#ubuntu-uk 2011-09-12
<shauno> I'm not sure I'll ever understand this country.  met eireann is giving us storm, flood and .. potato blight warnings?  http://met.ie/forecasts/warnings.asp
<directhex> shauno: if there's a potato blight, everyone will starve
<shauno> heh, I'm not going there ;)
<shauno> wound up on a bus/tourist tour recently, where the driver kept getting stuck on the very same topic.  rather awkward
<hamitron> my potato crop has been poor this year
<hamitron> :/
<directhex> you can't survive on a diet of only guinness, y'know. the potatoes are needed to supply the essential starch needed by the irish digestive system
<shauno> I sometimes think not being able to live on guinness alone, is a purely budgetary constraint
<ali1234> android browser does not support css fonts. or preformatted whitespace. or handle float:left properly
<ali1234> lol i crashed the browsershots vm
<ali1234> silly ie6
<ali1234> i guess it does not like vendor specific unicode
<ali1234> i think it's working now. teletext from 1996: http://al.robotfuzz.com/~al/teletext/
<Azelphur> fun
<ali1234> look at this aardvark: http://al.robotfuzz.com/~al/teletext/520.html
<ali1234> btw, you can click page numbers to go to that page
<ali1234> or the coloured fasttext links at the bottom work too
<sammm> HazRPG: OMG dude I just went for a dump and so much blood come out of my arse and made the toilet all red. :(
<sammm> And I ate a whole packet of high-fibre cereal too.
<sammm> HazRPG: I'm also thinking of lowering my mouse sentivity from 55CM/360 back down to 45CM/360
<sammm> HazRPG: My mouse mat is too small :(
<sammm> HazRPG: But it was the biggest I could find online
<kaushal> Hi
<kaushal> I have followed https://help.ubuntu.com/community/KVM
<kaushal> How do i reset root password of guest OS in KVM ?
<Myrtti> the same way you would without KVM
<kaushal> Myrtti: i did virt-viewer --wait vm3
<kaushal> how do i get into grub prompt
<kaushal> its 10.04
<MartijnVdS> kaushal: just press escape (or turn on caps lock) when it's booting up, like on a normal machine?
<kaushal> ok
<MartijnVdS> another option is to stop the guest, mount its filesystem on the host, "fix" /etc/passwd, unmount and start the guest
<MartijnVdS> but that's not always easy/possible
<MartijnVdS> /etc/shadow*
<directhex> woo 3g
<kaushal> MartijnVdS: Thanks
<kaushal> it worked
<kaushal> Myrtti: thanks
<kaushal> is there a way to check a specific server whose date is out of sync with the NTP Server ?
<kaushal> in the form of shell script ?
<popey> Morning all
<jpds> kaushal: ntpq -p
<christel> Good morning
<MartijnVdS> \o christel
<christel> hullu \o/
<Myrtti> huh?
<bigcalm> Morning peeps :)
<christel> heya bigcalm, Myrtti <3
 * bigcalm hugs christel and goes in search of coffee
<diplo> Morning all
<bigcalm> I can smell coffee!
 * bigcalm still doesn't wake up
<czajkowski> aloha
<czajkowski> dates are out for FOSDEM 4&5th February
<bigcalm> Morning czajkowski :)
<directhex> czajkowski, i should write a talk! i like fosdem!
<popey> i like it too
<popey> I think I'll go this year
<czajkowski> indeed
 * AlanBell looks forward to more during the week type conferences
<JamesTait> Happy Monday, everyone! :)
<popey> Happy birthday JamesTait
<bigcalm> Happy thingy wotsit JamesTait & S. Popey
<bigcalm> -y
 * directhex is on vdsl
<ikonia> popey: ahh you're active
<ikonia> popey: http://calculon.dnsdata.co.uk/images/stuff/popey-facebook.png
<ikonia> popey: it came back, slightly different, but the same thing
<bigcalm> directhex: Vino Drenched Sardines & Licorice?
<directhex> "Very-high-bitrate digital subscriber line"
<ikonia> directhex: finally on fibre
<ikonia> directhex: any good
<directhex> no word yet on reliability
<directhex> speed is good
<bigcalm> bt?
<directhex> bigcalm, yeah
<oimon> hmm getting a lot of referrer traffic on my blog from ibmforums.ibm.com but this seems to be some private ibm forum. anyone in here have access?
<popey> ikonia: I have never even _seen_ that video
<ikonia> popey: it's slightly different than normal as it normally looks like you've posted it, however this time it shows you like it
<ikonia> in this situation I can't actually see where it's come from
<popey> i never hit 'like' on 3rd party sites
<ikonia> popey: I don't doubt it, I never hit like, I thought it was you last time as it appeared to come from you, however this time, I can't understand where it's come from / who's posted it
<ikonia> it appears to be ever so slightly different
<directhex> I hate hate hate sites which integrate with facebook
<ikonia> (but the same video/base content)
<directhex> facebook gives so little control over what bullshit gets posted to your wall (and therefore force-fed to your internet friends)
<ikonia> directhex: it would appear that way, this one has me geniunly stumped of who/what posted it
<ikonia> before it was clear popey posted it (even though he didn't) now, I can't work it out
<directhex> faked "like" clicks, courtesy of dodgy javascript?
<ikonia> I only posted it to show popey as I couldn't get a screen shot of it last time
<ikonia> directhex: but normally it shows who posted it
<ikonia> if you look att he screen shot it appears to have come from no-one
<popey> what do you get if you hit the x?
<ikonia> block or report as spam
<popey> does it mention a group or person it came from?
<popey> block it âº
<ikonia> hide all be kalau light saber
<popey> also
<popey> bright green scroll bars :D
<ikonia> however I have no group or friend called that
<directhex> like is a plague, because you can't block the source of a like
<brobostigon> good morning everyone.
<directhex> e.g. i block farmville, but if someone likes farmville spam, it appears in my feed
<ikonia> popey: they are amaazing scroll bars !
<oimon> "interesting" theme..
<ikonia> just a basic dark one
<directhex> 2011-09-12 10:07:52 (4.37 MB/s) - `ubuntu-11.04-desktop-i386.iso' saved [718583808/718583808]
<popey> directhex: 3g?
<directhex> 100%[======================================>] 718,583,808 4.69M/s   in 2m 37s
<popey> nice
<bigcalm> Heh
<AlanBell> directhex: have you wall mounted the white box?
<directhex> AlanBell, not yet. i'd need to get some wall plugs of suitable lengths
<directhex> although supposedly the 3rd-gen huawei doesn't fail so much under load
<directhex> still gets hot, but cares less about it
<AlanBell> does it have a big "2B" on the base?
<AlanBell> the first one I had was the old model and cooked itself to crashyness within an hour
<directhex> AlanBell, the 2B is 3rd gen
<directhex> 2V is 2nd gen
<Mez> Has anyone had Nvidia working on Natty?
<Mez> Mine is still totally fucked.
<AlanBell> I have a 2B now, it is wall mounted but seems cooler anyway
<AlanBell> Language Mez!
<directhex> i'll see how we go horizontally for now.
<Mez> AlanBell: apologies.
<popey> works for me
<Mez> popey: Hmmles... mine won't work whatsoever... I can't get any kind of 3D acceleration.
<popey> is nvidia-current installed?
<popey> what do you have in /var/log/Xorg.0.log ?
<Mez> Installed but not activated
<ikonia> put it in your xorg to activate iut
<ikonia> it
<ikonia> xorg.conf even
<Mez> seems to load compiz, but crashes
<Mez> *** glibc detected *** compiz: corrupted double-linked list: 0x0000000001765260 ***
<ikonia> disable compiz and test it
<Mez> ikonia, huh?
<Mez> I was referring to compiz there.
<Mez> I'd ran it manuall
<ikonia> so do you get a stable working nvidia accelerated enviornment without compiz running ?
<Mez> I don't know.
<ikonia> disable compiz and try it
<Mez> I'm NOT running compiz.
<ikonia> sorry, your line "seems to load compiz and crashes" suggested you where
<popey> I still want to see Xorg.0.log
<Mez> I attempted it to get the error log - then when it froze - replaced owith metacity
<popey> have you rebooted since installing nvidia-current?
<Mez> About 700 times.  I've been having to run Gnome-classic with no Desktop effects since Pre-Natty
<gord> attempt again :)
<Mez> glxgears runs @ 1200 FPS
<gord> Xorg.0.log is the key here
<Mez> So I'm presuming that's actually a stable 3d environment
<Mez> My terminals playing up. one sec
<Mez> http://paste.ubuntu.com/687501/
<gord> glxgears is not a good indication of anything
<popey> looks good
<bigcalm> Looks pretty though
<Mez> http://paste.ubuntu.com/687503/ before anyone asks
<gord> isn't the 7300 that card that just bugs out all the time?
<Mez> It never bugged out before though.
<gord> Mez, right its the nvidia drivers or something, you might have more luck with Nouveau in accelerated mode to be honest. i was pleasantly surprised that it ran unity with all the bells and whistles just fine on my revo the other day
<Mez> So, something that was previously supported is no longer supported after the drivers were updated.  Now I know that Canonical have no control over it... but man... That's f**king annoying
<popey> s/canonical have no/nobody has any/
<bigcalm> Mez: please try not to swear, even *ing out letters doesn't look nice
<gord> sometimes there are bugs, nvidia don't reeeally care about old gpus in their new drivers
<AlanBell> so noveau sounds like the way forward then
<gord> nouveau has its own shedload of problems too :)
<gord> depends if your usecase falls in line with them or not
<oimon> having persistent problems with a particular .ashx feed in liferea. what other feed readers do people use?
<oimon> my workaround is to add it to google reader and then add google reader to liferea :-S
<bigcalm> The wind is now setting off car alarms
 * bigcalm is alarmed
<gord> because you are a car alarm too?
<Mez> bigcalm: yes - I know - I'm just very very frustrated.
<Mez> Now is about the time I'd be upgrading to +1.
<oly> anyone here got any tips on helping bugs get resolved in particular i would like to see this one resolved https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/774385
<lubotu3> Ubuntu bug 774385 in linux (Ubuntu) "dell studio 1749 sd reader not working " [Undecided,Confirmed]
<bigcalm> oly: doesn't work in my studio either, though I've never looked for a fix as I have a usb sd card reader as well
<oly> yeah, its annoying it used to work perfectly pre 10.04 and its still broken in 11.04
<oly> i mean 11.04 and 11.10 its broke
<oly> 10.10 it used to work perfectly
<oly> want to try and get some tracktion behind it now, as once its released they dont seem as intrested in fixing bugs for a current release :)
<AlanBell> oly: try and find out if the same hardware is in a certified laptop
<oly> okay
<AlanBell> http://www.ubuntu.com/certification/models?start=100&batch=50
<bigcalm> Mine isn't on the list :(
<oly> bigcalm, does everything else work on your laptop from livecd as this is the only thing i have found that does not
<gord> one of the big reasons i bought the thinkpad X220 was that it was ubuntu certified :)
<gord> or something akin to taht
<gord> it was on an wiki ;)
<oly> AlanBell, those models dont actually list the sd card reader device from what i can tell
<davmor2> morning all
<oly> lspci tells me its this SD Host controller: O2 Micro, Inc. Device 8120 (rev 01)
 * davmor2 prods czajkowski  just to say hi
<davmor2> MooDoo: anything?
<AlanBell> oly: yeah, it isn't massively helpful they way they do that site
<czajkowski> davmor2: oi oi 1 more day left me of me on irc before new job :)
<davmor2> czajkowski: I know that's why I'm making the most of prodding you while I can :P prod
<czajkowski> davmor2: :)
<oly> bigcalm, have you subscribed to the bug,
<oly> may help it get some traction if they can see more people with the issue
<CaMason> guys, one of my staff is having issues whereby sometimes the screensaver will not close
<CaMason> any thoughts on how to allow him to get back into his workstation?
<gord> CaMason, ctrl+alt+f2; killall -9 gnome-screensaver
<CaMason> um, 'touch: cannot touch `/tmp/test': Read-only file system'
<CaMason> how on earth has that happened?
<gord> CaMason, time to do a fsck - prolly why gnome-screensaver was going wonky
<CaMason> I can write to /home/ different partition - same disk
<MartijnVdS> yes
<MartijnVdS> different partition = different file system, which might not be mounted read-only
<gord> your root partition being read only is never a good thing ;)
<CaMason> strange. This only becomes apparent when his screensaver is on
<dogmatic69> unless its (readonly) friday
<dogmatic69> :D
<popey> or no print tuesday!
<oimon> anyone know of a feed reader client that supports google reader folders/tags? (liferea doesn't)
<bigcalm> 3.75MB/s - thank you Soundcloud for having decent pipes :)
<bigcalm> Loads of Solidsteel podcasts to catch up on
 * bigcalm be happy
<directhex> CaMason, try "mount -o remount,rw /"
<dogmatic69> could anyone shed some light on this? its happening every 20 seconds or so http://bin.cakephp.org/view/637732583
<oimon> my 20 month-old son can count to 10 in even numbers only \o/
<dogmatic69> oimon: time to start working on binary addition?
<oimon> dogmatic69: maybe primes first :)
<dogmatic69> anyone have an idea what the logs i pasted mean?
<oimon> dogmatic69: is mysqld running?
<dogmatic69> oimon: i believe so
<dogmatic69> not using mysql on that box though
<oimon> maybe that's what the errors are then, why not disable mysql from starting?
<dogmatic69> ye, i stopped it now
<dogmatic69> maybe should just apt-get remove it
<daubers> Afternoon
<ali1234> CaMason: does workstation have the "extra" screensavers installed? those can crash the machine
<CaMason> it's running the 'electric-sheep' screensaver
<CaMason> but it was crashing with the normal screensavers too. It just seems  little coincidental that the machine has often entered screensaver mode, then the drive goes RO.
<smittix> Anyone had the "can't guess meta-package" Error on 11.10?
<smittix> Can't update the system at all on a clean install of oniric
<directhex> CaMason, did it remount rw okay?
<CaMason> we rebooted and ran fsck
<CaMason> at least, I think it did. I did `touch /forcefsck` and rebooted.
<directhex> CaMason, ext3 or ext4?
<CaMason> ext4
<directhex> hm. i've encountered times in production where ext4 passes a fsck, but still throws up io errors
<smittix> I don't like it how they have taken the options away to change theme options :/
<smittix> Gnome-Tweak-Tool it is.
<CaMason> I'm doing a full smart scan on the disk. He's using the machine at the moment
<DJones> Is it wrong to check which way the wind is blowing you see a headline about an explosion at a nuclear power plant in France
<smittix> DJones: No it's perfectly normal heh
<DJones> Reading the headline again, nuclear plant rather than a power plant
<smittix> DJones: Link?
<DJones> smittix: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-14883521?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter
<smittix> :/
<DJones> Just realised, one of my staff is going to France on holiday on Friday........ She might not be happy when she comes back in from her lunch
<smittix> Or comes back from holiday with an extra toe.
<DJones> The glow in the dark would be handy though in winter when she's riding her bike to work, it'll save on lights
<jpds> DJones: Reflective gear.
<smittix> Anyone any idea when AMD will be releasing their 11.9 Catalyst drivers?
<directhex> smittix, before the end of the month.
<smittix> directhex: Ta
<MartijnVdS> isn't that like the Ubuntu release number though
<MartijnVdS> it'll be 11.10 if they don't make it this month
<smittix> Can't say I am liking the latest version of Ubuntu yet. But I also said that when 11.4 came out.
<directhex> MartijnVdS, yes! 8D
 * MartijnVdS uses the free ATI driver, no problems
<MartijnVdS> even unity works
<directhex> MartijnVdS, didn't support my card last time i tried
<ubuntuuk-planet> [Paul Tansom] Auto naming terminal tabs - http://www.linuxlore.co.uk/2011/09/12/auto-naming-terminal-tabs/
<directhex> well, 5 hours since getting infinity, and it hasn't randomly disconnected yet
<Laney> what speed?
<MartijnVdS> infinite?
<directhex> Laney, 37M down, 8M up
<MartijnVdS>  nice
<Laney> neaty wheaties
<oimon> E: Could not perform immediate configuration on 'unity-2d'. Please see man 5 apt.conf under APT::Immediate-Configure for details.
<oimon> ugh
<Azelphur> lol woo, finally convinced the shop that I bought my tablet PC from that it's actually meant to have a touch screen in it
<Azelphur> and that touch screens are not optional on tablet PC's
<dogmatic69> :D
<Azelphur> that only took 1.5 weeks \o/
<dogmatic69> what tab is that?
<Azelphur> Inspiron mini duo
<Azelphur> http://www.dell.com/us/p/inspiron-duo/pd \o/
<oimon> how does it run with buntu?
<Azelphur> seems to run ok, there's a couple little tweaks you have to do it
<Azelphur> I was trying to get the touch screen to work for ages until I noticed there was no touch screen connected according to lsusb.
<oimon> i suppose you had already trashed the windows that came with it?
<Azelphur> yea
<Azelphur> oimon: it actually came no OS, was a refurb
<oimon> sweet..
<oimon> except for the quality control
<Azelphur> indeed
<Azelphur> clearly it had a broken touch screen and someone stupid replaced the screen with a non-touch
<ubuntuuk-planet> [Dan Fish] Deterring foxes, the arduino way - http://www.ossmedicine.org/home_automation/arduino/09/deterring-foxes-the-arduino-way/
<TheFred> jacobw, A Big THANKYOU for all your help the other day with my networking problems
 * oimon wonders how long linux.com and assoicated websites will be down for. Need a printer driver :(
<gord> AlanBell, ping
<bigcalm> Surely a bell goes ding, not ping?
<gord> you are completely right
<gord> AlanBell, ding
<bigcalm> HEh
<AlanBell> o/ gord
<gord> AlanBell, so i asked about, "so the on-screen keyboard needs to get the window id of the window it's inputting into and set its WM_TRANSIENT_FOR hint to that window and its _NET_WM_WINDOW_TYPE to _NET_WM_WINDOW_TYPE_UTILITY"
<AlanBell> ok
<AlanBell> Pendulum: ^^
<AlanBell> that sounds like a generically good thing for it to be doing to all windows right?
<AlanBell> can it do that for the unity window?
<xr1> Anyone know if it is possible to use a evolution backup in thunderbird mail?
<gord> AlanBell, yup, unity has its own window for events
<christel> oimon: its playing havoc with my upgrading freenode plans, as i was going to do a kernel upgrade of one of our servers :(
<oimon> sux badly :(
<davmor2> xr1: not that I'm aware of did a google search throw up anything obvious?
<xr1> davmor2: No I couldnât find much, that's why i asked here ;)
<daubers> Anyone who is considering teaching new people to program should have a look at sense.open.ac.uk
<daubers> It's a bit fisher price, but does look to get the basics across (without having to learn a language)
<diplo> AlanBell: Was it you who had a friend in HP ?
<AlanBell> diplo: it was TheOpenSourcerer
<TheOpenSourcerer> Ahh - yes it was me.
<diplo> ah, just saw on the Reigister thatHP staff are to get a delivery of 6k of Touchpads if you didn't get yours
<diplo> Only for HP staff though
<TheOpenSourcerer> Yes - I had an email from him this morning ;-)
<TheOpenSourcerer> He has registered his interest...
<diplo> Nice, well saw and thought I'd let you know
<diplo> Well if he gets more than one :)
<TheOpenSourcerer> I asked for two.
<diplo> Well if he  wantsa little profit I'm up for 1 :)
<diplo> Right, better go and take my boy to swimming lessons, catch you all later.
<popey> TheOpenSourcerer: make it 3 :D
<popey> TheOpenSourcerer: get me one and I'll take your turn to queue for beerex tickets :D
<TheOpenSourcerer> Hey popey - it's probably too late - he put his order in this morning but you never know....
<popey> heh
<MartijnVdS> popey: http://www.newsbiscuit.com/2011/09/09/homeopathic-leak-threatens-catastrophe/
<popey> haha
<MartijnVdS> also, running in 50-60ish km/h winds is.. interesting :)
<dutchie> my friend is cycling land's end to john o groats
<dutchie> he's up in cumbria atm, and apparently the wind is sufficient to keep his bike at a 70 degree angle
<MartijnVdS> dutchie: I can imagine
<MartijnVdS> apparently it's even worse near the coast (here at least.. Cumbria is even closer to the "action")
<shauno> curious.  that's not the first time that's happened today
<MartijnVdS> shauno: what happened?
<shauno> not sure.  my vps keeps dropping off irc.  but I'm not losing it via ssh
<shauno> altho I might have a silly-long timeout on ssh.  I can never remember what I've played with
<shauno> but I think if bitfolk were bouncing, it'd be a little more noticable.  fairly sure I'm not the only one in here
<popey> shauno: o/
<MartijnVdS> Great, Vodafone
<MartijnVdS> Website claims: "Sorry you are not retainable. reason, you have a porting out request"
<MartijnVdS> Store claims: "We don't see any active porting request on your account"
<MartijnVdS> (I agree with the store, btw)
<oimon1> anyone with experience of xfs_repair on large filesystems? using 100% and using 24GB RAM and taking couple of hours on a 10TB filesystem
<oimon1> ah found a workaround :)
<oimon1> ctrl-c
<safiyyah> howdy
<popey> hi
<TheFred> hello!
<safiyyah> what are you all up to??
<TheFred> me? I'm waiting for my android emulator to boot so i can test my code
<TheFred> what about you safiyyah ?
<TheFred> meh! and its all gone wrong...
<safiyyah> lol
<safiyyah> well kids went to bed, felt lonely came to see what was going on around here
<safiyyah> in geek land
<popey> :D
<TheFred> safiyyah, there's some googd games on google+...
<safiyyah> ha
<TheFred> I like edgeworld
<safiyyah> i do like some card games
<safiyyah> but it will excite me and put me at 100% alert
<safiyyah> I need to sleep in about an hour
<TheFred> nah! its quick at a first, but then as you level up its a waiting game
<TheFred> .. but then i styart playing in different secors ata the same time while im waiting for upgraded
<TheFred> *upgrades
<Azelphur> if we're talking about good linux games, hedgewars
<Azelphur> really, hedgewars...if you havn't tried it yet, hedgewars
<Azelphur> if you don't like games, I don't care. Play hedgewars :D
<safiyyah> lol
<TheFred> oh gawd, the 'droid emu is trying to boot a virtual device with a 120080 x 800 screen on a my machine which on has a 1024 screen...
<safiyyah> I think I would rather watch a korean drama than the game TheFred
<TheFred> fair enough
<TheFred> Azelphur, yea, Hedgewars rocks
<Azelphur> indeed
<Azelphur> they are porting it to android
<Azelphur> DO WANT.
<TheFred> +1
<TheFred> they... the internet ninja's...
<TheFred> perfecting their arts of porting foo
<Azelphur> hehe
<TheFred> I take my hat off to an effort like that, I do a lot of 'droid dev work and its NOT easy
<TheFred> That will make online games more interesting tho.. assuming (hoping) they can all use the same game-servers
<Azelphur> yea :)
<Azelphur> TheFred: if your brave there's an alpha in the market, crashes a lot though
<TheFred> doubt it'll work on my phone, its a real cheap droid - zte racer : 128 Mb internal ram, and 500Mhz
<Azelphur> TheFred: I bought my mum a ZTE Blade, very nice phone :)
<TheFred> yea, i only use cheap pnes because dev work can hammer them, esp with gps testing in all weathers...
<Azelphur> hehe
<Azelphur> I have a desire Z :D
<TheFred> those phones rock
<TheFred> well-build, very decent display, and rapid to use
<Azelphur> hehe
<TheFred> today i'm having hassles with virtual devices not playing ball for some reason... you'd think that with them being virtual theyd behave same every day, but nooooo.....
<safiyyah> I was in love with my HTC until I saw my friends Samsung
<Azelphur> safiyyah: welcome to my world
<TheFred> So i'm going to install the x86 port of droid to my spare pc to help speed up my dev work
<aquarius> right, let's canvass #ubuntu-uk for opinions on my NAS choices.
<popey> !ask
<lubotu3> Please don't ask to ask a question, simply ask the question (all on ONE line and in the channel, so that others can read and follow it easily). If anyone knows the answer they will most likely reply. :-)
<popey> no
<popey> !best
<lubotu3> Usually, there is no single "best" application to perform a given task. It's up to you to choose, depending on your preferences, features you require, and other factors. Do NOT take polls in the channel. If you insist on getting people's opinions, ask BestBot in #ubuntu-bots.
<popey> :D
<mgdm> aquarius: you already have my opinion :)
<aquarius> I'm trying to decide between a D-Link DNS-320 and an HP microserver.
<popey> mgdm: what did you suggest?
<mgdm> popey: HP, on the basis it's more likely to be fixable if it goes boom
<popey> ahh
<popey> how many usb ports does the dlink have?
<mgdm> (I'm getting one, soonish)
<aquarius> D-Link thing. Pros: is Â£65. Does what I want, broadly (UPnP streaming of music/video, takes my 1TB SATA drive, BT client), theoretically expandable to run whatever I want through fun_plug, silent. Cons: will format my drive when I put it in, not as expandable as a real server.
<Myrtti> i vote for hp too
<popey> aquarius: have you asked twitter and/or Google+?
<aquarius> HP microserver. Pros: is a real server that I can install whatever I want on. Less likely to go mysteriously belly-up if my house gets struck by lightning again. Can expand with new hardware in the future. Cons: is twice as expensive. Is four times as expensive until I send a form in the post (!) to HP. Have to install Ubuntu and server software myself, which is hassle. Not silent.
<aquarius> popey, I have indeed
<popey> get someone else to do the install for you :D
<aquarius> my basic question boils down to: am I prepared to pay extra money and extra hassle (send form in post, install Ubuntu myself, be a sysadmin which I hate doing) just in order to (a) give me future expandability, and (b) not have to copy all the data off my 1TB drive and then back on again afterwards?
<aquarius> and I have spent all day vacillating about what my answer to this question is :)
<popey> i have gone from one disk in my hp...
<popey> to 4x2TB in RAID 10.
<popey> because I hoard data
<popey> /dev/mapper/data-data 2.9T  2.1T  673G  77% /srv
<aquarius> see, if I have to even think the phrase "RAID 10", or look at dev/mapper, whatever the byOurLady hell that is, then I have lost. This is what concerns me about buying a server; my days of fiddling with stuff so I can make the stream to PS3 work are in the past :)
<Myrtti> I need brainbleach
 * StevenR wishes the price of 2TB disks would drop a little
<aquarius> popey, also, you're not kidding you hoard data if you've got 2.9TB lyingn around.
<popey> aquarius: backups of lug.org.uk :()
<popey> amongst other stuff
<aquarius> popey, oh, right, fair play then
<TheFred> Myrtti, brainbleach? wassat?
<Myrtti> I read aquarius' text and my inner voice imitates a certain Stuart...
<TheFred> ah..
<Myrtti> get im off me brain aaarrrggghhh
<popey> aquarius: would you like me to buy an HP microserver, install Ubuntu on it, get the cash back and then send it to you and invoice you?
<TheFred> lool Myr
<TheFred> * Myrtti
<aquarius> popey, no. the problem isn't installing Ubuntu -- I have no problem with that (that's not even hassle, really). It's that at some point after that I'll install, say, mediatomb to stream to my PS3, and then that won't work. And I'll have to go dig through forum posts to find out why, and then ssh in and tweak a config file, and, and, and, life's too short. :)
<aquarius> which is how I feel about it 75% of the time.
<popey> I could offer a remote support contract
<aquarius> in the old days I found that stuff *fun*, but the fun in it has sorta disappeared :)
 * aquarius laughs
<aquarius> you saw above how I can pay less on the hardware and have it work, right? :)
<Myrtti> aquarius: you need an in-house geek
<aquarius> Myrtti, sure thing. If you know of one, say the word
<aquarius> ideally she'd like me, but I can live without. :)
<popey> arent you moving down here to the tropical prosperous south?
<popey> where the roads are paved with servers
<aquarius> nope. It's the glorious Midlands for me :)
<aquarius> so: opinions welcomed. You have about 40 minutes to give me your thoughts, and then I'm buyingn something from ebuyer so it arrives tomorrow :)
<aquarius> hm, the HP will let me actually get going on it tomorrow. The D-Link won't, because I'll have to copy all the data off my drive first. Advantage Microserver, there.
<popey> My opinion is thus:- Buy an HP microserver, do a base install of Ubuntu, ping someone (me happily) here to add whatever other bobbins you want and you're set
<aquarius> popey, assume that I don't want to do things other than media stuff with it, for the purposes of this argument. You really think it's worth twice as much money?
<StevenR> yes
<aquarius> I look forward to hearing justifications thereof :)
<Myrtti> I'd offer my services too but I've got too unpredictable schedule
<StevenR> (I know I'm not popey, but the microserver is more expandable, almost a proper server, probably faster)
<bigcalm> aquarius: At some point you'll think "I wish this thing could do XYZ. Should have bought that micro server"
<popey> +1
<bigcalm> Good evening btw
<aquarius> StevenR, if I just want media stuff, though, what does expandability and proper-serverness buy me? It just has to sit there in a corner and export samba shares. the NAS can do that.
<popey> more space
<popey> you can add disks to it
<popey> you could add an optical drive to it
<aquarius> bigcalm, aha, that's why the fun_plug stuff is interesting. the NAS can run additional programs.
<popey> to enable you to rip stuff
<Myrtti> mpd
<popey> nowhere near as much stuff
<popey> aquarius: backups of your laptop
<aquarius> popey, the NAS has two drive slots, and I've only got a half full 1TB drive right now -- disc space is not likely to cause me a problem, I don't think, although I'm open to challenge on this point.
<popey> do you use get_iplayer
<popey> ?
<aquarius> popey, agreed that fun_plug can do abouut 20 things and Ubuntu can do 20,000 :)
<aquarius> I don't use get_iplayer, or when I do it's rare
<aquarius> backups are in U1. :)
<Myrtti> proxy
<aquarius> proxy?
<popey> not much use when you have only one computer
<popey> useful for people like me with 8 computers on  :D
<aquarius> why would I want a proxy server?
<popey> you probably dont, some people do, you dont
<Myrtti> to have an ip in uk
<popey> oh, that
<aquarius> I already have an IP in the UK :)
<Myrtti> when travelling
<aquarius> ah, right. Don't need that.
<Myrtti> gj
<popey> ohhohhohh!
<StevenR> aquarius: you could also stack the microserver out with RAM and play with VMs
<popey> a know why you need a proxy
<popey> so you can make U1 work with proxies!
<popey> HAH!
<aquarius> popey, I saw that coming. :)
<popey> :D
<aquarius> StevenR, I could do, true. I could also stack the microserver out with wool and then play with knitting, and I don't wanna do that either ;)
<Myrtti> knitting â¥
<aquarius> see, this is what worries me: most (not all) of the cool stuff that you can do with a real server (as opposed to a limited-use NAS) is stuff I don't really wanna do, and it'll cost me extra money for the privilege
<aquarius> hence my vacillation :(
<popey> do get the dlink then?
<StevenR> aquarius: what are you precise requirements?
<Myrtti> http://m.flickr.com/#/photos/myrtti/6053606228/in/set-72157627455086640/ ;-)
<StevenR> just serving audio and files? Anything else?
<aquarius> popey, if it didn't wipe my drive I'd have already bought it. My other question is: am I prepared to pay an extra Â£165 just to avoid copying all the data off? Which I might be ;)
<aquarius> StevenR, er, I think that's it. (Not even sure I need serving files or audio. Just video.) BT client for extra credit.
<StevenR> aquarius: you *will* want to add more disk later.
<StevenR> eventually.
<aquarius> extra extra credit: be able to be put in my car and taken to dad's house, there to act as a USB device to be plugged into his computer so I can download things on his behalf.
<aquarius> StevenR, sure I will. The D-Link has two slots for drives. So I could put 2x2TB in it. By the time I've filled that, there will be 4TB drives or something
<aquarius> I suppose it's possible that I'll suddenly discover a need for 4 separate drives, but at that point (I need 8TB of data storage) I'm bottlenecking on my internet connection to download all that anyway :)
<aquarius> I can't decide whether my problem is that I'm indecisive or whether the two things are genuinely about evenly matched.
<aquarius> which is in itself indecisive :)
<popey> i have a co-worker who has a nas type thing
<popey> bufallo iirc
<popey> he does the copying files around dance now and then
<popey> but he has a couple of computers and photos and stuff
<aquarius> downsides with NASes: 1. they lie about whether they work or not (my existing one never worked *properly*), 2. not as expandable, 3. less robust (which is why current one is dead; house got struck by lightning)
 * StevenR has a DAS instead
<bigcalm> aquarius: so the ethernet ports on the router I gave you did work, it was just your NAS that was buggered?
<StevenR> though I've not got any disks for it yet
<aquarius> bigcalm, indeed, which I was just about to confess :)
<bigcalm> \o/
<aquarius> bigcalm, it finally occurred to me that I could plug my laptop into the router to see if they worked
<aquarius> and they were perfect
<aquarius> nas fail
<bigcalm> Yay and bummer
<aquarius> frustration!
<aquarius> T minus 30 minutes and counting.
<aquarius> Currently leaning towards the microserver
<aquarius> although my inner Scrooge is horrified that I'm basically prepared to pay Â£165 to save myself a few days of waiting and copying files around. :)
<popey> it will put fun back into computing dude
<popey> the dlink i just an appliance
<popey> designed for joe-dipstick
<popey> are you joe-dipstick?
<popey> or are you better than that?
<popey> hmm?
<aquarius> popey, ah, I am expecting all my fun-by-poncing-around credits to get used up by the raspberry-pi in two months. ;)
<StevenR> aquarius: the microserver will be the better bet in the log run.
<popey> which will go in a drawer and never be used
 * StevenR wants a raspberry pi too
<StevenR> I wonder if it can be a myth frontend
<aquarius> heh. I would quite like the *option* of being Joe Dipstick sometimes. It's not that I always hate fiddling -- I mean, my job's in computing, right? -- but sometimes it'd be nice to not *have* to.
<aquarius> StevenR, it can, as long as your videos are encoded right.
<popey> shame it cant run ubuntu
 * aquarius is debating building an e-ink book reader with it :)
<ali1234> you mean, shame ubuntu chose not to support it?
<StevenR> aquarius: well. They're encoded as the mythbox records the DVB stream
<aquarius> popey, yeah. That's our fault rather than theirs though :)
<aquarius> StevenR, ya, so you get to transcode
<popey> ali1234: did they ask for help then?
<popey> or just a byproduct of canonical dropping some arm revs?
<ali1234> that
<popey> right
<StevenR> aquarius: booooo
<ali1234> not that ubuntu would run well on it anyway
<popey> well, there is that âº
<aquarius> it's a bit short of ram, indeed :)
<ali1234> i mean i can understand dropping armv5 when your distro need 4gb to run nice
<ali1234> i'll probably get one if it is really as cheap as they say
<aquarius> 'zactly. Â£25? can't go wrong
<ali1234> i hope it has a nice programmable dsp though
<aquarius> dunno
<ali1234> otherwise it's useless, might as well get a maple mini or something
<aquarius> the media stuff is some clever broadcom thing
<aquarius> "useless" is a bit strong :)
<ali1234> yeah it will be binary drivers
<aquarius> the maple thingy is more like an arduino than a real computer, isn't it?
<ali1234> most likely outcome, you will only be able to use the dsp for opengl-es, and only if you use the specific supported versions of xorg and the kernel
<ali1234> the raspberry is also more like an arduino than a real computer
<ali1234> pretty much the only difference between it and the maple is it has (probably proprietary) video out and more ram
<popey> do we have a BOM of the Raspberry Pi yet?
<ali1234> yes
<ali1234> it's a BCM2835
<TheFred> hey folks, which is the best route to go for starting my own open source project?
<AlanBell> don't!
<AlanBell> find the one someone else has already started that does the thing you want to do
<aquarius> you jest, surely. The raspi has ethernet, two proper USB ports, HDMI out.
<AlanBell> aquarius: it is an SOC :)
<AlanBell> all you need to know is the C
<TheFred> thanks AlanBell
<AlanBell> aquarius: it also has composite out
<aquarius> AlanBell, yeah, I was responding to ali1234 claiming that a maple is the same thing :)
<AlanBell> ah, ok
<hamitron> AlanBell: surely never starting something new, reduces the chances of new ideas? ;)
<AlanBell> I was urging them to move the ethernet port so it has a free side, which would allow it to slide into a keyboard
<AlanBell> hamitron: first prove that it is a new idea
<aquarius> yeah, quite a few people have said "it would be nice if there weren't ports on all four sides" :)
<ali1234> TheFred: just start writing it
<aquarius> nihil sub sole novum.
<hamitron> ali1234: "just do it"
<AlanBell> aquarius: so it would have USB on the left, power and ethernet on the back and HDMI on the right
<hamitron> :D
<popey> Quidquid latine dictum sit, altum videtur.
 * aquarius laughs 
<AlanBell> and would slide into the top right corner of a keyboard with the USB slot making the connection into the keyboard
<TheFred> ali1234, thats one way to go, I'm considering starting a different approach to voice recognition via an android app
<aquarius> indeed it does :)
<ali1234> do not attempt to build "an open source project"
<ali1234> just write the software
<ali1234> attempting to build a community around vapourware never ever works
<bigcalm> Start coding on things to amuse yourself or address a problem you've been having and aren't satisfied with what's out there
<bigcalm> TheFred: ^^
<TheFred> good point
 * popey resists posting the url which has a very rude word in it
<popey> but has programming mother in it
<hamitron> popey: pm it?
<hamitron> ;)
<bigcalm> hamitron: it's easy to guess
<bigcalm> :)
<hamitron> haha
<hamitron> ofc
<hamitron> :)
<Azelphur> popey: would the hp microserver be good as a mythtv front/backend?
 * hamitron thinks it would lack grunt for the backend
<ali1234> the backend is very light
<Azelphur> transcoding?
<hamitron> even recording?
<ali1234> recording is trivial
<ali1234> transocding is pointless, why would you ever want to do that?
<Azelphur> isn't the advert detection expensive
<ali1234> somewhat
<ali1234> but it rarely works anyway
<Azelphur> lol
<hamitron> I'd get something with a faster cpu, just cuz you can
<hamitron> :)
<hamitron> I keep getting tempted to get one, just to "save" Â£100
<hamitron> :/
<Azelphur> yea, as I say it needs to be a frontend anyway
<Azelphur> atm I have an old P4 3ghz with 1GB RAM doing it
<Azelphur> and it's a bit sluggish, and I'm out of hdd space
<ali1234> for frontend you need good graphics
<hamitron> P4 3ghz will be faster
<hamitron> won't it?
<ali1234> nooooooooo
<AlanBell> you need a good power to fan ratio
<Azelphur> It's got a 9500GT for graphics
<Azelphur> :D
<Azelphur> Anyone feel like giving me some git(hub) help for a bit? :P
<Azelphur> this is so frustrating, I've almost spent more time trying to figure out how to use git than I did writing the code I'm trying to submit
<Azelphur> :/
<The_Fred> Azelphur, is that via sourceforge?
<Azelphur> no, github
<gord> pretty much why i don't like git much
<gord> every time i have to use it i have to relearn it and its never natural
<Azelphur> lol
<gord> evern simple things just have weird naming
<Azelphur> I just want to undo a commit I made to github
<Azelphur> and it's driving me insane :/
<The_Fred> Azelphur, i just seen with my sourceforge account that there is an option to have a Git project...
<Azelphur> woo did it
 * The_Fred offers Azelphur  a biscuit to help celebrate
<Azelphur> popey: https://github.com/MostAwesomeDude/bravo/pull/343 woo my first being useful :D
<popey> \o/
<popey> why not use the same format as mc?
<Azelphur> I did?
<popey> tp popey Azelphur
<popey> tp Azelphur popey
<popey> so tphere is kinda redundant
<popey> tppos is handy tho
<Azelphur> oh yea, dunno why I didn't do it the same way
<popey> heh
<popey> nvm
 * popey files a bug
<Azelphur> *shrug*
<Azelphur> noooo >.< lol
<popey> :D
<popey> j/k
<Azelphur> lol
#ubuntu-uk 2011-09-13
<nucc1> how do i find out what the binary for apache2 is on ubuntu server 10.04?
<MartijnVdS> nucc1: http://packages.ubuntu.com/
<ubuntuuk-planet> [Jono Bacon] Community Management Crib Notes: Conflict Resolution - http://www.jonobacon.org/2011/09/13/community-management-crib-notes-conflict-resolution/
<hoover> morning all
<popey> morning
<diplo> morning
<bigcalm> Morning peeps :)
<MartijnVdS> \o bc
<bigcalm> o/
<JamesTait> Good morning, everyone! :-D
<hoover> mornin JamesTait
<Pernig> morning James
<diplo> .
<DJones> Morning all
<Myrtti> moin
 * Myrtti looks at her inbox. :sadface:
<bigcalm> Mitta?
<bigcalm> I still find myself saying Mitta, Kiitos and Maito
<bigcalm> Wow, just recited the alphabet in Finnish
<bigcalm> I need coffee!
<christel> o.O
<bigcalm> christel: I was with a _crazy_ Finn for 4 years. Some things rub off.
<bigcalm> I am in no way saying that all Finns are crazy :)
<christel> hehe
 * bigcalm tickles christel for a giggle
<Myrtti> bigcalm: no important email :-(
<bigcalm> Myrtti: Google?
<Myrtti> total silence from everywhere Ive applied :-(
<bigcalm> Myrtti: I'm sorry :(
<brobostigon> morning everyone.
<dogmatic69> o/
<daubers> o/
<brobostigon> o/
<MartijnVdS> \o
<MartijnVdS> (that was left-handed!)
<jpds> No, that was your right-hand.
<MartijnVdS> jpds: it was not.
<jpds> It's like a mirror.
<MartijnVdS> jpds: no you're looking at the back of everybody's heads
<bigcalm> <o/
<MartijnVdS> bigcalm: "YMCA"?
<jpds> MartijnVdS: Why would you be waving at us facing the other way?
<bigcalm> Wave you hands in the air, like you just don't care
<jpds> Anywya.
 * daubers requires foodstuffs
<bigcalm> I had poptarts this morning
<bigcalm> I blame gord
<daubers> poptarts are evil
<kirrus> why? They're awesome
<daubers> They're like the endermen of foodstuffs. They're fine until you look at them, then they teleport to you and attack you with their hot sugary calorificness
<daubers> Now I want poptarts
<daubers>  /o\
<bigcalm> Bwuhaha
 * daubers wonders if a stupid delivery company will actually succeed in delivering his package, against all the experience of said  company failing in every regard
<kirrus> daubers: which company?
<daubers> kirrus: Yodel (used to be called Home Delivery Network)
<kirrus> Oh... I've got a package coming with them today...
<kirrus> :/
<daubers> kirrus: Anything exciting? Mines OU course stuff, fully expecting to have to go to their depot and collect it
<daubers> (although last time I arranged that with them they decided to redeliver it.... never did get that package)
<kirrus> Books! Fiction.
<daubers> kirrus: From Amazon?
<kirrus> Yup
<daubers> Hmm.... http://twitter.com/#!/RoughleeHandled/status/113536810092740608
<daubers> I think the parcel I never recieved was an amazon one. Was an electric razor. Went and bought it from Boots in the end
<czajkowski> TheOpenSourcerer: http://t.co/nWtb9sy
<daubers> Sometimes I think the high street survives because of the poor quality of delivery services in the UK
<dogmatic69> lol
<dogmatic69> you should try delivery service in other countries...
<daubers> dogmatic69: Since I moved to reading, I haven't had a single package actually delivered. Always had to go collect them
<dogmatic69> daubers: in south africa i never had a single package actually delivered. they all got stolen
<daubers> dogmatic69: Well, if you will live in SA
<dogmatic69> nope, i live in a country with awesome postal service... the UK :)
<davmor2> MooDoo: anything?
<davmor2> czajkowski: prod, prod, prod, prod, prod, prod, prod......etc
<czajkowski> davmor2: oi oi oi oi
<davmor2> everyone morning all
<daubers> dogmatic69: I'll agree with you if the day I don't have to make a 40 mile roundtrip to collect something I paid someone else to deliver to me
<davmor2> czajkowski: well can't pick on you for a while, while you get settled so I need to get it out of my system :P
<christel> czajkowski: are you all ready for tomorrow? :)
<dogmatic69> daubers: get a bigger post flap thing
<czajkowski> christel: yup :D
<christel> :D
<dogmatic69> the post guys normally push packages through my window if its too big
<daubers> dogmatic69: That doesn't seem to be the issue. I don't even get cards saying "We tried to deliver but you where out" I end up ringing them, askign where my package is and get told they left a card (which they didn't)
<dogmatic69> or i get it delivered to work where there is always someone about
<dogmatic69> strange
<dogmatic69> you must have the black sheep of royal mail doing deliveries
<daubers> dogmatic69: RM actually leave cards (which is fine), other delivery companies tend to not bother
<dogmatic69> ah.. like fedex etc?
<daubers> Yodel is the worst as I arranged to collect it, went to get it and they'd sent it out for redelivery (which never arrived and had no card)
<daubers> Remeber having something being delievered by city link that after two days of rearranging delivery I went to their depot and complained. They found my package (a Psion Revo) in the rubbish pile
<oimon> psion revo \o/
 * BigRedS wants a psion again
<BigRedS> does the revo do wifi?
<bigcalm> BigRedS: yes
<bigcalm> BigRedS: I have a Psion II if you want it ;)
<bigcalm> Or had, doubt it's been chucked
<oimon> i have a revo too if anyone wants
<oimon> plus i have the dock somewhere too.
<BigRedS> bigcalm: ooooh! I had a 3 and then a 5mx. I'm trying to think what teh II was like
<oimon> BigRedS: no wifi or bluetooth, but best OS ever until android
<BigRedS> haha, just had a quick google
<bigcalm> I think we might be thinking of different revos
<oimon> the agenda and spreadsheet app were ace
<BigRedS> there was a bit of a jump from II to 3 :)
<bigcalm> BigRedS: think brick
<bigcalm> Just a little
<daubers> Had rubbish batteries
<bigcalm> Yep
<BigRedS> oimon: It was all about battleships over IR
<oimon> BigRedS: i miised out on that :(
<oimon> only user i knew
<oimon> i read books on it, and did my accounts
<daubers> Battleships was cool
<oimon> my wife used it until last year when she got an htc
<oimon> the only problem was when the rechargeable batteries died, you lost your data :(
<BigRedS> oimon: Oooh, I don't remember that, but I was very good at syncing and charging
<daubers> Changing the batteries in the revo was a nightmare. Had to resort to a soldering iron
<oimon> lol, i bought replacements from ebay designed for revo
<BigRedS> haha
<BigRedS> Oh! The revo does bluetooth apparently
<BigRedS> so I might be able to get to the internets via that :) Wonder if there's an epoc ssh client
<daubers> BigRedS: if in doubt, there is a *nix ported to ir
<daubers> http://linux-7110.sourceforge.net/
<BigRedS> oh! This looks dangerously like becoming a project...
<BigRedS> Awww, that's Sarge based. That makes it even better :)
<oimon> BigRedS: psion revo doesn't do BT
<oimon> although there was a colour prototype made with BT
<BigRedS> oimon: ahh, yeah I'm seeing conflicting reports on BT
<dogmatic69> what is the best way to do dual boot?
<dogmatic69> looks like im forced to use windows for something :/
<BigRedS> er, with grub?
<BigRedS> dogmatic69: I'd create an empty space for Windows, install it there, then boot from a LiveCD to reinstall grub
<BigRedS> or stick it in a VM, which is an awful lot less hassle
<BigRedS> but really not dual-booting. It depends what you need Windows for
<dogmatic69> well i need it for a vinyl cutter
<dogmatic69> so dont know if vm will pass the port along properly
<BigRedS> ah yeah, then a dual boot is your better bet
<dogmatic69> need to make this work http://www.direct-shops.co.uk/products.php?product=Professional-Vinyl-Cutter-Cutting-Plotter-28%22-With-Optical-Eye
<dogmatic69> would be super happy if it worked on ubuntu
<bigcalm> Wine no good?
<dogmatic69> im sure ps files would work some how
<davmor2> czajkowski: MooDoo + Mrs MooDoo == Baby girl ahhhhhhhhhhhhhh
<czajkowski> davmor2: I saw on saturday
<czajkowski> so nice
<davmor2> meh I didn't get the news till I saw it on FB this morning :(
<czajkowski> davmor2: was on SAturday same day as the other kid
<diplo> Anyone in here ever used rpmbuild ?
<davmor2> czajkowski: Hopefully she takes after her Mom for looks if she looks like her dad I'd get to practice here LadyGAGA impressions from a early age :D
<davmor2> czajkowski: it was always going to be wasn't it as soon as MooDoo said any day but....
<oimon> diplo: yes
<czajkowski> davmor2: aye
<diplo> Trying to build cups oimon, last error and It should do it..
<diplo> RPM build errors: File not found by glob: /tmp/cups-root/usr/share/icons/*
<diplo> Any ideas ?
<diplo> CentOS channel is not exactly the nicest place to be at times :)
<oimon> are you rebuilding from SRPM?
<oimon> diplo: come to #slforum and we'll discuss in there :)
<aquarius> anyone know if there's a thing to let you do presentations from a phone? that is: a phone-USB-socket-to-VGA connector and associated software?
 * popey hands aquarius an ipad
<oimon> i still think of feminine hygeine products when I see ipad mentioned :-\
<oimon> would be cool in future to connect a raspberry pi with bluetooth dongle to the projector, and control the presentation with a bluetooth presenter gadget
<nigelb> popey: I now am a fan of your ideology. Things that work.
<aquarius> popey: the idea is to work with my phone, which fits in my pocket. If I have to carry an ipad I might as well carry my laptop :)
<popey> what ports does your phone have?
<popey> HDMI?
<czajkowski> they're very lgith and fit in my handbag
<czajkowski> *light
<jonsaint> hi all. can anyone help?? i got an iphone 4, can anyone tell me if itunes will work on ubuntu so i can keep my phone updated?
<oimon> "TheÂ DroidÂ X is the second smartphone to get anÂ HDMI outÂ port that allows you to connect the device to a projector or flat panel television"
<oimon> probably lots more since then
<dwatkins> jonsaint: itunes itself won't work natively on Ubuntu, but there are alternative applications (they won't update your phone, though)
<dwatkins> !itunes
<lubotu3> itunes is not available on Linux, but there are many audio player alternatives (see !players). For Daap clients (sharing music with other iTunes clients on the network), install banshee
 * AlanBell thinks aquarius would like the Samsung Galaxy Beam
<jonsaint> drat. looks like il have to keep my pc as a dual boot then :-(
<AlanBell> although it is probably a little less than awesome as a projector
<dwatkins> jonsaint: you could run windows in a virtual machine with VirtualBox for itunes etc.
<jonsaint> dwatkins, sorry but im new to all this and i wouldnt have a clue what to do lol
 * oimon wonders if "update phone" means system updates or add new songs to it
<aquarius> AlanBell, ah, no, that's a phone with a projector *in* it. I'm thinking of doing presentations at lugs or whatever where they already have a projector
<AlanBell> aquarius: yeah, fun concept form factor though! Not sure how practical it really is
<aquarius> pico projectors *drink* battery :)
<dwatkins> good point oimon - which do you want to do, jonsaint?
<aquarius> it is interesting, but not what I'm looking for :)
<dwatkins> pico projectors also need a really dark room as they're not very bright
<AlanBell> aquarius: there is a reasonable chance of getting hdmi out of a phone, possibly with a docking adapter or MHL http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mobile_High-definition_Link
<jonsaint> well ive fell in love with ubuntu but know little about it. all im worried about is keeping my iphone updated. if i can find a way on ubuntu then il wipe my drive and just have ubuntu on here
<aquarius> AlanBell, ooh, that's interesting
<dwatkins> jonsaint: do you mean 'keeping the phone updated with the latest software'?
<jonsaint> yes
<AlanBell> VGA is unlikely, no analog circuits
<AlanBell> jonsaint: can't the iPhone do over the air updates?
<jonsaint> not sure. ive always done updates via itunes
<aquarius> dammit, I'd have to buy a Samsung Galaxy S II. :(
<dwatkins> jonsaint: I suspect you don't absolutely need to do this, and in fact it might be best not to update it all the time, as it might possibly break support for Amarok, Banshee or whatever you're using in Ubuntu to copy music to it
<aquarius> I don't mind having a little box with a vga socket on it and a micro-usb lead poking out the side or whatever
<dwatkins> jonsaint: no reason you can't keep the windows partition for booting occasionally to run updates on your phone, though.
<AlanBell> I thought they were only a brick when you get them, after they have been introduced to itunes and your credit card they are fine to manage from other players
<jonsaint> bit of a pain in the ass tho to have 2. would be good if i could turn on my pc and have just ubuntu on there
<dwatkins> jonsaint: yeah, I sometimes use a virtual machine for windows-only apps, in theory it should work ok, but your mileage may vary as usual with this sort of thing.
<jonsaint> all i actually need windows for is my itunes update for my phone software
<dwatkins> why do you need to update your phone, jonsaint?
<AlanBell> I don't think you need that
<jonsaint> well i was told by a few folks to keep the updates current for the phone
<dwatkins> (I appreciate there are often security fixes and so on, but I would hope there weren't any vulnerabilities that were accessible from the mobile phone network)
<jonsaint> i dont really use it for music
<dwatkins> I don't tend to update my iphone, but that's beause I'm a naughty jailbreak user ;)
<jonsaint> haha. superb!
<dwatkins> I also don't update it because as my primary communication device, I don't want it to potentially break when a software update causes problems, but I accept that's more likely because I've jailbroken it.
<shauno> fwiw, ios5 goes a long way towards unchaining from itunes.  it does over-the-air updates, first-time setup without itunes, etc.  doesn't help you right now, but requiring a VM will go away eventually
<dwatkins> that's good to know, shauno - I gather they also hired the developer of mobilenotifier, which makes iOS have some much needed improvements to the notification mechanism.
<daubers> When OTA updates appears on IOS I'm sure Apple will start pointing out how android copied it
<dwatkins> jonsaint: since you're new to Ubuntu, I suggest the simplest solution would be to keep a windows partition so you have the option of dual-booting if necessary, then you can update the phone if you desire.
<dwatkins> You should be able to run itunes inside a virtual instance of Windows, but I've read there can be problems with the phone being recognised.
<popey> 13:11:04 < AlanBell> jonsaint: can't the iPhone do over the air updates?
<popey> In iOS5, yes, not before
<dwatkins> I'd start by reading this thread, for example, just make sure you have backups and other methods of transferring data etc. jonsaint - http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=687098
<popey> daubers: its already here, I do OTA updates on my iPhone
<popey> itunes in a VM is painful
<daubers> popey: My missus will never be able too (unless she updates her iPhone)
<popey> so update it?
<popey> (when iOS5 releases)
<daubers> popey: Also, iOS 5 is still only being seeded isn't it? Didn't think it was on general release (just dev accounts)
<jonsaint> can an iphone be updated without itunes then?
<daubers> popey: Didn't think iOS5 works on a 3GS
<daubers> jonsaint: Not yet
<popey> correct
<TheOpenSourcerer> Mrs TheOpenSourcerer uses iTunes in a VM and is living with it.
<popey> jonsaint: in iOS5, yes
<popey> due for release in October AIUI
<jonsaint> what is this i0s5?? all new to me lol
<shauno> the next major software update for your phone, makes it a little less addicted to itunes
 * dwatkins heads off to the station
<dwatkins> have fun, folks ;)
<daubers> jonsaint: Cisco's Internetwork Operating System (until apple took the name anyway)
<AlanBell> it is Apple's version of Android :)
<jonsaint> so whats this new update supposed o do?#
<bigcalm> AlanBell: lol
<daubers> jonsaint: It will let you update without iTunes
<jonsaint> ah superb
<daubers> jonsaint: Amongst other things
<jonsaint> more like apple being able to spy on us more you mean lol
 * czajkowski does the 1 more day back to work dance :)
<daubers> either way, I lost interest in ios ages ago. Can't do anything interesting in it
<jonsaint> looks like keeping it dual boot then. but when his new update happens, i can get rid of windows then??
<popey> yes, and no
<jonsaint> yes and no?????
<popey> well, you can software update over the air, you can get music on using ubuntu based music apps
<popey> not sure about application installation
<popey> you can of course install _some_ apps over the air
<jonsaint> ah right
<popey> but some require installing via itunes
<popey> you can backup to the 'icloud'
<jonsaint> cheers for all the info. better shoot and get back to doing some sort of work lol
<popey> :D
<czajkowski> davmor2: you on oneiric there ?
<davmor2> czajkowski: I have an oneiric box yes
<czajkowski> davmor2: click on your date and time and try and move to october cal please
<czajkowski> or any other cal other than september
<davmor2> czajkowski: can't move it fullstop
<czajkowski> me neither
<czajkowski> bit of a bug no
<davmor2> czajkowski: pass I think it's known I'm hoping that they include lightning if they are sticking with TB and actually have a working calendar again
<czajkowski> davmor2: I cant even boot to Unity 3d any more
<czajkowski> find me a bug on that
<czajkowski> I tried what popey suggested by creating a new user and logging in via that
<czajkowski> but no good
<davmor2> czajkowski: yes but you break stuff without trying anyway so that doesn't count :P
<czajkowski> davmor2: no my fault it worked yesterday. update/upgrade shut down restart and kapoof no worky
<czajkowski> most fliping annoying
<oimon> need to stop trusting my weather app :(
<popey> czajkowski: any errors in the home directory of the new user?
<popey> like ~/.xsession-errors ?
<czajkowski> lemmie see
<czajkowski> nope :/
<czajkowski> don't know how to report the bug I have atm though and nobody seems to have a similar issues
<czajkowski> maybe tis just cypher begining to die
<gord> Myrtti, shame you already got a 3ds, nintendo just announced a new colour :) http://www.next-gen.biz/files/images/3DS_misty_pink_426.jpg
<oimon> czajkowski: which graphics card?
<davmor2> czajkowski: fresh install and stop beating round the bush with it ;)
<czajkowski> whats the command again for that ?
<czajkowski> davmor2: noooo
<oimon> lspci | grep -i vga
<davmor2> czajkowski: lshw -html file.html and then post that on your server and direct oimon at it :)
<TheOpenSourcerer> czajkowski: Who you going to be working for then?
<czajkowski> TheOpenSourcerer: codegent.com
<oimon> you call them to hire a well-dressed developer?
<oimon> what do people think of this story? http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-14887428 'Wi-fi refugees' shelter in West Virginia mountains
<TheOpenSourcerer> Cool. Good luck.
<TheOpenSourcerer> And don't expect to me to say anything more nice to you until after the RWC - or at least until you are out ;-)
<czajkowski> davmor2: http://paste.ubuntu.com/688311/
<czajkowski> TheOpenSourcerer: hey you barely got through the othe day
<czajkowski> be careful
<oimon> Mobile GM965/GL960 Integrated Graphics Controller
<davmor2> czajkowski: why you telling me you hw I said point oimon at it ;) oimon over to you
<Myrtti> gord: I don't buy pink electronics
<gord> Myrtti, oh, aren't you the person with pink on highlight?
<Myrtti> gord: I am, but I still don't buy pink electronics
<czajkowski> gord: pleia2 does
<Myrtti> I think she has 3DS alreaedy tooo
<Myrtti> for some unknown reason I think pink electronics have smaller resale value
<Myrtti> so I don't buy pink electronics
<oimon> czajkowski: ugly hack, but have you tried forcing unity to start?
<czajkowski> nope
<czajkowski> how ?
<oimon> Add "UNITY_FORCE_START=1" to the  "/etc/environment" file
<czajkowski> ah ok
<czajkowski> will try that
<AlanBell> http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/ubuntu-uk/1283/detail/ release party \o/
<BigRedS> whoop!
<bigcalm> Do I really want to venture all the way to London?
<andylockran> hey guys - I have a pdf
<andylockran> if I print it from acroread in X, then it prints great with the default settings on my printer
<andylockran> (set in cups)
<andylockran> but how do I get that same output from lp - it prints a test page fine, but send it the pdf and it prints nowt :(
<andylockran> *desperate*
<daubers> andylockran: Convert it to postscript?
<BigRedS> bigcalm: yes
<AlanBell> andylockran: you need to pipe it through ghostscript
<BigRedS> bah. why is it midweek? that's a silly idea
 * daubers needs coffee
<andylockran> AlanBell: ooh?
<AlanBell> BigRedS: it is always on a Thursday unless they get excited by 10/10/10 and put it on Sunday
<bigcalm> What time of day would the release party be?
<AlanBell> it is an evening thing
<AlanBell> after work drinks
<bigcalm> I would have to take 2 days off work
<bigcalm> Or 2 half daysa
<bigcalm> -a
<AlanBell> or . . . organise a release party somewhere more convenient
<bigcalm> Having never been to one, I don't really want to host one
<BigRedS> Oh, I really should have spotted that pattern
<BigRedS> I think every year I complain about it :)
<AlanBell> that is why we are doing the happy hours
<AlanBell> on reflection starting in London does put it a bit close to the release party
<czajkowski> If I hear one mention of it's i London on the ML I will throttle someone
<czajkowski> if you wnat a release party in your area, organise one ! aka do something, even if tis go to a pub and drink and talk mingle
<AlanBell> I will mail the list shortly with a pre-emptive paragraph about that
<AlanBell> and referencing the happy hours
<AlanBell> the second of which I will also announce
<bigcalm> I'm not complaining, just gathering information :)
<AlanBell> and I think the third happy hour might be in Nottingham
<Laney> yeah?
<andylockran> AlanBell: doesn't look like that's working for me.. the printer is ps compatibl
<oimon> andylockran: tried running pdf2ps on the file and printing the resulting file?
<AlanBell> Laney: pick a day in November
<Laney> 25
<Laney> is 8 late for people to travel? or do you only expect locals?
<Laney> also oneiric's release date coincides with the nottingham beer festival
<Laney> how happy that is
<AlanBell> there isn't a hard defined start time
<AlanBell> just with the happy hours I want to specify a defined hour where you can expect to find people
<AlanBell> so November 25th in Nottingham?
<Laney> probably works
<aaronr> I've recently had a server handed off to me that's running the unsupported Ubuntu 9.04, unfortunately the upgrade path requires going through the also-now-unsupported 9.10. Are there any docs on how to deal with this?
<drussell> aaronr: not as far as I know... essentially backup anything important, cross your fingers and go through the upgrades until you reach something supported.
<aaronr> heh. thought that might be the answer.
<aaronr> no probs.
<drussell> aaronr: good luck :o)
<aaronr> haha, thanks :)
<Myrtti> yeah, skipping versions isn't supported unless it's from LTS to LTS
<aaronr> yeah. i'm guessing that do-release-upgrade will fail because the repo for 9.10 has moved to old-releases
<popey> uhm
<popey> have you tried it?
<popey> aaronr: https://help.ubuntu.com/community/EOLUpgrades
<aaronr> popey: yeah i read that, but won't that expect the "next" release to not be on old-releases too?
<aaronr> i mean sure, i can make the current release know it's on old-releases, but do-release-upgrades rewrites /etc/apt/sources.list
<popey> tbh I'd just modify the sources list and do a dist-upgrade
<Lcawte> Release party at a pub eh? Hmm
<aaronr> i thought doing dist-upgrade was bad now do-release-upgrade was around?
<czajkowski> Lcawte: always is
<popey> aaronr: do-release-upgrade is better. and I would try it first, but if it fails I'd do the dist-upgrade route
<aaronr> okay. thanks.
<AlanBell> Lcawte: we do non-pub events too, but the release parties are somewhat unavoidably pubish
<Myrtti> hm
<Myrtti> I think the correct term would be "have been"
<Myrtti> or even "historically have been"
<AlanBell> for the parties Myrtti?
<Myrtti> yeah
<Myrtti> what is that sentence the banks put in their adverts...
<popey> Your home is at risk if you do not keep up repayments on a loan secured against it?
<AlanBell> the London after work on the last day thing that the Canonical engineers turn up to will be in a pub
<popey> The value of your investment may go down as well as up?
<AlanBell> it is beyond my ability to alter that
<Myrtti> "past performance does not guarantee future results"
<popey> thassim
<AlanBell> if at first you don't succeed, give up
 * bigcalm gives up trying to be smelly and has a shower
<shauno> if at first you don't succeed, skydiving isn't for you :/
<bigcalm> That sounds like Milton Jones
<Myrtti> meh
<Myrtti> I like the Finnish undergraduate education system
<Myrtti> I know where to look for studies in such and such
<MartijnVdS> Hmm.. stack of new music \o/
<smittix> heh I like the screenshot camera sound in 11.10
<ubuntuuk-planet> [Dominic Watkins] Some useful apps for Mac OS X - http://rowla.dyndns.org/blog/2011/09/13/some-useful-apps-for-mac-os-x/
 * popey emails zoostorm asking if they will supply a naked pc
<Myrtti> has anyone used or tried shotwell in oneiric?
<MartijnVdS> I have
<Myrtti> do you use Flickr?
<MartijnVdS> yes, but not from shotwell
<MartijnVdS> shotwell + raw doesn't work nicely yes, so I load raw into shotwell, then process to jpg, and upload the jpgs to flickr using postr
<Myrtti> ah
<smittix> I still love DigiKam for that kind of thing. When im using my kubuntu machine
<smittix> export straight to flickr
<Catbuskris> anyone know a good program for recording video with webcam?
<smittix> Catbuskris: You can do it with VLC iirc
<The_Fred> check out 'monitor', I know it does still, but i think i recall somemention in the man pages about .avi's
<Catbuskris> thanks guys
<smittix> Catbuskris: See here http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=143732
<Catbuskris> what is my audio device??? ls /dev/audio* returns no results
<Catbuskris> i can record video on VLC but no sound :(
<bigcalm> Catbuskris: in the Software Centre, look for PulseAudio Volume Control
<bigcalm> Catbuskris: that will give you more control over input and output hardware
<Catbuskris> but bigcalm, i don't know what to put in th "audio device name" box analogous to "video device name".  According to PulseAudio the devices are called "Analogue/Internal Microphone"
<Azelphur> so my friend sent me a pic of the desk he built, it looks like what I want. http://dl.dropbox.com/u/23102991/IMG_0772.JPG anyone know where I might get something like that?
<Azelphur> perhaps without the weird middle cupboard, but that kinda shape desk :D
<MartijnVdS> Azelphur: IKEA kitchen cupboard + kitchen worktop?
<Azelphur> except I don't want to build it myself :p
 * Azelphur is scared of power tools
<mgdm> If it's IKEA stuff you won't need to
<mgdm> I mean, no power tools at least
<MartijnVdS> mgdm: for customizing it like that you might need to
<MartijnVdS> but IKEA has nice desks
<tonytiger> Evening all
<tonytiger> I hope you're going to listen in in an hour or so
<Azelphur> why would we want to do that :o
 * Azelphur runs
<Azelphur> tonytiger: what are you doing in an hour or so? :)
<MartijnVdS> Azelphur: ubuntu-uk-podcast-recording, I think
<tonytiger> :)
<Azelphur> ah cool :D
 * MartijnVdS watches the Star Wars bluray
<davmor2> MartijnVdS: is it the same as the normal version?
<AlanBell> Han shot first
<AlanBell> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_changes_in_Star_Wars_re-releases#Blu-ray_edition
<StevenR> AlanBell: the way it should be :)
<andybleaden> Hi All tweeted a few days ago about the possibility of setting up a Launch party sometime in October in Manchester. Firstly, anybody doing one already. Secondly I was thinking of try to approach Madlab to possibly host it and thirdly..who would like to come?
<AlanBell> hi andybleaden
<andybleaden> hi
<AlanBell> I don't know of anyone doing one already
<andybleaden> good...did want to tread on toes
<AlanBell> there was mention of Leeds on the list, but not Manchester
<andybleaden> AlanBell, Is there many do es and donts ...not done one before
<AlanBell> don't pay for a venue, just nominate a pub
<AlanBell> make sure there are at least a handful of people likely to turn up
<andybleaden> so pubs better I guess
<andybleaden> just thinking about wifi
<AlanBell> don't worry about wifi
<andybleaden> and the madlab place sounds cool
<andybleaden> aha
<andybleaden> hmm
<AlanBell> if you can do something at madlab then that would be cool
<andybleaden> AlanBell, how come wifi not a problem..people too busy drinking beer!
<AlanBell> yes
<andybleaden> outragious
<AlanBell> and just tether a phone if anyone wants it
<andybleaden> ah
<AlanBell> generally on the release day parties some people kick off a torrent before going out
<andybleaden> so having not been to one...what happens
<andybleaden> torrent..what of the release?
<AlanBell> however downloading a CD now takes about a minute or two on fast broadband :)
<andybleaden> So do some CDs pen drives etc
<andybleaden> Anyway ...anyone here from the North West who would like to come along to a Launch party in Manchester in October
<andybleaden> or even outside of the north west if they can come
<nucc1> i'm experiencing some weird issue with postfix, courier and sasl authentication. If i append any number of extra characters to the supplied password, authentication still passes
<mgdm> how many characters is the password?
<nucc1> 8 characters
<nucc1> only the first 8 characters are checked?
<mgdm> that's probably it then - depending on the way the passwords are stored it'll only check 8
<nucc1> mgdm, darn.
<nucc1> first, it requires plaintext passwords, then it only checks 8 chars.
<nucc1> i shudder.
<nucc1> i should look into a better scheme.
<mgdm> I have my Postfix and Dovecot set up to use TLS, but I'm fairly sure it uses more than 8 chars
<nucc1> what did you mean by "depending on the way the passwords are stored?"
<nucc1> they are stored in a mysql database
<nucc1> i'm using TLS too
<mgdm> well if you'd ended up using an old-school Unix crypt scheme at the back end, that'd only check 8 chars
<nucc1> the second problem is that smtp always fails with a message Authentication Failure
<nucc1> mgdm, what scheme are you using at your backend?
<mgdm> just the system shadow PW DB
<nucc1> i want to use a mysql database
<nucc1> because i'm using virtual domains
<mgdm> (probably not a brilliant idea in the long run, but I've got got around to changing)
<nucc1> mgdm, do you happen to know where the backend scheme is specified?
<nucc1> in my /etc/pam.d/smtp , i find that each line ends with crypt=1
<nucc1> and i don't quite understand what that means.
<mgdm> nucc1: I'm afraid not, I don't use SASL directly - I use Dovecot's authentication stuff instead, it's far easier to handle
<nucc1> mgdm, ok. i'll consider dovecot if this courier stuff proves to be too troublesome
<mgdm> I highly recommend it
<mgdm> It can talk to MySQL as well
<nucc1> mgdm, what they call it. cognitive dissonance? i just want to justify the effort i've already put into courier at this stage :p
<nucc1> but i'll give up if i don't succeed in the next 2 hours.
<j0nr> hey folks
<Laney> I am doing that right now with a particular build failure
<mgdm> nucc1: ah yes, I can understand that
<Laney> keep getting further and then hitting more problems
<Laney> but now I'm in too deep and have to see it through
<Laney> oh, works \o/
<j0nr> I am trying to get xbmc running on server edition. I therefore need to be able to launch it with xinit or something...as I do not want to run a full on desktop environment. I am struggling to get video driver working.... starting to get in a bit of a mess
<aquarius> j0nr, any reason why you don't want to run a full desktop environment? I mean, a lightweight window manager will not be any serious use of resources, and then all these problems go away, no?
<aquarius> install openbox or something like that
<aquarius> and then, pow, you've got proper X
<aquarius> and your video stuff will work :)
<j0nr> aquarius: Maybe I will try
<j0nr> as I am lost
<AlanBell> j0nr: what hardware?
<aquarius> j0nr, yeah. I suspect that'll help. install lubuntu-desktop, say, to get a Lubuntu system, and then work from there; that way, people who are prepared to delve into the misery of X and graphics and drivers and such are solving your problem, so you don't have to
<aquarius> (or, to be honest, just run real Ubuntu desktop. That's what I do on my Revo with boxee, and it's fine; a desktop environment that isn't doing anything doesn't use up resources.)
<j0nr> AlanBell: radaon mobility rv250
<AlanBell> that is just the graphics card right?
<j0nr> AlanBell: yes, its  Dell D600 Latitude
<j0nr> aquarius: the only thing it when I flick my tv to the pc input, i will be seeing a desktop right? I really just wanted to start 'xinit xbmc', so that when I went to PC on the tv, I would just see XBMC interface
<j0nr> so it is more of a media centre than just a pc plugged into the tv
<aquarius> j0nr, just put xbmc in your Startup Programs
<j0nr> certainly want to not have to sit with a keyboard and mouse
<aquarius> then as soon as the desktop starts, so will xbmc.
<j0nr> hm, yeah :)
<aquarius> search for Startup Applications in the dash
<j0nr> i'll give it a go... just worried as I am limited to 500mb RAM
<aquarius> and that way you get all the sensible ways to do things like configure the screensaver, etc.
<aquarius> well... lubuntu desktop might be a good way to go if you find that proper Ubuntu is too much for your machine
<aquarius> they do a reasonable job at making a lightweight desktop; I'm sure it has some way of setting a startup application :)
<j0nr> but is it differetn under the skin? i.e. right now I have server-edition installed. Is the difference between ubuntu and lubuntu just whether I install ubunut-desktop or lubuntu-desktop (in a manner of speaking)
<aquarius> j0nr, that's indeed the difference. The underlying infrastructure is the same for both
<diplo> evening all
<diplo> What do you guys use for ripping CD's ?
<j0nr> aquarius: downloading lubuntu - a fresh start methinks... cheers
<mgdm> diplo: sound juicer, I think it's called
<diplo> heh ta mgdm just found in software centre
<diplo> Giving it a go now
<mgdm> If you want to rip to MP3, you need to fiddle with the presets a bit
<aquarius> diplo, I rip CDs with the standard music player (Banshee). Nice and easy
<mgdm> Banshee's the standard now?
<diplo> oh not tried that, will take a look ta
<mgdm> Oh
<doc_matt> I still use grip ..
<doc_matt> does a better job with id3 tags on ogg vorbis
<doc_matt> or at least, it did last time I tried banshee
<diplo> not heard of grip either, got to be mp3's though  :/
<doc_matt> grip is quite ..old ..
<doc_matt> not even sure it's still being maintained
<diplo> I've always used CDEX on windows, never ripped under linux i don't think yet ive been using for years
<diplo> not in ubuntu repos
<doc_matt> my installs go a way back
<doc_matt> some stuff hanging around from a while ago
<diplo> :)
<shauno> spent almost an hour picking colours for various shell prompts.  tis an exciting life.
#ubuntu-uk 2011-09-14
<selinuxium> Morinng all, anyone still up?
<sammmm> HazRPG: I just went for a really big dump, but instead of it coming out in one massive piece, it came out in lots of small pieces.
<sammmm> The first bit was a little hard, but then it was plain sailing. :)
<sammmm> HazRPG: And I only bled a little bit on the toilet paper. :)
<Azelphur> !ops
<lubotu3> Help!  dgjones, Myrtti, Mez, jono, popey, Gary, Seeker`, Daviey, PriceChild or X3N
<Azelphur> nobody awake for that one, :(
<HazRPG> apparently not
<HazRPG> sammm: btw, just to point out... tis a family-orientated channel, plus it is logged
<HazRPG> e.g. http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/2011/09/13/%23ubuntu-uk.html
<sammm> HazRPG: OMG
<HazRPG> sammm: not know it was logged?
<sammm> HazRPG: Maybe we should stop talking to each other here.
<sammm> HazRPG: No.
<HazRPG> does say in the topic dude :P
<HazRPG> first rule of irc: always read the topic before you enter/post :P
<HazRPG> first (unwritten) rule*
<czajkowski> aloha
<AlanBell> morning
<TheOpenSourcerer> mornign all.
<TheOpenSourcerer> https://twitter.com/#!/opensourcerer/status/113854270767509504
<czajkowski> TheOpenSourcerer: awwww
<TheOpenSourcerer> How kid's tastes have changed eh? Imagine asking your mum & dad for one of these for your birthday: http://www.montezumas.co.uk/search/showitem.asp?r=&q=chilli&g=&i=1477&pg=1
<Azelphur> it's a popey, morning popey \o/
<popey> mng
<diplo> Morning all
<Azelphur> night all :D
 * Azelphur wanders off to sleep
<czajkowski> popey: you're missing from over there--->
<smittix> Morning all
<andylockran> morning sportsfans
<hoover> good morning
<DJones> Morning all
<smittix> Can anyone recommend anywhere to purchase a VPS?
<smittix> lowest cost would be good
<andylockran> bitfolk is a good bet
<smittix> ta, I will take a look
<danfish> smittix: amazon are offering more or less free micro instances for the first year
<MartijnVdS> "first one's free", like a drug dealer ;)
<smittix> heh
<smittix> Well I found one thats 512mb Ram, 1ghz Processor, 50gb HD and Unmetered bandwidth for Â£8pm
<gord> i don't really understand the concept of kickstarter - it seems to be people who have buckets, they are asking other people to put money in the bucket so they can have the money so they can start doing something to make money
<MartijnVdS> gord: as you know, it's impossible to make any money at all without a big investment
<gord> but its not an investment
<gord> its a donation
<gord> thats what i don't get
<MartijnVdS> even better! don't have to pay it back!
<MartijnVdS> free moneys
<gord> i get that its great for the people on kickstarter, i just don't get why anyone would give money to it, you won't get it back
<danfish> gord: it's a pyramid scheme, but with less risk of going to gaol ;)
<JamesTait> Good morning, all!
<danfish> o/
<gord> i'm gonna start a kickstarter called "gord wants cake"
<gord> you can put money in the gord wants cake bucket, i will use it to eat cake
<aquarius> gord, I think that's what flattr is for :)
<MartijnVdS> he won't get any flattr from eating lots of cake thouhg
<MartijnVdS> though*
<oimon> kickstarter won't give you the cake if you don't reach the total though :(
<j0nr> good moaning
 * Laney gives terminaling with UbuntuBeta Mono a go
<gord> is that public now?
<Laney> as public as it was
<AlanBell> hi all
<smittix> Morning AlanBell
<FND> hi - I'm struggling with X font definitions (for dmenu); how can I find out which font gnome-terminal uses (Preferences dialog suggests Mono 11) and convert that to old-school X format (-misc-*-*-...)?
<MartijnVdS> The "old-school" X fonts don't map well to "new style" font definitions
<MartijnVdS> they use a completely different system of finding and rendering fonts
<MartijnVdS> I'd install something like xfontsel
<FND> I was afraid of that
<FND> I actually used xfontsel, but didn't get on with it too well
<FND> I guess that's because the font selection doesn't map my expectations
<nucc1> for some reason, postfix isn't getting its config info for PAM from /etc/postfix/sasl/smtpd.conf, how can i find out where it is looking?
<hoover> nucc1: strace?
<BigRedS> nucc1: grep -r /etc/postfix pwcheck_method  ?
<hoover> postconf -a?
<BigRedS> oh yeah, that's more sensible
<nucc1> hoover, postconf -a lists cyrus and dovecot
<popey> morning all
<nucc1> hoover, how would i run it with strace?
<nucc1> strace postfix doesn't seem to help
<davmor2> MooDoo: you online yet dude?
<davmor2> czajkowski: enjoy your first day I hope everything goes well
<gord> gots me a black revo, wonder how it differs from the white ones
<popey> is that the one that stands on its corner?
<gord> i don't think so, i mean, i quickly took it out to take a look at it but it looks 100% the same as the regular revos but black
<gord> http://www.ebuyer.com/279898-acer-aspire-revo-r3700-net-top-pc-pt-semec-036 this one
<popey> 3700?
<popey> yeah, stands on the corner
<popey> well, looks like it :D
<dogmatic69> popey: o/
<popey> wonder what performance is like compared to the 1.6GHz atoms
<popey> gord: run hugos random benchmark on it!
<dogmatic69> have you got a list of things you run on the mc server? maps backups etc
<popey> http://www.hantslug.org.uk/wiki/HugoRandomBenchmark
<popey> not to hand dogmatic69
<dogmatic69> k :(
<popey> what specifics do you want to know?
<dogmatic69> was just hoping for a blog post titled "how to run a mc server by: popey" :)
<gord> funny enough, even though it was the linux version of the revo it came with a "webroot personal security" dvd
<dogmatic69> ill just have to wade through the minecraft wiki again
<dogmatic69> my little i3 is way up the list :D
<andylockran> guys - is there a documented way to upgrade a dead version of ubuntu to a newer release (eg jaunty) ?
<popey> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/EOLUpgrades
<andylockran> thanks popey :)
<dogmatic69> node.js is pretty damn fast... does that time thing in 0.061s
<gord> i think in reality your javascript compiler is good
<gord> i mean, its a simple statement that evaluates to i=1e8, you can just replace the entire loop with that if your recompiler is smart enough
 * AlanBell sits in the cafe below millbank tower
<dogmatic69> gord: ye, i was thinking its doing something like that.
<davmor2> AlanBell: etsu by any chance?
<AlanBell> davmor2: yes
<davmor2> AlanBell: Cheese ploughmans sandwich from there is one of the best
<AlanBell> coffee is cheap
<AlanBell> Â£1.25 bargain
<hamitron> Â£1.25 is cheap? :|
<AlanBell> are you upstairs davmor2?
<AlanBell> hamitron: this is London
<davmor2> AlanBell: Sandwich, pack of crisps and a drink is like a fiver
 * hamitron crosses London off his "to visit" list
<davmor2> AlanBell: No I'm in wolvo
<BigRedS> london has plus points that outweigh the minus point of expensive things
<davmor2> hamitron: that's amasing cheap in London
<hamitron> never been
 * AlanBell needs more contacts in the tower of power
<hamitron> I struggle to convince myself to spend 70p on a coffee
<hamitron> :/
<BigRedS> hamitron: depends on teh size of the coffee, surely?
<hamitron> I never drink more than a mugs worth
<hamitron> :)
<hamitron> what is the name of that player like XMMS and Winamp?
<hamitron> begins with A
<MartijnVdS> amarok?
<hamitron> na
<MartijnVdS> ample?
<hamitron> Au*
<hamitron> Aud* even
<MartijnVdS> audacity? audacious?
<BigRedS> hamitron: amp?
<hamitron> audacious
<hamitron> :)
<hamitron> ty
 * AlanBell has gained entry :)
<davmor2> AlanBell: <Kenith_Williams_impression> Ooooooh Matron! </Kenith_Williams_impression>
<kaushal__> Hi
<kaushal__> can i have sun-java6 version 24 deb package ?
<kaushal__> sun-java6-jdk
<kaushal__> for 10.04
<smittix> Ive been staring at a blank html document for about 3 hours trying to think of what to have on my homepage. 3 hours worth of creativity and i come up with this http://smittix.co.uk
<smittix> :/
<AlanBell> I like it
<smittix> heh
<smittix> AlanBell: Regarding the Notts Release Party, I will wait for a future date. After the notts beer festival
<kaushal__> AlanBell: hi
<kaushal__> where can i get sun-java6-jdk version 24 .deb package for 10.04 ?
<kaushal__> i had it but i have lost it
<kaushal__> somehow
<AlanBell> !info sun-dava6-jdk
<lubotu3> Package sun-dava6-jdk does not exist in natty
<AlanBell> !info sun-java6-jdk
<lubotu3> Package sun-java6-jdk does not exist in natty
<AlanBell> !info sun-java6-jdk hardy
<lubotu3> sun-java6-jdk (source: sun-java6): Sun Java(TM) Development Kit (JDK) 6. In component multiverse, is optional. Version 6.24-1build0.8.04.1 (hardy), package size 19745 kB, installed size 61372 kB (Only available for all amd64 i386 lpia ia64)
<AlanBell> http://packages.ubuntu.com/search?keywords=sun-java6-jdk
<AlanBell> !info openjdk-6-jdk
<lubotu3> openjdk-6-jdk (source: openjdk-6): OpenJDK Development Kit (JDK). In component main, is optional. Version 6b22-1.10.2-0ubuntu1~11.04.1 (natty), package size 10851 kB, installed size 34168 kB
<AlanBell> I would try and use that ^^
<AlanBell> or you can turn on the partner repo, it is in there
<AlanBell> http://archive.canonical.com/pool/partner/s/sun-java6/
<davmor2> AlanBell: Why you at Canonical HQ anyhow?
<AlanBell> davmor2: to get some stuff printed out :)
<davmor2> AlanBell: you don't own a printer of you own ;)
<AlanBell> I was sent the stuff to print after I got on the train
<davmor2> AlanBell: haha :)
<AlanBell> and I printed a copy of http://people.ubuntu.com/~alanbell/happyhour.pdf and stuck it on the fridge
<davmor2> AlanBell: Nice
 * AlanBell heads out for a cheese ploughmans sandwich then on to the Home Office
<brobostigon> afternoonings everyone.
<davmor2> brobostigon: morning
<brobostigon> davmor2: morning.
<JGJones> guys, just wondering - for a small organisation (around 30 staff) - what's a good asset database to use? or a template for libreoffice base?
<drussell> JGJones: depending on how much information you want, and how complex you want to go...
<drussell> JGJones: http://www.xtuple.com/node/2284
<JGJones> hmm was just looking at spiceworks
<drussell> JGJones: for future reference osalt.com is good for answering these kind of questions...
<JGJones> drussell - thanks, taking a look
<drussell> JGJones: http://www.osalt.com/search?q=asset
<drussell> JGJones: yvw :o)
<HazRPG_> \o
<brobostigon> o/
<oimon> yesterday i was throwing away some old junk and as i was throwing away a dvd case containing fedora core 5, i decided to open it to look inside (why?). and i found a music CD that i bought years ago and lost 3 days after buying, and never replaced :D :D
<MartijnVdS> \o/
<oimon> that's better than finding a fiver in the pocket of old jeans
<HazRPG_> brobostigon: :)
<hamitron> moral of the story.... don't be a lazy git and put stuff away properly after use? ;)
<brobostigon> HazRPG_: :)
<MartijnVdS> We found a CD Single of Ice Ice Baby when moving offices a few months ago :)
<oimon> hamitron: it's only happened since i was married, although my wife denies it.
<hamitron> haha
<oimon> i am still missing a footy game for the wii
<hamitron> gotta love marriage....
<hamitron> someone to blame ;)
<oimon> maybe i never tidied up in a rush before i was married
<oimon> currently 2hrs into a 10TB filesystem repair
<hamitron> :)
<hamitron> I'm trying to find space to move 400Gb off my windows 7 comp
<MartijnVdS> oimon: Ah, always a good excuse to clean the desk ;)
<oimon> already repaired it on monday :(
 * MartijnVdS hands hamitron /dev/null
<hamitron> since win7 decided to break itself
<MartijnVdS> oimon: time for fresh disks?
<hamitron> :/
<oimon> MartijnVdS: it's a machine for a colleague who is on holiday. should have 20TB of disk in RAID 1
<oimon> with 92GB SSD cache
<hamitron> :-o
 * hamitron dreams
<BigRedS> I'm trying to configure an apache vhost to use its own php.ini, anyone remember how to?
<BigRedS> All I can find are people saying 'no, use ini_set()' or 'no, use php_value'. But that doesn't work with sendmail_path, which is what I particularly want to set
<MartijnVdS> isn't that some SetEnv thing?
<BigRedS> MartijnVdS: maybe :)
<oimon> already rearranged my whole office MartijnVdS :)
<BigRedS> aha!
<BigRedS> php_admin_value works
<BigRedS> d'oh. But php doesn't have a 'my'...
<JGJones> hamitron - that's what a dog is for. Blaming all the farts on ;-)
<hamitron> :D
<oimon> slowly moving my entire collection of linux magazine into my work office to make space at home :)
<JGJones> cos if I blamed my wife...well...you're welcome to my funeral.
<MartijnVdS> BigRedS: Aren't those per <VirtualHost> block?
<BigRedS> MartijnVdS: yeah - I wanted to set teh sendmail path for php for a single virtualhost
<MartijnVdS> BigRedS: so you don't need a "my" :)
<BigRedS> oh, no, that was in the test php script
<BigRedS> just perl habits
<MartijnVdS> :)
<MartijnVdS> Perl habits are good habits
<BigRedS> oh yes
<MartijnVdS> except our sysadmin's perl habits
<MartijnVdS> they're horrible ;)
<oimon> that's because it's python :)
<MartijnVdS> oimon: ...
<oimon> MartijnVdS: ....
<BigRedS> well, sysadmin perl is different to developer perl
<BigRedS> and, er, I'm the former :)
 * MartijnVdS the latter
<BigRedS> I write everything so it runs in perl core on debian sarge, just in case :)
<MartijnVdS> eek :)
 * MartijnVdS uses loads of Squeeze backports on lenny
<BigRedS> haha
<HazRPG> hmm, is there a way to convert (or a plugin of sorts) irssi log files into html?
<MartijnVdS> http://www.t2-project.org/packages/2.1/nudelstats.html (first hit for "irssi log to html")
<DJones> HazRPG: I think so, give me a sec
<DJones> !logs
<lubotu3> Official channel logs can be found at http://irclogs.ubuntu.com/ . LoCo channels are now logged there too; for older LoCo channel logs, see http://logs.ubuntu-eu.org/freenode/
<DJones> Actually, I was thinking of this which is used by the ubuntu log bots http://mg.pov.lt/irclog2html/
<HazRPG> DJones: yeah, I noticed that at the end of one of the logs @ irclogs.ubuntu.com :) - much thanks, I'll have to give that a shot
<oimon> bugzilla needs to die in a fire :(
<davmor2> oimon: Bugzilla is there to teach you not to take LP for granted :)
<hamitron> and to not code bugs
<hamitron> ;)
 * oimon agrees
<brobostigon> question, a friend of mine tells me, that within hotmail, within its standard functions, you can tell it to not show ads. now, why on earth would Ms out in such a function, and block their income streams, to start with. so i do not believe this to be true.
<oimon> brobostigon: slashdot has that feature. although i haven't seen hotmail since the 90s
<oimon> and i've used adblock since forever too :)
<brobostigon> ok.
<oimon> sorry, i'm not helping :)
<brobostigon> no worries. :)
<gord> hum, they must of updated the wireless chipset in the new revos, it no work
<brobostigon> but i would be interested as to if it is true or not. as that would mean, MS are stabbing themselves in the foot.
<oimon> gord:  which model?
<gord> oimon, um. "black"
<oimon> R3700?
<popey> thssim
<gord> i guess?
<oimon> u need to install a package
<oimon> firmware-non-free or something like that
<oimon> i found the wifi on it very flaky though
<popey> brobostigon: only if people know about the feature, which almost certainly not many do
<brobostigon> popey: and also, i am finding no reference to such a feature, being built into hotmail. anywhere.
<popey> so it's an unsubstantiated rumour
<brobostigon> seems so, but the person i am talking to, claims it is there. i am doubtful, as to the truth a validity, of his words on it.
<oimon> i am also doubtful ;)
<brobostigon> why would they stab themselves in the foot, :)
<oimon> unless it's a feature for paying "office live 365" mugs^H^H^H^Hcustomers
<brobostigon> maybe, but it would still be documented somewhere wouldnt it.
<oimon> maybe they were referring to live365 VIP
<oimon> https://store.live365.com/popup/popup-preferred_membership_agreement.live section 1
<oimon> sorry forget that - it's not the micrsoft live 365
<oimon> it's another one
<popey> brobostigon: the problem is you're asking this in a channel full of people who probably really, honestly, don't give a toss :D
<brobostigon> popey: i totally agree, you are quite correct, including me. :)
<gord> popey, what was that benchmark site again?
<oimon> today has sucked :(
<popey> gord: http://www.hantslug.org.uk/wiki/HugoRandomBenchmark
<gord> ta
<popey> you are obliged to update it :D
<gord> thats the plan
<oimon> ever used "disown" to move jobs into a screen session?
<gord> popey, done and done
<popey> ooo, not much faster than my 3600
<Laney> oimon: try reptyr
<gord> fastest atom on there though ;)
<gord> and of course, that test only uses one core
<gord> shame i have to say bye to the machine... if it were a white one i could swap it for one of my own and they would be non the wiser ;)
<gord> well i guess i could swap the contents
<popey> :D
<popey> they're not _too_ painful to take apart
<popey> are they physically identical in shape?
<popey> the 3700 doesn't have esata now does it?
<gord> oh right no, thats what that blocked off bit was
<gord> but yeah they look the same
<hamitron> just over 5s on my i3
<hamitron> :/
<gord> dang it, the wifi chipset isn't picking up my N ssid
<MartijnVdS> N-only?
<MartijnVdS> maybe it's a 2.4 vs 5GHz issue?
<gord> it should see both
<MartijnVdS> gord: man iw :)
<matti> :)
 * TheOpenSourcerer is installing Windows 8 Dev preview in VirtualBox on Ubuntu :-)
<MartijnVdS> TheOpenSourcerer: ah the morphine drip kicked in? :)
<TheOpenSourcerer> It's quite slow... I'm interested in having a recent version of IE available for testing web sites and I do not want to buy Win 7 if I can avoid it.
<TheOpenSourcerer> Gosh only one reboot so far. It's updated the registry and is now "getting devices ready"...
<TheOpenSourcerer> Ah restart #2
<TheOpenSourcerer> 3rd time lucky?
<matti> LOL
<matti> ;)
<TheOpenSourcerer> Oooh - A green desktop
<TheOpenSourcerer> Several questions *after* the install. Why do they do that? Why can't they ask this stuff first time round?
<TheOpenSourcerer> "Preparing PC" - I'm sure that happened before...
<TheOpenSourcerer> Lots of network activity.
<TheOpenSourcerer> Might be interesting to wireshark that
<brobostigon> i found an answer, there is an opt-out for personalised advertising within hotmail. but no advertising block.
<MartijnVdS> brobostigon: that's in my browser anyway :)
<brobostigon> MartijnVdS: exactly, :)
<TheOpenSourcerer> brobostigon: I still have a hotmail account. I use it for spammy type email stuff. And I access it via Thunderbird so never logon nor see the ads.
<MartijnVdS> you can do that now?
<brobostigon> TheOpenSourcerer: :) good plan.
 * MartijnVdS though it used some weird outlook-only protocol
<TheOpenSourcerer> I have a Windows 8 front-end
<TheOpenSourcerer> MartijnVdS: POP
<MartijnVdS> TheOpenSourcerer: tbh I haven't used hotmail ever
<derek19> does anyone know how to create two or three email accounts in evolution?
<MartijnVdS> derek19: yes, in Edit -> Accounts add more accounts (maybe it's in Tools -> Accounts)?
<derek19> great stuff  I've had a go a few times put was unable to configure-nice one :-D
<derek19> derek19 is leaving- thanks for evolution tip MartijnVds
<nuclearworm_> hello, can someone help me to create a bootable cd rom to upgrade bios?
<popey> nuclearworm_: bootdisk.com ?
<smittix> Evening all
<popey> lo
<smittix> how goes it?
<nuclearworm_> popey , which image should i choose to create a bootable cd rom?
<popey> nuclearworm_: there is link on the front page that talks about flashing bioses
<popey> http://www.bootdisk.com/flash.htm
<gord> woo i hate samba
<gord> also hate the new nautilus
<MartijnVdS> you're full of rage aren'tyou
<popey> I had a nice tweet today
<popey> said something like 'oh, i see why you're angry, you like open source'
<popey> from a .net developer
<gord> just keeps rejecting my password attempts =\
<gord> and the log files are next to useless
<AlanBell> hi all
 * AlanBell is in a pub
<TheOpenSourcerer> pah
<AlanBell> specifically the Cask
<hamitron> popey, "oh, I see why you're not, you have no clue what is happening"
<brobostigon> :)
<popey> heh
<gord> i thought this guide looked familiar, turns out i wrote it
<MartijnVdS> 8-)
<gord> bleh hdmi audio isn't working for some reason, what on earth did i do to get it running on other revo
<czajkowski> Aloha
<bigcalm> gord: check in pulseaudio volume control, you'll be able to set the sound output as the hdmi port
<bigcalm> Hi czajkowski, how was work?
