in MI
<widox> finally some good weather - was getting worried with the snow; first I've seen it this season!
<cmaloney> widox: Awesome! We missed you!
<cmaloney> (where were you? :) )
<widox> cmaloney: avoiding winter :)
<widox> was down south mainly (GA, SC, FL) also in Portland, OR for a couple months
<cmaloney> Ah, nice!
<cmaloney> I'm surprised you came back. :)
<widox> heh. almost didn't from Portland :-o
<cmaloney> Yeah, I hear the gravitational pull of Portland is pretty high
<mrgoodcat> mornin
<cmaloney> https://www.reddit.com/r/progrockmusic/comments/4f2aat/interstellar_first_step_hans_zimmer_soundtrack/
#ubuntu-us-mi 2016-04-19
<jrwren> greg-g: !!!  i didnt know you were pregnant.  congrats to you and your family.
<cmaloney> ????
<cmaloney> greg-g is sharing the load and getting pregnant this time around?
<cmaloney> Good morning
<_stink_> yo
<mrgoodcat> hi
#ubuntu-us-mi 2016-04-20
<greg-g> :)
<jrwren> hi greg-g
<jrwren> we are mere hours away from release.... right?   ;]
#ubuntu-us-mi 2016-04-21
<cmaloney> ARe we? :)
<cmaloney> time to find the show-stoppers.
<jrwren> well, tomorrow is the previously announced release date.
<cmaloney> God morning
<cmaloney> And God morning
<cmaloney> Dammit
<cmaloney> Good morning. :)
<_stink__> hah
<cmaloney> Just one of those mornings
<_stink__> must be release day...
<_stink__> slorepo
<jrwren> zomg its only thursday!?!?
<jrwren> it needs to be friday
<jrwren> yay release day! seed them torrents!
<cscheib> when is official 16.04 release time, dammit
<cscheib> I want to spin up some servers.
<jrwren> torrents and isos are up.
<jrwren> i don't know when cloud images are up.
<cscheib> are they up? the ones I see are still tagged with beta
<cscheib> http://releases.ubuntu.com/16.04/
<cscheib> there's still mention of beta there
<jcastro> grab a daily?
<jcastro> 24 hours, nbd
<jrwren> http://releases.ubuntu.com/xenial/ afaik
<jcastro> cscheib: https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-announce/2016-April/000207.html
<jcastro> enjoy!
<jrwren> yay!
<jcastro> I wish we got the day off
<jrwren> lol.
<jcastro> jrwren: GO BACK TO WORK
<jrwren> oh, I am HARD at work. believe me.
<_stink_> i need an adult!
<cmaloney> Ubuntu 16.04 LTS is the first long-term support release available for
<cmaloney> the new "s390x" architecture for IBM LinuxONE and z Systems, as well
<cmaloney> as introducing the new Ubuntu MATE community flavour.
<cmaloney> Fuck yeah! Now I can be on a LTS!
<jcastro> jrwren: hard at work breaking production? awwwwww yeahhhhhh...
<jrwren> jcastro: that was NOT me. (this time.)
<cscheib> cool
<cscheib> the md5 is the same as what I was downloading earlier that was allegedly "beta"
<jrwren> cscheib: nice!
<cmaloney> "It was discovered that the PHP..."
<cmaloney> (insert bad thing)
<Zimdale> PHP is always followed by bad things =(
<cmaloney> Yeah, no joke
#ubuntu-us-mi 2016-04-22
<cmaloney> Good morning
<cmaloney> http://www.oreilly.com/business/free/build-to-lead.csp
<_stink_> if anyone knows a PHP dev who has some other skills and/or has lots of wordpress experience... my team is hiring
<cmaloney> heh
<widox> "other skills" -- reminds me of a Liam Neeson quote...
<widox> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B0hZ1KKpV54
<_stink_> haha
<Scary_Guy> anyone around?  I'm stumped.  Says I have no space for the upgrade and I'm using 8gb of a 1tb drive for the media center for the living room
<gamerchick02> that's weird
<gamerchick02> do you have to drives?
<gamerchick02> *two i mean
<Scary_Guy> nope
<Scary_Guy> it's a thin client, don't think I could fit two drives in it
<Scary_Guy> oh, weird, it's just partitioned stupid
<jrwren> i should have suggested that. it was my guess, but I thought... nah...
<gamerchick02> oh dang yeah. makes sense. sorry i'm in the bugcast right now and it's really active
<Scary_Guy> it's cool, was a shot in the dark anyway.  partition seems okay though so I'm not sure.  I don't partition much and it's encrypted with the unencrypted boot partition in front
<Scary_Guy> I'm searching google, was just wondering if anyone here ran into anything similar
<gamerchick02> i have not, i'm sorry.
#ubuntu-us-mi 2016-04-23
<godfather_> hello
<cmaloney> GOod morning
<_stink_> yo
<cmaloney> yo yo
#ubuntu-us-mi 2016-04-24
<cmaloney> Afternoon
<jrwren> zomg, good evening.
<cmaloney> evening
#ubuntu-us-mi 2017-04-17
<rick_h> morning
<_stink_> yo
<shakes808> morning
<rick_h> ugh, love it when my wife offers to make coffee...hate it when she burns it each time
<rick_h> rick thinks in case anyone is interested: https://twitter.com/mitechie/status/853952365455708161 :)
<shakes808> rick_h: keurig?
<rick_h> shakes808: oh hell no
<rick_h> moka pot
<shakes808> rick_h: You're FANCY!  ;) haha
<rick_h> shakes808: heh, just like coffee :)
<rick_h> have to put that fancy grinder to good use
<shakes808> i guess so.   at a previous  job, we had something like this -> https://goo.gl/ZaGgYB
<shakes808> our president LOVES coffee and his expressos.
<rick_h> yea, not gotten into an expresso maker
<rick_h> I fear the day I break that barrier
<rick_h> but do have a bi-weekly shipment of fresh beans from peet's coffee and the nice kitchenaid grinder and <3 moka pot brewing
<rick_h> though getting into pour over for the camper. Easier to do there.
<shakes808> they are pretty good.  Was addicted to "red eyes" :) and since it was free, i drank them everyday :)
<rick_h> lol nice
<mrgoodcat> don't hate i got my moka pot bc rick_h recommended it at chc
<cmaloney> I have yet to get th emoka pot
<rick_h> lol, how do you like it mrgoodcat ?
<mrgoodcat> I like it a lot
<cmaloney> But I already have a grind and brew from Melita. ;)
<mrgoodcat> I still tend to use the french press more often though
<rick_h> yea, my wife finds the french press faster and easier to clean
<mrgoodcat> basically the way I feel
<mrgoodcat> also moka is more espresso-y
<rick_h> yea
<rick_h> since I latte it up I like that about it
<mrgoodcat> I tend to drink black coffee
<mrgoodcat> we also get cold brew delivered to work from chazanno so I drink a lot of that
<rick_h> nice
<rick_h> I've not gotten into the cold side yet.
<mrgoodcat> its sweeter definitely
<shakes808> +1 mrgoodcat on the black coffee. why ruin the great taste?!