<gord> bigcalm, nope already checked
<czajkowski> fantastic
<bigcalm> Arse
<bigcalm> Great!
<gord> bigcalm, its lts so chances are the driver is just huuugely out of date
<bigcalm> *nod*
<gord> czajkowski, without you here, davmor2 and MooDoo were frankly, lost
 * czajkowski stabs MooDoo 
 * czajkowski pokes davmor2 
 * czajkowski congrats MooDoo on his new addition
<MartijnVdS> popey: What was the "electricity meter" you use(d) device called?
<MartijnVdS> uhr
<MartijnVdS> well you know what I mean :)
<gord> jaunty no good for hdmi out it seems, i can get the hdmi device but its got no outputs, lets try with maverick, thats what my revo is running
<daubers> evening
<MartijnVdS> \o
<gord> i'v managed to get hdmi working in one account but not the other =\
<gord> this is very confusing
<ubuntuuk-planet> [Ubuntu UK Podcast] S04E15  Remember Tomorrow - http://podcast.ubuntu-uk.org/2011/09/14/s04e15-remember-tomorrow/
<andylockran> :)
<AlanBell> MartijnV1S: that would be a currentcost
<davmor2> czajkowski: boo
<davmor2> gord: :P
<ubuntuuk-planet> [Andy Loughran] Clingo Universal Car Phone Holder - http://zrmt.com/2011/09/14/clingo-universal-car-phone-holder/
<AlanBell> hi all
 * AlanBell likes the events list http://loco.ubuntu.com/teams/ubuntu-uk
<AlanBell> and we need to add the Nottingham meetup to the list
<AlanBell> and sort out a christmas thing
<hamitron> loads of drinking basically? ;/
<brobostigon> evevning AlanBell
<brobostigon> nottigham i could do, it isnt far, a short train journey, if all is ok.
<AlanBell> hamitron: there is a barcamp in there, which despite having bar in the name isn't really about drinking
<hamitron> oh
<AlanBell> but yeah, there is a bit of a drinking theme to some of the others
<hamitron> :D
<AlanBell> barcamp == unconference
<hamitron> well
<AlanBell> anyhow, I want to add more non-drinky things, but they tend to be a *lot* more difficult and expensive to organise
<hamitron> the list is nearly perfect then
<hamitron> ;)
<hamitron> I suppose, yeh
<AlanBell> and we are moving out of geeknic season
<AlanBell> I did check out the Cask earlier
<ali1234> https://github.com/ali1234/bitmap2ttf new project \o/
<hamitron> ali1234, the clue is in the name?
<AlanBell> very clever
<AlanBell> the outliner.py contains less code than I would have expected it would need
<AlanBell> so it creates a pixellated font still, but a scaleable one right?
<ali1234> yes
<ali1234> it is how I made this font: http://al.robotfuzz.com/~al/teletext/100.html
<ali1234> note that even the graphics on that page, are actually fonts
<ali1234> "graphics"
<ali1234> the teletext font is in ubuntu repos, tv-fonts package but it is pcf
<AlanBell> I see :)
<ali1234> and firefox won't use pcf
<ali1234> btw, page only looks "right" in ff, webkit can't render fonts properly and ie just crashes on the vendor unicode
<AlanBell> the teletext thing is a brilliant project
 * funkyHat is IRCing on the M1
<ali1234> for the teletext thing i had to invent a totally new method for recovering NRZ signals
<ali1234> i think it is totally new, it doesn't work like any of the existing documented algorithms
<ali1234> i read quite a lot of papers on the topic
<AlanBell> this is the sort of thing the British Library or National Archives might be very interested in
<andylockran> funkyHat: hope you're not driving too :p
<ali1234> the page numbers/fasttext are all hyperlinked btw
<ali1234> total time to generate that full magazine = about 4 days with newest code, from 45 minutes of recording
<ali1234> when the raspberry pi comes out, i hope it has real programmable video out
<ali1234> because i want to use it to send teletext to a TV
<ali1234> but that requires modeline hacking
<ali1234> if it just has a hardwired pal/ntsc generator it won't work
<ali1234> if it just has a generic DSP and no open driver, it will be extremely hard, but possible
<AlanBell> eben@raspberrypi.org will know
<ali1234> i have this idea to develop a wireless box that inserts teletext into a video signal
<ali1234> based on stuff it pulls from a web server
<ali1234> then i can sell "teletext" to people that still want it (= old people) for a few quid a year
<ali1234> generate feeds etc
<AlanBell> the project to get archived text off VHS could get serious funding if you are after that
<ali1234> interesting
<ali1234> i have no idea how to go about it though
<ali1234> i wonder if "ceefax@bbc.co.uk" still works :)
<AlanBell> wonder if I still have Adam Farquhar's business card somewhere http://www.jisc.ac.uk/events/2010/05/brtf/adamfarquhar.aspx
#ubuntu-uk 2011-09-15
<ali1234> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=46_6aGXY6HU nice
 * czajkowski pokes MooDoo before she leaves for work 
<diplo> Morning all
<bigcalm> Morning peeps :)
<diplo> seems like it's going to be quiet here today with no talking since czajkowski at 8am
<gord> you could propose a topic of conversation ;) that might help
<diplo> Sleep?
<diplo> I'm knackered, not dropping off till 3am this morning then work at 8 doesn't bode well
<diplo> :)
<JGJones> Greetings
<JamesTait> Bonjour, tout le monde!
<AlanBell> morning peeps
<brobostigon> good morning everyone.
<Hippychick> good morning brobostigon, i hope you are having a good morning?
<brobostigon> Hippychick: other than physical failings, and issues, i am not bad. and you?
<Hippychick> not so good, mine is more mental then physical though...
<Hippychick> work are being gits again... :(
<brobostigon> :(
 * Hippychick wonders what the rules afre for being stressed
<brobostigon> interesting question.
<Hippychick> yeah, i know im stressed but in terms of work im not sure what i can do about it
<Hippychick> the people here are not exacly easy to talk to
<brobostigon> Hippychick: the thing that halped me, when stressed, is to compensate with the right release of that stress, and reduce stress.
<directhex> Hippychick, he wears a cape and fights crime. it's excellent stress relief
<Hippychick> directhex, who? or what?
<directhex> brobostigon! that's his "right release of that stress". beating up criminals
<brobostigon> :)
<davmor2> MooDoo: you online yet?
<davmor2> czajkowski: good first day?
<davmor2> morning all
 * AlanBell wonders if MooDoo and Laney are about
<AlanBell> http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/ubuntu-uk/1283/detail/ <- launch party in London
<AlanBell> trying to arrange an exclusive booking on the pub with Canonical underwriting a minimum spend :)
<AlanBell> I visited the place yesterday, it is quite good
<AlanBell> lots of nice beer on tap
<brobostigon> :)
<Hippychick> alanbell, is the party on the 13th october?
<AlanBell> it is
<Hippychick> yeah just saw that
 * Hippychick needs a phone with a bigger screen
<Hippychick> might have a look at comming
<AlanBell> yay
<Hippychick> im in ireland the day before hopefully work wont make me stay longer
<AlanBell> where in Ireland?
<Hippychick> no idea, whereever the plane lands and the customer takes me too :P
<gord> oh wow shipping to norway is espensive
<gord> expensive
<Laney> hello AlanBell
<davmor2> AlanBell: MooDoo is possibly still basking in the whole parenthood thing for the time being
<AlanBell> yeah, I expect he is
<oimon> basking?
<AlanBell> just wanted to set a date for the Nottingham happy hour/release party
<AlanBell> davmor2: he will be experiencing the joy of meconium
<directhex> it's late 2011, and minecraft still doesn't have a fix for an old lwjgl linux bug
<ali1234> popey: here is a bad error dialog for you: http://imagebin.org/172571
<Daviey> ali1234: doesn't look too bad to me.
<Daviey> I expected it to have goats being abused or something, that would be really bad.
<oimon> quite peaceful
<ali1234> it won't go away though
<Daviey> make it part of the layout.
<oimon> free some space :)
<Daviey> learn to enjoy your new dekstop friend.
<ali1234> i have done, it still won't go away
<Daviey> Don't force it to go away, just let it be.  It's not harming anyone, right?
<oimon> is your desktop normally green or the purple chunder?
<ali1234> normally green
<oimon> xkill ?
<ali1234> i tried that
<ali1234> it killed unity
<ali1234> and the pink thing stayed
<CaMason> hi guys. Trying to get a vodafone/Huawei 4511 device working. It's quite new, and I've got usb_modeswitch switching properly - but it's not appearing in network manager. Any thoughts?
<CaMason> aha, did it manually with modprobe and now it works!
<popey> hehe ali1234 :D
<popey> TheOpenSourcerer: WHERE'S MY TOUCHPAD DAMNIT!
<popey> or, afternoon.
<TheOpenSourcerer> lol hulo popey
<TheOpenSourcerer> I have not heard back from Jez (my mate).
<popey> Bah!
<TheOpenSourcerer> I have no idea when the internal firesale will take place either.
<Daviey> Is Jezzer still waiting behind the lorry for it to fall off?
<TheOpenSourcerer> He works for HP
<oimon> does he not want one himself?
<diplo> afternoon all, Anyone know with maverick if i can get mail indicator to show a different colour to IM ?
<oimon> trying to work out whether to bother with g+
<popey> I'm not sure G+ could cope with your grumpyness.
<oimon> it's been struggling so far
<davmor2> oimon: just what G+ needs more angriness ranting at the world ;)
<oimon> i would only have it on receive mode in the same way i use twitter
<oimon> G+ did show me a sweet picture of a fox enjoying a slide though
<oimon> i've been on g+ since the beginning but discovered i only check it 1x per week
<davmor2> man have you noticed how quiet it is without czajkowski around,  we should of got her a job sooner :D
<popey> :D
<popey> davmor2: make the most of it, it's only a 4 month contract
<davmor2> popey: you had to ruin a perfectly good day didn't you ;)
<czajkowski> davmor2: oi
<czajkowski> brat
<davmor2> czajkowski: hello sweetie I thought it would put a smile on your face ;)
<czajkowski> i shall kick your arse
<czajkowski> don't forget it
 * diplo asks everyone to calm down and relax
<diplo> :)
<diplo> Call it chill our thursday
<diplo> out*
<kirrus> Chill our works better
 * AlanBell wonders if davmor2 and derriere are coming to London for the release?
<AlanBell> http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/ubuntu-uk/1283/detail/
<davmor2> AlanBell: I might do depending on how work is we might be releasing on the same day then I'm stuck here in wolvo till 20:00
<AlanBell> surely you can work from Millbank!
<popey> AlanBell: do you see the columns on that page misaligned?
<AlanBell> popey: I reported that bug, yes
<Pendulum> AlanBell: you should poke mrevell as well for the party :)
<AlanBell> I should indeed
<popey> yes
<popey> get him to bring some LP t-shirts
<mrevell> Hmph? Whassat?
<popey> oh, bugger, he's here
<mrevell> popey, LP t-shirts! Only a handful left.
<mrevell> All female sizes.
<AlanBell> pub!
<popey> perfect
<oimon> not surprised...what woman wnats to waear LAUNCHPAD written on their boobs?
<Pendulum> oimon: I'd totally wear that
<AlanBell> mrevell: details of next thursday pub on the fridge door
<oimon> don't be surprised if a guy takes you up on the offer
<Pendulum> oimon: I already own the ThinkGeek 'Huge Tracts of Land' t-shirt
<Myrtti> Launchpad t-shirts?
<Pendulum> I get almost no comments on it from guys
<Myrtti> female sizes = ????
<Pendulum> lots of laughter from women
<Myrtti> AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA want some
<oimon> http://shop.canonical.com/product_info.php?products_id=398
<czajkowski> I want a LP T-Shirt!!!!!
 * Myrtti bites her nails
<popey> most comfy t-shirt I own is my BZR one
 * Myrtti msg's the fairy godfather in UK
 * popey gets a pm
 * czajkowski watches mrevell screen light up
<popey> oh, not that one
<andrewebdev> can someone tell me how to get around this: I'm trying to install a deb package in a VM. the vm runs Ubuntu Natty. I have both python 2.7 and 2.6 installed. when Installing the deb however, I get: "Dependency is not satisfiable: python (<2.7)
 * Pendulum wonders if ordering one would cost more for shipping than the shirt itself
<Myrtti> oh man, my sister is aiming at me with a staple gun
 * Myrtti goes back to painting
<mrevell> davmor2, I need an hour of your time. I'm doing some research in preparation for the "custom bug columns" feature.
<mrevell> davmor2, You up for meeting up?
<davmor2> mrevell: really where and when?
 * mrevell wonders what happened to davmor1
<mrevell> davmor2, Light House? Monday 11am?
<davmor2> mrevell: sounds doable might need to ensure they have wifi this time as I might be needed for work?
<davmor2> should be a .
<davmor2> at the end
<mrevell> davmor2, Yeah, wifi would be handy. I'll email you.
<davmor2> no probs
 * czajkowski kicks davmor2 and goes back 
<davmor2> see how the noise level increased when czajkowski came back?
<gord> there does seem to be a direct correlation between czajkowski and violence, but as we all know, correlation is not causation
<Laney> http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b014641w/Afternoon_Play_Floating/
 * czajkowski goes back to being quiet
<davmor2> gord: haha like it
<ali1234> does anyone know about DECT?
<ali1234> i have a base station and three handsets and all that works fine
<ali1234> i just added two new handsets but they don't ring when the others do
<oimon> argh i never knew how much i relied on linux.com and associated websites
<ali1234> i can still answer with them though
<ali1234> and make calls
<ali1234> they just don't receive the ringing signal
<ali1234> they are not muted either
<ali1234> the caller ID does not come through
<AlanBell> hmm, openswan-modules-dkms just doesn't work
<AlanBell> bug #626790
<lubotu3> Launchpad bug 626790 in Kunquat "add a horizontal divider for instrument controls" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/626790
<AlanBell> debian bug #626790
<lubotu3> Debian bug 626790 in openswan-modules-dkms "openswan-modules-dkms: Kernel modules doesn't compile" [Grave,Open] http://bugs.debian.org/626790
<Myrtti> my thumb hurts :-(
<Myrtti> peeling silicone glue was really stuck :-/
<AlanBell> if anyone is going to the Happy Hour next thursday and wants some (non-free) cake beforehand it would be great to have some people at this http://digital.cabinetoffice.gov.uk/2011/09/13/the-first-agiletea-meeting/
<AlanBell> I can't get there in time
<MartijnVdS> agile-tea?
<AlanBell> and agile cake
<MartijnVdS> I prefer my cake to stay still
<kvarley> Where did gtkdialog go from the repos?
<danfish> AlanBell: I might try and get to that cake-based event b4 the Happy Hour - looks interesting
<shauno>  this is really starting to get annoying :/
<MartijnVdS> shauno: what is?
<shauno> same thing still.  keeps dropping everything, and I don't see any pattern
<AlanBell> danfish: great!
<shauno> ugh, update-grub doesn't make backups?
<shauno> I really can't wrap my head around the junk that creates the menu.lst anymore
<Azelphur> I've made a bold leap into futureness, decided to scrap having title bars, close, maximize and maximize buttons on my windows altogether.
<Azelphur> I use decorationless windows now :)
<MartijnVdS> i.e. you started a QT app in Oneiric?
<Azelphur> hahaha
<MartijnVdS> (that kills unity-decorator...)
<Azelphur> MartijnVdS: no, I disabled the window decorations plugin in compiz.
<Azelphur> (deliberately)
<Azelphur> and I don't plan on re-enabling it either, at least not unless I can have something to make window borders look a little nicer, while not wasting loads of space
<shauno> so the only way I can find to change options in update-grub, is to edit /usr/bin/update-grub itself.  everything else seems to be completely ignored
<czajkowski> Aloha
<MartijnVdS> \o czajkowski
 * davmor2 runs up and flicks water at czajkowski  and runs off
 * AlanBell thinks davmor2 really should come down to London for the release
<davmor2> AlanBell: You want to see if I'm like this with her in the room right czajkowski will confirm I am :D
 * AlanBell will bring popcorn
<davmor2> AlanBell: I just don't push as hard when she's there I can see the unamused look on her face :D
<phil_m> hi all I'm I'm a newbie to ubuntu, i only stumbled across it the other week, I'm currently doing some oracle studies in java programming and developing (formally SCJP +  SCJD) and came across your podcasts which i listen to on the way to work. just wanted to say keep up the good work guys... :-))
<AlanBell> hi phil_m
<AlanBell> bug 379001 is a bit of a pain
<lubotu3> Launchpad bug 379001 in xserver-xorg-video-ati (Ubuntu) "Radeon Mobility M7 LW [Radeon Mobility 7500] multiple dual-head issues" [Undecided,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/379001
<AlanBell> or even bug 739001
<lubotu3> Launchpad bug 739001 in openswan (Ubuntu) "openswan kernel module failed to build: fatal error: linux/config.h: No such file or directory" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/739001
<AlanBell> yeah, that one.
<suprengr> Nice one, NASA:  The existence of a world with a double sunset, as portrayed in the film Star Wars more than 30 years ago, is now scientific fact.
<czajkowski> davmor2: oi
<danfish> hmm - I need a really small 4 port hub/switch - any suggestions?
<danfish> nvm - found one in my "man drawer" - plan to gut it and put it in a wall plate :)
<danfish> must clean out the man drawer some time
<Guest26907> evening
<mgdm> Hi daubers
<AlanBell> why are games tied to windows?
<AlanBell> apart from directx what do they use from the operating system?
<dwatkins> The development environment.
<dwatkins> There's also Steam, but OS X demonstrates things are portable.
<AlanBell> steam is a kind of app store for windows right?
<dwatkins> AlanBell: it's more a games store, but yes - games are installed through it and the licensing is also handled within Steam.
<AlanBell> by licensing you mean payments?
<danfish> AlanBell: you can run windows games on any OS...but it requires a drop of Bill Gates' blood and a unicorn tear ;)
<dwatkins> AlanBell: not just that, Steam handles the keys as well, sometimes internally (it authenticates with Valve's website so you can download a game on a new PC without the need to enter the key) or it'll just tell you the key to paste into the game.
<AlanBell> so the games are watermarked with drm stuff
<dwatkins> AlanBell: I believe so, yes.
<czajkowski> so this is who I work for now - watch the video http://www.codegent.com/blog/2011/9/september_news
<danfish> czajkowski: congrats - looks good :)
<czajkowski> danfish: thanks
<czajkowski> am knackered
<dwatkins> congratulations, czajkowski :)
<czajkowski> dwatkins: thanks
<dwatkins> Do you get to join the curry club, czajkowski?
<czajkowski> dwatkins: I'm sure I can do
<dwatkins> hooray
<danfish> czajkowski: you going to the happy hour next week?
<czajkowski> yup I surely am
<czajkowski> you ?
<danfish> oh yes - most definitely :)
<czajkowski> YAY!
<czajkowski> we shall meet for once!
<czajkowski> if you back out I will come and hunt you and pick on you like I do MooDoo and davmor2 are we clear
<danfish> czajkowski: haha - I will not dare to no-show on you!
<czajkowski> Good
<danfish> I have a rather good ubuntu circle of friends spray template - I may bring it along with a can of spray paint and offer to 'mod' laptops :D
<davmor2> czajkowski: You leave my good name out of this woman ;)
<czajkowski> what good name are you talking about
<gord> she has a point
<davmor2> no my name is good I might not be :P
<czajkowski> gord: hey you were taking my name in vain earlier on
<czajkowski> no jammy dodgers for you next time I see you
<gord> don't lump me in with that lot, i'm nice :P
<czajkowski> I had such a  odd bug
<czajkowski> unity 3d vanished
<czajkowski> Unity 2d worked
<czajkowski> tooked my fedora loving mac bf to reinstall it for me while I cooked dinner
<czajkowski> *took
<gord> strange
<danfish> I'm running xubuntu at the mo coz unity stuffs up the arduino IDE
<czajkowski> gord: Annoying one min there reboot gone
<danfish> #j #xununtu
<danfish> oops
<davmor2> czajkowski: no it would be me taking you name in vein well it's normally me, I mean it sounds like something I'd do at least, but I don't remember calling you a vein if that helps
<czajkowski> shrup ya pup davmor2
<gord> it does sound like something davmor2 would do
<czajkowski> indeed
<czajkowski> see
<czajkowski> he's trouble
<czajkowski> I'm the innocent one
 * AlanBell suspects czajkowski is probably innocent of something
<czajkowski> I am I tell you
<davmor2> AlanBell: You know how these riots broke out in London and nobody knows why it's strange how these violent instances have been happening since czajkowski moved in isn't it, think about it you know it makes sense ;)
<czajkowski> think about the lack of violent attacks in here since I'm gone and you not picking on me daily
<czajkowski> see tis you
<czajkowski> all you
<davmor2> czajkowski: So on a serious note how you liking your new job?
<czajkowski> loving it
<czajkowski> great fun, lots of new stuff
<czajkowski> and really really really busy
<davmor2> czajkowski: good glad to hear it
<czajkowski> on 2 projects today writing up and researching specs
<czajkowski> working on plans for dev folks for realistic deadlines that include testing
<danfish> thought for the day : if those rioters channeled their violence into rugby, England may have a chance at the rugby world cup #wrong channel
<czajkowski> danfish: you know what amazes me here
<czajkowski> olympics not for another year
<czajkowski> rugby WC on now
<czajkowski> and no advertising anywhere for it
<czajkowski> nothing to support your team
<czajkowski> it's amazing
<czajkowski> you don't see that back home and not everyone follows it
<czajkowski> but once it's the national team adverts galore
<danfish> czajkowski: I know - it's nuts :(
<danfish> football is dominant and it's a PITA
<davmor2> czajkowski: Yeah but in the uk it's second best to the one with the round ball :)
<j0nr> ok, so I installed lubuntu on my old Dell D600, but video is awful! Wondering if I have the best video driver or not...?
<AlanBell> and all the games are over before breakfast
<czajkowski> yeah but it's your national team for feck sake
<czajkowski> support them
<AlanBell> j0nr: you mean the static desktop or moving video?
<danfish> on the good side czajkowski - you've got to stay around in the UK until 2015 - RWC in england \o/
<czajkowski> danfish: and knwoing ye then
<davmor2> czajkowski: I show the rugby team the same respect I do my local and national football team there's an app for that ;)
<czajkowski> ye stil won't advertise!
<czajkowski> davmor2: so help me I am gonna kick yer ass up and down the field the next time we meet
<gord> czajkowski, not coming to orlando this time?
 * AlanBell hugs davmor2 and czajkowski 
<czajkowski> gord: nope didnt apply
<gord> boo
<czajkowski> gord: so bring your tea bags wit you
 * AlanBell isn't going to the house of the mouse either
<czajkowski> gord: top of the packing list before you cry!
<j0nr> AlanBell: um, everything. Screensavers, yet to try video, but a slow performing screensaver doesn't bode well
<davmor2> gord: on the plus side I am :D with Mrs M too
 * danfish is hungry - Mrs danfish has gone to son number 1 PTA meeting and still isn't back :(
<davmor2> danfish: you know where the kitchen is right? In there is this mystical stuff called food
<davmor2> http://instantrimshot.com/index.php?sound=rimshot&play=true
<czajkowski> danfish: tea and toast
<danfish> davmor2: heh - I'm the cook in the house - beef and green pepper madras going cold.....
<czajkowski> danfish: so eat it so
<danfish> czajkowski: too right - post-it note to wife "Dinner is in the Oven"
<czajkowski> exactly
<czajkowski> reheat
<czajkowski> microwave
<danfish> oops, scrap that, just in
<j0nr> AlanBell: youtube video like 1fps
<AlanBell> j0nr: well that kicks your media centre plans in the teeth a bit!
<j0nr> AlanBell: but do you think maybe i could be using better video drivers?
<AlanBell> doubt it, but what is the spec of that thing again?
<j0nr> 1.8GHz pentium, 512Mb ram, ATI Mobility Firegl 9000 (RV250)
<TheOpenSourcerer> Weird - spent ages trying to find out why my Thunderbird extension wasn;t working on the new TB7. Turns out that one of my preferences TB thought should be a string - it is a boolean and ALWAYS HAS BEEN!
<bigcalm_lappy486> Evening all
<smittix> evenin'
<MooDoo> hey all
<AlanBell> MooDoo \o/
<MooDoo> :)
<AlanBell> how is it going so far?
<AlanBell> past the meconium and on to propper poo now I guess
<MooDoo> not to bad at the moment, sleeping two hours at a time throughout the night
<MooDoo> yeah just
<AlanBell> in another 18 years or so she will move out
<MooDoo> pmsl, gee thanks :D)
<MooDoo> right better go it be a feeding time :D
<AlanBell> nom nom nom
<AlanBell> issyl0: coming to the release party?
<nucc1> anyone know if its possible to use courier with authmysql and md5 passwords?
<nucc1> i want to get rid of that CRYPT thing, and I've succeeded with postfix, but courier won't budge
<ali1234> what is wrong with this? : ../src/envy 4000 2>&1 >> ../log/envy.log &
<ali1234> maybe the problem is i don't have bash...
<ali1234> ../log/envy.log is created but it is just an empty file
<mgdm> there's a bit in bash where the 2>&1 needs to be the wrong side of something in order to work, it might be pipes though
<ali1234> 2>> envy.log works
<ali1234> i'll just assume it never writes anything interesting on stdout
#ubuntu-uk 2011-09-16
<nucc1> anyone bought a pc from linux emporium before? i'm looking at the shuttle, and i wanna know if i can extend it for a dual-head setup
<nucc1> scratch that. it seems it has a pci-e slot.
<nucc1> just need an apt GPU.
<justinBUJITSUBRO> good night yall can anyone know how to find the back door to a eMachines bios: V3.07
<justinBUJITSUBRO> i have forgoten my password
<justinBUJITSUBRO> i wrote when i bought it
<justinBUJITSUBRO> ok cyall
<Catbuskris> hi guys does anyone know the path analogous to /dev/video0 for audio?
<Catbuskris> /dev/audio0 doesn't exist. i know it has something to do with pulseaudio but i don't know what to write for the path :(
<Catbuskris> update: you prefix your command with padsp and it makes /dev/dsp work.
<Catbuskris> thanks guys
<Catbuskris> :D
<czajkowski> *yawns*
<czajkowski> morning
<AlanBell> morning
<czajkowski> AlanBell: hey hows you
<diplo> Morning all
<Knightwise> Morning
<andylockran> Morning.
<oimon> anyone got notify messages working for thunderbird 6? the extension is broken now :(
<j0nr> morning
<diplo> oimon: I got so fed up with TB and cpu usage and plugin issues I've just moved to Evolution now
<diplo> :/
<j0nr> I need a brain to pick about bash scripting
<oimon> diplo: evolution crashed every day for a year on me
<diplo> Oh :/
<oimon> tb is using 0 cpu
<diplo> Works for me, but only moved yesterday so we will see, but my colleague moved a couple of weeks ago and has been fine
<diplo> really..
<popey> \o/ webmail
<popey> Good morning also
<diplo> Mine kills my machine, debating about a reinstall anyhoo
<diplo> Use webmail for most of my services apart from work
<andylockran> hey guys - got an old intrepid box.. using a ppd file for a Zebra printer and it doesn't work - on later versions of cups (natty) it works fine
<andylockran> any ideas whether it'll be tied to a cups version?
<drussell> andylockran: it shouldn't be tied... but it's easy enough to backup the PPD and try it
<andylockran> drussell: I'm using a custom ppd that I've modified
<JamesTait> Happy Friday, team!
<czajkowski> mother of god NZ is killing Japan
<kirrus> I'm missing something here... there isn't a war on between NZ and Japan, right?
<kirrus> ;)
<BigRedS> If czajkowski is talking about it, it's either rugby or ubuntu, and that doesn't sound a lot like ubuntu :)
<kirrus> Ahh, Rugby.
<kirrus> 1009: RUGBY UNION - Hosts New Zealand are now 52-0 up against Japan in their second match of the World Cup, having scored six tries in the first half. More than 25 minutes left.
<kirrus> That is pretty embarassing for Japan...
<czajkowski> 69 - 7
<gord> well its not really a big sport there
<czajkowski> BigRedS: ahh you do know me
<czajkowski> gord: no bickies for you smart arse
<kirrus> czajkowski: to be fair, it's not a big sport here (England) either. ;)
<czajkowski> kirrus: go to the naughty step
 * kirrus slinks off tail between legs
<andylockran> czajkowski: Japan have had some pretty nice backs moves though
<andylockran> unlucky on the forward pass by their prop a second ago
<brobostigon> good morning everyone.
<Pernig> morning brobostigon
<brobostigon> morning Pernig
 * Laney wibbles
<kirrus> Why are you wibbling, Laney?
<Laney> made of jelly
 * oimon is having fun with ruby on rails apps :(
<davmor2> oimon: I read that as rugby on rails I blame czajkowski for that though all her talk of rugby all the time :D
 * BigRedS sympathises with oimon 
 * oimon wishes there was a #ubuntu-rugby group
<BigRedS> I do think 'having fun' as a euphemism for 'not enjoying myself' is stretched rather far when applied to anything ruby related
<kirrus> For those using a non-free O.S, Portal is free atm: http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2011/09/16/portal-free/
<oimon> yeah, rails app + passenger + ssl
<oimon> i think it's working now
<oimon> now i know why people buys apps instead :)
 * oimon must remember to use the toilet before announcing a time window for a service to be down for maintenance :-\
<hamitron> :D
<davmor2> MooDoo: you online yet you slacker
<Pernig> thanks kirrus
 * czajkowski stabs davmor2 and MooDoo 
<directhex> oimon, ruby on rails is a kids' framework, for people running "servers" on old pentium 3 boxes in their bedrooms and who *never* need to deploy properly
<directhex> i can't think of another reason for the dreadful design of the thing
<hamitron> what is wrong with pentium 3? ;/
<popey> heh
<popey> secondary Morning btw
<BigRedS> hamitron: yeah, apart from RoR I can't see anything wrong with directhex's scenario...
<directhex> undeployable software has no reason for existing
<BigRedS> the thrill of the challenge!
<kirrus> Gentoo exists for that challenge...
<davmor2> czajkowski: you leave MooDoo out of it he happily off being a dad again, no excuse to deaf out his mates obviously but ha ho
<oimon> although now it's running it's pretty stable
<oimon> although my puppet dashboard sucks as it's running on webbrick
<oimon> can't be bothered to spend a day fixing that
 * kirrus rants about customers ranting about our 'terrible' support when they refuse to contact us to.. ask for support.
<Laney> ugh, international travel
<hamitron> how can you rescan all usb devices?
<hamitron> I unplugged a hdd, and want to plug it back in, but it isn't detecting it
<hamitron> :/
<Pernig> is it not detecting it at all, or is it just not mounting?
<hamitron> nothing in dmesg
<Pernig> showing up when you use lsusb?
<brobostigon> lsusb doesnt show it?
<hamitron> no
<Pernig> sometimes when i unplug something then plug it back in in ubuntu
<Pernig> usually after 'safely removing' it
<Pernig> i have to plug it into a different port for it to show up again
<hamitron> that isn't really an option here
<hamitron> :/
<hamitron> I guess I could move my desk to get to the back
<hamitron> but easier to reboot
<hamitron> so was wondering if there is a way in the software, to avoid this
<Pernig> depending on the device, i think using eject rather than safely remove might help
<Pernig> that's what i use for my card reader (the device i have this problem with)
<hamitron> ok, will try that
<brobostigon> Pernig: so one option uses unmount and the other eject ?
<Pernig> brobostigon: i'm not sure on the backend of it, but i think safely remove unmounts then cuts the device off completely (if the device allows)
<Pernig> whereas eject just unmounts, say if you have a card reader and you want to remove a card to replace with another later
<hamitron> well, i did unplug it
<hamitron> :/
<hamitron> just won't re-detect when plugged back in
<Pernig> hamitron: i know what you mean, the device seems to 'stay off' when plugged back in
<hamitron> it is a usb hard drive
<brobostigon> Pernig: hmmm, interesting, more reserach required.
<Pernig> out of interest, does get its power from USB?
<hamitron> no, it has its own power
<hamitron> I did read about there been some problem
<Pernig> i think even if there is no bug, the options are a little ambiguous and could do with being addressed
<hamitron> and someone said unloading the ehci_hcd on a slackware install, to fix it
<hamitron> the kernel module I mean
<hamitron> [ 3116.036203] usb 1-3.1: reset high speed USB device using ehci_hcd and address 8
<Pernig> got to dash, back later
<hamitron> laters :)
<gord> amazon prime is nice, but sometimes i feel silly for the big delivery truck coming tom my house to deliver one roll of tape that i needed but was too busy to nip out to the shop
<davmor2> gord: hahaha
<Myrtti> on a grim subject, what is the protocol with the cards etc. sent to funeral directors, are they read aloud at the service?
<Myrtti> I know they are in Finland but how about UK?
<DJones> Myrtti: I think it would depend on who was taking the funeral
<Myrtti> hm?
<DJones> Some vicars may read some out, or maybe somebody who knew the person might read some out as part of the euology
<Myrtti> ok, thats what I thought
<DJones> From the funerals were I've been involved as the stand in verger, I wouldn't say it was common practise though
<Myrtti> a friend who I knew through FLOSS circles suddenly died on Tuesday and ordered a Moonpig card, I know it's hard on the family and feeling there are more shoulders carrying the weight is comforting
<Myrtti> s/ordered/I ordered/
<Myrtti> just didnt know about the protocol, but anyway, thanks
<DJones> You're welcome
<aptanet_> hmm, minimised xchat to the tray in unity and it has vanished, now way to get back to it even though it is clearly still running
<oly> lol, my xchat some times runs with the icon in the unity bar but you can not gain focus :p
<aptanet_> I've had to start a new instance
<aptanet_> I'm trying to decide whether to try to work out how to retrieve the other one, or simply kill it
<aptanet_> I'm sure somebody said that if you give unity a chance you'll grow to like it, so far I'm growing increasingly irritated by it
<oly> aptanet, i quite like the interface my biggest issue is that a lot of apps i use dont seem to like it
<kirrus> Unity is nice, it just has some awefully horrible bugs.
<oly> it likes to fail with full screen apps in particular
<aptanet_> my biggest issue is that it makes finding apps more difficult
<oly> and i like playing games :)
<ball> kirrus: I'm not keen for a couple of reasons, but I like that we have a choice of desktops
<ball> Hello TheOpenSourcerer
<TheOpenSourcerer> hello ball
<oly> i find it easier to find apps for the most part but some just dont show up even when you type the full name
<aptanet_> I'm afraid I look on Unity as an interesting proof of concept
<oly> gnote being one i tried today :p
<aptanet_> I don't want to switch to the keyboard to start typing the name and then back to the mouse to select it
<oly> yeah think its got a few years polish needed yet :)
<TheOpenSourcerer> Why would a server have a really high load average (~29)  when cpu load and memory are both fine?
<kirrus> ball: aye, the choice is useful
<ball> I thought for years it would be nice to have a menu at the top of the screen like Atari, Amiga and Apple Macintosh, but it breaks focus-follows mouse and my users would be confused about which window the menu was for.
<aptanet_> not to mention for less used apps I often know where they are on the menu, but not what the actual app is called - particularly when a 'friendly' name is sometimes used!
<oimon> i am left wondering if unity can ever be usable, even with more polish
<kirrus> TheOpenSourcerer: network, disk I/O
<TheOpenSourcerer> what's the best way to find out what is causing the load?
<aptanet_> ball, yes, I've had to back off focus follows mouse
<kirrus> iotop, iptraf, htop
<oimon> use top and press i to get rid of idle apps
<oimon> check the state "R" for running.
<kirrus> Sorry, that was to TheOpenSourcerer. :) If you're running software raid, it could be rebuilding, try cat /proc/mdstat
<TheOpenSourcerer> top shows the highest process as [ahem] top ;-)
<oimon> there should also be 28 other with R running state
<oimon> run:
<oimon> top -b -i -n 3 | pastebinit
<popey> probably something has been spawned a bazillion times in a cron job
<popey> lots of contention
<TheOpenSourcerer> ahh -
<TheOpenSourcerer> lots of these:
<ball> aptanet_: I've been doing to for too long to change now ;-)
<TheOpenSourcerer> 13608 root      20   0 18924  248   44 D    0  0.0   0:00.00 cron
<TheOpenSourcerer> 13653 root      20   0 18924  248   44 D    0  0.0   0:00.00 cron
<ball> aptanet_: The main thing for me is a strong desire not to confuse my users any more than necessary.
<kirrus> TheOpenSourcerer: 'pstree -a | less' should give you more of an idea as to what the cronjobs are actually doing
<TheOpenSourcerer> Thanks - I now seem to be locked out :-(... Will be digging a tad more.
 * popey uses pstree -Aa
<kirrus> Argh, I meant -p, not -a
<TheOpenSourcerer> It's being terribly slow with it's replies to pstree. Although the cli itself is OK.
<TheOpenSourcerer> Nope - think I am going to have to kill it.
 * TheOpenSourcerer blames AlanBell for installing a non-LTS version on a server ;-)
<davmor2> TheOpenSourcerer: I think you'll find it was czajkowski fault, it normally is on this channel ;)
<TheOpenSourcerer> Ahh yes - of course you are right davmor2
<aptanet_> ball, I've been determined to give unity a chance, but I much prefer using my slower netbook that can't run it than my desktop, so I fear its days may be numbered
<ball> aptanet_: I started putting Xubuntu on machines again.
<TheOpenSourcerer> Hmmm- am struggling to get it to do anything now. I have 4 terminal sessions to it and all are not responding. Can I do Magic SYSRQ over ssh?
<aptanet_> ball, I used to like XFCE when I was using Debian, but was never that happy with Xubuntu
<kirrus> TheOpenSourcerer: you can cat SYSRQ commands into the kernel, but that requires a responsive term :/
<TheOpenSourcerer> hmm
<kirrus> TheOpenSourcerer: can you remote-powercycle?
<ball> aptanet_: What issues did you see with Xubuntu?
<TheOpenSourcerer> I can log in and enter refreshes the prompt quickly enough. But try to run a command and it stalls.
<aptanet_> ball, quite a bit was the choice of apps and the hassle of removing and installing what I wanted iirc, and the tools for managing networking were a mess when I tried it
<aptanet_> I installed it again recently alongside unity, but there were several bugs with that and I didn't have time to play
<kirrus> TheOpenSourcerer: echo 'key' > /proc/sysrq-trigger
<TheOpenSourcerer> damn. can't get passed sudo.
<kirrus> TheOpenSourcerer: patience? Sometimes the commands will get through, if you give them long enough. But, if I were you, I'd be getting console access / rebooting it
<TheOpenSourcerer> kirrus: It is quite a long way away ;-)
<kirrus> TheOpenSourcerer: remote hands?
<TheOpenSourcerer> Yeah - maybe. I have sent it a sudo reboot so maybe in a while it will get round to dealing with it.
<AlanBell> did you break it TheOpenSourcerer?
<TheOpenSourcerer> Well - not really but I can't stop it right now.
<kirrus> TheOpenSourcerer: So, it's broken, but it has nothing to do with you, right? ;)
<TheOpenSourcerer> Yes kirrus - iw breaking when I logged in.
<TheOpenSourcerer> *it was
<kirrus> Do you have a remote console, KVM thing?
<TheOpenSourcerer> nah
<AlanBell> it has an integrated lights out processor apparently
<AlanBell> but that isn't plugged in
<ubuntuuk-planet> [Michael Wood] Inhibit - http://www.michaelwood.me.uk/wordpress/2011/09/16/inhibit/
<kirrus> Shame.. remote consoles are insanely handy :)
<Myrtti> chicken blue cheese pizza *nom*
<willcooke> ping popey
<popey> hullo
<ball> LOM ftw.
<kirrus> ball: LOM?
<davmor2> Myrtti: I didn't realise you could milk a chicken
<oimon> no food should be blue
<DJones> Blueberries
<ball> kirrus: Lights-out Management... server consoles.
<DJones> And what about sauted smurfs
<ball> kirrus: Let you reboot, load an OS etc.
<ball> kirrus: ...power on, power off, mess with (the equivalent of) CMOS/NVRAM settings.
<oimon> are blueberries blue, or more purpley?
<oimon> i guess i have to hand that one to you djones
<kirrus> ball: ahh, cool, I know what you mean. I normally use direct PDU access things, but then, I am sitting a couple of meters away from the server racks ;)
<davmor2> oimon: blue cheese isn't blue
<oimon> why's it called blue cheese?
<DJones> oimon: Blueberries are fruit though, so I wouldn't count that as food, its not a sausage roll pie so it can't be nutrisious
<oimon> http://whatscookingamerica.net/Salad/BlueCheese.JPG cheese+blue colour
<ball> kirrus: We use PDU access only when the LOM's dead, which doesn't happen often.
<oimon> who decided that eating mouldy cheese is a good idea?
<kirrus> ball: cool. I say PDU, but we've out own custom-coded interface to the things, so there is Big Red Buttons on certain webpages to reboot certain machines ;)
<DJones> Probably somebody with an empty fridge
 * czajkowski throws a bucket of smelly fish over davmor2 and runs away 
<Myrtti> gj
<davmor2> see now that was completely unprovoked attack there czajkowski so don't get trying to blame me for starting this war,  /me throws a bucket of iced water of czajkowski
<davmor2> Myrtti: you okay?
 * popey tickles Myrtti 
<Myrtti> yeah, just had pizza after a small stroll to see mum and taking some apples from her trees to her. No stone yet. Anyway, back to cleaning sawdust and sanding
<TheOpenSourcerer> That sudo doesn't seem to have the same process level as commands like "w" or "top" or "ps" is a bit of an issue it seems to me. I can watch my server processes but can't sudo to do anything.
 * czajkowski hugs Myrtti 
<TheOpenSourcerer> load avg now up to 47 and as a normal user I can move around the cli freely. But try to use sudo and the interface hangs.
<popey> su to root?
<TheOpenSourcerer> no passwd
<popey> oops
<oimon> sudo -i
<TheOpenSourcerer> that stalls oimon
<davmor2> TheOpenSourcerer: I'd say you broked it
<TheOpenSourcerer> Anyone got a *very* long stick?
<oimon> you broke the friday law
<popey> have you tried turning it off and on again?
<AlanBell> TheOpenSourcerer: can you crash it?
<AlanBell> hard as a normal user
<popey> TheOpenSourcerer: what kernel release are you on? :D
<popey> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-security-announce/2011-August/001399.html use one of them to crash it :D
<popey> http://web.nvd.nist.gov/view/vuln/detail?vulnId=CVE-2011-1581 maybe
<oimon> how long have you waited for the sudo to work?
<TheOpenSourcerer> popey: Sorry on phone. AlanBell installed 11.04 on this server
<popey> yeah, that kernel bug relates to 11.04
<TheOpenSourcerer> I have asked our customer (whose server it is) if he can go and give it a bloody big kick up the bottom.
<TheOpenSourcerer> Linux servername 2.6.38-11-server #48-Ubuntu SMP Fri Jul 29 19:20:32 UTC 2011 x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux
<TheOpenSourcerer> how could I crash it AlanBell? Do some kind of recursive command to fill the memory or something?
<czajkowski> popey: oh fixed my unity Â£D desktop issue
<czajkowski> popey: by me I mean filbert :D
<czajkowski> had to install unity it had vanished but could still see it on 2D
<AlanBell> TheOpenSourcerer: dunno really, I was just suggesting non-conventional ways to shut it down
<AlanBell> raising the temperature above the critical point would do it
<oimon> anyone here bought a porch recently?
<oimon> wondering if it's the same merry dance as double glazing quotes
<popey> TheOpenSourcerer: forkbomb sounds like it's already been run :D
<TheOpenSourcerer> This is weird though: http://paste.ubuntu.com/690883/
<TheOpenSourcerer> I'm hoping our customer will wander downstairs in a mo and hit the big STOP button on the front of the server.
<TheOpenSourcerer> Then AlanBell can work out why 11.04 likes to commit suicide so much :-)
<AlanBell> works for me :)
<diplo> blimey TheOpenSourcerer that is some serious load :)
<TheOpenSourcerer> yeah. But no processor load nor memory starvation.
<TheOpenSourcerer> And there really isn't much running on the box
<TheOpenSourcerer> 11.04 server, denyhosts, postgres, openerp and apache.
<TheOpenSourcerer> diplo: It's now 48 :-)
<popey> yeah, more cron jobs
<diplo> IO issue, hitting swap or something ?
<popey> wedged cron jobs
<TheOpenSourcerer> But it is really weird how as a normal user the cli is very responsive.
<diplo> hmm no 0k used
<diplo> Some bug there somewhere then :)
<TheOpenSourcerer> but try to sudo and it [the cli] stalls.
<diplo> Any one ever have issues with ntpdate setting time to non bst ?
<davmor2> gord: scope â apps with filter games still shows nothing still
<diplo> IE an hour slow
<gord> davmor2, yell at kamstrup on ayatana for me :)
<gord> davmor2, though it works fine here
<davmor2> gord one second let me check for updates before I start yelling then
<TheOpenSourcerer> It's almost certainly cron jobs: http://paste.ubuntu.com/690894/
<davmor2> gord:  I have a bunch of unity fixes so fingers crossed
<geekMePlease> Does the wireless modem E153 work in the newest Ubuntu?
<geekMePlease> * it does not seem to recognize the device
<geekMePlease> * have it connected it right now to 11.04
<kirrus> geekMePlease: a quick google revealed this, which might help? Sorry, don't have direct knowledge: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?p=11134372
<geekMePlease> What is the wireless program name in the newest Ubuntu in terminal?
<popey> wireless program name?
<geekMePlease> * there is no mark of my E153 -connection at the right-top corner
<popey> iwlist / iwconfig / nm-tool ?
<geekMePlease> popey: yes
<popey> ah, not that kind of wirelss?
<popey> 3G
<geekMePlease> popey: yes
<geekMePlease> There does not seem to be any driver for the modem E153
<geekMePlease> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/NetworkManager/Hardware/3G
<popey> what have you tried?
<ubuntuuk-planet> [Jonathan Riddell] Tu Parle Bazaar? - http://blogs.kde.org/node/4480
<ubuntuuk-planet> [Jonathan Riddell] 42,000 schools running Kubuntu derivative - http://blogs.kde.org/node/4481
<davmor2> gord: Yay I can haz gamez
<geekMePlease> It seems to notice that it is a usb-modem but does not get it synced with Network tools: http://pastebin.com/nVX39DaC
<geekMePlease> popey: above
<gord> davmor2, :)
<geekMePlease> the driver is still on alpha -phase 0.7.2
<geekMePlease> * ok, I will not buy the given modem.
<issyl0> AlanBell: The release party?  Possibly.
<issyl0> AlanBell: When's the Farnborough drinks thing again?
<MartijnVdS> issyl0: http://ubuntu-uk.org/happy-hour/ ?
<TheOpenSourcerer> issyl0: You mean the one next to popey 's house ?
<TheOpenSourcerer> 20/10/2011
<issyl0> TheOpenSourcerer: That's the one, yeah.
<issyl0> TheOpenSourcerer: Oh yay!
<issyl0> I have an excuse not to go to the college party that isn't "I won't be able to get home unless I leave at 10." :P
<TheOpenSourcerer> lol
<issyl0> So, good timing, guys.  :-))
<issyl0> (It's very sad though, isn't it?  :P)
<MartijnVdS> issyl0: do you use that excuse a lot then?
<issyl0> MartijnVdS: No, but it's true!
<issyl0> MartijnVdS: OK, maybe not totally true: The last train from the town in which my college is to the town in which I live is at 11pm, but still, it's the principle...
<MartijnVdS> issyl0: It's true here as well, if I leave after 23:00, I won't be able to get home (or, I will, but then I won't be able to drink, responsible driving etc.)
<issyl0> MartijnVdS: :-(
<MartijnVdS> \o/ car though
<issyl0> Heh.
<issyl0> I'm having driving lessons.  :-)
<MartijnVdS> I can drink water all night if it's a good party :)
<issyl0> The car my parents were going to let me drive when I pass my test has just broken down, though.  :P
<issyl0> MartijnVdS: Heh, water.  \o/
 * MartijnVdS has a yellow SMART
<MartijnVdS> like this: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e6/Yellow_Smart_Fortwo_side.JPG
<issyl0> Hmmmm/.
<issyl0> Is it normal that the table headers are slightly offset from the actual columns on http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/ubuntu-uk/1277/detail/ ?
<issyl0> It annoys me.
<MartijnVdS> issyl0: which table do you mean?
<MartijnVdS> ooh the bottom one is all broken
 * MartijnVdS blames AlanBell 
<issyl0> The registration table.
<issyl0> Yeah.
<gord> heh yeah the headers are centred while the items are left aligned
<gord> that is annoying
<ali1234> it's because someone inserted an empty header cell instead of using colspan
<MartijnVdS> gord: also, the header is wider than the contents
<issyl0> It doesn't look like the "edit" button works to edit the table, either, just the information about the event.
<ali1234> and it's the header that is left aligned and the contents is centered
<ali1234> what you should actually do is make everything centered and merge the empty cell with colspan=2
<popey> issyl0: its already been filed as a bug
<issyl0> popey: Oh OK.  :-)
<issyl0> popey: That's good then.
<popey> (I asked the same thing a few days ago)
<issyl0> popey: Aahh.
<AlanBell> gord: issyl0 yeah, that is a column that has something to do with pictures of people
<AlanBell> I reported the bug already
 * brobostigon puts e4 on, for big bang theory, :)
<AlanBell> bug 841790
<lubotu3> Launchpad bug 841790 in LoCo Team Directory "extra column in table header on attendee list" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/841790
<AlanBell> ^^ someone could confirm that if they like
<AlanBell> bug #734520
<lubotu3> Launchpad bug 713873 in Launchpad itself "duplicate for #734520 (in API) Person.logo_link is hard to use and performs poorly" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/713873
<AlanBell> ^^ someone commented out the avatars to fix that bug, and forgot to remove the <th> cell
 * AlanBell pushes the fix
 * AlanBell expects it won't get merged
<MartijnVdS> you didn't sign over copyright to Canonical?
 * issyl0 reports a Launchpad bug...
<issyl0> (It's been irritating me for ages; I've finally got around to reporting it.)
<issyl0> https://bugs.launchpad.net/launchpad/+bug/852056
<lubotu3> Ubuntu bug 852056 in Launchpad itself "Colons at the end of details on "confirm logon" screen." [Undecided,New]
<issyl0> Anyone else?  Or am I just a pedant?  :P
<MartijnVdS> let me check
 * MartijnVdS confirms
<MartijnVdS> "Does it affect you?" "Yes, deeply"
<issyl0> MartijnVdS: :D
<issyl0> MartijnVdS: Yay.  :P
<MartijnVdS> \o/ 90s week on the radio
<MartijnVdS> Only songs from the 90s, for a week
<Myrtti> Ace of Base!
<MartijnVdS> Myrtti: http://www.3fmfan.nl/page/muziekstats for the playlist of the last few hours
<MartijnVdS> they've only just started
<daubers> Evening
<MartijnVdS> \o daubster
<Neoti> Is torrenting a TV Episode or series illegal if you already have it recorded on a Tivo or V+ box from virgin Media, but want to have it stored on a media centre and plan to delete the recorded one from the relevant device? need help on the legality of this?
<MartijnVdS> Neoti: don't ask us, ask someone who's trained in legal matters
 * daubers tries to find his desk
<ubuntuuk-planet> [Jono Bacon] Getting Older - http://www.jonobacon.org/2011/09/16/getting-older/
<Hornet> Neoti: no
<Hornet> it's not illegal to download, it's technically a civil offence to upload however
<Hornet> but not criminal, and nobody has ever been prosecuted
<brobostigon> so 12.04 will be the next LTs?
<hamitron> yeh
 * hamitron is looking forward to it
<brobostigon> i am just thinking about ubuntu server for my vps.
<hamitron> all my 32 bit machines will be slackware, then 64 bit and servers on ubuntu 12.04
<hamitron> is my current plan
<MartijnVdS> ooh QI tonight
<brobostigon> and outnumbered, :)
<brobostigon> i was considering going to the pub, but the tv is too good,
 * daubers rips his OU course DVD to his HDD and phone
<AlanBell>  http://www.bcs.org/content/ConWebDoc/41634 issyl0 czajkowski
<AlanBell> and anyone else in the London area interested in Ada Lovelace day stuff
<AlanBell> canonical are investigating sorting out nibbles for the launch party \o/
<daubers> Hah! Didn't realise that the Nitty Gritty Dirt Band did a cover of "Crazy Words Crazy Tune"
<zleap> cake :D
<Azelphur> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/3832397/screenshots/September%202011/2011-09-16_19.45.13.png is this normal for minecraft 1.8?
<Azelphur> or is it a bug :/
<MartijnVdS> Azelphur: The magic darkness?
<MartijnVdS> that's a feature
<Azelphur> omg
<Azelphur> even with glowstone and torches? :(
<MartijnVdS> yes
<MartijnVdS> only sunlight works
<Azelphur> that's messed :/
<Azelphur> I guess that means underground bunkers are out
<MartijnVdS> Well glass roofs :)
<MartijnVdS> it's only below some level I think..
<Azelphur> :(
<Azelphur> I'm pretty much on the bedrock
<oimon1> hi guys, where is the banshee cddb configured? it's not recognising a well known cd..can't find the specific site in the prefs
<MartijnVdS> oimon1: it uses musicbrainz
<MartijnVdS> oimon1: which CD?
<oimon1> nada  surf, the weight is a gift
<MartijnVdS> is it very new?
<MartijnVdS> no.. it's from '05
<oimon1> musicbrainz picard recognises it
<MartijnVdS> oimon1: then Banshee should too
<oimon1> maybe i've disabled a plugin by accident
<oimon1> or banshee is just being lame
<MartijnVdS> Which Ubuntu version?
<MartijnVdS> because anything < oneiric won't work because of API changes
<MartijnVdS> on the musicbrainz site
<oimon1> lucid
<MartijnVdS> that's the problem then
<MartijnVdS> sound-juicer won't work either (API change as well)
<oimon1> banshee 2.01?
<MartijnVdS> oimon1: 2.1.4 here (oneiric)
<oimon1> hmm
<oimon1> what's worse is that i have the ppa enabled
<oimon1> bug 455461
<lubotu3> Launchpad bug 455461 in sound-juicer (Ubuntu Lucid) "Sound Juicer depends on deprecated libmusicbrainz4" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/455461
<MartijnVdS> yeah I've been subscribed to those
<MartijnVdS> sound-juicer is very broken on multi-cd sets atm
<MartijnVdS> banshe is better but not perfect
<oimon1> thanks for pointing me in the right direction :)
<oimon1> argh some joker knocked on the door asking to sponsor him for something. dog barks , baby stirs. there's a reason i have a no cold caller sign
<oimon1> i dont really trust sound-juicers mp3 settings
<MartijnVdS> oimon1: it's just a bunch of standard gstreamer settings.. there's a config gui
<oimon1> interestingly sound juicer works, so only banshee that's broken
<MartijnVdS> get a newer banshee :)
<oimon1> or a newer ubuntu ...i've got natty running upstairs
<MartijnVdS> that includes a newer banshee :)
<oimon1> but...it's upstairs :)
<oimon1> just tried playing openttd but looks like hard work
<oimon1> think i'll stick to wii games
<MartijnVdS> openttd is fun :)
<oimon1> looking forward to the long awaited "album artist" bug fix in banshee 2.3
<MartijnVdS> oimon1: album artist bugfix?
<oimon1> allow to show the "album artist" instead of artist in the artist list. avoids lots of entries when you wife adds a cheesy compilation
<MartijnVdS> ah
<MartijnVdS> I browse the album list anyway
<MartijnVdS> or search
<oimon1> that bug makes me use clementine
<oimon1> maybe i'm a bit ocd, but i don't like seeing will young and kylie in my artist list
<MartijnVdS> So give your wife her own account (and ~/Music)
<oimon1> she also has some good musics :)
<MartijnVdS> ln -s ~wife/Music/Good_Album ~/Music/
<oimon1> i try to keep all data under /data
<oimon1> then ln Music etc
 * MartijnVdS waves the FHS in oimon1's face
<oimon1> most of the music i listen to in the car noawadays is to keep my 1yr old son happy
<MartijnVdS> so.. loud guitar rock?
<oimon2> i wonder if canonical will follow MS W8 by putting a bunch of info on the lightdm screen now
<MartijnVdS> maybe...
<MartijnVdS> but what
<oimon1> the usual generic guff like weather info
<oimon1> i haven't really followed all the windows press this week but everyone seems to be focussing on the metro pre-login environment
<oimon1> buy windows8 , get a cut down splashtop?
<czajkowski> AlanBell: interesting
<AlanBell> the cake is not a lie
<Nafallo> apt-btrfs-snapshot is a VERY good idea.
<Nafallo> it just saved my ass :-)
<AlanBell> lucky donkey
<Nafallo> now i have to download all the updates again though :-p
<brobostigon> is one pound per GB, within and sd good value?
<Nafallo> should probably figure out which one broke my stuff as well :-p
<brobostigon> an*
<Nafallo> brobostigon: SD card?
<brobostigon> Nafallo: sdhc
<Nafallo> brobostigon: there is a lot more to it than the size. class is more important in most cases.
<brobostigon> Nafallo: what do i look for ? i am not very familier with that factor.
<Nafallo> brobostigon: depends what you're going to use the card for really.
<AlanBell> class 10 is the fastest
<brobostigon> Nafallo: using to boot haiku-os from.
<AlanBell> fast as possible then
<AlanBell> about Â£20 for a 16GB class 10
<brobostigon> ok, class 10 or nearest?
<brobostigon> ok, that sounds fine.
<brobostigon> thank you./
<Nafallo> if you want the fastest on the market, yes :-)
<Nafallo> class 6 minimum recommended for recording 1080p HD videos :-)
<Nafallo> might give you an idea.
<AlanBell> it still isn't fast compared to SSD, but is fast enough
<brobostigon> AlanBell: i will be using this, via the sd slot on my eeepc, and then via a usb sd adaptor on other machines.
<AlanBell> yeah, I have a machine that boots ubuntu server from SD
<AlanBell> works fine and is very convenient
<Nafallo> hrm
<brobostigon> ok, hmmm.
<brobostigon> interesting.
<Nafallo> I need windows on this machine :-/
<brobostigon> so highest class possible,
<brobostigon> http://www.ebuyer.com/282288-exdisplay-verbatim-securedigital-sdhc-class10-16gb-ebr1-43962
<brobostigon> would something like that, be fine?
<AlanBell> sounds good from the URL :)
<AlanBell> I have VPN stuff going on and browsers are being confused now
<brobostigon> :(
<brobostigon> new QI :)
<brobostigon> john lloyd, who came up with the idea, lives just down the road from me. in "great tew".
<brobostigon> there is alot of choice.
<brobostigon> when david gilmour was younger, he looks very alike to my younger brother, would my brother object to being compared to one of the best quitarists on the planet?
<AlanBell> brobostigon: all the oggcamp videos were recorded on SD cards identical to that
<brobostigon> AlanBell: ah, :)
<AlanBell> and my home server boots from one of them
<brobostigon> the one i s[ecofoed from ebuyer?
<AlanBell> yeah
<brobostigon> :)
 * brobostigon buys.
<tiga> qqq
#ubuntu-uk 2011-09-17
<daubers> Morning
<AlanBell> morning
<sagaci> hi
<czajkowski> aloha
<daubers> Woot!
<daubers> Almost finished my short syncy script to keep a couple of folders of docs in sync with google docs
<daubers> Just need to give it some intelligence as it assumes everything is a document at the moment
<brobostigon> good morning everyone.
<Laney> hiya
<brobostigon> morning Laney
<AlanBell> pronunciation question for you
<AlanBell> spd-say "ubuntu"
<AlanBell> spd-say "oo bun too"
<AlanBell> or something else?
<MartijnVdS> https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/ladkaalcnedlcimjgaldjoeahnklilnk
<AlanBell> and can you get spd-say to pronunce ocelot?
<kvarley> What tool should I be using to convert .glade UI's to bash scripts? I used to use gtkdialog but it's no longer in the repos
<czajkowski> Whoooooooooooooooooooooooooo
<AlanBell> :)
 * AlanBell thinks czajkowski just beat the aussies
<AlanBell> spd-say  "ubuntu oh nairic ossselot" < does that sound right?
<AlanBell> run it from a terminal
<czajkowski> we did
<czajkowski> :D
<AlanBell> spd-say  "ubuntu oh niric osselot" maybe
<matti> Hm.
<gord> AlanBell, maybe its my northernness creeping in, but "ubuntu on-eric osselot" sounds best to me
<czajkowski> aat least it's geting the Ubuntu right
<czajkowski> dear gods some folks say it and it's almost cringe worthy
<czajkowski> Ubuuutu
<AlanBell> spd-say "oo bun too" I kind of do that a bit
<AlanBell> spd-say -t female2 "ubuntu on-eric osselot" sounds just like czajkowski :)
<AlanBell> "ubuntu oh-neric osselot" seems good
<MartijnVdS> which engine does that use?
<AlanBell> espeak
<AlanBell> by default, but speech dispatcher is a front end for any back end speech synth
<MartijnVdS> that sounds very roboty in Dutch
<AlanBell> yeah, it isn't great, but it does fit on the disk
<AlanBell> http://mary.dfki.de:59125/ open Mary is much better, but is big and java
<MartijnVdS> Google Translate's "speak" button is good
<AlanBell> sure, but not really the point
<MartijnVdS> well if it had an API... :)
<AlanBell> the point being I want to patch orca so that it has a few pre-populated entries in the pronunciation dictionary so it doesn't sound so daft in the 10.10 installer
<MartijnVdS> 11.10, I guess, but good idea
<AlanBell> 11.10 yes
<gord> unbuntu!
<AlanBell> spd-say "oh-nigh-ric" has been suggested
<geekMePlease> What is the dep for non-realtek drivers?
<geekMePlease> * for natty 11.04
<geekMePlease> * trying to get usb mini nano wireless modem 802.11 working from Dealextreme
<geekMePlease> * on Lenovo x60
<MartijnVdS> geekMePlease: "non-realtek drivers"?
<MartijnVdS> geekMePlease: what kind of chipset does it have?
<MartijnVdS> geekMePlease: (use "lsusb" to find out what it reports to the OS)
<geekMePlease> MartijnVdS: Bus 001 Device 012: ID 0bda:8176 Realtek Semiconductor Corp.
<MartijnVdS> And it doesn't work out of the box when you plug it in?
<geekMePlease> MartijnVdS: does not seem to, see http://pastebin.com/DdvfQW3K
<MartijnVdS> I see a wlan0 device
<geekMePlease> MartijnVdS: it is my computer wlan, not the given wlan device
<geekMePlease> MartijnVdS: there should be 802.11abgn
<MartijnVdS> geekMePlease: can you pastebin the output of dmesg?
<geekMePlease> MartijnVdS: http://paste.ubuntu.com/691478/
<MartijnVdS> yeah it's not recognised.. hmm
<MartijnVdS> geekMePlease: there's a bug about this: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/linux/+bug/795770
<lubotu3> Ubuntu bug 795770 in linux (Ubuntu) "Realtek Semiconductor Corp. [0bda:8176] not detected" [Undecided,Incomplete]
<MartijnVdS> geekMePlease: it should work in 11.10 -- you can try the latest beta from a live CD
<MartijnVdS> geekMePlease: the bug also lists a backport/workaround
<geekMePlease> What is the terminal commnad to upgrade to 11.10 beta?
<geekMePlease> not apt-get dist-upgrade
<geekMePlease> - some option misning
<MartijnVdS> geekMePlease: it's a beta, it's not quite finished, things WILL break
<MartijnVdS> but if you really want to
<MartijnVdS> do-release-upgrade -d
<geekMePlease> MartijnVdS: Thank you!
<isleofmandan> Good afternoon. I've just done apt-get upgrade on my Oneric box. Now have a "System program problem detected" dialogue box, that won't stop bugging me. Anyone know how to shut it up?
<MartijnVdS> isleofmandan: what's crashing?
<MartijnVdS> it should give you a program name if you give it a password
<isleofmandan> er, how do it find out? *blush*
<isleofmandan> appears as soon as I log in
<MartijnVdS> yes
<MartijnVdS> and the dialog box has 2 options
<isleofmandan> it prompts for password
<isleofmandan> but then nothing happens
<MartijnVdS> it should show you a bug report tool with the crashing program's name in it
<isleofmandan> 3 seconds later, a new "system problem..." dialogue pops up. Cycle repeats forever!
<MartijnVdS> what happens if you choose the other option
<AlanBell> isleofmandan: yes, that is a completel pain
<MartijnVdS> "cancel"?
<isleofmandan> it pops up again...
<isleofmandan> :)
<isleofmandan> hence my trip here :)
<AlanBell> you can turn off apport somehow
<MartijnVdS> AlanBell: Completel? http://www.completel.fr/? We work with them at work :P
<MartijnVdS> AlanBell: that still doesn't stop the crashing he's seeing
<MartijnVdS> AlanBell: if something's respawning and dieing, turning off apport won't stop that, only hide it
<AlanBell> yeah, I know. Unity is a bit of a crashfest
<isleofmandan> If i leave the dialogue open, and hide it behind other windows it's not too bad. I guess that will have to do until the clever people fix it.
<AlanBell> I was finding the global menu was a bit crashy and respawny
<gord> hrrm, i put "crewe bus times" into google and it automatically found the bus i wanted... i'm terrified
<isleofmandan> Ah ha. Using xkill on the dialogue box is a permanent fix :)
* AlanBell changed the topic of #ubuntu-uk to: Welcome to #ubuntu-uk! http://ubuntu-uk.org | This channel is publicly archived http://irclogs.ubuntu.com | Mailing List http://tinyurl.com/uukml | Support Guidelines http://tinyurl.com/uuksupport | Meeting 19th September 21:00 UK time #ubuntu-uk-meeting | Happy Software Freedom Day \o/
<shavington> Hi all very quiet today
 * AlanBell files bug 852583
<lubotu3> Launchpad bug 852583 in gnome-orca (Ubuntu) "Orca does not pronounce "Oneiric Ocelot" very well" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/852583
<czajkowski> AlanBell: get it to say czajkowski
<AlanBell> see zaj kowski
<AlanBell> spd-say "chycofski"
<AlanBell> add a comment to the bug if you want that distro patched in to orca :)
<czajkowski> lol
<czajkowski> I'll be good
<shauno> can you install different voices/languages for orca?
<StevenR> yes
<AlanBell> shauno: yeah, speech dispatcher is just a front end for any kind of synth
<AlanBell> you can use it with hardware voice synthesisers, refreshable braille devices, all sorts
<AlanBell> and I knocked together a speech dispatcher module that just outputs to a file so you can tail that in a window and I can test things silently and get a full transcript of what it is trying to say
<TheOpenSourcerer> Hi AlanBell - Just thought I drop in and say "load average: 75.00," ;-) Now off to make a lasagne. ttfn
<AlanBell> TheOpenSourcerer: great, hope it crashes soon!
<shauno> mine handles foreign text better if I use a voice that's intended for that language .. doesn't sound like there's a direct parallel for that tho
<TheOpenSourcerer> lol
<AlanBell> shauno: speech dispatcher can pass through the language and voice settings
<shauno> so it's up to whatever synth you use to do something useful with that
<AlanBell> try spd-say franÃ§ais
<AlanBell> and spd-say -l fr franÃ§ais
<AlanBell> or even spd-say -t female3 -l fr "je m'appelle issyl0 et je parle franÃ§ais"
<MartijnVdS> issyl0 is a robot?! :)
<shauno> hm.  so cz<tab> is much more convincing with -l pl
<AlanBell> it is indeed
<czajkowski> eh?
<BigRedS> wait, you can call *people* with arguments now?
<MartijnVdS> ?
<BigRedS> If there's anyone I'd not do that to, it'd cz<tab>
<shauno> calling people with arguments is my speciality :/
<BigRedS> haha
<BigRedS> Oh, I've read back now. That's less fun.
<AlanBell> spd-say -l pl "czajkowski"
<czajkowski> BigRedS: only with rugby
<shauno> yeah.  just getting festival to make less of a hash of it by throwing it some hints
<czajkowski> best not to argue with me about that
<shauno> I've been having to do something similar with mine, but it uses different voices for different languages, which can be rather jarring
<mgdm> shauno -rf /
<MartijnVdS> mgdm: now you've shaunoed all over your filesystem..
<AlanBell> shauno: I would quite like to do an audio irc client as an irssi plugin that assigns a different voice for each person
<shauno> the worrying thing is I'd be tempted to use such a thing
<BigRedS> so long as there's a ranty voice for all-caps words
<BigRedS> and the bots sound like glados from portal
<shauno> I use voice notifications for far, far too many things.  my current irk is that I can't get it to use different languages for specific parts of a message
<shauno> so I can either have it mangle their name, or put the whole statement in that language
<MartijnVdS> shauno: HTML, <span lang=""></span> + fancy speech-enabled web browser?
<shauno> my web browser would be on the short list of things that don't talk to me ;)
<MartijnVdS> .. yet
<shauno> but some sort of equivalent markup would be handy, yes
<brobostigon> ok, why would it make any difference, if i can read from an sd card, with a usb adaptor, and cant just putting the sd card, into my eeepc's sd card slow, and then showing ntfs errors. whereas shows none, with the usb adaptor.
<MartijnVdS> Sounds like the SD card and the Eee don't like each other
<MartijnVdS> that happens sometimes
<brobostigon> why is the usb adaptor making any difference here?
<MartijnVdS> it might contain a different SD reader chip
<MartijnVdS> or non-dusty contacts
<MartijnVdS> stuff like that
<brobostigon> ok, let me try a different sd card, one moment.
<brobostigon> weird, that mounted fine.
<brobostigon> hmm,
<MartijnVdS> card/controller combination it is then
<MartijnVdS> is it a very new/old card?
<MartijnVdS> or a very new/old reader (or Eee PC)
<brobostigon> the card is about 3 years old. the usb adaptor i bought last year, and my eeepc is dated, 2009.
<shauno> looking at places I've had to override the language, seems my IM client is the biggest offender. I have 'new message from' or 'mesaj nou de la' depending on badly I want the name butchered
<shauno> 'martijn' seems to work fine.  the english voice turns ijn into een.  but icelandic & romanian names in particular, it renders unintelligible
<MartijnVdS> shauno: try with -l nl
<MartijnVdS> shauno: that's what it's supposed to sound like (minus the robotness)
<shauno> heh, festival doesn't do ijn so well in english :)  (mart-i-gen)
<MartijnVdS> exactly ;)
<MartijnVdS> I'm not marty-gen :)
<MartijnVdS> or marty jen
<shauno> http://oneil.me.uk/martijn.aiff  that's what mine comes up with (osx)
<shauno> not sure I have a dutch voice installed to try
<MartijnVdS> can't play that here
<MartijnVdS> martijn.aiff: could not find codec parameters
<shauno> seriously?  even my amiga can play those :/
<MartijnVdS> really
<MartijnVdS> even vlc doesn't work
<MartijnVdS> (you know it's bad when..)
<shauno> http://oneil.me.uk/martijn.mp3
<shauno> (lame, sox & libaudiofile have no problems with aiff :)  it's this nasty gstreamer nonsense!)
<MartijnVdS> shauno: file martijn.mp3 tells me it's still AIFF :)
<MartijnVdS> ah: "play" from sox does work
<shauno> hah, tab fail
<MartijnVdS> but it says "marteen", which is WRONG :)
<shauno> heh, it's close enough for me :)  (and sounds more natural than marti-gen)
<MartijnVdS> that it does
<shauno> trying not to install too many voices, because / is on an ssd, and they're 500Mb-ish each
<MartijnVdS> yike
<MartijnVdS> that's a lot
<shauno> but names in particular I'm fussy about, else I find myself using the computer's version IRL
<MartijnVdS> shauno: try on Ubuntu "spd-say -l nl Martijn" and you'll get a good idea :)
<shauno> yeah, I did.  the end comes out more like ayn
<MartijnVdS> ish. yes
<MartijnVdS> Weird Dutch phoneme :)
<MartijnVdS> we pronounce "ei" (egg) the same way
<shauno> well, no-one ever claimed dutch was normal :p
<mgdm> The couple of Dutch friends I have make no such claims :P
<MartijnVdS> at least it's not Frisian :)
<MartijnVdS> That's just English with a bad case of the Scandinavians :)
<MartijnVdS> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/West_Frisian_language
<MartijnVdS> + #Folklore_about_relation_to_English_and_Dutch
<ubuntuuk-planet> [Tony] Im a wedding photographer - http://tonywhitmore.co.uk/blog/2011/09/17/im-a-wedding-photographer-in-hampshire/
<shauno> oh good lord.  good luck with that one
<Myrtti> he doesn't really need it
<shauno> weddings terrify me.  tried it once, never again
<MartijnVdS> What, going to, or participating in?
<Myrtti> MartijnVdS: photographing
<Myrtti> for munnies
<MartijnVdS> ah
<MartijnVdS> I've never cared enough about my pictures to try to do it for money
<shauno> Myrtti: 'all of the above'.  but specifically shooting them
<Myrtti> I don't mind personally
<Myrtti> I've got good enough camera to enjoy it again
<Myrtti> well, photography in general
<MartijnVdS> Oh I like taking pictures
<MartijnVdS> it's just that when doing it for money, you need (a) skill, (b) some way to write bills (i.e. your own company, i.e. lots of boring administrative work)
<shauno> I helped a friend with one in the states.  quickly became apparent that I'm simply not cut out for it
<MartijnVdS> also, when you do it for the money, it can take away the "fun" bit
<MartijnVdS> same reason I don't code as often as I used to at home
<Myrtti> having a sole propri... pro... whatever isn't too difficult in Finland, even easier in UK (I hear)
<shauno> alcohol-assisted family feuds are not a conductive place to throw a very quiet geek :)
<Myrtti> and I like bookkeeping :-)
<MartijnVdS> see, I don't :)
<MartijnVdS> shauno: Are you talking about weddings, or small businesses :)
<Myrtti> double-entry bookkeeping is easy as 1-2-3 after a bit of training and proper software :-)
<MartijnVdS> Myrtti: see, I don't have either
<Myrtti> I even found a Finnish one with ready made accounts that I does fine in Ubuntu
<MartijnVdS> there's a Dutch command line one in Perl
<Myrtti> ledger is in the repos
<MartijnVdS> if anything, I'd use that
<Myrtti> hm, ledger wasn't the one I was thinking of
<Myrtti> oh well
<TheOpenSourcerer> Will Ubuntu  run on a Pentium PIII?
<MartijnVdS> TheOpenSourcerer: That's 686, so I think so, yes
<TheOpenSourcerer> TY - A mate just dropped round an old lappy he'd like me to stick Ubuntu on for him. It's a PIII 500Mhz ;-)
<MartijnVdS> awww :)
<TheOpenSourcerer> No boot from USB... No CD
<Myrtti> oof
<BigRedS> so boot off floppy
<BigRedS> :)
<MartijnVdS> SBM floppy \o/
<penguin42> TheOpenSourcerer: Net boot?
<MartijnVdS> almost doctor time!
<brobostigon> :)
 * brobostigon expressivly flails his hands into the air.
<MartijnVdS> brobostigon: I'm imaging you making a "wubwubwub" sound like Zoidberg ;)
<brobostigon> lol, no. :)
<brobostigon> new dr who :)
 * brobostigon gets a beer topup.
 * MartijnVdS gets the mint tea
 * popey tickles MartijnVdS 
<daubers> Evening
<MartijnVdS> popey: h,
<MartijnVdS> hm
<brobostigon> interesting, clearly certain inspiration in this episode.
<popey> no spoilers pls
<MartijnVdS> popey: of course :)
<brobostigon> i didnt give away anything, :)
 * popey sighs
<brobostigon> of course, no spoilers, :)
 * hamitron pokes Azelphur 
 * Azelphur counter pokes
<hamitron> is IRC up?
<Azelphur> mine? yea
<hamitron> I just disconnected from it, and can't connect
<hamitron> working again
<Azelphur> :D
<HazRPG> Hmm, I've just wrote an e-mail to someone who wants to start developing chrome extensions... I'm wondering if I should C&P and put it onto my blog...
<HazRPG> because it's a basic "hello world" extension...
<bigcalm_lappy486> Always a good place to start
<ubuntuuk-planet> [Andrew] nVidia GeForce 210 on Ubuntu 11.04 - http://whyareyoureadingthisurl.wordpress.com/2011/09/17/nvidia-geforce-210-on-ubuntu-11-04/
<czajkowski> dr.who wasn't bad
 * hamitron gags czajkowski
<MartijnVdS> watching Confidential now
<hamitron> I got it recorded, but not watch last weeks yet
<hamitron> :/
<hamitron> and boxing is on soon
<czajkowski> hamitron: hurry up so
<czajkowski> MartijnVdS: any thoughts on what was behind #11
 * AlanBell will be watching Dr Who later
<penguin42> hmph bbc radio webiste seems to be slow at the moment
<mgdm> This Dr Who is rubbish
 * mgdm digs out some proper old-school stuff 
<bigcalm_lappy486> Good evening mgdm
<bigcalm_lappy486> Said you'd enjoy the zip wire :D
<TheOpenSourcerer> anyone done any netboot installs?
<mgdm> bigcalm_lappy486: indeed :)
<TheOpenSourcerer> What's wrong with this? http://paste.ubuntu.com/691851/
<TheOpenSourcerer> never gets past pxelinux.0
<TheOpenSourcerer> i.e. pxelinux.cfg...
<mgdm> bigcalm_lappy486: Oddly enough, I was more nervous before my talks at FrOSCon than I was before stepping off a crane 150ft in the air.
<mgdm> bigcalm_lappy486: says something about my psyche, that does.
<bigcalm_lappy486> Ah, completely different
<bigcalm_lappy486> The worst that could happen with the zip line is death
<bigcalm_lappy486> Yet you could have been humiliated at Froscon
<mgdm> Heh heh heh
<shavington> What version are we up to
<ali1234> TheOpenSourcerer: ignore logs, break out tcpdump
<ali1234> most likely the problem is one of: permission error, typo in config file, or completely missing file
<bigcalm_lappy486> mgdm: how recently have you played with cakephp?
<mgdm> bigcalm_lappy486: never
<bigcalm_lappy486> Aha :)
<bigcalm_lappy486> I got bored again while on holiday
<mgdm> oh aye
<bigcalm_lappy486> One of my main client's project is in cake 1.1. So I'm used to cake, but thought I'd take a look at 1.3. Obviously things have changed, but the model/controller creation script seems to have gone. A bit of a silly thing to remove. CakePHP called their script Bake :)
<mgdm> Heh
<bigcalm_lappy486> Aye, having another go at my receipt logging app in another MVC, CakePHP this time
<mgdm> bigcalm_lappy486: the closest I got to CakePHP was a slice of http://www.flickr.com/photos/afilina/5490242693/ in Canada last year
<mgdm> oops, this year
<mgdm> (it wasn't actually very nice- the icing was boggin')
<bigcalm_lappy486> Hehehe
<bigcalm_lappy486> Do you take your ElePHPant with you everywhere?
<mgdm> That wasn't mine
<bigcalm_lappy486> I was somewhat chuffed when my boss gave me an ElePHPant
<mgdm> \o/
<mgdm> apparently you get pink ones now
<bigcalm_lappy486> A normal sized one. He got one for himself as well as one of the BIG ones for his kids :D
<bigcalm_lappy486> Ah, I like my blue one
<mgdm> I have a normal sized one too, got it a few years ago, I believe it's one of the first
<Myrtti> PINK?!?!
<mgdm> Myrtti: indeed!
<Myrtti> mmmm cake
<bigcalm_lappy486> http://www.flickr.com/photos/bigcuthy/sets/72157604110762041/
<bigcalm_lappy486> Hiya Myrtti :)
<mgdm> Myrtti: http://www.flickr.com/photos/derickrethans/6123855470/in/photostream
<Myrtti> awww
<Myrtti> PHP is actually the language I've managed to get most stuff done
<Myrtti> surprisingly
<mgdm> me too
<mgdm> it pays the bills, and has done for a while
<Myrtti> ha.
<Myrtti> what I mean is that I've actually done more than just a hello world with it
<mgdm> Ah :)
<bigcalm_lappy486> mgdm: mine appears to have been given to me in March 2008
<bigcalm_lappy486> Despite people bad mouthing PHP, I still do it and it still pays the bills
<mgdm> bigcalm_lappy486: http://www.flickr.com/photos/mgdm/2197674301/ was not long after I got my SLR, and I had the ElePHPant a while prior
<bigcalm_lappy486> Aha, so late 2007?
<mgdm> I suspect so
<bigcalm_lappy486> I think this one and the next makes me smile the most http://www.flickr.com/photos/bigcuthy/2331031908/in/set-72157604110762041/
<mgdm> hehe h
<popey> ebening all
<bigcalm_lappy486> Evening popey lad
<Myrtti> I wonder do I still have the code of my homebrewed CMS somewhere
<mgdm> bigcalm_lappy486: http://t.co/lYbqPCH
<bigcalm_lappy486> Sounds like a damn fine framework to me :)
<mgdm> bigcalm_lappy486: (not my elephpant, but my dram :P)
<mgdm> Hi popey
<bigcalm_lappy486> Just found how to bake in CakePHP 1.3. They had moved things about more than I had expected
<bigcalm_lappy486> I can actually recommend CakePHP. It's the most dev friendly framework I've been using so far
<bigcalm_lappy486> -sp
#ubuntu-uk 2011-09-18
<czajkowski> morning
<MartijnVdS> \o
 * MartijnVdS prepares for a 10 mile run today (http://damloop.nl/)
<czajkowski> watching england play for rwc
<AlanBell> morning all
<czajkowski> morning
<AlanBell> watching them play with odd shaped balls again?
<czajkowski> yes
<czajkowski> and you're winning in case you wondered
<czajkowski> I'm sure the lord is very happy this morning
<geekMePlease> I am upgrading to 11.10 beta. It has been about 30min in "cups: stopping...starting..." and not going forward
<geekMePlease> * I have another TTY open with google-chrome there.
<geekMePlease> * it should not take that much, since it is only a printing server
<geekMePlease> * I do not know what comes after cups. Can I stop the installation process there, seems to be rather at the end.
<AlanBell> geekMePlease: I would leave it a few hours rather than interrupt it
<AlanBell> or nuke it and reinstall
<czajkowski> and at this time of the morning help can be a bit slow
<czajkowski> be patien
<czajkowski> *patient
<geekMePlease> AlanBell: I will do it.
<geekMePlease> How can you monitor what the Ubuntu 11.10 installation -process does?
<geekMePlease> * need to monitor it from different tty, since cannot stop the current process
<nperry> try tailing the log; tail /var/log/apt/term.log
<geekMePlease> nperry: The log is ended 17/9/2011 18:30:01 so it has not make log entries for long time.
<nperry> you are using apt-get right?
<scoundrel50a> hi, I got a lenovo G550-6 laptop with Ubuntu 11.04 and 11.10 partitioned.....I am in the 11.10 partition trying to set it up how I like it as it installing a few things that I want like Google Chrome, but I am having a problem installing it.....I have the right .deb package, but I keep getting this error once Ubuntu Software opens to begin the installation, the there is an internal error, the file "/home/me/Downloads/google-chrome-stable_c
<scoundrel50a> urrent.deb" could not be opened....anybody know why that is happening?
<popey> scoundrel50a: did you close your browser?
<popey> oh, hang on, ignore that
<scoundrel50a> yes once the .deb package was downloaded
<scoundrel50a> baring in mind this is 11.10
<scoundrel50a> It had no problems installing into 11.04
<popey> i installed it on 11.10 last night
<popey> but I didnt use software centre
<scoundrel50a> well, I went to the GC page to download, then once it downloadedthe installer, when you click on the it oopenes the software centre to install it
<scoundrel50a> so how did you do it without it opening the software centre
<popey> open a terminal
<scoundrel50a> ah
<scoundrel50a> ok, what command
<popey> cd ~/Downloads
<popey> sudo dpkg -i google-chrome-stable_current.deb
<popey> sudo apt-get -f install
<popey> job done.
<scoundrel50a> ah, ok, will give that a go, thank you
<nperry> I like the alt+tab in unity!
<scoundrel50a> ok, iot says I have a dependancy problem, and it wont install
<nperry> Run the sudo apt-get -f install
<popey> scoundrel50a: run the second command I gave you
<scoundrel50a> ah
<scoundrel50a> its running now
<scoundrel50a> yay, it worked, would you suggest installing all .deb packages via the terminal like that
<popey> no
<popey> it's just the way I did it, and I know it worked
<scoundrel50a> ok, thank you brilliant
<nperry> popey: re your last tweet last night. Have you tried for example steam under wine using nouveau. Last time I tried it was awful!
<popey> no âº
<popey> i am on nouveau atm
<popey> nvidia just wont work
<geekMePlease> nperry: I am using sudo do-realease-upgrade -d, so probably apt-get if the given app uses it
<AlanBell> geekMePlease: you might be at the reboot and hope stage now
<popey> i wouldnt reboot
<popey> I'd kill it and do sudo dpkg --configure -a
<brobostigon> good morning everyone.
<geekMePlease> popey: I get the following error in running sudo dpkg --configure -a: dpkg: error: dpkg status database is locked by another process
<geekMePlease> ok, I need to remove only a lock -file
<geekMePlease> popey: I get erros in configuring: mountal, inittramfs-tools and ucf, for instance
<geekMePlease> popey: Dependency problems
<geekMePlease> * initscripts, plymouth, sysv-rc, libcairo2, upstart, libpaper1, libgail-common, libgs9, ghostscript-x, libfontconfig1, ifupdown, libgail18, gtk2-engines-pixbuf, libpam0g, plymouth-label, initscripts and module-init-tools
<geekMePlease> popey: Up.
<geekMePlease> It left the given packages unconfiguresd. Should I do force configuration. May break the whole system.
<popey> geekMePlease: interesting
<popey> geekMePlease: does sudo apt-get -f install
<popey> does that work?
<pr0ph3t> hi all
<pr0ph3t> long time no speak
<popey> hello
<popey> hows your sunday?
<pr0ph3t> hey popey
<pr0ph3t> just chillin
<pr0ph3t> how's yours
<popey> wise
<popey> same :D
<pr0ph3t> actually fiddling with gnome-shell
<pr0ph3t> on 11.10
<popey> working out okay?
<pr0ph3t> it looks interesting
<pr0ph3t> quite fast
<bigcalm_lappy486> Is it possible to keep gnome 2 when moving to 11.10?
<gord> nope, unless you mean gnome-panel, then yeah you could set that up
<geekMePlease> popey: I have the same problem as in the bug #260319
<lubotu3> Launchpad bug 260319 in grub (Ubuntu) "libpam-runtime fails to install (debconf DbDriver error)" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/260319
<pr0ph3t> why would you want to keep gnome2 bigcalm_lappy486?
<geekMePlease> popey: or #34946
<pr0ph3t> to run it on that laptop? :P
<geekMePlease> popey: s/#34946/#349469/
<bigcalm_lappy486> pr0ph3t: because I don't want unity or gnome3
<geekMePlease> popey: Managed to fix the problem by running first sudo rm -rf /var/cache/debconf/*
<pr0ph3t> I wasn't impressed by unity, but I find gnome-shell kinda captivating for me
<pr0ph3t> has anyone else been using it?
<popey> bigcalm_lappy486: there is a fallback mode for gnome 3 in 11.10
<popey> which is like gnome 2 2-panel
<pr0ph3t> although I used to like the gnome panel on top and cairo dock at the bottom, all personalised
<bigcalm_lappy486> popey: ah, ok
<Laney> where did the option to turn off the login sound go?
<popey> remove ubuntu-sounds package? :D
<bigcalm_lappy486> Change it to be the sound of silence?
<popey> bug 349469
<lubotu3> Launchpad bug 349469 in debconf (Ubuntu) "debconf: DbDriver "config": /var/cache/debconf/config.dat is locked by another process: Resource temporarily unavailable" [Medium,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/349469
 * popey tickles Laney with bug 853098
<lubotu3> Launchpad bug 853098 in tomboy (Ubuntu) "Oneiric Tomboy sync auth doesn't complete" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/853098
<Laney> yeah people are looking at that
<popey> also
<popey> why do we have an Ubuntu One option for sync which doesnt work
<popey> it says 'already registered' but sync fails
<AlanBell> will the P cycle be more stable from the start?
<Laney> the U1 patches aren't my fault :(
<popey> â¹
 * Laney runs off crying like a girl
 * popey cuddles Laney 
 * popey wonders if P will be based on debian testing again
<Laney> but yeh, people are supposedly fixing those particular broken things
 * Laney hopes we always base on testing
<AlanBell> it would be nice to have the thing remotely testable before freezes start happening
<Laney> such is the life with a 6-month cycle :(
<Laney> maybe I'll land this libproxy and break things some more (H)
<theAnimal-ZA> hello all
<pr0ph3t> I dont understand this gnome shell
<pr0ph3t> what do you call the menu under the title bar, with File Edit etc?
<pr0ph3t> the one that in Unity is transferred to the top panel
<pr0ph3t> re all
<pr0ph3t> flash player keeps using the standard output instead of the hdmi output like the rest of the system does
<pr0ph3t> i'm talking about sound, any of you had the same problem with 11.10?
<penguin42> pa seems a little touchy on 11.10 for me
<geekMePlease> How can you make USB-stick with has booting Ubuntu in Terminal?
<geekMePlease> * I have X60, no CD drive and my current Ubuntu works only in Recovery mode
<MartijnVdS> it should be possible
<Lcawte> Need more release partys :P
 * MartijnVdS is a bit tired after that 10 mile run
<kvarley> My whole ubuntu partition is set to read-only, how can I find that? :( Chown doesn't work
<brobostigon> live-build.debian.net, what does that use, to build debian images?
<scoundrel50a> ok, I have a lenovoG550-6 laptop with Ubuntu 11.04 and 11.10 preinstalled on a partition. So far things are ok with the 11.04 partition, it seems stable enough, but 11.10 is not stable at all, with things forcibly stopping all the time. One of the big things is, I have no reboot option on the drop down menu, there is no option to reboot anywhere.....is that a 11.10 thing, or is it a bug?
<penguin42> scoundrel50a: If you choose the 'shutdown' option it gives you the choice to shutdown or restart
<penguin42> (IMHO not very obvious)
<scoundrel50a> nope no option to restart
<penguin42> scoundrel50a: So you have at the top right an on/off symbol with a gear, click the shutdown option and you get a dialog box? What does it say?
<scoundrel50a> it says lock screen, log out, suspend, hybernate and shut down
<scoundrel50a> and if I choose the log out and try to reboot that way, it still has no reboot option
<penguin42> scoundrel50a: No, choose the shutdown option
<scoundrel50a> yes, and it onoy gives option to shut down
<daubers> scoundrel50a: Far left of the dialog that brings up
<penguin42> scoundrel50a: Oh, for me if I choose the Shutdown option I get a dialog that says 'Are you sure you want to close all programs and shut down the computer?' and the buttons are restart, cancel, shutdown
<scoundrel50a> ok, will take a look one sec,
<scoundrel50a> ah
<scoundrel50a> I see
<scoundrel50a> dint see that
<scoundrel50a> bit roundabout
<scoundrel50a> thank you
<penguin42> no problem
<penguin42> scoundrel50a: Now, if you can find where my shutdown button went on KDE .....
<scoundrel50a> ah, I am just getting ued to this, if I try to install KDE I'll be completely lost, I have to say, i do like 11.10 better than 11.04
<daubers> penguin42: It's in the terminal under "sudo halt" :)
<penguin42> scoundrel50a: can you say why?
<penguin42> daubers: oh, not the big button on the front?
<daubers> penguin42: Or that
<scoundrel50a> it doesnt say why, it just says something has forcibley closed.....
<penguin42> actually, that might work - not tried it...
<scoundrel50a> brb, need to log off, and reboot into 11.04 a sec
 * popey tickles marxjohnson 
<marxjohnson> yo yo sup
<marxjohnson> or something
<popey> Indeed.
 * daubers takes a crash course in web design
<daubers> 1) Animated gifs are good
<daubers> 2) <marquee> is teh best tag eva
<daubers> 3) See 2)
 * marxjohnson explodes
<daubers> \o/
<daubers> That was a significant part of my GNVQ in ICT if I recall correctly
 * daubers goes to watch Doctor Who 
<marxjohnson> Ah, ICT. What a subject
<scoundrel50a> back...ok, in Ubuntu 11.04 you have the option in the bar at the side to open applications and files and folders, but in 11.10 those options are not there, is that just in mine or is that 11.10
<AlanBell> I think you want the files lens
<scoundrel50a> is that what they are called?
<scoundrel50a> a lense?
<scoundrel50a> if possible I would like them both back, makes things easier, and if so how do I get them back?
<scoundrel50a> also, is there only 4 desktops allowed or can you get more, and is there a instuction manual for 11.04 anywhere?
<scoundrel50a> does anybody have any ideas?
<Azelphur> scoundrel50a: I believe you can have up to 32*32 desktops
<Azelphur> but if your using desktop cube it gets knocked down to 32 :)
<Azelphur> scoundrel50a: you should install ccsm from the software centre, it has all the gui tweaky buttons you could ever want
<scoundrel50a> oh ok, will have a look
<scoundrel50a> how do you add the desktops though, I cant find anywhere to do it
<scoundrel50a> plus will that program give me my Applications and Files & Folders things back in the left panel in 11.10
<Azelphur> no, that's a unity thing but I don't use unity so don't really know about it
<scoundrel50a> is there a manual for Natty and 11.10?
<Azelphur> I doubt there's much of anything for 11.10, it hasn't even hit alpha yet
<Azelphur> !ubuntu+1 | scoundrel50a
<lubotu3> scoundrel50a: Oneiric Ocelot is the codename for Ubuntu 11.10 - Support only in #ubuntu+1
<scoundrel50a> oh, I thought it was in beta?
<Azelphur> maybe I'm a bit behind :p
<Azelphur> ah, Beta 1 today
<popey> uh, no
<popey> beta 1 was over 2 weeks ago
<popey> scoundrel50a: as Azelphur says, compizconfig-settings-manager is quite good for tweaking GUI options
<Azelphur> and that was me reading the release schedule table wrong :D
<popey> hehe
<Azelphur> week 18, not 18th september \o/
<popey> i went for the date stamps on the files in releases.ubuntu.com :D
<popey> planned vs actual
<Azelphur> :)
<scoundrel50a> um, just installed it, but cant find it, where do I find ccsm
<Azelphur> scoundrel50a: you can just hit the button in the top left and type ccsm
<popey> I hit the windows button and then type "com", it shows up in the list
<scoundrel50a> ah, clever
<scoundrel50a> thank you
 * Azelphur has a fun UI which involves no window decorations, mouse gestures, cairo-dock and gnome-do
<scoundrel50a> how do I add desktops?
<Azelphur> scoundrel50a: in ccsm, in the general tab, check out the desktop size tab
<Azelphur> scoundrel50a: are you using desktop cube or wall?
<scoundrel50a> wall
<Azelphur> scoundrel50a: so yea, increase horizontal/vertical accordingly :)
<popey> i see no such option
<scoundrel50a> Desktop size, yeh?
<Azelphur> ccsm > general options > desktop size > horizontal/vertical size
<Azelphur> :D
<popey> oh,
<scoundrel50a> brilliant
<scoundrel50a> thank you
<popey> sorry, looking in the wrong place
<scoundrel50a> how do you take a picture of your desktop, I got the vid option, but cant work out just the picture
<penguin42> hit print-screen
<scoundrel50a> ah, just found the button, I thought there was a button to add for print screen
<scoundrel50a> that was on 10.10
<scoundrel50a> just added some more desktops, that looks odd now, like a fly with loads of eyes
<HazRPG> I don't get why this isn't working :( http://pastebin.com/RmiRFGja (its a chrome extension I'm trying to do)
<gord> two factor gmail stuff is weird... sometimes i have to do it, sometimes i don't
<daubers> http://www.theregister.co.uk/2011/09/16/uk_school_it_curriculum_trials_teaching_students_to_code/ <- Finally
<mgdm> \o/
<daubers> I did 6th form at Park House
<Myrtti> I'd be happy if the kids here would get even rudimentary skills in spreadsheets
<daubers> Anyone have a spider oak code? If I'm signing up might as well give someone some more space
<mgdm> Never heard of it, myself
<daubers> 's like dropbox or U1
 * daubers clicks the button
<Myrtti> I have one
<Myrtti> doh
<daubers> heh :) Never mind
<Myrtti> :-<
<Myrtti> oh well
<Azelphur> http://thedailywtf.com/Articles/Open-Sesame.aspx :D
<john__> JDmaX
#ubuntu-uk 2012-09-10
<hamitron> well
<hamitron> it is gonna be win95c, win98se or winME
<hamitron> not decided
<hamitron> but it has to be for old games
<hamitron> :)
<hamitron> maybe a mix of them
<hamitron> gonna use 2 x voodoo2 as well
<lucid> Filthy
<lucid> Will it powered by Hamster or Intel?
<hamitron> AMD K6-2 500MHz
<lucid> Filthy
<hamitron> 384MB PC100 memory
<hamitron> ;/
<lucid> You know you love it
<hamitron> ofc
<hamitron> first PC I built
<hamitron> :)
<lucid> You have a fetish problem my friend :D
<hamitron> hey
<hamitron> all I want is 1 PC and 1 OS to do everything I want
<hamitron> it just doesn't seem possible :/
<lucid> Only god know's your trouble's......
<hamitron> anyways
<hamitron> better get sleep
<hamitron> o/
<lucid> Indeedy mate cheers for the laugh :D
<lucid> Gonna continue my detox struggle :)
<lucid> The only way to stay off roll up's is....... Nicotine patch & Coffee while I catalogue my entire book collection. :/
<lucid> Thank you silent party. Good Night. :)
<ali1234> i bought uplink on humb bundle 3 for android
<ali1234> this game has an option to change the screen resolution
<ali1234> but it *only* changes the screen resolution, not the size of the UI
<ali1234> so half the game is off the screen
<ali1234> this is a joke
<Azelphur> lol
<Azelphur> ali1234: is that bundle still up?
<ali1234> no
<Azelphur> aw :p
<ali1234> $9.99 on software centre
<Azelphur> daylight robbery
<ali1234> for a completely unplayable game
<ali1234> their tech support forums only have other users
<ali1234> and they recommend hacking xorg.conf to fix it
<ali1234> time to make yet another software wrapper to feed the corect values to badly written proprietary software
<ali1234> the worst part of it is that the UI has this cool sliding effect so you can see the UI for a second as it slides off the right side of the screen
<Azelphur> \o/
<ali1234> running it in xephyr seems to work
<christel> GOOD MORNING
<MartijnVdS> \o
<AlanBell> morning all
<christel> morning alarmbell
<daubers> o/
<czajkowski> aloha
<mattt> ohaaieee
<hoover> morning folks
<czajkowski> morning folks
<spadders> Hi guys, I ran memtest overnight as requested, here's a pic of the results http://imagebin.org/227869
<MartijnVdS> that looks.. scary
<MartijnVdS> or at least corrupted
<SuperMatt> spadders: I'd get yourself some more memory!
<spadders> I have found out since picking it up, that it had a second memory stick added
<spadders> I think it was 1gb ram originally
<spadders> it is only needed for homework, a bit of browsing and social networking
<spadders> when you say more memory, do you mean instead of, or additional to
<mungojerry> upload speed 160Mbit/s not bad :D
<spadders> supermatt : when you say more memory, do you mean instead of, or additional to
<JamesTait> Happy Monday, people! :-D
<spadders> So, should I try running this test with each memory stick seperately?
<SuperMatt> spadders: well, with all that red, I would say instead of
<spadders> supermatt: I've never even seen memtest before, so relying on your expertise and advice.  Would it be worth running the test again with each memory module individually?
<AlanBell> spadders: worth a try certainly
<MartijnVdS> also try re-seating the memory -- sometimes it "comes loose" and contacts are bad
<MartijnVdS> I've had PCs with "bad memory" which fixed itself after just pushing it back in a bit
<hoover> Same here... repositioning the memory sticks usually helps
<mungojerry> cool story http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2200559/Adam-Cudworth-Student-takes-stunning-snaps-space-using-30-second-hand-camera-balloon.html?ito=feeds-newsxml
<hoover> brb
<mungojerry> i see a few more of these projects due to raspberry pi. doesn't say he used rpi but others have
<directhex> mmm pies
<mungojerry> bit early for pies
<mungojerry> popey, you should get that fella on the UUPC ..he uses ubuntu :P
<mattt> never too early for a pie
<MartijnVdS> Ï !
<mungojerry> i'm fasting this morning, no food till lunch
<pinky-> did you watch this weeks eposode of Horizon about fasting and living longer?
<pinky-> reducing the risks of cancer too
<pinky-> episode*
<spadders> looks like ram is FUBAR
<mungojerry> pinky-, i'm underweight so i have to be careful
<mungojerry> i'd probably faint if i fasted for longer
<mungojerry> since it adds up to around 16hrs including sleep
<mungojerry> but i didn't see the programme
<pinky-> ok
<pinky-> if you ever get 1 hour spare time its worth a watch:) http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b01lxyzc/sign/Horizon_20122013_Eat_Fast_and_Live_Longer/
<brobostigon> good morning everyone.
<pinky-> good morning to you too
<brobostigon> good morning pinky-
<pinky-> basically the docu says that eating protien all time puts certain chemicles in your body to 'go go go' mode and as the body builds fast if any errors are made in the dna cancers are liable to happens.. but if you fast the chems go from 'go go go' mode to 'repair' mode and you are liable to live 30 years longer if you fast regular
<pinky-> the guy in the docu ended up on a 5 on 2 off days eating regime
<pinky-> ^^ added that incase you never watch at some time
<pinky-> anyway.. very interesting
<JohnRobert> hmm
<JohnRobert> well anyone who stays fit and eats healthily stands a much better chance of living longer than someone who doesn't
<pinky-> they say fasting reducing to risk of cancer by a miilion to one
<pinky-> if you fast you will never develope cancers
<pinky-> ..well that's what they stated in the above docu ^^
<czajkowski> JohnRobert: I think it varies, mates mum is very healthy and has just been told she has stage 3 lung cancer, so I'm sure just being fit and eating healthy doesnt just cut it
<pinky-> they also say fasting reduces your risk to stroke to 0
<BigRedS> fit and healthy's also a good deal less fun than chocolate and beer
<mattt> pinky-: interesting link
<pinky-> ty
<pinky-> yeah when I watched it made me raise an eyebrow and I've played it since for a friend
<pinky-> made me pay attention too:)
<BigRedS> spadders: aha! Annoying as it is, that's one of the cheaper things that was likely to be causing the problem
<pinky-> all about reducing 'igf1' in the body
<spadders> bigred: At least I know what it is now, and can order some new ram.  Will let you know how I get on
<BigRedS> spadders: it might be worth taking out one stick at a time and retesting - it may well be only one bad stick
<BigRedS> (if you've multiple sticks)
<BigRedS> buit
<BigRedS> but only really if you've the time/power to spend on running memtest a couple more times, or patience to start using it and maybe have it panic again
<spadders> Bigred: it has 1x 2gb memory, which may be the problem anyway
<popey> what make/model of laptop is it?
<spadders> Bigred: I think it can only take max 1gb per channel
<BigRedS> Ah, fair enough, no chance of splitting it then. 2GB RAM is plenty, and memory exhaustion doesn't case panics
<BigRedS> you'd get the out-of-memory killer (or oom-killer to its friends) killing apparently arbitrary tasks off instead
<BigRedS> ah! Yeah 1GB is perhaps a little short
<spadders> It's an Acer Aspire 5315 series, model no icl50
<popey> looks like it only has one slot
<popey> http://www.crucial.com/uk/store/listparts.aspx?model=Aspire%205310&Cat=RAM
<spadders> there are 2 slots
<popey> oh, 2
<popey> "Each memory slot can hold DDR2 PC2-5300 with a maximum of 1GB per slot.* "
<spadders> ah, I see
<spadders> would I be better trying 2 x 1gb, or 1 x 2gb?
<bittin^work> yo
<pinky-> spadders : your pc is single channel ram so I would say a 1 x 2gb might have slightly faster latency
<popey> spadders, 2x1G
<pinky-> oh
<pinky-> ok ignore me
<spadders> lol, ok
<pinky-> :)
<davmor2> Morning all
<bittin^work> Morning
<davmor2> Mez: once again thanks for organising the jam :)
<davmor2> popey: I managed to captcha a video of the square on the rhythmbox play button bug
<davmor2> popey: it looks to me like there is a specific point that triggers it
<davmor2> popey: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/indicator-sound/+bug/1047473
<lubotu3> Ubuntu bug 1047473 in indicator-sound (Ubuntu) "Rhythmbox play button has an odd square around it." [Undecided,Confirmed]
<popey> i can't reproduce it davmor2
<popey> can you reproduce in a guest session?
<davmor2> popey: I'll have a look in a bit for you
<czajkowski> popey: any logical reason for
<czajkowski> 1901 czajkows  20   0  121m 3356 2800 R  84.6  0.1   0:54.88 at-spi2-registr    1944 czajkows  20   0  426m  14m 9.8m S  75.2  0.2   0:48.67 polkit-gnome-au
<popey> que?
<czajkowski> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/1196393/
<czajkowski> easier to read
<popey> can you paste the whole thing?
<czajkowski> http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/1196395/
<popey> bug 729827 perhaps?
<lubotu3> Launchpad bug 729827 in unity (Ubuntu Natty) "at-spi-registry consumes most of the CPU and make the system unusable on Natty" [High,Fix released] https://launchpad.net/bugs/729827
<popey> could be a regession
<czajkowski> ah
<czajkowski> had never seen the at-spi before
<czajkowski> machine has been unuable for the last few mins
<davmor2> czajkowski: I blame AlanBell, just cause he looks at a11y :D
<czajkowski> i cant change any of the bug status to new again
<AlanBell> I blame all those other processes that are high
<czajkowski> should I just leave a comment
<davmor2> czajkowski: at-spi is the a11y layer
<AlanBell> I don't think it is that bug
<czajkowski> AlanBell: I call me not being able to use my machine and a cpu usuage that high a bug :)
<popey> czajkowski, file a new bug
<AlanBell> yeah, it is a bug, just not that one
<davmor2> czajkowski: it will need a new bug that one was for natty so although it might be similar I doubt it is identical
<AlanBell> everything is high on that page, at-spi2 happens to be highest, but I don't think it is the cause of the stress
<czajkowski> hmm cant file it against reigistry
<czajkowski> at-spi2-core at-spi2-core-dbg
<AlanBell> at-spi2-core if you want to
<AlanBell> the problem is compiz/xorg/unity or something like that
<AlanBell> or thunderbird
<MartijnVdS> Oooh
<MartijnVdS> WANT
<MartijnVdS> http://intr.overt.org/blog/?p=153
<MartijnVdS> a new gvfsd-mtp implementation that's sane
<MartijnVdS> (i.e. it doesn't try to enumerate all files on the device at mount-time, causing timeouts on android)
<JohnRobert> heh
<JohnRobert> that's the most annoying thing about my phone
<JohnRobert> 'scanning filesystem'
<JohnRobert> phone grinds to a halt
<JohnRobert> what's annoying is that it does that even if it's plugged into a charger
<MartijnVdS> JohnRobert: the new Android phones are all MTP-based.. and I can't get it to work properly on Linux because of the timeouts :(
<JohnRobert> hmm
<mungojerry> never seen that problem
<mungojerry> i guess i don't plug my tablet in enough
<popey> me neither
<mattt> pinky-: watched that, quite interesting
<pinky-> cool
<davmor2> popey: but your's is all covered by libpod surely?  Is that the i-stuff library?
<pinky-> longer answer => yeah I also thought so so mentioned.. somebody mentioned fasting and it triggered the response
<mungojerry> is a 16hr fast sufficient or need longer?
<mungojerry> to reap benefits?
<pinky-> they said in the docu it's not healthy for somebody who is alreay under weight
<pinky-> already*
<mungojerry> :(
<popey> davmor2, true, i rarely plug the phone in though, i use U1 to sync my photos
<mungojerry> i agree but i'm doing it for spiritual reasons, so any health effects are just a bonus
<davmor2> popey: ditto
<davmor2> it's just easier :D
<czajkowski> I cant  connect phone to laptop any more since I upgraded to jellybean which is kinda irksome
<Laney> wow, brains are weird
<Laney> I was typing one command and thinking of another
<davmor2> czajkowski: yes you can you just need to set the portal mode
<Laney> and they ended up interspersed perfectly
<czajkowski> davmor2: that what now?
<czajkowski> I used droid air to get some stuff off it, but I want to put stuff on it which was where I used to connect
<gord> they use some silly new format don't they?
<mungojerry> does unity work as quick as this for you guys? https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=KMXK_ZzT9-8
<mungojerry> wondering if something about elementary is very fast, or he has a super duper PC
<popey> oh look, elementary took our design for unity spread
<czajkowski> hah
<bittin^work> iam a unity hater so i dunno
<czajkowski> mungojerry: mine is pretty fast
<popey> its as fast as that on my intel machine
<mungojerry> i tried a nightly build of elementary the other day, it seems v nice desktop (esp. the launcher etc) , but the apps are not ready yet
<popey> http://www.flickr.com/photos/40645538@N00/6697633711
<popey> todays randomly chosen desktop
<MartijnVdS> cool :)
<MartijnVdS> How does it choose?
<bittin^work> popey, =)
<bittin^work> i got some Windows 8 standard wallpaper to tired to change
<popey> no idea :)
<popey> i am using a tool called "variety" which is in the software centre
<MartijnVdS> popey: what are you using to change it, then? :)
<popey> I'm just using default settings
<MartijnVdS> $ LC_ALL=C apt-cache show variety
<MartijnVdS> N: Unable to locate package variety
<MartijnVdS> great
<MartijnVdS> Can't start software-center, "the bug has already been reported" but I get a "Page not found" error when it opens the bug in a browser
<MartijnVdS> go go launchpad
<bittin^work> :p
<mungojerry> MartijnVdS, private bug?
<MartijnVdS> mungojerry: probably, but it's not telling me that
<MartijnVdS> it says "Page not found"
<MartijnVdS> which I interpret as 404, not 403 "Forbidden"
<mungojerry> popey, does variety give the correct attributes to the photo?
<popey> attributes?
<czajkowski> BigRedS: I got the webapps I think working following http://ubuntulife.net/how-to-install-ubuntu-webapps-in-ubuntu-12-04/
<czajkowski> semeingly by default they will be in 12.10
<popey> MartijnVdS, apt-cache show != USC
<MartijnVdS> popey: but USC won't start
<mungojerry> popey, i mean the photo credit of the author
<MartijnVdS> popey: because of that "private" bug I can't see
<popey> not on the screen, no, but you can press a button to click through
<popey> i.e. it retains the source link it came from
<mungojerry> ah ok
<mungojerry> are the links always flickr ones?
<popey> no
<popey> there's lots of options for where to get images from
<popey> czajkowski, i wouldn't use that ppa
<czajkowski> no
<czajkowski> why ?
<popey> because webapps are in the repo now
<czajkowski> ah
<BigRedS> czajkowski: ah, cool. I've just got a new drive for my laptop, so I'll probably install 12.10 on that this eve
<davmor2> MartijnVdS: sudo /usr/share/software-center/update-software-center
<popey> BigRedS, ssd or rust?
<BigRedS> rust
<MartijnVdS> davmor2: does that fix the unicodedecodeerror?
<BigRedS> I pondered bying an SSD, but work just gave me a rusty one and free beats pay-for
<BigRedS> also, it's 250GB which I wasn't going to get out of SSD
<MartijnVdS> UnicodeDecodeError: 'ascii' codec can't decode byte 0xe2 in position 0: ordinal not in range(128)
<MartijnVdS> davmor2: it does not fix it.
<czajkowski> hmmm
<czajkowski> maybe not
<czajkowski> feck
<popey> /dev/sda1            213G  178G   25G  89% /
<popey> ^^ SSD :)
<popey> 240GB SSDs have come down in price
<MartijnVdS> davmor2: LC_ALL=C software-center works
<czajkowski> something happening
<MartijnVdS> \o/ huge SSDs
<czajkowski> but not sure it worked
<BigRedS> I'm hoping that a not-broken rusty drive will cause a noticeable upgrade here
<MartijnVdS> popey: What are you using on that? btrfs? ext4?
<BigRedS> and then next time I want an upgrade I can go SSD :)
<popey> ext4
<popey> MartijnVdS, whats the error you get, we can try and find the private bug
<BigRedS> oh, also, I'd go up to ext4 on this
<MartijnVdS> popey: https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/1047295
<lubotu3> Error: ubuntu bug 1047295 not found
<davmor2> MartijnVdS: can you run usc from the terminal and paste the ouput some where mvo will be interested in this I think
<popey> tempted to go btrfs on my next install
<MartijnVdS> davmor2: I've found a public bug: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/software-center/+bug/1047281
<lubotu3> Ubuntu bug 1047281 in software-center (Ubuntu) "Ubuntu Software Center 5.3.11 won't start" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<MartijnVdS> davmor2: that's the error I get
<popey> hmm, i see nothing private on that bug
<MartijnVdS> popey: but lubotu3 and I can't see it.. you must be special :)
<popey> try now?
<xnox> popey: btrfs.... I am pondering about doing that as well. I am currently on crypt+lvm
<MartijnVdS> popey:  worky!
<popey> \o/
 * MartijnVdS has btrfs on SSD
<xnox> popey: next step for me is degraded (hotplugging usb) raid + crypt + lvm
 * xnox ponders about migrating to UEFI boot, cause my laptop supports it.
<MartijnVdS> popey: the software center log (which packages were installed) might be private about that bug
<ixxvil> hi
<BigRedS> xnox: new things are bad. Come to Debian. :)
<MartijnVdS> BigRedS: install Lucid then ;)
<ixxvil> how do you give permissions to a user to use a dir but not the other  subdirs within it?
<MartijnVdS> ixxvil: read or write?
<MartijnVdS> ixxvil: if you give someone write permission to a dir, they can change permission on things in it
<ixxvil> well he should be able to write whatever he wants to the dir
<xnox> BigRedS: which things are new? UEFI? /me was using it since 2006 on most laptops, but this current one.
<ixxvil> just to the other subdirs
<ixxvil> just not to the other subdirs
<xnox> BigRedS: and I am a DD ;-) so I am in Debian =)
<MartijnVdS> ixxvil: man chmod explains everything about UNIX permissions and what can/can't be done
<ixxvil> well ive been there
<ixxvil> was just looking for the command to get it right
<MartijnVdS> ixxvil: you could make the dir owned by root, group <some group the user is part of>, mark the directory +t (sticky, like /tmp)
<MartijnVdS> ixxvil: then make the "unchangeable" dirs owned by root:root
<MartijnVdS> that should do the trick
<davmor2> MartijnVdS: thanks I've made the team aware of it
<ixxvil> whats root:root?
<MartijnVdS> ixxvil: user root, group root
<MartijnVdS> ixxvil: "not the user you're restricting" basically :)
<ixxvil> ok :d but whats te command to do this
<ixxvil> :D
<ixxvil> well basically
<ixxvil> i want my web dev tohave acces too the /var/www
<ixxvil> just to www
<ixxvil> but www/ has a bunch of other dirs in it that i dont want him to have any access to
<BigRedS> ixxvil: generally, the easier way to do this is to have a unix user for each site, and have the web dev use that unix user
<czajkowski> popey: is this norm - http://ubuntuone.com/0QOGH6Ellpy9ZjqzaTgLzR
<ixxvil> well i created an acct for him
<BigRedS> then this is all done automatically, and you get proper segregation of files and of scp/ssh access and suchlike.
<BigRedS> yeah, but put the site in ~/public_html, not in /var/www
<ixxvil> and his home dir stuff goes in /sftp/user
<BigRedS> and then he can have logs in ~/logs/
<BigRedS> and all that; having several per-user subdirectories is just setting yourself up for ridiculous fs permissions for no real benefit
<popey> czajkowski, thats the webapps notification thing
<ixxvil> well theres only 1 guy who has to use this
<BigRedS> (like /sftp/user /var/www/user /var/logs/user etc.)
<ixxvil> so i have no qualms setting it up
<popey> czajkowski, but I don't understand your question
<ixxvil> well any user created is automaticcallysent to sftp/
<czajkowski> popey: sorry got distracted by other window
<czajkowski> popey: so I go to the envelope thiny and don't see any notifications for any of the sites Ive clicked it to be used on aka fb and twitter
<czajkowski> so wondering if I am missing something
<popey> are you currently logged into those sites in chromium?
<popey> i.e. have a browser window open for fb/twitter
<ixxvil> BigRedS: i just wanna give him permissions to only www and not the rest in it
<ixxvil> not sure how i create public_htmla nd stuff
<czajkowski> popey: yes
<czajkowski> Ive only just logged in mind
<czajkowski> as I restarted the browser
<popey> you only see notifications once you have the integrated (icons in the launcher) and logged in
<czajkowski> oh
<ixxvil> ln -s ~yourid/public ~yourid/public_html
<ixxvil> that the way to create a public_html?
<popey> so basically, 1) install the webapps stuff, 2) launch chromium, 3) visit facebook etc and login, 4) click the integration option, 5) that's it. leave browser windows open for each app
<czajkowski> ah could be the intergratioj bit I'm missing
<mungojerry> popey, re: variety, i see lots of sources (flickr, facebook?, wallbase, wallpapersnet) http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~peterlevi/variety/trunk/files/head:/variety/
<czajkowski> ohhhhhhhhhhhhh I HAVE IT NOW!
<czajkowski> cheer popey
<Laney> hip hip
<mungojerry> \o/
<BigRedS> does it need to be chromium to make them work?
<czajkowski> Laney: now you just need your spinny spin chair!
<Laney> I have one at home too :-)
<czajkowski> https://twitter.com/czajkowski/status/245131316545335298/photo/1
<czajkowski> see along side the icons
<popey> BigRedS, until we get the firefox package done, yes
<czajkowski> I thought for some unknown reason it would appear under the envelope
<czajkowski> as not sure why I still have to have a browser open wit the page.
<BigRedS> popey: ah, cool
<davmor2> Laney: it's not done right if you don't sing the spinny song while you do it.....http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZUatnbaNfEo :D
<popey> oh man, this dynamic wallpaper thing makes me hungry!
<popey> http://wallpapers.net/fresh_salad-wallpapers.html
<mungojerry> how do graze make those rubberized bananas?
<popey> dried, low oven temp I imagine
<davmor2> mungojerry: grow banana and rubber trees close together :D
<mungojerry> they aren't the crunchy ones
<popey> oh, which ones?
<popey> link on graze.com?
<mungojerry> beach bum http://d3ckgugpyj5kdi.cloudfront.net/1090/16.jpg
<mungojerry> the best one i've tasted from graze was cherry bakewell. they had cherry infused raisins
<popey> http://www.tammysrecipes.com/node/1122
<popey> looks like they used a dehydrator
<mungojerry> rather nice as i can't eat normal banana without gagging
<popey> why?
<popey> guess it must be the texture, not the taste :)
<mungojerry> yes
<mungojerry> i love nearly all fruit, and i love banana flavour, but to eat it raw, i can only eat it with carnation evaporated milk over it, and sugar.
<mungojerry> otherwise i gag on raw banana when it sticks in my throat
<mungojerry> actually before then, it's when it's in my mouth and i'm chewing it
<bigcalm> Good afternoon peeps :)
<MartijnVdS> \o bigcalm
<popey> how odd
<MartijnVdS> mungojerry: chew first! Don't stick it in your throat all at once :)
<bigcalm> I feel I'm missing out on the best conversations
<mungojerry> my son didn't inherit my weirdness since he eats a banana every single day at brekky
<mungojerry> he's probably radioactive by now
<gord> i also love banana taste but can't eat it
<gord> its disgusting
<MartijnVdS> mungojerry: http://www.flickr.com/photos/treenaks/5869671221/
<bigcalm> Haha
<bigcalm> I remember when all mini figs were happy people
<christel> :o
<MartijnVdS> bigcalm: I even got a letter from Lego Netherlands once stating that that was policy :)
<mungojerry> yay gord \o/
<MartijnVdS> bigcalm: but that was in the mid-80s
<MartijnVdS> christel: hm? :)
 * bigcalm tickles christel
<mungojerry> have you tried with evap milk and sugar on top of slices?
<MartijnVdS> christel: http://www.flickr.com/photos/treenaks/5894757684/
<davmor2> mungojerry: do you live on acacia row?  does he wear a lot of yellow......etc
<bigcalm> MartijnVdS: it's a shame that some things change
<MartijnVdS> bigcalm: Everything to rake in more monies
<bigcalm> Yus
<czajkowski> figroll biscusits 4 in bowl add in some custard, bung in microwave for 1 mins, = yummy desert
<bigcalm> Well, business have to adapt with the times
<bigcalm> czajkowski: break up the fig rolls 1st?
<gord> figroll biscuits, 4 in a bowl., eat them all instantly. yummy
<czajkowski> bigcalm: NO!
<gord> then put more figroll biscuits in
<bigcalm> Hehe
<czajkowski> you can kinda break them up with the custard nice and wam
<czajkowski> *warm
<czajkowski> and mushy
<czajkowski> yummy
<czajkowski> used to get it at Irish college
<popey> mmmm figs
<popey>  \o/
<popey>  (.).oO( PARP!)
<popey>  | |
<czajkowski> and custard
<MartijnVdS> popey: http://clonekeenplus.sourceforge.net/img/keen4play1.jpg
<bigcalm> o.O
<davmor2> popey: you love beans, you can't blag me that it was the figs that made you do that :D
<christel> MartijnVdS: aww
<gord> not figs :P fig biscuits!
<MartijnVdS> christel: poor minifig?
 * davmor2 prods czajkowski cause I haven't today
<popey> ooooh! MartijnVdS
<MartijnVdS> popey: That's the sound I picture every time I read "PARP" :)
<davmor2> MartijnVdS: I see the lego man lost at sea but I hear http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nb8t3Lt8iJw
<MartijnVdS> davmor2: haha :)
 * davmor2 move bigcalm's tickle stick from christel to czajkowski and waits for the scream and consequent beating 
<ali1234> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rgClLSPmzP4
<czajkowski> >:(
<popey> can someone on 12.10 confirm bug 1048640
<lubotu3> Launchpad bug 1048640 in Unity "Keyboard shortcut appears over the dash" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1048640
<davmor2> that or the scary face
<bigcalm> And back to work - toodles
<davmor2> wow bigcalm has lost boys working for him
 * popey tickles czajkowski 
 * czajkowski peers at popey this is not a good thing to do 
<popey> look up at that bug
<MartijnVdS> peer 2 peers?
<popey> easy to confirm :)
<czajkowski> oh right
<czajkowski> done
<popey> ta
<czajkowski> why they all can't be that simple
<czajkowski> popey: any idea who to poke re https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/indicator-power/+bug/1048041
<lubotu3> Ubuntu bug 1048041 in indicator-power (Ubuntu) "Power icon doesn't show it is charging when it's plugged in" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<czajkowski> anyone want to earn some LP karma
<czajkowski> help some users
<czajkowski> https://answers.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+question/208155
<AlanBell> interesting that the shortcuts overlay appears on the monitor that the mouse is on, but the dash always involves a trek over to the left of the leftmost monitor
<czajkowski> https://answers.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+question/208075
<davmor2> czajkowski: it shows a lightning bolt when it is charging a full battery when it is charged and shows it discharging, you can click it and find out how long to charg or just remove the lead to get an idea
<davmor2> czajkowski: what more do you need :D
<MartijnVdS> you can change preferences to add a timer
<MartijnVdS> countdown to charged when plugged in, countdown to discharged when unplugged
<czajkowski> it's always showing a lignint bolt when plugged in
<czajkowski> *shown
<AlanBell> is it 100% charged czajkowski?
<popey> AlanBell, i dont get that
<popey> maybe the battery is reporting incorrect status
<AlanBell> popey: which? the shortcut overlay following the mouse?
<popey> or it's knackered
<popey> the dash on wrong screen
<popey> oh, you have launcher on only one screen?
<czajkowski> it's charged
<popey> how do you know its charged?
<popey> my laptop has been plugged in all night and shows lightning now
<popey> so i see same issue
<AlanBell> I have a launcher on both screens (it does that whether I tell it to or not)
<czajkowski> popey: aye that's what it used to be like, but as it's saying charged it doesnt show the lighting bold
<czajkowski> unplug it
<davmor2> popey: did you play about with the usb headphones by the way?
<czajkowski> and says discharging
<davmor2> czajkowski: Mez did a fresh install and marked that as a bug because on a fully charged machine it didn't show the fact that it was plugged in any more at all which made him wonder if the charger was broken
<AlanBell> czajkowski: if you leave it unplugged for 10 minutes or so then plug it in it should say it is charging
<meet> how do i change the position of the notifications of chat un 12.04?
<davmor2> popey: why do I get a load of browser windows popup with Authentication completed, please close this window.  I'm assuming a partial but not yet complete intgrated web experience is to blame or empathy is triggering something incorrectly
<popey> davmor2, not yet
<davmor2> popey: empathy is doing something wrong then
<meet> how do i change the position of desktop notifications  in 12.04?
<AlanBell> meet: short of recompiling notify-osd with different hardcoded positions that is hard to do
<meet> alanbell: no easy workaround? because for 11.10 i had it at the bottom
<meet> AlanBell: btw what are those messages called?
<AlanBell> notifications
<AlanBell> oddly enough notifications do support a different position
<AlanBell> gsettings set  com.canonical.notify-osd gravity 2
<AlanBell> will set them to gravity_east which is halfway up the right of the screen (where halfway is defined by the total height of all screens together)
<AlanBell> gsettings set  com.canonical.notify-osd gravity 1 to put it back again
<AlanBell> gsettings set  com.canonical.notify-osd multihead-mode focus-follow <- this means they turn up on the monitor you are looking at \o/
<MartijnVdS> another big leak - http://pastebin.com/2qbRKh3R
<ali1234> hurrrrrrr
<ali1234> actually my credit card has a 5 digit pin
<ali1234> so nyah
<MartijnVdS> I can change mine to have up to 6 digits I think
<JohnRobert> gr8, more to rememeber
<MartijnVdS> remembering is easy :)
<xnox> MartijnVdS: stop using 000 000 as your pin!
<MartijnVdS> xnox: 42 42 42 actually
<xnox> US ATMs are confused by > 4 digit pins though
<MartijnVdS> it's the US, confusion is expected ;)
<popey> bah, wallpapers making me hungry again http://wallpapers.net/white_chocolate_cake-wallpapers.html
<MartijnVdS> popey: use this: http://www.flickr.com/photos/treenaks/6816260055/in/set-72157629167894627/lightbox/
<gord> i would like a white chocolate cake please :(
<czajkowski> gord: http://asset0.konditorandcook.com/system/assets/files/46/img_353/Curly%20whirly.jpg
<gord> please put curly whirlies in it
<czajkowski> gord: http://www.konditorandcook.com/products
<czajkowski> AlanBell: why aren't you at the ceremony today
<gord> i hate you, john brought a giant chocolate cake into the office which is more chocolate than cake and i'm trying not to inhale it :(
<czajkowski> gord: you in the blue fin this week
<gord> till thursday
<czajkowski> ohh shall be in :)
<czajkowski> gord: that cake shop is either side of the office, one 2 blocks down on the right nad the other up by borough market!
<gord> why are you doing this to me :(
<czajkowski> being helpful!
<AlanBell> czajkowski: it is a parade rather than a ceremony and I have stuffs to do
<AlanBell> at some point I will watch https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JqtvHYPmNzk&feature=g-upl and file all the bugs
<ali1234> AlanBell: have you ever tried xfce?
<AlanBell> no
<mattt> borough market
<mattt> i'm just thankful i don't work near there
<mattt> otherwise i'd be broxe
<czajkowski> mattt: aye it's addictive and very close to the office
<popey> mmmmm
<popey> nice food at borough market
<xr1rr> anyone know if you buy a new laptop an dont use windows can you get the windows licence refunded
<AlanBell> xr1rr: feel free to try, but it probably won't work
<czajkowski> popey: you in this week ?
<zleap> xr1rr, plan B find a supplier who will sell a laptop without windows
<mattt> czajkowski: i think i saw squirrel there last time, that was a bit off putting
<mattt> but otherwise it's very very nice :)
<xr1rr> it is a shame your forced into buying a laptop with windows tho.
<czajkowski> mattt: see them down by london eye and down by thepark
<czajkowski> all of the place
<gord> why is seing a squirrel offputting?
<zleap> xr1rr, i am sure as you can buy without windows if you look around
<zleap> to me the more people who find those smaller suppliers it helps them and shuns the bigger players,
<zleap> xr1rr, http://nakedcomputers.org/
<popey> no czajkowski
<zleap> ebuyer also sell a few systems with linux or no OS
<popey> xr1rr, some vendors will sell you a laptop without windows.. such as Dell
<xr1rr> ok
<xr1rr> will check
<AlanBell> dell have some really nice laptops that they are not selling yet, project sputnik X31 I think
<AlanBell> xps13 even
<xr1rr> yeah thats nice, will cost you tho :)
<zleap> which is why you shop around, however if the spec is good then the cost is less important in a way
<mattt> gord: squirrel to buy to eat?
<mattt> not random squirrels running around the place :)
 * popey hugs his thinkpad
<JohnRobert> I have two thinkpads
<JohnRobert> they're ok
 * daubers looks at headphones again
<JohnRobert> t420s and edge 13
<gord> mattt, oooh
<mgdm> Hi, does anyone have any recommendations for laptop battery suppliers? My Thinkpad R500 needs a new one
<popey> mgdm, yes
<popey> http://myworld.ebay.co.uk/power_biz/
<popey> bought from them a few times as have others, who had no issue
<mgdm> great, thanks!
<mgdm> is it actual Lenovo kit or clones?
<mgdm> (not that I'm all thatbothered, if it works)
<mgdm> never mind, found out :)
<ubuntuuk-planet> [Tony] Happy birthday Mum! - http://tonywhitmore.co.uk/blog/2012/09/10/happy-birthday-mum/?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=happy-birthday-mum
<TheOpenSourcerer> can someone try confirm if they can reach www.godaddy.com please?
<TheOpenSourcerer> NM - http://techcrunch.com/2012/09/10/godaddy-outage-takes-down-millions-of-sites/
<davmor2> TheOpenSourcerer: http://www.downforeveryoneorjustme.com/www.godaddy.comgoogle.com
<TheOpenSourcerer> Seems to have killed access to some of our sites (DNS lookup failures) - we don;t host with them but they manage our domains.
<TheOpenSourcerer> Not all oddly - even not those on the same domain... Some of our "sites".libertus.co.uk are OK others are not. Weird.
 * popey cooks some lamb
<TheOpenSourcerer> unfortunately - our mail server happens to be one that is currently unavailable.
 * TheOpenSourcerer adds mail server to /etc/hosts
<davmor2> News at 10 Alan (popey) Pope, Kills and cooks Allan Lamb
<Azelphur> xD
<BigRedS> popey: what do you use to get posts onto both G+ and twitter?
<TheOpenSourcerer> BigRedS: Cut & Paste :-P
<BigRedS> TheOpenSourcerer: haha, that's what I've been using :)
<popey> yup
<BigRedS> oh
 * daubers does like cake
<marsilainen> I saw a job the other day which advertised plenty of cake
<brobostigon> hehe
<marsilainen> I would have been more swayed by burrittos TBH
 * AlanBell spots dns breakage
<marsilainen> just a bit
<marsilainen> we have several clients down
<brobostigon> yes, i had to manually set different dns on my nexus7 earlier.
<czajkowski> ththe godaddy thingy  has been hitting G+ and twitter tday
<marsilainen> yeah
<marsilainen> our clients seem not only to have used godaddy but also to have really low TTL values
<marsilainen> oh well
<AlanBell> high TTL values are normally just painful when you try and intentionally do something quickly
<brobostigon> so i set my nexus7 to use google dns, and it worked fine again.
<marsilainen> AlanBell: sure - but what value do you think is reasonable?
<d3ngar> Hello there, I was wondering: one of my MySQL users can connect without a password on the localhost, but requires a password from remotes
<AlanBell> d3ngar: that is quite normal
<d3ngar> I don't like that the user doesn't need a password
<d3ngar> Must be something in the my.cnf that can switch this off?
<AlanBell> there are two users with the same name d3ngar
<d3ngar> ??
<d3ngar> erm, it's not my username, if that's what you mean
<zleap> d3ngar, is that an anagram of Dengar one of the characters from star wars ?
<zleap> or if you read 3 as E it reads Dengar
<d3ngar> yes
<zleap> ah
<d3ngar> I found that the letter 'e' is taken way too often :)
<d3ngar> however, back to my SQL issue
<zleap> seen briefly in EP V when there is a line up of bounty hunters
<zleap> yeah sorry
<d3ngar> AlanBell: How can I switch this off?
<d3ngar> EP V?
<AlanBell> 'd3ngar'@'localhost' and 'd3ngar'@'%' can have different passwords (or none)
<AlanBell> and are effectively the same user, or two users with the same name, depending on how you like to think of it
<AlanBell> the @'localhost' account in your instance does not have a password
<d3ngar> But there isn't another user by this name?
<d3ngar> I checked the user table using the root account
<AlanBell> checked with something like select host,user from mysql.user order by user;
<d3ngar> so you saw two users?
<AlanBell> yeah
<AlanBell> or more, you can have a different password for lots of hosts % is the wildcard
<AlanBell> which for reasons I don't understand does not seem to include localhost
<AlanBell> select user,host,password from mysql.user order by user;
<AlanBell> then you can see which ones don't have passwords (or don't have identical passwords)
<dogmatic69> AlanBell: there is always an exception to the rule.
<BigRedS> % does include localhost unless you specify localhost
<BigRedS> IIRC the most specific match wins
<AlanBell> ok, that makes sense
<BigRedS> MySQL permissions are insane, though
<AlanBell> I seem to recall struggling to make that work, but maybe it was just me
<BigRedS> yeah, it never does what you mean
 * daubers downloads a quantel daily iso
<AlanBell> daubers: cool, let me know if it boots, yesterday ubiquity wouldn't start for me
<daubers> AlanBell: Ah, I'm trying the alternate to play with the server release in a VM :)
<BigRedS> I installed from today's Desktop ISO a few hours ago
<BigRedS> went fine
<BigRedS> amd64
 * mattt is finally getting around to playing w/ vagrant
 * daubers is trying to test some magic stuff for the hackspace
<daubers> Open door via SMS magic!!!
<daubers> or open door by HTML portal with geolocation MAGIC!!!!
<daubers> Hmmm... I get the feeling this is installing a full desktop without asking me....
<daubers> Does the alternate CD now assume you want a desktop?
<mgdm> daubers: isn't the geolocation stuff really easy to fake? :)
<daubers> mgdm: Yes, but it'll be hidden behind a login portal thing
<mgdm> ah ha
<daubers> just lets me give a "You're 50 miles from the hackspace, are you sure you want to open the door?"
<daubers> box
<daubers> *le sigh*
<daubers> didn't want a desktop
 * daubers removes VM and starts again
<daubers> mgdm: All of the IP addresses given out at the hackspace are public facing anyway, so could do it based on our IP range too if I wanted
<mgdm> ah ha
<stgraber> daubers: alternate always gives you a full desktop unless you choose "command line system" or something like that in the F4 menu when booting the CD
<daubers> stgraber: Ahhhhhhh
<stgraber> if you want to be asked what you want to install, use server or the mini.iso
<popey> yeah, that "command line system" in F4 is super handy for minimal install
<daubers> stgraber: Just finished grabbing the beta 1 server iso too. But will try it from the command line minimal instead
#ubuntu-uk 2012-09-11
<Monotoko> mornin' all
<mattt> morning
<christel> morning pretties
<TheOpenSourcerer> Want one now: http://www.nexcrea.com/video/
<MartijnVdS> Looks vaporwareish
<TheOpenSourcerer> Oh yes MartijnVdS - it isn't real now.
<TheOpenSourcerer> That's not the point though. ;-)
<MartijnVdS> agreed, it looks nice
<TheOpenSourcerer> It'll need a octacore 3Ghz ARM processor, 8G of RAM and a minimum of 64G of storage to be really usable in all those configuration ;-)
<TheOpenSourcerer> And an *amazing* battery
<ali1234> what happens if you lose your phone?
<ali1234> none of your computers tablets and TVs works any more?
<ali1234> sounds like a good idea
<TheOpenSourcerer> Don't lose it then.
<MartijnVdS> have it implanted
<ali1234> what if you want a iPad, and android phone, a sony TV and a asus laptop?
<ali1234> "sorry you can't you have to buy all of them from us"
<TheOpenSourcerer> That's an Apple sales strategy.
<ali1234> yeah and even apple is not razy enough to try this
<TheOpenSourcerer> As it is Android & Ubuntu you can chose to use different h/w and sync via any cloud system of your choice.
<MartijnVdS> you could make the screens etc. conform to a common standard
<TheOpenSourcerer> Make the connectors "standard" then lots of manufacturers can play :-)
<ali1234> yeah, fair enough
<MartijnVdS> connectors? make it wireless :)
<ali1234> they have ageneric docking station
<ali1234> yeah it really should be wireless
<MartijnVdS> if we're blue-skying anyway..
<TheOpenSourcerer> Fair point.
<ali1234> and while you're at it, how about putting a CPU in the docking station as well, so it can work without the phone
<MartijnVdS> and it becomes dual-core when you add the phone?
<ali1234> yes
<MartijnVdS> Everything stored "in the cloud" so you don't have to worry about that?
<TheOpenSourcerer> The phone would need to be at least quad already I reckon.
<ali1234> why?
<TheOpenSourcerer> So it would be as usable as my S3 :-)
<MartijnVdS> S3 ViRGE?
<darren> keiran, ping
<darren> KScully, ping
<diplo> Morning all
<JamesTait> Good morning, angels! :-D
<MartijnVdS> JamesTait: Good morning Charlie!
<MartijnVdS> 8-)
<TheOpenSourcerer> Some people seem to get up so late!
 * JamesTait is more of a night owl.
 * MartijnVdS has been up since 7:30
<JamesTait> Hey, me too!
<diplo> 6:15 here, just have to do the school run etc before work :)
<JamesTait> I set my alarm for 7:00, though, and drive my wife batty hitting snooze. :-P
<Monotoko> 5:45 here
<TheOpenSourcerer> Our alarm is 06:15 but I am usually awake before it.
<JamesTait> I don't think the school run counts as an excuse to get up at such a scary time. I did the school run on my bike twice before work this morning - one of my boys forgot his lunch bag.
<diplo> hah JamesTait, and it's not scary.. my boys wake me up.. not a lot of choice :)
<JamesTait> I could think of a few "choice" words I might use if my boys woke me up at that time. :-P
<diplo> They are only 4 & 5, the younger one would quite happily sleep in
<JamesTait> Mine are 8 and 5, and I think it's the younger one who normally wakes the older one up.
<JamesTait> Although I can never be totally sure. They're a sneaky pair at times. ;)
<diplo> heh
<christel> GOOD MORNING
<christel> i am having One of Those Mornings...
<MartijnVdS> howdy christel
<MartijnVdS> christel: "one of those morning"?
<christel> just sat down at my desk and realised i'd made 3 separate mugs of coffee in the space of 20 minutes
<christel> one is now cold, one is lukewarm and one is hot hot hot
<christel> not quite sure where i left my brain
<JamesTait> Buongiorno, christel!
<diplo> lol
<christel> JamesTait: \o/
 * TheOpenSourcerer has had 3 large mugs already... Can feel #4 coming up.
<MartijnVdS> christel: time for coffee ;)
<christel> TheOpenSourcerer: ah but you are probably sensible enough to drink them rather than put them down to go make another one! :P
<TheOpenSourcerer> Indeed I am christel :-D
<MartijnVdS> christel: maybe you need sugar first?
<christel> hehe
<christel> i think i need a jump start indeed!
<hoover> Hi folks
<christel> hiya hoover :)
<hoover> fingers crossed... rebooting a remote server with a new dhcp config... ;-)
<hoover> hey christel
<Monotoko> right... work time, see you later fellas :D
<hoover> Have fun Monotoko
<christel> have fun indeed!
<Monotoko> and dhcp... urgh ._. my routers DHCP broke so I have a box sat next to it that does it now
<hoover> yay, it's back up! ;-)
<MartijnVdS> hoover: that's the scarey :)
<hoover> This went better than expected, considering I also removed a previous 70-persistent-net.rules udev file ;-)
<Monotoko> the scarier bit is when you're remotely rebooting :P
<Monotoko> and it just... doesn't come back
<hoover> exactly... the machine has ilo, but it's not connected 8P
<hoover> Ok, now on to updating virtualbox
<BigRedS> Hm. I seem to have lost the "Desktop Size" setting in 12.10's ccsm. Anyone know where it's gone?
<czajkowski> http://www.canonical.com/about-canonical/resources/case-studies/capgemini-bpo-deploys-hybrid-thin-client-solution-ubuntu-adva  folks might find this an intersting read
<bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
<diplo> Anyone recommend a good tutorial for a mail server on 12.04 that they have used ?
<BigRedS> diplo: what sort of mail server?
<TheOpenSourcerer> diplo: We've been using Zentyal for a while - easy to use, manage and set up. Runs atop of Ubuntu.
<bigcalm> I found the quickest way to get a box sending out email was to install exim and use the ncursers interface to set it up
<mattt> bigcalm: ++
<bigcalm> But that might not be what you actually want *shrug* :)
<marsilainen_> can anyone suggest what channel it is best to ask DNS questions? (godaddy fallout...)
<marsilainen_> trying to understand how you are meant to work around the registrar (rather than just name servers) not being available
<marsilainen_> since I understand that's part of what happened yesterday
<BigRedS> exim? Ew.
<BigRedS> But any of the smtpds should Just Work on installation as far as sending mail goes; is that all you're after?
<diplo> Sorry out making cuppa
<diplo> BigRedS: for my vps
<diplo> Zentyal I'm looking at for work, but won't be suitable for my vps, was thinking postfix/dovecot setup.. is that what most people use ?
<BigRedS> It's the same on virtual hardware and on real hardware :)
<BigRedS> Are you wanting virtual mailboxes for incoming mail?
 * bigcalm offers christel a mug of coffee
<BigRedS> are you just after working outbound mail? Are you happy to have a unix user per mailbox?
<diplo> I think so, I'd like to see how others have set up
<BigRedS> I wrote this: https://github.com/BigRedS/postfixadmin-installer
<diplo> It's going to be very low traffic and max of probably 30 mailboxes
<BigRedS> which is badly written but appears to work
 * diplo looks
<christel> bigcalm: WHY THANK YOU I SHALL ADD IT TO MY COLLECTION
<BigRedS> for virtual mailboxes in Postfix/Dovecot with Postfixadmin for a GUI to manage it
<bigcalm> :D
<mattt> managing your own email kinda sucks
 * BigRedS concurs
<bigcalm> christel: drink them all and bounce off the walls
<BigRedS> ( /me manages other people's mail )
<mattt> BigRedS: sorry to hear that :(
<mattt> :P
<diplo> mattt: Not as much as GoDaddy going down
<diplo> :P
<christel> bigcalm: i am!
<brobostigon> good morning everyone.
<mattt> they still having issues?
<christel> brobostigon \o/
<diplo> They did last night, mine is back up this morning
<brobostigon> christel o/
<diplo> But I'm paying two bills atm and want everything moved to the VPS asap
<BigRedS> mattt: other people's mail is much better than your own mail :)
<MartijnVdS> Woo! http://www.amazon.co.uk/Hitchhikers-Guide-Galaxy-Complete-Series/dp/0563504196 arrived!
<diplo> Also need to work out how to use Bitfolks spamassasin setup
<brobostigon> MartijnVdS: woop :)
<mattt> bitfolk any good?
<diplo> yeah, well I've had no issues at all
<MartijnVdS> brobostigon: 14 CDs!
<mattt> diplo: i think i must have tried everyone but (linode, slicehost, rackspace, ec2, digital ocean, etc.)
<brobostigon> MartijnVdS: :)
<popey> diplo, its documented on their wiki
<popey> i used to use it, but switched to gmail
<diplo> the bitfolk one? popey, i've just opened Roberts one if you mean that ?
<diplo> BigRedS: Whats the reason of using your script over apt-geting postfixadmin ?
<AlanBell> czajkowski: do you know more about the cap gemini thing?
<czajkowski> AlanBell: only the link sorry its one of the case studies
<AlanBell> ok
<AlanBell> would be curious how they intend to do Unity to a thin client
<MartijnVdS> magic!
<AlanBell> server side llvmpipe?
<AlanBell> use the 3d accelleration of the client somehow?
<AlanBell> or is it a carefully worded case study and they are actually just using it to run citrix to windows terminal services
<czajkowski> AlanBell: wow you're a pessimist!
<popey> thats an option
<AlanBell> don't mean it in a pessimist way, it is just a bit vauge about whether it is Ubuntu that is being delivered to thin clients as a hosted desktop, or a fat install of ubuntu that is connecting to other hosted desktops
<AlanBell> or a hosted ubuntu deliverd to windows CE thin clients and hosted thin sessions to other windows things which makes even less sense
<AlanBell> and quite where unity fits into this is interesting
<BigRedS> diplo: we run Debian
<BigRedS> the postfixadmin package doesn't do all the configuring for you, either
<BigRedS> there is a ubuntu package for a pma server, though, now I think of it
<BigRedS> or at least something similar
<BigRedS> but if you apt-get install postfixadmin you still need to make Postfix and Dovecot talk to the DB
<Monotoko> ugh, postfix
 * Monotoko shudders
<BigRedS> haha
<Monotoko> I took the easy way... I use virtualmin :P
<BigRedS> MTAs are the new text editor
<diplo> I'll take a look then thanks
<Monotoko> after days and days of trying to get postfix to conform
<BigRedS> virtualmin uses postfix
<Monotoko> I know, but it configures it automatically :P
<Monotoko> saying that though, I do need to configure a basic inbox on an amazon AMI soon -.-
<davmor2> Morning all
<Monotoko> mornin'
<czajkowski> davmor2: ello
<czajkowski> anyone elses skype icon changed.....
<Monotoko> skype keeps crashing on me in Linux :(
<Monotoko> add a contact - crash, open settings - crash, try to talk to someone - crash
<czajkowski> it only crashes once when I video skype
<czajkowski> then reboot and it;s fine
<czajkowski> it's a mind of its own
<czajkowski> but I also *need* it
<davmor2> czajkowski: morning prod and a hug just cause
<czajkowski> heh cheers
 * popey needs some help with testing
<MartijnVdS> "make test"
<MartijnVdS> popey: what do you need tested?
<popey> a font
<MartijnVdS> I have lots of fonts! :)
<popey> :)
<czajkowski> hmm my little envelope indicator is gone
<czajkowski> bugger
<Monotoko> heh... it's not as bad as it was in the 8.04 days :P
<christel> you keep losing it!
<Monotoko> things just used to vanish and reappear a few reboots later :')
<czajkowski> well this is 12.10
<czajkowski> so I dont mind as much
<czajkowski> it's just unusal
<BigRedS> czajkowski: if it's any consolation, 12.10 is generally Just Working for me :)
<BigRedS> except for my not working out a way of rearranging my workspaces
<davmor2> christel: czajkowski lost it years ago
<czajkowski> BigRedS: it's working fine also here. I just noticed skype went away and now reinstalled it, and my envelope thingymagiggy is gone
<BigRedS> pft. I refuse to believe you're not having any problems :)
<czajkowski> I do like the default of 4 workspaces I use them every day
<BigRedS> yeah, I just like them all in a line
<czajkowski> BigRedS: just imagine me and the language and then it's very easy to see
<czajkowski> BigRedS: ah I dont I like up down and over :)
<BigRedS> else I forget two of them exist and lose apps...
<AlanBell> is there some special magic you need to do to allow rhythmbox to sync to android devices?
<popey> MTP?
<AlanBell> I plug it in and it connects and shows up in rhythmbox (and says MPT connect on the phone)
<czajkowski> popey: not working for me using jellybean and ubuntu
<AlanBell> but sync with library is greyed out and I can't drag stuff onto it
<czajkowski> AlanBell: is it jellybean ?
<AlanBell> no
<AlanBell> not even ICS
<czajkowski> ah ok differnet issue
<popey> can you make it mount in 'not mtp' mode?
<czajkowski> it used to work pefectly for me
<AlanBell> because they won't do over the air upgrades and I can't get kies to work
<davmor2> AlanBell: are you on quantal there?
<AlanBell> popey: yes, just tried that, still won't let me put stuff on it
<AlanBell> shows up as 12gb usb drive rather than music player
<AlanBell> davmor2: yes
<popey> can you fudge it with the special file you put in the root?
<davmor2> there is a fault with all music players I think there is an issue with the detector I pointed it out to pitti the other day I'll chase up with him
<popey> .is_audio_player is a file you can put on the device which rb and other players find
<popey> http://almost-a-technocrat.blogspot.co.uk/2010/11/isaudioplayer.html
<AlanBell> fudging it makes little difference
<Monotoko> right... need some coffee before moving all my domains away from GoDaddy
 * AlanBell won't bother moving from godaddy
<Monotoko> well, I'm moving my DNS hosting
<Monotoko> not the actual domains
<Monotoko> been meaning to get my own bind9 server up for some time
<AlanBell> cool
<popey> if you are on quantal, could you test this:-
<popey> sudo add-apt-repository ppa:sil2100/fonts
<popey> sudo apt-get update
<popey> sudo apt-get upgrade
<popey> you should get a new font package which adds the "medium" weight
<popey> this breaks some things, but I don't know the full scope
<popey> I think it's mostly limited to qt apps such as vlc, skype and mumble
<popey> would appreciate some testing to find others!
<popey> e.g. in vlc the preferences pane is all in bold
<MartijnVdS> who uses Qt apps anyway :P
 * MartijnVdS adds ppa
<MartijnVdS> "picard" (music tagger) is in semi-bold
<MartijnVdS> it's a qt app
<AlanBell> http://www.the-crown-london.co.uk/
<MartijnVdS> vlc as well
<AlanBell> http://www.imbibe-bar.com/garden.php
<MartijnVdS> it's not quite bold.. maybe it's the new "medium" font?
<AlanBell> are two pubs that have been suggested for the release party
<popey> MartijnVdS, any chance you can get before/after screenshots?
<MartijnVdS> uhh
<MartijnVdS> too late
<MartijnVdS> I can get "after" now..
<popey> you can revert back the font
<popey> or just remove the M font files
<popey> in /usr/share/fonts/truetype/ubuntu-font-family
 * MartijnVdS downgrades
<BigRedS> AlanBell: Not sure if suggestions are still open, but The George is very nice and not far from the Blue Fin building
<BigRedS> Is The Crown the old boxing pub on the corner of the Cut?
<MartijnVdS> popey: before: http://imagebin.org/227996
<AlanBell> BigRedS: suggestions still very much open
<AlanBell> no idea where the crown is
<MartijnVdS> popey: after: http://imagebin.org/227997
<popey> thanks
<BigRedS> AlanBell: yeah, George is nice, just off Borough High St, down towards te shard
<BigRedS> has a courtyard off the road, several ales. Proud of being old and/or having a shakespeare connection
<BigRedS> I havent been for five years, though
<mattt> i've been there recently
<mattt> to use the toilet :P
<BigRedS> used to be our defaul for work drinks
<mattt> i can vouch for the toilet
<BigRedS> haha
<mattt> it's quite clean
<BigRedS> blimey, it even has its own wikipedia page
<BigRedS> Oh, the connection is Dickens, not Shakespeare
<MartijnVdS> BigRedS: http://london.randomness.org.uk/wiki.cgi?George,_SE1_1NH ?
<mattt> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_George_Inn,_Southwark
<mattt> same one
<BigRedS> yeah
<BigRedS> Is there a way to search Launchpad for stuff written in a given language?
<BigRedS> I'm wondering if I'm yet good enough at Perl to help other people, but everything's written in Python these days
<daubers> \o/ python
<BigRedS> I found a script for it once, but it seems like the sort of thing that might be hidden away in a web UI...
<BigRedS> (a python script, no less. :) )
<daubers> a python script to search for perl projects?
<mattt> BigRedS: maybe just search by date
<mattt> ie, "projects last updated 15 years ago"
<mattt> may turn up a perl project
 * mattt realizes that wasn't a very helpful answer
<oimon> guys, if i wanna remove the ubuntu scrollbars is it safe to remove overlay-scrollbar package, and that's it?
<BigRedS> mattt: :)
<ali1234> BigRedS: perl is a write-only language anyway
<ali1234> nobody is good enough at perl to work on another developer's perl code
<AlanBell> oimon: gsettings set org.gnome.desktop.interface ubuntu-overlay-scrollbars false
<AlanBell> oimon: that way you don't remove the ubuntu-desktop package
<ali1234> does that actually work now?
<oimon> AlanBell, thanks. trying that. think i need to logout now
<mungojerry> AlanBell, i can confirm it works,. ta
<ali1234> here's a question: how do you tell a list can be scrolled, if the scrollbar is hidden?
<mungojerry> it's not hidden though, is it?
<mungojerry> there's a slim thingy
<mungojerry> hmm, there's a side effect which is that it always shows a scoll bar even even it doesn't need to
<mungojerry> in terminal for example
<popey> i see no scrollbar in terminal
<popey> until there is something to scroll
<mungojerry> i've disabled the ubuntu overlay jobby though
<ali1234> in other OSs it's hidden all the time
<BigRedS> I'm used to not being able to save attachments opened in Libre Office, but this now doesn't seem to want to let me zoom...
<mungojerry> owncloud just saved my bacon
<mungojerry> so i had a bacon sandwich to celebrate
<popey> mungojerry, i installed owncloud on a server at home
<popey> no idea what to do next :)
<mungojerry> colleague killed the hard drive on my pc
<davmor2> popey: use it :D
<mungojerry> Documents folder saved phew
<mungojerry> and my keepass file...
<mungojerry> popey, you can also lin together external cloud storage accounts into your owncloud
<popey> like U1 and dropbox?
<mungojerry> yesh
<mungojerry> or maybe a paid owncloud provider too
<popey> how?
<mungojerry> ownCloud currently supports: Amazon S3, Dropbox, FTP, Google Drive, OpenStack Swift, SMB, and WebDAV. Local file storage can also be mounted that is outside of your ownCloudâs data directory
<mungojerry> go to apps and enable external storage support
<mungojerry> " it is relatively easy to add support for other services if they provide an API."
<mungojerry> more details here http://blog.gapinthecloud.com/2012/06/10/configuring-external-storage-for-owncloud/
<mungojerry> but i am missing a step since it aint showing for me
<mungojerry> bug 690080
<lubotu3> Launchpad bug 690080 in libmatthew-java (Debian) "Manifest problem in libmatthew-java" [Unknown,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/690080
<mungojerry> bug 689080
<lubotu3> Launchpad bug 689080 in Zeitgeist Data-Sources "Vim datasource results in error when editing files remotely" [Low,Fix committed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/689080
<ali1234> what exactly is U1 music streaming?
<MartijnVdS> music
<ali1234> ok let me put the question a different way
<davmor2> ali1234: music that you buy that is streamed to stuff like phones
<ali1234> if i don't pay Â£3.99 a month extra for "music streaming" what exactly prevents me from streaming the music in U1?
<ali1234> considering that there is absolutely no difference between streaming and downloading
<gord> music streaming = access to the music streaming api. you could write a client that uses the syncing api but loose things like server side search
<ali1234> is that just meta data search?
<gord> i dunno
<ali1234> ID3 tags and such
<ali1234> i suppose that would be useful
<gord> i think the streaming api converts also, though i may be making that up
<davmor2> ali1234: streaming it mean that you don't fill up your phones memory with music tracks it is streamed like youtube
<ali1234> also, is it possible to link to albums and songs in the store yet?
<ali1234> davmor2: youtube downloads the whole video you know
<ali1234> into the firefox cache
<davmor2> ali1234: indeed but once you close it it goes away ie you get it back if you play a second track the memory from the first is freed up etc
<ali1234> it doesn't actually
<ali1234> the videos hang around in the cache for a long time
<ali1234> anyway, there's no reason this cannot be implemented using the syncing API as gord said
<ali1234> http://al.robotfuzz.com/~al/random/ffcache.py
<ali1234> ^ use that to rip flash video from firefox cache
<ali1234> and various other formats
<JamesTait> 'night all!
 * JamesTait waves
<MartijnVdS> howdy
 * MartijnVdS plays with ebtables
<xr1rr> anyone know a good bitcoin miner
<Azelphur> xr1rr: depends on hardware
<xr1rr> Nvidia, I know they not the best - far from, just want to try and setup and see how it works
<Azelphur> xr1rr: laptop or desktop?
<Azelphur> which nvidia?
<xr1rr>  desktop, I got hold of a, NVIDIA Tesla graphic card
<Azelphur> xr1rr: I dunno how well that will perform, perhaps try phoenix
<Toby> ...Hulllo?
<Toby> ...Ah, maybe some other time. Night!
<brobostigon> evening Toby
<Azelphur> !hello | Toby
<Azelphur> no hello? :<
<oimon> if something is for sale at Â£0.00 on a website do they have to honour it? (i guess not)
<AlanBell> oimon: nope
<oimon> thought so :D
<oimon> i remember a well known case of argos and a Â£30 telly
<davmor2> night all
<MartijnVdS> A program about VI kings on BBC HD.. but no editor in sight!
<dogmatic69> something is chewing up my drive.
<dogmatic69> got a notice there was 1.1GB left, went for dinner and now got another saying 500mb
<dogmatic69> Any way I can see what is using so much?
<dogmatic69> hmmm... just opened sys monitor and can see it ticking down
<popey> probably a log in /var ?
<popey> maybe use disk space analyzer?
<popey> could be something in your home spinning and putting a log in a .local directory
<dogmatic69> down to 380mb now :/
<dogmatic69> I dont even do much on my pc, I have most things on my server, just running xchat, email and netbeans really
<dogmatic69>  /var/log had kbs of logs
<dogmatic69> lol
<dogmatic69> popey: found the problem
<popey> ?
<dogmatic69> I closed my terminal (terminator) that had ~20 ssh sessions open to ~5 server all running innotop/htop/iotop etc.
<dogmatic69> instantly have 15GB again
<Azelphur> popey: did you hear about the guy who made a 10k btc bet that pirate would pay? XD
<popey> Azelphur, matthew?
<Azelphur> yea
<Azelphur> did you hear he ragequit bitcoin xD
<Azelphur> because he lost the bet
<popey> yes
<Azelphur> xD
<popey> i don't think there was ever any possibility either would pay out
<Azelphur> fun fun
<Azelphur> Anyone recommend anything besides cheese for video recording?
<Azelphur> Cheese records at like 0.1fps or less for me
<AlanBell> guvcview
<smallfoot-> can we release Ubuntu Muslim Edition today on 9/11 ?
<MartijnVdS> à² _à² 
<mattt> :-/
<shauno> are we ever going to teach them to use dd/mm like the rest of the planet?
<MartijnVdS> I think that requires a proper invasion
<AlanBell> just revoke the declaration of independence
<Azelphur> AlanBell: it worked but it desynced the audio track :(
<brobostigon> nos da everyone, sleep well.
<AlanBell> :( I had some problems with playback in openshot, I tried recording it as mjpeg because that is what comes from the camera rather than h264
<AlanBell> seemed better, then can transcode later in openshot
<Azelphur> hehe
<Azelphur> think I'll just try the youtube uploader this time, guvcview literally has like 10 seconds+ of difference between the audio and video
<Azelphur> annoying
<Azelphur> and the youtube uploader doesn't get any sound at all :(
<popey> pip pip
<Azelphur> since the internet is conspiring against me
<Azelphur> all of this https://dl.dropbox.com/u/3832397/Photos/2012/September/2012-09-11-230018.jpg in here https://dl.dropbox.com/u/3832397/Photos/2012/September/2012-09-11-230445.jpg
<Azelphur> scottevest \o/
<shauno> http://www.amazon.com/The-Book-of-Tea-ebook/dp/B000JQUVMC/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1347400801&sr=8-2&keywords=the+book+of+tea#_
<shauno> argh
<shauno> sorry, not used to putty.  trying to figure out how to get it to click Azelphur's links as, well, links
<Azelphur> hehe
<shauno> it used to work :/ but I think I had a third-party build, because it used to minimize to the tray.  oh well
#ubuntu-uk 2012-09-12
<popey> http://ubuntu.audioca.st/  - new..
<czajkowski> aloha
<mattt> morning czajkowski
<MartijnVdS> \o
<MartijnVdS> Voting day here today.
<mattt> glad to see i'm not the only one who has to get up at such a miserable hour
<mattt> even tho MartijnVdS you're +1 :)
<MartijnVdS> 7:52 ;)
<mattt> who are you voting for?
<MartijnVdS> dunno yet
<MartijnVdS> ~21 parties to choose from
<mattt> woah :-/
<MartijnVdS> some are obvious "joke" parties, and some I'd never vote for
<mattt> that makes it rather difficult
<MartijnVdS> but there are 3-4 parties I like
<mattt> what is of concern there the most?  economy?
<MartijnVdS> Economy/budget, "Europe" (I'm for it, most politicians against)
<mattt> ok, same old then :)
<mattt> anyway, gotta jet, ttyl!
 * mattt is on the road
<shauno> it's not that early; it's almost light out!
<livingdaylight> GM
<sahad> hi am having some problem while installing any new softwares or pakages in my ubuntu 12.04
<sahad> can any one help me in that
<MartijnVdS> sahad: can you describe the problem you're having?
<MartijnVdS> sahad: or copy the error message :)
<sahad> give me a minut
<sahad> The package system is broken  Check if you are using third party repositories. If so disable them, since they are a common source of problems. Furthermore run the following command in a Terminal: apt-get install -f
<sahad> this is the error message am getting
<sahad> when i trie to update
<MartijnVdS> sahad: which program do you use? the software centre?
<sahad> yes
<MartijnVdS> sahad: did you install packages from somewhere else than software centre?
<MartijnVdS> (earlier)
<sahad> yea i terid once
<MartijnVdS> which package was that?
<sahad> it was a language pack
<sahad> malayalam
<MartijnVdS> and how did you try to install that?
<sahad> using erminal window
<MartijnVdS> using 'apt-get install language-pack-something' or 'dpkg -i'?
<sahad> i will copy paste the way i did
<sahad> cd Desktop/ubuntu-8.04-ml
<sahad> sudo dpkg -i *.deb
<sahad> these two commands i did
<christel> morning lovelies
<MartijnVdS> sahad: ok.. so you installed the 8.04 language pack on 12.04, I see how that would break :)
<sahad> am sorry am not that advanced user
<MartijnVdS> sahad: if you could open a terminal, and type "apt-get -s -f install", then put the output on pastebin (see topic)
<MartijnVdS> sahad: no problem, we'll fix this easily
<sahad> k let me try that
<sahad> thanks
<MartijnVdS> sahad: the "-s" means "don't actually do anything", it'll show what it would do if you did "apt-get -f install"
<sahad> here is what am getting
<sahad> sahad@sahad-IdeaPad:~$ apt-get -s -f install NOTE: This is only a simulation!       apt-get needs root privileges for real execution.       Keep also in mind that locking is deactivated,       so don't depend on the relevance to the real current situation! Reading package lists... Done Building dependency tree        Reading state information... Done Correcting dependencies... Done The following extra packages will be installed:   l
<MartijnVdS> sahad: please use the pastebin :
<MartijnVdS> !pastebin
<lubotu3> For posting multi-line texts into the channel, please use http://paste.ubuntu.com | To post !screenshots use http://imagebin.org/?page=add | !pastebinit to paste directly from command line | Make sure you give us the URL for your paste - see also the channel topic.
<sahad> one minut
<sahad>  1  2  3  4  5  6  7  8  9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34  	  sahad@sahad-IdeaPad:~$ apt-get -s -f install NOTE: This is only a simulation!       apt-get needs root privileges for real execution.       Keep also in mind that locking is deactivated,       so don't depend on the relevance to the real current situation! Reading package lists... Done Building dependency tree        Reading sta
<MartijnVdS> sahad: that's not the URL to pastebin..
<popey> morning
<sahad> then?
<MartijnVdS> sahad: please give us the link from the browser's URL bar, which looks like "http://paste.ubuntu.com/1200043/"
<MartijnVdS> (but with a different number
<sahad> yeah i got it
<popey> timo managed to get 1200000 :)
<MartijnVdS> popey: woo :)
<sahad> and i pasted the txt in that
<sahad> and clicked on paste
<sahad> and am getting a new window with the and one option to download as text
<MartijnVdS> sahad: yes, and at the top in the white bar, where you type the URL it shows what you should paste to us, but don't worry I've found it.
<sahad> only one option is there
<sahad> its to download as text
<MartijnVdS> No in your browser's URL bar
<MartijnVdS> even higher :)
<sahad> http://paste.ubuntu.com/1200042/
<MartijnVdS> sahad: can you put the output of this on pastebin: ls -l Desktop/ubuntu-8.04-ml/*.deb
<MartijnVdS> sahad: Thank you!
<sahad> k i will do that
<sahad> http://paste.ubuntu.com/1200046/ here it is
<MartijnVdS> *opens link*
<sahad> ??
<MartijnVdS> sahad: I asked for "ls -l" not "dpkg -i"
<MartijnVdS> sahad: you can do this:
<sahad> k let me  try once more
<MartijnVdS> sahad: no I have enough info
<sahad> http://paste.ubuntu.com/1200049/
<sahad>  now?
<MartijnVdS> sahad: dpkg --remove ttf-malayalam-fonts scim-modules-table scim-ml-phonetic scim-m17n:i386 scim-init ml-xkbpatch ml-ubuntu ml-phonetic-mozhi m17n-db libm17n-0:i386 libgd2-xpm:i386 libotf0:i386
<sahad> am sorry i am not a advanced user so some dificulties in understanding
<sahad> how i am suppose to use thease commands?
<MartijnVdS> sahad: in a terminal
<sahad> all togather?
<MartijnVdS> sahad: it's one line
<sahad> kk
<MartijnVdS> so dpkg --remove etc. etc.
<sahad> but it saysrequesed operation requires super user privilages
<MartijnVdS> sahad: ah, put 'sudo' in front
<MartijnVdS> sudo dpkg --remove etc. etc.
<sahad> kk
<MartijnVdS> After this, you can re-install Malaysian support through "System Settings" -> "Language support"
<MartijnVdS> "System Settings" is in the menu (top right, click the 'Gear' icon)
<sahad> http://paste.ubuntu.com/1200061/
<sahad> ths is what i got
<sahad> some error
<sahad> check tht link
<MartijnVdS> sahad: ok.. can you do 'sudo apt-get -s -f install' again, and paste the output?
<sahad> k
<sahad> http://paste.ubuntu.com/1200063/ here it is
<MartijnVdS> sahad: ok, no try without -s
<sahad> sudo-get -f install?
<MartijnVdS> sudo apt-get -f install
<sahad> http://paste.ubuntu.com/1200069/ here it is
<MartijnVdS> sahad: you're on 12.04, right?
<sahad> yeah
<MartijnVdS> sahad: can you paste the output of 'uname -a'?
<sahad> sure
<MartijnVdS> popey: packages.ubuntu.com = down
<popey> thanks
<sahad> http://paste.ubuntu.com/1200070/
 * popey pokes IS
<MartijnVdS> sahad: apt-get -f install libgd2-xpm
<sahad> with sudo?
<MartijnVdS> yes, sorry
<sahad> http://paste.ubuntu.com/1200072/
<MartijnVdS> sahad: apt-get -f install libgd2-xpm libjpeg62
<MartijnVdS> The 'dpkg -i' broke a lot of things :(
<sahad> http://paste.ubuntu.com/1200076/
<sahad> so what to do now?
<MartijnVdS> sahad: wget http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu/pool/main/libg/libgd2/libgd2-xpm_2.0.36~rc1~dfsg-6ubuntu2_i386.deb
<MartijnVdS> sahad: then sudo dpkg -i libgd2-xpm_2.0.36~rc1~dfsg-6ubuntu2_i386.deb
<MartijnVdS> then "sudo apt-get -f install" again
<MartijnVdS> what does that do?
<knightwork> morning everyone :)
<pinky-> good morning knightwork and all the other luvley people
<knightwork> hello pinky :) how are you today
<pinky-> I'm just fine, how's you?
<pinky-> I've not long woken up and listened to http://ubun2.me/ whilst having breakfast and it's put me in a good mood
<pinky-> new ubuntu.audiocast
<pinky-> not serious but fun
<knightwork> an audiocast ?
<knightwork> so no RSS ? And not downloadable ?
<popey> :)
 * knightwork things thats just odd
<knightwork> hey popey
<popey> also they make a point that they don't use the term "podcast" because someone found it offensive, yet delivering the show via flash is fine
<pinky-> I shall from now on always remember "audio.cast"
<pinky-> umm .audiocast
<popey> not audioca.st ?
<pinky-> hehe
<pinky-> oh early here.. ah the title i get it now
<popey> ahh, 08:30 and my laptop goes bonkers.. that'll be the backup
<pinky-> yup from now on I shall always use the term in irc as audioca.st - ty for inspiration
<knightwork> "podcast" = Offensive ?
<knightwork> So we have to pussy-foot our way around the RFM lovers now too ?
<knightwork> RMS lovers i mean
<daubers> Jabber \o/
<AlanBell> here is what virtual RMS thinks of my laptop http://paste.ubuntu.com/1200100/
 * daubers fires up the Quantel VM
<popey> :)
<popey> is their show knightwork, they can call it what they like :)
<daubers> Oooh... is all the canonical stuff now moving to python 3? Just seen python3-update-manager in my updates list
<czajkowski> hows folks?
<knightwork> hey czajkowski  !
<knightwork> doing fine
<knightwork> howzyou ?
<czajkowski> glad to hear it
<czajkowski> not bad in the office woring away
 * AlanBell gives czajkowski a k
<knightwork> I'll probably go out shopping for an ultrabook tomorrow
<knightwork> want an 11 inch that runs nicely and doesnt break the bank
<knightwork> funny thing : All the PC models I found are more expensive then the apple macbook air.
<knightwork> But me wants an 11 inch to run Ubuntu on
 * czajkowski hasa 13'' ultrabook 
<knightwork> I just sold my (old) macbook air (it was a 13 inch)
<knightwork> i would like to have an 11 inch
<knightwork> i looked at the asus zenbook , but you can't get your hands on it in Belgium .. and it has an nvidea card ... so i'm kinda scared running ubuntu on it
<MattJ> Jabber \o/
<MattJ> I'm getting so slow :/
<knightwork> czajkowski: what ultrabook do you have ?
<jussi> ive heard the zenbook is kind plasticy and not great build quality
<czajkowski> toshiba z830
<knightwork> jussi: realy ? interesting
<knightwork> czajkowski: saw that one yesterday in the shop . Purdy Cewl
<czajkowski> yarp
<czajkowski> Sheldon rocks!
<jussi> czajkowski: that actually looks pretty nice
<knightwork> So .. the only alternative I have is to buy a mac , wipe the drive and put ubuntu on it.
<czajkowski> which Laney has done
<czajkowski> and runs well it seems
<JamesTait> Happy middle-of-the-week, everyone! :-D
<jussi> only an i3 though :/ can you get more ?
 * jussi hides from JamesTait - stop being so positive, its only wednesday
<diplo> Morning all
<jussi> :P
<JamesTait> And a cold Wednesday at that.
<TheOpenSourcerer> Yay! It's Wednesday
<TheOpenSourcerer> Happy Birthday JamesTait
<daubers> Wednesday is Hackspace day \o/
<JamesTait> Why thank you, TheOpenSourcerer. :)
<TheOpenSourcerer> I remember in Stockholm the locals used to go out and have a bit of session on Wednesday evenings - they called it the "Little Weekend" IIRC.
<JamesTait> And there was me thinking I'd erased all evidence of that fact from the public record.
 * TheOpenSourcerer is out with some old mates tonight for beer and an "All you can eat Chinese" :-D
<TheOpenSourcerer> JamesTait: Facebook is your enemy - I got an email reminding me a few days ago.
<JamesTait> TheOpenSourcerer: I guessed that'd be it.
<JamesTait> Good job I trust you.
<brobostigon> good morning everyone.
<czajkowski> gord: where are you.........
<czajkowski> oh just seen him arrive
<czajkowski> minus cake!
<czajkowski> for shame!
<JamesTait> czajkowski: Double cake next time then?
 * czajkowski sends gord to the cake shop
<MartijnVdS> pie ok too?
<popey> PIE!
<brobostigon> :)
<hoover> Morning all
<oimon> morning chaps. i have a document that states an industry standard % for incremental changes for backups in the enterprise, can't find any source for this - anyone know of one?
<hoover> Hi folks
<hoover> I exchanged my ancient nv gt8800 with a gt520 yesterday, since then I've had a couple of spurious reboots in 12.04.1... any idea why?
<hoover> nv driver version is 37xsomething
<hoover> I don't think it's power consumption, I guess the gt8800 would draw a lot more power than the 520.
<Oli> Is the card sat in well?
<Oli> And can you double-check the version of the driver. 37something doesn't exist.
<czajkowski> aquarius: and crash goes gwibber on 12.10 :(
<aquarius> czajkowski, heh. Ping kenvandine when he's up...
<czajkowski> yeah
<czajkowski> me and gwibner never see eye to eye :/
<czajkowski> aquarius: the U1 post yesterday seems to have gone done well yesterday
<aquarius> yeah, the web music store is cool
<diplo> I'm debating doing something on it
<czajkowski> aquarius: so on gwibber you flick to each colum no way to see them all on one page or am I missing something
<czajkowski> I get all tweets on one page
<czajkowski> hit arrow and over to direct message
<czajkowski> then all @me
<aquarius> I think you can add a column
<aquarius> HUD > column might have something :)
<czajkowski> look em and the the HUD do not get one
<czajkowski> which reminds me
<czajkowski> gord: is in throwing object distance of me
<czajkowski> anyone on 12.10 can cofirm https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gdm/+bug/1049495  or https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/xorg/+bug/1049501
<lubotu3> Ubuntu bug 1049495 in gdm (Ubuntu) "Login screen reports "unauthorized" before I even type a password" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<lubotu3> Ubuntu bug 1049501 in xorg (Ubuntu) "Flashing cursor appears in several random places on the screen" [Undecided,New]
<davmor2> Morning all
<czajkowski> davmor2: ello
<oimon> removing gwibber and gwibber-service is one of the first things i do on a fresh install
<TheOpenSourcerer> oimon: +1
<davmor2> -1
<TheOpenSourcerer> I use Hotot - very nice (and lightweight) compared to Gwibberish
<oimon> i used to, then i realised i don't use twitter much
<oimon> i don't use a client anymore
<oimon> i just check twitter on my phone while i'm waiting for the tube
<oimon> standing at the only bit you can get a signal
<hoover> oli: yep, card is set in and fastened with a screw
<hoover> Oli: Driver version is "ubuntu current" ;-) let me check
<hoover> nvidia 295.40, sorry for the mixup
<popey> czajkowski, you sure bug 1049495 is a gdm issue?
<lubotu3> Launchpad bug 1049495 in gdm (Ubuntu) "Login screen reports "unauthorized" before I even type a password" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1049495
<popey> we dont ship gdm by default
<Oli> hoover: Nothing's jumping out at me. I agree it's probably not power-related and the driver *should* be fine as far as I know.
<Oli> You could upgrade it to 304.43 with the x-swat ppa but there are no guarantees that's any better.
<czajkowski> davmor2: is your envelope thingy gone
<czajkowski> popey: aye I knot tis not default.
<davmor2> czajkowski: no my indicator-messages is still in place
<davmor2> popey: I'm assuming those bugs are related to the new gnome ubuntu cd
<popey> i care not then
<czajkowski> davmor2: hmm mine is gone
<davmor2> czajkowski: check it is installed
<davmor2> czajkowski: or better still sudo apt-get purge indicator-messages && sudo apt-get install ubuntu-desktop indicator-messages and see if it was an upgrade issue
<davmor2> czajkowski: other than that pick on gord not his fault I just like to see him squirm
<oimon> i've been using 304.43 without issue (different card though)
<czajkowski> ahh
<davmor2> popey: mc-launcher top app for last month
<directhex> gwibber was nice once, then it just got heavier and heavier
<hoover> Oli: yep I'll do some more testing, the machine apparently survived the night (12h uptime)
<davmor2> directhex: I found the version in 12.10 to be a lot more responsive I think it has been on a diet with the port process maybe
<cliftonts> Hi everyone
<davmor2> cliftonts: hello
<cliftonts> I've found an odd quirk with 12.10, thought I'd pop on and see if anyone else had it etc
<cliftonts> I've got an old laptop with a broadcom card in it. The card needs to be manually enabled with terminal commands before it works because of the driver issues.
<cliftonts> But this time when I did so it didn't appear to work. There was nothing in the networks list at all.
<cliftonts> I added the network I was connecting to into the network list using the edit screen and it connected up straight away, the networks all showed up and it's worked fine ever since
<cliftonts> I just thought it's odd, since rebooting after installing the drivers usually leaves you with a fully working system and I can see how people may be confused by this new behavious
<cliftonts> *behaviour
<cliftonts> Thanks guys, that really helps!
<czajkowski> cliftonts: or be patient
<czajkowski> people could in fact be working :)
<cliftonts> Really? I find that to be a very bad habit. Try to avoid it if I can!
<cliftonts> I was expecting some sort of response, even something off topic
<BigRedS> generally, if your expecting network manager to do the right thing you're probably going to be surprised
<cliftonts> I was assuming that not everybody on here is going to be at work
<cliftonts> And that not everybody on here is working in IT
<cliftonts> System program problem detected - Do you want to report the problem now?
<cliftonts> That feature is a great idea but it gets old VERY quickly when the machine is in a bad mood!
<davmor2> popey: on quantal do you know how the new addition drivers thing is meant to work?  ie when installing in virtualbox jockey used to say to install the additional drivers for vbox but the new addition drivers lists nothing
<popey> virtualbox driver is broken in 12.10 iirc
<davmor2> popey: ah that might explain it then
<popey> needs updating for next x i think
<popey> feel free to poke people!
<cliftonts> popey: Any chance you could take a quick read of my issue above and tell me if this is a known issue or just my pc?
 * davmor2 pokes christel and czajkowski cause popey told me to....../me wonders off nonchalantly whistling
<popey> cliftonts, you shouldn't have to manually edit to add a network
<popey> it should find them
<davmor2> cliftonts: have you had a look to see if there is a bug for it, if not that might be a good place to start, if you don't see one then it might be your machine but you should still file a bug, but the broadcom driver is a binary blob so there is nothing we can do about it
<popey> sometimes broadcom chips are slow to scan though, so they don't show up immediately
<cliftonts> popey: It does find them but it refused to until I added the first one manually
<popey> maybe it would have done if you waited longer :)
<popey> or it could be a bug
<cliftonts> And bare in mind I'm used to doing that procedure and I've never believed it to have gone wrong before
<popey> but that's not intended behaviour
<davmor2> cliftonts: once you installed the driver did you reboot?
<cliftonts> Perhaps I should re-install and really sit back and watch it
<cliftonts> yes davmor2
<cliftonts> I'm trying to navigate launchpad but I've used it so infrequently I'm a bit lost! lol
<cliftonts> Nope, I've got no idea how to just look at bugs for 12.10
<davmor2> cliftonts: just use google and "ubuntu bugs launchpad broadcom"  and then sift through the results
<cliftonts> I'll have a browse later I think. I should really get back to work. I'll re-install the system and try it again, this time leaving it for an extra long time before giving up on it
<czajkowski> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/broadcom-sta
<cliftonts> Bye then
<czajkowski> you're welcome cliftonts
<cliftonts> Thanks, I'll let you know if it's a bug or me just going mad!
<BigRedS> popey: what was it your thinkpad forward/back buttons were doing wrong? Mine appear to behave as they should everywhere
<popey> triggering hud
<popey> in 12.04
<popey> will try in 12.10
<BigRedS> Ah! I didn't try it in 12.04
<popey> they do nothing in 12.10
<BigRedS> it doesn't seem to in 12.10 but I've already changed the HUD shortcut to something daft so I don't mis-invoke it
<popey> you wouldn't notice it then
<popey> the keys do ALT+Left and ALT+Right
<BigRedS> Ahh
<BigRedS> I suspected as much.
<BigRedS> if I put the HUD key back to alt, the back/forward keys still work
<bigcalm> Good afternoon peeps :)
<hoover> hey biggie
<bigcalm> o.
<bigcalm> o/
<BigRedS> Good morning!
<bigcalm> Nighty night
<MartijnVdS> popey: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/802.3af
<popey> :D
<czajkowski> popey: ROFLOL @ pic
<popey> I feel a bit silly.
<czajkowski> I've seen people do that at times
<oimon> anyone looked at firefox mobile OS?
<oimon> what sort of kernel does it run?
<bigcalm> popey: seen my Dad do that and damage his laptop. On my own, I regularly try to plug USB into the RJ45 socket
<ali1234> oimon: an android kernel
<oimon> ali1234, thanks. even the UI looks like android
<oimon> well, 1.6 android
<ali1234> pretty much yes. but it is html5 and can be run inside desktop mozilla
<popey> ditto bigcalm
<oimon> popey, you get some odd trolls on your g+ posts
<popey> I do?
<popey> the ones about the netbook?
<oimon> looking at the asus post
<oimon> yeah
<davmor2> bigcalm: How do chap
<bigcalm> davmor2: rought. Woke myself and Hayley up with a coughing fit around 4am last night
<davmor2> bigcalm: :( not good, is it a dry tickly cough?
<czajkowski> oimon: lotta trolls out there :/
<oimon> although a certain fabian is the worst of the lot!
<czajkowski> he's blocked :)
<czajkowski> at least on my feed
<oimon> see his comments on popey's steam g+ update
<oimon> trolltastic
<czajkowski> nope I dont see them as I have him blocked
<ali1234> oh come on now. popey is trolling us on G+ every day anyway
<oimon> oh, g+ also blocks their comments? cool
<popey> lol
<bigcalm> davmor2: no, is a phlegmy cough
<oimon> robert kryten llewellyn is complaining on his feed that he is bombarded with "use ubuntu" comments every time he has a tech question
<oimon> i think its because of the comments on https://plus.google.com/u/0/+RobertLlewellyn/posts/75dKwLUyYHV
<oimon> shows that he has a high number of opensource followers :)
<ali1234> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GlHeZO7ZzEg&feature=youtube_gdata
<ali1234> is this perhaps the most pointless thing ever?
<ali1234> love how he can't find the @ on the OSK
<mgdm> ali1234: not far off
<oimon> ali1234, what a waste of electricity
<oimon> i'll never understand the fact that coke are one of the biggest companies on the planet
<BigRedS> well, it's not like keyboard layouts are standardised...
<oimon> have they stumbled upon a universally enjoyed drink? or are people just doing what they are told? or monopoly?
<dwatkins> popey: I was looking for an ancient page about running a secondary X server, and found an entry on commandlinefu.com which cites the Ubuntu UK podcast as a related site :)
<shauno> oh gosh, I used to have that working.  :0 on nvidia dualhead and :1 on the composite tvout.
<BigRedS> oimon: it's hard to argue that there's a monopoly going on
<BigRedS> I'd blame marketing largely
<popey> dwatkins, they link to us on every page :D
<dwatkins> popey: haha ok
<dwatkins> shauno: yeah, I remember reading about someone who had :0 for himself, and :1 for his kids to play games on; we were discussing in the office having a honeypot X server for someone who might come along and try to mess with your machine if it's not locked
<popey> we frequently run multiple x servers
<popey> thats what happens when you switch user
<dwatkins> OpenSuSE had a neat mechanism of creating an X session for each remote user
<dwatkins> I think it was via VNC
<oimon> xdmcp used to be the way to do it
<oimon> e.g. http://www.centos.org/docs/5/html/5.2/Installation_Guide/s2-trouble-remotex.html
<dwatkins> is that where you run the server and connect remotely to an X client running your actual apps?
<dwatkins> ah yes, -query
<dwatkins> first unix machine I used was a dumb X terminal :D
<AlanBell> yeah, sad that it is so broken these days
<dwatkins> I assumed there were simply more efficient ways to remotely display now
<oimon> on solaris i used to do it quite a bit
<oimon> i use freenx nowadays
<oimon> but it's slightly different, but cool in that you can resume/suspend sessions
<dwatkins> we used to boot the X Terminals off a separate system when the local server was down, you had to know the hexadecimal equivalent of the remote machine's IP address, but it allowed you to get work done when the rest of the room was unable to function :)
<oimon> and highly efficient bandwidth
<dwatkins> yeah, NX seems to be the fastest for what I use it for, over my ADSL connection
<TheOpenSourcerer> ssh -X
<oimon> dwatkins, i used to used NCD dumb diskless soplaris terminals
<oimon> they rocked
<oimon> they ran an X display on the terminal
<dwatkins> oimon: I think the ones I used were NCD also, great big sreens and the shared machine was a Solaris box
<oimon> on 10mb ethernet
<dwatkins> *screens
<oimon> i used them on a trading floor in a bank
<oimon> what's this excess flood ^^
<dwatkins> http://www.greenend.org.uk/rjk/gallery/photos/xterminal - 2nd image on here (note: high resolution)
<oimon> ah. good old days. they could fall on the floor and be OK
<oimon> unlike my pc yesterday which fell over and i lost all data
<dwatkins> I had all my applications set to start at login with specific places on the display
<oimon> yep :D
<dwatkins> we compiled fvwm so we could use it instead of whatever the default was
<oimon> and if the X display crashed the titlebar disappeared, just like compiz :D
<oimon> default was openwindows which was awesome
<oimon> fvwm is based off it
<oimon> over 10yr ago now
<oimon> the 90s was fun
<dwatkins> ah yes, I rel fvwm[2]
<dwatkins> oops, I meant to write that I really liked it
 * mgdm used fvwm2 in Uni
<dwatkins> little did I know I'd end up supporting 4Dwm for a living ;)
<mgdm> the machines had KDE of some sort on, too, but they were too slow
<dwatkins> I still run xplanet to this day, as many of the fvwm screenshots use
<dwatkins> http://www.catb.org/~esr/fvwm2/bluesteel.png
<dwatkins> whatever happened to the image viewer 'xv'?
<dwatkins> oh wait, that's xearth - old skool ;)
<dwatkins> ah, wikipedia tells all
<oimon> xv -root allowed you to set wallpaper :)
<oimon> linux seemed so different to the strict world of soalris
<oimon> when i first came across it in 1999
<oimon> ah, aug 1998
<andrews> Hey all - would anyone be able to tell me, roughly, how to connect my brand new installation of 11.04 (latest didnt work very well) laptop to my works windows 2003 server network (I know my unser names, the domain name etc I just dont know how to 'get there')
<BigRedS> what do you mean by 'connect'?
<BigRedS> filesharing? AD? printers?
<AlanBell> in nautilus go to file-connect to server, change from public FTP to windows share and fill in the details
<oimon> andrews, do you mean login to the pc using your AD credentials?
<andrews> Not sure BigReds - Ive no idea, I usually connect to the network with a windows based user name and password, which gets me the shared drives and my outlook emails etc.  I just want to be able to do whatever is nearest to that on this ubuntu laptop - which I have got connected via ethernet cable to our works network ports
<andrews> Our IT guys love the look of ubuntu and are keen to see it working (one is stood over my shoulder at present) though they know nothing about it
<diplo> ~Anyone play with Samba much ?
<diplo> @ 10.04 stage or maybe earlier there was software that let you auth
<oimon> andrews, you can do some quite tight integration, but in the least you should be able to open the file manager and click connect to server, choose windows share and enter your user/domain/password/server
 * diplo googles
<oimon> likewise
<AlanBell> andrews: getting stuff to talk to exchange can be non-trivial
<oimon> centrify
 * popey wants http://www.lifespanfitness.com/treadmill-desk/tr1200-dt-treadmill-desk.html one of them
<diplo> oimon: has it
<oimon> argh i just realised that my nslu2 which was graphing my current cost energy monitor usage got turned off 2 months ago
<oimon> linux mint failed to install on my desktop the other day..i thought they nicked a lot of ubuntu stuff..obviously not enough. not even the / partition was bootable so it would never boot. i gave up when it that still didn't work after fixing that
<oimon> usually the only linux i struggle with installing is opensuse
<oimon> quite fun to plot the temperature in my house over the year http://ubuntuone.com/1dJiVA76MAFOnwFWfYoxDj
<arsen> anyone any idea why vnc is generating loads of .pid and .log files ? when i connect to it..
<diplo> oimon: You guys use samba at all ?
<oimon> used to a lot over the last 10 yrs
<oimon> got a problem?
<diplo> l-elecbase nmbd[3709]: [2012/09/12 15:26:33, 0] nmbd/nmbd_incomingrequests.c:process_name_refresh_request(173)
<diplo> Sep 12 15:26:33 asl-elecbase nmbd[3709]:   Error - should be sent to WINS server
<diplo> Got lot's of servers getting filled with that
<diplo> It's all coming from a customer site that we are permanently VPN'd into
<diplo> I can't find a good result as to why it's publishing from the customers site to lot's of our dev servers
<diplo> I'd understand if it was between 2 machines both running wins or pushing it both ways, but we are only receiving those requests to our servers
<oimon> does broadcast traffic travel across the vpn?
<diplo> yeah
<oimon> intentionally?
<diplo> If I could have better google foo I could find a better solution
<diplo> Nope, well I haven't really checked the setup if I am honest
<oimon> http://lists.samba.org/archive/samba/2010-March/154217.html
<oimon> ?
<diplo> Idevelop mainly, but I'm finding it hard to debug as most of our /var/log/messages are getting filled with this
<oimon> "Ensure that your XP system knows where to find the WINS server"
<diplo> yeah, I read that one, so could be the clients aren't set up correctly at the customer sites, what I don't understand is why non wins servers are getting the data to there messages file ?
<diplo> Not sure if we still require a wins server either
<oimon> prob not since dns will resolve things for you. there's an order that windows machines try to resolve in
<diplo> Use of WINS (either Samba WINS or MS Windows NT Server WINS) is highly recommended
<diplo> from Samba doc, but it doesn't explain very well why it is 'highly recommended' :)
<bigcalm> I do wish that "YouTube personal digests" didn't kill Thunderbird :(
<oimon> diplo, it appears always on samba machines?
<diplo> It's off by default according to samba manual i read earlier
<diplo> So someone has turned it on I'm guessing.
<diplo> Going to turn it off and restart samba, see if that improves things
<oimon> testparm will dump your samba server settings
<diplo> Hmm, well that made 0 difference
<oimon> did you restart nmbd?