<mrgoodcat> I started drinking black because the cream and sugar isn't good for you
<mrgoodcat> but now I actually prefer it
<widox> no Aeropress users?
 * widox sips his freshly made cup
<widox> https://aerobie.com/product/aeropress/
 * cmaloney doesn't mention https://decentespresso.com/
<rick_h> widox: I keep wanting to try it, but you have to buy into the whole system which has turned me off so far
<widox> cmaloney: I hope you have one of these for your espresso machine ;) https://decentespresso.com/dem_suitcase
<cmaloney> Naturally
<widox> rick_h: its only the ~$30 device
<cmaloney> If I'm travelling anywhere I have to take my espresso machine. ;)
<rick_h> lol https://decentespresso.com/dem_suitcase this is going to change my popularity at sprints!
<widox> and it comes with a ton filters, that will last forever (I use mine more then once)
<rick_h> widox: shouldn't you be getting coffee flights at some awesome hidden coffee shop in Detroit? :P
<mrgoodcat> widox: i used to aeropress
<mrgoodcat> it was my first "craft" coffee experience
<brousch__> Black coffee from French press ++
<brousch__> It's actually easy to do cold in French press too. Put in the grounds, add cold water, leave it in the fridge overnight
<widox> rick_h: hah. well sometimes I like to stay home :D
<widox> french press is good. I'm usually just to lazy to clean it; aeropress is easier
<brousch__> I rinse it and throw it in the dish washer
<rick_h> ok, it's manipulated and all but still kind of impressive/cool https://twitter.com/xwithmywoes/status/853427567604445185
<cmaloney> I can see why nobody wants to use jslint
<cmaloney> "for (i = 0; i < tile_input.length; i++) {"
<cmaloney> "Expected '+= 1' and instead saw '++'."
<cmaloney> Um, OK
<Zimdale> O.o
<Zimdale> There's usually settings
<jrwren> eslint > jslint
<Zimdale> I hear jshint is decent too
<cmaloney> jshint didn't return anything
<cmaloney> so I knew it was full of shit.
<Zimdale> lol
<Zimdale> "MY CODE IS BAD, I KNOW THIS BECAUSE IT'S JAVASCRIPT!"
<cmaloney> Yeah
<cmaloney> I'm using it as a bit of a tutor (much like C linting) and it's making me more confused than anything
<cmaloney> partially because Crockford is a little opinionated on the for loop.
<mrgoodcat> cmaloney: I think they disallow the increment operator because when people use it inline with other arithmetic operators it is confusing to some programmers
<mrgoodcat> and even when it isn't confusing it unnecessarily increases cognitive load
<mrgoodcat> Â¯\_(ã)_/Â¯
<mrgoodcat> like when you see lines like `x = i++ + --j * k--`
<mrgoodcat> and you're like why would you do that :facepalm:
<mrgoodcat> basically disallow anything that allows people to be stupid because if they are allowed then they will in fact be stupid
<cmaloney> mrgoodcat: Right, I've seen the C code where the puzzle is to figure out ++c + c--
<cmaloney> And yeah, don't be stupid. ;)
<mrgoodcat> i think the lesson is that people will use the tools you give them
<mrgoodcat> even if that means using a bandsaw instead of scissors because bandsaws are cool
<mrgoodcat> people use the inc/dec operators purely to make the line shorter, rather than as index/counter or other things that make sense
<mrgoodcat> also why would you not just tile_input.map(fn) instead?
<Zimdale> Usually people use foreaches too.
<cmaloney> Zimdale: Yeah
#ubuntu-us-mi 2017-04-18
<cmaloney> Well, I figured out one of the issues and frustrations I was having with jslint / jshint
<cmaloney> Apparently the jshint plugin for vim ships with a very outdated jshint version
<cmaloney> worse, there were several copies of that jshint version installed in the .vim directory
<cmaloney> ugh
<brousch__> cmaloney: Are you going to PyOhio this year?
<cmaloney> brousch__: Planning on it
<cmaloney> Submitted a proposal for a talk
<brousch__> I haven't decided, but leaning towards yes
<brousch__> Carpooling?
<cmaloney> Depends on who all is going
<cmaloney> But yeah, planning on driving down
<brousch__> I have a GRPUG friend who moved to Tha D. He might be interested in carpooling from there.
<cmaloney> Whereabouts in the D?
<rick_h> cmaloney: heh if the wife's van ever comes in we can get a party bus going!
<brousch__> Downtown D, near Grand Circus I think
<cmaloney> rick_h: Are you planning on driving down as well?
<rick_h> cmaloney: I think so. Erica has the time off and I submitted a couple of talks
<cmaloney> Oh cool!
<rick_h> Yea, hopefully one of them gets accepted and will be fun stuff
<cmaloney> \o/
<brousch__> Wait, rick_h still does Python?
<rick_h> brousch__: sometimes :P
<rick_h> brousch__: the question is more "Rick still does programming?"
<rick_h> brousch__: but I have a couple of things to chat on
<brousch__> I haven't done much programming since 2015. At my current job it's mostly config management: a bunch of Jinja!
<cmaloney> sounds like a talk to me
<brousch__> I gave it last night :P
<rick_h> "templating for the mega power user!"
<cmaloney> "Ginger Ginsing Ninja Jinja"
<cmaloney> You'll have to play with it some more, but there you go
<rick_h> lol
<jrwren> at least it isn't Cheetah.
<rick_h> +100
 * rick_h gets the shakes at the thought
 * jrwren grumbles something about juju
<cmaloney> (context?)
<jrwren> Cheetah is an obsolete & abandoned python templating system.
<rick_h> cmaloney: cheetah was an xml based python template system
<cmaloney> Oh. Glad I missed that.
<rick_h> and I HATED trying to do everything in this xml crazy syntax world...guess it's like react :P
 * cmaloney got in when it was "Mako vs. Jinja".
<rick_h> I hated my encouters with it
<rick_h> yea, mako ftw
<jrwren> rick_h: you've seen charm utils, right? :p
<rick_h> jrwren: is it cheetah?
<jrwren> rick_h: yes.
<jrwren> rick_h: there is a reason it doesn't run in python3
 * rick_h adds a new todo list item...get rid of that
<rick_h> ugh
<rick_h> wtf
<cmaloney> Are you fucking kidding me?
<jrwren> rick_h: wtf indeed.
<cmaloney> The last release was in 12010
<cmaloney> (2010)
<jrwren> cmaloney: welcome to juju
<cmaloney> I'm not much for the cult of the new, but the cult of the moribund and necrotizing isn't great either.
<jrwren> cmaloney: in its defense, said library is at least 3 yrs old.
<cmaloney> I guess there's something to be said for not having Cheetah change on you
<cmaloney> but still, XML templating?
<cmaloney> I'd want to shoot myself.
<cmaloney> .rst is bad enough with its pickiness. I'd hate to add XML pickiness on top of it.
 * cmaloney finally canceled his Ars Technica subscription
<cmaloney> was subscribed to the full news feed, but realized most of what's there is phone sales, equipment plugs, car plugs, and Expanse spoilers.