<oimon> or just smbd
<diplo> yeah, restarting smb restarts both
<czajkowski> popey: got any pope relations in Cork ?
<oimon> is black mesas based off HL1 or 2?
<oimon> looks fun. warning contains some sweary words http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=muzAyaTNQeE#!
<adam_> hi
<adam_> hi
<czajkowski> BigRedS: ping
<BigRedS> czajkowski: pong!
<BigRedS> I've not sent anything yet :( Been horrendously busy...
<BigRedS> HUD is waaaay less annoying in 12.10 than 12.04 though
<popey> czajkowski, no idea
<czajkowski> popey: https://twitter.com/popecork  he started to follow today
<xnox> BigRedS: well.... compiz is less enthusiastic at stealing Alt+<Key> key presses....
<oimon> does anyone know how to do a reverse image search in google?
<oimon> wow http://images.google.com/imghp?hl=en
<oimon> cool
<AlanBell> tineye is what you want for reverse image search
<AlanBell> then again you can drag and drop images onto google image search and it does it
<oimon> i dragged a picture of my dog and it killed my machine :(
<oimon> i remeber when linux was rock solid
<TheOpenSourcerer> oimon: Linux still is - Unity isn't ;-)
<oimon> i'm on cinnamon
<oimon> the problem was chrome though
<TheOpenSourcerer> ha
 * SuperEngineer admires oimon's diagnostic skills
<SuperEngineer> ;)
<diplo> Any email server peeps/dovecot people here ?
<diplo> Wondering why my server isn't connecting to sql
<diplo> auth-worker(default): mysql: Connected to 127.0.0.1 (mail)
<diplo> Should display that, but it's not... can't see any errors
<mattt> mysql down?  :P
<diplo> If only it were that easy :/
<diplo> dovecot starts, but not showing it, try telneting to localhost pop3 and it's not displaying either
 * diplo wonders whether to do a fresh install on VPS and start again
<diplo> ooh may have found something in logs
<mattt> whatcha got?
<diplo> dovecot: pop3-login: Fatal: Can't load ssl_cert: There is no valid PEM certificate. (You probably forgot '<' from ssl_cert=</etc/ssl/certs/dovecot.pem)
<diplo> Hmm still didn't make a difference :/
<mattt> diplo: may need to crank up some debugging
 * diplo still going
<diplo> dovecot-mysql missing I'm hoping ( these guides suck! )
<jacobw> http://workaround.org/ispmail/squeeze
<diplo> I followed that first, the one I'm using worked fine for 10.04, but seems to have been a fair few changes for 12.04
<diplo> rah \o/
<diplo> One part fixed
<diplo> Still doesn't say it's connected to sql but...
<diplo> +OK Dovecot ready.
<diplo> \o/
<diplo> Break for 5 mins I think
<diplo> At least
<diplo> ooer At least Im learning*
<ali1234> has anyone ever done this genealogy stuff?
<jacobw> i have dovecot working with mysql on 10.04
<ali1234> i'm looking at gramps and it looks ok but a bit like 1990s shareware
<diplo> jacobw: yeah i did as well
<davmor2> ali1234: and that is the updated version
<ali1234> i want something that works like web 2.0
<diplo> upgraded now, and some configs etc have hanged and a few guides not changed some of that
<ali1234> like you tag people in photos etc
<ali1234> drag a box around them
<ali1234> like facebook for genealogy
<ali1234> but not some "cloud" thing
<ali1234> like maybe i could set up a diaspora server and make an account for all the people
<davmor2> ali1234: gramps is the only one to use on linux everything else sucks, there are a load of web based ones but they are fairly expensive iirc
<ali1234> or maybe there is a mediawiki plugin or something, that adds these features to it?
<ali1234> basically i just want a wikipage for each person's bio, with autogenerated skeleton pages with relationships auto filled, and photo tagging with auto galleries
<davmor2> ali1234: you can add photo's to a person in your tree in gramps as I understand it,  Big Ron would be the person to talk to really about it though but he is rarely on irc nowadays
<ali1234> yes you can
<ali1234> but you can't do it by "tagging" them like you do on facebook or G+
<ali1234> you add the image to the person rather than adding the person (people) to the image
<ali1234> so imagine a group shot
<ali1234> you have to add that to each person in the image
<ali1234> and then there is no record of who is who
<ali1234> i have a lot of photos with like 20 people in them
<davmor2> ali1234: crap outta luck then dude I think they all work pretty much the same way
<ali1234> there's actually an open feature request for this in gramps
<ali1234> maybe i can program an add-on
<ali1234> to merge a web gallery type thing, and have it pull the list of names available for tagging from gramps
<ali1234> it is python, so should be quite easy
<Azelphur> ali1234: so I just found out that nvidia implemented BaseMosaic and soft limited it to 3 monitors
<Azelphur> I gave a couple of nvidia employees a verbal beating over it \o/
<ali1234> i have no idea what that means
<Azelphur> ali1234: proper multi monitor support across multiple cards, what I've been waiting for for years.
<mgdm> You're good at your 'verbal beating' thing of late
<Azelphur> hehe
<Azelphur> mgdm: I gave someone else a verbal beating recently?
<mgdm> someone from eBay, someone from Amazon...?
<ali1234> 3 monitors is better
<ali1234> they only support 2 on most old cards
<Azelphur> mgdm: haha, good point :P
<Azelphur> ali1234: yea, but 295 was bugged and the limit was removed, 304 works
<Azelphur> so it seems like they've literally just imposed an arbitrary limit to force people to buy newer hardware
<ali1234> time to patch it then
<Azelphur> ali1234: or just finally bite the bullet and buy the displayport gear and drop my 6990 in
<Azelphur> :p
<diplo> woot, received email \o/
<diplo> Think I need to write this up :(
<czajkowski> anyone know why if you have your earphones plugged into the laptop and then shut down and  next time you power up mnus headphones sound is muted...
<MartijnVdS> because bug?
<mattt> MartijnVdS: did you vote?
<czajkowski> popey: pay back can you do the EUR symbol here
<czajkowski> I need to copy n paste
<popey> â¬
<popey> alt gr + 4
<bigcalm> Good evening peeps :)
<brobostigon> good evening bigcalm :)
<bigcalm> o/
<brobostigon> o/
<davmor2> bigcalm how you doing now
<bigcalm> So so davmor2
<davmor2> :-(
<bigcalm> Grumpy that I'm off to London tomorrow afternoon
<czajkowski> popey: cheers
<popey> \o/ London
<bigcalm> -_-
<mattt> bigcalm: sorry to hear that :(
<mattt> i went to shoreditch on sunday, was crazy
<mattt> couldn't wait to get out
<bigcalm> Attending a Symfony conference on Friday
<mattt> well, at least that should be fun :)
<christel> aw but you love london
<davmor2> bigcalm down to london again what did it do to endure you assaulting it
<bigcalm> 08:00 - Registration & breakfast
<bigcalm> I hear that there will be bacon and egg rolls for breakfast
<mgdm> anyone here going to OSHcamp at the weekend?
<bigcalm> davmor2: I didn't make enough people ill. Attempting to inflict more damage this time
<christel> :o
<bigcalm> I'd better be 100% healthy for the end of next week though
<christel> mgdm: it is too north!
<bigcalm> mgdm: never heard of it, wassat?
<bigcalm> mgdm: in any case, not me. I'll be attending wedding fairs...
<christel> bigcalm: open source hardware camp petal
<bigcalm> christel: I see :)
<christel> i am so tired
<bigcalm> I hope I'm as fragrant as a petal
<bigcalm> christel: relax, it's the evening. Ignore the fact I'm still working :)
<mgdm> christel: BS. It's like 3 hours south of here :)
<christel> hehe i have just made myself a coffee!
<christel> (first one of the day)
<czajkowski> catching up on listening to UUPC
<bigcalm> christel: try and drink this one
<davmor2> christel first coffee at bedtime sounds wrong somehow
<czajkowski> that add or weird future thing is weird still not sure what it was for
<bigcalm> czajkowski: me too, 4 eps to go
<czajkowski> oh dear
<czajkowski> there is more
<bigcalm> :)
<czajkowski> noooooo
<christel> davmor2: tell me about it! the toddler of doom has had me running around in circles all day, no time for coffee!
<davmor2> You should of called him kazack if his surname is doom :-)
<christel> haha
<davmor2> Anyway ladies and gents night night
<christel> nn davmorius my dear
<christel> <3
 * MartijnVdS watches the election results
<MartijnVdS> davmor2: Khazad.
<Azelphur> has EE set a date for their 4G launch yet, or a coverage map?
<diplo> daubers: You online ?
<bigcalm> Sleeeep
<brobostigon> nos da everyone, sleep well.
<diplo> http://www.speedtest.net/result/2176095766.png
<diplo> Time to upgrade to fibre :(
<diplo> gn all
<Seeker`> Azelphur: October I think. And 'in big cities' is as much as I've been able to find
<Azelphur> I see
<Seeker`> Azelphur: getting an iphone 5?
<Azelphur> Seeker`: no rofl
<Azelphur> already have an S3, why would I want a downgrade? ;)
<Seeker`> Azelphur: meh, can't be bothered with childish samsung fanboys :P
<Azelphur> Seeker`: it's not a fanboy thing it's fact, have you not looked at the specs?
<Azelphur> GS3 is better or equal to iphone 5 in every way o.O
<Azelphur> apart from 4g which is useless to me as it probably won't be available near me in the next few years
<Azelphur> margate is always last when it comes to things like that D:
<Seeker`> Mali graphics cores aren't anywhere near as good as the ones the iphones use :P
<Azelphur> Seeker`: got any benchmarks for that?
<Seeker`> http://www.glbenchmark.com/compare.jsp?benchmark=glpro25&showhide=true&certified_only=1&D1=Samsung%20GT-I9300%20Galaxy%20S%20III&D2=Apple%20iPhone%204S
<Azelphur> fun
<Azelphur> the s3 does win in a couple of those but overall the iphone seems to have it, I wonder how the iphone 5 compares
<mgdm> I would imagine better in a couple of regards
<Azelphur> probably
<Seeker`> Apple state that the iphone 5 has 2x the graphics performance of the chip the iphone 4s uses
<mgdm> the main reason I didn't get a new Android phone is that most of them are the size of a clipboard these days
<mgdm> </troll :P>
<Azelphur> I wonder how well it appears in actual game benchmarks :)
<Azelphur> mgdm: haha, galaxy note do it! :P
<Seeker`> Azelphur: The graphics chip in iphones is just better
<Azelphur> seems so
<Azelphur> in other benchmarks the S3 flies ahead, like browser benchmarks etc, but they are all cpu benchmarks
<Azelphur> I'd be interested to see some game benchmarks as I say :)
<Seeker`> Azelphur: GLbench is an accurate(ish) representation of game scenes you find on mobile devices at the moment
<Seeker`> http://www.glbenchmark.com/the-benchmark.jsp
<Azelphur> I see
<Azelphur> well that's interesting to know :)
<Seeker`> watched the video halfway down the page?
 * Azelphur watches
<Azelphur> I'm downloading glbench on my s3 too, gonna give it a whirl
<MartijnVdS> S3 ViRGE?
<directhex> S3 Trio V64+
<mgdm> Amazon S3?
#ubuntu-uk 2012-09-13
<jabulmer12_> #ubuntu
<jabulmer12_> ChanServ
<AlanBell> morning all
<pinky-> good morning to you too
<diplo> Morning all
<christel> morning lovelies
<MartijnVdS> \o christel
<MartijnVdS> how's you
<christel> MartijnVdS :D
<christel> i am well! bit sleepy, happily slept through the alarm this morning and ended up with a rather stressful start to the day!
 * MartijnVdS is on his first cup o'tea
<JamesTait> Good morning all! :-D
<MartijnVdS> \o JamesTait
<JamesTait> MartijnVdS: o/
<MartijnVdS> dear compiz/unity.. please stop half-maximizing my terminal
<AlanBell> anyone else find unity randomly flicks to mirrored displays after logging in?
<MartijnVdS> (I've already used ccsm to disable the bottom corners for "half screen" resize)
 * MartijnVdS has no mirrored display to test
<AlanBell> so you get a useful dual display at different resolutions for a minute or so, then suddenly it goes to the lowest common denominator
<AlanBell> and mirrors, which is almost entirely useless
<daubers> diplo: hello
<diplo> Hi daubers
<diplo> Sorry was making a cuppa and nattering :)
<daubers> diplo: You where after me yesterday?
<diplo> I was just wondering if you would care to share how you utilised bitfolks spamassasin setup ? Googled it las tnight and your blog post was a result :)
<diplo> Just set up my mail server last night and was going to add spamassasin check
<czajkowski> aloha
<brobostigon> good morning eveyrone.
<bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
<brobostigon> good morning bigcalm :)
<bigcalm> Hi brobostigon :)
<bigcalm> Once again I am turning up the volume on my drum & bass so that it drowns out the screaming tantrums coming from next door's child
<daubers> diplo: Ah... I don't anymore :)
<daubers> diplo: got fedup of running my own mailserver and updates nerfing the config everytime
<pinky-> bigcalm maybe it's your drum and bass making the child nextdoor scream? :)
<bigcalm> pinky-: not unless the child is wearing my headphones
<christel> whyfor they tantrum so much?
<diplo> no worries daubers
<bigcalm> christel: maybe because they don't get the attention they used to
<czajkowski> bigcalm: you know that may not be helping to calm the situation next door right
<bigcalm> czajkowski: ?
<czajkowski> the noise
<bigcalm> What noise?
<pinky-> they say binge drinking parents affect 1 in 3 children in the UK
<bigcalm> czajkowski: I'm wearing headphones
<czajkowski> ah k does the speaker still not vibrate a bit ?
<bigcalm> czajkowski: what speaker?
<bigcalm> I'm rather confused
<czajkowski> ok nm
<czajkowski> lets drop it
<bigcalm> :)
<mattt> haha
<daubers> stupid chroot
<daubers> chroot: failed to run command `/bin/bash': No such file or directory
<daubers> thats annoying
<daubers> IT DOES EXIST DAMN YOU
<mattt> maybe it's linked to something that doesn't exist?
<christel> bigcalm: why did they stop getting the attention they used to? did you use to entertain them? :P
<mattt> (ldd /bin/bash ?)
<daubers> all seems to exist
<bigcalm> christel: o.O
<bigcalm> christel: they moved in last week. It's been tantrums ever since. Children suck
<czajkowski> bigcalm: no they don't not at all, you're just rather anti them
<bigcalm> czajkowski: it's the noise. I'm happy not to have to deal with them
<czajkowski> I'm sur ethey could think the same about you
<bigcalm> I'm not anti them, just glad I'm not required to continue human existence ;)
<daubers> so apparently bash shouldn't be working on the host os as linux-vdso.so.1 is a myth
<pinky-> I would just try to ignore them and hoped one day they might just go away
<pinky-> distruptive families have a habit of moving a lot
<czajkowski> ye have no idea whats going n ther
<czajkowski> *e
<czajkowski> perhaps the poor kid is upset at the move and isn't used to their area
<czajkowski> give the kid a break bigcalm
<pinky-> maybe
<czajkowski> move is stressful on adults  can be hard for kids too
<bigcalm> My turning up my music is me ignoring them
<christel> bigcalm: aaah moving is a bit unsettling
<pinky-> yeah I agree, now you mention it
<christel> i have massive tantrums whenever i move
<christel> :D
<bigcalm> :D
<christel> im not even jesting :)
<mungojerry> if you drew a graph of tantrums during life, it would peak at age 2, unles you are an actor where it remains constat afterwards too
<christel> the boy wonder was much calmer about the whole moving thing than i was
<christel> he was just all "HEY THIS IS MY NEW HOUSE, AWESOME *RUN RUN RUN*"
<christel> i am waiting for tantrum-hell
<christel> i can count the ones he's had thus far on one hand and fear for the day where it becomes more frequent :x
<daubers> urgh... loads of softlinks missing
<christel> (which if mungojerry is correct should be soon!)
<mungojerry> had about 10 yesterday
<Laney> the terrible twos!
<pinky-> then trublesum threes
<Laney> feisty fours?
<christel> hehe
<christel> mungojerry: when abouts do they tend to start proper? what age? :)
<mungojerry> 2
<christel> the boy has 5 months left before he's 3! we've had maybe 3 tantrums in total so far, will it suddenly pick up ? :)
<mungojerry> wow, strange
<mungojerry> as soon as cnadles were lit, boom
<christel> haha
<mungojerry> they push all the way, making irrational requests
<czajkowski> aunt has a almost 3 year old, her twos were full of tantrums, the aunt would just leave her and walk away and she learnt very fast they wouldnt be tolerated
<popey> we had a tiny bit of "terrible twos"
<popey> but not much
<bigcalm> popey: did Sam have fewer or more tantrums because of having an older sister?
<bigcalm> Oh
<bigcalm> popey: did Sam have fewer or more tantrums because of having an older sister?
<popey> no, sam had more than sophie
<bigcalm> (compared to Sophie)
<popey> but still not loads
<bigcalm> Ah
<bigcalm> Maybe boys have more? Who knows
<mungojerry> my boy is quite spirited
<mungojerry> like his parents
<bigcalm> Every time I've driving my car this week, there has been at least one diversion. Different each time. I won't if my car is cursed
<mungojerry> and we don't give in
<christel> i guess part of the reason why we have very few (so far) is that it is just him so he has all the attention, all of the time
<popey> i was watching a ben goldacre clip on the bbc website the other day.. sam was in the room sat on the floor playing, heard a bit in the programme about god..
<mungojerry> well he tried walking down stiars yesterday in a way that would have proabably killed him, so either he does it properly or somethings gonna happen
<popey> "hey, daddy, you don't believe in god do you?", "no", "Me and mummy and sophie do", "Really? Interesting. What do you think god is?", "Uhhhhhh"
<christel> <3 sam
<bigcalm> Heh
<christel> he is so cute
<mungojerry> going to church is my boy's highlight of the week, he loves it. me too actually
<christel> i am rubbish at talking with kids but i like sam and sophie, they can hold proper conversations!
<popey> I dont think sam and sophie have been to church other than other peoples wedding/christenings
<mungojerry> my boy said yesterday, "when i am a big man i can grow beard and open front door"
<czajkowski> christel: aye popey kids are very cute and sooo polite
<christel> czajkowski: yah! i like them, they are funny :D
<popey> the school helps a lot there
<popey> little things like they have to shake hands with the teacher at the end of every day
<czajkowski> oh nice
<czajkowski> very nice
<popey> i met some random person in a pub, a while back at a party, she was ~15, and she introduced herself to me, and put her hand out to shake
<popey> she went to the same school :)
<czajkowski> anyone want to earn karma - https://answers.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+question/208450
<czajkowski> popey: nice
<popey> little things like that are great for their confidence
<czajkowski> it's true though, the manners we pick up as children can and do define you growing up
<christel> nice
<popey> when in pubs we always get the kids to order their own food and when waiters ask how it was we get them to tell the waiter :)
<mungojerry> i was in the dentist at age 25 and got out of the chair to swill my mouth out
<mungojerry> the dentist laughed his head off
<popey> heh
<mungojerry> he told me thats what children do because they can't reach
<mungojerry> i'd learned that behaviiour but didn't know why
<czajkowski> heh
<bigcalm> USB TTL thingy just came in the post. Do I work or spend the day trying to fix my WNDR3800? Ah, forgot I don't have the right screw driver though :|
<popey> bigcalm, my mate has boxed up the wndr3700, want me to get him to ship it direct to you?
<bigcalm> popey: Unless he's a long distance from you, I could pick it up next week?
<popey> he's in newbury
<popey> lemme see how we can get it from hom
<popey> *him
 * bigcalm goes to find out where newbury is
<bigcalm> Oh, I see. I could pick it up on of the days I'm down
<popey> my mate works in uxbridge, which you might be able to pass on the way out
<popey> when are you down?
<popey> and when are you going back, and driving or train?
<bigcalm> popey: Thursday to Sunday
<bigcalm> Driving
<popey> i might be able to get it next friday
<popey> lemme think
<bigcalm> !ping
<lubotu3> another contentless ping... sigh...
 * bigcalm kicks argos.com
<christel> JamesTait \o/
<JamesTait> christel: Hello dahling!
<christel> how art thou? :P)
<JamesTait> christel: Cold. :(
<JamesTait> So making myself feel better with a cup of hot rooibos and a chocolate chip muffin.
<christel> aww
<christel> oo muffin
<davmor2> Morning all
<JamesTait> davmor2: o/
<christel> davmor2: did you bring me a muffin? :)
<davmor2> JamesTait: morning and belated happy birthday
<JamesTait> THank you davmor2. :)
<JamesTait> I'm now closer to 40 than 30.
<bigcalm> My laptop's update manager is really struggling to up date its cache :(
<davmor2> christel: no but I tell you what next time I'm down soowwwwffff or your up here, I'll take time out to give you a muffin or an eclair or a Doughnut hmmmmm doughnut
<bigcalm> Morning davmor2
<davmor2> morning bigcalm
<mungojerry> bigcalm, i get that a lot on systems with mutiple DEs installed
<mungojerry> yesterday popcon shagged my machine for a while
<mungojerry> but usually it's apt-xapian-index
<bigcalm> I get the feeling that my DNS is buggered (even though I'm using Google)
<bigcalm> Is http://www.diy.com/ (B & Q) full of broken images for anybody else?
<davmor2> bigcalm: looks fine here dude
<bigcalm> Tis me then
<bigcalm> o.O
<popey> waiting for diy.com....
<davmor2> bigcalm: try a different browser
<popey> loaded in the end
<davmor2> grisial: what the????
<grisial> davmor2: now also available in welsh!
<gord> i'm just dubbed in welsh
<czajkowski> gord: ello
<gord> hiho
<davmor2> czajkowski: prod, prod, proddington, prodly proddington-smythe, hello :) Have a hug I feel like scaring you :)
<czajkowski> bleugh
<pinky-> I've currently got the 'not sure what to do' vibe
<pinky-> bored
<popey> I can help you fix that
<pinky-> any suggestions?
<bigcalm> Know any python? ;)
<popey> http://popey.me/Q4SAVs
<popey> http://popey.me/SZi1Ik
<popey> click those, find bugs, fix :)
<pinky-> me clicks
<pinky-> damn there's a lot
<popey> sorted by heat order
<popey> i.e. most affected users at the top
<mungojerry> how much clearance should there be in an office walkway next to a fire escape?
<bigcalm> More than none?
<daubers> mungojerry: Can you run down the middle while screaming in panic waving your arms in the air?
<mungojerry> daubers, i might, but the printer somebody has placed there might get knocked over
<bigcalm> mungojerry: do so to prove the point
<daubers> mungojerry: start a fire and try it?
<bigcalm> Cat swinging is also a useful guide
<diplo> mungojerry: Big company ?
<mungojerry> yes
<mungojerry> i want to move the printer but i need justification
<mungojerry> people come and talk right by my desk
<mungojerry> but it is next to a fire escape on a dodgy ikea table
<daubers> mungojerry: set fire to the ptiner?
<mungojerry> that is too small for it
<daubers> urgh
<daubers> s/ptiner/printer
<diplo> Ask the H&S person to do a assesment :) I used to have to do them all the time :/
<mungojerry> if they say no, then i miht be stuck with it
<mungojerry> i might just move it and people will assume if was H&S
<diplo> heh, risk assessment was the work i was looking for
<diplo> http://www.hse.gov.uk/contact/faqs/riskassess.htm
<ali1234> what's the deal with bug 346386? the original report has a patch, it's marked fix released, yet there are duplicate bugs constantly since the original report and people still reporting it
<lubotu3> Launchpad bug 346386 in apt (Ubuntu Precise) "[MASTER] Update fails with invalid package files with "Encountered a section with no Package: header"" [Undecided,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/346386
<mattt> pinky-: http://www.udacity.com/
 * pinky- clicks
<mungojerry> running iotop -b -o is quite enlightening..
<pinky-> I'm now sat eating lunch whilst watching python videos and not so bored - thanks!
 * bigcalm hugs christel
<popey> heh, i just got a global notice in thunderbird from christel
<popey> i forgot that i connected it to freenode
<popey> must have been connecting every day for some weeks
<christel> haha
<christel> someone told us off for the global "not just saying that you were being ddosed" i dare say it did say that, just in christelese
 * Laney tickles popey_tb 
<popey_tb> hehe
<bigcalm> I still don't see the point of irc via an email client, but that's just me
<DJones> bigcalm: +1 to that, but I guess its no different to irc via pidgeon or a web interface, if it suits people , they'll go with it
<mungojerry> can someone run " sudo iotop -b -o | grep jbd" and let me know the average %
<mungojerry> (non invasive command)
<Laney> people should be suspicious when you ask them to run random commands, especially ones with sudo in
<Laney> you probably want to explain what it is
<DJones> mungojerry: http://privatepaste.com/62cabc7b51
<BigRedS> mungojerry: https://gist.github.com/3714038
<mungojerry> it outputs the % age of i/o taken by the journaling process
<mungojerry> thanks chaps. on a quiet system mine is quite busy
<mungojerry> looks a bit like BigRedS results
<mungojerry> how does unity do the printer config? i get bug 871985
<czajkowski> bug #871985
<czajkowski> bah bot
<daubers> bah bah botsheep ?
<lubotu3`> Launchpad bug 871985 in gnome-control-center (Ubuntu) "The printing panel shouldn't display errors about firewalld not running" [Low,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/871985
<mungojerry> not a low bug IMO, however not sure if it affects unity users
<AlanBell> for my user I have a unity laucher on every monitor whether I want it or not, however in a guest session I can choose which monitor it goes on and it actually does go there
<AlanBell> any idea what I should be cleaning out to get my profile working right?
<Kami> I just edited a file with root priviledges but I get error message: " Error opening file /etc .../default: permission denied - the file on disk may now be truncated" - any idea why ?
<Kami> 2nd question: instead of using gnu nano 2.2.6  as editor, I want to use geany as standard code editor, is there a way to set that it as default ?
<MartijnVdS> Kami: how did you edit the file?
<Kami> mart - in gnu nano 2.2.6, I made the changes, I am trying to save them.
<MartijnVdS> the exact command please :)
<Kami> mart - I don't understand the question. The file opened and I modified it.
<MartijnVdS> yes
<MartijnVdS> how did you open the file?
<MartijnVdS> I assume you typed something in a terminal window..
<MartijnVdS> what did you type? :)
<Kami> sudo nano /etc/apache2/site-available/default - my password here
<MartijnVdS> Kami: so you put your password on the same line as sudo?
<MartijnVdS> or did you do:
<MartijnVdS> sudo nano /etc/apache2/site-available/default
<MartijnVdS> and then it asked for your password and you entered it
<MartijnVdS> You made a typo in the file name -- it's "sites-available" (plural "sites"), hence you're editing a non-existent file
<MartijnVdS> which shows up empty in the editor
<Kami> M - right about the typo, I got the second option where I was asked for my password on another line
<Kami> as I said, I just want to save the modifications and use geany as default as opposed to gnu nano 2.2.6
<MartijnVdS> good :) you should never have to type your password on a command line
<MartijnVdS> you could use 'sudo geany /etc/apache2/etc.etc.'
<MartijnVdS> instead of 'sudo nano'
<diplo> shouldn't you use gksudo ? ?
<AlanBell> no
<diplo> I rarely use gui apps now a days
<AlanBell> nano isn't a gui app so sudo is fine
<MartijnVdS> I use a web browser and terminals :)
<MartijnVdS> and rhythmbox
<Kami> m - ok thanks. Why am I not able to save the file ?
<MartijnVdS> AlanBell: bug geany might be
<diplo> No he wants for Geany AlanBell
<AlanBell> ah, ok
<MartijnVdS> Kami: because the directory /etc/apache2/site-available does not exist, you have to save in a directory that exists
<Kami> M - I have the file in front of me - with the right content - so shouldn't I be able to save the changes ?
<BigRedS> you can, but not into a directory that doesn't exist
<AlanBell> the bit I find curious is that "The file on disk may now be truncated!" is a geany error message, not a nano one
<Kami> wow ... so even though a directory does not exist, it opens a file inside that dir with the exact same content as a file in another directory ?
<AlanBell> in nano you just get no write permission turning up at the bottom just above the menu
<AlanBell> Kami: no, it should be fine
<AlanBell>   [ Read 36 lines (Warning: No write permission) ] is what you should see in nano if you open the file without sudo access
<AlanBell> and it should be able to save it if you do have sudo access
<MartijnVdS> ah
<AlanBell> is the directory mounted in a strange way?
<MartijnVdS> so Kami isn't telling us the whole story :)
<AlanBell> like it is mounted over sshfs or something?
<MartijnVdS> AlanBell: I think he might have opened the file in geany (without sudo)
<MartijnVdS> AlanBell: if you say that's a geany error...
<Kami> M -  I did not create the directory and I did not create the file. It's def a geany problem since I don't know the gnu command to save modifications of a file
<AlanBell> right, so go to the directory and do gksudo geany default
<AlanBell> and it will work, if you don't start geany with root permissions you will get that error, which is a complete lie, nothing will be truncated
<AlanBell> but that error is in the geany source code
<Kami> I am sorry, I am a newbie, I will start  from scratch, type sudo geany /etc/apache2/etc.etc.' - edit the file and try to save it.  Does that make sense ?
<AlanBell> gksudo geany /etc/apache2/sites-available/default
<AlanBell> that will work
<AlanBell> sudo will also work but gksudo pops up a nice window for the password and apparently prevents some problem that I have never encountered
<Kami> you are right - it works - thanks very much - appreciated
<Kami> any other tips for a newbie you feel like sharing ?
<czajkowski> BigRedS: ello...
<directhex> Kami, don't eat yellow snow.
<Kami> ahahha good one tx
<Kami> Hello again guys ..   I just don't get why geany creates so many pbs: kami@ubuntu:/etc/apache2$ gksudo geany httpd.conf  gives me an geany source code error, even though the file is there. Is there an easier editor to use ?
<diplo> gedit ?
<Kami> it opens an empty file
<diplo> Gedit does ?
<Kami> gksudo gedit httpd.conf  does not work, it keeps looking for the file but nothing happens
<brobostigon> trying using the whole file path,
<diplo> I've just ran it fine here
<diplo> gksudo gedit /etc/apache2/httpd.conf
<brobostigon> yes, full path.
<diplo> I rarely edit those sort of files with a ide though, normally use vi
<Kami> I just don't understand .... it does not open the file but just hangs
<diplo> You've entered the password and it opens ?
<Kami> i get a gksudo 11411 gtk warning
<diplo> So you have typed exactly this gksudo gedit /etc/apache2/httpd.conf ?
<diplo> How about instead doing gksudo gedit and browsing to the directory and opening it that way ?
<Kami> i get the warning, prompted for the password , enter the password, gedit opens an empty file which just hangs
<diplo> Works the latter way just as well
<Kami> I must have killed too many processes  because it just keeps on hanging
<diplo> Reboot and start afresh, works fine on all my systems
<Kami> you're probably right, thanks.
 * awilkins just uses sudo vim
<jacobw> yo
 * jacobw is hopeless vimmer
<knightnexus> Hey everyone
<knightnexus> Hey xnox
<knightnexus> Voicedictation is pretty cool on an irc client
<xnox> knightnexus: hola
<knightnexus> hownae you dude
<knightnexus> Tryin out an android linix client here
<knightnexus> Irc client
<knightnexus> Swipe yo swo
<knightnexus> Swipe  to switch channels is cool
<knightnexus> Srry bout the typos
<czajkowski> popey: so I'm hitting
<czajkowski> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/chromium-browser/+bug/1045268
<lubotu3`> Ubuntu bug 1045268 in chromium-browser (Ubuntu) "chromium-browser crashed with SIGSEGV in UnityWebappsContextRaiseCallback_dispatcher()" [Undecided,Invalid]
<czajkowski> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/chromium-browser/+bug/1041466
<lubotu3`> Ubuntu bug 1041466 in chromium-browser (Ubuntu) "chromium-browser crashed with SIGSEGV in UnityWebappsContextPrepareCallback_dispatcher()" [Undecided,Invalid]
<czajkowski> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/chromium-browser/+bug/1028060
<lubotu3`> Ubuntu bug 1028060 in chromium-browser (Ubuntu) "chromium-browser crashed with SIGSEGV in UnityWebappsContextPrepareCallback_dispatcher()" [Undecided,Invalid]
<czajkowski> but it keeps being marked as invalid any idea how I can get it looked at as my chrome has crashed a lot today with this same bug being opened
<popey> yo!
<popey> czajkowski, sorted
<Laney> apport won't be able to retrace from the PPA package
<popey> czajkowski, if you file any more which look like they might be webapps related, change the 'affects' to libunity-webapps, or ping us (or ken) and we can look at it
<popey> also, can you list what ppas you have in use?
<czajkowski> sure can do
<czajkowski> how do I do that ?
<popey> cat /etc/apt/sources.list.d/* | pastebinit
<popey> assuming you have package pastebinit installed :)
<popey> actually
<popey> change that:-
<popey> cat /etc/apt/sources.list.d/*.list | pastebinit
<czajkowski> k
<czajkowski> genius
<czajkowski> let me make it unprivate
<czajkowski> popey: https://bugs.launchpad.net/libunity-webapps/+bug/1050564
<lubotu3> Ubuntu bug 1050564 in chromium-browser (Ubuntu) "chromium-browser crashed with SIGSEGV in UnityWebappsContextRaiseCallback_dispatcher()" [Undecided,New]
<mattt> happy thursday evening everyone
<jacobw> http://www.thinkgeek.com/product/57f0/
<jacobw> want
<mattt> two bee
<czajkowski> popey: can sky do http://cheezburger.com/34419969
<popey> haha
<czajkowski> so want a pug :/
<czajkowski> and I have a name and all picked for it
<czajkowski> but just cant have one now :(
<popey> but... they're _so_ fugly
<czajkowski> :(
<czajkowski> wrinkly and cute
<mattt> pugs have weird breathing issues too i think
<czajkowski> and small and cuddly
<czajkowski> mattt: yes
<mattt> they are cute tho :)
<mgdm> breathing issues and I think hip joint ones too, if they're bred for small size
<mgdm> though I might be mixing that up
<AlanBell> xnox: ever tried using the installer with orca?
<AlanBell> bung a cd in, turn the monitor off, wait for the drums and hit Ctrl+s
<AlanBell> then get to the end of ubiquity without turning the monitor back on
<xnox> AlanBell: I fixed the high-contrast a11y theming bug which is very old.... do I get any points?! =)
<AlanBell> +1 point for xnox
<xnox> AlanBell: you can actually see the prepare page & manual partitioning now
<czajkowski> AlanBell: see arent you glad I told you xnox was in here now :)
<xnox> AlanBell: I know gtk quite well, but there is not enough ATK / AT-SPI (?!) documentation and tutorials.
<AlanBell> yes, that is keyboard navigable, I saw that working
<xnox> AlanBell: I went to #a11y @ GIMPNet and they couldn't explain much to me.
<xnox> I asked "How do I trigger an 'announce' event to the screenreaders?!"
<AlanBell> the main thing is having a completable path through ubiquity to the end
<xnox> and they said it's not possible, you can only do hints to the at-spi and screenreaders may decide to do something sensible.
<AlanBell> the screen reader kind of reads what you can put keyboard focus on
<xnox> AlanBell: can you give me an example of a good application which is "completable" with a screenreader?
<xnox> But if there is no focus?
<AlanBell> so stuff like the unity shortcuts overlay is a pile of fail because you can't focus on it at all
<AlanBell> you can do a flat review in orca and browse about the gtk structure of some applications
<AlanBell> kind of like using parasite
<xnox> e.g. I make OK button not sensitive when password fields do not match. But how can I tell the screenreader that it's not sensitive and more importantly why?
 * xnox has nothing to do with unity. plus by default ubiquity runs in a metacity session
<xnox> AlanBell: so, which Gtk+ apps are actually good with a11y?
 * xnox ponders if ocra itself is accessible
<AlanBell> gedit is OK
<AlanBell> orca itself is accessible and has a huge preferences dialog with lots of widgets in it
<AlanBell> orca help is technically accessible but not structured very nicely for screen readers
<AlanBell> I don't really like the way we assume people using orca already know how to use screenreaders
 * xnox yes, we suck. how can we suck less?
<AlanBell> in ubiquity the keyboard detection stuff and the world map thing are basically unuseable, but that isn't a showstopper as it does the right thing if you are connected to the internet when running it
<AlanBell> I proposed some changes to orca, but the gnome folk were not enthusiastic about it
<czajkowski> gnome not enthuastic to change, news at 12 :)
<MartijnVdS> oh they like change
<MartijnVdS> as long as it involves removing options
<AlanBell> and doesn't come from Ubuntu
<MartijnVdS> ah yes, because Canonical is the devil
<xnox> AlanBell: Alt underscore capital L plus shift plus two
 * xnox lol
<AlanBell> basically I want orca to start with "Welcome to Ubuntu, this is the Orca screen reader, press space to learn how to use orca or alt-tab to focus on another window and start using it"
<xnox> AlanBell: well orca itself is state-less hence it's good for a screenreader. ubiquity is not state-less it has global and mini state machines. Which is well hard to describe with a narative
<AlanBell> rather than "Welcome to orca, orca screen reader window, preferences button"
<xnox> AlanBell: we actually have some code in ubiquity to set ATK description on every single widget, apart from it looks like it's in a dead-end code path and not actually used.
<AlanBell> there was some code that screwed up the ATK description of everything so that an automated test framework could run it
<AlanBell> LTP
<xnox> AlanBell: isn't that change simply a Label in the ocra window?
<xnox> yeah, but I'm yet to find people who did LTP!
<xnox> if I can autorun ubiquity UI test scripted, I would have more time to do other bits
<xnox> AlanBell: how does debian gtk installer compare? is that accessible?
<xnox> AlanBell: ok, I quite ocra and it said "Quit push button." (standard Gtk+ stuff) "Good bye."
<xnox> how did it pronounce Good bye?!
 * xnox hmmm....
<AlanBell> line 881 of orca.py
<AlanBell> 1009 is message = _("Welcome to Orca.")
<AlanBell> 881:    orca_state.activeScript.presentMessage(_("Goodbye."))
<Monotoko> what's the best software to use to monitor about 4 servers? Just need to make sure all processes are up and check RAM/hard disk space
<xnox> Monotoko: check_mk
<xnox> Monotoko: install icinga + check_mk. Configure icinga (see readme) + add 4 lines of check_mk config (hostnames)
<Monotoko> hmmm that sounds pretty easy
<Monotoko> il install it in my local VM network and see if it works :)
<xnox> Monotoko: regenerate configs and you should have all standard checks (cpu usage, disk space, raid monitoring, heartbeat, internet, traffic.....) for 4 servers in less than 30 minutes
<Monotoko> wonderful
<xnox> Monotoko: add one line of python to inventorised "interesting" ports/processes and you are done.
<Monotoko> thank you xnox
<xnox> Monotoko: it's on my todo list to blog about it
<xnox> nagios.... for pragmatic people
<mgdm> Nagios++
<mgdm> its config is a little odd but it does tend to just work
<xnox> mgdm: yes. check_mk takes hostnames. resolves IPs & generates piles of nagios configs for most of usual things: CPU load, disk space, network i/o, processes, package upgrades, etc....
<xnox> mgdm: my check_mk config was 60 lines vs 340 lines of nagios (manual) config, I had all the previous checks (~40) + got 300 extra from check_mk
<xnox> cause it knowns about traps, MIBs, hearbeat, and many things I didn't have time to configure manually in nagios.
<mgdm> if I'd known about tht the first time I'd done it I'd have been happier :)
<xnox> AlanBell: orca is not useful. it's a screenreader so it has it's own private APIs to modify the scripts it's talking on the fly. As an external application (ubiquity) I cannot tell Orca "Switching to partitioning page"
<xnox> xchat is silent under orca =)
<AlanBell> yeah, you are not supposed to tell it what to say, you just make sure the application is keyboard navigable and things are described correctly so it can read them
<AlanBell> /usr/lib/python3/dist-packages/orca/scripts/apps has application specific hacks and tweaks
<popey> bed!
 * mgdm often means to ask popey what that quit message refers to
 * xnox done!
<xnox> I shrunk my partition and created a new one. The old one was LUKS + LVM + EXT4 with extends all over the place. Now I have small LUKS + (still with LVM and EXT4) but also an unencrypted luks for sbuild and stuff =)
<ubunkunubi> hello
<ubunkunubi> well, thats that delt with
#ubuntu-uk 2012-09-14
<pinky-> Good Morning All
<popey> morning
<daubers> Morning
<daubers> me waits for a HUGE delivery from RS
<MartijnVdS> daubers: 600 resistors
<daubers> MartijnVdS: A load of microcontrollers/caps/RFID antenna/Connectors/tools/linear regs etc
<pinky-> reminds me of when I used to blow microchips on a CLaNzeR chip programmer
<pinky-> I always used to buy the blanks from RS
<pinky-> in Leeds
<pinky-> chip/pic-programmer
<pinky-> eeprom reader/programmer
<daubers> This is a through hole prototype of a sensor node. If this works then I can make it all SMD (and cheaper) and get some PCB's made up :)
<pinky-> sounds interesting
<pinky-> flux is my friend. I luv friends with benifits
<pinky-> benefits*
<pinky-> haha
<pinky-> maybe it's too early?
<czajkowski> aloha
<popey> Oh Joy!
<popey> Updated my machine and get dumped to the grub prompt
<popey> WINNER!
<czajkowski> :/
<AlanBell> ops
<pinky-> WINNING
 * AlanBell declines to update right now
<czajkowski> indeed
 * xnox is in the office =) woop
<popey> this is odd
<popey> they've changed the wording of the grub menu
<popey> it now just says "Ubuntu" and "Advanced options for Ubuntu"
<popey> \o/ fixed
 * gord upgrades and puts on a cup of coffee for the enevitable breakage
<AlanBell> popey: what was the fix?
<popey> boot from a different hard disk
<popey> i have two, it updated the wrong one
 * popey stabs launchpad
<AlanBell> so it should be OK to update?
<mattt> "double down" ... what a stupid saying
<popey> yeah
<popey> mattt, americans.. what can you say. :)
<gord> its not a saying? its something you do in blackjack
<gord> i've never heard it used outside that context anyway
<mattt> gord: i've heard a # of american colleagues say it
<popey> me too
<popey> loads
<gord> correct them all
<gord> or just assume you are playing blackjack and throw cards at them
<mattt> maybe it'll kick it up a notch, and triple down
<popey> heh
<popey> quintuple down!
<mattt> :)
<xnox> popey: that's grub 2.00 for you ;-)
<gord> woo after upgrade lightdm doesn't work \o/
<xnox> gord: in what way?
<mattt> gord: double down and get that fixed
<bootlkhlll> mornin'
<brobostigon> good morning everyone,
 * daubers listens to the loud whine of "Grrnnnnnanaaarrgrghhhhhrhghghghghghghghghhghgh...... *kthump*" as the tree's get taken down
<xnox> daubers: perfect time for conference calls & google hangouts =)
<daubers> xnox: Yes!
 * Laney :(s at trees being taken down
<Laney> we're getting a big new tram line in nottingham which is really bad for trees
<Laney> https://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=university+boulevard,+nottingham&aq=&sll=37.0625,-95.677068&sspn=56.331468,114.169922&vpsrc=6&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=University+Blvd,+Nottingham+NG7,+United+Kingdom&ll=52.93774,-1.18727&spn=0.010604,0.027874&t=m&z=16&layer=c&cbll=52.93774,-1.18727&panoid=RqTi6XQILjZ49brKf4nl1g&cbp=12,352.31,,0,-7 both of those beauties
<daubers> Laney: We're going to plant a fruit tree further down the garden. The tree's that are going are less than a meter from the house. They're starting to affect the foundations :(
<Laney> :(
<daubers> cost me Â£VAST AMOUNTS on the insurance
<czajkowski> daubers: aye happened in our house in .ie
<daubers> so the plan is to get a pear tree or something that has smaller roots which we can train along one of the fences
<czajkowski> but mum loves gardening and has planted a lot more all away from the foundations of the house
<daubers> Yeah, these are those horrid things that grow a couple of meters a year too
<daubers> so replace them with something native and nicer
<daubers> something that bee's will like
 * daubers should think about walking down to the doctors surgery shortly
<diplo> I had the same issue, why don't the house builders think about the trees that are planted when they are small
<diplo> My tree took up the front path by about 3-4 inches all broken, and very close to that is the main sewer pipe.. I was worried the tree was going to take the sewer out so chopped it down.
<diplo> Refusing to die though :/ going to have to dig the stump out soon ( BIG job )
<pinky-> I like trees and want to hug them all
<pinky-> Bonsai to the rescue
<JamesTait> Happy Friday, folks! :-D
<pinky-> Poets day!
<JamesTait> pinky-: Not for me, I started late instead. :-/
<pinky-> atleast you got a lay-in
<JamesTait> Pah!
<JamesTait> They don't exist in my house!
<pinky-> young children?
<JamesTait> No, this morning my wife broke her glasses, so I had to take her to the opticians.
<pinky-> oh drama
<JamesTait> Yep, two boys.  8 and 5.
<JamesTait> So still young, I guess, even though they seem so grown up so quickly.
<pinky-> in a blink of an eye
<pinky-> yup
<pinky-> I'm nearing 50 years old now but been a granddad since I was 42
<davmor2> Morning all
<pinky-> Good Morning davmor2
<pinky-> JamesTait : you bought the boys any Lego?
<pinky-> it's one of my fav toys to give
<JamesTait> pinky-: A grandad at 42?  Fairly young, I suppose, but could be younger. ;)
<pinky-> yeah atleast it wasn't 32
<JamesTait> pinky-: We've got *loads* of the stuff.  Most of it left over from when we were boys, but we've got them some updated stuff as well.
<JamesTait> I poached some to build a Raspberry Pi case.
<pinky-> good idea:)
<mungojerry> best pi cases i've seen are the pibow
<JamesTait> Yeah, I wholly intended to get a pibow. In fact, it's what finally convinced me to get the Pi. I've just never got around to it.
<JamesTait> In fact, I should do that now.
<christel> yeah the pibow is cuteeee
<christel> the pins are a tad short though and keep falling out
<christel> (though they come with spare pins!)
<christel> (also, morning)
<JamesTait> Done.
<JamesTait> Hi christel. :)
<christel> hullu hullu hullu my dear! <3
<mgdm> I saw a pibow at oggcamp
<mgdm> might get one, nw that have the RPi too
<mgdm> \o/
<JamesTait> I'm going to see how things go with the Pi, but I'm thinking of getting a couple more, or maybe a couple of the other ARM boards that seem to be popping up left, right and centre.
<pinky-> I've not updated any main applications for ages and looking to try new and wondered if anybody had a recommendation for dvb-s2 software for Ubuntu?
<JamesTait> mgdm: I bought my Pi at OggCamp, and got the box signed by Pete Lomas. \o/
 * JamesTait has a thing about getting things at OggCamp and having them signed.
<mgdm> JamesTait: Oh, I didn't htink about the signing bit - I was having a chat with him at one point though
<JamesTait> mgdm: Seems like a nice chap. :)
<mgdm> Indeed
<davmor2> morning christel
<davmor2> czajkowski: prod
<pinky-> in Ubuntu (12.04) Software Center there is only 2 dvb apps and one doesn't work in 12.04 and other has no ATSC support so useless for satellite
<davmor2> bigcalm: how's london treating you again?  More important have you managed to distroy it yet so you don't need to go back?
<christel> morn davmor2 :)
 * AlanBell wonders what to have for lunch
<christel> cake
<mungojerry> got my hands on the new long iphone 5 http://ubuntuone.com/5AVzrvnmz9WoRWiWXxnmOS
<pinky-> haha
 * daubers can't have lunch for another 20 minutes
<daubers> stupid antibiotics
<czajkowski> pff
<czajkowski> those are only guidelines
<daubers> Dfeinatley means I can't get a bit tipsy at my brothers wedding tomorrow :(
<daubers> My experience of alcohol+antibiotics was much vomiting
<czajkowski> ah no they dont seem to have any effect
<czajkowski> was on strong stuff last wweekend at mates wedding and drinking no issue, she was on a morphine patch and also drinking. again no issue
<czajkowski> some people seem to be more sensative to them
<daubers> Really made me ill last time. Don't think I'd ever risk it again!
<daubers> At the time I might have been on one of these though http://www.nhs.uk/chq/Pages/871.aspx?CategoryID=73&SubCategoryID=103 as I had a gum infection
<czajkowski> daubers: I tend to be on weird strong stuff for my back but over the years have built up a large tolerance
<daubers> czajkowski: This is something I hadn't heard of before
<czajkowski> nods
<daubers> Ah wikipedia, where would i be without you
<daubers> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flucloxacillin
<mungojerry> the main issue with antibiotics is tummy problems
<mungojerry> so top up on good stomach bacteria
<daubers> eat many yoghurts, gotcha :)
<AlanBell> bigcalm: still up for next saturday in Farnham?
<AlanBell> http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/ubuntu-uk/1906/detail/
<christel> AlanBell: i believe he is at a training course today (but afaik he still intends to come down for happy hourage)
<AlanBell> great
<christel> daubers: yah some antibiotics dont react well to alcohol and make you sick -- the ones you're on now probably wouldnt make you sick if you drank mind, however, the alcohol *could* make them less efficient so it might not be the best of ideas to get shitfaced! ;)
<mungojerry> awww toddlers http://i.imgur.com/p9wnQ.gif
<czajkowski> awwww
 * mungojerry is a bit broody
<mungojerry> anyone who syncs their desktop PC data to cloud or other storage - what do you do with . files?
<mungojerry> currently am just backing up Documents , but a recent hard drive crash meant i lost lots of configs :(
<popey> i backup my entire home folder
<mungojerry> drip-sync, or a backup job?
<mungojerry> i do one-off backup jobs at home of /home to other folder
<mungojerry> but my work pc i am ownclouding
<TheOpenSourcerer> I backup ~, /etc, and /var (sometimes)
<bigcalm[mob]> Hi peeps :)
<AlanBell> hi bigcalm
<bigcalm[mob]> Pop
<bigcalm[mob]> Alanbell: I'm at  conference today hence my lack of response but get email when mentioned.
<bigcalm[mob]> Yes still up for beerage on Saturday
<bigcalm[mob]> popey: see above in response to your question as well :)
<popey> woot
<popey> will see if I can get a pass
<bigcalm[mob]> davmor2: London continues to suck
<bigcalm[mob]> Get a pass from whom?
<AlanBell> bigcalm[mob]: when are you in London until?
<bigcalm[mob]> popey: I'm down for 4 days, so don't feel limited to Saturday evening :)
<davmor2> bigcalm[mob]: did you ever stop to wonder if it only sucks when you are there?  I think they do it deliberately for visitors ;)
<bigcalm[mob]> AlanBell: I have an off peak ticket, so have to wait around until 7pmish u
<davmor2> bigcalm[mob]: Everyone seems to rave about London but I'm with you I just don't see it :)
<bigcalm[mob]> Before I can go home
<bigcalm[mob]> davmor2: hehe. You might be right
<bigcalm[mob]> AlanBell: are you in the big smoke today?
<christel> i'm not a big fan of londonia
<AlanBell> bigcalm[mob]: no, not today
 * bigcalm[mob] hugs christel
 * christel hugs bigcalm[mob] 
<bigcalm[mob]> Time to go. Catch you later
<christel> i intend to mention bigcalm in every other sentence now just so  that he keeps getting emails saying that someone is talking about him!
<davmor2> christel: that's just harsh think about bigcalm 's poor inbox
<davmor2> christel: bigcalm is right though it soon gets boring :D
<christel> that is exactly what i am doing! bigcalm will feel loved and special when he gets something other than spam
<christel> oh i didnt spot your evil twin before he left!
<diplo> what has bigcalm setup ? Can't be bothered to scroll up?
<popey> bigcalm, where are you staying?
<davmor2> yeah I need to swap it's irc channels over to me irssi proxy
<christel> diplo: he has one of these irc -> email scripts running so that he gets an email whenever we Talk About Him
<christel> (paranoid man that bigcalm is!)
<diplo> bigcalm sounds very paranoid!
 * diplo wonders how soon it will take bigcalm to get annoyed with it
<diplo> :P
<davmor2> diplo: it's useful if you are on more than one channel :)
<diplo> I guess I'm not that fussed :)
<popey> bigcalm can come and tidy my desk for me Needs a tidy... http://popey.com/~alan/desk.jpg
<brobostigon> wow, nice setup.
<davmor2> popey: I don't think you have anywhere near enough screens, keyboard or tablets there you need MOAR
<popey> +1
 * mgdm has a 27" iMac and a 32" telly on his desk at work for testing porpoises
<mgdm> I can barely move
<directhex> how does one evaluate small cetaceans with LCD displays?
<mgdm> very well, thank you
<mattt> i need a new monitor for home
<mattt> any recommendations?
<mattt> 24" widescreen or something of that nature
<Dave2> Dell U2412M
<AlanBell> for testing porpoises go to testtheporpoise.com. simples
 * mgdm has a Samsung 24" 1080p monitor, which is fine
<mgdm> I can't remember the model, sadly
<mattt> yeah, i quite like the dell ultrasharps
<mattt> they're quite ex tho :)
<mattt> mgdm: cool, will have a peek
<gord> i have two 24" samsung 1200p monitors :P
<popey> i have a cheap philips on my desk
<gord> i have to keep checking websites to catch them when they are cheep. everything else is 1080p or rediculously expensive
<popey> be nice if they did monitors with 2xvga, 2xdvi and 2xhdmi
<gord> why would you want two inputs?
<mgdm> this one actually doesn' thave a model number written on it
<mgdm> suffice to say it's a SyncMaster of some sort
<gord> syncmasters say on the top left, least both of mine do
<mgdm> Oh, FFS
<gord> :P
<mgdm> Yes, it's a P2450 :) I suspect they'll have a newer one by now
<bigcalm_laptop> Gits :P
<bigcalm_laptop> Love you all though
<christel> <3
<bigcalm_laptop> popey: now or next week?
<popey> bug 1042343
<lubotu3> Launchpad bug 1042343 in Ubuntu One Client "[FFE] Ubuntu One integration with Q sync indicator" [High,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1042343
<shauno> remind me again, why can't we ban timezones?
<mgdm> I'd like to ban daylight saving time
<shauno> I want to scrap them completely.  my head hurts.
<Seeker`> hmm, preordered an iphone 5 through carphone warehouse over the phone. Wonder whether I should have had a confirmation email yet
<pinky-> iphone 5 is only avail on EE and Three, not avail on 02 or Voda.. The battercharger from old iphones are obsolete so new required also
<AlanBell> wonder if the daily live cd works today
<pinky-> battery*
<pinky-> oh and you cannot make a call and surf net at same time
<MartijnVdS> pinky-: yay Apple.. oh wait
 * MartijnVdS had an interesting experience with Apple's lock-in today
<MartijnVdS> or actually, other people did (I just showed them that what they wanted to do was impossible unless they used ONLY apple hard/software)
<MartijnVdS> (or ONLY other hard/software)
<Seeker`> pinky-: well, thats just wrong
<MartijnVdS> no mixing
<pinky-> I'm desperate for a new phone and undecided what to buy next...
<Seeker`> iphone 5 is available on all of the operators on the UK
<Seeker`> You can only get 4G on EE / Three in the near future
<MartijnVdS> pinky-: Galaxy Nexus still wins for me :)
<MartijnVdS> even though it's almost a year old now
<pinky-> I read tech-news otherday that said different
<pinky-> maybe I need to research further
<Seeker`> http://www.vodafone.co.uk/brands/iphone/pay-monthly-iphone/index.htm
<Seeker`> Well, that took the whole of 2 seconds to disprove :P
<Seeker`> and http://www.o2.co.uk/iphone/iphone-5
<Seeker`> o2 are being really slow releasing their pre-orders though
<Seeker`> hence why I gave up and pre-ordered from carphone warehoues
<pinky-> The iPhone 5â²s LTE Will Only Work on EE, Even After Vodafone and O2 Roll Out 4G too <= yes I see news has been updated thanks for pointing it out
<popey> Ng, ordered yours? :)
<Ng> popey: yup
<popey> :)
<Ng> 32gb black
<Ng> popey: you?
<Seeker`> Ng: snap
<popey> nope
<popey> sticking with 4s till Ubuntu phone arrives :)
<Seeker`> Ng: who did you order with?
 * Seeker` is upgrading from an almost-broken 3GS
<Ng> Seeker`: direct from apple
<pinky-> http://www.information-age.com/channels/comms-and-networking/news/2123318/apple-iphone-5-is-an-ee-4g-exclusive-in-the-uk.thtml
<Seeker`> I tried to do that. Ran out between putting it in my basket and getting to the checkout though
<Seeker`> pinky-: 'a 4G exclusive'
<pinky-> says on that page.. Everything Everywhere, the owner of the T-Mobile and Orange networks, is in the process of selling part of its 4G band to mobile operator Three. If it went ahead, the deal would make Three the only other mobile operator in the UK to offer 4G services compatible with Apple's new iPhone.
<Seeker`> yup. 4G services compatible. Not that Vodafone or O2 can't have the iphone 5.
<Seeker`> Not sure how many other ways there are of saying it
<pinky-> hehe
<Seeker`> not sure whether I should be concerned over lack of confirmation email
<Seeker`> I bet HSBC have blocked the payment or something. They seem to be really bored in their fraud department at the moment, seem to be blocking just about every transaction with my credit card.
<pinky-> 2 wifi's in the iphone 5 is quite funky..
<pinky-> I watch BBC Parliament regular in day time when nothing else on and I've noticed alllll politicians use Blackberrys. It must be because of encryption.
<pinky-> and/or group chat
<MartijnVdS> No, it's because they don't have any connection with "normal" people
<pinky-> hehe well said:)
<pinky-> yeah I liked Blackberry when they were first launched but I wouldn't buy one now
<pinky-> and I really do need a new mobilephone
<pinky-> I wonder if the new iphone 5 has real glass for the screen and break if you drop them? I don't know as not looked it up or read anything related yet.
<pinky-> hmm I'm off to look stuff up, bbiab
<bigcalm_laptop> Good afternoon peeps :)
<davmor2> bigcalm_laptop: you know it's evening now right?
<bigcalm_laptop> davmor2: time is relative. And it _is_ after noon :)
<bigcalm_laptop> Best thing about London?
<bigcalm_laptop> Leaving it to go home :)
<pinky-> don't wear a watch and "you" decide what the time is
<popey> pip pip
<davmor2> bigcalm_laptop: That's not fair, there are some good people there too, but on the whole I find the best thing about London is it makes you appreciate where you live more :)
<davmor2> popey: Tally Ho
<pinky-> yeah I was born and bred in Hayes near Uxbridge but live in Yorkshire now and I'm much happier here as life is quiet and slow
<pinky-> and the air is freash
<pinky-> I live in a small village 1 mile from the sea and everybody knows everybody in the village... they miss nothing!
<pinky-> so everybody behaves
<pinky-> I could never move back to London, been here too long now and like it
<pinky-> moving back to London would disturb me
<popey> i used to work in uxbridge for a while
<popey> that place is a hole
<AlanBell> so did I
<davmor2> popey: it might be a hole but it isn't in the middle of the Atlantic now is it :D
<popey> thats aldershot
<pinky-> I lived in Bordon near Aldershot for a few years once too
 * bigcalm_laptop is just passing though Watford Junction
<bigcalm_laptop> \o/
<pinky-> the Big Divide is somehwere just north of Watford Junction
<pinky-> so they say
<Seeker`> bigcalm_laptop: you'll be near me now then
 * Seeker` expects bigcalm_laptop to drop out due to tunnels shortly
<Azelphur> anyone know roughly how much you'd pay for a home insurance type thing that would cover you for gadgets while wandering too?
<pinky-> I've got mobilephone insurance from my banks but I pay monthly fees for the account so I'm unsure
<pinky-> bank*
<Azelphur> yea, I heard it's pretty cheap if you get the whole deal covered in one go
<pinky-> yeah I get travel insurance and RAC cover and online fraud insurance thrown in
<Azelphur> fun
<pinky-> freebies really. its just the account I needed
<popey> usually you have to specify on the policy certain items over a specific value
<Azelphur> what perks does the account give you?
<Azelphur> ah
<jacobw> evening
<Azelphur> I mean I checked out a few places that offer gadget insurance, but they are usually quite expensive (Â£15 a month-ish) for my GS3 Nexus 7 and a laptop
 * MartijnVdS books a trip on a boat
<shauno> off-chance anyone knows how to get mysql to not treat Ã­ and i as equals?
<MartijnVdS> shauno: "collation"
<MartijnVdS> is the magic word
<MartijnVdS> shauno: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/367711/what-is-the-best-collation-to-use-for-mysql-with-php
<Azelphur> MartijnVdS: http://www.splicd.com/IzmNy3jqFog/2064/2074 british police are fun :D
<MartijnVdS> Azelphur: uh what
<Azelphur> xD
<shauno> hm, I thought I was using utf8_bin
<MartijnVdS> ooh, new QI tonight
<AlanBell> QI was good
<mattt> internet's down
<mattt> trying bt fon
<MartijnVdS> BT fon hom?
 * mattt looks at martinvds
<MartijnVdS> mattt: "ET phone home"?
<shauno> good lord, it actually works - https://dl.dropbox.com/s/hwyayrsecnp5bqt/Screen%20Shot%202012-09-14%20at%2022.56.08.png
<shauno> crazy i18n _and_ timezones at 11pm.  how much do I hate myself right now.
<MartijnVdS> shauno: but can you do this? http://paste.ubuntu.com/1205756/
<ali1234> great
<ali1234> perl scripts will make even less sense
<ali1234> python3 can do that too
<ali1234> why does perl use that "my" keyword?
<ali1234> what are they trying to say by calling it "my"
<ali1234> turns out what they are trying to say is "we already used the local keyword for something totally bizarre that nobody would ever want to do"
#ubuntu-uk 2012-09-15
<MartijnVdS> ali1234: no, it means "declare the variable with this name in the current scope".. sure you don't have to without "use strict;" but with strict you need to declare a variable 'our', 'my', 'local' or 'state'
<pinky-> coffee time
 * pinky- whispers to Azelphur "psst got any parsley?"
<MartijnVdS> atomic parsley?
<pinky-> I was just referring to the video clip he posted yesterday
<pinky-> :)
<AlanBell> bug 950160
<lubotu3> Launchpad bug 950160 in OEM Priority Project precise "Unity blocks other programs from binding globally to Super+* or Alt+* (* = any key)" [Critical,Triaged] https://launchpad.net/bugs/950160
<AlanBell> woot, HUD stealing alt from VMs might get fixed
<brobostigon> good morning everyone.
<TheHustle> Hello, please could someone tell me, how to get an md5sum of a cd in the cdrom drive, thank you.
<pinky-> https://help.ubuntu.com/community/HowToMD5SUM
<TheHustle> thank you pinky-
<pinky-> more coffee required.
<popey> +1
<Laney> getting out of bed required first
<Seeker`> No! Coffee bad! Tea good!
 * Seeker` ponders which sort of tea to have this morning
<brobostigon> new Dr Who, and new QI XL, tonight, :)
<MartijnVdS> *\o/*
<brobostigon> o/
<MartijnVdS> there was a program on trains last Thursday
<pinky-> I need a slave to send to the shop for cake as "Time Team" marathon is on More 4
<pinky-> oh it's quite sunny here today so I'm off in garden, back later
<popey> :)
<bittin> might not go to UK until next year
<popey> is that good or bad?
<MartijnVdS> for you or for him?
<Seeker`> good. means more tea for us!
<bittin> popey, its okay i guess
<MartijnVdS> Seeker`: hah, I have 2 trips to the UK planned already ;)
<bootinfdsds> AlanBell, Hi there ... love your G+ posts ...
<AlanBell> really?
<MartijnVdS> All the chicken ones?
<bootinfdsds> Yep ... I like Alan Pope more though ( he's addicted to it !)
<AlanBell> yeah, I like popey's posts more too
<popey> O_O
<czajkowski> lol
<MartijnVdS> popey: you do post quite a bit on G+ :)
<bootinfdsds> Are there any others that I dont know  about that do regular posts ?? - I could add them ...
<popey> I do?
<AlanBell> speaking of which, did you know that popey only has one facial expression? http://people.ubuntu.com/~alanbell/popey.jpg
<popey> haha
<bootinfdsds> opening....
<MartijnVdS> AlanBell: http://wolk.vandestreek.net/~martijn/lolpopey.jpg
<bootinfdsds> Christ .. I always wondered what the guy with the ball was ...
 * bootinfdsds has struth moment
<bootinfdsds> MartijnVdS, Looks like he goes to my local college .. Hahaha.
<bootinfdsds> I wonder what happened to this guy ???? http://goo.gl/m9nlm
<bootinfdsds> Some ppl !
<bootinfdsds> Anyway , did everyone vomit at the apple keynote ?
<AlanBell> did anyone watch it?
<bootinfdsds> Oh its software freedom day today !
<bootinfdsds> #sfd looks decidedly roomy with only 12 people in the channel...
<bootinfdsds> representing .. at least 450 people ... ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Software_Freedom_Day )
<bootinfdsds> Anything good on the radio at the moment ?
<bootinfdsds> .
<bootinfdsds> .
<bootinfdsds> .
<bootinfdsds> .
<MartijnVdS> bootinfdsds: stop flooding, please
<bootinfdsds>  I have to say when-ever I think of the UK Ubuntu group I think of dad's army ... Is that an Apt description ?
 * bootinfdsds realises he's just insulted the entire room ... oh dear me
<bootinfdsds> lots of 3pm games on today .. thought that was a tradition lost ?
<popey> davmor2, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/software-center/+bug/1049890
<lubotu3> Ubuntu bug 1049890 in software-center (Ubuntu) "Week 37 - Software center sends an icon to launcher even after the installation is cancelled." [Undecided,New]
<jacobw> bootinfdsds: kinda accurate, see 'the wing commander'?
<popey> http://images.plurk.com/2ApwVlEkIAt00qVcckJ5pg.jpg
<popey> hong kong airport apparently uses ubuntu
<jacobw> :D
<AlanBell> upgraded my OLPC to the latest image with Gnome 3
<AlanBell> fallback mode only but it is nice
<jacobw> AlanBell: how is compositing on an OLPC?
<AlanBell> well it all seems fine, no llvmpipe so it is just fallback without 3d stuff
<AlanBell> rhythmbox on it won't talk to my phone in exactly the same way it doesn't on Ubuntu
<jacobw> :)
<AlanBell> think I might take this to the office as an IRC machine
 * penguin42 wonders if there are any shortcuts in chrome to select a link within a webpage
<jacobw> https://chrome.google.com/webstore/detail/dbepggeogbaibhgnhhndojpepiihcmeb
<penguin42> jacobw: Ah yeh, I've been thinking of trying one of the vi plugins, what do you do in that to select a particular link?
<jacobw> in vimium, press f, each links will be subscripted with letters and you can use those letters to follow the link
<jacobw> vimium is quite unintrusive compared to the firefox extensions, which IMO are cumbersome
<penguin42> jacobw: I'm a bit worried though that since I use ff and chrome it'll be a pain to learn both
<penguin42> nice thing about vi is it works everwhere
<jacobw> they're the same
<penguin42> ah ok
<jacobw> vimium is kind of a limited implementation compared to the firefox extensions, the firefox extensions try to make it possible to use everything accessible to an extensions with a consistent keyboard scheme
<jacobw> there's more bugs in the FF extensions that in vimium
<penguin42> hmm nice, seems a bit odd to use HL for history forward and back and JK for tabs; tabs are horizontal
<jacobw> vim doesn't make a great deal of sense if you ask why everything is how it is, but it's just easier that way :)
<penguin42> jacobw: No, I mean vimiums use of HL/JK doesn't make sense to those of us who've used vi for about 50% of our lives
<jacobw> which do you do more often?
<jacobw> in my experience, vim prioritizes the things you have to do all the time
<jacobw> like all the things that are bound to capital letters
<penguin42> jacobw: I use vi all the time, and quite often use hjkl to move around
<penguin42> jacobw: My point was purely that I'd have expected vimium to use HL to move between tabs, rather than JK since tabs are typically horizontal and there is the association of hl to move horizontally
<brobostigon> QI XL :)
<Azelphur> pinky-: nah I don't sell parsly, I don't want the police to take my car xD
<pinky-> haha
<pinky-> that's tickled me
<pinky-> quite funny
<Azelphur> pinky-: did you see the one about the washing machine? :P
<Azelphur> police documentaries are funny xD
<pinky-> no doesn't ring any bells
<Azelphur> pinky-: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jh1asOpDZxk&t=58m20s
<pinky-> lol
<Azelphur> hehe
<pinky-> yeah like you watch that docu for one hour then at end they say that....
<Azelphur> indeed \o/
<pinky-> I just laughed so hard it hurt
<Azelphur> xD
<Azelphur> I have another one which is funny somewhere, trying to find it xD
<Azelphur> pinky-: http://www.splicd.com/c_ZBlMM7qlI/2410/2420 is a good one
<Azelphur> proactive policing right there.
<pinky-> yeah lol I saw that one the other day
<Azelphur> hehe
<Azelphur> did you see the one where the police were making funny noises?
<Azelphur> that's the one I'm trying to find xD
<pinky-> no not seen it
<Azelphur> yay here it is xD http://www.splicd.com/hOX_CJVh2uA/8/21
<pinky-> Bling!
<Azelphur> lol
<pinky-> actually I have a younger sister who is a copper from Durham and she writes on her facebook account all the time about gypsies:P
<pinky-> true
<Azelphur> fun
<pinky-> you can choose your friends but not your family heh;)
<Azelphur> hehe
<mattt> pinky-: did my first "fast" day today, bloody hungry :P
<pinky-> when I'm really hungry and there's nothing I fancy I just sleep it off
<mattt> i'm not used to feeling hungry, as sad as that sounds
<pinky-> yes if you are a regular eater, fasting is hard to do
<mattt> <-- regular eater :P
<pinky-> it's public logged in here and I can't really chat fully, but I take meds and when I do take them it's only time I eat.. when I don't take them I can't eat at all and can goes days and days
<mattt> ah, that sounds tough
<hamitron> never heard a better reason to pop more pills ;D
<pinky-> I'm addicted to coffee with sugar and that is what keeps my body weight up
<pinky-> I have curtain health problems
<pinky-> certain*
<pinky-> my meds rule my life so I tend to try and not take them if I have to
<pinky-> but there comes a time when I must
<pinky-> that's all I can really say in public
<mattt> fair enough
<pinky-> I'm a bit shy:)
<lanboy> i used to be shy
<pinky-> with virtual strangers in the Ubuntu world where nobody really knows who everybody is:)
<lanboy> but after i was forced to work with the public i became more open
<pinky-> I'm really bad at food shopping as I tend to always buy everything in tins! .. If I buy freash produce for the fridge it always spoils before I get round to thinking about eating it
<pinky-> so I stopped buying freash aprt from milk
<lanboy> buy stuff thats easy to add into stuff
<lanboy> peppers and onions etc
<pinky-> I tend to drink a lot of fruit smoothies in place
<pinky-> in place of
<lanboy> i've got peppers, tomatoes, spring onions and chinese cabbage right now
<mattt> or frozen veggies
<pinky-> if the Mylan calandar is correct and the world ends on December 21st at 10:30pm get to my place cos I've got all the tins!
<Seeker`> erm
<Seeker`> just
<Seeker`> no
<pinky-> also incase of Zombie outbreak
<lanboy> dont frozen vegetables negate the reason for having vegetables
<lanboy> i had a canned soup today and it was pretty awful lol
<MartijnVdS> *cue canned laughter*
<lanboy> oh you
<pinky-> Mayan*
<lanboy> what're you guys up to tonight anyway?
<pinky-> take over the world like we try to every night
<lanboy> olol
<lanboy> i'm having a discussion on the internet with some enraged girl on youtube
 * popey hugs pinky- 
<mattt> lanboy: frozen vegetables are perfectly good :D
<lanboy> i thought they lost a lot of their vitamins and good stuff through being frozen an unfrozen
<lanboy> and*
<guest72446> hii
<guest72446> i have issue with my webcam
<lanboy> whats the issue?
<brobostigon> nos da everyone, sleep well.
<lanboy> cheers
<brobostigon> o/
<Azelphur> anyone know how I'd change the application that opens magnet links?
<lanboy> opening from browser?
<lanboy> or system?
<Azelphur> lanboy: browser
<lanboy> firefox?
<Azelphur> chromium
<lanboy> oh
<lanboy> then i dont know :P
<Azelphur> hehe
<Goshawk> Hi guys, is there a linux version of windows 'scan disk' and if so, how do I do it?
<Azelphur> no idea what windows scan disk does, elaborate :P
<ali1234> scandisk does a lot of things
<ali1234> !fsck
<lubotu3> fsck is the FileSystem ChecKer, which runs automatically when you boot if you didn't shutdown cleanly. Type "man fsck" for information on running it manually. The command "sudo touch /forcefsck && sudo shutdown -r now" will force a reboot and a filesystem check; "sudo touch /fastboot" will skip a filesystem check at next reboot
<Goshawk> ah ok, cheers
<ali1234> that's more like chkdisk though
<ali1234> or dskchk or whatever it's called
<penguin42> Goshawk: So the question is what do you want to check/fix - fsck checks for inconsistencies in the fileystem structures, not anything to do with say a bad physical disk or fragmentation say
<Goshawk> actually all of the above
<penguin42> Goshawk: Well for physical disk issues I'd use smartctl to ask the drive to do a self test and see the error logs
<penguin42> Goshawk: And generally on Linux you don't need to do any fragmentation fixing
<Goshawk> ok cool
<lanboy> penguin42: you seem to be quite knowlegable, could you explain why i only get disk space back when i ctrl+del, del only removes the file visably
<lanboy> penguin42: sorry shift+del
<penguin42> lanboy: That shouldn't happen unless there is some program that has the file open
<penguin42> lanboy: If a program has the file open then it won't really be freed up until the program ends
<lanboy> penguin42: does nautilus count?
<penguin42> lanboy: Not for a directory normally - but if it's say a tar or iso that has actually been mounted/unpacked to view it by nautilus then probably yes
<lanboy> penguin42: i seem to have just lost disk space from deleting things in the past, is there anything i can do to sort it out /defrag?
<penguin42> lanboy: No, because it shouldn't happen
<penguin42> lanboy: Are you sure you've not just moved it to a trash can somewhere you haven't emptired?
<lanboy> penguin42: i deleted the files then emptied the trash
<penguin42> that should work
<Azelphur> aha, got it
<Azelphur> chrome uses xdg-open, so I did a little hack to make xdg-open do what I wanted \o/
<lanboy> niceee
<lanboy> penguin42: thanks for the info
<Azelphur> now I click magnet links and it ssh's my torrent box and adds them, automagically \o/
<lanboy> penguin42: heh i should probably reboot, havent done in 120 days :P
#ubuntu-uk 2012-09-16
<lanboy> everyone's dc'ing up in here :P
<penguin42> ?
<Monotoko> mornin' all :)
<guest49026> hello and good morning!
<guest49026> i try to send a "record signal" to zoneminder, but i don't know how.
<MartijnVdS> zoneminder? wazzat?
<brobostigon> good morning everyone.
<jacobw> hi brobostigon
<brobostigon> hi jacobw
<awilkins> I know it's possible to copy packages from one PPA to another, but is it possible to copy packages from normal packaging projects to a PPA targeting a prior release (ie - copy a package from Quantal repository to Precise PPA)
<popey> awilkins, no
<awilkins> popey, Thought so, I have taken the alternate tack of making a build recipe targeting Precise
<awilkins> Which of course, has queued the build I want 8 hours hence :-)
<Laney> hmm, not sure, the API looks like it allows that
<Laney> https://api.launchpad.net/devel.html#archive > copyPackage toSeries
<Laney> to_series
<popey> wont the packaging need updating?
<Laney> not necessarily
<Laney> it breaks if you have something with the same version published already
<jacobw> not necessarily, if the relationships haven't changed
<Laney> so won't work to copy to the same PPA :-)
<popey> yeah, blame czajkowski for the launchpad delays :)
<popey> (not her fault, but fun to blame her anyway)
<czajkowski> :(
 * czajkowski blames popey for taking up all the builds, 
<czajkowski> ( not entirely true but fun to blane him anyways)
<marsilainen_work> should it be possible to buy a motherboard with on-board graphics chipset and get ok graphics performance?
<marsilainen_work> I mean, not ultra-hot gfx performance or anything like that
<marsilainen_work> but ok enough that e.g. DVD video plays ok
<marsilainen_work> my current on-board gfx I believe to be Radeon 3000
<popey> my desktop is like that, i7 with onboard sandybridge graphics
<marsilainen_work> ok
<marsilainen_work> that's good to know
<popey> it can playback 1080p fine
<popey> its a crappy msi motherboard
<marsilainen_work> do you think that intel gfx is the best option if all I want is decent performance?
<popey> ms-7680 or something
<popey> decent performance doing what?
<awilkins> Flatland
<marsilainen_work> well, sorry, I mean just ok performance really
<marsilainen_work> so that DVD playback works ok etc
<popey> it runs unity fine :)
<popey> and video playback is excellent
<marsilainen_work> and switching between workspaces is smooth
<marsilainen_work> ok
<AlanBell> intel works fine and is painless
<marsilainen_work> sounds good
<popey> +1
<marsilainen_work> think I shall look for something that has intel as replacement
<popey> i would personally avoid amd/ati onboard
<AlanBell> nvidea and ati are perhaps better when they work
<marsilainen_work> yeah, it seems to suck
<awilkins> Running on the Intel at work (it's an Optimus laptop, but I don't need the GPU performance)
<AlanBell> but if you are interested in running pre-release ubuntu then you risk ending up with no X for a month or two at a time
<popey> nah, you can go backwards and make it work
 * popey dishes up roast dinner
<marsilainen_work> I'd forgotten what hell motherboard shopping is like when you haven't kept up with what the latest sockets & CPU types are :)
<marsilainen_work> wow you can still buy motherboards with parallel ports??
<awilkins> Presumably for people who're still rockin' the line printer
<awilkins> Green stripe fanfold 4tw
<marsilainen_work> lol
<popey> in my first proper job i had to operate a burster and a decollator to separate out multi-part carbon-impression print jobs into individual pieces of paper. that was fun
<penguin42> that must have been messy at the end of the day
<popey> the carbon got wound round spindles, which you just yank off and chuck in the bin
 * penguin42 is liking vimium
<popey> quiet today
 * Laney bangs some pots
 * popey makes tea
 * pinky- opens a tin
<Laney> of baked beans?
<pinky-> lentil n carrot soup
<Laney> mm
 * Laney ponders making soup for dinner
<Laney> got some beetroot that i'll never use otherwise ...
 * popey has tea and digestive biccy
 * popey wonders if xbmc can do iplayer
<popey> yay, xbmc box upgraded to 12.10
<hamitron> only 1 biccy? :/
<popey> yeah, nearly tea time
 * penguin42 just had a couple of choc digestives :-)
<hamitron> it must be tea time, if you are having tea?
<popey> pate for tea i think
<hamitron> think I'll probably be having a Sunday Roast
<popey> i did that for lunch
<popey> nommy stuffed chicken
<hamitron> :D
<hamitron> tbh, it wasn't gonna be a great outcome for the chicken whatever you did, when it is getting cooked
<popey> something very wrong with this acer revo
<popey> unity wont start
<hamitron> bonus?
<popey> http://paste.ubuntu.com/1209111/
<popey> that doesn't look good
<popey> oh, that'll be my xorg.conf
 * popey fixes that
<popey> erk, http://paste.ubuntu.com/1209113/
<popey> https://bugs.launchpad.net/compiz/+bug/1033404
<lubotu3> Ubuntu bug 1033404 in Compiz "[GLES] [nvidia] ./bin/compiz (opengl) - Error: FBO is incomplete: GL::FRAMEBUFFER_UNSUPPORTED (0x8cdd)" [High,Fix released]
 * popey adds unity staging ppa
<popey> 5 is too many computers to be fiddling with at once
<popey> wheee, new(er) compiz
<popey> \o/ unity desktop
<popey> huzzah
<popey> hmm, xbmc dies when i try to play some content
<popey> bah, nvidia driver got removed in the upgrade
<popey> $fun
 * mattt is watching the reading game and reading about the peewee ORM
<penguin42> popey: Binary drivers (for both nvidia and AMD) seem to have been a bit late to settle down in this cycle
<popey> yeah
<penguin42> oh, which reminds me, I must do an update on my vm and see whether llvmpipe is usable yet
<popey> virtualbox?
<penguin42> kvm
<penguin42> popey: I installed the beta in a vm last week, Unity was pretty fast but unusably crashy
<popey> bah, xbmc on 12.10 just craps out whenever I play a video
 * popey tries totem/vlc/mplayer/anything else
<penguin42> dragon?
<popey> so glad we didnt use nautilus/files/whatever 3.6
<popey> wow, unity is painfully slow on this ion nvidia thing
<penguin42> popey: does that have 3d accel ?
<popey> glxinfo suggests yes
<popey> http://paste.ubuntu.com/1209191
<popey> but the UI is doing like 1fps when doing various effects
 * penguin42 manages to type blind enough into the corrupted console on his vm to login and sudo apt-get install openssh-server
<shauno> trying to convert vm disk images that are almost too big for my laptop, is quite a juggling act :/
<penguin42> popey: It's incredibly slow in llvm-pipe on kvm as well
<popey> grr. vdpau seems to not work on 12.10 in xbmc, mplayer or vlc
<popey> ok, this is messed up
<popey> I'm getting 8fps from glxgears, and the glxgears box is just a black window
 * popey remembers there's an identical device on his mums network.. 
 * popey ssh's to get the xorg.conf from it
<penguin42> does it need a config?
<popey> for nvidia, yeah
<popey> just want to see what the difference is
<popey> this is unbelievebly slow
<popey> like it's using llvmpipe
 * Seeker` decides to skip 12.10 for now...
<penguin42> nvidia on +1 is supposed to be able to use xrandr isn't it?
<popey> nvidia on 12.04 can
<popey> but not the full 1.3 spec aiui
<popey> http://paste.ubuntu.com/1209287/ mums xorg.conf
<popey> http://paste.ubuntu.com/1209289/ mine
<popey> blagged from online..
<ali1234> nvidia has been able to do xrandr for years
<popey> nothing odd in there
<ali1234> just not any part that involves multiple monitors
 * popey files a bug
<popey> slowly
<popey> bug 1051640
<lubotu3> Launchpad bug 1051640 in Unity "Desktop performance unusably slow on nVidia ION" [Undecided,New] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1051640
<Laney> phwoar
<Laney> peeling cooked beetroot under the cold tap and then chopping it up has got to be one of the most pleasing cooking tasks
<czajkowski> Laney: smelly ?
<Laney> smells like beetroot
<Laney> i wouldn't call that smelly
<Laney> most people are more concerned about the staining :P
<czajkowski> I dont eat it
<czajkowski> and avoid the staining
<Laney> for some reason the veg box and the father keep resupplying me, even though i'm not massively keen on them
<Laney> the fun of cooking makes it alright though
<czajkowski> how do you cook them ?
<pinky-> all you need is parsley!
<Laney> oven
<Laney> but the skin just comes off in your hands after they are cooked
<Laney> it is most delightful
<czajkowski> lovely
<czajkowski> purple hands :p
<bigcalm> Hi peeps
<christel> hi hi bigcalm
<popey> yo
<bigcalm> Hey hey :)
<bigcalm> 3 day week, not sure if I'll cope
<bigcalm> popey: fixed your router?
<popey> rebooted it :)
<andylockran> hey all
<andylockran> popey: have you ever had success with that dongle method on a PS3?
<popey> i dont own a ps3, so no
<andylockran> ok
<bigcalm> Heh
<bootinfdsds> I heard kickstarter was coming to the UK in September ... is this a myth ?
<zleap> Off topic a bit,  does anyone know if MS word 2007 or above can save as PDF in the same way as Libreoffice can
<zleap> i am doing a poster in libreoffice,  to send to local youth centre,  i know full well if they send me it back havng been modified in word it gets all messed up at my end
<popey> why not send it to them as a pdf and ask for comments in an email rather than let them edit it directly?
<penguin42> zleap: Generally exporting from libreoffice to Word tends to get messy
<popey> bootinfdsds, http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-18780184
<popey> hmm, trying to fix a nerf gun
<popey> which has been left outside, so some of the screws are rusty, hard to get out :(
<Laney> :(
<Laney> my blender broke mid soup blending
<penguin42> Laney: You beet the life out of it
<stgraber>  /win 40
<bigcalm> New channel topic I think is due
<Azelphur> Here's a fun question. I have game server files on my server, and I run 5 instances of the server all off the same set of files, using command line arguments to change the configuration of each instance of the server, all good
<Azelphur> but, I want to change a specific file, for one server and none of the others
<Azelphur> any ideas short of making a copy of the whole thing to change one file?
<penguin42> Azelphur: Depending how many files, you could create a hard linked copy of most of it
<Azelphur> penguin42: how many files in the server? probably like 400 or something, one of which I want to change xD
<penguin42> Azelphur: I'd script something to make a hardlinked copy of it
<Azelphur> fun
<bootinfdsds> popey, [Kickstarter.co.uk] Yeah I thnk I'll email them about it , and ask. I can't wait to see the British Public videos of online begging begin.
<Laney> !info hardlink
<lubotu3> hardlink (source: hardlink): Hardlinks multiple copies of the same file. In component main, is optional. Version 0.1.1 (precise), package size 6 kB, installed size 60 kB
<Laney> Azelphur: ^
<Azelphur> this concept confuses me xD
<Laney> or there is cp -l
<Laney> then make the file you want to change not a hardlink, and profit
<Azelphur> fun
<Azelphur> what's the difference between a soft and a hard link?
<Laney> http://linuxgazette.net/105/pitcher.html is probably a better explanation than i can give on irc
<Azelphur> fun
<jacobw> a softlink is a link to somewhere else in the path, a hard link is a link to somewhere else in this specific filesystem
<mattt> jacobw: huh?
 * christel yawns
<brobostigon>    /me injects christel with caffeine.
 * brobostigon injects christel with caffeine.
<christel> <3 brobostigon
<brobostigon> christel: :)
<zAlanBell> http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/ubuntu-uk/1906/detail/ farnham \o/
<christel> i practised by consuming alcohol in vast quantities yesterday
 * christel nods
<Laney> (very) happy (few) hour(s)? http://www.beerfestival.nottinghamcamra.org/
<christel> beerfests \o/
<brobostigon> woop :)
<Azelphur> here's a fun question, Does anyone actually have a nice multiple presence setup on various IM networks? It seems like the networks themselves handle multiple presence poorly, if at all. :(
<brobostigon> christel: last one, at my local, was meant to only be a weekend, and it lasted 5 days.
<christel> fantastic
<brobostigon> christel: definatly, :)
<brobostigon> christel: he ober bought the beer.
<brobostigon> over*
<christel> fantastic
<christel> bring me to the next one!
<brobostigon> christel: how does banbury sound, ?
<christel> excellent! it is not too far away
<brobostigon> yay o/
<brobostigon> christel: i will keep you informed, :)
<christel> \o/
<brobostigon> \o/
<brobostigon> christel: in which, you would become, the third genius engineer, including myself and directhex in this area.
<christel> woop
<brobostigon> sorry, bad joke.
<christel> :P
<brobostigon> :)
<brobostigon> christel: i was talking of myself.
<brobostigon> is there a scale, of engineering skill?
<bigcalm> Is that how many beers you can social engineer out of other people?
<bigcalm> Why's it gone so quiet?
<brobostigon> o/
<zleap> not sure its getting late here (UK)
<brobostigon> 22:57
<zleap> yeah
<bigcalm> 23:00 almost. I really don't want to go to work tomorrow
<bigcalm> I'm still making object classes for a API calls
<bigcalm> Slow and tedious work
<ali1234> http://opensource.apple.com/source/WebKit/WebKit-7533.16/chromium/src/x11/WebScreenInfoFactory.cpp
<ali1234> aaaaaaaaaaargh
<ali1234> no multimonitor support *at all*
<brobostigon> nos da everyone, sleep well.
<ali1234> chrome determines the screen size by looking into the Display struct using X11 macros. can't patch macros :(
<ali1234> however i can probably just change the value in the struct, or patch XOpenDisplay and return something different
#ubuntu-uk 2013-09-09
<JamesTait> Good morning all, happy Monday and happy Wonderful Weirdos Day! :-D
<MartijnVdS> JamesTait: \o/
<mungbean> i think we all suscribe to that
<JamesTait> :D
<bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
<mungbean> did anyone else get a linkedin rquest from  From Quynh Tu ?
<mungbean> i think he's aded the whole world
<TheOpenSourcerer> Not me :-(
<TheOpenSourcerer> Perhaps I'm not of this world then...
<DJones> Nope, me neither
<MartijnVdS> not me
<mungbean> ah ok
<bigcalm> Not me, but I don't subscribe to that service
<DJones> mungbean is special :)
<bigcalm> That said, doesn't stop fictional people trying to invite me
<TheOpenSourcerer> = Everyone else isn't
<mungbean> i also reeived it on another email account i don't get linkedin mail on
<mungbean> so i thought somebody had done something naughty
<moodoo> mungbean: not looked yet.
<mungbean> no worries
<mungbean> thought it was a bit weird
<mungbean> 2 day week this week \o/
<moodoo> I'm off tomorrow, it's the kids birthdays
<mungbean> i had a young colleague that was perplexed when i came to work on my brithday. he said his mum had always given him the day off school all his life
<mungbean> and always took the day off on his bday
<moodoo> lol we're quite lucky coz we only have 2 birthdays to deal with at the moment for 4 people :D
<mungbean> that was rather well implemented
<moodoo> yeah :) wife and I, and the two kids :D
<ali1234> mungbean: i got a random linked in request the other day. different guy, but they see to come in waves
<mungbean> it said dear matthew and i'm not matthew
<mungbean> foudn the person and i am 3 degrees of separation, so many they just got click happy..adding 10,000 people
<ali1234> also yesterday i followed deadmau5 on soundcloud and i've got a couple of bot followers already
<mungbean> they are in vietnam though
<DJones> I get occasional linkedin requests and I've never even been on the linkedin website, never mind registered on it, I send the emails straight to trash
<ali1234> i get those, i don;t think they are really from linked in
<ali1234> because they go to spam directly, but real requests don't
<ali1234> even though the "real" requests are also people i never heard of who probably aren't even real
<DJones> Yeah, pure spam with a dodgy obscured weblink to click on
<neuro> i wonder who 'scott' from ebuyer was? :)
<brobostigon> good morning eveyrone.
<MartijnVdS> hi
<dwatkins> ello ello
<neuro> what up
<directhex> rainclouds
<popey> Good Morning
<MartijnVdS> directhex: we just get clouds.. rain stopped a few hours ago
<brobostigon> still raining here, :(
<directhex> yeah, banbury is wet
<TheOpenSourcerer> drizzle here in Farnham.
<brobostigon> very wet, and i had plans today too,
<TheOpenSourcerer> *NSFW* but a very funny 6minutes when you want a break: http://www.youtube.com/watch_popup?v=Uv2fVaHSISw
<MartijnVdS> http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/sep/09/swigging-pig-hogs-18-beers?CMP=twt_gu
<SuperMatt> I'm really surprised to see little movement on 1216223
<SuperMatt> bug 1216223
<lubotu3> bug 1216223 in ubuntu-wallpapers (Ubuntu) "Wallpapers for saucy salamander are being modified the wrong way, worsening their quality" [Medium,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1216223
<popey> SuperMatt: someone (you?) could propose a branch which contains better quality versions?
<Laney> interesting
<Laney> I'll mail the guy that gave me his compressed versions
<Laney> but yes if someone can do it better without increasing size then do
<AlanBell> why do we care about size?
<Laney> image size isn't unbounded
<Laney> not interested in arguing about that, fyi
<AlanBell> arguments are next door :)
<SuperMatt> so was the wrong person assigned to the bug?
<Laney> nobody's assigned
<SuperMatt> oh right, I must have read the bug report incorrectly
<Laney> mailed the guy
<AlanBell> has warty-final-ubuntu.png changed yet?
<directhex> isn't it .jpg?
<AlanBell> no, it is a jpeg, but the filename always has been png
<directhex> forgot which way around it was
<popey> think i might try making home made pot noodle for lunch
<popey> if it works I'll make one for wifeys packed lunch tomorrow
<bigcalm> If it doesn't work, it'll be for kids' packed lunches?
<popey> they have cooked dinner at school
 * popey tries this madness now
<SuperMatt> home made pot noodle?
<SuperMatt> isn't that just regular noodles?
<ali1234> home made pot noodle?
<ali1234> ^ what he said
<ali1234> i'm eating that right now
<MartijnVdS> pot noodle -> not poodle
<bigcalm> One would hope not
<ali1234> pot noodle -> to lend poo
<MartijnVdS> not looped
<mungbean> seem to have eye strain from too much time onthe dsi (xl) over the weekend
<mungbean> no idea how kids manage on the non xl versions
<popey> SuperMatt: not really
<popey> the thing is to make it in the morning or the night before, and be able to heat it with just a kettle / microwave
<popey> and have decent ingredients / taste
<popey> mine needs a bit of work
<popey> needs meat for a start!
<ali1234> cooked meat, reheated with boiling water?
<MartijnVdS> sous-vide pot noodles?
<popey> yeah
<popey> chopped into tiny bits
<popey> need something to thicken too
<popey> although if it's noodle soup that's not so bad
<mungbean> had pasty for lunch. regret it now.
 * TheOpenSourcerer had a chicken vindaloo baguette ;-)
<TheOpenSourcerer> Was mor chicken than vindaloo mind you :-(
<popey> Think I have improved the recipe
<dwatkins> http://blog.grubman.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/12/ChickFilA_EatMorChikin.jpg
<directhex> if only chick-fil-a weren't evil
<popey> http://pad.ubuntu.com/NotPoodle is my first go at it
<mungbean> directhex: why evil?
<mungbean> and are they in the uK?
<popey> they're massively anti-gay-marriage I think?
<popey> among other things
<mungbean> popey: the CEO gave money to a charity.
<popey> i may be mis-remembering then
<mungbean> the twitter people blew it up massively
<AlanBell> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-23572742
<popey> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chick-fil-A_same-sex_marriage_controversy
<mungbean> ". Of this, more than $3 million was donated primarily to Christian organizations whose agendas included positions that some consider to be anti-gay"
<directhex> mungbean, they're a militantly "conservative christian" group (ever wonder why they're closed on sundays) and has donated millions to fighting against lgbt causes
<mungbean> it all depends on your POV
<directhex> my POV is the family research council see *anti-bullying* programmes as dangerously pro-gay, so fight against anything that would help reduce bullying in schools
<MartijnVdS> à² _à² 
<directhex> so everyone who pays chick-fil-a for food is directly and intentionally funding teenage suicide
<mungbean> lol
<directhex> which, as someone who was bullied as a kid, isn't a cause i wish to support financially
<mungbean> they gave $2M in 2010, and $1,000 dollars to FRC who promoite traditional family values
<directhex> "promote traditional family values" is coded language
<MartijnVdS> For?
<mungbean> man-woman marriages. hardly coded
<mungbean> evryone has an agenda
<mungbean> some companies gave to the labour party who then went to war on a lie
<MartijnVdS> some people have weird ideas
<directhex> MartijnVdS, for "anti-gay, no matter the cost"
<mungbean> what does anti-gay mean
<MartijnVdS> directhex: also anti-divorce? because otherwise they'd be inconsistent.