<jrwren> lol
<jrwren> it is telling that their "tech" link at top of page links to /gadgets
<cmaloney> yeah
<jrwren> as if they are the same
<cmaloney> Worse, i would put the good articles in my "read and review" folder, and then never read them
<rick_h> yea, haven't watched ars for much lately
<cmaloney> so figured what's the point of paying for it if I'm not using it
<cmaloney> sadly the only place I have for tech news is Reddit
<cmaloney> which is about one step up from Hacker News
<greg-g>  /.!
<greg-g> ;)
<cmaloney> craigmaloney writes: "As a concerned Linux and FLOSS person who was previously employed by Geeknet I find that Slashdot's articles tend to have a rambling quality to them based ont eh community of people who make them"
<cmaloney> that and the ouster of cmdrtaco / hemos left a bitter taste in my mouth
<cmaloney> not that they haven't done well for themselves (and likely should have left a while ago)
 * greg-g nods
<cmaloney> I know, new management
<greg-g> cmaloney: did you ever know Wes Moran?
<brousch__> I still subscribe to some of /.
<cmaloney> Yeah, he was the designer for SF.net and Slashdot
<cmaloney> good person, and one of the better designers I've worked with
<cmaloney> (which isn't saying much because I rarely worked with designers)
<cmaloney> but he set a pretty high bar
<greg-g> cmaloney: he was my boss at WMF for the past year or so (we didn't have a CTO, so he being VP of Product took on the responsibilities while we hired)
<cmaloney> Oh cool
<greg-g> yeah, I like him a lot, he left WMF a bit ago (2 months or so)
<cmaloney> Ah, neat. Hopefully to something more awesome
<jrwren> is that Wes from down in Tecumseh?
<brousch__> What could be more awesome than WMF?
<jrwren> oh, nope.
<jrwren> too many people named Wes :)
<cmaloney> https://www.linkedin.com/in/westonnh
<greg-g> yeah, his plan was to actually honestly take a break for a bit, not sure how long
<cmaloney> I can imagine WMF VP of Product would burn one out pretty quickly
<greg-g> especially doing what he was doing: also having all of Tech report to him (just in managerial reasons, not wrt actual work, we're pretty self-governing, badly-ish ;) )
<greg-g> he worked hard, too, and was a remotie from NH
<greg-g> I loved that part for my own personal reasons, made it way easier for me to stop commuting the 2 hours each way twice/week :)
<greg-g> (that and baby #2)
<cmaloney> Yeah, no doubt
<jrwren> how old are the kids now, greg-g ?
<brousch__> That's one heck of a commute
<brousch__> Like me commuting to Ann Arbor from GR
<jrwren> 'cept that is 120mi. greg-g would be going 20miles. :p
<cmaloney> yeah, California has a transit problem
<greg-g> :)
<greg-g> especially northbay, going over the GGB is a huge bottle neck, and the only other option is the ferry which is $$$
<greg-g> but yeah, 40 miles :P (it's like commuting from SF to Mountain View, but without the option of taking CalTrain)
<greg-g> jrwren: Rowan is 5 and Terran turned 1 on Sunday(!!!!)
<jrwren> HAPPY BIRTHDAY!
<jrwren> I knew it was about now. He shares birthday with my Dad who would have been 70.
<jrwren> And my girl turned 10 yesterday.
<greg-g> awesome
<cmaloney> ++
<greg-g> it's hard for me because 4 days before Terran was born the pregnant wife of one of my team members died suddenly and the child didn't make it. And I like/would consider myself friends with him. So yeah, it's effing tough. He had to take last week off because of obvious reasons.
<cmaloney> :(
<cmaloney> Yeah, that's one hell of an anniversary. :(
<jrwren> It hurts. I can't imagine that amount of loss.
<greg-g> he's in a group that calls themselves the Shitty Widowers Club
<jrwren> ha! It is great that he found a group.
<greg-g> the humor they share is pretty dark :)
<cmaloney> I can imagine
<gamerchick02> trying out budgie. anyone in here give it a whirl?
<rick_h> Not here
<cmaloney> not i
<gamerchick02> ok
<gamerchick02> was just wondering if anyone had an opinion
<gamerchick02> it looks slick
<brousch__> All of my encounters with budgies involve a stick covered in bird seed and poop on my hat
<cmaloney> as one does
<gamerchick02> i got an operating system not found error on reboot
<gamerchick02> hrm
<gamerchick02> i'll mess with it another night
#ubuntu-us-mi 2017-04-19
<jrwren> i dont' understand what budgie is.
<jrwren> from where did it come?
<jrwren> There was no info about just what the ubuntu budgie remix is on the ubuntu budgie remix website. What is this budgie desktop? What is its pedigre?
<jrwren> Why would I choose it over any other?
<jrwren> I really don't understand linux desktop alt people. /r/ubuntu suffers from this to. It seems like the only thing people care about is the bling and nothing about actually using a computer to get work done.
<jrwren> I realized recently that I have zero interest overlap with the linux desktop community because I care zero about bling and I only care about being able to accomplish tasks at hand.
<jrwren> This is probably why I never gave a damn about unity. It did nothing to help me accomplish tasks I needed to get done. It only hindered them by taking away features that I was used to in either gnome or kde.
<cmaloney> I'm not a fan of KDE's customizability because it borders on fidgety
<cmaloney> I can fidget with it all day
<cmaloney> but I also don't like the minimalism of stripped-down GNOME
<hpucks> I like Mate these days.
<hpucks> Simple, yet still customizable if that's what you want.
<hpucks> And in my opinion Gnome 2 was the best at getting things done.
<shakes808> Morning all.  Not sure if any of you are StarCraft players, but they are remastering it with better graphics.  And the old one is free: https://starcraft.com/en-us/articles/20674424
<mrgoodcat> morning
<cmaloney> Good morning
<widox> morning
<greg-g> jrwren: ^^
<greg-g> Jay is the only starcraft player I know, and he was/is crazy about it :)
<jrwren> yup
<jrwren> :)
<jrwren> i played a few last night, and a few the night before that ;)
<brousch__> I used to play it way back when
<cmaloney> https://www.peppercarrot.com/en/article408/my-house-has-been-robbed
<shakes808> that sucks
<cmaloney> Yeah
#ubuntu-us-mi 2017-04-20
<cmaloney> Morning
<wolfger> morning
<rick_h> wet morning
<wolfger> chilly morning
<cmaloney> Yes to all of those
<shakes808> jrwren: you play solo or online?
<jrwren> shakes808: online.
<shakes808> I will download it again and will play against you! :)  It has been about 8 years since I have played
<jrwren> ha!
<jrwren> I play SC2: LotV, which is not free... but... custom games are free, so I guess we can still play against one another :)
<shakes808> I am talking about SC1: BW
<shakes808> I never bought SC2 yet
<jrwren> i do not play that.
<jrwren> but, you don't need to buy sc2 to play it.
<jrwren> you can download sc2 and play some free missions and you can play the arcade.
<shakes808> ????
<jrwren> the only thing you need to buy sc2 for is full campaign and ladder.
<jrwren> yes, sc2 has a lot of free content.