<directhex> MartijnVdS, no, not anti divorce
<directhex> divorce is fine, as long as it's straight divorce
<mungbean> "he FRC supports the requirement of a one-year waiting period before a married couple with children can legally get a divorce so that they can receive marital counseling, unless the marriage involves domestic violence"
<MartijnVdS> directhex: because that's a traditional family value?
<directhex> MartijnVdS, hence "coded language"
<mgdm> MartijnVdS: since Henry VIII, or thereabouts
<MartijnVdS> mgdm: well, yes, on your side of the pond.
<MartijnVdS> mgdm: We've been under catholic rule for a bit longer.. and "our" protestants don't like divorce that much either.
<MartijnVdS> good thing they're almost completely extinct now
<popey> there was a programme on the radio earlier about maersk
<popey> need to find it because I didn't finish it
<MartijnVdS> popey: shipping company?
<popey> ah, book of the week
<popey> yes
<popey> http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b039pdsw/Book_of_the_Week_Deep_Sea_and_Foreign_Going_Inside_Shipping_the_Invisible_Industry_Episode_1/
<mgdm> I know a few folk who've worked for them
<popey> worth listening to
<mgdm> (Where I'm from ,there's a decent number of people who go into the merchant navy in some form)
<directhex> mungbean, the SPLC is pretty much the gold standard for indexing of various hate groups, here's the FRC's section on their site: http://www.splcenter.org/get-informed/intelligence-files/groups/family-research-council
<popey> in the intro she explained how much it contributes to the .dk economy.. something like a third or so
<mungbean> directhex: and the chicken place gave 1000$ to them in 2010
<mungbean> KFC have a picture of rolf harris on their buckets
<directhex> mungbean, try following the actual citations. http://equalitymatters.org/blog/201103220005
<directhex> e.g. filtering $0.6M through the National Christian Foundation, whose sole purpose is to filter money down to groups like FRC
<mungbean> directhex: that article is full of bias "anti gay groups"
<mungbean> as if the raison d'etre is to be anti gay
<diddledan> as a christian I find it abhorrant that lgbt people are allowed to be forced to not be allowed to marry :-p
<mungbean> they provided catering for a marriage course
<diddledan> (I tried hard to make that sound as anti gay as possible while being as pro gay as possible!)
<mungbean> "Fellowship of Christian Athletes" - that sounds like an anti gay organisation??
<dwatkins> diddledan: I find it pretty crazy too, that the church has so much to say about this
<mungbean> sounds like an organisation supporting christian athelete
<blazemore> In a fair society it's only right and proper that gay couples have the mundanity of marriage inflicted upon them the same as everyone else
<ali1234> you can't tell much from the names
<blazemore> What makes them so special that they get let off?
 * dwatkins tries to choose an opportune moment to go get a cup of tea when his computer actually will be busy for more than 3 seconds
<directhex> mungbean, they're supporters of the "ex gay" movement, which has been dismissed by every credible psychologist in the world as extremely harmful
<mungbean> directhex: take a step back and consider whether christian charities are doing things other than sitting around bashing gays all day. huge amount of schools and hospitals and social charities were setup by christians
<diddledan> as I said, I identify as christian. I find it an offence to my beliefs that my religion is being used to promote hatred.
<directhex> mungbean, take a step back and consider whether it is possible for people to do good without doing so at the behest of their god.
<gordonjcp> directhex: quite the reverse, in fact
<MartijnVdS> [if any]
<gordonjcp> religious people are less likely to have a solid moral framework
<mungbean> that isn't what we're talking about though, the link you sne t me said that christian athlete cahrity was anti-gay
<mungbean> just because it was christian
<gordonjcp> I'd go so far as to say that Christianity is incompatible with morality
<directhex> gordonjcp, it is a widely held belief by theists that it is not possible for an atheist to have a moral character
<mungbean> this discussino is now turning into reddit
<directhex> gordonjcp, as morality only works when backed up by supernatural stick-and-carrot
<AlanBell> this is an interesting discussion, but somewhat offtopic
<gordonjcp> directhex: right, but it's the opposite way round
<gordonjcp> directhex: if a theist believes that they will be forgiven by their god no matter what they do, they have no real need for a solid system of morals
<gordonjcp> what does it matter to them?  They get forgiven and go to heaven just the same
<directhex> AlanBell, yes, it is. and i'm sorry for perpetuating it. but the handwavery of "oh it's fine, their name says they're loving and caring" when they help teenagers kill themselves is something i find vexatious
<gordonjcp> I have a solid system of morals because in *this* life I'd prefer it if people didn't think I was a horrible bastard that goes about being nasty to people
<AlanBell> everyone see intel blocking Canonicals patches for xmir?
<mungbean> yes, is it actually true?
<diddledan> AlanBell: yeah, I saw that last night on omg!ubuntu
<mungbean> saw a phoronix story so thought i'd wait
<directhex> AlanBell, i saw.
<ali1234> everyone saw it
<directhex> AlanBell, the reasoning stated so far is interesting
<mungbean> i called my mum, she saw
<AlanBell> http://cgit.freedesktop.org/xorg/driver/xf86-video-intel/log/ various commits in there
<directhex> AlanBell, i.e. i wouldn't blame them if it was "we don't trust that canonical will do the required maintenance on this crap, and we don't want to maintain it ourselves". but the stated reasoning is "yeah, this stuff's slow, and if nvidia/ati get to bypass it & use xorg, we are too"
<ali1234> why is it slow?
<ali1234> it's all inside #ifdefs
<ali1234> i suppose some of it checks a variable
<AlanBell> where was that stated? All I have seen is this http://cgit.freedesktop.org/xorg/driver/xf86-video-intel/commit/?id=218c9901e55e10fb5bc0c2a4caa04b1bee741a25
<diddledan> what's the relationship with Xmir vs mir?
<popey> diddledan: http://mjg59.dreamwidth.org/26254.html
<diddledan> thanks popey
<ali1234> mhall and mjg discussion on g+ was amusing
<directhex> AlanBell, i saw it mentioned in some surrounding discussion. might be on an FDO mailing list. i'll check
<diddledan> ok, so Xmir still runs mir backend. surely then the intel drivers would be interfacing with mir rather than xmir?
<ali1234> since mhall tried to use the exact same argument against me, which is now being thrown back at him
<popey> ali1234: i missed that
<ali1234> popey: you reshared it, that's hte only reason i saw it
<popey> oh, must have carried on after I went to bed then
<ali1234> yes it went on for a bit
<ali1234> i saw it this morning
<diddledan> and I thought mir used the same driver stack as wayland (which the intel drivers do target)
<popey> no, i +1'd that, didn't share it
<ali1234> +1 now reshares things
<popey> well, yes
<directhex> http://lists.freedesktop.org/archives/xorg/2013-September/056006.html seems pretty grumpy
<MartijnVdS> popey: the "pad.ubuntu.com" link doesn't work.. it claims I'm not authorized.
<directhex> i think chris would like to include the patches
<ali1234> popey: wait, i actually saw it because ogra did reshare it
<popey> MartijnVdS: what's your launchpad ID?
<directhex> but intel are invested in wayland
<MartijnVdS> popey: "You are currently logged in as https://login.ubuntu.com/+id/w8WFDJK"
<popey> MartijnVdS: https://launchpad.net/~ubuntu-etherpad/+members join that
<MartijnVdS> popey: done, still no access?
<ali1234> i think you have to be approved
<MartijnVdS> ah
 * AlanBell approves
<MartijnVdS> \o/
<MartijnVdS> I'm approved now, still no worky
 * dwatkins approves of MartijnVdS 
<MartijnVdS> ah
<MartijnVdS> log out & back in again
<dwatkins> switch it off then on again...
<davmor2> Morning all welcome to bostonian time
<MartijnVdS> davmor2: Boston? Rescuing tea?
<davmor2> MartijnVdS: no the rest of my team are in boston so I'm working on their timezone
<dwatkins> good morning
<halt> Hi all, I think i found one broken package but, not sure how to report it. It's aboute the zabbix-agent package on 10.04.4 LTS , and the issue is with the init script,
<halt> also the version what I can see on the web is not the same as what i can see with apt-cache search/show
<dwatkins> !info zabbix-agent
<lubotu3> zabbix-agent (source: zabbix): network monitoring solution - agent. In component universe, is optional. Version 1:2.0.2+dfsg-3 (quantal), package size 277 kB, installed size 676 kB
<halt> dwatkins: I have 2.0.0 from the repo but on the web i can see only 1.8 but anyway the init script is broken.
<davmor2> halt: what do you mean by on the web you only see 1.8?
<halt> davmor2:  this http://packages.ubuntu.com/precise/zabbix-agent
<mungbean> Candidate: 1:1.8.11-1
 * bigcalm rumbles in
<MartijnVdS> bigcalm: "let's get ready to rumble"
<mungbean> !info zabbix-agent precise
<lubotu3> zabbix-agent (source: zabbix): network monitoring solution - agent. In component universe, is optional. Version 1:1.8.11-1 (precise), package size 217 kB, installed size 608 kB
<mungbean> hang on , 10.04 is lucid innit?
<mungbean> !info zabbix-agent lucid
<lubotu3> zabbix-agent (source: zabbix): network monitoring solution - agent. In component universe, is optional. Version 1:1.8.1-1ubuntu1 (lucid), package size 223 kB, installed size 544 kB
<DJones> halt, Which repo have you got version 2.0.0 from?
<halt> DJones: lucid main universe
<mungbean> type apt-cache policy zabbix-agent
<halt> mungbean: http://paste.ubuntu.com/6083515/
<DJones> Is this on a real hardware, or is it a cloud based install
<halt> mungbean: here is my source list http://paste.ubuntu.com/6083527/
<halt> DJones: AWS EC"
<halt> s/"/2
<mungbean> at some point you installed a debian version
<mungbean> of the deb
<DJones> I suspect that might well be the problem, its not something I've had experience of personally, but I'm pretty sure I've seen issues where the AWS repo's don't match the official ubuntu repo's
 * SuperMatt scratches his head a little
<halt> mungbean: well hard to image how that possible but, fair enoght let's say it's possible and happend what you suggest how to fix it ?
<SuperMatt> I'm trying to cross compile nginx for arm. How do I tell the ./configure and make programs to use the crosscompile version of gcc?
<davmor2> halt: sudo apt-get purge zabbix-agent && sudo apt-get install zabbix-agent
<popey> nginx for arm? you running it on your phone?
<SuperMatt> no, for an embedded device
<halt> davmor2: it's worst to try let's see
<halt> davmor2: hmm ok that's resolved the sissue with the version but does not resolve the init stipt, it's still report incorrent status of the service, and it's even failed to run
<mungbean> i wonder what else you installed? try dpkg --list | grep squeeze
<davmor2> halt: pass then there are others that might be able to help you more
<halt> mungbean: nothing else is comming from debian just checked
<mungbean> maybe there is a zabbix channel now yuo are getting onto specific app issues?
<halt> mungbean: I'm on it, and waiting for now the officaial zabbix repo address, to fix this
<halt> let's hope so the officail package is not broken
<davmor2> halt: you might want to make sure that when you purge the init script is actually removed,  it might be that the faulty one was left behind. if it is purge the package and then remove the init script and then install the package again maybe
<halt> davmor2: good point let me try to remove the init script and test it again, but anyhow i will need an ppa or external repo to upgrade the package, i need a bit newer then 2.8 maybe this is why someone ( colleague of my ) install the debian package, but still a good question how ..
<mungbean> and check all zabbix-client are removed
<halt> just double checked, and the purge remove the init script so this is the new one, which means it's broken in the repo as well
<mungbean> how do you know the init script is broke?
<mungbean> and not something else?
<dwatkins> can you start the daemon manually?
<halt> mungbean: the script try to read an not existing PID file and then also it's try to get the infro from /proc based on the pid
<halt> yes i can start it and then i see it in the ps , but the status is runing all the time reagardless if it's runing or not
<halt> I installed the zabbix repo, and that pacakge has a valid, init script, so it's resolved for me but it whould be good idea to report it as bug
<bigcalm> Can one specify a ssh key to use with git on a specific server from the CLI? That is, not via editing ~/.ssh/config
<mgdm> bigcalm: you can't
<mgdm> bigcalm: unless you make some kind of wrapper script, and set that as the GIT_SSH command in the environment
<bigcalm> Knickers
<bigcalm> mgdm: that's fine
<mgdm> bigcalm: this is all from 'man git' and search for ssh :)
<bigcalm> :P
<bigcalm> Thanks
<ali1234> i htought anything you can put in config can be done on the command line
<mgdm> not in git's command line
<ali1234> oh, i see
<bigcalm> For the sake of this gitlab migration script, I _might_  just use a new key in the .ssh/config file
<bigcalm> It's not as neat as I would have liked
<mgdm> bigcalm: export GIT_SSH='ssh -F /path/to/alternate/config' might work
<mgdm> so you can have a separate SSH config file
<mgdm> (untested, but seems plausible from a quick reading of the relevant man pages)
<bigcalm> Oo, yes, that could work
 * bigcalm tinkers
<bigcalm> Ta
<DJones> popey, bigcalm Do you see this about Minecraft from a couple of days ago? http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-23572742
<bigcalm> DJones: I saw the headline but didn't get around to reading it
<DJones> Its quite good, I liked the descript of it as "digital lego"
<bigcalm> The Lego comparison has been there since day 1
<bigcalm> error: cannot run ssh -F /home/iain/www/system_scripts/git/gitlab_project_migrate/ssh/config: No such file or directory
 * bigcalm scratches his head
<bigcalm> That file does exist
<mgdm> selinux?
<mgdm> permissions?
<mungbean> thats not the whole command line though
<mungbean> ?
<bigcalm> mgdm: ubuntu
<ali1234> "ssh -F /home/iain/www/system_scripts/git/gitlab_project_migrate/ssh/config" isn't a file
<bigcalm> mungbean: it's all I wrote. Googling and reading says I should wrap the command
<ali1234> did you just put that whole string in GIT_SSH?
<bigcalm> Yes
<ali1234> well, you can't do that...
<bigcalm> Following mgdm's example
<ali1234> the git manpage specifically says that won't work :P
<mgdm> bigcalm: stick that command line in a .sh file and set that as GIT_SSH, then
<bigcalm> Seems I need to pass all arguments into it as well
<bigcalm> Is there an argument for $n ?
<bigcalm> "$@"
<diddledan> who in their right mind names a font "vag"?
<diddledan> "I put vag on your site for you, and if you look you'll be able to see it"
<diddledan> "what do you mean you want more vag?"
<diddledan> both paraphrases of things I've mentioned to colleagues
<diddledan> or colleagues have said to me
<mungbean> you're right, there's something a bit fishy about it
<ali1234> too much
<diddledan> :-p
 * bigcalm bounces
<bigcalm> Migration script works
<bigcalm> Now to let it walk over 124 projects
<diddledan> sounds scary
<directhex> migrating what?
<directhex> i need a redmine migration script :(
<diddledan> directhex: migrate redmine to what?
<bigcalm> directhex: migrating gitlab projects from gitlab2 on server A to gitlab6 on server B
<diddledan> bigcalm: sounds scary
<diddledan> what happens if 123 projects migrate but the last one fials?
<bigcalm> diddledan: fun. I like APIs. I tend to write a lot of them, so it's nice to use other people's when they are well documented
<directhex> diddledan, migrating redmine projects - PROJECTS, not whole instances - from server A to server B
<diddledan> directhex: ouch
<diddledan> directhex: afaict redmine tends to be a black box
<directhex> diddledan, which is basically impossible as redmine uses a per-server incrementing counter as its primary key for all the things, so the only way to do a migration is to renumber every issue etc - and parse all the text inside them to renumber references to other tickets too
<diddledan> that's even worse than than ouch
<ali1234> that doesn't sound impossible, just slow
<AlanBell> the copy process does that but on the same server
<AlanBell> and probably doesn't repoint references to issues properly
<AlanBell> directhex: can you copy the whole thing, then delete the projects you don't want, or is it really moving projects onto an already used server?
<directhex> AlanBell, the latter
<AlanBell> good luck with that :/
<directhex> there's a script, but it's mysql-only, and assumes no plugins store data on tickets
<directhex> (we use advanced roadmap)
<dutchie> o/
<ali1234> !info gedit raring
<lubotu3> gedit (source: gedit): official text editor of the GNOME desktop environment. In component main, is optional. Version 3.6.2-0ubuntu1 (raring), package size 519 kB, installed size 2699 kB
<bigcalm> Is there a nice markdown viewer that I can write documents in before throwing them into git?
<bigcalm> !info retext
<lubotu3> retext (source: retext): Simple text editor for Markdown and reStructuredText. In component universe, is optional. Version 3.1.4-0ubuntu0.1 (quantal), package size 66 kB, installed size 321 kB
 * bigcalm gives it a go
<bigcalm> Heh, the menu icons don't show
<MartijnVdS> yay globalmenus
<bigcalm> Oh, not menu, tool bar
<popey> MartijnVdS: storywar just arrived
<bigcalm> popey:  Your estimated delivery date is: Monday, October 07, 2013
<bigcalm> popey: might have to wait a while for that blog review :)
<MartijnVdS> popey: I'm expecting mine this week or next
<MartijnVdS> popey: depending on the efficiency of US->NL postal services
<davmor2> http://www.networkworld.com/reviews/2013/090913-ubuntu-test-273462.html hmmmmmm
<bigcalm> ARGH!
<MartijnVdS> bigcalm: hm?
<bigcalm> Access denied on a git repo I was happily using last night
<MartijnVdS> bigcalm: Linus did it
 * bigcalm sighs a hefty sigh at computer things
<bigcalm> MartijnVdS: I bet he did!
<MartijnVdS> bigcalm: time for an evening of non-computer things!
<bigcalm> Noo, I'm so close with this one thing
<bigcalm> I want to check in my migration script and then have it migrate all of the projects
<bigcalm> Right, I can access other repos on the same server
<bigcalm> So there is something wrong with the repo itself
<bigcalm> Oh my
<bigcalm> Just looked at the .git/config, the URL was for a different project on a different server
 * bigcalm eyes Linus
<bigcalm> Changed URL and it works
<MartijnVdS> *\o/*
<bigcalm> Nice pompoms
<daftykins> MartijnVdS's hobby has been coming along nicely
<daftykins> MartijnVdS: any luck starting a local dance troop?
<MartijnVdS> I'd do them in colour too if the channel wasn't +c
<MartijnVdS> daftykins: Nobody wants to join
<daftykins> aww :(
<daftykins> maybe the uniform you designed is ugly?
<MartijnVdS> daftykins: what's wrong with frilly socks?
<daftykins> you'd have to ask them :(
<MartijnVdS> maybe the problem is that it's *only* frilly socks?
<daftykins> that could well be!
<daftykins> you could at least add a belt
<MartijnVdS> a wrestler's belt! good idea
<MartijnVdS> *\8/*
<MartijnVdS> ^ added belt
<bigcalm> Around the neck?
<bigcalm> Or are those your legs in the air?
<MartijnVdS> maybe..
<bigcalm> Oh my
<MartijnVdS> aaanyway
<MartijnVdS> time for foods
<diddledan> I'm not the only one that laughs at insane emoticons then :-p
<diddledan> I'm somewhat fastidious over my own usage - they all have to include a nose when they're the smilie-sideways type: :-) :-p :-D etc.
<MartijnVdS> 8-)
<dutchie> what about backwards ones like D:
<MartijnVdS> (:
<dutchie> or D-: if you need a nose
<MartijnVdS> dutchie: "GREAT SCOTT!"
<diddledan> D-: is a sad face?
<diddledan> sad+moany
<MartijnVdS> surprised I'd guess?
<diddledan> i.e. sad, and gotta tell everyone how sad it is
<MartijnVdS> surprised in a bad way
<MartijnVdS> they're expecting 42mm of rain tomorrow..
<daftykins> not 40, not 45, 42!
<ali1234> 1.65354331 inches
<MartijnVdS> 42l/mÂ²
<ali1234> best web app ever: http://websdr.ewi.utwente.nl:8901/
<MartijnVdS> whatever I'm hearing.. it sounds like the imperial probe on Hoth
<ali1234> it's detuned
<ali1234> put 198 in the frequency box and click AM
<MartijnVdS> ali1234: there was a voice in there, just unintelligible
<ali1234> yeah, it's slightly detuned and wrong modulation
<MartijnVdS> I can get R5 Live on there
<ali1234> 27124.44/FM some dudes chatting
<MartijnVdS> 909
<MartijnVdS> ali1234: in a "Twente" accent :)
<MartijnVdS> 27MHz = http://nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/27_MC
<MartijnVdS> ali1234: 6607 / CW-wide
<MartijnVdS> ali1234: http://www.astrosol.ch/53790397a40a2bb01/53790397a40a31504/
<MartijnVdS> now I want my own SDR :)
<ali1234> i've got a rtl-sdr but it doesn't go down to these frequencies
<mgdm> I have an rtl-sdr too but I've not used it for a while
<mgdm> that needs fixed
<mgdm> also I've not used my actual radio in a while, either
<ali1234> there is a software DAB receiver for it now
<MartijnVdS> ali1234: cool!
<mgdm> nice
<ali1234> there isn't much interesting in the 100Mhz+ that it can do
<MartijnVdS> FM radio, I'd guess
<MartijnVdS> and DAB :)
<mgdm> I've seen people build downconverters to make it do other things
<ali1234> FM, DAB, DVB, tetra (encrypted), doorbells and so on
<ali1234> pagers, gsm etc... all encrypted
<mgdm> fvvo 'encrypted', in the GSM case at least
<mgdm> not that that makes it legally OK :-)
<MartijnVdS> GReat, Irish and Algerian stations clashing
<MartijnVdS> BBC WS with an American accent.
<MartijnVdS> Woo, BBC Radio Essex AM 8-)
<MartijnVdS> ali1234: the bright horizontal lines = lightning
<ali1234> awesome
<ali1234> what about the wide zig zags?
<MartijnVdS> how wide?
<MartijnVdS> ah I see them
<ali1234> very
<davmor2> MartijnVdS: 3 miles
<MartijnVdS> davmor2: this radio only goes up to ~200 meters ;)
<davmor2> MartijnVdS: that's no excuse for not having 3 mile wide zig zags ;)
<shauno> bah, I was about to link utwente's sdr until I realised that's what you were talking about
<neuro> evenin' all
<ali1234> http://imagebin.org/270390
 * neuro noticed an interesting coincidence just now
<ali1234> whatever it is is obviously not random
<neuro> this youtube video accurately describes the number of times i've put petrol in my car in the last 12 months: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3F0rPFASUXY
<shauno> the backstory on their rebuild mentions they get the occaisional front-end overload from the pager system the uni uses
<MartijnVdS> ali1234: the bottom of the page has a chat, you could ask there
<MartijnVdS> this would have been awesome to have in the 70s-80s
<shauno> looks a lot like the strange lines fldigi gives me, until I realised it was showing my laptops fans spinning up
<diddledan> fldigi?
<shauno> converter for a lot of the digital modes you'll find on HF
<mgdm> two laptops running fldigi with the output to speakers is an entertaining if pointless way to communicate across a room
<shauno> on my laptop the internal mic gets enough feedback from the speakers that it works quite well doing morse & rtty off websdr.  but I get straight artifacts from the fan noise
<diddledan> I Fear you've outgeeked me
<shauno> well, not so strange once you realise what they are.  strange when they're "just lines"
<MartijnVdS> Whoa.. very clear broadcast from the US (some god stuff)
<MartijnVdS> 15825 / AM
<ali1234> it's really impressive that they can digitize so much of the spectrum
<MartijnVdS> 15610 / AM -> WEWN
<MartijnVdS> "Catholic Apologist"..
<ali1234> a lot of the station labels seem wrong
<MartijnVdS> ali1234: I guess that's a database of *official* broadcasters for those frequencies
<ali1234> yeah
<MartijnVdS> ali1234: 12015 = Radio North Korea
<MartijnVdS> English-language news from the Iranian gov't @ 9715 8-)
<ali1234> lulz
<ali1234> "obama had better think twice!"
<ali1234> huh... none of those are the freq we're listening to it on :S
<ali1234> 9700 seems to be a crazy person
<MartijnVdS> ali1234: another religious channel
<brobostigon> oh dear.
<MartijnVdS> ali1234: http://www.overcomerministry.org/
<MartijnVdS> Somehow, those people have a lot of high-power transmitters
<brobostigon> things should be very secular and humanist really.
<MartijnVdS> whoa.. 9500 -> Australia
<MartijnVdS> "Good morning to you!"
<MartijnVdS> that signal went a long way around the planet
<shauno> I've heard of people picking up their own messages, and timing the difference between transmit & receive
<MrFukinMoo_> hello
<MrFukinMoo_> lo :D
<andylock1an> howdy
<andylock1an> heya
<andylockran> hey folks
<andylockran> any coders looking for a job in central london?
<popey> have you posted to linuxjobs?
<andylockran> not yet
<andylockran> boss is yet to sign off hiring officially
<andylockran> so not yet advertising
<mgdm> by 'coders', what specifically do you mean?
<andylockran> someone that knows coding
<mgdm> I know a guy who knows COBOL, that what you mean? :-P
<Azelphur> Hmm, I have this headset, http://www.gadgetlite.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/09/logitech-g930-wireless-gaming-headset.jpeg the arm that holds the bucket on has snapped, is it worth trying to glue it? o.O
<Azelphur> not sure if glue would hold long term
<popey> Azelphur in "breaking stuff" non-news
 * Azelphur breaks all the things
<Azelphur> technically it is quite old now, had it a few years
<Azelphur> at ~15 hours a day usage, it ain't bad to get this many years out of it, I guess.
<gordonjcp> andylockran: what kind of coders?
<gordonjcp> andylockran: and does it have to be London?
<gordonjcp> I could do London, for an additional Â£5000 per day
<bigcalm> Good evening peeps :)
#ubuntu-uk 2013-09-10
<DJones> Morning
<dwatkins> allo
<dwatkins> I just discovered http://www.datasheetarchive.com/ - I can see this is going to be extremely useful
<MartijnVdS> *bookmark*
<dwatkins> I never expected a promoted link on Twitter to actually be useful.
<popey> http://www.jmedved.com/usbamps/ want
<bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
<JamesTait> Good morning all, happy Swap Ideas Day! :-D
<brobostigon> good morning everyone.
<MrFukinMoo> Morning andy , how are you doing , im up in glasgow and can do the night train service for weekly based commuting , what kind of coding are you after ?
<DJones> I wonder whether that was the wrong channel
<AlanBell> in response to andylockran yesterday I think
<DJones> Ah
<bigcalm> AlanBell: thanks for the card :)
 * bigcalm tickles popey
 * popey tickles bigcalm 
<MartijnVdS> http://www.tikkels.nl/smaken.html ?
<blazemore> Is this a social channel?
<DGJones> Fairly social :)
<DGJones> Most things get talked about/discussed as long as they're not too far away from reasonable discussion
<brobostigon> and reasonable discussion includes talking about beer and curry, :)
<Laney> we are a social channel for social people
<DGJones> Just don't mention the war
<DGJones> Have to say that IRC has been quiet this morning
<directhex> we'll have no trouble here
<SuperMatt> twelvty!
<dwatkins> one!!!!11111!!!
<MartijnVdS> !!1eleventyone!!!1
<bigcalm> One-one was a horse. One-two was one too. One-one won one race. One-two won one too
<DGJones> I'd forgotten today was the #ubuntu-uk bingo game
<MartijnVdS> Ooh, a new Computerphile video!
<mgdm> I don't know what that is, but I don't think I'm going to watch any video today that isn't the new Arcade Fire track
<MartijnVdS> mgdm: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5sskbSvha9M
<mgdm> I think it's on for the 3rd time this morning
<mungbean> remember that floating wizard thig from teh dungeons and dragons cartoon? i just aciidentally made his hat out of blue tac without noticing
<mungbean> or was it another cartoon? some floating black wizard hat?
<ali1234> he-man
<ali1234> http://images.fanpop.com/images/image_uploads/He-Man-Masters-of-the-Universe-he-man-604198_393_616.jpg
<mungbean>  orko
<mungbean> thats him \p/
<ali1234> i don't believe this is a coincidence either http://www.ffcompendium.com/misc/9-orkoandvivi-o.jpg
<mungbean> hmm
<popey> anyone want a tizen dev phone? https://developer.tizen.org/support/development-unit-program/available-development-units
<popey> "These are not phones, and cannot connect to a GSM network."
<MartijnVdS> So.. 3G only? :P
<directhex> tizen on phones is a waste of your time.
<popey> Oh dear. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-berkshire-24028902
<mungbean> any closer pics of the letterbox?
<mungbean> i mean "letterbox"
<popey> unsurprising self-promotion from Geller
<popey> my nephew lives in Sonning. I should get him to take a better pic.
<popey> http://www.getreading.co.uk/news/local-news/post-box-prank-mystifies-villagers-5874497
<mungbean> wikipedia says uri geller is a magician
<mungbean> so he's admitted he was a fraud in the 80s then?
<mungbean> " URI GELLER has lifted the lid on his secret past as a SPY - and told how his spoon-bending antics were just a cover."
<mungbean> so say the sun
<popey> he calls himself a mystifier
<mungbean> thats one way to distance yourself from fraud.."it was a cover up for spying"
<ali1234> uh...not really
<mungbean> ah he claims he was in psychic ops
<directhex> it;s not fraud unless you claim to talk to the dead
<MartijnVdS> psycho ops
<mungbean> For years Geller was apparently part of the CIAâs psychic opps programme whose brief was to organise mind-reading against the enemy. The programme was closed in 1995, but Geller will confirm that after 9/11 he got a call. âThe only thing I can tell you is that I was reactivated.â And that he happened to be with Michael Jackson the day before.
<directhex> in which case there's a law requiring you to only talk to the dead legitimately
<directhex> The Fraudulent Mediums Act 1951
<mungbean> he's made many fraudulent claims
<ali1234> nobody really believes it though
<ali1234> so who cares?
<mungbean> yeah, TV loved him in the 80s
<directhex> ali1234, this country is filled with morons. "psychics" of all stripes are a multi-million pound industry
<directhex> mungbean, his career was destroyed overnight by james randi, thankfully
<ali1234> not my problem if stupid people want to waste their money
<directhex> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M9w7jHYriFo
<ali1234> actually if the vast majority of the world didn't regularly flush all their money down the toilet civilization would probably collapse
<awilkins>  I see mediums advertised in pubs around here all the time
<awilkins> It's sad, this area is a hotbed of evangelical Christianity and other mental diseases
<directhex> ali1234, it's explicitly evil. see also south park 6x15, "The Biggest Douche in the Universe"
<popey> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rdTqpscvaw4&feature=related also
<ali1234> perhaps, but on the galactic scale of objective evil, it's pretty low
<awilkins> Did you see the news story about the Karate Black Belt Teen Exorcists today?
<mungbean> i was telling my wife, if more people were like me, most shops would cease trading overnight
<awilkins> Video of them doing their Ukranian tour. Guess being poor makes you more vulnerable to memetic diseases
<mungbean> "It's to advertise the Mikron Theatre production of Don't Shoot the messenger at Sonning Lock.
<mungbean> popey: ^^
<popey> there we go
<mungbean> bbc journo didn't do their homework
<popey> well
<popey> scroll down â»
<popey> "Not true we have asked The Mill.
<mungbean> they asked a dolly bird on reception
<popey> lets just pipe that forum here yes? â»
<popey> Êâ¿à² 
<ali1234> http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2013/sep/09/nsa-sabotage-dead-mans-switch
<ali1234> rsync.net weren't the first to do this
<ali1234> pepperfish.net was doing it back in 2003
 * bigcalm tickles a rackspace cloud server
<bigcalm> Wonder if they are having routing problems today
<SuperMatt> oh, did you just notice something?
<SuperMatt> I got a couple of timeouts on a couple of services I run on there
<bigcalm> SuperMatt: getting huge packet loss within their network
<SuperMatt> aha!
<SuperMatt> oh, I'm seeing 0 packet loss from one location, but quite a bit from another
<SuperMatt> my mtr shows me this rackspace-gw.ip4.tinet.net is where it starts losing packets
<ali1234> can ssh tunnel dbus?
<ali1234> like ssh -X, but for dbus?
<mungbean> sounds like hackery
<ali1234> i would like to be able to run notify-send on the remote machine and see the notification on the local machine
<mungbean> https://github.com/guyzmo/notossh
<mungbean> for irssi?
<ali1234> no, i don't use that
<ali1234> just for notifying me when some long job finishes on a server
<mungbean> probably apply the same method to that though
<ali1234> yeah
<SuperMatt> bigcalm: it looks like there's still packet loss in rackspace, but it's not so high that my nagios is complaining any more
<SuperMatt> could be that whatever the issue is, is getting sorted
<bigcalm> Good to know
<SuperMatt> it's still hovering around the 23% mark though, which is less than ideal
<bigcalm> Sluggish terminals are a load of fun
<SuperMatt> no they're not
<SuperMatt> although ssh is a great protocol
<SuperMatt> it's useful that it can survive quite a lot of packet loss
<SuperMatt> at least it gives you a *chance* to fix something remotely
<mungbean> my sun servers are shagged :(
<mungbean> even ILOM is misbehaving
<SuperMatt> ILOM?
<mungbean> like DRAC
 * SuperMatt stares blankly at mungbean 
 * SuperMatt blinks
<mungbean> what servers do u use
<SuperMatt> we simply have a few vms scattered around the country
<mungbean> lights out management/out of band management interface
<mungbean> for accessing a serial console on the box
<mungbean> or performing power on/off indepently of server
<SuperMatt> I see
<MartijnVdS> They've discovered a new species of rabbit: http://i.imgur.com/KX7XAxW.jpg
<mungbean> lovely
<mungbean> can look at that all day
<mungbean> why do people have audible email notifications in office environment?
<jpds> mungbean: Because they don't have libnotify.
<mungbean> :(
<mungbean> constant ding dong swoosh and etc
<dwatkins> I have a colleauge who has his IM "bing" on all the time, so every time I message him, I get a bing
<dwatkins> ...and then there's the humming
<mgdm> send him messages timed so it spells 'eejit' in morse, or some such
<brobostigon> mine phone has a cookoo noise for incoming emails in k9, very amusing.
<brobostigon> my*
<dwatkins> mgdm: sadly I think the joke would be lost on him
<dwatkins> he doesn't even realise when he's humming
<mgdm> brobostigon: surely a woof would make more sense for K9? :P
<mgdm> this is why I have big headphones
 * mgdm sticks on that new Arcade Fire track *again*
<dwatkins> mgdm: likewise, Sennheiser HD 210s make life bearable
<brobostigon> mgdm: certainly, or a dr who k9 extract.
<dwatkins> my alarm clock is R2D2
<mgdm> dwatkins: I forget precisely what these are, but they're a Scottish company, and they're comfy enough...
<jpds> mungbean: You could imitate the sounds so thta it completely confuses them.
<mgdm> I keep meaning to SSH into someone else's Mac here and abuse the 'say' command
<mungbean> nobody needs aural stimuli for emails
<popey> what if you're alt-tabbed into sommat else?
<ali1234> i've got one of these: http://www.nandahome.com/products/tocky/
<ali1234> and i loaded the audio from this video in it: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hv6RbEOlqRo
<mgdm> that's horrific
<mungbean> wow http://www.flickr.com/photos/rhysdaviesphotography/4443501034/sizes/l/in/set-72157626849039396/
<mungbean> great shot of beachy head
<dwatkins> yeah, very nice
<DJones> Ugh, Windows Live Mail is an appalling email client
<SuperEngineer> DJones: I assume that's copied from an advert for Windows ;)
<DJones> Nope, thats from 4 hours of having to use the pile of &%*$Â£^%
<mungbean> going to wildlife park tomorrow \o/
<bigcalm> Whom here is a nginx fan?
<mgdm> I'm a fan of it
<bigcalm> Old nginx server had two fqdn on SSL on the same server and IP just fine
<mgdm> not used it for much complicated, though
<bigcalm> New nginx server isn't playing ball
<bigcalm> duplicate default server for 0.0.0.0:443
<bigcalm> Ignore me
<bigcalm> I copied a available-sites config but didn't remove default_server from the 2nd conf
<bigcalm> mgdm: ta for being ready
<jussi> AlanBell: you about=
<jussi> ?
<AlanBell> might be :)
<AlanBell> whassup jussi?
<Monotoko> wasps suck
<funkyHat> Do wasps actually contribute usefully to any ecosystem?
<Monotoko> I don't think so, one landed on the back of my neck, I wasn't aware of what it was so put my hand up to get rid of it
<Monotoko> stung my neck and my hand :(
<ali1234> did anyone see that news story the other day about "drunk, unemployed" wasps
<SuperEngineer> bzzzzzzzzzz
<ali1234> it was on the front page of the telegraph of course
<SuperEngineer> funkyHat: actually, yes - they do [surprisingly]
<SuperEngineer> or as one wasp said to the other... Do humans actually contribute usefully to any ecosystem?
<funkyHat> SuperEngineer: what is it? Wikipedia has a deceptively titled "Role in ecosystem" section which doesn't really explain much at all
<funkyHat> SuperEngineer: we make pandas have babies when they don't want to so they won't become extinct... surely that counts for something?
<funkyHat> Oh! If we didn't have fig wasps then we wouldn't have figs. I've never tried a fig, but fig wasps sound ok.
<SuperEngineer> funkyHat: they eat debris, waste, bugs & harmful insects [& humans at pubs]
<ali1234> pandas keep the bamboo under control
<SuperEngineer> ali1234: and make us all smile
<ali1234> not me
<SuperEngineer> boo hiss
<ali1234> o_o
 * SuperEngineer sends virtual wasp to ali1234 
<popey> ali1234 has a heart of stone
<AlanBell> minecraft question, do mods such as the lion king mod work on Ubuntu?
<diddledan> AlanBell: afaik yes
<ali1234> lion king mod?
<AlanBell> apparently that is what all the cool kids are playing
<ali1234> the mods are all patched java classes
<ali1234> so they all can work potentially
<ali1234> some of them have weird patching methods, but if oyu know what you're doing you can bypass that
<ali1234> that mod looks pretty cool
<davmor2> AlanBell: you know you're a geek right and not allowed in the cool kids group? ;)
<AlanBell> yeah, I don't do games
<MartijnVdS> Argh @ car stereos
<davmor2> MartijnVdS: problem?
<MartijnVdS> davmor2: Had to use extreme force to get the old one out (the "keys" didn't do their job -- could only get the radio out 1cm)
<MartijnVdS> davmor2: and the new radio expects the red and yellow wires to be reversed (12V continuous vs 12V when ignition is on)
<MartijnVdS> so I have to find some kind of converter block or something
<davmor2> MartijnVdS: so pull the pins out of the current plug and then swap them around ;)
<MartijnVdS> davmor2: yes.. pull them out of the plug. How? :)
<davmor2> MartijnVdS: have I got to tell you everything sheesh ;)
<MartijnVdS> the lead for my old radio had a plastic sleeve + connector in the middle
<MartijnVdS> to rearrange the 12V lines
<davmor2> MartijnVdS: :( sound like you are outta luck unless you cut the cable and solder it I guess
<MartijnVdS> davmor2: I'm going to check Halfords tomorrow, see if they have some kind of convertor/extension lead I can (ab)use
<davmor2> MartijnVdS: you in the UK then dude?
<MartijnVdS> davmor2: no, but we have Halfords in .nl :)
<AlanBell> MartijnVdS: in Halfords in .nl do they sell beam deflectors for driving in the UK?
<MartijnVdS> AlanBell: they do
<popey> AlanBell: have you ever played CaH?
<AlanBell> MartijnVdS: cool, I was wondering if they were even a think outside of the UK
<AlanBell> popey: nope
<blazemore> Any League of Legends ppl?
<andylockran> nope
<directhex> dota2 4 evah!
<ali1234> do we have any sound editors that aren't audacity?
<ali1234> ugh, launchpad is really messed up
<diddledan> that;'s windows 8.1 preview installed *ducks*
<ali1234> http://www.zimagez.com/zimage/screenshot-100913-211108.php
<mungbean> wow, new oz PM https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=zyY-xI6zgfk
<diddledan> he looks very uncomfortable
<mungbean> odd guy
<mungbean> Blackberry
<mungbean> 9.3%
<mungbean> 1.7%
<mungbean> 0.1%
<mungbean> market share uk/us/china
<dutchie> directhex: woo dota
<bigcalm> What language are upstart scripts?
<bigcalm> I'm guessing bash
<bigcalm> But likely wrong
<diddledan> bigcalm: they're a unique format
<diddledan> bigcalm: they're more config files than scripts
<bigcalm> Okay, ta
#ubuntu-uk 2013-09-11
<moodoo> morning all
<AlanBell> morning moodoo
<MartijnVdS> \o
<MartijnVdS> \o/ netflix launched in .nl
<dwatkins> congrats, MartijnVdS
<diddledan> MartijnVdS: is it a ghost town of really naff stuff like it was in the uk when they first launched it?
<MartijnVdS> diddledan: it has Doctor Who
<diddledan> \o/
<MartijnVdS> and Pixar films
<MartijnVdS> and lots of well-known TV shows
<MartijnVdS> but yeah, I'd expected more
<dwatkins> I've been watching Orange is the New Black recently, and Black Books.
<dwatkins> No idea if they're likely to be on Netflix-NL, mind you,
<MartijnVdS> diddledan: both are
<MartijnVdS> Orange is the new Black is the first thing you see when you log in
<dwatkins> No surprise, it's their own series.
<JamesTait> Good morning all, happy Hot Cross Bun Day! :-D
 * DJones points to Easter being about 5 months thataway ---->
<dwatkins> merry summer solstice, JamesTait
<JamesTait> DJones, what, we're only allowed to enjoy them at Easter?
<moodoo> 15 saturdays left until christmas :p
<DJones> JamesTait: I was working on only allowed to punish yourselves with them at easter, horrible things
<JamesTait> dwatkins, is it really? Seems a bit early.
<JamesTait> DJones, ah, then I can understand your position, even if I disagree with it. ;)
<dwatkins> 09:37 < JamesTait> Good morning all, happy Hot Cross Bun Day! :-D
<JamesTait> moodoo, SHHHH!
<DJones> JamesTait: I don't like sweet things, so that covers anything like that, give me something savoury anyday
<JamesTait> dwatkins, OK, I'm with you now.  Coffee hasn't kicked in yet.
<dwatkins> ;) I have soup, as I have already had several cups of tea.
<brobostigon> good morning everyone.
<SuperMatt> morning brobostigon
<brobostigon> morning SuperMatt
<diddledan> is it normal to be working with two laptops and a dual-headed desktop all at the same time? :-p
<Monotoko> I have energy drink... have had energy drink since 6 this morning
<DJones> Ooh, First ever Doctor who to be broadcast in a restored format
<diddledan> Monotoko: I has dietcoke and pepsi max - does that count as NRG drink?
<Monotoko> DJones: When? Where?
<brobostigon> i just have powerful coffee, that does me fine.
<Monotoko> diddledan: I had Monster Ripper saved since I knew I needed to come into the office early...
<DJones> Monotoko: Just mentions it on the bbc website http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-24038234 Doesn't give a date that I saw
<Monotoko> ... I can't believe that worked
 * Monotoko blinks at his computer screen
<diddledan> o_O
<diddledan> was it awesome?
<Monotoko> I just had to install vanilla 3.11 in order to upgrade Debian because our crappy hosting provider give their own custom compiled kernel
<Monotoko> my solution was so far out there, and I doubted it would work - but it did without a hitch
<popey> diddledan: dunno, i have 3 phones, two tablets, two laptops and a desktop on my desk
<diddledan> popey: ooh, good idea, airdisplay from my mac to my ipad for another screen! :-p
<bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
<Monotoko> 'morning
<DJones> popey: Do you have any empty space on the desk?
 * dwatkins has pretty much the same as popey - but with two deskphones, two mobiles
<diddledan> I've got two mobiles and a deskphone
<diddledan> my tablets are elsewhere
<DJones> I thought I was bad with 2 desktops, a tablet & a mobile phone
<dwatkins> I 'only' have three tablets, as the other two are being used by colleagues, my desk tends to be used as the charging station (we support mobile apps, too)
<Monotoko> I have a movile... a tablet, and a desktop
<Monotoko> *mobile
<popey> DJones: not at the moment, no
<popey> its a bit of a mess today
<popey> ali1234 enjoyed this last time.. https://canyoufindit.co.uk/
<dwatkins> I think I'd rather do competitions that teach me sysadmin and hacking ;)
<andrewebdev> anyone here know the ins/outs of port forwarding on a TalkTalk router?
<DJones> andrewebdev: Not one I've had anything to do with, but http://portforward.com/ should have some info
<DJones> Probably just a case of finding the manufacturer/model number and searching for it
<andrewebdev> well, my issue is somewhat unique
<andrewebdev> I'm able to forward a port fine so that someone from the outside can access something
<andrewebdev> but I myself, cannot access it
<andrewebdev> using the same ip/port
<brobostigon> from inside or outside?
<DJones> Is that using the external ip address of the machine, some routers force you to use the internal ip address of the machine you want to access
<andrewebdev> inside
<DJones> I use ssh from inside & outside my network, inside I have to ssh to the 192.168 address, but externally I use the public ip address
<DJones> That sounds like the same situation
<andrewebdev> ok. It's strange because it makes it difficult to test callbacks from web services
<andrewebdev> if I cannot check if my ports are forwarded correctly
<dwatkins> andrewebdev: can you ping the machine internally using its local accress on the same subnet?
<andrewebdev> yup that's fine
<andrewebdev> I can also access it perfectly with http://localhost:8000/
<dwatkins> is the ssh daemon running on the standard port, and can you ssh -vvv to it to see if it responds?
<andrewebdev> well it's not a ssh port
<andrewebdev> or service
<DJones> dwatkins: May not be ssh, i used ssh as an example
<dwatkins> oh ok
<popey> i set my external dyndns hostname in my /etc/hosts file
<dwatkins> but yeah, start from the most basic tests to see if it's running where it should be etc.
<popey> that way I can use the external hostname internally
<popey> breaks when I leave the house of course â»
<dwatkins> I have my server at home giving out its local IP address to local machines, so that I can use its dyndns address internally or externally
<andrewebdev> popey, that's not a bad idea actually
<popey> so if you go to popey.mooo.com you get my external IP, I get the internal one
<AlanBell> my router bounces stuff back to me from inside which is nice
<Laney> yeah I set that up
<Laney> "port reflection" I think it was called
<Laney> or maybe "internal port forwarding"
<popey> hmm http://hax.at/text/41
<popey> seems fixable via iptables
<MartijnVdS> openwrt fixes it using iptables as well I think
<MartijnVdS> let me check
<MartijnVdS> ah it uses DNAT instead of MASQUERADE for reflection, but similar to that, popey
<andrewebdev> popey, does that mean it's a issue on ubuntu or some service on the router?
<DJones> Looks like the Sky routers do the same thing via iptables if you telnet into the router
<mgdm> Are Sky ones still just rebranded Netgears?
<Laney> banshee just took me from Mogwai to songs from Lion King
<Laney> jarring
<DJones> mgdm: Not sure, I've just got the latest white one replacing an one of the old black ones
<mgdm> they at one point were dishing out DG834GTs, I think
<MartijnVdS> Laney: at least it's Lion King, not some death/doom metal.
<popey> http://hax.at/text/41 didn't work
<popey> iptables -t nat -I POSTROUTING -o br0 -s 192.168.144.0/24 -d 192.168.144.0/24 -j MASQUERADE
<popey> added that (changing 144 to 1) and rebooted router.
<MartijnVdS> popey: what's the router running?
<popey> dd-wrt
<MartijnVdS> ah.. I don't know how to configure that. On OpenWRT it's a single flag in /etc/config/network or /etc/config/firewall
<DJones> http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2013/09/mass-effect-composer-ubuntu-14-04-start-up-sounds
<MartijnVdS> popey: office music! http://open.spotify.com/artist/6VsiDFMZJlJ053P1uO4A6h
<DJones> Hi toby10ant
<toby10ant> Hi
<toby10ant> I'm new to the ubuntu community and wondered if anything was happening for ubuntu jam in the uk?
<DJones> There should be a couple of people around that can give you an idea of what events/meetings are going on
<DJones> I thought there was a web page with a list of events, but can't seem to find it
<DJones> Found it http://loco.ubuntu.com/teams/ubuntu-uk/events/ However only thing mentioned is a Real Ale Train meetup
<AlanBell> hi toby10ant not much happening in real life for the global jam
<moodoo> how about this page - http://loco.ubuntu.com/events/
<moodoo> lol :)
<daftykins> hey all. i've got a bare metal install file server (10.04.4) that i was updating with the latest kernel refresh yesterday. during the "update-grub" run however, it was getting totally stuck to the point i had to kill the process. i found this in dmesg: http://paste.ubuntu.com/6092369/
<AlanBell> but there are various online activities
<moodoo> only the real ale train for the uk at the moment
<MartijnVdS> daftykins: that doesn't look good.
<MartijnVdS> daftykins: broken disk?
<moodoo> toby10ant: hanging around in this channel will help :D
<daftykins> the kernel going on was 2.6.32-50-generic-pae - the smartctl output showed nothing wrong with the disk
 * AlanBell is going up to London later this afternoon
<daftykins> now - i do have a very bad habit of removing the running kernel after installing the new, before i reboot :D but i've never seen this before?
<MartijnVdS> daftykins: grub-probe tried to access a device that doesn't exist or takes VERY long to reply
<toby10ant> okay, it actually sounded a really cool event, just I don't think I could justify traveeling for it
<MartijnVdS> daftykins: so you either need to let it run, or have it skip that device, IF you can find out which device that is
<DJones> toby10ant: Wherabouts are you based
<toby10ant> Nottingham
<moodoo> toby10ant: o/ :)
<daftykins> MartijnVdS: there's a single HDD with a large XFS RAID volume, but since it's doing things with GRUB surely it's only on the boot disk?
<daftykins> or does GRUB probe every device 0o
<moodoo> toby10ant: where abouts?
<toby10ant> moodoo: I was thinking of going along to the local linux group, to see what it's like
<MartijnVdS> daftykins: grub-probe tries to access a lot of disk-like devices in /dev
<davmor2> Man working boston hours in the uk is a killer :)
<MartijnVdS> daftykins: and some not in there (using the bios)
<moodoo> toby10ant: notts lug is a great bunch of guts.
<moodoo> guys
<MartijnVdS> moodoo: guys with guts? 8-)
<toby10ant> moodoo: guts lol
<moodoo> yeah yeah yeah ;)
<DJones> moodoo: I think that was deliberate
<davmor2> moodoo: I've seen you gut in photos you were right the first time :P
<moodoo> davmor2: shush man, toby10ant is new here, don't want to give a wrong impression from a fellow nottingham user
<daftykins> MartijnVdS: "sudo update-grub" is sufficient to re-do the process yeah? that's what i was trying a couple of times to see if it'd complete
<MartijnVdS> daftykins: yeah
<daftykins> ty sir
<MartijnVdS> daftykins: there might be a "no probe" command line option
<MartijnVdS> daftykins: to stop it from doing BIOS calls
<davmor2> moodoo: come on they are linux geeks someone has to keep the beer houses open ;)
<daftykins> do you think it was my removing the prior kernel before rebooting into the new that's likely the reason for making it go funny? :D
<MartijnVdS> daftykins: no
<moodoo> davmor2: lol
<MartijnVdS> daftykins: unless you haven't rebooted yet
<MartijnVdS> (yay double negatives)
<daftykins> i've not no
<moodoo> toby10ant: you live in the center?
<daftykins> wow it just completed update-grub fine
<MartijnVdS> daftykins: then it might be looking for a module to load, and not finding it
<toby10ant> moodoo: no i live a bit out
<daftykins> i guess its' hissy fit was temporary :D
<daftykins> now i just have to see if it'll reboot and survive \o/
<MartijnVdS> *\o/*
<toby10ant> mooddoo: yourself?
<moodoo> toby10ant: calverton
<toby10ant> moodoo: so you attend lug meetings much?
<daftykins> MartijnVdS: thanks :)
<moodoo> toby10ant: not in a while
<moodoo> toby10ant: http://nlug.ml1.co.uk/ :)
<toby10ant> moodoo: cheers I was thinking of going along to the next meetup :)
<moodoo> toby10ant: and perhaps we could arrange an ubuntu hour in one of the local pubs :D
<toby10ant> moodoo: perhaps I live in kimberley and don't have a car atm
<moodoo> ah ok :)  kimberley ubuntu hour ;)
<moodoo> toby10ant: if you're not sure what I mean - https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Hour
<toby10ant> moodoo: that makes more sense!!
<moodoo> toby10ant: so go here and buy a tshirt/stickers lol http://shop.canonical.com/
<toby10ant> I've actually already got some stickers, from a few years ago on my laptop
<toby10ant> :)
<DJones> Monotoko: Given you're interest earlier in the Doctor Who comment http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/09/11/doctor_who_50th_anniversary_pic/
<moodoo> yay
<Azelphur> meanwhile, in Linux, my PCs sound card is broken so I'm using my laptop as a sound card.
<Azelphur> pulseaudio <3
<MartijnVdS> Azelphur: How did you do that?
<MartijnVdS> Break a sound card?
<MartijnVdS> #blamepulseaudio?
<Azelphur> MartijnVdS: I have no idea, it just seems to no longer function on my PC, tried it with a live xubuntu disk and everything, pulseaudio says its outputting, but nothing comes out.
<MartijnVdS> Azelphur: weird!
<Azelphur> yea
<Azelphur> it's only temporary till my USB headset gets fixed, I killed that too
<Azelphur> :<
<MartijnVdS> Azelphur: http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B000L98002
<Azelphur> lol
<ali1234> so, cassette tapes
<MartijnVdS> ali1234: vinyl records
<ali1234> no, cassette tapes. i have one with some old C64 source code on it, which was taped over
<MartijnVdS> ali1234: oops
<ali1234> i have a theory that since the C64 datasette is mono and the music was taped in stereo
<ali1234> then the data should still be present between the stereo tracks
<ali1234> albeit in very weak form
<MartijnVdS> ali1234: it might be, call the GCHQ to be sure :)
<popey> ali1234: thats quite a narrow gap isn't it?
<popey> although that tech probably not narrow by modern standard
<ali1234> http://matesy.de/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=55&Itemid=74&lang=en
<ali1234> i need one of these
<popey> ali1234: did you see the gchq thing?
<ali1234> yeah, i'm no good at ciphers
<popey> oh, i thought you were
<NET||abuse> d
<NET||abuse> umm, sorry :P
<ali1234> so i was thinking about ripping the read head from a old hard disk, attaching it to a servo, and using it to scan the tape in 2d
<MartijnVdS> ghetto forensics
<ali1234> i need to know more about cassette recorders though. like does the erase head wipe the whole width of the tape?
<MartijnVdS> ali1234: just the half of the side you're recording, I guess
<popey> wish I still had some of my old casettes
<ali1234> true, so it must be localized
<popey> think my mum threw them out
<MartijnVdS> I have some of mine, but nothing to play on
<AlanBell> if it was mono, but recorded on a stereo recording rig, it probably got recorded as two lines
<popey> if it was his own code on a tapedeck, thats less likely
<ali1234> AlanBell: that's the thing - the C64 cassette deck is mono, it was recorded over with music on a stereo tape desk
<popey> most people used crappy little mono tape decks, especially on c64
<ali1234> it was the original datasette, so obviously no need for stereo
<AlanBell> plausible then  :)
<popey> would it be "easier" to mask the stereo tracks, obscuring them from the reader
<popey> so the only 'visible' bit was the central mono remains
<AlanBell> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tape_head#Erase_heads
<ali1234> well the stereo reader has two heads
<ali1234> there's a picture on the wiki from that magview machine, there is a gap between the stereo tracks according to that
<AlanBell> I would say that is a lot harder than the awesome teletext recovery
<AlanBell> wonder if gordonjcp knows about the stuff ali1234 did on that
<ali1234> yeah, i've shown him before
<ali1234> "To put this in perspective, the government still has found no one who  can recover the 18-1/2 minute gap in the Nixon Watergate tape. They ran a  test in 2002-2003 with tapes similar to the Watergate tape and recorded  and erased on the same or similar machines. They decided that no one  showed enough promise during these trials to warrant letting them try  the real thing."
<ali1234> sounds like a challenge then
<ali1234> same page does say data recordings can sometimes be recovered
<celestin> any topic?
<popey> celestin: hello
<ali1234> hmm a floppy drive head might work better
<mgdm> Jabber \o/
<mgdm> actually I'm going to upgrade that to Jabber + OTR \o/
<MattJ> Jabber \o/
<MattJ> mgdm \o/
<mgdm> \o/
<Azelphur> \o/
<SuperMatt> me \o/
<Azelphur> him \o/
<SuperMatt> him? /o\
<Azelphur> you \o/?
<MartijnVdS> *\o/* ?
<mralc> hello uk
<mralc> how is everyone?
<mralc> i am new to linux and have installed unbuntu on my laptop
<ali1234> ok, i solved problem number one: how to wind the tape outside of a tape player
<ali1234> with lego
<mgdm> cunning
<ali1234> hmm... i need more gears
<ali1234> these old lego motors do not have gearboxes
<diddledan> hunble bundle 9
<zleap> hi toby10ant
<zleap> tombrough,
<ali1234> diddledan: fez!
<diddledan> has anyone got anywhere with the canyoufindit.co.uk challenge?
<ali1234> i think it is a bazeries cipher
<ali1234> because that would likely make q = e
<Monotoko> if I had about 5 VM's in a virtual network, and I set DNS up on one of them and pointed the others resolv.conf at it, would I be able to use internal DNS names?
<mgdm> Sure
<mgdm> I recommend dnsmasq for the purpose, it's nice and simple
<mgdm> though of course you can use BIND or whatever
<directhex> libvirt uses dnsmasq automatically for this
 * mgdm wonders why xfs (as in X font server) spontaneously went completely mental and ate 2GB of RAM on one machine
#ubuntu-uk 2013-09-12
<ali1234> fez is gooooood
<ali1234> completely crazy though
<moodoo> morning all
<TheOpenSourcerer> yo
<MartijnVdS> \o
<AlanBell> o/
<dwatkins> ahoy
* popey changed the topic of #ubuntu-uk to: Welcome to #ubuntu-uk! http://ubuntu-uk.org | This channel is publicly archived http://irclogs.ubuntu.com | Mailing List http://tinyurl.com/uukml | Support Guidelines http://tinyurl.com/uuksupport | IRC stats: http://tinyurl.com/uukstat | next meeting TBA | ubuntuî¿
<moodoo> great podcast/hangout last night popey :)
<MartijnVdS> "podout"
<MartijnVdS> (hangcast sounds too macabre)
<popey> thanks MartijnVdS
<MartijnVdS> popey: I'm old-school, I wait for the mp3 ;)
<popey> having problems with that!
<MartijnVdS> :(
<popey> It's on my iHP-140 which just locked up
<MartijnVdS> that's not good
<popey> its annoying
<popey> i wanted to merge the audio from that with the MP4 from youtube
<popey> now I need to wait for the battery to die
<popey> or take it apart and disconnect battery
<MartijnVdS> popey: you're not alone with "un-cooperative hardware": http://lkml.indiana.edu/hypermail/linux/kernel/1309.1/01669.html
<popey> yay, got it apart
<popey>  balls
<popey> can't power down without removing drive
<jussi> popey: does that thing not have a hard reset button?
<popey> no
<jussi> long press something perhaps?
<popey> no
<MartijnVdS> popey: is it this one? http://ec1.images-amazon.com/media/i3d/01/A/man-migrate/MANUAL000043279.pdf
<MartijnVdS> popey: because that has a "reset" hole next to the USB port
<popey> so it does
<popey> yay
<MartijnVdS> but that might be factory reset
<popey> that was easy
<popey> thanks chaps
<MartijnVdS> np!
<popey> the problem I had previously was it wouldn't show up as a usb device
<popey> BAH!
<popey> won't mount
<popey> wonder if I can remove the disk and read it in a pc
<MartijnVdS> popey: if not, you could at least run photorec against it to recover any files with known headers on there
<MartijnVdS> popey: (image it first!)
<popey> dunno what the on-disk format is though
<popey> need an adapter
<MartijnVdS> popey: do you have a picture of the connector? (or do you already know what it is)
<popey> it's a 1.8" IDE
<popey> http://www.amazon.co.uk/USB-1-8-HARD-DRIVE-ADAPTER/dp/B004351F7K
<MartijnVdS> looks a bit like CompactFlash
<popey> oh, looks like it is
<popey> i forsee a trip to maplin
<popey> bah, they dont sell them
<TheOpenSourcerer> You've really gotto love X. I'm in the office and I needed to see some emails from an old pop account that is only configured on my home desktop.
<TheOpenSourcerer> So I ssh'd -X to my home server, sent a wakeonlan to my desktop, ssh -X to my desktop, start Thunderbird. It then magically appears on my display in the office :-)
<TheOpenSourcerer> I hope all the Wayland/Mir stuff doesn't break this functionality.
<JamesTait> Good morning all, happy Video Games Day! :-D
<bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
<bigcalm> JamesTait: oooh, good time to re-play FEZ then :D
<JamesTait> bigcalm, I'd say it'd be a good day to play minetest with the boys, but that happens most days in some form or another anyway. ;)
<bigcalm> Hehe
<bigcalm> What's minetest?
<JamesTait> bigcalm, like Minecraft, but FLOSS.
<moodoo> minetest?   oooo /me goes looking
<moodoo> http://minetest.net/
<JamesTait> It's in the archive, but IIRC it's quite an old version before saucy - it's getting some pretty serious development at the moment, so it's worth installing it from the PPA.
<brobostigon> good morning everyone.
<bigcalm> popey: mele f10 is in my hands
<bigcalm> Delivery estimate was 4th -> 22nd October
<popey> heh
<MartijnVdS> popey: when the drive is in the iHP, is it detected (does /dev/sdX show up) and does mounting fail?
<MartijnVdS> popey: or doesn't it show up at all?
<popey> nothing in dmesg
<MartijnVdS> does the device work at all?
<popey> yes
<popey> powers up, and if attached goes into USB mode
<MartijnVdS> have you tried wiggling the USB cable/port? Might be a loose contact in there
<MartijnVdS> can it play the file? (you could get it out the old-fashioned way, with analog cables etc.)
<popey> could do
<jussi> TheOpenSourcerer: nice. I should learn how to do this at some point... :D ( I assume certain things need "turning on"
<TheOpenSourcerer> jussi: Nope.
<TheOpenSourcerer> just run ssh -X user@host
<jussi> TheOpenSourcerer: it just works out of the box ?
<MartijnVdS> yeah
<TheOpenSourcerer> Yes!
<TheOpenSourcerer> Absolutely brilliant
<TheOpenSourcerer> And you can chain
 * jussi tests
<TheOpenSourcerer> ssh -X me@host1, ssh -X me@host 2
<TheOpenSourcerer> Then run a GTK type app on the remote host
<TheOpenSourcerer> And watch the magic ;-)
<funkyHat> Well presumably as Wayland/Mir need to act as X servers for legacy apps anyway, that *should* keep working
<TheOpenSourcerer> Weel, as I said earlier I bloody well hope so.
<funkyHat> I would be pretty annoyed if it stopped working too
<TheOpenSourcerer> s/weel/well
<jussi> hey, wait... its a funky funky funkyHat!!!
<jussi> Hiya Matt :D
<jussi> it does appear to work
<jussi> although, gtk apps, I not sure if I have those installed...
<popey> TheOpenSourcerer: http://wayland.freedesktop.org/faq.html "Is Wayland network transparent / does it support remote rendering?"
<popey> dunno if that answers your question
<funkyHat> Hi jussi â¢)
<jussi> "This doesn't mean that remote rendering won't be possible with Wayland, it just means that you will have to put a remote rendering server on top of Wayland. One such server could be the X.org server, but other options include an RDP server, a VNC server or somebody could even invent their own new remote rendering model."
<jussi> so basically, the feature wont disappear, but I guess it will be still provided with X
<popey> if you have x
<ali1234> due to the way wayland works, it won't matter what client you use for remote rendering: since they'll all have to do screen scraping, they'll all be as awful as VNC, even if the protocol happens to be X11
<funkyHat> ali1234: unless you run an X server locally on top of wayland and can forward that through ssh, I presume
<ali1234> yes, that should work okay
<ali1234> the problem is what happens when you try to forward an app that only supports wayland
<ali1234> anything that supports X11 will continue to work fine
<DJones> Sheesh, people had to vote on this? http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-24040130 wonder what it looks like in the water
<bigcalm> I wonder what it tastes like
<ali1234> monkfish is both ugly and delicious
<ali1234> so maybe similar to that
<bigcalm> O M G http://www.bbcgoodfood.com/recipes/1924/baconwrapped-monkfish
<bigcalm> Bacon really is magical food
<mgdm> neuro: who is it that owns Scolocate? I'm sure it's either iomart or Pulsant, and suspect Pulsant, but can you remember?
<neuro> pulsant
<neuro> yes, the company who got booted out of scolocate 8 years ago now owns scolocate
<mgdm> heh, I didn't know they got booted out
<mgdm> why was that?
<neuro> cos they built their own dc ;)
<mgdm> ah
<mgdm> I thought it was going to be an interesting reason
<neuro> mgdm: there may have been more interesting reasons that i wasn't privy to, but that was the main gist
<neuro> lumison turned from a customer to a competitor
<mgdm> ah
<popey> happy birthday JamesTait
<JamesTait> Oh no, it's escaped!
<JamesTait> Thank you popey. It's a vicious rumour though. I don't think I have a birthday.
<bigcalm> JamesTait: you kept that one quiet by informing us of play games day
<bigcalm> JamesTait: and happy birthday
<JamesTait> It's also Cycle to Work day!
<MartijnVdS> JamesTait: but that's 2.5 hours each way!
<bigcalm> I would, if I didn't work from home
<JamesTait> bigcalm, me too. :)
<MartijnVdS> I might cycle to work a few days a week for my new job
<MartijnVdS> next month
<davmor2> Morning all
<JamesTait> MartijnVdS, better get on yer bike then! :-P
<dwatkins> I cycle as much as I can, it's about 5 miles each way.
 * JamesTait looks at davmor2, then at his clock, then back at davmor2.
<JamesTait> davmor2, you're just trying to confuse me, aren't you?
<bigcalm> Hi davmor2
<MartijnVdS> JamesTait: he's on Boston time, or something
<JamesTait> Bostin' time? ;)
<davmor2> JamesTait: the qa team are in a sprint at lexington so I'm on there timezone this week incase I'm needed for anything
<MartijnVdS> there or their?
<MartijnVdS>  
<JamesTait> davmor2, a simple "yes" would have sufficed. ;)
<MartijnVdS> "Thank you for your information, citizen"
<davmor2> MartijnVdS: their
<davmor2> JamesTait: Yes I do it deliberately to confuse you really :D
<JamesTait> I knew it!
<JamesTait> So when am I having my elevenses today?
<dwatkins> eleventy o'clock
 * JamesTait sets his alarm, just in case.
<bigcalm> A bit late for 11es now
<davmor2> JamesTait: when I knock off at 11pm?
<davmor2> JamesTait: you might want to change it's name to supper though :D
<JamesTait> davmor2, I'll be thinking of you. ;)
 * TheOpenSourcerer thinks we should change teen numbers to match the rest, i.e. tenty, tentyone, tentytwo etc...
<MartijnVdS> That's numberwang!
<moodoo> lol
<MartijnVdS> moodoo: Have you read the Reddit thread explaining the rules?
<MartijnVdS> moodoo: http://www.reddit.com/r/britishproblems/comments/1jvgn6/i_said_numberwang_to_the_pet_shop_cashier_when_my/cbioq86
<dwatkins> I think /r/britishproblems/ is my favourite subreddit at the moment.
<MartijnVdS> dwatkins: there's also /r/britishsuccess
<MartijnVdS> dwatkins: and /r/cgpgrey :P
<moodoo> MartijnVdS: that's awesome
<davmor2> moodoo: MartijnVdS: man you guys talking about rules just made me Lose the game
<moodoo> well that's numberwang
 * SuperEngineer hopes he has twotenty twotenty vision if he lives to tentytenty
<dwatkins> eleventy!!!111one!1!!1!1!
<SuperEngineer> dwatkins: not even Bender would try to make people believe that was possible!
<SuperEngineer> !Futurama
<SuperEngineer> [time to add an entry to lubotto!]
<dwatkins> yes
<inadream>  /msg nickserv dispense
<andylockran> hey
<andylockran> Ladies and Gents - good afternonn
<BigRedS> Anyone know where MySQL startup messages go now that it's apparently not to stdout or daemon.log?
<BigRedS> aha! /var/log/mysql/error.log
<diddledan> thankyou scrollback for making me lose the game
<mgdm> people still go on about that? Oh dear.
<directhex> moo
<mgdm> morning
<daftykins> hi
<diddledan> mgdm: the game has no finish
<daftykins> yeah i never got that game bs, ridiculous idea imo
<diddledan> daftykins: yet you still lose it
<daftykins> seeing friends pretending to care... *shakes head*
<daftykins> that's just an attempt for said losers to try and draw others into their bs :)
<diddledan> lol
<daftykins> sorry, got a bit rude there
<daftykins> but i feel very strongly about that one :P
<diddledan> you're just annoyed that you lost :-p
<daftykins> don't make me come over there!
<diddledan> didn't zimbra used to belong to vmware? when did that change?
<daftykins> maybe it passed you by whilst you were playing the game :(
 * daftykins ducks
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> nah i thought that
<BigRedS> diddledan: a couple of weeks ago
<mgdm> directhex: that indiegogo thing is priceless
<mgdm> (well, not quite, about $7600 it seems, but I didn't pay it)
#ubuntu-uk 2013-09-13
<brobostigon> good morning everyone.
<nigelb> Morning brobostigon
<brobostigon> morning nigelb
<JamesTait> Good morning all, happy Friday the 13th and happy Programmers' Day! :-D
<brobostigon> morning JamesTait
<bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
<brobostigon> morning bigcalm
<bigcalm> Howdy
<MartijnVdS> \o
<brobostigon> morning MrFukinMoo
<brobostigon> morning MartijnVdS
<brobostigon> sorry, tab fail
<popey> MrFukinMoo: you might want to rethink that irc nickname
<brobostigon> any sugegstions for an android twitter app, which will update and check even automatically, even with android's auto-sync off.?
<MartijnVdS> brobostigon: uh.. that's the point of turning auto-sync off: so it doesn't do that
 * MartijnVdS likes the default twitter app
<brobostigon> MartijnVdS: i want to be able to turn auto-sync off, and then say to it, ok, check every hour or so. and keep control.
<MartijnVdS> brobostigon: what's wrong with auto-sync though?
<MartijnVdS> brobostigon: All of android works like that: auto-sync off -> no (or a lot less) background data
<brobostigon> MartijnVdS: i may not want everything to auto-sync, battery life for example.
<MartijnVdS> brobostigon: The screen is the biggest battery user, not the radio.
<brobostigon> MartijnVdS: i agree.
<MartijnVdS> also, keep it connected as often as possible (I charge at home AND at work ;)
<MartijnVdS> I never get it <70%
<brobostigon> i try and do that also, but soemtimes circumstances make that difficult.
<brobostigon> i will try the standard twitter app.
<mungbean> is 08438320100 a real number?
<MartijnVdS> That's numberwang!
<mungbean> bah. what good is reporting numbers anyway
<MartijnVdS> brobostigon: I have one of these: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Duracell-Mobile-Phone-Portable-Charger/dp/B005EF2TG4
<MartijnVdS> brobostigon: for emergencies, mostly
<mungbean> some numbers stay open annoying people for years
<brobostigon> MartijnVdS: i recognise tht, i think you have mntioned it before.
<mungbean> any cyanogen users know how to add their own personal emergency calls number?
<MartijnVdS> mungbean: what, it doesn't recognise 0118 999 881 999 119 725 ... 3 by default?
<mungbean> :P
<popey> http://www.unknownphone.com/search.php?num=08438320100 looks like you're not alone mungbean
<mungbean> yeah popey its a pain because nothing ever appears to get done about them :(
<Laney> how can an off peak return nottingham-heathrow be 100 quid?!?!
<MartijnVdS> Laney: Privitization
<mungbean> including flights ? :P
<Laney> * massage and grape feeding included
<Laney> ah
<brobostigon> another good exmaple. my gf asked me a few weeks ago, if we fancied a weekend in edinburgh, i said fine, looked at train cost, Â£270 offpeak return for us both. ouch.
<MartijnVdS> brobostigon: wow.. it's almost cheaper to fly
<Laney> nice!
<mungbean> so you took her for a nandos instead?
<brobostigon> MartijnVdS: exactly.
<Laney> stayed at the travelodge by the m1 instead right?
<mungbean> volume of spotify ads is LOUD
<MartijnVdS> mungbean: Spotify has ads?!
<mungbean> only every other song
<MartijnVdS> mungbean: Ah wait.. I have "Premium"
<mungbean> i use it to listen to songs which i invariably buy
<bigcalm> I pay for Spotify so that I can use it on my phone
<popey> \o/ Spotify
<mgdm> o/
<mgdm> I mean \o/
<bigcalm> Because of that, I can also use it on my android tv dongle and listen to all musics though the hi-fi connected to the tv
<mgdm> they added the new Arcade Fire track so I can stop listening to it on YouTube \o/
<bigcalm> I should mutter something about using the mele f10 with the android tv stick
<bigcalm> At some point I might
<bigcalm> All good so far, though the air mouse takes some getting used to. Very much not like using a wiimote
<mgdm> We have those air mouse things in the conference rooms here
<mgdm> they're not that good
<bigcalm> It's nice having a full keyboard in your hands though
<bigcalm> Haven't been able to connect to skype yet, but that might be because I'm possibly not putting my password in correctly
<bigcalm> I want to find out what the remote is like as a skype handset
<mgdm> reminds me a bit of https://twitter.com/mgdm/status/255352132029513728/photo/1
<bigcalm> HAha
<bigcalm> Yeah, the mele f10 is much more remote sized
<exutux> hi
<exutux> hi
<AlanBell> hi exutux
<exutux> hi all ... http://paste.ubuntu.com/6101144/ this is my little script to get information from network printers getting pdf, it doesn't run on crontab but I don't know why... do you have some advice? thanks in advance
<exutux> ehy AlanBell hi
<AlanBell> exutux: are you getting errors from it?
<AlanBell> I suspect the environment isn't right when running as a cron task
<AlanBell> or the network operation cant resolve the address or lacks some kind of permission
<exutux> uhm nope AlanBell any error
<exutux> wait maybe I found problem
<exutux> yeah
<exutux> goal! :D
<AlanBell> what was it exutux?
<exutux> AlanBell: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/7607117/pdf-not-generated-using-wkhtmltopdf-using-automated-linux-bash-shell-script
<AlanBell> oh, so a lack of X for the webkit bit to do its thing
<exutux> bye
 * mungbean is making fun 8-bit things out of hama beads http://i.imgur.com/lDgzR6p.jpg
<daftykins> haha :D
<daftykins> i did something similar recently out of small mosaic tiles
<mungbean> for my son of course
<MartijnVdS> sure, "for your son" :P
<daftykins> ^ :D
<MartijnVdS> It's like "for a friend" :P
 * AlanBell bumped in to bug 1222436 already filed by popey 
<gordonjcp> http://media.desura.com/images/groups/1/3/2392/1-8BitCat.jpg
<mungbean> looking for new inspiration
<mungbean> maybe pac man
<MartijnVdS> mungbean: a pong paddle
<DJones> Hmmh, are we missing lubotto
<daftykins> "Your amazon order of GTA V has been dispatched" - :O
<popey> [15682.569787] [drm:i915_set_reset_status] *ERROR* render ring hung inside bo (0xa951000 ctx 1) at 0xa951220
<popey> STAB STAB STAB
<popey> mungbean: looking for something to do? https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.nerdyoctopus.gamedots
<popey> that game is fun
<popey> very simple
<mungbean> looks sweet
<MartijnVdS> daftykins: wut.. yours has?
<MartijnVdS> daftykins: mine is in the "Currently being dispatched"
<daftykins> yes sir
<daftykins> MartijnVdS: xbox or PS3?
<MartijnVdS> Delivery #1: Dispatching now
<MartijnVdS> daftykins: ps3
<mungbean> they going cheap?
<MartijnVdS> got the text from my credit card company this morning (which always means they're starting dispatch)
<mungbean> ah, gta5
<popey> That does look like a very special game
<popey> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2rIJmGj4g-s â»
<mungbean> but if the mugs didn't buy them then no consoles would get off the ground :P
<mungbean> how's the ouya?
<popey> I installed netflix on it today â»
<popey> dead handy
<MartijnVdS> \o/ netflix
<dwatkins> I really hope we get a linux version of Netflix soon.
<MartijnVdS> dwatkins: we will.. once Chrome has HTML5-DRM support
<MartijnVdS> dwatkins: it already works on Chromebook
<MartijnVdS> (yes DRM is evil etc.)
<popey> dwatkins: works in pipelight
<mungbean> so any nadroid can run netflix
<popey> yeah, i use it on android now and then
 * dwatkins goes to research pipelight
<popey> not often because the audio on android devices I have is terrible
<mungbean> spotify made unity freeze :(
<daftykins> MartijnVdS: i guess we won't be playing online then :(
<popey> what version of spotify?
<popey> is gta5 not cross platform gaming?
<daftykins> it's not been announced for next gen or PC yet
<daftykins> only PS3 and xbox360 are getting it for now
<MartijnVdS> GTA Online won't be out for a few weeks either
<MartijnVdS> (the online part of GTAv)
<mungbean> popey: 0.9.1.55.gbdd3b79f
<MartijnVdS> that's current
<mungbean> alt-f1 pkill sporift resurrected unity
<mungbean> i'm on 12.04 here
<mungbean> http://petapixel.com/2013/09/12/marked-photographs-show-iconic-prints-edited-darkroom/
<popey> http://www.amazon.co.uk/Nokia-Dual-Music-Phone-Unlocked/dp/B005W3HOMM
<popey> so cheap
<Azelphur> popey: on the smartphone side, I'm a real fan of this one at the moment http://www.carphonewarehouse.com/mobiles/mobile-phones/HUAWEI_Y300
<Azelphur> brand new on pay as you go for Â£70, runs android 4.1 ootb, has a decent dual core 1ghz cpu, adreno 203, 5mp camera, microsd up to 32gb
<Azelphur> really nice piece of kit that one :)
<davmor2> Morning all
<bashrc> Could ubuntu touch be installed on it?
<Azelphur> bashrc: I doubt it, atm ubuntu touch only supports the nexus line of devices afaik
<popey> if someone ports it, sure
<popey> Azelphur: nope
<popey> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Touch/Devices
<Azelphur> well yea, if someone ports it, sure
<Azelphur> popey: I was right then,I was almost right then, only nexus devices are officially supported, but lots of third party ports about
<popey> nice device
<Azelphur> that's a very impressive amount of third party ports actually, I'm surprised
<popey> mostly thanks to xda types
<Azelphur> :)
<Azelphur> but yea, couple of my friends bought the Y300, and I got one for my mum, everybody reports it's good stuff.
<Azelphur> bashrc: I notice the G300 is supported, the G300 is VERY similar hardware wise to the Y300
<ali1234> lots of the ports broke with the container flip
<ali1234> ie nearly everything on that list
<Azelphur> I'm sure I've read that SOME G300 roms work on the Y300, so the build for the G300 MAY work
<Azelphur> and if it doesn't, it's certainly not a huge jump to port it
<bashrc> Would be nice to have an affordable UbuntuPhone
<Azelphur> indeed it woul
<Azelphur> d
<Azelphur> bashrc: I'd be tempted to go ask on the G300 thread if it will work on the Y300
<Myrtti> bashrc: it's called "Nexus 4" from "Google Play"
 * MartijnVdS wants Nexus 5
<Myrtti> I wonder if I should order the Nexus 4 for my sister before they announce Nexus 5
<Azelphur> Myrtti: that's nowhere near Â£70 ;)
<Azelphur> Myrtti: I wouldn't, you will probably be able to pick up a really good quality used nexus 4 a few days after the nexus 5 comes out
<Myrtti> Azelphur: phones with hardware spec close to Nexus One from 2009 are close to 150â¬ retail over here...
<Azelphur> hehe
<Myrtti> so in that light Â£160 for a device that's straight from the package and has warranty left
<Azelphur> I wouldn't get the 8GB, it's not really enough
<Azelphur> 16 is squeeze enough
<Azelphur> don't forget you have no expandable storage, no microsd, etc.
<MartijnVdS> who needs that though
<Myrtti> ... my sister still uses Nexus One. Vanilla, because I don't have a device to flash CM to test if it would work for her anymore
<MartijnVdS> all I store on my phone are apps and podcasts
<Myrtti> she doesn't even know what podcasts are
<Azelphur> MartijnVdS: no podcasts in that space
<Azelphur> the OS uses like 3-4GB for starts
<Azelphur> and then by the time you've installed a few apps, maybe one game, that's your 8GB gone
<MartijnVdS> Azelphur: I use 1G for podcasts
<Myrtti> all she needs is a little bit of space for the apps and some music
<Myrtti> but she can't even have any apps on her Nexus One as is
<Azelphur> Myrtti: games on android are 1-2GB a pop
<Myrtti> because it's run out of space
<MartijnVdS> Azelphur: are/can be
<Azelphur> you can get away with 8 if you're doing the bare essentials, but apart from that, not enough
<Myrtti> she hasn't even updated Facebook for over a year
 * Azelphur shrugs
<Myrtti> since the updates don't fit on her phone
<Myrtti> so *anything* would be better than what she's stuck at the moment
<Myrtti> well, almost anything
<Azelphur> true
<Azelphur> Myrtti: I'd get the Y300 instead of the Nexus 4 in that arena then, tbh
<Azelphur> it has MUCH more space available, and much less wasted CPU/GPU power that you can't use because you have no space
<Myrtti> Azelphur: I can't recommend non-Nexuses for her
<Azelphur> no?
<Myrtti> because I've not used anything else myself
<Azelphur> ah
<Myrtti> and I can't help her with non-Nexuses
<Azelphur> it's not that much different, honestly, you can even flash it with AOSP
<Azelphur> and then it pretty much is a nexus.
<Myrtti> I'd give her my old Galaxy Nexus, but I need a spare phone for my travels
<Azelphur> although I haven't tried AOSPing one yet, might do my friends soon
<Azelphur> but yea, the hardware inside a nexus is gaming orientated, it makes no sense to buy it if you have no space to install games, honestly
<Azelphur> you'd be just as fine on the Y300 with a decent dual core, and then you have a microSD card slot so can add a 64GB microSD and cram it with music, movies, etc.
<Myrtti> my sister would be happy to just have Angry Birds and the bloody Candy game.
<Myrtti> :-D
<MartijnVdS> ooh there's a bloody version now? 8-)
<Azelphur> hehe :)
<Azelphur> Y300 would certainly run those, too
<Azelphur> for a budget phone, it actually has quite a bit of grunt, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Axl3oF2ZmF4&t=8m50s
<Myrtti> MartijnVdS: http://memegenerator.net/instance/35081118
<Myrtti> etc
<Myrtti> Azelphur: is that the pink phone
<Azelphur> Myrtti: no, it's the Y300
<Myrtti> mm
<Azelphur> Myrtti: aka the Â£70 one.
<Azelphur> http://i0.wp.com/gadgetizor.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/04/Huawei-Ascend-G520-phone-pictures.jpg
<bigcalm> Anybody here use gitlab or trac with an external smtp server?
<Azelphur> Myrtti: and then you just flash it with http://www.modaco.com/topic/363879-rom-b194-fusionx-b04-huawei-y300-jb-41-080913/ and tada, "nexus" :P
<mungbean> minecraft and hama beads seem to be made for each other http://www.funnyjunk.com/funny_pictures/2240611/my/
<brobostigon> is it possible to replace android's standard dialer prog? curious really, not thought about it, nor seen one on the market.
<daftykins> of course
<daftykins> i've never looked but everythings modular
<brobostigon> yes, certainly is modular.
 * daftykins doesn't know what Candy Crush is
<brobostigon> it is a popularist pointless game, that resembles tetris.
<daftykins> 512MB RAM on that Huawei Y300? ouch you don't want to run android 4.0+ on that if your sanity is important D:
<funkyHat> daftykins: I got android 4 running on a G1, so it can't be that bad ;D
<daftykins> ugh that must've been nasty
<Myrtti> brobostigon, daftykins: bejeweled blitz
<brobostigon> Myrtti: ummm,?
<Myrtti> not tetris, bejeweled
<Myrtti> gweled, kdiamond, whatever
<brobostigon> ah, ok, sorry, i havent actually played it, only seen pictures.
<DJones> Argh, IT support via pidgin with a 75 year old parent isn't simple, but finally successful
<daftykins> D:
<daftykins> how did you land that one?
<DJones> It was either that or have to go visiting on my way home from work
<DJones> He changed broadband suppliers & was installation of a new router
<DJones> However after last time he problems with his router, he disconnected every cable in sight and ended up plugging the desktop mouse into the router rather than the computer afterwards and wondered why the mouse didn't work
<brobostigon> lol.
<daftykins> D:
<daftykins> "but i'm mousing on the internets!?"
<brobostigon> more lol'z
<brobostigon> MartijnVdS: which twitter android version do you have?
<diddledan> joy: http://arstechnica.com/security/2013/09/security-of-java-takes-a-dangerous-turn-for-the-worse-experts-say/#!
<diddledan> and twttr are going public with an IPO
<diddledan> reallY? the analysts think twitter is going to be worth $10billion once public?
<diddledan> hype. pure hype
<diddledan> look what happened to facebook the days after their initial offering - they went up fast and came down hard once people realised facebook is essentially worthless
#ubuntu-uk 2013-09-14
<AlanBell> happy saturday everyone
<bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
<MartijnVdS> \o
<GentileBen> MartijnVdS, are you watching the game today?
<popey> Morning all
 * AlanBell gets back to being all web 2.0 with http://exceptionalemails.com/ (feedback appreciated)
<AlanBell> oops, didn't mean to say that here, but never mind :)
<mungbean> making more 8-bit hama stuff :) http://i.imgur.com/3YcCQ11.jpg?1
<popey> hah, nice
<brobostigon> good morning everyone,
<mungbean> gonna have to get the light box out of the loft this w/end
<mungbean> noticing the gloominess already in my energy levels
<brobostigon> SAD ?
<mungbean> who doesn't notice it?
<mungbean> i assume everyone does. the sunlight energises me
<mungbean> feel wasted last couple of days ,
<bigcalm> Good 2nd morning peeps :)
<brobostigon> morning bigcalm
<brobostigon> mungbean: i think i sleep better, with less bright sun in my eyes.
<mungbean> yes, i use eyepatches to sleep
<brobostigon> that works.
<mungbean> but i have to get up to feed baby or reposition my boy in his bed mulitple times per night :(
<mungbean> 4 hours unbroken sleep is something to strive for
<brobostigon> :(
<mungbean> my 3yr old is using unity lol
<mungbean> siwtching tasks, running clementine, choosing tracks/pausing
<penguin42> hehe good, so when do you teach them to code :-)
<mungbean> when he can play minecraft
 * AlanBell has been installing minecraft mods to keep offspring happy
<MartijnVdS> â« You gotta keep'em separated ?
<daftykins> 8D
<daftykins> Offspring \o/
<bubu> hey guys, how can I dpkg -i a .deb package and pass in options so that all the defaults are accepted during install?
<funkyHat> bubu: DEBIAN_PRIORITY=high dpkg ...
<funkyHat> bubu: or critical (bear in mind that even with critical it will still ask you for "critical" questions... there aren't many of those though
 * AlanBell finds a copy of the original SUN microsystems Java whitepaper from 1995
<bashrc> Are there any mobile boradband USB adapters which work especially well with ubuntu?
<brobostigon> androids tethering seems to work well.
<bashrc> is that tethering to a mobile phone?
<dwatkins> bashrc: I have a Vodafone Huawei one which seemed to work fine, although I'm not sure if its firmware also sends data to the manufacturer.
<bashrc> so I could become a cosmopolitan cafe dweller and yet still be on the internets
<dwatkins> You might want to check that tethering is allowed on your mobile contract, bashrc - sometimes it's not.
<bashrc> I wouldn't try to tether, I'd just get a USB adapter
<dwatkins> I tether all the time on my Three phone.
<dwatkins> well, not "all" the time, just quite a lot.
<brobostigon> me also.
<bashrc> I guess I'll just have to get one and see if it works
<dex90_>  /join #ubuntu
<dex90_> exit
<SuperEngineer> Dr. Who "best of" tonight - beeb1 7->7.30pm .... sounds fun
<brobostigon> yep.
<SuperEngineer> :)
<brobostigon> :)
<SuperEngineer> just spent 1 boring hour clearing rubbish from WinXP partion.. and that was their best yet?
<SuperEngineer> [old apps - registry - shortcuts -defrag ad infinitum
 * SuperEngineer yawns
<SuperEngineer> Dr. Who time folks ;)
<SuperEngineer> just realised earlier line should show beebÂ£ 1111 whoopos ;)
<SuperEngineer> *beeb3
<brobostigon> bbc3*
<ali1234> so... semantic filesystems... do we actually have one on ubuntu, and the tools to make use of it?
<penguin42> wth is a semantic filesystem?
<daftykins> ^
<ali1234> well, normal filesystems are heirarchical - they use directories, sub directories
<ali1234> and files can only be in once place
<ali1234> (hardlinks don't count cos they look like different files to most applications)
<ali1234> a semantic filesystem doesn't have directories
<penguin42> ok, so what does it look like?
<ali1234> generally they use tags
<penguin42> ali1234: How would you like to access it with conventional posix calls?
<ali1234> well it can be mapped into a heirarchy
<ali1234> each tag can be a directory
<ali1234> then files will show up in multiple places
<penguin42> ali1234: Sounds like something you could do with FUSE?
<ali1234> perhaps
<ali1234> the point is that you don't access it the way you'd access a normal filesystem
<ali1234> there is no cd
<ali1234> therefore there is no ls either
<penguin42> looks like there are a few around
<ali1234> so you need a whole new set of tools to really make use of it
<ali1234> just having the filesystem is one thing, but it needs tools to be useful
<penguin42> http://www.tagsistant.net/download for example
<penguin42> ali1234: Yeh I mean you really need to rework things like the GUIs that open files
<ali1234> yeah you would
<ali1234> well, maybe not
<ali1234> i mean, the biggest challenge is getting all your files into such a system, and then tagging them all correctly
<ali1234> once that is done, you can access it by mapping back into a heirarchy
<ali1234> so you don't need to reword existing tools... just need new ones
<penguin42> ali1234: Well I think there are tag schemes already, and auto-indexers etc - so then you just need to wire the search things to look for those - but you need to change the 'save' dialog
<ali1234> yeah, true
<penguin42> ali1234: Like if you were writing a document and you hit save you need to do something different
<ali1234> yes, you need it to ask for tags
<penguin42> or auto generate from content?
<ali1234> nah, automating it defeats the purpose
<penguin42> why?
<ali1234> the whole point is that human can categorize things better than the computer
<penguin42> ali1234: Really?
<ali1234> yeah, really
<penguin42> ali1234: Probably true, but it's not a bad goal to suggest some - like G+ does when you post
<ali1234> ok, but what about multiple files?
<ali1234> like for example a source code directory?
<penguin42> oh how you put source code in a system like that is a good question
<ali1234> well the answer certainly isn't "let the computer guess what to do"
<penguin42> ali1234: well  you probably have a project name in files in the source tree - e.g. in the metadata config
<ali1234> "probably"
<ali1234> now think about writing an auto-indexer that can recognise any open source project's source tree and tag it appropriately...
<penguin42> ali1234: Well yeh, but it would be reasonable for it to suggest that; and say working in something like Eclipse you're dealing with source in your project, and adding code to classes etc - so in principal you don't need to think about files
<ali1234> it's too late for that
<penguin42> well yeh
<penguin42> ali1234: But I think it's reasonable to provide a set of hints - and let a human add more
<ali1234> imagine a command like "file" but for directories...
<penguin42> certainly it's easy to recognise say class names
<ali1234> what language?
<penguin42> C++/Java any of the OO ones
<penguin42> ali1234: I think there are already libraries/code out there to do that
<ali1234> well file will tell you the language, maybe
<penguin42> ali1234: I'm thinking of the syntax highlighters, and ctags like code
<ali1234> but i think it would be faster to just go through and tag it by hand
<ali1234> humans are still better at pattern recognition than computers
<penguin42> yeh but source is typically pretty well structured - or it should be taken out and shot
<penguin42> ali1234: I mean yeh good luck trying to extract a tag from a perl file :-)
<penguin42> (although there is perldoc)
<ali1234> even if you can detect the language you still don't know what it actually does
<penguin42> no, but you can extract a class name
<Monotoko> bah, I hate Saturday night upgrades
<penguin42> saturday night's for fighting with apt?
<dutchie> ugh
<dutchie> why is there no confirmation for suspend
<dutchie> second time now i've hit suspend when i meant to shut down
<dutchie> it's really rather annoying
<penguin42> dutchie: Normally because it's quickly reversable and people want to do it quickly and run out of the house with their laptop
<dutchie> it's not that quick
<dutchie> it's slow enough to be really annoying
<penguin42> is anyone else seeing a block of junk on ebay's front page as the 1st of the 5 rotating adverts at the top?
<penguin42> hmm, fixed on reload - very very odd
#ubuntu-uk 2013-09-15
<JimboPea> Hi guys, I have a HP laptop with an amd apu a8, and discrete graphics. I have the latest beta driver installed. Buw when i run "aticonfig --od-getclocks" it only shows t.he clocks for the intergrated gpu and doesnt see the discrete card. Any ideas?
<directhex> add --adapter=all ?
<JimboPea> thanks :)
<JimboPea> So im trying to overclock my discrete card, which is adapter 1. I know i need to run "aticonfig --od-setclocks=500,420" but im not sure how to apply this to one adapter only
<directhex> er... try --adapter=1
<brobostigon> good morning eveyrone,
<Myrtti> Azelphur: where did you see the Huawei for 70quid?
<bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
<AlanBell> morning
<brobostigon> an ingress sea of blue, :)
<bigcalm> I should really get around to playing ingress
<brobostigon> it sucks battery, as it requires the gps to always be on.
 * bigcalm skips off to collect his wedding rings and suit :D
<brobostigon> :)
<brobostigon> good luck bigcalm
 * penguin42 realises he has three songs in his collection named 'Last train to...'
<Azelphur> now you just need to mix them together, so you can have last train to last train to last train
<penguin42> hmm
 * Monotoko watches his production server fall the ground
<Monotoko> turns out that "rm -rf ./*" is pretty close to the evil command
<penguin42> oops
<AlanBell> the command that shall not be named
<Monotoko> times like this, I actually like the cloud
<Monotoko> makes it really damn easy to restore my disk to an older version
<Monotoko> let this be a lesson to all, don't attempt to do a quick fix on a Sunday afternoon
<dwatkins> woohoo, finally got Ubuntu installed on my MacBook Pro using a Nifty Minidrive :D #SmugModeEngaged
<penguin42> Monotoko: Your cloud provider provides regular snapshots or something?
<Monotoko> penguin42: I take regular snapshots before doing anything major
<Monotoko> so if I do screw it up I can just revert
<penguin42> yeh always good
<mungbean> ugh , yahoo groups is so afwul
<mungbean> also, depending on which yahoo page i'm on, i have either no mail, 99+ emails, or 55 emails
<popey> Evening ratfans.
<penguin42> ratfans?
<penguin42> Roland?
<mungbean> just bought a set of linka moulds \o/
<mungbean> the younglings here won't know what that is
<ali1234> i know what those are
<ali1234> without googling too
 * penguin42 doesn't
<ali1234> i'm too young but my brother had a set
<penguin42> modelling?
<ali1234> penguin42: they are moulds for model buildings basically - you pour in plaster and get wall pieces that link together
<ali1234> interestingly enough one of the computer programs i am trying to recover from these C64 tapes is the program he wrote to design linka building layouts for wargaming
<penguin42> uisng an emulator?
<ali1234> using a tape player and recording the sound
<penguin42> nod, I'm assuming some of the c64 emulators have demodulators for it?
<popey> oh, i always wondered how those houses were made
<gordonjcp> ooh, I've got some linka moulds somewhere
<popey> didn't realise there was a whole thing to make them
<penguin42> popey: I'd always assumed it was people who were just very clever and patient
<popey> heh, ditto
<ali1234> penguin42: there's software to demodulate it from wav files yes - it works well but in this case the tapes have been taped over which presents rather more difficult challenge
<penguin42> ali1234: Hehe oh that's a bit special then
<penguin42> ali1234: tried moving the tape head a bit on the playback machine to see if you can get one better than the other?
<ali1234> that's what i want to try
<ali1234> but i can't do it on my tape player cos it's a walkman
<ali1234> so i have a plan: i built a tape winder with lego, and i'm going to try to read the tape with a floppy drive head
<ali1234> using the stepper for fine tracking control
<penguin42> heck, not got a clue if that would work or if the tape speeds are anywhere in similar speeds etc
<ali1234> they are very similar
<ali1234> track width is almost the same, floppy disk revolves a bit faster than cassette tape though
<ali1234> but i can wind the tape any speed i like
<penguin42> good luck
<ali1234> the tricky bit is going to be figuring out the pin-out of the drive head and how to amplify the signal enough for a sound card
 * penguin42 has enough tape decks around here that I could probably find one I could move
<ali1234> i'm not old enough to have a large collection of tape players
<penguin42> haha
<ali1234> i do have a couple of portable CD players and a minidisc player
<ali1234> and of course a box with about 50 old floppy drives and CD drives
<ali1234> hmm... so my tape player has auto-reverse but it seems that the reverse heads are kind of misaligned, because the audio is very quiet from them
<ali1234> maybe i can make use of that...
<ali1234> either that or this tape is just disintegrating
<mungbean> gordonjcp: made anything withthem?@
<gordonjcp> mungbean: not for at least 30 years ;-)
<mungbean> used to make stuff as a little kid, don't remember what happened to the moulds. thought it miht be nice family activity
<mungbean> beats lego for creating nice stuff
<mungbean> there's also fantasy stuff too http://www.hirstarts.com/projects.html
<ali1234> the trouble with this type of thing, which doesn't apply to lego, is what do you do with the models when you've built them?
<penguin42> ali1234: Run the trains around them?
<mungbean> make dioramas
<mungbean> make houses for the kid to play with his cars/train set
<mungbean> for my airfix stuff, the act of creation is most of the fun but i have a display case with them in
<mungbean> my wife is understanding because half the house is full of knitting paraphernalia
<mungbean> i gather quite a few people do it for wargaming but i don't really know much about that
<mungbean> watched grave of fireflies...rather depressing.
<diddledan> was it in here that I came up against backpush about the us healthcare obamacare nhs type reforms?
<ali1234> i doubt it
<diddledan> yeah, so do I but I can't think where else it would be
<ali1234> don't you have logs?
<directhex> computery places are a bastion of hardcore liberalism. also libertarianism, though
<diddledan> directhex: indeed
<ali1234> ironically they are completely opposite philosophies
<diddledan> well anyway, it's an interesting watch and completely offtopic, but I feel like sharing some "facts" about us healthcare vs nhs: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qSjGouBmo0M
<ali1234> when you say pushback what do you mean exactly?
<ali1234> i men what direction?
<diddledan> against national healthcare
<ali1234> i'm pretty sure everyone here loves the nhs
<diddledan> as in pro the insurance company system
<directhex> ali1234, economically, yes, they're opposites
<diddledan> I certainly love the nhs
<directhex> ali1234, very few "social conservatives" in these parts though
<diddledan> I guess it might have been in the wordpress channel but I believe I was surprised that someone would mention it in the ubuntu-uk channel
<diddledan> I gonna go search for logs now
<ali1234> well there's nothing in my logs
<ali1234> for "obama"
<ali1234> you've only said it once before here
<directhex> the nsa is deleting your irc logs?
<directhex> *thanks* obama
<diddledan> dammit, I haven't been logging
<ali1234> that meme is hilarious
<diddledan> logging turned on now
<ali1234> wordpress seems a likely place for this argument - lot of americans there, and freelance web devs do tend to be libertarian in my experience
<ali1234> the american ones anyway
<pr0ph3t> hi all
<popey> yo
<pr0ph3t> I have a lil problem, I'm trying to share the public folder, with samba installed in both ubuntu boxes, but I can't see them in Browse Network, Nautilus. What's strange is that my cousing can see my shares from his mac!
<directhex> ali1234, the thing about libertarianism is we know what it leads to - there is already a country out there living the libertarian ideal. no government interference in private affairs, no government regulation getting in the way of private enterprise. just free men and women, contracts, and private enforcement. i call this place "Libertaria", although i believe the commonly used name is "Somalia"
<pr0ph3t> we're connected to same network, I was wondering if there was a command line way of checking available shares
<ali1234> directhex: yes i agree
<directhex> pr0ph3t, there is. erm... something like smbclient -L?
<directhex> pr0ph3t, definitely smbclient is the command you want, but i can't remember the flags, it's been so long since i've used it
<pr0ph3t> directhex, I guess the problem is in trusting human beings to much, after all some kill, rape and do other horrible things, so to say that no control is needed from "above" is to forget the nature of some human beings
<ali1234> libertarians typically do support some government regulation though - contract law and property law but nothing else
<bigcalm> Hi peeps :)
<directhex> ali1234, yeah, they have a very childish view of "the only parts of law that are needed are the parts that support my drawn-in-crayon philosophy, everything else is pointless"
<ali1234> yes, quite
<ali1234> but to be fair, somalia isn't that
<directhex> ali1234, the key issue is libertarians don't believe in negative externalities or public good, so things like "poisoning air" can apparently be handled 100% by private contracts between every person in the country and  every single polluter in america - but not govt regulation because that's evil
<ali1234> yes
<pr0ph3t> directhex, smbclient -L 192.168.x.x was the command, and it shows the Public folder share, but it doesn't on nautilus
<directhex> ali1234, the whole philosophy is drawn in crayon, it doesn't account for "reality"
<directhex> ali1234, much like basic marxism
<ali1234> i wonder what happens in libertarian world if someone buys a large plot of land and sets up a democratic system of government and hangs a "no libertarians" sign on the front door
<ali1234> presumably they would be fine with that?
<ali1234> since it is private property
<ali1234> marxism is at least based in mathematical truths. i like that part of it
<ali1234> you are still right of course. mathematics is an abstraction and therefore not reality
<pr0ph3t> ali1234, economic determinism
<mgdm> http://news.stv.tv/politics/239574-nick-clegg-warns-against-outright-tory-or-labour-victory-in-2015/ yes, I'm sure he does
<mgdm> eejit
<ali1234> i want to see more coalition
<ali1234> if we had four or five different parties instead of two they'd never be able to get anything done
<ali1234> lab-con coalition would be funny too
<pr0ph3t> I can't even see the computer name in Browse Network, I have two Ubuntu boxes, but they do not show up for me, I can see my cousin's MacBook, but not the linux boxes names, but I can access them with smbclient, is it a Nautilus problem then do you think?
<ali1234> pr0ph3t: that is not unusual. try typing in the ip address in smb:// format
<ali1234> network browsing is a really horrible mess - it often doesn't even work on windows
<pr0ph3t> ali1234, it works with smb:// format, I can access or mount the share
<pr0ph3t> strange that nautilus does not recognise it though
<pr0ph3t> do you all use nautilus?
<ali1234> i use thunar/xfce but it uses the same backend
<ali1234> gvfs
<ali1234> and i used nautilus until two weeks ago
<ali1234> browsing is done on a different protocol to smb
<ali1234> it is really complex and never works right
<pr0ph3t> sometimes it does :P
<pr0ph3t> plus I really like nautilus
<ali1234> well you won't find anything that works any better than nautilus, that's for sure
<directhex> computers are terrible. stick with videotape.
<pr0ph3t> how about email client? You're all using thunderbird/evolution?
<bigcalm> Mutt!
<pr0ph3t> eheh, I had some problems viewing html pages with Mutt unfortunately :-)
<bigcalm> Thunderbird is the default, so most people use that if not gmail
<bigcalm> I wonder if popey managed to salvage the audio from last week's podcast
<popey> not yet
<bigcalm> Waiting for an interface?
<popey> waiting for time
<popey> working right now
<bigcalm> Ah
<bigcalm> Eugh
<bigcalm> I say eugh and I've just loaded my IDE :(
 * bigcalm goes to find a glass of wine to take the sting out of the evening
<popey> â¹
<popey> over a month since I had any booze
<popey> or coffee
<mgdm> given them up?
<popey> ya
<popey> lost a stone so far
<bigcalm> Well done
<mgdm> blimey
<bigcalm> OMG, it's the RAT in 6 days
<popey> indeed
<popey> thats going to be interesting. never been on the RAT and had no booze
<bigcalm> We got our wedding rings today (had to wait for them to be made). Having a sneaky trial run with mine to see how I get one while typing
<popey> hah
<popey> i take mine off _all_ the time
<popey> i also drop it on the floor a lot
<popey> dropped it on our honeymoon, through the cracks in the wooden decking and onto the sand underneath
<bigcalm> :O
<popey> had to crawl about 20 feet under the decking from the beach
<bigcalm> Clever lad
<popey> lucky to find it again
<bigcalm> Does Clare like to remind you of this?
<popey> she does
<bigcalm> Hehe
<popey> whenever we are in the lounge and she hears the familiar sound of metal on carpet
<bigcalm> How long have you two been married for?
<popey> it's 2013, so 13 years :D
<bigcalm> That's a handy way to remember
<bigcalm> Maybe Hayley and I should have tied the knot 3 years ago
<popey> we got engaged in 1999, and married exactly one year later to the day
<popey> should probably get my ring polished at some point
<popey> just went to look at my hand to see how scruffy it was and noticed it wasn't there, but was on the desk â»
<bigcalm> Fnar fnar
<bigcalm> Oh, wrong channel
<popey> \o/ highlights
 * bigcalm turns into a giggling 14 year old
<bigcalm> No difference from a giggling 34 year old it would seem
<bigcalm> Lets play Fez!
<ali1234> fez \o/
<mgdm> g'night
<ali1234> bigcalm: i found a weird thing in fez nobody else on the internet has ever mentioned
<bigcalm> Night mgdm
<bigcalm> ali1234: which is?
<ali1234> in the room where you lower the water, the pillars have some suspicious looking markings on them
<ali1234> http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=x_FbFIR1Tq4#t=28 <- this room
<ali1234> below the "mouths" there's that 2x4 block pattern... in different ones a different block is missing
<bigcalm> ali1234: not noticed that before. But I don't know if it has meaning or not. I've completed the game enough to get the stereoscopic view (but lack glasses for it) and haven't seen it mentioned
<ali1234> another weird thing that nobody seems to have looked at is those 3x3 "photos" in the starting village houses
<ali1234> there is something odd about the colours they use
<ali1234> they are neither RGB nor CMY
<ali1234> they are from a specific palette though, it's kind of orange-turqoise-dark green
<ali1234> i don't know what to make of it but it seems nothing in this game is accidental
<bigcalm> Fo show
<bigcalm> ali1234: have you found a game that you aren't able to complain about? :D
<ali1234> when did i complain?
<bigcalm> You complain about a lot of things
<ali1234> when did i complain about fez though?
<bigcalm> That is my point
<ali1234> oic
<ali1234> well, yes
<ali1234> there are other games i don't have any complaints about though
<ali1234> i think fez is might be my new favourite game though
<bigcalm> I loved it
<ali1234> i could go on for quite a long time about why it is great
<ali1234> like for example there is no killing in it, at all
<bigcalm> It's very well thought out
<ali1234> there isn't even anything "living" that can kill you
<bigcalm> You can kill Gomez by jumping off things and into holes
<ali1234> yes and that is it
<ali1234> lava/sewer water kills you
<ali1234> that's the most dangerous thing
<ali1234> they also didn't include a slippy slidey ice world. i hate those
<bigcalm> Hehe
<ali1234> and unlike, say, braid, the gimmick feels completely natural
<bigcalm> Saying that makes me want to play some Zelda
<ali1234> i don't see how anyone can ever make another platform game that doesn't have this rotation mechanic now
<bigcalm> You had some of it with paper mario
<ali1234> there are also no walls anywhere
<ali1234> the only direction that blocks stop you moving is down
<ali1234> that really gives a feeling of being able to go anywhere
<bigcalm> So how far have you tried to swim?
<ali1234> swim?
<ali1234> i tried to swim off the side of one map cos i thought that was the solution
<bigcalm> In the worlds where water doesn't kill you
<ali1234> and then later on that turned out to be the solution to a different map XD
<ali1234> there's also a code that lets you fly anywhere in new game+
<ali1234> i managed to get trapped with that and had to quit the game
<bigcalm> Oooo
<bigcalm> I haven't found that yet
<ali1234> i flew on top of something really high and even if i tried to fly down it registered as "fell to your death"
<bigcalm> Something new for me to see
<ali1234> so you did the lava room without cheating? nice
<bigcalm> Ug
<bigcalm> That was painful
<ali1234> yes, the only frustrating bit of the game
<bigcalm> But rewarding
<ali1234> this game is most like the dizzy games i think
<ali1234> except without the fake difficulty that made you smash the controller and throw the computer out the window
<bigcalm> Glad I didn't get to play the Dizzy games as a child
<bigcalm> Though there were plenty of other such games to frustrate me
<ali1234> super meat boy :)
<bigcalm> I didn't have that as a child either :P
<ali1234> well yeah - it's a modern game
<ali1234> in the USC - good game, if you like that kind of thing
<bigcalm> But I do now have an xbox controller (played all of fez with it). Will have to give it a go on Super Meat Boy
<ali1234> annoyingly no linux version on steam
<bigcalm> No, that is annoying
<bigcalm> I got it from the HIB I think a long time ago
<ali1234> yeah me too
<ali1234> tip: you can remap controller buttons ina config file
<ali1234> for me, they were all wrong on the defaults
<ali1234> but there's no in game remap
<bigcalm> http://dbsoundworks.bandcamp.com/album/super-meat-boy-digital-special-edition-soundtrack & http://dbsoundworks.bandcamp.com/album/super-meat-boy-choice-piano-cuts let me enjoy the game without playing it
<popey> bigcalm: you using an xbox controller on linux?
<bigcalm> The piano cuts are wonderful - I'm a fan of piano solo music
<bigcalm> popey: yes
<ali1234> popey: me too
<popey> ooh!
<bigcalm> popey: saved me from buying an xbox
<popey> what sorcery?
<bigcalm> popey: none
<bigcalm> popey: just works (tm)
<popey> a bog standard xbox 360 controller?
<bigcalm> Yes
<ali1234> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xBHGtPL_KZQ if you haven't see it, this is great
<bigcalm> popey: though I bought one that came with the usb adapter in the package
<ali1234> popey: i use a original xbox controller with a usb connector soldered on it
<ali1234> it works ootb in fez
<ali1234> but only after i mapped it properly in steam big picture mode
<ali1234> the button mapping is slightly different to the 360 controller
<popey> i have an xbox 360 controller here
<bigcalm> Works out of the box in linux in fez for me
<bigcalm> Sorry, xbox 360
<ali1234> but it works correctly in all steam games due to them all taking the config from steam
<bigcalm> Ah
<bigcalm> I've been playing fez from steam, which is why it works then
<ali1234> that's why i needed to edit the meat boy config i guess
<ali1234> well the 360 controller is "standard"
<ali1234> it probably works everywhere
<ali1234> but original one is nearly but not quite the same and most games don't handle it (because you need to solder a new connector to even use it)
<ali1234> steam has many controller profiles built in also: it has the 360 but not the orignal mapping
<ali1234> this is all done wit SDL2 btw \o/
<ali1234> SDL is now sponsored by valve
<ali1234> in the sense they employ the lead developer and big picture mode uses it
<bigcalm> Yeah, that metal remix wasn't for me :S
 * bigcalm goes back to the piano cuts
<ali1234> i love the crazy 7/4 time signature
<bigcalm> Oh look, it's Monday :(
<bigcalm> Time to stop pretending to be married and put the wedding rings in the safe
<bigcalm> Nighty night peeps
<ali1234> night
<popey> nn
<popey> wonder what the maximum number of bluetooth remotes you could support on one machine
<popey> practically speaking
<ahayzen> popey, think it is 7?
<ali1234> bluetooth remotes?
<popey> controllers, like the xbox360
<ali1234> i think the 7 limit is only for piconets, which is BT-PAN basically
<ahayzen> the PS3 has a limit of 7 controllers and it uses bluetooth as the connection IIRC
<ahayzen> Wikipedia states 'A master Bluetooth device can communicate with a maximum of seven devices in a piconet'
<popey> hmm
<ali1234> yeah but a piconet isn't limited to 8 devices total
<ali1234> it's a tree
<ali1234> and basic bluetooth comms (rfcomm) doesn't use it anyway i think
<ali1234> blah... i've forgotten how it works
<ali1234> i have no idea :/
<popey> whereas you can have many many USB devices
<popey> well, you could have multiple bt dongles and 7 per dongle?
<ali1234> 127
<popey> per root hub?
<ali1234> per port
<ali1234> technically yes
<ali1234> and yeah you can have multiple bluetooth adapters without problems
#ubuntu-uk 2014-09-08
<diddledan> pulsant finally got back to me - their top-of-cab switch had died
<diddledan> still recovering
<MooDoo> morning all
<mapps> hm
<mapps> fell asleep well early
<foobarry> my son woke me at 4am
<foobarry> didn't sleep again till > 6am
<mapps> =[
<mapps> i fell asleep around 1am
<diddledan> I was adminning servers till 5am
<diddledan> then slept for three hours and now back on the job
<Oli> I get to do just that tomorrow :(
<Oli> Got to love a good out-of-hours migration
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<mapps> diddledan,  you work from home?
<diddledan> mapps: yeah
<mapps> ;]
<mapps> time for latest ep of the strain
<mapps> :D
<foobarry> are you constipated?
<JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Monday, and happy Literacy Day! :-D
<Myrtti> nice. libc6 update broke my get-iplayer :-|
<Myrtti> (on debian)
<mapps> ;]
<davmor2> JamesTait: Ohhhhh get you with your grammar :p
<JamesTait> davmor2, I haven't seen her for years! :-P
<davmor2> JamesTait: bad dum tishas
<foobarry> groooan
<Myrtti> ooo
<Myrtti> http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk-news/2014/sep/08/prince-william-duchess-cambridge-expecting-second-child
<foobarry> my wife had hyp. gravidarum
<foobarry> so the duchess has my sympathies
<directhex> http://pbs.twimg.com/media/BxAp2CoIAAA4XSx.jpg:large
<popey> directhex: what speakers did you get in the end?
<directhex> logitech z553
<Myrtti> I want news about the new logitech keyboard
<directhex> they might even be discontinued now, but they're black and red and eye-catching, and not made by total muppets
<Myrtti> still asking for 50 quid http://www.logitech.com/en-gb/product/multi-device-keyboard-k480
<directhex> that looks so janky to type on
<Myrtti> would probably work for what I'd use it for
<foobarry> having so much trouble with apache config and https rewrites and lots of virtual hosts
<Azelphur> my employment contract is fairly awesome: https://home.azelphur.com/owncloud/public.php?service=files&t=0d302c5f272a6614b4e0502df3360659
<Myrtti> ugh bitcoin.
<foobarry> i can get https://blah to work, but some default config is stomping on my http redirect :S
<foobarry>     RewriteRule ^/?(.*)         https://%{SERVER_NAME}/$1 [L,R]
<foobarry> would that match even sites foo and bar when i have this wrapped in the baz virtualhost ?
<BigRedS> only if the baz virtualhost has foo and bar set as ServerAliases
<foobarry> they aren't :S
<BigRedS> ah, then when you request foo or bar you'll not get the baz vhost and so probably not that rewrite rule
<foobarry> sort of fixed it
<foobarry> although /js and /css aren't getting sent via proxy
<bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
<popey> word
<bigcalm> Excel
<popey> What was that presentation software in DOS which pre-dates powerpoint
<popey> i recall using it in 1988 or so
<popey> Harvard Graphics!
<popey> wow, well done brain
<BigRedS> foobarry: if you don't mind dumping all your config to the Internet I can have a look and see if I can tell why
<foobarry> BigRedS: thanks :D the problem is the same as this guy http://stackoverflow.com/questions/21671895/apache-reverseproxy-with-mixed-content-location
<foobarry> i think
<foobarry> ah i think its because each request gets sent to a capture portal
<foobarry> this may be a non standard problem and unique to us in which case..
<bigcalm> Chromium no longer does "hover" on things. Anybody else seen this happen?
<BigRedS> ah. that probably doesn't help :) Can you not test locally?
<bigcalm> Found the bug: https://code.google.com/p/chromium/issues/detail?id=357347
<bigcalm> Oooo, it's because I'm running Synergy
<SuperMatt> bigcalm: synergy causes bugs with a lot of the applications I use
<SuperMatt> no idea how though
<SuperMatt> like in evolution it stopped me from being able to expand folders
<bigcalm> I couldn't work without Synergy
<BigRedS> you're using synergy and evolution? I've only ever used Synergy to allow for the presence of a Windows machine
<BigRedS> and only ever used Evolution because I need to talk to Exchange and don't have Outlook
<Myrtti> evolution is the spawn of evil
<Myrtti> the email programme, that is
<foobarry> BigRedS: solved my problem
<foobarry> the problem was ruby and browser security
<BigRedS> ruby? ew
<foobarry> the page was generated by ruby which was asking for http: but the browser was not happy about serving an unsecure script via a https page, even though it got redirected by apache
<BigRedS> ah yeah, fancypants new security JSy stuff can get irked by trying to do interesting things with the HTTP
<BigRedS> It was way easier back in 'day
<diddledan> yawnage
<diddledan> http://www.bbc.com/news/world-latin-america-29106843
<foobarry> Azelphur: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-29115193
<Azelphur> foobarry: I wonder what they did, that news article is really sparse
<foobarry> nigerian money scam probably
<Azelphur> http://www.portsmouth.co.uk/news/local/vulnerable-women-duped-out-of-200-000-by-scammers-in-match-com-conspiracy-a-court-hears-1-6247848 there we go
<Azelphur> and yea, you are right
<foobarry> nice to know that single ladies out there have a spare Â£174,000 to spend on boyfriends
<foobarry> "Mr Edwards said the alleged scam involved âJames Richardsâ saying he was due to inherit Â£100m following the death of his dad, but that the money was in a bank in India and he needed cash to help free it up."
<foobarry> meh, same old
<Azelphur> indeed
<foobarry> i wonder if they got their money back
<Azelphur> somehow I doubt it
<Oli> Amazing that the classic 419 scams still work.
<foobarry> i remember when my friend's ebay/gmail accoutns got taken over but my mate still had blackberry forwarding turned on
<diddledan> oh dear, the sky is falling: http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-28707117
<Azelphur> foobarry: the latest in my crazy life is https://home.azelphur.com/owncloud/public.php?service=files&t=0d302c5f272a6614b4e0502df3360659 :)
<SuperMatt> Oli: social engineering works on the desperate.
<foobarry> he could see the guy sending message for offline payment and getting stuff delivered to an addres in islington
<SuperMatt> and they don't have to be desperate for money either
<SuperMatt> desperation can be for companionship
<foobarry> then the guy would write emails to his mum from the gmail account
<Oli> SuperMatt: True enough. These were dating site people so yeah, probably a good place to look for the right type.
<foobarry> a nigerian boy writing from fred'bloggs@gmail.com saying hi mum this is my new email account
<foobarry> doing the usual chit chat with his mum. it was bizarre
<foobarry> google wouldn't give the account back so he had to call a friend who worked there
<SuperMatt> yowzer
<SuperMatt> that's quite interesting really
<SuperMatt> I wonder if my mum would fall for it
<foobarry> why wouldn't you have your own email account?
<foobarry> my bro and sis are more compassionate/trusting than i
<foobarry> and get dragged into stuff like timeshare
<foobarry> as soon as i've  heard 5 seconds of the story, i'm saying timeshare, get away
<foobarry> they are "what? is it a trick then?"
<foobarry> like the time i caught my sister about to click submit on a form with her cc details
<foobarry> but some clear text on the page that should have been in a drop down box "Zimbabwe" made her pause, just as i walked in "NOOOOOOOOO stooooopp"
<SuperMatt> foobarry: same reason people don't have their own cloud files. It's just too damn difficult for regular users
<foobarry> allegedly the nudie pics were not very strong passwords
<foobarry> i heard they ran the "hack" against 500 passwords
<SuperMatt> ouch
<SuperMatt> that's not good
<foobarry> might be untrue
<foobarry> nut i'm sure it was thru ibrute
<diddledan> http://igg.me/at/Steampunk-Animation/x/4039834
<foobarry> nothing seems to twig ..hmmm... nudie pics... hope these are safe
<foobarry> and so many people did it!
<SuperMatt> I've been meaning to write a blog post about how the "front door" analogy that people keep using
<SuperMatt> saying "I locked my front door, I should be able to keep nudes in my home"
<SuperMatt> well  I say "no, you locked someone else's door and kept your nudes in someone else's house, but you only have access to one of the doors in the building and you don't know where the others are and how secure they are"
<ali1234> wat
<ali1234> my theory right now is that the trading ring thing was true, and one of the members got his dropbox and/or icloud hacked
<SuperMatt> maybe
<foobarry> you locked the door but the window is made of paper and its in a dark alley way that nobody will ever see you trying to get in
<ali1234> a better analogy is you put all your stuff in a rented locker at the airport
<foobarry> without cctv
<ali1234> no, it has cctv, but they turn it off when the government agents are going through all the lockers
<foobarry> apple had no cctv as they weren't locking out brute force attempts
<foobarry> and probably weren't logging it or they would have the person by now
<ujjain> Is there any UK bank that offers 2% rent without any *** conditions?
<ali1234> or that vulnerability wasn't used
<ujjain> UK banking is so complex :(
<ali1234> or they know who did it ad just haven't picked him up yet
<foobarry> rent = interest?
<ujjain> yes, rent = interest.
<ujjain> rente in Dutch.
<ali1234> 2& interest? ahahahahahaha
<ujjain> I think my English failed me there hehe, interest yeah.
<ujjain> I once had 5% interest with Icesave.
<ali1234> you won't get 2% without a 3 year bond or something
<ali1234> yeah icesave was a massive ponzi scheme
<ali1234> they went bankrupt, cost the UK millions of pounds
<ali1234> they caused the recession we are in now
<ali1234> at least in part
<ali1234> which is why you are not going to get 2% from anyone
<Myrtti> show me an account in any bank with 2% interest without any conditions in any country
<ujjain> yeah, true, there were some others with 5% too, lloyds bank has actually 4% if you have more than 4000 on your account, but only until 5000, which I just passed.
<ali1234> there is no bank acount anywhere without any conditions...
<Myrtti> no kidding
<ujjain> well, I saw Turkish banks with 9% when EU was 5%
<ali1234> yeah, and look at turkey now
<ujjain> highest interest without conditions in NL right now is 1,65.
<ujjain> yeah, changing currency is a high risk yeah.
<diplo> I get 5% on mine at the moment, but it only last 12 months :/
<diplo> http://www.nationwide.co.uk/products/current-accounts/flexdirect/features-and-benefits
<foobarry> i keep forgetting to sort mine out
<foobarry> and get tax taken off the missis account
<Myrtti> I have all my moneys still in Finland.
<ali1234> what does it mean in php when a function has \ before it?
<ali1234> eg \syslog(...)
 * DJones wonders if Daviey 's twitter account has been hacked looking at tehe seemingly random *.blogspot.com links being spammed
<diddledan> ali1234: that's using php's namespaces
<diddledan> \syslog means the syslog() function from the root namespace
<kirrus> Hey, is Daviey here?
<kirrus> Or can someone get ahold of him?
<kirrus> His twitter is hacked and is spamming.
<DJones> Querying the twitter spam>
<diddledan> Daviey: are you here?
<DJones> Yep, I've mentioned it here
<kirrus> ahh, sorry
<ali1234> hey guys, i think daviey's twitter was hacked
<diddledan> ooh, haxxored twits?! link me!
<diddledan> aah I found it
<diddledan> yeah, it would seem so
<ali1234> is it that one where it's all like "hey @somebody is this you? <url>"
<ali1234> then when you click you get a fake twitter login form
<diddledan> it looks like they've just @mentioned everyone he follows or maybe who follows him with a link of the form "blahblah.blobspot.com @follower"
<DJones> ali1234: http://imgur.com/UB44Cgb
<DJones> Screenshot from polly
<ali1234> yeah look spretty standard
<SuperEngineer> Daviey: is currently looged on as admin in #UUPC .. warn him there?
<diddledan> oh golly, that just reminded me of "polly in my pocket" the kids' toy from yesteryear
<ali1234> i've used tweeteraser.com to clean that stuff
<ali1234> where does fail2ban log to?
<ali1234> when it bans someone
<MartijnVdS> yes
<MartijnVdS> in /var/log/fail2ban.log
<diddledan> ali1234: either auth.log or syslog/messages (depending on whichever is there - I get confused so I try both syslog and messages due to different distros doing it differently)?
<diddledan> aah, well diddled, MartijnVdS
<ali1234> MartijnVdS: has the correct answer, cheers
<diddledan> so obvious now
<ali1234> i now have it banning wordpress bots, nice
<ali1234> ...and it banned a ssh brute forcer too
<ali1234> this is pretty nifty
<diddledan> "British plugs are better than all other plugs and here's why" (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UEfP1OKKz_Q)
<diddledan> love that there's a video for that
<ali1234> right, one more qustion, what's the deal with pingback spam?
<MarkDude> British plugs are larger than many of the devices I am powering
 * MarkDude is just sayin'
<MarkDude> Cool video- do folks really call it an *earth pin*?
 * MarkDude is in NorCal
<SuperEngineer> MarkDude - no... most of us call it "Fred" ;)
<MarkDude> Thats pants.
<MarkDude> :)
<diddledan> SuperEngineer: MarkDude: Fred is an awesome thing!
<diddledan> :-p
<ali1234> dont most people call it "ground"
<diddledan> I call it earth
<MarkDude> Dont get me wrong- UK plugs win for technical reasons
<ali1234> speaking of earth http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-29108451#sa-ns_mchannel=rss&ns_source=PublicRSS20-sa
<diddledan> but that might be because I know what I'm talking about due to daddy's trade
<ali1234> someone should explain to them the difference between weight and mass
<MarkDude> weight and mass are relative......
<MarkDude> XD
<ali1234> weight is relative, mass is not
<diddledan> ali1234: indeed, kg is mass. N would be weight
<SuperEngineer> *all* things are relative
<ali1234> you weigh less on the moon but your mass is the same
<diddledan> if I recall my science classes
<diddledan> N being newtons
<diddledan> on earth 1kg = 1N which makes it easy to confuse the two
<ali1234> er.. no
<diddledan> or is it 10N?
<ali1234> 1kg = 9.81N... think about it... F = M x A
<diddledan> bearing in mind I can't do the squiggly "roughly equal" symbol without mashing every key on my keyboard to find it
<ali1234> technically 1kg * 9.81ms^-2 = 9.81N
<diddledan> but anyway my point that kg is mass but people use it to mean weight because they're mormons :-p
<MarkDude> If a Catholic church is going speed of light- does it STILL have mass?
 * MarkDude drops mic. Walks off stage
<SuperEngineer> ...so the difference between well earthed & well grounded is???  [I am only one of those 2 items]
<diddledan> speaking of which, I think the gravitational pull of my body on surrounding objects is becoming not-insignificant :-D
<diddledan> i.e. I'm overweight
<MartijnVdS> http://www.commitstrip.com/en/2014/09/08/the-other-infinite-loop-that-all-coders-fear/
<diddledan> lol
<diddledan> that's my life alright
<MartijnVdS> same here
<SuperEngineer> near infinite loop... air dust sister's pooter; grab new can of air duster, continue air dusting sister's pooter, get new can of air duster......
<SuperEngineer> [coughh, choke, cough]
 * czajkowski tickles davmor2 
 * davmor2 cut
 * davmor2 grabs czajkowski hands and cuts her nails short and scraggly.....oh and hello stranger how are you?
<czajkowski> davmor2: great :)
<czajkowski> anyone on 14.04 and having issues with chromium ?
<czajkowski> won't launch currently
<czajkowski> earlier on kept saying there was an isue with profile
<daftykins> perhaps a reset is worthwhile
<czajkowski> hmm
<popey> i had that when my machine had rebooted
<popey> ends up leaving the profile unusable
<czajkowski> ahhh
<czajkowski> 2 reboots later I seem to have it now
<czajkowski> so how are we all doing ?
<daftykins> i had a wee trip to the hospital after a nasty bike accident, but today was the FIRST day i was able to tie my hair myself! :D
<daftykins> so definitely on the up and up
 * davmor2 wonders if the bike accident was due to hiar caught in the spokes
<daftykins> lol
<daftykins> it's still a bit of a mystery as to what happened
<daftykins> proper amnesia.
<Myrtti> diddledan: can recommend the hairy dieters book. It's brilliant.
<davmor2> I can recommend a Lionel Blair Cut like mine
<diddledan> apparently I look like Dave Myers (the hairy biker dude)
<czajkowski> I recommend clipping hair back before gettng on a bike
<czajkowski> I do wonder how Laney hasn't crashed yet
<davmor2> czajkowski: I just drive a car
<czajkowski> likewise
<czajkowski> full speed ahead and all that lark
<czajkowski> although since driving over where with jon and learning more about bikers I've come to see how to best avoid crashing into them
<czajkowski> aka giving them more space
<diddledan> him: http://cdn.images.express.co.uk/img/dynamic/79/590x/Dave-Myers1-443134.jpg and me from last weekend at a wedding: https://scontent-b-lhr.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xap1/v/t1.0-9/q81/p403x403/10632834_10152680493793896_6551808780321129618_n.jpg?oh=92e281b8d0dcda4bea0d4e34935dd10a&oe=54D08F56
<czajkowski> it's the numpties on them that do crazies things though that give them a bad name
<diddledan> ignore that my name isn't hazel :-p
<czajkowski> diddledan: Long lost twins
<daftykins> diddledan: not what i heard
<daftykins> ;D
<diddledan> daftykins: shush
<diddledan> daftykins: it was that one time
<daftykins> D:
<ysiry> hey
<ysiry> im from israel, if scotland recedes - can we make a comeback?
<diddledan> err?
<Myrtti> what
<Myrtti> I don't get it
<diddledan> Myrtti: nor me
<ysiry> we want in
<ysiry> back in*
<Myrtti> back in what
<ysiry> back in as members of the british empire
<ysiry> if scotland leaves, theres an empty spot
<Myrtti> because Ubuntu Linux UK local community is the venue to ask this.
<Myrtti> ok.
<diddledan> I think we're the guys to talk to about doing so, because we're very influential with the british government
<Myrtti> oh yes.
<diddledan> just last friday I was talking with ol' Dave Cammy about important "things"
<ysiry> brits lack humor :/
<ysiry> in second thought, I dont want in
<Myrtti> ok.
<davmor2> diddledan: next time slap him silly till he listens ;)
<Myrtti> totes mcgoats.
<ysiry> do they sing the 6th stanza in god save the queen in international events?
<ysiry> about crushing scottsmen
<davmor2> ysiry: Depends on how important the event is I think the very full version is about 16 so I am guessing not
<ysiry> 16 verses?
<ysiry> I only knew of 6
<diddledan> the most anyone sings in celebration of the queen at an important event is 2 verses
<diddledan> finding someone in britain who actually knows the second verse, however, is very difficult so that is usually just a load of mumbles
<ysiry> really
<directhex> i prefer the verse in la marseilleise about bathing in the blood of enemies
<ysiry> its not about bathing in blood of enemies
<ysiry> its about scaring the women and children of the enemy
<ysiry> I prefer the verse in the spanish athem uber alles
<ysiry> verses*
<ysiry> anthem**
<ysiry> it has no lyrics
<ysiry> its just a tune.
<ysiry> they used to have lyrics but they were removed post-Franco times.
<ysiry> so most of the people in the UK never learned the rest of the lyrics?
<directhex> i vote on changing the national anthem to "i've got a lovely bunch of coconuts". all in favour?
<ysiry> found the 6th verse from god save the queen:
<ysiry>     Lord, grant that Marshal Wade,
<ysiry>     May by thy mighty aid,
<ysiry>     Victory bring.
<ysiry>     May he sedition hush,
<ysiry>     and like a torrent rush,
<ysiry>     Rebellious Scots to crush,
<ysiry>     God save The King.
<ysiry> this is not much better than the french anthem
<davmor2> ysiry: there are 12 sorry,  9 official and then one for canada newzealand and zimbabwe.  On the whole the first 5 are sung which are ones that were pulled from the original 9
<ysiry> that is a lot of verses.
<ysiry> The Dutch anthem has a part in it where they pledge allegience to the Spanish king, isnt that bizzare?
<ysiry> on the first first verse.
<ali1234> i remember some computer atlas software from school that played the national anthems of the countries with really bad general midi
<ali1234> i don't remember what it was called, but it was amusing at the time
<gebbione> hello
<ysiry> do they change the word Queen with King depending on the gender of the monarch?
<ali1234> yes, of course
<ysiry> Has there ever been a time when there was no Monarch?
<popey> yes, before we were a monarchy
<ali1234> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_English_monarchs
<popey> quite some time ago â»
<ysiry> I mean after the monarchy was already established
<ali1234> yes, there are gaps where people were basically fighting for the crown
<ali1234> ah, also 1649 to 1660, no monarch
<ysiry> what happend?
<popey> Cromwell!
<ysiry> el vikingo?
<ysiry> ah
<ali1234> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Commonwealth_of_England
<ysiry> was he basically as powerful as the king?
<ysiry> mister lord protector
<ysiry> seems like he "served" in his position until he passed away
<ysiry> and was kinda dynastic too?
<ysiry> seems like the entire thing was handed to his son
<popey> some would like the country carved back up into those dominions https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_monarchs_of_Wessex#mediaviewer/File:British_isles_802.jpg
<ysiry> like who?
<ysiry> btw
<ysiry> why is it calle "England"
<ysiry> after the Anglos
<ysiry> and not Wesland or something
<ysiry> after Wessex
<ali1234> morrisey probably https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KKoS5X4SMrY
<diddledan> well if you follow football it's called "engerland" rather than "england"
<diddledan> :-p
<ysiry> why is it named after angles though and not after saxons?
<ysiry> it seems like it should have been called Wesland or Saxland or something
<ysiry> wasnt england formed by kings of Wessex?
<ysiry> who were Saxons.
<diddledan> why is America called America when there were native americans who used a different name before?!
<ali1234> wrong, actually
<diddledan> the victor writes the rules
<ysiry> i know why american is called america
<ysiry> i dunno why england is called englkand not not saxland or something
<diddledan> the victor writes the rules
<ali1234> because saxons were the people, anglo- was the place
<ali1234> anglo-saxons means saxons who live in "england" as opposed to germany
<ysiry> wait
<ysiry> They were from mercia
<ysiry> thats what I learned :/
<ali1234> they were from saxony
<ysiry> there was wessex and mercia
<ysiry> and they fought together against el-vikingos
<ysiry> how long is the idea of a single "England" ?
<ysiry> and the idea of "English" people?
<ysiry> does it go back to roman times?
<ali1234> no
<ysiry> certainly viking times
<ali1234> yes
<ali1234> "By 1012, the Vikings were in service in England as Thingmen, a personal bodyguard to the King of England."
<ali1234> roman period was 1000 years before that
<ysiry> hmm
<ysiry> right
<ysiry> from wiki:
<ysiry> "Alfred was the first King of the West Saxons to style himself "King of the Anglo-Saxons"."
<ysiry> Alfred the Great (849 â 26 October 899)
<ysiry> After Alfred had taken London in 885 and converted it into a burh, âall the English people that were not under subjugation to the Danes submitted to himâ.
<ysiry> so there was definitely an idea of a single English people
<ysiry> compared to the Danes.
<ysiry> and apparently by the time of his grandson Athelstan's reign, there was already a single UK
<ali1234> why all the questions?
<ysiry> question still remains
<ysiry> why they chose angle and not saxons
<Myrtti> because pudding.
<ysiry> pudding?
<Myrtti> pudding.
<ysiry> chocolate pudding?
<directhex> butterscotch
<ysiry> never tried that
<ysiry> how do you even make butter out of scotch?
<ysiry> or scotch out of butter
<MarkDude> This channel has better talk to read than any other geek channel I have seen :)
<popey> â»
<ysiry> sorry :/
<popey> its often like this, no need to apologise
<popey> we aren't particularly fussy about people being on topic round here
<popey> in fact most of the time it's offtopic
<popey> its unusuall for people to talk about ubuntu â¨
<popey> IME
<diddledan> popey: it's more of a social gathering in here :-)
<popey> ya
<diddledan> and that's partly why I like it in here :D
<ali1234> skellat raised this point in his UDS talk
<ali1234> locos should be off topic, cos if you wanted to be on-topic you'd be in the channel for that topic, not a geographical one
<ali1234> so loco channels provide a localize off-topic space, which builds community, which is the whole point
<izdubar> +1
#ubuntu-uk 2014-09-09
<SuperMatt> morning all
<ujjain> morning *
<BigRedS> Goooooood morning!
<Oli> Braaaaains...
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<ujjain> morning young padewons
 * ujjain waves yedi flag
<SuperMatt> yedi?
<popey> Morning
<ujjain> jedi?
<ujjain> it's star wars.
 * popey needs moar coffee
<JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Wonderful Weirdos Day! :-D
 * directhex is blogging about gamergate
<popey> Ruh-Roh
<directhex> it's been years since i was controversial on my blog
<directhex> there are lots of swears in it.
<popey> i liked the ITV blog post you did with your animals
<popey> iirc it was you?
<directhex> and 6 different synonyms for poo!
<directhex> yeah, that was mee
<directhex> the embedded images are all broken now tho
<directhex> i used a gallery plugin for wordpress before it had adequate functionality of its own, and it's gotten worse over time
<directhex> popey: feel like reviewing my text?
<popey> sure
<directhex> blog blogged. http://apebox.org/wordpress/gaming/635/
<Myrtti> directhex: great text.
<dogmatic69_> in bash is it possible to get prams 3 ->
<dogmatic69_> eg in the script I want to do foo/bar/command $1 $2 something $everything-else
<dogmatic69_> kind of $* but without $1 and $2
<BigRedS> you could make it an array, then shift twice, but you'd not then overwrite $1 and $2
<dogmatic69_> I could store $1/2 first then shift?
<BigRedS> yeah, shift might even return those values. I stop using bash way before arrays come into it
<dogmatic69_> how does this shift work? http://tldp.org/LDP/Bash-Beginners-Guide/html/sect_09_07.html is not helping
<BigRedS> ah, right, you maybe don't even need to do arrays
<BigRedS> it looks like you'll get what you want if you do somevar=$1; someothervar=$2; shift 2
<BigRedS> at which point $3 has become $1
<BigRedS> I'm not sure, experiment?
<dogmatic69_> thanks for the head start
<halt2> Hi All, I have a BT mouse and keyboard, but they keep droping the connection when I do not use them, which will be not an issue if they are reconnecting when i stat to use it again but it does not, any suggestion what should i hack to make it work ? as it should be ?
<dogmatic69_> BigRedS:  exactly right. works great
<BigRedS> ah good!
<BigRedS> halt2: that the batteries are charged?
<halt2> BigRedS: good guess, yes they are, but I have to note the system see them on 0% even if they are on 100%
<halt2> but now you asking it could be related, it's shout it down because it thinks the battery is flat , but it's not
<ali1234> directhex: does your blog actually have a point? what is it that you want me to do?
<Myrtti> don't be dick in Twitter.
<Myrtti> I think that's the main point.
<ali1234> i don't use twitter (or facebook)
<Myrtti> well, don't be dick in general is a good guidance
<ali1234> literally everyone who uses them is a massive asshole
<directhex> yeah, i was going for "don't be an idiot" rather than anything particularly penile
<ali1234> LITERALLY
<ali1234> is there anything else i need to do?
<Myrtti> directhex: yeah, I considered, but LRL2008 and mjg's speech came to mind
<directhex> ali1234: general case? condemn bad behaviour. silence is complicity
<ali1234> i can only condemn bad behaviour that i actually see
<Myrtti> I'm so burnt out on the past misogynistic geek idiocies that I can't give more than retweets
<ali1234> and since i don't use twitter i have no idea what it is you're actually talking about
<directhex> i could add a short paragraph saying as much, if you think it should be spelled out.
<ali1234> or am i supposed to go around actively seeking out bad behaviour just to condemn it?
<directhex> the big problem, which ties into the larger issue of under-representation, is a lack of empathy. just getting people to think about what effect they have on others is *hugely* productive. i'd like to think i achieve that with what i write.
<directhex> obviously don't go looking for trouble
<directhex> but be self aware, and empathetic, and you're 90% of the way to a better you
<ali1234> i am very aware that i have absolutely no influence on other people at all; especially in real life
<directhex> for the specific problem of gamergate, it's simple. don't join in, use #gameethics for grown-up discussion, point out the dog-whistle to your peers if you see them engage. if everyone did that, it wouldn't be a huge poopstorm.
<directhex> for wider issues of diversity in tech, that's a LONG discussion.
<ali1234> i don't have any peers
<Myrtti> then why are we having this conversation?
<Myrtti> just to waste time?
<ali1234> pretty much. i have no life
<ali1234> seriously tho, i don't know any other videogamers outside of the people in this channel
<BigRedS> I know people who play games, but not many people who describe themselves as "a gamer"
<ali1234> right
<ali1234> "gamer" means you go on twitter and talk about it a lot?
<BigRedS> well, it's like the distinction between 'a cyclist' and 'someone who rides a bike'
<ali1234> exactly
<BigRedS> many people define themselves by one of the activities they do a lot. I don't know many people who do so with computer games or bicycles
<ali1234> i don't know many people at all, and the ones I do generally don't define themselves in that way at all
<davmor2> ali1234: grow a peertree you have lots of peers then ;)
<ali1234> pretty much any group is defined by its worst members
<BigRedS> well, at least by its least-normal ones, those who are most obviously not in the group of non-members
<ali1234> wat
<Myrtti> davmor2: just out of interest, are the main replies to your questions mainly groans?
<Myrtti> :-D
<davmor2> Myrtti: did you not know I wrote christmas cracker jokes part time?
<BigRedS> haha. The people who are used to define a group aren't necessarily the 'worst' members, they're the people who are most obviously members. So the group of gamers is most defined by the teenage boys with poor hygene. They're more obviously 'gamers' than the rest of the people who identify as such
<directhex> which is totally meaningful, in 2014, with 1.7 billion downloads of angry birds
<BigRedS> yes, but those people don't identify as 'gamers' in the same way as the millions of people with a bike in the shed don't identify as 'cyclists'
<BigRedS> In firefox, searches from the Wonderbar seem to be performed with whichever engine is picked for the 'search' box. Is that the way it's supposed to be?
<ali1234> yes?
<BigRedS> Ah. I'll revert back to being of the opinion that the search box is completely useless
<BigRedS> I thought its one point was that it could be made to search differently to the wonderbar
<ali1234> no, the reason for it is for people who don't know what urls are
<BigRedS> hm? If the address box and the search box behave in exactly the same way, surely its only purpose is for people who haven't noticed they can search with the address bar?
<ali1234> yeah the search box is kind of pointless
<ali1234> it does mean you can always go back to your last search
<ali1234> the address bar clears out the search as soon as you hit enter
<BigRedS> ah yeah, I guess it doesn't guess things are URLs and fill them with %20s or try to use 'Error' as a scheme
<ali1234> https://github.com/ValveSoftware/steam-for-linux/issues/3478
<Tej> Hi guys.my ubuntu os slows down when copying files.can any one tell me a solution?
<SuperMatt> what filesystem type are you using?
<Tej> Ext4
<Myrtti> are you copying the files in the graphical user interface?
<Myrtti> instead of command line?
<Tej> Yes sir
<Myrtti> is any part of the system a USB drive?
<Tej> Wd external harddrive
<Myrtti> how old harddrive, how old computer?
<Tej> Asus i7 , 8gb ram. Wd 1tb hard disk usb3.0
<Tej> Almost 1 year old hdd
<daftykins> and then he was gone
<directhex> is anyone brave enough to say "IO on linux is garbage, and the whole thing is always slow under IO load"?
<foobarry> definitely the latter
<foobarry> well desktop UI anyway
<Myrtti> the desktop UI slows it down definitely
<ali1234> directhex: i say that all the time
<directhex> good
<ali1234> dd to usb -> total system freeze until it finishes
<popey> new iphone mockup made me chuckle http://i2.wp.com/dailytechwhip.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/04/iphone-6-4point7inch-screen.jpg?resize=640%2C342
<ali1234> the deadline scheduler is the problem, noop will prevent this
<popey> http://blogs.nvidia.com/blog/2014/09/04/nvidia-launches-patent-suits/
<ali1234> i'm not sad to see qualcomm and imagination getting sued
<foobarry> lawyers rubbing their hands
<diplo> A friends laptop is having screen issues, I'm thinking a ribbon/cable connection issue rather than gfx card issue. Thoughts ? When you bootup the screen either goes white or sometimes multi coloured and other times it just works, sometimes if you move the lid it'll start working
<foobarry> not sure why i watch these progs http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b04grp09/horizon-20142015-4-inside-the-dark-web
<foobarry> in dumbing down they actually don't appeal to many ppl
<popey> https://www.ifixit.com/Teardown/Motorola+Moto+360+Teardown/28891
<popey> diplo: dell?
<diplo> Acer
<diplo> Fairly old now
<foobarry> schumachers going hom
<foobarry> e
<popey> i find sometimes it's a doggy connection, and the connectors are often in the bezel around the screen
<popey> *sometimes* you can "fix" it by pinching the bezel all the way around
<foobarry> sometimes its the inverter
<diplo> I'll give that a go, otherwise I guess it's worth taking apart as I really do think that's the issue
<diplo> Wouldn't the invertor either break or work.. not be tempremental ?
<foobarry> but usually results in black screen
<diplo> From previous experience
<foobarry> diplo: no, my sis has the same issue
<ali1234> why would the inverter affect the picture? it powers the backlight, if it is CFL
<diplo> Just watched a few vids on yourtube and the ribbon does seem to be the cause on a few Extensa models.. will take a part tomorrow and see if it's just loose/damaged and if not order a new one
<mapps> hm
<mapps> replacement board for my broken samsung should be here tomorrow..yay
<diddledan> two hours until the apple event
<diddledan> quote from macrumors: "Apple will also be streaming the event live on its website, and users will need to be running Safari on Mac/iOS in order to watch the stream."
<diddledan> annoying that apple restrict things like that
<diddledan> how difficult is it to allow other browsers to stream it?!
<popey> why would they care?
<ali1234> i know i don't
<BigRedS> diddledan: someone was paid to put that restriction robustly in place
<directhex> yeah, there is no valid reason for the block, it's just to make mac users feel good about being in a club
<daftykins> mapps: board!?
<daftykins> https://www.dropbox.com/sh/hhdxqw6zm40opvo/AABr7vB7JayyUR60cxW8YERAa?dl=0
<foobarry> how long has chrome had an icon on the system tray?
<foobarry> http://i.imgur.com/e7UKGlK.png
<foobarry> paypal doing bitcoin transactions!
<ali1234> diddledan: got a hard wordpress question for you: i want to aggregate a bunch of rss feeds into wordpress posts, and then generate an rss feed of those posts as well as displaying them on the site
<ali1234> i want all the posts no matter where they come from to have the same guid, but wordpress always modifies my guid and puts http:// on the front of it
<diddledan> hmm. I can't think of an answer to that without investigation
<ali1234> it does this because "security reasons" (there is a comment next to the code that modifies the guid)
<diddledan> what security is gained from changing the guid?!
<ali1234> job security probably
<ali1234> ie "i'm the only person who understands this code"
<ali1234> so anyway, i just need a filter that lets me edit the rss items when it prints them out
<ali1234> maybe i could do it backwards
<foobarry> yep
<foobarry> aggregate items into a single feed, then produce wordpress page from it
<ali1234> what? no, that won't help
<ali1234> what i need to do is add a filter on get_the_guid that does str_replace('http://www.facebook.com', 'www.facebook.com', $guid);
<diddledan> ali1234: you can do just that: http://codex.wordpress.org/Plugin_API/Filter_Reference/get_the_guid
<ali1234> yeah i know
<ali1234> the problem is that will apply to every post on the site
<ali1234> and the guid will still be wrong in the database
<ali1234> it will work though
<ysiry> whats the English equivalency of IRA and 401(k) form?
<ali1234> ISA (individual savings account)
<ali1234> and there are many types of pension plans, not sure which is exactly equivalent to 401(k)
<ali1234> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Individual_Savings_Account
<ali1234> diddledan: so now i need to know if get_post_by_guid applies that filter or not...
<diddledan> ali1234: before or after the fetch? I would expect it to fetch by the guid in the database and apply the filter after fetching it
<diddledan> which sucks because the one in the db is wrong
<diddledan> I see your pain
<ali1234> that's okay, i can apply the filter that breaks the guid manually before calling get_post_by_guid
<ali1234> either way it's fine, i can work around it
<ali1234> i just need to look at the source
<diddledan> use the sauce, luke
<ysiry> oh wow
<ali1234> oh wait, get_post_id_by_guid is a function *i wrote* lol
<ali1234> so it uses the "fixed" guid, cos it hits the DB direct
<ali1234> that's even better, no chance of it getting "fixed" later on
<ysiry> seems like recently the british gov announce to cancel its decision that forced british savers to pull out their pensions as a monthly budget for the rest of their lives - meaning that they previously forbidded one-time monetary withdraw of the pension fund.
<ali1234> yeah they changed it recently
<ysiry> but now theyv'e change that, and savers can get their money either as monthly budget or a single lump-sum
<ysiry> inspite of the dangers invovled with lump sum withdraws
<ysiry> and the fact that they might not have a pension
<ysiry> oh
<ysiry> i see
<ysiry> they charge 50% tax for this lump sump withdraw
<ysiry> sum
<ysiry> so youd have to be irrational to choose this option
<ysiry> eyt, its still impressive.
<ysiry> yet
<ali1234> even if i filter the guid, wordpress just breaks it again before inserting it into the rss
<ysiry> wow
<ysiry> you can also buy pension allotments in the UK independently
<ysiry> not through insurance companies.
<ysiry> that is nuts.
<ysiry> I want to move in
<ysiry> the terms of withdrawls are set by the british regulator and they oversee it to make sure that it doesnt decrease too rapidly?
<ali1234> http://wordpress.stackexchange.com/questions/160806/how-can-i-prevent-or-workaround-wordpress-guid-mangling
<ysiry> do you know how this works ali1234 ?
<ali1234> what?
<ysiry> the settings for the  terms of with withdrawls
<ysiry> withdrawals
<ali1234> no
<ysiry> do you pay fees for deposits?
<ali1234> i don't know?
<ysiry> do you know what your management fees are?
<ali1234> i don't have a pension
<ali1234> so zero
<ysiry> really
<ysiry> is it not mandated by law?
<ali1234> i don't have a job either
<ysiry> ok.
 * SuperEngineer is having "fun" watching DBAN doing it's thing on sister's old hard drive
<SuperEngineer> [for "fun" - read "getting bored"]
<DJones> Why is that all the tweets I'm seeing about new apple products are less than complementary.....
<DJones> ...Oh I know, most the IT/tech people I follow are open source people
<ali1234> oh, apple are making giant phones too now?
<diddledan> ali1234: the real shocker that nobody saw coming is they're making the AppleWatch now
<ali1234> haha
<SuperEngineer> but haven't Apple *always* "watched" [you]
<shauno> you're thinking of google ;)
<SuperEngineer> ;)
<shauno> apple want your money.  google want your data.  slightly different takes on evil
<SuperEngineer> hmmm - location sata is location data - no matter who the thief/bigcorp
<SuperEngineer> *data
<ali1234> diddledan: now wp-cron is broken
<diddledan> grr
<ali1234> site a: http://dev.drumoff.tv : cron works okay
<ali1234> site b: http://drumoff.tv : cron does not work, identical database and source code
<ali1234> tested with wp-cli... stracing it reveals that site a: opens a connection to itself, site b is trying to resolve "drumoff.tv.co.uk"
<ali1234> this times out, blocking wp-cron
<diddledan> eww
<ali1234> "drumoff.tv.co.uk" does not appear anywhere in the source code or database
<diddledan> somethings wrong with the dns lookup
<ali1234> yeah, looks that way
<ali1234> i don't understand why it is looking up that name though
<shauno> can you try just sticking an extra . at the end of the hostname?
<ali1234> how?
<shauno> eg, http://drumoff.tv./
<ali1234> well... it works?
<shauno> that should make a hostname canonical so nothing tries to expand it into the searchdomain
<ali1234> wp-cron still doesn't work though
<ali1234> it is getting the hostname from somewhere else... i don't know where
<diddledan> dns
<diddledan> e.g. /etc/resolv.conf
<ali1234> no, it's looking it up on dns
<ali1234> that is what doesn't work
<shauno> it sounds like something doesn't realise .tv is a tld.  so it's trying to match it into the searchdomain.  which can be screwy on a lot of configs.  (eg, if your /etc/resolv.conf has "search co.uk", which isn't unusual if it's automatically generated on a host named foo.co.uk)
<ali1234> so why does it work fine with dev.drumoff.tv?
<diddledan> two .s
<shauno> no idea :)
<diddledan> try www.drumoff.tv
<ali1234> why is it even doing a dns lookup on itself anyway?
<shauno> (it's easy to test if it's searchdomain gone wild.  change "search co.uk" to "search foo.co.uk" and see if it starts trying to resolve drumoff.tv.foo.co.uk)
<ali1234> good idea
<ali1234> i don't have any "search" lines in resolv.conf
<ali1234> immediately before doing a lookup on drumoff.tv.co.uk it does a lookup on drumoff.tv which succeeds
<shauno> odd.  resolvconf adds them on mine.  and drives me nuts because it gets it wrong
<ali1234> this server has been messed about by hetzner... so yeah
<ali1234> okay, the error is coming from curl
<shauno> offtopic - dell charger, HP laptop - it appears to mechnically fit, do I dare?
<ali1234> shauno: you were right with adding the .
<ali1234> curl http://drumoff.tv <- hangs for ages doing the lookup
<ali1234> with the extra . it doesn't
<shauno> interesting.  but jsut "host drumoff.tv" doesn't ?
<ali1234> nope, that's instant
<ali1234> wget also hangs
<ali1234> other hostnames attached to this machine don't hang either
<shauno> curiously, perfectly zippy here (debian 7.6 on a hetzner box)
<ali1234> other programs like ssh and telnet also hang trying to resolve drumoff.tv.co.uk
<shauno> http://paste.ubuntu.com/8302966/
<ali1234> so it is definitely some weird search domain thing
<ali1234> http://paste.ubuntu.com/8302978/ this doesn't do it
<ali1234> is this some weird ipv6 thing?
<shauno> you can try that with curl, curl -4 and curl -6
<ali1234> curl -4 works fine
<ali1234> curl -6 = haaaaang
<ali1234> drumoff.tv doesn't resolve for ipv6
<shauno> hm.  I'm not sure what that tells us, other than we might be barking up the right tree  (it shouldn't hang, it should nxdomain or something)
<ali1234> host -6 also hangs
<ali1234> ;; connection timed out; no servers could be reached
<ali1234> this machine doesn't have an ipv6 connection set up... it can do, but we never turned it on in the control panel
<shauno> does it have any v6 nameservers defined?
<ali1234> how do i find out?
<shauno> in resolv.conf as usual (eg, mine's http://paste.ubuntu.com/8303004/ )
<ali1234> no. mine is same except without the ipv6 ones
<shauno> hm.  perhaps we're not up the right tree then.  -6 would naturally fail on both of those because it's not usable
<ali1234> yes, but curl -6 also does that weird .co.uk thing
<ali1234> curl -4 does not
<ali1234> on my local machine curl -6 fails instantly
<shauno> hm.  I don't have anything that doesn't have v6 to compare
<shauno> I don't supose there's anything in route -6 ?
<shauno> (other than lines pointing to lo)
<ali1234> loads of things...
<shauno> to eth0?
<ali1234> it looks like link-local addresses to eth0, yes
<ali1234> fe80 addresses
<shauno> any with an address in next-hop?  (hetzner are weird, and use LL addresses for the router)
<ali1234> yes
<ali1234> ::/0 fe80::1 etho
<shauno> I'm suspecting that really shouldn't be there.  an outbound route for v6 makes no sense if you don't have v6
<ali1234> well, maybe we do? i don't understand it
<diddledan> what does `ifconfig eth0` say?
<shauno> ifconfig's nice and easy for that.  if you have any address starting fe80, ipv6 is enabled.  if you have any address starting 2, you've got a public address assigned
<ali1234> inet6 addr: fe80::5246:5dff:fe4d:20ac/64 Scope:Link
<shauno> I'm honestly not sure if you should have a default route without a non-local address though.  it means you can send traffic off the local link, but no-one can return it
<ali1234> yeah it seems pretty messed up
<shauno> it's a single line in /etc/network/interfaces if you want to experiment with it (just gateway fe80::1)
<shauno> but I'll admit I'm guessing at oddities at this point
<ali1234> i don't have access to the oob admin console if i mess it up...
<ali1234> there is no ipv6 stuff in /etc/network/interfaces
<shauno> huh.  where the hell is it getting that from then
<MartijnVdS> autoconf?
<MartijnVdS> SLAAC
<shauno> I'd assume slaac would have given him an address
<MartijnVdS> yes
<MartijnVdS> and link-local addresses are automagic
<shauno> (and shouldn't give him fe80::1 as a gateway.  that's something very weird that hetzner do)
<shauno> but I am totally thrown at having a default route without an address.
<ali1234> should i just enable ipv6 properly?
<shauno> well if v6 works it shouldn't hang
<shauno> but if it doesn't work, it shouldn't hang either!
<ali1234> shauno: i'm trying to delete that ipv6 route with: route -6 del ::/0 gw fe80::1
<ali1234> and i get SIOCDELRT: No such process
<ali1234> okay, deleted the route, still hanging at name resolution with curl
<shauno> see that I don't get. it should fail just as fast as it does at home
<popey> http://www.theverge.com/2014/9/9/6128759/microsoft-said-to-be-buying-the-maker-of-minecraft-for-2-billion
<popey> golly
<shauno> yyyyeah I think 'golly' pretty much sums that one up
<Azelphur> just looking at the apple watch
<Azelphur> is it just me or does the default watchface look really ugly? round watchface on a square watch? o.O
<daftykins> can't believe this is on apple.com - https://www.dropbox.com/s/xa9ft88mpx1r30a/applewatch.JPG?dl=0
<Azelphur> daftykins: haha
<Azelphur> daftykins: that said, Apple maps seems to have strangely one upped Google maps (I never thought I'd say that)
<Azelphur> the navigation on Android wear is so shit it's actually useless.
<Azelphur> it looks like they've carbon cloned Google Now, inb4 everyone saying Apple invented it
<shauno> eh, you say cloned, we say perfected :)
<Azelphur> lol
<sn0> i wonder how long the rotary dial will last on the iwatch
<daftykins> 10 spins :D
<Azelphur> and I love how they have a long winded funny explanation for...an optical wheel
<shauno> heh, yes . everyone's complaining they're calling it a crown.  which is the proper term for that part of a watch :/
<shauno> although in the videos they use exactly the same phrase so many times it starts sounding alien
<shauno> personally, I like the arms race.  perhaps the navigation on android wear will start improving now that they have something to measure it against
<Azelphur> and to be honest, you have a touch screen right there which is a much larger scrolly area
<Azelphur> although I like the idea of a physical home button.
<shauno> we all take sides, but we actually do better if neither wins
<Azelphur> shauno: agree, arms race is good :)
<Azelphur> and yea, I was thinking the same thing, perhaps google will finally make nav on android wear not suck.
<shauno> I gather the idea is that when the screen is the size of your thumb, there's times you want to interact and still be able to see anything
 * Azelphur shrugs
<shauno> besides.  it makes it look like a watch
<Azelphur> the other thing I've had as a problem with Android wear is it seems to have this obsession with one button per screen, and you have to swipe to switch between buttons
<shauno> without that one detail, it'd just look like a really, really small iphone
<Azelphur> yes, it's a small screen, no, you don't need one button to take up the entire screen, you can quite happily fit 4 or so per page.
#ubuntu-uk 2014-09-10
<Coimbra> OERIAS is back!
<gebbione> serious? https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nautilus/+bug/1322925 5 months and no change?
<lubotu3> Ubuntu bug 1322925 in nautilus (Ubuntu) "Copy, paste stops working randomly in Ubuntu 14.04 nautilus" [Undecided,Confirmed]
<gebbione> useless distro
<gebbione> going to look for something better, so many bugs, how was ubuntu 14 acceptance tested????
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Swap Ideas Day! :-D
<DJones> Have I slept for 6 months, its not APril 1st is it? http://games.slashdot.org/story/14/09/09/2334235/report-microsoft-to-buy-minecraft-studio-for-2bn
<Myrtti> if Notch would want more money quickly, then that might be the way, I'm a bit doubtful he'd do that though.
<Myrtti> I suppose everything is possible.
<DJones> Its possible, but I can't see how MS would expect to recover $2bn from Minecraft sales/income
<DJones> Plus there's the comment by Notch about releasing the source code as "some kind of open source" once sales drop off
<Elions> Some cities have less habitants than there are people who own minecraft
<Elions> So it's unlikely
<Elions> at least, anytime soon.
<Myrtti> well there is a saturation point to it all
<Myrtti> what keeps the sales going is new ways Minecraft is being used
<DJones> Xbox version looks to sell for Â£17 ish, that'd be around 70M xbox minecraft sales needed to break even
<diplo> + the income from Xbox Gold to use it?
<DJones> Ahh, thinking about it, its probably not got anything to do with the game, they just want to by copyright/patents :)
<pulse> hi
<pulse> when do jobs start at in uk on average?
<pulse> can someone tell me? :P
<pulse> (i mean what hour of the day)
<diplo> Between 8-9am
<diplo> I start at 8 as do quite a few of my friends, depends on the job I guess
<DJones> If you're a postman, its probably around 5am
<DJones> Typical shift work would be 6am-2pm, 2pm-10pm, 10pm-6am
<popey> my previous job had "core" hours between 10 and 4 which you had to be in the office for, but they didn't care about the start/end time
<popey> so if you came in early, you could go out early
<pulse> thanks :)
<directhex> pulse: it largely depends on office culture
<directhex> pulse: e.g. i set off the alarm for my current job on my third day by arriving at 10am
<pulse> well, i think each country has an average of its own
<pulse> here in slovenia jobs usually start at 8
<pulse> it's no rule though, i was wondering when i can contact some firm in the uk :P
<pulse> i contacted them successfully now so no worries
<Myrtti> when I was a kid I thought all the jobs in Finland started at 7
<ThomasRedstone> lol, office jobs are traditionally 9-5:30, but there are increasingly jobs that either specify an earlier start, say 8:30, and later end, around 6:00, or where pressure of the work, and the culture forces people to work longer hours without it being in their contract...
<DJones> Bankers are at the office between 5am and 8pm, 1st & last 3 hours of the day to shred the incriminating paperwork
<ThomasRedstone> from what I've heard a lot of that time is wasted (at a junior level), and the later time is the actual work, because they only actually get the stuff they've been waiting on towards the end of the day, crazy bankers
<ThomasRedstone> anyone here been using Netflix on Ubuntu? I've got it working by upgrading lnbnss3 to the version used 14.10, but it's unstable (which might be purely down to the fact I'm using a different OS's deb files...)
<bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
<bigcalm> Anybody here make use of Checkpoint VPN?
<davmor2> bigcalm: NO
<bigcalm> davmor2: DAMN
<popey> i used to
<popey> when i worked in an office with silly windows rubbish
<bigcalm> :(
<ThomasRedstone> bigcalm, what's your real question? Maybe someone knows something...
<davmor2> popey: but windows let in light into the office, without windows you would be able to see unless they have those new fangled electric lights!
 * popey notes his blind is shut
<ThomasRedstone> popey, my curtains too, what is wrong with us?!
<davmor2> it's the sun it burnses us, the precious
<ThomasRedstone> Freelancer.com sent me an email with the subject "Are you capturing your mobile users?", where the hell do they expect me keep them all?! I'm not some evil super villain!!!
<davmor2> ThomasRedstone: surely you are the only person using your mobile
<ThomasRedstone> a good point, my daughter does sometimes, and she's already kind of captured, she can't legally go anywhere without my permission! Muhahaha :-P
<diplo> Recommendations of what to use other than Nagios, any preferred over another ?
<diplo> OPsview/Icinga/Zabbix are what I was thinking of trying
<foobarry> bleurgh
<foobarry> doc says i have bronchitis
<bigcalm> Tummy says I have hunger *gurgle*
<davmor2> bigcalm: it lies
<bigcalm> It makes me feel ill
 * bigcalm reaches for the chewing gum
<foobarry> diplo: adagios
<foobarry> its nagios with the annoying bits fixed
<bigcalm> foobarry: that sucks, I hope you get well soon
<diplo> I've not seen that foobarry
 * diplo takes a look
<bigcalm> A possible alternative to nagios: https://github.com/intrbiz/bergamot
<foobarry> i also had a 24hr sick bug yesterday to compound issues :(
<foobarry> feeling v sorry for myself
<diplo> demo is broke bigcalm, foobarry that looks quite nice
<diplo> May play with it locally
<bigcalm> diplo: it's by a guy from our LUG. He really needs more people to contribute and make the project great
<diplo> Get him to fix the demo first then :D
<diplo> I'll download later and try it locally
<foobarry> adagios allows editing of config files , where nagios will overwrite and squash files badly
<bigcalm> I'll prod him about the demo
<foobarry> also its morepretty
<diplo> yeah I noticed that, quite liked that
<foobarry> where's this list of 5m gmail accounts that were compromised?
<foobarry> think i've got it
<foobarry> wow there's some lame passwords
<intrbiz> bigcalm: hello there, thanks for plugging http://bergamot-monitoring.org/
<Myrtti> eh
<davmor2> intrbiz: wow dude what are you doing here ;)
<bigcalm> o/
<intrbiz> haha, dancing with the devil, something like that
<intrbiz> is Ubuntu 14.10 shipping with systemd?
<davmor2> intrbiz: dancing with the devil in the pale moonlight :)
<bigcalm> davmor2: at the moon under water no doubt
<intrbiz> mmmmm beer
<foobarry> my wife's name is on the 5M google emails
<davmor2> intrbiz: pass it's had bits for a while so I'm not sure
<foobarry> is there a list of passwords associated with the 5m names?
<davmor2> intrbiz: I would say it is more likely to land fully in 15.04 though but that is me guessing.
<diddledan> foobarry: what's this about gmail accounts?
<diddledan> (I just came in)
<foobarry> list of 5M compromised gmail  accounts out there
<diddledan> ooh
<diddledan> not good
<bigcalm> intrbiz: if it's the only thing stopping a .deb release, man up and write a init.d script ;)
<davmor2> foobarry: the guys purged the passwords reading the news articles
<bigcalm> intrbiz: or are there other bits of systemd that I'm missing?
<foobarry> the first two letters of the pasword don't match with one she ever used
<foobarry> have google ever distinguished between accounts with a "." in the name?
<foobarry> looks like hte passwods are not for gmail accounts
<diddledan> I'm not sure I understand the question
<diddledan> gmail usernames with or without a . must be unique
<diddledan> i.e. dan.llew and danllew are different usernames
<foobarry> really? even in gmail?
<foobarry> i thought i could send to foo.barry and foobarry and get both mails
<foobarry> "Gmail doesn't recognize dots as characters within usernames, you can add or remove the dots from a Gmail address without changing the actual destination"
<diddledan> weird
<diddledan> that's odd behaviour
<intrbiz> bigcalm: Its the initscript and log handling that I mainly rely on, nothing to major, just another bit of time
<bigcalm> Fair enough. I think you need more contributors to the project :)
 * bigcalm slithers off to lunch
<mapps> yay
<mapps> samsung motherboard here
<popey> \o/ changed my launchpad name https://launchpad.net/~popey
 * popey like sbears
<popey> also bears
<Azelphur> popey: now get your name changed by depol to that. :P
<popey> hehe
<popey> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aZZHBxM70OI
<Azelphur> hehe
<Azelphur> popey: did you see my latest shenanigans in Bitcoin land?
<popey> your job?
<Azelphur> yea
<popey> yeah, nice one.
<Azelphur> that and I got randomly shipped to Berlin by ownCloud, having only heard about it 4 days prior
<mapps> what you don re bitcoin
<Azelphur> mapps: https://home.azelphur.com/owncloud/public.php?service=files&t=0d302c5f272a6614b4e0502df3360659 is my employment contract :P
<mapps> lol cool
<Azelphur> indeed, gonna be fun :)
<mapps> think id be laughed at if i asked for that
<mapps> i guess small company?
<Azelphur> mapps: well, it was offered to me, they offered me any currency I liked
<Azelphur> somewhat small, but they are in the Bitcoin realm which is why Bitcoin is an option
<mapps> ah yea
<mapps> somehow dont think bet365 will pay me in btc;p
<mapps> i have to wait 6 weeks for pay after this month too..which blows
<Azelphur> mapps: the fact that a site like bit365 doesn't accept BTC is a major loss for them :P
<mapps> somehow bcause my pay date moves when i move to gibraltar ..quite annoying and i dont see why
<Azelphur> the BTC casinos are /huge/ now
<Azelphur> I made a tidy sum by investing in SatoshiDice
<mapps> really?
<Azelphur> yup
<mapps> i dunno its too much hassle for me tbh
<mapps> and for most people betting id imagine
<mapps> login betfair type my 3 digits in moneys there
<Azelphur> mapps: it circumvents gambling laws in USA, which is why its so popular.
<mapps> yea
<mapps> make a betting exchange with btc
<mapps> that would be cool
<Azelphur> hehe
<mapps> the new iphones seem nice
<mapps> and claim prety good battery life
<Azelphur> mapps: sorry, I read the specs last night while giggling
<mapps> pfff
<mapps> the battery life was decent..no?
<Azelphur> theverges article read like a comedy
<mapps> i dont see the appeal of a smart watch tho
<mapps> cant see what id want it for
<Azelphur> mapps: yea, apparently it's a bit better battery wise
<mapps> they claim 24hrs on one of them
<Azelphur> the things that made me laugh were the 1334x750 "Retina HD woo shiny" display :P
<mapps> heh
<marxjohnson> Um, 24 hours battery life for the iphone?
<mapps> ja
<Azelphur> "Apple says it uses an all-new sensor with even larger pixels than before." made me burst out laughing
<marxjohnson> If that's decent, what's it like on the 5?
<mapps> way less than 24jrs lol
<Azelphur> "Apple says the camera has a new autofocus system that uses pixels on the image sensor to focus even faster than before." what else is it gonna use, magic sky fairies? :P
<marxjohnson> Oh dear. I wonder what they do differently that makes it eat power? Maybe I just have less power-hungry stuff on all the time on my Nexus
<Azelphur> sorry...that article was so funny :x
<mapps> yea my nexus7 lasts a long time
<mapps> but my 5s if i actually do anything on it dies pretty quickly
<Azelphur> marxjohnson: it's 24 hours of standby time, web browsing and such is only 10 hours.
<Azelphur> and that 10 hours is probably with everything but the essentials turned off
<marxjohnson> Holy crap
<Azelphur> I imagine it's pretty much on par with other modern smartphones.
<mapps> yea
<Azelphur> mapps: on the watch, I really did like apples navigation thing, can't fault that in theory
<Azelphur> and googles one is terrible
<mapps> but who needs it
<Azelphur> I'd use it
<marxjohnson> Well when i was playing Sonic 4 on my Nexus that drained the battery in a few hours, but with normal usage (occasional calls/texts/browsing, TTS audio books) it lasts about 2 days
<Azelphur> I walk places a lot
<mapps> so do i..but use your phone for stuff?
<Azelphur> mapps: it's another stage in miniaturisation and portability, on the same basis, use your laptop for stuff ;)
<Azelphur> the watches are mostly useful for notifications though, it's a pain to pull your phone out just to find out you got an email that could have been viewed with a glance at your wrist.
<marxjohnson> Plus you get to feel like you're in Thunderbirds
<Azelphur> indeed, great fun talking to your watch and freaking people out
<diplo> Azelphur, I got round the email alerts by only having alerts/noises on emails I care about. Family/friends and a few important ones make a notification sound etc where as everything else just slips through
<Azelphur> I see, I prefer to not miss anything :)
<mapps> how long you in germany for?
<Azelphur> mapps: I'm not in Germany any more, I came back last Monday :)
<mapps> oh
<mapps> hm cool got 4g where i am atm
<mapps> normally only use my orange 3g contract..luckily one of thems ending in 2 weeks:D
<mapps> still got 18months on my ee one tho and i wont be here..dunno if its worth phoning ..im not gonna pay it off may aswell keep it if thats the case
<Azelphur> ouch
<Azelphur> mapps: going to Berlin?
<mapps> nah
<mapps> gibraltar
<mapps> but gt 2 contracts atm orange unlimited 3g iphone 5
<mapps> ee iphone 5s 5gig 4g
<mapps> didnt really want 2 while im not here..so luckily 1 runs out
<mapps> i could try and lower the tarrif on ee one i guess
<Azelphur> mapps: or sell it to someone that wants it
<mapps> nah then if theyre up to no good its under my name:D
<Azelphur> spose
<directhex> 10T sata rust drives announced by hgst @_@
<popey> wowzers
 * popey looks at the 12 bays in his microserver and ponders 12x10TB
<diddledan> popey: they have 12 bays?!
<popey> 4 internal, 8 external
<diddledan> aah
<davmor2> popey: why you ponder that, what flowers would you like at your funeral when you're beloved finds out an kills you? ;)
<diddledan> I wonder how quickly you could fill up a 120TB array?!
<diddledan> I suggest running a `for i in /dev/sd??; do dd if=/dev/zero of=$i; done` first... might take a few days to complete :-p
<intrbiz> Seagate (sort of) announced 8TB drives the other week.  Sadly it looks like HGST are having to use SMR to get the 10TB, which will dent perf somewhat
<diddledan> intrbiz: SMR?
<intrbiz> shingled magnetic recording
<popey> i could keep backups for longer
<ujjain> are credit cards used for paying rent? seems like a good idea to use a 2% unlimited cash back credit card for your rent
<ujjain> that 2% is 240 yearly for me
<diddledan> ujjain: no
<diddledan> ujjain: it is usually cash, cheque, debit or directdebit
<SuperEngineer> "Following the death of his pet rat, Pepeijn Bruins decided he wanted to have it stuffed and attach three propellers."
<SuperEngineer> is that really what happens on the Real Ale Train?
<diddledan> yey for getting "stuffed" drinking ale
<SuperEngineer> ;)
<davmor2> SuperEngineer: only before the party starts, afterwards they are too busy playing pass the ratcopter
 * SuperEngineer likes the idea of a ratcopter
<mapps> ujjain,  nah places charge a fee for using cc
<ujjain> ah right
<mapps> like booking flights and hotels :( else id use a cashback card all the time
<mapps> ive had like Â£60 of m&s vouchers so far his year:D
<ujjain> ah right fair point
<ujjain> I remember having such experiences
<mapps> i get cashback on my m&s mastercard
<mapps> i get cashback on my barclays american express BUT not everywhere takes it anyway
<SuperEngineer> mapps - keep a gun in same pocket as wallet... you'd be serprised how much cash back you get ;)
<mapps> heh
<mapps> its obv known not everywhere takes amex..as its 1 account but 2cards.an amex and a mastercard..the amex has cashback and 0 abroad fees:D
<mapps> hm i didnt know you were allowed lighters or matches in hand luggage..had to chuck some cool matches we got in a bar in Latvia..but yet at the airport accidently had a lighter on me and they said its ok
<mapps> i was sure you werent allowed O_o
<SuperEngineer> [probably the phosphorous in the matches that frightened them... silly huh?]
<SuperEngineer> [as if you could do anything nasty with phosphorous!]
<mapps> no i mean i chucked them in the bin at hotel
<mapps> but a lighter is ok?!
<SuperEngineer> in other words - they were correct
<mapps> i thought lighters.matches everything was banned
<SuperEngineer> provoded it's only got lighter fuel in it - it can't do anything more than explode, surely?
<SuperEngineer> ;)
<mapps> well thats enough
<mapps> you could start a fire!
<SuperEngineer> guess the NSA & GCHQ have now just started this channel lol
<SuperEngineer> ...& having mentioned them... hmmmmmmmm
<diddledan> I think the NSA and GCHQ have been monitoring this channel for some time - I'm here
<diddledan> surely my presence is enough to warrant surveilance, no?
<mapps> ;]
<SuperEngineer> diddledan [no, probably only the crime squad]  :D
 * SuperEngineer likes Gregg Proops advice to all peeps who send him mail following his podcast... add a little hate message for the NSA
<SuperEngineer> [last one was "if you're going to do that in the office - clean up after you]
<SuperEngineer> expletives deleted of course
<mapps> itd be ok to leave a raspberry pi on for 6months while im away wouldnt it?
<diddledan> yeah
<mapps> just wanted to leave squid and openVPN running on it so i can use stuff like bbc iplayer
<mapps> 4od
<mapps> etc
<mapps> i thought about leaving my dell desktop (old machine i use as server) but i feel its a bad idea?
<diddledan> at 5volt/1amp it'll barely register on any leccy bill
<mapps> im not meaning that
<mapps> i mean like no chance of a fire or something
<mapps> leaving my old dell desktop on for 6-12months would be dodgy?
<daftykins> i was rudely awoken today my a stern knock at the door
<daftykins> i dragged myself out of bed which was quite painful due to not having had my morning pain meds yet, and high-tailed it down there
<daftykins> nobody on the street, too slow =|
<SuperEngineer> yeah gads! I'm either running my pooters on coal or someone locally just lit a coal fire -and I'm *not* running pooters on coal!
<daftykins> then again later! caught him that time though, all for a pesky gas meter reader =|
<daftykins> SuperEngineer: feeling some heat?
<SuperEngineer> pooooooooh!
<daftykins> Winnie, the?
<SuperEngineer> daftykins: nah - smelling the smell
<daftykins> ah i see
<SuperEngineer> lol
 * SuperEngineer hears sheep bleating - assume they don't like the smell either
<bigcalm> Are there any better Markdown editors than ReText?
<daftykins> just sent a client an email to see if they'll read the serial number off a NAS i put in for them so i can get the Â£35 rebate - fingers crossed!
<SuperEngineer> you hum it - I'll sing it!
 * daftykins blinks
<SuperEngineer> ^ for bigcalm
<daftykins> i want what SuperEngineer's having
<bigcalm> SuperEngineer: you've lost me
<SuperEngineer> daftykins: it's called "on leave" - it's a rare earth material
<daftykins> mmm leaves
<SuperEngineer> spoil sport
<SuperEngineer> ..but honest - no leaves [well tobacco is/are leaves I sippose - but nowt else
<SuperEngineer> [don't worry - I'm off to see daughter tomorrow - i'll you in peace then ;)  ]
<SuperEngineer> *leave you
<daftykins> lol
<daftykins> i'm playing some more Destiny on my new xbox one which i bought yesterday
<SuperEngineer> did you choose destiny or was that the "enforced" freebie?
<daftykins> choice yeah, it was on offer
<SuperEngineer> nice one!
<daftykins> they had none of the consoles in with the silly Kinect device so i thought meh, no harm in getting the one without :D
<daftykins> so i got the console + game for Â£291
<SuperEngineer> yeh - less chance of NSA looking at the silly faces we make when playing games
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> agreed
<daftykins> but i really don't get this voice control fascination
<daftykins> it's totally unpleasant to me, i never even found myself wanting to try it on my smartphone
<SuperEngineer> Â£291?!!! - ypu could have given me Â£100 and I'd have given you an ex-box!
<SuperEngineer> emphasis on *ex*-box
<SuperEngineer> :D
<daftykins> that'll be my VAT-less benefit yeah ;)
<daftykins> i am quite impressed by HMV Guernsey, they were practically within Â£3 of amazon UK's price
<SuperEngineer> wow - also impressed
<daftykins> so i figured i'd prefer walking the ~150m rather than waiting for delivery :D
<SuperEngineer> I can do the Â£/metre maths there - that's good value
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> i did have to carry it in my one good arm mind you ;)
<daftykins> https://www.dropbox.com/sh/hhdxqw6zm40opvo/AABr7vB7JayyUR60cxW8YERAa?dl=0
<popey> I'm with daftykins
<popey> voice control. pah
<directhex> but for skyrim?
<directhex> fus ro DAH!
<bigcalm> Where are .desktop files stored globally?
<bigcalm> Oh, found them, ta
<bigcalm> So, anybody used uberwriter? :)
<popey> looks like pyroom
<bigcalm> I'm trying to find a decent Markdown editor that will allow me to include CSS when exporting to HTML
<bigcalm> Uberwriter does so, but it's a bit buggy
<popey> patches welcome
<popey> â»
<bigcalm> ReText isn't buggy but doesn't offer that option
<intrbiz> bigcalm: have you looked at somethink like jekyl?
<bigcalm> intrbiz: is that a KDE app?
<intrbiz> bigcalm: where you can apply templates to the MD, nah its a Ruby servery thingy
<intrbiz> bigcalm: it what github uses to do their pages stuff - http://jekyllrb.com/
<bigcalm> Ah. Looks overkill, but I'll have a play with it. Ta :)
<intrbiz> bigcalm: MD does allow you to inline HTML, should you might be able to cheat and munge in a style block
<Pendulum> daftykins: I do like that voice control makes things more accessible to disabled people. Personally, I have a love/hate relationship.
<davmor2> bigcalm: emacs, emacs does everything, or vim vim does everything :D
<davmor2> bigcalm: have you had a look at sublime I think there are a few people using that.
<bigcalm> davmor2: I thought sublime was Mac only
<davmor2> bigcalm: pass
<davmor2> bigcalm: http://www.sublimetext.com/2
<bigcalm> Ta
<davmor2> bigcalm: I don't know what it can do and not do I just see it's name banded around by devs
<bigcalm> $70
<bigcalm> I'll see if my current IDE can export MD to HTML
<davmor2> bigcalm: it does say free for evaluation it doesn't say how long evaluation is :)
<MartijnVdS> http://www.commitstrip.com/en/2014/09/10/guilty-sales-guy/
<popey> anyone know someone into debian packaging who wants some contract work? https://plus.google.com/u/0/116915640151584325691/posts/PYh6TGSGZEJ
<ujjain> Are sleeping at work and playing pc games at work valid rasons to get fired?
<daftykins> no to the first if you're in Japan, but i'd hope so for the majority of cases :D
<popey> Depends if there's guidelines that say don't do either of those things.
<popey> I saw an article recently about Googlers who sleep at work to avoid paying rent
<popey> and I know people who play games at work, but they work for game developers... sooo....
<daftykins> haha
<daftykins> hmm just grep'd that leaked gmail password text file for my addy and some others
<daftykins> no sign
<daftykins> thankfully
<ujjain> our guidelines say we can be subjected to drug tests
<ujjain> not that I use drugs, but still seems like you should be able to do what you want in your free time
<ujjain> yeah, my gmail address wasnt in the list either, fortunately
<ujjain> although I use a unique password for my gmail address that I dont use anywhere else
<daftykins> a friend did research work in Japan, it's considered a high mark of professionalism to have fallen asleep at your desk
<daftykins> what with the crazy hours they put in, etc
<ujjain> hmm, but everybody is so close to eachother at my company
<ujjain> I couldnÂ´t, but I hear stories about people arriving 3am at the company after going and waking up at 8am and work
<shauno> I don't seem to get in trouble for napping.  I get in trouble for snoring.  apparently that makes the difference.
<ujjain> ah me too, buffalo ujjain :(
<daftykins> XD
<shauno> the difference seems to be we can nap if there's no-one in sight.  but I can't snore unless the floor (and the floor below) are empty :/
<ujjain> they can make silencers for bazookaÂ´s, why not for me :-( IÂ´m sure I make less sound than them
#ubuntu-uk 2014-09-11
<maps|wrk> hi all
<SuperMatt> morning people
<SuperMatt> time to start discussing release parties?
<SuperMatt> wall papers were announced, so we must be close ;)
<knightwise> mownin Derps !
<lashy_> Hi guys  just noticed this ! Ubuntu newbie so  lot to learn. i have 5 awesome cats.
<knightwise> Welcome lashy_ !! !
<lashy_> well thank you
 * knightwise is a cross platform slider using a variety of Linux (ubuntu) mac and even windows systems.
<arsen> All the best of us use <too many> platforms :D
<arsen> he says, from a centos VM on a macbook pro
<arsen> via a debian server..
<arsen> :D
<JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Make Your Bed Day! :-D
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<popey> http://www.reddit.com/r/Ubuntu/comments/2g2uef/having_petty_trouble_with_chromium_web_apps/
<popey> i read that as "Heavy petting"
<popey> need more tea
<bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
<brobostigon> morning bigcalm
<bigcalm> Hola
<mapps> GAH
<mapps> ive put openvpn on my pi..done all the config/files..but the client doesnt even connect
<brobostigon> martijn knows quite abit about openvpn if memory serves.
<davmor2> JamesTait: You say that but I bet you didn't make your bed :P
<davmor2> JamesTait: Mind you if it is taking a day maybe you are ;)
<JamesTait> davmor2, :-O  I'm shocked by that accusation!  I make my bed every morning (because I'm always the last out of it).
<davmor2> popey: wow the app jump out and grope you, that would be trouble
<davmor2> JamesTait: so you make more work for yourself by being lazy genius ;)
<mapps> Sep 11 10:41:03 raspberrypi ovpn-server[5128]: Options error: In [CMD-LINE]:1: Error opening configuration file: /etc/openvpn/server.conf
<mapps> well thats one reason :D
<JamesTait> davmor2, no, I exchange one kind of work for another - if I got up first (before 4am) I'd end up preparing lunches and doing the ironing. ;)
<davmor2> JamesTait: hahahahaha
<mapps> gah renamed my config file..but it still doesnt seem to load - checking ps aux and it snot there
<mapps> and nothiung in sys log
<davmor2> rip Jaws
<mapps> hm?
<diddledan> mapps: the bond villain jaws died
<bigcalm> You mean the bond hero!
<mapps> ah yea
<popey> You mean Happy Gilmore's boss!
<bigcalm> How does one compare two git branches locally?
<bigcalm> GUI is preferable
<directhex> bigcalm: git diff branch1..branch2
<bigcalm> It can be done in gitlab, but it's not working locally
<directhex> meld is the preferred tool for examining such things, afaik
<bigcalm> directhex: GUI would be preferable
<bigcalm> I have meld, haven't worked out how to compare two branches in it though
<Myrtti> you know, I didn't know Yorkshire made individually wrapped one cup teabags
<bigcalm> Myrtti: Hayley gets mailed one once a year on her birthday from them
<Myrtti> bigcalm, yeah I got one a month ago too
<popey> You northerners are wierd
<Myrtti> bigcalm, but I specifically meant http://cdn3.volusion.com/gevj2.te6na/v/vspfiles/photos/TOHYO20-3.jpg?1351608825
<Myrtti> (mine didn't have the tag on a string)
<Myrtti> popey, pft. https://www.flickr.com/photos/myrtti/14803415938/
<popey> still wierd
<davmor2> Myrtti: don't get blagged by them.  Stick with pukka yorkshire tea
<Myrtti> oh you don't know even half of it
<bigcalm> Yorkshire Hard Water tea FTW
<Myrtti> yup
<Myrtti> tis lovely
<bigcalm> Which I keep calling Heavy Water
<Myrtti> I'm considering using the individually wrapped as *ahem* party favours for guests.
<Myrtti> with some 'Finnish' teas
<popey> went to a wedding at the weekend, favours were glass jars of sweets
<popey> girls had white chocolate buttons with sprinkles on them, boys had jelly babiesw
<popey> no, wine gums
<Myrtti> yeah well a lot of our guests will be flying in so I'm trying to keep the weight of the favours small
<popey> oh these were all eaten â»
<popey> very little weight left
<Myrtti> mm
<bigcalm> Heh
<bigcalm> I think we ended up not doing favours. popey: can you remember?
<bigcalm> We had a sweet cart and cake that peeps took away with them if they wanted
<popey> yes, i remember lots of sweets
<bigcalm> Hayley wanted to do the teabag idea, but ran out of time
<bigcalm> I occasionally think about the wedding and then instantly want another hog roast
<Myrtti> I've contacted Yorkshire if their importer has the one bag things in Finland
<bigcalm> Myrtti: are you having the wedding in FI or UK?
<Myrtti> Finland, otherwise it were easier
<Myrtti> for the favours-wise
<bigcalm> Ah
<Myrtti> but most of the other stuff seems to be cheaper in Finland
<Myrtti> at least to the level of readyness that I'm looking for
<bigcalm> Humm. I must have spent my euros in the wrong parts of Finland then :
<bigcalm> S
<Myrtti> yeah well this is a parish camp/conference centre, so their prices aren't at extortion level. Most expensive menu is 30,50â¬ a plate, venue is about 520
<Myrtti> and the lodging for the guests is depending on the room 40-50â¬ a night per face
<bigcalm> Nice
<Myrtti> lakeside place, so they've got lakeside sauna lodge and everything
<Myrtti> hopefully it's cold enough that the lake is frozen over
<bigcalm> Drool
<Myrtti> oh, and a hot tub too.
<bigcalm> Though that does mean not using the lake as a plunge pool after having a sauna
<Myrtti> there's always snow :-P
<bigcalm> Ah yes, I forget that Finland have proper winters
<Myrtti> http://www.saaksmaenseurakunta.fi/pappilanniemi/pappilanniemi/pappilanniemi_in_english/?id=1025
<bigcalm> Cool
<diddledan> "proper winters" :-p
<Myrtti> diddledan, shush.
<Myrtti> true last winter wasn't the snowiest ever, but there was some snow, for a tiny amount of time...
<bigcalm> My Finish winters were in Oulu or further north. I'm guessing they still got snow
<diddledan> sweeden in movies and tv shows seems to get a poo-load of snow
<diddledan> e.g. original girl-with-the-dragoon-tatoo movie
<diddledan> speaking of which, how annoying is it that steig larsson died without writing more books about her ?! :-(
<diddledan> I live in hope that someone else will come up with a compelling continuation to the story
<daftykins> diddledan: very inconsiderate of him i say
<daftykins> i did enjoy those books
<diddledan> me too
<daftykins> less so #3 that stayed in court a lot, yet it still managed to hold my interest
<Myrtti> oh btw to repeat myself from few days back. The Honourable Woman. Oh man. Watch it, if you haven't yet. Get it. It's available atleast on Amazon Prime and Google Play and whatnot.
<Myrtti> is amazin
<diddledan> Myrtti: thanks for the heads-up - that does look like it's gonna be an interesting watch
<Myrtti> I nabbed it from iPlayer when it still was there
<daftykins> series? film?