<shakes808> well, ladder is where it is at :)
<jrwren> true
<shakes808> but SC1 is free, the un-remastered version
<shakes808> I own it, but others can get it free now :)
<jrwren> yes. I have no interest in that. Sorry.
<shakes808> I think full game and online play
<shakes808> :P
<shakes808> What about HotS?
<jrwren> it was good. I played it when it was current.
<jrwren> WoL too.
<shakes808> WoL?
<jrwren> wings of liberty
<shakes808> Ah, SC2.. I will try to pick that up.
<shakes808> What about D2:LoD?
<cmaloney> Docker is now Moby
<cmaloney> that is awesome
<Zimdale> can't wait for mobycon
<cmaloney> Can't wait for Moby fans to get confused about Moby Containers.
<Zimdale> mobycon best feature moby
<jrwren> D2... not in a VERY long time.
<jrwren> I have been playing D3 a little bit this season.
<jrwren> D3 has changed A LOT since the launch of hte game. it is almost like a completely different game than when it launched
<shakes808> Is it getting back to what it used to be?  I was playing Path of Exile a little bit and thought, "this is what D3 should have been"
<jrwren> i'm not sure.
<jrwren> its still character building, but that is waht D has always been.
<jrwren> campaign is a breeze now, even on harder modes.
<jrwren> when it first came out, it was MUCH harder. I dont knwo what changed.
<jrwren> but they've made it so that when you get to level 70, there are still MORE abilities and missions.
<jrwren> its endless.
<cmaloney> the D
<shakes808> sweet.  i have been reluctant to pick it up.  but i have some friends that play and they have been trying to get me to play ( console and pc )
<jrwren> D3 on console?
<shakes808> XBox / PS4 has D3.  Not sure how I would like that
<jrwren> i can't imagine playing it that way.
<shakes808> right?!
<jrwren> but then, I never could play FPS on console.
<shakes808> I know three people that play it on a console
<shakes808> I play CoD:BO3 on XB
<shakes808> that and Netflix haha
<jrwren> ha!
<shakes808> all other is on PC
<jrwren> we have a Wii.
<jrwren> not a Wii U.
<jrwren> I am not a gamer. I just happen to play sc2 and d3.
<shakes808> haha
<shakes808> what about some team fortress?
<jrwren> never
<jrwren> a few hrs of ESO when it was in beta.
<jrwren> a few minutes of overwatch when it was open beta
<jrwren> a few minutes of cardstone/hearthstone
<jrwren> all enough to determine those games are not for me.
<shakes808> gotcha.
<shakes808> should pick up some TF :) it is fun game :)
<shakes808> I need to try overwatch
<shakes808> Haven't tried ESO yet. but played ES lightly.
<jrwren> i never played ES :)
<jrwren> I know skyrim was hugely popular and loved.
<cmaloney> There are only two games that I play regularly: Civ and MOO
<jrwren> what is MOD?
<cmaloney> Master of Orion
<cmaloney> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zgeVXG9ambk
<shakes808> MOO looks interesting
<shakes808> apparently firefox doesn't like the console.log?  works in chrome.
<cmaloney> shakes808: Seems to work in the version of Firefox that I have
<cmaloney> Are you sure you haven't accidentally re-defined it? :P
<shakes808> no, just doing a console.log(blah); and the dev tools weren't logging anything in the console.  I switched over to chrome and their dev tools were picking up all my logs :(
<jrwren> weird.
<jrwren> MOO looks like Settlers of Catan a gazillion times more complex and in space :p
<cmaloney> It's closest to Civilization
<cmaloney> but it's very cool
<shakes808> I hear the Civ series is a good one to play.  need to try that out one of these days as well
<rick_h> ouch, CIV is $60 and has in app purchases?
<cmaloney> There's several versions of Civ out there.
<cmaloney> Civ V is $30
<jrwren> $60 is kind of the going rate for new games, right?
<cmaloney> Yeah
<cmaloney> And the Anthology is $30
<jrwren> I remember paying $50 or $60 for Civ3 for linux to support gaming on linux. I never played said game. LOL
<cmaloney> Which includes Civ III, IV, V, and BE
<jrwren> I may even still have the packaging somewehre.
<cmaloney> Civ II you mean
<cmaloney> 3 was never out for Linux
<cmaloney> and II was part of the Loki Activision deal
<jrwren> ah.
<jrwren> then yes, II
<cmaloney> So jealous. :)
<jrwren> you want it for your bookshelves?
<cmaloney> That's the one release that I managed to avoid
<jrwren> i just checked. I was wrong. no packaging. just a CD and jewel case.
<rick_h> yea, guess I've not bought a game in a long time, figured CIV is CIV, but this is CIV VI
<cmaloney> CIV V introduced hex movement and a whole bunch of other changes
<cmaloney> Not played VI yet
<rick_h> I played the early CIV but not sure I did post-III
<rick_h> really surprised they don't have it on android. Seems like a very good phone style game
<jrwren> hrm, good point.
<cmaloney> They had a version called "Revolutions"
<cmaloney> I think that's on Android. It's a stripped-down version
<brousch__> freeciv is free
#ubuntu-us-mi 2017-04-21
<shakes808> I will have to try  freeciv
<cmaloney> morning
<rick_h> morning
<cmaloney> sitting at urgent care because my eyeball
<jrwren> :(
<jrwren> good morning to you.
<rick_h> ugh, good luck
<rick_h> I hope your eyeball continues to keep it's ball-ness
<cmaloney> watering and sore throat and sinus fun
<cmaloney> sorry, they called while i was typing
<rick_h> ugh, may this cold be a fast one
<cmaloney> thanks. unfortunately last night i had to get up a few times to soak my eye yo get it to open
<cmaloney> (yay)
<jrwren> :(
<cmaloney> bbl
<shakes808> hope all is well cmaloney
<jrwren> if you really want to get your nerd on this weekend: http://www.namesexposition.com/expo.htm
<cmaloney> shakes808: thanks
<cmaloney> jrwren: very cool
<brousch__> Freakish. Pink eye?
<jrwren> or very bad alergy?
<cmaloney> Hoping it's just bad allergies
<shakes808> cmaloney: any updates?  Allergies?
<cmaloney> think so
<cmaloney> typical urgent care: here are some antibiotics, here is some flo-nase
<cmaloney> and get some allergy eyedrops
<jrwren> :(
<jrwren> antibiotics when tehre is no verified bacterial infection is fail.
<shakes808> yeah, UC doesn't really emphasize on the C
<shakes808> https://us.battle.net/account/download?show=classic
<greg-g> jrwren: /me restrains self from ranting on our healthcare system and "urgent care" in-depth-ness
<jrwren> greg-g: oh please do rant.
<jrwren> i had to go to ER instead of UC on Sunday evening because all UC in town was closed.
<greg-g> :/
<greg-g> I had to go to an urgent care facility for my worker's comp doctor. So basically, instead of seeing a specialist our workers comp insurance company (separate from the normal ins comp we can select) made me see some random phys every 3 weeks. Worth. Less.
<cmaloney> ugh
<greg-g> I had to fight them (insurance comp) to see an actually qualified physical therapist that is in my town and not 20 miles away and at an urgent care facility.