<Myrtti> series
<Myrtti> 8 parts
<ujjain> what is the best site to sell 2nd hand it things? I want to sell my 2560x1440 monitor
<Myrtti> gumtree, facebook
<intrbiz> ebay
<Myrtti> freegle
<Myrtti> although that's for giving stuff away
<diddledan> ebay
<ujjain> ah ok, i have it on gumtree, but doesnt seem to be popular for monitors,
<ujjain> not a single 2560x1440 monitor listing
<ujjain> i'll do ebay, but I only have 12 reviews on my profile, 0 as a seller
<ujjain> thanks
<diddledan> ujjain: what size monitor?
<popey> http://m.gumtree.com/p/computer-monitors/x-star-dp2710-led-tempered-glass-27-2560x1440-samsung-pls-27inch-dvi-pc-monitor/1080655237
<popey> that one?
 * smittix yawns
 * daftykins joins in
<smittix> o/
<mapps> O_o
<mapps> cant wait  to move..weeeeeeeeee 23rd 06;25 :D
<mapps> living in the sun for once
<mapps> yay
<daftykins> :)
<daftykins> good luck, i can't cope with heat ;)
<davmor2> mapps: you know it rain there all the time right?
<mapps> hahaha
<mapps> im sure it doesnt
<davmor2> no all the time ;)
<mapps> bit annoying its so early
<daftykins> finally tidied up the laundry
<daftykins> damn that was hard work
<mapps> but work paying for the taxi anyway
<mapps> :)
<daftykins> :D
<smittix> Can anyone recommend any Python books?
<jpds> smittix: http://learnpythonthehardway.org/book/
<smittix> jpds: Awesome, Thanks!
<davmor2> smittix: +1
<davmor2> smittix: there is also some pretty nice python videos from google on youtube too iirc
<davmor2> smittix: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tKTZoB2Vjuk
<smittix> I struggle with the GUI stuff using glade
<daftykins> i can only think of glade as an air freshener
<smittix> heh
<smittix> I have also tried Anjuta
<mapps> my raspberry pi works well
<mapps> got squid and dansguardin and openvpn running on it
<mapps> yay
<SuperMatt> ok, it looks like I might be moving to a rolling release distro D:
<SuperMatt> I like Ubuntu so much, but I want to be more bleeding edge!
<SuperMatt> at the moment I'm looking mostly at opensuse factory
<smittix> taken me around 2 hours to get this far heh My own wargames - Game
<smittix> http://fpaste.org/132930/14104688/
<smittix> Well the start of it anyway
#ubuntu-uk 2014-09-12
<ali1234> hah! ipv6
<shauno> we've created a monster
<ali1234> hey shauno
<shauno> morning
<ali1234> while i was fiddling around the raid died
<ali1234> we had to get a new hard drive put in, and the other drive had enough bad blocks to corrupt the OS
<shauno> I'm quite glad I'm not one of your computers
<ali1234> then we had to reinstall... so now we've got working ipv6 at least
<daftykins> XD
<ali1234> now i just have to set verything up again :)
<daftykins> why weren't the bad blocks spotted prior in some kinda RAID health report 0o
<diddledan> iplayer thinks I'm foreign again
<daftykins> diddledan: perhaps they've yet to geoIP the 'amazing' variant of stoke ;D
<shauno> we finally get to deport dan?
<ali1234> daftykins: cos the mails go to /var/mail/root and who reads that?
<daftykins> lol
<daftykins> urgh it really annoys me when a dynamic DNS service doesn't seem to be functioning
<shauno> I just don't do dynamic dns.  once, I tried to do it on bind9 with apple 'global bonjour' pushing updates.  I'm still not quite the same person I was before that.
<diddledan> daftykins: as in the service providing dynamic dns or the service the ddns hostname points to?
<daftykins> well, i get a timeout trying to SSH to a client's box, that's all i truly know
<diddledan> aah
<daftykins> i haven't quite gotten around to getting them to pay for no-ip, so he forwards me the renew emails instead
<daftykins> i got one just the other day and did the captcha, but oddly it doesn't seem to be around
<daftykins> i might just be doing something silly, my heads not quite right since the accident still :/
<daftykins> i need to start taking notes of clients setups such as port configs, so i don't rely on my memory
<diddledan> anyone around who knows about floppies?
<diddledan> specifically really ancient 360KB 5.25inchers
<ali1234> a bit
<diddledan> ubuntu 14.04.1 won't recognise them
<daftykins> lol
<diddledan> I can correctly boot off an msdos disk but ubuntu won't mount the same disk stating that fd0 isn't a valid block device
<ali1234> it might be a usb device
<diddledan> o_O
<diddledan> what would usb have to do with things?
<ali1234> motherboard chipsets don't have floppy drive controllers built in any more
<diddledan> this motherboard does tho
<diddledan> you can't get usb adapters for 5.25inch drives
<ali1234> well, quite
<ali1234> did the mysql password hashing change between ubuntu 12.04 and 14.04?
<diddledan> ali1234: it might have, tho I would expect any older password hashes would still be supported for auth
<ali1234> nope
<ali1234> got to reset all the passwords
<diddledan> grr
<popey> [A
<popey> Morning
<diplo> Morning
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<DJones> I'll make up the quorum and confirm it is Morning
<smittix> Well that game idea hit a brick wall.
<popey> game idea?
<smittix> heh http://fpaste.org/132930/14104688/
<smittix> Was messing around with Python
<popey> heeh
<popey> I was playing with an HTML5 game creator thing recently
<smittix> I just sat there last night bored so started creating that. It'd look quite good in that old terminal application.
<smittix> I will have to add the games list and what not and see what to do from there. May have to watch the movie again.
<popey> Happy birthday JamesTait
<JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Friday, and happy Stand Up To Cancer Day! :-D
<marxjohnson> I've just turned my laptop on to find it's treating the keyboard as US layout, even though it's set to UK
<JamesTait> I read an e-mail thread about that recently, that I think suggested there was a bug.
<JamesTait> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-uk/2014-September/037881.html
<marxjohnson> aha, cheers
<marxjohnson> I'm doing a dist-upgrade now so we'll see if that fixes it...
<marxjohnson> Hrm nope still not right.
<MartijnVdS> http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2014/sep/12/glossary-internet-4chan-lolcats-buzzfeed-zynga
<DJones> MartijnVdS: Hmmh "IRC â internet relay chat, the protocol that allows IMs" So thats what IRC is.... Think it misses the point
<MartijnVdS> DJones: well, it's the original IM :)
<DJones> I can understand that argument, but does seem to understate what it actually is
<MartijnVdS> True, but it's an article for "normal" people :)
<DJones> I still think they'd have been better describing IRC as an instant messaging service using the multiplayer notepad system
<DJones> Hah, Pressgazette launches petition to stop authorities "spying" on journalists phone records.........Seems a bit like the pot calling the kettle black
<bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
<bigcalm> Email from my VPS
<bigcalm> /etc/cron.daily/apt:
<bigcalm> Segmentation fault (core dumped)
<bigcalm> I don't think that's a happy result
<Laney> the dying cry of an apt in distress
<Laney> where's your super cow powers now? huh?
<SuperMatt> I found a server the other day where crond hadn't started for months
<SuperMatt> didn't come back after a reboot either
 * bigcalm scratches his head
<SuperMatt> stragely it started fine when I ran the init script
 * popey looks for a good onion soup recipe. i haz too many onions
<bigcalm> I have MariaDB installed on my VPS. Just done a dist-upgrade and it's warning me that it's going to migrate the config from MySQL. Most odd
<bigcalm> popey: toasted cheese and onion sandwiches
<popey> i have cheddar and edam, so that's a possibility
<bigcalm> popey: caramelised onions
<bigcalm> 6 large red onions makes for a good batch of caramelised onions
<bigcalm> Anybody here running Ubuntu 14.04.1 on a 32bit machine?
<bigcalm> I'm getting this: http://paste.ubuntu.com/8326169/
<popey> bug 1320563
<lubotu3> bug 1320563 in systemd (Ubuntu) "invoke-rc.d: initscript systemd-logind, action "start" failed." [Undecided,Invalid] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1320563
<bigcalm> Ta
 * bigcalm reads
<bigcalm> Yep, Bytemark use a KVM kernel
<bigcalm> Now to see if they have a kernel close to 3.13.0
<bigcalm> Oh
<bigcalm> uname says that it's using 3.2.60
<bigcalm> Humg
<bigcalm> Humf
<bigcalm> The highest the VPS has to offer is 3.4.92
<bigcalm> Well, that worked
<bigcalm> popey: thanks
<popey> np
<SuperMatt> for some strange reason, I can't load the gnome-shell control panel
<SuperMatt> what's the process name for that?
<davmor2> SuperMatt: I don't know I don't use gnome-shell
<SuperMatt> looks like gnome-control-center was uninstalled somehow
 * brobostigon has been using gnome3 for ages now.
<SuperMatt> I started using it at work because our dual screen 19" monitors + cruddy graphics cards meant that unity ran slow
<SuperMatt> I'm now thinking of moving to opensuse factory so I can have a rolling release, and therefore get the new versions of gnome quicker
<foobarry> have you used opensuse before? i found it ....odd
<foobarry> and buggy and annoying
<SuperMatt> I put it on my home desktop last night
<SuperMatt> I think factory has a space for me because it's rolling and because it's quite solid
<SuperMatt> and it uses yum which I know well
<SuperMatt> I don't know pacman enough to use arch
<foobarry> it also uses that weird yast crap
<foobarry> i really wanted to like it but hated it
<foobarry> it should be intuitive to switch distros but this wasn't, even though the DE was the same
<foobarry> maybe its changed in a few years since i tried
<foobarry> actually last one i tried would even boot on my machine!
<foobarry> *not
<SuperMatt> I find opensuse interesting because it seems to lie between the rhel and debian ways of doing things
<SuperMatt> I just want to find out if they're taking the best things of each
<nigelb> Happy Birthday JamesTait!
<JamesTait> THanks, nigelb. :)
<nigelb> Or should I say, happy JamesTait day :D
<JamesTait> Oooh, that sounds scary!
<foobarry> wondering if i can justify buying a picture book for ~Â£35
<popey> a wat?
<foobarry> a book. printed one. with art in it
<JamesTait> A bookbook!
<foobarry> because my stupid/lovely library doesn't stock them
<JamesTait> http://youtu.be/MOXQo7nURs0
<foobarry> there's about 3 i want, so ideally i need to find a bookbookshop to peruse and browse
<foobarry> but only central london would have that variety :(
<intrbiz> foobarry: I use openSUSE, which version did you try?
<foobarry>  You can place a reservation for stock held within this London Libraries Consortium [LLC] catalogue for free
<foobarry> oh cool
<foobarry> intrbiz: 5yrs ago :D
<intrbiz> ah ok
<foobarry> maybe 2011
<intrbiz> 11.x then I guess
<intrbiz> yum is no more in suse, replaced with zypper
<foobarry> yes, i had zypper and yast to deal with
<foobarry> i never saw yum inside suse
<intrbiz> zypper is probably the best package manager around
<foobarry> "A 40p fee is payable for requesting an item". when is free not free?
<intrbiz> yast is interesting, it's been rewritten in 13.1 +
<intrbiz> ported to ruby
<foobarry> also the firewall config sucks royally on suse
<intrbiz> yup, that is easily fixed with: zypper in shorewall
<foobarry> had to make a change on a VM appliance made with suse factory thing
<foobarry> fw was hideous
<intrbiz> haha
<intrbiz> mageia had a very good FW setup and tools
<foobarry> i tend to use more standard distro as i use them in enterprise too
<foobarry> rhel/centos/ubuntu/debian
<intrbiz> sure, I've drifted away from mageia, mainly use openSUSE with some centos / debian / ubuntu as needed
<foobarry> whats the old name for mageia again?
<intrbiz> Mandrake -> Mandriva -> Mageia
<intrbiz> Mandriva was when Mandrake merged with Conectiva and a legal case forced a name change
<intrbiz> Mageia was the community fork
<intrbiz> there is also OpenMandriva, which doesn't seem to have much traction
<foobarry> heh
<bigcalm> intrbiz: mobile internet still more reliable than your home connection eh?
<intrbiz> bigcalm: certainly faster in an area with good coverage
<diddledan> now. a floppy drive that works fine via bios to boot a floppy (5.25inch 360KB drive) seems to io error on ubuntu 14.04
<diddledan> dmesg correctly reports that the floppy drive is a 360KB unit
<diddledan> but dmesg says there's io error when trying to mount it
<bigcalm> Wow, having fun with old hardware there
<diddledan> bigcalm: yeah, I want to archive all my hundreds of floppies
<diddledan> before the hardware to access them completely disappears off the planet
 * bigcalm tickles christel :)
<diddledan> bigcalm: you flirty
<diddledan> --y
<christel> hello bigcalm :)
<davmor2> christel: hello ;)
<davmor2> :) even
<diddledan> I've got my floppy mounted!
<diddledan> \o/
<intrbiz> diddledan: is it USB?
<diddledan> I had to tell the kernel that the disk change line doesn't exist
<diddledan> intrbiz: no
<diddledan> intrbiz: it's an old 5.25 inch 360KB unit
<intrbiz> sure, just wondered how you were connecting it
<bigcalm> I assume via an old mobo with a FD interface
<diddledan> direct to the mobo's fdc
<diddledan> you can't get usb connected 5.25 drives or adapters
<intrbiz> don't 5.25" and 3.5" drives share the same bus
<diddledan> yes they do
<diddledan> but your controller chip needs to know how to drive it
<diddledan> usb adapters for 3.5inch drives don't have the smarts to drive an older drive
<intrbiz> ok
<diddledan> floppy isn't the same as hdd - you need to specify exactly where the head should position itself via the protocol - you can't just say "I want block x" instead you say "move head to position 152 and spin the disk to 270degrees
<diddledan> it's for this very capability that copyprotection methods could be created which rely on a spiral track instead of a circular track as is normal
<ali1234> PC controller chips don't know how to read spiral floppies tho
<ali1234> which is why they can't read amiga disks etc, even though the drive hardware is identical
<diddledan> it's working nicely now with the disk change line disabled
<diddledan> getting lots of usable data off these floppies now
<shauno> I'm almost curious what you're keeping on 5.25" disks that you'd still call usable :p
<Giulianoc> Hello I have a ibm x31 thinkpad with ubuntu 10.10 ,Can you help to nstall xubuntu 12.04 , please?
<diddledan> oh golly that's ancient
<diddledan> that's gonna be a pain to bring up-to-date without wiping and starting anew
<Giulianoc> I do not have a problem to wipe the system since I cannot run any update through the update manager and install the 12.04 -14.04 Ubuntus os because not syupported pae
<Giulianoc> Hence xubuntu 12.04
<ali1234> is there a tool that will format mysqldump output so it isn't all one line and i can grep it?
<diddledan> ali1234: mysqldump can be told not to do that
<ali1234> too late for that now :(
<Giulianoc> Thanks for your prompt response, apology but I do not understand the question:format mysqldump output so it isn't all one line and i can grep it?
<daftykins> Giulianoc: backup your data and clean install
<diddledan> ali1234: for the future you can add --skip-extended-insert to the mysqldump commandline - I guess if it's not humungous you could import it into a blank db and re-export it?
<ali1234> yeah the thing is it isn't importing properly
<ali1234> that's what i'm trying to fix
<ali1234> i have a set of daily, weekly, monthly backups and i am tryin to figure out which ones are okay and which ones are bad
<ali1234> and why half the tables disappeared
<Giulianoc> how?
<Azelphur> Does anyone know (or know anyone who would know) how to add custom emblems to nautilus, for the purposes of a nautilus plugin?
<Azelphur> the documentation is useless :(
<ali1234> http://stackoverflow.com/questions/10874702/gnome-where-does-nautilus-store-emblem-data-and-how
<Azelphur> ali1234: ty :)
<Giulianoc> Does anyone know how create a pae, please?
<Azelphur> create a pae? physical address extension?
<Azelphur> what are you actually trying to do? the question doesn't make much sense
<Giulianoc> on my ubuntu version 10.10 I cannot install any new system because my pc x31 ib,m thinkpad has no pae
<Giulianoc> yes create a pae ty
<Giulianoc> or have an os ubuntu that does need one
<Giulianoc> please help
<diddledan> WHEEEEE
#ubuntu-uk 2014-09-13
<ali1234> kitchens
<ali1234> everywhere
<diddledan> o_O
<shauno> lol, go to sleep man
<diddledan> oops
<diddledan> I knew there was something I forgot
<ali1234> no, i have to delete spam posts about kitchens
<ali1234> stilhaus kitchens burned my house down and killed my dog
<ali1234> would not recommend
<shauno> do you ever take spam as a value judgement?
<shauno> I mean like, "man, I get the most dull spam in the world"
<diddledan> I get porn in my spambox
<ali1234> i don't get spam
<ali1234> it isn't my forum i'm deleting them from
<shauno> some people get russian brides, some people get purple pills ... I get kitchens
<diddledan> and apparently I'm a very desirable man
<ali1234> what i want to know is do they really think anyone who would actually pay attention to spam is either smart enough or patient enough to fix all the deliberate errors they introduced to get past the URL filter?
<diddledan> ali1234: I read an opinion that it's the idiots that are too dumb to realise there's any errors that they're targeting
<ali1234> but if they don't realise there's an error, how will they ever get to the website?
<diddledan> well now, that's the question, isn't it
<shauno> I wish it would rain :(
<diddledan> shauno: did you leave Ireland?!
<shauno> I know!
<shauno> I'm used to it washing the drunks off the street by now.  but 5am and still no rain.  what the hell
<diddledan> do you have a build-up of drunks you need got rid of?
<shauno> lol, yes
<brobosti1on> morning boys and girls.
<directhex> is it? :(
<brobostigon> is it what?
<Laney> no it's not
 * popey puts a 4-bar heater under Colin_brrrrr 
 * popey plugs it into Laney's leccy.
<Laney> it's alright, mine comes out of the lamp post anyway
<popey> \o/
<Laney> off to rubberneck http://www.nottinghampost.com/Residents-shock-aftermath-blaze-20m-University/story-22920732-detail/story.html
<popey> yikes
<Laney> 2 minutes that way â
<Laney> walking
<czajkowski> aloha
<popey> yo czajkowski
<czajkowski> folks may be interested in following this, this weekend https://geekli.st/hackathon/53acdd6d414544f30d5027eb
<mapps> yay back
<mapps> got nbanned because i left squid open
<mapps> heh
<Myrtti> "don't do that"
<mapps> yea
<mapps> :D
<mapps> i was just messing about and left squid runnong on the pi
<mapps> with dansguardian
<Myrtti> mapps: I take that #151093 can be closed then?
<Myrtti> Just a friendly notice to everyone who hasn't noticed it from elsewhere, change your nickserv passwords.
<mapps> ja
<mapps> how did you know Myrtti  staff here?
<Myrtti> yup
<mapps> ;]
<mapps> hopefully now my pi will connect to my wifi automatically
<mapps> wont be able to do anything else
<mapps> gonna use it for watching iplayer and using betfair ;]
<czajkowski> popey: you got an utopic machine there bby any chance
<czajkowski> popey: does flash player work on it
<popey> czajkowski: which browser?
<czajkowski> popey: chromium
<popey> i dont have that installed.. lemme see
<czajkowski> popey: when i get directed to http://get.adobe.com/flashplayer/?no_redirect  I download and install
<czajkowski> but then software center pops up and says There isnât a software package called âadobe-flashpluginâ in your current software sources.
<popey> its flashplugin-installer
<popey> install that?
<czajkowski> flashplugin-installer is already the newest version.
<czajkowski> 0 to upgrade, 0 to newly install, 0 to remove and 0 not to upgrade.
<popey> dunno then, i use chrome which has flash built in
<czajkowski> popey: cheers
<ahayzen> czajkowski, try pepperflashplugin-nonfree? see https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Chromium/Getting-Flash
<popey> yeah, good call
<czajkowski> whooo that worked
<czajkowski> thank you both
<penguin42> http://cakeageddon.com/  too far from Letshworth
<brobostigon> new dr who ep on bbc1 at 7:30pm.
<daftykins> pff ;)
<brobostigon> :)
<mapps> anyone around?
 * penguin42 yawns
<mapps> ;]
<mapps> got apache2 on my raspberry pi but i cant see where the doc root is set?
<mapps> cant see it mentioned in apache2.conf (/etc/apache2/)
<penguin42> normally somewhere under /var/www isn't it?
<mapps> the doc root is /var/www yea
<mapps> i just wanted to change it
<daftykins> why?
<daftykins> just use it ;)
<mapps> just habbit i guess
<mapps> ok:P
<daftykins> https://www.dropbox.com/s/l96yt6nj4kkfk2m/IMG_20140913_205432.jpg?dl=0
<mapps> nxt question then ..ive got openvpn running on there all works fine..how could i create a script to automate adding clients like with just 1 parameter like client name..when u do ./build-key-pass it needs you to press enter etc ..i could use expect i thought?
<penguin42> mapps: Do you have an /etc/apache2/conf.d or /etc/apache2/sites-available ?
<mapps> yea both
<penguin42> mapps: And do you have an entry in sites-available ?
<mapps> ah yes
<mapps> default
<mapps> thanks:)
<penguin42> np
<ali1234> what's a good webstats analyser? not webalizer or awstats
<ali1234> something that understands wordpress would be good
<mapps> hm thats annoying..when i load the link to a .ovpn (open von client config file) in safari on iuphone it just views the file as text
<mapps> wanted it to open it with openvpn connect
<Myrtti> ali1234: I've heard lot said about piwik
<Myrtti> not tried it myself though
<ali1234> well it certainly looks nice and modern. will check it, thanks
#ubuntu-uk 2014-09-14
<diddledan> hum te tum
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<ujjain> does anybody here play ladbrokes casino?
<popey> if anyone does mapps does â»
<ujjain> hehe ok, I just used their cashback + bonus thing, Iá¸¿ sure iÄºl get the cashback, but their 100% bonus sucks, you have to spend so much
<daftykins> it's all a mugs game.
<ujjain> yeah
<ujjain> at least with william hill I made a 60 pound profit and could withdraw
<ujjain> was lucky, and hopefully the 36,75 cashback http://www.topcashback.co.uk/william-hill-vegas/
<daftykins> i prefer not gambling at all ;D
<ujjain>  Prior to withdrawing or transferring your winnings, we advise you to first check if you played in accordance to the terms and conditions. I can see here that you still need to wager amount Â£2,008.60 and once completed you may able to request for withdrawal or funds can be transferred . You can see the wagering requirement by going to the Casino Account > Bonuses Tab. Here is the link where you can see the complete information:
<ujjain> yeah, itÂ´s addictive, IÂ´m up 100 pounds at ladbrokes
<ujjain> I wanted to cash out at 40 pounds up, but soeems I have to set up auto spin until 2k has been invested
<ujjain> and hope there is still some money left
<ujjain> ok, itÂ´s gone.
<ujjain> at least I should make a profit on the cashback, but wow, stpuid you cannot withdraw rules
<shauno> I understood some of those words :/
<dogmatic69> is it possible to set up an ssh config to a server with two ip's?
<dogmatic69> eg: ssh will try one and then the next
 * penguin42 isn't aware of a way of doing it with an ssh config; if you have a DNS entry with both IPs I think that should work
#ubuntu-uk 2015-09-07
<maps> morning
<czajkows1i> Aloha
<davmor2> Morning all
<bashrc> morning
<JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Monday, and happy Buy a Book Day! ð
<davmor2> JamesTait: Welcome back :D can I buy a film based on a book instead?
<JamesTait> davmor2, I think that's the opposite of what's intended. ð
<bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
 * popey falls off his chair
<popey> good morning
<bigcalm> :P
<bigcalm> I may have joined, but I bet I end up being a lurker
 * bashrc lurks
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<zmoylan-pi> morning sassenachs and non sassenachs
 * leecowdrey morning 
<SuperEngineer> I whoopsied my Ubuntu 14.0 .0->.1->.2->.3 [don't ask, TLDR] ;)
<SuperEngineer> & so installed a fresh 14.04.03 - I've just noticed that I used to be able to click on an app in the launcher to launch it, then click again to minimise
<SuperEngineer> ...on fresh install, I can't click on lancher icon to minimise... any thoughts on what I have/haven't done in my fresh install that stops this behaviour?
<davmor2> SuperEngineer: http://www.webupd8.org/2014/03/minimize-on-click-for-unity-launcher.html
<SuperEngineer> davmor2,  whoopee -thanks, mate, that was whatI'd done before & forgotten.  Many thanks
<maps> poland v gib ko 12mins;D
<davmor2> Here we are now Educate us
<diddledan> ello
 * diddledan sings "I came in like a bowling ball!"
 * zmoylan-pi sings 'you're the reason our kids are so ugly' 
<diddledan> \o/
 * Myrtti had to put the Chatroulette version of the Wrecking Ball on youtube
<diddledan> lol
<Myrtti> no links provided, find it yourself. Then I proceeded into watching the Call Me Maybe and All I Want For Christmas Is You Chatroulette videos, too.
<Myrtti> thanks for that, diddledan
<diddledan> Myrtti: any tmie! :-p
<diddledan> time**
<maps> anyone else watching narcos?
<diddledan> o_O
<maps> netflix series
<diddledan> don't know it
<diddledan> I'll look for it in a bit
#ubuntu-uk 2015-09-08
<ali1234> do you think i should take on a project to migrate a joomla 1.5 site to whatever is the newest version?
<ali1234> i only ever tried to use joomla once and it seemed like the most terrible thing ever
<ali1234> but it's a straight migration, so it should be relatively easy
<zmoylan-pi> and if anything goes wrong in the next nth years it'll be your problem...
<ali1234> yeah but that's more billable hours...
<zmoylan-pi> find a mate who does joomla who can give you a yea nay on if it's straightforward?
<ali1234> well yeah that's why i'm here...
<zmoylan-pi> i thought drupal had won the cms wars...
<ali1234> maybe but the site is like 10 years old or whatever
<diddledan> drupal won the enterprise
<diddledan> anyone who actually works with stuff prefers wordpress
 * zmoylan-pi puts on tremors 3
<diddledan> zmoylan-pi, you seem to have a worm fetish thing going on of late
<zmoylan-pi> nowt wrong with a good trashy monster movie
<JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Tuesday, and happy Physical Therapy Day! ð
<bashrc> morning
<diddledan> that sounds like hard work
<bashrc> good moaning
 * diddledan complains
<diddledan> (that's a good moaning for you!)
<davmor2> JamesTait: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vWz9VN40nCA
<diddledan> oh god
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<diddledan> allo
<brobostigon> hi diddledan
<JamesTait> davmor2, you deserve to be locked up for sharing that.
<davmor2> JamesTait: It's your fault you picked the day :P
<diddledan> https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/aiforeveryone/mycroft-an-open-source-artificial-intelligence-for
<diddledan> 50 hours
<diddledan> hmm, americans were having a lazy day yesterday?!
<diddledan> that's cheaky!
<diddledan> bbc says: 30,000 migrants now in Greece, 20,000 in Lesbos <-- that sounds entirely family unfriendly to me
<bashrc> I guess people are moving en masse to avoid ISIS
<bashrc> probably it's not smart to stick around when those folks show up
<bashrc> rather like nazis
<diddledan> bashrc: I guess women liking other women doesn't go down too well with ISIS?
<popey> diddledan: steady
<popey> i think we left that one at the gate when I left school 25 years ago
<diddledan> does anyone here have problems with virgin+SSH?
<popey> wfm
<diddledan> grr
<diddledan> it keeps timing out on me
<popey> my device is in modem only mode though
<popey> it used to fail before that
<diddledan> yeah mine's in modem mode too
<diddledan> :-(
<popey> I stay on ssh all day every day
<popey> no problem here
<Dave> timing out when you're using it? or when idle?
<Dave> (also, use mosh, etc, etc, etc.)
<diddledan> Dave: in the middle of an sftp transfer
<Dave> oh, well mosh probably doesn't help there then
<davmor2> diddledan: wfm too to my home server and externals too
<davmor2> diddledan: also my irc is on my home server so that connects well too :)
<diddledan> http://bloke.org/linux/ssh-timeouts-on-docsis-3-virgin-media-50mb-100mb-120mb/
<diddledan> that suggests something afoot
<diddledan> although 2012
<diddledan> maybe I should switch to someone else
<davmor2> diddledan: are you using standard ports? are you forwarding to a server from your router etc etc
<diddledan> port 22
<diddledan> and it's outgoing
<diddledan> not incoming
<diddledan> I don't have servers here
<diplo> diddledan: That also says that it's superhub related not when in modem mode ?
<davmor2> diddledan: then I have no issues and I'm doing it on and off all day the same as popey
<diddledan> diplo: are you reading the same page?
<diplo> diddledan: ServerAliveInterval 100
<davmor2> diddledan: and that is to my home network and external too
<diplo> On your ssh config ?
<diplo> Sorry meant to say in the comments :D
<davmor2> diddledan: are you sure the thing you are trying to connect to is up?
<diplo> http://superuser.com/questions/98562/way-to-avoid-ssh-connection-timeout-freezing-of-terminal-tab
<diddledan> see, I'm not using openssh :-p
<davmor2> diddledan: that is your problem then :P
<diddledan> this is using github.com/pkg/sftp
<davmor2> diddledan: will that not still use the ssh protocol and therefore open ssh then, or are you using another operating system?
<diddledan> no it uses an implementation of ssh in go
<diddledan> part of my problem is that my custoclient using that library doesn't actually do timeout how you expect - it just sits there pretending to have it's thumb in it's mouth until you get fed up and ^C it
<diddledan> the reason for the custoclient was because I need to remove files from the remote system which aren't in my local system meaning I need recursive enumeration of the remote files and an openssh sftp batch script can't anticipate that (AFAICT)
<diddledan> it would be easy if I could rsync but this client insisted on the server provider and the server provider insists on sftp access only
<davmor2> diddledan: don't know what to say then, I'm having no issues here, but I am only using standard ssh, maybe popey has a github account and can try that out
<diplo> If you are elsewhere diddledan it works fine, just from the Virgin line ?
<diddledan> good question - my colleagues haven't had an issue with their own access of the server from their locations but I myself haven't tried it anyplace else
<diddledan> or maybe I did and I can't remember whether it worked or not :-p
<diplo> Could raise an issue against the github about asking for the setting I said earlier to be added ?
<diddledan> ok a native sftp session just died
<diddledan> as in an openssh sftp
<foobarry> do you own the far end server diddledan ?
<foobarry> could be server timeout or cpu setting in limits.conf
<diddledan> nope
<diddledan> I can't access the server any way other than sftp
<foobarry> some cisco routers drop idle connections
<diddledan> the thing is it seems to just stop in mid-transfer
<diddledan> i.e. going nicely at 10Mbit/s and then suddenly nada
<zmoylan-pi> is it a certain time into the connection timeout?
<diddledan> no it's at a random interval
<davmor2> diddledan: does your connection drop if you watch a video on youtube or is it only ssh?  also does it happen if you use another os?
<diddledan> ONLY ssh
<zmoylan-pi> try a different ssh client?
<diddledan> although videos on yootoob use HLS these days which is many many connections
<diddledan> so that's not an apples-to-apples
<diddledan> zmoylan-pi: it fails in both openssh sftp and a golang coded sftp client
<zmoylan-pi> so it sounds more the server than your end
<diddledan> ooh, nearly time for people to gawk at the animals feeding
<diddledan> aka lunch
 * zmoylan-pi has beans, sausages and mash...
<davmor2> Spag bol by the smell of it :)
<diddledan> \o/
<diddledan> spag-bog* :-p
<diddledan> aka "sgetti"
<MartijnVdS> /sbin/sgetty ?
<diddledan> lol
<diddledan> https://twitter.com/50NerdsofGrey
<diddledan> I defy you not to read that in moss' voice
<diddledan> then there's this: "There are only two hard problems in distributed systems:  2. Exactly-once delivery 1. Guaranteed order of messages 2. Exactly-once delivery"
<mati> Hi I have problem to connect my HP printer via network Can anyone help me?:)
<diddledan> hahaha: http://boxerapp.com/blog/2012/11/12/pc-load-letter/
<diddledan> that is positively awesome
<diddledan> shame it don't work on loonecks
<foobarry> found an old SSD card, hdparm -r /dev/sda gives 80MB/s :(
<foobarry> -t
<foobarry> even my hard drive gives 110MB/s
<zmoylan-pi> but does it make the sound of a dot matrix?
<diddledan> \o/
<diddledan> zmoylan-pi: I might have to submit a PR for that
<zmoylan-pi> it only counts as a dot matrix printout when someone is rocking backwards and forwards at their desk chanting the mantra. 'when will the printing stop?'
<Laney> Brr
<Laney> cold today
<diddledan> why do apple have to do their announcements on wednesdays?! that's my day to be visting the parental units right when they're usually keynoting
<diddledan> i.e. 6pm
 * diddledan watching the original thunderbirds
<diddledan> I forgot how awesome it was
<zmoylan-pi> i preferred stingray
<zmoylan-pi> but it was excellent
<popey> yeah, i liked stingray and joe 90. never really got into captain scarlet
<zmoylan-pi> yeah it was the earlier one, wasn't it and didn't quite gel
<zmoylan-pi> i even liked terrahawks
<popey> I loved that
<zmoylan-pi> doesn't seem to get the same love as his 60s stuff
 * popey watches the titles again https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QNRzgB8PNtM
<popey> the graphics were very HHGTTG style
<popey> vector stuff
<popey> I recall making lego versions of their ships when I was a kid
<zmoylan-pi> and the ships in space 1999 are still some of the best ships in sci fi ever
<zmoylan-pi> and made it into red dwarf \o/
<popey> http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/entertainment/tv-radio/voice-terrahawks-hero-reveals-how-5457087
<davmor2> popey: this was still my favourite intro https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=acOnskcyrtA
<popey> davmor2: yeah, that blue and red ship, I'd make lego versions of that too :)
<popey> nothing like this tho https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/10/78/ea/1078ea8a085b0b784266453cc95ca3d3.jpg
<davmor2> popey: can you imagine a lego version of the starfleet ships the transform into the robot
<diddledan> fun video with a snippet that explains a useful method of coping with various web browser fails: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IskiTVqHp18
<diddledan> https://twitter.com/wikileaks/status/641369907381280768/photo/1
<diddledan> popey: wtf? mcafee for prez?!
#ubuntu-uk 2015-09-09
<czajkowski> Aloha
<zmoylan-pi> o/
<bashrc> g'day
<JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Wonderful Weirdos Day! ð
 * zmoylan-pi waves at weirdos day :-D o/
<zmoylan-pi> and why hasn't there been an os called weird?! :-)
<JamesTait> Back in Uni, when I was working on a MUD in my spare time, I started building a framework around the DGD kernel library that I dubbed WyrdOS.
<JamesTait> I probably still have some code somewhere.
<JamesTait> Though I doubt it would run on today's servers without significant changes.
<davmor2> JamesTait: We have a whole day \o/
<JamesTait> davmor2, *every* day should be wonderful weirdos day. ð
<davmor2> JamesTait: much better name for Wily too ;)
<zmoylan-pi> meh you can run an emulator on a rasp pi now :-)
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<Myrtti> :-D https://plus.google.com/u/0/+GoogleUK/posts/Kv2MVe6S1QF
<Myrtti> I'm so excited, going to get a RasPi display for my knitting machine kit :-D
<zmoylan-pi> isn't the output of the knitting machine the display? :-)
<Myrtti> nah. My knitting machine is controlled by an Arduino board, which requires the computer holding the pattern and doing the actual instructions to be either on all the time, or for the person doing the knitting make notes on where they're at. I figured it's easier to move that part to a RasPi than to either attempt (and fail) to keep a tally on what's the progress, or to keep the laptop on, conn---
<Myrtti> ected to the Arduino, for days.
<zmoylan-pi> use a rasp pi and just ssh in when you need to from your phone for maximum geekiness :-)
<Myrtti> sadly the knitting pattern stuff is quite visual
<Myrtti> so SSH won't really do
<zmoylan-pi> vnc it is :-)
<awilkins> ASCII ART
<awilkins> Make an ncurses knitting pattern UI
<zmoylan-pi> using ansi for colours
 * awilkins just got a new RPi2 for the weekend NHS Hack Day
<zmoylan-pi> nhs and hack... 2 words you don't normally want to see together...
<awilkins> Hack in the old fashioned sense
<awilkins> Not the press-hysteria sense
<zmoylan-pi> yeah that's what worries me... :-)
<awilkins> Hahahaha
<zmoylan-pi> when the worlds fastest amputation had a 300% mortality rate
<zmoylan-pi> it was a different time... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Liston#Liston.27s_most_famous_cases
<awilkins> Holy crap
<zmoylan-pi> and he was a great surgeon!
<awilkins> Great surgeons often are complete bumholes....
<zmoylan-pi> it's part of the mentality required for the job i think
<awilkins> czajkowski, You seen this? https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/fbz/knityak-custom-mathematical-knit-scarves
<Myrtti> ooh, double jacquard instructions
<Myrtti> excellent
<czajkowski> awilkins: ah interesting - I'm not the knitter on here though
<awilkins> Doh
<awilkins> Sorry. I obviously meant Myrtti.
<czajkowski> awilkins: Myrtti is :)
<Myrtti> yeah, I knew about it before she even started the Kickstarter
<Myrtti> as she had published the pattern just before
<zmoylan-pi> czajkowski would never have time to knit, unless they started allowing knitting needles on planes again
<Myrtti> but they do allow knitting needles on planes
<Myrtti> non-metallic ones.
<Myrtti> I just don't bother
<awilkins> Was going to say, if they don't allow carbon fibre go-faster knitting needles on planes I don't wanna fly
<awilkins> (I don't want to anyway. Flying is fun, security theatre is awful.)
<czajkowski> zmoylan-pi: wedding planning, house renovations nad work are keeping me very busy :)
<zmoylan-pi> would you have it any other way? :-)
<foobarry> http://www.google.com/patents/US6233389
<foobarry> there is a patent for the ability to record a programme while watching another :|
<Myrtti> "Original Assignee Tivo Inc."
<foobarry> tivo suck
<foobarry> http://www.engadget.com/2015/09/09/tivo-sues-samsung
<zmoylan-pi> isn't that what ever vcr has done since the 60s?
<zmoylan-pi> *every
<foobarry> not record and play at same time
<foobarry> also a patent for smooth presentation of images during fast search. not the algorithm but the concept :-|
<zmoylan-pi> they'd patent watching a fly crawl up the wall if they could
<foobarry> americans would grant it
<foobarry> and let someone else deal with the fallout
<foobarry> which is the reason my dock doesn't zoom when i move the mouse over it
<Myrtti> our mail ninja hasn't gone past us on his rounds yet and I'm hungry. If I go nuke a soup for myself, the mail ninja will strike and leave a "Couldn't fit this through your mailbox, neener neener" note
<Myrtti> oh the frustration
<zmoylan-pi> superglue on the letter box
<foobarry> are you camping by the window like a dog?
<Myrtti> no, just in the lounge
<zmoylan-pi> camping like a dog is as nothing to watching like a cat
<foobarry> i wonder if the reason many popular PVR don't do 30/60/180s skip is due to pressure from advertisers or because of a fake patent?
<zmoylan-pi> i seem to remember a few pvrs had the ability to skip ads removed or limited
<zmoylan-pi> more likely just took cash from the cable companies
<foobarry> ah maybe its just sky and vbox
<foobarry> youview are planning it
<foobarry> oh that was 3yrs ago, they should have it
<zmoylan-pi> fox targeted dish to remove autohop feature https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fox_Broadcasting_Co._v._Dish_Network,_LLC
<foobarry> and lost
<awilkins> MythTV has autoskip
<awilkins> I believe it uses a number of algorithms like detecting the sudden absence of channel logos and black keyframes 30s apart
<Azelphur> http://i.imgur.com/MehAyNA.png yay for documenting my ISPs failure to provide decent connection speeds over the course of a month
<diddledan> Azelphur: how did you do that? (I like the idea but don't know how do do such a thing)
<Azelphur> I wrote a little script using speedtest-cli that generates CSVs and brought them into openoffice, I test every hour.
<diddledan> nice
<diddledan> you image shows a lot of fluctuation :-)
<diddledan> hopefully your isp will buckle :-p
<Azelphur> Indeed it does, those 3mbit drops are what caused me to start documenting it
<Azelphur> I know what's wrong, it's their corporate policy
<diddledan> over provisioning?
<Azelphur> I've had the engineers tell me about it, their policy is Step 1) Pile users onto node, Step 2) Wait until users complain, Step 3) Discuss the fact that users are complaining at monthly review, Step 4) Set up new node
<diddledan> that's shocking
<popey> Azelphur: got the script handy?
<popey> I'd like to run that on my server at home
<diddledan> pop it on github ;-)
<popey> i was just about to do the same thing with speedtest-cli --simple
<Azelphur> it's really ugly/hacky, but here you go http://pastebin.com/C06z28UX
<Azelphur> Maybe I'll tidy it up, seems a few people want something that doesn't suck
<Azelphur> popey: that's exactly what I've done
<popey> thanks
<Azelphur> but yea, can certainly see my ISP is consistently failing to provide above the fault range
<Azelphur> I have 25 tests in the past month, all of which fall below 20mbit
<popey> and you can be sure you're not doing anything else at the same time?
<popey> because obviously, that will affect the speedtests
<Azelphur> popey: no I can't
<Azelphur> that's the downside
<davmor2> popey: there is an api for speedof.me too apparently
<Azelphur> popey: somehow I doubt it though, because I have a lot of speedtest fails at times when I'd be asleep
<popey> no torrents or owt?
<Azelphur> yea torrents are running
<popey> so surely that's going to affect it
<Azelphur> perhaps, but as I say I've seen these issues ruining my connection before, and checked at the router level
<Azelphur> I might rewrite this to talk to my AsusWRT router and collect data direct from the router - that way I know exactly what is going in/out and can get accurate metrics even while the connection is in use
<popey> where is the torrent running?
<davmor2> Azelphur: which provider are you with?
<popey> I use vnstat to show what traffic I'm using
<Azelphur> davmor2: enta.net
<Azelphur> popey: on the same box, in a vm
<davmor2> Azelphur: do they cap at peak times?
<popey> perfect, so install vnstat
<Azelphur> shouldn't do
<popey> and it will graph the traffic on the box for you
<Azelphur> popey: attacking it at the router level is still the best bet :)
<popey> maybe
<popey> vnstat gives you nice stuff like this for free http://popey.com/bandwidth/
<Azelphur> I know, but only for traffic you are using
<Azelphur> for line tests you need a short period result
<Azelphur> I did some more interesting stuff though, and grouped failures (failure is deemed <20mbit) by time, https://dpaste.de/Qh3Z
<popey> no, not the point I was making
<popey> the point I'm making is you can see from the graph what traffic you're using at the same time as your tests
<popey> so you can eliminate that
<Azelphur> ah I see
<Azelphur> That's fairly conclusive that the connection is shit between 9am-3pm really, that's 76 fails, 39 of them (51%) occurred in that time period
<Azelphur> I'll have to get into the router I think for my next thing, and collect data at that level
<diddledan> apple have a new product: the pencil
<diddledan> oh yey. microsoft are at the apple event
<popey> care--
<popey> :)
<diddledan> you should swap that with --care so that care gets reduced before you assign it
<daftykins> i return!
<daftykins> Wales is quite pretty in places
<daftykins> https://www.dropbox.com/s/sjjjxtq1hy45x0m/IMG_20150906_174622.jpg?dl=0
<daftykins> managed to keep the damage to a minimum this time :)
<diddledan> function daftykins() { return "present"; }
<diddledan> apple tv time
<diddledan> I wonder if it's still a hobby
<diddledan> "The future of tv is apps"
<daftykins> "we're going to start working with Kodi on AirPlay"
<daftykins> lawl++
<diddledan> why hasn't the developer of crossy road been sued by the people who made frogger back in the 80s?
<daftykins> i had partly expected that to crop up
<diddledan> brr. I'm chilly
<daftykins> a few creatures from Wales looked like they could keep you warm ;)
<diddledan> sheeps
<diddledan> "the most advanced smartphones in the world"?!
<diddledan> 3d touch? how is my mum going to understand the difference between touching and touching?
<daftykins> why does that generation matter? :)
<diddledan> apple make an android app now. one that will helpfully move your android stuff onto an iphone
<diddledan> (I'm trolling here, I think it's a bit silly myself)
<diddledan> I mean googley have many apps on ios but apple have one on android
<diddledan> and that one's goal is to get you off android
<diddledan> eh? what's the difference between getting an iphone on a contract vs getting one on an installment plan?
<ali1234> diddledan: because konami are too busy milking metal gear...
<daftykins> i forgot that was aout
<daftykins> *out
<ali1234> what's the easiest way to get a containerized LAMP set up on ubuntu?
<diddledan> speaking of konami - they should have patented the konami code :-p
<Azelphur> popey: I'm building v2, I have realtime (1ms accuracy) bandwidth coming out of my AsusWRT router :)
<popey> heh
<diddledan> ooh. the iana have specified .onion as a special-use domain
<diddledan> https://www.facebook.com/notes/facebook-over-tor/the-onion-special-use-domain-name/762325423874180
<Azelphur> popey:  while torrenting, https://dpaste.de/tWr2then while not torrenting, pretty cool :)
<Azelphur> do you have AsusWRT?
<popey> no
<Azelphur> :( shame
<diddledan> what's the difference between asuswrt and other wrts?
<m0nkey_> asuswrt is built on dd-wrt i believe
<m0nkey_> diddledan, i like the way that facebook actually took apart the Tor protocol to figure out how to get the .onion domain with the word facebook
#ubuntu-uk 2015-09-10
<diddledan> oops. forgot to set znc to autostart - the system just reboobed for presumably auto updates
<zmoylan-pi> i hate it when systems reboob
<diddledan> so apple emailed me to let me know I can get a developer edition of the new atv
<diddledan> (before consumers get to buy theirs)
<zmoylan-pi> so either they see you as special or gullible :-P
 * m0nkey_ sighs
<m0nkey_> Now I got to put up with the 'Did you see Apple did X' shit at work :/
<m0nkey_> Yes, I did. Exactly what MS did three years ago.
<diddledan> joy
<diddledan> they invented a stick you can make marks with. fancy name of "pencil". I couldn't believe nobody has ever done that before!
<m0nkey_> diddledan, from 3 years ago.. http://hijinksensue.com/comic/surface-tension/
<m0nkey_> That's some serious Nostradamus stuff there.
<diddledan> yeah that's pretty much exactly how it happened in the keynote, too
<m0nkey_> diddledan, check the date on the cartoon.. 2012
<diddledan> they even did invent a keyboard cover
<m0nkey_> see that the apple event in the same cartoon is WWDC 2015
<m0nkey_> year is bang on
<diddledan> lol. that's impressive foresight
<m0nkey_> Okay, I'm CTRL-D'ing out for the night
<sadaf2605_> hi
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<bashrc> morning
<directhex> is it? yuck, i hate mornings
<bashrc> have a moratorium on mornings
<brobostigon> morning
<davmor2> Morning all
<bashrc> move directly to afternoon. do not pass "go"
<davmor2> popey, diddledan: bit of argent stuck in my head this morning
<JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Thursday, and happy Swap Ideas Day! ð
<davmor2> JamesTait: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZzvI4p6ncqk
<JamesTait> Cheggers! And John Craven!
<JamesTait> And of course, Mr Crinkly Bottom himself!
<davmor2> JamesTait: here is an idea for you, The specials should totally cover Coolios Gangsta Paradise with just a hint of Ghost town thrown in :)
<JamesTait> davmor2, where do you come up with this stuff? ð
<davmor2> JamesTait: I got loads of them,  Kenny Loggins covering Iggy pops real wild child with a hint of Danger Zone
<davmor2> JamesTait: Nivarna Covering verves drugs don't work with just a hint of smells like teen spirit
<davmor2> JamesTait: My favourite one is Kinks covering Kings of Leons My sex is on fire with a hint of Lola
<davmor2> JamesTait: or The Crazy World of Arthur Brown Fire covered by prodigy to the sound track of fire starter :)
<JamesTait> davmor2, your talents are wasted here. ð
<Myrtti> uuh. mail man arrived with the raspi screen
<Myrtti> it is cute as a button
<brobostigon> :)
<davmor2> Myrtti: Yeah I wouldn't try sewing it onto something though ;)
<awilkins> Myrtti, Which one, the official one?
<awilkins> I have a Display-O-Tron for the NHS Hack Day this weekend
<Myrtti> Yeah
<Myrtti> https://instagram.com/p/7c0KL_IEwb/
<awilkins> Snazz
<daftykins> heh, some program on the iPlayer with the history of Children's BBC
<daftykins> Andy Peters and Ed the Duck :O
<zmoylan-pi> jackanory with bernard cribbins reading the hobbit...
<daftykins> why is there a dog calling people 'cocker' on kids TV now O_O
<zmoylan-pi> because calling them berks is too rude
<brobostigon> or nutcases.
<diddledan> the berks are just north of me (I'm in hampshire, and they're in the one above)
<daftykins> whoa, local gov just sold the car license plate "007" for a quarter of a million squid
<diddledan> yey. squids
<daftykins> finest currency
<daftykins> i think i've finally gotten rid of almost every one of the nasty pound coins i gained from your land whilst over :D
<diddledan> evil money
<daftykins> it is!
<daftykins> it's always good fun making people giggle in shops by referring to our pound notes
<daftykins> the girl was a little nice in mcdonalds once i explained i don't know the menu too :P
<daftykins> "sorry, not got one of these back home"
<diddledan> lol
<daftykins> stupid foreigner trying to get fries at breakfast
<daftykins> :>
<diddledan> that's horrifying! apparently at-risk youth are 55% more likely to enroll in college with a mentor! TERRIBLE!
<diddledan> (that's from linkedin on the twits)
<diddledan> those poor youth
<daftykins> the couple Roald Dahl documented?
<daftykins> we were chatting to this guy serving us in Beefeater about tips as well, he said if it were paid on card he'd get taxed on it so only see a tiny portion
<daftykins> very nasty :P
<diddledan> ooh, jurassic world is in my library
<diddledan> \o/
 * diddledan watching
<daftykins> heh
<daftykins> i saw that
<diddledan> I have actually paid for it but it's not released on dvd/download yet
<diddledan> oh dear. petting zoo dinosaurs!
<diddledan> that's evil!
<diddledan> poor things
<daftykins> ;]
<diddledan> aha,. the indominus rex doesn't like water
<diddledan> seriously bad name btw
<diddledan> suggesting that it can't be dominated is too prophetic
<Azelphur> popey / davmor2 version 2 is looking very cool :) http://home.azelphur.com/speedtest-results/output.html
<leecowdrey> Can anyone provide me with an IRC/twitter/Jabber contact at Canonical for the person recruiting for the role "Engineering Manger -Ecosystem (Americas)"; I'm not a recruiter, its just I have a question to ask. Cheers
<popey> hey leecowdrey
<leecowdrey> hey Alan
<popey> https://ldd.tbe.taleo.net/ldd01/ats/careers/requisition.jsp?org=CANONICAL&cws=1&rid=1020 that one?
<leecowdrey> thats the one
<popey> let me see if I can find someone
<popey> feel free to pm me the question
 * diddledan pms popey random questions such as "why do bananas have a bend?"
<daftykins> :D
<diddledan> the raptors are loose
<diddledan> and a dopey eejit is riding a motorbike along side them
<daftykins> mmm curry
<popey> Azelphur: http://i.imgur.com/hxKjJX2.png
<popey> result of running the script since last night
<Azelphur> popey: fun, what are you using for the charts?
<Azelphur> is that libreoffice?
<popey> ya
<Azelphur> popey: http://home.azelphur.com/speedtest-results/output.html I'm rendering mine in python/js with flot now
<popey> nice!
<diddledan> in the immortal words of I think it was rutger hower(?) in blade runner: "time.. to die.. I meen sleep"
<diddledan> mea, too
<diddledan> mean**
<daftykins> ruined :(
<diddledan> not my fault they released fifteen dozen versions!
<diddledan> aaanywho. nn
<daftykins> you can't sleep at normal times!
<diddledan> https://youtu.be/52xxaVKoI-c
<diddledan> in other news the soundtrack is aparently available to buy
<diddledan> and speaking of which, since when did the word "genre" stop describing the collection of different subjects and become a subject in it's own right?
<diddledan> I'm speaking of statements such as this from http://www.avclub.com/article/agents-shield-soundtrack-now-available-download-225171: S.H.I.E.L.D.âs music was written by prolific TV composer Bear McCreary, who is the go-to guy for genre shows.
<daftykins> genre shows o0
<diddledan> indeed
<diddledan> I don't get it
<diddledan> which genre?
<diddledan> THE genre
<diddledan> it's not any genre, it's genre
<daftykins> perhaps it was a placeholder that needed editing
<diddledan> I've heard it before tho
<diddledan> see there's people that think it is a real thing: http://www.wisegeek.com/what-is-a-genre-show.htm
<Azelphur> popey: http://home.azelphur.com/speedtest-results/output.html my chart is all fancy and interactive now :P
<diddledan> Azelphur: kinky
 * diddledan pokes Azelphur 's chart
<Azelphur> We shall build up all the data we need to fire my ISP...out of a cannon \o/
<diddledan> you're gonna spurt your data all over them?
 * diddledan hides
<Azelphur> :P
<Azelphur> Seems the tests are failing sometimes though, need to figure out some error handling and rerun the tests when they fail perhaps
#ubuntu-uk 2015-09-11
 * zmoylan-pi wonders if i needed a hunting licence for the spider i just killed
<davmor2> Azelphur: that's an impresively blank page for me ;)
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
 * leecowdrey_ morning
<JamesTait> Good morning all; happy Friday, and happy No News is Good News Day! ð
<zmoylan-pi> i thought no news day was april 18th? :-) http://www.newslite.tv/2011/04/18/on-this-day-in-1930-bbc-said-t.html
<davmor2> JamesTait: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JZSg-1z1V4g
<davmor2> JamesTait: or more appropriately looking at news reports https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z0GFRcFm-aY
<Azelphur> davmor2: my cron job broke it, it's fixed now http://home.azelphur.com/speedtest-results/output.html
<Azelphur> and it's better :P
<daftykins> Azelphur: what's to say tests of such a nature aren't reflective of load on the testing node, rather than your own connection?
<Azelphur> daftykins: my testing node is an i3 home server that doesn't do very much, I don't think that would be an issue
<daftykins> ah
<arsenip> is speedtest still considered impartial? i thought providers made sure they had conveniently healthy speedtest hops for their customers
<daftykins> doesn't even work for us down here :)
<daftykins> shows a max of 75% of real world download
<Azelphur> arsenip: doesn't need to be - I'm pulling bandwidth statistics out of the router
<Azelphur> so those results are the sum of speedtest.net + everything else on the connection, it's about as real world as you're going to get
<arsenip> ohhh ok
<arsenip> so drops in speed do seem to line up with speedtest then
<Azelphur> Indeed they do, and of course the difference between speedtest.net download and router download is what I'm actually doing with the connection at the time of the test
<diplo> Sharing the code Azelphur ?
<diplo> Anyone use kindles or Nooks ?
<diplo> I broke my screen yesterday, looking at getting a Paperwhite/Glo, looking for recommendations
<Azelphur> diplo: could do, it'll only work if you have AsusWRT though
<diplo> Ah OK, be nice to see the code though. What do you use to grab the info/store it?
<Azelphur> I use speedtest-cli and AsusWRTs web panel
<Azelphur> and I store it as a CSV
<diplo> Ah right, nice and simple :)
<Azelphur> maybe I'll spruce it up a bit and see if I can pull data direct off the router using SSH, so any Linux router could work
<diplo> ssh on my draytek, but just awaiting delivery of my Witi board and then that'll be the new one
<daftykins> hmm interesting little toy
<diplo> the witi ?
<daftykins> ja
<diplo> yeah, popeys fault :D
<Azelphur> does indeed look cool
<Azelphur> shame it's no good for me though, I need a home server anyway
<diplo> I've got one, but debating just using this for serving files witha  couple of 4TB drives
<Azelphur> I have 4x5TB so that wouldn't help me
<diplo> Dear god, that's some disk space!
<diplo> Bet they aren't cheap
<Azelphur> pretty cheap actually, my most recent one I bought for Â£67
<diplo> That's cheaper than my 4TB :/
<Azelphur> ;)
 * Azelphur loves purse.io;
<diplo> Get discounts for using it ? As drives are still Â£100+~
<daftykins> still on 6 x 2TB here
<Azelphur> diplo: yea, you get discounts for buying on Amazon using Bitcoin basically
<diplo> oh nice, I keep meaning to investigate Bitcoins and then get to the cba
<diplo> :)
<daftykins> had a fun message from a friend whilst away in Wales, he'd bought 4 x 3TB but he only uses intel fakeRAID, which wasn't coming up properly - i told him he had to do a BIOS update to get the latest option ROM which supports the 3TB disks
<diplo> Very interested in it though, obviously not enough though
<diplo> Only issue I had with my 4tb was formatting them
<diplo> parted et all needed me to do something different that I've forgotten
<daftykins> formatting o0
<daftykins> yay found that extension cable for my headphones for Â£11 delivered on www.custom-cable.co.uk - seems a good site
<zmoylan-pi> you can now sit 20ft away from your phone? :-D
<Seeker> gotta be careful of that radiation
<daftykins> nah they're earphones that are cabled only a few inches from the actual pieces, then a 3 foot extension cable connects between that and your device
<zmoylan-pi> it'll be the herd of donkeys tripping over the headphone cable landing on daftykins that will require explaining :-)
<daftykins> it has been funny for a while, losing a channel - volumes changing etc, so i need to get a new one
<Myrtti> *i.m wondering should I buy a 20cm cable to connect my Arduino Uno and raspi so Id have less cable clutter at my knitting machine, but ive not located the raspi yet so its an academic question so far
<daftykins> i think you should put more effort into your IRC disconnections first, Myrtti ;)
<Myrtti> oh?
<daftykins> well not super recent but from a couple of weeks ago perhaps
<daftykins> i think you got k-lined at one point
<zmoylan-pi> yeah, Myrtti did ask about ssl links which i think was to do with that
<Myrtti> yup, gave my permission to that before heading out to honeymoon
<daftykins> ah reet
<Myrtti> I was watchiing seaotters that day in Monterey
<daftykins> where's that?
<Myrtti> http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/p02v03p1/big-blue-live-episode-1
<daftykins> ah CA
<Myrtti> problem was solved by disconnecting from oftc
<daftykins> how was that causing freenode bouncing?
<Myrtti> ssl cert problem of some sort, haven't had time to troubleshoot better but then again 'i dont use oftc for anything
<Myrtti> because irssi got a major fit with the certs
<Myrtti> it sometimes worked for days without a hitch and then fall over at random intervaols
<daftykins> :(
<daftykins> i still need to resolve SASL auth with irssi, to stop it connecting if it fails
<daftykins> kornbluth fails me at times :D
<Myrtti> sorry for typos btw, trying to take nail polish off so 'ive wrapped my right hand fingers with foil
<daftykins> XD
<Myrtti> gel nailpolish so it takes a bit of effort
<daftykins> only time you catch me with nail products is removing paste from CPUs and heatsinks :P
<Myrtti> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yiuqCpqj_BU
<diddledan> evenin
<daftykins> o/
<zmoylan-pi> not out gallivanting?
<diddledan> you forget, I'm a hermit
<diddledan> I don't do physical access
<zmoylan-pi> gallivanting in a hermitage.... it's doable... :-)
<diddledan> well besides it being an advert for a samsung phone on the macrumors site (insert cynicism here) don't you love adverts that you only notice once you finish reading the article and look around the rest of the page and wonder what it is that the advert told me was "available now on galaxy s6 and s6 edge"? i.e. the advert must have told me, when I wasn't watching it because I was busy reading the page, about something but the advert is now at the
<diddledan>  end of it's playback when I finally notice it and so I have no idea what they were actually telling me
<daftykins> i don't get ads :>
<diddledan> it's surprising I got this one really. I installed adblock plus the other day so I guess I don't have it configured right
<daftykins> i've found a lot better behaviour from ublock origin of late
<daftykins> lower resource consumption
<diddledan> this is a ball of weird quote: " it appears that Apple has quietly added a set-up process for the new "Hey Siri" feature coming to the iPhone 6s and iPhone 6s Plus, thanks to a built-in M9 motion coprocessor"
<diddledan> 1) hey siri isn't new. 2) motion?
<diddledan> what does motion have to do with siri?
<daftykins> heh
<daftykins> looks like the writer had two sentences and glued them together
<Azelphur> ali1234: #gnome15 is coming to life, sounds like there might be a revival effort, would be cool if you dropped by to offer advice when needed :)
<diddledan> gnome15?
<Azelphur> http://gnome15.org/
<diddledan> *click*
<diddledan> aah, ok
<Azelphur> diddledan: I already convinced them to be clever and keep the backend modular, so we can have a generic macro frontend for all gaming keyboards with macro keys :D
<daftykins> for all the 1 users using one ;)
<Azelphur> loads of people have gaming keyboards :o
<zmoylan-pi> and loads of geeks have gamey keyboards from eating and drinking over them
<daftykins> pfft
<daftykins> i tried looking for a new mechanical the other day, everyone ruins the layout now
<daftykins> very irritating
<zmoylan-pi> lets add multimedia buttons
<zmoylan-pi> lets move the arrow keys
<zmoylan-pi> lets change the size of shift buttons and move keys a few mm
<daftykins> they... they started putting Fn keys in on desktop mechanicals =|
<zmoylan-pi> and some oses want you to press fn to use function buttons f1-f12...
<daftykins> i noticed Lenovo like doing a toggle function for that now, you have to pick which you prefer in the BIOS
<zmoylan-pi> these people need taking out and beaten with an ibm model m till they learn the golden rule
<daftykins> kinda makes sense for a laptop to have the Fn+F# function as default
<DJones> zmoylan-pi: I've got a HP laptop that does that, you have to change the bios if you want to use F1/F2 etc without pressing the function key
<daftykins> mmm
<zmoylan-pi> which on a new laptop is annoying or been called to fix something on someone elses laptop
<DJones> Yes, very annoying
<DJones> HP G72 as the specific model
<DJones> Once set, it stays set, so its no problem to the regular user, but as zmoylan-pi says, annoying if you're fixing somebody elses laptop and don't expect it
<diddledan> err: http://www.dabs.com/learnmore/computers/recreated-zx-spectrum/
<diddledan> it's expensive and seems to be purely a controller
<diddledan> i.e. it's not a recreation of the sinclair
<zmoylan-pi> yeah a bad bt keyboard... lots of those about already
<zmoylan-pi> the vega is a zx spectrum clone but it's nothing special either
<zmoylan-pi> if they wanted to be different they could have made a tablet running zx spectrum.  just add keyboard :-)
<zmoylan-pi> i'd love a pda style spectrum like this http://www.theregister.co.uk/2014/09/29/spectrum_competition_winner/
<diddledan> wow, popey , peppercarrot.com is beautiful - thanks for the link (via: podcast)
<diddledan> wow. freebsd has fixed a bug that had been in the kernel since 1997!
<diddledan> (bsd kernel, not loonorks)
<diddledan> ref: https://blog.crashed.org/dont-backout/
<zmoylan-pi> and undid other bug fixes since 1996? :-)
<diddledan> well that's it - other people have hit the same problem and might have patched their usage as evidenced by the fact the original mlockall bug never got fixed. so now the mlockall is fixed does that mean all those byproduct patches are invalid?
<zmoylan-pi> it's the game every developer plays 'code kerplunk' :-D
<diddledan> lol
<diddledan> keep pulling threads until it all falls over?
<diddledan> sometimes refered to as jenga too
<foobarry> is it safe to get kernel 4.1 yet?
<zmoylan-pi> with jenga you can rebuild.  with kerplunk you have 99% of the previous structure still in place exactly like when you started
<diddledan> http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2015/sep/11/gchq-password-advice
<directhex> foobarry: i've put mainline 4.2 on my laptop
<foobarry> which distro directhex ?
<directhex> trusty
<foobarry> i have really bad wifi
<foobarry> i wanted to try the new intel firmware but they only have the new stuff for 4.1+
<directhex> yeah, my wifi isn't supported by the kernel
<foobarry> hm
<directhex> unimaginably gad closed source driver
<foobarry> my other laptop works fine at home
<foobarry> intel 7260
<directhex> 11ac chip, driver supports 11g maximum
<zmoylan-pi> no need to have different passwords for everything... isnt that just making their job easier?
<foobarry> brought my work laptop home and it sucks on my wifi and at work too
<directhex> and drops open connections constantly (eg ssh)
<foobarry> yes directhex i have that too
<foobarry> pings dorp
<foobarry> and connection does too
<foobarry> http://www.intel.com/support/wireless/wlan/sb/CS-034398.htm syas i need 4.1 for the new stuff although no changellogs
<foobarry> even irc is laggy
<foobarry> laggy
<foobarry> 10s lag
<zmoylan-pi> well irc is often under ddos attack
<foobarry> no its my irtc  sessionand my ssh
<foobarry> and pings
<foobarry> i can't even see what i'm typing
<foobarry> directhex: which rep/instructions did you follow?
<foobarry> repo*
<directhex> foobarry: i used the mainline kernels deb
<directhex> http://kernel.ubuntu.com/~kernel-ppa/mainline/v4.2-unstable/ - you need the headers, headers-generic and image-generic debs
<foobarry> ta#
<foobarry> mainline is safe?
<foobarry> i thouht ubuntu added stuffs
<directhex> they do.
<directhex> but i wanted 4.2, and there's no trusty 4.2 deb yet
<foobarry> realised i haven't got lts-vivid installed
<foobarry> will try that with the newer firmware
<directhex> start with that
<popey> diddledan: good isn't it?
<diddledan> popey: it's great!
<diddledan> I love the style
<foobarry> seems better already on 3.19
<foobarry> with a different firmware
<foobarry> someone on askubuntu said it didn't fix for them. will have to try at work. never realised until today that it was just me losing wifi connection in meetings all the time
<directhex> i had to do evil things to make my wifi work on 4.2
<directhex> https://twitter.com/directhex/status/641280768761823232
<popey> for me 4.2 introduced massive slowdown on heavy IO
<popey> like, completely unusable when a bit of IO happens
<directhex> for me it made my laptop usable
<directhex> on trusty's kernel, i was getting intel_powerclamp going mad & throttling me down to nothing
<directhex> load avg >8 most of the time
<popey> yeah, i had powerclamp issues here too
<directhex> i'm waiting for lts-wily
<directhex> rather than using mainline
<directhex> grr, car still not done charging
#ubuntu-uk 2015-09-12
<mapps> hi all;]
<zmoylan-pi> o/
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<bujji> rm: cannot remove â1.zipâ: Input/output error
<bujji> hello
<bujji> daftykins: halo
<bujji> hi
<leecowdrey_> Bujji, problem?
<leecowdrey_> Guess not ;)
<foobarry> oh, all4 (4od) is working under firefox :-|
<penguin42> heck, that's a record, now if someone can get five.tv to work
<awilkins> GRARRRRR
<awilkins> python-qrtools
<awilkins> Project on launchpad
<awilkins> No docs page (that I can find)
<awilkins> ANNOYING
<awilkins> Ok, anyone know of a method of QR decoding for Python that works well on Raspberry pi
<awilkins> THe use case is - wave a QR code in front of the camera module, scan code, read data
<foobarry> penguin42: it's asking for flash v15
<foobarry> :-|
<penguin42> postoffice in Manc city centre has got very neat; self service stamp printing
<daftykins> :O
<daftykins> nice
<penguin42> select the country, weigh the letter, confirm that you're not trying to ship anything dangerous, pay, prints the stamp
<penguin42> is the dnf system upgrade to 23 working reasonably solidly now?
<Myrtti> Cambridge has the same
<DJones> Is that not called a franking machine......
<penguin42> DJones: Possibly; it was integrated into a general self-service till
<DJones> Must admit, slight difference is ours at work doesn't ask whether we're shipping anything dangerous
<daftykins> you must be well trained and accountable :)
<penguin42> DJones: I don't think normally the staff at a post office do; but this just displayed the standard list of stuff and asked you to tap through
<DJones> A bit different anyway, I suspect its just a case of the post office cutting staff for automated systems
<penguin42> DJones: Yes, it worked great
<penguin42> DJones: It's one of those post offices that has always had a huge queue (centre of Manc) and they completely redid it about a year ago, and have been trying new tech there - e.g. machines to get a ticket based on what operation you want to do, and now these self-servs
<penguin42> (I think they used it for filming Life on Mars at one point before it got redone - inside it was very 70s architecture)
<daftykins> :D
<DJones> I took a cheque to the bank this morning, completely changed from last time I went, gone the 6 bank tellers, except for 2, only one working, but two "staff"walking the floor trying to persuade people to use the automated machines for everything
<zmoylan-pi> as soon as they can make a bot to roam to do the persuading...
<zmoylan-pi> i wonder what ed-209 is doing these days... :-)
<daftykins> DJones: haha i saw that in an HSBC locally, found it really confusing as i saw a queue for the normal teller
<DJones> This was a nat west
<daftykins> normally i'd be all-for progress, but there's something truly confirming about a teller giving you confirmation, versus just tapping something in and hoping it'd work
<DJones> Iguess they're all going the same way
<daftykins> haha that reminds me actually, i walked in and saw my girlfriends brother - and he says to me "hello hello, does my sister know you're here?" :D
<DJones> Yeah agree  with that, I want a receipt when I pay a cheque in, not a scrappy bit of paper
<SuperEngineer> I've been away for 5 days & just found I can't sign in to Steam. Brain went: 1/ are they off line; 2/ take action in case of hacking; 3/ I'm too releaxed - can't be ars**d, save some monry & ignore it  :D
<daftykins> XD
<SuperEngineer> & now I'm back in... the relaxed attituded worked!  ;)
<SuperEngineer> *attitude
<penguin42> DJones: The natwest machines certainly used to give a receipt that included a scan of the cheque being paid in
<DJones> penguin42: Never seen them do that before, still wouldn't trust them not to get the shredder mixed up with the paying in machine
<penguin42> DJones: Yeh, I prefer humans for paying in, but a receipt with a scan seems reasoanble
<DJones> I'd have to know I was getting a receipt with a scan before I'd use it, so catch 22, won;t use it without receipt, without receipt I won't use it, so....Reallife cashier for me
<penguin42> DJones: Yeh I normally ask one of the floorwalkers to confirm it will give a scan
<DJones> Might be a case they've only just put the machines in, I'll wait for a while
<penguin42> DJones: Oh, the last time I did this was 5-10 years ago
<penguin42> (in natwest)
<popey> penguin42: ooh, wonder what size post offices will have those machines, sounds handy for people like me who can never figure out the obscure rules for postage
<penguin42> popey: This is the manchester 'main' postoffice, so a pretty big one
<popey> hmm
<penguin42> probably 10 or so counter positions
<penguin42> and now 3 self service
<zmoylan-pi> will self service use reduce bank charges...
 * penguin42 doesn't have any bank charges
<mapps> hm free samsung tablet when switching to sky
<mapps> i never got anything;[
 * zmoylan-pi passes the aspirin
<zmoylan-pi> no charge
<mapps> heh
<mapps> thanks
<mapps> anyone watch this goggle box? my dad keeps taking about it
<mapps> talkin
<daftykins> as in a program called that or any TV? :D
<mapps> the program, some ch4 show
<mapps> http://www.skyoffersnewcustomers.co.uk/samsung-galaxy-tab-4-sky-tv/
<daftykins> i don't think such a 'gift' can atone for what Sky does :)
<mapps> hmm
<mapps> skys cheap though compared to bt
<zmoylan-pi> but on the plus side you now don't have a samsung tablet with security issues in the software
<penguin42> BT keep trying to get us to do broadband through them, well *** get infinity on our streetbox then
<daftykins> hehe
<daftykins> someone local got a call from BT once, trying to sell a product too
<daftykins> bit hard when they don't operate in the Channel Islands :>
<mapps> heh
<mapps> hmm bt infinity is expensive tho
<mapps> i have sky fibre and its like 50 a month or something, seems a lot really?
<daftykins> what speeds?
<mapps> 80mbit it says
<daftykins> makes me cringe the way they're always saying it's a fibre service
<daftykins> funny that there's more often than not some copper or coax coming into the property :>
<daftykins> https://www.dropbox.com/s/71o5et5i95b16f3/IMG_20150912_233228.jpg?dl=0
<daftykins> :D
<penguin42> yeh I complained to advertising standards about that more than 10 years ago (when virgin started doing that trick) and they said that since no one was actually doing fibre they wouldn't do anything
<daftykins> hahaha
<daftykins> so it doesn't matter that it's wrong, only if someone is doing it for real and they're wrong
<mapps> moving is a pain
<mapps> 3 suitcases 1 gym bag, my work bag full, travel bag and my ash basket full of stuff
<mapps> having to make 3 trips to move it to my friends first
<daftykins> this between your rented pads down on the rock?
<mapps> well from current place to friend (3min walk)stay with him 3 days then move to new place
<mapps> estate agents bugging us for last months rent Â£1250 right..we paid Â£1550 deposit
<mapps> dont see why we should pay anymore
<mapps> plus i dont have the money atm, because when i got thi new place they wanted months rent and deposit
<mapps> Â£1500 deposit 1k rent
<mapps> im certain if we pay we'll have to beg for our deposit back
<daftykins> hrmm surely paying that rent and getting the deposit back is the same as paying them Â£300
<mapps> yea
<mapps> but they want last months rent then they can make us be for it
<mapps> estate agents always do this
<mapps> ep6 of narcos now
<daftykins> TV, the healthiest of your habits :)
<daftykins> hey mapps i was just in Wales doing some downhill mountain biking \o/
<mapps> cool:D
<mapps> isnt that far from you
<penguin42> wales has lots of mountains
<daftykins> mapps: yeah we took the boat then roadtripped up
<daftykins> penguin42: and very very poor roads, as we discovered!
 * penguin42 hasn't been very far into wales; it's a real pain to get to from Manc by public transport
<daftykins> ah probably only one train link in?
<daftykins> Â£13.10 on the Severn bridge was a bit ouch
<mapps> 13.10 for what
<mapps> how long did it take to get to wales
<daftykins> hrmm couple of hours drive i think
<daftykins> toll for the bridge
<penguin42> daftykins: Well, it's easy to get to Chester, and go from there, but the way that goes along to Rhyl etc along the edge just takes ages from Manc
<mapps> oh
<daftykins> mapps: we took the ferry to Portsmouth overnight
<penguin42> wales is a bit of a way from portsmouth isn't it?
<daftykins> sure is
<daftykins> but we had a van with us and our bikes
<penguin42> ah
<daftykins> and sadly only Portsmouth and Poole are sailing destinations for Condor ferries now
<leecowdrey_> Deposits should be lodged with external registered agency and not the landlord, still not perfect but it helps
<daftykins> that might not be law in Gibraltar
<leecowdrey_> It's not law regardless just best practice for new rental agreements for landlords and tenants
<leecowdrey_> Covers both parties
<daftykins> yeah i guess 'law' was a bad choice of word, i used to be a landlord
<leecowdrey_> Gibraltar I would of thought given the money flowing in/out would do similar
<leecowdrey_> But some landlords don't play that way
<mapps> gah not tired
<mapps> mind's spinning
#ubuntu-uk 2015-09-13
 * daftykins disconnects the starter
<mapps> ;]
<penguin42> huh I didn't know Brum had a maglec for 11 years
<mapps> whats maglec/
<penguin42> magnetic levitation train
<mapps> ah
<mapps> gah
<mapps> daftykins?
<mapp> hmm what can i watch to sleep to..fedup watching same tv again and again
<mapp> maybe radio would work
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<m6lpi> Morning
<popey> yo
<bigcalm> Good morning peeps :)
<Azelphur> popey: I kinda went overboard with this thing, https://dpaste.de/2jv0 this is running on the router now :)
<Azelphur> should work on any router that can run Python and has /proc/net/dev (which I think is pretty much any router that you can ssh into)
<daftykins> https://www.dropbox.com/s/ff8u8tf1vry58md/IMG_20150913_200045.jpg?dl=0
<daftykins> that's quite some traffic on my xbox one, 570GB since October of last
<popey> Azelphur: http://i.imgur.com/S4i3JDl.png
<penguin42> popey: What provider are you on?
<Azelphur> popey: :)
<popey> penguin42: vm
<penguin42> popey: Do you think you're hitting the throttling stuff that kicks in if you go over the limit in one hour where they slow you down for the next period?
<popey> I don't know what's causing it.
<popey> I don't think I do anything especially at that time.
 * penguin42 notes his ping time to google has doubled since about 6pm on Virgin, not sure if they're having problems or it's to do with the 5GB of updates I pulled
<popey> If I post a phone which is switched on and unlocked to myself, do you think the gps will be able to track it much?
<daftykins> worth a try :D
<penguin42> depends where it is and if it's bothered to use the GPS
<penguin42> for an android phone the location history is worth a check
<mapps> hmm
<mapps> i think yes
<popey> maybe pack a battery in the box too, to make sure it stays alive
<popey> for fun
<penguin42> http://i.imgur.com/bXtkGXm.png  ping time to google definitely a bit longer than normal
<popey> you on vm too?
<penguin42> popey: Yep
<penguin42> popey: On their bottom end 50/3
<popey> https://webmonkeyuk.wordpress.com/2012/01/26/putting-a-gps-tracker-in-the-mail/
<penguin42> popey: It would be fun to gather an accelerometer trace as well as GPS
<popey> hah, yes
<penguin42> popey: Both to see how it's been thrown and also you might be able to do integration to handle loss of GPS
<daftykins> i always found VM to feel held together with tape
<penguin42> daftykins: I find their routing is generally excellent
<daftykins> so many wide outages though :D
<penguin42> daftykins: Most of the outages I've had have been ~1hr type of screw ups, only one long one in ~2 years
<penguin42> daftykins: And I'm using it ~10 hours a day now
<daftykins> i guess they've improved their game!
<daftykins> used to see a lot of middle of the night outages in Portsmouth
<penguin42> not seen any lately, but it seems to be very area dependent
<daftykins> yeah, i was thinking perhaps being in a student area could increase it, but you're probably near a Uni too?
<penguin42> hmm interesting, they've been having ping peaks to google for the last 4 days in the afternoon/evenings
<penguin42> daftykins: Well it depends, I'm on the north side of Manchester, and most of the university stuff is in the centre/south
<daftykins> ah right
<popey> Ok, next question for the team!
<popey> Wifey currently has iphone 4s, previously had an iphone 4, that was her first smartphone.
<popey> Looking to replace it (no, not ubuntu phone).
<daftykins> and she's not cult-tied?
<popey> She likes small size phones (i.e. no stupid phablets)
<popey> no
<daftykins> any urgency?
<popey> she doesn't care, so long as it has fb, whatsapp, camera, space for photos etc
<popey> not really
<popey> Don't want to spend a lot though
<popey> Second hand iPhone 5s is the competition.
<popey> So something simliar sized, similar spec, faster than 4s.
<popey> sd card bonus
<czajkowski> I have an ubuntu phone looking to sell
<czajkowski> i case anyone knows someone looking for one
<Azelphur> popey: what sorta price bracket is that?
<popey> czajkowski: awwww
<popey> Azelphur: dunno, couple of hundred quid I guess
<Azelphur> popey: hmm so you're looking for something ~5"?
<czajkowski> popey: just don't get enough use out of it
<popey> yeah, between the size of a 4s and 5s
<czajkowski> as always have work aka main phone on as need the apps for work and travek
<popey> she likes small phones
<czajkowski> next 8 weeks I'm travelling every other week :/
<Azelphur> popey: the new Nexus 5 is coming out in <1m, something to consider perhaps but might be a little pricey
<popey> and probably too huge
<czajkowski> I am hoping ot move to 3 at the end of October, Vodaphone are a pita
<czajkowski> and gtting a S6
<popey> hm, old nexus 5 is pretty cheap
<mapps> i see the 6s is up for preorder..i haven't bothered with iphone for a while so didn't even know :)
<Azelphur> popey: I thought Nexus 5 is too big? :P
<popey> it is
<Azelphur> ah
<foobarry> new moto g?
<foobarry> good price
<daftykins> popey: i nearly mentioned the Nexus 5s, as it seems a second one is on the way soonish
<popey> oooh, and has sd card
<foobarry> also sure to get M release on android
<daftykins> i'd go Nexus to be on the monthly security patch bandwagon
<daftykins> unless they'll do the same
<popey> ugh, 1GB RAM
<Azelphur> popey: Sony Xperia Z3 compact meets all of your requirements.
<popey> oh! good call, forgot sony!
<popey> laura has one, and she loves it
<popey> excellent.
<Azelphur> yw
<Azelphur> yea I believe it does everything you want, a tiny bit bigger than the 5s but not by much (123.8 x 58.6 x 7.6 mm vs 127.3 x 64.9 x 8.6 mm) has card slot, is around Â£200, is fairly current (2014, September)
<popey> also, camera is a focus of it, which I like
<popey> she takes a lot of photos / videos
<Azelphur> has android 5 upgrade too, along with some nice extra features like IP68, 720p display, Shatter proof glass and a 20MP camera
<Azelphur> yea :)
 * Azelphur is good at phone finding
<foobarry> popey: which phone 1gb ram?
<Azelphur> popey: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Sony-XPERIA-Z3-Compact-D5803-Black-Vodafone-MINT-with-dock-/151815304595?hash=item2358e5b593 here's your best price, bang on target budget wise :)
<daftykins> Sony are a very poor android choice
<Azelphur> daftykins: you can fix that with https://download.cyanogenmod.org/?device=z3c
<daftykins> fix what?
<Azelphur> Sony are always amazing hardware shit software
<popey> foobarry: moto g
<foobarry> the high er storage version also has more ram
<foobarry> 16gb version has 2gb i believe
<popey> ah
<popey> Azelphur: locked to voda :(
<popey> little stand is handy
<popey> that certainly is top of the list at the moment
<popey> good work Azelphur :)
<Azelphur> popey: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Sony-XPERIA-Z3-Compact-D5803-Latest-Model-16GB-Black-Unlocked-Smartphone-Bundle-/361370436141?hash=item54235b422d best price unlocked, but probably best to just buy the one I linked, it's gonna cost less than Â£30 to unlock and it's in better condition and a stand too.
<Azelphur> yw
<daftykins> oh LG G3s are pretty good too
<popey> yeah
<Azelphur> popey: to be clear, your requirements are <135mm, <66mm, Android, >=2GB RAM and Card slot?
<Azelphur> oh, and Â£200
<popey> roughly, yeah
<Azelphur> Then your only choices are the Z3 Compact, Z1 Compact, Huawei Ascend P6 or the ZTE Nubia Z5S Mini
<Azelphur> there are no other phones that meet all the above criteria :)
<foobarry> not the motog?
<Azelphur> Moto G does not meet the criteria (>=2GB RAM) it only has 1GB RAM
<foobarry> Azelphur: higher storage version has 2gb ram i beliebe
<foobarry> The Moto G now goes up to Â£209/$219 for the 2GB RAM/16GB storage version, or Â£179/$179/$250AU for the plain 1GB RAM/8GB storage
<Azelphur> foobarry: you mean the Moto G 3rd Gen? It fails the size requirements
<popey> heheh
<foobarry> 142.1 x 72.4 x 11.6 mm
<popey> I'm so glad I asked in here :)
 * Azelphur is helpful
<Azelphur> and also a database of phones, apparently
<foobarry> statto
 * foobarry goes back to watching phoneshop
<foobarry> whats 7mm between friends?
<Azelphur> foobarry: he wants iPhone 5s sizes, which is actually almost 2cm bigger
<Azelphur> for the Moto G 3rd gen, I mean
<Azelphur> 123.8 x 58.6 x 7.6 mm vs 142.1 x 72.4 x 11.6 mm
<popey> what's that tool called which is a bag of beans you microwave then rest on a phone screen to make the glue melt?
<popey> (I assume it's beans)
<daftykins> ifixit.com sells a screen heater job
<popey> yeah, tried to find it then my gpu crashed
<popey> bah, they call it "iopener"
<popey> useless
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> want something local is it?
<popey> blimey, perhaps not, they sell it on amazon
<popey> http://www.amazon.co.uk/iFixit-iOpener-Apple-glued-devices/dp/B00KJ1XHLE
<daftykins> \o/
<mapps> *watching 1st dates, that show's so funny:D
<mapps> id never heard of this, what apple devices is it for?
<daftykins> sound like the fan bearings have gone? :D https://www.dropbox.com/s/4cbrf6b0ru00qo4/VID_20150913_214839.mp4?dl=0
<daftykins> warning: check volume
<mapps> is recruitment consultant really that good of a job, well paid etc? always seem to be flashy show off types
<mapps> althouh means nothing of course
<daftykins> fan motor i mean really
<popey> they are in sales, so yeah :)
<popey> selling people
<mapps> so it is paid well?
<popey> a friend of mine is one, we often take the mickey that he sits at work all day playing snap
<popey> matching jobs with candidates
<popey> It can be, if you're good
<mapps> when i say well i mean 60k+
<popey> well, often they are on a low basic
<popey> with commission for placement
<popey> either a monthly income for contractors they place, or a lump sum after a permie has been in place for N months
<mapps> ah
<mapps> but if it wasnt going well, not many jobs or candidates or whatever then the basic wage could suck?
<popey> I've had them call me up after 6 months (once they got their payment for placing me) and ask if I was happy (and did I want to move) so they could get another lump out of me
<popey> there's always candidates, and always roles
<popey> it's whether the role will accept an agent and whether you can find and convince one to go for the role
<mapps> ah
<popey> and whether they are any good once they get to interview
<popey> many agents will fire tons of CVs over for a role, in the hope one sticks
<mapps> i'd do that :) but i guess that could irritate employers
<popey> yes
<popey> which is why you often see adverts which say "No recruiters" on the spec
<popey> because they have had bad experience of exactly that
<mapps> ahh yea
<mapps> I'd be annoyed if i was getting loads of CVs which clearly arent up to it:)
<popey> thinking of a change of career? :)
<mapps> nah
<mapps> too much freedom, i waste copious amounts of time at work
<mapps> a normal office job would be a chore, i imagine most non work sites being blocked
<mapps> plus when i have standby i.e. nothing to do i just watch films or tv on my tablet :) if there's nothing to do, not my problem!
<czajkowski> aww under the dome is finished :(
<mapps> hmm
<mapps> i went off that a bit tbh
<mapps> big match soon, fed vs djoko, delayed due to rain;/
<daftykins> ah midnight and it feels late, this must be what normality feels like
#ubuntu-uk 2016-09-12
<ali1234> zmoylan-pi: for evading the "do not track" stuff i think
<ali1234> and it wasn't apple, just some users. but maybe you're talking about something else
<ali1234> oooh, that dropbox thing is really dirty. why would they do that?
<zmoylan-pi> yeah it wasn't apple when i went looking it up.  it was the safari tracking cookie thing
<zmoylan-pi> just in the mobile market everyone is suing everyone and it is hard to keep track sometimes :-)
<ali1234> indeed
<knightwise> Good morning
<davmor2> Morning all
<Gargoyle> o/
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<foobarry> wow mr robot latest episode was epic
<TwistedLucidity> What channel is it on, and is it on catch-up?
<foobarry> amazon prime
<foobarry> and USA network channel in the states
<TwistedLucidity> Ah. balls.
<foobarry> yeah :9
<TwistedLucidity> It'll be on Dave soon enough... :-)
<TwistedLucidity> Still...new Red Dwarf \o/ I hope it's funny
<foobarry> when?
<CRogers> Just got another user reporting conflict with the wm alt-drag convention in gnome
<CRogers> Recommend switching the defailt wm-action button to Super instead of Alt to prevent application clashes.
<CRogers> *default
<CRogers> In unity at least.
<foobarry> shift J must be my favourite vim shortcut \o/
<davmor2> CRogers: well done that's 2
<CRogers> Two since I logged on a week ago.
<davmor2> CRogers: feel free to write a bug report rather than complain about it here :) something might actually be done about it then
<CRogers> It's also enough to warrant this page on Inkscape's main site: https://inkscape.org/en/learn/faq/#alt-key-doesn-t-work-on-linux
<CRogers> davmor2 plenty of bug reports about it.
<CRogers> Problem is most don't consider it a "bug"
<davmor2> CRogers: indeed because it only affects a small subset of users
<CRogers> davmor2 No, because it's not a bug, it's just a bad convention.
<CRogers> So the behavior is intended.
<davmor2> Indee
<davmor2> +d
<CRogers> You have no statistics to indicate that "it only affects a small subset of users" other than if people confront the dev community with it.
<CRogers> And also, users would have to know what the problem is.
<CRogers> The user that just asked us on #inkscape didn't.
<CRogers> Which is the reason I'm making it more visible to you/everyone.
<CRogers> The fact that the gnome and ubuntu tweak tools include the option to change it would indicate it affects a larger number of users than you are assuming.
<CRogers> And it affects major software projects, who have to choose whether to dance around it when the alt-key is a standard modifier key used in all applications.
<BigRedS> I don't think that does; exposing the ability to change something is as likely to be just because it was easy to implement and might be useful as because of demand
<BigRedS> especially in free software
<popey> Bear in mind ALT+Click pre-dates Inkscape (and Unity)
<CRogers> I disagree with that. Esp in the tweak tools, which are notably sparing with options.
<popey> it's been a staple keypress combo for years
<CRogers> popey, yes, I'm aware of that. It was never a great idea to use Alt. It's too essential of a modifier for applications.
<CRogers> It's the duty of the wm to serve up applications, not to override essential function keys.
<popey> As davmor2 suggests, a bug would be useful.
<popey> we can work around some of these issues
<popey> and have done in the past
<CRogers> At this point all that is necessary is to make the default Super.
<CRogers> And have it changeable to alt in the tweak tool instead.
<CRogers> But sure. I'll make a new bug report.
<CRogers> And start filing complaints there too.
<CRogers> I guess it would also be useful to post a list of affected programs.
<CRogers> I know Blender, Inkscape and GIMP all have issues with that alt-key clash. I'm sure there are many more.
<CRogers> Then the issue becomes: do we mandate that all the applications switch those hotkeys, or is it better to finalise the convention of using the Super key as the default modifier for wm actions.
<TwistedLucidity> foobarry: Red Dwarf starts Spet 22nd I think
<foobarry> its gonna be bad
<knightwise> Parked outside in the sunshine today with the Dell Xps13
<knightwise> Man I love going for the non glossy screen :)
<foobarry> except...
<foobarry> keyboard imprints on the matt screen
<foobarry> glass tends to protect that a bit better.
<zmoylan-pi> whoever thought screens should be glossy need to be taken out and rubbed down with sandpaper
<foobarry> my dell e7440 has such low clearance you can't even carry the laptop folded without damaging the screen with key/nipple marks
<zmoylan-pi> i don't think i have ever chosen an electronic device on how thin it is
<foobarry> its not thin
<foobarry> but just doesn't have little rubber pads to avoid screen/keyboard touching
<zmoylan-pi> then a few more mm to provide clearance for keyboard and screen should have been included
<foobarry> yes
<foobarry> because of screen flex
<knightwise> I'm not getting any key imprints on the screen
<popey> I don't understand whether matte or shiny makes a difference in that regard
<popey> that's a function of the design of the lid not the screen
<foobarry> isn't shiny screen = glass?
<popey> not on my laptop
<popey> bohemian rhapsody is very different with only one headphone in
<foobarry> half as many galileo's
<BigRedS> haha
<foobarry> https://www.reddit.com/r/linux/comments/528n4p/freetype_27_has_been_released_it_adds_a_new/
<foobarry> i don't use windows fonts much so not such a deal
<zmoylan-pi> how do you use comic sans to drive people nuts then?? :-P
<Gargoyle> When I click on a notification in Gnome, instead of jumping to the corresponding app, I get another notification which says "[app] is ready!" which I then have to click to jump to the app. Is there a way to stop that and just go directly to the app in the first place?
<TwistedLucidity> zmoylan-pi: Comic sans has it's uses, e.g. scientific papers as 1,I and l are all distinct.
<TwistedLucidity> In many font they are hard to tell apart, and that can be confusing
<popey> Gargoyle: i just tried, and it switches for me
<popey> e.g. I just got a spotify notification and it switched to it when I clicked
<popey> the app was already open though.. dunno of that's a difference
<zmoylan-pi> true, but if you are presenting information you should choose a medium were there isn't even the chance of confusion... /disclaimer, i used a zx spectrum in which the n and m were one fuzzy pixel in difference :-)
<diddledan> *groan* http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2016/09/ubuntu-torrent-removed-google-infringing-transformers-movie
<Seeker`> I bet that torrent isn't what it says it is
<zmoylan-pi> someone uploaded the my little pony horror fest movie?! :-P
<popey> I would take a look but my ISP blocks that site
<foobarry> omg?
<foobarry> or the torrent site
<foobarry> maybe someone on reddit checked already
<popey> wakka wakka
<popey> it's actually an ubuntu iso?
<diddledan> it is
<diddledan> http://torrent.ubuntu.com:6969/announce is the tracker it's using
<popey> heh
<foobarry> EOL now though
<ali1234> yeah the tracker wont allow it so you cant download it anyway
<popey> the magnet link works
<Gargoyle> popey, can you mention me again?
<diddledan> snapcraft - does it use any containery things for blowing away changes when you're finished building (and not messing-up your installed system)
<popey> diddledan: yes, "snapcraft cleanbuild" will build  in lxc
<popey> Gargoyle: hm?
<davmor2> diddledan: what popey said and I was typing :)
<diddledan> :-) ta
<diddledan> lol @ Creating snapcraft-rarely-upward-roughy
<diddledan> hmm, cleanbuild just told me (with a load of python traceback) http.client.RemoteDisconnected: Remote end closed connection without response
<popey> get thee to #snappy
<Gargoyle> popey, Thanks... Seems hexchat doesn't event want to notify me (trying to figure out if its all apps or just slack)
<ali1234> i never managed to get cleanbuild to work
<diddledan> I'm wondering if there's a network issue with having docker installed
<ali1234> that ubuntu torrent is a legit iso btw. sha1sum matches anyway.
<popey> i use cleanbuild all the time here, but I had to faff a bit to get lxd working
<ali1234> i don't have docker installed afaik
<diddledan> I've not done anything to set-up lxd
<popey> i much prefer it over polluting my laptop with tons of stuff
<foobarry> i've been testing something called singularity
<foobarry> because docker has scary security in multi-user environment
<ali1234> i've pretty much given up trying to use snappy at this point. nothing i tried to package can work because of missing interfaces
<ali1234> and there's still no release for raspberry pi
<popey> i have it on my pi here
<popey> (pi 2)
<ali1234> me too
<ali1234> it doesn't work properly. and then it tried to auto update and completely died
<popey> how do you mean there is no release?
<popey> oh, I am on the very latest image and updates work okay here
<ali1234> i mean ogra told me there is no release
<popey> wat
<popey> the release was only last week :)
<popey> well, beta
<ali1234> i didn't know that. this was about two weeks ago
<popey> ah okay.