<cmaloney> "What brings you in today?" "Fucked up insurance"
<jrwren> i retract my application to work for WMF.
<greg-g> heh, our normal insurance options are great
<jrwren> oh. i retract my retraction
<greg-g> workers comp is generally a cheaper insurance that companies get
<cmaloney> yeah
<greg-g> 100% paid by WMF, including dependants. And if you choose the HSA-compat option they'll give you ~$5k each year.
<greg-g> (to put in your HSA)
<brousch__> https://hackernoon.com/the-javascript-phenomenon-is-a-mass-psychosis-57adebb09359
<cmaloney> yes
<greg-g> are those... female nipples! we only allow male nipples to be shown in the great USA.
<cmaloney> they're artistic nipples
<cmaloney> and yes, this is precisely how I feel
<cmaloney> i swear if brainfuck was released in Netscape we'd be talking about v8 brainfuck, and nodebf for the server
<jrwren> is this the same author who wrote the recent one that I loved
<jrwren> ?
 * jrwren checks.
<cmaloney> and?
<jrwren> nope.
<jrwren> i literally JUST found it.
<jrwren> I was thinking of "electron is flash for the desktop"
<cmaloney> ah
<jrwren> this looks so good: https://fosspost.org/2017/04/19/ubuntu-budgie-17-04-review/?utm_content=buffer89489&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=buffer
<shakes808> jrwren: that looks nie
<shakes808> nice*
#ubuntu-us-mi 2017-04-22
<cmaloney> morning
<jrwren> good morning
<cmaloney> How's the morning so far?
<jrwren> watching this on the big screen: https://youtu.be/UrvuydoI-eE
<jrwren> waiting for vacation.
<jrwren> eggs and toast were delicious, so I'll say the morning is great.
<jrwren> How are you cmaloney ?  any better?
<cmaloney> Still got the sinus thing going
<cmaloney> it's a little disgusting to go into details, but it seems things are getting backed up
<cmaloney> But have been able to get relief
<cmaloney> Mmmm... Eggs and toast sound yummy
<cmaloney> Having Tofu Scramble and Iraqi bread
#ubuntu-us-mi 2017-04-23
<cmaloney> morning
<_stink_> yo
<cmaloney> How's the morning?
<cmaloney> reminder: the release party is this friday at Penguicon
<cmaloney> (That reminder is for me to put it on the calendar)
<cmaloney> http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/ubuntu-us-mi/3557-ubuntu-michigan-loco-1704-release-party/
<brousch__> My body aches from yard work
<cmaloney> wheee
<jrwren> sounds fun.
<shakes808> evening all
<cmaloney> Evening
<shakes808> how are your allergies doing this weekend?
<cmaloney> Finally succumbed to taking an allergy pill
<cmaloney> We'll see if misery is my friend come monday
<shakes808> misery loves company
<shakes808> so they say
#ubuntu-us-mi 2018-04-16
<jrwren> don't forget to file your taxes. :)
<cmaloney> ok
<rick_h_> fortunately we kept power, the in-laws lost it down in grosse pointe
<rick_h_> but they had a generator installed and I think were actually kind of giddy to test that out heh
<waldo323> good morning
<waldo323> rick_h_, do you know which way it is fueled?
<rick_h_> waldo323: I believe natural gas
<waldo323> oooo I've heard good things.  I hope it worked well for them
<rick_h_> yea, we got a couple of status reports calls and seemed things worked out for them
<waldo323> thats good
<cmaloney> Yeah, we managed to keep power this time around
<cmaloney> I unplugged everything when the power was fluctiating
<cmaloney> fluctuating
<jrwren> smart
<jrwren> i always forget to do that.
<cmaloney> Yeah, I usually do too; especially if it's right before everything goes dark. :)
#ubuntu-us-mi 2018-04-17
<_stink_> just got power back an hour ago
<_stink_> we were out since sunday morning
<greg-g> wow
<rick_h_> _stink_: ouch, glad you're back in action
<rick_h_> my inlaws lost for most of sunday but had it back that night
<cmaloney> _stink_: Ugh. That sucks
<rick_h_> I didn't know it was still going on
<cmaloney> we had some flickering over here.
<cmaloney> so you must be over by the south-end of Royal Oak then
 * cmaloney is blanking on the actual location
<_stink_> we're right by the high school... wrapped up in the outage that impacted much of clawson
<cmaloney> Oh right
<cmaloney> Yeah, that whole area was goofed up
<cmaloney> Though when we got back from Meijer 34 we came down 14 mile. When we left it wasn't up. When we got back last night it was
<cmaloney> (Yes, I remember Meijer store numbers.)
<jrwren> How do you even know store numbers?
<_stink_> haha.
<_stink_> now.. what to do with the freezer stuff.
<_stink_> that's mostly rhetorical
<cmaloney> jrwren: Well, I worked at that Meijer in Royal Oak for many a summer
<jrwren> oh man, the blackout of 2001 was so fun. I got to eat so much ice cream that first night of hte outage!   :)
<cmaloney> so.. um...
<cmaloney> They print the store number on the receipt
<_stink_> hah, we chugged the milk at 5pm on sunday
<cmaloney> the one in Madison Heights is 222
 * cmaloney dates himself by noting that he worked at Meijer when they had a bottle return staffed by people.
<cmaloney> and a party pantry
<greg-g> what's a party pantry, grandad?
<cmaloney> and pet and garden when they had hamsters and pets weren't over by grocery
<cmaloney> greg-g: It's like a party store inside Meijer that had an outside door
<cmaloney> so folks could get their 40oz before / after work
<_stink_> greg-g++
<cmaloney> I remember when Meijer had an electronics departmet at the front of the store
<cmaloney> and an arcade
<cmaloney> and an Oasis where you could leave your children
<cmaloney> unsupervised
<greg-g> good old fashioned abductions
<cmaloney> Yeah, none of these new-fangled social media luring
<greg-g> :)
<cmaloney> just make a selection in the middle of Meijer and off you go
<cmaloney> One Stop Shopping at the M.T.A.
<cmaloney> (Meijer Thrifty Acres)
<cmaloney> wow, that turned dark quick.
<cmaloney> Anywho... um... yeah, that's how I know the store numbers.
<cmaloney> _stink_: Glad you got power back.
<_stink_> nice try, changing the subject :P
<cmaloney> Was it that obvious? :)
<rick_h_> hah
<rick_h_> "look everyone! puppies!" https://photos.app.goo.gl/kzhY5wPo1w548tyD3
<jrwren> I missed where it went dark.
<jrwren> Abductions?
<jrwren> I've never heard of an abduction from a child care center at a retail store. I don't think they happen.
<cmaloney> rick_h_: Awwwww!!!!
<rick_h_> damn sometimes I realize how spoiled amz has made things. I'm like "didn't I order something..." and have to go look it up because if it was amz it'd be here but for other places it takes 3 days just to ship
<cmaloney> jrwren: I'm sure the fear was worse than the threat ever was
<cmaloney> rick_h_: yeah, Amazon really does spoil you
<rick_h_> I got a shipped notice on a thing I ordered last week I forgot I ordered
<rick_h_> oh...well that's good I guess
<rick_h_> yea, puppies! going to be a fun summer with the new puppy in the house (in 2months)
<rick_h_> like having a kid again...waking up the middle of the night, can't go places, etc.
<_stink_> you sell it so well
<rick_h_> I'm trying to prepare my wife
<rick_h_> she's forgotten how much work it was
<rick_h_> "OMG it's going to be amazing!"
<rick_h_> ummm yea...after I spent 8months training it :P
<rick_h_> until then guard your shoes!
<_stink_> hah
<jrwren> ugh.
<jrwren> that is why I don't have a dog.
<jrwren> but then I see dogs and I really really want one. :)
<rick_h_> I've wanted this dog since I was about 10...only taken 30 years to finally get there
<rick_h_> so I'll take the work to get there.
<cmaloney> Get a cat. They're like a dog that doesn't give a shit about you. :)
<rick_h_> don't, they freaking live forever, puke on the floor, and get hair on everything. biggest regret is getting our cats
 * cmaloney <3s dogs but unfortunately my allergies prevent us from getting a dog. :)
<cmaloney> Aw c'mon. They're love-buckets.
<cmaloney> Pixel managed to get into the turkey during thanksgiving and horked up on the kitchen floor when we had company over
 * rick_h_ can't wait to be a cat-less house one day
<rick_h_> but to each their own :P
<cmaloney> heh
<jrwren> can't do cats because of alergies.
<cmaloney> You do realize they'll live to be 10
<cmaloney> 100
<jrwren> might not be able to do dogs either, but I might be willing to suffer.
<cmaloney> yeah, cat allergies are common.
<rick_h_> they're 12 now....
<rick_h_> and show no signs of dying
<rick_h_> #@%$@%$#@'ers
<jrwren> lol
<cmaloney> My parents' cat lived to 20+
<rick_h_> oh stfu
<rick_h_> I don't need to hear that
<cmaloney> 12 is middle-age for a cat. :)
<rick_h_> I'm holding out hope that 2020 is a magical year of no cats :P
<cmaloney> hahahahaha
<cmaloney> not unless you have a pillow-case and a bucket of water
<rick_h_> see, the internet is full of crap. You ask it how long cats live and they say "Lifespan: 4 â 5 years" and then you notice... (In the wild)
<jrwren> you could let your cats roam the neighborhood freely, killing birds and possibly getting picked up by coyotes.
<rick_h_> this is where I went wrong "Cats who spend significant unsupervised time outdoors tend to survive to be about 7 years old, while indoor-only cats can be expected to live to around 14 years of age."
<rick_h_> indoor cats, they should be illegal
<rick_h_> you end up in commitments you can't ever get out of
<jrwren> lol
<cmaloney> indoor cats are awesome
<rick_h_> someone send help to cmaloney, he's been hit on the head. Maybe fallen on some ice.
<rick_h_> :P
<cmaloney> Nah, I've grown up with cats
<_stink_> our littermate cats are 14
<_stink_> they... appear to be in perfect health
<cmaloney> Honestly you need to have a sense of humor to be a cat person
<_stink_> enough to drag their anuses all over the floor and have hairballs on my bed.
<cmaloney> because they will drive you mad
<cmaloney> they're hyper-intelligent little assholes
<_stink_> our female punches my wife inthe face at 5am
<cmaloney> Pixel has her routines
<cmaloney> when she wants to be fed in the morning she becomes a little beast
<cmaloney> there have been more than a few times that I've seen her sleeping on the chair and I want to get out some crash cymbals
<cmaloney> payback is a bitch you sweet little piece of ...
#ubuntu-us-mi 2018-04-18
<myself> wait, you have a cat named pixel too?
<cmaloney> myself: It's pretty common for techies / musicians to name their cat Pixel. Especially if they're a black cat with a white spot. :)
<rick_h_> hah, I find it amusing
<cmaloney> funnily enough Ed Wynne from Ozric Tentacles named his cat Pixel, and there's a song by Ozric Tentacles called "Pixel's Dream"
<cmaloney> Pixel Dream, rather.
<cmaloney> It's on the album "The Hidden Step" with a picture of a black cat
<cmaloney> https://ozric-tentacles.bandcamp.com/album/the-hidden-step
<rick_h_> nice
<jrwren> rick_h_: i just noticed candid on github. When did that get open sourced?
<rick_h_> jrwren: as we speak, over the last few weeks
<jrwren> ah, ok, so it is recent. That is cool!
<rick_h_> jrwren: opening up IDM and using it in MAAS/snaps/etc
<jrwren> makes a lot of sense. Cool that they decided to use that as a std, instead of rolling their own.
<rick_h_> jrwren: yea, trying to get the whole software stack on common ground so on prem setups can be more easily setup/put together
<cmaloney> nice
#ubuntu-us-mi 2018-04-20
<cmaloney> morning. Ish.
<greg-g> still here
<cmaloney> Good to know
<greg-g> :P
<cmaloney> Hey now
<ColonelPanic001> what
#ubuntu-us-mi 2020-04-13
<cmaloney> Thank youl. Happy Passover / Easter / Sunday
<Scary_Guy> Happy Sunday (well, Monday now)
<wolfger> Happy Easter Monday to all you auto workers
<rick_h> morning
<cmaloney> Happy day
<Dekkard> heh..yes
#ubuntu-us-mi 2020-04-15
<cmaloney> morning
<cmaloney> party party
<cmaloney> CHC tonight at 7pm
<cmaloney> Link forthcoming
<jrwren> TIL: Wendy Carlos did the score for A Clockwork Orange
<cmaloney> Yeah, I didn't know that either until I did. :)
<cmaloney> She's one of my favorites. Amazing musicianship.
<jrwren> yeah, she is awesome.
<jrwren> whoa! and Tron?!?  and a couple on The Shining Soundtrack?!?
<cmaloney> Oh yeah
<jrwren> oh. also TIL: Wendy was born Walter
<greg-g> very good WP article: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wendy_Carlos
<greg-g> I was confused for a second "Carlos disclosed her transgender status in a series of interviews with Arthur Bell " I thought, "Art Bell?! of Coast to Coast AM?!?!"
<cmaloney> Yeah, not quite
<cmaloney> :)
<cmaloney> I actually sent her a "you're awesome, no need to reply" email.
<cmaloney> Funnily enough, didn't get a reply. :)
<jrwren> that is where I learned it from.
<cmaloney> The wikipedia article?
<cmaloney> I learned about Wendy from a Byte Magazine article about TRON and the confluence of computers and the arts.
<cmaloney> Sorry, it was the one on Graphics: https://archive.org/details/byte-magazine-1982-11/page/n49/mode/2up
<cmaloney> Nuts. She wasn't in there.
<cmaloney> Might have been one of the other magazines at the time
<jrwren> i think i learned about her from you cmaloney
<jrwren> a few years ago
<cmaloney> Possibly
<cmaloney> https://gettogether.community/events/5069/coffee-house-coders-regular-meeting/
<cmaloney> Going to try to use my self-hosted Jitsi instance
<cmaloney> we'll see if it crashes and burns. :)
<greg-g> "Crash and burn!" from the best worst 80s movie about mechwarriors/big fighting robots! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GpX7S-gV10o
<greg-g> (I referenced the movie in one of my sub-team meetings so I had that link handy)
<cmaloney> Heh
<cmaloney> https://jitsi.decafbad.net/CoffeeHouseCoders20200415 <- CHC is live
#ubuntu-us-mi 2020-04-16
<rick_h> how did it go on jitsi last night?