<ali1234> still, beta isn't a release :)
<popey> there was an announce mvo made somewhere
<popey> well, true :)
<popey> close than "no release" tho ã
<popey> https://technomancy.itch.io/bussard looks fun
<popey> Creating snapcraft-hugely-robust-lamb
<popey> never get tired of the generated lxd names
<foobarry> mmm lamb
<diddledan> ok, I've got cleanbuild working now - had to remove the downloaded images and pre-configure lxd using `sudo lxd init`
<popey> groovy
<diddledan> now to get corebird building :-)
<knightwise> Yeeha :)
<knightwise> Meesa running Loki
<knightwise> Soooo Prettyyy
<brobostigon> hey hey knightwise
<knightwise> hey brobostigon
<brobostigon> :)
<davmor2> knightwise: why run from Loki he's a great guy just misunderstood ;)
<knightwise> :) I think he is too horny for my taste
<knightwise> hmm. I still get the "flickering" when I run chrome or firefox fullscreen
<Gargoyle> I've changed my screen resolution using the nvidia tool, and it looks ok. However, the actual desktop size is still the same size, so everytime I hit the right edge or bottom of the screen, is scrolls over revealing "random rubbish"
<Gargoyle> Is there some other setting I'm missing?
<SebthreeBQM10HD> hi
<SebthreeBQM10HD> popey ping
<popey> SebthreeBQM10HD: pong
<SebthreeBQM10HD> popey my nexdock came today but..
<popey> oh!
<popey> neat
<SebthreeBQM10HD> popey yeah you would think so but it dorsnt just work with anything but windows so far, but maybd i nerd a hdmi adaltr of some sort as well usb type c
<popey> :(
<popey> not even android?
<SebthreeBQM10HD> they sent a hdmi cablr but mostly not much good since thd nrxdock serms yo be micro hdmi as well as the drvices i want to connrct
<popey> seeing people saying it works with the raspberry pi
<SebthreeBQM10HD> popey they sent a hdmi cabld with it that serms to be normal on one end and micro hdmi on the. othdr that does work for connecting the remix mibi but that apparently dodsnt supoit
<SebthreeBQM10HD> thrir display tesoluuon thrvone you hate
<SebthreeBQM10HD> aand so a black screen for that
<popey> bummer
<SebthreeBQM10HD> it shohld sork with androd and linux to i just may be missing something hdni hardware wise i guesd
<SebthreeBQM10HD> popey how do i conect when both the nexdock Nd devices i want to use Re micro hdmi
<SebthreeBQM10HD> are mivro hdmi
<SebthreeBQM10HD> the amount of mistakes is since usibg the touch scren keyboard on table
<SebthreeBQM10HD> t
<SebthreeBQM10HD> popry is thdteike a micro hdmi to mivro hdmi csblr or something i brrn liokinh
<SebthreeBQM10HD> bern lookinh
<SebthreeBQM10HD> popey
<popey> i have no idea what you're asking
<SebthreeBQM10HD> popey they sent a hdmi cable wigh it that sems to be normal hdmi on onr end and micfo hdni on the other
<SebthreeBQM10HD> but both the nexdock and devices that eant to connect are micro hdmi so cant usr that
<popey> :(
<SebthreeBQM10HD> popey but they mention sometingbabout a usb c go hdmi adaptdr on their sebsite so posdibly i am mrsnt go havd one of those?
<SebthreeBQM10HD> usb c to hdmi adPter
<popey> how is the build quality?
<SebthreeBQM10HD> popey if you mean hos ig loks and sucg well like a nice whitd lap top
<ali1234> ubuntu phones have no autocorrect then
<ali1234> ?
<popey> heh
<diddledan> I don't get how typing on a table is any different to holding it in your hand
<zmoylan-pi> no autocorrect? sold! hate the flippin thing... :-)
<diddledan> zmoylan-pi: it's not a nokia
<zmoylan-pi> i liked t9 on my first nokia... till i realised i'd have to teach all t9 phones all the irish place names and words that didn't fit its dictionary
<zmoylan-pi> PLUS alternate spellings
<zmoylan-pi> WITH fÃ¡das and without
<ali1234> okay why is apache holding log file fds open? the log rotator rotated the logs but apache is still writing to the deleted files so they just grow forever (and aren't visible in the FS)
<SebthreeBQM10HD> diddledan they do have autocorrect but does not always work properly so disabled
#ubuntu-uk 2016-09-13
<daftykins> hello folks
<daftykins> http://imgur.com/a/TdW16
<daftykins> here are some snaps from my hiking here in Rocky Mountain National Park, Colorado :D
<daftykins> https://www.dropbox.com/s/ab0lv1u6hvcga8d/pano1.jpg?dl=0
<daftykins> https://www.dropbox.com/s/yh7im6wrg0gfayo/pano2.jpg?dl=0
<daftykins> couple of stitched together snaps
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<Gargoyle> mornin' brobostigon.
<brobostigon> morning Gargoyle
<davmor2> Morning all you funkytown brothers and sisters of course :)
<BigRedS> Goood Morning!
<JamesTait> Good morning all!  Happy Tuesday, and happy Positive Thinking Day! ð
<JamesTait> Also, both Fortune Cookie Day and Defy Superstition Day.
<JamesTait> And for those with kids, you're in for a treat as it's Kids Take Over The Kitchen Day.
<davmor2> JamesTait: welcome back dude https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HqYnevHibaI
<JamesTait> davmor2, ð  Blues Brothers ftw!
<davmor2> JamesTait: that was the added bonus :)
<davmor2> I mean it's 105 miles to Chicago, we have a full tank of gas, half a pack of cigarettes, it's dark and we are wearing sunglasses  you can't help but think positive
<diddledan> wat. https://youtu.be/sXQkXXBqj_U
<diddledan> south park is funky weird
<diddledan> davmor2: you'll have to add that into your song-of-the-day collection
<diddledan> and regarding earlier. yes. blues brothers are the amaze balls
<zmoylan-pi> you hadn't watched blues brothers?!
<diddledan> oh, I've watched blues brothers!
<diddledan> they're awesome
<zmoylan-pi> but till recently
<diddledan> balls
<diddledan> nah, I've seen it many times over the decades
<zmoylan-pi> ah, ok
<diddledan> spammers aren't even trying to phish anymore - received email with subject line of "Subject: There is some news on that topic we discussed."
<diddledan> (yes, they wrote Subject: in the subject field)
<diddledan> and, omg, not "that topic"
<diddledan> ?!
<diddledan> "so. you know a thing. it happened. thinglike"
<zmoylan-pi> wait till it's 'here is some malware to download and install' :-)
<diddledan> isn't that the swedish virus?
<zmoylan-pi> hands up who thinks that would still work o/
<diddledan> o/
<diddledan> how about "omg, I just found this awesome virus which steals all your money! download it now!"
<zmoylan-pi> everyone else is been infected with the latest virus, you don't want to be left behind!1
<Gargoyle> :( my notifications worked this morning, and now they are broke again.
<foobarry> my arms are sticking to my desk :(
 * zmoylan-pi gets some army surplus weather balloons and fills them with hydrogen and attaches them to foobarry's arms and places a do not smoke sign on their desk...
<DJones> foobarry: Don't fall asleep on the desk, then it'll be your face stuck to the  desk
<foobarry> i had blue tack stuck in my hair the other day, just before a presentation
<foobarry> no idea how it got there but it was very sticky
<zmoylan-pi> keyboard face is never _not_ funny :-)
<DJones> Whats hair?
<DJones> Thankfully wouldn't have that problem
<diddledan> zmoylan-pi: don't let those balloons crash or we'll think we're being invaded by aliens
<diddledan> I need to go to the posticle office
<zmoylan-pi> you can't go now, it's too late.  the proper time to go is during lunchtime with all your loose change to lodge in an account
<diddledan> zmoylan-pi: you're evil
<diddledan> zmoylan-pi: just think of all those business types trying to get things done during their lunchbreak?!?
<zmoylan-pi> do you think little evil things happen without careful advanced planning... will no one think of the evil overlords?!
<Azelphur> Don't suppose I could interest anyone in clubbing in on some offsite backup space on a dedicated heztner server? Good for anyone who is using borg/rsync/... https://gitlab.home.azelphur.com/snippets/5 for more info :)
<knightwise>   Whow :)
<knightwise> Pihole all setup , logging the queries realtime
<diddledan> I should know what a pihole is
<diddledan> aha adblocking?
<knightwise> Yup
<knightwise> Got a droplet at digitalocean
<knightwise> installed pihole
<diddledan> dark matter this week has a good quote: "I'm gonna disinfect the wound" *pours alcohol* "jeez, *wincing* disinfect it, don't get it drunk!"
<ali1234> 47GB outlook file... is that normal??
 * zmoylan-pi wonders if the utility to fix pst from ....way.... back to <2gb still works... :-P
<diddledan> ali1234: that's tiny for an outlook file
<diddledan> ali1234: usually you'd be looking at 500GB minimum :-p
<ali1234> i dont understand why the 47GB file is there
<diddledan> with three emails
<ali1234> outlook claims it does not own it
<diddledan> I'd be wary about deleting it
<diddledan> maybe copy it to another disk first
<ali1234> i already have two backups
<zmoylan-pi> i'd grep it for common email addresses the user contacts to see if outlook lies...
<popey> Ooh, getting flashbacks to fixing Lotus CC:Mail postboxes
 * popey goes for a lie down
<davmor2> popey: I wouldn't lie down while you're having those nightmares ;)
<zmoylan-pi> for me it was when outlook had a 2gb limit on pst files and despite informing customers of the solution. i'd reduce their pst file to <2gb and a few weeks later the problem would come back as they wouldn't purge old useless emails
<StevenR> hrrm. Anyone know much about partition referencing? I want to set spin-down times of specific disks, but I can't find a good way of referencing them. UUIDs seem to be for partitions
<diddledan> funky pc case: https://twitter.com/DamianEdwards/status/775788951789379584
<ali1234> StevenR: /dev/disk/by-id
<diddledan> nice work on the RPi gfx gonna land soon? http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=Raspberry-Pi-VC4-Linux-4.9
<zmoylan-pi> pffft, call that a netsplit...
<diddledan> playing havoc with irccloud, even though it only caught a few in here
<zmoylan-pi> some little script kiddy didn't get a captain crunch decoder ring in their rice krispies...
<diddledan> the earlier one caused an op to global: 20:35 <spb> [Global notice] We've put a cloth over the self-destruct button so that nobody pushes it again.
<diddledan> which begs the question: did someone push that button then?
<zmoylan-pi> they didn't have a molly guard?
<diddledan> ergh. those gentoo I have to admin. they have an init script called "unhaltable" which renames shutdown and reboot!?!
<m0nkey_> wtf, gentoo?
<zmoylan-pi> does it tell you what it renames them to?
<m0nkey_> who uses gentoo these days?
<zmoylan-pi> people who are still waiting for it to compile
<diddledan> m0nkey_: them over there -->
<diddledan> or maybe they're over there <--
<diddledan> or up there ^---
<diddledan> or down there ---v
<zmoylan-pi> or <^v>
<diddledan> I like the duck operator o>
<diddledan> otherwise known as dude scratching his head
 * zmoylan-pi stares suspiciously at diddledan >_>
#ubuntu-uk 2016-09-14
<mapps> hola
<daftykins> \o
<daftykins> mapps: what's new?
<mapps> not much, almost finished last ship s2;)
<mapps> on e12/13 s2 then got all of s3 to watch
<mapps> also need to watch narcos s2
<mapps> well.not 'need':P
<daftykins> XD
<daftykins> i'm in Boulder,Colorado right now
<mapps> sweet
<mapps> how long for
<daftykins> just done a few days hiking around Rocky Mountain National Park, here until Friday then off to Kansas for a baseball game, then more places after
<mapps> sweet
<mapps> how long in the states for total
<daftykins> http://imgur.com/a/TdW16
<daftykins> 3 weeks about :)
<mapps> gonna go wendys?:D
<mapps> lol
<daftykins> haha i've enjoyed a mcdonalds so far :>
<mapps> heh
<mapps> go to some cool places, you like steak, shrimp etc?
<daftykins> don't have any fast food on Guernsey of course ;)
<daftykins> never been hugely into steak but i'm going around trying more bbq yeah
<mapps> oh none? i mean here we have burger king/mcdonalds, no kfc, no subway
<mapps> no nandos
<mapps> see how much weight you can gain eatimng xxxl meals heh
<daftykins> sadly i've done that already!
<mapps> did you have to fly to the uk first then or fly somewhere else?
<daftykins> first day of hiking kicked my ass, i've gotten so unfit since my cycle spill 2 years ago
<daftykins> had perma pain start up in the intercostal muscles between the ribs i broke back then
<daftykins> bit of a wake up call :)
<mapps> still hurts?
<daftykins> yeah from the heavy breathing of the exercise at high altitude (hiked up hills to 10,000 feet) it set the pain off
<mapps> aha
<mapps> will it ever not hurt or will it always be there
<daftykins> yeah up to Gatwick on the 7am, found out my 11:20am flight was delayed 'til 2pm... which meant i missed my Toronto -> Denver flight, so had to go via Chicago which meant i ended up travelling and awake for like 26+ hours straight >_<
<daftykins> i mean it hasn't hurt 'til now apart from a couple of spells when i was doing exercise at home and was heavily breathing to catch my breath
<daftykins> just need to exercise and get back in shape i think
<mapps> what happens with the toronto - denver flight..do they refund your ticket, or do you get screwed by it
<daftykins> so i was already carrying the next boarding pass, just had to go to a desk and find where i was rebooked for
<mapps> they dont charge you? even if its diff airlines? i thought they might as they could say its no their issue
<daftykins> nah, in fact i can even get a partial refund since they delayed me over 5 hours
<daftykins> looking it up now
<mapps> so how did the 2nd leg know to rebook you ? if its a diff airline to first
<daftykins> the first must talk to the second auto
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<davmor2> Morning all
<Gargoyle> mornin'
<brobostigon> morning davmor2 and Gargoyle
<davmor2> brobostigon: morning dude
<brobostigon> :)
<foobarry> what does if ( $var =~ "jeff" ) in perl mean
<foobarry> contains?
<BigRedS> =~ should have a regex after it
<BigRedS> so that'd be equivalent to $var =~ m/jeff/
<BigRedS> and, yeah, $var contains jeff
<foobarry> hmm it just has "jeff"
<foobarry> ah ok
<foobarry> how can i edit it to say
<BigRedS> I'd imagine; m"jeff" would work like that, I don't really know what it does without the m
<foobarry> if $var contains jeff or bob?
<BigRedS> if ($var =~ m/(jeff|bob)/)
<foobarry> brill , thanks
<BigRedS> ah, it's nice to have an answer for someone in here for a change :)
<foobarry> woo
<popey> http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b07v0hhm was interesting. worth a listen
<BigRedS> I wish there was a "download this when it's available" button in the iplayer app
<popey> get_iplayer has pvr capability
<popey> cron that, and you can just add the url to get_iplayer
<BigRedS> hah, yeah, I keep meaning to make some daft concoction that'll make it easy to make a podcast feed of all the stuff I want to get_iplayer
<BigRedS> but I don't tend to listen to the radio at my PC so I've stopped using get_iplayer for radio stuff
<JamesTait> Good morning all!  Happy Wednesday, and happy Eat a Hoagie Day! ð
<davmor2> JamesTait: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vH8jAjtvc10
<foobarry> eat a bogey ?
<JamesTait> Well, if that's your thing....
<foobarry> facebook has reset all my user ignores
<czajkowski> Anyone in London tonight going to  http://www.meetup.com/Ubuntu-UK-Local-Community-Team/events/233941286/
<beaver545_> Good day all, I've had the go ahead from my boss for attendance at the Gstreamer conference for myself and a colleague, however when i try to buy the professional early bird tickets for 2, the form comes back saying only 1 is available...?
<popey> not sure that's something we can help with, is it?
<beaver545_> ah yes, sorry, thought i'd connected to the GStreamer channel!
<popey> however, I just went to https://ti.to/gstreamer-conference-2016/gstreamer-conference-2016
<popey> and changed number to 2 and continue and it says buy two
<DJones> Heh http://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2016/09/ubuntu-torrent-removed-google-infringing-transformers-movie
<popey> silly rabbits
<davmor2> popey: I think you mean  wasically wabbit
<czajkowski> popey: can you moderate a mail to the UK list please :)
<popey> done
<czajkowski> cheers!
<foobarry> sad to say goodbye to my ARM shares :(
<zmoylan-pi> you'll have to go out and get legless too... :-P
<popey> it's not goodbye, it's ææ¥
<zmoylan-pi> free soup? where? :-P
<davmor2> zmoylan-pi: you have it upside down it says puos eerf
<zmoylan-pi> my mistake, thank you davmor2
<diddledan> foobarry: why selling the shares?
<foobarry> softbank bought them
<foobarry> delisted from LSE
<diddledan> oh right
<foobarry> enforced sale at Â£17 per share
<foobarry> held them for 17 years
<diddledan> I figured they'd sell you equivalent value in the combined co?
<foobarry> if it had been for 10 or 20 yrs i would be rich
<foobarry> nope, outright cash purchase
<foobarry> i say cash, but they have massive debts
<foobarry> but i hear intel are thinking of doing arm chips again
<diddledan> TBH, stock markets are a dark art to my mind
<foobarry> i only hold 2 shares
<foobarry> i just think of them as i think of my star wars figures in the loft
<diddledan> I can't wrap my tiny little mind around it :-)
<foobarry> they have perceived market value which may rise and fall due to films and/or water damage
<foobarry> although shars are less tangible and less fun to playt with
<diddledan> :-o they're not mint-in-the-box?!
<diddledan> (ref: toy story)
<zmoylan-pi> not if they're kept in the loft i suspect
<popey> http://i.imgur.com/XS5LK.gif
<diddledan> lmao
<diddledan> I like cap'n murrica
<diddledan> he's fun
<popey> testing my new cheapo headphones with some Jarre
<popey> These are amazing for the price https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B00UNL7YR8
<diddledan> although hulk is pretty humorous too
<zmoylan-pi> but but they won't work with new iphone!!
<diddledan> ten squids?! that's cheap at half the price!
<zmoylan-pi> you could get 2 pi zeros for that... :-)
<popey> yeah, and really nice braided cable
<popey> so no twisty
<popey> went outside and mowed the lawn at lunchtime with them on listening to the world at one
<foobarry> i just bought my wife some MEE earphones
<foobarry> https://www.amazon.co.uk/MEE-audio-Sport-Fi-Isolating-Headphones/dp/B0038W0K2K
<foobarry> sennheiser keep changing their models
<popey> ooh they look good, wifey needs some for the gym
<popey> she keeps stealing everyone elses
<foobarry> they stay in a bit better
<popey> which led to this http://imgur.com/a/xOiFt
<diplo> I need some new headphones like that but bluetooth, my 3.5 doesn't work overly well :(
<popey> diplo: any job news?
<diplo> Last two bluetooth ones I've bought have either broke or not charged
<diplo> Didn't get it :(
<popey> aw :(
<popey> bluetooth sucks
<popey> [FACT]
<foobarry> bluetooth is so needy
<zmoylan-pi> my bluetooth headphones ran out of juice day before yesterday... first time...
<diplo> Guy who did lived in the same city and had experience with some of the tech i hadn't ( Docker / cfEngine )
<foobarry> it likes exlusive friendships
<diplo> But jobs mine if it falls through
 * diddledan gives diplo a consolatory hug
<zmoylan-pi> fingers crossed you get the next job...
<diddledan> diplo: I'm trying to find work, too, so I feel your pain
 * foobarry gives diplo an awkward fist bump hug, side hug thing
<diplo> Bluetooth works well for me, I use a portable speaker amongst other things for music
<foobarry> i'm going thru my usual "do i have to find another job" thing that happens every 2 motnhs
<diplo> It sucks, but it's good experience, fair amount of work around here, just wish I didn't have to travel to Bristol
<foobarry> from?
<diddledan> birmingham? :-p
<diddledan> that would be a hellish commute!
<diplo> Place called Trowbridge, it's not overly far, the traffic is hell
<foobarry> near bath
<foobarry> there's jobs in bath
<diplo> Trains suck, 2 carriages when there used to be 4, cheaper by car but takes longer, also not to sure I want to work in Bristol :D
<foobarry> saw a good one recently
<diplo> Yeah the one they were talking about above was in Bath
<diplo> Devops Engineer foobarry ?
<diplo> Got another one coming soon in a quaint little town called bradford on avon :) even closer
<foobarry> nah i think it was more up my street
<foobarry> hpc stuff
<foobarry> may have been a generic linux admin actualyl, i don't remember
<diplo> ah I saw that
<diplo> quite a few around here I've applied for, got sent one for windows that I could probably do, but I've not been around windows servers much in the last 5-6 years ( not that its hard ) and that puts some people off
<diplo> diddledan: Lost job or just looking ?
<diddledan> company I been working for has stopped sending me enough work so I need to find someone else to give me work to make ends-meet
<foobarry> brexit
<diddledan> brexit broke it
<diddledan> :-p
<zmoylan-pi> brexit is going to be blamed for everything for a few years...
<diddledan> yup
<diplo> That sucks, self employed ?
<ali1234> speaking of brexit, RAM prices are now up 40% compared to june
<foobarry> oof
<diddledan> self-employed only 'cos the company I was working for wanted the flexibility to do what they done :-p
<diplo> :/
<zmoylan-pi> did they give you a red shirt when you started? :-P
<diddledan> haha
<diddledan> dropbox are in hot water? https://techcrunch.com/2016/09/09/dropbox-responds-to-accusations-its-mac-desktop-client-hacks-os-x-security/
<davmor2> diddledan: yeah cause it is not like Apple do a competing cloud storage solution is it ;)
<diddledan> no, apple would never do that
<diddledan> https://boingboing.net/2016/09/14/a-powerful-attacker-is-systema.html
<czajkowski> Greetings from the Ubuntu UK meetup
<diddledan> once again apple does the $1 === Â£1 trick: http://www.apple.com/uk/shop/product/MMEF2ZM/A/airpods
<diddledan> why was I unaware of a meetup?!
 * diddledan rolls the rock back over himself
<zmoylan-pi> it means going out into natural light...
 * diddledan hisses
<ali1234> okay why can't my dvd drive read the windows install cd??
<ali1234> it works fine with linux boot discs
<zmoylan-pi> your pc is trying to protect you... :-P
<ali1234> it isn't my pc
<zmoylan-pi> right way up? /obvious
<zmoylan-pi> clean, scratched...
<czajkowski> diddledan: they'll promote it more next time
<czajkowski> I only knew as I saw popey RT a blog post about it today
<daftykins> ali1234: which version... and from which OS? you trying to just boot it?
<ali1234> there's something wrong with the drive... it's rattling now
<zmoylan-pi> air duster handy?
<daftykins> sounds like a wonky lens
<zmoylan-pi> not when it's rattly in my experience...
<zmoylan-pi> rattling is when the drive is either slipping while trying to spin it up or some other motor problem
<daftykins> true, i was trying to remember what it was my last drive was doing when it kept trying to refocus
<zmoylan-pi> when lens is wonky it'll spin happily but just never show a byte of data
<daftykins> mmm or error like this one was doing when ripping music (only use i have for CD :)
<daftykins> heh i just ordered an 8 piece ratcheting spanner set for an aircraft engineer friend back home, here in the US - it's Â£80 back home without tax, i just got it Â£41 delivered
<zmoylan-pi> i did have one cd explode when it was put into a 32x drive... spun up... *crunched* and sounded like a glass breaking
<daftykins> nice :) i heard that's why they stopped at 52x, discs couldn't take it
<zmoylan-pi> they could bring back disc caddies for higher speeds
<daftykins> iirc 52x was already 10,000RPM
<zmoylan-pi> of course someone could get smart and keep the disc stationary and make a head that spins faster
<daftykins> haha
<zmoylan-pi> and we could call it.... a hard disc... :-)
<daftykins> "...improvements can still be obtained using multiple laser pickups as demonstrated by the Kenwood TrueX 72Ã which uses seven laser beams and a rotation speed of approximately 10Ã."
<ali1234> it sounds like the spindle motor has a ball bearing rolling around inside it
<daftykins> what's the machine and the task? optical media seems like such a ghetto choice
<ali1234> how else am i supposed to install windows?
<zmoylan-pi> well... they are installing windows... :-)
<daftykins> ali1234: flash drive...
<ali1234> how do i put windows 10 install cd on a flash drive?
<daftykins> is the system legacy only?
<daftykins> non-EFI
<ali1234> no
<daftykins> ok, so format a drive as FAT32, extract the ISO contents into the root, preserving /boot and it'll be immediately EFI bootable
<zmoylan-pi> laptop or desktop?
<ali1234> it worked eventually
<zmoylan-pi> huzzah
<ali1234> i'm making a flash drive anyway
<zmoylan-pi> nothing worse than been onsite and having failures you could bypass in 10 minutes back at base
<ali1234> huh... it's showing the msi logo and underneath it says "getting ready"
<daftykins> yes the EFI systems are able to present the OEM logo merged with the Windows boot logo
<ali1234> okay what do i need to turn off on the first boot screen?
<daftykins> everything
<daftykins> and when it asks for an account there's a subtle option so you can avoid creating a Microsoft Account
<ali1234> even smartscreen?
<daftykins> well you can keep it if the user is not very bright, but it'll just be a hassle mostly
<ali1234> argh why is it so slow
<ali1234> oh, its getting everything ready for me
<daftykins> yeah it'll be hands off for a couple of mins even on a high end device
<ali1234> lol already got a weird error message in less than one minute after the desktop is up
<daftykins> never had issues here, could be your media - hope you installed the anniversary build :>
<daftykins> time for a good windows update lap
<daftykins> if you do the bare minimum to get on wifi, windows update will handle _all_ the drivers
<ali1234> i have to install drivers first because literally nothing works
<daftykins> or wired.
<daftykins> ok so just do one of the two then
<daftykins> no need for anything else
<ali1234> why is the cd drive i:
<daftykins> card readers?
<ali1234> ah yeah
<ali1234> loads of them
<daftykins> heh must be a multiformat sucker in there, mmm - in explorer empty drives are hidden by default now
<ali1234> that's cool
<daftykins> sometimes they're a safely removable USB device so i select that to remove it, change optical to D: again and then reboot
<zmoylan-pi> but a and b are still reserved in case you go mad and install 2 floppy drives? :-)
<daftykins> aww yis
<ali1234> well i could just unplug them from the motherboard
<ali1234> and do that
<daftykins> oh it's a desktop... well that's more effort than 2 clicks
<daftykins> also right clicking the start menu / super + X is a great shortcut to all the kinds of admin stuffs you want to get to on Windows typically
<ali1234> but how do i remove the USb device if there is nothing in it? other than unplugging it?
<daftykins> the safely remove icon in the system tray
<daftykins> *sometimes* it's an entry
<ali1234> they aren't shown there because there is nothing plugged in
<ali1234> no cards
<ali1234> actually i figured it out
<ali1234> devices and printers -> right click -> remove device
<daftykins> no that's not how it always works, sometimes it shows the parent reader
<daftykins> yeah that'll work!
<daftykins> kind of been doing Windows stuff for a fair time :>
<daftykins> sometimes amuses me how much ubuntu support i can give despite not even using it, too...
<daftykins> or should i say used to give :D
<ali1234> cool, it works
<ali1234> says it is updating onedrive
<daftykins> yip automatic from install, i disable that from startup in its' settings
<daftykins> the Windows Defender system tray icon can be disabled on the startup tab of task manager too, although it's probably handy to keep for noob users
<daftykins> so they know there's some level of protection
#ubuntu-uk 2016-09-15
<diddledan> I leave defender running personally
<diddledan> I don't do third-party av tho
<daftykins> diddledan: it just hides the icon
<daftykins> i find it ugly :P
<diplo> Morning all
<davmor2> Morning all
<czajkowski> aloha
<davmor2> czajkowski: you're alive
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<czajkowski> davmor2: just about :)
<davmor2> czajkowski: well if you will go on booze trains and then boozing in London what do you expect ;)
<czajkowski> I wasnt boozing in London
<czajkowski> I went to the Ubuntu meetup and had a diet coke!
<czajkowski> I had driven to the train station to get the train on time to get there
<davmor2> czajkowski: I'll let you off then :)
<czajkowski> gee thanks :)
<JamesTait> Good morning all!  Happy Thursday, and happy International Day of Democracy! ð
<diddledan> JamesTait: I didn't vote for that!
<TwistedLucidity> diddledan: That's how FPTP works, you never get what you want
<foobarry> any mosh users in here?
<TwistedLucidity> Me
<foobarry> thoughts?
<foobarry> can you scroll the screen?
<davmor2> JamesTait, diddledan: I think this covers it right https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YV4oYkIeGJc
<davmor2> JamesTait: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DU-RuR-qO4Y
<xnox> "Economy better than expected (hooray!) but biz investment still likely to be bad (boo!) and we're still probs going to cut rates. Lunch."
 * xnox giggles
<JamesTait> Not bad, davmor2, not bad. ð
<TwistedLucidity> foobarry: Yeah, it's just like SSH but a bit more resilient.
<TwistedLucidity> Problem I have right now is, mosh on CentOS 6.7 updated and demand Perl 5.14, but that's not available. Shall have to downgrade
<TwistedLucidity> I normally log into a Byobu session as well.
<diddledan> lots of lightning outside
<zmoylan-pi> saving the thunder for later? :-)
<diddledan> today's mr robot has me mindboggled
<diddledan> amazon are being overt with their advertising of the echo today: http://amzn.to/2cMbhDY
<zmoylan-pi> i was just thinking i want more hardware listening to me 24x7
<diddledan> well if you're not being listened-to by at least three people, or recording devices which are played to people later, then you're not modern
<zmoylan-pi> do other personalities count?
<diddledan> I can't wait until google get hacked and video of me in the nuddy gets leaked all over the internet
<diddledan> I know I've arrived when that happens
<zmoylan-pi> or your election campaign for president of the universe gets sidetracked...
<diddledan> meh, I'd rig the election anyway so it wouldn't matter
<diddledan> I wonder how busy the apple store in town is gonna be tomorrow...
<zmoylan-pi> shout 'stand back, he has a samsung' :-P
#ubuntu-uk 2016-09-16
<kram__> hi all
<popey> Morning
<SOFTA> #Pine64
<SOFTA> Is there any reason NOT to use Gparted to re-size partition 1 on an Android SD card ?
<popey> some devices want a very specific partition layout, yes
<popey> and if you futz with that, it can break boot
<SOFTA> I am leaving the boot partition alone  :-)
<SOFTA> I have a 15gb ext4 partition sitting next to 16gb of free space. Looks like prime real estate.
<davmor2> Morning all
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<diddledan> "who knew [the intelligence community] was afraid of Joseph Gordon-Levitt?" https://theintercept.com/2016/09/15/house-intel-panel-blasts-snowden-in-new-report-one-day-before-movie-release/
<JamesTait> Good morning all!  Happy Friday, and happy Working Parents' Day! ð
<diddledan> so. who wants a cheap home server? https://www.ixsystems.com/ixrack/
<davmor2> JamesTait: got you covered dude https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B32yjbCSVpU
<TwistedLucidity> diddledan: Can it run Crysis?
<Oli> With 30TB of RAM and 3200 CPU cores... You could probably teach it to build Crysis.
<zmoylan-pi> 30tb of ram... so chrome doesn't eat it all? :-)
<popey> wakka wakka wakka
<popey> comedy gold
<diddledan> ifixit are quick off the mark: https://9to5mac.com/2016/09/15/ifixit-teardown-reveals-exactly-what-replaced-the-iphone-7s-headphone-jack/
<zmoylan-pi>  i saw someone calculating how much more battery you could fir in the space taken by the audio jack.  it was less than what would be used by bt for listening to music for 5 plus hours
 * zmoylan-pi puts spare pair of headphones in bag to offer in sympathy to any iphone 7 user i see with flat headphones on public transport... :-)
<diddledan> they won't be able to use them :-p
<zmoylan-pi> it's funnier that way...
<diddledan> aanywho. I need to get going. got to see a guy about some work.
<zmoylan-pi> good luck o/
<diddledan> danke
<DJones> Nice car registration https://scontent-lhr3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/14232461_1209406015768151_714162736100123400_n.jpg?oh=813746d82d5d8858d76b6c86e9987948&oe=5843DEA8
<awilkins> Schweet
<awilkins> Networking question
<awilkins> With a docker spin
<awilkins> i) I am using docker ii) My computer is on a VPN iii) My VPN tool (rudely) doesn't use NM and overwrites /etc/resolv.conf instead
<awilkins> Docker copies /etc/resolv.conf into the docker containers
<awilkins> There is no route from the docker container network into the VPN, so all DNS lookups then fail
<awilkins> You can override docker to always use the local dnsmasq on your machine (yay!) that NM sets up
<awilkins> But that dnsmaq instance can't punt queries to the DNS servers on the VPN because it doesn't know about it
<awilkins> How can I instruct my NetworkManager instance of dnsmasq to do so?
<awilkins> (my preferred solution : someone fixes #1578193 and I can use strongswan instead of Shrewsoft VPN / ike-qtgui)
<awilkins> Answering own question : adding a config file to /etc/NetworkManager/dnsmasq.d/  with a line   `server=/my.corp.domain/*nameserver*` works nicely
<SebthreeBQM10HD> hi
<awilkins> Also adding `listen-address=<the docker bridge>` lets docker direct DNS queries to it
<awilkins> Sorted
<diddledan> zmoylan-pi: they liked me :-)
<zmoylan-pi> huzzah \o/
 * zmoylan-pi breaks out the non generic hobnobs to celebrate
<ali1234> my windows 10 insider install stopped working
<ali1234> it says winload.exe is not signed
<ali1234> i haven't booted it up in months
<zmoylan-pi> on plus side if it did boot how many gb of updates would it require... :-)
<ali1234> slightly fewer than it will need when i reinstall it?
<zmoylan-pi> true...
<zmoylan-pi> windows 10, testing your data caps... :-)
<ali1234> why does windows 10 hate numlock?
<MartijnVdS> doesi t?
<MartijnVdS> ali1234: if I had to guess, it's becuase tablets don't have numlock keys
<zmoylan-pi> i don't think i've seen a version of windows that didn't present some battle for some people who wanted num lock a certain way since win3.0
<ali1234> it won't allow you to turn on num lock by default
<zmoylan-pi> which annoys a lot of accountants
#ubuntu-uk 2016-09-17
<daftykins> works fine for me
<daftykins> 10 doesn't actually require many updates on a clean install
<daftykins> always with the pathetic comments from your freetards, yet you install ubuntu and need a huge number of updates
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<diddledan> moo
<SuperEngineer> quake
<diddledan> shiver
#ubuntu-uk 2016-09-18
<SuperEngineer> meow
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
 * SuperEngineer stops playing on Steam & looks out window.  Morning it is!
<brobostigon> :)
<SuperEngineer> Bug or cock-up?  Since updating 14.04 to 16.04, Nautilus "rotate image" [a function of nautilus-image-converter package] no longer works; rotate image does work.  Hurumph.
<SuperEngineer> dih!  I meant roteate doesn't work, *resize* does work [Hurumph]
<popey> I did wonder what you meant :)
<SuperEngineer> [& I appear to hve spelling finger problems - ehich is me not a bug ;-)  ]
<popey> it does sound like a bug
<popey> perhaps the extension needs updating?
<SuperEngineer> have removed package, resteated, reinstalled package.  All to no avail
<popey> no, i mean, speculating that the developer needs to update the extension
<SuperEngineer> popey: my reckoning is either a conflict I can't find or, indeed, a bug
<SuperEngineer> Anybody able to confirm whether this is me or a genuine buggy wuggy?
<SuperEngineer> popey: methinks you may well be correct :)
 * popey installs nautilus-image-converter
<SuperEngineer> thankyou
<popey> (nautilus:25866): Nautilus-Image-Converter-WARNING **: /usr/share/nautilus-image-converter/nautilus-image-rotate.ui:33:37 Invalid property: GtkDialog.has_separator
<popey> (nautilus:25866): Gtk-CRITICAL **: gtk_widget_show: assertion 'GTK_IS_WIDGET (widget)' failed
<popey> i see that in the terminal where I launched nautilus, when I use the rotate option
<SuperEngineer> oooooh!
<popey> https://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=2323811
<popey> that has a bodge
<popey> probably needs a bug filing and a patch
 * SuperEngineer checks the above
<popey> would file one at https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/nautilus-image-converter/+bugs
<popey> and if that ninja edit works, mention in the bug, let me have the bug number and I'll confirm
<popey> and maybe make a patch if I can figure that out :)
<SuperEngineer> Cheers, jsut about to do "the ninja".  May require a restart [it doesn't mention one though]
<popey> nah, just killall nautilus
<popey> then launch it again
<SuperEngineer> :-)
<SuperEngineer> It worked!
<SuperEngineer> popey: just found this already existing bug #1581094
<lubotu3`> bug 1581094 in One Hundred Papercuts "Rotate option fails to open dialog" [Low,Confirmed] https://launchpad.net/bugs/1581094
<SuperEngineer> and it says  Fix Released (9 comments) last updated 2016-06-26 view this bug
<SuperEngineer> I would dispute the availabilty of a fix in repo
<SuperEngineer> [but it claims it's for 16.04]
<SuperEngineer> Should a bug still be reported in view of the above, or would another "duplicate" be just another annoyance?
<popey> hm
<popey> I'd make a new bug, but mention the other bug in it
<SuperEngineer> I anticipated your answer and am currently doing so ;-)
<popey>     <property name="has_separator">False</property>
<popey> that line, I still see it on my installed package
<popey> so that patch wasn't applied
<popey> oh i see
<popey> it's fixed in 16.10 - yakkety
<popey> it needs backporting to xenial
<popey> yeah, doesn't need a new bug, sorry
<popey> just needs someone to actually do the backport SuperEngineer
 * SuperEngineer cancels bug report, then restarts new bug report requesting back port to 16.04 :-D
<popey> hah, no need
<popey> probably that bug is enough
<popey> have made a note, will look tomorrow
 * SuperEngineer cancels restarted backport bug report & decides to use the better option of: thanking popey ;-)
<SuperEngineer> [and sends telepathic note to popey to stop working Sundays and to have a virtual beer on me instead]
<popey> wise
<SuperEngineer> ;-)
<penguin42> hmm, EE are doubling the price of the payg deal I've been using - it might still be cheaper than anything else I can get
<penguin42> maybe 3's PAYG might work out cheapest at the 1p/MB
<penguin42> netcounter claims I only used 119MB in the last month and that included a week off which is higher
#ubuntu-uk 2017-09-11
<diplo> Morning all
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<diplo> Any update brobostigon ?
<brobostigon> diplo: yes, they said they found someone better who fits their requirements.
<diplo> bah, sorry to hear that.. but good luck in your search
<brobostigon> :)
<popey> Hello Team!
<diplo> Afternoon popey - back now ?
<popey> Nope, still in gay paris
<diplo> Nice, not my fave city, but love france
<diplo> Having fun ?
<brobostigon> good food and wine, whats not too like, :)
<zmoylan-pi> the looks of pity when people realise you're british? :-P
<popey> been a very busy weekend, UbuCon was great.
<popey> We ran a couple of snapcraft workshops which went well.
<diplo> brobostigon: The parisians :) people in France are great, been visiting for 30+ years.. only met a few Parisians I like :)
<brobostigon> diplo: ah, :)
<diddledan> popey: was there anything worth recording for youtube? and if so were those things recorded for youtube?
<popey> i think a few were recorded by the ubuntufun german guys
 * diddledan likes boobtubing tech stuff
<popey> not all though
<ali1234> anyone dealt with fedex importing stuff?
<ali1234> i'm trying to set up an account with them so i don't have to pay their advancement fee on top of the VAT
<ali1234> if i try to google this all i get is people complaining about it because they didn't set up an account
<ali1234> their online chat wasn't super helpful either
<diddledan> "I'm sorry Mr Ali, I don't know what bitty coin is"
 * diddledan goes for some icy cream
<daftykins> diddledan: :O where?!
<zmoylan-pi> he's pouring a speedbump and looting the ice cream van when it passes...
<diddledan> :-p
<daftykins> genius!
<zmoylan-pi> feels better when you earn the loot... :-)
<diddledan> whether you earn it or not, who can be bothered paying?!
<diddledan> so much easier to just nick it all
<diddledan> weird. a company locally I do work for has a bug where apache will sigsegv every friday
<daftykins> haha :D
<daftykins> it takes the weekends off as well eh
<diddledan> aye
<daftykins> what're you running on their kit, OS wise?
<zmoylan-pi> cleaner running the hoover beside their server at those times? :-)
<daftykins> or an employee with a very static generating outfit on? as per The Register's Friday "On-Call" segment
<zmoylan-pi> ah, mr. polyester is back...
<MooDoo> howdy all
<daftykins> \o
<daftykins> how goes it?
<MooDoo> yeah not bad thanks :) just installed aardvard to see what the daily build is like.
<MooDoo> *aardvark
<daftykins> ooh-err
<MooDoo> loving the transparency
<MooDoo> :)
<foobarry> given that ipplayer requires a login, does anyone know how this affects get_iplayer?
<daftykins> does it fail?
<brobostigon> there are two parameters for get-iplayer, --bbciplayer-username --bbciplayer-password or something along those lines.
<brobostigon> thats streamlink i was thinking of, sorry.
<brobostigon> my apologies.
<foobarry> dunno yet, but the website just started asking for a login
<daftykins> oh so it was only today? mmm
<daftykins> well i won't pay for a TV license since i don't have a broadcast service here at all, so that means no more BBC for me beyond radio!
<zmoylan-pi> they were looking at bringing in licence fee here in ireland even if you didn't have a tv buy had a tablet, laptop that could stream tv from web...
<daftykins> ah yeah, i think the Dutch or Danes pay a mandatory tax on top of their broadband services
<zmoylan-pi> and canada at one time had a tax on blank media usb drives because those thieving canadians were going to fill them with illegal mp3s...
<daftykins> tsk tsk!
<daftykins> Eau my... https://www.theregister.co.uk/2017/09/11/gemini_psion_alike_pre_production_prototype_handson/
<zmoylan-pi> it does look nice....
<zmoylan-pi> i'd prefer linux instead of android but you can't have everything...
<daftykins> says on page 2 it dual boots?
<zmoylan-pi> ooh, missed that... i do remember the kickstarter was linux but i stopped reading earlier when i saw android...
<daftykins> ;)
<Gargoyle> Can anyone offer any advice on crackling mic recording on a realtek HD audio (Shows ad HD-Audio Generic). I've done some googling and found some intel related tweaks relating to modprobe and pulseaudio, but none that work.
<Gargoyle> Hardware is good, recordings are crystal clear under Windows.
#ubuntu-uk 2017-09-12
<Gargoyle> Mornin all
<diplo> Morning
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<SuperMatt> morning
<brobostigon> morning SuperMatt
<MooDoo> howdy all
<SuperMatt> I've only gone and installed arch on my main box :/
<zmoylan-pi> calmy reach for the os/2 installation box and hit yourself on the head with it... :-P
<MooDoo> :)
<popey> morning
<MooDoo> howdy popey , how are you this fine day?
<popey> Super
<MooDoo> good good
<popey> Glad to be home
<MooDoo> holiday or sprint somewhere?
<popey> UbuCon Paris
<popey> :)
<MooDoo> nice
<foobarry> just had a recaptcha that wanted a german  Ã symbol
<zmoylan-pi> wait till it goes full unicode emojii...
<MooDoo> I saw somewhere the other day that had a chess game as a captcha )
<foobarry> knight to c4
<MooDoo> https://nakedsecurity.sophos.com/2013/03/12/chess-captcha/
<MooDoo> foobarry: yeah that's pretty much it lol
<zmoylan-pi> but what if the person has never played chess....
<MooDoo> Well as long as they refer to prawns and horseys then i'll be fine.
<diplo> popey: x220 - would you still recommend for a child to use ?
<popey> my kids use my x220
<popey> it's starting to get a bit long in the tooth for some things
<popey> e.g. minecraft & roblox
<diplo> Ah great, found one for a price I can afford on ebay
<diplo> Mainly for school, but they do play those games, has ssd/8gb ram
<popey> same spec as mine
<diplo> Core i5 ?
<popey> i7
<diplo> Oh shit :D
<diplo> oops
<diplo> Â£184.99, sound reasonable for that spec ?
<popey> i have seen x230 for 150 in cex
<popey> https://uk.webuy.com/product.php?sku=SLAPLENX23006B
<popey> i would certainly consider x230/240 if possible
<diplo> I keep forgetting about CEX, never used one
<MooDoo> might be interesting for the kids at home if they are also available around here
<popey> there's a few cex round here. i often pop in to look at laptops to get a feel for what's available. there are often thinkpads in there alongside expensive macs and crappy other laptops
<MooDoo> looking at the map there are 3 in nottingham
 * Laney stabs virgin media
<Laney> "your bill will be going up" nastygram
<MooDoo> Laney: I did that last year and went to sky lol
<Laney> :/
<diplo> I just moved from Sky to Virgin :)
<Laney> hope you like regular phoning to neotiate your price back down :(
<diddledan> I'm with A&A
<Laney> what cap / how much?
<diddledan> expensive :-p
<Laney> they seem competent
<Laney> but Â£Â£Â£ if you want a decent amount
<diddledan> I pay them more because I trust them more
 * Laney has a debian/ubuntu mirror running here ._.
<diddledan> they're currently looking at increasing some of their usage limits under the same price: https://aa.net.uk/broadband-home1.html
<diplo> Laney: Sky are worse for that, I will cancel as of 12 months and go to freeview
<diplo> That is certainly pricey, I use that much with Netflix/Amazon alone for A&As limits
<diplo> But I know they give a good service
<MooDoo> I've had no problems with sky, the only issue is the speed, until i move 15mb is the fastest i get
<diplo> I could get Fibre but only had adsl ( 6mb ) because they charged me Â£76 p/m and yet my work colleague on exactly the same package apart from had Fibre was paying Â£40
<diplo> And neightbour same again for Â£42, the guy on the phone said I can offer you Â£55, I asked him if he'd heard a word I had said and told him to cancel
<foobarry> my brother in law seems to use CEX as a computer lending library
<diplo> I must have been contacted 5 times since telling me it's not to late...
<MooDoo> i wished i lived in the b4rn area so I could get 1gbit down and up
<MooDoo> https://b4rn.org.uk/
<diplo> Â£30 a month!
<MooDoo> yup.....
<diddledan> I don't get what the difference is between each b4rn service tier
<diddledan> the home service is "Suitable for homes and micro-businesses with less than 6 employees, small schools". So why is that cheaper than Small Business service when they look to be the exact same deal under different price
<diddledan> and what about the home service makes it more suitable for homes than the small business deal?
<diplo> Amount of staff for the small business I guess
<MooDoo> who cares when you get gigabit for Â£30 a month,
<diddledan> I don't like that term: "5.1.10 You agree to sign any agreement reasonably required by the owner of the copyright in any software which we provide to you to enable you to use the Services." <-- even if I don't approve of the terms within?!
<diplo> Reasonably required will get you out of some stuff I guess diddledan - but I don't like things like that either
<diplo> but to hand wavy
<diddledan> apparently sex robots are gonna kill us all: http://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/latest-news/643302/sex-robots-hackers-killer-cyborgs-technology-elon-musk-artificial-intelligence-world-war-3
<MooDoo> as soon as skynet cums online ;)
 * diddledan groans (and not in the good way)
<MooDoo>  badum tish
<MooDoo> oh i do like Aardvark :)
<diddledan> yeah?
<diddledan> I haven't tried it yet
<diddledan> who's watching the apple thingy later?
<MooDoo> yeah it's nice, like all the transparency of the menus
 * MooDoo shakes his head, stopped caring about apple years ago!
<diddledan> :-)
<MooDoo> besides I'm sure the leak has informed everyone what's coming along
<diddledan> it's nice to see what everyone will be citing as next gen features that they don't realise have been a thing for years - like waterproofing over the last year
<diddledan> omg I can use it in the rain. I can't buy a phone without it now
<MooDoo> half the stuff samsung has been doing for ages
<diddledan> I still want AR in my eyeballs (nothing external)
<Seeker`> diddledan: not looked at the site, but I could imagine SLA would be different for different tiers
<Azelphur> I broke another thing, this time, weatherspoons. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_9j69RAR9fc
<Azelphur> ended up having to wait over an hour for food because of that one xD
<foobarry> unattended ubuntu installs FTW
<MooDoo> om goodness, just realised i've been part of the ubuntu uk comminity for nearly 11 years on the 16th Sept!!!!
<popey> woohoo
<popey> time flies :)
<MooDoo> yeah it does indeed
<diddledan> how do you break a pub?!
<diddledan> and what evil bar steward would do such a beastly act?!
<MooDoo> huh?
<diddledan> ref: Azelphur
<Azelphur> diddledan: I know, I'm terrible xD
<Azelphur> diddledan: but yea app allows you to order breakfast after 12 if you search for it as opposed to go via the breakfast menu :P
<daftykins> every restaurant should know that an all-day full english breakfast is mandatory
<diddledan> omg the children!
<diddledan> sorry
<daftykins> diddledan: all ready for a CrApple-tastic event?
<diddledan> yup
<diddledan> interesting topic which spawned my exclamation: https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/reject-names-with-expletives/2084
<daftykins> aww your reply got moderated
<diddledan> curiously that was merely a suggestion that Mr S should wield the banhammer on our behalf. it wasn't offensive
<diddledan> they left my comment in that post that the statement shouldn't be read seriously, though
<daftykins> definitely one of those messy topics, glad i don't sit in a position of responsibility over such things :)
<daftykins> diddledan: you wouldn't want to go making a... snap decision
 * daftykins runs
<diddledan> get your coat
<diddledan> (you've pulled?)
<daftykins> ooh-err i hope not
<diddledan> I pulled a muscle once
<diddledan> it hurt
<daftykins> my window lead got dressed this morning \o/ http://i.imgur.com/YGTd3YK.jpg
<daftykins> just need some finishing touches now, then it'll be another painting task
<diddledan> nice and insulated by the looks
<diddledan> were you on single-glazing before?
<daftykins> yeah original windows from this place, so super thin glass too
<daftykins> now they actually shut :>
<diddledan> I'm betting you'll notice a somewhat large drop in heating
<diddledan> bill*
<daftykins> hoping so, been about Â£5k of insulation inside too
<diddledan> nice
<diddledan> really going to town on the work! :-D
<daftykins> still got a large hole on one side due to the roof leak damge works though
<diddledan> :-(
<daftykins> yip! it was really obscene prior, it'd get down to within a couple of degrees of outside
<diddledan> ouch
<daftykins> really hoping it'll be a drastic change that'll stop me burning so much money on gas for the winter stints, mmm
<diddledan> when are you due to get it signed-off? (is it gonna be ready in time for this year's winter?)
<daftykins> i don't think there's too much to do, nothing is going on right now as i'm waiting on the reports to come in from the timber treatment guy and the engineer for the state of the roof beam that got a fair bit rotten
<daftykins> oh and then the insurance adjuster's say on those reports, too - since they involve more spending
<diddledan> your insurance guys must love you :-p
<diddledan> "damn, mr D. Kins has yet another claim?!"
<daftykins> originally i was going to have to start #3 as there seemed to be a leak on the rear too, but the timber guy reckoned no
<diddledan> phew
<diddledan> they'll black ball you :-D
<daftykins> i've been quite lucky really as all this stuff wouldn't have been uncovered unless i had made certain decisions
<daftykins> super jammy to have told the guys to rip down the existing plasterboard on a heavily rainy day and spot it dripping in...
 * diddledan tries to figure out all those negatives
<diddledan> is it apple time yet?
<daftykins> 6pm i think
<diddledan> yeah
<diddledan> is it 6pm yet?
<daftykins> nope :P
<diddledan> :-p
<daftykins> have you spoken to shauno yet? :P
<diddledan> nope. I donno where he hangs these days
<diddledan> and we're back to my joke (which got moderated) https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/reject-names-with-expletives/2084/41?u=daniel
<daftykins> i reckon it does reflect negatively
<diddledan> I wonder what it's like to actually type on: https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/azio-industry-first-luxury-vintage-keyboard#/
<daftykins> methinks not good
<zmoylan-pi> if it has the spring and bounce of the original 18th 19th century typewriters it's not to bad...
 * zmoylan-pi used a mechanical typewriter a bit
<diddledan> it looks like there's a lot of travel to actually get the key to register a press
<zmoylan-pi> a lot of travel is in a mechanical typewriter were it can feel you need to press a whole inch :-)
<diddledan> those mechanisms look like industrial/arcade push-button
<zmoylan-pi> but i did hate the shift and capslock buttons as they lifted the whole mechanism and required some effort
<diddledan> you couldn't use your pinky for the shift key until you'd built some muscle :-p
<zmoylan-pi> on plus side the average secretary could crush walnuts with her pinky...
<diddledan> bad news for her boyfriend
<diddledan> or his boyfriend
<diddledan> looks like that keyboard is using switches like these: http://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/push-button-switches/9138895/
<daftykins> not standard Cherry MX's then, hrmm
<zmoylan-pi> what i want in a keyboard is simple.  1) all the keys in right place 2) ability to rest hands on keys without pressing them 3) comfy typing...
<diddledan> for reference: https://c1.iggcdn.com/indiegogo-media-prod-cld/image/upload/c_limit,w_620/v1501781016/fmrvoegiay3nz4dbrenn.jpg
<daftykins> yeah you can't get #1 anymore :( they all futz with the proper layout in one way or another
<zmoylan-pi> 4) wired keyboard 5) doesn't require firmware upgrades
<diddledan> aah they have a section on the switches further down the page: "AZIO Typelit Mechanical Switch" with a travel of 3.6mm
<diddledan> +/- 0.3mm
<diddledan> so it could be as much as 3.9mm
<zmoylan-pi> i do like a clicky keyboard that lets me hear when it's done it's thing but it's incompatible with insomnia and typing at 3am...
<diddledan> wat? it's got a switch to flip between "mac" and "pc"
<daftykins> or anyone being near you :D
<daftykins> probably swaps super and alt
<diddledan> yeah it looks to be the layout it modifies
<diddledan> they give you mac-style key caps too, so you can pop the right label on
<zmoylan-pi> that would be more distracting to me than just using the same layout...
<daftykins> i'd rather just get platform agnostic supers :>
<diddledan> super!
<zmoylan-pi> though i've started to see wireless keyboards with pc, mac, ios, android switches on them which i think are meant for switching between different hardware on the fly which look interesting
<diddledan> is it apple time yet?
<zmoylan-pi> immediately after the 5 minute meeting you have ahead... :-)
 * diddledan wanders off for some crumpet
<daftykins> diddledan: i'm never prepared for those horrible lines "and we can't wait to show our new junk to you!"
<zmoylan-pi> i'm already thinking of this one as the iphone lisa due to it's ridulous price...
<daftykins> was the lisa dear back in the day?
<diddledan> wasn't it around 1500$ back then?
<daftykins> old money?
<diddledan> I'm way off, in old money: "it underwent many changes during the development period before shipping at the very high price of US$9,995" cf. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_Lisa
<daftykins> whaaaaaaaaaaaaat
<diddledan> 2016 equiv is estimated at $24000
<zmoylan-pi> great machine no one used because it was stupidly expensive... now the new iphone cost will be absorbed by the contract people get it on but still a lot of dosh
<zmoylan-pi> even when jobs left he came up with the next which started at $5000 iirc
<diddledan> of course, the next box is credited with the dubious honour of keeping objective C alive
<diddledan> if next hadn't run objc and therefore osx didn't we'd never have to live with such evilness :-p
<zmoylan-pi> also the worlds first web server iirc
<diddledan> yes, I believe Tim Berners-Lee _did_ use a next station to build his child
<diddledan> we could ask him. Tim, you're in here, right? :-p
<zmoylan-pi> be careful, one word and he could have you banished from the web...
<zmoylan-pi> no more cat videos for diddledan....
<daftykins> :D
<daftykins> i'll have to bootleg him some snaps of Mischief nipping about the house instead
<zmoylan-pi> he'll have to use ascii art via irc...
<zmoylan-pi> =^..^=
<diddledan> :-o
<diddledan> I'll go onto gopher
<daftykins> hrmm i have a final bill from the plumbers again for the bathroom insurance job, i *could* submit it to the insurers to pay, as they did finally come and resolve the broken sink plug... but their shower installation was rubbish
<daftykins> thing is do i really want to sit and wade through yet another bout of trying to get them to put it right o0
<diddledan> is it time?
<daftykins> don't make us get Tim
<diddledan> daftykins: that sounds like a sticky one - either you get the same guys to come back and keep the insurance happy or you get alternative guys and the insurace says wtf-chuck?
<diddledan> how many plumbers are there on the island?
 * zmoylan-pi sends diddledan a nice koala image to calm them down... @( * O * )@
<daftykins> i was half pondering videoing the iffy installation and running it by the manufacturer
<diddledan> doo eet
<diddledan> http://www.subaruoutback.org/forums/attachments/classifieds/258689d1458145355-fs-enkei-ekm3-18x7-5-45-5x100-w-235-50-18-tucson-az-doo-eet.jpg
<zmoylan-pi> they'll probably rate it by tea drunk and bum cleavage on display...
<diddledan> https://cdn-az.allevents.in/banners/a683a788e6c3869ff847d8e6f2431828
<daftykins> with all this waiting, this extremely white page is blinding me
<diddledan> somehow google also gave me this when I searched for those images: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2vxF58KYbMM
<zmoylan-pi> put on your apple rose coloured iglasses... a snip at $999
 * daftykins kills that one in seconds
<diddledan> it lasted seconds??!
<diddledan> right. time to reboob
<Laney> looking ominously grey out there
<zmoylan-pi> probably one of the exciting new colours for the new iphone :-)
<daftykins> winter approacheth
<zmoylan-pi> i'm in ireland.  winter landed with a damp splat weeks back...
<Laney> http://www.metoffice.gov.uk/public/weather/forecast/gcrjm8jf7 /o\
 * Laney ventures out nevertheless
<zmoylan-pi> a slight spot of rain there... http://www.meteoradar.co.uk/
<daftykins> tis but a drip!
<daftykins> Apple must still be finding the wall sockets in the new building...
<zmoylan-pi> they forgot the adaptor for the charger...
<daftykins> ah yep
<zmoylan-pi> or the adaptor for the adaptor...
<zmoylan-pi> it's adaptors all the way down...
<diddledan> turtle-shaped ones
<zmoylan-pi> of course at a very reasonable $19.99
<diddledan> 50% YoY growth of the watch?
<daftykins> its not that big! ;D
<diddledan> they're ahead of rolex now
<zmoylan-pi> in 20 years times those rolexes will still work :-)
<daftykins> indeed
<daftykins> Woz is there!
<diddledan> I was about to say that
<daftykins> ;)
<diddledan> they must be proud if they brought him in
<zmoylan-pi> probably to open the steve jobs auditorium
<daftykins> i wonder if he still wears his nixie tube watch
<zmoylan-pi> it's woz, he probably has a different one for every day of the month...
<zmoylan-pi> i wonder if he arrived by segway...
<diddledan> cellooler
<m0nkey_> You guys watching this crap?
<daftykins> yep
<daftykins> gotta know thy enemy
<diddledan> or even your enema
<m0nkey_> Didn't ASUS already do this with a smart watch?
<m0nkey_> BUT APPLE DID IT FIRST!
<daftykins> a moment ago Apple even invented calling emergency services
<m0nkey_> Holy crap! A TALKING WATCH
<diddledan> siri can talk?!
<m0nkey_> https://www.maxiaids.com/tel-time-iv-talking-watch-english-unisex-black
<m0nkey_> Yes, that's right. You can get a talking watch for $10
<m0nkey_> Not a $1000
<diddledan> they finally did away with the simcard
<m0nkey_> calling it now
<m0nkey_> new iphone doesn't have a sim card slot
<daftykins> well she nearly escaped the firm, but not quite
<diddledan> so the watch gives me impeccable balance?
<diddledan> grey?!
<daftykins> zmoylan-pi: wow you called it, they're adding the colour grey!
<daftykins> :D
<diddledan> swim poop?
<m0nkey_> So, expensive.
<diddledan> bug grey!
<diddledan> but*
<diddledan> they've also invented the zune
<daftykins> this silly fella doesn't know it's rude to skate in public
<m0nkey_> I had to use Microsoft Edge to watch the stream. How screwed up that is. Why can I not use Firefox or something?!
<diddledan> me too
<m0nkey_> Calling it.. 4K
<daftykins> you're not calling it XD it's been on all the tech sites as leaked for weeks
<m0nkey_> And some kind of intergration with a cable company
<m0nkey_> heh
<m0nkey_> I've not been following any of that crap
<diddledan> US-only
<diddledan> the cable tie-in I mean
<daftykins> can't avoid the headlines sadly :<
<diddledan> maybe something with disney
<diddledan> yup, 4k
<diddledan> and hdr
<diddledan> moar pixies!
<m0nkey_> lol
<m0nkey_> better pixels
<daftykins> don't clap! it wasn't them!
<m0nkey_> looks the same to me
<m0nkey_> image on the right looks more saturated
<diddledan> how do you show the benefit of HDR on a non-HDR monitor?!
<daftykins> nah it is decent, but it's certainly nothing they've done
<daftykins> just fiddle the colours a bit :D it does show
<daftykins> in photos of screens anyway :P
<diddledan> lol, spiderman looks fun
<diddledan> that's gonna be my takeaway
<daftykins> what restaurant do you go to for a spiderman takeaway? ;)
<diddledan> arachnids
<diddledan> ooh, autoupgrade
<m0nkey_> here we go
<m0nkey_> told you some kind of integration with a broadcaster
<diddledan> :-)
<daftykins> not exactly crystal ball work ;)
<diddledan> m0nkey_: you've got crystal balls?! :-o
<m0nkey_> you're telline me you dont?
<diddledan> no, mine are all meaty and covered in tomato sauce
<m0nkey_> you might want to get that checked
<diddledan> lol
<daftykins> i don't think he could pay anyone enough ;)
<m0nkey_> here we go
<m0nkey_> no sim card slot
<diddledan> it's circular
<m0nkey_> 64gb minimum
<m0nkey_> no charging port
<m0nkey_> only wireless charging
<diddledan> no ports at all
<m0nkey_> I had a tooth cavity filled around 11, should be okay to eat now, right? (3 hours ago)
<diddledan> they went with "8"
<diddledan> some pundits reckoned on them choosing X
<m0nkey_> glass
<m0nkey_> didn't i just say wireless charging?
<diddledan> BIONIC!?!
<diddledan> OMG, CYBORGS!
<diddledan> poor imation
<diddledan> apple-designed GPU
<m0nkey_> fuuu.. trying to eat and i can't feel anything
<m0nkey_> wish this anasthetic would wear off already
<diddledan> what's a deep pixel?
<daftykins> X might yet be another model :>
<m0nkey_> it's like a normal pixel, but deeper
<m0nkey_> great ass
<diddledan> "monitors movement.. to optimise the encoding" <-- sooo, a standard h265 encoder then
<m0nkey_> wait. i've used AR on a phone before
<diddledan> didn't red dwarf invent ar back in the 90s?
<diddledan> complete with groinal attachment
<daftykins> that was VR :P
<diddledan> they called it AR
<daftykins> hmm different word for A?
<m0nkey_> Actual Reality they called it in Red Dwarf
<daftykins> heh :>
<diddledan> Artificial*
<m0nkey_> or whatever ^^
<diddledan> :-p
<m0nkey_> it'll be funny if the headphone jack is back
<m0nkey_> wireless charging
<m0nkey_> and like you said diddledan, no ports..lol
<daftykins> cafes XD
<m0nkey_> and i bet your ass, it's a new wireless charging standard and not using this Qi
<m0nkey_> wow
<m0nkey_> THEY'RE USING A STANDARD!!!!
<diddledan> butter me!
<diddledan> ANY Qi CHARGER?!
<diddledan> that's nuts
<diddledan> how dare they be interoperable!!
<diddledan> you were right about 64GB
<daftykins> $$$
<m0nkey_> huh, so no integrated sim card?
<m0nkey_> here we go
<daftykins> 10 years no less
<m0nkey_> iphone X
<m0nkey_> lol
<m0nkey_> VR
<m0nkey_> ?
<daftykins> just OLED and no more home button even :P
<diddledan> it is X!
<m0nkey_> kiss your sim card goodbye
<daftykins> pretty sure modern iPad models have used the eSIM thing for a while
<daftykins> maybe only in the US though, dunno
<m0nkey_> bet it costs over $1000
<daftykins> they can't get enough good displays so the scalpers will be happy ;)
<m0nkey_> lol
<m0nkey_> my G6 does that
<m0nkey_> its in the screen
<diddledan> face
<diddledan> no fingerprint
<m0nkey_> hello.. android did this already
<daftykins> yeah but Apple invented it *groan*
<daftykins> ;D
<daftykins> brb
<diddledan> aww, tom cruise is gonna be out of a job. they can't use masks to fool facial id now
<m0nkey_> fail
<m0nkey_> that black notch would get annoying
<daftykins> i think he's having a bit too much fun there
 * m0nkey_ sighs
<diddledan> it's Jonny Ive time
<m0nkey_> i've not seen a sim card slot yet
<daftykins> "rawr you didn't pay your phone bill yet!"
<m0nkey_> LOL
<m0nkey_> https://imgur.com/pvc7mjU
<m0nkey_> stock dropped when it didn't work
<diddledan> wat
<diddledan> that's a bit cracray
<m0nkey_> geez.. a grand
<m0nkey_> They've not killed the SE or 6 yet?
<m0nkey_> Lol
<m0nkey_> Did you see Stephen Fry?
<diddledan> I was about to ask whether I just saw him
<daftykins> it's so fitting that someone who doesn't properly get tech but is just a fan of it, is there
<daftykins> wonder if macOS news will spill out, that actually relates to a job i've got coming up
<m0nkey_> diddledan: do I buy this? https://www.netgate.com/products/sg-3100.html
<daftykins> heh deja vu :>
<m0nkey_> I've not bought anything yet
<diddledan> I think I prefer that over the apu
<diddledan> partly because being netgate it helps fund pfsense dev
<m0nkey_> It'll come to $466 with shipping
<m0nkey_> Seems expensive for a router. lol
<daftykins> but ARM ;x
<diddledan> ARM is gonna kill Intel
<diddledan> nobody wants a PC anymore
<diddledan> it's all about the Internet of Poo
<daftykins> oh indeed, Apple's event showed us that
<daftykins> animated poo!
<diddledan> I, for one, can't wait until my toilet is connected into the internet reporting on twitter how squidgy it was
<daftykins> the NHS can :>
<daftykins> BBC News at Ten: more funding has been requested by the NHS in order to staff the monitoring of diddledan's new toilet
<m0nkey_> bah, even with the hotfix.
<m0nkey_> [ ID] Interval           Transfer     Bandwidth       Jitter    Lost/Total Datagrams
<m0nkey_> [  4]   0.00-10.00  sec  23.6 MBytes  19.8 Mbits/sec  3.962 ms  1903/3003 (63%)
<m0nkey_> [  4] Sent 3003 datagrams
<m0nkey_> 63% loss on UDP
<m0nkey_> If I drop the bandwidth down to 1Mbit/sec
<m0nkey_> I get zero loss
<daftykins> what was that story again, duff ISP device?
<m0nkey_> The Ubiquiti Edge Router
<m0nkey_> The UDP loss is why I want to get shot of it
<m0nkey_> No way should I be getting 63% packlet loss with UDP
<m0nkey_> you think 8GB RAM in a pfSense box is overkill?
<daftykins> yep
<m0nkey_> ok, 2GB then?
<daftykins> probably would be plenty
<daftykins> hrmm if i wanted a properly decent quality cinema experience in England, given Guernsey just has a town crier shout the plot at you for cinema... is it IMAX on top, then Odeon, then Vue?
<diddledan> daftykins: I believe IMAX is considered the best, but I've never been
<diddledan> between odeon and vue, I think it's "pays your money and takes your choice"
<daftykins> diddledan: mmmhrmm
<daftykins> bit bold to hop on the boat and nip up just for a film, mind
<m0nkey_> So I now appear to be running pfSense
<diddledan> :-o
<m0nkey_> UDP packet loss is much lower.
<diddledan> how'd you wangle that?
<m0nkey_> Using an old PC
<diddledan> aah
<diddledan> yey for old PCs
<m0nkey_> It's a stop gap until I get a replacement for the ER
<daftykins> :>
<daftykins> crazy question but with the wonky one, does it work fine if you use a TCP VPN?
<m0nkey_> Yeah, no problem
<daftykins> weird device
<m0nkey_> I'm in the market for a new router. Aside from the APU2 and ready made pfSense boxes.. suggestions?
<m0nkey_> No, I don't want an ASUS, Netgear, D-Link or whatever.
<daftykins> no consumer tat, mmm
<m0nkey_> Exactly
<daftykins> i think you're overthinking this XD
<m0nkey_> Blame Ubiquiti for this :D
<daftykins> are they doing anything about owning up to the issue etc?
<m0nkey_> A "firmware" fix was supposed to be available this month
<m0nkey_> But they've been very quiet lately
<m0nkey_> So this old PC has pushed my power consumption from 81W to 97W
<daftykins> :O
<m0nkey_> That's for the whole rack
<m0nkey_> Not just for that PC
<m0nkey_> lol
<daftykins> think my file server + router + switch + phone bridge comes in at around that
<m0nkey_> So that total includes: pfSense, FreeNAS, switch, PoE injector for wifi, VoIP ATA
<daftykins> ATA that's what i was trying to remember
<m0nkey_> With the ER running the PoE for the wifi, it totals at 81W
<m0nkey_> This is why I'm looking for something low power, such as the pfSense ARM thing
<zmoylan-pi> but winter is coming... :-)
<m0nkey_> Yeah. Don't remind me.
<daftykins> but you can just heat the family over the top o' the thing ;)
<zmoylan-pi> break out a bag of marshmallows and have a sing a long...
<m0nkey_> I'm still tempted by the APU
<daftykins> it's been nice enough for my clients setup
<daftykins> at least, once i find out why they havent been able to get it online :D bloody PPPoA auth for movistar's fiber
<m0nkey_> daftykins: Did you order direct from PCEngines?
<daftykins> nah linitx.com
<diddledan> linitx are the UK distributor, so I guess it counts as almost direct
<daftykins> ;D
<daftykins> i just went where me mate Dave recommended
<daftykins> which is amusing given i am also a Dave
<diddledan> as is m0nkey_
<daftykins> no wai
<daftykins> oi Dave
<m0nkey_> Hi Dave
<daftykins> :D
<diddledan> https://pbs.twimg.com/profile_images/514480991952699392/RkBBZpB2.jpeg
<m0nkey_> that's creepy
<diddledan> yes. yes it is
<m0nkey_> I'm on Twitter should you want to follow.. https://twitter.com/DavieDavieDave
<diddledan> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qkiix0aveRk
<m0nkey_> Needs more JPEG
<m0nkey_> This is the right one? https://www.pcengines.ch/apu2c4.htm
<daftykins> sure looks familiar
<daftykins> only thing the client didn't like was the default beeps on startup/shutdown/disconnect/etc as it apparently woke them up :D very quickly turned those off though (or so i thought)
<m0nkey_> it beeps?
<daftykins> ja
<daftykins> the build i have with just the SD card is incredibly slow booting
<m0nkey_> I'll be getting the mSATA SSD
<daftykins> yip
<daftykins> time for bed, ta-ra \o
<zmoylan-pi> o/
<m0nkey_> Cya
#ubuntu-uk 2017-09-13
<MooDoo> howdy all
<Gargoyle> o/
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<Gargoyle> what about us Aliens, brobostigon?
<brobostigon> those too, :)
<brobostigon> multi'gendered aliens?
<Gargoyle> :D
<MooDoo> howdy howdy
<brobostigon> morning MooDoo
<Gargoyle> o/
<MooDoo> howdy brobostigon Gargoyle
<diplo> Morning all
<MooDoo> howdy diplo, how's tricks?
<diplo> Not to bad thanks, sat on a train heading to the big smoke
<diplo> yourself ?
<MooDoo> yeah i'm ok thanks, just reading up on that bluetooth bluebourne thing
<diplo> ooh whats that then ?
<diplo> Sorry, dodgy line :)
<MooDoo> https://www.armis.com/blueborne/
<MooDoo> hacking bluetooth devices really
<diplo> ooh interesting
 * diplo saves that for the way back
<zmoylan-pi> now all those phones with out head phone jacks are vulnerable :-)
<diplo> Right better packlaptopaway
<MooDoo> later
<zmoylan-pi> you need a smaller irc doohickey :-)
<zmoylan-pi> in another channel iphones facial recognigition is a reason not to buy iphone x for his twin teenage daughters... :-P
<diddledan> zmoylan-pi: twins? what could go wrong?!
<zmoylan-pi> well for iphone x all twins are evil :-)
<zmoylan-pi> especially when teenager
<diddledan> https://www.macrumors.com/2017/09/13/doubts-speculation-face-id-fail-iphone-x-keynote/
<diddledan> haha, the adverts on that page as I loaded it are all for samsung via the carphone warehouse
<zmoylan-pi> there are adverts on web pages?!
<diddledan> what's a web page?
<diddledan> is that like Internet Explorer?
<zmoylan-pi> sure, you just view them in netscape excel...
<diddledan> I was talking to Joe the other day and he said that netscape are going communist
<diddledan> something to do with open hippies
 * diddledan strokes his neckbeard
<m0nkey_> hippy
<diddledan> err.. https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel-discuss/2017-September/017670.html
<diddledan> how about you configure your own system how you want it?!
<diddledan> IMO that is merely a sysadmin fail
<MooDoo> yup me too
<diddledan> the BFG: https://twitter.com/IamHappyToast/status/907970755937304576
<diddledan> jeepus, America! https://twitter.com/make5calls/status/907976554541596672
<diddledan> I wonder why we're drawn to stories about dystopias
<diddledan> maybe it's a reinforcement thing that what we're watching proves that our world can still get much worse
<Laney> "your ISA money could be earning a market leading variable rate of 1.15% tax-free p.a./AER"
<Laney> jokers
<diddledan> daftykins: zmoylan-pi : I hope shauno doesn't see https://youtu.be/sjlHnJvXdQs
<zmoylan-pi> people are already saying they're going to buy it
<zmoylan-pi> once the sale of their kidney on ebay goes through of course...
<zmoylan-pi> when you consider for many people that their phone has replaced their laptop for most of what they do online.  it seems a bit more reasonable as they used to fork out over a grand for one of those
<zmoylan-pi> so we're reaching an era like it was in 90s in japan were people didn't own pcs and wrote novels on their phones...
<ali1234> wait
<ali1234> iphone x is a real thing, and they also made an iphone 8 at the same time?
<daftykins> yep
<ali1234> is "x" pronounced "ten" like OS X?
<daftykins> one to be the incremental upgrade, the other to push the boundaries
<daftykins> yep
<ali1234> and there's no iphone 9?
<zmoylan-pi> nein
<ali1234> i have no words
<ali1234> none that i can say here anyway
<daftykins> and still the cultists will lap it all up and preorder, amazing
<ali1234> i'm not sure they will tbh
<daftykins> :)
<zmoylan-pi> we'll have to see what sales numbers are like...
<zmoylan-pi> those that they release of course...
<ali1234> i'm sure they'll sell loads
<ali1234> but perhaps fewer than previous iterations
<zmoylan-pi> but they didn't seem to release a new small phone so that will upset a few
<ali1234> it's probably a good mode
<ali1234> *move
<ali1234> the small phone owners are probably the least likely to upgrade
<ali1234> most likely to be happy to keep what they already have
<zmoylan-pi> but the 5se's are starting to show their age
<ali1234> are they though?
<zmoylan-pi> do they still get updates?
<daftykins> anything without a 64-bit CPU will be culled shortly
<zmoylan-pi> for folk with small hands it was optimal
<ali1234> maybe that's ho it will go with apple, but in general that won't happen
<daftykins> which?
<ali1234> 64 bit
<daftykins> yeah probably
<daftykins> that 5c i got given the other day is 32-bit only so it won't see iOS 11 and likely become redundant very shortly
<zmoylan-pi> i think the bigger gap in their offerings is that there was no mac book pro yesterday
<daftykins> huh?
<zmoylan-pi> or mac pro rather... saw a few channels hoping against hope for something
<ali1234> mac pro like desktop?
<ali1234> didn't they release a new one last time?
<daftykins> oh no they already said that won't rear its' head before 2018 or 2019
<ali1234> going back to the classic tower case style?
<daftykins> yeah they're definitely doing a U turn on it
<zmoylan-pi> seems people want expandable not an appliance
<ali1234> well yeah, if people want an appliance they'll buy a mac book
<ali1234> the stupid trash can thing had no market
<zmoylan-pi> and some old mac books are going for very good money online as you can't buy them new anymore
 * daftykins giggles over the guy in Dixons Travel at London Gatwick asking for an adapter for a standard USB port on the lowest end macbook
<zmoylan-pi> *KERCHING*
<daftykins> indeedy
<zmoylan-pi> why are they fetching a red cushion with gold brain?
<m0nkey_> Heh, I saw people with the new MacBooks at this conference I went to. It was dongles, dongles everywhere
<daftykins> :) madness
<zmoylan-pi> dongles all the way down....
<m0nkey_> At least my Mac has standard USB ports :)
<m0nkey_> Advantage of having an old mac
<daftykins> still a mac though ;)
<m0nkey_> It's 5 years old, I'm not replacing it until it dies.
<zmoylan-pi> till they decide it is no longer mac like enough...
<m0nkey_> I'm kinda amazed it's still working actually.
<zmoylan-pi> mac make or made very good laptops.
<zmoylan-pi> was common to hear of a student using same macbook all through college whereas windows users were on a new one per year
<daftykins> the move to soldered in SSDs mean that (almost all) of the very latest models are now just tossable when there's a problem, oh and hope you have a backup...
<m0nkey_> mine doesn't have a soldered ssd thankfully
<daftykins> i think that's more down to the fact they'd buy some <Â£300 turd and expect to be sorted
<daftykins> no it's only on the latest models as i said
<daftykins> no doubt becoming the norm, though
<daftykins> and before that it was proprietary interfaces that accessory sellers had to reverse engineer
<zmoylan-pi> chromebooks have sewn up cheap end of market
<daftykins> nah
<zmoylan-pi> cheaper to pick up an american iphone... :-) https://twitter.com/juanbuis/status/907883402195595265
<daftykins> good if you eat nothing and teleport places
<zmoylan-pi> you cook feral rats on your travel iron... :-P
<daftykins> here's a fine news piece: https://www.theregister.co.uk/2017/09/13/bikini_baristas_police_investigation/
<diddledan> "He insisted that all his new hires were told not to expose themselves to customers." <-- because that's what you tell new employees in case it wasn't clear
<diddledan> anyone who insists on telling people not to do something probably means they want them to do it
<diddledan> "whatever you do *WINK WINKY WINK* don't *WINKY* strip *WINK* and get extra *wink* money for doing *wink* things!"
<diddledan> hmm, ftp.heanet.ie is timing out
<diddledan> obviously that's via http
<diddledan> https**
<diddledan> ok, who needs diddlin'!?!
<daftykins> ooh-err
<m0nkey_> Ooh, I got a mention: https://www.ixsystems.com/blog/vbsdcon-2017
<diddledan> nice
<diddledan> you're Internet Famous now
<daftykins> heh
 * zmoylan-pi remembers been taken aside on my first job in retail and been shown a club to use in case any one tried to rob the place...
<m0nkey_> I guess I'm officially a BSD guy
<diddledan> you can't back-out now
<daftykins> unless you turn m0nkey into a kind of Batman role
<m0nkey_> I run pfSense and FreeNAS, maybe I should install FreeBSD on the desktop ;)
<daftykins> i hope you have the prerequisite facial hair
 * diddledan hides his beadage
<diddledan> beardage*
<zmoylan-pi> and brown sandals with blue socks?
<daftykins> diddledan: put those beads away
<diddledan> but they make my face fungus pretty
<zmoylan-pi> wow, equifax had admin admin as user name and password in argentina... :-)
#ubuntu-uk 2017-09-14
<m0nkey_> wait. I have the same user/pass for my firewall
<MooDoo> howdy all
<SuperMatt> Morning
<MooDoo> how are you supermatt?
<SuperMatt> I'm well. Got an interview today \o/
<SuperMatt> I refuse to stay in a job for too long
<SuperMatt> don't want people relying on me now
<MooDoo> SuperMatt: not at rackspace?
<MooDoo> SuperMatt: and why not?
<SuperMatt> I've not been at Rackspace for years!
<zmoylan-pi> fingers crossed interview goes well...
<MooDoo> SuperMatt: oh lol, shows how long i've been away from here....what are you doing now and where are you planning on going?  still a technical role?
<SuperMatt> MooDoo: I'm at Sky right now, and I'll be interview with Facebook
<zmoylan-pi> so... you are willing to sell your soul to the man... :-P
<MooDoo> SuperMatt: ooooo nice :)
<MooDoo> SuperMatt: teaboy?
<SuperMatt> Man, even if I could be tea boy, I'd take that job
 * zmoylan-pi checks list... seems you like your tea made with the tears of interns... wow, facebook does know everything... :-P
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<MooDoo> morning brobostigon :)
<brobostigon> morning MooDoo :)
<diplo> Anyone got any pointers with samba, customer with a VM, we share a directory with samba, same on every customer we use. This site smbclient -L localhost -Uuser get a few different errors but I think they all come back to DNS, but I can ping localhost/127.0.0.1 can ping the server name can telnet to 139 / 445
<diplo> Also tried smb4 as I was getting session setup failed : SUCCESS - 0
<diplo> Now geting protocol negotiation failed: NT_STATUS_IO_TIMEOUT
<diplo> I've tried a minimal config ( a few lines )
<diplo> I really don't think this is samba, but I can't seem to trace down the issue, selinux disabled and iptables off
<diddledan> marnin
<MooDoo> diddledan: yo!
<diddledan> o/
<diddledan> wat. Docker runs on IBM Z Mainframes?!
<diddledan> ref: https://blog.docker.com/2017/09/docker-ee-on-ibm-z-mainframe
<zmoylan-pi> i suppose all platforms should suffer? :-P
<SuperMatt> first part of the facebook interview process complete \o/
<diddledan> you're going to facebook?!
<MooDoo> SuperMatt: how'd it go?  was it a phone interview?
<diddledan> does that mean you will get to see my privates?
<MooDoo> diddledan: everyone has seem them any way ;)
<diddledan> oh dear
 * zmoylan-pi changes SuperMatt's alignment from chaotic neutral to chaotic evil... :-P
<SuperMatt> Yeah, a phone interview, just getting all the ducks in order. Nothing overly technical
<SuperMatt> I will always be chaotic good
<foobarry> SuperMatt has more interviews than i have hot dinners
<foobarry> even i've interviewed him :D
<SuperMatt> This is true, I forgot about that
<SuperMatt> I move on as soon as an employer gives me cause to do so
<brobostigon> being lawful evil, could be interesting. lol.
<diddledan> and this is how Google is preparing it's AI: https://t.co/bWh6StUR1v
<MooDoo> SuperMatt: you mean before they catch you f***ing up ;)
<diddledan> should I upgrade to artful yet?
<diddledan> I feel very artistic, I can even draw my name (kinda)
<zmoylan-pi> no, get a bag of marshmallows as we celebrate cassinis destruction tomorrow...
<zmoylan-pi>  https://saturn.jpl.nasa.gov/mission/grand-finale/grand-finale-orbit-guide/
<diddledan> https://media0.giphy.com/media/kZqEw3blwGk9O/giphy.gif
<zmoylan-pi> i hope satutn is insured...
<zmoylan-pi> but launched in 97... that's some serious space hardware handling the cold of deep space...
<diddledan> what about the voyager
<diddledan> still going strong since 1994, despite all the borg incursions
<diddledan> they totally need to high definate DS9 and Voyager
<zmoylan-pi> might be hard with ds9 as like tng it was shot on video i think...
<diddledan> tng wasn't on video
<diddledan> they high definated tng
<diddledan> it was the effects that were video-only
<diddledan> the live action was all film
<diddledan> that was one of the benefits of being made by paramount who wanted to prove that film was still relevant :-p
<zmoylan-pi> still means having to redo all the effects for high def, no?
<diddledan> of course, they were right, but nobody believed them
<diddledan> yeah, which is why they don't want to do DS9 and voyager, because the effects being recreated costs too much
<zmoylan-pi> i saw a vintage tv ad on my tumblr.  showing st:tos as a reason to buy a shiny new colour set :-)
<diddledan> I bet they'd poo all over the fans if they tried to recreate the effects themselves
 * daftykins chuckles at a client trying to renew their office 365 sub
<diddledan> sounds like a bad idea to me
<zmoylan-pi> do they get a free mug?
<daftykins> wow they managed to get the wrong edition too, so MS says they can only have 9 months and not 12!
<diddledan> aww
<diddledan> all the months!
<daftykins> i've got Guardians of the Galaxy Volume 2 on
<zmoylan-pi> 'i bought a years subscription to office 365 and all i got was this mug' :-)
<daftykins> not even a mug :(
<zmoylan-pi> my favourite gift ever was a mouse mat that came free with a hp tape drive... it advertised hp archive products on a mouse mat with less stuctural integrity than a post it note
<zmoylan-pi> ...or the dell xp pen they gave out at the launch.  if you tried to write with it the nib would push back into the barrel and the ink exploded a week after i got it...
<zmoylan-pi> look at the size of that screen... it's huge :-P http://www.atticpaper.com/proddetail.php?prod=1967-rca-tv-ad-star-trek
<daftykins> ooh yeah sign me up
<daftykins> my Dad would always order discounted software to get the free mouse it came with, such as a bunch of programs by that old 'serif' company
<zmoylan-pi> pageplus!! i bought that... it was actually excellent...
<daftykins> mmm that's the one, and drawplus... yada yada
<zmoylan-pi> a friend used it on ancient 386sx with 4mb ram for dtp. using a brother laser printer with 512k of ram.  we knocked up seriously impressive documents that got comments from people who couldn't do it on more expensive hardware
<daftykins> :>
<zmoylan-pi> it took patience of a saint mind... :-)
<daftykins> zmoylan-pi: are you secretly the King of Ireland?
<zmoylan-pi> ard rÃ­? no
<zmoylan-pi> that would go to the southern or northern o'neills.
<zmoylan-pi> last one legged it to rome after wiping out british army at battle of the biscuits
<daftykins> oof
<zmoylan-pi> for about 100 years afterwards the saying in england was 'better to die like a criminal in england than die like a dog in ireland' iirc
<daftykins> does that not depend which type of biscuit you are?
<zmoylan-pi> basically he destroyed all the biscuits for a large army in a part of ireland were there wouldn't be a corner shop for 300 years...
<daftykins> that right there is a long wait
<zmoylan-pi> army starved to death trying to cross island back to dublin
<zmoylan-pi> not technically a military victory as no glorious battle was fought but the army was still /dealt/ with by a tiny force
 * daftykins munches on toblerone
<zmoylan-pi> pre brexit toblerone or post brexit toblerone?
<daftykins> everything seems shrunken to me now :(
<diddledan> only britain and ireland could have a battle about biscuits
 * zmoylan-pi loads the trebuchet with custard creams...
#ubuntu-uk 2017-09-15
<MooDoo> howdy all
<diplo> Morning all
<MooDoo> howdy diplo, what's new?
<SuperMatt> howdy all
<diplo> Not alot MooDoo, still recovering from a stag do last weekend and saving up for the next on in November, yourself ?
<diplo> hey SuperMatt
<SuperMatt> Still recovering?
<MooDoo> diplo: yeah man i'm ok....
<MooDoo> SuperMatt: you get through to the next round?
<SuperMatt> yuppers
<MooDoo> well done chap
<SuperMatt> ta
<MooDoo> what position is it any way?
<SuperMatt> Platform Engineer
<MooDoo> cool
<diplo> Yup, don't have the most healthiest of bodies, have an auto immune illness, so exertion breaks me above and beyond :) but worth it
<diplo> That sounds like a very broad raning job description :)
<MooDoo> so if FB goes down we know who to contact ;)
<SuperMatt> Indeed
<SuperMatt> but I'd probably tell you to jog on
<MooDoo> in all seriousness i've looked into FB jobs, but i'd have to move to ireland or london, they don't do that many remote jobs
<MooDoo> SuperMatt: and i'd accept it :D
<SuperMatt> because an outage would probably be an ISP or DNS issue ;)
<SuperMatt> oh man, I just want to go back to bed and not do any work
<MooDoo> SuperMatt: i've been thinking that since 5:30 am when i got into work
<SuperMatt> Why so early?
<MooDoo> SuperMatt: I start work at 6 on fridays, traffic was dead so got in a little earlier lol
<MooDoo> wanted to check a rhel box i setup yesterday was still ok
<SuperMatt> What did you put on it?
<MooDoo> rhel 7.3
<MooDoo> it will be running progress
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<MooDoo> morning brobostigon
<brobostigon> morning MooDoo
<foobarry> 7.4 is our
<foobarry> out
<brobostigon> 7.4 of what?
<zmoylan-pi> the upgrade from 7.3 :-P
<diplo> foobarry: I'm trying to keep all our customers up to date. How soon after releases  do you upgrade ?
<diplo> brobostigon: RHEL I believe
<brobostigon> diplo: ah.
<MooDoo> i need to keep 7.3 as the app we use is only certified for this release....so can't yum upgrade on it's own :S
<diplo> That's a PITA MooDoo
<MooDoo> diplo: yeah tell me about it
<diplo> Can you just pin the libs etc that it is dependant on and update everything else ?
<MooDoo> diplo: i think there is a yum-plugin-security that allows you to just check and install security relavent parts only
<diplo> Well that's better than nothing I guess
<MooDoo> yeah i guess....
<MooDoo> jesus - http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-41278545
<diplo> Without clicking, guessing rhe explosion ?
<MooDoo> diplo: yes
<MooDoo> bit late to the party on that one
<popey> worst party ever
<MooDoo> yeah just watching the news, ied :(
<diplo> It's been confirmed? not had a chance to read up yet
<MooDoo> yeah just watched a police commissioner about it
<zmoylan-pi> just glad no one was killed...
<MooDoo> yeah indeed
<zmoylan-pi> and that the misfiring of the device will leave more evidince to nail those responsible quicker
<MooDoo> scary thay it was a missfire.....
<diddledan> I feel the need to swear
<zmoylan-pi> research suggests that intelligent people swear more.... so i'm a fecking genius :-P
<brobostigon> :D
<foobarry> i never swear :|
<popey> Speaking of swearing. https://forum.snapcraft.io/t/reject-names-with-expletives/2084
<foobarry> not even accidentally
<popey> I do all the time. Terrible potty mouth
<foobarry> looks like that thread was a big time sink for all involved
<brobostigon> of me and my fiance, she has the potty mouth, :)
<popey> Yup. Could have been easier if he'd checked first.
<diplo> I see where he's going with it, I actually found that software a week or two ago.. and thought why would you name it that.. but yeah by consensus it's already everywhere
<diplo> Thanks for the bronze popey  :)
<popey> hehe :)
<NET||abuse> hey guys, anyone know what's up with ubuntu 16.04 and yarn? I tried installing it but node is the wrong versin "0.10.43"  and the command nodejs is the right version,
<NET||abuse> but yarn is looking to /usr/local/bin/node
<NET||abuse> not /usr/bin/nodejs :S
<daftykins> one package based and one you've installed by another method?
<NET||abuse> yeh, but i've sero clue where the other file comes from :S
<NET||abuse> i could move it
<NET||abuse> temporarily.
<daftykins> dpkg -l | grep node
<daftykins> history | grep node
<daftykins> see what past-you got up to...
<NET||abuse> server has been running way too long for any history to see where it came from,
<daftykins> so you won't even try?
<NET||abuse> no i tried of course, just saying the result is the only history of "node" is what i've just done int he last hour
<NET||abuse> history only at 1000 it looks liek
<NET||abuse> dpkg -l |grep node only shows the packages i know, standard nodejs package whihc provide /usr/bin/nodejs executable.
<NET||abuse> which is the version i want yarn to use.
<daftykins> i wonder if the update-alternatives stuff knows of both you have on
<NET||abuse> seems to work when i rename the node file :P
<popey> NET||abuse: dpkg -S /path/to/file, to see where it came from
<popey> (if it came from a package)
<foobarry> ahhh room full of ubuntu https://imgur.com/a/inIN5
<diddledan> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-41288525
<diddledan> UK terror alert level raised to CRITICAL
<daftykins> i spy no towers, foobarry!
<foobarry> all in one pc's
<foobarry> pretty decent spec, i7 and 8/16G ram i think
<foobarry> there were some i5s that took more than 2x longer to install
<foobarry> using unattended install
<daftykins> ah, best hope they're reliable... still concerning to me
<foobarry> i think the convenience of reduced desk space is a biggy
<foobarry> see how small the desks are, 30 in a room
<zmoylan-pi> more space for desk toys... \o/
<foobarry> student lab :P
<foobarry> giving proper skills
<daftykins> so little space for notepads to document their work properly ;D
<foobarry> hmmm rclone beta working with onedrive for business
<zmoylan-pi> i used clipboard in computer lab as it provided the space to store notes, printouts, pencil and place to write...
<daftykins> cunning ;)
<zmoylan-pi> desks barely held vt100 terminals
<zmoylan-pi> look how slim that keyboard is... :-) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/VT100
<MooDoo> evening all
<daftykins> \o
<zmoylan-pi> o/
<zmoylan-pi> what has you online at this time of night on a friday?
<MooDoo> just setting up my system with external monitor on my laptop so the wife can do her dental exam tomorrow, so just playing about really
<daftykins> ah har
<daftykins> second screen to cheat and look things up eh ;)
<MooDoo> daftykins: lol it's an open book exam :)
<daftykins> ah ha - "who has made the finest post-it note assortment"
<MooDoo> quite like having external monitor on my laptop :D
<zmoylan-pi> i used to do it all the time, then i found i was just putting twice as much info in my view slowing down my processing what i am seeing time... so now i use one monitor and flick to what i need at that moment as and when i need to
<MooDoo> means I can talk to you lot while watching netflix :C
<MooDoo> :)
<zmoylan-pi> i offload my media watching duties to my phone propped up on keyboard of laptop while i type on real keyboard plugged in :-)
#ubuntu-uk 2017-09-16
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
<MooDoo> howdy all
 * zmoylan-pi hugs hot mug of tea for heat...
<penguin42> it's not THAT cold yet
<zmoylan-pi> 8c atm and to drop to 0 tonight...
 * brobostigon has a penderyn, he is happy with that.
<zmoylan-pi> ...or cares less about everything else... :-P
<brobostigon> or even worse if you have lost all HP and your counting own your constituion points till death.
<brobostigon> down*
<zmoylan-pi> ah, sure you have a few saving throws to go... and maybe a team medic to give it a bash too...
 * zmoylan-pi fondly remembers my barbarian with a point spent in medicine... a great tank field medic... saved the day on more than 1 occasion even if did mean standing in a battle and trying to roll to heal against the odds...
<brobostigon> zmoylan-pi: in our last game, my partner plays a cleric and i am a wizard, she had to roll against her heal skill to keep me alive.
<zmoylan-pi> alignment issues?
<brobostigon> we are both nominally LG.
<zmoylan-pi> we did have a great medic who's alignment meant that her best spell was completely useless on the group as we didn't share her alignment... which had to be explained every session :-)
<brobostigon> zmoylan-pi: the point being, as a sorcerer i shouldnt have put myself in that position to start with.
<brobostigon> woops, :)
<zmoylan-pi> oh sure, magic weilders who jump into battle... have seen a few of those... :-)
<brobostigon> non'existant str and dex, oh yeah, keep your distance.
<zmoylan-pi> unless you're a rogue or a kender...
<brobostigon> or a barbarian
<zmoylan-pi> who have other problems if they have no str...
<brobostigon> most magic users have little use for str and dex.
#ubuntu-uk 2017-09-17
<brobostigon> morning boys and girls.