<rick_h> couldn't join, was in the middle of making dinner and last time I joined during that it was a bit strange
<Scary_Guy> Good morning.  I have nothing else valuable to contribute other than that right now.
<Scary_Guy> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2XLZ4Z8LpEE&t=116 except maybe that.
<Scary_Guy> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MikoF6KZjm0 or that
<cmaloney> morning
<cmaloney> It went well. Had three people on besides myself
<rick_h> cool
<rick_h> how was jitsi? is it a web based thing?
<Scary_Guy> Jitsi has desktop/mobile/web clients.  https://meet.jit.si is the web one.  I've used it and it works great, but I didn't have many users.
<Scary_Guy> In any case, it's certainly better than Zoom.
<cmaloney> The desktop stuff is deprecated
<cmaloney> they're relying on WebRTC now
<cmaloney> and SIP for phone connectivity for conferences
<cmaloney> It works really well.
<cmaloney> I self-hosted this last meeting and had a Linode instance handle four users without trouble
<cmaloney> 4 cores, though. :)
<cmaloney> I could have probably done it with less
<Scary_Guy> Maybe, but the Android client just got an update :D
<Scary_Guy> Though I have a theory that things which require internet access don't really need an app and should be able to run in the browser.  Also, things for offline use should require an app (like office, single player games, etc...)
<Scary_Guy> It seems like with phones everyone wants to make an app to suck data from the user or sell it and suck data from the user.
<cmaloney> I think the main issue with Jitsi mobile is CPU performance
<cmaloney> I think you could crush a mobile phone with full-on WebRTC
<cmaloney> and Safari on iOS probably works slightly worse than Safari on MacOS
<cmaloney> At first I was skeptical, but I think they have a good reason for it
<Scary_Guy> Anything on mobile is going to work worse than anything on a legitimate desktop.
<cmaloney> Indeed
<cmaloney> More explanation than Absolution.
<cmaloney> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ijpQcd4FS8k
<cmaloney> That was the meeting we ran on meet.jit.si with OBS doing the streaming
<Scary_Guy> OBS is great
<cmaloney> in part because meet.jit.si's jibri instances are all busy recording or streaming for other folks
<Scary_Guy> I haven't really gotten into it much though.
<cmaloney> Yeah, OBS is solid software
<Scary_Guy> I'm working on getting my own audio stream up so I can pipe it into my Discord bot rather than just playing through my own voice channel.
<Scary_Guy> Not that I love Disocrd, but it is an okay option for now.
<Scary_Guy> (When it's not randomly crashing)
<Scary_Guy> (which is often enough to be annoying, but not so often that I uninstall it)
<cmaloney> I haven't used Discord ouside of the web client
<cmaloney> and even then it's not my favorite.
<jrwren> i like it. it is fast
<cmaloney> No doubt there, but I find myself marking things read more often than not
<cmaloney> Definitely not great for the FOMO
<Scary_Guy> I mute a lot of servers.
<Scary_Guy> and ignore a lot of things.
<cmaloney> yeah
<cmaloney> I'm on some servers that are no longer sparking joy
<cmaloney> I deleted a few but I think I need to remove some more
<Scary_Guy> Yeah, leaving is always an option.  I have some I should just axe too.
<Scary_Guy> There is a Discord Linux one if you want though https://discord.gg/discord-linux
<cmaloney> What's the main advantage of that outside of better voice?
<Scary_Guy> It crashes randomly on you?  XD
<cmaloney> You've sold me
#ubuntu-us-mi 2020-04-17
<rick_h> TGIF
<jrwren> +1
<cmaloney> morning
<cmaloney> Shitty saturday. :)
<jrwren> anyone want to add a correction to the Boyer-Moore wikipedia page? https://github.com/microsoft/STL/pull/724
<cmaloney> I would if I understood it. :)
<cmaloney> https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:Boyer%E2%80%93Moore_string-search_algorithm&diff=951299110&oldid=900548503
<jrwren> oh good, someone did
<rick_h> lol
<gamerchick02> was going to install Journey on the PS4.  PS4 has to update. oi!
<cmaloney> Which version of Journey, the one with Steve Smith in it?
<Scary_Guy> lol
<gamerchick02> the PS4 game.... ?
<gamerchick02> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Journey_(2012_video_game)
<gamerchick02> it was free on the PS4 "stay home and play" thing so i have no complaints. that and Uncharted collection but i already have that
<Scary_Guy> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Journey_(band) he was making a play on words.
<Scary_Guy> Is joke, good joke, very funny
<gamerchick02> ah yes, sorry
<gamerchick02> yes it was
<cmaloney> :-D
<cmaloney> There's also the rather daft Journey Arcade Game
<cmaloney> and the dreadful Journey Escape cartridge for home gaming
<cmaloney> i just explained how to use jitsi with my parents
#ubuntu-us-mi 2020-04-18
<gamerchick02> cmaloney, i tried Jit.si and it didn't work for my mom so we switched to Zoom. i'm not happy about that but whatever
<jrwren> why not skype, or google hangouts or google duo or facetime?
<cmaloney> gamerchick02: Firefox?
<gamerchick02> yes firefox
<cmaloney> I tried it with my parents and they had to use Chrome
<cmaloney> it was slightly frustrating to my dad to log into Chrome, but eventually they managed
<cmaloney> and you could see the light dawn for them on why this was useful
<gamerchick02> jwren, i'm the only apple user in the family (ipad and i don't facetime with it), no to skype, no to hangouts, no to duo. it's too much to deal with right now, i do not have the bandwidth to help remotely right now.
<cmaloney> jrwren: I have reasons for each, but not sure if you care to hear them
<gamerchick02> i can't leave to drive the hour and a half-ish to her house without risking a jail sentence and a $1000 fine so i'm not taking chances and i'm not happy about it. i know WHY (to keep the richies from going to their summer homes) but dang if it's killing me
<cmaloney> Well, it's also to contain the spread of COVID-19
<cmaloney> But yeah, if zoom works then cool
<cmaloney> THat's one thing I like about Zoom: they've made it really simple to onboard folks
<cmaloney> Jitsi is working on the Firefox issues, though so hopefully it'll get better
<cmaloney> But yeah, remote diagnostics is no fun
<gamerchick02> nice! i'll keep that in mind. it worked for my brother in firefox but he also has a beefy PC (as do i) and she's working from a laptop
<gamerchick02> no remote diagnostics is absolutely no fun. i cannot see what she's doing and she's afraid to touch ANYTHING so i say "click on this" and she'll question me. or i'll say what do you see? "nothing." well that's a grand old help.
<gamerchick02> when i'm on remote help calls being helped i tell the tech EXACTLY what i see and EXACTLY what i've clicked or typed in.
<gamerchick02> with the exception of passwords or passcodes, then i say "i'm entering my password/code"
<jrwren> I'd LOVE to hear reasons why zoom is better than skype or hangouts.
<jrwren> I guess if it is your typical MSFT is evil stuff, I'd rather not both you with writing it out.
<gamerchick02> zoom is not the best. i do not care what the best is but zoom works at this point in time so i'm not going to question it. i do not have bandwidth to argue with anyone about semantics about which video call software is best when I CANNOT SEE MY MOM to troubleshoot or even just see her in person.
<jrwren> that isn't what I mean. i'm not judging.
<cmaloney> jrwren: Zoom doesn't require an account to use it, just the client
<jrwren> interesting!
<cmaloney> jrwren: Also Hangouts used to (not currently) have an upper limit of 10 people for a call
<cmaloney> And Skype had a spam problem
<gamerchick02> oh yes the whole account thing is one of the reasons why we're using it
<cmaloney> Not sure if that is still true with MSFT's transition for Skype from the old client, but leaving up your skype client was bound to attract horny russian girls
<gamerchick02> i'd rather her use some open source client on linux but getting her to use linux at this point is a lost cause that i don't have the bandwidth to get her to use either
<gamerchick02> EW
<cmaloney> Only one person needs a zoom account
<jrwren> now that you mention it. that is why i closed the skype client and never used it again many years ago... until a month ago.
<gamerchick02> i knew there was a reason why i abandoned skype
<jrwren> thanks, that all makes sense.
<gamerchick02> now i use skype for business every day for work but mostly screenshare and IM.
<cmaloney> So yeah, that's why Zoom is eating MSFT and Google's lunch
<cmaloney> Also Google kinda screwed up with their mixed messaging on the state of Hangouts and Google Meet
<cmaloney> It's part of the reason I checked out Jami and Signal
<cmaloney> And Google Duo feels like one of those Google Projects that gets started and has a half-life of 2 1/2 years before they kill it
<cmaloney> see also: Allo
<gamerchick02> see also Stadia. i predict that to be gone before 2025
<cmaloney> And Facetime is Apple only so Zoom has the advantage there
<cmaloney> gamerchick02: problem with Stadia is they should have kept Google Fiber to supplement it
<gamerchick02> plus 1 to facetime. i realize that facetime is so EASY (i have used it in the past) but it's apple only and will never get ported to another system
<gamerchick02> cmaloney, yes i agree. "every google fiber customer gets Stadia for $X extra if they want it."
<gamerchick02> or they get a free trial for X months
<cmaloney> This is why I'm so hot on Jitsi, because it's actual competition to Zoom from the OSS side
<gamerchick02> i prefer PS4 and switch for gaming :)
<cmaloney> Well, it also takes care of the crappy bandwidth issues
<gamerchick02> oh and PC. one of the reasons why i've not bopped into the xbox arena... because almost all xbox games are on windows
<gamerchick02> plus i'm not a halo fan. *shrug*
<cmaloney> But alas, I'm not Google, and even sometimes I wonder if GOogle is either
<gamerchick02> lol true. their messaging services are just a hot mess right now
<cmaloney> I will admit that since the closure of G+ I'm not about to put in any effort into exploring Google products
<gamerchick02> i still use hangouts but want to kill it in favor of telegram. just need one person to move over to telegram. hangouts doesn't even work on my watch
<gamerchick02> i actually liked G+. why do they kill the good stuff... RSS, G+, hangouts (almost)
<cmaloney> I'm really hesitant about telegram, honestly. They've done a few things that really irritate me, not the least of which is their ICO for their BS whatever-coin.
<cmaloney> gamerchick02: There's more corporate whuffie to be had in decommissioning and creating new products than maintaining them.
<gamerchick02> i just want fewer chat apps on my phone
<gamerchick02> true
<jrwren> i find it is pretty easy... don't use products by the really evil companies. IMO GOOG and FB are REALLY evil. that cuts out over 50% of the chat app market ;)
<cmaloney> jrwren: indeed
<gamerchick02> jrwren, that's great but then i'm vastly limiting my pool of friends (people i actually know in meatspace) that can contact me online. it's a double edged sword.
<gamerchick02> not everyone knows that these companies are terrible (or they know and don't care). i know and care but in the interest of keeping in contact with people, i use them. *sigh*. yes i've given out my number (please do text me. please!) they insist on contacting me on facebook.
<gamerchick02> oh and honestly there are people i only want to contact me on facebook (cue people that i'm connected to because reasons but don't want to have my mobile # also for reasons. those reasons being every dang meme and conservative thought that passes through their head)
<jrwren> yup.
<jrwren> its a choice.
<jrwren> i'm ok with limiting my pool of friends.
<jrwren> i say, "I don't use that"
<jrwren> always hilarious when i login to FB once every 6mo or so and see old messenger messages I missed.
<jrwren> just a week or so ago I learned how to see the cold messages on there... saw something from years ago... cuz FB can't write software for shit.
<cmaloney> I much prefer the "I'm not on Facebook" response, but I know that's a choice. :)
<cmaloney> My email is public if someone wants to get a hold of me
<jrwren> i just got cold emailed by someone after answering their stackoverflow question. am i wrong to find that inappropriate?
<gamerchick02> i'm not ok with limiting my pool of friends. many are non-technical (like through OES and Nile) and i'm not going to snub them because "i don't do facebook". what i do is LIMIT my facebook use to every other day-ish and make sure i have notifications on for events and that's it.
<jrwren> sure. life is about choices.
<Scary_Guy> I used Jitsi with Firefox and had no issues, but that was before the most recent major update.
<cmaloney> I think it's mostly to do with camera / microphone access
<cmaloney> My dad had a hell of a time getting it to work with Firefox
#ubuntu-us-mi 2020-04-19
<Scary_Guy> Yeah, I think it restricts everything by default now and you have to allow it in.  Though I think it should still ask you.
<dzho> we used jitsi for a LUG meeting today and one person had a heck of a time getting audio and video working
<dzho> but the other five of us had no trouble really
<Scary_Guy> I hate Chrome/ium but maybe use that?  I do use it for Netflix and other streaming services that refuse to work on Firefox.
<cmaloney> Yeah, if Firefox isn't working then you'll have to suffer Chrome
<dzho> yeah I don't remember if this guy was using Chrom[e|ium] or not, but that's what I was using and what I was recommending all around. I think we had him switch at one point. Turns out it was a permissions problem upstream somewhere in his settings. He swore he'd just used them all earlier and so they were working and that couldn't be it.
<dzho> Until he went to check and that was it.
<dzho> The permissions structures of these environments have always been a challenge to navigate, but the response to concerns about that seems to have been to add yet More Stuff, which then of course just makes it even harder to understand and control.
<jrwren> wow... BigBlueButton looks interesting.
<cmaloney> dzho: Yeah, that's the unfortunate side effect of browser-based controls
<dzho> well, browser-based controls permuted through all possible web sites, and then layered atop OS-based controls permuted through all possible applications
<dzho> like, spam was a hard-to-solve problem in mostly-text environments 30 years ago and the biggest response to it all seems to be "that sucks, so let's make silos and add multimedia features what could possibly go wrong"
